Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Board and table games/Archive 3

message: I recently created an article about Transformation playing cards.  I think they fall under the purview of this project, but I'm not sure, so I didn't add a project tag.  Anyway, any input would be welcome.  It's my first fully fledged article. -Chunky Rice 23:00, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Transformation playing card]] 

message: Just thought that I'd mention this template is being considered for deletion so you can express your opinion on this.  Craw-daddy 07:34, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: BGG Template considered for deletion

message: The members of this project might be interested in this discussion . -Chunky Rice 21:55, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Board game discussion at [[WP:NOT]] 

message: Would anyone involved in this project care to take a look at the Farkle page as written, and let me know whether it markedly deviates from the style expectations of this project? Thanks!Jbening 21:36, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Farkle? 

message: An article about online board game retailer Funagain Games is up for AfD here.  Thought the project might have an interest. -Chunky Rice 19:50, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, I've been having a hard time, as well.  I did find this interview , which has some depth, though I'm doubtful that Tom Vassel qualifies as a reliable source (this was before his podcast became affiliated with the site). -Chunky Rice 18:57, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I guess it would still be good to incorporate appropriate material from that interview into the article, if it seems like a good idea.  Unfortunately, I also noticed that there's a notability tag on The Dice Tower article.  :P  --Craw-daddy|Talk 19:01, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, I think it could be argued that The Dice Tower meets criteria 3 of WP:WEB, in that it is distributed by a respected entity independent of itself, which is to say, Funagain. -Chunky Rice 19:04, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Hmmm, how odd!?  :)  --Craw-daddy|Talk 19:31, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Boardgame article at AfD 

message: Is there (or should there be) a category for Articles that fall under this project?  As I've been looking around at some of the games and designers listed in WP many of them don't have categories, or, perhaps not useful ones. I think that a category for WPBTG would be useful.— Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 15:58, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: A better understanding of how categories work has answered my question.  No. :)  — Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 23:31, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  category for WP:WPBTG 

message: Should Board/Card game designers and publishers come under this project?
:Certainly. -Chunky Rice 20:49, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Scope 

message: I have no problem with the Category:Historical board games tag, but I do have a problem with the way it seems to be used, as I've mentioned on its talk page.  Comments welcome — Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 18:40, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Historical games category 

message: How do we get it so that if someone adds (for example) the Category:Science fiction board games tag that it also appears as if they'd added Category:Board games?  This would make tying all the games together much much easier.— Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 19:23, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, first, I'm not aware of a technical way to do that, other than to employ a bot.  Second, that would likely be counter to Wikipedia's category guidelines.  Generally speaking, when an entire category is broken up into subcategories, we don't list both the subcategory and the parent category.  There are exceptions, but I don't think this would be one of them.  -Chunky Rice 19:57, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

text: We don't ever want that to happen.  That is the point of having more specific categories. 2005 20:05, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: ok, I understand better how it works now that I've followed the category up and down.  I guess what I was hoping for was to, say, go to the Board games category, and see everything that was under it, rather than having to keep traversing the sub- and super- categories.  I guess I had a misunderstanding of how things worked.— Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 20:10, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  more about about categories 

message: Is there be a special infobox template for game designers, or, if not, is there a generic one to use?— Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 23:34, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I found the generic .  I'll use that for now — Timotab Timothy (not Tim, dagnabbit!) 23:54, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  People infobox templates 

message: I've started a page for the High School Drama! card game. Right now it's only a stub (although cited), and help on direction would be apprechiated. A fairly new game, but perhaps some else here has experience with it. I'd hate to think I'm alone. Nargrakhan 21:12, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the help on the article and a heads up on how images work on Wikipedia. I'll borrow a digital camera and make the alteration ASAP! Nargrakhan 23:38, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  High School Drama! 

message: Given the lengthy list of games from this company (see the article itself), would it be appropriate to create a category for its games?  This would then allow editors to use this category and avoid the lengthy list in the article (as it's also marked for cleanup).  This category could then also encompass all of its board games, card games and role-playing games.  
I kind of hate the idea of Category:Steve Jackson Games games as the name of the category (like the awkward Category:Cheapass Games games), but can't necessarily suggest anything more appropriate.  --Craw-daddy | T | 15:59, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Couldn't it just be Category:Steve Jackson Games?  For all articles SJG related?  There can't be that many non-game ones anyway. -Chunky Rice 16:19, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Should I go ahead and create it then?  --Craw-daddy | T | 17:53, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure.  Be BOLD. -Chunky Rice 17:56, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Category for [[Steve Jackson Games]] games??

