Talk:James and Lily Potter/Archive 1

message: the biggest question has to be- why did voldemort ask her to stand aside?
:Moved from the article. Speculation and discussion are better suited to the discussion page --billlund 03:08, August 24, 2005 (UTC)
Lily must have some sort of relationship with lord v. Could they have been friends? Although in book 6 dumbledore says that v never wanted any friends. maybe they are related?
Voldy would very much liked to have Lilly on his side, no doubt. Being blind to love, he may have considered it possible to seduce her to the dark side once James and Harry were gone. Slughorn says that everyone who met Lilly liked her. Alternatively, perhaps he was willing to spare her on Snape's pleading.  ---Ransom
:For more discussion on Rowling's thoughts about this, see  (do a text search for "Lily"). It's very fascinating, but if you want a wide audience to discuss this, you'll probably get more out of posting on a fan forum instead of in here. --Deathphoenix 14:50, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I personally would need more evidence to believe that there's some significance to Voldy having asked Lily to step aside rather than having just killed her from the get-go.  My guess is that, being so fixated on his goal of killing Harry, he'd succumbed to tunnel-vision. I'm definitely going to check out that link phoenix just posted, though.--Icarus 14:59, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  Personally, IMO, Voldemort, being fixated on killing Harry, would have killed anyone in his way without asking. It'd be more work to ask her to stand aside than to just kill here. --Prosfilaes 01:17, 1 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: We don't know how magic works, maybe it's hard work, all this magical killing.Sandpiper 06:12, 1 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Discussion on Lily's sacrifice to save Harry 

message: Shouldn't this article be split? James and Lily have very different backstories and personalities. We actually know very little about the time they were married, most of our information is from their Hogwarts days (especially for James).
I agree. I would have expected an article for each of the two characters and was rather surprised to find only one. To me, this way it looks like they are "only" important as a married couple and Harry's parents, and not as characters of their own. Eisblume 12:11, 2 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think there should be two seperate articles for James and Lily, there is not enough noteable information on each to make split articles. I also think that they are "only" important as a married couple and as Harry's parents. That may change in book 7, I do seem to remember JK saying that their professions and what they did after Hogwarts will be touched upon but who knows but JK herself if it is really important, or if she is just throwing in a little backstory to keep us fans happy. KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 02:17, 5 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Splitting article 

message: Besides that point, Lily and Snape friends? From what I've picked up from the books is that Snape had very few friends and the ones he did have were all in Slytherin and became Death Eaters. In fact when Lily defends Snape in the memory (Snapes Worst Memory), he calls her a mud blood, and says I don't need your help. At least something along those lines. Not to be crude but if I called someone, "nigger", "spic", or "cracker" I don't think we'd be friends. (I'm assuming that mud blood is like those terms) KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 02:17, 5 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I havn't found it, but there is a quote about Lily making friends with even the most unlikely people, in fact particularly with people others did not like. She is rather taken aback by the insult above, which could mean anything... but would still be consistent with her surprise at being insulted by a friend. Mostly, there is the problem of how Snape is the HBP and has that book, but Lily being the one brilliant at potions (not him). So the mystery is how he came to have the information: from a friend? cheating in class? The really interesting question is whether Snape, like everyone else, was in love with her and this ruled the whole of the rest of his life. Sandpiper 13:10, 8 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Those are great points, but if Snape and Lily were friends, don't you think she would have known that James was still cursing Snape every chance he got? "She started going out with him in seventh year," said Lupin. "Once James deflated his head a bit," said Sirius. "And stopped hexing people just for the fun of it," said Lupin. "Even Snape?" said Harry. "Snape was a special case. I mean, he never lost an opportunity to curse James, so you couldn't expect James to take that lying down, could you?" "And my Mum was okay with that?" "She didn't know much about it to tell you the truth, I mean James didn't take him on dates with her and jinx him in front of her, did he?" (Page 671 American Scholastic Edition, order of the phoenix, p591 uk) My point is if Snape was in love with her and a friend of her's and he hated James don't you think he would have been telling Lily all of that, to get them to break up. So he try and be with her and because he hated James? Break them up just to spite James? LOL this is what I love about these books there is so much to look at and to think about. And only JK knows what the truth is. KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 05:10, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think you have the chronology wrong. The scene where Lily defends Snape is from their 5th year. They have advanced potions together in their 6th year, the stuff Harry has just been getting tips on, and she finally gets together with james only in their seventh year. So from the point of view of the backstory for HBP and its mirror when Snape and Lily were in the same year, Lily is still not interested in James. If you take the 5th year scene at absolutely face value, snape swears at Lily, suggesting he hates her too. So, obviously, no relationship. But alternatively he is so upset because he has been made a fool in front of her and lashes out at everyone when he imagines it all going pearshaped. If that is the case, then it seems quite possible he would not want to keep telling her every time James made a fool of him again. From the other side, Lily getting sweet on James would certainly give him a motive to keep up the vendetta in 7th year, when probably Lily would not be listening to him anyway. But we have the 6th year clear when they were busy spooning in potions class. We know Lily goes off with James, but what happened before that, and in particular what did Snape think might happen. At least at the start of year 6, she and Snape had similar opinions of James and everyone knew his likeing for cursing people. Sandpiper 03:33, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Just because Lily and Snape shared a 6th year class in potions doesn't give any valid indication that they could have been friends. Harry and Draco share a 6th year potions class too and they hate each other. In fact Harry, Ron, and Hermione all share that class with Draco. I'm not saying that it's impossible for Snape and Lily to have been friends at one point. I'm just saying it's highly improbable. Who knows when Lily starts getting "sweet" on James. There are not any indication that she only started in 7th year. In "OotP" Lupin just says they started going out in 7th year. They could have been becoming friends during thier 6th year. KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 23:54, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

