Talk:Hungarian Justice and Life Party

message: I moved the following from the main page - as it is realy talk.
:the MIÉP is not the Hungarian "extreme" right party. it is just the frightening of the hungarian socialist party(MSzP), which is the legal successor of the Hungarian Communist Party(MSzMP), the owner of the red-terror till the system-changing. the MIÉP is about a semi-extrem right party, and its program is so far from for example Le Pen's (Fr) extreme right party. in Hungary you can't speak about nationalism, or "extreme" right parties, because in Hungary both the "nation" and nationalism mean something else. to be hungarian is just the community of fate.
::by: szil
: Iagree. Gubbubu 10:30, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: I also removed this from the article:
One of the goals of the MIÉP is to regain the territories lost in the Treaty of Trianon back in 1920 to several countries in its vicinity - see picture on the left, with Hungary's original territory in pink.
The reason for deleting this is that simple fact that it is not true. Have you found it in the official programme of the party or elsewhere??
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.6.243.100 (talk • contribs) 12:53, 27 March 2006
I have seen it on their poster in Szeged at a villamos stop where they enumerated their goals. This was one of them 
160.114.126.82 14:32, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Goals 

message: >>The new political formation has been registered under the name the "Third Way" (Harmadik Út) and it harbours nationalist and populist goals,<<
: what does it means "populist goals"? Who says it? Gubbubu 10:30, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: He is a populist nationalist, whose tax-the-rich, anti-globalization, anti-Nato and anti-EU policies are not unlike those of the far-left Workers Party of Gyula Thuermer. BBC
-- nyenyec ☎ 21:54, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Populist 

message: Dodgy?! That's encylopedic! --82.33.11.170 18:12, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dodgy?! 

message: I do not mean to troll, but we are missing the point.  Understanding any party from its party program or from listening to its readers is a futile.  You need to read between the lines of their party program or platform.  For the casual reader of MIEP's program very few statements, if any, should raise red (no pun intended) flags.  But analyzing the differences how particularly sensitive areas in Hungarian politics and in the everyday debate are addressed, it becomes evident that the party builds its beliefs on a nationalistic, hungarocentric, xenophobic, and clearly populist ideology.  The right combination of anticommunism and antisemitism coupled with nationalism are the main pillars of Central and Eastern European populist ideology.  
Case in point.  I run a simple electronic translation from Hungarian to English of two successive statements in the MIEP party program and did some - hopefully minor - linguistic adjustments to make the language somewhat clearer.  Hungarian language is such an easy language to understand ...  The MIE program is at http://www.miep.hu/al/kiskate.html, and here are the statements... 
"Is MIEP a fringe party?  
According to its political rivals, MIEP is a far-right, neo-nazi, chauvinistic, nationalistic, and anti-semitic, excluding, anti-gypsy party.  Gyula Horn said: "this is the party of nuts".  There is absolutely no truth to the statement: the conservative and national ideas have already been planted 100 years ago against the "progressive" and the "modernist" communistic and liberal political powers.
"IS MIEP a Christian democratic party?  
Yes, and unequivocally so.  Both within and outside the Parliament, MIEP has closely followed the rules of the constitutional democracy; the teachings of the Christ are considered the fundamental norm and without them no one can live freely and peacefully.  MIÉP is a Christian democratic party poignantly opposing any such Endeavour that conflicts with these societal core values, and on behalf of all men and society, MIEP rejects fully both individualism and pluralism as being uniformly antisocial and anti-humanistic. Anarchy, pathological deviations and the acceptance of the "dissimilarity" of individuals fails to harmonize with democracy or Christian ethics."
I would argue that this is a party on the right, deeply rooted against any social progress, heavily borrowing the "fundamentalist" ideology of the evangelical right of the GOP (in the US) and extremely populist. Later in the program, MIEP makes some word choices that can be seen as purposefully inflammatory.  MIEP spends considerable time explaining why they respect people, except for those that are "different".  In Hungarian common parlance gays and gypsies are always different.   Moreover, MIEP embraces foreigners as long as they are hardworking or tourists brining well-needed foreign capital.  MIEP hates the United States and the "American way of life", and it believes that all evil came from Trianon and/or the United States.  This anti-americanism is rather hypocritical, particularly when considering their embrace of the Republican ideology.  While MIEP does not anymore argue for Trianons' repeal, MIEP believes that Hungary should work to create a strong, independent, Christian Hungary for all who are Hungarian.  And all who are HUngarian live in the pre-Trianon Hungary. 
And the truth is, as always, in the eyes of the beholder.  These are my 5 cents or approximately 11 forints.  --209.23.214.244 20:20, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Populist =/= popular. -- nyenyec ☎ 17:02, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reading between the lines 

message: Why is the tag up? -- nyenyec ☎ 04:09, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disputed neutrality rationale? 

message: That article is written as if MIÉP were leading the 2006 protests in Hungary which is wrong, although supporters of MIÉP are higher represented in that mob than in the whole country.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Torzsmokus (talk • contribs) 
* http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13509-2371248.html
The point of including the link is because it gives a good overview about MIEP's views, not because what it writes about the protests. Anyway, if you read it carefully you see that it acknowledges that Fidesz supporters count for the bulk of the protestors.
It doesn't say that MIÉP was leading the protests.
-- nyenyec ☎ 06:30, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  reason for commenting out The Times link 

message: I added some information about the party's connection to Anti-Semitism. I think it's important for people to know a more fair and balanced description about political parties. (Eddie 21:10, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anti-Semitism