Talk:Camping

message: I am removing this from the second graf unless it can be sourced:
It continues to be a response to the increasing urbanization and isolation of Western society. Camping is often associated with a sense of nostalgia or of romanticism for 'the times of our fathers'. It simultaneously evokes images of 'oneness with nature' and 'man against nature' - independence and self-sufficiency ... Camping divides those who enjoy it from those who do not more distinctly than most other common leisure activities.
Daniel Case 13:04, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Clean up intro

message: What about camping out for video games or a large sale?
:Well, if we've got a source for it we could include something.  ·:·Will Beback  ·:· 05:39, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Urban camping

message: *In Section "Definitions":  "Survivalist campers set off with little more than their boots...."  Most "survivalists" I know (and that ain't many, but I consider myself one...) would not think of setting off without a bug-out bag at minimum (if given the choice.)  The only exception I can think of is survival tests (self-imposed or otherwise,) which I, at least, wouldn't consider "camping."  I'm not saying that ultralight backpackers (and perhaps others) don't go camping with no gear, just the term "survivalist" here.
:So I'd propose the weasely "Some campers set off..." or "Ultralight backpackers set off..." etc.
* "The most comfortable form of camping uses recreational vehicles (RVs), essentially wheeled houses."  Can someone point out an objective reliable source which suggests an RV is the most comfortable?  I've stayed in RVs, Campers, and Pop-Ups.  Personally, I find a tent to be the most comfortable.  I know of others who believe anything less than open sky is not comfortable.  Now if that were "The most expensive form of..." I'd buy it, so to speak.  ;)  Is there a better way to phrase this sentence that won't tick off crusty old tent campers like me?
: Agreed, "comfort" is relative and possibly POV.  I changed it to "range of amenities".  While comfort may be arguable, it's hard to say that an RV doesn't have more amenities than a backpacking tent.  Hope that helps.  --Rehcsif 19:52, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A couple of proposed revisions 

message: I created a page for glamping (a portmanteau for glamorous camping) and it got deleted - although I admit it wasn't much info at first. If someone knows more about it, we could put a section on here that 'glamping' redirects to.JW (talk) 19:31, 5 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Glamping

message: In the United Kingdom, the term "camping" specifically refers to tents. One would never describe someone caravaning or motorhoming as 'camping'. 86.21.227.237 (talk) 22:18, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Should this article be split so that 'camping' only deals with tents and the like, with caravans and motorhomes in a separate article?  Murray Langton (talk) 10:48, 29 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with splitting the article.  Camping is tents to us in Australia, and I think this is a fairly understanding of the word.--Dmol (talk) 12:33, 29 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Oppose. This is certainly the U.S./Canadian usage. In many campgrounds a tent can go on any site and a camper on any with a good surface. How is cooking smores on a campfire different if you have a tent or a trailer? You would have to duplicate most of the content of the article. We already have sub-articles on backpacking, canoe camping, camping coaches, Recreational vehicles, etc. Rmhermen (talk) 22:58, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Non-international usage

message: I have created :Category:Camping by country to clear out the clutter in :Category:Camping.  I have also written a Camping in New Zealand article.  I urge editors to do the same for their respective countries. -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 09:46, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It depends on which country you are in.  In USA using a motor home counts as camping, while in UK and NZ camping is taken to imply using a tent.  Also some countries allow you to stop overnight in remote areas wherever you like, while others strictly enforce restrictions on where such stops may take place. Murray Langton (talk) 05:37, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Camping in different countries 

message: The section on camping with a bicycle includes the phrase 'despite less capacity for storage' by comparison with tramping/backpacking.  I doubt whether this is correct: a pair of bicycle panniers has a capacity of around 50 litres, so with two pairs of panniers (one pair on front wheel, one pair on back wheel) we get a capacity of around 100 litres.  Can also add a carrier bag (20+ litres), a handlebar bag (15+ litres), and an underseat bag (5 litres).  How many rucsacks have a capacity over 100 litres?  As an alternative to pannier bags, I tow a bicycle trailer for trips up to about 40 miles/day; trailers vary in capacity - mine is nearly 100 litres. Murray Langton (talk) 09:12, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Unsourced text removed. Cheers, Wassupwestcoast (talk) 15:14, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bicycle capacity 