message: *
:: --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 00:03, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  updated --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 15:35, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion: 2038 (board game) 

message: *
:* I think you want WP:CVG again with that one. Percy Snoodle 11:53, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: ** Hmm, agreed, this is a PC game and not (which I took at first glance) a boxed strategy game ... my apologies.  More care will be taken in the future. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 00:03, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion: Malvinas 2032 

message: It looks like pretty much the entire rules have been added for this game - I suspect it's not appropriate, but I wanted to check with people here first. — Timotab Timothy (not Tim dagnabbit!) 14:54, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Delete, both on the basis that Wikipedia articles should not include instructions and that they read to me as a direct copy of the game rules and as such, a copyvio. Cheers --Pak21 14:58, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So you also think that Mille Bournes should be deleted, since it has instructions on how to play the game?  (Which, as far as I know, is not a copyright violation of any published set of rules...) Or that Laws of the Game (and it's subarticles) should be deleted since they give instructions on how to play football?  Or Poker?  And so forth... I guess I'm wondering where the line is drawn on WP:NOT#GUIDE.  In any event Timotab has reverted Grass (card game) to a former version, without the copyvio.  (Thanks for that, by the way.)  --Craw-daddy | T | 15:12, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Mille Bournes is an absolute mess and needs serious cleanup. Laws of the Game is the beginnings of a good article, going into the history of the laws, though the actual laws could arguably be placed on Wikisource instead, with commentary on them from secondary sources here; the "subarticles" aren't describing each law, but are encyclopedic things about the ball, the referee, the pitch, etc. Poker is fine, although could do with some sources for the "Game play" section (but then so could most of Wikipedia...). Cheers --Pak21 15:20, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The Laws of the Game are on Wikisource already :-) Cheers --Pak21 15:22, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Grass (card game)]] 

message: Know of an article that could do with a picture of a game?  Ask me!  I have access (through my own collection and my board game group) to many games, and I can likely take a picture for you.  Can't guarantee it, of course, but I'll do my best.  — Timotab Timothy (not Tim dagnabbit!) 14:55, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Looking through the current top ten on BGG, none of Twilight Struggle, El Grande, The Princes of Florence, BattleLore nor Shogun have free photos. Cheers --Pak21 15:04, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Heh, I have none of those, but I'll see what I can do. — Timotab Timothy (not Tim dagnabbit!) 15:06, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Photos 

message: :: --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 02:30, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  updated --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 01:23, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion: 18XX conventions 

message: Hi.  A user has raised the point on my talk page that the policy on links to external play sites should be mentioned in our structure/style guide section.  It's my feeling that they're discouraged by WP:EL, so I'd like to add a note to that effect to the guide; but what would other people's opinion be? Percy Snoodle 09:53, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that the points you used in your talk-page response are valid.  A couple of sentences from that could be added to the project's guide, and probably should, since boardgames are more likely than most topics to have non-notable sites that people will want to link to.  If we don't make this guideline's applicability clear, we can expect linkspam revert wars to waste a lot of our time. Barno 15:37, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  External play sites 

message: I invite everyone to contribute to the new article about this gaming magazine that I've just moved into the mainspace.  It likely needs more "claim to notability" (whatever I mean by that) and more references.  Cheers  --Craw-daddy | T | 17:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Knucklebones (magazine)]]

message: I've been adding references to Origins Awards for some games and I've run across the following question.  Is the organizing body called the "Academy of Adventure Gaming, Arts & Design" or the "Academy of Adventure Gaming Arts & Design"?  The difference is in the comma.  Even the website of the Academy is vastly inconsistent.  On the home page you can even see the inconsistencies there, with none in the page title, one in the banner, none in the first sentence, and three(!) in the first sentence under the "Award Submissions..." heading.  I know that the article on the Origins Awards has it listed without the comma, but I'm not sure which one to use here.  (Minor question, perhaps, but I'd like to source articles correctly.)  --Craw-daddy | T | 18:55, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There are seven newspaper citations for the use without a comma -- Capital Times (Madison Wisconsin) ×3, Chicago Daily Herald, Puget Sound Business Journal, Lansing State Journal, Toronto Star -- and none for the use with a comma. Of course, they're inconsistent on the use of the ampersand vs. the word "and". :-) -- JHunterJ 23:46, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, it's just hard to figure out what the correct usage should be given the state of the website itself.  So the "Adventure Gaming" is a modifier for the phrase "Arts & Design" (or "Arts and Design").  --Craw-daddy | T | 23:51, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm a member, and there is no comma in the name. Being an adventure gamer doesn't get you in the organization, nor being an artist or a designer. You need the confluence of those things, either being an adventure gaming artist, designer, publisher, or other gaming industry member. The website is indeed wildly inconsistent, though. So I guess I'm saying, "Um, trust me." Which kinda sucks.--Mike Selinker (talk) 10:48, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Origins Award question

