Talk:Quebec English

message: They pronounce it "Bernard" because they're saying it in English, not because they can't say it in French. Just because the signs have to be in French doesn't mean the English name stops existing.. it just doesn't appear on the signs. When French street names or "Montéal" and "Québec" are used instead of English street names and "Montreal" and "Quebec", this is because they are being written in French, not because the English version takes an accent or is called "de la Montagne". What I mean to say is, the signs use the French translation or version of the name. That doesn't mean there is no English version. -65.94.224.14 13:53, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Street names

message: Your SAQ example corroborates what I say from the beginning. There is no generalisation extended to all first-language English-speakers. Some might say “liquo(u)r commission” and some may indeed say S.-A.-Q. but that doesn’t make it a dialect. However, as a linguist specialising in English-French contact, I have observed this phenomenon and was in fact very surprised to hear “sack”. Interestingly enough, in French “sack” is for the SAAQ while S.-A.-Q. (separately) is for the liquo(u)r store. Btw, many will say that “liquor” or “liquour” is American, so go figure; the misinformation works both ways.
Now, with what you say, I, being a native New Yorker having lived in Paris and in Montreal (this latter city for 8 years, though I’ve been visiting regularly for almost 20 years), I would be an Anglo-Quebecker or speaking Quebec English if I say “S.-A.-Q.”. And yes, S-A-Q is what I’ve always said. It’s because I speak French, not because of a so-called dialect. French is my second language, though main language. I work in French, did virtually all of my university education in French, including my Master’s in linguistics. I tend to borrow/calque from French. It’s even hard for me to pronounce standard gallicisms in English with an English-language pronunciation (phonological framework). According to my friends, it’s a riot to hear.
 ~ We call it boozeheimers. SAQ counds too much like the shortened form of "sacrement".--Soul scanner 12:50, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: SAQ

message: I don’t where you’ve been hiding not to have noticed “ATM” written on a sign posted in store/bank windows, even in non-tourist areas. It’s ubiquitous and far from “odd”. ABM is an alternative to ATM but it’s hardly a Canadian phenomenon, never mind unique to Quebec. Plus, there is huge variation to the ATM issue. In North America, some people say “ATM”, “bank machine”, “money machine” and the now TD-trademark “green machine”. There is such a thing as variation and it would be disinformative to make it a CAN/US issue, nonetheless a so-called Quebec English topic. Many true English-speakers say “guichet” in English because it’s a general word instead of “box office”, “ticket window”, “bank window/wicket”, and yes, “ATM”.
[May I interject that guichet is not used by Anglophones but the word I generally hear, especially from older Anglophones is wicket as a general word? Sorry - in true Canadian fashion...Albertde 20:46, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: ATM

message: Rather than tackle all the issues at once, I'll try them one at a time. As a native anglophone Montrealer, I have not once heard an anglophone refer to the the S.A.Q. as the "sack". Call my proof anectdotal, but then again so it seems is the statement of the author. Anecdote vs. anecdote I'm afraid. Loomis51 23:05, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: A couple of friendly reactions to CJ

message: It's okay = It's fine 
Is this not true in all english?  In Canadian English (at least, the "western Canadian English of Ontario & westwards") these two phrases are essentially interchangable.  Perhaps "It's okay" carries a slightly more positive connotation, but if it does, its very slight. WilyD 14:16, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think you missed the point. Some of the structures are grammatically correct but semantically very incorrect. If you say "It's ok" instead of "It's fine" you change the meaning. The two expressions indicate how you look at the proverbial glass of water: is it half-full or half-empty. "Ok" means acceptable but leaves much to be desired and "fine" means just acceptable enough. Clearly, I'm referring to the value judgment people make in their very limited English or very fluent yet poor English. When the waiter asks you how the food is and you reply "It's fine", he or she will simply go on to ask you if you'd like anything else because he or she understands that you're satisfied. However, if you answer "It's okay", he or she will think that you're not pleased with the food and will/should ask what the matter is or might just change the subject to avoid the issue. As for francophones, "It's fine" is absent from the vast majority of their speech inventories. Just imagine the repercussions when they travel: English-speaking waiters outside of Quebec and Canada must think Quebec francophones quite rude or hard to please. -- CJ Withers 06:44, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure that I did - I guessed it was the connotation that you were claiming differed, then incorrectly guessed which one is "supposed" to carry which connotation for non-Quebecers.  In as much as I have only my experience as an anglophone to go by, I don't think your characterisation of "It's okay" and "It's fine" are accuracte for "Non-Quebec English".  I'd have to say "it's okay" at a restaurant is a stronger approval than "it's fine", although both are easily washed out in the noise of how you say it.   Of course, a Torontonian may not have English experience that's representative of anything - I don't know.WilyD 14:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

text: Sounds like a research topic to me. CJ Withers 04:12, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Minor Question

message: It would be really great if someone who's got wikipedia table-making down pat to clean up the examples part of this article. Not only am I clueless, but I don't want to waste several weeks on learning since I have other articles to write and translate. So, again, I think tables for the examples would rock. -- CJ Withers 06:44, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Tables anyone?

