Talk:Dulce de leche

message: Dulce de leche is extremely popular in Mexico and Central America as well, although it is known with a different name, "cajeta" (a word for dulce the leche accepted by the Real Academia Española). Unfortunately this word has a second meaning in the Argentine and Chilean slang (with sexual connotations). Nonetheless, cajeta is the word used for dulce de leche, and it is as popular in Mexico and Central America as it is in South America. Also, the most common ducle de leche is made out of cow's milk, but in Mexico, dulce de leche made out of goat's milk is popular as well. --Comment unsigned by J.Alonso
:ok. great. why did you post this in the discussion page, instead of the article? --Gerardo199 19:54, July 29, 2005 (UTC)
::I'm Argentinian and actually here the word "cajeta" is not used with sexual connotations. You're crazy, J.Alonso? --200.123.161.135 04:18, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Come on, man! Unless you've been living on top of the Aconcagua since birth, you should know Cajeta DOES have sexual connotation in Argentina. I laughed my ars off when, in Mexico, I bought some Bigotes de Cajeta (they were actually good). Mariano(t/c) 09:28, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yup, I guess the anonymous user lives on the top of the Aconcagua. Or perhaps, he is extremely naïve. --J.Alonso 19:19, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I may be being nit-picky about this, but the article makes it sound as though it is called 'cajeta' in Central America, too. It is called 'dulce de leche' at least in El Salvador and Guatemala.–Bspacheco 06:11, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

text: Following the recepy, yes. My mom used to make dulce de leche by cooking a closed Condensed milk can in boiling water. Nevertheless, I'm not sure they are historically related. Mariano(t/c) 11:05, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cajeta 

message: Perhaps is more easy to understand if you compare toffee (English toffee) whith "dulce de leche". In this way "dulce de leche" is a soft-toffee. Essentially is the same.
:Nope. It's identical to Scots tablet but there's only a vague resemblance to toffee, English or otherwise. Toffee ain't crumbly. -- Derek Ross | Talk 07:48, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Toffee 

message: I saw the musical Guys and Dolls a couple of months ago at my friend's high school and in the cabana scene Sky orders a "Dulce de leche" for Sarah when she asks for a milkshake, and it turns out to be an alcoholic drink he uses to basically trick her into getting drunk. The dialogue goes a little something like this:
Sky: How about a drink?
Sarah: A milkshake, please.
Sky (to the waitress): Dulce de leche.
Sarah (after getting her drink): These are delicious, what did you call them?
Sky: Dulce de leche.
Sarah: Dulce de leche... what's in it, besides milk?
Sky: Oh, sugar... and a sort of native flavoring.
Sarah: What's the name of the flavoring?
Sky: Bacardi.
Sarah: Doesn't Bacardi have alcohol in it?
Sky: Only enough to act as a preservative.
If you've seen Guys and Dolls you know that Sarah ends up drunk, but anyways, I'm just wondering a lot about this now, because the article says nothing about a drink that goes by the same name. Anyone have any information on this? Shivers talk 23:38, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alcoholic drink? 

message: Hey there, I'm Gustavo and I want to introduce myself and to collaborate in this beautiful project. By the way, "dulce de leche", as you mention here, is not Argentinian but Uruguayan as well, so I would rather use the word River Plate or Rio de la Plata in order to include both of them.
You will see, there are several theories on the subject and you may have your opinions which do not prove to be fully considered as true or reliable evidence. Indeed, we should take into account the fact that Uruguay and Argentina were and still are countries with a similar history, more or less the same kind of culture and customs and, what is more, we both speak "Rioplatense Spanish", perhaps that being the reason why here, in Europe and in other countries in the globe, people tend to associate Uruguay with Argentina and viceversa. They don't see the difference, then, I say, should we?
It's not my aim to argue about something irrelevant but I thought we, as River Plate brothers, must take conscience of this fact and stop with that rivalry.
I would like to include the Uruguayan theory and, actually, I'll do it as soon as I have time. For now I can only say that African slaves may have introduced dulce de leche into the country and then spread all over the region. I'm not saying that this idea has to be considered as truth, when everyone knows that the origins of this jam is a subject to discuss.
Finally, "dulce de leche" is available in some places here in Spain and Andorra, and has nothing to do with Peruvian or other versions of the product. The flavor is different, the color changes according to the ingredients that each country employs and the "name" is also different. In Chile, for instance, the so called "dulce de leche" contains, among its main ingredients, nut cream and, sometimes, chocolate.
I agree with those who said that dulce de leche must have an article of it own.
--Gustave - May I help you? 00:18, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Rivalry and further comments on the subject

