Wikipedia talk:Selected anniversaries/December 8

message: :Prevously posted on WP:ERRORS:
(12/8) Not an error exactly, but I would have worded it  1980 - Former Beatle John Lennon was shot and killed outside of the Dakota apartments in New York City.   Why give Chapman the publicity? Tvoz |talk 05:26, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: While I agree with your point, but the re-write you suggested is in the passive voice.  I suppose the preference here is to use the active voice.  ~Sasha Callahan (Talk) 05:41, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Those positions aren't opposites - they could both be satisfied with a version like "...Lennon died of gunshots outside of..." or "...gunshots received outside of..." Art LaPella (talk) 06:00, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: True, I was only commenting on the suggestion given.  How about "Former Beattle John Lennon dies of four gunshot wounds, including one to the heart, sustained outside the Dakota"  ~Sasha Callahan (Talk) 06:09, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That would be fine - I wasn't thinking about the active vs passive voice.  Tvoz |talk 16:21, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

text: Why give Chapman the publicity? He's had that since 2004... Zzyzx11 (Talk) 06:37, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Surely that's not a good enough reason to continue it. Tvoz |talk 16:21, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia is an encyclopedia.  Our concern here is presenting information.  To withhold pertinent (and already widely-available) information because we don't like the guy is not exactly the encyclopedic thing to do. -Elmer Clark (talk) 20:27, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not a matter of withholding information - it's a matter of how the item is slanted,  what is the emphasis.  The notable thing that happened on Dec 8 1980 is what happened to Lennon - and I think it should not have been framed in terms of Chapman's action, making him the centerpiece- it is about Lennon's death.  Active voice is not the most important consideration anyway - but even with it there are ways of stating this without making it a piece of news about Chapman. Do we say On September 30, 1955, Donald Turnupseed crossed into the car lane that James Dean was driving in, and killed him?  For all I know we do, and if so, I'd object there too. It's news about James Dean, even  if we have to write it in passive voice, not news about Donald Turnupseed.  Tvoz |talk 03:10, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Pretty much any sentence can be re-written into the active voice.   For the example you gave "James Dean dies after a car crash on..." ~Sasha Callahan (Talk) 03:16, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Right, as you suggested above:  Former Beatle John Lennon dies after four gunshot wounds, including one to the heart etc.  My objection is to the construction Mark David Chapman does such and such. If he had shot and killed an anonymous person that day it would have made the news in New York, but it wouldn't be commemorated 27 years later, is my guess.  The story is not about Chapman, it's about Lennon,  and the item should be about Lennon, that's all.  Can we note the archives so the same thing isn't perpetuated next year?   Tvoz |talk 03:23, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  If Chapman didn't shoot, there would be no story. Both are important. Lennon is more important, though. Please leave things as is. --74.13.130.57 (talk) 05:52, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: My point exactly - Lennon is more important. I don't care if we include Chapman's name or not - this isn't about "don't speak the monster's name", it's merely putting the focus on the important person in the exchange, not somehow elevating Chapman into equal or greater importance in the event. We also wouldn't say Yoko Ono watches as her husband John Lennon is shot dead in front of her.   If we must, put Chapman in at the end of the sentence - but the focus should be on Lennon - if he had been hit by a cab it wouldn't say Joe Cabdriver runs over John Lennon, killing him. Or it shouldn't. Tvoz |talk 18:35, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: John Lennon

message: The prevailing theory is that Lennon was murdered, not assassinated. Or, more precisely, when people say Lennon was "assassinated," they tend to mean he was sent by the CIA to kill Lennon. If you say Lennon was murdered (as most people do) you tend to believe he was killed by a nutcase.JoelWhy (talk) 19:04, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Changed to "shot and killed". howcheng  {chat} 20:23, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: John Lennon -- Murdered vs. Assassinated

