Talk:40-yard dash

message: Three of the five citations do not exist anymore. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by DumbLoserGuy (talk • contribs).
----
The citations were simply edited wrong, they have been restored.Jbonneau 18:35, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: This statement is problematic-- "Therefore, if a coach knows that a player runs 40 yards in 4.5 seconds, he will be able to leave the line of scrimmage when a punt is kicked, and reach at the point where the ball comes down just as it arrives."
At the NFL Combine, players don't run in full equipment.  So while the 40-yard dash is a measurement of the player's raw speed, his 40 time isn't going to translate exactly to the playing field.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.65.201.52 (talk) 04:50, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Explanation of the use of 40 yard dash in football 

message: In order to mention players on this page as having allegedly run fast 40 times, it should be that their corresponding page makes such claims. This is not true in the case of Vick or Coles, they should either be removed from this page or their pages should be updated.Jbonneau 18:35, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the standard should be higher yet; there should be a verifiable source outside of Wikipedia for the claim.  If the corresponding player article provides such a source, then we'll use that; otherwise, even if the corresponding article makes the claim, it is unsourced and should be removed if one is not provided.  I will now place Template:citationneeded tags on each of the players accordingly. —Sesquialtera II (talk) 20:33, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Standard for mention of players 

message: Didn't Ted Ginn Jr. run a record breaking 4.06 run? i think it should be added.Doorknob123 13:39, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I did a search and found a Daily News article that supports this, so I will add it. —Sesquialtera II (talk) 20:33, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

text: Ted Ginn Jr. did not even run the 40 at this year's Indianapolis Combine. And when considering "legitimate" 40 times, it would be inappropriate to consider times turned in from various locations, conditions, methods because there are too many variables involved to consider such times as being relative. FCooney 01:49, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

text: He reportedly ran in the 4.4 (+/- 0.02) range at a pro day in Columbus. I don't have a reliable source for that. --Mr Wednesday 20:01, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Ted Ginn Jr.

message: The Ziegler article that was cited reports his 40 yd time as 4.38 s, which is not the 40 m time listed in this article but is also not the 40 yd time listed in this article.  Any chance of getting this reconciled? --Mr Wednesday 20:03, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ben Johnson's 40 yd time 

message: Players such as Randal Williams (4.04)[2], Bo Jackson (4.12)[3], Michael Bennett (4.13)[4], Jerome Mathis (4.25) [5],DeAngelo Hall (4.15)[6][7], Michael Vick (4.25),Lee Suggs (4.27)[8], Don Beebe (4.21)[9], Randy Moss (4.25)[10], Darrell Green (4.15[11], 4.2[12]), and Laveranues Coles (4.2)[13] have approached that mark.
I suggest deleting this entire sentence. We spend a lot of time in this article establishing that times below 4.20 seconds are virtually impossible to attain, yet this sentence seems to give credibility to these times with the "approached that mark" phrase. Funnyhat 17:32, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's a great point. Since we can't arbitrarily add 0.2 seconds or so to the times that NFL people are claiming, it should be noted in the article even more specifically that NFL times are not comparable to Olympic times, due to the hand timing reasons mentioned in the article. Radishes (talk) 17:35, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Outlandishly-fast times 

message: As far as I can tell, Jerry Rice is not "a homo."  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.120.244.109 (talk) 03:28, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vandalism removed 

message: This article does not cite any of its sources, and frankly many of the 40 times quoted are extremely suspect.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sean10mm (talk • contribs) 19:25, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  No sources 

message: This page is just plain bad.  I came here to learn about the 40-yard dash and got an unintelligible mish-mash of uncited numbers and suspect logic.  Needs heavy editing, at least.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.247.154.18 (talk) 05:43, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Completely agree with the above post. The article in particular breaks down near the end. I've noticed something of a trend in sports articles on Wikipedia - sports topics that aren't especially notable seem to have been repeatedly edited by fans and followers of the sport in question, resulting in a mish-mash of contradictory facts and opinions. Radishes (talk) 17:31, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Needs to be rewritten

message: Is he really the "... now considered one of the best kick returners in NFL history and holds numerous return records."  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.234.33.43 (talk) 21:37, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Hester?

message: It would seem, after much reading and research, that the 4.3 is not impossible, just not nearly as likely as folks would have you believe.
So, if you are a skill position player in the NFL, and run a fully electronically timed 40 yd dash in the 4.6's, you are NOT slow, one might say you're a step faster than most. 4.7's = Average. If you run in the 4.5's, you are FAST. In the 4.4's, you are VERY FAST. In the 4.3's, you should be in the OLYMPICS, 4.2's means you are either lying or you have been hand timed by a coach with an itchy finger.
Conversely, the definition of "FAST" for collegiate times can be rolled back a tenth, and high school times an additional tenth or two, from those above numbers.
But nobody will go to full-scale electronic timing, just because no one wants to be seen as slow compared to the times they read about. Hand timing will always reign. Ideally coaches should time their players in full pads, on grass, over 25 yards to get a true read of how fast their guys are. But that will never happen. So, just be smart enough to take the times you read about with a grain of salt....for instance 4.57 backwards? Please!
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Deke49 (talk • contribs) 19:31, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  What is actually "Fast"? 

message: The fastest ever recorded was Joey Galloway in a individual workout with the Seattle Seahawks before they drafted him. He ran a 3.9.
Going to have to see a reference for the 3.9 claim.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.234.10.144 (talk) 10:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  3.9?? 

message: there is a reference to "powell" in the article with no first name ... someone who give a rip about sprinters please clean this up, thanks  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.81.197.249 (talk) 16:43, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  who is powell? 

message: I added the "not verified" tag because all, if any references are missing from the article.Yumehoshijima (talk) 04:16, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Not Verified tag

message: excerpts from a FoxSports.com article at the 2001 draft by Clark Judge. The last paragraph seems to negate much of the talk here:
"I never saw Vick run a 40, and I wasn't at his workout at Virginia Tech. But one thing I can guarantee is this: Vick cannot run the 40 in under 4.3 seconds. Heck, he can't run it under 4.4, either. That's not a knock on Vick. It's a knock on an NFL practice that is absolutely, positively out of whack. I'm talking about 40-yard dash times. They're the standard by which draft-eligible players are measured, and they're as reliable as UFO sightings. Yet when the NFL begins its march of draftees on Saturday you're going to hear how one running back ran a 4.32, a wide receiver peeled off a 4.34 or some 350-pound lummox breezed through a 4.85. It makes for good copy. But so did Paul Bunyan.
"The only way to get a true 40-yard dash time is to get electronic timing where a man breaks a wire when he leaves the starting gate," said Buffalo's vice president in charge of player personnel, Dwight Adams. "The 40 is a common denominator in football, but it's blown way out of proportion. It's physically impossible to run a 4.2 and, probably, a 4.3. Check with the good track coaches/and sprinters across America, like Brooks Johnson the Olympic sprint coach"
Don't tell that to the guys holding stopwatches. I remember when Vance Johnson, then a wide receiver at the University of Arizona, ran the 40 in 4.19 seconds. At least that's what I was told. I guess Denver was, too, because the Broncos made him their second-round draft pick in 1985. I also remember when Laveranues Coles, then a wide receiver at Florida State, was supposed to have run a 4.16. Nobody said anything about it being wind-aided, but it would have taken Hurricane Andrew to push him to a finish like that. The Jets media guide has him clocked at 4.29 last year, and there was no wind advisory there, either.
The NFL scouting combine has been using electronic timing since 1990, but that's one year after Deion Sanders set the standard against which all others are measured. Sanders ran a 4.29 in Prime Time, and nobody has beaten the mark since. "You've got to take into consideration that most of these times are done with stopwatches," said San Diego State's Rahn Sheffield, coach of the women's track and field squad and a former track star himself. "A 4.2 really translates to a 4.4. When you hand time (dashes) it opens up room for human error. So when a Marshall Faulk runs a 4.33, it really equates to a 4.5." All of which comes as no news to Adams, who for years has laughed off 40-yard dashes and vertical jumps and long jumps as insignificant measures of a football prospect's abilities. He's more interested in production, which makes a lot of sense to me & anyone else who believes stopwatches weren't made for football. Remember when Jerry Rice emerged from Mississippi Valley State in 1985? He was supposed to be too slow. Same with USC running back Marcus Allen. Yeah, well, I never saw a defensive back who could catch Rice from behind until he tore up his knee, and Allen's a lock for the Hall of Fame.
O.J. Simpson might have been the fastest back to play the game. Go ahead and make a case for Bo Jackson. Maybe Herschel Walker, too. But Simpson ran a leg on Southern Cal's 440-yard relay team, one that set a world record, and if he were in this year's draft he'd be the fastest running back by far; faster than Big-10 sprint champion Michael Bennett. Faster than LaDainian Tomlinson. Faster than Deuce McAllister. Any idea what Simpson ran for a 40? I do. Try 4.5. If you don't believe him ask Simpson or any of his track coaches. Heck as the officials from his time at USC.
"I must've missed something here," said Adams. "I spent some time this spring with an Olympic sprinter, and we sat in a stadium together, watching guys work out and talking about how the 40-yard dash times were way overdone." The sprinter was Dennis Mitchell. Yeah, THAT Dennis Mitchell. He and Adams were together at the University of Florida, and when they heard times of some of the guys they watched Mitchell said nothing. He just shook his head. "He was a little shocked," said Adams. "Being a great sprinter, he'd never seen so many people running 4.1s and 4.2s. I've talked to (track coach) Brooks Johnson and others who say, 'You football people are way ahead of us.' Of course, they're facetious."
If Adams had his way, he'd rely more on times for shorter distances -- especially for offensive and defensive linemen. Make them stop running 40s and time them for 10s, maybe 20s. That's all they usually cover, anyway. "I could see it," said Cleveland's vice president in charge of football operations, Dwight Clark. "But for running backs, wide receivers and defensive backs, I'd like to see the 40 stay." The Browns don't rely on others' times. They clock prospects themselves, and if they don't, they don't have a record of them. The Browns never timed anyone at 4.2. They never timed anyone at 4.3, either, though they had the University of Arizona's Trung Canidate at 4.32 last year. I wasn't at that workout, either, but I know something was wrong.
And here's why. The fastest starter I ever saw was sprinter Ben Johnson, and at the 1988 Seoul Olympics track and field's fastest starter ran the 100 meters in a blistering 9.79 seconds, a time that later was disallowed after Johnson tested positive for steroids. Know how fast he covered the first 40? It was 4.69 seconds. Forty meters is approximately 44 yards, which means Johnson ran the first 40 in 4.26. So, now, let's see if I have this straight: The chemically enhanced Johnson, the fastest starter in track history, ran the fastest 100 in history... only it was one-tenth of a second slower than Laveranues Coles a year ago and three one-hundreths of a second ahead of Sanders' NFL combine record.
It makes you wonder. It makes you wonder why anyone believes this stuff."  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.204.88.178 (talk) 00:05, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: A yard is .9144, so actually 4.29, and probably worse since he is still accelerating. This just further makes your point. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 23:08, 11 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: More clarity needed for how the "football forty is timed"

message: "This reflects the difference that timing methods can cause to a runner's time."
I disagree with this and think it should either be cut or have a citation.
I have a source <a href="http://speedendurance.com/2009/08/06/40-yard-dash-times-for-usain-bolt-and-ben-johnson/">that says</a> the discrepancy between the 100 times and the 40 times is that the 100 is determined more by peak speed than the 40 is, where the 40 is almost pure acceleration. This sentence in the article implies that someone who runs a faster 100 would clearly run a faster 40, which goes against what the other article says.
Someone should rewrite this paragraph.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.244.79.104 (talk) 23:37, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: This needs a citation, right?

message: He went to the Oakland Raiders number 108 overall. I cant fix it so if someone else can that would be great. :D
Donitaliano1 (talk) 15:09, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. --bender235 (talk) 15:27, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Jacoby Ford

message: Need to clarify this in the article.
NFL 40 times - the clock starts when the player moves. The runner starts the clock
Athletics 40 times - the clock starts when the gun goes. The runner has to react to the gun. So in essence, the clock is already running when the player starts.
Gatlin only has a 4.44 forty time, as it's a time taken from the first 40 of one of his 100 metre runs. A run where he was reacting to the gun.
Reaction time to a gun, by a sprinter, is something like 0.3 seconds. Meaning 0.3 is already on the clock when they hear the gun go off. Then add in another 0.1 second for their brain to process it, and move.
Any 40 time a sprinter does, in a race, you can probably take off 0.4 just for the reaction time. They're probably running closer to 4.1 forties in reality. Which ties in with their dominance over nfl players over the full 100 as well. 
Cjmooney9 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 13:01, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: overlooking something

message: | 4.28 || Mike Wallace ||  ||  || Wide receiver || 2010 || 
Mike Wallace had a 4.28 40 yard dash time look it up
174.97.152.137 (talk) 02:52, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: According to NFL.com, which is where the results come from, Wallace ran a 4.33. Eagles 24/7 (C) 03:57, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request on 19 December 2011 

message: Add this to 40 Yard Dash Table:
| 4.28 || Mike Wallace ||  ||  || Wide Receiver || 2009 || #84 overall by Pittsburgh Steelers
|-
2 Reliable Sources for Mike Wallace 4.28 40 Yard Dash Time:
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=68061&draftyear=2009&genpos=WR
http://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?f=Mike&l=Wallace&i=8384
Hoopsnerd (talk) 23:42, 7 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The second link is not a reliable source and NFL.com says otherwise. Eagles 24/7 (C) 23:45, 7 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request on 7 January 2012 

message: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/1999/jordan_retires/archive/831128/  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.4.67.101 (talk) 05:46, 23 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Michael Jordan ran a 4.3  

message: The references appear inside the table for records. I'm not sure how to fix this so I thought I would mention it.
164.107.15.131 (talk) 04:55, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for the heads up. --Marc Kupper|talk 05:46, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Formatting problem 

message: I was doing some Google searches to confirm/verify the Wikipedia article and found http://nflcombineresults.com/nflcombinedata.php  Only eight of the times match. I was starting to edit the Wikipedia article to match this web site until I hit Trindon Holliday which we have as 4.29 and this web site has at a record 4.21 seconds.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1543670-how-are-40-yard-dash-times-recorded says "There's even some dispute as to the fastest time since 1999. The NFL recognizes Johnson's 4.24 seconds, but as Rang wrote, NFLDraftScout.com calls Trindon Holliday's time of 4.21 seconds in 2010 the top mark (the NFL adjusted Holliday's time all the way down to 4.34 seconds)."
The nflcombineresults.com web site weighs in with No Such Thing As An Official 40 Yard Dash Time
I may need to revert some of my edits based on the nflcombineresults table but wanted to see if there's consensus on what times we should use given that it seem difficult (impossible) to verify the "official" NFL times.  At http://www.nfl.com/40 the NFL claims "The 40-yard dash is the premier NFL Scouting Combine drill." - They sure make the data for this "premier" metric hard to track down.
Here's a table that has the times from Wikipedia, nflcombineresults.com, and what I could extract from http://www.nfl.com/40 and http://www.nfl.com/combine/top-performers 
:
Wikipedia	40 Yard	NFL 	Name                       	Height (in)	Weight (lbs)	POS	Year
4.29     	4.21   	    	Trindon Holliday           	65         	166         	WR 	2010
4.28     	4.22   	4.28	Jacoby Ford                	69         	186         	WR 	2010
4.24     	4.24   	4.24	Chris Johnson              	71         	197         	RB 	2008
         	4.24   	    	Rondel Menendez            	69         	178         	WR 	1999
4.28     	4.25   	4.28	Demarcus Van Dyke          	73         	176         	CB 	2011
4.30     	4.25   	4.30	Darrius Heyward-Bey        	74         	210         	WR 	2009
4.28     	4.26   	    	Jerome Mathis              	71         	181         	WR 	2005
         	4.27   	    	C.J. Spiller               	71         	196         	RB 	2010
4.27     	4.27   	    	Stanford Routt             	74         	193         	CB 	2005
4.27     	       	4.27	Marquise Goodwin           	69         	170         	WR 	2013
         	4.28   	    	Mike Wallace               	73         	199         	WR 	2009
4.28     	4.28   	    	Champ Bailey               	73         	184         	CB 	1999
4.28     	       	N/A 	Carl Vogel                 	72         	195         	SF 	2013
         	4.29   	    	Johnny Knox                	73         	185         	WR 	2009
4.29     	4.29   	    	Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie	74         	184         	CB 	2008
4.29     	4.29   	    	Fabian Washington          	71         	188         	CB 	2005
         	4.29   	    	Jay Hinton                 	71         	200         	RB 	1999
         	4.30   	    	Mike Thomas                	68         	195         	WR 	2009
4.30     	4.30   	4.30	Yamon Figurs               	71         	174         	WR 	2007
4.30     	4.30   	    	Darrent Williams           	69         	176         	CB 	2005
4.29     	4.33   	    	Josh Robinson              	0          	199         	CB 	2012
4.30     	4.34   	4.30	Tye Hill                   	70         	185         	CB 	2006
4.28     	4.50   	    	Fred Russell               	67         	195         	RB 	2004
--Marc Kupper|talk 07:41, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is www.nflcombineresults.com reliable? 

message: According to his Combine profile, at least - it says he ran a 4.34: http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/Tavon-Austin?id=2539336  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.135.100.102 (talk) 02:21, 14 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you Sy9045 (talk) 14:53, 7 October 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tavon Austin shouldn't be on the list? 

message: Espn's 30 for 30 "Bo Knows" even mentioned Bo's record time. Other than a single report by a single writer which was double sourced by the way, I missed all the supposed scrutiny even tried to search myself. Seems an attempt to try to downplay as if times prior to 1999 are not legit. OK so all Olympic records prior to digital stopwatches should also be given same scrutiny.Like I said poorly sourced and seems to discredit people like Bo Jackson who according to multiple sources including USA Today's cover that week set the long standing record. --0pen$0urce (talk) 09:03, 20 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Bo Jackson

message: This Page says Tavon Austin's official 40 yard dash was 4.25. In fact, his adjusted official by NFL was 4.34. I bet a lot of the data is very inaccurate. You can't claim unofficial data "official" I don't know why this page is protected and won't let people to edit the obvious error. Just brings down the credibility of wikipedia.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.165.23.252 (talk) 18:01, 17 July 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks! I don't know why it's protected too. Sy9045 (talk) 14:53, 7 October 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not official, wrong data 

message: The section says it is based on "According to a five-year NFL combine report...The following average times were measured between 2008-2012 at the NFL combine." The  reference is a blog that supposedly goes "back to every draft since 2000." 
I'm not saying the reference isn't good, but it clearly doesn't match what we're saying that we are showing. --Onorem (talk) 00:09, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: You are absolutely right! I've updated the table to match the reference. I've left the unreferenced rows for now though. --Falcorian (talk) 19:12, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Average time by position 

message: sent by someone with a radio show, please do not bother. We are not interested. Thanks-- Dlohcierekim  (talk) 17:20, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  If you were  

message: It's reported that Bo Jackson did not attend the 1986 NFL Combine. That would invalidate claims that he ran a 4.12 at said combine as stated in 40-yard dash#Records. I can't find the original article from The Sporting News to verify.
https://www.raiders.com/news/bo-knows-40-yard-dashes-20411732 AmericanNinja80 (talk) 21:22, 12 July 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bo Jackson 1986 Combine