Talk:Worth School

message: I've just removed some edits that just aren't appropriate on Wikipedia. When reinserting, try to write something that will not be out of date in six months - the adverb currently might have a date in brackets. The family life of the new headmaster and the delight of the governors is human interest stuff that belongs in a local newspaper.--Lo2u 16:16, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent changes re new head 

message: The side panel contained out of date information, which I have removed. The section on "gappies" gave undue prominence to a feature this school shares with many others, who do not appear to need to advertise the fact - e.g. no mention is made of the fact that the school employs "teachers"! The section about Woldingham school is out of date. The paragraph on OFT should perhaps be a separate article - there were 49 other school involved, so it is difficult to see why the investigation featured uniquely on this page. Lanspergius 19:50, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: re-edit

message: The wikipedia is not the place for news anouncements about changes in a school's admissions policy. The change in the school's policy needs to be incorporated into the body of the article as a description of what is the case. Lanspergius 12:18, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: removed news item

message: I have added information about price fixing and salmonella in an attempt to make the site less of an advert and more factual. Not being at the school when this happened the information is limited feel free to add whatever you like —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Wiggstar69 (talk • contribs) 20:52, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Down sides 

message: Attempting to maintain a neutral tone by removing the material referred to above. Lanspergius 21:12, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed the above 

message: iv'e made some more subtle changes intending to make it less like an advert for the school and more factual. I love worth school and wikipedia and I want a reliable sourse of information.
R. Wiggins —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Wiggstar69 (talk • contribs) 22:04, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  This site is being decribed as a brochure 

message: I have reinstated a paragraph on this event, since another user has made reference to it. Lanspergius 23:32, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  OFT 

message: I like the resent change to this page and now it holds a fair amount of reliable information, although I do think that the one thing that it is still lacking is the connection to girls schools.
Other users obviously dislike this section (due to its constant deletion) and I can understand why, although, the school does have obvious and strong connections to these schools and although it doesn't have to be put across how I have done it I would like it to be there.
--Wiggstar69 17:29, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A thought out conclusion 

message: The "Tony Tyler" who has a wikipedia page is not the T.T. in the list of alumni. Please don't link to that page! Thanx. Lanspergius 16:43, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alumni 

message: Harry Enfield does not regard himself as an "alumnus" of Worth, and would not wish to be lsited here.
:I've always deleted his name from appearing on the list, although if you look up the meaning 'alumni' does it really matter whether you enjoyed your time, graduated, or want to be affluated with it? The fact is he went to the school, this means his Alumni.--Wiggstar69 22:40, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Harry Enfield

message: I have made some minor edits particularly in the first section to make it less biased.
ALUMNI -- I have added info to the Alumni lists : Michael Questier is also a respected author, having published numerous books/research papers on obscure areas of Catholic history. It is fairly unusual, specialist work, and makes him stand out as an academic, a term which is somewhat anonymous and unspecific anyway. I also added the band Nick Wesolowski played for. The previous appelation "musician" is anonymous,vastly over general and insufficient, and you would only find out more if you did a google search. Wesolowksi's band most certainly were/are highly regarded and successful, and are regularly cited in retrosepctive studies of the late 70's period. Please don't mess around with my changes, unless you have valid reason to do so;reasons beyond snobbery as to who YOU consider worthwhile as some kind of representative of "what Worth School should be known for." Personally, I think some Alumni on the list are not particuarly significant or praiseworthy -- but I certainly wouldn't edit them out since to do so would be biased and relying on my own subjective reaction. Signed, Rutherford lad ( Worth School, 1977 -- 1982 )Added François Schiettecatte, who is highly respected as a leading computer/tech innovator. A google search will support my addition to Worth's alumni listing ( Signed, RUTHERFORD LAD ex Worth, 77 -- 82 )User:Rutherfordlad
THE MONOCHROME SET and the ALUMNI LISTINGS
Please, would whoever keeps deleting the presence of NICK WESOLOWSKI as a worthy Alumni -- stop! Whether you personally are into music or not is irrelevant. His band contributed a lot to Post Punk music in UK, so stop being ignorant and selective. And yes, I was at Worth in the 70's, in Rutherford under Bernard Moss. Stop deleting Weslowski and his contribution.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.138.57.171 (talk) 14:36, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Minor edits 

message: :Image:Worth Crest Stained Glass.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 11:39, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Worth Crest Stained Glass.jpg

message: I have changed ‘Alumni’ to ‘Notable Alumni’, (both terms not strictly correct: see Contention below,) as anyone who studies and passes might be considered an alumnus/na; there is an obvious problem if anyone's name can be added.  Generally, Notable Alumni are those who have achieved 'national notability' most often beyond the confines of education, either before, during, or after association. Even if a person works as a professional in some capacity beyond the School this doesn’t automatically entitle that person to be considered as ‘notable’ unless achievements beyond normal, personal, school, or employment activities can be independently demonstrated, verified, and linked-to, such as with significant published articles about or by the person concerned. Proofs of notability are not personal or promotional web sites and pages, blogs, forums, or Wikipedia pages where the subject has a passing mention. Indeed, a notable person should have such verifiable achievement that would warrant a Wikipedia article in his own right.
Further, the addition of names within a ‘Notable’ list that demonstrate no such verifiable notability could be seen as self-serving, impinging on Wikipedia’s guidelines concerning a neutral point of view, Wikipedia:Neutral point of view, and bringing the whole article into disrepute. Where someone is ennobled, or has gained significant national honours, (letters,) notability might be assumed even if there are no obvious links to this notability. Please refer to Wikipedia’s guide to Wikipedia:Notability.
A previous heading ‘Famous Pupils’ was changed, (to 'Alumni',) through reasoning that that wording is subjective. This of course can be true. However fame, or notability (a better word), will not be subjective if links proving that notability can be made.
I have rationalised the list under this section to show a common style that is more egalitarian, as there should be no appearance of ranking in Wikipedia lists. There is no need to elaborate on entries however important be the 'alumnus'; this is especially true when the 'alumnus' links to his own Wikipedia article. Where an 'alumnus' has no Wiki article, an extended description beside his name could imply lack of notability; suspicion of 'trying too hard to  prove a point'. Less is always more. Therefore, as far as possible, I've Wikified by adding bracketed single/double words as qualification. I have added a red link to invite an article for Michael Questier, who, through googling, appears notable. The already 'redded' Peter Jonas certainly should have his own article: any takers on these two?
*(Update: 28 Aug 2010.  I have created a stub for Michael Questier - anybody want to expand it?).
*(Update: 10 Sep 2010. I have created an article for Peter Jonas (director)).
Others on the list without assigned Wikipedia articles are suspiciously un-notable in Wikipedia terms. One (Robert Carroll) seems to be defined largely by his own web site and appears to have added his own name, see COI. Three (Michael Ellis, François Schiettecatte and Tony Tyler) are defined by their professional and employment duties and have no added gongs. One (Nick Wesolowski) is a one-time member of a band; how many millions of those are there?. 'Alumni', yes... Notable? See further discussion above, under Minor edits.
A notable 'alumnus' with a Wikipedia article, Owen Lean, is defined by one newspaper article and a link to an 'official' web site. Although I find it surprising that the Owen article hasn't been tagged for deletion and he considered non-notable here, recently he appears to have achieved higher profile, although whether or not there is verifiable evidence for this development is another matter. Anyone care to improve his article?
*(Update: 16 Oct 2010. Three more scans for the same event added, and two scans for further two events added, although the text remains paltry).
If there is a desire to add names of those who studied at the school to a list, a separate article for this could be created where ex-students can be added, and which can be linked-to from the main article. This of course might not suit those who seek self-aggrandizement: Wikipedia:Conflict of interest.
====Notables who don't want to be notables:====
There has been discussion over the inclusion of Harry Enfield under a 'Famous Pupils', 'Alumni' or 'Notable Alumni' list. Observations have been made that Enfield did not like Worth School therefore wouldn't want to be added, and that he was only a pupil for a short time. Whether Enfield liked the school or not is, in Wikipedia terms, irrelevant, and if removal was made on these grounds it would be a blatant case of Wikipedia:Conflict of interest. Enfield doesn't own the Worth School article; Enfield doesn't even own the article under his own name. Therefore removing him on these grounds is a non-starter. Length of stay at the school is a moot point however. If he was a pupil for, lets say, two weeks and took no or few lessons, then there is a case to be made for removal. If he was registered for, attended, and studied for at least a term, then a removal decision becomes tricky. Perhaps someone can provide verifiable evidence of his length of stay; until such information is available, and a discussion has taken place, I propose that he remains on a 'Notable' list.
:Update: please refer to Alumni guidelines. Acabashi (talk) 14:23, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable Alumni 

