Talk:Super transformation (Sonic the Hedgehog)

message: Absurd?  Perhaps, but I thought this needed to be pointed out regardless.  In Sonic 2 and Sonic 3 & Knuckles, Flickies appear to be in a super transformed state while being around another who's enpowered with the Emeralds.  While the out-of-game explanation would be that the Flickies share the same palette that Sonic and Knuckles do, in Sonic 3 & Knuckles, four supercharged Flickies appear when Tails goes Super, and quickly revert to their usual (blue) color when Tails turns normal.  I believe this would qualify the entire Flicky species as being capable of Super transformation. (Mind you, there haven't been any Flickies around as of late when the cast transforms, and the Flicky that was in Sonic Adventure was never shown while Sonic was in Super form.)  Just a thought. Eternalslumber 01:02, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: While I would probably support that as far as a fan, I don't think I, or any responsible editor could support that for inclusion on Wikipedia... sorry :( --Zikar 01:10, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Heh, don't mention it.  I think it's an interesting fact, but I don't consider it a big loss. Eternalslumber 11:47, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Flicky?

message: Guys, if you're going to delete this article, let me make a suggestion. How about we move all the Super transformation information about particular characters to the articles of those characters and just be done with it? User:Denjo
: I've suggested that myself, but it seems that that's the way things USED to be which ultimately led to the creation of this article.  Super Sonic's section and the overall Knuckles page, it seems, were just getting too damn long and eventually got separated out into this one.  I'm not sure why this isn't merged with "Super transformation (other media)" though.  At any rate, if you have an opinion on the deletion, you should go to the discussion page and vote on Keep, Delete, etc.  So far the "Keep" arguments are in the lead. --Bishop2 15:02, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: They were going to be one originally however, it was way too long so I decided to cut them in two.  Especially since I'm not qualified to edit the Sonic the Comic info and I haven't until recently been following Sonic the Hedgehog issue by issue.  I also haven't seen the JPN episode 67 of Sonic X so I can't say much about DSS except for what's in the 4kids edit. :/GrandMasterGalvatron 16:01, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Suggestion

message: When did that go up? There's no discussion or anything in here about... it just seems to have randomly cropped up, should we remove it? --Zikar 00:32, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah...I was there when A man In Black added it.  I really don't know what to say.  Anyone who's played Sonic knows about Super Sonic.  The Super Sonic article's been up for deletion numerous times and it failed each and every time.  It also failed the merge votes until I FINALLY took action and combined all of the Super/Hyper/Burning forms myself.  I guess I'll remove it for the simple fact that it has survived numerous Afds in the past.GrandMasterGalvatron 15:46, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Also, to A Man in Black, the original research idea is really debatable at this point.  You could effectively tag every Sonic article with it because only the fans care enough to add all of this data.  Look at the Sonic hacking scene.  The fans have disassembled most of the Genesis games, and have written numerous utilities to do all but create an entirely new game from an existing one.  Hell, I'm working on a Sonic 1 hack right now and it already has two playable characters instead of one.  
The whole debate is the reason the Concept Mobius references die hard...no one but the fans cares enough about it, and the articles ALWAYS fail afd.  I really don't know what I can say about it.  I've seen to it that every statement here is cited in some form.  There's really nothing more I can do.  There are no sources outside of the games themselves and official websites.  If you want to tag the entire Sonic series of articles for deletion then go right ahead ^^.GrandMasterGalvatron 15:54, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

text: You really think so?  Then send the article up for deletion and watch it fail AGAIN.  This article's been up at least THREE times for Afd and it always survives.  Always.  Go on...tag the entire staple of articles til there's only Sonic, and then tag him too.  Then go tag about 90% of all of the articles on this site.  The Wikipedia intro already said that the content of this site reflects the concerns of it's readers.  You can trim the hell out of all of the sonic articles and they'll all come right back.  Gonna protect them all from re-creation?  Go ahead, be my guest.  No character has any real world notability outside of Sonic himself.  Believe me, I was actually trying to whip these articles into shape but I see it's truly a waste of time.  My greatest contribution here was the reformatting of this very article.  I've trimmed, and cleaned, and out of universed, and it's still not enough so just fuck it all.  Delete the whole damn series.  I've done all I can >>GrandMasterGalvatron 04:30, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Notability tag?

