Talk:Michael Knighton

message: I can't find any details about what Knighton has done since he left Carlisle - this needs sorting! --Robdurbar 18:03, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: It seems Michael Knighton has a website which goes into great detail about himself and his other persuits including being an artist and poet. He reportedly created a scultpture said to be worth £70 million. article I'm going to take a guess the Konghtin Pearlmich is a pseudonym for Michael Knighton. His web address is Official website. If I get the time I will attempt to add the additional information that can be verified.
I am more than happy to discuss issues editors may have with my changes, but only on the basis they cite authoritative references and use unbiased language when writing on this page. The article suffers from unverified facts and bias language.
 --Dreylax01 (talk) 12:54, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: This article has been subject to a lot of attention from sources very close to Mr Knighton, who have continually claimed that the facts contained therein are not reflective of the situation as it actually happened. However, we can only go by what is reported in the media, not what Mr Knighton's propaganda team would have us believe. I think it is a bit much to describe him as an artist and poet simply because he's drawn a few pictures, written a few lines of verse and stuck them up on his website. Very few third-party sources would describe him as an artist or poet and neither should we. Furthermore, his bid for Manchester United was actually only £20m – £10m to buy Martin Edwards' shares and a potential £10m more to buy the shares off the rest of the shareholders at the same price he had offered Edwards. The extra £10m you mentioned came in the form of proposed renovations to Old Trafford. You claim that Knighton's bid to buy the club fell through for unknown reasons, but the reasons are in fact quite well known – his financial backers pulled out, leaving him marginally short of the asking price. Your contributions to the article read like you have intimate knowledge of Knighton's business history, yet your comments here give the opposite impression. If you have any connection to Knighton, it behoves you to inform us. – PeeJay 21:24, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

text: I have no feelings one way or another towards Knighton. If you have interpreted my comments as negative towards him, then I fear you are simply seeing what you want/expect to see. You are right that repetition of a fact does not increase its veracity; however, when various respected journalists (Michael Crick, Mihir Bose, Jim White) all report it in top-selling books, then it becomes something to take notice of. There are no sources who claim that the deal fell apart for any reason other than that the money wasn't there, so I don't see any reason to beat about the bush. As for entrepreneurship, he may have acted in an entrepreneurial way in the past, but that is not what he is known for. Neither is he very well known for his art or poetry; he may have been published as a poet and had his art exhibited, but those things are not what he is primarily known for. Teddy Sheringham has taken part in a few televised poker tournaments, but I wouldn't describe him in the opening sentence of his article as "a footballer and poker player". – PeeJay 22:39, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

text: Just because one other editor approves of a change does not necessarily mean the edit is kosher. The information about Willie Layton is too specific for an article about his great-grandson. By all means, however, create the article about Willie Layton. – PeeJay 21:31, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

text: Yes, I probably would since you seem to have no idea about editorial discretion, but if the man is notable, someone should create it. As for the statement, you should know that Wikipedia is not a democracy; we don't work based on what the majority wants, we work around policies designed to help us decide what should and should not go into articles. You think being one of the 125 "greatest players" at a club like Sheffield Wednesday is interesting? I don't disagree, but I don't think it's what makes Layton notable, especially given the status of Sheffield Wednesday. – PeeJay 12:21, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

text: No, I don't think that's what makes him notable. If you asked anyone who had heard of Layton what they knew him for, they would most likely say "Oh, he was part of the Wednesday team that won the league twice in the 1900s", not "Oh, he's one of our 125 greatest players". That 125 greatest players list isn't even readily available anywhere and only appears in one obscure book. It wasn't an official club poll or anything like that, just the opinion of the author of one book. Furthermore, where is your evidence that Knighton was inspired by his ancestor? Maybe he just liked football. You don't have to have a relative who played the sport to want to do it yourself. Finally, I'm not being hostile, I'm just presenting my argument. – PeeJay 11:44, 7 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  New information needs to be added 

