Talk:Dorje Shugden/Archive 2

message: high robertect, thank you for opening a section on that theme. I extended the section to give different views. I expelled the passage:
Further expression to the desire for religious homogenity can be seen in the formation and activities of the United Party between 1964 and 1973. This party was established by Gyalo Thundup [7]the brother and representative of the Dalai Lama. Amongst its objectives was the creation of "a single reformed Buddhist temple for all the sects [7] ". The 16th Karmapa in particular was instrumental in opposing this movement, organising what become known as the Thirteen Settlements see also [8] and [9].
I do not understand what this passage is for, especially it is not reasonable to me why the creation of "a single reformed Buddhist temple for all the sects" is a sign for "the desire for religious homogenity". The same could be argued to the Rime movement. I understand that Geshe Kelsang is accusing HHDL for only being interested in gaining power and control over all Tibetan schools and their adepts - which is based mere on his belives than facts, I think and with that opinion he is quite alone. However if you can reasoning this passage we can reinlcude it, please discuss it here or make the passage more clear, thank you very much, --Kt66 22:59, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi Kt, I removed the Geshe Kelsang quote because it is now out of context, in this quote he is referring specifically to the United Party. If you read in more detail about the United Party you will see that the idea was to consolidate all of the resources and followers of the different schools under one school, headed and controlled by the Dalai Lama and as such it is not related to the Rime movement. However it is a controversial topic and I understand if it is not included. Best wishes (Robertect 11:25, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi [User:Robertect|Robertect]], thank you. I agree the United Party must not be directly related to the Rime Movement but I think the idea is the same. But for this I have to read it in detail as you still said. The idea of seeing in this a political attempt of gaining power ("controlled by the Dalai Lama") I can not follow, outsite of NKT, Trimondis, Ole Nydahl, Shamar Rinpoche and Shugden followers the Dalai Lama is a high respected spiritual person, also to Theravadins and other Buddhist traditions and religious poeple and even scientists; for that people it is natural to see him as a head of such an idea of an open non secterian school or temple without including the idea to see this as a political power attempt. There exist a nunnery for western nuns in Dharamsala with this approach and natural they see HHDL as their head yet. But of course it may be "a controversial topic" here. Nevertheless I felt to include your citation of GKG POV, expressed in his letter. It fits in the section of GKG/NKT so I remove it there. many regards. --Kt66 13:15, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: political dimension

message: Could this documentary be of use? http://www.dalailama.com/page.157.htm --Aryah 07:31, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Documentary link?

message: Dear Editors, Dear Robertect, I didn't follow the changes of the article and didn't read it. I have not the interest to work more on that article so that's why I refrain from further editor work. If someone is familiar with the matter he/she can check the changes. The article I can agree with I published at: http://info-buddhismus.de/new_kadampa_tradition.html#Shugden . Take care, Shugden is the neverending story ;-) I make an end. --Kt66 19:47, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Robertect's last changes (July/August 2006)

message: This section should be improved and balanced. It's just a start. --Kt66 14:10, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: NKT/SSC/Shugden conflict in the west - NKT's media campaign and the medias reaction