Talk:Tennessee Williams

message: Is Gay Bashing really a PC way of putting it? I'm from the UK so maybe it is different in the US? 88.109.187.133 22:47, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gay Bashing 

message: The name “Tennessee” was a name he adopted from his father's background in Tennessee.But the BooksFactory bio (external link) says: Williams's Deep South accent and poverty made him a target of his schoolmates and earned him later from his university [of Missouri] classmates the nickname ‘Tennessee’.Who’s right? Is it even possible to know?  Frungi 01:06, 2 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Even if it is true, there is no point in referencing his father if you don't spell out exactly what is his father's background in Tennessee. Did his father sell in Tennessee? The article doesn't say. Also, I think the section about his critics being homophobes is slightly biased.  Knapster2005 14:07, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: IF anyone has read his memoirs, the section about students at Missouri giving him the nickname seems a bit false. Williams states plainly that it is from his father's connection in East Tennessee, and his family connection with the first governor of Tennessee and the first man to oversee the Tennessee territory before it became a state. Liontamarin 20:04, 6 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If we look at Lyle Leverich's biography (which has been widely known to be the definitive biograph of TW since its publication in '95), he writes that there have been "many versions of how Tom became known as Tenneseee..." (274).  Probably the best thing we can do is use the story Leverich uses-- Williams was on his way to New York to meet his agent Audrey Wood, when on the way he'd decided to go to New Orleans instead.  But before going to New Orleans, he decided to send a manuscript of a collection of one-act plays entitled American Blues into a playwriting contest by the Group Theater (for which he later won a $ 100- I think- award).  When he sent these plays off, he altered his birthdate by three years because of an age restriction on the contest.  As a result, he decided to create a nomme de plume.  He signed the application, "Tennessee Williams."  Later, when he arrived in New Orleans, he signed into his room as Tennessee, and the rest, as they say....  (This last little bit is anecdotal from a prof. of mine who is a renowned TW expert.)HomelessRobles (talk) 03:53, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name 

message: Michael David and I have been having a discussion on one anothers' talk pages about the rights and wrongs of including Williams in the people diagnosed with clinical depression category. My evidence for including him is as follows:
* Autobiographical evidence: Williams discussed his "decade-long episode of depression" in his own memoirs
* Biographical evidence: ...and it's been in his biographies, too.
* At least one academic paper exists written by clinicians which reviews his psychiatric history, and includes: "we believe that sufficient evidence exists to suggest that Williams probably had major depressive episodes at age 25, 35, 46, and 52 years". The article also acknowledges the problems of attempting such diagnoses.
* Williams is known to have received psychotherapy for his depression.
* ...and to have taken antidepressants.
I believe that this merits his inclusion in the category. Given that we are unlikely to persuade him to nip round with a letter from his doctor, largely because he's dead, I think it's entirely appropriate in a project such as this to categorise people as suffering from conditions where that is supported by historical evidence and their own personal discussions of the topic.  Nmg20 01:44, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree.--Parkwells 17:48, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I would add that his play Suddenly Last Summer was a result entirely of his extended analysis with Dr.Lawrence Kubie-- it is something widely known to TW scholars.  Williams was in analysis with Kubie right after Rose (his sister) had her lobotomy.  In the sessions, Kubie encouraged Williams to stop writing and urged him to attempt to "cure" his homosexuality.  Here's one source that might help: HomelessRobles (talk) 04:02, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category: ppl diagnosed with clinical depression 

message: I'm glad to see that template for all the plays, but right now it's awfully difficult to look at.  Even if it's necessary to include every play and screenplay he ever wrote (and I'm not sure it is, since many of these don't even have articles yet), is it possible to subdivide it by, say, full-length plays, screenplays, one acts, etc.?  Unless all these are full-length already, in which case, I'll happily shut up... --24.216.66.133 04:14, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Template 

message: Tennessee's 1937 play was not called "The Fugitive Kind" that was the name of the movie, starring Marlon Brondo, adapted from the play "Orpheus Descending" it was later re-worked and re-published as "A Battle of Angels." Within the list of plays the title should be "Orpheus Descending" 
----
TheBigGrayDog
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The above text is wrong.  "A Battle of Angels" was rewritten and published as "Orpheus Descending."  Whoever edited this earlier was mistaken.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.96.143.241 (talk) 18:31, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Fugitive Kind 1937 

message: Why is there a template of Tennessee topics at the bottom of the page? Williams is not really, in any way, part of Tennessee (other than in name an in family history, but only in this way is he vaguely connected). Has someone made a very stupid error or is it sly vandalism? Liontamarin 21:47, 6 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Went ahead and made the correction. It just didn't seem appropriate and didn't figure it should stay. Liontamarin 21:50, 6 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tennessee Topics Template 

