Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Pronunciation/Archive 6

message: Regarding local pronunciations, Louisville, Kentucky#Pronunciation is a featured article with quite a nice section. (I'm not sure if  would be better : is  meant to be the local realisation of , and if so, it it accurate?) 
I'm not wedded to a one-size-fits-all solution, but I certainly don't want to restrict transcriptions to RP/GAm for articles particularly associated with regions with other accents.  If we model our pronunciation convention on the spelling convention, the appropriate phrasing of the spelling convention is not "use British or American spelling as appropriate"; it's "use local spelling". Currently, IPA transcriptions of English words link to Help:IPA for English.  (well, some link to IPA but probably shouldn't.)  I think they would better link to a page in the Wikipedia: namespace.  We could have a series of such pages, one per accent, that would simply list all IPA symbols for its phonemes, plus a few sample words for each.  I say put these in Wikipedia: rather than main namespace as they would  be minimal pages designed solely as an aid for readers to work out the pronunciation, like the key in any dictionary.  There would be links back to the Help:IPA for English article and to the main-namespace article which describes the relevant phonology in detail. To start with, we have Wikipedia:IPA key for Received Pronunciation, Wikipedia:IPA key for General American and Wikipedia:IPA key for Australian English. If someone then feels none of the above is suited for whatever word, they can add another page for the relevant accent and link to that, provided there is verifiability for the listed phoneme inventory and symbols.  This places the onus on the local patriot to put in the extra effort they feel their locale deserves. As for non-region-specific words, I'm happy to point to RP and GAm transcriptions, since  with that as a start it should be easy to work out the sound in one's local accent based on the spelling (RP  might be Scottish , but not if it's spelled  Featherstonehaugh ). As to whether we need always specify both pronunciations: I guess not; but if someone sees only one and decides to add the other that shouldn't be disallowed. jnestorius(talk) 20:10, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, I'd prefer a diaphonemic system, which would almost certainly succeed in covering a wider range of dialects (though obviously it's not going to cover all dialects) with, in many cases, fewer transcriptions, and would probably be easier to read.--JHJ 17:40, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: A local-accent transcription alternative proposal

message: As a way of comparing how different methods cope with a particular example, how would they deal with the table of the main Uranian moons on the Uranus page?  At the moment, it looks like this:
The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)
Name
(Pronunciation key)                        	Name
(Pronunciation key)                        	Diameter(km)                                    	Mass(kg)                                        	Orbital radius(km)                              	Orbital period(d)
Miranda                                         	mə-ran'-də                                      	470(14%)                                        	7.0(0.1%)                                       	129,000(35%)                                    	1.4(5%)
Ariel                                           	arr'-ee-əl                                      	1160(33%)                                       	14(1.8%)                                        	191,000(50%)                                    	2.5(10%)
Umbriel                                         	um'-bree-əl                                     	1170(34%)                                       	12(1.6%)                                        	266,000(70%)                                    	4.1(15%)
Titania                                         	tə-taan'-yə                                     	1580(45%)                                       	35(4.8%)                                        	436,000(115%)                                   	8.7(30%)
Oberon                                          	oe'-bər-on                                      	1520(44%)                                       	30(4.1%)                                        	584,000(150%)                                   	13.5(50%)
Under a diaphonemic scheme (the one currently labelled "Compromise System"), it might end up more like this:
The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)	The main Uranian moons(compared to Earth's Moon)
Name
(Pronunciation key)                        	Name
(Pronunciation key)                        	Diameter(km)                                    	Mass(kg)                                        	Orbital radius(km)                              	Orbital period(d)
Miranda                                         	                                                	470(14%)                                        	7.0(0.1%)                                       	129,000(35%)                                    	1.4(5%)
Ariel                                           	                                                	1160(33%)                                       	14(1.8%)                                        	191,000(50%)                                    	2.5(10%)
Umbriel                                         	                                                	1170(34%)                                       	12(1.6%)                                        	266,000(70%)                                    	4.1(15%)
Titania                                         	                                                	1580(45%)                                       	35(4.8%)                                        	436,000(115%)                                   	8.7(30%)
Oberon                                          	                                                	1520(44%)                                       	30(4.1%)                                        	584,000(150%)                                   	13.5(50%)
with a link to the key (which should be in the Wikipedia: namespace) where the link to Help:Pronunciation respelling key is now.  Note how it needs only one transcription for Oberon, which would probably need several in some other methods.
---JHJ 17:40, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That really helps put it into perspective.  It certainly looks suitable to get the pronunciation across to me, a Canadian.  Perhaps we can find more real examples to get a broader picture.  I'll start with one, below. —Michael Z. 2006-09-28 18:52 Z
# Recce  (from reconnaissance)
If you want some to play with, try List of names in English with non-intuitive pronunciations jnestorius(talk) 19:42, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: An example

message: I've put a notice at Wikipedia talk:Simplified phonetic transcription for Lithuanian drawing its editors' attention to this page, and vice versa. Looks like it's only used on a few articles. jnestorius(talk) 19:42, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Lithuanian