Talk:Biffeche

message: I'm having trouble finding anything on the web for this besides Biffeche's own site.  The whole thing's odd enough that I'm very uncomfortable not having more references on this--a kingdom run by an American in Senegal that co-rules a kingdom in Ghana?  I can't find it referred to in Academic Search Premier or JSTOR either; unless somebody can post a news story or related item about this soon, I'm worried Wiki may be perpetuating someone's hoax here.  (At least two anons have posted here feeling this was the case, and sadly, been ignored, as above...)  --Dvyost 07:54, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: This goes for Bethio too.  --Dvyost 07:54, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Needs more references 

message: :Here is one published reference to the previous king.  A search of the city newpaper index in St. Louis, Mo., exhibits this obituary of the person called King Edward I of Biffeche:
:http://www.slpl.lib.mo.us/libsrc/obit98c.htm
:where he is called "H. R. H."
:"Schafer, (H.R.H.) Edward C.   6/3, (photo) #6/4"
:======================================
:The actual obituary costs a fee to download, but the first few paragraphs are free:
:: http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_action=list&p_topdoc=11
::-------------------
::EDWARD C. SCHAFER
::PR MAN, WAS MADE TRIBAL KING 
::St. Louis Post-Dispatch June 4, 1998
::Section: METRO Edition: FIVE STAR LIFT
::Page B5 Word count: 302
::ID#: 9806040417 
::memorial Mass for Edward C. Schafer, a former reporter and public relations man here who was elected king of an African tribe in the 1960s, will be celebrated at 11 a.m. today at St. Anselm Catholic Church, 530 South Mason Road, Creve Coeur. The body was cremated.
::Mr. Schafer, 75, of west St. Louis County, died April 4, 1998, of cancer at the Westview Nursing and Rehabilitation Center in West County. In 1963, Mr. Schafer became king of the African tribe of Biffeche in the Republic of
::Download the full text of this story ($2.95).
::---------------------
:This seems to be an independent, published "verifiable" reference to his kingship in the 1960's, although Biffeche is called a "tribe".  The St. Louis Post-Dispatch has been the mainstream newspaper of record in St. Louis, Mo. (since the closing of the St. Louis Globe-Democrat several years before).
67.101.68.58 06:16, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Here's one small reference 

message: Obviously this is getting into original research, but it is of background interest if any fancies investigation. A number of Senegal tourism websites mention Savoigne: such as this one - no reference to any kingdom - and this one, which mentions "Savoigne (le royaume de Bifèche)".
I also found a website for Saint Blaise Statues, a Catholic mission and factory school in Savoigne, with contact details for Père Emmanuel Zanaboni - who must be the same guy who gets the diatribe in the FAQ2 at the Kingdom of Biffeche website. Tearlach 03:30, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: More digging

message: The story on the "Befeche website" is that the king of Befeche (an African, of an ancient dynasty) was childless and willed his kingdom to an American because the American was a benefactor financially and in other ways, and that the people of this little tribe or band of people consequently regard him as their king, and lastly that he keeps a low profile (no interviews, no granting of "titles" to jokers who pay for it, no nothing). The web site also says Befeche is "a part of the Republic of Senegal" and "non-secessionist", i.e. it doesn't claim to be independent. Since there are lots of African republics that recognize traditional local "kings" and "kingdoms" within their territories, the story isn't especially implausible or unlikely. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.93.65.103 (talk • contribs) 
:I can certainly confirm that it's not a hoax, and have plenty of photographic evidence that could prove it - but no credible sources.  Still hoping to find some (I know that Biffeche has been covered in American newspapers, but I'm having trouble actually digging up any articles).  Hopefully one will turn up eventually... -Elmer Clark 01:03, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  HOAX? MAYBE, BUT IF SO IT'S A CURIOUSLY PLAUSIBLE ONE. 

