Talk:Madhava of Sangamagrama

message: Please provide a citation for Madhava being "considered the father of mathematical analysis" . . .  I know of no printed sources that make a reasonable claim of this . . . the father of analysis as we know them today are more likely to be consider Karl Weierstraß, as he was interested in the basis of the Calculus . . . before his time, there were no clear definitions regarding the fundamentals of calculus, and thus theorems could not be properly proven. Madhava  in contrast, like many before him, merely introduced the idea of infinity to certain classes of functions, like many after him would do before analysis was put on a firm footing. Arundhati bakshi 18:45, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: See Mathematical analysis and it's talk page for more detail (and a printed source for the claim). Also see  highlighting all pioneers in analysis - it considers Madhava the founder of mathematical analysis in contrast with Weierstrass as father of modern analysis. Weierstrass' page also says the same.  --Pranathi 00:29, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Then he should be mentioned as the father of an older form of mathematical analysis. Kerhwos (talk) 14:54, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citation Needed 

message: Hi, I put these questions on the Kerala school.
Could we get some cleanup on the maths stuff?
*Infinite series expansions of functions.
:Ok.  How?  By Taylor series?  Fourier series?
*The power series.
:Power series of what?
*The Taylor series.
:Taylor series of what?  There are 4 or 5 trigonmetric functions listed below.
*Trigonometric series.
:...
*Rational approximations of infinite series.
:...
*Taylor series of the sine and cosine  functions (Madhava-Newton power series).
:Ok.  Wouldn't that fall above?
*Taylor series of the tangent function.
:Likewise
*Taylor series of the arctangent function (Madhava-Gregory series).
:Likewise?
*Second-order Taylor series approximations of the sine and cosine functions.
:What's the 2nd order Taylor series?  If the "1st order" is just sin(x) ~ x, then the second order would be sin(x) ~ x + x^3/3!.
*Third-order Taylor series approximation of the sine function.
:So that would be sin(x) ~ x + x^3/3! + x^5/5! ?
*Power series of π (usually attributed to Leibniz).
:Which one?  π = 4/1 - 4/3 + 4/5 - ...
*Power series of π/4 (Euler's series).
:Which one?  Does this mean Leibniz above?
*Power series of the radius.
:What radius?
*Power series of the diameter.
:What diameter?
*Power series of the circumference.
:What circumference?
*Power series of angle θ (equivalent to the Gregory series).
:???  What does this mean?
*Infinite continued fractions.
:Ok.  As solutions to quadratics?  Cubics?
*The solution of transcendental equations by iteration.
:As solutions to ...
*Approximation of transcendental numbers by continued fractions.
:Which transcendental number?
*Tests of convergence of infinite series.
:Ok...
*Correctly computed the value of π to 11 decimal places, the most accurate value of π after almost a thousand years.
:Ok...
*Sine tables to 12 decimal places of accuracy and cosine tables to 9 decimal places of accuracy, which would remain the most accurate upto the 17th century.
:Ok...
*A procedure to determine the positions of the Moon every 36 minutes.
:Ok...
*Methods to estimate the motions of the planets.
:Ok
*Integration.
:Including the fundamental theorem of calculus?  Which rules?  Integration of polynomials?
*Term by term integration.
:Ok
*Laying the foundations for the development of calculus, which was then further developed by his successors at the Kerala School.
:...
Thanks!  --M a s 01:57, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Put on [[Kerala School]] 

