Talk:Scotch (adjective)

message: How did the word "Scotch" in reference to the people of Scotland, rather than the drink of course, survive in American English but not in any other dialects of English?  Surely there is a story to be told even if it is just a quick description of how the American English dictionary was compiled to explain the difference. [This unsigned comment by User, 80.41.227.227 - 21 June 06]
it isnt used in other dialects of english because scottish people dont like being called scotch (before you ask how i know this i am scottish and every scottish person i know including myself dont like it)
:The obvious explanation would be that it survived (if it really has) for the simple reason that Americans are less likely to meet any Scottish people to set them straight on the matter. --Oolong 17:02, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: A little history on American English?

message: Maybe Scotch should redirect to Scotch whisky? This seems to be the most current use of the term. I'm not sure how to rename this page, however. Givennovel 02:14, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In my experience Scottish people don't say "Scotch Whisky" or "Scotch Pie" at all - just "whisky" and "pie". - Duncan Sneddon  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.132.41.0 (talk) 11:24, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It shouldn't. I've heard "pint of scotch" in local pubs (N. E. England). Dsalt (talk) 00:21, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Whisky 

message: See the title of his poem, "On a Scotch Bard, Gone to the West Indies"  , clearly not a "pejorative" usage. -- Ben TALK/HIST 05:33, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Robert Burns used "Scotch" as ="Scottish" 

message: I was initially amused to find a citation for the use of Scotch in regard to politicians, but actually it appears that the term "Scotch-Irish" is more common than "Scottish-Irish"(an estimated 1,190,000 vs. 284,000 hits).  Which term is most correct? Mike Serfas 13:52, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Depends on what you mean by "correct" and for which country. Both are acceptable English. If you meant in terms of public opinion (i.e. actual usage), then the numbers speak for themselves (opinions can change over time, however). Not sure why you would be amused even if it was just "Scotch" by itself. That's the common and acceptable term in North America, even embraced by those that fit the description. Outside of America, the meaning can be misinterpreted as referring to ethnicity only. It has more to do with nationality. I never even heard of the terms "Scots" before today. It seems that one or two users are trying to push this word over the Atlantic, which is cool if it is indeed offensive to them, but they are making it appear as if it's already a reality. Wikipedia can be a powerful platform. 75.4.145.158 (talk) 21:38, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Scotch-Irish 

message: I'd suggest that no one outside (outwith?) Scotland thinks that "scotch" has negative connotations. English people use it innocently, Americans use it fondly. It is a mystery how Scottish people have come to consider that it has connotations. The foul calumny of meanness attaches to Scots/Scottish/ Scotch in general (because of people like John Laws, Adam Smith?) never mind which word is used (the slight tendency in America to use 'scotch' to mean 'mean' is perhaps because 'scots' and 'scottish' are less used generally). To my ears 'scots' always sounds mean and hard and slatey. Scottish sounds more heathery. Scotch happier. 88888 23:57, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Imagined insults

message: This article seems to have acquired a melange of odd unsourced and unlikely statements, such as the proposition that American lawyers always use the phrase 'Scotch law' (I deal with them daily; they hardly ever do!). I was entertained by the last editor, User:Reginmund, whose user page says he is "proud to be English" and "of Scottish ancestry", asserting in his deletion of the statement that the usage of 'Scotch' was pejorative, that 'Being a Scot, I don't find this offensive at all"(!) and have tried to state a balanced view on this. I have also tried to clean up the paragraph beginning 'Decline in Usage', which has got into a mess due to a combination of (a) wrong use of tags, so that material is invisible, and (b) the inclusion of material which may be interesting but is of no relevance. 
On this 'pejorative'/'not pejorative' matter I can only say that the Scottish dislike of the word has been fairly widely (albeit far from universally) known since at least 1908 (see New York Times reference), and as a Scot who works and travels in England and America a fair bit I am very conscious that there is an English usage of 'Scotch' as a genteelly derogatory word, like 'Frog' or 'Dago'; I don't hear it used as a compliment! But I am also conscious that this is not American usage, where it is, in my experience, always innocent. ariwara (talk) 23:03, 8 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Clean-up

message: I'm not sure what makes the "pre-emminant" AJP Taylor an expert on Scottish matters considering the horrible way in which he dismisses Scottish culture in some of his work.-CM  
:Entirely agree.  This is why I deleted that, but I was reverted.  I think this SHOULD be removed - or possibly kept as a minority view mentioned somewhere further down, but not highlighted like this.  And the "eminent" bit is POV. I'll chage it. --Doric Loon (talk) 09:25, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: In fact, the A.J.P. Taylor quote is the only properly referenced statement in the whole article. Chrisieboy (talk) 11:02, 7 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Bear in mind Taylor was writing over fifty years ago and is specifically talking about English usage - and the broader thrust of that introduction makes clear this means "in England" rather than the language. However it does feel a bit like a shot in a mini-linguistic war. You see similar rows today (including on Wikipedia talkpages) about a traditional name being the "English name" [sic] of particular countries that have renamed themselves. Timrollpickering (talk) 11:09, 1 June 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: A J P taylor

message: This should be mentioned too. 75.4.145.158 (talk) 20:51, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Scotch Tape]] 

message: The confusion between Scots and Scotch (the latter being on the one hand disparaged by Scotsmen and -women who are Scots speakers; and on the other, apparently used by them in speech) arises out of a still-current local prounciation variant: a consonant followed by a final S causes that S to mutate into Sh. Thus, mince becomes minsh, a pronunciation I can attest to having heard my grandmother (born Glasgow Calton, 1917) use; and Scots becomes Scotsh - or, to the non-native ear, Scotch.
Those in search of citations should look in Billy Kay's The Mither Tongue, where he references this passim.
Nuttyskin (talk) 18:24, 17 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Pronunciation

message: I have to wonder if this is invariably true among folk from Scotland. Here in Australia I have now been exclaimed over by eleven who lack the thick Scottish accent I have heard in Edinburgh and Glasgow. (Where, be it said, a substantial proportion are themselves or their ancestors were from Ireland: as so was Gaelic). All exclaim over my obvioiusly being Canadian where, they assure me, there are more Scotch than in Scotland (and so-expressing it). Is the Scottish-versus-Scotch distinction perhaps a Lowlands issue? My western Canadian grandparents and their siblings were all Gaelic-speakers and not one of them used "Scottish." Indeed, I discover that many south-Bougainvilleans, years after my time there, carry my name: apparently it is still remembered that I demanded at a school staff meeting that the Australian school rule be abandoned that, as in my grandparents' time in Canada, students be punished if caught speaking their own languages rather than English, they at least being allowed to speak it on weekends. Masalai (talk) 12:41, 8 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: What?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.102.253.144 (talk) 13:51, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: "Scotch (the latter being...disparaged by Scotsmen and -women..."