Talk:Chaldean/Archive 1

message: Asm cc 11:29, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: you are looking for the Khaldi article. This page should allow simple disambiguation between (1) Chaldean Christians, (2) Chaldeans=Assyrians/Babylonians in Hellenism, and (3) the Caucasian Chaldeans (Khaldi). dab (ᛏ) 14:13, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

message: there are three main meanings, (1) ancient Babylonian; (2) modern "Chaldeans/Assyrians" (properly, Neo-Arameans); (3) Khaldi. Disambigation should be by these three main meanings, with sublists for derived terms (languages etc.) dab (ᛏ) 08:54, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: you need to say what you mean by "Chaldean civilization". I just said that the term is equivalent to "Babylonian". Your distinction of "ethnic Assyrians" vs. "ethnic Babylonians" is pointless. dab (ᛏ) 11:50, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

text: I just can't stop laughing :D Chaldean 23:31, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: disambig

message: Chaldeans are not ethnically Assyrians as thought by many. People have misunderstood about the Nestorian Church and it's people and belevie that all of members of the Nestorian Church was of Assyrian origin and it's here where many are wrong. The Nestorian Church consisted of the majority of all the Christians in the middle East and Turkey because they were promised protection from the Persian Empire because both the Nestorians and Persians were threatned by the Byzantite Empire which disallowed the practice of the Nestorian faith of Christianity. When the Nestorian Church split apart, there were two rival leaders, Mar Shimun XIII Denha, the leader of the Assyrian Church which was located in Dyiarbakir (today's Turkey, where the Assyrians escaped after the defeat by the Chaldeans, when they were forced to relocate), and Yohanan Soulaqa VII was elected as a Patriach in Alqosh, the leader of the Chaldean Catholic Church (today's northern Iraq, around 300km away from Babylon, well inside the area which Chaldeans conquered and settled in).
There is no 100% guarantee that all of today's Chaldean are of Chaldean origin and the same with Assyrians due to the many war which made so many people relocate, and even when the Chaldeans conquered the Assyrians, there may have been a couple of thousand left hiding in the land of today's northern Iraq.
To conclude with, Most Iraqi Assyrians are Ethnically Chaldeans or must have been of either greek, persian or arab descandent because every single of their towns were heavily demolished and destroyed and the survivors had no choice but to escape to the neighbouring countries. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 124.184.131.93 (talk • contribs)10:17, 26 October 2006 . 
The Chaldean church and the Chaldean Language is completely different from that of the Assyrian people. Is there any proof in the pudding to prove the views of the Assyrian people who state that Chaldeans are ethnically Assyrians. The fact is this, if the Chaldeans deterioted the Assyrian people, and burnt down the city of Nineveh causing the Assyrians to flee, how could it be that they exist more then the Chaldeans? It is about time that the Assyrian people stop denying their history and past, accept they got defeated and furthermore do not re-instate that Chaldeans are Assyrians. If the Chaldean and Assyrian people were one people why is it that the Assyrian People don't wish to be called Chaldeans, Why is that the Chaldean people don't wish to be called Assyrians? It just goes to show that they are completely different people, with a different race and religion. I dont see how the two link. Please do not laught as this issue please dont, as this is a very serious issue which needs to be resolved so that the truth is out for the people to know, so that the historical fact and sources are shown and to show that the cracks appear through the bias Assyrian opinion in our world today.
Chaldean_Warrior 17:07, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: With all due respet, that's where you're wrong, Chaldean_Warrior. The Assyrian and Chaldean languages are both dialects of the Aramaic language, and are very similar; they are both Neo-Aramaic languages, although I think the Chaldean language is more influnced by the Arabic language (sorry if I'm wrong on that last part). The only difference between the modern Assyrian and Chaldean people is that Assyrians are adherents to the Church of the East, and the Chaldeans are adherents to the Chaldean Catholic Church. The term "Chaldean" was used by the Pope in the 17th century to distinguish the two. The fact that Chaldeans don't want to be called Assyrian has nothing to do with the truth; the reason they don't want to be called Assyrian is because for many generations, they have enforced the title designated by the then-Pope and Roman Catholic Church. Also, there are many sources which attest to the significant continued presence of Assyrians throughout Northern Mesopotamia. Please do your reading before you make your accusations.Šarukinu 03:39, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chaldeans are not Ethnically Assyrians 

