Talk:Pope Benedict XVI/Styles Vote

message: Should the style "His Holiness" be used in front of Pope Benedict XVI's name (as in His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI)?
Place a vote in a section of your choice, and if you want to state why, keep it brief. Thanks. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 22:28, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: My objections stand as stated above. This poll is redundant as it has already been decided by a majority that prefixed styles violate NPOV. Leaving it up to individual page editors to conduct and enforce private polls to allow an overturned non-NPOV style guide to remain in effect would violate NPOV. A more constructive question could be asked, because the prescriptive language of the prevailing survey alternative did not carry a consensus, whether the style ought to be provided in the introductory paragraph or elsewhere in the article, however, this particular question is already being addressed in a general ratification vote. Whig 04:50, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: What??  A very slight majority preferred not to use styles.  I see no evidence that a majority views styles as POV. john k 07:44, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The reason why I am conducting this is that if the new idea is rejected, then pretty much we will be back to square one. And, based on that square one, titles are used. If the whole community cannot think up of something for all, then we should deal with the question on individual pages. As mentioned before, it is kind of hard to use a blanket policy on people and their titles. Some people have titles that we use everyday (Sir, Dame), while others were created by a cult (Dear Leader). Each page has the capibility to decide on their own about the prefixed styles and that is what I am doing with this poll. Oh yeah, one more thing, I will not vote in this poll unless there is a tie. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 14:29, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, square one is styles are not used; that was the way Wikipedia was originally before all the edit wars over this issue. And it is quite obvious that nothing approaching a concensus will exist on this page, especially given the number of Christians who are likely to be editors of this page and who are strong supporters of the pope. And arguably, Christianity is a cult, as are all religions. Titanium Dragon 03:33, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Now, I would like to say that not everyone voting in favor of the proposed idea has a religion at all, and there are some who have a faith in a religion and still voted against the idea. So I would not try to lump everyone in the same group. As for the cult opinion, that is not something I am really going to discuss here, since I do not have the answer to that question. Plus, as mentioned before, no matter what I do, what Whig does, or anyone for that matter, there is still going to be a problem with this issue. There will be some who will enforce what we have right now, some who will change it to the Britanica version, or come up with their own version all together. Plus, will we reach the 80 percent consensus: no. Last check its pretty much 2:1 (22 (or 21)- to 11), and I know that still might not be consensus to meet some people's standard. I have no clue when we will ever reach consensus on this issue, but we got more folks involved, so once this is done, we can try to bring everyone involved here into the general MoS issue, which (after permission from Whig) get some type of mediation on this matter. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 03:37, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vote or Die! (Now Closed) 

message: #JYolkowski // talk 22:59, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Support 

message: #Lulu of the Lotus-Eaters 22:36, 2005 May 15 (UTC)
#Gugganij 23:03, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: My objections stand as stated above. This poll is redundant as it has already been decided by a majority that prefixed styles violate NPOV. Leaving it up to individual page editors to conduct and enforce private polls to allow an overturned non-NPOV style guide to remain in effect would violate NPOV. A more constructive question could be asked, because the prescriptive language of the prevailing survey alternative did not carry a consensus, whether the style ought to be provided in the introductory paragraph or elsewhere in the article, however, this particular question is already being addressed in a general ratification vote. Whig 04:50, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: What??  A very slight majority preferred not to use styles.  I see no evidence that a majority views styles as POV. john k 07:44, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The reason why I am conducting this is that if the new idea is rejected, then pretty much we will be back to square one. And, based on that square one, titles are used. If the whole community cannot think up of something for all, then we should deal with the question on individual pages. As mentioned before, it is kind of hard to use a blanket policy on people and their titles. Some people have titles that we use everyday (Sir, Dame), while others were created by a cult (Dear Leader). Each page has the capibility to decide on their own about the prefixed styles and that is what I am doing with this poll. Oh yeah, one more thing, I will not vote in this poll unless there is a tie. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 14:29, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, square one is styles are not used; that was the way Wikipedia was originally before all the edit wars over this issue. And it is quite obvious that nothing approaching a concensus will exist on this page, especially given the number of Christians who are likely to be editors of this page and who are strong supporters of the pope. And arguably, Christianity is a cult, as are all religions. Titanium Dragon 03:33, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Now, I would like to say that not everyone voting in favor of the proposed idea has a religion at all, and there are some who have a faith in a religion and still voted against the idea. So I would not try to lump everyone in the same group. As for the cult opinion, that is not something I am really going to discuss here, since I do not have the answer to that question. Plus, as mentioned before, no matter what I do, what Whig does, or anyone for that matter, there is still going to be a problem with this issue. There will be some who will enforce what we have right now, some who will change it to the Britanica version, or come up with their own version all together. Plus, will we reach the 80 percent consensus: no. Last check its pretty much 2:1 (22 (or 21)- to 11), and I know that still might not be consensus to meet some people's standard. I have no clue when we will ever reach consensus on this issue, but we got more folks involved, so once this is done, we can try to bring everyone involved here into the general MoS issue, which (after permission from Whig) get some type of mediation on this matter. Zscout370 (Sound Off) 03:37, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Oppose