Talk:HIM (Finnish band)

message: To the ignorant people who put this genre:
Do you even know what Alternative Rock is??? How can you label HIM as Alternative Rock??? The latest album might have some elements of it, but HIM is NOT an Alternative Rock band... They have Gothic Rock elements, Metal elements, Glam Rock elements and much more... Iaberis 18:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't make personal attacks, that doesn't make your argument stronger. It was long established before that the genre is some kind of alternative rock. 72.154.87.112 19:00, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Does it really matter, i mean we all know it's Love Metal (genre) and can't we just leave it at that? - Beautiful so ur (talk) 17:24, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The fact that it has metal in it makes it not gothic rock, lol — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.192.236.174 (talk) 05:40, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

text: 87.122.10.165 here is correct saying Love Metal is not an encylopedic/notable/recoginised genre therefore we can't use it in the infobox unfortunately.  AngelOfSadness  talk  17:45, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

text: Okay, thanks JohannHenrik. Cacodyl (talk) 12:25, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Moe, where are these "months of discussion"? In this section at least they seem to be purely debating whether or not the genre is "Love Metal". It is obviously not, as that genre does not exist. No one seems to be discussing whether or not it's a sub-genre of metal, which seems fair enough. Cacodyl (talk) 14:38, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I suggest you look at the top of this talk page, the links to the archives for the old discussions, thats where the same old tired debate on the genre that has been discussed countless times over and over again. It was decided to keep it at alternative rock, thus the warning in the middle of the genre box to not change it without consensus, which you kindly ignored. If you want to restart this conversation, again, you may want to alert WikiProject HIM's members. In addition, basing your change on a proposed change that was, albeit unrelated to this original thread, was actually proposed by yourself and supported only by a new account to Wikipedia with no history, is not consensus. Most of the members are probably not aware of the change, I suggest you let all of them take part in this discussion. — Moe ε 16:19, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Yeah, right, and if you play it in reverse you'll hear satan's voice and it will install windows 95 on your pc. Song lyrics are like Rorschach test - you see what you want to see. If you see satanism than perhaps you have a problem.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.28.202.102 (talk) 18:09, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Alternative Rock???

message: alternative rock??????????(like a placebo,radiohead,30stm)...
To the ignorant people who put this genre: Do you even know what Alternative Rock is??? How can you label HIM as Alternative Rock??? The latest album might have some elements of it, but HIM is NOT an Alternative Rock band... They have Gothic Rock elements, Metal elements, Glam Rock elements and much more...they are love metal  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Albertrocker (talk • contribs) 20:11, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no such musical genre as Love metal. That link goes to an article about the band's album. Until there is a genre article to link to and you have a reliable source to show that someone other than you believes HIM are a "love metal" band, you cannot add it here. And please lay off the personal attacks like calling other editors "ignorant"; that doesn't help anyone. Thanks, Gwernol 20:14, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  alternative rock???? 

message: *him(1991/2000) LOVE METAL
*now they are POST LOVE METAL  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.248.44.241 (talk) 18:15, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, love metal is not a real genre. Thanks, — Moe ε 13:04, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  What the heck is post love metal? Zazaban (talk) 05:09, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Genre 

message: Actually, listing the three most sourced genres (which are in this case, gothic rock, gothic metal and alternative rock) could have been a good solution for all this dispute. Nevertheless, some people approached this problem in a more subjective way, I guess. Myxomatosis57 (talk) 19:17, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: OK then, where are the Goth elements? Wear some black clothes and you are a Goth musician? Seriously, HIM was never a Goth rock band. All the band members have got a Metal background. A style definition has nothing to do with POV. Every music style has its own characteristics. And HIM isn't Goth at all. They don't even fit into the Goth metal genre.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.134.3.58 (talk) 15:21, 3 October 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: No, it is about POV and is original research; based on your perception of the band's style. The biggest problem for this article (in terms of genre) are the fanbase constantly flooding in and boycotting every single well-sourced genre that is not "love metal", (e.g. alternative or goth, no matter they're actually sourced or not). I changed my mind now, better to keep it solely as rock. Myxomatosis57 (talk) 08:46, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: A suggestion

