Talk:Soviet War Memorial (Tiergarten)

message: I hope my additions (which are mostly from memory) are correct, feel free to edit out errors.  It would be good if someone could provide a translation of the inscription. Andreas 14:48, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks - I added that to the description. Andreas 12:41, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comment

message: I believe at the time of the battle the VVS was not an independent arm, it was under control of the Red Army (like the USAAF was at the time).  If that is wrong then I will correct the link.  I don't think many members of the Soviet navy were involved. :-) Andreas 16:04, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Red Army 

message: The article does not explain one thing. How is it possible that this statue is still standing? It is a symbol of enemy and oppressor that forced half of the country under dictatorship for decades. Red army also raped, robbed and killed civilians like berserk barbarians while they destroyed this city. After nazis were defeated many nazi symbols were destroyed, which was good. Now communism is gone but there are still this kinds of monuments hailing to communist dictatorship and crimes - which is extremely weird because Germany is declared democratic country. They could just demolish this temple of horror, like liberated people usually does in such circumstances, but they do not. Tell me why and also add that to the article. 193.167.40.108 15:10, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If you can find sources in mainstream media or books that discuss that issue then sure, it can be added to the article, but we can't really do original speculation ourselves. I would be curious myself though whether it's been an issue in Germany; it has been an issue in nearby Latvia and Estonia (Estonia, for example relocated one Soviet war memorial amidst some controversy). --Delirium 00:31, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Germany agreed with the USSR at reunification that it would take care of Soviet war graves and memorials (see Two Plus Four Agreement). Even in cases where this does not apply, many communist-era memorials are still standing and are maintained out of historic interest (such as that of Ernst Thälmann in Prenzlauer Berg). ProhibitOnions (T) 15:40, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It is also a practice in other Central European countries which were fighting against the former Soviet Union. For example, in the Hungarian capitol, Budapest, a Soviet Memorial is still standing in the very heart of the city, just in front of the local U.S. Embassy. Though local rightwing extremists repeatedly suggest its removal, the memorial is maintained wisely according to bilateral agreements with Russia which in exchange maintains Hungarian war memorials and military cemeteries located there. Every coin has two faces. --BorderTourist.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.56.93.242 (talk) 13:05, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Amazing how quickly people forget the great sacrifice the Soviet Union made to ensure freedoms enjoyed around the world. Is this merely a sign of the times or surreptitious moves made by right-wing forces to undermine the Soviet war effort? Shakes head sadly... 81.77.73.24 (talk) 00:53, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

text: It is true that Germany agreed to maintain the Soviet-era monuments throughout the country, including those in Berlin.  It is also correct that the Soviet Union was attacked by Hitler's Germany and the Eastern Front was a case of defending their own territory.  The war in the East was an ugly affair, not that any war is very nice.  When the battle lines reached the original German boundaries, the Soviet troops were reminded they should repay what Germany had done to the motherland.  They did so, and Berlin was the lair of the beast so it got some special attention.  Many of the Soviet troops had fought from Stalingrad all the way to Berlin, and it was clearly time for payback in their eyes.  Stalin said "a bucket of blood for a drop..." and his commissars encouraged the excesses.
Although the monument is very heavy-handed, it was deliberately "in your face" to remind the Germans that they had lost and that the Soviet Union would never allow them to rise again.  Probably the only "odd" part is that it was placed in the British occupation zone, although that might well have been intentional too.  Stalin fully expected to take over the entire city by pushing the western allies out...which he nearly did.  However, it is also true that the Tiergarten was the largest open space where something like this could be easily built, and the red granite used for it came from Hitler's Chancellery, not far away.  Seen in the context of the times, it made sense, at least to Stalin.  Wood Artist (talk) 06:26, 6 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: how is it still standing?

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Locally it is, or has until recent times been, known as: "tomb of the unknown rapist" or "tomb of the unknown plunderer".Making Up Meanings in a Capital City: Power, Memory and Monuments in Berlin Cochrane, European Urban and Regional Studies.2006; 13: 5-24 (Further referenced to Ladd, B. (2004) The Companion Guide to Berlin. Woodbridge, Suffolk: Companion Guides.)
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User:Beatle Fab Four, please state your concerns, preferably after reviewing the discussion at Talk:Soviet War Memorial (Treptower Park) --Stor stark7 Speak 22:02, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  It's not a game, Stor stark7. It's very serious. And you know why I and other editors corrected the article. Once again, see discussion on the Treptower Park. Beatle Fab Four (talk) 22:11, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  The other editor simply pointed to your edit in an unresolved conflict. He triggered way to quick, and his edit was unfounded. As far as I can see my reply is the last thing that's written there (Treptower Park). If you or other editors have any arguments for why the alternative name should not be included in this (Tiergarten) article, then please present them here in an orderly fashion, thank you.--Stor stark7 Speak 05:13, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Resolution to the edit warring