Talk:Fettes College

message: Is the stuff in the 'Culture and Atmosphere' section vandalism? ZephyrAnycon 21:14, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: To be honest I doubt it is. I go to a private school as well and there is often articles in the press about friction between us and local state school. The press seem to love scandels from 'posh' schools. Whether or not it is included in the article is debatable. --coolmark18 20:23, 10 April 2006 (GMT)
As a pupil at Fettes I think I can confirm the previous point of view. There is very little tension whatsoever: there have been a few minor incidents over the past five years I've been in attendance, but no more than a dozen and none at all serious. Furthermore, I would say the tension exists only within "select" groups at each school. On the whole, relations are very good and, if not close, peaceable.
- Scuddworthy 15:24, 17 April 2006 (GMT)
I'm a former fettes pupil (left 1998) and I have still have siblings there. I also disagree with the comments about drug and alchohol use. Obviously all teenagers misbehave, but from speaking to friends who attended other schools, I think it's simply not true that Fettes has a problem on this front. [unsigned]
The article is currently one-sided. For example, the comments about the use of "public school" in Scotland have been removed, and it has been turned into a glowing advert for the place. A number of incidents have got in the press and the teacher hoax (I don't know if she claimed leukaemia, but it was certainly some terminal illness) certainly did.
I am told by people who used to go to Broughton High School that some of them would be chased or attacked while taking a short cut across Fettes' grounds. It obviously upset the school, since they've put up razor wire at the Ferry Road end. Obviously they don't like Piltonites!
Remember folks - this is a two sided article. Not advertising copy. Fettes comes in for a lot of criticism, both in the press, and within Edinburgh. --MacRusgail 19:01, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think a mention of the recent Youtube video should also get a mention. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by MacRusgail (talk • contribs) 17:20, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Vandalism

message: Sean Connery, who was the original actor to portray James Bond in the cinema, worked as a milkman's delivery boy in his youth. One of the places on his route is said to have been Fettes College
- Definitely needs a citation; the Sean Connery article repeats this 'fact', also uncited.  Given that he was from Fountainbridge, it must have been a helluva big milk round. --duncan 19:02, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Given the amount of people in this town who claimed to have had Sean Connery deliver their milk, he must have been the world's most hard-working milkman. Lurker oi! 18:52, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sean Connery 

message: I've removed most of the names from the article - basically, anyone without a linked article to corroborate their existence or plausibility. It's a bit drastic, but a lot of nonsense was creeping in... and our net of notability is broad enough that if someone was significant enough to be noted as a former pupil, they're probably notable enough for an article. Shimgray | talk | 23:27, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alumni 

message: This section doesn't sound very encyclopaedic. I suggest taking some of this information and adding it to the history section, as simple lists of information are not highly regarded on Wikipedia. Lurker oi! 18:39, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Culture and Atmosphere 

message: Noremacnomis seems to be reverting/making changes, then making a bunch of minor changes in the hope his major changes don't get noticed. On a scale of one to ten, how thick does he think we are? Come on Noremacnomis, this is a well-known tactic and will not escape notice! Lurker oi! 18:41, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comical editing patterns 

message: It makes little sense to delete just two years of academic results. It would be better to delete all the academic results - but that just leaves the material about a former headmaster, drugs etc. Surely leaving the academic results in gives a bit more balance? Dormskirk 21:40, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No it doesn't leave any "balance". What you put in was basically advertising. My problem is that I know a little too much about how these schools massage their exam figures. For one, they poach all the bright pupils from the state sector to boost the figures, and give them scholarships, and for another, they exclude certain people from sitting exams (usually the rich, thick ones who pay the fees!)--MacRusgail 11:08, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

text: I think it is probably better to compare it with other Scottish private schools. The figures as per Scottish schools in general don't really take into consideration some of the tactics that private schools use to boost their figures.--MacRusgail 15:28, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Are you comfortable therefore, for this purpose, that independent schools and private shools are roughly the same thing, and we can therefore state that "Fettes is regularly placed first in the list of Scottish Independent Schools by the Sunday Times"? Dormskirk 15:44, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Okay - just as long as the whole article doesn't become too "gushing". --MacRusgail 16:04, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Thanks. I will amend. Dormskirk 16:10, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Academic results

