Talk:Richard Boyle, 1st Earl of Cork

message: is there any rumour of relatedness to shakespeare?213.106.120.242 (talk) 10:42, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Lookalike

message: Firstly, it's obviously very pro-Boyle and therefore not NPOV.
Secondly, *most* of it doesn't even make any sense whatsoever - 
e.g. the second sentence of the first paragraph - this is utter gibberish; the reference to the "strategic use" of marriage with 
a link to the Queen Mother's ancestry - this is a non-sequitur...
I mean, what? The Earl "strategically" planned that 400 years into
the future one of his descendants would marry a future king in
purely in order secure his "immortality". Riiiiight. 195.194.199.50 15:45, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Historical Context Section is Nonsense 

message: The following changes were made to address confusion and POV/NPOV
Split up and simplified first paragraph of historical context and added at the end of what is now the second paragraph:
"rather than offering an objective appreciation of him as a historical phenomenon."
Qualified the claim concerning "marriage into the  Royal line":
"achievement" (as one who aimed at "rising to power by successfullly permeating  the aristocratic hierarchy" would inevitably see it).
Added the following at the bottom of historical context:
"If one wishes to understand the forces which have mostly "airbrushed" (or more accurately,"failed to paint a comprehensive or comprehensible  picture of) the Earl from the cannon of historical literature, one needs to recognise a number of understandable causes resentment towards him."
"His shameless pursuit and acquisition of wealth, power, social elevation and titles, was a practice which, whilst by no means foreign to the aristocracy of the time, was most abhorred by rich and poor alike when it was conducted with success by an upstart, someone without the historical bloodline which was seen at the time as the legitimate basis for power."
"Oliver Cromwell was another relevant contemporary example of how the power of historically descended aristocracy was beginning to change (i.e., lose its exclusive grip on power, although in different ways,  Cromwell was a general and Boyle was a businessman) in Boyle's lifetime, although Cromwell's elevation to the very top of the political hierarchy ensured that literature was 'kinder' to Cromwell than it was to Boyle, at least in terms of "depth of coverage"."
"The fact that Boyle was to so many an outsider in the territory he sought to control was itself further reinforcement for such resentments."
"It would not be unrealistic to view Boyle being characterised historically as an "unspeakably notorious rogue", mostly on account of his financial success and the succession of "suspiciously good outcomes" which seem to accompany all but the very last of the challenges presented by his many adversaries."
"Nonetheless, in the context of the cirumstances in which he found himself, his opportunistic successes do draw admiration in some quarters."
::Why has no-one signed the comments above? I am of the opinion that the personal opinions (do we know whose they are?) in the article have no place in an encyclopaedia. Such views may well surface during a class at university but they would not appear in, say, Britannica without serious back-up. The fact remains that Boyle's century was one of corruption throughout the British Isles and the majority of extant Scottish peerages date from the 17th century. To suggest he was somehow poor and a "rags to riches" story is hardly accurate as his family were landed and had sufficient funds to send him to an excellent private school, and he was later training for the law, something which then required money and influence. Most of Ireland was terribly poor at the time and you would not need to have much money to be regarded as 'comfortable' as a stepping stone to better things. As for marrying well, this is hardly unique to him! My suggestion is that envy is apparent in every century towards those who have done well for themselves. In the 19th and 20th centuries it was represented by the socialists. I'd get rid of all the pathetic waffle and just leave in the facts. David Lauder 17:55, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Should this page be titled "Richard Boyle", and just link the the Earl of Cork page? Xx78900 (talk) 18:09, 3 November 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move page