Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Turkey/Archive 3

message: Heads up on this.  I already did a round of reverts, could use some backup.DBaba 05:29, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Vandalism

message: While looking at the prod-ed Alpagot, I found sites that consider it a place name.  There is no :tr:Alpagot but I found :tr:Alpagut, which I have attempted to duplicate over here as Alpagut.  Any clues here? John Vandenberg 05:29, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alpagut and Alpagot 

message: Should we create a manual of style for Turkey related articles, something like Wikipedia:Manual of Style (Turkey-related articles)? Maybe we can get a consensus on things like using Turkish characters. see these DenizTC 01:00, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No we shouldn't others do not use French, German or Russian characters and those are more common than Turkish so I see no reason why Turkish should be a exception because others who do not have Turkish installed may mess up the title with question marks the Turkish language wikipedia has the native name. I did it per WP:UE --Karent82 21:02, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You are mistaken. First, Russians don't use a Latin based alphabet; French people and Germans use a modified alphabet just like Turks do. Take a look at :Image:Latin_alphabet_world_distribution.png. Second, please see Wikipedia:WikiProject_France/Categorization, check the categories and note the abundance of the 'French characters' (non English characters in French alphabet like é). Third, please see Wikipedia:WikiProject_Germany/Conventions, especially the following. "The Wikipedia convention is to use the 30-letter German alphabet in proper names, in line with the broader Wikipedia convention of using local Latin alphabets. It is helpful to explain near the top of an article how to convert a name to the 26-letter alphabet."DenizTC 19:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  MOS 

message: I just ran across Template:PD-TRGov-Military-Air Force which I'm highly suspicious of, as none of the other branches of the military have such templates. Can anyone turn up conclusive or even suggestive evidence that this is real? If so, the template should cite it. Thanx, 68.39.174.238 22:16, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anyone know about this template? 

message: Can Wikipedia:WikiProject Turkey/Templates/Makalp InfoboxCitiesTownsDistricts be deleted? Andy Mabbett | Talk to Andy Mabbett 09:59, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  .../Templates/Makalp InfoboxCitiesTownsDistricts 

message: As I see Jaber Castle is categorised under WikiProject Syria.
However, as defined under the title, Jaber Castle is an independent Turkish territory, as an extension and exclave of the Republic of Turkey. So, as an objective situtation, it should be categorised under WikiProject Turkey...— Preceding unsigned comment added by  88.224.97.207 (talk • contribs) 
:An article might be part of multiple projects, and that is a good thing, since that means more people are interested in improving it. I added Caber Kalesi to our project. DenizTC 01:18, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jaber Castle 

message: merhaba arkadaslar, could you please help me expand the works section of User:Teemeah/Ozan Colakoglu? I spent two days on Google and cannot get further on. Also , if you can find more info about his biography, I'd appreciate it very much. The guy is so gizli it seems to be impossible to get to know more about him, like his birthdate! Tesekkürler --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 16:15, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Help with Ozan Colakoglu! 

message: Please pay attention to the article. See the article's talk page for further information on the matter.--Doktor Gonzo 20:24, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Yasilova incident]] 

