Talk:Soldering

message: I removed the How-to section by User:216.138.194.68, since it was very long, concerned mostly/only with pipe soldering. If the user wishes to write a how-to (a good thing in itself!), I've suggested (on that user's talk page) that it should be in a Wikipedia:How-to article oa a Wikibook. --Janke | Talk 10:04, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

message: When soldering copper, brass, nickel, silver, etc. the solder joint is stronger, not weaker, than the surrounding metal. Also I'm not sure the term wetting applies to how the solder comingles with the metal at the joint.   —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.169.169.1 (talk) 01:16, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: The introduction doesn't make any sense

message: We might want to add a note about this: in the UK it tends to be soul-dering, whereas in the US it's sodder-ing, with  a silent L.  ProhibitOnions  (T) 15:27, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Does anybody know why that is? I've always said solder, but everybody else here says sodder. 205.174.22.28 23:18, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just to add to the confusion, I often hear it said (in NE USA) as if it were spelled saudering, or even sauldering.  To keep myself honest, I just rotate between all the pronunciations. human 23:19, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Pronunciation

message: The electronics section seems to be talking about through-hole components. There's nothing wrong with that, but we should point out that that's a (very) old technology....surface mount is completely dominant these days.
--
Surface mount is popular, however electronic technicians will frequently encounter through-hole, as hand soldering is an essential skill in the trade, its highly relevant. 124.149.50.202 (talk) 11:03, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Obsolete technologies

message: I think the melting temp of solder is below 450 F (not C as in the article). Comments??
This would be aout 232 C.Nicolem23 16:10, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think celsius degrees are OK. Although 200°C is around the melting point of most of the solders used in electronics, other solders exist with a much higher melting point. CyrilB 16:35, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: 60-40 Tin-lead solder has a melting temperature around 370 degrees F. What the article says is that any alloy that melts below 450 C is considered a solder, higher melting-point alloys are considered brazes. 60-40 Tin-lead certainly qualifies as a solder, melting at 370 F. Might not be a bad idea to clear that up if you'd like. Middlenamefrank 18:10, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  solder melting temp error? 

message: This article talks about solder as a filler, but in silver soldering there is never ANY gap between the two pieces to be joined - in fact any gap between the two will usually mean that the join will not be very good. I was once told that if I could see light through the gap between the two pieces, then the join was not tight enough.
Another issue is the silver content of silver solder. This article lists the silver content cutoff point at 40%, but I know for a fact that you can get it up to 76% silver content, and sometimes higher for specialist applications such as jewelery (I've known some jewelers to use pure silver as if it were solder, but that's a different kettle of fish).
Just wanted to know what people's views were on this. ▫Bad▫harlick♠ 00:12, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm an EE, so my real-life experience is from an entirely different professional position, but it looks to me like we're on the same page here. As the article says, the (rather arbitrary) cutoff point between 'soldering' and 'brazing' is 450 °C (842 °F). I see from the silver page that the melting temp of pure silver is 961.78 °C, or 1763.2 °F. That places it way beyond the 'soldering' threshold. I'm no expert on the formulations, especially given the inclusion of other elements (bismuth?, lithium??), but maybe 40% silver is pretty near to the 450C limit? So anything over 40% silver is TECHNICALLY silver brazing, not solding or 'hard soldering'? It doesn't sound like we're on different pages. A better structural joint (brazing) requires closer setup tolerances.Middlenamefrank 06:23, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've not heard of "hard soldering" referred to as "brazing", so I'm quite sure that there's a definition between the two that nobody has noticed yet. I can cite sources if need be - I'm pretty sure that 70% silver content solder and above is still considered solder and still has a fairly low melting point in relation to pure silver. Don't forget that it only takes a little bit of tin to reduce the melting point of a metal quite drastically. Even so, I don't quite agree that there is any kind of established cutoff point in temperature or silver content - even if there was an average level I don't see how we could verify such a claim. Metal generally doesn't seem to care about what someone else has decided - it'll still work as a solder whether someone agrees with it or not. :) ▫Bad▫harlick♠ 15:40, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

text:  Silver solder permeates the surrounding metal, much like how wood glue is absorbed by wood. This creates a bond that is actually stronger than the surrounding metal. Brazing is more like superglue, it just sits on the surface and sticks the two pieces together. Brazing is much weaker than soldering, but unlike soldering it can be used to fill gaps. Grauenwolf (talk) 20:53, 23 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Solder as a filler?

message: It would be good to add something about "no clean" fluxes.  With their wire use it seems appropriate to have information about them here. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Schneimn (talk • contribs) 20:35, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Look at the middle paragraph in the "flux" section. It says "no-clean" fluxes are available and oftentimes perfectly adequate, but might not give sufficient performance in a poorly-controlled, non-production environment. What else would you like to say about them?  Middlenamefrank 02:52, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  The Kester web site and other source say cleaning of rosin-based flux residue is optional and only for appearance; that the residue is non-conductive unless the equipment runs hot enough to melt the residue (over 70 C). --Wtshymanski 17:46, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I thought removal of non-activated fluxes (R) was optional, but activated (RA) and mildly-activated (RMA) fluxes required removal. Not true?  Middlenamefrank 19:23, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Additional Flux Information 

message: WP:NOT says under  Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information  that Wikipedia is not an instruction manual.  A tutorial on how to make a soldered connection is part of a Wikibook, not the Wikipedia.  An encyclopediac article must avoid second-person address and should not have the flavor of a how-to guide. --Wtshymanski 17:46, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's a good point. Should we just scrap the 'how-to' sections? If we're going to do that I'd rather move them somewhere and link to them, since I think a fair number of people looking up 'soldering' want to know how to do it. Do you know if there is a wikibook entry somewhere for soldering? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Middlenamefrank (talk • contribs) 19:25, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: How-to not an encyclopedia article

message: Has anyone noticed that the section on stained glass soldering has absolutely nothing to do with stained glass? 75.5.180.33 14:40, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stained Glass 

message: I am certainly in a conflict-of-interest situation, so I would like others to judge the value of the content available at this link:
Video and Joint Gallery A 7 minute overview video, large gallery of good and bad joints, and list of references to other guides.
The site is commercial, but this page is mostly encyclopedic in nature with an attempt to provide references for almost all claims.
CuriousInventor (talk) 14:00, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for being upfront with your conflict of interest, and discussing it here instead of persistently re-adding the link; all unlike some other contributors. This is definitely in the spirit of wikipedia. I've no personal opinion about the site, but I want to thank you for handling the matter so nicely. --Rifleman 82 (talk) 14:08, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  External Link for Consideration 

message: Please define "joint". Thank you. --64.149.33.236 (talk) 07:02, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Look it up in a dictionary. Wizard191 (talk) 15:31, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Solder Joint 

message: Please don't put that nonsense about minerals coating the lead making it safe back in. It's an urban legend and one which contributes to the misuse of lead based solders on potable systems. Yes, this does happen which is why lots of people still have lead in their supply without suffering ill effects, but it doesn't always work that way and that's why lead is banned. Water companies can change the composition of the water at will, without notification which they are perfectly entitled to do and in practice, actually do, do which will disturb the coatings and put lead back in the supply. It also does not always occur, sometimes the coating doesn't happen due to the water composition and then you get people with lead poisoning. If it was safe then lead would not be banned. 82.132.139.212 (talk) 11:06, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lead Based Solder in Potable Systems 

message: To the Softsoldering the temperature is under 450ºC, hardsoldering 450ºC to 900ºC, high temperature soldering more than 900ºC. 
To the European International Welding Engineers in Germany at least.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.226.117.77 (talk) 10:04, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Temperature

message: Someone should add a bit on tinning and how to remove oxides off the tip 'WITHOUT' sanding which destroys the plating.--Ericg33 (talk) 03:57, 25 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Possibly, the question is where without disrupting the flow of the article.  It is also not true in the general case - many larger irons use unplated bits.  The article is careful to portray soldering in the round rather than solely electronics assembly and we need to preserve that generality. Crispmuncher (talk) 11:22, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

