Talk:Juan Rodríguez Cabrillo

message: If Cabrilho was Portuguese and sailing for the Spanish before 1580, that would make him a traitor like Magellan (Portugal and Spain were enemies, and Spain annexed Portugal around 1580). Maybe that explains why his name is not famous in Portugal?
:: Cabrilho is quite well known in Portugal. Where does such strange idea comes from? He even came in Portuguese postal stamps, etc.75.42.79.126 (talk) 03:48, 10 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  That is not how it worked. Portugal and Spain were rivals - not enemies, apart from when they were actually engaged in some conflict - and people from all over Iberia worked from one or the other country without being labelled "traitors". There were also same Castillian, Basque and Galician (and others) sailors working for Portugal.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.138.208.165 (talk) 00:04, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Is Cabrillo a traitor?

message: Nearly every source in the internet describes Cabrillo as portuguese, including the spanish edition of the wikipedia. So I changed the nationality from spanish to portuguese. 84.90.18.136 19:19, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Alas - how could you have done that? What a mistake, if what was more common before was to consider Cabrilho Spanish. How dare you? Wikipedia runs (seemingly) based on "what is more common", even if being mistakes...so you just defied such policy - and hey...actually ran into facts and scientific accuracy instead. Bravo!!75.42.79.126 (talk) 04:00, 10 November 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Cabrillo portuguese

message: he was the first person to discover san diego shores —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.9.91.114 (talk) 00:26, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No, the local natives discovered that area long before he arrived. That said, Cabrillo led the first European expedition to see many California sites. -Will Beback · † · 01:26, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: History

message: His name came a  cat carc that now is extient[[Media:[[Media:  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.115.232.239 (talk) 01:32, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  His name came from... 

message: The flagship San Salvador and Victoria were not built in Navidad, Mexico. Cabrillo (according to the following discussion in the spanish Wikipedia article by Professor Carmen González Huguet of the José Matías Delgado University in San Salvador, El Salvador) Built these ships on the orders of Pedro de Alvarado in the Xiribaltique Bay, in native tongue (now called the Jiquilisco Bay in Usulutan Department of El Salvador). He departed from the Port of Acaxutla (now Acajutla, still a small port by the way)off the Salvadoran coast bound north to Navidad, Mexico and on to discover the coast of California. Furthermore, she mentions not two ships, but rather 13 that were built and piloted by Cabrillo, of course the San Salvador being the flagship.
Her narrative.......(Spansih)
"Mi nombre es Carmen González Huguet, soy profesora de Historia de la Universidad "Dr. José Matías Delgado", en El Salvador. He leído con curiosidad la página sobre Juan Rodríguez Cabrillo y quisiera referirme a un error de bulto. Dicen ustedes textualmente:
"En 1540 un terremoto destruyó la antigua ciudad de Santiago de Guatemala, se dice que Cabrillo notificó del incidente a la corona española y esa información se considera el primer reportaje que se haya enviado de un acontecimiento ocurrido en el nuevo mundo hacia Europa.- Desde un puerto guatemalteco de la costa del océano pacífico, Cabrillo se dedicó durante un tiempo a importar y exportar mercaderías entre España, Guatemala y otras partes del imperio español"
Esta información no es exacta. La villa de Santiago de los Caballeros de Guatemala fue fundada primeramente por don Pedro de Alvarado en las cercanías de Iximché, capital de los señores cakchiqueles, en 1524, durante la primera etapa de la conquista de Guatemala. En 1527 los cakchiqueles, aliados de los españoles como los tlaxcaltecas en México, se rebelaron. Eso forzó a los españoles a fundar nuevamente la villa de Santiago en un paraje próximo a la actual Ciudad Vieja, en el valle de Almolonga, el 22 de noviembre de 1527.
En la madrugada del 11 de septiembre de 1541, un alud de piedras y lodo bajó del Volcán de Agua (que no un terremoto) y destruyó la ciudad. En este desastre murió doña Beatriz de la Cueva, la viuda del conquistador Pedro de Alvarado. Esta señora había sido nombrada Gobernadora de Guatemala a la muerte de su marido. Fue la única mujer que ostentó dicho cargo en toda la época colonial. La destrucción de la villa hizo que volviera a fundarse, esta vez en el valle de Panchoy, en la actual ubicación conocida como Antigua Guatemala.
En la probanza de méritos de sus descendientes, se afirma que Juan Rodríguez Cabrillo y su familia tuvieron encomiendas en el territorio de El Salvador, en Jicalapa, población situada en la zona conocida hoy con el nombre de Costa del Bálsamo, entre los actuales departamentos de Sonsonate y La Libertad. Bernal Díaz del Castillo, en su "Historia verdadera de la conquista de la Nueva España menciona en el capítulo CCIII (México, Alianza ditorial, 1991, pag. 831): "Razón es que se traiga a la memoria y no quede por olvido una muy buena armada que el adelantado don Pedro de Alvarado hizo el año de 1537 en la provincia de Guatemala, donde era gobernador, y en un puerto que se dice Acaxutla, en la banda del sur, y fue para cumplir ciertas capitulaciones que con su majestad hizo la segunda vez que volvió a Castilla y vino casado con una señora que se decía doña Beatriz de la Cueva; y fue el concierto que se capituló con su majestad, que el adelantado pusiese ciertos navíos y pilotos y marineros y soldados y bastimentos, y todo lo que hubiese menester, a su costa, para enviar a descubrir por la vía del poniente a la China o Malucos u otras cualquier isla de la Especiería..." Aquí Bernal trenza datos de dos expediciones: la de 1537, cuando Alvarado fue, efectivamente, a Perú, y la de 1540, cuando iba a las islas de la Especiería. En este segundo viaje fue cuando llegado al puerto de Navidad el virrey Mendoza suscribió con Alvarado unas capitulaciones. El gobernador de Guatemala acudió en defensa de los españoles que estaqban siendo atacados por los indios y Alvarado murió, en el peñol de Nochistlán, a consecuencia de las heridas que le ocasionó un caballo que rodó por una pendiente: el caballo del escribano Baltasar Montoya. Acaxutla no es otra que el actual puerto de Acajutla, en la costa del departamento de Sonsonate. Conclusión: de acuerdo con la probanza de méritos, Juan Rodríguez Cabrillo construyó en Xiribaltique (en la actual bahía de Jiquilisco, departamento de Usulután) y pilotó para don Pedro de Alvarado una armada de trece barcos (el dato es de Bernal) que partió de Acajutla y que eventualmente descubrió California."
KeniKex 21:03, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Origin of Cabrillo's voyage was not from Mexico 

message: An IP recently changed Cabrillo's birthdate, which we had listed as March 13, 1499, to "unknown". Another editor reverted the change, but on research I believe the IP was correct. I could find no scholarly support for that date or for any birthdate. Biographies mostly state that his birthdate, birthplace and parentage are unknown; from his later career they speculate that he was born around 1498 to 1500. I have changed the birthdate in the article accordingly, with references. OK with everybody? --MelanieN (talk) 23:13, 20 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I reverted the IP as suspect without a source but since you have found one, it's all good... Also I have no idea where the March 13 1499 date came from or who added it - I only reverted for the reason I gave. Cheers, Til Eulenspiegel /talk/ 23:25, 20 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Birthdate 

message: In the section titled "Nationality" is this sentence (partially quoted here): "His nationality was first addressed by contemporary Spanish orly chronicler Antonio de Herrera y Tordesillas..."
What does "orly" mean?
67.131.78.34 (talk) 04:20, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for catching that. It was added by a troll in January and nobody caught it. I've deleted it now. Anything else you see that needs fixing, please let us know - or go ahead and fix it! --MelanieN (talk) 14:24, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Undecipherable word 

message: The article's title should be changed to his real name João Rodrigues Cabrilho, since he was a Portuguese national. The current display is a Spanish variation of his name, but not it's correct writting or spelling. The fact that the English speaking viewers are more used to the Spanish variation or if the English books present that same variation is irrelevant.
If someone's name is, let's imagine, John Thatcher, it would be ridiculous for the Portuguese article entry of him to be displayed as "João Colmo".
Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by PedroLFMA (talk • contribs) 02:39, 23 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: The relevant Wikipedia policy is WP:COMMONNAME. For an illustration in practice, consider the article on Christopher Columbus. If Cabrilho is best known to English speakers as Cabrillo, then that's the name the article uses. —C.Fred (talk) 02:45, 23 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedians do have the power to change policy, however this is the current policy installed. The international community knows this specific article-subject by his spanish name. the majority of the sources use this name. From this we derive the consensus that the spanish name is the right one to use for the article, there is no doubt. Cristiano Tomás (talk) 05:16, 23 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Change title name 

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thread_title:  External links modified