Talk:Mobile, Alabama/Archive 2

message: List of people from Mobile, Alabama is an orphaned article, perhaps created as a split due to the 'Notable Mobilians' thread at the top of this page, since there is no Notable list in the article at all right now.  The separate list is short and not even linked to by this page, so probably should be merged (back?) into this article, though perhaps as prose and not a list. AUTiger » talk 19:02, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I would ask that for the moment we let it stand as is. We can link out to it so it won't be orphaned. The problem with those kind of lists is that they quickly get out of hand and are very difficult to manage. Others may have a different opinion. --JodyB yak, yak, yak 02:13, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps a category would be a better solution?  I would also agree that the list should remain seperate from the article (if it must exist at all).  /Blaxthos 04:37, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I went ahead and merged Mobile, Alabama#Notable residents into the List of people from Mobile, Alabama, expanding into several more sections.  Left only the historical and modern people I felt would be more well-known to the general public under the Mobile, Alabama#Notable residents in order for the Mobile, Alabama article to flow more smoothly.Altairisfar 06:32, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Merge List of people from Mobile, Alabama

message: Replaced the old photo of the Mobile skyline with a 2007 view taken from the USS Alabama in Battleship Park.  The old photo was a digitally altered photo that was taken before the Battle House Tower was completed, the top of that building had been added to that older photo.  But we still need a higher resolution photo taken on a clear day, I'm going to attempt to take one soon, the current one was the best that I already had.  Altairisfar 00:09, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Skyline 

message: I have quick-failed this article based primarily on its complete failure to address important aspects of the city's history, thus meeting the "obviously non-neutral treatment" clause of the GA quick-fail criteria. A history of Mobile which fails to adequately address segregation and the civil rights movement within the city is a broken one. Other majors issues include, but are not limited to: the placement of Arts and entertainment as the first section following the intro. At the very least, History and Geography should come before any culture section (see FA-class examples such as New York City). The external links section needs pruning desperately. The bulleted list of Surrounding cities and suburbs should be either removed or made into prose and merged with Geography. I also see no reason for having an Awards section; keeping a separate section for two entries feels like undue weight on this aspect. Overall, the article makes too often a use of a bulleted list rather than a complete prose section with proper context; the Media section is an especially egregious example of this. In terms of accuracy and inline citations, the article is good in parts but spotty or worse in others. Remember that it's not just about having a certain amount of references, it's about how and where those references are cited. There are many sections where exact statistical counts and dollar amounts are presented, these should have a direct, inline citation to them. The Education section is entirely lacking in inline refs. The bare minimum of inline citation is one at the end of each paragraph and for quotations. Several sections, such as History, have large paragraphs without a single ref. VanTucky Talk 21:55, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have addressed the bullet lists and the article arrangement.  I strongly disagree with your quick-failed assessment based primarily on "its complete failure to address important aspects of the city's history, thus meeting the "obviously non-neutral treatment" clause of the GA quick-fail criteria.  A history of Mobile which fails to adequately address segregation and the civil rights movement within the city is a broken one."  It does need to be addressed, but does not constitute a violation of WP:NPOV.  The history section is a broad overview of three centuries of Mobile's history, it does not deal with Mobile's social history on any account.  I agree that segregation and the civil rights movement (as well as racism) deserves to be addressed, especially in the History of Mobile, Alabama article or even in an expanded article of its own.  Altairisfar 01:30, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

text: I am asking for a more thorough Good article reassessment of the article.  Altairisfar 01:54, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll say two things:  One, I was just considering nominating the article for a GA review when I saw that you already had done so.  I think the article is much better than B-class.  However, I would recommend re-entertaining the points VanTucky brought up and addressing them by expanding appropriate sections within the article.  There is much significance in the information he says is missing, and perhaps not dealing with social history is truely a problem.  Let's address the issues instead of rushing back in asking the other parent.  /Blaxthos 02:18, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There are two aspects to ensuring a NPOV: fair treatment, and making sure to give space for all significant points of view. Painting a happy little picture of Mobile by failing to mention the powerful affect racism has had on shaping the social, economic and educational facets of a major Alabama city is failing to address all significant points of view, and thus, violating NPOV. VanTucky Talk 02:54, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

text: As I said, it does need to be addressed, but I do not believe it constitutes a quick fail.  Maybe it does, but another opinion will not hurt the article.  The history section deals primarily with war and how the wars shaped Mobile, it can certainly be expanded further in other directions but it doesn't paint "a happy little picture of Mobile".  Altairisfar 03:24, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not even elementary school textbooks make the mistake of only treating history in the context of wars, and neither should this article. As to the appropriateness of a quick-fail, I think you can see that so far the decision is unanimous in favor of endorsement. VanTucky Talk 18:20, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No need to be condescending.  Altairisfar 00:17, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: First "good article" nomination

