Talk:Guilt (emotion)

message: This article fails to discuss objective guilt (guilt in the sense of actual violation of moral law), and only considers the concept as an emotional (or subjective) state.  There is a Guilt (law) section, but it only deals with guilt in the context of criminal law, and societal standards.  Should another article be added, or should this article be expanded to consider guilt feelings as a reflection of the incurring of objective guilt through transgression of moral law?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.233.57.240 (talk) 00:48, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Objective Guilt

message: 'Psychopaths' (and sociopaths) are now called Anti-Social Personality Disorder, so that last section should probably be update to the current term. Also maybe add something about Narcissistic Personality Disorder, who also either don't feel guilt, or experience it as shame.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.100.206.240 (talk) 04:54, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: people unable to feel guilt...

message: This needs two articles. It appears there are at least a couple of very different kinds of guilt, psychological and legal. Are there any others? 2 August 2005 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mneumisi (talk • contribs) 
:I concur. The section on legal guilt should be divorced from the psycology. The second paragraph in the "legal" section should also be eliminated or moved. 19 June 2006—Preceding unsigned comment added by Mneumisi (talk • contribs) 
::Beautiful Mneumisi is responding to his own message, intentional or unintentional? Travb (talk) 10:12, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well if you can't agree with yourself, you probably shouldn't make comments. I would have to say "unintentional," since they were a year apart and unsigned at that. I wonder if I am conducting conversations with myself on any other talk pages? Still, Once again I have to agree with myself. Manney 13:59, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I disagree. Rather, a better discussion of the scope of 'types of guilt' should replace this section. Many educational institutions discuss guilt as "collective" (sometimes called shared), "private," and "public." This is merely an observation from the discourse I've had on the topic relating to literature and film examples. Lepercon (talk) 05:39, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

text: I agree that this article could be split into more sections than just "guilt" as a general topic.  Subsections would be a terrific idea for this topic.  I think another guilt type could be "moral guilt."  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.169.160.114 (talk) 02:05, 31 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: This needs two articles

message: Has anyone else noticed that people writing the emotions articles seem to exhibit the emotions they are writing about? For example, check out the ranting in the discussion group for hate, as opposed to say the joy people or the guilt people. 26 August 2005; —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.17.226 (talk • contribs) 
:Hey, editors are human too! Jacobisq (talk) 10:43, 5 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Who writes the emotions articles? 

message: I added  the weasel words template.  "Some people..." etc. is not up to encyclopedic standards.  Whenever I see "some people" the obvious question is who? 
The more I read this article the less I like it.  It needs a lot of work, but I am not interested enough in the subject to spend my time doing it.  
I also added the  tag.
ALSO: PLEASE SIGN YOUR POSTS using ~~~~ Travb (talk) 10:07, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Added weasel words template

message: Guilt trip is the act of making someone feel guily, not guilt itself; so I don't think the entry's should have been merged.
--Spooony 20:49, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Guilt Trip 

message: I punched up a major revision of that section. I also considered a wholsale deleting of "causes of guilt" section since it is all weasel words without citation, but it is a start. Perhaps later. I used legal sources, for which there are very few, to define a concept which is taken for granted by just about everyone. I wanted to avoid philosophy, but I wanted more than a circular argument which required mentioning the idea of free will. 
Manney 15:06, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: criminal law guilt

message: Guilty by association currently redirects here, but I think it could as well redirect to collective guilt. Maybe it needs a disambiguation page with links to both these articles.80.235.69.196 11:48, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, this was meant for another discussion page (Association fallacy).80.235.69.196 11:50, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Why does it redirect here? "Guilt by association" is a logical fallacy, and belongs within that catagory. 68.209.235.149 15:39, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: May-be ''Guilty by association'' should be a disambiguation page

message: There doesn't seem to a distinction between guilt and shame.  If you read and compare the wikipedia articles on "guilt society" and "shame society" you will notice that there is a clear distinction drawn.  It is almost revealed here on the "guilt" page:
"The philosopher Martin Buber underlined the difference between the Freudian notion of guilt, based on internal conflicts, and existential guilt, based on actual harm done to others."
This concept of "existential guilt" is shame, and the notion of guilt, based on internal conflict and the premonition of doing something sinful are quite different.  In a shame culture, you judge your actions in the eyes of others.  In a guilt culture, you judge your desires through the lens of social morality.  Guilt has more to do with this internal conflict and psychological morality.
(A Thought Surgeon Named Crisis (talk) 16:29, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Distinction Between Guilt and Shame

