Talk:R.A.B./Archive 3

message: Russian and middle-eastern languages will translate R.A.B.'s letter differently if R.A.B is female.
Did the translators ask JKR whether R.A.B. is male or female?
I await with interest the cross-refencing which will ensue in a few months.Sandpiper 17:48, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I can see the (Harry Potter fandom) headlines now: Russian translation proves that Amelia Bones is R.A.B. --Deathphoenix 18:44, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm surprised nobody has suggested that it's Susan Bones. ;-) -- DocSigma 11:58, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Male or female R.A.B-translation 

message: There are three pictures in RAB turned upside down.  The Three houses. Hufflepuff is the first picture, Ravenclaw is the second picture and Slytheryn is the last picture.  "B" makes up the picture of a badger when it is turned upside down Bones' last initial "B".  "A" makes up the picture of the eagle when it is turned upside down. Last name that starts with an "A" is still being investigated.  "R" makes up the picture of the snake when it is turned upside down.  Last name that starts with an "R" is still being investigated.  My theory is that it is three people.  Bones being one of them.--66.87.127.175 15:48, 14 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: ...what? o_0 -- DocSigma 18:49, 21 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: R.A.B. refers to him/herself several times as "I" during the note found inside the fake locket.--207.160.210.253 01:44, 23 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: RAB as Pictogram

message: Why is everyone asuming that RAB is an i identification of the note's auther? the letters could just as easily be a hidden mesage.
In "the secret garden" one charecter signs his notes BAR, standing for Burn After Reading. The leters RAB could stand for Read And Burn, or any number of other phrases.
:I doubt it's a person as well.  It might be an organization, or as you say, a message.  JK likes tricking us.  Remember when (SPOILERS, of course) we thought that that Snape and Sirius were bad guys in books 1 & 3.  Remember when we thought that there was a super-weapon in book 5?  Remember when we were looking for a royal prince in book 6.  The fact that Ron and Hermone thought that RAB were initials shows us that they aren't.  -Arctic.gnome 08:45, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  '''Not a person?''' 

message: This article starts by mentioning Dumbledore's death. While it is hard to see how anyone could have read the book far enough to know about RAB without going on and discovering the death, why do we begin by saying Dumbledore is dead? This is entirely irrelevant information to the issue of who RAB might be. Sandpiper 23:01, 29 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spoiler, Dumbledore's Death 

message: Could it be possible that RAB is Dumbledore?  R could be an unknown first-name or possibly the word "respectfully," A for Albus, and B could be two Ds stacked up on each other (a fancy way of signing his name).    -Feripe
What theories should be listed here? It looks like only the most popular candidates show up here. But why are the most popular the only ones that should be mentioned? - Mig
:well, to be listed a theory would have to have a degree of noteability, a significant body of support. It would also have to pass a common sense test of whether it was factually acurate.
:In the example here, we are somewhere told Dumbledore's whole name, and it does not fit the initials at all. Second, the fact of signing the note with anything suggests that this will be meaningfull to the person reading the note, so it is not likely to be difficult to identify. Perhaps if Dumbledore was in the habit of signing hinself with a monogram, but he is not. The simplest and most obvious explanation is that it is exactly what it appears to be, three initials of someones name. That is how it is interpreted within the book. Sandpiper 19:09, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Haven't gotten a wiki account yet, but I probably will momentarily. Anyway, Dumbledore's full name is Albus Percival Wulfric Brian Dumbledore. Plus, comparing what has been given as Dumbledore's writing before (Sorcerer's Stone, note that falls out of Invisibility Cloak) with R.A.B's handwriting, I don't see much of a resemblance. So I don't think R.A.B is Dumbledore. Interesting theory though. 69.92.180.201 07:17, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: RAB is Dumbledore

