Talk:Benjamin Urrutia

message: my source for adding biblio entries that Mikkalai deleted: 
--goethean ॐ 18:49, 15 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  LDSF 

message: User:Katefan0 protected this article yesterday, apparently over a content dispute. --Tony SidawayTalk 17:04, 21 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I did, thanks much for adding it to WP:PP, it was an oversight. · Katefan0(scribble) 17:23, 21 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Protected

message: goethean, why are you so dead set against the LDSF books? Is it because you are brutally anti-Mormon? 
And why are you so dead set against including scholarly articles from American Anthropologist and the Hebrew University? That does not make any sense at all. And why do you say "your" book reviews and "your" journal articles? They are not mine. We are talking about Benjamin Urrutia.
And your approach to editing is one of bullying and blackmail. Not cool. --anonymous comment by 
:How soon we forget who fought to keep this article from being deleted. I most certainly am not anti-Mormon. Wikipedia has an interest in limiting the use of itself for self-promotional purposes. I am trying to balance the interests of Wikipedia versus your apparently very strong interest in promoting Benjamin Urrutia. Pardon me for assuming that you and he are the same person. You must admit that you do seem to know an awful lot about how to order his books, information that none of us have turned up in our research. Wikipedia bibliographies include books authored, not articles or books edited, and only books whose existence can be independently verified — that is, which are not self-published. Also consider Mikkalai's comments:
::An encyclopedic bibliographic list usually includes major works of a person. Being an editor is hardly an important contribution to be mentioned...By "Source" I mean exact printing data, preferrably ISBN. But my main objection was includion of "Slanted Glory" with no traces whatsoever.
All right, keeping the article basically as it is at present, with the addition of External Links to the Peaceable Table, LDSF, Logia of Yeshua, American Anthropologist. Does everybody agree?
I am not B.U., but I do know him personally. I have no interest in promoting him, but certainly in making his ideas -which are excellent and original ideas - available to everyone. 
The notion that being "an editor is hardly an important contribution" is nonsensical. It's like saying only the players in an orchestra are important, the conductor is not important. Besides, B.U. wrote some of the articles and stories in the LDSF books. He is a player as well as the conductor. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.99.1.118 (talk • contribs)  16:40, 24 September 2005  (UTC)
::It's like saying only the players in an orchestra are important, the conductor is not important.
:No American Anthropologist. Wikipedia articles do not list journal articles in bibliographies. No Slanted Gloria unless you can come up with an ISBN or real publication data. As far as I know, BU only edited LDSF2 and 3. If you cannot provide evidence to the contrary, please stick with those claims. 
:And please consider that the article is simply better the way it is now — without listing a bunch of only tangentially related, out-of-print books. Peruse Wikipedia articles and let me know if you can find another that listed books that were merely edited by the subject of the article. --goethean ॐ 14:52, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Bibliography

message: Doesn't seem to be a lot of discussion going on, so I've unprotected. Be nice. --Tony SidawayTalk 04:41, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Unprotected

message: Okay, Mr. Goethean, now how about adding those Peaceable Table External Links you offered?
Once those are in place, the article should remain as it is until Urrutia's next major book is published. Peace.
:I didn't add the external links because you never agreed to stop adding inappropriate entries. Namely: LDSF, Slanted Gloria, and the journal articles. Do we have an agreement?  --goethean ॐ 16:31, 30 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. I'll put the titles of the books in later. --goethean ॐ 16:27, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Peaceable Table

message: The text of the Spangler Nodule - YHWWY - could be a variant of the Tetrgrammaton. Urrutia's is the only reading and translation of this text that has been offered in the last 208 years. Das Baz, aka Erudil 15:38, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You don't seem to grasp the fact that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a place to post your ideas of what may or may not be. And you are also for some reason assuming that there was a text, which is definitely not proven nor likely. Doug Weller (talk) 20:19, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

text: So what? There is nothing to link the text with the bit of iron it was allegedly copied from.  And that still doesn't justify original research by you.--Doug Weller (talk) 20:19, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

text: Ok, just give me the quote where Benjamin Urrutia says that and the source of the quote.  I have never said that the text did not come from the nodule, I have simply said that we have no evidence linking the text with the nodule, and that is simply a fact. We have no reason whatsover to rule out forgery.--Doug Weller (talk) 15:44, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Spangler Nodule text

message: It is imperative to restore these two original sections. Mashing the two up into a single miscelaneous section labeled "Others" is not the least educational or helpful, but the very opposite.  Das Baz, aka Erudil 03:23, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Restoring Two original secions - "Ancient Languages" and "Contemporary Issues."

message: We restored mention of the period spent in Israel. There is no reason to suppress this fact.  Das Baz, aka Erudil 20:05, 3 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: You know about WP:AGF so there's no excuse for that. It was removed, with other material about that period, as unsourced. Rather than accuse people of trying to suppress facts you should simply aknowledge that it was unsourced and source it. Dougweller (talk) 20:59, 3 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: For the record, such as it is: there's a mention (likewise unsourced) on the page of Kibbutz Ein Hashofet that Benjamin Urrutia studied [the Hebrew language] in an ulpan course there. -- Deborahjay (talk) 10:13, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Israel, May 1974 to July 1977

message: The article relies too much on primary sources describing what he has said/written, etc. These are inevitably chosen by editors who choose their favorite bits, while what we really need are independent sources discussing his ideas. Dougweller (talk) 09:50, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: That's not what policy says, see WP:PRIMARY. Dougweller (talk) 21:47, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Primary sources