Talk:Aztec calendar

message: As I was reading through the article I keep asking myself where these pieces of information where coming from. I then realized that the article is missing in-text citations. The references are all at end and they need to be linked to the appropriate text in the article. Also, after referring to a featured article I noticed that the Note section is currently being misused. They should be an expansion of simplified sentence. Currently the Notes has two citations. --Esqm8 (talk) 21:58, 22 September 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Do you think we could add something to the page, that shows how the aztecs used the calendar to practice religion or how they interpreted it. I think the article does a great job showing the way the calendar functions, but is missing how it was interpreted. Smp5gd (talk) 21:48, 22 September 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: In-text References and Citations

message: I fail to see how the article XIUHPOHUALLI is different than this one; and so why is it split! One should be the subheading of the other. This article XIUHPOHUALLI has a conflict with itself, and also with the Wikipedia topic AZTEC CALENDAR. The first month shown there is Izcalli with the Nemontemi days after Tititl (as 18th). Then a chart is there duplicated from here Wikipedia AZTEC CALENDAR which shows first month as Atlcahualo with the Nemontemi after Izcalli as (18th). Hubert Bancroft (1886) shows Tititl as first month with Nemontemi after Atemoztli (as 18th), and his sketch diagram from someone else shows Atemoztli as first month with Nemontemi after Pan-Quetzal-iztli (as 18th). Someone needs to get it all together, if not Wikipedia then all the cities of the Aztec who apparently did not have an empire with a single standard for it. Do you think perhaps they moved their Nemontemi every 120 years? or some cities did i.e. month Atemoztli (1160ad) then Tititl (1280ad) then Izcalli (1400ad) then Atlcahualo (1520ad)
98.144.71.174 (talk) 15:09, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Contraditions to which is first month 

message: Everything written in the article is related to the Aztec calendar, and nothing distracts the reader. A few statements need to be backed up by citation that are not currently cited. The addition of graphs and charts is very helpful and informative for the reader, as well as laid out in a concise manner.
-Dgoldenfarb (talk) 19:14, 25 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Overall Evaluation 

message: The correlation difference between the Aztec of Cortez (1519 AD) and the Mayan is caused by these 13 days of trecena. Mayan day 1Ahau is Aztec day 1Xochitl (The Lord or Flower =five-petal Venus pentacle), and Mayan day 1Ben is Aztec day 1Acatl (the christ-king's staff, the cornstalk reed). However, Aztec day 1Xochital is 13 days earlier on Mayan day 1Manik. And Aztec day 1Acatl is on Mayan day 1Ahau. So all Aztec days are 13 days before their Mayan equivalent. So if the Aztec regard 1Acatl as a year bearer and as a calendar round, it is because it falls on Mayan 1Ahau.(1518 AD Year Bearer day 1Acatl is Mayan 1Ahau 13Pop.)
Delete your words sayng the date doesnt exist, and i will delete defending my honor, since it does exist. Also "Mayan 1Ahau 13Pop" never occurs in the Maya calendar. 1 Ahau only coincides with a Haab' coefficient of 3, 8, 13 or 18. Not all possible combinations of Tzolk'in and Haab' actually occur. Senor Cuete (talk) 01:43, 14 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Aztec Tonal-Pohualli Correlation with Mayan Tzolkin 

message: Sorry for my confusion, yes the Calendar Round does occur. Don't the rest of you find the writings of this author to be rambling, incomprehensible and to contain irrelevant factoids about astrology? After reading what he has written carefully I think he's saying that a Calendar Round repeats every 260 days, that the Tonalpohualli is off from the Tzolk'in by 13 days. Senor Cuete (talk) 16:09, 14 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  YEAR 1 REED:  Just what proves 1519 as Year 1 Reed ? 

message: :According to Bernal Diaz de Castillo the fall of Tenochtitlan occurred on August 13th 1521 (Julian). Various chroniclers of the conquest recorded that this was the day 1 snake in the Tonalpohualli. This is also the day 1 snake in the Mayan Tzolk'in if you use the GMT correlation. This is considered to be evidence for the GMT correlation and that the Tzolk'in was universal throughout Mesoamerica. Before this editor's text could be included in the article, wouldn't he be required to cite reliable sources for his statement (at least I think he's saying) that there is a 13 day difference between the Tzolk'in and the Tonalpohualli?  Senor Cuete (talk) 16:51, 14 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cortez YEAR  1Reed  Contradicts the Fall Date of Tenochtitlan

message: (Senor, only a Catholic could look at the whole world and presume that when you say Savior and destruction that you only mean Jesus (every nation and every culture and every religion as its creation its savior and its predicted destruction). I dont feel it admirable for scholars to be accusing 2012 as a white man's twist to Mayan theology. Such printed media is merely a flip in power of who gets to say what. This reminds me of how american schools taught that Catholics were stupid thinking the world flat while Columbus a genius when in fact they had accurate round globes that showed the Pacific-Atlantic ocean 3 times bigger without an America in it. Columbus made discovery by believing his own lie that the earth was smaller. Yet our schools lied and claimed the Greeks did not know the earth was round 200 years before Jesus. I kept my geometry book from 1971 which gives the Greek measurements of the round spherical earth. Now we have people doing the same thing with this 1Reed date of which explains why i couldnt get any dates fixed in 1985. I am seeking competent sources and if none of you people are such, that isnt my fault. Rambling is to say things that are empty. YOU may not understand me, but i say more in each sentence here of mine, than whole paragraphs of unproven texts in your supposed sources. A source must be mathematically correct, not just some quote from an author worshipped with clout. Unless of course you have ignorant students, you gave degrees to, and they think the 13-day difference that we have now, is also 13 days back then. And yes much stupid ignorance is posted in this Wikipedia, and not edited, while truths like the factual positions of the Sothic star are ignored. I have three IPs and you treat one like a nut case while you admire a different one. That doesnt make me the fool, because i dont change personalities with IPs.)  98.144.71.174 (talk) 04:03, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The people that Cortez met at Veracruz were Totonacs, not Aztecs. That arrival date is a date in the Julian calendar not any Mesoamerican calendar. A year bearer is a Tzolk'in (Tonalpohualli) date that coincides with the first date of the Haab' (Xiuhpohualli). You can read about it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_calendar#Year_Bearer. Time and the Highland Maya by Barbara Tedlock describes the use of Year Bearers in modern Guatemala. A new year bearer is seated every 365 days not 260. Aztec year bearers use the same days as the Campeche system but the coefficients are different. Apparently one of Moctecuzoma IIs predecessors chose to celebrate the 52 year Calendar Round completion on a different day than it would have fallen on. Also most articles say that the Year Bearer in the Aztec system was the Tzolk'in day that corresponded with the last day of the Haab' month Kumk'u, not the first day of Pop. For these reasons you can't use whatever Maya calendar program you have to analyze the Aztec system. You could save yourself a lot of angst by reading about these calendars, starting with the links in this comment. You may think that the Aztec calendar has something to with the savior, etc. and that's fine but the people who wrote this article (Not me but you guys are doing a good job.) aren't writing an article about that. I highly recommend that you read A true history of the Conquest of New Spain by Bernal Diaz de Castillo because it's one of the greatest books ever written. I'm not Spanish or Catholic, just someone who values Wikipedia and wants it to a valuable on-line resource. I'm going on vacation tomorrow so good luck guys.  Senor Cuete (talk) 23:51, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Faulty Sources (Prestigious or Not) 

message: I would like to know the value of the 1Reed Year and the 1Reed day. A value means its equivalent new year date and equivalent day of whatever event. I have just read an article that says Cortez landed Veracruz in 1519ad March 4, and came to Tenochtitlan Nov 8. How does this skip over April 1Acatl which falls on Mayan 1Ahau. The fact is simple that 260 days earlier 1Acatl falls either on 1Ahau 13Pop or 13 days later on 1Ben 6Uo. How is either one a year Bearer, and if you go 260 days forward you get 1520ad for a 1Acatl that's either 1Ahau 8Chen or 13 days later 1Ben 1Yax, of which i have never heard anyone yet display a new year at the half year even though Genesis implies the whole world had flipped the calendar with 180 leap days in 1513bc.
One source claims the 1 Reed date is landing the shore of the Aztec at Veracruz were shifted 13 days earlier than of Tenochtitlan Mexico City. Everything I beleive about origin from both oriental and Egyptian sources verifies the Mayan existed in their form of calendar before the Aztec date for Cortez. So the Aztec date of Cortez was shifted 13 days, where as Tenochtitlan was not. The claim that Year Bearer is a certain day expects that date to be the Aztec new year. Using the Aug 11 epoch to appease YOU, the choices are for 260 days:
1518ad 1Acatl on 1Ahau 13Pop as Aztec Year Bearer (new year Aug 4 or 5)
1519ad 1Acatl on 1Ahau 13Kankin (April 21 or 22)
1520ad 1Acatl on 1 Ahau 8Chen (Jan 6 or 7)
to claim Veracruz had the same calendar as Maya would take away all the thousands of Easter weekend claims for the arrival of Cortez on 1Reed and place his date 13 days later.
1518ad 1Acatl on 1Ben 6Uo (Aug 17 or 18)
1519ad 1Acatl on 1Ben 6Muan (May 4 or 5)
1520ad 1Acatl on 1Ben 1Yax (Jan 19 or 20)
I would not be inclined to make claim that Cortez should be dated as the rising Venus of 1520ad January, though i take note that 1 Yax is the half year which so many cultures of the world had flipped 180 days.
 98.144.71.174 (talk) 17:02, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Any Value to 1Reed Date

message: Who says the Aztecs added 6 days to the solar year (for leap year correction?). It sounds logical but evidence is against it (the tonalpohualli, that is interlinked with the xiuhpohalli was thought to be inline with the Mayan calendar. The Mayan 365-day year did not use leap correction (although the mayans were aware of the solar year not being 365 days and used corrections for this in calculations), so the Aztecs did not (if they did use in it the xiuhpohullia, the name bearer-system would have gone wrong, or correlation with the mayan 260 would have shifted. Neither occured).
I remnoved the 6 days stuff. This calendar doesn't really work.
Rene Voorburg 
Many many books out there are propagating this lie about leap day in Mayan or Aztec calendars.98.144.71.174 (talk) 22:11, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The fact that the Natives were using intercalculations to adjust for Earth's axis precession is stated by both Duran and Portilla. Thirteen days added to the end of the 52 year period as noted by Prescott is probably the most accurate of the observations. -- Grae Bear (talk) 20:31, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

text: I added the one from Aztec I guess the anon writer was refering to. -- Infrogmation 00:30 May 4, 2003 (UTC)
----
Please refer to Wikipedia's Aztec calendar, since it was the best known Mesoamerican calendar for the Europeans...
I doubt this is true. I think Maya calendar is more basic than mentioned one. It was perhaps best known to Europeans in the past, but now comes the time, this won't be true anymore. --XJamRastafire 04:03 Jan 11, 2003 (UTC)
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This article is something of a mess, with a mixture of good info and some dubious points. I don't have time to do the research to rewrite the whole thing now, but I wanted to go on record with this. -- Infrogmation 00:30 May 4, 2003 (UTC)
As some of Wikipedia's other Mesoamerica articles are improved, this article is looking worse in comparison. It starts out with a statement at least dubious, I'd say false, about it being derived from the Maya calendar.  It waunders around, sometimes specifically talking about the Aztec calendar, and sometimes about Mesoamerican calendars in general, not being clear when it discusses one of the other. I think we could use a fresh start, maybe at Aztec calendar/Temp for now. Let's begin with a basic factual description. When we have a decent article, let's move that here, then move what is in the article now here to talk. -- Infrogmation 16:25, 13 May 2004 (UTC)

text: Also, perhaps I'll start an article on Mesoamerican calendars, dealing with what they have in common and linking to the specific ones. -- Infrogmation 16:29, 13 May 2004 (UTC)

text: There being no objections, I'm replacing the article with the one that had been at Temp. Below is the old article. If cleaning up this talk page is desired, perhaps it could be moved to something like "Aztec calendar/old". -- Infrogmation 05:29, 26 May 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Miscellaneous previous discussions

message: ancientcalendar.htm
I counted around 100 visitors. This page is not under copyright. I had my time understanding this article. Basically i edited out unrelated explanations (of course related to the article).
I do not know if the information is useful for people. It is possible to print it directly. For the wikipedia article, this does not make sense. It also lives from the color scheme (considering copying the table to the article). I do not really sell anything. A few external links do not bug people, however i read the policy, and won't add it again. Because wikipedia style guidelines, articles are not allowed simplification, change color scheme, link style etc. Articles have to be "scientific". It is allright, but the article really is not giving an immediate explanation. South american styles are not all the same. Akidd dublin•tl•ctr-l 15:17, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  External site about aztec calendar 

message: The opening paragraph of the article leads off with this sentence: "The Aztec calendar is not a calendar at all, but rather a stone describing the migration of the Mexica from Aztlan to Tenochtitlan."
Where did this come from and does it belong here?  I doubt it.  I think it crept in somewhere and nobody was paying attention.  Any objections to changing it back?
--Richard 21:08, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No objections, the change should be reverted. Whoever put that bit in is confusing two different things - the calendar system and a physical artefact.--cjllw | TALK 01:52, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not a calendar? 

message: It has been proposed that tonalpohualli be merged into this article (Aztec calendar).
*I would oppose, on the basis that these are not equivalent, and while the former may be regarded as a specific type of calendar there is ample scope for these two articles to stand independently. The "Aztec calendar" article should certainly mention/summarise the "tonalpohualli" article, but it could/should contain a lot more on other calendric systems as used by Aztecs, eg the 365-day system, the Calendar Round, the "Lords of the Night", "Lords of the Day" and "Birds of the Day" cycles etc etc. "Aztec calendar" should stand as an overall article addressing all calendars and their aspects, while articles on specific calendars can be used to (eventually) cover each of these in more detail than is fitting for an overall summary.--cjllw | TALK 01:23, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge proposal (Nov 06) 

message: I hear that in 2011, the end of the aztec calendar arrives. Is there any basis for this? I've heard about it a couple of time from colleagues, so it might be notable enough for inclusion? McKay 16:14, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You're probably thinking of the Long Count calendar used by the Mayans. The Aztec calendar didn't have such an endpoint. --Ptcamn 17:29, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: End?

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thread_title: Image source problem with Image:Aztec calendar stone.JPG

message: The link to the Aztec calendar site http://www.azteccalendar.com/ is crammed full of advertising. The headings of the pages have as many as three different ads. In the left column Under Adds by Google are three hyperlinked texts. These are linked to a page with lots of stuff for sale. In the upper right of the home and other pages are various ads from Google AdSense. The right side of many of the pages have adds. Wikipedia has a policy against linking to commercial sites. Wikipedia IS NOT A MARKETING TOOL FOR YOUR BUSINESS. For this reason This site should be removed from the external links.  Senor Cuete (talk) 19:20, 22 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links - Aztec calendar - commercial site 

message: ‎I reverted the edits by 98.144.71.174 because I can't understand what he wrote here or in the article. Also "Mayan 1Ahau 13Pop" never occurs in the Maya calendar. a Tzolk'in of nn Ahau only coincides with a Haab' coefficient of 3, 8, 13 or 18. Not all possible combinations of Tzolk'in and Haab' actually occur. Senor Cuete (talk) 01:50, 14 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reversion of edits by ‎98.144.71.174 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Putting these two sources here for future reference. May be useful for updating and expanding the Reconstruction section of the article: 
Kaldari (talk) 18:23, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Calendar correlations 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: I removed a bunch of comments by an editor at the IP address 75.86.64.46—the same person who was already responsible for a bunch of comments back in 2014, posted from the address 98.144.71.174. I strongly suspect this editor is the one who, even earlier than that, created the accounts Elijah Michael and Elijahovah and has been pushing astronomical/calendrical fringe theories for years. As usual, his writing was convoluted and difficult to understand, and with his corrections to his own years-old comments and replies to years-old comments by other editors, it made the whole talk page look pretty chaotic. I'm leaving this note mostly to clarify what the hell happened here. A. Parrot (talk) 03:15, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edits from IP address 75.86.64.46