Talk:Collagen

message: a women at work has a sore on  her leg that she thinks looks like skin cancer and it is getting bigger.  they did an autopsy on it and they said that it was collagen.  does anyone know how to treat this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.60.217.106 (talk) 23:46, October 15, 2003 (UTC)
:Wouldn't her doctor know how to treat it?
:WebMD aticle <- This (copy-paste link) is the only thing I found that might somehow be related, but her doctor would know better so it would probably be a good idea to get his/her advice before trying anything... umm.. yeah. Also, I think you mean biopsy... Evil saltine 23:50, 15 Oct 2003 (UTC)
thread_title: Advice please

message: This article should be pulled for the time being as it full of inaccurate information. I will massively reconstruct it by Nov. 19, 2005. For the time being, this is what happens when sources are not cited!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.244.6.225 (talk) 12:25, November 16, 2005 (UTC)
:I removed that, since it sounded like a vandalism (I was only able to caught it when looking at the history, tought, as he changed type IV from basal lamina to somewhere in the penis). It's a shame it took from November 10 to 24 for someone to spot that error. Algumacoisaqq 22:31, 24 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rife with inaccuracies 

message: this article doesn't make any sense to me. Maybe it does say but I can't find anywhere what part of the animal this comes from, and about it being made into Jelly, what type of jelly. I can't find out anything anyway because it's full of scientific words. For example: Hydroxylation of lysine and proline amino acids occurs inside the lumen. This process is dependent on Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C) as a cofactor. Someone should make this article more explanatory and less confusing! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.59.200.187 (talk) 21 December 2006 (UTC)
:: Basically, collagen is the scaffold an animal is built on.  So collagen is everywhere.  There is no collage organ, and no collagen distribution system.64.252.24.246 (talk) 00:48, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that most articles on Wikipedia in the medical, scientific, and technical spheres are mystified with jargon. This makes them inaccessible to the casual reader. Creating in-WP links of jargony words is not a huge help as it forces readers to hop from article to article trying to figure out what things mean. Please reconsider how you write here on WP and take pity on people who come here to learn about topics that are new to them. If they can already understand, or have the ability to decipher the jargon, why would they need to come to WP in the first place? Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 20:59, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  i dont get it 

message: The source cited (footnote 4) does not, as far as I can tell, indicate that human collagen is derived from "aborted fetuses."  Nor can I find a credible source on the internet to indicate that it ever is.  Indeed, a discussion thread on Snopes  found evidence to the contrary.
The page cited in footnote 4 also does not verify the use of human placentas, though I did find two sources that do: (question #7) and   
Also, if we're going for the strange sources of human collagen, the cited page does mention "neonatal foreskins" as the source for the product Apligraf. —Preceding unsigned comment added by DrBoron (talk • contribs) 15:57, June 28, 2007 (UTC)
I'm confused that medical and/or cosmetic use does not include any discussion of body shaping -- fattening the lips, for example. I saw a comment about an "actress" who has unnaturally big lips. Clearly there is more at work than lipstick and nature. The comment was that perhaps she had "pissed off the collagen fairy." I assume that people arrange to have collagen injections to augment certain soft tissue such as the lips. I expected to learn more about that here; but I don't see that use mentioned. Am I wrong, or can someone provide more info? I have never contributed a comment before; hope I'm doing it correctly. Cadillac84 (talk) 18:18, 17 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Medical uses - human collagen 

message: I believe we should expand the basic research to include some topics that have been explored more in depth. This can talk about the monomer research dealing with collagen. For example I added to this section:
Basic Research Collagen is used in laboratory studies for cell culture, studying cell behavior and cellular interactions with the extracellular environment. Currently, studies have been conducted to enhance the understanding of collagen at a monomer level. It is believed that collagen and fibronectin have a codependent relationship, where they rely on each other with the extracellular matrix. It is believed that if this mechanism is understood the idea behind regenerative medicine, focusing on how to not only rebuild a tissue after being damaged, but additionally return it back to its original function. (I have the citations and such in my sandbox). I think something such as this will help to enhance this section. Please let me know your opinions or other areas I could expand in this section.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thepowerofprotein (talk • contribs) 02:39, 29 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: Basic Research

message: There is an important disorder missing in this table, namely, the progressive illness known as Systemic Sclerosis or Scleroderma. Can any merciful soul add it in the right place, please? --AVM 17:04, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Merciful is my middle name. Two Merciful Oars18:27, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Types of collagen and associated disorders - missing info

message: This article talk page was automatically added with  banner as it falls under :Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . Maximum and carefull attention was done to avoid any wrongly tagging any categories , but mistakes may happen... If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot (talk) 18:11, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: [[WP:FOOD|WikiProject Food and drink]] Tagging

message: What do the colors in the picture mean (like a certain molecule)?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by R31415 (talk • contribs) 04:09, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Collagen is composed of a triple helix. Each color represent a chain (therefore, 3 colors are shown here) ReitnorF (talk) 03:39, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  What do the colors in the picture mean? 

message: 8.6 "Reconstructive surgical uses" contains argumentation based on the digestive pathway of collagen in the gut, concluding "there is no reason for orally ingested collagen to affect connective tissue in the body, except through the effect of individual amino acid supplementation".
For me as a reader this really begs for a comment regarding 8.2 "Type II Collagen and Rheumatoid Arthritis" which refers to a study on orally ingested collagen and reduction in "severe, active rheumatoid arthritis".
If this reduction is likely to be attributal to anti-inflammatory agents accompanying the orally ingested collagen, this should be clarified.
Over-fifties with joint pains are bombarded with advertising inviting them to spend large amounts of pill money on ingesting collagen products. Wikipedia is a good place to start when looking for advice. The presence of two apparently contradictory points does not reduce confusion for these readers.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.224.63.234 (talk) 07:15, 30 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Inconsistency between 8.2 and 8.6 

message: I am interested to know how long a collagen cell usually survives, I guess by type, and what is the normal ending (apoptosis?). JoshNarins (talk) 19:36, 9 March 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  How does collagen break down, if it all? 

message: I have this giant medical book: Mosby's Medical, Nursing, & Allied Health Dictionary Sixth Edition and the entry on collagen states that the word collagen is derived from the Greek words kolla, meaning "glue", and genein, meaning "to produce". The book's most recent copyright is 2002. Not sure where this would go on the article, or even if it should be on the article, but I thought that it might do good knowing. 71.227.24.227 (talk) 17:55, 25 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name origin 

message: I see where the watchers here have ceased answering queries, but will post in the hopes that one will respond anyhow. 
Where is the collagen used in the cosmetics industry (make-up, hair products, skin products) and medical field obtained from? Is it bovine, porcine, or sheepies? I imagine that it's obtained only from animal flesh or can it also be obtained from milk? How do Hebrew and Islamic consumers tell what type of animal source was used? And this seems to a be a case of vegetarians need not apply unless there is a non-animal slaughter analog. How is the raw material processed before it's used? What is the potential for consumer irritation or allergy? Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 21:15, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Raw material sources? 

message: doi:10.1111/jth.13249 JFW | T@lk 15:45, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hemostasis role 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hi everyone,
I wanted to post this information that I researched on the evolution of the collagen gene families. This information was researched as part of an assignment for one of my college courses in genetics. Part of the assignment is to upload what we researched onto Wikipedia. I was interested in researching collagen, as I am affected by Ehlers-Danlos. I also realized that the collagen page does not discuss the evolution and emergence of the collagen gene groups, so I thought that adding something in based on this topic would be of use. 
Please let me know if there is anything that should be further edited, added in, or removed. I appreciate constructive criticism, but would really benefit from people telling me what exactly the issues in the article are before deleting anything.  
Thanks! I hope everyone is well and is staying safe. Cheers. Anna Maior 200445 (talk) 22:07, 15 April 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: - comments on these revisions below and use in the article, please? Zefr (talk) 15:34, 18 April 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello Zefr - I think that your revision is an improvement, being more readable and would agree with your location of it. Think it's worth a note of the info being noteworthy and perhaps some of the material in Anna's edit could be expanded on at some time. (Am happy to look in now and again) Best --Iztwoz (talk) 11:44, 19 April 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Addition of a subsection that discusses the evolution of the collagen gene groups  

