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lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn809tv

gn8koxf

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

Not a lawyer but work in rental housing. You need to check your lease very carefully but in Texas they cannot take rent and apply it to late fees or other expenses unless specified. You would have to pay them specifically for late fees or other expenses, rent is for rent.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8imd9

gn7zxvu

Is the property manager who offered you the discounts the same manager as the one claiming that you now owe her back most of the discounts? If you were never offered the discounts every month, why didn't they say something sooner and continue letting you pay your rent for $200 less?

Hi there! I’m the LegalFAQ bot. It looks like you may be experiencing housing issues related to housing or eviction. Come to https://legalfaq.org to find legal resources for renters in each state. You can also find links to local groups that can help you with legal, financial, or other problems at https://legalfaq.org/getHelp. Help us provide accurate advice to fellow redditors: if your post was related to housing or eviction, please like this comment; otherwise, please dislike this comment.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8aa1z

gn8imd9

Look online to see if your city or state has a tenant's union. The laws around these issues vary greatly by location. A local lawyer or tenant's union or legal aid group will be able to guide you on next steps.

Is the property manager who offered you the discounts the same manager as the one claiming that you now owe her back most of the discounts? If you were never offered the discounts every month, why didn't they say something sooner and continue letting you pay your rent for $200 less?

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8cakj

gn8imd9

So, the 'outstanding items' were never addressed/fixed? Seems to be a key piece of info missing.

Is the property manager who offered you the discounts the same manager as the one claiming that you now owe her back most of the discounts? If you were never offered the discounts every month, why didn't they say something sooner and continue letting you pay your rent for $200 less?

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8imd9

gn809tv

Is the property manager who offered you the discounts the same manager as the one claiming that you now owe her back most of the discounts? If you were never offered the discounts every month, why didn't they say something sooner and continue letting you pay your rent for $200 less?

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn9axdo

gn8aa1z

So if I’m understanding this correctly, the apartment was not really up to standard, you complained, and the property manager gave you a rent concession rather than fix the issues. Now that a new company is in charge, this same manager is arguing that the concession was supposed to be a one time thing. So, here’s where I stand on this as someone who isn’t an attorney but has some legal knowledge: Absent some clear verbiage to the contrary, I think most reasonable people would assume that a rent concession for issues with an apartment would be ongoing, at least until the issues were fixed. A one time reduction in rent does not seem like a reasonable way of interpreting it that agreement, and given that residential leases as usually prepared with little room for negotiation (the legal term is “contracts of adhesion”) any ambiguity is generally resolved *against* the person drafting the document. Plain English, I think you have a very strong argument for your position while your landlord’s position is pretty weak. Here’s an issue though. You have a lot to lose. If they file for eviction, even if you win, it makes renting more difficult. A lot of landlords will automatically deny anyone who was party to an eviction suit, and there are only a few states that protect against this. I am not sure if Maryland is one of them. If I were in your shoes, I would start calling immediately for a consultation with an attorney to get their advice with the nuance of state specific law. If they feel you have a favorable position, I would ask them about drafting a letter in response on your behalf. In my experience, knowing that a tenant has legal counsel is usually enough to put an end to such nonsense.

Look online to see if your city or state has a tenant's union. The laws around these issues vary greatly by location. A local lawyer or tenant's union or legal aid group will be able to guide you on next steps.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8o009

gn9axdo

Not a lawyer. Wouldn't onus be on management company to demonstrate that concession which they gave for 8 months was only supposed to be for one month, and that such was communicated to OP? In the absence of that, the actual rent bills, and accepted payments from OP seem to tilt facts towards OP.

So if I’m understanding this correctly, the apartment was not really up to standard, you complained, and the property manager gave you a rent concession rather than fix the issues. Now that a new company is in charge, this same manager is arguing that the concession was supposed to be a one time thing. So, here’s where I stand on this as someone who isn’t an attorney but has some legal knowledge: Absent some clear verbiage to the contrary, I think most reasonable people would assume that a rent concession for issues with an apartment would be ongoing, at least until the issues were fixed. A one time reduction in rent does not seem like a reasonable way of interpreting it that agreement, and given that residential leases as usually prepared with little room for negotiation (the legal term is “contracts of adhesion”) any ambiguity is generally resolved *against* the person drafting the document. Plain English, I think you have a very strong argument for your position while your landlord’s position is pretty weak. Here’s an issue though. You have a lot to lose. If they file for eviction, even if you win, it makes renting more difficult. A lot of landlords will automatically deny anyone who was party to an eviction suit, and there are only a few states that protect against this. I am not sure if Maryland is one of them. If I were in your shoes, I would start calling immediately for a consultation with an attorney to get their advice with the nuance of state specific law. If they feel you have a favorable position, I would ask them about drafting a letter in response on your behalf. In my experience, knowing that a tenant has legal counsel is usually enough to put an end to such nonsense.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn9axdo

gn8cakj

So if I’m understanding this correctly, the apartment was not really up to standard, you complained, and the property manager gave you a rent concession rather than fix the issues. Now that a new company is in charge, this same manager is arguing that the concession was supposed to be a one time thing. So, here’s where I stand on this as someone who isn’t an attorney but has some legal knowledge: Absent some clear verbiage to the contrary, I think most reasonable people would assume that a rent concession for issues with an apartment would be ongoing, at least until the issues were fixed. A one time reduction in rent does not seem like a reasonable way of interpreting it that agreement, and given that residential leases as usually prepared with little room for negotiation (the legal term is “contracts of adhesion”) any ambiguity is generally resolved *against* the person drafting the document. Plain English, I think you have a very strong argument for your position while your landlord’s position is pretty weak. Here’s an issue though. You have a lot to lose. If they file for eviction, even if you win, it makes renting more difficult. A lot of landlords will automatically deny anyone who was party to an eviction suit, and there are only a few states that protect against this. I am not sure if Maryland is one of them. If I were in your shoes, I would start calling immediately for a consultation with an attorney to get their advice with the nuance of state specific law. If they feel you have a favorable position, I would ask them about drafting a letter in response on your behalf. In my experience, knowing that a tenant has legal counsel is usually enough to put an end to such nonsense.

So, the 'outstanding items' were never addressed/fixed? Seems to be a key piece of info missing.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8whwv

gn9axdo

Hi, landlord here... In Nevada, where I operate, the rent is agreed to in the lease. I cannot abruptly give "discounts" to the rent. We have written in the lease I can take days off, but that is provided in writing. That's the point of a lease. They are agreeing to charge you a set amount, and you are agreeing to pay a set amount. As I always say, a leave is a living document, and it works both ways. You need to get a copy of your lease that YOU SIGNED, and tell them to stick to their part. If you've paid that part, you are in good standing. The ONLY caveat I can think of would be an exception to days rented. I took 5 days off one of my tenants rent when they had a gas issue, as we agreed they would not get a hotel, and instead chose to have 5 days off of their rent. This was all in writing from my PM, with my signature, their signature, and everyone was provided copies.

So if I’m understanding this correctly, the apartment was not really up to standard, you complained, and the property manager gave you a rent concession rather than fix the issues. Now that a new company is in charge, this same manager is arguing that the concession was supposed to be a one time thing. So, here’s where I stand on this as someone who isn’t an attorney but has some legal knowledge: Absent some clear verbiage to the contrary, I think most reasonable people would assume that a rent concession for issues with an apartment would be ongoing, at least until the issues were fixed. A one time reduction in rent does not seem like a reasonable way of interpreting it that agreement, and given that residential leases as usually prepared with little room for negotiation (the legal term is “contracts of adhesion”) any ambiguity is generally resolved *against* the person drafting the document. Plain English, I think you have a very strong argument for your position while your landlord’s position is pretty weak. Here’s an issue though. You have a lot to lose. If they file for eviction, even if you win, it makes renting more difficult. A lot of landlords will automatically deny anyone who was party to an eviction suit, and there are only a few states that protect against this. I am not sure if Maryland is one of them. If I were in your shoes, I would start calling immediately for a consultation with an attorney to get their advice with the nuance of state specific law. If they feel you have a favorable position, I would ask them about drafting a letter in response on your behalf. In my experience, knowing that a tenant has legal counsel is usually enough to put an end to such nonsense.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn9axdo

gn809tv

So if I’m understanding this correctly, the apartment was not really up to standard, you complained, and the property manager gave you a rent concession rather than fix the issues. Now that a new company is in charge, this same manager is arguing that the concession was supposed to be a one time thing. So, here’s where I stand on this as someone who isn’t an attorney but has some legal knowledge: Absent some clear verbiage to the contrary, I think most reasonable people would assume that a rent concession for issues with an apartment would be ongoing, at least until the issues were fixed. A one time reduction in rent does not seem like a reasonable way of interpreting it that agreement, and given that residential leases as usually prepared with little room for negotiation (the legal term is “contracts of adhesion”) any ambiguity is generally resolved *against* the person drafting the document. Plain English, I think you have a very strong argument for your position while your landlord’s position is pretty weak. Here’s an issue though. You have a lot to lose. If they file for eviction, even if you win, it makes renting more difficult. A lot of landlords will automatically deny anyone who was party to an eviction suit, and there are only a few states that protect against this. I am not sure if Maryland is one of them. If I were in your shoes, I would start calling immediately for a consultation with an attorney to get their advice with the nuance of state specific law. If they feel you have a favorable position, I would ask them about drafting a letter in response on your behalf. In my experience, knowing that a tenant has legal counsel is usually enough to put an end to such nonsense.

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8aa1z

gn809tv

Look online to see if your city or state has a tenant's union. The laws around these issues vary greatly by location. A local lawyer or tenant's union or legal aid group will be able to guide you on next steps.

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8cakj

gn8o009

So, the 'outstanding items' were never addressed/fixed? Seems to be a key piece of info missing.

Not a lawyer. Wouldn't onus be on management company to demonstrate that concession which they gave for 8 months was only supposed to be for one month, and that such was communicated to OP? In the absence of that, the actual rent bills, and accepted payments from OP seem to tilt facts towards OP.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn8o009

gn809tv

Not a lawyer. Wouldn't onus be on management company to demonstrate that concession which they gave for 8 months was only supposed to be for one month, and that such was communicated to OP? In the absence of that, the actual rent bills, and accepted payments from OP seem to tilt facts towards OP.

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn809tv

gn8cakj

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

So, the 'outstanding items' were never addressed/fixed? Seems to be a key piece of info missing.

lj1usd

legaladvice_train

Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!! My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.

gn809tv

gn8whwv

--- > http://imgur.com/a/myIAb --- *I am a bot whose sole purpose is to improve the timeliness and accuracy of responses in this subreddit.* --- **It appears you forgot to include your location in the title or body of your post. Please update the body of your original post to include this information.** --- ***Do NOT delete this post - Instead, simply edit the post with the requested information.*** --- Author: /u/bluefrog3301 Title: **Propery manager conducted audit and says I owe $1600 in back payments for discounts erroneously given to me. They have taken my February rent to apply to this oversight and is now telling me that I am behind on February rent!!!** Original Post: > My apartment manager is harassing me for money I do not owe. When I moved into my apartment there were many outstanding deficiencies. I sent an exhaustive email detailing/noting all of the items that they promised to do prior to my move in that were not completed. The property manager conducted a walk thru of my unit. I pointed out all of the outstanding items. She apologized for the many oversights and told me that they would apply concessions to me account verbally and via email. The amount and duration of the concessions were not told to me. My rent is $1500 a month and for 8 months I received a concession of $200 off of my monthly rent. I paid $1300 per month plus water, as billed. Now the property manager sent me a notice stating that I owe back $1600 because she hadn't intended to give me those discounts and it was meant to only be a one-time discount of $200. She has taken my Feb rent payment and applied it toward this amount and informed me that I am now behind on my rent. When submitting my rent checks I always made note on my checks that the check was to cover rent+water. I have never missed a rent payment and never paid late. Always paid my rent on time, minus the concessions that were given to me. I received a notice demanding I pay the delinquent rent (that IMo is not delinquent) or face eviction. Also, received a notice to renew my lease. Another note... the property is under new ownership and management and they are telling me that these discounts though given to me from the prior owner/management company are now owed to them. The onsite property manager, the one harassing me, is the same onsite manager who issued the discounts and now working with the new company.   --- LocationBot 4.999988713 83/601rds | Report Issues | >!TdUO5NmMWlXWXJFcjJzZ!<

Hi, landlord here... In Nevada, where I operate, the rent is agreed to in the lease. I cannot abruptly give "discounts" to the rent. We have written in the lease I can take days off, but that is provided in writing. That's the point of a lease. They are agreeing to charge you a set amount, and you are agreeing to pay a set amount. As I always say, a leave is a living document, and it works both ways. You need to get a copy of your lease that YOU SIGNED, and tell them to stick to their part. If you've paid that part, you are in good standing. The ONLY caveat I can think of would be an exception to days rented. I took 5 days off one of my tenants rent when they had a gas issue, as we agreed they would not get a hotel, and instead chose to have 5 days off of their rent. This was all in writing from my PM, with my signature, their signature, and everyone was provided copies.

