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Quote | ReplyI do not think that 3-BP should necessarily be avoided because of the possibility of TLS. I thought that this risk should be noted and managed, though this is something that could be controlled. With the proper monitoring and medical assistance in place, 3-BP could provide an anti-tumor effect while still being safe. It would be important to be careful when trying to make it more powerful with combinations. In the metastatic melanoma patient it was found that straight 3-BP gradually brought down LDH levels. It was only when it was combined with paracetamol that there was a truly massive immediate anti-tumor effect.

Route of administration is also of importance. With the liver cancer patient, a direct injection of 250 mg of 3-BP into an obstructed liver artery was made resulting in a very large dose to the tumor. This evenutally resulted in a very large anti-tumor response. The metastatic melanoma patient was treated with IV 3-BP and this resulted initially in a more subdued tumor response.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 05, 2015 09:53 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 06, 2015 12:40 AM Jcancom wrote:

I do not think that 3-BP should necessarily be avoided because of the possibility of TLS. I thought that this risk should be noted and managed, though this is something that could be controlled. With the proper monitoring and medical assistance in place, 3-BP could provide an anti-tumor effect while still being safe. It would be important to be careful when trying to make it more powerful with combinations. In the metastatic melanoma patient it was found that straight 3-BP gradually brought down LDH levels. It was only when it was combined with paracetamol that there was a truly massive immediate anti-tumor effect.

Route of administration is also of importance. With the liver cancer patient, a direct injection of 250 mg of 3-BP into an obstructed liver artery was made resulting in a very large dose to the tumor. This evenutally resulted in a very large anti-tumor response. The metastatic melanoma patient was treated with IV 3-BP and this resulted initially in a more subdued tumor response.

The problem is you cannot get 3BP from a doctor at any reasonable price and not sure the places that do it will give you some for later. Some of us would not be confident enough to do it ourselves.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 05, 2015 10:17 PM
Quote | ReplyWith all the smart people on this site wanting to do 3BP we should figure a way to get the trials started or maybe get some other clinics to do it to bring down the price.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Mon Apr 06, 2015 01:00 PM
Quote | ReplyCancer Lett. 2014 May 1;346(2):300-8. doi: 10.1016/j.canlet.2014.01.015. Epub 2014 Jan 27.Sensitization of metformin-cytotoxicity by dichloroacetate via reprogramming glucose metabolism in cancer cells.Choi YW1, Lim IK2.Author information\*1Department of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology, BK21 Cell Transformation and Restoration Project, Ajou University School of Medicine, Suwon 443-721, Republic of Korea.

* 2Department of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology, BK21 Cell Transformation and Restoration Project, Ajou University School of Medicine, Suwon 443-721, Republic of Korea. Electronic address: iklim@ajou.ac.kr.

AbstractTo investigate sensitization of metformin-cytotoxicity, cancer cells were treated with dichloroacetate (DCA), an inhibitor of pyruvate dehydrogenase kinase (PDK). Metformin-cytotoxicity was mainly dependent on glucose availability and reducing power generated by pentose phosphate pathway, whereas DCA cotreatment enhanced metformin-cytotoxicity via reprogramming glucose metabolism by inhibiting PDK and increasing mitochondrial respiration. DCA cotreatment elicited cell death rather than cell survival despite high glucose and high GSH condition. In conclusion, DCA sensitized metformin-cytotoxicity by reprogramming glucose metabolism in part from aerobic glycolysis to mitochondrial oxidation, evidenced by measurements of glucose consumption, lactate release, and the ratio of oxygen consumption rate/extracellular acidification rate.

Copyright © 2014 Elsevier Ireland Ltd. All rights reserved
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Mon Apr 06, 2015 06:38 PM
Quote | Reply#Cancer Doxycycline Studies - Maryland Lyme - Google Siteshttps://sites.google.com/site/marylandlyme/.../ **cancer**-**doxycycline**-studies#\*
Multiple studies found doxycycline has the ability to reduce or eliminate various forms of cancer and cancerous tumors. There is a high rate of people with Lyme ...

**Cancer Doxycycline Studies**Multiple studies found doxycycline has the ability to reduce or eliminate various forms of cancer and cancerous tumors.  There is a high rate of people with Lyme disease developing cancers.  Below is a news article in easy-to-read language.  Following it are the actual studies mentioned in the article, and a list of more recent scientific studies linking doxycycline to cancer improvement.

**Scientists find way to 'turn off' cancer**

**Antibiotic halts aggressive tumours in mice**

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Mon Apr 06, 2015 07:54 PM
Quote | ReplyWonder why doxycycline and not minocycline?

BTW, your links don't work.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Mon Apr 06, 2015 08:00 PM
Quote | ReplyAnswering my own question, doxycycline is cheaper, and had been tested.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/01/150128081957.ht
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Mon Apr 06, 2015 08:01 PM
Quote | ReplyThere is a lot of research on this. I put it here as food for thought.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Apr 06, 2015 10:18 PM
Quote | ReplyI have quite a history with Lyme--now in "late stage" with it.  Was not even recognized when I was a teenager--and, looking back, I had all of the symptoms when I was 19.  Finally diagnosed in the early 1990's--used dual antibiotics--amoxicillin and minocycline (50mg.) daily for almost 2 years.  The spirochete still there to this day--must have mutated, etc.

In any event, diagnosed with breast cancer 3 years ago--went through surgery, IPT, etc.  Still having major problems--ND suggested  doxycycline for a month to possibly help with cancer stem cells.  Thinking this may be a good idea prior to any involvement with potential usage of DCA or 3-BP.  Addressing the stem cells initially may help control possible  spread prior to treating with DCA or 3-BP.

Chronic inflammation would likely be the major culprit for Lyme patients who later develop cancer--also the fact that the immune system is exhausted.

Open to any thoughts here.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:42 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 2:18 AM jetsparkle wrote:

I have quite a history with Lyme--now in "late stage" with it.  Was not even recognized when I was a teenager--and, looking back, I had all of the symptoms when I was 19.  Finally diagnosed in the early 1990's--used dual antibiotics--amoxicillin and minocycline (50mg.) daily for almost 2 years.  The spirochete still there to this day--must have mutated, etc.

In any event, diagnosed with breast cancer 3 years ago--went through surgery, IPT, etc.  Still having major problems--ND suggested  doxycycline for a month to possibly help with cancer stem cells.  Thinking this may be a good idea prior to any involvement with potential usage of DCA or 3-BP.  Addressing the stem cells initially may help control possible  spread prior to treating with DCA or 3-BP.

Chronic inflammation would likely be the major culprit for Lyme patients who later develop cancer--also the fact that the immune system is exhausted.

Open to any thoughts here.
silver hydrosol-ozone enemas
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 01:33 AM
Quote | ReplyThank you, Genelle--I will look into these two suggestions.

Another question for anyone knowledgeable...I know that RGCC (Greek lab) is offering SOT (apparently treatment for cancer stem cells).  Only offered through doctors that have a private agreement with them.  Does anyone know how successful this treatment has been with addressing the cancer stem cell problem?  Would that be the way to go instead of using doxycycline?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 07, 2015 08:37 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 5:33 AM jetsparkle wrote:

Thank you, Genelle--I will look into these two suggestions.

Another question for anyone knowledgeable...I know that RGCC (Greek lab) is offering SOT (apparently treatment for cancer stem cells).  Only offered through doctors that have a private agreement with them.  Does anyone know how successful this treatment has been with addressing the cancer stem cell problem?  Would that be the way to go instead of using doxycycline?
I would not comapre SOT with doxycycline. If financials are not an issue, I would take SOT anyway and consider doxycycline as well.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 07, 2015 08:39 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 2:18 AM jetsparkle wrote:

I have quite a history with Lyme--now in "late stage" with it.  Was not even recognized when I was a teenager--and, looking back, I had all of the symptoms when I was 19.  Finally diagnosed in the early 1990's--used dual antibiotics--amoxicillin and minocycline (50mg.) daily for almost 2 years.  The spirochete still there to this day--must have mutated, etc.

In any event, diagnosed with breast cancer 3 years ago--went through surgery, IPT, etc.  Still having major problems--ND suggested  doxycycline for a month to possibly help with cancer stem cells.  Thinking this may be a good idea prior to any involvement with potential usage of DCA or 3-BP.  Addressing the stem cells initially may help control possible  spread prior to treating with DCA or 3-BP.

Chronic inflammation would likely be the major culprit for Lyme patients who later develop cancer--also the fact that the immune system is exhausted.

Open to any thoughts here.
Did your ND suggested doxycycline for a month? What was the dose he suggested?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 11:13 AM
Quote | ReplyHe originally wanted to start me out with 2 per day--100 mg. each for a month.  Then, knowing how sensitive I am to most things, he wants to begin with 1-1xday for a while to see my tolerance.

Thanks for your comment about doxycycline and SOT.  But do you know of any positive results from using SOT?  I don't have any actual feedback/information about whether it has actually been performing.   I am familiar with RGCC--have used their services and think they are quite competent and results highly useful.   But would like to know more statistics about the SOT and how the patients have responded to the technique.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 07, 2015 11:33 AM
Quote | ReplyRegarding SOT, the only info I have is the following: i have seen some slides showing positive results following this treatment; can only be delivered when the tumor is a few cm or smaller; TLS can be observed following the treatment.

I do not expect you will find much moore info on this available on the web - I would better contact one of the doctors delivering this treatment and ask for more info.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:59 PM
Quote | ReplyThank you, Danielus.  I did telephone one of the doctor's offices the other week about it--the only reply I received from one of the receptionists was that it was "individual" as to success.  I needed more information than that in order to make a good decision.

I will see if my ND will call one of the doctors here offering the treatment--perhaps further information will be shared with him as an ND rather than me as a patient.  If so, I will post what he finds out.

All in all, it does sound promising--good lab behind it. Money is a factor--but, if it works well, then may be good to follow through.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Tue Apr 07, 2015 04:00 PM
Quote | ReplyIf a SOT has to be made up for each person on an individual basis, how does one know it is working?Doxy is cheap, and crosses the blood brain barrier, though I wonder if azithromycin would be better.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 04:22 PM
Quote | ReplyI don't know how one would determine it is working--other than once more sending a blood specimen to RGCC after a certain amount of time for them to determine the CTS's and CSC's.  Apparently only 3 doses max are to be given per year--and even possibly less so as not to cause any difficulties.

Doxycycline is from the tetracycline family--Zithromax is not (it is a macrolide--closely related to penicillin).  I personally never did very well with Zithromax overall--but did have success back in the 1990's with Minocycline to help somewhat alleviate Lyme symptoms.  Never completely cured though.

Then one has to be concerned about overusage of antibiotics generally--wear and tear on the immune system, etc.  It can be a vicious cycle--one just has to try to balance it all out somehow.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 04:25 PM
Quote | ReplyForgot to mention that I believe the clinical studies determined that it was the antibiotics from the  tetracycline family that were beneficial in "eliminating" cancer stem cells.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Tue Apr 07, 2015 04:44 PM
Quote | ReplyMetformin selectively targets cancer stem cells, and acts together with chemotherapy to block tumor growth and prolong remission

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2756324/

(It also does the job without chemotherapy)

Metformin may function as anti-cancer agent via targeting cancer stem cells: the potential biological significance of tumor-associated miRNAs in breast and pancreatic cancers

http://www.atmjournal.org/article/view/3965/4955

And Metformin cost $4 a month at walmart.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 05:12 PM
Quote | ReplyGood reminder for me about Metformin and its effect on cancer stem cells.  Genelle has mentioned it--as have others--and I appreciate all of this input.

SOT is expensive--and if I can get the job done with other things, all the better.

I know that you have mentioned that you will be sharing anything new about 3-BP as you become more aware of the best way to administer it.  Would appreciate this, too.

Just wanted to mention to any other breast cancer patients--more and more information being given about the inability of mammograms to detect cancers in dense tissue.  And I do not like all of the radiation anyway.  Only have had one mammogran--and that was practically forced upon me.  Refused to do ultrasound if I did not do mammogram first!  Did not have much choice if I wanted to find out about possible malignancy.   Then they could not determine anything by the mammography--went ahead and did ultrasound to fine tune it.  Good grief...

However, on the positive side,  the newest thing available (ultrasound-wise) is called Sonocine--ultrasound that can determine much better if any malignancy in dense breasts.  Scheduled to have one done very soon.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 05:41 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 8:44 PM skaran wrote:

Metformin selectively targets cancer stem cells, and acts together with chemotherapy to block tumor growth and prolong remission

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2756324/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2756324/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2756324/

(It also does the job without chemotherapy)

Metformin may function as anti-cancer agent via targeting cancer stem cells: the potential biological significance of tumor-associated miRNAs in breast and pancreatic cancers

http://www.atmjournal.org/article/view/3965/4955 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.atmjournal.org/article/view/3965/4955 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.atmjournal.org/article/view/3965/4955

And Metformin cost $4 a month at walmart.
I just started Metformin 250 am and 250 pm. Now increasing to 250 3 times a day. The doctor is going to test for insulin both fasting and after a big meal as that was the reading we had on a GT test a while back. That is- everything was normal with glucose but there was an insulin spike at the end of the GT test. The sugar was normal then too. She wants me to get under 5 insulin for fasting and I do not remember the number for the 3 hr after meal. Any advice? We will add the DCA after a bit and the diet a bit after that. Does DCA affect the numbers on glucose or insulin skaran?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Tue Apr 07, 2015 06:03 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, Azithromycin from macrolide family, but it was the one tested and shown to increase survival in NSCLC

http://www.impactjournals.com/oncotarget/index.php?journal=o

But I forgot yours was a breast ca, so Doxy it is.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 06:40 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 10:03 PM zhaosr wrote:

Yes, Azithromycin from macrolide family, but it was the one tested and shown to increase survival in NSCLC

http://www.impactjournals.com/oncotarget/index.php?journal=o ncotarget&page=article&op=view&path%5B%5D=3174&path%5B%5D=6141"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.impactjournals.com/oncotarget/index.php?journal=o  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.impactjournals.com/oncotarget/index.php?journal=o

But I forgot yours was a breast ca, so Doxy it is.
Thank you for the link you provided just now--wonderful information.  Have not read it over thoroughly yet--but did briefly skim it and found reference further confirming  validity of using doxycycline and Metformin together--great efficacy.

I worried about taking the doxy--can cause such Herxheimer's with Lyme disease that I have--but I have to look at the bigger picture--getting rid of those ctc's and csc's!

Thanks again--and I ( and I am sure everyone else here on this thread) wish only the best for you and your wife.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Tue Apr 07, 2015 07:35 PM
Quote | ReplyThanks. Wife is now critically ill having bled into pleural space from tumour invading blood vessels. She hasn't had another bleed since she was transfused last night, so hoping for the miracle.

Since she can't have chemo until this all settles down they have agreed to my cocktail of drugs last night. I've  asked for gefitinib to be restarted, added in atorvastatin to inhibit nf-kb, and to potentiate the gefitinib, and also doxy. Azithro would have been too much to ask. All a long shot but Pascal's wager and all. Otherwise she was on nothing.

I had her on Metformin when she was diagnosed last year but  they stopped it last night. Didn't argue. But will try and restart it if she gets out of hospital.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 07, 2015 08:24 PM
Quote | ReplyAll of us will hope for a miracle, too.  Kudos to you for being so very supportive of her--and being her special advocate--she, too, must be a very special person.

Best to you and please keep us updated.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:44 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 11:35 PM zhaosr wrote:

Thanks. Wife is now critically ill having bled into pleural space from tumour invading blood vessels. She hasn't had another bleed since she was transfused last night, so hoping for the miracle.

Since she can't have chemo until this all settles down they have agreed to my cocktail of drugs last night. I've  asked for gefitinib to be restarted, added in atorvastatin to inhibit nf-kb, and to potentiate the gefitinib, and also doxy. Azithro would have been too much to ask. All a long shot but Pascal's wager and all. Otherwise she was on nothing.

I had her on Metformin when she was diagnosed last year but  they stopped it last night. Didn't argue. But will try and restart it if she gets out of hospital.
In sickness and in health. Love is what makes us human.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Apr 08, 2015 01:53 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 07, 2015 11:35 PM zhaosr wrote:

Thanks. Wife is now critically ill having bled into pleural space from tumour invading blood vessels. She hasn't had another bleed since she was transfused last night, so hoping for the miracle.

Since she can't have chemo until this all settles down they have agreed to my cocktail of drugs last night. I've  asked for gefitinib to be restarted, added in atorvastatin to inhibit nf-kb, and to potentiate the gefitinib, and also doxy. Azithro would have been too much to ask. All a long shot but Pascal's wager and all. Otherwise she was on nothing.

I had her on Metformin when she was diagnosed last year but  they stopped it last night. Didn't argue. But will try and restart it if she gets out of hospital.
Dear Zhaos, is good to hear that your wife can take drugs. In this case I have one more pice of info that you may want to consider:

If the tumor shows on PET scan than one strategy that has been shown effective in killing even pancreatic cancer, demonstrated on humans, is using proton pump inhibitors. I have seen results from various cancers including brest, ovarian, pancretic.

The idea is to inhibit as many proton pumps as possible so that protons (aciditity) can not be exported our of the tumor cell. As a result the intracellular pH will decrease and that will inhibit various enzymes required for the suvavial of tha cancer cell. This in turn will kill the cancer cells.

The cocktail that has been used is consisting out of Amiloride (30mg/day), Omeprazole (40mg/day), Resveratrol (500mg/day), Querceting (up to 9g/day!), Acetazolamide (250mg/day).

Note that Amiloride (30mg/day) alone has been shown to lead to strong tumor markers decline http://www.medicinabiomolecular.com.br/biblioteca/pdfs/Cance

Also please note that both Amiloride and Acetazolamide may lead to an increase in K so you need to follow that carefully with the blood tests every week. Anyone starting this protocol needs to go up in the number of drugs step by step, i.e. add one more every several days.

Atorvastatin may well with thsi strategy since I think is a PTI, inhibiting MCT - but just check.

Although I would not do this, the more gucose you give to the patient with this protocol the more chance of success may be since the glycolysis will increase but the protons can not be xported out.

Here is a reference to get more clarity on this strategy: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24195657

Prof. Salvador harguindey published a lot in this field so you can further explor thsi: http://salvadorharguindey.blogspot.nl/p/scientific-articles.

I hope this helps. All the best to you and your wife!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Wed Apr 08, 2015 02:58 PM
Quote | Replyfrom Genelle: "I just started Metformin 250 am and 250 pm. Now increasing to 250 3 times a day. The doctor is going to test for insulin both fasting and after a big meal as that was the reading we had on a GT test a while back. That is- everything was normal with glucose but there was an insulin spike at the end of the GT test. The sugar was normal then too. She wants me to get under 5 insulin for fasting and I do not remember the number for the 3 hr after meal. Any advice? We will add the DCA after a bit and the diet a bit after that. Does DCA affect the numbers on glucose or insulin skaran?"

