Talk:Carnedd Gwenllian

message: So the name is to be changed and we have in the article a brief explanation of why, but what is the origin of the original name please? Old Man of Storr (talk) 15:48, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Name

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The article currently says 'On 26 September 2009 the summit was officially renamed Carnedd Gwenllian'.  Clearly it has been renamed – I don't dispute that.  But what does 'officially' mean in this context?  Who decided that it should be renamed?  It wasn't the Princess Gwenllian Society – they campaigned for the rename, but were evidently not able to make the change unilaterally.  Was it the Ordnance Survey who made the decision?  Yes, they decided to update their maps map, but usually they only follow established or official usage.  Does that suggest another body such as Gwynedd Council were the party who made the decision?  (The mountain summit is in Gwynedd, just, though the border with Conwy is barely a hundred metres from the summit.)  That said, I note the BBC News article does not use the word 'officially'.  I also question whether the decision was really made on 26 Sept.  That's the date of the BBC's article, which may be days or weeks after the event.  Based solely on the current source, which I fully accept may not be telling the full story, a more accurate statement might be 'In September 2009, the Ordnance Survey agreed to change the name of Carnedd Uchaf to Carnedd Gwenllian on their maps.'  – 22:04, 24 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Based on this article from 24 September, which uses the past tense ('has been renamed'), I have changed the date to just 'In September 2009'.  (Also, that article does use the word 'officially', while also acknowledging the OS 'does not have the authority to alter place names', thus suggesting it was a decision by some other body.) – 22:12, 24 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  I see that the BBC report says that; The Ordnance Survey (OS) agreed to put Gwenllian on the map after a campaign by the society and consultation with groups such as the National Trust and Snowdonia National Park Authority. which rather lends support to the suggestion above that the word 'officially' be removed. If the name of a street had been changed for example then there is a process to be followed and an 'authority' which must sanction it, so that would be 'official'. But when it comes to mountains, being natural features, there is no 'official' body, there are landowners (the NT in part in this case) and then there are statutory agencies (SNP amongst others in this case) which will deploy the commonly used names or indeed make up their own names for their own purposes and then there is the OS whose policy over the years has been to seek evidence in the neighbourhood for the names of things (witness the OS 'names books' of old). There is also in this case a campaigning body who have used the term 'official renaming ceremony' in their news item but I think that's arguably a partisan description rather than one which is strictly accurate. Unless someone can demonstrate to the contrary, then we might reasonably assume that no 'official' name change has taken place but that certain key parties have agreed between themselves that a new name be applied, a change which (for all we know, and congrats to the Princess Gwenllian Society in this) has been accepted by the public at large. I'm therefore removing that word cheers Geopersona (talk) 06:29, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  'Officially' renamed