Talk:Qarmatians

message: In the Journal of Islamic Studies 17 (2006) 200  one can find a review of Theology, Ethics and Metaphysics • Edited by HIROYUKI MASHITA (Royal Asiatic Society Classics of Islam). In Volume III, pp. 196/7 is discussed the millenarian excitement.
In a book on conjunctions by Abu-Abdallah Al-adi can be found the prophecy that the rule of the magi would be restored in the 18th conjunction after the birth of Mohammed. Islamic astrologers let coincide the birth of Mohammed with the triple conjunction of the year 571 C.E. The Jupiter-Saturn conjunction of October 928 took place 18 conjunctions aftetr 571. It occurred in the constellation Saggitarius, also mentioned in the book of Al-adi in connection with a 10th millenium (?).
Siffler (talk) 15:01, 12 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Conjunction October 928 

message: I'm seeing some references to the Qarmatians having fled to Multan (in modern Pakistan) after having been driven out of Egypt, and clashing with Sunni Muslims and sun worshippers out in the east.  Is this generally accepted in academic circles?  Is it worth covering in this article? MatthewVanitas (talk) 17:03, 26 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Qarmatians in Multan (Pakistan) 985-1175 CE? 

message: "There is a general tendency in the Sunnite and Shiite sources, when referring to the Ismailis, often erroneously call them Qarmatians without perception of the distinction between them."
This is an article about the Qarmatians and this is everything the section has to offer about their religious beliefs?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.114.174.194 (talk) 08:47, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Religious beliefs 

message: There's a passage in this article that appears to be lifted almost word-for-word from Slavoj Zizek's The Year of Dreaming Dangerously.
From the article:
The Qarmatians aimed to build a society based on reason and equality. The state was governed by a council of six with a chief who was a first among equals.[8] All property within the community was distributed evenly among all initiates. The Qarmatians were organized as an esoteric society but not as a secret one. Their activities were public and openly propagated, but new members had to undergo an initiation ceremony involving seven stages.
From The Year of Dreaming Dangerously:
The Qarmatians' goal was to build a society based on reason and equality. The state was governed by a council of six, with a chief who was first among equals. All property within the community was distributed evenly among all initiates. Although the Qarmatians were organized as an esoteric society, they were not a secret one: their activities were public and openly propagated. 
The Year of Dreaming Dangerously is not cited anywhere in the article, much less after the passage itself (citation 8 points to a different source).
204.213.244.97 (talk) 19:39, 17 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I have removed the paragraph in question. Also, Slavoj Zizek, is not a historian nor does he have any specialization for the time period in question, therefore he can not be considered a reliable source. Thanks bringing the plagiarism to our attention. --Kansas Bear (talk) 20:23, 17 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Possible Plagiarism 

message: In the "Collapse" section of the report it says "After defeat by the Abbasids in 976 the Qarmatians began to..."
It would be helpful if the report were more specific as to what "defeat" is being referenced. I have searched and been unable to find reference to any specific battle or event. As such, I find the explanation somewhat confusing.
Thanks, V Fairchild VFF0347 (talk) 19:11, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Collapse of the Qarmatians 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I believe it is very anachronistic to call the Qarmatians "socialists" because the concept of socialism didn't exist back then and would be completely alien for 10th century Muslims. Calling them just utopian or even   "Proto-socialists" would sound better. 2804:14D:7848:8CD9:7034:55AC:91C9:87FB (talk) 04:07, 23 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The earliest group which has been subject to comparisons of this type is Mazdakism, called "pre-modern communism" by its Wikipedia article. AnonMoos (talk) 00:31, 24 February 2023 (UTC)

text: I agree. Applying the term ‘socialist’ to them seems completely anachronistic. Not to mention the fact that the sources (the ones that are available that is) don’t seem to provide evidence of them being socialist. They were also a state that depended to a large extent on slavery which seems to to be a contradiction with what we consider to be socialism.  Theworks84 (talk) 14:56, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I have to disagree on that point. Ussr, China, North Korea etc all used slavery. There's not really anything stopping socialists from creating any "class" of person they need 46.7.28.113 (talk) 01:33, 24 April 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: A fair point but I would argue that what socialists states created in many cases was a modern form of serfdom, I.e the individual was bound to the state in such a way that curtailed their freedom, movement and life in general, but people still possessed limited rights. Slavery is the physical ownership of a human by another human which, at least in theory, socialism disagrees with. I think the main point though is that the term socialist is out of place as it did not exist as a concept in this time period Theworks84 (talk) 21:19, 2 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anachronism 

message: Qaramtian invasions of Egypt have been given separate pages. فضائل الصحابة (talk) 15:19, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Qaramtian invasions of Egypt separate pages