Talk:List of twelve-step groups/Archive 1

message: I removed all of the hoaxes.  Many groups should probably be removed as they're not notable. Groups without meetings, for instance, should be identified and removed. -- Craigtalbert 10:29, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  List Needs Clean-up 

message: I removed all the groups that didn't have any indication that there were any face-to-face meetings from the list. Call it WP:N or WP:EL but every idea someone had for a group that they made a website for doesn't deserve to be listed here. -- Craigtalbert 07:47, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If the groups do not publish or make available a directory of meetings it is WP:LINKSPAM, and they can't be included on this list. -- Craigtalbert 21:39, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Please mind WP:FORUM. In response to your other comments, yes, I am aware of closed meetings and that many groups meet irregularly, and still others meet over the phone or online. However, we can't allow people to use wikipedia and a vehicle from promoting non-notable groups. If a "group" does not have meetings, then they are certainly non-notable and do not belong on this list. -- Craigtalbert 02:21, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Please mind WP:CIVIL. A good way to solve this problem would be to produce reliable sources documenting your claims. -- Craigtalbert 07:21, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Please read WP:COI, WP:LINKSPAM, WP:RS, WP:N and WP:V. -- Craigtalbert 07:21, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed theoretical groups 

message: Attn. Graig:
I am not speeking for the ANA and MediaA groups as there are no authorities but as a members. First of all, as much as I can empatize with fellow members in their heated attempts to reason with you, I want to apologise for any upset or misunderstanding this may have caused. 
Secondly...it  is not our intention to spam or the promote anything ...Wikipedia has created an oportunity to "edit" and we did that and it appears that you are taking it upon yourself, what appears on this end like juvenile behaviour and remove all our postings ...do you have a personal objection to our groups? If so please let us know so that we can respond.
Other members already have posted information in response to all your objections i.e.: in terms of "reliable sources" etc.
We have updates of our pages with "Historical Documents -PDF"  that includes a cc. of an article in "Adbusters" and the date of an announcement in the International Herald Tribune.
In reply to your request that we list meeting info. we wrote that many members do not use the web and that although meetings are frequent they are not regular as we use telecommunications in a real time bassis and have meetings whenever we need to. The Clock can also a form of media addiction. Having comlied with all of these when we re-enter our data you write that we are spamming.....did you review this material? What is your reply?
 
If Wikidedia does not want people to edit the pages they should let people know in advance. Instead of presenting themesleves as open to public editing and then having censorship and threats to ban any one who attempts to publish.
I think that there is enough room in cyberspace for a few lines on incumbent 12 step meetings ...you list meetings that are non 12 step oriented ...what objection can you have to groups that are 12 step oriented but are to small to have the main stream media "reliable sources"  report on them or that do not have "regular meeting lists".
12 Step programs are not a "Who's Who" of the orthodoxy...our groups are in the main based on the oral tradition and this does not mean that we are in your words a "hoax" or a "fraud". 
I think that if you want to practice compassion and do the Buddha thing and like MFT12X12 suggested and "get off the centre of the universe" and see your actions objectively you will have to agree there is probably some real egoism here that is blocking the commonweal...but it is not my business to take your "moral invnetory" here. I am speaking as an ehticist here and in terms of ethical behaviour, I think it is important to keep an open mind and realize that not all 12 Step organizations will fit, or need to fit into your world view to be legitimate and that it is not your mandate to be the censor, in a page that is open to the public to edit ...it is like a lamp post that everyone uses to pin up posters ...is it your job to pull them off? If Wikipedia is a private property and you are the proprietor and you do not wish to have incumbent groups posted that is one thing...then this fact needs to be displayed so as not to mislead the public users. 
On the other hand if the page is not open for the public to edit ...a notice of this fact should be placed on it i.e.: this is a private space and we monitor what appears here. 
In my opinion if we are talking reasonably about communications protocol, then this is what would be appropriate. 
There is 98% junk on the internet and I think that the information that we provide is worthy of a a few bytes of space, in a commons space like Wikipedia is offering here and there must be many other more notable items on the web, that need the efforts of a censor.
If you are sincere about "clean up" and "legitimacy" of our 12 step programs we invite you to become a member and find our for yourself if our "meetings" and our program is for real. If not then we beseach you to stop censoring us, smearing us with these negative lables of "Hoax" and "Fraud" and to have compassion and mutual respect in your affairs towards our organization and it's members. 
Thank You for your openness
Unconditional Love and Peace
Hartcomm 15:53, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not upset, and none of this is personal. I have reviewed the information you have posted, and I don't see anything to establish the notability of your groups. Wikipedia has several guidelines that are intended to keep articles encyclopedic and to prevent misuse, and I believe I am following them. I have cited the ones I feel are relevant when making changes. Reasonable people can disagree, but I believe the guidelines are very clear in this case. -- Craigtalbert 21:03, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

text: I never called your groups a hoax. There were a few hoax groups I removed from the list in March, and they were hoaxes. I later removed groups that are non-notable. I'm sorry that you disagree with me. You can put in a Request for Comment and get the opinion of other wikipedia editors on this issue. -- Craigtalbert 20:29, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  12 Step listings on pages that are open to public edit should not be censored 

message: I posted a "warning" about Narconon at the top of the Nar-Anon article to match the ones in the Narcotics Anonymous and Narconon articles. Having a paragraph dedicated to it here seems a little ham-handed, the current disambiguation information proceeding the other articles is more than adequate. I'm removing removing the paragraph from this article. - Craigtalbert 10:24, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Narconon paragraph 

message: Hello, I do not see GamAnon listed under 12 step programs. GamAnon is similiar to AlAnon as it is for any person that has been affected by the gambling problem. Its a very important and crucial program to list. Please include this in your listings. Thank you very much, Hugnkiss22.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hugnkiss22 (talk • contribs) 18:30, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I included GamAnon. I was on the fence about what friends/family auxiliary groups to put on the list, since the less notable ones are usually mentioned in the articles of the "primary" organization. That was good enough reason to avoid making a decision about it. -- Craigtalbert 19:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gam Anon 

message: I want to suggest an alternative to the traditional wording and perspective of the 12 steps. Instead of being oriented to an external higher power, it is self-directed. It is called "The Proactive Twelve Steps" and can be found at http://www.proactivechange.com/12steps
I am not entering this info as an edit because I have a conflict of interest. 
Wikizeno 13:09, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I would be happy to make such an edit for you, if you can supply reliable sources documenting the notability of The Proactive Twelve Steps. -- Scarpy (talk) 17:38, 13 July 2008 (UTC)

text: By reliable sources, I mean according to wikipedia's standards, e.g. books or journals with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. -- Scarpy (talk) 19:08, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alternative to the traditional 12 steps 

message: Thank you very much for adding Gamanon and the website!Hugnkiss22 22:56, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gamanon 

message: Having three meetings (not groups -- meetings) does not make "Slaves Anonymous" an established organization.  Sorry. -- Craigtalbert 15:36, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Slaves Anonymous 

message: I'm responding to a request posted on Wikipedia:Third opinion. Here are my opinions:
* An editor with a conflict of interest should not be editing this article; at best that editor can propose an addition on the talk page.
* It is well known that links on Wikipedia attract traffic to a site. In that sense, any link posted on an article is potentially promotional. A link put there by someone associated with the site is therefore definitely promotional, and should be deleted immediately.
* The opinions of an editor with a conflict of interest should have zero weight on whether his/her organization deserves a mention in the article, because of the conflict of interest.
* Overall, this article has no business providing external links to any of the organizations listed. If the entities aren't notable enough to have their own Wikipedia article, they shouldn't be listed here at all. The individual articles should each have an external link to the subject organization. I'm tempted to propose this article for deletion due to lack of notability of much of the content.
That last point probably isn't what either of you wanted to see, but there you have it. The link to PAA should go, as well as the others. ~Amatulić (talk) 22:15, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You're right, I removed the nns. -- Scarpy (talk) 22:55, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Third opinion

message: Not including the ones listed on the Addiction recovery groups page.
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Adult_Children_of_Alcoholics - 3521 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Al-Anon/Alateen - 992 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Clutterers_Anonymous - 512 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Co-Dependents_Anonymous - 1699 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Co-Anon - 50
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/COSA - 686 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/COSLAA - 1 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Debtors_Anonymous - 670 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Emotions_Anonymous - 1195 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Emotional_Health_Anonymous - 166
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Gamblers_Anonymous - 1085 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Gam-Anon - 22
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Gam-A-Teen - 24
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Neurotics_Anonymous - 561 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Nar-Anon - 447 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Overeaters_Anonymous - 2419
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Online_Gamers_Anonymous - 863
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Sexaholics_Anonymous - 2166 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Sex_Addicts_Anonymous - 2612
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Sexual_Compulsives_Anonymous - 1028
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Smokers_Anonymous - 86 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Sex_and_Love_Addicts_Anonymous - 1549
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Workaholics_Anonymous - 714 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Celebrate_Recovery - 974
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/GROW - 2883 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/LDS_Family_Services - 322
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Parents_Anonymous - 129 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Pagans_In_Recovery - 449 
* http://stats.grok.se/en/200809/Schizophrenics_Anonymous - 183
-- Scarpy (talk) 08:13, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Page List 

message: you are not mis-informed on your fellowship vs programs. The groups are all fellowships / the members work and practice a program. Please stop this mis-information.
they are fellowships that work a program found in thier books. Please get it correct. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Petermixt (talk • contribs) 18:55, July 20, 2007 (MST)
: No, I'm not. I will point you to the directions I gave in my previous email. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Scarpy (talk • contribs) 19:34, July 20, 2007 (MST)
:: sorry bud - but you are just repeating the most common mistake of all. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Petermixt (talk • contribs)) 20:26, July 20, 2007 (MST)
::: Maybe I am. If you had some reliable sources on the topic, you could easily prove me wrong.
::: At any rate, I will no longer respond to emails on this topic. I will post the converstation on the articles talk page, where it belongs:
::: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:List_of_twelve-step_groups
::: Decisions made on article content should be transparent whenever possible. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Scarpy (talk • contribs) 20:56, July 20, 2007 (MST)
:::: Well - I've been wrong also - we recently brought this question up at the board level. Seems :::: the answer to this began with the Cocaine Anonymous pamphlet "Guide to the 12-steps".
:::: http://www.ca.org/literature/guideto12steps.htm
:::: They published it years ago.. it states that CA - does not have a program of their own -- but :::: rather thy use the program found in the book, Alcoholics Anonymous. Some of them used the NA :::: book, but what is significant is that they recognized the difference between the fellowship of :::: AA and the Program of AA which is in that Big Book,
 
:::: http://alcoholism.about.com/library/weekly/aa010716a.htm
:::: http://powerfullyrecovered.com/articles/essays/programvfellowship.htm
 
:::: ok --- now dinner. Have a great evening.
 
:::: Pete —Preceding unsigned comment added by Petermixt (talk • contribs) 21:18, July 20, 2007 (MST)
::::: These are not reliable sources, but they are interesting. At any rate, while this may be true in the organizations that copied AA the most assiduously, the program in many of them includes more than the Twelve Steps and Traditions: e.g. Debtors Anonymous (spending plan), Overeaters Anonymous (food plans), Sexual Compulsives Anonymous (sexual recovery plans), Workaholics Anonymous (abstinence plans). There are several other examples. In fact, EHA, EA, and NAIL don't suggest any kind of abstinence or behavioral changes at all. But if you substitute programs for fellowships again, I don't see that the difference is large enough to fight about.  -- Scarpy (talk) 03:59, 21 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  From my email: Conversation with [[User:Petermixt]] 

message: If anyone is interested, there is relevant discussion on this topic at the following pages: 
* User:Petermixt/User_talk:Petermixt
* Wikipedia:Help desk#Legal threat over article language (will be archived  here)
* User talk:Barneca#Could you have a look please for me also? (will probably be archived here)
I have suggested that Peter make the language changes to the articles that he's advocated for (e.g. groups/programs --> fellowships). Although he's requested that I make them, I don't want to make these changes for him espeically since (even though they've been withdrawn), it comes after two legal threats. The pressure to do it feels like I'm being coerced more than it feels like collaboration. He seems competent enough to edit wikipedia and Barneca additionally suggested he try using the WP:OTRS. -- Scarpy (talk) 21:24, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Update 

message: It's all in the archives. I am not unsympathetic to the groups that might be notable, but don't have an article demonstrating it. In fact I've created several because of this, and have been keeping track on this list above. -- Scarpy (talk) 00:13, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: One citation mentioning that a meeting exists is not enough to show notability of groups. No discussion of topic. Removing these again. -- Scarpy (talk) 15:34, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Consensus to only include notable groups 

message: 'Notable'? By whose standards......?!  Many of the organizations stricken from the list are sizable and widespread. Who defines 'notable'?  Just because no one has gotten around to writing a wiki article about something doesn't mean that it is 'not notable'.  The idea that an organization must have a wiki article to be considered notable is very wiki-centric to say the least. Its as if nothing exists until it is first written about in wikipedia...
70.215.167.217 (talk) 07:14, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: look up WP:NOTE to better understand what we mean by that term.  I have also placed a "welcome" template on your page, to better familiarize you with Wikipedia policies.  The reason for the "should have a wiki article" statement is that if it does have a wiki article (and you will note that there are many MANY who do) than it shows that there is enough coverage and secondary sources to justify inclusion in this article.Coffeepusher (talk) 13:48, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

text: .158, what would be your standard for notability? Number of meetings? How long it's been established? Should groups someone thought up on a whim last night be included? Without reliable sources documenting size or history of groups, what assurance would readers have that the information is correct? Lip Balm Anonymous appeared on this list for several months because there was no oversight or criteria established. -- Scarpy (talk) 19:47, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

text: this conversation would go a lot smother if you could tell us which of your groups didn't meet this standard but would meet the standard of "all kinds of outside citations would suffice to meet the REAL standard of notable" and provide those standards of notable that you are referring to.  your analysis of "group think" is a little patronizing and I would really appreciate it if you choose to continue this conversation that you try TRY and respect your fellow editors.  you have constructed a straw man for the consensus process which is demeaning and insulting to both you and us.Coffeepusher (talk) 19:50, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  The word 'Notable', as it is used in discussion on this page, is an Arbitrary and Subjective Term 

message: Since meeting times and locations are often published in newspapers for twelve-step groups, news archive searches can inflate the importance of their results. The groups struck out on the list either have no Google Scholar results or don't appear to have enough for an article (Google Scholar results can also often be misleading as authors will sometimes rattle off a long list of twelve-step groups without discussing them, but it's not nearly as bad as a news archive search). If editors find or know of articles in "non-scholarly," but still reliable sources (or in scholarly sources not indexed by Google Scholar), unstrike organization name and provide citations. This way we can work on making articles for notable groups. -- Scarpy (talk) 00:31, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  Some novel searches just for this fellowship: searching just on their website URL (28 results), using a the or operator for the acronyms and instances of the full fellowships name (~1,010 results). -- Scarpy (talk) 21:53, 31 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: it would be most appreciated to write an article.  Tophinspired (talk) 04:25, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Now 38 results. -- Scarpy (talk) 17:42, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

text: It doesn't look good . -- Scarpy (talk) 02:23, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

text: As of late October 2011, there have been articles in both the Wall Street Journal and the New York Times on UA, as well as many, many others (just try a Google search).  I'm now preparing an articleEweinber (talk) 05:21, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Why don't we try and see if that article sticks before adding it to a wikipedia list.Coffeepusher (talk) 21:03, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. I was thinking about making a UA article not too long ago, but I'm still kind of reconciling with Wikipedia (she can be a real bitch). -- Scarpy (talk) 17:19, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

text: When Social Phobics Anonymous or Social Anxiety Anonymous becomes notable enough to warrant its own article on Wikipedia, then it may be added back. The prior consensus was to include in this list only those groups having Wikipedia articles. ~Amatulić (talk) 01:15, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

text: You will want to read WP:N. -- Scarpy (talk) 07:03, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

text: There is no an article on this group. -- Scarpy (talk) 06:40, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

text: Updated July 6th. Wrote stub for Online Gamers Anonymous. -- Scarpy (talk) 08:51, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  An article for this group was added several months ago: Parents Anonymous. -- Scarpy (talk) 02:25, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Done. -- Scarpy (talk) 07:57, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Groups removed that might be notable enough for articles 

message: How about UA - Undereaners Anonymous -- Tophinspired (talk) 04:25, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It doesn't look good . -- Scarpy (talk) 02:23, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

text: As of late October 2011, there have been articles in both the Wall Street Journal and the New York Times on UA, as well as many, many others (just try a Google search).  I'm now preparing an articleEweinber (talk) 05:21, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Why don't we try and see if that article sticks before adding it to a wikipedia list.Coffeepusher (talk) 21:03, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. I was thinking about making a UA article not too long ago, but I'm still kind of reconciling with Wikipedia (she can be a real bitch). -- Scarpy (talk) 17:19, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Notability of Underearners Anonymous (UA)

message: Social Phobics Anonymous (Now also called Social Anxiety Anonymous) has adopted a 100% 12 Step approach and is now in 4 states as well as running three telephone meetings with international participation. The program is now more than 6 years old and has almost 70 pages of its own literature. Perhaps it should be added back onto the list. 
66.227.84.101 (talk) 01:10, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: When Social Phobics Anonymous or Social Anxiety Anonymous becomes notable enough to warrant its own article on Wikipedia, then it may be added back. The prior consensus was to include in this list only those groups having Wikipedia articles. ~Amatulić (talk) 01:15, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

text: You will want to read WP:N. -- Scarpy (talk) 07:03, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Notability of Social Phobics / Social Anxiety Anonymous

message: Still does not look good  -- Scarpy (talk) 15:38, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Food Addicts in Recovery Anonymous 

message: For motivational purposes as articles are created for groups on the list above, I'm moving them here. -- Scarpy (talk) 06:40, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no an article on this group. -- Scarpy (talk) 06:40, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

text: Updated July 6th. Wrote stub for Online Gamers Anonymous. -- Scarpy (talk) 08:51, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  An article for this group was added several months ago: Parents Anonymous. -- Scarpy (talk) 02:25, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

text:  Done. -- Scarpy (talk) 07:57, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Groups created from list 

message: ABA: Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous (ABA)
http://aba12steps.org/ 
198.147.19.2 (talk) 11:05, 11 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: - as the article states:-"This is a list of Wikipedia articles on twelve-step groups" there is no article on  Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous so it cannot be included - please Write the article first - Arjayay (talk) 11:12, 11 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 11 September 2015 

message: 70.127.230.61 (talk) 14:53, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: As above, this is a list of Wikipedia articles on twelve step groups. There is no Artists Recovering Through the Twelve Steps Cannolis (talk) 14:59, 19 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 19 October 2015 

message: Computer Game Addicts Anonymous (aka:CGAA) -  - is a fellowship of men and women that seek recovery from addictive gameplay by helping one another stay clean a day at a time. 
Essentially it would be: CGAA - Computer Game Addicts Anonymous(<-Link) for recovery from addictive computer and video game play. Here is a relevant article to join the cool-kids-club: http://shoeleathermagazine.com/june-2015/time-for-e-hab/— Preceding unsigned comment added by Lord Captain Kitten (talk • contribs) 17:03, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: As the lead paragraph states, this is a list of Wikipedia articles. Write the article first, and then it can be added to this list. ~Amatulić (talk) 18:47, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please add the following to the Twelve-step group list 

message: Opa- opiates anonymous  Lee5528 (talk) 21:57, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: . See WP:WTAF. ~Amatulić (talk) 20:45, 31 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Add 

message: Regarding list of 12 step programs please note that on clicking on COSA (formerly codependents of sex addicts), one is taken to information on another 12 step program, namely SAA.  
COSA is for anyone who has been affected by someone else's sexually addictive behavior.
The cosa website for further information is cosa-recovery.org
If there is no text with information about cosa available on Wikipedia I suggest it at least not send people to SAA as it could cause confusion for someone looking for above definition as saw is for sex addicts themselves.
Thank you
24.46.9.220 (talk) 18:20, 18 October 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Good point. I have removed the COSA entry, especially because it violates the purpose of this page, which is a list of Wikipedia articles. There is no Wikipedia article on COSA, and we already have a link to SAA elsewhere on the page. ~Amatulić (talk) 18:44, 18 October 2016 (UTC)
replies: text:  There is a section on it in the SAA article, Sex Addicts Anonymous#COSA as it's an auxiliary group of that organization (in the same way Al-Anon is for AA). I would say this is a borderline case since the organization has some status in Wikipedia, but worth keeping on this list. - Scarpy (talk) 21:24, 18 October 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: OK. I put the link back, but this time linked to the section, and named the link more appropriately to avoid the confusion described by the anon above. ~Amatulić (talk) 22:36, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 18 October 2016 

message: Please add this as another type of 12 step meeting.  I'd like to hear from others who may be starting groups.  Google search for other info 
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2016/08/31/some-churches-are-forming-racists-anonymous-groups-for-those-brave-enough-to-join/
I don't know how to make a subject come up for discussion, or editing.  Am I doing this correctly?
72.188.10.94 (talk) 18:22, 17 November 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Write the article first, showing that this organization has significant coverage in multiple reliable and independent sources, then it can be included in this list. ~Anachronist (talk) 05:35, 18 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Racists Anonymous 

message: Add to list of 12 Step Programs based on AA:
RCA - Recovering Couples Anonymous http://www.recovering-couples.org/ Sandra95617 (talk) 21:15, 3 March 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. -- Dane talk  21:48, 3 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 3 March 2017 

message: Please include the following fellowship which has been omitted:
ABA - Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous
http://aba12steps.org/about/ Thunderarch (talk) 15:20, 9 March 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: - the inclusion criteria for this list includes a Wikipedia article, but Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous does not have an article, so is ineligible - Arjayay (talk) 15:29, 9 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 9 March 2017 

message: Add to 'Programs partially patterned after Alcoholics Anonymous':
Millati Islami seeks to integrate the treatment requirements of both Al-Islam and the Twelve Step approach to recovery into a simultaneous program (http://www.millatiislami.org/) 82.38.122.13 (talk) 10:32, 8 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 8 May 2017 

message: *CGAA – Computer Gaming Addicts Anonymous Janice in recovery (talk) 23:55, 23 May 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Cannolis (talk) 01:19, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 28 May 2017 

message: *CGAA – Computer Gaming Addicts Anonymous (Video game addiction) Janice in recovery (talk) 05:04, 29 May 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: The link to another Wikipedia article does not meet the standards for what are considered reliable sources.  The article does not appear to address CGAA as a twelve-step treatment option for video game addiction.  Please read the reliable source standards and re-post your request with an indication that such a source considers CGAA a twelve-step treatment option for video game addiction.  Thank you. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 15:34, 30 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 29 May 2017 

message: I would like to say that there is a group lacking inbetween the entry of the PA Pills Anonymous and the SA Sexaholics Anonymous on that page,s.o.
The groups name is Recovery Anonymous and it is the abbreviation RA. The website can be found www.r-a.org . This is a group which is helping if you have more addiction than one or more behavioural addictions than one. It is including all.
So the correct list is looking like that after the correction:
* OLGA – Online Gamers Anonymous
* PA – Pills Anonymous, for recovery from prescription pill addiction.
* RA - Recoveries Anonymous
* SA – Sexaholics Anonymous
* SA – Smokers Anonymous
Kind Regards
2003:76:4F58:5500:9DF0:5A02:CB7:E3D3 (talk) 15:04, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: . It is a good suggestion, but the objective of this list article is to list 12-step groups that already have their own article on Wikipedia. Before it can be added to this list, an article must first be written. ~Anachronist (talk) 15:12, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 2 August 2017 

message: Please add to list: 
Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous (ABA) 2602:306:BC02:90B0:9539:744B:AEFB:659D (talk) 03:16, 23 August 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. jd22292 (Jalen D. Folf) (talk) 03:37, 23 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 23 August 2017 

message: Neutralninja (talk) 13:08, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format.  — Ammarpad (talk) 13:17, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 13 November 2017 

message: We would like you to add "S-Anon" as a 12 step organization modeled after AA that helps individuals that have been affected by someone's addiction to sex. Please reference www.SanonIL.org to refer others to a site that can help. Messenger of Recovery (talk) 19:02, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: - No Wikipedia article = No inclusion - Arjayay (talk) 21:51, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 17 November 2017 

message: No pressuring to believe in higher powers
You can keep your willpower
No forced belief in male deity
Instead of twelve steps there is only one:
STOP ALL YOUR LYING  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wikigor1234 (talk • contribs) 05:34, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dishonesty Anonymous 

message: Wikigor1234 (talk) 05:39, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: Entries on this list need to have a Wikipedia article. —KuyaBriBriTalk 13:55, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 21 June 2018 

message: Add this to the section called "Programs patterned after Alcoholics Anonymous":
CAFAA - Caffeine Addicts Anonymous
Please hyperlink the above to www.CaffeineAddictsAnonymous.com.
Fyi (I'm not asking for this to be in Wikipedia): This 12-Step group has not yet been listed, and fully follows the 12-Step AA program. CAFAA is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization, or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. It's primary purpose is to stay free from caffeine and help other caffeine addicts achieve a caffeine-free life. CAFAA is free and, like all 12 step programs, has no profit motive and does not accept any money from outside organizations.
Please let me know if you add this. Thanks. MsSB1 (talk) 19:35, 29 July 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the  template. - FlightTime (open channel) 19:41, 29 July 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 29 July 2018 

message: Would like to ADD this 12-step group which 100% follows the 12-Step Format:
CAFAA - Caffeine Addicts Anonymous (https://www.CaffeineAddictsAnonymous.com)
Thank you. MsSB1 (talk) 18:14, 4 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: The list is for subjects that have Wikipedia articles, we don't add external links (Spam) to articles like this. Theroadislong (talk) 20:18, 4 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 4 August 2018 

message: I would like to add this group: Love Addicts Anonymous loveaddicts.org   Let me know if I can present a description of the group in another section of Wikepedia. Thanks Lori Glass (talk) 18:06, 12 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: The group needs to have a Wikipedia article first. Sam Sailor 19:05, 12 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 12 August 2018 

message: Please add:
OTC - Open to Change (recovery from compulsive avoidance of intimacy)
Link to: www.open2change.org Boypacer (talk) 13:26, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the  template. Why/how is this group notable? - FlightTime Public (open channel) 13:36, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 19 November 2018 

message: Other Good Forms of Anonymous Outerlimits
1. NoBody Knows Anonymous
2. Shit Fucking Vanish Anonymous
3. Mulholland Anonymous 2602:306:C4EB:A109:D9A5:EE38:2E54:D69C (talk) 20:57, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. DannyS712 (talk) 21:43, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 25 December 2018 

message: *LR – Librarian Wit 2602:306:C4EB:BEC9:B10B:417C:F0AE:D79A (talk) 15:23, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: This list only includes entries with an existing Wikipedia article based on multiple independent sources. Please take a look at Wikipedia's general notability guideline, and see WP:WTAF for an essay with some additional advice. Thanks, ‑‑ElHef (Meep?) 17:39, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 8 January 2019 

message: Under the heading Programs patterned after Alcoholics Anonymous, below the entry named CA -- Cocaine Addicts Anonymous, please add CAFAA -- Caffeine Addicts Anonymous. Link to this website: https://caffeineaddictsanonymous.com/
Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3777290/ RenaCrispin (talk) 03:06, 4 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: After reviewing the archives for similar edit requests the consensus is the group needs to have a Wikipedia article which before being added. As of this request the group Caffeine Addicts Anonymous does not have an article. Alucard 16❯❯❯ chat? 13:59, 7 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 4 March 2019 

