Talk:Consequences of Nazism

message: This page is a daughter article of the main Adolf Hitler article. WhisperToMe 18:53, 25 Nov 2003 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: " In that sense, Hitler's Final Solution destabilized the already volatile Middle East for the long term. 
The only positive outcome of the war was the destruction of Nazism and fascism as political and ideological forces, although modified forms of fascism lingered in Spain and Portugal under Franco and Salazar. The horrors of Nazism, when fully revealed by the Nuremberg Trials in 1946, also produced a radical re-assessment of the anti-Semitic attitudes which had been so prevalent in Europe. The process known as denazification meant that German society, in particular, was radically changed for the better in the postwar years. Other forms of pseudo-scientific racism, such as eugenics, were also discredited by the uses to which the Nazis put these doctrines. The founding of the United Nations on October 24 1945, and the principles enshrined in the Charter of the United Nations, were signs that at least some of the lessons of Hitler's career had been learned. "
"The Jewish people consider Hitler's regime the greatest calamity in their history since the fall of the Temple in AD 70. " 
"The Polish were compensated by lying in ruins former German cities, that required a lot of effort to bring to the life Recovered Territories. For the first time in history, Poland ceased to be multiethnic and pluralistsc country. For the first time in history, the share of Catholic and the share of Polish speaking exceeded 2/3 of Polish population.
Poland was put under thyranny of totalitarian regime. Loses of Poland were immense, and poportionally the highest in Europe."
"  This confirmed the Soviet Union's already paranoid fear of the West, which led to the setting up of the Communist governments in eastern Europe; the Soviets hoped to use the satellite states there as a buffer zone against new invasions from the West, and to prevent such a catastrophe from ever happening again.
Another outcome was the destruction of Nazism and fascism as political and ideological forces. While modified forms of fascism continued in Spain and Portugal under Francisco Franco and António de Oliveira Salazar, it never regained popular appeal.  As Germany radically reworked their society in a process known as denazification, the credibility of anything associated with Nazism was damaged or destroyed.  Militarism, long a feature of German society, was abandoned.  The horrors of the Holocaust, revealed by the Nuremberg Trials in 1946, prompted a reassessment of old anti-semitic beliefs, resulting in an increasingly tolerant atmosphere toward Judaism in the West.  Eugenics, which had been popular in the scientific and government communities since the late 19th century, lost appeal after the brutal excesses committed by the Nazi regime in its name. "
(no cited source, sounds POV, impossible to verify).
This stuff is clearly very POV. In a way, the whole article is, but I kinda like it. The quality of what you've written is high, but the anti-fascist, anti-eugenics, pro-jewish POV comes thru too clearly at times. JackLynch 05:26, 13 Dec 2003 (UTC)
thread_title:  Moved from article 

message: I'm sorry to have vexed you so severely. Would you perhaps like to point out a few of my numerous mistakes, so that I might reflect? I am sure that in time, and with cool heads, we can sort this article out nicely. Jack 05:23, 16 Dec 2003 (UTC)
thread_title:  Perhaps I felt a little too free? 

message: The anti-Nazi POV of this page, and certainly of many of those in the talk is clear. I think that this POV is probably shared by the vast majority of the west (I am far less certain that it is the majority world view). What I am wondering is what is the wiki policy on popular POV? Should an article take a side on stuff, ever? Should it describe the holocaust as horrible? Are words that have a good or bad connentation ever acceptable to use? Obviously many think so, but I don't. Opinions have no place in an encyclopedia, and those who insist on placing them here should "find some other place" IMO ;). Jack 18:51, 17 Dec 2003 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anti-Nazi POV 

message: Move to Consequences of Adolf Hitler's rule? --Jiang 03:09, 4 Jan 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: See Wikipedia:Browser page size limits. --Jiang 06:09, 7 Jan 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move? 

