Talk:Zen at War

message: Hello my good friends. Warmest New Year greetings! Regarding the issue of alleged mistranslation, may I offer the following anecdote? When I was working as an in-house translator at the largest law firm in Japan during the asset bubble of the late 1980s, I translated the will (last testament) of an American art teacher who had owned a large plot of land in central Tokyo since the Occupation. Appreciation of land prices had made him a multi-millionaire, but he was now dying of cancer from smoking. The dying man, who I visited at the hospital with the lawyer and paralegal, had wanted to change the executor, who he'd discovered had connections with the yakuza. He was right, for after he died, the will was probated by this executor, who was indeed connected with the yakuza. As translator, my name and address appeared on the document. A mobster came to my home and threatened me with violence. A man from Teikoku Data Bank (the Japanese equivalent of Dunn & Bradstreet) also ominously came to my home asking very personal questions. In the trial, the VERY FIRST issue raised by these proven criminals was my alleged 'mistranslation' of the dead man's will. This was of course hopeless because our very excellent Japanese lawyer (a Tokyo University graduate and former prosecutor) had gone through the translation with a fine-tooth comb, and the governing translation was the Japanese version anyway. So you may be able to see by now what my feelings might be when I read about alleged mistranslations in Professor Victoria's books by people who apparently not only do not understand Japanese but seem to have a predisposition to favor one side in this debate. Although the other side had no chance in their specious allegations about mistranslation in the case of this will, those who detract Professor Victoria's works know that the vast majority of his readers do not understand Japanese and will therefore not be able to confirm the facts one way or the other. And of course, these detractors know that in debates regarding politics and religion, there is no impartial judge and no penalty for making false allegations.  I can not help but recall the Dover Trial regarding Creationism, in this regard. Yes,  I do believe Professor Victoria was a bit harsh at times. I also think most of the people in this 'Zen debate,' including professor Victoria himself, are missing the more fundamental point of how any supposed 'enlightened person' can support a war outside his own homeland under any circumstances. I believe, in the revised edition of his Zen and War, the good professor was more cognizant of this 'elephant in the room.'  I am a former member of Sanbo Kyodan and during the 1970s found and read many old books by well known Zen Roshi. Since most of these old writings by 'Zen masters' supported what can only be described as an aggressive (not defensive) war against China and other Asians, that glorified Emperor worship, anti-Semitism and other forms of what Erich Fromm described as 'social narcissism,' which is nothing more than a collectivistic form of egoism (the very opposite of muga 無我), I was, as a young spiritual seeker in those days, appalled and devastated. For me, Victoria's book lanced a painful, festering wound, and I rejoiced. But while I admire the professor, it by no means I believe he should be exempted from the requirements of rigorous academic standards. But neither should his detractors be exempt. I have NEVER seen any concrete proof of any alleged mistranslations on Victoria's part that impugns the basic thesis of his works - or, for that matter, even proving the specific mistakes he's alleged to have made. The very fact that his detractors snipe around the periphery of his works itself raises suspicions in my own mind about their own agenda. The facts remain: Envious of Western Imperialist powers, Japanese militarists and their passive and cowardly supporters attempted to create their own empire in Asia through acts which not only equalled but surpassed the brutality of Western imperialism. Enlightened Zen 'masters' supported this with FULL knowledge of everything that was going on. I don't believe that any mistranslation on Victoria's part will be revealed that will ever change this basic historical fact, even though it may be disturbing to the followers of the Zen sect. --Gunnermanz (talk) 10:09, 4 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Point of Reference regarding Alleged Translation Errors 

message: It's not clear to me why these links were removed. It seems to me that they provided insightfull further information. Joshua Jonathan (talk) 14:41, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Section blanking

message: This article overuses quotations - see WP:QUOTEFARM. Many of these quotes should be paraphrased in our own writing. Parsecboy (talk) 23:51, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Quotes

message: Briana victoria, Kemmyō Taira Sato, are they notable? Remember we avoid all red links when its about criticism, as well as appraisal. Bladesmulti (talk) 08:14, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Brian Victoria is definitely notable! Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 08:54, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: And other author? Bladesmulti (talk) 10:00, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: For the English Wikipedia, he is notable at this article, since he commented on Brian Victoria. but Brian Victoria himself also is notable because of this book of him; I don't think that a separate article is warranted. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 13:58, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Criticism 

message: In spite of the last comment by , I did create an article on Brian Victoria. This was prompted by a discussion on the Talk page at Soka Gakkai, regarding Victoria's view of Makiguchi. For now the Victoria article is mainly a list of his other books and journal articles from one site, with a link back to this article. Hopefully in the future it can serve as a home for more links and place for general discussion of his contributions and criticism. (I also updated this article with his current affiliation.) --Margin1522 (talk) 10:34, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article on Victoria 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: : Moved from main article Andy Dingley (talk) 14:13, 6 January 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Responses