message: I believe that the article did not reasonably meet the criteria for a quick-fail. If it doesn't meet the good article criteria then I would like a more in-depth assessment.  Altairisfar 02:08, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: This looks like MUCH too many fixes for a hold or even for some quick fixes to be made here in a short time.  I would recommend making these fixes, and trying again for a new nomination. --Jayron32|talk|contribs 06:24, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Crossposted from [[Wikipedia:Good article reassessment]]

message: Completely merged the somewhat extraneous and very frequently vandalized "Notable residents" section completely into the List of people from Mobile, Alabama.  List of people from Mobile, Alabama is in the "Further reading" section.  Thinned down the "External links" section a little more.  Changed subheading "Popular culture" to "Trivia".  Removed the external link in to the Wave Tansit System in "Transportation".
We still need ongoing work on the following:
*References over entire article (see numerous examples above).  
*Inclusion of segregation and the Civil Rights Movement into "History" and into the History of Mobile, Alabama article.  Which, itself, is largely unreferenced and has many inaccuracies too by the way.
*Work on the lead per WP:LEAD.
*I agree that the bulleted list of Surrounding cities and suburbs should be either removed or made into prose and merged with Geography.  Ideas anyone?
*Improvements in the flow of the article and writing style.
*Any other suggestions for improvement?
Altairisfar 21:41, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Quick note: Changing the title of the section "In Popular Culture" to "Trivia" is a BAD IDEA.  In popular culture is a narrowly defined subsection, and easy to maintain.  Trivia is an invitation to add crap to the article.  I would change it back.  The section was fine as it was.  See WP:TRIVIA for more details.  --Jayron32|talk|contribs 02:42, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Ongoing post good article nomination improvements and edits

message: Annexation of West Mobile  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.27.147.94 (talk) 02:06, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We also need to find an updated picture of Mobile County showing the new city limits.--Donovan Ravenhull 13:08, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I left a message on the talk page of Arkyan, the original creator of the current image.  Judging from the info he already has posted there his images utilize geographic boundary files provided by the US Census Bureau, and therefore cannot be simply updated in that way until the next census.  He recommends manually editing the map to reflect updated boundaries with a utility for editing the Scalable Vector Graphics files.  He recommends Inkscape.  I have downloaded it, but it may take quite a while before I can use it. On another note, the local news media have been reporting that the Mobile Regional Airport will probably ask the city to annex it soon also and this will not require a vote, so Mobile's city limits may expand again soon.  Altairisfar 20:17, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Annexation 

message: I've done much work on the history section in an effort to make it fair and balanced, it still needs some work but I think that the basic structure is there now.  Now need some other people to review it and leave some of their assessments of where the article is still weak.  Thanks.  Altairisfar 18:54, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Completed more major work in the history section, requesting some constructive criticism.  Altairisfar (talk) 00:31, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Update on the updates 

message: I've just completed more major work on the intro for the article and did some minor edits to the body to reduce the size per WP:SIZE  I did an estimate of the readable prose and came up with 47 kilobytes as per Wikipedia:Article_size#References.  The total size of the page is still 92 kilobytes.  Most other cities seem to range from 80 to 110 in total size.  Still waiting for someone to give the article a peer review/assessment.  Altairisfar (talk) 06:22, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The use of Template:Infobox Weather and a few other fixes have brought total size down to 84 kilobytes.  Altairisfar (talk) 23:58, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro and readable prose 

message: I'm nominating the article for GA assessment again, I believe that all of the old issues have been taken care of.  Didn't get much feedback from the peer review or my assessment request from my fellow members of WP:ALA, but hopefully I haven't been too blinded by the work I've done on the article.  Altairisfar 07:51, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The article is currently under GA review by User:Rudget.  Altairisfar 16:55, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I will be reviewing this article tomorrow. Brace yourselves. No, I'm only joking. :) — Rudget contributions 18:54, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Update: Nominated for [[WP:GA]] again 

