Talk:List of Freeza related characters in Dragon Ball

message: I like the idea of this page as a possible way to get around the monstrosity that List of Dragon Ball characters has become, but you may be straying from the source material a bit and adding (well-reasoned, perhaps) supposition. Frankly, a lot of stuff just isn't said in the manga/anime and the daizenshuus are unreliable because nearly all of the information we have *in English* that comes from the daizenshuus come from websites that add their own layers of supposition. So, this is a tricky road.
All that said, fighting move lists are some of the most difficult topics. First, because most of the moves aren't named in any canon sources. I think there aren't more than two dozen moves named in all of Dragon Ball, and almost none for the minor characters. And once we get to this point in DBZ, technique names become rarer. And second, because there are many DB-based video games in the US and Japan and they all have character moves and things which don't necessarily agree. In general, moves that come from the games are best listed in the game article, or on a game-specific Wikibook, with a link to that page from here.
The tricky part about these "list of" pages is that the per-character information necessarily needs to be brief. The reason the characters are listed here (generally) is because they aren't important enough to warrant their own article and so having article-length stubs with tons of extraneous information is counter-productive and hurts the value of the list overall. I'd suggest that you could have a summary section of "techniques of Freeza's army" which describes (in canon terms) the overall style, types of body armor, etc. And then do less per-character information. JRP 15:50, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Nothing was lost from any of their articles. Sentences were merged, punctuation was improved, and details were added at points within. So far as the lub-fest was, it got to be NPOV and had to be culled into neutrality. Papacha 16:27, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Character list pages

message: What about Orlen, the guy who seems to be the same race as Mr. Appule but has orange skin, red eyes and fangs? I think he merits a mention, although for the life of me, I can't understand why Appule's role in finding the destroyed village was removed from the anime; since he gets killed off immediately afterwards, Orlen's existence is pointless, not to mention confusing since it was APPULE, not Orlen, who left Dende's village with Mr. Zarbon.
Also, how about Mr. Dodoria's four underlings from the Bardock special? I know none of them were named, but they had an important role in killing Bardock's friends and even participated in what is (in my opinion) one of the very best fight scenes in the entire DBZ storyline. You could list them under the collective title of "Dodoria's Men" or something. - Kooshmeister
:Dodoria's troupe are nobodies, and though it's a precursor to something grander Bardock's men aren't that important either. Blue and Rasp are only here because of sticking around way past their welcome as Toei filler. The scientists in the restoration tank are sadly more notable than any of Dodoria's flunkies.
:And as you said, Orin (Or is it Orlen? Who cares, he's an ORANGE) is pointless, so there you go. Papacha 06:22, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: S'all right. If that's how you feel, be bold and add him in. I'm against listing unnotable toadies, but if you feel Orin had a important anime part to play write up a short bio and post it up; we'll work on the clean-up together. You can even note the story-line change between the anime & manga. Zarbon's got a decent enough pic of him to use. Papacha 01:09, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Orlen? 

message: From all this moving. Someone get me a barf bag, I need to sit down... Papacha 06:25, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I'm getting dizzy... 

message: Just thought I'd explain why I removed mention of him dying when Trunks blows up King Cold's ship: the doctor never left Freeza Planet 79. It's a common misconception that Freeza's reconstruction took place on the ship due to Cold's line in the dub of "Change course!", when actually this occurred in the medical facility on Planet 79. For whatever reasons Funimation tried to make it seem like those scenes took place aboard Cold's ship and not the base. In any event, there's no evidence the doctor went with Cold and Freeza to Earth, much less died when the ship went kablooey. (And if I'm wrong and we do see the doctor aboard the ship, please feel free to correct me) - Kooshmeister
: I removed it altogether, since the doctor spoken of in the piece is a casualty of Planet Vegeta. The new doc shouldn't be confused with him, just like the few other members of Cui's race.
*Also, please leave my newly uploaded images alone. Their quality is fine when they're small, and more importantly they're different from the same tired old images seen on every DBZ site on the planet. Variety is not the spice of DBZ life due to the reuse of the same pics since the 90s. - Kooshmeister
*:It's there because the "tired old image" is a clear pic, properly sourced, and not blurry like the other. Commentary on "Variety is not the spice of DBZ life" isn't a valid argument for putting a lesser picture above another. Find a better cap of it (or do it yourself) and there would be no problems. Voice of Treason 00:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Doctor on Freeza Planet 79 

message: How strong are the members of cooler's armoured squadron in comparison to the ginyu force, I ask this because in the namek saga goku defeated all of the ginyu force with no effort at all (excluding captain ginyu who goku spent a whole episode fighting before powering up and guldo but he was already dead before goku got there) but then in movie 5 goku still easily beat them but he seemed to use a lot more power also if you could give exact power levels or a rough guess that would be great thanks User:Kami-Sama.
Well...Cooler's Team is hard to guess, but my estimates for the Ginyu Force would be somthin' like:
#Guldo: 10,000
#Recoome: 40,000-60,000
#Burter: 40,000-50,000
#Jiece: 40,000-50,000
Cooler's team must be at least 50,000 each, at most 70,000.--KojiDude (talk) 02:11, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Coola's Armoured Squadron vs. the ginyu force 

message: May I ask why you haven't added king Vegeta to Freeza related character list after all he was the king of all saiyan and in the flash back of dbz you see freezer treating king Vegeta in a similar fashion to zarbon and dodoria I now that king Vegeta tried to kill Freeza but Freeza was asking for betrayal when he took his son Vegeta of him.
And about my previous question you answered my question about the ginyu forces power level but did not answer my question about who would win in a fight ginyu force or coolers armoured squadron. thanks User:Kami-Sama
:King Vegeta isn't a Freeza related character...If we added everyone Freeza killed or used as a pawn to the list it'd be endless.--KojiDude (talk) 16:49, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  King Vegeta ??? 

message: Can I please ask you if you would create a main article for coola's armoured squadron like you've done for the ginyu force (an article with all three of the members of the squadron) I ask this because the coola's armoured squadron are some of my favourite characters in the dbz movies. User:Kami-Sama
:Probably not, and any attempt at making one should be speedied as fancruft. They're minor characters easily covered in the base of this article and Coola; the Ginyu are the focus of part of the manga and a decent number of episodes. Papacha 20:16, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  main article 

message: It's not nessecary for them to each have their own summaries. here just needs to be one of the whole group, and if a reader wants more, they click the link for the Ginyu Force. I understand they're your favorite characters, but that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want with the page.--KojiDude (viva la BAM!) 23:52, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. They're not necessary. If we're going to keep them, it should be a summary of all of the members in one paragraph (two if needed). They already have their own page and the summaries here are pretty much word-for-word. Sasuke-kun27 00:05, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Exactly. Having summaries here defeats the purpose of the Ginyu Force article. If they're listed here, why not just slap an AfD tag on Ginyu Force while you're at it?--KojiDude (viva la BAM!) 00:08, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What we have now is fine. If you want more info on the team members, click on the link. It would be stupid to use the 3RR arguing over whether or not the Ginyu Force should list every single member on this page (when they have their own page and everything here is pretty much copied and pasted from there) when we could be acting like civil people and talk over this like we're doing now. Sasuke-kun27 00:14, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Sarcasm or not, Gogeta and Goku/Vegeta are three entirely different people. Whereas the Ginyu Force on this page and the Ginyu Force article are almost exactly the same. The only real difference I notice is "Sentai and the Ginyu Force" and "Video Games". Sasuke-kun27 00:33, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Coola's squad don't have their own article. So what if it isn't list of Freeza Related Groups? The page only needs a short summary of the group, and a link to their main article. What good does having them all do other than giving your favorite characters more recognition? (Also, a little side note, Gogeta and Goku/Vegeta are entirley different entities with entirley different pasts and personalities, so that argument is more or less useless)--KojiDude (viva la BAM!) 01:07, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Somone who knew it wasn't necesary to have the information. We are not doing this out of "hate" for villains. Kiwi is the english manga name for Cui, thus the name that should be used here. The Ginyu Force do not each need their own summaries, for the reasons listed already. Please see WP:OWN and WP:NPOV.--KojiDude (viva la BAM!) 01:21, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ginyu Force 

message: ok. I have come up with a solution. the page should be moved to List of non-Saiyan Dragon Ball characters in Freeza's empire. It is true that Freeza has a galactic empire, and all the character on here fit into that classification, without any ambiguity as to whether Cell should be on here. and "non-Saiyan" prevents Vegeta etc from needing to be here. Plough | talk to me 08:05, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: True, but then Coola and his henchmen would have ot be removed, scince they're not member's of Freeza's empire.--KojiDude
hmm, what about "Cold Empire" then, because Cold is Freeza and Coola's father Plough | talk to me 07:16, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

text: It kinda seems to me like you want to do the move just because you don't want Cell on the page, which is a pretty clear example of bad faith and a WP:OWN issue.--KojiDude (Contributions) 07:47, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry I'm kinda late here, but now that you guys mention it, shouldn't Vegeta be listed on the page? I mean, he was one of Freeza's top fighters (I believe) until he started fighting against Freeza. I mean, if Cell gets a mention, I believe Vegeta should get one too. // Sasuke-kun27 20:40, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If you think they should be added, go ahead. It sounds like a logical idea to me.--KojiDude (Contributions) 20:44, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  page move 

message: I think Im taking this article into a good direction. with some recent fixing and all. I DO however need some henchmen so if anyone would be willing to help me then you are welcome here!!-Sarzad 03:16, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  good improvements 

message: at first sight found this:
*Dodoria's Elite
:they appear as non-playable characters in Dragon Ball Z Sparking! Neo PS2 jap (story mode: Bardock's scenario) and some of them are playable in the Wii version.
*Saiyan race
:Thurles, Tullece, Taresu whatever his name is at Freezer's service with his 4 henchmen in armor ("tree of might" OAV). info available in the manga (anime comics) 's character guide. (check Tullece article's discussion page)
Paris By Night 18:44, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: lacking infos