message: Hello, this article about R.A.B. is very good and I liked it so much, that I translated it into german for our german fellows in the harry potter forum. But unfortunately the people of wikipedia in Germany find Harry Potter very irelevant and deleted the article. This is disgusting even if it is typical for germans. I thought wikipedia is a very good thing but I am sorry to say this englisch version is very tolerant and nice to read, but the german version is intolerant and so much censored that it's no more fun, it's really sad.
Thanks anyway for the article, it's fantastic :)
Noa
Hi Everyone, TRIWIZARD here.  R.A.B.  is SNAPE.  Yes, you heard me right.  Harry and Dumbledore were the ONLY ones in the cave.  The first to get the REAL horcrux.  No one came before them because the potion was still intact.  They retrieved the real horcrux.  Dumbledore was slowly dying because he drank the potion.  Snape knew this and Dumbledore knew this.  The last time when DD destroyed the ring horcrux Snape saved his life by stopping the spread of the curse to only DD's hand.  The two of them argued in the forest.  Snape was telling DD that he didn't want to be a double agent anymore.  He didn't want the responsibility that he might not be able to save DD life again if he went looking for another horcrux.  But DD told Snape that he promised and that he had to continue.  Snape hit DD with a curse that sent his body flying up into the air.  That is a strange type of killing curse as we know the Avada Kadavara curse kills you right then and there.  Your body dosen't fly up and slowly fall back to earth.  There was a black huddled mass at the body of Dumbledore at the Astronomy Tower.  It was Snape who had a head start on Harry he got to DD body and did the switch with the fake locket.  I believe that R.A.B. is a code name that Snape uses with Voldemort.  It is a name that only LV would know.  It is what Snape used to pass information to LV when he was spying on Dumbledore.  LV knows this RAB and RAB's letter is written to the Dark Lord.  RAB wants revenge.  Snapes revenge will be when he destroys the locket horcrux and Snape knows that each horcrux has a killing curse attached to it.  Thus he will be killed by destroying the locket.  Harry will somehow get the fake to LV and LV thinking that he still has the Locket horcrux will be SHOCKED to learn that it was his trusted servant Snape who helped in his downfall.
:Interesting theory.--May the Force be with you!  Shreshth91($ |-| r 3 $ |-| t |-|) 07:33, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Translation of the R.A.B.-article on wikipedia.org 

message: I see the new section on Andromeda Black, and it's all fine and dandy in my opinion (and even quite interesting), but how do we determine what is speculation, and what isn't? Some person could have their own theory and thought up that it's Andromeda, or someone could have read many speculations on websites in the Harry Potter fan community and decided Andromeda had to be added, but how do we know which is which? Emily 21:20, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I argued quite some time ago against the addition of rampant speculation (see Archive2 and possibly Archive1 as well), but was overruled by a fair number of people. I'd still like to remove any uncited and/or non-notable speculation. Of all these, I think we should only leave Regulus Black and quite possibly Amelia Bones (but only because she was mentioned as a theory of a notable HP fan, Melissa Analli, I think it was). However, this is an opinion largely left unchanged from quite a while ago for me, so maybe some fresh commentary will help. --Deathphoenix ʕ 05:18, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  What's speculation? 

message: I've nuked the entire "other possibilities" section. The majority of this article is already speculation, and while some of the theories probably shouldn't be here, the ones mention in "Other possibilities" weren't even notable enough to merit individual sections describing each one. If they're not notable enough for that, they're not notable enough to be mentioned in here at all. --Deathphoenix ʕ 17:35, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Other possibilities 

message: I am pretty sure that this is mostly speculation and orginal research, but I don't care, I just loved reading this article! 
It is fine as it is, don't apply the policy too strictly, violating it sometimes makes wikipedia so much more interesting...
Lag 21:23, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I loved it 

message: As there is very little canon knowledge of R.A.B. this article has been full of speculation for far too long. The only speculation I have left in is obviously Regulus Black, this qualifies as encyclopedic as a hot topic being publicly commented on by J.K. Rowling.
:Why not save space and simply direct people to the Regulus Black page?Michaelsanders 23:19, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: R.A.B. might not be Regulus Black, as it stands currently in canon R.A.B. is an as yet unknown new character. This article will almost definatly be fleshed out after the publication of book 7, and if R.A.B. does turn out to be Regulus then we would probably discuss possible merger then (as with Tom Riddle/Voldemort or Peter Pettigrew/Scabbers). Saving space? don't really need to, after all wikipedia is not paper.  Death Eater Dan    (Muahaha) 23:28, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: To be honest I don't agree with cutting everything out. Nigh on everything in this article (apart from the initials in foreign translations) is speculation. Regulus is the best fit, but he's not the only possibility. These others deserve at least some space, even if it is just as "former possible candidates for RAB." Supersheep 23:07, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Severe cut back on speculation

message: Editor Danlina had previously deleted what appeared to be duplicated information on translated foreign editions regarding the initials R.A.B., and the Black surname.  I reverted the deletion, but then later decided that if it appeared to be duplicitous or repetitive, then it probably was, and needed to be fixed.  I rearranged the segments somewhat, and combined the two "translations" groups (R.A.B. and Black) into a single Translations subtopic covering both concepts "closer" to each other, but still in separate paragraphs, so the train of thought is more continuous and logical.  Hope it helps - it was a bold move, and thanks to Danlina for boldly taking the lead on the effort. --T-dot 17:52, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Translation" segments duplication 

message: Just wondering. A brief and casual glance shows me that there are seven occurences of "I", seven lines in all, fourteen verbs (know, will be, read, want, know, was, discovered, have stolen, intend, destroy, can, face, meet, will be), sixtythree words in all (not countig the initials). Second thought: what about an anagram? Such a long one would be incredibly difficult to solve, but there might be hints. What made me consider this possibility is the unusually casual language - one would not exactly expect that vocabulary but it might be necessary if the text indeed an anagram. Finally, "stolen" is suspicious. Stealing means taking an object from its rightful owner. I do wonder what the choice of words might imply here.
:Oh boy - somebody better get the Bible Code-breakers on it... --T-dot 18:33, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Did it ever occur to anybody to analyse the text of RAB's message itself? 

message: I was thinking of compiling a list of Harry Potter character surnames that begin with "B" and posting that as a sort of "brainstorm" list, not to be judged individually, but mentioned in passing.  Not so much to increase the speculation, but to attempt to untilt the article slightly away from the overwhelming support for Regulus Black.  It is not a hard task by any means, but I wanted to clear the concept in advance.  Someone else is already pushing up Bones family members as an alternative.  Others include Brown, Bell, Boot, Brocklehurst, Branstone, Bulstrode, Bletchley, Bole, Baddock, Binns, Babbling, Bagman, Bode, Brand, Borgin, Burke, Bagshot, Borage, Bayliss, Benson, Bishop, Bryce, and probably several more I missed from the List of characters in the Harry Potter books.  Comments?  --T-dot 18:47, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm baffled by that ... not sure what you are getting at.  Are you saying that whoever signed the note with "R.A.B." is not likely to be someone with those initials, or at least someone involved having a surname beginning with a "B", or that it was not really "signed" R.A.B., and that it was just perhaps a closing epithet or something, and that we should therefore include everyone in the Harry Potter Universe on the list of suspected Horcrux thief candidates, regardless of whether they can legitimately be considered an R.A.B. candidate in some way or other?  Please explain your last, Simply south.  --T-dot 20:27, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No, no, no, sorry. I was replying, not specifically for R.A.B. I was meaning it was an interesting and er.. thorough idea to mention creating an article for every single surname in Harry Potter. I was jokingly suggesting that this should also be done for the other letters of the alphabet, although maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea... maybe a brief mention. As for R.A.B i am just awaiting the next novel to find out. Maybe. Simply south 20:38, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Naw - what I meant was that it might be encyclopedic to provide a short list, in the R.A.B. article, of all the other known surviving wizard family members with surnames beginning with a "B", on the assumption that "R.A.B." is a person, most likely a wizard, with a last name beginning with "B".  This should slightly rebalance the article away from such a heavy slant towards Regulus Black, which is still speculative (albeit almost universally accepted), whatever his middle name might be, at least until the truth of the matter is finally revealed.  It would seem that this might also perhaps head off some of the Fanforum Fanatics who keep slipping in random alternative RAB's, based on what they read on someone else's blog page or other highly speculative "dumbledoreisnotdead.com" type sites.  --T-dot 23:38, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  List of B's 

message: Yesterday, I added a paragraph on Amy Benson in the Other Theories section, as we have an article on her and the possibility that she is R.A.B.  It is a remote possibility, especially since I can't imagine what R could possibly stand for, but I think it does carry some weight given the significance of the cave.  It certainly carries more weight than saying any wizard whose last name begins with B and has unknown first and middle names could be R.A.B.
Regardless, I agree that it is total speculation, and there appears to be consensus that the only speculation worth including on this page is Regulus Black, as that possibility has been acknowledged (not confirmed or denied, but acknowledged) by J.K. Rowling.
However, if we're not going to include this speculation on this page, then we probably shouldn't be including it on Amy Benson either. -- Northenglish (talk) -- 17:58, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I agree, it shouldn't be noted in Amy Benson either, though one case for including it is that there was someone notable who thought R.A.B. might be Amy Benson. I don't remember who it was, though. --Deathphoenix ʕ 19:34, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Amy Benson 

