Talk:Terri Schiavo case/Archive 35

message: New News:
New Template Created to stop instability in this article -so it can be featured, if the Wiki-Spirits find favor and want to give a blessing: 
See the 4th picture, which says: "This article is protected from modification because it is currently or will soon be on the Main Page."
My explanation of events.--GordonWattsDotCom 01:48, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I haven't been following the FAC votes, but it sounds like people are concerned the this article is too unstable to deserve FAC status. You have no one to blame for that but yourself, Gordon. You kept pushing this POV stuff into the article, and knowing 3RR would prevent you from keeping it in, you requested the article be locked instead. Yeah, the article is unstable because of YOU. You couldn't just drop it or find neutral wording and instead you ran to an admin to lock the page. That makes the article look unstable as hell. And if an article is so disputed to cause an edit war and page lock DURING a FAC vote, then editors will see it as a sign of problems and vote against. What did you expect? FuelWagon 13:20, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Template Created to stop instability 

message: The article says:
:By her senior year in high school, Schiavo was overweight....She may have developed an eating disorder around this time in order to cope with her perceived weight problem. 
If the article says she was overweight, the how was her weight problem perceived? Either she was overweight or she perceived herself to be overweight. It can't be both. Kingturtle 03:59, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It can certainly be both.  Some people are overweight but do not believe themselves to be so, or acknowledge their overweight status while not caring.  There are also differences between being overweight and having a "weight problem". — ceejayoz ★ 00:41, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The article is not locked due to any disputes about Terri's weight; it is locked for disputes on whether or not to simply report on the facts regarding the concerns of the various parties about Terri's FIRST admission to a hospice; and the major versions are put forth by me and FuelWagon, and an admin is waiting patiently for concensus on that issue --therefore it is NOT logical to debate non-relevant issues that have not bearing on the article's fitness at this point; hold off on that if/when we reach concensus on the other issues and unlock the article -and, your studied review would be helpful here.--GordonWattsDotCom 01:45, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  weight 

message: The article says:
:Schiavo's friends began to have suspicions about her eating habits. After meals out, she would immediately excuse herself to go to the bathroom.
Which friends? Friends from Pennsylvania? New friends in Florida? This article needs to be specific here - otherwise it sounds like hearsay. Furthermore, the article needs to clear. Which friends? Who! Kingturtle 04:05, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Wow.  It's remarkable what sort of stuff gets deleted from the article as unverifiable or disputed and magically gets added back. patsw 04:11, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Three minutes of googling found this link . quoting: "During the malpractice case, at least one of Schiavo's friends testified they knew she was bulimic because after meals out, she always immediately excused herself to go to the bathroom." Enjoy. FuelWagon 17:21, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

text: I am very familiar with that article.  In the same trial, Michael, his family, the Schindler's, and Terri's other friends testified to the contrary they did not observe this obvious indicator of bulimia.  And, again, if she had been forcing herself to vomit to the extent it would eventually cause the potassium imbalance that caused her collapse, there would have been scarring of the esophagus and stomach evident in the autopsy.  The persistence of speculation of an eating disorder remains a problem in the article. patsw 17:50, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: well, lets get rid of all this bulimia speculation so we can report what really happened: Michael abused Terri and strangled her the night of her collapse. FuelWagon 18:33, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  friends' suspicions 

message: Hey, I thought things had cooled down. What's with all this fussing again?
My quick fix approach would be this: Each party makes ONE edit per day. And only ONE comment per party, on any given edit.
So if 4 people are editing, this would mean:
#Four edits.
#Each edit would get 4 comments (max) for a total of 16 comments (you can comment on your own edit).
Want to try that for a week?
(your former Mediator), Uncle Ed 00:00, September 9, 2005 (UTC)
:Having read through all of the above, it's clear to me that:
:# Both Gordon and FW are rather entrenched into their respective positions and
:# My opinion is not going to be enough to create any sort of consensus by itself.
:It seems that the best course of action is to put up a Request for comment for the issue at hand, and get more voices to chime in on this. When we have a significant number of editors looking at it, we can reach a consensus.
:I realize that putting this on RfC is going to attract just as many POV warriors as it will disinterested third parties, if not more. With that in mind, I will keep as close an eye as I can on this article and the goings on here at the talk page in the days to come.
:In the interest of fostering easy-to-comprehend discussion, I have a pair of suggestions:
:# Try to minimize the number of subheadings created on the talk page, for clarity's sake and
:# Don't interject comments into the midst of someone else's chronologically superior comments when you are trying to speak to certain points.
:I think if we keep things like that in mind, and if we try to foster as level-headed a discussion as possible, we will succeed in coming to a consensus. I urge both of you, Gordon and FW, to keep in mind that this is only Wikipedia; it's important, but not important enough to pop a blood vessel. You're both clearly sick to death of one another, and maybe a day or two away from the project wouldn't be a bad idea. That said, you're both intelligent adults and no one has any power to tell you what to do, regardless.
:I am going to submit this article for RfC shortly, and for the sake of clarity, I'm going to archive anything on the talk page that does not directly impinge upon the matter at hand. I hope that this is agreeable to all. Fernando Rizo T/C 01:36, 9 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: "I hope that this is agreeable to all." Yes, all that=agreeable // except that (maybe) you could speed up the RfC, if that is possible, or, maybe I will look into speeding it up??--GordonWattsDotCom 02:11, 9 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The article has been put up for RfC. Fernando Rizo T/C 02:33, 9 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Let's all stop bickering

message: Since an article RFC has been filed, here is the short version of the issue:
GordonWattsDotCom recently added the following paragraph to the second guardianship challenge
:In April 2000, in the midst of the guardianship challenge, Schiavo, widely described as the "brain-damaged Florida woman" [25] at the heart of this legal battle, was admitted to a Pinellas County, Florida hospice [26], a facility, which in her state of Florida, is typically only legally allowed to admit terminally ill patients. [27]
An edit war ensued. Gordon ran out of reverts and asked an admin to lock the page before his edit got reverted again. The page has been locked since. The dispute has deadlocked and there are currently two proposals.
*I left my reasoning in a below section with this edit. Basically the paragraph is not needed at all because it is not an important enough point. The page has been protected too long over such a small point and Gordon should simply agree not to add it until consensus is there for having it be in the article. - Taxman Talk 18:03, September 11, 2005 (UTC)
*I'll second Taxman for the sake of moving forward. Marskell 18:21, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Article RFC