Talk:Watford Grammar School for Boys

message: Hi Carinya, thanks for contributing to wikipedia.  Please add sources to show the verifiability of your information.  Guidelines are here WP:V.  Articles without verification sometimes get tagged for deletion by (sometimes overzealous) recent change patrollers.  Notability or importance is another important thing to explain although minimal importance is usually enough.  Notable alumni, mention in works of literature, that sort of thing.  Above all, have fun. Thatcher131 15:56, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

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thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:WGSBlogo.gif

message: Moneyhill, I see you've re-ordered the list (which was in chronological order).  Is there any particular pattern to your order?
You've also retitled the section Notable recent alumni from the more common Notable alumni.  Is there a reason for that? Kanguole (talk) 19:30, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alumni list 

message: Is not the inclusion of the full committee of the old boys' cricket club a little bit too tangential to the main subject? I would suggest that the whole section on Old Fullerians be removed and covered in a short para along the lines of: "Old boys of the school are known as Old Fullerians. The Old Fullerians run a number of active sports clubs." In fact, you could probably do without that second sentence.
Just a suggestion! I see there are a couple of keen editors for this piece...
HenryPhillips (talk) 12:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I've cut the table and the cricket club subsection.  Not sure about further cuts. Kanguole (talk) 14:27, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Old Fullerians 

message: MoneyHill is keen to remove David Sullivan from the list, saying "Sullivan notorious, not notable; brought UK journalism to an all-time low and shame to the school".  But notoriety and notability are not mutually exclusive; he certainly is notable.  This page ought to report all the relevant information, even if some of it is embarrassing to the school. Kanguole (talk) 14:35, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed.  I would suggest that David Sullivan is pretty notable.  I don't see how someone's future behaviour or business dealings reflect positively or badly on the school.  For example I notice that Nick Leeson is top of Parmiter's School list of notable Alumni, yet he brought down a bank!  As one of the richest men in England it's difficult to ignore him.  Perhaps as a compromise he can be described as a "Newspaper Proprietor" on this page, and people can read his page to find out the rest, if they don't already know.WW9066 (talk) 23:40, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Also, I notice that Laurent Barnard, guitarist in the band Gallows has been taken off the Alumni list.  The guidelines from the Wikiproject Schools states: Notable alumni — Provide a bulleted list of notable alumni with a short description to explain why they are famous. Alumni without their own Wiki articles should always have third-party references.  i.e. Alumni need not necessarily have their own wikipedia page.  Gallow's music may not be to everyone's taste, but the band, including Laurent himself have appeared on the front cover of NME and Kerrang! magazines.  That makes him fairly notable in my opinion.WW9066 (talk) 23:40, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I may have trimmed a bit much, but there were no third-party references for him either. Kanguole (talk) 00:57, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Agreed. He clearly passes notability criteria. No serious debate on the page for Sullivan about notability. Not a nice man but the last time I looked there was a page for Hitler too... HenryPhillips (talk) 21:55, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  Re: Sullivan, I didn't realise he'd given money to the school as well - pretty difficult to disown him if the school is happy to take his money.WW9066 (talk) 11:14, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

text: The secondary school was founded in 1884, and Gerald Moore would be 1910s.  It's rather less likely that the poor children who received an elementary education in the Free School would have risen to national prominence, if indeed it can be considered the same school at all.  It's true that the list is inevitably partial, but it does seem likely that if an old boy becomes famous, someone will remember that he was at the school.  Many people do find lists of former pupils useful; that's why they're in histories of the school, and are a standard feature of Wikipedia schools articles.  The article on David Sullivan is a strong case for notability.  As for "head boy", I believe that you added that; I'm happy to remove it.  Kanguole (talk) 01:38, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

text: The issue of notability does not surely refer to the school, merely to this wikipedia page.  He is notable and he is an alumni of the school.  The issue of whether the school is proud of his achievements, for the purposes of this page is irrelevant.  In fact we could note make a sub-note that the school have distanced themselves from him, if that were the case.  But we can't, because the school are quite happy to take his money - obviously the school is proud of him.  May I suggest again, that he is described here as a "newspaper proprietor" as a compromise that may keep everyone happy?WW9066 (talk) 11:51, 5 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see how hiding information would make anyone happier: it still leaves Sullivan associated with the school. Kanguole (talk) 00:04, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alumni list 

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thread_title:  External links modified