Talk:Winnie Madikizela-Mandela

message: I have removed the words "and convicted fraudster" from the first sentence because I believe it portrays a biased point of view.  While it is a fact that she was convicted of fraud, calling her a 'fraudster' has a subjectively negative connotation.  Furthermore, her fraud conviction is not one of the most notable things she is known for and therefore hardly justifies mention in the first sentence.  I think the mention in the last sentence of the introduction (and of course in the more detailed biography) is sufficient.
--Audentis (talk) 14:04, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: "Convicted Fraudster"

message: More should be written about Winnie Mandela's legacy of Human Rights® and Social Justice® advocacy.
Specifically, it should cover her brave pioneering of the practice of "necklacing"; wrapping a gasoline-soaked rubber tire around the necks of her political opponents and setting it ablaze.
: Regardless of the above comment, the article does contain plenty that casts Winnie Mandela in a negative light.  There is however relatively little on her importance in the anti-apartheid movement, her role as a populist, her symbolic status (keeping the Mandela name visible while her husband was in prison), and her grass-roots popularity despite the controversies. This deserves more analysis in the article. Because she is both important and controversial, a neutral point of view is vital. Zaian 23:28, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The above comment seems bonafide. I am editing out the sentence.  /¨Ezeu 01:58, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The "things went horribly wrong" exchange between her and Tutu when she appeared before the Truth and Reconciliation Commission should be mentioned. Zaian 23:28, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Human Rights advocacy

message: If Winnie was born in 1936 and met Nelson in 1957, how can she have been 22 when they met? The citations are all there, but either the BBC, the nndb, or The Guardian must be wrong here.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.232.93.70 (talk) 11:32, 4 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: The above comment seems bonafide. I am editing out the sentence.  /¨Ezeu 01:58, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The "things went horribly wrong" exchange between her and Tutu when she appeared before the Truth and Reconciliation Commission should be mentioned. Zaian 23:28, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Information Please

message: Wasn't Stompie 16 years old, not 14? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.42.190.101 (talk) 13:53, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Stompie's Age

message: I am trying to expand this article, mainly focusing on the differences between this book and other accounts (books and otherwise) of South Africa throughout this period. Any comments or suggestions are appreciated on the talk page.BillMasen 13:25, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The book can be cited in further reading section.--Biografer (talk) 01:37, 4 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Mandela: The Authorised Biography]]

message: I thought that she lived in a government-owned housing project.  That ain't wealthy.  (I live in the USA which "houses the poor" in government-owned housing projects).HeyYallYo 19:48, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Did she own land?  Did she own gold mines?  What were her assets? I do not nelieve that she had a "wealthy background" of any sort.  HeyYallYo 12:04, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The inner circles of the ANC are fraught with corruption: or at least as "corruption" is intepreted in refined democracies. Meaning, if it were possible to know what and how much her sources of income are, more criminal charges would likely be raised against her. From the local TV news she appears to live a middle-class life. The question "Did she own gold mines?" is rather stupid - a South African gold mine is a massive industrial operation run by a publically listed company; during apartheid years ownership of mining equities by non-whites was difficult or impossible. However today she may have small equity stakes in a number of enterprises, as do I. It wouldn't be generally available information.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paulsheer (talk • contribs) 12:42, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: How wealthy was she?

message: Just to let you know this page is outdated if it claims Ms. Mandela is a "former" politician. When talking about the recent ANC's National Executive Committee (NEC) election, the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7156246.stm) claims that, "The ex-wife of former President Nelson Mandela, Winnie Madikizela-Mandela, emerged top in the NEC vote in the northern town of Polokwane, endorsed by 2,845 of the 3,605 delegates. She has not been active in the ANC since 2003, when she was convicted of fraud."  
Time to update, registered users. Thank you.  124.86.70.119 (talk) 22:16, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: "former" politician no more

message: Where's the mention of her accused involvement with the brutal murder of 14-year old Stompie Moeketsi? Big news that helped sully her career, yes? Then include it... ---32.144.204.190 (talk) 19:15, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It is here? Wizzy…☎ 13:36, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Stompie!

message: An article on Front Row, UK BBC Radio 4, Saturday 23.01.10 just pointed out that the fact she spent 400 days in solitary confinement isn't even mentioned on the wikipedia page :) Might wanna look into that...  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.44.206.103 (talk) 19:51, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: 400 days in solitary confinement

message: Her connection to Julius Malema is worth mentioning. --196.2.126.175 (talk) 08:47, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Julius Malema

message: Hi everybody. On behalf of the teams behind the Wikipedia Primary School research project, I would like to announce that this article has been selected to be reviewed by an external expert. We'd like to ask the English Wikipedia community to join our efforts and improve the article before December 31, 2014 (any timezone); a revision will be then sent to the designated expert for review in early 2015. Any notes and remarks written by the external expert will be made available on this page under a CC-BY-SA license as soon as possible, so that editors can decide if and how to use them. Thanks a lot for your support! --Elitre (WPS) (talk) 16:13, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Wikipedia Primary School announcement

