Talk:Godzilla Junior

message: This page had too little information and no pictures. This needs pictures of Baby Godzilla from infant to adult and loads more information. This page also contains false information including Minilla being called his brother; Minilla is not in the Heisei canon. Junior did indeed die when he tried to fight Destoroyah's final form but was brought back to life by Godzilla's nuclear meltdown. Also Junior is not naive.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.105.45.88 (talk) 22:34, 24 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Needs Information

message: If I recall, Godzilla Junior was in:Godzilla 2000,Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla,Tokyo SOS,and Final Wars.I remember that proven in G-Fan.Al Destoro. (talk) 19:34, 8 April 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: No JR is not G2000 Godzilla against MG TOKYO SOS FW Godzilla FinalGoji is Grandpa 54  G2000 Kiryugoji/tokyososgoji are seperate  members of Godzilla (1954) species Monster 1954 (talk) 17:16, 21 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Continuity 

message: User:493Titanollante, please let us discuss this issue about the 1998 Baby Godzilla being included in this article. First off, let's get this out of the way, the Baby Godzilla featured in the 1998 film and its follow-up TV-series has always been registered under the title and character "Baby Godzilla" (nothing else), and although it was related to Godzilla in the 1998 film/TV-series, it was officially a separate character. This article, currently called "Godzilla Junior", includes the character-names "Baby Godzilla" and "Little Godzilla", and the Baby Godzilla returned in a different form in the 1998 film/TV-series, and thus there should be no issue. By the way, I must point out that you cannot remove content again and state that "I gave no reason for adding the content back" when you didn't even provide any reason for removing the content in the first place. You must provide a valid reason for removing content, especially if your removal of contents is challenged. I also must point out that I gave my reasons for removing or adding contents to the article. TurokSwe (talk) 08:17, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Well this article is mainly focused on Toho's Godzilla Junior from Godzilla vs. Destoroyah but it also covers it's adolescent years seen in Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla II and Godzilla vs. Spacegodzilla. Granted they are trademarked differently because of the names reflecting their age, they are still the same character. TriStar's Godzilla Junior is a different story. It honestly shouldn't be covered in this article because it isn't the correct article to tie TriStar's Godzilla Junior but rather, the Zilla article because TriStar's Junior, whether it be 1998 or the animated series, is indeed an incarnation of Zilla, not Toho's Godzilla Junior. The "Godzilla Junior" trademark you referenced shows here that the trademark is abandoned, so it really can't apply to this article; also because that same trademark you referenced is a different trademark from Toho's, that makes them separate unrelated trademarks as you can see by their designs. Additionally, TriStar's "Godzilla Junior" is just not the same character as Toho's. TriStar's Junior has much to do with Toho's Junior just as much as Minilla has to do with the Heisei era's Junior. It just doesn't synch up because they are not the same characters. Armegon (talk) 22:15, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Then I may suggest we make sure this article to be dedicated specifically to Toho's "Godzilla Junior"-character. But it must be pointed out that the article covers Toho's Baby Godzilla and that the TriStar Baby Godzilla is registered under the "Baby Godzilla" character first introduced by Toho and uses two monster icons (one which is the same as Toho's Baby Godzilla). TurokSwe (talk) 09:17, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

