Talk:Hungarian People's Republic

message: The People's Republic of Hungary had actually two different coats of arms, one from 1949 until the 1956 revolution, and one after the revolution, respectively. The article only shows the latter one.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.2.139.222 (talk) 17:11, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

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thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:Nkm343.jpg

message: I'm unhappy to see when history gets revised from a perspective of now instead of 20 years ago, when it happened. The authors or authors of this article stated some inconsistencies.
1. The Hungarian Soviet Republic was not the second, but the third state to adopt communism, see Bavarian Soviet Republic for reference. Aside from that from the armistice of 1918 until the peace of 1920 and its ratification of 1921 no hungarian state was officially acknowledged, for reference see the history of Hungary between 1918 and 1921.
2. Churches of any kind were opressed in Eastern countries but of course not for reasons as stated to separate it from the state but to push it on the sideline into unimportance.
3. Last but not least there are inconstiencies with the content of Transition to democracy. The Network of Free Initiatives (Szabad Kezdeményezések Hálózata) was not "so-called" but a real opposition force. The author favors the opinion that was formed after 1994 when the Union of Free Democrats (SZDSZ) made a coalition with the Hungarian Socialist Party(MSZP) that it was premeditated though it was not, for reference see former SZDSZ-members in the Fidesz, like István Tarlós and others who left the SZDSZ for the aforementioned reasons.
That Pozsgay was admitted to the Politbüro is lesser important than the fact that country was run by Károly Grósz, who is not even mentioned in the article, although he was the General Secretary who used his power to slow the changes. Pozsgay was in fact a so-called opposition, he did not favoured the multi-party system. He might be a great friend of Viktor Orbán now, though he was not, when Orbán and fellow members were beaten in 1988. Indeed, the Ventral Plenum did favoured the multi-party system, for reasons of winning time, every communist party did or tried that, so that in the coming elections they win most of the votes. Amusing to read that the Communist party's membership declined, a mere statistical fact. In a faint liberalising attempt the Hungarian Workers Socialist Party had established the Patriotic Front of the People (Hazafias Népfront) to establish "free elections" in 1985, Pozsgay was also a member of this organization. Also "freed" or "individualized" party secretaries were also no members anymore, yet all of these people were part of the establishment.
Pozsgay said people's uprising not popular uprising, major difference. The Hungarian Workers Socialist Party reformed itself to 2 parties, not one: one being the MSZP and the other one the new MSZMP, so MSZP is de jure and the Magyar Kommunista Munkáspárt (Munkáspárt, MSZMP) is the de facto follower of the former MSZMP.
The article fails to mention that the MSZMP wanted a strong President of the Republic so if anyone becomes the new prime minister he will have as much power as that of France. The provisional president, Mátyás Szűrös took that position. The author should mention that before 2000 he was an influential socialist politician, former ambassador to Moscow. The readers should not be mislead into believing these people were democrats, on the contrary.
And I truely admit that the Fidesz played part, a big one actually in the transition, still they were not the only ones as some including themselves try to interpret it as a "unique" way to present history. Shinichi1977 (talk) 18:30, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Several inconsistencies in the article

message: This Wikipedia entry contains the incorrect statement that "Communist Interior Minister László Rajk established the ÁVH secret police".
In reality, Rajk established the ÁVO (the Department of State Defence within the Hungarian State Police). The ÁVH was established at the proposal of János Kádár, Rajk's successor as Interior Minister.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.36.19.111 (talk) 14:36, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Incorrect statement regarding the ÁVH 

message: redirects here which I don't think is right considering that communism has played a role in Hungarian politics before and after the People's Republic of Hungary, examples being the short-lived Hungarian Soviet Republic, the experiment with council communism during the Hungarian Revolution of 1956, and of course the status of contemporary communist parties in Hungary. Charles Essie (talk) 21:04, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Separate article about "Communism in Hungary"? 

message: Can 'someone' link the mention of the name here (and on a couple of other related WP pages) to the Hungarian WP article on him and/or the translation here. Jackiespeel (talk) 10:24, 9 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Attila Szigethy 

message: The Hungarian Revolution of 1956 page states, with cited sources, that around 2,500 to 3,000 Hungarians were killed during the Revolution and 13,000 were wounded.  I'd just like to know the source for the 20,000 figure that appears on this page. ImperatorPublius (talk) 19:09, 9 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  20,000 killed during the Revolution? 