message: ACA should be changed to:  ACA Adult Children of Alcoholics/Dysfunctional Families
as supported by the its World Service Organization, Inc. Qt9998 (talk) 05:05, 4 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Alucard 16❯❯❯ chat? 14:00, 7 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 4 March 2019 

message: PLEASE ADD RACIST ANONYMOUS TO THE LIST
http://rainternational.org Allenazali (talk) 04:10, 25 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 25 March 2019 

message: This is not a list of Wikipedia articles, but rather a list of 12-step groups which have WP articles. Whereas the inclusion criteria (must have article) is within policies, stating it in the article seems unencyclopedic. I am changing it to refer to "notable 12-step groups". NisJørgensen (talk) 20:33, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  The lead misstates the subject  

message: Add On-Line Gamers Anonymous - the website of which is https://www.olganon.org/home - to the list of twelve-step groups. On-Line Gamers Anonymous is to help people recover from video game addiction and computer game addiction. Mattrb81 (talk) 22:54, 24 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: This list only includes subjects that already have an article. – Thjarkur (talk) 00:21, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 24 February 2020 

message: add
ABA- Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous Christinaklein123 (talk) 22:58, 12 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: Subjects should generally have an article prior to being included on the list. Jack Frost (talk) 10:05, 13 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 12 July 2020 

message: Add these 12 steps groups:
EDA - Eating Disorders Anonymous
ABA - Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous
http://eatingdisordersanonymous.org/
https://aba12steps.org/ Britt.Mehr (talk) 22:56, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: These don't have an article on Wikipedia yet. – Thjarkur (talk) 23:29, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 17 July 2020 

message: Hi - there is a new 12-step program that is extremely important to add:  IA - Intimacy Anorexia and MA - Married and Alone. There are 12-step groups for both. There is more info here at this website: 
Intimacy Anorexia - Characteristics, Treatments & Resources  www.intimacyanorexia.com
Thank you. 2605:A601:AB07:FB00:7CD2:3FEA:CC94:1161 (talk) 15:06, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: These don't have an article on Wikipedia yet.  – Thjarkur (talk) 15:22, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 9 September 2020 

message: Add CGAA Computer Gaming Addicts Anonymous https://cgaa.info/
ITAA Internet Technology Addicts Anonymous https://internetaddictsanonymous.org/ 2600:1700:E7A1:4280:4910:AB38:6855:E890 (talk) 18:35, 17 September 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: per WP:WTAF. These don't have articles. –Deacon Vorbis (carbon • videos) 00:12, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 17 September 2020 

message: Please add this fellowship to your list: Internet and Technology Addicts Anonymous
Source: https://internetaddictsanonymous.org/
I am part of this fellowship and can confirm it is a 12 step fellowship, based on the principles of AA and other 12 step fellowships. 82.6.150.1 (talk) 11:46, 2 October 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: . Look above. –Deacon Vorbis (carbon • videos) 13:01, 2 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 2 October 2020 

message: Please ADD "Financial Underearners Anonymous" to the list of available 12 Step Programs.  Please create a hyperlink that connects this to www.financialua.org FinancialUA (talk) 21:57, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Does not have a Wikipedia article. – Thjarkur (talk) 22:03, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 8 December 2020 

message: Looking to add groups including Obsessive Skin Pickers Anonymous and On-line Gamers Anonymous. Pmnef (talk) 21:33, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: When those groups have Wikipedia articles, then they can be added to the list  RudolfRed (talk) 23:55, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 21 December 2020 

message: Add "MA - Marijuana Anonymous" to the list of 12 step groups patterned after Alcoholics Anonymous 2601:204:E780:D7A0:E42B:FBD6:6CD8:266E (talk) 03:40, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: It's there now.  RudolfRed (talk) 05:12, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 6 January 2021 

message: Add the following to the list:
MAA (Media Addicts Anonymous) 
https://www.mediaaddictsanonymous.org 2603:7080:1A01:9000:E532:A868:3AA5:510F (talk) 16:10, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: . See WP:WTAF. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (talk) 18:39, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 20 June 2021 

message: Please add Dual Recovery Anonymous for people who are diagnosed with a mental or emotional health issue and also have a addiction problem
Their website - http://www.draonline.org/ DhawanM (talk) 05:07, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: . See WP:WTAF. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (talk) 06:17, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 22 June 2021 

message: ;Add another 12-step recovery group based on AA to list:
https://recovering-couples.org/
—RCA [Recovering Couples Anonymous] 2603:8000:6E06:3002:24E8:3B8A:FB46:33FF (talk) 22:58, 20 November 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: This list only includes entries with an existing Wikipedia article based on multiple independent sources. Please take a look at Wikipedia's general notability guideline, and see WP:WTAF for an essay with some additional advice. Thanks, ‑‑ElHef (Meep?) 23:04, 20 November 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 20 November 2021 

