Talk:Onychomycosis

message: Onchomycosis can be caused by many different fungi, and many other conditions like a psoriatic nail and paronychia can look so much like it that dermatologists still need to have a lab workup done.  What was the causal agent, if any, of the wife's onychomycosis that was relieved with vinegar?  How can anyone possibly give universal medical advice based on one person's kitchen experiments with the application of 19th century hygiene principles to an (I strongly suspect) undiagnosed condition?  
Mercurochrome contains mercury and is banned in the US.  All sorts of these common home disinfectants were tested against fungal skin and nail infections in the 1910's to 1950's and the only one that stood out as somewhat effective was Whitfield's ointment, with the active ingredient benzoic acid.  But even it doesn't stand up to scientific comparison as a serious onychomycosis remedy.  The common fungi causing dermatophyte onychomycosis are too deeply seated in the nail to be affected by materials applied to the surface (unless the materials are combined with chemical nail softeners under occlusion).  Mercurochrome is commonly used in developing countries to treat fungal ear canal infestation (otomycosis), but there the fungus is right at the surface.  Mercurochrome can't even penetrate to kill the endospores within spore-forming bacteria.     
Onychomycosis isn't life-threatening but casual treatment recommendations based on anecdotes are no more helpful here than they are in any other disease.  No doubt carrot juice and staying optimistic cured somebody's wife's cancer somewhere, but there's a serious ethical problem with extending this observation into a general prescription. Yes, any individual could make a novel observation -- but there's nothing novel about applying vinegar, iodine, garlic, lemon peel, oregano, etc. against fungal skin infections.  It's been done.  Tea tree oil is still being investigated but results are mixed (for references go to Entrez PubMed website and search on keywords: tea tree oil onychomycosis.  Also: tea tree oil tinea.  Also: tea tree oil dermatophyte).  Keywords for the otomycosis statement above are otomycosis mercurochrome.  
Summerbell 18:32, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Remember, Wikipedia does not exist to provide medical or health advice. For medically oriented articles such as this one the focus of the article is etiology and the popular treatments, peer reviewed scientifically proven treatments as well as popular folk remedies. Even if these folk remedies are totally useless or even counter productive and dangerous. This provides those reading the article a good overview of all the available "treatments," and more importantly the place of the disease within our society as a whole. Besides anyone reading Wikipedia as their sole source of diagnoses and treatment information has greater problems. 130.71.96.19 16:19, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Home remedies 

message: I could get one.  The question is, would anyone really want to see it?
: The article lacks a good quality image, go for it. Pgr94 05:39, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes would be nice, but this comment has not seen any replies. Main page has a picture which is fine IMO. Calling this comment done.  17387349L8764 (talk) 19:21, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anyone interested in a picture for this article? 

message: My wife had an infection and cured it by soaking the infected toe for 30 minutes in vinegar every day for 3 months. She would keep the nail as trimmed as possible the whole time. Don't cause your body stress with something like Lamisil. Save your money and health.
: Hi, comment is not signed and personal experience. Very unsuitable for encyclopedia. Vinegar is not mentioned in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fungicide and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fungicides, and neither in for example https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0738081X0900248X?via%3Dihub. Calling this comment done. If you think vinegar has an effect, add it with quality references.  KR 17387349L8764 (talk) 19:24, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vinegar 

message: I wanted to add something on the FDA OTC Topical Antifungal Monograph, but all I could find were some very general bits of info on the FDA website (see  and ). I also haven't been able to find anything on the FDA's 1994 ruling that said that no OTC anti-fungal product was effective on nails, and required the wording "this product is not effective on scalp or nails" on all OTC anti-fungal products (even if they were still allowed to use trademarks such as Fungi-Nail!). The closest I could find was this DOC file Comparison of Labeling for All Topical Antifungals Treating Athlete’s Foot. Can anyone provide better information? BlankVerse 15:37, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  FDA Topical Antifungal Monograph 

message: *Tea tree oil is a known antifungal. The topical application of high levels is a verified remedy for some dermatophytic skin infections although not for onychomycosis, where the fungus is often too deeply nested in dense subsurface nail tissue to be full expunged by topically applied materials of any kind.
The article that is referenced does not say that tea-tree oil doesn't work because the fungus is too deep subsurface.  This needs more evidence or is WP:OR. Pgr94 18:41, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it was because of the WP:OR reference to the fungus being too deep to be treated by Tea tree oil. If you want to put it back in and either find a source for this claim or remove it feel free. Personally I tried treating my fungus militantly with Tea tree oil, with four treatments a day. During this period the fungus, which had been advancing, went into remission in all my nails, but the fungus under a few toe nails was persistent. I eventually stopped treatment and the fungus has not returned in any nails, but has grown back in the nails where it was still present. 130.71.96.19 16:25, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ineffectiveness of Tea-tree oil - evidence? 

