Talk:Boro people

message: has  presented distorted information about Bodo term as of recent us.  This is completely propaganda.  Boros were known as Mech and Kacharis to others.  But they called themselves as Boro = Bara &   Bara-fisa &  Bhim-ni-fsa   .  
ref -  
Hodgson on koch dhimal and bodo 
https://archive.org/details/essayfirstonkoc00hodggoog 
& 
THE KACHARIS BOOK
PerfectingNEI (talk) 18:46, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Distorted information about Bodo 

message: 1 . Riyazu-s-salatin https://archive.org/details/riyazussalatinhi00saliuoft/page/n15  
2. The Cooch Behar State and Its Land Revenue Settlements
https://archive.org/details/coochbeharstatei00chaurich/page/224
& 
http://coochbehar.nic.in/Htmfiles/history_book.html
 
 
3. Census of Assam 1931 , Volume 3  https://dspace.gipe.ac.in/xmlui/handle/10973/37319 
https://dspace.gipe.ac.in/xmlui/bitstream/handle/10973/37319/GIPE-CENSUS31009-Contents.pdf
4. Bishnu Rabha Rachanabali Volume 1  https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.451480/page/n83
5. An Historical and Descriptive Account of the Kachari Tribes in the North Cachar Hills: With Specimens of Tales and Folk-lore https://digital.soas.ac.uk/AA00000195/00001/pdf
6. The Kacharis  https://archive.org/details/kacharis009491mbp
7.  Essay the First: Koch , Bodo , Dhimal tribes ; Hodgson 1847 https://archive.org/details/essayfirstonkoc00hodggoog/page/n150
8. Journal of the Asiatic Society of Bengal, Volume 9, Part 2 , 1840 , Page 829 https://books.google.co.in/books?id=0TQzAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA829&lpg=PA829&dq=Ha-tsung-tsa
9. Kirata-Jana-krti ; S.K Chatterji 1951 
https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.32096/page/n117
10. Ahom-Englsih-Assamese dictionary by G.C Borua
https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.463794
https://digital.soas.ac.uk/content/AA/00/00/06/16/00001/pdf.pdf
11. Journal of Assitic Society Bengal 1856 (Notes on North Cachar)
https://archive.org/details/journalofasiatic2478asia/page/600
12. The early states 
13.  A Statistical Account of Assam V.1
14. A Statistical Account of Assam V.2
15. Extracts from the Narrative of an expedition into the Naga territory of Assam. By E.R. Grange ; JASB 8 Pt 1  
16. http://linguistics.berkeley.edu/~dwbruhn/STEDT/Damant_1880_notes-tribes.pdf 
47.29.189.107 (talk) 15:37, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Some History Books for Boro people 

message: * 
The Kacharis ; 1911 ( Ramsa & Ramsa-aroi & Ramsa mauza )
https://archive.org/details/kacharis009491mbp/page/n61
JASB V.9 Pt.2 ; 1840 ( Ha-tsung-tsa & Rangtsa / Ramsa )
https://archive.org/details/journalasiatics24benggoog/page/n223
Damant, G.H ; 1880 ( Hojai = Dimasa & Boro = Rangsa / Ramsa) 
http://linguistics.berkeley.edu/~dwbruhn/STEDT/Damant_1880_notes-tribes.pdf
Soppitt ; 1885 ( Some explantion about Ramsa by Dimasa but I feel It's not correct )
https://digital.soas.ac.uk/AA00000195/00001/pdf
JASB V.8 Pt.1 ( Kosāree = Ramsa+Hojai )
https://books.google.co.in/books?id=3lBQAQAAMAAJ&q=ramsa#v=snippet&q=ramsa&f=false
JASB V.9 Pt.2 ; 1840 ( Uninhabitat Ramsa village )
https://books.google.co.in/books?id=0TQzAQAAMAAJ&q=Ramsa#v=snippet&q=Ramsa&f=false
Notes on North Cachar 1855
https://archive.org/details/journalofasiatic24asia/page/600
J,P Wade - A History of Assam 1800
https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.125418/page/n119
IITG - Bodo
https://web.archive.org/web/20190430200542/http://www.iitg.ac.in/rcilts/bodo.html
47.29.189.107 (talk) 15:32, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cachar History of Bodo people 

message: @IP user halt edit-warring, following edit summaries are not wp:civil neither edits are helpful in anyway:
* 16:21, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  18,353 bytes +968‎  →‎History: Narrow minded edits by Bhaskarbhagawati.
* 16:14, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  18,353 bytes +968‎  →‎History: Bhaskarbhagawati don't know how to use Wikipedia. Somebody please block this editor.
* 15:56, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  18,353 bytes +1,110‎  →‎History: History word always study past. Nobody can say everything about at once. Historical study infer new new things with latest discoveries. Bhaskarbhagawati is creating issues in issueless page . Jealousy isn't good for health.
*  15:28, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  14,959 bytes -2,419‎  It's just Wikipedia . Better to delete everything to make happy Bhaskarbhagawati Be happy Bhaskarbhagawati
* 12:53, October 4, 2019‎ 2409:4065:48a:fd02:6113:95a3:175b:879b talk‎  18,355 bytes -153‎  →‎History: Bhaskarbhagawati disruptive tags
Your messages on my talk:
* 16:34, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  4,804 bytes +3‎  →‎Bodo people: Challenge GU
*  16:34, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  4,801 bytes +617‎  →‎Bodo people: Fantasy boy Bhaskarbhagawati
*  16:19, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  3,586 bytes +330‎  →‎Bodo people: Narrow minded edits by Bhaskarbhagawati
* 15:31, October 4, 2019‎ 2402:3a80:de4:2f2b:45d9:8249:ee0d:25df talk‎  2,826 bytes +267‎  →‎Bodo people: Be happy Bhaskarbhagawati 
Discuss your problem with other editors, if you can convince them, i have no issues.Thank you.भास्कर् Bhagawati Speak 12:04, 4 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bodo people#History 

message: Scholars have suggested different theories of migration. Scholars suggest Tibeto-Burman of Assam migrated atleast 3000 years ago. Some scholars also claimed Bodo-kachari migrated 4000 years ago. So, It's still not clear. But It's widely accepted that Bodo-kachari peoples are autochthon of Brahmputra valley. 
Is it wrong to add autochthon status for Bodo-kachari people ?
Here, Chaipau had removed the autochthon word and added Pre-historic settlers. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:MobileDiff/954090362
Logical Man 2000 (talk) 17:40, 30 April 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that it is not clear when they came in, but we know that the Boros were not the first and that they settled in and admixed with the already present.  Linguists, geneticists and ethnographers—all agree on this.  This does not satisfy the definition of autochthonous.  We should not include this because it is not WP:NPOV. Chaipau (talk) 19:49, 30 April 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  Be careful, You are removing cited content. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 04:12, 1 May 2020 (UTC)

text:  No scholars have proved that Boros aren't autochthons. If you can bring any research paper then you can insert your claim. You are inserting something based on either hypothesis or WP:OR.  Logical Man 2000 (talk) 04:31, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  As already accepted by van Driem (2007) on the basis of genetics: "The Y haplogroup 02a is represented at a frequency of 77% in Austroasiatic groups in India and 47% in Tibeto-Burman groups of northeastern India. This patterning could suggest that Tibeto-Burman paternal lineages may have partially replaced indigenous Austroasiatic lineages in the northeast of the Indian Subcontinent and that Austroasiatic populations preceded the Tibeto-Burmans in this area, as linguists and ethnographers have speculated for over a century and a half.".  Therefore, it has been widely believed by linguists and ethnographers for more than a 100 years that the TB people followed the AA and admixed with them.  This is precisely what autochthons don't do—follow other people and admix with them.  This is what the Ahoms did as well in Assam.  Wikipedia cannot say opposite things.  It is possible some authors used the word autochthons, but that does not mean it is generally accepted.  Chaipau (talk) 08:23, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  You are comparing 1228 with 3000-4000 years old. I would prefer concensus from other editors than you. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 09:30, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Where did you get the cut-off year in the definition of autochthons?  Chaipau (talk) 10:07, 1 May 2020 (UTC)

text: Which historians---given that this is a prehistoric issue?  van Driem's quote above is the academic consensus as it has been for the last one hundred and fifty years. And the Mundas came to Assam after 1835.  Not autochthons even though they are called adivasis.  Chaipau (talk) 10:59, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  K.L. Barua , Gait consider Kacharis are aborigines of Brahmaputra valley. Khasi-Jaintia might be autochthons of Meghalaya. But Boros are earliest setllers of Brahmaputra valley. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 15:20, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  K L Barua and Gait are not WP:RS according to Wikipedia policies.  These are nearly 100 year old works.  Boros, who speak a TB language, are not the earliest settlers in the Brahmaputra valley.  DeLancey, Taher and others agree on this point. Chaipau (talk) 15:52, 1 May 2020 (UTC)

text: Please look at the genetic data.  AA reached Northeast approx 5000 years ago.  TB is more recent, based on both Y-DNA as well as mtDNA.  That is what van Driem precisely says in the quote above. Chaipau (talk) 16:05, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: Autochthon

message: It is widely accepted by Scholars that Mahamanikya was Kachari king. Boros are also known as Kachari. Mahamanikya was called Varaha Raja. Therefore, scholars tried to connect Varaha with Boro but Dominant senior editor Chaipau don't allow me to add this cited content :
According to Bardalai, Mahamanikya was popularly known as Varaha or Barahi, with passage of time it began to pronounce as Bara or Boro.Madhava Kandali mentioned Mahamanikya also as “Barahi Raja”, and this led the late Madhav Chandra Bardalai to say in the introduction of Kaviraja Kandali’s work published by him in print in 1899 that the title Barahi with passage of time began to be pronounced as “Bara” or “Bara”... Bardalai further seeks to connect the term  Varaha in text with Boro For example - Dimasa have sanskritized form Hidimba-sa , Tipra have sanskritized form Tripura , Koch have sanskritized form Kuvaca. 
* 
Logical Man 2000 (talk) 13:41, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: WP:Fringe according to Chaipau

message: This move was requested by Chaipau on the basis of better phonetic . 
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Boro_people&diff=944496316&oldid=944345409
But he is claiming Bodo instead of Boro in Mech people. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Mech_people&diff=955379667&oldid=953909077
Logical Man 2000 (talk) 16:12, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: This was based on Moshahary's assertion given here: Boro_people#cite_note-13
Mushahary's reference was added on 30th April 2020. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Boro_people&diff=954154602&oldid=954153996 But page move happened much before. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 20:46, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bodo people --> Boro people 

message: Dalton concluded meaning of Boro from the saying - "Boro heri geder heri". Chaipau removed the content 
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Boro_people&diff=956280868&oldid=956276462
Reason given by Chaipau : "Boro heri geder heri is not etymology of Boro. Boro is great in Indo-Aryan, cannot be self-identification of Boro" . Boros use Saan for sun (eng). There may be some linguistic relation with Indo-European. What is big deal if Boro word have similarity with Indo-European word ? Why do User:Chaipau have so much problem with Boro people ? 
Logical Man 2000 (talk) 14:36, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Need citation. Chaipau (talk) 14:55, 12 May 2020 (UTC)

text: Also you cannot derive Boro both from TB as well as IA. Makes no sense.  WP:IINFO.  Chaipau (talk) 15:01, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  Citation is already given. Nowhere it's written that it originate from Indo-European. Dalton was first person to conclude Boro means "Great people" using the saying "Boro hari geder hari". You make no sense. You just waste time in edit war.  Logical Man 2000 (talk) 15:08, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I have marked where a citation is needed by "cn".  As mentioned above you cannot pack the etymology section with everything people have said till now (WP:NOTEVERYTHING).  This an encyclopedia.  Chaipau (talk) 15:58, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  Citation is already given along with Borok = Man. (Bhatt). Etymology means origin. Dalton was first person to guess the correct form. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 16:11, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: Boro heri geder heri 

message: Chaipau has removed following references - 
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* Mushahary, Moniram (1981) Bodo–English Dictionary
* Pulloppillil, Thomas & Aluckal, Jacob (1997) The Bodos: Children of the Bhullumbutter
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Logical Man 2000 (talk) 06:03, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I recommend to take the issue to WP:RSN, afterwards to WP:ANI.भास्कर् Bhagawati Speak 19:20, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  Since, Many information and citations were removed. Therefore, Some references became unused. Still many references within it can be used. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 20:25, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: References

message: Content removed by Chaipau " Section of Boros were known as Rangtsa or Ramsa. According to tradition the Kacharis had their domain in Kamarupa and they belonged to a lineage called Ha-tsung-tsa or Ha-cheng-sa or Hachengsa and Kacharis called themselves Rangtsa or Ramsa.  * Bishnu Prasad Rabha, Activist, musician, songwriter and painter.  A section of Boros called themselves Ramsa, which means Children of Ram.  "  Logical Man 2000 (talk) 14:55, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I know you are a sockpuppet of  now.  For some reason you are hung up on this issue.  The evidence is overwhelming now that the Dimasas came from the east, from somewhere near Sadiya.  You have been trying to insert this input from Soppitt for a long time.  Chaipau (talk) 15:18, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  User:Chaipau mail (User talk:Chaipau#Logical Man) other editors and admins to block other users with sockpuppet allegation. If you're trying to spread fake information then you'll surely have conflict with those users who love to add true information. It's possible that you remove those specific information to match the conflict with other users. You may have conflict with many users, It don't mean i'm wrong, May be you're wrong. It's well known Bishnu Rabha was Boro. You removed the content. Boros of southern side called themselves Ramsa. All Ramsa section of Boro know it. If you remove these basic things then you'll surely have conflict with all other users. Why do you want to remove so many things from this page ? This must be biggest question for all future editors who will read this section. Then they'll surely learn about you also. Logical Man 2000 (talk) 15:37, 16 May 2020 (UTC)

text: I'll consider your allegation as personal attack.  Logical Man 2000 (talk) 15:46, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: History of Boro

message: User:Chaipau mostly edit Ahom people related pages where he writes things which support claims of Ahom people. He has a habit of removing things which support claims of Boro people. He only argue with other editors and mail admins to block other editors Logical Man 2000 (talk) 17:52, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Note for other editors 

message: , South korean also have relation with Ayodhya, see Heo Hwang-ok. Can you give any source for your claim "this claim has no credibility" in this [] ? You have removed sourced text. It's against the policy of wikipedia. Boros have Mythical relation with Rama. Its clear from their folk tradition and Its clearly written in myths section. I believe you know the meaning of myth. So, You're free to not believe it.  Anyway, I just keep checking Boro people page and make corrections.  2409:4065:49E:77D5:7078:DCA1:D5E5:C03E (talk) 22:20, 23 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: @IP: FWIW, block evasion is against the policy of Wikipedia. The source by Dodiya is not about Bodo history, so of little relevance here. –Austronesier (talk) 08:03, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

text: "The source by Dodiya is not about Bodo history", that's obvious, right? One single mention of the Bodos in a 300-page volume. It would be even more obvious so if the citation were complete (B. Rajkhowa (2001). "Oral tradition of the Rāmāyaņa". In Jaydipsinh Dodiya (ed.), Critical Perspectives on the Rāmāyaṇa, New Delhi, Sarup & Sons.) –Austronesier (talk) 09:12, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

text: Do you know WP:RS and WP:SYNTHESIS. You don't have any source. And You are not authority for anything. Since, You lack any source so yoour WP:SYNTHESIS isn't acceptable infront of WP:RS. You are simply wasting your and my time 2409:4065:E0B:7CE7:AC90:2FEA:8945:B7C4 (talk) 09:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

text: And what is the need of concensus from  , are you authority of wikipedia ? do you have any source to reject the reliable source ? you're trying to WP:OWN here. It's against the policy of wikipedia . 2409:4065:E0B:7CE7:AC90:2FEA:8945:B7C4 (talk) 09:56, 24 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Where is the source for your "why is it not possible to present a source which covers the Boro people as main topic" claim ? Ofcourse it will be possible to present entire thesis if there will be proper funding to do research on this topic. But this source is already WP:RS and You're just waste of time. 47.29.202.28 (talk) 09:36, 27 August 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: Credibility

message: Some non-bodos who doesn't know Bodo history continuously targeting this category saying Bodo surname doesn't mean Bodo.  Which is stupid argument seeing the present scenario. Bodos never take anyone's surname now, though they may have taken before.  Also, Bodos' surname are never taken by other communities.  Boro people aren't heterogeneous group. Nehemiahnarzary23 (talk) 01:42, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I've notified/warned you about not adding unsourced entries in the list of notable Boros twice before in your talk page. Wikipedia doesn't go as per your personal whims and wishes. Go through WP:V. Not writing somebody's name is not targetting a community. Be WP:NEUTRAL here. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 15:16, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  what could be the criterion for adding names here?  Should we go by general rules on caste?  Also, it is uncertain that last names are enough.  For example, Kenny Basumatary's middle name seems to be Deori (Deori people), and it is likely he has Deori heritage too.  So is he Deori or Boro?  He makes Assamese movies.  So he is Assamese as well?  Bishnu Rabha is another problematic issue.  Identifying people sometimes by their names (Kenny) or biological parents (Bishnu Rabha) is fraught with issues.  So what kind of criterion should we use? Chaipau (talk) 10:04, 18 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  Surnames are not enough. That would be WP:SYNTH. We should go by the general rule of WP:V, sourcing them with an RS. Caste will not apply since it is a community, otherwise self-identification will come into play for the living individuals. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 10:13, 18 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable Bodo People 

message: This sentence -  - requires copyedit IMO. Part of it is redundant, "though Boros inhabit all other districts of Assam", since the lead sentence already says "largest ethnolinguistic group in the Assam state". Second, the "and Meghalaya" part implies that Boros are found in all districts of Meghalaya at significant percentages, which likely is not the case. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 19:26, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: thanks for looking into this. I agree. There are currently too many issues with the entire lead section.  I think this should be corrected properly after a demographic analysis is made on all districts.  Since the Boro people are a scheduled tribe, they are identified via the census. Chaipau (talk) 19:36, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lead