Talk:History of agricultural science

message: * Enriching the Earth
* Synthesis of Ammonia
* Mendel
* Tracing the Origin of Organic/Sustainable Agriculture
876890nb6ygm,x6  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.21.108.116 (talk) 20:09, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bibliography for editing 

message: The current article starts with the statement:
* Agricultural science began with Gregor Mendel's genetic work, but in modern terms might be better dated from the chemical fertilizer outputs of plant physiological understanding in eighteenth century Germany...
** Current Wikipedia entry on History of agricultural science
This statement is added here in Jan 17, 2010 (see here), but the initial statement about Mendels premier role in agriscience has been postulated in Jan 4, 2006 in the agricultural science article, see here. On Dec 23, 2007 (see (here) conformation has been requested, which has not yet been added.   
There is reason to doubt this statement, if you consider the following two contemporary quotes: 
* Early knowledge of agriculture was a collection of experiences verbally transmitted from farmer to farmer. Some of this ancient lore had been preserved in religious commandments, but the traditional sciences rarely dealt with a subject seemingly considered so commonplace. Although much was written about agriculture during the Middle Ages, the agricultural sciences did not then gain a place in the academic structure. Eventually, a movement began in central Europe to educate farmers in special academies, the earliest of which was established at Keszthely, Hungary, in 1796.The scientific approach was inaugurated in 1840 by Justus von Liebig of Darmstadt, Germany. His classic work, Die organische Chemie in ihrer Anwendung auf Agrikulturchemie und Physiologie (1840; Organic Chemistry in Its Applications to Agriculture and Physiology), launched the systematic development of the agricultural sciences. In Europe, a system of agricultural education soon developed that comprised secondary and postsecondary instruction. The old empirical-training centres were replaced by agricultural schools throughout Europe and North America. Under Liebig’s continuing influence, academic agriculture came to concentrate on the natural sciences...
** "Agricultural science" lemma on the Encyclopedia Britannica online, 2014
** Comment: The Keszthely article mentions, that "the Faculty for Agriculture of University of Pannonia is located in Keszthely" probably since 1796...!?
** The New Encyclopaedia Britannica. Vol 1 (1998). p. 156 further explains: There was, however, no formal agricultural education or research until 1796, when a special academy was founded at Keszthely, Hung; and professorships of agriculture and rural economy were founded at the universities of Edinburgh (1790) and Oxford (1796) in Great Britain. Meanwhile. in France and Germany, Albrecht Thaer, S.F. Hermstadt, Jean-Baptiste Boussingault. and, in particular, Justus von Liebig were laying the foundations of agricultural research...
* Die Frühgeschichte der Pflanzenbauwissenschaft ist eingebettet in die Entwicklungsgeschichte der Landwirtschaftslehre. 1727 hatte der preußische König Friedrich Wilhelm I. an den Universitäten in Frankfurt/Oder und in Halle/Saale Lehrstühle für Kameralwissenschaft einrichten lassen. Ziel des dort angebotenen Kameralstudiums sollte es sein, fachlich qualifizierte Staatsbeamte auszubilden. Zu den Unterrichtsfächern gehörte auch die Landwirtschaftslehre.Der maßgebende Wegbereiter für die Entwicklung des Pflanzenbaus zu einer Universitätsdisziplin war der an der Universität Göttingen lehrende Kameralwissenschaftler Johann Beckmann. Er hat 1767 das Wort Pflanzenbau in die deutsche Schriftsprache eingeführt. Vorher sind für diesen Teil der Landwirtschaftslehre ausschließlich die Begriffe Ackerbau, Feldbau oder Landbau benutzt worden. Pflanzenbau war im Kameralstudium jedoch nur ein Lehrfach. Pflanzenbau-Forschung auf experimenteller Basis wurde damals an den Universitäten nicht durchgeführt.Erst Albrecht Daniel Thaer veränderte nach 1800 mit seinem neuen Gedankengebäude einer rationellen Landwirtschaftslehre diese forschungsarme Zeit. Nach seinem Vorbild wurden in vielen Teilen Deutschlands landwirtschaftliche Akademien gegründet und in den dort angeschlossenen Gutswirtschaften Feldversuche durchgeführt. Mit der Übernahme naturwissenschaftlicher Erkenntnisse und Methoden wurde der Pflanzenbau mehr und mehr eine experimentelle Disziplin. Ab 1840 bestimmte vor allem die von Carl Sprengel und Justus von Liebig propagierte Düngung der Kulturpflanzen mit mineralischen Nährstoffen und die damit einhergehenden Düngungsversuche Inhalt und Methodik pflanzenbaulicher Forschung.
** German Wikipedia entry on :de:Pflanzenbauwissenschaft, which at the moment is the wikilink to this article
Searching for "agricultural science" in 19th century books, revealed some other interesting quotes: 
* THE BRITISH ASSOCIATION: The New Section For Agricultural Science.Sir,It is with much pleasure that I hail the notice of Dr. Granville for the formation, at the next meeting of the British Association at Birmingham, of a section for the promotion of scientific agricultural researches, an idea which was, I believe, first started by Earl Fitzwilliam at one of the English Agricultural Society's meetings, with which society the new section of agricultural science will in no way interfere, since the Society is adapted for other objects—will be, evidently, a kind of locomotive Smithfield Cattle Shew, and Exhibition of Agricultural Instruments—they do not intend to make any scientific movements, not having a single person on the committee of management except Mr. Youatt, the eminent veterinary surgeon, who has the slightest knowledge of science...
** "The British Association" in: British Farmer's Magazine, Volume 2. 1838, p. 402
* The Council have had the pleasure of adding to the list of your Honorary Members the distinguished names of Dr. Sprengel, residing in the kingdom of Prussia, not only one of the most active cultivators of agricultural science in that part of the Continent, but the editor of a monthly Journal of Agriculture, and author of numerous important works on Agricultural Chemistry, the Doctrine of Soils, and a Treatise on Manures—from the latter of which a chapter on Animal Manures has already been translated by your Secretary, and printed in the Fourth Part of the Journal; of Dr. Daubeny, the Sibthorpian Professor of Rural Economy in the University of Oxford, who has liberally placed his Lectures at the disposal of the Journal Committee; and of Professor Johnston, of the University of Durham.
** Journal of the Royal Agricultural Society of England. 1840
In short, people mentioned here are:
* Gregor Mendel (1822–1884)
* Justus von Liebig (1803–1873) / Albrecht Thaer, S.F. Hermstadt, Jean-Baptiste Boussingault and, in particular, Justus von Liebig
* Frederick William I (1688–1740), Johann Beckmann (1739-1811), Albrecht Thaer (1752–1828), Carl Sprengel (1787–1859), Gregor Mendel (1822–1884)
* Augustus Granville (1783–1872), Earl Fitzwilliam (1786–1857), William Youatt (1776–1847),
* Carl Sprengel (1787–1859)
From these quotes it seems fair to say that for a start:
# Agricultural science is preceded by early knowledge of agriculture (a collection of experiences) verbally transmitted from farmer to farmer (and since the ancient Greeks and Romans add to paper, see Geoponici)
# Agricultural science has it's roots in 18th century Germany 
# Agricultural science as a discipline emerged in Britain in the first half of the 19th century
But there is much more, for example:
# Knowledge of agriculture has been written down since the ancient Greeks and Romans add to paper, see Geoponici
# For example, in the Netherlands Agricultural science (Landhuishoudkunde) as an academic disciple was initiated by Willem I by appointing of Jan Kops in 1815 As Harro Maat (2001, p. 42) stated: "The chairs in land-household studies, installed at the Dutch universities in 1815, were the first formally arranged facility for the development of agricultural science..."
# Edward John Russell traced back the Agricultural Science in Great Britain to 1620 in his 1966 A History of Agricultural Science in Great Britain, 1620-1954.
To be continued. -- Mdd (talk) 22:03, 11 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origin of agricultural science 

message: The lead of this article has been changed, see here, from a lead explaining the origin of agricultural science, which existed here since the start of this article in 2005:
::Agricultural science began with Gregor Mendel's genetic work, but in modern terms might be better dated from the chemical fertilizer outputs of plant physiological understanding in eighteenth century Germany. In the United States, a scientific revolution in agriculture began with the Hatch Act of 1887, which used the term "agricultural science".''
To a lead presenting the aim of the study of the the history of agricultural science:
::History of agricultural science studies the scientific advancement of techniques and understanding of agriculture. While advances such crop rotation have existed much longer, the formal scientific study of agriculture began in 19th century Germany.
This change is an improvement, because this first lead was very questionable. There are however two problems with this recent edit:
* This edit practically erased almost all (premature) text concerning the origin and development of agricultural science
* The reference to britannica.com doesn't mention "19th centry Germany" but the "Central Europe (specifically Hungary) late 18th century" as origin, stating: ... a movement began in central Europe to educate farmers in special academies, the earliest of which was established at Keszthely, Hungary, in 1796. 
A fundamental problem here is that the term "History of agricultural science" has two meanings (similar as with the term history of science): 
# The actual history of agricultural science, and 
# the study of this history 
Now theme of the second is "History of agricultural science studies." Since this article is called "History of agricultural science" the change of scope of the lead is not preferable. -- Mdd (talk) 11:43, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I have made some revisions to hopefully address these issues. There's still plenty room for development and clarification I believe. I also fixed the citation. -- Josh.vill (talk) 20:44, 23 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Double meaning of the word "History of agricultural science" 

message: The overall structure of the article is clear and straightforward. The ratio of specific and useful information to padding is good, although at times it makes the flow a bit choppy. Information is well-cited. 
There is specific information in the introduction that should probably be moved to a later section on the relevant topic. Many of the facts presented don't seem to fit together into a narrative or structure. Perhaps an explicit timeline of major advances would be helpful. Some language, such as "helped give an understanding of when crops would prosper," is unnecessarily vague and brief. Logo Aesthesis (talk) 01:02, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Review of Josh.vill's Edits 

message: Walkerc84
The format of the article is great, it is easy to follow and the information given is very informative.  The lack of visuals makes the page a little bland, so maybe you can find some pertinent images to put in.  I also think that it would be nice to have a brief overview of the agricultural scientists contribution to the science; I know you have a link to their wiki page but it might be easier to just add a one or two sentence summary of what they did for agricultural science that they should be mentioned on the page.
Walkerc84 (talk) 13:39, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Peer Review 

message: Edit this in Hindi 
कृषि विज्ञान का इतिहास कृषि के इतिहास का एक उप-क्षेत्र है जो कृषि की समझ और वैज्ञानिकों की समझ के बारे में सोचता है। उर्वरक का वैज्ञानिक अध्ययन, 1840 में यूटस वॉन लिबिग द्वारा प्रकाशित किया गया था, इन्नर ऑर्गेनिक केमि अर्नवन्दुंग औफ एग्रिकुल्टचेमी एंड फिजियोलॉजी (कार्बनिक रसायन विज्ञान के अपने कृषि और फिजियोलॉजी के अनुप्रयोगों) के साथ। [1] कृषि विज्ञान में लीबिग की अग्रिमों में से एक आवश्यक पौधे पोषक तत्व के रूप में नाइट्रोजन की खोज थी। Latino heats (talk) 05:33, 2 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:   History of agriculture  in Hindi have  

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