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egmm8nf

egmu6az

Document everything! The text messages between you The agreement that it would be onky a week The social media shpwing what she was doing for three weeks

File for emergency custody, for starters. Do not let her take him. Do not let her parents take him. If he’s in school/daycare, alert them of the situation and her current state. And lastly, ignore the bullshit on social media. The people that matter will know the truth.

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egmu6az

egmp7zc

File for emergency custody, for starters. Do not let her take him. Do not let her parents take him. If he’s in school/daycare, alert them of the situation and her current state. And lastly, ignore the bullshit on social media. The people that matter will know the truth.

File for emergency custody at the court house first thing on Monday. Are you on the birth certificate? Does she have custody? Edit: Saw your comment below. Would this normally be your weekend?

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egnkamx

egnr3jq

I'm in a family of CPS workers. They see this all the time. There might be a court battle but in the end you will get full custody of this child. Which also means she will be required to pay you child support. What you need to do is get a lawyer that helps you. If she shows up high or drunk, call the police. If she abandons the child with you again, call both the police and CPS to get it documented. I'm talking immediately, *at most* you wait one hour after the mutually agreed pick-up time. Not days. You want her abandonment documented and you want it formally decided that you get to take care of the child in the meantime.

A month ago you posted how the mother is posting on social media that she spends the child support on herself. You stated he has no toys, no new clothes etc. Now she's abandoned him and will "be back eventually". Stop waiting to do something! You can get another career, you can't replace your child. Call CPS, do it today! Tomorrow get a lawyer. This child needs you.

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egn4g59

egnr3jq

It wouldn't hurt to call the police, make a report, show them what's what, and get child services involved so that the baby remains safe with you.

A month ago you posted how the mother is posting on social media that she spends the child support on herself. You stated he has no toys, no new clothes etc. Now she's abandoned him and will "be back eventually". Stop waiting to do something! You can get another career, you can't replace your child. Call CPS, do it today! Tomorrow get a lawyer. This child needs you.

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egnr3jq

egn6m69

A month ago you posted how the mother is posting on social media that she spends the child support on herself. You stated he has no toys, no new clothes etc. Now she's abandoned him and will "be back eventually". Stop waiting to do something! You can get another career, you can't replace your child. Call CPS, do it today! Tomorrow get a lawyer. This child needs you.

Looks like you about to get full custody :)

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egn4g59

egnkamx

It wouldn't hurt to call the police, make a report, show them what's what, and get child services involved so that the baby remains safe with you.

I'm in a family of CPS workers. They see this all the time. There might be a court battle but in the end you will get full custody of this child. Which also means she will be required to pay you child support. What you need to do is get a lawyer that helps you. If she shows up high or drunk, call the police. If she abandons the child with you again, call both the police and CPS to get it documented. I'm talking immediately, *at most* you wait one hour after the mutually agreed pick-up time. Not days. You want her abandonment documented and you want it formally decided that you get to take care of the child in the meantime.

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

egnkamx

egn6m69

I'm in a family of CPS workers. They see this all the time. There might be a court battle but in the end you will get full custody of this child. Which also means she will be required to pay you child support. What you need to do is get a lawyer that helps you. If she shows up high or drunk, call the police. If she abandons the child with you again, call both the police and CPS to get it documented. I'm talking immediately, *at most* you wait one hour after the mutually agreed pick-up time. Not days. You want her abandonment documented and you want it formally decided that you get to take care of the child in the meantime.

Looks like you about to get full custody :)

arcqj5

legaladvice_train

[MI] My ex and I came to an agreement for me to keep my son for a week, she disappeared for 3 weeks, and is now saying I kidnapped him. I have had my son since the 20th of January. BM was supposed to pick him up the 27th of January, she did not pick him up. I texted her and she said “I’ll be back eventually”. During her time away she was doing hardcore drugs, driving reckless, and partying(she posted these things online). She showed up at my door yesterday, no car, barely any clothes, and obviously still high on something, wanting our son. I refused to give him to her and called her parents to take her home. Today she is now posting that I kidnapped our son, she didn’t know where he was, and that I’m abusing him. Absolutely none of this is true, she has not even tried to come get him today. I have cameras in front of my house and can prove that. What I have: 1. Screenshots of every text message between me and my ex agreeing to me having him for a week, her saying she’d be back eventually, and my “where are yous?” during these 3 weeks, 2. Phone call recordings of me and her parents talking about her showing up to my house high 3. Screen recordings of her doing drugs, reckless driving, etc 4. The video of her showing up to my house high How do I proceed from here? I am worried that she will call the police and this will destroy my career. I am already getting hate mail.

ego9430

egp6245

Sounds like you should be filing a potential neglect report against her and trying to get full custody. If you still don't want to do that, then just keep all the evidence together so you can give it to police if they actually come knocking. If you can fit it all on a few dvds to just give to them, even better

First thing tomorrow go to the local court and file for emergency custody. Do not bring your son to school as she may go get him from there. You will have to wait at the courthouse for your decision (at least in NH you do). If it is approved you have to bring copies to his school immediately. Make sure to change who is allowed to pick him up.

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn4521e

dn3wmcg

I'm in AA, 2.5 years sober. You are a drunk talking to another drunk. You are not a therapist or a priest. You 1000000000% are not obligated to keep this confidential. You keep things confidential to a point - accusing someone of being a child molester is past that point. Also, child molesters have the WORST of the ABSOLUTE WORST treatment in prison, both from other inmates or staff. The excuse "my ex framed me" is a pretty typical justification, which means it is not believed. Also to the person who said you would not be allowed to sponsor.. that's complete bullshit. Once again, there's a line to AA confidentiality.. i can't think of ANYONE in my (very big) circle/network of AA friends who would look down upon you/think badly of you, and also.. AA cannot decide who can and cannot sponsor. You could have 30 years of continuous sobriety and I had 10 minutes and I could still sponsor you. Also, what the everliving fuck is she going to do when she gets to step 9? "Made a direct amends to such people wherever possible" THIS IS POSSIBLE FOR HER AND SHE SAID SHE'S NOT GOING TO DO IT. If you get shit in your homegroup/local AA meetings, fucking sprint to find a new one.

The information would be best in the hands of his lawyer. If you know the town you can try googling "town + state" + "crime" and sift through the google news results to try to find him. Once you know his name and when he was convicted, you should be able to figure out which facility he's in, where you can then write him and let him know what she said to you both. Finally, write down as specifically as possible everything that happened that's related. It could be a while before this goes anywhere, and your testimony will have more weight if our recorded the details now, rather then what you remember in a few months or more. *edited for grammar*

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn4521e

dn44xvr

I'm in AA, 2.5 years sober. You are a drunk talking to another drunk. You are not a therapist or a priest. You 1000000000% are not obligated to keep this confidential. You keep things confidential to a point - accusing someone of being a child molester is past that point. Also, child molesters have the WORST of the ABSOLUTE WORST treatment in prison, both from other inmates or staff. The excuse "my ex framed me" is a pretty typical justification, which means it is not believed. Also to the person who said you would not be allowed to sponsor.. that's complete bullshit. Once again, there's a line to AA confidentiality.. i can't think of ANYONE in my (very big) circle/network of AA friends who would look down upon you/think badly of you, and also.. AA cannot decide who can and cannot sponsor. You could have 30 years of continuous sobriety and I had 10 minutes and I could still sponsor you. Also, what the everliving fuck is she going to do when she gets to step 9? "Made a direct amends to such people wherever possible" THIS IS POSSIBLE FOR HER AND SHE SAID SHE'S NOT GOING TO DO IT. If you get shit in your homegroup/local AA meetings, fucking sprint to find a new one.

> she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. Wait, what? So *she* has admitted to producing child pornography as well as falsifying an accusation?

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn4521e

dn3z8n1

I'm in AA, 2.5 years sober. You are a drunk talking to another drunk. You are not a therapist or a priest. You 1000000000% are not obligated to keep this confidential. You keep things confidential to a point - accusing someone of being a child molester is past that point. Also, child molesters have the WORST of the ABSOLUTE WORST treatment in prison, both from other inmates or staff. The excuse "my ex framed me" is a pretty typical justification, which means it is not believed. Also to the person who said you would not be allowed to sponsor.. that's complete bullshit. Once again, there's a line to AA confidentiality.. i can't think of ANYONE in my (very big) circle/network of AA friends who would look down upon you/think badly of you, and also.. AA cannot decide who can and cannot sponsor. You could have 30 years of continuous sobriety and I had 10 minutes and I could still sponsor you. Also, what the everliving fuck is she going to do when she gets to step 9? "Made a direct amends to such people wherever possible" THIS IS POSSIBLE FOR HER AND SHE SAID SHE'S NOT GOING TO DO IT. If you get shit in your homegroup/local AA meetings, fucking sprint to find a new one.

AA will likely no longer allow you to sponsor after this, they take the confidentiality part pretty seriously. That said, AA has no legal protection of actual confidentiality like client-attorney privilege. You think this is bad? The Innocence Project had a case where murders occurred and the police thought there were multiple murderers. In fact, there was only one. The murderer made a plea deal to get life in prison instead of the death penalty in exchange for testifying against the innocent one. The innocent one was subsequently convicted. The murderer had bragged about doing this to his lawyer, and only his lawyer. Because of client-attorney privilege there was nothing the lawyer could do. Luckily, his client died after a decade, and notified the Innocence Project. The innocent was released after 13 years on death row. You have no legal requirement to go down this path. Don't let the eventual AA rejection get to you, this is the righteous course of action to get that evidence. There may enough evidence he is still convicted or not enough to even overturn the verdict. There is nothing you can do about that.

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn3x7xe

dn4521e

Yes, write it down, date, times, names. Our former FBI director makes a good case on the importance of keeping notes. It does carry weight.

I'm in AA, 2.5 years sober. You are a drunk talking to another drunk. You are not a therapist or a priest. You 1000000000% are not obligated to keep this confidential. You keep things confidential to a point - accusing someone of being a child molester is past that point. Also, child molesters have the WORST of the ABSOLUTE WORST treatment in prison, both from other inmates or staff. The excuse "my ex framed me" is a pretty typical justification, which means it is not believed. Also to the person who said you would not be allowed to sponsor.. that's complete bullshit. Once again, there's a line to AA confidentiality.. i can't think of ANYONE in my (very big) circle/network of AA friends who would look down upon you/think badly of you, and also.. AA cannot decide who can and cannot sponsor. You could have 30 years of continuous sobriety and I had 10 minutes and I could still sponsor you. Also, what the everliving fuck is she going to do when she gets to step 9? "Made a direct amends to such people wherever possible" THIS IS POSSIBLE FOR HER AND SHE SAID SHE'S NOT GOING TO DO IT. If you get shit in your homegroup/local AA meetings, fucking sprint to find a new one.

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn3z8n1

dn44xvr

AA will likely no longer allow you to sponsor after this, they take the confidentiality part pretty seriously. That said, AA has no legal protection of actual confidentiality like client-attorney privilege. You think this is bad? The Innocence Project had a case where murders occurred and the police thought there were multiple murderers. In fact, there was only one. The murderer made a plea deal to get life in prison instead of the death penalty in exchange for testifying against the innocent one. The innocent one was subsequently convicted. The murderer had bragged about doing this to his lawyer, and only his lawyer. Because of client-attorney privilege there was nothing the lawyer could do. Luckily, his client died after a decade, and notified the Innocence Project. The innocent was released after 13 years on death row. You have no legal requirement to go down this path. Don't let the eventual AA rejection get to you, this is the righteous course of action to get that evidence. There may enough evidence he is still convicted or not enough to even overturn the verdict. There is nothing you can do about that.

> she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. Wait, what? So *she* has admitted to producing child pornography as well as falsifying an accusation?

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn3x7xe

dn44xvr

Yes, write it down, date, times, names. Our former FBI director makes a good case on the importance of keeping notes. It does carry weight.

> she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. Wait, what? So *she* has admitted to producing child pornography as well as falsifying an accusation?

70kto1

legaladvice_train

(FL) I sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous and heard a fifth-step inventory today where a woman told me that she sent her ex-boyfriend to prison by lying and saying that he molested her child. I clearly asked her if she was going to rectify this situation as part of her recovery and she basically said No, that he deserved it; that she was including this so that she didn't have to feel guilty about it. She didn't feel guilty, she was quite smug. I played along and asked her a few questions about the situation. Poor bastard. Later this evening we were both outside of a meeting and talking with a mutual friend. I started to complain about my ex-boyfriend, saying what a jerk he was. Then I teasingly said that she had gotten back at her ex so good that she sent him to prison over some bullshit lie, and she laughed and agreed! So basically I tricked her into admitting it in front of a second witness. What do I do now with this information? I'm assuming that I'm not obligated to keep this confidential. This might ostracize me from the fellowship, but I don't care; I was so utterly horrified by this. I don't know what this man's name is. It happened about a year ago apparently. I have really specific information- she used his phone to take pictures of the kid unbeknownst to him. He already had a criminal record but it wasn't for anything awful like this. What do I do? Also, I'm not quite sure if it happened in Florida or if this was before she moved here.

dn3z8n1

dn3x7xe

AA will likely no longer allow you to sponsor after this, they take the confidentiality part pretty seriously. That said, AA has no legal protection of actual confidentiality like client-attorney privilege. You think this is bad? The Innocence Project had a case where murders occurred and the police thought there were multiple murderers. In fact, there was only one. The murderer made a plea deal to get life in prison instead of the death penalty in exchange for testifying against the innocent one. The innocent one was subsequently convicted. The murderer had bragged about doing this to his lawyer, and only his lawyer. Because of client-attorney privilege there was nothing the lawyer could do. Luckily, his client died after a decade, and notified the Innocence Project. The innocent was released after 13 years on death row. You have no legal requirement to go down this path. Don't let the eventual AA rejection get to you, this is the righteous course of action to get that evidence. There may enough evidence he is still convicted or not enough to even overturn the verdict. There is nothing you can do about that.

