Talk:Masonic conspiracy theories

message: The title may or may not be NPOV, but I think it's too ambiguous.  However, I don't know much about conspiracy theory.  What does everyone else think?  Rustyfence (talk) 21:50, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: The title is neither POV, nor ambiguous in a practical sense.  It means theories about Masonic conspiracies since Masons don't have conspiracy theories.  It's like "presidential assassination theories"--presidents don't have assassination theories so it must refer to theories about presidential assassinations in any neutral reading.  (Taivo (talk) 22:35, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree with Taivo.  This has been discussed before.  While the english phrase "masonic conspiracy theories" could mean either "theories about a Masonic conspiracy" or "conspiracy theories belonging to the Masons", the opening sentence of the article quickly establishes which of these possibilities we are talking about.  The only reason to disabiguate would be if someone wanted to write an article on the second meaning ("conspiracy theories belonging to the Masons").  Since that is highly unlikely (as there are no conspiracy theories belonging to the Masons), we don't need to worry about disabiguating. Blueboar (talk) 23:09, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

text: Conspiracy theorists love the P2 scandal... because it does involve an actual conspiracy ... onto which whole bunch of unsubstantiated claims (mostly of the NWO variety) can be grafted.  Separating what is fact from what is unsubstantiated claim can be difficult... which means it is fertile ground for conspiracy theorists. Blueboar (talk) 13:31, 17 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Title

message: -   
I am cutting the image of the reverse of the Great Seal of the US with the red hexogram on it... there are just too many errors.  It simply does not illustrate what the caption claims it illustrates.  Note the lines going down the sides of the pyramid (especially the one on the right side)... they had to fudge them to make it even come close to the designated letters... heck, even as drawn, the vertexes come closer to other letters than the ones stated in the caption.  Try it with the official version of the seal and it does not work at all. Blueboar (talk) 00:18, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Hadn't noticed that.  That is pretty bad - the only reason A and S line up is because they're on the same plane, and the circled letters are way out of alignment with the triangle.  Fundamentally speaking, if you draw lines like that on a real dollar bill, you could cross any ten letters you wanted because of the relative size of the pen and the dollar. MSJapan (talk) 04:17, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  cutting the M-A-S-O-N image 

message: According to Christopher Hodapp, the Masons have new competition in their conspiracy to control the world.  There is new evidence from arial photography of Washington DC... See: this posting on his blog.  (I am suddenly seeing the cartoon strip Peanuts in a whole new light).  :>) Blueboar (talk) 12:51, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah, but Snoopy was a Christian beagle and not a Satanic dachshund!  "Beagle" is even a good English word (from Old French), while "dachshund" is German!  (Godwin's Law!)  (Taivo (talk) 15:24, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: That won't stop a good conspiracy theory... Snoopy was obviously realy a dachshund... after all he was created by Charles Schultz (a German name).  Notice how he was always being shot down by the Red Barron?  An attempt to plant defeatist notions in the minds of God fearing American children (if Snoopy can't defeat the Red Barron, can you resist Satan?)  See... more proof... Plus, if you add up the letters in the phrase "Good Grief", devide by 13, add 33, multiply by 76 (the year Linus was Pope... another clue) you end up with ... ok, I haven't figured that part out yet... but I bet it comes to something very very sinister and predicted by Nostradamus (who obviously must have owned a dachshund). It's all true I tell you, TRUE!  Blueboar (talk) 15:39, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: You've got it!  The result is 2560.615..., which if you truncate the fraction is 2560.  Add the decimals and you get 13, the day on which the Templars were arrested!  Then if you take that, add the decimals of 615 to it, you get 7, the holy number!  Obviously, it's an attempt to claim that the Angry Dachshund is the Great Architect of the Universe!  (Taivo (talk) 16:22, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

text: Oooh... Masons and Dachshunds all in one theory!  Perfect!. Blueboar (talk) 18:17, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why has no one mentioned this on Wikipedia?  The world should be warned. 

message: * Greetings and salutations brothers, (and sisters), from Hamilton, Ontario, Canada. Great article by the way. Not too sure if this should be included but rumour has it that the Ringling Brothers were freemasons as well. you know what they say, "Too many Circuses and not enough freaks." Best Regard! ;)  Nhl4hamilton | Chit-Chat  04:06, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Interesting info, but it's not really a conspiracy theory, so I don't think it fits in this article.  However, if we can find a reliable source for their membership, we could add them to the List of Freemasons. Blueboar (talk) 12:57, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Hodapp, Freemasons for Dummies, pg. 291, "The Ringling Brothers: All seven of them".  (Taivo (talk) 13:19, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Hodapp is certainly reliable. Blueboar (talk) 17:01, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  GREETINGS 

