Talk:The Five-Forty-Eight

message: I just had a couple questions on the summary of the story. First, where did you find the story? In a quick google search you can find the story from the New Yorker so a citation can be made for that. Also, in the summary it states that he fired her which is sort of true, but human resources really fired her with encouragement of Blake. But, he was also out for the rest of the day to avoided Miss Dent. Also, at the end of the summary the last two sentences seem more opinion based than anything. Yes, the statements are correct but it doesn't directly state that in the story just alluded to it. Lastly, although it's a short but strong summary of the story, I think adding a little bit more detail could help in making the summary stronger along with a Critique section to make the Wiki page stronger as well. http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1954/04/10/the-five-forty-eight Dwperrotti (talk) 00:36, 6 April 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that adding a citation regarding the original publication will make the summary stronger.  And the summary would also benefit from more accurate language and elaborative detail Kbrowe (talk) 15:35, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Summary  

message: After viewing this page I was surprised to find a distinct lack of content. I would recommend separating the first section (identifying the article, publication, etc.) with the rest of the summary, and give the summary it's own section. As for the summary, I find it a little too cursory. A more detailed summary would help to flesh out the article, and do the story justice. The last two sentences seem very interpretive, and I'm not sure that I would agree with them. I would argue that the story is noteworthy because of Miss Dent. Her actions and the subsequent character growth seen in Blake make the story much more noteworthy than the fact that the story is told from Blake's perspective. Also, the article is missing a reference for the Benjamin Franklin Magazine Award and the Alfred Hitchcock Presents episode. Lastly, a reference to the story itself on the New Yorker website would be a good addition. JBiggs (talk) 17:21, 8 April 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I wholeheartedly agree. I will begin working on a Summary to add to the article, and clean up the up-front summary. I will also look into whether or not it won any more awards. Additions/critiques will be posted here. Dboyn1 (talk) 12:30, 10 April 2017 (UTC)

text: JBiggs, good idea... and linking to The New Yorker on Wikipedia would be a small contribution. Kbrowe (talk) 15:39, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Summary / Misc. Edits 

message: I am currently working on a infobox for this page. I am looking for suggestions for what to put for the genre, the picture in the infobox and anything else you guys and girls think of adding. What I have in it currently is the Author, Country, Language, Publisher, Media type, and Publication date. Lturb1 (talk) 00:16, 10 April 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: LOVE THIS IDEA!  I suggest adding it soon so that other editors can make contributions accordingly. Kbrowe (talk) 15:40, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox 

message: The summary could use more details instead of just the couple sentences that are used to explain it. More could be added about the plot and describing some key points of the story without revealing everything completely; such as Blake's character being a married man and the relationship with his wife. Although the story mainly dealt with his relationship with Miss Dent, there are vital details not accounted for that could help to understand the short story better. The summary should be able to give ample information of the short story that will reflects its key values. The word choice in the last couple sentences could make the article seem biased, maybe adding a source that you used could help credibility so it doesn't seem that way. Other readers may not agree with that last statement that was made. --Shellebryan (talk) 03:37, 10 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Summary/Content 

message: I have drafted a more detailed summary and included a Characters section for review. Please make critiques and recommendations.
JBiggs (talk) 12:26, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article Contribution Draft 

