Talk:Jews/Archive 9

message: I archived the 74 KB talk page, because it seemed to me many discussions had become self-perpetuating. JFW | T@lk 11:33, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Archived the talk page

message: I'l present back the disputes I find interesting. Others can restore the ones they are attending in / pushing forward.
:Could you sign, please? You may have noted that some snowballed discussions have been stopped as a results of my move. JFW | T@lk 00:34, 3 Sep 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: The article is disputed thus it is not feasible to backup all of the talk page

message: My take on this: I'm am not aware of any documented atrocities happening in the working camps (Danny seems to know otherwise/better?), except towards the end of the war lack of food and hygiene. The article should first of all point out that the concentration camps were not only for the Jews and there didn't happen any organized killing there. The camps weren't even initially built for the ethical Jews - they were for criminals and political dissents.
Then the PC history records, that there were the six? exterminations camps (Rudolf Hess confesses three in Nuremberg trials), which were used to gas Jewish/Roma/Soviet POW victims to death. They should be mentioned AND the number of these camps should also be noted, so the reader makes a clear distiction between a normal and an extermination camp. 141.76.1.122 15:32, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Dispute about the nature of concentration camp versus extermination camp:

message: Restored back. 141.76.1.122 15:32, 31 Aug 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Dispute about the nature of the whole wikipedia Jew article: neo-Nazi's, White nationalist and Jewish agenda

message: Have an easy fast, and a joyous Sukkot everyone--Josiah 09:24, 23 Sep 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  A non-controversial topic :) 

message: I'm sorry, I'm still learning how this Wiki stuff works.  Anyway I wanted to suggest to edit the Karaite section to add that the Jewish authorities in the Nazi era also denied the Jewishness of Karaites in order to save them from the Nazis.  69.70.145.243 00:03, 24 Sep 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: It would probably go better in the Karaite_Judaism page.--Josiah 14:58, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Karaites 

message: Many members of Stormfront have been quite open about their goals on Wikipedia, and you can find that information [www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=149686&highlight=wikipedia here].  The players so far:
* Igor is none other than [www.stormfront.org/forum/search.php?searchid=411786 Svyatoslav Igorevich], an active, dues-paying member of Stormfront.  Location: Charleston, S.C.
* 62.252.0.5, aka [www.stormfront.org/forum/search.php?searchid=411906 Enforcer]. Location: U.K.
Feel free to update this list.  --Viriditas 23:26, 15 Oct 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Stormfront

message: Taking a lesson from the techniques used by Jayjg and colleagues "to add an NPOV balance" to Muhammad al-Durrah, Palestine Children's Relief Fund and Medical Aid for Palestinians articles, I will be adding an NPOV balance to this and other articles by including Robert Faurisson and Ernst Zündel's critiques of the veracity of claims about extermination camps. These don't reflect my POV on the subject but, like Jayjg, I feel it necessary to "just report who says what" in an effort to bring NPOV balance to these articles. --Alberuni 20:33, 23 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: The article is about Jews, not about the Holocaust or Holocaust Denial.  Please put material in the appropriate articles. Jayjg 03:24, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: If this article is going to discuss the extermination camps, then it is only appropriate to add balance by providing the critiques by other groups. This adding of balance is akin to your insistence that NGO Monitor's opinion be included in articles about Palestinian NGOs like Medical Aid for Palestinians, Palestine Children's Relief Fund, etc and that IDF investigations and Atlantic Monthly articles denying IDF responsibility be included in articles about the IDF murder of Muhammad al-Durrah. I'm sure you will understand. --Alberuni 03:43, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)

text: I understand all too well; the Holocaust article deals with Holocaust Denial Jayjg 04:18, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)

text: I trust that you will clean up those articles as I have cleaned up Muhammad al-Durrah, Palestine Children's Relief Fund and Medical Aid for Palestinians of irrelevant material, as suggested by Mirv/Noone Jones on my Talk page. --Alberuni 06:28, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Deleting criticisms of those NGOs by an organization which monitors NGOs is hardly "clean[ing] up" "irrelevant material", but something entirely different.  Holocaust Denial material belongs in the Holocaust denial page. Jayjg 06:36, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: How is it different? Critiques by POV organizations need to be moved out to their own pages. I've explained it 5 times to you.--Alberuni 07:05, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Opinion about NGOs belongs on various NGO pages; for example, criticism of the Anti-Defamation League is found on the Anti-Defamation League page, including many links. So too with Greenpeace etc.  Now is your claim that Holocaust Denial is actually not historical revisionism, but rather a "critique" of Jews?  Or is it that Jews are an NGO? Jayjg 07:16, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Adding an NPOV balance to the Nazi section of the Jew article