Talk:Messianic Judaism/Archive 7

message: This article should include a section on Jews that followed messiahs other than Jesus like Sabbatai Zevi or Menachem Mendel Schneerson. Would those still be considered  Messianic Jews or not? PiMaster3 15:08, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No. They don't self-define as Messianic Jews. And self-defined Messianic Jews are unrelated to these other groups. The term Messianic Judaism has a very specific application to an emerging NRM. It has a recognized scholarly definition, and people outside the movement who have no desire to affiliate with it should not be miscategorized within it. --AuntieMormom 23:35, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well stated.  Messianic Jews are specifically those of Jewish ethnicity who have come to a "completion of faith" by receiving the Jewish Messiah, Yeshua/Jesus.  Messianic congregations usually also include Messianic Goyim/Gentiles, but the object of their worship is the same: Yeshua haMashiach.  Shalom u brachot!  -SHLAMA 00:35, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Non-christian Messianic Jews 

message: Have we come to any conclusion on what this article should display? I am tired of the lock on the article and I am wanting to continue further -- but nothing is moving. 
The article has been locked since 6/05. Today is 6/30. 
When will it be removed?
Rivka 16:48, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Conclusion 

message: The new and consensus version has been posted. Obviously, it's not polished as well as we'd all like, however, I do believe we can make an effort as a group to import information from the old article into the new article and its appropriate section. I am fully aware the version I have posted will be mercilessly edited, but that's the nature of wiki. I have posted it because I believe it was a consensus move by the majority of those who contribue to the article, and I fully believe allowing all sides a section of their own to post information and rebuttals will help alleviate some of the disagreements on what should and should not be in the article. If over time it helps the development of a future Messianic Judaism portal, so be it. I'm just doing my part by expanding the info as is, to match other articles like Islam, Judaism, and Christianity. It's about time we start getting serious about making this a featured article page. Please make all changes to the current article, and please help cite sources for information that has been posted. Let's finally get this article moving in a positive and consensus-driven direction. inigmatus 21:35, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The New Version 

message: I was going to begin this like "Messianic believers define sin as transgression of the Law of God (1 John 3:4-5)".  Is there any reason that statement does not work? (I am very new to actually editing things on Wikipedia, and am open to all answers). Thanks -- Rivka 22:32, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sin, Atonement, Faith & Works Section 

message: The section on modern history which carried a dubious tag, was unsoursed and obviously innacurate.  I replaced it with a section from a previous version which was documented with relaible sources, and though by no means comprehensive, is a good starting point. I can't see any resonable objections to it but please speak up if there is any objective problems with it ( other than claiming the sources are unreiable, because they don't support your viewpoint). 
Also this section clearly need expanding, as messianc judaism has continued to evlove since the 70's, and has become more torah observant, and more distant from hebrew christianity.  There also seems to be a Ango/American focus with no mention of the movements in Israel, eastrn europe, and the rest of the world. 69.181.209.11 07:10, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  History 

message: The newly added portion seems to me to be POV. Unless the anonymous poster has a source, perhaps it should be reworded(or deleted)? Rivka 13:37, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Messianic Gentiles 

message: Since this is a disputed article I don't want to start hacking away at it.
First, in the "Identity" section there's a link to a non-existant Jewish objections to Messianic Judaism article. I don't think there needs to be an entire article on that subject. I think the Jewish Objections section works just fine. So how about deleting "or see also Jewish objections to Messianic Judaism."
Second, under section 4. "Torah" I don't think the terms "Majority view" or "Minority view" are correct. Law vs Grace may be the majority view for Hebrew Christians, but Grace and Law seems to be the majority view for people who identify themselves as Messianic Jews. Onethang 16:08, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: One vote in support of these edits  12.218.150.29 04:57, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Proposed Edits