message: The chaldeans back then were cowards and we chaldeans of today are ehtnically Assyrians, the chaldeans back then were cowards because the only point in time where they could take on the assyrians was when the assyrians had no king and when the chaldeans had a cowardly allegiance with the Medes. And even then when they did take Nineveh it would be Embarassing of the Chaldeans to assume that they did the job, if you go to the british museum, the remains are EVIDENCE OF BARBARIC AND UNCIVILIZED WAY OF taking over a capital, by burning it down. I would like to thank the (blank) for his comments or should i say FACTS about your allegiance with the Medes. Without them you wouldnt even stand a chance COWARD. And you say that we are ethnically arab, well being a Chaldean (ethically Assyrian) i would have to say that our language is close to arabic than the assyrian is. Also i would have to say that The Assyrians have done so much more than we have, like create a flag before we copied their idea, start schools, tv channels, POLITICAL PARTIES, radio channels, countless clubs, and their NATIONAL celebration of the Assyrian New Year which celebrates the amount of years the Assyrians have been a civilization. In Chicago were i live, there is a Chaldean club were i go to and they are so racially intolerant of Assyrians, their are always fights between the Chaldeans and the Assyrians, because we narrow minded Chaldeans are too arrogant, but we Chaldeans are always going to their new years, and clubs and i have never dealt with any racial comments, only friendliness and kind Christian comments.
And another point i would like to make, the Chaldeans were Fooled by the Medes and destroyed, that just goes to show how gullible the Chaldeans were.
I would like to reinstate my point, WE CHALDEANS OF TODAY ARE NO ETHNICALLY CHALDEAN, BUT CHALDEAN BY RELIGION ONLY, so the only thing that differs us from the Assyrians is that of our Catholicism and their Orthodox. Thus meaning that Chaldean is not a nationality, but a religion, and why they have a flag i dont understand, and to the guy above me who seems kind of lost, its you who has mixed your blood with kurds and persians and ARABS, and lost the battle. We Assyrians, are not gullible, and we are kind hearted ACCEPTING christians, who admire (blanks) comments. Chaldo gangsta 21:29, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  ≈ You are a shame to the chaldean name asm cc and the person above me ≈ 

message: Firstly, i would like to point out how displeased i am with you about how low a level you have sunk in order to think of a decent comeback by involving my family, which has greatly offended me, i know it is of no use trying to dob you in because i know what your plan b is.
Secondly, If me and my family have listened to the Assyrians all our lives then please explain to me what you mean by FACT, maybe what you can replace it with is OPINION.
Thirdly, the scythians were our very very miniature allies who played a very small role, but the Medes were a much larger and stronger force and were more capable of destroying the Scythians yet like the Chaldeans were to afraid to take on the Assyrians alone.
Fourthly, yes the fact that the two brothers were jealous of eachother and both wanted the throne is true, but at least the throne was worth fighting for, i dont see any Chaldeans fighting over the throne i guess it wasnt as valuable as the Assyrian throne.
Fifthly, the Assyrians didnt cowardly flee to the mountain regions my friend, we used our wit and smarts to preserve our blood, unlike the chaldeans who have just mixed through with the kurds and arabs and persians, what a shame we couldnt preserve their valuable blood.
Sixthly, what was this smaller less populated army, and no matter what it was, our capital was barbarically taken away from us, our men and warriors savagely murdered, how would you expect us to react.
Seventhly, you are just contradicting yourself, first you say that we COWARDLY ran away from you, then you say that we were one of the mightiest empires, make up your mind. Also, the Chaldeans are being hypocryts by saying that we attacked that chaldeans with the help of the egyptians (which is yet to be proven therefore still considered untrue), we were only acting in retaliation to your actions with the assistance of the Medes, as you did to us when we attacked the Babylonian capital.
Eighthly, You are once again contradicting yourself, because we both know for a fact that my sources are the Assyriologists (chaldeology does not exist probably because it isnt worthy enough to be studied) and scholars of Chaldean heritage. I am yet to be informed of you extremely unreliable sources.
Ninethly, you cannot make assumptions like "I am probably more educated than you about this subject" because you are only making a fool of yourself, for all you know, you could be talking to a professor.
Tenthly, i would like to know, and please do not lie because that is shaming your nation and proving to yourself that you are losing, answer me this "WHERE DO YOU GET YOUR OPINIONS (NOT FACTS) FROM?????" what is your very unreliable source. You state that the Medes had the responsibility of taking Nimrud and Asshur and the Chaldeans took on Nineveh, i would be very interested in finding out.
Yours Cuttingly, Chaldo Gangsta Chaldo gangsta 06:32, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  You make me laugh 

