Talk:Gustav Stresemann

message: I swear he got killed.... or does my memory fail me?
:Heart attack. You're thinking of Walter Rathenau, I think. Mackensen (talk) 15:02, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: I just reverted Molobo's latest attempt to distort the description of Stresemann's role. For my rationale, see above. --Thorsten1 17:29, 11 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Molobo's renewed attempts to overstate Stresemann's "aggressiveness" towards Poland 

message: Somebody wrote a long text on Stresemann at Stresemann, Gustav (Weimar Era). I couldn't identify it as copyvio through just googling, and moved the text to Talk:Gustav Stresemann/Moved text, where it is available for possible later merging or other use. up+land 20:36, 2 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Moved text

message: I have removed the following sentence "The reason were the atrocities against the German minority in the occupied territories committed by or tolerated by the Polish government, see: Hermann Rauschning" as this is grossly POV. The reference to the "occupied territories" implies that the lands lost by Germany to Poland after World War I still rightfully belonged to Germany. Through that was in fact Stresemann's viewpoint, presenting it like that as a statement of fact is very POV. Through the Polish government was more noted for breaching then observing the Minority Treaty, I think the term "atrocities" is a little too strong. Not allowing ethnic German children to attend a German language school for instance can hardly be considered an "atrocity". Anyhow, atrocities or no atrocities, Stresemann would had still wanted the former German lands back, so presenting Stresemann's determination to take all of the former German lands in Poland as only a response to Polish "atrocities" is highly misleading. Indeed, one can take this a step further and say that for Stresemann, like many other Germans in the 1920s, the problem were not so much Germany's borders with Poland, but the existence of Poland, period that was the issue. Plus, one is not supposed to be using another article to support a statement, so using the Rauschning article as a basis for that is also wrong. --A.S. Brown (talk) 01:38, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: With all due respect, Jäger, you are wrong here. Your question posed here about why former German cities should not belong to Poland shows your problem here, namely you are following a German nationalist agenda. This is supposed to a talk page for dicussing improvements to this article, not a forum about why certain cities should belong to Germany, not Poland, but since the question was posed here, I'll give you an answer. First thing, it is totally irrelevant who founded what city when it becomes time to decide ownership. By your logic, New York should belong to the Dutch today since they founded that place. So the U.S. government should just surrender New York to give it back to the Dutch with no regard for the feelings of the vast majority of New Yorkers who see themselves as Americans. Second, Poznań was not "entirely inhabitated" by Germans. According to the German census of 1910, 57% of Poznań's population were Poles. And finally, the Polish people of Poznań were so unhappy about being under German rule that they revolted in December 1918 in order to rejoin Poland, something that you seem to have no interest in. Turning back to this article, you seem to be suggesting that Poland was waging some sort of genocide against its German minority in the 1920s. This is a most extraordinary claim that is only be backed up by a book written by Rausching all the way back in 1929. I'll have never, never' read anything to support that claim in any mainstream history book, ever (trust me, I'll have read a great deal about modern European history). If that is really true (and I'll very strongly doubt that it is), why don't you bring in some work by a historian publishing through an academic press or in a proper historical journal to support this uttery extraordinary claim that the Polish government was operating secret camps where thousands of ethnic Germans were "disappearing" (presumably murdered) in the 1920s, instead of a book published all the way back in 1929 by a man well known for his tendency to invent things? If your claims of genocide are true, you should have no trouble finding such an article or book by a historian published in the last ten years saying that (note that neo-Nazi cranks who often make that claim don't count). As far as I am aware, no historian today has ever endorsed Rausching's book, which makes it a bad source. Finally, the 1928 exchange at the League of Nations is being phrased to make it sound like the entire world stood in support of Germany's claims against Poland, and really needs to be rephrased. Really, I have no problem if you want to say that Stresemann complained about the schools question, but calling that an "atrocity" is way over the top. Saying that Stresemann wanted the land that used to belong to Germany returned is OK, but much of your edits seemed designed to defame Poland by painting that country as systematically oppressing its minorities, and thus justifying Stresemann's campaign, which is not OK. What you really should be thinking about is that is in the 1950s-1960s, the West German government rejected the Oder-Neisse line, and wanted a return to the German-Polish border of December 31, 1937, that is the frontier established by the treaty of Versailles. The same frontiers that Germans spent the entire 1920s-30s complaining about as totally unreasonable, a frontier that no German could live with is the same frontiers that Germans in the 1950s-60s wanted to see re-established, which might suggest that the borders set up by the Treaty of Versailles were no-where near as unreasonable as Stresemann and everybody else in Germany claimed in the 1920s. Given the fact that the Oder-Neisse line was created in response to World War II, which in its turn was caused when Germany attacked Poland in 1939, might that suggest this German campaign against the frontiers of Versailles was ultimately a self-destuctive one? Might not Germany been better off if it had accepted the frontiers of Versailles instead of seeking to challenge them? There is a very good book by Detlev Peukert which says that if Germany would done far better if had just accepted the frontiers of Versailles since seeking to challenge them caused the most bloody war in history, and which ended with Germany losing much more land than under Versailles. Peukert does not quite put it like this, but in essence he calls Stresemann an idiot for his views about Poland. After all, if Germany had not attacked Poland in 1939, what are now the Polish cities of Wrocław and Szczecin would still be the German cities of Breslau and Stettin. By seeking to challenge the frontiers of Versailles, Germany lost far more land to Poland than been the case under the much-hated Treaty of Versailles, which might suggest that Stresemann and company were no doing Germany any favors with their obsession with overthrowing Versailles. Something to think about. --A.S. Brown (talk) 01:47, 22 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: This is really POV

