Talk:Florida/Archive 1

message: When this page displays on my page some of the paragraphs lower in the page (universities, sports etc.) start with several list items in a smaller print size: this looks wrong. Does everyone else see this bug or is it my browser? CAn anyone fix it? --BozMo|talk 08:47, 11 Jun 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I removed off the HTML tags and fixed it. --pile0nadestalk | contribs 17:42, 24 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Type variations 

message: Shouldn't we be using U.S. customary for a U.S.-related article? We could still keep the metric in parentheses, or put the U.S. units in parentheses.
:I agree, metric usage is not acceptable or understandable by the vast majority of English speaking readers.--Britcom 13:45, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Still, most people in the U.S. don't use it. It's like in Doctor Who articles, British spellings are used. Programme instead of program, for example. Metric measurements just aren't common usage in the U.S. I wouldn't expect articles about European countries or cities to have non-metric measurements listed first, so vice versa. But that's just me. --Ebyabe 13:33, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The USA has NOT made any changeover to metric. Inclusion of metric equivalents on labels is not a changeover, it merely allows tourists to understand our quantities. Only the military and science use metrics in the USA because they work closely with metric nations. No change has been made (nor would one be accepted) by the American people at large. --Britcom 20:07, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metric 

message: I just reverted an anonymous edit that had changed the percentage of Roman Catholics from 23 to 27 percent.  There was no supporting information.  I am not aware, though, where this information orginally comes from.  If anyone thinks that the percentages of different religious groups is a misrepresentation, please try to find an appropriate source for more up-to-date info.  I have done a little bit of searching, but can't find much.  Currently our numbers add up to 97%, which seems odd, considering we have categories of "no religion" and "other religions."  Again, since I can't find a discussion of it here, I am not sure how these numbers were reached.  I'll keep looking for more current info.--Minaflorida 17:03, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Info on Orthodox Catholics should be included in the article since Florida has large a Orthodox population in it.  I hope they have not been lumped in with the Roman Catholic numbers. --Britcom 07:59, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Orthodox Catholics or Eastern Orthodox? --Kimon 14:00, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: My understanding is that most Orthodox religions consider themselves Catholic and maintian that it was actually the Roman Catholic bishop (i.e. the Pope) who broke away from the original Catholic Church, what we now call the Orthodox Church. But, in Florida I was mainly speaking of the Greek Orthodox Church, but there are others as well. --Britcom 04:37, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Religion

message: 64.12.116.131 changed the percentage of whites from 65.4 to 67.4,
the percentage of Hispanics from 16.8 to 12.8,
and the percentage of Blacks from 14.6 to 20.6.
Please don't make changes like that without referencing some current resource, and describing the change in the talk page so that people won't mistake it for vandalism!  Also, if you're going to change some figures like this, it's best to log in first, so that if people have questions about it, they can talk to you about it.
--GraemeMcRae 06:26, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Changes to the Race and Ancestry Table

message: Recently, User:JeffreyAllen1975 added the statement, The hottest temperature ever recorded was 109 °F set on June 29, 1931 in Monticello, Florida.
I was concerned about the authoritativeness (I looked it up, it's a word) of that figure.  Not that I doubt JeffreyAllen1975.  I trust, but I check.  And when I checked. I found a website for the city, epodunk.com, that says "Record high: The state's highest temperature on record was reported here on June 29, 1931, at 109 degrees," exactly matching the edit.
Still, this is a website whose main function is advertising local merchants in all areas of the U.S., not an authority on weather.  I checked weather.com, which said "The highest recorded temperature was 106°F in 1962."  Uh-Oh.  A strike against the data.  Still, with all due respect, weather.com is a company whose main goal is selling advertising -- not a respected authority.
I had a heck of a time navigating the NOAA websites, but finally managed the feat.  The main page for the NOAA's National Climatic Data Center is:
*NOAA Satellite and Information Service, National Climatic Data Center
Under the heading "Climate Info." is a link labeled "Extremes" that leads you to this page:
*Weather / Climate Events
There are dozens of links on this page.  Click the one labeled "Extreme Weather and Climate Events", which brings up this page:
*Weather extremes
Amongst the tornados and hurricanes, you will find a link to this:
*Temperature extremes and drought
Look for "All-Time Temperature Maximums By State, PDF file", and you'll see a link to this:
*Eureka! Maximum all-time temperatures by state
By the way, there's also a link for the all-time low temperatures by state, which is
*All-Time Temperature Minimums By State
The statement is hereby corroborated.  After all that, I feel I should document this somewhere a little more permanent than Florida's Talk page.  Maybe I'll make a List of All-Time High and Low Temperatures by State  That's the ticket.
Before I leave this topic, I would like to say publicly to User:JeffreyAllen1975 Thank you for putting an interesting factoid into the Wikipedia, and getting me started on this odyssey of discovery.  Without dedicated editors like you, this place wouldn't be so great!--GraemeMcRaetalk 06:17, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Record temperature -- is it really 109º? 

message: *Special:Whatlinkshere/List_of_Protestantism_by_US_State
It is POV to selectively list Protestantism and not also link, for example List of Catholicism by US State or List of Buddhism by US State.  brenneman(t)(c) 10:20, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[List of Protestantism by US State]] 

message: I think that under the cities/metro areas section, the metro areas listed should link to the metro area articles, not the city articles.  I'm prepared to make that change, but wanted to see what people thought first.
:Agree. ALC Washington 18:49, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metro areas 

message: Why not a Politics of Florida section? --Revolución (talk) 04:48, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Politics of Florida

message: I have unlinked Jones College because the current article at Jones College is for Mary Gibbs College at Rice University. -- Dalbury(Talk) 00:58, 4 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Jones College

message: An ABC store typically refers to an Alcohol Beverage Control store operated by one of the  Alcoholic beverage control states. However, this is not the case in Florida, which has hundreds of privately owned ABC alcohol retail stores.24.163.88.33 23:48, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the reason why it was taken out of the article was because it didn't contribute anything. Why does it need to be here? Why do people care? Mike H. That's hot 00:03, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You hit the nail on the head, Mike.  While that may be interesting if you are say, the proprietor of an ABC store or you own the chain (as in, using Wikipedia for advertising, a no-no anyway), I'm not sure why that was a)inserted in the "Economy" section, and b)relevant to anything in the article anyway.  Seemed overall like a glaring non-sequitur. Trevormartin227 00:11, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It might be confusing to a tourist, but that can be covered in Wikitravel. -- Donald Albury(Talk) 14:38, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: FL not an [[Alcoholic beverage control state]]

message: Why was this added to the state infobox? It could go on the History of Florida page, but I can't see how the dates of the Civil War are are relevant enough to put there, except perhaps to Civil War buffs.--Cúchullain t / c 01:31, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Former Confederate State template

message: I've often heard people discussing how messed up Florida is, and 60 minutes recently elaborated on this point. A quote from a CBS news article reads as follow, "The Sunshine State is a paradise of scandals teeming with drifters, deadbeats, and misfits drawn here by some dark primordial calling like demented trout. And you'd be surprised how many of them decide to run for public office." This is certainly a pov quote (although including pov quotes does not make an article pov), however I think it's important that at least some mention be made of this issue. For the full article you can go here. Vicarious 11:13, 27 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Florida's dark side

message: I think that there should be more information about the Civil War in this article. Was there any battle fought in Florida? Where were most of the slaves concentrated? How was the state affected; obviously it was affected in the same way as all of the other Southern states, but is there anything in particular? If anyone could help, it would be appreciated. Thanks. Stallions2010 21:38, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, there were. Around Sumter and other places (sorry I don't know more) I remember going to reinactments of particular battles. So I know there are people actively interested. I'll try to find some stuff.  KarenAnn 22:11, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Civil War 

message: Those guys are really working on it. Why don't we do the same KarenAnn 22:11, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Take a look at the State of Michigan talk page!

message: * Florida Civil War maps
* Civil War Florida News
* Florida in the Civil War
* Facts - Florida in the Civil War
* Florida Civil War Roster 
* Florida Heritage Collection Civil War in Florida
* Battle of Olustee 
* American Civil War Homepage
* Civil War in North Florida 
* Battle of Natural Bridge
If anyone wants to take up this topic these look like interesting pages. KarenAnn 23:56, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Civil War in Florida References

message: The "Important" cities and town section seems to have grown into a shopping list of every metro area, city and town in the state, sorted by population. Except for the sorted populations of the less notable places, all of this information is already in the main article, List of cities in Florida. In that the Florida article is already too long, what objections are there to ditching the entire list as duplicative below, say, the final entry on "Metro areas"? --Flawiki 15:07, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd rather have that whole section be prose anyway. We definitely don't need to mention "important" towns like Archer, Florida, approximate population around 3,000. Mike H. I did "That's hot" first! 19:31, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I deleted the towns that do not have a population greater than 25,000, because these towns, while they may be nice, are not considered important in the encyclopedic sense.  An anonymous user reverted my changes, citing some commentary about small towns...this reasoning does not justify inclusion in an encylopedia, totally irrelevent. Please visit Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not.  Not wanting to get in to a revert war, let's hear some more opinions.  Thanks Trevormartin227 17:34, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Wiping towns <25K seems a reasonable compromise. It doesn't look like the reverter is interested in discussing this though, so off it goes again. --Flawiki 12:56, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The complete and utter lack of comments supporting keeping any bits of either the city or college list is mind boggling.  It seems both of these lists are ripe for complete nuking. --Flawiki 23:32, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The city list appears to have redundancy in the list, as can be seen by DeLand & Deltona appearing twice on the list.  Also the appearance of "University" on the list seems a bit ridiculous, as it seems to incorporate both students living on campus and those living immediately off campus, along with the local population (I actually live in this area when I am attending classes, and it is just part of the greater Tampa area like Lutz and Carrolwood).  Onto the concern  on the Universities and Colleges lists: There is already a wikipage with the State Universities so why not just compile a list page to contain all the Universities and Colleges, and their Campus Locations.  EX:  "Lake Sumter Community College; Leesburg, Sumterville, Clermont." This may maintain an easily readable main FL page and still allow for easy access to the information about post-secondary education.  Those are my thoughts on the situation, and if nobody has a problem with them I will start to make some of this happen as time allows. Das Nerd 06:32, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Addressing your concerns over the list of cities: Deltona and DeLand are not actually listed twice.  The list first contains the populations of the state's collective metropolitan areas as grouped by the US Census Bureau.  First listed is Miami/Fort Lauderdale Metropolitan with over 5,000,000, then Tampa, then both Jacksonville and Orlando and decreasingly so according to each designated metropolitan area's population.  These areas are listed collectively  and are named by the US Census Bureau after the largest cities located within them.  They are grouped together because the cities located within them either border each other, or are in close proximity to each other, and thus, affect their populations and are generally considered to one large urban area.  Next down the list, you have each individual city's population, such as Jacksonville, with 700,000 people in contrast to Jacksonville meotropolitan, with a little more than 1,000,000.  The Deltona-Daytona Beach-Deland metropolitan area is the name given the the area around Daytona Beach, we first list its metropolitan population, and then below it, each major city in that metropolitan area's population is quoted individually from the metro area's whole.  As for University, the reason this is included is because the list contains both cities and census designated placees which are unincoporated communities that behave like cities but aren't.  University, in Hillsborough County, is designated as a census-designated place and has a population larger than 25,000, so it is included.  The population of the area designated as "University" most likely includes persons who list their homes in the US Census Surveys as being located within the boundaries of that particular CDP.  Thus, it is not ridiculous to place the CDP in the list as, according to the US Census Bureau, over 25,000 people list their home as being located in the Univerty CDP, Hillsborough County, Florida.  Lutz and Carrolwood, which may also be CDPs or individual cities are not listed possibly because their official population tallies have not yet reached 25,000.  Hopefully, I have been able to explain the reasons for the list being the way it is.  I have no comment on your concerns about the colleges and universities.  Thanks. -- SmthManly / ManlyTalk / ManlyContribs 06:58, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I personally don't like "University, Florida" being included, either. It may be a CDP, but it's also somewhat of a non-entity, in that the area is either called "Tampa" or "Temple Terrace," depending on what part of "University" you live in. Nobody in the area calls it "University, Florida," as if it were its own town or anything. Mike H. I did "That's hot" first! 06:58, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Important" cities and towns? 

message: What is your opinion on Florida being part of the South? On the current map showing the South (see below), northern Florida (Pensacola/Tallahassee area) is included, but southern Florida (Miami/Homestead area) isn't (or rather isn't a definite part of the South, being striped). Do y'all think that all of Florida should be included, none of it, or it is fine the way it is? Input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.Current map of the South.--Stallions2010 22:57, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Florida wasn't really all that populated until the "land booms" of the 1910s and 1920s. The railroad to Miami helped build it up but for about 50 years from 1865 to 1915, Florida was still very thinly populated. Mike H. I did "That's hot" first! 07:41, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm... seems like an attempt to divide and conquer the great state of Florida:) I think drawing a line on a map between the "Southern" and "non-Southern" parts of the state is totally arbitrary and probably misleading. Personally I would consider Florida Southern with reservations, but also something distinct. I think the whole state should be one color (I'd prefer solid over striped, it looks prettier) and the reservations should be explained in the article.--Cúchullain t/c 17:10, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I have lived in South Florida (Miami Beach) for the last five years, and I lived in North Florida (Gainesville) before that.  I agree with how the map is drawn.  Very few aspects of Southern culture are widely represented in South Florida, with fewer the further south you go.  Many people joke that Florida is actually divided into two parts: "Florida" in the North and "Cuba" in the South.  (Sobesurfski 03:42, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The map has been changed to where all of Florida is solid now. Apparently the map met some controversy. --Stallions2010 05:32, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Florida as part of the South 

message: I changed the history to refer to England/English for events prior to 1707, which is when England and Scotland joined to form the Kingdom of Great Britain. It is anachronistic to speak of British or Great Britain prior to the Acts of Union 1707. -- Donald Albury(Talk) 00:43, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  English vs. British 

message: I was struck by this statement, Their [African-Americans] proportion declined over the next century, as many moved north in the Great Migration while large numbers of northern whites moved to the state. I know it was not just northern whites. In fact, I'm pretty sure that whites from other southern states out-numbered northern whites as immigrants until after WW II. The problem is finding sources. -- Donald Albury 02:25, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Migration to Florida 

message: I'm not a Floridian and have no desire to edit this article, but I do have to say this is currently one of the worst pages of any major U.S. state article.  It needs a major overhaul and cleanup, it lacks organization but has plenty of cruft, and very little coherence or substance.  NTK 06:22, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Terrible. 

message: Moved from another section to end of page in line with normal practice.
Does anyone have unit mixes on apartments or properties in the Melbourne/Brevard County area's?
:This talk page is for discussing the contents and format of the article on 'Florida'. I suggest you look for on-line apartment guides for Brevard County. -- Donald Albury 15:27, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Question on apartments

message: There's no way that the state averages 300 days of full sunshine per year.  That would mean at least 83% sunshine averaged over the entire state, and that's assuming all of the other days are completely overcast (but also assuming that the # of "full sunshine days" are evenly distributed throughout the year).  In general, this section could use many more sources. Ufwuct 21:48, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, I really doubt it. In the past 10 or so times I've been to Florida, 3 of those trips have been rained out, and it's usually only sunny in the winter (or at least that's the case when I go, especially in January). 1ne 21:47, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

text: I removed the dubious assertion. I have heard that described about many places, including Southern California. If anything, it's more of a tourism slogan about Florida, with no evidence to back it in reality. Mike H. I did "That's hot" first! 00:48, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Dubious assertion regarding sunshine

message: The Wikipedia:WikiProject U.S. states format has been updated to include a new Sports section, that covers collegiate sports, amateur sports, and non-team sports (such as hunting and fishing).  Please feel free to add this new heading, and supply information about sports in Florida.  Please see South_carolina#Sports_in_South_Carolina as an example. NorCalHistory 16:39, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New ''Sports'' section added to updated [[Wikipedia:WikiProject U.S. states]] format  

message: I changed the area of Florida, I used information form the 2000 census, as the previous data had no source I figured this was ok.  However, I wasn't sure how to cite it properly.Lotu 06:44, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Area  of Florida 

message: Semi-protection has been requested for the article due to vandalism. --Britcom 09:52, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-Protection 

message: Under External links can some one please remove MyFlorida.Com - The Official Portal of the State of Florida because this is a duplicate link that already exists in the article's InfoBox, and unfortunately because the article is semi-protected I can't change it. Thank you in advance. 151.198.148.170 05:48, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The link has been removed--Britcom 22:42, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Request For Removal of Duplicate Link

message: While it makes sense to include Spanish Florida in WikiProject Spain, I think including this article in that project is a bit too much. I'm uncomfortable with the proliferation of project tags I see on many talk pages. Too many cooks and all that. -- Donald Albury 01:35, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  WikiProject Spain tag 

message: Semi-protection has been requested...again.  Children should find somewhere else to play or I am going to call your mother. --Britcom 08:37, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Persistent Vandalism 

message: What is the nickname of florida? That should be included in the geography or something so when you get a chance could you please pu that in their. Thanks —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.111.2.46 (talk) 18:55, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Nicknames of states, cities, etc. are always listed in the infobox, usually below the flag and seal, if applicable.  In this case, it's "The Sunshine State."  Since it really has nothing to do with geography, there's no need for it to be there.  However, it's standard to be in the same place on all infoboxes. EaglesFanInTampa (formerly Jimbo) 19:14, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nickname of Florida 

message: Nevada got outpaced by Arizona in 2006, making it the second fastest growing state. Florida, I believe, is 3rd.
Plus, the source justifying it leads to a link that doesn't work.
: If you have a source, then please do edit the article and include a link to the source here. --Britcom 16:01, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have made the edit for you, I would encourage you to set up a user account for yourself as this page is often protected due to continued vandalism from some immature users. No personal questions are asked in the process of setting up a user account and it is a fairly quick and simple process. And also remember to "sign" your posts on the talk pages using 4 tildes ( ~~~~ ) (usually to the left of the #1 key on your keyboard) this will automagicly insert the time and date and your IP address (or username if you have one) so we can keep track of who said what here. --Britcom 06:48, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Second Fastest Growing State? 

message: Hello, my name is rich from dhms in drexel hill i used to live in florida i i think u should post up in florida the nature in the everglades and all animals an how buetiful it is because if u have experienced it by first hand then u will know wut im talking about thank you and good-bye[[Category:147.31.184.143 16:34, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  whoo 

message: "Crackers" is a racial slur. The claim that white Floridians affectionately refer to themselves as "Crackers" needs citation.
:"Cracker" is sometimes used as a racial slur, but may have not been originally. I know many people who talk about the "Florida crackers" and refer to them affectionately (or even call themselves that). I don't think I can give you a source that definitively says it myself but if you look for the information it's out there. It is definitely not just a racial slur. To say it is that is without background.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_cracker 75.104.47.114 15:13, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It can be used as a racial epithet, for instance when referring to "cracker cops" or it can imply that a particular white person has racist or unenlightened attitudes ("that cracker down the street who trains his dog to growl at black folks"). As the Wikipedia article says, it can also be used as a proud self-descriptor with no racial overtones whatsoever. The meaning comes from the intent and context of the usage. I'm not sure what's so hard to understand about that. Twalls 16:04, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree completely. 75.104.47.114 01:39, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think "cracker" is a racial slur anymore than redneck is a racial slur. Both refer to a stereotype people with a certain background.  I think if cracker is used as an epithet, it is mainly used in that manner outside of Florida, so the Floridan usage is not considered offensive here since it has a sense of meaning almost unique to Florida.--Britcom 09:24, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  To the original poster: Quit trying to be P.C.- you have no idea what you're talking about. Read Patrick D. Smith's "A Land Remembered" to learn about crackers. 130.134.81.16 17:07, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Racially Offensive terms