Talk:Syncretism

message: I removed the following part of the paragraph on Druzes that I found insulting and definitely not abiding to NPOV. The Druze religion is definitely mysterious and complicated but it doesn't mean that it is "simulated". I am not Druze (nor Lebanese) but I'm currently writing about politics in Lebanon and I can imagine that the author was thinking of the shifting political allegiances of some Druze parties or figures in Lebanon. But this has nothing to do with their religion. Mbaudier (talk) 17:20, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Their practice of disguising themselves as followers of the dominant religion around them makes it difficult to distinguish belief from simulated belief.
In fact, an element of Druze religion is that core practices remain secret and that there be accommodation relative to the beliefs of neighbors, to whom the core practices are represented as non-religous social practices. It is no insult to state this; any inference to politics is conjectural rather than implicit. But this conversation belongs in "Talk" rather than the article- although it is a particularly telling example of syncretism in practice.Klasovsky (talk) 18:22, 2 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Druze and NPOV

message: Recent edit: "Syncretism can be contrasted with contextualization, the practice of making Christianity relevant to a culture." If it can, then it certainly should be contrasted. If it can't be, then the sentence should be deleted. As it stands, the sentence transfers little information. --Wetman 00:35, 2 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: "Contextualism"

message: I removed the following paragraphs. It is unclear, badly written and clearly does not abide to the rules of the NPOV, complaints follow after each paragraph:
:Enlightened and emerging thought beyond the current constructs of the major world religions, left vs right, capatalism, communisim, socalism and so forth is clearly syncretist in nature.
(Why is it "enlightened"? Compared to what? Why is this position so obviously more "enlightened"?)
:Syncretism is the adjective of common sense that has permeated human thought since humanity began. The term encapsulates the wisdom drawn from the observance and acceptance of everything.
(Whose "common sense"? How do you define "common sense"? What is wisdom in this case? What is meant by the "acceptance of everything"? Are we talking ontology, metaphysics etc? Clear it out.)
:Syncretism has always existed and is older than any religious concept or adherance. It is the timeless stream of consciousness that travels in parrallel with human evolution and it's inherant historical and heirachical religious belief systems.
(According to which sources has this "always existed"? According to which sources is it older than any religious concept? What proofs exist? On the contrary -- our oldest books and works of art are clearly non-syncretist and the signs of one single religion. Define "hierarchical religious belief systems" what is included and what is not?)
:Syncretism can not exist within any specific religious sect or order - "The capacity of individual sects Syncretist for survival was also weakened by the syncretist acceptance of all religious myths as being valid and true"
(I can't even understand how this paragraph fits together. Why can't it fit into any specific religious sect or order? On the contrary, several such "sects and orders" exist.)
Harvester 18:36 24 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Grouping some religions under the word "syncretic" might be useful for some purposes, but it seems to me that it's too ambiguous to convey any actual information about a particular religion, without specifying precisely what characteristics of the religion it refers to. For information purposes, it would be much better to list those characteristics. What "syncretic" does do, what it's notorious for doing when applied to a particular religion, is to convey a feeling that predisposes people to discount or devalue that religion, without conveying any actual information about it. It seems to me it would be contrary to the purposes of the Wikipedia to allow the word "syncretic" to be passed off as information, about any particular religion. At best, it might be said that "In view of (list considerations, or link to a discussion of considerations), some people call it 'syncretic'" JimHabegger 12:26, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Excisions for NPOV

message: The following text has been removed more than once from the article, so let it stand here, for information: 
:The word Syncretism comes from Latin syncretismus, which formed on the same model as "concrete" (con + cretus the past participle of crescere, "to grow," giving "grown together") or "accretion" ( a + crescere) "grown towards [a nucleus]]."  Plutarch (1st century CE) apparently overlooked these analogies when he was writing his essay on "Fraternal Love" in his Moralia. Reaching for a source, he found it in the example of the Cretans who were reconciliated in their differences and came together in alliance when faced with external dangers. "And that is their so-called "Syncretism.'" So the word was in circulation when Plutarch wrote in the late 1st century CE, though we have no other examples.
:Blindly following Plutarch, Syncretism is often said to come from the Greek συγκρητισμός (synkretismos), which means that two join a pact against a third.
===Discussion===
The word Syncretism comes from Latin syncretismus, which in turn comes from the Greek συγκρητισμός (synkretismos), which means that two join a pact against a third. The elements are the syn ("together") and cretus (the past participle of crescere, "to grow"); the latter also occurs in "concrete" and "accretion".
::But syn is Greek and crescere is Latin. They didn't mix. -- Error 23:42, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with Error. The Greek syn or συγ (together) , Kret- or Κρητ-, the truncate of Κρητικά (Cretan), and the suffix -ism or ισμός  come together to form this word. This entry should be modified. Brad O. 07:38, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: The corollary to this reasoning, then, is that there is no analogy with "concrete, concretion" or "accretion" etc? Or is the unlikelihood being offered, that the inhabitants of the island of Crete are involved in those words too, in some fashion? I do agree with Error that the macaronic mix of Greek and Latin in syncretism is deplorable, like "homosexual" and many other linguistically barbaric coinings. --Wetman 12:23, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, homo- and hetero- were solid Greek prefixes for ages, and then some boob joined them with the Latin –sexual. American Heritage and Merriam-Webster dictionaries list the Cretan-related origin of syncretism. Disparate Cretans were known to unite against common foes to defend their island. We’ll see what others say, now that the word is on today’s main page. Cheers to the Sox. -- Brad O. 16:04, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

