Talk:Kurds in Syria

message: The catgeory does not apply to this article as Kurds in Syria is about a group of people not a region.Heja Helweda 03:30, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category: Kurdish Inhabited Region 

message: I just finished removing bias from this article. It is notable that almost all of the article was violating copyrights. I rewrote the article and neutralized it. The claims of suppression are not facts, they are claims fro certain organizations and that should be always noted. The background of the citizenship controversy was included; it is clear that the creator of the article, or the section, presented the issue in an anti-Syrian, one-sided way. Please discuss any changes here before making them. Regards, Anas talk? 15:15, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neutralized article 

message: It says in the demographics that the kurds in Syrian kurdistan came from Turkey. Thats not true the kurds is Syrian kurdistan has always been there.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mrkurdistan (talk • contribs) 05:35, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I know and I agree with you. I told the moderator about this once.
Source says the majority of Kurds in Syria came from Turkey.--Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 21:25, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

text: The source is Youssef M. Choueiri (2005). A companion to the history of the Middle East (Hardcover ed.). Wiley-Blackwell. p. 475. .  --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 10:35, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Migrated to North eastern Syria from Turkey?? 

message: In this edit: , an IP removes "The majority of Kurds in Syria originally came from Turkey in the 1920s." and its source with the edit summary: "false assertion made by unreliable source"
The source is Youssef M. Choueiri (2005). A companion to the history of the Middle East (Hardcover ed.). Wiley-Blackwell. p. 475. .
Dr. Choueiri: BA (American University of Beirut), MSc (SOAS, University of London) PhD (Corpus Christi College, University of Cambridge), Reader In Islamic Studies at the University of Manchester: 
Book is published by: Wiley-Blackwell: "Wiley-Blackwell is the international scientific, technical, medical, and scholarly publishing business of John Wiley & Sons, with strengths in every major academic and professional field and partnerships with many of the world's leading societies. Wiley-Blackwell publishes nearly 1,500 peer-reviewed journals and 1,500+ new books annually in print and online, as well as databases, major reference works and laboratory protocols." 
This demonstrates that the source is reliable and the argument that its a "false assertion" is not backed up by anything. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 15:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of well sourced facts 

message: User Guest2625 has repeatedly added to the article that the areas where Kurds live in are "Kurdish areas". They are not. These claims are not in any way following real history and instead going by Kurdish narrative propaganda that is not following real history or factual events.  Those ares has never in history "been Kurdish" or been part of any made up name "Syrian Kurdistan" or "Kurdistan". --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 12:49, 26 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Falsehoods 

message: Hi!
I'm inviting editors to participate in the discussion to move the article 'Syrian Kurdistan' to 'Rojava'. My rationale is: This article is about a region governed by the PYD, which calls the area Rojava. Foreign press also uses this term, for example  (BBC)  (Guardian)  (Independent)  (VICE). Other examples on Wikipedia such as Kosovo (not South Serbia), Catalonia (not Catalonian Spain) or Scotland (not Scottish United Kingdom) indicate this article should be called Rojava as per convention. Thanks Genjix (talk) 19:04, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move for page 'Syrian Kurdistan' to 'Rojava', 18 January 2015 

message: Dear editors interested in the topic, there is a ongoing discussion on balance and deletion of content in the Human rights in Rojava article. It would be appreciated if some of you would be willing to contribute to solving issues, concerning deletions of material in the article as well as not least in the talk page discussion. -- 2A1ZA (talk) 15:21, 18 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Balance discussion in "[[Human rights in Rojava]]" 

message: The claim that it has been abandoned by the government is a serious claim that need several reliable sources. The government had abandoned only a few towns and cities but never completely abandoned them as it is still there. The vast majority of Rojava territory has been captured from ISIS with the support of coalition.Ferakp (talk) 18:51, 25 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Abandoned by government 

