Wikipedia talk:Noticeboard for India-related topics/Archive 29

message: The article about him had the title Yuvraj of Patiala because it was originally written as a cricket article. Somebody has moved it to Maharaja Yadavindra Singh. IMHO, it is fine, except that it should be changed to Yadavindra Singh of Patiala. If you have any views on this, please comment at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Cricket#Yuvraj_of_Patiala_.3E_Maharaja_Yadavindra_Singh Tintin 15:12, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yadavindra Singh of Patiala 

message: There may be cross-cultural issues of perception here   that could benefit from the perspective of Indian Wikipedians. While Osho has become part of India's mainstream, in the United States he still does not get a fair hearing, IMO. -- Jayen466 00:58, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Osho]] 

message: In view of the Malayalam language article, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mappila Malayalam may benefit from your input. Please consider participating in that discussion. -- Jreferee   t/c 06:33, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Mappila Malayalam]] 

message: Ok. Bollyvista—"About us" says, "Through years of hard work, Bollyvista.com has been able to assemble a syndicate of reporters and dedicated technical staff to bring the best of Bollywood to its viewers around the world." So it is not a fan-managed site. It has proper staffs, and offices etc. Disclaimer says, "Bollyvista.com expressly disclaims any and all warranties, express or implied, including, without limitation: (a) Any warranties as to the availability, accuracy, completeness or content of information, products or services that are part of the Bollyvista.com web site..." 
The disclaimer is pretty generic; indiatimes "terms and conditions" says, " All the contents of this Site are only for general information or use. They do not constitute advice and should not be relied upon in making (or refraining from making) any decision"; rediff.com disclaimer says, "REDIFF .COM AND/OR ITS RESPECTIVE SUPPLIERS MAKE NO REPRESENTATIONS ABOUT THE SUITABILITY, RELIABILITY, AVAILABILITY, TIMELINESS, LACK OF VIRUSES OR OTHER HARMFUL COMPONENTS AND ACCURACY OF THE INFORMATION, SOFTWARE, PRODUCTS, SERVICES AND RELATED GRAPHICS CONTAINED WITHIN THE REDIFF SITES/SERVICES FOR ANY PURPOSE."
So, disclaimer-wise, bollyvista is comparable to rediff and indiatimes. And it is not a fan-managed website. Yes, it is smaller in size than ToI or rediff. And it is not as widely read/consulted as indiafm. So, what may be it's reliabilty??? My opinion, it is reliable for non-exceptional claims, if properly considered along with the context (just like any other media reliable source, where context should be taken into consideration while deciding reliability). It seems to be "trustworthy or authoritative in relation to the subject at hand". Comments?--Dwaipayan (talk) 17:46, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Bollyvista

message: This is a website from INDOlink , which "...is the first Ethnic portal serving Asian-Indians worldwide since 1995. INDOlink is a US Corporation, located in San Ramon, California - with satellite offices in New York, and Bombay, India".
In its terms of service, it has similar disclaimers,disclaiming inaccuracies etc. So, it seems to be not a fan-managed site. However, on checking a few articles, most of them seemed to be written by someone named "Abid". Also, no formal statement on office or stuffs have been made. So, my view on planetbollywood is, it is probably not reliable. It is definitely less transparent than bollyvista or indiafm.--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:24, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So, my question is, can we use review from these site? It is an active site and every new released film receives a review there (not from this Avid, by different writers. Shahid • Talk2me 18:55, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No, we should not be using for reviews too. Instead it would add more value to the article in terms of credibility, if we use well-accepted sources mentioned above. - KNM  Talk 19:07, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I cannot answer Shaid's question right away. I am not an expert in examining WP:RS. My opinion is it will be better not to use this site, as it's RS-ness is debatable. You can ask in Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard, and, wait for other editors to express their views here. Regards.--Dwaipayan (talk) 19:10, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Planetbollywood.com

message: I could not fine out any "about us" or 'disclaimers' in the website. It is hard to prove it's reliability, even if to support some non-exceptional claim.--Dwaipayan (talk) 18:28, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Apunkachoice

message: Can someone check the reliability of this site? Gnanapiti 22:40, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Indiantelevison.com seems to be reliable in the context in question, and for non-exceptional claims. The about us and the disclaimer clearly state about the eponymous private company, and their office, and their strving towards accuracy. It is not a blog/fan site, with considerable transparency about their way of working and the content.--Dwaipayan (talk) 01:00, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: indiantelevision.com

message: It seems to be RS. Is it? Shahid • Talk2me 19:23, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: www.fullhyderabad.com

message: I've already proved its reliability. I followed the instruction of some editors, to get an evidence to this or another site being reliable, and looked for it in different RSes. And I've found it! See please Indiatimes and ToI mentioned it on several occasions, writing "According to boxofficeindia.com..." - . I think if it is mentioned in reputable sites which. And it's not only mentioned. If these reputable RSes use boxofficeindia.com as source of information for themselves, it is definitealy reliable. User:Spartz and User:Nichalp support me now. Regards, Shahid • Talk2me 15:42, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Being cited in another RS does not make the site a RS itself. For example, wikipedia is sometimes cited in the media, but wikipedia is not a RS.--Dwaipayan (talk) 21:10, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's what Nichalp and Spartaz told me to do. It's not that it's just mentiones. It is used as a source of information. Shahid • Talk2me 21:14, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Being cited by another RS as a source proves the notability of boxofficeindia, and is one step towars proving its reliability. But whether it is RS also depends on its editorial oversight, scrutiny etc (as explained in WP:RS).--Dwaipayan (talk) 21:33, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The case is, if strong RSes (newspapers) can use it as a source, Why can't Wikipedia? It is clearly an RS. IMO, it's not only a notability. Now, if we have to go further, we have to contact the site. Regards, Shahid • Talk2me 21:54, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Dont make it sound like they're using boindia the same way they use Reuters.  boindia is no reuters.  Reuters would be notable and RS even on its own.  They dont need to piggyback or backdoor on the weight of less than a handful of throwaway mentions in RSes.  boindia isnt even 'notable' for wikipedia purposes, let alone reliable.  Try writing an article about boindia and you will realize why it isnt even notable.  Sarvagnya 22:22, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The fact that you have some problems with this site is your own problem, not mine. It's very difficult to find a site which cites a comprehensive info about consistent box office collections, like BOI does. Now I don't care in which frequency it's mentioned in RSes, but it's mentioned. It can hurt you, but... it's still mentioned, and it's used as a "source", again, as a "source" for these RSes. So I don't find a reason to invalidate it on Wikipedia, just because one user has problems with it. And the fact that you direct me to policies doesn't impress me too much, how much more so when you link the word "reliable" to WP:Redirect... Re creating, I can easily create one, and I'll do that later. Shahid • Talk2me 09:22, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

text: Getting stats on box office collections is not too difficult. =Nichalp «Talk»= 02:48, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, now I have to say something about box office mojo and it's Indian Box Office Index. Box Office Mojo is a reliable source, I trust. Now, if you would just check the figures for Chak De India according to box office mojo as mentioned here it says that Chak De India has grossed over $13,672,145. Multiply that by 39.295 and you get Rs. 53,72,46,937. According to IBOSnetwork, Chak De's Raw Net Collection is Rs. 53,72,46,935. So, are we supposed to believe that this is the right figure? Another site, indiafm.com has lot in common with boxofficeindia.com, just like box office mojo's and IBOSnetwork's figures are almost the same. This is confusing me now since according to indiafm.com and BO india, Chak De has crossed 60 crores, but according to BO Mojo and IBOS it hasn't yet crossed 60 crores. Also, according to indiafm.com, Chak De has entered the "All-time Blockbuster" region by crossing 64 crores but according to BO India it has yet to cross the 64 crore mark. So we have totally 4 different sites (and I still doubt BO Mojo's reliability when it comes to international countries' domestic box office figures) with 4 different ways to make us think they're reliable but we're still back where we started!! For a long time I have been following BO India as if it's an official BO site. Anyway so many of these doubts in my mind, I hope someone can clarify them. Thanks, Maaz. Figurefour (talk) 08:54, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Figurefour, you're right and you're not the only one. I'm with you!:) Many editors on Wikipedia use BO India here. The fact is that it's very difficult to follow on precise numbers everywhere. What we do get is that all these four sites are reliable and very close to each other in terms of verdicts and general numbers. You won't find in any of these sites that Chak De was a flop, or average, or semi-hit. Every site clearly says that it's crossed the blockbuster verdict. Like yourself, we, the editors on Bollywood related articles, have always used this site as a source. It is very well written, and very active as well, updating itself every week or even 2-3 days. I won't give up, just because one editor or two find it unreliable for no clear reason. Regards, Shahid • Talk2me 09:35, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: boxofficeindia.com

