Talk:Doula

message: I tagged the opening section of this article for POV issues. Many adjectives used in it are highly subjective, e.g., "experienced" (suggests a uniform level of minimum competence, which cannot be established); "informed" (suggests omnipotence, which is impossible); "in many settings" (weasel words); "assisting the parturient woman during transport from home to hospital or birth center" (suggests this always takes place, which cannot be proven); "nutritious" (highly subjective). 
The second sentence is a confused mess that suggests either all doulas work for six weeks as maids or work for several months under specific circumstances.
I propose a thorough scrubbing of the entire opening section. Dhvrm (talk) 15:47, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The word "informed" in this context is part of the phrase, "informed choice," http://www.aboutkidshealth.ca/Pregnancy/Informed-Choice-Informed-Consent.aspx?articleID=7569&categoryID=PG-nh2-13 
99.240.253.120 (talk) 03:03, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

text: I think it's insensitive and actually quite ignorant of you to blatantly assume that doulas cannot stop killer meteors from striking the planet. I'm going to assume good faith, however, and presume that you are just ill-informed. If you really think this, though, please provide verifiable third-party sources to back your claim. 69.86.207.10 (talk) 14:04, 26 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neutrality 

message: Should these external links be limited to organizations that help people find doula's rather than links to individual doulas?
:: I think there are FAR too many external links. Wikipedia is not a link directory. I will remove some in a few days unless there are concerns about doing that. I think we should three or four. If people want to find doulas they can do it via Google Maustrauser 11:17, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Nobody has complained so I am going to delete many of the external links as per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:External_links Maustrauser 00:13, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: At present there are (a) way too many links and (b) lots of links to help people find doulas. I actually believe even that is not a function of this encyclopedia. Links to sites that have considerable information on what doulas are, etc., that go well beyond mere directories of them, seem far more appropriate. For example, the link to the UK nonprofit association would fit pretty clearly, while the site on How to Find Doulas in Los Angeles is unnecessary (and easy for anyone to find by using a search engine, anyway). Lawikitejana 02:27, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

text:  Hello, I'd like to add a link to some information on training as a doula in Australia - the information listed on Wikipedia is all US based and it would be great to have some resources covering other parts of the world. I also have a very busy, free, australia-wide doula directory, which people may want to look at if they have decided they would like to hire a doula after reading this. The links are: http://www.bellybelly.com.au/articles/birth/how-to-become-a-doula-in-australia and http://www.bellybelly.com.au/find-a-doula. I hope any of those are suitable and Australia will be able to be represented - Doulas are growing very popular here. Thanks. KellyBZ 07:30, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello, KellyBZ - I definitely appreciate your desire to contribute, but promotion of a particular website is prohibited per WP:EL and WP:SPAM. If the website has unique information to add a worldwide perspective to this article, I would recommend incorporating this information and possibly citing your information as a source, provided the website meets the reliability criteria. RJASE1  Talk  07:38, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

text:  Nope. That's paranoia. I remove links that do not meet the policy set at WP:EL Gillyweed 21:39, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  External Links 

message: I just did a little bit of work around here, like adding sections, wikifying, and random fixes. However, I am a bit uneasy about the whole section that is now under "Doulas in North America"; even though it's cited, this might be too much text to just take from another source. Anyway a lot of it is redundant, as the work of doulas has already been described. If anyone has some input, I would appreciate it. Otherwise, I am probably going to take out much of this section soon. Thanks, romarin [talk ] 03:16, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fixing up the article 

message: It seems to me that both the article and the professional doula organizations are confused about the origin of the work "doula"; in Greek (which is my mother tongue) it really means "slave". You might say that this is how the word is used in modern Greek only, but the fact is that the word "doula" is derived from the ancient Greek word "douleia" ("δουλεία") which does mean, without any doubt, "slavery". Indeed, the word "douleia" may be the only word in ancient Greek that describes the concept of slavery. I think it is unfortunate that this body of professionals who indeed offer services which can be extremely helpful for some people, chose this word to describe themselves. 164.143.240.34 12:40, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  etymology 

message: As noted before, the "Doulas in North America" section is in need of rewriting. As it was, it read like an advertisement or a magazine article. As a start, I did the following:
*Removed a few dead links.
*Added a "not verified" template, as the statistics presented in the section do not appear in the cited magazine article; nor should this article be considered a reliable source anyway.
*Removed the rest of the section directing to search engines and guiding career seekers, per Wikipedia guidelines.
--128.139.104.168 23:30, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  My changes 

message: I added some links for Australia a little while ago and have only just received word that I did the wrong thing....I thought anyone cold add to it.....please accept my apologies. The link I would like to add are to the DOULA REGISTER www.doularegister.com this is run by a non-profit orgnisation in New South Wales, Australia and people work on a voluntary basis for them. It is like DONA in the USA. They also run the only free standing birth centre www.naturalbirth.org.au They run courses for doulas but they do not make money as everything is put back into the birth centre. 202.7.184.205 03:08, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Hi. You didn't do the wrong thing at all. BE BOLD is one of the principles of Wikipedia. What you do need to do is ensure that the links meet with WP:EL. If they don't then they are deleted. Sometimes there is a fine line between what is considered acceptable and what isn't. If your site didn't have the .com suffix it would probably be more likely to survive. Gillyweed 04:13, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  ADDING NEW INFORMATION 