It took me a little bit to figure out what '5' ment.  You must be in Canada where they measure in mmol/L.  In the states we measure in mg/dl.  In the USA 5=90 that is much too high to have an affect on cancer.  Normal for people without cancer isn't the same as people with cancer. Your glucose levels need to be between 3.6 to 4.2 before meals and should come down close to that 2hr after meals and your blood ketones need to be around 3 or 4 to stop feeding the cancer.  It's only possible with a ketogenic diet.

http://www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com/cancer-diet.html

I keep restating it, but this is important.  Your success depends on not feeding the cancer thatISthe Chemotherapy.  Just a side note. Went for a contrast MRI yesterday.  Radiologist can't get over how much my breasts have cleared up in 18 months (go every 6 months).  The only things that are visible (I used to have all kinds of benign anomalies and some hyperplasia as well as the cancer) is the scaring from the biopsy's and the resolving cryo I didn't have the tumor removed surgically because I wanted it to stimulate my immune system to recognize it. Not bad for someone who had a 1.2cm grade 2, Her2 invasive cancer diagnosed in Dec of 2012.  Without surgery, Chemo or Radiation.  I only treated it with Cryo and Keto Diet, aromatase inhibitors, Metformin (I'm on 1000mg). Depending on your size you could go up to 1000mg BID, but work up to that if you need to "Low and Slow", DCA 6.25mg/K (I'm on 310mg BID), Curcumin (Mixed with hot fat and black pepper to make in bio-absorbable.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Wed Apr 08, 2015 03:11 PM
Quote | ReplyOh I forgot to answer your question about DCA.  I doesn't affect glucose #'s.  It depolarizes the mitocondia of a cancer cells and makes them able to function like more normal cells, which allows them to realize they are defective and move towards apoptosis.  Metformin and DCA working synergisticly induces apoptosis better then just about anything else out there. And they're cheap.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Wed Apr 08, 2015 03:16 PM
Quote | ReplyOh below 5 means the fasting insulin. We are upping the Metformin to achieve below 5 on that and get  good numbers for fasting glucose and insulin as well as good numbers for insulin and glucose after a big meal as a way to decide on the dose of Metformin. I do not know how then adding DCA will affect that. We will 1st do Metformin then DCA IV then KETO. Tank you for the inf on ketones.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Wed Apr 08, 2015 07:40 PM
Quote | ReplyMetformin should be used in conjunction with DCA

"Dichloroacetate enhances apoptotic cell death via oxidative damage and attenuates lactate production in metformin-treated breast cancer."

http://www.researchgate.net/publication/265610099\_Dichloroac

(when you get to the pg, click on 'full article' to the right to read the entire article about how they work together to produce (ROS) reactive oxygen species.  All chemos work by producing ROS,  but this combo works only selectively on cancer cells and leaves healthy cells alone.)

Metabolically this works for all Pet Positive cancers, not just breast cancer.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Apr 08, 2015 10:17 PM
Quote | ReplyBest Wishes zhaosr.

It is a great responsibility posting to this thread when some are coping with severe illness. I hope some of the suggestions that you have found on this site have been useful and that we have been able to provide you with some comfort and support.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 05:27 AM
Quote | Replyskaran    I have seen enough research to accept that the KETO Metformin DCA protocol works. You, at one point, posted some numbers of blood levels of glucose and ketones and mentioned a ratio. So let us say that a person could achieve that level of glucose and supplement some ketones. What would be missing? And if something is missing or if that would not work- what other factors would be operative or missing?I appreciate your experience and success in this method and i have already found a lot of information on it which  my doctors have added to the information they have collected on this DCA protocol at my request. My doctors have gotten a clinical protocol  for IVs and we will begin soon. I have refused part of the protocol which includes GST as I have seen research that cancer cells use it and and need it to be depleted to be able to die. If you can address this please do as my decisions are always open to change. They will follow one IV with a Vit C IV and the second DCA IV was to have been followed by GST according to the protocol by a doctor at a medical school whom one of the docs learned about at an oncology conference. If this works for me, I and friends will refer people we know to this method so it will help others. I was thinking to start with IVs and later switch to pills after some success in blood markers and maybe a scan. Do you have any thoughts on that idea? It seems that IVs have some advantages in terms of dose and side effects. I recently told my pastor about it. He was a biology major undergrad before law school and theology seminary and asked for all my research. I sent  what I had including  information you posted and some from my doctors. He will follow this and refer some people if we have success. I would appreciate any feedback on this.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Thu Apr 09, 2015 09:29 AM
Quote | ReplyGenelle- You are giving me homework.  I was not so familiar with GST and had to investigate. I don't know if this will answer your question.

http://www.hindawi.com/journals/omcl/2013/972913/

This is their conclusion:

8. Conclusions
"The modulation of cellular GSH is a double-edged sword, both sides of which have been exploited for potential therapeutic benefits [120]. Enhancing the capacity of GSH and its associated enzymes, in order to protect cells from redox-related changes or environmental toxins, represents a persistent aim in the search for cytoprotective strategies against cancer. On the contrary, the strategy of depleting GSH and GSH-related detoxification pathways is aimed at sensitizing cancer cells to chemotherapy, the so-called chemosensitization [121]. In this context, it has been reported that GSH and GSH enzyme-linked system may be a determining factor for the sensitivity of some tumors to various chemotherapeutic agents. In particular, GST is a relevant parameter for chemotherapy response, and it may be utilized as a useful biomarker for selecting tumors potentially responsive to chemotherapeutic regimens.

However, the attempts to deplete GSH have been limited by the nonselective effects of BSO and have stimulated the research of new GCL inhibitors.

Since it is well known that GSH depletion leads to the upregulation of antioxidant genes, many of which are under Nrf2 control and, that in several types of tumors, Nrf2 is constitutively activated [122, 123], a new and indirect approach for cancer therapy may be used to modulate the Nrf2-ARE pathway. Based on this, Nrf2 creates a new paradigm in cytoprotection, cancer prevention, and drug resistance."

This article was published in 2014. After reading this a few times what I think they are saying (without going into all the alphabet soup) GSH is inhibited from working by the effects of BSO (L-Buthionine sulphoximine (BSO), which inhibits gamma glutamyl cysteine synthetase (gammaGCS), is used to modulate the cellular redox status)

In plain english it means this therapy is in the very early (guinea pig) stages of development, has a lot of kinks in it and hasn't shown to be so effective.

Excessive GSH appears to be a downstream result, not the root cause of cancer, which is metabolic damage.

(A little of personal information here)  I started out with 2 other ladies on this cancer journey.  The stumbling block for both of them was the diet.  I had the most viriulent form and no choice, chemo wouldn't have worked for me.  They both went through 'standard and customary' treatment.  One passed this past December after going through the worst of side effects, infections, and bell palsy from the chemo which didn't work. The other struggling with denial about what needed to be done focused her time and (lots of) money on balancing her hormones thinking controlling estrogen in her body will do the trick.  She (finally) realizes that what she is doing hasn't helped her a bit and we have started working together on her diet. On another note.  I have another friend (who has a lot of physical issues) who has tried everything to loose weight and feel better.  She's been gluten free for years and only continued to put on weight.  I started her on a Ketogenic diet 3 weeks ago. (Not the cancer diet which is 12g of carbs a day, but one that has 20 to 30g of carbs a day and moderate protein).  I told her it would take 3 weeks for her insulin to flatten and for her appitite to abate.  She called me after 2 weeks and this is what she said, "I can't believe it.  I'm no longer hungry and I can't eat the amounts of food you said I could have.  The only effects I feel is that I have more energy and I'm not thinking about food all the time."  (This is the side effect of healthy fat consumption)

I hope this helps, All the best.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:01 AM
Quote | ReplyThank you so much skaran for te information. I will not have trouble with the diet in terms of being weak. I had 4th stage ovarian 6 years ago and have figured out various ways to live. My question about being able to achieve a low glucose blood level and then supplement woth ketones was not because I cannot control myself. I am curious if that would work.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:17 AM
Quote | ReplyIt is well known that elevated levels of glutathione may act to protect cancerous cells by conferring resistance to chemotherapeutic drugs.

In thsi context, I was wondering why there is no reccomandation from the oncologs for all the patients taking chemo to take some paracetamol in advance. Or maybe they do reccoment but I am not aware of?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:28 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 2:17 PM Danielus wrote:

It is well known that elevated levels of glutathione may act to protect cancerous cells by conferring resistance to chemotherapeutic drugs.

In thsi context, I was wondering why there is no reccomandation from the oncologs for all the patients taking chemo to take some paracetamol in advance. Or maybe they do reccoment but I am not aware of?
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/224716.php
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:41 AM
Quote | ReplyThe GST was part of the medical protocol from the oncology conference my doctors got and you infuse it after the 2nd weekly IV of DCA. I did not want to do that extra IV FYI. As you can see below this information seems to suggest the idea of getting a correct blood level and supplementing with ketones. My docs will be treating some who have GI and kidney issues and we were wondering  if we could soften the diet if a patient had other issuesCancer Lett. 2014 May 1;346(2):300-8. doi: 10.1016/j.canlet.2014.01.015. Epub 2014 Jan 27.Sensitization of metformin-cytotoxicity by dichloroacetate via reprogramming glucose metabolism in cancer cells.

"whereas DCA cotreatment enhanced metformin-cytotoxicity via reprogramming glucose metabolism by inhibiting PDK and increasing mitochondrial respiration. DCA cotreatment elicited cell death rather than cell survival despite high glucose and high GSH condition.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:49 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 2:17 PM Danielus wrote:

It is well known that elevated levels of glutathione may act to protect cancerous cells by conferring resistance to chemotherapeutic drugs.

In thsi context, I was wondering why there is no reccomandation from the oncologs for all the patients taking chemo to take some paracetamol in advance. Or maybe they do reccoment but I am not aware of?
I could get a copy of the protocol as to the other things they will add to the iV bag if that would help others. The 1st IV of DCA is followed by a Vit C IV and the 2nd (in a week) is followed by a GST iv which I declined as mentioned. I could present your idea to them as they work with me and pretty much will do what I want if there is evidence. I have no evidence on paracetamol. All my research these 6 years has been focused on me sticking around and helping others I know. There is a lot of inf, actually TMI in a way. If you think this would help us could you post something and I will run it by all 4 of my docs.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 09, 2015 11:16 AM
Quote | ReplyI am sorry genelle, maybe you explained that before but what is GST?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 11:19 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 3:16 PM Danielus wrote:

I am sorry genelle, maybe you explained that before but what is GST?
glutathione
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 09, 2015 11:25 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 2:28 PM skaran wrote:

On Apr 09, 2015 2:17 PM Danielus wrote:

It is well known that elevated levels of glutathione may act to protect cancerous cells by conferring resistance to chemotherapeutic drugs.

In thsi context, I was wondering why there is no reccomandation from the oncologs for all the patients taking chemo to take some paracetamol in advance. Or maybe they do reccoment but I am not aware of?
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/224716.php "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/224716.php " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/224716.php
Skaran, this link doesnt answer my question.

For clarity, I am not refering to long term use of Paracetamol. Only use a few days before and during chemo administration. After that you can always go back to adding NAC or Gluthadiole to compensate.

In some countries in EU, Paracetamol is suggested by medical doctors for any health issue --> consumption is very high --> no specific peek in blood cancer has been observed as suggested in the link. So I would not worried about such a risk when considering short term use to facilitate chemo or 3BP adminstration.

Yet, my questions remains open: Why Paracetamol is not suggested before and durring Chemo?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Thu Apr 09, 2015 11:59 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 2:41 PM Genelle wrote:

The GST was part of the medical protocol from the oncology conference my doctors got and you infuse it after the 2nd weekly IV of DCA. I did not want to do that extra IV FYI. As you can see below this information seems to suggest the idea of getting a correct blood level and supplementing with ketones. My docs will be treating some who have GI and kidney issues and we were wondering  if we could soften the diet if a patient had other issuesCancer Lett. 2014 May 1;346(2):300-8. doi: 10.1016/j.canlet.2014.01.015. Epub 2014 Jan 27.Sensitization of metformin-cytotoxicity by dichloroacetate via reprogramming glucose metabolism in cancer cells.

"whereas DCA cotreatment enhanced metformin-cytotoxicity via reprogramming glucose metabolism by inhibiting PDK and increasing mitochondrial respiration. DCA cotreatment elicited cell death rather than cell survival despite high glucose and high GSH condition.
This is from Ellan Davis's Book

Contraindicated Health conditons are:
History of pancreatitis
Active gall bladder disease
Impaired liver function
Impaired fat digestion
Poor nutritional status
Gastric bypass surgery
Abdominal tumors
Decreased gastrointestinal motility;this may be in conjunction with conventional cancer treatment and associated drugs
History of kidney failure

Contraindicated medications:
Anti-sezure medications such a Zonegran, Topamax and Diamox can caus acidosis and this effect can be even stronger when used in combination with R-KD
Diuretics such as Lasix, dosages may need to be titrated downward or discontinued entirely as R-KD has a pronounced natural diuretic effect

Note on Steroids:
Lupron (leuprolide)and Decadron (dexamethasone) can raise blood glucose but in many cases they are needed to reduce adema and other complications.  Dr. Colin Champ has advised that in these cases the diet is especially beneficial as it helps keep blood glucose down while taking prescribed drugs.

She also states:
If you are currently undergoing chemotherapy or radiation treatments, it is extremely important that you with a healthcare professional experienced in the implementation of a R-KD for cancer.  Chemotherapy drugs and radiation treatments have toxic side effects and can rob the body of bitamins and minerals via their effect on the digestive tract and absorption of food nutrients.
Chemotherapy drugs and radiation treatments may also impact the immune system and also liver and kidney functions and these factors must be considered when planning an optimal diet. If your current medical team is unable to provide support you can contact her at www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com  to ask for help in locating and experienced professional.

Having said that Dr. Seyfried feels strongly that the diet must be adhered to in order for it to work optimally. I took it on fairly slowly and didn't start it with a fast.

I started it by finding my resting metabolic rate on this site

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/calrmr.htm

This RMR Calculator will average out how many calories you absolutely need a day to support your body weight.

I reduced its suggested calorie intake by 30% but kept my proteins at 1g/k of body weight and restricted my carbs to 12g.  The rest was fat.  I did this till I produced ketones with a ketone stix. (This only shows ketones for the first weeks of the diet after that it's inacurate and you need a bood ketone meter.) I added more and more fat as I was able to handle it over many weeks.  The initial side effects for me was nausia and vomiting when I tried to force down the fats and what's known in the process as keto flu.  So take it slow, your body becomes keto adaptive over a few weeks.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Thu Apr 09, 2015 12:07 PM
Quote | ReplyDanielus-You asked why they aren't using it here.  I think that this is the answer.  Oncologist know about this study and think it is unsafe.  They probably remember that it is counterindicated and probably don't remember why or the details. That's all. I myself think that even with long term use, going from 1% possiblity of getting blood cancer to 2% still very low incidence, so if you want to use it go ahead, but I'm not an oncologist.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 02:08 PM
Quote | ReplyThanks for all the info skaran as well as the sources.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 02:10 PM
Quote | ReplySo danielelus are you saying that Advil will deplete GST so the DCA cn work better? If i do DCA IVs 2x a week ow often and how much would I take?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 02:15 PM
Quote | ReplyCould someone comment on this part of my post?

DCA cotreatment elicited cell death rather than cell survival despite high glucose and high GSH condition.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 09, 2015 02:27 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 4:07 PM skaran wrote:

Danielus-You asked why they aren't using it here.  I think that this is the answer.  Oncologist know about this study and think it is unsafe.  They probably remember that it is counterindicated and probably don't remember why or the details. That's all. I myself think that even with long term use, going from 1% possiblity of getting blood cancer to 2% still very low incidence, so if you want to use it go ahead, but I'm not an oncologist.
Hi Skaran. Thanks for the clarification. It was only a link so I could not know what exactly you meant by that. If you would be an oncologist you would probably not be around :)

Anyway, it would be strage if an oncologist would take this risk into account and use this as a basis not to suggest paracetamol ... but we can expect anything indeed ...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Thu Apr 09, 2015 03:07 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 6:15 PM Genelle wrote:

Could someone comment on this part of my post?

DCA cotreatment elicited cell death rather than cell survival despite high glucose and high GSH condition.
This was shown in cancer cell lines.  That means near perfect controls inside a lab in a petri dish. Not in a human subject who's metabolic profile is ???? Whether this works the same way in human beings is unknown till they actually do human trials and get a few years of data.  We are all individuals.  So some people eat junk food their whole lives, revel in risky behaviours and live to 95.  Alas, sadly I am not in that catagory.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 09, 2015 03:12 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 09, 2015 6:10 PM Genelle wrote:

So danielelus are you saying that Advil will deplete GST so the DCA cn work better? If i do DCA IVs 2x a week ow often and how much would I take?
Genelle, I think that lower levels of Gluthadiole will support any pro oxidant strategy to kill cancer cells. On this line, I would expect that paracetamol would support both DCA and Vitamin C IV since both are pro oxidant approaches. On the other hand, I see Vitamin C IV and DCA IV as longer term treatments and Paracetamol as a short term approach due to potential toxicity. So I would not take Paracetamol every time when taking the IVs due to the potential side effects. I would start the IV treatment without paracetamol, follow the markers and than during one week only I would add paracetamol, e.g. 1.5g/day, and see the impact on the markers.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Thu Apr 09, 2015 04:21 PM
Quote | ReplyI was hoping this would be an option for those not able to do KETO along with the DCA and Metformin ie  get sugar down and supplement ketones.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Fri Apr 10, 2015 12:26 PM
Quote | ReplyAnybody has recommendations for metastatic thyriod cancer, refractory to radioactive iodine? A friend is starting a nexavar (sorafenib) treatment. I would think 3-BrPA and DCA related metabolic approaches should apply also to thyriod cancer, but I have seen no explicit publications for thyriod. Any opinion on this?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 10, 2015 12:31 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 10, 2015 4:26 PM ipappas wrote:

Anybody has recommendations for metastatic thyriod cancer, refractory to radioactive iodine? A friend is starting a nexavar (sorafenib) treatment. I would think 3-BrPA and DCA related metabolic approaches should apply also to thyriod cancer, but I have seen no explicit publications for thyriod. Any opinion on this?
Metabolic treatments such as 3BP, DCA, 2DG, Keto, etc do not depend on the cell type. For these it is important to know if the cancer is visible or not on PET.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Apr 10, 2015 12:39 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 10, 2015 4:31 PM Danielus wrote:

On Apr 10, 2015 4:26 PM ipappas wrote:

Anybody has recommendations for metastatic thyriod cancer, refractory to radioactive iodine? A friend is starting a nexavar (sorafenib) treatment. I would think 3-BrPA and DCA related metabolic approaches should apply also to thyriod cancer, but I have seen no explicit publications for thyriod. Any opinion on this?
Metabolic treatments such as 3BP, DCA, 2DG, Keto, etc do not depend on the cell type. For these it is important to know if the cancer is visible or not on PET.
Danielus,

Perhaps you (or anyone else can chime in!) can answer this for me.

Last night I was reviewing an RGCC test (complete profile) from 2013--have not had one since then.  I scanned the different agents, and to my surprise, found out that there seems to be 0% efficacy when using DCA and Metformin!

Yet, my latest PET/CT scan (February 2014) definitely was "lit up" with cancer areas--go figure....

Any thoughts about this?  Hoping DCA and/or 3-BP--plus Metformin will work in my case.  Seems to me they should if cancer is visible on the PET/CT scan.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 10, 2015 12:53 PM
Quote | ReplyRegarding 3BP IV, I have some update:

during February my wife's LDH started to grow relatively fast. Begining of March we started 3BP IV. After two infusions at 0.5mg/kg and 1mg/kg, at a distance of 3 days, LDH stopped growing remaining at the same lavel with the last measurement. After other five IVs growing from 1mg/kg to 1.5 mg/kg, at a distance between 3 days up to 7 days, the LDH declined with about 10%. Side effects are related with some pain during the IV at around 1.5mg/kg. In order to avoid pain we recentlly started to add some procaine as well which should also help the tummor perfusion. However, I need to investigate the potential interaction of 3BP with procaine. Going to higer doses we will need to add sodium bic. If anybody is aware of interaction between 3BP and procaine please let me know.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 10, 2015 01:23 PM
Quote | ReplyJetsparkle, here is my oppinion:

First, I like RGCC, but when I look at the their test I only belive what is suggested to work. That meens that there is some direct activity of that component against the cancer cells. If something doesnt show up on the RGCC test I would not conclude it doesnt work since tehre can be so mechanism that are taking pace in a human body and are not visible in the lab (and the other way around). Metformin for example has multiple direct and indirect anti-cancer activities. Btw, I allso seen such results where DCA alone doesnt work but DCA+DMSO will work.

If I would still have to expain why Metformin and DCA would not have direct anti-cancer effects on cancer cells that show up on PET, my explantion would be the following: in these cancer cells the mitochondria is death and can not be rescued. In that case, any glycolisis inhibitor such as 3BP and 2DG should still work. Also the strategy to inhibit proton pumps (as explalin in one of my earlier comments) should work as well. B17, Artemisinin, Hyperthermia, Quercetin, etc. should still have the potential to work well.

I hope this helps.

