Template talk:Politics of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic

message: I believe this template refers to Western Sahara's politics, and should therefore have the flag of Western Sahara. This does not mean bias against the Moroccan viewpoint (that WS is Moroccan), since there simply is no "politics of Western Sahara" in the Moroccan context; just "the Southern Provinces".
It is the same case as with Template:Politics of Palestine; it would be really weird (and incredibly POV) to put an Israeli flag there , since it only concerns intra-Palestinian politics (and I believe this template is for intra-Sahrawi politics, since Morocco has its own template). This does not mean that Wikipedia denies the Israeli claims on Palestinian territory, since that particular conflict is covered extensively in the text of those articles. It just means that, just as it is not reasonable to have the Fatah page headed by an Israeli flag, it is not reasonable to have the Polisario etc pages headed by Moroccan flags.
The references to Western Sahara's present non-sovereignty and the link to Moroccan politics are informative and appropriate, though.
Cheers, Arre 23:42, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that there is a confusion between the words "Western Sahara" (the territory disputed between Morocco and Polisario, and controlled by Morocco) and"SADR" (the proposed state proclaimed by Polisario over this territory). Western Sahara isn't for SADR what France is for Republic of France for example, at least not for the UN and of course Morocco. To clarify the situation for WP readers we should change the title of the templatee into "Politics of SADR, etc", Or comply to WP neutrality principles by adding information about Moroccan government who have de facto control over the territory. Daryou 14:24, 27 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I repeat, this is not (only) about the territory or about the Sahrawi republic, but about intra-Sahrawi politics (within and without, before and during the republic & Polisario) referring to "Western Sahara" as a nation or concept. It is completely synonomous with Palestinian politics, where there neither is nor should be an Israeli flag, since Israeli politics are a different matter altogether, despite the fact that Israel physically controls the territory the Palestinian politicians are claiming to represent. This point is made clear in the articles on the territory, but that doesn't change that Palestine and Israel are different political entities, as are Morocco and Western Sahara. Separating the subjects does not mean taking sides in the territorial/national dispute between the two political/national camps. Arre 20:36, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: On the question of the flag

message: Daryou has broken is one off breaking the 3RR. Can you not find a better way to resolve this? - FrancisTyers 22:53, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: 3RR

message: So, the first problem in this template is regarding which flags to include. I've been to the politics pages of similar states and made a list:
*Politics_of_Kosovo - 0 flags
*Politics_of_Abkhazia - 2 flags: (i) Flag of Georgia (ii) Flag of Abkhazia
*Politics_of_Northern_Cyprus - 2 flags: (i) Flag of Cyprus (ii) Flag of Northern Cyprus
*Politics_of_Transnistria - 2 flags: (i) Flag of Moldova (ii) Flag of Transnistria
*Politics_of_Somaliland - 1 flag: (i) Flag of Somaliland
*Politics_of_South_Ossetia - 1 flag: (i) Flag of South Ossetia
*Politics_of_Tibet - 1 flag: (i) Flag of Tibet
Wikipedia seems to be split between having just one flag (the flag of the nation/government) and having two (one for the "internationally recognised" (IR) government and one for the non-recognised (NR) government). 
There doesn't seem to be a politics page with an IR government flag below an NR government flag, so I would think that thats not the best way to continue. The Palestinian page is not appropriate to compare as it redirects to Politics of the Palestinian National Authority which is about a government not a country. If we were to make that comparison then both this template and the page would have to be moved. 
Seeing as this is about a government in exile, we could treat it like Politics of Tibet and have solely a Western Sahara flag, or seeing as it is a disputed territory, we could treat it like Politics of Kosovo and have no flag. 
I would recommend removing both flags, per Politics of Kosovo while the dispute is resolved. - FrancisTyers 23:29, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd say the same, and one of the users in the dispute agrees with me. Hedley 23:32, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Thank you for your opinion, Western Sahara is a territory disputed between Morocco and Polisario, each side has its own arguments which they think suffiscient, the UN is trying now to resolve the problem through a referundum. First of all, the problem is about neutrality of WP, the flag shown in the politics infobox is the flag used by one party of the conflict (polisario) and refused by the other (Morocco) and not recognized by the UN (the mediator in this conflict). There was an edit conflict about the infobox of Western Sahara page between me in one side and Koavf and Arre in the other, a survey was necessary and the results are here and here. The "no flags" option seems to be the least controversial solution. Daryou 23:35, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I would tend to agree. It seems that User:Koavf has stated that this is inconsistent with other disputed territories. The treatment of disputed territories is inconsistent, but at least one example can be pointed to that takes the no flag option. - FrancisTyers 23:43, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Yes, I agree that both of you have been getting worked up over this article. Blind reverting will not do any good. Do you agree to have a template with no flags, or can you recommend/suggest another option? - FrancisTyers 11:44, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Excuse me but I know what does mean consensus for you, you are not willing to change your opinions and you confessed many times and in your user page that you are pro-polisario biased, no consensus is possible with you, we had the same edit conflict before, a survey was necessary, you see that most of WPians agree with neutrality, please comply with their opinions. You see that third party opinion in this last conflict agree with an infobox without flags, I willl do it. Daryou 07:34, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no need to talk about his beliefs. We're here to talk about flags. Note, I agree that there shouldn't be any flag for now, but this is just to stop you edit warring while you resolve the dispute more fully. I would point out that moving the template to :Template:Politics of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic would solve the problem and I believe this kind of solution is the type used in resolving the Palestine issue. - FrancisTyers 11:44, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

text: I suggest you check my edits before making accusations of acquiescing to his demands. I made the suggestion of having no flags while the dispute was resolved (per Politics of Kosovo), Daryou and Hedley agree. I am reverting back to that while we talk about this. You would agree to moving the Template to :Template:Politics of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic? If this is case we can certainly keep the one flag version that you seem to be supporting. - FrancisTyers 17:02, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Outside view

message: This is not a vote, but you might want to explain your preference, reason etc. beneath the ones you approve of. - FrancisTyers 23:29, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for your opinion, Western Sahara is a territory disputed between Morocco and Polisario, each side has its own arguments which they think suffiscient, the UN is trying now to resolve the problem through a referundum. First of all, the problem is about neutrality of WP, the flag shown in the politics infobox is the flag used by one party of the conflict (polisario) and refused by the other (Morocco) and not recognized by the UN (the mediator in this conflict). There was an edit conflict about the infobox of Western Sahara page between me in one side and Koavf and Arre in the other, a survey was necessary and the results are here and here. The "no flags" option seems to be the least controversial solution. Daryou 23:35, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I would tend to agree. It seems that User:Koavf has stated that this is inconsistent with other disputed territories. The treatment of disputed territories is inconsistent, but at least one example can be pointed to that takes the no flag option. - FrancisTyers 23:43, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Yes, I agree that both of you have been getting worked up over this article. Blind reverting will not do any good. Do you agree to have a template with no flags, or can you recommend/suggest another option? - FrancisTyers 11:44, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Excuse me but I know what does mean consensus for you, you are not willing to change your opinions and you confessed many times and in your user page that you are pro-polisario biased, no consensus is possible with you, we had the same edit conflict before, a survey was necessary, you see that most of WPians agree with neutrality, please comply with their opinions. You see that third party opinion in this last conflict agree with an infobox without flags, I willl do it. Daryou 07:34, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no need to talk about his beliefs. We're here to talk about flags. Note, I agree that there shouldn't be any flag for now, but this is just to stop you edit warring while you resolve the dispute more fully. I would point out that moving the template to :Template:Politics of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic would solve the problem and I believe this kind of solution is the type used in resolving the Palestine issue. - FrancisTyers 11:44, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

text: I suggest you check my edits before making accusations of acquiescing to his demands. I made the suggestion of having no flags while the dispute was resolved (per Politics of Kosovo), Daryou and Hedley agree. I am reverting back to that while we talk about this. You would agree to moving the Template to :Template:Politics of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic? If this is case we can certainly keep the one flag version that you seem to be supporting. - FrancisTyers 17:02, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Options

message: So, Justin what do you think? Is this compromise ok? We move this template to :Template:Politics of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic and include the flag? I haven't looked at the Independence Intifada page yet, but you can discuss which infoboxes should be included on the talk page there. - FrancisTyers 21:05, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Done! Cool :) - FrancisTyers 21:41, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Consensus

message: *Please do not abuse of Western Sahara in naming tamplates
*Please developp/rename own templates for "sadr" or polisario to clearly meet the topic.
*If not I will redirect the Western Sahara template to the one on. Morocco, as you know, claims Western Sahara as part of its territory.
*Please rename/use all your templates for "sadr" and polisario related topics adequately.
Thanks wikima 18:24, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Abuse of WS templates 

message: I am trying to insert a POV tag that shows on the template.
Any one has an idea of an elegant way to do?
Thanks wikima 17:37, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The template and the POV