Talk:NFI Group

message: While the article's tone appears quite professional compared to what I found in Millennium Transit Services#Models, the models listing looked like a jigsaw of dashes and parentheses. I did some cleaning up in Historical and Current subsections, just to make dash use in there consistent and user-friendly in terms of legibility.
Most of this is a good part from my own point of view and a good part from the Dash article.
*I didn't touch on bus models, as they use the hyphen-minus anyway;
*Years in the form of "from xxxx to xxxx" and "xxxx to present" look like this: 1968–1974 and "1996–present";
*Years in the form of "from late 1980s to mid 1990s" are given an unspaced em dash: "late 1980s—mid 1990s", since the from and to statements are not mere numbers, but contain two (or more) word constructs (I don't mind if someone disputes this statement in favour of an en dash);
*Parenthetical statements, such as "F40LF — Fuel Cell (Hydrogen) Test Buses (1996)" are separated with a spaced em dash. While indeed in American English usage, spaced em dashes are not used, I still feel it is warranted in here, so as to separate bus model numbers from the rest of the text and not make it appear as part of the model number itself;
*For consistency in sections with the above point, parenthetical statements are also separated with a spaced em dash.
Despite my own cleanups, there is still an overabundance of parentheses.
-Mardus 01:05, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Models 

message: I've removed the client list from the article on the basis that it doesn't add anything to the article.  It can be easily summed up as "Yeah, they've had a lot of customers."  My thought is that if the client is notable in relation to the topic then fine (like the 870 frame fiasco for Flxible).  Otherwise, it's not particularly notable and makes the article unnecessarily long.  SchuminWeb (Talk) 10:45, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed client list 

message: Who ever said that OC Transpo owns the DE40i is wrong, I should know, I live in Ottawa. So I fixed it. 99.245.254.34 (talk) 01:58, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Invero 

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thread_title: File:New Flyer Buses Effective from 2012.JPG Nominated for speedy Deletion

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: although most people would rub it off, I thought I should point out that Long Beach Transit is the only operator of the GE40LFA.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by EditorTheInvertedFan (talk • contribs) 05:58, 20 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  The NFI GE40LFA  

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified (February 2018) 

message: All, couple things:
1) New Flyer Industries Inc. (the parent company of New Flyer transit buses, MCI motor coaches, ARBOC low-floor cutaway buses, and NFI Parts - visually shown here: https://www.nfigroup.com/) had its name formally changed in May 2018 to NFI Group Inc. - can we please rename the page to NFI Group Inc. to reflect that? 
2) Logo: the logo shown is incorrect. NFI Group has its own logo, and further, the New Flyer transit bus logo has since been updated and the one shown is no longer used. I can provide the logo - can someone update if I do?
3) Website: FYI only - the NFI Group Inc. site (https://www.nfigroup.com/) will be further built out and launched shortly. It will contain all corporate history, all subsidiary information, investor relations content, aggregate news/press releases (from New Flyer, MCI, ARBOC, and NFI Parts), and aggregate career postings. Much of this will move over from newflyer.com (given New Flyer represents the transit bus brand only).  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lcnorris (talk • contribs) 13:13, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Logo & Header 

message: # the market share has shifted since the cited (and entirely unsupported) 2016 numbers. NFI is now a near-monopoly, with minuscule competition from Gillig Corporation and Canada's Orion International and Nova Bus.
# hype content: parroting of decade-old "top employer" accolades without noting this applies to office work (corporate, sales, engineering) not anything mechanical (i.e. most NFI jobs), and only to Canada rather than the United States (i.e. most NFI jobs). Is it still "top" or is this stuff now fancruft?
# without any clear ties to the article proper, the Bus models section is only a gratuitous list, and ought to be deleted. Anyone who loves it can bury it in List of buses.
# there could be a See also section for such articles as New Flyer Low Floor, New Flyer Xcelsior, New Flyer Invero, and Alexander Dennis Enviro200 (the NFI "MiDi" model, fwiw).
# as repeatedly brought up (and derailed) previously on this Talk page, there really needs to be much effort put into differentiating NFI Group (the multi-company owner or holding corporation or investor group or WTF it calls itself) from the actual transit-bus-building part, colloquially New Flyer of America (NFA). For example, NFI's bus-parts business functions independently from the assembly lines. Without that demarcation, the article freely swings from talking corporatese to talking bus-making (the core revenue stream and the primary brand image).
# it strikes me as strange that there's no examples of the New Flyer "wing" logo seen daily by millions of commuters and pedestrians.
# is New Flyer at any point differentiated from cartage company NFI Industries?
# New Flyer's Toronto Exchange ticker symbol is NFI.UN
# that Market Beat article is in multiple ways superior to NFI Group Inc. and ought to provide a model for revision.
# throughout the present article are perhaps a hundred examples of semiliteracy, not least being questionable understanding of basic English punctuation.
# New Flyer doesn't have a history so much as an evolution. Been awhile since I read the official company bio, but a couple dozen (at least) small regional manufacturers were accreted in the '50s and '60s (some themselves agglomerations), whether near-bankruptcy acquisition or strategic partnership. The present article is heavily slanted toward making the subsequent waves of ownership sound like geniuses for simply recognizing profit potential.
# a potentially interesting side-trip for an encyclopedic article would be the effects of unionization and the 1982 Buy America Act (which specifically "deals with purchases related to rail or road transportation") — it's common knowledge in western Minnesota, but I can't find formal sources so realize it'd presently qualify as synthesis. The Crookston plant started out 35 miles away, in Grand Forks in the late 1980s. But as North Dakota is a "right-to-work" (anti-union, that is) state, some major bus buyers such as New York City and Los Angeles avoided New Flyer, and BAA blocked NFI from simply selling them Winnipeg-made buses, so the operation was entirely moved to Minnesota. (Ironically enough, NFI's Jamestown NY component production plant isn't unionized.) The Anniston plant took advantage of a preexisting campus, but a major draw was Alabama's RTW; coupled with massive unemployment in the region, wages can be kept minimal and few workers are at all vital (98% of jobs considered semi- or unskilled labor). The Crookston and Saint Cloud plants are represented by the Communication Workers of America because no other union would take on such a small workforce (officially 325 and 750 respectively), specifically Local 7304. Despite recurrent anti-union rumblings from NFI, loss of the Minnesota union would significantly undercut sales.
For starters.Weeb Dingle (talk) 20:44, 3 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I've blanked the entire Bus models section. Anyone who misses it should comment here.Weeb Dingle (talk) 16:26, 24 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  cleanup/fixup: suggestions 

message: Hi all,
Full transparency: I work for New Flyer. 
Wanted to give a heads up on a few factual changes to NFI Group references on the page: in short, NFI Group Inc ("NFI") is now the parent company of multiple entities, including New Flyer, MCI, ARBOC, NFI Parts, and Alexander Dennis (the latter of which was acquired in May - details @ https://www.nfigroup.com/2019/05/28/nfi-group-inc-announces-acquisition-of-alexander-dennis-limited/). With the acquisition, NFI grew overnight from 6,000 people to just under 9,000 people, and from operating in 2 countries to operating in 10 (Canada, US, UK, Germany, Ireland, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong, Mexico, New Zealand).
The page currently references New Flyer ownership but does not mention/make clear the ownership of other subsidiaries. Can you please integrate updates into the page so it's current? Below is the statement normally found in our press release "boilerplates" (obviously do not expect this verbiage to carry over, as it's likely too corporate for the Wiki page):
About NFI 
With over 8,900 team members operating from more than 50 facilities across ten countries, NFI is a leading independent global bus manufacturer providing a comprehensive suite of mass transportation solutions under brands: New Flyer® (heavy-duty transit buses), Alexander Dennis Limited (single and double-deck buses), Plaxton (motor coaches), MCI® (motor coaches), ARBOC® (low-floor cutaway and medium-duty buses), and NFI Parts™. NFI buses and motor coaches incorporate the widest range of drive systems available including: clean diesel, natural gas, diesel-electric hybrid, and zero-emission electric (trolley, battery, and fuel cell). It also supports infrastructure development through New Flyer Infrastructure Solutions™, a service dedicated to providing safe and reliable charging and mobility solutions.  In total, NFI now supports over 105,000 buses and coaches currently in service around the world. For the fiscal year ended December 30, 2018, NFI posted revenues of US$2.5 billion. NFI common shares are traded on the Toronto Stock Exchange under the symbol NFI. News and information are available at www.nfigroup.com, www.newflyer.com, www.mcicoach.com, www.arbocsv.com, www.alexander-dennis.com, and www.nfi.parts. 
Thanks,
L  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lcnorris (talk • contribs) 19:40, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  NFI Group - Corporate Reference Updates 

message: This article is too much of a hassle. So I propose to split this article into New Flyer Industries for buses and models and the NFI Group will remain as a corporate entity itself. --69.157.127.100 (talk) 21:26, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I think what might solve that (though I don't think this article does represent much of a hassle) is a separate item about the products. Remove them from this article there is not much left. For example see Wolseley Motors and List of Wolseley automobiles. Maybe current product(s) sat stay in this article. Just a thought. Eddaido (talk) 22:15, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:  Strongly support the split, but provided that we move the bus models into a separate article/sub-page. Perhaps that's what  suggested above? Doug Mehus (talk) 00:25, 11 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, that's what I meant, a separate list article about all those bus models. Have a look at the examples I suggest.  Eddaido (talk) 01:02, 11 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: , Ah, yeah, that makes sense. Proposed post-split article title should be List of New Flyer bus models, unless it includes those models of its subsidiaries (i.e., ARBOC and Alexander Dennis), then I'd go with List of NFI Group bus models. Doug Mehus (talk) 01:32, 11 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Disagree overall. Agreed, the fanboy data ought to be removed, but if anywhere it should be stuffed into the extant List of buses, where the infinitesimally few users who feel the need can easily use their browsers' Search function. Some mention could be made here as to their current production models, but W'pedia is not a repository for extended wankery that, if anyone actually cared about such ephemera, would already exist elsewhere.Weeb Dingle (talk) 02:28, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Split into New Flyer Industries