Talk:Good Friday prayer for the Jews

message: The title of the page is misleading.  After all there are many good Friday prayers in the Roman Rite, and the Easterners follow their own order.  The page should be called "Good Friday Pray For the Jews" or something like that.  Also note the change in Latin from "perfidus" to "perfidia."  The "i" and the feminine make "perfidia" an abstract noun equivalent to "unbelief" or "faithlessness."  But it was translated as "Who rejectest not even the faithless Jews," or something like that when it should have been "even Jewish (Iudaeicam) unbelief (perfidia)."  I took it upon myself to make a quick correction of the language.  I believe this is important.  If someone has a better (accurate) correction, feel free to update it.  But I think "dost not reject even the faithless Jews" is a poor an unacceptable translation.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.61.105.201 (talk) 03:56, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Title

message: The "Birkat Ha-Minim" seems a little out of place, just tacked on to the end of the article. It appears to be a Jewish perspective, so maybe we could incorporate it into a "Jewish response" section? Thanks--Geremia (talk) 21:46, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I certainly agree that this section appears "tacked on". It is borderline off-topic. I would certainly support moving it into another section. I would even support substantially eliminating it. Rwflammang (talk) 12:59, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  It does give the impression that the material is tacked on as a form of poor catholic apologetics that is so prevalent in Wikipedia articles "You are just as like us" kind of stuff rather than acknowledging the mistakes of the past. Taam (talk) 13:23, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Birkat Ha-Minim" section 

message: The statement that Jews do not suggest that their religion is best and that they do not seek to convert is a bit much IMO. Orthodox (and others) believe (correctly according to most Christian sources, as well) that they are God's chosen people. They do not seek to convert because only those of Jewish extraction can become Jews. Orthodox do not recognize conversions. Conservatives somewhat reluctantly. The point being that being Jewish is exclusively Jewish. All others can keep out! This is somewhat different than genially tolerating other religions as equal to one's own! For these reasons, the paragraph needs restructuring IMO. Student7 (talk) 21:55, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, the rebuttal and the whole off-topic jewish prayer is out of place here. It should all be eliminated. It has no relation to the Good Friday liturgy. Rwflammang (talk) 14:18, 23 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Jewish rebuttal a bit much?

message: I've removed (again) the unsourced claim that the translation "faithless" is incorrect. The translation of "perfidis" has been dealt with earlier in the article, at least twice, and both sections have sources. It's unnecessary to include another claim that "faithless" is wrong, especially one that states it as a fact when there is clearly disagreement on the translation. PaulGS (talk) 01:57, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anti-Defamation League and translation of phrase 

message: Much has been written in this article about Jewish objections to Christian prayers.  Do the Jews submit their religious rituals to scrutiny and criticism by non-Jewish groups? John Paul Parks (talk) 05:19, 31 July 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Jewish Influence

message: Why are you guys trying to hide the fact that the prayer had the words perfidiuos Jews up until 1959? Someone removed that version of the prayer fr the article and I bet it was a Catholic, trying to hide the shameful traditions of the Church. Well, guess what? The cat is out of the bag.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.249.84.113 (talk) 20:24, 31 July 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Not only is that version in the article - and has been for years - it never had the words "perfidious Jews" in it. It had the words perfidis Judæis, and as explained in the article, perfidis is "unbelieving", not the "treacherous" meaning it has in English, PaulGS (talk) 02:21, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Perfidiuos Jews version of prayer removed by Catholic apologists

message: Are vaguely referenced "...liturgy of the Tridentine Mass, which dates back to 1570." The should be made clear in lead/introduction. Naytz (talk) 04:17, 6 April 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origins 

message: Changed to perfidious to match the reference. Please stop trying to hide that Catholics referred to them as perfidious. I see from the history that catholic apologists have been trying to do so, and this needs to stop immediately.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.228.78.67 (talk) 22:19, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Source for "perfidious"? PaulGS (talk) 02:33, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  traditional prayer 

message: Did they pray this in spanish? I'm pretty sure most catholic older chileans don't even know this prayer existed. What about other latinamerican countries?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Korosuke (talk • contribs) 07:17, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: it was the same for everybody up until Vatican II (before then mass was in Latin for everybody).  The spanish equivalent to ICEL is here.  perhaps someone who speak spanish can find the missal there and see what it says now. Jytdog (talk) 09:43, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spanish-speaking community