Talk:Sergo Ordzhonikidze

message: His death was officially ruled a heart attack, not a suicide.  This is the information on the Russian wikipedia.  And there is no mention of the likely theory that he was killed on the orders of Stalin.  If I can find some sources I'll add this.
: I'm also aware of claims that O was murdered on Stalin's orders, and it seems plausible, though probably not provable in the circumstances of Stalinist-era politics Chrismorey (talk) 01:18, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Official Death Ruling 

message: This article is ridiculous. Anyone here examine the archives? Sergo shot himself because he couldn't abide what Stalin was doing. I don't know why wiki's leftist orientation extends to pro-Stalin rumbswabbery, but this is a disgrace.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.108.18.61 (talk) 13:21, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I disagree that this is a "lousy" article as Unsigned said. But there are some things that could be improved on. "Likewise there is no evidence that Ordzhonikidze had quarreled with Stalin." I don't know what the point of this statement in the article. I expect he did argue with Stalin over the phone or in person which wouldn't be recorded, if Stalin had tortured his brother as the article says.  Wiki does not have a "leftist" or "pro-Stalin orientation." It is a free public source all kinds of people write on, and I like it! Rakovsky (talk) 19:08, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  It may not be lousy but it's certainly sketchy for an article on a major C20 political figure, especially one from a state as controversial as USSR. Unless anyone objects, I'll beaver away at amplifying it from my somewhat limited range of sources. BTW if Krushchev's memoirs are to be believed, even senior apparatchiks didn't lightly argue with Stalin as the penalty could well be a painful death Chrismorey (talk) 04:35, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

text:  I've had another go incorporating additional material, from some oldish sources but better than none.  I've also deleted some platitudes specifically including allegations that O's brothers were also repressed.  As this was S.O.P. under Stalin, it isn't worth saying.  I've also toned down the overtly-Stalinist POV in places (sorry Rakovsky, but this article went out of its way to exonerate - or should that be whitewash? - Stalin).  This is a WIP and I plan to do more. Chrismorey (talk) 04:25, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: and have done so Chrismorey (talk) 08:02, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: and have had a further go.  I feel I've done enough and agree that it needs attention from an expert.  There is more on his fall and death than on his career, but he was an Old Bolshevik who specialism was revolutionary politics, on which sources are (to be polite) unreliable.  As noted, his staff did the work of his department while he sat on the Politburo. Chrismorey (talk) 08:22, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Room for Improvement 

message: I can't claim to be an expert but am familiar with the general area.  The problems with this section seem more apparent than real, so I've tried to fix them per request.  That said, any article dealing with Stalinist Russia is going to contain conjecture, and equally clearly the official reports of the time can't be relied on (cf. Kirov murder).  We shall almost certainly never know and IMHO the best bet is to record the credible alternative explanations. Chrismorey (talk) 01:12, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Politburo member 

message: Why is the subject rated High importance for Russian military history and only Medium for Soviet Union?  Ordzhonikidze wasn’t Russian, had no military role and the most influential period of his life was under Soviet rule.  By contrast, he was a very senior member of the Soviet government for several years, and died in disputed circumstances during that quintessential Soviet invention, the violent political purge.  Surely the ratings should be reversed. Chrismorey (talk) 08:03, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rating 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Congratulations and thanks to all of the editors who got this article to the featured article of the day.  —  AjaxSmack  04:53, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: Congrats