Talk:Final Fantasy VIII/Archive 1

message: I've redirected a number of recently created articles regarding individual characters from Final Fantasy VIII to this main article. All of them  were virtually substubs, and said nothing more than "so-and-so is a character from Final Fantasy VIII," less than was actually on this page. It brings up the question of what characters actually warrant individual articles: certainly the main characters (Squall, Rinoa, possibly Laguna), but beyond that? It's my personal inclination to avoid article sprawl: information about Final Fantasy VIII should be here, on the Final Fantasy VIII page, and not spread over dozens of pages all across Wikipedia. In extreme circumstances when there is simply too much information to fit in the main article, then you can spin it off into its own seperate page, but that did not seem to be the case with any of these examples. I left the page on Quistis as it was, because it did have a reasonable amount of detailed information, but I'm inclined to attempt to merge that into this article anyway, and leave the seperate articles as an exception, rather than the rule. Any thoughts? – Seancdaug 22:40, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)
Thanks. A vocal minority turned Final Fantasy VI into a fancruft-fest of the worst order; I'm glad someone's trying to turn back the tide here. jdb ❋ (talk) 15:53, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unneeded character pages? 

message: If you've seen the Xenogears/Xenosaga page, you've probably seen the extensive plot encyclopedia under construction.  FF8 is my favorite game (next to, not surprisingly, the Xeno-series in general), primarily because of its excellent storyline.  So, I propose that we maintain a plot encyclopedia of all elements (we can link to preexisting pages and add items not yet discussed).  If you guys hate the idea, feel free to delete it.  It seems to have worked fairly well on the Xeno pages.
PS: I'm Deckiller...just not logged in ^_^
*A non-registered user just added this section to the encyclopedia.  I'm woundering if we should keep it, or disperse it throughout the article?--ZeWrestler  Talk 13:36, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plot Encyclopedia 

message: It seems to me that the story for this page if vague and more back cover of a book type material then the other Final Fantasy's. I think it needs  to be completely redone. Do I have any support in this?
:It could definately do with some more material, just to expand it to the end of the plot, but try to keep it fairly short and to-the-point. There's an unforutnate tendency for plot summaries to expand into novelisations here. ;) Sockatume 15:54, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Story

message: I'm beginning to think that the Limit Breaks section of this article is getting out of hand. Shouldn't the game's article provide a brief explanation of the mechanics instead of every single limit every character has? They should probably be in to the individual character articles anyway. Anyone agree? ~ Hibana 17:27, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Limit Breaks

message: I've read from the chocobo article that FFVIII is compatible with the Japanese PocketStation and that it allows you play a mini-game called Chocobo World as Boco to give your Guardian Forces extra abilities in the main game. How can this be integrated into the main article? ~ Hibana 18:18, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  PocketStation compatibility 

message: Yeah, the link in the Game Reception section talks about the game's overall sales in 1999, which are stated at the top of the section. But there is nothing sourced for information on the game's popularity boost due to RPGs. ~ Hibana 05:58, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't want to speak too fast, but I think there is no source because this is pure speculation from the person who put this. It is said: "These two games in the Final Fantasy saga, arguably the two most popular, are perhaps benefitting from greater interest in RPG's altogether, such as World of WarCraft, Neverwinter Nights, Guild Wars, and the upcoming Final Fantasy XII." Please note the words perhaps, this is a sign of speculation most of the time. I suggest this part is removed.--DarkEvil 06:09, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. --JiFish(Talk/Contrib) 16:50, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

text: I just removed another section that I felt was just repeating information and highly opinionated. If there isn't any objections to the factual dispute, I'm removing the popularity spike comment soon. ~ Hibana 19:45, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: From what I can piece together from the version history of the article and the version history of the talk page, I assume you're talking about the "criticisms and fan reception" section. While this section is inherently opinionated, it is the opinion of quite a large segment of FF8 players. Many of these criticisms I've seen over and over again on various reviews and various message boards. It also seems rather strange that the "Fanbase and criticism" section has no criticisms at all. Viltris 21:46, 4 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Popularity "spike" 

message: I understand that most of these articles have been catagorized, but some people seem to ignore that catagories.  I figured that putting these lists and articles together in a section will help some newcomers to Wikipedia find information quickly. Feel free to delete if the majority of you don't like it. Deckiller 00:18, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: If someone reads the article, they can find the wiki for all of those other topics. That's just not the format of these articles. ~ Hibana 00:57, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  FF8 articles and lists 

message: The fanbase section has some POV.  I'll try to clean it up when I get the chance. Deckiller 21:43, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fanbase section 

message: I removed the following lines from the Reception and Criticism section, on the grounds that they are POV and unverifiable: 
"Perhaps the game's most revolutionary feature, its compelling love story, has provided the basis for the claim made by many that the game is "the Titanic of video games." More so than any game that preceded it, Final Fantasy VIII weaved an epic romance that tugged at the heartstrings of gamers worldwide."
Who exactly calls FFVII 'the Titanic of video games'? If a source/reference for that quote can be found, it can be kept, but otherwise there's no justification for keeping it. Similarly, the phrase 'more so than any game that preceded it...' is arguable - there were several games with detailed and involving romantic plots before FFVII, though they may not have been as influential. - Terraxos, 19:31, 29 January 2006
:I just removed it again. It was just re-added by User:64.203.10.156 still without reference or explaination. --JiFish(Talk/Contrib) 14:14, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Quite frankly, if I was god of Wiki, I'd make it so that one had to sign up to edit.  Also, I'd suggest strict guidelines for vandalism; one warning. Oh well ^_^. Deckiller 21:08, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Try to assume good faith. This user may well just be a newbie. --JiFish(Talk/Contrib) 21:37, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I take it back. I should have checked the talk page first. :) --JiFish(Talk/Contrib) 21:39, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reception and criticism 

