Talk:Ancients (Eternal Darkness)

message: I'll just deal with these paragraph by paragraph... I appreciate that you're trying to improve the article, we all are. Just make sure your corrections are accurate, and that the result is prose as good as or better than the previous version. There's no need to remove adjectives, either, unless you think they're POV.
You changedThey are apparently members of a species that existed before other life emerged from the primordial ooze. The relentless movement of ice and the continental drift and other "inscrutable" reasons bound the Ancients deep beneath the planet's surface, biding their time, waiting until the moment was right to return. The protagonists, particularly Alexandra Roivas, must stop their machinations and prevent the enslavement and destruction of humanity. The four surviving Ancients appearing in the game are:
toA mysterious and great calamity trapped Chattur'gha, Ulyaoth and Xel'lotath deep beneath the Earth's surface and under the heavy foot of Mantorok. The protagonists in the game must stop their plans of returning to the surface of Earth and and prevent the enslavement and destruction of humanity. The four Ancients appearing in the game are:. I don't think the game or manual says anything about a calamity... or Mantorok's foot. Can you cite this??
[Chattur'gha] resembles a huge snake-like creature with a triple jaw and lobster-like claws, and his Essense is the Claw of Chattur'gha, a red-clawed worm with an ara of violence surrounding it.toHe is a red being with lobster-like claws, and his essence is the Claw of Chattur'gha—a red claw that contains his strength.The "red-clawed worm" description is adapted from the game's description of the essence when Pious finds it, and the aura of violence from the game's statement that "The Claw of Chattur'gha [...] seethes with unrestrained violence." As for snake-like, I didn't know how to describe him. His segments make him look a bit like an Onix to me, but that doesn't seem appropriate for the tone of this article. And he has a hideous and unsettling triple-jawed mouth, you can clearly see this when you look at him, I'm not sure why you removed it. As for capitalization, the game uses capitals when referring to the Essences, so I think we should too. I did mistype it, though.
During his control of Pious Augustus he displays gullibility, as he relies on Pious's word, and puts his faith in an prophetic vision where he destroys Xel'lotath (though Ulyaoth and Xel'lotath also make mistakes similar to the latter, perhaps seeing visions of alternate timelines where they were summoned by Alex).toDuring his control of Pious Augustus he displays gullibility, as he relies on Pious's word, and puts his faith in a vague and prophetic vision where he destroys Xel'lotath (though Ulyaoth and Xel'lotath also make similar mistakes).Not a bad change, I'll leave it, I just wonder how to convey the removed information. Each Ancient sees flashes of the battle that occurs in a different timeline. Also, the current phrasing makes it sound like the others also put too much faith in Pious, but this is not the case, Xel'lotath even questions his loyalty.
the Veil of Ulyaoth, a dome with sharp arms or talons curving downwards.tothe Veil of Ulyaoth, a dome with sharp arms or tentacles curving downward.They really don't look like tentacles, they're more like talons or claws( but I didn't want to say claws because of Chattur'gha). Frankly, the whole thing looks like a Metroid to me, but that's also not in keeping with the tone.
The very sight of [Xel'lotath] is maddening; she is a strange, pinkish being with four arms surrounding a single great eye, and a wormlike tail trailing behind her; and her Essence is the Sigil of Xel'lotath, an impossile artifact resembling a warped angel.toShe is a strange being with four arms surrounding a single eye, and a snakelike body. Her Essence is the Sigil of Xel'lotath.
I'm not sure I understand the impetus behind any of these changes. Like her creatures, Xel'lotath's body seems to make no anatomical sense. Her trunk, in which her arms are rooted, is not snakelike at all, the eye is indeed "great"( in the sense of "large") and the tail is more remniscent of a fluke( flatworm) than a serpent. The warped angel thing is, again, adapted from in-game text, and I don't see how the inclusion of the description hurts the article in any way.
Mantorok, God of Order and Chaos, also known as the Corpse God, is the creator of the Tome of Eternal Darkness in the video game Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem. Although it appears in the game to be in a position of inferiority, it is in actuality the ultimate Ancient. It created the equilibrium between the other three Ancients, making sure that they would fight and destroy each othertoMantorok, God of Order and Chaos, also known as the Corpse God, is the creator of the Tome of Eternal Darkness. Although it appears in the game to be in a position of inferiority, it is in actuality the ultimate Ancient. It created the equilibrium between the other three Ancients, ensuring that they would fight and destroy each otherGood changes.
The heart never stopped beating, even throughout the many centuries of the Corpse God being bound, during which time it has apparently lain dying.toThe heart never stopped beating, even throughout the many centuries of the Corpse God being bound, during which time it has apparently laid dying.You're confusing lay(/lays/laying/laid/has laid) with lie(/lies/lying/lay/has lain).
-- WikidSmaht (talk) 21:33, 10 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  "corrections" 

