Talk:Empire of Kitara

message: This article is a collection of assertions, none of which have foundation whatsoever.
The Bantu peoples of East Africa all have detailed oral histories of their nations going back several hundred years.  These oral histories were written down in the 1890s. The oral histories all mention a people called the Bachwezi as having ruled the area long ago, and having "gone away".  There is absolutely nothing else in the oral tradition about the Bachwezi.  The statement about their having ruled a particular large area is pure speculation.
The claim that the Babito rulers who established the modern kingdoms were Luos from the Sudan is unsupported by any evidence.  The  traditional history states that the Babito rulers came from the North.  The Babito rulers set up hierachial central governments with a cattle owning ruling class, features not present in any Luo society.  In Ankole and Rwanda the members traditional ruling class have discernible physical features which suggest a Hamitic rather than Nilotic origin.  (Physical anthropometric studies are detailed in "The Uganda Protectorate" by Johnston
The Bigo bya Mugenyi site has not been studied in detail; the claim that it was the capital of the empire is preposterous.
The lack of any detailed knowledge about the Bachwezi has puzzled scholars, considering the fact that oral histories were so detailed.  One scholar, Dr M.B Nsimbi of Uganda, noted the existence of many names whose etymology is unknown. This is odd because most Luganda names have a known origin, such as a proverb.  He speculated that they were remnants of a culture whose history was ruthlessly effaced, perhaps that of the Bachwezi.
The third reference cited by the article (Doyle) states that the claims about the Bachwezi are viewed with skepticism by historians.Kigongos (talk) 23:19, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I respectfully disagree. There is enough in the oral tales of these people to warrant it to be taken seriously. If tales of Vikings and Normans can be taken seriously, so should be tales of Babito. Ezeu (talk) 23:15, 26 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: This article is a collection of assertions

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message: this is subpar and not wikipedia-standard writing or information whatsoever, can most of the recent edits be reverted? 73.217.107.48 (talk) 01:16, 1 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: @73.217.107.48 I definitely agree. KiwiNova (talk) 02:26, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

text: There's not really any version I can find going back several years that can be salvaged. Its a mess, in various different forms, for much of the page's history. I'd be more inclined to flag the page for deletion or basically start over, writing it only with reliable stories and emphasising that Kitara is a legendary state and not a fully documented historical one. Maswimelleu (talk) 19:43, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  this page is a mess