Talk:BBC Studios Natural History Unit

message: :BBC Natural History Unit → ? – The BBC Natural History Unit is now part of BBC Studios and is known officially as BBC Studios Natural History Unit, see: https://productions.bbcstudios.com/our-production-brands/the-natural-history-unit https://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/bbcstudios/2021/historic-moment-as-bbc-studios-in-bristol-announces-a-new-home BBC Studios Comms (talk) 13:25, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: , article renamed. ~Anachronist (talk) 15:27, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 6 August 2021 

message: Logo change.
As stated in move request above BBC Natural History Unit is now part of BBC Studios and is known officially as BBC Studios Natural History Unit. It has a different logo (https://productions.bbcstudios.com/our-production-brands/the-natural-history-unit) which we have tried to upload but was repeatedly rejected by the Wikipedia system.
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 14:26, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: . Upload your logo with a commercial fair-use permission, and be sure the logo is low resolution (like less than 300 pixels wide). Or if you upload it to Wikimedia Commons, you need to release it to the Wikimedia Foundation under an acceptable free license, which may not sit well with BBC executives. ~Anachronist (talk) 15:37, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  The logotype is simply text and squares, and wouldn't be copyrightable in most countries. But c:COM:TOO#United Kingdom says that the threshold of originality is very low in the UK.  @Georgie, please see Wikipedia:Non-free content for Wikipedia's fair-use restrictions. (I'm surprised that :File:BBC Studios logo.svg is an SVG not a low-res PNG. And very surprised that :File:BBC Natural History.png was bot-moved to Commons and allowed to stay there.) Sorry that you've had trouble uploading the logo, but copyright is a complete minefield. ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 13:31, 21 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - Logo 

message: In the infobox please could the Parent company be changed from "BBC" to "BBC Studios". 
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 14:26, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Theroadislong (talk) 15:21, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - Infobox Edit  

message: Please could we replace the first paragraph as it is outdated and factually inaccurate. At present it reads: 
The BBC Natural History Unit (NHU) is a department of the BBC which produces television, radio and online content with a natural history or wildlife theme. It is best known for its highly regarded nature documentaries, including The Blue Planet and Planet Earth, and has a long association with David Attenborough's authored documentaries, starting with 1979's Life_on_Earth_(TV_series).
Please could it be changed to the following:
BBC Studios Natural History Unit (NHU), part of BBC Studios Productions, creates world-leading natural history content. With over sixty years’ heritage, the production unit has been at the forefront of innovation (citation: ) and has a long association with Sir David Attenborough, starting with his authored documentary Life on Earth in 1979.
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 14:26, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: entirely inappropriate promotional trumpery. Theroadislong (talk) 15:04, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - First Paragraph 

message: Please could we replace the second and third paragraphs as they are both outdated and factually inaccurate. At present they reads: 
The Natural History Unit is a specialist department within BBC Factual Production, which is itself part of BBC Studios. Each year it produces around 100 hours of television and 50 hours of radio programmes, making it the largest wildlife documentary production house in the world.[1] The BBC commissions programmes from the Unit for broadcast on five terrestrial television channels (BBC One, BBC Two, BBC Four, CBBC and CBeebies) and BBC Radio 4. Content is marketed internationally under the BBC Earth brand by the corporation's commercial arm, BBC Studios. Original content is also broadcast on the Earth Unplugged YouTube channel.[2]
The Unit has been based in Broadcasting House, Bristol since its formation in 1957, and has been headed by Julian Hector since 2016.
Please could it be changed to the following: 
The Natural History Unit received over 200 awards for its programmes, including 4 Emmys and 11 BAFTA TV awards, between 2017, when BBC Studios’ production arm first launched commercially,  and 2020  . 
Its globally renowned nature documentaries include Planet Earth II and Blue Planet II, which have been watched by over a billion people in the last three years . The latter sparked a campaign against ocean plastic pollution and drove change on a global scale, with the G20 agreeing an international framework to address marine plastic litter. In recognition, BBC Studios’ Natural History Unit and Sir David Attenborough won the Chatham House Prize for the series’ impact and contribution to international relations . 
The Natural History Unit’s multi-award-winning output ranges from landmark documentaries like Seven Worlds, One Planet  and technically challenging live shows like Blue Planet Live  to much loved long-running series like Springwatch  and children’s programmes like Andy’s Adventures. 
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 14:56, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  again, entirely inappropriate promotional trumpery, this is an encyclopedia article, not your marketing department! Theroadislong (talk) 15:06, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - Second and third paragraphs  

message: Please could we add a new section called "New customers and audiences" 
This section would read the following:
Since launching commercially, the Natural History Unit has won commissions from international broadcasters including Apple TV+ (The Year Earth Changed  and Prehistoric Planethttps://deadline.com/2019/05/jon-favreau-prehistoric-planet-apple-1202609696/), Discovery (Endangered, narrated by Ellen DeGeneres ), NBC Universal (The Americas previously known as The New World ), National Geographic (Ocean Xplorers   in partnership with James Cameron) and Migu (Animal Impossible ) as well as producing for the BBC.   
Content is marketed internationally under BBC Studios’ BBC Earth brand. Original content is also broadcast on the BBC Earth YouTube channel. 
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 18:38, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: with modification. I removed the unsourced claim about "Migu". ~Anachronist (talk) 15:54, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - New Section - New customers and audiences 

message: Please could we add a new section called "Innovation"
This section would read the following:
The Natural History Unit has been at the forefront of ground-breaking innovation – including shooting the world’s first high definition natural history landmark series (Planet Earth (2006 TV series)), underwater time-lapse cameras in Antarctica (Life (British TV series)) , the highest use of drone technology (Seven Worlds, One Planet)  , using cameras from space to tell stories of life on our planet (Earth from Space)  and building the world’s first manmade waterhole with a built-in fixed rig camera system and half-submerged photographic hide (Waterhole) . In 2021, Winterwatch was the world’s first large scale production to be powered by green hydrogen and emissions-free electricity     . 
The NHU has also driven innovation in natural history story-telling, for example Dynasties, described by TV critics as “Game of Thrones” for the natural world used the narrative arc of a drama to enhance viewers’ emotional connection with the stories  .
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 19:00, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  again, entirely inappropriate promotional trumpery, this is an encyclopedia article, not your marketing department! Theroadislong (talk) 15:07, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - New Section - Innovation  

message: Please could we add a new section called "Locations"
This section would read the following:
The Natural History Unit has been based at Broadcasting House, Bristol on Whiteladies Road in Clifton in Bristol since its formation in 1957. It was announced in April 2021 that it will move to a new 21st century sustainable production base in Bristol city centre 
BBC Studios Natural History Unit is launching a production base in Los Angeles to support the global boom in natural history programming and US buyers 
BBC Studios Comms (talk) 19:31, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: see WP:NOTNEWS. Theroadislong (talk) 15:30, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Request - New Section - Locations 

message: * Specific text to be added or removed: Replace the line "The BBC Studios Natural History Unit (NHU) is a department of the BBC which produces television, radio and online content with a natural history or wildlife theme. " with the line "The BBC Studios Natural History Unit (NHU) is a department of BBC Studios which produces television, radio and online content with a natural history or wildlife theme.
* Reason for the change: The BBC Studios Natural History Unit is a department of BBC Studios, the largest commercial subsidiary of the BBC, rather than a stand alone department at either the public funded broadcaster or at group level. 
* References supporting change: The Natural History Unit | BBC Studios https://productions.bbcstudios.com/our-production-brands/the-natural-history-unit
Georgie - BBC Studios Comms (talk) 15:45, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: . It was basically a request to add one word "studios" to the sentence. ~Anachronist (talk) 17:16, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed Change First Paragraph  