message: My wife, who is a Montreal-born anglophone and does speak some French (good pronunciation but bad grammar), does not use any of the expressions listed in this section except for having the habit of using want for will. She also talks about the Express instead of Expressway.Albertde 12:04, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: My English is ''broke''

message: As amusing as the titles are "My English is broke", "Pardon my French", this is an encyclopaedia.  The style should be more formal than this. --Saforrest 19:43, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tone is too casual 

message: 500,000 people in Quebec speak English as their mother tongue. They should be the main focus of the article. There's no more reason to talk primarily about those who use it as a second language than there is to have an article on "California English" talk primarily about the way Hispanics speak English there. At most, a short, separate, section would do, with a link to an article  called "English as a second language in Quebec" if there was a lot of material. The fact that some people outside the province might be confused by the term "Quebec English" because they don't know that there are native English-speakers there is beside the point. The term "Quebec English", as used by linguists, virtually always refers to the English of first-language speakers, and that should be the main focus of an article with the title "Quebec English". Joeldl 15:20, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Undue focus of article on second-language phenomena 

message: I'm an anglophone from rural Quebec who went to English high school. I have never lived in Montreal. I am bilingual. When visiting Eastern Ontario I learned that 'direct payment' is the preferred term, instead of INTERAC. Eventually Interac was replaced with 'paiement direct' as more trademarks were associated with debit cards.
Dep is not a term I'm familiar with, depanneur is always used.
I always use the term 'soft drink'. (If this means I have no first-language, so be it!)
It bugs me when Americans pronounce last names that are French, for example "Mary Kay Letourneau".
Most of the English I experience today is from reading and listening, rather than actual conversation.
While in Ontario, I was asked more than once if I was from Nova Scotia (whassup with dat??)
Quebec English is simply a substitution in vocabulary. I have no idea if I have an accent, except perhaps for Ontarians believing I'm from NS Pendragon39 19:21, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've noticed that the further east you go in Quebec, the more the accent sounds like the Maritimes. --Soulscanner 06:57, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  INTERAC 

message: I'm an Anglophone who has lived in Montreal my whole life, gone to school in English my whole life and has been a part of the Anglophone community all my life as well. I don't understand why everyone thinks this page should be deleted! I've heard and used many of the phrases and terms on this page! And it is very true that the way we speak English has influences from French grammar and structure, the most common of them being "Open/close the lights", the use of "me" to compare yourself to someone or something else, all of which are mentioned on this page.
P.S. I have heard people calling the S.A.Q. "Sack", but they're almost always promptly corrected =P
: I say "sack" all the time for SAQ. I also call the RAAQ the "rack". And I always correct people when they say "open/close the light" or "pass the mop". It's just wrong.--Soulscanner 06:58, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  You mean the "RAM Q"? Pendragon39 08:23, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Seems fine to me 

message: The reason most of this page should be deleted is because it is all original research and unreferenced, and has been since its inception. I could add tonnes of stuff here on the Montreal Jewish English, Montreal Italian English, Montreal Greek English,  Montreal Irish English, etc. but it would all be original research like the rest of the stuff here. I could also start separate sections on Gaspesian English (like Maritimes), Eastern Townships English (like Northern Vermont), the Ottawa Valley English, the Cree and Inuit dialect, all of which are much more distinctive than the standard Canadian English heard in Montreal. The English taught and used in schools and workplaces in Quebec is standard Canadian English. A few people who assimilate into the francophone community speak with a French accent.  It doesn't warrant an article. --Soulscanner 06:53, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe there should be one article to cover Canadian flavours of English and French (eg. Fort Coulonge ). The Newfies can have their own article Pendragon39 08:27, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  If there is a reference for it, fine. There is an article on Canadian English with references. But even the definition given in this article seems unclear; it seems to identify "Quebec English" as something a few people (we're not told who) speak in the Montreal area, and there is no reference to back up this definition. --Soulscanner 11:05, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Quebec English would most likely be spoken by anglophones who went to English school in Quebec or who have lived in Quebec for a long time amongst francophones. Unilingual anglophones living in Quebec would not end up learning an interlanguage in the same way bilingual anglophones would, but they may learn to speak as their anglophone neighbours do. I dislike the emphasis on Montreal as I'm from rural Quebec. Not every anglophone in Quebec lives in Montreal. So the article lacks references, that doesn't mean the phenomenon doesn't exist or shouldn't be documented. Finding references is a lot less fun than editing an article, so its no surprise there is a backlog all over Wikipedia. Perhaps the best reference is to encounter those who live this reality. Whether that be an anglophone living in the Pontiac or a francophone who was born and raised in Fort Coulonge. Eventually someone with a PhD or whatever will choose to document these small details of Canadian life. Pendragon39 04:59, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

