Archive:Ogamon-Stavrok Debate May 2012

On May 25, 2012, the day before the Major Executive special election, the two opponents, incumbent Arnold Ogamon and challenger Stavrok hold this debate. Questions have been sent in to the moderator, Ehtya, and the responses and procedure of the debate follows:

## Debate Format

I will ask all questions at once. The questions will alternate who must answer them first. You are permitted to an answer and a second answer after you hear your opponent (each of you get two chances to talk during each question). The questions should look like this when finished:

#### Example Question

**What is your favorite color?**

**Ogamon:** I would have to say blue, blue is a great symbol of freedom.

**Stavrok:** Probably red, it symbolizes strength.

**Ogamon:** My opponent is wrong to say red, blue is a far superior color!

**Stavrok:** Ogamon is only diverting towards me to take focus off the fact that blue is not a good color.

## Debate

The official debate is below this marker. Good luck to both of you.

#### 1: Main Reason

**What do you each feel is the main reason you are the best candidate to be Major Executive?**

**Ogamon:** Experience is my main reason, and from what I've learned, there is no better qualification. Experience is what makes a businessman successful, experience is what members of the military want in terms of a leader, experience is what helps us get up every day and take on the challenges. My experience in leading the Triumvirate as Major Executive, in the Countdown Crisis, in the delicate months after Zerouh left, in making sure the Triumvirate stays on top, is what the union needs.

**Stavrok:** The best reason for me is the promise of something new. The Triumvirate can't always remain the stale, worn out, formal Triumvirate that Arnold Ogamon has made it. I want to bring us back to our youthful outlook on things. I have different ideas from what the Major Executive can do than Arnold does, if I am elected I will do different things. It's time for change.

**Ogamon:** Formal Triumvirate you say? That formal Triumvirate is what has given us things like the resume policy (something I see you enjoy), rules of criminal procedure, a good strong court, the Administrative Branch, and so much more. My opponent is saying that we should "go back", he's saying we should "go back"! Am I the only one amused by that? There's a reason we left whatever the past was, because we needed something new!

**Stavrok:** We're not just going back, we're going back to the old mindset. Back when Zerouh fought for good and change was actually happening. I'm not saying that some of the stuff that we've done under you (though a lot of it was by others) is bad, I'm just saying that we can do more mate.

#### 2: Role

**What is the role of the Major Executive?**

**Stavrok:** Strictly speaking the role of the Major Executive is to be what Zerouh described as the midpoint between an Executive and a full blown president. The Major Executive oversees the wiki, the sites, and the security of the Triumvirate. I think Zerouh was a great Major Executive, he did all of that, he didn't do what Arnold is now doing: expanding the power of the position to have all these strange roles making them much more presidential. People are beginning to see the Major Executive as a president, and that's not good. The Major Executive is a single person under control of the Executive Branch.

**Ogamon:** The Major Executive isn't a President! I don't have veto powers, I can't nominate every government officer, and I can't lead a whole branch of government on my own! I just do what I think is necessary for the best of the Triumvirate, I don't try to make the Major Executive too powerful, I just do what I think is for the best.

**Stavrok:** You didn't answer Ehtya's question tho, what is the role of the Major Executive? It's time to restrict the position a little.

**Ogamon:** The role is to manage sites, be the *de facto* commander in chief in a crisis, manage the offices not being overseen (Head of Law Enforcement, Director of Resume Services, Head of Media). Restricting the position will be detrimental to the effectiveness of the government. It wasn't me who expanded the position so much either, that was Ehtya. During the Countdown Crisis he's the one who started making emergency orders and declarations, he's the one who became commander in chief, these things you're trying to put on me are not my doing. I stepped down in that crisis because I couldn't get in contact with the rest of the Executive Branch as well, I am glad I made that decision. Let me also say this: the Major Executive is not as political as we're making it out to be. The person in that role should be the most active, the most experienced, and the most confident. Stavrok is none of those things, I have confidence, I'm active, and I have experience.

#### 3: Minor Executive

**Why is Ehtya both of your choice for Minor Executive?**

**Ogamon:** Ehtya has shown, especially in the Countdown Crisis, that surprisingly, he is the best one out there. If he were running for Major Executive, hell, even I might vote for him haha. Ehtya has experience, brilliance, and honor on his side, there is no one I would put before him that I think could lead the Triumvirate better.

**Stavrok:** I agree with Arnold completely, and he's been a good friend of mine since before the Triumvirate was even around.

#### 4: First Thing

**If you are elected, what is the first thing you'd do?**

**Stavrok:** Literally speaking the first thing I'd do is probably have some discussion with Arnold as to how the pass the position along. Once I become Major Executive, the first thing I want to do is pass the PEACE Act. If I were only to be remembered for two things I'd choose it to be releasing the economy and the PEACE Act. I am open to compromising with Arnold a little bit on passing that since I know he's leading the opposition against it but the premise of it is a thing the Triumvirate needs.

**Ogamon:** I'd continue, I think that what I've done has been helpful, and I think the people are behind me. The future is ahead and I'm the one to help take us there!

**Stavrok:** Arnold is saying that he just wants to keep doing the same, and it's not working people. The Triumvirate has few citizens, we're isolated, and the government won't step in financially. The Ogamon path is not a good one.

**Ogamon:** It is working, we see unprecedented levels of productivity, we see an expanse in member growth (three new members in the last month or so), we see business giants moving in and bringing great benefits, we seem pretty profitable to me.

#### 5: Role Model

**Which historical Triumvirate figure who is not still here and who is not Zerouh do you most look up to?**

**Ogamon:** We've had a lot of good Executives, we've had a lot of bad ones. The way the Executive Branch is designed, we're weighted in terms of the bad ones, only about 20% of the Executives there have ever been would be considered "good". Anarchy Dies, Mojo Rising. Those might be the two I'd name. Both had ideas, both here a while, both gave themselves a pretty good reputation.

**Stavrok:** Good question mate. I'd have to say probably Mojo Rising or this man from the early days that only a few of us knew about, he was an agent for TDI (before TDI even existed), Ascencia brought him to the Triumvirate during when we first took on Uhnul in October 2009. Meeting him was such a thrill, he's long gone now and not remembered at all, but now that you've made me think about it, I'd like to give him the Distinguished Defensive Service award, he definitely has earned it and he was a nice fellow.

#### 6: Biggest Project

**If you become/stay Major Executive, what would be your biggest project before the election in August?**

**Stavrok:** The PEACE Act. What it will do for the Triumvirate is unforeseen as far as how great it could be. It will make us an international sensation again, increasing recruiting and appeal. Back in our glory day when we were first founded we were more powerful than ever, we had hundreds of members (if you counted clan members) all devoted to our great cause and the way everyone cared about what they stood for was lovely. We've fallen away from that, it's time to take us back to our days when we would help people in need and people always looked up to the Universal Triumvirate!

**Ogamon:** I think I'll be working more on historical protection things, I've got a few ideas for how we can set "beacons" of sorts for the future, it's a concept I'm really excited about. Expansions to the Historical Protection Act and working on the recruiting improvements are some things I'll focus on.

**Stavrok:** So it's more important to protect our history than it is to make our future better? You say I keep looking to the past but look at you, I'm planning things to change the future, you're planning things to give us more insight into the past.

**Ogamon:** There is such a thing as learning from the past, not making the same mistakes. Part of the reason the United States is such a marvel of a country is because it's so new, because we have our history so well maintained. I want the same for the Triumvirate so that we never forget the history of the union.

#### 7: GUARD Act

**What do you feel about the GUARD Act, is it a necessary evil or a terrible affront to the way of the Triumvirate government?**

**Ogamon:** I don't think it's either. It's most certainly not a necessary evil. My Minor Executive, Ehtya, and I worked on it together in response to the Countdown Crisis. It gives the Major Executive additional power in an emergency, exactly as Ehtya used during the Countdown Crisis, so that the Triumvirate can remain safe when even the Executive Branch falls out of communication.

**Stavrok:** I'd say necessary terrible affront, I don't agree with a lot of it. I think the way it elevates the Major exec is bad, the Major Executive is not the king, the president, or anything like that. Calling them commander in chief is false, if anyone is it might be Ascencia as Head of Intelligence, at the end of the day he controls our defense force, not the Major Executive.

**Ogamon:** That's wrong, the GUARD Act does much more good than bad, it's good to have a commander in chief during a crisis and I'm proud that I've made the Major Executive position the one that deserves that designation during a crisis.

**Stavrok:** The entire Executive Branch is the commander in chief, anyone who knows anything about what Zerouh planned for the EB would know that Zerouh did not want a single person to have as much command as the GUARD Act has given the Major Executive.

#### 8: Opponent's Best Work

**What is your opponent's greatest accomplishment?**

**Stavrok:** Probably the first thing he went out to do: the resume system. It's a great idea and tho I know it's hard to manage (as Major Executive since we have no Director of Resume Services right now) it has done a lot of good.

**Ogamon:** Thank you Stavrok. Obviously I'd have to say the financial system, it's amazing! Stavrok is really intelligent when it comes to economics and I wouldn't like anyone else to have his position, he's very good at it.

#### 9: Population Crisis

**How do you intend to deal with the population crisis?**

**Ogamon:** My opponent and I are working on this together, we both have the same idea and we're working on an idea that is sort of similar to one Hester suggested more recently. It's basically a system for recruiting incentives, where the government will give people who recruit members for the Triumvirate money.

**Stavrok:** Arnold and I have made an agreement: we will focus on the population crisis and stick with our agreement no matter how the election turns out. Me and Arnold are allies in this, it's important we don't argue about it and get something done. Along with this making us more international, something I really am trying to do, will increase recruiting.

**Ogamon:** Besides the pieces of the PEACE Act that "help" recruiting, I agree with Stavrok. International focus will not help recruiting, that's a myth that Stavrok is trying to use to push his agenda.

**Stavrok:** It's not a myth at all, think about it, back when the Triumvirate was new and we focused on helping the world instead of just ourselves like we do now, we had clans joining all the time. We had over 200 members! That's better than we've had since this isolationist thing has begun.

#### 10: Incumbent Advantage

**Do either of you feel the election is unfair due to the incumbent advantage Ogamon has?**

**Stavrok:** I do feel that it is somewhat unfair but I think that gets cancelled out by the errors made by the person who is in the office. Arnold has made errors and the Triumvirate people know that, so it's time for something new.

**Ogamon:** I don't think it's an advantage at all. Guess that answers that.

#### 11: Government Spending

**What is your stance on government spending?**

**Ogamon:** I am against government spending of almost any kind. I think it is wrong for the government to intervene in the free market. This is something my opponent and I disagree on significantly. The government can and should not be helping (and by doing so, hindering) any private individuals or enterprises, it's a terrible precedent for us to set and it will lead to a weakened socialized Triumvirate, not a strong capitalist one.

**Stavrok:** I'm going to quote Ogamon here, "I'm not an economist", funny... But it's my job to be an economist and I can tell you that he's wrong. I agree with what he is saying about not making us socialized or over-intervention by the Government but I do like Keynesianism. The government can do alot of good with programs and spending to stimulate the economy. Totally hands off can hurt things, that's just basic economic theory.

**Ogamon:** Just because I'm not an economist doesn't mean I can't understand economic theories. A free, hands-off, market is the best there can be. No government spending. No government intervention. The individualism of the Triumvirate is amazing, great businesses like General Media have grown without government intervention, let's push for more innovation, not for the government stepping in and messing up everyone's day.

**Stavrok:** Arnold has even recognized that I'm a better economist than he is but he still thinks I'm dead wrong on this. Keynesianism. That's all I have to say.

#### 12: Biggest Threat

**What is the biggest threat the Triumvirate faces?**

**Stavrok:** The population crisis. Not having people is a threat, I don't think that there is any person or group out to get us.

**Ogamon:** Attacks like the Countdown Crisis are the biggest threat. These random attacks are what we should be prepared for, I trust the Head of Intelligence and the security measures in place to protect the Triumvirate.

#### 13: Isolationism vs. Interventionism

**You've both clashed a lot on whether or not the Triumvirate should focus internally or externally, if you become/stay Major Executive, what would be your role in this?**

**Ogamon:** I will not stand for any of the recent attempts by this progressive group in the Executive Branch to push for more interventionist legislation and use of resources. I will fight the PEACE Act until the day I leave the Triumvirate. My opponent wants to send us back to where we were before Zerouh turned us into the Triumvirate we are today, and it will not work.

**Stavrok:** INTERVENTIONISM! Us "progressives" are trying to make the Triumvirate better, keep us away from your no-alliance, no-trade, no-help policies. Back in the day when Zerouh would step right in front of people like Uhnul and Aeraes, those are the days I want to go back to. Zerouh, without thinking about how it might harm him, stepped right up in front of them and told them to stop or else they'd meet the full force of the Triumvirate. It worked and it gave us recognition and more. It was fantastic to watch and inspiring. Arnold might not understand this because he wasn't around, this was all in the Genesis Age and since Arnold's joining the Triumvirate and the defeat of Uhnul are practically the two events that made the start of the modern age, Arnold just doesn't have that old time mindset.

**Ogamon:** I am not anti-alliances. I am for them so long as they don't give us excessive entanglement in international affairs. Did I read that right?! I don't have the old time mind set? I apologize for being modern and realistic, didn't know it was so offensive to people.

**Stavrok:** Thanks for keeping mature... all that I'm trying to say is that we can do incredible things once again. The Triumvirate can become the glory it once was.

#### 14: Ten Words

**You are the Major Executive. Intelligence has revealed there is a massive attack coming and all of the people of the Triumvirate are looking towards you for consolation. You may only say up to ten words to them. What would you say?**

**Stavrok:** "Have faith in the Triumvirate, in our ideas and government"

**Ogamon:** "We stand united, and together we can survive anything"

#### 15: Second Minor Executive

**There has been a massive attack and your Minor Executive, Ehtya, has been incapacitated. You are likely to be incapacitated yourself soon, who would you support as a substitute Minor Executive?**

**Ogamon:** Ascencia, as much as that man pains and irritates us all, he is excellent under pressure and would do very well in an emergency.

**Stavrok:** Arnold. Pardon me for thinking that even though he's my opponent, we can't be honest here. If both me and Ehtya were to go down then of course I'd choose Arnold. He has some experience that would be good. Ascencia is not who I'd choose, hes not stable and is not who the Triumvirate would look to.

**Ogamon:** Ascencia is fantastic at what he does, no one has ever argued that he is not. I appreciate the compliment though.

**Stavrok:** Yes he is but he's not a leader, not the person you'd want as the figurehead in a crisis.

#### 16: Business Stimulating

**As Major Executive what would you do to stimulate business in the Triumvirate?**

**Stavrok:** All kinds of things! Unlike what Arnold would do, which is just sit back and watch, I believe we can do a lot of good as the Executive Branch by helping out. Things like incentives for businesses to get started, government loans, government bonds, all kinds of things!

**Ogamon:** Nothing, we need to, as the government, stay out of it entirely. Business doesn't do well when the government interferes, it's important that we don't ruin the great businesses in the Triumvirate by stepping in and messing things up!

**Stavrok:** If an economic crash occurred, are you really saying the government should just sit back and stay out of it? The reason the USA got out of the depression is because Roosevelt used his New Deal to help push the country out of the depression. Government spending, government intervention, the government is a useful tool in helping the economy. I'm not saying that we shouldn't have minimal government spending I'm just saying that we can't just take the stance that we're never ever going to do anything.

**Ogamon:** The United States and the Triumvirate are two very different things Stavrok. I'm a fan of FDR and of the New Deal for the most part, it was a great idea and yeah, it worked. In the Triumvirate things are different though, we're not as big and the consequences aren't as severe. If the TTI crashes some week, no, the government shouldn't do anything, it can actually do more harm for the government to do something than for the market to just fix itself.

#### 17: Extent of Power

**What do you feel is the extent of power of the Major Executive?**

**Ogamon:** As much as we can make it to be for it to do what is necessary. I believe there is power to the position, necessary power, in order for it to be effective. I support the GUARD Act, the Constitution, and all other laws that make the position powerful enough to act but restricted enough to stay in its place. Stavrok would say that he wants the position to become less powerful but I don't think that is a good option right now, the position needs to stay strong in order to operate and do what is necessary.

**Stavrok:** It's gone too far, way too far. Arnold has expanded the power of the position to absurd levels and if we don't act fast to restrict the Major Executive then whoever gets the position in the future will work under weird circumstances that would make me uncomfortable. No person should have that much power, even if they're a good person.

**Ogamon:** It hasn't gone too far at all, I'm not a President or anything, and not everyone looks up to me. As many people look up to me as the leader as they look up to you and Ehtya.

**Stavrok:** That's because of the mistakes you've made, and the people are trying to show that it's time for something new.

#### 18: Fall

**If the Triumvirate were to fall tomorrow, what do you think we'd be remembered for?**

**Stavrok:** How much fun we were. I know we don't all get along alot but it's always fun. I always look forward to checking online to see how things are and to talk with my friends.

**Ogamon:** I agree with Stavrok, it's been really fun. And the great opportunity we've provided to those interested in learning and experiencing how a society works and operates. It has been really fun though, I don't think anyone would argue with that.