message: * Specific text to be added or removed: 
Please could we replace the paragraph that run as follows: 
The Natural History Unit is a specialist department within BBC Factual Production, which is itself part of BBC Studios. Each year it produces around 100 hours of television and 50 hours of radio programmes, making it the largest wildlife documentary production house in the world. The BBC commissions programmes from the Unit for broadcast on five terrestrial television channels (BBC One, BBC Two, BBC Four, CBBC and CBeebies) and BBC Radio 4. Content is marketed internationally under the BBC Earth brand by the corporation's commercial arm, BBC Studios. Original content is also broadcast on the Earth Unplugged YouTube channel.
With the following slightly edited version:
The Natural History Unit is a specialist department within BBC Studios Productions. Each year it produces around 100 hours of television and 50 hours of radio programmes, making it the largest wildlife documentary production house in the world. The BBC commissions programmes from the Unit for broadcast on five terrestrial television channels (BBC One, BBC Two, BBC Four, CBBC and CBeebies) and BBC Radio 4. It also makes programmes for other broadcasters and services including Apple TV+, Discovery, Inc., National Geographic Global Networks and NBC Universal. Content is marketed internationally under the BBC Earth brand. Original content is also broadcast on the Earth Unplugged YouTube channel.
* Reason for the change: The Natural History Unit is now part of BBC Studios, the largest commercial subsidiary of the BBC, which means it now makes natural history content for companies and broadcasters other than the BBC. Also, it is not accurate to say that BBC Studios takes NHU content and markets it internationally under the BBC Earth brand when the Natural History Unit is now itself a part of BBC Studios. 
* References supporting change:
 
Georgie - BBC Studios Comms (talk) 16:40, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: . ~Anachronist (talk) 17:24, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed Change Second Paragraph  

message: So, when did the NHU get shifted from BBC to BBC Studios? Does anyone have a reference for the change? Something like that should be mentioned in the History section of the article. ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 12:14, 21 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Phrasing from the 2016 Guardian article  suggests NHU was one of the original groups alongside Factual and Scripted: "exit of ... Wendy Darke, who was due to be head of natural history" and "moving those who work in key areas, such as drama, entertainment and natural history, out of the public and into the private sector". ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 12:49, 21 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Change from BBC to BBC Studios 

message: * Specific text to be added or removed: 
After the second sentence of the third paragraph please could we add the following sentence
“It was announced in April 2021 that the Natural History Unit will move to a new sustainable production base in Bristol city centre. It is also launching a production base in Los Angeles to support US buyers.”
* Reason for the change: 
Whilst it has been based in Broadcasting House, Bristol for many years the NHU will soon be moving to a new location in Bristol and adding an additional office in Los Angeles. We understand if this may seen too much like news, but the statement that the NHU is based in Broadcasting House, Bristol will soon become factually inaccurate. 
* References supporting change: 
 
Georgie - BBC Studios Comms (talk) 11:51, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi , per WP:CHRYSTAL I won't add this information. Once the move happens, a new request can be opened to update this information. Z1720 (talk) 17:24, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed Change - Adding extra sentence to third paragraph 

message: * Specific text to be added or removed: 
Please could we add the following text to the Awards and recognition section: 
“The Natural History Unit received over 200 awards for its programmes, including 4 Emmys and 11 BAFTA TV awards, between 2017, when it first launched commercially, and 2020. In 2019 BBC Studios’ Natural History Unit and Sir David Attenborough won the Chatham House Prize for Blue Planet II’s impact and contribution to international relations, which was presented by Queen Elizabeth II.”
* Reason for the change: 
BBC Studios Natural History Unit has received a number of new awards and recognition since this section was last updated. 
* References supporting change: 
  
Georgie - BBC Studios Comms (talk) 11:58, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done:  This is an obvious example of PR. Denied. Quetstar (talk) 04:02, 25 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  actually in that proposed paragraph, the first sentence would be OK, as these are notable and well known awards. ~Anachronist (talk) 04:29, 25 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: @Anachronist: Understood. Request reopened. Quetstar (talk) 05:49, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

text: Partially done. From the first sentence, I've included the BAFTA and Emmy count in the existing mention of them, but I've declined to do the rest; for the general award count, I believe we would be violating WP:DUEWEIGHT to include it without coverage from independent sources. I've also declined to implement the second sentence for similar reasons; while I could find independent coverage of the award being granted, they typically declined to mention the BBC unit being party to the award and instead focused on Attenborough. The best exception I could find to this was this article, from the BBC - but therein lies the problem, as there is no clear guidance on whether BBC News is considered independent from the other parts of the Corporation, and in this case, given the lack of other sources covering this, in conjunction with commentary from some members of Chaltham House about the award and the notion that the reason for it was Attenborough's celebrity, not the merits of the program, I have decided to lean on the side of caution and decline to consider the BBC article. Collectively, this leads me to consider that including this award would violate WP:DUEWEIGHT, though should another editor disagree I would have no objection to them adding the line, if the statement about who it was awarded by is omitted. BilledMammal (talk) 07:30, 23 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed Change, addition to Awards and recognition section