Talk:Seventy (Latter Day Saints)

message: Although it could be argued that after 1936, when the Seventy were placed under Stake control, that the Seventy became lower than High Priests, but before that time Seventies were generally thought of as holding a higher priesthood office and responsibility.
Note the following -
"There is nothing in the Doctrine and Covenants upon which an idea can be based that the High Priests have precedence over the Seventies."  (Brigham Young, Deseret News, 6 June 1877)
"The High Priests possessed the High Priesthood; but the Seventies possesed the High Priesthood and the Apostleship which was the highest power on the earth or in the Church."  (Parley P. Pratt, Seventies Record, Nauvoo, Book B, 25 January, 1846, p. 226)
See also Joseph Smith's letter to Orson Hyde, 14th May 1840, History of the Church 4:129.
There is much more substantiation on this point, but this I hope will suffice.
--Tobey 16:03, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Seventy lower than High Priests?

message: There's to be a mistake .. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.227.206.232 (talk • contribs) 19:18, 24 May 2007
:If you were to sign your name, and explain your reasoning about this "mistake", perhaps someone could help you. I just looked at the article closely and found no reference to "15 apostles." but my guess would be that if there were such a reference, it would refer to the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, who, though they are now 14 in number, all hold the priesthood office of "apostle." Does that help? --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable 23:46, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: 15 apostles?

message: There's been a short series of reverts around the phrase "By the time Joseph Smith was martyred".
I confess that this is not a cut-and-dried issue.
Here's Merriam-Webster's definition
1 : a person who voluntarily suffers death as the penalty of witnessing to and refusing to renounce a religion
2 : a person who sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle
Using these definitions, it would seem obvious that Joseph Smith was a martyr.  But, to be more precise, he was a Mormon martyr.
To be called a martyr is laudatory.  To be called a heretic is derogatory.  What's the difference?  Whether the religion and/or principles are accepted as orthodox.
And this is what makes use of the word "martyr" POV.  From a Mormon POV, Smith is obviously a martyr.  From a secular POV, he is also a martyr but no more so than other heretics who are also martyred for their religion.  From the POV of a "mainstream" Christian (e.g. a Catholic, Orthodox or Protestant), Smith was not a martyr, just a heretic.  
Thus, to sidestep this whole POV dispute, it's easier to just avoid using the word "martyr" in this context.
--Richard 07:07, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that the word is best to be avoided. Saying he was "killed" or even "murdered" is less problematic and just as accurate. –SESmith 08:13, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Martyrdom of Joseph Smith

message: I have made a few changes to this page, all in the Presidency of the Seventy section. I have placed by the name of each Presidency member the date of their call to the presidency, and the source for each date, which makes it verifiable. I have also changed Elder Tingey's title from "Presiding President" to "Senior President". While it is true that the most senior presidency member presides over the other six, he is defined as the Senior president in the following sentence: "Elder Carlos E. Asay will serve as Senior President of the Seventy." (Found in Ensign, Sept. 1995 p. 74) Further, note this sentence: "With Elder Asay’s release, Elder L. Aldin Porter will become the senior member of the Presidency of the Seventy." (Found in Ensign, Aug. 1996 p. 71) Consequently, the changes have been made. Thanks. --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable 23:47, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Changes just made 

message: I wonder who the first German Seventy was -- Elder Uchtdorf? -- pne (talk) 12:59, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  First German Seventy? 

message: In attempting to add information about Elder Richard J. Maynes's call to the Presidency, I ran into an error with the formatting for the reference, and don't know how to fix it. HELP! Thanks. --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable (talk) 08:39, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Someone (I'm not sure who) removed the sources I had listed for the changes made on February 11, 2012. Rather than removing them, they should have been fixed. Could someone with more WP experience than me please reinclude those references and fix the problem rather than removing them again? Thanks. --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable (talk) 03:19, 13 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I suppose it's probably just a different interpretation of when things are "official". From my reading of LDS scriptures, one couldn't really say that the change is completely "official" until it is ratified by the common consent of church membership. That generally happens in a General Conference meeting. However, the change can certainly be implemented prior to common consent having been given. This is probably what has happened here, which changes the common consent bit into more of a formality or technicality than anything else. (Fixed the ref, by the way.) Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:31, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

text: As there has been some dispute over the date of Maynes's call, I looked it up using a google search. The Church's official website reports the date of the change as January 20, 2012. So that is the date that should be used, regardless of what the LDS Church News reports. Post here before reverting. --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable (talk) 18:35, 2 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Richard J. Maynes reference 

message: For the LDS section of this article, when August 1 arrives, we will want to make the following changes where it talks about the Presidency of the Seventy:
:Jay E. Jensen will be released from the Presidency of the Seventy and as President of the North America Northeast Area.
:Donald L. Hallstrom will preside over the North America Northeast Area, succeeding Jay E. Jensen.
:Craig C. Christensen, newly called to the Presidency of the Seventy, succeeding Jay E. Jensen, will preside over the Idaho and North America Central Areas, succeeding Donald L. Hallstrom.
Thank you. --Jgstokes-We can disagree without being disagreeable (talk) 06:04, 12 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  August 2012 changes. 

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thread_title:  External links modified