message: The benefits section mentioned a study of doula only vs childbirth only mothers interviewed afterwards. It was too focused on the fact the classes were Lamaze. Such Bradley vs Lamaze slants are inappropriate.
--Ralphie (talk) 11:58, 25 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleaned up BENEFITS section 

message: See . --Una Smith (talk) 16:16, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yep, it's because you haven't added them yet!! :-) 65.112.197.16 (talk) 00:21, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Doula as community health worker

message: I've removed :Image:Doula.jpg from the article. It could be a picture of anyone (a doctor, a nurse, a midwife, a spouse, a friend) so it adds nothing to the article. It's a nice pic for a family photo album or even a userpage, but according to the image use policy, "These images are considered self-promotion and the Wikipedia community has repeatedly reached consensus to delete such images." Kafziel Complaint Department 19:01, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pic removed 

message: Doulas are often trained and experienced in childbirth. They provide continuous physical, emotional, and informational support before labor, during labor, birth and the immediate postpartum period. A doula's goal is to help the woman have a safe and satisfying experience, as the woman defines it.
The concept of a Doula is not new. A woman supporting another woman through labor is a tradition that goes back many years in all cultures. Since many of us do not live in close knit communities where our sisters, mothers, aunts, and friends are there to support us through pregnancy, childbirth and motherhood, these events can be scary and can make you feel lost if you have to experience them aloe.
A doula helps fill this gap by providing support to the woman and her support system throughout the childbearing year. A doula does not replace the support system, instead she helps support them so that they can focus on loving and encouraging the laboring woman. Supports need support to!
Doulas also serve as a source of information during pregnancy, labor and birth. A doula assists families in gathering information about their pregnancy, labor and the options available for delivery. Another important role of the doula is providing continuous emotional reassurance, physical comfort such as massages, and a tens machine and trusting in the woman's ability to birth her baby.
The acceptance of doulas in maternity care is growing rapidly with the recognition of their important contribution to the improved physical outcomes and emotional well-being of mothers, partners and infants. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shachybd (talk • contribs) 23:05, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Parts of that sound OK though a good part sounds like opinion and not fact such as "Since many of us do not live in close knit communities where our sisters, mothers, aunts, and friends are there to support us through pregnancy, childbirth and motherhood, these events can be scary and can make you feel lost if you have to experience them aloe." I would also want to make sure that anything that you add is well cited. Drumzandspace2000 (talk) 23:21, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  I would like to change the information to this: does any one have any objection? 

message: Isn't a DAI more like a Midwife then a Doula? Drumzandspace2000 (talk) 12:03, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  India 

message: I am done edit warring with Drumzandspace2000 regarding his/her continued undo's of my legitimate additions to this page. I would request that he or she stop his/her inappropriate behavior or will seek other redress. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Docimastic (talk • contribs) 05:23, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I am sorry that you feel that way, however I have in the past removed your edits and others as the organizations listed are global or US wide and not regional ones. I have also tried in the past to keep the organizations listed to the larger/better know ones. My comments the last time I removed your edit may not have been worded the best they could have and I am sorry if that caused you to be upset. Drumzandspace2000 (talk) 13:07, 23 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit Warring 

message: Tried to base it on pubmed stuff and books on google books from the more reliable publishers. Too much use of the WSJ and NYT for criticisms though, it'd be nice to have something from pubmed. WLU (t) (c) Wikipedia's rules:simple/complex 17:03, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Wow. --Anthonyhcole (talk) 19:01, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Substantial rewrite 

message: Why is ALICE still listed on this page? I have removed it before only to have it put back. I understand that for a long time they provided Doula training however looking at the reference and also over http://www.alace.org in general I see no mention that they provide doula trainings any more. It does mention "Childbirth Educator Training and Certification Program" which is not a doula training. I will wait a while before making the required edit so others can way in on this.Drumzandspace2000 (talk) 12:14, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: See . WLU (t) (c) Wikipedia's rules:simple/complex 13:02, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: It says nothing on that page about offering Doula trainings. It says "the ALACE Childbirth Educator Training and Certification Program" The only mention of Doulas on that page is not about trainings or classes. I have removed it again from the page if someone has a reference to show that Alice is still around and still doing Doula trainings please chime in Drumzandspace2000 (talk) 09:29, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  ALICE 

message: The also only provide childbirth education not doula training. As above I will make the edit to remove this unless someone knows otherwise. Drumzandspace2000 (talk) 12:53, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Oops, you are correct. I had thought Ballen verified it but Lamaze was only mentioned in a table discussing labour support. My bad. WLU (t) (c) Wikipedia's rules:simple/complex 13:11, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lamaze International 