message: Alright people...have it out here.  Ya'll have been going back and forth and it's time to settle it.
Now I don't have the game, but from what I've seen, three rings enter him.  I understand why it could be thought to be all of them though.  Now I'm personally staying out of this one so you guys are gonna have to reach a consensus here.GrandMasterGalvatron 20:34, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, we should start by consulting the reliable sources that have seen fit to comment on this subject. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 20:36, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There are none.  So where does that leave us?GrandMasterGalvatron 20:40, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If there are no sources, then the information is not included. It's that simple. ' 23:45, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Have fun putting up the entire series for Afd thenGrandMasterGalvatron 12:34, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Must you use the "then delete everything" reasoning every time? I think I've seen it three times since A Man in Black first arrived. Gurko 11:55, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes because it makes no sense to slag one article when they all suffer the same problem!GrandMasterGalvatron 18:37, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Getting back on topic, I'd like to address the "three of the World Rings" thing that people keep inserting into the text.  I just had to revert this yet again, and here's the problem - there's no actual FLUID cut scene showing his transformation.  It's just a series of framed, stylized still images.  Which means that we have no damn clue how many rings flow into his person, becauase we don't see it happen and have no idea what's being kept off-screen.  This is part of the problem, obviously.--Bishop2 02:03, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Would it be best to mention that Darkspines resembles "Dark Super Sonic" from Sonic X? (Even if that form appeared for a few seconds in the entire animé, from what I remember...) 88.107.74.30 00:56, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

text: Going back to the topic of how, the official Prima guide states that four of the Rings go around his wrists and ankles. Ericdd329 15:11, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Prima guides aren't official sources. I've read a Prima guide for Animal Crossing that doesn't even know what gender some of the characters are. As far as the actual topic, I agree with Bishop2. But its much more in the form of sonic games for it to be seven. JDub90 16:26, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Darkspine and the World Rings 

message: The name of this article should be changed to Super Transformation in Sonic Media so we don't have to delete this article.
:Well, it was gonna be that way at first, but the article was split in two because there was a great load of information in it from the comics and Sonic X.:/GrandMasterGalvatron 19:31, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Name change

message: This is not a request...it is a demand to add external links to compensate for the ridicluous loss of data from this recent retardation.  In addtion, I expect nothing short of this article reaching GA status and beyond.  That's been the intent of this article since day one and I'll be damned if some random passerbys fuck that over.  That is all.GrandMasterGalvatron 15:31, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If you want external links THAT badly and THAT quickly, you could always, y'know, add them yourself? --Bishop2 15:42, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes I could, but then someone's gonna find a bullshit reason to delete them, so I'm gonna make them do it.  It's one thing to clean up and article, but to remove sources and make it less informative is a whole 'nother can of worms altogether. GrandMasterGalvatron 15:48, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Who removed any sources?  If sources were removed, put them back.  I'm the one who did the two big cleanup posts, and I'm pretty sure I didn't remove any sources that are actually relevant to anything. --Bishop2 16:08, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You realize most of those sources were pointless, right? Why the hell does anyone care if the three Super forms give them same height and weight? Nemu 17:25, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  External Links...NOW 

message: Running out of Rings in a final boss battle results in an instant loss of a life regardless of the battlefield.
Not quite true. If you are standing on a piece of debris in Sonic Adventure when you run out of rings, you stay alive until you touch the water. It's a small little thing, but it contradicts this line.  Masterotenko 17:46, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Now this I can testify to. I've actually done that and though I never touched the water, I just randomnly collapsed and died. I even got a ring and they still killed me off XD. Meh..it'll probably end up deleted :/GrandMasterGalvatron 17:47, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm? Yes, it will. In that case, it's me, Heavy, from Sonic Stadium! I sent you the PM of fandom yesterday. Also, I swear I've ran around as regular Sonic at some point. Perhaps I was on DX? Masterotenko 17:52, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've only been able to play DX.  However, it looks like we'll have to alter the statement. (then again, I'm fairly sure Super Sonic was mentioned in EGM's review of SA:DX.  I'll have to look it up)GrandMasterGalvatron 17:56, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I did that too (in DX) to see what happened. For me, Sonic stayed alive for five seconds or so, and then died anyway. Gurko 08:31, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Maybe it was some splashing water?  Anyway, Sonic would be swept up by the waves that Chaos makes.  The point is, final boss fights have happened in bad conditions that Sonic couldn't usually survive in.  I think it's notable that this is the first one that he can last a while in, too.Jon166 01:43, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Instant Death from De-Super 

