Talk:Dagorhir

message: I appreciate the edits to keep the article on topic - but as a relative Wiki neophyte I have a question: Is it valid to list just one of the many groups that were inspired by Dagorhir?  Belegarth is just the most recent one that has gone off and established itself as a separate group with its own identity, local groups and so on.  Amtgard, Emarthengarth, and Darkon are earlier ones that took the inspiration of the idea of fun medieval/dark age and fantasy reenactment with foam weapons and developed it in their own way.  
Despite Anonymous' arguments, Belegarth is only important to Dagorhir as an irritant online - with individuals hacking in ads here, trolling and redirecting people off of Dagorhir's websites and the like.  I've talked to folks in both groups, at events and online and most are either not knowledgeable of the other group or just want to go to local events and have fun. 
  
Kyrax 05:14, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It is my understanding that at the time of the split, Belegarth and Dagorhir split approximately 50/50 in terms of population.  Hence, it seemed to me to be a fairly powerful historical event that was worth at least a small mention, and not just a minor spin off.  It does not seem correct to label Belegarth as a group that merely is "inspired" by Dagorhir.  Instead, it seems proper to list Belegarth as a historical splinter group, much like the Latter Day Saint or other movements.  Hence, I allowed the historical reference to stay in the article.  I may not be happy with the way it is written, but as a historical schism, it probably should at least be mentioned.  In terms of the second link, in the "See Also" section, it is my impression that the rules set for Dagorhir and Belegarth are not just similar, but extremely similar. The rules set seems far closer to Dagorhir than SCA, Amtgard, Darkon, or any other game.  
*It doesn't matter where an IP address is located, vandalism is vandalism. Brutilus 15:26, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Are references to just one of several offshoot groups relevant or accurate? 

message: I would like you to verify that your numbers are ~not~ inflated by non-members from other groups such as Darkkon, SCA or Belegarth, as obviously there is a faction of folks who believe they are. I know of many peope who consider the games as interchangable, I will sight just a few (Crynolyn, Kyrax, Onyx, Magnus of Taurendor/Narnia, Athron, etc.) Go ahead, ask them, I dare you.
Dear Anonymous IP Address(or not quite so anonymous):
The material you are adding violates N:OR. It is also not Verifiable.  Lets examine each claim in turn and see if we can reach a consensus.  Remember, the burden is on you to support the challenged statements.
* This divide has caused ill will among Dagorhir leaders, but for the most part the fighters tend to treat the two organizations as interchangeable, attending the events that are most convenient for them, regardless of organization affiliation.
Do you have any sources that state the majority of fighters tend to treat the two organizations as interchangeable? Upon reading the Dagorhir board, it seems to me that treating the organizations as interchangeable is incorrect. Is it relevant that people in one game go play another game?  It seems we would be adding to the SCA section "People in SCA also fight in Darkon, Amtgard, Belegarth ,Dagorhir ,Nero, etc etc.  The article is about Dagorhir, not about what people in Dagorhir also happen to do. (That is because Dagorhir will barely acknowledge the existanc of other groups, much less work with them to promote the foam fighting community.)(Yes, I have sources who attend both dag and bel events regularly, as well as statements from Dag members on the Bel boards stating such.)
*This number may also be skewed by a large number of fighters that consider themselves members of Belegarth, who attend Dagorhir events from time to time.
Once again, the Belegarth members that attend Dagorhir events.  Is it relevant to the number of Dagorhir members the number of members fighting at a Dagorhir event who also happen to fight Belegarth?  Shall we list the SCA?  You get one bite at the apple. Belegarth split from Dagorhir. That is historical fact.  There may be crossover members, but at this point they are two distinct boffers, just like Nero and Darkon.
I'm very confused with the amount of changes going on here.  This is an encyclopedic article about Dagorhir.  It's relevance to Belegarth is noted appropriately in the history section, and in the "see also" link.  I don't think anything more needs to be added and doing so just seems to be yet another "Belegarth vs. Dagorhir wiki battle" that is, frankly, pointless and silly.  If editors have problems with one or the other, that is no excuse for this silly editing war.  I assume the same thing goes on over at the Belegarth page, and the same should apply over there too.TheCommodore7 15:18, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Adding repeated references to Belegarth 

message: Gotta love fly-by-nighters who place things in our article like this without mentioning anything in the talk page.  From the look of his edit, it looks like he's an SCA guy who didn't like our cross-link.  Since he doesn't want to back up his reasons for doing such and he's disregarded what we've talked about regarding notability (read: fan site) already, I'll revert these changes. TheCommodore7 13:58, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fan Site

message: This section is meant for  events that are hosted by and /or attended by multiple chapters / realms. This is meant for the general public. The inclusion of the host chapter is not necessary.Brutilus 13:41, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Other Events 

message: Dagorhir will be featured on Discovery Channel's Wreckreation Nation on June 20th at 10pm.  This show could go a long way to adding a lot of verifiable information to this entry.TheCommodore7 (talk) 22:08, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wreckreation Nation 

message: I removed the words "numerous lesser" before "spin off organizations" because "lesser" was not neutral/opinion-free as required on an encyclopedia page, and "numerous" was misleading--only two foam-fighting organizations descended directly from Dagorhir, Belegarth and Amptgard. If there are more than two that have _directly_ descended from Dagorhir that I have overlooked, please feel free to choose another appropriate adjective ("two" is not really "numerous"). Also, as a member of this organization, I would like to say that adding content opinionated against other organizations does NOTHING for our publicity, except make us look egotistical and elitist. Really guys =/ -Sidheag, Dominion of the Unconquered Sun 72.128.62.85 (talk) 04:33, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for your help.  There has been a lot of POV content on here, both pro- and anti-Dagorhir.  Any help eliminating that stuff to create a NPOV article is helpful.TheCommodore7 (talk) 16:09, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Small edit, comments about opinionated content. 

message: I am of the opinion that the recently added external links (to similar groups) are inappropriate for this article.  I believe that this article is about Dagorhir and any similar groups should point to another wikipedia article, where that article can link to the respective external link.  There are currently wiki articles on Belegarth, Darkon, and Amtgard.  I know nothing about the Kingdom of Stanislaus, and wonder how big a group is that uses Tripod.
I also note that, according to Wikipedia:External_link, we should avoid "Sites that are only indirectly related to the article's subject: the link should be directly related to the subject of the article."  What does everyone else think?TheCommodore7 (talk) 16:18, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Since no one has any objection, I'll do what I stated above. TheCommodore7 (talk) 16:06, 12 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Outside Links 

message: The name Dagorhir appears to be Sindarin for 'battle master'.  Can someone confirm such an origin? —Tamfang (talk) 01:33, 17 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  the name 

message: History section of article copies wholesale from history section of their website. Zell Faze (talk) 22:56, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyright violations 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 4 external links on Dagorhir. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090106132001/http://www.eryndor.com/gear.php to http://eryndor.com/gear.php
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080509054550/http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/Dagorhir%20Handbook%202003%20Edition.pdf to http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/Dagorhir%20Handbook%202003%20Edition.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070629193916/http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/history.htm to http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/history.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070629193916/http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/history.htm to http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/history.htm
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 4 external links on Dagorhir. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081220004142/http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/events.htm to http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/events.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090204094924/http://dsc.discovery.com/tv/wreckreation-nation/wreckreation-nation.html to http://dsc.discovery.com/tv/wreckreation-nation/wreckreation-nation.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20061004165417/http://www.dagorhir.com/chapters/index.htm to http://www.dagorhir.com/chapters/index.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070408021221/http://www.dagorhir.com/dagorhir/dagorhir.htm to http://dagorhir.com/dagorhir/dagorhir.htm
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thread_title:  External links modified