Talk:Jazz rap

message: not sure when (or if) this'll be responded to, but I was wondering if De La Soul would be counted as Jazz Rap. ReverendG 06:09, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: De La are a lot of things, but jazz rap is most definitely one of them.  "I Be Blowin" ( a jazz instrumental ) is a classic of theirs, from Balhuun Mindstate ... or however you spell it.  ForrestCroce 02:51, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  De La Soul 

message: I really don't think OutKast belongs on this list ... weird/"out there" and jazz aren't the same thing.  ForrestCroce 02:51, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I would agree, it doesn't sound like jazz rap at all. But it's doubtful it would sound quite like it does without gang starr, ATCQ, etc. going before it.  There is that that lovely elegiac cornet solo at the end of Life's a Bitch, and samples from Donald Byrd, Ahmad Jamal, Reuben Wilson, Gary Burton. 86.42.83.73 (talk) 20:17, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable artists and albums 

message: Can someone tell me if this would qualify as jazz rap? Youtube: Mr Boinkin & Kurnel MC Thanks! Citikiwi 07:22, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  NZ Jazz Rap? 

message: An entire article on this genre and no mention of Pete Rock?! Come on. :P
23.16.58.52 (talk) 06:53, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pete Rock.. 

message: "Also Hip Hop Duo Madvillain whose song "All Caps" from his album Madvillainy has jazz influences." is hardly encyclopaedic. The information is likely very useful and the articles linked to already cite the claim, but it's written like it was just tagged on like a random. The entire article reads a bit like this. If any experienced editors who are also Jazz Rap fans are reading this, this could be a project for you. 125.253.96.174 (talk) 21:06, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article needs work 

message: I have never herd the phrase "Jazz rap" before, nor does this article explain the origin of the phrase that is it's title. I believe it is dubious at best, and likely some sort of wikipedia invention. Drn8 (talk) 17:29, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Original Research? 

message: Much of what is classified as Jazz/Rap is derived from this period before the domination of top-40 format in radio. Swing was the dance style that mainstream radio stations did not play in the 40's, until the advent of black appeal. Modern jazz came about from the Be-bop influence and swing at the same time emerging with the advent of the 'personality jock' in radio, spewing jive invectives and signifying, playing at the dozens on air. Hip-hop artists thru necessity came to rely on sampled instrumentals from the early modern jazz period. Taking the artists and music that fit this category and fitting them in a genre is appropriate - seeing all the links tying it together makes the editors requests for citations overly redundant. Some of these need to be removed.108.6.113.75 (talk) 23:35, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Black Appeal Stations 

message: Completely agree with Drn8 above, ten years later, that this is original research. Have been listening to hiphop for nearly 40 yrs, and jazz rap is not a recognized subgenre among adherents. I'm talking from a mainstream, notability perspective. Where are the citations? Where is the academic support?
The logic of this original research is fundamentally flawed and disrespectful to hiphop's history. The logic states that Tribe, De La, Digable Planets are all jazz rap because they sampled from jazz records. Saying, "a hiphop subgenre is created when a producer samples from a particular genre of music" is nonsensical. Have you ever met a crate digger? They delight in hopping all over a vinyl shop. When RZA sampled from old Kung Fu movies, did they start calling Wu Tang "Kung Fu Rap"? When Jay-Z sampled an Egyptian musician on Big Pimpin' was the song called "Belly Dance Rap"? Of course not.
Not only is this disrespectful to hiphop's history, it disrespect's jazz as well. Jazz is improvisational, Hip Hop is not. Freestyle is improvisational, sure, but the albums of Tribe, Gang Starr, & the JB's, albums cited by this article as exemplary of jazz rap, are not Freestyle albums. If there is no improvisation, Jazz has not left it's most archetypal imprint.
The artists mentioned here; Tribe, Digable, De La, Gang Starr, the Roots, JBs, Common - They are all either progressive, Boom bap, or Golden Age artists. Sure someone from here also slapped "Jazz Rap" into their infoboxes, but those are confirmation bias edits.
- The one notable exception to all of this (again, from a mainstream perspective...there may be tiny artists that are exceptions) is Guru's Jazzmatazz series of albums. That truly is a fusion of jazz and hiphop - it says so on the album cover. But is one series enough to substantiate a wiki article?
I'm not well-versed on deletion, but if someone will school me on the process, I'm happy to get the ball rolling and help get this deleted.JGray (talk) 22:50, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article should be deleted; Here's why