Talk:Paul Crouch

message: I mislabelled my last update as a "footnote", which it's not.  Anyway, I added links to the LA Times article referred to in the body of the article, plus the TBN web site, so people can verify stuff.  --rob 07:52, 22 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: Prove it.
There is more to him than one article, the allegations of which have not been verified as fact, but all you seem to focus on in your bias. 
The man has done a lot of great things and won many awards. He has many notable, well written about accomplishments. I would write about them, but what's the sense with some of you deleting everything on Wikipedia every 5 seconds that you don't like, fact or not.
 
-Sonustar
He is also a liar. --66.218.18.250 20:05, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Prove it

message: Please do not add tags without giving a detailed explanation for it. We don't let tags stay or bogus claims stay. Both are to be removed if the claims/tags aren't without reason. Arbustoo 23:54, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: NPOV tag

message: I have updated the basic facts regarding Paul Crouchs' career in broadcasting, and the network he founded. I have added credible neutral sources which verify statistics on the size of Trinity Broadcasting Network, awards, citations, and rating in the US as the 6th largest Broadcast Group. I have attempted to leave original content and only moved its location so that the paragraphs flowed in a logical fashion. In some places, the new information was more accurately cited, so old information that stated the same fact was replaced, but not restated in a way that took away from the original intent of the editor.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ellen Brichetto (talk • contribs) 19:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Updated Bio/Neutral Sources

message: I've proposed that Jan Crouch be merged into this article. Jan being the co-founder of TBN means that it might not be appropriate just to delete her article, but her notability is entirely dependent on the network rather than on independent coverage of her, so it's better to merge any useful content into this article and perhaps rename it "Paul and Jan Crouch." Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 18:44, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Smile of a Child doesn't appear to be notable, so her status as its founder and president doesn't contribute to notability. HLE's website gives no indication of her being involved in its administration in any way, so whether or not that would contribute to independent notability is a moot point. Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 06:31, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

text: This is not substantively different from the comment I replied to, but you haven't addressed the criticisms I made of it in my reply, namely that Smile of a Child is not notable per Wikipedia guidelines, which require significant coverage in reliable sources, and that the HLE site doesn't say that Crouch has ever done so much as sweep floors for the park, let alone run its operations. Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 17:59, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

text: For the third time, Smile of a Child is not a notable organization, so her role in it is irrelevant. Businesses and charities are not automatically notable, and people associated with them, even less so. The fact that they have a TV channel doesn't make them notable - that TV channel is on the station run by their founder! Hardly independent recognition. The sources added confirm that she is president of HLE, but that isn't a notable position. See WP:BIO (which doesn't even mention "founder of something" as a notable position, so if someone else felt like it, they might well come in and say "who cares if she's the founder, she hasn't received any coverage in reliable sources"). Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 19:55, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

text: The UN doesn't think Smile is "notable," it gives it a one-sentence mention in a long list of charities who have done good work, and the "special consultative status" was awarded to the organization rather than to Jan personally. I see no evidence that her name ever came up. And claiming that their TV channel/network is independent from TBN is like claiming that Nick Jr. is independent from Nickelodeon - her notability for founding TBN is why I didn't recommend this for immediate deletion and instead proposed a merge, but she doesn't gain added notability for the Smile of a Child network which, as I said, is a sub-network of TBN. You don't get to double-dip. As well, if she is so widely acclaimed or notorious, information about her should appear in reliable, independent sources. If she's so famous, why don't any reliable sources care? (There's Encyclopedia of women and religion and a vaguely satirical article in The Advocate, which doesn't amount to much.) And finally, before you baselessly accuse me of disruptive editing, look to the beam in your own eye - you do nothing on Wikipedia but promote the Crouch family, and if I feel it's worth it I may file at WP:COIN so that users unaffiliated with the subject may have a real discussion. Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 04:25, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

text: The UN doesn't think it's notable, it thinks it's helpful. The two are not synonyms. All these things about her being 76 and living in Orlando are very nice - I myself know some wonderful elderly ladies who live in Florida - but this is irrelevant. As I've said, what, six times now, she has not received coverage in reliable sources, nor has she any significant achievements apart from founding TBN with Paul. Hence the proposed merge rather than a proposed deletion. If she's so very notorious, surely you can provide evidence of her notoriety, rather than merely your assertion. Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 05:03, 16 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed merge 

message: Why are there no mentions of the backmasking controversy he started? It did bring him to public attention, seeing as he acused a number of high profile artists of promoting Satanism through backmasking techniques. --Spence The Chef (talk) 07:31, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Backmasking 

message: I added the following sentence to the Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN) history section, "Paul Crouch received $400,000 in executive salary as president and his wife $365,000 as first vice president."
It was based on the May 2012 
Family Battle Offers Look Inside Lavish TV Ministry article in the New York Times. User:Lyonscc, who seems to have concerns about publicizing controversial information about top executives of religious nonprofit organizations in general, and compensation data in particular (see Salaries of the Hanegraaffs, Cleanup of Article, and "String of controversies" and compensation) removed the sentence, despite all the reasons I identified in our dialogues in the Talk:Hank Hanegraaff article. I'm admittedly a newbie to Wikipedia editing, so my earlier rationales for adding compensation data were uninformed, but my latest post ("String of controversies" and compensation) hopefully represents a more knowledgeable perspective.
I'm moving the sentence to the Criticisms and controversies section where, based on the source article title and content, it more appropriately fits.
Ralph Dave Westfall 15:36, 11 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Compensation of the Crouches 

message: Paul Crouch may be dead, but other people named in the article are not; please note that all references to living people still need to abide by Wikipedia's biographical article policy relating to living people. -- The Anome (talk) 17:40, 1 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[WP:BLP]] 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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