Talk:Great Lent

message: :Does anyone fancy working on WikiProject Christian liturgical year? Gareth Hughes 11:08, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Liturgical year

message: Does there really need to be two seperate listing for Western Lent and Orthodox Lent? Zach82 02:34, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: As someone who has belonged to both traditions, the nature of the seasons has diverged considerably; they are observed differently and have different dates. Wsbhopkin 13:55, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: On the other hand, there is only one page for Easter Wsbhopkin 13:56, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

text: This is true: but I think the same reconing applies: the two celebrations are so manifestly different that to do them both justice they should be treated seperately. The article on Orthodox Easter should be titled "Pascha" (with perhaps a brief discussion and a link to it in the [Western] Easter article). MishaPan 19:08, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know.  In my experience converts tend to exaggerate the differences based more on the convert’s own ignorance of the beliefs and practices of his previous sect.  The article mentions differences of habit and ceremony, but it doesn't have anything to say on the difference of significance or underlying theology.  If you could, perhaps, provide any genuine differences outside of "Golly, out Lent is a couple weeks longer!" then perhaps it might justify a seperate article. Zach82 17:15, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

text: If I may be so bold, speaking as someone who studied western liturgics before becoming Orthodox myself and beginning the study of eastern liturgics (23 years ago), the difference is quite a lot more than simply the length of the Fast (which, by the way, is not the case; both traditions fast for 40 days, the difference is how they count the 40 days). In addition to that rather minor difference, the entire structure, theory, and theological approach is different between the two traditions. In some cases, diametrical opposites exist (West: no "Alleluias"; East: more "Alleluias" than normal. West: Ash Wednesday [with the Imposition of Ashes]; East: Clean Monday [with the admonition not to mark one's face, but to wash one's face], etc.). Great Lent, in fact, provides one of the most interesting formats for studying the differences between the two traditions. Orthodox Great Lent is such a rich subject, it could occupy numerous pages, and really deserves a separate treatment--and a much more detailed one than this page currently provides. MishaPan 01:29, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Pray go ahead and propose changes to this article then.  You are the expert after all.  As the article stands Great Lent and Lent aren't sounding all that different- when you really get down to it they are both seasons of penitential preparation for Easter, sectarianism aside.Zach82 04:00, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Gentlemen, you're both right. They are the same concept - a season of penitential preparation for Easter, but there's so much to say that it might be overloading one page to put the practices of East and West in a single page.InfernoXV 06:08, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

text: More like Easter is the english word of Pascha... :P Besides, who wants to use Easter it just calls for all the detractors to bring up pagan roots. "Easter is from ester!" or whatever. Anyway, Pascha is what it is called by most Orthodox, not Easter.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.73.114.111 (talk) 22:12, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Well in French, Italian, Spanish, Catalan, Portuguese, Dutch, and Danish, the word for Easter is similar to the Greek one, with the pak- root, which was taken from the Hebrew Pesach.  Only English and German are different.  Just another example of how semantics are misinterpreted by English speakers to create false differences between Eastern and Western Christianity.  I mean, how fucking stupid is this that we have a separate articles for "Lent" and "Great Lent".  Skyduster (talk) 17:27, 28 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: On the other hand, the English translation "Passover" is really congenial. :-) --131.159.0.47 (talk) 13:52, 4 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Do we need two seperate articles?

message: When I began editing the article today, it had the  tags at the beginning and end of the article. Looking at WP:noinclude, I couldn't see any reason why they should be in this article, so I removed them. But I thought I should mention it here in case there was a relevant reason for them being where they were. MishaPan (talk) 18:22, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Noinclude?

