Talk:Indian folklore

message: Thanks for fixing this for me (re the keep template). Metamagician3000 08:19, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

message: For good suggestions on how to improve this article, please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Indian folklore.  Thanks -- Argon233 T C @ ∉  04:06, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article Improvement 

message: I don't profess to have deep knowledge of the folklore of India.  The opening sentence seems to suggest that there is no folklore in India, and that the claim that India has folklore is wholly the result of some kind of colonial condescension to their religion and way of life.  This strikes me as frankly preposterous.  Folklore is a human universal, even if the scope of what's folklore and what represents a greater or more formal social investment in its truth may have fuzzy outlines.  There must be at least some local narratives, oral traditions, and children's games in India. 
Also, I'd suggest that this be moved to Folklore of India, just on the outside chance that someone might come here looking for Native American folklore. — Smerdis of Tlön 13:41, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Um, I was just trying to improve upon the load of patronising crap that was there beforehand.  Rather than taking the lazy route and slapping a POV notice on it, why don't you try improving the article first?  Be bold.  It wasn't my intention to suggest that there is no folklore in India, but I'm stumped how to write about the subject without suggesting Hindu and other religious beliefs are just folkways, as the original article did.  Vizjim 22:12, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Obviously, the relationship between Hinduism and the folklore of India needs to be explored in some detail: I suspect that, being an originally polytheistic religion, the relationship between Hindus and their deities and sacred texts is different from Christian or Muslim experience, and that folk Hinduism may be more open to local variations and local tales of the acts of deities from folk Christianity or folk Islam.  About this, I can currently only speculate, though I may try and look up some reading about this.  But any information I gain about it is going to be third hand. More importantly, though, I can't imagine that India is free from folktales, semi-historical legends of heroes, villains, and tricksters, folk music, folk dance, folk poetry, and folk art.  Religion is probably peripheral to at least some of this material.  Some of it is likely shared between the Hindu, Muslim, and other citizens of India.  To claim that sensitivity to the religious feelings of Indians requires an assumption that the very concept of the folklore of India is some kind of colonialist imposture goes beyond obnoxious social constructionism: it implies that Indians aren't human.We really need a Portal:Folklore, to standardize the folklore titles and give some assistance in improving these articles.  An appropriate starting outline would perhaps help avoid these sorts of misunderstandings. —  Smerdis of Tlön 03:16, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Please look through the history of the article, understand what I was reacting to, and either improve the article or leave it alone.  The newest revision contains no POV that I can see but is also effectively a blank article, so intelligent and verified content would be welcome, either here or at the currently redlinked Folklore of India (I'd support a move if someone suggested one).  However, you need to tackle the point made in the edit summaries - India is not a singular culture (as, say, Scotland is), and across an entire sub-continent containing 180+ languages, 15-odd religions, and hundreds of regions which used until colonial times to be independent entities, there will be very little common folklore, possibly none.  Would we be better setting up tributary articles dealing with the folklore of each region of India, for example?  Vizjim 08:29, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *I've tried to rewrite the opening paragraphs, at least, and added a number of see also's; I've also tried to set up a basic outline of topics that I think ought to be addressed by somebody.  I agree that the previous versions were condescending garbage; I just think that the replacement went too far in the other direction.  IMO, the chief focus of the article should IMO not be on Hinduism or Hindu mythology, although folk Hinduism ought to be addressed.  Folklore properly understood is much broader than that.  I have tried to set up a number of suggestions about subjects that ought to be covered, even if they only turn into lists of links to specific narratives and art forms, at least they will be organized on this page.  Smerdis of Tlön 14:34, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Thank you Smerdis of Tlön(Ihcoyc) for the large improvement to this article. I would second the suggestion to change/move the article name to Folklore of India as I think that this wording would be a less ambiguous description of the subject matter, and would seem more consistant with common conventions.  -- Argon233 T C @ ∉  16:09, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Off to a bad POV start.  And suggesting a move