text: and συγκρητίζειν (synkretizen) 
BTW, the quote of Plutarch seems to be rather out of proportion -- I understand that he used the word to mean a simple political pact, not in the sense of the article.  Do we need a whole paragraph for that?
Jorge Stolfi 23:19, 1 Jun 2004 (UTC)

text: Plutarch to the contrary notwithstanding, syncretism has nothing to do with Crete. We are all guilty of folk etymology sometimes, and even Plutarch may nod. It just takes a few words to disambiguate such an entrenched idea. Wetman 23:36, 23 Jun 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes indeed. On the nose. --Wetman 12:23, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

text: I have read that Cretans had the reputation of liars, hence the liar paradox originally features a Cretan. Thus "to syncretize" would have an element of lying. -- Error 00:37, 6 Sep 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: ...an odd conclusion. There's a false syllogism there. The "Cretan" element in "syncretism" is a red herring, anyway, as I explained in the suppressed passage that is quoted above. Wetman 19:49, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)

text: A link removed simply because the available Web information happens to be in a widely-known language that's not English bodes poorly for the thousands of such references in the English-language Wikipedia. A link removed because its misleading inaccuracies is more acceptable: many Christianist links fall under this rubric.
I can confirm that synkretismos originally actually meant 'pact of Cretans'. It is true that by popular etymology it was connected with kerannumi (not crescere) early on, but the correct etymology is definitely from Crete. The meaning of the word changed from 'pact' to , well, syncretism under the influence of the association with kerannumi. dab (ᛏ) 11:50, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

text: An optimistic assertion! We await its confirmation! --Wetman 15:12, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: fair enough. hold your breath :) I resolve to deliver after Christmas. dab (ᛏ) 19:35, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

text: ok, so far I included the information on . the kretismos seems to be disputed, and I am not sure if I can produce definite proof. But I know some linguists favour a direct connection with Crete. The cresecere connectoin seems rather far-fetched, on the other hand. dab (ᛏ) 22:06, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Removed etymology

message: The word Syncretism comes from Latin syncretismus, which in turn comes from the Greek συγκρητισμός (synkretismos), which means that two join a pact against a third. The elements are the syn ("together") and cretus (the past participle of crescere, "to grow"); the latter also occurs in "concrete" and "accretion".
::But syn is Greek and crescere is Latin. They didn't mix. -- Error 23:42, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with Error. The Greek syn or συγ (together) , Kret- or Κρητ-, the truncate of Κρητικά (Cretan), and the suffix -ism or ισμός  come together to form this word. This entry should be modified. Brad O. 07:38, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: The corollary to this reasoning, then, is that there is no analogy with "concrete, concretion" or "accretion" etc? Or is the unlikelihood being offered, that the inhabitants of the island of Crete are involved in those words too, in some fashion? I do agree with Error that the macaronic mix of Greek and Latin in syncretism is deplorable, like "homosexual" and many other linguistically barbaric coinings. --Wetman 12:23, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, homo- and hetero- were solid Greek prefixes for ages, and then some boob joined them with the Latin –sexual. American Heritage and Merriam-Webster dictionaries list the Cretan-related origin of syncretism. Disparate Cretans were known to unite against common foes to defend their island. We’ll see what others say, now that the word is on today’s main page. Cheers to the Sox. -- Brad O. 16:04, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

text: and συγκρητίζειν (synkretizen) 
BTW, the quote of Plutarch seems to be rather out of proportion -- I understand that he used the word to mean a simple political pact, not in the sense of the article.  Do we need a whole paragraph for that?
Jorge Stolfi 23:19, 1 Jun 2004 (UTC)