message: People, do you think that cheating will solve the problem of portraits of contemporary people? That if you declare an image as public domain saying that it is stated in Turkish on the website, will make an image public domain? ALL the images in Halide Edip Adıvar are tagged with the wrong licence! ALL of them are copyrighted! I checked the websites. The french website doesn't say a word about licencing - thus has to be taken as unfree according to Wikipedia rules. The Üsküdar Amerikan Lisesi library doesn't have any partucular copyright notice - but the front page of the website clearly say: copyrighted. Now let's please just stop uploading unfree images under free licence, no wonder why the Turkish editors have a bad reputation on Wikipedia! Don't give reasons of prejudice to other editors and admins! If you can't find a free image of a certain person, dman it, leave the page wihtout illustration, and that's it. Sooner or later some admin will find out about the fake images. And by the way, Inanna, who uploaded the photos, is banned, so could you please remove the photos from the article? And remove halide edip's photo from the Turkish people article's montage because the licence of the montage is underpublic domain. Please check the origin of ANY photo before you put it into a montage and release under public domain. let's keep the Turkish articles out of copyrigth issues, PLEASE!!!! Lütfen! --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 12:51, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Do you think :Image:Soprano Gencer.jpg has wrong tag as well? If not, we can crop it and add it to the composite. DenizTC 00:27, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Deniz, please think about it. If you look at the uploader's talk page, you can see he/she uploaded the same photo three times, and two had been deleted because he/she didn't specify the source. How can you prove that the phot was really announced into the public domain? It has no source to verify the licence!!! You don't have to think much about it that this picture will soooner or later be deleted by an admin. Just like the previous ones he uploaded. Try selecting pictures with really existing licences. And if we can't find any such photos, then we won't put women in the montage. Simple as that. No matter how we all struggle with this question, the wikipedia rules are clear and sooner or later such pictures will be deleted - and then you worked for nothing. --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 06:41, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

text:  By the way, I have a free licenced photo of Göksel from the commons. --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 06:43, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Applying free licences to unfree images 

message: Could someone help with sourcing? There's an AFD current - Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Burcu Güneş. She looks notable, but the lack of English sources is making the article difficult to verify. Gordonofcartoon 13:55, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Burcu Güneş]]

message: There is a merger proposal, any thoughts? DenizTC 07:16, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Doğan Türkmen]] 

message: As of now, I'm going to repair the article in the following manner:
* Revise the History section to reflect periods, and draws from legitimate sources.
* Revise the Architecture section in sections of the city. How could you not have an article that fails to mention Sultanahmet or Yildiz Palace? I plan on organizing the monuments, churches, mosques, and palaces by area- Sultanahmet, Eminonu, et cetera.
* Revising the rest of the sources that are not properly formatted.
I know it can be done. Is anyone else with me? Monsieurdl 18:57, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: My guess is the tahakale site is a piece of plagiarism from Wikipedia rather than the other way round. Some tell-tale signs in their text showing it isn't original. In any case, thanks for working on the article. Fut.Perf. ☼ 12:41, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no plagiarism. How do I know? Because I wrote it all by myself, word per word, comma per comma, building per building. I also wrote the entire Religion section, and about 80% of the Istanbul article as a whole. If the question is "how do you know all that stuff", the answer is because I studied Architecture at the University of Florence in Italy, where the "History of Architecture" classes are probably the most difficult in the entire world (they literally make you cry for passing the exams and turn you into a "Rain Man" of History), under renowned professors such as Ezio Godoli (who is the author of the famous book "Istanbul 1900: Art Nouveau Architecture & Interiors".) 84.243.253.101 14:08, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Istanbul]] article

message: I've proposed the creation of one here. Your input would be appreciated. Thanks! --Hemlock Martinis 20:59, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ottoman Empire WikiProject 

message: Please see Talk:Georgians#1.5_million_Georgians_in_Turkey.3F the number quoted in the Georgians article for Georgians in Turkey seems suspect. I guess it's possible that there are 1.5 million Georgians in Turkey. Would you know of a better source for the number of Georgians in Turkey? Pocopocopocopoco 17:26, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Georgians in Turkey 

message: The newly created Ülker article has been listed on AfD: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ülker.  --Lambiam 23:45, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Ülker]] on AfD 

message: Next to Turkish people and Demography of Turkey, we also have an article People of Turkey. In the lead paragraph it promises to be about "the Cultural historiography of Turkey", and states that it "covers the changes to Turkish people during the 20th century." If that is the intention, then the title of the article is not aptly chosen. However, as it is the article does nothing of the sort; it is not going anywhere, and is basically useless. It is also not under any active development; discounting duplication of the information at Demography of Turkey and "original research", it always has been in a sorry state.
The article Demography of Turkey also has a problem: the title should be Demographics of Turkey., and I think it should be moved there rather than just redirect there.
I further propose to simply make People of Turkey a redirect to Demographics of Turkey.  --Lambiam 16:24, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So done.  --Lambiam 17:58, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  People of Turkey 

