Talk:Florida Gators football

message: This article has been targeted for a major re-write by one or more of the editors of the University of Florida Wikipedia Project, including achieving an "encyclopedic" neutral point of view, properly sourcing all factual material to reliable and authoritative sources (either on-line news sources or hard-copy publications), and uniform style and formatting consistent with the UF Wikipedia Project, all with the goal of satisfying the Wikipedia requirements for "Feature Article" status.  Given the sensitivity of some UF-affiliated editors to changes to Gators athletics articles that they have placed on their "watch lists," your comments and input are solicited.
The ultimate goal is to eliminate any "rah-rah" aspects of the article, and let the facts and statistics regarding the Gators' history football success speak for itself, so that the final product will reflect well on the University of Florida, as viewed by unaffiliated readers seeking information about the team, UF, UAA, etc.
Please leave suggestions below or contact the undersigned editor privately by e-mail or user discussion messages.  Thank you.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:15, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article targeted for major re-write 

message: Why are 3 non-championship years included in the list under the section "Conference Championships"? Very odd. Maybe the section name should be renamed to "Best Conference Record Years."  204.128.230.1 (talk) 21:05, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Conference Championships?' 

message: I just changed the colors used on this page. Previously there had been a bright red-orange, which I replaced with a more mellow orange color;  these shades are both commonly used, though the latter is used more in uniforms, signs, the stadium itself, etc. and is easier on the eyes when reading. I also changed the (bright) blue used the a more opaque royal blue. I believe the new orange is superior, but the new blue is more expiremental.--Porsche997SBS 03:10, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shades of Orange 

message: I have been looking but unable to find what the specifics were for the 1984 violations, if anyone with more info on this subject could specify what they were in the article, that would be greatly appreciated  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.188.246.60 (talk) 23:31, 10 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  NCAA Violations? 

message: :Image:Old UF Athletics logo (stylized).png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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BetacommandBot 23:26, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fair use rationale for Image:Old UF Athletics logo (stylized).png 

message: If every logo the Gators have ever used will be in the article, someone may as well break the history section into segments by era and use the logos in each era.  Right now they seem to clutter the article. WTStoffs 16:29, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Logos? 

message: :Image:UF logo (1966-1967).png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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BetacommandBot (talk) 21:47, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fair use rationale for Image:UF logo (1966-1967).png 

message: :Image:UF logo (1992-1997).png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
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BetacommandBot (talk) 21:47, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fair use rationale for Image:UF logo (1992-1997).png 

message: :Image:Script ``Gators``.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot (talk) 20:10, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fair use rationale for Image:Script ``Gators``.png 

message: I just finished expanding the conference championship table into a table that lists every season's final record using this link and this link.
I dunno how to change the colors of cells, but I'm thinking that championships should probably be highlighted rather than just asterisked, and maybe division titles should be so indicated as well. Also, I double checked all the numbers, but feel free to triple & quadruple check, just to be sure. I started to get cross-eyed after a while... Zeng8r (talk) 01:10, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Season-by-season records 

message: Why does the first team offense not have a quarterback listed?  Surely somebody was selected. Monkey Bounce (talk) 23:05, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Good catch. Somebody must have removed Spurrier for reasons unknown and nobody noticed... until now. Zeng8r (talk) 00:46, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  University of Florida All-Time Team 