message: 02-Dec-2007 - Mobile's social problems: I find it highly amusing about the emphasis on Mobile's "segregation" as a major issue.  You see, Mobile has had extreme social elitism since the first French settlers stopped, on the way, at Panzacola (Florida) and fought the Spanish settlers (but left), then founded Mobile and fought (over titles & position) circa 1702, leading to today's exclusive parties of the debutante season, including the Mardi Gras mystic societies, as obvious examples of the social elitism.  Now, to really complicate the issues, note that secret societies are, well, secret, so it will be difficult to get so-called "NPOV" sources to verify Mobile's highly elitist society.  I'm not saying that segregation was not an issue, but perhaps, the section should be called "News Trendy Views of Mobile" rather than an attempt at some actual objective view of Mobile's 305-year history.
I'm not laughing at anyone in particular, just at the notion that "segregation" is at the core Mobile's social problems. Hence: Give me a break! OMG, There's dumb & dumber, and then there's Mobile's "segregation" problem (invented in Mobile, you see): it's not like anyone in France ever said, "The people have no bread? Let them eat cake," about non-black people. LOL!! LOL!! Bump it down the road...to SELMA!!!!  Hehehe. Ever heard of Prichard? Oh, too funny! Put that one with the news reports that Hurricane Katrina went into the French Quarter and parked (without affecting anywhere else)! Those 23 fishing boats grounded in downtown Alabama towns must have been an illusion (no, Katrina was pushing them to the French Quarter, but missed and pushed their seawater 12 miles inland through Mississippi). LOL!!!!! Sorry, I just couldn't stop laughing. Oh, too funny. Anyway, there might be some way to hint at Mobile's historical social elitism to downplay the "Mobile-invented-segregation" viewpoints. Too, too funny. -Wikid77 17:14, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sarcasm is neither helpful nor welcome.  Regarding your views, please see the original research guideline and the neutral point of view policy.  Also, keep in mind that this is not a forum for general discussion of the subject matter.  Thanks.  /Blaxthos ( t / c ) 17:32, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  To USER:Blaxthos: Please read the above paragraphs again, focusing on the discussions about the word "segregation" further above, and also, please note that this is not a forum to link "WP" links, but rather focus on the issues discussed for improving the article.  Also, sarcastic multiple links to "WP" pages is neither helpful nor welcome, or did you not realize how your attitude affects your posting? If you must be sarcastic, please focus on issues and not attempt sarcastic insults to someone who has worked on over 10,000 Wikipedia articles. Thank you, in advance, for attempting a better attitude, WP:CIVIL. -Wikid77 17:56, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

text: An overwhelming consensus was reached during the last GA review (see above) as to inclusion of segregation in this article.  All of the material in the article is referenced from reliable sources, and verifiable.  Nowhere does it state that segregation was or is at the core Mobile's social problems, though one could infer that.  The inclusion of this material is vital to making the article fair and balanced as roughly 50% of Mobile's population is African American.  Altairisfar 23:51, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mobile's social problems 

message: 02-Dec-2007: After having read multiple sources about Mobile's Mardi Gras festival, I noticed peculiar terms in the article "Mobile, Alabama" refering to Carnival as the "religious" term, whereas Mobile treats Carnival/Carnivale and Mardi Gras as a city festival they alter as they wish.  It began as French Catholic circa 1703, was segregated by British rule from 1763-1780, and was forced to Spanish Catholic from 1780~1812; however, Mobile added parades on New Year's Eve in the 1830s, and today, the final Monday & Tuesday have been declared school holidays, regardless of political affiliation, and the joint "International Carnival Ball" has been held each November in Mobile for 15 years, since 1993 [see: MardiGrasDigest about 1993]. Perhaps one source tries to force a view that "Mardi Gras" is the final Tuesday, but multiple other sources refer to that Tuesday as "Mardi Gras day" because "Mardi Gras" is a term for the whole festival season in Mobile.  Saying a phrase like "the parade was held on Mardi Gras" is like saying "the parade was held on summer" (that's not sarcasm, it's an analogy).
Overall, I recommend consulting multiple sources, especially those posted or published around Mobile, because a particular author's book or website might try to slant terminology contrary to what many other groups in Mobile actually use.  I am concerned the article is becoming a "text book" view of Mobile, and ignoring many other available sources around Mobile, within a broader view of the subject. -Wikid77 20:46, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The article cites the Mobile Bay Convention & Visitors Bureau website, the Mobile Carnival Museum website, a national newspaper article, a Mobile Press-Register article, and the Mobile Area Mardi Gras Association website.  Where are these other published sources of which you speak?  You do not include them in the article Mardi Gras in Mobile, to which only today you cut/pasted the entire Carnival and Mardi Gras section of this article, of which I wrote every word using the above mentioned sources.  You mention MardiGrasDigest as a source, but it's disclaimer statement reads "Mardi Gras Digest & "Carnival Lasts All Year!.....Now!  So Does Your News",  & " The News & Business Journal of the Carnival Industry", are registered Trademarks of Clark Companies of N.C., Inc. Many pages in the Mardi Gras Digest.com Web site feature links to other sites, of which are operated by companies unrelated to us. Mardi Gras Digest  has no control over the content or availability of any linked site."  Is that a reliable source?  On another note that really doesn't belong on this talk page, I find it questionable, considering our past interactions on other articles (Talk:Mardi Gras in Mobile) that this bone of contention suddenly arises as this article is up for GA review.  Altairisfar 21:23, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: To User:Altairisfar: Your reactions here are all over the board.  I changed just 2 sentences, which you have reverted twice, without prior discussion.  I did not say the remaining text was incorrect, so why shouldn't I copy some of that into the main article?  I checked the sources, to verify accuracy, and adjusted several phrases into the other article, but overall it was okay.  Saying the Mardi Gras text in the article "Mobile, Alabama" doesn't belong as a subject on this talk page is really reaching.  Then, mentioning "this bone of contention suddenly arises as this article is up for GA review" sounds like you are trying to suppress opinions about the article under review.  Please stop, stand back and be objective.  There is some kind of psychological situation arising here, and the reactions are way off center. I am not the enemy here.  I am trying to correct peculiar, incorrect wording in that article: everyone knows Mobile Mardi Gras starts before New Year's, with society balls, so why keep deleting that?  -Wikid77 01:43, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Attempted objectivity in Mardi Gras text 

message: 03-Dec-2007: The article "Mobile, Alabama" has been greatly expanded in the past few months, and I believe it now contains a very impressive range of information.  It could be very close to achieving "Good-Article" (WP:GA) status.  Regardless of that situation, I say congratulations (already) to all who have contributed to greatly expanding the article's content.
Now, for the future, we should focus on more civility in dealing with other editors' additions to the article.  Let other people make contributions, without a cut-throat pursuit of reaching the WP:GA goal.  Who cares? The article is good enough for qualifying as "good" material.
There are more troublesome issues, which I would address:
* bizarre huge climate table: someone changed the narrow climate table into an over-wide insert that calls Template:Convert 60 times to convert rainfall inches to mm, or degrees F to C, even though the calculations were already done, hardcoded as short numbers in the prior narrow table.  Anyway, the table is now 7kb (about 8% of the entire article) just to show temperatures/rain.  There are weather-templates already existing which format that data in about 1kb of article text, potentially reducing article size by about 6kb, quite quickly, without having to proofread large sections of text.  Also, in the future, the article might be a candidate for an even better, smaller weather-template table.
* balancing history coverage: Ideally, the history could be summarized into planned sections representing major events, say for each 50-year period.  Even though hitting some highlights will likely satisfy WP:GA, I think a representive sampling of each 50-year period (or so), outlining urban renewal, would make the article better than WP:GA.
* wider range of photos:  The clean skyline photos are very good; however, just "off-screen" to the left of the skyline is another important picture for Mobile, the extensive shipyard operation along Mobile Bay; similarly, other photos could be added from various sources to help diversify the visual range, including perhaps photos of Mobile's older abandoned areas. Security risks could be more blurred.  Extra photos are not mandatory for WP:GA but could surpass that level.
* roll-out detailed sections:  I believe more could be done to shift details out to other "main" articles, so that the core of the article "Mobile, Alabama" could be made even smaller, focusing on a "Mobile-in-a-nutshell" type of article.
* reconsider medium-importance city:  Maybe along some scales, Mobile would be considered medium-importance, but that doesn't seem to make sense, when all factors are considered.  I think Mobile should be reconsidered: the first full-fledged capital of French Louisiana (over 17 years), oldest city in the area, very probable inspiration for founding New Orleans, a major seaport, massive trading center, an antebellum city that wasn't burned to the ground, large population center, highest rainfall for growing crops (outside Tacoma), vital I-10 link as a bridge/tunnel into Florida, testament to social elitism, etc.
Mobile is not an isolated, fringe city, and I think the article could be better balanced in view of that position. However, again, I must commend all those who have expanded this article in the past few months: great job, in a very short time. -Wikid77 01:43, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Beyond good enough article 

message: I doubt that this would be good to put in the article, but I just had to share it with my fellow editors around Mobile.  The following link is to a page at the nat'l weather service branch in Mobile, AL, and it includes a picture of a cloud formation that appeared over Mobile, AL back in 2003.  If nothing else, you just _have_ to see this.  Also, someone might want to check to see if nat'l weather service photos are public domain--if so, it would make a great pic for the page.
www.srh.noaa.gov/mob/121103hole_punch/holepunch-main.html  — Eric Herboso 10:25, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I from Daphne here. It's a remarkable photo, NWS pics, like all federal government employee works, are public domain. However I am not sure it would really fit in the Mobile article. A little extra research and a stand alone article could be useful. - JodyB talk 13:14, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Weird Clouds 

message: Here is the revision of the page I assessed, but I have since made subsequent edits. Below is my assessment.
:GA review (see here for criteria)
#It is reasonably well written.
#:a (prose):  b (MoS): 
#It is factually accurate and verifiable.
#:a (references):  b (citations to reliable sources):  c (OR): 
#It is broad in its coverage.
#:a (major aspects):  b (focused): 
#It follows the neutral point of view policy.
#:a (fair representation):  b (all significant views): 
#It is stable.
#: (no edit wars etc.)
#It contains images, where possible, to illustrate the topic.
#:a (tagged and captioned):  b lack of images (does not in itself exclude GA):  c (non-free images have fair use rationales): 
#Overall: 
#:a Pass/Fail: 
Further analysis of my findings:
*All images were correctly tagged, captioned and appropriate to the article in question.  
*Grammar, spelling and prose was excellent.
*Everything is readable, and doesn't incorporate words that a "beginner" wouldn't understand.
*It is very good for the single-handed work of Altairisfar, and avoids POV-style content, something important for an GA nominee.
*It is factually accurate and is backed up comprehensively with verifiable and independent, reliable sources.
*The article is focused and addresses a broad range of information without going into unnecessary detail. 
===Other Comments===
I am willing to  pass this article based in it's reivision cited, and the subsequent edits I have made. It's a very well written article. Next step FA. Regards, — Rudget contributions 17:38, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Good Article Assessment

message: I am willing to  pass this article based in it's reivision cited, and the subsequent edits I have made. It's a very well written article. Next step FA. Regards, — Rudget contributions 17:38, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Other Comments

message: the references were soooo long I switched to a 2 column list. Fell free to change it if you like. - JodyB talk 20:36, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: column reflist

message: A few recent changes, partially in an effort to reduce page size:
*Added Healthcare section, after coverting this recent addition into prose and adding sources:
:There are 5 hospitals in Mobile, Alabama.
http://www.hospitalsreport.com/Alabama/hospitals/Infirmary_West.asp
http://www.hospitalsreport.com/Alabama/hospitals/Mobile_Infirmary.asp
http://www.hospitalsreport.com/Alabama/hospitals/Providence_Hospital.asp
http://www.hospitalsreport.com/Alabama/hospitals/Springhill_Medical_Center.asp
http://www.hospitalsreport.com/Alabama/hospitals/Univ_Of_South_Alabama_Medical_Center.asp
:There are 15 nursing homes in Mobile, Alabama.
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Allen_Memorial_Home.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Cogburn_Health_And_Rehabilitation_West_Inc.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Cogburn_Health_Center_Inc.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Cogburn_Nursing_Center_Midtown.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Crowne_Health_Care_Of_Mobile.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Gordon_Oaks_Convalescent_Center.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Gordon_Oaks_Convalescent_Center.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Little_Sisters_Of_The_Poor.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Lynwood_Nursing_Home.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Mercy_Medical_Snf_Mobile.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Mobile_Nursing_And_Rehabilitation_Center.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Sea_Breeze_Health_Care_Center.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Springhill_Manor_Nursing_Home.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Springhill_Senior_Residence.asp
http://www.nursinghomespro.com/Alabama/nursing_homes/Twin_Oaks_Nursing_Home_Llc.asp
*removed the table "10 largest manufacturers in Mobile", of which I was the author, as it really didn't contribute very much to understanding the economy of Mobile.
*removed some Carnival and Mardi Gras info that is covered more extensively in the subarticles Mardi Gras in Mobile and Mystic society.
Altairisfartalk 19:08, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Additionally, I finally got around to creating the articles for Mobile's nine historic districts.  Altairisfartalk 04:31, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Unlinked material above as possible spam links, a link to this site was added again today in the External links section.  Altairisfartalk 16:53, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent edits 

message: I just wanted to advise the editors who are most active here that according to current Wikipedia practice, we don't do separate lists of radio stations for each individual media market — however, we do permit larger overview articles that list all media, including radio, television and print, by individual city. Accordingly, I've moved List of radio stations in Mobile to Media in Mobile, Alabama — however, as I'm not personally familiar with the market, the television and print sections on that article are currently just straight copy-and-paste from the short blurbs on television and print media in Mobile that were already present in this article. So I'd invite somebody more familiar with the Mobile media market to expand Media in Mobile, Alabama to provide more information on the television and print markets. Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 22:37, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Media

message: In the last revision I edited, I found duplicate named references, i.e. references sharing the same name, but not having the same content. Please check them, as I am not able to fix them automatically :) 
* "MoMfort" :
** "Other Locations: Historic Fort Conde" (history), Museum of Mobile, Mobile, Alabama, 2006, webpage:MoM-Other
**  "Other Locations: Historic Fort Conde" (history), Museum of Mobile, Mobile, Alabama, 2006, webpage:MoM-Other.
* "antebellum1" :
** Thomason, Michael. Mobile : the new history of Alabama's first city, page 65. Tuscaloosa: University of Alabama Press, 2001. ISBN 0817310657
** Thomason, Michael. Mobile : the new history of Alabama's first city, page 69-71. Tuscaloosa: University of Alabama Press, 2001. ISBN 0817310657
* "conde1" :
** 
** 
DumZiBoT (talk) 04:29, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bot report : Found duplicate references ! 

