Talk:First rock and roll record

message: I'm not going to get into an argument over what the first rock 'n' roll song was, but for those who are curious, I think we should be aware that the definition of RNR has changed since the '50s. Much of what we now call RNR was called rhythm and blues and coexisted with rock. We're looking at the first part of the 20th century with 2005 eyes, and, if you've listened much, a great deal of jazz might be called rock 'n' roll if it were re-released now. Some performances, like Louis Armstrong's take on Shine (c.1930) have a distinctively different sound from most other jazz contemporaneous, and we might call it rock if it were released later.Some songs we clearly call rock now were called R&B then, such as the Cadillacs Speedo. Fats Domino claimed (back then) that RNR was simply a new name for R&B.Be that as it may, for my money, Rock Around the Clock was the first clear break into what was, then and now, called Rock 'n' Roll, including Crazy Man Crazy. But if we have to go earlier, try 60 Minute Man (1951, IIRC), which isn't even mentioned in the article.We've been using rock 'n' roll as a virtual synonymn for popular music for so long that I fear we're interpreting everything else as a precursor instead of viewing rock as a development. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 07:54, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: This article is in definite need of a cleanup. I don't know how to tag an article as such but this article needs a lot of cleanup for visual orgnaization as well as an evaluation of the second half of the material having to do with Elvis... Shouldn't that get put in an article about Elvis? 68.44.73.253 00:23, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Definitely, the second part of the article needs a cleanup, or moved to the Elvis Presley article, or possibly separated into a "King of Rock And Roll" article, with additional viewpoints.  Hmm.ArglebargleIV 06:47, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. The whole Elvis section is hopelessly POV in its current form. I have deleted most of it since listing Elvis' hit records and TV appearances has nothing to do with the topic at hand. 23skidoo 15:57, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The "King of Rock and Roll" section was completely irrelevant to the article's topic. I deleted it.   Wasted Time R 03:53, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  No argument from me. Might make an interesting article on its own, though. 23skidoo 04:08, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comments 2005-06

message: Country music's influence and impact on the birth of rock n roll is greatly underplayed here. I will be adding information to the article about it  over time, but as I have school it will be as time permits. If anyone else can find anything more to add about this important factor please do, rock n roll was the fusion of country and r&b, not just another name for r&b! 72.75.200.103 00:57, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Too greatly. Too too greatly. This list surely needs a cleanup. At first, most recordings mentioned here are country recordings having a little to do with rnr. Second, as rnr evolved from rnb (if they ain't no the same) the impact of rnb artists is too minimized in this article. We can describe every single genre like this, and the way it's done here let's say Jazz was developed from Klezmer, and House is just a synonym for disco. Third, the article is overflowed with stuff of 'who was the first to say words 'rock' and 'roll' in one song'. Let's then say House evolved from a record where someone said 'Rock the house'. Fourth the comment above of that 'rnr has no first song/first record' is something related to philosophy much more than it is to the encyclopedia. -- 82.209.225.33 (talk) 08:08, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: And, btw, country influenced greatly the genre called 'rockabilly' and not a rnr -- 82.209.225.33 (talk) 08:08, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Comments 2007-08

message: A discussion is taking place on Talk:Origins of rock and roll regarding merging some of the content of this article, and then possibly redirecting the title to Origins_of_rock_and_roll#First_record. SilkTork *YES! 16:08, 23 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Merging to [[Origins of rock and roll]]