Talk:Holy War (Boston College–Notre Dame)

message: There is currently a long, ranbling section about the same topic in the Boston College Eagles football article. I suggest cleaning it up for npov and neutral tone and then moving it here. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 20:25, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Suggestion to merge from Boston College Eagles football section

message: JMM13, I realize Wake is a fine school, but your edits to this article make it clear that you need to learn more about the distiction between fact and opinion.  You also have removed portions of the article that are factually accurate.  You stated that you removed opinion, but then re-inserted the line "many students who dont get into ND end up at BC".  Is it possible for a statement to be any more opinion than that, given that the admission stats don't back it up?
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Not sure who the annoying ND fan is who keeps re editing this page, but if ND as strong a school as he argues, perhaps he might be capable of using correct grammar, and start referring to graduates of his beloved institution as "alumni" not "alums".
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I removed the passage "For Boston College fans, the game is an annual chance to show that Boston College is a worthy spoiler in Division I-A college football. For Notre Dame, the game is their 11th most important historical rivalry, just behind USC, Michigan, Michigan State University, Navy, Army, Purdue, the University of Miami (Florida), Pittsburgh, Penn State, and the annual intrasquad Blue and Gold game."  This is an opinion that is perjorative toward BC appears to be a perpetuation of an ND fan's belief that BC exists only to defeat ND.  A search on ND published newspapers and websites indicates a great deal more attention to this game than Miami, Pitt, Army or Penn State, which indicates a factual flaw in this statement.
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Disagree with the merge with the Ireland Trophy and Leahy Bowl.  These are two seperate awards, started at different times, by different organizations. AriGold 12:05, 28 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I incorporated most of the info from these two articles into the section called "Trophies." --Mulenberg 17:20, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

text: A quick survey of major media outlets shows that this term has currency by parties neutral to the rivalry. Some examples: CBS (http://cbs.sportsline.com/login?xurl=/nfl/story/7825520), CNN/Sports Illustrated (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/college/news/1998/11/03/week11_previews/), USA Today (http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/USAToday/access/56239298.html?FMT=FT&FMTS=FT&date=Nov+9%2C+1992&author=Michael+Hiestand&pub=USA+TODAY+(pre-1997+Fulltext)&desc=Trumpy%2C+Enberg+make+game+worth+watching), New York Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/120451p-108484c.html) --18.95.1.44 02:48, 16 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Use

message: ESPN's Ranking college football's best rivalries lists BYU vs. U of U as the "Holy War". It fails to list BC at all, and ND's rivalry is with USC. As a Utah resident I have noticed that the "Holy War" term is consistently used for the BYU-U of U rivalry. I actually was considering creating a page on the rivalry (especially with its rivalry extending back to 1942 or earlier) until I discovered this page. Any ideas on what should happen?
I think the term Holy War arose because both schools are Catholic.  While anyone can use any term they want in sportswriting, I am not clear how the BYU vs U of U game should be called this since Utah is not a religiously-founded institution.  If another Mormon school were playing BYU it could make sense.  Anyway, I think Vatican Bowl is a funnier name for the ND-BC thing, but I guess it was too politically incorrect to catch on.
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My guess is that the use of "Holy War" in Utah is, to a degree, ironic. BYU is, of course, owned and operated by the LDS Church. Utah, on the other hand, is not only public, but is from my understanding ferociously secular. — Dale Arnett 07:10, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I live in Utah, and I have heard it referred to as the Holy War before. Never made much sense to me either, but whatever. bob rulz 08:05, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  ESPN Rivalry rankings - BYU vs. U of U is the Holy War? 

message: this article should not be wasting space on the internet.  the rivalry was fun enough while it lasted, which was incredibly short, but it's over.  somebody who knows how to should just delete the whole damn thing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mitnibobo (talk • contribs) 07:21, November 30 2005(UTC)
:Hi there, if you feel the article should be deleted, the deletion critieria is shown here and the nomination process for deleting articles is outlined here. - Akamad 07:25, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  The subject certainly is notable, but it is marred with severe POV problems. For instance, the games selected as "notable" are arbitrary, and the names assigned to them are colloquial and are also arbitrary and biased. For instance, who refers to the most recent game as the "Beatdown in Beantown" The name is not sourced and qualifies as Original Research. Moreover, the nature and extent of the rivalry is not clearly defined. Finally, the disagreement among Notre Dame fans about whether BC is considered a true rival is never mentioned. This is an encyclopedia, not a sports blog. This article as it stands now is blog material.Tedmoseby (talk) 08:11, 21 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  i'm new to this, so bear with me please 

message: I reverted all the hockey stuff.  While the use of the word "rival" is debatable even for football as the two schools are not in the same conference and don't regularly play; it is clearly not appropriate to expand this to hockey, where the teams only play sporadically.  Please remember to follow consensus. -- KelleyCook (talk) 14:27, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The recent hockey edits 

message: Recent edits have gone back and for on whether this trophy was created by the student government at Notre Dame or by both school's student governments. I cannot find anything to suggest the BC student government's involvement in its creation. Please cite a source before re-attributing it. 24.91.215.57 (talk) 06:18, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Ireland Trophy

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thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:BostonCollegeEagles.png

message: This is certainly a "rivalry" and should be referred to as such in the opening paragraph. In fact I would say in the bigger picture this is much more of a rivalry than say ND-USC or BC-Miami, since ND and BC fight for the same students, faculty, grants, scholarships, etc. as well as clout/prestige within the Catholic church and academia generally. Case in point, an article penned by a ND professor formerly at BC:
http://www.the-tidings.com/2006/0825/essays.htm
While this background is inappropriate for the article itself since so much of it is POV, it underscores the depth and breadth of the relationship between these two Catholic schools. 75.4.142.12 (talk) 16:40, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: "Rivalry"

message: Allegedly, the Chicago Tribune reported the incident of Boston College vandalizing the Notre Dame visitor's locker room in 2002 as a post-game celebration, for which Boston College later paid Notre Dame an undisclosed amount of retribution money. However, further research is needed to substantiate this claim, not just scuttlebutt. Bullmoosebell (talk) 18:19, 22 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  2002 Vandalization controversy 

message: Frank Leahy Memorial Bowl into Holy War (Boston College vs. Notre Dame). The content is repetitive and the trophy is notable primarily because of the rivalry, where information about it would best be presented in the appropriate context. It also follows the established precedent of other rivalry trophies being described or merged within a parent rivalry article.CrazyPaco (talk) 21:20, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I have completed this merge. Jweiss11 (talk) 03:21, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merger proposal 

message: Substituted at 18:11, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Assessment comment

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thread_title:  External links modified