message: I actually heard that dulce de leche was actually invented in Bretagne by a nationalistic french teacher in my school who also claims, for instance that the Malvinas should actually be french...
What exactly makes that point of view more valid than the Argentine one??? I mean, and i'm quoting from this atricle,"It is, however, more likely to have its origins in Europe"...
Maberk, 12/11/06
:I guess you mean the Dulce de Leche and not the Malvinas. You have to have in mind the importance of Dulce de Leche to Argentina and the hole South America; wereas it might have it origin elsewere (I would remove the more likely from the text) it is mostly important in the context of the Argentine cuisine. Mariano(t/c) 12:35, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: French Invention

message: As a joke reply, I would like to remind you here in Russia we caramelize condensed milk without thinking of the French or the Spanish. It sorta annoys to me see how Dulce De Leche "takes all the credit", but that how it happens all the time: you just can't invent something without being told your newly invented thing have already existed elsewhere. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 08:33, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Russian invention 

message: the cajeta article is too short and should be merged into the Dulce de leche article. I also think cajeta is just a type of dulce de leche and it's the same thing as AREQUIPE.. typical of Colombia, Venezuela and other countries.. remember the obleas?. the name may be mexican but cajeta or arequipe isn't solely mexican or invented in mexico, neither Colombia or venezuela.. so these articles are inaccurate and must provide references.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by F3rn4nd0 (talk • contribs) 
:Well, Cajeta is from goat's milk (I believe), and Dulce de Leche from cow's. It might not be a big difference, but the final product is not exactly the same. Arequipe is somehow whiter and also tates rather differently. I'm not sure it is such a bad idea leaving each regional version separatelly.--Mariano(t/c) 12:20, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Cajeta is usually made half&half (goat and cow's milk), but I believe both cajeta and arequipe fall under the same general concept of "Dulce de leche". In spite of the small variations in ingredients (quite normal in transnational products), cajeta is synonym of dulce de leche, at least in Mexico, though I do not know if it is the case in Central America. Like F3rn4nd0 suggested, I agree on merging the articles. It makes no sense to have separate articles (treating them as two different things) and then speaking about the legendary origins of all types of dulce de leche. --Dúnadan 16:59, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Cajeta Vs Dulce de leche?

message: Let me toss in my two cents on the terminology stuff. My knowledge of this is limited to the Peruvian confection Manjar Blanco and the U.S. confection Dulce de Leche. I can tell you that these are very different things. As a practical matter I believe that the basic ingredients are the same (although the minor flavorings may be different) but the preparation is different. The key difference is the caramelization of the sugars which gives dulce de leche its brown color and strong flavor. This is NOT the case for manjar blanco which is why it has a more creamy flavor and white color (hence the name). Unfortunately I have little knowledge of the confections of other countries so I do not know which type of confection applies to which country. As far as the cajeta/ariquipe debate above I cannot say what each refers to. One thing that adds to the confusion today is that in many places dulce de leche is gradually creeping in as a replacement for manjar blanco since it is easier to make.
One specific comment: The Spanish "Manjar blanco" article says that Chile uses "manjar" to refer to dulce de leche whereas this page says that it refers to "manjar blanco" like Peru. Can somebody resolve the discrepancy?
--Mcorazao 16:14, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I noticed too and fixed this. Christophe Lasserre 02:07, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  More terminology debates 

message: From dulce de leche article: "Although the transformation that occurs in preparation is often called caramelization, it is actually a form of the Maillard reaction, a chemical reaction that is responsible for many of the flavors of cooked food." From Maillard reaction article: " The following things are NOT a result of the Maillard browning reaction: caramel made from milk and sugar, especially in candies".  So which is it?  Caramel also contains this contradiction. 76.202.58.168 04:51, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Indented line Like the Maillard reaction, caramelization is a type of non-enzymatic browning. However, unlike the Maillard reaction, caramelization is pyrolysis, as opposed to reaction with amino acids.
Afaicr (from watching Heston Blumenthal, lol), the Maillard reaction is one that converts proteins to sugars, in agreement with the above. Also, simmering an unopened can of condensed milk in water for hours (these things I knew about from an Argentinian woman I knew 30 years ago) wouldn't reach the right temperature for the Maillard reaction either (I realise it may be possible for that reaction to occur at lower temperatures at higher pressures). Nigella pronounces it as an Italian would pronounce "Dulce de lecce": you'd think she'd be better educated than that. Fuficius Fango (talk) 17:35, 28 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Maillard or not? 

message: I moved the sentance about starbucks offering dulce de leche flavored lattes and frappachinos from the "origins" section to the main section. It still seems a little out of place so if anyone thinks it needs to be moved or changed around to fit better with the rest of the information, please do so. Glassbreaker5791 16:51, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Location of Starbucks fact 

message: I presume you don't want this wikipedia entry to become a list of products, but I thought I'd mention that The Hershey Company seems to have a number of new ones that are flavored with DdL.  
Hershey's Dulce de Leche Syrup
It seems that they tried dulce de leche kisses but they aren't listed on their products list now so maybe they weren't popular enough. 
According to this, Nabisco also has DdL-flavored Oreos. 
jwilkinson (talk) 19:11, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Other Dulce de Leche products 

message: change the name to English, this is wikipedia in English not Spanish Wikipedia.--~EEIMEEIM (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 22:39, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  And what name do you suggest? Even Häagen-Dazs uses "dulce de leche" as one of its ice cream flavors.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 148.87.19.210 (talk) 23:51, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: cambiar el nombre

message: "Legend says that it was invented in Argentina [1]. "
I think this is irrelevant for an enciclopedic article. All cultures have legends about the origin of many things. For example, some people think that storks deliver newborn babies or that babies come from Paris, yet this is not mentioned in the article about human pregnancy or about France.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 148.87.19.210 (talk) 00:02, 12 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Legend 

message: I think this is stretching the point a bit. The Philippines has a population of over 100 million, less than half a million of whom speak Spanish (i.e. less than 0.5%). Only 3,110 Spanish nationals currently live in the Philippines, and "the majority of the population is composed of ethnolinguistic groups whose languages are Austronesian also known as Malayo-Polynesian in origin." -Spacemartin (talk) 21:07, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  "The only Hispanic country in Asia, the Philippines" 

message: Dulce de Leche as such a thing, has it origins in Argentina and Uruguay. In Brasil and the rest of Latam is a whole different product. The oldest register of something alike Dulce de leche is a Chilean prepararion called 'Manjar Dulce'.
I feel these English texts in Wikipedia only has the objective of deny Latam products and history towards the World Market. Otherwise, I don't get the goal of them. There are a lot of active talks that are meant to correct it with the right information. 181.13.65.10 (talk) 13:22, 13 July 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: It is the same in Spanish Wikipedia. If you wish to modify this portion of the article, please provide a reliable source.--ReyHahn (talk) 15:14, 13 July 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article y all wrong 

message: Is it like caramel? 174.21.23.217 (talk) 04:42, 25 November 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Dulce de leche goes through non-enzimatic browning (Maillard and caramelization). If enough sugar is added it tastes similar to caramel (just not quite). Note that caramel does not contain milk while in dulce de leche milk is the main ingredients.--ReyHahn (talk) 09:24, 25 November 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dulce de leche 

message: I’ve noticed that most articles for food have a list of ingredients or generalized nutrition info, are this article lacks that. Is this an exception? And following this, does Dulce du Leche contain lactose in high enough amounts to trigger an allergic reaction, or is it cooked out with the evaporating moisture? I do not know the specifics, and feel free to remove my question if it is incorrect to ask here. 2600:1014:B044:6728:E8B2:6D16:B54D:8E64 (talk) 14:32, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I added nutritional value table per request. Does that cover your needs? --ReyHahn (talk) 17:38, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

text: Weird question, as the milky's essence doesn't not evaporate, the water aka dihydrogen monooxide does. If you want a non-lactic dairy product, try looking up words like kefir or varenets/ryazhenka; or tvorog, or smetana/sour cream to see whether lactose or caseine or other proteine you are allergic to gets disassebled by the fermentation process OkiPrinterUser (talk) 08:42, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nutrition Information 

message: Here in Russia, the are no products labelled as something with "Dulce de leche". And thus, no factory in Russia would ever fill its oreshki condiment with something labelled as "Dulce de leche" because "no one knows what it is", "we would have to spend a lot of money on the PR campaign". 
What I see on the photo is, it's merely boiled condensed milk, instead. Please don't misinterpret candies from Russian cuisine as Latin ones. It's like claiming Russian X is "actually Western Y under other name" - wrong; because that would involve confusing correlation and causation OkiPrinterUser (talk) 13:54, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  The oreshki 

message: IMO, people should actually focus on listing the ingredient variations of Dulce de leche, not on its popularity "under different name". You see, the basic Dulce de Leche looks like basic boiled milk with sugar - it's like implying every bread and butter sandwich is a butterbrot dish of German origin.
However, according to the earlier commentators, there ARE variations of dulce de leche, where some are good and some... well, not so much. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 14:21, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kinds of Dulce de leche - needs a list of ones indeed marketed as ''dulce de leche'' 

