Talk:Regional language

message: Why is Spanish not mentioned here? It is a regional language in the U.S. Being predominant in Puerto Rico and parts of California, Texas and New Mexico.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.92.213.195 (talk) 02:43, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Spanish

message: Somebody should write about Indian Regional Languages too, there is official recognition to about 15 of these languages. India must have the most number of regional languages in the world, what with almost each state in India having its own language. The debate of National vs Regional language has been and still is rampant in the country.
:Since you seem to know a bit about the situation, you should feel perfectly free to include this information. Be bold!--Yuje 22:00, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I would, but then my style won't fit in because I only know what any lay person from India would. :D Plumenator 21:51, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Indian Languages

message: Have tried to put article into some semblance of order. This article is likely to be unwieldy if too many regional languages get a mention, so I have pruned some links (sorry, all!). However, this article is still overwhelmingly Eurocentric and would benefit from some examples from other continents. Man vyi 17:45, Oct 27, 2004 (UTC)
:Partly as a result of the recent disputes, and partly because of the difficulties to define what a regional language should be, I have proposed to narrow the scope of this article. See #Narrower approach below. — Instantnood 19:30, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Eurocentric

message: Cantonese is de facto official in Hong Kong and Macau, and are used for official purposes, e.g, by the government, in the law courts, in the meetings of the legislature. There is at least one law in Hong Kong requiring the use of Cantonese, but not Mandarin in audio notice. As for the definition of country, cf. list of countries and list of sovereign states. — Instantnood 13:51, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The official language in HK and Macau is the Chinese language, and it is this language which will be reflected here if there is any need to suddenly define the PRC as "three countries, two systems".--Huaiwei 11:43, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Chinese and English are the official written language as according to the Basic Law and other laws. When spoken, for all official purposes, such as meetings of the legislature, speeches made by government officials, trials in law courts, etc., Cantonese and Putonghua are practically official. As for law courts, however, Chinese languages other than Cantonese and Mandarin are accepted, and interpretation is available anyway. There are laws in Hong Kong specifying that English and Cantonese (but not Putonghua) must be used, e.g.  verbal annunciation in lift cars. The word country as in the saying "One Country, Two Systems" is synonymous with State (sovereign state). — Instantnood 17:17, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Do show us the basic law dictating only the written language as the official language of the two SARS if you are able. Otherwise, your argument dosent shift from the fact that Cantonese remains a de facto official language, and not specified as such in any official text describing the official language of the SARS. That a language is used in the law courts or governmental speeches dosent make them any more "official" than de facto. Any Chinese dialect can be used in the Singaporean law courts, and are used in official government broadcasts, so does this make them official overnight?--Huaiwei 17:32, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: They don't dictate only written languages are official languages. See article 9 in both basic laws. See also section 3 of the Official Languages Ordinance (chapter 5), for the case in Hong Kong. Can a Singaporean MP swear in any Chinese languages she/he prefers when she/he assumes office? Can the Singaporean President deliver his annual address to the parliament in any Chinese languages she/he prefers? — Instantnood 18:01, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: So they dont actually dictate any writtern langaage as official, when in actual fact they simply define "Chinese" and "English" as official language without having to specify whether they are writtern or spoken, as is the case in every single country on earth (other then perhaps the PRC, but again this is debatable). Is it only instantnood who once went around claiming official languages only refer to the spoken, and not the writtern aspect of their respective languages. So it is pretty obvious that you cannot add an entry describing Cantonese as an "official language" in the two SARS, for they simply are not. As for the Singaporean instance, no law forbids one from swearing in any language, so since when do a matter of personal preference become legislature? And since when do the Singaporean president have to deliver his annual address to parliament? Well the president of Singapore cant exactly deliver that in any Chinese language...coz he isnt Chinese! :D--Huaiwei 18:07, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the Singaporean constitution, Malay, English, Mandarin (note: not "Mandarin Chinese") and Tamil are the official languages . Can an MP speaks in Shanghainese when speaking in a parliament meeting ?    The PRC considers Putonghua to be official (in mainland China), so as the ROC, which considers Kuo-yü to be official. The President of Singapore delivers a "President's Address" to the Parliament annually at its opening, doesn't he? — Instantnood 19:04, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Cantonese

