Talk:Ukrainian–Soviet War

message: I would expect this war was erased from Soviet era research/books? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  03:54, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, it was never mentioned and forgotten --70.18.211.240 (talk) 20:15, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: In Soviet historiography

message: Conflict cannot be seen as conflict between states because the problem was not in the independent state but with the goverments. Both sides fought for Ukrainian Republic but both fought for different goverments - one allied with "democratic" Europe, another - allied with "democratic" Russia. After the fall of Russian Empire there was no goverment supported by all people at all. Some people don't like goverment for his alliance with Germans, others - with Europe and previous ruling classes, while others don't like goverment for his alliance with Russia (they really wanted indepence - from it). So to say more correct is to say about Civil War for Democracy and democratic goverment on the territories of that day Ukraine (newly-born Ukrainian Republic). All sides wanted Ukrainian Republic - and they got it, but in the form of Ukrainian Soviet Republic allied with Russian Republic in Soviet Union (which was not good to all of citizens - but to most part of them). Also we need to remember that a lot of Ukrainians fought in Red Army and Red Cossacks troops. Serge-kazak (talk) 22:22, 6 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  One Ukrainian Republic - different governments 

message: How we can talk about "Ukrainian-Soviet War" during 1917-1921 when Soviet Union was established only in 1922 and one of major entities who establish Soviet Union was Ukraine? It was civil war between forces that support bolsheviks and forces that support nationalists  (actually far more complicated). It was internal civil war as it happens on all territory of Russian Empire does not matter what modern Ukrainian revisionists cry aloud. 220.237.0.150 (talk) 04:12, 28 January 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: The Bolsheviks renamed Russia into the "Russian Soviet Republic" in early 1918 (see Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic), and the term Soviet appeared even before that, namely after the February Revolution in early 1917, so the title would mean that the fight was mainly between the Soviet Russia and Ukraine. —Kammerer55 (talk) 04:47, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Terminology lame altogether 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion:
* 
* 
* 
* 
* 
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 07:23, 15 April 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion 

message: Maybe this should be moved to Soviet–Ukrainian War so the entries are in alphabet order? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 01:56, 20 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I concur. "Soviet–Ukrainian War" makes much more sense - it was Soviets who attacked. Constantinehehe 05:14, 1 August 2020 (UTC)

text: Yes, I support such a move, both alphabetically and because Soviet Russian side was the aggressor. I have renamed the page accordingly.--Sanya3 (talk) 03:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  I reversing this move.  The primary source cited uses the former order of the parties.  If there are other sources added to the article that support a different titling, we can open a requested move discussion here and try to gain consensus. UnitedStatesian (talk) 17:40, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name 

message: This is not how historical reporting is done. It's not up to you to decide good guys and bad guys or present either of two non-state wannabe "governments" as more legitimate than the other - or either more legitimate than any of the other warring factions. The title itself is a misnomer. There was no Ukrainian-Soviet war, because Ukraine was not a state and Ukrainians fought on both sides and the USSR didn't even exist yet. The entire pseudo-country was factionalised and in-fighting as various groups struggled for power - all claiming to want an independent Ukraine, including Ukrainian socialists and Ukrainian Bolsheviks. All fighting over a territory which didn't even have defined borders until the Bolsheviks established them and most certainly could not be defined as a recognized State within those borders before that. Then you have the side-deals between your favorite factions and Poland, a country which hadn't existed for 150 years, and various meddling by Germany and Austria-Hungary.  You have invented a "war" out of whole cloth. It doesn't even come close to the threshold of a war between nations. It was part of a larger internecine squabble those of us in the know like to call the Russian Revolution and peripheral to an actual full-scale war we call World War 1. The fighting could not rightfully be called a war of independence either, because it didn't win Ukraine independence - the collapse of the Tsarist government made everywhere within the former empire de-facto independent. All sides claimed to be fighting for an independent state and, perhaps not ironically, when Ukraine did eventually attain international recognition as an independent nation-state, it was under the auspices of the Soviets as the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, a founding member of the USSR in 1922 and later a founding member of the United Nations in 1945, after the USSR had defeated Hitler and NAZI Germany in Europe - and Ukraine. These are simple facts. You need to state them, whether you are pleased by them or not. There are no good guys and bad guys. The one truism in war is that almost everyone thinks they are the good guys - including Adolph Hitler and Harry Truman and Julius Caesar and probably Genghis Kahn.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2806:10AE:10:9E66:8CDB:FC70:2AF2:F2 (talk) 02:13, 25 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  This Whole Page is Obviously Biased