Talk:Gasoline/Archive 2

message: * "Petrol" is used in a greater number of countries
*:Countries don't speak; people do.  —Teknic 14:53, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Arguments for "petrol" 

message: *And the number of people in the US speaking English was 262,375,152 in 2000, according to the US census. 
:One wonders how well that English is spoken/written. I often hear/read better English from people who speak it as a second or third language.
::That is a vile, pointless and incendiary comment and has no basis in this debate.  You can't even acknowledge who you are.  ℬastique▼talk 22:35, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  English in USA 

message: * 47% of 454,900,000 = 213 803 000
** According to a Eurobarometer survey of 2001, 47% of the citizens of the (15-states) Union speak English well enough to hold a conversation. - English as a lingua franca for Europe
** 2004 population 454,900,000 - European_union
* The European Union uses British English
::How's this for a different barometer?
::
Google              	hits
gasoline site:eu.int	4,700
petrol site:eu.int  	14,900
::That pretty much puts the kibosh on a notion of uniform European Union use of British English, doesn't it?  Gene Nygaard 03:21, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Missed one. Search on Google (petrol gasoline site:eu.int) "about 8,650 results".  Google is not a measuring device for language usage.  GraemeLeggett 06:31, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  English in the EU 

message: In China, when using English, the word is "gas."  In Thailand, it is also "gas."  --AStanhope 16:15, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Shell in their Hong Kong website uses "petrol", so I guess the Cantons probably use the p-word. GraemeLeggett 16:37, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  Petrol in Malaysia too it seems, fascinating Website [www.shell.com]GraemeLeggett 16:41, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: English in Asia 

message: Any data on english in Africa, Nigeria is a large country with a hefty proportion of English speakers (email scams notwithstanding). GraemeLeggett 06:37, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The English spoken in most African nations is based on British English. Nigeria (pop. 128,771,988), like South Africa (pop. 44,344,136), is a member of the Commonwealth. - Yama 07:12, 25 May 2005 (UTC)

text: We are talking about English usage as a whole. That includes things like conversations, not just over the Internet. While it may be true that people type gasoline when using Google, this is more a factor of US dominance over the Internet (i.e. they are forced to use gasoline to retrieve results from US sites) rather than an indicator of their true preference. — Yama 13:05, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: English in Africa ?

message: *I can overwhelm this board with insignificant and pointless facts as well.  These are facts all the same:
*Gasoline, while not the preferred word, is in use in the UK.  A small but not insignificant number of articles written by BBC News correspondents use the term, gasoline.   UK citizens know what you mean when you say Gasoline.
*Gasoline, while not the preferred term, is in use in Australia.  A small but not insignificant number of articles written by ABC correspondents (not Reuters, etc.) on ABC News use the term, gasoline.  Australian citizens know what you mean when you say Gasoline. 
*Petrol is still not being used by American news correspondents at all.  Most Americans don't know what petrol is, yet still use the internet on a regular basis.  Please don't draw this one little sentence out of context.  There's a whole slew of facts here.
* Reuters, one of the primary sources of American, British and Australian news yeilded the following on today's date:  100 articles for gasoline, 73 articles for petrol.
::I live in Australia and I've never heard the ABC use gasoline except when discussing the USA. I get 124 results for gasoline at abc.net.au, most of which are talking about the USA or Iraq, and 7,930 results for petrol at abc.net.au, most of which are talking about Australia. The word gasoline is hardly in use in Australia. --bainer (talk) 01:31, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I have noticed the same thing. Often an article/report will use the term preferred by those who are being reported on, rather than the preference of the target audience. — Yama 11:30, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: In the United States, this does not hold true.  Non-American terms are almost never used in the media, unless no American equivalents exist. —Lifeisunfair 15:14, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: English in the UK and Australia

message: * British Commonwealth countries in the Caribbean favor the term gasoline over petrol.  
*  Nations in Latin America use American English as their preferred English of business over UK English.  This represents some 40 trillion people (I don't have the specific figure here).
*:I don't think English is a widely (and fluently) spoken/read language in Latin America, but I could be wrong. If so, it lends no weight to this debate. — Yama 13:08, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: English in Latin America and the Caribbean

message: ==== British English (and minor variants) ====
* United Nations system (UN, UNESCO, UNICEF, etc.)
* World Trade Organization (WTO)
* International Organization for Standardization (ISO)
* International Electrotechnical Commission (IEC)
* International Telecommunication Union (ITU)
* World Health Organization (WHO)
* International Labour Organization (ILO)
* International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA)
* Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC)
* South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation (SAARC)
* International Criminal Police Organization - Interpol
* International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC)
* WWF - The Conservation Organization
* Amnesty International
* North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (NATO)
* European Union (EU)
* Organisation of Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD)
* Commonwealth Secretariat (Commonwealth of Nations)
* Organisation of Eastern Caribbean States (OECS)
* International Olympic Committee (IOC)
* Fédération Internationale de Football Association (FIFA)
* Transparency International
* Greenpeace
==== American English ====
* International Monetary Fund (IMF)
* World Bank
* Organization of American States (OAS)
* NAFTA Secretariat
* and World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO)
Anybody can pick and choose international organizations and come up with a massive amount on one side and very little on the other.  There's not even any source for this information.  Once again, this proves absolutely nothing. ℬastique▼talk 23:50, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that's why the list was titled "Use of English by Major International Organisations". The focus is on the big ones, not the small fry. — Yama 13:13, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: And as we've seen elsewhere, even on these organization's websites, the use of gasoline over petrol is often preferred, in spite of their choice of English.  Plus, you forgot to mention that the majority of your UK-using list preferred a modified form of Commonwealth English over the standard (-ize over -ise, and it seems sometimes, gasoline over petrol)  ℬastique▼talk 14:26, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I did not forget, I make mention of the variant elsewhere on the page. Please read all of my new comments before replying. I seriously doubt whether gasoline is part of this variant. I see this variant being used all the time (it is relatively common, but hardly dominant, where I live) but I never see gasoline. — Yama 15:06, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Use of English by Major International Organisations 