message: The section related to tea tree oil was removed from the 'natural remedies' section via this edit by User:68.36.170.182.  Was this removal in accordance with consensus? --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 01:12, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it was because of the WP:OR reference to the fungus being too deep to be treated by Tea tree oil. If you want to put it back in and either find a source for this claim or remove it feel free. Personally I tried treating my fungus militantly with Tea tree oil, with four treatments a day. During this period the fungus, which had been advancing, went into remission in all my nails, but the fungus under a few toe nails was persistent. I eventually stopped treatment and the fungus has not returned in any nails, but has grown back in the nails where it was still present. 130.71.96.19 16:25, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Removal of passage

message: * Crocodile Oil: There is something amazing in the crocodile’s immune system, there are strings of peptides that were only discovered very recently in the last eight or nine years and they are a powerful mechanism for fighting bacteria and fungal infections. Repcillin Crocodile Skin Balm is made in South Africa and uses the fat from CITES approved Crocodile farms in Africa.
: Is this verifiable?  WP:V Pgr94 22:35, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Crocodile Oil 

message: There are different types of onychomycosis.  It would be good to get images of each type.  For example see  Pgr94 10:25, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wanted: images for each type of onychomycosis 

message: As no evidence has been found for vinegar since Feb. 2007, I have removed it. 
Distilled white vinegar.  Drops are applied to the cuticle twice a day.  This method does not kill the fungus, but the vinegar allegedly changes the pH (acid content) of the new nail formed in that 12-hour period. (The scientific perspective, however, is that vinegar is unlikely to penetrate the dense keratinous tissue thoroughly enough to have any significant effect. Instead, it may be absorbed by the skin above the nail and work its way to where the nail is actually forming.) As the old, infected nail grows and is cut away, it is said to be replaced by an acidic nail, uninhabitable by fungi.  Several months of consistent application are involved.
Pgr94 (talk) 13:14, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Vinegar treatment needs referencing. As answered in another section, is not mentioned as fungicide (or activity, effectivity) and neither in medical literature such as https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0738081X0900248X?via%3Dihub therefore closing this comment.  KR 17387349L8764 (talk) 19:27, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vinegar passage removed. 

message: If someone with access to good sources could examine these issues and possibly amend the article it would be appreciated
* The fungus "infects" the nail.  Could this be clarified as to whether fungus is growing under and around the nail, or within the material of the nail itself?
* Also the difficulty of treatment seems to be because of the difficulty of getting treating agent to the best location.  Is drilling holes in the nail a workable option?
Thanks, Wanderer57 (talk) 20:33, 30 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fungus location 

message: Short of time right now so this a note to self, or anyone who else wants to follow recents developments.
* see reviews  and 
* check differential diagnosis of psoriatic nails
pgr94 (talk) 22:25, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, great share, but meanwhile it's 2021. Any integration of the parts? I think your goal should be to integrate directly if you find, as it would come with greater success and satisfaction for you and us. KR 17387349L8764 (talk) 18:28, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent reviews (Aug 2008) 

message: I've had severe toenail fungus for just over forty years.  It started when I lived in the tropics.
At this writing, the fungus is completely expelled in two nails, is almost done being expelled in four others, and halfway gone in the big toes.  Two were already clear.
How?  I soak the toes in 50% Listerine, 50% white vinegar, for 30-45 minutes every night.  I started about four months ago.  I didn't make this up - a Google search for "Listerine toenail fungus" finds many testimonials, and occasional discussions of the method of operation.  It seems that the fungi can't handle eucalyptol and thymol, plus the other assorted toxins that make Listerine lethal when a lot is swallowed.
Not sure if a photo of the half-clear big toes would be helpful.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by MoonDJ (talk • contribs) 16:33, 31 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, glad "something" (like Listerine) worked for you. If you have materials (references, studies, valid scientific documents) you should include it directly. Your experience is unique, remember, and it ships with many other conditions and constraints, but this is an encyclopedia and this article needs specific scientific-medical clarity IMHO. Since you did not receive any replies, nor has this discussion been answered or reflected, I call it done for now unless someone will cite/references it with resources. KR  17387349L8764 (talk) 18:31, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Listerine and vinegar 

message: On recommendation from my GP, using a cotton swab, applying a single drop of undiluted bleach twice a day underneath my toenail is rapidly removing the fungus. Half of the nail bed has recovered in 6 months. Application is quick and there seems to be no tissue damage. If considered, use caution though...
RudiBosbouer (talk) 08:03, 14 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Anecdotal evidence that should be ignored.  Unless you have reliable sources, this means nothing.  Please don't post your personal medical experiences.  OrangeMarlin Talk• Contributions 17:20, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: It may or may not mean nothing.  Any established remedy was once experimental.  I, for one, intend to try it. Kostaki mou (talk) 23:12, 31 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Having done just that, may I add that it is important to have adequate ventilation to avoid inhaling the vapor. Kostaki mou (talk) 22:10, 3 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Someone posted a while ago that she used Comet to remove the fungus, however her toe got cancerous and had to be amputated. Be careful with unproven remedies. Joshmax (talk) 18:06, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

