Talk:Isambard Kingdom Brunel

message: The article claims that the RN commissioned Brunel to carry out the famous trial of HMS Rattler vs. HMS Alecto to settle the paddle vs. screw argument. However the RN's commission was in 1844 to study different forms of screw propeller and the paddle comparison wasn't until the following year. Is there any reference to support Brunel being involved with this later trial too? Surely Brunel had already made his own mind up and would hardly have been regarded as an impartial judge?
It's also worth noting that the Great Britain had already been launched before both of these trials. Brunel's own die was already cast. Andy Dingley (talk) 02:47, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: You are right, I have removed that and put in a reference to the tests he conducted on the steam tug Archimedes. I think this may come from mis-information from Adam Hart Davis in a TV programme. Jezhotwells (talk) 15:11, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Brunel, Rattler & Alecto 

message: There used to be a pub, in Bristol, called 'The Great Engineer' - the pub sign was of Brunel.  The address was Goodhind Street, Bristol - BS5 0ST.  I don't know whether the pub is till there [possibly knocked down, with flats built on the site].  Can any one confirm.  Is the [former??] existence worth mentioning?
Autochthony wrote 2050z 4th December 2009.   86.151.60.238 (talk) 20:48, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Recognition

message: Whilst I'm not sure enough work has been done to restore Featured Article Status, I think the article is at least a Good Article. Does a more involved editor want to nominate it. If it fails the GA nomination, then it's still at least B class, and I've rated it as such for Wikiproject Bristol with this edit NullofWest Fill the Void 15:28, 14 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I have a significant rewrite in the works, and plan to go through GA and FA after that. It might could skate through GA as is, but I'd rather have it in great shape first. Maralia (talk) 17:47, 14 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Good article still? 

message: Did he die or did the gauge?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dr.queso (talk • contribs) 05:10, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: It Died

message: In the Thursday Next books, which are more or less based out of Swindon, a character named Isambard Kingdom Buñuel makes small but frequent appearances as an eccentric and brilliant book engineer.  Something worth including?  I was shocked and amused to come across this article and find that the character was inspired by a real person.
66.108.94.198 (talk) 21:51, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think so, this sort of trivia is not suited to an encyclopaedia, perhaps a passing mention in the article on the books. Jezhotwells (talk) 22:03, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jasper Fforde cameo? 

message: Brunel was not just a civil engineer, but also nautical and mechanical. The first paragraph should be modified. DesmondW (talk) 18:42, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Engineer 

message: It can't possibly have been part of Brunel's vision (in the 1830s) for the Great Western Railway that passengers should cross the Atlantic on the 'Great Eastern', not built until the late '50s! I changed it to 'Great Western', which was contemporary. 
86.181.115.142 (talk) 13:23, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Great Eastern 

message: Perhaps we should mention that I.K. Brunel is a major figure in the alternative-history novel The Difference Engine. He succeeds the fictionalized Lord Byron as prime minister. --Christofurio (talk) 00:12, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: No, because Brunel's relevance to a novel does not mean that the novel has any relevance to Brunel. Andy Dingley (talk) 00:36, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: The Difference Engine

message: Born 9 April 1806 Weybridge, England... Or The son of French civil engineer Sir Marc Isambard Brunel and Sophia Kingdom Brunel, Isambard Kingdom Brunel was born on 9 April 1806 in Portsmouth, Hampshire. ...Which is it, as currently this article contradicts itself.  92.233.49.173 (talk) 18:21, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: His older sisters were born in Weybridge, but by the time IKB was born, they'd moved to Portsmouth to work on the block making machines. Andy Dingley (talk) 21:38, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks Andy.  Probably worth getting that right. 92.233.49.173 (talk) 19:57, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  One of the best early life descriptions I've read (good for Marc too) is in the first of a trilogy of Brunel books that aren't well known: Stephen K Jones' Brunel in South Wales.  Well recommended, as they cover lots of Bruneliana that's poorly covered elsewhere. Andy Dingley (talk) 20:37, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Born where?