text: Plutarch to the contrary notwithstanding, syncretism has nothing to do with Crete. We are all guilty of folk etymology sometimes, and even Plutarch may nod. It just takes a few words to disambiguate such an entrenched idea. Wetman 23:36, 23 Jun 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes indeed. On the nose. --Wetman 12:23, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)

text: I have read that Cretans had the reputation of liars, hence the liar paradox originally features a Cretan. Thus "to syncretize" would have an element of lying. -- Error 00:37, 6 Sep 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: ...an odd conclusion. There's a false syllogism there. The "Cretan" element in "syncretism" is a red herring, anyway, as I explained in the suppressed passage that is quoted above. Wetman 19:49, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)

text: A link removed simply because the available Web information happens to be in a widely-known language that's not English bodes poorly for the thousands of such references in the English-language Wikipedia. A link removed because its misleading inaccuracies is more acceptable: many Christianist links fall under this rubric.
I can confirm that synkretismos originally actually meant 'pact of Cretans'. It is true that by popular etymology it was connected with kerannumi (not crescere) early on, but the correct etymology is definitely from Crete. The meaning of the word changed from 'pact' to , well, syncretism under the influence of the association with kerannumi. dab (ᛏ) 11:50, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

text: An optimistic assertion! We await its confirmation! --Wetman 15:12, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: fair enough. hold your breath :) I resolve to deliver after Christmas. dab (ᛏ) 19:35, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

text: ok, so far I included the information on . the kretismos seems to be disputed, and I am not sure if I can produce definite proof. But I know some linguists favour a direct connection with Crete. The cresecere connectoin seems rather far-fetched, on the other hand. dab (ᛏ) 22:06, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Discussion

message: I don't see how this is syncretism, bringing 'different yogas together'(as all yogas form part of hinduism), this idea formed the basis for raja yoga, even BKWSU,Brahma Kumaris or poss. Sri Aurobindo's aim at an Integral Yoga...Domsta333 (talk) 11:50, 14 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ananda Marga 

message: I'm going to remove the statment in the main text that says that the Bahá'í Faith is trying to unite Judaism, Islam and Christianity.  This is not true.  The Bahá'í Faith believes that the source of Judaism, Islam, Christianity and the Bahá'í Faith is one, the one God, but that each religion was revealed at a different time and place according to the exegencies of the day, and thus there will be differences.
Does Bahá'í allow practising other religions together with itself? If yes, then it is a syncretist religion,and then it should not be removed. If not it is not, and then you were right to remove it. --Beoran 00:04, 2004 Dec 31 (UTC)
*While the Bahá'í Faith respects the divine nature of other religions, as a Bahá'í you do not practice the beliefs of other religions, you practise Bahá'í beliefs. --Navidazizi 00:17, 2004 Dec 31 (UTC)
The Unitarian/Universalist Church is a syncretist religion, as all spiritual traditions are welcomed; religious pluralism is one of it's many liberal characteristics.
:If this article is to be limited to religions that explicitly allow sharing beliefs or practices rather than religions resulting from mixings, it should be made clearer.
: Many Unitarian Universalists would object to being labelled a "religion" at all. Members are welcome to to express and share any personal beliefs, from any established religion or none at all. There is a large "Humanist" and atheist segment of UUs that espouse no overtly religious beliefs, as opposed to spiritual aspirations. The "affirmations" adopted by all UU members do not incorporate or aggregate the doctrines of any formalized religions. Lyn (talk) 23:06, 8 September 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: The Bahá'í Faith

message: I'd like some information on the origins of Judaism. Are there any good sources on how it came be, and what elements it gained from other religions?--generally, I mean outside of biblical sources.
there is.. lots of work being done on comparative religion (searching for links between regional alternatives to stories found in the OT specifically).. famous examples there are the flood mentioned in the Gilgamesh Epic (look at it as either 'independent verification' or a fear of water that was relevant to more than one culture, and that the Jewish culture acquired and interpreted in its own way.)Boombaard (talk) 02:27, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  in Judaism

message: it's sort of a shame there's almost nothing on the nearly wholesale appropriation of Greek mythology by the Romans, as well as the interesting differences between the two views on the purpose of religion. for me they probably were the first religions that i noticed the 'extended/sive borrowing' going on, but i can't really say i know enough about it myself to write anything up. Boombaard (talk) 02:59, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I actually just threw in a appositive that the Catholic Saints are probably just Greek/Roman gods by another name.  --Colin, Latin Teacher --Mrcolj (talk) 14:09, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