message: The Veeramanidasan article talk page contains a controversy over the proper title, whether it should be Veeramanidasan or Veeramani Dasan.  It also needs substantial cleanup and some references to demonstrate notability.  --Kevin Murray (talk) 05:06, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Veeramanidasan]] 

message: In addition to the new article announcement page (WP:INBIN), we now have a new article page that is automatically updated by a bot. The bot reads all the new articles for a day and puts suspected India-related articles into this page. It can be accessed with the shortcut, WP:INNEW.
The bot runs on a list of rules that will need to be tweaked per instructions at the bot owner page. There is also the log on the User:AlexNewArtBot/IndiaLog explaining the rules that sent an article to the search results (the log  is cleared every day, so try to look into the history of the log). Regards, Ganeshk (talk) 19:45, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[User:AlexNewArtBot]] - New Article Bot 

message: This is to bring into notice about a project developed to help Wikipedia in Indian  Editions. Even before launching the project, considering the importance of the same DD NEWS (the official news channel of Government of India) did a story about the project and a recorded version is available at
http://mozhi.org/news
You can try some tools (for trying the coding) at
http://mozhi.org/hindi
http://mozhi.org/punjabi
http://mozhi.org/tamil
We can offer  customized search boxes for Wikipedia pages for Indian readers to search in the respective languages and they enter words in the respective Indian language itself. The users can enter words directly in the respective languages and search.
Please let us know if you need any clarification or help in implementation. You can find the contact page in our site for the same.If interested we can launch it extensively and include all the pages.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Aasisvinayak (talk • contribs) 
:Hello Aasisvinayak. Welcome to wikipedia! Congratulations to you on the outstanding achievements mentioned in the video. Looking forward to your contributions here. Regarding the search function, non-English wikipedias already accept text in other languages directly. Please try typing in the search box at Hindi Wikipedia, for example.--thunderboltz(TALK) 13:57, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I want to search following 51 words in google at one go how do I do it ?Mahitgar (talk) 17:30, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

text: Terms I want to serch at one go at google:विकिपेडीआ OR विकिपेडिआ OR विकिपेडीया OR विकिपेडिया OR विकीपेडीआ OR विकीपेडिआ OR विकीपेडीया OR वीकीपेडिया OR वीकीपेडीआ OR वीकीपेडिआ OR वीकीपेडीया OR वीकीपेडिया OR वीकीपेडिया OR वीकिपेडीआ OR वीकिपेडिआ OR वीकिपेडीया OR वीकिपेडिया OR विकिपीडीआ OR विकिपीडिआ OR विकिपीडीया OR विकिपीडिया OR विकीपीडीआ OR विकीपीडिआ OR विकीपीडीया OR वीकीपीडिया OR वीकीपीडीआ OR वीकीपीडिआ OR वीकीपीडीया OR वीकीपीडिया OR वीकीपीडिया OR वीकिपीडीआ OR वीकिपीडिआ OR वीकिपीडीया OR वीकिपीडिया OR विकिपिडीआ OR विकिपिडिआ OR विकिपिडीया OR विकिपिडिया OR विकीपिडीआ OR विकीपिडिआ OR विकीपिडीया OR वीकीपिडिया OR वीकीपिडीआ OR वीकीपिडिआ OR वीकीपिडीया OR वीकीपिडिया OR वीकीपिडिया OR वीकिपिडीआ OR वीकिपिडिआ OR वीकिपिडीया OR वीकिपिडिया
You can try mine... !!! But please see the notes before the search  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Aasisvinayak (talk • contribs) 17:40, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Support to Wikipedia Indian Editions 

message: I was going through the articles Coast_Starlight and Amtrak_Cascades, where you can see the route of the trains on the right. Somehow I like this, since it explains visually all stoppages, distances, train changeover points, bridge crossings (you can see this for Cascades, where they have mentioned the Steel Bridge crossing on the map), alternate routes and state border crossings.
I was just thinking why we cannot have such a map for Indian trains like Golden Temple Mail. Most of our train articles just list the origin/destination stations, and stoppages along the route. They also list which loco pulls the train. Adding these would make the article much more readable.
Some ideas/problems I could find:
* Some stations have stoppages only on certain days. Eg: Divine Nagar Halt in Kerala. I am a railfan myself, and have noticed from the timetable that most trains seem to stop only on certain days. I don't have statistics to back me up on how much trains do so, but I can get you those if you want. How do we represent these?
* Do we need to show times of arrival/departure? The Amtrak articles don't have these.
** One problem here is that times can often change. If we have them, then we need to constantly update them (or) we can have a disclaimer at the top.
** Timings on the Konkan railway are different when the monsoon is on in those areas. How do we represent these?
* Some trains take entirely different routes on different days. Also, some trains have totally different destinations. But I guess, we can handle these like what has been done for Coast_Starlight. Anyway, some thought will have to go into this.
Any others?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by The Silent Contributor (talk • contribs) 06:13, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: IR follows the policy of maintaining two kinds of distances: chargeable distances and actual distances (Am not sure if those are the exact names used). Which do we show? The Silent Contributor (talk) 06:18, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Route map for Indian trains 