message: From http://www.rickross.com/reference/brainwashing/brainwashing11.html
Guilt-tripping – One thing that aggressive personalities know well is that other types of persons have very different consciences than they do. Manipulators are often skilled at using what they know to be the greater conscientiousness of their victims as a means of keeping them in a self-doubting, anxious, and submissive position. The more conscientious the potential victim, the more effective guilt is as a weapon. Aggressive personalities of all types use guilt-tripping so frequently and effectively as a manipulative tactic, that I believe it illustrates how fundamentally different in character they are compared to other (especially neurotic) personalities. All a manipulator has to do is suggest to the conscientious person that they don't care enough, are too selfish, etc., and that person immediately starts to feel bad. On the contrary, a conscientious person might try until they're blue in the face to get a manipulator (or any other aggressive personality) to feel badly about a hurtful behavior, acknowledge responsibility, or admit wrongdoing, to absolutely no avail.
- Nearfar (talk) 21:31, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Add the phrase 'guilt-tripping'? 

message: I Removed the split section tags, added in 13:36, 13 July 2007 
 over a year and a half ago. travb (talk) 14:58, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Removed split section tags, added in July 2007

message: I think this would be an interesting secton to add. There must be some interesting studies of "guilt", or shame, in apes, and there's at least one showing that the "guilty look" a dog gives you is just a response to human cues (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T2J-4WGM4JN-D&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=f291ef36ea7128512261ffde08ed8ac8)GM Pink Elephant (talk) 21:42, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Non-Human Guilt?

message: Never heard of either. Is this a joke? The terms certainly don't rise to subject heading on this page. 
MarkinBoston (talk) 02:24, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed overguilt and underguilt section 

message: Rich Farmbrough, 03:14, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: In Our Time

message: The lede starts off like it's going to talk about the legal concept, as in Guilt (law). But the rest of the article describes the psychological, i.e., emotional aspect.
I think this article needs more distinction between guilt as a legal concept and the emotional feeling. --Uncle Ed (talk) 20:51, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Legality vs. emotion

message: If guilt is not observable in a state of affairs, then it arises by ascription or utterance. Simply ascribing (i.e. writing to) guilt to B doesn't establish the state of affairs where B is guilty and therefore doesn't establish the truth of the sentence 'B is guilty' just as simply saying "The cat is sitting on the mat" doesn't establish the state of affairs where the cat is sitting on the mat and therefore doesn't establish the truth of the sentence 'The cat is sitting on the mat'.
The process is one of magical incantation i.e. saying it's so makes it so. Ash138.217.214.135 (talk) 12:19, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Status of guilt. 

message: "The end is nigh" was used to communicate the idea that as a society we had transgressed and that we would receive a collective punishment.   There were those recently who claimed that the New Orleans disaster was a divine punishment for sodomy in that city.   I presume there is a name for this syndrome of anticipated punishment for a perceived collective guilt.   It would be useful if this aspect of Guilt were added to this article.FreeFlow99 (talk) 13:48, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Guilt and anticipated punishment of a society 

message: It says tribe, but shouldn't it be changed to social circle / family? Or group? Tribe sounds off to me i dont know.
2001:44B8:4137:6200:A5F5:7487:198D:674C (talk) 06:10, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tribe? 

message: Hello,
the search term "Guilty Conscience" redirects to this page. It also is a song by Eminem and Dr. Dre, but is neither mention in the disambugations for "Guilt" or "Guilty". Since the song as an rather comprehensive article I'd like to add it into the "For other uses, see ..." section but I don't know how. Would be great if someone could do that.
SkySilver (talk) 02:48, 24 February 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Other uses: Song by Eminem 

message: A discussion is taking place to address the redirect :Lack of guilt in psychopaths. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 November 26#Lack of guilt in psychopaths until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.  Marcocapelle (talk) 12:59, 26 November 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Lack of guilt in psychopaths" listed at [[Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion|Redirects for discussion]] 

message: The Online Etymology Dictionary says that the derivation of gylt from gieldan is suspect. 2605:A601:A73A:7900:300D:B32E:F400:FC63 (talk) 01:39, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  etymology