Talk:Asian witchcraft

message: Contains nothing except for a short sentence on Indian witchcraft which is common knowledge. Delete. — Stevey7788 (talk) 01:00, 9 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Untitled 

message: Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Asian witchcraft 01:06, 10 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: from vfd

message: The Japanese section mentions two kinds of mages in Japanese culture, the Fox employing kind and the snake employing kind.  However, there is a description of the fox kind without a complementing Snake kind.  I suggest one be added or the line be redacted.  Catzilla4 (talk) 06:00, 24 August 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia just summarizes sources.  We've got a source that mentions both, but more sources discussing the fox familiar: hence the current format.  Adding more about the snake without adding more sources, or removing the line about the snake familiars, would go against WP:UNDUE. Ian.thomson (talk) 11:57, 24 August 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: The former option I meant because it seemed that with so little information on them, that it was unverified.  I meant in the latter option to find some sources and add the information from them in.  I will see if I can find more information on snake familiars to add to this section.Catzilla4 (talk) 02:45, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you saying that the citation given does not mention snake familiars?  If not, then it's verified.  Ian.thomson (talk) 03:00, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Snake familiars 

message: So, just to be clear, this article on Asian witchcraft concentrates on the Hebrew Bible, the New Testament and Islam, saying virtually nothing about any sort of witchcraft beliefs or practices that are native to actual Asian cultures. And while it can be argued that all three religions are certainly heavily practiced in and around Asia, the title of this article is thus misleading. It references but makes no distinction between the Western concept of witchcraft and what is actually practiced as religion in Eastern cultures. I came looking for information on what is deemed witchcraft in the Pacific islands, Korea, China, Tibet, India, Malaysia ... simple answers to things like, what does Shinto think about witchcraft? or Buddhism? What does witchcraft look like in Thailand? what's the difference between Asiatic shamans and Asiatic witches? There's nothing here of substance outside a nod to Japanese anime (of course) and kitsune. Out of the entire Indian subcontinent we get two sentences, both crime statistics. This article is embarrassing. No mention of the penanggalan witches of Malay? The tale in Japan of Uheita and the Witch? The Balinese witch Tjalon Arang and her magic book? How a witch turned Prince Ulay of the Philippines into an ape? (all these references come from Jan Knappert's excellent book, Pacific Mythology, pages 325-326) And that's just one book. How does Chinese Black Magic play into this? Animal familiars? Kulam? Onmyōdō? Makutu? Tohunga? Daayan? As you notice almost everything I talk about are already articles found in Wikipedia with a minimum amount of effort, so I'm not suggesting anything radical when I say that I would like to work on this article, but I first want to remove 90% of the content concerning the Middle East, and concentrate on actual Asian witches, since there is a lot of research on the subject but what is presented here is embarrassing. Xenomorph erotica (talk) 14:28, 29 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Not only that but this article brings up Middle Eastern magic and never even once brings up Kabbalah! This article is a freaking joke Nightfall217 (talk) 23:12, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:   Yes, technically in West Asia, but the predominance was really throwing off the balance of this articles (and others), so it was spun off into Witchcraft in the Middle East. Perhaps you have views to add there? Skyerise (talk) 19:11, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Middle East is now Asia? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: It has been proposed that the section on the Middle East be split into a new article, Witchcraft in the Middle East.
* Support: Asia and the Middle East really are two very different domains. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 18:22, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed split to [[Witchcraft in the Middle East]] 

message: Should this article keep or remove this material on the Korean mudang or "shamans"? Midnightblueowl (talk) 10:49, 4 March 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: From discussions at the Talk Page, it seems that the main reason for including the mudang here is the fact that Korean Protestants accuse mudang of trafficking with demons. That, however, does not make them witches. Moreover, Christians (of many kinds) commonly believe that all non-Abrahamic (and sometimes even Abrahamic) religions are trafficking with demons. This is a common Christian accusation against Hindus, for example. If we include the mudang in an article on Asian witchcraft on this basis, then we would also have to include Hinduism in this article, and probably also Shinto, and Chinese folk religion, and Mongolian shamanism - any Asian religion, in fact, that some Christians believe ultimately venerates demonic beings. Midnightblueowl (talk) 11:00, 4 March 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Everyone knows there are no such thing as witches. There is only the hunt, and it is the hunt that defines the witch. Mudang have been hunted as witches. Historically, this deserves documentation, just as all the other witch hunts do. Chinese shamanism is already in the article: they were hunted as witches by Confucians. Skyerise (talk) 04:22, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

text: This shows that mudang have been considered witches by Christians in Korea since 1890. Skyerise (talk) 11:40, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

text: *Fair enough. Could we use these sources more heavily (I don't think they are presently used at all) and thus offer a short paragraph just explaining how the mudang have been accused of witchcraft, and by whom? The present text just seems excessively lengthy and not focused on witchcraft accusations itself. Midnightblueowl (talk) 13:47, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: *I already added material from the last source just after I posted these here. I don't see how it is too long, the whole section details historical and ongoing persecution - nothing else is covered... Skyerise (talk) 19:22, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  RfC: Should this article cover the Korean mudang ('shamans')?