Talk:Consolidated Commodore

message: Out of service by 1935?
Pan Am retired it's last Commodore in September 1946.
NC668 crashed on 24 August 1944 in Biscayne Bay, while operating out of Dinner Key due to taking off with locked controls.
Out of service by 1935?
Hah.Mark Lincoln 22:13, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That claim came from NASA SP-468, the original source for this article. Pan American timetables make it clear that it's completely wrong, though, and I've removed it. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 08:09, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

message: Pan Am Airways Navigation School in Miami, Florida continued to use Commodores until at least late 1942 as training aircraft. The Royal Air Force used it to train aircrews, probably for most of the war. My father (who later flew in Halifax bombers in 78 Squadron) started his training there. Between 6 July and 11 October he clocked up 51 hours 40 minutes in NC669M and NC670M (20:25 hrs at night) with various pilots.PhilJeffries (talk) 17:42, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Use during World War 2 

message: As far as reported by Popular Mechanics in the caption to the photo retrieved from the external link to Google Book, The Commodore was in service in 1930, before the Pan Am was founded, and had to be a route operated by NYRBA. Thanks for your attention.--Threecharlie (talk) 19:49, 31 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, the Commodore was definitely not in service before Pan American was founded, but it was originally built for NYRBA, whom Consolidated had a close relationship with. Pan American got the type through buying NYRBA, before the production order had been completed, and Pan American received the balance of the order. --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 16:45, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Operators 

message: The listed specifications for the Commodore were clearly incorrect (some grossly so), even though they had been cited from a published book:
:
It appears that this book was very sloppy in its fact-checking. Except for the passenger capacity, the engines, and the maximum speed, the given specifications were identical to those for the Consolidated P2Y, despite the fact that the P2Y was an improved design with more powerful engines and an additional lower stub wing and was a maritime patrol aircraft rather than an airliner. I've replaced the Commodore specs with those in the 1930 edition of Jane's, with a few values confirmed by the Commodore's type certificate data sheet. (The other values in Jane's are also apparently consistent with other sources.) --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 18:47, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Specifications were certainly incorrect, even though cited, due to low-quality source. Fixed. 

message: Ralph A. O'Neill, who founded NYRBA,in his book about that airlines makes numerous references to the use of Commodores by NYRBA. This includes flights out of Miami and Rio. He does not seem to say that there was straight through service by Commodores. It seems that some legs were flown by Sikorsky S-38s. See: A Dream of Eagles, Ralph A. O'Neill, 1973, Sanfrancisco Book Company (Houghton Mifflin), Boston .
::Regular all Commodore service was  started in Feb. 1930 using 8 Commodores flying separate sections.
 Mark Lincoln (talk) 23:00, 7 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  NYRBA use of Commodores 

message: According to the United States Civil Aircraft Register http://www.airhistory.org.uk/gy/reg_N29.html Commodore c/n 8 (NC664M) was owned by two organizations, Chamberlin AL (Chamberlin Airline?) and Miami-Key West Airways, before it went to Alaska Star Airlines. The United States Civil Aircraft Register listed NC664M to Chamberlain AL before it listed Miami-Key West Airways as the owner. As I have not been able to find evidence that either actually operated the aircraft, I did not include them as "operators" of the Commodore.
Miami-Key West Airways, Inc. was a Florida corporation active between October 4, 1934 and August 7, 1940. I have been unable to learn anything else.
Chamberlin left more footprints. There was a Chamberlain Aeronautical Corp, and a Crescent Aircraft Corp Aircraft Corp (pres: C D Chamberlin) both of Jersey City, NJ.  Crescent Aircraft was founded in 1930 and went Bankrupt in 1939. Crescent Aircraft Corp produced several airplane including the C-2 Trainer for the Chamberlain School of Aviation in 1930. The United States Civil Aircraft Register lists the "type" of those airplanes as "Chamberlain" and not "Crescent Aircraft".
Clarence Chamberlin was a WW I flyer in the Aviation Section of the Signal Corps, later a barnstormer. He also worked as a corporate pilot, a flight instructor, an air-mail pilot, and an aerial photographer. One of his businesses was to buy surplus Army planes, restore them, and then sell them. He set an endurance record, and flew a record setting Transatlantic flight which was also the first transatlantic flight to carry a passenger. He opened Chamberlin Airline which flew between New York and Boston and which failed (dates unknown). Chamberlin Airline may have been the Chamberlain AL listed on the United States Civil Aircraft Register. If so did the equipment of Chamberlin Airline include Commodore  CN664M?
During the 1930s he had a barnstorming operation, Chamberlin Flying Service Incorporated, which flew four Curtiss Condor COs which were acquired from Eastern Air Transport (later Eastern Airlines). One of them crashed on October 21, 1935. The copilot was Ruth R. Nichols which made the demise of NC-725K the first Commercial accident with a female fight crew member. Chamberlain Air Service flew it's Condors until 1937, perhaps as late as 1939. During the same period he  owned flight schools, aviation trades schools and aircraft dealerships. As a dealer in used airplanes, that the paths of Clarence Duncan Chamberlain and the Consolidated Commodore might have crossed. Chamberlain apparently sold Consolidated Commodore  CN664M to Alaska Star Airlines. How it came to be owned by Chamberlain before he sold it to Alaska Star Airlines remains a mystery.
Any information about either Miami-Key West Airways, Inc., or Chamberlain's connection to NC664M will be welcomed.
- Mark Lincoln Mark Lincoln (talk) 15:43, 15 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Few Last Mysteries  

message: Why was any mention of the New York, Rio, Buenos Aires Line purged? NYRBA was the customer for the Commodore. It is true that the last 4 were delivered to Pan Am, but . . .
I also replaced a citation using a web site for one using a book. Web citations are ephemeral. Books are not.
Mark Lincoln (talk) 22:43, 7 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  NYRBA 

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thread_title:  External links modified