Talk:Astronomical symbols

message: Method not specified  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.211.137.187 (talk) 23:26, 13 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Deleted Earth

message: The tooltip for the Crescent Moon says "First Quarter" and that for the Decrescent Moon says "Last Quarter". This is wrong. First and last quarters look like half moons and are not the same as crescents. The confusion probably arose because the author thought of quarter as a fraction of the illuminated portion. The word quarter as used by astronomers is really the fraction of an entire lunation.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.127.193.122 (talk) 12:29, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Crescent Moon is not First Quarter

message: * I see the Unicode rendering for Uranus as having an additional line as compared to the NASA image. (The middle vertical line extends above the horizontal line.) -- Beland 22:18, 4 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Discrepancies

message: Page should probably be moved to either Astronomical symbol or List of astronomical symbols. -Silence 01:47, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Recommended move

message: How come there are 2 different symbols for Pluto?
Do the new planets like Ceres or "Xena" have a symbol?--Sonjaaa 16:14, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ceres has a bunch from back when it was discovered in 1801 and was thought of as a new planet before it was demoted. Vesta, Juno, Pallas have them too. GracieLizzie 00:34, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

text: Astronomers rarely use symbols in general nowadays (except for those of the Earth and the Sun), and in fact the IAU discourages their use. Some do use them anyway, though. Pluto has multiple symbols because many astrologers did not accept the astronomical P-L symbol and devised their own (source). It's probably better to think of them as just planetary symbols, that today are mostly used in astrology, but could equally well be used by astronomers if desired. Eris (used to be "Xena") has some common symbols in astrology now. Double sharp (talk) 13:27, 17 October 2021 (UTC)
thread_title: Pluto

message: I think that the article should be split into Astrological symbols; there are, as the article says, astrological symbols that are not the same as their corresponding astronomical symbols.100110100 23:07, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Or the page should be renamed to Astronomical and astrological symbols. -- Jordi·✆ 07:35, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  The Page should be renamed. Most symbols are common to both Astronomy and Astrology, also, Astronomy hardly ever uses symbols anyway, so I'm not sure if the purely Astronomical symbols are worth a page anyway. JamesFox 11:44, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Split 

message: The symbol for which Eris is known is not the Apple of Discord, but in fact the Five Fingered Hand of Eris (better known just as the Hand of Eris). It is a) in line with the other symbols and glyphs for planets, because it has crescents and lines b) so that it cannot be confused with the symbol for Chiron, which also uses a circle and a "K" already. This matter is under debate at this very moment in a discordian community  on livejournal. There is also a petition to whoever officiates these symbols www.petitiononline.com/ffhoeris/petition.html. I have also brought this up on the talk page for Eris , and have also sent a proposal letter to the discoverer of the planet. --Travlr23 03:55, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I removed the (K) symbol, as no support has been given that it's under consideration anywhere.  (Sadly, I didn't realize I wasn't logged in until after submitting the page.)   DenisMoskowitz 13:42, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The other good thing about the FFHoE symbol is that it has the letter K in it, both backwards and forwards, and it has an "X" in it to represent how the planet used to be called "Xena" - much like the symbol for Uranus has an H in it because it used to be called Herschel. (see, my planetariam teacher, Mr Williams, would be proud that I remembered that!) --Travlr23 01:04, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Symbol for Eris 

message: I noticed that the article specified U+02A1 as the Unicode character for Ceres. I removed it, since U+02A1 is actually LATIN LETTER GLOTTAL STOP WITH STROKE -- it is a phonetic letter, whose resemblance to the Ceres symbol is pure coincidence. There is a proposal to add codepoints for some of the symbols ( see [] ) which passed the first vote in May. JamesFox 11:09, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's actually not purely coincidence, since they're both representations of a sickle, but you're right to remove it, since it isn't the symbol for Ceres. Nice work uncovering that proposal. └ OzLawyer / talk ┐ 12:43, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ceres and Unicode 

