Talk:List of town tramway systems in Europe

message: I decided to split this list into three parts because the file size has reached "156K and growing." Ldemery 20:06, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Splitting list 

message: I decided to list systems in France, Germany and Italy by region (or Bundesland) because of the large number of systems in these three countries.
Completion of listings for Germany, The Netherlands, Switzerland and the U.K. will wind up my contributions to this section. I have tried to include all town tramway systems in Europe for which I could find documentation. I hope that others will fill in the blanks. Ldemery 01:39, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Region / Bundesland 

message: I have replaced this city as the "bottom" of the Russia-Europe section, with annotation. I think it should remain as re-entered until it is confirmed that no construction was started (either pre- or post-1991). Ldemery 02:21, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Petrozavodsk 

message: With reluctance, I have added French départements as subdivisions of the régions. This is to facilitate addition of suburban electric tramways. References (contemporary and modern) are organized by département, and the networks themselves tended to serve only one département. Ldemery 03:28, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  France - départements  

message: The genesis of the Katowice area tram system is a complicated matter. Although it is now governed as a single entity, it had at least two ancestors: 1) the Upper Silesian part (ex-German), originating in 1894 as a narrow track steam interurban (later electrified and regauged to standard); 2) the Zagłębie part (Sosnowiec area, ex-Russian), originating in 1928 (already Polish times) as a standard gauge system. Both were and are connected by just one single-track line. There were also some municipal tram companies, e.g. in Beuthen/Bytom, a standard gauge system initially separate from the narrow gauge interurban (but later fully incorporated). Thus, I think, at least one more date should appear, 1928 for "Zagłębie" trams. 
Nevertheless, I find the list very interesting and well done. 212.51.213.2 23:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Katowice (Poland) 

message: Could we please consider splitting off those countries that have long entries?  I would suggest that Belgium, France, Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, Russia, Spain, Switzerland, Ukraine, and the United Kingdom should get separate articles, linked from this one.
Also, what the heck do those ♦ symbols mean?  I suspect it means something like 'inter-city', but why is that not explained in the introduction? Bastin 15:07, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've now split off those countries' lists.  Still haven't a clue what the diamonds mean, though. Bastin 11:47, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The ♦ symbols are an attempt to accomplish to moving some place names toward the right side of the column. That is, grouping various systems under the name of the major regional center. Examples include suburban lines and "nearby" towns that had town tramway systems, not necessarily connected to the "major regional" system. Any suggestions how to better communicate this concept visually? Ldemery 18:23, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Split and the ♦ symbols

message: Funchal , the capital city of the Madeira Region (in Portugal) also had tramways , horsedrawn and the small system never saw electrification. 
Sotavento (talk) 20:14, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Funchal 

message: I think the article's title should be List of urban tramway systems, as many of the cities in the list are not usually referred to as towns. Also the tables would look more legible if the location/locality column would be the first one, like in List of town tramway systems in Romania. Elekhh (talk) 09:47, 27 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cities and Towns 

message: I have never seen an article use a Navbox in the middle of the article's text, as this one does. It would seem to violate WP:ORDER rules. Does anyone know if this article's use of the Navbox this way is "allowed"? Is there a better way to handle this, so the Navbox can be moved to the bottom, as per WP:ORDER? --IJBall (talk) 19:03, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The whole point of this "Europe" list was to cover countries that had too few tram systems to warrant having a standalone list, but I see that someone recently created "articles" for every country here, even Monaco!  There's no reason at all for Wikipedia to have an "article" listing tram systems in Monaco (which has only a single city), under any title, and same goes for the other European countries that have had very few tram systems (currently and historically).  Personally, I feel that those small-country lists of tram systems should all be deleted, but I don't really want to spend time on that (however, if someone else does, I'd likely vote in support of any deletion nominations if I hear of them). However, if a consensus to keep them emerges, then this article, List of town tramway systems in Europe, should be changed to just a list of links to those articles, with the navbox at the bottom. But for the reasons I just gave, I think the navbox and many of its articles should be deleted.  Navboxes can be useful, but I've noticed some some people use them in a way that only encourages creation of "articles" on non-notable subjects.  The mere presence of the navbox in question here (also named "List of town tramway systems in Europe", using the navbox :Template:Europe topic) encourages some people to create lists that, in my opinion, shouldn't be created.  Actually, since this navbox does not use its own template, but merely settings within a broader Europe template, I think I'll just remove it myself, but I'll wait a day or two to avoid confusing anyone reading this discussion. SJ Morg (talk) 08:52, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Follow-up: OK, as a test, I'm trying to do a 'speedy deletion' () on the recently created List of town tramway systems in Albania. If that is successfully speedily deleted, I'll do the same for the other 'stub' articles that User:2020j recently created. If the speedy deletion is declined, I'll go the  route next. --IJBall (talk) 02:03, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  I support your effort, and I hope the speedy-deletion request is accepted. SJ Morg (talk) 03:52, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  OK, 'speedy deletion' seems to be working on the single system 'stub' articles. List of town tramway systems in Lithuania I've converted to a 'redirect' as a 'bot' had already tagged the page with that suggestion. When I get some time, my next order of business will be to delete the Navbox at this article, and replace it with a list of standard wikilinks to the relevant articles... --IJBall (talk) 17:26, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article's use of Navbox 

message: In light of the above discussion, I am proposing that List of town tramway systems in Latvia, List of town tramway systems in Slovakia, and List of town tramway systems in Slovenia (all of which are very short list table articles) be merged back to this article. (List of town tramway systems in Norway is another candidate for a merge back to here, though I am not proposing a merger of that article at this time...) Please indicate your support, or opposition, to this proposal below. Thanks! --IJBall (talk) 21:54, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: 'Merge-from' candidates