text:  P.S. I recommend the Anglo Guide to Survival in Quebec by Josh Freed. Not a reference (as far as I can remember) but good for a laugh and some insight into anglo life in Quebec Pendragon39 04:59, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I think you need to examine wikipedia guidelines. Documenting unreferenced information as you propose is doing original research. Please check the labels links at the top of the article. They explain it fully. It might be the case that these phenomena should be documented and that it is way more fun to note your own observations rather than backing them up with verifiable references, but that is not what Wikipedia is for. Articles that do this should be deleted, according to Wikipedia. From my own observations, the English spoken in Quebec is at once too similar to standard Canadian English to be considered a distinct dialect, and at the same time too varied to be considered as a distinct variety of this dialect.  Townshippers, Ottawa Valley dwellers, Jews in Cote St. Luc, fishermen on the lower North Shore, Gaspesians, Italians in Saint Leonard, Inuit in Nunuvik, and Point-Saint-Charles Irish all have very distinct accents and expressions, but unless these are documented and identified elsewhere I wouldn't start articles on them here.  --Soulscanner 21:05, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Okay. I editd the intro, which was repetitive and missed some important information about the Canadian dialect it belongs to. Also added more info on regional variations in remote and rural areas. --Soulscanner 09:23, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Looking good :) Pendragon39 14:22, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  A lot of it will be challenged in the future. But I'll adopt your open-minded and inclusive attitude for now. --Soulscanner 02:14, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  If the information is accurate it might survive. Pendragon39 18:33, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  <strike>Delete</strike> Reform article 

message: For those who enjoy referencing articles, please see the reference section in the West/Central_Canadian_English article. Perhaps those refs are applicable here as they "seem" to be the source for the paragraph on Quebec English and other regional variations Pendragon39 18:43, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  References? 

message: 1. A french speaking Quebecker would not say "Close the door" for "Lock the door", but for "Shut the door close"
2. "A good placement" is not "A good location" but "A good investment"—Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.110.7.180 (talk) 15:29, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Few mistakes I noticed 

message: I have assessed this as a Start Class, as its detail is nearly completely unreferenced, and of midimportance, as I do feel that it plays a strong role in understanding the history of Canada. Cheers, CP 03:43, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Assessment

message: I just want to point out that Trois-Rivières actually has a significant English history and is commonly spoken as Three Rivers --68.145.127.213 (talk) 01:43, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I never heard of people calling Trois-Rivières as Three Rivers except me explaining that word to my unilingual mother who has a little knowledge of Quebec geography and French (she's from the States). I always call that city in its original French name. If you think that Trois-Rivières has a significant English history, then write about it in the right article: Trois-Rivières. 24.202.31.204 (talk) 20:57, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

text: I have also heard Three Rivers numerous times, especially when speaking to native anglophones.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Forbore (talk • contribs) 03:05, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

text: I am a twenty year-old English-speaker born and raised in Montreal and I have always heard it called Three Rivers, which I also say. I can attest to having heard the English term Three Rivers used by both my father's (Working class British/Canadian) and mother's (Italian-Canadian) respective families and communities.-174.94.79.158 (talk) 04:11, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Three Rivers

message: In Quebec English, the word fight is pronounced /faɪt/ or /fʌɪt/ ? Fête (talk) 23:22, 13 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  fight 

message: There's this professor from Quebec at my university, and one of the things that really struck me as weird is that his /ʌ/ is extremely fronted, it sounds almost like [ɛ] (perhaps he uses his French /œ/?). This is a math-heavy class, so I hear a lot of "nembers." Is this an idiosyncrasy or is it common?--206.225.133.1 (talk) 16:44, 9 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: ʌ Fronting

message: This list of names is currently presented as examples of Quebec English pronunciation, but there is no explanation as to how English-speakers pronounce them. 108.254.160.23 (talk) 14:30, 17 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mario Lemieux, Marie-Claire Blais, Jean Charest, Jean Chrétien... 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This is not, as the writer claims, a "grammatical impropriety", but simply standard British English - which has had considerable influence on Canadian English - when referring to the condition (as opposed to being admitted to, or working in, a specific hospital). Brits are usually surprised to hear Americans (and Canadians) saying "in the hospital" with this meaning, and would consider it incorrect, as well as misleading ("Which hospital do you mean?").213.127.210.95 (talk) 16:43, 3 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  "in hospital" 

message: Well, someone got the number of speakers wrong. If the population of Quebec is over 8 million, then how is there an estimate of 20.1 million in Quebec? Whoever put this mistake must be either: a. A vandal or b. doesn't even know about Quebec.
(And here I am, sitting at the computer at St-Cleophas.) 2001:56B:DC25:9C00:E092:3277:84E3:3AFE (talk) 12:09, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  ...