Talk:Lambda Phi Epsilon/Archive 1

message: Due to a lack of citations, I have deleted the second paragraph of the University of Texas at Austin section which gave purported details on the incident.  The existing citation led to http://www.statesman.com/news/content/news/stories/local/12/14/14indict.html?cxtype=rss which is a page that is not found.
Skandalicious 08:28, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: University of Texas at Austin Details

message: What troubles me is the fact that the actions of individual members of this particular fraternity have been singled out and is dangerously close to being misconstrued as endorsed by Lambda Phi Epsilon, Inc.  While I can't speak for the Lambda Phi Epsilon national board, I don't believe that these charges (ie: drug possession, shootings, etc) has anything to do with the fraternity itself.  Just because P -> Q and Q -> Z does not make P equal to Z.  In this case, it can read fraternity -> member, member -> drugs, does not equal fraternity -> drugs.
I am leaving the Kenny Leoung section as-is because although some members may take offense to it, it did happen during a fraternity sanctioned event (to my knowledge).  If anyone has any further information regarding it, please post.  
Thanks all for contributing to this page and let's try to keep it civil and not go back to any revert wars (they're more of a pain in the ass than anything).
edit: Perhaps we should wait for offical police investigation results regarding Leoung?  Thoughts?
-Timlee 03:09, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Comment 1

message: Is there evidence available to support this somewhat POV edit to the page? Some kind of citation would be a good thing. Ëvilphoenix Burn! 18:13, 4 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: In my recent searches on Luong, I haven't found any article that supports this.  He may very well have been in an accident but there hasn't been any news reporting on that.  I would vote to delete the commented section. -Timlee 02:09, 5 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  evidence 

message: I checked the website, http://www.nicindy.org/ and the wikipedia page for the North-American Interfraternity Conference in reference to recognition. Lambda Phi Epsilon is still listed under this National Conference. --Danngo 20:16, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  National Recognition 

message: This is an online encyclopedia, not a message board. Anything that has been reported by the media can be included here regardless of people's feelings. --† Ðy§ep§ion † 00:44, 3 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Not a message board

message: Starting with the statement "first and only nationally recognized Asian-Interest fraternity based in the United States." I've done some research and this seems to be a very opinionated statement, seeing as their are other National Asian-interest fraternities that began earlier than Lambda Phi Epsilon fraternity. I understand that Lambda Phi Epsilon may be recognized as being part of the NIC but many of the chapters are not part of the NIC or any other council at all. Some are recognized only as student organizations, not as an official fraternity at all. Therefore, stating that this fraternity is THE FIRST and ONLY nationally recognized Asian-interest fraternity may be misleading. Please be unbiased towards all organizations, fraternities, etc. and state the facts.
134.35.2.4 21:43, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  This information seems to be from a biased POV. 

message: I believe that this section (Controversial Deaths) of the article on Lambda Phi Epsilon is quite unfair to be posted on this website. There has been no verdict in any of these cases nor has the Irvine chapter been charged. Why i believe this is unfair is not because these events are being published on this site, but the fact that NO other organizations have a section like this on their page. It is a known fact that other organizations such as Sigma Pi, Beta Theta Pi, etc all have had incidences where such occurences have happened. 
For example, the San Jose incident, Alam was a victim of a murder. The person who committed the crime of stabbing the brother to death was closely affiliated with Pi Alpha Phi. However, there is no article linked to the Pi Alpha Phi page, even though some of their xangas and profiles online include the words "lambda killaz". 
If posting news articles and published papers on Wikipedia regarding the organization is fair, why are there no other articles linked to the water hazing deaths of mainstream Greek fraternities? Is it because they are more well protected behind the millions of dollars they take from their members? If we want to speak locally, an affiliate of Beta Theta Pi, UC Irvine, was convicted of raping and stabbing a woman, carving swastikas on her body. However, the organization is actively back on the campus. Such examples are of pre-meditated actions whereas we are imcriminating Lambda Phi Epsilon for an accident that happened during a sporting event. 
Oh, and as a little FYI, the "evidence" posted here are testimonials from Pomona students. However, did Daniel Dai ever mention that he has self proclaimed to have been a member of Sunny Side Wah-Ching in Southern California? Listening to a gang member who has committed pre-meditated crimes would not be legit in my book. 
Due to this injustice of posting, I will continue to delete these articles in this section until further action is taken to include such sections in all pages for other fraternities. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Crazytrip (talk • contribs) 22:32, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  There has been a debate about controversial incidents that have occured in relation to fraternities. For a prime example,please see Phi Kappa Psi and its talk page. Samwisep86 06:28, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I believe the reason why it's included is because it's cited. For better or worse, anything can be included in Wikipedia if it is cited. As far as Beta Theta Pi at UC Irvine is concerned, that person you are referring to was never part of Beta.  He was only a pledge for about a week and his actions never took place during a fraternity event whereas the incident at UCI concerning Lambda Phi Epsilon was a fraternity event and therefore involved the group as a whole. The UCI Betas were kicked out over a hazing incident. I know, because I was there during that time. They're back because they've already served their suspension --† Ðy§ep§ion †  Speak your mind 06:45, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Inconsistency 

message: The flow of the information currently is in the following order: Convention, History, and then Chapters.  For better flow of information, I suggest that the sections be reordered as: History, Chapters, Convention.  (Convention is a congregation of all 46 chapters, which would be more appropriately placed after the Chapters portion.)
If anyone disagrees to this, please let me know.  Otherwise, I'll go ahead and make the change.
Pinto a 07:38, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Changing the information structure on the main page