Talk:Glossary of ballet

message: I've seen 'turn-out' mentioned a lot, but there's no entry for it here, at least not in terms of dance.  Is it synonymous with technique?  Can someone who knows please explain with a new entry.
:Please. I was about to ask the same question. --Hhielscher 01:21, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Turn-out 

message: I think that the arm positions described here are not the ones used at the Bolshoi (which follows the Vaganova method). Anybody else on this? If I do not get any comments I will proceed and correct it. They seem to be the arm positions in the Cecchetti syllabus, or maybe French school. Gioland71 01:18, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ballet arm positions are wrongly named 

message: I found the existing article very helpful when checking the spelling of ballet terms I never learned to write.  This would be more helpful if it included as many terms as possible.  I have only studied in a school claiming to teach "American" style - supposedly a mix of all styles - but the terms I have been looking for the spelling of: 
saut de chat {pronounced "sō-də-shǎ" (a leap similar to grand jeté but beginning with a developpé)}
tembé {pronounced "tǒm-bě" meaning "to fall" (often happens before a pas de bourrèe)}
enveloppé {pronounced "on-VEL-o-pĕ"(a developpé in reverse)}
en closhe {pronounced "on-clōsh" or "on-clǒsh" (a degagé that brushes back and forth through first position)}
Being from an "American" school, will the terms I have learned for steps benefit this article?
Liquid06 03:17, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  On Terminology 

message: --CopyToWiktionaryBot 14:21, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  2007-02-1 Automated pywikipediabot message 

message: someone put the following in the part about the five possitions:
All of these photos of the positions of the feet with pointe shoes are extreme examples of the student rolling in and not "holding her arches up" and standing with the proper weight distribution on her feet.  (Let's find photos with better technique)
Now while this in un encyclopedic in its phrasing (especialy the last part) I felt maybe there could be a point of mentoning it in dicussion 71.131.42.85 09:06, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Foot Positions

message: Why are the positions of the arms mentioned in the entry of the positions of the feet? I find this quite confusing - for an non-expert, it might sound like they are always used together! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gioland71 (talk • contribs) 02:36, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Foot Positions - or arms?

message: Note: in the example, while the dancer turns , ideally the leg should be at 90 degrees from the waist, no lower or higher
Vaganova describes the turn at 45 degrees (fouetté en tournant at 45 degrees). Gail Grant describes it at 90 degrees (fouetté rond de jambe en tournant). 
I cannot really say if the 45 degree one is still performed at all - and the image is too quick for me to say if there is anything wrong with it, but stating that a 45 degrees turn is never acceptable might be misleading. Gioland71 02:55, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fouetté

message: ok first: grande has an 'e'at the end so please if you spot a grande without the 'e' put it in there. and second, isnt a grande pas de chat kind of like a....something else which i cant spell for crap. it sounds like (sew te je) i'm a dancing vampirate!! (talk) 19:02, 14 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  grande (pas de chat) 

message: It is customary to italicize words from a foreign language which have not become naturalized, but in the case of ballet almost all of the French words have become native to English; this is to say, there is no other word for them in English. Might we dispense with italics? Robert Greer (talk) 14:47, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I added the italics to emphasis the term being defined. In any articles that use these terms, I also use italics.
--Mrlopez2681 (talk) 17:41, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  italics 

message: Why not giving the IPA version of the names instead of the english mock-up? --Cantalamessa (talk) 22:18, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Because it is too much effort? I do not personally know anything about IPA. Gioland71 (talk) 01:30, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The pronunciation section (see below) probably answers your question - is it the French pronunciation we should report (IPA) or the anglicized version? My teacher in Montreal was fluent in French although with a wonderful Russian accent, but here in Toronto my teacher can't pronounce correct French at all (he's from the US), and really sounds like those mock-ups people are giving here... Just terrible for people who can speak French, but this is the English wiki, so... Any other comments on this topic? Gioland71 (talk) 13:27, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I would vouch for giving the french IPA - I think we should remain true to the actual source words. It is of note that most of these words have not been absorbed into common english usage (although "pirouette", "pointe", and a few others have been), so they should therefore be treated as foreign words, and given those pronunciations first. However, as the anglicized pronunciations have become so prevalent, esp in the US, it probably wouldn't do any harm to give those prons as well - just as we do for many foreign names such as "Paris". (I'm a bit late to the discussion, but it's important.)–The Fiddly Leprechaun · Catch Me! 20:44, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  IPA

