Talk:Zatoichi

message: Referring to this particular segment, with emphasis added by me:
:Zatoichi befriends a local farmer, helping her gambling son and two geishas who are seeking revenge for the murder of their parents.
I thought the gambler was the farmer's nephew, not son. The English subtitles of my copy of Zatoichi has that man referring to the farmer as 'Aunty'. --T-Boy 11:05, 17 Jun 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Beat Takeshi's ''Zatoichi'' 

message: [With respect to the Kanji used, I think the "ichi" in Zatoichi's name should be translated as 'city' and not "one".   
It is also common for Japanese people to call older women "obasan" (aunty) in colloquial speech. This doesn't mean they're relatives, though.]--11.11.2004
:Concerning the translation of "ichi," I agree. I will remove it. Is there a reason to translate the name anyway? Also, the version I watched said "nephew" when describing the young gambler. --Feitclub 02:34, Jan 19, 2005 (UTC)
in zatoichi meets yojimbo, which i watched last night, one character teases Z saying he should be #2 instead of "ichi" number 1. Samiam70002 06:45, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: So it's a pun. —Tamfang (talk) 04:25, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  translation of the name 

message: This page is seriously messed up. It can't make up its mind whether to be an article on the character Zatoichi, or whether it should be about the movie (the one with tap dancing) Zatoichi, or even whether it should be an article on the general Zatoichi phenonmenon (linking to the character bio and movie pages). --maru   (talk)  contribs 03:36, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I would agree that it's "messed up" if it tried to tackle all those facets without distinguishing between them, but it seems to me to be well organized.  —Tamfang 19:38, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

text: This IS that page about the character. If anything, the movie(s) should have a separate page, but at the moment it seems this article is well sectioned and organized. -- Ajshm 18:50, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Is there a reason why we have a picture of Takeshi Kitano instead of Katsu Shintaro? Are there no public domain images of Shintaro available? I'd like to see Shintaro here, because he spent most of his career portraying Ichi, and built the character as we know him.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Toxonix (talk • contribs) 16:03, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Splitting 

message: Can some body tell me where the information of the Groups of Tōdō-za is from? In the movies blind masseurs are said to be part of a group called ANMA.
cheers
--06:39, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Group of Blind 

message: Was Zatoichi really fictional? Entirely? I remember seeing a Martial Arts documentary which briefly mentioned a traditional play telling the story of an heroic blind swordsman, though it did not mention the name Zatoichi. Also, I think Kenshi might deserve a mention on this page. Also, of the many unused ideas of Bruce Lee was his own adaptaion of Zatoichi. Dessydes 18:50, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fictional? 

message: The section Character refers to his name 
: The character's name is actually Ichi. Zatō is a title, the lowest of the four official 
: ranks within the Tōdōza, the historical guild for blind men. Ichi is therefore properly 
: called Zatō-no-Ichi ("Low-Ranking Blind Person Ichi", approximately), or Zatōichi for short
Given that "one" in Japanese is "ichi," should this not read "Low-Ranking Blind Person Number One?"
*Septegram*Talk*Contributions* 21:02, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps, but it's written with the kanji for "market" not "one".  —Tamfang 06:15, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name 

message: I would like to see a little more personal info about ichi on this page, specifically why he took up swordplay. If I remember, he explains his reason in the first movie. He claims that other blind people try to compensate for the disability by being good masseurs or musicians, but he wanted to be different. He was tied of being called a cripple, so he took up a skill that commanded respect. It was this determination that made him very good very quickly.
As far as movie chronology goes, he took up swordplay at the late age of 23 or 24. This age is based upon what a serving girl says to some of her patrons. She says some samurai are looking for a blind masseur who is "26 or 27 years old". Ichi claims he took up swordplay "three years ago", hence the estimated age. 
Certain dialogue from other characters also helps explain why he became so good. A samurai marvels at the size of Ichi's right shoulder and comments that he must have put forth a magnicent effort to attain mastery of the Sword. Again, Ichi's own swordmaster says he trained harder than any of his "seeing students" and that he would train "rain or shine".
Other personal details that should be added
#He was not blind from birth (possibly from an illness).
#Both of his parents died when he was young.
#Was raised by old, woman which he calls "grandma".
#Killed his own sword master in a duel.
I'll leave someone else to add the info as I'm sure that other users are far more knowledgeable on the subject than I am. I have only seen 5 of the 26 movies. --Ghostexorcist 05:50, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In one movie Ichi says he was separated from his father during a pilgrimage (to see the sunrise on Mount Whatsit); he meets a man who might be his father.  Is there another movie that says both his parents died early?  —Tamfang 08:48, 1 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The 3rd one says his parents died when he was young and an another woman took care of him. He calls her "grandma". The 26th movie says his mother died when she was 28 and he was 2. --Ghostexorcist 09:54, 1 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: While we're on the subject of his relatives, don't forget that he killed his brother in a duel in the second movie (apparently over a love triangle of some kind). I don't have a copy within arms reach so I can't check it myself, but this is what I recall. Sweetfreek 19:24, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You are right, I forgot to add that one. He even cut his arm off during a duel from their youth. --Ghostexorcist 19:28, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: On the subject of Ichi's life, in "New Tale of Zatoichi," (the blind swordsman carries his sword in that film in an umbrella rather than as a cane) Ichi tells his childhood friend, the shamisen player Tamekichi, that he had become "so focused on drawing swords and killing people" that he joined the Yakuza. His statements that his current life was a punishment for the people he murdered while in the Yakuza seems also to imply that he was not blind from birth. Later in the film he flatly states that he could see at one time; when Yayoi tells him the moon is beautiful, he replies that he can see it in his mind - "I can still see an image of Shimodate inside my mind, lit by the moonlight when I could still see."  Tamekichi refers to Ichi as "Ichi from Kasama," which would indicate that Ichi's hometown was a village called Kasama. According to the statements made by Ichi's sword master, this film comes four years after he studied under Banno, a samurai who seems to have fallen in status. Ichi also seemed to have feelings for Banno's sister. It also seems, from Banno's ease with Ichi's blindness, that Ichi was definitely already blind when he took up the sword. Atypicaloracle (talk) 16:58, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

