Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Anime and manga/Yu-Gi-Oh!/Archive 1

message: Hello to all reading this, I am SWD316. I have officialy opened up the project page WikiProject Yu-Gi-Oh! to get a better perspective on everything related to Yu-Gi-Oh!. — Moe ε 22:29, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Founding of WikiProject Yu-Gi-Oh! 

message: We need to come up with a checklist of some kind so we can better organize what needs to be done. Anyone have any suggestions? — Moe ε 23:13, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  Good Suggestion, I'll add it to the To-Do list here on the discussion page of this project. Can anyone else come up with other good ideas? — Moe ε 17:58, 4 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ideas 

message: Someone please merge Atemu with Yugi Mutou. Or do that thing where Atemu automatically redirects to Yugi Mutou. I'd do it but I don't know how. Geg 16:46, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. (the code is #REDIRECT article Setokaiba 18:59, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Request

message: As some of you may have noticed, I have recently taken a harsh stance on users (be they registered or no) creating articles on unimportant cards such as Giga Gagagigo. I propose that unless these cards are important for reference to the anime, we get rid of them, and instead make articles along the lines of this one.
Also, how about making the individual, unnoteworthy articles speedy delete candidates? Setokaiba 17:23, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The problem with doing E-HERO articles is that they essentially turn into lists of cards; at least DM and BEWD have a history that can be summarised. Setokaiba✌≝ 18:31, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Cards

message: How about making articles on all characters and cards that took an important role in the anime or the manga?
Locke2457 13:10, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Anime & Manga

message: I'll put it simply. They are fancruft. On top of that, they are lists, which should be avoided in favor of prose.
Consider the needs of the newcomer. Will the newcomer be interested in a list of cards without any meaning or explanation? Most likely not. I propose that we scrap the long lists in favor of notable cards, something like my edit of Yugi Mutou. That kind of writing would be more interesting to readers, and not something they'd just skip over. Please leave the cruft to fansites. The exclusion of minor cards will not in anyway harm Wikipedia's coverage of Yu-Gi-Oh!'s various characters. --Apostrophe 23:23, 1 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  I agree with Apostrophe.  In the end, there're TOO much cards to list on.  And this is an encyclopedia, not fan-site.Baron 03:53, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Card lists in character articles

message: This user is engaging in mass spamming of the Yu-Gi-Oh! card articles. I suggest that we revert all of his edits and block him for at least a week. Who agrees? (No, I have not dealt with it. It is too extensive for me alone, and I do not know all of the pages involved) Setokaiba 18:00, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: User:220.233.30.154

message: I thought you might like to know that the template  and the category Yu-Gi-OH! stubs are currently up for deletion at Stub types for deletion. The project's input on the arguments raised there, would be helpful. --TheParanoidOne 15:11, 14 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stub type up for deletion 

message: Well, someone sent me an invite onto this here WikiProject - although I made a lot of edits to the Yugi and Kaiba articles in the past, I don't think I could be a part of this WikiProject simply as I have nothing constructive to add (I don't get GX here, I haven't seen the final anime story arc, I don't read the manga, and I suck at the game).
But here are a few cleanup proposals that could be helpful to the project to get its wheels rolling:
* Template:Yu-Gi-Oh! Directory needs to be cleaned up badly.  It is twice as big as any other TOC template that I've seen (it takes up a whole freaking screen on my viewport), it breaks style conventions for TOC templates, and I believe it may just have too much data (booksource links are not worthy of being put into a TOC).  I highly recommend that you have a separate GX template, a separate manga-only template, an anime-only template, a characters-only template, and so on.
* The "notable cards" should only list cards that are notable.  Yugi having Dark Magician is notable, as DM is a key monster with lots of character buildup.  Yugi having Mirror Force is not - just because pretty much everyone else has one.
* We really shouldn't write about minor characters in any series, as being a minor character does not by itself imply notability.  Shizuka, Otogi, Mai, etc. are okay as they are part of the supporting cast.  Dartz, Siegfried, etc. are okay as they are key antagonists.  But do we really to mention Jean Claude Magnum, a one-shot character only superfically related to a supporting character?
* There are lots of really long paragraphs with run-on sentences.  Good prose leads to good articles.
* We don't really need to repeat ourselves by saying that Joey Wheeler is the English version name of Katsuya Jonouchi.  We should also be consistent with naming conventions - saying "Honda" in Battle City (Yu-Gi-Oh! story arc) and "Tristan" in Virtual World (Yu-Gi-Oh! story arc) speaks of the project's lack of coordination, the lack of coordination between the two articles, and thus lowering the article quality of both articles.
* Personally, using "a. k. a." reeks of poor style.  Replace conditional logic with polymorphism.
kelvSYC 07:19, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I understand most of the stuff (the card lists have been talked about before), but I see no reason to move the anime articles, especially Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters. Like I said, this is the English Wikipedia. If you do that, you might as well move the Yu-Gi-Oh! GX page to Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters GX. The minor character articles do need to stay, as most anime articles on Wikipedia do have a page dedicated to all the series' characters. Look at Naruto, One Piece, Fullmetal Alchemist, etc for examples of this. And yes, the template may be a little big, but at least get all the other templates ready and on their respective pages before removing all the content from the current one. I'm returning all the previous content to the current template until then. Geg 21:42, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I ask you this: would the casual fan know what "first series anime" or "second series anime" mean if they only saw the anime for the first time?  To the reader unfamiliar to the series, this distinction would not make sense.  Using Yu-Gi-Oh! (Toei) and Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters removes the ambiguity, and aids in the disambiguation process.  It's not whether we are in the English Wikipedia or not, it's all about how we can tell the series apart for the aid of the casual reader. There is no ambiguity with GX, so we don't need to move GX there.  kelvSYC 21:50, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The casual fan would also not know what "Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters" is either since the show is only called that in Japan. The formal title of the English series is just "Yu-Gi-Oh!". And yes, the fact that this is the English Wikipedia does matter. There are rules about calling things by their most commonly-used English names, or at least the name used by the most popular medium. Names like Katsuya Jonouchi instead of Joey Wheeler are used because the article follows the names used in the English manga. At least I think that's the reason; I'm not entirely sure on everything. Talk to WhisperToMe for more details on that. Geg 22:12, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The reason that the names are that way is because YGO is originally a manga medium, and that we use manga names whenever we can - we'd move Jaden Yuki if there was an English GX manga adaptation that used Judai as the name of its main character.  We also need the Duel Monsters part to differentiate it from the earlier Toei series.  Saying "first series" or "second series" does not aid either series in telling it apart from the other - the fact that the NAS series uses a different name is a great aid to tell the two apart.  Whether it is the English Wikipedia or not does not help to make that difference known.  WP:NC does not help us here, it only makes it worse. kelvSYC 03:48, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

text: Most series have pages dedicated to all the characters, but they are not that well written in general.  We do not need characters that appear once and never to reappear again.  We only need to keep main characters and significant recurring characters. kelvSYC 21:50, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  kelvSYC's thoughts on the Yu-Gi-Oh WikiProject 

message: Hello. As many have seen, I've done a series of short analysis on the decks of various Yu-Gi-Oh characters (see Ryo Bakura, Vellian Crowler, and more for a few examples), and since no one has objected or deleted them, I've assumed they're generally accepted. Does anyone mind me doing more for the rest of the characters then? I'm quite adept at the TCG, hence my grasp on the subject is likely quite better than most people. My thanks. Sephiroth BCR talk 5:15 , 3 April 2006 (UTC)
The problem is that deck analysis is inherently POV - I'm worried about whether deck analysis is strictly your own opinion or general consensus of the gaming community.  We can't avoid it as the story revolves around the game, and the deck is indicative of the character's personality.  kelvSYC 18:24, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Leave it to fan sites, not encyclopedia.Baron 03:54, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Deck Analysis 

message: I'll join the Yu-Gi-Oh! WikiProject.  How can I help?! User:Dark Magician 17:33, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Your already helping. :-D Keep up the good editing (related to Yu-Gi-Oh!). By joining, you can now have a neutral place to discuss articles related to Yu-Gi-Oh! and have a place to come to if your ever in need of advice. Moe ε 21:37, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yu-Gi-Oh! WikiProject 

message: Should the policy:
#If no dub or translated manga, Japanese names (e.g. the first series and the first film).
#If dub but no translated manga, dub names (e.g. most of GX, filler arcs).
#If dub and translated manga, manga, names (the main series)
be mentioned somewhere on this talk page or in the main article? Setokaiba✌≝ 09:59, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Policy on character names 

message: Is it possible for someone to block this user, or at least caution him, because this person keeps deleting the tables about the Dark Magician related cards. Glenn Browne 17:55, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: User:84.27.205.3

message: Could I write good detailed episode guides? I'm sure Yu-Gi-Oh! is a notable enough series, and Wikipedia has a certain policy for episode guides I could be sure to follow. Maybe we could include that. Matty-chan 02:04, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Episode guides 

message: With the recent addition of the Capsule Monsters adventure to the Yugioh universe, should the monsters used in the Capsule Monsters movies be added to the card lists? If so, it would mainly have 'Thunder Kid' added to Tristan's cards, and 'Dark Witch' added to Tea's. User: Drake Clawfang, June 1, 2006. 5:00 PM EST.
I don't see why not, I mean they are still theirs. Matty-chan 17:50, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Capsule Monsters 

message: Also, I decided to make redirecting pages with the Japanese titles, like Insector Combo that redirect to the article page. Good or bad idea?
Matty-chan 17:51, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Japanese titles 

message: How about a section for manga and card game differences? Sounds like a good idea to me. Matty-chan 23:16, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Difference 

message: Considering how much I contribute, I'd like to officially join the project, if I may. User: Drake Clawfang, June 16, 2006. 3:14 PM EST.
::Of course you're free to join. — The King of Kings 23:08, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Joining 