message: * International Monetary Fund (IMF)
* World Bank
* Organization of American States (OAS)
* NAFTA Secretariat
* and World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO)
Anybody can pick and choose international organizations and come up with a massive amount on one side and very little on the other.  There's not even any source for this information.  Once again, this proves absolutely nothing. ℬastique▼talk 23:50, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that's why the list was titled "Use of English by Major International Organisations". The focus is on the big ones, not the small fry. — Yama 13:13, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: And as we've seen elsewhere, even on these organization's websites, the use of gasoline over petrol is often preferred, in spite of their choice of English.  Plus, you forgot to mention that the majority of your UK-using list preferred a modified form of Commonwealth English over the standard (-ize over -ise, and it seems sometimes, gasoline over petrol)  ℬastique▼talk 14:26, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I did not forget, I make mention of the variant elsewhere on the page. Please read all of my new comments before replying. I seriously doubt whether gasoline is part of this variant. I see this variant being used all the time (it is relatively common, but hardly dominant, where I live) but I never see gasoline. — Yama 15:06, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  American English 

message: On naming matters:
Here in Hungary,
Gasoline (gázolaj) is the name for Diesel engine fuel.
Benzene (benzin) is the name of fuel for Otto engines (which require spark plug).
Petrol (petróleum) is the thing you put in the shiny brass lamp with wick to get light.
It would be great if a worlwide standard was reached on mineral oil derivative naming.
I guess some people must get killed every year filling their car's tank with the wrong kind of fuel when travelling abroad.
: This difference should be reflected in the Magyar version, not the English one.
::Not at all.  It's just as relevant as non-English-speaking Indians using petrol. - Omegatron 19:04, Jun 6, 2005 (UTC)
:::I don't understand how you could interpret things that way. The discussion was about English-speaking Indians, of which there are many millions. Besides, in Magyar neither petrol or gasoline mean  what they do in English, so I don't see how it applies to the debate. 202.139.41.194 03:07, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Hungarian naming

message: *The title Gasoline/Petrol is unacceptable. As it stands this talk page is a sub-page of Gasoline. Jooler 04:12, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: *This page now has the same format as football (soccer) Jooler 04:30, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: *Acceptable, at least to me, while the debate rages on.  However, please leave Gasoline as the first word in the text--in the spirit of compromise.  ℬastique▼talk 04:32, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Redirect Direct Redirect

message: ::I think everyone here should take a look at your link, Jooler, and see it.  It looks like a joke, but I now realize that people are pulling up random articles and changing American spellings to UK.  For instance, Anonymous User User:59.167.21.48, who posted on this page yesterday, did that very thing earlier that day.  ℬastique▼talk 20:58, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: What are you talking about? I initiated that article, and I prefer it to be BE. According to arguments you yourself have made previously on this page, my preferences override all else. Do I detect some double standards? — Yama 00:46, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I've already eaten my words...  Don't make me say I'm sorry twice.  It's dreadfully hard for me.  ℬastique▼talk 00:50, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes it's a joke, as is the US version. 202.139.41.194 06:55, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Random Nonsense

message: Protected from moves. This is not an endorsement of the current name. When my watchlist is literally 50% full of people moving this page back and forth, something has to give. Now is the time to discuss. --Golbez 07:32, Jun 7, 2005 (UTC)
:That's easy.  It should be moved to Fossil fuel for reciprocating piston engines equipped with spark plugs over the existing redirect.  Nobody can complain about that, as nobody calls it that. --Carnildo 03:14, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protected 

message: Just in case you don't think it makes any difference, Gasoline doesn't exist as far as Wikiwax is concerned,  Petrol is just fine of course.  hydnjo talk 00:41, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you aware that Wikiwax is an index to Wikipedia article titles? --Yath 06:41, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, thats what I'm talking about, the WikiWax Wikipedia index.  hydnjo talk 18:05, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Wikiwax]] and [[Gasoline]]

message: This page is 185 kilobytes long.
:If there's an overwhelming conensus, then the "debate" should now end and the "consensus" should be followed - assuming the purpose of debate is to reach consensus on action. -- Uncle Ed (talk) 20:35, Jun 13, 2005 (UTC)
::Yes, that's why I formally requested a page move.  Had you bothered to read the discussion, you'd have known that. —Lifeisunfair 20:45, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Must be a serious debate