message: Why is no mention of the (fabricated) 21st century Biffeche made in this article? The author of the site  has obviously gone to some length to promote his fantasy, and I believe it does deserve some mention. I know personally the man and story behind the 'modern Biffeche,' in that it is a complete fabrication and that the site is being used as an advertisment for selling royal titles (reading between the lines on the FAQ page, it doesn't take long to figure that one out). Perhaps with some clever sourcing and cross-referencing this fraudulent activity can be brought to rest, courtesy of Wikipedia editors? 24.94.113.184 18:53, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I largely agree with you. But, again, the problem is the complete lack of reliable third-party sources per WP:RS. Personal knowledge falls foul of the no original research, as does putting together all the bits and pieces and deducing. All we've got is the Kingdom of Biffeche site, which because of its exceptional claims really can't be used as a source without serious substantion (see WP:RS#Exceptional claims require exceptional sources). We've got the snippet about Edward Schaefer, and the non-fact that the Lonely Planet Micronations book says it isn't going to mention it. Can anyone find anything - newspaper, magazine, whatever - reporting in detail the current situation? You'd think such a good human interest story would be worth reporting. Tearlach 19:23, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Forgive my ignorance, but what does the "snippet about Edward Schaefer" concern? 24.94.113.184 19:59, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, I meant Schafer - the section from the St. Louis Post-Dispatch obit quoted above. Tearlach 20:01, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

text: Some statements above by 24.94.113.184 on 9 April 2007 are false.  Citations are still needed, but the original Wikipedia article's information about the modern Kingdom of Biffeche with American kings (before it was all edited out later, probably for political reasons) was factual.  The kingdom is not a "fabricated" "fantasy", and I know of no evidence that the current king Ronald I, or the previous American king of Biffeche, or the African kings before them, ever were "selling royal titles", as 24.94.113.184 specifically alleges.  If 24.94.113.184 genuinely knows the current king, as claimed, he/she should know this, and should certainly cite one example of a "sold" title before making such an accusation.  (If someone was honored with a title after building a hospital or clinic for poor Africans, that's not "selling titles".)  There was a long article about the kingdom (specifically the previous American king, Edward I of Biffeche) published in Esquire Magazine in the early 1980's showing that the first American king was already reigning in Biffeche by 1963.  I think the title was "All Hail the King of Biffeche" or something close.  All someone has to do is find and cite that reference and it will demolish claims that the kingdom is some kind of web cyber fantasy.  The royal family of Biffeche is powerful in America with estates and titles in Europe, Africa, America, etc., and is considered the richest family in the State of Missouri (possibly billionaires; see several discussions of this in the Usenet discussion group "rec.heraldry", and see the Wikipedia category Business families), so they're not likely to need to be selling any African titles to raise a few bucks.  The fact that several thousand Africans consider him their king precludes the "fantasy" allegation anyway, although some will question the propriety of ANY African people choosing an American king (as in Biffeche, Ghana and some other African countries) --- usually solely because of race.  If you merely disapprove of any American king reigning in Africa and you have no evidence of actual fraud, then it is inaccurate to call it "fraudulent"; just say you don't like it.ChoppityChop 06:03, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Oops, I was mistaken about the date of the Esquire Magazine article about the Kingdom of Biffeche; it was published in 1975, not the "early 1980's".  See the actual citation/reference below.ChoppityChop 10:55, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Modern Biffeche 

message: yetanother ref:  year 1895: encyclopaedie reference k. "bifeche" (biffeche) in senegalfluB west afrika:
"Historisch-geographische Enzyklopädie der Welt" v. 1880-1898, artikel "BIFECHE", zb. http://www.hicleones.com/Buchstabe-B.php usw. 72.179.41.223 00:18, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Does anyone have an English translation of this 1895 German encyclopedia article on Biffeche?ChoppityChop 12:02, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  1895 Encyclopedia article 

message: J. H. Sarnecki, Out of West Africa: The Strange Case of The King of Biffeche, Phi Kappa Tau Lectures, Gender Studies Program, Lawrence University, Appleton, Wisconsin, 2003.  See: ChoppityChop 19:15, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Excellent. I've e-mailed her, asking her if the text of the lecture has been published anywhere... Tearlach 19:41, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

text: ...but we'll have to wait because the autoresponder says she's currently on leave and will be out of email reach from May 3-May 10. Tearlach 21:59, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Found a 2003 reference to King of Biffeche 

