Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Novels/Archive 9

message: I just noticed on my watchlist that a first edition cover was recently speedy deleted by the Fair Use Gestapo (which means the uploader -- I don't think it was me -- might not even have been notified). The victim was Dr. No (novel). Ironically some non-first edition cover images were kept. Since the WikiProject is trying to promote the use of First Edition covers in the infoboxes, this is a dangerous precedent and who knows how many other First Ed. covers have been taken off? When and if the "AFD/IFD notification" page is created, this will have to be taken into account. I no longer contribute images to Wikipedia so I can't do anything to help in this case (I don't have a first edition of Dr. No anyway). Perhaps with a little research the speedy deleter can be made to see the error of their ways, especially given that the deletion is counter-productive to one of the aims of this Wikiproject. 23skidoo 20:00, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Page has been created - Wikipedia:WikiProject Novels/Articles-Images in danger of deletion  here. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:14, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: And duly watchlisted by me! You might also want to add a link to the wikiproject links box at the top right of this and other WP:NOVEL pages if you haven't already done so. I wonder if it might not also be helpful to send a note regarding this page to the maintainers of the bots that usually send out the notices asking that the page be added to their to-do lists (although I don't know whether they can be programmed to leave their messages under the appropriate heading). And there are also a few places where the image deletionists tend to congregate.  23skidoo 12:56, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: First edition image deleted

message: There is an article explaining what Paranormal Romance is, but why is there no category? Maybe this has been debated before, but wouldn't it make sense to make a list of all of the PR's on Wikipedia? I'm not very good at making categories or I would have done it myself.
71.117.41.22 15:02, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have added it to the project hierarchy on the main page. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 16:16, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Paranormal Romance 

message: :: --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 04:05, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  updated --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 11:39, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Renamed as it is a novel. Also challenged the prod - added notability info and reference with plot. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:24, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion: Angel Eyes (book) 

message: :: --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 03:19, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  updated --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 23:58, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Also challenged the prod - added notability info and reference with plot - also note we have a specific page for article challenges. Wikipedia:WikiProject Novels/Disputed novel articles :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:19, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion: Sweet Women Lie 

message: :: --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 15:22, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion: two in the ''Rogue Warrior'' series 

message: Forgive me if it's been covered, as I didn't see it in the archives, but how would I know what's a good reference for things like the critical reception of a novel? Amazon is out, apparently, but what about Barnes & Noble? Or sites like infinityplus.co.uk? I'd like to use something like Publishers Weekly, but they seem to be a pay site, and I can't see using that as a reference. So what's a guy to do? Howa0082 15:49, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Attributable Sources? 

message: Hello. Can anyone tell me if there's a Wikiproject that deals with articles about literary theory in its various manifestations? Many thanks, DionysosProteus 01:27, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I would think the WP:BOOKS would be the most likely place - however it isn't that well supported. Maybe there is a need. Obviously we can be involved but within the limitations of our scope. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 10:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Literary theory Wikiproject?

message: There is a proposal up for a project focusing on general, basic literature articles here. Please add your name if you are interested. Thanks, Wrad 20:46, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: See above. WP:BOOKS is closest to a Literary wikiproject as possible. Create a taskforce there? feydey 23:45, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Literature is about way more than books. See my points at the proposal page and at the WP:Books talk page. Wrad 23:48, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  WikiProject Literature proposal 

message: for accepting my application! If there's anything I can do, just post it on this page and it's done. Also, I'l need some of you guys to support my WikiProject, Fledgeling WikiProject Small Engines, as it's still in its request stage. Again, big thanks,--Gp75motorsports 01:32, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Where's a link so people can check it out? Doczilla 19:53, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Thank you 

message: Just wanted to point out... WP:POETRY is on the upswing for activity after being nearly without a pulse for a couple years. We're really trying to legitimatize the project so if anyone here wants to keep an eye on us or help out, just swing by! Many thanks. --Midnightdreary 15:49, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  WP:POETRY 

message: Thomas Mann is in need of additional cites. -- 201.53.4.206 19:56, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: May well be but the article is out of scope of the project. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:11, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Thomas Mann]] needs additional cites 

message: The structure of WikiProject Novels is confusing and user-unfriendly. We should expect a particularly large cross-section of Wikipedia users to be interested in the subject "Novels", therefore we should be especially careful to make this project user-friendly and easy to use. Please place a high priority on fixing this problem. If you don't understand the nature of the problem, please have someone else clarify it for you. -- 201.53.4.206 20:09, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, as someone who has come on and not signed up with a full wiki identity I would at least expect some "content" to your criticism. With substantive points and agreement from others with your observations we can start to do something about it, otherwise! :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:13, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi!  If you don't understand the nature of the problem, please have someone else clarify it for you. -- 201.53.4.206 11:40, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

text: Yea - I thought as much - you don't know do you! :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 12:26, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  WikiProject Novels is confusing and user-unfriendly 

message: Ok. I want to know whether this novel should have its own separate page.
:Generally yes, if sufficiently notable and there would be enough material to support to separate pages. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:37, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Quite right! :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:37, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

text: if there are "blurb" then yes it "is " breaking copyright and they should be rapidly removed. Ideally any summary written should be sourceable (e.e. referenced) but that doesn't mean a word for word copy. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:37, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

text: No problem :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 08:37, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

text: Seem pretty good to me - I not completely sure about the series based version rather than the chronological type, but this is about as clean as it gets. Any more specific information like "publisher" etc can be given on the novel article page. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:11, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

text: how about "Publisher's Blurbs are copyright material - copyright material should not be used". It would be nice to expand on this in the talk page with a perhaps boilerplate text with a slightly more encouraging piece about adding a summary written in your own words ideally with sourcing and references. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:11, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

text: No, but it really a function of the notability of the novel and the quality (and size) of the article. if the work on this the article comments is not really notable then there is not much you can do. Otherwise expand the article with quality content and it should ensure it's survival. See article talk comments. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 11:23, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Raymond E. Feist's Magician 

message: This is an article about a recently self-published book. I am reluctant to AfD it, due to ignorance about novels and notability etc. Could someone with the right knowledge have a look at it? Anarchia (talk) 22:12, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Seems legit to me - however the issue of notability does naturally arise. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:05, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I see no signs of notability. Doczilla 08:35, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have begun an AfD of this article. You are invited to comment at Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/The_True_Snow_White. -- Writtenonsand (talk) 17:58, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: [[The True Snow White]]

message: Someone's got it in for Jerry, Catherine and Una.  The discussion is here  Nick mallory (talk) 09:10, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[The Cornelius Quartet]] by [[Michael Moorcock]] up for deletion

message: Hi: Could you guys incorporate Light House: A Trifle into your WikiProject and rate it and perhaps categorize it? It's a new but fleshed out article on a first novel.-BillDeanCarter (talk) 12:12, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Considering this is a new article it appears a very good one. Others may look it over to check accuracy and other things that may be added etc. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:23, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the edits. It spent some time in the List of works by William Monahan before becoming its own article. What did you mean by a 1st edition cover? I think this is the 1st edition because it looks exactly like the hardcover cover I have. Do you mean first printing 1st edition?-BillDeanCarter (talk) 11:51, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No, what I mean is that if there is a cover it ideally should be the 1st. You add no caption that declares it to be the 1st. So, I just normally add this "comment" to prompt those who have not loaded a "1st edition cover" to load one, or those who have added one, to add a caption to declare it. I'll add one as I assume from what you say it is a "1st". :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 12:00, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ahh, okay. Thanks.-BillDeanCarter (talk) 12:16, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: ''[[Light House: A Trifle]]''

message: Currently there is an article on the short story "He" by H. P. Lovecraft.  The problem is that there is another short story titled "He" written by Katherine Anne Porter that currently isn't on here.  This may lead to some confusion for people who are looking for the "He" by Porter. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Leechristensen (talk • contribs) 
:added both short stories to He (disambiguation) page. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:12, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In addition, if and when an article on the Porter story is written, an additional dab statement can be added to the Lovecraft story page. 23skidoo (talk) 22:04, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  He, the short stories 

message: Herland (novel) could use some cleanup. -- Writtenonsand (talk) 22:21, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Herland (novel)]] 

message: I currently have 5 articles that are largely ready to go (except for one) about the Dragon series by Laurence Yep.  They haven't been put together in an anthology of some kind.  I'm thinking of making a collage out of the 4 books that make up the series to use on the article page about the series as a whole.  Is this kosher?  --BrokenSphereMsg me 22:34, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Probably not, unfortunately. The collage would still consist of four copyrighted book covers, so it could be viewed as an image gallery (similar to album cover galleries, which are frowned upon). In my opinion, it would be best to use the cover of the first book in the series article, and then use the other covers on the individual articles. Bláthnaid 12:07, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Unless I find a pic of all 4 book covers together, right?  --BrokenSphereMsg me 16:10, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I wouldn't "bust a gut" over this issue. Most novel series articles do not have cover illustrations for the reasons mentioned above (i.e. copyright and fair use issues). Also the most importance part is the quality of thetext of such article rather than dubious rationales for images. If there is an obvious need for a image then by all means but not normally. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 16:25, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Obviously you could find instances of compliance/noncompliance with that if you look; Lord of the Rings for example does this, and it's FA.  Personally I like to have illustrations in my articles if possible, but no biggie on 1 vs. 4.  --BrokenSphereMsg me 16:35, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I know the "Lord of the Rings" example and is doesn't seem to add to the article anything significant. I would be better if is gave the cover for the first combined edition published as Tolkien originally planned. (it was divided for publishing reasons, against his original intentions). :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 16:42, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: BTW, thanks for "wikifying" the templates I was using.  BrokenSphereMsg me 16:58, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

text: It's what we do! Keep editing :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 17:04, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Creating a collage from several book covers for an article about the series they're part of 

message: The message on the talk page here suggests the article may be a copyvio. Can someone from this project follow up on this claim? TomStar81 (Talk) 06:23, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Completely out of scope this is non-fiction . :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:32, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Eyes needed at [[Talk:On Combat: The Psychology and Physiology of Deadly Conflict in War and in Peace|On Combat: The Psychology and Physiology of Deadly Conflict in War and in Peace]]

message: I've nominated A Canticle for Leibowitz for GA. If someone has some time, could she/he do a GA review on this noteworthy novel, please? Thanks.Jim Dunning | talk 03:30, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Canticle for Leibowitz nominated for GA