Category talk:British musical groups

message: I'm not sure if this is the right place to discuss it, but I'm being driven slowly insane by the language used in articles in this category - "frontman", "smash hit", "raced to the top of the charts", "songsmith", "penned" and so many other sub-NME cliches it's unbelievable. There is also a huge issue with POV writing. Obviously, it's good that fans of particular groups are contributing, as they know a lot, but it seems hard for people to be objective. Lots of these articles are pop journalism, it seems to me, rather than encyclopedia entries. Anyway, rant over. Do people have suggestions for how we can sort this, other than by crawling through articles one at a time, and thereafter watching them like hawks...? --Rayray 10:53, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Language in British musical groups articles

message: I propose that this category be phased out in favor of "English musical groups", which is where most of these groups would fit.  [Great] Britain encompasses England, Wales, and Scotland.  There are already categories for Wales and Scotland so England should have a category to itself. Tastywheat 07:01, Jun 21, 2005 (UTC)
:I don't think that would be a good idea for the following reason.
:There are no-such nationalities as 'English' , 'Scottish' 'Welsh' or 'Northern Irish' - only 'British'. Whether there are categories for Wales and Scotland is immaterial - readers looking for a band by nationality wouldn't expect to find ZZ Top under Texan musical groups without there also being a category for US musical groups, so why should Wiki visitors (who may be from other countries) be expected to know which small part of the UK a band is from.
:By all means have separate entries for the UK constituent countries, but getting rid of the British musical groups category seems an unwise move to me. 82.111.118.46 19:44, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Since the general consensus is to keep this group, please try to categorize bands more specifically.  Make use of :Category:Northern Irish musical groups, :Category:English musical groups, :Category:Welsh musical groups, and :Category:Scottish musical groups whenever possible. Tastywheat June 30, 2005 22:41 (UTC)
-----
Page http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Category:British_musical_groups&from=T uses incorrect alphabetisation and mixes it with correct usage resulting in an order of entries incorrect by either system:
   1. The Teardrop Explodes
   2. The Waltons (IOW)
   3. The betts
   4. The The
   5. Theatre of Hate
Alphabetisation of the The under "the The" instead of "The, the" is incorrect, just as it would be incorrrect to list the Who under T instead of under W. In the case of the The, the situation is very clear; even on the band's albums, the article preceding the actual name is lower case. In the case of the Who and the Rolling Stones and the Netherlands etc., the following links provide clear, common sense help based on a sound feel for the language:
http://www.chicagomanual.org/cmosfaq.CapitalizationTitles.html http://fmwriters.com/community/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=17&topic_id=33574&mesg_id=33576
So, many of the other bands on this page are alphabetised incorrectly too. The list should go like this:
  1. Talulah Gosh
  2. The Teardrop Explodes
  3. The Tears
  4. Tears for Fears
  5. Teenage Fanclub
  6. Televise
  7. Television Personalities (band)
  8. Ten Years After
  9. Terrorvision
 10. Texas (band)
 11. The The
 12. Theatre of Hate
 13. Theaudience
 14. Them (band)
All of the following need to be removed because they're erroneous (and impossible to find) under the letter T and should be placed in the list according to the first letter of the word after the article:
   1. The Black Velvets
   2. The Chronicles of Adam West
   3. The Departure
   4. The Duke Spirit
   5. The Eldora Parade
   6. The Europeans (band)
   7. The Go! Team
   8. The Koreans
   9. The Orb
  10. The Peace & Freedom Band
  11. The Quick (duo)
  12. The Rakes
  13. The Rayguns
  14. The Shamen
  15. The Shop Assistants
  16. The Small Gentlemen
  17. The Sweeney (band)
  18. The Waltons (IOW)
  19. The betts
--Espoo 15:36, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Phase Out This Category