message: The African Slave Trade and its Remedy  by Thomas Fowell Buxton, Esq., John Murray Publishers, London, 1840, p. 193  ChoppityChop 16:23, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  On-line 1840 Reference, Slave Raids in "Country of Biffeche" 

message: The Kingdom of Biffeche History page at http://www.kingdomofbiffeche.net/history.htm claims: "The story is that in 1963 they could not settle upon a new King at the time; instead of choosing one of their own people they asked their priest, Father VAST, for guidance. He advised them to choose the person who had helped them the most during their plight. That person was one Edward Charles Schafer."
That "Father VAST" would be the "Père Jean Vast" who was ministering at Saint-Louis, Senegal in 1963. "...au Sénégal en 1949, vicaire à la paroisse cathédrale de Saint-Louis, il fut aussi actif dans le mouvement pour la Jeunesse Ouvrière Chrétienne (JOC). Curé de la cathédrale Saint-Louis en 1964, vicaire général du diocèse de Saint-Louis en 1968. Vers 1999, il se retire à l’abbaye de Langonnet (Bretagne). Il meurt à Bréhan, le samedi 3 septembre 2005, dans sa 85ème année. Il a publié entre autres. "Saint-Louis, ville au mille visages" en 1989." Source:  -- he was also the foremost promoter of African cinema in Senegal.  I recall that his role was also covered in "All Hail the King of Biffeche", Esquire Magazine, March 1975.  Together these references are a major piece of the source-documentation puzzle in place.ChoppityChop 17:46, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Identified the Priest who suggested [[Biffeche]] make Edward their King in [[1963]] 

message: Just a note, I removed the email address from this talk page to prevent abuse.  Of course, it is still in the page's history, if you need it for some reason.  Best, Smmurphy(Talk) 05:38, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Email address

message: The third-to-last of the royal costume engravings currently listed online for sale by Grosvenor Prints of London, at http://www.grosvenorprints.com/duflos.htm#duflpeti , Lot No. 224, shows a picture of the "Petit Brak" (or "Little King" of Biffeche, then resident at Maka on the Senegal River), in his royal garb.  This portrait is a page taken from the French book:
:Deuxieme Recueil des Portraits des Homes et des Femmes Illustres de Toutes les Nations Connues, Présentés Sous le Costume de leurs Dignités...
:A Paris, Chez Duflos le jeune, rue Saint Victor, 1787.  Gravés par le Sieur Duflos le jeune.
:Portraits and costume plates, in strong contemporary colour, with gold leaf line surround. ['A.D.P.R.' (Avec Privilege Du Roi) inscribed lower right].
The Petit Brak is somewhat misleadingly labeled in the catalogue entry (and on the engraving itself) as being the "Roy de Kayor" (King of Cayor): 224. Senegal  Petit Brak, Roi de Kayor.  The costume portrait of the real king of Cayor, the Damel of Cayor, appears below it as Lot No. 226, Lartifal Saukabe. Damel et Roy de Kayor. (Click on the web picture to see a bigger rendering of him.)
The apparent reason is that in mid-18th Century the Petit Brak, although his capital was at Maka in his kingdom of Biffeche, also ruled over a territory some distance away to the south called Gangeul in the area of Bieurt, which was (and still is) southeast of Saint Louis on the mainland of Senegal (i.e., closer to Cayor), not in Biffeche, which is northeast of Saint Louis.  This latter territory of Gangeul (as opposed to Biffeche) he held as a kind of feudal vassal of the Damel of Cayor.  Although he A. was a king (in Biffeche), B. was called "Petit Brak," and C. governed at Gangeul in Bieurt as a local seigneur subordinate to the Damel of Cayor, he was not the King of Cayor.
Most of this information comes from Footnote 29 of Journal Historique et Suitte du Journal Historique (1729-1731) Documents inédits, présenté et publiés par Charles Becker et Victor Martin, Publié dans le Bulletin de l’Institut Fondamental d’Afrique Noire
Tome 39, Série B, n° 2, avril 1977, p. 223-289 , the antique map  cited on the Biffeche page, and the 1728 map at . The footnote says: (29) Gangueul et Bieurt sont situés au sud-est de St-Louis, sur la terre ferme et appartiennent au Petit Brak. Celui-ci est un dignitaire important du Waalo et réside habituellement au village de Maka (25 km environ au NNE de St-Louis,...)...  So Maka, Biffeche, the home the Petit Brak, was not in Gangeul at all, and the Petit Brak was feudatory to the Damel of Cayor with respect to his Gangeul territory, ibid, without reference to the Kingdom of Biffeche.  Apparently, Biffeche was for long periods associated with the Waalo kingdom (as Waalo's protectorate) and at many times with Bethio (probably as Bethio's superior -- see the maps cited above).  Bieurt is inscribed at the far lower right of the maps, SW of Saint Louis.  (I read that Saint Louis itself was called Ile de Bieurt starting around 1638.)
This old French collection emphasizes royal costumes rather than the people wearing them.  That may account for the fact that the 18th Century Petit Brak looks rather caucasian, even nordic, for an African king.  (That's something we're used to here...)  Something else:
:In Biffeche we wear the cap of blue and white.
:Blue and white makes us love our kings.
:And the caps keep our heads warm.
:When our old men sit and talk
:They wear the caps of Biffeche in Blue and White..
In the 18th Century picture, the colors of the Petit Brak's cap and robe are blue and white.  ChoppityChop 21:51, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[18th Century]] [[Engraving]] of the Petit [[Brak (African kings)|Brak]], or Little King, of [[Biffeche]], online 

message: Searching Google News Archive with "Waalo", I just found: 
"A Dictionary of African Mythology   Date: 2000  Author: Harold Scheub  Oxford University Press
Njaajaan Njaay Lives in a River (Wolof/Senegal) Njaajaan Njaay was the mythic founder of the Waalo kingdom.:"
:After the great flood, the children of Noah multiplied, and some settled in the area that would become the great empire of Ghana. Among them was Mbaarik Bo, who was converted to Islam by Bubakar Umar. He then followed Bubakar Umar, who moved to the west. Bubakar Umar was the father of Njaajaan Njaay, the first ruler of the Waalo empire. Bubakar, continuing his work of converting people to Islam, now lived among the Serer, and was wounded by Hamar, the leader of the Serer." (emphasis added)
Saga:
:"Later, when No [Noah] got drunk, he cursed his son Aam....
:Then later came Misrae who was the uncle of the Fula and all the Sereer and the Waalo-Waalo and the Tukolor...
:The Sereer used to be masters of Biffeche many centuries ago.
:...A crazy man was hiding in the water watching her.
:You know who he was.
:He was Njaajaan the Waalo-Waalo who was crazy in the river.
:Grandson of Umar.
:Someday he would be king of all Jolof when it still included Waalo." (emphasis added)
So, it's "Bubakar Umar was the father of Njaajaan Njaay, the first ruler of the Waalo empire." versus "Njaajaan... grandson of Umar". ChoppityChop 07:11, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Contradiction 

message: So, when will the missing Kingdom history be put in the main article properly, and the dumb references removed?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.241.126.201 (talk) 00:34, August 26, 2007 (UTC) 
:Someone should collect all the references in this discussion page and make a fully referenced main article about the kingdom including the modern kings and delete the general-Senegal-refs padding.24.153.221.241 (talk) 21:48, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  So, when will the missing Kingdom history be put in the main article properly, and the dumb references removed? 

message: The University of Missouri-St. Louis has a historical research collection called the St. Louis Mercantile Library.  http://www.umsl.edu/mercantile/  It has an archive collection of the St. Louis Globe-Democrat going back over a hundred years.  This collection has some detailed articles about Biffeche.  One article "What Ever Happened to King Edward I of Biffeche?" by Walter E. Orthwein, Staff Writer, St. Louis Globe-Democrat, April 12-13, 1975, confirms some of the main issues questioned in the Wikipedia discussions.
:King Edward I of Biffeche---otherwise Edward C. Schafer, St. Louis public relations counselor who in 1964 ascended the throne of a tiny, new West African rebel state by popular vote.
:The 52-year-old sovereign reigns by grace of the U. S. State Department without forfeiting his American citizenship.  An absentee ruler, he governs by remote control from his home in west St. Louis County.
:The self styled mail-order monarch takes his duties with the utmost seriousness.  But he has never visited his subjects...
:"They want me to come," Schafer explains. "but I figure the cost of the trip could be put to better uses, such as buying badly needed tractors and farm machinery for them."...
The article also says a King of Biffeche was expected to travel by camelback after deplaning but Edward never traveled there, the American connection started in 1963 with a visit by "Mrs. Henrietta Bulus of St. Louis," the Senegal government had "welshed on its promise" to Biffeche of farm equipment, and Edward's first subjects were of the tribe Sereer (or Sierre) who were moved there by the Senegal government and selected him as their king.  "The wisdom of the choice was demonstrated by the new king's first official act---he went to Washington to apply for foreign aid."  There are numerous other facts.
This is clear.  By now, it seems like everything about the modern Biffeche kingdom and its white American kings has been confirmed by independent published documentation authority fulfilling the Wikipedia standard.24.153.221.241 (talk) 21:23, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: P.S. The article also has a picture with caption "King Edward I" and it looks like a very normal pleasant white businessman in a light jacket and dark tie wearing black-rim glasses and his short black hair is combed straight back.24.153.221.241 (talk) 21:40, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Documentation of the modern African Kingdom of Biffeche (with white American kings!) from the year 1975 

message: http://www.thebestlinks.com/Edward_I_of_Biffeche.html via Google  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.227.152.141 (talk) 17:22, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Info on King Edward of Biffeche, w Refs: 

message: New York Times today (Jan 26, 2009, p. A8) has an agricultural article about the north part of Biffeche at the town of Ronkh.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.93.216.22 (talk) 19:16, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article in Today's NY Times 

message: The International Commission on Nobility and Royalty - ICNR has included His Majesty, King Ronald I., King of Biffeche on their list of suspicious claimants.
http://www.nobility-royalty.com/id64.htm
Beside the International Commission of Orders of Chivalry - ICOC, the ICNR is the only international non-governmental association whose opinion is requested and respected by government institutions and Royal Houses. About the Sultan (talk) 13:28, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Suspicious Claimants 

message: This short reference currently (mid-2010) shows up on Google Books using search word "Biffeche"  It is a survey of various American radio talk shows at the time, and it mentions the radio show of King Edward of Biffeche, in St. Louis, Missouri, U.S.A., in the early 1990's, including his kingship of Biffeche.  This seems to be a completely independent historical confirmation, though the content is slight:
"A series of events beginning with a donated tractor gave him the official title of king of the tiny nation of Biffeche but he prefers holding court with his listeners.  As producer of the issue-oriented program "Metro Report", many of the topics discussed are also aired in his Monday evening Party Line segments."
Page 197 of Talk shows and hosts on radio: a directory including show titles and formats, biographical information on hosts, and topic/subject index, Anne M. Brewer, Whitefoord Press, 1995, 295 pages.
Apparently King Edward I of Biffeche (Edward Schafer) was the host of several radio shows in America.
24.173.73.210 (talk) 21:03, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  1995 Reference Confirms King Edward of Biffeche (previous American king) Story 

message: There are currently-on-line 1976 and 1987 newspaper stories about the previous American king of Biffeche: 
1. "African King Rules from St. Louis Home" in The Port Arthur News, Port Arthur, Texas,Page 31, March 10, 1976: http://www.newspapers.com/newspage/30141900/
2."Edward Schafer:  African King savors royal life in west county" West Citizen Journal (St. Louis. Mo.), July 29, 1987: http://www.tjresler.com/african-king.html
Edward I of Biffeche (deceased)  probably deserves his own Wikipedia article, since this kingship was noteworthy and unusual.
24.55.4.38 (talk) 02:44, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Published References for King Edward of Biffeche story in 1963-1987 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 8 external links on Biffeche. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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thread_title:  External links modified