message: None of the questions under Put on Kerala School have been answered.
To give an example, the article claims that Madhava invented the fundamental ideas of: 
# Infinite series expansions of functions.
# Power series.
# Taylor series.
# Maclaurin series.
# Trigonometric series
First question, were these expansions really infinite as claimed? Further, for some functions he gave what looks like the first terms of a Taylor or Maclaurin series of that function. That is a nice accomplishment. But the fundamental idea of a Maclaurin or Taylor series consists of giving the rule how to develop a function into a series. No evidence that he knew this is given. -- Zz 17:56, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I asked pretty much the same questions when reading those sentences. They make almost no sense. There are quite a few grammar issues (and shaky claims) in the current article. The part you pointed out is just the worst of it. 24.220.188.43 (talk) 14:53, 2 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: At 2019-12-08 there is the sentence "... uncertain ... whether any of these ideas were transmitted to the West, ... calculus was developed completely independently by Isaac Newton and Leibniz."  If transmission is uncertain then transmission is possible. In that case Newton or Leibniz could have benefited and the sentence is inconsistent. And incidentally, "it" is unnecessary in most sentences. Many sentences can be rewritten in a simpler form without "it". For example: "Transmission of these ideas to the West is uncertain." Regards, ... PeterEasthope (talk) 15:13, 8 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disputed 

message: Just added a number of facts, such as the location of Sangramagrama, the 
uncertainty regarding which of the results are specifically attributable
to Madhava (including a sketch of some of the arguments), ensuring that 
the reader is aware of the degree of 
doubt on this matter. 
Removed many of the indirect references (e.g. several instances of the Mactutor pages) with 
journal articles.  Merged the "bibliography" section into references (though
some people may disagree, I feel this is cleaner - you get a sense of what the text does; if we need to repeat the citations in a bibliography, it should have
annotations). 
Also added a citation for integration along with the original malayalam text. 
As for the disputed facts, I think 
among the examples given, with citations to various texts, we have
many examples of these three :
# Infinite series expansions of functions (mostly trig functions)
# Power series : all are power series expansions
# Trigonometric series : many involve the trig functions in the expansion
The following two however appear to be unlikely:
# Taylor series.
# Maclaurin series.
Since these express functions as powers of the derivative for a general function, it is unclear that the understanding of higher-order derivatives was sufficiently understood. 
While derivatives are being computed, it is not clear whether power series
of derivatives were used.  Unless other facts come to light, I am removing reference to these two. mukerjee (talk) 17:42, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Tag removed

message: I have no expertise in this matter, but the section This is due to wrong understanding of the authors concerned. It was almost impossible for the Jesuits in the sixteenth century, who are experts with the eminence of Mādhavan or his disciples, to study Sanskrit and Malayalam and to transmit them to European Mathematicians, instead of they themselves claiming the credit for the discovery. is very unclear. Who is misunderstanding whom? What is impossible? Were the Jesuits able to understand Mādhavan but unable to transmit them? Were they experts in Sanskrit and Malayam or not? Can anyone offer something to clarify it? Moreover, it reads to me like original research. Perhaps it would be clearer to say acknowledge priority in discovery of the relevant work to Mādhavan etc. but to state that there was no actual evidence that this knowledge was transmitted to the West; therefore the question of tranmission to Europe is simply unresolvable without more evidence. Rob Burbidge (talk) 09:51, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I asked pretty much the same questions when reading those sentences. They make almost no sense. There are quite a few grammar issues (and shaky claims) in the current article. The part you pointed out is just the worst of it. 24.220.188.43 (talk) 14:53, 2 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: At 2019-12-08 there is the sentence "... uncertain ... whether any of these ideas were transmitted to the West, ... calculus was developed completely independently by Isaac Newton and Leibniz."  If transmission is uncertain then transmission is possible. In that case Newton or Leibniz could have benefited and the sentence is inconsistent. And incidentally, "it" is unnecessary in most sentences. Many sentences can be rewritten in a simpler form without "it". For example: "Transmission of these ideas to the West is uncertain." Regards, ... PeterEasthope (talk) 15:13, 8 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Transmission to Europe 

message: I added a tone tag, because the article uses the plural third person ("we") very frequently, e.g. "We find Madhava's work on the value of π cited in..."  This is not in keeping with the style guidelines.  I'd fix it myself, but I'm supposed to be working instead of reading about approximations of Pi, let alone repairing a Wikipedia article!  :D --13.12.254.95 (talk) 16:04, 15 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Usage of "we" 

