Talk:Spion Kop (stadiums)

message: What's the evidence for this claim? Ste B 03:02, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The First Kop 

message: I have to take issue with the implication that it was a 'liverpool regiment' that suffered heavy losses at the battle of Spion Kop in the Boer War. Closest to this description is likiely to be The South Lancashitrs; however there were many other regiments from all over the UK and the Empire involved, several of whom suffered significant losses - http://www.britishbattles.com/great-boer-war/spion-kop.htm. The fallout from this battle seriously impacted on the public in the UK, it is almost certain that several Football Clubs, large and small and in a 'patriotic spirit' memorialized the encounter my so naming any mound like enclosure (remember many would not be 'stands' as we know them now, but more like 'The Hill' and 'The Mound' at Sydney and Adelade Cricket Grounds, i.e. Grass covered inclines).
can I also take issue with the assertion that the Anfield Kop is the only 'Official'y named stand.
I can only speak for Bramall Lane in Sheffield but it currently has the 'official' name 'Hallam FM Kop Stand' - http://www.sufc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/Prices/0,,10418,00.html
And, to my knowledge, has been officially the Shoreham Kop, since I started going to Bramall Lane in 1969, and unofficially, i.e. amongst supporters both 't'Shoreham' t'Kop' and 'Spion Kop'.
I'm pretty sure other grounds have stands with an 'official' Kop name.
SubtleBlade 23:28, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The banks and terracing at Woolwich Arsenal's Manor Ground were never officially given names. According to noted author Simon Inglis (Football Grounds of Britain, The Football Grounds of England and Wales, Engineering Archie - Archibald Leitch, Football Ground Designer), the earliest reference comes in the year 1904 when a local newspaper likened the refurbished Manor Ground terrace to that of Spion Kop. This reference predates the printed work of Birmingham journalist Ernest Edwards, who in 1906 nicknamed the refurbished Anfield terrace Spion Kop. And so it seems the earliest reference to a football terrace as Spion Kop can indeed be attributed to Woolwich Arsenal, where it was likened. However it should also be noted that this name was never formally adopted, unlike at Anfield, where later it was. smb 14:10, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  'official name' 

message: The image :Image:Bloomfield Road from above.jpg is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here.  In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page.  Please check
:* That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's description page for the use in this article.
:* That this article is linked to from the image description page.
This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --20:22, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:Bloomfield Road from above.jpg

message: The Riverside stadiums kop end is known as the new holgate end (the original holgate end being the kop end at ayresome park) suggest this is added rather than naming the name of a block number.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.104.177.68 (talk) 20:43, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Riverside 

message: Highbury isn't standing anymore is it? So the kop at that stadium isn't there. I don't know whether there are other stadia listed which are no longer standing, but if they are in the list shouldn't they either be removed or a note made that this is the case. --81.158.106.197 (talk) 15:20, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I think only 'stands' that are actually named Spion and/or Kop should be listed. Dynablaster (talk) 21:32, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Highbury

message: Less of the "loyal" and "famous". Keep it neutral.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.40.164.243 (talk) 14:44, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: With regards to the Kop at Anfield, is certainly famous, and quite easily the most famous of Kop stands in the world. The word is used regularly via a multitude of sources in conjunction with Liverpool FC. This is not really the case for any other kop stands. You need only put "kop" until Google to see this. In fact I was rather suprised to see only passing reference to the stand at Anfield on this page such is its noteriety. Perhaps the disputed section should be expanded to a more encyclopedic entry for the kop at Anfield. --Footix2 (talk) 21:50, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Peacock words  

message: It seems to me that in the list of 'kops' that there are a series of stands/terraces that have never been known as a kop. Rather, I suspect that these are, instead, 'popular ends', i.e. the end which is/was most popular with the home supporters, particularly as the common layout of football grounds used to have home fans behind one goal and away behind the other. A distinction should be drawn between the two, and if there is no verification that a particular stand/end has ever been referred to as a kop then it should be removed. Dancarney (talk) 15:59, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I entirely agree. If a reference is not forthcoming, it should not be on the list. Wikispan (talk) 19:55, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm making a start on getting references in there, then I'm going to start removing stuff. Dancarney (talk) 12:08, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kop vs. Popular End 

message: The incredible story behind the Kop 81.155.231.191 (talk) 12:11, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  BBC Sport: Spion Kop report 

