Template talk:Video game release

message: I believe I issued this before. Basically, IMO we should deprecate the INT parameter for a simple reason: "International version" is not a region. What does international says us? E.g. if it was not released in Japan, INT would say that it was released outside it, but where? Europe? China? Korea? Hence, we already put the specific region in most cases. For points where something is made available worldwide after a regional release, e.g. digitally, we use WW. Also implied by INT, other than with WW, it is implied that that digital re-release was not made available in the former exclusive region. We should have [yet another] tracking category and replace INT either with WW or the respective, correct region. Thoughts? Lordtobi (✉) 18:12, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: INT isn't a synonym for WW. It stands for an International Version, or at least it did before the instructions stating that it did were removed last year. - X201 (talk) 20:44, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I already note above what the current function of INT is, that being anything outside the original region, which does not make sense, as readeres would not know which region it was actually released in that day, except if we additionally append the same date with the correct region, which clutters it etc. etc. Lordtobi (✉) 07:16, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  Agreed with User:Lordtobi. An international version is simliar as a remake,[][] and we don't write "PS3 version: February 4, 2010" in the infobox. --A Sword in the Wind (talk | changes) 15:51, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

text: The maint category has been attached to this for a while now. Is there an active effort to remove INT? -- ferret (talk) 12:28, 11 May 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  The category is all cleaned up now (though it took a while). Also the international version article has since been deleted via AfD (not by me), so it's now more urgent than ever to remove it.  Lordtobi (✉) 10:39, 1 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  INT removed. -- ferret (talk) 14:02, 1 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should we deprecate INT? 

message: In Turkish Wikipedia, when we use WW, it says "unkown WW parameters.." (Module:Video game release) What is the problem? --Hedda Gabler (eski) (talk) 20:40, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you doing it as WW= or WW|? Enwiki's version of the template has depreciated using named parameters, so WW= would cause the error. -- ferret (talk) 20:53, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi , we use WW= --Hedda Gabler (eski) (talk) 21:03, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Unless you convert, you will not be able to use the module without making changes. The module will populate a category though that will tell you which articles are still using named parameters. You can use the category to update them. Enwiki converted everything before switching to the module, so the module never supported named parameters. -- ferret (talk) 21:05, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unknown WW parameter 

message: Can British Isles be added in the module? This region consists of the only countries in Europe that speak English (UK and Ireland). -- Wrath X (talk) 10:37, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Can you provide any examples where this will legitimately be needed? The template allows for you to link anything you need for uncommon items. The template's custom abbreviations are there due to their wide usage, and most other abbreviations are supported simply because they are standard ISO codes for those countries. Also, considering that Ireland considers the term British Isles to be offensive as a matter of national pride and position, it's probably best to not use it anyway. -- ferret (talk) 11:51, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: This is English Wikipedia and per Template:Video game release "add release dates for English-language regions". There are six countries that primarily speak English. US and Canada are covered by North America (NA), Australia and New Zealand are covered by Australasia/Oceania (AU/OC), UK and Ireland are covered by Europe (EU). However, sometimes the release dates for UK/Ireland and Europe differ. Examples include God of War: Ascension and Bloodborne. In these cases Europe doesn't cover UK/Ireland anymore but British Isles does. Also, I didn't think that the usage of British Isles was controversial on Wikipedia, since Template:English anime licensee and network have no problem using it for UK/Ireland. -- Wrath X (talk) 12:12, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Just use BI in the template where you need to. If there's only a handful of sourcable examples, it'll be fine. -- ferret (talk) 12:42, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Why not simply use BI? Asia, Southeast Asia, South America are in the module despite their release dates rarely being listed in the infobox. -- Wrath X (talk) 10:00, 1 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Because they were actually used. Editors have put them in dozens of articles, which I found while working on the template conversion. I've never found a case of someone using BI, so it's an atypical usage. I have seen a few cases of UK / IE, but never BI. -- ferret (talk) 13:54, 1 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: There's more reason to include BI than UK and IE since BI is a region as opposed to a specific country; and per WP:VG/DATE it's preferable to list regions in the infobox than countries. Still I see your point. Though, it's not uncommon for the UK/IE to have different release dates than the EU so I assume there's more than just a handful of examples. -- Wrath X (talk) 08:30, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  I replaced your BI on Bloodborne with UK/IE. It matches the prose, for one. We shouldn't link the Infobox and Prose differently. Otherwise we need to say in prose "Released in the British Isles", and I hope you understand that is completely atypical. -- ferret (talk) 13:36, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: If we do things that way then all the release dates for AU (Australasia) should be listed under AU/NZ (Australia/New Zealand) since most sources state Australia and New Zealand, not Australasia. Also, all PAL listings should be removed since no sources state PAL, instead they say Europe, Australia and New Zealand. For example, the Bloodborne article states Europe and Australia, not PAL. -- Wrath X (talk) 13:55, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: PAL was, in the past, a release region. In most modern releases of the last decade, it has been replaced with EU and AUS already. PAL is almost never used for current releases, only decades old ones. As for AU versus AUS for Australasia, this is already acknowledged as an issue (See talk archive). However, there's a lot of work to replace AU with AUS, or AUS with AU, as appropriate, and no one has taken on that effort yet. Australasia is generally used and accepted as typical for Aus/NZ, while as I've already noted, I've never once in a decade of editing seen British Isles used for a video game release. -- ferret (talk) 17:52, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: The reason why British Isles is never used is because most editors simply list the UK release date. However, per WP:VG/DATE it's preferable to list regional release dates than country release dates. British Isles is a region while UK is a country. I was thinking we could take a page from Template:English anime licensee, and use British Isles for UK/Ireland the same way it uses Australasia for Australia/New Zealand. -- Wrath X (talk) 07:10, 5 July 2017 (UTC)

