Talk:Flag of Albania

message: Before this article (The Origin of the Albanian Flag) is deleted, I brought this article in the talk page to consider its use in this article:
Colors of the Albanian Flag, the Archangel Theory
This theory suggests that the Albanian flag is related to an ancient religion which the Illyrians were associated with. To better understand this theory, you should read a little bit about the ancient Illirian religions, especially the cults associated with the two most sacred birds, the Eagle and the Archangel.
The colors of the Albanian flag are red and black, and a two headed eagle located in the center of the flag. We all know what the two headed eagle stands for but no one knows for sure why it is red and black. The Eagle = Shqiponja hence the name of modern Albania, Shqiperija "Land of Eagles", it is believed to be worshiped by the Illyrians as the god of war. It is also believed that Alexander the Great was the first one to use the double-headed eagle, but there is nothing that proves that Alexander himself carried the double-headed eagle on his armor. What is suggested is that a group of warriors from the northern tribes who had joined Alexander’s army, the Illyrians were the one that carried the Double-Headed Eagle, which could explain how the symbol ended up in Sirkap, today Pakistan, and other places that Alexander had originally concurred. Also see | Double Headed Eagle Shrine
Ancient Illyrians believed in some interesting ancient cults. A religion made out of multiple gods. Two of their most sacred ones were: Angjelusha Ilire = Engjuli = God of Peace and the Eagle = Shqiponja = God of War.
Angjellusha Ilire , Angelus Ilirica, Archangel also known as the Holy Bird still worshiped today by Daneti1is a sacred bird believed to have been worshiped by Illyrians years before the Christ. This bird is found only in the Illyrian occupied territories, modern Albania and Kosovo. The scientific name of the bird comes from the Greek language around 100 AD, they called it Columba Ilyrica = | Pellumbi Ilir. This bird has some distinct characteristics which are the reasons why it was worshiped by the ancient Illyrians. The bird flies at high altitudes which cannot be seen with the naked eye and it stays up in the sky for hours. The ancient Illyrians believed that the bird was up there communicating with the gods, in particular the god of SUN, Ellil = Dielli 2in ancient Illyrian, which they also worshiped.
How is this related to the flag? This bird is unique because it has been preserved genetically by the ancient Illyrians and worshiped as one their god for thousands of years and it is Red and Black. Those who created the Albanian flag, whether it is Skanderbeg or others before him clearly understood this ancient religion.
Documented phrases: “Our Religion is SHQIPTARIA”, in Albanian “ Feja jon eshte SHQIPARIA” Pashko Vasa , a documented phrase that suggest that we clearly had a religion long before the Christ. This phrase is also documented in other ancient text. The Flag according to my findings represents the two most sacred gods that Illyrians believed on, Red and Black = Engjellusha Ilire = Archangel= God of Peace, and The Eagle = God of War.
Written by Burim Istogu
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Origin_of_the_Albanian_Flag"
Hidden categories: Articles for deletion
-— Preceding unsigned comment added by Bulixus (talk • contribs) 07:35, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  '''The Archangel Theory''' as brought by Burim Istogu 

message: The eagle presented in the picture is the incorrect one. The right one is the one found in the coat of arms without Skanderbeg helm obviously. See also the talk in the file. Please someone who can correct it. Purusbonum (talk) 11:32, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Incorrect version of the Albanian Flag 

message: I've been reading some scholarly articles and learned about a flag with a green background, a crescent moon, and 3 stars. It is defined as the "Kingdom of Egypt" flag between 1922–1953. However, it was also identified as an "Egyptian Albanian Flag." Does anyone have knowledge of this particular flag? (Thanks in Advance!)
