Talk:Samaritan Pentateuch

message: The text days the Samaritan Torah has two thousand similarities with the original  Septuagint. How come this be so, since there are no existing copies of this mentioned text?? Davidrojaselbirt (talk) 00:21, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello, David. The text doesn't say the Samaritan Pentateuch has two thousand similarities with the original Septuagint. Alephb (talk) 01:20, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  there are no surviving copies of the Septuagint! 

message: The comparison of the Samaritan Pentateuch with the Masoretic text implicitly or explicitly treats the latter as canonical and regards the Samaritan as a variant text, e.g. "This variation has similarities to Deuteronomy 27:2-8 and is supported by changes to the verbal tense within the Samaritan text of Deuteronomy indicating that God has already chosen this place." This section should stick to presenting the differences. Explanation and evaluation of those differences is a matter for the section of textual criticism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:16b8:5cf9:200:d5be:e1f0:ac99:e004 (talk • contribs) 
:Agreed. Will add POV template referencing this section of the talk page to that section. -- Jacob's Crackers (talk) 18:22, 24 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  failure of impartiality 

message: Samaritan practice, like Jewish practice, divides the Pentateuch into weekly portions, referred to (per Tsedaka) as aalaakem. The portions are different, and I've produced this chart based on Tsedaka's and Shoulson's work for Genesis to demonstrate the distinctions. I would like to suggest it is added to the article somewhere. The transliteration system is intended to reflect the one already found on Samaritan pages on Wikipedia. I'm not great at formatting tables so if someeone would like to clean it up with some nice RTL formatting I wouldn't say no.
 Comparison of weekly reading divisions between the MT and the Samaritan Pentateuch, for the Book of Genesis
Masoretic Parashiyot	Israeli Hebrew Transliteration	Name Translation	Verses (MT Numbering)	Samaritan Aalaakem	Samaritan Hebrew Transliteration	Name Translation                      	Verses (MT Numbering)
בראשית              	Bereshit                      	In the Beginning	Genesis 1:1—6:8      	ࠁࠓࠀࠔࠉࠕ            	Barashet                        	In the Beginning                      	Genesis 1:1—3:24
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠅࠄࠀࠃࠌ ࠉࠃࠏ         	Waadam Yada                     	And the Adam Knows                    	Genesis 4:1—6:16
נוח                 	Noaḥ                          	Noah            	Genesis 6:9—11:32    	ࠅࠀࠍࠉ ࠄࠍࠍࠉ         	Waani 'Innani                   	And Behold I                          	Genesis 6:17—8:21
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠅࠉࠀࠌࠓ ࠉࠄࠅࠄ ࠀࠋ ࠋࠁࠅ 	Uyaumer Shehmaa al libbu        	And the LORD Said to His Heart        	Genesis 8:21—11:32
לך לך               	Lekh L'kha                    	Go Forth        	Genesis 12:1—17:27   	ࠋࠊ ࠋࠊ             	Lik Laak                        	Go Forth                              	Genesis 12:1—16:16
וירא                	Vayeira                       	And Appeared    	Genesis 18:1—22:24   	ࠅࠉࠄࠉ ࠀࠁࠓࠌ         	Uyai Abraam                     	And Abram Was                         	Genesis 17:1—20:18
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠅࠉࠄࠅࠄ ࠐࠒࠃ ࠀࠕ ࠔࠓࠄ  	UShehmaa Faqad It Shaarraah     	And the LORD Remembered Sarah         	Genesis 21:1—23:20
חיי שרה             	Ḥayei Sara                    	Sarah's Life    	Genesis 23:1—25:18   	ࠅࠀࠁࠓࠄࠌ ࠆࠒࠍ        	WAbraahm Zaaqen                 	And Abraham was Old                   	Genesis 24:1—25:18
תולדת               	Toledot                       	Generations     	Genesis 25:19—28:9   	ࠅࠀࠋࠄ ࠕࠅࠋࠃࠕ ࠉࠑࠇࠒ   	Wille Tuldot Yesaahq            	And These are the Generations of Isaac	Genesis 25:19—28:22
ויצא                	Vayetze                       	And He Went Out 	Genesis 28:10—32:3   	ࠅࠉࠔࠀ ࠉࠏࠒࠁ         	UYishaa Yaaqob                  	And Jacob Lifted Up                   	Genesis 29:1—31:16
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠅࠉࠒࠌ ࠉࠏࠒࠁ         	UYaaqam Yaaqob                  	And Jacob Arose                       	Genesis 31:17—33:20
וישלח               	Vayishlaḥ                     	And He Sent     	Genesis 32:4—36:43   	ࠅࠕࠑࠀ ࠃࠉࠍࠄ         	UTaasaa Dinaah                  	And Dinah Went Out                    	Genesis 34:1—36:43
וישב                	Vayeshev                      	And He Dwelt    	Genesis 37:1—40:23   	ࠅࠉࠔࠁ ࠉࠏࠒࠁ         	UYashab Yaaqob                  	And Jacob Dwelt                       	Genesis 37:1—38:10
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠅࠉࠅࠎࠐ ࠄࠅࠓࠃ        	UYusef Urad                     	And Joseph Was Pulled Down            	Genesis 39:1—41:49
מקץ                 	Miketz                        	At The End      	Genesis 41:1—44:17   	ࠅࠋࠉࠅࠎࠐ ࠉࠋࠃࠅ       	UlYusef Yelidu                  	And To Joseph Were Born               	Genesis 41:50—43:25
ויגש                	Vayigash                      	And He Came Near	Genesis 44:18—47:27  	ࠅࠉࠁࠀ ࠉࠅࠎࠐ ࠄࠁࠉࠕࠄ   	Uyabu Yusef Abita               	And Joseph Came Home                  	Genesis 43:26—46:7
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠅࠀࠋࠄ ࠔࠌࠅࠕ         	Wille Shemot                    	And These are the Names               	Genesis 46:8—48:2
ויחי                	Vayḥi                         	And He Lived    	Genesis 47:28—50:26  	ࠀࠋ ࠔࠃࠉ            	Il Shiddi                       	Almighty God                          	Genesis 48:3—49:21
                    	                              	                	                     	ࠁࠍ ࠐࠓࠕ ࠉࠅࠎࠐ       	Ban Farat Yusef                 	Joseph is Fruitful                    	Genesis 49:22—50:26
Isaacmayer9 (talk) 09:00, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: You should include the refs in this table draft. Looks interesting though, and with refs I believe it would be a good addition to the article. Nice work! Thank you, warshy (¥¥) 18:53, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Including a comparison of aalaakem to parashiyot 

