Talk:Chalkidiki

message: :The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 
This article is currently at Chalcidice, which is by far the least common of the three renderings in use; much more common are Halkidiki and Chalkidiki.  I would propose moving to Halkidiki, but Chalkidiki would also be an improvement.  A few relevant bits of information about each rendering, in order of my preference:
* Halkidiki
** Used by BBC News, The Guardian, Athens News Agency, and The Financial Times among others; 737 hits in Google News Archive
** Used officially by the prefectural government
** 588,000 English-language non-Wikipedia Google hits
* Chalkidiki
** Used by The Independent and Washington Post among others; 282 hits in Google News Archive
** 358,000 English-language non-Wikipedia Google hits
* Chalcidice
** Not used by any major news organizations; 117 hits in Google News Archives, almost all from pre-WW2 sources or Britannica
** 32,100 English-language non-Wikipedia Google hits
So clearly Chalkidiki and Halkidiki have much more use, both colloquially and in the mainstream media; Chalcidice seems to only be used in the modern era by classicists, when discussing ancient Greece, and never to refer to the modern prefecture.  I would prefer Halkidiki, because it's used more often and is more official, but either would be better than Chalcidice. --Delirium 19:27, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: As there've been no objections for several weeks, I went ahead and made the move. --Delirium 00:46, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There have been no objections because you haven't announced it on WP:RM! I don't have Chalcidice on my watchlist, so I didn't notice it. I strongly recommend to keep it at Chalcidice (cfr. Britannica and indeed common use among classicists), or at least have a discussion about it. For the time being, I'll move it back. Markussep 19:57, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: And I, as noted above, strongly recommend to keep it at Halkidiki, which is its official English name and by far the most widely used English name (cf. most major news organizations, the Greek government, and Google searches).  Chalcidice is almost never used in the post-World-War-II era to refer to either the peninsula or the Periphery. --Delirium 20:07, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll announce a move request back to Chalcidice at WP:RM then. In the meantime, please don't move anything else to "X, Halkidiki". Markussep 20:18, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

text: I vote to keep as it is now (i.e. Halkidiki) for the reasons stated by Delirium. If a classicist wants to look it up, they can find the redirect. Please note Santorini instead of Thera. --Kimontalk 20:23, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Proposed move

message: :Add  # Support  or  # Oppose  on a new line in the appropriate section followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~.  Please remember that this survey is not a vote, and please provide an explanation for your recommendation.
====Survey - in support of the move====
# Support Agree with Markussep on this one. Gryffindor 19:53, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Survey

message: # Support Agree with Markussep on this one. Gryffindor 19:53, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Survey - in support of the move

message: # Oppose - As stated by Delirium above, Halkidiki or Chalkidiki is the modern way of referring to this area. The classical name must be acknowledged and mentioned in the article but, it has been in disuse for a very long period of time. There is precedent for this in the case of Santorini and Thera. --Kimontalk 20:31, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Survey - in opposition to the move

message: Google scholar (articles from the period 1957-2007):
*Khalkidhiki 8
*Khalkidiki 17
*Chalcidice 300
*Chalkidiki 953
*Halkidiki 1280
Google news archive (articles from the period 1957-2007):
*Khalkidiki 6
*Khalkidhiki 34
*Chalcidice 62 (without Britannica 39)
*Chalkidiki 155
*Halkidiki 1050 
Google books (from the period 1957-2007):
*Khalkidiki 25
*Khalkidhiki 53
*Halkidiki 321
*Chalkidiki 447
*Chalcidice 654
Encyclopedias:
*Britannica Chalcidice
*Columbia Khalkidhikí
*Encarta Khalkidhikí
Google English language, only .org, -wikipedia:
* Khalkidiki 20
*Khalkidhiki 35
*Chalcidice 650
*Halkidiki 24,600
*Chalkidiki 35,200  
Markussep 20:49, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal.  Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.</div>
The article makes little mention of the area in Classical times, and it seems unlikely that we would have an article about it based solely on its renown in antiquity. There therefore seems to be little reason to maintain the classical "Chalcidice" spelling. Spellings ending in -cidice are much less commonly used than endings in -kidiki, and of the available transliterations for the first letter, "Ch" is preferred by WP:GREEK. This article has been renamed  as the result of a move request. This may have implications for other articles, such as Agios Nikolaos, Chalcidice, Pallene, Chalcidice, Pallini, Chalcidice, Panagia, Chalcidice and list of settlements in the Chalcidice prefecture. --Stemonitis 12:44, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: This closure defies both Wikipedia policy on names, and the discussion above. (Upon consideration, it is possible that Markussep, who did not explicitly vote for his own proposal, was not counted; if so, this is understandable carelessness.) I have moved to Chalkidice, as a compromise positon. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 21:33, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You should not have moved the page unilaterally. This discussion was closed by a Wikipedia admin. Also, please be aware that this was not a vote! --Kimontalk 22:04, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I definitely prefer Chalkidiki over an artificial name like Chalkidice! I didn't cast a vote for my own proposal because I realised that English usage wasn't as strong for Chalcidice as I thought. Markussep 22:10, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: "Chalkidice" is totally foreign to any English usage ever.  I don't believe it is possible to compromise between two spellings by switching between them halfway through the word.  I would prefer Chalcidice (fully English) for the English Wikipedia, but I'd much much rather see a purely Greek and not-so-English (but somewhat established) spelling than this coinage, which I'm not sure doesn't run afoul of WP:NEO.  Wareh 23:50, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Scholar.google.com does show some usage - it's Browning's choice; but Chalcidice is of course more common. If it does not mollify people, I will support Chalcidice. Halkidiki is Greek nationalism, and flatly unacceptable and unEnglish. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 00:12, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: How exactly is a spelling different from what you like nationalism? The spelling that was AGREED to is clearly acceptable to all but you. --Kimontalk 00:24, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Would you prefer "terminological inexactitude?" There are two voices above that  oppose this name. Only you supported it.  Stremonitis had no business closing this poll as he did, contrary to the votes and the evidence. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 21:07, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

text: IMO this pov-title tag is not necessary, I don't see this as a nationalist POV issue, but as a Leghorn/Livorno or Brunswick/Braunschweig discussion (older vs. modern/local name). Proper classic transliteration would be "Chalkidikē" or something like that, Chalcidice is the Latinised form (which would be used if it were mainly about a place or person in antiquity, see WP:GREEK), Chalkidiki is the modern form (using the WP:GREEK rules). I see only two hits for Chalkidice in google scholar after 1957, actually Chalkidike gets 175 results. Stemonitis probably considered the outcome of the discussion above, which was clearly leaning towards Chalkidiki. Markussep 08:05, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: English use

message: 02-April-2007: EARTH to FREAKOPEDIA:  Yes, the current name "Chalkidice" is bizarre. I have sequenced the peculiar names for "Chalkidiki" noting "almost never Chalkidice" to regain some dignity in the bizarre situation:  "To err is human, to really foul things up requires a committee."  Of course, the article should some day be filed correctly to a common name, but at least noting the rarity of a name regains some sense of respect for Wikipedia.  Such committee-mangled decisions have happened for centuries, so it's all okay, long-term, and if we laugh together, then it won't be like everyone else is laughing at Wikipedia.  The Greek articles are beginning to expand well, and there are a lot of impressive results to offset the temporary glitches.  Keep on writing.... -Wikid77 04:26, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bizarre name 

message: For whoever is interested, I've posted move proposals for List of settlements in the Chalcidice prefecture and for :Category:Chalcidice as a result of the above discussion. --Kimontalk 13:33, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move proposals for other pages 

message: Add "* Support" or "* Oppose" or other opinion in the appropriate section followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion with ~~~~
*Strong Support as nom. The Britannica article cited above is fairly clear evidence, as are the 500 hits at Scholar.google.com; it is true that Chalkidiki is occasionally used by those who write Lesvos and Evia for Lesbos and Euboea; but that doesn't make any of them English. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 22:38, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Oppose. I've seen the spelling (C)halkidiki numerous times (in modern contexts) but not Chalcidice. Valentinian T / C 16:15, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Survey 

message: :I ran across this article working with olives and specifically (and sort of ironically) my daughter bought a jar of Member's Mark olives from Sam's. The jar stated the olives came from region of Halkidiki, Greece so I looked it up and found a lot of sources. On Wikipedia I redirected to this article (Chalkidiki) and the alternate names of Chalcidice or Chalkidike and Halkidiki. A longer story shorter is that a vast majority of the search results, after reading "Did you mean: Halkidiki" uses --- Halkidiki. Several pages of searches, even when specifically using Chalkidiki, return the same Halkidiki. I came to this page and saw the "Proposed move" with comments that "The English is, and always has been, Chalcidice." and then after the close "The Google searches above suggest that (outside of classical scholarship) Chalkidiki and Halkidiki are more common than Chalcidice.".
:I am not sure why the article is at the current name but I became exhausted attempting to validate any name over the far more common name of Halkidiki. There are instances when we use an alternate name over the more common name, usually associated with disambiguation, but simply because a classical name "might be preferred by some editors or a project is not justification. I tried to find where "The English" version "is, and always has been, Chalcidice.", and I find that to be unsubstantiated. 
:On a second "Request move" it was stated. This title follows WP:GREEK, and I don't see any explanation as to why that reasoning is insufficient. Discussions like this are what naming conventions are supposed to resolve.". An editor, concerning the name, stated "...and I don't see any explanation as to why that reasoning is insufficient. Discussions like this are what naming conventions are supposed to resolve."
*Unless there is consensus to move to a less than common name because of technical reasons, like disambiguation, it has been found time and again that a local naming conventions cannot override the more broad community consensus that follows policies and guidelines. 
:I have searched and can find absolutely no reason why this article is not titled Halkidiki. As far as English use the second largest wholesale chain in America uses Halkidiki and there is the "Halkidiki olive" (also known as the Mt. Athos) and the "Kalamata olive". One source states "Olivellas S.A., a family company located in Halkidiki Greece.", sales "Halkidiki olives and "Kalamon olives", with sales of 8-9000 tons "to more than 50 countries". This is representative of a super majority of the sources and is in line with the numbers shown in the AFD.  Otr500 (talk) 22:42, 14 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article name 

message: This website refers to Gaidouronisia: A landscape full of “blue lakes” - https://exploringgreece.tv/en/greece/gaidouronisia-a-landscape-full-of-blue-lakes/25304/
Unfortunately, neither Gaidouronisia nor Drenia have a Wikipedia article, or even a Redirect. Can someone solve this mystery? Or is this a Missing Article? Mais oui! (talk) 09:46, 27 July 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  “the famous Gaidouronisia or Drenia as their official name is, in Chalkidiki”