Talk:Árpád Pusztai

message: * Have marked this as NPOV disputed, since there seems to be very little reference to disagreements with Pusztai's work that actually have some factual basis to them, and the article just reads in such as way as to seem a bit polemic.
***I totally agree. This article reads like a stump speech.
...  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.121.141.78 (talk) 03:26, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: NPOV

message: A POV tag was added to this article more than two years ago. As I can see no evidence of any actualy POV dispute, I am removing it. If there are POV problems they must be fixed, not left in the article as justification for a badge of shame. Hans Adler 20:06, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The major problem I see with this article is that it is close to being a coatrack. The discussion of one event takes up more than three quarters of the article. It should definitely get a mention, but in my opinion the majority of the GM potato controversy section should go in its own article or be merged into Genetically modified food controversies (where it is already mentioned). AIRcorn (talk) 20:18, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Good point. It was a life-changing event and is his main claim to notability, but as a scientist he is only a borderline case of WP:BLP1E, and the event happened when he was 67 or 68. If we can find enough material for a genuine biography that covers most of his career, we can move some of the material about the controversy elsewhere and leave a summary here. Otherwise we should probably rename this article. Hans Adler 21:58, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: My preferred action would be to keep this article as Arpad Puztai but merge all the GM potato controversy data to Genetically modified food controversies#Pusztai potato controversy. Then to write maybe two paragraphs summarising the controversy here using a main template linking to the merged info. The potato, monarch butterfly, Starlink and maybe some other major controversies could then later be forked into there own article if necessary by some brave soul. AIRcorn (talk) 21:53, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The effect of that will be to move a large chunk of text from a short article into a relatively long article. I am not sure that's the best approach. Hans Adler 23:21, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: True, but there will be some replicated text we can remove and it may be possible to make it more concise in the process. Another option is to create a new article called Genetically modified potato controversy and link to it from both. Either way, I will start looking for some background info on Puztai to try and flesh out this bio. If I can't find anything we may as well just rename this article. AIRcorn (talk) 00:53, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

text: Have just added what I could find about his life before the controversy. AIRcorn (talk) 02:14, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that the article is currently a coatrack and that it should be dealt with in the GMO controversy article, summarised and linked to from here. Smartse (talk) 17:02, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

text: Although the prefered option would be to move this to the Genetically modified food controversies article I think it's best to give the controversy it's own article and link from both. The current section in Genetically modified food controversies article is very pro GM and if this text is transfered there it would likewise be heavily edited to introduce weasel wording to soften the criticism.Wayne (talk) 06:20, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

text: Judging by the differences between the text in this article and in the GMO article there certainly seems to be room for further expansion which could explain both sides of the story. I'm not sure whether a separate article would be best, or to make a genetically modified potato article, similar to the genetically modified tomato one where we could cover everything like amflora as well. Smartse (talk) 10:14, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Got bold and went ahead and moved the bulk of the GM controversy to Pusztai affair.AIRcorn (talk) 11:47, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV tag 

message: In this article on Pusztai, the following text describes the process leading up to the publishing of Pusztai's letter in the Lancet:
"...was seen by six reviewers - three times the usual number. Five gave it the green light to be published in The Lancet, the only reviewer arguing against publication was Prof John Pickett of the government funded Institute of Arable Crops Research. After consulting with the Royal Society, Pickett broke the protocols of peer review by publicly attacking the Lancet for agreeing to publish the paper.[12].."
There are no references quoted for any of the above text (Reference 12 is the Pusztai letter in the Lancet).  
I found an article Scientists revolt at publication of 'flawed' GM study in the Independent newspaper at the time which says the referees (the article does not say how many but quotes from three) "..found the study to be defective in design, execution and interpretation."  It claims the Lancet editor faced a revolt by the referees unless the editor made it clear that the study was "... deeply flawed and its conclusions highly speculative and unsubstantiated..."  I suppose that is what the Lancet editor Richard Horton did in his covering note Genetically modified foods: “absurd” concern or welcome dialogue? when he wrote "Ewen and Pusztai's data are preliminary and non-generalisable." 
 
In my view, the Independent article paints a different viewpoint on the attitude of the referees to what is now in this Wikipedia Pusztai article.  Does anybody have a disagreement with me re-writing this part of the Pusztai article along the lines of the article in the Independent and Horton's note in the Lancet?
SylviaStanley (talk) 12:42, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: According to this in Science the paper was reveiwed by six, with one publically opposing the paper, another thought it was flawed, but wanted it published "to avoid suspicions of a conspiracy against Pusztai and to give colleagues a chance to see the data for themselves" while the other four raised questions that were addressed by the authors. AIRcorn (talk) 13:25, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pusztai Lancet Letter - Peer Reviews 

message: "He is a world expert on plant lectins" was changed to "He is the world's leading expert on plant lectins" with the summary this is how he is described by most sources. To label anyone as the leading expert in anything would require some pretty strong evidence from their peers and even then should only be used cautiously. As this calls him a world expert, I would suggest changing it back. AIRcorn (talk) 00:16, 25 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I had a look at what he is called. A search finds 1870 hits for "world's leading expert", 540 for "world's foremost expert" and 400 for "world expert" which also includes "the world's expert". We are probably safe saying "world's leading expert" considering there are likely very few experts in the field.Wayne (talk) 08:28, 25 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  World's leading expert 

message: Are we sure he was a protein scientist? This from 2006 in The Independent calls him a nutritionist and that fits in with what his papers were about and what the aim of the Rowett Research Institute is. SmartSE (talk) 15:45, 25 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Pusztai has a degree in Chemistry, a BS in Physiology and a PhD in Biochemistry. His specialty is the interaction of biologically active compounds, such as lectins, proteins, enzymes, enzyme inhibitors and probiotics with the gut. He worked in the Protein Research Department at the Rowett for 36 years. Wayne (talk) 21:14, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

text: You could call him a biochemist I suppose (then we can wikilink it). Isn't that essentially what a protein scientist is? That could also cover nutritionist. It looks like he spent a lot of time isolating lectins early in his career and studied their nutritional effects on mammals later from the linked papers. AIRcorn (talk) 06:29, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

text: Pusztai calls himself a nutritionist.  He argues in several web sites that many of the scientists who criticise his work are not qualified to do so becaue they are not nutritionists like himself.SylviaStanley (talk) 12:19, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Changed protein scientist to Biochemist and added nutritionist AIRcorn (talk) 05:12, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks SmartSE (talk) 11:19, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protein scientist? 

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message: There is a missing word, (or possibly words) at the start of the last line of this section, immediately after the word "their". I suspect the word is probably marriage, but would like confirmation. Editrite! (talk) 07:28, 30 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Life and career