message: The comparison of the Samaritan Pentateuch with the Masoretic text implicitly or explicitly treats the latter as canonical and regards the Samaritan as a variant text, e.g. "This variation has similarities to Deuteronomy 27:2-8 and is supported by changes to the verbal tense within the Samaritan text of Deuteronomy indicating that God has already chosen this place." This section should stick to presenting the differences. Explanation and evaluation of those differences is a matter for the section of textual criticism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:16b8:5cf9:200:d5be:e1f0:ac99:e004 (talk • contribs) 
:Agreed. Will add POV template referencing this section of the talk page to that section. -- Jacob's Crackers (talk) 18:22, 24 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Also agreed. I will go through all sources given and try to work on this section, taking into account your comments - no version should be referred as the canonical one nor as the variant one, both being two different versions which are obviously considered by their own groups to be the original, canonical one. Dan Palraz (talk) 10:42, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  failure of impartiality 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: not moved. Current title is the WP:COMMONNAME. (closed by non-admin page mover) Vpab15 (talk) 12:54, 30 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Samaritan Pentateuch →  – Pentateuch and Torah are perfect synonyms, but the most common name is Samaritan Torah, and it is the form used by the Samaritans themselves Dan Palraz (talk) 12:34, 22 May 2022 (UTC)

text: This is a contested technical request (permalink). DanCherek (talk) 12:57, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: The numbers shown in a quick Google search are not reliable, if you move on to page 12 of the search you'll see that Google actually only has 144 results for Samaritan Pentateuch: https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Samaritan+Pentateuch%22&newwindow=12&ei=jp-KYpnNE9iQxc8PtrW34As&start=110 Either way, Pentateuch is still a little more common as it is the Greek, Christian version of the Hebrew word Torah, but as the Jewish Pentateuch's main article is Torah and not Pentateuch, it seems reasonable that we should grant the same treatment to the Samaritans. Dan Palraz (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2022 (UTC)

text: * Oppose. WP:COMMONNAME, largely because the text is more widely discussed by outside scholars than by adherents, especially in English. It's also more specific: "torah" also has a wider sense of "teachings" to both Jews and Samaritans, which is why Jews often refer to the Pentateuch as "chumesh". This is IMO a very serious issue with the current page Torah, which is confusingly half about the Pentateuch and half about the wider sense of the word. Not relevant to the move but if it helps: I've had a number of opportunities to discuss this text with Samaritan leadership, including Benyamim Tsedaka, and IIRC none of them objected to the use of "Pentateuch." Over the last few years I've started to see "Samaritan text" and "ST" a lot more, so we might have reason to change this soon (also the Hebrew page is נוסח שומרון), but "Samaritan Torah" is too niche to be appropriate. GordonGlottal (talk) 14:32, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 22 May 2022