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On Sep 02, 2015 1:04 PM JRW07 wrote:

I thought you guys might find this info interesting.  It is very important to further enhancing the immune response.  It has the potential to be effective on most cancer types.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht m"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht

JRW really appreciate your sharing info here.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 02, 2015 11:14 AM

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On Sep 02, 2015 3:10 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 02, 2015 1:04 PM JRW07 wrote:

I thought you guys might find this info interesting.  It is very important to further enhancing the immune response.  It has the potential to be effective on most cancer types.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" 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rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht

JRW really appreciate your sharing info here.
Wholeheartedly agree with that sentiment and appreciate the knowledge/expertise being shared.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 02, 2015 11:16 AM
Quote | ReplyGood grief--sorry I hit that "reply" button and the thoughts I expressed took half a page!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Sep 02, 2015 01:14 PM

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On Sep 02, 2015 2:25 PM lilyt wrote:

Hello dear members of the forum,

I heard about a case of undiffentiated small carcinoma with unknown origin.At "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://origin.At " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">origin.At  first there was a tumour on the side of neck but after they cut it it turned out it wasnt the primary cancer. PET scanner didnt show anything and the person is about to be MRI-ed. Its currently suspected the origin is in the lung, the cancer is agressive and the person feels worse from day to day. I am a bit worried I mentioned 3BP to those peope, though I have heard it most likely wont work on non PET visible scans. I told them so too. They will most likely give it a try though. I want to know, do you know if there would be some chance for something more effective in this case? Thank you very very much!
Hi lilyt, are you sure it is very agressive and not visible on PET?
Also, the questions is what are the financial capabilities and can he/she travel? In anycase, I will sugest a few things on my webpage. I hope this evening.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by lilyt on Wed Sep 02, 2015 02:13 PM
Quote | ReplyHi Danielus,

thats what I got as info- undefferentiated small cell carcinoma with unknown origin. The man is only 44 years old and feeeling less well every day...His relatives told me he barely speaks anymore. The chemo assigned till now def didnt do any work. Now doctor's proposal its most likely a lung cancer and there will be a new set of chemotherapy. I forwarded his relatives the info I have and his relatives connected with the German/Dutch clinic. Andrew is a great guy, I have a deep respect to him and he once again is willing to help, but even he said its best to not concentrate on 3bp only.I truly trust him and just am willing to cooperate those people in any possibilities so they can do most of the time left. I read  your page, I know there are couple of other possibilities, but not sure what else could be applicable in the case. DO you have any idea about what has best chance even when the tumour is not PET scan visible..I will follow the page for updates. Sorry for asking all those questions, but when I give someone an idea , a hope , I really want to cooperate for the best outcome. Also, the man has all his results translated in english, if that would help i could request them. Thank you for being so helpful and cooperative always. I was too late to help my grandmother, the reason I found this forum, but for me it would be just as important if the info can help any other person in their battle for life.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Wed Sep 02, 2015 02:58 PM
Quote | ReplySince PET scans measure the activity of cells, and cancer cells are GENERALLY more active than normal cell, the more aggressive growth pattern is the signal, by 'lighting up'.  Unfortunately, the cancer which is more slow growing, as is the case with most (though not all) kidney cancers, a PET is not very useful.  The first suggestion is to get a second read on the pathology of the biopsy or first bit of cancer.  Rarely can someone diagnose with only imaging, and a pathology specialist--usually at an academic center--is necessary in the case of unclassified, etc.  That can affect treatment enormously.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Sep 02, 2015 04:54 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, agree with peggy --> get a second read.

Here are some of the most effective treatments I see today: http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=324

I wrote it fast so there may be spelling errors, etc. Sorry for that. I will add others asap. I hope it helps.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:52 PM
Quote | ReplyI wonder whether sometimes 3-BP might be pushed out of the cell via MCT-4 after it entered via MCT-1? Perhaps treating first with 3-BP and then a proton pump inhibitor could stop this (if it were in fact occuring).
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 04:14 PM
Quote | ReplyAmp up salinomycin with ketoconazole? Would it be safe to increase salinomycin that much or would it be best to reduce salinomycin dosing (This might save quite a bit of money. I wonder whether there are other CYP3A4 inhibitors?)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 04:24 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, it looks like there are quite a few other CYP3A4 inhibitors.

Grapefruit seems to always pop up. People taking salinomycin should be aware of this. I am not sure how the safety of salinomcyin would change ...

"was done to check the effect of concomitant administration of Ketoconazole (KTC) on SAL pharmacokinetics. KTC, being a selective CYP3A4 inhibitor increased the systemic exposure of SAL significantly to 7-fold in AUC0-αand 3-fold increase in Cmaxof SAL in rats with concomitant KTC administration"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CYP3A4#Inhibition\_through\_frui
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 04, 2015 05:28 PM

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On Sep 04, 2015 8:14 PM Jcancom wrote:

Amp up salinomycin with ketoconazole? Would it be safe to increase salinomycin that much or would it be best to reduce salinomycin dosing (This might save quite a bit of money. I wonder whether there are other CYP3A4 inhibitors?)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole
Yes J, is relevant but I woudl simply stay away from it since I do not think is good to play with the effectivness of salinomycin at home.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 05:37 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, this is true. Salinomycin appears to be a powerful yet potentially dangerous drug if not taken correctly. However, it seems well worth noting that grapefuirt is a potent inhibitor of CYP3A4 as was noted in wiki. It is important for safety considerations to realize that there are substances that could greatly increase the availability of salinomycin.

I wonder whether the article quoted is an indication that salinomycin might soon be heading for the clinic?

And of course there are micelles to also amp up salinomycin.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26228105
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 04, 2015 05:48 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 9:28 PM Danielus wrote:

On Sep 04, 2015 8:14 PM Jcancom wrote:

Amp up salinomycin with ketoconazole? Would it be safe to increase salinomycin that much or would it be best to reduce salinomycin dosing (This might save quite a bit of money. I wonder whether there are other CYP3A4 inhibitors?)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26282489 "" 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rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketoconazole "" 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Yes J, is relevant but I woudl simply stay away from it since I do not think is good to play with the effectivness of salinomycin at home.
The most significant CYP3A4 inhibitor is abiraterone, developed by Prof. Gerry Potter.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:09 PM
Quote | ReplyInteresting Moonlitnight. I will have a look at that. Thank you.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:14 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 9:37 PM Jcancom wrote:

Yes, this is true. Salinomycin appears to be a powerful yet potentially dangerous drug if not taken correctly. However, it seems well worth noting that grapefuirt is a potent inhibitor of CYP3A4 as was noted in wiki. It is important for safety considerations to realize that there are substances that could greatly increase the availability of salinomycin.

I wonder whether the article quoted is an indication that salinomycin might soon be heading for the clinic?

And of course there are micelles to also amp up salinomycin.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26228105 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26228105 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26228105
Yes J there are several indeed and thsi is why I added the reference on my page about ketokonazole - to remember the relevance of CYP3A4 in this case.

I think the clinical trials are already going on and I also think there is quite a bit of underground treatment with Sal in some hospitals in EU, combined with chemo.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:14 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 10:09 PM Danielus wrote:

Interesting Moonlitnight. I will have a look at that. Thank you.
Daniel, Gerry Potter is a very brilliant scientist/researcher. He developed abiraterone as an advance on ketaconozole. Uni of Sheffield then London I think. Abi is also a potent CYP17 inhibitor, which is why he developed it, as it blocks the synthesis of androgens. Unfortunately, it did not work for my husband. Gerry is a very friendly fellow and great to speak to.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:15 PM
Quote | ReplyBtw J, Chitosan may be a more simple alternative to micelles. Good that you reminded.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:18 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 10:14 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 04, 2015 10:09 PM Danielus wrote:

Interesting Moonlitnight. I will have a look at that. Thank you.
Daniel, Gerry Potter is a very brilliant scientist/researcher. He developed abiraterone as an advance on ketaconozole. Uni of Sheffield then London I think. Abi is also a potent CYP17 inhibitor, which is why he developed it, as it blocks the synthesis of androgens. Unfortunately, it did not work for my husband. Gerry is a very friendly fellow and great to speak to.
Thanks again M. I am very interested in androgen inhibitors as well.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:44 PM
Quote | ReplyWow, abiraterone had an IC50 of 2nm for 17α-hydroxylase . Wonder what its IC50 would be for CYP3A4. Also be interested to know how this would change salinomycin availibility.

Ketoconazole already had a large effect on salinomycin PK: Abiraterone is the next generation of ketoconazole.

"When administered orally, ketoconazole is best absorbed at highly acidiclevels," Any relation to tumor PH?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:51 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 10:44 PM Jcancom wrote:

Wow, abiraterone had an IC50 of 2nm for 17α-hydroxylase . Wonder what its IC50 would be for CYP3A4. Also be interested to know how this would change salinomycin availibility.

Ketoconazole already had a large effect on salinomycin PK: Abiraterone is the next generation of ketoconazole.

"When administered orally, ketoconazole is best absorbed at highly acidiclevels," Any relation to tumor PH?

I don't think it has any bearing on tumour pH, J. It it just absorbed better in the GI tract in an acid environment. In other words, don't have it with baking soda. It can be a very dangerous drug, allowing much more of other drugs into the system through enhancing their metabolism (CYP3A4). Our US doc told a sad story of a patient who was doing very well on abi so he went home somewhere in Scandinavia to see relatives, then hurt his knee. Another doc have him hydrocodone and the next morning, he was found dead on his boat. We have to be very, very careful with CYP 3A4 inhibitors.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 04, 2015 06:53 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 10:51 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 04, 2015 10:44 PM Jcancom wrote:

Wow, abiraterone had an IC50 of 2nm for 17α-hydroxylase . Wonder what its IC50 would be for CYP3A4. Also be interested to know how this would change salinomycin availibility.

Ketoconazole already had a large effect on salinomycin PK: Abiraterone is the next generation of ketoconazole.

"When administered orally, ketoconazole is best absorbed at highly acidiclevels," Any relation to tumor PH?
I don't think it has any bearing on tumour pH, J. It it just absorbed better in the GI tract in an acid environment. In other words, don't have it with baking soda. It can be a very dangerous drug, allowing much more of other drugs into the system through enhancing their metabolism (CYP3A4). Our US doc told a sad story of a patient who was doing very well on abi so he went home somewhere in Scandinavia to see relatives, then hurt his knee. Another doc have him hydrocodone and the next morning, he was found dead on his boat. We have to be very, very careful with CYP 3A4 inhibitors.
I meant to type "Abi can be a very dangerous drug" there, as I was previously speaking of keto needing an acid environment. Abi is also enhanced when taken with a fat.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 07:06 PM
Quote | ReplyThere are a long list of CYP3A4 substrates, hydrocodone is one of them. One would need to be very careful if one were on abiraterone. It did seem to me likely that such a powerful inhibitor of CYP3A4 would be quite dangerous. It would be pretty much like removing your body's built in toxic filtration system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CYP3A4#Inhibition\_through\_frui
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 04, 2015 07:13 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 04, 2015 11:06 PM Jcancom wrote:

There are a long list of CYP3A4 substrates, hydrocodone is one of them. One would need to be very careful if one were on abiraterone. It did seem to me likely that such a powerful inhibitor of CYP3A4 would be quite dangerous. It would be pretty much like removing your body's built in toxic filtration system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CYP3A4#Inhibition\_through\_frui t\_ingestion"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CYP3A4#Inhibition\_through\_frui  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CYP3A4#Inhibition\_through\_frui
Yes...many drugs, if not most, use this metabolic pathway. I have a whole lot of abi sitting in my medicine cabinet. At $4,000 or so for a month, it seems like such a waste, but I guess I should take it back to the drug store for disposal.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 07:19 PM
Quote | ReplySome of what I read on the internet suggested that it might be going off patent next year. Is that true?

It only seems to have went on patent in 2011.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 08:11 PM
Quote | ReplyGood to know which CYP detoxifies 3-BP!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 04, 2015 08:27 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 05, 2015 12:11 AM Jcancom wrote:

Good to know which CYP detoxifies 3-BP!
Do we know that J?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 04, 2015 08:44 PM
Quote | ReplyNo, that was more a question?

Just wondered whether or not 3-BP was detoxified by a CYP. Might be important! If someone were taking grapefruit juice or something, things might happen.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:20 AM
Quote | ReplyThis article found that resveratrol downregulated HK2. When it was combined with sorafenib  in sorafenib-resistant HCC patients it showed benefit.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4537043/

Liposomal formulations of reserveratrol are available.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:49 AM
Quote | ReplyReading the article, I note that this is work with cell lines in the laboratory and with some mice that have been given a certain form of liver cancer, and then treated with sorafenib.  The cancer then develops resistance to the action of sorafenib, and with the particular compound--not just resveratrol--alone, there was some increase in cell death.

Not ready for prime time, but the work of researchers is always part of the hundreds of tiny foundation stones, which may eventually lead to an effective agent for certain cancers.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:52 AM
Quote | ReplyI will start the 3-BP traetment in about 20 hrs..

Can anyhone tell me if i can combine it with all my supplements ??

Ans should I take paracetamol to make the 3Bp work better?
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:54 AM
Quote | ReplyAnd what about the CBD oil I use?? I heard it does the same with drugs as grapefruit does
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:00 PM
Quote | Reply"CBD potently inhibits CYP3A4 and CYP2C19 (a liver enzyme that acts on 5-10% of drugs in current clinical use, including the anti-platelet clopidogrel (Plavix), anti-ulcer drugs such as omeprazole, anti-seizure drugs such as mephenytoin, the anti-malarial proguanil, and the anxiolytic diazepam). These liver enzymes are needed to metabolize many drugs.

CBD is well tolerated and has a large therapeutic index but this can't be said for other pharmaceuticals and any alteration of liver enzyme metabolism can put a patient at risk of toxicity from the other co-administered drug.

In 1998, various researchers showed that grapefruit juice, and grapefruit in general, is a potent inhibitor of CYP3A4, which can affect the metabolism of a variety of drugs, increasing their bioavailability. In some cases, this can lead to a fatal interaction with drugs like astemizole or terfenadine.

The effect of grapefruit juice with regard to drug absorption was originally discovered in 1989. The first published report on grapefruit drug interactions was in 1991 in the Lancet entitled "Interactions of Citrus Juices with Felodipine and Nifedipine" and was the first reported food-drug interaction clinically.

The effects of grapefruit last from 3–7 days, with the greatest effects when taken simultaneously with the drug. In addition to grapefruit, other fruits have similar effects. Noni (M. citrifolia), for example, is a dietary supplement typically consumed as a juice and also inhibits CYP3A4; pomegranate juice has this effect as well."

The best advise might be to re-consider using CBD if the prescription drug has a grapefruit warning on the label.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:04 PM
Quote | ReplyThe whole thread is pulling for you mar. Best Wishes!

On a first treatment perhaps you might just want to see what straight 3-BP does (you can always go for amplifying any response on future treatments). Sometimes adding in all sorts of cotreatments right from the start makes it uncertain what the 3-BP alone can do. Others on the thread with greater knowledge might have a different opinion. I will defer to their judgment.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:12 PM
Quote | ReplyI was also wondering about CYP3A4 with regards to 3-BP. It is not clear to me whether 3-BP is a substrate. For this reason it might be best to start off without cotreatments! 3-BP can be powerful all by itself.

The nanomolar potency of abiraterone is very scary. If this potency applied to inhibiting CYP3A4, then this could be very dangerous with a wide range of other chemicals.

From what I read on wiki it seems the body has other detoxifying pathways for some chemicals (e.g. in glycolysis, such as methyglyoxal with Glo1). Perhaps 3-BP is degraded in such a dedicated pathway as well???
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:19 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 06, 2015 3:52 PM mar60 wrote:

I will start the 3-BP traetment in about 20 hrs..

Can anyhone tell me if i can combine it with all my supplements ??

Ans should I take paracetamol to make the 3Bp work better?
Hi Mar, are u going to Bracht for the treatments?

Some of your questions may be answered here http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=184

others here http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47

and others here http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?page\_id=72
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:22 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 06, 2015 3:54 PM mar60 wrote:

And what about the CBD oil I use?? I heard it does the same with drugs as grapefruit does
Sounds like you are taking the CBD oil orally--can also be used topically.  My suggestion would be to initially just follow the protocol of the clinic so that you will see the efficacy of the 3-BP.  But I am sure the clinic can provide a better answer to your question as to what to incorporate or eliminate regarding your protocol as they are treating you.

I have not read any literature about using CBD with 3-BP.  However, I did come across an article from this site: www.portmoodyhealth.com .  Apparently they use DCA as a treatment.  They advise that if taking cannabinoids and any other CNS drugs that cause delirium, DCA must be used cautiously (start with low dosage and gradually increase).  Don't know if this would apply with the usage of 3-BP or not.

I don't know enough about CBD except I think that there can be varying  percentages of CBD and THC in the oil?   One may conclude that CBD alone may not be a problem--but THC may want to be avoided.

Just some thoughts being thrown out here--certainly no expert on this!

mar60, I am so excited and happy for you that you will soon be receiving 3-BP at this clinic!  You have my whole-hearted support and encouragement for a wonderful outcome--and I am sure all of us here on the thread wish you the same. Kindly keep us posted, if possible, too.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:44 PM
Quote | Reply"Sorafenib is the only chemotherapeutic drug that has been shown to be effective in prolonging the survival of HCC patients."

"Although the in vivo doses of resveratrol used in our study were high, resveratrol is not toxic at high doses in humans"

"Moreover, 3-bromopyruvate (3-BP), a pyruvate analog that acts as a specific glycolysis inhibitor through a different mechanism of action than 2-DG [30], also attenuated the cell proliferation inhibitory effects of resveratrol in aerobic glycolytic HCC cells"

So, 3-BP and reserveratrol seem to oppose each other. Wonder if there could be some way of timing it so that one could treat with both 3-BP and reserveratrol and have them work additively or better?

Figure 5D shows that in the mice even resveratrol alone reduced the size of the tumors.

"Mice treated with resveratrol (10 mg/kg/BW/day) or sorafenib (10 mg/kg/BW/day) alone showed a significantly smaller tumor diameter than untreated mice after 30 days of treatment (2.03 ± 0.35, 1.58 ± 0.27 vs. 2.84 ± 0.56, P = 0.026, P = 0.002, respectively" Seems like a mixup on the tumor diameters: they do not match with those shown in Figure 5D. Is the resveratrol tumor smaller (2.03, as above) or larger (as in Figure 5D) versus the sorafenib tumor?

It would now also be interesting to see what the research found for reservatrol in ccRCC, as it appears to knock down HK2.The  latest research suggested that ccRCC might be a highly glycolytic tumor type ("apparent absence of mitochondria").

The problem with quite a lot of this preclinical research is that it never makes it way into the clinic. There is no pharmaceutical company that stands to gain from spending all the money necessary to definitely determine effectiveness.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:52 PM
Quote | ReplyOne short but important point: for cancers with no or limitted mitochondria use ketogenic diet. That will be very effective. Why? The cancer cells will not be able to switch on fuels other than glucose.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 01:18 PM
Quote | ReplyIn the study that used the much more effective and safer  cyclodextrin formulation of 3-BP which apparently is what Prescience wants to move into the clinic, it was noted that hypoxia leads to the overexpression of MCT-1??

"Specifically, recent studies have established the link between hypoxia and the expression of MCT-1, which was shown to be overexpressed in hypoxic cells, thus providing a plausible explanation for the increased sensitivity of hypoxic tumor tissue towards 3-BrPA"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4300523/

versus my post "Down Regulation-- Chronic hypoxia" Wed Aug 19, 2015 09:58 PM.

Wonder which one is correct?

I read the other day that salinomycin seems to work especially well in hypoxic conditions. Perhaps this might be why a 3-BP salinomycin combo worked so well with the lung cancer patient in Colombia.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 01:21 PM
Quote | ReplyHmm, do we no of any cancers that have an "apparent absence of mitochondria"?

I believe I recall something about ccRCC fitting such conditions. Wonder whether ccRCC might be especially stressed under a ketogenic diet?
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 06, 2015 05:50 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 06, 2015 5:18 PM Jcancom wrote:

In the study that used the much more effective and safer  cyclodextrin formulation of 3-BP which apparently is what Prescience wants to move into the clinic, it was noted that hypoxia leads to the overexpression of MCT-1??

"Specifically, recent studies have established the link between hypoxia and the expression of MCT-1, which was shown to be overexpressed in hypoxic cells, thus providing a plausible explanation for the increased sensitivity of hypoxic tumor tissue towards 3-BrPA"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4300523/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4300523/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4300523/

versus my post "Down Regulation-- Chronic hypoxia" Wed Aug 19, 2015 09:58 PM.

Wonder which one is correct?

I read the other day that salinomycin seems to work especially well in hypoxic conditions. Perhaps this might be why a 3-BP salinomycin combo worked so well with the lung cancer patient in Colombia.
This is all so confusing. I thought we were supposed to be using oxygen with 3BP...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 08:39 PM
Quote | ReplyThat is what I am also confused about.

I am not sure whether it is a typo in the cylcodextrin article or is just based on specific assumptions that they are making.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 09:26 PM
Quote | ReplyAbout 2 weeks ago liposomal 3-BP was mentioned on the thread. This might be one to think about. The below article notes that this form of 3-BP can be quite a bit more effective than straight 3-BP. Surprisingly as noted above the hypoxic conditions did better with 3-BP than normoxic. The article notes that HK2 levels are higher under hypoxia which would give 3-BP a better chance at being effective.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4501223/#SD4-ijn

People on the thread have noted personal experiences making liposomal formulations. This might be something worth pursuing on the thread.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 06, 2015 09:30 PM
Quote | ReplyThat is just crazy. We have been using O2 with the 3BP at the naturopath's (until we found out they were charging $60 for it), and for 15 minutes before, during and after, at home. There just doesn't seem to be any consistency. I'd be very happy if someone would find out that acetaminophen was contraindicated as it is such an obnoxious drug.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 09:40 PM
Quote | ReplyWe should probably work with the idea that if it tastes yucky, makes one feel uncomfortable, costs quite a bit, ... is an all round drag, then it is probably good for you until we hear otherwise.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by dumbcritic on Sun Sep 06, 2015 09:48 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 02, 2015 1:55 PM Danielus wrote:

On Sep 02, 2015 1:04 PM JRW07 wrote:

I thought you guys might find this info interesting.  It is very important to further enhancing the immune response.  It has the potential to be effective on most cancer types.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht "" target="\_blank" 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rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831120316.ht
This is very interesting. It seems it could be good to combine with e.g. 3BP or Sal or anyother effective treatment. There are suggestions that alone would only stop the cancer growth. Was any of the anti-CD47 applied on humans so far? Or do we have a feeling on what would be the effective dose?
Two Anti-CD47 Phase I trials are recruiting https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02367196?term=anti+cd47&rank=4 https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02447354?term=anti+cd47&rank=2 One is active, not recruiting https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02488811?term=anti+cd47&rank=3 and one has been withdrawn https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02096770?term=anti+cd47&rank=1

There should be another 1-4 Phase I trials by the end of this year, and some more in 2016 and 2017. Also upregulation of PDL-1 may happen if a T-cell attack is caused by this. Even IDO, and T regs, and/or MDSC.

A number of cancer immunotherapies share a common weakness in that they are attacking tumor cells along a single axis of mechanism of action (think CAR-T). They have shown that early incomplete clinical responses to single-mechanism drugs are often followed by relapse, due to the emergence of resistant tumor clones http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22924051/

Also some of these new technologies rely primarily on CTL, using specific T-Cell receptors to identify and kill tumor cells. Over time, resistant tumor clones with low or absent major histocompatibility complex (MHC) expression often emerge under selective pressure by CTL http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15069585/  High mutation rates allow tumor cells to turn genes on and off at random, employing multiple evasion mechanisms, thereby allowing them to evade the CTL induced by modern immunotherapies http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9709811/  While researchers have identified the genotypic and phenotypic profiles of CTL that can generate an effective response in the patient, durable, complete responses remain rare http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21113290/  Some more info here http://www.nature.com/icb/journal/v76/n1/full/icb19982a.html  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14534734
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by dumbcritic on Sun Sep 06, 2015 09:50 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 02, 2015 2:53 PM jetsparkle wrote:

I have had the dendritic cell vaccine used on me a couple of times--but not in Europe.   However, I cannot for a certainty vouch for its efficacy since not sure how accomplished and professionally the procedure was done "south of the border".  Have valid and serious doubts about their  procedures and possible contamination.  Been there, done that...

Would think that any dendritic vaccine procedure available right now may be found in some German clinics--and would trust that as being superior for usage.

Was reading this same article last night--think dendritic vaccine very viable for cancer patients.  Believe in the U.S. they are trying to formulate various versions of it at different places (Stanford, etc.) also--but still in immature stage or in early trials.  At one time, trying to recall, read an article about it discussing  the problem of patenting such a vaccine.

Generally though, to my knowledge, the dendritic vaccine is made specifically right now from each individual's blood--not a patented vaccine procedure.

Kindly correct me on all of these thoughts, if necessary--a bit befuddled this morning!
CLBS20 (NBS20) http://www.caladrius.com/development-pipeline/clbs20/  by Caladrius is in a global Phase III for metastatic melanoma https://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT01875653  It had a median survival of five years in patients with Stage III and Stage IV. Also they are going to be looking into other type's of cancer too. Then there is DCVax-Direct http://www.nwbio.com/nw-bio-announces-data-date-dcvax-direct  and three Phase II trials should be starting soon. DC vaccines are personalized
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 06, 2015 10:00 PM
Quote | ReplySomething we should all probably tune into is that with a new formulation you might be talking about a whole new method of entry into the cell. With straight 3-BP, entry is through MCT-1. With Mito-3-BP entry was through the cell membrane.

Liposomal 3-BP might also enter through the cell membrane. MCT-1 might then no longer matter. This could make a big difference in terms of effectiveness.

Perhaps the free form of 3-BP would not be able to access the inside of the cell under certain conditions (e.g. low oxygen --> low MCT-1 expression??), while under exactly the same circumstances entry would occur with liposomal 3-BP. Under such conditions dosing with a full range of 3-BP formulations might hit the cancer cells from a whole bunch of different angles all at the same time. (Possibly preventing tumor  escape?). Hypoxic cancer cells, normoxic cancer cells, high acid cancer cells, low acid cancer cells, hard on their luck cancer cells: a whole range of cancer cells might then be within range for these different formulations of 3-BP to attack.

I would also wonder whether you might then also be able to clog up for example MCT-1 and perhaps other glucose type molecules while the liposomal 3-BP and perhaps ketones (liposomal ketones) had free entry?

Combination 3-BP formulation therapy?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by rliff on Mon Sep 07, 2015 03:14 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 06, 2015 3:54 PM mar60 wrote:

And what about the CBD oil I use?? I heard it does the same with drugs as grapefruit does
There appears to be conflicting evidence on THC & CBD oil & CYP3A4 - here are some links to cyp3a4 inhibition & induction with cannabinoids:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21356216 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21356216

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24160757

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21356216 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21356216

However, I'm still not aware of any research to suggest that 3BP is an inhibitor or inducer of CYP3A4, so not sure of the relevence of the above.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 07, 2015 12:18 PM
Quote | ReplyThe thread has made several references to immunotherapy as an anti-cancer strategy. Eosinophils  "are involved in the destruction of tumor cells"  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  Wonder if they could be upregulated through eotaxin-1?
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Caddy on Mon Sep 07, 2015 01:49 PM
Quote | ReplyAnyone heard from Mar?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 07, 2015 01:49 PM
Quote | ReplyAspirin and immunotherapy

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/09/150903131416.ht

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=348
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 07, 2015 02:07 PM
Quote | ReplyAnother HK2 approach

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150831101507.ht
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Mon Sep 07, 2015 02:22 PM
Quote | ReplyI did not get the first treatment today because  the nurse could not get the Neede  in  needle in my vains. ( I tink because of the chemo I had a few years ago).She tried it for an hr but did not succeed . .so she told me toch ask for a line (or What is it called?) In a  hospital  so we went to a hospital but  they did not want to help me..they did not know  about 3 BP and when they  called the ( litlle) clinic in Bracht/ German the Phone was not answerd...they also told me this is not a simple procedure..so I will  go back to Bracht tomorrow  and ask them to arrange an appointment in a German clinic..
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Mon Sep 07, 2015 02:28 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 07, 2015 6:22 PM mar60 wrote:

I did not get the first treatment today because  the nurse could not get the Neede  in  needle in my vains. ( I tink because of the chemo I had a few years ago).She tried it for an hr but did not succeed . .so she told me toch ask for a line (or What is it called?) In a  hospital  so we went to a hospital but  they did not want to help me..they did not know  about 3 BP and when they  called the ( litlle) clinic in Bracht/ German the Phone was not answerd...they also told me this is not a simple procedure..so I will  go back to Bracht tomorrow  and ask them to arrange an appointment in a German clinic..
Mar, that must have been very stressful. You need a PICC line or a port - probably a PICC as that requires less surgery.  Once that is in, it will be very easy for the IV to go in. No more needles. We send you our very best!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Caddy on Mon Sep 07, 2015 03:24 PM
Quote | ReplyMar,

I'm so sorry to hear this. It must have been very frsutrating - and it's also one of those times when being a small independent clinic has its disadvantages.

Stay positive. I'm sure Andre is doing his best for you - once you get the picc line in, things will be so much better.

Thinking of you.

David
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Mon Sep 07, 2015 03:28 PM
Quote | ReplyMar, I would be extremely worried to be treated in a place which cannot do a simple IV, and then to be sent to get a PICC line at a hospital which clearly does not think this in an appropriate procedure.  Also, the clinic which had sent you out for such a procedure, knowing that you are to start their treatment, and yet cannot provide a working phone number?????

If this is the quality of the care at such an important time, how can you be confident that you will get decent care--not to mention an effective treatment--when you do return.  Alarm bells and red flags are going off in my head and heart for you.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Sep 07, 2015 03:52 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 07, 2015 6:22 PM mar60 wrote:

I did not get the first treatment today because  the nurse could not get the Neede  in  needle in my vains. ( I tink because of the chemo I had a few years ago).She tried it for an hr but did not succeed . .so she told me toch ask for a line (or What is it called?) In a  hospital  so we went to a hospital but  they did not want to help me..they did not know  about 3 BP and when they  called the ( litlle) clinic in Bracht/ German the Phone was not answerd...they also told me this is not a simple procedure..so I will  go back to Bracht tomorrow  and ask them to arrange an appointment in a German clinic..
Mar60,

So sorry that you had to experience all of this--you must have been so frustrated--and felt like a pin cushion!  Years ago I experienced something similar so I know the feeling.  So many cotton balls and tapes all over the place!  And you are right in thinking that perhaps the chemo you had years ago affected your veins--making them a little more difficult to access.

Probably the hospital could not perform the necessary PICC procedure if they did not have an order from the clinic/doctor to do so.  And their being unfamiliar with 3-BP--since unconventional to them--would make them also shy away from helping.

Keep positive, be confident, and have hope--and remember that we are all cheering you on to better health and recovery.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Mon Sep 07, 2015 04:48 PM
Quote | ReplyPff. ..Very very confusing. .
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Sep 07, 2015 04:49 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 07, 2015 8:33 PM Andre-GC wrote:

Everybody!  Reading this I feel I have to give a reaction. My name is André and am the founder of the clinic in Bracht/Germany. Me myself was a lungcancer patient in januar 2010, doctors told me I had 3 months to live. Then I started treatment in Germany and 9 months later my cancer was not visible any more. For this reason I started the clinic. To help people on a non commericial base.
When we at first started treatment 3-bp we saw really great results. Later on (I know this sounds really redicilous) I noticed people who were doing oral/transdermal, were doing better than people who received infusions. After some research: protocol was not followed. No attention for other so well needed minerals etc. etc. For this reason (and several others) we (I and some good doctors) stopped in Bracht. Only remaining one guy who is not following the protocol and a new (not worked in) natural healer. Our treatments are still taking place, but no longer in Bracht. I am deeply sorry to hear this taken place. Was not aware there were coming patients to Bracht.
If anyone wants info, my email still is andre@kankerbehandelen.nl
Andre,

Thank you for providing all of this information--and explaining the current situation at Bracht.  Both very kind and conscientious of you!

Hopefully Mar60 will email you about this very soon and get things straightened out so that she can move forward in a positive way.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 07, 2015 04:54 PM
Quote | Replymar, I hope you can sort all this out.

I am so glad that the clinic didn't just jam that needle into your arm. It generally takes quite a bit of courage and integrity to say that one simply doesn't understand why something unexpected is happening and then stop to regroup. Often people would simply trudge forward no matter the risks to others merely to appear competent.

It is well worth taking a day or two and having this done properly instead of having a big complication.

Keep up your spirits!

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Mon Sep 07, 2015 05:13 PM
Quote | ReplyMar, Can you explain where you are being treated, and how that relates to the Bracht clinic?  Do you feel that there is sufficient information to make your treatment decision with confidence, and have you discussed this with an oncologist who has experience both with your disease and the suggested treatment?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Mon Sep 07, 2015 05:19 PM
Quote | ReplyNog. . .I Don't know oncologists Who know about this  treatment. .I Just spoke  to André in a private message and we will speak to each other tomorrow morning. .I feel very very confused now..Don't know What to do .André can you tell here What is wrong with the protocol in Bracht?.according to you?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Caddy on Mon Sep 07, 2015 05:21 PM
Quote | ReplyAndre,

I think it would be very helpful if you could let Mar60 know where you are treating patients. Everyone understands that 3BP is an experimental treatment. But the information shared here is supposed to guide people to the best possible centre for treatments - I had personally supported the Bracht clinic, without knowing that you were no longer involved.

Would it be possible for Mar60 to transfer to your new centre?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Sep 07, 2015 06:34 PM
Quote | Reply Thank you, Andre, once more for taking the time to explain what has occurred.  I hope all of this gets sorted out and mar60 will get the help she needs.

As you mentioned, "All about money" is the name of the game today it seems.  Just read an article on the internet about Merck's drug, Keytruda, now being made available in Britain at a discounted rate for  use in their health care system.

While I am glad those in need there there will have better access to the drug--should they seek its use--I am appalled that Merck continues to charge $150,000 per year for patients here in the U.S.

Apparently the rate of the discount is "commercially confidential"--the words used in the article.  Unbelievable.

Mar60, do not become discouraged--you must go forward and, in a way, it may have worked out to your benefit that your veins could not be accessed.  Andre will certainly do the best he can to guide you through all of this.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Mon Sep 07, 2015 06:56 PM
Quote | ReplyDear All,

Just to bring a bit more clarity:

Andre thinks 3bp works great and it helped people to stay alive and those are today in good condition.

Next, the point of Ande is that 3bp works if done well, including oxygen, limited sodium bic and peparation before administration. But he sais that latelly these rules were not respected by the doctor he was working with. Instead, that doctor was: not giving oxyge anymore, putting too much sodium bicarbonate in the 3bp solution, etc. This is why he says IV in Bracht is no longr effective. So that is not because of 3bp, just tobe clear.

furthermore, andre says  that even oral and transdermal may be enough in some cases for effectivness.

i hope this helps.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Bollie on Mon Sep 07, 2015 06:57 PM

Quote | Reply

On sep 07, 2015 10:34 jetsparkle wrote:

On Sep 07, 2015 10:10 PM Andre-GC wrote:

Just one short reaction. Started a long one, but connection failed. I / we strongly believe IV in Bracht is no longer very effective.
- you have to give oxygen during IV. Suddenly it was no longer given;
- when adding (to much) sodium bicarbonate (to bring up Ph)
to 3bp, 3bp is no longer effective;
- same for preparing. Prepare and give immediately by IV. 3bp is very instable.
Even more important we noticed safety measurements went down to a level, it became to risky (steril working)

I tried to fire the guy, but did not succeed. We work in Germany and the clinic is on the name of this german guy, because of german law.

Again, 3bp can work great. In the beginning we saw amazing outcomes.  People who were "finished" are still alive now and in very good condition. Last patients did not have any positive reaction, allthough I see everybody treated orally/transdermally reacts good. Together with more natural support.

The danger of 3bp everybody must know. You can not use just one simple bullet. And you have to help the body. Oxygen, minerals, immune stimulation etc. etc.
Then you might have a (better) chance.

I still very much regret the situation with "Mar" and feel responsible. With cancer you are depending on "doctors". "These same "doctors" often have different motivation.
Brings us back to were we started, whole economy and health services make us sick, keep us sick.
All about money.
Thank you, Andre, once more for taking the time to explain what has occurred.  I hope all of this gets sorted out and mar60 will get the help she needs.

As you mentioned, "All about money" is the name of the game today it seems.  Just read an article on the internet about Merck's drug, Keytruda, now being made available in Britain at a discounted rate for  use in their health care system.

While I am glad those in need there there will have better access to the drug--should they seek its use--I am appalled that Merck continues to charge $150,000 per year for patients here in the U.S.

Apparently the rate of the discount is "commercially confidential"--the words used in the article.  Unbelievable.

Mar60, do not become discouraged--you must go forward and, in a way, it may have worked out to your benefit that your veins could not be accessed.  Andre will certainly do the best he can to guide you through all of this.
Hi everyone,

So sweet to see all your concerns about my dear friend Mar, who ended up in a strange nightmare today. Lets hope that André can help her a.s.a.p. to receive the best protocol for 3bp and not the one in Bracht.

Thank you all again for your warm words and encouragement! She needs it XxX

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Tue Sep 08, 2015 05:00 AM
Quote | ReplyOk, so there is a transition at one of the clinics in Germany that was offering 3BP and people should be aware of that in order to set the expectations at the right level. This was/is a place not focussed on financial gain but on helping patients, and this is because Andre was focused on people. Such a model is great and unique and this is why I like so much but we, the society still have to learn how to make such a model sustainable.

Zooming out from Bracht, to 3BP, there are other places in Germany and beyond offering 3BP treatment and that is good. Yet, the prices will probably not be so accessible at Bracht.

On a more positive note, I just received an e-mail from dr. Jason Williams during the past days saying that he is now seriously looking at a new model where he woudl be able to treat patients with 3BP, Salinomycin and immunotheraphy, in Mexico, at much lower prices. He is even looking at the legal framework in which the patients can be thought how to perform own treatments at home so that they can continue those treatments and the price of such an outpatient model would be around 100-150USD/day.

Conclusion: there is a very interesting dynamics around 3BP treatments across the world and to my knowledge there will be even more in the near future. The essentials we should take from the previous discussion is that 3BP treatment has great potential on humans if done well. In the end, there is a good reason why so many important doctors around the world are seriously considering or even using 3BP as an anti cancer treatment.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Caddy on Tue Sep 08, 2015 06:04 AM
Quote | ReplyThat's a really positive, and balancing, post, Daniel. To hear that Dr Williams is looking to provide an affordable AND comprehensive care treatment is really good news.

But it's also a shame that an affordable location in Europe seems to have dissapeared with the changes at Bracht. I hope Andre takes time to learn from these experiences, and then try again. Your input has been invaluable, and it would be a great pity to lose it.

Please keep us posted on developments with Dr Williams. If there's anything to come out of this personal setback for Mar60 it's this:

1. 3BP is a very promising treatment, but it's still experimental;

2. It's also a difficult treatment to get right, due to its relative instability;

3. There are a few experts in its administration around the world, and it's vital to go to a place that is drawing upon that expertise (not rejecting it)

4. As patients we have to do everything we can to check out treatment options and centres.

But, at the end of the day, there are risks in any new procedures - it sounds as though Mar might have been lucky not to be able to get the IV line in.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Sep 08, 2015 01:32 PM
Quote | Replymar, I hope everything worked out for you.

This got so confusing, with the change in leadership at the clinic.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Sep 08, 2015 01:34 PM
Quote | ReplyThis is an interesting one using an immune approach. Article talks of this possibly inducing durable cures.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/08/150827122048.ht
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Tue Sep 08, 2015 02:37 PM
Quote | ReplyThere are many patients who have received immunotherapies, which have had lasting effect.  I am one of those.  Eleven years ago I was diagnosed with metastatic kidney cancer, had surgery to remove a 4inch/10cm tumor, but had 100s of mets in my lungs.  I was advised to enter a high dose interleukin 2 treatment regimen which required a total of 4 weeks in the hospital.  Half way through the treatment, CT scans showed that my mets were beginning to shrink.  It was, however, nearly five months after the last dose of HD IL2--which stimulates the immune system just as it might in the presence of an infection--that I was completely free of kidney cancer.

This treatment was approved for kidney cancer in 1992, and for metastatic melanoma in 1998.  This was also the basis for understanding taht the immune system can truly recognize the invasive cancer cells, erradicate them, and remember how to do so to give a lasting therapy.

Again, not used for every cancer, and approved because there was nothing else which could help those patients.  It took years to get approval, and now with carefully selected patients, up to 45% get some benefit, either with stable disease--no growth, but no shrinkage, partial response--some shrinkage and for some time, and complete response--disappearance of mets and with a durable response.

The newer immune therapies are trying to build on this, and as yet, there is still not guarantee of success for all patients, nor do these responses tend to endure.  Lots of research and careful study of all these research projects is more valuable than chasing after unproven ideas.  Wish it were easier, but it is not, sorry to say.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Tue Sep 08, 2015 05:39 PM

Quote | Reply

On aug 06, 2015 9:29 Jcancom wrote:

My point exactly. Probably why the FDA granted 3-BP orphan drug designation in pancreatic and, bile duct and liver cancer over the last year or two.

Yes there is quite a bit of heresay evidence involved. Could anyone on the thread verify Dayspring's claim on the basis of their clinical description and markers? I would tend to believe them. The comment from the patient seems to add support to the claim.

Some more heresay. In the below thread post, it was mentioned that this Stage IV pancreatic patient was the ONLY pancreatic cancer patient treated at Dayspring by the doctor talked to. That would make it 100%! There was no selection involved. Sure, it is only one patient though how many people can step up to the plate with a 1% chance and nail it? This might be why Dayspring seemed so willing to step up for the gofundme patient.

Mon Aug 03, 2015 06:09 PM
Hi all,

I am the pancreatic, 68 year old cancer patient that Dayspring is writing about.

I am on 3-BP self medicating since mid June. My intention was not to get into this forum until I felt sure that my self medication really seemed successful. I am not there yet.

My only alternative, for the moment at least, is to take the powder (Aldrich Sigma), mix it with water, ph neutralize it with sodium hydroxide and take it orally. This seems to me the least effective way of administration.

I have spent a lot of time trying to catch up reading through the forum.

However, passing around Aug 4 I found a lot of talk about my case. I therefore feel obliged to give you my whole story.

After some painful months during the autumn 2014 I was finally diagnosed with P C early December 02.

CA19-9 was 4732 and the tumor size 47x44 mms.

Pain relief was successfully administered and treatment was planned. I had 4 chemo sessions (Gemcitabin and Oxaliplatin) from early Jan to Feb 9. In parallel I had (on our own behalf, needless to say) B17 and a lot of other stuff, like beet juice, thistle milk, bromelain and trying to avoid sugar.

The chemo was successful. We (my wife and I) think it was much due to the combination of chemo and B17. Doctors were surprised. CA19-9 was 677 and tumor size 24x22 mms.

On Feb 13 we sat off to Dayspring Cancer Clinic and spent 4 weeks taking “everything” including 3-BP. I abandoned pain relievers.

To me it was a tough regimen. 3-BP was nothing compared to the taste of the green juices and some of the medications. 3-BP was first given orally and later as IVs. The treatment ended March 14.

After spending some 10 days visiting friends and returning to Sweden I had a CT-scan and CA19-9 test (March 30) that showed that the tumor size was the same as when we left for the US but CA19-9 was at 126. It was decided to not resume chemo and to have a new CA19-9 and CT-scan in 2 month. However, after 3 weeks I started to feel the same kind of pain that had haunted me last year. After a CA19-9 that showed 700, a CT-scan was done May 13, now showing a size increase of 5 mms.

Chemo was resumed May 22.

I tried to gather the things needed for 3-BP self medication, as 3-BP was the only thing I had faith in, and tried to figure out a proper dose.

I started self med in mid June and CA19-9 was falling. The decrease continued until Aug 5 (171) but has since increased slightly. The latest scan (Sept 3) showed tumor size going from 25 to 30 mms.

Late June I also enrolled in an English study that offers metmorfin (2x500 mgs/day), atorvastatin (1x80 mgs/day) and vermox/doxycyclin (1x100 mg/day, alternating monthly) so I am also taking this medication in addition to 3-BP.

After 4 chemos I once more stopped that early July.

Now with the tumor gaining size again I decided to start chemo with Gemcitabin as I read on the forum that it might work well with 3-BP.

CA19-9:

Dec 12               3235

Dec 16               4732

Jan 07                2566

Feb 09                677

Feb 16                533   Dayspring

Mar 10               202   Dayspring

Mar 30               126

May 05              700

May 22             1574

Jun 03               1571

Jun 16                922

Jul 07                  435

Jul 22                  244

Aug 05               171

Aug 21               253

Aug 31               372

CT-scans:         Tumor size

Nov 25              35 mms + probable met in liver, 10 mms

Dec 08               47x44 mms + liver met

Feb 09               24x22 mms + necrotic liver met

Mar 31              23x22 mms

May 13             25 mms

July 07               25 mms

Sep 03               30 mms + liver met 13 mms

I started my 3-BP self med at dose 1 mg/kg. I got bad diarrhea and stopped for a few days. After 2 weeks my body had adjusted and I have not had any bad side effects that I am aware of so far.

I increased the dose to 150 mgs (2,2 mgs/kg) and currently I am at 250 mgs (3,7 mgs/kg) since a couple of days. At bed time I take 1 g paracetamol, 1 teaspoon of colloidal silver and 1 tablet of vermox or doxycyclin.

At 3 am I take my daily dose of 3-BP to keep a healthy distance to food plus another 1 g of paracetamol.

The dose increase is my reaction to the fact that the tumor is growing again. Maybe this is not a wise response?

Any suggestions from you would be welcomed.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Sep 08, 2015 06:28 PM
Quote | ReplyThis is just awesome! Pretty much all the players wind up on our thread. A great big welcome to our new poster!!!

Some initial ideas:

Would TACE 3-BP make sense for the liver met?

I am not sure whether you should be taking the atorvastatin (it knocks down MCT-1 which is the door 3-BP needs to get into the cell, see url below.)

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=184?

Yeah, those green juices would probably make me sick too.

I am not sure, though if I were you at some point I might jump back on the plane to Arizona. They probably really know what they are doing.

Not sure why you aren't IVing 3-BP? You might be able to get everything all set up through your homecare or something. You have the top quality 3-BP product so I do not understand why you arent't trying it IV.

I would like some input from the thread, though liposomal IV 3-BP might make quite a bit of sense. The recipe is online and Prescience Labs is thought to be considering this formulation for their upcoming clinical trial.

Are you getting any marker response when you dose with 3-BP? In the melanoma patient it was clear that the 3-BP doses were moving the markers. I would become worried if you started to move toward no clear pattern of dose and response. Others on the thread might ask you about cotreatments such as oxygen, 2DG, etc. ?

A warm welcome new poster! We will all do our best to help you out. I will defer to those on the thread with greater 3-BP understanding.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Sep 08, 2015 06:33 PM
Quote | ReplyAlso not clear about the metformin combined with 3-BP (See url below).

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=184?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Sep 08, 2015 07:45 PM
Quote | ReplyThe oral dosing range that you are using is similar to the recommeneded IV dosing range of 1-2 mg / kg. So you are probably underdosing. The feeling with 3-BP is that once  a response has been achieved, then the response should probably continue (This was true with both the liver and melanoma patients.). We'll have to see if this is also true for you.

Might also want to consider preventative nebulizing: don't want any lung mets to get a start. What oral dosing range did Dayspring use? [As your clinical situation has possibly since then, we would need to what oral dosing would make sense for you now.]

Salinomycin might also be worth considering, though this one seems somewhat dangerous. It would be best to seek expert medical guidance for it.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by finder on Wed Sep 09, 2015 03:48 AM
Quote | Reply@Ulfgosta, Impressive story. I hope you succeed and can keep us informed about your experiences. One question: did you notice problems with your kidneys following the oral 3BP doses? Pain in the back? It is known that the kidneys always show up on PET diagrams, and therefor are likely to accumulate 3BP. Have you regular blood chemistry done, except for tumor markers? ThanksQuote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterdumbcritic

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by dumbcritic on Wed Sep 09, 2015 06:06 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 07, 2015 4:18 PM Jcancom wrote:

The thread has made several references to immunotherapy as an anti-cancer strategy. Eosinophils  "are involved in the destruction of tumor cells"  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  Wonder if they could be upregulated through eotaxin-1?
Eotaxin-1 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24604010  Eosinophils orchestrate cancer rejection by normalizing tumor vessels and enhancing infiltration of CD8(+) T cells http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25915731  http://www.nature.com/ni/journal/v16/n6/full/ni.3159.html  However Up-Regulation of PD-L1, IDO, and Tregs in the Melanoma Tumor Microenvironment Is Driven by CD8+ T Cells http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4136707/

So low dose cyclophosphamide may help http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3399042/  But there is a down side http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v133/n6/full/jid201367a.ht  as this may cause an increase of MDSC http://www.immunotherapyofcancer.org/content/pdf/2051-1426-1  MDSC (myeloid-derived suppressor cells) are immune cells that inhibit T cell proliferation and activation. In the presence of chronic inflammatory conditions or cancer, myeloid differentiation is skewed towards the expansion of MDSCs. These MDSCs infiltrate tumors and inflammation sites (COX-2 inhibitors anyone??) where they halt the immune responses by inhibiting T cells and NK (Natural Killer) cells. MDSCs also support cancer cell proliferation, progression, metastasis and survival by promoting evasion from immune attack. Clinical research has found that cancer tissues containing high numbers of MDSCs are resistant to anti-cancer therapies and associated with poor patient prognosis. So using HR1 and/or HR2 antagonists (antihistamine's) may help stop these cells
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Wed Sep 09, 2015 02:53 PM
Quote | ReplyHi Jancom,

Thanks for your heartly welcome.

