Talk:Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany

message: Is there a source for this 253 calories per Jew?
From what I understand, heavy labourers in Buchenwald Concentration camp were given 1750 calories per day. 
http://www.shoaheducation.com/food.html says 600 per day in concentration camps generally, but unfortunately, doesn't list calories in ghettos.
Only 253 in the Warsaw ghetto seems horrifically low. It might well be true, but I'm curious where the stat comes from.
-- TheMightyQuill 13:38, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Food Rations

message: The image :Image:Warsaw Ghetto mass grave, 1941.jpg is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here.  In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page.  Please check
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thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:Warsaw Ghetto mass grave, 1941.jpg

message: :parts of the city outside the walls were called "Aryan"
Is this true? Aryan != Slavic and in Poland there was a large Slavic population. When speaking from a Jewish perspective, "non-Jewish" = Gentile, not Aryan. -- Green Cardamom (talk) 17:05, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Aryan vs Gentile 

message: A simplifiaction - Not all were executed, however sometimes whole family was murdered like Józef and Wiktoria Ulma.Xx236 (talk) 10:25, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Any Pole found giving any help to a Jew was subject to the death penalty 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: *unsourced, called by whom? There was no such word in Poland before the war.
*If it is a Nazi name, like Final Solution or Polnische Schweine, it should be written always in quotation marks.
Xx236 (talk) 07:51, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  The parts of a city outside the walls of the Jewish Quarter were called "Aryan." 

message: The Łódź Ghetto existed ~ in 1944, was it renamed to a concentration camp?Xx236 (talk) 08:02, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Liquidation 

message: The map in the infobox it is too small to read the text and therefore not helpful to readers. I'm not convinced by the sourcing; it says "using information from USHMM & Wikipedia." Wikipedia is not a reliable source and I'm not sure whether USHMM means Encyclopedia of Camps and Ghettos or the website; either way it's not verifiable. The caption is still wrong because many ghetto inhabitants were executed by death squads near the ghetto rather than being deported. Also, a picture of an actual ghetto is most useful as header image to represent what ghettos looked like. buidhe 00:43, 4 June 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: This was posted at about the same time as the above. I now agree that the map is probably not best suited for the infobox. However, I have a hard time saying the map is not fit for inclusion. I guess the source listed is not as helpful as I thought, since it just links to the main page of the museum. In any case, maybe a more central discussion of the map is warranted, as it is used in many articles (not that that means it is reliable, but having a discussion only here seems improper to me). Please feel free to remove the map and add a different photo. ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia talk  00:48, 4 June 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Map in infobox 

message: I just reverted the removal of the current infobox photo, which is a map detailing the Holocaust. On further reflection, the map, while certainly relevant to the article, may be more suited for the body, since it does not show -only- ghettos, but also concentration and death camps. What are the thoughts on this? ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia talk  00:44, 4 June 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: This was posted at about the same time as the above. I now agree that the map is probably not best suited for the infobox. However, I have a hard time saying the map is not fit for inclusion. I guess the source listed is not as helpful as I thought, since it just links to the main page of the museum. In any case, maybe a more central discussion of the map is warranted, as it is used in many articles (not that that means it is reliable, but having a discussion only here seems improper to me). Please feel free to remove the map and add a different photo. ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia talk  00:48, 4 June 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox photo 

message: The link for reference "ushmm-7445" redirects somewhere else. The link should be updated to: 
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/types-of-ghettos 016bells (talk) 19:35, 13 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Done – Jonesey95 (talk) 16:08, 14 January 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 13 January 2021 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: moved. Moved to Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany. There is a general consensus to not stay at the current title. While there were a number of titles proposed, Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany found the most support. (non-admin closure) Captain Jack Sparrow (talk) 13:14, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Nazi ghettos →  – Per my rationale from Talk:List_of_Jewish_ghettos_in_German-occupied_Europe#Requested_move_6_May_2023 and the existence of :Category:Ghettos in Nazi-occupied Europe (which likely needs renaming to include the word Jewish, per its child subcategories like :Category:Jewish ghettos in Nazi-occupied Belarus, and perhaps the change from Nazi to German), for clarity, this article would be better of under Jewish ghettos in German-occupied Europe. Although to achieve full clarity, I am now thinking if we should not be using the phrase "Ghettos for Jews" rather than "Jewish ghettos"? I.e. Ghettos for Jews in German-occupied Europe Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:00, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

