Talk:Missouri/Archive 1

message: I've lived in Missouri all my 34 years, and I'm a big fan of canoeing, but I've never heard that the name means "canoe". Anyone have a reference for that?
This is what the World Almanac and Book of Facts relates, and its what the official Missouri Tourism website relates, however it's not certain.  The state was named for the river, which was named for the tribe, which received its name from the Algonquin Indians.  Supposedly, "Missouri" means "people of the big canoes", not just "canoe".  HOWEVER, I always heard, and found in other sources, that "Missouri" means "muddy waters" and came from another Indian group.  Missouri Tourism says there is a mixup with what the name the Missouri Indians called the river means "muddy waters", but I'm not convinced.  Like you, I've lived in Missouri all my life; but I've heard both, and that the exact origin was uncertain.  Personally, I think the origin of "canoe" should be removed, at least for the time being. Rt66lt 03:05, September 4, 2005 (UTC)
: According to "Names on the Land" (Stewart), a standard of placename origins, the Missouri River acquired its name in the aftermath of Jolliet and Marquette's 1673 voyage from Green Bay to Arkansas, down the Mississippi.  He writes, "...they came in a few days to a wide river pouring in from the northwest, very muddy and swift.  From some Indians they learned its name as Pekitanoui, or "muddy".  On their maps, Jolliet and Marquette put down the name of various tribes living along its course, as they must have learned them from Indians near the mouth.  Among these tribes were the Ouchage and the Messouri.  Afterwards the French called that river by the name of the first of these tribes, changing it to Osage.  But finally that became the name of a smaller river, and the greater one became Missouri.  As to its meaning, "miss" may mean "big".  But whether the whole name means "big muddy", or "big canoes" or something else, is a matter of doubt."  Elsewhere he points out that the names given to Indian tribes by other Indians were often of ancient origin and uncertain meaning even to the Indians.  It could be that the Indians who told the French about the Messouri tribe did not know the term meant anything other than the name of a tribe. Pfly 06:32, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  State name 

message: I've recently changed Template:US state to make the table more compact and have converted all state articles except Missouri's to use the template.  Including the English measurements in addition to metric makes the table entries look awkward in the current version of the template.  Kansas is the only other state article that includes English measurements.  Anyone care if I convert Missouri to use the template and delete the English measurements?  An alterative might be to create a different version of the template that accommodates both English and metric (which I'd be willing to do if anyone strongly cares about preserving the English measurements). -- Rick Block 15:52, 10 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: The US still uses the English system, most of our data sources on US topics use the English system as a result, and many US readers think in terms of the English system.  AFAIC, as long as this is the case, we should have both systems referenced in our articles and templates. - jredmond 17:10, 10 Dec 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  convert to use [[template:US state]] and drop English measurements? 

message: I have removed this from the article because it does not fulfill the requirement of use "for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research" as required by American law. If you intend to discuss the tourism industry in Missouri or otherwise discuss something with specific reference to the postage stamp, please add the image back in. Johnleemk | Talk 17:05, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Image:Wiki missouri.jpg]] 

message: I don't know how to edit or add disambiguation pages, but might I suggest that a link to the Wikipedia article on the American battleship "USS Missouri" be added to the Missouri page? [unknown user]
Good idea, I second that motion. Joncnunn 21:36, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Battleship 

message: Perhaps there should be a state holiday section, since Missouri has a few holidays not on the US Federal List, including Truman Day. This is the state employee list.
* New Years Day
* MLK Day
* Lincoln's Birthday
* Washington's Birthday aka President's Day
* Truman Day (Monday, May 8th in 2006)
* Memorial Day
* Independence Day (aka 4th of July)
* Labor Day
* Columbus Day
* Vetrans Day
* Thanksgiving Day
* In 2005, day after Thankgiving by Governor's Degree; so far no word on 2006
* Christmas Day
Joncnunn 16:04, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: State Holidays

message: I must say, we are taking some liberties with what we're listing as "important cities." I'm sorry, but Eldon and Lebanon do not qualify. Ste. Genevieve is a stretch, and Osage Beach is just a resort town on the lake. Aluminum boats, the Miller County derby? I'm born and raised in Missouri and none of that means anything to me. We can't put every county seat on there; after all, we have the most counties of any state!
: I agree, Eldon and Lebanon aren't "important" enough to make the list.  If Osage Beach is on the list (and possibly if it isn't), Branson should be.  It's far more important a tourist town. Kamoranakrre T. Eyaelitenan 03:20, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I could go with Lebanon as a manufacturing center but won't push it.  "Notable" might be a more fitting section heading than "important".  BTW, four other states have more counties than Missouri.  (We Wikipedians are supposed to be sticklers for the facts.)   --Kbh3rdtalk 14:06, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I agree, rename this section in a more netural term such as "notable cities" or "cites of interest". (Everyone's home town is important to them). And definately add Branson.  We actually could list every county seat, but then the images with their locations would have to be removed. Jon 19:13, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Important cities is a embarrasing meaningless category that invites all sorts of trouble.  It's so overdone with the graphics as to overpower and trivialize the whole article.  Follow the model Illinois.  Have a brief paragraph  on the biggest cities and send folks on their merry way to List of cities in Missouri and List of towns and villages in Missouri. You could also add List of metropolitan areas in Missouri.  This subheading really does have to be drastically reduced or nuked altogether!   Americasroof 02:01, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Important Cities

