Talk:Australian feral camel

message: Changed: "The Australian camels, roving in the only feral herds of their kind in the world and reckoned to number between 43,000 and 60,000..."
to:"The Australian camels, roving in the only feral herds of their kind in the world and reckoned to number between 500,000 and 700,000..."
Based on current estimates: 
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200504/s1344199.htm
http://www.deh.gov.au/biodiversity/invasive/publications/camel/index.html
http://www.abc.net.au/news/scitech/2002/01/item20020116124339_1.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4485105.stm
-as well as the number listed at the base of the article.
The suggested maximum of 60.000 for all Australia seems a little odd considering the estimated population just for the state of South Australia  alone is 60,000.OzoneO 01:29, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comment

message: The first 3-4 paragraphs appear to be lifted word for word without attribution from http://www.deh.gov.au/biodiversity/invasive/publications/camel/index.html - Please note that Australian Government materials are not subject to the copyright exemptions relating to the materials of the U.S.A. Government.  Staphylococcus 08:14, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Possible Copyright vio

message: The paragraph that starts the "History" section ("The Australian camels, roving in the only feral herds of their kind in the world and reckoned to number between 500,000 and 700,000") seems to be a near word-for-word rip-off from the linked article http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/198801/camels.down.under.htm.  As a matter of fact, the original Wiki article seems to have been an exact rip-off in this section - updates have changed the numbers and some of the wording, but it's still nearly identical. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.169.79.134 (talk) 12:15, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Another Copyright vio?

message: Yet another of Wikipedia's many cut-and-pasted articles is flagrantly displayed here.
Wikipedia's reliability and factualness has improved, but the plagiarism is extensive and deplorable.
As noted a month ago, this is directly lifted from http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/198801/camels.down.under.htm
Someone even had the gall to list that url as an external link!  Maybe they're waiting to see if they'll get in trouble.  I think I might just delete most of it to call an administrator's attention.Yopienso 19:25, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I reverted your edit as it had corrupted the page. I also checked the plagiarism and found this on the site it came from:"Texts of articles copyrighted by Saudi Aramco World or Aramco World may be reprinted, either in print or electronically, without specific prior permission from the publisher." This means the text can stay for now and can then be edited at lesiure to make it more encyclopedic by anyone interested enough to put in the work. Cheers. Wayne 23:13, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Definite Copyright Violation

message: Also, the number of camels given is wildly inflated from 43,000-60,000 to 500,000-700,000.  Yopienso 19:31, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You missed the dates. There were 60,000 camels in 1988. There were 700,000 camels in 2005. If you check the current 2007 population it is now 1 million. The population doubles every 5 years. Wayne 23:21, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

text: The material included is complete in terms of the section headings and copied as an encyclopedia article for reference so can possibly claim fair use for omitting non encyclopedic content. I believe updating the (1988) copyright material in the artical with current 2007 data is probably acceptable and not classed as abridgement (I'm no lawyer so I could be wrong). The only violation left is there is no credit given on the page itself but it is still linked to the source as required and credit is given in this talk page so would probably be acceptable to Saudi Ramco as the talk page is part of the article (and there is no commercial benifit). The material in question appears to have been here for years with no problem. The copy/paste part should be completely rewritten so that copyright will no longer apply but until then the text should be kept available not only as a base to work from but as it also provides substance relevant to the article. The finished product will still link to Saudi Ramco as a reference so it's a win win situation.  Wayne 02:10, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

text: See above. The source gives permission. If you still have concerns, then rewrite the material instead of deleting. You also deleted a lot of material from other sources that is definately not copyrighted. Wayne (talk) 16:41, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Vandalism or attempt at humor

message: A lot of this article sounds more like a newspaper article than an encyclopedia... --Wolf530 (talk) 20:28, 27 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: In what ways? See I just read it and it seems fine to me. Crafty (talk) 21:29, 27 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it's fine too.  I've removed the tag. HuskyHuskie (talk) 02:42, 27 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Inappropriate tone

