Talk:João Goulart

message: Both IPA given pronounces of the middle name Belchior are wrong about the accent. Belchior is oxytone, so emphasis on BelchiOR.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 177.40.121.71 (talk) 09:12, 24 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Pronounce

message: I would really like to see some citations concerning CIA warships off the coast of Brazil during the military coup of 1964.P97dav45 22:33, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Request for Citation

message: From the 5th paragraph: "Also, the congressmen was ressented with loss of power and pressure made by Goulart in some occasions (like the "Comício das Reformas", Reform's rally)." 
I'm trying to clean up the article, but I'm not sure what this sentence means. crazyeddie 18:25, 23 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: It is interesting, I do not believe that the "Reform Rally" as you called it is in the article at all at the moment. This is highly irregular.--Kiyarrlls-talk 19:45, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fifth paragraph sentence

message: What political parties were involved? Could Quadros be described as a conservative? Also need more information on Goulart's reforms. crazyeddie 18:45, 23 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Vargas created two parties Brazilian Labor Party, and the Social Democratic Party (Brazil. Opposed was the National Democratic Union (Brazil). The Brazilian Communist Party was influential especially because of Luis Carlos Prestes. Janio was from the opposition, his candidateship was launched by Sao Paulo's PTN, but supported by the UDN. Since voters could choose President and Vice-President separately, it was a man from a different party and ideology who would have the Vice Presidency, namely Joao Goulart from the Brazilian Labor Party strongly leftist as the name suggests.--Kiyarrlls-talk 17:44, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

text: Quadros was a populist domestically but politically he advanced non alignment. His most significant characteristic was against the idea of adherence to either the Capitalist or Soviet blocks, and defended non alignment as advanced by the Asian-African Conference. It is the most important because it was the cause of attrition between the right wing establishment associated with capitalist block multinationals, who decried him as a communist for reopening diplomatic relations with the USSR and attempting to open a commercial relationship with countries of the socialist block.--Kiyarrlls-talk 20:07, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Parties and Conservative Quadros and Reforms

message: I am removing this paragraph:
According to senator Jarbas Passarinho, 1964 coup d´etat avoided the imminent communist threat represented by several world and local manifestations, such as: militar insubordination in 1963 in Brasilia, mariners in 1964; Fidel Castro´s, Che Guevarra´s, China, Soviet Union and Cold War. Even militaries wanted to move forward with democracy, since economy was growing and Medici was a very popular president. Passarinho states that Colombia still faces civil wars, and that Brasil could have had the same fate if it was not the military government. He also point out that although censorship was severe, it was Latin America´s softest since media[1] supported the coup and along with the Congress was still open and operating[2]. This public support was extended to entrepeneurs, business people, mid class, who also supported the National Renewal Alliance Party, the situationist party [3]. One could add a comment based in the country´s history which has a steady tradition of conservative governments and severe repression against social revolutions, since monarchy, right-wing republicanism and today´s neoliberalism
.
In addition to the very poor English, it is an apologia for the coup and has little to do with the actual subject of the article.
---fzirp, 18 July 2007
::Iam sorry, my english looks much better than that of the article --which is awfull. In the first paragraph it is said that artists, and ordinary people were exiled. It is true but it offers only one side of the history --there is the side of reality. There was public support, from media, people, etc. Chine is mentioned and I did just the same by giving a world view, a global context.
:Anyway, I do look forward to see you speaking/wrting in portuguese, french, german, italian...any other laguage. 
:--Ludovicapipa yes? 12:50, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: According to senator Jarbas Passarinho, 1964 coup d´etat avoided the imminent communist threat represented by several world and local manifestations, such as: militar insubordination in 1963 in Brasilia, mariners in 1964; Fidel Castro´s, Che Guevarra´s, China, Soviet Union and Cold War. Passarinho states that Colombia still faces civil wars, and that Brasil could have had the same fate if it was not for the military government. He also point out that although censorship was severe, it was Latin America´s softest since mediaEm nota de redação, a Folha explicou que "O regime militar (1964-1985) passou por diferentes fases. No contexto da polarização da época, que dividia o país, a Folha aprovou a deposição do presidente Goulart. Esteve sob censura entre 1969 e 1983, quando a supressão das liberdades públicas atingiu seu ponto máximo. A partir de 1974, o jornal foi uma das principais vozes a reivindicar a democratização do país."  supported the coup and along with the Congress was still open and operating ítulo:  Golpe 'foi inevitável, mas durou demais', diz Jarbas Passarinho (The coup was unavoidable but lasted too long . This public support was extended to entrepreneurs, business people, mid class, who also supported the National Renewal Alliance Party, the situationist party Brasil 1964: Revolução ou contra-revolução?. One could add a comment, based in the country´s history, that it has a steady tradition of conservative governments and severe repression against social revolutions, since the Monarchy, right-wing republicanism and today´s neoliberalism.
This content is already duplicated in the 1964 coup article. There's no reason to try to add opinion justification to the coup in an article about João Goulart. This is one of those clear "Main Article" sections.--Dali-Llama 04:35, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don´t agree. I find very imporant to offer a local and global overview. Ludovicapipa yes? 06:58, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: How is this a local or global viewpoint? This is the opinion of a man who was part of the dictatorship. It shouldn't be part of an article about a man who was deposed by the very same dictatorship, but certainly part of the article on the coup itself. You see no conflict of interest and lack of a neutral point of view in doing so?--Dali-Llama 08:16, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

