Talk:Kouta Hirano

message: There is preëxisting consensus that hiragana is not needed when giving Japanese names; see Wikipedia:Manual of Style (Japan-related articles) for the currently agreed-upon format. Please do not add the kana again until and unless consensus changes concerning this.  –Aponar Kestrel (talk) 14:07, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "Furthermore, Hirano himself is known to write his name in hiragana — technically furigana — above its kanji counterpart." - Everyone does, Bakemono. That doesn't mean he writes his name in Hiragana (when it's not furigana). See, male names are almost NEVER given in hiragana. Hiragana is a "female" script, so to speak. WhisperToMe 02:38, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's going a bit far, don't you think? It certainly used to be, back in the Heian period when it was invented; and on reflection it's true that it is more common for girls to have names without kanji than it is for boys. However, I have nothing but agreement for your main point: in Japan everyone effectively must provide kana renderings of the kanji in their names, or else no one will know how to pronounce them. To consider a relevant example, 平野 can also be read Tairano, Hinino, or Hirana. As gikun, 平野 is also used for the name Ōhira. And apparently (I have no idea why) there's at least one person out there who glosses their name 平野 as Karurosu, which I assume is somehow a rendering of Carlos.  (And you probably thought it was hard to figure out how to pronounce Trzetrzelewski!) Hiragana and furigana aren't considered unnecessary because we have the kanji; they're considered unnecessary because we have the rōmaji. (See also Japanese name, kanji, and nanori.)  –Aponar Kestrel (talk) 04:57, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hiragana 

message: To be fair, it appears that the most common way to romanize his name in Japan is "Kouta Hirano" (based on all the Japanese manga pages scanned above by Bakemono). However, the most common way to romanize the name in English (which is what Wikipedia uses to determine which to use) appears to be "Kohta Hirano" based on the number of Google hits for each version of the romanization, as presented above). Specifically, the Naming conventions page states: 
::Generally, article naming should give priority to what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity, while at the same time making linking to those articles easy and second nature.
Now, it stands to reason that the title that "the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize" is going to be the name most commonly found when doing a seach on the internet using Google, Yahoo!, AltaVista, or whatever other search engine/registry you want to use to perform the search. Here are results of those searches:
::Kouta Hirano or Hirano Kouta:
:::Google: 22,280 total hits (20,500 hits "Kouta Hirano", 1,780 hits "Hirano Kouta")
:::Yahoo!: 3203 total hits (2880 hits "Kouta Hirano", 323 hits "Hirano Kouta")
:::AltaVista: 3075 total hits (2760 hits AltVista, "Kouta Hirano", 315 hits AltaVista, "Hirano Kouta")
:::Lycos: 1688 total hits (1462 hits Lycos, "Kouta Hirano", 226 hits Lycos, "Hirano Kouta")
::Kohta Hirano or Hirano Kohta:
:::Google: 95,100 total hits (44,200 hits "Kohta Hirano", 50,900 hits "Hirano Kohta")
:::Yahoo!: 11,953 total hits (11,300 hits "Kohta Hirano", 653 hits "Hirano Kohta")
:::AltaVista: 11,836 total hits (11,200 hits "Kohta Hirano", 636 hits AltaVista, "Hirano Kohta")
:::Lycos: 2578 total hits (2155 hits "Kohta Hirano", 423 hits "Hirano Kohta")
I suspect that any other search engine will return similar ratios. Now, are we going to go with "what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize" (per WP:NC), or are we going to go with something else? ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 22:26, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Considering that most publications in North America other than DH's manga releases use "Kouta" (the TV series for example), it's not like people won't recognize "Kouta". Many people in the fandom, if not most, use Kouta. And, as I've said time and time again; several prominent, reliable, professional websites and publications use the Kouta spelling. The "anime press", if you will. AnimeNewsNetwork is arguably the source for anime and manga news/info. The fact that they would use "Kouta" instead of "Kohta", despite DH's usage, says something to me. They're very picky about the spellings of seiyuu/mangaka/etc. ANN, AnimeonDVD, Anime Insider, etc. Animerica used the "ou" spelling too if memory serves me right. Geneon uses that spelling both here and in Japan, as does Pioneer. And let's not forget the conventions, the trade shows, etc. that have used "Kouta". Geneon at AX 2005, for example. I don't see why DH's rendition of his name takes precedent over the others. The google results are skewed. Who cares if it gets loads of results? How is that relevant to this argument? I completely agree with Ned, the Google test does not provide us with a good representation. The results are bloated because of the websites and bookstores selling the manga. This accounts for a single company using the "oh" spelling - Dark Horse; the retailers use it as a result. They work with what they're given, they just sell the product and have no reason to use a different spelling. And since the TV series (which uses "Kouta") was lisenced here first, you could even argue that DH's usage of "Kohta" is an anomaly, and not the other way around, but that's moot. Schrödinger 23:27, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I don't really don't care what title this article has. I don't care about this author/artist, either. I do disagree that "Kouta" is the "universally correct spelling of his name", and I've stated my reasons. You can continue to belittle me all you want and it won't change my mind. Your tactics are incredibly uncivil, and you have a lot to learn about interacting with other editors here in a civil manner. Sarcasm is fine in small doses, but when you use nothing but sarcasm in your posts, it's incredibly difficult to take you seriously at all. Unless you learn how to play nicely in the sandbox, you're going to continue to have a difficult time interacting with all but a very small minority of editors here on Wikipedia. You aren't garnering any friends with the way you're currently acting. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 00:15, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I honestly still think the title should be at Kohta Hirano instead of the other one because Kohta shows up so many more times in Google. WhisperToMe 02:33, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Okay.. 1. I know about the evidence you presented. Guess what? I say Kohta Hirano is a trade name too :) After all, Mr. Hirano knows that Dark Horse romanizes his name that way, right? In sense it is his trade name. Also, I disagree with the notion that Kouta Hirano is the most common in the fanbase. If it was, how come "Kohta Hirano" is more common? WhisperToMe 03:16, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Title revisited 