text: Good points have been made here, but you can't just go and change it on articles without gaining consensus first. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 00:17, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Additions 

message: Is stuff like this , which outputs:  permitted? Or should it be avoided? --The1337gamer (talk) 19:38, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm, I see it a lot. I think the output is desirable, because it takes up less space than listing two regions with the same date separately, but I do think it would be great if the template actually had support for multi-region dates built in.--IDVtalk 19:44, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

text: Code wise, permitted and fine. Guideline wise? While the wikitext is more complicated than it would be to have NA and EU separately, it reduces the number of output dates. I don't have a strong opinion either way and have usually left it like this. I can add multi-region codes but we'll need to make a list of the most common ones. Off the top of my head, "NAEU" would be the most common by far, possibly followed by UKIE (See sections above about "BI" code. I still disagree with BI, as no one uses that language normally in VG articles and IE itself views it as an offensive term). -- ferret (talk) 23:26, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  syntax question 

message: In terms of using this for the infobox template and considering wikidata, is this template's usage preferred over bare dates?
If so, is it possible to figure out how we can call this template when there is only one date to include - eg, while one could use "WW|date" to show a worldwide release, but if that's the only date, then the "WW:" presentation is unnecessary, and it would be great if that could be simplified in the resulting wikitext.  Obviously, this is only the case if this is a preferred use template. If it is not necessary or preferred, then we can just spell the date alone, and that's it. --Masem (t) 15:26, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: My position is that the template is unnecessary to display a single date. The template's primary purpose is to create an unbulleted HTML list with region/date pairs. I could update the module to detect if the template has only been used with WW though, and suppress the display. I view that as a bit non-intuitive though, and could result in users believing the template broken or their syntax wrong, leading to extra edits or complaints as they try to figure it out. The template also used to be used without a first parameter, which caused some minor unexpected issues, so there is now a category to find and fix such uses. -- ferret (talk) 15:42, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that having an input that isn't displayed (e.g. |WW|date only showing the date) isn't ideal. Primefac (talk) 15:44, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, so the template's not preferred and it is preferred to actually avoid it if there's a single date. I'll look to update the infobox template to reflect that. --Masem (t) 16:04, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I went ahead and updated WP:VG/DATE with this info, but I'm sure somebody could make it more clear. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 20:39, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

text: This template creates a div box for listed items, resolving countries codes and pairing them to dates. No metadata or other tags/categories/etc are output, there is no benefit to using it for a single date except when you want to designate a specific region. Single WW use just outputs more HTML than necessary to convey a single date. No comment on start date. -- ferret (talk) 01:23, 5 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Two questions 

