Talk:Jim Prentice

message: I just want to say that what has happened here with the re-adding of DMCA controversy, and addition of the wikipedia controversy is a shining example of why wikipedia is great. the truth shines through. Good work everyone.--Matt D (talk) 14:04, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Great work

message: From the current revision:
:Some have suspected that Prentice, along with MPs James Moore, Peter MacKay, Belinda Stronach and Chuck Strahl, was one of the five "unnamed" Conservative Party MPs that Harper rebuked in November 2004 for attempting to covertly start raising funds and support for a future CPC leadership race.
Who are "some?" Wikipedia reports political speculation of sufficiently high profile, but is not a gossip board. As tempting as that can be. See babble at Rabble, Freedominion, electionprediction or the Franksters board for that. :)
:neoconservative fiscal credentials
I'm not yet aware of his policy positions on anything besides SSM, but how appropriate is neoconservative? He made his name in the fairly fiscally neutral practice of law (or fiscally negative, if you're not a lawyer, tee hee), then he ran to succeed Joe Clark. The arguably neoconservative proposal that got the big spotlight in that leadership race was Scott Brison's, to disband ACOA and offer a lower tax rate in the Atlantic instead; he did go to Prentice, but soon enough would join the Liberals. So... what do we have showing Prentice's neoconservatism? Samaritan 22:20, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Leadership possibility section

message: Anyone have a suggested NPOV wording for his actions on the DMCA front.  I liked the quote to the extent that "he only heard of facebook yesterday" when he delayed introducing this backwards bill.
In any case, its a hot button topic, but we need a better paragraph on it and yet, I don't think I could write it due to my POV (yes, I have one too) -- Tawker (talk) 01:05, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  DMCA 

message: "P. E. James Prentice, PC, MP (born July 20, 1956, in South Porcupine, Ontario near Timmins) is a Canadian lawyer and politician. He is a traitor to the Canadian People and hopes to sell of Canada's copywrite law to struggling American conglomerates." AndrewMcinally (talk) 21:46, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: it's all true, just poorly written and incorrectly spelled. He really is an utter berk and he needs to be run out of town on a rail.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.129.102.63 (talk) 08:54, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nicely done 99.234.69.64 

message: I've removed the following meta-content from the page. Maybe some mention belongs in the article, but regurgitating a CBC news item ain't the way to do it. --Calton | Talk 23:08, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The complete story is at Government buffing Prentice's Wikipedia entry Editors of this page will want to read this article - Ahunt (talk) 23:47, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I have requested semi-protection at WP:RFPP due to this and the heavy IP vandalism resulting from it. -- Reaper  X 03:34, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Meta-content

message: I've fixed the citations and done some formatting changes to establish something of a chronological order. Hope this helps DSatYVR (talk) 03:42, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations fixed 

message: "When Canadian Heritage Minister Josee Verner and I have reached a consensus and we're satisfied, we will introduce a bill."
should read
"When (Canadian Heritage Minister Josee) Verner and I have reached a consensus and we're satisfied, we will introduce a bill."
can someone with priveleges edit that for me?Benjamander (talk) 04:05, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. -Royalguard11(T·R!) 04:18, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Shouldn't that be square brackets rather than parentheses? - 142.167.65.170 (talk) 19:24, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: tiny proofread

message: I split the copyright controversy section into the 'copyright legislation and controversy' and 'wikipedia controversy' sections.  These two issues, while moderately intwined, are not one in the same, hence two different headers.  TheIguana (talk) 04:54, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyright controversy split 

message: I've been putting some work into finding a citation for this quote, with no luck so far. I thought I'd drop in a list of what I've done so far here, in case someone else is also looking.
First, I've been through all the Hansards from October through December 2007, which is the only likely period when Prentice might have said this in Parliament. Reports of the quote on the web all point to him saying it either in November or late October, but I decided to open the window a little just in case.
In any case, the only time Prentice addressed copyright in this period was on October 23rd, 2007. The Edited Hansard (Number 006), the one for that days, has Prentice saying this during the debate on address in reply to the Speech from the Throne:
Our government is aware also of the need for copyright reform and that this is essential to ensuring Canada remains competitive. We will introduce legislation in the next few months that will provide legal measures for rights holders, clarify the rules relating to copyright as they apply to Internet service providers, address the educational and research use of copyrighted materials, and address consumer interests.
At the moment, my suspicion is that the quote being used in the Wikipedia article -- if it's referring to something he said in Parliament -- is a mangled version of the final three words in the last sentence of this.
Another major possibility is that he made this statement to the media at some point. Fortunately (in this particular case) the current government keeps very tight rein on statements by ministers to the media, so there's not much to track down. I've not managed to find anything resembling this quote. As there's no central location to mine this possibility, it's entirely possible I've missed something, but I think that the only major article from October, November, and December that I've been unable to read is hiding behind a pay wall at the Globe and Mail's site: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/Page/document/v5/content/subscribe?user_URL=http://www.theglobeandmail.com%2Fservlet%2Fstory%2FLAC.20071210.INGRAM10%2FTPStory%2FBusiness%2Fcolumnists&ord=45369234&brand=theglobeandmail&force_login=true If someone has the ability to read that, it might be worthwhile.
Having failed so far, my next project is to watch the videos taken at the impromptu quizzing of the Minister on copyright mattres during his constituency office's December open house. If someone's already gone to that trouble, I'd appreciate knowing about it so I don't have to fire up YouTube for many hours while drinking coffee spiked with Red Bull to stave off sleep. -- Paul Drye (talk) 20:27, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Put consumers first" quote 

message: I'm anonymous but not a vandal.  Could somebody please add the following to the article in the "Copyright legislation and controversy" section:
Michael Geist compiled a list of 10 questions he would like Prentice to answer about the upcoming copyright legislation.


76.10.147.117 (talk) 23:41, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: done 69.196.131.38 (talk) 07:02, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Someone removed the reference because it was self-published.  I added it back because it was a mirror of an article in The Hill Times.  I also added a list of 10 more questions Geist recently came up with. 69.196.131.38 (talk) 04:50, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Questions from Michael Geist 

message: I added some more detail to this section. Note, the draft legislation is "rumored" to be like the DMCA, it has not been tabled in the Commons yet, and until it is no one can comment definitively. Also made some minor grammatical edits. I will try to drop back in here later, got to check, I may have some more things to add. UrbanTerrorist (talk) 01:31, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: "allegedly" and "is rumored to" have no place in an encylopedia article. If they haven't been proven true, they do no belong in the biography of a living person. Should these lines be removed? GaryColemanFan (talk) 02:48, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

text: I agree with GaryColemanFan. UrbanTerrorist's language violates WP:NPOV, especially relative to previous version. (The more true and damaging an accusation is, the more objective it has to be to be credible.) Avt tor (talk) 03:05, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The problem has to do with the Canadian Political system. Generally it will be known that a bill addressing an issue is being worked on, however the contents of the bill are not known until it is placed before the House of Commons. So we know that a bill will be introduced, but outside of the people at Industry Canada who had a hand in drafting it, no one knows what the bill will contain. The word "rumor" is probably not the correct word to use in the situation, but the original entry was written as if certain provisions (for example the Canadian equivalent to the American DMCA) are known to be in the bill, and this is not the case as yet (though based on the fact that we know Prentice has been meeting with the RIAA and the MPAA, and he has avoided meeting with groups with opposing opinions, this is likely). Feel free to re-word that section in a more acceptable manner, and I'll drop in again tomorrow, it's time for me to walk my dog, and go to bed. UrbanTerrorist (talk) 04:08, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: We know he was going to table the bill last December but didn't (CBC reported on it), and he said he was going to table one before summer (he said at least). -Royalguard11(T·R!) 19:03, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Well it's been tabled now. UrbanTerrorist (talk) 00:29, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Controversy Section Update 

message: I'm not sure if this fits within the bounds of WP as both these links go to organizations that argue the other side of the debate, so I've linked them up. I'm seeking comments from others on this. If they don't meet WP guidelines feel free to re-edit DSatYVR (talk) 03:13, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I removed the external links to these two sites that were in the article, external links would be better placed on their respective wikipedia pages when they get created. TheIguana (talk) 03:47, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Links added for "Canadian Software Innovation Alliance" and "Excess Copyright Blog" 

message: 4 out of 24 citations are to Geist's blog. I now invite Brimba to specify exactly which sentences require citations such that the  tag can be removed. --Tagishsimon (talk) 18:15, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I have started working through the sources. Under the section “Net neutrality” we state “refusing to answer questions about the government's position on throttling practices by national ISPs.”, while the source says “refused to be drawn into the simmering net neutrality debate”. Brimba (talk) 19:27, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Citations

message: It looks like there is more than one Canadian Government agency or Conservative MP who is using Wikipedia to scrub articles. The IP address(s) in question is 192.197.82.153 Dean Del Mastro and 192.197.82.155 Pierre Poilievre 
DSatYVR (talk) 16:37, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Conservative MPs Dean Del Mastro and Pierre Poilievre have edits originating from the the Canadian House of Commons 