message: I've merged the page histories of Kohta Hirano and Kouta Hirano (as well as their associated Talk pages) in order to fix the incorrect cut-and-paste move of the pages. Please do not move the pages through cut-and-paste again. Thank you. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 00:03, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Page histories restored

message: Coming here per the comment on WP:ANIME all I can say is... strawpoll anyone?   (I also refer interested parties to the fictional character name discussions on WP:MOS-JA, a category of names which have this problem on a more frequent basis.) 
A few points: put all name variations into the article.  This will allow the names to all be picked up by search engines.  The most efficient way to do is to footnote them on the name entry.  Also create redirects from the various other spellings of the name (I assume this was done already.) This will also push search engines into picking up this name. 
Template nihogo is another good way to include name varations in an article that help to increase searchability .  I would also like to reinforce the idea that we should NOT include the "hiragana version". Romaji trumps that usage in most cases.  --Kunzite 00:12, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Well.. 

message: Okay - If we can't have ruby characters, we shouldn't. Everyone is in agreement with not having ruby characters, right? WhisperToMe 02:12, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: WP:MOS-JA → "Do not use the  tag to further annotate the kanji, as many browsers cannot display it properly, and it does not degrade gracefully." They're not even used in the Japanese wikipedia. --Kunzite 02:28, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Ruby characters

message: Amazon.co.jp uses "Kohta". See: Amazon.co.jp listing. — Nrtm81 10:18, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kohta Hirano 

message: I see that Crossfire hasn't got an article, I know that most is covered in the Hellsing article (mostly the characters) but I was thinking we summarise the plots and note differences in the characters (Maxwell's change in appearance for example.
Sam 11:44, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: About Crossfire

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thread_title:  External links modified