message: Just an addition I wanted to propose, regarding the Ancients' "conflict" scenes at the end of the game. I think these scenes are worth exploring, as they reveal a little more of each of the Ancients' traits and personalities. Includes SPOILERS, of course. (This is my first attempt at editing Wikipedia, so I thought I would post in talk before messing with the actual page.)
Chattur'gha: Overview
His first "weapon" in combat is his red energy ray, which he projects from his open claw. Chattur'gha's energy ray can burn the enemy, or it can act as a kind of "tractor-beam." He tried to use the first kind of ray against Ulyaoth (only to have its power turned back against him instead). He used the ray's second function to pull Xel'lotath within range of his claws.
His claws themselves are Chattur'gha's other main weapon. He is, in fact, the only one of the Ancients to make use of purely physical attacks.
Chattur'gha: Combat against Xel'lotath
Chattur'gha relies on his brute force to win this fight. He displays very little strategy, aside from in the first round, where he allows Xel'lotath to draw close before smacking her with his claw. When his enemy appears to split into three, Chattur'gha's solution is simply to whack them all at once (after pausing for a moment as if he really had to think about it).
The battle ends because Xel'lotath is stunned from the blow, and therefore unable to dodge Chattur'gha's "tractor-beam." Once he has her in his claw, his sheer brawn is too much for her, and Xel'lotath is torn apart.
Chattur'gha: Combat against Ulyaoth
Chattur'gha's limitations become more obvious in his losing fight. It seems that he only has the two methods of attack. He IS smart enough to give up on his energy ray when he discovers that Ulyaoth can suck it up into a portal and fire it right back at him. But the only other thing Chattur'gha can think to do is try to attack Ulyaoth with his claws.
Once Ulyaoth destroys his first claw, Chattur'gha never even manages a third attack. And after his other claw is gone, he actually tries to run away, making him the only Ancient who tries to flee from his destroyer. It could be said that this is cowardice on Chattur'gha's part. (Couldn't he have tried to slither up and bite Ulyaoth with that big mouth of his?) Then again, it might be that without his claws Chattur'gha had no choice but to flee, as he was both literally and figuratively disarmed.
Ulyaoth: Overview
Like Chattur'gha, Ulyaoth's attack capabilities are limited. His sole power in battle with the other Ancients is his ability to create portals. Ulyaoth can use these portals either to shoot energy beams OUT at the enemy, or to suck the enemy IN through the portal.
Ulyaoth: Combat against Chattur'gha
It is pretty clear that Chattur'gha never had a chance. Ulyaoth uses his portals creatively, from pulling in Chattur'gha's energy ray and shooting it back at him, to dismembering the enemy Ancient by pulling him into his portals, and then closing them on Chattur'gha once he is partway through. 
Ulyaoth seems to be much faster than either of the enemy Ancients: he is able to intercept Chattur'gha's attacks and counter-attack almost instantly. In contrast, both Chattur'gha and Xel'lotath have to pause for a moment before countering their opposing Ancient's move.
 
It could be argued that Ulyaoth was toying with Chattur'gha during this fight, sadisticly cutting him apart, once piece at a time. Note that he uses his portal to absorb Chattur'gha tail-first, instead of head-first, arguably extending the other Ancient's suffering.
Ulyaoth: Combat against Xel'lotath
As with Chattur'gha, Ulyaoth's limitations become clearer when we see him in his losing battle. The Absent Horror can't seem to do anything BUT create portals. Even when Xel'lotath has proven that she can block Ulyaoth's portal-beams or deflect them back at him, he keeps trying the same tactic. Perhaps he lacks the imagination to try anything different? By the end of the fight it is pretty clear that Ulyaoth has run out of tricks. 
He does not, however, attempt to use one of his portals to flee. Perhaps in his arrogance he refused to consider that he might actually lose to Xel'lotath.
Xel'lotath: Overview
Xel'lotath seems to have the widest range of powers available to her. She can channel her power to form shields, or energy balls, beams, and bolts. She also uses illusions to aid her, as when she seems to go into Ulyaoth's portal only to reappear behind him, or when she creates two duplicates of herself while trying to confuse Chattur'gha.
Xel'lotath: Combat against Ulyaoth
Xel'lotath pauses to consider each attack that Ulyaoth makes before she counters him. Since she can block his attacks with relative ease, it seems that she can afford the time. She plays with the other Ancient's mind by seeming to vanish into his portal, only to reappear behind Ulyaoth (instead of being destroyed as he must have intended). In the end, she destroys him with a blast of power once he is too weakened to attack or defend himself.
Xel'lotath: Combat against Chattur'gha
Xel'lotath's downfall appears to be her overconfidence. Despite having the apparent advantage in variety of long-range attacks, she keeps getting too close to Chattur'gha. Her "three Xel'lotaths" illusion fails because she and the duplicates are close enough together that the other Ancient can strike all of them at the same time.
Once Chattur'gha has caught her in his claw, Xel'lotath seems to panic. Instead of trying to hit him with another magic attack, she first claps her hands to her "cheeks" (the sides of her eye) in apparent shock, then flails her arms wildly in an attempt to break free. Of course she cannot compete with Chattur'gha in terms of physical strength, and so she is quickly torn apart. 
Faceless Man 01:19, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm... I think it needs to be cleaned up, it's kind of wordy. While I like and support your idea of adding information about the conflicts, I'm not sure we need thorough descriptions, and we definitely don't need redundant examination of each fight under each Ancient. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 21:01, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Additions? (The Ancients in combat)