message: G'day all,
I didn't want to just jump right in and throw edits around when I just got here.
Original article says: Squall's weapon is the gunblade, and he is undoubtedly the strongest of his comrades; his Lion Heart limit break is capable of doing up to 130000 hit points of damage, and is the only attack that can do significant harm to Ultima and Omega Weapon.
However I suggest changing that section to: Squall's weapon is the gunblade, and he is undoubtedly the strongest of his comrades; his Lion Heart limit break is capable of doing up to 130000 hit points of damage, however the most powerful attack in the game is Selphie's very rare limit break "The End" which can kill the strongest bosses in one hit.
Omega Weapon laughs at one Lion Heart limit break, however The End takes him out first go. Any thoughts?
(Or do I just need a life? ;))
Pete
--Ozyowie 15:31, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Now that you mention it there's a whole lot of cruft and rubbish in that particular section! As you say, The End is perhaps more effective but to be honest I don't think its necessary to mention any of it here. I'd change that sentence to somthing more generic like: Squall's weapon is the gunblade, and his Limit Breaks see him perform powerful sword sequences. Btw, you might be interested in joining Wikipedia:WikiProject Final Fantasy - perhaps we'll see you there! >Gamemaker 16:24, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Characters 

message: I just reverted a slew of edits made by an anon editor yesterday. Forgive me for not noticing this sooner. Deckiller 23:14, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the second revert, I was just about to do the same thing =) >Gamemaker 23:20, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Your welcome ;D That was a pretty strange series of edits though, eh? Deckiller 23:21, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Indeed! Incidentally, a short while back an edit to the Characters section crept in that compares the FF8 story to The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe, even if it wasn't a bit of a tenuous link, doesn't it qualify as original research? >Gamemaker 23:23, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, unless sources can be cited, it's OR. Deckiller 23:26, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Vandalism?

message: I'm not sure there's any worth in merging Lunar Cry here as the article currently stands. There is a case for rewriting the story section, to cover the entire story in suitable brevity, in which case the lunar cry would obviously get a mention. Until then, there are enough references already (particularly in List of Final Fantasy VIII locations) that I'd recommend redirecting/deleting the standalone article (especially given the quantity and quality of its innacuracies ;) ) >Gamemaker 12:54, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. I want to see this article transwiki'd and then deleted. I tried to  it to that effect, but someone removed the tag. (Mind you, I don't think i've ever seen a  tag that wasn't removed.) Take it to AfD? --JiFish(Talk/Contrib) 13:37, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd recommend just a redirect to the List of Final Fantasy VIII locations or this page. It'd be most at home at the locations page, but whatever the measures taken, the Lunar Cry warrants its own page about as much as the Sister Ray did. If that much. Ryu Kaze 23:15, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

text: By the way, I'd strongly recommend against a full story summary of FFVIII unless it could be very concise. Very. Ryu Kaze 23:19, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't worry, that would be the point =)  I was thinking along the lines of the story section in the recently peer reviewed Final Fantasy IV article. >Gamemaker 23:31, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, I worked to compress the storyline sections of Final Fantasy IV and Final Fantasy IX into succinct sections, and I'd be willing to give it a shot for FF8. Deckiller 23:39, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Something like that looks good to me. If you'd like to try to it, give it a shot. If not, I can give it a go sometime in the next day or so. I've just got to review the Rikku page first and see where the wording can be tightened and references added. Let me know here or on my talk page. Ryu Kaze 23:42, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hehe, plenty of takers, eh? I'd love to do it too, FF8 is my speciality, but to be honest I don't know when I'd get the time. Still, there's no rush. If you guys beat me too it, I'll just have to meddle with your work ;) >Gamemaker 23:48, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that's one of the things one must bear on Wikipedia, eh? XD I've spoken to Deck, and I'm going to whip up something in the next day or two. I'll link you both to it once it's ready so you can offer additional comments. Ryu Kaze 23:51, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merging the Lunar Cry article 

message: Promoted!  This is a great article, perhaps one of the best I've seen on video games.  Nice job. Air.dance 02:44, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Good Article

message: Doesn't this deserve its own section? I mean, there's a bit of the technical stuff at the beginning there and pictures for the cover, but is that really all that's needed? Were there no changes? What about the PocketStation thing with the chocobo and that red lion thing? Weren't those included in the PC version? I don't have the PC version (it's too expensive and hard to find), or else I would add the section myself. --Eternal Trance 20:12, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: About the only thing notable is that you no longer require any extra peripherals to play the Chocobo World mini-game. Aside from that, it's a plain port, no other changes. --TheEmulatorGuy 23:49, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: PC Version

message: I'm not sure so I thought I should ask.  If the factual content of the article calls into question the validity of the criticism itself, then should the criticism still be included?  The "Story" sections explains how the character goes through a significant change throughout the course of the game.  The quote "he appears to undergo little visible character development" seems to make little sense.  On the other hand, if it doesn't matter whether or not the criicism is justifiable, just that it was actually made, then I would personally like to know where that particular criticism came from.
Varmintx 01:08, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Several of these comments are unreferenced and have no place in the article as of yet. However, it's likely that these criticisms have been made by prominent sources. I'll simply add the citation template to the needed areas for now. ~ Hibana 01:33, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Reception and criticism" the last line 

message: The story section needs work. See Talk:Final Fantasy X for some good criticism of how we're handling plot summaries. — Deckiller 06:17, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I included most of the major story arcs (with a few script references and 1-2 more arcs to go). Now the challenge is reducing it by 20 percent. — Deckiller 06:43, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Before we go for FA