Talk:Ascending cholangitis

message: Why is this article named Ascending cholangitis? It is not the most common use (googling ascending cholangitis gives ~50.000 results, compared to cholangitis, which gives more than 700.000).
Besides, "ascending" isn't even mentioned in the article itself!
I suggest a move. Mikael Häggström 09:36, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Never mind. There were other causes of cholangitis than ascending cholangitis. Thus another article is now created of cholangitis. Mikael Häggström 10:15, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 

message: Given the patchy nature of the literature on this condition, it will be very hard to populate sections on "epidemiology", "prognosis" and "history". Kinney's article doesn't mention those.
For the purposes of history, we can say a word or two about Charcot and Reynolds, whose triad and pentad respectively made quite a lot of impact on the recognition of this illness, but otherwise there's really not an awful lot to say. JFW | T@lk 16:41, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: What a surprise:  JFW | T@lk 16:56, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The hard bit 

message: It says that hypotension and confusion are also characteristic symptoms, but later in the article it is revealed that even the 'Charcot's triad' is now becoming a rare finding, and that the Reynold's pentad (which includes these two symptoms) is further rare to find. So, would be alright to not quote them as at least "characteristic symptoms"?
Can the portion be changed to something like this: "Characteristic symptoms include jaundice, fever and abdominal pain. Low blood pressure and confusion may develop with worsening of condition (or developing shock)."
I have not made these changes myself as I'd be afraid that, doing so shouldn't upset or offend you in any way. If you're alright with my making changes, I'll make them now on, and of course you can revert them if they are not agreeable with you.
Regards.
—KetanPanchaltaLK 09:41, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I have improved this. JFW | T@lk 18:06, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The lead 

message: I don't know if my threshold would be considered low, but, I believe the article is in a very good shape now. May be we can elaborate a bit on pathogenesis, (and hence, the risk factors) of this condition as well as the gallstones. Congratulations to JFW!
Regards.
PS: I am making this comment after going carefully through the entire article.
—KetanPanchaltaLK 11:13, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd agree it's looking a lot better now due to the work both you and Jfdwolff have put into it! I'd say it's probably a B class now, needs a bit more work before becoming GA, though :) Regards, CycloneNimrod talk?contribs? 15:06, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: GA? We've only been going for two days! I'm sure that with some ongoing improvements we'll reach GA in the course of next week, but I need you guys to double-check my edits and make suggestions for improvements. JFW | T@lk 20:17, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Haha, JFW I wasn't suggesting we put it up for a nom now ;) Of course it needs more work. I'll try and get working on this soonish. Regards, CycloneNimrod talk?contribs? 20:24, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Short comment 

message: I've found another journal article(its not free). It has some additional information on risks and data about what % of cholangitis is caused by tumours.
 Definitions, pathophysiology, and epidemiology of acute cholangitis and cholecystitis: Tokyo Guidelines
I'll try add any relevant information in it.Ziphon (ALLears) 08:00, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, the Tokyo guidelines are part of a whole series of articles. The problem is that the article is also not free, and it reflects on pracice in Japan where bile duct stones often do not originate from the gallbladder but develop in situ for some reason. JFW | T@lk 08:23, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

text: The good thing is that SpringerLink displays all the references! We might be able to snatch the more important ones (e.g. the ones reporting mortality in cholangitis). JFW | T@lk 08:25, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Such as , , . JFW | T@lk 08:30, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Feel free to add this. Perhaps a new section called "Causes". JFW | T@lk 09:47, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

text: I have moved the addition to a section called "causes" and changed it to prose. Bulleted lists are generally discouraged (see Wikipedia:MOS#Bulleted and numbered lists). JFW | T@lk 10:03, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Could I ask you to write a "prognosis" paragraph? Having reviewed the three papers above I think it would be more useful to cite the conclusions from the Tokyo paper on mortality predictors of poor outcome. JFW | T@lk 10:07, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  Does it look alright Ziphon (ALLears) 12:35, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Perfect. I've made some pedantic changes :-). Perhaps we ought to clarify the meanings of respiratory failure, myocardial ischaemia etc. JFW | T@lk 14:45, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  another article 

message: Excellent work JFW as usual! One thing... the cholangiogram clearly shows a naso-biliary drain so it's technically not an ERCP. I will work on the article when I get a chance. JC Petit 05:57, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Kinney doesn't mention this use of a nasobiliary drain. Have you got another source? JFW | T@lk 09:20, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The drain was probably put in prior to ESWL of the large stone (the cholangiogram shows a monster of a stone for which mechanical lithotripsy would be challenging).  You can't see most stones on ultrasound prior to ESWL, so you leave a nasobiliary drain to do a cholangiogram in order to target the stone. JC Petit 04:32, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Can I also give a significant chunk of the credit to Ziphon and KC Panchal? JFW | T@lk 11:40, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Of course.  The article looks brilliant, everyone did a fabulous job. JC Petit 04:32, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Great work JFW

message: Interesting to see that the Kinney article has been already cited so many times that the reference section has exhausted the entire alphabet. Hope we don't have to cite it one more time!
—KetanPanchaltaLK 14:18, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm. I'll have no qualms citing it again if needed. It is a rather good article for our purposes. JFW | T@lk 14:54, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It's okay, we still have plenty of characters left for use if we decide to cite it more ;) Regards, CycloneNimrod talk?contribs? 17:51, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  A to Z 

message: Due to the use of ERCP as a diagnostic as well as a therapeutic modality, there is presently some overlap wrt description of this technique. I have no real problems with this, but it may warrant some reshuffling. JFW | T@lk 06:41, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Duplication 

message: After JC Petit's expert expansion of the "treatment" section (I totally forgot to mention lithotrypsy) I am convinced that we ought to submit this baby for WP:GAC before the end of the MCOTW cycle. JFW | T@lk 06:41, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: In my (very limited) experience, an article takes correct direction towards finer improvements only after being nominated. So, we can nominate it. As it is, right now quite a few users are concentrating on the article—Ziphon, JC, Cyclonenim, yourself, and myself—so as and when recommendations are made, we can make appropriate corrections (almost round the clock). So, I think we can indeed nominate it at the earliest (may be even right now). —KetanPanchaltaLK 10:41, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

text: All the best and thanks! —KetanPanchaltaLK 14:42, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: When to go for GA

message: I asked Dr Kinney to have a look at our current version. He was very positive, and only made the following remark:
:The one comment i would make is that under the treatment section, you discuss antibiotics as the primary therapy, and suggest that "The above treatment may prove ineffective in about 15% cases."  Drainage via ERCP is really the primary treatment and antibiotics are used to temporize and treat any systemic complication of infection.  While antibiotics are of course used, they are secondary to drainage as the primary therapy.
I will try to revise this today, probably using his own review. JFW | T@lk 06:38, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: That's certainly very encouraging. So, we're on the right track. —KetanPanchaltaLK 10:57, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  I have rephrased a sentence or two. JFW | T@lk 17:57, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dr Kinney says hi 

message: doi:10.1136/gutjnl-2013-305039 is a primary study suggesting that cholangitis is a strong predictor of upper gastrointestinal malignancy within the next 6 months. We're going to see this is secondary sources soon. JFW | T@lk 11:50, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cancer risk