Talk:Halaib Triangle

message: Context: Many months ago, I proposed that this article be moved from Hala'ib Triangle to Halayib Triangle. The move was made. That move was reversed within the last twelve hours for reasons that can be found in the discussion above. In reversing that change, all (I think?) occurrences of ‹Halayib› in the article were changed to ‹Hala'ib›. I then changed back only those occurrences which were explicitly transliterations of the Arabic word, rather than uses of an English name. I also changed one occurrence of حلائب to حلايب. The former was added by an editor who was unfamiliar with the Arabic word based on the English name given in this article. I had hoped that these changes would be uncontroversial as they are—I think—matters of fairly straightforward fact. Beyond My Ken reversed those changes. In order to avoid edit warring, I'm explaining my changes here. I won't revert the reversions quickly in case my perception of uncontroversiality is amiss.
Both the Eyptian and Sudanese governments consistently use the spelling حلايب in their materials, with only one Egyptian exception that I was able to find many months ago; that page has since disappeared. For anyone who knows Arabic, I do not think that it is controversial that the Arabic name is حلايب. There is copious evidence on-line, including on our sister Arabic Wikipedia. (The word حلائب does occur in Arabic, so you'll get Google hits, but it does not refer to the city or the Triangle.) If we are transliterating Arabic, the appropriate MOS Romanisation is Ḥalāyib. It is not Ḥalā'ib. I think that this should also be uncontroversial: It is not different from saying that the Pinyin for the Mandarin name of China is "Zhōngguó", not "Qaina" or "China", even tho for obvious reasons we choose to call the page China rather than *Zhongguo.
I understand the desire for consistency within the article. However, I believe that a form of consistency which demands that the representation of the original language (whether in Arabic script or in Romanisation) match the chosen English name is backwards, & in this case leads to multiple inaccuracies.
I would like to:
# remove the two places where this page asserts that the Arabic name is حلائب, as that's simply false;
# employ the Romanisation Ḥalāyib when transliterating Arabic (but nowhere else until we have a decision on moving or not moving), as, again, I think that's false; and
# restore the Romanisation of Egyptian Arabic from "Mosallas Ḥalāyeb" back to "Musallas Ḥalāyib", as the other transliteration is inconsistent & not in keeping with either the MOS or any scholarly materials that I'm aware of. Pathawi (talk) 07:08, 11 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: *OK by me. Beyond My Ken (talk) 07:31, 11 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: The Name in Arabic is حلايب

message: HALAYEB
Halayeb - understand, it is Halayeb when it is spoken in Arabic not Halayib ; the difference is in how the Arabic letter ي is pronounced. Do you understand ? Dear USER: I am asking kindly that you do not revert my change of Halayeb to any another name, I do accept that you deleted my unproven section about the rebels that are still secret till today and only few people know about this matter and I am one of them who can speak freely because I live in USA and another person who is my link to the people living in Halayeb triangle. Do you think, rebels can proclaim themselves in Egypt with the dictatorship there and ask for a referendum, a free referendum, in Halayeb triangle, without being caught and imprisoned and then executed without a trial ?
If you find another user who understand Arabic better than me and surely you will find an English language better than me, then, I am ready to accept the change of name: must be better than me in both Arabic and English. If you are targeting me as you did in the past, I am ready to fight till I get blocked from Wikipedia and then, I will continue to edit as an anonymous. So let us ask people about which is exact : Halayeb or Halayib with the above condition : better Arabic and English than me.
And for your knowledge : there are signs that can be found above or below an Arabic letter and those change how the letter is pronounced. So the name in Arabic is حلايب - ح - ل - ا - ي - ب ح = h ل = l ا = a ي = i or y ( which are very similar in pronunciation, just read Andi and Andy) while the ي in Arabic here is pronounced just like ye ب = b So according to the rules used by some people who do not understand Arabic - why there is an extra (a) between the (h) and (l) in the English word ?
I will revert your edit and I will fight for the correct name as it is pronounced in Arabic, just for one cause : I am from Halayeb triangle. And why the name remained almost the last decade and more as Halayeb ? If you want to fight after all this facts and proofs, I am ready. I can be reached at +1 2622275793 and abdelhamidelsayed@hotmail.com Best regards, Abd Elhamid Elsayed Abdelhamidelsayed (talk) 01:41, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Once again, you're not understanding.  Please read WP:COMMONNAME.  The name of the place IN ENGLISH is what matters, not what the locals call it in Arabic.You've been trying to make this change for 10 YEARS.  It's time to stop before you get blocked. Beyond My Ken (talk) 02:41, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Halayeb, it is pronounced Halayeb from a capable Arabic language native, very good English language ( living in USA from 1998, so I speak English very good). It is not Halayib, understand. 

message: This isn't published anywhere I know of, so inappropriate for the article. I do research on Bidhaawyeet (the Beja language). According to Bishaari people I've talked with, the original name in Bidhaawyeet is Awliib or Aylaab (depending on dialect), referring to a particular kind of grass used for grazing livestock which the area is famous for. I haven't been able to identify a botanical name for the grass variety, & don't have any further information on it. A similar name appears in EM Roper's 1928 handbook of Bidhaawyeet, but referring to the land west of the Red Sea Hills. Arabic Ḥalāyib is taken to be a distortion of the Bidhaawyeet name. In contemporary Bidhaawyeet, people refer to the place as Halaayib, which is from the Arabic Ḥalāyib. Pathawi (talk) 08:56, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Just found a passage in a book in Bidhaawyeet which identifies the grass as ooliib with the definition: 'the grass goats like best; it is said to cure diseases'. No reference to the region, tho. Pathawi (talk) 09:00, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: Bidhaawyeet Name: Original Research