Talk:Lauffen am Neckar

message: I would be happy to collaborate in the editing and proof-reading of this page.Mikeo1938 08:39, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

message: Thank you Boson for reading the entry and for your comments, which I'll be addressing once I've got in touch with those who wrote the German.  When I'm in Lauffen at the end of the month, I'll get some standard reference books. I've followed the link to the Heraldry page and asked for assistance. Is it the case that a special format is required to describe the arms? Mikeo1938 05:29, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know what Wikipedia requirements are regarding descriptions of coats of arms. Although I have dabbled in Heraldry, I am not an expert A quick look at the Manual of Style didn't yield anything, so I took the easy way out and marked it for expert attention. I do know that, for English coats of arms (not specifically in Wikipedia),  the emblazonment usually uses a special language influenced by Norman French. For instance the "tincture" (colour has a special meaning in heraldry) that is depicted as white actually represents the metal silver, which is called "Argent" in heraldry. So if the German uses "silver" (rather than white) the English should probably say "Argent". If it is a plain (non-heraldic) language description, the German would probably use "weiß" rather than "Silber. Other conventions are the use of the words "azure" for blue, "gules" for red, "courant" for running etc. When objects ("charges"?) are shown in their "natural" colours (like the envelope?) this is, I believe, described as "proper". Though it is, I believe, frowned on in heraldic circles, for a translation it might be appropriate to make a reference to the (presumed) "pun", which an English reader might not be aware of: a running messenger, or "Läufer" (runner) is used to represent "Lauffen" ("laufen" = to run".). The borderline between translation and original research is sometimes not very clear. --Boson 06:39, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

text: A fine example of a blazon for a complicated coat of arms can be found here. --Rosenzweig 20:57, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Review 

message: Here's my attempt, it will probably need some polishing though:
:Argent a messanger in vestments Vert and shoes Gules, holding in his dexter hand a letter of the field sealed of the second and in his sinister hand a spear of the same tipped Azure. — Kpalion(talk) 08:56, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In English heraldry, it's better not to repeat the names of tinctures (colors) once they were mentioned, so instead you use terms like "of the field", "of the first", etc. In this case, Argent (white) is the color of the field, so "a letter of the field" means "a letter Argent". Gules (red) is the second tincture of a charge (an object) mentioned in the blazon, so "sealed of the second" means "sealed with a seal Gules". "A spear of the same" means "a spear of the last previously mentioned tincture ", i.e. Gules. And "tipped Azure" means (or I hope it does) "with a tip Azure". There might be a better word to substitute for "tip" though. BTW, if a the coat of arms depicts an object which alludes to the name of the armiger (in this case the town), it may be described as canting arms. — Kpalion(talk) 11:55, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

text: Argent a messanger vested Vert in shoes Gules, holding in his dexter hand an envelope of the field sealed of the third and in his sinister hand a spear of the same headed Azure. — Kpalion(talk) 08:56, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

text: I was wondering about the colour of the envelope. Since it on the field, can it really be "of the field?; In the depiction, it seems to be silver-grey (and has a border?). Possibly this is "proper" rather than a normal heraldic tincture. The German does say "silbern", which would presumably be Argent, but wouldn't that be against the rules of tincture? Not that it is really for us to do the German heralds' job, but the English does seem to highlight a violation of the normal rules! --Boson 22:44, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. The blazon seems to violate the rule of tincture, but it's not our job to correct it. — Kpalion(talk) 09:22, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Blazon of the CoA 

message: I'm now comparing my edit of the original translation with the current text in the German article and making changes accordingly. Mikeo1938 (talk) 00:09, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: this is IMHO not good.
*a gallery should not be used, there is commons.
Nevertheless, this is an very good article and on its way to a GA. Sebastian scha. (talk) 04:51, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Revision

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thread_title:  External links modified