I am curious what others think about this
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by adickens7 on Fri Apr 10, 2015 03:10 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 08, 2015 7:16 PM Genelle wrote:

Oh below 5 means the fasting insulin. We are upping the Metformin to achieve below 5 on that and get  good numbers for fasting glucose and insulin as well as good numbers for insulin and glucose after a big meal as a way to decide on the dose of Metformin. I do not know how then adding DCA will affect that. We will 1st do Metformin then DCA IV then KETO. Tank you for the inf on ketones.
We have stopped doing DCA IV's because of the toxicity and lack of specificity in comparison to 3bp.  Our experience is that 3bp is a far superior product to DCA.

Of critical importance is watching glucose levels, ketone levels and nutrition.  Anything to help control blood glucose is a good idea.  Metformin is good for controlling gluconeogenesis but so are a number of other products such as the berberine family of botanicals. The ketogenic diet and other ketogenic products are very beneficial.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Apr 10, 2015 03:30 PM

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On Apr 10, 2015 5:23 PM Danielus wrote:

Jetsparkle, here is my oppinion:

First, I like RGCC, but when I look at the their test I only belive what is suggested to work. That meens that there is some direct activity of that component against the cancer cells. If something doesnt show up on the RGCC test I would not conclude it doesnt work since tehre can be so mechanism that are taking pace in a human body and are not visible in the lab (and the other way around). Metformin for example has multiple direct and indirect anti-cancer activities. Btw, I allso seen such results where DCA alone doesnt work but DCA+DMSO will work.

If I would still have to expain why Metformin and DCA would not have direct anti-cancer effects on cancer cells that show up on PET, my explantion would be the following: in these cancer cells the mitochondria is death and can not be rescued. In that case, any glycolisis inhibitor such as 3BP and 2DG should still work. Also the strategy to inhibit proton pumps (as explalin in one of my earlier comments) should work as well. B17, Artemisinin, Hyperthermia, Quercetin, etc. should still have the potential to work well.

I hope this helps.

I am curious what others think about this
Danielus,

Your opinion indeed does help to sort things out--very much appreciated!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Apr 10, 2015 03:36 PM

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On Apr 10, 2015 7:10 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 08, 2015 7:16 PM Genelle wrote:

Oh below 5 means the fasting insulin. We are upping the Metformin to achieve below 5 on that and get  good numbers for fasting glucose and insulin as well as good numbers for insulin and glucose after a big meal as a way to decide on the dose of Metformin. I do not know how then adding DCA will affect that. We will 1st do Metformin then DCA IV then KETO. Tank you for the inf on ketones.
We have stopped doing DCA IV's because of the toxicity and lack of specificity in comparison to 3bp.  Our experience is that 3bp is a far superior product to DCA.

Of critical importance is watching glucose levels, ketone levels and nutrition.  Anything to help control blood glucose is a good idea.  Metformin is good for controlling gluconeogenesis but so are a number of other products such as the berberine family of botanicals. The ketogenic diet and other ketogenic products are very beneficial.
It is good to read your comments since you are very knowledgable about DCA/3-BP, etc.

You no doubt have your hands tied, so to speak, as to how much information you can share about 3-BP and the ways/formulations in which you administer it--since it must be proprietary at this point in time.

However, anything you can add to this discussion and that can help us who cannot afford clinical costs, is much appreciated.

You just mentioned the usage of the berberine family that can be used instead of Metformin to help control blood glucose. Would you be able to share more information about that?

Many thanks.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

View all Alternative Treatments Discussions Post A New Discussion946 Posts | Page(s): Prev 12...63 64 65 66 67 ...9495 Next james-peters

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Sat Apr 11, 2015 01:51 AM
Quote | ReplyEfficacy of Berberine in Patients with Type 2 Diabetes http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/  http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa  http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sat Apr 11, 2015 02:37 AM

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On Apr 11, 2015 5:51 AM james-peters wrote:

Efficacy of Berberine in Patients with Type 2 Diabetes http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/  http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa ry\_4\_12.html"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa  http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512 000871"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512
james-peters,

Thank you for providing this excellent information--appreciate your sharing it and will read it thoroughly.

Offhand, are  you aware of any negatives/side effects in using berberine for which a person should be aware?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Sat Apr 11, 2015 03:16 AM

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On Apr 11, 2015 6:37 AM jetsparkle wrote:

On Apr 11, 2015 5:51 AM james-peters wrote:

Efficacy of Berberine in Patients with Type 2 Diabetes http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ " 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james-peters,

Thank you for providing this excellent information--appreciate your sharing it and will read it thoroughly.

Offhand, are  you aware of any negatives/side effects in using berberine for which a person should be aware?
Theoretically, it may cause blood sugars to become too low and it may cause low blood pressure. Also the half-life seems to be 3-4 hours. So a little and often may be needed and I would try and wait a few hours before taking any other meds as its hard to say if it will cause interactions or not with them
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sat Apr 11, 2015 03:19 AM
Quote | ReplyThanks again for the information!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sat Apr 11, 2015 07:00 PM
Quote | ReplyBertberine and transglucosidase
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:04 AM
Quote | ReplyThank you all for your wishes. My wife's condition has rapidly progressed, with more bleeding into her pleural space, after a failed pleurodesis, and mediastinal shift, tumor growth compressing her good lung. She is in a drug induced coma so that she doesn't suffer from what has been intractable pain, and shortness of breath.

There no options left for her that I can see.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Apr 13, 2015 02:31 AM
Quote | ReplyMy heart goes out to you--have been thinking about you and your wife and had such hopes that there would be good news.

Please know that all of your comments are so much appreciated here on this thread--and thank you for sharing your knowledge and caring with us.

Continue to have hope--you have been--and continue to be--your wife's warrior and advocate.  Be comforted and be reassured that she has known this-- and of  your love for her throughout all of this--present time included.

Best to you, zhaosr--and to your beloved wife.  I can only hope that some other options will be provided somehow.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by zhaosr on Mon Apr 13, 2015 09:56 AM
Quote | ReplyThan you for your encouragement and wishes but she passed away at midnight. This disease is really evil and I hope you people do find a cure for your own loved ones.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:31 PM
Quote | ReplyEven in such a time of extreme distress and heartache, you have still manifested such kindness in caring and hoping for others, zhaosr.

My heartfelt condolences upon your loss--words cannot adequately express the sadness felt for you at this time.

You will be remembered for your valiant efforts and support--and that is an encouragement to all of us here.

May you have comfort and peace in the coming days--knowing that your dear wife  recognized your love throughout this ordeal.  The very best to you for setting such a fine example for us all.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by adickens7 on Mon Apr 13, 2015 02:43 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 11, 2015 5:51 AM james-peters wrote:

Efficacy of Berberine in Patients with Type 2 Diabetes http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2410097/  http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa ry\_4\_12.html"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementa  http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512 000871"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211383512
Question: The Science Direct article says that berberines affect mitochondria.   "We observed that oxygen consumption was decreased and glycolysis was enhanced with berberine as indicated by increased lactate production."   In cancer that is not is a welcome piece of news for me!

How about bitter melon which affects glucose-6-phosphatase and fructose 1,6 biphosphatase in the liver during gluconeogenesis.The Biochemical Journal. May 15 1993;292 ( Pt 1):267-270.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

View all Alternative Treatments Discussions Post A New Discussion946 Posts | Page(s): Prev 12...64 65 66 67 68 ...9495 Next skaran

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Mon Apr 13, 2015 08:39 PM
Quote | ReplyFrom adickens7-Question: The Science Direct article says that berberines affect mitochondria.   "We observed that oxygen consumption was decreased and glycolysis was enhanced with berberine as indicated by increased lactate production."   In cancer that is not is a welcome piece of news for me!

That is why you need the DCA
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 01:02 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 14, 2015 12:39 AM skaran wrote:

From adickens7-Question: The Science Direct article says that berberines affect mitochondria.   "We observed that oxygen consumption was decreased and glycolysis was enhanced with berberine as indicated by increased lactate production."   In cancer that is not is a welcome piece of news for me!

That is why you need the DCA
Agreed! The DCA is being used at several Canadian clinics and there are clinical protocols because DCA is available. 3BP is hard for a clinic to get because of the patent.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 14, 2015 05:42 AM
Quote | ReplyDear zhaosr, I am so sorry. There are no words to express that but you have my utmost condolences.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 14, 2015 05:58 AM
Quote | ReplyWhen using 3BP this may be good news as well: it means that if the cancer cell will not be killed (which seems to be typically the case) Berberine would increase the sensitivity of cancer cells to the 3BP treatment.

Here is a good article on Berberine as well: http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Paulo\_Oliveira35/publica
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:15 AM
Quote | ReplyI have berberine. It does not make a lot of difference and has to be taken many times per day. So sorry jhaosr. Hope you have family around you for support.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:53 PM
Quote | ReplyI am just wondering why none of the clinics--here in the U.S. or Mexico--have responded very well to the queries posed to them regarding protocol, dosage, costs, side effects, results, etc. of 3-BP they are administering at their clinics.

Both Drs. Ko and Pedersen had the wonderful motive of being able to tremendously help relieve people of cancer with this relatively inexpensive substance.  Yet, as far as I can glean, most cancer patients will have to further excessively drain their bank accounts to pay current high-asking costs in order to both have initial treatments and then follow-up, ongoing treatments at said clinics.

Just saying.....
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:59 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 14, 2015 4:53 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I am just wondering why none of the clinics--here in the U.S. or Mexico--have responded very well to the queries posed to them regarding protocol, dosage, costs, side effects, results, etc. of 3-BP they are administering at their clinics.

Both Drs. Ko and Pedersen had the wonderful motive of being able to tremendously help relieve people of cancer with this relatively inexpensive substance.  Yet, as far as I can glean, most cancer patients will have to further excessively drain their bank accounts to pay current high-asking costs in order to both have initial treatments and then follow-up, ongoing treatments at said clinics.

Just saying.....
Yes around 30K or more. They do not even follow up with 3BP at home. Atlanta told me the 3BP will make cancer go away but it has come back with patients. I do not want to go to the AZ clinic so Atlanta is my only option.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 02:11 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 14, 2015 12:39 AM skaran wrote:

From adickens7-Question: The Science Direct article says that berberines affect mitochondria.   "We observed that oxygen consumption was decreased and glycolysis was enhanced with berberine as indicated by increased lactate production."   In cancer that is not is a welcome piece of news for me!

That is why you need the DCA
We are just establishing by blood tests today if my dose of Metformin is correct. Doing fasting and after meal tests on insulin and sugar. So skaran I wonder if the berberine and/or the DCA will change the numbers?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 02:19 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 14, 2015 9:58 AM Danielus wrote:

When using 3BP this may be good news as well: it means that if the cancer cell will not be killed (which seems to be typically the case) Berberine would increase the sensitivity of cancer cells to the 3BP treatment.

Here is a good article on Berberine as well: http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Paulo\_Oliveira35/publica tion/49787319\_Berberine\_as\_a\_promising\_safe\_anti-cancer\_agent\_-\_is\_there\_a\_role\_for\_mitochondria/links/0deec535057ca9b644000000.pdf"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Paulo\_Oliveira35/publica  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Paulo\_Oliveira35/publica
Summary (All Essential Benefits/Effects/Facts & Information)Berberine is an alkaloid extracted from various plants used in Traditional Chinese Medicine.

Berberine is supplemented for its anti-inflammatory and anti-diabetic effects. It can also improve intestinal health and lower cholesterol. Berberine is able to reduce glucose production in the liver. Human and animal research demonstrates that 1500mg of berberine, taken in three doses of 500mg each, is equally effective as taking 1500mg of metformin or 4mg glibenclamide, two pharmaceuticals for treating type II diabetes. Effectiveness was measured by how well the drugs reduced biomarkers of type II diabetes.

Berberine may also synergize with anti-depressant medication and help with body fat loss. Both of these benefits need additional evidence behind them before berberine can be recommended specifically for these reasons.

Berberine - Examine.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com Examine.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com  /supplements/**Berberine**/\*

Berberine’s main mechanism is partly responsible for its anti-diabetic and anti-inflammatory effects. Berberine is able to activate an enzyme called Adenosine Monophosphate-Activated Protein Kinase (AMPK) while inhibiting Protein-Tyrosine Phosphatase 1B (PTP1B).

Berberine is one of the few supplements in the Examine.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Examine.com  database with human evidence that establishes it to be as effective as pharmaceuticals.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 14, 2015 02:23 PM
Quote | ReplyBerberine is **POSSIBLY SAFE** for most adults for short-term use when taken by mouth or applied to the skin.

Special Precautions & Warnings:
**Children**: It’s **UNSAFE** to give berberine to newborns. It can cause kernicterus, a rare type of brain damage that can occur in newborns who have severe jaundice. Jaundice is yellowing of the skin caused by too much bilirubin in the blood. Bilirubin is a chemical that is produced when the old red cells break down. It is normally removed by the liver. Berberine may keep the liver from removing bilirubin fast enough.

**Pregnancy and breast-feeding**: It’s **UNSAFE** to take berberine by mouth if you are pregnant. Researchers believe berberine can cross the placenta and might cause harm to the fetus. Kernicterus, a type of brain damage, has developed in newborn infants exposed to berberine.

It’s also **UNSAFE** to take berberine if you are breast-feeding. Berberine can be transferred to the infant through breast milk, and it might cause harm.

**Diabetes**: Berberine can lower blood sugar. Theoretically, berberine may cause blood sugar to become too low if taken by diabetics who are controlling their blood sugar with insulin or medications. Use with caution in people with diabetes.

**High bilirubin levels in the blood in infants**: Bilirubin is a chemical that is produced when the old red blood cells break down. It is normally removed by the liver. Berberine may keep the liver from removing bilirubin fast enough. This can cause brain problems, especially in infants with high levels of bilirubin in the blood. Avoid using.

**Low blood pressure**: Berberine might lower blood pressure. Use with caution in people with low blood pressure.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

View all Alternative Treatments Discussions Post A New Discussion946 Posts | Page(s): Prev 12...65 66 67 68 69 ...9495 Next Jcancom

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:17 PM
Quote | ReplyDear zhaosr:

My deepest condolences.

I regret that I did not more forcefully advocate for the use of 3-BP. Cancer is constantly trying to progress, there can be no time for hesitation once a course of action is chosen.

However, as was noted on the thread, there have only been two published patient reports with 3-BP. It is difficult to give unqualified endorsement with such a small amount of clinical evidence.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Apr 16, 2015 04:10 PM
Quote | ReplyI have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by adickens7 on Thu Apr 16, 2015 04:46 PM

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On Apr 16, 2015 8:10 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.

Well I think the good book pertains to life and living and not something that sits on a shelf or when someone goes to church two times a year.  If you are offended by someone actually trying to apply scriptures in daily living then that is your prerogative.  It is my prerogative to try to live it daily.

I took from the earlier post that Mr. Chiu was disrespectful of Dayspring and myself and our attempts to make 3bp available.  If someone does not like our cost then why don’t they open a clinic and charge what they want?  Or is it just easier to complain and throw rocks? Why do people complain about Dayspring? The answer is found in Teddy Roosevelt’s “The Man in the Arena”.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

So I trust and pray you get in the arena and know firsthand what we are doing so that you are more than a cold and timid soul. I would hope and pray that people would support Dayspring in trying to make 3bp available but I suppose it is easier to complain.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 16, 2015 05:08 PM
Quote | ReplyI think there is no issue with teh fact that Dayspring is offering a Ferrari. It is a privat clinic and as I understand is not a non-profit organisation. What is wrong is at a higher level and that is our society mixing health with business. But that is another discussion that we can not solve here. However, this this social context I like that there are places such as Dayspring clinic.

It is their choice and belive (and business model) that 3BP needs to be supported by many other treatments that have an associate cost as well. Only installing a port to administrate IVs may cost more than 1000 dollars ... and than adding hyperthermia and others will enhance that cost + having multiple IVs every day and others will easy justify the costs. If I would have the money I would probably go there.

What is important to say is that during the past months I learned that there are multiple clinics out there offering 3BP as well - some will be very accessible in price while offering 3BP alone. Fore those who do not have the finace to get the whole package from places such as Dayspring, these may offer an option. It seems that while they do not advertise on the web, most of the major clinics are offering 3BP (you just have to call and ask).

One other point I have learn during the past days and which for me is a kind of breakthrough: due to confidentiality reasons I can not go into the details, but the point is that there is no fundamental reason why the 3BP treatment as performed on the 16-years old boy has not been used again. In other words, 3BP treatment/effectivness/side effects was not a reason. After that, the treatment went underwater, probably due to legal reasons. This fact, next to the results from Dayspring, next to the results I saw and next to the results that the dr. in Egypt saw in his patient makes 3BP a serious anti-cancer treatment not only in theory, not only on animals but on HUMANS.

The only and major challenge is to tune the traetment to the patient and sometimes it may work alone, sometimes it may need paracetamol and sometimes it may require additions such as those used by Dayspring.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Apr 16, 2015 05:46 PM

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On Apr 16, 2015 8:46 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:10 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.

Well I think the good book pertains to life and living and not something that sits on a shelf or when someone goes to church two times a year.  If you are offended by someone actually trying to apply scriptures in daily living then that is your prerogative.  It is my prerogative to try to live it daily.

I took from the earlier post that Mr. Chiu was disrespectful of Dayspring and myself and our attempts to make 3bp available.  If someone does not like our cost then why don’t they open a clinic and charge what they want?  Or is it just easier to complain and throw rocks? Why do people complain about Dayspring? The answer is found in Teddy Roosevelt’s “The Man in the Arena”.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

So I trust and pray you get in the arena and know firsthand what we are doing so that you are more than a cold and timid soul. I would hope and pray that people would support Dayspring in trying to make 3bp available but I suppose it is easier to complain.

I definitely am not offended by anyone attempting to apply scriptures in daily living--I wish more would do so, in fact--the world would be a much better place.  Just as I wish more would express compasssion when someone's loved one passes away--i.e. zhao's wife.  I did not notice any type of caring/condolence on your part when this happened--somehow I do not view this as "daily Christian living" on your part. However, I do  have difficulty identifying the nexus between the scriptures and your apparent thoughts that your clinic is being attacked by those who merely desire to question about its costs and practices.

And so now I am being identified as a "cold and timid soul"--along with my being accused of being only a complainer.  Such heartless, cold, unkind words from a "healer".  Unbelievable.  What an encouraging thing to say to a person who has Stage !V cancer with mets.  You, sir,  need to examine your own heart and motivations.

Well, enough of sparring with you--I do not want to spend any more time discussing available treatments with or from you.  Egotism and arrogance have no place in a healing, spiritual environment--and you seem to have an abundance of both of these characteristics.

All on this board know that various treatments are necessary and are synergistic.   Cancer must be targeted from all different directions.  That is why, perhaps, it may be a good idea to target the cancer --and not the patients who are attempting to sift through the morass of available treatments and protocol--attempting to find a viable solution.

I have been involved with holistic therapies for decades now--and highly approve of them.  I do know that charging almost $10,000.00 per week for 5 days of treatment is excessive.  To state that a seriously ill patient is merely "complaining" about your clinic costs is unconscionable--no, one is just stating that perhaps these costs are out of reach for the average person who is trying to save his/her life.

Your sarcastic remarks and insinuations are unmerited and unwanted by those earnestly seeking help.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 16, 2015 06:04 PM
Quote | ReplyI think it is easy to escalate discussion when writing. I am sure that face to face you would have a very good and constructive discussion. There is a lot of passion here and I propose to use it in a constructive way. Based on your previous contributions I am 100% that you are both very well intended people.

Regarding prices, I went to clinics in Europe and paid even 1500 euro/day for a set of treatments.

One month treatments at good clinics in Germany cost between 20k and 40k.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 16, 2015 06:08 PM
Quote | ReplyFortunaetly, we can now have 3BP at home as one of the previous contributor mentioned. That can be oral, nebulized or topically applied with DMSO. The cost of that will be in the range of max 200$/month. So there are various options.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Apr 16, 2015 06:40 PM

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On Apr 16, 2015 10:04 PM Danielus wrote:

I think it is easy to escalate discussion when writing. I am sure that face to face you would have a very good and constructive discussion. There is a lot of passion here and I propose to use it in a constructive way. Based on your previous contributions I am 100% that you are both very well intended people.

