Talk:List of Hewitts and Nuttalls in England

message: It would be nice if, in the intro paragraph, the number of Hewitts, Nuttalls, and Marilyns was shown (i.e., "There are a total of X Hewitts and Y Nuttalls, with Z of them additionally classified as Marilyns."). howcheng  {chat} 16:44, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Added. The numbers I have written there are based solely on the numbers of rows of different colours in the tables, so if anyone makes any changes to the tables (adding or removing peaks, or changing their status), they will have to update the counts accordingly. --Stemonitis 16:56, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm.  In that case, I think we have an error.  The Nuttalls' book list 251, and there are the two new ones (Honister Crag & Birks Fell).  The TAC Hewitt booklet lists 178 to which Birks Fell should be added.  So we seem to have gained a Nuttall and a Hewitt.  Or more likely, two hills listed twice.  I can't immediately find them… — ras52 08:58, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Black Mountain? --Stemonitis 09:05, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Did you include the Black Mountain in your count?  It's not in the tables here, just noted in Note 3.  Also Viewing Hill was listed twice.  — ras52 09:10, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

text: It is in the tables here. I found Viewing Hill as well, but removed the other one of the pair; it should be fixed now. --Stemonitis 09:13, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

text: So, is 254, counting Black Mountain (and there's no good reason why one wouldn't one count it), the right number? Shall I change the DYK entry to 254 / 179? --Stemonitis 09:15, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, I hadn't noticed the BM had been added.  Sorry about that.  The Nuttall's 251+2 does not include the BM, so 254 is accurate; the 178+1 Hewitts does include the BM, so that is now correct too. If you could change the DYK entry, that would be good. — ras52 09:19, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

text: Done. --Stemonitis 09:36, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Counts 

message: Why are exact prominences given for so many tops? A lot of these must be estimates, where there is no spot height at the col.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.194.163.143 (talk) 11:59, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Prominence 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: See the Nuttalls' own website: http://www.nuttalls.com/mountains/2000.htm - Calf Top, Tinside Rigg and Long Fell are missing (but Miller Moss has just been added - see this). PamD 16:29, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: https://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2016/11/17/hill-sleuths-celebrate-birthday-with-news-of-three-new-hill-classifications has the grid refs and heights for Tinside Rigg and Long Fell. PamD 16:54, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Updates needed 

message: Two new articles have been created, List of Hewitt mountains in England, Wales and Ireland, List of Nuttall mountains in England and Wales, which are October 2018 downloads of the Database of British and Irish Hills (DoBIH) for Hewitts and Nuttalls.  
These articles also have linking to individual Wikipedia articles (including Grid Ref linking).  They have the DoBIH parent peak for Nuttalls (as per other new Wikipedia articles on Munro Tops and Donald Tops), and linked to their individual peak Wikipedia articles.  In addition, they have the full classification listings for each individual peak (e.g. whether it is a Birkett etc.).  The Nuttall article also has a DoBIH column called "Area (Nuttalls)" which is the DoBIH estimate of the most appropriate area title that is reflective of the structure used in the Nuttalls book (while respecting some specific issues with their structuring).  The new articles were downloaded automatically and required no manual intervention (except to select columns and fix some links), so OR issues are minimal.
In contrast, this article has data which is old (many height and prominences have changed), is un-sourced (e.g. a BBC researcher could not quote this data), and has a break-up of peaks into Sections which makes it hard to update the tables by download (Nuttalls and Hewitts, given their low prominence, are more prone to changes).  This article also contains "parent" peak data for every Nuttall and Hewitt which is not appropriate.  The DoBIH only record "parent peaks" for peaks which are not in themselves parents (e.g. parents do not have parents), or which are not so isolated that a parent title is not meaningful.  We should go with the DoBIH approach, who are experts in this area (e.g. parent peaks are core to prominence calculations) and avoid the approach taken in this article, which I think is confusing.
However, time and effort have gone into making this article, so I did not want to REDIRECT myself without checking first. Britishfinance (talk) 13:37, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Have also updated the new Nuttalls page to rank by prominence so a reader can see how many Nuttalls are Hewitts and Marilyns and P600s etc. Britishfinance (talk) 11:08, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Propose to re-direct page