text: Hi, fully disagree with this "solution" by your "GP". Bleach is unacceptable for body (inside, outside) normally. What next, petrol? I close this discussion because no scientific referencing and anything like "take bleach" is nothing the main public should read about in an encyclopedia. Cite it, reference it, add studies, etc. but not like this. I come across wild things too, but we should try to raise the bar for general public. For other information, see main articles such as Virucide, which has tons of references including bleach. Nobody, no GP ever should recommend you bleach. Just no, not even in discussion.  17387349L8764 (talk) 18:35, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Undiluted Bleach 

message: These should be used as refs rather than as further reading
* 
* 
Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 17:00, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I would accept there use if full access was available for free but there isn't. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 00:56, 27 May 2011 (UTC)

text: It would be more constructive to provide alternatives than to just remove them from the article.  pgr94 (talk) 09:11, 27 May 2011 (UTC)

text: Thanks, helpful finds! I will add them to a new section together with the findings by pgr94, so we have a list of references (free, open, or not, whatever) we can use as potential references. I would close this there otherwise for clarity. KR  17387349L8764 (talk) 18:37, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title: Reviews

message: I was diagnosed with Onychomycosis and was treated with fulvacin.  The condition was eliminated within 45 days as the nail grew out.  Any claim of a "challenging" treatment in this article seems to exist in order to appease believers in alternative and holistic remedies, or to appease persons apprehensive of "mainstream" treatments.  Claims of a cure based on garlic/vinegar/lasers/prayer seems dubious at best.  My chemical-laden, corporate/mainstream/liver-killing treatment cured my condition post haste, and I wouldn't have it any other way.  Enjoy your fungus -- I'm sure your girl loves it!!  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.60.103.173 (talk) 04:51, 1 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Efficiacy of home remedies 

message: Once I had an infection in one of the foot's small fingers, it lasted for at least a year, until I removed the nail myself with a tweezer. The nail grew back and the infection was gone. Any opinions from physicians or scientific studies in this regard?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.238.51.163 (talk) 02:24, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes it exists, however is not recommended. WebMD mentions it, however, there is no guarantee that the new nail is free of fungus and in fact I know a person who had it done and the nail is still infected. Nail removal is also mentioned and discussed differently in literature and medical context, as nail avulsion. Welsh et al. mention that "removal of the diseased nail, followed by treatment with topical antifungals or the use of new-generation azoles may improve therapeutic outcome.", so clearly, the removal alone will not solve it. I will add this and further information later on, but close your comment from 2021.  KR 17387349L8764 (talk) 19:10, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  How about nail removal? 

message: There are products on the market claiming to cure onychomycosis with Undecylenic acid as the active ingredient.  Pubmed doesn't show very strong evidence for this.  E.g. .  Does anyone know of any other evidence for undecylenic acid?  Meanwhile beware that the science doesn't appear to support the claims of "Fungi Nail"'s peddlars.  (www.funginail.com)   Treat nail fungus infection. Suitable for everyone (all ages) Tested clinically with 100 % efficiency after 12 weeks of use. pgr94 (talk) 18:08, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, yes good finding (the references), did you read it? It concludes "Combining all patients treated with the cyanoacrylate solution demonstrated a 49% cure rate at 1 year, which compares with only a 36% rate of mild or moderate disease with topical ciclopirox and a 25% cure of all nails with oral terbinafine." Worth mentioning on main article space I think but 3-5 more references would be ideal to support this (cyanoacrylate solution). I will add it to the new section "List of references", calling this done.  17387349L8764 (talk) 19:18, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Side note: Warning: Cyanoacrylate also known as "Super glue", so whatever the "solution" is needs to be critically understood. BR 17387349L8764 (talk) 19:34, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Undecylenic acid 

message: Onychomycosis is infection of the nail. Paronychia is infection around the nail. The lede of each article should make readers aware of the other, closely related article. (I have tried to cross-link the articles. My work was reverted. Now the matter is in your hands.) -71.174.175.150 (talk) 15:08, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: It is already crosslinked and listed here "Diseases of the skin and appendages by morphology" at the bottom. Does not need cross linking twice. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 20:58, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Completely uselessly obscure and inadequate to help the average browsing reader to be aware of this very relevant potential confusion, between two very similar conditions.-71.174.175.150 (talk) 14:46, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: We specifically do not list in see also sections topics already linked in an article. Mentioned that they are similar here  Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 19:33, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Onychomycosis vs. Paronychia 

message: I had nail fungus back in 2000 and was prescribed Griseofulvin and it knocked it out in four months.  I think this drug has been generic since the birth of Christ, so I'm not shilling for big pharma/the liver killing industry.  Just saying what worked for me.  You can soak your toes in bleach/vinegar/witch potion all you want.  Have fun with your nail fungus. 24.51.217.118 (talk) 22:06, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, right, it's not mentioned in the main article which is not ideal, however is under https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fungicides mentioned. It's mainly against ring worm, so application in case of onychomycosis needs further referencing and elaboration IMO. Further, "For many fungal infections, especially of the nail (tinea unguium), newer drugs work better than griseofulvin.", so it's not really used for nail fugus.  KR 17387349L8764 (talk) 19:38, 10 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Griseofulvin