Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Opera/Archive 15

message: In view of recent problems, I am wondering if we should have a policy on biography infoboxes - to be included on the main project page.
Here is a possible wording:
New infoboxes: We hope all new infoboxes will be proposed and discussed on the project talk page, before being added to individual pages. We deplore the use of generic infoboxes that contain factual errors and ambiguities, because they have not been designed with opera articles in mind.
Do you agree with this? Is the wording OK or should it be changed in any way? Thanks --Kleinzach 14:02, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Although I'd add a final sentence to make it quite clear: Remember: factual accuracy is essential, infoboxes aren't. --Folantin 14:10, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks good to me. Mak (talk) 03:51, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yep. The original with Folantin's addition looks fine. Cheers, Moreschi  Talk 14:44, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes.  With the additional bit by Folantin.  Nice job. Antandrus  (talk) 14:47, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Policy on biography infoboxes

message: Now that this category has been zapped, can we agree a substitute (German romantic operas or Romantischen Opern - but are German-language category names permissible in en.Wikipedia?)?  I'll be happy to define it and add it to those opera articles that are entitled to it (and patrol it from time to time!) --GuillaumeTell 17:50, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think "German Romantic operas" would be fine. It is a specific category and many operas, such as mid-period Wagner, were actually called by that name by their composers. --Folantin 19:09, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. I think calling it Romantischen Opern would be in line with using French names for French genres, and perhaps be more specific (less likely to catch 20th century works), but German Romantic (big R?) operas would be OK if you both prefer that. Can I refer you both to Satirical Operas (above)? I'd be grateful for your ideas. --Kleinzach 23:33, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Big R for the artistic movement. --Folantin 08:24, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: On reflection, having it in German might be more likely to keep out interlopers. --GuillaumeTell 15:42, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Good. That was my feeling too. And it would be consistent with our idea of using original designations to keep everything crystal clear. --Kleinzach 23:04, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've now created :Category:Romantischen Opern and populated it. --GuillaumeTell 10:30, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

text: No, it should be in English, like the rest of this Wiki. Andy Mabbett 12:01, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm, then opéra comique should be "comic opera"? --Folantin 12:16, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Or maybe Orfeo ed Euridice should be anglicised, never mind the confusion that would cause. Maybe the same for L'incoronazione di Poppea? Le Devin du village? Come on. Moreschi  Talk 13:58, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Or indeed Haute couture, Bossa nova, Mahjong, Sudoku and Kindergarten. But since my joke has already been misinterpreted as advice here, I'd better remember WP:BEANS. --Folantin 16:16, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Romantic operas again 

message: In Wieland Wagner I have referenced a page  which I thought was Spanish, but I'd like to check. Peter cohen 22:55, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, it's in Spanish.  :)  Antandrus  (talk) 22:57, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, Spanish. --Kleinzach 22:59, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Crikey! That was quick. Thanks, both. Peter cohen 23:02, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anybody here able to tell the difference between Spanish and Portuguese? 

message: Is there a view on having entries for characters? With title charaqcters, you can reference the opera; with parts such as Hagen it is possible to reference the mythic or historic characters on which the part is based; but what about Eva or Elisabeth? Peter cohen 23:01, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We have quite a strong policy on not having articles on characters. In fact they have been deleted in the past. We prefer to discuss Iago, say, in the Otello article, not outside it. For the same reason we prefer not to have articles on individual arias, sections of operas etc. --Kleinzach 23:08, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  That would explain the rather eccentric list in the arias category. Peter cohen 23:18, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Opera characters 

message: I don’t quite understand why the lyrics will have to be copied to Wiki source. Does it mean all current lyrics/texts  will be transferred to Wikisource and future lyrics/text will have to be done there? How does the link works  then?  Take one example,  La Traviata article and one of the arias - Libiamo ne' lieti calici. Currently, when we hit “Libiamo ne' lieti calici” link in the main page, it will go to a new page under “Libiamo ne' lieti calici” title in Wikipedia, and if we want to write a lyric, we just need to write in a new page and then link it to the main article. Does the new policy (is it new?) means that we have to write the lyric in wikisource and then link it to wikipedia? (correct me if I’m wrong) . It is a bit hassle, isnt it? It is much easier like how it is now , this is just my opinion.- Jay 15:04, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the point of not having individual articles on arias here at Wikipedia is that it's very difficult to write good articles about them. What's there to say? Usually just where the aria takes place in the opera and the libretto. Really, articles should not be written than couldn't be improved to featured status. At least in my view. These ones usually can't be. Moreschi  Talk 15:09, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The point about Wikisource is that Wikipedia is meant to be an encyclopedia, so simply having collections of texts does not fit in well with that goal. Wikisource is meant to be a collection of free source texts. Although it makes sense to quote lines from a work when discussing it, it does not usually make sense to have the entire text as part of the discussion. Mak (talk) 15:47, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Especially when that text comprises most of the article, which is especially undesirable. Moreschi  Talk 15:58, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

text: It's also the case that an increasing number of out-of-copyright opera libretti are available on the Internet (a good source is Bob Frone's page, and links can be - and are (or if they aren't, they should be) - provided from individual operas' pages. --GuillaumeTell 17:40, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Question about Wikisource