Talk:Crossover (fiction)

message: Has anyone seen that Swiffer commercial with Florence from The Jeffersons,
Rosario from Will & Grace,
Alice from The Brady Bunch,
Benson from Soap and Benson, and
Geoffrey from The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air?
What category would that be in?  Because honestly, the ones here are a little confusing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mole  (talk • contribs) 17:21, 26 July 2004
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No one really likes posting here when the categories are this confusing.  I know, I made them.  If anyone wants to reorganize them in some form, or explain them in better terms, go ahead.  Ihavenolife —Preceding undated comment added 04:56, 26 September 2004
It seems to me that the place to start is by defining the different types a little better - these categories are both confusing and in some cases, counter-intuitive.  What did you have in mind for each of them when you created them?  Lokicarbis 06:38, Jan 23, 2005 (UTC)
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Why is the article under the plural 'fictional crossovers' and 'fictional crossover' a redirect? 213.236.117.2 14:28, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Comment

message: I must disagree with this article. Conan meeting Elric was not some one-shot deal with no consquences. The wizard Kulan Gath died in that crossover, and when he next met Conan in Conan the Barbarian I#253-260, in issue#259, he referenced his death in that issue, calling Elric an "albino". Not only that, but in Savage Sword of Conan#189, Zukala also recalled meeting Elric. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.188.116.136  (talk • contribs) 22:59, 20 February 2005
I removed a section about Superman being real in the Seinfeld universe, based on one conversaion in the series. Seinfeld characters frequently talk about stuff they know nothing about. DJ Clayworth 13:57, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Unfortunately, somebody has gone and replaced it.  I do not agree that Superman is "real" in the Seinfeld universe.  Jerry and George are simply Superman fans and discuss him frequently.  It's meant as a verbal game the characters play, much like a thought experiment although that's probably givign it too much weight.  I don't think it was ever meant to imply that Superman "exists" in the Seinfeld universe in the sense that one could meet him on the street, or see him flying overhead.  I'm removing the comment from the article. Canonblack 04:18, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with the deletion of Superman in Seinfeld. Using the word "universe" for most works of fiction is fairly pretentious, anyhow. Writers always try to be coherent. I don't see shows such as Seinfeld as having any "universe" at all, it's more like everyday people meeting regularly in everyday circumstances. The use of "universe" is pretentious in much comic usage, too. Throwing characters together for bizarre encounters can be amusing, but it's rarely significant. For example, I haven't read a Superman comic for years. And yet, if I picked any random one off the news stand, I'm confident I'd understand within a couple minutes almost everything that was going on. That is to say, the ten years I've missed of all these "crossovers" ultimately has almost no affect on my reading. 76.102.1.129 (talk) 09:05, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Conan meeting Elric was referenced many subsquent times.

message: :or through the incorporation of characters and fictional universes within the public domain (or those that are at least considered to be; examples include Sherlock Holmes, Dracula, etc)
Sherlock Holmes? Dracula? Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (d. 1930) and Bram Stoker (d. 1912) certainly died before January 1, 1936, putting the works in the public domain in life-plus-50 and life-plus-70 countries. Only a few SH stories remain eligible for copyright in the United States. So are we talking about Mexico (life plus 100)? Or are we talking about use of trademark as an ersatz copyright against derivative works? --Damian Yerrick (☎) 23:53, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: ''Considered'' to be PD?

message: The category and the name of this article are currently being discussed for renaming WP:CFD#Category:Fictional_crossovers . Some are proposing a complete reversal of title word order to Crossover fiction. // <B>Fra</B>nkB 02:06, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Renaming discussion

message: I have added the WP Fan Fiction template because this article is used as a reference for "crossover" in some fan fiction articles and a lot of crossovers are fan fiction. This of course does not imply that all crossovers are (as they obviously are not), but a lot are, etc.,etc., so... yeah. Hence the template. Runa27 23:05, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: WikiProject Fan Fiction template

message: I think the list of spin-offs is becoming too long and unwieldy; we only need a handful to illustrate the overall point that certain shows that have spin-offs do crossover with each other. Furthermore, whilst I'm not familiar with every show in that list, it seems to have become more a general listing of shows which have spin-offs rather than shows with spin-offs that have crossed over with each other to me, or lists of shows that can be connected by crossovers without actually being spin-offs from each other.--Joseph Q Publique 01:21, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: List of spin-offs

message: With apologies to everyone whose contributions I just lopped off, I adopted a bold stance and did a thorough overhaul of the article.  It was, to my eye, on a bit of a rambling course, and said many of the same things repeatedly.  Hopefully, it's a bit more focused now.
One of the major changes was to that television crossover list.  I just had to delete it.   As User:Joseph Q Publique notes, above, it was a conflation of two ideas: spin-offs and crossovers.  Frankly, both lists have already been done, better, elsewhere, and the article already linked to both other lists.  When a list of crossovers gets to the point of claiming that Blossom and Gloria are related by crossover, it's time to throw it out as failing to convey useful information.  Or even, for that matter, accurate information.
I've also greatly reduced the lead and the number of sections.  The article has been split into two main sections, "Legal" and "Unofficial" crossovers.  Much of the lead appeared in three separate places before; now the bulk of what had been the lead now only appears under the new main section heading, "Legal Crossover".  All the stuff that was actually describing a type of television crossover is now under the "Television" heading.
But the article still has significant deficiencies.  I think it needs some historical background.   It's kinda weird that you can read the whole article and not be able to answer the simple question, "What was the first fictional crossover?".   I also think the "Unofficial" section needs some beefing up, and probably needs to get away from its nascent tendency towards yet another list.   It probably needs an image: maybe the cover of The Doctor and the Enterprise, since it can't really be covered by copyright, would be appropriate.  Maybe there are some hard facts that could be added to the "Legal" section.  Is there any data on whether crossovers actually do drive sales or ratings?  Are there critical opinions about the merits of crossovers?
The major problem with the article remains that it's still largely unreferenced, and that's a big problem, given how old the article actually is. CzechOut 00:55, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Article overhaul

message: *In series Darkwing Duck there are two joking crossovers "A Star is Scorned" {Darkwing Duck charatchers are revealed to be actors-with a joke of Drake Mallard watching "DD" on TV!} and "Twitching Channels" {Darkwing finds out he is a cartoon show in a parrell universive}.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.53.145.110 (talk) 13:07, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Joking Crossovers in same show?

message: i mergered it....--O.waqfi (talk) 17:53, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Done

message: The text of this article is, some for reason, duplicated twice. Looking at the edit history it looks like when someone removes the duplicate (as I have just done), a bot will usually come along, detect the sudden deleition of half the article as vandalism, and put the duplication back.
How can we get around this? Aawood (talk) 12:52, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Removing duplicate section

message: Wouldn't books like The Mysterious Island an early example?
It brings together Verne's characters from 20,000 Leagues and Captain Grant's Children.
--Error (talk) 01:37, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Verne

message: The title makes no sense. The crossover is about two fictional works intertwining, but the crossover itself actually exists. The title should definitely be changed.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.91.112.212 (talk) 21:07, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Change name to Crossover (fiction)

message: Reading this article, I think the biggest weakness is the poor defintion of what a crossover is, especially in TV.  Many of the examples provided are not crossovers at all, rather they are spin-off series. For example, NCIS:LA is a spin-off of NCIS, which in turn is a spin-off of JAG. The Finder is a spin-off of Bones. All these series' were developed in their 'parent' series. The Law and Order and CSI series' are in another class of spin-offs, which weren't so much developed within a parent series, rather the spin-off is conceptual - and by it's nature will lead to crossovers.  A better term for this series is a 'TV franchises', maybe.
Truer crossovers are those which are not 'introduced' in one series or a part of a franchise concept. For example, truer crossovers would be like (1) Law And Order:SVU and Homicide: Life on the Streets; (2) CSI and Without a Trace; (3) NCIS:LA and Hawaii5-0; (4) ER and Third Watch; (5) CSI:NY and Cold Case etc.  All these series are stand alone, yet have been linked through common characters.  That, for me, is an important factor in what constitutes a true crossover.
Just my 5 cents worth but I feel having some kind of definition/typology for what a crossover really means would be good for this article to make better sense. Mari370 (talk) 02:03, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Defintions of Crossover

message: In the early 1970's, "The ABC Saturday Superstar Movie" aired some hour-long animated movies that included a few crossovers of animated cartoons shown on ABC. One notable episode, "Popeye Meets the Man Who Hated Laughter" (1972), included characters from several newspaper comics, including Popeye, Tiger, Blondie, Hi and Lois, Little Iodine, the Katzenjammer Kids, Quincy, Beetle Bailey, Maggie and Jiggs, The Little King, Snuffy Smith, and others.
Also, the 1991 ABC sitcom "Hi Honey, I'm Home" used the crossover idea as a premise. Each episode featured an actor or actress reprising a role from a classic sitcom.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mohanchous (talk • contribs) 00:59, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Possible notable examples

message: Overall, this article needs more citations to back it up or removal of editorializing.
For example, where does "As a way to further toy sales he devised the Secret Wars crossover" come from?  This simply hangs as personal opinion of the contributor, and I'd like to delete it if no citation is forthcoming.
Likewise "though here he is satirized as being an inept and unfavorable antagonist, likely to parody Sean Connery's appearance in the 2003 film adaptation."  It sounds great to me, and I'd love it to be true, but it's opinion.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Michaelpremsrirat (talk • contribs) 04:04, 6 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Sourcing

message: When did this happen? cause i keep searching it and it didnt appear and if there was a crossover I'm sure everyone who watches Steven universe would know Jstar367 (talk) 04:11, 24 July 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: It appears to be a hoax, as there are absolutely no Google search results for "Steven and the Johnny's" apart from Wikipedia and sites that mirror it. Thanks for noticing that. nyuszika7h (talk) 08:40, 24 July 2016 (UTC)

text: Seems like it was added in this edit back in May and the next editor, , who is presumably not familiar with these shows, made a copy-edit to it. nyuszika7h (talk) 08:44, 24 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Steven and the johnny's? 

message: This page currently lists "Frankenstein Meets the Wolf Man, in 1943" as the earliest film crossover.  What of the character Lee Chan (Mr. Chan's son in the Charlie Chan series) in the 1938 film Mr._Moto's_Gamble based in the Mr. Moto series 76.220.73.160 (talk) 04:28, 25 July 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure if the Lee Chan example would count, as I haven't seen those films, but if having a character from one film show up in another counts as a "crossover", an even earlier example would be The Testament of Dr. Mabuse (1933), a sequel to Dr. Mabuse the Gambler (1922) which incorporates a character from M (1931 film). —Flax5 14:34, 19 August 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Earliest film crossover 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The article tries to cast the New Scooby-Doo Movies as some of the earliest examples of animation crossover. However, crossovers had been happening much earlier theatrically (such as all those Bugs Bunny versus Daffy Duck shorts), and even Hanna-Barbera had started at least a decade earlier, with Yogi Bear appearing in "Swedish Visitors", a 1963 episode of The Flintstones. (I'm going to discount Popeye the Sailor (film), as that Betty Boop cartoon is the first appearance in animation of Popeye, although he was developed separately in the papers and would obviously become a separate film property.) --Nat Gertler (talk) 13:59, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early animation examples 

message: "Ivan Tsarevich and cameo appearances of Pepper and Carrot in episode 4 of Morevna Project."
I have no idea what any of that is. Meanwhile way down the article we have an image from King Kong vs. Godzilla, two film characters that I would argue have near-global recognition. Why not swap them? --80.42.117.157 (talk) 23:29, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Obscure main image 

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