Episode 73: Shrek Week

"I don't think the answer is actually not liking K-pop; I think the answer is revolution."

### Featuring

Kate Mitchell (host)
Aysha U. Farah
Sarah Zedig

## Music

### Outro music

"Perfectly Generic"

Kate, Aysha and Sarah record a whispery episode while Andrew’s asleep. Topics: Don’t Wake Daddy. Parasite. Eridan & Feferi. Davekat. Kojima’s influence on Homestuck. Platforms ruin media.

Listen to this episode at https://pgenpod.com/updates/episodes/73

## Transcript

Kate:        The perfectly generic podcast contains spoilers, occasional adult language and Vriska. This show is made possible by listeners like you patreon.com/pgenpod. We'd like to thank our Crocker tier patrons [Names] for their generous support per episode.

[intro]

Kate:        We can talk quietly, you know, like I feel like this is a good level. This is a great recorder so picks up. Hi, welcome to the perfectly generic podcast. We're talking quiet like because we're in  Andrew Hussie's house and he hasn't woken up yet. And we don't want to wake him up recording a podcast about his webcomic

Aysha:     Yeah we don't want to wake– just he's very grumpy when he wakes up. He is much like Shrek.

Kate:        Is he?

Aysha:     I don't know I made that up.

Kate:        All right.

Sarah:     He's exactly like Shrek.

Kate:        He's exactly like Shrek. He's a jolly green ogre.

Aysha:     Is Shrek grumpy when he wakes up?

Kate:        Shrek is grumpy all the time. Anyway, I'm here with Sarah Zedig and Aysha U. Farah. We're talking about Shrek

Aysha:     It's been a Shrek week. It's been a pretty Shrek centric week

Kate:        Shrek week. That's the new discovery channel theme week.

Aysha and Kate:        Shrek Week

Aysha:     What is some Shrek information? I don't know but–

Kate:        Xtine is going to die if we get some Shrek lore wrong.

Aysha:     The first time that I met Shelby Craig, they told me

Kate:        Wow. You know Shelby Craig?

Aysha:     I know right? Kinda wild.

Kate:        Wild wow.

Aysha:     The first time I met Shelby, they told me a story where they were at Dragon Con with a bunch of other Homestuck cosplayers. And they got into an elevator with Jason Momoa who was like smashed and he was like 'Eyy, you are all little Shreks'  [Kate and Sarah hyperventilated laughter]And people would get into the elevator and he's like, 'Don't worry just hanging out with my Shreks' [Kate and Sarah laugh]. Jason Momoa, if you're listening,

Kate:        We stan you

Aysha:     I like your muscles.

Kate:        Yeah, you're a very attractive man Jason Momoa. I am a lesbian but like I could still aesthetically appreciate Jason Momoa.

Aysha:     God all these episodes where you're just like talking about men, like  Kim Kitsuragi when you said, intermission one. You're like  Kim Kitsuragi, my husband. I was like, Oh, man

Kate:        He's my husband. I have a fictional husband now.

Aysha:     I must meet this man.

Kate:        Yeah, there was a fictional character so powerful that it made me fall in the boy hole.

Sarah:     Incredible, yeah,

Aysha:     I've been in the boy hole my whole life.

Sarah:     Yeah.

Kate:        God bless. It's really hard in the boy hole. Okay, well...

Aysha:     This episode already sucks

Kate:        We're trying to plumb you–You guys haven't had me as a host for a while. So you've had folks that have been trying to make the podcast good, quote, unquote. And so I'm coming back in from the west with my shit army to make this show as bad as fucking possible.

Aysha:     Should we move over there? I feel like it would be easier to quickly do a quick relocate. [Sarah laughs] I'm gonna go grab your coffee. \*they move to a secondary location\* This is amazing.

Kate:        There's a wooden statue of a horse in this room. We just relocated to another room and there's a statue of a horse.

Sarah:     Yeah. Somebody should hop on that piano and play accompanying music.

Kate:        Yeah that would definitely be good for an episode where we're trying not to wake up guy.

Sarah:     This is true.

Kate:        This is like operation the podcast.

Aysha:     Wait, isn't there a 90s board game called Don't Wake Daddy

Kate:        Yes, exactly. But also don't.

Aysha:     That sucks.

Kate:        Yeah.

Aysha:     I hate that.

Kate:        I mean, there were people who were– I mean this was the most common comment on the Eboy Hussie account.

Aysha:     Daddy?

Kate:        We were talking about this yesterday, daddy.

Sarah:     Oh.

Aysha:     It's like–

Aysha:     He said he cherishes every one

Kate:        Yeah, every comment is valuable and important.

Aysha:     Every comment is beautiful. We are all children of God.

Kate:        All replies are valid.

Aysha:     No, they're not.

Kate:         No, they're not.

Kate:         So Twitter's about to come out with this thing where you can set your tweets to not be replied to by anybody. And I bet I'm gonna set every tweet– I'm going to make a proclamation. Because here's the thing, nothing valuable has ever happened in a Twitter reply.

Sarah:   Absolutely nothing.

Kate:      Never. It's a lawless wasteland. Have you seen James's Twitter replies?

Sarah:   They're awful.

Kate:      They're the least funny place on Earth.

Aysha:   The only place worse than James's Twitter replies is Drill's Twitter replies

Kate and Sarah:   Yes, yeah.

Aysha:   That is a wasteland.

Sarah:   Yeah, everybody thinks they're funny.

Kate:      Yeah, well Drill has just started blocking literally everyone who replies to him so yeah.

Aysha:   That's awesome

Sarah:   Such a power move.

Aysha:   Yeah. God, I just like– Drill is just the epitome of not giving a fuck, the level that I want to be at.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Kate:      I can't believe that you're writing Act 2 of a game that Drill was on the writing team for Act 1 of.

Aysha:   I still haven't met– I mean, I could have met him and just not known who he was.

Kate:      Yeah,

Sarah:   That's true.

Aysha:   It's like, oh, who's that intern who held the door open for me at  Whatpumpkin headquarters?

Kate:      Yeah at our big skyscraper downtown penthouse corner office. This is actually– so when you change your name in Florida, you have to get fingerprinted because Florida is a hellscape. So I went in to get fingerprinted when I lived in Florida. And the sheriff's assistant came back in with the prints and were like, 'This is really interesting. Your prints look almost exactly like somebody who was trying to hide their prints.' And he showed them to me and was like, "Look, you've got all these cuts on your fingers.' And I was like, Oh my God. I just –so I've been managing a political campaign this year. And I'd been folding and mailing thousands of pieces of paper, and I got literally thousands of paper cut– like miniature paper cuts on my fingers that made my fingerprints unrecognizable. Like Touch ID never worked for me.

Aysha:   I can't believe that we've just found a way to hide your identity. Just paper cut yourself a lot.

Kate:      Just stuff thousands of envelopes with fundraising letters for county commission.

Sarah:   I like the person that did your prints that came back like Hey, isn't this funny? Oops

Kate:      That's white privilege right there. 100 percent that's white privilege.

Sarah:   Yeah, it's like 'Oh, looks like you've been trying to erase your fingerprints.' and you're like, oh, wow, that's weird.

Kate:      That is weird.

Aysha:   With me they would have been like We're putting you in terrorism jail.

Kate:      Yeah, right. Exactly. Right. Like, here's a charming funny little story about how I escaped you know, it's insane that they– first off they make you fingerprint yourself. Second, you have to go to court twice. Third, it's $600 in Florida

Sarah:   Christ.

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   To change your name?

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   Holy shit.

Kate:      Yeah. So I got the thing. I did the fingerprint part and then I didn't pay the $600. I didn't finish changing my name in Florida. I just didn't because it was too expensive. And I needed that $600 for food and like my lights were getting shut off and shit. Politics doesn't actually pay really well if you have principles.

Aysha:   Yeah. I don't think anything pays well if you have principles.

Kate:      Yeah.

Sarah:   That's why nobody asked them.

Kate:      Yeah,

Aysha:   yeah,

Kate:      Well, I'm broke his shit and I like to think I have principles.[Aysha and Kate laugh]

Aysha:   God. Okay, I guess we're supposed to talk about Homestuck?

Kate:      This week in Homestuck. This is a segment that nobody does anymore.

Sarah:   I do it.

Kate:      You do it? Well, sure. Okay. Get defensive about it. This week

Sarah:   Fuck you.

Aysha:   This week in Homestuck is so many things.

Kate:      There were two Pesterquest routes and a Homestuck^2 update.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Sarah:   That's true.

Aysha:   God that was– I think that Eridan route made me laugh the most of every route except for the Dave route. Like it was– I just was not expecting it.

Sarah:   It's so funny.

Aysha:   Griever did a great job.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Kate:      I mean, I like– you know, I was expecting big things from the Eridan route since obviously, for those who don't know the full story, I requested Eridan and got Vriska instead which is really funny. But I didn't actually ask to write Vriska, I wanted to write Eridan. And my Eridan route would have been way way meaner.

Aysha:   Kate was assigned Vriska at birth.

Kate:      I was assigned Karkat at birth because I'm a cancer.

Aysha:   That's true. [Kate laughs] That's powerful.

Kate:      Yeah, I'm apparently going to cosplay Vriska today at a furry convention.

Aysha:   Yeah, we're going to furry con. Rolling up to the furry con.

Sarah:   Yeah, can't wait.

Kate:      We're gonna go party with furries.

Aysha:   Probably it's gonna– I predict this will rule, actually.

Kate:      Yeah I know right. Well, this is like– furries are awesome.

Sarah:   It's true. We know this.

Aysha:   Yeah, we've always known. And my dad wrote the Feferi route, which was cool. Because he loves a Feferi so much. And

Kate:      I remember when we talked about Feferi when he was on the show.

Aysha:   I know. He said she reminds me of him which was really–

Kate:      Yeah.

Sarah:   Aw.

Aysha:   Which reminds him of me.

Kate:      Yeah, and I went awww.

Aysha:   I think it's because I'm one of those like, because I'm a Pisces and I used to swim.

Kate:      Yeah. [All laugh]

Sarah:   Yeah, I really enjoyed that route. Like it's prose heavy in a way that the rest haven't been and

Aysha:   That's my dad's writing style.

Sarah:   Well, yeah. No, it's very clear that this is somebody who actually knows what the fuck he's doing. And of course everybody's a little mad about it because they don't like having to read.

Aysha:   I mean, like people were saying that it didn't have any insight into Feferi at all, which is not true because a lot of it is about how Feferi, like, feels politically about Alternia and kind of about her hypocrisy kind of a little bit. And how, I guess it's not hypocrisy, it's more like naivete sort of. It's just like, you know, like, let them eat cake sort of.

Sarah:   Right. I feel like the Feferi/Eridan routes together really cap off the Alternia section of the game really well, because that's the two sort of pillars of the game so far has been politics and gender.

Aysha:   Yeah. From the sublime to the ridiculous. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, I don't think I've actually publicly announced this yet, but we're going to take a three week break before the alphas just to you know,

Kate:      Cuz like you're having trouble fitting Jake's entire ass in the game file?

Aysha:   Yeah.[Aysha and Sarah laugh] God, I hate that.

Kate:      Colonel, I'm trying to be in a visual level game.

Aysha:   But I'm dummy thicc

Kate:      But I'm dummy thicc and Steam won't accept the upload.

Sarah:   Every time the artist gives a preview, it's like I don't know why this sprite is like 700 gigs,  it just won't– I tried to compress it and it just won't.

Aysha:   Actually, that happened like the Erdan route. This latest route was pretty hefty, so it took forever to upload and GitHub kept crashing. Like hey bro.

Kate:      GitHub had to prioritize their bandwidth to ICE.

Sarah:   Oh my god.

Aysha:   Yeah, but no I feel like that this route... this volume made me like Eridan more just because the sprites are so good

Sarah:   Oh yeah they were

Kate:      Now you understand. You were present when I had my Eridan Revelation where I became the fully ascended Eridan stan.

Aysha:   Just like the complete like bitch mode of the sprite with the phone

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   Just like oh boy. Also he calls people which is just ungodly.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Kate:      It's just so– I mean, I had this image in my head, but when I talked about stanning Eridan I couldn't communicate it to people. Like I couldn't say what I saw. I couldn't elucidate it into words and then Griever like, reached into my brain and pulled out the Eridan from in there. So he was just this like... complete... I'm trying to decide how many slurs I should say. [All laugh]

Sarah:   You held a secret truth in your heart and Griever saw through the artifice and pulled the truth out and gave it life.

Kate:      Yeah,

Aysha:   Eridan's is just a white feminist.

Kate:      Yeah, he's just kind of a mincing little prick. And I love that about him.

Sarah:   Nice save.

Kate:      Yeah, there we go.

Aysha:   The kind of guy who calls up his buddy at 3am to ask for dick pics, you know that kind of– everyone had that friend.

Kate:      I just genuinely because I loved it because I love Eridan but I don't like how a lot of people who like Eridan try to make him this like UwU soft boy who's just misunderstood entirely right and like gloss over the fact that he's a horrific racist.

Sarah:   Yeah. It's a theme among the boy likers.

Kate:      Yeah, well you can't say that anymore.

Sarah:   Ah shit

Aysha:   I like my boys nasty.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   As a known boy liker.

Kate:      I'm just confused why people stan villains but they don't actually enjoy them being villains. I don't know. It's like villains are fun. I like villains.

Aysha:   I mean, I continue to insist that as a Dirk liker, there is nothing I... The only thing I wanted that

Kate:      That's also a slur, to be fair.

Aysha:   To be a Dirk liker?

Kate:      Dirk liker, yeah.

Aysha:   Well whoops. As someone who enjoys Dirk Strider, there is nothing that I want more than to see Dirk figure out his shit and get a therapist and get better but the thing that I want just as much is to see him completely go apeshit which is what happened.

Kate:      Yeah. Dyke is short for Dirk Liker.

Sarah:   \*deep sigh\*

Aysha:   God damn it.[Kate laughs] Jesus Christ.

Sarah:   Wow.[All laugh] So speaking of Homestuck^2–

Kate:      Speaking of dykes Oh, yeah Homestuck^2 [Sarah wheese laughs].

Sarah:   Y'all with Karkat and Dave wear each other's shirts.

Aysha:   Like, guys, I love DaveKat so much. They're so important to me.

Kate:      When Aysha writes DaveKat, I see it. I get it. I care.

Aysha and Kate:      I care them.

Sarah:   Yeah the bits of DaveKar hinted in the Karkat route were so much fun, and then this is of course, just delicious.

Kate:      I always liked DaveKat. I know that I don't talk about boys as praxis, although that's all falling apart. My head's in my hands. I am in a crisis.

Aysha:   Kim Kitsuragi just got you.

Kate:      He got me.

Aysha:   He broke open the boy seal.

Kate:      Lieutenant Kitsuragi. He ushered in– well, it was Kim Kitsuragi who opened my fictional boy third eye and then Vulfpeck opened my real boy fourth eye.

Aysha:   I can't believe that you...  eventually everybody gets obsessed with a boy...Are Vulfpeck a boy band?

Kate:      Are Vulfpeck boy band? Yeah, Vulfpeck are a boy band but they're like boys from accounting school. Right, which I guess is sort of, I guess that's tailor made for me. I needed a boy band of people who look like they really know their way around Microsoft Excel. [Sarah laughs]

Aysha:   My boy bias, I don't think they've ever turned on a computer. No that's not true. BTS vlogs.

Kate:      They're very online

Aysha:   Yeah they're extremely online.

Sarah:   Yeah

Aysha:   I don't know if they use spreadsheets though. I bet Nam-joon uses spreadsheets.

Sarah:   Shrug I don't know. I don't know what to say.

Kate:      Sara's out of so out of place in this house, which is just–

Aysha:   A boy liking house

Kate:      It's just such a boy liking house. I mean, there's BTS everywhere.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   Yeah, it's good.

Kate:      Anyone who thought oh Andrews Kpop thing is ironic or a gag.

Sarah:   No absolutely not.

Kate:      First off, I don't think he ever has done anything ironically in his life.

Aysha:   Yeah, definitely not. He's very earnest. Yeah, this update was probably, I think, my favorite so far. Just because I missed them. I miss them. I miss Dave Strider.

Kate:      I'm still a first update stan.

Aysha:   It was really good.

Kate:      I still like that one a lot. But that's the only one with Terezi in it. So I'm just like, biased.

Sarah:   Yeah, no, I'm impatient for more Terez but I still like... Getting to spend time with the Omega kids was– that was the one for me. I love those kids. But it is fun to see. I'm enjoying getting to see characters we're not used to seeing talk to each other like Kanaya and Dave and Roxy and Karkat. Like those are just like fun. I like seeing characters bounce off each other in ways we haven't seen before.

Kate:      Yeah, everyone was like I want to see Dirk and Rose talk to each other and they wished on the monkey's paw[Sarah laughs] and it all went wrong. They they had to be kept separated because their megalomania was [Kate sings  first notes of Megalovania]

Sarah:   God damnit Kate.

Aysha:   This is what I was saying. Before I even met Andrew, I was writing an epilogue fic.That's what I called it and in it, it's like Dirk's POV from one part and he's thinking like It's not safe for me to talk to Rose because she is the person who tells me that all my worst qualities are fine. Because she has them. So like, the two of them are enabling each other.

Kate:      They're da–I mean, you know, Rose is a deeply dangerous person.

Aysha:   Yeah, always has been.

Sarah:   Yeah

Kate:      And people kind of forget that and sand the edges off of her.

Aysha:   She was the first villain.

Kate:      Yeah, she was. She was a secondary antagonist of the early acts, and I think that's extremely awesome of her.

Aysha:   Yeah that rules.

Sarah:   Yeah. And then Kanaya came along and shoosh papped her.

Kate:      Yeah, well Kanaya just loves to try to, you know, get a handle on very dangerous women.

Aysha:   She's like, oh, a woman who I can, you know, just have lean on me until I collapse.

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   Perfect.

Kate:      Yeah. That's awesome. That'll keep me from thinking about myself.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   Here's somebody I can fix. Sweet.

Kate:      But yeah, so right now in Homestuck^2, we're still definitely in the table setting zone, right? Where all the different– I mean first of all, because we're coming off of a huge prose novel, I think it's nice to sort of go around and set the various tables and stuff

Aysha:   See what everybody looks like

Kate:      Yeah, see what everybody looks like and you know show what the various separate streams that are happening are.

Aysha:   I'm just holding out for candy Karkat. Just holding out for Big Boss Karkat. As everyone's started calling him

Kate:      I call him Dilfkat.

Sarah:   Dilfkat?

Kate:      Dilfkat yeah.

Aysha:   Does Karkat have dad energy though?

Kate:      Candy Karkat has dad energy.

Aysha:   Ehhhh

Kate:      He's the daddy of the revolution.

Aysha:   Instead of general they call him daddy. [Aysha laughs] That sucks

Kate:      We said daddy more in this episode than any previous episode of the pgen pod.

Aysha:   Let's just call it the daddy episode.

Kate:      I'm calling it Shrek Week.

Sarah:   That's a good episode. Let me sing you the songs of Big Daddy Marx.

Aysha:   Was Marx a daddy? Discuss.

Kate:      Was Marx a daddy?

Aysha:   He was the daddy of communism.

Kate:      Yeah, I guess that's true.

Aysha:   Yeah. This sounds like a Disco Elysium thought. Like internalize the thought.

Kate:      Yeah. Was Kras Mazov the daddy of Mazovian Socio-Economics?[Aysha and Sarah laugh] By the way, we did an intermission about this, but you should play Disco Elisyum. It's very, very good.

Sarah:   Yeah

Aysha:   Yeah, I'm breaking the rule. I'm referring to things that are in intermissions. The cardinal rule, I'm breaking it.

Kate:      I think that's called we're driving engagement to the Patreon.

Sarah:   Ahh

Aysha:   I love to do engagement.

Kate:      Yeah, if you're enjoying this episode of me just sitting around and trying to ruin a podcast on purpose, then you'll love intermission.

Aysha:   Yeah, I speaking of engagement, I now get art emails from like a lot of them are probably phishing, scams and stuff like that. But I get emails being like as an influencer, we would like you to hock our products and like.

Sarah:   No.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Kate:      I used to get a ton of those when I worked in gaming. But what I did get was I got a bunch of free computer hardware from gaming companies for being a gaming influencer. And the problem is that it all glows with various shades of LED rainbow lighting.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Kate:      And so my work PC is a Technicolor nightmare, but I got it all for free. So

Aysha:   I wish someone would give me free stuff.

Kate:      Yeah. That's the thing is, when I worked in gaming, and I made good money, everyone also gave me a bunch of free shit.

Aysha:   That's how it works.

Kate:      Yeah

Aysha:   Yeah. Well, you know, being poor is very expensive.

Kate:      Yeah, it is.

Aysha:   Jesus christ.

Sarah:   I love it.

Kate:      I think we're a little bit lost.

Aysha:   Yeah, we got lost. Disco Elysium launched us into class warfare.

Kate:      A softball critique of the class system. Yeah.

Sarah:   Could you explain what religion Kanaya is?

Kate:      No.

Sarah:   No? Okay.

Aysha:   We're not gonna do that.

Sarah:   Yeah. I know.

Aysha:   She's not wearing a hijab though people. That's not what a hijab is.

Sarah:   The people want to know.

Kate:      I think she's just thinking about her wife a lot, it's my impression, and she's just  super dramatic. So

Sarah:   Yeah, I love her.

Aysha:   I mean, Maraym is an arab name. So like, Yes, I do. I do like the– I love her outfit, though. It's so cool. I love the rose. And the scarf. Yeah. So she's in mourning.

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   God. I'm really glad that we got to unpack– we got to hear a little bit more of her instead of her just raging.

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   Because that was step one but now it's reached to acceptance.

Sarah:   This is what's good about like these early updates right now is that nothing is happening. Everybody's sort of waiting for the thing to happen.

Aysha:   How are your feelings?

Sarah:   So yeah, it's just like right now we're just checking in on emotionally and I think that's a great breather after the epilogues.

Aysha:   Homestuck has always been a lot of people sitting around waiting for events to happen and what that feels like. Because so much action happens offstage. It's like, oh, yeah. Do you remember this thing that we just did? And it's like, I've said it before, but it's very Shakespearean referring to circumstances that did not happen on stage. Because this is not the medium to impart those things. Because same with just having fight scenes in books. It's like, sure, okay, but after a certain time, it's like, and then he punched the guy, and then he punched him back. And it's like, okay, some people are really good at that. But typically, I'm just like, Okay, then they fought. Cuz that's not what a book is for.

Kate:      Yeah, I've written a couple good action scenes in my day, but the thing is it's fun to write action scenes, but they're just junk food. There's almost never anything of value imparted in them.

Sarah:   Yeah. I Try to make them be like there's one fight scene I wrote that was from Dirk's perspective and the whole thing is him trying to describe a cool anime battle but it's also against Roxy and he's trying to convince himself no this is fine it doesn't matter and he keeps like falling back into like but I don't want to hurt her

Aysha:   Well the point of prose, and my dad is the person who said this, and he said the point of prose is to take a moment and extend it so you can have something that happens in like a second but you can dwell on it for like a chapter. The only other thing that does is a sports anime but. So like to go through.

Sarah:   Sorry. Sorry, is this the way that we get you into anime by making you watch sports anime?

Kate:      \*intense deep sigh\* Uggghhhhhhhh.

Sarah:   Ha ha ha.

Aysha:   No if there were a sports anime as good as a sports anime about girls, I would say this would be the way But sports anime is all boys.

Kate:      I watch Real Sports. I have enough sports in my life. I think

Aysha:   Yeah. You don't need any

Kate:      I'm a jock. Yeah, I insist, as I sit here, you know, weak and frail.

Aysha:   Weak butch jock.

Kate:      Weak butch jock.Yeah.

Aysha:   Those are all just your attributes. What was I saying? Oh yeah, if you have a fight scene and you're dwelling on the emotional states inside of the scene, and it's the same with sex scenes. It's like, I don't want to read a sex scene that's just like, this went in this hole.

Kate:      Yeah, that's porn. That's just pornography. There's no– that's fine.

Aysha:   There's you know, a time and a place. But the interesting parts are the, what's going on in the brains.

Kate:      Yeah, it's like I've written one fic with sex. And it was mostly a fade to black like,

Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   But it's like, yes, it's like the point of prose is to

Kate:      I should say, I've written one Homestuck fic with sex. I've definitely with my past fics no one will ever find.

Aysha:   Yeah. So yeah. It's like that's the point. So that's I think why the epilogue hits so hard is because we've seen these characters do horrible things to each other, but we've never heard their thoughts while they do them.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah. Yeah.

Aysha:   Like especially the Jane and Jake stuff is made so much worse because you get Jane's internal monologue about how much disdain she has for this person that she's using.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah

Aysha:   And it's like, oh, boy, this makes this worse.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   Oh Jane.

Kate:      Yeah Jane

Sarah:   Oh Jane.

Kate:      Ever just think about Jane Crocker?

Aysha:   Yeah. Every day.

Sarah:   No.I am not one of you.

Aysha:   I love Jane.

Sarah:   Oh, I love her too. I don't know. It's weird how writing fanfiction has made me like all of the Homestuck characters more. The second I try to get into their head I'm like, I don't want to deal with this person. I don't know how to write them. And then they just take over and they're like, Well, let me.

Aysha:   So basically with nepeta I was like I've never had feeling about Nepeta in my life. And then I sat down to write her route. And I was like, Oh, no, I love her now.

Kate:      Yeah.

Sarah:   Yeah, she's great. There's a reason why everybody loves these characters, they just sort of forget who they actually were. And, you know,

Kate:      They disappear into the fannon shroud where characters get certain attributes played up, and others completely disregarded and ignored.

Aysha:   Right. I mean, it's, I mean, and I think that so much of that is just a, as usual, a result of the platforms that we engage with fandom in because  back in the day, when everybody was in forums or on live journal, there was much much more like encouragement of deep engagement with content. On LiveJournal there were no likes. You couldn't like something. If you wanted to respond to somebody's fic or art you had to leave a comment. And even if it was just 'sweet' or something like that, it creates more of an engaged like, nuanced level. But on Twitter, it's just like, oh, when we just look at 800 things. And I don't know I'm hypocrite because I'm like terminally on Twitter just because like it–

Kate:      There's a lot of accounts that post pictures of birds. So that's why I'm here

Aysha:   Yeah. But like, I think that Twitter is ruining fandom I really do. I agree.

Kate:      Well, I mean, social platforms in general are. Twitter is not, you know. This is the thing people are always like: well one's better than the other. No like Twitter, Instagram, Tumblr, Reddit.

Aysha:   They all suck ass.

Kate:      They're all hellholes.

Sarah:   Yeah, they're all designed from the ground up to monetize outrage and encourage outrage.

Aysha:   Yeah. So we get put in this pressure cooker that is designed to make us mad so we engage. Which is a good thing to remember when you're really mad on Twitter, and you go on to like, if you see some shit that just drives you insane. It's like you are being controlled.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   Like this is what they want.

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   But like, I mean, I am still you know, I'll be Ugh. And my girlfriend will be like, what?And I'm like someone is wrong on the internet.

Kate:      There's a take.

Aysha:   All these people are mad about DaveKat and everyone's like log off and I'm like, no.

Sarah:   I like feeling mad. It feels like something I'm doing matters. You know? That's the thing is anger is gratifying.

Aysha:   Right? But also it's like and I try to tell myself this constantly. I'm like, these people who are yelling at me, they're not mad at me.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   They're mad at the circumstances of their life, of which I am a face kind of. And it's like, when everybody's constantly– let's talk about capitalism some more. Everybody is exhausted by their lives and by their jobs and by the news and just being like, having all the life sucked out of you. And then you get online and try to engage with the thing that brings you joy. And when that thing hurts you, it's like how could you like How could you do this to me? It's you your fault that I feel this way and it's like no it's not.

Kate and Sarah:   Yeah

Aysha:   It's like because I'm using this to try to feel less dead inside myself.

Sarah:   Yeah. It is wild the feeling of the artist exists to create a thing for me and like art does not mean anything to the creator somehow it's like if this thing hurts me that's a fault as if there was no direction behind it like no reason for it to be a painful thing. It's wild how it becomes a one sided thing. It is like turning art into a product it's like

Aysha:   Yup yup yup.

Sarah:   When you go to Walmart and you pick something off the shelf you don't think what was the Skittles corporation's intention behind this bag of Skittles?

Aysha:   To taste the rainbow?

Sarah:   To taste the Rainbow. Yeah, exactly.

Aysha:   I don't know. It's like I know that not everybody is like this, but watching characters that I love, struggle and fail even is like, I like that it makes me feel bad but also good on the other side of that because it's like not everything is easy. And of course I like to read fluffy fanfic. I write it. It's fun you know, but at the same time, it's like... I was about to say it doesn't have any meat. Thanks for ruining that one. But I don't know. It's like, sometimes I want that but it's like you need a varied diet it's like sometimes I want to see people not be happy. Yeah, because I'm not happy all the time.

Aysha:   I have a deep soft spot for shonin in anime where like, in My Hero Academia every time Deku loses, gets

Aysha:   Kate left because we're talking about anime.

