Wikipedia talk:Navigation template

message: For example, in this revision of the Michael Jackson article, the "Death" category links to Death of Michael Jackson. This seems weird to me, like putting links in headers, and it's inconsistent. Is there any consensus about this? Popcornduff (talk) 01:13, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: That's normal. --Izno (talk) 02:02, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:  Common, normal and acceptable. Walter Görlitz (talk) 08:30, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks to both of youse. Popcornduff (talk) 05:32, 13 February 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Putting links to articles in the sidebar

message: Take a look at Template:Roland_Corporation. As you can see, it has a whole bunch of redlinks. I fear editors are just using the template as a list of every product Roland has ever made, regardless of whether articles exist or should exist for these products. Am I right to be suspicious here, is it acceptable to include lots of redlinks? Should I remove redlinks to things that don't require articles? Popcornduff (talk) 04:56, 21 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I would leave that template alone because the redlinks are not excessive. If you knew (from familiarity with the topic) that some of them really were unsuitable for an article (no hope of satisying WP:N), you might remove those but it's significant effort without much benefit. There was a large discussion somewhere (probably on this talk) about whether there should be a rule that red links should be removed from navboxes. I can't find it at the moment but I think it ended with the conclusion that I support, namely that plausible red links are useful pointers that encourage editors to write articles on the missing topics. That only works if the red links are for plausible articles. Johnuniq (talk) 06:24, 21 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: The consensus is in WP:Red link:  --Izno (talk) 13:39, 21 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the replies. Thank you Izno, that's pretty clear. Popcornduff (talk) 14:28, 21 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Redlinks in templates

message: I don't know if this is the best place to ask, but I'd appreciate some third party input on the discussion at Template_talk:TRS-80_and_Tandy_computers regarding changes to that template and the interpretation of policy behind the changes. Thanks. Ubcule (talk) 15:06, 11 May 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Input regarding changes to navigation template (inc. section-level link removal) 

message: An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Navboxes. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so.  Hildeoc (talk) 22:21, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Navboxes listed at [[Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion|Redirects for discussion]] 

message: Is there a chance that we could get some community perspective at the said template . Interested editors seem to be split into two parties who have very different perspectives, and the talk pages shows years of concerns.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 21:31, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Feedback requested at the Template "Germanic peoples" 

message: What should be done with  and ? All the links in the former are in the latter, and every page with the former also has the latter, adjacent.
A recent TfD, with just three participants (one of whom was the proposer, me) resulted in keeping the former template. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 22:07, 15 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shining some light on Licht 

message: I'd like to make people aware of a module (Module:Article list) that I have written for use in navboxes which has several features that might be useful. The module uses Wikidata to generate stable links. In particular:
* Links to articles that are moved will automatically update in the template
* Articles which are deleted will automatically disappear from the template
* Common words can be automagically removed from the piped label by using a  parameter
* Potential articles can be loaded, which will automatically appear if/when the article is created
I'm working on a few more improvements like automatically sorting the links into alphabetical order, and allowing an option for redlinks to be displayed — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 20:03, 21 February 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Quick update. The module is working well and I've been adding it to a few templates experimentally. The alphabetical sorting is now implemented too. I am ready for some feedback with a view to deploying it more widely. — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 18:36, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stable article list 

message: I have just started an RfC relevant to this guideline, which may interest editors working with navigation templates or navbox style guidelines. Chubbles (talk) 02:07, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Relevant RfC 

message: I have been wondering for years whether non-editors use navboxes at any significant rate, and I believe that I have identified a way to measure that, if anyone's interested in it.  
The tool to use is wikitech:Provenance.  The link in the navbox would need the full URL with the ?wprov= key, wrapped in Help:Plainlinks (so it looks right on the page).  Then there's the matter of figuring out how to get the data back out of the other end of the system, so this isn't as quick and easy as clicking on a pageviews tool.  But I believe that it's possible to do, and I believe that the regulars at Wikipedia:Village pump (technical) could figure this out pretty easily.  It might even be possible to change something in the main navbox template itself to do some of this work automatically (like marking all the links in navboxes as plainlinks, rather than needing to mark each one separately).
I don't have any plans to do this myself, but I wanted to leave this message in case anyone else was interested in it. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:14, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Do readers use navboxes? 

