Talk:Großdeutschland (disambiguation)

message: Ok, it really worries me when a non-logged in user with no user history absolves Grossdeutschland of war crimes -- especially as Grossdeutschland fought on the Eastern Front, alongside the Einsatzgruppen. However, anonymous is apparently right that Grossdeutschland wasn't part of the SS, and the bit about the book seems factual. But still, I'm suspicious. Can anyone shed light on this? orthogonal 10:18, 10 Jun 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, Grossdeutschland was an Army unit, one of only three known by name that I'm aware of, the others being Feldherrnhalle and, in France in 1944, Panzer Lehr. It was an elite unit with an unusually large establishment strength, probably as large as a regular panzer division and panzergrenadier division combined, especially considering it was more likely to be up to strength. It began in 1939 as (mostly sure, not entirely sure) as an all-volunteer motorized infantry regiment, so-called because recruited from all over Germany and, unlike most Army units had no territorial attachment. It became a division in 1942 and a panzergrenadier division in 1943. Although I haven't looked, I don't recall seeing any specific mention of Grossdeutschland in Eastern Front atrocities. It was probably as culpable as the rest of the regular German Army, which means it may very well have carried out the Commisar Order and participated in small-scale massacres of civilians. But as for Einsatzgruppen-type stuff, no, almost certainly not. The question isn't really, "Was GD like the SS and the Einsatzgruppen because only they committed atrocities," but rather what did ordinary soldiers in the regular Army do? I'm sure there are books with info on this. --ArminTamzarian 01:50, 18 Nov 2004 (UTC)

text: re "an Army unit", does know whether GD was a Heer unit, or an OKW unit? — B.Bryant 22:37, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  War crimes 

message: Is "Greater Germany" really the correct translation? I'd prefer Great Germany rathermore, elsewhere it would have been called Grösser Deutschland --Shandris 15:30, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's common usage to translate German Groß-foo with "Greater Foo" in English. —Nightstallion (?) Seen this already? 00:23, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

text: "Greater Germany" is not a literal translation but rather an equivalent expression to represent a geopolitical concept. The term has come into widespread usage in English-language texts. See additional comments, below. -- Deborahjay (talk) 06:50, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Correct translation of term?

message: The stub says ; Grossdeutchland is a pre-Imperial German term as the article says
It was also one of the official names of the WW2 german state. Thus, a WW2 article as well as a 19th century article.
-Alex 12.220.157.93 11:03, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Origin of term

message: This needs to be expanded upon the idea of Greater Germany of National Socialist; this reference may come in handy.-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  01:02, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Nazi Greater Germany 

message: Großdeutschland is a compound from groß (great, large, big, grand) and Deutschland (Germany). It has the same grammatical structure as Großvater (grandfather). The translation "Greater Germany" is, allthough common in the English-speaking world, simply wrong and Allied propaganda.
:BS.  Gene Nygaard 01:12, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Translation

message: :Image:Grossdeutschland.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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BetacommandBot (talk) 22:23, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Grossdeutschland.jpg

message: Greater Germany is absolutely standard as the translation of Großdeutschland. Some people may not like it, but an encylopedia article isn't the place to try to change a well established translation. Incidentally, Kleindeutschland is normally rendered as Germany without Austria.  Norvo (talk) 12:40, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Translation again 

message: There is a  for this image at Commons on the ground of a number of factual inaccuracies in this map. You are very much welcomed to participate in this discussion. Given the problems with that image, it might also be advisable to remove this map from this article. --AFBorchert (talk) 15:44, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I've commented out the img and replaced it, until further notice (this says nothing about a my POV in this matter). Greetings. Sebastian scha. (talk) 03:32, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Image:Europa1937-1939.gif]] 

message: Greater Germany is a concept different to Lebensraum, I would not mix them, certainly not in the introduction. It should be mentioned apart in a special part.--Ziko (talk) 18:32, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Greater Germany and Lebensraum

