Talk:Christopher Speer

message: I removed this paragaph not because it was not referenced -- something which could be fixed -- but because I thought it was editorializing.  I found it interesting, and infomratiove, but it the wikipedia is not for advocacy.  
If we can cite an authorititative source which offers the view that Khadr wasn't charged with killing a noncombatant medic because the Prosecutors know they couldn't back up tht charge, by all means we can cite that.  Otherwise...
Cheers!  Geo Swan 11:55, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  remove editorializing -- see talk 

message: I reverted a recent edit with the edit summary (→Paramedic training and status as "medic" - Clarified Geneva Convention discussion to reflect Article 25 & 41 provisions.)  No question that this material, properly cited, can be covered in the wikipedia.  But, since it states: "It is not clear from published accounts whether Sgt. Speer's mission to investigate the compound for survivors was considered to meet these criteria or whether he was wearing the required distinctive armband." -- it doesn't belong here.
Accounts of the firefight make pretty clear that the GIs do not believe anyone survived.  There is no support for the assertion that Speer was looking for survivors.
The Toronto Star article stated:
*(
An article in the National Post stated:
*(
I'm removing
"Military prosecutors and most press accounts refer to Speer as a "medic." Although Sgt. Christopher Speer had been trained as a medic, he was actually leading the squad combing the compound after they believed all occupants had been killed".
The cited source, http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/01/11/1136956242159.html?page=2, is totally silent on the subject of whether Speer was a medic or not.  If there is a source for the contention that "military prosecutors and most press accounts" are wrong in their use of "medic", that source is obviously not it.  Furthermore, the contention Speer was "leading the squad" is actively contradicted by http://www.thestar.com/News/article/208502 which states that "Delta soldiers moved in through a hole in one of the walls. The fourth in line was Silver, and just behind him was Sgt. First Class Chris Speer".  If Speer "leading the squad", why was he, an enlisted man, "behind" Mike Silver, an OFFICER?Bdell555 (talk) 14:38, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  revert -- see talk 

message: I reverted this unexplained edit, after leaving a note on the wikipedian's talk page.
It just seemed to reduce the readability and maintainibility of the text. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Geo Swan (talk • contribs) 
: Agreed. Plus,  is unnecessary with relatively few citations. –Pomte 23:51, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  revert  -- see talk 

message: The accidental release of OC-1's testimony is going to require a lot of revision of this and other related articles.
I thought I should tone down one of those revisions.  
Reasonable people can disagree as to whether the accidental release of the unredacted statement from the CIA official confirms that Khadr did not throw the grenade.
The CBC article doesn't actually take the stand that the released document confirms that Khadr did not throw the grenade.  I thought the version prior to mine needed to have this toned down.  The CBC article quoted Khadr's lawywers stating it showed he didn't throw the grenade.  It can be read as containing some broad hints that he didn't throw the grenade.  But it stops short of saying he didn't throw the grenade.  
I think some of my correspondents can guess as to which side I would take, in a private discussion.  But, in article space, we can't go beyond what our references state.  If someone found an authoritative reference that did state the new document proved Khadr didn't throw the grenade, we could include that conclusion in article space.  But, we would have to attribute that conclusion to the source -- because other authoritative sources don't go that far.
Cheers!  Geo Swan (talk) 21:52, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Confirmed?  See talk 

message: Khadr has pled guilty to the charge of murder.  Obviously, this changes this article dramatically.  I have made some edits to update the matter, as well as in the Khadr article itself.  Thank you.--Yachtsman1 (talk) 00:50, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Nowhere in your update did you state that Khadr's plea was the result of years of negotiation for Khadr to agree to a plea bargain.  I welcome an explanation as to why you excluded this important information.  Geo Swan (talk) 16:02, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: There's also the not-so-minor detail that any confession obtained by throwing a fifteen-year-old kid into an extrajudicial torture camp (which does not even respect US law, or what passes for it) and holding him for four years without trial will be unreliable. There are other discrepancies with the US version of events, such as a presumption that Khadr was the only one still alive to be able to throw the grenade (later refuted by a witness, OC-1, to indicate one other was still alive but was later killed by the Americans). A confession obtained by torture is useless as a victim will say anything just to make the abuse stop. 66.102.83.61 (talk) 12:32, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Khadr's Plea

message: This military site is at odds with later accounts:
* 
Cheers!  Geo Swan (talk) 16:35, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: This same bit of whitewashing (claiming Speer's group was randomly ambushed out of the blue instead of acknowledging that they were on the offensive, surrounding and attacking an occupied building believed to house insurgents) also appears in this source  but this is wildly inconsistent with other sources. I'm wondering if I should have even cited the source, although for some basic info such as date and place of burial it is of value. 66.102.83.61 (talk) 12:40, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  ongoing confusion over how SFC Speer died 

message: I can't find a reference for the statement that Sgt. Speer was wearing indigenous clothing when he was fatally wounded, near the beginning of the article.
Does anybody know where that information came from, or whether it's accurate?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Diane1976 (talk • contribs) 03:16, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sgt. Speer Wearing Indigenous Clothing? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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