Talk:Gumball 3000

message: Rapper Xzibit was stopped by the police in the Netherlands for speeding. His drivers license was confiscated but he was allowed to continue, having his copilot drive. Xzibit loses drivers license (in dutch),  Xzibit and the police (picture). Does anyone want to put this in the article?
*It turns out that wasn't Xzibit's real license. Should that be added in? Or should the part about Xzibit losing his license be left out, or left as is? Alexcicio 19:34, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: 2007

message: According to the entry Cannonball, the first Cannonball Run organized by Brock Yates in 1971 was won by Yates and Dan Gurney.  This article (Gumball 3000) states that "Cannonball" Baker and Gurney won the 1971 race.  Another source I have says that Baker died in 1960, 11 years before this race.  Can someone do some research and reconcile these facts?
Doesn't this race involve driving over the speed limits on open roads, thus committing various traffic offenses? David.Monniaux 09:48, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Cannonball

message: For 2007 official sponsor ALK has a site with team blogs and team route tracking. Link is www.rallybird.eu. Useful to include? {Cdev mk 11:55, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: links

message: several paragraphs end with an exclamation mark - unencyclopedic? (clem 19:01, 7 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: style

message: I'm going to take some photos of the start today, 30 April 2006, in The Mall at 15:00. Anybody else going to be there? Edward 10:15, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: 2006

message: Something should be mentioned about the Gumball TV series that was produced for the 2006 rally, that featured competition between Ed Leigh and Alex Roy. Mosdefau2 12:29, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: TV SHOW

message: Article has undergone a broad copy edit for tense, usage, grammar, and punctuation which reduced NPOV.  Current needs include a through wikification, improved/expanded introduction to better explain notability of the event, references/footnotes, and introduction of mainstream media coverage.  While the article could be perceived as NPOV or somewhat of a promotion, that may be due to celebrity participation.  This is a FUN article.  ChicagoPimp 03:55, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: MAJOR UPDATE

message: I have some footage from the start of the 2007 Gumball. I got a great spot right at the start grid and filmed every car starting. 
The footage can be seen at . I also have about 80 high quality photos. I am making a gallery and will post the info here soon.
Also, there are some faults on the Wikipedia page regarding the schedule for 2007 - the Gumballers are not visiting Venice to my knowledge. I got my information from the official programme given out on the day. Ogdini 07:33, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Gumball 2007 London

message: I think its better to call it tour instead of rally. Rally is a competitive sport. Gumball is a road trip and it's not competitive even though some of the drives are obsessed with speed! DimTsi 00:42, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *I was reading here: [] where Max describes it as "a cultural international tour" and I thought: "hmmm, that's the word I was looking for!". I think it's called a rally because it was inspired by rallies but that doesn't nessesarely mean that it is one, right? --- DimTsi 12:29, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *Ooh, all right, I stand corrected! Alexcicio 22:41, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It is still called a rally by its organizers, and it certainly is regarded a race by many/most participants. You can call it "road trip" all you want in a misled effort to justify or cover up this criminal activity, but at the end of the day "Gumball" is just that: an illegal road race. I honestly can't believe some peoples' admiration for this! Olav L 11:01, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *Olav L... I've already explained why it is not a rally and why I think it's a road trip. It's not that I admire anything about it! And I'm certainly NOT trying to justify nor cover up anything! Why would anyone here want to do a thing like that!?! I made this edit (days before the accident happen) calling it a tour because technically speaking it's not a rally! BTW I agree that it's a stupid event. Might be fun, but stupid... and dangerous! - DimTsi 19:18, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Look, "stupid" does not even begin to describe this. You are still way too friendly. I think "criminal" is more to the point. And it is still a race, whatever else you may have read or heard (the official statements of the organizer should not be taken as objective truth, they have something to hide obviously). Perhaps I was a bit too harsh but I do want you to understand this. European public motorways are *not* the private playground of rich, spoilt and bored people with ridiculously fast cars. Please, I lost two family members in an auto accident - not because of this "Gumball" race but the guilty driver certainly fit the profile. It's immoral, they think they are above the law. At the very least, these people's driver's licenses should be confiscated for life. If people are hurt (or even killed...) because of their actions, they should be in prison. Olav L 20:48, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Rally, Race

message: I added a paragraph about the hit-and-run performed by two Gumball drivers in Macedonia, which left one person dead, and the other fighting for her life. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 89.205.1.219 (talk) 17:47, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Gumball 3000 fatality

message: This article is seriously biased. There's hardly anything about it on the controversy and the legality of this monstrosity. Wouter Lievens 09:24, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. This is a terrible article to the point that it reeks of uncritical admiration. Olav L 10:51, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps a criticism section should be added. But I should point out that there are few concrete facts about the tragic accident. It is on the papers today, but stories are conflicting. I should point out that calling the Gumball 3000 a monstrosity is seriously biased, there is plenty of criticism that can be made without resorting to name calling. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.45.180.197 (talk) 12:05, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's why it is called a monstrosity on the talk page, not in the article. Olav L 20:36, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