text: This argument has gone in circles, a bit. The reason for supposing some connection between Snape and Lily is the potions book, apparently property of Snape, and the repeated insistance by Slughorn that Lily was the one brilliant at potions. Hence, how the information got from her to him. Like Harry, he seems to have been taking lessons from someone other than Slughorn. Then there are the comments about her character, making friends with anyone and being admired by everyone, and her apparent sympathy for Snape. I quite agree, nothing explicit is stated, but the circumstantial evidence is there. Mostly, JKR writes detective books. She could wholly dismiss this in book 7, and write it off as just amusing background. But that is not her style. She follows up on clues. a relationship with Lily explains Snape's whole life. Sandpiper 19:36, 11 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Slughorn does say that Lily is great at potions. But his insistance is that Harry is better at potions than Snape was. He does not ever state that Lily was. He does however state that Lily was rather good at potions and that thats where Harry gets it from. BUT AGAIN SLUGHORN NEVER ONCE SAID THAT LILY WAS BETTER THAN SNAPE AT POTIONS Book 6 also states strong speculation from Harry that he thinks, the "Half-blood Prince" made some of those curses up himself. You really think it's at all possible that Lily would help invent, or invent spells like Levicorpus, Sectumsempra, and Muffliato. All of that seems very unlikly to me. :-D KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 23:46, 11 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, I try to follow what is actually said in the books. What it says is that Lily is fantastic at potions, and Snape is fantastic at curses (or whatever, but 'dark' magic). So the obvious conclusion is that snape wrote the spells, and lily wrote the potions tips. The thing is that both have ended up in the same book, and the book, at least at one point, belonged to Snape. Also, the spells were created well before the time that this particular book was being used in class. If Snape simply created everything in the book, then he would have to have been fantastic in class at potions, but Slughorn never mentions him.  I can believe Snape taught Lily curses, and she taught him potions. Slughorn commented on how cheeky Lily was, and that she ought to have been a Slytherin. Yes, I can believe she was interested in improving her curses. Sandpiper 20:24, 12 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Thats a fair point but the writting seems to be all the same. Harry never says hey you know what? these potions tips and these spells look like they have different hand writting. Besides Harry uses a potion tip to save rons life...REMEMBER.....Just shove a bezor down thier throats that doesn't sound like a potion tip Lily would have made. :-D KnowledgeOfSelf | talk. 21:46, 12 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, I wouldn't agree with that, she is described as cheeky and instinctive. Not as being good at analysis and theory. So, sod the analysis and just stuff a bezoar down his throat, because it would work. The tips are about what works. I agree, the handwriting is described as small and crabbed, just like Snapes. But as yet we do not have a description of her writing, and we still have the odd circumstances of why Snape would still be working on these spells so long after releasing them through the school. In some ways it makes more sense if it was Lily who did all the writing. 81.7.59.24 16:15, 13 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Snape and Lily friends 

message: Hi. I have added the links to the respective Norwegian articles at the bottom, in <>. Hope someone can come up with how to link them, since there are two separate ones. - Helga76 20:00, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Links to Norwegian articles 

message: Anyone know where the information on this historical character better belongs. Is there enough info on him for an article or a mention somewhere more suitable? Sensible to have a redirect or disambiguation, but not really sensible to have a bio of him here Sandpiper 09:13, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I've never heard of him, but there are several hit for his name in a google search. One of the sites that mention him is a government website. --¿ WhyBeNormal ? 20:41, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  US general James Potter (deceased)