message: I'm not sure if this list of 'camping equipment' is really appropriate here, since it seems to include a lot of things which a backpacker for example would not even consider (folding chairs!).  Also those who use an over-equipped 'Recreational Vehicle' would not generally bother with a tent.
Alternatively the list could be split into several sections, indicating those items more appropriate to the various forms of transport used.
Any other ideas for making the list more useful?  Murray Langton (talk) 20:37, 26 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  re Camping Equipment 

message: I removed these two: 
"Beach camping is increasing in popularity in countries with open sea. The main advantage of this type of camping is that the campers do not need to carry around lots of necessary equipment. In this case, the equipment consists of a decent tent, cookware and camping stove. Beach camping is also growing in popularity because it offers a genuine camping experience without having to hike many miles and because of the recreation opportunities available by being located next to a beach.
Lake camping usually refers to the activity which involves driving a car to a campsite, near to a lake. This is normally a great choice for people who enjoy camping but do not have too much time available to do it. Lake camping is done during the weekend, as a quick vacation. Although it does not involve hiking, it is still called camping because the campers are sleeping in a tent at the site. Moreover, this is one of the most comfortable types of camping given the fact that the sites are typically regulated and there are bathroom and shower facilities available."
These seem to be only locations to camp in not "kinds" of camping alongside the other items on the list. There is certainly nothing unusual about camping by lakes where I live - and there aren't all driveup campsites either. To camp at the largest lake on the largest island on the largest lake, for instance, requires a 4-6 hour boat ride then a 15 mile hike. Beach camping doesn't require less equipment but more - to take advantage of watersports. But equipment is mainly a matter of personal style (and number of children). Some beach sites are quite remote, even more so than some hike-in site as they can only be reached by boats. At the same park I mentioned before one campground is 15 miles off the mainland (but about 120 miles of water travel if taking the official park boats.) Rmhermen (talk) 13:43, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Types of camping

message: I still am not sure what this section is exactly but I removed this: 
"In states such as Connecticut, Iowa, Illinois, and Colorado, children, under the age of 18, do not need adult supervision in order to enjoy nature, as long as the camp is in designated recreational or camp areas. However, in some states such as Arkansas, Rhode Island, and Georgia, many people cannot camp until the age of 21 without a proper camping permit." 
It doesn't seem to fit into the section. Rmhermen (talk) 21:37, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Social camping

message: I would like to revert to the standard images on the right rather than the two images on either side of each at the beginning of each section with only a small column of text between, followed by a large block of text with no images. I wanted to ask here for a third opinion first though. Rmhermen (talk) 23:06, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed ... plus thinning out some of the redundant images - no need for multiple photos to illustrate the same things. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 00:48, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

text: Reorganized - but I would like a better lead image still. Rmhermen (talk) 00:42, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Image layout

