Talk:Pronoia (psychology)

message: Honestly, I'm confused at how someone can read this article and NOT do something about it.
"A peasant revolt therefore came into being as a result of outsourcing pronoia and the wikipedia. The technopeasants, sick and tired of being landless and ignored for decades by the media, rose up in defiance of the old pronoia laws."
WHAT does this mean? WHERE is this? What region of India? WHAT pronoia laws? An encyclopedia is not a dumping ground for New Age rhetoric, vagueries, or buzzwords like those featured here.
If this is indeed such a phenomenon as the article tries to describe, then let's have it rewritten (if nothing else), or deleted. --Addama 17:14, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why is this page still here? 

message: I am going to rewrite this starting from the Wired Magazine article which introduced me to the Pronoia meme. I will attempt to locate subsequent references associated with the figures cited, or others. I too think the India/Africa content is dubious.
Once the edits are done, I wonder if Pronoia_(psychology) is a suitable title? Any suggestions?
I am wading in here... Discovered Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Zippies, and apparently the original India/Africa references are referred to in the New York Times although there is no mention of the word pronoia.
tokind 16:43, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Working on it. 

message: Perhaps this should be split into Pronoia (philosophy) and Pronoia (psychology), and Pronoia (disambigiation) edited accordingly? tokind 23:54, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Two articles? 

message: The mixed message emanating from various quarters needs to be analysed. While some would concur on the belief of Clark, that rave culture involves designer drugs or that trance parties require shamanic medicine, the issue of self-medication needs to be addressed, if only, to avoid the issues associated with substance abuse and so on. I don't subscribe to Clark's message, nor do I have any sympathy for Tim Leary's message taken out of the context of the sixties. I do however agree with Aldous Huxley and do not want to associate myself with any populist appeal to drug usuage.Ethnopunk 13:21, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Message of the Zippies

message: This article doesn't belong in the WikiProject Psychology article base. It talks about a philosophy or worldview, not a psychological concept.--Cassmus 08:10, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: WikiProject Psychology

message: The section Pronoia affliction begins:
:According to Pronoia.net, Dr. Fred H. Goldner claims that he, writing at Queens College in October 1982, published a paper in Social Problems (V.30, N.1:82-91), in which he coined the term pronoia to describe a psychological affliction.
The wording ("according to...", "claims") implies that Goldner is falsely claiming authorship of the article and/or the term. 
The second paragraph of the article includes a straightforward citation for the article, and a  URL is listed under External links. I just checked the link, which resolves to a JSTOR page. It is accurate, and the abstract includes the claim of coinage. 
The origin of the doubt seems to be Pronoia.net, which is cited as the source of the content of the 3rd paragraph. Their definition page says:
:The first modern use* of the word pronoia I can trace occurred during the psychedelic 1960s and 1970s - following a charismatic smile from John Perry Barlow. The EFF co-founder, Grateful Dead lyricist, and grizzled veteran of both Millbrook and Haight-Ashbury defined pronoia as:  "the suspicion the Universe is a conspiracy on your behalf".
: * FOOTNOTE
::It was brought to our attention several years ago, via e-mail by Mr. Fred H. Golder [sic], that he believes HE in fact deserves credit for the revival of the word Pronoia in 1982. To his point, Pronoia.net offers a taste of his serious academic paper here. Writing at Queens College in October 1982 (in SOCIAL PROBLEMS,V.30,N.1:82-91), Mr. Golder summarizes:
:: [...]
::Our response: Well, maybe feelings of pronoia are always just a "delusion"... or maybe Mr. Golder just hasn't gotten the vibe? :-) Seriously, it seems to us as if this pop-psych definition of the word Pronoia holds up a dysfunctional and delusional minority to a scientific zoom lense [sic], and reports the view as if it were an accurate representation of the larger youth phenomenon. Pronoia.net disagrees with this basic premise.
It's clear there are two different senses of the word here, which this (WP) article separates as Pronoia philosophy and Pronoia affliction. Pronoia.net apparently disagrees, snarkily (and the pop-psych here is not Goldner's), and without seeing Goldner's email it's not clear whether he viewed them as distinct. But Pronoia.net gives no citation for the "1960s and 1970s" origin of the philosophy sense, and there's no reason to doubt Goldner's independent origination of the term for the affliction. FWIW, the OED cites Goldner's paper as the origin of the word in this sense.
I've added the citation to the article here and removed the weasel wording.  --Thnidu (talk) 01:02, 28 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origin of the word 

message: Paranoia and Pronoia: The Visionary and the Banal, Laurence J. Kirmayer,
Social Problems, Vol. 31, No. 2 (Dec., 1983), pp. 170-179 (10 pages)
Published By: Oxford University Press
https://doi.org/10.2307/800208, 
https://www.jstor.org/stable/800208 2001:171B:2274:7C21:5D8A:B87E:340D:EFA8 (talk) 19:26, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another psychology reference 

message: Jules Marshall, 
May 1, 1994,
Zippies!,
Wired magazine, https://www.wired.com/1994/05/zippies/ 2001:171B:2274:7C21:5D8A:B87E:340D:EFA8 (talk) 21:25, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Added it to the article. 2001:171B:2274:7C21:5D8A:B87E:340D:EFA8 (talk) 10:44, 26 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: This is unrelated and it is only a passing mention. Veverve (talk) 13:45, 28 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wired reference