Twillisjr (talk) 16:30, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: It was called Egyptian Albanian because the royal house of Egypt was of Albanian origin.--— ZjarriRrethues — talk 17:02, 30 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Egyptian Albanian Flag 

message: I've never seen the hammer-and-sickle flag used in photographs during the 1944-1946 period. As far as I can tell this flag was used by the Albanian partisans only on specific, Communist Party-related occasions. The flag actually in use was the basic Albanian flag used today; the star was added when it was proclaimed a People's Republic in 1946. --Ismail (talk) 04:39, 27 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Flag of the Democratic Government of Albania" 

message: 1. The otherwise widely reported design of the flag of "Independent Albania" can be clearly confirmed in photos of that time, such as https://www.tiranatimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/13825279344_6b8e3aab7b_b.jpg from the Albanian Congress of Trieste.2. The otherwise widely reported design of the flag of the Principality can clearly be confirmed in actual specimens of the flag such as https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1033571990308506&set=pb.100009671439264.-2207520000 . The "de-facto" flag stems from photo evidence in the post-Wied occupied Principality which shows "generic" double-headed eagle flags in use.3. The file of the flag of the Republic is the same as the replacement one, just higher quality (does not include wear & tear + dirt in the vectorization). The "alternative flag" of the republic is seen in European vexillological publications of the time and could warrant a mention.4. The Zogist flag (modern flag + helmet of Skanderbeg) is ultra-easily confirmed by every flag-guide in existence at the time + easy photographic confirmation.5. Italian imposed fascists flags equally easily confirmed. In 1942 the old Zogist flag is reported to have begun to be used again due to the unpopularity of the fascist one. This is easily confirmed by both photos and video from the time.6. The kingdom during German occupation readopted the old constitutions and its symbols. The use of these are easily confirmed by both photos and videos of state functions.7. Hammer and Sickle flag is a little more sketchy and could need more defintie sourcing, but is reported in use by the partisan government.(8.Regarding the Republic of Mirdita, the use of "generic" double-eagle flags are used everywhere in Albania at the time and indeed reported to be used the men of this group (who also used the generic symbol of stamps etc)--Havsjö (talk) 16:03, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: 1. How can you see the images of the flags on both links you provided and conclude definitively how the flag looks? It's impossible to tell the shape of the eagle from both images.2. You are posting a Facebook image of a random user showing a flag that is supposedly 100+ years old in mint condition? Yeah, sounds very legit.3. Your explanation is vague and confusing. Which flag are you referring to?4. The zogist flag is easily confirmed. I agree 100%. All you have to do is go to the official Royal Court Website to see it https://albanianroyalcourt.al/symbols5. Fascist flag design has many variations. I designed the emblem of this period so I know. The official one used in ceremonies (see: Luce Institute archives) varies greatly from the lesser arms design found in the currency used at the time.6. Can you show me sources about the flag used during German occupation?7. Again, sources?8. There is no evidence of a flag being used by the Republic of Mirdita. None. If you disagree, show me that evidence? Kj1595 (talk) 19:37, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  I admire your effort to contribute information on the history of flags in Albania. However, the fictional images you have uploaded do more damage than good. You need to do more serious research when you upload content and label them official titles. You don't seem to be a native Albanian speaker which makes it harder for you to find reliably sourced content. That's totally understandable. But I suggest you do more indepth study of "historical" images you upload here. Kj1595 (talk) 19:59, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  1. Perhaps not every millimeter of every feather is 100% identical to the vectorization, but its clearly the same "fat" eagle design which is known to be the design of the original flag. So that file/flag should not be removed. That the notion of that flag being just based of some post-card is totally stupid. I mean the reason for the fat eagle being the "standard" design in the 1910-1920's of "generic" flags is because of its origin there. Like  or here 2. The image is from a museum  (look in the display) and its a well-known design. Here is also from Albanian PM:  File/flag should not be removed. Here is also some other flags of that era  and the eagle-design further confirming . The "de-facto" flag in the chaos period of WW1 with basically no "state" (but still formally the Principality), "generic" double-eagle flags are seen used in various photos or relic-flags by