Talk:Jayadeva

message: Note:  Project Banner with Orissa workgroup parameters was added to this article talk page because the article falls under :Category:Orissa or its subcategories. Should you feel this addition is inappropriate , please undo my changes and update/remove the relavent categories to the article -- Amartyabag  TALK2ME 02:54, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[WP:INDIA]] Banner/Orissa Addition 

message: I am working on that article. Jayadeva is too important to be a single entry. Please don't merge it here. SDas (talk) 00:11, 4 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Works of Jayadeva

message: This is an interesting and important article but it needs editing and needs to be condensced.  Obviously Bhagat Jaidev was important, but this is a little to lauditory.  Needs references.  I have added it to the Sikhism template and done preliminary revisions, but more is needed.
Seth J. Frantzman 19:23, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: ====
Rich Farmbrough, 19:11, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Copied from redirect talk page

message: Jayadeva, Jayadeva in Sikhism and Jayadeva birth controversy all provide a POV position on his birthplace. Now it is likely correct but it is disputed. I'm not convinced that in a dispute between whether he was born in Orissa and Bengal we should use official Orissa government sources. See also the discussion at Wikipedia talk:Noticeboard for India-related topics#Jayadeva. Dougweller (talk) 05:49, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It is clearly wrong to assert in this main article that he was definitely born in Orissa, as we currently do. Providing a link to the "birth controversy" article is not some sort of get-out clause because it implies that we have made a determination of the controversy ourselves for the purpose of this main article. We are not permitted to make such determinations. For an extremely brief, tertiary overview, see page 212 of this. (Probably of no use as a source but it does succinctly demonstrate the issues). - Sitush (talk) 15:46, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: No. We can't use orissa government sources as reliable sources. The articles are written by information officers in the PR department of the government of Orissa, so they are not scholarly sources. On further research, it appears that the birthplace of Jayadeva is uncertain. The definitive work is that of Suniti Chatterjee who identified Kenduli, Bengal as his birthplace but, as this  source says, there are rival claims from Orissa and Mithila. I guess our article should say something along those lines (I can't work on it for a while). I agree with Sitush that linking to the controversy creates the impression that there is a controversy which is not correct. In scholarly work, all that there appears to be is some uncertainty and that is easily handled by a couple of lines in this article. --regentspark (comment) 16:23, 19 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The links provided by Orissa Review are not from the PR sources. People like Dr. Ajit Tripathy is a  doctorate in literature and he currently is the Election Commissioner of Odisha. Odisha government has also issued a stamp to commemorate Jayadeva. The work by Suniti Chatterjee cannot be taken as a basis for Jayadeva's birth place as it has long being rebuked by eminent scholars like Padmashri Satya Narayan Rajguru and others. So please stop glossing over the fact that he was born somewhere else and not in Kenduli Sasan, Orissa. Jayadeva is gitagovinda wrote that he was from Kendubilva. Kendu - means kendu tree and Bilva means Bel tree. It is very commonly seem near Kenduli Sasan in Puri where as there was no Kendu and Bel trees found near the place which is falsely claimed as Kenduli in Birbhum. Reference to Miller's cannot be given as it was written in the early 1980's and it was not scholarly. She didn't do a research on Jayadeva's origin.  --Arjyap (talk) 09:28, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: You need to read WP:NPOV. We can't state that this is a settled issue. And yo shouldn't remove sources onthe basis that you disagree with them. See WP:RS. The article needs to make it clear that there has been and is a dispute -we can't take sides. I have no stake in this at all - I'm not Indian and have no connections with Orissa or Bengal, I'm just trying to keep this article balanced. Dougweller (talk) 11:12, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV issues 

message: There doesn't seem to be anything in :Jayadeva in Sikhism that justifies its status as a separate article. That which is present can easily be incorporated into the main Jayadeva article. Sitush (talk) 17:23, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: This should be non-controversial,  and I'll do it tomorrow unless someone object/beats me to it.. In performing the merge it would be best to refer to the source directly rather than the Jayadeva in Sikhism article, since the former contains important qualifiers. Abecedare (talk) 17:39, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I've already merged them. --regentspark (comment) 18:36, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed merge with [[Jayadeva in Sikhism]] 

message: This is an established fact that Jayadeva was born in Puri, Odisha. Please let us not gloss over the fact. Sanskrit is very similar to oriya and not any close to bengali. Oriya was formed around 5-6 centuries ahead of Bengali. And that is a testimony. Jayadev's writings were Vaishnava as he referred to Lord krishna. Only after 15th century did Bengal saw Vaishnavism when there were already temples dedicated to Radha Madhava in Kenduli Sasan. Jayadeva was a Brahmin and a Sasan in a brahmin village. Hope it clarifies the myth spread by the stupid westerners.Aryadash (talk) 22:00, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It is not an "established fact" according to reliable sources and your own original research counts for nothing here. Please read the recent discussions above. - Sitush (talk) 12:14, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: That's not the way we work. Our articles reflect the work of sources that meet our criteria at WP:RS. We do not try to present our own evidence, that is against our policy of no original research as you've been told above. If you think any sources fail WP:RS you can raise them at WP:RSN. Dougweller (talk) 22:14, 6 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: In addition, we have the neutrality policy. This means that we need to reflect the opinions of all reliable sources as and when we find them. We cannot just ditch some because we do not like the things. Believe me, if we could then I would love it because I'd have a field day stripping out things that (in my opinion) are plainly daft across a whole range of articles. But then other people would think that what I consider to be plain daft is in fact the right thing. Like you, I am constrained by the community consensus and, however paradoxical it may seem, I agree with it. If you do not like the policy then you'll have to try to persuade the community to adjust it ... and like it or not, your chances of succeeding are somewhere around infinity + 1. - Sitush (talk) 02:09, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jayadeva was born in Puri, Odisha.  

message: Santoshdasandroid (talk) 11:09, 14 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Also, this is a direct copy-paste from http://odisha.gov.in/e-magazine/Orissareview/2008/feb-march-2008/engpdf/70-71.pdf Cannolis (talk) 11:42, 14 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 14 September 2015 

message: There is a separate article on Jayadeva birth controversy. This article already has a sourced statement which states that "Recent studies show scholars still disagree on the issue." That, with a list of proposed birthplaces is good enough for this article. An Odisha.gov.in e-magazine is not at all an acceptable source for asserting that Odisha is now unanimously or widely accepted as Jayadeva's birthplace. Besides, your edits have other problems such as unexplained removal of sourced content (e.g. the bit about Guru Granth Sahib) and addition of the irrelevant Odia script (Jayadeva was a Sanskrit poet, not an Odia poet; also see WP:INDICSCRIPT). utcursch | talk 17:35, 22 February 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: @Utcursch Looks like some editors have started pushing particular views regarding his birthplace controversy. Check out the recent edits. ThethPunjabi (talk) 00:53, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

text: I understand but there are also no unbiased references about the fact that jayadeva was a court poet of Sena dynasty or he has visited bengal at sometime, but how can you anyone state that 'Jaydeva was a Sanskrit poet, during the reign of Lakshman Sen – the 12th century king of Bengal'. A similar references I also can give to you please follow this link The History of Medieval Vaishnavism in Orissa by Prabhat Mukharjee. There are lot of confusions about birthplace and where he lives. Then we should remove everything in this article about his birth and where lived, why not we write everything about his work only and rest in a separate article, which would be better.  --sujit_km 04:23, 25 February 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sujit900's edits