text: A local and global historical overview, porvided by his statement. I think he didn´t state his opinion, quite the contrary, he talked abt historical facts (local and global). As for his guessing abt Colombia, it is assumed he is someone from the system. Ludovicapipa yes? 11:08, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's his opinion. Not that the facts happened, but rather that these events justified the coup. That's his rationale. So would you have a problem if I added a similar paragraph from someone opposing the coup saying that it wasn't justified?--Dali-Llama 17:43, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

text: No I don´t care if you add, as long as you cite and it looks proper and linked to the article. I fixed the link and it looks Ok. Ludovicapipa yes? 10:31, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I will reinsert Passarinho´s statements. I think you rare inserting Gapari´s point of view and I don´t agree with that. Gaspari is someone who opposes militars --he is a communist and his point of view is that of someone against militars. Ludovicapipa yes? 11:44, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I was very careful not to insert opinion, just narrative. I'm not trying to justify the coup or condemn it: just to explain the sequence of events. There's no opinion in what he's saying. When there is opinion, it should be clearly stated and prefaced (as is done in the passarinho quote).--Dali-Llama 12:40, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Jarbas Passarinho paragraph

message: I've removed:
:According to senator Jarbas Passarinho, 1964 coup d´etat avoided the imminent communist threat represented by several world and local manifestations, such as: militar insubordination in 1963 in Brasilia, mariners in 1964; Fidel Castro´s, Che Guevarra´s, China, Soviet Union and Cold War. Passarinho states that Colombia still faces civil wars, and that Brasil could have had the same fate if it was not for the military government. He also point out that although censorship was severe, it was Latin America´s softest since mediaEm nota de redação, a Folha explicou que "O regime militar (1964-1985) passou por diferentes fases. No contexto da polarização da época, que dividia o país, a Folha aprovou a deposição do presidente Goulart. Esteve sob censura entre 1969 e 1983, quando a supressão das liberdades públicas atingiu seu ponto máximo. A partir de 1974, o jornal foi uma das principais vozes a reivindicar a democratização do país."  supported the coup and along with the Congress was still open and operating ítulo:  Golpe 'foi inevitável, mas durou demais', diz Jarbas Passarinho (The coup was unavoidable but lasted too long . This public support was extended to entrepreneurs, business people, mid class, who also supported the National Renewal Alliance Party, the situationist party Brasil 1964: Revolução ou contra-revolução?. One could add a comment, based in the country´s history, that it has a steady tradition of conservative governments and severe repression against social revolutions, since the Monarchy, right-wing republicanism and today´s neoliberalism.
This content is already duplicated in the 1964 coup article. There's no reason to try to add opinion justification to the coup in an article about João Goulart. This is one of those clear "Main Article" sections.--Dali-Llama 04:35, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don´t agree. I find very imporant to offer a local and global overview. Ludovicapipa yes? 06:58, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: How is this a local or global viewpoint? This is the opinion of a man who was part of the dictatorship. It shouldn't be part of an article about a man who was deposed by the very same dictatorship, but certainly part of the article on the coup itself. You see no conflict of interest and lack of a neutral point of view in doing so?--Dali-Llama 08:16, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

text: A local and global historical overview, porvided by his statement. I think he didn´t state his opinion, quite the contrary, he talked abt historical facts (local and global). As for his guessing abt Colombia, it is assumed he is someone from the system. Ludovicapipa yes? 11:08, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's his opinion. Not that the facts happened, but rather that these events justified the coup. That's his rationale. So would you have a problem if I added a similar paragraph from someone opposing the coup saying that it wasn't justified?--Dali-Llama 17:43, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

text: No I don´t care if you add, as long as you cite and it looks proper and linked to the article. I fixed the link and it looks Ok. Ludovicapipa yes? 10:31, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I will reinsert Passarinho´s statements. I think you rare inserting Gapari´s point of view and I don´t agree with that. Gaspari is someone who opposes militars --he is a communist and his point of view is that of someone against militars. Ludovicapipa yes? 11:44, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I was very careful not to insert opinion, just narrative. I'm not trying to justify the coup or condemn it: just to explain the sequence of events. There's no opinion in what he's saying. When there is opinion, it should be clearly stated and prefaced (as is done in the passarinho quote).--Dali-Llama 12:40, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  removed Section justifying coup 

message: I know Goulart is populist, but do populist=left-wing in English? He was capitalist n' lovin' it, from what I know, being friends with Vargas (fascist sympathizer populist). He wasn't even a social-democrat! He fully supported the United States government diplomatically during the missile crisis, and he was a wealthy landowner. He was, at most, a centrist, and that's only because he promised (we can't even know for sure if that would really happen) to modernize the country's (capitalist) economy to avoid economical collapse, and give some benefits to workers in exchange for political support. Hardly the Godless commie-lovin' dictator-wannabe anti-American bastard the supporters of the coup wanted the world to believe he was. --200.222.30.9 15:51, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Left wing and right wing first of all have different meanings in different times and in different places. In the temporal context of the Cold War the world was polarized, approximation to the Soviet Union meant "Communist", nationalism was seen as anti-USA and therefore pro-Soviet Union. Furthermore in regards to the location, Brazil had an oligarchical past which was opposed most stringently by the dictatorship. Thus while "Varguismo" seems to carry the right-wing aspects of dicatorship and industrialism, in the context of Brazil it does represent Left-Wing politics.--Kiyarrlls-talk 01:16, 30 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Goulart, left-wing? 

message: This Brazilian site: [Carta Capital] from a Brazilian magazine writes that Jango's son claims Jango was murdered. I don't believe that Jango was murdered.Agre22 (talk) 20:05, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Jango's son claims:His father was murdered

message: I read in a Brazilian book that Jango was arrested in 1944, because he was drunk and naked. Is this true?Agre22 (talk) 20:05, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Jango was arrested, because he was drunk and naked?

message: I don't know enough about this topic to be comfortable making edits, but the last two paragraphs of the "military coup" section definitely do not adhere to a neutral point of view.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.162.103.75 (talk) 10:03, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: No they don't, and they are also redundant. I removed them. — McDutchie (talk) 09:44, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Violation of Neutral Point of View 

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060210193734/http://brazilnow.info/books01.php?ID_Books_Title=27 to http://www.brazilnow.info/books01.php?ID_Books_Title=27
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Interesting transcript of an Oval Office conversation which took place on October 7, 1963https://nsarchive2.gwu.edu/NSAEBB/NSAEBB465/docs/Document%209%20brazil-jfk%20tapes-100763-revised.pdf Details about his plans for Brazil have been confirmed.2601:447:4101:41F9:2D6B:2FC6:661E:168B (talk) 19:59, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: JFK was basically the leader of the coup

message: Jango's son, João Goulart Filho is notable enough to have an English article? He was State Deputy from Rio Grande do Sul between 1982-1986 and disputed the elections in 2018 as part of the Free Fatherland Party. Erick Soares3 (talk) 16:36, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jango's son article 

message: An article in Reader's Digest which appeared a few years after the coup was effusive in its praise for the coup and its leaders. If it were not written by the coup leaders propagandists, it could have been.  It was entitled, "Brazil: The Country That Saved Itself".  Does anyone with access to back issues of RD and an interest know what number it was that contains this.  It should somehow be mentioned in the article, or perhaps even more, the article devoted to the coup.  72.105.77.31 (talk) 20:26, 9 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  ''Reader's Digest'' article