message: hello.
i have not edited pages before, or posted in here, so i apologize if i break some sort of protocol. i did not edit the article for this very reason, and instead opted to post in here.
source #1 for the article (Balas, M. C.; Gale, M.; Kagan, S. H. (2004). "Delirium doulas: An innovative approach to enhance care for critically ill older adults". Critical care nurse 24 (4): 36–46. . edit), which is referenced 11 times is simply NOT about doulas in the way that this article is structured. this article presents doulas as lay-people that assist in pregnancy, labor and post-pardum scenarios: all true. the source is NOT about this role.
the source article is about lay-people assisting with dementia patients: ONLY. it never mentions children, or child-birth.
using the article as a source is find under the "other uses" of doulas heading...but to reference the article FIRST, and ELEVEN times (that means TEN times for things that the source does NOT support) is awful.
this really needs to be fixed.
nicholas
:I agree and have informed the Nursing and Medicine WikiProjects. Thincat (talk) 20:40, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The article was used to support the pronunciation and it also contains the following line "A doula (doó la) is traditionally described as a layperson who offers physical, emotional, and informational support to women in labor and the women’s partners." so it supports the definition at least. Other examples of content in the article do appear to be supported by this reference, as it contains towards the end a section called "Use of Doulas in the Obstetric Setting" which is a few paragraphs long. I assume most of the references came from here rather than the parts of the article on delirium and ICU etc. Lesion (talk) 21:55, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  source number one is a SERIOUS issue. 

message: This article needs to make up its mind about whether a doula is a midwife or not. These sentences suggest that a doula is a midwife:
″A doula is a nonmedical person who assists a woman before, during, and/or after childbirth, as well as her spouse and/or family, by providing physical assistance, and emotional support.″
″This may be due to doulas providing intermittent assistance being experienced midwives who focused less on social support and more on medical aspects of delivery.″
However, this sentence suggests that she isn't:
″Continuous support during labour provided by doulas (along with variety of groups such as nurses, midwives, other hospital staff, partners, family or friends) have been associated with improved outcomes for both mothers and children.″
So, which is it?
74.71.71.165 (talk) 16:20, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Obviously, if there are differences, a doula is not the same as a midwife. Some doulas may have undergone training as a midwife and may have some experience in the profession, but choose to work as a doula (at least that's how I understand it; I'm new to the subject), and the sentence in question doesn't say they're the same (just that there is some overlap in people, but not necessarily roles). There are clearly at least three crucial differences between midwives and doulas: First, the required education, as the profession of doula is not regulated and the title can be used by anyone (as the article points out), second, the fact that midwives (primarily) provide medical services and doulas do not (generally speaking), and third, a doula proves post-birth assistance, which a midwive does not. A doula therefore provides services more like nannies in part. However, midwives, doulas, nannies/maids, night nurses, baby/newborn nurses, babysitters, au-pairs and mother's helpers all provide somewhat different services connected with pregnancy, childbirth, childcare and support for the parents. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 14:45, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I deleted the second cited sentence ("This may be due to...") since it was poorly worded and seemed to imply that doulas were midwives. 2604:2000:EFC0:2:F4EC:C71F:9AE0:D5FB (talk) 18:32, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Doula = Midwife? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I think we need a better image for the lead. This one looks too much like a "sick" woman in a hospitalised setting. A doula is helping laboring women to work through the labor pains in a positive emotion. If I had time I'd look myself for a better picture, hopefully there is one in Wikimedia Commons. EMsmile (talk) 15:12, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Replaced the image to be more representative of a doula's work during labor. 9H48F (talk) 19:12, 13 April 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:  I love the new image that you have chosen, 9H48F - thank you! Much better than the one that was there before! EMsmile (talk) 12:52, 20 April 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Need better image in the lead

message: I have heard that in 2022, doulas will have some form of state-sponsored standard within the Commonwealth of Virginia. Is there a way the article can reflect that on the next rework? 2601:846:C100:2D80:BD81:43F1:5D07:52A9 (talk) 09:55, 31 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the comment, I added Virginia to the list of states offering Medicaid reimbursement. Potentially, this section could be expanded to add details of the state programs along with section subheaders for each country discussed. 9H48F (talk) 14:54, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Doulas and the Commonwealth of Virginia 

message: The lead states they are 'trained professionals' but in the next paragaph it sais they may not have any formal training so which one is it? 2A00:23C7:5AD0:8F01:6483:E9A9:EDB:ABD3 (talk) 03:59, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Confusing article 

message: The article claims that abortion doulas exist in the United Kingdom but havent provided a source. This should be removed as this is very unlikely. 2A00:23C7:5AD0:8F01:6483:E9A9:EDB:ABD3 (talk) 04:02, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Abortion doula 

message: — Assignment last updated by Jbasnet (talk) 03:13, 15 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title: Wiki Education assignment: SSC198

message: — Assignment last updated by KemiahOwoh (talk) 21:30, 4 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title: Wiki Education assignment: BMSC 4309 Nutritional Biochemistry and Metabolism