Talk:E. Morton Jellinek

message: forgot to log in at UNSW; changes made on 17 June 2006 & 18 June 2006 to Jellinek article were made by Lindsay658 -- showing one of the many UNSW IP addresses (129.94.6.28)Lindsay658 01:37, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Omitted log-in

message: Telling Truth recently altered my earlier text so that it read:
:::Jellinek studied biostatisticsAlthough, at the time, what we now call biostatistics was known as biometrics, it is now better to describe Jellinek as being involved with biostatistics, rather than biometry and physiology at the University of Berlin (from 1908 to 1911) and at the Joseph Fourier University in Grenoble (1911). He claimed, apparently falsely , to having received a Master of Education degree at the University of Leipzig in 1914.There is also considerable controversy over Jellinek's claim that he had earned a "real" doctorate (i.e., rather than being awarded an "honorary" doctorate). More information at  In 1935, the University of Leipzig bestowed an honorary Doctor of Science degree upon him. However, he apparently tried to present this honorary degree as an earned degree . This has additional significance; because Jellinek was a Jew -- see History of the Jews in Germany. However, it appears that he tried to present this honorary degree as an earned degree . In 1965, after his death, he received an honorary Doctor of Surgery from the University of Chile.
I have changed the text (and it is not entirely a "reversion") so that it now reads:
:Jellinek studied biostatisticsAlthough, at the time, what we now call biostatistics was known as biometrics, it is now better to describe Jellinek as being involved with biostatistics, rather than biometry and physiology at the University of Berlin (from 1908 to 1911) and at the Joseph Fourier University in Grenoble (1911). He received a Master of Education degree at the University of Leipzig in 1914. In 1935, the University of Leipzig bestowed an honorary Doctor of Science degree upon him.This has additional significance; because Jellinek was a Jew -- see History of the Jews in Germany.
 
:There is considerable controversy over Jellinek's claim that he earned a "real" doctorate in 1935 (i.e., rather than an "honorary" doctorate) in the form of Sc.D. from the University of Tegucigalpa in Honduras; however, "that university does not currently exist, and no records are available for verification".(Page (1997), p.1620. Also, more information at  Although initially declaring the degree from the University of Leipzig to be an honorary degree, he later represented it as being an "earned" degree.More information at  In 1956, he received an honorary Doctor of Surgery from the University of Chile.
The following reasons apply:
:(1) I had made a mistake in my earlier version; he was awarded the "honorary Doctor of Surgery from the University of Chile in 1956, not 1965 as I had written in the earlier version (and, of course, from this, the degree was not awarded posthumously) -- and this date of 1956 is supported by .
:(2) There is not now, and there never has been at any time, any controversy over whether or not Jellinek received a Master of Education degree at the University of Leipzig in 1914 -- and any claim that this is otherwise can not be supported by the information supplied within the source quoted by Telling Truth (i.e., ) which, in fact, asserts that Jellinek did, indeed, receive such a degree from Leipzig in 1914.
:(3) There is "considerable controversy" over Jellinek's claim that he had earned a "real" Doctor of Science from the University of Tegucigalpa in Honduras in 1935. However, as Telling Truth's added reference (Page, P.B., "E. M. Jellinek and the Evolution of Alcohol Studies: A Critical Essay", Addiction, Vol.92, No.12, (December 1997), pp.1619-1637.) indicated on page 1620, "the University of Tegucigalpa in Honduras] does not currently exist, aand no records are available for verification". It is also very clear from Telling Truth's other cited source (i.e., ) that this is so.
REFERENCES
Lindsay658 02:56, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Correction of Telling Truth's Errors 

message: :To whomsoever you (singular or plural) might be, Drgitlow. . .
:As you can now see, the entire paragraph is now missing.
:In its current form, the article still tells the Jellinek story without becoming sidetracked by the issues that seem so close to your heart.
:I most strongly suggest that you devote your energy to doing something constructive -- like writing a detailed exposition of the entire matter, according to your view, and placing it on Wiki IN A SEPARATE PLACE for all to see.
:Now that there is nothing in the article to which you (singular or plural) can object to, I once again say to you "GO AWAY"!!!!!
:Just go somewhere else, and bother somebody else, and let me get on with my useful work. Lindsay658 00:18, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Yet another triumph for those who burn the books

message: This page on E.M. Jellinek is very poor and riven with errors.  I'm not cnversant enough with Wikipedia to make the corrections myself but I would be happy to discuss the page's problematic content with the chief author or authors, whomever they may be.  
Ron Roizen, Ph.D.
:Moved to here to separate this thread.
:Remember that Jellinek was an extremely controversial figure, and that many of his own claims in relation to the performance of experiments and other research have been unsubstantiated, and that many consider that his actual research, as reported by him, does not support the conclusions that he drew.
:Therefore, anything that you write about Jellinek must be objective and must not reflect a personal point of view.
:Please list below, in order, your "complaints" -- with, in each case citations from reputable sources -- and, at the same time, list what you understand to be the "truth".
:I, for one, would be very interested to examine a detailed list (accompanied by whatever evidence you might be able to muster to support your claims) of the "errors" that you claim this article is "riven with".
:Lastly, whoever you are, please always sign your comments. Lindsay658 18:20, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Comment by "Ron Roizen"

message: I accidentally deleted "In 1935, the University of Leipzig bestowed an honorary Doctor of Science degree upon him,(1997, p.1620)</ref>" and can't seem to replace it. Thanks for your help.David Justin 15:52, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Help, please

message: Hello - I'm working on converting some of the external links to inline references. Other tidying as well of course :D E_dog95'   Hi ' 06:03, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Some work being done 

message: The ref for the Page article appears to be wrong, as I can't find the article with the link to the 2007(12) journal. The correct ref appears to be Page, P. (1988). The origins of alcohol studies: E. M. Jellinek and the documentation of the alcohol research literature. British Journal of Addiction, 83(9), 1095-1103.  I don't want to change the cite without the original author's verification, however. FemmeBrulee (talk) 13:44, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  References 

message: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/elements/2013/04/the-creation-of-disease.html CharlesKiddell (talk) 05:20, 2 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Secondary Source 

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thread_title:  External links modified