Yes, write it down, date, times, names. Our former FBI director makes a good case on the importance of keeping notes. It does carry weight.

2q6s0k

legaladvice_train

Divorced a year, my ex-wife is getting daughter for the week of Christmas to spend with her and her boyfriend (who my daughter shouldn't be around) I was divorced a year ago, been separated for three. It was brutal; she cheated on me with three different men, start abusing prescription pain killers with her latest boyfriend and had me put in jail for a week for a crime I didn't commit. After an outrageous amount of money payed to a lawyer and a private investigator, I'm free and clear of any criminal charges and have primary physical custody of my 6 year old autistic daughter. Her mom gets her alternating weekends and holidays. Keeping it short, our agreement states that my ex needs to pay for half of our daughter's medical expenses and that our daughter is to have absolutely no contact whatsoever with her latest boyfriend. My ex lies to me and says that she isn't seeing him, even going so far as fabricating another man's name to throw me off. I've hired a PI again who got evidence that the man was with my ex while she had our daughter for the weekend, and I've got a print off of the guys facebook page showing the two of them together and in a relationship and that he lives there. Thats on top of the fact that she pays almost nothing regarding her medical bills (I haven't seen any money in two months). I've just dropped my daughter off to be with her mom for Christmas for five days. This is the first I've been away. I'm nauseated that I'm dropping her off to spend time with the this scum-bag degenerate druggy and my sociopath ex. How to I get through this, reddit. I feel prepared to go back to family court to address these issues, I can't live with myself knowing I stood by and watched the worst human I've ever met become a permanent fixture in my daughter's life. This is VA, by the way. --- **tl;dr**: Ex-wife lives with scumbag who she legally shouldn't be with, and is now getting common daughter for christmas.

cn3deyt

cn3do51

Unless the court order says he cannot be around her, or he is a registered sex offender then legally he can be around her. If you have evidence that he abused your child then you can file to modify the court order or possibly a restraining order.

Can you file to terminate her visitation rights? Or at least make it supervised? EDIT -- not sure why I am being downvoted. This is a valid step he can take.

24a1yy

legaladvice_train

[California] My girlfriend's ex sending out her nudes (of when she was underage) to her parents and harasses her, but now lives out of state, can anything be done? The title pretty much sums it up, I'm just curious if any legal action can be taken against this guy. He is apparently homeless and just mooches off of friends and will jump from state to state. She says theres nothing the police can do about him but I'm getting really sick of this constant harassment and wonder if there is any way to take legal action against this guy? He just recently sent her underage nudes to her mom which would be enough proof of the child pornography part, but he has constantly harassed her for the past two years since they have broken up. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated, thank you.

ch51vqb

ch525xv

Everyone needs to go to the police together and file a police report. You may also want to contact the police in the state that he is currently in, if you know.

Wait, did you say he's distributing child pornography across state lines?

1fqh2j

legaladvice_train

Dallas, TX - I am living with a now ex girlfriend (off the lease), can she legally take all my belongings and throw them away because they are in her apartment? She assaulted me last night, and was threatening to hurt herself, so I called the cops. They told me to find another place to stay, so I did. They arrested her, and now her dad is driving down here, and says that if I don't have all my things out by 5 pm, he's going to throw them in the dumpster. Doesn't sound legal to me. What statutes, precedents, etc can I hold up printed copies of and (hopefully) convince him not to do that? Or should I just pack as much as I can and gtfo

cacrvi5

cacs7oc

How long were you living in the home before this all happened?

You don't have to leave the apartment until a court orders you to. In fact, if she assaulted you, there's an excellent chance that one of her bail conditions is going to be that she has to stay away from you and/or the apartment. If you don't want to leave, simply go home. It's your home, you live there, and until you leave voluntarily or are evicted by a court, it will remain your home. You do not have to let her father inside at all, and if he shows up without his daughter, you're free to call the police if he refuses to leave. If your ex has been bailed out of jail, call whatever jail/court she's dealing with and find out if a restraining order is in place and if that means she can't come home. Calling the arresting officer might get results for you too.

1fqh2j

legaladvice_train

Dallas, TX - I am living with a now ex girlfriend (off the lease), can she legally take all my belongings and throw them away because they are in her apartment? She assaulted me last night, and was threatening to hurt herself, so I called the cops. They told me to find another place to stay, so I did. They arrested her, and now her dad is driving down here, and says that if I don't have all my things out by 5 pm, he's going to throw them in the dumpster. Doesn't sound legal to me. What statutes, precedents, etc can I hold up printed copies of and (hopefully) convince him not to do that? Or should I just pack as much as I can and gtfo

cacrvi5

cacs95l

How long were you living in the home before this all happened?

That'd be, hands down, theft of property. However, that doesn't stop a vengeful dad from throwing your stuff away. Dad's are crazy sometimes. I figure, you're legally safe, but is it worth all the effort you'll have to go through if they do decide to break the law? Edit: You're living with your ex, so I'm assuming your relationship is relatively sound (minus the recent happenings), so maybe she can calm her dad down? Or is the "ex" as result of this happening?

1fqh2j

legaladvice_train

Dallas, TX - I am living with a now ex girlfriend (off the lease), can she legally take all my belongings and throw them away because they are in her apartment? She assaulted me last night, and was threatening to hurt herself, so I called the cops. They told me to find another place to stay, so I did. They arrested her, and now her dad is driving down here, and says that if I don't have all my things out by 5 pm, he's going to throw them in the dumpster. Doesn't sound legal to me. What statutes, precedents, etc can I hold up printed copies of and (hopefully) convince him not to do that? Or should I just pack as much as I can and gtfo

cad22ye

cacrvi5

here are the numbers to the victim's services in dallas Victim Services – (for victims of homicide, sexual assault, aggravated assault, aggravated robberies, and traffic crimes). Pat Leal Keaton – Victim Services Coordinator –(Spanish Speaker) 214-671-3587 (Mon–Fri.) Krissi Boulom – Victim Advocate - 214-671-3588 - (Mon – Fri.) Sue Kelly – Victim Advocate - 214-671-3669 (Tues & Wed.) Family Violence Contact: (for victims of domestic/family violence) Sylvia Paige - Family Violence Counselor 214-671-4325 Petra Tamez – Family Violence Counselor – 214-671-4307 i would suggest starting with the family violence contact, but if you feel that you are not getting the right attention call the general crime contact (in my experience, male victims are NOT ignored by DV workers like reddit often suggests, however i cant speak to this particular agency). an advocate can help you with the next step, including a protection order that could possibly bar her from the residence (im not positive how it will work since she has the lease and i do not work in texas)

How long were you living in the home before this all happened?

yjp43w

legaladvice_train

A technician from an HVAC company damaged my ceiling while he was in the attic and now suing me for personal injury. What are my options? I reached out to a fairly large HVAC company in my region for seasonal HVAC unit maintenance. A technician came and went to the attic to examine the HVAC unit. When he was in the attic, he stepped on the ceiling and his leg punched through the ceiling making a big hole. The technician fell awkwardly but did not fall through the ceiling. I contacted the HVAC company immediately and the company apologized and sent a cleaning person on the same day. The company also wrote me an e-mail stating that they will reimburse the cost of repair, which was $1,000. A few days later, I received a letter from a law firm stating the technician sustained a personal injury and I am to contact my insurance company immediately. &#x200B; What do you think I should do next?

iup09oz

iup1wkd

Contact your homeowners insurance and let them handle it. They have to sue for your homeowners insurance to even come to the table.

>I am to contact my insurance company immediately That is absolutely the correct course of action. Your insurer will give you advice, including: * Whether or not to answer the letter directly * Whether or not to contact the employer letting them know their employee may be trying to double-dip on worker's compensation * Exactly how your insurer will represent or defend you A good insurer will say "send us the letter, and all the work orders and correspondence from the maintenance contract, and we'll take care of this."

gvo6yt

legaladvice_train

Can i (a minor 17) press charges on my moms abusive boyfriend if my mom refuses to? Earlier tonight i was lying on my couch and i head my mom scream from her room so i ran in to see her boyfriend on top of her with his hand around her neck. He got off and left as soon as i came in. i let him walk away while i talked to my mom to figure out exactly what happened and she told me that he got pissed after she refused to let him look at her phone i told her she needed to call the police but she said she wouldnt becuase 1. She didnt want my sibling to get involved and 2. She didnt want him getting in trouble. This isnt the first time this has happend ive had to detain him before but was able to do so fairly easily because im alot stronger than he is however this time he came back in from the house with a glock and cocked it on his way to his room while everyone else was eating dinner for all my strength im no match for a gun and im genuinely scared for the first time since i was a small child i told my mom i wouldnt do anything at least until Tomorrow when my younger sibling leave to go visit our biological father but that was before the gun should i disregard our agreement and call the police? And can they even do anything about it if i did call them?

fsqylao

fsqeh1o

If you haven't called the police yet, do it now. This isn't a legal advice situation, this is a "you, your sibling, and your mother are in danger of being murdered" situation. Full stop. Call CPS as well

Do call the police if you haven’t already. Your mother is not safe and neither are you or your siblings. I urge you to reach out to a Domestic Violence hotline like ncadv.org. They have some really great resources and can help you navigate the system and this situation. Additionally, you NEED a safety plan. On average, it takes domestic violence victims 7 tries before they completely leave their partner. Do not give up on your mom. She is scared and manipulated by her partner. Please call the police.

gvo6yt

legaladvice_train

Can i (a minor 17) press charges on my moms abusive boyfriend if my mom refuses to? Earlier tonight i was lying on my couch and i head my mom scream from her room so i ran in to see her boyfriend on top of her with his hand around her neck. He got off and left as soon as i came in. i let him walk away while i talked to my mom to figure out exactly what happened and she told me that he got pissed after she refused to let him look at her phone i told her she needed to call the police but she said she wouldnt becuase 1. She didnt want my sibling to get involved and 2. She didnt want him getting in trouble. This isnt the first time this has happend ive had to detain him before but was able to do so fairly easily because im alot stronger than he is however this time he came back in from the house with a glock and cocked it on his way to his room while everyone else was eating dinner for all my strength im no match for a gun and im genuinely scared for the first time since i was a small child i told my mom i wouldnt do anything at least until Tomorrow when my younger sibling leave to go visit our biological father but that was before the gun should i disregard our agreement and call the police? And can they even do anything about it if i did call them?

fsq9ao3

fsqylao

You can always keep a record (photos videos audio depending on your states consent laws) and always report to the police as another poster said now that there is a firearm on the property the police will take it more seriously. You can also contact domestic abuse lines or outreach in your area they can help you as well and reach out to CPS or to a children's domestic abuse line as well. Edit Not a lawyer

If you haven't called the police yet, do it now. This isn't a legal advice situation, this is a "you, your sibling, and your mother are in danger of being murdered" situation. Full stop. Call CPS as well

gvo6yt

legaladvice_train

Can i (a minor 17) press charges on my moms abusive boyfriend if my mom refuses to? Earlier tonight i was lying on my couch and i head my mom scream from her room so i ran in to see her boyfriend on top of her with his hand around her neck. He got off and left as soon as i came in. i let him walk away while i talked to my mom to figure out exactly what happened and she told me that he got pissed after she refused to let him look at her phone i told her she needed to call the police but she said she wouldnt becuase 1. She didnt want my sibling to get involved and 2. She didnt want him getting in trouble. This isnt the first time this has happend ive had to detain him before but was able to do so fairly easily because im alot stronger than he is however this time he came back in from the house with a glock and cocked it on his way to his room while everyone else was eating dinner for all my strength im no match for a gun and im genuinely scared for the first time since i was a small child i told my mom i wouldnt do anything at least until Tomorrow when my younger sibling leave to go visit our biological father but that was before the gun should i disregard our agreement and call the police? And can they even do anything about it if i did call them?

fsqf96w

fsqylao

Call the police ASAP. Tell them you witnessed the boyfriend showing aggressive behavior, and that you saw him lay hands on your mom. And most importantly, tell them he just took out a gun. Keep your brother in a separate room, or with a neighbor, just away from the boyfriend when you do this. When you make the call, tell them your mom might lie for him.

