Talk:Erik Bornmann

message: I gather that Bornman (with one N) was a professional name that he used.  Bornmann seems to be the family name (google his brother Roy) and it is also the name that Bornmann uses now (according to his link) and would seem to be his legal name also.  I suspect that it always was.  So I'm going to move (rename) the article to reflect this.  --JGGardiner 19:34, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Name Confusion

message: So what happened to Pilot House?  The intro says that it became a leading firm.  Since it was created only five years ago, one think that was still the case from reading the article.  Is it?  Does Bornmann have any involvement with them?  The article is rather confusing to read because it is out of chronological order.  --JGGardiner 18:24, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Pilot House

message: I am disturbed by the fact that this has become a forum for cronies of those that have been criminaly charged to attack an individual that has come forward to testify on behalf of the crown.  Wikipedia must be concerned by the fact that the encyclopedia is being abused in this way.  I encourage others to remain vigilant in preventing this continued abuse.
--rascalpatrol 01:08, 01 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Crown Witness 

message: Things seem to be a little heated here so I just want to remind everyone to keep things civil.  Also, it isn't cool to edit someone else's comments.  You really shouldn't edit a comment, other than your own, unless it is truly problematic (offensive, threatening, etc).  Thanks everyone.  --JGGardiner 04:53, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Editing

message: There's no logical reason for keeping the photo gallery link, is there?  It does not provide any additional information about the subject, and there is no discussion of his photography hobby anywhere in the article.  I will remove it at this point, but if another editor feels it is useful, please feel free to re-add. Risker 06:15, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Photo Gallery Link? 

message: An hour spent with Google tonight produced the following sources that provide background concerning Mr Bornmann that may be useful in adding content to the Erik Bornmann article.  A press release by his lawyer in Ontario, and a related canada.com article.  Tyee article, an essay he apparently did, Delta Optimist Article,  A reference to him in question period in the BC legislature and another one.  Something from CTV news, from Burnaby now, and two pieces from CBC 1 and 2. Something from Victoria voices,  and from Mr Bornmann's own work and from Andrew Coyne who I think is a Globe and Mail columnist.  These are at least a starting point. KenWalker | Talk 07:37, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Erik Bornmann links 

message: Wikipedia has very strict policies regarding articles on living people.  Given the tendentious nature of this article, I have applied them strictly, removing all unreferenced information, and would ask that everyone else do the same with this article.  Please only include information that is verifiable and reliably sourced.  Any information that is not referenced will be removed. Proto::► 12:21, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: All of the sourced material was purged by a sock before Proto got here, so I restored it. A total of 18 socks, not counting Rascalpatrol were confirmed as sockpuppets by a request for check user, including Randy3, who keeps deleting material and adding Bornmann's photography website here. I don't have time right now to work on this, but Proto's right - everything needs to be sourced properly, even non-controversial statements. Bobanny 17:36, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: (Ken, got your message on my talk page.)  All the information remains in the edit history - as long as the references are present, then the information can safely be restored.  If references were purged by a sock, I apologise for missing that, but we still need to ensure that every single fact is referenced accurately and reliably.  If this means the article takes time to put together, then so be it.  Better slow and correct than fast and wrong/unreliable.  Incidentally, do we have a reliable reference for Mr Bormann's year / date of birth? Proto::► 19:51, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, thanks for that info. I agree that care must be taken to source everything. KenWalker | Talk 20:18, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: More comments on this later, but I wanted to comment on the "tribute socks" that showed up during my block; as I already told Bobanny elsewhere - 'tweren't me, as I was blocked at the time and don't have the dough to get around a block by going to a webcafe (as our socks will if "their" IP address is blocked, which it should be...) - and at least one of the two that resembles my username, Skootum3, made "friendly edits".  But in review, and now that that's a confirmed sock - apparently from the same puppetmaster, or is that not what the sockpuppet report means? - it's suggestive that they were trying to "incriminate" me by making an edit that might look I was trying to violate the block.  Just a speculation.  But these are spin doctors, disinformationists and provocateurs we're dealing with; "they" specialize.  Suffice to say if there's only two puppetmaster, as stated in the sock report, I can guess pretty easily which two they are......Skookum1 20:26, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: BTW seem my comments to Proto on Talk:BC Legislature Raids about Punch & Judy.  One of the funniest bits in this whole affair was Omar Jack's (or was it Rich_H's?) "I am not a sockpuppet - who are you calling a sockpuppet" blustering...cf. Spiro Agnew.Skookum1 20:36, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: NOTE Skookum1 has been banned from wikipedia on at least one occassion for his irrational outbursts.  It is not difficult to imagine why given his conduct on this page. --Omar Jack 02:59, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[WP:BLP]]