message: *Swapped out and moved to Ineligible for maintenance reasons: Constitution of Romania, Biblioteca Ambrosiana, Union of South American Nations 
*Moved to Ineligible for maintenance reasons: Chełmno extermination camp
*New articles (unused): Brookings Institution, Queen Street massacre
*Swapped out: Pan Am Flight 214, John the bookmaker controversy
*Swapped in: Immaculate Conception (5th appearance, last in 2007), German Imperial War Council of 8 December 1912 (first appearance), Death of John Lennon (3rd appearance, last in 2009), Commonwealth of Independent States (6th appearance, last in 2009)
*Left in: Lithuanian Civil War (1431–1435) (2nd consecutive appearance, 2 total)
*Note: Bodhi Day may also be December 8 for places other than Japan, see Talk:Bodhi Day#Date of observance.
--howcheng  {chat} 22:27, 10 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  2011 notes 

message: *Moved to Ineligible: Brookings Institution (maintenance)
*Omitted: Lithuanian Civil War (1431–1435); German Imperial War Council of 8 December 1912; Death of John Lennon (Imagine (song) is TFA for 2012) 
*Included: Battle of Hong Kong (4th appearance, last in 2007; rescued from Ineligible); Queen Street massacre (first appearance; 25th anniversary); IKAROS (first appearance)
*Repeats: Ineffabilis Deus (2nd consecutive appearance, 6 total); Commonwealth of Independent States (2nd consecutive appearance, 7 total)
—howcheng  {chat} 12:49, 7 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  2012 notes 

message: *Moved to Ineligible: German Imperial War Council of 8 December 1912 (maintenance)
*New articles (ineligible): Battle of Canhe Slope (maintenance)
*Omitted: Battle of Hong Kong; Queen Street massacre; Commonwealth of Independent States; IKAROS (ineligible—maintenance)
*Included: Chełmno extermination camp (6th appearance, last in 2009; rescued from Ineligible); Pan Am Flight 214 (2nd appearance, last in 2010; 50th anniversary); First Intifada (first appearance; rescued from Ineligible); December 2009 Baghdad bombings (first appearance)
*Repeats: Immaculate Conception (3rd consecutive appearance, 7 total)
—howcheng  {chat} 05:31, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  2013 notes 

message: *Omitted: Chełmno extermination camp; Pan Am Flight 214; First Intifada; December 2009 Baghdad bombings
*Included: Lithuanian Civil War (1431–35) (3rd appearance, last in 2011); Battle of Hong Kong (5th appearance, last in 2012); Death of John Lennon (4th appearance, last in 2011); John the bookmaker controversy (2nd appearance, last in 2010)
*Repeats: Immaculate Conception (4th consecutive appearance, 8 total)
—howcheng  {chat} 09:08, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  2014 notes 

message: *Moved to Ineligible: First Intifada (maintenance)
*Omitted: Lithuanian Civil War (1431–35); Immaculate Conception; Battle of Hong Kong (ineligible—maintenance); Death of John Lennon; John the bookmaker controversy
*Included: Margaret Hughes (first appearance); Symphony No. 7 (Beethoven) (first appearance); Pan Am Flight 214 (3rd appearance, last in 2013); Queen Street massacre (2nd appearance, last in 2012); 2013 Little India riot (first appearance)
—howcheng  {chat} 17:44, 6 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  2015 notes 

message: *Omitted: Feast of the Immaculate Conception (ineligible—maintenance); Constitution of Romania (ineligible—maintenance); Symphony No. 7 (Beethoven); Pan Am Flight 214; Queen Street massacre; 2013 Little India riot
*Included: Paul Kruger (5th appearance, last in 2009; moved from December 30); Chełmno extermination camp (7th appearance, last in 2013; 75th anniversary); Commonwealth of Independent States (8th appearance, last in 2012; 25th anniversary); IKAROS (2nd appearance, last in 2012)
*Repeats: Margaret Hughes (2nd consecutive appearance, 2 total)
—howcheng  {chat} 19:12, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  2016 notes 