text: As a start, I changed the introduction of the article to make more clear that this race is controversial, and why. --Cpt. Morgan (Reinoutr) 18:22, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not surprisingly, anonymous editors do not like this in the article . --Cpt. Morgan (Reinoutr) 18:41, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I do like your changes. Perhaps more could be done but I'm not even touching this. Thanks for that first paragraph. Olav L 20:36, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. And yes, much more has to be done, I agree, but it takes a lot of time to find sources for much of the article i am afraid. --Cpt. Morgan (Reinoutr) 00:38, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

text:  I'm not anonymous, and I removed that (see below). --pgk 18:26, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

text: The main thing to remember is wikipedia is trying to remain a neutral point of view and verifiability, not truth is required. If there are multiple reliable sources which give coverage to problems with the rally then they can be used every bit as much as the positive ones. --pgk 18:26, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

text: You'd need to be careful of neutral point of view and no original research, the article should be balanced to give proportionate weight to the points of view from reliable sources. Watching a video compiled to show a certain extreme and then concluding (and writing about) that as generally representative would be original research and would be watching a video of hour upon hour of safe driving by some rally entrants and concluding therefore that everyone drives like my mother. --pgk 18:18, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Bias?

message: I've added the unreferenced tag to the page since although there is lots of references to this years event and the incident with Morley, the previous years seem mostly unreferenced as do the "winners" sections, not to mention reading that a fan site in places rather than an encyclopedia article. We might need to prune this back. --pgk 08:33, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Unreferenced

message: It was in the 2003 Gumball I believe. That Team Polizei Alexander Roy drove his Bentley Continental GT known as the "Interception" I believe. It wasn't the BMW M3.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.157.116.36 (talk) 17:49, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: A misprint I believe

message: I made this revert because it introduced a large amount of unreferenced information and broke several references in the process. Please feel free to re-add this material somewhere when it has been verified. - Mgm|(talk) 12:04, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I've removed what looks like a similar amount. Much is unencyclopedic in tone, not backed by references and quite frankly reads like advertiging bumph. I started adding  tags but it soon became apparent they'd litter most of the lede. Also remember what the lede actually is for. --81.104.39.44 (talk) 21:08, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

text: No you reverted someone else's edits, mine in no way affect your referencing. There is a severe problem with the version you restored and policy such as WP:NPOV and WP:NOR. Try reading what you restored, it's makes most of the lede little more than a puff piece for the rally, not an encyclopedia article.--81.104.39.44 (talk) 18:51, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Revert

message: "Still, Gumball HQ has never encouraged to speed, or to endanger the life of others, even, some drivers have seen themselves banned, or suspended, because of poor driving skills. But if you really want to point out the fact that there are accidents, you should also point out that never, one has been killed during the rally. The worst accident to date is Torquenstein's, with the Viper. The co-pilot wasn't injured, but Torquenstein was hit at the head and broke his shoulder. As it has been said, driving fast and arriving first isn't the main goal of the rally, it's only about having fun and getting the chance to show what your car can do in the end, at a given place, given time (e.g. racetracks)."   -----I do see that this was before the "incident" in 2007, but I'm new to wikipedia and have a question.  Should talk pages be updated/addressed for factual accuracy?  If not, its still interesting...  63.249.56.94 (talk) 07:25, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, thought I was signed in.... 63.249.56.94 is Cmiych (talk) 07:27, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

text: Talk pages are for discussing how to improve the article. We don't go back to fix accuracy issues, of course if someone makes a mistake during a discussion you are free to post a response pointing out the mistake. As you note in that instance such a response wouldn't be valid since the post was accurate given the time. --82.7.40.7 (talk) 13:42, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: interesting

