Talk:British Sign Language

message: The artice had said that ISL was Israeli Sign Language, but no such Wikipedia article exists, and I could find no verification of this, so I removed it.  The Irish Sign Language article refers to it as ISL, so I'm gonna trust them on this one...  Blackcats 07:42, 29 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It appears to exist now... -- THE GREAT GAVINI {T|C|#} 08:26, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

text: The abbreviation is ambiguous. Both  Israeli Sign Language and Irish Sign Language are recognized by Ethnologue. Thnidu (talk) 21:31, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed dubious talk 

message: As from 2006, CACDP will offer a number of new BSL courses, including a (non-NVQ) certificated Level III course.
Should the article be amended to reflect this?
Beth78 19:39, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Learning BSL Section

message: I am hoping that some reader of this page may be able to find support or a reference for the use of the "wanker" gesture - to offset the claim that the image should be removed from wanker  made on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Wanker (2nd nomination) Jooler 12:09, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: W.....

message: The ASL article shits on the BSL article. The sheer disparity in the volume of text makes BSL look like a homeless orphan sitting on the wintery steps of a dukes house awaiting death or scraps of duck at a Christmas feast.
'Please sir a leg of chicken or brussel sprout 'tis awful cold'
'Away with the crighton. It is the work house or the embrace of the reaper for you.'
'But sir am i not a man?' 
etc etc if you see my point. So how do we bulk up BSL?  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 83.104.130.77 (talk) 17:50, August 20, 2007 (UTC) 
:This is because there has been a great deal more research into ASL than into BSL (or probably any other SL), starting with Stokoe's dissertation in the early 1950's and his (with Casterline & Cronebridge) Dictionary of American Sign Language in 1965. If you want to "bulk up" the BSL article, find some research you can add to it. Or learn how to do it and do some yourself! I wrote my dissertation on ASL. Thnidu (talk) 21:35, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I wouldn't mind helping to improve the article. As I am currently studying BSL, I have access to various material concerned with the language, and should be able to help with things linked to grammar and structure etc. Also know some about the history of the language and how it developed from using the hands as a counting system. Will dig out my old notes and see what I can put together.--NeilEvans 23:44, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

text: I have found a few other sources, and have added the relevant info into a new heading titled 'Linguistics'.  I also moved the info on relationships to other languages there.  pgdudda (talk) 04:13, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: How we can develop this article

message: The opening quote of "(published estimates range from 30,000 to 70,000 but it is likely that the lower figures are more accurate)" is ridiculous. If published estimates vary, then on what source is the writer basing their assertion that the lower figure is more accurate?? You can't just guess at this stuff. VonBlade 21:30, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You're right, so I've removed it. If it has been published estimates of between 30,000 to 70,000 people, than that is what should be stated in the article, unless another source can be procided that states otherwise.--NeilEvans 21:55, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The British Deaf Association's website says that the GP/Patient Survey 2009/2010 found "just over 100,000" deaf adult BSL users in the UK. (I can't find the page on the BDA website now, but I saw it today, 24th Jan 2011. I sent them a query asking for a clearer indication of the source. Maybe the reason I can't find their claim now is that they have just taken that page down??) The BDA page in question gave a link to this survey (http://www.gp-patient.co.uk/results/), but when I followed it I couldn't find any national statistics. The survey in question certainly asked the question "Are you a deaf person who uses sign language?" (You can find all the questions if you poke about long enough on the survey website - the site is not easy to use, though, and direct links to the page on which I saw the questions are not available.) If the figure of 100,000 deaf adult users of sign language was correct, it is much higher than the vague estimate of 50,000-70,000 which people have been quoting from each other for very many years. UBJ 43X (talk) 17:22, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Amount of deaf people

message: The fingerspelling chart given here is a mirror image* of the one on Waterfall Rainbows, with the color removed and the labeling changed. In case you are thinking "Both charts show the same thing, so obviously they'd be similar," look at details like the exact shape of the crease-line at the base of the palm in I, or the shape of the fingers in S.
The Wikipedia chart was posted by Cowplopmorris, who claims to be the author. I'm not saying he isn't, but I don't see any author credit on Waterfall Rainbows, and the clip art page there says "These images are not to be used commercially without prior permission of Waterfall Rainbows".
*  The mirroring is useful, since the chart at Waterfall Rainbows unaccountably depicts left-handed signing. One image, B, is not reflected; that BSL letter is symmetrical as a sign, Type 1 or possibly Type 2 in Robbin Battison's typology of two-handed signs,Battison, Robbin. 1978. Lexical borrowing in American Sign Language. Silver Spring, Md.: Linstok Press. , but the picture is not quite symmetrical; there is a crease at the left wrist in both charts. The images may have been taken individually from the clip art page.
Thnidu (talk) 22:43, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The :Image:Bsl.png states that it was made with the British Deaf Association's BDA Finger-spelling font;  this is a TrueType outline font and you'll find lots of diagrams that have been produced using this font.  —Sladen (talk) 23:09, 4 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is the fingerspelling chart really original? 

message: According to Wikipedia guidelines content should not be deleted until this has been agreed with the contributor. As a contributor to the BSL page, I have added a link to our website. Although we opperate a commercial service, our site offers free resources and is a useful learning aid to BSL students. Should anyone disagree with this entry I would be obliged if you could discuss this matter using this discussion board. Richard.weaver (talk) 19:18, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Please refrain from adding links to commercial sites, as per Wikipedia:External Links, and to websites that you are associated with, per Wikipedia:Conflict of Interest - MrOllie (talk) 19:22, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Links 

message: As part of an ongoing reformation of NVQ levels, the qualification formerly called BSL Level 4 is now called Level 6.   I've made a tiny change to the article to reflect this, but I'm not particularly knowledgeable about the new level 6 qualification.  RedTomato (talk) 12:39, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I notice in the section on becoming an interpreter that the text still refers to NVQ Level 4, which is a conflict with the preceding text. Shouldn't that be changed, or am I misunderstanding the changed NVQ levels? (I'm only bold when I'm pretty sure I'm right!) Thanks, Dave  (djkernen)|Talk to me|Please help! 17:00, 24 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  BSL NVQ level 4 is now level 6 

message: Regarding the current BSL fingerspelling chart: this is the standard depiction of BSL fingerpelling, in which the hands are shown as they are seen by the person doing the signing, with the palms visible. This makes the chart useful for students learning to fingerspell. We now need to add a second chart showing what you see when watching fingerspelling. What the viewer sees is quite unlike what this chart shows. The hands are half turned away from the viewer. Most of the visual detail takes place on the palm side of the hands, but the viewer sees only the backs and edges of the hands, which lack many of the visual details.
A second chart showing the letters as seen by the viewer would be helpful because it would go some way to explaining why so many people have real problems reading BSL fingerspelling. I am not sure that people are really aware of this reason. For example, it is common practice for people to create exercises for BSL students in which a font made up of letters shown from the palm side are used. Students enjoy reading this font because it is quite simple to read, and their confidence grows ... until they come back to class and are shocked and baffled by the difficulty of reading real-life fingerspelling. The current fonts are misleading because they make BSL fingerspelling look easy to read, when in fact it is very hard.
Is there anyone out there who could draw the BSL fingerspelt letters as seen by the viewer? I suspect it will be difficult to make E, I, O and U, and the letters L, M, N, R, T, V and Z, legible. Ideally the chart should include all the variant shapes that one meets too. And then is there someone who could turn those drawings into a computer font? UBJ 43X (talk) 10:17, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I have just now found a font for the fingerspelling alphabet of Australian Sign Language (Auslan) which shows the hands as seen by the viewer. It is almost the same as BSL fingerspelling - just the letters J, K and R seem slightly different. It is free to download for personal use at http://www.dafont.com/admangraphics-auslan.font. UBJ 43X (talk) 22:30, 29 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Need for a BSL fingerspelling chart that helps students learn to ''read'' fingerspelling 

message: I've done my best to clean up the out-of-date mess here but it feels hopeless. The whole thing needs to be done from scratch. I took out shamelessly self-promoting edits from commercial entities and I stamped out the needless and inaccurate smearing of CSWs. There's still no mention made of SASLI and their registration process. The whole thing read like it had been written by someone who qualified 20 years ago.
Finally, what on earth is this interpreter/CSW stuff doing on the main British Sign Language page anyway? I don't see the French page having an entry on French interpreters. As an interpreter, it was drummed into me throughout training that if there is one thing which does NOT define the BSL community, it's interpreters.
There are now multiple ways to qualify as an interpreter and NRCPD is not the be-all and end-all. What about language brokering, the history of interpreting, deaf interpreters, relay interpreting?
--Terpatron9000 (talk) 20:24, 26 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  So many problems with qualifications/interpreting/CSWs 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: "BSL users campaigned to have BSL recognised on a similar level to Welsh, Scottish Gaelic, and Irish."
Is this the best way of saying this? Those three languages have *very* different levels of recognition. Giving it the same level of recognition as Welsh, for instance, would give it the same level of recognition as English, making it a joint official language along with English and back that up with laws about its use by public bodies. 
Unless BSL users were/are campaigning for very different levels of recognition in different countries in the UK, then it doesn't really illustrate what BSL users were/are campaigning for.
Also, in the information box, it says that BSL is a recognised minority language in "Scotland, England, Northern Ireland", obviously deliberately leaving out Wales (rather than being a typical oversight). I can't find any references to this, so am inclined to also alter this.
Any thoughts before I alter the article?  Ceiniog (talk) 07:11, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Official Recognition

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Should "communication support worker" be apitalised? Not according to Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biography#Titles_of_people.  
All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 11:14, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Job titles CSW 

message: I want to learn English 62.89.210.60 (talk) 15:00, 11 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  English  

message: Hello all, I added an image to this page as part of a short-term paid project to share images of a year of culture that was held in Leeds. There's more on the project here and more images to make use of here. Many thanks Lajmmoore (talk) 11:45, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  New image