Talk:Spencer Perceval

message: "In later life Perceval became an expert on Biblical prophecy and wrote pamphlets relating prophecies which he had discovered."
How exactly does one go about "discovering" a biblical prophecy? --Jfruh 16:55, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Prophecies?

message: I've reverted an edit which claimed, sourced to some trivia page, that only members of the Royal Family are allowed to die within the Palace of Westminster, so that Perceval was not pronounced dead until he left the premises. I find this highly suspicious, and haven't found other correlating sources online. Death in Royal palaces is somewhat extraordinary in law — the Coroner of the Verge, or since 1887 the Coroner of the Queen's Household presides over inquests of persons whose bodies are found within their premises — but I would ask for a citation from statue law or at least a somewhat more scholarly source before perpetrating this notion. Choess 04:37, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Can't find the statute but the law is definitely there - and recently voted the UK's most ludicrous law! http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7081038.stm Timrollpickering 11:02, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Death in Westminster 

message: How could he have held the post of Clerk of the Ordinance 18 years after he was killed? - JVG 23:08, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: My fault. Good catch. I've made a stub for his eldest son, Spencer Perceval (junior). Choess 02:11, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Query 

message: According to the Britannica, Spencer Perceval was made a King's Counsel in 1796.--218.103.209.27 05:28, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that is correct: this source also indicates the same.  I have included a footnote to the effect that (at age 33) this may make him the youngest ever Silk appointed in the UK.  Previously Wikipedia had recorded that honour as being held by two persons: Paul McBride and Emlyn Hooson QC, both of whom were demonstrably older that Perceval.  I appreciate that is dangerously close to OR, but keen to resolve the edit wars going ahead on the Paul McBride page about this point. --Legis (talk - contribs) 15:48, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: This is what Denis Gray, Spencer Perceval's biographer has to say (page 14): "He decided instead [of accepting the post of Chief Secretary in Ireland] to press his claims for a silk gown and wrote to Pitt on 24 January [1796] asking for permission to approach Lord Loughborough. 'I am encouraged to think,' he confessed, 'from what the Chancellor said to me near a twelve month ago, that he would not be unwilling to attend to an application from me...' In fact, Lord Loughborough had forgotten the hint and thought there were already too many K.C.'s on the midland circuit, 'but', he admitted, 'I have so strong a persuasion that your talents require only the opportunity of being more displayed to be admired that... I shall have great pleaseure in submitting your application to His Majesty'. Finally at a meeting of the council of Lincoln's Inn, held on 26 February 1796, Perceval was elected a bencher of the Inn." Oddly, Gray goes on to say the "thirty-four-year-old barrister had successfully established himself in his profession" as Perceval was still only 33, his birthday being in November. So, definitely younger than the contenders in the article you mentioned. The BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1218017.stm) thinks Lord Shawcross was Britain's youngest ever K.C., but he was born in 1902 and was made a K.C. in 1939 so that puts him out of the running. I am not too keen on making the claim for Perceval (and one of the youngest doesn't really cut it) since a) it doesn't have a source and b) there might have been a younger one. But a mention in a footnote is probably okay. I will change the footnote to the Gray biography, since it is just a date (and your footnote doesn't work - it has some red in it) and move it to paragraph on his career as the intro is footnote-free.Southdevonian (talk) 18:21, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: [[King's Counsel]]

message: He had to serve as his own Chancellor after obtaining six refusals of office.
...but every Prime Minister in the Commons served as Chancellor of the Exchequer until 1841 - does this reference a) imply Perceval was seeking to break this tradition 30 years early; or b) refer to the Duchy of Lancaster (Perceval seems to be the only PM to have held this - see List of Prime Ministers of the United Kingdom). Timrollpickering 19:23, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Own Chancellor 

message: The abolition of the slave trade is usually credited to the Ministry of All Talents, yet here it is said that: "It was under Perceval that William Wilberforce passed his Bill abolishing the slave trade." This can at best have been only true in the most formal sense, as the Ministry fell in March 1807, the same month that the bill received the Royal Assent, so the bill must have been carried through Parliament before Perceval returned to office.Dudleymiles 20:50, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Abolition of slave trade 

message: The information given about Isabella contradicts information about her sisters.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.183.167.196 (talk) 23:16, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: In what way?Southdevonian (talk) 12:21, 12 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Children

message: In The Times of 1 January 1938 there is a letter by C B Gabb (a regular contributor), in which he states that two granddaughters of Spencer Perceval had reached 100 the previous year. Jackiespeel (talk) 18:11, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Granddaughters

message: While trade tensions were one of the causes of the War of 1812, I don't think this is relevant to the article since the war started after the inquiry and after Perceval was assassinated. As it's worded now, it seems to imply that the war was one of the reasons the inquiry was called. Perhaps the relation of the Orders in Council to the War of 1812 could better be mentioned near the part of the biography which mentions them. I have removed the sentence from it's current location, I have not moved since I think someone with more familiarity with the subject could better determine how (and if) it should be added to that section.--HarryHenryGebel (talk) 06:48, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  War of 1812 

message: to which Bellingham replied "Indeed you are". I wasn't sure if this was vandalism or not. Is there a source? Southdevonian (talk) 12:14, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Sounds dodgy to me. I don't remember it being mentioned in any book about the assassination. Sam Blacketer (talk) 12:17, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

text: I added this - a tourgide at the House of Commons mentioned this. Apologies for not adding a source. Cooltrainer Hugh (talk) 18:38, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Did Bellingham really say this? 

message: The Earldom of Egmont appears to be extant at the moment, so not sure why it says it became extinct in 2011. 62.73.132.82 (talk) 08:57, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The 12th earl died recently and there may not be an heir to the earldom. If his son Donald is adopted then he won't be able, under the current law, to inherit the title (I think that is what the law is - I'm not well up on titles). Someone on the Egmont page has, I think, been a bit premature in naming him as 13th earl. Also they said the title otherwise could go to cousins via the female line, but I would be surprised if the Egmont earldom could be passed on in that way.Southdevonian (talk) 10:32, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Earldom of Egmont 

message: Did anyone notice that almost all of his children who married married cousins?  And all but 1 of his daughters never married.  I wonder if there is some psychological reason behind these facts? Bigmac31 (talk) 16:52, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Two of the six daughters, Jane and Isabella, married - both to cousins. Jane's husband was a cousin on both her mother's and her father's side. All of the six sons married, two of them to cousins. Was this typical of families of their class at that time? People did marry cousins more frequently in those days than these (there were for a start more of them to choose from). I don't know if women from upper class families were more likely to remain single than men, or if there was something different about the Perceval family.Southdevonian (talk) 12:45, 12 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cousins? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This article claims that after the assassination an inquest was held at the Cat and Bagpipes public house.
However, this statement appears to be contradicted by the wiki page Assassination of Spencer Perceval, which states:
Was an inquest held at the Cat and Bagpipes or the Rose and Crown? As it is cited, I am more inclined to believe the former claim. Is it possible that the pub was called the Rose and Crown at a different time?
:Spencer Perceval's biographer Dennis Gray says (page 460) it was the Cat and Bagpipes. There was another pub in Downing Street called the Rose and Crown.Southdevonian (talk) 22:16, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Inquest into death