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bilibili_data_72647293_BV12e4y1L7WR_p7_BV12e4y1L7WR_p7_m4-dialogue_0817922
[S1] Yeah, I mean, I think I definitely, I mean, we all come, when you come from the mud, when you gotta make something out of nothing, that's just what it is. The, the hustle is in us. It's, and you see an opportunity and you're like, "I want as much of that as possible." [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] My, my dad was cut from that same cloth of just being an entrepreneur, and my dad was doing everything from having, trying to have a ministry, to running his own business, to working for Coca-Cola, to Frito-Lay, to, you know, like, so watching somebody just
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[S1] Yeah, yeah. Like, and that's professionally before. I mean, I was doing talent shows and all of that stuff at like 11, 12, but by the time I got out there and really was on the road, I was 15. [S2] How, how so early? [S1] Well, the church, you know what I mean? My dad would be speaking and doing, so I would, you know, talent shows and different church events. I was, I was, you know, the- [S2] The devil. [S1] Yeah. [S2] He would
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[S1] The devil. [S2] Yeah. [S1] He was the devil. [S2] Telling Jesus jokes. He opened up for the preacher man. And, but from that, they was like, "Oh, there's something there." And trying to do music at the same time, music in the church and flipping it and going and doing the worldly stuff. And by the time I got out there, my dad was like, "Yo, this kid gonna do whatever he wants." And it started even in space 'cause a lot of times those, those preachers who'd be trying to, you know, get to the mega pastor level, they gotta start on like public access. And so that's what my dad was doing. He, and I learned how to work. I was his crew. I worked the camera.
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[S1] You're really controlling the, the stuff. You're really behind the scenes doing the behind the scenes work. [S2] Yeah, I had a, I had a talk show when I was like 11, 12 called Who's Got the Wisdom. [S1] Who's... [S2] [LAUGHS]
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[S1] I have on a trench coat. I come over here, the- the Twilight Zone. So, let me tell you who's got the wisdom. [S2] Who's got the wisdom. [S1] 'Cause it's my, of course my dad probably came up with the concept, but I'm up there trying to have a one-on-one conversation with, like, local mayors and congressmen and stuff. But as a kid, like, people would come in, 'cause this was in North Carolina at the time. People would come in, like, I was interviewing, like, Gladys Knight and Ramsay Lewis and Don King and, like- [S2] Do you have any of that footage? [S1] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, uh, I mean, it's- [S2] What are you doing with it? [S1] My dad, he got, like, tapes and tapes in there. [S2] What do you mean? Do you understand what that sizzle is?
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[S1] ... the stand up. Was there a pushback? [S2] Once they realized I wasn't gonna be no damn preacher, [LAUGHS] they was like, "Let, let 'em go." [S1] Did they want that? [S2] Yeah, but you know, I mean, I was, I was a rebellious kid. You know, PK's always challenging, like, I'd do way too much sinning to try to be anybody's preacher. [S1] I know you do now, but back then...
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[S1] I was a rebel though. Like, you know what I mean? Like I was, I was, I challenged my dad. And, you know, coming from, I didn't grow up with my dad, so I kinda, and we, and we met as a, I, um, you wanna try to tell me what to do. And luckily we found that space. [S2] How old, how old were you? [S1] Like 11, 12, you know what I mean? Uh, that's when my mom figured it was time for me to go learn how to be a man and live with my dad in creative spaces like the church and, and public access television and,
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[S1] That kinda allowed us to kinda build and, and from there, that's where the career started. [S2] Now before- [S1] He ain't gonna be in the church, but he gonna do somethin'. [S2] But before you met your dad and before your mom made that decision to open that door up- [S1] Yeah. [S2] ... was there like a, was there bad energy because of-
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[S1] Yeah, and it's, it's a vibe, man. I, I mean, clearly we all come from it and, and could, if we wanted to be bitter about things, I would say, man, there ain't no point in getting bitter, just get better. And that's- [S2] What time, what time are you gaining? What time are you gaining from a, from a bitter, from, from a bitter attitude or a bitter approach? [S1] Man, I mean, you do a,
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[S1] I mean, you do it brilliantly, man. Your relationship with your pops, man, I love. First of all, I love your dad. He's probably my favorite. I don't care. Whatever event I go to- [S2] Nuts. [S1] [LAUGHS] [S2] Dad's nuts. [S1] I don't wanna hang out with nobody- [S2] My dad's nuts, man. [S1] [LAUGHS] Everybody cares about. And, and, and it's 'cause he gonna be in the corner. Look at these motherfuckers. [S2] Yeah, he, he does- [S1] [LAUGHS] [S2] He, I've never seen, I've never seen anybody that's just more, he's just, he's just, he, he shouldn't ever be where he is. [S1] He is amazing, man. [S2] He's the guy that just shouldn't be there.
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[S1] No, I remember at the wedding, yo, I didn't hang out with everybody. It's a beautiful, it's like, it's the most beautiful shit you ever seen in your life. Like, bringin' Alicia Keys and singin' y'all down the aisle, like, and me and your daddy been, "Look at this shit." [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] But he ain't gonna pay Alicia Keys to come. I could've sang this shit.
