Talk:Won Gyun

message: Someone please rename this article back to Won Gyun as that is the most widely used spelling. Taeguk Warrior 12:25, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rename 

message: As a scholar of Korean history, I found this current revision of this article to be offensive and narrow-minded. This is not to say that Yi Sun Shin was not a great military leader, but the following linked past article is actually the more representative of Won Gyun as a military leader: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Won_Gyun&oldid=91097439
1. Won Gyun was the subject of intense historical revisionism during the Park Chung Hee administration. President Park Chung Hee is known to have greatly admired Yi Sun Shin and King Sejong as Korea's representative historical 'icons' and did his best during the dictatorial years to distort history to make things work to his vision of Korea. Yi Sun Shin's apotheosis was done partially through the degradation of Won Kyun (Won Gyun) who was also an important military figure at the time who received honors posthumously from the Korean monarchy. While it is true that he was involved in a catastrophic loss against the invading Japanese, that was more a symbol of the sheer incompetence of the Yi Dynasty court that was seeing signs of growing factional strife that resulted in historical calamity later on in its history.
2. There's a lot of dramatization in Korea on this topic for obvious reasons. Yi Sun Shin has long been taught to be one of Korea's national heroes, while Won Kyun has been relegated as a national antagonist. Also, a close inspection of Yi Sun Shin's writings suggest that Won Kyun wasn't as incompetent as taught in Korean schools and perpetuated through academia. Look at the sources cited for this article - they are either written during the Japanese occupation, or during Park Chung Hee's administration. There are virtually no historical first sources beyond Yi Sun Shin's memoirs (which I do not see any citations from in the article itself) and are understandably more antagonistic.
3. The accusations launched against Won Kyun such as his appointments in the military are unsubstantiated at best.
4. I admit that there is a tragic dearth of translations of first-hand accounts and records that are currently available in classical Chinese, and for various political and marketing reasons, not widely circulated beyond the narrow scope of Korean academia, and even then, finding sources in English pertaining to this topic remains impossible to find - more the reason that the only article in existence pertaining to the topic at hand in English is not bogged down by what has been effectively dictatorship-era propaganda lite. This includes a scholarly translation of the inscriptions at Won Kyun's burial grounds and shrine, also in a far less epic scale than the one for Yi Sun Shin.
5. While it is a somewhat raw source, there is one English website that does offer raw translations of the markings and inscriptions at the site. I'm not pleased at the quotes, but I have a sinking suspicion that they're actually quotes on the little signboards explaining the cultural sites being referenced and photographed near Pyongtaek that are government sponsored.
6. I also take offense at the contributor below who stipulates that most educated Koreans would be shocked to hear about the possibility that Won Kyun is not as bad as he is displayed in children's history books. In my experience with people who lived in the Park Chung Hee Era all have a certain dose of healthy skepticism that is lost today in a world cluttered by misinformation.
7. This is the link to the website. Some of the sources I will admit here are dubious but the historical marker sign quotes should be considered historical document in fact. http://kalaniosullivan.com/OsanAB/OsanSongtanKorHist.html and please scroll down to the article pertaining to 'Won Kyun.'
8. You can see that the site is actually very well taken care of, and of particular interest:
"Won Kyun (Hwan Gun) won the Battle of Dangpo by "recruiting the dispersed Army inspite of the unfavorable situation in the early phase of the war." He scored victories at Happo, Chokchinpo, and other skirmishes. (Source: Historical Marker at Admiral Won Kyun's Tomb)"
"Along with Gen Kwon Yul and Admiral Yi Sun-shin, he was granted posthumous honors by King Seonjo in 1603. (Source: Historic Marker at Admiral Won Kyun's Tomb)" (Direct quotes from the website)
Gwon Yul, Yi Sun Shin, and Won Gyun are the trio of famous generals during the Japanese invasions and slightly prior - but considerable animosity between the Deoksu Yi family and the Wonju Won family that seemed to have existed in history made Won Kyun an attractive target for historical distortion.
9. So with that, I've restored this page to how it originally was at the above posting. If you look at the text prior to my editing, you will see that everything 'good' mentioned about Won Kyun has been irresponsibly replaced with something remarkably 'bad' about Won Kyun. The article was also fraught with inconsistencies as the editors themselves did not have a full understanding of Won Kyun as a three-dimensional historical figure, preferring to report Won Kyun in the article as an antagonist caricature. Statement about often being drunk is taken from a source that is outdated and also very single-sided on the matter. There was no cite at all pertaining to Won Kyun concurring with the Japanese spy to get Yi Sun Shin arrested - and the paragraph right after explains in fact Won Kyun KNEW the Japanese spy was lying and only proceed with his cause of action due to the court and their orders. Senei's argument about Won Kyun's appointments are also incorrect - partially. Yi Sun Shin was also from a very distinguished family - a family that I descend from. (Deoksu Yi). Won Kyun prior to his military assignments was already a government magistrate.Whitearbiter 06:29, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reverting the Article Back and my justifications 

message: idkim has yet to offer any tangible edits to remove bias and distortion in his article, so I made considerable pruning of information that smacked of bias unless he can produce primary sources. Areas such as rumors about his death, which spanned two whole paragraphs, really had no point in an article, or at least in the size that it was produced and with the heavily anti-Won Gyun slant of the writer. I have also made several grammar edits such as the post-positive use of 'However.' Whitearbiter 09:05, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pruning of Bias