Talk:Education in the Soviet Union

message: The current link for the first source is broken: http://www.aiaa.org/content.cfm?pageid=406&gTable=mtgpaper&gID=55751  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.235.251.198 (talk) 10:28, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: [[:Template:Education infobox]]

message: I hope somebody expert in this subject will take on the situation in the experimental "cultural revolutionary" stage of Soviet education in the 1920's -- before the authorities decided that teachers were to run the classrooms, not the students (I think there was even a Politburo decree to this effect); before it was decided that classes, textbooks, and discipline were essential to the education of children; and before there was a prescribed curriculum with specific hours and "lessons" as the units of instructioin.  The early period was wonderful, and it was also "Soviet," but that was before the centralized institutional structure took over in ca. 1930.  There's some information on this in Sheila Fitzpatrick's "Cultural Revolution" book, and I hope someone will write something here on the utopian phase of Soviet education in 1920's.--Mack2 00:20, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Related to this, it would be helpful to have a section devoted to Soviet pedagogics. At this time the article speaks mainly of the institutional structure but hardly at all about the content of curricula, methods of teaching and learning, and so forth.  I can't do such a section but I hope somebody else can take it on. Vygotsky's (Выготский) psychology is also some to be mentioned in that section.--Mack2 20:22, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: The Early Period

message: In my opinion, one of the most important achievements of the Soviet educational system was that it managed at various times to offer schooling in 100 different languages.  A small section of this article needs to describe the setting up of the "national schools."  This was the only way that the country as a whole was able to achieve the high levels of literacy that it obtained, and also to reach the situation of 100% matriculation in the primary schools by the early 1960's even in some of the most remote or "backward" regions of the country.--Mack2 00:20, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've now added a paragraph on this issue. It could be made into a larger section with more details but I think this paragraph captures the essence of the policy and its implications.--Mack2 16:51, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Language Issues and Special Schools

message: I think a chart might be helpful to illustrate the routes to higher education.  In the meantime, I have clarified that graduation from a PTU was an academic end -- not a route to either completed secondary education or to higher education.  Graduates of PTU's were not eligible to enter a VUZ, unless somehow they went on to another secondary school to complete their diploma.  Only the graduates of (general) secondary schools or specialized secondary schools (or tekhnikumy) were eligible for entry to a VUZ.  (I also added the acronym VUZ to the brief summary in the text because it was widely used both colloquially and in "formal" writing about education as a short-hand way to refer to higher educational institutions.)--Mack2 15:05, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Proposed rewording.  I would like to change the translation of srednyi from "middle" to secondary, which is a more conventional translation; and similarly of vyssheye from "highest" to higher which is also a more conventional translation. It's consistent with the Russian use (and translation) of primary (nachal'noye), secondary (sredneye), and higher (vyssheye) obrazovaniye. This approach also avoids some awkward expressions in English and should cause no problems that I can envision. Without any objection here, I'll make those changes in a day or two.  Thank you.--Mack2 23:41, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Route to a VUZ

message: This article could use a small section on how extrance to VUZy was determined. By examination (what kind? Specific to each school, do you have to travel to the vuz to take the exam, when?), did applicants make multiple applications in a given year, what determined success especially in admission to most prestigious institutes or universities? I know many students might wait year after year to reapply for the most prestigious schools.  How did this work?  Here is one subtopic in which those with experience within the system can be especially helpful.  Thank you.--Mack2 01:38, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Entrance, admission to VUZ?

message: First, Soviet university article looks like WP:OR to me - no sources cited and I personally never heard of this term. As apart from that the article is written only from accusing perspective, containing heavy POV as a consequence, it corresponds to and largely duplicates Suppressed research in the Soviet Union - I'd recommend to merge it with that page, when at least some references are presented in Soviet university article. Cmapm 21:09, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with Cmapm. "Soviet University" in an abomination as an article.  I also agree that the term "Soviet University" is made up. In all my work/travels in the region, I never heard such a term. I think that article should be deleted totally as a separate item. (Some of the material in it may be of some use.)--Mack2 04:15, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Object to the merge

message: It seems to be articles on this topic is gradually changing and latest article failing to see the "Universally accepted truth", which is "The Soviet Union gained genuine progress in education compared to pre revolusion Russian empire". I can remember the article written under this title last year.I saw that one as much nutral and closer to the truth than this one.
Present article expresses a poor concern on genuine progress in education in soviet period.
Even this article says in tsarist Russia.. The literacy was only 27% and in 1970s it was 99%.But fails to see it as an improvement in soviet period.
And nothing written about how second world war affected to the education in soviet union. After second world war, the country had to rebuild the destructed education infrastructure. 
Indeed, censorships and state propaganda was existed in Stalin's period and his successors as well. It is true Stalin ordered execution of brilliant intellectuals who had opposed to his repressive activities. But unfortunately, Exposing only that part doesn't give a genuine knowledge to a reader.
This article doesn't give an overall picture.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.43.194.16 (talk) 11:42, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Need to compare with the education system existed in tsarist Russia.

message: This is an article about education in the USSR;  not about political ideology or indoctrination. The sections on "Komsomol" and "Pioneers" have no place in the article as these organisations form no part of the Soviet education program but are part of the Soviet political system! A person could, for example, be  a member in either organisation irrespective of his or her level of education. It's  the same reason why we do not have a section on "Boy Scouts" in the article "Education in the United States". -The Gnome (talk) 19:11, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: "Komsomol" and "Pioneers" are irrelevant to the article

message: I am very sorry, but it is really a ridiculous article with a clumsy choice of proving sources. Stalin died about 70 years ago, the USSR fell into oblivion in 1991, but this article is written as if the author and his/her sources remained in the years of Stalin period. I am not going to enter in any discussions here, I just state that please forget Stalin-style patterns of thinking and social life perception, and develop yourself for you may not spoil our dear Wikipedia, -- Zara-arush (talk) 17:47, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lack of sources 

message: I removed "Some of the heroes that existed were Pavlik Morozov, Malchish Kilbalchish, and Timur of Timur and His Squad (Pavlik Morozov was the only real one, both Malchish and Timur are fictional)." Heroes to whom? What did they do? Did they exist? Were they fictional? Is there a dispute about whatever this is? What does any of it have to do with the article? There is no source and it seems to contradict itself. Maybe someone can fix it and re-add if appropriate. 69.118.117.177 (talk) 15:32, 14 March 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Heroes? 

message: I am not a wikipedia person, but some people who are need to read this and realize that this article is *frighteningly* unencyclopedic, and needs to be given serious attention -- and possibly wrested from the hands of whomever currently has a hold on it. 23:04, 25 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article is beyond ridiculous. 

message: I tried to find published versions of the following references but failed, so I have removed them.
* Alexis Peri, “Destalinization and the Thaw,” Slide 17.
* Ibid., Slide 17.
* Alexis Peri, “Perestroika and It’s Children,” (Lecture Slides, Middlebury College, Middlebury, VT, April 29, 2014) Slide 10.
* Alexis Peri, “Destalinization and the Thaw,” (Lecture Slides, Middlebury College, Middlebury, VT, April 10, 2014) Slides 7, 10.
* Tatiana Smorodinska (Associate Professor of Russian), interview by the members of the class Born Under a Red Star: Children of Russia’s Revolution at Home, at School, and at Play, Middlebury College, May 1, 2014.
* Nina Wieda (Assistant Professor of Russian), interview by the members of the class Born Under a Red Star: Children of Russia’s Revolution at Home, at School, and at Play, Middlebury College, May 6, 2014.
Leschnei (talk) 18:26, 3 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  References