message: In case anyone was wondering, Ceres, Pallas, Juno, Vesta and Chiron were not the only asteroids to receive symbols.  This page shows symbols of many of the early discovered asteroids.  Good luck to anyone who wants to incorporate them. └ OzLawyer / talk ┐ 16:52, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Most of those asteroid symbols aren't any more official than the moon symbols I came up with - they're of recent, astrological vintage.  However, there are indeed official symbols for 14 of the first 15 asteroids - see this page. DenisMoskowitz 17:55, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Asteroid symbols 

message: I removed them, and this is why:  All the symbols have variants.  None are, to my knowledge, official.  Neptune may be drawn without the arrowy-bits on the prongs.  The curves of Jupiter and Saturn may be significantly different from one representation to the next.  The astrological symbol for Uranus may not have the middle prong going up (or, sometimes the circle is up, not down).  As for the symbols for all the asteroids recently added, I'm sure if you had original documents you'd see major variations as well. └ OzLawyer / talk ┐ 13:55, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Variations of symbols 

message: Okay. I guess I've missed the vague discussion in the talk section above, but now that I've seen that page changes, I feel that I must revert. There are no abstract, Astronomical symbols for all of the constellations. When it comes to constellations located along the zodiac, 12 of the 13 may give thier names to the Astrological Zodiac signs, also known as the house signs, but the symbols do not repersent constellations. They represent 30 degree divisions of the 360 degree circle of astrological longtitude, at least in astrology. I am very doubtful that any astronomical usage comes close in thier extent of use in astrology. JamesFox 13:11, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I reverted before seeing this comment, you are free to revert back.  I agree that the zodiac is pretty useless in a collection of astronomical symbols.  I therefore do reiterate that this page needs to be split. I'd suggest that the symbols included on the astrological symbols page mirror these.  The astronomical symbols article should be sun, moon, planets, dwarf planets, and asteroids. └ OzLawyer / talk ┐ 14:13, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Zodiac symbols are listed in Allen's Astrophysical Quantities (4th ed) on page 2.  --mikeu (talk) 18:20, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Astrological signs are a valid angular unit of measurement. They are not the same as constellations, so modern astronomers usually don't use them. However: the IAU abbreviations are the correct abbreviations for the constellations; some are different for the signs (and the IAU doesn't use the signs). Also, "Capricornus" and "Scorpius" are names of constellations; "Capricorn" (as in the Tropic of Capricorn, which has no correspondence to the constellation Capricornus) and "Scorpio" are names of signs. Also, the glyphs are never used when refering to constellations; they only correspond to signs. (Actually, astronomers rarely use glyphs at all; however, I have seen the glyphs for Aries and Libra on a diagram of the celestial sphere in a dictionary of physics, and it is clear from the diagram that is corresponds to the signs and not the constellations.) The Herschel glyph for Uranus is probably more commonly used in astrology than in astronomy, although I still prefer it because it is more distinct than the glyph for Mars. I have never seen the Le Verrier glyph. There is also another glyph for Pluto (which I don't use, because it is too similar to the one for Neptune), but I don't know if astronomers ever used it; astrologers sometimes use it though. Since they are glyphs for the same things, I would think it makes sense to combine them into the article, perhaps with footnotes or whatever to specify when they are used and who uses them. --Zzo38 (talk) 05:23, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

text: The symbol for Aries sees common use now in astronomy textbooks, but not as a symbol for Aries itself; rather its current astronomical use is in the "first point of Aries" sense (mentioned later in the article) as an unambiguous symbol for the reference direction in space, the vernal equinox.  (This use is generally found only in figures/diagrams, but it is perfectly mainstream.)  You can find the symbol used in this way in the figure shown in Orbital elements. BSVulturis (talk) 17:00, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zodiac Symbols 

message: Why is Venus pink?03:23, 1 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You got me interested! I  did a little investigation and as far as I can tell, it is a caching bug.  Back on February 20'th someone on commons changed the color of the :commons:Image:Venus_symbol.svg source image.  This mild vandalism wasn't reverted for a couple of hours.  However, the source image is in SVG format.  Because SVG is not widely supported in browsers, the MediaWiki software that runs Wikipedia builds PNG versions from the SVG versions and caches them.  Apparently the 25 pixel wide version was cached while the SVG was pink, and has not since been rebuilt.  As an example here are the identical image, but one specified to be 25 pixels wide and the other 30 pixels:  and .  Note that only the 25 pixel version is pink.  I'm not sure how to fix this or even who to notify to fix this. —RP88 04:20, 1 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  All fixed now! —RP88 09:49, 1 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Why is Venus pink?

message: The table on this page describes the symbol for Venus as representing "Venus's hand mirror". The page for Venus states: "Alchemists constructed the symbol from a circle (representing spirit) above a cross (representing matter)." Are they both correct somehow, or does one page need changing? --67.110.213.253 04:33, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Venus: Mirror or Spirit/Cross? 

message: Did anyone find an answer for who defines these symbols? I can find nothing on the IAU website about them, and NASA simply display the images without explaining who uses them or where they come from. The page here makes no mention of any controlling authority, and yet the symbol for Eris is "Unlikely to gain an official symbol". What makes a symbol official??
Feyrauth (talk) 01:20, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Since astronomers have basically given up on using symbols (since they'd need tens of thousands of them) and there is no controlling board of astrologers, symbols are a complete free-for-all.  It's possible that if the dwarf planet decision was reversed, public outcry would force someone to deal with the issue.  DenisMoskowitz (talk) 14:51, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: That is one reason I still watch astrology-related stuff. I would like them to have symbols, so that is what I do. --Zzo38 (talk) 05:18, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Officiation

message: I found a Unicode bug in the Venus symbol:
Font 4:
♀
Font 6:
♀
-PatPeter 20:18, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unicode Bug 

message: Are these symbols still commonly used in the scientific practice of astronomy today? Some of these symbols have been used in astronomy but in eras long in the past and in relation to the "science of the day" -- a.k.a. astrology and other observation of the cosmos in relation to superstitions. These symbols (and many others) were pertinent to science long ago but not really today I don't think. (I could be wrong. If so, please provide sources.) When astronomy for science (cosmology, physics, etc.) split from astrology, the latter retained the symbols. And that should be clearly indicated in the lede.
Then there's the issue of corroborating these lesser known symbols. I know the symbols of the planets. Those are quite common. But the lesser known ones (i.e. for asteroids, dwarf planets & other non-planet bodies) need citations to be credulous. It would be helpful to have some indication that they aren't some guy's personal Paintshop creations. They have to be symbols that are actually used widely and have documentation to prove it. But, hey, I really don't know what's real and what's not. I'm speaking from a lay position. So please do bring on the citations. Otherwise, some cleanup is required. ask123 (talk) 03:42, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I haven't encountered these symbols in professional journals and whatnot, but they are still used in at least some ephemerides and skywatcher calendars. See e.g. the farmers almanac astronomy section. Rwflammang (talk) 01:50, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Astrology and Superstition 

message: These entries contained unsourced data and/or original research, and were removed. Note that everything I removed remains in the Astrological symbols article.
For Eris, under Symbol represents: Unlikely to gain an official symbol (although there have been a number of proposals, such as the Hand of Eris 50x25px|Eris)
See the discussion on this page under the heading "Symbol for Eris". A livejournal discussion and an "online petition" do not constitute notability.
For Vesta: 25px|Vesta | #9910;| ⚶  
Removed because (1) I found no evidence of this symbol ever having being notably (or at all) used by astronomers, and (2) the astronomical symbol that was in common use looks different. 
2060 Chiron	25px	#9911;	⚷	proposed but not adopted
Removed because this is an astrological symbol. Described as "an inspiration shared amongst Al H. Morrison, Joelle K.D. Mahoney, and Marlene Bassoff", it was presented to the astrological community in 1977 in the CAO Times, vol. 3, p. 57, and appears to have been adopted nearly universally by astrologers.
asteroid	25px			proposed but not adopted
Removed because this symbol was not adopted.
Conjunction  	50x25px	Proposal;	undefined	
Meteor       	50x25px	Proposal;	undefined	
Meteor shower	50x25px	Proposal;	undefined	
Asteroid     	50x25px	Proposal;	undefined	
I'm not sure what to make of these four symbols, except to say that they are all unsourced, the conjunction symbol is definitely unlike the standard one, and the description page on each of these images appears to refer to fortune-telling.
If you find a source attesting to any of this material in an astronomical (not astrological) context, feel free to put it back in the article with a citation. 198.189.164.204 (talk) 03:11, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed from article 

message: Some of the "Unicode" entries in the tables were in decimal, others in hexadecimal. Changing all these cells to show both, on two lines. The standard notation 
*hex.: #x...;
*dec.: #...; (with no "x")
distinguishes them. 
I used this Perl script after confirming that it would catch all and only the table cells I wanted.
while(<>){
    if (($x,$n) = (/#(x?)([0-9a-f]+);/i) and !/Unicode/i) {
	s/^\|\#/| #/;
	if($x) { # hex, conv to dec
	    $dec = hex($n);
	    $hex = $n;
	}
	else { # dec, conv to hex
	    $hex = sprintf("%x",$n);
	    $dec = $n;
	}
	s/#(x?)([0-9a-f]+);/#x$hex;#$dec;/;
    }
    print;
}
Thnidu (talk) 22:09, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unicode 

message: Small mod this, but: the Sun and (to a lesser extent) Earth symbols are in frequent use in current astronomical papers and textbooks (e.g. L☉ for solar luminosity) so I've slightly changed the introductory text to reflect this. EqualMusic (talk) 08:22, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Untrue that all these symbols have fallen into disuse in scientific publications 

message: I don't know how to edit this, but I think 2060 Chiron may be on the list too.
Unicode Character 'CHIRON' (U+26B7) Sailorsun (talk) 19:34, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Added on 29 September 2021. Double sharp (talk) 13:28, 17 October 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chiron Symbol 

message: I found these symbols somewhere on the internet. However I don't think orcus' symbol is registered?
Here it is, I didn't make this: http://eaglezebrafish.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/astrological-symbol-for-orcus-and-pluto.html  — Preceding unsigned comment added by NHPluto (talk • contribs) 17:49, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pluto & Orcus 

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071106124911/http://aa.usno.navy.mil/faq/docs/minorplanets.php to http://aa.usno.navy.mil/faq/docs/minorplanets.php
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replies: text: Only the scenta.co.uk link was actually dead.  I reverted the other two. —RP88 (talk) 05:03, 11 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I removed the astrological symbol for Pluto () from the table because no evidence appears of its use in an astronomical context. While it has a place in the astrological symbols article, this one is for astronomical symbols. The removed entry is here for reference. If anyone has a Reliable Source™ of it being used astronomically (not astrologically), feel free to reinstate it.
Name        	Symbol	Unicodecodepoint	Unicodedisplay	Represents
134340 Pluto	      	                	              	Modification of Neptune's astrological symbol.                                                                       It symbolizes Pluto's Cap of invisibility (the circle) and the bident (the arc under the circle)? also a typical attribute of Pluto.
209.129.241.33 (talk) 23:45, 27 September 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Astrological symbol for Pluto removed 

message: For some reason, I'm not able to download the PDF of this page.
I keep getting this message (up-to-date Firefox, same issue with Chrome): "xxx.pdf.part could not be saved because the source file could not be read"
alex (talk) 16:44, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Seems to be fixed. — kwami (talk) 02:43, 18 October 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cannot download PDF 

message: I have a concern about the way the symbols are being shown in this table, in the cases where the symbol has a wikilink to an article about that symbol. If we want to show the symbol "as a 'thing' in itself", then we should show exactly that symbol and not an underlined version of it. This is because the line could be misunderstood as being part of the symbol. Options are to (a)just remove the wikilinking or (b)add another column giving the link or (c)something else. 
Comments? --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 15:53, 24 October 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see an underline unless I pass the cursor over it, in which case it's obvious that the underline isn't part of the symbol. Maybe that depends on the browser? — kwami (talk) 16:11, 24 October 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I also don't see an underline, but if this is a problem, then I guess removing the wikilinks is okay, since planet symbols is already linked as a see also. Double sharp (talk) 21:48, 24 October 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Column "Unicode" in table "Planets" in section "Symbols for the planets" 

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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion 

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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

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