Talk:2004 United States election voting controversies

message: President Obama said that electoral fraud does not happen in the United States; therefore, I move to remove this page.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.171.249.144 (talk) 19:53, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Vote to Delete

message: I've noticed that in a couple places in the article, technical terms are defined and explained. This reads like a term paper and doesn't appear encyclopedic. Linking style guidelines state that technical terms should be linked if there is an article. This is more valuable to the reader so that the article stays on topic and so that the readers can get more information about the technical term than we'd be able to provide inline in the article itself.
One particular example of this is the edit I made to the provisional ballots section, which appears to require some explanation. Instead of taking a whole paragraph to explain the term, a Wikilink is provided in the first sentence of the section so the reader may find out more about provisional ballots if needed or desired. --Amwestover (talk|contrib) 17:10, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You're example doesn't match the claim. A more relevant style guide would be WP:OBVIOUS. I'm not against wikilinking, but you're arguing relevant content should be removed. If you can suggest alternate language that would be fine, but only a wikilink is not sufficient. The explanation is relevant to why there is a controversy. Futher 2004 was the first presidential election which provisional balloting was mandated and for many states the first time they were ever used. If anything the section should be expanded not erased. Please do not revert and erase relevant content.71.178.193.134 (talk) 21:50, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Stating the obvious is more along the lines of saying "The Dallas Cowboys are a franchise in the National Football League". This isn't really stating the obvious, it's basically defining the term. That'd be appropriate for the lead in the provisional ballots article, but it's redundant to do it again elsewhere such as here. That's why it's suggested that technical terms be wikilinked.However, content specifically relevant to the 2004 election is appropriate. For instance, as you pointed out 2004 was the first election where they were mandated. I think that is pertinent information for this article that should be included. If there is sourced information confirming it, that's obviously even better. --Amwestover (talk|contrib) 06:05, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I apologize, but I fail to see nuance of your descriptions. Again, I'm fine with alternate language, I'm just saying something to give it context for readers is required. The biggest issue here is that provisional ballot isn't just a technical term. Its not something that most people familiar with elections commonly understand, even those with specific knowledge of the administration of elections in the US. Provisional ballots have different meaning in different states and a single meaning federally at the same time. Some states have used things they call provisional ballots for many years that bear no relation to wha the federal government calls provisional ballots and some states have been using something by a name other than provisional ballots that server the exact same purpose. When the Help America Vote Act became law the federal government began mandating provisional ballots, but only generally, allowing states to pick how they would be applied. This was a significant source of controversy in 2004. Again, I'm not saying all this info should be in this article, only that some context would be useful. Thanks. 71.178.193.134 (talk) 18:35, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Wikilinks

message: I did a little digging and, as far as North Carolina is concerned, i found this and this for starters. Based on what ive read, there is not enough here to warrant inclusion in this article, in my opinion.  The reason for this is, as R. fiend stated above, that i don't want to see this article become a dumping ground for every little thing that went wrong in 2004.  Frankly, we wouldn't be doing our readers any favors if we indiscriminately list everything that happened, no one would read it all and more important information would be lost in a sea of minutiae.
Having said all that, I do think that the voting machine section could stand some beefing up, both in terms of voting machine concerns generally and Diebold specifically. On that note, id like to throw out this link to start us out. 
I strongly agree with R. fiend's sentiment above that Mydogtrouble's focus on the actual article is commendable, so lets take that useful energy and put it into making this article better. Bonewah (talk) 19:42, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Diebold, North Carolina, etc

message: There is no mention here of Stephen Spoonamore, Mike Connell, and the associated computer election fraud. Perhaps someone who knows more about this matter could add to the article?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.201.169.151 (talk) 07:45, 31 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Omitted matters

message: Perhaps some of the following links could be added to the exit polling section.
Beyond Exit Poll Fundamentalism: Surveying the 2004 Election Debate
Controversies in Exit Polling: Implementing a Racially Stratified Homogenous Precinct Approach 
non-archive.org copy of a link we have
nate silver, 538
Long Lines, Voting Machine Availability, and Turnout: The Case of Franklin County, Ohio in the 2004 Presidential Election
Does Voting Technology Affect Election Outcomes? Touch-screen Voting and the 2004 Presidential Election
Why use an open source e-voting system?
Voter Disenfranchisement and Policy toward Election Reforms
Voting technologies and residual ballots in the 2000 and 2004 presidential elections
These are pulled from various deletion discussions and should be considered for inclusion (thanks, Protonk), I havent had a chance to review them, and, in the case of the scholarly journals, a number of them require subscriptions or are behind a paywall, but still, better to have all these links in one place, then to have to hunt them down. Bonewah (talk) 00:58, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: PBS interview with MITOFSKY Bonewah (talk) 21:32, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Some possible exit polling links