message: Having recently read Rolt's biography, I might start working on this article to see if I can't get the article back to FA status. Initially, I'll use Rolt and the 1870 biography to write the article before checking with a third book. Anyone have any suggestions as to authoritative sources?I'll open a Peer Review when I'm done. Edgepedia (talk) 12:27, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Rolt would be a bad move. He's the one originally responsible for most of the myths about Brunel.  The main books on Brunel I'd look at would be Brindle, Stephen K. Jones' Welsh trilogy and Brunel Junior's. It's a mark of just how bad this article is at present that these aren't already here (except Brunel Junior). Andy Dingley (talk) 13:20, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Thanks, this could have saved me a lot of work. I'll see if I can get hold of at last one of these sources. Edgepedia (talk) 13:33, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  These books look expensive. I think I'll unwatch this and move on. I could copyedit the text, removing peacock phases, etc, but perhaps that would give it a gloss it doesn't deserve. I'll perhaps come back later, but I have a comment: One thing that's not clear in the article is that the Great Western (ship) sailed before the Great Western Railway opened. Care is needed in designing a structure for the article to allow for readers to get to know the man (this is a biography) without it becoming disjointed. Edgepedia (talk) 16:07, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Brindle's cheap because you can often pick copies up in the cheapie bookshops. Brunel Junior is on Google and there's also an affordable reprint for the bicentenary (links are in the article on balloon flange girders). Even Jones is reasonable money, although you are after three volumes for the set!  I found mine in our local library by accident, then bought them. As I've also heard him speak locally a couple of times, I don't know if he had a hand in how our tiny town's library acquired them. Andy Dingley (talk) 18:39, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Adrian Vaughan wrote a biog of IKB, and in the preface/foreword/introduction/something he warns us about the problems with Rolt. --Redrose64 (talk) 19:40, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  What's in Rolt isn't too bad, the problem is that he misses out large amounts of Brunel's admittedly vast body of work. This leads to an over emphasis on some pieces, those that are now well-known, to the level where one museum in Bristol recently had a caption describing "Brunel's bridge" in Bristol (i.e. the only Brunel bridge in Bristol), when that's the one he didn't even build. We also have at least two surviving Brunel bridges, in London and Bristol, that were only recently rediscovered. Andy Dingley (talk) 21:50, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Getting article back to FA status 

message: * As to "What's wrong with this article" then just from the intro:
::As a result of the Railway Regulation (Gauge) Act 1846, the gauge was changed to standard gauge throughout the GWR network.
::Brunel astonished Britain by proposing to extend the Great Western Railway westward to North America
: The 1846 Gauge Act had no direct effect on the GWR's broad gauge network, it merely specified the use of standard gauge for new lines. The South Wales Railway of 1850 (authorised by its act of 1845) was broad gauge. The Vale of Neath and the South Wales Mineral Railway, amongst others, were even later and still broad gauge. For routes to Cornwall, broad gauge didn't go out of service until nearly 50 years after the Act and certainly not because of its provisions.
: Britons should not have been 'astonished' by a GWR plan to extend to North America by steamship, as it had always been part of the plans for the railway West from London and was part of the original prospectus for the South Wales and the Bristol and South Wales Union Railways for it to head west into Pembrokeshire and construct such a transatlantic port. Andy Dingley (talk) 03:09, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Intro

message: There are talks about the Brunel/GWR track gauge(s) at  WT:UK railroads and {RailGauge} talk. -DePiep (talk) 18:51, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: And then we get ignorant crap like this, which takes a grossly inaccurate section and manages to make it even worse. Andy Dingley (talk) 22:52, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  The 7-foot "Brunel" railway track gauge(s) 

message: The :Category:Bridges of Isambard Kingdom Brunel has only 18 entries, two of which are not full bridge articles. Surely there must be more Brunel bridges worthy of full articles. Is some editor up to the challenge?--DThomsen8 (talk) 20:38, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Your appeal seems to have had some result at least: Special:Contributions/82.132.216.184  8-(   Andy Dingley (talk) 22:53, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bridges of Isambard Kingdom Brunel 

message: The citations were a mixture of types.  I've converted all the bare text and bare URL types to templates.  There were a number of bare short forms, I've changed then to .  There were also a few  forms which for sake of uniformity I've converted to .  There are still some short form references using named refs that I'll have a go at tomorrow (it's 23:24 UK time and I'll be off to bed shortly).
Question: after I've finished the tidying, there will be a mixture of in-line citations and short form citations.  WP:CITE indicates that there should be only one type on a page, but also warns against changing the citation type without discussion.  However "Others will improve the formatting if needed".  I propose over the next week to convert all citations to  with appropriate reference entries.  This will:
* Ensure uniformity of style
* Avoid unnecessary duplication of details
* Allow "tool tips" and cross linking to function.
- any comments or objections? Martin of Sheffield (talk) 23:27, 13 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I added some page numbers and a couple of additional references. I would support sfn throughout and will try to look at some more of the references.— Rod talk 21:01, 14 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks.  Be careful though, there's one of the senior editors redoing my work so I'll be backing off for a while, I've plenty to do without locking horns with someone who has done 20 times as much as me! Martin of Sheffield (talk) 21:25, 14 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I always try to be careful... but I do wonder what a senior editor is - everyone's contribution is welcomed. There are several books in the Notes section (with isbn etc) which could be moved into the References section & sfn applied.— Rod talk 21:29, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