message: In response to user:Alanmak's edit summaries : " Hong Kong is not an example for "An official language of a country may also be spoken as a regional language in a region of a neighbouring country", as Hong Kong, Guangdong are within the same nation. " - Please kindly don't confuse the different concepts of country, sovereign state and nation. " Saying "Cantonese is a regional language that is closely related to the state's main language" is POV.It implies Cantonese and Mandarin are two separate languages.Tibetan is a better example for that. " - In what way are Cantonese and Mandarin intelligible? " Cantonese seems not to be a very good example of "regional language" " - Why is it not? — Instantnood 21:27, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Recent edits by user:Alanmak

message: Cantonese and Wu are recognized as languages by almost all reliable and non-biased sources, such as Ethnologue, most non-Chinese linguists, and most encyclopedias. Furthermore, the situation is exactly the same as with regional languages like Catalan and Sicilian, which in the past were simply regarded as dialects of Spanish and English, respectively. Cantonese is a language with more than 60 million speakers, greater than Italian, and it definitely deserves listing. As for the POV issues, it's already stated in the first paragraphs that regional languages are often considered to be dialects. --Yuje 05:51, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cantonese 

message: The definition of regional language, as for the purpose of this article, is the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages. What about narrowing the scope of this article - discuss only the languages recognised as regional languages as a result of the charter?  — Instantnood 17:41, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Narrower approach

message: Re  - A language does not automatically become a regional language just because it's spoken in some certain places. — Instantnood 18:05, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Why?--Huaiwei 18:16, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Why would a language automatically become a regional language? Are Hmong and Somali regional languages in the Twin Cities region of Minnesota? — Instantnood 18:36, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Have you established the meaining of the phrase "regional language" in the first place before throwing up extreme examples to push a point? Is the Chinese dialect in question as obscure as Hmong and Somali?--Huaiwei 23:53, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

text: For the first edit summary you quoted, my view is that when we're comparing between Putonghua and the regional languages in the PRC, whether Chinese is official in whatever countries is irrelevant. The same applies when we're discussing Scots, Frisian, Walloon, Aranese, Basque, Sorbian, we don't care whether English, Dutch, German, French and Spanish are official in any other countries. We mention only the UK, Ireland, Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, France and Spain, but not the US, India, Puerto Rico, Gibraltar, Bermuda, Canada, New Zealand, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Côte d'Ivoire, Haiti, Republic of the Congo, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Burkina Faso, Senegal, Seychelles, Argentina, Ecuador, Peru, etc.  "  is Huaiwei's excuse to remove regional languages  " - Yes, absolutely. He's reverting more than what he's talking about in his edit summary. — Instantnood 19:47, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have difficulty understanding how the first statement is "irrelevant", when a few paras down this page, you argue that only languages spoken in official capacity can be considered for inclusion in this list? Secondly, my explaination and action is plain obvious. Non of the Chinese dialects qualify to be regional languages except Mandarin, so its either you add Mandarin or do not add any Chinese dialect at all (as elaborated below). Adding Cantonese only is ridiculously inaccurate and misleading.--Huaiwei 23:53, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Definitions

message: Relatively new to the edit dispute here, but one small thing - I believe Cantonese and English are used as administrative languages in HK.  But I'm not 100% sure.  I am certain that the "official" languages/dialects in HK are all three of Cantonese, Mandarin, and English.  --- Hong Qi Gong 20:42, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What do you mean by administrative langauges? It's true that for many purposes, practically speaking, only Cantonese and English are used. The secretariat of the Legislative Council, for instance, does not always provide interpretation of its meetings in Putonghua. The Chief Executive rarely speaks publicly in Hong Kong in Putonghua (the last time he spoke Putonghua publicly in Hong Kong, as far as I can recall, was that on a press conference he replied in Putonghua when a question was directed to him in Putonghua.) According to law, for instance, lift cars are required to provide verbal annunciation only in Cantonese and English, but not Putonghua. — Instantnood 22:36, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, well it looks like you took out the "administrative language" wording anyway.  But on a slightly related note - Cantonese is not just the "de facto" official language in HK, it is one of the official languages in HK.  - Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 06:19, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The official languages in Hong Kong are English and Chinese. Neither Putonghua nor Cantonese is defined to be official in the same manner. — Instantnood 20:00, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cantonese - administrative language 

