Talk:Dookie

message: I am going to turn this article into something amazing.  Expect it to be a Good Article by next month, if things go smoothly.  If anyone wants to help, please leave a message on my talk page so I get back to you.  I cannot see my favorite album's article be in such bad shape!  I already have done some somewhat big things, like change the lead part of the article, make a background section, a part for chartings of the album and singles, and uploaded two preview songs.  I mainly need sources, so really just talk to me if you have that.  Thanks!  Xihix 22:29, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Doing a major re-do and revamp

message: Armstrong says in a quote about the album art: "The robed character that looks like Ozzy Osbourne is the woman on the cover of the first Ozzy album." It links to Blizzard of Ozz, which is Ozzy's first solo album, but really the woman is from Black Sabbath's first album. The link should be changed or something should be put after the quote to show that she's from a different album.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zelda Death (talk • contribs) 08:38, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Album name and art quote... 

message: The intro states, "As of 2008, Dookie is the band's best-selling album, with over 15 million copies sold worldwide."  Green Day discography, on the other hand, claims sales of 20 million, but that American Idiot surpassed this with sales of 22 million.  This contradiction should be fixed. Calbaer (talk) 17:33, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sales figures 

message: This album is not alternative rock, it's pop punk and punk rock. 84.122.157.205 (talk) 11:52, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. I am not sure why pop punk is being changed to alt rock. Everyone knows dookie is pop punk. It is probably the definitive pop punk record of the 90s. A source for alt rock needs to be found... Nouse4aname (talk) 10:40, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

text: All right, I did it. The genre section as it is now seems fine to me. - PM800 (talk) 05:23, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well, User:WesleyDodds just changed everything again and deleted the hidden message... Oh well. - PM800 (talk) 12:10, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: There's no reason to list "pop punk" specifically when you already list "punk rock" (pop punk being a subgenre of punk). I see no reason for such a stern warning in the genre field, when it really hasn't been an issue before. WesleyDodds (talk) 23:07, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you aware that people (usually anons) kept changing the genres back and forth? It was annoying. - PM800 (talk) 00:13, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I've had this page on my watchlist for one or two years now; it doesn't happen that much, and it's not that much of an issue beyond people changing the genre and doing nothing else to the page.  WesleyDodds (talk) 00:36, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: In a span of six weeks, the genre was changed on August 4, 6, and 14; and on September 10, 13, and 15. On average about once per week, so I figured that was often enough. I don't know. Nobody seems to mind, except you. - PM800 (talk) 00:51, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: That seems like a temporary blip. Nothing to get too worried about. WesleyDodds (talk) 00:06, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not worried about it at all, now that the warning is there. - PM800 (talk) 00:38, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Genre of album

message: Isn't American Idiot a diamond album now? It's sold over 14 million according to the article. can someone fix the statement where it says its Green Day's only diamond album? 24.141.7.98 (talk) 23:00, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  diamond status 

message: Why is someone removing the track listing template? Just curious. --Chickenguy13 (talk) 12:38, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: You don't actually need the template if it's already written out. The template is intended for use in articles where there is no tracklist currently and the author doesn't know how to format the section without a template. WesleyDodds (talk) 23:05, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, but it's not nessecery to remove the track list template. --Chickenguy13 (talk) 04:03, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: It's been the long-established template, so it should remain. WesleyDodds (talk) 00:05, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, i don't think you should just come and remove the track list template if it's already there, but i'm not gonna re-add it because i don't wanna start an edit war. --Chickenguy13 (talk) 07:21, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The tracklist template is not "intended for use in articles where there is no tracklist currently", it is intended for use wherever editors see fit to use it. That this article's track listing has long been formatted without a template is not a compelling argument for reverting (I venture that the reason an untemplated track list has been status quo here is because this article achieved FA 7 months before the tracklist template was even created). What is the advantage of a standard numbered list vs. using the template? I tend to prefer the template as it gives a cleaner presentation, separating tracks and lengths into columns and avoiding the need for en-dashes, and places notations such as authors in small text to distinguish them from the track titles. There are album FAs that use the template, and others that don't; there is no standard or rule as to when it may be used. For what it's worth, every single Green Day album article uses the template with the exceptions of American Idiot and Bullet in a Bible (which I believe don't use it because of the "chapter" subdivisions of some tracks, though there are workarounds for this). --IllaZilla (talk) 08:03, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The fact that it's the established tracklist format is an argument not to change it; it's what's been established and there's no necessary reason to change it to a template with unnecessary code when it can be plainly formatted. The only compelling reason to convert it to the template after the fact is to heed the recommendation by WP:ALBUMS that it be used for complicated tracklistings, which does not apply to this album (and note it emphasizes the use of bulleted tracklists first). As for presentation, neither is cleaner than the other. It's totally pointless to add the template if the tracklist is already written out. Whether other Green Day album articles use it or not is irrelevant. WesleyDodds (talk) 10:15, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Just because something is "established" doesn't mean it can't be changed. There are probably hundreds, if not thousands, of factual inaccuracies throughout Wikipedia - but as these are established I assume we shouldn't go about correcting them? It seems consensus is to go with the template, I agree that it looks neater, and presentation should be an important consideration for articles. Nouse4aname (talk) 14:43, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Exactly. Just 'cause something's been one way for a long time doesn't mean it can't ever be changed or improved. Like I said, the most likely reason it's been that way for a long time is because the article's FA review predated the creation of the track list template by almost a year. The fact that all the other Green Day articles use the template is hardly irrelevant, as these articles are all part of a series (Book:Green Day) and consistency across that series is a net positive. Which format looks cleaner is entirely a matter of personal taste. Clearly there are several editors, myself included, who feel that the template is a cleaner look regardless of the complexity (or lack thereof) of the tracklist. And I don't see any "unnecessary code" involved in the tracklist template, at least no more or less than is used to create a numbered list with en-dashes. --IllaZilla (talk) 15:42, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Track list template

message: I don't particularly care whether or not this is listed as 'alternative rock' (one of the least well-defined genres of music around), but since this appears to be an issue upon which editors disagree, I would suggest that a source is found to justify its inclusion, or else that it is left out.--Michig (talk) 11:45, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Allmusic lists it as Alternative Pop/Rock, Post-Grunge, Punk Revival, Punk-Pop, and Alternative/Indie Rock. BOVINEBOY2008 11:53, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: These also suggest that alternative rock can be sourced: , . Also included in Dave Thompson's book Alternative Rock. So the question now is what justification is there for removing it? Unless there are more authoritative sources that say it isn't alternative rock, that justification doesn't appear to exist. Some may not agree, but if reliable sources support it, just move on. --Michig (talk) 12:08, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The Editor who removed it seems to base it on personal opinion, or says that amg is not a good enough source. This seems like adequate justification in my opinion. BOVINEBOY2008 12:30, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Do you think Allmusic is a good source? it´s obvious that they don´t know anything about punk rock, as they consider "punk revival" as a genre..Also,. how can they think that Dookie is post-grunge? It has absolutely nothing to do with Grunge music. Seriously, they´re pretty pathetic, classifying Dookie as post-grunge just because it was released when Kurt Cobain died. Come on, I´m having a neutral point of view, Allmusic is rubbish.--Ogica1234 (talk) 19:23, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  Post-Grunge? This really proves that Allmusic isn't a good source..How can Green Day be post-grunge? Releasing an album after Grunge "died" doesn't make it post-grunge..--Revilal90 (talk) 02:07, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

text: Why do you consider Allmusic not a reliable source? BOVINEBOY2008 06:35, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  Personally, I think that Allmusic focuses more on trends than actually does on music when labeling and adds a lot of genres just for everybody to be happy. "The more genres, the better" isn't a professional way to label music..--Revilal90 (talk) 22:13, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Genre edit-war 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: Hello. I'm from the French Wikipedia and i'm currently working on this album with a collaborator. We have an issue with the release dates of the singles, which are not always the same according to different sources, and we especially noticed that three books about Green Day (Nobody Likes You from Marc Spitz, American Idiots & The New Punk Explosion from Ben Myers and Green Day: A Musical Biography from Kjersti Egerdahl) cite a release date in August for "Basket Case", whereas in that FA it's in November... but without references. So, i would like to know if you have an explanation for the release date in November which seems doubtful to me. Best regards. Olyvar (talk) 09:35, 3 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Nobody follows this page ? I made the change for "Basket Case" and added a citation. Cheers. Olyvar (talk) 18:32, 7 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I made this article into a FA about 12 years ago!  I may have gotten a date wrong or two since information like that was difficult to come by with a lot of verification.  Apologies for not being able to help more.  71.90.213.112 (talk) 13:59, 8 April 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Release dates of the singles 

message: The Background section of the article mentions the band being banned from the famous Gilman street venue, in the present tense. That may have been true at one point, but they have played sets there in 2001 (informally) and 2015. I don't know enough about the history of the band and the venue but maybe someone with knowledge of it can fix that.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:181:C300:6FE0:BC44:2670:5AA1:2CE4 (talk) 19:08, 7 February 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gilman Street 

message: Frwiki called this out as a featured article that aged badly, and they're right. I've taken a skim through this version and as this record grew more popular, it seems this was left in the dust of the 2007 era of FAs. Had this been presented years later, I don't think it would even pass the GA process. Dookies French article is in much better shape and is a featured article there, promoted May 2018. I encourage anyone who is interested in rescuing this article to try their hand at translating for material to bring to enwiki. I would really like to not take this to FAR, so I hope this has a lot in sotre for us. dannymusiceditor  oops  06:06, 29 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: So far, I have edited up through a track-by-track relay of the album. I have much more to do, but as time goes on I will have this completed. dannymusiceditor  oops  22:16, 30 September 2023 (UTC)
replies: text:   - from a quick look, setlist.fm is user-generated and shouldn't be used in a featured article and I'm worried that the youtube link to the full concert is a WP:ELNEVER situation unless Green Day is taking the Grateful Dead approach to distribution of live concert filmings. Hog Farm  Talk 20:17, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Didn't notice those, thanks for the heads up. I have corrected the issue. dannymusiceditor  oops  20:34, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  FA status - French article may be of help 

message: I'm worried there may be a bit of hyperbole in the 924 Gilman Street content that doesn't align with the venue's own article; but some of the sources are dead, others blocked outside the US, and others are hour-long documentaries with no indication given when the statement appears!
This article says: 
The 924 Gilman Street article says: 
While this is a featured article and that one is labelled as having 'multiple issues', I have to say their version sounds plausible - a venue has a policy that normally doesn't allow major label artists (without a specific exception, which has been used for Green Day), rather than the venue (a 501(c) non-profit) specifically spitefully banning Green Day as sell-outs - and I have a fear that the version here has been dramatised for effect, which isn't ideal for a featured article. But I can't see enough of the sources to be sure. Is anyone able to clarify or investigate further? TSP (talk) 16:43, 22 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  924 Gilman content