message: The story begins with Blake exiting an elevator at the building he works at in New York City. He immediately spots a woman in the crowd outside the elevator, an old acquaintance, and is troubled by it. He disregards her and continues out of the building, and begins to head for the train station to catch the express train home. As he began walking, Blake begins to wonder if the woman is following him. He stopped at a storefront and gazed in the window for a moment, until he notices the reflection of the woman standing near him on the sidewalk. He quickly begins walking again, now wondering if the woman means to do him harm in some way. He decides to stop at a men's bar in an attempt to lose his pursuer. As he drinks his beer, he reflects on his relationship with the woman, and the reader is introduced to the backstory behind the mysterious woman. She had been hired by personnel to be his personal secretary several months before. After working together for three weeks, Blake offered to buy her drinks after work. She invited Blake to her apartment where they had a drink and then had sex. The next day Blake waited until she was out for lunch and then called personnel and asked them to fire her. Blake then took the rest of the day off.
After reminiscing in the bar, Blake drinks a second beer and decides to head for the train station to catch the local train, the five-forty-eight. At the station Blake buys a newspaper and then boards his train and finds a seat. He notices two of his neighbors sitting near him, Mrs. Compton and Mr. Watkins, neither of whom Blake cares for. Blake begins reading his paper, but is soon interrupted as someone addresses him. He looks up to see it is the woman from before. He recalls her name, Miss Dent, and greets her. Miss Dent takes a seat next to Blake and they begin to make small-talk. Blake begins to feel uncomfortable and attempts to leave to another train car. Miss Dent stops him and informs him that she has a pistol in her pocketbook, and will kill him if he moves or tries to leave. Now that she has Blake's full attention, Miss Dent informs him that she only wants to talk. 
Miss Dent begins to explain how he she tried to contact Blake, but begins to ramble somewhat incoherently. She then urges Blake to read a letter she has prepared for him. The letter addresses Blake as her husband, details dreams she had and touches on her time spent in the mental hospital. Miss Dent interrupts Blake's reading by explaining how she has plotted against him, questioning whether she should kill him or not. The train then arrives at Shady Hill, Blake's destination. 
Blake is escorted off the train at gunpoint by Miss Dent, who urges him to continue away from the train station and leads him towards a freight house. She then tells Blake to stop and turn around. Miss Dent orders Blake to his knees, as she explains that she doesn't want to hurt him, merely teach him the lesson he would otherwise be incapable of learning himself. She tells him to put his face in the dirt, Blake does so and begins to weep. Then Miss Dent, having fulfilled her revenge, explains that she can now wash her hands of Blake. She then turns and walks back to the train station. Blake watches her go, and when it seems clear she has forgotten about him, he picks himself up and continues to walk home.
JBiggs (talk) 12:27, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: This summary is a lot better, it includes more of the details in the story, and expands on Miss Dent and Blake's relationship. Shellebryan (talk) 13:11, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  I agree with Shellebryan; this summary is a big improvement.  Minor c/e still needed.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kbrowe (talk • contribs) 15:44, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Summary 

message: Blake - The central character of the story. Blake is a middle aged businessman, most likely an executive, who works in New York City and commutes to the suburbs via the train. He is petty, narcissistic, and highly critical of those around him. Blake has trouble connecting with others, as is evidenced by his relationships with the other character in the story.  
Miss Dent - Blake's former secretary, and the second central character of the story. Miss Dent spent some time in a mental institution before being released and getting a job as Blake's secretary. She was fired abruptly after having a sexual encounter with Blake, and has spent the subsequent months trying to contact him.
Louise Blake - Blake's estranged wife, whom he only married for her looks. She has turned to alcohol to deal with alienation from her husband. She confides her marital troubles in Mrs. Compton, their neighbor. 
Charlie Blake - Blake's oldest son, who has recently made friends with the Watkins boy and has been spending an increasing amount of time residing at the Watkins' house.
Mrs. Compton - A neighbor of the Blake's and fellow commuter, she is a friend and confidant to Louise. She does not care for Blake due to the way he treats his wife.
Mr. Watkins - A neighbor of the Blake's, and the father of Charlie's friend. Mr. Watkins does not care for Blake after he was confronted about his lifestyle and Blake expressed that the Watkins were a negative influence on Blake's son Charlie.  
JBiggs (talk) 18:27, 23 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Characters 

