Talk:John Carroll (archbishop)

message: The article ought to clarify what were Carroll's relations with the new Revolutionary government under Washington, and how he used those relations to get himself to the post of top American clergyman. And too, it must be specified the motives of Bishop Briand for his excommunication, which some have alleged were related to some prohibited or controversial masonic affiliation. ADM (talk) 06:16, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Relationship with authorities

message: An edit has been made by Contaldo80 noting that Carroll owned a slave and was supportive of slavery. While there is no citation, I can certainly imagine it could be true. But I wonder if this belongs in the section describing his ministry as bishop. Maybe there should be a separate section with more information on this topic. I can see undoing/redoing already taking place on this addition, and no doubt whoever removed it also thought it just didn't belong in that section. Ericstoltz (talk) 22:47, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I've seen the same statement on a few other pages, including Christianity and slavery and Catholic Church and slavery; all of them without a reference. I agree it could be true, but it's not properly sourced for the 'pedia just yet. Gentgeen (talk) 23:03, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe this edit should be undone again. A search indicated two documents of Carroll in an anthology. In one he denies ever having owned a slave but that he was caring for one of his sister's slaves. In his last will he bequeaths a slave (perhaps his sister finally transferred title to him?) to a friend on the condition that the slave be set free. As for supporting slavery, the only document I could find is Carroll defending slaveholders who were gradually divesting themselves of slaves, arguing against doing it all at once. That hardly makes him an advocate. It does not appear as cut-and-dry as the edit makes it seem. Ericstoltz (talk) 23:44, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks - I've tried to provide some sources now and have nuanced the text. Not necessarily an 'advocate' he nevertheless tolerated the situation (as did many jesuits and clergy of the time). Agree it might go better in another section though so feel free to move. Contaldo80 (talk) 10:51, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. I've moved your edit to a separate section called Attitudes Toward Slavery. Maybe this might start a more comprehensive look at how he approached this issue.Ericstoltz (talk) 19:08, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks good. Contaldo80 (talk) 15:51, 25 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Position on slavery 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I plan on working on this article for awhile, with the aim of brining it up to GA status. Ergo Sum  20:45, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Planned improvement 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: Moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) Adumbrativus (talk) 05:57, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: John Carroll (archbishop of Baltimore) →  – WP:OVERPRECISION. As far as I can tell, he's the only archbishop named John Carroll that is discussed on Wikipedia. Per WP:NCPDAB, we don't use  when  would suffice. In this case, "of Baltimore" is also rather misleading, as his domain included much more than Baltimore. The article says that "Until 1808, Carroll administered the entire American Catholic Church." He is the only person in :Category:19th-century Roman Catholic archbishops in the United States and :Category:Roman Catholic archbishops of Baltimore to have the specific location of his domain identified in the article title. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 23:30, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 2 January 2024