If you haven't called the police yet, do it now. This isn't a legal advice situation, this is a "you, your sibling, and your mother are in danger of being murdered" situation. Full stop. Call CPS as well

gvo6yt

legaladvice_train

Can i (a minor 17) press charges on my moms abusive boyfriend if my mom refuses to? Earlier tonight i was lying on my couch and i head my mom scream from her room so i ran in to see her boyfriend on top of her with his hand around her neck. He got off and left as soon as i came in. i let him walk away while i talked to my mom to figure out exactly what happened and she told me that he got pissed after she refused to let him look at her phone i told her she needed to call the police but she said she wouldnt becuase 1. She didnt want my sibling to get involved and 2. She didnt want him getting in trouble. This isnt the first time this has happend ive had to detain him before but was able to do so fairly easily because im alot stronger than he is however this time he came back in from the house with a glock and cocked it on his way to his room while everyone else was eating dinner for all my strength im no match for a gun and im genuinely scared for the first time since i was a small child i told my mom i wouldnt do anything at least until Tomorrow when my younger sibling leave to go visit our biological father but that was before the gun should i disregard our agreement and call the police? And can they even do anything about it if i did call them?

fsq9ao3

fsqeh1o

You can always keep a record (photos videos audio depending on your states consent laws) and always report to the police as another poster said now that there is a firearm on the property the police will take it more seriously. You can also contact domestic abuse lines or outreach in your area they can help you as well and reach out to CPS or to a children's domestic abuse line as well. Edit Not a lawyer

Do call the police if you haven’t already. Your mother is not safe and neither are you or your siblings. I urge you to reach out to a Domestic Violence hotline like ncadv.org. They have some really great resources and can help you navigate the system and this situation. Additionally, you NEED a safety plan. On average, it takes domestic violence victims 7 tries before they completely leave their partner. Do not give up on your mom. She is scared and manipulated by her partner. Please call the police.

gvo6yt

legaladvice_train

Can i (a minor 17) press charges on my moms abusive boyfriend if my mom refuses to? Earlier tonight i was lying on my couch and i head my mom scream from her room so i ran in to see her boyfriend on top of her with his hand around her neck. He got off and left as soon as i came in. i let him walk away while i talked to my mom to figure out exactly what happened and she told me that he got pissed after she refused to let him look at her phone i told her she needed to call the police but she said she wouldnt becuase 1. She didnt want my sibling to get involved and 2. She didnt want him getting in trouble. This isnt the first time this has happend ive had to detain him before but was able to do so fairly easily because im alot stronger than he is however this time he came back in from the house with a glock and cocked it on his way to his room while everyone else was eating dinner for all my strength im no match for a gun and im genuinely scared for the first time since i was a small child i told my mom i wouldnt do anything at least until Tomorrow when my younger sibling leave to go visit our biological father but that was before the gun should i disregard our agreement and call the police? And can they even do anything about it if i did call them?

fsref6x

fsqf96w

Spouse of a cop- the state has the right to prosecute in family violence cases even if there is not an (adult) complaintant. Please call the police and let them know what is going on.

Call the police ASAP. Tell them you witnessed the boyfriend showing aggressive behavior, and that you saw him lay hands on your mom. And most importantly, tell them he just took out a gun. Keep your brother in a separate room, or with a neighbor, just away from the boyfriend when you do this. When you make the call, tell them your mom might lie for him.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipuj13x

ipunuwz

Yes. That is blatant fraud. If you want to take legal action, have a chat with a lawyer, many do free consultations, and they will tell you every step that needs to be taken. Some lawyers even do flat rates for stuff that can be taken care of easily.

You can also call the state housing dept that provides the assistance and report it, they will also go after people who fraudulently claim benefits.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipvcd0s

ipuj13x

I’d also recommend checking your credit report to make sure there’s no unauthorized accounts opened you weren’t aware of.

Yes. That is blatant fraud. If you want to take legal action, have a chat with a lawyer, many do free consultations, and they will tell you every step that needs to be taken. Some lawyers even do flat rates for stuff that can be taken care of easily.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipwzcx5

ipx1whd

You would not take any action. The state is the injured party in this case.

I am not a lawyer but I work for my local housing authority. Depending on what type of rental assistance she is on, you should seek out the office that is supplying her with the assistance. Give them her name, your name, and let them know you do not live there and need to be removed from her case. She should have a case worker or case manager of some sort.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipx1whd

ipwc3ue

I am not a lawyer but I work for my local housing authority. Depending on what type of rental assistance she is on, you should seek out the office that is supplying her with the assistance. Give them her name, your name, and let them know you do not live there and need to be removed from her case. She should have a case worker or case manager of some sort.

Not a lawyer, definitely fraud but you wouldn’t gain much if anything by taking legal action. You can report it and have the government take action and get back what you missed out on which may or may not be worth the trouble. I would call her and let her know to stop so you can appropriately get it before taking legal action, just me though.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipwzcx5

ipx84um

You would not take any action. The state is the injured party in this case.

It’s fraud but not fraud against you. Just keep pressing the issue with the government agency you are trying to get rental assistance from. They need to take you off her claim so you can put one in for yourself. It’s their call if they want to pursue charges against your mother.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipx84um

ipwc3ue

It’s fraud but not fraud against you. Just keep pressing the issue with the government agency you are trying to get rental assistance from. They need to take you off her claim so you can put one in for yourself. It’s their call if they want to pursue charges against your mother.

Not a lawyer, definitely fraud but you wouldn’t gain much if anything by taking legal action. You can report it and have the government take action and get back what you missed out on which may or may not be worth the trouble. I would call her and let her know to stop so you can appropriately get it before taking legal action, just me though.

xnpv6p

legaladvice_train

My parents kicked me out but used my info for rental assistance? Is this fraud? Hi im. A 22 year old male. My mom had kicked me out at the beginning of 2022 and I was told to live with my dad. I tried to apply for rental assistance and was told I was supposed to be at my moms address from our states rental assistance program. Since then I still haven’t lived there and I know that at least from January to June my information was being used. Is this considered fraud? And if I wanted to take legal action how could I?

ipwzcx5

ipwc3ue

You would not take any action. The state is the injured party in this case.

Not a lawyer, definitely fraud but you wouldn’t gain much if anything by taking legal action. You can report it and have the government take action and get back what you missed out on which may or may not be worth the trouble. I would call her and let her know to stop so you can appropriately get it before taking legal action, just me though.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqup6b

djqtukr

You can and should sue your parents, or have a lawyer send a demand letter. You cannot commit the crime of extortion in Florida in so doing, however. A lawyer will advise you on how to structure an appropriate settlement that may result in your sister coming to live with you for the remainder of her minority. Do not try to DIY this, or you could end up charged with a crime.

This is very, very difficult. Under the law in most of the US (most of the world), parents have a right to decide how to raise their minor children. There are some facilities for brainwashing people out of being gay which are so horrific that I have little better terms to describe them other than torture. In fact, a couple of US states have actually passed laws against these places, but that doesn't help much because parents have a right to send their children to someplace else that doesn't have such a restriction. There is very little you can do about it, legally. On the other hand, there *IS* a major legal issue where you DO have leverage. From your description, it sounds like there is a plausible argument that your father committed fraud to scam you out of $20,000. If you pursued this, there is a decent chance that you could get law enforcement involved and it is not impossible that your father could be convicted of a felony for such a fraud. You certainly could sue to get the money back, and could probably get a judgment to garnish his wages, seize his bank accounts, and so forth until you had been repaid. The most obvious thing to do would be: "*Dad: pull my sister out of that program and either let her live with you unmolested or else send her to live with me -- if you don't, then I'll press charges and get you thrown in prison for fraud.*" **Don't do that, because that would be blackmail.** At least, I think it would, depending on the exact wording. With a very careful approach it may be possible (depending on the exact details of the laws on blackmail in your state, which I do not know well enough to advise you on) to get that same message across without actually committing blackmail. If I were to do such a thing I would probably find a lawyer who could help me figure out how to use this without committing a felony of your own. Because if I understand you correctly, you are not happy about the $20,000 but your REAL concern is for your sister. My heart goes out to you (and her) and I wish you the best of fortune and a successful outcome.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqtqtq

djqup6b

Unfortunately, parents of children under age 18 have almost unlimited power over their children, outside of physical or emotional abuse. Although all decent, educated people recognize that gay conversion therapy is (a) complete bullshit and (b) abusive, you cannot be certain that Florida CPS will see it that way. Nevertheless I would immediately call CPS and report what you know. Make sure you include the fact that you believe parents lied to sister's school and on Facebook about where she went. Be prepared to be frustrated by CPS. They may be professional and do their job. They may be fellow members of the Christian Taliban and think your parents did nothing wrong. You could consider consulting a FL family law attorney to see if there is any chance you could get a judge to order your sister removed from the facility. I I would look for a GLBTQ friendly lawyer. You could ask the same attorney if you have any legal means to force your parents to remove her from the pray away the gay camp. On another front I would contact local LGBTQ organizations to see if they can help. I hope for the best for you and your sister.

You can and should sue your parents, or have a lawyer send a demand letter. You cannot commit the crime of extortion in Florida in so doing, however. A lawyer will advise you on how to structure an appropriate settlement that may result in your sister coming to live with you for the remainder of her minority. Do not try to DIY this, or you could end up charged with a crime.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqw2rx

djr159x

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr159x

djqtukr

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

This is very, very difficult. Under the law in most of the US (most of the world), parents have a right to decide how to raise their minor children. There are some facilities for brainwashing people out of being gay which are so horrific that I have little better terms to describe them other than torture. In fact, a couple of US states have actually passed laws against these places, but that doesn't help much because parents have a right to send their children to someplace else that doesn't have such a restriction. There is very little you can do about it, legally. On the other hand, there *IS* a major legal issue where you DO have leverage. From your description, it sounds like there is a plausible argument that your father committed fraud to scam you out of $20,000. If you pursued this, there is a decent chance that you could get law enforcement involved and it is not impossible that your father could be convicted of a felony for such a fraud. You certainly could sue to get the money back, and could probably get a judgment to garnish his wages, seize his bank accounts, and so forth until you had been repaid. The most obvious thing to do would be: "*Dad: pull my sister out of that program and either let her live with you unmolested or else send her to live with me -- if you don't, then I'll press charges and get you thrown in prison for fraud.*" **Don't do that, because that would be blackmail.** At least, I think it would, depending on the exact wording. With a very careful approach it may be possible (depending on the exact details of the laws on blackmail in your state, which I do not know well enough to advise you on) to get that same message across without actually committing blackmail. If I were to do such a thing I would probably find a lawyer who could help me figure out how to use this without committing a felony of your own. Because if I understand you correctly, you are not happy about the $20,000 but your REAL concern is for your sister. My heart goes out to you (and her) and I wish you the best of fortune and a successful outcome.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr159x

djqtqtq

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

Unfortunately, parents of children under age 18 have almost unlimited power over their children, outside of physical or emotional abuse. Although all decent, educated people recognize that gay conversion therapy is (a) complete bullshit and (b) abusive, you cannot be certain that Florida CPS will see it that way. Nevertheless I would immediately call CPS and report what you know. Make sure you include the fact that you believe parents lied to sister's school and on Facebook about where she went. Be prepared to be frustrated by CPS. They may be professional and do their job. They may be fellow members of the Christian Taliban and think your parents did nothing wrong. You could consider consulting a FL family law attorney to see if there is any chance you could get a judge to order your sister removed from the facility. I I would look for a GLBTQ friendly lawyer. You could ask the same attorney if you have any legal means to force your parents to remove her from the pray away the gay camp. On another front I would contact local LGBTQ organizations to see if they can help. I hope for the best for you and your sister.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr159x

djqvuhh

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

Sue them. Also talk to a lawyer about theft by deception. Probably won't stick but they don't know that, and it should scare your parents to have the possibility of criminal charges. Them being scared of your legal action means more chance of getting what you want, your sister removed. Good luck

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvler

djr159x

At the very least, you need to sue your parents. When you sister is in an ok position, you need to cut contact with them.

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr159x

djqvuxz

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

Is there any chance she can apply for custody of her sister?

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqw2jp

djr159x

Did you make any verbal agreements with your father about the money? Was it intended as a loan?