message: As well as being Chancellor, Stresemann was Foreign Minister of Germany from August 13th 1923 (while he was Chancellor he was also Foreign Minister)to October 3rd 1929,when he died. 
He was preceded by Friedrich von Rosenberg and succeeded by Julius Curtius.
I tried to add this information to the info box but couldn't do it. If anyone knows how I would appreciate it if they could add a Foreign Minister section to the info box.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.96.127.111 (talk) 17:25, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Foreign Minister - info box 

message: Vierteljahrshefte für Zeitgeschichte is used as source to claim supposed atrocities in Poland.
It so happens that it was the journal made by German nationalists Hans Rothfels who supported Nazis before the war untill he was forced to escape Germany due to his Jewish roots, and who repeatedly bashed Poland in German nationalist propaganda. In other words it seems to be very dubious source. I also made several edits to remove comments and claims not supported by sources and against Wikipedia is not an essey rule--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 00:46, 25 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: You deleted the period concerning Stresemanns Poland-Policy with the exception of one sentence, where is said that he was not ready to make peace with Poland. So the reader must get the impression that Stresemann has been a "war monger", which he wasn´t. Remember that this is the article of a Peace-Nobel-Laureate! The section "in the Weimar Republic" in the present form is a deep injury against him! This article has to inform the reader for what resons Stresemann acted as he did. On whole wikipedia there is not a single article, where the atrocities against the German miority in Polen, which were the reason, are mentioned. Therefore I have tried to furnish evidence of these happenings by citing some sources, principally those about the session of the League of Nations in Lugano in 1928. The claim that Hermann Rauschning is a "nazi author" has been completely refuted on the talk page of his article. I therefore invite you to restore the period in the original form!Jäger (talk) 22:37, 8 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Neither this article nor the one on Hermann Rausching (where you you've been trying to insert similar material for the past two years against consensus) is a place for your POV pushing about supposed "Polish crimes".Volunteer Marek (talk) 00:45, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Dear Marek, you know very well that these polish crimes are not "supposed" ones, but that they really happened. You should take a look at the Hermann Rauschning-talk page, where you will find the article of a contemporary Polish professor, his name is also Marek,  who confirms this!Jäger (talk) 00:05, 31 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: For the 1000th time, this isn't an article for this kind of stuff, EVEN IF there was some substance to it (rather than just being straight up POV pushing). We've been over this on Rauschning's page, on WP:RS several times - you've kept this up for something like 3 years now and each time you were told (not just by me but by many others) that these edits are not appropriate. Each time you failed to get any thing near a consensus for their inclusion. Keep em out.Volunteer Marek (talk) 08:02, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

text: Dear Marek, You may constantly remove my edits but You can not remove the truth!Jäger (talk) 23:49, 2 October 2011 (UTC)

text: Dear Marek, what did Pope John Paul II. say under the Brandenburg Gate in Berlin: "Es gibt keine Freiheit ohne die Wahrheit" (there is no liberty wihthout the truth)Jäger (talk) 00:06, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vierteljahrshefte für Zeitgeschichte 

message: The image near the bottom of a book (biography?) doesn't seem to have a purpose. It should be removed, or updated with subtext and moved to a relevant location if it is deemed important.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.177.20.123 (talk) 05:34, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image of book? 

message: The paragraph on the Rentenmark just seems really shoddily written. I'd fix it myself but I'm busy right now.
Hyperinflation in the Weimar Republic would reach its peak in November 1923.[11] Since Germany was no longer able to pay the striking workers, more and more money was printed, which finally led to hyperinflation. Eventually Stresemann introduced Germany's new currency- the Rentenmark. This ended this disastrous process by introducing a new currency, the Rentenmark, which reassured the people that the democratic system was willing and able to solve urgent problems.
See what I mean? TotallyNotEtreo 14:06, 14 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rentenmark 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The paragraph on Stresemann's Poland policy has a number of serious problems. The following statement "In the same year, while Poland was in a state of political and economic crisis, Stresemann began a trade war against the country. Stresemann hoped for an escalation of the Polish crisis, which would enable Germany to regain territories ceded to Poland after World War I, and he wanted Germany to gain a larger market for its products there. So Stresemann refused to engage in any international cooperation that would have "prematurely" restabilized the Polish economy." is not sourced by the articles cited. Nor is the statement "Besides waging economic war on Poland, Streseman funded extensive propaganda efforts and plotted to collaborate with Soviet Union against Polish statehood." The article actually states "On another front, Stresemann courted the favor of the Soviet Union. Amicable relations with Russia would protect Germany from utter dependence upon the good will of the West and would intimidate Poland" (p. 39). Furthermore, the article says that Stresemann's hopes to redefine the border after 1925 came to naught because he assumed Poland would collapse into civil war and need Western aid, a condition of which would be the annexation of limited areas (Danzig, the corridor, parts of Polish Silesia). Poland remained stable, so this didn't happen. There's nothing here about plotting against Polish statehood, merely that Stresemann hoped to revise the borders. The statements about his trade war and plot to destroy Poland either needs to be sourced or removed.2601:85:C202:150:124:C63:BE66:BD68 (talk) 02:44, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Poland Paragraph 

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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion