Template talk:Countries and territories of Southeast Asia

message: A suggestion for a standard approach to the naming, titling and sections of this and similar templates has been made here – please visit and share your thoughts!  Thanks, David Kernow (talk) 03:27, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Standardization suggestion - please contribute! 

message: Joining ASEAN. Papua New Guinea asks RP support for Asean membership bid Retrieved July 8, 2009 Somare seeks PGMA's support for PNG's ASEAN membership bid Retrieved July 8, 2009--23prootie (talk) 17:35, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Papua

message: Please provide a list of countries that recognized Taiwan as an independent Country and not Republic of China. If not i will remove them.  LLTimes (talk) 17:52, 3 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Taiwan as an independent country 

message: Though politically not part of Southeast Asia, Taiwan is clearly part of Southeast Asia by geography (supported by sources in the Southeast Asia article). Should the inclusion criteria of this template solely politics? 218.250.143.16 (talk) 22:14, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Considering the name of the template (Template:Countries and territories of Southeast Asia) and the sectioning of the template ("Sovereign states, Dependent territories, Subdivisions, Disputed territories"), I say yes. Quigley (talk) 22:17, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  The Andaman and Nicobar Islands aren't politically part of Southeast Asia. And yet it's included. Also on the list is Hainan. Meanwhile Papua New Guinea is observer of ASEAN since 1976 and special observer since 1981, and is bidding for (full) membership of the ASEAN, yet it isn't included. I'd suppose geography to be the major criteria. 218.250.143.16 (talk) 22:24, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no point having this template saying one thing and the Taiwan article saying another. Indeed, this conversation should actually be at the Taiwan page – if there is consensus to changing that article to say it’s in SE Asia, then this template should be changed automatically. --Merbabu (talk) 04:46, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

text: I agree on "general consensus" but that's not the same as posting a few URLs - the URLs must prove the general consensus, and not just say it's part of SE Asia. And again, I don't think this is a question for the template, rather, the Taiwan article needs the change (or not), then this template can follow suit.  cheers --Merbabu (talk) 08:08, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

text: *Taiwan is substantially south of Japan - which is East Asia.  China covers a great deal of Asia - and including a large amount in SE Asia, off the coast of which Taiwan lies.  IIRC. Taiwan extends south of the northern borders of Laos and Vietnam,  and is mainly south of Myanmar.  Thus the "south" part is hard to deny.   We do not have a template for "other parts of east Asis which are not politically in 'southeast Asia'"  at this point.   Thus my position that something in the east of Asia and in the south of Asia would normally be considered in the southeast part of Asia.   Perhaps English is not the primary language here? Collect (talk) 16:36, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: *That is one possible interpretation, but we have to consider culture and politics as well, which is one reason why the Far East of Russia is not generally considered to be part of "East Asia". And even adhering to your interpretation lends some trouble: show me reliable sources that state that southern Fujian, which includes the city of Xiamen and is across the strait from Taiwan, is seen as being part of Southeast Asia. —HXL's Roundtable and Record 17:01, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Would not Macau (in the list) be closer to Taiwan culturally than it is to the Philippines?   And is not Papua far more a Pacific Island nation then it is remotely related culturally to Macau?  Once we have Macau in the list, it is really hard to justify the hop-jumping to exclude Taiwan. Collect (talk) 17:58, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Then this discussion should expand to discuss whether the two SARs should even be on here. —HXL's Roundtable and Record 19:28, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Taiwan 

message: I don't understand why these need to be listed. it's not like their inclusion within southeast asia is disputed, rather their possession is disputed (which is irrelevant for the template). It gives a lot of undue weight to relatively minor geographic features in front of many other large features that don't appear in the template. So I'm removing them. --Merbabu (talk) 10:24, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Aren't these islands part of Southeast Asia? 218.250.143.16 (talk) 17:42, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not questioning whether they are in SE Asia. I'm questioning why they need to be listed separately? --Merbabu (talk) 21:37, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: "Sovereignty disputed" section