message: Quote from edit summary: ...Hakka is not regional language province-wide... 
I would suggest Wu and Cantonese are also not "regional language province-wide" either and therefore not a reason to exclude Hakka. The Wu speaking areas do not correspond to one province, and there are Chaozhou and Hakka speaking regions in Guangdong. LDHan 13:16, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Cantonese is used by the government of the Guangdong Province, for instance, to a certain extent. Is Hakka used by the government of any prefecture-level cities, prefectures, districts or counties? — Instantnood 20:00, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Whether or not the government of Guangdong Province uses Cantonese has nothing to do with my point that Wu or Cantonese are also not "regional language province-wide". Are you saying Cantonese is used by the government of Guangdong Province in Chaozhou and Hakka speaking areas? LDHan 15:50, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Used to precisely what extent by the provincial governments? Citations please? In which province are any of the Chinese dialects used in official capacity? If the language must be a designated as an official language by any institution at any level, than practically non of the Chinese dialects will qualify except Mandarin. Could you explain why Mandarin dosent appear in this list then?--Huaiwei 23:47, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Chinese regional language province-wide

message: I don't agree with the inclusion of catalan as a regional language, or I don't agree with your definition of regional language (you can choose...). That's the starting definition of regional language in your article:
1. traditionally used within a given territory of a State by nationals of that State who form a group numerically smaller than the rest of the State's population; and
2. different from the official language(s) of that State.
*Well, basically I don't agree with point nº1 cos in Catalonia catalan speakers are (more or less) twice in number than non-catalan speakers. The fact that we catalan-speakers know to speak spanish (and non-catalan-speakers they don't want, or at least it seems they don't like to speak in catalan with us) doesn't mean that there is more spanish-speakers than catalan-speakers in Catalonia. The definition of regional language as a language spoken by "a group numerically smaller than the rest of the State's population", then, excluides the catalan.
*And I don't agree with point nº2 cos Catalan is "the natural and official language in Catalonia" (as is written in our Constitution), and is used in all the official places: presidency, TV, shops, schools (we learn all in catalan)... And it can't be "different from the official language(s) of that State" because it is one of the official ones.
When we refer to catalan, we shold know that is like if we refer to french in Quebec, to dutch in Belgium...
The only thing we (catalans) dislike is the Spanish Government's politics, that shows an untrue idea of what Spain is. And the reality of Spain is that is a country where over the 33% of people has got a mother tongue (or usual language) different than spanish/castillian. And lots of spaniards are uncomfortable with the idea. That's why you'll find that lots of us (catalans and basques) don't like the idea of being spaniards.88.23.209.44 23:36, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Whether we agree with the European Charter's definition or not, it's a definition established by treaty so it's of encyclopaedic value. Spain has ratified the European Charter in respect of Catalan as a regional or minority language within the meaning of the Charter. There are certainly other definitions possible. Man vyi 06:06, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Catalan is not a regional language 

message: Local language redirects here, but I'm thinking that this term deserves a separate article. The term is used (or misused) fairly widely in ways that are sometimes very different than regional language. I'm posting this to see if there is any interest, feedback, etc.--A12n (talk) 13:20, 22 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Local language 

message: Hello,
the article  says the following: 
*The Frisian languages, regional languages of the Netherlands and Germany, belong to the Germanic family. The article Frisian languages has a plural title, which suggests that the sentence should be split up.Sarcelles (talk) 08:02, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Frisian languages]]