Talk:Marsha P. Johnson

message: OK, here are some of the main ones. As discussed regularly, and especially last month, RS sourcing a negative to statements from the subject (Never self-identified as trans) is not really possible. It's not that there are amazing, RS sources out there that we are ignoring. It's that we are dealing with a difficult-to-source bio here. But here are several strong statements of self-identification from interviews in Pay It No Mind, now with the timestamps. I'm going to nowiki them so they can be dropped in as needed. Many of these timestamps were added by productive editors in the edit summaries or are there in the notes; in those cases all that's been added is the quote. In places where something is stated in the beginning of the film, and repeatedly throughout the entire film, I haven't bothered with a timestamp (though for sake of completion, we could certainly cite those with a handful of timestamps). But as we've seen for anything at all controversial, that draws edit-warriors and POV-pushers, we need these. Also, in some places I have purposely avoided pronouns in the edits, due to it discussing times when Marsha either was insisting on a masc. name and presentation, or due to the lesser-known (and not well-documented fact) that Johnson never had "preferred pronouns," and I think some of the emphasis here on fem. pronouns, in the lede in particular, is what has led to the chronic, well-meaning but inaccurate changes to the article and even the source documents. 
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. One of the first people to go in drag at Stonewall: "I didn't get into it right away; I was like the butch makeup queen, working Greenwich Village. And then I started doing drag. ... I started becoming a drag queen."  Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. On dressing up for work and learning how to do makeup, because, "as a pretty little boy, or a pretty little transvestite, or pretty boy made up as a girl, that's the most money you're going to make."  Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. "People used to come and bring guns, and pull guns out on me because they didn't think that I was; you know I would tell them I was a boy and I was in drag and I would tell them that I would go, like, hustling, and would they want to go out? And they'd say, 'Yes, I want to go out.' And then I'd get up in the hotel and I'd take off all my clothes and they'd say, 'I can't believe that you're a boy!' And I know this man can't believe I was a real woman. Honey, I'm just a transvestite." Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. "It was just once in a while I would run into this lunatic who would actually have it in his mind that I was a woman. And I mean I'd tell him that I was a boy and he just wouldn't believe until he'd seen everything down my pants and everything. Another day, another illusion. [laughs]" Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. Marsha P Johnson says Marsha 'Pay It No Mind Johnson' is a "Drag Queen Name" and again self-identifies as a "boy". Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. "The life I thought I'd be living as a homosexual." Also uses "homosexual" as a noun several more times in section, for self and potential husband. Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
Johnson's last two stated self-identifications in film, in 1992, ten days before going missing, are "Legendary Queen" and as part of community of "all gay people.":
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. "There's so many queens gone that I'm one of the few queens still left from the seventies today. But I'm not the only one; there's several legendary queens." Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
 - Michael Kasino. Published on Oct 15, 2012. "That's how come I walk every year. That's how come I've been walking for gay rights all these years. ... You never completely have your rights, one person, till you all have your rights. And I figure as long as there's one gay person that hasn't walked for gay rights... all of us should be walking for gay rights." Accessed 26 Nov 2017.
There are more, but that's what I've got formatted for now. <3 - CorbieV ☊ ☼ 20:58, 26 November 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Recent attempts to remove Marsha's birth name, Malcolm - which Marsha continued to use, along with other variations, sometimes going by the family nickname "Mikey", as well as "Marshall", may be well-meaning, but show a lack of familiarity with the sources, so I am renewing the info in this section. Marsha re-applied for the birth certificate we link here in 1990, removing the Jr., but keeping the birth name of Malcolm intact. I realize that with all the revisionist history out there, it's hard for some to understand that Marsha did not have preferred pronouns, and never really insisted on being called Marsha (it was just the most common name Marsha went by), but sometimes did insist very firmly on being called Malcolm, Marshall or Mikey. This is not part of the most popular narrative in the current activism you find among younger people online, but it's documented, as well as remembered by all of us who are old enough to have been in the Village when the "Mayor of Christopher Street" was still alive. - CorbieV ☊ ☼ 20:39, 31 January 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Formatted citations with time stamps and quotations 

message: Please change the line "Marsha P. Johnson (August 24, 1945 – July 6, 1992), also known as Malcolm Michaels Jr.,[3][4] was an American gay liberation[6][7] activist and self-identified drag queen.[8][9] Known as an outspoken advocate for gay rights," to instead say "Marsha P. Johnson (August 24, 1945 – July 6, 1992),was an American gay liberation[6][7] activist and self-identified trans woman. Known as an outspoken advocate for gay rights," including Marsha's deadname is disrespectful and unnecessary, this is not who she identified as nor what she wants to be remembered as. Not only that, she was not a drag queen, she was a trans woman who fought for the trans community, there is a very important difference. 2600:1011:B13C:4878:C45E:53D5:9689:8D19 (talk) 05:29, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Hyphenation Expert (talk) 06:26, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 2 June 2023 

message: The David France link goes to the wrong David France (not the person who made the documentary). 2601:19B:4100:3F92:44DB:2258:23C8:DBB4 (talk) 19:25, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Error (re: link to filmmaker David France) 

message: The paragraph about RuPaul uses inconsistent pronouns: "During an episode of his show" vs "RuPaul told her contestants" 74.109.181.230 (talk) 10:12, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Charliehdb (talk) 10:29, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 2 June 2024 

message: Put back in my account  170.203.203.100 (talk) 18:40, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  So I deposit  10 dollars to the Yukon Gold, and it's not letting me play my game, so can I have my money back, to my account