Talk:Castorocauda

message: If you look at the fossil itself, instead of to the fancy drawings made of it, is the tail really that similar in form to that of a beaver? ~:o\--MWAK 11:17, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I was noticing that as well.  The tail is dorso-ventrally flattened but nowhere near as wide as a beaver's.  The beaver similarity mostly comes from it being scaly and flat.  Though it seems to have more hair on its tail than a beaver.  I think a scaly platypus tail might be a better comparison.  --Aranae 15:24, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. And then even the flatness of the tail is incertain as the integument remains are rather 2D. Also I simply can't see the webbing of those presumed webbed feet. I get the feeling the animal was interpreted within the preconceived notion that it was semi-aquatic and that its qualities were not individually used to test this hypothesis.--MWAK 07:41, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

text: I also just noticed that the article compares the broadest of caudal vertebrae, C5, of Castorocauda to a narrow vertebra, C15, of Castor suggesting a similarity in adaptation.--MWAK 08:44, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Tail

message: "Castorocauda is not considered to be a mammal by most authorities. The technical, cladistic, definition of a mammal is the group containing all living mammals (including monotremes, placentals, and marsupials) and their descendants."
So there's no such thing as an extinct mammal? That can't be right. If that was true, then mammoths, sabertooth tigers, etc. wouldn't be considered mammals. Does anyone who understands this better than me want to shed some light on this?
Since it has hair and tiny auditory ossicles, it sounds like a mammal to me. I'm not an expert here (I have only a minor in Biology), but I understand that there are three main characteristics that make something a mammal: fur, middle ear ossicles, and mammary glands. It would be hard to prove or disprove the presence of mammary glands from a fossil, but the other two are documented. Why isn't it considered a mammal?
:Mammoths and sabertooth tigers are both members of Eutheria along with many modern mammals, so they're considered mammals.  In other words: the genera are extinct, but the higher taxa are not.  Order docodonta, on the other hand, is extinct with no modern descendants.  Therefore, Castorocauda lutrasimilis is not technically a mammal. You can see one interpretation of the phylogeny here. bcasterlinetalk 22:34, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What was meant was: the ancestor of all living mammals and its descendants, as Liriodendron emended in the article. So it is a "crown group" definition. To use characteristics alone for a definition is problematic and this practice is being abandoned. Would you call a pterosaur with fur, milk glands and middle ear ossicles (tricky to evolve but stranger things have happened :o) a mammal?--MWAK 11:55, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Castorocauda was definitely a synapsid, a monophyletic group defined as mammals plus all species more closely related to mammals than to birds, snakes, turtles, etc. However, the crown mammals (also monophyletic) are, by definition, the last common ancestor of placentals, marsupials, and monotremes; plus all of its descendants. Castorocauda was not a crown mammal, hence not a mammal in the narrowest sense. However, many scientists define mammals as a monophyletic group consisting of the crown mammals plus some but not all other synapsids. Under such a definition, Castorocauda would likely count as a mammal. A descendent of the pterosaurs would not be a mammal because then mammals wouldn't be monophyletic. In biology, the only valid taxa are those that are monophyletic.--Solomonfromfinland (talk) 00:01, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not a mammal? 

message: While this article is really interesting and all, I think that the subheadings ("Not quite a mammal", "Adapted to water") give a science magazine-esque feel to it. I can't really think of any replacements right now, but I think you get the point, so if anyone wants to go ahead and fix it, you have my support. Obli (Talk)? 23:00, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Subheadings 

message: I wanted to voice my objection to the move.  This animal was not a beaver in any sense, I have seen no reference using the term Jurassic beaver as an actual name, and the name only serves to mislead any readers.  --Aranae (talk) 22:52, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree, this move was ill-advised. Most prehistoric animals are refered by their scientific genus name. ArthurWeasley (talk) 15:32, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Name change

message: Just a question...Is it known that the specimen found was an adult, or could it have been a juvenile?  Upon reading that this species breaks the mold of the tiny Mesozoic mammal size, I wondered if it might actually have been much larger than the 1-2 lbs it is thought to have been.
Terryval (talk) 22:33, 30 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Juvenile or adult? 

message: It lived 154 - 150 million years ago.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.177.220.111 (talk) 11:20, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fossil range 

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thread_title:  External links modified