message: Despite claims that an Englishman came to American, learned camping and then returned home and invented it in 1901 and popularized it writing in 1908:
:1799 first camp meeting (James McGready in Logan county, Kentucky)
:1801 Cane Ridge Revival camp meeting in Kentucky
:1807 First camp meeting in England 
:1818 Oldest surving camp meeting founded Hollow Rock, Ohio 
:1832 Shiloh Camp meeting in Missisippi started 
:1848 Paradise campground in Galena claims to be oldest in Illinois (needs independent sourcing)
:1850 First Thames camping skiff built.
:1857 Alpine Club (UK) founded
:1861 Gunnery Camp in Connecticut " F. W. Gunn is credited as starting recreational camping as we know it today, and the tradition goes back to 1861 when he took his students on a forty mile walk to Welch's Point in Milford."
:1862 Austrian Alpine Club founded
:1863 First Swiss Alpine Club hut
:1865 Des Plaines Methodist Camp Ground - thousands erected tents in the summer to attend revival meetings
:1868 Norwegian Trekking Association founded
:1869 William Henry Harrison Murray publishes Adventures in the Wilderness; or, Camp-Life in the Adirondacks. As many as 5,000 people try to camp in the area that summer, making "Adirondack" Murray the father of camping.
:1871-1874 “McGuirk’s Medicinal Springs" invalid camp in Yellowstone
:1874 First YWCA camp
:1874 Club alpin français founded
:1874 Patent for a folding table notes it could be useful for "camping out" parties
:1876 First private U.S. summer camp for boys (Dr. Joseph Trimble Rothrock)
:1876 Appalachian Mountain Club founded (a fishing camp founded this year later becomes an official hut)
:1876 The Adventures of Tom Sawyer has Tom playing pirate, making camp and cooking on a campfire
:1877 Thomas Hiram Holding goes on a canoe camping trip in Scotland; published account titled The Cruise of the Osprey
:1879 Camp Life in the Wilderness by Charles A.J. Farrar describes a two-week trip in Maine in 1874.
:1879 Samuel White Baker ships a Gypsy caravan from England to Cyprus for his holiday tour.Cyprus as I saw it
:1880-1883 George W. Sears (Nessmuk) publishes details of his solo canoe camping trips in the Adirondacks in Forest and Stream magazine 
:1880 First leisure trailer built for William Gordon Stables of Scotland
:1880 The organizing meeting of the American Canoe Association noted that camping sites would be available to any who desires one.
:1882-3 concessionaire's leases at Yellowstone modified so that they wouldn't interfere with the enjoyment of campers 
:1883-4 several hotel tent camps at Yellowstone (semi-permanent tents with service buildings)
:1884 George Sears writes Woodwork, a book on "ultralight" camping, camp cooking, fishing, and solo canoeing
:1885 Arnold Hague of the U.S geological Survey suggests to the secretary of the interior that Yellowstone should offer licenses for “pack-trains and outfits for the accommodation of those who wish to leave the beaten tracks and camp out in the mountains"
:1885 First YMCA boys camp, Camp Baldhead (later known as Camp Dudley)
:1885 Gordon Stables writes The Gentleman Gypsy about travel in his caravan "Wanderer"
:1886 Boys' Brigade in Scotland holds their first camp
:1888 Oldest hut in the Appalachian Mountain Club system (based on Alpine huts already existing)
:1889 Jerome K. Jerome publishes Three Men in a Boat describing a Thames River boat camping trip
:1889 Camping and camp outfits. A manual of instruction, Shields, G. O. (George O.). "based on twenty-five years'  experience in camping and the study of camp-lore..." Not his first book on the subject and mentions he has already been using a sleeping bag for several years instead of the old-style bankets. (also calls hiking "tramping").
:1890 Alonzo McMaster of Locport, New York patents improvements in a camping vehicle with toilet, stove, ice box, fresh water tanks, convertible seat/beds, wardrobe
:1892 First organized co-ed camp, Camp Arey in Arey, New York
:1892 "McMaster Camping Car" was available to rent at Yellowstone for $5 a day. This was a horse-drawn gypsy-type wagon equiped for 12-day trips.
:1894 Oldest continuously operating camp on one site in North America: Keewaydin Camp was organized on Lake Temagami in Ontario, Canada
:1897 Thomas Hiram Holding invents bicycle camping, publishes Cycle and Camp in Connemara
:1897 Yellowstone was so popular that campers were only allowed to camp for two days at any one spot, no camping within 100 feet of a road, campsite to be cleaned by burning or removed trash.
:1898 24 companies had permits to guide camping trips in Yellowstone which was half of all visitors
:1898 First Canadian YMCA camp
:1900 First Boys' Club camp
:1901 Thomas Hiram Holding holds first camp with the Association of Cycle Campers, later known as The Camping and Caravanning Club, at Wantage, England
:1902 Specially desirable camping places should be protected from development of hotels in U.S. national forests
:1902 Woodcraft Indians scouting founded. First edition of the Birch Bark Roll
:1902 First private girl's camp, Camp Kehonka, the first, private independent girls' organized camp near Wolfeboro, New Hampshire, in 1902"
:1904 Camp Highlands for Boys in Sayner, Wisconsin - oldest continuously operated, private camp
:1905 Sons of Daniel Boone scouting founded
:1906 The book of camping and woodcraft - a guidebook for those who travel in the wilderness Horace Kephart "As for camps within easy reach of town or supply-posts, everyone, I suppose, know best how to gratify his own tastes in fitting them up..."
:1906 Alpine Club of Canada founded
:1907 First Boy Scout camp - Brownsea Island
:1908 The Camper's Handbook published by Thomas Hiram Holding
:1908 Scouting for Boys first published
:1909 Girl Guides founded 
:1910 Auto campers (recreational vehicles) first produced in U.S.
:1910 "Camp Directors Association of America" founded by male directors of boys' camps, later called American Camping Association
:1910 First Boy Scouts USA camp
:1910 Camp Fire Girls founded
:1911 (In  2011) "With over ninety-five camps that are 100 years old or older, camp is a genuine tradition."
:1912 First Girl Scouts USA camp
Rmhermen (talk) 19:25, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: There are multiple related ideas here: 
*working and living in the wilderness (logging camps, prospectors, traders, hunters, trappers, explorers, rendezvous) - probably not "camping" - very old
*camp meetings - religious-oriented gatherings in central locations with temporary living quarters - somewhat like modern festival camping, maybe "camping" - at least by 1799
*"recreational camping" - non-work, non-religious - at least by the 1860s 
*"organized camps", group camps, summer camps - often permanent building but not always, focused on outdoor skills and recreation - maybe "camping" - at least by 1861
*Alpine huts - permanent structures, may provide food, sleeping quarters, etc - maybe "camping" - at least by 1863 
*permanent tent camps - a step down from the hotels in the wilderness but with at least partly canvas semi-permanent or permanent tents, may have wooden floors, halfwalls, support buildings (dining hall, etc.) - probably "camping" - at least by 1870s
*designated areas for individual camping - at least by 1890s
*scouting organization camping - 1902
Rmhermen (talk) 20:32, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: history section

message: The section Camping equipment (as it reads now), is written too much like a guide on how to camp.  Wikipedia is not a guide.  Wikibooks is a more suitable place to write on what one "must" possess.  This section contains many uncited opinions such as "Any camper, and not only the survival ones, need waterproof matches..."  Further, this article is about camping in general and thus all it's forms, but the section implies inaccurate assertions about the needs of teardrop trailer campers, hammock campers and other forms.  As I do not see a way to revise this section in a way that will not gather original thought, I am inclined to delete it and expanded the of common equipment.  Do any other editors here see an alternative solution?–Sparkgap (talk) 19:14, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Camping equipment 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
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Participate in the deletion discussion at the . —Community Tech bot (talk) 18:38, 27 September 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

message: Perhaps this article could be edited to include mention of discuss different tents and tent setups for car camping. A link to the Springbar article might make a good addition to this page — either in the article itself (in the Recent Trends section) or in "See also."  Xlea Nollmav (talk) 01:10, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Note: user Xlea Nollmav (talk) is being paid to promote Springbar. Murray Langton (talk) 15:49, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: That is actually no longer the case. This is simply in an effort to help the brand address the orphan link issue that you and I previously discussed. As you suggested, I am adding a note on related talk pages (without directly adding links myself) to see if others believe adding a note/link to Springbar would be relevant/helpful. If this is not the way to go about this, please let me know. I appreciate any guidance.  Xlea Nollmav (talk) 16:17, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Additional content/reference