message: I find it affending you personal attacking me when you call ma a shame to the Chaldeans when its you, an Assyrian who it to embarresed of his people so he makes an chaldean account to defend them cause he knows them are wrong, who is the one who is a shame to their people now.--- it seems you have alot of grammar problems in this paragraphChaldo gangsta 06:37, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  You got the best discussion, stop with the personal attacks and get to the facts 

message: I'm not sure what happened to this page, but it's been butchered. Firstly, it doesn't conform with MOS:DP in that the first words in bullets aren't capitalized, there are periods, sentence structure varies, etc. Secondly, disambiguation pages are supposed to be arranged according to similar categories, not periods of time. Thus, this page should be arranged according to languages/people/etc., not modern/ancient/whatever. For example, modern Chaldean Neo-Aramaic and the Urartian language should both be under "languages", not separated for some untold reason. --334 17:34, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Conformity 

message: Okay,as a reader I typed in "Chaldean" to find out about the people we in Michigan call "Chaldean Iraqis."  We have the largest Arab population in the United States, slightly over 1 million people, but some people confuse "Arab" with Muslim.  Our newspapers are always sure to tell readers that a large portion of our "Arabs" (middle easterners) are "Chaldean Iraqis" or "Chaldeans" which are also described as more Christian (in number) than Muslim.  Uh, I don't see any of this on the disambig page.  All I see are ancient civilizations and languages.  What about the modern people who live outside the Middle East and call themselves (or are called by the news media) Chaldeans?  Should this be added??  There's a reference but no link on the Michigan page under Demographics.  'splainin' needed! Gaviidae 08:59, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Apparently the link I was looking for was not there on 1 December but it's back and now I see it.  Assyrian 82.93.133.130 19:52, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Chaldean Iraqis

message: User Gaviidae reported there are over 1 million arabs in Michigan and that Chaldeans make up the majority. This is not true. There are more Muslims in Michigan than Chaldeans. I just checked www.michigan.gov census information and Michigan has over 10 million residents. Although the census information does not say how many Chaldeans there are in Michigan, because Chaldeans are "counted" as whites, so there is no real way to tell. My estimate is no more than 350,000 chaldeans in Michigan and I think the number is actually smaller, more like 200-250,000. Remember most of the Arabs in the Dearborn area are Muslim, not Chaldean. Chaldeans are also seen as "Middle Men" like the Koreans in Los Angeles. A Middle Man is an ethnic group that serves the lower class, this is done in the Detroit area through supermarkets, party stores, gas stations, etc. Sometimes there is racial tension between the Chaldeans and the black communites they are serving, because of this middle position. Gaviidae also reported "Chaldeans are not Arabs." Again, not true. We are Arab, I am an Arab-American. We speak a dialect of Aramaic and are from the Middle East. I don't think I am better than any other Arabs. I guess if you really want to get technical we are "Indo-European", just like Greeks and Armenians. Also I would like to add it is very dissapointing to to see Chaldeans and Assyrians fighting here. We should celebrate our similarities not our differences. Also, someone earlier said there is a Chaldean night club in Chicago where Assyrians and Chaldeans fight, name the club, because I doubt that is true. If anything it is Assyrians OR Chaldeans fighting WITH Muslims. Also I would like to add some Chaldeans I know supported the Iraq invasion in the beginning but almost all disapprove now. I am proud to say I was against it from the beginning and I can't wait for the Bush administration to be tried for war crimes, crimes against humanity, misleading the public...Fight the Bush Dynasty people, and the occupation of Palestine!!User:Detroitchaldean|Detroitchaldean]] 03:40, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Man you are completely lost. We are neither indo-european nor Arab. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 12.15.7.70 (talk) 18:04, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

text: And let's keep it relevant and discuss improvements that can be made to this article. Baristarim 04:37, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chaldean Population In Michigan 