message: Because there are some active editors in here, I figured I'd just put this info out on the talk page and let you guys decide whether its worthy of putting in the article.  Mobile homes were invented in Prichard, Alabama and were named after the good city of Mobile -- not, as is usually assumed, because they are mobile.  The reference info for this is here:  .  I hope this is helpful!  — Eric Herboso 15:09, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: This just seemed incorrect and I had never heard of it. If you check the "reference" page to the article, it states that it is not true and is just an exercise in creative writing.  Here's the "reference" page: www.snopes.com/lost/false.asp.  Cheers.  Altairisfartalk 15:31, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  mobile homes 

message: I was astounded to find that Wikipedia did not have an article on the Azalea Trail Maids.  I've created a rough start, mostly based on the things I remember from my highschool days.  I'm sending up a flare to ask for assistance in improving the article (both content and sourcing) -- even if you don't want to actually write the article, please send me some source citations and I'll hunt the source down and incorporate it into the article.  Thanks!  //Blaxthos ( t / c ) 19:09, 21 March 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Hey, thanks for starting one.  I'll incorporate a link within the Mobile article and add it to Mobile template.  I'll see if I can up with some additional sources for the Azalea Trail Maids. I know there has to at least be some additional news coverage from the time of the presidential inauguration, with the all of the controversy within the state that it stirred up.  Altairisfar 23:40, 21 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Azalea Trail Maids

message: Protecting a page for almost half a month because one user keeps editing a page is ridiculous. The topic is under discussion, and anyone who is not mature enough to wait for the discussion to end before changing the relevant section should be blocked from editing. Please unblock this page.--Svgalbertian (talk) 15:23, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Protection

message: Under the Sister cities section, a user at 24.23.198.90 is changing the flag icon for the West Bank Israeli settlement of Ariel from the Israeli flag to the Palestinian flag:
: Ariel, West Bank (Israeli settlement)
to:
: Ariel, West Bank (Israeli settlement)
My reasoning for why the Israeli flag is used here is that the settlement is populated by Israelis and is governed by Israel. The anon user's position seems to be that since it is in the Palestinian territories the Palestinian National Authority flag should be used.  Comments?  Altairisfar 14:15, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I believe this work by the scholarly journal xkcd expresses this dispute in a succinct manner. - Dravecky (talk) 23:14, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: @24.23.198.90 - Could it be that Israel's cartographic aggression has succeeded, and you simply don't want to admit that for POV reasons? NickCT (talk) 19:47, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  It probably has... in Mobile, Alabama. However it's a much bigger world, and international borders are not defined by the sister cities committee in Mobile, and as a source on such matters a press release by the city of Mobile carries zero weight compared to nation states and international bodies. When it comes to recognition by nations, it hasn't, as not one nation on earth (aside from the protagonist) accepts it. 24.23.198.90 (talk) 04:14, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Besides you are missing my point, this hot button issue should be avoided for the Mobile article (minimum no flag), as it is a great, and very well maintained article. It's not like the status of Ariel is going to be resolved on Talk:Mobile. 24.23.198.90 (talk) 04:20, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

text: What every country on earth bar one recognise does not qualify as "lingering claims", but the overwhelming global consensus on what is, and is not Israel. 24.23.198.90 (talk) 21:42, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually I meant 'lingering' as persistent not settled or meaningless.  My point is a concrete one.  Israel controls those territories politically, territorially, culturally, and militarily.  They lack some international recognition.  I don't like or prefer that situation, but it seems pretty clear that Mobile Alabama thinks their pact is with an Israeli city, that de facto it is an Israeli city, and that the territorial dispute should not be reflected in Wikipecia's flag graphic until the situation on the ground actually changes. Ocaasi 07:06, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Sister cities/Palestinian flag for Israeli settlement

message: Does anyone else think this article is up to GA status?--Bigpoliticsfan (talk) 23:52, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Looking for someone to nominate this article for GA status 

message: Your current set up of delegitimizing the city of Ariel, Israel is imbalanced, angering and incorrect. Please do not remove the flag of Israel accompanying it.124.180.140.187 (talk) 13:02, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: No one cares about your anger.  Myself, I was in favor of the Israeli flag, but the consensus ruled.  The discussion above was quite extensive and conclusive: Sister cities/Palestinian flag for Israeli settlement.  Altairisfar (talk) 00:25, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Israel flag for Ariel 

message: The discussion is heating up again on the Mobile, Alabama article as to whether the sister city list should include an Israeli or Palestinian flag for an Israeli sister city that is a settlement in the occupied West Bank, see previous discussion at Talk:Mobile, Alabama#Israel flag for Ariel.  The last discussion in 2010 led me to remove the flag entirely, now an anon user is constantly adding back the Israeli flag and saying that they are angry about any insistence that no flag be present.  Altairisfar (talk) 00:40, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  Consensus seems to be overwhelmingly for the removal of all flags in the aforementioned section, which I will now do with a hidden reference to this discussion. Altairisfar (talk) 05:06, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  RfC: Flag icon for Ariel, an Israel in the occupied West Bank 

message: Ariel is a settlement in the West Bank, a place nearly the entire world agrees is not in Israel. It is a straightforward NPOV violation to call Ariel a city in Israel, beyond that it is just factually wrong. Not even the Israeli government claims the West Bank is in Israel. There are a hundred sources that say Ariel is not in Israel, among them The Christian Science Monitor, Haaretz, NY Times, and The Guardian. Ariel is not in Israel, despite what the website for the city of Mobile, AL says. nableezy - 18:57, 28 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree this isnt the place to argue it, that should take place at Talk:Ariel (city), and Id rather not have that fight drive people away from editing an article on a city in Alabama. All that said though, this article shouldnt contain a provably erroneous fact in it. nableezy - 16:04, 29 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ariel in Israel 

message: I have an edit request to add references to the one line in dispute (the Ariel settlement) in this article.  First, the Mobile's Sister Cities citation should be removed, as it is already present at the top of section.  It could be made into a repeating reference for each city listed if need be, but I had just put it at the top intro since that seemed the most logical.  These articles discuss that Ariel is indeed a settlement in the occupied West Bank and I believe should be added as verifiable references to the line in question if we intend to end this farce:
* </ref>
*</ref>
* </ref>
* </ref>
I believe that the article protection level should be restricted to registered users for a couple of months once the current protection expires, that should cool it all down (I hope), I am so weary of this issue that I wish that I could convince the city council to cease the sister city agreement with this settlement.  Thank you for your time, whatever your decision.
Altairisfar (talk) 13:19, 29 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: The page's protection level and/or your user rights have changed since this request was placed. You should now be able to edit the page yourself. If you still seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details. Please make sure you have consensus first. —  (e • t • c) 03:22, 1 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protected edit request on 29 January 2015 Suggestion 

message: The Fun Ship Holiday belonging to Carnival was in Mobile and the Carnival Elation replaced the Holiday.  I knw it was the Holiday, because I cruised the Holiday.
166.177.186.65 (talk) 12:20, 18 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 18 June 2015 

message: Huldra, please think before you edit. If you look at the changes you make with this edit, you will see that many, many of those changes are vandalism, which should not be restored (eg, changing "President James Madison" to "Supreme Leader James Madison"). FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 07:30, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: User:FreeKnowledgeCreator Yeah, please do think before you edit. Notice that you placed Ariel (city) on the occupied West Bank as being i "Israel"? Huldra (talk) 07:37, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: The edit you made restored vandalism to the article - as should be obvious to anyone looking at it. If the claim about Ariel was inaccurate, you could and should have removed it without restoring vandalism in the process. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 07:39, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I see what you mean, alas, your edit restored the that "Ariel" was in "Israel". What about restoring it to this edition? Huldra (talk) 07:46, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: LOL, I see you already have, Huldra (talk) 07:49, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vandalism 

message: I love this article.  Good work everyone and thank you from a resident.
In my opinion, the two paragraphs below seem a bit awkward when compared to the rest of the piece.  The rest of the work states the actions and facts about the Civil Rights era and its aftermath in a clear, non opinionated manner.  I feel these two paragraphs need some attention in that regard.
Would it be possible to expand on the facts in the highlighted sentences such that they come across more historically?  Both of the sentences are true, but they seem to deserve an explanation via helping people understand the specific actions and circumstances involved.  Personally, I was unaware of the work toward early integration of the civil forces and the voluntary desegregation of buses and lunch counters and I think it would be beneficial as a fact which helps define our city.
Again, I praise the work as it stands.  I do not feel capable, nor morally authorized, to make the edits myself, but I hope some of you would consider the points and possible actions which might be helpful.
The transition to the postwar economy was hard for the city, as thousands of jobs were lost at the shipyards. Eventually the city's social structure began to become more liberal. Replacing shipbuilding as a primary economic force, the paper and chemical industries began to expand. No longer needed for defense, most of the old military bases were converted to civilian uses. Following the war, in which many African Americans had served, they stepped up activism to gain equal rights and social justice, especially in the Jim Crow South. The city of Mobile police force and Spring Hill College were integrated during the 1950s. Unlike the rest of the state, the city buses and lunch counters voluntarily desegregated by the early 1960s.
The Civil Rights Movement gained congressional passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Voting Rights Act of 1965, eventually ending legal segregation and regaining effective suffrage for African Americans. But whites in the state had more than one way to reduce their voting power. Maintaining the city commission form of government with at-large voting resulted in all positions being elected by the white majority, as African Americans could not command a majority for their candidates in the informally segregated city.
 
