Talk:Nueces massacre

message: Hollywood should film this remarkable episode of history! 91.65.16.97 (talk) 19:26, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Hollywood

message: Campbell, Randolph B. Gone to Texas: A History of the Lone Star State. New York: Oxford University Press, 2003.
Kamphoefner, Walter D. "New Perspectives on Texas Germans and the Confederacy." The Southwestern Historical Quarterly 102, no. 4 (April 1999): 440-455. http://www.jstor.org/stable/30242540 (accessed February 11, 2013).
Marten, James. Texas Divided: Loyatly and Dissent in the Lone Star State, 1856-1874. Lexington, Kentucky: University Press of Kentucky, 1990.
McGowen, Stanley S. "Battle or Massacre?: The Incident on the Nueces, August 10, 1862." The Southwestern Historical Quarterly 104, no. 1 (July, 2000): 64-86. http://www.jstor.org/stable/30241669 (accessed February 11, 2013).
Shook, Robert W. "The Battle of the Nueces, August 10, 1862." The Southwestern Historical Quarterly 66, no. 1 (July, 1962): 31-42. http://www.jstor.org/stable/30236222 (accessed February 11, 2013).
Wooster, Ralph A. Civil War Texas: A History and a Guide. Austin: Texas State Historical Association, 1999.
--Stonecm (talk) 01:26, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Bibliography

message: Nueces Massacre Outline
I.	Stub Introduction: This is the brief summary before the article proper.  Will mostly be the existing first paragraph, but there will be a few sentences as an addendum on the outrage that followed (Marten, 120).  There may also be a reference to continued 21st century dispute between descendants in the area on justification for the incident (McGowen, 85-86).
II.	Background:
 
A.	German Population in Texas
a.	German immigrant or recent (first or second generation) descendant population reached approximately 20,000 in Texas around 1860 (Campbell, 207).
b.	Settlement Patterns: Though Germans lived most areas, they settled heavily in the Hill Country along the Guadalupe, Colorado, and Brazos rivers (Struve, 3). The settlement can be described as a “geographic triangle” between San Antonio, Seguin, and New Braunfels in South-Central (at the time known as western Texas) Texas (Shook, 31).  A series of counties in this region, mentioned in the existing second paragraph, was known as the “German Belt” and Germans ran the municipalities (Campbell, 207-208).
c.	Political disposition of Germans:
i.	 Germans were a complex population, but generally were apathetic or antagonistic to slavery (Kamphoefner, 449).  Those who were slave owners kept them more as servants than as a connection to cotton-culture, and were not wedded to the system (Kamphoefner 442-444).
ii.	This population was augmented by a very liberal and republican group of Germans, known as achtundvierzieger or forty-eighters.  These were the immigrants from the failed revolutions of 1848 and were vehemently opposed to slavery.  In 1854 at the Saengerfest (a festival) in San Antonio they actually authored a political platform calling for its abolition, later called the “San Antonio Platform” (Marten, 27)
iii.	This animosity between Anglo-Texans and Germans simmered through the 1850’s and the disputes were only magnified by the Civil War (Marten, 31).
B.	Disputatious Germans and Violence between 1861 and August 1862
a.	Confederate Point of View: On declaration of war, Germans were mostly, to outward appearances, passive (Wooster, 37). Confederate officials, however, saw the German population as an internal threat.  They sensed a lack of support for the Confederate cause among the Germans and even celebration at Union victories (McGowen, 68).  There was also fear about German-run local militias arming and organizing these potential threats (McGowen, 67).
b.	German Actions: Most Germans did nothing of the sort and were apathetic to the cause (Marten, 115).  Confederate fears were not, however, entirely unfounded.  In June 1861, several forty-eighters organized the Union Loyal League.  Though purportedly established to protect the Hill country counties from Indians and outlaws, it was rumored, and probably was, the enforcement arm of German unionist sentiment (McGowen, 67-69).  The Union Loyal League even created strategies to break out federal soldiers from Camp Verde (McGowen, 72). 
c.	The Draft and Response
i.	The Confederate Conscription Act was passed in early 1862.  This section will be covered in the existing second paragraph. 
ii.	The Confederate response to German opposition, as well as earlier disputes (see above), was to have General Bee dispatch Captain James Duff, and impose martial law on Gillespie County in late May 1862 (Shook, 32 and McGowen, 75).  Captain Duff was viewed by his troops as unfit for command and overly aggressive, though this does explain his arrest and execution of two German immigrants (McGowen, 76).  Considering the Confederate response, and the difficulty in living in the Confederacy as active unionists, several German-Americans took this last affront as a reason to leave.
iii.	Frederick “Fritz” Teneger and his Union Loyal League associates planned to leave Texas by way of Mexico.  They would eventually make their way to New Orleans and join the Union effort (Shook, 35).
III.	Flight and Battle
a.	Departure
i.	61 German-Americans, led by Fritz Teneger departed from Turtle Creek near Kerrville between August 1st, and August 3rd, 1862 (Shook, 35).
ii.	Informed of their intentions, Captain Duff dispatched Lieutenant Colin McRae with approximately 96 men in pursuit on August 3rd, 1862 (McGowen, 77).
b.	The Engagement
i.	Lt. McRae made contact with the German camp at the banks of the Nueces River in a small prairie.  Lt. McRae organized a pincer to surround the German camp and attacked just after 1:00 a.m. (McGowen, 77-78).
ii.	The battle ensues.  It ends with a Confederate charge on the camp and the flight, serious wounding, or death of all the Germans (McGowen, 78-80).
IV.	Casualties and Aftermath
a.	Confederate Losses: These numbered two dead and eighteen wounded, including Lt. McRae (Shook, 39).
b.	German-American Losses: Reports on casualties for the vanquished were sparse and inconclusive (McGowen, 81-82). A reasonable conclusion is that nineteen Germans died outright in the assault on the camp (Campbell, 265).  How the Confederates dealt with the wounded and fleeing is what gave this conflict the apt title of massacre.  Nine badly wounded Germans were killed following the battle by the Confederate cavalrymen and nine more were pursued to the Rio Grande where they too perished (Campbell, 265).
c.	Those that survived both the battle and the pursuit either hid out in Texas, fled to Mexico, or eventually joined Union forces like the Union First Texas Cavalry (Shook, 41).  The engagement at the Nueces River, though gaining the Confederate administration the ire of other Germans, did mark the general end of overt and distracting unionism among this group (Shook, 42).
V.	Legacy
a.	Texas Germans were some of the largest celebrants of Union victory (Kamphoefner, 451)
b.	Local German-Americans erected the “Treue der Union” monument (use existing fifth paragraph) on January 20, 1866 as the only monument to unionism erected by locals on former Confederate territory (Kamphoefner, 440, 451)
c.	Battle or Massacre?
i.	The well-armed state of the Germans, based on McRae’s reports of recovered arms, and their intention to fight for the Union supports the less common moniker Battle of Nueces (McGowen, 83-84).
ii.	Viewed in the light of the repression and killing of 18 German-Americans in an execution-style seem unnecessary (McGowen, 85-86).  
iii.	Continued dispute (McGowen, 85-86)
ATTENTION OTHER EDITORS: As part of Wikipedia's education project, I will be adding this information in a more complete form over the next few months.  Criticism and suggestions are welcome, but beware of large adjustments.  
New source: Walter Struve, Germans and Texans, (Austin: University of Texas Press, 1996).
Stonecm (talk) 23:28, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Outline for new additions

message: Is it known exactly where the battle/massacre took place, so that coordinates can be added to the article? —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 09:13, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Coordinates?