Talk:NFL on Thanksgiving Day

message: I heard somewhere that the NFL has continued the Detroit and Dallas tradition because the idea of playing on Thanksgiving was originally very unpopular among the teams.  Since Detroit and Dallas agreed to do it when it was unpopular, they have been able to keep the tradition even though now lots of other teams want to host the game.  If anyone has some support for this, it would be a useful addition to the page.  --TjoeC 18:34, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: General

message: Alot of glaring errors with the overall standings at the bottom of the page. Can someone help clean up? 70.156.99.18 06:05, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Standings Errors

message: Since this is an article about an NFL subject from the '20s to the present (and future), does it make sense to have the "2006 NFL" box at the bottom of the page? -- Pawl 01:45, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  2006 NFL box 

message: Is there a reason why Dallas and Detroit are the regulars during this game?  If there is, I think it would be useful to add that info to the article. Regards, -- Jeff3000 04:53, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reason for Dallas and Detroit 

message: When did the league start using the name "Thanksgiving Classic" for their Thanksgiving games? I do not recall them using it before the 1990s. Also, I do not recall the league ever using that name for the 2006 season; as the actual :Image:ThanksgivingDETDALKC.JPG logo shows, it is just "Thanksgiving". Zzyzx11 (Talk) 20:44, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I strongly agree with this move request. I've been an NFL fan for a long time, and I have no association with the term "Thanksgiving Classic". A quick web search for the term returns no results relevant to the NFL Thanksgiving games other than the WP article among the first 20 links. A search for "thanksgiving classic" NFL adds only an article from The Week magazine, which is a general interest (i.e. not sports focused) publication. The league's own Thanksgiving page doesn't appear to contain the term. A search of the league's current media relations site also doesn't turn up any references to the term. I have to go all the way back to media releases from the league in 2003 and 2001 before I can find any use of the phrase "Thanksgiving Classics". The 2001 release does specifically state (bold in release) "The traditional Thanksgiving Day games played in Detroit and Dallas will be celebrated as Thanksgiving Classics. In both games, the Dallas Cowboys, Denver Broncos, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers will celebrate their histories by wearing a uniform worn during an era of each franchise’s past glory." In short, while I agree that the marketing term Thanksgiving Classic was used at least in 2001 and perhaps as recently as 2003, it seems to have been discarded by the league for at least the past 10 years in promoting the games, therefore the name NFL on Thanksgiving would seem to be the better article title. — DeeJayK (talk) 19:26, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: After a bit of further research, I don't believe this move would require administrator assistance due to a special exemption for moving a page over a redirect which should apply in this instance. That said, it's not a bad idea to let the community weigh in on the proposed change, but unless there is an outcry in favor of the existing name in the next few days, I would have no issue with simply making the change. After all, the subject of the move was first broached on this talk page in 2007 and to date there has been no push back against the proposal. — DeeJayK (talk) 02:57, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I did a little bit more research, and it appears the NFL used the term and logo "Thanksgiving Classics" in 2005 (LINK), but in 2006 is disappeared, and has never been used again. Research courtesy of the WayBackMachine helped. But that appears to be the final time. However, that does not change the point made succinctly above. The term is dated, and not used in any capacity anymore. Doctorindy (talk) 18:07, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I had a bit of free time this morning, so I decided to be bold and made the name change. I also renamed the List of Thanksgiving Classic broadcasters to List of NFL on Thanksgiving Day broadcasters. I've updated as many redirects as I can find, most importantly those in any of the templates and redirect pages. The list of pages that link to "Thanksgiving Classic" appears to still list all of the pages which include transcluded links from the templates — I'm assuming that it might take some period of time for these transclusions to update or something? Does anyone know how that works? — DeeJayK (talk) 16:41, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It's very good, and alongside of that, I've been taking the time to clean up the page. It will get increased traffic in the next few weeks, and needed a major trim of fat.  Doctorindy (Talk) 20:00, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  The "Thanksgiving Classic" Name 

message: *Going into the 2009 games, again, there appears to be no mention of the term "Thanksgiving Classic(s)." That will mark the 4th year in a row the name has been abandoned. This page should be changed to a variant of NFL on Thanksgiving Day. Doctorindy (talk) 14:24, 28 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Possible page name change

message: With the 2013 edition of Thanksgiving Day games quickly approaching, I submit yet another suggestion to move/revert this article to NFL on Thanksgiving. The term "Thanksgiving Classic" has completely disappeared from use in official (and unofficial) NFL vernacular. It doesn't seem to have been used in any context since 2005. Since it would be moving to a page that already exists (NFL on Thanksgiving and/or NFL on Thanksgiving Day are currently re-direct pages), I believe to do it properly it would require administrator assistance. Doctorindy (talk) 18:38, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I strongly agree with this move request. I've been an NFL fan for a long time, and I have no association with the term "Thanksgiving Classic". A quick web search for the term returns no results relevant to the NFL Thanksgiving games other than the WP article among the first 20 links. A search for "thanksgiving classic" NFL adds only an article from The Week magazine, which is a general interest (i.e. not sports focused) publication. The league's own Thanksgiving page doesn't appear to contain the term. A search of the league's current media relations site also doesn't turn up any references to the term. I have to go all the way back to media releases from the league in 2003 and 2001 before I can find any use of the phrase "Thanksgiving Classics". The 2001 release does specifically state (bold in release) "The traditional Thanksgiving Day games played in Detroit and Dallas will be celebrated as Thanksgiving Classics. In both games, the Dallas Cowboys, Denver Broncos, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers will celebrate their histories by wearing a uniform worn during an era of each franchise’s past glory." In short, while I agree that the marketing term Thanksgiving Classic was used at least in 2001 and perhaps as recently as 2003, it seems to have been discarded by the league for at least the past 10 years in promoting the games, therefore the name NFL on Thanksgiving would seem to be the better article title. — DeeJayK (talk) 19:26, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: After a bit of further research, I don't believe this move would require administrator assistance due to a special exemption for moving a page over a redirect which should apply in this instance. That said, it's not a bad idea to let the community weigh in on the proposed change, but unless there is an outcry in favor of the existing name in the next few days, I would have no issue with simply making the change. After all, the subject of the move was first broached on this talk page in 2007 and to date there has been no push back against the proposal. — DeeJayK (talk) 02:57, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I did a little bit more research, and it appears the NFL used the term and logo "Thanksgiving Classics" in 2005 (LINK), but in 2006 is disappeared, and has never been used again. Research courtesy of the WayBackMachine helped. But that appears to be the final time. However, that does not change the point made succinctly above. The term is dated, and not used in any capacity anymore. Doctorindy (talk) 18:07, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I had a bit of free time this morning, so I decided to be bold and made the name change. I also renamed the List of Thanksgiving Classic broadcasters to List of NFL on Thanksgiving Day broadcasters. I've updated as many redirects as I can find, most importantly those in any of the templates and redirect pages. The list of pages that link to "Thanksgiving Classic" appears to still list all of the pages which include transcluded links from the templates — I'm assuming that it might take some period of time for these transclusions to update or something? Does anyone know how that works? — DeeJayK (talk) 16:41, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It's very good, and alongside of that, I've been taking the time to clean up the page. It will get increased traffic in the next few weeks, and needed a major trim of fat.  Doctorindy (Talk) 20:00, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Name change/revert

message: I added a section introducing the annual MVP's for the networks. Although it started out as somewhart of a silly gimick, it actually is noted annually, and both CBS and FOX make a big deal about their respective awards. Listing them seems undoubtably logical. A few older years have to be looked up to fill in some of the blank lines. Doctorindy 16:14, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  MVPs 

message: I removed the future matchups because it is against WP:NOT, Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. The NFL has not stated who will play in the future. The NFL tradition is Cowboys and Lions, but it changed this year by having an extra team. Who is to say that there will be the same teams? What if the NFL decides that the Lions are too awful to play on Thanksgiving now? It is all speculation and doesn't need to be there.++aviper2k7++ 23:37, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed section 

message: :Image:Thanksgiving2006logo.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Thanksgiving2006logo.png

message: :Image:Troybrown02alliron.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 15:25, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Troybrown02alliron.jpg

message: As much as Detroit fans like to see their Lions play on Turkey Day (Thanksgiving), I take up the side of the fans and the NFL commissioner Roger Goodell in stripping Detroit of its Thanksgiving game.  Hardly anyone wants to see the Lions these days.  If Detroit were replaced by another city for the first game annually, I would choose the Philadelphia Eagles.  Philadelphia is an important city in American history, and the Eagles, much like the Cowboys, may get down for a couple years but then bounce back.  On the other hand, the Lions will be a long time before even being respectable.  Having said all these things, here are some possible matchups for the early game (12:30/1:00 ET)on Thanksgiving 2009.
1) Atlanta @ New England - Boston is another important city in American history, and the Patriots are the team of the 2000s, even if they just miss the playoffs in 2008.  And Atlanta can prove that 2008 was no fluke.
2) Tampa Bay @ Miami - Florida battle, both teams should be in playoff contention in 2009.
3) New Orleans @ Philadelphia - I called it the "Catholic Bowl", since the cities in which the Saints and Eagles play are historically Roman Catholic.  On the football side, Drew Brees gets to show his "gunslinger" arm against Donovan McNabb.
4) Minnesota @ Pittsburgh - "Big Bad Ben" Roethlisberger is as tough as the steel of the city he plays in.  And Minnesota is always tough.
5) Philadelphia @ Chicago - If the early game is moved to 1:00 ET and 2008 standings support it, this early game treats the nation to one of the NFL's classic matchups.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.62.209.152 (talk) 17:42, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Possible 2009 NFL Thanksgiving Matchups 

message: I'm no Lions fan, but that entire section is littered with mostly synthesized prose. Citation 4 apparently notes Detroit's futility, but looking at the actual link, the article only tells us their win-loss record, and makes no mention of the team's struggle since 2001. Citation 6 only tells us about the game, and nothing about "the chants [getting] louder." The paragraph about supporters and detractors is pretty much a battleground between pro-Lions editors and anti-Lions editors, with absolutely no sources to back up any of the claims, as shown by the numerous  tags. In the last paragraph, someone clearly snuck in some anti-Lions bias by saying that if Goodell removed the Lions from Thanksgiving, it would be "agreeing with the fans." (Pro-Lions editors would probably say something like "ruining an American tradition", for example.) The remaining speculation in the rest of the paragraph regarding who the other Thanksgiving host should be is just that: speculation.
Of course, hardly anyone will take note of this, but for those who do, that's great. Pandacomics (talk) 21:43, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I took note of it and have resolved the issues in question. J. Myrle Fuller (talk) 23:29, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Numerous issues with the "home team controversy" section 

message: Notable appearance droughts section - how much of a factor is the current schedule really?  It's been in process 8 years so far - which is the length of time it takes for every team to face every other team at home once.  I mean it makes it sound like they would have played loads of times (particularly with San Diego and the 49ers issue) - when infact they have only been eligible for 2 games (or 4 for the AFC east) and makes it sound like the schedule has been in for rather longer than it has (it's only done one 8 year cycle).  212.20.248.35 (talk) 10:57, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current schedule - how much blame really? 

message: I don't see them on the standing list for defunct teams. They played in multi games in 30sSmith03 (talk) 18:51, 25 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: NFL Dodgers

message: Actually, even though the Dallas Cowboys never play the early game on Thanksgiving, there have been many NFL games played in the past with 11:30 A.M. local time starts. In the old days, when December Saturday regular season games and postseason games had 12:30 P.M. EST starts, a lot of those games would take place in Central Time Zone cities with 11:30 A.M. start times. Also, recent Pro Bowls have had 11:30 A.M. start times in Hawaii. Because the NFL never schedules games with 11 A.M. local start times, the cut-off seems to be at 11:30. Therefore, it's incorrect to state in the article that the NFL avoids start times before Noon. The NFL could theoretically schedule the Dallas Cowboys for the early game on Thanksgiving, but they choose not to because Detroit is in the Eastern Time Zone. I realize that I'm nitpicking about something minor, but I just wanted to bring this up.67.188.208.139 (talk) 06:24, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: NFL Avoiding 11:30 A.M. Start Times for Games

message: According to this article, the new TV contracts allow for the NFL to, if so desired, have both Dallas and Detroit host NFC opponents.  How about rotating the "all-AFC" game over every 3 years.  Here's how the rotation would work:
Year 1: AFC-AFC (CBS 12:30), NFC @ Detroit (4:00 FOX), NFC/AFC @ Dallas (8:00 NBC)
Year 2: NFC @ Detroit (12:30 FOX), AFC-AFC (4:00 CBS), NFC/AFC @ Dallas (8:00 NBC)
Year 3: AFC @ Detroit (CBS 12:30), NFC @ Dallas (4:00 FOX), AFC-AFC (8:00 NBC)
Sounds like a fair rotation, huh?  The rotation centers around the AFC-AFC game.
Also, the NFL should consider moving the "early" game to 1:00 ET (so that the Central Time zone could host) with the "late" game to 4:30 ET and the "prime" game @ 8:30 ET.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.62.209.129 (talk) 23:30, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Thanksgiving Scheduling Rationale 

message: Are citations availble for the Game MVP awards presented by CBS, Fox & NFL Network? Gmporr (talk) 18:57, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations for Game MVPs? 

message: Now that the new TV contracts for the NFL are in place, the NBC game on Thanksgiving night could showcase state matchups (including "Governor's Cups") and even city rivals playing each other.  With that in mind, here are possible Thanksgiving night games in the future:
2013 - Miami Dolphins @ Tampa Bay Buccaneers
2014 - Houston Texans @ Dallas Cowboys (Texas "Governor's Cup) or St. Louis Rams @ Kansas City Chiefs (Missouri "Governor's Cup") or San Francisco 49ers @ Oakland Raiders (Battle of the Bay)
2015 - New York Jets @ New York Giants (Battle of NYC or Subway Match or "Gotham City Classic")
2016 - Pittsburgh Steelers @ Philadelphia Eagles (Battle for PA)
Most, if not all, of these matchups could land very high ratings.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.62.209.129 (talk) 15:43, 22 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Possible Future Prime-Time Thanksgiving Matchups 

message: title of article is NFL on thanksgiving, I realize it gets stretch to include the AAFC and AFL, but the pre 1920 games? come on!! what are the sources? if I find a game  played in boise Idaho between to semi-pro teams from 1915 can I add that?
:Most of them came from Professional Football Researchers Association-affiliated sources such as Roy Sye's Independent Pro Football site, Ghosts of the Gridiron (which is Philadelphia-centered), Luckyshow (which focuses on New Jersey/New York historical teams), and various others. I would tend to agree with your assessment that maybe it doesn't belong here, but there is a case for it given it shares the same lineage. J. Myrle Fuller (talk)  21:34, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: pre-1920

message: The sources that were originally posted for this statement, coming directly from the league itself, state that cross-flex only applies on Sunday afternoons and that Thursday contests were not subject to the cross-flex rule. () Now, yes, the league has aired all NFC games in that time span, in seeming violation of the CBS contract with the AFC, but it's not necessarily cross-flex at play here, especially if the league says it is not. CBS also has a separate contract with Thursday Night Football, which can carry either conference, so that could cover the Thanksgiving games as they are on Thursdays. (Further implying this: Fox has not carried any AFC team, which it would be allowed, perhaps even encouraged, to do if it were a cross-flex.) J. Myrle Fuller (talk)  21:41, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm now questioning your source, in light of the 2018 schedule that was released a few hours ago, still giving an all-NFC matchup to CBS. In that nfl.com article, the quote that "Thursday, Saturday, and Monday games are not affected" appears in the paragraph BEFORE the paragraph about (or any first specific mention of) the cross-flexing mechanism. Thus, IMO, your claim does not appear to be explicitly stated in the source that the cross-flexing was definitely excluded from Thanksgiving games. And thus I also question your other claim that those all-NFC Thanksgiving matchups on CBS were primarily part of those previous TNF contracts. Zzyzx11 (talk) 01:37, 20 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cross-flex DOES NOT APPLY 

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thread_title:  External links modified (February 2018) 

message: I am finding a lot of redundant content in both the history and broadcast sections. This is because they seem to be intertwined. Among the repeated content:
* The reason why the Detroit and Dallas games initially rotated annually as intra-conference (NFC at NFC) and inter-conference (AFC at NFC) games was to satisfy the constraints of the network holding the rights of the AFC package, and allow it to air one of the games.
* 2014 was the first year since the 1970 AFL-NFL merger that both Detroit and Dallas games were intra-conference (NFC at NFC), coinciding with the implementation of "cross-flexing" between CBS and Fox.
* The third primetime time first aired on NFL Network, then moved to NBC in 2012.
Thus, it is probably better to merge the content. Zzyzx11 (talk) 17:59, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge history and broadcast sections 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: not moved. (closed by non-admin page mover)  feminist🇭🇰🇺🇦 (talk) 15:01, 30 April 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: NFL on Thanksgiving Day →  – Should we change the article title to NFL on thanksgiving to include the new game that is going to be added this year on prime video? Hoopstercat (talk) 13:24, 23 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 23 April 2023 

message: A move request at Talk:NFL_Christmas_games#Requested_move_12_May_2023 was submitted that may have bearing on this page.  As nominator, my opinion is that both pages should be titled either "NFL (Holiday) games" or "NFL on (Holiday)" but be consistent with each other. Please leave comments on the linked RM. Frank Anchor 13:52, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Like i mentioned before on a previous move I think it should be NFL on Holiday format so we can include all the info necessary so we don’t leave out anything Hoopstercat (talk) 18:44, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: And that idea was rejected and not the subject of the current move request on the Christmas page. Frank Anchor 19:49, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move at [[NFL Christmas games]]