Talk:Harold Hongju Koh

message: The article as it currently stands fails to note that Koh has received strong support by man prominent right-wing individuals including Ken Starr and Ted Olson. Sources that should get incorporated include . JoshuaZ (talk) 15:44, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: The Guardian: WikiLeaks v the imperial presidency's poodle, November 29, 2010. --spitzl (talk) 18:23, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Sources that should get added

message: I added a POV tag to the transnationalism section. From my understanding of Koh's work and positions, this account of the controversy is strongly unbalanced and not representative of his views at all. It's telling that his views, according to him, aren't described at all - only strong criticism. It's noted that two moderates (credentials unstated) are supportive, but their basis for support is also not well described. I'm tempted to remove parts of the section to the talkpage to be reworked without presenting a prejudiced live version. I may do that later this afternoon, in the interim I'll try to do some rewriting to introduce a bit of balance. Nathan  T   (formerly Avruch) 16:45, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: In the meantime, the "Controversial Views" paragraph should be removed while the neutral version is being written. A collection of quotes distorting his views on transnationalism and law in general not only violate WP:QUOTE, WP:BLP, but also possibly WP:COATRACK. One needs to keep in mind WP:RECENTISM as well considering the current Legal Adviser of the Department of State nomination. Khoikhoi 18:27, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I've made a quick and dirty start on the nomination and the part of his legal philosophy that has come under fire. I've got some other sources and hope to expand the coverage, but this or a version of it should do for now. Nathan  T   (formerly Avruch) 20:22, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Any chance you could throw in the sources I linked to above? It seems important to note that he's been supported by a lot of prominent conservatives. JoshuaZ (talk) 17:12, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Done by Kenosis. Honestly I'm not a huge fan of linking to blogs, even if the writers are well respected in their field. I wish the comments by Ken Starr and Ted Olsen were reported in more conventional reliable sources (the Times mentions them in the Caucus blog [still a blog!], but only by reference to what others have reported). Nathan  T   (formerly Avruch) 18:19, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  The Starr sources is a conventional source- article from the Yale Daily News. JoshuaZ (talk) 23:43, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

text: I think that, given the fact that Koh is the subject of political controversy, we need to be careful in quoting commentators on his political views.  The Glenn Beck quotation (at the end of the State Dep't nomination section) adds no analysis to this article, as the view that treating foreign law as precedent might undermine American sovereignty has already been expressed as the views of respected legal commentators (Justices Scalia and Thomas) - all it adds is hyperbole, and so it should be removed.  Similarly, I think that David Lat should be identified as "Former editor of Above the Law and Yale Law Student" rather than "Former federal prosecutor" because his 'authority' as a commentator comes from having run the blog, and been a Yale Law student - not from having been an AUSA. Chris2145 13:22, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I think former federal prosecutor is David Lat's most significant professional achievement, a major element of his general credibility, and should remain. Perhaps "Former federal prosecutor and Yale Law graduate David Lat" might work as well? As for the Glenn Beck quote - it's a direct quote on this issue, although it isn't obvious from the text. Scalia and Thomas have expressed views on the general subject (internationalism in law), but not Koh directly. Plus, stylistically I think it gives readers an idea of how significant the philosophical gulf is. Beck's view is starkly stated in that quote, but it isn't far off in substance from many others. The last point is that a lot of the criticism of Koh isn't coming from respected legal commentators - its coming from political commentators. We should have at least one representative, given that they are considerably higher profile than the blogger critics. Thanks for registering an account and coming here to discuss this, by the way. Nathan  T   (formerly Avruch) 21:17, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

text:  Beck has zero qualification on the matter. Quoting him in this fashion is quoting an individual with no qualifications who is oversimplifying complicated issues. I'd prefer if we just removed the Beck remark. JoshuaZ (talk) 04:33, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: In politics (and that is what this is about), it isn't only the opinions of experts that matter. I'm not a huge Glenn Beck fan, but millions of people listen to and watch him daily and his opinion is representative of the sort of criticism that is making the Koh nomination controversial. Nathan  T   (formerly Avruch) 11:39, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

text: Done. Thanks for the reference. ... Kenosis (talk) 22:25, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: POV tag

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