message: Currently, and since the very beginning, the title of this article is: Mādhava of
Sañgamāgrama
However, if you’d like to spell Sangamagrama with diaereses diacritics, the correct spelling would be
Saṅgamagrāma
ñ vs. ṅ is relatively unimportant (though inaccurate), but -māgrama is simply wrong and confusing when it’s actually -magrāma. Since the title is wrongly spelled, we’re going to have to move this article sooner or later, to simply “Madhava of Sangamagrama” or maybe “Mādhava of Saṅgamagrāma” or...???  Any suggestions? —Gyopi (talk) 11:46, 15 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spelling of Sangamagrama 

message: No picture provided nor can i find one on the web.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Srathi00 (talk • contribs) 14:26, 6 November 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Picture needed. 

message: Much of this article is taken word for word from this biography, particularly the section on infinite series. HGilbert (talk) 12:14, 15 March 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Copyright violation is a serious problem and we should definitely remove instances of it; thanks for bringing it up. But I cannot actually find any sentences taken word-for-word from the MacTutor site (except the phrase "Madhava gave three forms of Rn which improved the approximation", which is fairly generic, and explicitly cited with the MacTutor site as reference). Also, this article is much longer than the MacTutor biography, so I don't think it's possible that most of this article is taken from there. Could you give examples, or simply remove whatever you think is copied, and then we can reinstate them from proper sources? Shreevatsa (talk) 16:50, 15 March 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  I've removed or rewritten those. There isn't anything more, as far as I can tell. Shreevatsa (talk) 20:40, 15 March 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  You have only rephrased, instead of rewriting them. Kerhwos (talk) 14:42, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plagiarism 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Madhava of Sangamagrama. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060806040307/http://www.canisius.edu/topos/rajeev.asp to http://www.canisius.edu/topos/rajeev.asp
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 20:56, 29 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Madhava of Sangamagrama. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added  tag to http://www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Projects/Pearce/Chapters/Ch9_3.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060821195309/http://www.kerala.gov.in/keralcallsep04/p22-24.pdf to http://www.kerala.gov.in/keralcallsep04/p22-24.pdf
*Added  tag to http://www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Biographies/Madhava.html
*Added  tag to http://www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Projects/Pearce/Chapters/Ch9_3.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 22:18, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Madhava of Sangamagrama. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080321094302/http://www.humanities.manchester.ac.uk/aboutus/news/display/?id=121685 to http://www.humanities.manchester.ac.uk/aboutus/news/display/?id=121685
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 01:27, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: We have an IP that has removed information twice supported in reliable sources and replaced it with information also supported. The issue here is the removal of sourced information and replacing it with an older source. The removed information is from a journal and website from 2007 and retrieved in 2020, respectively. Their information is sourced to a journal from 1995 . I have refrained from further escalating this but these edits appear disruptive even if they are in good faith. --ARoseWolf 20:49, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  IP removal 

message: Little is know about his life. So don't add random image from internet here. WP has certain rules ChandlerMinh (talk) 19:17, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The image people keep wanting to add is a copyright violation that shouldn't be on Commons anyway.... XOR'easter (talk) 20:44, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Don’t add image 

message: Recently user  has added a lot of content to this page especially in the “Madhavan, the person” section . Since this is an encyclopaedia I would like to request Krishna Chandran to make those sections as succinct as possible. The Wikipedia Manual of Styles suggests to not use many unnecessary words. The articles present form is like as if it is written like a blog. ChandlerMinh (talk) 19:22, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copy edit 

message: I recently removed some unsourced or junk reference which doesn't support Wikipedia source guidelines. is broken and not reliable so I've removed it and MAT Cancius link isn't really a reliable source for citing in Wikipedia so I removed it. Leveinhockerkerala (talk) 05:55, 14 September 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kerala school of astronomy and maths