Talk:Henry VI, Part 2

message: As y'all can see, I've done a small bit of work on the article! What I’ve done is pretty self explanatory really. I've reorganised it so that it's laid out correctly as per the standard layout of the WikiShakespeare project. I've added material everywhere. I've added some pictures, added a pretty thorough bibliography and added a couple of external links. I'm reading through the Oxford edition of Henry VI, Part 3 now, and then I'll do Henry VI, Part 1, so I'll probably pick up bits and pieces of info in them which I'll add here as I come across them. I'm pretty happy with how it's turned out, and as with The Two Gentlemen of Verona and The Taming of the Shrew, I welcome feedback. Bertaut (talk) 00:23, 22 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent edits 

message: I've made several changes to the page, most of which I hope will prove unobjectionable:
* Notes have been separated from citations.
* A citation style has been introduced that should make it easier to find the appropriate item in the list of secondary sources.
* Quotations have been compared with their originals and amended accordingly.
* Several new citations have been added.
* All citations have been templated and given sfnrefs; ISBN numbers, DOIs, URLs, &c., have been added where appropriate.
* I've removed several repetitious passages, some quotations and examples that appear superfluous, and words (mostly adverbs) that add little to the structure of the argument.
Alexrexpvt (talk) 17:05, 2 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Various Changes 

message: The articles on the three Henry VI plays are lengthy, and it seems superfluous to have the same material repeated in all of them. I've therefore deleted the material in italics below, and added a link to the identical material in the article on Henry VI, Part 1. Hopefully this streamlining of the article will meet with approval. NinaGreen (talk) 03:13, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Streamlining the article 

message: Dick: The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers.
I'm surprised that there's no analysis, nor even a simple mention of this line within the article, given that it's probably one of the few lines that anyone remembers from this play.  Anyone?  --24.212.139.102 (talk) 00:40, 3 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: That is probably the best known quote from the play to be sure, but in the grand scheme of things, it's not overly important in a thematic sense. Just because it's a well known line doesn't warrant inclusion of a discussion in the article. However, having said that, if you did want to add something backed up by adequate sources, go right ahead , perhaps in the language section. Bertaut (talk) 17:50, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I made a decision a long time ago not to get overly involved in wikipedia, having been bitten once too often, so I'll leave this to others. -- 24.212.139.102 (talk) 17:56, 5 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Fair enough. Sometimes, it's not the most pleasant place on earth. I'd give my right arm for a few more people who knew more about Shakespeare (or literature in general) than they do about the MOS or WP:THIS/WP:THAT! Bertaut (talk) 01:52, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  "... let's kill all the lawyers." 

message: This is my first time posting a comment/question on a Talk Page, so I apologize if my format is incorrect.
This article says, with respect to Margaret and Suffolk, that:
"Another minor source may have been William Baldwin's The Mirror for Magistrates (1559; 2nd edition, 1578), a series of poems spoken by deceased, controversial historical figures, who have come forward to speak of their life and death, and to warn contemporary society not to make the same mistakes as they did. One such figure is Margaret of Anjou, and Roger Warren argues that Shakespeare may have taken the inspiration for Margaret's sorrowful departure from Suffolk (which is found nowhere in Hall, Holinshed or Grafton) from this poem."
I am trying to track down the basis for this comment.  I cannot find anywhere that Roger Warren has argued that Mirror for Magistrates is a source for the relationship between Margaret and Suffolk.  Rather, he says (Oxford Shakespeare, Henry VI Part 2, page 32) that Mirror may have provided a partial source for the lament of Eleanor, the Duchess of Gloucester.  He further says, on the same page, that most likely Shakespeare used Mirror "to a much lesser extent" as a subsidiary source.
With respect to Margaret and Suffolk, Warren says (page 29) that there is no historical evidence that Margaret and Suffolk were lovers and that Shakespeare may have picked up the idea from a hint in Edward Hall's Union.
Does anyone know the basis for the above quote on Wikipedia?  Further, can anyone help me track down Roger Warren?  I thought he was at the University of Leicester, but do not see him on their website.  I wanted to ask him about this.  I am a doctoral candidate working on a thesis about the relationship between Samuel Daniel and Shakespeare and the source for the Margaret-Suffolk relationship is an important part of my thesis.
Musophilus (talk) 13:41, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi there. Your formatting is fine! I don't think you need worry too much about this, as it seem to be a simple case of incorrect information. So I'll delete it from the article. As regards contacting Warren, last I heard, he was in Leicester. It's very possible he's retired. The best thing to do would just be to contact the English department at the university, they'll be able to tell you exactly where he's hiding! Bertaut (talk) 01:16, 21 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Hey, there's no problem with you posting about this here. You might also try posting on the talk page of the Samuel Daniel article, although from the looks of it, there aren't too many Daniel enthusiasts/experts around these here parts! To be honest, I wouldn't really be able to give you anything you don't probably already know. I'm okay when it comes to who influenced Shakespeare, not so great when going in the other direction. As regards Daniel, I wouldn't know much about him beyond Shakespeare's use of Civil Wars as a source for parts of the Henriad. Perhaps  or  might be able to give you some advice. They'll both automatically be alerted that I've mentioned their names here, so if they have anything of interest for you, I'm sure they'll drop by. Bertaut (talk) 01:49, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Margaret and Suffolk 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Henry VI, Part 2. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.screenonline.org.uk/tv/id/527213/index.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100611183330/http://shakespeare.emory.edu/illustrated_index.cfm to http://shakespeare.emory.edu/illustrated_index.cfm
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I wonder if "the Duke of Somerset is killed by Richard" is perhaps ambiguous as to which Richard is being referred to, given that Richard was also the name of the Duke of York (as well as the first name of the real Salisbury and Warwick). A reader unfamiliar with the play, but aware of the history may in particular be confused as in reality York's son Richard (the later Richard III) whom Shakespeare has killing Somerset at St Albans was two years old at the time of the First Battle of St Albans and so did not actually fight at it (let alone kill a Duke...), but the other three Richards did. Thus I wonder if "the Duke of Somerset is killed by York's son Richard" would work better. Dunarc (talk) 21:35, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Good call. I've made the change. It's been a long time since I really looked at this page; could do with a bit of a rewrite in a few places. Bertaut (talk) 01:27, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  Thanks, I think it makes things clearer. Dunarc (talk) 21:18, 8 January 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Death of Somerset in synopsis 

message: I'm surprised that the article has no mention of the question of authorship, since many scholars believe there's a co-author.  Oxford Publications actually credits all 3 parts to Shakespeare and Marlowe. Carlo (talk) 15:17, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Authorship