Talk:Ipperwash Crisis

message: H&K machine gun sentence, that gun has been used for years by SWAT police forces, a regular police officer does not carry such a weapon, the statement seems to represent every police officer. Please rectify. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ajayfahlman (talk • contribs).
The statement that there were burial grounds that Ipperwash was built upon is ultimately inconclusive. Reports are that it was only a claim and has not been verified to either point otherwise. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by BT14 (talk • contribs).
Dudley George was the driver of the bus that the natives had used to attempt to run over the police officers.  As well, the statement that the native was arrested in a "violent and brutal fashion" sounds hardly like an unbiased report, as only the natives claim that undue force was used. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.115.129.253 (talk • contribs).
:According to Peter Edwards' book (One Dead Indian, p.7]), Nicholas Cottrelle was the driver of the bus, and was wounded by police gunfire.  Dudley George was not on the bus. If you have another reference, please cite.--Bcholmes 18:05, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: Two additional points seem topical, and I am considering adding them to the article. 
First, Ken Deane didn't just think that Dudley George had a rifle, but later realized that it was only a stick.  Deane maintained all through the appeal process that Dudley George really had a rifle, and that the native protesters were armed.  If anything, this hurt Deane's case: all he'd have to do is convincingly say that he thought Dudley George had a rifle at the time of the shooting.  That it later turned out to be a stick isn't legally relevent.  Peter Edwards talks about why this position is hard to justify given other facts in the case.
Second, Edwards doesn't seem to address it, but in the testimonies before the Inquiry, some of the native protesters (such as, for example, Nicholas Cottrelle) testified that well before the shooting Deane threatened Dudley George with the claim that he'd be the first one killed.
-- Bcholmes 01:14, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Additional Points 

message: In the Background section of the article, it says:
"As early as 1993, while Camp Ipperwash was still being used as cadet summer training centre for the Royal Canadian Army Cadets, a few natives had occupied the an adjescent [sic] piece of land. After the summer of 1993, the cadet camp was no longer used, and cadet training was moved to CFB Borden. This illustrates that the natives occupied the land earlier then 1995."
- How do the facts 1) natives occupied adjacent land as early as 1993 and 2) cadet training was moved after the summer of 1993 illustrate that the natives occupied the land earlier then 1995? That's a stretch of logic, considering what facts that are given to illustrate the point. --130.47.34.2 17:58, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Background 

message: I propose to merge the article on Dudley George here. Besides 2 short sentences about the origin of his name and him being the 8th child, everything is related to the Ipperwash Crises. Clearly it makes therefore more sense to merge all that information in the Ipperwash Crises article and make the Dudley George article a redirect. -- P199 (talk) 14:02, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yep, probably a good idea, but we should keep all the info about him. - TheMightyQuill (talk) 16:40, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

text: *The 2 short personal notes can easily be incorporated into the Ipperwash Crises article as well. -- P199 (talk) 18:52, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

text: This seems like a pretty reasonable argument. The comparison with Louis Riel and Dudley George is valid some ways, but not in others. Riel was a prominent leader who was prominent and active for at least 15 years, whereas (at least, to my knowledge) George gained prominence only after his death. I'm not arguing that makes George unimportant, and his legacy is undoubtedly important and probably deserves an artcle, but there just isn't much content to include in an article about him. I don't think the move to merge was ignoring the significance of Dudley George, but simply acknowledged that, to the larger society (although obviously not to his family), his death was more significant than his life. I'm willing to hold off on a merger, but can you think of ways we could expand the Dudley George article? By the way, it sounds like an article on Sam George is definitely needed. - TheMightyQuill (talk) 16:52, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Merge proposal

message: The article depends much on one book and interpretation of the inquiry, which transcript is a primary, not secondary source.  It needs more valid third-party sources, since it appears most  significant for leading to changes in national and provincial policy.  This part could be expanded, rather than arguing details of exactly what happened that day.--Parkwells (talk) 17:51, 22 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Needs more third-party sources

message: I propose again to merge the article on Dudley George here. 3 years have gone by since the first proposal to allow time for the addition of more info and establish greater notability. That hasn't happened, so nearly everything is still related to the Ipperwash Crises. As per WP:VICTIM and WP:BLP1E, a person only notable for one event should generally not have an article on them. The little personal info can easily be merged. And don't compare him to Louis Riel: George didn't found a province! -- P 1 9 9 • TALK 16:42, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Merge proposal 2

message: I propose to merge the article on Ken Deane here. All the arguments related to Dudley George apply to him as well. Only notable for one event (WP:BLP1E). -- P 1 9 9 • TALK 17:20, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Merge proposal 3

message: I noticed when I was in Canada that the word "native" is commonly meant to refer to the Indians. For those of us outside Canada, it is a bit confusing at first. A "native" is someone who is born in a given country. Hence, even in this discussion (see above, "I am Canadian. I am not native.") we get confusing mix of terms. Literally, someone who is not native to Canada has come from another country. For someone born in Canada to say he is not "native" is a logical contradiction.
Some picky people may argue against "Indian" since the indigenous population in Canada did not come from India. Fair enough, but then words like "indigenous" or "aboriginal" or other such highly technical terms might be in order.
Furthermore, I contend that using the word "native" in reference only to the Indians is rather loaded and perhaps too confrontational for an encyclopaedia article. It challenges the legitimacy of the presence of the vast majority of Canadians who are of other ethnic origin but who otherwise were born there and may have had 6,8 or more generations of their family in that country. 
I think it is important that language be used precisely in Wikipedia. After all, Mike Harris is just as native to Canada as the late Dudley George was.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.58.104.89 (talk) 07:11, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Use of word "native" 

message: 'George was unarmed and an OPP officer fired and killed Dudley George, believing the flashlight he held in his hand was a weapon.' Surely we are not in a position to know what the officer believed, only what he later claimed. I propose changing this sentence to read (say) 'claiming that he took the flashlight he held in his hand to be a weapon'. SewerCat (talk) 14:02, 4 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: Use of the word 'believing'

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Ipperwash Crisis. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070310221858/http://scc.lexum.umontreal.ca/en/2001/2001scc5/2001scc5.html to http://scc.lexum.umontreal.ca/en/2001/2001scc5/2001scc5.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080229172020/http://www.ipperwashinquiry.ca/report/vol_1/pdf/E_Vol_1_Conclusion.pdf to http://www.ipperwashinquiry.ca/report/vol_1/pdf/E_Vol_1_Conclusion.pdf
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 05:35, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: changed "Death of Dudley George" to "Killing of Dudley George" per WP:DEATHS DJ (talk) 09:40, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Changed "Death" to "Killing" to follow Wikipedia policy 

message: kenneth deane of project maple is alive. Who paying his pension. 74.127.203.249 (talk) 21:35, 14 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Scapegoat of project maple