Regarding prices, I went to clinics in Europe and paid even 1500 euro/day for a set of treatments.

One month treatments at good clinics in Germany cost between 20k and 40k.
Thank you for your voice of reason, Danielus.

And it will be beneficial to get back on track and help one another as best as we can. I, too, have spent quite a lot of money for health care over the years (both in  and out of the country)--and now must make intelligent decisions as to how to move forward.  I need questions answered  in order to do so.  Neither my energies--nor funds--can be wasted at this time--so every protocol must be investigated and determined if best in my case.

Thanks again--your comments are always much appreciated.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Apr 16, 2015 07:25 PM

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J Cancer 2014; 5(7):609-624. doi:10.7150/jca.9002

Pyrroloquinoline Quinone Induces Cancer Cell Apoptosis via Mitochondrial-Dependent Pathway and Down-Regulating Cellular Bcl-2 Protein Expression

Wonder how this one might be combined for synergistic effect. (Note: Article only presented in vitro results)

Article notes that ... Exposure to PQQ triggers ROS accumulation] (Figure 4) {Interesting with respect to possible acetaminophen cotreatment}... Reduced cell ATP levels by PQQ treatment (Figure 5) { Energy depletion appeared large at higher doses at 12 h}. What rational combination might maximize this effect with 3-BP?

PQQ is readily available online at a price of $14 a bottle for 10 mg pills.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Fri Apr 17, 2015 12:57 AM

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On Apr 16, 2015 8:46 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:10 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.

Well I think the good book pertains to life and living and not something that sits on a shelf or when someone goes to church two times a year.  If you are offended by someone actually trying to apply scriptures in daily living then that is your prerogative.  It is my prerogative to try to live it daily.

I took from the earlier post that Mr. Chiu was disrespectful of Dayspring and myself and our attempts to make 3bp available.  If someone does not like our cost then why don’t they open a clinic and charge what they want?  Or is it just easier to complain and throw rocks? Why do people complain about Dayspring? The answer is found in Teddy Roosevelt’s “The Man in the Arena”.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

So I trust and pray you get in the arena and know firsthand what we are doing so that you are more than a cold and timid soul. I would hope and pray that people would support Dayspring in trying to make 3bp available but I suppose it is easier to complain.

Everyone can see who you are from all this Dr Dickens. However, your information is somewhat useful.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Fri Apr 17, 2015 01:46 PM
Quote | ReplyResearchers at the University of Miami have found that an over-the-counter supplement is effective in both preventing and treating prostate cancer.

The supplement, 4-methylumbelliferone (4-MU), is a non-toxic oral agent used as a dietary supplement in Europe and Asia for improving liver health. Treating mice with the supplement appeared to inhibit prostate cancer from further developing starting as soon as eight weeks after  the rodents were diagnosed.

“The results were simply amazing,” principal investigator Vinata B. Lokeshwar, a professor of urology and director of the pilot and translational studies component of the Miami Clinical and Translational Science Institute, said in a news release.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Apr 17, 2015 02:28 PM
Quote | ReplyThat is interesing.

**4-Methylumbelliferone**(**4**-MU) is an inhibitor of hyaluronic acid (HA) synthesis with an IC50 value of 0.**4** mM

http://www.apexbt.com/4-methylumbelliferone-4-mu.html

One of the only known mammals that has never contracted cancer (when not genetically modified to lack HA) is the naked mole rat. The naked mole rat produces large amounts of HA.

http://www.nature.com/news/simple-molecule-prevents-mole-rat

However, there is confusion online whether HA might actually contribute to cancer progression.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyaluronan#Role\_in\_cancer\_metas
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by adickens7 on Fri Apr 17, 2015 02:50 PM

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On Apr 16, 2015 9:46 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:46 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:10 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.

Well I think the good book pertains to life and living and not something that sits on a shelf or when someone goes to church two times a year.  If you are offended by someone actually trying to apply scriptures in daily living then that is your prerogative.  It is my prerogative to try to live it daily.

I took from the earlier post that Mr. Chiu was disrespectful of Dayspring and myself and our attempts to make 3bp available.  If someone does not like our cost then why don’t they open a clinic and charge what they want?  Or is it just easier to complain and throw rocks? Why do people complain about Dayspring? The answer is found in Teddy Roosevelt’s “The Man in the Arena”.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

So I trust and pray you get in the arena and know firsthand what we are doing so that you are more than a cold and timid soul. I would hope and pray that people would support Dayspring in trying to make 3bp available but I suppose it is easier to complain.

I definitely am not offended by anyone attempting to apply scriptures in daily living--I wish more would do so, in fact--the world would be a much better place.  Just as I wish more would express compasssion when someone's loved one passes away--i.e. zhao's wife.  I did not notice any type of caring/condolence on your part when this happened--somehow I do not view this as "daily Christian living" on your part. However, I do  have difficulty identifying the nexus between the scriptures and your apparent thoughts that your clinic is being attacked by those who merely desire to question about its costs and practices.

And so now I am being identified as a "cold and timid soul"--along with my being accused of being only a complainer.  Such heartless, cold, unkind words from a "healer".  Unbelievable.  What an encouraging thing to say to a person who has Stage !V cancer with mets.  You, sir,  need to examine your own heart and motivations.

Well, enough of sparring with you--I do not want to spend any more time discussing available treatments with or from you.  Egotism and arrogance have no place in a healing, spiritual environment--and you seem to have an abundance of both of these characteristics.

All on this board know that various treatments are necessary and are synergistic.   Cancer must be targeted from all different directions.  That is why, perhaps, it may be a good idea to target the cancer --and not the patients who are attempting to sift through the morass of available treatments and protocol--attempting to find a viable solution.

I have been involved with holistic therapies for decades now--and highly approve of them.  I do know that charging almost $10,000.00 per week for 5 days of treatment is excessive.  To state that a seriously ill patient is merely "complaining" about your clinic costs is unconscionable--no, one is just stating that perhaps these costs are out of reach for the average person who is trying to save his/her life.

Your sarcastic remarks and insinuations are unmerited and unwanted by those earnestly seeking help.
Hi jetsparkle,

I was saddened by zhoa's wife's passing.  But when his first comments to me were to blatantly lie in saying "Dayspring doesn't have a MD" and to follow up with "well he is not a board certified oncologist" put me in a place where it did not seem appropriate to say anything to him.

The cold and timid soul comment is directed to those who want 3bp available clinically but when it is complain about the cost.  But wisdom is justified of her children. There is a pancreatic researcher here who makes a salary of 1.25 million a year and has gotten nowhere (why not try 3bp??? hmmmm).  The average oncologist makes 290k a year and in a recent poll 60% were unhappy with their salary.  I did not break 60k in my salary for 2014 so it is discouraging when I am accused of overcharging or being too high in our price.

When people make up facts about Dayspring like "charging almost $10,000. a week" is upsetting to me and I try to get the facts right. So people willing to tell a lie about Dayspring makes me want to respond and if an accurate rebuttal causes difficulties to people then perhaps I should bow out of this discussion.  I originally got into this forum because of Danelius and trying to get information out and information in but that period seems to have passed.

God's Best to All!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 17, 2015 04:09 PM

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On Apr 16, 2015 11:25 PM Jcancom wrote:

J Cancer 2014; 5(7):609-624. doi:10.7150/jca.9002

Pyrroloquinoline Quinone Induces Cancer Cell Apoptosis via Mitochondrial-Dependent Pathway and Down-Regulating Cellular Bcl-2 Protein Expression

Wonder how this one might be combined for synergistic effect. (Note: Article only presented in vitro results)

Article notes that ... Exposure to PQQ triggers ROS accumulation] (Figure 4) {Interesting with respect to possible acetaminophen cotreatment}... Reduced cell ATP levels by PQQ treatment (Figure 5) { Energy depletion appeared large at higher doses at 12 h}. What rational combination might maximize this effect with 3-BP?

PQQ is readily available online at a price of $14 a bottle for 10 mg pills.

I am not sure if PQQ should be used with 3BP but it seems suitable to be used with DCA. Specifically, as I mentioned before, the theory of a group of profesors is that an incarese in the intracellular alkalinity of cancer cells kills in time mitocondria. This transformation will than turn DCA theraphy into an ineffective treatment. On this line, when using DCA treatment you will want to make everything possible (I think) to keep functional mithocondria. PQQ (and CoQ10) seems to do that: http://www.alsearsmd.com/2015/03/the-most-promising-cancer-f

Btw, I was just reading during the past days on the web about the recent article entitled  "Dichloroacetate stimulates changes in the mitochondrial network morphology via partial mitophagy in human SH-SY5Y neuroblastoma cells". This paper indicates that "Blocking late phase autophagy increases the effects of DCA, suggesting that autophagy protects the cell, at least partially, against DCA." If thsi is the case DCA treatment should be combined with Chloroquine (an anti-malaria drug - authophagy inhibitor - also shown to work well with 3BP).
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 17, 2015 04:17 PM

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On Apr 17, 2015 6:50 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 9:46 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:46 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:10 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.

Well I think the good book pertains to life and living and not something that sits on a shelf or when someone goes to church two times a year.  If you are offended by someone actually trying to apply scriptures in daily living then that is your prerogative.  It is my prerogative to try to live it daily.

I took from the earlier post that Mr. Chiu was disrespectful of Dayspring and myself and our attempts to make 3bp available.  If someone does not like our cost then why don’t they open a clinic and charge what they want?  Or is it just easier to complain and throw rocks? Why do people complain about Dayspring? The answer is found in Teddy Roosevelt’s “The Man in the Arena”.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

So I trust and pray you get in the arena and know firsthand what we are doing so that you are more than a cold and timid soul. I would hope and pray that people would support Dayspring in trying to make 3bp available but I suppose it is easier to complain.

I definitely am not offended by anyone attempting to apply scriptures in daily living--I wish more would do so, in fact--the world would be a much better place.  Just as I wish more would express compasssion when someone's loved one passes away--i.e. zhao's wife.  I did not notice any type of caring/condolence on your part when this happened--somehow I do not view this as "daily Christian living" on your part. However, I do  have difficulty identifying the nexus between the scriptures and your apparent thoughts that your clinic is being attacked by those who merely desire to question about its costs and practices.

And so now I am being identified as a "cold and timid soul"--along with my being accused of being only a complainer.  Such heartless, cold, unkind words from a "healer".  Unbelievable.  What an encouraging thing to say to a person who has Stage !V cancer with mets.  You, sir,  need to examine your own heart and motivations.

Well, enough of sparring with you--I do not want to spend any more time discussing available treatments with or from you.  Egotism and arrogance have no place in a healing, spiritual environment--and you seem to have an abundance of both of these characteristics.

All on this board know that various treatments are necessary and are synergistic.   Cancer must be targeted from all different directions.  That is why, perhaps, it may be a good idea to target the cancer --and not the patients who are attempting to sift through the morass of available treatments and protocol--attempting to find a viable solution.

I have been involved with holistic therapies for decades now--and highly approve of them.  I do know that charging almost $10,000.00 per week for 5 days of treatment is excessive.  To state that a seriously ill patient is merely "complaining" about your clinic costs is unconscionable--no, one is just stating that perhaps these costs are out of reach for the average person who is trying to save his/her life.

Your sarcastic remarks and insinuations are unmerited and unwanted by those earnestly seeking help.
Hi jetsparkle,

I was saddened by zhoa's wife's passing.  But when his first comments to me were to blatantly lie in saying "Dayspring doesn't have a MD" and to follow up with "well he is not a board certified oncologist" put me in a place where it did not seem appropriate to say anything to him.

The cold and timid soul comment is directed to those who want 3bp available clinically but when it is complain about the cost.  But wisdom is justified of her children. There is a pancreatic researcher here who makes a salary of 1.25 million a year and has gotten nowhere (why not try 3bp??? hmmmm).  The average oncologist makes 290k a year and in a recent poll 60% were unhappy with their salary.  I did not break 60k in my salary for 2014 so it is discouraging when I am accused of overcharging or being too high in our price.

When people make up facts about Dayspring like "charging almost $10,000. a week" is upsetting to me and I try to get the facts right. So people willing to tell a lie about Dayspring makes me want to respond and if an accurate rebuttal causes difficulties to people then perhaps I should bow out of this discussion.  I originally got into this forum because of Danelius and trying to get information out and information in but that period seems to have passed.

God's Best to All!
Wow, a pancreatic researcher makes a salary of 1.25 million a year??? Andrew, are you considering Salinomycin treatment as well as an addition to Dayspring?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 17, 2015 04:59 PM
Quote | ReplyAn interesting subject relevant for cancer treatment is telomerase. In cancer, this is known to be upregulated and protect the cancer cells by inhibiting the naturall erosion of telomers which would otherwise lead to natural death of fast replicating cells. Therfore telomerase inhibitors are interesting anti-cancer elements. Berberine seems to have a telomerase inhibitor role as well. Here you can read a bit more about the theory behind: http://www.pg.gda.pl/chem/konkurs\_jc/project\_description\_jc.

Yet, the most interesting and accessible telomerase inhibitor seems to be procaine: http://www.newswire.com/procaine-turns-off-telomerase-and/12

But othes say it is a telomerase activator instead (i.e. an anti-aging element): http://www.newswire.com/the-procaine-pump-and-the-cells/7191

What do you think? Is an inhibitor or an activator?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 17, 2015 05:00 PM
Quote | ReplyAn interesting subject relevant for cancer treatment is telomerase. In cancer, this is known to be upregulated and protect the cancer cells by inhibiting the naturall erosion of telomers which would otherwise lead to natural death of fast replicating cells. Therfore telomerase inhibitors are interesting anti-cancer elements. Berberine seems to have a telomerase inhibitor role as well.

Yet, the most interesting and accessible telomerase inhibitor seems to be procaine: http://www.newswire.com/procaine-turns-off-telomerase-and/12

But othes say it is a telomerase activator instead (i.e. an anti-aging element): http://www.newswire.com/the-procaine-pump-and-the-cells/7191

What do you think? Is an inhibitor or an activator?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Apr 17, 2015 07:38 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 17, 2015 6:50 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 9:46 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:46 PM adickens7 wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 8:10 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have absolutely no idea why a quote from the Bible pertains to Dayspring Clinic--totally out of context as far as I am concerned.  Gives one pause for thought when equating a doctor/clinic to Jesus and His teachings.

I checked out  "We Have A Cure" on Facebook and its website. The doctor authoring these is an advocate of 3-BP and is trying to get accurate clinical trials going.  More can be read by going to her site.

She stresses that appropriate protocol should be addressed.  Also questioned such protocol, doses, results, side effects, and openly sharing such--and so forth  so that the usage of 3-BP can be made available to any interested in the future.

I do not think Mr. Chiu wants this to stop--he just wants to know why such an inexpensive substance is now going to be out of range for those in need--and that could pass away because the costs are so high. Valid questions...

"Using a Ferrari?"  Only the very wealthy can afford to purchase this type of car--and the costs of these programs, knowing that a month alone at a clinic is not sufficient to address cancer--may well indeed equate to purchasing this extravagantly priced car.

Technically your clinic is making this program only available to those  with very sufficient funds.  I will never believe that no profit is being made--and one should be able to profit--but not at the probable expense of lives of others.

Physician Heal Thyself--First Do No Harm.

Well I think the good book pertains to life and living and not something that sits on a shelf or when someone goes to church two times a year.  If you are offended by someone actually trying to apply scriptures in daily living then that is your prerogative.  It is my prerogative to try to live it daily.

I took from the earlier post that Mr. Chiu was disrespectful of Dayspring and myself and our attempts to make 3bp available.  If someone does not like our cost then why don’t they open a clinic and charge what they want?  Or is it just easier to complain and throw rocks? Why do people complain about Dayspring? The answer is found in Teddy Roosevelt’s “The Man in the Arena”.

“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

So I trust and pray you get in the arena and know firsthand what we are doing so that you are more than a cold and timid soul. I would hope and pray that people would support Dayspring in trying to make 3bp available but I suppose it is easier to complain.

I definitely am not offended by anyone attempting to apply scriptures in daily living--I wish more would do so, in fact--the world would be a much better place.  Just as I wish more would express compasssion when someone's loved one passes away--i.e. zhao's wife.  I did not notice any type of caring/condolence on your part when this happened--somehow I do not view this as "daily Christian living" on your part. However, I do  have difficulty identifying the nexus between the scriptures and your apparent thoughts that your clinic is being attacked by those who merely desire to question about its costs and practices.

And so now I am being identified as a "cold and timid soul"--along with my being accused of being only a complainer.  Such heartless, cold, unkind words from a "healer".  Unbelievable.  What an encouraging thing to say to a person who has Stage !V cancer with mets.  You, sir,  need to examine your own heart and motivations.

Well, enough of sparring with you--I do not want to spend any more time discussing available treatments with or from you.  Egotism and arrogance have no place in a healing, spiritual environment--and you seem to have an abundance of both of these characteristics.

All on this board know that various treatments are necessary and are synergistic.   Cancer must be targeted from all different directions.  That is why, perhaps, it may be a good idea to target the cancer --and not the patients who are attempting to sift through the morass of available treatments and protocol--attempting to find a viable solution.

I have been involved with holistic therapies for decades now--and highly approve of them.  I do know that charging almost $10,000.00 per week for 5 days of treatment is excessive.  To state that a seriously ill patient is merely "complaining" about your clinic costs is unconscionable--no, one is just stating that perhaps these costs are out of reach for the average person who is trying to save his/her life.

Your sarcastic remarks and insinuations are unmerited and unwanted by those earnestly seeking help.
Hi jetsparkle,

I was saddened by zhoa's wife's passing.  But when his first comments to me were to blatantly lie in saying "Dayspring doesn't have a MD" and to follow up with "well he is not a board certified oncologist" put me in a place where it did not seem appropriate to say anything to him.

The cold and timid soul comment is directed to those who want 3bp available clinically but when it is complain about the cost.  But wisdom is justified of her children. There is a pancreatic researcher here who makes a salary of 1.25 million a year and has gotten nowhere (why not try 3bp??? hmmmm).  The average oncologist makes 290k a year and in a recent poll 60% were unhappy with their salary.  I did not break 60k in my salary for 2014 so it is discouraging when I am accused of overcharging or being too high in our price.

When people make up facts about Dayspring like "charging almost $10,000. a week" is upsetting to me and I try to get the facts right. So people willing to tell a lie about Dayspring makes me want to respond and if an accurate rebuttal causes difficulties to people then perhaps I should bow out of this discussion.  I originally got into this forum because of Danelius and trying to get information out and information in but that period seems to have passed.

God's Best to All!
And it saddens me that you seem to be missing the point in this discussion--hopefully you will take the time over the weekend or so to re-think your availability on this thread.

Zhao should be allowed to express his thoughts and ideas--as should we all.  He was under extreme distress--he probably knew that his wife did not have much of a chance to survive.  So his questioning you should not have been taken so personally--he needed to know what kind of clinic you have, the costs, the results, the data, etc.  Please do not fault him or others for wanting to glean more information about potential treatments or costs.  There are many clinics out there--and patients cannot afford to test them all out.  Serious decisions have to be made.  The more you can accommodate valid questions from potential patients, the more confidence they will have in you.

As for the cost of 3-BP--well, we all know that it is a relatively inexpensive substance.  Drs. Ko and Pedersen's intent was to be able to make this available to a multitude of cancer patients at a reasonable cost to them.  We all know that most cancer patients can no longer work because of their accompanying disabilities.  Funds begin to seriously shrink with continued care--sometimes funds have been spent fruitlessly in the past--and we become wary and need facts validated.

So, if you were in our position, and had a loved one that needed care--and your salary for 2014 was not quite $60,000--well, imagine how stressed you would be trying to pay for care to keep your family alive?  Probably all of your year's salary could be gone in one fell swoop.  Who will feed your family--who will pay the rent/mortgage--how will your children's needs be met--well, the list goes on and on.

I did not make up the facts about approximate costs of being $10,000 per week.  I had been told by someone else that you had offered a 3-week cost of almost $30,000--that is why I averaged that way.  I am not in the habit of lying in any way, shape, or form.  Perhaps there was a misunderstanding about those fees?  In any event, even $28,000 for 4 weeks would average $7,000 per  a 5-day week--that is a lot for the average family today.

No one is trying to discourage you from adding to this discussion regarding facts and details--they are much appreciated.  And most, I am sure, are glad that you are offering 3-BP at your clinic.  But you must realize that we are trying to stay alive--money is a huge component in our being able to go to a clinic such as yours. And, unfortunately, there are definitely some of us who will never be able to pay the subsequent costs of such treatment. That can be very frustrating indeed.

Nevertheless, it would behoove you to recognize that your sharing of facts and details may help in this discussion.  Apparently most of us are very impressed with 3-BP or we would not be on this message thread.'

So, just a suggestion--it may be a good idea to take a step back, think about how your ideas and suggestions could potentially help others despite their not being able to afford your clinic--and then reassess whether or not you would like to continue on this thread.  No one wants you dismissed--we just want you to recognize that not all can afford clinic prices.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Sat Apr 18, 2015 12:51 PM
Quote | ReplyFirst to Zhaosr, my deepest sympathy and condoleances for the loss of your wife.

To Dr. Dickens, I personally appreciate your contributions to this list and wish you would continue to share good or bad experiences with 3BP, like the pancreatic cancer you mentioned. Each new case-report helps us figure out this puzzle. I am sure many would highly appreciate more details and more cases reports. Thanks in advance.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sat Apr 18, 2015 01:03 PM
Quote | ReplySame here: I personally appreciate you contribution Dr. Dickens  and hope you will continue to post here.
Quote | Reply

# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sat Apr 18, 2015 01:25 PM
Quote | ReplyDr Dickens, I agree that your contributions are welcome. I also agree with jetsparkle that you could be more sensitive.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sat Apr 18, 2015 01:32 PM
Quote | ReplyOk, clear! Than lets go back to science. :)

Any reaction on my question related to telomerase?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sat Apr 18, 2015 01:40 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 17, 2015 9:00 PM Danielus wrote:

An interesting subject relevant for cancer treatment is telomerase. In cancer, this is known to be upregulated and protect the cancer cells by inhibiting the naturall erosion of telomers which would otherwise lead to natural death of fast replicating cells. Therfore telomerase inhibitors are interesting anti-cancer elements. Berberine seems to have a telomerase inhibitor role as well.

Yet, the most interesting and accessible telomerase inhibitor seems to be procaine: http://www.newswire.com/procaine-turns-off-telomerase-and/12 3670"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.newswire.com/procaine-turns-off-telomerase-and/12  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.newswire.com/procaine-turns-off-telomerase-and/12

But othes say it is a telomerase activator instead (i.e. an anti-aging element): http://www.newswire.com/the-procaine-pump-and-the-cells/7191 7"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.newswire.com/the-procaine-pump-and-the-cells/7191  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.newswire.com/the-procaine-pump-and-the-cells/7191

What do you think? Is an inhibitor or an activator?
Would it not affect the normal cells as well and shorten their life?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sat Apr 18, 2015 05:54 PM
Quote | ReplyIn literature I havent found anybody to be concern with the inhibition aspect since telomerase is overactive in cancer cells. But if it is an activator, there is a concer that the anti-aging effect may apply to the cancer cells as well...

My question remains open: is procaine an activator or inhibitor of telomerase?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat Apr 18, 2015 08:00 PM
Quote | ReplyFound this interesting.

Below link notes that 2 primary liver patients were treated with 3-BP "showing promising initial results." Might one of these patients be the German patient? What about the other? Why hasn't this result been published?

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/vascular/irc%20reseach/geschw
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 19, 2015 04:43 AM
Quote | ReplyHey Jcancom. Interesting indeed. I think these two cases are different and do not include the treatment from Germany. This is the case because Geschwind was not involved in that intervention, based on the list of authors of the paper.

Anyway, I am sure many people were treated succesfully (before and after the published case) but there were no publications anymore.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:29 AM
Quote | ReplyThis is a great story on 3BP: https://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/10/bill-sardi/is-a-cancer-c
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 09:06 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 17, 2015 6:28 PM Jcancom wrote:

That is interesing.

**4-Methylumbelliferone**(**4**-MU) is an inhibitor of hyaluronic acid (HA) synthesis with an IC50 value of 0.**4** mM

http://www.apexbt.com/4-methylumbelliferone-4-mu.html "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.apexbt.com/4-methylumbelliferone-4-mu.html " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.apexbt.com/4-methylumbelliferone-4-mu.html

One of the only known mammals that has never contracted cancer (when not genetically modified to lack HA) is the naked mole rat. The naked mole rat produces large amounts of HA.

http://www.nature.com/news/simple-molecule-prevents-mole-rat s-from-getting-cancer-1.13236"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/news/simple-molecule-prevents-mole-rat  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/news/simple-molecule-prevents-mole-rat

However, there is confusion online whether HA might actually contribute to cancer progression.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyaluronan#Role\_in\_cancer\_metas tasis "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyaluronan#Role\_in\_cancer\_metas  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyaluronan#Role\_in\_cancer\_metas
Life Extension magazine this month is supporting research and has an article on this supplement.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 09:12 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 17, 2015 8:09 PM Danielus wrote:

On Apr 16, 2015 11:25 PM Jcancom wrote:

J Cancer 2014; 5(7):609-624. doi:10.7150/jca.9002

Pyrroloquinoline Quinone Induces Cancer Cell Apoptosis via Mitochondrial-Dependent Pathway and Down-Regulating Cellular Bcl-2 Protein Expression

Wonder how this one might be combined for synergistic effect. (Note: Article only presented in vitro results)

Article notes that ... Exposure to PQQ triggers ROS accumulation] (Figure 4) {Interesting with respect to possible acetaminophen cotreatment}... Reduced cell ATP levels by PQQ treatment (Figure 5) { Energy depletion appeared large at higher doses at 12 h}. What rational combination might maximize this effect with 3-BP?

PQQ is readily available online at a price of $14 a bottle for 10 mg pills.

I am not sure if PQQ should be used with 3BP but it seems suitable to be used with DCA. Specifically, as I mentioned before, the theory of a group of profesors is that an incarese in the intracellular alkalinity of cancer cells kills in time mitocondria. This transformation will than turn DCA theraphy into an ineffective treatment. On this line, when using DCA treatment you will want to make everything possible (I think) to keep functional mithocondria. PQQ (and CoQ10) seems to do that: http://www.alsearsmd.com/2015/03/the-most-promising-cancer-f ighter-in-years/"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.alsearsmd.com/2015/03/the-most-promising-cancer-f  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.alsearsmd.com/2015/03/the-most-promising-cancer-f

Btw, I was just reading during the past days on the web about the recent article entitled  "Dichloroacetate stimulates changes in the mitochondrial network morphology via partial mitophagy in human SH-SY5Y neuroblastoma cells". This paper indicates that "Blocking late phase autophagy increases the effects of DCA, suggesting that autophagy protects the cell, at least partially, against DCA." If thsi is the case DCA treatment should be combined with Chloroquine (an anti-malaria drug - authophagy inhibitor - also shown to work well with 3BP).
I have been doing PQQ 20 mg for 3 years since my cancer damaged (finished off by being rear ended) 4th lumbar was replaced. It helps regrow the neurons to relieve numbness. Now i cannot even tell thre was any surgery since the surgeon was so good. I am flexible and there is no pain. I did not know it had cancer effects.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 12:21 PM
Quote | ReplyI am disappointed that the two 3-BP patients mentioned above apparently have not been published in the literature.

Primary liver cancer is probably one of the best tests to demonstrate 3-BP's anti-cancer effects. If these patients had had an even more positive outcome than the German patient, this would be of interest to many liver cancer patients (and cancer patients in general).

It seems that patients will have to fight for the right to information, the right to access etc. 3-BP every inch of the way. Hopefully, at some point there might be a change in consciousness and The People will understand that just as with the logic behind Open Access journals (i.e. The People fund the authors of many of these articles to do their work), the people should also have the right to the information gained in research on university campuses and government institututes (which The People also fund).

This is not about removing the right of researchers to patent their work. It is about allowing the intellectual products of the research to be more fully understood in the community. We would all feel more comfortable with 3-BP if there were more published reports, with patients at different stages of illness and different clinical presentations etc. .

There appears to be a conspiracy involved with 3-BP treatment. 15 years after the initial research, there is still an absence of published clinical experience, though it appears to be becoming more widely used and recognized by the insiders.

The Hopkins lab might have submitted the 2 primary liver cancer patients in their filing to the FDA. I wonder if a Freedom of Inforamtion request to the FDA would uncover the results for these patients.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 01:06 PM
Quote | ReplyWhat happened to the post from Dayspring on the pancreatic patient?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 01:09 PM

Quote | Reply

Never mind here it is

Hmmm, Graham Chiu.  Who is he?  What is his profession and who does he work for?  What is his conflict of interest? What is his axe to grind with 3bp being offered by Dayspring?

A wise man once said “Do not be surprised if the world hates you, it hated me before it hated you” so I should not be surprised at people like Mr. Chiu.  He has many facts wrong and one is that the clinic is not 30,000 a month but 28,000 per month.  While not necessarily notable it just goes to show that this person will say what he wants to say irrespective of accuracy.

We are making 3bp available to patients and seeing success.  We just had a pancreatic in clinic with a starting CA 19-9 of 530 (less than 35 is normal) and in three weeks it was 202 and he went home on an oral protocol.  This past Monday he reports that his CA 19-9 is now at 126.  That is a 75% reduction in his blood marker.  So detractors like Mr. Chiu cannot change these numbers.  Why does Mr. Chiu want to see this stop?  Does he not want people to use 3bp? Or is it just that Dayspring does not use Mr. Chiu’s 3bp and it is sour grapes to him.

3bp is like the Queen on a chess board.  The other side (cancer) gets the full board of players and we are asked to only use the Queen?  There is a lot more to treating cancer than seemingly non-medical wanabees like Mr. Chiu understand.  It takes the full board of players to get good results.  A person spends over 160 hours in clinic in that month.  Plus there is a nutritionist, a colon hydrotherapist, a medical doctor, an oral program, hyperthermia, EWOT, four daily green juices, many IV’s and much much more that goes into the month other than 3bp.  Mr. Chiu seems to think that in buying a car he knows the price of a Yugo and does not understand that we are using a Ferrari.  Our patients want us to use a Ferrari.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 01:30 PM
Quote | ReplyThis thread is getting a little too unwieldy. (I can not find the pancreatic cancer patient reference.)

Perhaps we should organize the information on this thread as a comprehensive document and post it sequentially as a parallel thread or a pdf.

It could sort of be like a wiki. I would like to take on the editorial role for minicells. Anyone else interested?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 01:33 PM
Quote | ReplyGood idea. I hsppened to have sent that post to a friend so I had it.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Sun Apr 19, 2015 01:48 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 5:06 PM Genelle wrote:

What happened to the post from Dayspring on the pancreatic patient?
It disappeared. I noticed that too and don't understand how it is possible that some messages are lost.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 02:18 PM
Quote | ReplyYou should be careful with supplements and the possible interactions they might have with other supplements/ medications. It is still not clear (to me) how PQQ might intereact with DCA/3-BP etc. .

It might be a good idea to cut back on supplementation during treatment. Perhaps you could add some things back in to see how they would change treatment response.

(With the many off-target effects of some supplements such experimentation might be the only way to arrive at more effective treatment results. Sticking rigidly to a preset treatment plan would not allow you the opportunity to optimize.)
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 04:45 PM
Quote | ReplyI have been reading through the recent article "The Cytotoxicity of 3-bromopyruvate in breast cancer cells depends on extracellular pH" by the Hopkins researchers et al. .

The article brings together some of the ideas we have noted on this thread. The role of MCT1, importance of the proton motive force, extracellular pH as a modifier of 3-BP effectiveness, etc.

Several posts on the thread suggested the importance of buffering 3-BP to a pH of 7.4 when administering it. I am not sure how this relates to the finding in this article that an extracellular pH of 6.0 is more effective than 7.4 for 3-BP treatment. (These might be separate issues).

The finding in this article that the cancer cell selectivity of 3-BP can be (at least in part) be attributable to MCT1 and to the pH effect described in the article is welcome news. There has been legitimate concern that 3-BP could potentially have serious side effects. This articles helps to explain and somewhat lessen these concerns.

"Due to the alkylating proerties of 3BP, it is surprising that few secondary effects have been reported to date."

Article raises the question of whether CD147 glycoslation inhibition in normal cells or over-expression in cancer cells might be of benefit.

Also, the question of whether reducing the proton motive force (ionophores etc.) might be counterproductive in 3-BP treatment.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 04:59 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 8:45 PM Jcancom wrote:

I have been reading through the recent article "The Cytotoxicity of 3-bromopyruvate in breast cancer cells depends on extracellular pH" by the Hopkins researchers et al. .

The article brings together some of the ideas we have noted on this thread. The role of MCT1, importance of the proton motive force, extracellular pH as a modifier of 3-BP effectiveness, etc.

Several posts on the thread suggested the importance of buffering 3-BP to a pH of 7.4 when administering it. I am not sure how this relates to the finding in this article that an extracellular pH of 6.0 is more effective than 7.4 for 3-BP treatment. (These might be separate issues).

The finding in this article that the cancer cell selectivity of 3-BP can be (at least in part) be attributable to MCT1 and to the pH effect described in the article is welcome news. There has been legitimate concern that 3-BP could potentially have serious side effects. This articles helps to explain and somewhat lessen these concerns.

"Due to the alkylating proerties of 3BP, it is surprising that few secondary effects have been reported to date."

Article raises the question of whether CD147 glycoslation inhibition in normal cells or over-expression in cancer cells might be of benefit.

Also, the question of whether reducing the proton motive force (ionophores etc.) might be counterproductive in 3-BP treatment.

Would you be able to tell me how to access this article?

Thanks!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:01 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 6:18 PM Jcancom wrote:

You should be careful with supplements and the possible interactions they might have with other supplements/ medications. It is still not clear (to me) how PQQ might intereact with DCA/3-BP etc. .

It might be a good idea to cut back on supplementation during treatment. Perhaps you could add some things back in to see how they would change treatment response.

(With the many off-target effects of some supplements such experimentation might be the only way to arrive at more effective treatment results. Sticking rigidly to a preset treatment plan would not allow you the opportunity to optimize.)
So you guys think i should stop the 20 mg PQQ now? I just did my first DCA IV this week. It has really helped this last 3 years but the numbness from the surgery is almost gone.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:13 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 9:01 PM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 19, 2015 6:18 PM Jcancom wrote:

You should be careful with supplements and the possible interactions they might have with other supplements/ medications. It is still not clear (to me) how PQQ might intereact with DCA/3-BP etc. .

It might be a good idea to cut back on supplementation during treatment. Perhaps you could add some things back in to see how they would change treatment response.

(With the many off-target effects of some supplements such experimentation might be the only way to arrive at more effective treatment results. Sticking rigidly to a preset treatment plan would not allow you the opportunity to optimize.)
So you guys think i should stop the 20 mg PQQ now? I just did my first DCA IV this week. It has really helped this last 3 years but the numbness from the surgery is almost gone.
With 3BP I would consider to stop but with DCA not as it may actually help DCA. But maybe others have a different oppinion?
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:15 PM
Quote | ReplyAs I remember coffeine helps DCA, so you may want to have a coffee before the IV.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:25 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 8:45 PM Jcancom wrote:

I have been reading through the recent article "The Cytotoxicity of 3-bromopyruvate in breast cancer cells depends on extracellular pH" by the Hopkins researchers et al. .

The article brings together some of the ideas we have noted on this thread. The role of MCT1, importance of the proton motive force, extracellular pH as a modifier of 3-BP effectiveness, etc.

Several posts on the thread suggested the importance of buffering 3-BP to a pH of 7.4 when administering it. I am not sure how this relates to the finding in this article that an extracellular pH of 6.0 is more effective than 7.4 for 3-BP treatment. (These might be separate issues).

The finding in this article that the cancer cell selectivity of 3-BP can be (at least in part) be attributable to MCT1 and to the pH effect described in the article is welcome news. There has been legitimate concern that 3-BP could potentially have serious side effects. This articles helps to explain and somewhat lessen these concerns.

"Due to the alkylating proerties of 3BP, it is surprising that few secondary effects have been reported to date."

Article raises the question of whether CD147 glycoslation inhibition in normal cells or over-expression in cancer cells might be of benefit.

Also, the question of whether reducing the proton motive force (ionophores etc.) might be counterproductive in 3-BP treatment.

I have to go to sleep so I wil be short in comments :)

- availability of MCTs is essential for 3BP effectivness - we need to upregulate these with e.g. butyrate, oxygen, starving, etc.;

- low extracellular pH seems to help 3BP (I dont trust 100% but I take this into account) - therefore do not inhibit proton transport - on this line a dangerous but potentailly effective strategy is to deliver 3BP with glucose.

- I would not buffer 3BP to that high pH not even for IV (maybe for nebulizer only); for oral admin has to be around 5 (based on various sources)
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:32 PM
Quote | ReplyI accessed the article through paying deepdyve. The article seemed interesing enough to pay for it.

However, I thought deepdyve allowed free unrestricted access to articles after the monthly payment. I am not sure whether this is true now and might now cancel my monthly subscription. deepdyve did not make it clear if they were actually charging for each article on top of the monthly charge. This seems wrong.

I found the idea that the proton motive force is necessary for 3-BP to be transported into the cell interesting.

The article used the ionophores (valinomycin and monesin etc. ) in 3 cancer cell lines and showed that they knocked down 3-BP uptake. [CCCP dramtically knoscked down 3-BP uptake.] . I wonder how this might relate to salinomycin cotreatment with 3-BP. This research seems to suggest that salinomycin might not make a great combination with 3-BP (though the Columbian clinic seems to be having good results using the combination. Perhaps they allow salinomycin to wash out before treating with 3-BP).
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:41 PM
Quote | ReplyWith respect to PQQ, I only wanted to point out that it is important to realize that supplements can have many potential side-effects and so you should disclose all your supplements to your doctors and possibly reduce ones that might not be needed now.

However, PQQ appears that it might be beneficial in this instance. It would be useful to think through whether it would actually help with DCA. I am still not clear whether the mitochondriogenic aspect of PQQ would help or hurt in cancer treatment.

Perhaps you could even see what happens to LDH numbers when you take PQQ with DCA treatment and when you do not take PQQ.

We will all be interested in how DCA works out for you. Keep us updated!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 05:49 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 9:32 PM Jcancom wrote:

I accessed the article through paying deepdyve. The article seemed interesing enough to pay for it.

However, I thought deepdyve allowed free unrestricted access to articles after the monthly payment. I am not sure whether this is true now and might now cancel my monthly subscription. deepdyve did not make it clear if they were actually charging for each article on top of the monthly charge. This seems wrong.

I found the idea that the proton motive force is necessary for 3-BP to be transported into the cell interesting.

The article used the ionophores (valinomycin and monesin etc. ) in 3 cancer cell lines and showed that they knocked down 3-BP uptake. [CCCP dramtically knoscked down 3-BP uptake.] . I wonder how this might relate to salinomycin cotreatment with 3-BP. This research seems to suggest that salinomycin might not make a great combination with 3-BP (though the Columbian clinic seems to be having good results using the combination. Perhaps they allow salinomycin to wash out before treating with 3-BP).
Thanks--I will check into it further then.  It does sound very interesting and well worth reading.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 06:27 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, it seems like a good read. When I searched pubmed for 3-Bromopyruvate + the Hopkins researchers names I only got about 20 hits. This is the only rticle they have published over the last year. So, this article should get you right up to minute with what the thought leaders of 3-BP research think are the important unanswered questions.

This article seems especially important as it addresses a concern that lingers for many, namely: how could a strong alkylating agent like 3-BPp actually be safe?

It is too bad that great scientists are often not great economists. The total revenue that is generated by charging $40 per article must be close to zero. Considering the elasticity of demand for these articles, they would surely generate tremedously more money if they lowered the price. Not to mention that this research has already been paid for by taxpayers.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 06:33 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 10:27 PM Jcancom wrote:

Yes, it seems like a good read. When I searched pubmed for 3-Bromopyruvate + the Hopkins researchers names I only got about 20 hits. This is the only rticle they have published over the last year. So, this article should get you right up to minute with what the thought leaders of 3-BP research think are the important unanswered questions.

This article seems especially important as it addresses a concern that lingers for many, namely: how could a strong alkylating agent like 3-BPp actually be safe?

It is too bad that great scientists are often not great economists. The total revenue that is generated by charging $40 per article must be close to zero. Considering the elasticity of demand for these articles, they would surely generate tremedously more money if they lowered the price. Not to mention that this research has already been paid for by taxpayers.
Good grief--they charge that much?  I certainly agree with your remarks about that!

In any event, I will see  somehow about reading it--as you said, the most up-to-date article--and that is important information for us to know.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 07:01 PM
Quote | ReplyYeah, thought deepdyve was a pretty good deal. $40 per month all you can eat buffet. I was not happy when I realized that they might be charging a $4 per article rental fee.

I think these file sharing sites might have just grabbed the content and showed the content holders that with better business practices they could greatly increase the revenue content owners.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 19, 2015 08:01 PM
Quote | ReplyI am reading the article "Transpoert via SLC5A8 with Subsequent Inhibition of Histone Deacetylases HDAC1 and HDAC3 Underlies the Antitumour Activity of 3-Bromopyruvate" .

"...If inhibition of DNA methylation in vivo induces re-expression of SLC5A8 in tumors, 3-bromopyruvate and DNA methylation inhibitors may synergize to improve efficacy in cancer treatment." Sounds interesting especially thesynergize part.

{One of the linked articles notes that 5-azacytidine is a DNA methylation inhibitor. There are a few FDA approved methylation inhibitors and one recently from China (I seem to remember that cytidine has been mentioned before on this thread).}

The article notes that 3-BP is transported by SLC5A8, involves a NA+ transport, DNA methylation inhibitors can lead to cancer apotosis in the presence of 3-BP, and HDAC 1 and 3 inhibition is associated with apotosis.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 09:07 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 19, 2015 9:15 PM Danielus wrote:

As I remember coffeine helps DCA, so you may want to have a coffee before the IV.
Caffeine? How much and what does it do?
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 10:32 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 1:07 AM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 19, 2015 9:15 PM Danielus wrote:

As I remember coffeine helps DCA, so you may want to have a coffee before the IV.
Caffeine? How much and what does it do?
There is a site that explains it further--do not quite remember the facts though--so here is the site:

thedcasite.com

They explain the caffeine protocol (plus a great deal more) therein.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 10:58 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 2:32 AM jetsparkle wrote:

On Apr 20, 2015 1:07 AM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 19, 2015 9:15 PM Danielus wrote:

As I remember coffeine helps DCA, so you may want to have a coffee before the IV.
Caffeine? How much and what does it do?
There is a site that explains it further--do not quite remember the facts though--so here is the site:

thedcasite.com "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com

They explain the caffeine protocol (plus a great deal more) therein.
Found this on the site. Maybe it is what you read.

Question: There is caution against combining DCA and caffeine with patients with brain cancer. Is this caution the same with patients with lung cancer that has spread to the brain?

Answer: It is our understanding the deaths were in glioblastomas patients. The deaths all appeared to be people who were already on high dose DCA (25 mg/kg plus) and then on started high caffeine. Caution is adviised. Most people cannot take much more than 10-12 mg/kg of DCA when on high caffeine.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Apr 19, 2015 11:07 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 2:58 AM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 20, 2015 2:32 AM jetsparkle wrote:

On Apr 20, 2015 1:07 AM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 19, 2015 9:15 PM Danielus wrote:

As I remember coffeine helps DCA, so you may want to have a coffee before the IV.
Caffeine? How much and what does it do?
There is a site that explains it further--do not quite remember the facts though--so here is the site:

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target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">thedcasite.com

They explain the caffeine protocol (plus a great deal more) therein.
Found this on the site. Maybe it is what you read.

Question: There is caution against combining DCA and caffeine with patients with brain cancer. Is this caution the same with patients with lung cancer that has spread to the brain?

Answer: It is our understanding the deaths were in glioblastomas patients. The deaths all appeared to be people who were already on high dose DCA (25 mg/kg plus) and then on started high caffeine. Caution is adviised. Most people cannot take much more than 10-12 mg/kg of DCA when on high caffeine.
Just went to the site to help refresh my memory.

If you open up the site, on the left-hand side of the page, you will see a list of subjects discussed.  One of them is "DCA--Caffeine Protocol."

There is a great deal more information about the usage of DCA and caffeine together--including the caution of using this combination with brain cancer.

Hope this helps!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Mon Apr 20, 2015 03:48 AM
Quote | ReplyI shared the paper mentioned by Jcancom "The cytotoxicity of 3-bromopyruvate in breast cancer cells depends on extracellular pH" on the following link:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1d0pwvaipcmdnq4/2015\_Cytotoxicity\_

Excerpt from the discussion section:

"In the present study, we show for the first time that at pH 6.0, the affinity for 3BP transport is higher than at physiological pH (i.e. pH 7.4). This fact is important for better understanding the mechanism of 3BP’s effective and rapid killing action towards cancer and perhaps important also in giving a crucial clue to understanding the absence of noticeable side effects observed in in vivo studies in normal tissues. Due to its high glycolytic phenotype, a tumour’s extracellular environment is commonly acidic, a feature that promotes 3BP’s action including its transport by MCTs through the plasma membrane of cancer cells with high affinity. We also observed that 3BPcytotoxicityis about the same at both pH 6.0 and 7.4, but with a highersensitivityat pH 6.0 (Figure 4). This suggests that higher doses of 3BP may be needed relative to those used at pH 6.0. [...] Due to the high affinity and selectivity of cancer cells for 3BP uptake, low dosages can be used, thus avoiding potential side effects and systemic treatments should be less problematic."
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Mon Apr 20, 2015 04:06 AM
Quote | ReplyYes, ipappas I also wanted to point the discussion to your link. I was wondering how these statements can be connected to the fact that some people take 3BP orally, going into a low pH environment in the stomach.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterjetsparkle

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Apr 20, 2015 06:26 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 7:48 AM ipappas wrote:

I shared the paper mentioned by Jcancom "The cytotoxicity of 3-bromopyruvate in breast cancer cells depends on extracellular pH" on the following link:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1d0pwvaipcmdnq4/2015\_Cytotoxicity\_ 3BP\_breast\_cancer\_depends\_extracellular\_pH.pdf?dl=0"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.dropbox.com/s/1d0pwvaipcmdnq4/2015\_Cytotoxicity\_  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.dropbox.com/s/1d0pwvaipcmdnq4/2015\_Cytotoxicity\_

Excerpt from the discussion section:

"In the present study, we show for the first time that at pH 6.0, the affinity for 3BP transport is higher than at physiological pH (i.e. pH 7.4). This fact is important for better understanding the mechanism of 3BP’s effective and rapid killing action towards cancer and perhaps important also in giving a crucial clue to understanding the absence of noticeable side effects observed in in vivo studies in normal tissues. Due to its high glycolytic phenotype, a tumour’s extracellular environment is commonly acidic, a feature that promotes 3BP’s action including its transport by MCTs through the plasma membrane of cancer cells with high affinity. We also observed that 3BPcytotoxicityis about the same at both pH 6.0 and 7.4, but with a highersensitivityat pH 6.0 (Figure 4). This suggests that higher doses of 3BP may be needed relative to those used at pH 6.0. [...] Due to the high affinity and selectivity of cancer cells for 3BP uptake, low dosages can be used, thus avoiding potential side effects and systemic treatments should be less problematic."
Thank you, thank you, thank you!!

I had been fretting somewhat about how to obtain this paper--could not sleep--ended up at the computer--and here it was!

Appreciate your being able to share it--and will read it thoroughly. Great to have such current information--now will await more thoughts from those much more knowledgeable than I on this message board about it, too.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Mon Apr 20, 2015 09:38 AM
Quote | ReplyIf I'm not mistaken someone mentioned that DCA should be stopped if using 3BP.  This doesn't seem to be so.

Flow cytometric evaluation of the effects of 3BP and DCA on THP-1cells a multiparameter analysis.

http://download-v2.springer.com/static/pdf/674/art%253A10.1007%252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf?token2=exp=1429537929~acl=%2Fstatic%2Fpdf%2F674%2Fart%25253A10.1007%25252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf\*~hmac=cb13ae6a9742df283c8d7c1ba79159e5efb4ac27cb93c01a368a4d6c1d3aba3f
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Mon Apr 20, 2015 10:32 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 12:01 AM Jcancom wrote:

I am reading the article "Transpoert via SLC5A8 with Subsequent Inhibition of Histone Deacetylases HDAC1 and HDAC3 Underlies the Antitumour Activity of 3-Bromopyruvate" .

"...If inhibition of DNA methylation in vivo induces re-expression of SLC5A8 in tumors, 3-bromopyruvate and DNA methylation inhibitors may synergize to improve efficacy in cancer treatment." Sounds interesting especially thesynergize part.

{One of the linked articles notes that 5-azacytidine is a DNA methylation inhibitor. There are a few FDA approved methylation inhibitors and one recently from China (I seem to remember that cytidine has been mentioned before on this thread).}

The article notes that 3-BP is transported by SLC5A8, involves a NA+ transport, DNA methylation inhibitors can lead to cancer apotosis in the presence of 3-BP, and HDAC 1 and 3 inhibition is associated with apotosis.
jcancom Maybe if you create other threads you could make a list of all the substances that seem to have value and a short summary of each. There are so many ways to do 3BP or add to it and processes affected that it could be organized.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:48 AM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 1:38 PM skaran wrote:

If I'm not mistaken someone mentioned that DCA should be stopped if using 3BP.  This doesn't seem to be so.

Flow cytometric evaluation of the effects of 3BP and DCA on THP-1cells a multiparameter analysis.

http://download-v2.springer.com/static/pdf/674/art%253A10.1007%252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf?token2=exp=1429537929~acl=%2Fstatic%2Fpdf%2F674%2Fart%25253A10.1007%25252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf\*~hmac=cb13ae6a9742df283c8d7c1ba79159e5efb4ac27cb93c01a368a4d6c1d3aba3f
skaran this is some communication i received re DCA. Your thoughts?
You want to be quite low carb - aim for 30-50 grams carbohydrate a day, and increase fat intake to add calories.  A nice website that can help you monitor carbs is myfitnesspal.com-I am emailing you an ebook on the ketogenic diet. This is the diet I followed.  It is very strict.  I thought you might find it informative.-Dr. Anderson also suggested oral DCA.  I have not looked into this, all DCA has a good chance of side effects.  Are you interested in oral DCA? If so, I will look into pricing.-He said DCA is a toxic substance - side effects of IV use at higher doses are short term neuropathy,  inability to answer questions, confusion, memory issues, feeling out of sorts.  Something to be aware of during treatment, as it would happen during the IV. Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterGenelle

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:05 PM
Quote | Reply This says blood sugar is normal during ketosis{| class="cellpadding"
Commentary invited by editors of Scientific American MindMIND Guest Blog HomeAboutContactThe Fat-Fueled Brain: Unnatural or Advantageous?

By Shelly Fan | October 1, 2013 |  7

backup is ketone bodies that the liver derives primarily from fatty acids in your diet or body fat. These ketones – β-hydroxybutyrate (BHB), acetoacetate and acetone – are released into the bloodstream, taken up by the brain and other organs, shuttled into the “energy factory” mitochondria and used up as fuel. Excess BHB and acetoacetate are excreted from urine, while acetone, due to its volatile nature, is breathed out (hence the characteristically sweet “keto breath”). Meanwhile, blood glucose remains physiologically normal due to glucose derived from certain amino acids and the breakdown of fatty acids – voila, low blood sugar avoided!
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Tue Apr 21, 2015 02:20 PM
Quote | ReplyCalorie restriction and how much fats, as a percentage of your total daily calories you are eating come into this. Dr Seyfried recommends a therapeutic water fast to lower your blood glucose levels first, then you start using the R-KD in order to force your body to use ketone bodies as a fuel. Ketone bodies and blood glucose need to be in a certain range, you need to check this daily. Getting blood glucose levels down this way shouldn't be a problem and can be done
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Tue Apr 21, 2015 02:25 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 20, 2015 8:06 AM Danielus wrote:

Yes, ipappas I also wanted to point the discussion to your link. I was wondering how these statements can be connected to the fact that some people take 3BP orally, going into a low pH environment in the stomach.I wonder if the First pass effect has any effect?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 21, 2015 03:05 PM
Quote | ReplyThat is a big question indeed. Fortunately we had a contributor here on cancer compass who was so kind to share his experience with oral 3BP. That is Jaques. He was and is taking 3BP orally with great results. However, he had to add paracetamol to that and he was also taking chemo which before 3BP administration was not effective. He is a cancer scientist and he clearly knows what he is doing. So, I gues this answers at least partially the question regarding the first pass effect?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 21, 2015 03:38 PM
Quote | ReplyYou can take HCL pills to get low stomach acid.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 21, 2015 04:01 PM
Quote | ReplyOh I see you may want a high PH. I have a water machine that makes high PH water. I am looking into seeing if Mexico sells 3BP pills.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Bananamoore on Tue Apr 21, 2015 05:19 PM
Quote | ReplyHello everyone, I have been following this thread for a few months, I am in awe of your personal initiatives and research; I havent posted before because I didnt have much to add, and I don't now, but I am writing to ask for any of your help and advice. My dad has extensive stage small cell lung cancer, we have been battling with integrative chemo/supplementation/Vit C IVs. Was going well until radiation caused bowel problems, severe constipation, he went off all meds/supplements; tried to get help from hospital, nothing, went to another, they pumped him full of narcotics and treated bowels a week later. In the meantime, it spread to his brain, they denied any further treatment and when he was discharged 2 weeks later he is now on hospice. We are still trying at home, he is on shots of GcMAF and pain is better, but his mind is definitely slipping, he is not aware of what's going on; we can see daily changes and he is losing his swallowing reflex (to my knowledge it doesn't cross BBB). My family and I are struggling whether we want to put him through another round of hospitalization for a second opinion; if we go we need to decide today; my thinking is to give him nutritional support, and get him on temozolomide for the brain mets; but would this reverse the symptoms he is having? If it works we can try 3BP and salinomycin. I've been in contact with the doctor that did this in Columbia, he wanted to try ablation and immunotherapy first but the 3bp and salinomycin would be a second option. But right now, in no condition to even eat properly. Does anyone know if salinomycin can be absorbed by the skin if rubbed on with dmso? In desperation I purchased some, but a meager amount of 25 mg. I understand there are no doctors here, but I would value your insights as much as you are willing to give them. We are reeling trying to decide whether to make peace with this reality or keep fighting. -AnnQuote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterDanielus

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Apr 21, 2015 06:00 PM
Quote | ReplyDear Bananamoore, I am very sorry to hear about your dad ... I think we should fight as ong as we can. There are always chances. Here is a very good discussion on combining various drugs and supplements with succesful outcome on brain cancer: http://www.cancercompass.com/message-board/message/all,74411

Beyond this, I think that:

- trying the combination of DMSO with Salinomycin and topical application might be a good idea, but I would take care not to go beyond doses of 200-250ug/kg and you shoudl not touch the solution. At this dose, side effects such as tremour may be expected for about 30-60min.

I am not sure if pure Salinomycin (

53003-10-4)is soluble in DMSO but the sodium salt version I know it is. Otherwise is soluble in ethanol and that would work for IV administration.

- have a look at **Perillyl Alcohol - thsi is highly relevant for brain issue and can be delivered via intranasal aerosol - there were clinical studies on that with good results**

- immunotherpahy is a very good idea indeed - as previously discussed there are great options in Germany from prof Nesullhut (if I spel it correctly) and he was working with a Dr. from New York (I guess Cheng or something like this) - so you may access that in US. If you need more details on thsi route just let me know and I will serach for the details of the Dr. in New York

- Offcourse Salinomycin and 3BP combination is a great idea but probably difficult to access at this point.

- if you go with temozolomide I woul add Disulfiram and Chloroquine to that. Have a look here as well: http://virtualtrials.com/pdf/williams2014.pdf

I hope thsi helps. I wish your dad al the best and hoep he will get well.

Kind regards
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Apr 21, 2015 06:25 PM
Quote | ReplyBest Wishes.

This extent of metastatic illness is beyond my comfort level to offer a comment. As a suggestion, though, see:

http://www.longecity.org/forum/topic/67301-alternative-cance
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Bananamoore on Tue Apr 21, 2015 08:13 PM
Quote | ReplyThank you for your replies; would you know if selenium would cross the BBB?Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterJcancom

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Apr 21, 2015 09:20 PM
Quote | ReplyI read online of someone who used sodium selenite drops intranasally for brain mets. Sodium selenite appears to helps protect normal cells during radiation and sensitize cancer cells.

I will definitely defer to the more learned thread members on this one.

The previous suggestions of  3BP and salinomycin etc. are probably what you should focus on.
Quote | Reply

# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Tue Apr 21, 2015 09:40 PM
Quote | ReplyBananamoore, I am sorry to hear about your father

Whenever cancer spreads it stays the same as the primary, so the mets are still small cell lung cancer in his case. Some have even said that cancer even evolves to spread to certain parts. Low dose cyclophosphamide may cause depletion of Tregs (a good thing) however it may have an unexpected effect of induction of myeloid-derived suppressor cells (not a good thing). Photodynamic therapy can kill malignant cells by apoptosis and/or necrosis (a double-edged sword), it can shut down the tumour microvasculature and stimulate the host immune system. The immune system needs antigens (markers) so I would say this is the best way to go, or using local hyperthermia like the thermotron rf8 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2928494  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7790260  (low dose radio has a synergistic effect) which can cause necrosis and heat shock proteins. Once this happens using immunotherapies can help (GOleic is not the same as GcMAF)

High dose IV Vit C may help. Adding oral & liposomal should help too http://www.canceraction.org.gg/system/files/Hickey-Liposomal  http://www.csom.ca/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Vitamin-C-and-  http://www.anh-europe.org/files/080807\_RealStoryOfVitaminCan  Then there is oral and IV alpha lipoic acid and IV Vit K3. Oral salvestrols http://jeffreydachmd.com/2013/06/salvestrols-for-cancer-surv  and Selenium http://www.lef.org/Magazine/2012/SS/Selenium-Protect-Against

Low Dose Naltrexone which is cheap but doesn't work for everyone and isn't a cure could help (if it does work it would have to be taken for life) http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/ldn\_and\_cancer.htm
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Tue Apr 21, 2015 09:55 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 22, 2015 1:20 AM Jcancom wrote:

I read online of someone who used sodium selenite drops intranasally for brain mets. Sodium selenite appears to helps protect normal cells during radiation and sensitize cancer cells.

I will definitely defer to the more learned thread members on this one.

The previous suggestions of  3BP and salinomycin etc. are probably what you should focus on.
From Med Hypotheses http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15694701  In this study they found it had a time and dose-dependent manner http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0887233309  and it may have  oxidizing properties (not great for healthy cells). It seems the max daily dose of any selenium (organic or not) is 1-3mg. But this needs to be under strict medical supervision. This level is potentially toxic and should not be undertaken without guidance, support and monitoring by a doctor. It equates to an intensive chemotherapy. Toxicity symptoms; hair loss, irritability, itching of skin, metallic taste, nausea, vomiting, weakness, unusual tiredness, garlic odour on sweat and/or breath and fingernail weakening. The NOAEL is 800mcg
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by skaran on Tue Apr 21, 2015 09:59 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 21, 2015 2:48 PM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 20, 2015 1:38 PM skaran wrote:

If I'm not mistaken someone mentioned that DCA should be stopped if using 3BP.  This doesn't seem to be so.

