Talk:Yola dialect

message: There are small errors here which a native of south Wexford can correct. 
Drazed means 'scuffed'. The drawing of thread from wool was known as 'drazing'. A wound incurred after a fall is known as a 'draze'.
Keek is actually 'geak' or 'geek' - to take a geak at something, meaning to look at it; or geeking in the window. Obvious cognate of 'gawk' and 'gawking'.
Amain may be a rendering of Ammin' meaning 'ambling along'. Rare.
Fash stems from 'farsh'. Compare with the Yiddish for old and confused person 'farshimmeldt'. 
--- No no no. Farshimmeldt = far+shimmeldt 'mouldy', schimmel is mould, as it is in Dutch. 84.53.74.196 23:44, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comment moved from article 

message: A couple of words listed here as Yola are, from my personal experience, also common in Scots [see Scots Language], specifically in Fife where I lived but I'm sure more widely, namely
neape = turnip (spelt neep, as in the popular dish "tatties an' neeps") and
fash = confusion (in the sense of mental confusion or worry, as in the frequent exortation "Dinnae fash yesel."). I'm not sure what this implies but someone more expert may be able to make something of it. 87.81.230.195 (talk) 12:32, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know about "fash", but in the case of "neape/neep" it's a case of an archaic word that has died out in the standard language being preserved in dialects. —Angr If you've written a quality article... 18:26, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Another word which I used to often hear my aunt from Wexford Town use was "fornenst": "It's out there fornenst you" meaning "It's out there in front of you". I remember a man I know from Belfast saying he had heard it there and claimed it was Scots but owing to the relative conservatism of some features of Hiberno-English, such features are probably just survivals from Middle English. My aunt would always say "lacen" for "laces" and "ashen" for "ashes", clearly on the same pattern as ox-oxen, child-children in English. An Muimhneach Machnamhach (talk) 17:11, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I've often heard lacen (also as a verb) and ashen too but I couldn't find them in my sources. User:geraldkelly 9 April 2008  —Preceding comment was added at 21:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yola - Scots common words 

message: I’m moving this to the Discussion Page in order to deal more satisfactorily with the issues of sources. I have queried the sources used for some recent changes. I deal with these below. If sources cannot be provided for these additions I suggest they be removed.
On sources in general, I have confined myself to quoting from ó Muirithe and Dolan (1996) because they conducted a scholarly and professional survey of all the source material and included in their book what they thought was worth including. Leaving out much what they considered unreliable - which includes much of Barnes's material.
=== Vocabulary ===
I have checked Poole’s Glossary as published in ó Muirithe and Dolan (1996). I can find no mention for the following words: weisforth, londe, daie, yersel, vriend
Please provide a source for these words.
=== Pronouns ===
The reference to “Poole 1867” means, I presume, the book written by William Barnes in 1867 and entitled Glossary of the Dialect of Forth and Bargy, which reprints Poole’s Glossary. On page 133 (which is a quote from a speech given to the British Association by the Very Reverend C W Russell, DD, President of St Patrick’s College Maynooth) there is a discussion of pronouns and a general comparison with modern English. However, I cannot find any reference to the information, specifically the forms of cases for personal pronouns, as laid out in the table.
This book can be downloaded from Google Books.
Geraldkelly (talk) 09:57, 22 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Questions on sources 

message: The reference to “Poole 1867” means, I presume, the book written by William Barnes in 1867 and entitled Glossary of the Dialect of Forth and Bargy, which reprints Poole’s Glossary. On page 133 (which is a quote from a speech given to the British Association by the Very Reverend C W Russell, DD, President of St Patrick’s College Maynooth) there is a discussion of pronouns and a general comparison with modern English. However, I cannot find any reference to the information, specifically the forms of cases for personal pronouns, as laid out in the table.
This book can be downloaded from Google Books.
Geraldkelly (talk) 09:57, 22 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pronouns 

message: This article needs IPA to be used in it to demonstrate pronunciations. The current spellings are clumsy and could be pronounced vastly different depending on the readers own dialect. If I can find the source documents, I will put the proper phonetic spellings in.
DonConquistador (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 17:10, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Since the language was never recorded before it died out, it isn't known exactly how it was pronounced, so it won't be possible to add IPA. Angr (talk) 21:01, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: IPA

