Talk:Kingdom of the Netherlands

message: The article states:  In these cases the Netherlands acts alone, according to its constitution and in its capacity as the Kingdom of the Netherlands. The other three countries cannot do the same for affairs of the Kingdom that only pertain to them and not to the Netherlands proper. In these cases, the provisions of the Charter prevail.
This is factually untrue. The charter always takes presedence in all of the countries regardlless if there is an affair pertaining to the other parts of the Kingdom. There is alot of jurisprudence on this matter.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.88.179.51 (talk) 12:49, 26 July 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: This is regulated in article 14 sub 3 of the Charter. It says: "Regelen omtrent aangelegenheden van het Koninkrijk, welke niet in Aruba, Curaçao of Sint Maarten gelden, worden bij wet of algemene maatregel van bestuur vastgesteld". In English: "Provisions concerning Kingdom affairs which do not apply in either Aruba, Curacao or Sint Maarten shall be effected by Act of Parliament or order in council". The two legal instruments mentioned are regulated by the Constitution for the K. of the Netherlands and not by the Charter. Makes sense when you come to think of it. Why should Charter Institutions be invoked for a treaty for instance, that doesn't effect the other countries. Also mind that it doesn't work the other way around. The three Caribbean countries need to invoke Charter institutions even when a 'Kingdom affair' at hand, doesn't apply or touches the interest of the Netherlands. Gerard von Hebel (talk) 19:20, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Charter vs Dutch Constitution 

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*Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20150402124422/https://www.koninklijkhuis.nl/nieuws/nieuwsberichten/2014/augustus/koning-en-koningin-bij-viering-200-jaar-koninkrijk-in-maastricht-(2)/ to https://www.koninklijkhuis.nl/nieuws/nieuwsberichten/2014/augustus/koning-en-koningin-bij-viering-200-jaar-koninkrijk-in-maastricht-(2)/
*Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20110511014717/http://www.rnw.nl/caribiana/article/dennis-richardson-voorgedragen-voor-raad-van-state to http://www.rnw.nl/caribiana/article/dennis-richardson-voorgedragen-voor-raad-van-state
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Almost all categories of Netherlands are on Netherlands, such as :Category:Member states of the European Union and :Category:Member states of NATO.
But :Category:Member states of the Council of Europe uses Kingdom of the Netherlands instead. Is there any reason to use Kingdom for that particular one? It's more confusing since in Member states of the Council of Europe article it links to Netherlands, not Kingdom of the Netherlands. --fireattack (talk) 21:25, 15 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: The member state is the Kingdom of the Netherlands. Not the constituent country. Gerard von Hebel (talk) 12:11, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: So should Kingdom be used in all such instances? Laurel Lodged (talk) 14:18, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Basically yes. Sometime the membership of an international organization only applies to the European territory (that used to be the constituent country) but to the outside world it always operates as the "Kingdom of the Netherlands". Gerard von Hebel (talk) 14:25, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, but I think it's more appropriate to use Netherlands when the jurisdiction of the organisation only applies to that part (such as the EU). In the case of the Council of Europe, it would be applicable to the whole state unless there are exceptions made in the agreements for the other constituent countries. Any idea about Benelux? Rob984 (talk) 14:42, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: That would make things even more confusing because some of the Carribean Islands, that do not or not entirely take part in these international organisations are now part of the constituent country. Treaties about these matters do not speak or define the constituent country to indicate limitations generally. The speak of the European territory of the kingdom. Gerard von Hebel (talk) 14:46, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: That is how it is currently I think? Treaties just refer to the Kingdom of the Netherlands with the exception of those parts. Same for Denmark with respect to Greenland and the Faroes. The Kingdom of Denmark doesn't even have a separate article however. Rob984 (talk) 14:59, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: The whole of Denmark is discussed in Danish Realm, which makes more sense as a title than Kingdom of Denmark in my opinion as it's less ambiguous than a straight formal name. I think it makes sense to use the Kingdom for most/all categories, pipelinked to put it under N for ease of navigation. CMD (talk) 17:02, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

text: Yes, but the state including all of its territories is also unadorned "Denmark", which is the shorthand name of the entire state as well as the term used to refer to the constituent country. While using the formal and shorthand names differently is a useful tool of convenience, I feel it can be taken too far. "Danish Realm" is meanwhile used in sources as well as "Kingdom of Denmark" (and other variations such as "Danish Kingdom"), but lacks the potential ambiguity of also being the formal name of Denmark. CMD (talk) 18:11, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category confusion with [[Netherlands]] 

message: :Kingdom of the Netherlands →  – Kingdom of the Netherlands should redirect to the Netherlands. When most of the people write "Kingdom of the Netherlands", they are thinking of the Netherlands 83.137.6.126 (talk) 11:52, 6 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Oppose. The Netherlands is a constituent country of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. It is not called "Kingdom of the Netherlands" on its own, but forms a kingdom together with the other constituent countries. As far as I am concerned, the kingdom as a whole is never (officially) referred to as the "Dutch Realm". ― Ætoms [talk] 13:06, 6 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 6 May 2020 

message: I can believe that it's . The weak form of en ('and') can be  too, to avoid homophony with the indefinite article. Apparently der is the same in that regard, presumably to avoid homophony with the unstressed form of haar (d'r, pronounced ). But as far as I know, the original pronunciation of der, des and den originally contained a schwa even in the stressed form, much like de (nobody says , no?). Sol505000 (talk) 06:26, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: What is the reason is unclear to me, but the pronunciation "rules" are quite clear. It is ɛ when 'der' means "of the" (former genitive plural form), but not in a last name combination ("van der"), although even the latter is pronounced with ɛ sometimes when a lastname is specified (and to make sure people don't write down "van de"). I have always heard of des and den with a ɛ though, and not in any other way.... L.tak (talk) 21:07, 24 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  IPA transcription of the word "der" 

message: There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Netherlands which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you.  —RMCD bot 20:47, 4 November 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move discussion in progress