Salbasia (talk) 15:42, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Does this seem awkward? 

message: Bayfest no longer exists in Mobile and ceased operations in 2015. An alternative sprung up, seemingly last minute, called Ten Sixty Five.
The city hosts BayFest, an annual three-day music festival with more than 125 live musical acts on multiple stages spread throughout downtown.[99] The event was attended by more than 200,000 people and generated in excess of $38 million for the city's economy during its 2011 season.[100]
wkrg.com/2015/09/16/bayfest-music-festival-cancelled/
BayFest 2015 organizers: Festival is canceled, effective immediately (updated)
Mobile's new downtown fest has a name: Ten Sixty Five | AL.com
Mnemnoch (talk) 05:13, 2 June 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bayfest Now Gone 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Thank you to Mobile Public Library Local History and Genealogy Division for providing informative newspaper articles about Mobile's sister cities. -- M2545 (talk) 19:56, 9 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Acknowledgment

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: In the "Government" section, third paragraph, last sentence, I would suggest adding "...and was re-elected to a second term on August 22, 2017."  (Stimpson took office on November 4, 2013 and was re-elected to a second term on August 22, 2017.) (http://www.al.com/news/mobile/index.ssf/2017/08/mobile_voters_go_to_polls_tues.html)Deemon1211 (talk) 15:52, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: although I didn't include "to a second term" since I think that was already stated by the word "re-elected." Thank you for noticing this. CityOfSilver 16:32, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 29 November 2017 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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thread_title:  External links modified (February 2018) 

message: My name is David K Akridge.  I am a high ranking employee of the Mobile County Public School System in Mobile, Alabama.  I'm the Executive Director of Technology and have worked in the system for 27 years.  Data is a big part of my job and the data on the school system is very outdated.  Number of schools, students, budget, and employees are not accurate.  I'm new to Wikipedia and not sure how edits on these types of pages are made.  I can gather better information and provide or can be allowed to edit.  Please let me know what I can do to help?
David K Akridge
dkakridge@comcast.net
dakridge@mcpss.com  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dkakridge (talk • contribs) 22:20, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Public School System Information. 

message: I'm going to add the fact that this town was in Ken Burns' documentary The War Ygdflgdflop (talk) 22:10, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate.  Seagull123  Φ  16:23, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 12 November 2020 

message: Adding a reference to the newly updated page on the Old Mobile site in the colonial history section would be useful:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Mobile_Site  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.90.250.21 (talk) 21:16, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request: Link to Old Mobile site 

message: Why is this page protected? Thanks in advance.HumbleConservative (talk) 16:16, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I suspect it is because it's sister city Ariel; an Israeli settlement on the occupied  West Bank. Certain pro-Israeli vandals insists on changing West Bank to Israel, cheers, Huldra (talk) 20:25, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. But if you look on the other sister cities o Ariel, those cities' pages aren't protected. Cheers. -HumbleConservative (talk) 00:52, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protected against vandalism? 

message: This page was apparently protected because of arbitration sanctions on the Arab-Israeli conflict, but how does this city even relate to the conflict!? Is it some error? --🔥LightningComplexFire🔥 19:58, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: See the section on sister cities. The issue lies there with Ariel being a sister city. Scarlettail (talk) 20:29, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

text: Yes, but the other city's sister cities are not protected. Why is that? -HumbleConservative (talk) 00:53, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  What?? 

message: The city updated its seal in 2015 to remove all flags except for US flag in the background. That could use an update in the info box. You can see it used now in city docs (like meeting agendas, minutes, etc.). And would the new city logo be appropriate to add the the page? Can’t remember when the rebrand happened, but I’m talk about the one on the city website (and all around town now)--Lahti213 (talk) 14:13, 13 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I added the new one but need the new flag too to replace old oneLahti213 (talk) 15:36, 16 January 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  New city seal? 

message: 21st century, thanks! Guide7547 (talk) 11:50, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  New subsection needed 

message: Looking through these comments, it seems that this page has been protected for a long time, and is in dire need of fixes from the community (for example, the image of the city seal which is several years out-of-date).
According to [the wikipedia admin pages](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_guide/Protecting), protections should be kept short and have a specific purpose.  Please unprotect this page so that Wikipedia can continue to be an encyclopedia that "anyone can edit".
173.18.228.33 (talk) 11:25, 18 September 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unprotect page 

message: If anybody is near Magnolia Cemetery (Mobile, Alabama) with some time on their hands, we could use a photo of the fancy mausoleum of notorious American slave trader Hope H. Slatter. According to a website that shall not be named, he's in Square 15-Lot 28. TIA if anyone can help. jengod (talk) 07:06, 6 November 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Photo request  

message: The section for Sports is outdated. The football team of the University of South Alabama no longer plays at Ladd-Peebles Stadium. They now play at Hancock Whitney Stadium. Additionally, the Dollar General Bowl is now called the 68Ventures Bowl, and is also played at Hancock Whitney Stadium. The Senior Bowl is also played there. I would make these changes, but the page is protected. JClary1 (talk) 12:10, 1 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Update Sports Section