message: I've removed large swathes of hidden text from the article, which doesn't appear to be serving any purpose since everything that's been concealed is paraphrased in the live version of the article.
* From the lead section, I deleted this text (I mistakenly revised a portion of it for grammatical correctness, but for the most part, it's unchanged relative to the original):
::After World War II, Hungary—a former member of the Axis powers—came under the occupation of the Soviet Union.  The Soviets, believing the local Hungarian Communist Party was popular enough to win elections, allowed free elections to be held on 4 November 1945.  However, the result was a resounding victory for the non-Communist Independent Smallholders' Party, whom the Soviets thus forced into entering a coalition government with the Communists.  From then on, the Communists used so-called "salami tactics" to take power, gradually eliminating their political opponents one at a time through conspiracy and subterfuge.  This typically involved framing prominent opponents for "anti-state" conspiracies, arresting them, forcing them into exile, and rigging elections."Hungary: Salami Tactics" Time (April 14, 1952). Retrieved March 15, 2011Safire, William, Safire's Political Dictionary, Oxford University Press, 2008 (revised), p. 639, .
::By 1949, the Communists had achieved undisputed rule over Hungary and declared it to be a People’s Republic.  Under Mátyás Rákosi's Stalinist dictatorship, Hungary was one of the most brutal totalitarian police states in the Eastern Bloc.  Thousands of real and alleged political opponents—including from within the ruling Communist Party—were subject to arrest, torture, and execution by the notorious secret police, the ÁVH.  After Stalin's death in 1953, the Soviets appointed the more moderate Communist Imre Nagy to the premiership, who attempted to roll back some of Rákosi's harshest measures.  However, Rákosi remained General Secretary of the Party, and he was able to use his influence to force Nagy out of the government in 1955. But after Nikita Khrushchev’s denunciation of Stalin in February 1956, Hungarians in large numbers felt emboldened to criticize Rákosi and demand his resignation.  A vigorous intellectual movement soon arose demanding democratic reforms and Imre Nagy's restitution to the leadership.
::Rákosi finally resigned in July 1956 and appointed his second-in-command, Ernő Gerő, as his replacement. However, Gerő proved unable to stem the tide of dissent. Longstanding resentment against the regime soon erupted into a popular uprising in October–November 1956.  After secret policemen fired into a crowd of anti-government demonstrators on 23 October 1956, the government called in Soviet troops.  Unable to defeat the determined Hungarian guerillas in urban warfare in the streets of Budapest, the Soviets finally agreed to withdraw from the city.  Imre Nagy was restored to power, and he promised democratic reforms, the abolition of the one-party state, and withdrawal from the Warsaw Pact. However, the Soviets soon reversed their earlier decision and decided to crush the Revolution, sending a massive military force into Budapest and other cities on 4 November.  After over a week of fighting, they finally crushed the armed resistance.János Kádár, a former member of Nagy's government, took power in his stead. Initially he presided over a period of cruel reprisals against former revolutionaries, executing hundreds of them including Imre Nagy himself.
* From the Stalinist era subsection, I removed this:
::Repression was harsher in Hungary than in the other satellite states in the 1940s and 1950s due to a more vehement Hungarian resistance.
::Approximately 350,000 Hungarian officials and intellectual party members were purged from the Hungarian Communist Party from 1948 to 1956. Any member with a western connection was immediately vulnerable, which included large numbers of people who had spent years in exile in the West during the Nazi occupation of Hungary. Approximately 150,000 were also imprisoned, with 2,000 summarily executed.
::Additionally, during "social purges" of non-party members, in Budapest at 2:00 AM on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays vans transported purge targets, who by 1953, numbered approximately 700,000. Of those 98,000 were branded as spies and saboteurs, 5,000 of which were executed. These social purges used immense amounts of resources, including almost one million Hungarian adults employed to record, control, calculate, indoctrinate, spy on and sometimes kill targets of the purge.
* And under the 1956 revolution's subsection, there's this annotation that's been added to an unspecified citation—either the one entitled "Heller", or the one entitled "Chapter X.I, para 482 p. 153" (perhaps both):
::"this ref has the marvellous detail about Hungarian army members tearing the communist badges from their caps and joining the revolutionaries. it was in the article earlier, but I took it out because it was unsourced. now that is is sourced, it seems a shame not to use such a vibrant detail"
If anyone has any use for these paragraphs, let me know and we can discuss ways to reintegrate some of this back into the article. Kurtis (talk) 01:37, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hidden text removed 

message: Shouldn't the infobox also include the system of government that existed in the Hungarian People's Republic during the Hungarian Revolution of 1956. Charles Essie (talk) 04:46, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infbox government parameter