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[S1] About my dad, when I was, like, this is just who he is. My mom's sister had passed away. My mom was already, my mom had already passed. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] So my Aunt May passed away, and, you know, I- I gotta go and just make sure I- I- I pay my respects. [S2] Right, right. [S1] On behalf of my, just me, my brother, my mom. I wanna be there. [S2] Right. [S1] Right?
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[S1] He just, he just- [S2] Man, he's amazing, yo. [S1] He equated my mom's sister's death to a fly. They dropping like flies, ain't they? [S2] In his white linen. [S1] Yeah, I hope I ain't next.
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[S1] And we've had these conversations of like, "Man, Nick, why would you?" I'm like, "I don't care. I don't give a fuck. I don't care what people think." So, that side comes out when I stand firm on my beliefs. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And when I stand firm of just being solid. 'Cause at the end of the day, I know I come from a, a strong moral compass of like, I just wanna be good to people. I just wanna go... And you're the same way, man. Like, you just wanna be able to say, "Look,
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[S1] I'm blessed, so now I wanna be a blessing to people. And with, when anyone actually tries to challenge that, then I'll probably buck up. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And, and that's why I always try to be, you know, the, the dude that's gone, gone zig when everybody else is zag.
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[S1] Here, here's my thing that I found out about you, man. You're very well-read. There's, there's so much knowledge in there and, and information. When it comes to our culture, when it comes to black people, when it comes to the heritage, when it comes to, you know, ancestors, where we're from, you're so well-read. [S2] Yeah. [S1] When, when did you start the search for the abundance of information?
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[S1] Where now, like, I realize I'm in circles where I don't want people to know how smart I am. I don't want to get in there and, like, try to be like, "Well, I'm this, and I have this," because, you know, first of all, nobody likes to know it all. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] Nobody wants to be in a room where everyone's like, "Hey, did you know this? Well, I just finished reading this book." So I try to fall back on it now, but now it's just such a passion and a habit that I just love education. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] I love learning, man, and I never want to stop learning. So, but I find myself
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[S1] That's learned, though. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Right? Like it's a, it's a, it's a learned, it's a learned trait, a learned quality because there is a moment where th- there's a want- [S2] Yeah. [S1] ... for approval within the thing that you now have. You want, you wanna see people go, "Oh, that's dope." [S2] Yeah. [S1] "Oh, man, that's amazing that you," there's, there's a want for that. But then after receiving that, you realize that it's not as important as you once thought it was.
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[S1] That's, that's, that's a great segue to my next question, man. You said something, uh, early on where you like, look- [S2] But man, very serious here. [S1] This is great. I told you. I told you it's good. It's a great, I told you it's great dialogue. [S2] This is real stuff. [S1] It's a, yes. It's a different version of me. [S2] This isn't how we talk every day.
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[S1] Yes, this is a, it's a, it's a great, a great dialogue, okay? Uh, here's a piece that I want to go back to. You said, like, you know, there's certain things you just don't care. I don't, I don't care what people think. There was a moment where you and I, we were having some talks, right? As, as shit hit the fan. You, you're no stranger to stepping in it. I'm no stranger to stepping in it. [S2] I feel like our shit, we, we, we volleyball with shit. We t- we shit, tennis shit. [S1] Yeah, yeah. It's, it's- [S2] 'Cause, like, I'm hitting some shit, and I'm like,
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[S1] But it's never at the same time. [S2] Never at the same time. [S1] I can always check on you. You've always been able to check on me. [S2] Yeah. [S1] If it happened at the same time, I'm, I'm, I'm scared of, of the lack of support. [S2] Yeah, that would be great. We, we visited each other in the hospital multiple times. [S1] Yes.
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[S1] Yes, yes we have. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Yes we have. There was a moment when you were going through your bout and you, you felt, you felt the need to say, "The biggest hurt is seeing my people turn on me." [S2] Oh, man. [S1] Seeing my people turn on me, right? [S2] Yeah,
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[S1] Yeah, that shit, I was in therapy for a long time about that shit. Granted, like, okay, I know this group of people is probably gonna feel this way. Uh, but then when the people who are supposed to have your back, you start feeling shit. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Like, wait, hold, I'm trying, I'm rapping for us. [S2] Yeah. [S1] That's when you find yourself like, okay, one, how serious is this? 'Cause everybody sees this as a game, uh, and, and a hustle and a grind, this shit we talk about. But when you actually talk about the principles of who you are as a person, and people start to question that. [S2] Question.