message: I don't travel in Ballet circles, but any that does- Is the pronunciation guide for Retiré (reh teh ray), correct?  
I ask because if I recall my french correctly, the ir would rhyme with pier.  Certainly- practice rules, so if it has become bastardized into (reh teh ray) in the english speaking ballet world, far be it for me to intrude.  Mak (talk) 17:01, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: My "petit robert" says it should be pronounced  Gioland71 (talk) 13:40, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  Right.  That's how I'd pronounce it- I'm not sure the guidance the article gives is incorrect because I asked my daughter's teacher who is an accomplished ballerina and she said she had always pronounced it the way the article describes.  She was aware of the other pronunciation but she recalled it used by people from Europe- everywhere from the US she hears it the way she pronounces it.  Given that, I'm not doing anything to the article, since I am deferential to usage.  It's a shame, because the french sounds so much better, but there you are.  As for this proposal concerning IPA- it forces more fidelity, but realistically, it is not even that great for European languages.  Even IPA doesn't give a unique symbol for the french gargled r.  There's either the spanish trilled r, or the american r (upside down in IPA), and neither is anything close to the french r.  Which is odd, because as I understand a Frenchman was one of the authors of IPA.  I bow out of this matter. Regards- Mak (talk) 01:01, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The IPA symbol for the french r is 'ʁ' - see WP:IPA for French. Although I too have seen the 'ʀ' used in a number of dictionaries. –The Fiddly Leprechaun · Catch Me! 20:35, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

text: I've always heard 'reh-tee-ray'. Mazz0626 (talk) 18:12, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Would any of you be fine if your child learnt English pronunciation from, dunno, a Russian native speaker whose second language is English? I don't think so. You have heard 'reh-tee-ray', but it is pronounced  128.100.227.81 (talk) 20:58, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pronunciation 

message: I have removed the following statement - 
"A very well-known coda is from "Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy", from the Nutcracker suite, in which the dancer traditionally performs numerous quick pique en tournents in rapid succession around the expanse of the stage"
There are several problems with this statement. First, stating that "the dancer traditionally performs numerous quick pique en tournents in rapid succession around the expanse of the stage" is only referring to a particular version of this number. I have seen several productions of The Nutcracker where such steps are not performed during the final passage of this solo. 
This number has been titled "Dance of the Sugerplum Fairy" over time, in the original program it is referred to in the proper balletic-french as Variation dansée de la fée Dragée.
All of this aside, however, the final passage of the so-called "Dance of the Sugerplum Fairy"  is certainly NOT a coda as it is referred to in ballet. One should read the definition of coda.
A coda in music and a coda in ballet are two different things. Although a music score might call the final passage of the "Dance of the Sugerplum Fairy" a coda, it is certainly NOT a coda in the art of ballet.
As is stated in the definition, a coda is a piece of music which brings the suite of dances known as the Grand pas, Grand pas de deux, Grand pas d'action, etc. to a close.
--Mrlopez2681 (talk) 17:39, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit to the section of a balletic "Coda" 

message: * According to the FATD syllabus battement means 'beat'
Thanks Gioland71 (talk) 00:39, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pls explain FATD 

message: There should surely be mention of écarté/écartée in the article. I don't have the time to add it myself currently, but I thought I would bring it to everyone's attention. Signing off, –The Fiddly Leprechaun · Catch Me! 20:59, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Écarté 

message: For those of us who don't speak French or whatever, indication of pronunciation would be of great help. This glossary is not terribly complete (though pretty good). I wish this had been taken more seriously. The article has the look of being thrown together. Gingermint (talk) 00:37, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pronunciation  

message: The recently edited definitions of Ballerina, Danseur and Ballerino has changed the definition from a word to call a ballet dancer based on their gender to a title that only internationally famed ballet dancers acquire. I would just like to confirm, is this correct? I've always thought and told that those words are words used to call everyday ballet dancers, and the prestigious title instead would be say "Prima ballerina assoluta" or "Danseur noble" for those internationally famous. Thanks, Y.sundaravej (talk) 12:32, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ballerina/  Prima ballerina assoluta 

message: Okay, not to be anymore annoying but, from time to time, people have added "definitions" to things that aren't ballet terms, ie, definition of Modern Dance to Famous Ballerinas. Could we please keep these to relevant terms of ballet please? Thanks Y.sundaravej (talk) 12:38, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Keeping the definitions to glossary of ballet terms only 

message: In a previous edit of the section Coda, such things as "Coda générale" or "Grand coda" were changed to "générale coda" or "Coda grande". Although the changes may be grammatically proper, it has never been done this way in ballet. As a historian, I have seen several programs, etc. from the ballets of Imperial Russia and 19th century Paris. If the term "coda" includes "générale" or "Grand" it is always presented as "Grand coda" or "Coda générale". --Mrlopez2681 (talk) 15:18, 20 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  edit to the balletic term  "coda" 

message: The danseur noble section is off-the-mark. The designation has as much to do— if not more — with the sort of dancer the danseur is — the sort of rôles he might dance — than his distinction within the world of dance, there being highly distinguished dancers who nonetheless would never be thought of as danseurs nobles. — Robert Greer (talk) 13:35, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Danseur noble 

message: ? 2001:56A:F414:D300:FDD0:34D0:A51F:14E9 (talk) 23:23, 9 March 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Pas allé