Talk:Mott Haven, Bronx

message: "an up and coming neighborhood"?
Sounds like a real estate agent placed this. It may warrant deletion.
:Are you smoking crack you bought in that neighborhood??!
I was thinking just that (about the real-estate agent)!  Made a few changes to make it a bit more honest, though it could prob. even be cleaned up more to reflect the truth about the current state of the area.  I'm from Manhattan, but taught just north of there - a school I helped found is actually right near there on 139 & Willis.  Justjared 21:34, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Up and Coming?!?!

message: Added in descriptions of the real problems in this neighborhood and some photographs. Mott Haven is one of the poorest neighborhoods in America and deals a long list of social problems. Do not let the real estate agents turn a fact based article into an advertisement. The area is not gentrifying. I also wanted to add the comments and linked article about the clocktower and lofts does not apply to Mott Haven but a small section of Port Morris adjacent the Third Avenue Bridge.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wikiwiki718 (talk • contribs) 02:06, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Added, Cited, Organized

message: I've been living in Mott Haven for 5 years, near the southern end of the neighborhood adjacent to Port Morris.  There have been a lot of claims here of "real estate agents" editing the page, but the fact is I was the one who added some of the edits to the page a while ago to reflect my own experiences living in the neighborhood.  I am not a real estate agent.  I am a resident, and I've seen for myself the transformation going on in the neighborhood.  Yes, it is still a very poor neighborhood, but it's ridiculous to delete all references to the changes going on and call this a "balanced" article.  The murder rate is down by 80% since 1990, robbery down by 79%, burglary by 82%, assault by 63%.  Friends of mine moved to Mott Haven 8 years ago, they were one of the first to renovate a building in the neighborhood.  I'm living in a renovated building myself, a loft conversion.  On Alexander Avenue one block from me, a whole slew of formerly burnt-out brownstones have been renovated and I know graphic designers, artists, and musicians living in them now.  And yes, these are all in Mott Haven, not just Port Morris.
And it's not just in my neighborhood near Port Morris -- it's also in the entire neighborhood.  The Hub, at 149th and 3rd Avenue, has seen a flourishing of new businesses.  Bank branches have opened there.  It's a bustling commercial district.
The edits to the article have eliminated all references to the very real transformation going on here.  This article needs to have some balance restored.
Syntheticzero (talk) 17:45, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree, I don't think this gives the full story and why on earth do they list every housing project -- they don't do that for Manhattan neighborhoods. Every new york neighborhood has a lot of projects. Shall we remove that section, and just mention that there are X many projects as a single sentence? This could also use more information on the arts.  futurebird (talk) 04:53, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: This article is currently biased heavily in a negative direction

message: In the first paragraph more data on the transportation serving the neighborhood was added.  Corrected the southern boundary to the Bronx Kill waterway.  This part of the Bronx is part of Mott Haven, not Port Morris.  Jim Henderson appears to have edited both this article and the Port Morris article to include this error.  If he has a citation to support his assertion, please show it.  The Community Board 1 map illustrated Port Morris as lying to the east of the Bruckner as I said.  They go so far as to print the name Port Morris vertically so that it is very clear the neighborhood lies to the east of Mott Haven.  Please look at the map.  While New York City neighborhood boundaries are fluid, residents of this area consider themselves part of Mott Haven.  Port Marris starts east of the Bruckner Expressway.  It is not a majority residential area, it is an industrial one.
Land use section expanded to include all types of buildings and land in use.  Data from the most recent local community board map.  
Demographics edited for accuracy and tone.  The most recent statistics available are from Community Board 1.  When the 2010 Census results come out, modifications may be in order.  The previous paragraph contained normative statements about the population and unsupported statistics.  I searched the cited document for any data supporting the assertions and could find none.  For example that "over half the population lived in poverty"--in fact the Community Board Report cited as a link says only 39% of the population lives below the poverty line.  The community board statistics are complicated by the fact that they mix Mott Haven data with Melrose data.  If there is a published source for the assertions made by the previous editor, please cite the source.  
Housing Projects
Housing Projects in New York City have their own Wikipedia article.  Each individual project has at least a Wikipedia stub.  That is the appropriate place to put details such as the name, height of building, or the year of construction.   This is excessive and tedious detail for the average user just looking to learn about the neighborhood.  Imagine how boring it would be if the name, height and type of every building in Mott Haven were listed?  The quantity and concentration of housing projects in Mott Haven is significant compared to other NYC neighborhoods, but the fact that it has it's own section and that there are 17 housing projects mentioned adequately conveys that fact.  It is important to remember that the housing projects are not the sum total of the neighborhood experience.  Neither are they used as directional landmarks by residents.  
Removed Jonathan Kozol book reference from within the article.  That's great that someone read this guy's book a 15 years ago, but that doesn't mean it merits inclusion in the article text.  It could be used as a cited source  (although not for current statistics because it is too old.)
Generally--the Social Problems section seems like a good candidate for deletion unless it is rewritten to be less vague.  Statements like "the incarceration rate is high" or "a high proportion" are vague.  What is the percentage of the population that is currently incarcerated or formerly incarcerated?  Other wise "high rates" begs the question "compared to what?"  Is the rate higher than Melrose's?  Brooklyn's? Texas's?  Equally vague are statements about being "poor" or that the cause of social problems is young pregnancy.  "Poor" is a relative concept so it is important to give factual data wherever possible.  I included the percentage of the households living below the poverty line--an objective measurement--for this very reason.   Although social problems are important, I question whether they really ought to be included in an article about a neighborhood.  Are we going to have subsections called "Drug Addiction", "Police Conduct", "Mental Illness", "Handicapped Access", "Stray Animals", "Rodent Control", etc.  All of these are problems affecting Mott Haven and other neighborhoods but they do not necessarily merit inclusion in this Wikipedia article.   
The History Section could use expansion to include more recent events.  Mott Haven and the South Bronx in general played a significant role in the development of rap and hip hop and that seems worthy of mention.  
Tourism has started in the area too, with the Bronx Culture Trolley visiting local art galleries and a hotel under construction.  Perhaps that could be worked into the existing urban renewal section.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Starturtle73 (talk • contribs) 09:41, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:   '''Made Edits Toward Greater Factual Accuracy and More Neutral Tone''' 

message: I have removed the URL hxxp://www.hdc.org/motthaven.htm, whose domain is a known phishing site per http://www.phishtank.com/phish_detail.php?phish_id=3477047. epic genius (talk) 18:33, 3 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed a phishing site 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 5 external links on Mott Haven, Bronx. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20151013065024/http://www.urbanresearchmaps.org/plurality/ to http://www.urbanresearchmaps.org/plurality/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160304213905/http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/lucds/bx1profile.pdf to http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/lucds/bx1profile.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150525030524/http://www.nyc.gov/html/nycha/html/home/home.shtml to http://www.nyc.gov/html/nycha/html/home/home.shtml
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150727034949/http://www.bronxhistoricalsociety.org/chrono.html to http://www.bronxhistoricalsociety.org/chrono.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150609052322/http://www.bronxhistoricalsociety.org/bxbrief to http://www.bronxhistoricalsociety.org/bxbrief
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thread_title:  External links modified (February 2018)