Talk:Islam/Archive 12

message: Semiprotected like Moslem to deal with recurring vandal. DJ Clayworth 22:33, 3 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Semi-Protection

message: Could someone add some information on what virtues are considered most important among believers and practitioners of Islam?
Dominio 15:52, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That would vary from teacher to teacher, sect to sect. It is a huge topic. Better to explore this via material in the references and links. Zora 21:51, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Virtues of Islam

message: The list of See alsos is completely random and totally useless to anyone wanting to find out more about Islam. We had a reader asking questions at the Qur'an article the other day -- what does the Qur'an say about women? war? and other such hot topics. I pointed him to the correct articles -- the same ones that have endured trench warfare for the last year or two -- and then started thinking about why he would even ask such a question. 
Seems to me it's because the hot topics are also the ones where the combat is hottest, and no one wants to send readers there. So we end up sending people to anodyne topics like Dawa and Adhan, which don't answer the questions they want answered. 
I'll think this over and then come back with a list of suggested see alsos. Perhaps other people can think of lists? ones that emphasize the hot, difficult topics? Zora 10:47, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  See also 

message: I might be wrong but how can anyone read "Daud" as "Dawood," which is David's arabic name.  I suggest that transliterating names should be made to sound like the original even if it might look a little funny to the average english speaker/reader.
--A.Khalil 02:08, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The prophet "Daud" (David) 

message: CltFn added edited the intro in the following way:
"
Islam (Arabic: الإسلام; al-islām (listen (help•info)), "submission (to the will of the Islamic god)") is a monotheistic faith, one of the Abrahamic religions, and believed by some sources to be the world's second-largest religion. Followers of Islam are known as Muslims. Muslims believe that the entity they call God revealed his alleged divine word directly to mankind through many prophets and that Muhammad was the final prophet of Islam.
"
First of All: When we say "Muslims believe that God revealed his divine word directly to mankind through many prophets and that Muhammad was the final prophet of Islam." then it is what Muslims believe and not what Non-Musilms believe. The change is unjustified to my mind.
Secondly, "submission (to the will of God)" was replaced with "submission (to the will of the Islamic god)"). 
This change is not honest for the following reasons:
In the Christianity article we read:
"Jesus Christ as God"
This should be changed to 
"Jesus Christ as christian god"
Please note that to jews, Christians are worshiping a different God. Jews are forbiden to enter Churches BUT they can enter mosques. 
See : http://www.askmoses.com/qa_detail.html?h=255&o=2400
Jews recognize Islamic God, but don't recognize Christian God. 
Christians recognize Jewish God but not Islamic God. 
Muslims recognize Jewish God but not Jesus as God.
Now, CltFn please tell me should I go over all the Christian related articles and change God with “christian god”?
--Aminz 04:12, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It has nothing to do with the Christian article. The point is that you are using a monotheistic POV in the intro as though the Islamic God was everyone else's. The Islamic God is particular to islam and that is the NPOV that we should present.--CltFn 05:47, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes... but still, I don't understand most of your deletions/changes either -- what you remove as like a "sermon" is valid information that is important to understanding Islam. It's not prosletyzing. I'd never convert, but I'd be interested to know what the Islamic creed is, for instance. How is providing that information POV? I've reverted to reinstate the information that you deleted; I think that your edits to the first paragraph are questionable, but if you make those particular edits again I, for one, will let them be. Hbackman 06:01, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  CltFn, I really think that your version is just overly verbose. Once we've said 'Muslims believe...' we don't need to add caveats to every clause in the rest of the sentence. We've stated it is their belief so the reader can assume that their belief is their own POV. Ashmoo 06:27, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  CltFn, My whole argument is that why you have left all other articles on Christianity and Judaism and only want to change this article. Can't your argument be applied to those articles as well? --Aminz 06:42, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, this is not new of CltFn, he has done this a lot in the past to start a revert war on many Islamic articles and now he's trying it here. He never understood is that God in the monotheistic use of Judaism, Islam and Christianity is very different from god of other religions such as Hinduism. --a.n.o.n.y.m   t 17:14, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent edits of [[User: CltFn]] 

message: I don't know if this issue has been discussed before and if so, what the outcome was: the 'Beliefs' section outlines the main Sunni and Shia beliefs, but I think there should at least be a subsection on the five pillars of Islam, as it's one of the first things that non-Muslims, when first learning about Islam, associate (rightly so, as they are compulsory for most Muslims) with the religion. MP   (talk) 18:30, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I added references to three articles, including the Five Pillars of Islam, but I didn't add a sub-section because that may be considered too Sunni-centric. joturner 22:45, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Beliefs section and 5 pillars 

message: Is the phrase peace be upon him after mentioning the prophet appropriate for an encyclopedia article? This implies a narrative / personal article and potentially bias. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.3.154.95 (talk • contribs) .
:I have since removed them. They must have been snuck in, in between other vandalous edits. Feel free to remove them in the future. Pepsidrinka 20:38, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Peace be upon him