Talk:United States of Greater Austria

message: I have heard about the archduke reforming the empire, however I have never heard of him renaming it the "United States of Great Austria", how was it supposed to be called in German? Gryffindor 14:16, 25 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: German name

message: remove "great"? 900 google hits. Tobias Conradi (Talk) 06:17, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: This is still odd though. I have never heard of such a name. The websites (now taking away the 'blogs') talk about a "concept" or "something like" the United States of (Great)er) Austria. I would say maybe combine the ideas of the archduke with his article? Gryffindor 22:21, 26 October 2005 (UTC)

text: Although the article is interesting, I have to point out that the Archduke thought of a concept of a "United States of Austria", but I have not found any evidence that he or anyone ever thought about seriously renaming the empire as such. Therefore naming the article is quite misleading. I therefore propose that the article (or parts of it) be merged with that of the Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria. Anyone who objects obviously please feel free to say so. Gryffindor 13:59, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

text: Some information on the United States of Great Austria in First World War doccumentary episode "To Arms" they show a map drawn by order of the Archduke calling the empire "Die Vereinigten Staaten von Gross-Österreich".Renato Rocha 17:54, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, what I have found is a book published by the Romanian Aurel Popovici, which he did in 1906, explaining the concept of a "Vereinigten Staaten von Groß-Österreich" , . This would translate as "United States of Greater Austria" I think. Does anyone know the difference between "Great (country)" and "Greater (country)"? Because I get more hits on google if I type in "United States of Greater Austria", which would make more sense. However, the references so far seem to point at Popovici, maybe he picked it up from the Archduke? So this is confusing, there seem to be at least two creators of this idea? The German Wikipedia makes some references to this: , . Also maybe the article should be renamed in this case? 
Google hits "United States of Great Austria": 14 
Google hits "United States of Greater Austria": 49 
Google hits "Vereinigte Staaten von Groß-Österreich": 231 
any suggestions? Gryffindor 12:08, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

text: I've heard of this concept, and moved it to its correct name (Vereinigte Staaten von Groß-Österreich in German, United States of Greater Austria in English). I'm against a merge; if you think the article is too short, I'll try to find some comprehensive information at the Österreichische Nationalbibliothek on the issue.  ナイトスタリオン ✉ 08:31, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Added some information. What do you think?  ナイトスタリオン ✉ 08:54, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I was going to change the tag to a rename-tag anyways, I would have preferred if we had a discussion about a renaming first, because I am not sure how to translate "Groß" in this case, both "Great" and "Greater" work such as "Great Britain" but "Greater Serbia" for example, both "Groß (Name)" in German language. I think it probably is "Greater" in this case, but I would like to hear some more opinions first. In any case, yes it looks much better, cheers. I will add some information as well, especially expand on the ideas of Popovic, they seem to be in synch with those of the archduke, not 100% sure though.. Gryffindor 10:17, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry for being too bold; however, it was rather clear to me in this case, as all other concepts of a Großreich use "Greater" AFAIK (cf. Greater Romania, Greater Albania, Greater Serbia, Greater Poland, Greater Germany, ...), and since I personally have only encountered "Greater Austria" in English usage. According to the sources I've read, it seems as if Franz Ferdinand had a group of councillors around him who helped him flesh out this concept, and Popovic was the most productive and well-known one; I'll research a bit more, though.  ナイトスタリオン ✉ 10:50, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Oh, and I moved your note to the bottom and reverted your addition of "(speaking)" to Austria, since - as little as I personally think of the idea of Austrians supposedly being of German ethnicity - it was Deutsch-Österreich in German, not Deutschsprachiges Österreich. 's that okay?  ナイトスタリオン ✉ 10:51, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Gryffindor sought my input on the translation of Groß-Österreich. I think Nightstallion's reasoning above is correct and Greater Austria is the better translation. (The "great" in Great Britain has a slightly different meaning - i.e. it is as opposed to "Little Britain" i.e. Brittany - than the "greater" in the examples quoted above). Valiantis 14:18, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for your input. Well I am not arguing about the name itself, I just want to make sure that we have all the information correct considering Wikipedia has been under attack for not being accurate enough sometimes. Alright, so I think we can settle the name question. Nighstallion, the changes are good too, I think the Note part would still better above the listing. I have read user comments who get confused with the difference between "German" as a nationality and as a language, therefore I was stressing the language part, if it's ok I'll change it to this compromise. Is that ok? Gryffindor 15:20, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I changed the formatting a little to look less ugly, but in principle - yeah, why not.  ナイトスタリオン ✉ 22:42, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: "great"

message: :::::::Cool. It would be nice if we could add a map somehow of this idea, however I'm not big in the drawing department.... any ideas, does anyone know anyone who does that kind of a thing? Gryffindor 10:47, 17 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll try asking Morwen; it's mainly a question of trying to find the correct borders from current maps (i.e. which regions of Poland, Romania, ... belonged to A-H) and then creating a map from that information, based on the link at the bottom of the page.  ナイトスタリオン ✉ 11:24, 17 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Map