message: The speculation and original research is creeping back into the article. Yes the article is based on theory until the release of the 7th book however the only viable theory worthy of entering in an encyclopedic capacity is Regulus, as this is a hot topic that has been comented on by the author and can be sourced as such. Death Eater Dan (Muahaha) 15:58, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Removal of speculation

message: If you reverse R.A.B. it becomes Bar this could mean it has somthing to do with a bar such as the Hogs Head where numerous other relavent things have happened. --Dr. B
:sounds like a wonderfully speculative and convoluted theory that belongs all over the HP fan forum sites and the gossip blog pages along with all the rest of the fan theories.  Fits right up with the Mirror of "Erised" (except the whole word-reversing there was a play on the mirror theme).  Just please do not present that theory here as encyclopedic material in the main article, or anywhere in the Wikipedia, unless you first bounce it off J. K. Rowling herself and get her to say: "why ... YES - that is exactly correct!  How on earth did you figure that out?  SUPERB detective work Dr. B!!" ... or something to that effect.  Until you get that approval, it does not belong here.  The other "theories" that have been presented in the main article have at least been acknowledged by Rowling, or at have a reasonably strong basis in logic and reason, and have been argued-out and agreed-to for inclusion by consensus.  Thanks for your input though.  --T-dot 12:09, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  B.A.R 

message: Following was posted by User:Myrrh8 - and subsequently deleted as clearly speculative:
    
:In Harry Potter book V, ch. 10, an article in the magazine "The Quibbler" reports of a character named "Stubby Boardman" who is quoted to not only closely resemble Sirius Black (very likely if he has the features of Sirius' brother Regulus) but who is said to have "retired from public life ... nearly fifteen years ago", the time at which Regulus Black supposedly died. Rowling, when asked about Regulus prior to the publication of The Half-Blood Prince, during World Book Day online chat, March 4, 2004, answered the question: "Will we be hearing anything from Sirius Black's brother, Regulus, in future books?" said: "Well, he's dead, so he's pretty quiet these days." This could be an indication that since his identity as Black is "dead", Regulus keeps "quiet" under the synonym of "Stubby Boardman".
The reason for deletion is as follows.  We have allowed the "reasonable" theory that Regulus Black may be R.A.B. (whatever his middle name might be) due to the fact that all foreign language translated editions show the same correlation between the translated surnames for Black and the last initial in the translated versions of R.A.B.  That is reasonable and sufficient.  
This new theory that Regulus Black is alive and living under the name Stubby Boardman, on the basis of random information from The Quibbler that he "resembles" Sirius is simply not reasonable.  The Quibbler, in the Harry Potter Universe, is as non-authoritative and unreliable a source for information as a source can be, even after the occasional random tidbit of truth it may on occasion produce by accident.  But then to further stretch Rowling's assertion that Regulus is "dead, so he's pretty quiet these days" to mean that he is alive and living quietly as "Stubby Boardman" is simply overstretching the bounds of reason.
Until the Seventh Book is published, or until someone can get Rowling to admit that Regulus is alive and living as Stubby Boardman, this theory cannot stand in the Wikipedia - which must be Verifiable (WP:V) and based on Reliable Sources (WP:RS, and not based on fan speculation or Original Research (WP:NOR).  --T-dot 18:50, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "New theory: R.A.B. = Regulus Black hiding as Stubby Boardman" 

message: What do you think?
:No.
There are some severe holes in the "Riddle Ain't Bad" theory. For Example, whoever replaced the horcrux with the fake obviously didn't like Voldemort and was planning to destroy the real horcux/locket. So, why would an enemy of Voldemort (Tom Marvolo Riddle) sign a letter left to the Dark Lord as "Riddle Ain't Bad". If you must speculate, please don't be so disposed to suggest something entirely unreasonable. Even The Quibbler has some truth to it (Harry's story published in said magazine to tell those in the wizarding community about Voldemort's return is one example). 20:36, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Riddle ain´t bad"