message: === Condensed milk dulce de leche ===
A form of dulce de leche sometimes is made by boiling an unopened can of sweetened condensed milk for two to three hours (or 30 to 45 minutes if contained within a pressure cooker), particularly by those living in countries where it cannot be bought ready-made. This results in a product that is much sweeter than the slow-boiled kind. This method could be dangerous, and should not be done on a stove: if the pot is allowed to boil dry, the can will overheat and explode.
=== What should be improved ===
So. This article got a dangerousy sounding recipe, that calls for making a "homemade dulce de leche" by cooking a whole unopened tin can! That can explode if not careful enough! ALL WHILE it says in an adjacent paragraph: "Much of the water in the milk evaporates and the mix thickens". Ugh. Removed (moved to the talk page) because 1) 450-recipe cookbook could have been a compilation of original recipes from newspapers (hence WP:OR or rather, WP:SELF) 2) that's just unsafe. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 08:10, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Homemade dulce de leche" made of a tin can 

message: So. This article got a dangerousy sounding recipe, that calls for making a "homemade dulce de leche" by cooking a whole unopened tin can! That can explode if not careful enough! ALL WHILE it says in an adjacent paragraph: "Much of the water in the milk evaporates and the mix thickens". Ugh. Removed (moved to the talk page) because 1) 450-recipe cookbook could have been a compilation of original recipes from newspapers (hence WP:OR or rather, WP:SELF) 2) that's just unsafe. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 08:10, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  What should be improved 

message: ==== Glass jar ====
According to https://sgushhenka.ru/poleznye-sovety/varenaya-v-domashnix-usloviyax.html (a primary source, though. In Russian...) you can pretty much boil condensed milk in a glass jar, standing upright and surrounded by water; no need to boil a whole tin can
 Ставим в кастрюлю, куда наливаем воду. Вода должна доставать до уровня содержимого в банке.
 После закипания убавляем газ и варим 3 часа. Не помешиваем.
It should be put in a pot, the water level should reach the level of condensed milk.
After boiling, the heat should be reduced. Keep cooking for 3 hours.
Hope this helps.
ALSO: In Russian, the idea of boiling something in 2 pots or a pot and a jar is called "vodyanaya banya" - an idea of giving your food a sauna-like treatment rather than applying direct boiling. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 10:02, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alternative ideas to boil condensed milk to dulce-ify it 

message: According to https://sgushhenka.ru/poleznye-sovety/varenaya-v-domashnix-usloviyax.html (a primary source, though. In Russian...) you can pretty much boil condensed milk in a glass jar, standing upright and surrounded by water; no need to boil a whole tin can
 Ставим в кастрюлю, куда наливаем воду. Вода должна доставать до уровня содержимого в банке.
 После закипания убавляем газ и варим 3 часа. Не помешиваем.
It should be put in a pot, the water level should reach the level of condensed milk.
After boiling, the heat should be reduced. Keep cooking for 3 hours.
Hope this helps.
ALSO: In Russian, the idea of boiling something in 2 pots or a pot and a jar is called "vodyanaya banya" - an idea of giving your food a sauna-like treatment rather than applying direct boiling. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 10:02, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Glass jar 

message: The same link (https://sgushhenka.ru/poleznye-sovety/varenaya-v-domashnix-usloviyax.html) says you can microwave condensed milk. The measurements aren't listed, so I assume it's 1 "regular" jar, under 402g/1 pound in mass.
1. Put it into a microwave-suitable bowl
2. Set up max wattage and 20 min times
3. Mix every 3 minutes.
6 iterations of mixing, 7 iterations of microwaving, but at least it won't explode. OkiPrinterUser (talk) 10:02, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Microwave cooking 

message: The "preparation and uses" section is looking very much like a cookbook or how-to, which Wikipedia is WP:NOT. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 16:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Except, this recipe has its notability: it is necessary to conter a "boiling a tin can" dangerous meme (see above). 2A00:1370:81A2:4AE2:707C:13AC:57F6:698B (talk) 09:08, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  cookbook... 

message: You have both recently reverted the addition of citations to various cooking websites used to verify various food-related facts (such as the fact that dulce de leche goes by the name kajmak in Poland). I would argue that, since this is a food-related article, food-related websites are going to be the best sources. What would you suggest as better sources? WikiDan61ChatMe!ReadMe!! 13:04, 24 January 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Journal articles, books, other such reliable sources as are expected in other non-food related articles. Many recipe sites exist only to collect ad views, and the Wikipedia article risks becoming a spam magnet. ... discospinster talk 16:02, 24 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent reverts based on "not a cookbook" rationale