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[S1] I won't even lie to you. At one point it was a, it was the biggest fear- [S2] Mm. [S1] ... that I had in my career. [S2] Mm. [S1] The biggest fear is, what if nobody don't like me? [S2] Right. [S1] What if they decide to not like me or accept me or my talent? That was the fear. [S2] Because the grind is always about how likeable you, how, how many people like you, how many followers- [S1] It's about the acceptance. [S2] Yeah, it's about being accepted. [S1] Right? It's about, it's about the acceptance. And, and it took me, it took me going through the things that I went through
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[S1] ... to go, "Oh, wait a minute. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Wait a minute. Oh, th- you're never going to make them all happy. [S2] And that's just, it's about fuck- [S1] You're never gonna please them all. [S2] It's fuck about what others think. [S1] Exactly. [S2] You know, I mean, other people's opinions about me is none of my business. [S1] Exactly. [S2] It's about, because really, when you're doing it for the acceptance, then really that's the work you gotta do within because you're yearning for, there's something empty. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] But now, like, man, I love being flawed.
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[S1] I love knowing the fact that, like, I be fucking out. Like, just, it's such a comfortable space to be in because I'm happy with who I am. I'm happy with the decisions I make. And when I'm not happy with it, that means I gotta go work on me. I'm not blaming it on a community. I'm not... And that's what I really had to get to because just like- [S2] You were angry. You were angry. [S1] Yeah, I was-
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[S1] Yeah, I was mad 'cause I'm like- [S2] You're pissed off. [S1] 'Cause first of all, I was already on my, like, militant shit, right? Just from all of the learning that I've had. And I'm like, "Yo, they really, they really fucking with us on so many different levels to a place where this is indoctrinated in us from-
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[S1] I feel like your frustration came from you actually being on the front line. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Not because it was the cool thing to do, but it was because it was the right thing to do. [S2] Right, right. [S1] You, you not only said, "I'm willing to lose everything- [S2] Right. [S1] ... for this," because that's how important this is, you felt like that's the stamp- [S2] Right. [S1] ... to show guys, I'm,
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[S1] This is, this is a passion. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Like, right is right, wrong is wrong. And what's wrong is, is so blatant that I wanna be a part of somehow making it right. And this is gonna be my effort. This is my energy. And when you gave that, went through what you went through, and then it seemed like there was an about face where people all of a sudden- [S2] Yeah. [S1] ... forgot that, that acted as a, as a nice little, as a nice little stab to the heart.
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[S1] down I was or how in-tuned and, and then when you're trying to do all of the right things for that acceptance and then you realize they're never gonna accept you. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] You know, uh, whether people wanna label you as corny or label you as a
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[S1] Sell out or label you, because first of all, success is intimidating. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And so even dealing with that from a young age mixed in with when you start doing with, dealing with social issues, then you start to question the communities in which you're a part of.
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[S1] And then when you get to that space, you're like, you, you never, one, you never want to speak bad about your own or what you believe your own to be. And then you also, then you find yourself like, all right, well, if I'm trying to build myself up, I don't have to talk bad about the other people. Even if my people want me to talk bad about other people. [S2] You don't have to. [S1] Yeah. And I learned that, I'm gonna be honest, man, I learned that from some cat, you know, some of the best to ever do it. And really having to take some of those lessons from like, you know, you know, Harry Belafonte.
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[S1] You know, who's still one of the coldest. [S2] Wow. [S1] In one of the, from activism to entertainers, and then even, you know, Dick Gregory. [S2] Cussed me out in the hospital. [S1] But he came to see me in the hospital and got cussed out by Dick Gregory. [S2] Dick Gregory. [S1] But, and he literally, like, he don't give a fuck. [S2] No. [S1] Like, just every, every word out of his mouth, motherfucking- [S2] I did nothing. All I did was come to the hospital, Dick. [S1] Fuck you, dog. [S2] What you doing? What you doing? It's Dick. I came to see Dick.
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[S1] It was a brilliant night though, man. And, and just even, but life lessons, man. They, these are people that paved the way for us and all we can do is sit back and listen. And, and that's really where I got to those spaces. And even when I was met with my own challenges, it was like, man, let's go with them. Because as we know, you know, man, we built for this. [S2] Absolutely. [S1] Tough times don't last, but tough people do. [S2] Oof.
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[S1] Who is Nick Cannon as a dad then? Segwaying off of that and you're talking about- [S2] Yeah. [S1] ... energy to the kids. I mean, right now, Nick Cannon as a dad, the numbers are growing. [S2] Dad to a whole bunch of motherfuckers. [S1] Yeah, yeah. I mean, I mean, I mean, you just had, you just had a new baby. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Right? [S2] Yeah. [S1] Uh- [S2] It's crazy. Our kids are so similar in ages. Um, I get to that space, man, of, there's a level of responsibility- [S1] Total, total number. [S2] I don't know that. You gonna put me on the spot? [S1] I'm saying- [S2] It's like spades. I got eight and the possible nine. [S1] No.
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[S1] Okay, so on some, on some real shit, let's talk this for a second. 'Cause this is what I struggle with, and I see you deal with it very well. 'Cause I, oh, naturally, I'm an introvert. I don't... [S2] You, you, you fall back. [S1] I live it. [S2] The bigger a room gets, you fade to the back. [S1] Yeah, and you... [S2] You don't, you don't like the... [S1] You effortlessly walk into a room and control the energy. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] I don't like controlling the energy in the room. [S2] Why? [S1] You, it's... I don't know. I don't want that responsibility.
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[S1] Are we really connecting? Are we actually being our authentic self? [S2] Right now you are. To hear you talk, I love talking to you because- [S1] Right. [S2] ... flawed, un-flawed, you're, you're you. And- [S1] Right. [S2] ... you know, the way you talk, the way you speak,
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[S1] People, this here, man, you're so comfortable with being uncomfortable. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] You're, you're so, you're so okay with saying, "Yo, therapy, I'm not getting it right. I don't know this," or, "I'm trying to figure this out." Why don't people care? I don't know, man. Like it's, you're asking yourself these questions. You're trying to figure this stuff out. You're, you're a work in progress, as am I. As am I, a forever work in progress. And here's the thing, we're never gonna get it right. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] It's never gonna be perfect.
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[S1] We're never going to walk on a straight line. [S2] Yeah. [S1] We're still going to trip. We're still going to fall. But if we can continue to be better than we were the day before, or the week before, then we're doing our job. This right here to me, this is, this is doing our job. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] This was a dope-ass conversation, and it was real. People don't get to hear us talk like this. [S2] No, it was real shit. [S1] And that's what this is about. [S2] How much I owe you? [S1] You don't owe me anything, but, you know- [S2] The, the therapist, when they say shit like that, they, they charge me after. [S1] They charge. No, no charge, man.
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[S1] Nick, I appreciate you coming on, man. Amazing conversation, great dialogue. That's what this is about, man. That's what Heart to Heart is about. [S2] That's what it is. [S1] I'll be damned if we didn't just have one. [S2] Yeah, it was. That was some real heartfelt shit. [S1] It damn sure was. Nick Cannon. [S2] Hmm? Next time I come here, you have some Capri Suns. [S1] No, no Capri Suns. Okay? How much are they paying you? Are you getting a check from them? [S2] I- I should. [S1] I wanna talk to you about it. [S2] I- I- At least send me some- [S1] You got a Capri Sun deal? [S2] I should get one. [S1] Did you get a Capri Sun? [S2] I need one 'cause- [S1] That's the guys I always wanted. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Did you get a Capri Sun? [S2] 'Cause I got a guy who's over at Capri Sun.
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[S1] Why should I? Because guys, we get to talk and we get to have a good time. Please welcome Bryan Cranston, ladies and gentlemen. Bryan Cranston. Come on, Bryan. [S2] This is amazing. [S1] Huh? Do you like this?
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[S1] Do you like this right here? How are you, man? [S2] It's so good to see you. You look great. Thank you. [S1] You look really good, man. I like the suit. [S2] Oh, thank you. [S1] Yeah, no, I'm serious. You look good. [S2] Thank you. [S1] I'm surprised. [S2] What? Why are you surprised? [S1] 'Cause normally you don't. Oh, remember the thing? [S2] The, the... [S1] The thing. [S2] The thing with the... [S1] The thing. I'm joking, man. There is no thing. All right, so Brian, here's the thing. This is my, my talk show. [S2] Nice. [S1] Some of the best conversations happen over a glass of wine, which is why
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[S1] Come on, Ryan. [S2] Okay, yes, yes, yes, yes. [S1] Yes, please, please. Thank you, man. [S2] Beautiful. [S1] I'm serious what I said, though, about some of the best conversations happening over a glass of wine. If you notice, or if you haven't noticed, when you drink wine, you get very talkative, right? Stuff just starts to flow. Before you know it, you look at the time, you're like, "Oh my God, I can't believe I was talking
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[S1] ... that I just didn't expect. I was so blown away by your ability to be so warm and welcoming, not just to the cast, but to the crew. And it was such a comfortable environment for me doing this movie, 'cause this was my first, like, this was like my first kinda serious role. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Right? [S2] Yeah. [S1] It's the first one.
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[S1] So, low key, I was nervous. I didn't say nothing. [S2] You weren't really? [S1] Not just nervous about lining up next to the level of actors and actresses that I had to in that film. And that was you and Nicole Kidman. It was like, well, I don't want to be the guy that looks like I don't belong. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Right? So I know I gotta come in, I gotta do my job, I gotta be prepared. But dude, you made me better. [S2] Well, I'm, I, thank you for that. [S1] I mean it. [S2] That's very kind of you. Usually I have in my contract that nobody's allowed to look me in the eye when I step on the set. [S1] Really?
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[S1] Yeah. [S2] Because I, you know, I kinda wanna create an intimidation factor and have everybody fear me. [S1] Well, that's not, I don't think that's- [S2] That's why I think, uh, it worked with us. [S1] Well, I don't think that they were- [S2] I think you were afraid.
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[S1] I wasn't afraid. I wasn't, I wasn't afraid. [S2] A little bit? [S1] No, Brian, I wasn't afraid at all. I'm telling you the, I admitted what I was nervous about, right? I, I, I already admitted that. So it's not about fear. It was more about being nervous about just being next to you. [S2] Oh. [S1] While, while acting, that's all. [S2] That's, yeah, that's a, really, that's a lovely thing to say. Thank you. [S1] When, when did it click for you that you were,
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[S1] ... that you were this, like, thesbian. Like, when did it mentally click that you had what it took to not just act, but truly become these characters? [S2] Well, my father was an actor. [S1] Really? [S2] Yeah. My, my mother and father were both actors. [S1] So you'd come from the business, then. [S2] I'd come from the business. They had a, they had a very tumultuous relationship. They needed to become stars, and neither of them became stars. [S1] Well,
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[S1] Wow. Okay. [S2] And it exploded the, the family structure and it was bad there for a while. [S1] Bad there meaning bad in the house with mom and dad? [S2] Yeah. Yeah. It was- [S1] How? What was bad? [S2] What was bad was that my mother started drinking. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] And my father left. [S1] Okay. [S2] So from the age of 11 on, I didn't see my father until I was about 22.
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[S1] Get out of here. [S2] Yeah. [S1] My dad wasn't around either. [S2] Yeah. [S1] My dad was vacant. Um, I would say, damn, it may be around the same, the same age. [S2] When you were about 11? [S1] About 11, ten, ten, 11. My dad's Bible's with drugs, though. [S2] Yeah. [S1] My dad, uh, he got tied up and just kinda went down a road where he never came back. [S2] Yeah. [S1] And the difference is, we didn't know where he was. So then later we found out what was going on with my dad, and it was more of a discovery. [S2] And were you actively looking for him?
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[S1] Uh, n- we weren't really allowed to. [S2] What do you mean? [S1] Does that make sense? So my mom, my mom and my dad weren't closed.
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[S1] So because they weren't close, you know, my mom kinda shut, she shut the doors to what could be the relationship with your dad when she knew my dad was spiraling out of control. [S2] Yeah. [S1] So because she had the knowledge, oh, he's out there, he's on drugs, he's doing everything he's not supposed to be doing. [S2] I don't want my kids to be- [S1] My kids aren't gonna be around that. [S2] Got it. [S1] So it was kind of a, a shield. And then as my dad got better, or started to get better, um, I, I think my mom found religion around the same time.
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[S1] So she started to like play hopscotch with, uh, I'm in, I'm in, I'm in, and I'm out. I'm okay with your dad coming to get you, but then I got, I had a bad day. No, not today. Which kinda, you know, it, it, it definitely messed with the relationship between my dad and my brother at one point. But not me so much. I was, I was too young. So my dad is just my dad. [S2] Yeah. [S1] I, I, it didn't matter. I, I loved my dad. Did your dad leaving affect your feelings towards him at a young age?
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[S1] Yeah, there were, th- there were lingering feelings of, of, uh, abandonment and resentment and anger. And I think, you know, ironically, I just channeled all that stuff into my work. So I, I look for characters. I'm, I, I'm attracted to characters that are damaged. [S2] Damn. [S1] And, and that I, that at least they have a sense of purpose and,
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[S1] Is that why it's so, I don't even like using the word easy because it's not easy, but you make it look so damn easy. Your ability to, to go in and out of emotion so fast. We were on a set of a, of our movie, um, Untouchable, right? [S2] No. It's called The Upside. [S1] Upside. But it's the remake of- [S2] Of Untouchables. [S1] Untouchables. [S2] Yeah. [S1] So the original was that. Ours is called The Upside. But there was a scene where
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[S1] You and I were, were, I'm pushing you at nighttime. We went to get the weed. [S2] Yeah. [S1] We went to go smoke the weed. And in this scene is when you talk about the accident. You talk about how you got hurt and then you started to talk about your wife and you cry in this scene. I remember them saying, "Cut." I remember them saying, "Cut." And then after we were cut, you would stop, and then me and you would finish talking and joking.
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[S1] Well, don't, no, don't sell yourself short because you have all the tools and you brought it all. I said when we first started The Upside, I said, "This is going to live or die on Kevin Hart's shoulders." [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And it thrived because of you. You had to drive every single scene- [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] ... and, and manipulate the scenes.
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[S1] How do you then make the switch the way you did? Was it, was it intentional? [S2] Yeah. [S1] It was intentional. [S2] Very much so. [S1] Wow. [S2] Uh, there's a tendency in our business- [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] ... to say, "Oh, Kevin Hart does this. Oh, let's give him that." [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] "Let's give him another one of those." [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] And another one, and another, and another. And it's up to you, then, as you have, to say, "No." [S1] Yeah. [S2] "I'm not doing that anymore. I'm going over here." [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] And they're saying, "But Kevin, you do this so great." And you go,
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[S1] There's a level of fear in doing what you wanna do because if that thing that you wanna do doesn't work, oh my God, will I have the opportunity to do it again. [S2] Yeah. [S1] And it's much more of a fear for, you know, black actors and actresses because, oh my God, how many shots do we get? [S2] Yeah, that's right.
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[S1] Right? Like, I don't, I'm not going to get many shots. So, as I've been navigating, you know, this, this, this walk, so I got to make sure that I move correctly. [S2] Pull the financing out of his next movie. [S1] I got to, I got to make sure that I'm, that I'm, I'm really taking calculated steps because of that.