message: A concern has been raised at WT:VG#Excessive Warhammer articles about the Warhammer 40,000 articles. As Warhammer is primarily a table game, I thought I'd let you know here. Cheers, Miremare 19:43, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Warhammer articles 

message: Dear Wikimedians,
This is a (belated) announcement that requests are now being taken for illustrations to be created for the Philip Greenspun illustration project (PGIP).
The aim of the project is to create and improve illustrations on Wikimedia projects. You can help by identifying which important articles or concepts are missing illustrations (diagrams) that could make them a lot easier to understand. Requests should be made on this page: Philip_Greenspun_illustration_project/Requests
If there's a topic area you know a lot about or are involved with as a Wikiproject, why not conduct a review to see which illustrations are missing and needed for that topic? Existing content can be checked by using Mayflower to search Wikimedia Commons, or use the Free Image Search Tool to quickly check for images of a given topic in other-language projects.
The community suggestions will be used to shape the final list, which will be finalised to 50 specific requests for Round 1, due to start in January. People will be able to make suggestions for the duration of the project, not just in the lead-up to Round 1.
* General information about the project: m:Philip_Greenspun_illustration_project
* Potential illustrators and others interested in the project should join the mailing list: mail:greenspun-illustrations
thanks, pfctdayelise (talk) 12:34, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[m:GIP|Greenspun illustration project]]: requests now open 

message: I think we should create our own assessment template and begin tagging articles. 99% of board and table games are not claimed by any project, and not assessed. This can be easily modeled on Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Assessment and :Template:Vgproj. PS. Would we include ccgs within our framework? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  18:25, 14 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've noted we already have a template that can be easily modified for that: :Template:BTGProject.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  05:58, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have been going through many of the articles for this project, updating the ratings (class and importance).  The ones that I have found seem to be mostly stubs and "start" class articles, with the occasional "B" class article, and the very rare higher class article.  I have generally been giving importance ratings of "low", with a few getting a "mid", and the rare one receiving "high" or "top".  As an exception to this, for gaming companies and designers, I have been giving them "mid" or "high", as without the designers and publishers we, of course, wouldn't have many of these games.  :)  Feel free to join me in the assessments and/or alter ones that I have made if you disagree with me.  I have also set up the category pages for the quality/importance, so we can soon add a table having the ratings of articles such as can be found at the Video Game WikiProject.  I hope this encourages people to contribute to those articles that are lacking.  Many of them are in desperate need of references/reviews.  --Craw-daddy | T | 01:59, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Assessment 

message: Hey. I wrote a brief stub for the podcast The Dice Tower. This is a well-known podcast among board game geeks, hosted by prolific game reviewer Tom Vasel. It's been in existence for 112 episodes (some weekly, some every two weeks). Tom has interviewed many of the cream of crop of game designers. His podcast is hosted by Funagain Games, a major internet game distributor. Anyway, the stub has been nominated for deletion for non-notability. Is there anyone out there with more knowledge/experience of The Dice Tower who might be able to dredge up notability stuff so this article is not deleted? I emailed Tom, and he said he thinks they are going to be mentioned in a gaming podcast article in Knucklebones magazine's next issue. Applejuicefool (talk) 06:52, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll add the citation there. -- JHunterJ (talk) 13:30, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Dice Tower 

message: Could someone will more knowledge of the notability standards for board games chime in at Wall Street Spin?  There was an interesting bit of link hijacking going on there, but verifying the remaining content is probably best left to editors who have worked in the genre.  Thanks! Kuru talk 18:22, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wall Street Spin 

message: This category name is highly confusing, since Chinese chess is the common English name for a different board game, and one would naturally expect it to be filled with players of Chinese chess. Any suggestions on renaming it? 
70.51.9.174 (talk) 07:47, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Category:Chinese chess players]] 

message: *I've made some changes to the front page guidelines ("Structure" section top) for what "at a minimum" needs to be in an article, trying better to spell out what should be in a strategy section (at the level of whether to include one or not).  The later section "Structure > Style guide for game articles > Strategy" goes into more detail.  I thought the previous text wasn't what an encyclopedia is trying to do (unless the thing most noted in reliable sources was "why it is entertaining, etc.").  Please compare the present version to the previous (15-December) text and feel free to suggest further changes or to be bold. Barno (talk) 03:53, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Project's article structure guide (strategy sections) 