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thread_title: External links modified

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thread_title: External links modified

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thread_title: External links modified

message: So poorly written but I'll try improving it FYI bookgirl (talk) 18:15, 2 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Death

message: Is there any evidence to back up Mandela's claim that the 2010 interview with Nadira Naipaul was "a fabrication", or is this just another case of the dismissal of inconvenient facts as "fake news"? JezGrove (talk) 23:11, 2 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: The point is that the sources contradict each other. Naipaul asserts she interviewed Mandela, and that she said the things quoted in her report. Mandela claims the interview was a "fabrication". They can't both be right, and since Naipaul's published account of their meeting is very detailed I was wondering whether Mandela had offered any evidence or details in support of her own version of events. JezGrove (talk) 23:20, 5 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: While this discussion should focus on the article, rather the subject, it has to be noted that she had a history of giving interviews, and later repudiating them. The TRC report discusses an interview about the murder of Abu Asvat with a Sunday paper a couple of days after his murder, that she then denied giving at the TRC. The TRC report  states that there was a pattern of such denials, and the TRC didn't seem to take her denial seriously (page 572, section 69).  If a reliable secondary source covered this point, it could be incorporated into the article. Park3r (talk) 11:44, 15 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: 2010 interview with Nadira Naipaul

message: Winnie and Nelson Mandela separated in 1992, before Nelson Mandela became President. Their daughter Zindzi accompanied Nelson at his inauguration in 1994. Winnie never acted as First Lady, even though their divorce was only finalized in 1996. Zaian (talk) 14:30, 3 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: JLo-Watson, can you explain why you think this should be added back? They were estranged during Nelson Mandela's presidency so she never acted in the role of First Lady. Zaian (talk) 07:02, 5 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text:  Reliable Source stating that she was never First Lady: https://www.iol.co.za/news/opinion/winniemandela-sas-mother-of-the-nation-who-was-never-first-lady-14242652. Quote from Winnie herself, in an interview in 1994 (after Nelson became president): "I am not fighting to be the country’s first lady. In fact, I am not the sort of person to carry beautiful flowers and be an ornament to everyone." Zaian (talk) 12:26, 5 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Never First Lady?

message: For people who are convicted criminals, there should be a Convicted criminal with the arrest photo, rather than that of the political infobox. What are peoples thoughts. Perhaps we could include both as some other ex-politicians have 132.234.228.144 (talk) 06:36, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox should be of Convicted criminal rather than (or in conjunction with) that of politician 

message: Hello! I am a college student who is working to evaluate articles in Wikipedia.  Upon reviewing the article and the guidance Wikipedia puts out for evaluating articles, I am recommending that the lead section be revised for this article. Although it provides a lot of comprehensive information, it does not accurately reflect and summarize all of the contents of the article. According to Wikipedia the lead section should provide a brief description of the various sections of the article and not provide information that is not present elsewhere in the article. Madikizela-Mandela's article goes against both of these things and does not provide an overview of her both negative and positive contributions. Additionally, details regarding both her personal life and criminal proceedings are discussed in the lead section that aren't mentioned later in the article (her own children and the murder of Stompie Seipi).  I just think she is a really prominent female political and social leader, and her lead should concisely reflect what is described later in the article and would benefit from being revised for clarity. Sek124 (talk) 20:18, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the lead covers the important events/accomplishments relevant to Madikizela-Mandela's notability, but it could be more concise and certain details can be moved to later parts of the article. I agree that some info regarding her personal life and criminal proceedings is not discussed later, although Wiki doesn't require all facts in the lead to be repeated later (MOS:LEADREL).  23impartial (talk) 03:08, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lead Section and Overall Clarity 

message: Stephen's class gave an assignment why their parents gave them the names that they did later that day at night Stephen ask his father and his father smile at his son you were named after an important South African who helped to change history who dad? asked Stephen.You were named after 
Stephen Bantu Biko . Steve Biko was an important leader during the apartheid years,' 
"Said Stephen'father".
What did you do , dad? asked Stephen?
He believed that we black South Africans after to solve our own problems in our own way.He started an organization and raised money to end apartheid,' Stephen 's father. 
What happened to him? asked Stephen.
Many of us though he would be the next great leader after president Mandela.But he was arrested, and he was killed in prison.
He was a great man."
Stephen felt very proud to be named after such an important person in South African history 102.219.24.137 (talk) 14:42, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you guys please 🙏 search about it 102.219.24.137 (talk) 14:44, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  How Stephen got his name