Sarah:   Bye. Anytime Deku loses, and he has this moment of being down on the ground and having the shit kicked out of him and it's really sad and then he has that like, no I can overpower this because of the power of my friends and he finds some new secret power level or whatever. That shit always makes me cry because I like seeing characters fail and then find something in themselves and persist and it's unrealistic it's childish I don't give a shit. Seeing characters fail and then succeed by virtue of just sticking to it does make me feel better. It's inspiring to me?

Aysha:   Right. The thing that's really got me fucked up, you can come back Kate, I'm talking about capitalism again. The thing that's got me real fucked up about the commodification of art is the commodification of hope sort of? Like this new... I don't know. Like these Disney stories that is like hits of dopamine so you don't take... I don't know. I mean, like, I don't think it's like a giant conspiracy to keep everybody quiet, though it could be. But this idea hope core like, I don't know, it's like that we don't have to change. Society can stay the same as it is, but we can just escape and there's nothing wrong with escapist fiction that's like my whole life. That's what I make. But at the same time sometimes I'm like, Am I doing the wrong thing? Is creating art to make people feel good actually part of the problem? I don't know and it worries me.

Sarah:   It worries me too but I always have to step back and realize the level at which I'm making things does not... I don't know I always try to find a balance between something that makes people feel good and something that challenges folks. I think there's a place– I used to be a big fan of Christopher Nolan as a creator and I always thought

Aysha:   That's the prestige guy right?

Sarah:   Yeah, The Dark Knight, yeah. I used to be a big fan of his because of all the directors who try to do big things that are candy Hollywood movies, Nolan was somebody who used the artifice of the Hollywood blockbuster to try to explore interesting ideas. And they weren't always well executed. And they're often very shallow, but they are interesting. And I always thought it was a very good example of you can take the artifice of something that is very commercially viable and hide something more challenging at its core. And that's what I thought for a long time. But now I've come around this idea that a lot of progress of art has actually operated on that assumption for a long time. Because in America communist has been a dirty word since the Red Scare. And meanwhile, conservatives just sort of say what they think.  Neo nazis online are just neo nazis online. And so I've come around on this and I think now it's like,

Aysha:   The use of subtly is over.

Sarah:   Yeah. Now we just need to say what we believe like, it's time for us to say the quiet part loud too.

Aysha:   Right. I think there's been a lot of that... this year, there's been a lot of just kind of blatantly like, but like, you're talking about hiding radical messages inside of typical things. Like Knives Out I felt did that. Everybody watch Knives Out. Because I thought it was just gonna be like, Clue 2. I thought it was gonna be whodunit and then I was like \*gasps\*.

Sarah:   Yeah. Yeah, it's a it's a whodunit about–

Aysha:   Don't say what it's about.

Sarah:   Oh you're right, you're right.

Aysha:   Because I feel like that it's so fun to just jump into that. Kate's back.

Kate:      Did you guys get it out of your system?

Aysha:   Yeah. We got the anime out of our system. Going into Knives Out and not knowing what it was about was like–

Sarah:   Yeah

Aysha:   I just I'm like looking at my friends like,

Kate:      It was so delightful. Every time I was just like shockingly delighted by it.

Aysha:   Yeah. I love to look at Daniel Craig so that also was good. And just like I always say like, I like Daniel Craig way more than I feel like I have any reason to. He's not even handsome to the level that I like him. I just love Daniel Greg. Fuck you James Bond.

Sarah:   Yeah

Kate:      I liked Skyfall.

Aysha:   I love Skyfall. I think that's a really good movie.

Kate:      Sarah is a Skyfall hater.

Aysha:   Really?

Sarah:   I'm not a Skyfall hater. I just don't care. I watched it and I thought that's all right. I don't know.

Aysha:   I mean to enjoy a James Bond movie I have to turn my brain off.

Kate:      Yeah, like that's, I mean, yeah, that's fine.

Aysha:   I just think Silva– I thought he was a really good villain. No Country for Old Men guy was a really good villain.

Sarah:   Yeah. Javier Bardem. Yeah.

Kate:      I liked Casino Royale as well.

Sarah:   Oh yeah, Casino Royale was pretty good.

Aysha:   I also really like Ben Whishaw for also no reason so watching the combination of Daniel Craig and Ben Whishaw was like oh a movie that I can get behind.

Kate:      And they had Ralph Fiennes who I am a noted stan of.

Aysha:   Yeah. Also that Bond song for that one slaps. The Adele song rolls.

Kate:      Yeah, it does.

Aysha:   Isn't Billie Eilish doing the new James Bond song?

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   It should just be I'm the Bond Guy.[Kate and Sarah laugh] Bad Guy 2.

Sarah:   Oh my god. Wow

Kate:      I'm the bond guy. God, I'm actually excited about the new one, No Time to Die, because the director directed all of season one of True Detective, which I think is a masterpiece.

Aysha:   The good one yeah.

Sarah:   Yeah. Cary Fukunaga.

Kate:      Yeah.

Sarah:   Yeah. I've Fukunaga's and stuff. There's another Netflix show he did called maniac that is very, very good.

Aysha:   Rami Malek is in the new Bond film. Of course he's playing a terrorist because he is Arab. So therefore must be a terrorist. An eco terrorist, which I feel like could be great or terrible, depending on

Sarah:   They're not gonna do it well. I am curious to see because they're switching out where Bond is going to become a woman after this. And they have the woman who's going to replace them in this movie. So I'm like, yeah, it's a black woman.

Aysha:   A new Double 0, yeah.

Sarah:   Yeah. So I think that there's potential there.

Aysha:   I wonder if they're gonna kill Daniel Craig in this.

Sarah:   I'm sure that– you know, I don't know. Because the first assumption is, oh, they're going to kill him. And that immediately makes me think okay, so they're not going to do that.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Sarah:   But then again, I thought

Aysha:   But Bond movies have never subverted my expectations.

Sarah:   Yeah, I mean, like, when, Judi Dench announced that she was no longer gonna be part of Bond movies. I was like, I was just gonna die in this and then she did. It's like alright there you go.

Aysha:   Yeah. I mean, that's not the point of– I feel like the Bond films would be better if they took themselves a little less seriously.

Kate:      Well then you'd like the Pierce Brosnan era. Like basically every Bond movie before Daniel Craig.

Aysha:   Yeah, it's like they don't know what they are. It's like they're struggling. It's like they struggle between this ridiculous level and then serious and it's like, you gotta... I feel like you have to commit to one.

Sarah:   Well, it's literally the Daniel Craig era came about because the Bourne Identity was so popular.

Aysha:   Oh, yeah.

Sarah:   And it was like we gotta do the shaky cam, gritty realistic action star type thing and Casino Royale did a pretty good job imitating that. But then the whole thing sort of fell off the rails.

Aysha:   Yeah. Well, I mean, it's like metal gear is just let's take James Bond and take it to ridiculous extremes. Like it's just like a parody of James Bond, the American action hero, but like, Oh, yeah, also, like the one– back to Homestuck, anyway.

Sarah:   Oh, yeah.

Kate:      Homestuck?

Aysha:   Homestuck? Look, I just want to talk about Daniel Craig, listen. Yes that that was a Metal Gear reference and it was me. But everybody's like Homestuck is Metal Getal– Metal Gear is Homestuck now. It's like the thing I think I've seen people talk about the most.

Kate:      And Andrew yesterday was just like Homesuck's always been Metal Gear.

Aysha:   Yeah, it has. Playing Sons of Liberty I was like, oh, it is Homestuck.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   This is just Homestuck.

Kate:      Wow pester logs are just codec conversations.

Sarah:   [ laughs the word yeah]

Aysha:   You're right.

Sarah:   Ah shit. Blowing this one wide open.

Aysha:   And I mean, candy feels like a Metal Gear game, this sort of just, Is any of this actually happening? Or is it just kind of? I feel like yeah, it's just like, should I take this seriously? Probably not.

Kate:      It's dreamlike, with these big like, Titanic, ridiculous figures representing various facets of imperialism like heteronormativity or whatever. Like, you know, Kojima's not subtle.

Sarah:   No

Aysha:   He never has been.

Kate:      And Homestuck isn't particularly subtle either.

Aysha:   Yeah. Like, I'd always heard about how sexist Kojima was, and I was like, Okay, and then I started playing the first game and I was like, Yes, but also, like, there is like a level of satire here that is like every single woman throwing themselves at this murderer? Like immediately.

Kate:      I just don't think Metal Gear has a notably lesser role for women than most western video games.

Aysha:   No, I was actually shocked by how many women there were in Metal Gear because, I don't know, there's so many video games and anime that have no women, and people are like– Oh, look, it's like, as usual. Is it more sexist to have no women or is it more sexist to have a sexist depiction of women? Like I think that that's always like– I've seen people say , Oh, I don't like to play games with women in them because they're always sexualized and stuff so the solution is to just don't have any woman at all. Like, also, Metal Gear–

Kate:   Well the men are sexualized too.

Aysha:   Yeah, it's like Snakes ass is in every frame.

Sarah:   Oh, yeah. Metal Gear Solid four. Four is an interesting case because there's this whole cabal of dangerous women and they have interesting stories, but they're also highly sexualized in a way that sucks. And I think that's like the perfect– I know, you haven't gotten there yet but it's the perfect encapsulation of this conversation. I don't know.

Aysha:   Right But just like this sort of like over the top like, Yeah, that's just the way that every woman throws themselves at Snake regardless of whatever is going on is very like, this is what happens in American action films from the 80s.

Kate:    Yeah.

Aysha:   Which I thought was really fascinating. So when everyone's like, Oh, yeah, well, Kojima's horrible at women and I was like, I don't think I agree with that. I don't know. The women of Death Stranding are all really fascinating.

Kate:      Yeah, yeah, I'm completely fascinated by them. There's, unfortunately Freud.

Aysha:   I mean always. This is Rose Lalonde's whole deal. Unfortunately Freud.

Kate:      Yeah unfortunately, Freud. Yeah, I mean Death Stranding is fascinating. I was fascinated by it. I'm still fascinated by it.

Aysha:   I'm fascinated that... Norman Reedus. You can just do everything with that man's body in that.

Kate:      Yeah.

Sarah:   It's true.

Aysha:   Oh, boy. Like, what is it? I don't even know what day it is but it's Saturday. Sarah:

It's Saturday now.

Kate:      Saturday. Yeah, it's pgenpod day. Yeah,

Aysha:   I like how we just woke up and we're like, oh, maybe we should do a pgenpod. I don't know.

Sarah:   Yeah, I fucked up.

Aysha:   Yeah it happens to the best of us.

Kate:      Sometimes you schedule to record with somebody and then you remember that you're actually going to be in Andrew's house.

Sarah:   Well, specifically, it was oh we're gonna be on the road physically incapable of recording a podcast.

Kate:      Yeah, Sarah got to listen to me sing along to my music library for six hours.

Sarah:   Oh, it's been longer than that. It's been like the entire time I've been with you.

Kate:      Well I'm charming, so it's all right. And my music taste is great.

Sarah:   It's only They Might Be Giants.

Kate:      That's not true.

Sarah:   It's mostly They Might Be Giants.

Kate:      That's not even true either.

Aysha:   While we're hanging out over Christmas you did indoctrinate me into Vulfpeck. I really did like the live show it ruled. I have to get my dad to listen to it. He would love Vulfpeck because he loves funk that you can't fuck to.

Kate:      Yeah, exactly. Vulfpeck is so perfect. It's practically asexual funk. [Aysha and Sarah laugh]

Aysha:   I feel like that then... And then my thing that I got into this year was BTS and I feel like it's on the opposite end of the same spectrum. It's sort of like... everything like sort of like...very, very, like, what's the fucking word intentionally horny? In a very self conscious way, which is weird. But also I'm like, Oh, I can't stop looking at this kind of way. Like, oh god if you want to talk about capitalism, the Kpop industry is very good at capitalism.

Kate:      Yeah. We have BTS Uno.

Sarah:   Yeah. It's something.

Aysha:   And the same thing. And I always ask myself when people are like the Kpop industry is so bad. I'm like, worse than the American music industry? Cus it's bad here too.

Kate:      Are workers exploited?

All:   Yes.

Kate:      Are workers exploited in every industry?

All:   Yes.

Kate:      I don't think the answer is actually not liking Kpop. I think the answer is revolution.

Sarah:   Yeah.

Aysha:   That's why when people are like, Oh, Kpop is so x and y. I'm like, that's just that's a racist take.

Sarah:   Yeah, well, Yeah, I mean, everything that they say about BTS was true of The Beatles, but because it was the Beatles like, oh, that rules.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Kate:      Well, I don't think anybody today thinks the Beatles rule, really.

Sarah:   Okay? I-I don't

Kate:      There were years of like– I just remember the years of Tumblr anti Beatles backlash.

Aysha:   Really?

Kate:      Yeah, it's really funny.

Aysha:   That's a rabbit hole, never heard of that.

Kate:      Yeah, it's a real thing.

Aysha:   God, what, a– I think that this is just like the perfect encapsulation of Tumblr, because like, What a stupid thing to get mad about. It's been years y'all. It's been decades.

Sarah:   Yeah, just just walk away to bricks.

Kate:      Here's a quote Quincy Jones was asked his first impressions of the Beatles. And he said they were the worst musicians in the world. He told interviewer David Marchese they were no playing motherfuckers Paul McCartney was the worst bass player ever heard. Ringo, don't even talk about it. Jones recalled arranging Love is a Many Splendored thing for stars 1970 debut solo album sentiments journey, Ringo had taken three hours for a four bar thing he was trying to fix on the song. He couldn't get it. We said mate, why don’t you get some lager and lime, some shepherd’s pie, and take an hour-and-a-half and relax a little bit. In the interim Jones called English jazz drummer Ronnie Verrell into the studio. Ronnie came in for 15 minutes and tore it up. Ringo comes back and says George, can you play it back for me one more time. So George did and Ringo says that didn't sound so bad. And I say yeah, motherfucker because it ain't you. Great guy though.[Aysha and Sarah laugh]

Sarah:   Oh my god. Wow

Aysha:   I like to dunk on the Beatles.  I mean the way I feel about the Beatles is the way I feel about a lot of bands. I'm like, fine. Like

Kate:      I was a big Beatles buff growing up

Sarah:   Me too

Aysha:   I'm not like turn that shit off. I'm just like, okay, there's the Beatles. Like I wasn't brought up on them. Like I think a lot of people's dads play them The Beatles and shit like my dad played The Police and Steely Dan

Kate:      My dad liked Rush.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Sarah:   One of the first albums I owned was the Beatles number one collection.

Kate:      Yeah me too.

Sarah:   I listened to that non stop.

Sarah:   Yeah, I love the yeah.

Aysha:   The first album I ever bought was the Police album Synchronicity, which is the kind of child I was.

Sarah:   Wow. The first album I bought with my own money was, I think, one of Eminem's albums. And my mom took me to the record store and I bought a tape cassette and we listened to it on the way home and within five minutes my mom turned it off and then turned the car around and said we have to take this back because you can't listen to it. [Sarah and Kate laugh]

Kate:      The first album I bought with my own money with They Might Be Giants The Else.

Aysha:   Yeah, gosh. It was a while ago. I'm so old.

Kate:      Yeah.

Aysha:   I can't believe I'm gonna be 31 in two weeks, two months, guys.

Sarah:   Two months.

Aysha:   Yeah.

Sarah:   Wow. I'm almost there. It will be four months for me.

Aysha:   God.

Kate:      Baby.

Aysha:   Yeah,

Sarah:   Baby.

Aysha:   So like 30 rules though. I've had such a better time being 30 than I did throughout any of my 20s like everybody being like, Oh, old. I'm like, nope. It's good.

Kate:      I'm looking forward to being 30. I'm looking forward to undergoing a continual process of milfification. The only thing I'm not looking forward to about my 30s is that my body is already deteriorating at a rapid rate and I'm worried that I will just dissolve into a pile of dust at some point over the next decade.

Aysha:   I mean, I don't know. I  hit 24 and I suddenly cannot drink anymore. Like, in college. Fuck it. Just like, whatever. I could drink the nastiest shit and be fine and go to class the next day.

Kate:      Jäger red bull?

Aysha:   Yeah, now it's like two beers. And I'm like, Oh, I feel a little bad the next day. I was like, ah so old. I mean, your body's like, you're poisoning yourself. And I'm like, I know. Shut up, let me do it.

Sarah:   Yeah that's the point. Come on.

Kate:      World is bad.

Aysha:   World is bad just get so fucked up that you forget you're a cop. More Disco Elysium.

Kate:      Play Disco Elysium. That's our show.

Aysha:   Wouldn't it be fucking horrible to wake up one day and you just don't remember anything and then a guy tells you that you're a cop.

Kate:      I know

Aysha:   Like imagine that.

Kate:      I know,

Sarah:   It's like every day on Twitter.[Aysha and Kate laugh] And that's our show.

Kate:      All right.

Aysha:   Stop snitching.

Kate:      You can find the show perfectlygenericpodcast.com on iTunes, Spotify, Google Play, overcast wherever you get your podcasts. The show is made possible by the patrons. The support that you give to the show is shared equitably with everyone who makes this show possible. And I wanted to thank our Skylark tier patrons right now. [names]

Aysha:   This is getting so long.

Kate:      I know we have so many supporters. It's very nice. And for just $1 an episode, you get access to the entirety of intermission, a bonus podcast where we get a little loopy.

Sarah:   Yeah, we did one over dinner or over lunch.

Kate:      Yeah. You can come listen to me, Sarah, Rory and Xtine have lunch.

Aysha:   That's like, you know, with a podcast you feel like you're just hanging out and having lunch with the people.

Kate:      You can  deepen your parasocial relationship with me for just $1 an episode. I should  do friend ASMR where I just ask you about your day and stuff.

Aysha:   Your next album.

Kate:     Yeah, exactly. All right. Goodbye, everybody. I hope we didn't wake up Andrew.

[outro]