message: Upon the Italian armistice with the Allies, Nazi Germany annexed sections of northeastern Italy, including South Tirol/Alto Adige. --Paul from Michigan (talk) 06:48, 10 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Short-lived annexations from Italy 

message: It is natural for Austria to be a member Land of the present democratic and liberal German Federation. After all, they already have the same language and currency and there is not a border after the Schengen Treaty...So, from any point of view, Austria is already closer to the German Federation than any of the states (former sovereign nations) which built the Federation in 1871. It is something natural. In fact, the former DDR was, and still is, much more different from any point of view from the former West German Lander than Austria or even The Netherlands or Luxembourg.--88.23.27.105 (talk) 00:07, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  German liberals were right 

message: The reference to Kleindeutschland in the intro seems to me to be either badly worded or horribly misrepresented.  As I understand it, the concept of Kleindeustchland had absolutely nothing to do with Lebensraum, either for or against it; rather, it was more of a political idea excluding Austria (and Hungary) from any idea of a "United Germany".  For that matter, I'm not sure that the concept of Greater Germany has any relation at all to Lebensraum; Greater Germany was about unifying all or most of the disunited lands with German ethnicities, while Lebensraum was about, essentially, European colonization (and displacement).
To put it another way, if similar terms were applied to the United Kingdom, "Grossdeutschland" would have been about uniting the kingdoms of Mercia, Wessex, East Anglia etc. into England, while "Lebensraum" would have been about the British colonial drives into Africa and so on.  This is of course a very loose analogy, intended merely to convey the difference between the concepts. 114.28.255.201 (talk) 07:17, 3 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kleindeutschland Meaning? 

message: this article is totally off the mark and desperately needs a change. i only stumbled upon it by chance because the german article on the "greater german solution" led me here. but that is a wrong link and i will delete it.
greater germany (großdeutschland) was a term only used by the nazis for germany and all the occupied areas they figured should be part of it. 
"the greater german solution" (großdeutsche lösung) was one of the two options that were considered in the era of nationbuilding in the 1800s. the other one was the "smaller german solution" (kleindeutsche lösung). the former would have included austria-hungary and all its non-german possessions which, in bismarck's view, would have invited a lot of trouble into the new nation. the latter excluded austria-hungary at the price of leaving a several million germans outside. this was the option bismarck chose.Sundar1 (talk) 18:33, 28 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  greater germany vs. greater german solution 

message: The literally translation of Great Germany is Großdeutschland, like Great Britain is Großbritannien. Greater Germany is Größeres Deutschland.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.221.19.142 (talk) 17:15, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Großdeutschland simply means large Germany, or greater Germany, as in "comprising a larger area". Great, and Grand, would be "großartig" in German, just like gorgeous, magnificent etc. -- Matthead  Discuß   20:52, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Großherzog means Grand Duke.  The translation of the Groß German language prefix into the English language has the following meanings, Grand, Great, Greater, as well as Major, Superior, Big, Bigger, Large, Larger (in contrast with Minor, Inferior, Little, Littler, Small, Smaller, respectively).  Großdeutschland translates to Greater Germany, and GroßBritannien translates to Great Britain.  The suffixes of Country-Endings include -land (German), -ien (German), -ia (Latin), -ie (French, -y (English).  ArmchairVexillologistDonLives! (talk) 23:36, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: As was mentioned earlier on this very page, regardless of what the literal translation of Großdeutschland may be, the actual English expression that has come into use is Greater Germany. To extend the argument to the extreme the most literal translation of Großdeutschland in English would be "Great Dutch Land", but I don't think anyone would actually argue for that.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Khajidha (talk • contribs) 19:50, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: "As was mentioned earlier on this very page, regardless of what the literal translation of Großdeutschland may be, the actual English expression that has come into use is Greater Germany" - hit the nail on the head.  Actual usage is what matters - you can't try and impose a consistency on language which just doesn't exist. Knepflerle (talk) 12:34, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: "Greater Germany"