Talk:Xbox 360/Archive 4

message: Allegations and claims regarding the 360's use of electricity are worthy of mention. For example, there are reports that it may use more energy than a standard PC with the same game title in use. Comparisons to future Next Gen material may also be included or verified. --AWF
:Not really. Perhaps if the system were proven to really suck an incredible amount of power, it might be worth noting. But the 360 uses a liquid-cooled triple-core processor that requires (if I'm not mistaken) two high-speed case fans. Using more power than some other devices seems obvious (like the computer in question, which was probably a single-fan-cooled single core). Even then, this would go in with the technical errata, as it doesn't seem to cause much of an issue at all for the vast majority of consumers. Gspawn 14:24, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The D/C output is listed as 203W in the hardware spec section. Lets say the power supply has ~66% efficiency (about the average minimum for a cheap pc power supply), that gets you up to ~300 watts, which is close to the power consumption of an average new pc and pretty modest when compared to a high-powered gaming rig. ˉˉanetode╞┬╡ 14:37, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "Energy hog"

message: "The controllers have two digital touch-sensitive trigger buttons."
Is this true? I can't find any mention of it anywhere else, and my controller only seems to have normal buttons. Perhaps they meant to say that it has analogue triggers?
:Sounds like the triggers are pressure sensitive, but no others.  Unusual, as I seem to recall that all the buttons on Sony's Dual Shock 2 controllers are analog. Two analog pressure-point triggers, two vibration feedback motors, and one eight-way directional pad are included. -  --OscarTheCattalk 18:46, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The original Xbox controllers (Duke and Controller S) had fully analog face buttons (A,B,X,Y,Wh,Bl) and fully analog triggers, as well as analog joysticks and d-pad. However, with the Xbox 360, only the triggers, joysticks, and d-pad are analog, the face buttons are digital. --CanesOL79 16:48, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Touch-sensitive buttons 

message: They need reviewing.  For example, do we need another 360 review  (added today) --OscarTheCattalk 10:19, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Have left a msg with contributor, asking that reviews only be added to articles where there isn't already a review, in order to keep external links to a minimum.  Otherwise we'll have pages and pages of reviews, all saying pretty much the same thing. (WP:EL). --OscarTheCattalk 10:29, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links 

message: Both of these were very similar to "off the shelf" PC hardware and were therefore sold to Microsoft at inflated market prices.
This seems counter intuitive - I'm not saying it's wrong, but to the lay reader it might need explaining. WhiteCat 06:55, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Retail configurations and pricing  

message: Just got my XBOX 360 Premium pack today (Australia), it had no headset in it. The box doesn't indicate that it contains a headset either. Either there is no headset included in the premium pack, Australia doesn't get the headset in any pack or MS happened to print one box out of thousands that contained no picture of a headset and no headset. I am guessing that Australia got shafted. Already spent 1200 dollars on this thing, looks like I need spend 50 more. This page should be updated to reflect this fact. 202.191.106.34 10:07, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi - this is documented in the article, see Xbox_360_launches#Australia_and_New_Zealand Regards, --Oscarthecat 10:21, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Grrr, it still burns me up. Thanks though, I can't believe I missed that before posting here 202.191.106.34 14:36, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Headset included, or not

message: Ghost Recon Advance Warefare was technically an Australian launch title, it was available in all stores, in bundles and well, it was a launch title. I don't know how to add that to the launch title list or if it should be added, but just thought I would say 202.191.106.34 14:51, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: GRAW

message: Several blogs are reporting that the system isn't doing well in Japan at all, with store liquidating their stocks for the equivalent of US$125.  Surely this is worth mention in light of the upcoming console wars.
:Actually, it is not that accurate. According to Kotaku, "Japanese Kotaku scout Sean A. also wrote into let me know that the price is conditional on signing up for @TCOM service (an ISP that I personally don’t know about, Sean, but thanks for the benefit of the doubt) AND buying an Xbox 360 with your game." I remember this has been also explained during the first sales week, when low prices began appearing and everyone though they were selling Xboxes at a lower cost. -- ReyBrujo 15:58, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well one thing that is accurate is its poor sales figures.  It's performing worse in Japan than the original Xbox did which was pretty bad.  Only 81,770 Xbox 360s were sold in Japan in 2005, compared to the 123,000 the original Xbox was able to sell there in its first three days.   According to Maruyama, the Executive Officer General Manager for the Xbox division in Japan, the original Xbox sold only 450,000 units as of July 2005.   Dionyseus 18:12, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Indeed. I was just pointing out that Microsoft won't lower the price of the Xbox in Japan, at least until PS3 officially launches. -- ReyBrujo 01:23, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Failure in Japan? 

message: This paragraph was removed from the opening section by Mcdonaldsguy.  I realise that we need to keep the opening section short, but the information offered here seems  to offer some crucial information to gamers.
:In all countries except Japan the console is sold in two different configurations: the "Xbox 360" and the "Xbox 360 Core System". The former configuration is often referred to as the "Premium Edition", which includes a hard drive (required for operations including backwards compatibility with selected original Xbox games), a wireless controller, a headset, an Ethernet cable, an Xbox Live silver subscription, and a component HD AV cable (which can also be used on non-HD TVs).
:--Oscarthecat 08:10, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Core details 

message: ( I've reinstated this talk thread, was removed earlier, in case others want to contribute. --Oscarthecat 08:16, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I see you've now moved the marketing section to a seperate article, seems a good idea in order to keep the main article leaner and more on-topic. --Oscarthecat 08:16, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

text: Thought I might bump in here and post a potential item-of-interest: I was working at Future Shop during the XBox 360 launch.  Apparently, Microsoft rushed testing on their consoles to meet the Holiday Rush; as a result, one-in-three was a return (for any number of defects/replacement calls).  Someone may want to verify the rushed-testing thing, as it might have just been an exaggeration, but I think it bears mentioning if it's true. DarkMasterBob 09:59, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Console launch

message: I did an edit earlier, undoing a revert by an anon IP.  My comment was "rv - that last anon rv appears bogus - reverted a lot of good work done on the article - please discuss on talk page". If discussion required over whether my rv was incorrect, let's discuss here. --Oscarthecat 11:18, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Revert

message: If you want to shorten this article a bit I've a few suggestions:
:Section 'Retail configurations and pricing' cut 3rd paragraph completely
:Section 'Launch titles' cut the table at least - this section becomes less relavent as time goes on
:Section 'Controller' shorten to 1 paragraph?
:Section 'AV connection cables' cut completely
:Section 'DVD drive' cut 4th (final) paragraph
:Section 'Software developement' shorten XNA, cut Proceedural synth. as a paragraph completely
Other sections could be simplified - eg Does anyone need to know how many 360's were sold in Febuary?, Dashboard section - just too much info - why not just print out the instructon manual (sarcasm).
I won't make these edits myself since I've not been contributing much to the article, but I think these suggestions are fairly impartial if you need an opinion.HappyVR 20:49, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  About shortening 

message: Hey, I have Xbox 360 that's defective, and is giving me a "3 Red Lights: The Xbox 360 system is experiencing a hardware failure" I'm just wondering whether a pic of the pattern might be a good idea for the red lights pattern area.Delta Elite 01:03, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think that's a good idea, there's far too many pictures in this article already. Dionyseus 06:22, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Okay, but maybe in the future if the articles are split up to shorten the 360 article. I doubt it, but i'm going to keep the photo.-Delta Elite 18:22, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: A good idea might be an illustration? Not a PNG or GIF or even SVG, maybe just use a table with four squares, and put the ones that go red, shaded in red. Just a thought. - RHeodt 12:47, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Doesn't the manual explain what the lights mean?  If it does, I don't see why it needs to be added to this ridiculously long article.  Dionyseus 18:51, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There's really no purpose to it, except that people continue to upload tech support information, or random complaints about crashing. The "Screen of death" info is worse, actually, as there is no mention of an "Xbox 360 screen of death" anywhere except Wikipedia mirrors and sites that rip Wikicontent. I tried to clean up and condense it, but the whole "Technical Issues" section could easily do with two short paragraphs and a couple of links to Xbox tech support sites. All that crap will still get posted though, the only way to deter it would be to split the Technical Issues of to a seperate article.  Even then, that article might devolve to a poorly cited list of miscellaneous complaints and half-baked support suggestions. ˉˉanetode╞┬╡ 04:01, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Xbox 360 Ring of Light

message: Microsoft is revamping their efforts in Japan. Check it out. .Delta Elite 02:09, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: They are releasing a new bundle with Fifa World Cup 2006, according to Gamasutra.  -- ReyBrujo 03:58, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Not that I'm correcting you (since "relaunch" is the word the article you showed uses) but I wouldn't exactly call that a relaunch. The context I usually use relaunch in, is a relatively large hardware modification which is promoted as having been changed (not just a quiet change, like Xbox's change from 8GB harddrive to 10GB). Something I would call a relaunch is when Apple upgrade the features of the iPods, cause they not only changed it, but they're advertising the change. - RHeodt 12:45, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay.Delta Elite 21:06, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Not sure if anyone noticed but the two articles have contradicting dates.  One claims the "relaunch" (which is really just a new bundle game) will be on June 29, the other claims it would be on April 27th.  Dionyseus 23:25, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

text: This is not true, as the April press conference clearly did not involve with this so-called "relaunch".Kenimaru 06:28, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Xbox 360 Relaunch

message: :"Microsoft's decision has also allowed Japanese developers to fully utilize the hard drive to optimize game performance, since it is part of the default system configuration in their market. However because of the existence of a Core System edition, many games do not require a hard drive."
This paragraph is confusing, contradicts itself, and is basically content-free, so I just removed it entirely. If someone can find something useful to merge out of it please add that back in :). Just another star in the night T | @ | C 10:40, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I was thinking it contradicted itself, but decided to see if anyone else would say anything. I had come very close to removing it several times myself. - RHeodt 12:44, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  removed paragraph 

message: The paragraph dealing with hardware implementation is perhaps the most important part, as the method used in X360's design is pretty unique. Plus it contains the article's only mention of the CPU's lack of support for out-of-order execution. ˉˉanetode╞┬╡ 11:12, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't disagree - but when we have a main article generally we should simply summarize whats in that article. I just thought, while interesting, it included a bit more then just a summary - plus there was some advertising language - but if you think otherwise then you probably know more then I do :). Just another star in the night T | @ | C 12:00, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, the problem is that the main procedural generation article doesn't really explain the optimizations included in the Xbox 360 design. A summary of procedural generation isn't relevant without that info. You could just write "Xbox 360 games may use procedural generation, for more info see this article" - but then why bring it up at all? ˉˉanetode╞┬╡ 12:53, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, now I'm kind of embarassed, the above post is false and the procedural generation article does have X360 technical info. Sorry RN. I now have no objections to cutting this section ˉˉanetode╞┬╡ 13:31, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Procedural synthesis 

message: The overheating paragraph almost seems biased, probably due to wording...<BR>
"Because of its high power consumption and limited capacity to dissipate heat, the Xbox 360 console has a high risk of overheating. Problems associated with overheating include reduced system performance and instability that may result in crashing or hardware failure. Users are advised not to obstruct air flow to the enclosure vents or power supply. Some users have installed custom cooling solutions in their consoles as a preventative measure."<BR>
The 360 has a "high risk" of overheating? Only if you don't follow the reccomendations and warnings expressly stated in the manual. Editing the paragraph as such. Gspawn 14:32, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Overheating 

message: Unless I'm mistaken, M$ announced the Xbox did indeed make an overall swing around to the profit side around the time of Halo 2's launch. And also unless I'm mistaken, M$'s entertainment division did very well for itself and absorbed the Xbox's losses while reporting its own profits for most of the lifecycle. Am I completely crazy, or does this portion need to be revamped/removed? Gspawn 14:47, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I would say you are quite sane :) - seriously, I'd get some relaliable sources and just go for it :). Just another star in the night T | @ | C 15:07, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

text: Microsoft's Home Division did have its first quarterly profit around the release of halo 2, as reported late-January 2005. However a Forbes article from October 2005 states that "The Xbox game console is hot, but its division has lost $4 billion in four years and isn't yet in the black." So the statements in the article are accurate: "Microsoft's home entertainment division posted a loss through nearly every quarter of the console's lifecycle" (note "nearly"). Profits made by the Xbox division were not bolstered by system sales, since Microsoft repeatedly slashed the Xbox's price.  The section is factually correct, if a bit wordy. ˉˉanetode╞┬╡ 15:57, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: GamesIndustry is reporting that Microsoft revealed a Q3 loss of USD 388 million in its Home and Entertainment division, which houses the Xbox 360 console, despite a gain in revenue and an overall profit for the company.  -- ReyBrujo 12:44, 28 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Profits 

message: The backwards compatibility update makes the IGN backwards compatible article in references outdated. Discuss. TRega123
:Hi - in what way does it make the IGN article outdated?  Have had a peek and it's not immediately apparent.  Thanks. --Oscarthecat 17:57, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Backwards Compatibility Update 

message: Last time I checked, the USB ports, although supported USB 2, had less power going to anything plugged into, making a normal USB stick impossible to use. I think this should probably be mentioned somewhere in the article, but then again, I could be wrong. --RabidZombie 18:24, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The Microsoft memory stick is a normal memory stick! As for the amount of power suppied it's hard to know. It's enough for WiFi adapaters and controllers, which means it must be suppling a fair amount.vortex 03:01, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  It has plenty of power. I've had USB sticks, charging kits, a USB hub plugged in all at the same time, no problemsDelta Spartan 05:11, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The USB 2.0 ports on the Xbox 360 have just as much power going through them that any other USB 2.0 port does. It's a standard, which means that the rules have to be followed completley. It might be a defective console, but it's not the architecture of the motherboard, that's for sure. --CanesOL79 16:54, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  USB ports 

message: I would like to add the following new external link for the Xbox 360 page.
Pixel Gamers - Xbox 360 News, Podcast,  Screenshots, Previews & Reviews
I use this site every day and find it a valuable resource that provides the information I want clearly.
15:07, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New External Link 

message: Please help improve the article. jaco♫plane 21:00, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I like the idea of an article that is full of the latest cream of the crop info about Halo 3, count me in ^ ^JayKeaton 15:04, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Article's going great! Count me in too.-Delta Spartan 05:12, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Okay, I know this may be a little too early, but how about we all make a Halo 3 wikiproject?-Delta Spartan 06:10, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Before the game is released I doubt there would be support for any more Halo 3-specific articles than just Halo 3... so a WikiProject now would probably be jumping the gun a bit. Remy B 06:59, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

text:  Agree, project before the game even comes out may be straying into WP:NOT territory. That said, it's great to have all the info /speculation/rumours/allegations collected together. --Oscarthecat 07:10, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Halo 3]] 

message: It appears the 360's been modded with some sort of firmware fix.  Since there's such a large section on modifications in the old xbox article, perhaps one should be started here?
Here's the mod in question:
http://bt.xbox-sky.com/review.php?id=8841&page=1&p=1
: AGAINST, that's piracy not modding... Kenimaru 06:18, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Virtually all early console modding winds up getting focused on illegal activities including pirating, "copied games" (so-called before they're sold), "backup discs" (early piracy trials not intended to be sold yet)... heh. But seriously- until there's an actual modding community (dashboard-enhancing Linux, media extenders, etc) and not just software piracy, it's definately not worth mention. 172.167.97.48 16:57, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  modification 

message: Hello, I notice that you have a box (that opens and closes at the touch of a button) - very usefull - could someone supply a link to the formatting guidlines for this feature, or an explanation of code grammar. Thanks.HappyVR 12:25, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: formatting - retail configurations and pricing

message: This article needs a section badly about key first party and second party game development houses an what are the key first party , second, and third party games. Also we need to make notes about the increasing use of the systems capabilities. Perhaps showing comparison from the initial titles like Amped 3 and games like Gears of War  which have far superior graphics. For a comparison look at Nintendo Gamecube and see how they reference games.  This part is ncessary and also a prequisitie for including game screenshots into the article --larsinio (poke)(prod) 18:26, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ummm... why? I think it's great as-is, for several reasons. The article is already growing very long just to cover all the hardware, for example. And I don't think that many 360 fans are absolutely clamoring to see huge lists of what's first-party and what's exclusive... they haven't so far. Perhaps a "side article" could be started for this if none exist, but the main article doesn't really seem to need it. 172.167.97.48 16:52, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: We need to still mention games that are on teh system, like launch titles or examples showign games that take advantage of particular capabilities. This is the only way we can include screenshots legitimately, which ar eneeded to show exactly what the 360 is capable of. And about perhaps the killeraps of the service, like Geometry wars or whatnot. --larsinio (poke)(prod) 16:46, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Games

message: I think this section is a  bit too long, don't you? It should have it's own, seperate article. I think maybe information about what each ring of light combo means should be kept, but the rest should go in a new article. What do you think? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.43.16.39 (talk • contribs) .
Made new article, feel free to contribute to it.--Jigahurtz 23:58, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Technical Difficulties?

message: Shouldn’t that be Elder scrolls IV Oblivion now? not Call of Duty 2. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 192.152.208.1 (talk • contribs) .
:Numbers still favour Call of Duty 2, as far as I know. -- ReyBrujo 19:02, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: On the page, it was Ghost Recon: Advanced Warfighter, then got changed to Elder Scrolss IV: Oblivion.  No source was given for either.  We need a source, then revert any changes that don't cite a source. Ace of Sevens 05:02, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Top-selling game 

message: In the UK atleast (and im asuming other PAL regions) the xbox 360 can play DVD's at 576i and 576p, 4:3 and 16:9.  I beleive the 576i is 50 frames per second, but I am unaware if 576p is at 50 or 25 frames per second.--Evari001 12:25, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Output Resolutions 

message: Is there a computer/videogame article better than this one? We've all contributed bits and pieces, if not chunks, of information to this article, and I think it shows. Let's hope this gets nominated as a featured article, I think that would be FANTASTIC. Let's keep making the article better. --CanesOL79 04:46, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Any better? 

message: http://curmudgeongamer.com/2006/07/4-million-xbox-360s-sold-still-not.html reports Q2 2006 sales figures(with sources from NeoGAF and Next-Gen.biz) and a total of 4million units sold world-wide.
Should we add the information or wait for the microsoft official balance report? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Xymor (talk • contribs) 17:54, 15 July 2006  (UTC)
:I am hesitant to use this, as the article is making a guess on non-domestic sales. I guess it could be included as long as it was qualified as an unofficial estimate. That said, I'm noticing that, even more than with tech specs, editors get very careless with sales statistics, introducing original errors. I'm still trying to figure out how the Nintendo DS Lite sales count is being arrived at. Dancter 18:25, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Q2 2006 Sales figures 

message: The accessory section is to lengthy, made a new article for the purpose of simplification. The article should focus on the console, not the accesories. Those wanting to know more about them can go to the above linked page for more details. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jigahurtz (talk • contribs) 02:20, 20 July 2006  (UTC)
*Notimating the section being moved to hardware-74.33.11.34 10:09, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Xbox 360 Components And Accessories

message: I don't think that it's realy needed, having something that was a limited edition special included in a comparison seems unneeded. More so later in the consoles lifetime. 
*Oppose: It was a launch item so it should be their —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Elven6 (talk • contribs) 01:31, 21 July 2006  (UTC)
**It's a launch item, that's the point. It's not a part of the console anymore, it was part of the launch console. The chart is to show the differances between the versions. Not made to show all the bonuses microsoft decides to throw in whenever it wants -74.33.11.34 05:04, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Bonus media remote in comparison