I will further investigate my alternatives but Swedish regulations are much stricter than for instance German reg, so any certfied med person is risking her license by helping with alt medicin. My oncologist just refuses any talk of alts and I do understand him, but have a slight difficulty in understanding the lack of curiosity.

Also 3-BP is not heard of here. I am trying to educate some people and this thread is of course a blessing in that respect.

Also the work that Danielus is doing on Wikipedia is really fantastic and a goldmine for us all in our situation.

I am not sure what oral dose I got at Dayspring. When trying to find my way I got the same figure from D (1-2 mgs/kg and up to 20 mgs/kg in some animal studies) so I have assumed that my oral Dayspring dose was like 2 mgs/kg.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Wed Sep 09, 2015 03:34 PM

Quote | Reply

On sep 09, 2015 7:48 finder wrote:

@Ulfgosta, Impressive story. I hope you succeed and can keep us informed about your experiences. One question: did you notice problems with your kidneys following the oral 3BP doses? Pain in the back? It is known that the kidneys always show up on PET diagrams, and therefor are likely to accumulate 3BP. Have you regular blood chemistry done, except for tumor markers? ThanksHi finder,

I haven´t felt any kidney problems so far.

I have rather irregular blood work done before chemos.

There has been some discussion on CA19-9 and LDH as markers on this forum. I did an excel diagram from my lab reports to see what correlatet best to tumor size. I think my small reaserch was inconclusive. The small sample size and the fact we are dealing with biology makes it hard to conclude. You might imagine a better corr with LDH.

When disussing this issue with my doc he said that LDH might or might not be a marker. If that depends on the individual or something else I don´t know.

To get a readable diagram I had to multiply LDH and tumor size with suitable factors.

Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 09, 2015 03:59 PM
Quote | ReplyWhere is everyone from the thread? This is huge! Our new poster is a 3-BP mega star!

In terms of tumor size, I would agree with the authors of the melanoma article. Tumor size, per se, is not relevant. The important thing to focus on is the amount of metabolically active tumor.

In the melanoma article, the authors noted that 3-BP stopped active metabolism of the tumor. The last LDH reading was 12 (from a starting value of 4500). However, the last check of actual tumor size found that it was same as it had been from the start of treatment. It might take months for the body to process the destroyed tumors.

The idea is that tumor size does not correlate hardly at all with the actual amount of metabolically active cancer, while LDH (for some patients) can correlate quite well.

E.g. 2900 Aug-31 was the LDH column (muliplied by 1000)?

The melanoma patient's serum LDH was measured in U/L. What units are your readings in? I think I would try for my frequent LDH readings. It only costs $4.15. It would be well worth it. Seeing how your LDH moved with 3-BP treatment would be imporant. Perhaps you could try for LDH labs even a few times a week, if this marker were shown to be related to 3-BP response.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24636230

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Wed Sep 09, 2015 04:51 PM
Quote | ReplyI hoped my diagram would paste in too.

I make a new attempt.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 09, 2015 04:54 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 09, 2015 7:59 PM Jcancom wrote:

Where is everyone from the thread? This is huge! Our new poster is a 3-BP mega star!

In terms of tumor size, I would agree with the authors of the melanoma article. Tumor size, per se, is not relevant. The important thing to focus on is the amount of metabolically active tumor.

In the melanoma article, the authors noted that 3-BP stopped active metabolism of the tumor. The last LDH reading was 12 (from a starting value of 4500). However, the last check of actual tumor size found that it was same as it had been from the start of treatment. It might take months for the body to process the destroyed tumors.

The idea is that tumor size does not correlate hardly at all with the actual amount of metabolically active cancer, while LDH (for some patients) can correlate quite well.

E.g. 2900 Aug-31 was the LDH column (muliplied by 1000)?

The melanoma patient's serum LDH was measured in U/L. What units are your readings in? I think I would try for my frequent LDH readings. It only costs $4.15. It would be well worth it. Seeing how your LDH moved with 3-BP treatment would be imporant. Perhaps you could try for LDH labs even a few times a week, if this marker were shown to be related to 3-BP response.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24636230 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24636230 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24636230

I cannot even find the new poster's first post. This forum's layout is awfully cumbersome.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Wed Sep 09, 2015 05:34 PM
Quote | ReplyObviously it is not possible to paste images.

Below you can see my LDH readings i U/L.

Whwn I was refering to Danielus good work I misstakenly wrote Wikipedia in stead [ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ ]

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 09, 2015 05:47 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 09, 2015 9:34 PM ulfgosta wrote:

Obviously it is not possible to paste images.

Below you can see my LDH readings i U/L.

Whwn I was refering to Danielus good work I misstakenly wrote Wikipedia in stead ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">[ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ ]" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">[ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ ofhttp://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/ ]

Well these LDH numbers are most impressive. We start with home IVs tomorrow and also topical in the eves. Using 2DG (oral) as well. LDH is very very high for my husband, like 1700 or something close. Well done!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 09, 2015 06:13 PM
Quote | ReplyIf you like you could post any images to the 3-BP wikia. The only tricky bit is that you might have to resave the file in another format (giff etc) to upload it.

Was the August 31 LDH reading 48.4? I did not know that they reported these labs to 1 decimal place. LDH does not seem to be tracking what is happening to the tumor at all. CA-19-9 might be better.

I asked about this before and I am still interested. What typical life expectancy would someone have  CA19-9 readings of about 3000? Dayspring on their website considered the overall clinical picture to suggest  "Very poor short term prognosis". Interestingly Dayspring focused there attention more on the CA19-9 numbers.

http://www.dayspringcancerclinic.com/3bp-cases/

From the melanoma patient. This is the IV dosage range. Wonder what the oral range is?

"Based on the reference 3BP dosage range in humans (2–3.5 mg/kg body weight) reported recently..., the patient received 3BP at a dose of 1 mg/kg, added to 500 mL of glucose (5%), by slow-drip intravenous infusion over 2 h"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4110469/

http://3bromopyruvate.wikia.com/wiki/Special:NewFiles

Was the LDH
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by finder on Wed Sep 09, 2015 07:06 PM
Quote | Reply@Jcancom, Tumor size on a CT or MRI is not the parameter to go by. Treatment with 3-BP turns a lot of tumor cells necrotic, and they will be encapsulated by the surrounding tissue. In a CT or MRI scan, their size seems to be about the same. Their constituency will be different. With MRI, under different settings, one could see the changes, but these images are seldomly made. I wil try to find the required parameters for these images. As for blood chemistry, I would suggest to read the published case report in order to prevent complications. Ammonia seems to be a problem in relation to a succesful 3-BP treatment.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twittermar60

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Thu Sep 10, 2015 02:51 AM
Quote | ReplyOkay this is Mar..I had a meeting with André  a few days ago and hè told me about What is wrong in the clinic in Bracht. .I also talked  to Klaus and  Marion from the clinic in Bracht..they were surprised to hear that André and the dr  started  another clinic and were treating patiënts again with 3Bp...while I was there I met the mother of a young patiënt. ..this patiënt started in Juin (I think)..so I spoke to this mother via Facebook later and she told me lots of things went wrong in Bracht. .so we both decided  to switch over to Heerlen..to the New clinic  from André and the German dr..I will go there on wednesday  to start the oral and transdermal 3-Bp. ..I hope it will have the same effect as the infusions and I also  hope Klaus will change  the things that went wrong..
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 03:23 AM
Quote | ReplyI want to bring forward for the thread's consideration and input the potential role of somatic genetic mutations in selecting cancer treatments. I am not sure whether this applies. If it does not I would welcome someone to post and enlighten me.

This idea occured to me as I was looking throgh an exome file of a family member. While going through the file I noticed that there was a variant in the GlO1 gene. rs4746 a fairly common SNP.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/projects/SNP/snp\_ref.cgi?rs=4746

http://www.omim.org/entry/138750?search=138750%20209850&

From OMIM "There was a 12-fold increase of the GLO1 transcript in colon carcinoma tissue compared to normal colon tissue from the same patient, and the authors concluded that GLO1 gene expression was induced in colon carcinoma."

For rs4746, "has reduced functional activity. ... suggested that a reduction in GLO1 enzyme activity could result in the accumulation of methylglyoxal, which may be toxic to the developing brain. The data suggested that homozygosity for the glu111 allele is a predisposing factor in the development of autism."

I found it interesting that the biochemistry of our family member might result in a higher risk of autism, while also might confer an advantage for methylglyoxal treatment if it were needed.

At the very least it might be helpful to be aware of this fact if MG treatment were to be considered. The comments on the thread have been one size fits all: having the exome file could allow a personalized approach.

I also checked for SLC16A1 variants. This is gene that codes for MCT-1. A study found that MCT-1 is the primary determinant of 3-BP treatment successs.  1 variant had an MAF of less than 0.001. There was also a missense mutation. It is not entirely clear what these variants imply, though they do raise provocative questions.

Our family member also might have a variant in the mitochondria ND2 gene. NADH DEHYDROGENASE, SUBUNIT 2 is almost at the center of the cellular respiration process in mitochondria.

http://www.omim.org/entry/516001

Several other variants also caught my eye. One that predisposes to biotinidase deficiency which apparently can result in multiple carboxylase deficiency and ketoacidosis.

Another rare variant that can lead to glycine encephalopathy (nonketotic hyperglycinemia).

"identified a key role for serine and glycine metabolism in the survival of brain cancer cells within the ischemic zones of gliomas. ...as the excess glycine not metabolized by GLDC can be converted to the toxic molecules aminoacetone and methylglyoxal."

http://www.omim.org/entry/238300#0004

It was surprising how many at least reasonably plausible hits turned up with no great effort. Perhaps using such knowledge a personalized treatment plan could be developed for patients. It might be able to take advantage of individual differences that are present in people's biochemistry. Further it might help explain why some people respond to certain treatments while others do not.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:39 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 10, 2015 6:51 AM mar60 wrote:

Okay this is Mar..I had a meeting with André  a few days ago and hè told me about What is wrong in the clinic in Bracht. .I also talked  to Klaus and  Marion from the clinic in Bracht..they were surprised to hear that André and the dr  started  another clinic and were treating patiënts again with 3Bp...while I was there I met the mother of a young patiënt. ..this patiënt started in Juin (I think)..so I spoke to this mother via Facebook later and she told me lots of things went wrong in Bracht. .so we both decided  to switch over to Heerlen..to the New clinic  from André and the German dr..I will go there on wednesday  to start the oral and transdermal 3-Bp. ..I hope it will have the same effect as the infusions and I also  hope Klaus will change  the things that went wrong..
Thank you, Mar, for providing all of this information.  I am so happy that this has been straightened out for you and that now you can move forward with the appropriate care you deserve to have!

I know this all must have been confusing and exhausting for you--but better to have learned this now rather than later.

I can fully understand your anxiety--and perhaps the loss of confidence--that has occurred.  Happened to me with a Mexican clinic--lots of promises and hopes--then they did not appropriate follow through with my care.  Left me floundering. Unconscionable and unethical.  We do not need to experience these things as seriously ill patients--but sometimes it will happen--as we cannot control the bad actions of other people.

But I feel that Andre is leading you on the correct path--and he is to be commended for his integrity and honesty throughout all of this.

Very best to you, Mar--and kindly keep us posted as to how you are faring.  And always remember there are others who care about your welfare and hope for your recovery!
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Thu Sep 10, 2015 11:02 AM
Quote | ReplyJancon: "Was the August 31 LDH reading 48.4? I did not know that they reported these labs to 1 decimal place."

I just converted from "European" unit to U/L. You multiply by 16,7. I did not skip the decimal which perhaps is normal practise.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 11:35 AM
Quote | ReplyI am still not sure about this LDH number.

The normal LDH range for adults is 122-222 U/L.

It is difficult for me to believe given your cancer burden that your LDH could be in the normal range. If you truly have such low lactate numbers perhaps there could be some one of exploiting this to your advantage (so perhaps your cancer might be especially vulnerable to ketosis etc.).

http://www.mayomedicallaboratories.com/test-catalog/Clinical+and+Interpretive/8344

Have you considered nebulizing 3-BP? This might be one way to up effectiveness?

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 11:42 AM
Quote | Replymar, this must be very difficult for you. 3-BP is an emerging therapy, so it is in a state of flux. Yet, it makes life more difficult for you while you are coping with your illness.

The whole thread will be happy when you can find a path to 3-BP treatment and move back to wellness.

We're all pulling for you!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Thu Sep 10, 2015 01:08 PM
Quote | ReplyJancom, you are absulotely right.

My misstake. I apologise.

Here is the correct conversion (I hope):

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 10, 2015 01:33 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 10, 2015 6:51 AM mar60 wrote:

Okay this is Mar..I had a meeting with André  a few days ago and hè told me about What is wrong in the clinic in Bracht. .I also talked  to Klaus and  Marion from the clinic in Bracht..they were surprised to hear that André and the dr  started  another clinic and were treating patiënts again with 3Bp...while I was there I met the mother of a young patiënt. ..this patiënt started in Juin (I think)..so I spoke to this mother via Facebook later and she told me lots of things went wrong in Bracht. .so we both decided  to switch over to Heerlen..to the New clinic  from André and the German dr..I will go there on wednesday  to start the oral and transdermal 3-Bp. ..I hope it will have the same effect as the infusions and I also  hope Klaus will change  the things that went wrong..
Mar, thank you for this info. Very interesting to me as my guy has severe cachexia and gets up in the morning very hungry (he is on an appetite enhancer). So we cannot do the IV before his blood sugar rises as a result of eating. I can do both the topical and oral though. He has vomited in the past after oral but I'll get him to sip it slowly. We also have to add 2DG into the picture.

We are both wishing you the very best with your treatment, keeping it all crossed, including eyes, and adding our own positive thoughts to your healing.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 01:33 PM
Quote | ReplyI am still not sure whether these numbers are correct.The  lastest LDH reading is within the normal range! I do not know whether this makes sense. It is so critically important to have a marker that can be used to determine whether treatment is succeeding or not.

Could you ask Dayspring to give you the labs they did while you were with them? They probably did frequent labs, possibly daily. It would be great to know which markers where related to 3-BP treatment success.

With the labs you have provided it is not clear whether things are getting worse (as from the CA19-9 marker) or better (as from the LDH).

I think it would be a very good idea to try to go to a 3-BP clinic (possibly one in Germany or the USA) monthly for maintenance treatments. This is what the liver patient did and his cancer retreated over one year of 1 treatment monthly. This would not need to be overly expensive. Perhaps you should start with a week of treatment per month for a month or two, and then when the 3-BP pushes back the cancer you could move back to 1 day per month.

You really need to aggressively push back the illness while it is in a weakened position. Don't slack back because things seem to be going well. I am sure others on the thread can help to encourage you to get the treatment you need to keep you well. We're your support group! Stay well.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 01:35 PM
Quote | ReplyAnyone considered sublingual 3-BP?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 10, 2015 01:39 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 10, 2015 5:35 PM Jcancom wrote:

Anyone considered sublingual 3-BP?
Well yes...how to do though?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Thu Sep 10, 2015 02:06 PM
Quote | ReplyMar, Can you tell this group more about your cancer, its stage and so on, and the type of treatments that were recommended.  It would seem that you were not helped by the traditional medications and looking for something else, thus search out the 3Bp, despite the limited information and lack of medical studies.

The reality is that not all medical doctors and/or specialists can handle all cancers properly, and that even the very best will disagree on treatment options.  Also, many will agree that one treatment is the best, but the patient does not respond.  Even in the newest medications, some will responds, and others not, and even after a response, the cancer can work around the medication and begin to grow again.That  uncertainty is a sad reality, but understanding all the treatments and their records is the best way to find something effective.

wishing you the best, PeggyRCC
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 02:37 PM
Quote | ReplyI think the 3-BP patents mentioned sublingual as a possible route of treatment.

Wonder if it could be easy as putting it under your tongue? Possibly after neutralizing pH. Might need to be careful with dosing as this might be an oral route that could actually have direct access to the bloodstream.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 10, 2015 03:05 PM
Quote | ReplyI wouldn't want to try that myself. I thought that sublingual required micronization or some such thing.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 03:50 PM
Quote | Replyulgosta, could you give us a little background on your 3-BP treatment journey? Your treatment in February at Dayspring was not long after they started 3-BP treatment. How did you hear about 3-BP? What internet resources helped guide your 3-BP treatment choice?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Sep 10, 2015 04:25 PM
Quote | ReplyDear ulfgosta,

Thank you for sharing with us you experience and for the nice words about the website. I added in Excel the data you shared and what I can conclude from that (if there is no shift in data due to paste error) is that you do have a clear response from the Chemo sessions. Specifically, based on my knowledge, during effective treatments, markers and/or LDH may/will grow. But if after that treatment the levels start to decline to a level below the initial one, that is a sign of effectiveness and this is the case for both of the chemos. As a result, it is difficult to conclude if the 3BP is effective based on these numbers, but you know better and if you feel it helps its enough.

Possibly that everything you do in parallel is helping this response you have to chemo which is very good. Specifically, the metformin + mebendazole + atorvastatin seem to slow down the growth if I look at the numbers.

Not clear to me if you did a PET scan? Maybe you mentioned that already.

Regarding what you are doing in parallel here is what I think:
- Indeed, atovastatin is not suitable with 3BP as J mentioned earlier.
- Mebendazole dose is very low if you are taking 100mg/day only. I know people taking much more than that with no toxicity, e.g. 1g/day.

What I suggest in addition to that is
- Celecoxib 400mg/day. Start with 100-200mg/day with food.
- LDN 4.5mg/day may help as well.
- octreotide - given to pancreatic cancer patients at german clinics to slow down or stop the growth

More serious than that, I suggest Diflunisal and or Salinomycin.

Besides, you may want to read the following:

**Dipyridamole**http://cancerx.wordpress.com/2008/11/10/dipyridamole-for-can

**Chloroquine**http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3545437/

Biological Approaches to Therapy of Pancreatic [Cancerhttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2882228/ Cancerhttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2882228/ ]

A triple combination of **atorvastatin**, **celecoxib** and tipifarnib strongly inhibits pancreatic cancer cells and xenograft pancreatic [tumorshttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24647860 tumorshttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24647860 ]

**Celecoxib** and **GABA** cooperatively prevent the progression of pancreatic cancer in vitro and in xenograft models of stress-free and stress-exposed mice.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22916251

**Paricalcitol**: Does Vitamin D fight pancreatic cancer?http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/sep/25/pancreatic-cancer

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Sep 10, 2015 04:29 PM
Quote | ReplyAn Indian patient doing TACE with 3BP in the liver in India and with a 60% reduction of activity after 3 administrations http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-101
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 04:53 PM
Quote | ReplyWow, this is huge news! If India is onboard, then this train might really be ready to leave the station!

Would be great if there were some Indian urls that discussed 3-BP. The poster's relative might not be the only patient treated there! We had an Indian doctor interested in treating with 3-BP. India might be the perfect financial-regulatory-social context to roll out 3-BP. With the sort of scale possible in India, India might become the global leader in 3-BP treatment. They could quickly become highly expert 3-BP providers and a world wide rush to India of medical tourists might ensue. Very exciting.

We had an Indian doctor interested in treating with 3-BP. Wonder if that doctor is the one who treated the poster?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Sep 10, 2015 05:06 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 09, 2015 7:48 AM finder wrote:

@Ulfgosta, Impressive story. I hope you succeed and can keep us informed about your experiences. One question: did you notice problems with your kidneys following the oral 3BP doses? Pain in the back? It is known that the kidneys always show up on PET diagrams, and therefor are likely to accumulate 3BP. Have you regular blood chemistry done, except for tumor markers? ThanksBased on my experience there ar no issues with that finder.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Sep 10, 2015 05:13 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 09, 2015 10:06 AM dumbcritic wrote:

On Sep 07, 2015 4:18 PM Jcancom wrote:

The thread has made several references to immunotherapy as an anti-cancer strategy. Eosinophils  "are involved in the destruction of tumor cells"  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granulocyte  Wonder if they could be upregulated through eotaxin-1?
Eotaxin-1 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24604010 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24604010 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24604010  Eosinophils orchestrate cancer rejection by normalizing tumor vessels and enhancing infiltration of CD8(+) T cells http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25915731 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25915731 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25915731  http://www.nature.com/ni/journal/v16/n6/full/ni.3159.html "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/ni/journal/v16/n6/full/ni.3159.html " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/ni/journal/v16/n6/full/ni.3159.html  However Up-Regulation of PD-L1, IDO, and Tregs in the Melanoma Tumor Microenvironment Is Driven by CD8+ T Cells http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4136707/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4136707/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4136707/

So low dose cyclophosphamide may help http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3399042/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3399042/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3399042/  But there is a down side http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v133/n6/full/jid201367a.ht ml"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v133/n6/full/jid201367a.ht  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v133/n6/full/jid201367a.ht  as this may cause an increase of MDSC http://www.immunotherapyofcancer.org/content/pdf/2051-1426-1 -10.pdf"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.immunotherapyofcancer.org/content/pdf/2051-1426-1  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.immunotherapyofcancer.org/content/pdf/2051-1426-1  MDSC (myeloid-derived suppressor cells) are immune cells that inhibit T cell proliferation and activation. In the presence of chronic inflammatory conditions or cancer, myeloid differentiation is skewed towards the expansion of MDSCs. These MDSCs infiltrate tumors and inflammation sites (COX-2 inhibitors anyone??) where they halt the immune responses by inhibiting T cells and NK (Natural Killer) cells. MDSCs also support cancer cell proliferation, progression, metastasis and survival by promoting evasion from immune attack. Clinical research has found that cancer tissues containing high numbers of MDSCs are resistant to anti-cancer therapies and associated with poor patient prognosis. So using HR1 and/or HR2 antagonists (antihistamine's) may help stop these cells
Very helpful post! What is your oppinion regarding cyclophosphamide?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Thu Sep 10, 2015 07:51 PM
Quote | ReplyI don't know if the use of this treatment by one doctor on his patient(s) is indicative of India as a whole supporting this treatment.

Where is the basic and foundational evidence for this, with what cancers, what stage of cancer, what co-morbidities, what side effects, etc, etc  In this last thread there are discussions--all raising extremely important questions yet to be answer.  What is the delivery system, does it get digested in the gut, why one time a transdermal dose, the next a sublinqual, etc etc?

Not worthy of the excitement at this time.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 10, 2015 08:23 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 10, 2015 11:51 PM peggyznd wrote:

I don't know if the use of this treatment by one doctor on his patient(s) is indicative of India as a whole supporting this treatment.

Where is the basic and foundational evidence for this, with what cancers, what stage of cancer, what co-morbidities, what side effects, etc, etc  In this last thread there are discussions--all raising extremely important questions yet to be answer.  What is the delivery system, does it get digested in the gut, why one time a transdermal dose, the next a sublinqual, etc etc?

Not worthy of the excitement at this time.
Yes, there is much to be learned, discussed, found out...and you certainly have a right to your own opinion.

But, then again, much good feedback that some have been helped with 3-BP and supportive treatments.   Those especially who have sought conventional treatments previously and no longer may have options in that arena.  Or who have been scarred --and perhaps further harmed--by  some of the inept treatments that can be offered through conventional means.

So, personally, I will continue to monitor this thread and be very interested in 3-BP's possibilities--sorting things out along the way.  Frankly, I believe it is worthy of excitement.

I found "Tripping Over the Truth" to be an excellent read.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 10, 2015 09:34 PM
Quote | ReplyWhat I find so exciting is that 3-BP has been moving through different regulatory and social contexts over the last 15 years or so in an attempt to find the environment that will allow it to thrive.

10 years after being discovered in America, a hospital ethics committee in Germany had the authority to allow 3-BP treatment for the liver patient. At that point only mouse studies had been published. Few other juridications in the world would have permitted this.

After the publication of the melanoma patient, clinics in America began treating with 3-BP. Now that further treatment successes are being noted, it appears that other nations are allowing 3-BP treatment.  If we could find the right context for 3-BP it could truly reach a point of critical mass.

India would seem to be a place with many of the characteristics that would allow a lift off moment for 3-BP. Possibly foremost among these characteristics might be an absence of Western death denial hysteria. It is truly startling that even when no viable treatment options are reasonably available to terminally ill cancer patients, Western governments still exert state control over the use of such products as 3-BP. This was recently confirmed by our new poster who was successfully treated with 3-BP in Arizona. He noted that in Sweden any medical professional who helped him receive 3-BP, which is now known to be an effective treatment for him, would be at risk of losing their professional status.

It is quite possible that Indian culture has not yet acquired this form of Western civilization's insanity.

This is like watching sparks fly and waiting for the fire to start. Under the right circumstances 3-BP will launch.

India has so many pluses. Take away the big money hurdle, add in some doable selection technology (e.g. first responders, possibly some genetic selection as I suggested recently), within a certain life affirming cultural context without an all encompassing centralizing Orwellian state, large scale pools of highly homogenous patients ... India could launch this one.

More specifically one might say that Indias could launch this one. One other plus might be that India as a monolithic state does not exist in the same way that it does in many other societies. In most other nations, having one centralized regulatory structure has stopped almost all innovation, including 3-BP for these last 15 years.

It should be clear to all on this thread that we are not talking about needing thousands of patients for a breakthrough moment with 3-BP, nor probably hundreds, nor even dozens. Successfully treating even a fairly small group of patients with acknowledged untreatable terminal cancer with 3-BP is probably all that is needed. From such a starting point all the foundational science could be added in.

This will be a very interesting situation to monitor.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 11, 2015 09:54 AM
Quote | Replyulfgosta, have you had an exome scan or genechipping done? I would love to know what variants you might have in your SLC16A1 (i.e. MCT-1 gene), mitochondrial respiration genes, among others.

I am not completely sure whether any somatic mutations in these genes would influence your response to 3-BP treatment, though it would be very interesting to investigate this question.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:26 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 10, 2015 11:51 PM peggyznd wrote:

I don't know if the use of this treatment by one doctor on his patient(s) is indicative of India as a whole supporting this treatment.

Where is the basic and foundational evidence for this, with what cancers, what stage of cancer, what co-morbidities, what side effects, etc, etc  In this last thread there are discussions--all raising extremely important questions yet to be answer.  What is the delivery system, does it get digested in the gut, why one time a transdermal dose, the next a sublinqual, etc etc?

Not worthy of the excitement at this time.

Dear Peggyznd, it is difficult to understand your point in the current context. If you look at 3BP as to a conventional treatment you can access in any hospital than your questions are fair. But only in that context. As long as you move out of that there are no more valid.

If all these questions would have to be clearly answered before applying a new treatment on humans, that there will be no new clinical trial and no new treatment available in the hospitals.

In addition, I think that the information we have today about 3BP, including the strong scientific foundation and the exemples of anti-cancer effect on humans (that have no other options anymore), clearly makes 3BP a more interesting option than many other treatments that are today investigated in clinical trials.

Therefore, the facts remain. 3BP can kill cancer cells in theory and in practice, as demonstrated. So, just see 3BP as a promising clinical trial. There are many things we know and even more that we need to learn. And this is the reality for the whole oncology world both conventional and alternative.

So lets address constructive questions that can help us progress.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 11, 2015 03:14 PM
Quote | ReplyVery interesting indeed.

The new Indian poster is now talking about 8 additional patients treated by this one doctor in Bangalore. Wonder if they all had HCC?

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-101
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Caddy on Fri Sep 11, 2015 08:31 PM
Quote | ReplyHi, This may seem a little off-topic, but I thought I'd write about the 'convential' route to colon cancer. 3 days ago Iwent in for surgery. Because of the place that the tumour was located, they had to remove 2/3rds of the colon. It's now almost 2 full days on the recovery ward and I fee terrible. I can tell the surgeons ar concerned about leakage form the gut because they sent me for a CT scan today. I was made to drink a large jug of scan prep - I knew I would throw it back up and sure enough I did. After the scan the doctor said I had to have a tube inserted through the nose and into the stomach. Cue more vomiting and much bile produced. I now have to have this tube in until my lazy bowel starts working....this could be days or even weeks apparently. I've just finished another bout of retching which sent a litre of bile out through the tube. Imagine dry retching with laparoscopic scars in the stomach wall. The news from the scan was inconclusive- some evidence of fluid having escaped but apparently that doesn't mean the surgery hasn't worked..and my supposedly fixed atrial fib has broke through again so I will probably need further touch up procedure, if I ever get out of here Avoiding surgery may have been a wise decision in hindsight!Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMoonlitnight

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 11, 2015 08:35 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 12, 2015 12:31 AM Caddy wrote:

Hi, This may seem a little off-topic, but I thought I'd write about the 'convential' route to colon cancer. 3 days ago Iwent in for surgery. Because of the place that the tumour was located, they had to remove 2/3rds of the colon. It's now almost 2 full days on the recovery ward and I fee terrible. I can tell the surgeons ar concerned about leakage form the gut because they sent me for a CT scan today. I was made to drink a large jug of scan prep - I knew I would throw it back up and sure enough I did. After the scan the doctor said I had to have a tube inserted through the nose and into the stomach. Cue more vomiting and much bile produced. I now have to have this tube in until my lazy bowel starts working....this could be days or even weeks apparently. I've just finished another bout of retching which sent a litre of bile out through the tube. Imagine dry retching with laparoscopic scars in the stomach wall. The news from the scan was inconclusive- some evidence of fluid having escaped but apparently that doesn't mean the surgery hasn't worked..and my supposedly fixed atrial fib has broke through again so I will probably need further touch up procedure, if I ever get out of here Avoiding surgery may have been a wise decision in hindsight!You will get out of there...worry not. That sounds just terrible though, Caddy, especially the dry retching. Don and I are sending you our very best for a speedy recovery.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 11, 2015 09:57 PM
Quote | ReplyGet better soon Caddy!

It would be just so much better for people if something simple and hopefully without such side effects could be used to treat cancer (e.g. 3-BP).

You'll probably be out of hospital in no time. Sometimes it might be a bit rough at first, though things will get better quicker than you ever imagined.

All the best!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:36 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 12, 2015 12:31 AM Caddy wrote:

Hi, This may seem a little off-topic, but I thought I'd write about the 'convential' route to colon cancer. 3 days ago Iwent in for surgery. Because of the place that the tumour was located, they had to remove 2/3rds of the colon. It's now almost 2 full days on the recovery ward and I fee terrible. I can tell the surgeons ar concerned about leakage form the gut because they sent me for a CT scan today. I was made to drink a large jug of scan prep - I knew I would throw it back up and sure enough I did. After the scan the doctor said I had to have a tube inserted through the nose and into the stomach. Cue more vomiting and much bile produced. I now have to have this tube in until my lazy bowel starts working....this could be days or even weeks apparently. I've just finished another bout of retching which sent a litre of bile out through the tube. Imagine dry retching with laparoscopic scars in the stomach wall. The news from the scan was inconclusive- some evidence of fluid having escaped but apparently that doesn't mean the surgery hasn't worked..and my supposedly fixed atrial fib has broke through again so I will probably need further touch up procedure, if I ever get out of here Avoiding surgery may have been a wise decision in hindsight!Caddy,

You can be as much "off-topic" as you want to!  We are here to support and encourage you as best we can.  Have been thinking about you and wondering how you were faring--and just cannot express how sorry I am you have to go through all of this!

No wonder you feel terrible after that surgery--and all of that vomiting and retching!  The bowel can slow down because of the inflammation and the drugs/anesthesia, too.  So expect that--but, hopefully, will start working in the time period they mentioned to you.

Oh, what a mess for you.  Be strong and courageous--I know you are that type of person--but I also know all of this can really get one despondent (and that word doesn't even begin to describe how you must feel at this point).  One day at a time, Caddy, and just remember we all care very much and deeply appreciate your kindness and input that you have given to everyone here.

Wish I could wave a magic wand and everything would be perfectly all right this very minute--alas, cannot do that.  But please try to be as calm as you can and encourage yourself with as many good thoughts as  you can (mind/body connection).  One day at a time--just get through one day at a time--and please, please be patient with yourself--frustration gets us nowhere very fast.

Very, very best to you--please keep us updated with how you are--and know that our positive thoughts and best wishes go wholeheartedly out to you!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ipappas on Sat Sep 12, 2015 04:22 PM
Quote | ReplyCaddy, sorry to hear how bad it is after the surgery... be patient it is still very early, I am sure it will get better day by day. I was throwing up alot the first two days after my surgery, too. Take care, all our positive thoughts are with you!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by kcervantes on Sat Sep 12, 2015 04:57 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 12, 2015 12:31 AM Caddy wrote:

Hi, This may seem a little off-topic, but I thought I'd write about the 'convential' route to colon cancer. 3 days ago Iwent in for surgery. Because of the place that the tumour was located, they had to remove 2/3rds of the colon. It's now almost 2 full days on the recovery ward and I fee terrible. I can tell the surgeons ar concerned about leakage form the gut because they sent me for a CT scan today. I was made to drink a large jug of scan prep - I knew I would throw it back up and sure enough I did. After the scan the doctor said I had to have a tube inserted through the nose and into the stomach. Cue more vomiting and much bile produced. I now have to have this tube in until my lazy bowel starts working....this could be days or even weeks apparently. I've just finished another bout of retching which sent a litre of bile out through the tube. Imagine dry retching with laparoscopic scars in the stomach wall. The news from the scan was inconclusive- some evidence of fluid having escaped but apparently that doesn't mean the surgery hasn't worked..and my supposedly fixed atrial fib has broke through again so I will probably need further touch up procedure, if I ever get out of here Avoiding surgery may have been a wise decision in hindsight!Hi Caddy -

I know this far too well :/  My husband has had bowel surgery 3 times now.  It is very typical they put the NG tube down into your stomach.  They need to drain the bile until your bowels start working again.  Nothing by mouth AT ALL :/  It will usually take 3-4 days for you to pass anything and allow them to remove it.  BUT it will happen:)  Make sure they are feeding you somehow ie; picc line TPN etc.  You dont want to lose too much weight.

THe only thing that concerns me is did your surgeon say if he left enough intestine to absorb the nutrients and allow proper metabolism?  If not, you'll have to research various options to help with this.  Dont lose hope!  You can do this!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 13, 2015 04:50 PM
Quote | ReplyThe other day I wondered whether somatic mutations can relate to cancer incidence and progression; apparently yes.

Mitochondria are at the centre of many of our discussions about cancer and their respiration. Below article talks of how a mutation in the mitochondrial D-Loop region is related to breast cancer.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16568452

This article mentions how viral therapy could be used to change mitochondrial mutations. This could be an exciting approach to cancer therapy. Mutants might be introduced to mitochondria that would be beneficial for normal cells (e.g. increased ATP generation etc.), while these mutants might put pressure on cancer cells. This would force cancer along a certain development path which cotreatments might be able to target.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 13, 2015 04:52 PM
Quote | ReplyHere is the reference for the gene therapy approach to mitochondrial mutation.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18256697
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by audiop on Mon Sep 14, 2015 01:09 PM
Quote | ReplyI'm throwing this out there as I'm running out of ideas.  My wife has been doing IV-C therapy at home and we're confronted with the nationwide shortage of sterile water (and other sterile IV solutions, ringers lactate etc.)  I've been ordering cases of 24 500ml bags and they've sent 8 each time. Now they tell me my most recent order won't be filled.  I've been ordering through a naturopath friend so a prescription is not a problem.

Anyone have online suppliers still filling orders?

I know we can get into a discussion about how ridiculous this is but what I really need is someone with stock to sell.  Private messages or email are fine.

Thanks!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Sep 14, 2015 01:41 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 14, 2015 5:09 PM audiop wrote:

I'm throwing this out there as I'm running out of ideas.  My wife has been doing IV-C therapy at home and we're confronted with the nationwide shortage of sterile water (and other sterile IV solutions, ringers lactate etc.)  I've been ordering cases of 24 500ml bags and they've sent 8 each time. Now they tell me my most recent order won't be filled.  I've been ordering through a naturopath friend so a prescription is not a problem.

Anyone have online suppliers still filling orders?

I know we can get into a discussion about how ridiculous this is but what I really need is someone with stock to sell.  Private messages or email are fine.

Thanks!
Yes, it it absolutely ridiculous.   This situation has been ongoing for more than a year now....the entire story behind it can be easily found on the internet.  The whole shortage thing is a crock to me.

There are no online sellers for one to order directly from as far as I know--a doctor, etc., must order.  Perhaps doing some research and finding some sellers and then having your naturopath try to order from them would help.  But it seems everyone is being restricted and monitored (key word) as far as how many can be ordered--even per doctor.

Do you have a friend who is a veterinarian?  Maybe he/she could help.  But the stock is definitely being restricted--and has been for some time.  I don't think we will ever really learn the true reason behind it either.

Could you order a smaller size bag?  500 ml is a lot of fluid--perhaps 250 or 100--then take it from there.  Wonder if that would make a difference in ordering and receiving?

Hope you find an answer to this dilemma--best to you.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by audiop on Mon Sep 14, 2015 01:53 PM
Quote | ReplyAll sizes, 250ml to 2000ml are shorted.  I've been ordering through my naturopath friend and the suppier ships directly to me.  Funny how the $11,000 Neulasta shot my wife gets during each chemo cycle is in plentiful supply but a bag with water in it can't be filled.

Frustrating that while I'm trying to put together the next IV regimen of 3-BP (thanks to Daniel for his support), the powers that be are yanking the stool out from my current IV therapy.

I never look at a problem in terms of conspiracy but I'm starting to modify that.  By the way, IV-C solutions have quadrupled this year.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Mon Sep 14, 2015 07:34 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 14, 2015 5:53 PM audiop wrote:

All sizes, 250ml to 2000ml are shorted.  I've been ordering through my naturopath friend and the suppier ships directly to me.  Funny how the $11,000 Neulasta shot my wife gets during each chemo cycle is in plentiful supply but a bag with water in it can't be filled.

Frustrating that while I'm trying to put together the next IV regimen of 3-BP (thanks to Daniel for his support), the powers that be are yanking the stool out from my current IV therapy.

I never look at a problem in terms of conspiracy but I'm starting to modify that.  By the way, IV-C solutions have quadrupled this year.
You could try to order from Germany? I am not sure if it is possible to send to US and what would be the transport price but at least you can have a look. Here is a pharmacy seling e.g. 10x250ml saline for 9 euro: http://shop2.bodfeld-apotheke.de/product/kochsalzloesung-0-9

There is no need for prescription for basic stuff in Germany.

If you want to search through all German pharmacies use this link http://www.medizinfuchs.de/

Regarding Vit C, I will soon write a post on that and try to address how to make IVC solution - in the end it can be done and sterilize same as 3BP.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 14, 2015 07:47 PM
Quote | ReplyWhat is the going price in the US for sterile water?

I am totally amazed that this could even be a problem. Surely there would be all sorts of people that would engage in some export import. How can you create an artificial shortage of a product that is fully in supply in the rest of the world?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by audiop on Mon Sep 14, 2015 07:48 PM
Quote | ReplyThanks Daniel,

I'm actually looking at making my own sodium ascorbate solution and sterilizing/filtering bags or bottles of distilled water for injection.  I'm getting very impatient with the U.S. FDA getting in the way of every therapy outside of a failing SOC that just might add a little hope to a dying patient.

I look forward to your notes and I may be able to contribute as I have some experience with IV-C.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:14 PM
Quote | Replymar, the whole thread is pulling for you and hope that your treatment on Wednesday goes well! It has been somewhat irregular that the ex clinic manager where you were going to go for treatment faulted their procedures on our thread.

I was worrying that you might not be able to receive the treatment you have been looking forward to for so long. It was starting to confuse me quite a bit. I am sure you were also quite confused. Hopefully this has now been all cleared up and you can concentrate on getting better.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:18 PM
Quote | ReplyI missed that Mar was having her treatment Wed. Wishing you the very best, Mar. Go get 'em!

Caddy...how are you feeling?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:33 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 15, 2015 2:18 AM Moonlitnight wrote:

I missed that Mar was having her treatment Wed. Wishing you the very best, Mar. Go get 'em!

Caddy...how are you feeling?
Yes, I missed that, too, about Mar having upcoming treatment on Wednesday--best to you, Mar.  Please keep us updated!!

And ditto on the sentiments about Caddy--when you are able to, please let us know how you are--we all care very much and wish the best for you.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by audiop on Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:31 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 14, 2015 11:47 PM Jcancom wrote:

What is the going price in the US for sterile water?

I am totally amazed that this could even be a problem. Surely there would be all sorts of people that would engage in some export import. How can you create an artificial shortage of a product that is fully in supply in the rest of the world?
It's been in shortage for a long time.  See:

https://www.ismp.org/newsletters/acutecare/showarticle.aspx?

http://www.ashp.org/menu/DrugShortages/CurrentShortages/Bull

Google it and you'll find articles about hospitals scrambling to get next week's supply in.  When I do receive the water it's cheap- $4/500ml bag.  Importing it will probably cost four or five times that.  Last time I imported water the shipping cost was large and it sat on a dock for ten days waiting for FDA clearance.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Tue Sep 15, 2015 02:46 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 15, 2015 4:31 AM audiop wrote:

On Sep 14, 2015 11:47 PM Jcancom wrote:

What is the going price in the US for sterile water?

I am totally amazed that this could even be a problem. Surely there would be all sorts of people that would engage in some export import. How can you create an artificial shortage of a product that is fully in supply in the rest of the world?
It's been in shortage for a long time.  See:

https://www.ismp.org/newsletters/acutecare/showarticle.aspx? id=69"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.ismp.org/newsletters/acutecare/showarticle.aspx?  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.ismp.org/newsletters/acutecare/showarticle.aspx?

http://www.ashp.org/menu/DrugShortages/CurrentShortages/Bull etin.aspx?id=1120"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ashp.org/menu/DrugShortages/CurrentShortages/Bull  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ashp.org/menu/DrugShortages/CurrentShortages/Bull

Google it and you'll find articles about hospitals scrambling to get next week's supply in.  When I do receive the water it's cheap- $4/500ml bag.  Importing it will probably cost four or five times that.  Last time I imported water the shipping cost was large and it sat on a dock for ten days waiting for FDA clearance.
Yes, and I seem to recall various instances where the FDA went to some European countries to "examine" their facilities to see if they were "up to par with U.S. standards"--they were interested in seeing if they then woud be able to purchase i.v. bags from them because of the U.S. shortage.

The whole thing does not sound right.  How difficult is it to keep up production for saline and sterile water in bags?  Something else must be going on behind the scenes, I think.

And I would be wary right now of importing anything--boxes would be heavy, shipping charges high (as you said), and FDA might not clear the items at all.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 16, 2015 02:23 AM
Quote | ReplyAnd, Audiop, sending best wishes to you and your wife that you will find the necessary supplies for her--and that her condition will improve for the best.

In the meantime, D has been a wonderful source of both information and support.  Good you are in contact with him!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by rliff on Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:30 AM
Quote | ReplyI have just received a supply of 3BP from China, and it is a beige coloured, chrystallised single mass.  It also gives off a very, very acidic vapour when opened.  I wondered if anyone had an explanation or has experienced similar ?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Thu Sep 17, 2015 01:37 PM
Quote | ReplyDo you have any idea of what is supposed to look like, what other compounds might be mixed in it, the concentration, a chemist to analyze it and so on?  I have to express a huge concern that this is the way you might wish to treat yourself, and it sounds dangerous, and as a minimum, a dumb idea.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 17, 2015 01:55 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 17, 2015 3:30 PM rliff wrote:

I have just received a supply of 3BP from China, and it is a beige coloured, chrystallised single mass.  It also gives off a very, very acidic vapour when opened.  I wondered if anyone had an explanation or has experienced similar ?
Mine (ordered from the US) is a white crystalline product. The crystals differ in size depending on which supplier but I have never heard of a beigey single mass. I am wondring if it absorbed water en route and is deactivated. Can you ask the supplier? (In any event, I personally would not use it, although it's probably less dangerous than most chemotherapy drugs.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by rliff on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:14 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 17, 2015 5:55 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 17, 2015 3:30 PM rliff wrote:

I have just received a supply of 3BP from China, and it is a beige coloured, chrystallised single mass.  It also gives off a very, very acidic vapour when opened.  I wondered if anyone had an explanation or has experienced similar ?
Mine (ordered from the US) is a white crystalline product. The crystals differ in size depending on which supplier but I have never heard of a beigey single mass. I am wondring if it absorbed water en route and is deactivated. Can you ask the supplier? (In any event, I personally would not use it, although it's probably less dangerous than most chemotherapy drugs.
Many thanks for your positive, helpful reply Moonlitnight - you've supplied just the information I needed.  It was held up and opened by customs, and as you say it supposed to be a white crystalline product, it would appear to have been spoiled in one way or another.   Bit risky to use I think, so back to the drawing board !
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:19 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 17, 2015 6:14 PM rliff wrote:

On Sep 17, 2015 5:55 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 17, 2015 3:30 PM rliff wrote:

I have just received a supply of 3BP from China, and it is a beige coloured, chrystallised single mass.  It also gives off a very, very acidic vapour when opened.  I wondered if anyone had an explanation or has experienced similar ?
Mine (ordered from the US) is a white crystalline product. The crystals differ in size depending on which supplier but I have never heard of a beigey single mass. I am wondring if it absorbed water en route and is deactivated. Can you ask the supplier? (In any event, I personally would not use it, although it's probably less dangerous than most chemotherapy drugs.
Many thanks for your positive, helpful reply Moonlitnight - you've supplied just the information I needed.  It was held up and opened by customs, and as you say it supposed to be a white crystalline product, it would appear to have been spoiled in one way or another.   Bit risky to use I think, so back to the drawing board !
I know that one of mine (the larger crystals) tends to clump as soon as I take it out of the bottle. I hit it with water before it does and use this one for the topical, so not too concerned. Clumping is something it likes to do very fast if there is any moisture in the air. D may know what to do with it to declump...but the beige colour would be a concern to me.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:24 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 17, 2015 6:14 PM rliff wrote:

On Sep 17, 2015 5:55 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 17, 2015 3:30 PM rliff wrote:

I have just received a supply of 3BP from China, and it is a beige coloured, chrystallised single mass.  It also gives off a very, very acidic vapour when opened.  I wondered if anyone had an explanation or has experienced similar ?
Mine (ordered from the US) is a white crystalline product. The crystals differ in size depending on which supplier but I have never heard of a beigey single mass. I am wondring if it absorbed water en route and is deactivated. Can you ask the supplier? (In any event, I personally would not use it, although it's probably less dangerous than most chemotherapy drugs.
Many thanks for your positive, helpful reply Moonlitnight - you've supplied just the information I needed.  It was held up and opened by customs, and as you say it supposed to be a white crystalline product, it would appear to have been spoiled in one way or another.   Bit risky to use I think, so back to the drawing board !
Good and kindly reply from you in response to a good, positive answer from Moonlitnight!

We are all here to encourage one another and be of  sincere help.  Hope that drawing board comes up with something good for you very, very soon!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:25 PM
Quote | ReplyThe color depends on purity:

- >95%: orange crystalin powder
- >97%: orange - to white powder
- 100%: pure white powder

Chinese suppliers provide mainly 95%.
Western suppliers provide >97% and rarely 100%.

Any is good as long as it is well manufactured, stored etc. and depending on the administration route the purity becomes more relevant - so that for IV only >97% shoudl be used.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:27 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, beige coloured is about right, this would be 3-BP of less than 100% purity.  100% pure 3-BP should be pure white. It probably started off as a powder and perhaps with a bit of moisture formed into a single mass.

And yes it does give off a very very acidic vapour. If someone were to take 3-BP out of a freezer and open it right away then such a vapor would be given off. This would obviously not be a terribly smart thing to do.

The idea might be that removing the 3-BP from a freezer environment will lead to water vapor reaching it, this would cause the powdered form to change into a vaporized 3-bromopyruvic acid form.

I have mentioned a few ideas of how a basic chemical analysis could be done on a sample of 3-BP. For example, in one of the published articles from the 2012 issue with the liver patient, there was mention of certain concentrations of 3-BP stopping fermentation in yeast. (This is how 3-BP works in cancer: it stops cellular respiration.) One way of checking whether 3-BP were active would be to have an actively growing yeast sample and then add 3-BP. The yeast fermentation should then stop. In the article they gave exact molarities of 3-BP and the results for a specific strain of baker's yeast. It would be great to have a highly accurate standard value using 100% pure 3-BP to test against samples bought online. I am not completely sure how safe this would be. One would need to be reasonably cautious when adding 3-BP to water in an open system.

Pure 3-BP has a density of around (2 g/ml).  Perhaps this property could be used to determine the purity of the product you bought. Some of the contaminants of some of the routes of synthesis have densities less than water so should float on top. One of the posters to our thread noted that this was true. He mentioned that when 3-BP is added to water there can be a "scummy" residue on top. He used a filter to remove this.

