Talk:Pythia

message: 213.46.66.66 (talk) 05:25, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: This article should mention the Sibyl somewhere

message: I removed this text: ", gazing at a cauldron of water.   Note the low ceiling, hollow floor and barrier between the Pythia and the supplicant."
Whatever Themis is looking at, it's not a "cauldron", which would be much larger. The painting doesn't give us any evidence for what would be inside the vessel she's looking at.
The low ceiling and floor are not terribly meaningful, since this is a vase-painting. Space isn't represented realistically in vase painting, we're dealing with symbolic representations instead. What we can tell from the image is that we're inside the temple of Apollo (or, at least, a Doric temple)--as Maurizio says (p. 48), "The central Doric column and hints of entablature above indicate that we are looking within the temple of Apollo at Delphi."
Notice that this image is also not evidence that consultants were separated from the Pythia by a barrier: "The column between them is clearly not dividing them, as both figures have their feet in front of it." (Bowden 2005, p. 27) A column would make a fairly poor barrier anyway. --Akhilleus (talk) 07:29, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Removed text from caption

message: There was a recent change of dates from BCE to BC and CE to AD. The first time a date was mentioned with a notion of era, BCE was used: see ]. Per WP:DATE we stick with the system that was first used. --Akhilleus (talk) 15:47, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  BC/BCE; AD/CE 

message: I have been thinking about a possible improvement to the article.  We have the discussion on how the Pythia was selected.  We have how the oracle was prepared for each period, and how taxing the experience was for the oracle and her shortened life expectancy.  But what I see missing is the nature of the experience for the supplicant.  It would appear that the supplicant would undergo a four stage process.
Step 1: The Journey to Delphi - Supplicants were motivated by some need to undertake the long and sometimes arduous journey to come to Delphi in order to consult the oracle.  This journey was motivated by an awareness of the existence of the oracle, the growing motivation on the part of the individual or group to undertake the journey, and the gathering of information about the oracle as providing answers to important questions.
Step 2: The Preparation of the Supplicant - Supplicants were interviewed in preparation of their presentation to the Oracle, by the priests in attendance.  The genuine cases were sorted and the supplicant had to go through rituals involving the framing of their questions, the presentation of gifts to the Oracle and a procession along the Sacred Way carrying laurel leaves to visit the temple, symboli of the journey they had made.  
Step 3: The Visit to the Oracle - The supplicant would then be led into the temple to visit the adyton, put his question to the Pythia, receive his answer and depart.  The degree of preparation already undergone would mean that the supplicant was already in a highly aroused and meditative state, similar to the shamanic journey spoken of in the article.
Step 4: The Return Home - Oracles were meant to give advice to shape future action, that was meant to be implemented by the supplicant, or by those that had sponsored the supplicant to visit the Oracle.  The validity of the Oracular utterance was confirmed by the consequences of the application of the oracle to the lives of those people who sought Oracular guidance. 
I feel that an addition of these steps to the article, involving a partial re-write of the section, would help readers understand something more of the nature of the oracle at Delphi.
What do you others think?
Reagrds John D. Croft 03:51, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: John, I think that this is an essential addition to the article. The only thing I'd be worried about is making the text too long, but that can be dealt with after the text has been added. --Akhilleus (talk) 06:25, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: A Suggested Addition

message: Pythia has been placed on the list for Peer reviewed status, as I think it is of FA status now.  Would like others to make a comment on how it could be possibly improved. John D. Croft 15:40, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Request for Peer Review

message: I've reverted back to an earlier version of the intro, because the article was stating a couple of things which are no longer the consensus in scholarship. For instance:
*"however, there is a high probability that she was first an oracle for the goddess, Gaia, who was the Great Goddess,  Earth,..." Some myths say this, yes, but the oracle was established in the 8th century BCE, and "that the neighbouring precinct of the Earth is older, is something known only to mythology." (Burkert, Greek Religion, p. 144.) In other words, this myth doesn't reflect the actual history of the oracle.
*"Mythographers such as Robert Graves relate that the new myths are used to account for the transition from an earlier religious tradition involving mostly goddesses, to the mixed pantheon of classical Greek mythology, with the roles of many goddesses often changing to those of gods or consorts." Any time we find ourselves citing Robert Graves for an interpretation of myth, we should probably take a step back...see the very negative evaluation of his work by classical scholars at The Greek Myths.
*"Records exist that the Delphic oracle was established as early as the 8th century BCE." We don't have "records" of its establishment in the sense that ancient texts give us help with this question; what we've got is archaeology, and the archaeological record tells us that the Apollo sanctuary was established in the 8th century. There is some evidence for continuity of cult from the Mycenaean area in the sanctuary of Athena, but that's a separate area 1-2km away from the Apollo sanctuary. --Akhilleus (talk) 15:27, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The intro and Robert Graves 

message: I heard about a theory of the Oracle being a facade or part of the framework of, basically, an intelligence community of Antiquity. The Jackal God 23:10, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Worth looking into?

message: According to Europe: A History by Norman Davies, the Delphic Oracle continued to operate only until a barbarian invasion in 267 AD, completely destroying the temple. In the article it is listed as being in operation until 393 AD, when it ceased operation by emperor Theodosius I shutting down Pagan temples. How could of it continued operation if it was destroyed? Was a new site built? JanderVK (talk) 17:21, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Davies is probably wrong, but the way to determine this is to look at more sources. The Oracle apparently functioned during periods when the temple had been destroyed by earthquake, e.g. after 373BC, so it doesn't seem as if a fully intact structure was necessary. Although a building can be "destroyed" and yet have significant portions still standing. --Akhilleus (talk) 17:24, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Barbarians

message: Farrell 1907 isn't in the bibliography. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 02:49, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: FarNell (1896) 1907.--Wetman (talk) 05:52, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Source not found 

message: What differentiates the Pythia from the Delphian Sibyl? Lily20 (talk) 21:12, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: See Sibyl.-The Gnome (talk) 05:20, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Delphian Sibyl 

message: What about where an oracle told a king to attack I think the Persian Empire and that "a great empire will fall." His own empire fell when he was captured. This could be in a section about where the oracle was wrong and right and/or how the oracle made prophecies that could be interpreted either way. (The source for this quote is my history textbook so I can cite it.) UNIT A4B1 (talk) 01:19, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  New section 

message: This section seems to be beside the point, probably fringe, and given undue weight. I might trim down. Ceoil 13:32, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The scientific conjectures and theories about the phenomenon of the Delphic Oracle would seem to be, in fact, equally important to the history of Pythia.-The Gnome (talk) 05:20, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Scientific explanations

message: There are some references like the first cited one ("Morgan 1990, p. 148") that don't say what the reference is. Am I missing something?
Wawawemn (talk) 11:22, 22 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The references in this article are somewhat scattered. There's a "Notes" section for the in-text citations, and a separate "References" section for the bibliography. I'm not sure why it was set up this way, but it looks like it works. Feezo (send a signal | watch the sky) 11:28, 22 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: General re-write, mostly on style confortmity; sources expanded, alphabetized; clean-up. Hope it's better. -The Gnome (talk) 12:13, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: References

message: Even Alexader the Great once visited Pythia just to ask about his destiny. The pythia replied, that he'd be conquering wast lands & many battles but, he'd die at a very young age far from his home.Tushar Doshi (talk) 19:14, 22 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable Visiters to Pythia 

message: Surely this article should be re-named Delphic Oracle (or Oracle of Delphi) per WP:COMMONNAME. DeCausa (talk) 15:21, 10 September 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not too sure about that.  A Google Books search gives "Pythia" at c. 423,000 hits, "Delphic Oracle" at 176,000, "Oracle at Delphi" at 57,800, and "Oracle of Delphi" at 38,600.  That's not the most scientific of investigations, to be sure, but "Pythia" has been the most common term that I've encountered in my studies.  davidiad.: 16:34, 10 September 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Interesting. I was prompted by the opening of the lead "...commonly known as the Oracle of Delphi", which reflects what I thought was the case. I would have said that "Delphic Oracle" was the popular term and Pythia was primarily academic/specialist. But your Google books results suggests not. Perhaps the lead opening should change to reflect that! DeCausa (talk) 20:28, 10 September 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  It's hard to say.  I'm mostly used to specialist sources and I just looked at an undergraduate Greek history textbook in which Delphic Oracle was the preferred form, so there's a chance that GBooks is misleading about what's used for general audiences.   davidiad.: 00:11, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

text: Perhaps I'm actually discussing what I've heard in conversation—in which Pythia = oracle has a ring—than what I've read.  The mass-metonymy of the priestess = the Pythia = the oracle might complicate having two articles since the terms are treated as synonymous (or at least Pythia with the oracle) and there will be considerably overlap.   I bet there are some interesting discussions of the Pythia as a literary construct, so that might be one angle to guide an article on the office.  davidiad.: 01:24, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[WP:COMMONNAME]] 

message: The book;The Mystery of The Oracles by Philipp Vandenberg  seems to indicate that during at least part of the oracle's existence there was an elaborate spy network dedicated to finding out well in advance of the supplicant's arrival just what the question would be. Also in the book I believe there is mention of an elaborate "Theatre" at or under the temple grounds with cubicles where supplicants were subjected to sensory deprivation & possibly opiates before being presented with a 'Show". Unless the book is totally fabricated or discredited at least some reference should be made.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.45.242.22 (talk) 00:16, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Theatre & Spy Network 

message: I have personally worked around Hydrogen Sulfide gas & while it is common in oil fields & geothermal gasses it is also extraordinarily dangerous. Overdose is sudden & at very low concentrations. Deaths are common. It also has a characteristic "Rotten Egg" smell; certainly not a sweet perfume. It is a major hazard in geothermal gasses. I know based on personal experience that many deaths would have taken place among the priestesses if H2S was the intoxicant gas. Ethylene is a very rare component of geothermal gasses. I will suggest that pouring lots of alcohol into the fissures could generate Ethylene gas. Libation with oil & wine was common in association with the Pagan religions. It would take greater knowledge of chemistry than I have to verify if this is possible so I only advance it as an idea. Could be tried by experiment.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.45.242.22 (talk) 01:03, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  H2S & Ethylene 

message: The last oracle was reputed to occur after the closure of pagan temples had been ordered, and the temple was already a ruin.  Secondly Fontenrose and Maurizio were witing before the modern ethylene theory had been suggested.  The previous statement made it look as though they were commenting on the ethylene hypothesis.  This is not true, they were reporting upon the so-called garbled nature of the prophecies.  Regards John D. Croft (talk) 10:32, 5 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Corrections of anachronistic statements

message: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Collier-priestess_of_Delphi.jpg
This used to be the original image used.  However, it was changed to an image that is not as good (in my opinion).  Why was it changed?  Collier's image is much better.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Esotericpig (talk • contribs) 20:10, 1 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why was John Collier's Priestess of Delphi image removed? 

message: Substituted at 03:35, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Assessment comment

message: Just adding here that "Pythia was the House of Snakes." doesn't make any sense. Shouldn't it be "Pytho was the House of Snakes." ?  or even better, a more descriptive verb is chosen, like 'Pytho became known as...,' or 'Pytho translates to...'  ?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Seguefisch (talk • contribs) 01:05, 15 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: Doesn't make sense

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: how can this article not mention Socrates? 98.153.112.234 (talk) 19:51, 20 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  socrates?