message: I will be experimenting here on constructing the calendar for Great Lent suggested above. It may take me some time, so I'm doing the experimenting here rather than on the article's main page.
Great LentCalendar of days in the Lenten Triodion
Sunday                                   	Monday                               	Tuesday                              	Wednesday                            	Thursday                             	Friday                               	Saturday
Zacchaeus Sunday                         	Week of the Publican and the Pharisee	Week of the Publican and the Pharisee	Week of the Publican and the Pharisee	Week of the Publican and the Pharisee	Week of the Publican and the Pharisee	Week of the Publican and the Pharisee
Sunday of thePublican and Pharisee       	Week of the Prodigal Son             	Week of the Prodigal Son             	Week of the Prodigal Son             	Week of the Prodigal Son             	Week of the Prodigal Son             	Week of the Prodigal Son
Sunday of theProdigal Son                	Meatfare Week                        	Meatfare Week                        	Meatfare Week                        	Meatfare Week                        	Meatfare Week                        	Saturday of the Dead
Sunday of theLast Judgment(Meatfare Sun.)	Cheesefare Week                      	Cheesefare Week                      	Cheesefare Week                      	Cheesefare Week                      	Cheesefare Week                      	Saturday of theHoly Ascetic Fathers
Sunday ofForgiveness(Cheesefare Sun.)    	Clean Monday(First Day ofGreat Lent) 	First Week of Great Lent(Clean Week) 	First Week of Great Lent(Clean Week) 	First Week of Great Lent(Clean Week) 	First Week of Great Lent(Clean Week) 	Theodore Saturday
Orthodoxy Sunday                         	Second Week of Great Lent            	Second Week of Great Lent            	Second Week of Great Lent            	Second Week of Great Lent            	Second Week of Great Lent            	Saturday of the Dead
Sunday ofSt. Gregory Palamas             	Third Week of Great Lent             	Third Week of Great Lent             	Third Week of Great Lent             	Third Week of Great Lent             	Third Week of Great Lent             	Saturday of the Dead
Sunday ofthe Cross                       	Fourth Week of Great Lent            	Fourth Week of Great Lent            	Fourth Week of Great Lent            	Fourth Week of Great Lent            	Fourth Week of Great Lent            	Saturday of the Dead
Sunday of St. John Climacus              	Fifth Week of Great Lent             	Fifth Week of Great Lent             	Fifth Week of Great Lent             	Thursday of theGreat Canon           	                                	Saturday of the Akathist
Sunday ofSt. Mary of Egypt               	Sixth Week of Great Lent             	Sixth Week of Great Lent             	Sixth Week of Great Lent             	Sixth Week of Great Lent             	(Last day ofGreat Lent)              	Lazarus Saturday
Palm Sunday                              	Holy and GreatMonday                 	Holy and GreatTuesday                	Holy and GreatWednesday              	Holy and GreatThursday               	Holy and GreatFriday                 	Holy and GreatSaturday
I haven't yet figured out how to display each day as a seperate cell and still have text like "First Week of Great Lent" span more than one cell, so I can't number each day as I'd like. MishaPan (talk) 22:21, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Lenten calendar

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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message: I can't tell about the russian tradition, but the Good Friday section for the greek tradition is wrong. The Descent from the Cross and the removal of the soma are part of Royal Hours service in the morning (not the afternoon), and so is the placement of the Epitaphios inside the decorate catafalque at the centre of the church. C messier (talk) 08:04, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: So why not find a source that says so and then correct it? (But if you would prefer to put a draft here for comment, before moving to the main article, please do.) 𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 14:27, 19 March 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: , I found a source mentioning it is during the morning, but it isn't as detailed as the unsourced description here. C messier (talk) 15:24, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
replies: text:  Almost by definition, any reasonably credible source has far greater standing than an unsourced assertion, so definitely go ahead and replace it. If anybody has better evidence, let them produce it. Thank you for digging out this source, that is always the hard part (but, IMO, the most interesting part) of building a credible article. Once found, anybody can make the citation look pretty for example like this:  (Translation by Google Translate so possibly can be improved?) Any probs, feel free to give me another ping. --𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 16:33, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Accuracy