message: Some of you people living amongst me in the diaspora are completely lost. Read the article above mine. Dude, you whoever wrote it, don't know anything about your people. We are in no way shape or form "Indo-European" though there may be slight chanes of some who may have some anscestory. Our language is semitic related to Hebrew and Arabic. Start reading something. We are not Arab though according to the definition by the Arab league we are if we either speak Arabic or come from an "Arab" country. However their definition is for their own political aims. We are Syriac Christians and speak modern forms of Syriac/Aramaic. You may call yourself Chaldean if you belong or had ancestory that belonged to the Chaldean church. You may call yourself Aramean if you speak Aramaic. You may call yourself Syriac if for the same reason. You are Assyrian however because that was our original homeland after the conquest of Sumer and Akkad by Sargon the Great. Understand that. He was our first King that united the lands of ancient Mesopotamia. We are not Arab. Do some reading please. I don't think you are very educated in this field. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 12.15.7.70 (talk) 18:13, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I am Chaldean. I am Assyrian. I am Syriac. I am an Aramean. I am not Arab. I am not European. I am not Asian. 

message: You are right, we are not Indo-European, although our culture is closer to them than it is to the Caucasians. Customs, food and way of life are very similar, although the Iraqi food is spicier due to the direct trade route Iraq has with India. Unfortunetly for us when you fill out a college application or census information there will be no choices for "Chaldean, Aramaic, or Syriac". So we will never know how many of us there really are. There are no choices for "Arab" either, rather the country, like India, or Pakistan. I guess I am lost in this aspect, but you did clear some of that up. I've done plenty of reading, I have a college degree, my major was not Middle Eastern Studies sorry to say. Of course you have the right to say "Chaldeans are not Arabs", and I understand WHY you are saying it, but that bumps you into the Caucasian category, because remember there is no acknowlegment of Syriac people in modern U.S. census, college or any other acedemic, or government info. (There are estimations, usually done by "one of us") So my point is, I identify closer to Arab Americans and Indo Europeans than the Caucasians, I hope that makes SOME sense. Maybe discussions like these will change things.20:28, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Simple Semantics 

message: Once again it has been prove that Chaldeans are not ethnically Assyrians. Yes the Chaldean Catholic Church derived from the Nestorian church, however, the Nestorian Church had not yet been given the name the Assyrian Church of the East, it was later on. The nestorian Church united the Chaldean, Syrian and the Assyrians into one people, the people of mesopotamia, the different people split and got back their unique identity again, however, there is a chance that some few of today's Chaldeans and Assyrians are not from the racial group as they believe that they are from due to the Nestorian Church which had united them as one people for such a long time.
Anyone who states that Chaldeans are ethnically Assyrians are influenced by all the propaganda of today's world. Just because someome supplies you with an internet article suggesting that Chaldeans are ethnically Assyrians doesnt necessarily make it true, from all we know it could be written by an assyrian, if you want the truth, visit official website which cannot be edited by anyone.
Asm ccc 05:30, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  For Chaldeans all over the world 

message: First and formost none of the "Assyrian" or "Chaldean" Emperors referred to themselves as such. They all referred to themselves as Kings of "Sumer and Akkad." Assyrian (Babylonian as well) was coined by the Greeks centuries after (in a historical context) to refer to those whom held Ashur as the supreme diety in the land of Sumer and Akkad for example as the Jews referred to southern Mesopotamia as "Shinar" which meant "land of the moon [god]." "Babylonia" was also coined by the Greeks to refer to southern Mesopotamia which had its "capital" in Bab-ilu aka Kadingirra aka "Babylon." Just as people in ancient Sumer and Akkad referred to themselves by the city-state they inhabbited and religion they followed so do the modern people, they refer to their ethno-religious group by village and/or "national" origin. "Chaldean" was also coined by the Greeks to refer to the last indegenous conquerors of "Babylonia." In reality in the Syriac language we ALL refer to ourselves as Sourayeh or Souryoyeh which is simply translated as Syrian in English which itself is Greek-derived from the designation of the former colonial territories of Assyria for they referred to Sumer and Akkad as Assyria and its colonies (Aram and Canaan) as Syria. That is it in a nutshell. We are Sourayeh/Souryoyeh and ultimately we are Assyrian, Babylonian, and the "Sons and Daughters of the Fusion of Sumer and Akkad." We are Chaldean as well and we are Aramaean as well. However if you want to get into semantics, some hold the God Ashur as one with the Christian God Yah(weh) aka "God the Father" which himself started out as the Canaanite storm god which was roughly equivelent to Ashur and interpreted by the "Hebrews" as the one God; the so-called "sky axle" or "Holder of Heaven" therefore we are THE true "Assyrians" in an ethno-religious sense. Also compare Yah to Ea and you will see the origins of the Abrahamic religions lie in the land that is now called Iraq. The Tsar is Gone but I am King 15:37, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  ASM, please... 