message: I cut the deck related text out of Yu-Gi-Oh! Trading Card Game and moved it because that article is too big... but I can't find any references for the deck types. I would appreciate it if someone could dig one up. Salad Days 18:00, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That should probably be entitled "List of...", per policy. As for a reference, I doubt that anyone has ever bothered to compile an exhaustive list of deck types, just those prominent in a specific format... Setokaiba✌≝ 19:20, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Yu-Gi-Oh! Deck Formats and Strategies]]

message: Nearly every page on the list of Yu-Gi-Oh Cards has been nominated for deletion! We have to get out there and stop it from happening, those pages have valuable content that some jerk is trying to get rid off. User: Drake Clawfang.
*I'm not entirely opposed to the deletion, and was initially going to nominate Elemental Heroes for speedy deletion myself.  We have a Yu-Gi-Oh wiki where card information can be found. Danny Lilithborne 20:28, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Speedy Deletion 

message: Just a heads-up, I will be removing specific card effects and other card spoiler from articles when I see them, per both WP:NOT a gameguide and WP:NOT duplication of primary source material. I would appreciate help in this. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 20:52, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spoiler info 

message: Okay, recently we've had a lot of edit wars over the Card articles, specifically the lists of cards. I think I have a solution. Playability sections should be scrapped, lose them, they're fan-based and can't be sourced, we can't keep them. Keep the stats of the card in question, it's Attribute, Type, etc: if the article is about the card, the stats all but have to be stated. Do not list the stats of the other cards in the series, but do list their names. In the case of Red-Eyes and Blue-Eyes, keep their "Relation to (insert other dragon here)" sections on the ground it demonstrates the rivalry between Joey and Kaiba. Can we agree on this? 
Oh, and I apoligize to AMIB for the above, which was rather rude. However, it does seem AMiB, a lot of your edits seem to remove information as opposed to adding it. Drake
Yeah, it's unfortunate when information has to be removed, but sometimes it's necessary. I think there might be something that can be written about the use of the cards; there has to be some published descriptions of the evolution of the competitive environment, maybe in one of the game player magazines (Scrye/Inquest/etc.)
As for the card stats themselves, they need to go. Not only are they copyright violations (and I realize other sites republish this, but Wikipedia just isn't other sites), but they're also verbatim source material. They just can't stay; I'd suggest linking to a site that does publish spoilers, as an alternative. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:42, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Game Guide Edits 

message: Hello. The WikiProject Council is currently in the process of developing a master directory of the existing WikiProjects to replace and update the existing Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory.  These WikiProjects are of vital importance in helping wikipedia achieve its goal of becoming truly encyclopedic. Please review the following pages: 
*User:Badbilltucker/Culture Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Culture Directory 2, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Philosophy and religion Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Sports Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Geographical Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Geographical Directory/United States, (note: This page will be retitled to more accurately reflect its contents)
*User:Badbilltucker/History and society directory, and
*User:Badbilltucker/Science directory
and make any changes to the entries for your project that you see fit. There is also a directory of portals, at User:B2T2/Portal, listing all the existing portals. Feel free to add any of them to the portals or comments section of your entries in the directory.
The three columns regarding assessment, peer review, and collaboration are included in the directory for both the use of the projects themselves and for that of others. Having such departments will allow a project to more quickly and easily identify its most important articles and its articles in greatest need of improvement. If you have not already done so, please consider whether your project would benefit from having departments which deal in these matters. 
It is my hope to have the existing directory replaced by the updated and corrected version of the directory above by November 1. Please feel free to make any changes you see fit to the entries for your project before then. If you should have any questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you. B2T2 22:22, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry if you tried to update it before, and the corrections were gone. I have now moved the new draft in the old directory pages, so the links should work better. My apologies for any confusion this may have caused you. B2T2 14:09, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Project Directory 

message: I suggest splitting the Yugioh template. It was brought up on the template discussion screen and I agree that the template is a bit large. I think we should split it into a Character template and a merchandise/anime and manga template. Drake
* As per this concern, I've split the template in two: one template for the original series, and another for GX. Whatever is shared between the two series, however, I've left untouched, such as the TCG, Duel Disks, video games, etc. --Benten 17:25, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Splitting the Template

message: I have a few issues to discuss. Why should we keep calling Spell Cards Magic Cards for our characters. Also, the Legendary Dragon cards are not Magic Cards, they're monster cards. and I think Capsule Monsters with Duel Monsters, they're totally different. If you still disagree, tell me why.
The Legendary Ranger 22:24, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Magic Vs. Spells 

message: You guys said that for Tristan/Honda's notable dueling cards, Rare Metal Soul is the same as the Rare Metalmorph from the Rise of Destiny pack. Where's the proof that they are indeed the same? they sound different because they are different types of cards with different images, names, and effects.
The Legendary Ranger 16:14, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rare Metal Soul 

message: I have noticed in a lot of the seperate card articles that the beginning of the introduction and the categories all link to the Yu-Gi-Oh! Wikia. I think that this should not be, and that the links need to be in an External Links section of the article. Before I went ahead with this, I wanted to know what everyone thinks about it. Red Director 01:52, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Links to the Yu-Gi-Oh! Wikia 

message: Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 16:38, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wikipedia Day Awards