message: WP:NAVIMAGES demands that navbox images "should have a justification to appear", but fails to explain what that justification should be. As it stands, it only gives licence for more fastidious editors to go around removing images that clearly illustrate the collective theme of the links grouped in the naxbox. What are the criteria for including (or removing) an image? Cnbrb (talk) 17:27, 7 November 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: This is a good question. I was wondering about this with regards to the template on Artificial intelligence, whose image is clearly at odds with WP:NAVIMAGES, but where I think it is generally thought appropriate to have a picture. Does WP:NAVIMAGES still reflect common editorial practice? Felix QW (talk) 14:31, 28 September 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Images 

message: Didn't see anything in the archives, but is there a preferred way to order multiple navboxes that are placed at the bottom of articles? I assume the obvious of most relevant (on top) to least relevant (on bottom) but thought I'd ask. -- GoneIn60 (talk) 02:26, 11 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ordering multiple navboxes 

message: WP:EXISTING suggests we list all members of bands when at least one is blue linked; it seems a reasonable extension to apply the spirit of that rule to episodes of TV shows. For reference, Template:Torchwood fits this: most episodes have articles, but the two from season one that don’t are still listed. Meanwhile, Template:House (TV series) appears to only list the episodes that have articles, but this could give the impression that the episodes listed are the all the episodes of the season. 
Would anyone oppose extending the guidance here to include collections like TV shows? Or perhaps editors here have alternate ways to view this. — HTGS (talk) 02:55, 23 April 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd oppose this, as a navbox is for navigation, not information.  Any unlinked text does not provide a navigation function, and just clutters a navbox. --woodensuperman 11:53, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  EXISTING and TV episodes 

message: Per WP:EXISTING, while existing articles are strongly favored for navboxes, there can be times when we include non-existing article links or text. E.g.:
:[R]ed links can be retained in navigation templates that represent a well-defined and complete set of data (geographic divisions, annual events, filmographies, etc.), where deleting red links would leave an incomplete and misleading result.
And
:Note: In navigation boxes about musical ensembles, it may be appropriate to list all of the members of the ensemble, to avoid the perception that the ensemble is a solo act, provided that at least one member of the ensemble is notable.
What about including former members of a group as well? As you likely know, the convention is to have current members listed with  tags and in the above section followed by a listing of former members that do not have the  tag. Should former members of a band be included in a navbox, even if not all of them have articles?  ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 10:50, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: As I read it, the only reason to include the non-notable members is to avoid the perception that the ensemble is a solo act.  There's no navigational benefit whatsoever to included non-notable former members, it's purely unnecessary clutter.  Navboxes are for navigation, not for information. --woodensuperman 11:23, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: "[R]ed links can be retained in navigation templates that represent a well-defined and complete set of data". ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 11:25, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I disagree with the guideline regarding redlinks in filmographies, etc, as some works are simply not notable.  Even filmographies in articles are sometimes only partial filmographies, so this seems strange in a navbox.  WP:WTAF should always be the preferred option, so that notability can be established prior to inclusion.  In any case, a well-defined set is North/South/East/West, not sometime members of a pop band. --woodensuperman 11:27, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Question about musical ensembles and former members 

message: You are invited to join the discussion at :Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/SdkbBot 4.   talk 05:10, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title: Relevant BRFA

message: You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:Categories, lists, and navigation templates § Questioning WP:BIDIRECTIONAL.   talk 18:42, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title: Discussion at [[:Wikipedia talk:Categories, lists, and navigation templates#Questioning WP:BIDIRECTIONAL|Wikipedia talk:Categories, lists, and navigation templates §&nbsp;Questioning WP:BIDIRECTIONAL]]