So, in addition to everyone else: * Definitely pursue getting a lawyer to see if you can yank back the $20,000 conditional gift. * Check out this page and see if your parents live in a locality that has banned conversion therapy. While Florida has not, some localities have, and therefore they may still have committed a crime. * Bills have been proposed in FL to ban conversion therapy within the state. Contact her (and your) state rep and senator and agitate for the ban. If they are for the ban, they may know of the therapy camps in FL, which you can narrow down by affiliation with your parent's church/denomination.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqtukr

djqw2rx

This is very, very difficult. Under the law in most of the US (most of the world), parents have a right to decide how to raise their minor children. There are some facilities for brainwashing people out of being gay which are so horrific that I have little better terms to describe them other than torture. In fact, a couple of US states have actually passed laws against these places, but that doesn't help much because parents have a right to send their children to someplace else that doesn't have such a restriction. There is very little you can do about it, legally. On the other hand, there *IS* a major legal issue where you DO have leverage. From your description, it sounds like there is a plausible argument that your father committed fraud to scam you out of $20,000. If you pursued this, there is a decent chance that you could get law enforcement involved and it is not impossible that your father could be convicted of a felony for such a fraud. You certainly could sue to get the money back, and could probably get a judgment to garnish his wages, seize his bank accounts, and so forth until you had been repaid. The most obvious thing to do would be: "*Dad: pull my sister out of that program and either let her live with you unmolested or else send her to live with me -- if you don't, then I'll press charges and get you thrown in prison for fraud.*" **Don't do that, because that would be blackmail.** At least, I think it would, depending on the exact wording. With a very careful approach it may be possible (depending on the exact details of the laws on blackmail in your state, which I do not know well enough to advise you on) to get that same message across without actually committing blackmail. If I were to do such a thing I would probably find a lawyer who could help me figure out how to use this without committing a felony of your own. Because if I understand you correctly, you are not happy about the $20,000 but your REAL concern is for your sister. My heart goes out to you (and her) and I wish you the best of fortune and a successful outcome.

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqw2rx

djqtqtq

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

Unfortunately, parents of children under age 18 have almost unlimited power over their children, outside of physical or emotional abuse. Although all decent, educated people recognize that gay conversion therapy is (a) complete bullshit and (b) abusive, you cannot be certain that Florida CPS will see it that way. Nevertheless I would immediately call CPS and report what you know. Make sure you include the fact that you believe parents lied to sister's school and on Facebook about where she went. Be prepared to be frustrated by CPS. They may be professional and do their job. They may be fellow members of the Christian Taliban and think your parents did nothing wrong. You could consider consulting a FL family law attorney to see if there is any chance you could get a judge to order your sister removed from the facility. I I would look for a GLBTQ friendly lawyer. You could ask the same attorney if you have any legal means to force your parents to remove her from the pray away the gay camp. On another front I would contact local LGBTQ organizations to see if they can help. I hope for the best for you and your sister.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqw2rx

djqvuhh

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

Sue them. Also talk to a lawyer about theft by deception. Probably won't stick but they don't know that, and it should scare your parents to have the possibility of criminal charges. Them being scared of your legal action means more chance of getting what you want, your sister removed. Good luck

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqw2rx

djqvler

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

At the very least, you need to sue your parents. When you sister is in an ok position, you need to cut contact with them.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvuxz

djqw2rx

Is there any chance she can apply for custody of her sister?

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqw2rx

djqw2jp

I am not a lawyer, but I would imagine you would have a case against your parents for the $20,000. Based on a few things I've read about engagement rings, Florida law recognizes "conditional gifts". You gave your father $20,000 to have a life saving surgery, he failed to follow that condition and therefore may owe you your $20,000 back. This amount of money is "get an attorney" level, as the max for small claims in Florida is $5,000. The advantage of getting a lawyer, is that he may be able to work out a settlement where you agree to drop the suit in exchange for guardianship of your sister, or some other positive outcome that you would consider worth 20 grand. As u/Zanctmao mentioned, you do not want to do this on your own as extortion is a very fine line to walk. "Give me guardianship of my sister or I'll sue you for the $20,000 may be criminal extortion, whereas sueing for $20,000 but offering a settlement of some non-monetary form might be OK.

Did you make any verbal agreements with your father about the money? Was it intended as a loan?

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqtukr

djqtqtq

This is very, very difficult. Under the law in most of the US (most of the world), parents have a right to decide how to raise their minor children. There are some facilities for brainwashing people out of being gay which are so horrific that I have little better terms to describe them other than torture. In fact, a couple of US states have actually passed laws against these places, but that doesn't help much because parents have a right to send their children to someplace else that doesn't have such a restriction. There is very little you can do about it, legally. On the other hand, there *IS* a major legal issue where you DO have leverage. From your description, it sounds like there is a plausible argument that your father committed fraud to scam you out of $20,000. If you pursued this, there is a decent chance that you could get law enforcement involved and it is not impossible that your father could be convicted of a felony for such a fraud. You certainly could sue to get the money back, and could probably get a judgment to garnish his wages, seize his bank accounts, and so forth until you had been repaid. The most obvious thing to do would be: "*Dad: pull my sister out of that program and either let her live with you unmolested or else send her to live with me -- if you don't, then I'll press charges and get you thrown in prison for fraud.*" **Don't do that, because that would be blackmail.** At least, I think it would, depending on the exact wording. With a very careful approach it may be possible (depending on the exact details of the laws on blackmail in your state, which I do not know well enough to advise you on) to get that same message across without actually committing blackmail. If I were to do such a thing I would probably find a lawyer who could help me figure out how to use this without committing a felony of your own. Because if I understand you correctly, you are not happy about the $20,000 but your REAL concern is for your sister. My heart goes out to you (and her) and I wish you the best of fortune and a successful outcome.

Unfortunately, parents of children under age 18 have almost unlimited power over their children, outside of physical or emotional abuse. Although all decent, educated people recognize that gay conversion therapy is (a) complete bullshit and (b) abusive, you cannot be certain that Florida CPS will see it that way. Nevertheless I would immediately call CPS and report what you know. Make sure you include the fact that you believe parents lied to sister's school and on Facebook about where she went. Be prepared to be frustrated by CPS. They may be professional and do their job. They may be fellow members of the Christian Taliban and think your parents did nothing wrong. You could consider consulting a FL family law attorney to see if there is any chance you could get a judge to order your sister removed from the facility. I I would look for a GLBTQ friendly lawyer. You could ask the same attorney if you have any legal means to force your parents to remove her from the pray away the gay camp. On another front I would contact local LGBTQ organizations to see if they can help. I hope for the best for you and your sister.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr1ce7

djqtqtq

Not legal advice, but I would suggest calling the church and talking to someone there. Ask to be anonymous, and explain that you have a child/family member that is gay/lesbian, and if there are any "programs" the church can recommend that could help. Chances are the church employees will give you the name(s) of the same place, which may allow you to help track her down. Good luck.

Unfortunately, parents of children under age 18 have almost unlimited power over their children, outside of physical or emotional abuse. Although all decent, educated people recognize that gay conversion therapy is (a) complete bullshit and (b) abusive, you cannot be certain that Florida CPS will see it that way. Nevertheless I would immediately call CPS and report what you know. Make sure you include the fact that you believe parents lied to sister's school and on Facebook about where she went. Be prepared to be frustrated by CPS. They may be professional and do their job. They may be fellow members of the Christian Taliban and think your parents did nothing wrong. You could consider consulting a FL family law attorney to see if there is any chance you could get a judge to order your sister removed from the facility. I I would look for a GLBTQ friendly lawyer. You could ask the same attorney if you have any legal means to force your parents to remove her from the pray away the gay camp. On another front I would contact local LGBTQ organizations to see if they can help. I hope for the best for you and your sister.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvuhh

djr1ce7

Sue them. Also talk to a lawyer about theft by deception. Probably won't stick but they don't know that, and it should scare your parents to have the possibility of criminal charges. Them being scared of your legal action means more chance of getting what you want, your sister removed. Good luck

Not legal advice, but I would suggest calling the church and talking to someone there. Ask to be anonymous, and explain that you have a child/family member that is gay/lesbian, and if there are any "programs" the church can recommend that could help. Chances are the church employees will give you the name(s) of the same place, which may allow you to help track her down. Good luck.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvler

djr1ce7

At the very least, you need to sue your parents. When you sister is in an ok position, you need to cut contact with them.

Not legal advice, but I would suggest calling the church and talking to someone there. Ask to be anonymous, and explain that you have a child/family member that is gay/lesbian, and if there are any "programs" the church can recommend that could help. Chances are the church employees will give you the name(s) of the same place, which may allow you to help track her down. Good luck.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvuxz

djr1ce7

Is there any chance she can apply for custody of her sister?

Not legal advice, but I would suggest calling the church and talking to someone there. Ask to be anonymous, and explain that you have a child/family member that is gay/lesbian, and if there are any "programs" the church can recommend that could help. Chances are the church employees will give you the name(s) of the same place, which may allow you to help track her down. Good luck.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr1ce7

djqw2jp

Not legal advice, but I would suggest calling the church and talking to someone there. Ask to be anonymous, and explain that you have a child/family member that is gay/lesbian, and if there are any "programs" the church can recommend that could help. Chances are the church employees will give you the name(s) of the same place, which may allow you to help track her down. Good luck.

Did you make any verbal agreements with your father about the money? Was it intended as a loan?

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvuhh

djr49m6

Sue them. Also talk to a lawyer about theft by deception. Probably won't stick but they don't know that, and it should scare your parents to have the possibility of criminal charges. Them being scared of your legal action means more chance of getting what you want, your sister removed. Good luck

Look for lawyers in Florida who deal with the rights of gay teens. They may take this on pro-bono. In a perfect world, they might use the fraudulent $20k surgery as a pretext for legal actions. They might sue your parents for the 20k, asking the court for a subpoena on information and receipts of the "summer-camp" as proof of fraud. A law firm specializing in fighting anti-gay therapy might be able to use that to allege child abuse and petition the court to appoint a guardian ad litem to represent your sister. As others said, you can and should sue your parents. This case might be good for a law firm/non-profit trying to fight these "camps" in Florida, because your parents committed fraud to get the fees -- that gives you/them some amount of legal standing in bringing a lawsuit to trial.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr49m6

djqvler

Look for lawyers in Florida who deal with the rights of gay teens. They may take this on pro-bono. In a perfect world, they might use the fraudulent $20k surgery as a pretext for legal actions. They might sue your parents for the 20k, asking the court for a subpoena on information and receipts of the "summer-camp" as proof of fraud. A law firm specializing in fighting anti-gay therapy might be able to use that to allege child abuse and petition the court to appoint a guardian ad litem to represent your sister. As others said, you can and should sue your parents. This case might be good for a law firm/non-profit trying to fight these "camps" in Florida, because your parents committed fraud to get the fees -- that gives you/them some amount of legal standing in bringing a lawsuit to trial.

At the very least, you need to sue your parents. When you sister is in an ok position, you need to cut contact with them.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvuxz

djr49m6

Is there any chance she can apply for custody of her sister?

Look for lawyers in Florida who deal with the rights of gay teens. They may take this on pro-bono. In a perfect world, they might use the fraudulent $20k surgery as a pretext for legal actions. They might sue your parents for the 20k, asking the court for a subpoena on information and receipts of the "summer-camp" as proof of fraud. A law firm specializing in fighting anti-gay therapy might be able to use that to allege child abuse and petition the court to appoint a guardian ad litem to represent your sister. As others said, you can and should sue your parents. This case might be good for a law firm/non-profit trying to fight these "camps" in Florida, because your parents committed fraud to get the fees -- that gives you/them some amount of legal standing in bringing a lawsuit to trial.

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djr49m6

djqw2jp

Look for lawyers in Florida who deal with the rights of gay teens. They may take this on pro-bono. In a perfect world, they might use the fraudulent $20k surgery as a pretext for legal actions. They might sue your parents for the 20k, asking the court for a subpoena on information and receipts of the "summer-camp" as proof of fraud. A law firm specializing in fighting anti-gay therapy might be able to use that to allege child abuse and petition the court to appoint a guardian ad litem to represent your sister. As others said, you can and should sue your parents. This case might be good for a law firm/non-profit trying to fight these "camps" in Florida, because your parents committed fraud to get the fees -- that gives you/them some amount of legal standing in bringing a lawsuit to trial.

Did you make any verbal agreements with your father about the money? Was it intended as a loan?

6l3i1d

legaladvice_train

[Florida] I found out that my younger sister was sent away to a religious camp for her sexuality by my evangelical parents, who lied and took money from me (I believe) to fund it. I am furious. I posted this in r/relationships but I was told to post here. I live in Florida and so do my parents. This rest of this is a direct copy paste of what I posted there. I posted a thing here a two years ago that helped me with an uncomfortable situation involving a boss at work and it helped me save a good friendship and my job, so hopefully you guys can help me again with a much much more serious situation. I didn't remember that account so I made a new one. I need to give a little background to explain the situation. This will probably be long. I'm shitty at writing so please bare with me. I work as a computer engineer and live away from my parents. I moved out when I was 18, not because we had a particularly distant relationship, but because I was very hungry for independence and I didn't want to go to college like they wanted me to. I fell in love with programming and got a job a month after I graduated, and I've done that since. I am extremely frugal, and I now make about 70k a year after taxes (go mr. money mustache). Both my parents are in traditional white collar jobs that make significantly more money than I do, and they are horrific with money. When I was growing up my parents were semi-religious (church on easter and christmas type of deal) and not particularly invested in it or politics. Somewhere in the last three or four years they became interested in it, and in the last year in particular (regarding the last elecion especially) they have become some of the most religious and overfocused political people i've ever seen. I have tried distancing myself from this by refusing to talk about these issues over the phone at all. I could not disagree more with them. I think they have some very hateful views, but I've chosen not to engage them on it. Growing up I was not close to my younger sister, mainly because of our age gap. However she has grown up and is very pleasant to speak to. We have spoken on the phone daily (I speak to mom and dad much less frequently) since she was around 14. I have not been exposed to to much of this because I intentionally tell both sides I don't want to talk about their drama (although I am generally clear with my sister that I agree with her, but I don't want to badmouth her parents). My sister is a lesbian, which I have no issue with whatsoever, and my parents do not (or did not) know and would immediately be against. We talked about this a quite often. My sister also has political views completely at odd with my parents (she was in trouble for not supporting their favorite political candidate, you can probably guess who) but I encouraged her to swallow it and suck it up at home for her safety and sanity. She mentioned a few times in the last two months about wanting to come out to them and I highly highly discouraged it. I have heard both of my parents approve of a pastor who disowned his gay son and similar stories. I didn't want them to do that to her. I have offered to let her live with me when she turns 18 but imagined that being in the future. I made her promise not to do that and she did. On her 16th birthday, she came out to them. I was a little angry with her over the phone (I didn't curse or scream or anything, but I was annoyed, but with sympathy for her position. I did chide her a bit, which I acknowledge was dumb.) She was extremely mad at me and didn't call me for four days, which was a long time for us not to speak. We spoke afterwards and I was much better, but things weren't going well. They didn't kick her out but weren't speaking to her at all. Literally she was screaming at them and they just quietly went into their rooms, not saying a word. I offered to speak to them for her and she begged me not to, so I did not, against my better judgement. My Dad, a week later, called me over the phone. He said that he was sick and needed emergency money to have a procedure He begged me "not to tell" mom or my sister. He needed about 20 grand. I had refused them money in the past for a car loan and made it clear that I wasn't giving them money, but I did for this, cautious but ultimately trusting him not to lie about his own potential death. I disagreed with him about a lot of things but he had always been so steadfast about the importance of honesty the thought of him lying about something like that seemed ridiculous and I felt guilty for even thinking that. About another week after that, my sister stopped calling me. I thought she was mad again for some reason but she didn't answer at all. I was worried. I called my parents and asked about her after about a week and they said she was being moody (I thought they thought I didn't know about her sexuality or what was going on). I checked my Facebook that night and I read an days old message from one of her friends that explained that she had been trying to reach me and that my sister was taken from her house into a van and driven off by men in a program with her and my parents there before kicking the friend out of the house. Her friend visited my parents house several times and they eventually told her they sent her to a religious program. She didn't get the name. I called up my father, and he denied it twice before admitting it after a long talk. I was so angry. They seriously have these religious camps that parents can send teens to anytime without committing a crime forever. I didn't think it had anything to do with the money, but I looked it up after that and found out that these programs are generally very expensive. I called him up again and he admitted that's where the money went. I demanded that he let her out and he told me it was his money. I told him I'd never speak to him again and he just ignored me. I try calling him up every few hours for the last several days when I found out and they ignore almost all of my calls. He intentionally didn't tell me the name of the facility or camp, but I've done reading and these are almost always dangerous places. I don't even know if she is in the US anymore. People die and get brainwashed at these places. I feel so guilty for giving them the ability to do this. I don't know the name of the camp, and I did technically give them the money. My only recourse at this point is to go tell everyone in their neighborhood what they did. I saw a facebook post they made about sending my sister to a snooty christian boarding school and that is NOT what they did. I called the school they posted and she isn't going there. They are very connected to the church/suburban town community and I think it would threaten them to have their image splattered with the truth. I would completely disown them now if it wouldn't completely destroy my chances of getting her out. I am at a loss. Please help me. tl;dr: My parents lied to me and took money claiming it was for an illness only to turn around and use it to send my sister to a camp because she came out. They are ignoring my calls. I don't have any legal grounds (i think) and I do not know how to convince them to let her out.

djqvuhh

djqvler

Sue them. Also talk to a lawyer about theft by deception. Probably won't stick but they don't know that, and it should scare your parents to have the possibility of criminal charges. Them being scared of your legal action means more chance of getting what you want, your sister removed. Good luck

At the very least, you need to sue your parents. When you sister is in an ok position, you need to cut contact with them.

vvnc2m

legaladvice_train

Girlfriend suicided because of orthodox parents' emotional abuse on finding out about us. Her father pressing charges on me. Country: India, State: Bengaluru. My girlfriend committed suicide on May 20 by jumping off the 10th floor of her building. Relationship context: We'd known each other for 2 years. We were in a relationship for 9 months. She had been mad suicidal for years, since before meeting me. Most of it because of her self esteem issues. She was a twin. Her twin is the perfect orthodox conservative girl her parents would want. Whereas my girlfriend ( let's call her "S" ) fell in love and shit. S always thought that her parents deserved a better daughter and stuff. Mad suicidal. Very low self esteem. I kept her happy. Our relationship was healthy 100/100. She was so innocent and naive. I always took care of her. Was always there to hear her out when she was suicidal. She told me plenty times that I saved her. and that, if I wasnt there.. she would've been gone long back. I kept her happy. I kept her alive. Incident: Two days before she committed, her twin found out about us by peeking into her college mail ID's google photos (college mail ID logged in her laptop. auto-synced media) and she incriminated S to their mum. Her mum travelled from state A and reached state B (where S lives with her two roommates) the very next day. S works night shift. 6pm to 4am. The day they found out.. they shouted at her the whole day. Slutshamed her. She's the most innocent, naive, *one guy for life* kinda girl you could ever see. Her parents knew it too. But they still questioned her as if she was planning to be a whore for life. Emotional abuse. She didnt sleep that day. Went to office by 6pm. Contacted me from office and let me know everything over gmeet call. The next day morning her mum reached state B and continued the emotional abuse. They'll speak badly, make her cry, console her and make her cry again. S didnt sleep that day too. Evening 6pm office again. Told me everything. I helped her do her work. Told her that things will turn out alright.. and was supportive in every way. I was on gmeet call till 3:30 pm.Then I went to sleep. S hadnt slept for two days now. She missed taking her anxiety meds too as mum was home. (Parents do not know about psychiatric medication. They never trusted psychiatry. She had anxiety. Once attempted to hang herself in April. I saved her, travelled from state C to state B ( we live in different states too ) to be with her, had her consult my psychiatrist over call and got her on medication. ) After I went to sleep by 3:45, S left office by 4. Her mum called and kept abusing her throughout the cab ride to her apartment too. At 4:30 in the morning that is. She reached her building. Her apartment is in the 10th floor. She went to her floor. She didnt have it in her to go inside the door to face her mum, where she would be waiting with a mouthful of hurtful words. She jumped off the 10th floor. Help: I have all whatsapp, discord chats where she says how suicidal she was, how her parents never understood, how they stressed her out, and how much I saved her. How healthy our relationship was, how happy she was with me.. everything. I do not have any chat/message/recording of what she said to me the night before she suicided. It was all over gmeet call. Now I've been contacted by State B's police. Asked me to come to state B for enquiry. Because her father suspects me. HELP: What should I know? What should I be ready with? Note: Her father is a big shot. He has contacts. Politicians, Police cmmissioners, etc etc. And definitely access to lawyers who could spin the story on me. Im a little scared and anxious. Because though I know that I was 100% not responsible for her suicide.. I also know that her father's lawyers can spin the story and paint me the bad one. I need help. Please.

ifkzs1b

ifl5yqc

Find a lawyer to speak to. If you are at a college or university, they may have resources to help find a lawyer. Do not speak to the police without a lawyer. Anything you say can and will be used against you. Do not try to be helpful with the police in this manner. They are allowed legally to lie to you in order to get information from you.

What a terrible situation. This sub is mainly focused on USA law. You might get better help posting on r/legaladviceindia as a case like this will probably play out very differently in those countries. I’m sure there are a lot of cultural differences in how this situation played out, and the law may be different also. I also think that you need someone familiar with Indian law to understand how the situation with the different states will play out. My hunch would be not to travel to that different state unless you’re forced to, and to not talk to either the police or the opposing sides legal team until you have your own legal representation and they gave you advice on what to do. It’s quite possible in a case like this to make it worse for yourself simply by doing something stupid because you’re uninformed. And her dads lawyers work for him so they have zero interest in being fair to you, quite the opposite in fact. On top of that, there is possible corruption to contend with. Even if you do everything correctly, if you girlfriends father succeeds in corrupting officials connected to your case, you may still be screwed. I don’t know enough about India to be sure but I think it’s a possibility that the actual best advice is to cut your losses and start over someplace else. Good luck to you and I hope you’ll get out of this situation soon.

juzv88

legaladvice_train

I came out to my parents as Lesbian and they kicked me out. I’m 17, don’t have a home, and they’re threatening to keep my savings and stuff, too. What can I do? Basically in the title. I’m 17, living in Utah, US. I’m living at a friend’s right now but they don’t really have room for me, I’m staying on their couch and it won’t work long term. Is it even legal for my parents to kick me out as a minor? Like I just turned 17, I can’t do anything for myself legally (i.e. get an apartment) for a year. Do I have any grounds on my savings or my stuff?

gcgwwgn

gchxoxa

Call CPS, they will have resources for you and help you. I’m so sorry you’re going through this

OP in your last post to /r/legaladvice you state you’re 19. In this post you say you just turned 17. Your real age is important in regards to your options. Either way you were a tenant and they cannot kick you out without legally evicting you. If you are indeed a minor they can’t just kick you out, they have a legal obligation to provide for you until you are 18 and in some states until you graduate high school if you turn 18 before then.

juzv88

legaladvice_train

I came out to my parents as Lesbian and they kicked me out. I’m 17, don’t have a home, and they’re threatening to keep my savings and stuff, too. What can I do? Basically in the title. I’m 17, living in Utah, US. I’m living at a friend’s right now but they don’t really have room for me, I’m staying on their couch and it won’t work long term. Is it even legal for my parents to kick me out as a minor? Like I just turned 17, I can’t do anything for myself legally (i.e. get an apartment) for a year. Do I have any grounds on my savings or my stuff?

gchb6r5

gchxoxa

They're legally required to look after you until you are 18 and can't kick you out. You can contact the police. Afterwards you're going to have to make preparations for when you turn 18. You should start collecting documents and make moves towards securing your money. At the moment your parents could drain your bank account if they feel like it and once you're 18 you will have to take steps to remove their access to it because it's not automatic.

OP in your last post to /r/legaladvice you state you’re 19. In this post you say you just turned 17. Your real age is important in regards to your options. Either way you were a tenant and they cannot kick you out without legally evicting you. If you are indeed a minor they can’t just kick you out, they have a legal obligation to provide for you until you are 18 and in some states until you graduate high school if you turn 18 before then.

juzv88

legaladvice_train

I came out to my parents as Lesbian and they kicked me out. I’m 17, don’t have a home, and they’re threatening to keep my savings and stuff, too. What can I do? Basically in the title. I’m 17, living in Utah, US. I’m living at a friend’s right now but they don’t really have room for me, I’m staying on their couch and it won’t work long term. Is it even legal for my parents to kick me out as a minor? Like I just turned 17, I can’t do anything for myself legally (i.e. get an apartment) for a year. Do I have any grounds on my savings or my stuff?

gchxoxa

gchtfpf

OP in your last post to /r/legaladvice you state you’re 19. In this post you say you just turned 17. Your real age is important in regards to your options. Either way you were a tenant and they cannot kick you out without legally evicting you. If you are indeed a minor they can’t just kick you out, they have a legal obligation to provide for you until you are 18 and in some states until you graduate high school if you turn 18 before then.

Call CPS, it is illegal for parents to just stop taking care of their kids. You can apply for emancipation if you want, which will allow to separate from your parents and act as an independent adult. That being said, the process can be quite slow, and since you're going to be a legal adult in less than a year anyway, it may not be worth it to start the process.

juzv88

legaladvice_train

I came out to my parents as Lesbian and they kicked me out. I’m 17, don’t have a home, and they’re threatening to keep my savings and stuff, too. What can I do? Basically in the title. I’m 17, living in Utah, US. I’m living at a friend’s right now but they don’t really have room for me, I’m staying on their couch and it won’t work long term. Is it even legal for my parents to kick me out as a minor? Like I just turned 17, I can’t do anything for myself legally (i.e. get an apartment) for a year. Do I have any grounds on my savings or my stuff?

gchtfpf

gchy9s8

Call CPS, it is illegal for parents to just stop taking care of their kids. You can apply for emancipation if you want, which will allow to separate from your parents and act as an independent adult. That being said, the process can be quite slow, and since you're going to be a legal adult in less than a year anyway, it may not be worth it to start the process.

http://encircletogether.org/ That links to a LGBTQ Youth house in Provo, if you can get there. They are very helpful for teensin your situation. Also reach out to your school counselor or a teacher, they can help get the CPS thing rolling.

juzv88

legaladvice_train

I came out to my parents as Lesbian and they kicked me out. I’m 17, don’t have a home, and they’re threatening to keep my savings and stuff, too. What can I do? Basically in the title. I’m 17, living in Utah, US. I’m living at a friend’s right now but they don’t really have room for me, I’m staying on their couch and it won’t work long term. Is it even legal for my parents to kick me out as a minor? Like I just turned 17, I can’t do anything for myself legally (i.e. get an apartment) for a year. Do I have any grounds on my savings or my stuff?

gci11kp

gchtfpf

Call the police/CPS and report to them they kicked you out. Even if you don’t want to go back there doing this stops them from reporting you as a runaway and potentially getting a criminal record. File this report away from your parents house. Then request an escort to get your belongings.

