Talk:Partita for Violin No. 2 (Bach)

message: Is it just me, or is this page kind of weak?   I know vague criticism is mostly useless, but I don't know if anyone is watching this page.  One thing I noticed is the page on the chaconne/ciaconna form claims spanish provenance, with this page claims italian.  I always thought italian, but I'd like to find a more accurate reference.
Abruzzi 03:51, 27 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: Music-encyclopedic writings must not be without character-descriptions which are in essence personal and subjective, however the good encyclopedian naturally expresses a mean (average) of common perceptions.
I allowed myself to remove a note stating a question or request for "original research", which is inappropriate according to the above. I actually also like the Brahms quote (should be sourced, though) which adds to the reader immense value. After all, a written work by a 300 year old European composer has several aspects: genesis, realization, performance history, and reception history including reviewers and researchers opinions.
For the question of whether it should be mentioned as part of "The Complete Six" I disagree, there is a certain amount of freedom and judgement needed and emphasizing the importance of this piece versus, say, the Sonata in C is most appropriate and well done by having it mentioned in a special article. 
Furthermore composers often selected and performed single pieces from complete works. Another example is the organ version of the prelude from Partita 3 by Bach himself found in some Cantata. --d-axel (talk) 01:56, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Character of Partita 2 

message: I think it is a very good idea to make an article combining all six works for unaccompanied violin. I am not sure if individual articles are needed for each individual work, but if we remove this one we probably have to dedicate a significant section of the larger article to Chaconne being as it is the most popular movement in the repretoire.
* Turns out, there already was one, it was just hard to find.  Sonatas and partitas for solo violin (1001-1006)  I've been working on it lately. Alcuin 06:29, 29 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Complete Six 

message: Dublin pedant writes: The page states "The ciaccona ... lasts some 13-14 minutes, surpassing the duration of the previous movements combined." This is not true for the Monica Huggett/Veritas recording (first 4 movements: 16 mins 40 secs, Chaconne: 14 mins); I doubt that this is true for other recordings either.
:It could be that performing the previous movements without any repeats is shorter than performing the Chaconne alone -- but I've never tried to time that myself. Mademoiselle Fifi 15:58, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Data point: Arthur Grumiaux takes 13'17" to work his way through the Chaconne. The timings for the other movements of the partita are 3'06" for the Allemanda, 1'58" for the Corrente, 3'05" for the Sarabanda, and 3'06" for the Giga. He takes the usual repeats, which is to say, he repeats the first section but not the second in each movement. Clearly the Chanconne makes up the bulk of this work. ILike2BeAnonymous 17:55, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Duration

message: I have a repruduction of handwritten from Bach Ciaccona, and it is written Ciaccona, not Chaconne! Stop saying Bach wrote Chaconne! He wrote Ciaccona!
thanks
--93.147.133.46 (talk) 01:37, 17 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ciaccona vs Chaconne 

message: According to the article, "[n]otable recordings of the Partita have been made by Henryk Szeryng, Midori Goto, Nathan Milstein, Arthur Grumiaux, Gidon Kremer, Jascha Heifetz, Itzhak Perlman, Yehudi Menuhin, Leonid Kogan and Hilary Hahn, to name a few."
Hasn't nearly every well-known concert violinist recorded the Partita, or at least the Chaconne/Ciaconna, at some time?  IMO, it's safe for a layperson to assume that if s/he has heard of a violinist, that violinist has recorded at least the last movement of the Partita.  (rhetoric) It might be easier to list performers who *haven't* recorded it!  (/rhetoric)
For this reason, the "notable recordings" sentence seems useless to me; I recommend removing it.  If there are recordings made notable by some unique aspect of their performance, place in music history, etc., we could have a separate section with approx. one sentence naming a given performer and describing what is noteworthy about his/her recording.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.176.7.3 (talk) 20:51, 8 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  List of famous recordings: Useless? 

message: The Brahms quotation needs a citation, but I don't know how to flag that or whether anyone is really paying attention to this page.  134.173.80.129 (talk) 20:38, 27 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Added. For your future reference, you can flag unreferenced material in WP articles by typing  or  immediately following an unreferenced claim. /ninly(talk) 22:03, 27 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Brahms quotation 

message: My question is, assuming that Bach did label the names of the five movements of this Partita #2 in Italian, whether it would not be a good idea to also list their French equivalents. They are usually - not always - listed in French on recordings, and also at IMSLP . 
(As to the statement and controversy concerning whether the Ciaconna takes longer to play the the preceding four movements together, it might seem simple enough to add something like depending on which repeats are played or omitted. This would be helpful to Wikipedia visitors who are unfamiliar with the concept of dropping repeats.) Milkunderwood (talk) 23:46, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Both done. Milkunderwood (talk) 03:29, 12 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  French names of the 5 movements 

message: I'm wondering what the quality standard is, if there is any, for inclusion of audio files with articles.  While I'm sure that there are rights issues attached to particularly well-known performances of this Partita, there are certainly more polished performances of this work in the public domain than are posted here.  The recordings of the Allemanda, Corrente and Giga are particularly unacceptable.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vienner (talk • contribs) 00:47, 29 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sound File Quality 

message: The article says "The movements correspond to the dances of the time". Where is the citation for that claim? 190.173.136.114 (talk) 22:03, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: This does verge on a "sky is blue" situation, especially with each of the movement titles linked to an article about that form. However, if your point is that a chaconne is not a dance, then you are right to object.—Jerome Kohl (talk) 22:20, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unsourced sentence 

message: Why on Earth would you insist on removing the Brahms quote that I added and which I properly cited?  It is under a specific section referring to the reception of this piece. It is not placed in a section discussing technical aspects, like counterpart. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.163.65.129 (talk) 01:23, 21 April 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: The quote you added is already in the article. Look again. intforce (talk) 01:30, 21 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Brahms quote 

message: On the wiki page about Chaconnes, it mentions accurately how the form came from South America, then quickly caught on in Spain. It also mentions that chaconnes were danced to. However, there is a statement in this article suggesting that Chaccones were not danced to, which is incorrect! Roymacneil (talk) 02:45, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I added this explanation to the article: "While the origin and early usage of the chaconne is a dance, its 'busy passage-work and contrapuntal density largely obliterated and dance feeling' by Bach's time in Germany." and provided a source for it, the same Silbiger at Grove who's cited in Chaconne. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 04:06, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
thread_title: Chaconne dance

message: it's well written Ciaccona not else 2.39.53.42 (talk) 18:00, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ciaccona 

message: The redirect Chaconne in D minor has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at  until a consensus is reached.  NW1223<Howl at me•My hunts> 15:44, 6 November 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  "[[:Chaconne in D minor]]" listed at [[Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion|Redirects for discussion]]