Any one with chemical knowledge might be able to help out on this one. 3-BP when added to water will form an acid. It might be possible to calculate the theoretical pH of such a solution. One could then measure the pH of your solution to determine how closely it matched the predicted value.

Many on the thread are likely in interested in how such chemical analyses could be done.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:42 PM
Quote | ReplyCould someone help me find the right word?

In March of 2015, there was a chemical leak near Montreal in which 40 tons of titanium tetrachloride were released. Apparently this can result in the formation of hydrocholoric acid "snow".

What is the word for this process in which the snow forms? It is something like hydrogyospic.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 17, 2015 02:54 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 17, 2015 6:42 PM Jcancom wrote:

Could someone help me find the right word?

In March of 2015, there was a chemical leak near Montreal in which 40 tons of titanium tetrachloride were released. Apparently this can result in the formation of hydrocholoric acid "snow".

What is the word for this process in which the snow forms? It is something like hydrogyospic.
hydrophilic means attracting water but I have no clue what making snow would be.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Thu Sep 17, 2015 03:01 PM
Quote | ReplyGot it!

hygroscopic

I was pretty close. A hygroscopic sustance readily takes up mositure. In the Montreal chemical leak chemical snow was created when hydrochloric acid took up mositure. So, bascially you can wind up with a hydrochloric chemical vapor which simply sounds crazy dangerous.

I am not totally sure, though 3-BP might also be hygroscopic. This might be why the vapor forms. So, this would be a 3-Bromopyruvic acid chemical vapor which sounds even more crazily dangerous than the (by comparison) mildly dangerous hydrocholoric acid vapor.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 18, 2015 01:29 PM
Quote | ReplyAnyone had an update from Mar?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by mar60 on Fri Sep 18, 2015 02:16 PM
Quote | ReplyThis is Mar..after I had a conversationele with  André  I told Klaus in Bracht I was ging to talk to the dr and André  to decide where I wanted to do the treatment. .after I heard What is  wrong in Bracht I decided not to do the treatment  there..so I went for an intake with André and the dr and now I am waiting for the postman To bring the 3-Bp ( oral and transdermal)...so I did not start the treatment yet..
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 18, 2015 02:19 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 18, 2015 6:16 PM mar60 wrote:

This is Mar..after I had a conversationele with  André  I told Klaus in Bracht I was ging to talk to the dr and André  to decide where I wanted to do the treatment. .after I heard What is  wrong in Bracht I decided not to do the treatment  there..so I went for an intake with André and the dr and now I am waiting for the postman To bring the 3-Bp ( oral and transdermal)...so I did not start the treatment yet..
Thanks for that update, Mar. We are all rooting for you!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Sep 18, 2015 03:19 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 18, 2015 6:16 PM mar60 wrote:

This is Mar..after I had a conversationele with  André  I told Klaus in Bracht I was ging to talk to the dr and André  to decide where I wanted to do the treatment. .after I heard What is  wrong in Bracht I decided not to do the treatment  there..so I went for an intake with André and the dr and now I am waiting for the postman To bring the 3-Bp ( oral and transdermal)...so I did not start the treatment yet..
Mar,

So very glad to hear from you and to know that soon you will begin 3-BP treatment!  Please keep us updated as much as possible--and always remember that we are wishing you the very best!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Sep 18, 2015 03:23 PM
Quote | ReplyNow where is another person about whom we are concerned--Caddy?? Hope with all of my heart that he is faring better--and I know others on the forum are concerned and care, too!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Fri Sep 18, 2015 03:26 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 18, 2015 7:23 PM jetsparkle wrote:

Now where is another person about whom we are concerned--Caddy?? Hope with all of my heart that he is faring better--and I know others on the forum are concerned and care, too!
Yes indeed. All are concerned for Caddy and sending many  caring thoughts.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat Sep 19, 2015 01:14 PM
Quote | ReplyMar, I am so happy that you have found a way to access 3-BP through qualified medical practioners. The whole thread wishes that this will help you.

Caddy, I hope that you are feeling better now. Hopefully, the secondary problems that you mentioned are being addressed. I was surprised when you mentioned that such a large portion of your colon had been resected. Get well soon!

ulfgosta, we would all love an update from you as well. We want to make sure that you do not relax your treatment efforts after an impressive first round with 3-BP. Ongoing 3-BP treatments (perhaps in a clinic in Germany?) might be needed to maintain the momentum against the cancer. The thread wants to help you stay focused on making progress against your cancer. We are here to help you!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sat Sep 19, 2015 02:07 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 19, 2015 5:14 PM Jcancom wrote:

Mar, I am so happy that you have found a way to access 3-BP through qualified medical practioners. The whole thread wishes that this will help you.

Caddy, I hope that you are feeling better now. Hopefully, the secondary problems that you mentioned are being addressed. I was surprised when you mentioned that such a large portion of your colon had been resected. Get well soon!

ulfgosta, we would all love an update from you as well. We want to make sure that you do not relax your treatment efforts after an impressive first round with 3-BP. Ongoing 3-BP treatments (perhaps in a clinic in Germany?) might be needed to maintain the momentum against the cancer. The thread wants to help you stay focused on making progress against your cancer. We are here to help you!
Amen to this. We are all connected.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 03:52 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 19, 2015 6:07 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 19, 2015 5:14 PM Jcancom wrote:

Mar, I am so happy that you have found a way to access 3-BP through qualified medical practioners. The whole thread wishes that this will help you.

Caddy, I hope that you are feeling better now. Hopefully, the secondary problems that you mentioned are being addressed. I was surprised when you mentioned that such a large portion of your colon had been resected. Get well soon!

ulfgosta, we would all love an update from you as well. We want to make sure that you do not relax your treatment efforts after an impressive first round with 3-BP. Ongoing 3-BP treatments (perhaps in a clinic in Germany?) might be needed to maintain the momentum against the cancer. The thread wants to help you stay focused on making progress against your cancer. We are here to help you!
Amen to this. We are all connected.
Yes--very much agreed.  Who knew that this cancer journey would lead us to one  another--and to such brave, wonderful, sharing persons?  And, for this part of it, we are very grateful and have found ones that have proved to be a blessing.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by ulfgosta on Sat Sep 19, 2015 05:21 PM
Quote | ReplyHello Jcancom and all others,

Thanks for your thoughtfulness.

I will have new blood tests on Wednesday and depending on that I will make my next move.

I will definetely keep you posted when there is something interesting to tell.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by audiop on Sat Sep 19, 2015 08:58 PM
Quote | ReplyMoonlitnight, I missed this post.  My wife is on a ketogenic diet and takes a ketone supplement 1,3 butanediol. This elevates blood ketones and provides an alternate energy source that can counter cachexia.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sat Sep 19, 2015 09:12 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 20, 2015 12:58 AM audiop wrote:

Moonlitnight, I missed this post.  My wife is on a ketogenic diet and takes a ketone supplement 1,3 butanediol. This elevates blood ketones and provides an alternate energy source that can counter cachexia.
Oh my, F. Thank you. My guy is so thin (think Belsen and then some) that I am not sure he can do the full keto. I am interested in the supplement though. Is that available online or does it have to be ordered as a supplement? I will go snooping.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sat Sep 19, 2015 09:33 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 20, 2015 1:12 AM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 20, 2015 12:58 AM audiop wrote:

Moonlitnight, I missed this post.  My wife is on a ketogenic diet and takes a ketone supplement 1,3 butanediol. This elevates blood ketones and provides an alternate energy source that can counter cachexia.
Oh my, F. Thank you. My guy is so thin (think Belsen and then some) that I am not sure he can do the full keto. I am interested in the supplement though. Is that available online or does it have to be ordered as a supplement? I will go snooping.
F, the Indian doc who used to post here recommended Beta-Hydroxybutyrate (BHB) as a supplement called KetoCaNa. Daniel, could you please let us know if this is related to the sodium butyrate that I use every day for Don? Apparently it provides an alternative source of fuel for the cells irrespective if whether or not one continues consuming carbs. Interesting.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by audiop on Sat Sep 19, 2015 09:35 PM
Quote | ReplyI sent you a supplier.  My wife takes 2 tsp 1,3 BD with 1 tbsp MCT oil, 3 or 4x/day.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:07 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 20, 2015 1:35 AM audiop wrote:

I sent you a supplier.  My wife takes 2 tsp 1,3 BD with 1 tbsp MCT oil, 3 or 4x/day.
Thank you, F. Very much appreciated!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by dumbcritic on Sun Sep 20, 2015 08:44 AM
Quote | ReplyThere was a pilot study in 10 advanced cancer patients. The patients did a very low-carb, ketogenic diet for 28 days. According to a PET scan, 4 of the patients continued to have progressive disease, while 5 remained stable and 1 had a partial remission. The patients who had the best metabolic response to the diet (that is, lowest insulin and highest ketone levels) saw the most improvement http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22840388

In 1995, a case report of two girls with nonresectable brain cancer (anaplastic astrocytoma stage IV, and cerebellar astrocytoma stage III) was published. After 7 days on a ketogenic diet, blood glucose levels decreased and glucose uptake at tumor site decreased by 21,8%. One of the girls had significant improvement in symptoms and her disease did not progress for the next 12 months, the other was lost to follow up http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7790697  One of the patients remains alive at this time (Dr Linda Nebeling MD, personal communication with Prof. Tomas Seyfried PhD)

Rapid Response of Glioblastoma Multiforme with the Ketogenic Diet: A Case Report http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2874558/  http://www.nutritionandmetabolism.com/content/pdf/1743-7075-

In a pilot trial of 16 advanced-stage cancer patients, a ketogenic diet did improve quality of life and stopped the progression of cancer for the 5 patients who completed the 12 week study http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21794124

Also omega-3 fatty acids may help too http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2408928/
The ketogenic diet and hyperbaric oxygen therapy prolong survival in mice with systemic metastatic cancer http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3673985/
Ketone supplementation decreases tumor cell viability and prolongs survival of mice with metastatic cancer http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4235292/
Non-Toxic Metabolic Management of Metastatic Cancer in VM Mice: Novel Combination of Ketogenic Diet, Ketone Supplementation, and Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4464523/
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:09 AM
Quote | Replyulfgosta Regarding a ketogenic diet, have you considered tryint it? It might be helpful in combination with 3-BP treatment.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:33 PM
Quote | ReplyOn the below url an Indian poster talked of a successful TACE 3-BP treatment of his father who has HCC. Might someone clarify the posters comments about a decline in 60% SUV values in HCC (multicentric?-- metastatic?). Would such a patient response be impressive in HCC?

It would be amazing if we could establish contact with other Indian 3-BP patients.

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 20, 2015 08:37 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 20, 2015 12:44 PM dumbcritic wrote:

There was a pilot study in 10 advanced cancer patients. The patients did a very low-carb, ketogenic diet for 28 days. According to a PET scan, 4 of the patients continued to have progressive disease, while 5 remained stable and 1 had a partial remission. The patients who had the best metabolic response to the diet (that is, lowest insulin and highest ketone levels) saw the most improvement http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22840388 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22840388 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22840388

In 1995, a case report of two girls with nonresectable brain cancer (anaplastic astrocytoma stage IV, and cerebellar astrocytoma stage III) was published. After 7 days on a ketogenic diet, blood glucose levels decreased and glucose uptake at tumor site decreased by 21,8%. One of the girls had significant improvement in symptoms and her disease did not progress for the next 12 months, the other was lost to follow up http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7790697 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7790697 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7790697  One of the patients remains alive at this time (Dr Linda Nebeling MD, personal communication with Prof. Tomas Seyfried PhD)

Rapid Response of Glioblastoma Multiforme with the Ketogenic Diet: A Case Report http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2874558/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2874558/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2874558/  http://www.nutritionandmetabolism.com/content/pdf/1743-7075- 7-33.pdf"" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nutritionandmetabolism.com/content/pdf/1743-7075-  target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nutritionandmetabolism.com/content/pdf/1743-7075-

In a pilot trial of 16 advanced-stage cancer patients, a ketogenic diet did improve quality of life and stopped the progression of cancer for the 5 patients who completed the 12 week study http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21794124 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21794124 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21794124

Also omega-3 fatty acids may help too http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2408928/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2408928/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2408928/
The ketogenic diet and hyperbaric oxygen therapy prolong survival in mice with systemic metastatic cancer http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3673985/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3673985/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3673985/
Ketone supplementation decreases tumor cell viability and prolongs survival of mice with metastatic cancer http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4235292/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4235292/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4235292/
Non-Toxic Metabolic Management of Metastatic Cancer in VM Mice: Novel Combination of Ketogenic Diet, Ketone Supplementation, and Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4464523/ "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4464523/ " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4464523/
Thank you not-so-dumbcritic... much appreciated.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Tue Sep 22, 2015 02:19 PM
Quote | ReplyHere's an interesting one: Use sickle cells to attack hypoxic tumors. Really neat that you could use hypoxia as a targeting mechanism.

We have been extremely focused on the metabolic side of tumors. Using the sickle cell approach with 3-BP might help reduce concerns about removing the normoxic layer of tumor cells only to be left with more resistent hypoxic cells (due to downregulated MCT-1).

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:54 AM
Quote | ReplySo a few of our members are using 3BP as a primary therapy now. Has anyone seen any positive results first hand?Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterJcancom

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:43 PM
Quote | ReplyWhile it is true that a few members of the thread have tried 3-BP without success, I am still quite impressed with the impressive reports of 3-BP's effectiveness.

Our thread is greatly honored to have a poster with stage IV pancreatic cancer who has had a significant response to 3-BP treatment.

Apparently India is now offering 3-BP treatment. Noteable successes are already being reported in HCC and other cancers.

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65

There has been so much success with 3-BP, it is astonishing. This is not about deception through selection. The pancreatic patient now posting was the first and only (till that time) pancreatic cancer patient treated with 3-BP at Dayspring. Alternative medicine has always misrepresented outcomes by not disclosing the size of the treated population.

So many times with 3-BP it is not unreasonable to speculate that the denominator, so to speak, must be low. They are already reporting success in India, even though treatment there has likely only started fairly recently.

I must admit that my enthusiasm as a poster to this thread is now diminishing as the train seems to be leaving the station. Increasingly it feels as liftoff has already occurred and it is time for my thread retirement party.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:49 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 4:43 PM Jcancom wrote:

While it is true that a few members of the thread have tried 3-BP without success, I am still quite impressed with the impressive reports of 3-BP's effectiveness.

Our thread is greatly honored to have a poster with stage IV pancreatic cancer who has had a significant response to 3-BP treatment.

Apparently India is now offering 3-BP treatment. Noteable successes are already being reported in HCC and other cancers.

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65

There has been so much success with 3-BP, it is astonishing. This is not about deception through selection. The pancreatic patient now posting was the first and only (till that time) pancreatic cancer patient treated with 3-BP at Dayspring. Alternative medicine has always misrepresented outcomes by not disclosing the size of the treated population.

So many times with 3-BP it is not unreasonable to speculate that the denominator, so to speak, must be low. They are already reporting success in India, even though treatment there has likely only started fairly recently.

I must admit that my enthusiasm as a poster to this thread is now diminishing as the train seems to be leaving the station. Increasingly it feels as liftoff has already occurred and it is time for my thread retirement party.

Don't you even think about retiring, Jcancom! So much of your vitality, enthusiasm,  and vigilance has proved to be very helpful here--and you would be sadly missed if you departed!

There is much more to do yet with 3-BP--and your research has always kept the thread invigorated.  Many of us who are not well cannot accomplish this--we need and count on people like you who care and are enthusiastic to continue this and keep everyone motivated.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 23, 2015 01:17 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 4:49 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 4:43 PM Jcancom wrote:

While it is true that a few members of the thread have tried 3-BP without success, I am still quite impressed with the impressive reports of 3-BP's effectiveness.

Our thread is greatly honored to have a poster with stage IV pancreatic cancer who has had a significant response to 3-BP treatment.

Apparently India is now offering 3-BP treatment. Noteable successes are already being reported in HCC and other cancers.

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" 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There has been so much success with 3-BP, it is astonishing. This is not about deception through selection. The pancreatic patient now posting was the first and only (till that time) pancreatic cancer patient treated with 3-BP at Dayspring. Alternative medicine has always misrepresented outcomes by not disclosing the size of the treated population.

So many times with 3-BP it is not unreasonable to speculate that the denominator, so to speak, must be low. They are already reporting success in India, even though treatment there has likely only started fairly recently.

I must admit that my enthusiasm as a poster to this thread is now diminishing as the train seems to be leaving the station. Increasingly it feels as liftoff has already occurred and it is time for my thread retirement party.

Don't you even think about retiring, Jcancom! So much of your vitality, enthusiasm,  and vigilance has proved to be very helpful here--and you would be sadly missed if you departed!

There is much more to do yet with 3-BP--and your research has always kept the thread invigorated.  Many of us who are not well cannot accomplish this--we need and count on people like you who care and are enthusiastic to continue this and keep everyone motivated.
I agree with Jetsparkle. But it is disappointing to see that thread members using 3BP are not seeing the results they hoped for.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 23, 2015 01:19 PM

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On Sep 23, 2015 3:54 PM Meech90 wrote:

So a few of our members are using 3BP as a primary therapy now. Has anyone seen any positive results first hand?Not us but we haven't started the IVs yet - all topical and occasional neb and oral.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 01:53 PM

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On Sep 23, 2015 4:43 PM Jcancom wrote:

While it is true that a few members of the thread have tried 3-BP without success, I am still quite impressed with the impressive reports of 3-BP's effectiveness.

Our thread is greatly honored to have a poster with stage IV pancreatic cancer who has had a significant response to 3-BP treatment.

Apparently India is now offering 3-BP treatment. Noteable successes are already being reported in HCC and other cancers.

http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65 " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=47#comment-65

There has been so much success with 3-BP, it is astonishing. This is not about deception through selection. The pancreatic patient now posting was the first and only (till that time) pancreatic cancer patient treated with 3-BP at Dayspring. Alternative medicine has always misrepresented outcomes by not disclosing the size of the treated population.

So many times with 3-BP it is not unreasonable to speculate that the denominator, so to speak, must be low. They are already reporting success in India, even though treatment there has likely only started fairly recently.

I must admit that my enthusiasm as a poster to this thread is now diminishing as the train seems to be leaving the station. Increasingly it feels as liftoff has already occurred and it is time for my thread retirement party.

You can't declare that he had great success with 3BP because all areas of response from his lab reports coincide with times that he was undergoing chemotherapy. I think Daniel has had people in his life using 3BP for a little while; I'd like to hear what his experience is. Having enthusiasm is nice but misinterpreting reports and being overly optimistic about this therapy, where we haven't really seen any first hand reports of success, could lead people to start trying an unproven and potentially ineffective therapy while other options are on the table. I still have faith in 3BP because the theoretical science is sound but we need to stop getting carried away.Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 02:24 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 5:19 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 3:54 PM Meech90 wrote:

So a few of our members are using 3BP as a primary therapy now. Has anyone seen any positive results first hand?Not us but we haven't started the IVs yet - all topical and occasional neb and oral.
Topical as in application to the skin via cream of some sort? Do you know if nebulizing has helped with anything in the lungs (if there is disease in the lungs?)Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMoonlitnight

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 23, 2015 02:54 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 6:24 PM Meech90 wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 5:19 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 3:54 PM Meech90 wrote:

So a few of our members are using 3BP as a primary therapy now. Has anyone seen any positive results first hand?Not us but we haven't started the IVs yet - all topical and occasional neb and oral.
Topical as in application to the skin via cream of some sort? Do you know if nebulizing has helped with anything in the lungs (if there is disease in the lungs?)Meech, we have done so few nebs. Kim has done quite a number I believe. The topical is done per Daniel's suggestions using DMSO as the carrier. Up here, they don't care to find out where the disease is as it makes no difference in terms of treatment, or so I have been informed.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Wed Sep 23, 2015 03:07 PM
Quote | Reply"we need to stop getting carried away" is right, as a quick review of this thread will show that there is no real verifiable benefit for any defined patient group.  We have discussed/mixed multiple types of cancers, patients, delivery systems, strengths, variations on the basic compound, the contamination and/or mixed strengths and so on.  Just imagine going into some clinic where the med being offered varied from day to day, was supposed to fix all ailments for all, and had no track record of success.  Having a report of a single patient having been treated is not the same as having a history of reliable and beneficial response to some medication.

The sad part of all of this is that we all wish desperately that there was a single magic bullet to combat the 100s of cancers which are found in millions of different people, and with that magic bullet, cure them all.  It ain't going to happen, guys, wish as hard as we can.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 23, 2015 03:46 PM

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On Sep 23, 2015 7:07 PM peggyznd wrote:

"we need to stop getting carried away" is right, as a quick review of this thread will show that there is no real verifiable benefit for any defined patient group.  We have discussed/mixed multiple types of cancers, patients, delivery systems, strengths, variations on the basic compound, the contamination and/or mixed strengths and so on.  Just imagine going into some clinic where the med being offered varied from day to day, was supposed to fix all ailments for all, and had no track record of success.  Having a report of a single patient having been treated is not the same as having a history of reliable and beneficial response to some medication.

The sad part of all of this is that we all wish desperately that there was a single magic bullet to combat the 100s of cancers which are found in millions of different people, and with that magic bullet, cure them all.  It ain't going to happen, guys, wish as hard as we can.
Peggy, I think we are well aware there is no verifiable benefit for any defined patient group - as there is not with any existing drug for advanced cancer except for blood and testicular cancers perhaps. Those "benefits" we read about, when papers are pulled, or researchers questioned, rarely produce the positive effects they are purported to. Often a person will rally becasue the weaker cancer cells have been killed off, leaving the more virulent stem cells to party and quickly kill their host. Even my oncologist agreed on that point.

I don't think anyone of any intelligence within this group expects 3BP to be a "magic bullet." That is why we add  various other components to address multiple aspects of cancer - tubulin suppressors, anti-angiogenesis agents etc.

For many of us, sick and tired of the useless and dangerous treatments thrust upon us as if we all respond identically to them, 3BP and other substances provide a far less dangerous form of possibly effective treatment...as well as hope. Would you please clarify for me what precisely your post is aiming to achieve? Dashing hope? Telling a lot of "silly little children" how they should be handling their treatment? I'm just not sure... What I AM sure of is that I will try everything possible that I have personally researched that may be of benefit to my life partner.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Wed Sep 23, 2015 04:44 PM
Quote | ReplyFrankly, I am concerned for patients who really understand very little about the complexity of cancers, are without good and effective treatments, and are thereby very vulnerable to people who offer medications/compounds/whatever that are not shown in an objective way to be beneficial.

I am painfully aware of the limitations of the available treatments, and that many patients may receive little or no benefit from any traditional and/or approved therapy.  Still others receive some benefit as to the shrinkage of a solid tumor or metastases, but at a tremendous cost due to the side effects.  Others benefit for a while, and then the drug loses effectiveness.

A careful reading of the studies and an understanding of how those studies may or may not be translated into clinical practice shows that much of this is still a guessing game--but at least there is some data on which to make those guesses. Doctors and researchers use the group's experience, and must try to apply it to one individual, with the natural weakness of that approach.

There are many classes of agents used against many diferent types of cancers, and probably too little ability to sort out who has the best CHANCE of responding to any one agent.

Some chemos kill cells directly, with the fast growing cancer cells being killed the fastest, but still killing normal cells.  Radiation does the same, and is most effective with faster-growing cancers.

Other attempt to starve the growth of tumors, cutting off blood supply to the tumors, again taking advantage of the growth factors which differ from the normal, slower-growing cell.

The medication which saved my life eleven years ago revved up my immune system which becme hypersensitive to my 100s of kidney cancer mets.  That response was unusual, and in my case, durable.  Other patients who might be described as the "same" as me have not responded.  Many doctors won't recommend that drug, as it has tough, though passing, side effects. And the chance of responding well is low.  Some doctors know how to sort out the patient most likely to respond, and know how to maximize the use of the drug to elicit that response.

It is the careful analysis of the patient, the type of cancer, the current interaction of the cancer and the immune system, the interactions of other medications, such as the anti-angiogenesis drugs with the other drugs, the body's ability to recover from side effects and much more which has to be taken into consideration.

It is the lack of this careful consideration that worries me in this discussion of this single compound, without all the other factors that must be examined at the same time.

I ask that patients be given all the data about their disease, about the research, about the options, about their own general health, about clinical trials, about basic biology and so on, so they can make the best decision in this very challenging and heartbreaking process.

