Talk:Kerry Bolton

message: I write as a query here as to whether Kerry Bolton had grown up in Australia (specifically in western suburban Sydney) before he attended Lower Hutt College.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.59.30.198 (talk) 15:07, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origin and Youth 

message: Isn't being far right inconsistent with being conservative? Just as Nazis were radical and national 'socialist', and right wing, and not in any sense conservative.119.224.91.84 (talk) 07:02, 22 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Conservative? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Several facts cast doubt on the assertion that Kerry Bolton has a doctorate from a recognised (or accredited) university. 
These assertions should be sourced in line with wikipedia's BLP guidelines.
First: If the doctorate was conferred in 2006, as claimed here, then the dissertation should be registered on publicly accessible thesis databases. I have been unable to locate his dissertation in any such database.
This could be resolved by naming the university at which the doctorate was conferred, and/or naming the subject's doctoral supervisor, as is standard for academic biographies. A link to a university library catalogue which holds the dissertation would verify this.
(Note: I am not disputing that the book mentioned is in fact published. It has been, by Renaissance Press; only the assertion that this book was accepted as a doctoral thesis by a recognised university cannot be verified.)
Second: Even the subject's own website, kerrybolton.com, is slippery about his exact qualifications, saying only: "Kerry Bolton (b. 1956) has certifications and doctorates in theology, social work studies, psychology, and Ph.D. honoris causa."
Anyone who has in fact earned a doctorate is unlikely to mention it in one breath with minor certifications like this. 
Again, there is no mention here of the institution which conferred either doctorate — honorary or otherwise. This is highly irregular for an academic biography. In fact, usual practice is to name the awarding institution immediately after the qualification.
Third: There is no mention (in this article) of any undergraduate study that would qualify the subject to undertake doctoral research. As far as I am aware, Hutt Valley Technical College is a high school.
Fourth: Elsewhere, regarding his academic qualifications, Kerry Bolton asserts in an interview ( http://wermodandwermod.com/newsitems/news090120120102.html ) that he holds a doctorate in religious studies and an honorary doctorate "from an eminent Asian institution." This sounds suspicious; anyone with any sort of doctorate, especially an honorary one, names the institution where it was conferred.
The exact nature of the subject's academic qualifications must be clarified. If related claims cannot be verified, or if the granting institution is an unaccredited institute of higher education, any reference to a "doctoral dissertation" should be removed, as it may suggest greater academic credibility than is warranted.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Josip888 (talk • contribs) 02:58, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I've checked the reference and it appears that whole sentence is dubious. It turns out the thesis info was added by Bolton, who is not a reliable source for anything - not even himself. -- haminoon (talk) 08:04, 3 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Doctorate 

message: This article has been turned into a nice little hagiography. Perhaps some more eyes might want to consider this. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇  21:25, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV 

message: Over the past few days I have contributed new material to this page, and in some cases corrected biased and factually incorrect and misleading statements about Kerry Bolton. The material I have contributed, has today been removed by admin "Jpgordon". I have received no explanation for the removal of the content I have contributed, or any clarification as to why none of my edits have been acceptable to this Wikipedia admin. Admittedly, I am new to Wikipedia, but if this is an example of the way Wikipedia ensures "neutrality" (let alone encouraging user participation) I can only assume that it does not extend to those branded "Nazis" by Wikipedia Admins !! 
Karlwinn (talk) 05:32, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Your assumption is correct, inasmuch as Nazis are given short shrift around here, and there's no way to be neutral about Nazis. My action was not, however, administrative; any Wikipedia editor could do exactly the same thing.   --jpgordon𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇  06:55, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

text: , please let me seek some clarification from you with regards to Wikipedia:No legal threats, one of Wikipedia's policies. Are you saying that if your edits are not reinstated, you will encourage this person's publisher to take legal action? Schwede66 17:33, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Karlwinn there is a 'View History' tab on the main page where you can view the rationale for every edit. I believe that the rationale you're looking for is  'rm entirely POV edits, essentially whitewashing this Nazi.'  with an addition of  'I agree' . The article's use of the word NAZI is sourced to a reliable independent third party source, it is not libel because we have a source for it. I encourage you to learn how libel works. If you want to change the article substantially then it's likely that you're going to need independent coverage of the subject to base those changes on, I suggest looking in press archives and similar. Non-English sources are welcome. Stuartyeates (talk) 18:33, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