message: Today, Jim Prentice announced a bill, Bill C-61. Below is a copy of the e-mail sent out to many people.
"The Government of Canada has introduced Bill C-61, An Act to Amend the Copyright Act. The proposed legislation is a made-in-Canada approach that balances the needs of Canadian consumers and copyright owners, promoting culture, innovation and competition in the digital age.
What does Bill C-61 mean to Canadians?
Specifically, it includes measures that would:
expressly allow you to record TV shows for later viewing; copy legally purchased music onto other devices, such as MP3 players or cell phones; make back-up copies of legally purchased books, newspapers, videocassettes and photographs onto devices you own; and limit the "statutory damages" a court could award for all private use copyright infringements;
implement new rights and protections for copyright holders, tailored to the Internet, to encourage participation in the online economy, as well as stronger legal remedies to address Internet piracy;
clarify the roles and responsibilities of Internet Service Providers related to the copyright content flowing over their network facilities; and
provide photographers with the same rights as other creators.
What Bill C-61 does not do:
it would not empower border agents to seize your iPod or laptop at border crossings, contrary to recent public speculation
What this Bill is not:
it is not a mirror image of U.S. copyright laws. Our Bill is made-in-Canada with different exceptions for educators, consumers and others and brings us into line with more than 60 countries including Japan, France, Germany and Australia
Bill C-61 was introduced in the Commons on June 12, 2008 by Industry Minister Jim Prentice and Heritage Minister Josée Verner.
For more information, please visit the Copyright Reform Process website at www.ic.gc.ca/epic/site/crp-prda.nsf/en/home
Thank you for sharing your views on this important matter.
The Honourable Jim Prentice, P.C., Q.C., M.P.
Minister of Industry
The Honourable Josée Verner, P.C., M.P.
Minister of Canadian Heritage, Status of Women 
and Official Languages and Minister for 
La Francophonie 
"
I believe that since this is a VERY HOT TOPIC, many people may want to vandalize Mr. Prentice's page and write biased information about him.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by PC helper online (talk • contribs) 20:24, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Vandalism will be reverted but I'm not protecting the page.  It wasn't too bad after Industry Canada was caught claiming that the bill doesn't exist and I don't think it will be too bad now.  I'll fork an article for this bill because I think it's notable upon it's own strengths now. -- 21:27, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: C-61 is up for editing, feel free to join in -- Tawker (talk) 21:30, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: May I also point out that WP:PROTECT states "Semi-protection should not be used as a pre-emptive measure against vandalism that has not yet occurred". -- Reaper  X 22:31, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. There has been no vandalism so far, if there is, then we protect it. Otherwise, let Wikipedia function as it is supposed to do, even if we don't always agree with the edits. It's part of the process that makes Wikipedia so strong. UrbanTerrorist (talk) 00:35, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You jinxed it Terrorist. 3 instances of anon vandalism. If it persists, take it to WP:RFPP. -- Reaper  X 04:13, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You are kidding right? 3 cases doesn't even register. Got to wait a little while past that before even asking. -Royalguard11(T·R!) 05:17, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You know it always rains after I wash my car... I read all the vandal edits, and all I can say is we get a really low class of vandal around here. UrbanTerrorist (talk) 05:31, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lock This Page before damage is done 

message: Don't know if it is relevant to the biography page or not....I know its relevant to the bill, but I don't think there should be any further expansion of the controversy part on details more related to the bill than Jim Prentice, since Bill 61 already is about that....we don't need the same info in two places.....the one here should be more related to the person. Noian (talk) 16:14, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: People can join Facebook groups to express their opposition to the cause or idea that the Facebook group supports, so citing membership numbers is misleading. In fact, the *only* way to express opposition to a Facebook group (on Facebook, on that group's page), is to join it. So the number is a little meaningless. Further - is there a single study or shred of evidence that Facebook groups in general, or this one in particular, has any impact on policy or decision making? Or do they just put cute icons on people's home pages?198.161.2.211 (talk) 22:16, 22 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I believe that both Noian and 198.161.2.211 have made good observations. This Facebook group is, for technological reasons, reduced to 536 members (https://www.facebook.com/FairCopyrightCanada/posts/204499936315952?stream_ref=10). But even if it was 80000, there would have to be a reliable source that says the number mattered and was specifically relevant to Prentice.  Peter Gulutzan (talk) 14:24, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Seeing nobody jumped in to defend it or fix it, I have removed the talk about a Facebook group. Peter Gulutzan (talk) 14:09, 27 May 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Facebook group 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello all, I've recently done a bit of re-writing on this page to bring it up to the standard of other First Ministers across the country. I've also added some other sources, and removed some of the more contentious and unreferenced claims. I'd like to think that the unreferenced tags can be removed now, but I'd prefer to have a second (or third+) set of eyes look over it first. Thanks, Ajraddatz (Talk) 08:55, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rewrite and adding references 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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