Wikipedia talk:Requests for arbitration/Zeq/Proposed decision

message: Does this cover things like asking for unprotection for the 2 articles as well? Zeq has been hitting RfP pretty hard the last few days. We remove the requests after rejection but then he immediately recreates it. Thanks. I'm going to unprotect the articles but I'm guessing he'll then want them protected. --Woohookitty(cat scratches) 03:45, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: An injunction ought to allow us to unprotect the articles, otherwise it's not doing it's job. There shouldn't be any reason for the articles to be protected unless during a spate of vandalism or edit warring. This doesn't prevent him from making repeated requests, but if he continues to make requests, he's POINTing or just being disruptive, in either case take it to WP:ANI or use your admin judgment, but there's no reasonable expectation that these should ever need protection during the injunction, barring some new unrelated conflict. Dmcdevit·t 03:58, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  The last time I have requested page protection is over two weeks ago or more so not sure what is "hitting the Rfp page hard the last few days". Many things in Wiki are in the eye of the beholder. I was not making any point or being disruptive, so please : always assume good faith. Zeq 17:41, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Question on temp injunction 

message: Before you close. I urge the ArbCom to engae in discussion with the parties.
Something you did not do so far.
You have paid no attention nither to facts nor to motions. You were acrried away after Fred suggestions and for example "punished" Heptor on Palestinian Exoduse" Where he was not active and not even supportive of the tactic I took there.
My tactic there was to remove unrelevant material and one that is clear progeganda after  all  attempts (well documented in talk) for dispute resolution have failed.  Going After Fred suggestion (although he decale his anti israel bias before the case started) shows that you have not made a minimal effort to familiar yourself with the facts: Heptor was not involved in Palestinian exodus but I will not continue to confuse you with facts. 
I want to give you anther chance due to embarsmment this case may cause Wikipedia should you decide to go ahead in the direction you went so far. My suggestion: Set it aside and let's talk. Zeq 15:32, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comment by Zeq

message: :: Fred said "I am not sure which quote you refer to" so I suggest you familirieze yourself with the material Zero added (and I removed) this is the same material that zero added again (and I removed....) - you see Fred it takes  Two parties  to have a edit war (but ArbCom only "punished" the Pro-Israel side......These are the editors who support the country, which is a member of the UN but you think should't exist)- but let's move on.
::The ArbCom decision to use only schlary sources is  way beyond  what current policy state.
::This leads to 3 outcomes:
1.Many sources useed all over these articles as well as many other Palestine related articles will have to be removed. For example all the material describing palestinian suffesring in articles such as the wall israel is building in the west bank will have to be removed because it is not coming from the only type of sources you now decalre as valid.
2. You are "punishing" me and Heptor on violating a policy that did not exist when we "violated" it. If you look at the policy as it was before you made this sweeping change to it - we did not violate it.
3. Equality: Zero and others used the same type of sources (and actually Heptor has provided a scholarly source the quote Zero and Ian removed.
Fred, do yourself and the ArbCom a favor: Accept my motion to mediate the content of the articles. I have stated that will not take an active part in the actual editing of these articles (for month or forever) as long as a mediator (or grop of mediator) will work together with the parties to make the articles NPOV (according to Wikipedia own policies) .
So in a fact, you don't need to ban me or you  can  ban me, that is not the issue. The issue is to fix the articles.
Zeq 05:25, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zeq's answer and motion 

message: I am highly concerned about the proposed remedies regarding Heptor, which I find hard to justify based the available evidence. It is proposed that "Heptor is banned indefinitely from Palestinian exodus, and is placed on Wikipedia:Probation." However, Heptor made a total of 5 edits to Palestinian exodus: 
# addition of 1 sentence on the status of Palestinian refugees, 
# addition of a paragraph on the Jewish exodus from Arab lands,
# change of POV tag to POV-because tag, 
# paraphrase of a paragraph,
# minor addition of information on a historian. 
Never in the course of the edits did Heptor remove any information from the article, whether sourced or unsourced. I find it hard to believe that a user can be banned from an article for just 5 (!) edits done in good faith, most of them insignificant and none of which is a revert. Pecher Talk 15:02, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. It seems that some sort of error is taking place here. Palmiro | Talk 14:49, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

text: As written somewhere else already. I agree. User:ChrisC 21:02, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I accidently switched articles when I was writing the proposal up. Fred Bauder 21:51, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Proposed decision on Heptor

message: The proposed decision reads:
:Zeq is banned indefinitely from 1948 Arab-Israeli War and Palestinian exodus, and is placed on Wikipedia:Probation. He may be banned by any administrator for good cause from any article which he disrupts by tendentious editing. All bans and the reasons for them to be logged at Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Zeq#Log of blocks and bans.
Zeq's edits on Israeli Arab show a problem which does not readily resume itself to tendentious editing: his edits reduce the coherence of the article, both by their poor use of language and the confused layout he introduces. The fact that he makes many successive edits and repeatedly reverts aggravates the problem and drives other editors off these articles. Can the decision, whatever it may be, provide for dealing with this problem as well as the question of tendentiousness? Palmiro | Talk 18:22, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I did not look at this particular article, but it can be dealt with under the under the probation he is being put under. While I did not focus on it, Zeq has trouble with spelling and syntax and in my opinion, with logic. He is just not that good at English and at times seems irrational. That is a different problem than tendentiousness but disruptive nevertheless. Fred Bauder 21:56, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed decision on Zeq 

message: As I explained  here, I did not notice that Ian Pitchford added material I deleted. There was no mention of this material on the talk page, only a single word, "expand", in the edit summary of this edit. After I reviewed the material he added, I think it is perfectly proper information to be included in the article. However, I do think material he deleted is sourced just as well as what he added. -- Heptor  talk 22:24, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: PS: As to the text Ian Pitchford deleted, I hope  this finding of fact currently in the workshop will be looked at. -- Heptor  talk 22:57, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

text: PPS: Really, I removed this information by mistake!!!! It was two edits. And I don't even disagree with the information Ian added! Look at my last 5 edits: . I was adding information, not removing it. Look, this is just ridiculous! -- Heptor  talk 11:14, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Heptor, you are fighting facts against a biased group of people who don't even know they are biased. They never bother to look at all facts, understand the real issues or read the discussions in talk. They "cherrypick" an edit and build a case around it while ignoring similar edits from the other side. Sean, who had more intimate knowledge on the dispute suggested to ban Ian and me. He surly understood what went on more the the 8 people who call them self "ArbCom" and think that if 200 people voted for them they can do what ever they want. But it is not they who should be blamed: Mr. Wales, own this site and this bias will land on his door step at some point. Zeq 11:42, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

text:  Could I possibly get an answer here? At least a confirmation that somebody besides Zeq actually reads this? -- Heptor  talk 01:30, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Indeed, why should we ban a user indefinitely from a certain article for just two questionable edits? We don't do that even to simple vandals. I surmise that if those edits had been done by a vandal, s/he would have been warned, then warned again, and only subsequently blocked for some time. I see no reason why a good-faith editor must be treated more harshly than a vandal. Heptor made a number of positive contributions to many articles and an indefinite ban does not look justified. Pecher Talk 17:29, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: So Heptor, you claim you just made an inadvertent mistake. Fred Bauder 19:46, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Any punishment must be commensurate with the offense. Pecher Talk 22:08, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

text:  I do; on those to edits I didn't notice that Ian Pitchford added information to the article, and I do not have any objections against the material he added. The edit summaries became rather misleading and uncivilious (especially user:Zero0000 excelled  with summaries like "take out some of the trash"),  so it was hard to know what was really done without reading the text. -- Heptor  talk 00:54, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Heptor's deletion of material