Call CPS, it is illegal for parents to just stop taking care of their kids. You can apply for emancipation if you want, which will allow to separate from your parents and act as an independent adult. That being said, the process can be quite slow, and since you're going to be a legal adult in less than a year anyway, it may not be worth it to start the process.

juzv88

legaladvice_train

I came out to my parents as Lesbian and they kicked me out. I’m 17, don’t have a home, and they’re threatening to keep my savings and stuff, too. What can I do? Basically in the title. I’m 17, living in Utah, US. I’m living at a friend’s right now but they don’t really have room for me, I’m staying on their couch and it won’t work long term. Is it even legal for my parents to kick me out as a minor? Like I just turned 17, I can’t do anything for myself legally (i.e. get an apartment) for a year. Do I have any grounds on my savings or my stuff?

gci67am

gchtfpf

I am very sorry you had this experience. Unfortunately, it is entirely too common. The first thing I would do is go to the bank and see if you can take your money out. I understand you don't want to go back, and I can understand why, so you need to look for alternative solutions. If you can communicate with your parents, I suggest you remind them that they have broken the law by kicking you out and they can get in a lot of trouble for doing so. You could call CPS on them and they would likely be forced to take you back in and could be looking at various charges, which they no doubt don't want. If there are other children in the household, once CPS gets involved, they look at everything. Normally, I would tell someone in your situation to contact CPS, a teacher, guidance counselor, or other adult for help. If you contact anyone official, they will have to report this to the government though, and you will need to think about whether that is best for you. However, if you need to go back home and you think you will be safe there, then if your parents are unwilling to budge, CPS is the answer. At any rate, assuming there is no one else to take you in, I would suggest that you tell your parents that they would be best off renting a place for you and providing you with an allowance so you can care for yourself. That is not normally what I would suggest, but if you feel unsafe in your parents' home and you feel you can care for yourself, this might be the best way to go for you. You can look into becoming emancipated. Here are the forms you will need to file in court https://www.utcourts.gov/resources/forms/emancipation/ If you become emanicpated, you should be able to rent an apartment. A number of folks have given you groups that can offer you help. PFLAG Is a great resource for your parents and family, if they are having trouble accepting you. I am sure the pridecenter and some of the other groups will have some suggestions too, I would reach out to them asap. The circle site looks especially helpful. I removed the link because apparently Reddit forbids it as a fundraising site. In the meanwhile, are you managing financially? You may find that people would be willing to donate to a young person in your situation. Unfortunately, I have seen a lot of young people end up in your situation. I wish people could remember that they are supposed to love their children no matter what. Why some parents reject their children over orientation I will never understand. I hope you have a good social circle to support you.

Call CPS, it is illegal for parents to just stop taking care of their kids. You can apply for emancipation if you want, which will allow to separate from your parents and act as an independent adult. That being said, the process can be quite slow, and since you're going to be a legal adult in less than a year anyway, it may not be worth it to start the process.

7l77zr

legaladvice_train

15, almost 16 getting threats from parents who are ready to kick me out (OR) So my parents are quite ready to kick me out. I’m 15, turning 16 in exactly 6 days. It was sprung on me pretty quickly, but as with this subreddit, I need to tell you the full story. So all my problems started right around the beginning of middle school, when I was hit with pretty heavy depression. I’m currently a sophomore in high school. In only the last year my parents decided to actually get me help after I asked them numerous times. I had to switch my medication for only the second or third time(due to unhealthy weight loss), and my father went pretty ape shit on me, calling me a guinea pig, lab rat etc. (All my medication has already gone through clinical studies and trials. Nothing new there.) Side note: My parents completely lie to my doctor and counselor, acting on my side, just wanting the best for me. When I get home they switch up and they tell me my depression doesn’t even exist and its just an excuse as to why I struggle in school. My father (I no longer am calling him dad) just snapped on me and said when I turn 16, he will go through all legal things to get me out of the house and out of their care. In all honesty, I’m not sure if it’s even a bad thing for me. They have never supported me or believed me. So I ask you all, what should I do at this point? Should I just sit tight and wait for him to take the first legal steps or should I? Shall I pack my bags just Incase? Thank you for taking the time to read this and for any advice you give me. Happy holidays to all.

drk2txe

drk5jqz

This isn't a legal question. Your parents can send you to live with family, go to boot camp, it whatever safe and legal choice they make. There is nothing for you to do but wait and see, and talk to your counselor/therapist about it

Your parents can't put you out in the streets at 16. They also can't stop you from joining the military when you are eligible at 18. Don't pack a bag. Don't do anything that could be seen as running away or making a plan to run away. Being classed as a runaway could land you in the juvenile justice/child protection world which is...not ideal. The next time you see your doctor, mention these threats and ask your doctor to talk to your parents about them. I'm sorry that they're handling things so badly.

7l77zr

legaladvice_train

15, almost 16 getting threats from parents who are ready to kick me out (OR) So my parents are quite ready to kick me out. I’m 15, turning 16 in exactly 6 days. It was sprung on me pretty quickly, but as with this subreddit, I need to tell you the full story. So all my problems started right around the beginning of middle school, when I was hit with pretty heavy depression. I’m currently a sophomore in high school. In only the last year my parents decided to actually get me help after I asked them numerous times. I had to switch my medication for only the second or third time(due to unhealthy weight loss), and my father went pretty ape shit on me, calling me a guinea pig, lab rat etc. (All my medication has already gone through clinical studies and trials. Nothing new there.) Side note: My parents completely lie to my doctor and counselor, acting on my side, just wanting the best for me. When I get home they switch up and they tell me my depression doesn’t even exist and its just an excuse as to why I struggle in school. My father (I no longer am calling him dad) just snapped on me and said when I turn 16, he will go through all legal things to get me out of the house and out of their care. In all honesty, I’m not sure if it’s even a bad thing for me. They have never supported me or believed me. So I ask you all, what should I do at this point? Should I just sit tight and wait for him to take the first legal steps or should I? Shall I pack my bags just Incase? Thank you for taking the time to read this and for any advice you give me. Happy holidays to all.

drkk4zi

drktnlc

Don't pack, as others have said, but if you know where your birth certificate and social security card are, get them now and put them somewhere safe and accessible to you if they tell you to leave. You're old enough to work, but you're going to need your SS card to work legally. You might need your BC to get a driver license (though SS card is enough in my state, TX) if you don't have that already. I wouldn't carry your BC and SS card around with you all the time (too much risk of loss), but having them in your room or house in a quick to grab envelope that your folks won't find and you can snatch on the way out the door is probably better than nothing. If you have to enroll in a different school, then a BC and/or SS card might also be required. Talk to your school and personal/medical counselor (or primary care doc if that's who is giving you your psych meds) about these threats too. At least one of them might be required to report this to CPS if it actually happens. Sorry for your troubles.

I am not a lawyer. I am an Army Recruiter. You will be eligible with parental consent to join the military at 17. BUT. Mental health issues are a big deal to us. Make sure you follow through with your counseling medication and care over the next few years. If you change doctors make sure you get copies of your history including medication from them. But honestly, most military recruiters won’t touch mental health issues unless you can show full history and when the issues stopped (treatment and medication). We have minimum timelines before we can look at requesting a waiver. But the most important thing is getting better. That is number one, hands down number one. There are people out there who want you to succeed. Total strangers and friends. But no matter what surround yourself with help and good people. Easier said than done, I know. But keep at it, never be afraid to ask for help.

gdxgbs

legaladvice_train

6 weeks ago, my Employer cut my pay by 25% (due to "COVID19") until the foreseeable future. I'm a full time, salaried employee in Michigan. But as of this week I have more work to do than ever. What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? My boss fed me some BS about how the company owes me a raise and that'll happen this year but they dont know when full salaries will come back. I dont trust a word they say and I'm applying to new jobs. But in the meantime I'm pissed about how much work I have to do now. I want to just decline the work and say I'm too busy. I don't care if they fire me; but I don't want to quit and lose out on unemployment. Thanks in advance for any/all advice!

fpk0gjf

fpk0yvc

Declining work cuts pretty close to the 'insubordination' line where they could fire you for cause which could cause unemployment to be denied. If this is going to be your path...document, document, document. Send emails detailing your workload and inability to handle the volume before declining new work. With unemployment covering even less than your 25% reduced salary and new jobs not quite hiring at the previous levels, you could also try another strategy prior to lighting that bridge on fire: "While I am aware of the challenges to the business and reasons for the reduction, I likewise have financial obligations that aren't being met with this reduction, are there other tasks I can cover which can bring me to my previous level of compensation" It certainly is worth a shot, and if successful will put you in a better position coming out of this thing (new responsibilities typically = more pay/raises...eventually) Meanwhile, keep up the job search.

> What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? No legal recourse. You can either accept or reject. They can either continue to employ or to fire. If firing for insubordination (in this case refusing to do assigned tasks) they can fight UI claim and would likely win. UI is also tiny compared to your salary, at least after late July. You're absolutely not the only one. Cuts of 30%-35% and increased workload is pretty common in the last two months. Also keep in mind that your company by making cuts may last longer than companies that pay more now but are planning on an earlier economic recovery. There's a lot of crystal ball going on here... would you rather have $10,000 a month for 6 months then UI, or $7,500 a month for 18 months, then $10,000 a month, etc.

gdxgbs

legaladvice_train

6 weeks ago, my Employer cut my pay by 25% (due to "COVID19") until the foreseeable future. I'm a full time, salaried employee in Michigan. But as of this week I have more work to do than ever. What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? My boss fed me some BS about how the company owes me a raise and that'll happen this year but they dont know when full salaries will come back. I dont trust a word they say and I'm applying to new jobs. But in the meantime I'm pissed about how much work I have to do now. I want to just decline the work and say I'm too busy. I don't care if they fire me; but I don't want to quit and lose out on unemployment. Thanks in advance for any/all advice!

fpk4ogi

fpk450a

As others have suggested: Declining the additional work could get you justifiably fired. UI is 50/50 in this climate. If you're able to collect, in the short term you'll receive better than typical benefits - but once those dry up you'll be looking for a new job in what could be the worst job market in our lifetime. In the big picture: Don't take it personally. Yes, there are bad employers out there. How was this job and management prior to covid? (And really, be honest in that evaluation). These are really unusual times. Very very few industries are unaffected, and the middle-ground companies (those who have been impacted, but not so much that they have to slash their entire payroll at once via mass layoffs) are walking a very fine line. Things need to get done, accounts receivables has probably extended all their terms from N30 to N120 or more, and the company is doing everything possible to survive. It's going to be rough out there for a while. Be caution in your expectations to replace this job with another at better (or equal!) pay right now.

Legal recourse? None.

gdxgbs

legaladvice_train

6 weeks ago, my Employer cut my pay by 25% (due to "COVID19") until the foreseeable future. I'm a full time, salaried employee in Michigan. But as of this week I have more work to do than ever. What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? My boss fed me some BS about how the company owes me a raise and that'll happen this year but they dont know when full salaries will come back. I dont trust a word they say and I'm applying to new jobs. But in the meantime I'm pissed about how much work I have to do now. I want to just decline the work and say I'm too busy. I don't care if they fire me; but I don't want to quit and lose out on unemployment. Thanks in advance for any/all advice!

fpk0gjf

fpk4ogi

Declining work cuts pretty close to the 'insubordination' line where they could fire you for cause which could cause unemployment to be denied. If this is going to be your path...document, document, document. Send emails detailing your workload and inability to handle the volume before declining new work. With unemployment covering even less than your 25% reduced salary and new jobs not quite hiring at the previous levels, you could also try another strategy prior to lighting that bridge on fire: "While I am aware of the challenges to the business and reasons for the reduction, I likewise have financial obligations that aren't being met with this reduction, are there other tasks I can cover which can bring me to my previous level of compensation" It certainly is worth a shot, and if successful will put you in a better position coming out of this thing (new responsibilities typically = more pay/raises...eventually) Meanwhile, keep up the job search.

As others have suggested: Declining the additional work could get you justifiably fired. UI is 50/50 in this climate. If you're able to collect, in the short term you'll receive better than typical benefits - but once those dry up you'll be looking for a new job in what could be the worst job market in our lifetime. In the big picture: Don't take it personally. Yes, there are bad employers out there. How was this job and management prior to covid? (And really, be honest in that evaluation). These are really unusual times. Very very few industries are unaffected, and the middle-ground companies (those who have been impacted, but not so much that they have to slash their entire payroll at once via mass layoffs) are walking a very fine line. Things need to get done, accounts receivables has probably extended all their terms from N30 to N120 or more, and the company is doing everything possible to survive. It's going to be rough out there for a while. Be caution in your expectations to replace this job with another at better (or equal!) pay right now.

gdxgbs

legaladvice_train

6 weeks ago, my Employer cut my pay by 25% (due to "COVID19") until the foreseeable future. I'm a full time, salaried employee in Michigan. But as of this week I have more work to do than ever. What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? My boss fed me some BS about how the company owes me a raise and that'll happen this year but they dont know when full salaries will come back. I dont trust a word they say and I'm applying to new jobs. But in the meantime I'm pissed about how much work I have to do now. I want to just decline the work and say I'm too busy. I don't care if they fire me; but I don't want to quit and lose out on unemployment. Thanks in advance for any/all advice!

fpl6n6q

fpk450a

I'm going to point out here that this isn't *necessarily* unreasonable, if your work has increased due to other people being laid off or the reduced pay wasn't because of less work but rather concern about reduced income for the business (e.g., clients who aren't going to be able to pay their bill or will pay net 90 instead of net 30). A lot of people are getting pay cuts right now. However, assuming that it IS unreasonable, I think your best bet is to push back in a professional way, the same way you might push back on being overloaded if you hadn't just gotten a pay cut: "Boss, I'm currently getting more work than I'm able to get through during the week. Can we talk about how to prioritize this so that the most important stuff is getting done?" or "Boss, I'm getting overloaded and I won't be able to get to everything this week. Is there a way to shift some of this to X person? (use this one especially if you know if there are workers who are still getting paid but who have less to do.)

Legal recourse? None.

gdxgbs

legaladvice_train

6 weeks ago, my Employer cut my pay by 25% (due to "COVID19") until the foreseeable future. I'm a full time, salaried employee in Michigan. But as of this week I have more work to do than ever. What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? My boss fed me some BS about how the company owes me a raise and that'll happen this year but they dont know when full salaries will come back. I dont trust a word they say and I'm applying to new jobs. But in the meantime I'm pissed about how much work I have to do now. I want to just decline the work and say I'm too busy. I don't care if they fire me; but I don't want to quit and lose out on unemployment. Thanks in advance for any/all advice!

fpl6n6q

fpk0gjf

I'm going to point out here that this isn't *necessarily* unreasonable, if your work has increased due to other people being laid off or the reduced pay wasn't because of less work but rather concern about reduced income for the business (e.g., clients who aren't going to be able to pay their bill or will pay net 90 instead of net 30). A lot of people are getting pay cuts right now. However, assuming that it IS unreasonable, I think your best bet is to push back in a professional way, the same way you might push back on being overloaded if you hadn't just gotten a pay cut: "Boss, I'm currently getting more work than I'm able to get through during the week. Can we talk about how to prioritize this so that the most important stuff is getting done?" or "Boss, I'm getting overloaded and I won't be able to get to everything this week. Is there a way to shift some of this to X person? (use this one especially if you know if there are workers who are still getting paid but who have less to do.)

Declining work cuts pretty close to the 'insubordination' line where they could fire you for cause which could cause unemployment to be denied. If this is going to be your path...document, document, document. Send emails detailing your workload and inability to handle the volume before declining new work. With unemployment covering even less than your 25% reduced salary and new jobs not quite hiring at the previous levels, you could also try another strategy prior to lighting that bridge on fire: "While I am aware of the challenges to the business and reasons for the reduction, I likewise have financial obligations that aren't being met with this reduction, are there other tasks I can cover which can bring me to my previous level of compensation" It certainly is worth a shot, and if successful will put you in a better position coming out of this thing (new responsibilities typically = more pay/raises...eventually) Meanwhile, keep up the job search.

gdxgbs

legaladvice_train

6 weeks ago, my Employer cut my pay by 25% (due to "COVID19") until the foreseeable future. I'm a full time, salaried employee in Michigan. But as of this week I have more work to do than ever. What kind of recourse do I have to decline more work being put on my plate? My boss fed me some BS about how the company owes me a raise and that'll happen this year but they dont know when full salaries will come back. I dont trust a word they say and I'm applying to new jobs. But in the meantime I'm pissed about how much work I have to do now. I want to just decline the work and say I'm too busy. I don't care if they fire me; but I don't want to quit and lose out on unemployment. Thanks in advance for any/all advice!

fpk0gjf

fpk450a

Declining work cuts pretty close to the 'insubordination' line where they could fire you for cause which could cause unemployment to be denied. If this is going to be your path...document, document, document. Send emails detailing your workload and inability to handle the volume before declining new work. With unemployment covering even less than your 25% reduced salary and new jobs not quite hiring at the previous levels, you could also try another strategy prior to lighting that bridge on fire: "While I am aware of the challenges to the business and reasons for the reduction, I likewise have financial obligations that aren't being met with this reduction, are there other tasks I can cover which can bring me to my previous level of compensation" It certainly is worth a shot, and if successful will put you in a better position coming out of this thing (new responsibilities typically = more pay/raises...eventually) Meanwhile, keep up the job search.

Legal recourse? None.

4z71gh

legaladvice_train

[MT] My boss sexually harassed me. There are emails, he admitted it to the company and he settled my lawsuit. When he got fired I got fired too because they needed money (my pay) for his severance package. Was it legal?

d6tkor3

d6tll95

I am not a lawyer But pretty sure this is shady as fuck talk to a lawyer.

You should consult with an attorney on this one. Legally, they can't terminate you in retaliation for making a sexual harassment complaint, but they may be able to terminate you for other legitimate reasons, and budget reasons could well be legitimate. A consultation with an attorney shouldn't be too expensive, and after giving them all of the pertinent information, they should be able to advise you on what action, if any, you should take based on the specific facts of your case. Also, definitely appeal your unemployment denial; being let go for budget reasons shouldn't disqualify you for unemployment, so either your employer is telling a different story about the reasons for letting you go or your unemployment office is one of those that automatically denies all requests the first time.

4z71gh

legaladvice_train

[MT] My boss sexually harassed me. There are emails, he admitted it to the company and he settled my lawsuit. When he got fired I got fired too because they needed money (my pay) for his severance package. Was it legal?

d6ttgh8

d6tkor3

This is pure speculation, but I have a lot of experience drafting executive employment agreements. Under any normal circumstances, if an executive is fired because of sexual harassment, that will be a "for cause" termination and the executive shouldn't be entitled to any severance. The same is generally true with company-wide severance plans. I agree with the others that said budget reasons may be legitimate, but if the company is giving him severance that he's not legally entitled to (i.e. he wouldn't get it under his employment agreement or the company's severance plan, but the company is just trying to be nice), it would be hard for them to justify terminating the person he sexually harassed to cover that cost. As the others said, I would consult with an attorney.

I am not a lawyer But pretty sure this is shady as fuck talk to a lawyer.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn0wjgt

gn0ugbr

You need a good employment law attorney immediately.

Speak to an attorney. This is more complicated than "was it legal for them to fire me." And you can always report to the police.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn0wjgt

gn0vbpr

You need a good employment law attorney immediately.

No, that was certainly an unlawful termination. You should consult an employment lawyer ASAP.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn12e7o

gn0ugbr

Your description of the aftermath is short and to the point, which is great. Write up a description just like it with a timeline of the actual incident to as well as any details you remember from the agreement they tried to have you sign. Call several attorneys in your state and give them the general rundown, see who bites. Use their response as an indicator of how much of a case you have, but don't sign paperwork with an attorney that you feel is steamrolling you. There are thousands in your state, it's possible you're going to make one of them a lot of money.

Speak to an attorney. This is more complicated than "was it legal for them to fire me." And you can always report to the police.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn0vbpr

gn12e7o

No, that was certainly an unlawful termination. You should consult an employment lawyer ASAP.

Your description of the aftermath is short and to the point, which is great. Write up a description just like it with a timeline of the actual incident to as well as any details you remember from the agreement they tried to have you sign. Call several attorneys in your state and give them the general rundown, see who bites. Use their response as an indicator of how much of a case you have, but don't sign paperwork with an attorney that you feel is steamrolling you. There are thousands in your state, it's possible you're going to make one of them a lot of money.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn0ugbr

gn1wfsw

Speak to an attorney. This is more complicated than "was it legal for them to fire me." And you can always report to the police.

As everyone else said, employment attorney, now. For what it's worth though, while you're correct in not signing, the NDA would likely be unenforceable if you had signed it. NDAs legally cannot be used to prevent you from reporting criminal activity, especially that in which you're the victim.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn0vbpr

gn1wfsw

No, that was certainly an unlawful termination. You should consult an employment lawyer ASAP.

As everyone else said, employment attorney, now. For what it's worth though, while you're correct in not signing, the NDA would likely be unenforceable if you had signed it. NDAs legally cannot be used to prevent you from reporting criminal activity, especially that in which you're the victim.

li398z

legaladvice_train

(Indiana) I was fired for refusing to sign an nda after being sexually assaulted at work. Was this legal? I was barred from calling the police after I was sexually assaulted at work. I was also told I had to sign an nda saying I could never call the police, testify in court or tell anyone else I was sexuallying assaulted or I would face a 6 figure penalty. I was told I would get a $4000 bonus. I wasn't given any time to decide. It had to be signed immediately. I wouldn't sign it so I was fired and escorted out by security. I did go to the police. My boss was arrested and charged with battery and sexual battery. Another manager and a security guard were both charged with obstruction of justice because they tried to delete the cctv. My boss, the other manager and the security guard weren't fired, they came back after getting bail. My question now is was it legal for them to fire me because I wouldn't sign the agreement or does at will employment cover them.

gn2qssd

gn2fscs

Lawyer. Now. What you just said is “My superior assaulted me, tried to bribe me, then got other employees to be complicit in trying to cover up a criminal act” There is no world where you don’t need a lawyer for this.

Not a lawyer- Everyone is correct in calling an attorney. As an added bonus you may also wish to call the local labor department and report to them what happened as well. By alerting them they may find reason to investigate your former employer, if they're willing to fire you for not signing and NDA that is highly illegal what else are they up to? Even if they were a government agency and you had a high security clearance they couldn't make you sign an NDA in regards to something like a sexual assault. The labor department deserves to know what other illegal activity they've done to wrong others including yourself.

uljef7

legaladvice_train

Was sexually abused by coworker. Employer won’t take actions because it didn’t happen in work premises. I’m a 25yo straight male, my coworker is over 50yo also male but he’s not straight. This happened in Florida. He’s always “playing” and every time he can touches my butt. This happens at work on a regular basis. A few days ago we went to a party not related to our job and long story short he ended up touching my private area all night and even locked my friends out of the house to be alone with me while I was lying unconscious in bed, if it weren’t for my friends I don’t know what he could have done. I’ve got witnesses and I even have a recording of the front door of my friends slamming the door worried about me. I confronted this coworker and he denied everything that he did, I talked to my manager and she says there’s nothing she can do because it happened outside the work premises. She offered to change our shifts so we don’t have to see each other but I refuse to work in the same workplace knowing that eventually we will encounter each other, it’s a very small golf club and we don’t even have a HR. What would be the best course of action? Should I file a police report? Talk to the general manager in hopes that he’ll believe me? Get a lawyer or just quit and move on? I’ve been at that club for over 3 years and it just kills me the fact that he gets away with what he did. Thanks for reading my embarrassing story.

i7vuxxf

i7vx2n6

He touches you at work? Have you reported that? Otherwise the workplace isn't the police, or a judge, or a jury, they don't enforce laws. You need to go to the police.

This is sexual assault, if you have witnesses that are willing to testify that this touching is unwanted call the cops are file a report. Doubly so if you have video evidence of this happening. Next time it happens yell at the top of your lungs for him to stop touching your butt. Make a big scene out of it. Dont put your hand on him, just back away and yell.

4rf7m9

legaladvice_train

Stepfather was fired unexpectedly and has been refused a reason for his termination. Boss's son now gets his contracts, is this wrongful termination? We live in Huntsville, AL and this happened last week. My stepfather works at a printer/office supply renting leasing type company and he and my mom had just returned from vacation and when he went back to work they fired him, and although he asked their reasoning, they refused to explain. Now, his friends at the job have told him that all the contracts he had sold and negotiated were being passed on to the boss's son, and he is making easy money because of it. I was just wondering if this could qualify as wrongful termination because as far as anyone can tell, the only reason he was fired was so that the boss's son didn't actually have to work to sell anything and he could get paid commission for all the contracts that are soon to come back up that my stepdad was previously in charge of. I couldn't find anything in the AL or federal state codes but I did only give it a topical review. We plan on trying to set up a meeting in order to at least give the boss a chance to explain if there were other factors at play but, being as he was among their top salesman, had won them contracts with several large companies, and had a spotless record, I don't know of any other reason for him to be dropped.

d50lqem

d50lof3

Nope. At-will employment. He can be fired for no reason at all.

Did your father have an employment contract?