Albanians. Again from Albanian PM Edi Rama  from 1917.3. Republican flags ("State" and "national")  and . the latter indeed on a square shape. You replaced this flag with this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_the_Albanian_Republic_(1925%E2%80%931928).svg which is the same flag but lower quality. The strange "alternative flag" for the Republic is this . Info about it here  (I have also seen this flag in charts from that time, probably some kind of error though).4. Why did you remove the Zogist flag (also from the "Kingdom of Albania" article, if you known its design is real?   also Bonus:  Army flag of Royal Army which you removed from here for no reason. Even https://albanianroyalcourt.al/symbols/ here, which you sent tells you this is the royal falg and army flag... NOTE THAT ROYAL FLAG IS NOT THE SAME AS NATIONAL FLAG. ALL MONARCHIES HAVE A ROYAL FLAG FOR THE MONARCH TOO ASIDE FROM THE COUNTRIES FLAG5. fascist flag has 1 design   although some are made in "lower quality" or with smaller emblem or some such, but the design ("on paper") is the same. Here is Fascist era "Zogist" flag  (and there are other photos and videos)6. Here is a random street flag from German period as a bonus:  Otherwise, here are "crowned" version  and another  (the latter is a still from a video of that ceremony by the government (here is PM Rexhep from that occasion ). + it is known these symbols returned with the return to that pre-Italian constitution. Here is some info on eye-witness of 1:2 proportions, but I would personally prefer if the "normal" version was standardized on on this site... 7.8.Here I admit I have no source definite source lol. But this "generic" flags would be used here (as they were by seen used by everyone in Albania in this period, hehe... But okay this one can be removed....So to purge these flag which are proved to be used is very bad and is just removing info. Put the info regarding these flags with the files and trim the really unsourced ones (like Miridita, I guess...) and dont just purge everything and say retarded stuff like how OBVIOUSLY used flags were "Not used" or "did not exist" (Independent Albania, Principality, German-era, ZOGIST era(!)) Or that some minor disturbance in a vectorization invalidates these like flags which often are not 100% standardized IRL anyway. (Same  HERE! Why included IRL material imperfections rather than the intended "on paper" design? Do you model in a hole in the flag if the specimen you base the vector on is torn?) --Havsjö (talk) 21:04, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  1. No, it is not known to be the design of the original flag. This is where you stumble and provide no credible sources to make such a claim. The following article link from Albania's largest news network, Top Channel, dated November 1, 2012 explains clearly that the design of the original flag remains a mystery. It brings up 10 hypothesis but in conclusion it says there is no evidence to say for sure which variant was the original flag used on the day of November 28, 1912 https://top-channel.tv/2012/11/01/misteri-i-flamurit-te-pare-shqiptar2. Edi Rama's post is 100% incorrect. That flag is a recreation of what Wied's flag may have looked like. The only surviving flag of that era belongs in the National Museum of History's ethnographic fund and as explained, it is in a very poor state and impossible to reconstruct. The flag Rama posted doesn't show the shielded peacock which makes it automatically fictional. Here is the image of the only surviving flag of that era displaying the shielded peacock posted by another reputable news portal https://shqiptarja.com/lajm/nje-histori-plot-mistere-br-rreth-flamurit-te-princ-vidit-br3. The flag of the Albanian Republic you posted is 100% fictional. Its only source is an amateur site created by Jaume Ollé. The actual flag is entirely different and is sourced from Teki Selenica's book "Shqipria më 1927 (e illustruar)". That book is the official pamflet created to promote the history and culture of Albania at the time. Selenica was a high ranking official known for his extensive work on the first official census conducted in the country. It has also been confirmed in notable scholar Jaho Brahaj's book "Flamuri i Kombit Shqiptar". Here is the evidence https://scontent.ftij1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/161587847_1876819149142039_4046926532410974476_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=110474&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=1wcSLS6h2MwAX-qf7wv&tn=-oaH8xbfyKxq2h2J&_nc_ht=scontent.ftij1-1.fna&tp=14&oh=99d06e7f07a68208955ff43e8ce8f034&oe=6077F6014. How can the zogist flag you posted be the real one when I showed you the official source which is the Albanian Royal Court Website?5. Fascist flag as I said has many variations. The design of the helmet in the current flag is fictional and shows no resemblance to any historically recorded flag of that time.6. The images of the flag you posted look completely different from the flag found in the article. You keep proving my point.7. crwflags.com is not a credible source.8. So you have no source but decide to add some flag you found on some website anyway? This is what I mean when I say your contribution is creating more damage than good.9. Essad Pasha's flag is reconstructed based on historical imagery. You rather have a generic image a 5 year old can design on paint just because it might look that way in print? Kj1595 (talk) 21:51, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: 1. Contemporary images of the flag in use by government representatives etc is easily a credibly source. The article you sent talks about unknown origin of the individual, specific, absolutely nr.1 first flag from the independence declaration on 28 November 1912 and the person who made it etc, it does NOT call into question the general design of "mass-produced" national flag of the country, which can be easily confirmed by many photos to back up the known sources that describe or depict it to be the "fat" eagle. How can such clear photo evidence of its use, matching written sources, be dismissed by that flag not being the very, very, very nr.1 first flag??2. For some one interested in heraldry and flags, it astonishes me how you dont seem to be aware of distinguishing "royal flag", "national flag", "state flag" etc. The "destroyed" flag with the peacock-shield is indeed, as your source describes, the "royal flag" or "Wied's (personal) flag", this is also known . BUT the widely reported and sourced flag of the COUNTRY (not Wied's flag a.k.a. royal banner) is the the version the larger version with a star and no shield as described by man sources. The museum pieces (which are not fake, (and although Mr. Rama's is reconstructed, is from museum/experts, not his home made project...) and do not contradict that example of Wied's (personal) flag, clearly matching the sources description and depiction of this flag. This  is also treated by experts at a museum, with Mr. Zefi being the Head of the Cultural Heritage Sector in Lezhe, not some random peoples photos... Understand that these images/specimens are not the sources in themselves, but merely backing up the written sources which already describe and depict these flags. Bonus: the civil ensign (if you know what that is... dont confuse this with another type of flag now...) of the Principality from time during the Austrian occupation in WW1 .3.The flag posted by Edi Rama (the prime minister of Albania, not some random person!) is not a fake. Its design matches also the known stipulations from the flag related laws of the time mentioned here  (such as the state flag having a crown in the middle of the eagle, as opposed to its "empty" civil variant). Once more I am astonished, however, by what to show in this image . The flag you replaced the national flag with is clearly described in that image as the flag of the ARMY! How do you not distinguish between these flags?? Also, the Army/War flag and the Presidents banner are also described here  (although the president version is missing the rays, and the might have incorrect proportions). BUT anyway, these variants were not "unknown" and do not contradict the source-accurate flag of the STATE presented by Mr. Rama (and again, although reconstructed, is from museum/experts, not his home made...). Here is btw the SQUARE, black eagle army/naval flag (as per your own source!!)  (square shaped indeed, as is common with military flags like this and which seems to be consistent with army + presidential/royal flags throughout the history in Albania) and here is the state flag , there is no contradiction and no indication that this specimen is false!!4. Yet again I am unfortunately forced to expressed my continuing astonishment at the ignorance of such basic vexillology in this context... The royal website clearly says its the ROYAL flag and ARMY flag.... This is INDEED well known and confirmed by sources (as are all the above claims I make, naturally) Its no rarity for sure... But how does this is any way invalidate the equally commonly and definitively sourced civil/state flag of the country (without or with crown above the eagle, respectively, in non-square shape and without the laurels)!? Do you not know the difference or make any distinguishing between this different types of flags?? This betrays a fundamental lack of understanding!6. Also with the Fascist flag there is a state (crowned with the Savoy crown) and a civil variant without one. All variations from this design , such as here the details of the crown here  is just the result of material imperfections, not changes to the actual design. The crown (of the state flag) can be seen even on this image 7. It is known that the pre-Italian constitution was readopted by the government during the German occupation, and this includes the laws of state/national symbols etc (although the old flag, as mentioned and shown, was already used in the later Italian period). The actual uses of these symbols are proved with the period photos showing their use at that time. What else is there to say? The only "controversy" here the 1:2 variant of the same design, which could be removed if the eye-witness accounts of people seeing are not credible enough. The "shorter" / normal version is proven beyond any doubt, anyway.... (Btw, the armpatch of the Skanderbeg SS-division has only been seen on some of that units