Talk:Race and intelligence (test data)

message: deleted the section on "darker skinned orientals" having lower iq scores. southeast asians are not darker skinned orientals, they are for the most part a different migratory group with highly significant australo-melanesian admixture.  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.205.62.146 (talk) 05:51:35, August 19, 2007 (UTC) 
Do Orientals have a higher IQ if its Summer and they have a tan then?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.225.216.157 (talk) 01:39, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: deleted a section

message: I added some information on the "Asian-American" classification. Asian-American encompasses an extremely genetically diverse population, so it's not to be confused for any sort of proof in either direction.72.205.62.146 02:29, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Despite the ongoing controversy about IQ difference in the US. Gargi Bhattacharyya , Liz Ison and Maud Blair have found that IQ differences between black and white populations in the UK and elsewhere are virtually non-existent. Black Caribbean and Black African children and children for whom English is an additional language make relatively greater progress during preschool than White children or those for whom English is a first language.
(The reference was Minority Ethnic Attainment and Participation in Education and Training: The Evidence  (Bhattacharyya, Ilson, Blair, 2000).)
It was inaccurate and misleading. The Bhattacharyya et al. document does not mention IQ at all, and the stuff about children making relatively greater progress merely says that children (not just Black children) who have "English as an Additonal Language" catch up, at least partly, with their native English-speaking peers.
What the Bhattacharyya et al. paper actually shows is that Black African children achieve somewhat lower attainment in school than the White group, and Black Caribbean children achieve a much lower attainment, especially the boys. More recent data shows Black African girls overtaking White boys. 
Explanations for differences in immigrant populations performances have to take into account the effects of different patterns of selective migration. For instance, for an African to get into Europe is fairly tough, and to get into America is very tough (they can't paddle there from Morocco). The result is that such Africans as are found in America are very often from Africa's elite. This can account for the high educational attainment of African immigrants in the USA.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.254.200.215 (talk) 23:13, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: African Immigrants

message: If you mean that table at the end, I agree, WD. futurebird 00:33, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: This article may not be compliant?

message: I'm a bit uncomfortable with the term "Hispanic" being used in the chart below without at least a footnote explaining the definition.  On an aside, do we have page numbers for the H&M ref.  Not to imply that they need to be here, but I'd like to read the text supporting these numbers.  Thanks! --Kevin Murray 21:08, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Chart

message: How can SAT scores be tied to IQ?  More than anything these are a product of ability and environmnet, with a huge emphasis on the latter.  --Kevin Murray 06:25, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: SAT measures g and correlates with other IQ tests approximately as well as other IQ tests do with one another. The cause of differences in SAT shouldn't be a matter of discussion in this article. --W.R.N. 07:15, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Some insecure troll changed European IQ on the page from 100 to 105. I reverted.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.205.62.146 (talk) 06:29, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: SAT Scores

message: here are the data tables from Lynn (2006). If, for example, they were all included here, I think that would be too much. But what criteria could be used to select a subset? --W.R.N. 07:38, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe we shouldn't include any large data tables here, but merely reference them to their original source?  We don't have to select a subset, we can simply refer to them at a different location. --JereKrischel 15:40, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  appendix 

message: Undue weight and outdated material. Skull size has been changed to no longer particularly relevant. Should be removed. Objections?Ultramarine 13:00, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pre WW II skull data 

message: Attempted compilations of average IQ scores by race published by Richard Lynn in Mankind Quarterly and Murray, C. and Herrnstein, R. J. in their book The Bell Curve place Ashkenazi Jews at the top, followed by East Asians, Whites, Hispanics and Native Americans, and African Americans.; ; 
Or should this read "ethnic groups" ? futurebird 21:53, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know if I agree with the general move to rename. This question is really just about how Murray, Herrnstein and Lynn describe these differences and making this text match the sources. futurebird 23:39, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The problem is, Murray and Herrnstein themselves conflate ethnicity, race, and of course population. Slrubenstein   |  Talk 11:48, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Do Murray, Herrnstein and Lynn think Jews are a race?

message: This sentence:
:In fact, Blacks of African descents in the UK, on average, earn more money and obtain higher levels of education than the native white populations.
seems to be at complete variance with current UK data and so is either out of date or suspect. There has been a lot of UK government & media concern recently about low educational achievement of UK black schoolchildren. Take for example this (admittedly patchy) data from the Institute of Race Relations, no less, showing blacks to be the lowest achieving ethnic group at GCSE level:  (though it doesn't distinguish African from Caribbean blacks, and I should think most available stats wouldn't either). Ben Finn 00:02, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: UK educational attainment

message: Please note you should not transclude other articles into here. See Talk:Eurasian hybrid vigor#Removing my OR Nil Einne 08:51, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  No transcluding 

message: The article states "In a study by done by Dennis Saccuzzo on information-Processing for African-American, Latino, Filipino, and White elementary school children enrolled in gifted versus non-gifted school programs, gifted African-Americans showed the fastest reaction times of the ethnic groups tested while nongifted African-Americans showed the slowest. The study, however, found only a "modest" correlation between reaction time and IQ.[98]" 
This is self-contradictory. Either there is a correlation between RT and IQ or there isn't. What are the actual numbers? What is meant by gifted? IQ?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.68.243.6 (talk) 19:54, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reaction time 

message: I unredirected this article as (A) The AfD was marginal at best, certainly no consensus was achieved. (B) The links to this article remain in the main article (C) The result of the AfD was merge. This has not been done, the content that presently exists bears no relation to the content of this article. Lobojo (talk) 22:53, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recreation