Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Media Restoration/Landmark images

message: I think one good method of integrating such 'landmark' photographs more tightly into Wikipedia is to have captions, paragraphs, sections and even whole articles, about the photographs. See Wikipedia:Captions for ideas on how to write a good caption within an article. See :Category:Photographs for articles on photographs. We also have articles on artworks, and on maps. See :Category:Maps for the latter, such as :Category:Old maps of the world. For articles with sections about photographs, see examples such as Neville Chamberlain for a treatment of the famous "peace in our time" photograph. For more on the history of the various Chamberlain images, see Wikipedia:Images and media for deletion/2007 August 20#Image:Neville Chamberlain2.jpg and User:Carcharoth/Chamberlain image information. I also forgot to mention :Category:Non-free historic images - while many of the free images can be sorted and dealt with on Commons, it is here on Wikipedia that the accompanying encyclopedic prose (with references) is best written. And the non-free historic ones can only be dealt with here, and not on Commons. Though it is worth remembering that the oldest non-free historic ones are quietly falling into the public domain as time goes by. Carcharoth (talk) 21:32, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Just to avoid a wild-goose chase, due to the provisions of the Mickey Mouse Protection Act, no additional historic works will enter the public domain under U.S. law between 1998 and 2019.—Twigboy (talk) 17:56, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, we can thank Sonny Bono for that.  Fortunately we're also getting new images under public domain and copyleft from volunteers who document current events.  Some of that donated material may be feature-worthy. DurovaCharge! 18:43, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

text: That's only the ones where there was an identified author, I think. And I believe that non-US material entering the public domain outside the US, and first published outside the US, is still OK. It gets confusing though, so don't take my word for it. You also get people who donate images into the public domain, even press agencies sometimes. See :Commons:Category:PD U.S. News & World Report and :Commons:Template:PD-USNWR for pictures and details. Another good example is :Image:Martin Luther King Jr NYWTS 4.jpg, which can be seen to be PD according to this. Carcharoth (talk) 14:12, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I studied writing in graduate school where a course in related law was required curriculum.  Some of the nuances of image copyright are things I'd like to know better, but I'm up on the basics.  Thanks, DurovaCharge! 16:46, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Articles or sections about photographs 

message: Does the second version stand a chance?  It's still soft focus. DurovaCharge! 21:27, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *So many lines! I can't tell if the horizontals on the lower half are tilted, and I'm not sure if that horizontal in the upper half is  a tilt or perspective distortion. Also, it's too bad the composition is the way it is—no place for Mr. Owens to run/fall into. WRT the issue you bring up, I think the focus, especially on the face, is of sufficient sharpness for a 1936 photograph. Given the date, the history, and the iconic nature and importance of the event being depicted, I would be completely happy supporting if it was only a matter of focus and sharpness. The composition and tilt (if it is a tilt) would be bigger issues for me. --Malachirality (talk) 22:14, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *Actually I think it does need a very slight ccw rotation, based on the verticals, but not as much as the horizontals would suggest. So a mixture of perspective and actual tilt, I guess. --Malachirality (talk) 22:17, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

text: *I would actually say that the difference is not only unsurprising, but relatively mild. Not to bash Commons at all, but it's been my experience that many images overwhelming pass commons and then fail at en.wiki FPC. This is often not only a matter of difference in encyclopedic concerns (which is absent from Commons). Just take a look at the current nom page--my Dalai nom and most of Aitias' Commons FP noms. The main difference IMO is that english FPC emphasizes (almost requires) voters to consider the input and comments of others and to use these opinions to inform their own vote, while Commons seems much more up-or-down support/oppose. Tangentially, en.wiki also has stringent enc. considerations that preclude many of the "pretty" Commons FPs. Anyways, that's just my two cents. --Malachirality (talk) 22:43, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Second opinion wanted 

