Talk:Metal: A Headbanger's Journey

message: the film uses "Norwegian Black Metal," not "Norwegian Death Metal." Changed it in Contents
--69.141.203.252 17:47, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Contents 

message: Could someone who has access to it put some kind of summary of that flowchart found within the movie? Apparently it can be both navigated on the DVD as well as found in the booklet that comes with the music CD. Someone must have at least one of these. (The DVD isn't released til August in UK, and I'm a little impatient ;) )
* Well, that chart is a monster, and I think it is far to big to give a detailed explaination, even if it just the connections between the genres. If you go here, about three-quarters down the page, some guy re-wrote the chart out. Give it a look, if someone wants to condense it down or recreate it for this page, be my guest, and good luck.
(Matt d84 03:10, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Request

message: Anyone know what these are called? perhaps a link to the wiki entry? 123.100.96.142 10:00, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  That scene with the huge swords after the black metal discussion 

message: i recently received a myspace bulletin from the century media myspace that read:
"Metal is expanding and evolving and becoming more diverse," said Canadian anthropologist and filmmaker Sam Dunn, who directed "Metal: A Headbanger's Journey," released on DVD this summer. "It's at a much more vibrant state than it was even five or 10 years ago."
Dunn is working on a sequel to the film with the working title "Global Metal" which will trace the popularity of metal overseas, especially in developing countries like Brazil, Columbia and Indonesia.
so maybe after there's more info, maybe a section, or a whole page. ~~Patrick~~ 22:17, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  sequel 

message: Was the family tree actually from the film, or somoeone elses design? As Goth Metal and Gothic Metal are different things, and most of the bands listed their are neither of the two.
It was actually from the bonus section of the DVD. Opeth as "goth metal" and Cradle of Filth as Norwegian black metal? It's not like this DVD should be treated as a truthful reference.
::yea really, I mean Opeth as Goth Metal, not only is that offending, it isnt true. As a true encyclopedia, shouldnt wikipedia make a point as to that is wrong or something. It sure as hell is false, as is about half the things on that retarded tree.
Hey, guys, ever heard of signing your posts?  Anyway, it's not up to us to say what is or isn't Goth Metal, that would be original research.  All we can do is report what other sources, like this DVD, say.  Kevlar67 05:30, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Goth Metal

message: Surely the film's inaccuracy on the existance of doom metal (Candlemass under stoner metal) and its being a 'close alternative to goth metal' should be noted. Pzekkio 01:13, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Dunn got this genre totally wrong... I mean SURE, Kyruss sounds so much like Cathedral (sarcasm)...  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.101.156.35 (talk) 01:04, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Doom Metal

message: I just removed the spoiler tag since the movie was actually a documentury, and you can't really post a spoiler about a documentury :P Talk User:Fissionfox 10:39, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spoiler Tag 

message: Is this an exact reproduction of Sam Dunns scheme from the film? Can someone tell me what them "romantic-goth-blackmetallers" Cradle of Filth are doing on that list? They use elements  from "blackmetal", but to put it in here? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 85.200.11.14 (talk) 03:29, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Norvegian Black Metal 

message: Little kids jumping in and adding whatever their favorite band is to the chart is getting annoying. THE CHART IS COMPLETE IN CONTEXT TO THE FILM. This means there is no point in adding any more bands to the chart for any reason. As far as the movie goes, these were the only bands included, and that's all that matters as far as this page should be concerned. Stop adding people you think got shafted. Of course plenty of bands have been left out, but the point of the film's chart was to list just a few examples, not everyone ever. Thanks. // Logical Defense 23:40, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dear Kids of Wikipedia 

message: OK metal heads, I created this table thing, and have been adding names from the official movie website as well as more detailed info from Wiki, as I find the time. I'm not really a metal fan, but the movie was THAT good. Anyhow, if somebody feels like organizing it better, or at least SUGGESTING how we may put it into some kind of alphabetical order, please let me (us) know, Much thanks.--RobNS 22:47, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the chronological order of the movie is a good order. --Ifrit 19:34, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So, do you feel like rearranging them Frit? Cheers--RobNS 19:44, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Table with Artists, Bands and hometowns 

message: I don't know if the comment on about Vikernes is "inaccurate." According to the wiki page on "life imprisonment": "Life imprisonment is a sentence of imprisonment for a serious crime, nominally for the entire remaining life of the prisoner, but in fact for a period which varies between jurisdictions."
So what's inaccurate about saying Vikernes is serving a life sentence? Perhaps this is only confusing to an American audience? Most other countries have a maximum amount of years for a life sentence.
Maybe someone should change this?  
BTW, another factual error(though not a "statement" per se) is mentioned on the IMDB entry:
Factual errors: A diagram of Metal evolution appears a few times throughout the documentary. There is a box with Norwegian Black Metal (Second Wave) where Cradle Of Filth reside at the bottom of it. In fact, CoF are from Suffolk, England and their style little resemble anything near Second Wave sound.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.94.190.45 (talk) 21:13, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  About the "Inaccurate Statements" 

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BetacommandBot (talk) 13:20, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:METAL POSTER.jpg

message: I know that the metal community at large likes to disown nu-metal and alt metal due to the fact it owes more to alternative rock than shred, but i was really dissapointed that the bend most responsible for it was completely left out of the film. New albums aside, Helmet did more than any other band including Faith No More to invent the nu-metal sound and seem to always be shunned in favor of Patton worship. not that he dosen't deserve it, but i wish Helmet could get some credit from metalheads every once in ahwile.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.213.25.226 (talk) 22:58, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Helmet 

message: In accordance with the interactive chart on the DVD, which is the same as the one in the movie bar one or two additions, there are some major flaws
1.) AC/DC is excluded from Hard Rock
2.) Tool are excluded from Hard Alternative
3.) Diamond Head are excluded from NWOBHM
4.) Children of Bodom have been added to thrash. This is in neither the film nor DVD, and is a complete false representation of Children of Bodom. It's not even a slight mistake, like calling Cradle of Filth black metal or Manowar glam, it's completely the opposite style. It even contradicts what is written on the band's wiki page, aswell as Thrash Metal's wiki page, and near enough every metal page on the net.
5.) Not on the chart, but in the band listings beneath, Extreme Noise Terror are missing from the grindcore section  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.99.36.149 (talk) 19:46, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: See also: Judas Priest on the talk page Weeliljimmy (talk) 21:08, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Yeah i agree with number 4, i looked at the list on the bonus dvd and CoB was nowhere to be found and it is a mismatch but not a big one. i can see why people would consider them thrash and it's not that big of a deal, i mean their new album is very thrash-like so why is it such a big deal. but anyway they should be taken off because they are nowhere on the chart.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.25.88.247 (talk) 21:22, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Inaccuracies of the chart 

message: Mainly because the chart represents the view of the film, not anybody elses, regardless of how true it is.
Even if not, Opeth are clearly gothic natured. The genre tags and selected bands are meant to sum up and represent, not squarely define, as this would be impossible. Opeth are a modern band that play drawn out, semi-progressive epics with death metal vocals and tons of gothic melodies and imagery. The artwork, the clean vocal passages, the melancolic guitarlines and atmosphere...all gothic in nature. They were put last in the list of goth bands for a reason, to sum up how far the gothic thing had gone from Paradise Lost and Type O Negative.
Cradle of Filth's case is kind of the same. As much as kvlt kids far and wide hate to admit it, Cradle of Filth (at least in their most popular era) took most of the Norwegian black metal's elements to a different level. Not a better level, or the next level, or the future level or whatever, just to a different level. They took shrieking, blastbeats, tremelo, blasphemous lyrics and the Satanic/Pagan imagery - but rather than replicating Satyricon and Burzum did something different, with the inclusion of vampyric and erotic lyrics, aswell as much more theatrics. Again, like Opeth, they were listed last for a reason - after listing the traditional representatives, they were left at the end to show a successful mainstream band that worked on the old Gorgoroth ethos but changed it for (their own) better.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.99.36.149 (talk) 19:58, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ignore the Opeth/C.O.F. complaints 

message: A quick question: can this documentary be cited as a reliable source on band genres? Personally, I'd say no, since there are a number of blatant mistakes in the chart catagorisations, but I'm curious as to whether it does fit the definition of a reliable source or not (given that it's not a written source, but does a DVD that's out count as "published" by wikipedia standards?) Prophaniti (talk) 10:30, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I would think yes. I'm sure many documentaries would qualify as a source. Blackngold29 14:32, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It probably could by Wiki's standards, however it would lead to problems since many of the sources we currently use are much more accurate. I don't advise using it as a source. (Albert Mond (talk) 15:22, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Can this be cited? 

message: hows that relative? i say we list the interviews in order of first apperance in the film and list only the info given ♠♦Д narchistPig♥♣ (talk) 06:59, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  bithplace 

message: Shouldn't we keep to the view of the film and how they determined it all to be? and not by their Wikipedia pages and especially not ourselves? People seem to keep adding bands towards their point of view when it should match the chart no matter how wrong we think it is. FireCrystal (talk) 04:02, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The film's heavy metal history chart 

message: I really don't understand how they could have forgot the whole pagan,viking,folk subgenre, because the folk metal subgenre is really important to the whole style of metalheads totay, for exemple all the guys wich are wearing thor's hammers or drinkhorns, to be serious I think that the folk metal scene is way more important than storner metal or pop metal or all those things  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.79.152.1 (talk) 23:36, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't understand why either. I guess Sam Dunn doesn't know of that genre? The Global Metal movie could of very well covered the variations because folk metal is a worldwide or in this case a global genre. A lot of folk metal bands come from other places unlike the US and he covered bands from Japan to Brazil and the Middle East, etc such as Orphaned Land. He didn't cover post-metal, sludge metal or doom metal either. Stoner metal I would say yes... but I would say glam metal was indeed important as it was a very popular genre in the early 80s and its antics are what tempted thrash bands to bring metal to a whole new level. FireCrystal (talk) 19:27, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Folk Metal? 

message: I know we can't change the list, but seriously, what were they thinking? The problem starts when they list 'Hard Rock' as a subgenre, when Metal itself came from early Hard Rock in the '60s. Punk, of course comes primarily from '60s Garage Rock. While it's true that much punk was influenced by early metal, it's certainly not a subgenre. /rant (Albert Mond (talk) 15:20, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Punk as a Metal Subgenre? 

message: They were on the movie under "Hard Rock"  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.228.39.239 (talk) 20:30, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Then why don't I see them here? FireCrystal (talk) 20:33, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

text: Hmm... could this be wrong then? Is there something like it on the official site? I thought it was strange too that AC/DC wasn't here. FireCrystal (talk) 20:49, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

text: It clearly shows AC/DC there so I think it's safe now to list them but obviously have a hidden comment by it like "check movie" or "see 'AC/DC?' section on talk". FireCrystal (talk) 18:52, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  AC/DC? 

message: However, I think as some of the bands the film refers to as metalcore are better known as crossover or groove metal, there should be some indication to this. The metalcore page lists many of those bands as precursors or implies they are not metalcore, but were called that by some publications. Perhaps something like "not to be confused with..." or "(Many of these bands are better known as crossover or groove metal)". I'm somewhat surprised there hasn't been any complaints or edit wars over this, considering the discontent many metal fans have for metalcore.58.161.121.183 (talk) 07:20, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: There has been a lot of complaints. Just read the talk page. The rule/concensus? is we just note how the movie organises the bands and leave it at that. Weeliljimmy talk 10:31, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not to be genre warring or anything 

message: The "Definitive metal family tree" was listed out with hyphens (see snapshot), which was fairly ugly, so I changed the section to use semicolons as separators (see snapshot). I also added some indentation (and fixed a few of the wikilinks, which is essentially invisible).
Anyway, I think the section looks better now. I thought I'd make note of the change on this talk page in case anyone objects. --darolew 09:09, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Some formatting changes to "Definitive metal family tree" 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018)