Talk:Square and Compasses

message: We should probably add something about other groups who use or used the S&C such as the formewr United American Mechanics whose items are often seen on places like ebay mis-lableled as Masonic. I also once met a German tourist who was wearing a shirt with an S&C, a hammer and a saw. I inquired if he was a Mason. He informed me it was the logo of a German carpenters union.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.100.229.69 (talk) 15:08, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Other Uses

message: I was corrected on this recently myself - it's not a "compass" but rather "compasses".  Shall we change the title? MSJapan 16:03, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll just move it, and everything will update accordingly. MSJapan 16:56, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Scratch that, as there's article space there already.  I'll ask an admin to move it. MSJapan 16:59, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

text: OK... to clarify... HalFonts has it backwards.... the plural (compasses) is an archaic usage that is (in the modern world) unique to Freemasonry... however, since this article is about the Masonic symbol (and not about the actual tool in a non-masonic context), the plural form is actually correct in this article.  We would use the singular (compass) in an article that is not related to Freemasonry... but should continue to use the plural here. Blueboar (talk) 16:20, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Move?

message: The reference cited doesn't say anything like what's in the article.  Can we get some better sources for this? There's a lot more stuff out there on the S&C, but we need non-anecdotal and cited sources. MSJapan 16:03, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll get some other sources.  Jokerst44 16:26, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: OR?

message: I have cut a lot of the speculation on the meaning behind the S&C... it was unreferenced, and thus amounted to Original Research.  I have replaced that material with a few lines taken from the main Freemasonry page. There is still a lot of work to be done on this article.  Blueboar 17:12, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Material removed and added 

message: Please provide the angle of the compass, does the angle have any importance?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.122.95.211 (talk) 17:37, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The angle of the compasses does not have any significance or importance.  Blueboar (talk) 18:14, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: This link: Value of the Angle of the Compasses, on the BC and Yukon grand lodge website may be useful to this discussion.  These angles are often proscribed, but it appears to me to be more a matter of trademark accuracy than some deeper meaning. Jax MN (talk) 16:43, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Jax... I Get a "404 - File not found" error for that link.  Blueboar (talk) 20:24, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I tried adding a www to the link, buy that didn't work either yet, searching the BBY site for "angle" shows either, page fine. Odd.  Jax MN (talk) 21:13, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah... I think I found the problem...  you added a down slash ("|") between "html" and "Symbolic".  here is the link without it. Blueboar (talk) 23:37, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: (I just double checked and my link does work) Blueboar (talk) 23:41, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: angle

message: A few days ago, I 'accidentally' came across a Youtube video about Rastafari & Freemasonry that stated something about the Masons' square & compass that I hadn't heard before. Last night I confronted a 32 Degree Mason friend of mine at work with, "I read on an Internet post that the Masonic logo of the square & compass is so important to Masons because these were the tools of Jesus the Carpenter. Is that true?" "Of course! Why else would they be so obsessed with those tools? Because they were the tools of a carpenter - because they were Jesus' tools." Confirmation. 
- Brad Watson, Miami 71.196.121.70 (talk) 15:55, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmmm... I think you should seek a second opinion. Youtube is hardly a reliable source, and I am not sure if the fellow you talked to was being serious? (Most 32nd degree Masons would say "we" not "they" if they were being serious, and they would not use words like "obsessed").  Also... a 32nd degree Mason would know that the S&C are stonemasons' tools... not carpenters tools. Blueboar (talk) 18:42, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

text: "I was told by a 32nd Degree Mason" isn't a reliable source either.  Please read Wikipedia's policies... start with WP:Verifiability and WP:Reliable sources.  They will tell you the type of sourcing that is needed.  Blueboar (talk) 12:32, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Square & Compass were tools of Jesus the Carpenter 

message: I added the following...
Thus, Freemasonry combines the belief in the unity of God and the study of science. (ref: Secrets of Founding Fathers, History Channel, [2009?]) - Brad Watson, Miami 71.196.11.183 (talk) 04:05, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Which might be appropriate in the main article on Freemasonry, but really has little to do with the S&C. Blueboar (talk) 12:34, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  The unity of God and the study of science 

message: OK... I will give Tony some credit... he has at least tried to give us a source (his latest was this), and I thank him for trying.  Unfortunately what he comes up with does not qualify as reliable.  Tony... If you have not already done so, please read our guideline on Identifying reliable sources.  It explains what type of sources are acceptable on Wikipedia, and what to avoid.  You may also want to read our policy on Undue weight... we don't include fringe opinions if doing so would give them undue weight.  Blueboar (talk) 13:05, 12 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Yea, I gotta agree with Blueboar on this one. the citation Tony listed is not reliable. Additionally, the point you are trying to add to the article is not neutral. Eric Cable  |  Talk  17:26, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The Globalresearch link also has several factual errors on what is really basic information. MSJapan (talk) 19:03, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The Global Research link doesn't mention compasses or dividers, the other reference is a graphic on a blog with a recipe for an emetic. Am I missing something? Fiddlersmouth (talk) 21:40, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Sources