message: I would think that the designer of games such as Memoir '44, Battlelore, and the Command and Colors series should have his own page here.  When I have a chance I will start one, but please feel free to do so in the meantime.  (If you start one on your own sandbox, feel free to post a link here so that others can add to the work in progress if you like.)  There's a relatively recent article in Knucklebones, namely the relevant information is < ref></ref>.  When (if?) I make an article, I will certainly include some mention of the material in that article.  Obviously the project would want more references than a single article, but I mention this one as a start.  Cheers.  --Craw-daddy | T | 15:41, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Richard Borg 

message: Hello from Wikiproject Video Games. I'm just here to tell you about a discussion that a an IP user started on our discussion page. The point raised is about the where your non-video and our video game articles overlap as regards the people who actually create games. Please chip in to the conversation, it always helps to get a different angle on a subject. - X201 (talk) 09:26, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Had I known this project existed, I would've posted my original rant here instead of there, but there's no way I would have found that out from the pages in question - which is exactly the point I was trying to make.  71.126.99.212 (talk) 13:17, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: (Video) Games

message: In order to source some of the adaptations of the Hobbit, I'm trying to find reviews or magazine articles for several Iron Crown Enterprises  boardgames namely the Battle of Five Armies, The Lonely Mountain and The Hobbit Adventure game. I've looked through indexes of Dragon (magazine) and White Dwarf (magazine) but can't find any reviews or references to them (othe than the odd advert). I was wondering whether anyone could help track down reliable sources and possibly add them to the article, or point me in the right direction. Thanks. --Davémon (talk) 18:32, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  ICE, Merp and [[The Hobbit]] Adaptations 

message: I saw that our project page lists only Category:Tabletop games. Looking there, I see that Category:Board games and Category:Card games are two of the categories within the Tabletop games cat-tree.  There are others... and looking down Category:Wargames I see more detailed subcats at different levels.  Reviewing Diplomacy (game), I see that it's tagged with category "Board wargames", but that doesn't make it come up in the list for category "Wargames".  I think this means we just have to make each cat a member of its parent cat by adding its tag.  But that should be done for all the tree that we're concerned with, correct?  That will help us see the whole group, and help users see all games in our project's scope, is that right?  I might be away for 48 hours but I will look into this (if nobody else gets to it first).  Originally I just intended to ask whether to put the "Board games" category tag on the Dip article, then I was going to ask whether to add mentions of that and "Card games" in the cats section of the WPBTG front page.  Barno (talk) 01:55, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't add  or  to the diplomacy article.  From Wikipedia:Categorization and subcategories: "In straightforward cases an article should not be in both a category and its subcategory."  Diplomacy is in board wargames, which is a subcategory of board games and of wargames, so it should not be in either of the parent categories.  Regarding adding  to the list on our front page, I'm in favour of it. Percy Snoodle (talk) 10:20, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Categories 

message: There's a template under discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Role-playing games#Excess gameplay description template for marking articles for cleanup.  Comments from members of this WikiProject would be welcome. Percy Snoodle (talk) 15:12, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Excess gameplay description template 

message: Greetings!  I've been working on the article for Ogre and would like to have additional input on it.  Despite having never played the game myself, it's my desire to get this article up to WP:GA standards in the next couple of months (I don't think it's ever going to be a candidate for WP:FA, so that's why I'm going for GA).  Anybody that has access to (print) magazines (like White Dwarf, Dragon, computer magazines where they review the Atari/Commodore versions, etc), I'd like to request them to please add some appropriate info/citations to this article.  I think this game is an important milestone in the history of gaming, bringing lots of attention to, and attraction for, the Microgame concept.  After all, if this game wasn't as successful as it was I doubt that Metagaming Concepts would have printed so many other microgames, and likely other companies would not have entered into the microgame (or minigame) market either.  Many thanks in advance!  --Craw-daddy | T | 20:23, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Request for comments on (and additional references for) [[Ogre (game)]]

message: Hmmm, would it possible that someone with more knowledge than me about how templates work, and how to change them correctly, could edit the  template?  I'd like the template to automatically add the appropriate category (or categories) to the talk page, indicating whether it's a "Low-importance" or "Mid-importance" article and so forth for the project (and the same for the "class" too).  I've tried to edit the template a little bit, but there is obviously more going on than I understand at the moment.  Basically I've seen other WikiProject banner templates that automatically add these categories to the talk pages based on the parameters in the template and would think it would be rather useful to have here as well.  Many thanks.  --Craw-daddy | T | 18:44, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, now I think I understand a little better.  The edited template seems to work fine, I was assuming that it worked something like Categories did.  I thought that if I changed the template them it would apply to the old pages that used the template, but you have to update those pages (even if you change nothing on them) to have the template re-applied to them.  So I don't think that any further editing has to be done to the template (just the part of my brain).  :)  Sorry.  --Craw-daddy | T | 20:35, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: BTG Project template

message: Having mentioned this to a few other people, I thought I'd share it here. Check out the book Hobby Games: The 100 Best, edited by James Lowder (2007 by Green Ronin Publishing). This is a collection of essays done by game designers (like Gary Gygax, Greg Costikyan, Allen Varney, Richard Berg, Steve Jackson (both the US and UK Jacksons), Richard Garfield, etc) about their favorite games (they couldn't choose their own, or one in which they had a financial interest). It's the closest thing to an "academic reference" that you might find for many modern games (i.e. ones published in the last 25-30 years or so). The coverage is mostly geared towards board/card/war games (with a few articles on role-playing games). Now go forth and improve more articles.  :) --Craw-daddy | T | 22:31, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: There is an essay written by Richard Berg (on a game called Plague!).  There is also an essay about Berg's game Terrible Swift Sword.  Richard Borg is not one of the essayists, although there is an essay about Borg's game Battle Cry, written by Tracy Hickman.  Hope this clears things up a bit.  --Craw-daddy | T | 18:40, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Reference available for games

message: I don't want to bite the newbie, but a new editor is starting to edit articles on card games, inserting the word "sport" in various contexts, as well as add them to :Category:Sport (which should be an empty category anyway, as the category page says).  See, for example Speed (card game).  I don't think it's appropriate to do this, but wanted some additional input before I start reverting these kinds of edits.  I will leave a similar message with my thoughts on this editor's talk page.  --Craw-daddy | T | 15:55, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Whatever the editor is trying to achieve, there's got to be a better way of achieving it than replacing "game" with the awkward construction "sport/game" every place it occurs. -Stellmach 17:07, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Also, if the thesis is that card games are sports, then the existing categories for card games should be subcategories of sports. Articles should not be in both a parent and child category, as noted above. So in no case is adding these articles to the Sports category called for, as far as I can see. -Stellmach 17:10, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

text: The editor clearly has a non-standard understanding of things.  I reverted some of the edits, Craw-daddy didn't.  They should be reverted everywhere, at least until all board and table games are redefined as "sports". 2005 (talk) 00:02, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

text: I asked at the time here to see if there was any consensus before I just started reverting them.  I know I reverted some of the changes at some point, but there still could be a few that remain.  --Craw-daddy | T | 00:26, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Just to clarify my above comment, I reverted some of the edits; Craw-daddy reverted some of them also... "I reverted some of the edits in addition to the ones Craw-daddy reverted" I believe they were all fixed as of teo days ago. There may be more since then..2005 (talk) 01:51, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Recent edits about card games

message: The user is now on his/her third identity and has moved on to labeling board games like backgammon, chess and go as "table sports" and "mind sports", including making his/her own parallel "sports" category structure. Considerable work appears to be needed to keep this from getting way out of hand. 2005 (talk) 07:39, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Now also more "sports"

message: I have been working on articles contained in list of collectible card games and was wondering if there were others out there who could research additional cititions to add to these. Mathman1550 (talk) 23:33, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It depends I guess.  I have access to the Pyramid archives (which require pay access).  Let me know what game(s) you're interested in and I can try to have a look when I have some free time, especially if there's something specific that you may be looking for.  Otherwise you can always post more general inquires here and hope that someone can help you out.  --Craw-daddy | T | 23:41, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Well there are so many of these with references and info lacking, its hard to choose which are most important to do first. We could start with the oldest games and work our way foreward. The oldest games on the list that need help are Dixie (card game), Galactic Empires, Illuminati: New World Order, On the Edge (game), Spellfire, Star Trek Customizable Card Game, and Super Deck!.  Some just need referenced, some need so much more. Thanks if you get time to look at these. Mathman1550 (talk) 04:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Collectible card games

message: * SunCreator (talk) 14:00, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article is listed for deletion [[Cake (draughts player)]] 

message: Board and Card Games Timeline omits a lot (almost all those used in the "History" section of [4X]!) but may be useful for others tracing the history of various game genres. E.g. Tactics II seems to have been the "first influential commercial wargame." Philcha (talk) 09:02, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Games timeline

message: Randomran and I have been working to get 4X up to GA, and we've found  board games described as "4X". Since neither of us knows much about board games, we'd appreciate input from someone who does. Can anyone help? Please respond at Talk:4X#Board_games. Philcha (talk) 09:05, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: 4X and board games