Talk:Rural purge

message: This entire article reads like a complaint.
173.228.44.72 (talk) 05:21, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Flagged for POV 

message: In the interest of accuracy, this article should mention that most of the cancelled shows had declined in popularity and were not in the Nielsen top thirty at the time of their cancellations.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.143.202.206 (talk) 21:09, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ratings 

message: I realise it can be difficult to find references for an event that happened 40 years ago, but this article needs them to demonstrate that this is, in fact, a notable term. As it is, the article appears to consist mostly of original research. Robofish (talk) 00:29, 22 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I doubt that it's a standarnd term.  I'm surprised at this article.  I think some of it is wrong and it doesn't well support its title.  Zaslav (talk) 23:00, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is this a widely-used term? 

message: As of October 23, 2010, this article lists 'The Beverly Hillbillies' as being 33rd in the ratings for the 1970-71 season. When you check the citation listed, you find a list of the top 30 shows of that season. You do NOT find a list that extends beyond that. Thus, there's still no evidence provided to demonstrate that 'The Beverly Hillbillies' was 33rd that year.
I'm not trying to be a jerk about this. I'd love to know the show's rating for that year. If someone has the proof, please, post it.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.131.142.97 (talk) 05:38, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree, and have deleted that passage. While I don't doubt that 'The Beverly Hillbillies' was #33, or that the person who wrote that knows it, the citation doesn't support it. The paragraph already says that it and 'Green Acres' were out of the top 30, and the citation supports that. It's not necessary to mention 'The Beverly Hillbillies' again while not mentioning 'Green Acres' again. Richard K. Carson (talk) 06:37, 22 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  'Beverly Hillbillies' Reference Unsupported 

message: As the article's intro states, the "rural purge" was about TV shows (many but not all with rural theme) being canceled not because of low ratings but because they where seen as having too old of a demographic. As such, many of the examples listed in the article do not count as part of the "rural purge" as they got the ax for  low ratings, even if they might have had a rural theme or are older demographic. The examples should only include shows axed despite being popular except with older less desirable demographic. I've removed a number of shows from the list that had poor ratings at the time they were canceled and thus don't qualify as victims of the rural purge. I think all the others I kept do qualify for being on the list. I removed the example clean-up tag since I believe the problem has been properly addressed. --Cab88 (talk) 22:04, 10 September 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleaning up the list of purged shows 

message: . . (This is wrong on many levels. It was never called "The Rural Purge."  Did you make that up?  The de-ruralization was a CBS event in 1971, which fell under a larger umbrella. The broader picture demonstrates an initial decision to reduce dependence on shows which skewed toward older viewers.  Thus, Red Skelton, Jackie Gleason, and Lawrence Welk. Also, it should be noted that this was the first years of the concept of demographics, and  A.C. Nielsen ratings had not devised a real means for gathering demographic data, so it was "hit and miss" guessing strategy by the networks. 
It should be noted the most of the shows listed below were canceled due to overall low ratings.  The "Rural Purge" as coined here was equally about older viewers, or as better stated, non-urban viewers.  That was the ultimate goal in 1970-1971. And the entire event was mostly due to the change in broadcast laws, as stated by one of the writers of this page. Approximately 14 shows had to leave the schedule since the networks lost so many hours to local affiliates.  There were a handful of shows that still had high ratings, such as Mayberry R.F.D. and Hee Haw, but that was not the norm. Many had dipped to levels normal for cancellation. Certainly, these shows were not "replaced" by Maude or The Jefferson's. 14 1/2 hours of programmable blocks literally vanished. No shows replaced those canceled, as the broadcast time did not exist any longer. Television had always had a history of programming youthful, urban oriented shows.
The "PURGE" did not continue through the 70's, as indicated below, but as less profitable, shows fell in the ratings, they were eventually canceled. Long running shows are more expensive to produce. 
And, Here's Lucy was not canceled by networks, but by Lucille Ball.  She had wanted to leave after season 5, but CBS persuaded her to do one more year.  It was known all season long that the show was in its final season. Most of the shows canceled had lived long runs, some even record breaking.  Calling it "the rural purge" suggests a more menacing tactic and a prejudice toward rural America. It was simply dollars and cents, the sudden loss of broadcast hours, and the need for networks to drop less profitable shows. 
The "fish out of water" era was fading, and Bewitched, I Dream of Jeannie and a host of fantasy themed shows fell into this category and were naturally ending their runs too. 
Sorry, I intended this to be a private note to the authors, as this article feels meandering and agenda driven, and in the process loses a valid point of view... but the tricky html code has failed me)..  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.168.191.157 (talk) 20:02, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: . Weird long diatribe that was situated in the middle of the article for no reason 