text: Another example of Roman syncretism is the way then identified the various local gods/goddesses with the Roman equivalents as part of bringing their new subjects into Roman society.  One of the best examples, of course, is the way they appropriated the Twelve Olympians of Greek Mythology, not only by identifying them with their own gods, but bringing in all of the mythology as well.  JDZeff (talk) 18:52, 11 April 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  in greco/roman religion/culture 

message: User:Gschadow removed from Syncretism#Syncretism in Christianity with summary remove mention of Easter as a recent syncretist tradition, nothing syncretist about it, and not recent, Halloween is not a Christian celebration)
For Easter, see Eostre.
Halloween is linked to the Christian eAll Hallows Day.
--Error 00:34, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  in Christianity

message: Could somebody please expand this section? Right now it's one phrase about Islam as syncretic religion, and then two phrases (80% of text) stating that Muslims do not see this as syncretism. This surely could be interpreted as undue weight. I'm sure many would like to see some examples of elements incorporated from Judaism/Christianity/other religions.
--Smokopilomidanek 00:20, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: actually, there is a difference in how islam explicitly states they're the best and the latest when it comes to the Abrahamic religions. Jews/Christians seem to (theologically) gloss over inconsistencies a bit more, though islamic theology (officially, that is.. I don't believe very many of of the vocal ones approve of that notion) is set up in such a way that more recent insights supposedly supersede previous ones (wrt the shari'a/fiqh distinction).Boombaard (talk) 02:59, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  in Islam 

message: What about the syncretism in Norse or Germanic religion as apparent in Vanir and Aesir religion? --Tlatosmd 04:53, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: And its blending with Christianity, as mentioned in various places in Ragnarök, and the ambiguous Thor's hammer / cross pendants that exist, the Christ-like character of Baldr, and possible influence of Norse mythology from the Greek. 213.122.16.90 (talk) 22:05, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Norse syncretism 

message: There really should be some mention of the Gospel of Mani. It was an attempt by Mani to syncretise Christianity, Zoroastrianism, and Judaism. Not sure what section to put it in though...freestylefrappe 00:16, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gospel of Mani

message: The link to timboucher.com is a dead link.  I visited the site, but I cannot find the described essay on syncretism anywhere.  I am removing this link.  I could not find any other suitable external link to replace it.  --Euthydemos 14:27, 1 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: "External Links"

message: Is Chrismukkah an example of syncretism? Also, the interfaith article notes its distinction from syncretism, but the inverse is not true. 66.167.139.143 (talk) 08:20, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chrismukkah 

message: Does anyone else find it odd that the "Latter Day Movement" is refered to as a syncretism of Christianity? To me, its the same as calling Islam a syncretism of Christianity (After all, Jesus Christ was a prophet in the Quran). Morminism is more like the 4th Book religion (Judasim, Islam, Chrisianity, Mormanism). Maybe its just me as an outsider looking in, but it does seem wierd. SGT Justin Gregory Blodgett, US Army Infantryman (talk) 20:00, 26 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Great point - this was incorrect. As a Latter-Day Saint, I'll try to clarify without being too verbose. Yasashiku (talk) 00:28, 17 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disagreement 

message: Suggest adding something about the Masonic Order, syncretism of these beliefs with that of a religious order that bears some similarities otherwise.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.9.207.65 (talk) 01:03, 13 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Masonic Order 

message: What's it there for? Cdh1984 (talk) 19:27, 30 October 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Map graphic 

message: When syncretism increases tolerance, but also atheistic criticism and naturalist theories (usually scientific).  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:2149:8209:7100:CBB:84BB:A6B5:97B3 (talk) 22:08, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  make paragraph and page: [[Syncretic secularism]] 

message: "Indian influences are seen in the practice of Shi'i Islam in Trinidad. Others have strongly rejected it as devaluing and compromising precious and genuine distinctions; examples include post-Exile Second Temple Judaism, Islam, and most of Protestant Christianity." The second sentence does not refer to the first.
Drsruli (talk) 06:19, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Non sequitor 

message: The main photo on this page shows what it calls an example of Greco-Egyptian syncretism, but there is no information about this in the article. It made me think of the great Greco-Buddhist art of Afghanistan, Pakistan, etc. that spread after Alexander's campaign through the region. Does anyone have any thoughts on adding this content in. I've wanted to research the topic more after seeing some of these statues at the Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York, but I didn't know where the info would be needed. Perhaps this page is a good place to start. —Zujine|talk 09:52, 26 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Greco art