message: The common "mad heroine" theme that appears in many of his plays may have been influenced by his sister.  This is marked with a "citation needed" tag, but I'm wondering why, since, if the information about Williams's closeness to Rose, her mental illness, and subsequent lobotomy allowed by her parents is all true, the rest seems sort of empirical.  It seems self-evident to me, at least in terms of "Suddenly Last Summer," that Catherine Holly's predicament seemed to shadow that of Williams's sister, Rose.   I would think that, if someone had instead added to the article that Williams had not been creatively influenced by his family, a citation would have been needed, since so many of his characters and their dramatic contexts seem relatively to have dynamics, personalities, and challenges germane to Williams's own experiences and family members.  Since the statement above is tagged with "citation needed," though, I'm now wondering if I misunderstand the necessity for a citation in the context of an article?
Help me out!
Sugarbat 16:16, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's all in that word "appears" - this is not a fact, but speculation. Don't get me wrong, that speculation may be very valid in terms of the circumstantial evidence, but you need to be explicit that it is speculation only. It also needs to be not just something a wikipedia editor thinks, but something the best known critics or biographers of Tennessee Williams think, demonstrated with citation - then it will have better validity.  Ceadge (talk) 09:38, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Citation Needed" for Rose's influence on Williams's writing? 

message: I have one source that says one arm was written in the 40's
amazon has it listed as published in 1950, 
http://www.amazon.com/One-Arm-Tennessee-Williams/dp/0811202232
and this article says 67.
can someone update that?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kactapuss (talk • contribs) 01:32, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  "One Arm Date? 

message: The article needs work with copy editing, sourcing and reorganizing.  The discussion of autobiographical elements and other aspects of the plays should be given separate treatment from the events of his life. It's confusing. I made a start.--Parkwells 17:43, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Reorganization

message: I added Hart Crane to the influences section on the side, since A) It says right in the article that he was one of his most profound influences and B) Williams said many times that Hart Crane was one of his biggest influences.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.13.107.185 (talk) 07:52, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Influences 

message: I don't understand why every wannabe unknown and overrated hype monger is included here simply because they referenced Tennessee in their work. Let's knock this off. Talk is cheap. So who needs it? He was far greater in every aspect, and deserves a well-sourced bio.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Telegrapher52 (talk • contribs) 05:51, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Trivia? Leave until this article is vetted 

message: Nothing in the article about he's convertion?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.21.246.145 (talk) 20:21, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: His "conversion" to Catholicism, facilitated by his brother Dakin after Tenn had just OD'd and was in rehab... it is important, but from what I understand, he only did it to appease his brother, not because of any profound religious experience.  Either way, it is an interesting thing to include, though I can't point to any source one way or another, I'll keep an eye out. HomelessRobles (talk) 04:11, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Convertion to catholicism

message: In the article we have two different dates that indicate his death, which are 24 and 25 of February! Citing source is needed! --Kaaveh (talk) 19:07, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Date for his death 

message: At “Nitocris”, it is claimed 
This does not perfectly contradict the claim in this article that 
if Smart Set didn't publish the story for a bit more than a year after it awarded the prize, but the suggestion is that one of these reports is in error. —SlamDiego←T 22:04, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  The dating of “Nitocris” 

message: This article has been reverted by a bot to  as part of a large-scale clean-up project of multiple article copyright infringement. (See the investigation subpage) This has been done to remove User:Accotink2's contributions as they have a history of extensive copyright violation and so it is assumed that all of their major contributions are copyright violations. Earlier text must not be restored, unless it can be verified to be free of infringement. For legal reasons, Wikipedia cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions must be deleted. Contributors may use sources as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously. VWBot (talk) 14:25, 10 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyright problem 

message: Regardless of what the reports said at the time, it is possible that Williams's death was a suicide? It's very mysterious to just have a bottle cap lodged in your throat like that. Since no one was with Williams when he died, no one really knows whether or not his death was a suicide. Thus, I think the possibility of suicide should be mentioned in the part about his death.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 169.235.85.2 (talk) 01:40, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Unfortunately, this would be original research. Sorry. TheStickMan[✆Talk] 02:17, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

text: That, and much more, are covered in the New York Times article cited. The section already has too many unsourced statements. --Wikiwatcher1 (talk) 01:15, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Death

message: If he was seven when the family moved to St. Louis, then he didn't "first" attend Soldan High School.  He would have been in grade school.  Also, the family first lived in the west-central portion of St. Louis City (hence the attendance at Soldan, which is a city high school), and later moved to University City, a nearby suburb. 
I don't want to make the changes without proper cites. I know there is at least one biography that documents the different places he lived (including addresses) and schools he attended in St. Louis, because I read it years ago, but I don't have time to look it up again. It's out there, though, for a more enterprising person to find.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mr dna2003 (talk • contribs) 14:00, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: There's a ton of stuff in St. Louis about him attending Soldan including the note about him on the St. Louis Walk of Fame.  This site notes he had 29 different homes in St. Louis.  Moving around that much would sure make it more believeable he was in the Soldan area at some point.Americasroof (talk) 14:25, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for your eagle eye.  I have clarified the wording on the article.Americasroof (talk) 16:03, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Education 