message: As the record of the AFD is no longer linked through these pages, I thought it best to post it here so newcomers to this page can see "what went down" and why the ongoing shuffle of data (which, no doubt, will continue, unless the sockpuppets and their puppetmaster(s) have been blocked....which they should be IMO).Skookum1 00:53, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Link to Record of Bornmann AFD 

message: I have semi-protected the page due to continual disruptive editing from a connfirmed sock farm. Proto::► 11:16, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected 

message: Just thought I should comment on sources I included. I cited the police warrant that was posted by the CBC, but only for his full date of birth, which should be an acceptable source for uncontroversial information, but wouldn't be for other stuff. I also cited Bornman's own writing, but again, only for his political work experience, not for anything contentious. Perhaps a better 3rd party source could replace it later, and more details added, but for now, this article conforms to all the relevant policies. The only point of information that isn't sourced is that 3 more were charged in 2006, which I didn't come across this round, so if someone else is so inclined, please add a citation, although again, I don't think that's controversial information, and certainly doesn't blemish Bornmann's reputation. As is, this is probably one of the best sourced stubs on Wikipedia. I'm sure more material will come up when information starts trickling out of the trial proceedings. In the meantime, BC Legislature Raids is in desperate need of clean-up. Bobanny 19:00, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Can some of the references obtained for this article be lifted across?  Proto::► 10:14, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think what you mean is can they be migrated to BC Legislature Raids - ??  Necessarily they're often the same sources/references; those deleted from here (and slowly being restored) were also deleted from BC Legislature Raids ("the Ledge Raids" or "Ledgegate" for short btw), and so are also hiden in that article's edit history; for the usual "reasons" - that the columnist is an NDP (socialist party) or that the Straight or the Tyee is "leftist", or for whatever other non seqitur-ish reason.Skookum1 19:02, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: sources

message: Complete with Wikipedia usernames and snippets from this Talk page: Erik Bornmann article on Wikipedia proves highly controversial: a tale of intrigue and attack of the "Sock Puppets". No comment/I'm clueless about whether it's an accurate description of what's been going on. Kla'quot 04:44, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Look, we're on Bill Tieleman's blog 

message: From: "RCMP Targeted Aides", Vancouver Sun - 28 April 07
:"The defence lawyer speculated that the call may have stemmed from Bornmann issuing a press release that indicated he had been cleared of any wrongdoing and was now a witness instead of a suspect.
:"It was untrue, McCullough said of Bornmann's false claim of exoneration, which was reported by a number of media outlets at the time.
:"The defence lawyer questioned whether part of the Crown deal was to allow Bornmann to pursue a legal career. Bornmann received a law degree from the University of B.C. and then went to Toronto to article for a law firm.
:"He had applied to the Law Society of Upper Canada (LSUC) to become a lawyer and would have had to disclose on his application that he was under investigation for bribing government officials, McCullough said.
:"He alleged Bornmann lied about his past in his application, which undermines his credibility.
:""The defence says you can reasonably infer that the law society would have never admitted him if he had told the truth," McCullough told the judge.
:"He said Berardino had a duty to tell the LSUC about Bornmann but instead did nothing until the law society contacted him.
:"McCullough told the court that Bornmann now is facing a disciplinary hearing after a member of the public filed a complaint.
Don't have time to fit into the article, or any similar new material on BC Legislature Raids; that should probably not be the article on the Basi-Virk Trial, though, but on the "event" of the raids themselves.  The larger and increasingly complex scandal/controversy swirling around the evidence being revealed at the trial should be its own article; Legislature Raids Cover-up maybe or my preference is Ledgegate but that's not "in currency" (yet).Skookum1 20:07, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: New material on Erik

message: It is worth stating that the payments Bornmann is alleged to have made are illegal payments.  Removing the word illegal strips a relevant and important characteristic of what he is alleged to have done.  User "Rightoh" has removed the word illegal.  This omission leaves open the possibility that the payments were legal and if that were the case there would be far less importance placed on what Bornmann is alleged to have done.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Opennicropachy (talk • contribs) 04:22, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alleged to have made illegal payments 

message: Not sure if this has been linked in teh article yet; this is the article in the Vancouver Sun giving links to the full texts of the warrants, including Bornmann's information to the police.Skookum1 (talk) 09:58, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: The warrants

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified