Talk:Jewish tribes of Arabia

message: Jimharlow99 please refrain from inserting those texts bellow claiming the Himyarite and other tribes were sadducees. The reviewed, accepted, mainstream scholarship asserts the Sadducees died out as a distinct group after the fall of Jerusalem in 70CE. Also, what has "the prophecy of Daniel" to do with a historical event? It is clearly a theological interpretation in "Rise of Islam" section. If you persist in that, this article will be protected.--Francatrippa (talk) 15:11, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Hey, Francatrippa! I've declined your request for a third opinion, since there's no discussion of the topic, a necessary prerequisite for a 3O.  I'm not trying to be bureaucratic here; it's just that, in the nature of 3O, there's nothing we can do to help if there's no discussion to join.  The thing is, 3O is designed to provide a fresh set of eyes on a discussion that has deadlocked; 3O Wikipedians have no special authority to determine or enforce consensus whatsoever, so there's really nothing else we can do.  If you're seeing behavioral issues with this user that are preventing discussion, you might want to try the Wikiquette Assistance board; if the edit wars have gotten out of hand so much that admin intervention is needed, you can try the edit-warring admin noticeboard, although that probably shouldn't be your first resort.  Thanks, and good luck! Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 19:26, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the tip --Francatrippa (talk) 19:28, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Sadducees and prophecy on the Islam

message: Because you know how much the Arabs would have to gain in a majority Muslim society by converting to Judaism.  I mean, Hollywood was just so powerful in the 1100's A.D.  and it would have been so convenient to convert to Judaism back then to try to get in on the slice of the pie eh?
Honestly ashkenazi if you are going to lie, stop being such retards.
Disregard that, you know why.
67.148.120.105 (talk) 11:53, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yup 

message: I've added the POV tag due to the theological content of this section. It presents an interpretation of the rise of Islam as one based on pre-existing Jewish prophecy - which is all well and good, but if the prophetic/theological underpinning of the disappearance of the Jewish tribes is to be emphasized, then that argument needs to be stated explicitly.
This sentence, for example: "In 622 CE, Prophet Mohammed leveraged Jewish-Arab despondency at successive military defeats, abandonment by Persian Jews, loss of Jerusalem (again), the Murder of the Exilarch Nehemiah ben Hushiel , and the renewed opposition of the Banu Quraish, set out for Taif" has no reference, and is very argumentative/theoretical - the preceding paragraph also lacks sources.  
The section also fails to explicate the military aspect of Muhammad's conquest, and the political aspect (Dhimmitude, etc). 
I will attempt to re-write it when I get the time.
- Ledenierhomme (talk) 15:19, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm working on that section. There is a lot of POV. I removed a teleological reference to the prophecy of Daniel (?).--Francatrippa (talk) 12:20, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  I am going to revert your deletion because the Prophecy of Daniel is precisely the argument used by Salman al-Farsi, among others, to champion the goals of Prophet Muhammed (s.a.w.) in Yathrib.  this prophecy is vitally important to understanding the political dynamics of the Yathrib before and after the emergence and supremacy of ISlam in Yathrib. Jimharlow99 (talk) 22:38, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Islamic theological content in "Rise of Islam" section 

message: Greetings,
I note that the last sentence of the section entitled "Judaized Arabs" is, as of May 20, 2013, as follows: "— in fact Contemporary Judaism actively discourages conversion and converts even after conversions have occurred." 
I wonder if the capitalization of the word Contemporary is meant here to mark some special group, since — despite a great deal of variants of current Judaism (— I had assumed "Contemporary" to refer to current times) — the standard Jewish attitude toward conversion and converts, both historically and currently, and regardless of denomination, is not well described by the sentence above, as may be seen here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conversion_to_Judaism#Relations_between_Jews_and_proselytes (whose citations #s 43-48 see), and in Shemot ("Exodus") 22:20, Vayikra ("Leviticus") 19:33 and as explicated by Rambam in the Mishneh Torah, Hilchot Mechira 14:15.
There may exist "contemporary Jews" who discourage conversion (absolutely, as opposed to in the form of a traditional 3-time discouragement as a ritual test of sincerity) and/or discriminate against converts for whatever reason (though it is expressly forbidden to do so), but to claim this as normative for "Contemporary Judaism" minimally requires the citation of at least one counter-argument to the sources here cited, and, in my opinion, is a mis-characterization that should be removed entirely, whether or not replaced by a statement on the subject based on more accurate sources.  
Thanks,
Lyrelyre (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 03:59, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Re: contemporary Jewish conversion  

message: These two sources are unreliable: Mitchell Bard's "Idiot's Guide" (cited via JVL), and the EretzYisroel.org article.  Both need replacing.  I am going to delete text sourced to them if this situation is not fixed soon. Zerotalk 15:06, 12 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unreliable sources 

message: The Islamic fundamentalist line is that all Jews in the mid East are foreign invaders, colonialists. However, denying the continuing presence of powerful tribes of Jews in the Middle East as late as the 600s is actually denial of the Koran. Are there debates about this? Profhum (talk) 05:50, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Denial of Koran? Query 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Googling this name mostly brings up fringe websites and the footnote by his name year isn't any source but a claim he's the same person as a bunch of other people.--JaredMithrandir (talk) 04:27, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  We need some primary sources on Shallum Ben Hushiel 

message: The references in this article are super off, and I have no idea how to go about fixing them. 
In the last section, "Rise of Islam," the references go up to number 22, but there are only 17 references listed. I suspect that some of the references may have been removed from the reference list, but I'm not sure if it was only references 18-22 that were removed from the end of the list.  If any references were removed in the middle of the reference list, that would throw off the order and mean a bunch are mislabeled.
I'm not a frequent editor, so maybe someone else can decipher this issue.
NomNomNomDePlume (talk) 19:14, 14 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  References are missing or mislabeled