text: Oppose Other articles and categories have been created or renamed at this verbose and uncommon phrase (1 result on Google scholar vs  hundreds for the current title) but that is not a reason to move this article. "Nazi ghettos" is a common way of referring to the topic (also see , ), as is "Jewish ghetto" (but this is ambiguous) or "Polish ghetto" (arguably misleading, and not all the ghettos were in Poland). Only the first satisfies the condition of being unambiguous and concise. Furthermore, it is consistent with other articles with long-established titles such as Nazi concentration camps. I hope you are not proposing a move of that article. (t · c) buidhe 19:07, 15 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: If there is any other title that could be considered it would probably be Ghettos (Holocaust) (t · c) buidhe 19:13, 15 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: If consensus prefers Nazi ghettos → Jewish ghettos in Europe during World War II, instead of Nazi ghettos → Jewish ghettos in World War II Europe, I would also support that option. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 01:11, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

text: Comment, I proposed it already in category discussion, but why not move it to Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany? It leaves no doubt who was held in ghettos and who was creating them, also the time period is clearly defined. We can also add "...in Europe" to be totally precise. Marcelus (talk) 12:34, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: As described in the article Jewish ghettos in Europe, most if not all of the Jewish ghettos listed under the proposed main title header Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany were in fact already in existence well before the 20th century. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 01:11, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Where does it says that? If so it should be removed because it's complete untruth! Marcelus (talk) 07:38, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The section Jewish ghettos in Europe#Origin and the articles Ghetto and Jewish quarter (diaspora) indicate that "When political authorities designated an area where Jews were required by law to live, such areas were commonly referred to as ghettos, and were usually coupled with many other disabilities and indignities. The areas chosen usually consisted of the most undesirable areas of a city. In the 19th century, Jewish ghettos were progressively abolished, and their walls taken down, though some areas of Jewish concentration continued and continue to exist." There is a list of such areas at Jewish quarter (diaspora). —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 08:35, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Jewish quarter (the part of the mostly non-Jewish town where a lot of inhabitants are Jewish) and Jewish ghettos (part of the town where Jews are forced to live) are two different things and shouldn't be conflacted. And it doesn't seem to me that the cited article does that ("In the 19th century, Jewish ghettos were progressively abolished"); there was no ghettos in Europe in 1939, Nazis didn't take over any existing ghetto, because there there were none. Marcelus (talk) 09:48, 17 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The section Ghetto#Nazi-occupied Europe contains the following: "During World War II, ghettos were established as a form of concentration camp by the Nazis to confine Jews and Romani into tightly packed areas of the cities of Eastern Europe. The Nazis most often referred to these areas in documents and signage at their entrances as "Jewish quarter." These Nazi Camps sometimes coincided with traditional Jewish ghettos and Jewish quarters, but not always." Taking these facts into account, if there is consensus for the proposed main title header Nazi ghettos → Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany, I would likewise support such an alternative form. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 14:03, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

text: *Oppose: User:Buidhe shows that this is the WP:COMMONNAME. Furius (talk) 00:39, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

text: Relisting comment: Relisting to get a consensus on what alternative title should be picked. – MaterialWorks 11:59, 21 May 2023 (UTC)

text: Note: WikiProject Jewish history has been notified of this discussion. – MaterialWorks 11:59, 21 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I do confirm my support for the alternative move proposed by Marcellus: Nazi ghettos → Jewish ghettos established by Nazi Germany. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 14:05, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that "established by" is just awkward and quite bulky - besides, to me it sounds like setting up an NGO. ౪ Santa ౪99° 14:13, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: As mentioned above (at 14:03, 17 May 2023), The section Ghetto#Nazi-occupied Europe contains the following: "During World War II, ghettos were established as a form of concentration camp by the Nazis to confine Jews..." —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 14:38, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 14 May 2023