message: This would be the beginning of the Critical Response section:  
Magill Book Reviews reviewed "The Five-Forty-Eight" in February of 1990. In this review, he/she talks about the plot and about the character Blake. The reviewer describes Blake's confidence being based off of his own "Self-Importance" and to be nothing more substantial than acting upon the "sumptuary laws" of the upper/middle class. He/she then goes on to explain Miss Dent's need to reclaim some of that self-respect she had lost sleeping with Blake. Also, by accomplishing her task of flowing Blake home to Shady Hill she had taught him a lesson, and more dignified and merciful than Blake. He/she finishes the review by talking about the ending and questioning whether Blake learned his lesson at the end of the story. He/she also explains that Blake might as well be Cheever's most unlikable character, and is remarkable for his callous attitude towards others. Along with confusing the sumptuary laws, moral obligations, and human responsibilities he lives by.Dwperrotti (talk) 13:01, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Critical Response  

message: Quentin Martin writes about the images within The Five-Forty-Eight. He explores multiple examples of imagery within the story. First he writes about when Blake was walking in downtown Manhattan and turns to see a plate of glass. Inside that was a domestic model that contained cups of coffee, magazines, and flowers in vases. But, the cups were empty of coffee, the flowers were dead in the vase, and the guests had not come. But, Blake saw his own reflection in the plate glass. Martin explains that this illustrates a "false-front emptiness" where Miss Dent thinks Blake's life is full of friendships, money, and a large and loving family but in reality sleeps in a room by himself, torments his wife, and all but abandoned his son to a neighbor. Martin also states that his domestic woes and ego dived behavior which is fueled by what he perceives as people wronged him. However, this all accumulates to his behavior being as open as the store-front window according to Martin. He then introduces another image theory about the ride home on the train. Martin explains that the first and third ad, that depict a women and man toasting wine and a Hawaiian Dancer; show visual manifestations of Blake's and Miss Dents emotional desolation and psychological dysfunction according to Martin. One final image that Martin explores is the Cat's Paw ad. Where a once popular rubber heel placed on the bottom of a shoe to prevent slipping and falling is actually a metaphor for Blake and Miss Dent. Martin explains when Miss Dent states, "You’re the only obstacle between me and my happiness" that the first and more literal meaning is that Blake is between her and the station ads that represent the relationship she seeks. But also Blake is the heel between Miss Dent and her happiness. 
Another addition to the Critical Response section! Dwperrotti (talk) 01:41, 27 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Addition to Critical Response  

message: I made two more additions to this section on the main page please read through it and tell me what you think of it before I add it in thanks.
(First One)
Robert A Morace gave his views on "The Five-Forty-Eight" in his Author Biography on John Cheever. Morace states that after his reading on "The Five-Forty-Eight" he found it to be close to another story also written by John Cheever called, “O Youth and Beauty”. Morace says that Blake is Cheever's least likable characters through out Cheever's stories. Morace states that Blake has under gone a change based on this experience he had with Miss Dent saying that this is the first time that Blake is experiences regret. Morace also states that we don't know if these changes Blake experiences will be long lasting or not. What Morace says about Miss Dent is that with her not killing Blake she discovered some kindness and saneness within herself that could put to use.
(Second One)
Philip N Meyer gave his views of "The Five-Forty-Eight" in an article that he has written called The Inside Story. Along with his own views he also adds in an article written by Charles Baxter who is a writer and also teaches at the University of Minnesota. The article Meyer uses is called In the Art. of Subtext: Beyond Plot. Blaxter says that Blake as a character, "a completely loathsome suburbanite who keeps up the appearance of gentility in business and at home, but whose inner life is hypocritical and self-deluded". Blaxter also says that Miss Dent character is, "a lunatic of sorts, but in Cheever's story she is a messenger of fate. She is the ax to open the frozen sea of Blake's soul". What Meyer has to say about this story is that Cheever exposes gender power imbalances, social cruelty and sexual abuse in this short story.
Thanks for reading also for the input Lturb1 (talk) 23:46, 30 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  More Addition to Critical Response 

message: At the top of the article there's a link to "the television adaptation".  As if there's only one.  I didn't expect to get taken to some 1970's thing, I was expecting to go to the Alfred Hitchcock Presents episode.  Something should be done about this.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.212.167.36 (talk) 10:10, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  "the" Television Adaptation