Talk:Alstom Traxx

message: This page is quite german-centric...
From the group were derived two italian locomotives (E.464 and E.412, respectively TRAXX 160 DCP and TRAXX 112E) and a third group for Poland, EU43 (TRAXX112E), 8 vehicles that were never acquired by PKP and then sold to Rail Traction Company. 
The project in its initial phase involved Ferrovie dello Stato, not only DB, since an agreement was signed to provide a new group (the 464) to replace the old E.646 regional locomotives. A prototype of the E.454 group, developed for the purpose by FS itself but inadequate because too powerful and expensive, was offered in 1994 by FS to the ADTranz Consortium to serve as base for the TRAXX family.
Following this, E464 was one of the first groups delivered, back in 1996. It is the biggest group derived by the TRAXX family with over 580 locomotives running up to now. (look at http://www.leferrovie.net/loco/e464.php it you need a source) --Jollyroger 07:58, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Moreover, lenght, weight and powers vary considerably among the group, ranging from 15.750 mm and 19.400 mm for the body lenght, 70 to 90 tons for weight and 3500-5600 kW for power. --Jollyroger 08:14, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with you Jollyroger.Furthermore this page should contain 2 sections : one for the electric versions and one for the diesel variants which were introduced last year.I will try do to do this, but any commens are welcome ! --Btrs 20:44, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Actually, the E464 was made a member of the TRAXX family recto-actively when the TRAXX brand name was introduced in 2003, but this idiocy was dropped in 2007. I now put this into the article with sources. Also, the E464 wasn't delivered in 1996, it was only ordered back then; first delivery was in 1999. --Rontombontom (talk) 17:22, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

text: I further note that not much (if anything) of the E454 survived in the E412 and E464 and nothing in the actual TRAXXes (post-2007 designation). The E454 had two-phase fixed frequency choppers and DC motors, the E412 and E464 has GTO-based converters and AC motors. The drives and gear ratios are different, too. The E454 had 2800 mm wheelbase bogies, the E412 and E464 have ones with the same 2650 mm wheelbase as the ABB Flexicoil bogie tested in the DB 120 004 and resulting in the DB Class 101 bogie (the TRAXX freight versions have the same wheelbase but a different bogie frame). The carbodies are different, too, and not just in length. --Rontombontom (talk) 11:44, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: (German-centric, Italian lineage)

message: A few possible errors here - will attempt to mend myself if I can. In the meantime I have left 'tags'  on the problem bits.Carrolljon (talk) 00:19, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: [[TRAXX#The_electric_versions]]

message: The article is too DB centric.
There is no mention of 'AC 140' / '140AC' locomotives which is bombardier's own description.
Looking for SBB Re 482 turns up nothing.
It needs redoing.FengRail (talk) 17:39, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: German centric - also useless

message: Currently redoing the article - to include references + rewriteFengRail (talk) 11:57, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: 
WORK IN PROGRESS


message: According to Giancarlo Piro from UIC (UIC user producer interaction program, johanesburg 2000) the Greek railway had made an order to Bombardier (ADtranz) some diesel electric locomotives (bo-bo, 80 t.,2100kw,200 km/h) for being used in line between athens-thessaloniki which is not yet electrified and after electrification it was considered for these locomotives to be converted to electric locomotives (5000 kw).these to type locomotives have about 80% common parts as well as:
car body, cabs, bogies, traction motors, inverters, compressor, braking sys .... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ghorbanalibeik (talk • contribs) 
:Comments above moved from article to talk page. WuhWuzDat 17:55, 16 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  common platform (Comments moved from article) 

message: Removed addition that they also are made in Trapaga  - no idea if this is true or not, but only ref I have doesn't mention it. ???
Shortfatlad (talk) 02:06, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Electrical components

