Talk:University of Florida Taser incident/Misc Deletion Comments

message: This article has been nominated for deletion. See here. [Tyler] (talk/contribs) 04:10, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: AfD

message: The article has been tagged for deletion, however an entry for September 18, 2007 in the deletion request page does not appear. Without an entry here the reason for this nomination cannot be discussed properly. No reason is given here either. This smacks of vandalism. William (Bill) Bean 13:19, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It showed up the next day. See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2007 September 19#University of Florida Taser incident. CWC 15:21, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Please, there is no need for unwarranted cries of vandalism.  The discussion is there now for all to participate.  Gamaliel (Angry Mastodon! Run!) 16:27, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If an article is tagged NPOV without cause and then nominated for deletion without that nomination appearing where the entire community can find it...well, what else would be assumed? By the way "this smacks of vandalism" is not the same as saying "this is vandalism." Happy to clear that up for you. Follow proper procedure people!  William (Bill) Bean 00:29, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The article was nominated for deletion and posted to the log within a minute of each other (using TWINKLE), each at 4:06. ObiterDicta ( pleadings \u2022 errata \u2022 appeals ) 01:13, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

text: WP:CIVIL and WP:AGF are also part of "proper procedure". Gamaliel (Angry Mastodon! Run!) 16:12, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Deletion Tag

message: Worth keeping. Ian 22:39, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  National Significance 

message: I have stated this on the AfD page... but I think it is worth stating here.  I think the event is notable and should be reported... but I have a real problem with reporting on it at Wikipedia instead of Wikinews.  Wikipedia is an encyclopedia.  As such we should not be reporting on events that are still taking place (that is what Wikinews is for).  This event is still unfolding.  We don't know what the ramifications and impact of this event will be.  Personally, I do think think this is going to end up as a major event... and I think we should have an article in Wikipedia... I just don't think it should have one YET.  It isn't encyclopedic YET... it is still news.  We need to wait and see what the ramifications, impact and outcome of this event will be before we have an article on it.  Move it to something like Wikinews for now, and recreate it on Wikipedia later. Blueboar 20:12, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So you'd like to have everything in Current_events deleted too?  It's quite normal and acceptable to write about high-profile events as they occur.  That's Wikipedia's job; to be a reliable source of neutral information about important events, to provide the details that news reports don't. - Omegatron 23:07, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Re:Current events portal page... No... I consider the Current Events page to be an exception.  For one thing, it isn't an article.  It is an inter wiki "extra"... it contains brief blurbs on the news, and links to wikinews for more in-depth coverage of the events.  I agree with you that Wikipedia's job is to be a reliable source of neutral information about important events... we just disagree on when it is appropriate to write about the event.  Our job is to write in depth articles about events, not to report events as they happen.  We are an encyclopedia, not as a news outlet... to me writing an encyclopedia requires having some perspective on the event... and you can not get perspective on something while it is going on.  Oh... as for providing the details that news reports don't... careful with that, remember No Original Research applies for current events as well as any other article. Blueboar 00:07, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable for Wikipedia vs. notable for Wikinews 

message: Wikipedia:
This web page should not be deleted.  It contains factual events that could be linked to opinion, yet are not necessarily negative towards the biography of Mr. Kerry.  It occurred at Mr. Kerry town hall forum in Gainsville, Florida.  -Preceding unsigned comment added by Jdemosth (talk # contribs) 14:19, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  {(UF student taser incident)} 

message: The wide news coverage that this incident has brought (both in mainstream media and the blogosphere), and the viral video (http://feeds.wired.com/~r/wired/topheadlines/~3/158792950/dont-tase-me-br.html) cannot be ignored. It is notable enough in many ways (and remember that wikipedia even has a Leeroy Jenkins article). At least it should be added to the University of Florida article, although I don't think that's appropriate. --Miguel1626 02:55, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Good.  That goes on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/University of Florida Taser incident, not here. superlusertc 2007 September 20, 03:05 (UTC)
Sorry, about that. Still learning about proper Wikipedia procedure ;) --Miguel1626 20:52, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should be kept 

message: I feel it should not be deleted.
It maybe merged to John Kerry or UF. But This is my humble Opinion. --ThanosMadTitan23 23:32, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The deletion discussion is taking place here. - Crockspot 23:42, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should Not Be Deleted 

message: Greg Palast, in his response to the Taser incident, states that Alachua County, Florida was "just about the worst" of the United States' 5000+ counties in the disenfranchisement of black voters in the 2000 presidential election. Video24.93.190.134 16:53, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, why I did not include Alachua County portion of the Greg Palast quote is a very good question. Alachua County, was in fact the primary subject that Greg Palast was addressing in the piece I quoted from. I only included the portion of the Greg Palast quote that said that he thought Andrew Meyer was referring to chapter 4, because Armed Madhouse discusses many other topics besides the 2004 election. I did not include the Alachua county of the Greg Palast quote because Meyer did not mention Alachua County. Meyer specifically mentioned by name Volusia County and generically referred to minorities being disenfranchised in Florida and Ohio. I could not find any links to the text of Armed Madhouse itself, so I had to substitute other articles Greg Palast had written, so a reader of the WikiPedia could follow up on Mr. Palast's arguments on the web without having to physically get their hands on a copy of his book. No, this information is at the core of the incident. On one hand Andrew Meyer was rude, he cut in line, he was loud, he was grandstanding, he was abusive, he used a crude word like blowjob, on the other hand, as long and rambling as his questions were, Mr. Meyers' two minutes were not up. Mr. Meyers was startled when the mike was cut off and sarcastically or ironically said, "Thank you for cutting off my mike." There is some evidence that his mike was turned for the content of his speech. Andrew Meyer was not cut off by Senator Kerry, he was not cut off by Ambassador Jett, he was cut off and removed from on orders of someone from ACCENT or the police, based in part on the content of his speech. Where was Ambassador Jett and why wasn't he moderating the event? Why was Senator Kerry left in the position of having to cut off someone making a personal attack on him? Are there any witnesses or articles that would clarify why Ambassador Jett was not running the show? Jim.Callahan,Orlando 05:04, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Please find a better place to post such material, as it is irrelevant to this incident. Nosferatublue 16:59, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Alachua County in the 2000 election

message: I've searched UF's student directory and came up with two options: Andrew J. Meyer and Andrew W. Meyer.  Anyone know which one it is?00:56, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's in the police report (PDF file linked in article). Badagnani 22:18, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Middle Initial 

message: Does anyone have a link to his personal website so we can see if he really is a prankster? Leafyplant 02:32, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The site lists his activities as "getting wasted" and "being ridiculous." Revolutionaryluddite 02:36, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Do we have a link to his website? 

message: I have seen the videos and can't see any evidence that he was tasered. Is there any confirmation besides him yelling "don't taser me" and then screaming?  \u2014Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.27.66.175 (talk) 05:30, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Read the police report (the PDF file); it states that he was "drive stunned" with the Taser. Badagnani 05:33, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Was he Tasered? 

message: I think that John Levy's statements, quoted in an entire paragraph, are given undue weight. Revolutionaryluddite 03:57, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that the paragraph gives undue weight. However, Levy's comments on what Meyer told him (hearsay) provide insight into Meyer's POV. I found it odd that the article omits that Levy met Meyer in second grade (Washington Post article cited). Flatscan 04:18, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  If John Levy's statements are about Meyer's personality and character, shouldn't they be moved to the 'Andrew Meyer' section? Revolutionaryluddite 16:04, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: After consideration, I think Levy's comments should be cut substantially. He's Meyer's friend (POV), the comments are hearsay, and their current length gives them undue weight. I'm against moving them before the description of the incident due to POV balance. Flatscan 03:59, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  John Levy 

message: University of Florida Taser incident#Andrew Meyer (wikilink will break if section renamed)
This section looks like it was merged from the Andrew Meyer article. I think it has unnecessary/irrelevant details. In addition to trimming the section, I suggest renaming it to "Student". Flatscan 21:06, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Andrew Meyer section 

message: I read two sources that say Andrew Meyer staged the whole thing. Some of the cops were in on it, and Meyer knew he was going to be "tased"; how else would he know the term "tase" (as it is not something most people know). I think these sources should be included in the article. This is a "conspiracy theory" about this incident, I guess. It sounds plausible to me based on his previous history of pulling pranks. Timneu22 00:26, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see that you shared the sources. What are they? Badagnani 00:28, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Oh just google "andrew meyer the whole thing was staged." Some of the sources appear to be more credible than others, of course. Timneu22 01:29, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You'll have to provide links. I entered "andrew meyer the whole thing was staged" into Google as suggested and read the first 5 links. While there is evidence to suggest that Meyer arranged some of the video recording and dramatized/exaggerated on-camera (both already mentioned in the article), I didn't see anything that supported your other assertions. I've seen "tase" before, or Meyer could have shorted "Taser" on his own - it's hardly a technical term. Flatscan 02:05, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

text: I think the officer was telling him "you will be Tased" before Meyer responded with that now-famous line. Badagnani 17:40, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

text: The facts are that officers brutally silenced an opinionated student with less-lethal weapon on university campus. This can't be pardoned even in your twisted POV. Assaulting a kid on the floor by 6 officers with a dangerous weapon for voicing a question? Kerry wanted to answer him, there was nothing to prompt the police to do what they did. Public forum is public forum and speakers talk to each even with higher voices, thats the very point of it. We usually leave student with an urgent message to speak and then discuss it. He was laying handcuffed and grounded by 6 officers when being electrolucted, something what should certainly be investigated. He wanted to video tape Kerry's answers to his important questions, that is all that was "staged" here. If you want to trick us into thinking that somebody would want be tased by a stun weapon and then charged by police then think twice.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.102.174.10 (talk) 08:18, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, that was a worthless rant! Timneu22 00:58, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The whole thing was staged!