text: I agree 100% with Armegon. Toho's Baby Godzilla trademark and TriStar's outdated "BABY GODZILLA" trademark are separate (Toho's canceled the 1998 Baby trademark so it shouldn't even be called "Baby Godzilla" anyways). Swe, I don't know how you missed it, but I DID give a reason for undoing your edit (something along the lines of: "Godzilla Junior is a different character from Zilla Junior, or 'American Godzilla Junior,' if you will"), while you didn't give one for undoing my undo. You did give a reason for removing some of the garbage in the article (example, removing the "major enemies" section of the infobox, which has nothing to do with my undo but okay...) however, so I must give you kudos on that. As far as Toho--or anyone for that matter--is concerned, "BABY GODZILLA" is most certainly not the same character as the real, true Baby Godzilla, who was created by Toho for Toho's Heisei Godzilla series. Sure, "BABY GODZILLA" and Baby Godzilla were at one point the same character, but now that's changed after Toho decided to strip Zilla of the "God" prefix and cancel its trademark and its baby's trademark. I know you're going to not read this at all, but the "The Zilla Name Change" page on Wikizilla has updated a lot since the last time you probably visited it, so I recommend you give it another read: http://godzilla.wikia.com/wiki/The_Zilla_Name_Change . In conclusion, the Baby Zilla/Zilla Junior stuff shouldn't be included here for the same reason the Zilla (Toho) page wasn't merged with the Godzilla page--they're not the same, and that's what Toho says. 493Titanollante (talk) 02:53, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: My friend, unless you're willingly ignorant you should be able to observe each of my given reasons for adding the contents back in the article history, especially considering you didnt provide any valid reason for removing the contents afterwards other than the childish come-back "No reason listed for re-adding content," completely ignoring my previously given reasons. The TriStar "Baby Godzilla" icon was outdated, but the character was still registered under "Baby Godzilla" (thus being a different incarnation of the Baby Godzilla character first introduced by Toho) and has always been. There is no point in trying to make a connection between TriStar's Baby Godzilla and Godzilla '98 or Zilla, considering their only connection is that the Baby Godzilla is related to Godzilla in the 1998 film/TV-series, otherwise they're entirely different characters both in-universe and officially. Just as Godzilla Junior and Godzilla (while being the same species) are different characters in Toho's universe. TurokSwe (talk) 09:17, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: TurokSwe I must ask that you be civil in your arguments. Per WP:TPNO rules, you had no right to name call him "ignorant". Remember, that was one of the factors as to why you got blocked. Now back to the subject at hand. Now, you say that TriStar's Baby Godzilla character just makes it a different incarnation of the one introduced by Toho. If that were the case, then TriStar would have used Toho's trademark for their version of the baby instead of this one. As you can see, they are separate trademarks completely different from each other. This just means that both Tristar and Toho did not see them as the same characters or as an incarnation of Toho's Baby Godzilla. Like I said, if they did, they would have used the original trademark pendant but they didn't. The Godzilla from 1964, 1973, 1995, and 2014 are literally not the same Godzilla as the 1954 one but they are all still trademarked the same because Toho sees them all as incarnations because they all carry the same strong resemblance and characteristics of the Godzilla character. If we were to write this article from an IN-UNIVERSE perspective then there would be different articles for every single Godzilla, however, WP:INUNIVERSE states that we should not write these articles as such. TriStar's Baby Godzilla hardly bears any strong resemblance in design or character to Toho's version to even be considered an incarnation of Toho's Baby Godzilla but it's like I said earlier, this article is mainly focused on the Godzilla adolescent from the Heisei era. It does not reference past era adolescent incarnations such as Minilla or Godzooky, TriStar's Baby Godzilla should not get special treatment either.Armegon (talk) 16:17, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: First, no, that was not one of the factors that resulted in me becoming blocked, that was due to "edit warring." Secondly, I apologize to this child (even though I never called him "ignorant") but it seemed I had to point it out seeing as he was not willing to admit what I said I had done was accurate when it could be observed in the article's page-history. When it comes to the monster icons, as I stated earlier, TriStar used two monster icons for their American version of the Baby Godzilla, namely their own and Toho's (as shown here for example: http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140907171202/the-american-godzilla/images/b/b0/1998_GODZILLA_VIRTUAL_SHAKIN_MGA_hand-held_video_game_movie_NEW_SEALED_Rare%210.JPG). Toho's original icons for "Godzilla" and "Baby Godzilla" were in fact more frequently used on products related to the 1998 film than the new icons that TriStar created. The TriStar Baby Godzilla was still registered under the "Baby Godzilla" character created by Toho, and if I may speculate, the reason they would have made a second monster icon for the Baby Godzilla could be for demonstrating that the product on which the icon would appear deals with TriStar's version of Baby Godzilla (which exists in a different universe from the Toho Baby Godzilla). But whatever the reason, both icons were used for the 1998 Baby Godzilla, and the creature was still registered under the same character as the one Toho created a few years earlier, so basically it should be considered a new incarnation of the Baby Godzilla character. The TriStar Baby Godzilla and the Toho Baby Godzilla may be different, but one shouldn't look away from the similarities such as both creatures originating from an egg, both are big dinosaur-like reptiles (soon to become gigantic monsters) which interacts with humans, and were to eventually take over the throne after their respective fathers had died. As I said earlier though, if this article is to specifically deal with Toho's Baby Godzilla (Godzilla Junior) then we better make sure people understand that is what this article is about. Agree? TurokSwe (talk) 17:30, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

