Talk:Panko Brashnarov

message: The source does not say that he himself described as Macedonian, please do not insert partsan links. ForeignerFromTheEast 00:02, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello ForeignerFromTheEast and thank you for using the talk page this time. I will start of with the link. It is a scan of an official document and therefore non-partisan. The site is owned by the Soros Foundation [] it is a "private operating and grantmaking foundation, aims to shape public policy to promote democratic governance, human rights, and economic, legal, and social reform." it is owned by neither a Bulgarian or Macedonian and is therefore also unbiased and non-partisan. On the other hand the links you provide are all from Bulgarian sources and in this case it is a conflict of interest and unfortunately cannot be taken as "non partisan".Ireland101  —Preceding comment was added at 01:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not quite. It is soros.com.mk and it is infamous for its falsified pieces of historical materials. ForeignerFromTheEast 01:17, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Soros.com.mk is still owned by the Soros foundation. Your claim that it is "infamous for its falsified pieces of historical materials" is new to me. Please provide a link to support you accusation.Ireland101  —Preceding comment was added at 01:22, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure: this is the falsified version: . This is the true version: :Image:Bulgarian Folk Songs.jpg. ForeignerFromTheEast 01:26, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I do not think anything is falsified, it just seems that they cropped the image a little off at the top. In order for them to have falsified it they would have had to add information or change it. Ireland101  —Preceding comment was added at 01:30, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The information is changed. "Bulgarian" is lost from the title "Bulgarian folk songs". This is a clear falsification. ForeignerFromTheEast 01:33, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I am trying to understand your logic however I am having troubles. If someone cropped off(accidentally or intentionaly, it is unknown) the word Encyclopedia off of Encyclopedia Brittanica would that be "falsification". I don't think so.Ireland101 01:40, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It means that they are either careless or choosing to hide information. Either way unreliable source. ForeignerFromTheEast 01:45, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

text: The word propagamda just slips off your tongue. This is a clear case. --Laveol T 09:20, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Ethnic Macedonian

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Panko Brashnarov. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110716191826/http://www.novamakedonija.com.mk/NewsDetal.asp?vest=7131191488&id=9&prilog=0&setIzdanie=22329 to http://www.novamakedonija.com.mk/NewsDetal.asp?vest=7131191488&id=9&prilog=0&setIzdanie=22329
*Added  tag to http://www.soros.org.mk/archive/G08/A08/sa5709.htm
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:25, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: @Local Hero
Hello, can you please clarify how my edit was an unhelpful edit and why I need to get consensus on talk?
--James Richards (talk) 11:54, 27 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello. Unhelpful because it does nothing to improve the content of this stable article. Consensus because it's been challenged (by me). Not sure if you read up to the second sentence but it's dealt with sufficiently there. I also don't see a source on the page stating "Brashnarov was Bulgarian". He was the first speaker of ASNOM. --Local hero talk 13:40, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

text: We don't decide what's obvious, we work based on sources, so thanks to Jingiby for providing that. I'm fine with the article as of his latest revision. --Local hero talk 15:16, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

text: You really don't need to @ me on every comment. Reading through the article, one can see that his ethnicity isn't so clear-cut as you wish to make it. We're best off leaving it as it is now. --Local hero talk 19:33, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

text: As the one trying to make this change, the burden of proof is on you to prove that labelling Brashnarov as a Bulgarian in the lead sentence is appropriate. So far you've just pointed out some text about Bulgarophile leanings. Note that I'm not making any claims about his ethnicity, rather I'm stating the article is dealing with the subject fine as-is. --Local hero talk 20:29, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

text: I guess we'll just leave it up to dispute resolution . --Local hero talk 21:03, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

text: I think you need to read WP:SYNTH, the first sentence in particular. --Local hero talk 21:18, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

text: Macedonian Bulgarians are a regional group of ethnic Bulgarians, so no. We have not established that Brashnarov had such a consciousness. Do you understand the point of your dispute resolution entry? You and I disagree (a dispute) and we're awaiting opinions of others at that entry. Please stop pestering me with a million pings. Regurgitating the same lines in different words does nothing to convince me of your unfounded position. --Local hero talk 13:35, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

text: Do you realize you're asking me to deduce his ethnic consciousness based on things he did? We do not make deductions or assumptions on Wikipedia. I've assumed good faith on your part long enough but you make intentionally non-neutral edits that other established editors do not make. Notice that I would be considered to have opposing viewpoints to Jingiby but we basically never end up in disputes because he makes edits based on sources, even if they are slanted to his side at times. --Local hero talk 13:57, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

text: I don't know what you mean by 'non-neutral edits', me correcting Macedonia,Macedonian when appropriate with North is not non-neutral, I have made some mistakes when doing it but I have acknowledged them and have apologized for them to you when I can see that they are wrong. And thanks to replying I understand what you mean now about making assumptions, I have posted a message on Jingiby's page about whether he has any sources about Brashnarov's self-identifying himself if you like. I did go the wrong way about this as I made the edit after reading all the info about him on the page that I have listed throughout this article, so yeah you are right in those regards, I will see what sources there are about my edit and get back if there is anything worth discussing. Apologies from my part. --James Richards (talk) 14:14, 28 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Brashnarov was not a writer and had not left much as archives. At least I don't know about such. In contrast, Pavel Shatev, for example, was a writer and has left many such examples where he clearly identified as a Bulgarian. But their joint presentation to the Communist Party of the Soviet Union is a good example. It is from 1948, when Macedonian language was codified, but they wrote intentionally in Bulgarian. This entire presentation smells on extreme Bulgarophilia, anti-Yugoslavism and anti-Serbism. That's why they paid with their lives. Jingiby (talk) 14:24, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

text: Thanks Jingiby and Jamesrichards12345, just glad we came to an agreement here. Apologies if I came across as combative at times, Jamesrichards12345. --Local hero talk 14:58, 28 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't worry, be happy, everybody. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 15:08, 28 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  R:E Unhelpful Edit 

message: It says pretty clearly here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulgaria_during_World_War_II#Occupation_in_Thrace_and_Macedonia that Bulgaria occupied Macedonia in World War 2. And only an idiot would say that occupation was "annexation".
:Of course Wikipedia is not a source. Look for example: Bulgarians occupied and annexed Yugoslav and Greek Macedonia. in James Minahan, One Europe, Many Nations: A Historical Dictionary of European National Groups. Greenwood Publishing Group, 2000, ISBN 0313309841, p. 440. Bulgarians, aided by the Germans and Italians, occupied and annexed Yugoslav and Greek Macedonia. in James Minahan, Miniature Empires: A Historical Dictionary of the Newly Independent States, Greenwood Publishing Group, 1998, ISBN 0313306109, p. 178. Bulgarian-occupied (later annexed) areas of Yugoslav Macedonia. in  Jozo Tomasevich, War and Revolution in Yugoslavia, 1941-1945: Occupation and Collaboration, Volume 2, Stanford University Press, 2002, ISBN 0804779244, p. 161. Jingiby (talk) 18:38, 11 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bulgarian occupation of Macedonia in World War 2