Talk:The New York Times International Edition

message: As the French newspaper Libération is currently being characterized as "militant" in its article I would like to know whether the International Herald Tribune's statement [www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/899082/posts "Chirac and his poodle Putin have severely damaged the United Nations", "Chirac's Latest Ploy", WILLIAM SAFIRE] would qualify this newspaper as "militant" as well? Just a rhetorical question... Get-back-world-respect 15:12, 14 Oct 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Militant?

message: I think the histrory of the paper goes back further than this article indicates - see New York Herald Tribune — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.250.112.194 (talk • contribs) 13:18, 13 June 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The "Tribune" part of the name comes from the Paris edition of the Chicago Tribune, started during World War I. See "The Paris Edition", by Waverley Root. The two papers merged between the wars. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.12.150.107 (talk • contribs) 04:48, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Link Back to New York Tribune?

message: John Hay Whitney's bio says he bought the paper in '58, the Tribune's website says '59... which is it? - Eric 21:53, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: 1958 or 1959?

message: Centralism is a belief in the concentration of government power.  Centrism describes the ideology of the Third Way--a belief in free markets mixed with a concern for social welfare.  The article says the paper is Centralist, but it seems more likely that they're Centrist.  Which one is it?  -Tjss 15:37, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Centralist? on Centrist? 

message: * "The International Herald Tribune is the premier international newspaper for opinion leaders and decision-makers around the globe."
This language is PR boilerplate cribbed directly from Times-Mirror corporate communications, as a simple Google search on the sentence readily reveals. 
Even if it weren't, surely [NPOV WP:NPOV] would preclude editorializing about the publication's relative preeminence in its chosen market segment and its prestigious, "qualified" readership (which allows it to charge higher ad rates). 
If the flacks are going to write history, they should at least back up such claims as 'premier' with hard data on circulation and reader demographics, don't you think? And if this entry is not flack-authored, then it's plagiarism.
--cbrayton — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cbrayton (talk • contribs) 17:30, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Flagrant Neutral Point of View Violation / Plagiarism 

message: Is there any particular reason why the Introduction notes that one of the 33 international publication locations includes Dhaka?  Any reason why Dhaka deserves special note?  I can't imagine any, so I've removed it from the Intro.  I'm not even sure if I should include mention this tidbit in the Distribution section.  If anybody feels that it belongs there, say so, or make the addition yourself. Patiwat 01:58, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Published in Dhaka - so what? 

message: If the paper is headquartered in Neilly-sur-Seine, why does the infobox list it as Paris? One wouldn't list Harvard University as being in Boston, or the New York Islanders as playing their home games in New York City. Wiki Wistah 21:30, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Site of Headquarters 

message: There is controversy around the removal of an article reporting on the melamine economy in China, which was located here:
* http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/04/29/news/food.php
 Additive that tainted U.S. pet food is commonly used in China
 By David Barboza and Alexei Barrionuevo
 Published: April 29, 2007
For details:
* http://www.itchmo.com/read/melamine-spiking-in-food-widespread-for-years_20070429
What are IHT policies for removing articles from the IHT web site?  Should there be a retraction notice?  Do newspapers of record have an obligation to explain why they remove articles?
--jwalling 22:25, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  IHT Melamine controversy 

message: I've read the IHT and I have detected quite a bit of Irish cultural influence. It would be good to know just exactly how Irish the newspaper is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.157.229.14 (talk • contribs) 07:09, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I also noticed some Hebraic cultural influence, presumably because the IHT is an affiliate of the New York Times.  ADM (talk) 12:41, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Irish ?

message: This image contains an advertising. It should be removed from the article.--Александр Мотин (talk) 12:19, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: No, it is showing the whole front page of the paper.  There is nothing wrong with showing how much of the front page is now dedicated to advertising. --Pmsyyz (talk) 20:22, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:File:IHT.jpg]] 

message: This page reads like a corporate press release. Can we get some editors in to balance the tone please?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chrisvnicholson (talk • contribs) 08:46, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Press Release 

message: The article says: "The IHT’s old domain, iht.com, now redirects to international.nytimes.com."
This is no longer the case. 
While there is a link to international.nytimes.com there is no automatic redirection. The iht.com banner says "International Herald Tribune - The Best in Global Journalism" followed by "The New York Times Company now plans to use iht.com to experiment with new ways to deliver information and to learn how, you, our international readers, want to follow the news."
Gentleman wiki (talk) 04:25, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Web site? 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on International New York Times. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20150703144441/http://www.ihtinfo.com/about/about.html to http://www.ihtinfo.com/about/about.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20150703121822/http://www.ihtinfo.com/press/press-releases/2013/february/the-new-york-times-company-announces-plan-to-rebrand-the-international-herald-tribune-as-the-international-new-york-times/ to http://www.ihtinfo.com/press/press-releases/2013/february/the-new-york-times-company-announces-plan-to-rebrand-the-international-herald-tribune-as-the-international-new-york-times/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20150703121822/http://www.ihtinfo.com/press/press-releases/2013/february/the-new-york-times-company-announces-plan-to-rebrand-the-international-herald-tribune-as-the-international-new-york-times/ to http://www.ihtinfo.com/press/press-releases/2013/february/the-new-york-times-company-announces-plan-to-rebrand-the-international-herald-tribune-as-the-international-new-york-times/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100303130208/http://www.ihtinfo.com:80/about/history.html to http://www.ihtinfo.com/about/history.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 05:34, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I updated the top of this article with the fact that the paper is no longer known as the International New York Times, but just as The New York Times, with the non-U.S. editions called the international edition. 
I also added that many Paris newsroom operations were closed at about the same time.
I suspect some of the other information, like the paper being based in La Defense, is not correct anymore. However, I have no seen a secondary source reporting this. So i will wait to update. 
Also, I made the Jonathan Spollen disappearance a separate section. It was under "columnists" before, where it did not belong.  PumpkinKitten (talk) 15:34, 12 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  2016 rebranding 

message: As it stands now, it is in sub-literate, incorrect English, and has paragraphs and sentences out of place. Hayford Peirce (talk) 01:10, 28 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  History section needs to be completely rewritten 

message: It looked to me like the outcome of these discussions a year ago was that this  article would, in addition to describing the current New York Times international edition, carry the overall history of the Paris operation from 1887 to 2016, hence the bolding of  and  in the lede here as presumably the target for those two redirects, while there would be a separate detail article  to cover the 1967–2013 paper.  But the odd thing was that the International Herald Tribune article contained no link to this article at all; I only discovered this article by accident.  So in an attempt to help readers navigate this arrangement, I put a hatnote on the International Herald Tribune article to say that the history of the predecessor and successor papers is here.  And I promptly got reverted.  
So we are back to the International Herald Tribune article not acknowledging the existence of this one.  The hatnote on International Herald Tribune now says that the prior history of the Paris operation is at the  article ... but due to an unrelated change made in January, the redirects for Paris Herald and Paris Herald Tribune point to the International Herald Tribune article.  Even though the lede bolds are still here.
This arrangement is untenable.  My view is that there should be only one article about the Paris operation, not two, and the one article should be called International Herald Tribune, which is the final important well-known name that it had.  In other words, I fully agree with those who don't want its memory wiped from Wikipedia.  This situation comes up sometimes in company histories and the well-known name has been restored in other cases, see for example Talk:Iomega#Requested move 20 February 2021.  This one article will include the back history of the Paris Herald and Paris Herald Tribune, including cultural references and whatnot; the full history of the International Herald Tribune; and an aftermath section that describes the name change in 2013 and the Paris closure in 2016.  This one article will have the redirects and the lede boldings for Paris Herald and Paris Herald Tribune.
If a separate article about The New York Times International Edition really needs to exist, it should just cover the period from 2013/2016 forward, and not all the back history before that.  On the other hand, I suspect that the material about The New York Times International Edition and The New York Times International Weekly could be merged into the main  article.  The main point is, the current New York Times International Edition operation really has nothing to do with the historical Paris Herald/Paris Herald Tribune/International Herald Tribune operation.
Does this approach make sense to others?   Wasted Time R (talk) 12:48, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  This arrangement of articles is still unresolved 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: Withdrawn by nominator.  This request got misinterpreted or misunderstood by most of those responding to it.  It is clear that there will continue to be two articles.  As for renaming to preserve the correct Wikipedia content histories, that ship has sailed, as several others started moving/adding/changing content in the current arrangement and I have as well.  So it is what it is.  (non-admin closure)   Wasted Time R (talk) 18:55, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: The New York Times International Edition →  – As I indicated in the section above (and no one has disagreed with me), the current arrangement of articles is unsatisfactory and there need to be two separate articles.  A) The  article should contain the history of the famous newspaper that existed from 1967 to 2013 under that name, and also its  famous prior history as the New York Herald Tribune European Edition and before that the Paris Herald and so on, back to 1887.  Yes, we have an International Herald Tribune article right now, but it is a separate branch that was created fresh in February 2021 from a history of redirects, see here.  The real history of the International Herald Tribune article in Wikipedia is here at this title, going back through several moves to January 2003, see here for the origin in the early days of Wikipedia.  A renaming should be done, with the branch text then being merged into the renamed article and post-2013 material being pulled out of it.  B) The  article should also exist, under this name once the move is done and this becomes a redirect.  This article will contain the history of New York Times' own international editions, starting in 1943 with its Overseas Edition, continuing in 1948 with its United Nations Edition, then in 1949 with its International Air Edition, and then from 1960 with its International Edition.  This paper was a competitor to the New York Herald Tribunes more well-known European Edition.  It was then folded in 1967 when the Times gave up and instead became three-way co-owner of the International Herald Tribune, which this article will cross-reference to.  Then this article will resume with 2013, using the material currently at this location, when the International Herald Tribune title goes away and The International New York Times name over, soon followed in 2016 by the closure of the Herald Tribune offices, the sale of its archives, and the current name The New York Times International Edition, which brings this article full circle back to 1943.  C) I have lots of text and cites prepared offline in support of building up the history in both articles, and I have saved the branch text for the merge, but first this move on top of an existing article needs to be done. Wasted Time R (talk) 01:46, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

text: , what you propose makes more sense than what we have now. I'll just make my little objection to put it on the record: I know I was out-!voted last time, but laying aside the romantic attachment we all (me included) seem to have for the Paris Herald and the IHT of its heyday, the fact remains that the present-day NYT International Edition IS, in a corporate sense, the IHT successor, and is NOT the successor of the 1940s NYT Overseas Edition. As you note, the NYT's international offering was later a competitor to the IHT, and was folded, with the title lying dormant for decades. Meanwhile, the IHT was partially owned by the NYT from 1967 (surely still part of its heyday) to 2002, then fully owned by the NYT from 2002 to 2013, functioning (and subtitled) as the "Global Edition of the New York Times". The name changed to International New York Times in 2013, and only later, after the name changed, was the Paris headquarters closed. So we have an unbroken history of Paris Herald - International Herald Tribune - International New York Times - New York Times International Edition, all based in Paris. The split performed on this article last year zeroed in on 2013, the year that the International Herald Tribune name was dropped. But was the Oct. 15, 2013, International New York Times a different newspaper than the Oct. 14, 2013, International Herald Tribune? Presumably it had the same staff, the same features, the same headquarters, the same subscriber list, etc. We may not like that the NYT killed a storied and beloved brand name, but Wikipedia should be describing the world as it is, and in my opinion there's no date on which you can say: "this is where the IHT history ends -- and this is where the NYT International Edition begins as a brand-new organization". OK. I've said my piece. Again, I know mine is the minority opinion on this, so let me be realistic and restate: If we are going to split the articles at 2013, the changes you propose above make sense. ``` t b w i l l i e ` $1.25 ` 05:03, 3 March 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:   Your points are legitimate, and the text of the articles will describe the 'corporate sense' as you call it.  But brand names matter.  And the corporate history is tangled beyond just the NYT involvement.  In summer 1966, when the New York Herald Tribune was in danger of failing (and then did), WaPo bought 45 percent of its European edition, and it was published as The International Edition of the New York Herald Tribune–The Washington Post until May 1967, when the NYT entered into the three-way ownership arrangement (with Whitney Communications Corp. being the equal third) and the International Herald Tribune began.  Clearly brand names mattered to both papers, a year apart.  Until 2013, when there was a tangible change in attitude by the NYT when it took down the name, an attitude made even more clear when the NYT shut down the Paris operation in 2016.  In this particular case, I think both history and readers are best served by having one article that describes all the international papers that had 'Herald'/'Herald Tribune' in their name, and another article that describes all the international papers that have 'New York Times' in their name.  Wasted Time R (talk) 12:35, 4 March 2022 (UTC)

text: No do not merge. Keep separate entry for the International Herald Tribune based on robust due diligence outlined in earlier discussion. From a historical standpoint, they are two separate newspapers.
Rather surprised that this has sprung up again. Wondering if this intervention is perhaps on behalf of the New York Times org? Eachone (talk) 7:18, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  Part of my proposal is to put existing (and soon-to-be-added) material about the Paris Herald, the European edition of the New York Herald, and the European edition of the New York Herald Tribune into the initial sections of the International Herald Tribune article, so that the entire history of the Herald Tribune operation in Paris could be seen in one place.  It looks like you disagree with this idea, as you have just moved such material into the New York Herald and New York Herald Tribune articles.  Is that a correct assessment?   Wasted Time R (talk) 14:03, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 1 March 2022 

message: This is not the first attempt to grab the IHT history, and to place it (quite inappropriately), under the New York Times banner. A commentator in the earlier discussion pointed out that “Redirecting the IHT to the International New York Times is like obliterating 125 years of history”. 
It would make much more sense to delete this dodgy ‘New York Times International Edition’ Wikipedia entirely and to create a chapter under New York Times (of which it is a part).  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iconstand (talk • contribs) 15:39, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title: Why these repeated attempts to erase The International Herald Tribune a famous newspaper, which has an important history ?