message: The often-repeated assertion that Woolwich Arsenal supporters nicknamed a terrace "Spion Kop" remains unsupported by evidence. The claim was first made by Phil Soar in The History of Arsenal Football Club. But his source—a press cutting dated 1904—only mentions Spion Kop fleetingly. The author, in a single sentence, merely notes the similarity between spectators' heads popping over the top of the embankment to warring factions atop the hill of the same name. To Phil Soar, this was as good as saying Arsenal had a terrace named Spion Kop, even though the evidence clearly does not stretch that far.
The part about Liverpool fans nicknaming their own terrace is conjecture (though entirely sensible) based on a 1906 report by Birmingham journalist Ernest Edwards in which he wrote "This huge wall of earth has been termed 'Spion Kop', and no doubt this apt name will always be used in future in referring to this spot." It is reasonable to assume the name was adopted by fans in the way indicated by Edwards. But some accounts (including Mark Lawrenson's) conflate these two separate pieces of evidence and apply Ernest Edwards' report to Woolwich Arsenal, without justification. Wikispan (talk) 12:55, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Woolwich Arsenal 

message: While it may have originally been called the Spion Kop, am pretty sure at least from its 1994 rebuild its just been called/referred to as the Kop; shouldnt the article note this?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.17.0.3 (talk) 10:36, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Liverpool Kop 

message: The Blackpool image is a copyright violation. I added the Liverpool one since it receives plenty of text in the article.Cptnono (talk) 16:53, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: How so? It seems to be made available under fair-use. Wikispan (talk) 17:57, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no FUR for this article. FURs need to be done for each article the image is used in. A FUR would not be valid for this article since this it is replaceable with a free image. Cptnono (talk) 18:00, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for explaining. Wikispan (talk) 23:10, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem. I thought the image was pretty cool myself. Here is some more detailed info: Wikipedia:Non-free use rationale guideline and Wikipedia:Non-free content.Cptnono (talk) 00:24, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Image

message: An image used in this article, File:Spion Kop at Hillsborough.jpg, has been nominated for speedy deletion for the following reason: All Wikipedia files with unknown copyright status 
;What should I do?
Don't panic; you should have time to contest the deletion (although please review deletion guidelines before doing so). The best way to contest this form of deletion is by posting on the image talk page.
* If the image is non-free then you may need to provide a fair use rationale
* If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale, then it cannot be uploaded or used.
* If the image has already been deleted you may want to try Deletion Review
To take part in any discussion, or to review a more detailed deletion rationale please visit the relevant image page (File:Spion Kop at Hillsborough.jpg)
This is Bot placed notification, another user has nominated/tagged the image --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 22:16, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: File:Spion Kop at Hillsborough.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

message: I have several times tried to make an edit to refer to the fact that Tottenham Hotspur's new stadium will have a kop-style stand (the South Stand) with 17,000 capacity (the largest in the UK when finished). Each time it has been reverted by Ilikeeatingwaffles for reasons which I don't find convincing. 
Here are some sources and I leave it to others to decide:
* http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11675/10002894/tottenham-reveal-400m-plans-to-modernise-white-hart-lane Sky Sports  - "the largest single 'kop' stand in the country, which will be known as the home end and hold 17,000 capacity in total."   — Preceding unsigned comment added by MrStoofer (talk • contribs) 11:07, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Do you have a source to say that the stand will be called The Kop? All the stands listed in the article all called The Kop (or similar). This stand appears to be a massive single-tier stand, but not called a Kop - cf. the Südtribune at Westfalenstadion. Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 11:45, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

text: The first sentence states that Kop is a "colloquial" term for a type of stand. If the policy for this page is as as per Ilikeeatingwaffles then that needs changing, because Tottenham's new stand is colloquially known by that name (full disclosure: I did edit that sentence but not that bit.) MrStoofer (talk) 12:07, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Plus of course the History section does not follow the "official names only" policy.MrStoofer (talk) 12:09, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Not all stands named "Kop" are large, single-tiered and behind the goal - see the Spion Kop at Filbert Street, the Popside Kop at the Baseball Ground or the Kop at St Andrew's (stadium). Some stands that are in the Kop "style"(?) are not known by that name - the Park End at Goodison Park, the North Stand at Maine Road, Gallowgate End at St James' Park. You're right that the inclusion of the stands at Villa Park and Molineux confuses matters further! So, maybe the whole article needs a rethink? How should the criteria be defined? Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 09:19, 13 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: It is clear from (1) this article itself (see especially the History section) and (2) the references that I cited above, that there is a widespread understanding that a single-tiered end may be referred to as both "a kop" and as "kop-style". If there is to be an article on this subject (which is open to debate) then it has to reflect that. Since the article does already reflect that, I cannot see how adding the reference to THFC's new Kop would go against the article as it stands. If you want to exclude it, then the whole article needs to be re-written with a clear explanation of what is a "kop". MrStoofer (talk) 10:30, 13 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure that it is clear that a single-tiered end can be defined as a "kop", seeing as two-tiered stands are also included by name or in the history section. The most useful thing would be a WP:RS that gives a definition. Maybe a broader consensus is required, with help from WP:FOOTY, for example? Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 13:52, 13 September 2016 (UTC)

text: We've got a bit off topic. The issue was why was THFC's proposed stand excluded from mention, I believe that I have refuted your reason (it is not "officially" called a kop) because the article is not limited to stands "officially" called a kop. So can it be mentioned now?MrStoofer (talk) 15:21, 13 September 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Though the list does seem to be. I dunno. Feel like it's opening a can of worms, TBH. Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 10:46, 14 September 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tottenham Hotspur new stadium 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 11 external links on Spion Kop (stadiums). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://edition.cnn.com/2008/SPORT/football/10/29/first11.stadiums/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090210193006/http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0500liverpoolfc/0100news/tm_objectid%3D17610578%26method%3Dfull%26siteid%3D50061%26headline%3Dhow-kop-tuned-in-to-glory-days-name_page.html to http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0500liverpoolfc/0100news/tm_objectid%3D17610578%26method%3Dfull%26siteid%3D50061%26headline%3Dhow-kop-tuned-in-to-glory-days-name_page.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130804153153/http://www.derbycountyfootballhistory.co.uk/ to http://www.derbycountyfootballhistory.co.uk/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110103131019/http://www.swfc.co.uk/page/Hillsborough/0%2C%2C10304~1032653%2C00.html to http://www.swfc.co.uk/page/Hillsborough/0,,10304~1032653,00.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080522131803/http://www.nottscountyfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/MeadowLane/0%2C%2C10426%2C00.html to http://www.nottscountyfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/MeadowLane/0,,10426,00.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20101230170910/http://www.fsf.org.uk/ground-guide/stadiums/tranmere-rovers/prenton-park/ to http://www.fsf.org.uk/ground-guide/stadiums/tranmere-rovers/prenton-park/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20101230195107/http://www.fsf.org.uk/ground-guide/stadiums/wrexham/racecourse-ground/ to http://www.fsf.org.uk/ground-guide/stadiums/wrexham/racecourse-ground/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100331231309/http://www.bcfc.com/staticFiles/77/42/0%2C%2C10412~148087%2C00.pdf to http://www.bcfc.com/staticFiles/77/42/0,,10412~148087,00.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100125033020/http://www.lcfc.com/page/StadiumHistory/0%2C%2C10274~432446%2C00.html to http://www.lcfc.com/page/StadiumHistory/0,,10274~432446,00.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110930221107/http://www.linfieldfc.com/latestnews.asp?nid=3515 to http://www.linfieldfc.com/latestnews.asp?nid=3515
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090210193006/http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0500liverpoolfc/0100news/tm_objectid%3D17610578%26method%3Dfull%26siteid%3D50061%26headline%3Dhow-kop-tuned-in-to-glory-days-name_page.html to http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0500liverpoolfc/0100news/tm_objectid%3D17610578%26method%3Dfull%26siteid%3D50061%26headline%3Dhow-kop-tuned-in-to-glory-days-name_page.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 04:55, 20 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The table of Kops mentions the Spinnekop stand at the Dutch club De Graafschap. It was added in 2007 by an unregistered user (their sole contribution to en.wp). A cited reference does verify the existence of the Spinnekop stand at the club, but not any connection with the Spion Kop or any other Kop stand. Spinnekop is Dutch for "spider's head" and Afrikaans for "spider"; I don't think it has anything to do with "spy's lookout hill", which is the original Dutch and Afrikaans sense of spion kop. I propose to remove the Spinnekop from the table unless anyone knows why it should be kept there. Frans Fowler (talk) 15:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Done -- Frans Fowler (talk) 11:20, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spinnekop at Graafschap football club