Talk:Max and Moritz

message: "Max und Moritz" was not a comic strip. It is more accurately characterized as an "illustrated story book" and can certainly not claim to be the first comic strip.
:Question of definition. It was probably more of a comic strip than many other things produced around that era. I heard Yellow Kid were mostly single-panel cartoons, for instance. I've skimmed through the book again, and you can basically make out most of the story without reading any text at all, unlike some other early comics.
::Of course it's a question of definition.  If you define a pig as a pigeon, then pigs have wings.  The problem is, any definition that includes "Max und Moritz" also includes a lot of other material that most people are not used to thinking of as comic strips.  M&M is basically an illustrated children's story in rhymed verse.  So is "The Cat in the Hat".  Is that a comic strip?
::Almost everything that we normally call a comic strip is a serialized publication; that is, it appears in installments.  M&M was published as a single story (see below).
::Comic strips generally have text and image explicitly linked.  Most commonly, the text is in a balloon pointed at the image of the character speaking; or the text may appear within the frame line surrounding a panel.  Some commentators make a case for counting as "comic strips", series of images, where each image has a small block of descriptive text placed underneath it.  For an example, see Ally Sloper.  M&M is verse with pictures inserted at irregular intervals.
::Any definition of "comic strip" broad enough to include both M&M and a modern-day strip (say, Blondie) would surely also include the picture stories of Rodolphe Töpffer.  These stories were published (serially in newspapers) in 1833-1846, and are a known influence on Wilhelm Busch.  If M&M (1865) was a comic strip, it certainly was not the first comic strip.
::I find no support for the statement made in this article, "... began newspaper publication in 1865."  According to a story on the website of German media group WDR, Busch published his earlier picture stories in the weekly newspaper "Die Fliegenden Blätter"; but his publisher, Caspar Braun, decided to bring M&M out as a book.  The first copies went on the market on April 4, 1865.
::I must also disagree with the parenthetical phrase in the article, "the direct (though never credited) inspiration for the Katzenjammer Kids".  Martin Sheridan, in "Comics and Their Creators" (Luna Press, New York, 1971), writes:  "The ... comic strip editor of the Journal asked [Rudolph] Dirks to draw a strip emulating the work of Wilhelm Busch ...".  It's probably true that Busch was never credited in the strip itself, but what other comic strip ever credited its source? Gwil 19:19, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Not strip

message: I've added some edits linking M&M to the classic late medieval prankster stories of Till Eulenspiegel (Named derived from the lower german "Ull mer'n Speel" engl. (sim.): "Kiss my a***"). The first (to prank no 1) link can be supported by the image in the Reclam print version of Till []. Images of the Reclam version of "Ein kurzweilig Lesen von Dil Ulenspiegel" are based on the wooden prints of the Till Eugenspiegel edition of 1515. Sofafernsehfan (talk) 22:41, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comparison of M&M to Till Eulenspiegel 

message: According to the article, the first line of the preface is 'Ah, how often we read or hear of'. I've never heard this version and Google gives only two results for it, one of which is the article itself. In my opinion, it should be 'oft' instead of 'often', in which case it would really be a trochaic tetrameter. Are there any sources for 'often'? -84.172.32.197 (talk) 14:58, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  'Ah, how often we read'? 

message: Hi there, I was just sharing the wikipedia article on Max and Moritz (the children's book), and was wondering if we could make a disambiguation page, instead of referring to the V2 rockets in the article on the children's book. Something like "For other uses see Disambiguation".  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.71.194.134 (talk) 20:09, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Add a Disambiguation Page