Flow cytometric evaluation of the effects of 3BP and DCA on THP-1cells a multiparameter analysis.

http://download-v2.springer.com/static/pdf/674/art%253A10.1007%252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf?token2=exp=1429537929~acl=%2Fstatic%2Fpdf%2F674%2Fart%25253A10.1007%25252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf\*~hmac=cb13ae6a9742df283c8d7c1ba79159e5efb4ac27cb93c01a368a4d6c1d3aba3f
skaran this is some communication i received re DCA. Your thoughts?
You want to be quite low carb - aim for 30-50 grams carbohydrate a day, and increase fat intake to add calories.  A nice website that can help you monitor carbs is myfitnesspal.com-I am emailing you an ebook on the ketogenic diet. This is the diet I followed.  It is very strict.  I thought you might find it informative.-Dr. Anderson also suggested oral DCA.  I have not looked into this, all DCA has a good chance of side effects.  Are you interested in oral DCA? If so, I will look into pricing.-He said DCA is a toxic substance - side effects of IV use at higher doses are short term neuropathy,  inability to answer questions, confusion, memory issues, feeling out of sorts.  Something to be aware of during treatment, as it would happen during the IV. I have been taking 6.25mg/k of DCA orally for the past 18 months along with 500 mg B1 twice a day.  I haven't had any side effect with this dose.  It doesn't even upset my stomach. I was worried that I would have issues with using it while on a R-KD but nothing has materialized. I don't understand why anyone would have high dose IV's of DCA administered when you can take it orally with metformin and get better results without indangering their life? Combined with a R-KD it seems to have given me amazing in the results.  My internist who predicted gloom and doom two years ago is now singing a different tune. About your diet suggestions I can only say that the only diet that has shown clinical results, that can raise ketones and lower glucose is Dr. Seyfreids diet.  That means 12g of carbs daily TOTAL.  It's the same daily amount no matter how much you weigh. Tonight I made a 9" kahlua cheese cake. It serves eight.  Each slice is heaven. 2.63g of carbs, 56.12g of fat.  and 5.69g of protein. It's sooo filling and rich that I can bearly finsh a slice because of the fat content.  It can be done.  Almost all the food I prepare now is a vehicle for eating fat.  I eat almost 2000 cal a day.  80% fat, 1gram of protein per kilo of body weight (for me that's 50g) and 12g of carbs.  An I use fatsecret.com , I prefer it to myfittnesspal.com .
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Apr 22, 2015 03:21 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 10, 2015 4:53 PM Danielus wrote:

Regarding 3BP IV, I have some update:

during February my wife's LDH started to grow relatively fast. Begining of March we started 3BP IV. After two infusions at 0.5mg/kg and 1mg/kg, at a distance of 3 days, LDH stopped growing remaining at the same lavel with the last measurement. After other five IVs growing from 1mg/kg to 1.5 mg/kg, at a distance between 3 days up to 7 days, the LDH declined with about 10%. Side effects are related with some pain during the IV at around 1.5mg/kg. In order to avoid pain we recentlly started to add some procaine as well which should also help the tummor perfusion. However, I need to investigate the potential interaction of 3BP with procaine. Going to higer doses we will need to add sodium bic. If anybody is aware of interaction between 3BP and procaine please let me know.
Update on the above: CT scan before and after one month treatment with 3BP (several IVs only + topical applications of 3BP with DMSO and NaBic) showing 17% decrease of lung tumor. Everything else (including all the other supplements/drugs) is well documented. Therefore, decrease in LDH corelates well with decrease of tumor size. This is to me another confirmation that 3BP is working.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Wed Apr 22, 2015 03:50 PM
Quote | ReplyBananamoore, Noscapine comes from the plants of the poppy family, without the painkilling nor addictive properties. This is primarily used for its cough-suppressing effects. It can pass the BBB and is currently being investigated as an antitumor agent in several human cancers. The half-life is short (1.5-4h) and bioavailability is low, so a little and often would be needed. It works as an anti-mitotic agent (inhibits mitosis, or cell division). Doses ranging from 1000mg per day to 4000mg per day have been used

Then there is Perillyl Alcohol which deals with the Ras subfamily of mutations. This in turn has an anti angiogenesis effect, if may cause apoptosis (programmed cell death) as well. It comes in the form of a nasal spray and side-effects are mild
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Apr 22, 2015 04:06 PM
Quote | ReplyJames, on Noscapine, would you suggest to take 1000mg spread during teh day?

Note: Noscapine at thsi dose is relatively expensive. I think a box of 100capsules of 200mg was about 250euro. Griseofulvin, an antibiotic with a similar anti-cancer mechanim as that of Noscapine could be more accessible in terms of price. Some open minded oncologs in Germany are giving 1.5g/day to their patient for years with no side effects (yet liver functions have to be followed).

Perillyl Alcohol - do you knwo more about the side effects following the intranasal delivery? Are there special delivery tools currently used? Where can you access this treatment?

And finally, I am curious what is your oppinion about Methylglyoxal. It was used in India with great results as a glyco inhibitor, there were big news around 2000 and than ... silence ...

Thanks.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Wed Apr 22, 2015 04:14 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 22, 2015 1:59 AM skaran wrote:

On Apr 21, 2015 2:48 PM Genelle wrote:

On Apr 20, 2015 1:38 PM skaran wrote:

If I'm not mistaken someone mentioned that DCA should be stopped if using 3BP.  This doesn't seem to be so.

Flow cytometric evaluation of the effects of 3BP and DCA on THP-1cells a multiparameter analysis.

http://download-v2.springer.com/static/pdf/674/art%253A10.1007%252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf?token2=exp=1429537929~acl=%2Fstatic%2Fpdf%2F674%2Fart%25253A10.1007%25252Fs10863-012-9414-7.pdf\*~hmac=cb13ae6a9742df283c8d7c1ba79159e5efb4ac27cb93c01a368a4d6c1d3aba3f
skaran this is some communication i received re DCA. Your thoughts?
You want to be quite low carb - aim for 30-50 grams carbohydrate a day, and increase fat intake to add calories.  A nice website that can help you monitor carbs is myfitnesspal.com-I am emailing you an ebook on the ketogenic diet. This is the diet I followed.  It is very strict.  I thought you might find it informative.-Dr. Anderson also suggested oral DCA.  I have not looked into this, all DCA has a good chance of side effects.  Are you interested in oral DCA? If so, I will look into pricing.-He said DCA is a toxic substance - side effects of IV use at higher doses are short term neuropathy,  inability to answer questions, confusion, memory issues, feeling out of sorts.  Something to be aware of during treatment, as it would happen during the IV. I have been taking 6.25mg/k of DCA orally for the past 18 months along with 500 mg B1 twice a day.  I haven't had any side effect with this dose.  It doesn't even upset my stomach. I was worried that I would have issues with using it while on a R-KD but nothing has materialized. I don't understand why anyone would have high dose IV's of DCA administered when you can take it orally with metformin and get better results without indangering their life? Combined with a R-KD it seems to have given me amazing in the results.  My internist who predicted gloom and doom two years ago is now singing a different tune. About your diet suggestions I can only say that the only diet that has shown clinical results, that can raise ketones and lower glucose is Dr. Seyfreids diet.  That means 12g of carbs daily TOTAL.  It's the same daily amount no matter how much you weigh. Tonight I made a 9" kahlua cheese cake. It serves eight.  Each slice is heaven. 2.63g of carbs, 56.12g of fat.  and 5.69g of protein. It's sooo filling and rich that I can bearly finsh a slice because of the fat content.  It can be done.  Almost all the food I prepare now is a vehicle for eating fat.  I eat almost 2000 cal a day.  80% fat, 1gram of protein per kilo of body weight (for me that's 50g) and 12g of carbs.  An I use fatsecret.com "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://fatsecret.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">fatsecret.com  , I prefer it to myfittnesspal.com "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://myfittnesspal.com " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">myfittnesspal.com  .
Thanks. I was plannig to start with IVs and then go to pills later. I got a book on KETO and ordered MCTs from coconut oil. The book refers to Seyfrieds.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Apr 22, 2015 04:17 PM

Quote | Reply

On Apr 22, 2015 7:21 PM Danielus wrote:

On Apr 10, 2015 4:53 PM Danielus wrote:

Regarding 3BP IV, I have some update:

during February my wife's LDH started to grow relatively fast. Begining of March we started 3BP IV. After two infusions at 0.5mg/kg and 1mg/kg, at a distance of 3 days, LDH stopped growing remaining at the same lavel with the last measurement. After other five IVs growing from 1mg/kg to 1.5 mg/kg, at a distance between 3 days up to 7 days, the LDH declined with about 10%. Side effects are related with some pain during the IV at around 1.5mg/kg. In order to avoid pain we recentlly started to add some procaine as well which should also help the tummor perfusion. However, I need to investigate the potential interaction of 3BP with procaine. Going to higer doses we will need to add sodium bic. If anybody is aware of interaction between 3BP and procaine please let me know.
Update on the above: CT scan before and after one month treatment with 3BP (several IVs only + topical applications of 3BP with DMSO and NaBic) showing 17% decrease of lung tumor. Everything else (including all the other supplements/drugs) is well documented. Therefore, decrease in LDH corelates well with decrease of tumor size. This is to me another confirmation that 3BP is working.
This is wonderful news--very happy there is  such good progress!

And thanks to you and so many others on this board for sharing  vital information about various possible treatments--much appreciated.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Apr 22, 2015 04:25 PM
Quote | ReplyThanks for your nice words, jetsparkle!
This is our purpose here: share to help
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Apr 22, 2015 05:55 PM
Quote | ReplyThis is great news!

3-BP has often been used as a last resort when patients had complex medical complications. As the clinical evidence becomes more persuasive, people can try 3-BP before the onset of such problems when a clearer glimpse of the potential of 3-BP can be observed.

Possibly paracetamol could be added (at some point) if excessive tumor burden is not a concern.

Best Wishes.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Thu Apr 23, 2015 03:16 AM
Quote | ReplyDanielus, great to hear of the good results, thanks for sharing, wish you continued progress! What type of cancer is it, lung or other with mets to lung?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Apr 23, 2015 03:41 AM
Quote | ReplyThanks. Other with mets in the lung. The primary one is gone with other alternative treatments.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Thu Apr 23, 2015 04:05 PM
Quote | ReplyDear Howard, you haven't written for a while. How are things for you?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Apr 24, 2015 02:20 PM
Quote | ReplyGood question, ipappas. I hope Howard is well - I did not like the idea of taking so much Salinomycin ...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by howardA on Sun Apr 26, 2015 09:59 AM
Quote | Replymorning  pappas and danielus  still here . been down hard for the last couple of weeks. my natropath says that maybe the combo of dca and salinomyicin pushed me over the edge , but believe it was  the salinomycin. severe leg pain , stairs a nonstarter right now , but things  are starting to come back around . was doing .330 mg three days a week with a zinc back (mwf) for about 3 weeks. it kicked my ass won't go there again. walking like i'm 90 and got hit by a mid sized bus. doing a body detox . marker #s off the chart, we'll see how it goes from here.  thanks for the concern
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 26, 2015 11:06 AM
Quote | ReplyGreat to have you back Howard!!! :)

What are your treatment plans now?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Apr 26, 2015 11:40 AM
Quote | ReplyGuys, what do you think about Methylglyoxal?

This is another glycolysis inhibitor that was used with great success on humans:

To test the efficacy of this formulation, 46 patients suffering from different types of malignancies in different stages of the disease were randomly chosen: brain –2, head and neck –2, gastrointestinal –11, lung –6, gynecological –6, breast –3, urological –4, hematological –2, prostate –2, gall bladder –1, pancreas –2, others –5. The effect of the formulation on overall survival, regression of the tumours and general well being of the patients were analyzed. The follow-up of the patients ranged from 4–56 months. The results of the study show that 18 (39%) patients had complete remission, 18 (39%) patients had partial regression and/or stable disease condition, whereas 8 (17%) patients had progressive disease. In addition to the measurable improvement of the majority of the patients there was remarkable improvement in the quality of life of nearly all the patients. There was no significant adverse side effect in almost all the patients. http://www.cancer-therapy.org/CT/v4/B/HTML/17.%20Talukdar%20

It is easy accessibe from various sources including China.

I am looking forward to read your comments on this element.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 26, 2015 03:43 PM
Quote | ReplyGreat find! It amazing this has had so little press. I know honey does not go bad in spite of the sugar in it. My Chinese doctor says you can put it on a wound if you have nothing else. So Methylglyoxa is antibacterial too.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Apr 26, 2015 04:06 PM
Quote | ReplyHoward, get better soon!

Why did you decide to go with DCA instead of 3BP? 3BP appears to be the more powerful of the two and it has been used in humans with salinomycin. When you start mixing up your own protocol you might not be able to predict the outcome.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun Apr 26, 2015 04:33 PM
Quote | ReplyI will do my 4th DCA IV Wed; it will be my 1st full dose. I think there is a small reduction in symptoms already. The diet is  hard on my system. I have tried to be too strict and I need to put a few more carbs in it. My doctors think I will be ok with 30-50 carbs and supplement with MCTs. I just did fat and meat and do not feel ok so I will add some carbs, They do a bag of nutrients and things to prevent side effects before 1 IV and a Vit C IV with the other, 2 IVs per week.
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Sun Apr 26, 2015 04:34 PM
Quote | ReplyHoward, good to hear from you, wish you a fast recovery, get better soon.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Mon Apr 27, 2015 05:16 PM
Quote | ReplyI have been looking for information on B1. I saw the following on a forum. I am looking for evidence that the fat soluable form of B1 goes to glutamine and the I saw that so I am confused. I started B1 for side effects of DCA.

found this on a forum

There has been some observations by practitioners that suggest glutamine could feed tumor growth. However, this study found that the glutamine didn't make the tumors grow on mice.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/00224804909

I've never heard of glutamine being used for neuropathy. However, as one of the amino acids found in glutathione, perhaps there is some logic in trying it. However, another way to increase glutathione is by getting your methylation cycle working. A prescription vitamin supplement called Metanx will help do that. (The ingredients in Metanx are available over-the-counter.) Metanx is used for diabetic neuropathy. Be sides increasing glutathione production, these special forms of vitamins help improve blood flow and repair nerves.

Another substance used for diabetic neuropathy is benfotiamine. Benfotiamine is an active fat soluble form of vitamin B1. (If you are diabetic or have cancer, you probably need this form rather than ordinary vitamin B1.) The neurological side effects of Xeloda (5-FU) are thought to be due to its interference with vitamin B1. However, doctors are hesitant to prescribe vitamin B1/benfotiamine because vitamin B1 is one of the nutrients required for tumor growth. If you are on Xeloda, you might want to ask your oncologist if it is okay to take benfotiamine during your recovery week, when you are not taking the Xeloda.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 02:23 PM
Quote | ReplySorry I cannot figure out how to post this article on mitochondria.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Fri May 01, 2015 03:17 PM
Quote | ReplyI had my 1st full dose IV Wed. I have very low energy the day after. I have the option of doing pills on the days I do not do IVs. Low energy is extreme and I am not sure if it is from the DCA or the Keto diet. There is a bag of nutrients and lipoic and other things to prevent side effects before 1 IV and the other IV is combined with Vit C IV. Is anyone interested in progress reports? Are there any suggestions?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri May 01, 2015 03:46 PM
Quote | ReplyHi Genelle, do you take two IV? First with nutrients and lipoic and nect one of DCA+Vit C? How much DCA is in what you call full dose?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Fri May 01, 2015 03:56 PM
Quote | ReplyThe bottle says 500mg/ml. 2 IVs per week 1st with the nutrient bag 2nd with the Vit C IV. My cncer symptoms are a little better already even though I only just had the 1st full dose. I need help figuring out if  B1 or the fat form of B1 is better. At present I am mixing them and I can feel the difference in tingling if I forget. I am also doing R lipoic orally. The ow energy may be due to loss of minerals from the diet so I am correcting that.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri May 01, 2015 04:08 PM
Quote | ReplyGenelle, it is still not clear how much DCA and Vit C you are taking. When you know just let us know. Otherwise, I recognise the low energy feeling after the DCA administration. Are you taking DCA capsules as well? is Vit C mixed with DCA? If yes, you may want to add DMSO as well if they can.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri May 01, 2015 04:18 PM
Quote | ReplyDear All, here is a great study indicating that thyroid gland status has huge impact on the cancer development. The authors succeded to obtain great results (CR and PR) after inducing hypothyroxinemia by common medication.

Medically induced euthyroid hypothyroxinemia may extend survival in compassionate need cancer patients: an observational study.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25410096 It is against what some clinics would suggest, i.e. some would suggest to increase the activity of the thyroid as they say it is connected with an active immune system ... while the study above clearly shows that active thyroid would acclualy support tumor growth ...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sat May 02, 2015 12:51 AM

Quote | Reply

On May 01, 2015 8:08 PM Danielus wrote:

Genelle, it is still not clear how much DCA and Vit C you are taking. When you know just let us know. Otherwise, I recognise the low energy feeling after the DCA administration. Are you taking DCA capsules as well? is Vit C mixed with DCA? If yes, you may want to add DMSO as well if they can.
They use 4 bottles of Vit C from the pharmacy. Each bottle says 500MG/ML and sterile 50 ml. It goes into a bag of sterile water. The DCA says each ml has .273ml equiv streile 10ml single use. Does that tell you? I am reading the empty bottle. On the front it says 500mg/ml like the DC bottle. I have both empty bottles. I am offered to take capsules and have not done so yet as today was my 2nd full bottle (dose). They do not mix the bags.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun May 03, 2015 11:35 AM
Quote | ReplyDanielus I sleep on the 2 days after the iVs. I have lots of supplements but the only ones i am taking now are lipoic and B1 and minerals. I was told that the fat form of B1 benfotiamine can become glutamine but i can find no evidence of that. After 6 years of cancer I have just about every pill you could imagine. Any suggestions about that or about benfotiamine?
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# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Sun May 03, 2015 12:27 PM
Quote | ReplyHi Genelle, thanks for sharing the details. If they give 4 bottles of 50ml of 500mg/ml Vit C per week, that means 100gr Vit C per week. The dosage of DCA was unclear.

By the way, an intereting info: a conference for researchers on metabolic targeting of cancer will soon take place in Bonston. I think it is the first time such a conference is organized and for me it signals the growing importance of these approaches. The program can be downloaded here:

http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/

J. Geschwind, PreScience Labs, has a talk entitled: "Effectively Translating From In Vitro To In Vivo & Into The Clinic?", Pedersen, Ko or Michelakis are not listed, big pharma is represented.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun May 03, 2015 12:27 PM
Quote | ReplyNew 3BP article. It mentions that fasentin (in addition to 2-deoxy-D-glucose and 3BP) inhibits glucose uptake and glycoloysis.  Wonder if there might be synergy if combined with 3BP and/or 2-deoxy.

BMC Cancer. 2015 May 1;15(1):335. [Epub ahead of print]
Transient elevation of glycolysis confers radio-resistance by facilitating DNA repair in cells.

Mol Cancer TherNovember 20087;3546

A novel inhibitor of glucose uptake sensitizes cells to FAS-induced cell death
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun May 03, 2015 12:36 PM
Quote | ReplyDear Genelle, is difficult for me to jump in with suggestions withouth knowing all the details behind. What I can do is to share with you info that you can go through and see how that can be used in your specific case. On this line, here is a very good document on the DCA administration, that will help you understand more about the theraphy: http://www.oicc.ca/uploads/dca-health-professional.pdf  It may also answer the question regarding B1.

Btw, why you are only taking lipoic and B1 and minerals and not the other supplements?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun May 03, 2015 12:49 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 03, 2015 4:27 PM ipappas wrote:

Hi Genelle, thanks for sharing the details. If they give 4 bottles of 50ml of 500mg/ml Vit C per week, that means 100gr Vit C per week. The dosage of DCA was unclear.