message: This article is about the Kurds in Syria, not Rojava or Northern Syria. There were too much information which weren't relevant at all. They were related to the demographics of some cities and towns. Also, some sections had too much details that didn't really help the article at all.Ferakp (talk) 08:38, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: It seems that anything related to atrocities committed by Kurds is irrelevant to you, while atrocities committed against them is so relevant. Please do not arbitrary delete information that were discussed before then demand others to use the talk page. It goes the other way around: first you get a consensus, then you make your edits.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 09:07, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: If that was my point, I'd have added Kurdish sources where they tell their own stories about mentioned incidents in this article where Kurds are doomed to be "responsible" by Arab nationalists. How burning village and similar area-related history/information have to do with the Kurds in Syria? Check other similar articles, they haven't written similar incidents. Ferakp (talk) 14:53, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: None of the sources is made by "Arab nationalists". Just like the Baasthist atrocities have something to do with the Kurds, what happened in Amuda have something to do with the Kurds in Syria. 1- it helped them expand and made the town Kurdish. 2- It is part of their history in Syria, their political history to be precise. This paragraph you are trying to delete is not different from paragraphs listing the discrimination against Kurds (just in reverse) and hiding it have only one purpose: whit washing. This paragraph was also discussed before, and it cant be deleted like this.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 15:06, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
replies: text:  Yep, whenever I try to neutralize article it's "whiteashing". I got your feedback. There is difference between "Baathists" and "Kurds".Ferakp (talk) 17:14, 10 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not relevant sections 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: As stated at WP:NOETHNICGALLERIES, . Strawberry4Ever (talk) 12:28, 19 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  No ethnic galleries 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 6 external links on Kurds in Syria. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160304001038/http://www.kurdipedia.org/books/74488.pdf to http://www.kurdipedia.org/books/74488.PDF
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160304001038/http://www.kurdipedia.org/books/74488.pdf to http://www.kurdipedia.org/books/74488.PDF
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120321195743/http://www.mesop.de/2010/12/14/memorandum-of-kurds-in-syria/ to http://www.mesop.de/2010/12/14/memorandum-of-kurds-in-syria/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070310231931/http://www.amnestyusa.org/regions/middleeast/document.do?id=80256DD400782B8480256F63006435DB to http://www.amnestyusa.org/regions/middleeast/document.do?id=80256DD400782B8480256F63006435DB
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: It was claimed that removing the word "traditional" as a description for the name Rojava is original research. Also, it was claimed that mentioning that Kurdish nationalists consider the Kurdish inhabited regions of Syria part of Kurdistan is original research. Therefore, I ask for reliable academic sources attesting: 1- the usage of the name Rojava since a period long enough for it to be considered traditional (I know that it came to use after the war, so 7 years ago, hardly long enough for it to be traditional) 2- A source listing those regions as part of proper Kurdistan according to non Kurdish official authorities or renowned historians.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 16:21, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I think by 'traditional' the editor who added the word meant that 'Rojava' was used by the local Kurds way before the war (thus 'traditionally'). I've added a source for that now. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 18:03, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: if they used the name way before, then a reliable source should be provided. Anyway, your last edit is appropriate (not the one before it where u reverted me to restore a status quo that was based on sensetional claims lacking any sources).--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 18:11, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rojava being traditional, and Western Kurdistan 

message: Amr, you seem to  be labouring under a misapprehension. The reference doesn't say that 40% of the population of Aleppo Governorate are Kurds, rather that 40% of Syrian Kurds live there. Konli17 (talk) 19:13, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: May I ask why do you insist on editing highly contested pages without using the talk page first? You do that in several places, leaving the summary: tidy, and NPOV, or revert POV.... yet most editors who edit those articles are here to push a POV, you included (and I excluded since Im not editing those articles). Naturally, edit wars then take place. It is in the editing policies that you seek a consensus on the talk page if you know you are inserting claims that will be contested, and I really urge you to do this. As for your latest edit: the language you used indicate that you mean 40% of Aleppo is Kurdish inhabited, and its not hard to clarify what you mean by adjusting the wording. Second, I have a problem with you writing that Kurds live in the geo-cultural region of Syrian Kurdistan. This is obviously what you and many Kurds believe in, but thats up for debate. I would be okay if you write that Kurds live in a geo-cultural region in North Syria designated by many of them as Syrian Kurdistan.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 11:00, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: That's quite unfair Attar, for a number of reasons. Firstly, I initiated this discussion. Secondly, it's quite clear to me that the 40% figure refers to Afrin's 30% plus Aleppo city's 10%; if you believe this could be made clearer, you could have edited the text instead of blanking it. Thirdly, the version of the article you reverted to still describes a geocultural region, as this is what it said before I edited it. Konli17 (talk) 15:22, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I wouldn’t say its unfair. The pages you are interested in are contested, and you and Amr revert each other several times a day. Yet you sometimes change an article fundamentally without seeking consensus (not only you of course: most of the editors in the Syrian Kurds circus are doing it, and by circus I mean the situation of the articles here which constantly under edit wars, not the Syrian Kurds themselves). It would be easier for everyone to have a consensus. No one like to see that red notification saying that your edit was reverted (I know I hate it, and I dont edit those article to keep myself out of this). I edited the article and restored your edits with modification (clarified that its 40% of the Kurdish population and not of Aleppo's population, and added that Syrian Kurdistan is a designation accepted by many Kurds, not universal). If you dont think this is good, then revert, and then Amr will revert you, then you will revert him, and the show will go on (sadly). Btw, you are using this source: sahipkiran.org- Does it satisfy the rules for reliable sources of News Organization mentioned here?--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 23:05, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I agree with a lot of what you say.  I came across the source when it was referenced in a book, The Kurds of Northern Syria by Wladimir van Wilgenburg and Harriet Allsop. I'm quite happy with your effort to find a middle ground; that's been pretty rare in my recent experience, so thank you. I've just edited the lede, please let me know what you think. Konli17 (talk) 00:43, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Alright for the source. It wouldnt be hard for all of us to reach a middle ground, we just need to be reasonable, which I understand can be hard when the topic is as sensitive as identity, ethnicity, and land. Cheers.--Attar-Aram syria (talk) 11:17, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Distribution 

message: I'm at somewhat of a loss, as an edit of mine has been reverted seemingly because it included the sentence "Many Kurds seek political autonomy for what they regard as Western Kurdistan". This is being described as POV-pushing. Can anyone tell me what POV they believe this sentence pushes? Konli17 (talk) 20:23, 17 August 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV-pushing 

message: Amr, you've reverted more than once on this page today, violating the sanctions in place over Syrian war-related articles. Best revert back before you attract the attention of anyone inclined to apply those sanctions. Engage here instead. Konli17 (talk) 18:34, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sanctions violation 

message: Amr, I've no objection to a discussion of the different estimates of Kurdistan's Syrian population, but the lede isn't the place for that. Also, please read WP:VANDALISM and stop referring to my edits as such. Konli17 (talk) 20:03, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I am open to working with you on editing the lede. However, on top of your previous problematic edits, your last edit here is changing facts. For example, replacing "many" by "some", removing "no more than" before the 10% number and "at most" before the number of villages, and replacing "Syria" by "Jazira" and "encouraging" by "allowing". All these "minor" edits change the meaning and are considered OR or faking the source content. Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 20:23, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Those changes were necessary because of WP:POINT. Was there migration from Northern Kurdistan to parts of Western Kurdistan apart from the Jazira in the 1920s and 30s? The text refers only to the Jazira. Konli17 (talk) 20:39, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

text: Stop saying western Kurdistan, this only exists in your imagination. The content you have changed uses Syria and Turkey. Anything else is fake 
or being made up by you,and the nature of your edits shows your POV spirit and motivation. Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 23:01, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: You're quite wrong, about pretty much everything. Will you answer my question? Konli17 (talk) 23:21, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: YES, there WAS kurdish immigration to other parts of Syria. In the 1930s Kurdish Alevis fled the persecution of the Turkish Army during the Dersim Massacre, settled in Mabeta.  Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 04:30, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I can't access that. Does it give any idea about numbers? Konli17 (talk) 11:58, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sourced material/edit summaries 

message: The CIA map is incorrect. The Kurdish population is not represented well for example in Syria.
Here for one example: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tell_Hamis 
You can clearly see that Kurds do not make up majority in all of this region, its actually about half. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:EmilePersaud 02:23, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Incorrect information 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
* 
Participate in the deletion discussion at the . —Community Tech bot (talk) 00:53, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

message: Extremely badly written 5.173.41.41 (talk) 00:48, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copy editing badly needed 

message: The second sentence in the lede reads: "A portion of Syrian Kurds are originally Turkish Kurds who have crossed the border during different events in the 20th century.<ref name="Storm">". This is incorrect, since the Storm states the following (on P475): "The majority of the Kurds in Syria are originally Turkish Kurds, who left Turkey in the
1920s in order to escape the harsh repression of the Kurds in that country." So, changing "The majority" to "A portion" is at least misleading. The page is protected so I was not able to modify it myself. New Aramean (talk) 21:45, 14 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Fixed the inaccuracy. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 00:23, 15 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  One sentence is falsely presented 

message: Hello all,
I'd like to raise a concern regarding a statement in the article asserting that "The majority of Syrian Kurds are originally Turkish Kurds who have crossed the border during different events in the 20th century." This claim, solely supported by a single, weak source with limited coverage, warrants a closer look.
The credibility of a claim of this nature hinges on robust evidence. The current claim is backed by a solitary source that appears to be inadequately substantiated. A single, unsupported source does not adequately establish a generalization about the origins of Syrian Kurds. (And there has been issues with this bit of text before, it is quite a serious claim.)
Furthermore, it's vital to recognize that the provided source appears to be confined to a single page. Attempting to encapsulate the complex origins of a significant population within a single page lacks the depth required to provide a well-rounded understanding. For such a significant claim, it is imperative that we gather a diverse array of well-established sources. This includes consulting in-depth studies and scholarly works that delve into the complexities of Kurdish migration and settlement.
In light of these considerations, I propose a reevaluation of the claim in the article. A more comprehensive and well-supported analysis of Syrian Kurdish origins would greatly enhance the accuracy and depth of the information we present. Krqftan (talk) 05:03, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The sentence has a reliable source, so it is not unsupported.--Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 05:34, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not good enough. I viewed the book. A singular page with just some sentances about this topic. It's not enough to back up this serious claim. Many might've crossed the border, but definitely not "a majority". This undermines the significance of the then Syrian Kurds. You can not possibly think this. If the claim is deemed true, then provide with more sources.  Krqftan (talk) 05:48, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you saying that the sentence is not supported by the source? Can you ad the text from the book here? --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 06:14, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
replies: text:  I think he meant that there is only one source supporting the sentence, especially with the lack of studies supporting that claim. So i suggest to add "According to Youssef M. Choueiri, The majority of Syrian Kurds are originally Turkish Kurds who have crossed the border during different events in the 20th century."Sulaimanl (talk) 18:06, 13 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Questioning Unsupported Claim about Syrian Kurdish Origins