Talk:History of Rwanda

message: "Habyarimana immediately instituted genocidal programs, which would be directed against all Tutsis and against any Hutus seen as in league with Tutsi interests. " 
Any source for these "genocidal programs?"    —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.247.216.150 (talk) 22:55, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Source question 

message: "War and division seemed to open the door for colonialism, and in 1897 German colonialists and missionaries arrived in Rwanda. The Rwandans were divided with a portion of the royal court being very wary and the other seeing the Germans as a welcome alternative to the dominance of Buganda or the Belgians.Rwanda put up far less resistance than Burundi to German rule."
the part saying Rwanda but up Less resistance is not correct.
Rwanda actualy put up one of the biggest resistances in africa
and was never fully colonized it was under german control but was self governing
i will add spesfic information soon  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.50.139.196 (talk) 00:53, 25 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  German colonialism 

message: ------
It would be helpful to explain which
ethnicity is dying in the 
part "By April 1991 100,000 were dead, by May, 200,000".
Also, the "The prime minister and her 10 Belgian bodyguards were among the first victims." comes from nowhere.  Who's she?
----
wasnt the belgian catholic church somewhat responsible for the slaughter? they said that the tutsian invading army was comunistic, and that communism was related with satan in some way.. i dont really remember how :/ Noone 12:15, 22 Apr 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I haven't heard that before but that's quite a reach. When massive numbers of people of one ethnicity readily rise up and murder their neighbors of another ethnicity in a mass slaughter it is unlikely they were inspired by a church saying that some group was "communistic." Cecropia 14:27, 6 May 2004 (UTC)

text: In a time before memory, the Twa were replaced by the migration of the racially Congoid forbearers of today's ethnic Hutus.  The Hutus had been an agriculturalist people making traditionally no use of domesticated animals, and thus were culturally at contrast with the third of Rwanda's ethno-racial g Rwanda's ethno-racial g Rwanda's ethno-racial groups to arrive, the taller, racially Hamitic Tutsis.
Surely these pseudoscientific "racial" terms are derived from now-discredited nineteenth-century theories? Deleting these terms. -- The Anome 11:37, 24 May 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early discussion 

message: Any chance of getting some sort of idea what period the events described in the early history / civilization sections take place in?  I realize it would be likely impossible to attribute exact dates, but any kind of rough idea would be helpful.  Even the "background" section of Rwandan Genocide is more detailed. --Nephtes 15:57, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early history / civilization sections 

message: Having considerably shortened Rwandan Genocide#Background, I've moved the original Background section to a temp page, Talk:History of Rwanda/Ethnic History of Rwanda. Not all of that belonged in Rwandan Genocide. But it seems like there's information there that has not been incorporated into this article. -- bcasterline • talk 01:34, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ethnic History of Rwanda 

message: Please see talk page of Rwandan Genocide and Bibliography of the Rwandan Genocide; much plagiarism previously (and perhaps still) from unacknowledged, unattributed sources in the main body of that article (and perhaps borrowings from it in this one).  Since this article has incorporated some material from that article (without providing any references or citations of its own at all), verification is a big problem.  Major editing help requested. NYScholar 04:06, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Problems of lack of sources/citations/references/verification 

message: I started a section at History of Rwanda#Origins of Hutu and Tutsi to summarize parts of Mamdani's book.  However, the section is rapidly getting out of hand.  I am now considering breaking out an article Origin of Tutsi and Hutu, into which this section and info at both Hutu and Tutsi may be merged.  I think I opposed such a similar proposal long ago, but I've come to the conclusion that a single article to consolidate information and sources may be in the best interests of the topic. Thoughts? - BanyanTree 06:09, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Origins of Tutsi and Hutu]] breakout article? 

message: I am reading African Guerillas: Raging Against the Machine edited by Martin Bøås and Kevin C. Dunn. In chapter 2 (pages 31-32), written by the editors, they say that in 1959 Tutsis weren't allowed to be citizens. Anyone else know anything about it? If so, that would be relevant to include. JoshNarins (talk) 15:58, 16 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tutsi Citizenship in 1959- ? 

message: I feel like deleting everything in the "pre-colonial history" section that I can't find in the French or German versions of this page. I'm not saying it's all lies, but there is a HUGE amount of history with absolutely NO sources and NO citation-needed tags. My favourite has got to be the kalinga. While a quick google search does turn up some results for this, they don't all necessarily agree on the details, and I'd love to know where the author found it so we can cite that source (and/or other sources) and use their information.
Who DID write this article? I'm looking it up and throwing something on their talk page.
סרסלי, קײק פּלז (talk) 09:54, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  citation seriously needed! 