text: I agree with the last post and the generality needs to be preserved. However, I find the entire article unorganized and confusing. I think the problem is that soldering is used in many sectors, for example the soldering one does for pipe work is different from the soldering in the PCB manufacturing sector. They are both soldering but the tools used for the process are very different and in some cases what applies to the pipe work, would be unthinkable to a PCB soldering operator, ESD protection being a good example.--Aisart (talk) 22:29, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tinning and caring for tip 

message: I have heard this is possible because tin erodes chrome and iron.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ericg33 (talk • contribs) 07:32, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: First of all, there are two kind of soldering tips, plated and unplated. 
* Bulleted list item
Unplated tips are basically bare oxygen free copper that gets heat. The problem is that copper oxidizes with the oxygen in the air and if put at a higher temperature, the oxidation will happen very rapidly. To complicate matters further, Tin dissolves copper and the higher the temperature, the faster the dissolution rate will be. These are the kind of tips where you hear people using sandpaper or a file to sharpen and clean.
* Bulleted list item
Plated tips have a copper core that is protected by a thin (from 70 up to 300 microns) layer of iron that protects the copper from the air and tin. While the iron reduces the thermal effectiveness of the solder tip it also extends its life as tin takes much longer to dissolve the iron layer. However, the main factor that destroys a tip is mechanical wear. The friction to run the tip up and down the pad or touching the component will eventually create cracks and spots where the tin will enter into direct contact with the copper, and that will eventually create a hole, just like a cavity that will get larger until the tip breaks down.
Therefore keeping this sort of tips tinned, will extend their life considerably, anywhere from 10% to 50%.
* Bulleted list item
Your mention of chrome is incorrect. Chrome actually repels tin and does not allow it to bond to its surface. That is why is generally plated on areas where one does not want solder to stay (ie: the upper part of the tip).--Aisart (talk) 23:00, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tin Solder ruins iron tips? 

message: Diff I have put the page back to its state before Ebnpebnp made major changes. A quick look at the first reference did not show support for the statement that "Soldering appears to be a hot glue process, but it differs from gluing in that the filler metals alloy with the workpiece at the junction to form a gas- and liquid-tight bond."
In particular, I found no mention of "hot glue" in the reference, nor any mention of the filler metal forming an alloy with the surface material of the workpiece. It is possible that I missed that, so pointing it out will be appreciated. __ Just plain Bill (talk) 20:14, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Major change? 

message: The section on lead free soldering says that it is a 'common misconception' that lead soldering requires more heat than leaded. I can't find anything in the cited reference to support this, and as someone who works in the industry I can say that we certainly use higher temperatures in the non-leaded process.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.241.230.158 (talk) 10:45, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lead free soldering temperature 

message: A discussion is taking place to address the redirect :Reballing. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 July 10#Reballing until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  pandakekok9 (talk) Junk the Philippine anti-terror law! 08:37, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Reballing" listed at [[Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion|Redirects for discussion]] 

message: I pulled out most of the application-specific material out of the old “Processes” section, and renamed it “Soldering vs. Brazing”, since the remaining material in that section is concerned mostly with that. The section still remains a bit of a mess, unfortunately. My interest is mainly with electronics soldering, and I’m not knowledgeable enough to compare and contrast soldering across diverse applications. I also renamed “Tools” to “Heating methods”. I feel that, aside from the heating methods, tools are (mostly) specific to the application and process, and does not benefit from consolidation in a single section. Material on application- and process-specific tools were moved to their respective sections.
DriveByWriter (talk) 19:02, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title: March 2021 edits

message: Please provide some information about soldering materials. 2409:4063:211E:50BB:B382:CFB1:BC02:4504 (talk) 14:41, 1 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Soldering 

message: Hans-Joachim Peter: Handbook of Inductive Soldering, Hans-Joachim Peter Verlag Berlin, 2017, ISBN 978-3-00-064582-2 (www.induktionsloeten-peter.de/en) Hansjoa (talk) 15:15, 14 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Literature