message: I reremoved:
"The Gumball 3000 has become extremely popular in recent years, and has become a successful commercial enterprise. Earning many corporate sponsors, countries often bid to host a part of the event, keen to harness the tourism it attracts. In 2006 the event included Phuket, Thailand into the route, in order to attract tourism back to the region following the disastrous Tsunami; and in 2008 the event was invited by the Chinese Government to finish in Beijing during the Olympic Games - as one of the official cultural events celebrating the Olympics. That same year the Gumball route incorporated Pyongyang, North Korea as a result of working with the United Nations and the various governments in the Korean Peninsular in an attempt to use the multinational and multicultural element of the event to promote "friendship" in the region."
The source given says nothing about popularity (extreme or otherwise) or commercial success. It says nothing about countries "bidding" to host part of the event. It says nothing about attracting tourism to the region. Says nothing about being invited by the Chinese Government. Says nothing about the united nations to promote "friendship" in the region. There maybe some usuable stuff in there but that's probably mainly warranted in the detail on the relevant year.
I will however add a paragraph about having received unusual permission from North Korea because that is pretty significant. --82.7.40.7 (talk) 18:34, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/gumball-3000-forum/53888-gumball-article-sunday-times-8th-may.html In reference to the success of the company, extract from the Sunday Times. J4k3yyy (talk) 15:26, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well as a post on a messageboard of the article it's far from ideal but I do have vague memories of reading such an article so I'll assume that it's a verbatim reproductin of the real thing, we couldn't use that itself as a link per Wikipedia:ELNEVER point 1 which prohibits linking to copyright violations which this is, that forum won't have permission from the sunday times to reproduce the article. That however wouldn't prevent us sourcing it to the print publication we needn't have a web link. Being largely a lifestyle feature piece with large chunks direct quotes from the people involved, the quality of fact checking is likely to be low, and I'd be dubious as to the significance of this piece. --82.7.40.7 (talk) 19:21, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  In reference to your point, the majority of the articles that cite the 2007 accident are tabloid press sensational articles that are equally incorrect in regards to the facts of what actually took place, they could even be conveyed as being damaging to the company image in the way they're currently being conveyed here. J4k3yyy (talk) 15:15, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  I haven't gone through them, I certainly know there are mainstream press articles which are not features or based on interviews with "interested" parties which cover the incident and they are certainly preferable to such sources. If the company feels there is a serious issue they can raise that with the wikimedia foundation, though they generally stay out of content issues they can usually advise and point people in the right direction. The OTRS system can also enable them to contact volunteers who can help to ensure the basic policies are adhered to. Issues can also be raised here but try and be specific (i.e. not "we don't like it", more like if an source doesn't reasonably support the claim, is unbalanced in coverage compared to the prevelance of viewpoint (i.e. a violation of WP:NPOV, or is not reliable within the standards point out with enough details that it can be dealt with effectively. If you (assuming you have no conflict of interest on such matters) have issues feel free to edit to make sure they are reliable sources and wikipedias content meets neutral point of view, No original research and verifiability. As a personal perspective see the talk section above on this page titled "2007 Nick Morley crash with 2 dead in Macedonia" the user signing themselves as "82.7.39.174" is me before my IP address changed over last Christmas. I raise a fair few issues with how this aspect has been presented in the past and have done my best to keep it fairly balanced, you can also take a look at this historic link which is contemporary with that above discussion where I try and get more people to keep an eye on that to make sure it doesn't get out of hand. I hope you can see my interest in this is trying to keep this balanced as an encyclopedia article. --82.7.40.7 (talk) 21:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

text:  As another note you can also raise questions about the overall reliability of sources at the reliable sources noticeboard where you should be able to get some additional eyes on if certain sources meet our standards. --82.7.40.7 (talk) 08:39, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Remove unsourced paragraph

message: The route did indeed get changed, and Dallas was dropped. So whoever changed it back to Dallas, get up to date.
http://www.gumball3000.com/blog/gumball-2012  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.227.24.9 (talk) 06:46, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: 2012 rally

message: Cooper appears to have only two claims to notability, his engagement to Eve and the founding of the Gumball 3000. Suggest merging here what minimal content there is on him and leaving Maximillion Cooper  as a redirect. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 22:22, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed merge with [[Maximillion Cooper]] 

message: I noticed that the Vogue article used as citation for the opening line on Maximillion Cooper co-founding the rally with his ex wife Julie Brangstrup actually only mentions that Maximillion founded the rally, not Julie. I have removed Julie's name as a result and suggest the following sources as an alternative, which all seem to point to Maximillion Cooper being the sole founder of Gumball.
Metro newspaper - http://metro.co.uk/2009/10/27/maximillion-cooper-241699/
Complex magazine - http://www.complex.com/rides/2013/06/most-influential-people-in-the-auto-industry/maximillion-cooper
OotingPooting (talk) 10:37, 8 May 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro/Founder 

message: Reading about the rally elsewhere I came across mention of a stop in North Korea in 2008. This seemed significant so I've added in a section for 2008 with some references detailing the North Korea stop OuEstLeBob (talk) 20:55, 6 October 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  2008 

message: An undue weight tag was added to the "2007" section in 2014, with no details in the edit summary, and I can't find any discussion of it in Talk. I assume from reading the section that the perceived problem is that too much weight is being given to the fatal collision, and perhaps also to the various driving infractions and so forth, compared to coverage of the rally in other years.
*I agree that the coverage of the collision seems excessive, considering that it has its own article, 2007 Gumball 3000 collision.
*As for fairly detailed coverage of various driving infractions and related issues in other countries for 2007, and practically no coverage in other years (I think only a mention of speeding in 2010), could give the impression that all hell broke lose in 2007, whereas this may not be the case - it should at least be made clear in this section, whether this was an unusual year for legal problems and police intervention. If it wasn't, and details on various police issues can't easily be found for other most or all other years, perhaps a separate section on legality and issues is in order (such a section seems a good idea regardless, the legal status of the race in the countries it travels through, and the instructions given to participants, seem like basic questions I for one would expect to find answered).
I've begun work on resolving the undue tag as far as I understand it, including restoring a "See also" to the collision article, which was removed and replaced by an in-text link. Comments and editing help are of course strongly encouraged! --Tsavage (talk) 15:12, 17 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  2007 undue weight 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified