Talk:Takarazuka Revue

message: The Wikipedia standard for names of modern Japanese figures is to use normal English name order (given–name family–name). On this page, the names of some Takarasienne follow this standard order while some duplicate the order of the Japanese names (family–name given–name). I realize that English name order may ring less familiar with Revue fans in and out of Japan, but English order is what is used in Revue English publications, and following the standard makes the Jennes's pages easier to find and the page content easier to understand ("Is her given name Sena or Jun?") for those less-familiar with the Revue. I think making it easier for new people to learn about the Revue and become fans is a good thing.
Over the next few days I will do the following:
# Move existing Family–name Given–name Jenne pages to Given–name Family–name, and make Family–name Given–name a redirect to Given–name Family–name.
# Replace Family–name Given–name references in this article with Given–name Family–name.
# Do the same in existing Jenne articles.
Future Jenne articles should be created as Given–name Family–name with a redirect from Family–name Given–name. -- Meyer 06:49, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name order 

message: ... needs a definition (portmanteau from Takarazuka + Parisienne). (I think the French would probably say "Takarazukaine" by parallel with America -> Americaine, but I doubt my logic carries any weight in the Sumire Empire.) -- Meyer 09:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Takarasienne 

message: * otokoyaku would be better translated as male role, and daughter role whilst literal seems clumsy - female role instead? -- 202.228.229.72 07:33, 19 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Otokoyaku is "male role."  Musumeyaku is not exactly equivalent to "female role"--there difference should be noted, and saying "literally daughter role" is a good way to do it. -- Exploding Boy 18:24, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

text: I am now leaning toward breeches roles and skirt roles as translations of otokoyaku and musumeyaku since these are established English theatre terminology. Skirt role = musumeyaku is not a perfect fit, but I guess that can't be helped with a unique institution like the Takarzuka Revue. -- Meyer 07:40, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  ''Otokoyaku''/''Musumeyaku'' 

message: Need to make sure this is consistently translated as "Superior Members" in all Revue- and jenne-related articles. -- Meyer 21:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  ''Senka'' 

message: * Is the gratutous references to yuri fandom really significant or necessary? -- 202.228.229.72 07:33, 19 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I hardly think it's a "gratuitous reference."  It's an established fact. -- Exploding Boy 18:24, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think I've got to agree with 202.228.229.72. If it really is an "established fact" then it should be mentioned first on the Yuri page, which it's not at this time. If and when "Takarazuka Revue fetish" is considered significant enough to mention in Yuri, then someone can consider whether it's significant enough from the POV of the Takazuka Revue (not a forgone conclusion) to restore the reference to Yuri here. I've updated the "Cultural phenomena" section accordingly. -- Meyer 07:19, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yuri fandom (refactoring previous discussion) 

message: I'd like to rework this section incorporating information from the much more extensive list on the Japanese WP page, particularly emphasizing those who went onto careers other than acting, like politician Chikage Ogi.
There are so many actresses on the list (101 on ja.WP page), I'd like to define some criteria for their inclusion on this English page (current list seems to overly-favor recent "graduates"). -- Meyer 07:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe list only actresses with entries at IMDB.com? This wouldn't be representative of their popularity in Japan, but might be a fair criterion for mention to the en.WP audience. This standard would leave Hitomi Kuroki on the list but disqualify Mao Daichi. -- Meyer 07:58, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Not feasible....Since most of the actresses continue work on stage rather than on TV or movie. -- Cougarwalk  20:17, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

text: What about limiting it to actresses with at least a stub page on ja.WP and citations of a career after Takarazuka? -- Meyer 10:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Some people in the English speaking community is working on that.... -- Cougarwalk 20:16, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Actresses listed on ja.WP page Takarazuka Revue Graduates (62 names, 54 with own ja.WP pages)? -- Meyer 08:33, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Former Takarasienne 

message: This section and its clumsy title need to be rewritten.
What are the "two main categories of the musicals"? 
# "Western classic musicals, operas, novels or even films" (this is one category?) (The extensive list of sources consumes more space than appropriate: mention a few exemplary sources, perhaps a few more in a section on "Notable productions" (strangely missing at present).)
# manga
# Japanese and Chinese history (This gives short shrift to Japanese period drama which is a major genre for revue productions (roughly half of Grand Theatre productions).)
# biographies
# original works
… quite a long list for just two categories: tighten up. -- Meyer 08:26, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Categories of Musical they perform 

message: I have made a change from "six troups" to "five troups" because 
SENKA might not perform alone.
The name of the Takarazuka Revue is applied by assumption that the Takarazuka Revue (Additionally with Takarazuka Ongaku Gakkou = Takarazuka Music School that is the theatrical company member training place) is one school. The theatrical company member is called SEITO ( student), the retirement is called SOTSUGYOU ( graduation) and Founder Ichizou Kobayashi is still called SENSEI (Teacher) ( according to the book by Shinji Ueda a producer working for Takarazuka Revue ). SENKA means "a specialized subject" or "a non-degree graduate program" and special members (actress who are topping soon, the former top's actress, and the elderly veteran  actress) belong to SENKA. 
To begin with, is SENKA a troupe ? I think that it is a mistake to call the group that might not perform alone troupe.Penpen0216 02:25, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  About SENKA 

message: >...but at the end of the first year, women are divided by the faculty and the current troupe members...
Divide by current troupe member? Aren't they know which troupe they will in AFTER their first stage? ---- Cougarwalk  06:48, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Questioned..... 

message: I think we need to work things out about this issue. Since some people are so eager to build page of their favourite actresses. However there are a couple issues I would like to point out:
*First of all, write it in a professional way: don't need to mind the typo, someone/bots will correct them. Just don't write them as a fan but as a contributor.
*Secondly, don't TOTALLY copy of what from Takarazuka Wikipedia. You need to edit and no need to show the year of the performance.
*Thirdly, while writing a page for a former member, balance the information.
Also, here is a Userbox that you can add to your personal User page:

Thanks for bearing with me! 
Cougarwalk 02:18, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  About Building pages for the actresses/former actresses 

message: I can't find any reference to Haida Shoko. - Sparky 16:28, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In :ja:はいだしょうこ it is described that some episodes on Haida Shōko are written in 『NHKのおかあさんといっしょ』2007年7月号別冊「ファミリースタジオ」("NHK's Okasan to Issho" July, 2007 Separate volume "family studio." 『NHKのおかあさんといっしょ』 is a monthly magazine (picture book) which Kodansha publishes. I add the link to the introduction page of the October, 2007 issue amazon.co.jpTakarazuka Family Land 14:22, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: NHK's ''Okasan to Issho'' singer

message: It has been suggested that Takarazuka Theater be merged into this article. Please discuss this below, and express your opinion of either Support or Oppose regarding the merge. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 04:52, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Merge discussion

message: *support merge-no sense having two articles on the same topic. Chris (talk) 18:20, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Discussion

message: I found this in the article, commented out below "Fan clubs" and before "Influence" - it's my hope that by moving this to the talk page rather than letting it sit unseen in the article that someone might translate it. -Malkinann (talk) 11:22, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: From Ja.wp

message: This section does not seem to suit an encyclopedic article, although it has some merit. It seems strange and perhaps inappropriate to dwell on the writings of two American academics and not cite or reference Japanese sources.  Is there a widespread (or at least notable) debate or discussion in Japan about Takarazuka and its influence on young girls?  Is the debate mainly within the Takarazuka community, or even only among professionals working in Takarazuka? This section gives no sense of whether the female patronage of Takarazuka has notability or is simply a curiosity mainly of interest to academics outside of Japanese society.  And in the case of the latter, who are these writers? Citing and quoting from their book(s) does not seem adequate in this case to justify their inclusion in the Takarazuka article. On the other hand, it might become good enough, with some further work, to merit its own article! Cuvtixo (talk) 16:10, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for your recent work on copyediting this article.  I feel this might be a case of "working with what we've got" - these academics have written on the audience of Takarazuka in English, which is the language people contributing to the English WP would understand and have access to sources in English.  If you've got a knowledge of Japanese, then please feel free to try and find some Japanese sources on Takarazuka's fans.  I'm not sure what kind of study has been done on the fans of Takarazuka, or for that matter, any aspect of Takarazuka, in Japanese. There doesn't seem to be a large body of work on Takarazuka in English and Jennifer Robertson inimates that the same is true of Japanese, that Takarazuka just isn't studied.  I believe Robertson mentions that Takarazuka was used by the contemporary Japanese media of the time as a scapegoat for "Class S" and ome couples, (butch-femme couples which outlast adolescence).  Certainly the Class S section here could be cut down a bit more, as the article Class S (genre) has been created. -Malkinann (talk) 00:27, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with Cuvtixos point that this feels out of place in an encyclopedic article - I might suggest removing it or making it its own article. Otherwept (talk) 07:14, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Audience of Takarazuka 

message: Hit and run talk comment: I don't know the topic well, so I can't judge... is it notable that Takarazuka Revue has a version of Julius Caesar called (Rome at Dawn), with Marcus Junius Brutus portrayed by Jun Sena? If so, feel free to find a way to add this.—Mrand Talk • C 16:18, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should Rome at Dawn be mentioned within this article? 

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thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:Ernest Moon.jpg

message: According to the Ace Attorney fansite Court Records, the game series will be adapted into an opera/musical performed by the Takarazuka Revue. Should it be noted in this article somewhere?
Link
--Marshmello 19:03, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Newest project 

message: Actually, it doesn't even rise to the level of "editorializing." It simply states the author's impression without a shred of documentary evidence. This section could be made meaningful with references, for example, to quotes by noted Japanese homosexuals about Takarazuka. If I had the time, I could probably dig up at least two or three from my private library (and I can think of one particular essay off the top of my head). I have no doubt that Takarazuka is and always has been a hotbed of same-sex affairs and even long-lasting relationships, and has been an inspiration to generations of gay and bisexual Japanese women. But without some documentary evidence and a neutral point of view, this section as it stands has no place here. I plan to remove it in 24 hours, so if anyone can defend or improve it before then, please do. Matt Thorn (talk) 04:36, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: "Takarazuka and homosexuality in Japanese society" section is pure editorializing

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thread_title:  Blacklisted Links Found on [[Takarazuka Revue]] 

message: I have just removed the following sentence from the lead:
:The troupe takes its name from the Hankyu Takarazuka rail line in suburban Osaka. 
There is no evidence of this in the article. Prima facie you would have to say it take its name from the city where it is located. Granted that the city itself did not come into existence until the 1950s, the Japanese article on the city says that the name had been used for the area since the Edo period. So unless there is a source which clearly says that the revue was named after the train line, I don't think such a claim belongs in the lead. AtHomeIn神戸 (talk) 00:44, 12 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sentence removed from lead 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018)