message: The magazine "Continental Modeller" (sister magazine of Railway Modeller) published an article in the June 2010 edition : P.374 by 'Ron Smith'
This article copied much information from the article, and did not include the relevant licensing terms, additionally the publication claims copyright on its contents.
I have sent a letter to peco publications explaining the situation. It is based upon Wikipedia:Standard_license_violation_letter#If_you_are_a_significant_contributor_to_the_text and I have reproduced it here:
Dear Continental Modeller:
I am pleased to see that your publication (June 2010 TRAXX locomotive article), uses content from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org), the free encyclopedia. This is the sort of reuse that those who contribute to Wikipedia, as I do, wish to promote.
However, you must follow the licensing terms which govern all Wikipedia text. Most of Wikipedia's content, including the text you are using, is dually licensed under the the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported License (CC-BY-SA 3.0) and the GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL) (unversioned, with no invariant sections, front-cover texts, or back-cover texts). The text of these licenses, the relevant legally binding documents, can be found at <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:CCBYSA> and <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_the_GNU_Free_Documentation_License>. Wikipedia does offer advice about how to comply with these licenses. This can be found in detail at <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Copyrights>.
First, I note that you included a link back to the source Wikipedia article as is suggested at that page. However, additionally, you should also include a CC-BY-SA notice, a GFDL notice, or both. You could, for example, add the text "This article is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported License, which means that you can copy and modify it as long as the entire work (including additions) remains under this license", and provide a link to a copy of the CC-BY-SA. Text such as "This page contains text from Wikipedia, the Free Encyclopedia" is a good way to acknowledge the general source of the text.
I was a contributor to this article, and text that I wrote appears in your magazine - in parts copied verbatim. Since it appears without specifically attributing me (and the other authors), or linking to the text of the CC-BY-SA or GFDL under which I released my contributions, the existence of this article violates my copyright, as well as those of all other contributors.
for example the text has been copied from the wikipedia article:
"In the early 1990s the Deutsche Bahn sought replacements for its electric locomotive fleet - the universal locomotives DB Class 120 had been successful.."
"The TRAXX P160 AC is the passenger version of this class, with a correspondingly higher top speed of 160 km/h, with lower unsprung mass achieved through the use of hollow shaft final drive replacing the axle hung motor arrangement in the freight version. The bogies and drive unit are the same as used in the DBAG Class 146"
"In May 2004 Bombardier introduced an improved version of the TRAXX locomotive platform as demonstrator loco 185 561. The unit was fundamentally the same as the F140AC machines, with some minor improvements - cabins now had a crumple zone.."
"At the same time as the introduction of demonstrator loco 185 561 for the F140 AC2 class another new type was introduced: this was the locomotive SBB Re484 001; the first TRAXX unit that could operate under AC and DC electrified catenaries. As well as the 15/25kV AC supplies.."
"In 2005 Angel Trains cargo placed an order for 10 DC electric locomotives with Bombardier, the first machine E483 001 was produced in August 2006 at Bombardier's plant in Kassel.."
And many other examples. In addition the tables used in your article appear to have been copied verbatim.
Please add the required acknowledgments to your publication.
Thank you.
77.86.125.207 (talk) 18:30, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Failure to observe copyright etiquette by Continental Modeller

message: I found this article to be extremely shabbily written. Apart from formatting issues, what bugged me most was the description of the emergence of the type in the Development section. Bombardier may retouche Adtranz and AEG and ABB out of the history of TRAXX in its press releases, but Wikipedia shouldn't pretend that a brand name introduced in 2003 (by a company acquiring locomotive production in 2001!) started in 1999 or even earlier; and Octeon should be mentioned. I have now re-written this section, with sources, and attempted as minimal cleanup of the type descriptions. But most of the latter sections are unsourced, the infoboxes are full of numbers and units without space between them and other bad formatting, etc. Anyone feel up to it? --Rontombontom (talk) 17:31, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Not me, as you've just insulted my previous work ;) Maybe you should start with a blank page :( Sf5xeplus (talk) 18:10, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, I didn't meant to insult your work or the work of any single editor... it was my impression, both from the article and the Talk page, that this is a typical work in progress Wikipedia article which is a massive subject, which was worked on by several editors, but none of them could 'complete' the work (not the least due to the on-going developments nature of the subject). There was even French punctuation with space in the lede (I take the result of an incomplete translation job). --Rontombontom (talk) 18:18, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: (ouch edit conflict - not really getting at you) (seriously though) Please do the mending if you can - the article has been through a couple of revisons, and has mostly improved everytime - maybe you'll be the one to get it to GA status. Good luck - we're counting on you :) Sf5xeplus (talk) 18:10, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Major re-edit -- still more work needed 