message: I've removed the term "Anglic" twice now, as it doesn't appear in the cited sources I've been able to check. It's certainly absent from the two books by Hickey I cited in my additions. The term appears to be pretty obscure and may be confusing to readers. Additionally, the Hickey books call this a "dialect" or "variety", but never a "language". Finally, I think the List of dialects of the English language article is a better and more intuitive target than English languages; if anything the two articles should be merged.--Cúchullain t/c 14:43, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Additionally, I'm wondering if "Forth and Bargy dialect" or "Forth and Bargy" would be a better title for this article. This is what's used in both books by Hickey and by Dolan, and it returns 28,600 Google hits. "Yola" is harder to tease out, but Yola English returns only 14,800, most of which appear not relevant; "Yola language" returns 73, mostly Wikipedia knockoffs, and "Yola dialect" returns only 75. It seems names using "Forth and Bargy" are more common in the sources.--Cúchullain t/c 14:54, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know if the articles should be merged or not, but as long as they're separate, we should retain links to both.  "Yola" is the ISO name, not that we need to follow ISO. "English", "Anglian", and "Anglic" are all names for the node; any would be acceptable.  — kwami (talk) 02:20, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: How is this? I'd originally written "English language or dialect", with the link going to English languages, but after more reading I didn't see any sources that called it a "language", and none use the term "Anglic", so I figured list of dialects of English is a better link. As for Yola, I'll do a bit more research. It looks like it's well established (obviously) but "Forth and Bargy" may be more common.--Cúchullain t/c 12:45, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: "Language or dialect" would be fine, though "variety" is often used where the distinction is not clear.  It's a separate language per ISO, but I don't know how widespread that POV is.  — kwami (talk) 15:23, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: "Anglic"?

message: hi lads. amain is actually a norman word derived from the old norse 'almanna' which means 'of easy use', so im guessing that goin on amain means getting along easily or without any hassle.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Neilowex (talk • contribs) 17:39, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  amain = norman word [comment moved into chronological order] 

message: There is much use of the term "Southern Ireland" no doubt by an English write who wishes to distinguish that part of Ireland from the British possession of Northern Ireland. However, to anyone else in the world who is not British the term "Southern Ireland" would probably mean the extreme south of the island of Ireland rather than the Republic of Ireland.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.113.20.219 (talk) 06:49, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It seems to be used here only once, and it is indeed reference to the southernmost parts of Ireland rather than the Republic.--Cúchullain t/c 12:08, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Southern Ireland? 

message: "The last speaker of Yola died in 1998." --should this be 1898 perhaps ? Leasnam (talk) 17:28, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Last Speaker 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Why on Earth is this page in the :Category:Spurious languages? Is there any serious doubt that this dialect existed? Steinbach (talk) 20:49, 19 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Spurious"? 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: moved. (non-admin closure) NW1223<Howl at me•My hunts> 19:10, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Yola (language) →  – Current title is inconsistent with other titles for languages. ~Red of Arctic Circle System (talk) 18:24, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

text: This is a contested technical request (permalink). – Ammarpad (talk) 08:16, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

text: Hi there. This doesn't look uncontroversial at all. There was an RM in 2013 which saw it moved from Yola language to Forth and Bargy dialect. And then a couple of months ago somebody boldly moved it to Yola (language), and I imagine that user added the parentheses because the title without them already existed. This needs a discussion. Dr. Vogel (talk) 00:16, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

text: Support I don't see what's controversial with keeping the same title but without parentheses. It can be discussed whether it is a language or a dialect later, but move it to "Yola language" for now to be consistent with other language articles. -Vipz (talk) 22:27, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

text: Note: WikiProject Languages has been notified of this discussion. signed, 511KeV    (talk) 16:07, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 19 April 2022 

message: things Must have been confusing
For every one when they got to drinking . 209.171.85.210 (talk) 17:28, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Viking french Irish 

message: Is there much warrant to include a revival date or L2 speakers? The source provided seems to be original to whoever added the edit, and the justification for the number given within is based on either unreliable or unverifiable information. 
In particular, the discord server which provides the 140 speaker count experiences only sporadic activity and there has not been conversation in Yola since 2022. For those of you who wish to see the server for yourselves, the link can be found on the 'Gabble ing Yola' website (https://sites.google.com/view/gabble-ing-yola/language/english?authuser=0).
To wrap up, this really seems more like a group of people interested in the language from an academic perspective rather than a serious attempt at revival. Due to this, I would recommend the removal of this information from the article as it seems to be misleading. Galloglach21 (talk) 15:38, 26 September 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Revival movement 

message: @Pigginator1 If we're going to call Yola a dialect, then we need to be able to say what language it's a dialect of. It's certainly not modern English, as it dates back too early for that. Whether or not it's part of Middle English has nothing to do with the era it exists in, but whether it has diverged significantly enough from it to establish itself as a separate language. If it has, then we need to recognise it as a separate language properly (not as a "variety"); if it hasn't, then it's part of Middle English. Theknightwho (talk) 03:25, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Anglic language variety"