message: As part of the WikiProject Good Articles, we're doing sweeps to go over all of the current GAs and see if they still meet the requirements of the GA criteria. I'm specifically going over all of the "Conflicts, battles and military exercises" articles. I have recently reviewed Hood event and have determined that it is in very good shape but need some assistance to remain a GA. I have put the article on hold for seven days until the issues on the talk page of the article are addressed. I wanted to mention it here so that members of the project, if interested, could assist in improving the article and help it to remain a GA. It currently has a few problems concerning the citation templates & needs only a few more inline citations. Additionally, I will be leaving messages on other WikiProjects and editors affiliated with the page to increase the number of participants assisting in the workload.
If you have any questions about what I've said here, let me know on my talk page and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. I hope members here assist in addressing the issues within the article, and keep up the good work in improving articles on Wikipedia! --Nehrams2020 02:45, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Hood event]] [[WP:GA|GA]] [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles/Project quality task force/Sweeps|sweeps]] review: On Hold

message: Currently 'People from a Turkish city' categories are treated like 'People from a Turkish provice' cats. Should it stay like that? DenizTC 15:34, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Just to make sure, do you mean that, for example, for :Category:People from Trabzon we can't see whether this covers Trabzon Province or just the city of Trabzon? We can see the difference, however, for Hatay, Kocaeli and Sakarya, and ... there are :Category:People from Hatay, :Category:People from Kocaeli and :Category:People from Sakarya, but not :Category:People from Antakya, :Category:People from İzmit or :Category:People from Adapazarı. So apparently this is by province and not by city. An exception is :Category:People from Milas (Milas is in Muğla Province), but that is the only exception I could find, so that seems more like a mistake. Then :Category:People by city in Turkey is a misnomer. So it looks like we should recategorize Albert Jean Amateau from :Category:People from Milas to :Category:People from Muğla, have the then empty :Category:People from Milas deleted, and have :Category:People by city in Turkey renamed to :Category:People by province in Turkey.  --Lambiam 17:53, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

text: I've proposed the category for renaming: Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2007 October 21#Category:People by city in Turkey.  --Lambiam 09:55, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

text: Apparently that proposal is rejected. We'll have to recategorize people from province X but not from city X one by one by hand. I'm not sure what the best way is to approach that. I think that in practice this means the situation will remain as it is, wrong or not.  --Lambiam 19:02, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Categories of cities 

message: I suggest removing "Denial of the Armenian G Point" article from WikiProject Turkey, because it is another Armenian supporters page of Wiki. And I suggest removing all comments which you think against Turkish point of view, making this page the biggest and most powerful Turkish Supporters page of Wiki. --Obsteel 06:26, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not an advocacy site, and WikiProject Turkey is about providing encyclopedic information about Turkey, not for pushing a point of view, removing comments contrary to a point of view, or providing a rallying place for "supporters", all of which is in stark violation of Wikipedia policy. -- Jibal 04:45, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

text: It is just the opposite obsteel, WPTR groups together articles relationg to Turkey and which project members would be interested in developing. It must remain in the project, on the contrary. Baristarim 04:54, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  About "Denial of the Armenian G Point" article 

message: Does anyone know quite what this is? If so, could you please edit the description on Commons accordingly (and possibly add categories)? Thanks in advance. - Jmabel | Talk 00:42, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It is a portable shoeshine kit, as in this picture. The bottles contain various kinds of shoe polish; presumably the compartments at the sides can hold brushes. The client puts his foot (one at a time) on the thing in the middle.  --Lambiam 09:57, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Help describing image 

message: copied here, maybe someone here knows about Bahoz Erdal.
:Any reason, why he is notable? Any reason, why we should use blogs and violate WP:RS? Any reason to have this article not NPOV from the start? Do we know any detail about him, his age, gender (male I guess), which university he finished (medical or PhD doctor)? How will this article be expanded, with his quotes? Will we be just advertising PKK, you know who is not that related to HPG anymore, as PKK is peace loving. We don't have an article on that Syrian AlQaeda guy captured in Turkey, who was top tier. Just let's not abuse blockquotes.  17:10, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  bahoz erdal 

message: Please check Đorđe Martinović. I am not so knowledgeable about Ottoman impalement. We might have a little bit of Anti-Turkism in Serbia. DenizTC 17:56, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ottoman impalement 

message: As part of the WikiProject Good Articles, we're doing sweeps to go over all of the current GAs and see if they still meet the GA criteria. I'm specifically going over all of the "Conflicts, battles and military exercises" articles. I have reviewed Byzantine-Seljuk wars and believe the article currently meets the majority of the criteria and should remain listed as a Good article. In reviewing the article, I have found there are some issues that may need to be addressed, and I'll leave the article on hold for seven days for them to be fixed. Please consider helping address the several points that I listed on the talk page of the article, which shouldn't take too long to fix. If you have any questions, let me know on my talk page and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. --Nehrams2020 07:31, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Byzantine-Seljuk wars GA Sweeps Review: On Hold

message: Special:Contributions/85.100.158.102 has been adding pop folk to Turkish musicians articles, sometimes deleting other relevant wikilinks. Any opinions on this? DenizTC 02:45, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well just let him be - no great harm done for the moment. I took a look as well and reverted some of his edits. Baristarim 04:22, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: ok DenizTC 04:47, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  pop-folk 

message: Hey everyone. I'm trying my best to keep the elements of the old TR infobox- just replacing it with the new one and saying "finished!" just isn't in the best interests of Wikiproject Turkey. We need to collaborate on an adapted version of the new one so we can call it Infobox settlement TR, just like Deniz said in the deletion page. I really like the Turkish flag/red bar (as long as it is the same pixel size as the new infobox) and the pushpin maps. I am hoping there will be a gathering of the minds on this project? Thanks/teşekkürler benim arkadaşlar! Monsieurdl 20:40, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Would be better to discuss on the deletion page or on  the template's talk page.  DenizTC 01:48, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox Settlement TR 

message: I'm planning to add the top importance articles to this list. DenizTC 01:55, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Status Article list 

message: Deniz (and all WPTR members), you can bring out any modifications you wish to the template. The categorizations you mention seem fine with me and I think there is space for two more pictures. For example, one representing the Hittite civilization, such as pictures either of Hattusas or Kadirli lions. The way I see the template, it could be useful for civilizations which were rooted in Anatolia and were more or less confined to it, which excludes successive empires that extended much beyond. Tell me what you think. A must picture to add, in my opinion, would be that of the Mother Goddess statue discovered in 1997 in İncesu Kanyonu, Çorum or Yozgat, in province border almost to the meter. Fazla tahrip etmediysek tabii. Böyle değerleri koruyup Anadolu'yu hak etmek lazım. Selam. Cretanforever 10:36, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: For some more images, see commons:Category:Hittite Empire and its subcategories commons:Category:Hattusa and commons:Category:Hattuşa.  --Lambiam 15:13, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I very much like the pictures, particularly the one on the right. I have always loved the blue tiles from Iznik, and wherever the tiles were made, they are very similar. Monsieurdl 15:51, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That tile is from Kubadabad Palace. When that palace was constructed in the 13th century, Iznik was still Nicaea, the capital of the (Greek) Empire of Nicaea. The production of the blue kind of tiles and pottery Iznik is deservedly famous for started only in the late 15th century. Thus, this beautiful tile was almost certainly made elsewhere.  --Lambiam 20:44, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anatolian Civilizations template 

message: Is it correct that Turks have the privilege to state that ancient Turks are the fathers to most people on world and fathers to most civilizations on earth? This statement can be found in our article Turkish people.  --Lambiam 12:40, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll take a look at it, and try to solve the problems in the article. Please abide by WP:3RR until everything can be sorted out. NOTE to WPTR: We need to get over there quickly and calm things down- it looks like a mess there. Monsieurdl 13:06, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Turkish people 