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.dailyiowan.com/news/2004/09/20/Opinions/Disenfranchising.Youth.Minorities-723650.shtml
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:20:10, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:20, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.tampatribune.com/MGBOPBXS5WD.html
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:20:31, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:20, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 2 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp?Page=%5c%5cPolitics%5c%5carchive%5c%5c200412%5c%5cPOL20041208b.html
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:20:50, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:21, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 3 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.democrats.org/pdfs/ohvrireport/section02.pdf
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:21:01, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:21, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 4 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen}}
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:21:10, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:21, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 5 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.vote.caltech.edu/media/documents/VotingMachines3.pdf
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:21:21, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:21, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 6 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.votingtechnologyproject.org/media/documents/Addendum_Voting_Machines_Bush_Vote.pdf
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:21:30, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:21, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 7 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://stonescryout.org/files/unexplained.pdf
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:21:41, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:22, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 8 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.votenader.org/media_press/index.php?cid=413
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:21:54, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:22, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 9 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://boxer.senate.gov/news/record.cfm?id=230450
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:22:00, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:22, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 10 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen/print
** In Electoral fraud on 2011-03-18 02:15:19, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:06, 404 Not Found
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:22:11, 404 Not Found
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:22, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 11 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.motherjones.com/arts/books/2005/11/recounting_ohio.html
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-05-25 07:49:37, Socket Error: 'An existing connection was forcibly closed by the remote host'
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:24:09, Socket Error: 'An existing connection was forcibly closed by the remote host'
--JeffGBot (talk) 12:24, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 12 

message: During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
* http://www.naacpldf.org/content.aspx?article=80
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-11 12:20:10, Socket Error: 'getaddrinfo failed'
** In 2004 United States election voting controversies on 2011-06-26 01:47:28, Socket Error: 'getaddrinfo failed'
--JeffGBot (talk) 01:47, 26 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 13 

message: I'm surprised that this article has no mention of the controversy surrounding the alleged rerouting of Ohio election results through the servers of SmarTech, the same company that hosted gwb43.com.  For those not familiar with this, see this recent article in The Free Press, which mentions a recent court filing.  Dotyoyo (talk) 18:02, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  GovTech and SmarTech involvement in Ohio results 

message: Several of the citations have accusations which aren't actually supported by, well, anything other than accusations.  What use does it do to repeat accusations which were investigated - or even in the citations - did not actually assert any wrongdoing upon the part of those named? 76.21.107.221 (talk) 04:47, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  'Accused' 

message: In the interest of honesty and objectivity, it's worth noting that ACORN was the one that brought the only verified, real instances of voter registration fraud by some of their employees to the attention of authorities.  They were not "exposed".  Those allegations that were made originally by outsiders turned out to be unfounded or outright fabricated when investigated by authorities.  ACORN self-policed and there was little or no connection between partisanship and the fraud that occurred.  That was not the case in any of the instances with Diebold or any of the GOP-connected registration, vote, and counting frauds.  There is an attempt to show equivalency between ACORN, a non-partisan non-profit organization that had no systemic instances of partisan fraud, and what the evidence repeatedly showed was an organized and concerted effort to commit fraud from right-connected individuals and organizations during the 2004 election for the express purpose of manipulating election results.  71.65.115.103 (talk) 21:28, 5 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  ACORN 

message: The Arbitration Committee are reviewing the discretionary sanctions topic areas with a view to remove overlapping authorisations, the proposed changes will affect this topic area. Details of the proposal are at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Motions#Motion: Overlap of Sanctions where your comments are invited. For the Arbitration Committee, Liz Read! Talk! 21:34, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Arbitration Motion 

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*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.dailyiowan.com/news/2004/09/20/Opinions/Disenfranchising.Youth.Minorities-723650.shtml
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/news/2004/08/22/2004-08-22_exposed__scandal_of_double_v.html
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.naacpldf.org/content.aspx?article=80
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080518213045/http://www.commondreams.org:80/views04/1110-31.htm to http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1110-31.htm
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://cha.house.gov/hearings/Testimony.aspx?TID=676
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.edssurvey.com/images/File/VotingEquipStudies
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/comments/2005/050208.php
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.ca6.uscourts.gov/opinions.pdf/04a0367p-06.pdf
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.house.gov/judiciary_democrats/mitofskyelecinforesp12704.pdf
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thread_title:  External links modified 

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*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1110-31.htm
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp?Page=%5C%5CPolitics%5C%5Carchive%5C%5C200412%5C%5CPOL20041208b.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081202233059/http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/politics/2002060393_breakin12m.html to http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/politics/2002060393_breakin12m.html
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thread_title:  External links modified