message: Ever since the article became a real B-Class article, it is clear that the article is mostly maintained by SilverBullitt. He completely redid the article from scratch. There is now an overwhelmingly large number of sources tying HIM to gothic subgenres. It was decided we would use those for the article's infobox, as genre wars with fans are now far less common. dannymusiceditor  Speak up!  02:35, 11 August 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: New generation article: Rewritten version c. 2017

message: I've found some evidence on a website that confirms that HIM is infact a metal band! Here it is, http://www.spirit-of-metal.com/groupe-groupe-HIM-l-en.html Note: That I've also fix the genre on the wikipedia page.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by S.R.G.G Spinster (talk • contribs) 23:15, 11 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  HIM (Finnish band) 

message: Someone who knows more than me about the band needs to go through the article cleaning up grammar and adding references for some of the claims made. --Anarchangel23 (talk) 02:41, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Cleanup Needed

message: Can someone removed the tours section because it is out of date and has dates of upcoming shows from 2007, it is now 2008, feel free to make a new section for 2008 tours and gigs.
Will sign when I can log in. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.70.166.128 (talk) 12:28, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I took out all of the out of date info and put the rest in the past tense. Cheers for bringing it up as it probably would have been left like that 'til the summer. ;)  AngelOfSadness  talk  19:09, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Cheers, You may also want to add the fact they did quite a big tour with Black Sabbath too.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.71.190.137 (talk) 01:16, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Tours

message: I've put this article under semi-protection due to vandalism in the genre option. It seems that some guy, keeps on removing the genre paragraph and replaces the genre without even talking here first... Iaberis 18:59, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Woot that means that this article actually kinda matters and people give a shit :D. A good step towards the HIM wiki editors goal....HIM_(band) FA status! :p --Diaboli 00:04, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you sure it's been semi-protected as an IP user has just edited it?  AngelOfSadness  talk  21:04, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

text: Well, the DumBot unremoved it... I'll ask for a permanent semi-protection... Iaberis 01:55, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The bot removed it because the page wasn't protected by an admin. Simply adding a protection tag doesn't protect the page itself from edits by IP addresses. One IP vandalising a day isn't something we can't handle without page protection. Now if it got to the point where there was vandalism edits every five minutes then would be the time to request page protection.  AngelOfSadness  talk  13:07, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Protection

message: Ok, Maybe I'm just bringing up old points here, but I couldn't find anything about them in the archives and I've got questions I need answered. First, The statement that they aren't a satanic band. I was willing to accept this at first, but the constant 666 theme is really iffy to me. Also, the fact that their name was His Infernal Majesty also brings up a lot of questions. Can anyone explain their name and theme? If they really aren't satanic or straight goth, give me some proof. Also, This part of the article just seems ridiculous:
"Their first bandname was His Infernal Majesty (chosen spontaneously, as a complete joke). But as their popularity rose, they needed to change their name because:
    * Finnish people were having difficulties pronouncing the name
    * The band name was never actually serious
    * The band started getting unwanted occult associations and people started to think of the band as satanic when it is not."
Not only does this seem completely POV, but is there any proof that their first name was a joke? I can understand the occult associations part, if they're not satanic, but Finnish people were having trouble pronouncing it? That just seems stupid. Any answers for me? 70.171.209.15 03:13, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Just listen to their music and you will understand that their not satanic.The Illusional Ministry 17:42, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok to answer a few questions, First of all Ville has said in several interviews that the name is not satanic blah blah etc. All that info has been taken from interviews. So since it has been taken from interviews it is not POV. I don't know where you got that first quote about "Chosen spontaneously" since Ville has stated that the origin was from the same book that Whoever guy in Sabbath got the name "Black Sabbath" and since HIM was originally a Sabbath cover band they got a name from the same book, and ENGLISH book which they at first didn't understand the connotations of the name. All that matters to me (and should be for others) is that Ville has said the band is not satanic thus they aren't and like Illusional Ministry mentioned above me, you can listen to the music and tell it is not Satanic, I mean god this ain't black metal. Also about the whole "Heartagram looks like a Pentagram." fucking shit I thought that was in the article? About how its a heart and a pentagram combined together to be kinda like a yin and yang about love and death etc. Yet again interviews with ville. SO LONG STORY SHORT THE ARTICLE IS FINE. --NekoD 08:33, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Do you even know what Gothic Rock is? Have a listen on The 69 Eyes and The Sisters of Mercy and come back to discuss the gothic rock elements in HIM... Iaberis 18:26, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Other

message: Him & Her redirects to here, but the article has no mention of it anywhere that they might have been previously named Him & Her. Also, on the MTV2 Headbangers Ball, Vol. 2, the song Your Sweet Six Six Six is published under the name Him & Her. Anyone know any information on this? § Eloc § 02:09, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Please see HIM_(band)#Name_confusion, which touches on the subject briefly. — Moe ε 05:16, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Him & Her]] 

message: Noticed someone changing "formed in" date to 1992 from 1991, so I took a look.  Err, the reference sites say 1995.  Published discography says 1995.  Only reference to an earlier date is about "an undistributed demo tape whose only copy is ..." - sheesh!  Why does it say anything other than 1995?  Which references says that? Shenme (talk) 13:25, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: But in a few interviews, over the years, Ville said that he, Mige and Linde formed a band when they were fourteen/fifteen (around 1991/1992)("Witches and Other Night Fears" demo tape was made in 1992), then the guys minus Ville (due to his asthma) worked in army forces of some sort for a few years(correct me there if I'm wrong), then the guys reformed when they were around eighteen (around 1995) as HIM, made a second demo called "This Is Only the Beginning", which was released in 1995(The first proper release by the band so I'm guessing that explains with what the published discography says) and released first EP 1996 etc. I'm not sure if they were called HIM back in 1991/1992 when the first started out or they might have gone by another name and then changed it or if they should be treated as two different bands. But I'm guessing that's where all of the confusion lies regarding the band's beginnings. Now it's just trying to make any sense of all of this, separate fact from fiction and trying to find reliable sources to back it all up. :)  AngelOfSadness  talk  13:53, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Considering it is well known that the band made a demo in 1992 (Witches and Other Night Fears), saying it is 1995 when they formed is incorrect, no matter what references refer to 1995 (as a matter of fact, those references that also say 1995 also recognize the 1992 recording anyways, so those refs saying 1995 need to get their fact straight :P). A Google search for HIM in 1991 will provide hits outside of Wikipedia and its mirrors. As for 1992, I'm not so sure. I never heard the band ever being formed that year, but that is the year its first recording is noted. Most references either say 1991 or 1995, with 1995 being the completely without knowledge of Witches and Other Night Fears. — Moe ε 16:35, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure I even found a reference stating they were founded in 1996. But I did, however, find an english excerpt from Synnin Viemää (I'm fairly sure it was an offcial finnish biography on Ville/the band published a few years back), were it says the band were formed in 1991(You have to scroll down halfway to the paragraph below the header "HIM, HIS INFERNAL MAJESTY". Well at least that's something for now :)  AngelOfSadness  talk  16:56, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  1991 / 1992 / 1995 / 666 ? 

message: Currently there is only a subtle capitalization to disambiguate HiM (band) from HIM (band). The idea in this proposal it to make it more explicit by moving:
*HiM (band) → HiM (American band)
*HIM (band) → HIM (Finnish band)
Thoughts/discussions? +mt 14:56, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that would be fair to do as it not only would meet what's said in WP:Naming conventions but it would also be easier to distingush the two bands from each other which can be hard for anyone who doesn't know much about either band.  AngelOfSadness  talk  18:26, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: moved Straight Edge PXK 23:39, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Move both HIM and HiM band articles

message: I'm just wondering if there is consensus as to the pronunciation of the band's name - is it 'H-I-M' or 'him'? I can't find a reference online after a Google search, but if anyone has one I think it should be added to the article. --Aseld talk 10:40, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: There never really needed to be a consensus given that the band themselves call "him" by pronunciation (written in all caps as HIM not separated by periods like R.E.M). People only spell the band name out as H.I.M. in written mediums because of the whole "His Infernal Majesty" thing back in the nineties as to what HIM stood for and, I'm guessing, the use of capitals in the name suggested it spelled out something. And as a joke apparently the band said it stood for His Infernal Majesty (keeping in with the link to Satan an such) in interviews to deal with that particuarly repetitive "annoying/stupid question" that plagued them in their early interviews . But no one, in my knowledge, has ever spelled out the name HIM when referring to them in non-written mediums (like on radio or television) so it's not really a thing that has come up before probably because the band's name isn't H.I.M. to begin with hence why each letter isn't said in the pronunciation unlike R.E.M.  AngelOfSadness  talk  17:52, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, thank you (I'd never heard of the band prior to reading the article, and approaches to periods in initialisms vary). --Aseld talk 08:13, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pronunciation 

message: I would do this by myself, but I don't know how. Someone needs to create a separate page for Screamworks: Love In Theory & Practice, their album coming out in 2010. Because it's an album, it needs a separate page solely for the album, detailing everything people need to know about this album. Like I said, I would do it, but I don't know how  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Corleonelives (talk • contribs) 17:47, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Screamworks Needs A Seperate Page 

message: I know this is a bootleg but there's a lot of fans who actually own a copy (gutted?), so I was thinking of adding this either to the main page or as a Bootleg page, because this isn't the only one. What are other people's views? Or should it just be ignored completely and let more unsuspecting fans buy more of something that is not genuine? - Beautiful so ur (talk) 15:30, 18 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ultra Rare Trax Vol.1 

message: To whoever deleted the "Werchter Festival Bootleg" page and had it redirected to the 'HIM Discography' page: the Werchter Festival Bootleg is not a bootleg, it is an official release by the band/Universal records. --St.HocusPocus (talk) 05:07, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I know this is a very late reply, but please read the edit summary accompanying that edit. It being an official release has nothing to do with why it was redirected - it was not proven to be notable as no reliable, significant third-party coverage had been found. Just because a band releases something doesn't make that release notable enough for an article here on Wikipedia. In fact, there are notable bootlegs that receive their own WP articles (the most notorious example has to be Dawn of the Black Hearts, although that's currently debatable since it's had a questionable-notability tag for about a year now). Zeke, the Mad Horrorist (Speak quickly) (Follow my trail) 20:09, 11 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Werchter Festival Bootleg 

message: Why have all the pages for the bands singles been deleted? I've scanned several other band pages here on Wikipedia and none of them seem to have had all the pages about a particular song/single, completely removed.
--St.HocusPocus (talk) 10:44, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: First of all, they were not deleted, they were redirected to their respective album pages. Second, not all of them were (those with verified high chart positions were retained). For those that were, this was done because the singles themselves were not demonstrated to be notable & worthy of their own articles. Some of them also had particular problems with crufty & unverified information. To address your second sentence, that's likely just because no one's gotten to it or decided what to do with yet, so its existence doesn't automatically justify that of other such pages on Wikipedia. Zeke, the Mad Horrorist (Speak quickly) (Follow my trail) 19:56, 11 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of All Song Pages 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on HIM (Finnish band). Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110711161345/http://www.heartagram.com/store/featured/digital-versatile-doom-live-orpheum-theater-xxxvii-wflipbook to http://www.heartagram.com/store/featured/digital-versatile-doom-live-orpheum-theater-xxxvii-wflipbook
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110711161457/http://www.heartagram.com/news/2010/11/01/swrmxs-official-screamworks-remix-album to http://www.heartagram.com/news/2010/11/01/swrmxs-official-screamworks-remix-album#comments
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Is there a Wikipedia policy which limits the sizes on these images? These look so much larger than any other image I've seen on a band article. They're ginormous. They should be adjusted nevertheless, but I don't know the specific limits. dannymusiceditor  Speak up!  00:10, 18 September 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image sizes 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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