text:  The 26th movie (1989) says Ichi lost his sight, not his mother, when he was 2 and she 28. —Tamfang (talk) 21:39, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Personal info 

message: I recently watched Yojimbo, Sanjuro and Zatoichi meets Yojimbo, and was struck by how little Sassa (in the latter film) resembled Sanjuro (in the Kurosawa pair) – apart from being played by Mifune, of course.  The paragraph recently added to the article makes me wonder whether the writer saw the same movies I saw. —Tamfang (talk) 09:30, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It is debateable at best if the Yojimo of the Kurasawa films and the Yojimbo of Zatoichi meets Yojimbo is the same character. So I have add a fact check tag to that paragraph. Marc29th (talk) 17:53, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yojimbo 

message: I edited the sentence about the american remake Blind Fury, that movie is no way an action-COMEDY !!!! Pure action, partly drama. -jailbirdt  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.129.252.200 (talk) 10:53, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Blind Fury Film Genre 

message: One film has an opening caption that mentions Tenpō, if memory serves.  Can someone confirm, so this can be mentioned in an appropriate place? —Tamfang (talk) 04:25, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: #6 begins with a visit to the grave of Kichizo who died two years ago; the stone is inscribed Tenpō 13-2-13. —Tamfang (talk) 05:15, 21 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  date 

message: * The English title is not a direct translation of the Japanese title.
User:Moocowsrule removed this note, saying, "That's completely irrelevant per WP:MOS-JP; the title should be the official English name."
I didn't find anything in WP:MOS-JP touching directly on this.  Anyway I think Moocowsrule misses the point: the note is not urging that the English titles in the table be replaced by translations of the Japanese (though I'd like to see those translations in another column!) but merely warning against a natural misunderstanding on the part of those of us who do not understand Nihongo.
I'm reverting the deletion. Perhaps the note could be rephrased. —Tamfang (talk) 20:14, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: For what's worth, I agree both about the utility of the note and about the utility of literal translations (any volunteer?). Goochelaar (talk) 21:21, 27 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  English titles 

message: According to the Tokyo Shock DVD release, the title of the 1989 film is Zaotichi the Blind Swordsman whereas "darkness is his ally" is simply the promotional slogan.  Thus I made this change.Desertpapa (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 22:31, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The Tokyo Shock/Media Blasters release may have it as something a bit different, but the original release title in Japan, therefore the official name of this film, is ZATOICHI. Any inconsistency in the article will be rectified.75.21.155.245 (talk) 09:33, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  1989 film title 

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thread_title: File:Zatoichi.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

message: Since the Internet Movie Database (imdb) is not acceptable as a reference source here, and I myself can't find anything online to reference the actual release of this film, it's been tagged needing a citation. Perhaps a wiser editor will come round and fill that in, that missing ref. that I do not think is out there. Rotten Tomatoes - is that allowed here? - may have a review, and a review should count as proof to release of a film. I couldn't get the webpage at RT to work and saw nothing there. Djathinkimacowboy 06:47, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Zatoichi the Last", 2010 

message: We are having a problem with the precise art form for Zatoichi's sword. I Ai Do is always used and is acceptable per Wikipedia, but there seems to be a problem with this. Whilst assuming good faith, I'd like to call for assistance with anyone knowing the specific name of the form (holding the swordcane upside-down) with citation. But any further changes to that without a citation may be misinterpreted.Djathinkimacowboy(yell) 15:50, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zatoichi's style 

message: This section is connective trivia which doesn't tell us anything about Zatoichi. JoshuSasori (talk) 00:10, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Excessive connective trivia 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Episode 3 of Ahsoka names the Jedi blind fighting training Zatoichi, likely referencing this character. 96.31.177.151 (talk) 06:28, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  trivia 

message: :
What does the phrase mean literally?  Hard to imagine anything that could produce both these translations. —Tamfang (talk) 20:55, 23 March 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Google Translate gives "If it's dark, it's here" – and "If it's darkness, it's the gate of childhood" for the rōmaji version.  Hmm. —Tamfang (talk) 21:08, 23 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  curious paraphrase