message: I admit I failed to register the whole discussion that has been going on about this article. Right now I think it's not that bad and could give an uninformed person looking for knowledge a good introduction to the post-WWII situation. I wonder if Adam still thinks it is "a badly-written and morally bankrupt piece of nonsense, full of a whole lot of new opinionated statements under the guise of NPOV" and that it "might as well now be abolished". >KF< 21:31, 13 Jan 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: hahahahaha..... I understand its a bit hard to follow, but he made that in statement in context, responding to some rather extreme edits I made in response to his "I apologise for being anti-fascist, anti-eugenics and pro-Jewish. Feel free to write some pro-fascist, pro-eugenics and anti-Jewish text to balance mine.". I clearly did too good a job, and he was in no way amused, lol. Anyways, it has been edited mercilessly since them, and continues to be. Jack 01:04, 14 Jan 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Whats the deal?

message: Jewry is, as far as i'm aware, an antequated if not outright derrogatory term - i think Judaism would be much better. --80.142.247.173 20:34, 18 Mar 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: What's with the usage of the word "Jewry" ?

message: The article focuses on Germany and its treatment, seems unbalanced-the fate of Jews and  countries  ruined by Germany has only few lines.
--Granet 19:44, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Balance 

message: These edits should be checked thoroughly for the relevance of the citation given, the accuracy of the data and any copyright violations. For example take this paragraph:
:Sixty percent of Soviet POWs died during the war. Millions of Soviet POWs and forced laborers transported to Germany were on their return to the USSR (in many cases forcefully repatriated by the Western Allies) treated as traitors and deserters and were executed or deported to the Soviet prison camps. Over 1.5 million Red Army soldiers imprisoned by the Germans were sent to the Gulag in Siberia and the far north (25 years was the usual term).
The source given is http://www.moreorless.au.com/killers/stalin.html but the second half of the paragraph is very similar to one which appears in http://www.belarusguide.com/history1/WWII_partisan_resistance_in_Belarus.htm
:Millions of Soviet POWs and Belarusian...
--Philip Baird Shearer 15:41, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Relevance of the citation given 

message: I have seen in the Effect on Austria section a sentence about West Germany and East Germany (i.e. about the Stalin Note). Can I remove it??? It's not fit to a paragraph about Austria. -Pika ten10 (talk) 02:48, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unrelated sentence... 

message: I changed the number of 8.7 millions to 10,651,000 to make it consistent with the article Eastern Front (World War II) and made appropriate reference.
I did that because Wikipedia must be self-consistent. In addition to that, the number of 8.7 millions is the official number. Some researchers argue that the real number was much higher, up to 25 millions and even more (although not all their arguments look convincing). To verify the official number I checked the Memorial database (OBD Memorial the official database of killed and missing in action soviet soldiers). They claim that this database contains names of all of them. I tried to find my grandfather (was missing in action during the Battle of Stalingrad), but there was no his name there. The name of my friend's grandfather was also absent. I made a short poll among my friends asking them to search their dead relatives in this database, and only part of them could find anybody there. I conclude, therefore, that the number of 8.7 millions is a lower estimate only, so in situation when Wikipedia gives two different numbers the larger number is more trustworthy. 
Someone may argue that I present my own research. It is not the case. I simply linked two Wikipedia articles together. --Paul Siebert (talk) 05:50, 20 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Paul you are right. This is not original research. Vadim Erlikman an independent Russian journalist has published a handbook of statistics that covers humnan losses in 20th century conflicts. Poteri narodonaseleniia v XX veke : spravochnik. Moscow 2004.  His breakdown of Soviet WW2 losses is 7.6 million killed in battle or . missing in action, 2.6 million POW dead and 400,000 partisan & militia deaths, for a total of 10.6 million. The official figures published in English translation appear inG. I. Krivosheev. Soviet Casualties and Combat Losses. Greenhill 1997 . The official total of confirmed battle deaths & deaths from non combat causes is 6.9 million, not counting those missing in action. The total missing in action and POW dead is only 1.8 million which adds to the official total of 8.7 million. Western historians agree that the Soviet POW death toll was around 3 million. When one adds the estimated 3 million POW to the 6.9 million confirmed deaths, plus at least 500,000 killed in battle but missing, one can see that the estimate of 10.6 million is indeed reasonable. The argument used by Krivosheev is that many men were taken prisoner by the German's were not officially in the ranks even though they may have been in the reserves. On the civilian side of the ledger the Russians  today count 1.8 million dead in German camps or in forced labour. My hunch is that these 1.8 million civilians were in fact reservists caught in the German dragnet. In 1965 Marshal Konev claimed 10 million Soviet military deaths, I believe he was correct. If you take a look at Krivosheev's reconciliation of the total number of men drafted to the number on the rolls in 1945, the figures do not tie out to the  official figure of 8.7 million, they add down to 10.1 million. The Soviet Union was well known for fuzzy math --Woogie10w (talk) 23:58, 20 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  10,651,000 dead Soviet solders, not 8.7 millinos 

message: The article claims that Britain never recovered its position as a superpower. 'Superpower' is a post WWII term, Britain was never a superpower, it was however a great power. i feel that this section requires alteration because of the inappropriate use of the term 'superpower'. Perhaps the article could state that 'Britain never recovered the influence it had prior to World War Two', or something like that. Does anyone else feel the same way?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.2.125.228 (talk) 01:03, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Britain as a superpower? 

message: If a user makes a post and quotes the source, another user can jump in and change the data without changing the source cited. Tonight I fixed the section that quoted Vadim Erlikmans figures on Soviet casualties in WW2. Erlikman clearly states total Soviet losses were 10.6 million, including 2.6 million POW. If one makes a post on Wikipedia, it is necessary to watch it like a hawk in order to prevent anyone on the planet from adding unsourced material.--Woogie10w (talk) 01:23, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why Wikipedia has such a bad reputation 

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thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:Einsatzgruppen Killing.jpg

message: I have done a major rewrite upon the section referring to future conflicts to fit reality. 
1. Ideological changes in warfare? No subsequent armed forces have adopted Nazi ideology.
2. It is worth noting that the Allies adopted the innovative techniques and practices of the German Army and the Luftwaffe at the first opportunity as needed for their victories as conditions allowed and in accordance with the nature of the war.
3. The Nazis did not introduce rocket warfare (the Soviet Army was using Katyusha rockets as short-range artillery weapons), and the V-1 and V-2 rockets did not decide the war.
4. The 'Wonder weapons' based upon technology introduced in the stages of design and testing (jet aircraft and long-distance missiles) appeared too late to have any influence upon the war, but they were developed by the victors.  Pbrower2a (talk) 16:13, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Future conflicts 

message: This is an obscure POV fork that needlessly repeats material that can be said on the articles on Nazism and Nazi Germany.--R-41 (talk) 18:36, 7 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I concur, cannot see why this topic deserves a separate article. AadaamS (talk) 05:37, 9 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV fork from Nazism and Nazi Germany. 

message: As I recall all of the Baltic states were occupied by Nazi Germany yet neither Estonia, Latvia nor Lithuania is mentioned in this article. Surely those countries must have been affected by nazism and the occupation or nazi collaboration during WW2? AadaamS (talk) 14:35, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Baltic states 

message: The Yugoslavia section is generally fine, but there are a few issues with it. Firstly, the only referance, Carl Savich, is by no stretch of the imagination a reliable source. Secondly, the picture caption "Due to their strong opposition to Nazism, Serbs were considered enemies of Hitler's Germany. Alongside Jews, Serbs were expelled in certain countries." is unreferanced and sounds like self-serving nationalist fiction. The main reason for their treatment lay in the Ustasha's policies and nationalist views, not the Nazis, though the Nazis did encourage the Ustashe to take a hard line against them in their divide and rule policy. Ana Radic (talk) 18:47, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Yugoslavia

message: Was not Austria again separated from germany after WW2? The Consequences of Nazism? and is prohibited to join Germany? It should be also added.Ovsek (talk) 13:32, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Austria 

message: I replaced the "german people seen as genocidal" passage with german males are thouhgt of as evil by most non-german people in the world. German women are not called evil by non-germans since they are women and therefore are useful to non-german males for sexual purposes.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.103.140.192 (talk) 08:58, 8 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  German males viewed as evil 

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message: Nazism 197.188.199.63 (talk) 14:27, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  History 

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