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[S1] You know what I mean? [S2] It is, but it's tricky because you don't want to be so calculating that you take the risk factor out of it. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] You have to say, "There is a certain amount of risk to doing this role or that role." When you did Upside, I think we had a conversation and I, it was like, um, this is, this is a, really a, a, a love story about, with two straight men. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] And how they each can- [S1] I remember this. [S2] ... inform the other person- [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] ... about a future. [S1] It's when we met,
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[S1] That's when we met, before, before the film, we met. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Yes. [S2] And, and my, I went home after our lunch and my wife said, "What do you think?" And I said, "He's got it. I think he can do this." Because it was going to take your acting self to really drop in. It wasn't Kevin Hart as we've loved to see him and, "Wow!" You know, it wasn't, it
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[S1] It's not that. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Because, because if, if, if that guy, if that guy shows up, then you're, you're jumping out of, out of your character and into something that's real comfortable. [S2] Who's your most challenging role to date? [S1] I think, uh, I think when I, I,
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[S1] ... on Broadway. [S2] Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. [S1] And then we did a movie version of it. And that was probably the most, uh, challenging because the depth of that character, he had the highest heights of ambition and aggression and assertiveness and the lowest of lows with self-doubt and insecurities and crushing depression and everything in between. The other part of that is that it was a real man.
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[S1] And when you are playing a non-fictional character, there's a responsibility that comes with it. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] I hope you get the chance, I hope you look for something where you can play a, a real person. [S2] There's not many people my size. I've been looking. I've been searching. [S1] Have you, have you been looking? [S2] I've been looking for a lot of people. There's not many my size. [S1] But, you know, with, with the magic of special effects and visual effects, they can make you look huge. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Yeah, but, so you don't think that you can do that? [S2] No.
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[S1] I had no money, community college, right? Community College of Philadelphia. [S2] [LAUGHS] [S1] Broke his health, and I was like, "Dude, rent is due." You know, at this point, I didn't want to go to mom. I was trying to survive on my own. [S2] Now, did you, did, did you have the body then that you do now? [S1] No. No, no, no. It was a, it was a shit show. [S2] So that was like- [S1] It was a shit show. [S2] It was- [S1] It was- [S2] This guy is skinny-ass- [S1] It was- [S2] ... like a-
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[S1] This guy is skinny-ass. [S2] It was gonna be, it was gonna be a mess. It was gonna be a mess. Uh, but I was really gonna do it. I was like, I got nothing else. What am I gonna do? [S1] Woo! [S2] And I remember I was in the living room, uh, I was in the living room and I was, like, rehearsing. I had this girl and she was, like, "All you gotta do is get a routine." And I was listening to Genuine. Genuine, uh, Pony.
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[S1] That was my song. And I'm like, I'm gonna have a nice little routine. I was putting together a routine, and my brother walked in- [S2] Yeah. [S1] ... while I was doing it. And my brother, I've never seen somebody so mad. "What are you doing?" Dude, mind your business. "What are you doing, man?" I'm practicing. [S2] He didn't laugh? [S1] No, no, he didn't laugh. [S2] He was mad because he actually thought you were gonna do this.
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[S1] Here's a good question for you. [S2] Okay. [S1] We've talked about the acting. I understand how you approach it. I understand where the emotion, the pain, the happy comes from, where you're able to pull. I understand the childhood now and what was tough based off of what you said, right? What are your extracurricular activities outside, outside of the business? What does Bryan Cranston do? [S2] I, uh,
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[S1] It's a deep breath. [S2] Yeah, well, you know, I- [S1] That's a very deep breath. [S2] I'm now 65 years old. I don't play golf. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] I work out. Um, I spend time with my family. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] And I work. [S1] Okay. [S2] I don't collect anything. [S1] Wow. [S2] I don't, I, not watches, not cars, not, I don't, I, I have, I can do all that, but I'm, it's just not interesting. [S1] Where'd the money go? [S2] In the bank.
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[S1] Okay, so my wife said to me the other day, not the other day, a year or two ago. [S2] We were talking about it and- [S1] I, I've been acting for over 40 years. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And I love it. I do. It's a, it's such a passion of mine. I also love my wife. I've been married to for over 32 years. And, uh, I said, you know,
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[S1] Acting, you're married to acting. I'm your mistress. [S2] Yeah. [S1] And I went, "No." [S2] You know what's crazy? [S1] She goes, "No, it's okay. As long as I'm the only mistress you have, I'm okay with it." [S2] You know what's crazy? [S1] What? [S2] I had a different example that was given to me that set a light bulb off. And it was that I married to my job and that I was dating my family.
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[S1] And that was a- [S2] That hurts. [S1] That hurt. [S2] Yeah, it does. [S1] Right? And it wasn't as if I did one thing and then there's a break, you do another right after. Oh my God, this was big. This one's gonna be bigger. You keep feeding this thing- [S2] Yeah. [S1] ... that you have and you're embedding it in the will and want for more in your job. And then you come home and you're with your family and it's like, "Hey guys, come on, let's eat dinner real quick. Hey, we're gonna, we're gonna do, we're gonna go to the movies." You're cramming life
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[S1] You and I have been very, very fortunate in our careers. We've had opportunity present itself. And because neither of us came from any kind of wealth, any kind of, uh, fortunate environment. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] My, I was kicked out of our house. They put a eviction notice on the front door. Out. Split up and the family split up and it, it was bad. So when opportunity presented itself to me,
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[S1] I, I had to grab it. You have to turn it over and say, what's, what's best. What's best for you. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] What's best here. Because if the family went away, what is it worth? [S2] Mm-hmm. The one thing that you just said is, within, you know, that, that, that, that attitude, right? Of another and another and another. The biggest thing, because we come from nothing, there's always been a fear for me, Brian. [S1] To go back to- [S2] To go back.
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[S1] ... go back, that it's all gonna go back. [S2] Yes, like that's a, that's a real fear. And, and there's a, there's a high volume of people that will never understand that fear. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] That will never truly identify with that fear because they don't know that it's real. They heard about it.
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[S1] You've heard about- [S2] Yeah. [S1] Being poor. You've heard about having nothing. You've heard about people losing their homes. But if you never really experienced it, well, it's just something that you heard. [S2] Yeah. [S1] So when you finally discover something, and then you could discover something else, like, "Well, I don't, wait a minute."
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[S1] Yeah. [S2] I don't want to let this go. [S1] But do you, you, you can't, at this stage, you can't possibly still feel that jeopardy that it's going to go away. [S2] No. At this, at this stage, at the age 41, by the way, much younger than you. [S1] Yeah. [S2] A lot younger. [S1] Yeah, 41, that's good. No, you look good. [S2] When you said your age, the first thing I thought, I'm a lot younger. [S1] A lot.
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[S1] I learn. I get better. [S2] Well, when you fuck up, do you, are you easy on yourself? Do you forgive yourself or do you beat yourself up? [S1] Depends on the level, man. I've done it a lot. I've done it a lot. Um, but I don't, I don't wish that it didn't happen. Like I've, every, every time I've touched the stove and it's been hot, I'm thankful for that burn.
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[S1] I'm thankful for that burn. [S2] And you don't touch it again. [S1] I'm not touching that stove again, right? But I, I don't like hearing about things. Some things you just gotta, you gotta see for yourself. You gotta do and know for yourself. And then in this thing that we're in, in this, in this world of fame and success, you're not prepared for what comes with it.
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[S1] And sometimes you, you don't learn it well. [S2] Absolutely not. [S1] There's a lot of people who have not learned it well.
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[S1] Did the fame bite you at any point? [S2] I was working actor since 25 and did a bunch of different shows and things. But Malcolm in the Middle changed things for me. And I was 40 years old. And then I was 50 years old when Breaking Bad happened. I was already, I had wife and a child and a small house and I was already secure. [S1] You're polished. [S2] In my foundation. [S1] Yeah. What kind of father are you? Because if you're dad and your relationship with your dad,
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[S1] Well, uh, it's funny. I did that, um, genealogy show, um, Who Do You Think You Are? [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And they traced, they took DNA and then they did research and they traced it back to Ireland. My fourth, four times grandfather, right, and grandmother came from Ireland to, first to Canada and Canada to the, to the States and,
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[S1] Out of the five, including my father, my grandfather, my great-grandfather, great-great, and great-great-great, only one didn't desert his family. So four out of five of my predecessors- [S2] Wow, okay. [S1] ... deserted their family. [S2] Okay, I got it. [S1] I mean, completely deserted them. And it, it, it was funny because it, it's so foreign to me. It is, it is not
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[S1] of letting my kids down, the thought of saying something and not following through. [S2] Crushing. [S1] It's because I know what it feels like, right? And to this day, I'm, when I tell you, love my dad. Love my dad. Mistakes are not, it's my dad.
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[S1] I know what it feels like as a child to sit with that and stick with that. For my kids, I stand on the things that I say. And the most important thing is our word. I tell them that. The most important thing is our word. [S2] Were you able to have that conversation with your dad, that, of, of what happened, where were we, who are you now, how did- [S1] We still, we still ain't really, me and my dad never really talked about it, but- [S2] Yeah, it's kind of a genera- generational- [S1] Yeah, but we don't-
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[S1] Yeah, but we don't, we don't have to. [S2] Well, it's not like it's a weight off of my back. Like I've been waiting to hear it and now I can go on. It, it would be more for my dad than for me. I've already made the decision to still love. Do you still have a relationship with your father? [S1] No, he and I, uh,
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[S1] We never, we never were able to bridge the chasm that was created by his disappearance and my confusion as a child and- [S2] Was that an attempt? [S1] Yeah. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Yeah. [S2] It just didn't happen. [S1] Um, we, I was able to get my dad to go to therapy one time. I got to give him credit because he actually said these words.