By the way, an intereting info: a conference for researchers on metabolic targeting of cancer will soon take place in Bonston. I think it is the first time such a conference is organized and for me it signals the growing importance of these approaches. The program can be downloaded here:

http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/ 61/2014/11/6844-Target-Cancer-Metabolism-Brochure\_v6\_Info.pdf"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/

J. Geschwind, PreScience Labs, has a talk entitled: "Effectively Translating From In Vitro To In Vivo & Into The Clinic?", Pedersen, Ko or Michelakis are not listed, big pharma is represented.
Thanks. Very interesting. At least we can check every participating company and see what is their metabolic solution ... maybe we can replicate some. Cornerstone with their alpha lipoic acid is there too.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun May 03, 2015 12:53 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 03, 2015 4:27 PM ipappas wrote:

Hi Genelle, thanks for sharing the details. If they give 4 bottles of 50ml of 500mg/ml Vit C per week, that means 100gr Vit C per week. The dosage of DCA was unclear.

By the way, an intereting info: a conference for researchers on metabolic targeting of cancer will soon take place in Bonston. I think it is the first time such a conference is organized and for me it signals the growing importance of these approaches. The program can be downloaded here:

http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/ 61/2014/11/6844-Target-Cancer-Metabolism-Brochure\_v6\_Info.pdf"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://cancermetabolism-summit.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/

J. Geschwind, PreScience Labs, has a talk entitled: "Effectively Translating From In Vitro To In Vivo & Into The Clinic?", Pedersen, Ko or Michelakis are not listed, big pharma is represented.
I would be surprised to be 100gr since you dont want to start with that from teh first IVs ...

The DCA, I guess is 2730mg/IV since 273 is probably mg and not ml.

But why not ask the doctor how much is inside?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun May 03, 2015 01:00 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 03, 2015 4:36 PM Danielus wrote:

Dear Genelle, is difficult for me to jump in with suggestions withouth knowing all the details behind. What I can do is to share with you info that you can go through and see how that can be used in your specific case. On this line, here is a very good document on the DCA administration, that will help you understand more about the theraphy: http://www.oicc.ca/uploads/dca-health-professional.pdf "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.oicc.ca/uploads/dca-health-professional.pdf " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.oicc.ca/uploads/dca-health-professional.pdf  It may also answer the question regarding B1.

Btw, why you are only taking lipoic and B1 and minerals and not the other supplements?
I throw up a lot on the Keto diet so i have not included a lot of pills.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun May 03, 2015 01:05 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 03, 2015 4:27 PM Jcancom wrote:

New 3BP article. It mentions that fasentin (in addition to 2-deoxy-D-glucose and 3BP) inhibits glucose uptake and glycoloysis.  Wonder if there might be synergy if combined with 3BP and/or 2-deoxy.

BMC Cancer. 2015 May 1;15(1):335. [Epub ahead of print]
Transient elevation of glycolysis confers radio-resistance by facilitating DNA repair in cells.

Mol Cancer TherNovember 20087;3546

A novel inhibitor of glucose uptake sensitizes cells to FAS-induced cell death
I think I have seen some articles on the sinergy of 2DG with 3BP. At least another HK inhibitor works in sinergy with 2DG: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19660769

Btw, in Germany there are private clinics administrating 2DG IV.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun May 03, 2015 01:14 PM
Quote | ReplyI thought that the clinical results for 2DG had not been that encouraging (The link for 2DG was bad).

Propanolol also can downregulate HK2.

J Nucl Med. 2014 Mar;55(3):439-45. doi: 10.2967/jnumed.113.121327. Epub 2014 Feb 6.
Propranolol inhibits glucose metabolism and 18F-FDG uptake of breast cancer through posttranscriptional downregulation of hexokinase-2.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sun May 03, 2015 01:19 PM
Quote | ReplyEach ml contains DCA ml (equivalent to 50mg) Sodium Bicarbonate USP 278.2mg and sterile waterq.s. for injection Sodium Hydroxideand/or Hydrocloric Acid may have been used to adjust PH to 6.5 to 7.5 10ml single use 500mg/ml

I have posted everything it says on the DCA bottle. Hope that makes it clear.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun May 03, 2015 01:26 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 03, 2015 5:14 PM Jcancom wrote:

I thought that the clinical results for 2DG had not been that encouraging (The link for 2DG was bad).

Propanolol also can downregulate HK2.

J Nucl Med. 2014 Mar;55(3):439-45. doi: 10.2967/jnumed.113.121327. Epub 2014 Feb 6.
Propranolol inhibits glucose metabolism and 18F-FDG uptake of breast cancer through posttranscriptional downregulation of hexokinase-2.
here is the link again. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=19660769  Indeed propanolol is an intresting one as well.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Mon May 04, 2015 02:11 PM
Quote | ReplySo I will take mitochondria support which I have and any other suggestions considering i cannot take large amounts of pills?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon May 04, 2015 09:16 PM
Quote | ReplyLet's give kathymcc a big thread welcome!

Earlier today she started the thread "Use of 3BP". Apparently she is involved with a non-US medical center interested in starting a clinical trial with 3-BP.

Anyone else interested?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon May 04, 2015 09:28 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 05, 2015 1:16 AM Jcancom wrote:

Let's give kathymcc a big thread welcome!

Earlier today she started the thread "Use of 3BP". Apparently she is involved with a non-US medical center interested in starting a clinical trial with 3-BP.

Anyone else interested?
Any type of news  about 3-BP is very much welcomed!

I was hoping that Andrew Dickens would continue to contribute to this forum, too--but, alas, I found the following on the internet and seriously wonder if he will do so.  We can only hope he will share more in the future.  We are all here to help one another as much as possible!

http://www.longecity.org/forum/topic/73453.-is-3-bromopyruva  cancer-cure

Hope I typed that correctly--not sure if there is a period after 73453.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon May 04, 2015 09:34 PM
Quote | ReplyJust double-checked the site--there is no period after the numbers--just type it without.

jc\_the\_1 is the name he is using on that forum--starts on page 6.

I hope he will  understand that even if some cannot afford to go to his clinic his scientific/medical input is appreciated anyway.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue May 05, 2015 02:15 PM
Quote | ReplyThe doctors took me off the Keto diet today. I have lost too much weight and cannot consume enough calories to stop the wieght loss. It will be interesting to see if the DCA and Metformin will help in spite of the diet.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue May 05, 2015 03:42 PM
Quote | ReplyI guess kathymcc is from Freeport Family Wellness Center  in the Bahamas. Source: http://www.cancercompass.com/message-board/message/all,67701
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue May 05, 2015 04:07 PM
Quote | ReplyAnd by reading more that she wrote,  does this mean that Dayspring is paired somehow with Dr. Pederson?

I wish we were getting more facts about the usage of 3-BP at these clinics--results, usage, dosage, overall treatment plans, etc.  It would be such a great help to all of us to be able to glean further information.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue May 05, 2015 04:44 PM
Quote | ReplyI dont think Prof. Pedersen is involved. He lets and supports Dr. Ko. he is always reffering to her and giving all the credit to her as well. (One of teh best supervisors you can have ... I think)

On the other hand, Dr. Ko may support them with advises etc. so this is a reason to trust Dayspring next to the fact that the Dr. from Dayspring is the only (out of many) that joined thsi discussion and contributed.

However, regarding the contribution, there is a limit in to that as well. We can ask them to contribute but the question is what to expect more than the contribution of Dayspring? I would like more but I can not expect more. If I woudl be them I would be very carefull as well with communication. For us, it is easy since we represent ourselfs only while they represent an institution.

However, besides the clinics I am sure there are many others who are reading the info we are sharing here, they are using it while they do not care to share back. And those are the people that we should expect to start sharing to keep thsi discusion alive and grow our knowledge. If there is no contribution from others as well, those like me will get tired to only share.

The same with Andrew, the Dr. from Dayspring. He is spending the time to discuss with us here and we start complaining about the price, etc ... instead of appreciating his contribution ...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue May 05, 2015 05:02 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 05, 2015 8:44 PM Danielus wrote:

I dont think Prof. Pedersen is involved. He lets and supports Dr. Ko. he is always reffering to her and giving all the credit to her as well. (One of teh best supervisors you can have ... I think)

On the other hand, Dr. Ko may support them with advises etc. so this is a reason to trust Dayspring next to the fact that the Dr. from Dayspring is the only (out of many) that joined thsi discussion and contributed.

However, regarding the contribution, there is a limit in to that as well. We can ask them to contribute but the question is what to expect more than the contribution of Dayspring? I would like more but I can not expect more. If I woudl be them I would be very carefull as well with communication. For us, it is easy since we represent ourselfs only while they represent an institution.

However, besides the clinics I am sure there are many others who are reading the info we are sharing here, they are using it while they do not care to share back. And those are the people that we should expect to start sharing to keep thsi discusion alive and grow our knowledge. If there is no contribution from others as well, those like me will get tired to only share.

The same with Andrew, the Dr. from Dayspring. He is spending the time to discuss with us here and we start complaining about the price, etc ... instead of appreciating his contribution ...
I am truly sorry if I offended anyone by mentioning that some cannot afford the prices at the Dayspring clinic.  I suppose I was responding somewhat to what Zhao had mentioned in some of his posts.

Andrew's scientific posts have always been appreciated.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue May 05, 2015 05:11 PM
Quote | ReplyRegarding the DCA and Metformin combination ... even if there are publications indicating the sinergy, it is still with a question mark for me since DCA needs a working mitho while Metformin is inhibiting that ...
Quote | Reply

# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

View all Alternative Treatments Discussions Post A New Discussion947 Posts | Page(s): Prev 12...77 78 79 80 81 ...9495 Next Genelle

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Tue May 05, 2015 05:22 PM
Quote | ReplyWhen I spoke to Dr Pederson a while back he was not familiar with Dayspring.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue May 05, 2015 05:39 PM
Quote | ReplyWow!!!

http://wellness4cancer.com/metablox/

Freeport has already treated 50 cancer patients. There literature mentions that a phase 2 clinical trial with Metablox is in progress!!

This is massive! Up to now we have had no clear idea about how sequential patients were responding. One problem is that it is not completely clear that Metablox is 3BP. However from the recent post on the thread "Use of 3BP" it would so. It would be very helpful if they could simply publish case histories of patients already treated.

We can start to up the volume on this thread now. The Bahamas clinic notes in their literature that tumor lysis syndrome biomarkers were present in some of their patients, though they were able to manage it. So, some of the patients they have been treating have had substantial tumor burdens.

Freeport has really stepped up for cancer patients. While they are keeping the nature of their forumlation and protocol somewhat obscure, this might be necessary for 3BP to have a future. They should be rewarded for their contribution.

Perhaps we could start a crowdfunding project in which a lottery for seriously ill cancer patients could be conducted in which the prizes were a trip to the Freeport Family Wellness Centre. Funders could contribute (and if they chose), could decline a prize in favor of a cancer patient.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue May 05, 2015 06:35 PM
Quote | ReplyMetablox on the Freeport website (Metabloc on the Use of 3BP thread) is described on the the thread "Use of 3BP" as a twin drug to 3-BP. Would be great to know what Metablox is.

Can you trademark a name (e.g. Metablox TM) without providing the formulation of the substance?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue May 05, 2015 07:02 PM
Quote | ReplyI am liking this idea about crowdfunding 3-BP for cancer patients.

Indiegogo has a charitable crowdfunding platform.

https://learn.life.indiegogo.com/how-it-works/

It would be best to have no personal contact with the money raised. (They seem to ask for a personal bank account for funds to be deposited into.) It would be best to have funds sent directly to the cancer centres. Perhaps what could be done is whichever cancer patients won the lottery would be given a voucher redeemable at any cancer centre that had demonstrated competency with 3-BP treatment. Such a lottery could help clarify which cancer centres are actually offering 3-BP treatment.

Any comments?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue May 05, 2015 10:31 PM
Quote | ReplyI have been reading the cancer quack watch websites for possible mention of 3-BP. Considering the 2 published human reports,the growing number of cancer clinics worldwide that appear to be administering it, the FDA's approval almost two years ago for a phase 1 trial, the granting by the FDA of orphan designation in two indications etc etc 3-BP appears to be above being called quack medicine.

Has anyone found claims online that 3-BP is in fact quackery?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed May 06, 2015 01:34 AM

Quote | Reply

On May 06, 2015 2:31 AM Jcancom wrote:

I have been reading the cancer quack watch websites for possible mention of 3-BP. Considering the 2 published human reports,the growing number of cancer clinics worldwide that appear to be administering it, the FDA's approval almost two years ago for a phase 1 trial, the granting by the FDA of orphan designation in two indications etc etc 3-BP appears to be above being called quack medicine.

Has anyone found claims online that 3-BP is in fact quackery?
Why discussing that when based on the science and clinical facts 3BP is clearly effective against cancer? How this would help our discussion?

Btw Jcancom, just wanted to say this: your enthusiasm is amazing and brings a very positive energy to this discussion.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed May 06, 2015 06:21 PM
Quote | ReplySeveral people on this thread distrusted 3-BP so much that they continued to recieve the same ineffective treatments right to the end. By the time they realized that they needed to try something different (e.g. 3-BP), it was too late. We believe in 3BP, though we likely constitute a claustrophic closet full of people.

Casual observers will assume that 3-BP is more quack medicine. Often, they will not have the time or energy to sort through the legitimacy of 3-BP treatment. We can make it easy for them by doing the due diligence. Readers of this thread might also wonder at some of the suggestions made on this thread, as some of these suggestions are listed on the quack cancer sites.

http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/cancer.htm

Interestingly, I have not yet found the assertion made online that 3-BP is quack medicine. This seems reassuring. Some might wonder (as sometimes I do) why 15 years after the initial research more clinical evidence has not been produced for 3-BP. If we can help provide reassurance to those who might be unsure, then some might give 3-BP a try. Things could really start to happen.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed May 06, 2015 09:57 PM
Quote | ReplyWould 3-BP be safe to be given for brain mets using a nasal route of administration? It was noted on the thread that 3-BP is not typically expected to cross the BBB.

Such a method of administration might allow lower and safer doses.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Fri May 08, 2015 12:53 AM
Quote | ReplyWell I did my DCA IVtoday. Last time I was so sick (BP too low blurry vision nausea unsteady on my feet) they took me off the Keto diet. The doctor did a urine test and there were ketones and the blood test showed HIGH GLUCOSE. Today after adding a fair amount of carbs my glucose WENT DOWN. Something about ketosis made glucose go up!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Fri May 08, 2015 06:19 PM
Quote | ReplyOne post said DA needs a working mitho. What is that?
Quote | Reply

# Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

View all Alternative Treatments Discussions Post A New Discussion947 Posts | Page(s): Prev 12...78 79 80 81 82 ...9495 Next james-peters

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Fri May 08, 2015 08:53 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 08, 2015 4:53 AM Genelle wrote:

Well I did my DCA IVtoday. Last time I was so sick (BP too low blurry vision nausea unsteady on my feet) they took me off the Keto diet. The doctor did a urine test and there were ketones and the blood test showed HIGH GLUCOSE. Today after adding a fair amount of carbs my glucose WENT DOWN. Something about ketosis made glucose go up!
If you eat too much fat and/or calories you get dyslipidemia. So your blood glucose stays high and you pee out the ketones, which means your aren't *in the zone* for it to work. Did you monitor both your ketones & blood glucose a few times daily?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Genelle on Sat May 09, 2015 01:06 AM
Quote | ReplyI ate so little I lost 8 lbs in a week
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat May 09, 2015 01:38 PM
Quote | ReplyI have not been able to understand why so many antibiotics appear effective against cancer (salinomycin etc.). These articles shed some light on the question. The clinical human results presented do not appear to be overwhelmingly favorable, though perhaps they were not designed with the correct dosing or schedule in mind to maximize effectivess.

It is quite strange that no one noticed these anticancer effects of these widely used 50 year antibiotics (assuming they are in fact effective).

Antibiotics that target mitochondria effectively eradicate cancer stem cells, across multiple tumor types: Treating cancer like an infectious disease

J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Oct 4;98(19):1375-82.
Bacteria-eradicating therapy with doxycycline in ocular adnexal MALT lymphoma: a multicenter prospective trial.

Chlamydophila Psittaci Eradication With Doxycycline As First-Line Targeted Therapy for Ocular Adnexae Lymphoma: Final Results of an International Phase II Trial
Genet Mol Res.2014 Apr 14;13(2):2796-805. doi: 10.4238/2014.April.14.8.Genet Mol Res. 2014 Apr 14;13(2):2796-805. doi: 10.4238/2014.April.14.8.Azithromycin enhances the favorable results of paclitaxel and cisplatin in patients with advanced non-small cell lung cancer.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterDanielus

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sat May 09, 2015 01:55 PM
Quote | ReplyDoxycycline effects are impressive indeed. Next to antibiotics, antifungals and anthelmintic have very strong anti-cancer activity as well. E.g. Itraconazole, Ketokonazole, Griseofulvin, Mebendazole, Albendazole, Niclosamide, etc.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat May 09, 2015 02:10 PM
Quote | ReplyI found it a real eye opener that since mitochondria are endosymbiantly derived from bacteria using antibotics would selectively attack them.

Hwoever, I am not totally sure how cancer stem cells would be targetted specifically and not just all cells. Perhaps cancer cells need to generate more of them.

Or what the rational strategy would be to combine with metabolic approaches (e.g. 3-BP and salinomycin).
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Sat May 09, 2015 02:22 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 09, 2015 5:06 AM Genelle wrote:

I ate so little I lost 8 lbs in a week
How many calories were you eating a day?Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterjames-peters

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Sat May 09, 2015 02:26 PM
Quote | ReplyOxaloacetate, an intermediate of the Krebs cycle, has been designated an orphan drug by the FDA. This nontoxic, natural compound has been shown to inhibit the growth of brain cancer (in mice) by mimicking the molecular changes induced by caloric restriction (CR) http://www.gliaxal.com/9.html  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22297683
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by james-peters on Sat May 09, 2015 02:41 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 09, 2015 5:38 PM Jcancom wrote:

I have not been able to understand why so many antibiotics appear effective against cancer (salinomycin etc.). These articles shed some light on the question. The clinical human results presented do not appear to be overwhelmingly favorable, though perhaps they were not designed with the correct dosing or schedule in mind to maximize effectivess.

It is quite strange that no one noticed these anticancer effects of these widely used 50 year antibiotics (assuming they are in fact effective).

Antibiotics that target mitochondria effectively eradicate cancer stem cells, across multiple tumor types: Treating cancer like an infectious disease

J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Oct 4;98(19):1375-82.
Bacteria-eradicating therapy with doxycycline in ocular adnexal MALT lymphoma: a multicenter prospective trial.

Chlamydophila Psittaci Eradication With Doxycycline As First-Line Targeted Therapy for Ocular Adnexae Lymphoma: Final Results of an International Phase II Trial
Genet Mol Res.2014 Apr 14;13(2):2796-805. doi: 10.4238/2014.April.14.8.Genet Mol Res. 2014 Apr 14;13(2):2796-805. doi: 10.4238/2014.April.14.8.Azithromycin enhances the favorable results of paclitaxel and cisplatin in patients with advanced non-small cell lung cancer.The down side with many off these is that they are off patent. Only a few people have been given salinomycin so far and the side-effects seem limited. The key is there therapeutic index and potential toxicities. So we need Phase I & II trial data in order to get the dose, schedule and other things sorted out.

Targeting cancer stem cells by curcumin and clinical applications  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24463298  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24851881  http://stemcellres.com/content/5/5/116  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3039120/  http://www.transonc.com/article/S1936-5233(09)80040-5/abstract and sulforaphane http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2862133/  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23902242
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat May 09, 2015 02:49 PM
Quote | ReplyYeah, I wonder if antibiotics would need to be dosed chronically to help in cancer. In some of the cited studies, peoploe were treated with the antibiotics for 3 weeks. Perhaps to be effective in cancer antibiotic treatment would be required to be longer than that.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sat May 09, 2015 03:24 PM

Quote | Reply

On May 09, 2015 6:26 PM james-peters wrote:

Oxaloacetate, an intermediate of the Krebs cycle, has been designated an orphan drug by the FDA. This nontoxic, natural compound has been shown to inhibit the growth of brain cancer (in mice) by mimicking the molecular changes induced by caloric restriction (CR) http://www.gliaxal.com/9.html "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.gliaxal.com/9.html " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.gliaxal.com/9.html  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22297683 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22297683 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22297683
Oxaloacetate seems interesting. Do you have additional relevant info on it?
Quote | Reply