message: There are two major groups that produce collagen proteins: the fibril and non-fibril groups.Vuorio, Eero, and Benoit de Crombrugghe. “THE FAMILY OF COLLAGEN GENES.” Annual Reviews, www.annualreviews.org/doi/pdf/10.1146/annurev.bi.59.070190.004201. These groups are further divided into different types, based on the functions that the specific protein plays in the body. 
- Fibrillar collagens produce the three-dimensional frameworks of different tissues and organs that provide the body with structural support. Fibrillar collagen forms characteristic cross-striated fibrils. This group of collagens share a single common ancestor and arose due to large-scale gene duplication events.Rodriguez-Pascual, Fernando, and David Anthony Slatter. “Collagen Cross-Linking: Insights on the Evolution of Metazoan Extracellular Matrix.” Nature News, Nature Publishing Group, 23 Nov. 2016, www.nature.com/articles/srep37374. 
- Non-fibril collagen does not form cross-striated fibers, and instead forms extracellular networks. 
It is important to note the morphological differences between these two different groups, as their differences are a result of divergent evolution. These two collagen types arose as a result of different mutation and gene duplication events that allowed for the evolution of the collagen protein.Haq, Farhan, et al. “Comparative Genomic Analysis of Collagen Gene Diversity.” 3 Biotech, Springer International Publishing, Mar. 2019, www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30800594. Gene duplication allows organisms to acquire new genes and creates genetic diversity among organisms-- this then leads to the evolution of organisms and to the development of new organisms.Magadum, Santoshkumar, et al. “Gene Duplication as a Major Force in Evolution.” Journal of Genetics, U.S. National Library of Medicine, Apr. 2013, www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23640422. The duplication of collagen genes has led to an increase in gene number in different collagen types, and has created diversification in developmental processes that involve collagen.Exposito, Jean-Yves, et al. “The Fibrillar Collagen Family.” International Journal of Molecular Sciences, Molecular Diversity Preservation International (MDPI), 28 Jan. 2010, www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2852846/. 
The emergence and origin of vertebrates as a subphylum in biology is associated with the evolution of the skeleton.Zhang, GuangJun, and Martin J. Cohn. “Hagfish and Lancelet Fibrillar Collagens Reveal That Type II Collagen-Based Cartilage Evolved in Stem Vertebrates.” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America, National Academy of Sciences, 7 Nov. 2006, www.pnas.org/content/103/45/16829. During the evolutionary time frame known as the Cambrian explosion, fish-like creatures began to develop a skeleton.  Having a skeletal morphology proved to have an evolutionary advantage for these organisms, as it provided the body with structural support. Studies have traced back the molecular evolutionary history of chordate collagen genes to examine how the duplication of certain collagen genes has given rise to collagen genes in skeletons.Wada, Hiroshi, et al. “Molecular Evolution of Fibrillar Collagen in Chordates, with Implications for the Evolution of Vertebrate Skeletons and Chordate Phylogeny.” Wiley Online Library, John Wiley & Sons, Ltd, 28 June 2006, onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1525-142X.2006.00109.x. Through research, it has been found that the alpha collagen gene is responsible for the expression of a skeleton morphology in vertebrates.“COL1A1 Gene - Genetics Home Reference - NIH.” U.S. National Library of Medicine, National Institutes of Health, ghr.nlm.nih.gov/gene/COL1A1. Additional research found that fibrillar collagen was co-opted in the ancestors of chordates.Wada, Hiroshi, et al. “Molecular Evolution of Fibrillar Collagen in Chordates, with Implications for the Evolution of Vertebrate Skeletons and Chordate Phylogeny.” Wiley Online Library, John Wiley & Sons, Ltd, 28 June 2006, onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1525-142X.2006.00109.x. Co-opting occurs when natural selection finds new uses for existing genes. The co-opting of the fibrillar collagen gene allowed for new species of organisms to evolve. 
The evolution of the collagen protein has led to a highly interrupted gene, meaning the collagen protein contains sections of exons that are interrupted by sections of introns.Hwang, Eileen S, et al. “Interruptions in the Collagen Repeating Tripeptide Pattern Can Promote Supramolecular Association.” Protein Science : a Publication of the Protein Society, Wiley Subscription Services, Inc., A Wiley Company, May 2010, www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20340134. These interruptions are important for the biological function of the protein, and also plays a role in the molecular flexibility, degradation, and ligand binding abilities of the collagen proteins.Hwang, Eileen S, et al. “Interruptions in the Collagen Repeating Tripeptide Pattern Can Promote Supramolecular Association.” Protein Science : a Publication of the Protein Society, Wiley Subscription Services, Inc., A Wiley Company, May 2010, www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20340134.
This is a complex subject that would benefit from expertise in collagen biochemistry (not my area), while respecting WP:NOTTEXTBOOK #6-8 to keep the content explained as simply as possible. 1) the subtitle can be more generalized. 2) I have edited the section using more recent reviews, and made syntax and WP:REFPUNCT corrections. Following the guidance of NOTTEXTBOOK, I used general reviews rather than individual additional sources where there was also an issue of source reliability by WP:CITEWATCH. 3) the most appropriate place for this section appears to be before the History section (which is not so much about history, as a discussion of controversies, which don't impress as encyclopedic or needed). I'll leave Anna's draft intact above and place a revision below. In the history for this article are several experienced editors whose input would help. Zefr (talk) 17:28, 16 April 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: - comments on these revisions below and use in the article, please? Zefr (talk) 15:34, 18 April 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello Zefr - I think that your revision is an improvement, being more readable and would agree with your location of it. Think it's worth a note of the info being noteworthy and perhaps some of the material in Anna's edit could be expanded on at some time. (Am happy to look in now and again) Best --Iztwoz (talk) 11:44, 19 April 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: The Emergence of Different Collagen Types