message: *Moved to Ineligible: 2013 Little India riot (maintenance)
*New articles (unused): Ann T. Bowling
*Omitted: Margaret Hughes; Paul Kruger; Chełmno extermination camp; Commonwealth of Independent States; IKAROS
*Included: Lithuanian Civil War (1432–1438) (4th appearance, last in 2014); Symphony No. 7 (Beethoven) (2nd appearance, last in 2015); Operation Python (first appearance); Queen Street massacre (3rd appearance, last in 2015; 30th anniversary); December 2009 Baghdad bombings (2nd appearance, last in 2013); Adolph Menzel (first appearance); George Boole (first appearance); John Banville (first appearance)
—howcheng  {chat} 16:52, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  2017 notes 

message: *Omitted: Lithuanian Civil War (1432–1438); Symphony No. 7 (Beethoven); Operation Python; Queen Street massacre; December 2009 Baghdad bombings; Adolph Menzel; George Boole; John Banville
*Included: Margaret Hughes (3rd appearance, last in 2016); Paul Kruger (6th appearance, last in 2016); Pan Am Flight 214 (4th appearance, last in 2015); John the bookmaker controversy (3rd appearance, last in 2014; 20th anniversary); 2013 Little India riot (2nd appearance, last in 2015; rescued from Ineligible); John Peckham (first appearance); Georges Méliès (first appearance); Ann T. Bowling (first appearance)
—howcheng  {chat} 16:39, 8 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  2018 notes 

message: *Omitted: Margaret Hughes; Paul Kruger; Pan Am Flight 214; John the bookmaker controversy; 2013 Little India riot; John Peckham; Georges Méliès; Ann T. Bowling
*Included: Symphony No. 7 (Beethoven) (3rd appearance, last in 2017); Immaculate Conception (9th appearance, last in 2014); Chełmno extermination camp (8th appearance, last in 2016); United Airlines Flight 553 (first appearance); December 2009 Baghdad bombings (3rd appearance, last in 2017; 10th anniversary); John Pym (first appearance); Father Mathew (first appearance); Yuliya Krevsun (first appearance)
—howcheng  {chat} 17:56, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  2019 notes 

message: *Rescued from Ineligible (unused): First Intifada
*Omitted: Symphony No. 7 (Beethoven) (ineligible—maintenance); Immaculate Conception (still appears as an observance); Chełmno extermination camp; United Airlines Flight 553; December 2009 Baghdad bombings; John Pym; Father Mathew; Yuliya Krevsun
*Included: Lithuanian Civil War (1432–1438) (5th appearance, last in 2017); Paul Kruger (7th appearance, last in 2018); Brookings Institution (first appearance; rescued from Ineligible); Murder of John Lennon (5th appearance, last in 2014; 40th anniversary); IKAROS (3rd appearance, last in 2016; 10th anniversary); Antonio de Benavides (first appearance); John Banville (2nd appearance, last in 2017; 75th birthday); Ann T. Bowling (2nd appearance, last in 2018; 20th anniversary)
—howcheng  {chat} 03:52, 10 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  2020 notes 

message: *New articles (unused): Jewish cemetery of Salonica
*Omitted: Lithuanian Civil War (1432–1438); Paul Kruger; Brookings Institution; Murder of John Lennon; IKAROS; Antonio de Benavides; John Banville; Ann T. Bowling
*Included: Margaret Hughes (4th appearance, last in 2018); Ineffabilis Deus (2nd appearance, last in 2009); Chełmno extermination camp (9th appearance, last in 2019; 80th anniversary); Operation Python (2nd appearance, last in 2017; 50th anniversary); Commonwealth of Independent States (9th appearance, last in 2016; 30th anniversary); Maria Josepha of Austria (first appearance); Jean Sibelius (first appearance); Betty Holberton (first appearance; 20th anniversary)
—howcheng  {chat} 08:36, 9 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  2021 notes