text: In 2009 Bolton co-founded and was a primary spokesman for the Kapiti Dog Owners' Group (KDOG), which successfully lobbied council to regain, extend and improve off-leash dog exercise  areas. In 2014 he was involved in a campaign that sought unsuccessfully to save a young dog from euthanasia for allegedly nipping another dog on the hind leg in the course of play.https://issuu.com/the.star/docs/214183kn/8https://issuu.com/the.star/docs/214337kn/2 The dog was euthanised two days early after threats on facebook of violence against council staff members.
Clearly, this is using your earlier text. Stuartyeates (talk) 08:45, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

text: I'm not clear on whether you're supporting or opposing the text I propose, which is unrelated to "neo-Fascist" or "Nazi" labels. Stuartyeates (talk) 21:39, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Deletion of my edits by admin "Jpgordon" 

message: Rather than post this to the page, can the admins of this page please approve / comment on this suggested change:-
"Kerry Bolton is a New Zealand political activist, and author noted for his far-right, pro-Fascist, neo-Nazi ideology. His ideology and writings have been influenced by Oswald Spengler, Nietzsche, Walter Schubert, and the Eurasianism of Alexander Dugin. Interview with Kerry Bolton - Part 1. His writings and views have been called "pro-Nazi", "anti-Jewish" and "nationalist" in a thesis written by Roel van Leeuwen. Though Bolton has objected to the label "anti-Jewish" and states that he is actually "anti-Zionist".Interview with Kerry Bolton - Part 2
I can provide citations for the above, and more content for other sections, but see little point if the above isn't even acceptable to this pages esteemed Administrators. 
Karlwinn (talk) 23:32, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: This is a complete replacement for the lede? I'd need to see the sources added first. Stuartyeates (talk) 23:52, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: The sources provided are unsuitable, since they are primary sources. As an encyclopedia, wikipedia is a tertiary sources based on secondary sources. This is not to say that the text can't fly, but it can't fly with those refs. Stuartyeates (talk) 08:25, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: User has been indefinitely blocked, see User_talk:Karlwinn. Stuartyeates (talk) 23:07, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Revised Bolton text. 

message: Without overly commenting on the crap above, is there a particular reason that this person is branded as a 'neo-nazi' and of a 'pro-nazi' organization, yet in Alexander Rud Mills he is not, "In 1980 Kerry Raymond Bolton from Christchurch, New Zealand, along with David Crawford, co-founded a New Zealand group called the Church of Odin. They both had a background in far-right political activities. Paul Spoonley quotes Crawford as saying that the Church of Odin was exclusively for whites, and specifically whites "of non-Jewish descent" and that "the main Odinic law requires loyalty to race". By 1983 Bolton had left the Church." - it seems that mentions of this person in other articles are not reflecting the sources.
Its pretty clear in all the sources that he is a neo-nazi, but that seems to have restricted to this article only. Additionally it is unproven that he is 'far-right', facism and Odinist neo-nazi cultism are not synonymous with the less extreme far-right political viewpoint, call it what it is. The comments about various court actions do not seem to have translated to anything expect part of one source being discredited. trying to add sources from WP:FRINGE viewpoints is not acceptable.
This page is incredibly negative, describing every bad thing there is with no redeeming features, however careful examination of Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons will show clearly that this article meets all the guidelines and is not an attack page.
Careful examination of notability could suggest that this person would probably meet WP:NPOL. 
And finally for the record, a neo-nazi is anyone who adheres to odinist, facist and anti-semintic views, yes many people were perfectly happy with Hilter before the holocaust, but we can safely say that after said event, only extreme fringe groups adhere to these beliefs. While these groups are tolerated, they are legitimately referred to as neo-nazi. 'neo-nazi' is not the same as 'nazi' In this case the sources backup said usage of the wording. Dysklyver 13:56, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comments 

message: &  show a man of the same age and name has died. Dysklyver 14:02, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: We can't go by name and age from primary sources. We need secondary sources to report it. --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 17:45, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Note that these are pretty common names in this part of the world,and those are in a different country. Stuartyeates (talk) 19:20, 19 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Death 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Needless to say (one would have thought) Ordo Sinistra Vivendi does not translate into English as "Order of the Left Way". The word "way" in Latin is via; vivendi means something like "of what must be lived". In point of fact, sinistra is not even a Latin word; it's actually Italian, and even so cannot stand on its own as an adjective. This is just Dog Latin, about as close to Latin itself as pro bono public-house-o. To what were we reduced before Google Translate?
Nuttyskin (talk) 22:24, 9 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  ''Ordo Sinistra Vivendi'' translation 