message: Undue weight (WP:UNDUE) given to outlandish conspiracy theories (WP:FRINGE) compared to reasonable concerns an outsider might have, such as institutional corruption or subversion by fraternal organizations (or mutual benefit societies, or societies with secrets, or whatever you're calling them this week).
Perhaps this article could be renamed to "outlandish masonic conspiracy theories", or "disinformation about masonic conspiracies"?
It doesn't help that in the sections immediately preceding this one, there are Masons crowing about howlers they or their associates have dug up.  Ironically, a source used on this very page to combat some sources of misinformation about Freemasonry (the Taxil hoax) also supports the contention that some Masons deliberately promote wild conspiracy theories about Freemasonry so as to discredit their critics.
This article and its discussion page make me want to wash the slime off my computer's screen.
Jeremystalked T C 10:53, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Jeremy, this article is about those very wild, outlandish conspiracy theories that you complain about.  This is the place to list them.  --Taivo (talk) 13:39, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Furthermore, this article goes out of its way to discuss such theories without POV.  It consciously refuses to discuss whether these claims are true or false... valid or not.  It neutrally lays out the most commonly made claims, without commentary.  You can not get more neutral than that. Blueboar (talk) 22:32, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia is not the place to list "very wild, outlandish conspiracy theories".  The article should be about the phenomena of Masonic conspiracy theories.  What is the history of Conspiracy theories, what are the academic theories behind why Freemasonry attracts so many conspiracy theories, what has been the cultural impact of these.  To be fair the article is not entirely devoted to the listing that Taivo is so fond of, but the listing is problematic. JASpencer (talk) 22:48, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV problems 

message: * http://www.newenglishreview.org/Robert_Wolfe/Judeo-Masonic_Thought_And_The_Birth_Of_The_Modern/  Discovered while searching for something else, placed here for future use. MSJapan (talk) 08:43, 14 August 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Third-party thought piece on the Judeo-Masonic conspiracy 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: Youtube is not a citable source, moreover, Wikipedia is NOT about "proof". We aren't supposed to prove anything. Don't add that again. Your edits were contested and you can discuss them here.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pepe Oats (talk • contribs) 13:37, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: This is overall non-sense.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.230.14.126 (talk) 13:39, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

text: Here is the revert by Pepe Oats: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Masonic_conspiracy_theories&diff=861579213&oldid=861579100 and the link to occult symbols being inserted into a national US Television broadcast of a baseball game https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X28ouoVHy_c  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.230.14.126 (talk) 13:42, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Now, what we shall do is examine whether any of these symbols are in any way connected with Free Masonry.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.230.14.126 (talk) 13:50, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Anyone able or willing to examine this?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.230.14.126 (talk) 14:01, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

text: It is your job to examine any piece of information you are given. 1000 reasons for this - one of them is Wikipedia adding the phlegmatic if not hypocritical "conspiracy theory" tag to any subject differing official versions of things. Apart from the youtube still containing the fact of masonic occult symbols inserted into a nation-wide US TV broadcast, A citable book on the subject might be this one: https://www.amazon.com/Masonic-Occult-Symbols-Illustrated-Cathy/dp/1891117122 If you or anyone else is interested in the truth, rather than other motives. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.230.21.145 (talk) 17:43, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Whoever is trying to put a link to a youtube video into the article proper: 

message: https://www.amazon.com/Brotherhood-Secret-World-Freemasons/dp/0880291133/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1538232940&sr=8-1&keywords=the+brotherhood+stephen+knight
quotes: 
"Stephen Knight made a very good investigation of the Freemasons. His book is very open minded, and is more of a presentation of facts than it is drawing conclusions."
"The book has a good reputation, and I can see by the quotes, etc. that Stephen put a lot into this. I believe because of this his work is truthful. However, it was not quite what I was looking for. I was looking more for an explanation of actually what the Freemasons do in their secret world, and what some of their rituals entail. The book was more about proving favouratism and thereby corruption, in the main institutions of Britain by the Freemasons."
"This book was excellent to say the least. The author did a great job at presenting valid sources and documentation. He also did a great job at staying unbiased. Its too bad he died a year after the book was published."  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.230.21.145 (talk) 18:00, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Book: "The Brotherhood: The Secret World of the Freemasons" 

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thread_title:  Copyright problem removed 

message: I don't think that the allegation of Freemasons being involved in "other space agencies" other than NASA is a case of saying that the "sky is blue" and it is very definitely missing from the cited source. @Partofthemachine, please provide a reliable secondary source for your claim, the WP:BURDEN is on you! Elizium23 (talk) 20:46, 2 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: @Partofthemachine, you've re-added your claim a 3rd time (WP:EW) but your source fails to mention space agencies at all. What gives, man? Just either give a source or wait. Elizium23 (talk) 20:59, 2 December 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Freemasons at "other space agencies"