message: I think that is time to give a proper (negative) answer to this fraudulous ideology, inherited from the Marxist-Leninist-Maoist historiography.
See for example these two quotations from the current article:
Precolonial era:
*"All the people of Rwanda were expected to do tribute to the Mwami, and this tribute was collected, in turn, by a Tutsi administrative hierarchy. Beneath the Mwami was also a Tutsi ministerial council of great chiefs, the batware b'intebe, while below them was a group of lesser Tutsi chiefs who for the large part governed the country in districts, each district having a cattle chief and a land chief. The cattle chief collected tribute in livestock, and the land chief collected tribute in produce. Beneath these chiefs were hill-chiefs and neighborhood chiefs. Again, over 95% of hill and neighborhood chiefs were of Tutsi descent."
Colonial era:
*"Europeans simplified this arrangement and decided that the Hamitic Tutsi were racially superior and should thus make up the entire ruling class, while the inferior Bantu Hutu should become a permanent underclass."
So, the statement that the colonists would have laid the base for future Hutu-Tutsi animosity is a primitive lie.--Mazarin07 (talk) 17:39, 21 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  So, let's blame the European colonists for all problems of Africa? 

message: What does the Armenian Genocide have to do with Belgian politics?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.40.1.129 (talk) 16:18, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Armenian Genocide 

message: This article and another seem to imply that there was glaciation in central Africa during the last glacial maximum or such Is there a source for this? It seem preposterous/embarassing. I don't believe there has been glaciation in equatorial Africa at any time in the last several million years. 72.228.190.243 (talk) 21:00, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: There is glaciation in equatorial right now if you go high enough :)  But other than that I don't know. The source for the fact you mention is the Briggs and Booth travel guide, which admittedly is a somewhat dubious source. The quote from that book is "Even back in the ice age, Rwanda was showing its typically green and fertile face; a part of the Nyungwe Forest remained uncovered by ice, so that animal and plant life could survive there."  So that's where it comes from, but do you have any sources that state that all of Rwanda was not covered by glaciation at that time? As I say, the Rwenzoris just to the north have a glacial sheet even now. And the west of Rwanda is unusually high altitude. Would be interested to know more, anyway. Thanks  — Amakuru (talk) 21:29, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: "Ice sheet" is the operative expression characteristic of the actual glaciation elsewhere. The mountain glaciers are technically glaciation and it's definitely the case that the glacial maximum would have had some effects in central Africa. The central issue is that at no time was Rwanda closed to human habitation due to an ice sheet and on the contrary, it has always been during the human epoch temperate or milder. That at least is what we must assume without a source for something else based on the content in other articles on glaciation. It's the complete coverage, as you say, of all of what is now Rwanda that is overreaching without such a source. The indications are that at no time in any relevant period was there more than 10s of square kilometers of glaciation and that in comparison with an area of 26 000 sq. km. 72.228.190.243 (talk) 00:04, 7 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: So History_of_Africa#Paleolithic, sources given there, and of course common sense are the basis for the presumption of more or less continuous habitation, albeit at levels consistent with the then stages of human culture. Contrary to the apparent, and as I say, embarrassing confabulation about the ice sheet, what the first ¶ of the Early History § ought to note is simply the great antiquity of the Twa as its surviving aboriginal people.72.228.190.243 (talk) 00:43, 7 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Last Glacial Maximum  

message: I understand that the name of the area during colonial times was Ruanda-Urundi. It is occasionally referred to in this article by that name and, and frequently by Rwanda-Urundi [sic]. I think that the latter may be an unintentional misspelling -- Google reveals no results at all under that spelling, though Wikipedia has a redirect page with that name. Could someone please clarify? Lou Sander (talk) 14:49, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: yes, you're right. There's no such thing as "Rwanda-Urundi". I will go through and change these references. Thanks  — Amakuru (talk) 21:14, 30 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  I was a ham radio operator back in the late 1950s, and I was pretty familiar with the African countries back then. Their names all changed pretty soon thereafter, though, and my knowledge of the new names isn't as good. I thought I remembered Ruanda-Urundi from way back when. ;-) Lou Sander (talk) 21:20, 30 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Rwanda and Burundi became independent in 1962, and as far as I know it was at that time that the modern forms, with the w rather than the u came into common usage, at least in French and English (I'm not sure if there was a specific spelling used when writing in the local Kinyarwanda language during the colonial era). That must have been quite exciting to be a ham radio operator, back in those days... it must have been a completely different world from today!  — Amakuru (talk) 21:27, 30 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: It sure was exciting and different. Some of the African broadcasting stations put strong signals into Pittsburgh. I remember Radio Brazzaville especially. There was also an amateur station in Zanzibar that I remember well even today. In those days a domestic long distance phone call was a pretty big deal -- hearing or talking to somebody in Africa was really something special. Lou Sander (talk) 21:54, 30 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  I lived in rural Rwanda ten years ago, and even then things were pretty remote. I had a short wave radio that could receive BBC World News and Voice of America (plus other international stations), and without an internet connection, that and occasional phone calls were my contact with the outside world during the week - I often went into the city at weekends, which was a bit more connected. I imagine now that one could fairly easily get connected with a smart phone and 3G internet, even in the rural areas, so the world continues to get smaller!  — Amakuru (talk) 15:15, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ruanda-Urundi 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: If the fact that the military rule in Rwanda caused a genocide of the Tutsi race makes you uncomfortable, then don’t go to this page. You don’t need to delete BASIC HISTORY. Now keep it with the infobox if you don’t want to start an edit war. Wikifixer559 (talk) 21:33, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why did you have to take away the infobox for the military rule in Rwanda?