Talk:Hajji

message: Becase of ongoing discussion I have added this page to the Wikipedia:Pages needing attention section in the Wikipedia:Pages needing attention/Religion section, under teminology Superbun (talk) 14:14, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Added to articles needing attention 

message: I'd be curious to see any documentation of this, but I always assumed that calling Iraqis (specifically) "Haji" was due to the Mighty Mighty Bosstones song by that title, referring to "the baddest mf'er in Baghdad".  I had that song on my iPod when deployed to Iraq in 2003, so the two points clicked, I assumed that was the original motivator.  The Johnny Quest theory makes some sense too.  I doubt that the slur/slang is directly connected with the Hajj, as almost no Americans servicemen would have been familiar with the term "Hajj" until the US military ran security for Mecca-bound Iraqis in the first pilgrimage following the invasion.  The term has to be somehow related to associating "Haji" as an individual's name, and either the MMB song or the Quest TV show would seem the main influencers featuring a character named "Haji"
MatthewVanitas (talk) 16:58, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It's funny people actually think it matters whether the servicemen are calling every Arab they see "Hadji" or "hajji." One title is a cliche cartoon version of a Indian prince from "Johnny Quest," and the other is an honorific title. So is it better to misrepresent all Arabs with one title or the other? Either way the American servicemen are grouping all Muslims and all things Arab under a disparaging title, and make no distinction between real human beings. Notice that the character Hadji is from India. Of course, our brave young men don't have a damn clue what the difference is.
It's not about whether one is morally better than the other. It's about factual accuracy.--Tchoutoye 01:39, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Hajji not being used by US Servicemen

message: If my grammar is not erroneous, хаджи/хаџи/hadži are plural, whereas χατζής is singular. I think English hajji covers both singular and plural. --Tēlex 18:17, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, хаджи/хаџи/hadži is not the way to say a Hajji, it's only the title (like hadzhi Nikola). The person is called a хаджия/хаџија/hadžija, plural хаджии/хаџии/хаџије/hadžije and so on. Todor→Bozhinov 18:28, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah, if you want that, the Greek equivalent would be Χατζη- (unaccented, and spelled together with the following name). Fut.Perf. ☼ 18:33, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Number 

message: While I was at Sather Air Base, everyone who wasn't part of the coalition was a hajji.  The insurgents, the barber, the launderer, the men, women, and children.  Sometimes it was a slur and sometimes it wasn't.  It just depended on the context.  I was, however, dressed down for saying it on one occasion, so some people are more sensitive about its use than others. Hughsonj (talk) 21:59, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not Just Civillians 

message: This recent edit says that the honorific is only used by "non-Arab muslims".  What does that mean?  Non-Arab means what, in this case?  Those who are not native speakers of Arabic?  Those who do not self-identify as Arab?  Those who do not come from areas that are traditionally seen as Arab?
Isn't Hajj an Arabic word?
Aren't there lots of Arab speakers who apply this term?  --  Geo Swan 17:55, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: it's not used by Arab speaker, instead Arab use Haajj حاج. Non-Arab Muslims in my edit meant Non-native-Arabic-speaking Muslims. I don't understand why my edit was deleted?. --Lanov 00:29, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I reverted your edit because I believe it to be misinformed. Your comment above demonstrates that you may be confusing the two Arabic words حج  and حجي . The former translates as 'pilgrimage', the latter as 'pilgrim'. Therefore, only the latter is applied to people. Anyone who does the Hajj is entitled to be a hajji, whether you are an ethnic Arab, an Arabic speaker or neither of these things makes no difference. — Gareth Hughes 12:00, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, I see. so it's an English word and therefore it doesn't matter if you are an Arab or not. Anyhow, and just to let you know that Arabs do not use the word  حجي . Instead, they use حاج . I'm a native speaker of Arabic and I never heared the word Hajji  before. Also, in Lisan Al-Arab, the largest and the most realible Arabic dictionary, you can't find the word "Hajji" حجي under the root H-J-J or حج . --Lanov 17:30, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Sorry, I didn't see the alif in your حاج and thought you meant حج, and that there was no term used among Arabs.  is the classical word for pilgrim, but I'm sure I've heard حجي in colloquial Arabic. The form حجي is an adjective form, and is more widespread in translation. Perhaps we need to find out more about the etymology of this word. I'm sorry if I misunderstood what you were saying. — Gareth Hughes 14:23, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Used by "non-Arab muslims"? 

message: "Haji" is certainly not slang, but a negative racial/ethnic slur. A U.S serviceman calling an Iraqi a Haji is akin to a U.S servicemen calling a Vietnamese person a "gook" or a Japanese person a "Jap". Padishah5000 16:17, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Original research is not allowed on Wikipedia. Oh, and if you called me a "Haji", I would consider it a racial slur. Padishah5000 08:42, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Its not original research; if you're talking about how servicemen and servicewomen overseas use the terminology, the user is actually a source.  And frankly, no one asked what you thought of it.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.89.149.99 (talk) 03:43, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

text: Changed "perjorative" to "comprehensive."  It is definitely used as a catch-all term for Iraqi civilians, Arabs, or Middle-Eastern peoples, although less now that a decade ago.  The word "perjorative" implies a definite negative connotation on the part of the speaker, however, and that cannot be assumed.  Although the misuse of the term for regional populations may be wrong, we still need to maintain some sort of NPOV on Wikipedia. 75.207.5.136 (talk) 03:56, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Haji Is a Racial Slur 

