Talk:Jan Groenveld

message: An image used in this article, File:Jan Groenveld.jpg, has been nominated for speedy deletion for the following reason: Wikipedia files with no non-free use rationale as of 3 December 2011 
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thread_title: File:Jan Groenveld.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

message: On this page, there is only information about how Jan Groeveld has potentially helped people get out of known cults.  However, on her personal web page at http://www.culthelp.info/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2&Itemid=3 .  In her web page, she presents a very closed minded perception of what is religion versus "cult."  There are some very controversial and potentially hateful statements made about many religions listed on this web page.  
Also worth noting, is that even though she wrote a book, there is no evidence that she is a notable public figure respected in her field (or by any large population in general) for her work.  
Anybody with enough desire is phyiscally able to create a Wikipedia page for themselves.  It seems like Jan Groevnveld might have created this one herself.
Another concerning thing is that there is no credible evidence that the creator of this article got permission in the external sources where it says (with permission).  What kind of permission?  Is there an industry standard citation that can be used to reference back to?
---Soultravel7 [02:59 UTC] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Soultravel7 (talk • contribs) 03:15, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reccomendation for Immediate Page deletion--Seems like a personal advertisement-  Personal Bias 

message: I was raised by Jehovah's witnesses parents from a third world country. I believed that my religion is the only true religion in the world, and I also believed that the governing body is composed of anointed Christians that Jehovah God trusted to care for his belongings and his people. Though I believe the teachings from the Watch Tower, I don't believe that the Watch Tower is perfect. The governing body acknowledges that fact. There are many errors in the teachings, but that is not the problem in this organization since we have been learning and growing. The real members of the anointed class, and members of the governing body, humbly accept this fact. So, what is really the problem? As the organization keeps expanding the governing body, could barely control it's members from all over the world. That's why many turned crazy. Who are in control? The elders are. How the elders control their congregations? This is how:
First: The governing body sends overseers (circuit overseer/district overseer) to congregations for regular check up to see how the congregations doing. The circuit overseer check all the members' report cards if they regularly participate in the kingdom ministry/preaching activity. The elders want to look good. They want hundred percent participation from their members, so that they will be commended as very good shepherds. For example: one time in the Felton congregation, Felton California, the son of the presiding overseer announced all the members that would apply for pioneering in that month. He announced almost all of the members in the Felton congregation applied for pioneering. That was unprecedented, I never heard such many applied for pioneering ever since. I also went out in the ministry one day. In the daily text meeting before we went out in the service, one brother asked, where are the others? I thought we are too many? Since almost nobody went out that time. Some of the brothers and sisters in that congregation left and transfer to the other congregation not long after that. 
Second: In the public talks on Sundays, the elders would demonize the speakers that they invite. When the elders notice that there are members in their congregation that they hate, they would tell bad reports to the speaker, so the talks would turn nasty. Annoying the members so they would go away and stop attending the meeting. Not necessarily that the members are doing bad things so the elders hated them, but because the elders are envious or jealous of that members. For example, a highly educated member who is doing just well in the congregation, has been hated since the very beginning he attended in the meeting in Felton California. No matter how much he's done the presiding overseer hated him very well. So he has to demonize the speaker and talk bad about higher education. He would emphasize that topic and that's what he always report to the circuit overseers, so that when the governing body heard it, they would also emphasize that in the Watch Tower study articles. I had tried to comment one time in the Watch Tower when the study article is about focusing in the kingdom ministry, instead of attending secular schools or pursuing higher education. The Watch Tower cited an example of Noah's days, that Jehovah instructed Noah to focus in spiritual matter. So, I commented that during Noah's days, Jehovah taught Noah how to build a humongous ark to save Noah's entire family and all the animals because destruction was on the way. Teaching to build that humongous ark is a material thing it is not about spiritual thing. Jehovah was teaching Noah engineering thing, so that they would be saved from the destruction. That was the main focus when destruction was coming. Now, we are always taught in the Watch Tower that destruction or Armageddon is now on the way, and also they always said that only baptized Jehovah's witnesses will be saved during the destruction and no other people from different religion. They always discourage Jehovah's witnesses members to learn skills or going into higher education. Now can you see a logic here? Jehovah's witnesses depend too much with the other people or other religions for living. I mean, who build the cars that they use? Do you know one Jehovah's witness know how to build a car? I haven't heard one. Who build the airplanes that they use when they travel to different places to attend international conventions? Do you think Jehovah's witnesses will survive in Armageddon? What are they thinking? They want Jehovah to perform miracle for them, like providing a giant bird if they want a ride? We are always taught that we don't have to think or talk about what is not mentioned in the Bible, but of course we would understand what would happen even if it is not written in the Bible if we use our discernment. When for example a statement would say a boy tossed the ball up in the sky. We know what would happen to the ball after he tossed the ball. 'what goes up must come down.' It's no brainer. Education is not always all about money. Jehovah doesn't want his people to grow ignorant, instead he wanted them to be highly educated.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.249.119.106 (talk) 20:57, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: if your still alive this is something that I look into.currently I'm disfellowed.the biggest problem is people who know the real truth and lie for what ever reason they are evil.im not saying Jehovah witnesses are liars I'm saying in the congregation there are evil people.also imperfection exist like you mentioned avobe.example here in wiki their suppose to be no biased opinion.the page wouldn't work if they had it.giving up is not the solution.im going back because it's the solution for humanitys problems no doubt. 104.173.37.138 (talk) 00:28, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jehovah's Witnesses What's Wrong? 

message: I think this is another in a string or articles created to puff up people and organizations in the anti-cult movement that are otherwise not notable.  See the "Opposition to New Religious Movements" template. Elmmapleoakpine (talk) 23:14, 24 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable?