Talk:Damin

message: Hello 
I just want to point out that the exact date, when the last Damin speaker died is unclear. Hale states in 2000 that the last warama  ceremony was held half a century ago. McKnight in his book states (in 1965) that the last ceremony has been hold some 10 years ago. The warama  was usually done with men in their 20. It is difficult to figure out when the last Demiinkurlda died, I think around mid 70 but I am not sure. Oub 18:50, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I have to admit that I was rather hesitant with adding an extinction date at all. Problem is: Damin was quite an unusual language in the sense that it wasn't anybody's native language. "Extinct" means that the last native speaker has died (that's at least the definition used by SIL), which explicitly does not mean that there aren't any people around who know it as a second language. Well, given the role of Damin as a ceremonial language, I thought it not unreasonable to use the year of the last ceremony as its extinction date. Of course, it remains a matter of taste. But if you insist on the 1970s, then in your place I would rather write "1970s" instead of "1975", which is far too precise. --IJzeren Jan  In mij legge alle fogultjes een ij 19:22, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Right, I agree that in that circumstances such a date I problematic, the situation is not very clear to me. First of all the studies performed by Hale about Damin was done in the mid 60 when at least some 10 Demiinkurlda were living. McKnight, the author about an anthropological study of the Lardil himself speaks the language or at least has quite detailed knowledge of it, for he thought some Lardil his knowledge. But as a matter of fact, no warama  ceremony has been hold in the last years also McKnight has expressed his hopes that it might be the case in the future. So in a way the language is sleeping . May be it is best to delete that date and not to specify any. Oub 21:15, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I agree that would be best. Since we all agree that the language �s extinct, I think we should keep the extinction box, but without a year. How does it look now? --IJzeren Jan  In mij legge alle fogultjes een ij 09:06, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Extinction of Damin  

message: :I have to admit that I was rather hesitant with adding an extinction date at all. Problem is: Damin was quite an unusual language in the sense that it wasn't anybody's native language. "Extinct" means that the last native speaker has died (that's at least the definition used by SIL), which explicitly does not mean that there aren't any people around who know it as a second language. Well, given the role of Damin as a ceremonial language, I thought it not unreasonable to use the year of the last ceremony as its extinction date. Of course, it remains a matter of taste. But if you insist on the 1970s, then in your place I would rather write "1970s" instead of "1975", which is far too precise. --IJzeren Jan  In mij legge alle fogultjes een ij 19:22, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Right, I agree that in that circumstances such a date I problematic, the situation is not very clear to me. First of all the studies performed by Hale about Damin was done in the mid 60 when at least some 10 Demiinkurlda were living. McKnight, the author about an anthropological study of the Lardil himself speaks the language or at least has quite detailed knowledge of it, for he thought some Lardil his knowledge. But as a matter of fact, no warama  ceremony has been hold in the last years also McKnight has expressed his hopes that it might be the case in the future. So in a way the language is sleeping . May be it is best to delete that date and not to specify any. Oub 21:15, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I agree that would be best. Since we all agree that the language �s extinct, I think we should keep the extinction box, but without a year. How does it look now? --IJzeren Jan  In mij legge alle fogultjes een ij 09:06, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Re:Extinction of Damin 

message: ::Right, I agree that in that circumstances such a date I problematic, the situation is not very clear to me. First of all the studies performed by Hale about Damin was done in the mid 60 when at least some 10 Demiinkurlda were living. McKnight, the author about an anthropological study of the Lardil himself speaks the language or at least has quite detailed knowledge of it, for he thought some Lardil his knowledge. But as a matter of fact, no warama  ceremony has been hold in the last years also McKnight has expressed his hopes that it might be the case in the future. So in a way the language is sleeping . May be it is best to delete that date and not to specify any. Oub 21:15, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Re: Extinction of Damin 

message: :::Yes, I agree that would be best. Since we all agree that the language �s extinct, I think we should keep the extinction box, but without a year. How does it look now? --IJzeren Jan  In mij legge alle fogultjes een ij 09:06, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Re:

message: Hello 
I must say that I am not to happy about the external link: this is basically copied from the book of Dixon (the name of the mystical person is not correct!) And it does not provide more  information as the article, well Catford is mentioned fine, but that is all. So I propose to delete that link. Oub 21:25, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: External Link 

message: Which are the two rhotics in Lardil that are spelled r and rr, approximant and flap? We should correct the consonant table. kwami 09:56, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  rhotics 

message: I hope to obtain soon an article about Damin phonology and therefore be able to answer that question. Oub 11:43, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: RE: rhotics 

message: Hello
As I said in an earlier mail, the link does not contain any new information and even contain an error concerning the mystical founder of Damin, hence I removed that link. Any objections?  Oub 11:43, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: External Link, removed 

message: Perhaps someone could add a link to an audio file for those intrested in learning correct pronounciation.  As this is an language being so unique it would be worth a type of enthographic observation and recording.
:Do you mean speech examples of Demiin? Impossible, the Lardil do not want such samples to be available to outsiders. There are speech samples collected by Linguists but of course, these Linguists, understandably,  do respect the wish of the Lardil. Oub 13:19, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Speech samples of Demiin 

message: I checked, the last living full fluent Lardil speaker pronounces it Leerdil ! Oub 08:58, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Leerdil or Lerdiil 

message: What is this "practical orthography" the article talks about? Perhaps that should be explained in the article? Jon Harald Søby 13:11, 17 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Re: Jon Hello sorry for the delay. As far as I can remember, the term practical orthography appears in some of the Articles of Hale about Demiin and I think also in the Lardil Dictionary, but I am not sure and shall check. Basically what it means is trying to express the phonetics without using IPA symbols, since English is not very suited for that, Hale tried to use well practical orthography in order to express the phonetics of the words in question Oub 19:47, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, I understand. But perhaps the article should mention it in some way or another, so other people other people aren't confused. Jon Harald Søby 22:41, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Throughout the article, the name of the language is spelled Damin as well as Demiin. It seems like one of these should be chosen as the "correct" way to spell it (at least in English), and to change all of them to that. As a new reader to the article, it was confusing when both of the names began to be used interchangeably. 128.208.232.82 (talk) 22:41, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Practical orthography? 

message: Hello recently somebody added:
 In addition, it used all of the grammatical suffixes of Lardil. It is the only language not to make the distinction between second first and third person, as there is no difference between the second and third person.
Well as described in the article, Demiin has just 2 pronouns, so what is said is just a special case. However without a citation I am very skeptical of claim, that it is the only language. I know of at least one other (ceremonial) language with a very small vocabulary, but I am not sure how many pronouns it posses. In any case it should be it is the only KNOWN language  since there a lot of unrecorded one, especially in the New Guinea area. Oub 13:54, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Every natural language I'm aware of has at least three pronouns, two personal (I/we and you) and one demonstrative (this/that). Not to say there can be others with only two, but 3 PN languages are notable in themselves. kwami 22:20, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

text: Nonetheless, "It is the only language..." is a huge claim to make unreferenced. There are other languages which only make a 1st/non-first in personal pronouns - I don't know whether there are any that only make that distinction everywhere, but it seems perfectly possible...  —Preceding unsigned comment added by profundity 155.245.35.141 (talk) 17:11, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Only language with..  

message: I'm not convinced by Damin's listing as a constructed language. Based on the information given in the article, it appears to be a ceremonial register of Lardil, not a conlang. Categorising it as an Artistic Language, alongside Brithenig and Dothraki, seems especially bizarre/insensitive. Jeikon (talk) 13:13, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not an artistic language and the article does not claim that it is, so you're just wrong there. Damin is quite different from Lardil and has a very limited vocabulary, and cannot function as a natural language. Everything else also indicates a constructed origin. --JorisvS (talk) 13:26, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm referring to the content of the conlang template box appearing at the bottom of the page, which does indeed indicate that Damin is an artistic constructed language. I have no issues with the text of the article. Jeikon (talk) 11:54, 28 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah, okay.  I've changed the navigation template. --JorisvS (talk) 16:01, 28 March 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Classification as a constructed language