message: Editing the article down to only its citable factual information has left us with a shorter piece, and I'm wondering now if we might merge it with the "Super transformation in other media" article.  Mind you, that article may also need to undergo some editing... --Bishop2 18:36, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: At this point, probably not, if only due to "Sonic the Comic"'s evil Super Sonic.  There's simply too much data within the comics for the articles to be one.  Believe me, I was going to at first, but it was just too long X_X.  Not to mention the game and comic versions of Super Knuckles are completely different..as well as Super Tails and Turbo Tails.GrandMasterGalvatron 04:50, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Good gravy, what's with the desire to merge all this stuff?  There's nothing wrong with linking articles to one another.  Soon we'll have one long page called "Sonic" with one sentence describing each little topic... Paul Haymon 05:21, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Possible merge with Super transformation in other media?

message: Wasn't he debatable? Oh well.... ChromeWulf ZX 02:47, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the current definition of Super Transformation in the article, Chaos should not be included. Paul Haymon 08:31, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll get him.GrandMasterGalvatron 13:23, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: And just to be clear on why Chaos shouldn't be in, it's because there's a difference in the two Super forms (Super and Perfect): Super forms use positive energy and Perfect forms use negative energy.Cheeze Master 00:10, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  So......Chaos is In? 

message: : We already cleaned it up and added attributions.  Someone's going to have to tell me what else needs work in it.  Otherwise we'll just lose the tag. --Bishop2 21:24, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Let's see, clean-up of Sonic's and expansion of Shadow's.  Sounds like a Shadow fan to me.  Tags removed.GrandMasterGalvatron 16:03, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup of Sonic section?  What? 

message: Just a comment here, not a suggestion or anything: Mecha Sonic's method of "going super" seems more like an "overcharge" to his chassis than anything.  It's without contest that this is indeed a "super" form given his animations and sounds, but I just thought I'd mention this.  ~ Joseph Collins (U)(T)(C) 23:36, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: And the other Super forms are an overcharge to the body. Eriorguez 00:57, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: What he said XDGrandMasterGalvatron 00:07, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  ...touché.  ^_^;  ~ Joseph Collins (U)(T)(C) 02:45, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

text: You know what I just thought of, though?  As far as we know, nobody has been Super before Sonic (besides /maybe/ Chaos), so Sonic, Tails, or even Eggman could have very well made the "Super" part up.  I mean, it's not like as soon as he transforms, the emeralds say "omg, its leik super sonic or else so dont mock meh 1337 skillzorz Sonic joo n00b."  So yeah, Mecha Sonic could be Super Mecha Sonic just as easily as Sonic is Super Sonic, because it's just a nickname for charging up.Jon166 01:35, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

text: By the way, did anyone make an enemy transformation page yet?  You know, with Perfect Chaos, Devil Doom, Metal Overlord, etc.? Jon166 01:38, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That would be unecesarry. Cheeze Master 00:11, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mecha Sonic's "Overcharge" 

message: I recently added that Darkspine Sonic's voice is comparable to Jet the Hawk. This is probably the best description to add right away. I don't know if you need some sort of voice clip for a source, but the quality is the same and the tone is almost the same. Why take this descriptor out?
: It's a matter of personal opinion, really, as to whether it sounds much like Jet or not, so we can't really use it in case someone might hear it and think it's totally different. --Bishop2 20:20, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I personally thought that "Shahra, lend me your power!" sounded like Knuckles.  Jet is more high pitched and scratchy.  I'd say Darkspine Sonic has a more powerful voice, if anything. Jon166 01:30, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Darkspine Sonic voice=