message: As I am eager to resolve this dispute with rational and logical conversation, I have requested  a third opinion. --Dreylax01 (talk) 13:05, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I am a regular volunteer at the Third Opinion project. The guidelines of that project say, "Before making a request here, be sure that the issue has been thoroughly discussed on the article talk page. 3O is only for assistance in resolving disagreements that have come to a standstill." The request for a Third Opinion in regard to this dispute has been removed because there has been no such talk page discussion between the editors involved in the dispute. Consider leaving a note on the other editor's user talk page asking him or her to come here to discuss the matter. Regards, TransporterMan (TALK) 13:59, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested Third opinion (3O) 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Michael Knighton. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added  tag to http://archive.thisislancashire.co.uk/1998/04/25/802667.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090828031900/http://www.angelfire.com/dc/3games/halpin.html to http://www.angelfire.com/dc/3games/halpin.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150705151936/http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/carlisle-united/latest/michael-knighton-breaks-13-year-carlisle-utd-silence-1.1220258 to http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/carlisle-united/latest/michael-knighton-breaks-13-year-carlisle-utd-silence-1.1220258
*Added  tag to http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/carlisle-united/latest/if-carlisle-united-ever-invite-me-back-i-ll-go-knighton-1.1220443
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I have requested blp editors to give this article a once over as Knighton is in the news. The Vintage Feminist (talk) 17:53, 15 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Request for eyes on from blp editors 

message: Hello fellow Wiki editors, please can you review the following edit to 'after football' section : "In 2022, Knighton exhibited two works at the Royal Academy of Arts Summer Exhibition. One of the works depicts a silhouette of a footballer and a bee.https://se.royalacademy.org.uk/2022/artworks/michael-knighton/729". Thanks in advance Rollotron (talk) 09:15, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Although the information is factual, can you please provide some third-party coverage to prove its encyclopaedic notability? – PeeJay 11:00, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: This information is of public record. Third-party coverage provided by a national newspaper can be found below. The RA is an internationally recognised charity for the arts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Academy_of_Arts. The RA summer exhibition is the world's oldest open submission exhibition, held every year since 1769 for emerging and established artists. Some of the world's best artists have exhibited in this exhibition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Academy_Summer_Exhibition. Knighton's work is listed in the 254th RA Summer Exhibition catalogue: https://www.royalacademy.org.uk/exhibition/summer-exhibition-2023. Third-party coverage can be found in an article written by Joe Bernstien for The Mail on Sunday, Aug. 2022, discussing Manchester United and the Glazers in which Knighton's inclusion in the RA Summer Exhibition is mentioned. A version of this article also appeared online https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-11130633/Michael-Knighton-says-end-near-Glazer-family.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rollotron (talk • contribs) 10:10, 1 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: No one is disputing the accuracy of the information, the issue is whether it's really appropriate to mention in an encyclopaedic article. Furthermore, the Daily Mail isn't really considered a reliable source on Wikipedia, so if you could provide a different source, that would be appreciated. – PeeJay 02:08, 2 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks PeeJay for your comments. Appreciate the Daily Mail is a deprecated source (hence used only in the chat) but the RA catalogue and links to the exhibition are not. I understand your point regarding the appropriateness of such an event. I think exhibiting artwork at a nationally recognised institution for the first time should be considered notable information for the 'After Football' section. The summer exhibition is a public event which recieves national media coverage each year, Knighton's inclusion may be of interest to someone reading about his activies after football. I noticed from reading the chat page you were against establishing an 'After football' section in the first place. Does this explain a reluctance to add anything further? We might disagree on this addition to the page and have requested a Third opinion to help us both. Rollotron (talk) 15:40, 2 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I would welcome a third opinion. You're right, personally I don't think Knighton's art career is particularly noteworthy, and that's backed up by the paucity of sources, but I'd like to see what others think. – PeeJay 21:39, 2 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Great, thanks for welcoming an 3O on this PeeJay. Btw, I'm in your camp on Knighton's art, but appreciate some people must obviously like it, including the judges at the RA (stops typing and scratches head). Rollotron (talk) 16:01, 3 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: @PeeJay@Rollotron The inclusion of the works in the Royal Academy of Arts Summer Exhibition seems relevant, but the content of the works definitely doesn't. I would keep the citation, but change the line to something like "In 2022, Knighton exhibited two mixed media works at the Royal Academy of Arts Summer Exhibition." Blueshiftofdeath (talk) 01:43, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  After football edit.