message: Was there any criticism of the network for doing this? It would seems like there would be.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.24.165.50 (talk) 00:12, 2 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Criticism  

message: Personally, I think this so-called "Rural Purge" article is choppy and lacks a lot of needed, or simply wanted, information. It is very clear that the majority of the shows cancelled were sitcoms with rural themes, but is it not true that dramas with declining ratings and older demographic ratings were axed as well? Shows with long runs, coped with dropping viewership and diminishing creativity were cancelled as well. For example, Petticoat Junction had indeed been loosing viewers for many years, but according to other sites, the series still placed in the Nielsen Top 35 in 1970, which, in my opinion, was still a show with respectable ratings. I have read on numerous sites (not just Wikipedia) that The Beverly Hillbillies and Green Acres placed 33rd and 34th, respectively, in the spring of 1971. I have often doubted that the phrase "Rural Purge" was ever really used; it has, more than likely, evolved over time. I think ratings (that can be found) she be included for all of these shows. This should be, because readers could know where each show placed in the ratings when it was cancelled. I have also read that in the late sixties and early seventies, the TV landscape was rapidly changing. Newer generations were no longer interested in the shows of the past. Sitcoms like Petticoat Junction, Beverly Hillbillies, Green Acres, Andy Griffith Show, and Gomer Poyle, USMC (so on and so forth) were not new to them, and that is why they did not watch them. Westerns were declining as well: Gunsmoke had been losing viewers for years, just like Bonanza and The Big Valley. Even the zanier and outlandish sitcoms like Bewitched and Here's Lucy were regarded as a passé by the average American viewer. Most of these shows are now regarded as some of TV's classics, but still their popularity had dropped, owing to the end of their initial network runs. More shows that were cancelled, but excluding rural themes, should be discussed. Variety shows, I believe had also dropped in recognition; and even though popular variety shows came in the future (Sonny & Cher and Donny & Marie), the genre had lost much of its core audience. Overall, I believe this article should be expanded, fuller detailed, and better organized through out. This article is not bad, it just needs to be more in depth.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by ClassiCoEditor97 (talk • contribs) 01:24, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is there more information out there?  

message: This article's Background section starts with "Starting with The Real McCoys, a 1957 ABC program, U.S. television had undergone a "rural revolution", a shift towards situation comedies featuring "naïve but noble 'rubes' from deep in the American heartland".[1] CBS was the network most associated with the trend...." Well, where's the Wiki article about the "rural revolution"??? (I know nothing about that subject, so I won't start the Wiki article.)
Phantom in ca (talk) 19:08, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Where's the Wiki page for "Rural Revolution (in TV)"? 

message: I think it important to note that at the time Petticoat Junction was cancelled in 1970, the ratings had been in a steady decline ever since the death of the show's star, Bea Benaderet, in late 1968. This probably had as much to do with it's cancellation as any "vendetta" against Rural Programming, if not more.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.232.239.205 (talk) 02:01, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: It may also be worth noting that PJ was almost cancelled one year earlier (the show even having something of a "farewell" episode at the time), so that its final season was already to some degree an extension beyond its "natural life". 2601:545:8202:4EA5:29E9:6C64:8DF:BCFD (talk) 23:22, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Other reasons for the cancellation of "Petticoat Junction" 

message: The Big Valley was another western that was canceled in 1969 (with definite plans of its own for continuation, such as having Sajid Khan become a supporting cast regular, after his introduction in a fourth season episode, "The Royal Road"). Should it not also be deemed a casualty of this purge? 2601:545:8202:4EA5:29E9:6C64:8DF:BCFD (talk) 23:32, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  1969: ''The Big Valley'' 

message: In addition to not being a "rural" program, (Bewitched seemed to be representative of having the suburban settings that CBS and other networks (in this case, ABC) were supposedly wanting to focus on. What is the argument for including Bewitched on this page? BookhouseBoy (talk) 03:18, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree also.  I never read about any such purge and as I tended to follow TV news I would probably have heard about it.  This is not good evidence, though.  Zaslav (talk) 23:03, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I've heard actors talk about it (mostly people upset their shows were cancelled and they were out of work), but there's certainly no encyclopedic evidence to make an article about it. If I was still an active user here I'd certainly go through the formal process of asking for this page to be deleted.Njsustain (talk) 12:36, 22 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  How does [[Bewitched]] fit into this theme? 

message: …but nevertheless an essay, which is not consonant with the purpose of Wikipedia.
The comedy shows were unusual in that four generations of my family would often sit down and enjoy them together, something none of the replacements managed. We were rural enough but hardly ignorant hillbillies or stuck in the Outer Boondocks.
The word "purge" is used entirely too much throughout, as though to hammer the concept into the reader's consciousness and "validate" it. Makes me suspect that the "rural purge" thing is not only hugely post hoc but attributable to one source, so I wouldn't be surprised at some degree of citogenesis.
There's also a LOT of "by the way" inclusions and commentaries and factoids that are not at all clearly supported by any credible source. As these have muddled here for years, I say they're fair game for outright deletion.
There's a theme running throughout that partially credits the "purge" to a chase after increased social relevance. Either that needs to be greatly reduced (if not removed entirely) or its failure clarified considering the "airheaded nostalgia" boom marked by Happy Days (1974 debut) and its spinoffs — no Korea, no Vietnam, no civil rights marches — hot on the heels of American Graffiti (1973).
The listing of "purged" shows, never strong to begin, becomes increasingly ephemeral until fetching up at a season-by-season tally that appears to have been pulled out of (to be polite) thin air.
For comparison to the "older" and "rural" demographics, I Spy ended 1968, Star Trek in 1969. Did that make them part of the "escapist"/"non-relevant" part? If so, shouldn't THAT be the focus of the article? If not, how the hell did Spock have "rural" or "older" appeal?Weeb Dingle (talk) 19:15, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree.  I think it was made up by the original writer and is an example of poor original research.  One glaring error is attributing "spy shows" to the "British invasion", a musical phenomenon, when it was actually due to the success of James Bond.  I was there at the time and everyone knew that.  I support deleting this page.  Zaslav (talk) 23:05, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm with you on that. I mean, it's an interesting thought, and would likely be fine in a book or magazine article, but it's likely synthesis to drop it here. The States had detective shows (well, just cops with better wardrobes, really; radio plays with pictures) and the Brits had spy shows, each probably reflecting how the countries dealt with postwar and Cold War issues and anxieties — which goes waaay past the article's remit. I'd say cut it.Weeb Dingle (talk) 19:51, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  an interesting essay 

message: Both Gomer Pyle and Red Skelton are listed as "the first" to be canceled. Obviously this can't be true. But it's not necessarily as simple as proving that Gomer Pyle went off the air first; maybe there's a dispute about whether Gomer Pyle even belongs in the article. So I'll leave that question to the people who understand the issue. TooManyFingers (talk) 10:19, 6 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gomer Pyle or Red Skelton? 

message: A lot of people like to interfere with articles they don't know anything about. Just because you don't know doesn't mean no one does. CNN ran a report on the purge in its series "The Sixties", and "The Seventies". PBS, and The History Channel have mentioned it in several documentaries on television. The documentaries show, and quote writers of books on the subject, interviews actors, producers, critics, and many others in the industry. "inline" doesn't mean online. The long list of citations at the end of wiki articles reflecting the demand for citations is more a reflection of the ignorance of those demanding the citations than contributing to the authority of the articles. Citations are for disputed or likely to be disputed information. Disputes should be published disputes among experts in the field the information comes from not from those too ignorant of the field to even know elementary information about the field. Or disputed because they just don't like what the information reveals, and are tasking the editor for basic information just to make it more likely the editor will give up. If you write "I don't know but..." or you demand a cite, and it is supplied then you shouldn't be involved in the article at all. Disputes shouldn't be allowed from every ignorant jack hole on the planet. That's not how real encyclopedias work. 
98.164.81.209 (talk) 17:19, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Whatever are you going on about? --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 22:31, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Networks document purge 

message: Although show titles are mentioned in the course of discussion of various topics, this article needs a list codifying exactly what shows were "purged." Reading this talk page it would seem the article once had such a list, and it would probably need some sort of citation (plus policing the list to make sure shows that were not cancelled due to the page - such as Get Smart, or Wild Wild West which was cancelled a couple years before and arguably due to violence - are not included). 23skidoo (talk) 21:35, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: The list was removed in 2020 as almost entirely unsourced. Schazjmd (talk) 21:43, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title: List of shows needed