message: When I was in Iraq we used the tern Haji for anything local, 
Haji shop = when locals were allowed on or around bases to sell variouse items to service personell.
Going Haji = driving across the medians in divided roadways or off the normal confines of the paved road to avoid traffic, altercations, military convoys, or just generally slow people.
Haji(food name ie. burger, pizza, subway.etc) = ANY food you could get outside from the chow hall.
Haji taxi = the white vehicals with orange fenders are identified as freelance taxis all throughout Iraq.(look at the photos or news clips, you see them more than you realise)
In my group I never heard anyone using the term in a hateful or demeaning way. 
I never heard it as a slur directed at anyone as in "you sorry haji" or the like.
I think it can be taken and viewed many different ways depending on you persepyion and predisposition.
Suasponte
:Original research is not allowed on Wikipedia. Oh, and if you called me a "Haji", I would consider it a racial slur. Padishah5000 08:42, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Its not original research; if you're talking about how servicemen and servicewomen overseas use the terminology, the user is actually a source.  And frankly, no one asked what you thought of it.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.89.149.99 (talk) 03:43, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Changed "perjorative" to "comprehensive."  It is definitely used as a catch-all term for Iraqi civilians, Arabs, or Middle-Eastern peoples, although less now that a decade ago.  The word "perjorative" implies a definite negative connotation on the part of the speaker, however, and that cannot be assumed.  Although the misuse of the term for regional populations may be wrong, we still need to maintain some sort of NPOV on Wikipedia. 75.207.5.136 (talk) 03:56, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  you will hear what you want to hear

message: I am removing the line that indicates the word may not be intended as a slur because it is not sourced and it also does not comply with NPOV.  See WP:NPOV --Mherlihy (talk) 21:00, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV 

message: The part of the racial/ethnic slur needs to be removed.This is not the list of  racial & ethnic slurs, but an article that was intended to describe the honorifc title of someone who completed pilgrimage to Mecca or a muslim pilgrim.
If you want to create a seperate racial/ethnic slur wiki you can do that - but do not mix up the two.
That would be just disrespectfull and this is above gentleman's intention, I believe. I will proceed removing that vandalism and please someone protect this article - at least semiprotect. capybara capybara
[[[Special:Contributions/95.223.187.171|95.223.187.171]] (talk) 00:
19, 20 April 2010 (UTC)]
:Removed the slur once again! Hodgie is not the same as Hajji and please do not add it again to this article.It's vandalism.95.223.187.171 (talk) 14:48, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I suspect the use of Hajji is often meant as a slur just as Gook, Slop, Slophead, Slant Eyes were used about the Japanese during World War II and during the Korean War to refer to North Koreans and perhaps South Koreans and about Vietnamese during the Vietnam War.  If they don't look like us, they are often the victim of racial/ethnic slurs.  Just think about allthe ones that are used in our own country to refer to other groups who don't look like "us"--whoever "us" is that is/are speaking.Sailorguy51 (talk) 14:34, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: No, it's not vandalism. It is appropriately referenced. The fact that this is a racial slur does not mean Wikipedia is racist for documenting it. Please get your logic straight. __meco (talk) 14:49, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

text: Not to be insensitive, but no one cares what you "suspect", nor about your random rant about racism in the US. If it's not cited, it doesn't stay. Vintovka Dragunova (talk) 05:06, 9 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protection

message: I would argue that the reference to the slur should not be at the very top of the article. For example, in the article [[Yankee] its use as a slur in Latin America is not noted in the top section, but is buried farther down under "Contemporary Usage". Dan Carkner (talk) 20:51, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Still not neutral framing of topic

message: Hi
I just did a quick copyedit.
There were some descriptions removed and some words moved around in sentences.
Nothing major should have changed.
I am a little confused as to how this has become a racial slur for South-Asian People though.
I have never heard of it being usedfor that purpose, as South Asians are not really Arabic/Middle East.
It may be because it is perceived as a slur against Indians (from India btw, not the USA), but that is Hadji, with a "D" as far as I can see from my research (though somewhat limited).
The character in that case wore a turban but was a Sikh, I believe - and I would imagine some research would unfortunately lead to the term hadji/hajji being a reference to anyone wearing a turban, regardless of faith.
None of the servicemen I know use the term as a bad slur; as previously pointed out in one of the posts above, they use many other much more disagreable terms when slurring the local population or referring to Arabs, 'Middle East' Muslims and others. Chaosdruid (talk) 21:42, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Editing Dec 2016 

message: Two references have been removed because they were found to be opinion pieces in a newspaper. Wikipedia policy is clear that we are not to cite opinion as fact, and are to attribute opinions to their source. A remaining reference has been notated as receiving a 404, and as there was only one remaining reference left, a needs more citations tag was added. 24.155.244.245 (talk) 19:22, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of Reference Citations in Racial Slur Section 

message: The title is used in west Africa countries,like Nigeria 102.88.34.91 (talk) 12:01, 22 June 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Alhaji is listed among the alternate usages in the first line of the article, but if you have any other suggestions feel free to let us know. Dan Carkner (talk) 13:52, 22 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hajj to alhaji