Talk:Pirate utopia

message: Bit of a pro-anarchist slant here? Evan Donovan 03:58, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Where? Zanturaeon 00:40, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

text: I have posted a POV tag because of the obvious one-sided nature of this article.  Alternative viewpoints and historical context are required.  For this reason, this entire article is currently suspect. --Zeamays (talk) 17:06, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

text: Not sure where you're seeing a pro-anarchist slant, unless maybe you think any article that doesn't condemn anarchism is "pro-anarchist". Anyway, as I understand it, the pirate republics, including Nassau (which is for some reason omitted in the article) had no rulers - at least as far as we know - so the term "anarchist" applies in the sense that these republics were "anarchist" in the literal sense, and not necessarily in the political sense. So there's no political slant, at least as I see it. Ianbrettcooper (talk) 19:13, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pro-anarchist slant? 

message: The article doesn't mention the possibility that the pirate utopias were supported tacitly by empires so long as the pirates attacked vessels of the rival empires. Autarch 19:29, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Mea culpa! The section on the Barbary Coast pirate utopias mentions signing treaties with nations in agreement not to attack that nations' vessels. So much for the independence of these areas! Autarch 19:32, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tacit support by empires? 

message: I like this whole notion by Hakim Bey, but i think it's part of his (Peter Lanborn Wilson)'s page.  It doesn't deserve it's own page.  In struggle and solidarity, -Dylanfly 17:10, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: MERGE?

message: I was rather astonished by this article when I was redirected from pirate haven. Pirate haven is a well understood historical concept; pirate utopia is a controversial neologism developed recently by a political essayist who is so fringe, he is even considered controversial in anarchist circles. I believe the material about Peter Lamborn Wilson's theories should be merged into his own article unless they can be shown to be otherwise notable, while pirate haven should be used for an article on conventional historical research. Some of the articles in the "list of examples" for this one, contain leads to help start a havens article. -- Securiger (talk) 12:10, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Split ''and'' merge ... 

message: I believe that the definitions of haven and utopia themselves not only point us in the correct direction on creating an appropriate page but will also clear up the question of bias.
Pulling definitions from Merriam Webster Online Dictionary
Haven
1  : harbor, port 
   
2  : a place of safety : refuge 
   
3  : a place offering favorable opportunities or conditions <a haven for artists>
Utopia
1: an imaginary and indefinitely remote place
2: often capitalized : a place of ideal perfection especially in laws, government, and social conditions
3: an impractical scheme for social improvement
I believe that these definitions would show that a haven is simply a port or harbor which acted as a safe place or refuge for pirates or may have simply been a place where an inability or lack of desire to enforce maritime laws made for favorable conditions for pirates which I believe any historian or laymen would be willing to admit have or still do exist. On the other hand Utopia by definition would suggest a place where the laws, government, and social conditions match someone's ideals, most likely the pirates themselves, which would inherently imply that there is bias as soon as someone says or writes that someplace is a utopia. 
I am planning on creating a page for pirate haven and fully support the idea of merging this article with the author since a pirate UTOPIA is simply his ideology on what constitutes a utopia and is no way representative of a tangible place since one man's utopia is another man's hell. --Epignosis (talk) 21:09, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  In support of haven over utopia 

message: To end this debate, I have created a separate pirate haven article, without the anarchist theories. --Zeamays (talk) 21:36, 1 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: New article: [[Pirate haven]]

message: I changed the name to Hakim Bey since "Hakim Bey" is the name he is known.
--95.8.191.160 (talk) 14:39, 3 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: This assertion has no basis in fact.  Not one shred of evidence has been presented to prove these two names refer to the same person.  On the other hand, there is evidence that "Hakim Bey" has been used by multiple authors.  The merging of the two here on WP is problematic to say the least. ---RepublicanJacobiteTheFortyFive 01:04, 12 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name 

message: Is Wilson the only one who ever wrote about "pirate utopias"? Because there may be some serious doubts about the historicity and notability then. I mean historians might not be aware of the issue and might not have created reliable sources, because it is so new and obscure. Tinynanorobots (talk) 20:44, 23 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text:  Ok, I did some research, mainly reading Wilson's writings (wow). He came up with the whole idea from his original research, and he presents it differently then it is here. For example; it appears he uses Franco as a synonym for a Algerian pidgin, not an Argot. Anyway, I will make some changes. Tinynanorobots (talk) 21:46, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Scholarship 

message: — Assignment last updated by Krisso12 (talk) 21:13, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title: Wiki Education assignment: Humanities 2 1400-present