Talk:Albus Dumbledore/Archive 4

message: I've seen how rapidly this page can get into cruftism and rampant rediting, so I'm bringing this to talk first.:
He was joined by his brother, Aberforth, who proved to be quite different from Albus, not possessing the extraordinary magical talent - while Albus settled matters with reason, Aberforth settled with duels. When Ordinary Wizarding Levels came about in his fifth year, the elderly Griselda Marchbanks, Head of the Wizarding Examinations Authority, who personally examined the school-age Dumbledore for his Nastily Exhausting Wizarding Tests in Charms and Transfiguration, remarked to Dolores Umbridge that the young, talented Dumbledore had "...done things with a wand I'd never seen before."[HP5] When Dumbledore and Doge left Hogwarts, they planned to take their "then-traditional" tour of the world. On the eve of their trip, the 18-year-old Dumbledore suffered the death of his mother Kendra, killed by Ariana, who was on one of her outbursts.
needs a major edit. as written now, Griselda leaves Dumbledore's NEWT exam room and immediately comments to Dolores Umbridge. Obviously, this isn't at all how it happened, Griselda recalled this many years later. the paragraph should reflect the proper order of events and the intervening time. ThuranX 22:19, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Paragraph needs rewording. 

message: I believe that an image of Richard Harris as Dumbledore shoulde be there.I would also like to know why the image of the Elder wand was removed--Donrub 1:00 PM ISTDonrub 07:37, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You are right, and I added one from Chamber of Secrets into the section of the same name. Thanks for the input. :) - Arcayne (cast a spell) 17:27, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

text: That sound you hear is me slapping myself repeatedly on the forehead. LOL! I've fixed it now. Thanks for catching it. Man, that was dumb of me... :-/ - Arcayne (cast a spell) 18:19, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

text: The "other guy" is Sir Michael Gambon. In the future, don't vandalize the article and then ask to have your POV implemented. faithless (speak) 12:26, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

text: The editor's note under Sir Michael Gambon that reads this is the most appropriate image, you changed to this is the least appropriate image. That was vandalism. faithless (speak) 13:10, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Images 

message: This develepment section is  a pointless section as nearly all of it repeats the appearance section  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.141.65.200 (talk) 12:29, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, I didn't see this. But the article looks good to me now. faithless (speak) 04:05, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Development

message: Is there a reason why we shouldn't use the second Gambon as Dumbledore pic in place of the current one? Granted, the first one's an action pic, but the second is a better portrait. Thoughts? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 15:28, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't exactly understand what you mean.  Would you like to replace 75px in the infobox with 50px? =David(talk)(contribs) 15:58, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

text: I'd tend to agree, that image does look better; but wouldn't the landscape image be better than the portrait one for the infobox?  I think the image would push the text a bit too far down...either that, or be too small.  The landscape image seems to fit better. =David(talk)(contribs) 22:57, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I show the difference here.  I think that, if we shrink the image down to 200px, it looks all right.  Any comments? =David(talk)(contribs) 21:14, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Dumbledore image

message: "...is portrayed as a wizard with modern/reformist ideas about blood purity..."Does it not seem more descriptive and accurate to say liberal?Zain Ebrahim 07:55, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It would be more accurate to describe those ideas rather than label them. If a label is used, it should have a source. Pairadox 08:09, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In that case the sentence should be completely removed since the rest of the paragraph provides description. Zain Ebrahim 08:16, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: How about throwing a  tag on it instead? That will give people a chance to look for a reference. Or a  if you feel really strongly about it. If the tag is still there in a month, remove the sentence then. Pairadox 09:03, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sounds good! Zain Ebrahim 09:10, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Whoa. You DO realize that phrase was already in the article, right? We simply tagged it for citation rather than immediately deleting it (or changing it to some other OR wording, as you did). Now it makes even less sense. More charitable compared to whom? Who's doing the comparing? Pairadox 18:06, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yep, I removed the bit that needed citing as well, substituting the word 'charitable' in its place. More charitable than say, Draco Malfoy, or Voldie. Charitable is more generalized than the previous substitute requiring citation that likely doesn't exist. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 18:45, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, so "more charitable" according to you. Sorry, Arcayne, your change is every bit POV and OR as the former text probably was, and just as much in need of citation. Pairadox 19:09, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Maybe you're right. :) Perhaps you have an alternative in mind? I'm open to suggestions, Pair. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 19:21, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, at this point basically what Zain Ebrahim outlined above, removing the entire sentence. We can skip the tagging and waiting that I suggested since it's pretty much agreed that the basic phrasing is flawed. Oh, and I'd support removing the "because of his wisdom" phrase in the second paragraph also. Pairadox 19:39, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I can live with that. How about the rest of the editors monitoring the Discussion page. Your thoughts? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 19:54, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Okay, I'm going to go ahead and remove the first sentence as well as the "because of his wisdom". Refer anyone who reverts to this section. Zain Ebrahim 07:19, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Modern vs reformist vs liberal 

message: Also, am I the only one who doesn't like the bit in the opening about JKR's old schoolmaster being the basis for Dumbledore? I've never heard that before, I'm pretty sure she has never said that that is the case, and the sources don't wow me. But of course if it's just me, never mind. faithless (speak) 00:15, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't care for the first source, but the second seems okay as far as sources go. To complicate matters, though, I found a reference to another .possible inspiration in the archived talk pages. (There may be more - I stopped at one.) So, what do we do with this? Pairadox 08:05, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I give much more credence to The Independent than the others, but am still far from convinced, as that piece seems like more of an op-ed than anything else. I don't mind so much if the info stays, just as long as it's made very, very clear that this is all supposition (even if it is a reliable source, Rowling is the only one who can say where the inspiration came from). Unless, of course, JKR has already said this somewhere and I somehow managed to miss it. :P faithless (speak) 09:39, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe this is my inclusionist tendencies showing through, but maybe we should include thelinks to the citations here, and look at them side by side, judging then? - Arcayne (cast a spell) 18:21, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Who inspired Dumbledore?

message: There is also mention on this page that Dumbledore owned only one Deathly Hallow, the Elder Wand. *Bzzzzt!* WRONG! Albus actually had in his possesion all three Hallows at one time or the other. The Elder Wand obviously came from Gindelwald, but don't forget that he also had Marvolo Gaunt's ring which turned out to be the Ressurrection Stone and he held, for ten years at least, the Cloak of Invisibility which belonged to James Potter and Albus then passed it onto Harry. (75.69.171.158 19:42, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: But he only actually owned the Wand.  He was holding the cloak (which technically belonged to Harry) and he had picked up the ring (which technically belonged to Voldy).  He had only won the wand, and possession of it only had transferred to him.  =David(talk)(contribs) 19:49, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Number of Deathly Hallows 

message: I did some kind of clean up of this article, which can be reviewed in this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Albus_Dumbledore&diff=162603270&oldid=162589202
Some of the information I moved, shortened or removed was about this: 
*All this stuff about his favorite sweets, the names of the magazines in which his articles were published, and more useless information.
*An overdetailed description of the scene in which Snape overhears Trelawney's profecy.
*A list of all the members of the original Order that were killed during Voldemort's first rise to power.
*A full description of everything that Dumbledore said in the speech in Harry's first year at Hogwarts (that the Zonko articles were forbidden, the Quidditch teams, and more).
*Some scenes contained information not related to Dumbledore, for example that mention of Bellatrix killing Sirius in the Department of Mysteries.
*Is it necessary to use two lines to tell everyone that Harry was sent back to Dumbledore's office via Portkey?
*Overdetailed description of the dialogue between Dumbledore and Harry at the end of book 5.
*Overdetailed description of the cave scene in book 6.
*Overdetailed description of the dialogue between Dumbledore and Harry in King's Cross.
*The information about the Elder Wand is contained in the article for Deathly Hallows. It was more of a history of the Wand rather than useful information concerning the character.
Any thoughts on this? Lord Opeth 04:43, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A clean-up for Dumbledore's article