text:  Basically, your changes all used  (also known as ), which the article did not previously use - it used a mixture of , ,  etc. - this is known as . CS1 and CS2 should not be mixed on the same page, so I altered all those  to the most appropriate CS1 template. --Redrose64 (talk) 21:32, 14 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations 

message: The article (at the moment) mentions in its introduction that Brunel developed the SS Great Britain, "the largest ship ever built" when it was launched (with 322 ft). 
It is a pretty bold claim considering that the page describing the Chinese treasure ships casualy mentions ships ranging between 400 and 600 feet in 15th century China, and as long as 425 feet in 3rd century BC Greece.
It is rather difficult to be that sure of the numbers, so shouldn't we play it safe, and call it rather "the largest steamship ever built" or something similar?
Since I am not a regular contributor, I leave the matter to your hands.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.67.179.126 (talk) 20:35, 27 March 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  SS Great Britain: The largest ship ever built 

message: I'm not too happy with "Brunel's name is an amalgamation of his parents' names. He inherited the family name of his father, and his middle name is his mother's surname. This was a common name construction for the time".  This particular construction was common at other times, up to and including the 20thC.  I have no information either way for current trends since 2000.  I'm tempted to remove the final sentence, but then we are back to regarding it as special ("unique" as one editor has put it).  Alternatively "This was not an uncommon construction, then as now".  Any better ideas? Martin of Sheffield (talk) 10:06, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: No objection to removal. Alternative suggestion also seems fine to me. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:16, 23 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name 

message: Trivial, I know but more than once there have been edits in either direction. According to the OED, 'to orient' is the earlier verb and is still good British English; a structure which has been 'oriented' then has an 'orientation'; UK English seems to regard this as leading (by back-formation) to the verb 'to orientate' (which most UK readers would, I think, tend to use in casual speech) but US English regards that back-formation as a vulgar error. Since there is much to be said on both sides, and 'orient' can't be dismissed as not British English, I have ventured to offend both sides by substituting 'aligned'. I hope that's a blue beret intervention, not a blue helmet one.  Rjccumbria (talk) 18:37, 6 April 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Good idea, well done. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 21:58, 6 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Box Tunnel: oriented or orientated ? can we agree on aligned ?? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Isambard Kingdom Brunel. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: When you drag your cursor over "Somerset Bridge," something else--a train station, as I recall--pops up instead. I don't know how to fix that. Land o Dixie (talk) 16:17, 1 November 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: The bridge is just to the south of Bridgewater station, and is written up in the same article.  The link is actually to Bridgwater_railway_station#Somerset_Bridge which is the section dealing specifically with the bridge.  There's nothing to fix. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 16:32, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

text: (ec) That isn't a problem, it's normal behaviour for a piped link and/or redirect to that section of the target article. "Somerset Bridge" doesn't (yet) have it's own article, so this is the nearest internal link. Regards. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:34, 1 November 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Somerset Bridge" problem  

message: IKB is categorised in 'Great Western Railway people' where he is deliberately ordered under '.'. (I tried to clean the speck off my screen before realising what it was.) I had to go and check why it happened because it looked so weird, with the full stop being smaller than the bullet point. I presume that it is intentional and done to put him at the top of the list. Why? Granted he is very important, but I have found no guidelines about messing about with the surname sort order just to put one person at the top of the list. And if he needs to be so prioritised, wouldn't '1' give a better result?--Verbarson (talk) 21:33, 23 March 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: The dot was added by  in  during May 2017. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 23:15, 23 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category entry under '.' 

message: "During this time, he also learned fluent French ..."
You can learn French (or any language) and speak it fluently but you cannot *learn* fluent French.Haynesta (talk) 15:25, 28 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early Life 

message: It is appropriate for this article to use British English spelling, but not to enforce it when quoting quoting an American source.Stearnes, R.E.C. "Toredo, or Shipworm." The American Naturalist, Vol. 20, No. 2 (Feb. 1886), p. 136. What spelling did The American Naturalist print? -- Verbarson  talkedits 17:49, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: We don't copyedit attributed quotations. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 18:58, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I posted the comment because  may have done just that; on the other hand they may have access to the original source and be correcting an incorrect quotation, so I refrained from 'uncorrecting' it. (That issue of the Naturalist does not appear in the online archive.) -- Verbarson  talkedits 19:17, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tunne''ll''ing?