message: I was looking in commons for "adtranz" and found these images : 
and on ru:wiki :ru:Электровоз BR 185
*cross section of drive mechanism probably an essential image - licensing issues?
*pneumatics  - means nothing to me - but looks informative - licensing issues?
*machine room image (no issues?)
I don't think the drive image can be used here, which is a shame. However the electrical schematic can. Would it be worthwhile re-texting it in english? It also confirms (apparentently assuming it isn't yet another hoax..) that the transformer taps are 2+2+1+1 with 2 each for each bogie 1 for head end power 1 for auxilliarys.. Is it trustable?  Sf5xeplus (talk) 00:41, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Images

message: - If I understand correctly TRAX has max. speed 140/160/200 km/h versions, where 140 has rigid "palm grip" type bearings boogie, 160 mixed tech and 200 has full high-speed boogie, with price increases as usual. The 200 km/h variant is not mentioned in the article, however.
- The article fails to mention or emphasized that genesis of TRAXX was more or less the result of certain national railways' revolt versus the technically sound, but execessively powerful and unnecessarily fast, luxury-priced "Siemens Taurus" locomotive. 82.131.210.163 (talk) 13:00, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Additions recommended 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on TRAXX. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090307042830/http://www.bombardier.com:80/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-p160-ac---germany?docID=0901260d80012a20 to http://www.bombardier.com/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-p160-ac---germany?docID=0901260d80012a20
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090307065230/http://www.bombardier.com:80/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-f140-ac---switzerland--sbb-?docID=0901260d80010289 to http://www.bombardier.com/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-f140-ac---switzerland--sbb-?docID=0901260d80010289#
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on TRAXX. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20120214091706/http://www.bombardier.com/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-f140-ac---germany?docID=0901260d800101b4 to http://www.bombardier.com/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-f140-ac---germany?docID=0901260d800101b4#
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified  on TRAXX. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110706223037/http://www.bombardier-transportation.ch/dateien/PPC%20Site%20Zurich.pdf to http://www.bombardier-transportation.ch/dateien/PPC%20Site%20Zurich.pdf
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090707035846/http://www.bombardier.com/files/en/supporting_docs/TRAXX_MS_EMAS.pdf to http://www.bombardier.com/files/en/supporting_docs/TRAXX_MS_EMAS.pdf
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*Added  tag to http://www.pkp-cargo.pl/Pierwszy_rozkladowy_pociag_PKP_CARGO_obslugiwany_lokomotywa_TRAXX_wjechal_do_Niemiec,78,pr,28,j,1.html
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090509043813/http://www.bombardier.com:80/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-dc?docID=0901260d8001eade to http://www.bombardier.com/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-dc?docID=0901260d8001eade
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thread_title:  External links modified 

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*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.bombardier.com/en/transportation/products-services/rail-vehicles/locomotives/traxx-ac/traxx-f140-ac---switzerland--bls-?docID=0901260d800102be
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This is mentioned as a leasing company. Actually it is a subsidiary of the German state of Niedersachsen (Lower Saxony). The full name is
″Landesnahverkehrsgesellschaft Niedersachsen". Background: the rail reforms of the 90s put regional rail traffic into the responsibilty of the states. These founded subsidiaries (here the LNVG) to handle it. The LNVG decides the frequency and routes of the trains and delegates the operation to the lowest bidder (here Metronom). As a method to generate more competition, they often use their better credit rating to buy the rolling stock or vouch for the leasing rates. Otherwise the state owned DB could underbid most private competitors.
This probably is too much detail for an article about TRAXX.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:2028:615:D701:D459:AFE0:B99C:89C7 (talk) 00:33, 23 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  LNVG 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) Extraordinary Writ (talk) 07:11, 13 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: TRAXX →  – I feel like this page needs the manufacturer included within its name because otherwise people would be confused. Due to an error I was unable to move the page over redirect. --Edgar Searle (talk) 02:23, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 6 January 2022