message: There has been discussion over the inclusion of Harry Enfield under a 'Famous Pupils', 'Alumni' or 'Notable Alumni' list. Observations have been made that Enfield did not like Worth School therefore wouldn't want to be added, and that he was only a pupil for a short time. Whether Enfield liked the school or not is, in Wikipedia terms, irrelevant, and if removal was made on these grounds it would be a blatant case of Wikipedia:Conflict of interest. Enfield doesn't own the Worth School article; Enfield doesn't even own the article under his own name. Therefore removing him on these grounds is a non-starter. Length of stay at the school is a moot point however. If he was a pupil for, lets say, two weeks and took no or few lessons, then there is a case to be made for removal. If he was registered for, attended, and studied for at least a term, then a removal decision becomes tricky. Perhaps someone can provide verifiable evidence of his length of stay; until such information is available, and a discussion has taken place, I propose that he remains on a 'Notable' list.
:Update: please refer to Alumni guidelines. Acabashi (talk) 14:23, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Notables who don't want to be notables:

message: Here is the rub.  What does 'Alumni' mean in terms of Worth School? Strictly, it should mean those who have graduated with a degree, something that the School doesn't offer. However, the definition of 'Alumni' seems to be stretched nowadays, even on Wikipedia, therefore I didn't want to remove it unilaterally. 'Famous pupils' was closer to the mark, but the word 'famous' was rightly objected too; it is too hyperbolic and restrictive. As 'famous' and 'alumni' are problematic, I suggest that the section header should be Notable Worthians.
You can see that I haven't removed anyone from the notable list, even though I was sorely tempted. I would like a discussion between serious identifiable editors, (i.e. those with operating User and Discussion Pages, not just an IP address,) to decide on a Notable's section heading, and who, if any, might be removed.
Please Note: Iam not, and have never been, associated with Worth School, or with others who have been associated with the School. I have, to my knowledge, never met anyone from the school. I have edited and discussed the article with disinterest, and with an aim to make it conform to Wikipedia standards.
Acabashi (talk) 15:09, 26 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Contention

message: I have removed a part mini biography on Andrew Bertie from this list section. Where Individuals at institutions are covered in their own substantial biographies in Wikipedia, any additional pertinent facts should be added within those biographies to avoid duplication and confusion. All that is needed in a list is Name/Position/Dates; the link suffices. It would be useful if someone can supply the dates to Andrew Bertie's tenure.
Acabashi (talk) 15:09, 26 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Notable Staff

message: Please read the discussion and reasoning above before challenging delections. It has been 4 months since the probable contentious additions into 'Notables' of François Schiettecatte, Michael Ellis, Nick Wesolowski, Tony Tyler, and Robert Carroll were challenged, with reasoning and requests for comments from other editors of this page. As there has been no adverse feedback on deletion, or reasoning why these should be considered notable, I have removed them from the list. Even at this very late stage, if any editor wishes to challenge the deletions, please add sound reasoning here after considering comments above, and copy these to my talk page. Please note: notable people will be of at least known and credited national importance, will be defined other than by themselves or those known to them (Wikipedia:COI), will have such standing to warrant a Wiki article in their own right, and will be defined by acheivements usually beyond their day job with references to reliable third-party sources. Delections have been made from a position of neutrality; I have no association with the school or with anybody mentioned in the article; any further additions from editors should be made on that basis: Wikipedia:NPOV.
Acabashi (talk) 00:40, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edits - 09 December 2010 - removal of 'notables' 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on Worth School. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080610055129/http://www.oft.gov.uk/news/press/2006/182-06 to http://www.oft.gov.uk/news/press/2006/182-06
*Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20120513164633/http://www.worthschool.co.uk/page.php?pid=93 to http://www.worthschool.co.uk/page.php?pid=93
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Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 14:19, 29 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Worth School. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160827201232/http://www.worthschool.org.uk/Worthian-wins-UK-Rugby-Coach-of-the-Year-Award to http://www.worthschool.org.uk/Worthian-wins-UK-Rugby-Coach-of-the-Year-Award
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Worth School. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120331113128/http://www.worthschool.org.uk/view-news.php?newsID=114 to http://www.worthschool.org.uk/view-news.php?newsID=114
*Added  tag to http://www.iconeye.com/read-previous-issues/icon-102-december-2011/worth-abbey-church
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080828195009/http://www.oft.gov.uk/news/press/2006/166-06 to http://www.oft.gov.uk/news/press/2006/166-06
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 01:54, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified