Talk:Constitution of the Athenians

message: Shouldn't it be Constitution of Athens?
Add Pseudo_Xenophon Constitution of Athens. Septentrionalis 21:57, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: Perhaps this should be split into two articles, Constitution of the Athenians (The Old Oligarch) and Constitution of the Athenians (Aristotle), with this page to disambiguate? Not that there's enough material now, but later...? → (AllanBz ✎) 03:12, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: When there's enough material, which will be a long time. Old Oligarch would be better though; avoids piped links. Septentrionalis 17:07, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: When this is done, the links should be divided carefully. Septentrionalis 16:29, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Split article? 

message: The wikisource link links to Aristotle's Constitution of the Athenians, not the Old Oligarch's. I spent a good 20 minutes looking for a passage before I figured that out.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.103.4.0 (talk) 22:58, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wikisource link 

message: There is now a rather extensive article describing the Constitution of Athens, from the (public domain) 1911 encyclopaedia, on wikisource. If someone (who has a better knowledge of the subject than me and knows how much of the EB1911 article is outdated) could incorporate part of it into the wikipedia article, there would hopefully be enough material to finally split it. If it's any help, I've copied the EB1911 article, (making some of the syntax, idiosyncratic to wikisource, more wikipedia-friendly and splitting some of the paragraphs) to this talk subpage. (I didn't change any of the actual text). Gephyra (talk) 00:48, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Encyclopædia Britannica 1911 

message: Up until just over a week ago, the first sentence of the lead has remained relatively unchanged since June 2014; since March 26th this article page has undergone 17 edits (at the time of writing), mostly concerning this lead sentence.
It currently reads:
"The Constitution of the Athenians (Greek: Ἀθηναίων πολιτεία Athenaion Politeia also translated The Polity of Athenians) is the name given to two texts from Classical antiquity: one probably by Aristotle or a student of his, the second attributed to Xenophon, but not thought to be his work."
Prior to this, it read:
"The Constitution of the Athenians (The Athenian constitution; Greek: Ἀθηναίων πολιτεία Athenaion Politeia) is the name given to two texts from Classical antiquity: one probably by Aristotle or a student of his, the second attributed to Xenophon, but not thought to be his work."
The major difference is in which alternative titles we mention for the work in the lead. WP:OTHERNAMES says that "significant alternative names for the topic should be mentioned in the article, usually in the first sentence or paragraph".  As far as I can see, The Polity of the Athenians is not a "significant alternative name".  For instance, this google ngrams search shows that "constitution of the athenians" has been more common than "polity of the athenians" consistently since 1936.  The Loeb and Penguin translations both title the work "The Athenian Constitution"; the Cambridge Texts in the History of Political Thought translation calls it the "Constitution of Athens", Kenyon's translation calls it the "Athenian Constitution", the OED(2) refers to the Politeia as Constitutions (but refers to Ath. Pol. as such), and the Oxford Concise Companion to Classical Literature refers to the "collection of the 158 constitutions" of which Ath. Pol. is the only extant.  Finally, volume 5 of the Cambridge Ancient History refers to the Athenian Constitution throughout.
It seems clear to me that if we are to follow WP:OTHERNAMES, the lead should follow the form which has been agreed on for the past two years, and that there is no need to add in "also translated The Polity of Athenians". 
Anyone want to make a case for a different position? 
 pinging people involved in the move request discussion and the relevant article space edits.
Caeciliusinhorto (talk) 19:46, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with your argument. I think the old lead is a little awkward as it stands and would be keen to see it altered to something like "The Constitution of the Athenians or the Athenian Constitution (Greek: Ἀθηναίων πολιτεία Athenaion Politeia) refers to two texts from Classical antiquity: one probably by Aristotle or a student of his, the second attributed to Xenophon, but not thought to be his work." I think I have said what I have to say about "Polity" above. Furius (talk) 23:46, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well, after five days it doesn't seem that anyone has put forward any reason not to revert.  I'm going to go ahead and use your suggested text. Caeciliusinhorto (talk) 22:39, 9 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Lead sentence

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified  on Constitution of the Athenians. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20040803125826/http://etext.library.adelaide.edu.au:80/a/a8/athenian.html to http://etext.library.adelaide.edu.au/a/a8/athenian.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 19:24, 12 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified