Talk:Alessandra Mussolini

message: I feel sorry for the person who intends to write up articles for each one of those god-awful films!!--Lacatosias 09:30, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Films 

message: Here we go again. Someone is trying to disguise the fundamental, undeniable, self-proclaimed fact that this wacko is a fascist in the purest "Salute il Duce", totalitarian sense of that term. Her party is  a breakaway from the National Alliance (formerly MSI of Benito Mussolini) because she was disgusted with Fini's rejection of fascism as "the absolute evil" and his demonstration of anti-racism in going to visit Isreal. She is extremely proud of her grandfather and has always done everything within her power to defend his sickening and horrifying fascist record. I wish the footsoldiers of Sam Spade and others on this 'pedia would cut out the attempts to whitewash the history of fascism, nazism and all the other abominable right-wing isms which have caused such damned destruction to humanity over the last century. --Lacatosias 13:42, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, that's exactly what I wrote, isn't it? Gosh, I'm taken aback by your brilliant reading comprehension skills.--Lacatosias 13:27, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, yes, essentially that is what you wrote. "Right-wing isms," whatever those are, you claim have caused incomparable destruction; yet the Soviets caused the same amount of destruction in one single year's time, eg, holodomor. So what was your point exactly? 216.185.250.92 (talk) 06:40, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

text: I guess he refered to the part in which you blamed the right for attempts to destroy mankind. So there is nothing wrong with his reading comprehension skills. :P PS: Do you really believe that e.g. Hitler was right-wing? He was a damn socialist... (National Socialist German Workers Party, wasn't it?) Kundziad
Yeah its weird. Nazism was an extreme right and it was under a socialist heading. Additionaly Hitler didn't really give a damn about the workers, he used them as weapon building puppets, which created an illusion that he gave them work. Right parties concentrate on giving power and wealth to the government while left parties concentrate on helping people. I am guessing Hitler used the socialist logo in order not to appear to radical and different, virtually all his opponents were other socialists, so he also decided to introduce himself as a socialist, which he obviously wasn't since he used all the resources gathered by population to supply Germany with weaponry. His socialist stance was however justified by the fact that during his reign German people always had work, mostly in war industry. Other than that, no other examples of socialism in Germany were in practice.--Gusiman 07:06, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

text: Wow!! A well-known and documented  member of the Italian right-wing terrorist organization of free-masons and mafiosi P2 has made an alliance with an unreconstructed racist who continues to defend a man (her grandfather) who commited one of the most atrocious and underreported genocidal campaigns to extermine black Africans in the history of mankind in Ethiopia.I think that's pretty horrifying regardless of party and ideological labels, don't you?? --Lacatosias 12:14, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Wasn't this "campaign to exterminate black africans" actually just a war against an idependence movement in one of Italy's overseas colonies? the very same thing that had been done by Britian, Germany, Belgium, France, Spain etc etc over the age of empires. Mussolini did allow the use of flamethrowers and poison gas in the war on ethiopia, cruel weapons yes, but weapons that where used by the "good" Britian, United states and, yes, Italy in the first world war. Flamethrower use even continued into the Second world war and Vietnam, while Landmines, arguably even worse weapons as they hang around after the end of a war to maim civilians, continue to be used today by various regimes, even "the good guys". Mussolini may have done some evil things, but what nation and government hasn't at some point?Felneymike (talk) 16:47, 4 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Whitewashing the facts.. 

message: This a very helpful and informative excerpt from the article fascism which helps to clear up the relationship between fascism and socialism on the one hand - fascism was fundamentally anti-socialist from the very beginning - and provides a throughly documented account of the actions of Allesandra's beloved grandfather on the other. Please read and educate yourselves just a tiny bit (if that is even possible):
"In this fluid situation, Mussolini took advantage of the opportunity and, rapidly abandoning the early socialist and republican program, put himself at the service of the antisocialist cause. The fascist militias, supported by the wealthy classes and by a large part of the state apparatus which saw in him the restorer of order, launched a violent offensive against the syndicalists and all political parties of a socialist or Catholic inspiration, particularly in the north of Italy (Emiglia Romagna, Toscana, etc.), causing numerous victims though the substantial indifference of the forces of order. These acts of violence were, in large part, provoked by fascist squadristi who were increasingly and openly supported by Dino Grandi, the only real competitor to Mussolini for the leadership of the fascist party until the Congress of Rome in 1921.
The violence increased considerably during the period from 1920-1922 until the March on Rome. Confronted by 
these badly armed and badly organized fascist militias attacking the Capital, King Victor Emmanuel III, preferring to avoid any spilling of blood, decided to appoint Mussolini, who at that moment had the support of about 22 deputies in Parliament, President of the Council. Victor Emmanuel continued to maintain control of the armed forces: if he had wanted to, he would have had no difficulties in booting Mussolini and the completely inferior fascist forces out of Rome. Therefore, it is not appropriate to refer to Mussolini's rise as a "coup d'etat" since he obtained his post legally with the blessing of the sovereign of the nation.
As Prime Minister, the first years of Mussolini's reign were characterized by a coalition government composed of nationalists, liberals and populists and did not assume dictatorial connotations until the assassination of Matteotti. In domestic politics, Mussolini favoured the complete restoration of State authority, with the integration of the Fasci di Combattimento into the armed forces (the foundation in January 1923 of the Milizia Voluntaria per la Sicurezza Nazionale) and the progressive identification of the Party with the State. In political and social economy, 'he emanated legislation that favoured the wealthy industrial and agrarian classes (privatizations, liberalizations of rent laws and dismantlement of the unions).
In June of 1923, a new majoritarian electoral law was approved which assigned two thirds of the seats in Parliament to the coalition which had obtained at least 25% of the votes. This law was punctually applied in the elections of 6 April 1924, in which the fascist "listone" obtained an extraordinary success, aided by the use of shenanigans, violence and intimidatory tactics against opponents.
The assassination of the socialist deputy Giacomo Matteotti, who had requested the annulment of the elections because of the irregularities committed, provoked a momentary crisis of the Mussolini government. The weak response of the opposition (the secession of the Aventine), incapable of transforming their posturing into a mass antifascist action, was not sufficient to distance the ruling classes and the Monarchy from Mussolini who, on 3 January 1925, broke open the floodgates and, in a famous discourse in which he took upon himself all of the responsibility for the assassination of Matteoti and the other squadrist violence, proclaimed 
a de facto dictatorship, suppressing every residual liberty and completing the identification of the Fascist Party with the State.
From 1925 until the middle of the 1930's, fascism experienced little and isolated opposition, although that which it experienced was memorable, consisting in large part of communists such as Antonio Gramsci, socialists such as Pietro Nenni and liberals such as Piero Gobetti and Giovanni Amendola. 
While failing to outline a coherent program, fascism evolved into a new political and economic system that combined corporatism, totalitarianism, nationalism, and anti-Communism in a state designed to bind all classes together under a capitalist system. This was a new capitalist system, however, one in which the state seized control of the organization of vital industries. Under the banners of nationalism and state power, Fascism seemed to synthesize the glorious Roman past with a futuristic utopia. 
Despite the themes of social and economic reform in the initial Fascist manifesto of June 1919, the 'movement came to be supported by sections of the middle class fearful of socialism and communism. Industrialists and landowners supported the movement as a defense against labour militancy. Under threat of a fascist March on Rome, in October 1922, Mussolini assumed the premiership of a right-wing coalition Cabinet initially including members of the pro-church Partito Popolare (People's Party). 
The regime's most lasting political achievement was perhaps the Lateran Treaty of February 1929 between the Italian state and the Holy See. Under this treaty, the Papacy was granted temporal sovereignty over the Vatican City and guaranteed the free exercise of Roman Catholicism as the sole state religion throughout Italy in return for its acceptance of Italian sovereignty over the Pope's former dominions. 
In the 1930s, Italy recovered from the Great Depression, and achieved economic growth in part by developing domestic substitutes for imports (Autarchia). The draining of the malaria-infested Pontine Marshes south of Rome was one of the regime's proudest boasts. But growth was undermined by international sanctions following Italy's October 1935 invasion of Ethiopia (the Abyssinia crisis), and by the government's costly military support for Franco's Nationalists in Spain.
The invasion of Ethiopia was accomplished rapidly (the proclamation of Empire took place in May of 1936) and involved several 'atrocities such as the use of chemical weapons (mustard gas and phosgene) and the indiscriminate slaughter of much of the local population to prevent opposition.
The armed forces disposed of a vast arsenal of grenades and bombs loaded with mustard gas which were dropped from airplanes. This substance was also sprayed directly from above like an "insecticide" on to enemy combatants and villages. It was Mussolini himself who authorized the use of the weapons: "Rome, 27 October '35. A.S.E. Graziani. The use of gas as an ultima ratio to overwhelm enemy resistance and in case of counterattack is authorized. Mussolini." "Rome, 28 December '35. A.S.E. Badoglio. Given the enemy system I have authorized V.E. the use even on a vast scale of any gas and flamethrowers. Mussolini." Mussolini and his generals sought to cloak the operations of chemical warfare in the utmost secrecy, but the crimes of the fascist army were revealed to the world through the denunciations of the International Red Cross and of many foreign observers. The Italian reaction to these revelations consisted in the "erroneous" bombardment (at least 19 times) of Red Cross tents posted in the areas of military encampment of the Ethiopian resistance. The orders imparted by Mussolini, with respect to the Ethiopian population, were very clear: "Rome, 5 June 1936. A.S.E. Graziani. All rebels taken prisoner must be killed. Mussolini." "Rome, 8 July 1936. A.S.E. Graziani. I have authorized once again V.E. to begin and systematically conduct a politics of terror and extermination of the rebels and the complicit population. Without the legge taglionis one cannot cure the infection in time. Await confirmation. Mussolini."  The predominant part of the work of repression was carried out by Italians who, besides the bombs laced with mustard gas, instituted lagers, installed public gallows, killed hostages, and mutilated the corpses of their enemies. Graziani ordered the elimination of captured guerrillas by way of throwing them out of airplanes in mid-flight. Many Italian troops had themselves photographed next to cadavers hanging from the gallows or hanging around chests full of detached heads. One episode in the Italian occupation of Ethiopia was the slaughter of Addis Ababa of February, 1937 which followed upon an attempt to assassinate Graziani. In the course of an official ceremony a bomb exploded next to the general. The response was immediate and cruel. The thirty or so Ethiopians present at the ceremony were impaled, and immediately after, the black shirts of the fascist Militias poured out into the streets of Addis Ababa where they tortured and killed all of the men, women and children that they encountered on their path. They also set fire to homes in order to prevent the inhabitants from leaving and organized the mass executions of groups of 50-100 people. 
International isolation and their common involvement in Spain brought about increasing diplomatic collaboration between Italy and Nazi Germany. This was reflected also in the Fascist regime's domestic policies as the first anti-semitic laws were passed in 1938. From that year on, with the publication of the Manifesto degli scienziati razzisti (Manifesto of the Racist Scientists) (in reality about 90% written by Mussolini himself), fascism declared itself explicitly anti-Semite.''
--Lacatosias 09:12, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I agree that there are many similarities, in practice, between communism and fascism. I know there are people who donìt like the use of this term, but to me they are both just different manifestations of totalitarianism. But there are essential differences, in principle, between the two: nationalism is definitional of fascism and is almost contradictory (in principle of course) to the internationalist socialism. Racism is usually definitnional of fascism; not of communism. My point is very simply that fascism is NOT just a warped form of socialism. As you yourself point out, the defintion of socialism is enormously diverse, probably to the point of subjectivity these days. The fact is that many conservative Republicans think that Bill Clinton was a socilaist, for example. There are even some extreme libertarians who consider George W. Bush a socialist (he has, after all, expanded the size of the State rather enormously in the military, homeland security and even Medicare sectors and the national debt has exploded on HIS term). On the other hand, most Western European governments are far to the left of the US on economic issues (more governmental intervention) but far more "Libertarian" than the US on such matters as legalization of drugs, abortion, gay marriage, sodomy laws and these kinds of things. The fact is that all modern economies are "mixed economies". They are neither completely socialist nor completely capitalist. There is a simple reason for this: both of these extremes do not work. I tend to favor much  more government intervention in the economy than exists in the US but much less than exists in Italy.  On the other hand, I favor complete drug legalization, unlimited abortion rights, gay marriage, infinitely reducing the size of the militaty and the security budgets, extreme civil libertarianism in the legal sense, universal acess to contraception, pornography, etc.. Where does that put me?  I am almost certainly classified as a socialist in the US, while I am classified as something I know not what in Europe. In any case, it should be clear why I think it is ridiculously simplistic to insist that fascism is a form of socialism. I despise any form of totalitarinsim or authoritarianism, though, no matter what how it labels itself. But I don't beleive that the free-market is the answer to all of the world's problems either.--Lacatosias 08:14, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Here's an excerpt  

message: I wrote this comment in an edit summary to this article this morning:
she would not deny it; why cover it up; It is better to be a fascist than to be a homosexual "freak" like yourself).
Just wanted to clarify: this last sentence is  NOT an assertion of MY opinion. I wrote very hastily and hope this is not misunderstood. The point was: I think this is clearly what A.M. meant by her phrase, in Italian, "E meglio essere un fascista che un frocio." It was clearly intended as an anti-gay, anti-transgender insult in the sense of "it is better to be fascist than a faggot" .No need to beat about the bush. Though, now that I think of it "Faggot" may not be sufficently insulting to get the meaning across. Well, let's leave it as frocio them.--Lacatosias 17:25, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree,she can only be proud of her Grandfather,and you are right,its much better to be Fascist then communist or a homosexual.When I was to Rome last year I met a lot of respected people :doctors,judges and so on,and many of them are publicly fascist,and I got to Lazio-Livorno and I saw that most fans are fasicist,and theres nothing wrong with it.Even Di Canio is.Dzoni 14:23, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

text: You are a very sick fellow and a disgrace to all Italians who have ever walked on the face of this earth, sir. Good evening...--Lacatosias 15:37, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I am have 100% Italian genes and ancestry. That means I am Italian as much as a Jew born in Russia is Jewish. But you are right, I am also an American. And my American father and uncles put their lives at risk to liberate this country from the Nazi freaks who had occupied it under authorization (or because of the cowardly weakness) of Il big, fat Grande Pulcinella. My grandfather on my mother's side was a member of the anti-fascist Partito d'Azione and helped to hide members of the glorious resistence under the bed in his house.  This is a legacy which  I am quite proud of on both sides. My mother lived through it first hand as a child and tells me all that I need to know about the fascist disaster.--Lacatosias 11:05, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

text: What?? I said I was 100% Italian in genes and ancestry. My father was born in the US but his father and mother were BOTH immigrants from Italy. My father married my mother (another immigrant from Italy). That's 100% Italian blood (to use a term you would probably prefer). I was born and raised in the States; I now LIVE in Italy and have been LIVING HERE  for the last five years. I don't know what Alternativa Sociale's numbers are, but I think you are certainly overestimating them. The polls I have seen put them down at  1% to 2%. As to the Partito d'Azione: it was a party of intellectuals of both the left and the right who opposed fascism. Period. Mafiosi my ass. However, since you did bring it up: better mafiosi than fascista, nonno!! Also, you have already been in power for the last five years, you will be out on April 11 and then Berlu and his henchmen will be in jail, while the rest of you porkers will be eaten alive by the Chinese Communists. Be afraid!! Be VERY AFRAID!!!!!!! We will not boil your children, we will roast them first. HAAAAHAAAAAA!!--Lacatosias 15:51, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Yes, yes, blah, blah. OK, that's enough. This it turning into a blog.--Lacatosias 10:34, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

text: Yeah, I just did!! HAAAAAAAAAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!! Alternative: 1% as I said!!--Lacatosias 14:56, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

text: Well, I'm not going to boast about anything. Truth be told, I don't like any of this ridicouls process. There are far too many extremists on both sides: facists and commies all over the damned place. If you total up the extremist votes, you get about 20% fascist (or closet facist and 20% communist (or closet commies). I voted for the moderate Margerita. This system is a catastophe. No one will be able to govern until proportinal represantation is abolished and the small parties are excluded in favor of the stable, alternative US style majoritarian 2 party 
system. The president should be elected directly, etc.. I hope all you radical lefties in the US will pay attention to what's happening over here and stop takking about PR as a good electrol system. It sucks!
I have never missed the US so much in my life. Either the Democrtacic candidate wins or the Republcian wins. The house and senate is a sperate bracnh altoghether. Absolute brilliance of the founding fathers!! No extremist parties and little wacko extemist inlfuence. I have to live here to take care of my aging mother. Otherwise, I'd be out of the European madhouse before you can finish sneezing.--Lacatosias 08:53, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Who's going to rule in favor of him? The Communist magistrates? Hahahah!! It's over, bud.--Lacatosias 09:36, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I put this in the edit summary  

message: Now that second picture is under the official one,dont move it again,because it is better now(I still think second picture should not be here at all,but anyway thi is better)Dzoni 11:31, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: This is nicer

message: Has nothing to do with citing the meaning of frocio....... and is disgusting.
Si,link numero 8 was a joke,it wasa link to forcio site,so I delete that,because its offendive to both every reader and to Miss Mussolini.
Libro e moschetto - fascista perfetto
I under stand why some of you communistas hate her,but dont ruin the article because of that
Ice Cold 02:46, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Link 8 =

message: The degree information contained in the "Education" section seems a little dubious, given that the American University of Rome dosen't grant anything higher than a bachelor's degree. Is there any credible internet source indicating she holds a PhD from there?LondonIce 06:50, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm. European Parliament CV seems it would be a reliable source, but it says "Graduate in medicine and surgery (1993)" nothing about PhD in Chemistry, and it doesn't mention which university. AnonEMouse (squeak) 07:15, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Education 

message: Alessandra Mussolini is a truly disgusting, degenerate person who caused a lot of harm to Italy and Italian soceity. But the article describes her as if she is a wonderful person and an outstanding politician. There is no objectivity in the article at all. The article needs to be re-written.66.65.129.159 (talk) 02:34, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The article is written by neo-fascists 

message: I really do not agree with the photo of Alessandra performing the Fascist salute, does anyone agree with me? I find it absolutely repulsive Milesgilbert (talk) 02:48, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Well . . . no doubt she is aware that many people find the Fascist salute repulsive, both in Italy and elsewhere, and yet she delivers that salute in full view of the cameras. It seems, in that sense, to be an image that accurately represents the article's subject. How to judge that subject is left up to the reader, and Mussolini has provided ample further evidence to guide the reader's judgment in the quotes the article contains. Universaladdress (talk) 08:35, 8 September 2012 (UTC)

text: I have now restored the image once again for the same reasons. Kelisi (talk) 05:57, 31 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: And I'm restoring the 2007 image again.  Dismas|(talk) 10:35, 18 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: There is a far more professional looking picture on her parliament site.--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 19:58, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Picture 

message: she is actually graduated in medicine and surgery (institutional chamber of deputies profile: http://www.camera.it/29?shadow_deputato=33830) LAUD (talk) 16:36, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: It would be appreciated if the dates and donor of the degrees would be given, and if she did any clinical work. She does not appear to have had a medical career, and the postnominals might look a joke without this being put in context.Cloptonson (talk) 20:04, 18 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Degree

message: Can liberals stop trying to make her look bad and merely state the facts? Even the picture you chose was to make her look bad.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 47.186.210.131 (talk) 06:31, 28 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Biased liberal article 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: There's a mistake (factual, thanks God!) about Romano Mussolini, where he is said to be "the fourth son of Benito Mussolini". He was his fourth child, but only third son, having been preceded by sister Edda (b. 1910) and brothers Vittorio (b. 1916) and Bruno (b. 1918).  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.34.244.230 (talk) 13:06, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: It looks like Romano was indeed Benito Mussolini's fourth son, see Benito Mussolini#Personal life. Tsumikiria⧸ 🌹🌉 17:03, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mistake about Romano Mussolini, Alessandra's father. 

message: I've greatly trimmed down the impeccably detailed summary of a Twitter argument with Jim Carrey per WP:NOTNEWS. There was absolutely no outcome to that argument, and yes it did make the news but WP:NOTNEWS, Wikipedia is not a newspaper. You can get 50 sources on the same day with soft news like funny animals or selfies, but that does not make it more encyclopedic than subjects that don't get as wide news coverage. This was just a story that could get clicks as it involved an actor who Americans know, and a politician with a surname they may recognise having a meltdown in broken English.
I've tried to reframe it as the fact that this isn't the only time that she has defended Benito on Twitter,  but then again is that really worth noting in an encyclopedia that she would do something so expected? Wallachia Wallonia (talk) 21:08, 14 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jim Carrey