text: Armegon is 100% correct once again! TurokSwe, I thought you were above calling people names now, but I see that's not the case and that your behavior is still much like a child's. Anyways, if they're supposed to be the same, why not use the same trademark instead of making a new one--which Toho cancelled anyways? Godzilla Junior is a different trademark from Godzilla just how the 1998 "GODZILLA" trademark is different from the real Godzilla trademark, and exactly how the true, Heisei series Baby Godzilla trademark is different from the 1998 "BABY GODZILLA" one. Baby Godzilla, Little Godzilla and Godzilla Junior, while they have different trademarks, are literally the exact same character from a canonical standpoint and by Toho's official word. Baby Zilla was the same character before the Zilla name change (when Toho cancelled Baby Zilla's trademark) and even before that, they had almost no similarity to each other. Like Armegon said, this article is about the character that appeared in the Heisei series, and this is why it doesn't talk about Minilla or Godzooky--and why it shouldn't talk about Baby Zilla. 493Titanollante (talk) 17:16, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't act arrogant, just an advice. As it comes to the new monster icon that TriStar created for their new incarnation of the Baby Godzilla, I can see how it could be necessary to create a new icon that would specifically resemble TriStar's Baby Godzilla incarnation. You can say the same thing about the Godzilla (Zilla Jr) from Godzilla: The Series, that creature was once a character named "Baby Godzilla", and later "Juvenile Godzilla", and now "Godzilla". They may portray the same character in the story, but this is IN-UNIVERSE, we're talking reality now. As in reality; 1) the Toho films presents the "Baby Godzilla", "Little Godzilla" and "Godzilla Junior" as different characters (even though they represent the same character IN-UNIVERSE); 2) the TriStar film/TV-series presents the "Baby Godzilla" and "Godzilla" as different characters (even though they represent the same or related characters IN-UNIVERSE). Anyways, the Baby Godzilla and Godzilla in TriStar's universe may represent the same species, but they're still different characters with different titles. Do you understand my reasoning? By the way, there is no "real" Godzilla-trademark, there is just a trademark, and trademarks can be different and constantly change. TurokSwe (talk) 17:42, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I wouldn't say that just because Baby, Little, and Junior have separate trademark pendants means that they're different characters. In-universe or not, they're the same characters, they just have different titles as they grow up, for copyright's design sake. As the baby grows, the design will eventually change, so will the name (you wouldn't call an infant an "infant" when he turns 5, right?). The names such as Baby or Little Godzilla reflect the character's age, it doesn't really make them separate characters, only the titles are separate but we're getting a bit off track. The whole purpose of this discussion is whether to include TriStar's Baby into this article, which I vote not to. If TriStar's Baby is to be noted, it must be on the Zilla article because TriStar's Baby is an incarnation of TriStar's Zilla. Armegon (talk) 18:06, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with Armegon once again. 493Titanollante (talk) 21:26, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

text: I'll vote for "no" aswell on the grounds that this article should only refer to Toho's Baby Godzilla, and not the TriStar incarnation of the Baby Godzilla character.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by TurokSwe (talk • contribs) 19:07, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Excellent. I'm pretty certain 493Titanollante may agree with us as well but we'll have to wait for his confirmation. Now, I do believe that TriStar's Baby does deserve a notable mention in the Zilla (Toho) article. Although, the article does cover nearly every incarnation of the character from the 1998 version and its babies to Final Wars to Rulers of Earth. Perhaps the trademark should be noted? Armegon (talk) 19:23, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree, this should only be for Toho's Godzilla Junior/Little Godzilla/Baby Godzilla. 493Titanollante (talk) 21:26, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

text: Indeed, the trademark really must be noted if it is to be correct. Really all the major incarnations should be given a little introduction in the article, according to me at least. TurokSwe (talk) 19:35, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: By the way, have you noticed the "Godzilla"-template on the bottom of the Godzilla Junior-article has a duplicate right under it? TurokSwe (talk) 19:38, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I fixed it. Also then there's that issue on the Godzilla (franchise) me and you have been having whether to tie the Baby Godzilla to the Zilla article. You say no because the article does not cover the Baby Godzilla. I however, who has contributed to the article immensely, do believe it does. The article covers every single incarnation, including the animated series incarnation, which is an offspring of the adult from the live action film. Since the Baby is an incarnation of TriStar's Zilla, it makes sense to link it to the Zilla article Armegon (talk) 20:32, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  1998 Baby Godzilla 

message: So Like there a therory where the Godzilla In GVMegalon and GVG REX  (not the showa one)  and it is even SHOWEND this Godzilla story is a sequel to GVDestroyah so uh RexGoji Should be in this page Monster 1954 (talk) 03:59, 22 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Inaccurate or Accurate?