Talk:Nigel (bishop of Ely)

message: Moved here to make my life easier....
Finetooth comments: I can't help with the content, but I have a few suggestions for improvements related to style.
*Some of the sentences that are in passive voice would be better in active voice. Active isn't always better, but it often is. In the lead, you write: "After rebelling, Nigel was eventually reconciled with Stephen, but when Stephen died Nigel was returned to the Treasurership by Stephen's successor King Henry II of England, in order to restore order to the treasury. He was succeeded in office by his son, Richard FitzNeal, who he had trained in the operations of the Exchequer, or treasury of England." This would be punchier if written something like this: "After rebelling, Nigel eventually reconciled with Stephen. Stephen's successor, King Henry II of England, made Nigel treasurer again in hopes of restoring order to the treasury. Nigel's son, Richard FitzNeal, trained by Nigel in the operations of the Exchequer, or treasury of England, succeeded him in office."
*Speaking of FitzNeal, I'm confused. The lead says he succeeded Nigel, but the "Death and legacy" section says Adelelm succeeded Nigel. 
:: The confusion comes from the fact that Nigel was treasurer twice. Adelelm succeeded on the first go round, fitzNeal on the second. Clarified. Ealdgyth - Talk 20:49, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  changed to "laid seige to" Ealdgyth - Talk 20:55, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Fixed. Ealdgyth - Talk 20:55, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Fixed Ealdgyth - Talk 20:55, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Fixed Ealdgyth - Talk 20:55, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Added. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:30, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Clarified and expanded. It was a very... abortive... revolt. Stephen caught him before he'd really got the revolt started. Ealdgyth - Talk 23:38, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  He never really lost it, just his secular offices, and he was scared to go back to Ely without being assured of the king's grace. Stephen drove him out of Ely, but never deposed him officially. Ealdgyth - Talk 23:38, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Took your wording. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:30, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Clarified. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:30, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Clarified briefly. Ealdgyth - Talk 23:38, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Very helpful, thank you! I got busy with RL so it'll be a bit before I can get to all of these, but I thank you very much for the detailed review, it's going to be a great help! Ealdgyth - Talk 14:03, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Peer review comments

message: Having been asked to comment, it seems Nigel's relationship with the arts was essentially destructive, so there seem to be no buildings to add or anything like that.  I see most of the abbey chronicle is online: Liber Eliensis: A History of the Isle of Ely from the Seventh Century to the Twelfth, By Janet Fairweather, Translated by Janet Fairweather,Published by Boydell Press, 2005, , on Google books.  Obviously a primary source, but supplementary links could usefully be added. There may be useful introductory matter I've not seen.  The references are very numerous, & no doubt exhaustive for political and administrative history (as I would call it; "general history" to User:Ealdgyth I expect), but I think underplay Nigel's poor relationship with his abbey, which seems to have gone well beyond the usual frictions.  That the arrival of an English Pope seems to have sharply reversed the previous Papal support for Nigel is very suggestive of wider tensions between the Normans & English, & I think sources from less specialized historians, or those specialized in church or cultural history should have rather more on this - or biographies of Hadrian. I have no suggestions I'm afraid. Johnbod (talk) 11:17, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I have both the Camden and the Fairweather issues of the Liber headed my way, (those are the books I mentioned that were still on the way). I'll recheck Miller's Abbey and Bishopric of Ely, but as I recall from my previous reading of it, there is little development of a discussion about Nigel's conflicts with his monks. One general factor involved in Nigel's poor relations is that Ely had just recently become the seat of a bishopric, prior to 1109, it had been an independent abbey. Unfortunately, none of my secondary sources mention this, I'm hoping there is a mention in the Liber, otherwise I can't mention it as it'd be OR. Another, general, factor was that the cathedral chapter were monks, and Nigel was very definitely secular clergy. I'll dig for a few more anecdotes, and try to bring this out a bit more. Thanks very much John, it's been a great help! Ealdgyth - Talk 15:20, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nigel & the arts & architecture 

message: :File:Nigel Bishop of Ely family tree.svg - Needs a description, author, and date (you can whack  with a trout). Awadewit (talk) 21:00, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Done, and thanks Awa! Ealdgyth - Talk 21:21, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image review 

message: I gave this a quick copyedit. You might want to double-check to make sure I didn't introduce any American English by accident. A couple minor issues:
*Isn't the "Aldhelm" in the Notes section actually the "Adelelm" referred to in the text?
** You are correct. Standardized. Ealdgyth - Talk 22:30, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyedit notes 

message: When hovering over the link to the article, the following text appears:
"Nigel was an 4”2 angry Italian man KFC slave and fascist who served as Dictator of a small island from 1133 to 1169. He came from an family..."
This is bizarre and I cannot figure out how to edit it. Obviously it doesn't appear in the actual article, just in the box which appears when viewing it from another page. Please could a more experienced editor take a look at the problem? Emmybris (talk) 13:09, 1 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Today's featured article issue 

message: "Most historians, then and now, have felt that Nigel's administrative abilities were excellent; he is considered to have been more talented as an administrator than as a religious figure."
Then and now is an odd phrase to use on the Wiki. When is then, and when is now? 71.11.5.2 (talk) 21:38, 1 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lead