message: Hi,
I felt the article Religious violence in India draws a bad picture of india and needs re-writing.. please comment..
DhananSekhar (talk) 18:46, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comments needed on [[Religious violence in India]] article 

message: I came across their website recently and notice that they have an image database available for viewing. The image is displayed with the notice "Information presented on this page is open for copying and reproduction. Use of appropriate byline/photo/image credits to NIOImage Library is requested.". Is that compliant with cc-by-sa? Can we upload pics to wikipedia/commons directly from this site without worrying about permission/licensing? - Aksi_great (talk) 09:29, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Does it limit the "copying" to non-commercial? Also, without it explicitly saying so, can we assume it to be usable under CC-by-sa? --Ragib (talk) 10:25, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The answer is NO. We cannot assume anything. We need explicit correspondence from NIO which should be logged in ORTS. =Nichalp «Talk»= 17:11, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok. I'll write to them. Problem is that their contact us form isn't working. I'll keep on trying. - Aksi_great (talk) 05:13, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  National Institute of Oceanography image database 

message: It is seen that many of the new featured articles are not been dislayed in the Portal:India. Pls. add those articles in the portal. Amartyabag  TALK2ME 11:40, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ambuj isnt on Wiki much these days to manage the portal. Can you please list the articles that need to be added to the portal (either here or on my talk page)? I'll try to update it myself. Ideally, they should be listed at WP:PINSAC, but since they are already featured, that would be a pretty pointless exercise.--thunderboltz(TALK) 14:17, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, here are some of the articles which are not listed:
*Kaziranga National Park
*Kingdom of Mysore
There can be few more left. Amartyabag  TALK2ME 14:43, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Regarding Portal India 

message: The article Beedi  could  use  some general cleanup. It has some cites, but could use more. -- 201.37.229.117 21:14, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Beedi]] needs general cleanup 

message: This is one of the most bigoted articles I've come across in Wikipedia. I dont think it was even worthy of being here (due to blatant communalism,anti-Hindu rhetoric,etc) until I modified it to make it look readable on November 30, 2007. Still, I dunno who the hell could give such an article a 'B' rating and that too to an article which was unreferenced (the references were added later and are not more than 3 days old). I guess the article needs to be re-evaluated and re-written.Thanx -Ravichandar84 07:20, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Devasahayam Pillai]] 

message: An editor recently changed the article title from Mahatma Gandhi to Mohandas Gandhi, after little discussion. I believe "Mahatma Gandhi" was correct, since it's the most widely used. The admin who changed the article title thinks other policies apply. I'm willing to be proven wrong, but since most of the editors there (four) don't seem to have much experience with India-related articles, it would be helpful to hear from some with experience. Go to Talk:Mohandas Gandhi#Gandhian POV and Talk:Mohandas Gandhi#Anti-Gandhian POV if you're interested. Thanks, –priyanath talk 02:58, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The page name has now been changed to Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi.  (See my post: Talk:Mohandas_Karamchand_Gandhi#Full_name.  Fowler&fowler«Talk» 17:03, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Mahatma Gandhi" or "Mohandas Gandhi" 

message: Kottakkal needs some serious cleanup. It is currently tagged with This article or section needs to be wikified to meet Wikipedia's quality standards, This article does not cite any references or sources. (January 2007), and This article or section is written like a personal reflection or essay and may require cleanup. Thanks. -- Writtenonsand 18:26, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Kottakkal]] (desperately) needs your help 

message: The article  Shahid Pratap Singh of Punja Sahib is written like a personal reflection or essay and does not cite any references or sources. 
There is no evidence that this topic is notable. If we can't add some good cites to this article, IMHO it should be deleted. -- Writtenonsand 19:08, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Shahid Pratap Singh of Punja Sahib]] needs your help