message: "Missouri has a very notable urban-rural split, as Democrat John Kerry only won four of the state's 115 counties—St Louis City, St Louis County, Ste Genevieve, and Jackson County." In the 2004 cycle, (and for 2000 and to a somewhat lessor extent in 1996) having a notable urban-rural split was the norm in US states, so I'm not sure that it's important enough to list here. It's actually more interesting in 2004 that many rural New England counties were blue and a few big cities in the great plains were red. Jon 19:21, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Questional importance

message: While it was an anon IP edit, I thought I would address the issue.  There is currently no "official" language in Missouri.  The closest thing you have is a statute "recognizing" English as the "common language" of the State, but that's really just a policy statement and nothing more.  M.S. 1.028. Peyna 01:07, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Official language 

message: I don't think it is necessary to have a census column from 1990 adjoining the 2000 one.  As you can see from the data, the numbers really didn't change that much between the two years. Funnyhat 22:55, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done.  How does it look? Peyna 23:50, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  1990 Census Data 

message: I think some of these are really questionable. Granted, I am from St. Louis originally, but I really don't see Lebanon as major city for the state; the justification for this one even seems iffy. Other opinions on this?
Another odd inclusion here is Eldon; I do not think that this is an very important city in terms of the state, no offense going to the fine citizens of Eldon. However, I've been to Eldon a few times, and I still do not know what the Miller County Derby is. I have a hard time imagining many people from outside the state giving this much consideration, but I could be wrong. The fact that it is larger than Osage Beach isn't really that important either.
Again, I'm not trying to start a war about which cities are important or not; all of our cities are important ones. As such I think this section such maybe be renamed "Major cities." "Important cities" is in a loaded phrase, begging to have people roused about how important their own community is.
Comments please. --Doyel 14:59, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Major Cities 

message: The Missouri Bellweather is the single most interesting facet of contemporary Missouri politics.  To pick most of the elections in 100 years might be conicidence.  But to pick every one except one is something quite unique.  To reduce this to just the results of the last election is a shame.  Do a googe on "Missouri Bellweather"
http://www.google.com/search?q=MISSOURI+BELLWETHER
Americasroof 02:30, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Unless you can provide some references giving us something more than a mere correlation, it doesn't belong in the article.  Additionally, a "bellwether" is an indicator of something or a leader in a particular area.  Missouri's choice of politics does not influence the rest of the country, and aside from voting for whoever won the presidency in 24 out of the last 25 elections doesn't mean much either.  Especially when you consider the drastic changes in the makeup of the country and its citizens throughout that time.  I would argue it doesn't even qualify as a bellwether.  Peyna 02:43, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Do the google
http://www.google.com/search?q=MISSOURI+BELLWETHER
Americasroof 02:53, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What's your point?  I see a bunch of articles written by politicans in Missouri puffing up its importance and I see another bunch of articles that do nothing more that state the same correlation you have.  If you can provide some evidence that Missouri actually plays a leading role in the direction that politics in the country take OR it is an indicator of the political climate of the country, which doesn't seem the case, arguably a state like Ohio is doing a better job of that since it has been so close in elections lately and so hotly contested, much like a snapshot of the rest of the country.  Peyna 12:20, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Missouri Bellweather

message: The whole point of an encyclopedia article is to point out things that are unique. There have been numerous articles and broadcast stories about I-70 and I-44 being the first as the system celebrates its 50th year.  Peyna has been vetoing my edits on interstates and bellweather and the justifications have always been POV.  I on the other hand have cited sources (a big Wikipedia plus).  Here's a source for the Missouri first interstates. .  I'm really not up to continue fighting over this article.  It's a shame because there's a lot of cool unique things about Missouri that make interesting reading.  Americasroof 03:14, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The Missouri thing re: interstates is interesting, but if you're going to include it, it should be qualified to state that other states make the exact same claim and give the different claims.  Since this is already done at the article Interstate Highway System, do we need to repeat the information?  But, just providing "Missouri claims to have built the first Interstate" is POV.  Feel free to write an NPOV version. Peyna 12:23, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: First Interstates