message: The extract from Sir William Fettes' will was tagged as needing a source since March. None was provided, so the extract was removed. Do not reinstate this material without adding a citation. Lurker (talk · contribs) 16:43, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please cite sources 

message: An important Scottish school with a consistent top five ranking in the league tables. The alumni include Tony Blair and three senior members of the British Cabinet (Chancellors of the Exchequer and Foreign Secretaries.) A good start at referencing. Very close to a B but rather too many lists rather than prose sections. Dahliarose 09:50, 10 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Assess

message: Perhaps we ought get a category for Old Fettesians? --Counter-revolutionary 21:12, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: there is one: Category:Fettes alumni Dormskirk 22:04, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah, surely Old F.... is better? Thanks anyhow, --Counter-revolutionary 02:35, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that Category:Old Fettesians would be more correct. It does not seem to be possible to move categories on wiki so the only way to do this is to set up the new category and re-categorise all the relevant biographies. I am happy to try this Dormskirk (talk) 13:42, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It can be moved, but due to the wonders of wikipedia, it is also a fairly bureaucratic process. You need to have a poll on the page, or take it to "categories to be moved". --MacRusgail (talk) 13:53, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for this MacRusgail. I have now re-categorised all the relevant biographies. Hopefully an administrator will delete the old category: I have requested this is on its talk page Dormskirk (talk) 14:51, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Category

message: There seems to be a quite distinct bias towards fairly non-notable (by the scope of this article) but recent events towards the end of the History section. I'd propose simply removing it, beginning at "In 2002...", bearing in mind that whilst there are news citations provided, the guideline given in WP:NOTE is "A topic is presumed to be notable if it has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject." (emphasis mine) Thoughts? Angus Lepper(T, C, D) 23:18, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: "Recentism" isn't a proper word. Surely there's a better term for it. --MacRusgail (talk) 16:50, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It may not be listed in many dictionaries; nor will many computer science jargon terms — but I'll still use them in context. Since the term has currency in Wikipedia, the use of the term is fine. However, the term used is irrelevant, particularly as my actual message (outside of the header) gave a description of what I meant, for the sake of those who hadn't encountered it before. Do you have any comment on my actual proposal, rather than a meta-discussion on how I chose to couch it? Angus Lepper(T, C, D) 16:59, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's a horrible, and recent neologism, at best. Surely there must be a better term. There is one that's based on a French word, but I can't remember it just now. --MacRusgail (talk) 16:59, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If you think there is too much material about recent events, shorten it, rather than removing all reference to events which took place after 2002. Lurker (said · done) 15:48, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: For what it is worth, I am not aware that any of the events quoted (either in 2002 or 2007) received coverage in more than one publication - if that is relevant in determining whether the coverage was significant Dormskirk (talk) 23:42, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

text: It's not that there is too much recent material—it's that [I feel that] an undue bias is being placed upon the notability of events simply because they are recent. I could not find evidence of any wide coverage of the events in question, and this is a criterion for notability. Angus Lepper(T, C, D) 19:02, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recentism in History section 

message: I was startled to read that Sir William Fettes intended to establish a school for poor children and orphans. How and when did Fettes become fee-paying, please (and such high fees, too)? The Fettes website doesn't mention poor children or orphans. Misterhig (talk) 15:00, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, it wouldn't! This is not an uncommon origin for private schools. See here for starters.--MacRusgail (talk) 16:12, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Transition 

message: I'm well aware that there's a drugs scandal on the go just now there. Can I suggest that we keep things in perspective. All schools have drug problems, it's just that in this case, like that of Gordonstoun particularly, as a posh school, it hits the headlines more often than it would in a not so posh one. I'm sure it happens as often at Broughton High School, just over the road - just that the papers can't be bothered writing on it.
The article should reflect the fact that there are periodic problems with drugs (cannabis mostly, which is hardly heroin), but we should not give over a huge chunk of the article to the ongoing issue.--MacRusgail (talk) 21:41, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Druggies 

