Talk:Distancing effect

message: I don't understand why this page is titled "Distancing Effect."  This translation is far less common than "alienation effect," and it does little to clarify the nuances of Brecht's neologism.  Alienation effect at least retains the etymological connection to Entfremdung.  I wrote a comment two years ago pointing out that "alienation effect" is 5x more common than "distancing effect" when cross-referenced with "Brecht" in jstor results since 1990 (still true), but I'm not sure to whom my appeal should be directed.  The title of an article is not the proper place for this kind of editorial rigidity, nor is it appropriate to attempt to undermine 70+ years of thoughtful scholarship on Brecht by dismissing "alienation effect" as a mistranslation.  There seems to be someone out there who cares very deeply about this, and I invite him or her to cite and sufficiently cross-reference the idea that "distancing effect" has become the translation of choice.  Pblchkn (talk) 21:50, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Right now the page is a mess of fragmentary attempts to explain the problem. Can one of you replace them with a concise paragraph, with citations? That way the question of title will be much less important. NeoAdamite (talk) 01:53, 31 October 2011 (UTC)

text: The problem of translating Verfremdungseffekt is discussed very clearly in the introduction to the 2015 Bloomsbury edition of Brecht on Theatre, pp. 4–5. Read it here, starting at the last paragraph break at the bottom of p. 4. —Wegesrand (talk) 10:49, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

text: I agree, Redmagic: that passage you quoted from p. 91 does look like the likeliest candidate for the actual quotation. But it's not really close enough to the "prevents the audience" quotation in the article to be, say, a competing translation. My guess is that the "prevents the audience" quotation is not Brecht at all, but a critic's paraphrase and explanation of Brecht's concept. (It's not John Willett's, from the end of "Alienation Effects in Chinese Acting.") A Google search turns up thousands of web pages with this exact quote, almost never with bibliographical citations, but occasionally with Willett 91, suggesting that the author of this Wikipedia article simply took it from one of those other web pages. Hong12kong (talk) 09:56, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

text: Yes, Hong12kong, I had already annotated a student's essay with this quote to the effect that I do not believe that this is actually from Brecht's work. It seems to me that it should be removed from the article, unless the original author can give a legitimate source. I also did that Google search, and agree that it may be that the author took the quote from one of those other sources. It is also possible, I suppose, that those other quotes can be traced back to this wikipedia page, which says something rather depressing about the state of scholarship in this area.Redmagic (talk) 12:42, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Verfremdungseffekt in English 

message: The first sentence is as follows, "The distancing effect, more commonly known (earlier) by John Willett's 1964 translation the alienation effect or (more recently) as the estrangement effect (German: Verfremdungseffekt), is a performing arts concept coined by playwright Bertolt Brecht"
I am wondering what the dates are for the second redefinition (alienation to estrangement). The reason of my query is the fact that estrangement is a loaded word when one is looking at Darko Suvin or other theorists who have brought on an extensive subject on that word and use Brecht within it. Should the change be mentioned here.
New to editing and don't have the date offhand or really at all, so was wondering if this was an important edit I should research and insert.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pelicansofnewyork (talk • contribs) 04:16, 8 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Date needed for first sentence. 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Can some examples from more mainstream works be given?
The current examples are not very clear and are from Brecht and non-Western plays that the readers (me at least) do not know.
Special:WhatLinksHere/Distancing_effect has links from Shakespeare plays and other works.
Can somebody knowledgeable give examples how this effect appears in some of these works?
--Error (talk) 16:22, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Examples 

message: This article is inaccessibly academic in its word choices, particularly in the “origin” section. No casual reader passing through is going to make it past the first paragraph. Truuuuuck (talk) 15:27, 10 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tone