message: Discussion moved from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Nauseous_Man#Re_Kerry_Bolton_edit copy and pasted below, with minor edit for readability:
*<start copy and paste>
=== Re Kerry Bolton edit===
Hi NM, Re Kerry Bolton I have not reverted your edit (yet) and would like you to justify your changes, I detail the change points here and my response.
* 1. Re: White supremacy, he personally has disputed this and in some ways I agree with him - he seems to hate all lefties and moderates and even right wing leaning people that disagree with him, as well as white Jews and others of a white nature, so almost categorically he does not think all whites are superior to any and all other races. nb it is now scientific consensus that race is a construct, (which he also references, whilst throwing shade on all of the other races anyway).
* 2. Re: Doctorate(s) I cannot Prove a negative, from reputable sources pov, it is the least of the issues with this muppet, so I cannot find an article that addresses this issue, I did do some research, including the published texts, theses, alumni etc on Akl, Otago, Waikato and Canterbury Uni's websites and found no evidence at all, however, I note on one of the book sellers sites, it states one of the doctorates is form a non-reputable Greek uni, which I give little credence.
* All in all, I think my edit is truthful and backed-up with as good a source(s) as we are going to get.
* Finally, I think we may need to copy and paste this to the articles talk page and seek further input from other editors.
I look forward to your comments. The Original Filfi (talk) 01:46, 16 September 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi User:The Original Filfi. Thanks for reaching out. Do you mind if we move this over to the Talk page, so that we can get wider community input? 
Re: point 1, his work and views unambiguously fall into the white supremacy camp, even if he disputes that, it's what they're labelled. Perhaps a section could be expanded on his competing views about racial purity. Being a white supremacist doesn't negate the other views. 
Re: point 2, I ultimately agree with you. My concern is that could potentially violate [WP:NOR] is all. 
I reckon we move the chat to the talk page and see what others think! 
Nauseous Man (talk) 02:07, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

text: I wouldn't expect a white supremacist to like all white people, especially those who disagree with them. That is not a good argument for him not being a white supremacist. I don't see any claim he holds multiple doctorates in the page given as ref, apart from his title at the top of the page. If this is the evidence, the statement should be "He uses the title "Dr", but...".-gadfium 06:30, 16 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Discussion on white-supremacy and doctorates verifiability. 

message: Hi NM, Re Kerry Bolton I have not reverted your edit (yet) and would like you to justify your changes, I detail the change points here and my response.
* 1. Re: White supremacy, he personally has disputed this and in some ways I agree with him - he seems to hate all lefties and moderates and even right wing leaning people that disagree with him, as well as white Jews and others of a white nature, so almost categorically he does not think all whites are superior to any and all other races. nb it is now scientific consensus that race is a construct, (which he also references, whilst throwing shade on all of the other races anyway).
* 2. Re: Doctorate(s) I cannot Prove a negative, from reputable sources pov, it is the least of the issues with this muppet, so I cannot find an article that addresses this issue, I did do some research, including the published texts, theses, alumni etc on Akl, Otago, Waikato and Canterbury Uni's websites and found no evidence at all, however, I note on one of the book sellers sites, it states one of the doctorates is form a non-reputable Greek uni, which I give little credence.
* All in all, I think my edit is truthful and backed-up with as good a source(s) as we are going to get.
* Finally, I think we may need to copy and paste this to the articles talk page and seek further input from other editors.
I look forward to your comments. The Original Filfi (talk) 01:46, 16 September 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi User:The Original Filfi. Thanks for reaching out. Do you mind if we move this over to the Talk page, so that we can get wider community input? 
Re: point 1, his work and views unambiguously fall into the white supremacy camp, even if he disputes that, it's what they're labelled. Perhaps a section could be expanded on his competing views about racial purity. Being a white supremacist doesn't negate the other views. 
Re: point 2, I ultimately agree with you. My concern is that could potentially violate [WP:NOR] is all. 
I reckon we move the chat to the talk page and see what others think! 
Nauseous Man (talk) 02:07, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

text: I wouldn't expect a white supremacist to like all white people, especially those who disagree with them. That is not a good argument for him not being a white supremacist. I don't see any claim he holds multiple doctorates in the page given as ref, apart from his title at the top of the page. If this is the evidence, the statement should be "He uses the title "Dr", but...".-gadfium 06:30, 16 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Re Kerry Bolton edit

message: See WorldCat:
Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion in Context 
by Kerry Bolton, Sergei Nilus 
A two booklet set by Kerry Bolton examining The Protocols in modern and historical context. 
Paperback, 95 pages
Published July 1st 2005 by Steven Books 
Original Title
The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion in Context
ISBN
1904911366 (ISBN13: 9781904911364) 
Edition Language
English
Characters
Elders of Zion 
Other Editions 
None found 
All Editions | Add a New Edition | Combine 
 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.167.126.25 (talk) 15:26, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protocols of Zion by Kerry Bolton