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[S1] Um, as you so kindly pointed out, I'm, I'm slightly older than you. [S2] Old. [S1] Yeah. [S2] Old. [S1] As you get older, I find less interest in material things. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] And I want experiences. I just want experiences. Look, let me put it in, in these terms. Uh, I'm in the fourth quarter of my life. [S2] Is it the fourth or third? [S1] Fourth. [S2] I thought the fourth is 75.
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[S1] No, dig this. Zero to 20, first quarter. [S2] Okay. [S1] Oh, man, all things going on. [S2] Okay. [S1] 20 to 40, second quarter. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] Feeling good. Half-time, you're 40 years old. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] Like you are now. It's like, "I'm ready to go." [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] But let me tell you something. You've just now entered the third quarter of your life. [S2] Okay. [S1] 40 to 60. 60 to 80 is the fourth quarter. I'm in there. I just, I'm 65. [S2] Holy shit. I'm in what quarter?
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[S1] You're in the th- third quarter. Sorry. You better get moving. You're in the third quarter, my friend. Time. [S2] That, I thought I was in the sec- I thought it was zero to 25, 25 to 50. At 50, over the hump. Now we're on the back half of the race. 50 to 75. [S1] Oh, boy. [S2] And if you make it past 75,
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[S1] You're in the- [S2] Now the fourth quarter, 75 to 100. [S1] Yeah, 75, well- [S2] Nobody, not many people. Listen, if you can get to 100, you're in sudden death over time. And that mean, I mean literally. [S1] It's not a good game. [S2] Literally. [S1] It's not a good game. [S2] It, it could happen like this. [S1] Yeah, it's not a good game. Every day. Every day could be the day. [S2] That's it. [S1] Oh, Pop-Pop woke up again. [S2] [LAUGHS] Thought he was dead. [S1] Oh God, he's up. Everybody, everybody. [S2] Cancel that trip to the mortuary. [S1] Cancel, yeah.
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[S1] If I fall out of love with acting, then yeah. And look, my mom has Alzheimer's, so genetically, it's in there. [S2] Yeah. [S1] If, if I get to the point where I can't memorize my lines, if I can't do a play, if I can't memorize my, my lines, then I'm not gonna be an actor on stage with the earbuds in there. [S2] Mm-hmm. [S1] Tell 'em, you know, you looked very handsome today. You looked very handsome today. [S2] So there's no,
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[S1] Now, here's the difference. I have an end day. I already have it in my head. [S2] Can you share it? [S1] No, I don't want to tell anybody. [S2] Can you whisper it to me? [S1] No, then that's telling somebody. [S2] Can I put it out on my social? [S1] No. What are you doing? I just told you. I just told you. I don't, I don't want to share it, but I'm telling you. [S2] Can I write it on a bathroom wall? [S1] No, what are you, are you listening to what I'm telling you? [S2] God, I can't do anything.
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[S1] Are you listening to what I'm telling you? [S2] God, I can't do anything. [S1] Listen to what I'm telling you. [S2] Okay. [S1] I'm thinking about the day that I, that I shut it off. But the part that I shut off is my personal investment. The machine should still- [S2] Yeah. [S1] ... should still be able to run from everything that's been put into it- [S2] Right. [S1] ... all the pieces of the puzzle. That should go. But I do have a date in time. [S2] Now, when you
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[S1] What are you doing? Why don't, why don't I just tell you outside of this? [S2] 62, 63. [S1] 50 years old. [S2] 50. [S1] 50. I'll be age 50. [S2] I broke you down. [S1] You broke, what? You didn't break me down. [S2] I broke you down. [S1] You didn't break me down. [S2] I broke you. [S1] Okay. This is ridiculous, is what it is. Another one for you. This is a doozy, okay? This is a real doozy. [S2] Uh-oh. [S1] So you say you don't have any other hobbies. [S2] No. [S1] Right? You say you don't spend money on anything else. You love to work.
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[S1] You have a tequila, a mezcal. [S2] Mezcal. [S1] A mezcal. You and, uh, Aaron Paul. [S2] And Aaron Paul.
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[S1] Uh, Aaron Paul. [S2] Aaron Paul and Dos Hombres. [S1] And Dos Hombres. [S2] Yeah. [S1] Right. This is kinda like a extracurricular activity. [S2] I have the same work ethic that you do. [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] If I'm gonna do something, I'm gonna go all the way. We, we talk to distributors of Dos Hombres everywhere and we say, "Look, this is no different than, than doing a film, a television series where I'm invested and I'm passionately involved in it." [S1] Mm-hmm. [S2] We wanna make our mezcal the number one
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Mescal in the world. [S1] Do you, do you love the space? [S2] I do. [S1] You love the space. [S2] It's fascinating to me. [S1] Yeah. [S2] And I'm learning so much. It's a, it's, I'm carving out a new area and Aaron Paul is actually brilliant. [S1] He's a great guy, man. [S2] In this, in this. He really is. And he got me involved in this. It, it was his idea. [S1] You guys basically kept that relationship going. [S2] Yeah. [S1] After you maintained it. [S2] Yeah. [S1] I mean, that's a lot of years of work to get it up.
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