Talk:Grand Slam (professional wrestling)

message: Would this be evidence that WWE has established a Women's Grand Slam (Raw, SD, NXT, Women's Tag)?
Just askin'.
Vjmlhds (talk) 05:04, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: During the Survivor Series 2017 pre-show Charlotte called herself a Grand Slam champion (Raw, SD, NXT and Diva). That was not included, but this being written and published on their twitter is slightly better. It definitely meets the first 4 criteria in WP:TWITTER, but if it is the sole basis for inclusion, so I would think #5 would come into play. Its not an article, but its the sole basis for the entire sections inclusion. #5 is moot however because we have WP:SECONDARY sources mentioning it too     - Galatz גאליץשיחה Talk 13:24, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:  So if this is good to go, then someone (who is much better at making a chart than I am) can make a section/chart to acknowledge Bayley.  Also, if she's a Slam winner, then the Triple Crown stuff is a moot point an not worth fussing over. Vjmlhds (talk) 13:49, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Done, but someone else feel free to edit any of the color changes I made to make room for adding NXT (thought the gold and yellow were too close), or other format changes. - Galatz גאליץשיחה Talk 14:11, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

text: Firstly being an IP editor or registered user makes no difference. Second as to your points, Wikipedia is built based on WP:RS abd WP:SECONDARY sources are extremely important. I have provided three sources here that are unrelated to the WWE which state this is a grand slam, in addition to the WWE tweet. The WWE twitter account holds more weight than what Cathy Kelly states back stage, I am not sure what press release you are referring to, because as far as I am aware a backstage comment is not a press release. I provided a link to Charlotte claiming Diva, Raw and SmackDown makes a triple crown, but we have nothing other than that stating it. The Triple Crown and Grand Slam must be achieved independently, its not a one than another. - Galatz גאליץשיחה Talk 16:44, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

text: Oh and as for the term Tertiary being used, it is open to other suggestions. One of the definitions from webster is , being as NXT is the WWE equivalent of "higher education" I felt it was appropriate, but we could always just make it 3 singles and tag. Its always wikipedia policy to wait to add things, its better to be missing something than risk having something wrong included. - Galatz גאליץשיחה Talk 16:54, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

text: WWE often has these videos which aren't really in the WWE Universe (the odd aspect of professional wrestling where its the fine line between a sport or a TV show). The example I gave about Charlotte and the women saying they are in the Royal Rumble last year, all appears in their videos but did not apply to the reality of their shows. (I am using these two since both involved previous discussions on WP.) Due to this their backstage WWE.com videos fail under WP:VIDEOREF. Sportskeeda is unfortunately not a RS under WP:PW/RS. I have looked and cannot find anything other than them (which the MSN link is) to mention it. If you have something from a RS that discusses it, that is very different. - Galatz גאליץשיחה Talk 17:07, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

text: Well, JDC is right. No source includes the NXT titles as part of the grand slam. I made a quick research in WWE.com  but the text says " the victory also made Bayley the first Superstar to ever hold the Raw Women’s Championship, the SmackDown Women’s Championship and the WWE Women’s Tag Team Championship — the Women’s Grand Slam, if you will." Wrestlers always make  claims during their promos, but it's necessary being recognized by the promotion.  --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 14:58, 4 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:  You're right that it doesn't make sense, but that's what WWE's sources say. WWE have confirmed that both the Triple Crown and Grand Slam are those three titles, but have not included any other in their recognition for the Grand Slam. We may actually be wrong in saying the women's Grand Slam is an actual accomplishment (all we have to go on are a Tweet from WWE that says Bayley is a Grand Slam winner but fails to acknowledge which titles, and the WWE.com source that I provided and  quoted where it says "the Women's Grand Slam, if you will"). The thing is though, and  seems to not understand this, it's not for us to decide that the NXT Women's Championship is included in the Grand Slam when the WWE themselves have yet to acknowledge or confirm its inclusion. --JDC808 ♫ 01:25, 5 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: So are we basically making the decision for WWE and including the NXT title, or what? --JDC808 ♫ 00:33, 13 June 2019 (UTC)

text: I heard my name being called, so I'll chime in - I added a story in the Calgary Sun newspaper written by Natalya Neidhart where she specifically lists the Raw, SD, NXT, and Women's Tag Team Titles as being the components of the Grand Slam as a reference.  So this isn't a "twitter rant" or original research.  The Calgary Sun had hometown girl Nattie serve as a special correspondent to write about the MITB event.  That's as good a source as any. Vjmlhds (talk) 01:49, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: That just sounds like a similar case to Charlotte Flair saying such and such titles made her a Triple Crown and Grand Slam champion, which WWE did not recognize, and thus far, they haven't recognized Natalya's claim either. That's the issue. We need an actual WWE source confirming the titles, not just a wrestler saying it. The one that we do have does not include the NXT title. --JDC808 ♫ 07:56, 23 June 2019 (UTC)

text: As I don't have this saved in my watchlist, I kind of forgot about this discussion, but are we ever gonna come to some kind of consensus on this issue? There's still no official recognition from WWE that they recognize the NXT Women's Championship for the Grand Slam (if the women's Grand Slam is an actual accomplishment, yet). --JDC808 ♫ 11:20, 1 August 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, WWE Shop has just come out with a Bayley "Grand Slam Champion" T-Shirt where all 4 titles are shown (as well as the MITB case). Vjmlhds (talk) 22:18, 2 August 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I can concede to that. --JDC808 ♫ 09:12, 3 August 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: So, are we now arguing the MITB is part of the Grand Slam? I think that's just a shirt with everything Bayley has accomplished in addition to the Grand Slam label they designated in this article:  They've only offhand referred to the accomplishment as a Grand Slam, and have meanwhile made two official statements with custom pictures (for Bayley and Alexa) calling the same achievement a triple crown. Tldr; I think its two different names for the same accomplishment... and so does WWE. MARIOFan78 02:38, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bayley - Women's Grand Slam 

message: For the WWE (modern) and TNA Grand Slam listings, is there a better way to list the dates of the 2nd Grand Slam? For example, maybe list the dates and reigns that compose of the second reign as Grand Slam? retched (talk) 19:43, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Multiple Grand Slams? 

message: Bret Hart is a Grand Slam Champion too. He won the WWE Title, the tag titles, the IC title and the US title. 89.204.130.246 (talk) 09:24, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: So WWE does not recognize WCW-owned reigns of the championships when counting for the WWE Grand Slam Championship. However, the argument does make sense as the lineages for both titles DO line up. (WWE recognizes the US title as starting back in the NWA era through the end of the WCW/Turner era.) Nonetheless, WWE didn't update their original list (nor the revised list) to include any WCW title reign which is what matters most. retched (talk) 13:43, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bret Hart 

message: Why isn't there a WCW section? 2600:387:C:6A14:0:0:0:2 (talk) 18:10, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Because WCW never defined a Grand Slam criteria before they went under. Sure, the idea of using  their Triple Crown (World, US, and Tag titles) with the addition of the TV title seems plausible, but a) since they never declared it as such, we cannot say it was, and b) the TV title was abandoned well before the company folded, so it's clear they didn't really care much about it themselves. But mostly a). We can't introduce something that didn't actually exist. oknazevad (talk) 23:26, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  WCW? 

message: bret hart being a grand slam champions was brought up and the reason for not adding him was that wwe doesn't count wcw US titles but bret won the wwe US title back in 2009 or so
so he's part of the new grand slam format 2607:FEA8:BF1D:7700:FCE1:6CF3:6193:3D0 (talk) 18:37, 6 September 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: No. As I stated above, Bret won the WCW United States States Championship. WWE only counts title reigns that were started during the WWE's ownership of WCW and onward as part of the Grand Slam. While the histories are the same, that qualifier makes it not a part of the WWE Grand Slam. retched (talk) 18:43, 6 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  bret won the wwe US title as well 

message: In addition to Rhea Ripley becoming the 5th female to become a grand slam champion in WWE joining Askua Sasha Banks Charlotte Flair and Bayley and doing it the fastest. Rhea Ripley is also the first wrestler in history to conquer the female titles of RAW, SmackDown, NXT and NXT UK with the exception of the NXT Womens Tag Team Championship. - 2A02:C7C:53C1:E00:6D68:BFEC:AC91:7F55 (talk) 11:51, 2 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rhea Ripley Grand Slam note 

message: I proposed that the section about WWE Grand Slam winners be split into a separate page called List of WWE Grand Slam winners because the section is too long. -St3095 (?) 04:34, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think it's too long per se. The question is, I suppose, if you remove the WWE Grand Slam stuff, is the other Grand Slams notable on their own? Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 08:32, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Oppose Article is about wrestling Grand Slams.  If you take out WWE, then it would open up Pandora's Box for people to want the other Slams to have their own page. Let sleeping dogs lie. Vjmlhds (talk) 02:45, 13 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Split proposal