message: See the above discussion. An archival copy of http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/198801/camels.down.under.htm  is available here. 
Present version of this article (unwikified):
*Camels in Australia are the only feral herds of their kind in the world, and are estimated to number more than 1,000,000, with the capability of doubling in number every nine years.[1] The Australian camels are descendants of camels imported into Australia, beginning in the mid-19th century, to help lay the foundations of the nation. Shipments came largely from the Indian subcontinent, but animals were also landed from Muscat, Yemen, Iraq and the Canary Islands.Arriving in a trickle that swelled to a flood by the early 20th century, the camels were often guided and cared for by Muslim cameleers known as 'Afghans'. Handlers came from lands as far away as Egypt, Turkey and Persia, though most — with their camels — hailed from northern India and what today is Pakistan. But the men were all, almost always incorrectly, called Afghans or simply "Ghans." The name stuck to a section of the 2,900 km (1,800 mi) transcontinental Central Australia Railway linking Port Augusta in the south to Darwin in the north. Camels hauled material and supplies to the men building that line beginning in 1879, and the segment of track from Port Augusta to Alice Springs was called "The Ghan" until it was relaid near the end of the 20th century.
Saudi Aramco:
*The one-humped dromedaries, roving in the only wild herds of their kind in the world and reckoned to number between 43,000 and 60,000, are descendants of camels imported into Australia, beginning in the mid-1800's, to help lay the foundations of the nation. Shipments came largely from the Indian subcontinent, but animals were also landed from Muscat, Yemen, Iraq and the Canary Islands.Arriving in a trickle that swelled to a flood by the early 20th century, the camels were often guided and cared for by Muslim cameleers. Handlers came from lands as far away as Egypt, Turkey and Persia, though most - with their camels - hailed from northern India and what today is Pakistan. But the men were all, almost always incorrectly, called Afghans or simply "Ghans."
Apart from minor word changes - which do not solve the copyright problem - this is obvious copying. The Saudi Aramco website does not state that the text may be modified and redistributed in modified form and that there are essentially no restrictions on further usage apart from keeping the same copyright conditions. See WP:Copyrights. Boud (talk) 23:32, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: This page is listed at the subpage Wikipedia:Copyright_problems/2011_July_29, so copyright clerks can deal with it after 3 August, or admins after 5 August: see Wikipedia:Copyright_problems#Closing_listings. Boud (talk) 23:10, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Saudi Aramco copyvio 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Australian feral camel. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140508134635/http://www.lrm.nt.gov.au/feral/camel to http://www.lrm.nt.gov.au/feral/camel
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The Broken Hill terrorist attack is appropriately linked with a short summary in the history section at the end of a long section on  Muslim cameleers  because it is a notable attack carried out by two men who had arrived in Australia as camel drivers, had worked as camel drivers, and were living and working in a sizeable community of current and former camel-drivers - one of the attackers was the imam of the community of Muslim camel drivers.E.M.Gregory (talk) 12:19, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I'e removed your re-addition - it's inappropriate for this article - the attack wasn't carried out by camels. Bahudhara (talk) 12:43, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Battle of Broken Hill|Broken Hill terrorist attack]]

message: The statement "the only herd of dromedary (one-humped) camels exhibiting wild behaviour in the world" is both unclear and without citation.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Adamgoldberg (talk • contribs) 11:24, 24 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unclear Sentence, "only herd ... exhibiting wild behavior" 

message: I have removed references to feral Bactrian camels in Australia. Although this BBC article refers to them being present, this appears to be an error - I can find no other reliable reference to feral Bactrian camels in Australia. This forum thread references Introduced Mammals of the World (Long) indicating that only five Bactrians were ever imported, and they are certainly not referred to in standard Australian reference texts (field guides, etc.), which exclusively include dromedaries. If anyone has further evidence I invite them to share it. Frickeg (talk) 03:57, 18 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bactrian camels 

message: The lead section of the article is lacking in a true overview of the topic. More could be added on the role of the camels in Australia including tourism, aboriginal relationship with camels, and the food industry. In the aboriginal section clarification is needed on the purpose of mentioning Camels and the Pitjantjara the documentary. I am confused on its relevance to the topic. I also think the mention of indigenous camel art should be its own section and have a development on the topic. The article’s purpose is to discuss feral camels, yet the second picture, located in the history section, is of a domesticated camel. Much of the information in the article discusses domestic camels as well, should the title be changed? This includes the use of camels for transport and tourism. Additionally there is a section on camel milk being produced, how is this connected with feral camels? Can feral camels be used for milk creations? Lastly this article is lacking on the topics of behavior, movement, diseases, predators, habitat, and diets of feral camels.
Ella Settle (talk) 20:31, 13 February 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comment