message: As part of the WikiProject Good Articles, we're doing sweeps to go over all of the current GAs and see if they still meet the GA criteria. I'm specifically going over all of the "Conflicts, battles and military exercises" articles and just reviewed Battles of macrohistorical importance involving invasions of Europe. I believe the article currently meets the majority of the criteria and should remain listed as a Good article. In reviewing the article, I have found there are some issues considering sourcing that should be addressed, and I'll leave the article on hold for seven days for them to be fixed. I am leaving this message at this project page, along with the other relevant task forces/WikiProjects to the article, since the article falls under this topic and figured you might be interested in helping to improve the article further. The article needs some more inline citations, an expanded lead, and uniform inline citation formatting. If added, I'll pass the article. If you have any questions, let me know on my talk page, and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. --Nehrams2020 00:15, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm on the case. From what I see, it is merely a matter of gathering sources together and formatting them properly. Thank you for the hold. Monsieurdl 00:36, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Battles of macrohistorical importance involving invasions of Europe]] GA Sweeps Review: On Hold

message: Byzantine-Ottoman wars—In reviewing the article, I have found there are some issues considering the lead and some sourcing that should be addressed, and I'll leave the article on hold for seven days for them to be fixed. The article needs just a few more inline citations, an expanded lead, and some minor cleanup, and if fixed, I'll pass the article. If you have any questions, let me know on my talk page, and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. --Nehrams2020 02:50, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Byzantine-Ottoman wars]] GA Sweeps Review: On Hold

message: The template  was placing the talk pages of Turkey-related lists in :Category:Turkey-related lists and the talk pages of Turkey-related images in :Category:Images of Turkey.  However, these categories are also used for encyclopedic content.  As it's desirable to keep categories used by WikiProject Turkey separate from encyclopedic categories, I have modified the template to use :Category:List-Class Turkey articles and :Category:Image-Class Turkey articles.  Spacepotato (talk) 03:33, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Change to categories for image talk pages and list talk pages 

message: I copy my request from the Tarkan talk page. I am working on improving the article I want it to be regarded at least a Good Article, but I'm aiming for FA, I managed to get it to FA in the Hungarian wikipedia. I need help with the Awards section to find more awards he won. My message from the taélk page:
:: >> Hello everyone, I'd be grateful if you could help me finding references to more awards... I searched through the web using turkish keywords like Tarkan+ödül or Tarkan+Kral TV+ödül and others, but I couldn't find much. I am pretty sure he had won a LOT of awards in Turkey... I know he won the Kral TV several times, but couldn't find any references, the Kral TV website is simply .... sh*t. Could you help me? Thanks in advance.
+ if you have any references from printed media (newspapers, magazines), it would also be welcome!! Or even video links... whatsoever, just let there be some more!  Thank you!!! --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 09:02, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Tarkan (singer)]] to GA or FA - Please help with references 

message: also, please see the tarkan talk page for the propsed changes in the structure. I want to know your opinion as those would be major changes, total reordering... Thank you! --Teemeah Gül Bahçesi 14:37, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  also changes

message: I've just received a request for expanding this article. I don't know nothing about the subject. Is there someone who knows more about this man? If so, you could improve the article? -- FayssalF - Wiki me up®  16:52, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Hattat Aziz Efendi]] 

message: Can anyone here assist us with the consideration of this philosophy journal now at AfD,  Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Baykus Felsefe? DGG (talk) 08:11, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Baykus Felsefe]]

message: Greetings! As part of the Wine Project's efforts to expand Wikipedia's coverage of the world of wine, I created the Turkish wine article. I would greatly appreciate any help from the Turkey Project in expanding or improving the article. Also any images of Turkish wine would also be gratefully welcomed. Thanks! AgneCheese/Wine 10:34, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Turkish wine]]