Talk:Diane Ablonczy

message: Quite a slant in the paragraphs about Arar, this does go against the neutrality principle of Wikipedia.
*I've adjusted the wording.  Feel free to make further changes if you think the current wording is POV (it's entirely accurate as a description, though, and a source has been provided).  CJCurrie 21:37, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: I would like to see the reference to the question on Arar removed. I don’t know the appropriate way to put this up for discussion, so I am putting this message on the discussion page as well as my talk page. I invite CJCurrie to read and consider this before doing another split-second revert. My reasons for the removal are as follows: 
* Taking one out-of-context question made in a fourteen-year career that covers thousands of Hansard pages full of questions, statements, and speeches, and inserting it in the middle of a factual “CV” is inappropriate. Isn’t this supposed to be an “encyclopedia?” 
* The fact is that AT THE TIME the question did NOT create any great political controversy. Only with hindsight about the terrible injustice done to Mr. Arar is the question raised by Ms. Ablonczy controversial, made to look even more so because of  editorial slant. 
* AT THE TIME information had just come to light (during a visit by U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell) that the FBI provided information about Maher Arar to the RCMP weeks ago. This seemed to confirm earlier allegations that there was a terrorist connection. I am giving you several newspaper sources to back that up. Cheney, Peter,"Allegations against Canadian revealed, "The Globe and Mail, October 18, 2002 page A13 Trickey, Mike, “FBI told RCMP Ottawa man had terror link: Embarrassed officials admit U.S. sent evidence about Maher Arar”,“The Ottawa Citizen”,November 18, 2002 page A1  Naumetz, Tim,“Manley won't discuss Arar case: Liberals accused of losing control after FBI says RCMP knew about terror allegations, kept mum”,“The Ottawa Citizen”, November 19, 2002 Trickey, Mike, “Red-faced officials admit to having terror suspect data: Canada claimed U.S. withheld information”,“Calgary Herald”, November 18, 2002 page A6. Ms. Ablonczy undoubtedly had her own sources. 
* It is in the above CONTEXT that the questions were asked and the thrust of Ms. Ablonczy’s (and other MPs’) questions – as anyone who reads them in context can see for themselves  - was on the adequacy of the government’s screening and security checks process. These are the types of questions opposition MPs legitimately ask when trying to hold the government accountable and get to the bottom of things. Ms. Ablonczy was doing her job, although with the wisdom of hindsight her choice of words was unfortunate. 
* The tragic story of Mr. Maher Arar is well documented in a full Wikipedia page – this out-of-context reference has no place here. TapuyoGN 22:19, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Remove Question

message: Ottawa not helping deportee, NDP says
PETER CHENEY
19 October 2002
The Globe and Mail
Metro
A6
Prime Minister Jean Chretien has come under attack for his government's "dismissive response" to the case of a Canadian who was deported to Syria by the United States.
NDP leader Alexa McDonough says that Mr. Chretien and the Liberals have not done nearly enough to find out what happened to Maher Arar, an Ottawa telecommunications engineer who was sent to Syria after being arrested by U.S. immigration officials during a stopover while flying home to Canada.
Mr. Arar's family have not heard from him since Oct. 3, shortly before his deportation.
"Canadians cannot trust their government to defend or protect their rights abroad," Ms. McDonough said in a statement that was delivered to Mr. Chretien's office yesterday. "I am deeply distressed by your dismissive response to the United States's illegal imprisonment, interrogation and deportation of a Canadian citizen of Arabic origin."
Mr. Arar, who lived in Ottawa with his wife and two children, was arrested at New York's John F. Kennedy Airport on Sept. 26 and subjected to a series of lengthy interrogations in which he was accused of belonging to al-Qaeda. He was later deported to Syria, even though he was carrying a Canadian passport.
*********
Please note that this article was published a full month before Ablonczy made her statements in the HoC.  I trust that other editors will not longer use the excuse of "she was only doing her best with the information she had at the time".  CJCurrie 20:10, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Per Request

message: On Sept 10 you stated “the questions are accurately portrayed” – yet 5 minutes later you removed the most slanted section, tacitly admitting that they were NOT accurately portrayed. As Firstpastthepost suggests, there is still editorializing even in the remaining wording. 
::::Actually, I chose to remove the assertion that Ablonczy supported America's decision to deport Arar (it's fairly obvious that she did, but she didn't say so explicitly -- therefore, the claim had to be removed).  CJCurrie 21:26, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not going to respond to all of this, but since you've asked for clarity as regards the timeline, you may find this interesting ...
Foreign Affairs distances itself from Maher Arar
18 November 2002
CTV News - PM
Host(s): LLOYD ROBERTSON
LLOYD ROBERTSON: The shadowy case against a Syrian Canadian is shrouded in mystery and innuendo. Maher Arar, who is a citizen of both Canada and Syria, was arrested in the US, declared a terrorist and deported to Syria. At the time, Ottawa cried foul, but now suddenly it's done an about-face, and as CTV's Roger Smith tells us, the question is why?
ROGER SMITH (Reporter): Maher Arar was first portrayed as a victim of US injustice, now he's fingered as an alleged terrorist who slipped through Canadian hands.
DIANE ABLONCZY (Canadian Alliance MP - Alberta): The fact is, he wasn't properly checked.
SMITH: Arar, a Syrian-Canadian with dual citizenship was arrested in September at a New York airport and deported to Syria after US allegations he belonged to al-Qaeda. His brother denied it.
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: He has no links to terrorists, nothing, he have no links at all.
SMITH: For weeks, Foreign Affairs Minister Bill Graham complained about Arar's treatment and demanded more evidence. But last week, US Secretary of State Colin Powell defended the US action and Ottawa suddenly changed its tune. Foreign Affairs now says Canada is closely collaborating with other international agencies. Still, there was no comment on reports that the RCMP tried to question Arar last January, or on the new evidence against him.
JOHN MANLEY (Deputy Prime Minister): We would not, in any circumstances, of course, disclose information of that sort.
SMITH: For the opposition, it's proof of holes in Canadian security.
ABLONCZY: How is it the US could uncover this man's background so quickly when this government's screening system failed to find his al-Qaeda links?
STEPHEN HARPER (Opposition Leader): We may have a cover-up, but what we've likely got is just pure bungling.
SMITH: But the NDP leader accuses the Alliance of being too quick to condemn Arar.
ALEXA MCDONOUGH (NDP Leader): They're sounding like the judge, jury and the executioner based on rumours that are unsubstantiated about someone's guilt or innocence.
SMITH: With Arar being held in a Syrian jail, it's still not clear what the evidence is against him. But the careful new line out of Ottawa does raise questions about why he was never interrogated in Canada. Roger Smith, CTV News, Ottawa. 
CJCurrie 21:19, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Oct 8 to CJCurrie

message: My previous attempts to address the above issue by providing reasoned arguments for removal were immediately countered by CJCurrie, who keeps reverting within minutes. I don’t want to get into an edit war, but I also am not willing to give up on making this a balanced and factual biography. I therefore am now making the following changes:
* add information on a far more substantial part of Ms. Ablonczy’s career than this one question, to provide a little balance
* provide context for the Arar question (see discussion above and CTV news article quoted by CJCurrie) and replace editorializing with factual quotes  
* restructure and create a new section to provide a cleaner flow of information .  
I understand that proper procedure is for other editors to now work on the wording until there is agreement, so I expect CJCurrie to leave this new version up for discussion or suggest changes, not just do another point blank revert.
TapuyoGN 20:13, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Revise text

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