message: Sorry i have not been on for a long time to my busy schedule as an educator, however, i believe we are getting somwhere, tyou stated "We are Sourayeh/Souryoyeh and ultimately we are Assyrian, Babylonian, and the "Sons and Daughters of the Fusion of Sumer and Akkad." We are Chaldean as well and we are Aramaean as well" Thank you. I believe you are right, but why does it say in the front page of the article say that chaldeans are contemporary Assyrians
Asm ccc 00:21, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: but why does it say in the front page of the article say that chaldeans are contemporary Assyrians - because your Patriach says so. Chaldean 00:47, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

text: No offense, but who are you, a 15 year old in Austtralia, to tell the people in the homeland what is their identity? Take a look at these pictures; []. Do you see what I see? Chaldean Catholics waving the Assyrian national flag. Who are you to tell them they are not Assyrian? Why dont you go back to the homeland and talk to these people? Let us know if you have converted them. Chaldean 16:07, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Finally we are getting somwhere 

message: Chaldeans are Chaldeans, Asssyrians are Assyrians- that's just the way it is. Myself, being an ethnic Assyrian from Nineveh, or around that area ( I cant really be sure, since Assyria no longer exists- duh!!!!!), believe it's wrong us to attempt to claim another race, despite having very simliar cultures and launguage( the religion being the only major milestone towards complete unification?, to be ours.I am an Aturiah, and to all my Assyrian brothers- unite under our flag- and leave spaces under it for Assyrians- not Chaldeans.
Assyrian blood n veins 04:32, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So now everything in Wiki must be according to OED? How about using common sense and seeing what the world is saying by doing a simple search? Chaldean 23:39, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why are assyrians arguing? 

message: They don't have there own article?  --Vonones 23:02, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Or maybe a link to here  --Vonones 23:03, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chaldeans 

message: user:Chaldean has been bulling people into his beliefs, changing people's comments on this page into his own.  Putting peoples real names into this discussion page to scare them off.  He also scares them by saying he'll ban them.  But in all reality you are being reported.  Your sources & who you know, don't matter.  And Chaldeans are not Assyrians, or the contemporary of them.  That is that & deal with it.  We have different religions, languages, & beliefs.  We are not the same but we are human, we bleed the same, we all have hearts but to say we are the same your crazy....similar yes but same no.  And user:Chaldean for your reference where you put my real name here & said I was a hypocrite...no sir I said chaldeans & assyrians should unite & in no way did I say we are the same, I meant we should consider each other as family & not creating arguments. KALMANI (talk) 09:48, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: if you want to report user misbehaviour, report it to WP:ANI, and remember to post the relevant diffs. Yes, Chaldean has a history of misbehaving, but he is hardly the only one in the topic. It is almost impossible to maintain a minimum of sanity in the "Syriac" topics for all the hysterical nationalism thrown about. We'll need to clamp down on that sooner or later, but you can rest assured that besides wasting people's time, such pranks do not result in any actual effect. dab (𒁳) 10:39, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: thx dab for the info.  While I am kind of new to wikipedia,  I also know that the wrong info should not be passed around as truth.   user:Chaldean has been targeting me & threatening to ban me if I try to do anything.  That is why I am seeking adoption so I can fight back the right way & put him & others in there corner.  Wikipedia is about collaboration not using mafia tactics & bulling people what you believe in.  We should help each other not threaten each other. dab thanx again!  If you don't mind can you help me in editing or doing other things the right way in wikipedia. KALMANI (talk) 12:27, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Like dab has said, state your case and we will go from there. Chaldean (talk) 23:00, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: in the coming months...I will have my case stated & we will go on from there! KALMANI (talk) 13:19, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[user:Chaldean]] Should be banned for Bulling People into his Beliefs!