I think we would agree that this is more helpful to be cautious and informed than to over react to the limited information that we have seen in this thread.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by smyrnalover on Wed Sep 23, 2015 05:01 PM
Quote | ReplyI agree with you Peggy. The danger is that desperate people will clutch at straws and spend their hard-earned money on quackery. There is no statistical evidence on 3bp, and I quite frankly question the motives of the posters who troll all the web sites proposing this unproved remedy. Cancer is extremely complicated, and there is no silver bullet.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMeech90

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 05:26 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 7:07 PM peggyznd wrote:

"we need to stop getting carried away" is right, as a quick review of this thread will show that there is no real verifiable benefit for any defined patient group.  We have discussed/mixed multiple types of cancers, patients, delivery systems, strengths, variations on the basic compound, the contamination and/or mixed strengths and so on.  Just imagine going into some clinic where the med being offered varied from day to day, was supposed to fix all ailments for all, and had no track record of success.  Having a report of a single patient having been treated is not the same as having a history of reliable and beneficial response to some medication.

The sad part of all of this is that we all wish desperately that there was a single magic bullet to combat the 100s of cancers which are found in millions of different people, and with that magic bullet, cure them all.  It ain't going to happen, guys, wish as hard as we can.
I think you've gone too far in the other direction by saying "it ain't gonna happen". There are commonalities within all cancers that therapy can exploit in all likelihood. Just because we haven't found something to cure most forms, doesn't mean we won't. The model for searching for a cure for the past half a century was to attack the genetic mutations which cause cancer, ignoring the fact that genetic mutations aren't proven to be causative and can be a byproduct of an earlier cause. Also it was done under the assumption that there are only a minute amount of oncogenes when that has recently been found to be untrue. Essentially, 60 years of research has basically been potentially wasted hunting something with potentially the wrong thesis in mind.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterjetsparkle

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 23, 2015 05:28 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 8:44 PM peggyznd wrote:

Frankly, I am concerned for patients who really understand very little about the complexity of cancers, are without good and effective treatments, and are thereby very vulnerable to people who offer medications/compounds/whatever that are not shown in an objective way to be beneficial.

I am painfully aware of the limitations of the available treatments, and that many patients may receive little or no benefit from any traditional and/or approved therapy.  Still others receive some benefit as to the shrinkage of a solid tumor or metastases, but at a tremendous cost due to the side effects.  Others benefit for a while, and then the drug loses effectiveness.

A careful reading of the studies and an understanding of how those studies may or may not be translated into clinical practice shows that much of this is still a guessing game--but at least there is some data on which to make those guesses. Doctors and researchers use the group's experience, and must try to apply it to one individual, with the natural weakness of that approach.

There are many classes of agents used against many diferent types of cancers, and probably too little ability to sort out who has the best CHANCE of responding to any one agent.

Some chemos kill cells directly, with the fast growing cancer cells being killed the fastest, but still killing normal cells.  Radiation does the same, and is most effective with faster-growing cancers.

Other attempt to starve the growth of tumors, cutting off blood supply to the tumors, again taking advantage of the growth factors which differ from the normal, slower-growing cell.

The medication which saved my life eleven years ago revved up my immune system which becme hypersensitive to my 100s of kidney cancer mets.  That response was unusual, and in my case, durable.  Other patients who might be described as the "same" as me have not responded.  Many doctors won't recommend that drug, as it has tough, though passing, side effects. And the chance of responding well is low.  Some doctors know how to sort out the patient most likely to respond, and know how to maximize the use of the drug to elicit that response.

It is the careful analysis of the patient, the type of cancer, the current interaction of the cancer and the immune system, the interactions of other medications, such as the anti-angiogenesis drugs with the other drugs, the body's ability to recover from side effects and much more which has to be taken into consideration.

It is the lack of this careful consideration that worries me in this discussion of this single compound, without all the other factors that must be examined at the same time.

I ask that patients be given all the data about their disease, about the research, about the options, about their own general health, about clinical trials, about basic biology and so on, so they can make the best decision in this very challenging and heartbreaking process.

I think we would agree that this is more helpful to be cautious and informed than to over react to the limited information that we have seen in this thread.

Peggy,

I appreciate your concern and the fact that you have spent many years studying, analyzing, and researching cancer--and the many aspects of prospective treatments.

However, I have yet to see any "careful analysis of the patient" in my own circumstances--along with any doctors being concerned with my body's ability to recover from side effects of any medications they have advised me to take.

Instead I have encountered arrogant and ignorant persons in that field who have failed to listen to my concerns and needs.  Never was I rude or impolite--but they were--and yet I think I was, no doubt, branded as an uncooperative patient at times.  When I quietly and sincerely voiced my concerns about the usage of bisphosphanates--as I have quite a detailed  dental history--the oncologist's only response was this:  "one injection a month for 12 months."  No interest in asking me to inquire of my dentist for his opinion first and then determining whether I was a candidate for this drug--no, just a glaring look of dismissal of my concerns.  I quietly sat there--appalled--yet continued to be respectful.  I knew that wrongful usage of these could cause irreversible jaw necrosis---and I was mortified that no interest was shown in my dental history prior to usage.  I will not be led blindly down that alley.

Well, the list could go on and on about mistreatment from those with whom I always respected--my father being a doctor--he died in 1965.  A long time ago--and now I no longer take for granted that those in medical authority have my best interests at heart.  Yes, there are some real gems out there that still do truly care and help patients to make the best decisions possible in this very challenging and heartbreaking process--to use your own words.

But what I do not understand is why you are interested in 3-BP at all and comment about it--mostly negatively?  Yes, we as patients must educate ourselves--most of us never thought we would have to do so much reading and researching on our own.  We thought we could entrust our health to those who were educated in medical schools.  Well, that is not always the case as most must work within certain AMA parameters or else they will not be accepted by their peers--and, most likely, will not be allowed hospital privileges.

So that leaves us to continue to search and learn--and right now, for most of us, 3-BP is offering us much hope.  True, we do not know everything about it yet.  But the alternatives that have been offered to us via mainstream medicine are not very palatable either.  And not always proved--and not always life-giving nor giving quality of life.

I know that you mean well with most of what you are sharing---and that we must all be cautious.  But most of us do not have much time remaining if we continue to just wait for conventional means to bail us out of our dilemma.  We need hope and we need to try something else.  Right now--that is 3-BP--along with other supportive treatments.  No singular treatment is the magic silver bullet--but we must continue to examine the positive aspects of 3-BP and move forward with it as best as possible.

I give  the highest credit to Dr. Ko and her research---and her love for people. She is not doing this for any glory--she is doing it so that people can have hope for their future.  Her story is one of courage and caring--despite the negative actions of others. And I admire the doctors who are doing cryoablation and improving quality of life for their patients.  What a tremendous breakthrough it will be when cryo can be used for breast cancer patients!

It all sounds good when you mentioned that you would like patients to be given all the data about their disease, about the research, about the options, about their own general health, about clinical trials, about basic biology--so that they can make the best decision.  Frankly, right now I consider that a pipe dream---yes, it is the right thing for a patient to learn--but I have not encountered it in the past 3 years since being diagnosed with Stage IV breast cancer--and I sincerely doubt that many others have either.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 05:36 PM
Quote | ReplyI can see why she's overly critical of the thread. I'll use my own example: I'm a 24 year old with a supposedly very aggressive (supposedly) Stage IV cancer (extra pulmonary small cell carcinoma). The mets are unconfirmed to be cancerous as they're acting somewhat weirdly and not growing much at all and are very small (6mm at the largest), so my treatment isn't imminent. I've finished primary treatment and now I have a choice between clinical trials and 3BP. Someone in my position has the luxury of time to decide whether they want to do 3BP treatment; what if I saw this thread and the scores of nothing but enthusiastic posts about findings that don't warrant enthusiasm and made the wrong choice? It's not just end stage patients that are affected by this.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMeech90

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 05:43 PM
Quote | ReplyThat said, I think being hopeful for 3BP or any other therapy is a great thing. I believe that it can work (Romans 5:3-5), I just don't like seeing only positives extrapolated from a complex situation. It really obfuscates the real meaning of what is happening.Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 23, 2015 05:50 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 9:36 PM Meech90 wrote:

I can see why she's overly critical of the thread. I'll use my own example: I'm a 24 year old with a supposedly very aggressive (supposedly) Stage IV cancer (extra pulmonary small cell carcinoma). The mets are unconfirmed to be cancerous as they're acting somewhat weirdly and not growing much at all and are very small (6mm at the largest), so my treatment isn't imminent. I've finished primary treatment and now I have a choice between clinical trials and 3BP. Someone in my position has the luxury of time to decide whether they want to do 3BP treatment; what if I saw this thread and the scores of nothing but enthusiastic posts about findings that don't warrant enthusiasm and made the wrong choice? It's not just end stage patients that are affected by this.Well, that is where it would behoove you to take the time you have to research what mainstream oncology can offer --and compare it with the history of 3-BP--from inception until now.

Have the doctors explain the clinical trials and everything involved.  It would be wise of you to do so.  When some of these drugs work, they can be real winners--just as what happened with Peggy.  Yet, she also said others did not respond as she did with the same treatment.  So the ball will be in your court with any final decision.

With end-stage patients, time is of the essence. And, generally, we are not offered many chances of trials.  The one cryoablation trial I read about involves the patient being 65 or over, the tumor being rather small (I think it was 1.5 cm--not sure), and some other criteria that limits the people that would be qualified for the study.  Understandable--but not helpful to many of us to get help right now--before it is too late.

I wish you only the best in making the right decision for your case, Meech90.  And I am truly glad that you have the time and opportunity to learn more about various treatments and trials.

But I will continue to be enthusiastic and hopeful about 3-BP--and will eagerly await any news about more findings and results of it usage.  Frankly, I have no other recourse.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 06:07 PM
Quote | ReplyI encourage you to be hopeful :) it'll do nothing but help. I am also hopeful for 3BP but I just don't feel like misrepresenting information is really helping anybody right now. Have you made plans to begin with 3BP?Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterjetsparkle

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Wed Sep 23, 2015 06:26 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 10:07 PM Meech90 wrote:

I encourage you to be hopeful :) it'll do nothing but help. I am also hopeful for 3BP but I just don't feel like misrepresenting information is really helping anybody right now. Have you made plans to begin with 3BP?Thank you for  your kind words, Meech90.   I know that you have very serious decisions to be made, too--and truly, truly wish you the very best.

Plans are being made--albeit small ones. Somehow I think I need the full gamut--but one step at a time for now.

Yes, we all need hope--and, yes, sometimes we can get overly enthusiastic on the thread--but I do think we are on the right track and we can sift through the information with a discerning eye.  Every  bit of information we can glean aboug 3-BP helps us to make decisions.

So, please, as a side note to Peggy--your input can be helpful.  But careful usage of words is of the essence here amongst those who are fighting for their lives.  Caution and research, yes--but don't dim that glimmer of hope we need in order to move forward.  We have heard your words of warning--and we are not ignoring them.  But some of us are hanging on by a thread-- have both  exhausted and been exhausted by conventional medicine's offerings.  Don't throw too much water on the flame that is still there.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Wed Sep 23, 2015 06:35 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 9:43 PM Meech90 wrote:

That said, I think being hopeful for 3BP or any other therapy is a great thing. I believe that it can work (Romans 5:3-5), I just don't like seeing only positives extrapolated from a complex situation. It really obfuscates the real meaning of what is happening.Meech90, I am sorry to hear abouth the challenges you have to encounter at your age. Btw, I like very much your way of thinking and communicating. I have little time to discuss again my views on 3BP but that is reflected in the text on my website. I guess you know very well your conventional options. What I can suggest is that besides considering 3BP you shoudl have a look at Salinomycin since I think it was suggested to work very well for small cell lung cancer. Next to that, don't losse time and start applying immunotheraphies. There are many private clinics offering good immuno options. When the tumors are small the chance is high for many to work.

Peggy, I guess you havent heard of experimental treatments and clinical trials. When starting a new treatment there is a lot of science and no statistics on humans. Yes, when there is no statistics the risks are higher. This is why new treatments are only offered to those with no other options. As you can see, most of the posters have already tried the conventional treatments or there are no real conventional treatments for their specific case.

Btw peggy, have you seen http://www.survivingterminalcancer.com/
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 23, 2015 07:01 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 9:26 PM Meech90 wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 7:07 PM peggyznd wrote:

"we need to stop getting carried away" is right, as a quick review of this thread will show that there is no real verifiable benefit for any defined patient group.  We have discussed/mixed multiple types of cancers, patients, delivery systems, strengths, variations on the basic compound, the contamination and/or mixed strengths and so on.  Just imagine going into some clinic where the med being offered varied from day to day, was supposed to fix all ailments for all, and had no track record of success.  Having a report of a single patient having been treated is not the same as having a history of reliable and beneficial response to some medication.

The sad part of all of this is that we all wish desperately that there was a single magic bullet to combat the 100s of cancers which are found in millions of different people, and with that magic bullet, cure them all.  It ain't going to happen, guys, wish as hard as we can.
I think you've gone too far in the other direction by saying "it ain't gonna happen". There are commonalities within all cancers that therapy can exploit in all likelihood. Just because we haven't found something to cure most forms, doesn't mean we won't. The model for searching for a cure for the past half a century was to attack the genetic mutations which cause cancer, ignoring the fact that genetic mutations aren't proven to be causative and can be a byproduct of an earlier cause. Also it was done under the assumption that there are only a minute amount of oncogenes when that has recently been found to be untrue. Essentially, 60 years of research has basically been potentially wasted hunting something with potentially the wrong thesis in mind.And that, Meech, is how this whole 3BP thread came about - the pitfalls (and politics) chasing down genes and their switches is one step ahead of where we should be - that is, focusing on the causes of genetic mutation and switching. The thing that starts the cancer process in the first place. It is this, combined with a less-than-stellar immune response that precipitates the genetic changes. Is it the person's terrain? Stress? Many factors? Two combined? Which two? Chasing the genetic changes is going after a moving target as even the same tumour will contain many mutations. So much money and effort wasted here.

Let's not forget, Peggy, that Johns Hopkins and (MDA?) are also very interested in this drug. It's not some random thing like the ooze from a deep sea sponge found only under cedar logs on Long Beach.  We are just attempting to get there first as most of us don't have 7+ years to wait.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 23, 2015 08:03 PM
Quote | ReplyThank you Jet and Moon for your encouragement not to retire. I was ready to take up shuffle board, and work on my tan-- full time: there is just so much to look forward to in retirement. Um... Thank you for rescuing me!

This thread is back! Yeah!! There are still some willing to nay say. Well so much the better.

There has just been so much good news that keeps on drifting its way to our thread. It really is amazing. There have been admittedly a fairly small number of patients reported that appear to have benefited from 3-BP, though these successes keep on coming. As I mentioned it is all the more impressive because success with 3-BP appears to happen quickly. The liver patient might have been one of the world's first people treated with 3-BP. Apparently the Indian clinic that we are receiving reports of success from is the only known 3-BP treater in that country.

Then there are the growing list of 3-BP patients: The 2 primary liver patients at Hopkins, the liver patient, the melanoma patient, the lung cancer patient, the pancreatic patient, the breast cancer patient, the HCC patient in India and another HCC patient from there, reports of responses (though perhaps not lasting ones from Atlanta), successes from the German clinic ( which apparently has recently undergone some management changes), responses of uncertain credibility from The Phillippines, the Gofund me bile duct patient among others.

Note: The Gofundme bile duct patient recently passed away. The thread will surely sadly say goodbye to such a vibrant and caring person. It should be noted that this patient was under treatment by the large medical cancer organization that hosts this forum. I find it encouraging that such a respected and knowledgeable organization would choose 3-BP for their patient. It is also encouraging that after only 1 or 2 weeks of 3-BP treatment this patient's markers were  declining. It is not clear to me why it was then decided to stop 3-BP treatment. The conventional treatments that were tried afterwards were, as expected, not effective.

For those who note that 3-BP is untested and unproven, I am sure we would all be very interested in what specific alternative treatment you might suggest. Many people on this thread have run out of conventional options. In fact many of their doctors after years of failing to provide treatments of any value to them finally fired them and told them to prepare their affairs.

For such patients an overly strict warning about the dangers of 3-BP is in itself a form of advice and for terminal patients it can be dangerous.

In Fool's Paradise there are never any difficult choices. You can have more ice cream or more chocolate or more of both. Terminally ill cancer patients are not offered such options. We need to provide helpful advice for people even when there is not complete information.

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 23, 2015 09:30 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 9:43 PM Meech90 wrote:

That said, I think being hopeful for 3BP or any other therapy is a great thing. I believe that it can work (Romans 5:3-5), I just don't like seeing only positives extrapolated from a complex situation. It really obfuscates the real meaning of what is happening.Meech, first I am sorry about your having cancer at age 24. That is just so wrong on a number of levels. I am curious though, as you are obviously very educated and intelligent, why would you say that in reading the enthusiastic comments here, you could be swayed? I ask because there has to be a point where you either believe/try something or decide it is quackery. For example, I can read on and on about a machine that changes the body enough to get rid of cancer. I decide it is complete rubbish, based on research that I pull and my own suspicions. Therefore I do not believe in this line that the feds and oncology folks like to bandy around - that alternative/integrative/outside of the box treatments take people away from the standard of care that could benefit them and are therefore dangerous. We have free will and we should use it as it contains more intelligence than allowing someone who has basically been brainwashed to be in charge of our care. Certainly the oncologists I have met have been brainwashed, or appear to have been. It's all about collecting a paycheque and never, ever questioning or considering anything out of the box. I would not entrust my life to that attitude.

In the case of 3BP, I am cautiously optimistic based on the chemistry/physiology, which makes sense, but I also give a variety of other treatments to approach the cancer and get it to leave. Angiogenesis inhibitors, tubulin inhibitors and a few other things to stifle its various mechanisms. I don't see everyone enthusiastically endorsing 3BP. The three people I know who are using it do so intelligently and with an open mind. If they see results of a positive nature, they say so, but also, if they are not seeing any positive results, my husband for example, on topical.  Anyway I am rambling on here and likely not making much sense as I need fodder and a cup of tea. Wishing you well.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:31 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 1:30 AM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 9:43 PM Meech90 wrote:

That said, I think being hopeful for 3BP or any other therapy is a great thing. I believe that it can work (Romans 5:3-5), I just don't like seeing only positives extrapolated from a complex situation. It really obfuscates the real meaning of what is happening.Meech, first I am sorry about your having cancer at age 24. That is just so wrong on a number of levels. I am curious though, as you are obviously very educated and intelligent, why would you say that in reading the enthusiastic comments here, you could be swayed? I ask because there has to be a point where you either believe/try something or decide it is quackery. For example, I can read on and on about a machine that changes the body enough to get rid of cancer. I decide it is complete rubbish, based on research that I pull and my own suspicions. Therefore I do not believe in this line that the feds and oncology folks like to bandy around - that alternative/integrative/outside of the box treatments take people away from the standard of care that could benefit them and are therefore dangerous. We have free will and we should use it as it contains more intelligence than allowing someone who has basically been brainwashed to be in charge of our care. Certainly the oncologists I have met have been brainwashed, or appear to have been. It's all about collecting a paycheque and never, ever questioning or considering anything out of the box. I would not entrust my life to that attitude.

In the case of 3BP, I am cautiously optimistic based on the chemistry/physiology, which makes sense, but I also give a variety of other treatments to approach the cancer and get it to leave. Angiogenesis inhibitors, tubulin inhibitors and a few other things to stifle its various mechanisms. I don't see everyone enthusiastically endorsing 3BP. The three people I know who are using it do so intelligently and with an open mind. If they see results of a positive nature, they say so, but also, if they are not seeing any positive results, my husband for example, on topical.  Anyway I am rambling on here and likely not making much sense as I need fodder and a cup of tea. Wishing you well.
I think it'd be easier to be swayed by something that legitimately seems like it could work and then seeing overly optimistic comments about it. Personally, I'm not swayed by the overt optimism but I am considering the 3BP route. But I'd imagine someone who hasn't done much research on this and enters the thread could easily expect the world based on overly optimistic posts. I think cautious optimism is great but to be overly positive to the point of misrepresenting what data says, because you're only seeing what you want to see, might be dangerous.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMeech90

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:35 PM
Quote | Reply@jet, really hope it works out for you and I hope you can manage to get the treatment sooner rather than later. @Daniel: thanks for the words, and thanks for the Salinomycin suggestion. I saw the doctors in Colombia were using that in combination with the 3BP. So we'll see what I decide. Lot of immunotherapy options - none for my cancer type really - but I believe a good amount would be open to recruiting a young patient with excellent performance status. Like I said earlier; I was told that my hospital in Toronto (PMH) is experimenting with 3BP so I might even be able to receive it in a clinical setting.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterJcancom

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:07 PM
Quote | ReplyBest Wishes Meech. It must be very difficult at such a young age to be facing such a challenge.

Perhaps you could look into the 401 clinic. The 3-BP trials have been delayed so perpetually that it is not clear there is any intention of ever starting a trial. With all the gray market 3-BP treatment perhaps the regulators will simply keep an eye on what is happening and not intervene. It seems very reasonable to me to at least consider sub-therapeutic dosing to determine whether you might be a 3-BP responder. Too many people wait until nothing can help them.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 24, 2015 03:27 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 2:35 AM Meech90 wrote:

@jet, really hope it works out for you and I hope you can manage to get the treatment sooner rather than later. @Daniel: thanks for the words, and thanks for the Salinomycin suggestion. I saw the doctors in Colombia were using that in combination with the 3BP. So we'll see what I decide. Lot of immunotherapy options - none for my cancer type really - but I believe a good amount would be open to recruiting a young patient with excellent performance status. Like I said earlier; I was told that my hospital in Toronto (PMH) is experimenting with 3BP so I might even be able to receive it in a clinical setting.**Thank you for your very kind words of encouragement, Meech90.  They are much appreciated.**

**You have quite a decision to make--and I feel that Daniel gave you excellent advice.  He certainly has your welfare at heart--as we all do.   Tackle this problem as soon as you determine what is best for you.  Although younger than most of us, you certainly have a very thoughtful and intelligent presence--you indeed will sort this out with much forethought.**

**Your input here on the thread is appreciated, too--best to you, Meech90!  Please keep us updated.**
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### RE: HOW YOU CAN CURE YOUR CANCER WITH RICKSIMPSON CANNABIS OIL???

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 24, 2015 11:39 AM
Quote | ReplyAh, we have a testimonial for Rick Simpson oil (which did nothing for my husband's prostate cancer, nor my friend's breast cancer). But again, YMMV.
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### RE: HOW YOU CAN CURE YOUR CANCER WITH RICKSIMPSON CANNABIS OIL???

by peggyznd on Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:42 PM
Quote | ReplyThe branded cannabis oil promo is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about.  Again, the most vulnerable among us needs protection from this kind of thing.
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### RE: HOW YOU CAN CURE YOUR CANCER WITH RICKSIMPSON CANNABIS OIL???

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:51 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 4:42 PM peggyznd wrote:

The branded cannabis oil promo is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about.  Again, the most vulnerable among us needs protection from this kind of thing.
I, for one, would never put furthering 3-BP information in the same category as the above-mentioned cannabis promo.

I actually do know of some people whose pain has been eased by the usage of cannabiis oil--so I will not disparage it entirely. Of course, I would be more on the side of the CBD and not the THC oil.

And then there have been studies where young children suffering from severe seizures are being helped with the CBD cannabis oil.  Sanjay Gupta--a neurologist--put together quite a program about this.  His eyes were opened to its properties in this regard.

And don't forget the harm that many conventional drugs for cancer cause to people--so there is no perfect answer here either.

Vulnerability can come in many instances--blindly following conventional or holistic means can be dangerous.
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### RE: HOW YOU CAN CURE YOUR CANCER WITH RICKSIMPSON CANNABIS OIL???

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 24, 2015 01:25 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 4:51 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Sep 24, 2015 4:42 PM peggyznd wrote:

The branded cannabis oil promo is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about.  Again, the most vulnerable among us needs protection from this kind of thing.
I, for one, would never put furthering 3-BP information in the same category as the above-mentioned cannabis promo.

I actually do know of some people whose pain has been eased by the usage of cannabiis oil--so I will not disparage it entirely. Of course, I would be more on the side of the CBD and not the THC oil.

And then there have been studies where young children suffering from severe seizures are being helped with the CBD cannabis oil.  Sanjay Gupta--a neurologist--put together quite a program about this.  His eyes were opened to its properties in this regard.

And don't forget the harm that many conventional drugs for cancer cause to people--so there is no perfect answer here either.

Vulnerability can come in many instances--blindly following conventional or holistic means can be dangerous.
That testimonial appears on many pages if you Google it. It's just an ad for RSO (which can easily be made up at home). I would like to add here that cannabinoids have value as painkillers and glioma, as well as many other cancers I am sure. And yes, it is true that our cells have two cannabinoid receptors. I certainly do not feel that mentioning or exploring use of cannabinoids exploits the most vulnerable. Once again, it is an avenue that needs careful exploration and not trite phrases thrown about by closed-minded people. As Jetsparkle points out, cannabis has produced wonderful effects in children with seizures, and I'll add for patients with specific cancers. It is also a powerful analgesic and anti-nauseant. Our medical oncologist wrote us a prescription for it when my husband was experiencing knee pain.
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### RE: HOW YOU CAN CURE YOUR CANCER WITH RICKSIMPSON CANNABIS OIL???

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 24, 2015 01:30 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 5:25 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 24, 2015 4:51 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Sep 24, 2015 4:42 PM peggyznd wrote:

The branded cannabis oil promo is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about.  Again, the most vulnerable among us needs protection from this kind of thing.
I, for one, would never put furthering 3-BP information in the same category as the above-mentioned cannabis promo.

I actually do know of some people whose pain has been eased by the usage of cannabiis oil--so I will not disparage it entirely. Of course, I would be more on the side of the CBD and not the THC oil.

And then there have been studies where young children suffering from severe seizures are being helped with the CBD cannabis oil.  Sanjay Gupta--a neurologist--put together quite a program about this.  His eyes were opened to its properties in this regard.

And don't forget the harm that many conventional drugs for cancer cause to people--so there is no perfect answer here either.

Vulnerability can come in many instances--blindly following conventional or holistic means can be dangerous.
That testimonial appears on many pages if you Google it. It's just an ad for RSO (which can easily be made up at home). I would like to add here that cannabinoids have value as painkillers and glioma, as well as many other cancers I am sure. And yes, it is true that our cells have two cannabinoid receptors. I certainly do not feel that mentioning or exploring use of cannabinoids exploits the most vulnerable. Once again, it is an avenue that needs careful exploration and not trite phrases thrown about by closed-minded people. As Jetsparkle points out, cannabis has produced wonderful effects in children with seizures, and I'll add for patients with specific cancers. It is also a powerful analgesic and anti-nauseant. Our medical oncologist wrote us a prescription for it when my husband was experiencing knee pain.
Well said, my friend!
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### 3-Bromopyruvate

by Meech90 on Thu Sep 24, 2015 02:07 PM
Quote | ReplyJust posting to change the thread title back for Google searches, etc.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMoonlitnight

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### RE: 3-Bromopyruvate

by Moonlitnight on Thu Sep 24, 2015 02:09 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 6:07 PM Meech90 wrote:

Just posting to change the thread title back for Google searches, etc.How did that even get changed, Meech? I didn't think one could change subject lines. Thank you.
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### RE: 3-Bromopyruvate

by jetsparkle on Thu Sep 24, 2015 02:29 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 6:07 PM Meech90 wrote:

Just posting to change the thread title back for Google searches, etc.See, Meech90, we truly need your "youth" and savvy on this thread!

Thanks for re-focusing the thread title--must have changed when we replied to the RSH oil promo....
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Sep 25, 2015 11:30 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 23, 2015 11:01 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 9:26 PM Meech90 wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 7:07 PM peggyznd wrote:

"we need to stop getting carried away" is right, as a quick review of this thread will show that there is no real verifiable benefit for any defined patient group.  We have discussed/mixed multiple types of cancers, patients, delivery systems, strengths, variations on the basic compound, the contamination and/or mixed strengths and so on.  Just imagine going into some clinic where the med being offered varied from day to day, was supposed to fix all ailments for all, and had no track record of success.  Having a report of a single patient having been treated is not the same as having a history of reliable and beneficial response to some medication.

The sad part of all of this is that we all wish desperately that there was a single magic bullet to combat the 100s of cancers which are found in millions of different people, and with that magic bullet, cure them all.  It ain't going to happen, guys, wish as hard as we can.
I think you've gone too far in the other direction by saying "it ain't gonna happen". There are commonalities within all cancers that therapy can exploit in all likelihood. Just because we haven't found something to cure most forms, doesn't mean we won't. The model for searching for a cure for the past half a century was to attack the genetic mutations which cause cancer, ignoring the fact that genetic mutations aren't proven to be causative and can be a byproduct of an earlier cause. Also it was done under the assumption that there are only a minute amount of oncogenes when that has recently been found to be untrue. Essentially, 60 years of research has basically been potentially wasted hunting something with potentially the wrong thesis in mind.And that, Meech, is how this whole 3BP thread came about - the pitfalls (and politics) chasing down genes and their switches is one step ahead of where we should be - that is, focusing on the causes of genetic mutation and switching. The thing that starts the cancer process in the first place. It is this, combined with a less-than-stellar immune response that precipitates the genetic changes. Is it the person's terrain? Stress? Many factors? Two combined? Which two? Chasing the genetic changes is going after a moving target as even the same tumour will contain many mutations. So much money and effort wasted here.

Let's not forget, Peggy, that Johns Hopkins and (MDA?) are also very interested in this drug. It's not some random thing like the ooze from a deep sea sponge found only under cedar logs on Long Beach.  We are just attempting to get there first as most of us don't have 7+ years to wait.
Thought that the article I read this morning on the internet validly supports Moonlitnight's response speaking about the pitfalls of "chasing down genes".

The article is entitled: Cells' Lack of Glucose Dulls Immune System's Ability to Fight".

Basics of the article include stating that "one of scientists' great hopes in fighting cancer is the immune system."  However, cancer cells have many strategies for avoiding attacks from such.

Researchers at Washington University School of Medicine in St. Louis have identified a new strategy.  They found that if tumor cells take in enough glucose from their immediate environments, they effectively starve T cells and render them unable to attack.

"Glycolysis always was thought to be a more reliable way to fuel cancers/ rapid growth. But the new study suggests that glycolysis offers another advantage to cancer cells:  It serves to nutritionally incapacitate T cells, thereby preventing them from mounting an optimal immune response against tumors."

This was then identified as a "tug of war for sugar between tumors and T cells."  So scientists are interested in better understanding how to use the immune system to fight cancer.

Thus all of the new and valid interest in immunological drugs.

Meanwhile, 3-BP has always used the more simplistic idea of glycolysis as a basis for attacking cancer cells if they show up on PET scans.  Using 3-BP with supplemental immune boosters/drugs, nutrition/diet, cryoablation,  and other supportive therapies seems to be an optimal choice for those whose cancers show up on these scans--rather than just the trio of surgery, chemotherapy, and radiation.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Sep 25, 2015 11:33 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 25, 2015 3:30 PM jetsparkle wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 11:01 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 9:26 PM Meech90 wrote:

On Sep 23, 2015 7:07 PM peggyznd wrote:

"we need to stop getting carried away" is right, as a quick review of this thread will show that there is no real verifiable benefit for any defined patient group.  We have discussed/mixed multiple types of cancers, patients, delivery systems, strengths, variations on the basic compound, the contamination and/or mixed strengths and so on.  Just imagine going into some clinic where the med being offered varied from day to day, was supposed to fix all ailments for all, and had no track record of success.  Having a report of a single patient having been treated is not the same as having a history of reliable and beneficial response to some medication.

The sad part of all of this is that we all wish desperately that there was a single magic bullet to combat the 100s of cancers which are found in millions of different people, and with that magic bullet, cure them all.  It ain't going to happen, guys, wish as hard as we can.
I think you've gone too far in the other direction by saying "it ain't gonna happen". There are commonalities within all cancers that therapy can exploit in all likelihood. Just because we haven't found something to cure most forms, doesn't mean we won't. The model for searching for a cure for the past half a century was to attack the genetic mutations which cause cancer, ignoring the fact that genetic mutations aren't proven to be causative and can be a byproduct of an earlier cause. Also it was done under the assumption that there are only a minute amount of oncogenes when that has recently been found to be untrue. Essentially, 60 years of research has basically been potentially wasted hunting something with potentially the wrong thesis in mind.And that, Meech, is how this whole 3BP thread came about - the pitfalls (and politics) chasing down genes and their switches is one step ahead of where we should be - that is, focusing on the causes of genetic mutation and switching. The thing that starts the cancer process in the first place. It is this, combined with a less-than-stellar immune response that precipitates the genetic changes. Is it the person's terrain? Stress? Many factors? Two combined? Which two? Chasing the genetic changes is going after a moving target as even the same tumour will contain many mutations. So much money and effort wasted here.

Let's not forget, Peggy, that Johns Hopkins and (MDA?) are also very interested in this drug. It's not some random thing like the ooze from a deep sea sponge found only under cedar logs on Long Beach.  We are just attempting to get there first as most of us don't have 7+ years to wait.
Thought that the article I read this morning on the internet validly supports Moonlitnight's response speaking about the pitfalls of "chasing down genes".

The article is entitled: Cells' Lack of Glucose Dulls Immune System's Ability to Fight".

Basics of the article include stating that "one of scientists' great hopes in fighting cancer is the immune system."  However, cancer cells have many strategies for avoiding attacks from such.

Researchers at Washington University School of Medicine in St. Louis have identified a new strategy.  They found that if tumor cells take in enough glucose from their immediate environments, they effectively starve T cells and render them unable to attack.

"Glycolysis always was thought to be a more reliable way to fuel cancers/ rapid growth. But the new study suggests that glycolysis offers another advantage to cancer cells:  It serves to nutritionally incapacitate T cells, thereby preventing them from mounting an optimal immune response against tumors."

This was then identified as a "tug of war for sugar between tumors and T cells."  So scientists are interested in better understanding how to use the immune system to fight cancer.

Thus all of the new and valid interest in immunological drugs.

Meanwhile, 3-BP has always used the more simplistic idea of glycolysis as a basis for attacking cancer cells if they show up on PET scans.  Using 3-BP with supplemental immune boosters/drugs, nutrition/diet, cryoablation,  and other supportive therapies seems to be an optimal choice for those whose cancers show up on these scans--rather than just the trio of surgery, chemotherapy, and radiation.
Here is the  article:

http://medicalexpress.com/news/2015-09-cells-lack-glucose-du
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Fri Sep 25, 2015 11:36 AM
Quote | ReplyWell, that did not go through very well!

http://medicalexpress.com/news/2015-09-cells-lack-glucose-

dulls-immune.html
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:25 PM
Quote | ReplyI have got an idea percolating any suggestions before I add the milk and sugar would be appreciated.

We could start a crowdfunding campaign to investigate the genetics of 3-BP response. Studies have already shown that the main determinant of 3-BP's effectiveness is the MCT-1 protein. 3-BP is a ridiculously powerful anti-cancer drug. The main problem (perhaps one of the only problems) is that for some people 3-BP simply cannot gain access to the cell. When 3-BP was coupled to a postive ion (tug boat) in the form of Mito 3-BP, there was an order or two larger anti-cancer response than even with 3-BP.

A genetic study found that the gene that encodes MCT-1 SLC16A1 is by far the most important genetic factor in 3-BP's effectiveness.

I have examined the exome sequence of a family member. I noticed a few variants in their SLC16A1 gene: a somewhat common missense variant, an very rare regulatory region variant among others.

My idea is to raise money and study the implications of such variants on 3-BP response. There have been a crowdfunding campaign already for a cancer patient in order to be treated with 3-BP. However, funding such a patient would not unlock why some respond to 3-BP and some do not. If we could start up a crowdfunding campaign we might be able to discover such a link. This would be enormously important information for humanity! Simply taking a treatment that will never work because of the wrong genetics, is a waste of time and money. With a genetic approach we could predict responders before treatment was even started. Perhaps an entire computerized database could be established to find those treatments that would be helpful.

This would appear to be a not too bad an idea. Instead of helping one patient, everyone everywhere might benefit from this research. With such a large potential market of potential contributors it would be easy to finance the research. The research itself might not even have to be that expensive. Of course, we have some on the thread who have been treated with 3-BP. It might be interesting to find out why some have had success and others not.

In terms of actually doing the science of the project, I have received online ads for lab researchers that are commercial. About all you have to do is write a cheque and tell them what to do and they'll take care of it for you. Sounds great!

Comments PLEASE!

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:49 PM
Quote | Reply"The highest scoring gene, SLC16A1, encodes MCT1, an H+ linked monocarboxylate transporter that excretes lactate from cells and is highly upregulated in a subset of cancers. The second highest scoring gene, Basigin, is a chaperone necessary for escorting MCT1 to the plasma membrane"

"Strikingly, of the 20,000 mRNAs examined, SLC16A1 mRNA levels were the single best predictor of 3-BrPA sensitivity"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3530647/
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Fri Sep 25, 2015 04:43 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 24, 2015 2:35 AM Meech90 wrote:

@jet, really hope it works out for you and I hope you can manage to get the treatment sooner rather than later. @Daniel: thanks for the words, and thanks for the Salinomycin suggestion. I saw the doctors in Colombia were using that in combination with the 3BP. So we'll see what I decide. Lot of immunotherapy options - none for my cancer type really - but I believe a good amount would be open to recruiting a young patient with excellent performance status. Like I said earlier; I was told that my hospital in Toronto (PMH) is experimenting with 3BP so I might even be able to receive it in a clinical setting.Yes, there are some clinics administrating Sal which may be even more relevant for your case. Immunotheraphies can also be accessed at private clinics at accessible costs - no need to wait for a possible trial - they are in general relevant for most cancers. But in that case you need to go to some well know clinics. Such loccations can be found in US and Germany.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 25, 2015 05:29 PM
Quote | ReplyNow this is interesting: a super duper ketogenic agent.

{ (R)-3-oxobutyl 3-hydroxybutanoate (OBHB) }

"hyperketonemiain" almost sounds too super duper.

Obviously one wonders how this might help in cancer.

"Earlier people used prolonged fasting or a very high-fat and very low-carbohydrate containing diet to raise the plasma KB levels [5,11]. However, the side effects like dehydration, urate nephrolithiasis, substantial weight changes, and amenorrhea associated with these methods hindered their applicability.

Ketone monoester (KME), the reduced derivative of OBHB has undergone extensive animal and human toxicity tests  and was declared to be safe by Food and Drug Administration.  ...

KME can be a safe and promising agent to induced hyperketonemia and can be administered regularly as a food supplement without changing the habitual diet."

Might be time for to load up the shopping cart on Sigma. This has already been deemed by the FDA to be GRAS. I am not sure whether sneaking around would even be necessary.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4509263/
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Fri Sep 25, 2015 08:44 PM
Quote | ReplyThis is fairly exciting news.

Up until now the level of ketosis that could be achieved using ketogenic approaches was typically on the range of 0.1 mM. This new treatment is moving towards continuous levels of 6-8 mM!  In addition it can take quite a bit of effort using other approaches. This seems so much easier.  6-8 mM might be a good range for cancer treatment. (not sure about this, we have talked about this issue several times before).
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by venum on Sat Sep 26, 2015 11:12 AM
Quote | ReplyCF102 for hepatocellular carcinoma (HCC) seems to be in news now.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/canf-fite-biopharma-looking-tr
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Sat Sep 26, 2015 04:17 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 25, 2015 8:43 PM Danielus wrote:

On Sep 24, 2015 2:35 AM Meech90 wrote:

@jet, really hope it works out for you and I hope you can manage to get the treatment sooner rather than later. @Daniel: thanks for the words, and thanks for the Salinomycin suggestion. I saw the doctors in Colombia were using that in combination with the 3BP. So we'll see what I decide. Lot of immunotherapy options - none for my cancer type really - but I believe a good amount would be open to recruiting a young patient with excellent performance status. Like I said earlier; I was told that my hospital in Toronto (PMH) is experimenting with 3BP so I might even be able to receive it in a clinical setting.Yes, there are some clinics administrating Sal which may be even more relevant for your case. Immunotheraphies can also be accessed at private clinics at accessible costs - no need to wait for a possible trial - they are in general relevant for most cancers. But in that case you need to go to some well know clinics. Such loccations can be found in US and Germany.
I'll have to look for it. I keep all of my documents and have been looking for specific immunotherapy that targets proteins or genes that are overly expressed in my tumor type (according to my pathology report). I don't have a detailed genetic analysis on hand though nor do I know if one has been done so it's been slim in terms of what I can find for the preliminary genetic expressions.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterJcancom

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat Sep 26, 2015 04:20 PM
Quote | ReplyHas it been firmly established that PMH is experimenting with 3-BP? Is this in human patients?
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Sat Sep 26, 2015 05:53 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 26, 2015 8:20 PM Jcancom wrote:

Has it been firmly established that PMH is experimenting with 3-BP? Is this in human patients?
It has not. When I mentioned 3BP to my oncologist he wasn't very aware of it but he did say he believes PMH is conducting some phase I trials. I then mentioned 3BP to an oncology nurse who was administering my chemotherapy maybe a week later, without telling him that my oncologist had suggested that trials were being run at PMH (just telling him in general what the therapy is and how it works, etc.) and the nurse then also told me that there are patients receiving 3BP at PMH. I ended my 6 cycles in June, so it has been at least three months since these encounters (likely more than that). So I'm not 100%. I meet with the phase I people the Monday following this one and I'll ask about it there.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterJcancom

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat Sep 26, 2015 06:05 PM
Quote | ReplyUm, that is legal? Is it legal anywhere in the world to conduct such a trial? That is very surprising to me!

There are people all over the world monitoring our thread. We do the best that we can to piece everything together. Though having an actual clinical trial would obviously be of considerable interest to many people. They have been trying to start a phase 1 under the FDA for years now! Could PMH have pulled this off already?

I am simply amazed that doing an underground clinical trial at one of the world's premier cancer clinics would even be conceivable.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Meech90 on Sat Sep 26, 2015 06:54 PM
Quote | ReplyIt was likely a communication error or there's been approval. I'd say there's virtually no chance of it being 'underground'.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by dumbcritic on Sat Sep 26, 2015 09:04 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 26, 2015 8:17 PM Meech90 wrote:

On Sep 25, 2015 8:43 PM Danielus wrote:

On Sep 24, 2015 2:35 AM Meech90 wrote:

@jet, really hope it works out for you and I hope you can manage to get the treatment sooner rather than later. @Daniel: thanks for the words, and thanks for the Salinomycin suggestion. I saw the doctors in Colombia were using that in combination with the 3BP. So we'll see what I decide. Lot of immunotherapy options - none for my cancer type really - but I believe a good amount would be open to recruiting a young patient with excellent performance status. Like I said earlier; I was told that my hospital in Toronto (PMH) is experimenting with 3BP so I might even be able to receive it in a clinical setting.Yes, there are some clinics administrating Sal which may be even more relevant for your case. Immunotheraphies can also be accessed at private clinics at accessible costs - no need to wait for a possible trial - they are in general relevant for most cancers. But in that case you need to go to some well know clinics. Such loccations can be found in US and Germany.
I'll have to look for it. I keep all of my documents and have been looking for specific immunotherapy that targets proteins or genes that are overly expressed in my tumor type (according to my pathology report). I don't have a detailed genetic analysis on hand though nor do I know if one has been done so it's been slim in terms of what I can find for the preliminary genetic expressions.*Personalized* treatments vary across a spectrum. So you can have a standardized product which has standardized targets, but with personalized profiling. These are peptide vaccines, DNA vaccines and checkpoint inhibitors. Then you can have a personalized product but with standardized targets. These are CAR-Ts and dendritic cell vaccines with pre-selected peptide antigens. Then there are personalized products with personalized targets, like DCVax by NW Bio

So most of these are current treatments which are largely standardized, but not truely personalized. This raises 2 key issues… *Russian Roulette* In which the patient's tumor may or may not express the targets. (e.g., EGFRvIII mutation in GBM - only expressed on around 30% of GBMs). Or the fact tumors can and do stop expressing 1 or a few targets (antigens). But tumor cells cannot stop expressing all targets. So the only way forward in my view is a personalized product with personalized targets.

So this *turns on the immune system to find and fight the cancer cells. Then you may need to* release the brakes *with checkpoint inhibitors (e.g., Anti-CTLA4, Anti-PD1, Anti-LAG3, Anti-KIR, Anti-TIM3). You also may need to* push the gas *with co-stimulatory molecules (e.g., OX40), pro-inflammatory cytokines and/or cell trafficking molecules as well.*

The only way around some of this is by using an Anti-CD47 mab. This may cause an in-situ vaccine. It operates through macrophages (innate immune system) but can exert downstream effects on the adaptive immune system (T cells). It also mobilizes the immune system to attack the bulk of cancer cells and even cancer stem cells. Unless you can afford a DC vaccine?. But in order to make a DC vaccine you need some tumor.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Sat Sep 26, 2015 11:24 PM
Quote | ReplyHas anyone done a search of the clinicaltrials.gov  site to determine if there is even a mention of 3bp?  I cannot imagine that this is being done as "underground".  Whoever is aware of such trials, past or present, should be able to find the data, the prinicipal investigator, give the complete name of the medical center, and follow up to see what the latest update is available.

Phase I trials are done with very few patients as they are simply to determine if the drug is safe with a selected patient group.  Then they are taken to Phase II, if there is determination of safety to determine the level of dosage.  The large Phase III trials which really measure the effectiveness of the drug, and its side effects, the outcomes measured and so on are those which lead to FDA approval.

It is this process which is intended to protect patients, and give guidance to doctors and patients as to how a drug should be used, and wht to expect as to benefit and risk, though the general population may have both less benefit and greater risk than the study population.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sat Sep 26, 2015 11:32 PM
Quote | ReplyWanted everyone to be aware of what I have been reading up on.

The SLC16A1 gene which produces the MCT-1 protein has 7 splice variants, and is associated with 5 phenotypes (including several forms of cancer).

http://uswest.ensembl.org/Homo\_sapiens/Gene/Summary?db=core;

Samples from various tumor types were analyzed on the below url.

The interesting thing is that across most cancer types about 1 % of the tumors had overexpressed SLC16A1. A few also gained copy numbers. This is highly speculative, though it is possible for some reason in some people (about 1%) high SLC16A1 expression might push them towards cancer, while at the same time they might be particularly good candidates for 3-BP treatment. It might be helpful to realize that cancer clinics might have the ability to in some way select those patients who might have a good response to treatment based on this information. The site provides the exact variants that seem to be involved.

The NIH has a large transcriptome project now under way.

http://www.genome.gov/13014330

This site shows the gene expression for SLC16A1. Perhaps this expression changes during cancer progession.

http://www.gtexportal.org/home/gene/SLC16A1

Also of note is that there is an RNA anti-sense gene form of SLC16A1 known as SLC16A1-AS1. This is interesting, though it is not entirely clear to me what this means. A gene whose function it is to knock down SLC16A1 expression?

The above post might inspire those on the thread to discuss this interesting topic.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 12:03 AM
Quote | ReplyI think sometimes with clinical trials they do not stay with the textbook game plan. Our poster to the thread was able to receive independent confirmation from 2 people at PMH that 3-BP treatment is underway there and has been for at least several months. This is all heresay, though it is quite intriguing. Clinicaltrial.gov  has no mention of 3-BP or bromopyruvate etc. .

I have started my screenplay about the 3-BP story. My story line is that an American government offshore medical dark ops program with 3-BP went wrong and it was determined to white wash it. Not bad, just no one else take it!
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 01:18 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 4:03 AM Jcancom wrote:

I think sometimes with clinical trials they do not stay with the textbook game plan. Our poster to the thread was able to receive independent confirmation from 2 people at PMH that 3-BP treatment is underway there and has been for at least several months. This is all heresay, though it is quite intriguing. Clinicaltrial.gov "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  has no mention of 3-BP or bromopyruvate etc. .

I have started my screenplay about the 3-BP story. My story line is that an American government offshore medical dark ops program with 3-BP went wrong and it was determined to white wash it. Not bad, just no one else take it!
Lol. Just don't call it Return to Shangri-La, which is my big "Bad guys chasing the same \*\*\*\*" novel.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 01:20 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 5:18 AM Moonlitnight wrote:

On Sep 27, 2015 4:03 AM Jcancom wrote:

I think sometimes with clinical trials they do not stay with the textbook game plan. Our poster to the thread was able to receive independent confirmation from 2 people at PMH that 3-BP treatment is underway there and has been for at least several months. This is all heresay, though it is quite intriguing. Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  "" target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">http://Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov " target="\_blank" rel="nofollow">Clinicaltrial.gov  has no mention of 3-BP or bromopyruvate etc. .

I have started my screenplay about the 3-BP story. My story line is that an American government offshore medical dark ops program with 3-BP went wrong and it was determined to white wash it. Not bad, just no one else take it!
Lol. Just don't call it Return to Shangri-La, which is my big "Bad guys chasing the same \*\*\*\*" novel.
Oh and go for it J. You've done all the research.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Sep 27, 2015 07:23 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 1:04 AM dumbcritic wrote:

On Sep 26, 2015 8:17 PM Meech90 wrote:

On Sep 25, 2015 8:43 PM Danielus wrote:

On Sep 24, 2015 2:35 AM Meech90 wrote:

@jet, really hope it works out for you and I hope you can manage to get the treatment sooner rather than later. @Daniel: thanks for the words, and thanks for the Salinomycin suggestion. I saw the doctors in Colombia were using that in combination with the 3BP. So we'll see what I decide. Lot of immunotherapy options - none for my cancer type really - but I believe a good amount would be open to recruiting a young patient with excellent performance status. Like I said earlier; I was told that my hospital in Toronto (PMH) is experimenting with 3BP so I might even be able to receive it in a clinical setting.Yes, there are some clinics administrating Sal which may be even more relevant for your case. Immunotheraphies can also be accessed at private clinics at accessible costs - no need to wait for a possible trial - they are in general relevant for most cancers. But in that case you need to go to some well know clinics. Such loccations can be found in US and Germany.
I'll have to look for it. I keep all of my documents and have been looking for specific immunotherapy that targets proteins or genes that are overly expressed in my tumor type (according to my pathology report). I don't have a detailed genetic analysis on hand though nor do I know if one has been done so it's been slim in terms of what I can find for the preliminary genetic expressions.*Personalized* treatments vary across a spectrum. So you can have a standardized product which has standardized targets, but with personalized profiling. These are peptide vaccines, DNA vaccines and checkpoint inhibitors. Then you can have a personalized product but with standardized targets. These are CAR-Ts and dendritic cell vaccines with pre-selected peptide antigens. Then there are personalized products with personalized targets, like DCVax by NW Bio

So most of these are current treatments which are largely standardized, but not truely personalized. This raises 2 key issues… *Russian Roulette* In which the patient's tumor may or may not express the targets. (e.g., EGFRvIII mutation in GBM - only expressed on around 30% of GBMs). Or the fact tumors can and do stop expressing 1 or a few targets (antigens). But tumor cells cannot stop expressing all targets. So the only way forward in my view is a personalized product with personalized targets.

So this *turns on the immune system to find and fight the cancer cells. Then you may need to* release the brakes *with checkpoint inhibitors (e.g., Anti-CTLA4, Anti-PD1, Anti-LAG3, Anti-KIR, Anti-TIM3). You also may need to* push the gas *with co-stimulatory molecules (e.g., OX40), pro-inflammatory cytokines and/or cell trafficking molecules as well.*

The only way around some of this is by using an Anti-CD47 mab. This may cause an in-situ vaccine. It operates through macrophages (innate immune system) but can exert downstream effects on the adaptive immune system (T cells). It also mobilizes the immune system to attack the bulk of cancer cells and even cancer stem cells. Unless you can afford a DC vaccine?. But in order to make a DC vaccine you need some tumor.
Verry good comment. Only one addition: to make DC tumor is not required - blood taken from the patient is enough. Cost in Germany of a DC vaccine + anti PD1 + a few others was around 6000 euro and would have to be taken every moth or every few months until clear.
Quote | Reply

### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Sep 27, 2015 07:28 AM
Quote | ReplyThis is a very interesting paper I found today indicating that Tetrathiomolybdate Protects Against Liver Injury from Acetaminophen in Mice http://jrnlappliedresearch.com/articles/Vol4Iss3/Brewer.pdf&  like this article a lot because Paracetamol is needed during 3BP (and other chemotheraphies) to inhibit the Glutathione production (a resistance mechanism of cancer cells against pro oxidant therapies). One main drawback of using Paracetamol was the liver toxicity and co-administration of Tetrathiomolybdate seems to protect against that. This is a great bonus from TM next to its anti angiogenesis properties.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 10:33 AM
Quote | ReplyNote: To make the above url work just remove the final ampersand.

This is a great article, though I am unsure whether TM could be combined with paracetamol in order to lower GSH levels and then prevent toxcity. At the end of the article it mentions that NAC could be used to prevent a decline in GSH.

"The mechanism of ACAP toxicity is believed to be conversion of the drug to N-acetyl-p-benzoquinone imine(NAPQI) by cytochrome p450 in the liver. This metabolite interacts with hepatic glutathione (GSH) leading to rapid GSH depletion. ... NAC helps maintain GSH levels.
"

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Sep 27, 2015 10:58 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 2:33 PM Jcancom wrote:

Note: To make the above url work just remove the final ampersand.

This is a great article, though I am unsure whether TM could be combined with paracetamol in order to lower GSH levels and then prevent toxcity. At the end of the article it mentions that NAC could be used to prevent a decline in GSH.

"The mechanism of ACAP toxicity is believed to be conversion of the drug to N-acetyl-p-benzoquinone imine(NAPQI) by cytochrome p450 in the liver. This metabolite interacts with hepatic glutathione (GSH) leading to rapid GSH depletion. ... NAC helps maintain GSH levels.
"

Thanks for the correction of the link.

Could you please clarify why you are unsure? Why do you connect TM with NAC?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:32 AM
Quote | ReplyIn order for acetaminophen to effectively amplify the effectiveness of 3-BP treatment GSH levels must decline. The article notes that acetaminophen --> N-acetyl=pbenzoquinone imine (NAPQI) through cytochrome p450 in the liver. This results in rapid GSH depletion and toxicity.

The article then goes on to mention that the current therapy adds NAC (not sure whether NAC is actually added ?) which helps maintain GSH levels.

The problem that I am having is that if GSH levels are maintianed with NAC, then cotreatment with acetaminophen and TM would not lower GSH levels and would then not be helpful when given with 3-BP.

My worry is that removing the toxicity (lowered GSH levels) would also remove the benefit in 3-BP cotreatment.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:48 AM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 3:32 PM Jcancom wrote:

In order for acetaminophen to effectively amplify the effectiveness of 3-BP treatment GSH levels must decline. The article notes that acetaminophen --> N-acetyl=pbenzoquinone imine (NAPQI) through cytochrome p450 in the liver. This results in rapid GSH depletion and toxicity.

The article then goes on to mention that the current therapy adds NAC (not sure whether NAC is actually added ?) which helps maintain GSH levels.

The problem that I am having is that if GSH levels are maintianed with NAC, then cotreatment with acetaminophen and TM would not lower GSH levels and would then not be helpful when given with 3-BP.

My worry is that removing the toxicity (lowered GSH levels) would also remove the benefit in 3-BP cotreatment.
Intresting how you came to this conclusion :)

Dont worry, forget NAC. That is just a pharagraph at the end of the article suggesting that NAC next to TM may work even better for that specific purpose, i.e protect liver.

I did not said anything about that and did not suggested to use it. I am actually against NAC due to its strong anti oxidant potential that may cancel the effect of many theraphies.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 12:05 PM
Quote | ReplyI find this fascinating and eagerly await more responses. I absolutely abhor acetaminophen. It's just appallingly bad for the liver. SInce I am giving Don about 1.4g a day (and that should be more), I have been pondering the use of NAC at night. Don's IVs are currently in the pm. At issue is the half-life, which is 5.6 hours, meaning there still would be a significant amount in the system the following am, should we elect to begin using the IVs before food in the am.  If this drug Daniel mentions can be used concurrently, that would obviate the concerns over the half-life of the NAC.

We actually started the IVs only yesterday - with low dose, escalating all this week. Just getting this set up (and developing the "do-dahs" to actually do it) has been a marathon. Am adding 2DG soon as well.  My guy is not doing well bone-marrow wise and has daily diarrhea which robs him of nutrients. This has been going on for almost 7 months, making him skeletal. But he is in good spirits and the IVs should help.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 12:29 PM
Quote | ReplyI am excited about this new information I posted about the expression levels of SLC16A1 in what appears to be normal tissues ( http://www.gtexportal.org/home/gene/SLC16A1  , notice that SLC16A1 also has a pseudogene which has some activity in the testis).

When you click on the SLC16A1 gene, there is a figure showing the expressoin levels in normal tissues with error bars. Something of interest is how large these error bars are. This is not entirely explained by low sample sizes. For instance, when the figure is sorted from smallest to largest, whole blood is the second smallest, even with a large sample size, while spanning almost 2 logs!

The big question that this figure suggested to me was what factors might be causing such a large variation in MCT-1 expression. This is not merely a question of theoretical interest. MCT-1 is the main entry point for 3-BP into the cell. We will have to wait for such foundational science.

The liver tissues had a fairly high level of expression, which is particularly clear when the many brain and other samples with large error bars are removed.

What might be special about the liver? I then looked up the Cori cycle (aka the lactic acid cycle) on wiki.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cori\_cycle

I am not sure though MCT-1 might be a primary entry mechanism for lactate in the liver for the Cori cycle.  This would be awesome! We talked earlier on the thead of taking advantage of the investment phase in glycolysis. It seems that this is exactly what the Cori cycle can achieve. The diagram on the right on the wiki page shows that 6 ATP are needed by the liver to convert 2 lactate into a glucose molecule. This could cause a massive metabolic burden on the liver. It seems that quite a few things are coming together to make the liver an ideal place to treat with 3-BP. This might be why the first patients were liver patients!

To recap: Normal liver tissue has natually highish SLC16A1 expression. Lactate enters cells to a large extent (?) through MCT-1. In the liver lactate cycles through the Cori cycle (gluconeogenesis) in order to produce glucose at a huge metabolic cost to the liver. TACE 3-BP would then have a perfect environment to be effective in liver cancer: High MCT-1 expression, massive potential to deplete ATP.

Typically it is a particularly serious development when cancer reaches the liver. Perhaps 3-BP could netralize this effect.

Wiki also notes that excess lactate is cleared by the kidneys. Notably metformin inhibits the Cori cycle.

Wiki also clarifies that gluconeogenesis is involved in the ketosis response. "The intestine uses mostly glutamine and glycerol." (for gluconeogenesis versus primarily lactate, alanine and glycerol in the liver)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gluconeogenesis

We have considered glycolysis extensively on this thread. It might be time to shift to the Cori cycle (gluconeogenesis).
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 01:29 PM
Quote | ReplyI wanted the point about NAC to be totally clear. It is true, D as you pointed out, that they just sort of tacked this on at the end of the article. It does not seem to be related to the results they found of TM reducing acetaminophen toxicity, though it is still somewhat unclear.

"Since TM works through an entirely different mechanism, concomitant TM and NAC therapy might offer an excellent combination therapy."

I would feel so much more comfortable if they directly addressed the question: What happens to GSH levels when treated with TM and acetaminophen? Acetaminophen rapidly reduces GSH levels --> toxicity. In what way does TM treatment change this? They say that TM works through an entirely different mechanism. Fair enough. However, if TM in no way changes the depleted GSH levels, then how would it prevent the toxicity known to be caused by low GSH levels?

It would be great if TM could go downstream and fix up the immune problems caused by low GSH levels without having to change the GSH levels directly. This is what the article seems to be indicating. I just wanted to make sure.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 02:19 PM
Quote | ReplyThe url is not showing in my prevous post about the tumor types and SLC16A1 expression. This one seems too important to let slip by.

You can try different cancer types by selecting on the right "Select button". This seems to be showing that a small percentage of cancers have upregulated SLC16A1 expression and a gain of copy number. Almost none of these tumors have reduced SLC16A1 expression. It would seem that these patients would do especially well with 3-BP treatment. Finding a subgroup of patients with especially favorable response to 3-BP treatment could be helpful in moving 3-BP forward.

http://cancer.sanger.ac.uk/cosmic/gene/analysis?coords=AA%3A

http://cancer.sanger.ac.uk/cosmic/gene/overview?ln=SLC16A1

Here's another neat tool. Select the tissue type on the top, Press GO on the right, select Genes with Mutations, and then type SLC16A1 in the search box on the right.

http://cancer.sanger.ac.uk/cosmic/browse/tissue?#sn=kidney&a

These urls are looking at the much maligned gene mutation approach to cancer treatment. So for example the breast cancer tissue is listing over 23000 genes or transcripts with a mutation. Considering that the human genome has roughly 23000 it almost seems pointless having a list: you could just say All genes could lead to breast cancer!

This is an interesting resource to go through.

The disappointing thing to remember in terms of 3-BP treatment is that since tumors are heterogeneous even someone with upregulated SLC16A1 might only derive benefit for a time before resistance would develop. This would be true of any purely genetic approach.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Sun Sep 27, 2015 03:27 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 4:05 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

I find this fascinating and eagerly await more responses. I absolutely abhor acetaminophen. It's just appallingly bad for the liver. SInce I am giving Don about 1.4g a day (and that should be more), I have been pondering the use of NAC at night. Don's IVs are currently in the pm. At issue is the half-life, which is 5.6 hours, meaning there still would be a significant amount in the system the following am, should we elect to begin using the IVs before food in the am.  If this drug Daniel mentions can be used concurrently, that would obviate the concerns over the half-life of the NAC.

We actually started the IVs only yesterday - with low dose, escalating all this week. Just getting this set up (and developing the "do-dahs" to actually do it) has been a marathon. Am adding 2DG soon as well.  My guy is not doing well bone-marrow wise and has daily diarrhea which robs him of nutrients. This has been going on for almost 7 months, making him skeletal. But he is in good spirits and the IVs should help.
So glad you have started the i.v.'s--and sending my warmest and best wishes for their success in helping him recover!

You and others are a true inspiration because of your love and sincerity.  Not enough adjectives to describe the admiration, actually.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 05:08 PM
Quote | ReplyThank you Jet...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 05:12 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 27, 2015 5:29 PM Jcancom wrote:

I wanted the point about NAC to be totally clear. It is true, D as you pointed out, that they just sort of tacked this on at the end of the article. It does not seem to be related to the results they found of TM reducing acetaminophen toxicity, though it is still somewhat unclear.

"Since TM works through an entirely different mechanism, concomitant TM and NAC therapy might offer an excellent combination therapy."

I would feel so much more comfortable if they directly addressed the question: What happens to GSH levels when treated with TM and acetaminophen? Acetaminophen rapidly reduces GSH levels --> toxicity. In what way does TM treatment change this? They say that TM works through an entirely different mechanism. Fair enough. However, if TM in no way changes the depleted GSH levels, then how would it prevent the toxicity known to be caused by low GSH levels?

It would be great if TM could go downstream and fix up the immune problems caused by low GSH levels without having to change the GSH levels directly. This is what the article seems to be indicating. I just wanted to make sure.
Ah phooey! We cannot use TM due to Don's bone marrow suppression and need for blood transfusions.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by dumbcritic on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:15 PM
Quote | ReplyIn 2016 there will be more single and combo trials for CB-839. Also in the first half of 2016 CB-1158\* (an arginase inhibitor) will enter a Phase I. However it seems it won't be until some time in late 2016 or even 2017 that their HK II inhibitor will enter the first Phase I trial

CB-839 is the only selective glutaminase inhibitor currently in clinical trials. Here is the poster for Acute Leukemia http://www.calithera.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/European  and in Solid Tumors http://www.calithera.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/220515-C

CB-839 is First-in-class, is well tolerated, shows early signs of activity as a single agent, and achieved both PK and PD endpoints in the Phase I. It reduces key metabolic intermediates including: glutamate, aspartate, TCA cycle intermediates, glutathione and nucleotides. It generates double-stranded DNA breaks and causes replication stress. It suppresses mTOR signaling. It suppresses gene expression of glycolysis and purine metabolism. This then blocks growth and induces apoptosis

CB-839 CONCLUSIONS

Among solid tumor patients treated at doses of 600-800 mg BID,
41% (7/17) had stable disease lasting for ≥ 3 cycles
? Among solid tumor patients treated during dose escalation TID,
19% (6/31) had stable disease lasting for ≥ 3 cycles
– Three patients (2 TNBC, 1 RCC) have durable stable disease (11, 8 and 7 months)
and remain on study
? Among AML patients treated with CB-839 as a monotherapy
– 28% (5/18) remained on study for > 4 cycles
– One patient achieved a CRi response, and has been treated for 10+ months
? CB-839 is well tolerated in advanced cancer patients
– Less than 15% of patients experienced drug-related G3 or G4 adverse events
– Asymptomatic, reversible elevations in LFTs were markedly reduced on BID fed
dosing schedule

Single Agent Dose Expansion Cohorts (Ph1b) will be for: TNBC, RCC, NSCLC (KRAS mut), and AML. Also IDH, FH and SDH muts

Combination Dose Expansion Cohorts (Ph1b) will be for: TNBC + paclitaxel, MM + dexamethasone, MM + dex and pomalidomide, RCC + everolimus, NSCLC + erlotinib and AML + azacitidine

Recruiting - Study of the Glutaminase Inhibitor CB-839 in Solid Tumors https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02071862?term=CB-839&
Recruiting - Study of the Glutaminase Inhibitor CB-839 in Hematological Tumors https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02071888?term=CB-839&
Recruiting - Study of the Glutaminase Inhibitor CB-839 in Leukemia https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02071927?term=CB-839&

* Arginase, is secreted by Myeloid-derived Suppressor Cells (MDSCs). This then depletes arginine and in-turn suppresses T cells. CB-1158 is a potent, orally bioavailable inhibitor of arginase. It reverses the immunosuppressive properties and increases arginine levels in tumors. It has single agent anti-tumor activity in preclinical models http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3697836/  From this link *MDSC are now recognized as a key immunosuppressive cell type in the development and progression of malignancy [33]. The prevalence of these cells and their immunosuppressive capacity has been reported in multiple different malignancies including head and neck, prostate, renal cell, and breast [4–9].*

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:24 PM
Quote | ReplyI think I am going crazy. Does anyone recall reading that 3BP can be mixed up in water and then kept for three days or so? I can't seem to find where I read this.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:29 PM
Quote | ReplyI think it was best to mix and use, though I also think I recall on the thread that some mixed and then refrigerated. Not totally sure. Good to search the wikia.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:31 PM
Quote | ReplyVery interesting about an inhibitor of glutamate, glutathione etc. . Will look forward to see how this could be added to 3-BP.

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01287585?term=Polaris
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:31 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 28, 2015 12:29 AM Jcancom wrote:

I think it was best to mix and use, though I also think I recall on the thread that some mixed and then refrigerated. Not totally sure. Good to search the wikia.
Thanks J. I am not good with wikias...where does one find it to search it?
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:40 PM
Quote | ReplyNo problems. I got 32 hits on the first installment of our thread when using the Find feature with "mix"

Jan 09, 2015 02:36 PM  "i  was mixing up the acid ,(case# 1113-59-3), in small batches of say 50ml and was keeping it in the fridge"

Jan 09, 2015 08:54 PM "i mix 3 bromopyruvic acid (case # 1113-59-3) in small amounts 50ml at a time, store at room temp and alklize just before use"

D wrote:

Jan 11, 2015 06:40 AM "3BP can indeed be stable at 4C for about a week, when at relatively low pH. I have read the suggested paper and it seems that in contrast to that, when 3BP is mixed into a solution resulting a pH such as 8 and stored at high temperatures such as room temperature, the stability is very very low so that the 3BP decays very fast, i.e. becomes 12.5% in about 80min when stored at a temperature of 37C. Another example: 3BP at pH3 stored at 4C shows no detectable decay over 2 months, while 3BP at pH3 stored at room temperature (18C) had a half life of 29 hours. If the pH is increased to 7-8 than that half life becomes even smaller. ..."

I am quite surprised by this considering how unstable 3-BP can be. Though it seems it can be stable over about a week at low temperature and low pH,
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Sun Sep 27, 2015 08:42 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 28, 2015 12:40 AM Jcancom wrote:

No problems. I got 32 hits on the first installment of our thread when using the Find feature with "mix"

Jan 09, 2015 02:36 PM  "i  was mixing up the acid ,(case# 1113-59-3), in small batches of say 50ml and was keeping it in the fridge"

Jan 09, 2015 08:54 PM "i mix 3 bromopyruvic acid (case # 1113-59-3) in small amounts 50ml at a time, store at room temp and alklize just before use"

D wrote:

Jan 11, 2015 06:40 AM "3BP can indeed be stable at 4C for about a week, when at relatively low pH. I have read the suggested paper and it seems that in contrast to that, when 3BP is mixed into a solution resulting a pH such as 8 and stored at high temperatures such as room temperature, the stability is very very low so that the 3BP decays very fast, i.e. becomes 12.5% in about 80min when stored at a temperature of 37C. Another example: 3BP at pH3 stored at 4C shows no detectable decay over 2 months, while 3BP at pH3 stored at room temperature (18C) had a half life of 29 hours. If the pH is increased to 7-8 than that half life becomes even smaller. ..."

I am quite surprised by this considering how unstable 3-BP can be. Though it seems it can be stable over about a week at low temperature and low pH,
Thanks J. That is very interesting. I will just mix it with the sterile water and shoot it in at the time of use.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:11 PM
Quote | ReplyVery exciting! Mito-3-BP is moving throught the patent process. Within the last week or two there appears to have been a new filing. Mito-3-BP has been amazingly effective (in cells). One of the only identified barriers to 3-BP effectivess is MCT-1. If you could just use a postive ion to drag 3-BP into a cell one would expect much higher efficacy. Mito-3BP has shown 1 or 2 logs of improvement over 3-BP. Unfortunately we still have not seen in vivo results.

https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2015138992&recNum=24&maxRec=&office=&prevFilter=&sortOption=&queryString=&tab=PCT+Biblio
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by jetsparkle on Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:49 PM
Quote | ReplyJust wanted to send best wishes to both Mar and Caddy--we have not forgotten you!  Let us know how you are faring when you are able...
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Mon Sep 28, 2015 01:20 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 28, 2015 4:49 PM jetsparkle wrote:

Just wanted to send best wishes to both Mar and Caddy--we have not forgotten you!  Let us know how you are faring when you are able...
Yes, please do. I second this sentiment and wish you both the very best.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Danielus on Mon Sep 28, 2015 02:30 PM
Quote | ReplyFor the lady focussed on RCC (and others):

CXC chemokine receptor 4 is essential for maintenance of renal cell carcinoma-initiating cells and predicts metastasis: In conclusion, CXCR4 identifies a subpopulation of tumor-initiating cells in RCC cell lines and plays a role in their maintenance. The relative insensitivity of such cells to tyrosine kinase inhibitors might contribute to the development of therapy resistance in RCC patients. Future therapies therefore could combine blockade of the CXCR4 signaling pathway with standard therapies for more effective treatments of metastatic RCC.

More about CXCR4 antagonist that may be available to anyone http://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/?p=265
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by peggyznd on Mon Sep 28, 2015 09:47 PM
Quote | ReplyI am likely the person most focused on kidney cancer in this thread, and do appreciate getting this reference to this study, which compares some cell studies in the laboratory.  As I understand the study after a first read, kidney cancer cell lines were developed from tumors given by two different patients, one with a small Stage I tumor, and the other with Stage IV tumors.  The patients were not treated, only donated cells from their respective tumors.  The article does NOT clarify if these were the same type of RCC, whether clear cell or papillary.

It is not odd to see that the tumor cells from the older, larger, more established tumor would carry more and different receptors than from the smaller, 'younger' tumor.  It will be interesting to see if this study can lead to additional studies with established cell lines of kidney cancer, which can then be tested in mice who will be given kidney cancer from these various lines.

This is quite preliminary information, and reflects the need for the essential bench science which must study the very critical steps of cell division, what stimulates the cells to divide, and in th case of tumors, what can interfere and slow that growth.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Mon Sep 28, 2015 10:07 PM
Quote | Replyhttp://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/09/150928125105.ht
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 30, 2015 05:07 PM
Quote | ReplyDoes anyone know how to access this without paying a fortune? I am sure I saw the whole article somewhere...

3-Bromopyruvate (3BP) a fast acting, promising, powerful, specific, and effective "small molecule" anti-cancer agent taken from labside to bedside: introduction to a special issue.Quote | ReplyMore Sharing ServicesShare Share on email Share on facebook Share on twitterMoonlitnight

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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 30, 2015 05:16 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 30, 2015 9:07 PM Moonlitnight wrote:

Does anyone know how to access this without paying a fortune? I am sure I saw the whole article somewhere...

3-Bromopyruvate (3BP) a fast acting, promising, powerful, specific, and effective "small molecule" anti-cancer agent taken from labside to bedside: introduction to a special issue.I guess the URL would have helped:  http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs10863-012-9425-4
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 30, 2015 05:37 PM
Quote | ReplyThe post below has a url. For some reason the url itself would not post.

Thu Jul 09, 2015 07:42 PM
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Moonlitnight on Wed Sep 30, 2015 05:40 PM

Quote | Reply

On Sep 30, 2015 9:37 PM Jcancom wrote:

The post below has a url. For some reason the url itself would not post.

Thu Jul 09, 2015 07:42 PM
Erm...pardon J? I don't understand what you just wrote... I hit the URL and go to the Springer site.
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### RE: Anyone used 3bp (3-bromopyruvate)?

by Jcancom on Wed Sep 30, 2015 05:46 PM
Quote | ReplyYes, but when I wanted to post the url for a free full text copy of that article it did not post. If you go to our thread on the day and time I mentioned then you will see the url and can access when of the most important 3-BP aticles gratis.
Quote | Reply