message: Same image, nominated at both sites within a day's difference.
*Commons 14-0 support (as of now)
*Wikipedia 4-0-1 support with several dissatisfied comments, an attempt at color correction, and calls for more changes.
Insights? DurovaCharge! 22:25, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *I would actually say that the difference is not only unsurprising, but relatively mild. Not to bash Commons at all, but it's been my experience that many images overwhelming pass commons and then fail at en.wiki FPC. This is often not only a matter of difference in encyclopedic concerns (which is absent from Commons). Just take a look at the current nom page--my Dalai nom and most of Aitias' Commons FP noms. The main difference IMO is that english FPC emphasizes (almost requires) voters to consider the input and comments of others and to use these opinions to inform their own vote, while Commons seems much more up-or-down support/oppose. Tangentially, en.wiki also has stringent enc. considerations that preclude many of the "pretty" Commons FPs. Anyways, that's just my two cents. --Malachirality (talk) 22:43, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Commons FPC v. Wikipedia FPC

message: :Looks good. Good cropping and clean-up. One question. The original is here. Does it matter whether we are using the right or left hand image of the stereoscope? I would say, though, that this isn't particularly a landmark image. Nice encyclopedic image, but that wouldn't in my view be enough for featured picture candidates. It needs a little something extra. Carcharoth (talk) 14:32, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's a piece of social history.  Documentary evidence of everyday life is a legitimate historical discipline.  I'm thinking of seeing how the people on Commons feel about it. DurovaCharge! 14:45, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree, but if you are including those in landmark images, there will be lots of them. To my mind, landmark images refer to specific people and dates, but it's in your userspace for now, so I won't quibble. Carcharoth (talk) 14:59, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

text: I think the original caption works. I don't see anything weird about calling someone a native, but maybe that's cause we're proud of being natives where I live. (Unfortunately, I'm actually a transplant, but this is home.) Kyaa the Catlord (talk) 17:41, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you.  It's not so much native as Palestine. DurovaCharge! 17:55, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmmm, I don't have a problem with that either. Nice work on these images, btw. Kyaa the Catlord (talk) 05:58, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. :) DurovaCharge! 13:02, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another cleanup job for review 

message: The orginal stereoscope description for this 1905 image says, The native mode of grinding coffee, Palestine  The photo was distributed commercially for a United States audience. link to the Library of Congress file, link to the Library of Congress group description.  I've tried to correlate this description to the Ottoman Empire administrative divisions of 1905 and really can't place it definitively anywhere.  The description looks politically loaded by 2008 standards.
Suggested description would be "Women grinding coffee, Middle East, 1905.  Original steroscope caption reads The native mode of grinding coffee, Palestine."
Basically I would like to see about getting this fine photograph of daily life featured, and want to avoid upsetting anyone's political sensitivities.  Suggestions are welcome. DurovaCharge! 23:14, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the original caption works. I don't see anything weird about calling someone a native, but maybe that's cause we're proud of being natives where I live. (Unfortunately, I'm actually a transplant, but this is home.) Kyaa the Catlord (talk) 17:41, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you.  It's not so much native as Palestine. DurovaCharge! 17:55, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmmm, I don't have a problem with that either. Nice work on these images, btw. Kyaa the Catlord (talk) 05:58, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. :) DurovaCharge! 13:02, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Request for comment 

message: Please reply here.
*Palestine was what English speakers were invariably calling that region at that time, e.g. I've used this book as a source for a Palestine town: . Yes, there was no political entity by that name, but by that reasoning, there's no such place as New England either. Besides, at that time, Palestine was in the Near East, not the Middle East, which didn't exist yet then either. -- Kendrick7talk 23:33, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the original caption works. I don't see anything weird about calling someone a native, but maybe that's cause we're proud of being natives where I live. (Unfortunately, I'm actually a transplant, but this is home.) Kyaa the Catlord (talk) 17:41, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you.  It's not so much native as Palestine. DurovaCharge! 17:55, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmmm, I don't have a problem with that either. Nice work on these images, btw. Kyaa the Catlord (talk) 05:58, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. :) DurovaCharge! 13:02, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: RFC feedback

message: The following are (as of 31 December 2007), the pics and media that I consider "landmark" (well, I guess what I'm really saying is that these ones are of specific, rather than general, historic interest). Many of the others are of interest, but these are what I see as the cream of the crop:
*:Image:Yeager supersonic flight 1947.ogg - agreed!
*:Image:Douglas MacArthur lands Leyte1.jpg - cleaned, on PPR
*:Image:1stPhotoFromSpace.jpg (beware trying to clean this up - the poor quality is part of the historic value)
*:Image:Nimitz missouri.jpg - too small
*:Image:Federal Ironclad GALENA 1862 lowres.png - I can't explain the cutout
*:Image:Marche sel.jpg - out of focus
*:Image:Benoist xiv.jpg - too small
Some of the others are great as well. I've started putting them in articles. Carcharoth (talk) 15:25, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the help.  The first photo from space went down in flames at PPR.  We need a larger version to even have a change.  I might go to work on the Nimitz pic today.  Happy New Year. :) DurovaCharge! 20:29, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It did? I can't find that discussion anywhere. Happy New Yesr to you too! Carcharoth (talk) 21:23, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've checked out all the others and added my notes. DurovaCharge! 03:56, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The cutout? The magnification box, do you mean? The original lacks that. You could submit both. Carcharoth (talk) 18:40, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

text: The originals are here. They are already linked from the image page. :-) Carcharoth (talk) 17:52, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The ones that stand out for me 

message: No matter what I do this is going to be very soft focus, but considering it's over 100 years old and rather dramatic...think it's worth a try? DurovaCharge! 18:51, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The great thing about this pic, in my opinion, is the guy in the background bending sideways to get a better view... I generally don't like pictures like this, as I get to thinking too much about what choices the guy about to die made (or what choices others made) that led to his story ending this way. But this is a dramatic picture, there is no doubt about that. Carcharoth (talk) 17:54, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You're right about the fellow bending sideways.  I wish the man on the far left hadn't been cut off.  Would have drawn in the viewer more effectively to have someone standing nearby.  I don't like this type of scene either and part of what makes it palatable is that it's over 100 years old. DurovaCharge! 18:06, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another cleanup 

message: The Library of Congress link you have provided goes to a search form for a specific collection. Did you mean to link to the general LoC image search here instead? Carcharoth (talk) 21:04, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wrong link? 

message: I've re-upped a newer version here: :Image:Andrew johnson2.png
let me know what you think. JaakobouChalk Talk 14:00, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Not quite sure it's ready for showtime.  Try peer review. DurovaCharge! 18:52, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Andrew Johnson]] 

message: The King picture and B-25 tanks are now both in articles. Mostlyharmless (talk) 05:59, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. ;) DurovaCharge! 07:27, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: No worries, the King pic wasn't my doing. They're not going to get to Featured Pictures if they aren't 'encyclopedic' :) The Air Guardsman on the radio-tower is also homed, at Inspection. Mostlyharmless (talk) 07:41, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Homes found

message: You may want to substitute the current image with the accurate one per this discussion. ww2censor (talk) 23:27, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: British Guiana stamp

message: Hope I didn´t over do this one. please your review/comment on it! the right lower corner is unrepearable without harming the original too much.--Hrald (talk) 12:56, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Hiram Rhodes Revels by Brady-Handy

message: Since I´m new at uploading other peoples work, I don´t know if I did it correctly.I hope it doesn´t get deleted.--Hrald (talk) 23:49, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Abner Doubleday

message: I've looked at the history a bit and there seems to have been very little activity after 2009. And I'm finding most of the images requesting editing I've looked at so far have long ago been addressed. So my question is "Do any human beings (and/or fellow editors -wink-) care about this page?" --Kevjonesin (talk) 17:36, 15 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is this a dead project page?