Talk:Sigmar Gabriel

message: why does en.wiki call all German Ministerpräsidenten minister-president exept for the Ministerpräsidenten of Lower Saxony which en.wiki calls prime minister - that does not make much sence doesn't it?178.210.114.106 (talk) 16:13, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Prime minister vs. minister-president 

message: Bei Euch auf dem " Commonwealth of England, Scotland and Ireland", Britannien, London, Vereinigtes Königreich, United Kingdom, Wales, Schottland, Ireland leben 17.000.000 Millionen Menschen "Yes Brexit". "Die sagen all, wir leben auf der Insel im Atlantik" (siehe Karte https://www.google.se/maps/@52.8061121,-1.2638921,397089a,35y,270h/data=!3m1!1e3). Der Deutsche Bundestag hat ein Bundesgesetz verabschiedet, die Europäische Union ist sich nicht einig (EU-Kommission sagt JA, Europäisches Parlament sagt NEIN), dass die 35 Millionen Menschen die vom Deutschen Staat bezahlt werden (25 Millionen deutsche Rentner) auf der Insel (ohne Ireland) in den Monaten Juni 2017, Juli 2017, August 2017, September 2017' fuer jedes Auto 50 Pfund und fuer jede Person 50 Pfund pro Person pro Tag (24 Stunden) (100 Pfund) bezahlen muessen fuer eine nach Deutschen Vorbild Jahr 2017 per Bundesgesetz verabschiedete Infrastrukturabgabe (Fahrzeug (PKW, LKW, BUS)- Maut) bezahlen sollen. Eine Bahnfahrt von Hamburg (SPD) nach Muenchen (CSU) bei der Deutschen Bahn (deutschebahn.de; db.de) kostet pro Person 120 Euro (Zugfahrtzeit 5-6 Stunden ICE) 192.121.232.253 (talk) 07:17, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: Hallo Breidten, Hallo Briten, Hallo Britten, Hallo Beid

message: I don't speak German, so I didn't want to mess around with the citation without knowing what it says, but it seems like this part should be removed from the "early life and family" section:
"and, in honor of his father, devoted crypto-Fascist."  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:8805:9205:E00:418C:42E6:FA7B:C227 (talk) 04:16, 8 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Devoted crypto-fascist"?  

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The user TheRandomIP wants to have it out, I disagree with that. Therefore I ask for others to look at it. --Nov3rd17 (talk) 18:02, 4 March 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should the content till Feb. 20 in section "arms exports" be part of the article? 

message: I've read the above and would appreciate some clarifications: What sources does each of you have, irrespective of language, to support their position? Please quote as accurately as you can in English. Also, could you please summarize your understanding of the relationship between the office of the German Minister of Foreign Affairs and the exportation of arms from Germany? François Robere (talk) 13:56, 5 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: The only thing you have to know is that the paragraph and their cites sources said "Merkel's government has approved XY" and from there it is clear that a conclusion like "and therefore Gabriel supports XY" (which is indirectly implied if something is written in a paragraph about Gabriels political positions) is invalid in terms of WP:SYNTH. Please note that the discussion is not finished yet as we are still exchanging arguments and trying to come up with a solution (e.g. rephrasing or using better sources that actually support the conclusion "and therefore Gabriel supports XY"). User Nov3rd17 is known to use meta sites like Third Opinion way too early (and he has been banned repeatedly for misusing meta sites, just saying...) Therefore I think it's too early to make a final decision. Sorry...  --TheRandomIP (talk) 17:50, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

text: As I have already told you, if you have sources that criticize Gabriel for an increase in arms exports, you can add this to the article. The previous section in the article did not cite such sources. Just make a proposal instead of wasting other users time by unnecessary early inquiries to Third Opinion. We are not that far away from each other. --TheRandomIP (talk) 08:10, 7 March 2018 (UTC)

text: This goes in the right direction. I would support the addition of "Gabriel has been criticized by opposition leaders for failing to prevent several deals that resulted in a significant rise in German arms exports during his tenure." to the article. However, I think it has to be discussed whether a separate section "Notable deals decided during his tenure" makes sense. Not only is merger not related to arms export (should be removed from the article altogether) but also can this draw an incomplete picture. For example he may have withdrew permission for Rheinmetall which is a single but notable event. However, at the same time he may have approved many smaller deals not notable enough in isolation but in combination exceed the volume of all the single, notable events. I would just leave it as it is and not create a separate section. --TheRandomIP (talk) 16:50, 7 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text:  The section as-is, I think, needs a bit more work: both paragraphs start with essentially the same topic - a reservation regarding arms sales - but continue in separate directions, with the deals being somewhat out-of-place in both (I'm not sure the first is an example of unusual caution, and the latter of unusual leniency). Hence my suggestion of either tying everything more neatly, or separating the deals from the explanation. François Robere (talk) 19:15, 7 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text:  Ok, I see. I'd prefer to go the other direction and make the deals more connected to the rest of the chapter. But I think the Rheinmetall deal is already somewhat connected because it is temporally close to his announcement of a "more cautious approach"; to what it is already connected in the paragraph. The Krauss-Maffei Wegmann deal should be removed altogether, because as far as I can see here the question is not about arms export but about fair trading (cartel); remember Gabriel was head of the ministry of economics which includes much more than just arms exports. I you have no obligations I would implement the things we already agree on which is the addition of one sentence (and the removal of the Krauss-Maffei Wegmann deal if you'd also agree on this). --TheRandomIP (talk) 17:30, 8 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree with one inclusion (only highlighted here) : "Gabriel has been criticized by opposition leaders and the press for failing to prevent several deals that resulted in a significant rise in German arms exports during his tenure." and a press article (in English language) as source. Is that agreeable? --Nov3rd17 (talk) 17:34, 8 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Which source do you mean exactly? --TheRandomIP (talk) 17:55, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

text: German Weapons Exports Reached Highest Level on Record in 2015 or  14-Year High: German Arms Exports Peak or The New Arab: German arms exports to Arab, Middle Eastern countries surge amid conflict or World: Germans up in arms about weapons sales to Turkey and others (Washington Post) and so on .. or best my first source: Germany's cabinet approved record-breaking arms exports (dw.com) --Nov3rd17 (talk) 19:16, 8 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see critique by the press of minister Gabriel. As far as I can see, the press only reports about critique that others have voiced (in specific the opposition parties the Left and the Greens). Therefore I would not support the addition of "and the press". --TheRandomIP (talk) 19:28, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

text: The articles in German language are critical: like Sigmar Gabriel: Der Rüstungsminister from Die Zeit. Or: Rüstungsexporte: Wie Gabriel seine Glaubwürdigkeit verspielt (But Google translation has formatting issues with both.) --Nov3rd17 (talk) 20:11, 8 March 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, these sources actually support the addition, so I am no longer against it. It's important that the claims in the article are supported by sources, even if the sources are in a different language. What's the point of having an english source when the content does not support your text? --TheRandomIP (talk) 20:21, 8 March 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Third opinion