message: Guys, there is no bigger Gator fan than me, but I have very real misgivings about including the 1984, 1985 and 1990 seasons in the conference championship table.  This implies an unreconstructed rebel attitude on the part of the University of Florida, the Gators sports program, the football team and Gator fans.  Having heard Jeremy Foley speak on this topic, I know that this does not represent his view or the official view of the UAA.  (If you have any doubt, please read the quote from UF President Marshall Criser in his Wikipedia article.)
I lived through those years as a UF undergraduate and grad student, and the Pell-Hall scandals deeply offended my sense of right and wrong, as it did many other alumni and fans.  Frankly, 20 years later, most of us are over it----8 SEC and 3 national championships later, we do not need to behave like NCAA scofflaws (leave that to fans of other schools).  Let's recognize the best conference records for those years in the article text and/or appropriate footnotes, but let's not imply that those records represent SEC championships; they don't.  The program was caught in NCAA major infractions twice (in the case of Pell, one of the worst cases in NCAA history), and the team was ineligible for the SEC championships in 1985 and 1990 as a result; the SEC university presidents took the unprecedented step of vacating the 1984 title and not awarding it to the runner-up.  That was quite a statement at the time.  Let's not engage in not-so-subtle forms of denial that make every non-Gator reader of this article think the university and its alumni are without honor.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 02:03, 23 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Counting conference championships 

message: How come the all-blue alternate jerseys aren't shown?  RayJay17 (talk • contribs) 12:36, 11 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alternate Jersey 

message: The article states that "Gators running back Chuck Hunsinger rushed for 2,017 yards in 1948 and 1949", but this just cannot be. In 1972, Nat Moore broke the Florida single-season rushing record with about 840 yards. Perhaps Hunsinger recorded his total over three years rather than two. Cwelgo (talk) 23:06, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Cwelgo, you get a gold star, Gators fan.  I checked the 2010 Florida Gator Football Media Guide, and it confirms Hunsinger's career yardage at 2,017, but shows him as being active from 1946 to 1949 (freshmen were NCAA eligible during World War II and immediately after).  The original source for the 2,017 yards in his junior and senior seasons was Tom McEwan's 1974 book, and even though the vast majority of yardage was compiled in 1948 and 1949, he still had some positive yardage as a freshman and sophomore.  I will fix the text of the article tomorrow, when I can dig out all of my Gators football books.  Thanks for being diligent.  Any time you want to get actively involved with WikiProject University of Florida, let me know on my contact page.  We could always use another hand.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 05:18, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chuck Hunsinger's rushing yardage 

message: I'm a bit confused by the use of the phrase "Bowl Eligible" for the blue shading for each season. Florida has been eligible for bowls a number of times without being invited to a bowl (1986 comes to mind), but those years are not shaded blue. Come to think of it, in the distant past there were no bowl eligibility requirements whatsoever and teams with losing records were sometimes invited (e.g. 1970 William & Mary) so in a sense every team was bowl eligible every year. I suspect the phrase should be "Bowl Team" or "Bowl Invitation", but clearly the conference champion teams were also bowl teams and they are shaded a different color, so I don't know what phrase to suggest. "Non-champion Bowl Team"? Yech. Cwelgo (talk) 20:57, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bowl Eligible 

message: Concerned college football editors may want to comment on the navbox TfD here: Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2011 September 8#Template:University of Florida Athletic Hall of Fame.  The nominating editor wants to delete the University of Florida Athletic Hall of Fame navbox.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 14:02, 8 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion of UF Athletic Hall of Fame navbox 

message: Relevant deletion discussion at Wikipedia:Files_for_deletion/2011_December_31#File:Florida Gators football helmet.gif.--GrapedApe (talk) 17:32, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Image deletion discussion

message: A Florida Cup refers to when Florida, Florida State or Miami beat the other two teams in the same season. Beginning in 2002, the Florida Sports Foundation, the official sports promotion and development organization of the State of Florida, has presented the winner of the series with The Florida Cup (trophy), symbolizing the Florida college football champion. Florida was awarded with the Florida Cup trophy in 2008 after beating Florida State 45-15 and Miami 26-3. The cup has only been awarded 6 times, since Florida and Miami don't play every season only Florida State could win it any season if they win both games vs Florida and Miami. FSU won 2 cups in 2010 and 2011. Miami won the first 3 Florida Cups from 2002 to 2004 
This is what i think it should be change to.Theworm777 (talk) 13:46, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Florida Cup

