Talk:Asp (snake)

message: The word 'asp' is indeed archaic and has been used for various things by various peoples in various eras uncomprehendingly.
You have found a source that says "aspis is greek for viper". Wrong!
In chronological order: -
Aspís was originally Greek for SHIELD.
Then it became the Greek for the Egyptian snake that looked like a shield (cobra, obviously).
Then it became the Latin word for the same animal (the Romans met it in north Africa).
Then Plutarch wrote in Greek of the Aspís being the cause of Cleopatra's death.
Her actual death and her literary death are two separate things that should not be confused (Plutarch basically invented the metaphor of "taking a viper to your bosom").
Then, taken from the Latin, it became an English word for an animal no-one had ever seen, but sounded thrilling (see Caxton's definition in the OED - "a beest unable to be caught except by charming").
Then it started to get used in English for European creatures that bore no resemblence to the Egyptian cobra (if Shakespeare used the word asp, it was probably from an English translation of Plutarch).
and so on.
You have a mess to sort out over many pages. FangoFuficius (talk) 09:12, 19 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  What is the basic problem? 

message: Shouldn't this page be Asp (snake) rather than Asp (reptile), since the archaic term is used solely in reference to snakes? --64.85.223.85 (talk) 04:34, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move 

message: And shouldn't this merge with the Vipera aspis page? This article isn't making much of a case for considering the asp separately from the, erm, asp... 128.135.181.127 (talk) 16:34, 14 May 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think so.  Global perspective.  Outside the geographic range of the European asp, the most common use of the word is probably to refer to the snake used by Cleopatra in her suicide, which apparently was not Vipera aspis. --Dan Wylie-Sears 2 (talk) 18:50, 31 July 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: moved. Clear consensus to move the article as proposed. No consensus for making it the primary topic. (closed by non-admin page mover) Vpab15 (talk) 11:02, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Asp (reptile) →  – Clearer and more specific. Asp only refers to specifically snakes, no other reptiles. It's currently confusing that Asp (snake) redirects to a disambiguation page instead of this one. This is an article that discusses the meaning of asp in relation to snakes and can cover the snake entries on that disambiguation page. MClay1 (talk) 14:43, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

text: --Relisted to gather more discussion on the various destination options.--Shibbolethink (♔ ♕) 18:25, 15 August 2021 (UTC)

text: --Advertised at WikiProject Amphibians and Reptiles.--Shibbolethink (♔ ♕) 18:25, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 30 July 2021 

message: When someone comes to a page called "Asp (snake)", it's very likely that they're trying to find out which snakes are called asps.  Are there several species within the genus Vipera, with the common name "asp"?  Are there several species in different genera within the viperidae?  Is it a common name for the entire viperidae?  Is it still used for some cobras?  I don't know, because the article doesn't tell, and I haven't found it in a reliable source to add.  --Dan Wylie-Sears 2 (talk) 18:19, 31 July 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  But what are they?