message: If the organization isn't notable enough for a Wikipedia article, it doesn't go on this list. - Scarpy (talk) 02:16, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  No non-notables 

message: Please can someone add Gaming Addicts Anonymous to the list? Many thanks, OliviaMcCabe (talk) 00:09, 30 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Addition of missing 12-step fellowship 

message: Add ITAA: Internet and Technology Addicts Anonymous to the list of programs modeled after AA. 2601:145:4280:D830:49:6281:19B8:AF62 (talk) 20:53, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done for now: It must be notable enough for a Wikipedia article. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 21:08, 7 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 7 April 2022 

message: A few other programs can be added:
CEA-HOW also called compulsive eaters anonymous HOW,  is a 12-step program for people with eating disorders (their website is ceahow.org)
Chapter 9 anonymous is a 12 step program for couples in recovery, their website is chapter9couplesinrecovery.org
RCA is recovering couples anonymous which is another 12 step program for couples in recovery, their website is recovering-couples.org 104.172.98.161 (talk) 00:59, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done for now: They must be notable enough for a Wikipedia article to be included on the list. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 01:01, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 29 April 2022 

message: Additional 12-step programs to add to the list include:
Internet and Technology Addicts Anonymous - I.T.A.A. (https://internetaddictsanonymous.org/)
Media Addicts Anonymous - M.A.A ( https://www.mediaaddictsanonymous.org/ ) 24.103.126.108 (talk) 19:35, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: Pages must have an associated wikipedia article to be added to this list. ITAA is only mentioned in a disambiguation page with no article and the MAA isnt even mentioned, so neither of these fit the requirement. Aidan9382 (talk) 19:55, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 14 June 2022 

message: GAA - Gaming Addicts Anonymous
ITAA - Internet and Technology Addicts Anonymous
MAA - Media Addicts Anonymous
VA - Violence Anonymous  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tortuga244 (talk • contribs) 11:18, 30 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: None of these will be added for the same reason as the discussion below (No WP article). Aidan9382 (talk) 19:56, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please add this four groups under Programs patterned after Alcoholics Anonymous 

message: RCA or Recovering Couples Anonymous is another well known 12 step program. https://recovering-couples.org/ 2600:1700:9758:3650:3C7C:2A33:C153:4CD4 (talk) 17:09, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: See WP:WTAF, we don't have an article on Recovering Couples Anonymous Cannolis (talk) 18:49, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 27 September 2022 

message: SPAA - Sex and Porn Addicts Anonymous 143.177.152.160 (talk) 23:27, 28 October 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. It also needs to be notable enough for a Wikipedia article. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 23:32, 28 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 28 October 2022 

message: Link goes to the page for Eating disorders, not Eating Disorders Anonymous. Page is semi protected so can't correct on my own. Thanks 2604:2D80:E591:7E00:B052:3CF4:D1F9:A302 (talk) 20:20, 18 October 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I have removed the entry. This is a list of Wikipedia articles of 12-step groups, not an indiscriminate list of every 12-step group in existence. There is no article on Eating Disorders Anonymous. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:26, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Eating Disorders Anonymous 

message: Under 'Programs patterned after Alcoholics Anonymous' please include Obsessive Skin Pickers Anonymous. Their website is here for reference: https://www.osparecovery.org/ 2A02:C7C:6451:1400:7455:92C3:586A:95 (talk) 14:16, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done, there is no Wikipedia page for Obsessive Skin Pickers Anonymous. --Mvqr (talk) 16:01, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 5 January 2023 

message: Add the following group to list of 12 Step Programs:
Artists Anonymous - website: https://artsanonymous.org/ ApproachingZen (talk) 17:56, 25 March 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: There is no Wikipedia page for 12 Step Programs: Artists Anonymous. Lightoil (talk) 06:01, 26 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 25 March 2023 

message: Please add Recovering Couples Anonymous (RCA) with link to website recovering-couples.org
A 12 Step program for Couples. Technology.Chair (talk) 16:40, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Do also note that WP:PROMOTION is not allowed here on English Wikipedia. — Paper9oll (🔔 • 📝) 18:15, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 7 May 2023 

message: Please add the following:
Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous.  
Main PO Box 125 Edmonton, Alberta  T5J2G9 Canada
Website: aba12steps.org 217.180.201.154 (talk) 21:18, 2 July 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: . We have no article on Anorexics and Bulimics Anonymous. This is a list of 12-step groups that are notable enough to have Wikipedia articles. ~Anachronist (talk) 21:25, 2 July 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 2 July 2023