message: The Audrey Wood linked in the "Career" paragraph is not the agent, but a children's book author.  The childen's author was born in 1948, according to her Wiki bio, at least. Sources such as the agent's obituary show that she started her agency in 1937, so I think it's safe to say these are different people.  
I've not yet edited the entry, mainly because it will take some time, as an infrequent contributor, for me to ensure I'm following correct form. I hope it's needless to say that this influential agent needs her own entry.  Non-authoritative sources include the New York Times article documenting the dedication of the Audrey Wood Theater in 1984, current status of the theater itself unknown to me.  Time permitting I may try to draft a fresh bio, once I've read her autobiography, Represented by Audrey Wood (1981).  — Ebbixx (talk) 21:16, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Career 

message: How does an article get hundreds of edits over 8 months, with lots of action on the talk page, and nobody notices that the list of plays has gotten lost in a vandal fighting mishap?  When obscure articles that nobody looks at very much get screwed up for long periods of time, that's one thing, but this article?  That kind of thing is just embarrassing for the whole project. john k (talk) 16:31, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: It happens. TheStickMan[✆Talk] 03:34, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  For shame 

message: "The Williams family home in Columbus, Mississippi, was recently renovated and reopened."
Recently I've been to the "Tennessee Williams Welcome Center" in Columbus, MS, the house this refers to. Not only was the house renovated, it was moved from its original location. It can be visited and contains some TW memorabilia. http://www.thecityofcolumbusms.org/primary.asp?t=9&p=66
I'm not an experienced editor and English is not my first language, so I hope someone with more experience can edit / add this entry.
Imke2u (talk) 07:59, 13 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Columbus family home 

message: No expert here, I can't figure out why the infobox lists his nationality as "Mexican", when the body of the article lists no link between Williams and Mexico at all. 108.75.200.203 (talk) 03:05, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: That's an error. He wasn't Mexican at all. Futurist110 (talk) 01:40, 8 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why "Mexican"? 

message: In a lot of sources, it says that Tennessee Williams choked to death on a bottle cap (an extremely depressing way to die), but I've also read that he died of acute seconal intolerance here:
*http://www.nypost.com/p/pagesix/tennessee_death_myth_OjzkpyFjmyFnwEmBXQVSKK
*http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Repository/getFiles.asp?Style=OliveXLib:LowLevelEntityToPrint_ASCENT&Type=text/html&Locale=english-skin-custom&Path=CAP/2010/02/21&ID=Pc01413
*http://www.flavorwire.com/161476/71-things-you-didnt-know-about-tennessee-williams/5#content_top
*http://www.roundabouttheatre.org/upstage/lecture_glass.pdf
*http://scottkenan.blogspot.com/2011/05/finally-truth-about-tennessee-williams.html
These links/sources suggest that the bottle cap story was invented in order to avoid negative media coverage and that the coroner, Elliot Gross, quietly corrected his report six months afterwards. Heck, even this Wikipedia article--Secobarbital--supports the seconal intolerance claim. My question is, how did Tennessee Williams actually die? Futurist110 (talk) 01:40, 8 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Digging a little deeper, the book Unnatural Death by Michael Baden is cited as a source in that last blog link of mine. I checked this book and it appears to be pretty reliable. Also, Elliot Gross (if this is the person of the same name) was accused of incompetency several times (http://truthinjustice.org/gross.htm, http://articles.philly.com/2004-08-27/news/25391453_1_murder-charge-ellen-andros-medical-examiner-s-office, http://www.phillymag.com/articles/who-killed-ellen-andros/, http://www.nytimes.com/1987/10/30/nyregion/koch-dismisses-gross-faulting-his-leadership.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm, http://www.law.cornell.edu/nyctap/I93_0205.htm). Therefore, Gross lying about Tennessee Williams's death might not have been entirely implausible. Futurist110 (talk) 02:24, 8 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Larry Myers's credentials look legit (http://www.nytimes.com/1994/04/24/nyregion/a-prolific-playwright-finds-name-dropping-pays.html). I wonder if the revised report for Tennessee Williams's death (if it ever existed) can be found somewhere. That should resolve this whole dispute. Futurist110 (talk) 02:56, 8 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Cause of Death

message: Is it appropriate to add a section about TW's career as a poet? He published two collections, and his poems remain in print in a 2007 edition from New Directionshttp://ndbooks.com/book/the-collected-poems-of-tennessee-williams. The Poetry Foundation biohttp://www.poetryfoundation.org/bio/tennessee-williams cites instances in which Williams's "poetic" writing was a factor in the critical reception of his plays. And in the Paris Review interviewhttp://www.theparisreview.org/interviews/3209/the-art-of-theater-no-5-tennessee-williams TW says plainly "I’m a poet. And then I put the poetry in the drama. I put it in short stories, and I put it in the plays." Also related is this 26-minute audio recording of TW reading his poetry.Lleksahr.lo (talk) 16:26, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: TW as Poet ?

message: You say that his later works were written in a different style, that audiences didn't respond to. Can you give some idea what this new style was like? Valetude (talk) 13:53, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Style of his later works 

message: Someone has added "Jewish" to his ancestry.  While I wouldn't call myself an expert on Williams, I have read extensively about him (pretty much all the biographies, including his mother's) and I can find no such reliably sourced claim.  In fact, Williams' letters are full of casually anti-Semitic remarks, but no more than might be expected from someone of his generation and background.  In any case, Jewish ancestry is pretty unlikely and so I'm removing it unless someone can provide a citation.  Incidentally, I am 1/4 Jewish myself, so no claims of race/religion bias, please.Gillartsny (talk) 14:59, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I do not readily have the genealogy from Tennessee Williams back to John Lanier; however, Lanier Family Tree in Wikipedia reports a direct connection. Going back further in the tree, one can see that John Lanier was a child of Clement Lanier. Clement Lanier was the child of Nicholas the Elder Lanier and Lucretia Bassano. Lucretia is the daughter of Anthony Bassano and the granddaughter of Jeronimo Bassano. There are cited claims in the Jeronimo Bassino article in Wikipedia. While some researchers say the family was Jewish, another says they were converted Jews. Specifically, in the Project Continua: Women Who Persist article on Aemilia Lanyer, also descended from Jeronimo, she is called a Marrano Jew. So the Jewish ancestry is true, but perhaps it is too far back to be included without a paragraph on the topic. It could be something along the lines of ... Evan though Williams had a distant Jewish background, he wrote ...    I don't know if you could find this idea, but I bet he did not even know of the fact. You would have to include the Lanier family history. The Bassanos and the Laniers were musicians for Henry VIII among others. Could be an artist thing. I do not plan to write a section on this fact, but it might be a challenging idea for someone who is interested. JKWS13 (talk) 13:32, 12 July 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Seems way too distant to be claimed as significant.Parkwells (talk) 23:38, 5 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jewish?  I never heard that before 

message: I am new to editing and must confess that I am no expert on William's but "Williams found his classes boring, however, and was distracted by his unrequited love for a girl" doesn't seem to add up given that it is not mentioned anywhere that Williams wasn't homosexual. It seems to me that either relevant citations need to be found or the statement should be removed. Ahamletlostnamedgatsby (talk) 21:09, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  This seems a little out of place... 

message: ,
Regarding the images of the residences that were reverted, I see the issue in that there are already a lot of images in the article. I have a proposal to run by you, would it be ok of you to use a multiple image format in the paragraph starting out "When he returned to New York..." in Personal life.
Or, if you are concerned about the NY building image, just using the Key West image?–CaroleHenson (talk) 21:51, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: No, I think multiple images is a great solution. Beyond My Ken (talk) 01:35, 30 March 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, great. Thanks!–CaroleHenson (talk) 04:40, 30 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Residences 

message: In the Childhood section, a writer said that Williams' father "regarded his son's effeminacy with disdain". Unless there's a direct quotation in which Williams' father called him effeminate, it's just the preconceived notion of the writer. I added { {Citation needed} } FWIW
--Aimzzz (talk) 14:34, 29 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Effeminate"? 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20111021053816/http://www.usgennet.org/usa/mo/county/stlouis/williams/gen.htm to http://www.usgennet.org/usa/mo/county/stlouis/williams/gen.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20131212210036/http://www.thecityofcolumbusms.org/primary.asp?t=9&p=66 to http://www.thecityofcolumbusms.org/primary.asp?t=9&p=66
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I wonder, if some kind of international influence might be written in the wikipedia based on following fact:
"La chanson Quelque chose de Tennessee, écrite par Michel Berger pour Johnny Hallyday, lui est dédiée en 1985 (album Rock'n'Roll Attitude)."
(Read: :fr:Quelque chose de Tennessee)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.4.77.96 (talk) 20:34, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  International influence? 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:
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Participate in the deletion discussion at the . —Community Tech bot (talk) 04:41, 6 January 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion 

message: Please add, This Property is Condemned Passagress (talk) 02:03, 19 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Movie Missing