German officers (and I think of some Albanians in the Handschar SS-division, who I also recall were later were moved to the Skanderbeg division after its formation. It was anyway not a widely worn one, and not in any case replacing the national/state flags!?)8. I can conceded this one due to lack of specimen/photos backing up this description(9.) Essad Pasha's flag. Just crazy to me to include such material imperfections in the digital vectorization of the flags design (and indeed, what, holes in the cloth?? Dirt??) when the design is supposed to be "red with a white star", and not "red with a white star, although with a slightly misaligned left arm of the star or loose thread on the bottom right"The well-confirmed flags (and, would be nice, the variants for naval/civil ensigns, royal/army banners etc! should be depicted here and their origin/design etc described. Now you have just removed a ton of stuff (although messy and imperfect) and replaced it with nothing or very fundamental mistakes which do not distinguish between basic things... Such as the very nr.1 first specific flag used on 28 November 1912 vs first flag design of the general used flag (the latter which is easily proved), or no separation/distinguishing between civil flag/state flag/royal flag/army flag etc... Not good!  --Havsjö (talk) 06:27, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  Before I respond to your points, you don't think I want these articles to have flags and emblems? Of course I do. As you may or may not know, I have authored hundreds of logo images in vector format here in Commons. I would be more than happy to design flags and emblems of the missing articles if only we had credible historical evidence of their existence. Not remakes of hypothetical variants but accurate to the pixel historical images.1. Where is the evidence that the flag you posted, the one found in Spiridon Ilo's postcard of 1920, which is a reprint of Marigo Posio's (Ilo's cousin) hand-embroidered flag, where is the evidence that was the flag used in Independence Day? If you cannot provide me the evidence from credible sources, I will no longer respond to this point.2. Again, where are these credible sources that say that Wied's flag looks like the one from Edi Rama's facebook post? Do you know that there is no record of any historical illustration of the flag used during Wied's era? There are records of his coat of arms, several of them actually. But no record of the flag illustration. So how can you tell me that this is the flag without any physical proof? You are just hypothesising.3. Do you know how foolish your argument here is? That eagle is nothing more than a recreation of the eagle from the Ministry of Justice qarkore found here http://cod.al/?page_id=598#tab-d393ce31-349c-44. I have no idea what you just wrote. What does the Royal Army flag have anything to do with what we are discussing? And that is the flag of the monarchy you posted is entirely different from the one found in the royal court website? You are confusing me here. Why are you posting a fictional flag of the monarchy that contradicts official sources?I am not responding to points 6 and 7 because I have no idea what you just wrote. Your command of the English language is making it very difficult for me to continue carrying on this discussion.9. I uploaded a historically accurate flag. The previous flag was fictional. No physical evidence of that flag exists. End of conversation. Kj1595 (talk) 08:13, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Basically all of Wikipedia would need to be purged of every flag if every "pixel" needs to be reconstructed 10000%, since flags, and especially old flags, have minor variations based on production quality etc in the time before machine-mass-production, but this does not change that the specific design they all try to replicate is "the flag"1. Re-read, I dont know what flag was the very first one used on 28 Nov 1912 held in the hands of Ismail Qemali and I have not claimed to know that specific flag-specimen (which is what the article you sent is discussing). But it doesnt matter if that particular, singular specimen is not known since what this argument is about is the national flag in general which was used by Albania between 1912-1914, which has ample proof. That your article talking about that particular specimen does not contradict the documented use of the flag otherwise.2. The flag specifications which details the national flag, the royal flag (aka Wied's own flag), the flag of the crown prince, and the civil ensign as designed by Emil Dopler Jr., backed up by expert museum pieces and presented by Cultural Heritage experts and even the Prime minister of the country.3. Indeed, those qarkore from the republican era use the style the republican style eagle since that was the style of eagle used at the time?? I am not in a position to question how those museum experts recreated the flag, but using the documented style of eagle in use at the time combined with the flag specifications from the laws defining it at the time makes sense... The flag you replaced the aformetioned state flag with, i.e. , is however (as also detailed in the flag specifications of the time), the