message: At present there is a discussion relating to the renaming of :Category:Old Fettesians. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at this discussion page. Please note that the discussion is not a majority vote so contributions should be based on Wikipedia policies and independent sources. Cjc13 (talk) 12:59, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category:Old Fettesians rename 

message: Extracted " Historically the school environment was harsh and strictly disciplinarian hence Fettes College provided a fertile recruitment ground for the military officer corps and many boys went on to serve in the Colonial Service and Intelligence Service overseas. "
This was added to the main article but was deleted by Betty Logan as unsourced. Intelligence information by it's very nature is always unsourced. But the facts exist and remain. Those in the know would know and those not in the know would not know.86.132.241.46 (talk) 11:47, 18 August 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: As per Wikipedia:Verifiability, "Even if you're sure something is true, it must be verifiable before you can add it". Therefore I will be removing it again, and I would appreciate it if you don't restore it without complying with Wikipedia's policies. Betty Logan (talk) 12:15, 18 August 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: To Betty Logan::
Did you attend Fettes College?
Have you ever worked for the Intelligence Service?
Have you ever been in the military?
Have you ever been in the Diplomatic Service?
Have you ever been in the Fettes School Library?
If your answer is no to all the above questions then you ought to stop undoing my edits.
86.132.241.46 (talk) 12:36, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

text: This may well be true, but it can't be included in the article unless there is a reliable source. If it is the kind of information which by its nature "cannot be allowed to be sourced" then it still cannot be included. -- Alarics (talk) 18:18, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

text: My school also had (and still has) a shooting range, armoury (with obvious steel doors) which contained a full range of arms. It also had an active cadet service for Army, Navy and Air cadets. The school prospectus and annual magazines used to refer to such in glowing terms. If you wish to add the information, then the sources  will not be too difficult to come by. (Incidentally, along side the reference books and works of classic fiction, the library also contained various military/strategy/heroism books, all of which were of interest to the populous, especially those who went into the forces. I strongly doubt whether Fettes was unique in having the same facilities as many other public schools. - SchroCat (talk) 19:29, 18 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fettes College ''("The School for spies?")'' and recruitment by the Intelligence Services 

message: I have heard it said that Fettes has been a good source of Military officers and many of the former pupils end up in the military or the Diplomatic Service or in politics ? Can someone please comment on this? I know the last Labour Prime Minister Tony Blair was a boarder for five years at Fettes College , at Arniston House (which later became an all-girl boarding house) under Housemaster "Bob" Roberts MA(Cantab) who then went on to be Headmaster at Shrewsbury College? 109.156.205.111 (talk) 13:33, 8 September 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Wouldn't that be equally true of many "top" schools? What is it that you want to change in the article? Isn't it sufficiently apparent from the "Notable Old Fettesians" section of the article what kind of people have been educated there? -- Alarics (talk) 13:50, 8 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Main Careers of Fettes pupils

message: Have you noticed that the article is back to exam pass rates (which are pauchled by private schools anyway) and not about scandals? -MacRùsgail (talk) 10:27, 30 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: The shills are back in town

message: Has been tagged. Could have an interesting section on the school's history, but instead resorts to advertising.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.148.18.220 (talk) 16:42, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Drive-by tagging is unhelpful - please feel free to improve the article if there are problems with it. I have added an extra paragraph to the history myself to get things going. Dormskirk (talk) 22:43, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I have added quite a bit more. Hopefully this is now sufficiently interesting and encyclopedic. Dormskirk (talk) 17:27, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Advert tag

message: "Fettes College has produced many judges, lawyers, diplomats, military officers and politicians. In sport, its most notable alumni are on the rugby pitch. Four Old Fettesians have won the Victoria Cross and one the George Cross."
So basically all this article talks about is military, law and government employees. Why not discuss scientists (one of whom won the FRICKING NOBEL PRIZE!!!), writers, musicians etc?! --2A01:4C8:141A:89CD:1:1:E972:5E99 (talk) 21:19, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: I have added "persons from academia" to the list and would be happy to see it amended further. Dormskirk (talk) 22:04, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alumni POV 

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