message: One more thing, here is some brief mention of Popovici's proposal describing which region is formed for which nationality (that could be included into article):
* http://terkepek.adatbank.transindex.ro/belso.php3?nev=127
Quote: "Az Ausztriában élő román Aurel C. Popovici könyvében ("Die Vereinigte Staaten von Gross- Österreich", 1906) összegzi álláspontját a Monarchia etnikai alapú demokratikus föderatív átalakulásáról. Eszerint a birodalom 15 etnikai alapú politikai egysége Német-Ausztria, Német-Csehország és Német-Morvaország, Csehország, Szlovákia, Nyugat- Galícia (lengyel), Kelet-Galícia (rutén), Magyarország, Horvátország, Erdély (román), Székely Terület, Vojvodina (szerb), Kraina (szlovén), Trentino (olasz) és Trieszt (olasz). A német kisebbségek 12 autonóm területet alkotnak (elsősorban Magyarországon)."
It is in Hungarian, but the one who knows the Hungarian names for those peoples could understand it. I do not speak Hungarian, but I know few Hungarian words, so I will translate this if somebody do not understand. PANONIAN (talk) 14:53, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't want to show off with my knowledge but I speak Hungarian on a very good level. :-) The sentence says: "Aurel C. Popovici, a Romanian living in Austria summarises his point of view in his book ("Die Vereinigte Staaten von Gross- Österreich", 1906) on the democratic, ethnicity-based restructuring of the Monarchy. According to this, the 15 ethnicity-based political units of the Empire are: German Austria, German Czech Land, German Moravia, Czech Land, Slovakia, West-Galizia (Polish), East-Galizia (Ruten), Hungary, Croatia, Transylvania (Romanian), Szekler Area, Voivodina (Serbian), Kraina (Slovenian), Trentino (Italian), Triest (Italian). The German minorities have 12 autonomus areas (mostly in Hungary)."  The source you quoted lists this as one of the ideas to reform the Monarchy, but it does not mention that this plan was supported by Franz Ferdinand. I hope this helps. Congrats to the map, very interesting. --KIDB 08:22, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

text: I suggest, if you have no other information, that the legend under the map clearly states that it is based on Popovici's ideas, and may only be an illustration of what Franz Ferdinand could have proposed. Eg: A proposal for the autonomous areas within the Monarchy (by Popovici, 1906) --KIDB 08:36, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: source in Hungarian

message: I think the way the article is written gives to much credence to the concept that, at this point, the Austro-Hungarian Empire was a German, and, to a lesser extent, Hungarian dominated state. What about all the pan-German and Christian social groups talking about how Germans were feeling threatened by the growing power of the ethnic minorities? Many felt that the Hapsburgs seemed to be bowing down to pressure from them, not the Germans. This was the same milieu in which the basic ideas of Nazism began to take root. I don't defend the Nazis or ethnic nationalism generally, but I can see how it could feel to be in the ethnic Germans position. I have strayed to far from the point - referencing it as basically a German dominated area in the period might not be accurate.--Dudeman5685 04:34, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Magyar-German hegemony 

message: Does anybody know the percentages each majority nationality in these "states"?
Obviously there were more Jews in this Empire than Slovenes or Italians, but they appear
to be unrepresented. Does anybody know how they were distributed in these areas?68.4.200.35 (talk) 10:12, 8 March 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, they counted the number of people which were talking the different languages as their first language, not their religion. Jews lived in the whole monarchy, but mostly in Eastern Galizia, Vienna, Budapest and Prague. They were counted mostly as German. --Otberg (talk) 19:12, 8 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Percentage of Majority Nationalities? Jews? 

message: As I know, there was no recognized nation Bosniak in Austria-Hungary, neither claims of such a nation. Muslim people of BiH at the time called themselves either Turk, either Croat, either nothing. That nation came into existence in second Yugoslavia after WWII under the name "Muslim", and changed the name to "Bosniak" in 90's.
Can somebody put a reference for "ten ethnic groups" including "Bosniaks" with any name in Austria-Hungary? If not, I suggest to erase them from the list. Moreplovac (talk) 18:56, 10 September 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bosniaks? 

message: There is a paragraph given to why the Hungarians generally opposed the plan since it'd take quite a bit of the existing territory away.  But, was there any opposition to the name of this this proposed reorganization of the empire?  Can someone find any historical discussion on this?  I ask, because I can only imagine that an empire in which each of the dominant members were very proud of their piece of the empire that to go from "Austria-Hungary" to the "United States of Great Austria" with no mention of the other major component of the country would cause some kind of consternation. --Criticalthinker (talk) 18:48, 19 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Couldn't help but notice that the two paragraphs discussing the Archduke's support for a "United States of Austria" have no source, which you'd expect for such a radical claim. 62.68.123.214 (talk) 22:34, 1 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Source for Franz Ferdinand's approval?