message: ~~  {{Connected contributor|User1=Your kessemhacoll |U1-declared=yes.})
Collagen used in medical applications related to tissue, bone, and skin repair and reconstruction[Yang C, Hillas PJ, Báez JA, et al. The application of recombinant human collagen in tissue engineering. BioDrugs. 2004;18(2):103-119. doi:10.2165/00063030-200418020-00004] is largely extracted from animal sources such as marine, bovine and porcine.[T. Wang, J. Lew, J. Premkumar, C. L. Poh and M. Win Naing, "Production of recombinant collagen: state of the art and challenges," in Engineering Biology, vol. 1, no. 1, pp. 18-23, 6 2017, doi: 10.1049/enb.2017.0003.] Potential contamination of animal-derived collagen with pathogens has led to the demand for safe recombinant sources of this complex molecule. [ Merle C, Perret S, Lacour T, et al. Hydroxylated human homotrimeric collagen I in Agrobacterium tumefaciens-mediated transient expression and in transgenic tobacco plant. FEBS Lett. 2002;515(1-3):114-118. doi:10.1016/s0014-5793(02)02452-3]-
Recombinant human collagen is a promising alternative to animal collagen for medical applications, including potential superiority in safety, immunogenicity and biocompatibility.[T. Wang, J. Lew, J. Premkumar, C. L. Poh and M. Win Naing, "Production of recombinant collagen: state of the art and challenges," in Engineering Biology, vol. 1, no. 1, pp. 18-23, 6 2017, doi: 10.1049/enb.2017.0003.]
The expanding need for collagen and its byproducts in industrial applications has spurred development of high throughput extraction and recombinant synthesis, designed to provide pure material resembling its natural form.[Shoseyov O, Posen Y, Grynspan F. Human recombinant type I collagen produced in plants. Tissue Eng Part A. 2013;19(13-14):1527-1533. doi:10.1089/ten.TEA.2012.0347] Recombinant human collagen has been expressed in both eukaryotic (Escherichia coli) and prokaryotic (yeast, plants, mammalian cells, insect cells) hosts with varying degrees of success. Insufficient post-translational modifications and low yield remain as unresolved issues.[T. Wang, J. Lew, J. Premkumar, C. L. Poh and M. Win Naing, "Production of recombinant collagen: state of the art and challenges," in Engineering Biology, vol. 1, no. 1, pp. 18-23, 6 2017, doi: 10.1049/enb.2017.0003.]
Transgenic production systems have also been investigated for the expression of recombinant human collagen, including the mouse mammary gland and milk from transgenic cows.[Yang C, Hillas PJ, Báez JA, et al. The application of recombinant human collagen in tissue engineering. BioDrugs. 2004;18(2):103-119. doi:10.2165/00063030-200418020-00004] The advent of plant-made pharmaceutics has introduced an additional feasible transgenic alternative to conventional, fermentation-based expression models.[Shoseyov O, Posen Y, Grynspan F. Human recombinant type I collagen produced in plants. Tissue Eng Part A. 2013;19(13-14):1527-1533. doi:10.1089/ten.TEA.2012.0347] It is found successful to produce type I collagen from tobacco plants[T. Wang, J. Lew, J. Premkumar, C. L. Poh and M. Win Naing, "Production of recombinant collagen: state of the art and challenges," in Engineering Biology, vol. 1, no. 1, pp. 18-23, 6 2017, doi: 10.1049/enb.2017.0003.],[<ref>Stein, H., Wilensky, M., Tsafrir, Y., Rosenthal, M., Amir, R., Avraham, T., ... & Shoseyov, O. (2009). Production of bioactive, post-translationally modified, heterotrimeric, human recombinant type-I collagen in transgenic tobacco. Biomacromolecules, 10(9), 2640-2645.‏
] a non-food crop with a large leaf mass and prematurity stage harvesting.[Shoseyov O, Posen Y, Grynspan F. Human recombinant type I collagen produced in plants. Tissue Eng Part A. 2013;19(13-14):1527-1533. doi:10.1089/ten.TEA.2012.0347]
Because it seemed totally redundant, containing only information found elsewhere in this same article, I removed the following: ==Adaptation and diversification==
The evolution of collagens was a fundamental step in the early evolution of animals, supporting multicellular animal forms.<ref name="exposito"> Collagens are the most abundant proteins in vertebrates, making up some 30% of all proteins in the human body. Based on their molecular structures, collagen proteins are divided into two main classes – fibril-forming (or fibrillar) collagens and non-fibril-forming (non-fibrillar) collagens – which are further divided into 28 different types (as of 2017), based on individual structures and functions that the protein specifically has in the body. Fibrillar collagen, producing the three-dimensional frameworks in different tissues and organs, derived from a single common ancestor during evolution. Non-fibrillar collagen is the major supporting component of the extracellular matrix.
The morphology of fibrillar and non-fibrillar collagen types became differentiated during divergent evolution. These two collagen types arose from different mutation and gene duplication events that evolved to the current 28 types of collagen proteins providing the diversification of collagen-supporting structures in the body, such as the skeleton, which formed from the alpha (denoted as α) collagen gene. Fibrillar collagen was co-opted during evolutionary adaptation from existing genes by natural selection to construct new organ and tissue structures, enabling the emergence of evolved species with improved capabilities.
I was following the Wikipedia dictum, "Be bold". The only new information in the removed text might be the references. Perhaps some of these references belong at the other places in this article which give this same information. 
Also this section failed to make clear that it is speaking of human callogen exclusively. Nick Beeson (talk) 00:28, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recombinant Human Collagen 

message: The following section has been deleted without any explanation on 00:56, 22 October 2021 by someone at the following IP address 2601:40b:0:5935:e5de:5f7a:f112:7e37, in the edit here. 
I just retrieved the content of the section hereafter to preserve it and for possible  discussion. I think the topic is of interest for at least two reasons: 
# This section is useful as it points to a new way of synthesis of collagen by using cultures of modified microorganisms such as the yeast Pichia pastoris (see the reference); 
# The term "vegan collagen" is more and more used in the media, especially for advertising for cosmetics: this is quite puzzling for those aware of the animal origin of this protein, not to say misleading for many consumers. Therefore, the use of such an antinomic expression should be demystified and the public correctly informed. 
Therefore the content of this section is useful and deserves at least a place somewhere in this page. If someone disagrees with some aspects of this section, or with its tone or too direct style, it would be better to adequately edit the section and to adapt it than to brutally revert this section without the least explanation and without argument. This is particularly true when the revert is done from an anonymous IP address and that no discussion is possible. I intent to reintroduce this information in a way or in another on this page with minor adaptations to  present the same information with another title, or with another tone, if required. If the person hidden behind this IP address 2601:40b:0:5935:e5de:5f7a:f112:7e37 has some objections, please have the courtesy to explain the reason why you deleted this section. Shinkolobwe (talk) 17:54, 22 October 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: The revert by the IP was justified. Your only source for the reverted edit shown below was Healthline, which is written by non-expert bloggers, not health professionals, and not published in WP:MEDRS-compliant journals, books, or medical association statements - see WP:MEDREV - there is no systematic review confirming that Pichia pastoris is widely accepted by the nutrition or medical communities for growth of collagen. Zefr (talk) 18:07, 22 October 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  Thank you for your answer, your explanations and the arguments you developed. I agree that the reference provided was very weak. In the meantime, I have done some bibliographic search and also read the previous section about the recombinant collagens mentioning also some of the references I have found myself. I am not specialist in the field. The fact that I was shocked by an advertising about vegan collagen I heard several time last week explains why I started to write this section: it was more to denounce this misleading term presently used in too many advertising hypes. I am happy to learn from you that there is no systematic review confirming that Pichia pastoris is widely accepted by the nutrition or medical communities for growth of collagen. I do not know if other ways of production via other organisms were more successful or not. This confirms the misleading character of the vegan collagen expression. From the reference given here below and the discussion of the previous section, it seems that different ways of production of recombinant collagens have been explored, but I ignore if it was successful and if the recombinant collagen technique reached the industrial production stage. Some companies also claim to have registred patents for vegan collagen and it sows the doubt in the mind of the reader. So, it was just to turn the neck of this duck, but now how to express that with appropriate arguments and in the right way. Shinkolobwe (talk) 22:41, 22 October 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Terminology and hype: Vegan collagen? 

message: Ive recently been researching collagen online, and have seen various reports of possible BSE contamination in Collagen supplements, and was surprised that it has not been mentioned in the wikipedia article at all, even to dispel such claims.
I've also made a somewhat loose link between the collagen sold under the brand name "vital proteins" which is sold in many western countries, and recent instances of BSE in Brazilian livestock (where vital proteins supposedly sources its collagen" Keithl1221 (talk) 13:22, 16 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Missing information