message: I think it might be time to add an image to the top right of this article, in keeping with the Wiki standards for a Good Article.  My initial gut feeling is that we should put the Super Sonic image from "Sonic the Hedgehog" up there, as it's a good example as well as the most recent.  However, that would leave us needing a photo to go in the Super Sonic section... any thoughts? --Bishop2 20:21, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: How about an image of someone changing into super state?  I don't know :/  Whatever you do, an image for Super Sonic isn't a problem as I have plenty.GrandMasterGalvatron 21:17, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  All right, I took your suggestion; how's that look?  Too much? --Bishop2 04:06, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sprites look kind of... tacky... like we ran out of budget or something... --Zikar 04:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I like that it shows the process of transformation, unlike a still image.  That could also be done as a series of stills, though.  And god knows the Sonic Advance sprites look way more attractive than the ridiculously undetailed, smaller polygon models used in Sonic Rush. --Bishop2 05:31, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Time for a Main Article Image?=

message: This may just be me, but in the actual Sonic Adventures 2 game, the names that come up when you beat the final boss are Super Sonic and Hyper Shadow.  I've only played the dreamcast version, so I'm not sure if they changed it in the Gamecube version, but if they didn't I believe his title should be changed to Hyper Shadow, via Sonic Adventure 2 as a source.  Vrtrahex 21:41, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Read the section.  Do you see where Super Shadow's name is bolded within the text?  That's a link.  Click it.GrandMasterGalvatron 22:18, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

text: On second thought, hold up for a minute.  Some douche deleted the images.  I'll fix it.GrandMasterGalvatron 22:21, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

text: Ok they're back.  Now check that image.  it's the Sonic Rivals data card for Super Shadow.  The last Hyper States were in Sonic 3 and KnucklesGrandMasterGalvatron 22:48, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

text: On the Dreamcast he was Super Shadow too, Shadow has a speaking line where he said "Sonic, I don't know how much longer I can stay in my Super Form" or words to that effect. The term Hyper Shadow was NEVER used in any game ever. I've played both Dreamcast and Gamecube versions, and both games are identically except for Super Shadow's colouring. It's been mentioned this was due to the way the Dreamcast processed colours but there was no source for that so take it as you will. --Zikar 11:27, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Super Shadow? 

message: Just a heads up that a better image is coming soon.  Also, Sonic Rush Adventure is out and Burning Blaze is in it.  I trust you European folks will update her section?GrandMasterGalvatron 01:42, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: And when do you think the image will be up? Cheeze Master 00:16, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: As soon as someone with a ROM of either Sonic Rush or Sonic Rush adventure takes some screens of the final story.  I've already asked one person I know of to do it and he's working on that now.  If any of you lot are able to run it on your PCs (mine is slow as hell) then go for it.GrandMasterGalvatron 22:02, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Burning Blaze 

message: Is it really necessary to link to images of the "You've collected all of the Emeralds" screens?--MythicFox 20:42, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, because there has to be a source.  Past experiences and edit wars have deemed it necessary.  Nothing goes in this article that cannot be reliably cited.  That's just the way Wikipedia rolls (well, at least it tries to)GrandMasterGalvatron 07:28, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I agree with GMG, the article needs links or else users will change the names to Turbo Tails and Hyper Shadow, etc. A user has been removing the links, I will put them back. User:Super Knuckles 16:42, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image links 

message: If you haven't seen it already, Sonic has been announced in Brawl. They even post a video with him in it. In the last 30 seconds of the video they show the Chaos Emeralds fly around him and he becomes Super Sonic. I put this in, but you may want to check this out yourself. Fangz is hungry :3 11:54, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Super Sonic in Super Smash Bros Brawl? 

message: Too many pictures in the article.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.214.175.60 (talk) 00:00, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Too many 

message: I got the pic of hyper sonic --Shadow rocks101 (talk) 11:44, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  hyper sonic 

message: I put down Sonic and mentioned about the different tranformations when aborbin the dark energy of the choas emeralds and the super emeralds and they deleted it. even thou the information was accurate. Also i request that the data be reposted! because it has become a waste of my free time.
:What on earth is that image? The only example within the games of anything asorbing the negative energy is Chaos, and Sonic takes the rest of the energy to become Super Sonic! as for "it has become a waste of my free time", welcome to wikipedia, and please remember to sign you comments on tallk/dicussino pages with: "~~~~", hope that helps?  Doktor  Wilhelm  14:28, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm fairly certain he's talking about something that only happened once in Sonic X. The Meterex kidnapped Chris and Cosmo, and Sonic became so enraged when he saw Chris badly hurt and Cosmo terrified in their prison that he transformed into what appeared to be a dark version of Super Sonic (his eyes in distance shots seemed to be all white, but close-ups revealed his eyes were still their normal green). About the deletion of the info: I am not the one who deleted it but from the page history I can see that it was entirely speculative and didn't meet Wikipedia:Verifiability. In the episode, nothing was ever explained about this 'Dark Sonic', not even his name - the transformation could be the negative power of the Emeralds like you said, or it could be because the Emeralds were all fake and thus the transformation was different. Or the whole transformation may be just a super-exaggerated Face fault (similar to how Amy's body was engulfed in flames when she was angry) since the fake Emeralds never were shown glowing or anything to transform Sonic, and this 'Dark Sonic' is really just a really ticked off normal Sonic. So since everything, even the 'Dark Sonic' name, is just speculation by a fan, it isn't something that should be included in Wikipedia. I'm sorry you wasted your time but, as Wilhelm said above, this is how Wikipedia works. Cigraphix (talk) 15:49, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: While the transformation in Episode 67 of Sonic X DOES look somewhat like that, it is never shown from that angle. It must be fanart. -- RattleMan 17:52, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  No dark Sonic??? 

message: :Image:Super Metal Sonic.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot (talk) 05:56, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Super Metal Sonic.JPG

message: Why is this article called Super transformation?  This term wasn't used in any game or anywhere else, to my knowledge.  Furthermore, it doesn't really specify what the article is talking about.  I propose a move if we can find a better name for this concept, unless it ends up merged into some other article like Chaos Emeralds or something. Redphoenix526 (Talk) 16:21, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  The term is used in the PC version of Sonic Heroes, if that helps. --Bishop2 (talk) 20:34, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Then it makes sense for that to be applied to the other media article, but it doesn't make sense for this one.  Besides, isn't the comic series non-canonical for everything listed here? Redphoenix526 (Talk) 22:56, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Plus no one else has come in saying that it should be used for something else. If it's not broken, don't fix it. --Zikar (talk) 09:32, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, if you insist.  Though if a better term comes up, I'll be asking again. Redphoenix526 (Talk) 18:38, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Moving this page

message: Super Sonic's eye colour can be clearly seen as brown, why do people keep saying it's red.Fairfieldfencer (talk) 12:42, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Super Sonic pics 
For starters they're brown in Sonic X, (compare them to Shadow's and you'll see for yourself) and the channel icons have made mistakes before, (such as E-123 Omega having a black stripe when it's silver in the games), but otherwise I see your point. But I think it should be noted that his eye colour was previously brown.Fairfieldfencer (talk) 10:14, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Jumping back to that bit about Omega's stripe, check out this: http://sonic.sega.jp/sonic_heroes/chara_d.html http://sonic.sega.jp/sonic_heroes/shots/ev_dark3.jpg
Okay so it was black in the games. Back to the point Cigraphix, his eyes can clearly be seen as brown in Sonic Adventures 1 & 2 and in Sonic Heroes, (the best view is after he uses a team blast in the final battle).Fairfieldfencer (talk) 11:46, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Super Sonic eye colour 

message: Should Sonic's new werewolf form in Sonic Unleashed be considered a Super Transformation under Sonic?
- sonicmaster1223  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.252.60.15 (talk) 00:58, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Sonic's Werewolf Form

message: actually im surprised i didnt think of that.lol.anyway when super power effects are close to super forms cause flick's to have it,tails and knuckles gained it when they were in sonic heroes, in new super sonic the hedgehog gave silver and shadow gained super form by touchin super sonic  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ronnie42 (talk • contribs) 13:56, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Super form close power