flag of the army  (as explained here). The same republican style eagle you talk about is also shown on those same pages... The flag you upload (army flag), does not contradict the specifications/expert-recreations of the state/civil flag4.Here is the flag of Russia , here is the (former) royal flag Here is the flag of UK , here is the royal flag Here is the flag of Netherlands , here is the royal flag Here is the flag of Albania , and here is the royal flag Same situation with the national flag vs the royal flag (Wied's flag) in the Principality. The national flag of the Zogist kingdom is ofc well known and easily confirmed, is the the, per your own source (the royal website), royal flag (also used as army flag), also documented here . You make no distinguishing between these types of flag. The National flag is seen defined in the laws of the time (declared on 22 November 1928 and confirmed 8 August 1929. The royal/army flag was adopted on 8 Aug 1929) and seen in photos, so its not some unsourced/unconfirmed thing.6. Italian period use civil flag (without savoyard crown) and state flag (with savoyard crown). All "variations" of this flag is just unintended results of poor materials or whatever. No "variants" on emblem design is official or intended. Later in the Italian period the pre-Italian Zog-flag is again used (the normal national flag of 1928-1939 period)7. In the German period the pre-Italian constitution was readopted, including the flag laws which it contained. Thus the pre-italian (Zogist) symbols returned into law, and the actual IRL use of these symbols is proven by photo and video.9. There is no "this or that" flag, its the same flag in both cases--Havsjö (talk) 09:21, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  To be fairly honest with you, most flags in Wikipedia are indeed fictional and/or of very poor quality. This is specifically true with the coat of arms. Albania is an exception. Its historical coat of arms are exceptionally accurate from a historical perspective. The flags however are a different story. And that is what I'm trying to correct here.1. There is ZERO historical proof that the flag of Spiridon Ilo was used by the provisional government from 1912–1914.2. There is ZERO historical proof that Prince Wied's flag looked like the one posted in Edi Rama's facebook post or the post found in Paulin Zefi's facebook account.3. No. The Ministry of Justice qarkore used a different eagle from the Ministry of Education qarkore as the link shows. As you can see, the person who created that flag is completely unaware of this fact and assumed the eagle he may have seen was part of the official flag.4. The national flag used during the Monarchy is not well-known because it is not found in any articles. The fictional flag may be well-known but the historical flag is not well-known. I am in the proccess of finishing it this weekend. Why do you keep mentioning the royal army flag? I don't understand?9. Again, what are you arguing about? The updated flag of Essad Pasha accurately matches the flag found in the German Ministry of Foreign Affairs archive. There is an actual image of that flag. So, what are you arguing? Kj1595 (talk) 09:50, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: 1. Yes it is. Here it is .2. Yes, the specifications of the flags of the principality, which the museum pieces presented by Mr. Rama and Mr. Zefi depict. Those specifications include also other falgs like the royal flag (with a peacock-shield etc)3. The museum-experts who made the reconstruction use the style of eagle which can be seen in the documents from the republic and here .4. The royal, national and state flags are specifically defined in the aforementioned flag related laws from 1929. The flag from the royal website shows and describes the royal flag (vis-a-vis the national/state flag, the difference of which I showed examples of in the previous response). That royal flag (square shape with laurels) was also used by the army (as per the flag-related laws). This is different from the civil/state flag shown here in use in 1939  Here it is again after it was re-adopted in 1942 . --Havsjö (talk) 10:06, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: 1. That's an image of the delegates of the Congress of Trieste. Not the provisional government. How can you even see the eagle in that flag?2. Those are not historically accurate images. Why? Because no historical illustration of Prince Wied's flag exists. Only the damaged flag at the National Museum of History. So, those are hypothetical recreations of how the flag may have looked. And of course they are fictional because they lack the shielded peacock.3. The fictional Republic flag is not made by museum experts. It is only found in Jaume Olle's website and is based on a version of the eagle that is similarly found in the Ministry of Justice qarkore.4. You continue to bring up the royal army flag? Why? I did remove the fictional royal army emblem some time ago. What is it about the army flag you need to know from me? Kj1595 (talk) 10:41, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Flags 

message: The historical background of the flag raised by Ded Gjo Luli at the Battle of Deçiq is discussed by:
:*Verli, Marenglen (2014). "The role of Hoti in the uprising of the Great Highlands". Studime Historike (1–2)
:*Pepo, Petraq (ed.) (1962) Kujtime nga lëvizja për çlirimin kombetar (1878-1912). University of Tirana (published on the 50th anniversary of the declaration of independence of Albania)
*I have removed a facebook post by Edi Rama - reposted at a website which casually hosts articles about "Pelasgians" - which links it to two unknown Albanian emigrants who came back from the US and brought it to Ded Gjo Luli. Bibliography doesn't discuss this event and these two figures are unknown. Facebook posts aren't reliable sources. Thank you.--Maleschreiber (talk) 20:28, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  I did some more research on this and a different version of the flag's history is provided by Palok Traboini based on his wikipedia page. Thanks for the correction. I will update the description shortly. Kj1595 (talk) 21:19, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Battle of Deçiq 

message: I updated the layout similar to the german model by removing the box and opening up the text and enlarging the size of the flags to their custom width. For the "Historical flags" section to look more presentable, the description text needs to be expanded. This can take time and more research. Kj1595 (talk) 23:57, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: And btw, do you want to see proof why the sickle flag posted here is fictional? https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_Albania_(1944–1946).svg – Here is a historical image of the democratic government of 1944 in its first official gathering https://scontent.ftij1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/164000471_1880145662142721_8151588164118439675_o.jpg?_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=110474&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=g37CctUPMdUAX-zCTmk&_nc_ht=scontent.ftij1-1.fna&tp=14&oh=5a706cd3ee708d48c74ab8a06a0535a7&oe=607E1ADA Kj1595 (talk) 00:16, 23 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: That is a great photo, good to finally have some concrete info on that flag. As I mentioned I suspected the hammer-sickle flag to be of dubious accuracy since the flags carried by the partisans (while still at war and immediately after victory) was just the bird and nothing else on them --Havsjö (talk) 16:28, 23 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title: Article layout

message: Heyo, I found this picture on Getty of Prince Leka in front of a royal Albanian flag at his house in Paris, another online of him around the time of the Civil War, one from the Guardian's obituary and just another I found on the web; I just wanted to confirm the details of it. Was the crown always a black outline or is this just a specific version Leka used? 
There's also this close up of the royal family flag which indicates to me that the current wavy texture on the file that currently exists should be removed since its clearly just part of the way the flag is and not some special pattern; the person drawing it for the website just kept it in for whatever reason. 
--Spiritual Sausage (talk) 02:11, 30 June 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Those are flag recreations. The truth is, we have no existing evidence of the actual flag used during King Zog's reign. And same for the coat of arms. I know it is hard to believe but yet here we are. The communists destroyed any remaining evidence of the Zog era. For now, the recreated flag model in the royal website will have to do. Btw, it was called Albanian Kingdom, not to be confused with the Kingdom of Albania during fascist rule. Kj1595 (talk) 18:16, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:   at the very least could the wavy texture get removed off the current Albanian Kingdom file? it looks unnatural and judging by the picture of that specific flag IRL its only part of how the flag was made Spiritual Sausage (talk) 11:14, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I have tested it and it looks worse due to the fact that the shape of the eagle wingspan is uneven. That image is temporary. I will eventually find the historical flag and coat of arms. Just recently I found the official fascist flag and coat of arms and it will be uploaded here in this article soon. Kj1595 (talk) 18:03, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Shame about that but awesome to hear about the fascist ones! Spiritual Sausage (talk) 19:40, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kingdom of Albania flag? 

message: Shouldn’t the article mention the (quite obvious) link to other countries also using the double headed eagle coat of arms on their flag (as well as the links to other noble families in the region, ex the Crnojevic family) and the origin from the Byzantine empire? Ossianthegreat (talk) 11:45, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  More on links to other flags 

message: § III.1: “…  blood red …”. But “#FF0000” = “RGB: 255–0–0” is a bright red, not a blood red. I suspect that the RGB is wrong. JDAWiseman (talk) 20:10, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Blood red ≠ #FF0000