Talk:Fluid and crystallized intelligence

message: needs work
This article is one of the worst I've ever seen on Wikipedia--it's garbled, poorly written, blatantly sexist, and doesn't rely on the state of academic knowledge on the topic. When I read it, I was actually surprised--even by the standards of Wikipedia, this is shocking. It reads like it was written in the middle of the night by somebody on drugs who imagined that they were writing something "scientific." I am going to suggest that the article be removed. Editing wouldn't help, because the fundamental basis of the article is too incoherent. Fluid intelligence is an interesting concept, but this article doesn't really address it in a very sophisticated or useful way.   — Preceding unsigned comment added by KopeckyMaxime (talk • contribs) 23:17, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Earliest comments

message: I have posted a bibliography of   Intelligence Citations for the use of all Wikipedians who have occasion to edit articles related to human intelligence and related issues. I happen to have circulating access to a huge academic research library at a university with an active research program in issues related to this topic (and to another library that is one of the ten largest public library systems in the United States) and have been researching these issues since 1989. You are welcome to use these citations for your own research and to suggest new sources to me by comments on that page. -- WeijiBaikeBianji (talk) 17:35, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intelligence Citations Bibliography for Articles Related to IQ Testing 

message: Journal of Intelligence — Open Access Journal is a new, open-access, "peer-reviewed scientific journal that publishes original empirical and theoretical articles, state-of-the-art articles and critical reviews, case studies, original short notes,  commentaries" intended to be "an open access journal that moves forward the study of human intelligence: the basis and development of intelligence, its nature in terms of structure and processes, and its correlates and consequences, also including the measurement and modeling of intelligence." The content of the first issue is posted, and includes interesting review articles, one by Earl Hunt and Susanne M. Jaeggi and one by Wendy Johnson. The editorial board of this new journal should be able to draw in a steady stream of good article submissions. It looks like the journal aims to continue to publish review articles of the kind that would meet  Wikipedia guidelines for articles on medical topics, an appropriate source guideline to apply to Wikipedia articles about intelligence. -- WeijiBaikeBianji (talk, how I edit) 21:12, 5 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The Journal of Intelligence — Open Access Journal website has just been updated with the new articles for the latest edition of the journal, by eminent scholars on human intelligence. -- WeijiBaikeBianji (talk, how I edit) 21:33, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Journal of Intelligence — Open Access Journal 

message: What is meant by "John L. Horn, the primary student of Raymond Cattell." The bio of Cattell says he was provided with 2 postdocs and several graduate research assistants at U of Illinois in 1945 and retired circa 1973, so if he maintained a 6 person lab he might have had dozens of such research workers, as well as countless students in classes and advisees. What would make Horn his primary student? A reliable source is needed or the word "primary" should be removed. Edison (talk) 21:18, 14 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Horn, the"primary student" of Cattell

message: From the introduction:
"The terms are somewhat misleading because one is not a "crystallized" form of the other. Rather, they are believed to be separate neural and mental systems."
But then right after:
"It is the product of educational and cultural experience in interaction with fluid intelligence. Fluid and crystallized intelligence are thus correlated with each other."
This looks contradictory to me, and is very confusing. Perhaps it makes sense technically, but this is in the introduction to the article. The second quote makes perfect sense to me and fits well with the rest of the text, but the first quote seems really out of place. (Since crystallized intelligence clearly seems to stem largely from fluid intelligence, why emphasize that they are separate systems?) --Ornilnas (talk) 00:07, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Crystallized form of fluid intelligence? 

message: In order to understand the definition of the topic at hand in the lead, you need to know the difference between induction and deduction, know what working memory is, and have figured out what is meant by "relational abstractions". Just linking these concepts to their pages isn't enough, they should be either adequately explained in the lead itself, or rewritten in such a way as to avoid them.--Megaman en m (talk) 09:54, 23 August 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lead too complex 

message: Can anyone else confirm that the section "Fluid versus crystallized" makes no sense? I can't see what the first paragraph, which seems to be talking about something related to physics, has to do with intelligence at all. This whole section seems to rely purely on primary sources as well. There are also notable cases of what seems to be original research synthesized from primary sources. 
A prime example seems to be "The reason why hard scientists cannot see this obvious absurdity is in the fact that they are effeminate and thus visuospatially handicapped. Since gravitational potential energy is the energy of instantaneous spatial configuration, hard scientists are neurologically unable to understand it." The first sentence only has primary sources and contains original (unencyclopedic) statements like "visuospatially handicapped". The second sentence in this example... I can't even begin to understand what it's trying to say. This is by far not the only sentence like this.
Can anyone else skim through this section and tell me what they think? Because I can't make heads or tails of it.--Megaman en m (talk) 14:44, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fluid versus crystallized section is a mess 

message: I read a paper by John Horn more than 35 years ago. The paper contains an illustrative example of fluid and crystallized approaches to problem solving. I no longer have the  paper in my personal archive (or can't find it in the welter of papers in my house) and, for the sake of accuracy, I don't want to recapitulate the example from memory. I am familiar enough with the paper because I cited it in my doctoral dissertation. I ordered a copy of the paper from my university's inter-library loan service. When I get the paper, I will use the example Horn provided to help explain the fluid and crystallized approaches. Iss246 (talk) 00:01, 16 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: You raise a larger, more important issue, namely, the validity of the theory itself. Two preeminent critics of gf-gc theory to reference are Lloyd Humphreys and Robert Sternberg. I recommend referencing them in a section devoted to criticism of the theory. Iss246 (talk) 01:18, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Example of fluid and crystallized approaches to problem solving 

message: — Assignment last updated by Mtaz0801 (talk) 19:24, 29 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title: Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development winter 2024

message: This, {\displaystyle x+1/2*(100-x)*2} is the number of shoes worn, has the + and * swapped at the beginning. If x is the one-legged people, it's reasonable to believe x * 1/2 is the number of shoes worn, not x + 1/2. 
The answer isn't 100 either. Let's say 50 people have one leg. That's 25 shoes. Half of the remainder wear two shoes, that 50 shoes. The total is 75. Let's say you have all one-legged patients, that's 50 shoes. 96.231.246.62 (talk) 09:26, 12 April 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: The shoe example comes directly from Horn's article in the journal Trans-Action. I am going to change the citation. I don't remember if it was in the book by the same name. Iss246 (talk) 04:38, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  shoe equation is wrong