Talk:Revolutionary Organization 17 November

message: *Support: In accordance with Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not this article should be properly labled as a terrorist organisation. -- Cat chi? 10:11, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Requested move

message: I'd prefer a move to Revolutionary Organization 17 November, seeing as that is the full name of the group according to the article. violet/riga (t) 18:48, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Alternative proposal

message: The alernative proposal, moving the article to Revolutionary Organization 17 November was accepted and the article has now been moved. violet/riga (t) 22:36, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Decision

message: Granted, Terrorist is a strong word, howvere they are a terrorist organisation as far as NATO/INTERPOL/EU/US is concerned. Aproporatley mentioning that should work.
:Not to mention that they were actually convicted by the Greek courts. --Delirium 07:54, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Terrorist 

message: The reason for deleting the Kleanthis Grivas tract is this : in the alleged US documents he presents there is no mention of Greece, Welch, 17th November, or anything pertaining to the matter at hand. All of it is LaRouche-type speculation on his part, which amounts to "if the United States government sent such papers, wouldn't they also be capable of ordering the killing of Welch?". And it doesn't stick. Smear campaigns based on guilt-by-association have no place in wikipedia, even less so when afformentioned papers are debunked Soviet forgeries that were used as a propaganda tool in the cold war (also see: State Department answer).
As for the other changes I reverted, they're reeking with -pov- and, thus, do not belong here. I mean, seriously, you have to be a real imbecile to enter a "do you really believe what the government says?" type of statement into an article and expect to find it standing there after more knowledgeable editors have taken a look. Porfyrios 17:11, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Please refrain from personal attacks. The US State Dept considered that this article warranted a denial, both have to be inserted. This is fact. Whatever you think about Grivas or about the US State Dept, both are relevants here. Tazmaniacs 18:35, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Please find other formulation then instead of deleting sources. This may be considered as vandalism. Tazmaniacs 18:39, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

text: This is rather ironic since you state that you are against censorship on Wikipedia on your user page... Tazmaniacs 18:41, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

text: It seems Grivas uses a negative to prove a positive. Was there any factual evidence in his article? Intangible 19:11, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Klenathis Grivas's article

message: There is plenty of gossip circulating Greece about the timing of the arrests of the N17 participants and the upcoming(then) olympic games.  America had made suggestions that the games should not go ahead in Athens due to the security risks of a N17 attack.  By 'amazing coincidence' just before the games an organisation that had elluded capture for so many years was suddenly captured in its entirity.  
Granted this is hearsay and speculation so has no place on the main wiki page but is definately food for discussion here.--unsigned
Two years before the Olympic Games is your definition of "just before"? This "gossip", mainly the product of unreconstructed groupies of the 17th November terrorists, seems to conveniently forget that the apprehensions started because a freaking bomb exploded in the hands of one of the terrorists. 212.251.124.214 11:02, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: However, many more were convicted on, let's say "dubious", evidence, and that could be an indication of such speculations. Anyhow, we cannot include such info on the article unless we can cite that, eg "political commentator X said that...". --Michalis Famelis (talk) 11:49, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  N17 capture and the olympics 

message: I believe that the image had no copyright. Perhaps the person you placed it in the first place can give us details. Politis 12:19, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Picture

message: "N17 is currently implicated in a rocket attack against the US Embassy in Athens occuring 12 January, 2007."
What on Earth is that? 2 hours after the hit, and someone already reached a conclusion? When nobody nowhere even implied something like that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.205.108.52 (talk • contribs) 
:We should make it clear to our readers that the Greek authorities are calling Revolutionary Struggle an N17 "spinoff", and not imply anything further.  Jkelly 18:46, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Premature conclusions

message: I copyedited the article and removed the tag. I also corrected the Turkish names. Put a stub sign on the formation section but I dunno if it's the correct one. --Suleyman Habeeb 16:34, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  removing tag, copyedits 

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BetacommandBot (talk) 16:16, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:November 17.jpg

message: Reference 5 and 6 are dead links.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Leendert123 (talk • contribs) 13:46, 26 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  dead links 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 5 external links on Revolutionary Organization 17 November. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071120171110/http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/news/content.asp?aid=18879 to http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/news/content.asp?aid=18879
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070927202859/http://www.cyprus-mail.com/news/main_old.php?id=7103&archive=1 to http://www.cyprus-mail.com/news/main_old.php?id=7103&archive=1
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071120171133/http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/news/content.asp?aid=27078 to http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/news/content.asp?aid=27078
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071120171137/http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/news/content.asp?aid=37570 to http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/news/content.asp?aid=37570
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070927080717/http://www.athensnews.gr/athweb/nathens.print_unique?e=C&f=13160&m=A06&aa=1&eidos=S to http://www.athensnews.gr/athweb/nathens.print_unique?e=C&f=13160&m=A06&aa=1&eidos=S
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This label provides no information, is usually used a smear rather than an empirical descriptor, and isn't included in most pages about revolutionary Marxist-Leninist groups. The only time this label might be appropriate on Wikipedia is if multiple reliable sources have used it, in which case its use in the first sentence is still dubious. In this case, it's an editorial claim that is unsourced. The opening sentence "17N...was a Marxist-Leninist urban guerilla organization." is sufficient and provides plenty of information about who this group was and what it believed. "Far-left" is unsourced, opinionated, and clutters the first sentence. It should be removed. Philomathes2357 (talk) 17:25, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I’m not removing it under your advice because you’ve already shown yourself to have an extremely fringey stance here. Dronebogus (talk) 09:44, 18 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Far-left