Talk:Tira, Israel

message: I have generally found Petersen, Andrew (2001), A Gazetteer of Buildings in Muslim Palestine: Volume I (British Academy Monographs in Archaeology) to be very reliable. But on this town he has slipped, and provided a lot of references which are for Al-Tira (Ramla). I will list all the refs given, and try to find out if it checks out or not. Cheers, Huldra (talk) 23:20, 9 November 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, I thought so too,  but I would like order the stuff here a bit first.  Eg. it looks as if  he hasn´t had the  al-'Ulaymi -ed available;  typically, while  al-'Ulaymi write a lot about  Jaljulia, that is not reffed, (apparently he did not find the village under the name of  "Djaouliyeh")  while  completely irrelevant stuff like under Al-Qabu and  Qalansawe (=under a disscussion of head-gears; qalansawes!) ..is referenced. Huldra (talk) 20:09, 11 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Petersen, 2002, mix-up 

message: The reasons for the high crime rate articulated in the source, verbatim, as "Part of the problem in policing towns like Tira, according to police, is insufficient cooperation from local residents, who are often cowed by a culture of suspicion towards police and a pervasive fear that makes them highly reluctant to come forward and report crimes."
I have paraphrased this as "part of the problem lies with the local population who have a culture of suspicion towards police, resulting in underreporting of crime and lack of cooperation." This is accurate,  and there is no basis for removing that from the article. Inf-in MD (talk) 11:09, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Imagine that. You cited an article whose main theme is the lack of police protection and you cite it as the fault of the population. That's disgraceful. You also put in honor killings without any source that mentions honor killings in Tira.  What it says, not in relation to Tira, is "Arab leaders say Israeli police largely ignore the violence in their communities, everything from family feuds and mafia turf wars to domestic violence and so-called honor killings." You didn't think it was necessary to mention the Arab position. That's even more disgraceful. Zerotalk 12:33, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Imagine that! I cited an article whose topic and headline is crime in Tira- 'Tira man guns down restaurant owner, is then shot dead by pursuing cop', which give background info on the causes of high crime in Arab society, including Honor killing, and I include that in the article. Inf-in MD (talk) 13:13, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  You distorted the source. In your next attack on the article you took a single event from 18 years ago and turned it into a general problem in the present tense. More disgraceful editing. Zerotalk 14:28, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I did not distort the source, I quoted it nearly verbatim. That this is problem in Arab society in general is attested to in multiple sources. Inf-in MD (talk) 14:33, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  This is not an article about Arab society in general, and your opinion about Arab society is not admissible. Zerotalk 14:50, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: An article about murder in Tira mentioned that this was problem in Arab society, in general. That's not my opinion -  I quoted that. You objected in the spurious grounds that it didn't say it was a problem specifically in Tira, so I added an article that described a specific incident in Tira. Inf-in MD (talk) 14:59, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title: Crime

message: The earliest appearances I can find on maps are "Tiret" on an 1828 map by A. Arrowsmith, and "et-Tireh" on an 1843 map by  W. Hughes.  I can't find any text to support the first of these. The second probably comes from a mention by Robinson. Zerotalk 14:23, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Maps