Talk:Bar (music)

message: "In musical notation, a bar line or measure is a segment of time defined as a given number of beats of a given duration."
This is the first line, and I don't understand it fully. Is the same meaning derived by typing: (?)
"In musical notation, a bar or measure is a segment of time defined as a given number of beats in the segment of time."
If it means the same thing I prefer the latter, because it's more clear to me.Logictheo 07:00, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Please sign your posts on talk pages per Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages. Thanks! Hyacinth 07:26, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Confusing

message: Since it seems it means both 1. Go before than, and 2. Has higher rank (with other words, has something extra), I'm replacing the word with the meaning behind each word. Comments welcome. Logictheo 09:06, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Awesome, noticed that too. 2001:8003:617A:7701:FD8B:95AC:276A:EFDC (talk) 09:50, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  word "preceded" has 2 meanings? 

message: There is an article about this symbol, the title of which is [Repeat sign]. There, the expression "repeat barline" is not even mentioned. I suspect that this is not just an imperfection of that article. Indeed, theoretically the repeat sign should not be called a barline, because it consists of two barlines and two dots. See also modern musical symbols.  
So, I suggest to delete the reference to "repeate barline" in this article, unless you have an authoritative reference proving that this improper terminology is accepted and used (as it often happens even in sciences). If you have such a reference, then I suggest to indicate this alternative terminology in the articles repeat sign and modern musical symbols as well, for the sake of consistency. Paolo.dL (talk) 19:08, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: If you can find a Wikipedia policy or guideline which suggests the removal of the term "repeat barline" for reason please do so. If you can find a source which denounces it as incorrect terminology please do so. Hyacinth (talk) 03:45, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Repeat barline is not a barline 

message: This is funny: "Measure (music)" redirects to "Bar (music)", but the latter article is mainly saying that "bar" is poor usage, "measure" is good usage. According to my New Grove (1980), English "bar" and American "measure" are equivalents, as are English "bar-line" and American "bar". Not to speak of the "twelve-bar blues". --91.32.134.232 (talk) 22:49, 18 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree, somewhat arbitrarily... I wonder what the reason is for our English bias? Seniority? =) So, I suppose we should transform this page a bit and rename it to Measure (music). Other input/opinions? --DJ Phazer talk 09:31, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: What? Why? No, ‘Bar (music)’ is a good name. As I said above, it is wrong to call ‘bar’ bad usage, ‘measure’ good usage; ‘bar’ is correct British English. We should remove the following sentence: ‘Although the words bar and measure are often used interchangeably the correct use of the word “bar” refers only to the vertical line itself, while the word “measure” refers to the music contained between bars.’ --91.32.132.189 (talk) 15:44, 28 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Changed. --91.32.161.2 (talk) 16:59, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

text: Bar is the same as measure - measure can be used more professionally in some situations but bars is just as fine. This is a weird edit in the publishing. 2001:8003:617A:7701:FD8B:95AC:276A:EFDC (talk) 09:51, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bar and measure 

message: Seems like a lot of the first section is concerned with bar numbering rather than bars per se. (Also it's pretty prescriptive.) Maybe the discussion of numbering could be moved lower down, and the first section could talk more about how bars typically divide the sound into regular patterns of stressed beats. —Wahoofive (talk) 06:34, 21 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bar numbering 

message: I have initiated a formal RM action to move Musical scale to Scale (music). Contributions and comments would be very welcome; decisions of this kind could affect the choice of title for many music theory articles.
NoeticaTea? 00:10, 21 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: This will help with consistency and understanding 2001:8003:617A:7701:FD8B:95AC:276A:EFDC (talk) 09:52, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move: "Musical scale" → "Scale (music)" 

message: Is a bar an aspect of audible music, or only a convention of notation? The current lede defines a bar as a segment of time defined by a given number of beats, but I would suggest that only notated music contains bars, which are demarcated by barlines. This in turn implies something about the meter of the music, but the word bar itself is only meaningful in notation, much like note values themselves. Agree? —Wahoofive (talk) 06:04, 31 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The bar is a 2D-diagram of music, where the x coordinate is time and the y coordinate is sound frequency. You can fold the bar into a circle and use polygons to represent monophonic sounds like percussion . In the latter example, the ability to represent musical notes has been traded for the ability to represent polygons in a circle (instead of a series of bars on a line). The barrel organ, phonograph cylinder and compact disc are examples of 3D notational systems. Machine readability increases with every dimension, but human readability decreases. --83.137.6.237 (talk) 10:51, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notational convention 

message: We read at the section "History":
The earliest barlines, used in piano and vihuela music in the 15th and 16th centuries...  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.65.56.10 (talk) 18:12, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Replaced with "keyboard" —Wahoofive (talk) 19:46, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

text: nope 2001:8003:617A:7701:FD8B:95AC:276A:EFDC (talk) 09:51, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Piano music in the 15th and 16th ???!!!??? 

message: Is it wise to be using a source for distinctions of usage in modern English that was written almost 40 years ago (1979)? I don't have access to any more recent books with a similar purpose but I feel that, especially given that it was cited in regards to a distinction that could easily be outdated (whether the term bar and measure can be used interchangeably in American English) it might be wise to get a source from this millennium to weigh in on the issue.Snowblinded (talk) 00:45, 18 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Manual of Modern Practice? 

message: In the article there are two spellings in use: barlines and bar lines. I don't care if it should be the British or the American spelling, but it should be spelled uniformly. --Rettinghaus (talk) 12:56, 6 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  barline spelling 

message: The first image gives the impression that barlines are called "bars". It doesn't show that a bar contains notes and is about duration and rhythm. Instead, there should be a time signature and for example three bars of music, each bar in a different color, and the figure caption can explain that ("the first two notes are in the first bar (shown in blue), ...").  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.10.194.100 (talk) 01:09, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  First illustration is misleading 

message: The introduction is unclear to me in terms of everything but visuals.  "The bar line (or barline) is a vertical line written in the music which separates the bars."along with the illustration is clear enough, but how does one hear a bar? Kdammers (talk) 02:35, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: You can't hear a bar; it's strictly a notational device. —Wahoofive (talk) 01:14, 15 December 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro 

message: The question is the value of x: space, hyphen, or null. I think the last ("barline") is preferable. Reference books to hand suggest: older British texts (first pub. 1940s and 1950s) use "bar-line"; Gardner Read (US) uses "barline", even in the middle of a misguided rant about how non-American terminology is wrong or unprofessional. The Dolmetch reference I just removed () also uses "barline", as do most of the comments above. I think it is OK to list all three alternative spellings, but suggest using "barline" through the article. Imaginatorium (talk) 12:07, 10 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bar <i>x</i> line