message: The article currently asserts that "the 1928 Gators set a new national scoring record of 336 points."  There is no in-line citation for this record, and it appears to be inaccurate.  Michigan had exceeded that point total five times in 1901 (550 points), 1902 (644 [points), 1903 (565 points), 1904 (567 [points), and 1905 (495 points).  Vanderbilt had also exceeded it in 1915 (513 points), 1912 (391 points), and 1904 (452 points).  See also Texas in 1914 (358 points) and Cornell in 1921 (392 points).  Cbl62 (talk) 03:09, 27 March 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Cbl, I've got at least one published source that states the Gators were the highest-scoring CFB team of 1928 – Tom McEwen, The Gators: A Story of Florida Football, The Strode Publishers, Huntsville, Alabama, p. 97 (1974).  That seems to be verified by contemporary newspaper accounts.  I have spot-checked the powerhouse programs for 1928, including the mythical national champions Georgia Tech (221) and USC (267), and have found none that scored more than 267 points that year (Alabama 187, Arkansas 251, Army 215, Boston College 263, Illinois 145, LSU 180, Michigan 36, Nebraska 144, Notre Dame 99, Ohio State 135, Oklahoma 120, Oregon 234, Pitt 177, Tennessee 249, Texas 122, Vanderbilt 152, Wisconsin 163).  So the claim of being the 1928 national scoring leader appears to be credible.  What I can't find is any source that supports this was a "new national scoring record," and a CFDW spot check of your evidence verifies there were several previous teams who scored more than 336 points.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 06:19, 27 March 2013 (UTC)
replies: text:  No issue with them being high scoring team of 1928.  Only concern is with assertion of "new national scoring record". Cbl62 (talk) 14:34, 27 March 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed.  I've already changed the disputed text to reflect the sources.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 14:38, 27 March 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  1928 national scoring record 

message: I appreciate your recent efforts to improve coverage of the Florida Gators football team's 1996 national championship season.  That said, the main Florida Gators football is a survey -- an overview -- of the Gators football team, past and present, including the program's history, and it must balance its coverage of different eras of the Gators' history.  As I am sure you are aware, there are individual season articles for the Gators' three national championships seasons and each of the Gators' individual seasons since 1999, and decade histories before 2000.  The Gators have had many noteworthy and important seasons in their history, including 1928, 1952, 1960, 1966, 1969, 1984, 1985, 1990, 1991, 1995, 1996, 2006 and 2008.  The level of '96 detail included in several of your recent edits to the main article are greater than the balance required in a survey of the entire Gators' program and its history; much of this detail should probably be moved to the season-specific 1996 Florida Gators football team article, so as to maintain the balance of the main/parent article.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 19:49, 6 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Coverage of '96 Gators championship season and related details 

message: This article needs a mention of Fleming Field, but I understand the history is difficult. I will be looking for things. Let me know if you find anything to expand on what we have already. Cake (talk) 19:47, 16 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Fleming Field

message: Have y'all considered splitting this big puppy (or "hatchling", since this is about gators), now weighing in it at almost 200,000 characters, per WP:Article size? A logical point of division might be to split the history section into a new article on History of Florida Gators football with a hatnote linking the two. Cbl62 (talk) 17:04, 16 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, the readable prose portion of the article is just a wee bit shy of 100,000 characters, so a split isn't mandatory, but something to consider. Cbl62 (talk) 17:22, 16 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  No reason to split.  And there remains a lot of word-smithing and referencing to be done in the aftermath of the recent additions.  IMO, the history should be one of the two or three core elements of the article: recounting the team history is one of the primary reasons to have a team article.  Frankly, it would make a lot more sense to shunt the bowl history and the like into a separate list, and a lot of the random, non-notable player lists should probably be removed.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:34, 16 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article size 

message: The Florida-Georgia rivalry is certainly notable. It's played at a neutral site, usually ranked teams etc. Of course the FSU rivalry is also very notable. I am pushing back on Tennessee. There's nothing special about it. I see all the attempts to make it sound like more, but in the end, it's 2 SEC rivals that play each other every year, no different than Kentucky, Vanderbilt etc. There were a few years where their match-up meant something, but in the borader picture, most of them are just run of the mill schedule games. Niteshift36 (talk) 16:28, 1 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: In the interests of full disclosure, I am a graduate of the University of Florida, a former academic tutor employed by the University Athletic Association, a long-time fan of the Florida Gators sports teams, a frequent editor of articles related to the University of Florida and the Florida Gators sports teams, and one of the prime contributors to this article over the past six years.  All of that said, I think I can say with some objectivity that I (and several of the regular editors of Florida Gators articles) are probably better positioned to judge who University of Florida athletes, alumni and fans consider to be their principal rivals.  From our subjective viewpoint, Florida State, Georgia and Tennessee are the Gators' three most important rivals, and all three of them are on another level from "just another SEC game" (recognizing, of course, that FSU is not an SEC member).  I expect that other regular editors of Florida Gators articles, such as ,  and  will readily substantiate my analysis.  Cheers.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:07, 1 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: *Since we agree that GA and FSU clearly belong on that list, we won't need to spend any more time talking about those. I see one revert had the edit summary of "Even Tim Tebow says so". With all due respect to Tim, he is looking at his 4 year period and we should be looking at a longer term view. The alleged rivalry, according to the article, started in 1992. Except for the time that Peyton Manning was there, the Vols really haven't done a ton. Even the Vols article says "The games' national implications diminished in the 2000s, as first Florida and then Tennessee suffered through sub-par seasons." Yes, there was a brief time period where this was an important match-up, but this is nowhere near the GA and FSU rivalries. That said, if a bunch of Gator fans (since you just pinged a whole group) are going to claim to be in "a better position" to decide (because we all know a fan opinion is always more valid than an outside observer), I won't remove the entry again. Niteshift36 (talk) 18:31, 1 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: *Indeed I concur with the above analysis. Other than the Gators recent streak against Tennessee, there is no reason to consider removing the article. In my view, that would make as much sense as removing it for Tennessee once having Neyland; or removing the Georgia article since Georgia used to dominate the series. I am at a loss for defending this much better than "read the notable games." As above in the 90s and into the 00s the UF-UT game always decided the SEC East champion (He surely misspoke with florida/georgia).  Many greats have tales with the series. Bobby Dodd started his first and last games against UF (his son Dodd Jr. played at UF, and Ray Graves was to be his successor at Tech). Peyton Manning never defeated UF (Sports Illustrated never expected it). Doug Dickey coached at both schools. I would think even from the perspective of Tennessee, their tier one rivals are Bama, Vandy, and UF. Not to say Georgia, for instance, isn't a Vol rival. As the Gators close the season with FSU; they open with (cupcakes and then) Tennessee. Cake (talk) 18:35, 1 December 2015 (UTC)

text: Georgia, FSU, and UT are Florida's biggest rivals, no doubt about it. The Tennessee game has perhaps only gotten national attention since the mid-90s, but it's been a heated and odd rivalry for partisans going back to 1928, and for reasons beyond just what happened on the field - the Doug Dickey saga, Spurrier growing up in Tennessee and then needling them when he beat them, UT leading the charge to strip Florida's 1984 SEC title, etc etc etc. Definitely belongs on the list, imo. Zeng8r (talk) 03:37, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

text: *Interesting. Pretty sizable drop in score between 2-3. I'd say that makes a stronger case for leaving off LSU and Miami. Niteshift36 (talk) 18:13, 6 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rivalries 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 58 external links on Florida Gators football. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Florida Gators football. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/florida/2015-schedule.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120327063047/http://www.heisman.com/winners/d-wuerffel96.php to http://www.heisman.com/winners/d-wuerffel96.php
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Florida Gators football. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140715001359/http://www.gatorsports.com/article/20081128/NEWS/811280285/1130?p=all&tc=pgall&tc=ar to http://www.gatorsports.com/article/20081128/NEWS/811280285/1130?p=all&tc=pgall&tc=ar
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081202151237/http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/sep/07/070044/cb-war-canoe-trophy-once-again-has-meaning/sports/ to http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/sep/07/070044/cb-war-canoe-trophy-once-again-has-meaning/sports/
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I rearranged several sections because this article contains of body text and important info nestled far below a lot of less important tables and lists, most of which are of limited interest to a casual reader. Most football media guides (and other non-fiction articles and books) put those sorts of lists and tables after the text, often in an appendix, making it easier for readers to get the basic information and then read / scroll onward to see more esoteric details if they so desire. There is absolutely no reason why important sections like Florida's rivalries and a list of the current coaching staff, etc. should come after a huge block of all-time records tables and several all-century teams, etc. To be honest, I don't care if other college football program articles are badly organized; mediocrity in others is no reason to be satisfied with mediocrity for oneself. Your edit summary has a strong whiff of WP:IDONTLIKEIT / and anti-WP:IGNOREPRECEDENT but no real reasons for keeping the less-than-desirable status quo. If you want to discuss which specific sections are most important, that's fine. But knee-jerk reverts are not constructive. Zeng8r (talk) 00:08, 22 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I disagree with your view on the relative importance of helmet logos, pant colors, and the current "Director of Strength & Conditioning" over the team's Rivalries, National championships, and similar sections within this article. Also to part of your point, some of the prose ala :History of Florida Gators football should be included in this article's sparse History section. I've invited other editors to comment. UW Dawgs (talk) 03:01, 22 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: There's a discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football about whether current coaching staff section should even be included at all on main program articles.  Probably worth having a general discussion there about order of topics for main program articles, such as this one.  The issues at stake here are not unique to the Florida Gators. Jweiss11 (talk) 00:35, 26 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  rearranging sections 

message: In the Division Championships tab it has 2020 listed as Co-Champions with a tiebreaker, but after Georgia's Game with Vanderbilt was canceled they finish at 7-2 and Florida finishes at 8-2. The Sourcehttp://a.espncdn.com/sec/media/2020/2020%20Football%20Championship%20and%20Tiebreaker.pdf provided for that, in the article, claims that special rules treat them like they have the same record, however, no where in the source does it say that. The part I think that it is referring to is "Should a team be ready and able to play a game, but the opposing team not be able to play, then the team that was ready to play may add one game to its total number of games played for the purpose of meeting the minimum number of games to be played (for clarity, the addition of a game to the total number of games played will not count in the final standings but will only be included to meet the minimum number of games if that team has competed in fewer than the required minimum number of games needed to be eligible for the SEC Football Championship game or to be considered in a tiebreaker). The source says that any additional games wouldn't be counted towards the standings, so by that Georgia couldn't possibly be Co-Champions without rescheduling Vanderbilt. The source doesn't at any point say that they would be treated as though they are at the same record as it claims in the article. It only at one point states that if a team were 9-1 and another were 8-1 and 8-1 won the Head to Head they would represent the Division in the Championship Game. The criteria the source gives for division champions says "The team in each division with the highest winning percentage during the ten-game Conference schedule (using both divisional and cross-divisional games) will be declared division champion. If two or more teams are tied with the highest winning percentage, they will be declared division co-champions." Florida's win percentage is 80% at 8-2. Georgia's win percentage is 77.78% at 7-2, so shouldn't 2020 not be considered as a Co-Championship unless the Conference were to officially declare it, which to my knowledge they haven't. 2020SecEastChamps (talk) 21:15, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed that the sourcing needs to reflect the application of the 2020 rule, not just link to a document which contains the rules. I did not flag or revert, yesterday. Good catch. UW Dawgs (talk) 21:22, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  2020 Division Championship