message: Adding to the prior discussion re: not using this template when the infobox only lists one worldwide date, is there some metadata benefit to using this template or  over simply using no template? I remember the answer being "yes" but I never asked how/why. czar 00:55, 5 June 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: This template creates a div box for listed items, resolving countries codes and pairing them to dates. No metadata or other tags/categories/etc are output, there is no benefit to using it for a single date except when you want to designate a specific region. Single WW use just outputs more HTML than necessary to convey a single date. No comment on start date. -- ferret (talk) 01:23, 5 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metadata 

message: Currently, the Module builds UL and LI HTML on it's own. I've updated the sandbox to rely on Module:List, which helps us ensure we're inline with formatting in other lists. This results in the list becoming slightly more condense. Please see Template:Video game release/testcases to compare the differences. If no opposition, I will move this live within a week or two. -- ferret (talk) 17:19, 26 January 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm completely fine with the new look, and this actually makes the infobox less dominant in shorter articles or in articles with many dates. Lordtobi (✉) 17:24, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

text: Went ahead with this, since the format change is minor, makes things more compact, and by virtue of using Module:List should be MOS compliant. -- ferret (talk) 13:36, 29 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Format tweak 

message: , you just enabled possible stylization for this template. While I feel like this would generally be a neat addition, I fear that it sacrifices uniformity. Is there a specific thought behind the inclusion? Lordtobi (✉) 06:10, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Lordtobi's point about uniformity is not a frivolous one but I feel like giving the template more options is the good way forward, and if need be, agree on guidelines on its usage, especially within infoboxes which is a most rigid context and also probably 90%+ of this template's usage. Ben · Salvidrim! ✉ 20:33, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Regarding the new styling parameters 

message: Hi guys. The docs only mention dates but another data point in a video game release is its price, and possibly others. And it renders ok, like with this edit. Is that ok and should the docs be updated to not be hardcoded to mention dates? Or are dates legit hardcoded into the template? Must they be? Or what? Thanks. — Smuckola(talk) 08:57, 5 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: This template was developed with dates in mind, but it does enforce those so obviously it can be used and abused for anything. Per your example, prices really aren't that good of a use-case as they would only appear on consoles/peripherals, given that we out-MOS them on game articles. IMO, it does not require to state every single possible use but its primary one, which is dates. Lordtobi (✉) 09:32, 5 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. The /doc says  which pretty well covers every possibility while still indicating that dates are its primary function. Primefac (talk) 14:21, 5 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: This basically. This is frequently used to denote publishers by region. The template has no actual support/control/enforcement of dates. That was just it's earliest use case. It's main purpose is to generate a list and resolve region codes. -- ferret (talk) 14:31, 5 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Non-date values?

message: I noticed there are a few of this style of multiregion dates.  Any objections to having the module automatically split/link these?  Thanks! Plastikspork ―Œ(talk) 23:29, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Sometimes people also do JP/NA. May want to only split on / as long as the parameter doesn't already contain a link. On the flip side, I noted that most of these are Arcade release dates with only a year (that are unsourced as well, it seemed), so it's a bit of a niche use. -- ferret (talk) 23:56, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: For that matter, if the parameter contains a link, we should probably skip trying to resolve Country data as well. -- ferret (talk) 23:57, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: ferret, yes, I agree.  Anything we can do to reduce the number of failed country data transclusions the better :)  Let me know if you want me to help. Plastikspork ―Œ(talk) 00:00, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  You're more than welcome to work on the module, though I'd love to see the finished sandbox before you push live. I can't promise I'd look into this any time soon. -- ferret (talk) 00:02, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: ferret, I put something in the sandbox.  It's probably more cautious than necessary in that it (1) attempts to split the label into a list and (2) checks to make sure all entries in the list are 2 or 3 letters uppercase and (3) then iterates over entries.  If there are any entries that don't match this pattern, it falls back to the old behavior.  I could make it more aggressive, but you never know what someone might try to pipe through there :)  Feel free to make changes, suggestions, throw tomatoes, etc.  Thanks! Plastikspork ―Œ(talk) 00:41, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  Added use cases to Template:Video game release/testcases. What about the case where one is linked and the other is not? Too niche? I believe we won't be making a bad Country data transclusion anymore so maybe not worth dealing with. -- ferret (talk) 01:20, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: ferret, I updated the sandbox to include that case.  Thanks! Plastikspork ―Œ(talk) 12:27, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  Added a "triplet" test case, also worked fine. I'm good! -- ferret (talk) 12:34, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Within such constructs, '?' ("Unknown") is not recognized. Should it be included despite the rather rare usage? IceWelder [✉] 12:41, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: To be honest, why do we have ? for Unknown? Like, when would you have a sourced release date but not know the region it pertained to? Especially in combination with other regions, i.e. NA/JP/? .... -- ferret (talk) 12:44, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Only case I could imagine would be for old games where a source vaguely claims that it released e.g. "in Japan and some other regions" on date X. I'd have to agree, though, that we could deprecated the question mark altogether. IceWelder [✉] 12:45, 24 March 2020 (UTC)

text: Assuming I did it right, we should now be tracking ? with .  And, I have synced the new / region parsing from the sandbox. Plastikspork ―Œ(talk) 13:46, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: So far I've only seen one mainspace article using it, which I just removed it from. Probably need to wait longer for cache purges though. -- ferret (talk) 13:44, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  I've removed the parameter and deleted the category, after all these months it only contained the template and it's subpages. -- ferret (talk) 14:21, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

text: I've added some text for it. -- ferret (talk) 14:20, 30 June 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Support for JP/NA? 

message: Page watchers may be interested in  Izno (talk) 00:22, 29 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Preview warning and hatnotes moving to templatestyles 

message: Hello, I used your module in Videoherní vydání (on the Czech Wikipedia) and changed some functions, because we don't use them or have them (we are only using labels etc.). My question is: is it somehow possible to add error message in parametr of label (and error/maintenance category) when the label is wrong, for example when label is "Ssasdsa" (doesn't make sense) or / "us" (small words)? When you for example put wrong ID into Authority control, it will make nice red words using row and also adds category, but I'm not skilled in these fields so I'm asking you. Thank you very much RiniX (talk) 14:34, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Lines 135-146 is how you'd do this, roughly. In this case, we're checking for and reporting older syntax so if it appears, it can be corrected. But it's the same concept to check for other conditions, undesired combinations, something being lowercase, etc. -- ferret (talk) 15:16, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:   I somewhat made it (error when it's blank), but still couldn't find a way to do it with labels (aliases). You'll probably know right away (sorry for bothering you). RiniX (talk) 16:25, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: You have to loop through all the arguments, and if one isn't what you want, throw the warning label. To do that you have to have a list of some sort designation what the valid arguments are. That was "knownArgs" in the original module, which is at the top. -- ferret (talk) 17:53, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text:  Thanks a lot. RiniX (talk) 19:19, 24 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Question (help) 

message: I always thought this template was really weird compared to the rest of Wikipedia's template formating. I wouldn't mind so much, but the more I use it, the more it gets annoying to use. 

Wouldn't it make much more sense to do it like this? 

Maybe this will also help organize the release dates more vertically, like this: 

I know you can still technically organize it vertically on the current version, but this seems easier to read. In my opinion at least. What do you think?Blue Pumpkin Pie (talk) 22:20, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: The template worked that ways years ago. It presented several problems though. First, the old template had a set order, meaning that Japan always came first, even if it was an older date. Second, you could only use each parameter once, and in some cases you needed them multiple times. This resulted in people use the template repeatedly back to back, causing multiple lists that weren't a single unit. Third, only specific hard coded regions worked. Fourth, you can't combine regions, such as NA/EU. A some point, a new template, literally named  was created, using the current format, to work around this. A TfD later resulted in the templates being merged, with the "new" syntax being preferred, and later the entire template was converted to Lua to expand its limits (it was limited to 20 total items period before), make them standardized Lists, and make it work with literally any region. Finally, unnamed parameters are widely used and this really isn't as unique as you think. -- ferret (talk) 22:28, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I see. it makes sense now.Blue Pumpkin Pie (talk) 22:37, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title: Better method?