Talk:Undine

message: Is Lawrence a Greek name? —Vivacissamamente 13:18, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: At that, what is a knight doing in a tale from Greek mythology?  It conforms to the medieval legend of the undine, but it does not seem to match otherwise.  Goldfritha 00:32, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Comments

message: I put in introductory information about the race of undines, but I don't think I smoothed out the flow from that to the fairy tale "Undine"; I'm not sure how to go about it.  Goldfritha 02:28, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Smoothing

message: This page alternatively uses both "Ondine" and "Undine;" we should pick one and use it consistently. Also, there are no references given in the "Sleep" section, and I'm not sure it's appropriate as-written. Shiftychica (talk) 07:12, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Editing To-Do

message: I am not comfortable with the tone set under "Characteristics," which seems to be telling me where I can go out and meet a nymph. Thoughts? Shiftychica (talk) 07:12, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Tone

message: I removed an extensive passage (link here) which was mostly about the piano piece Gaspard de la nuit, which I did not believe was appropriate. Since my earlier deletion was reverted, I'd like to explain why I deleted the passage in the first place. There are various problems with the passage, and unless these problems are fixed, I seriously object to the inclusion of this passage in the article.
*Ravel's piece is already mentioned in the bulletted list.
*There is far too much information about the piece here: this is an article on ondines, not Gaspard de la nuit. If readers are interested in Gaspard, they can click through to the article on Gaspard; otherwise, this is overkill for what is simply a cultural reference.
*The etymology of the name Gaspard is not at all related to the article's subject, and only tangentially so to the piano piece. It should not be in this article at all.
*There are numerous spelling, grammatical, and stylistic errors.
*As to the "other cultural reproductions" that were cited, Also Spracht Zarathustra, The Magic Flute, and Amahl and the Night Visitors, what references are made to ondines? I personally cannot recall--if there are indeed references, then they should be explicitly mentioned. The reference to A Tale of Two Cities appears to be about the name Gaspard, which again is irrelevant to this article's subject.
*In addition, if these references are to be included in the article, then they should be part of the bulletted list, not as they have been formatted.
Please feel free to add this info to the article for Gaspard, once the appropriate corrections are made. However, the passage should not be here in this article.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.179.102.50 (talk) 04:39, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm in agreement.  Thank you for putting your reasons up.  Good work.Luminum (talk) 13:12, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  in re: Gaspard de la nuit 

message: So I tried to look up ondine in my dictionary and it wasn't there, but undine was. My impression is that ondine is an obsolescent variant, and that the current spelling is undine, from Neo-latin undina. I think the name of this article should be changed. Rwflammang (talk) 17:55, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: While on the subject of name changes, is the parenthetical (mythology) accurate or even necessary? Undines were postulated by Paracelsus as part of his alchemical theory; they are not found in Greek or Roman mythology. If you go to the Undine disambiguation page, every name mentioned there comes directly or indirectly from this coinage of Paracelsus. Rwflammang (talk) 11:23, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Undine vs Ondine

message: Undines are also shown in Perfect World (Chinese created game, also in the International version). There are monsters early on called "Undine of Virtue, etc" that are depicted as mermaids who float on land, with fins on their hands, possibly the head. Here's a link to PWI's wiki page.   — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.182.102.157 (talk) 00:53, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Other games

message: Hello. Recently I gutted quite a lot of this article. Here's why: First, most of the information here was totally unsourced. Wikipedia doesn't operate on the authority of anonymous editors alone. Beyond that, statements like "The German folktale of Ondine, a water nymph who curses her unfaithful husband to cease breathing if he should ever fall asleep again, is the basis for 'Ondine's Curse'" are flatly wrong. In line with this statement, the removed material was a big tangle of confusion. The name Undine enters the record by way of the pen of Paracelsus. It is thereafter a concept specific to alchemy and/or alchemically-influenced works. The subject of water beings in folklore is another matter, and the concept of an undine and the folklore record must not be conflated if there is any hope for accuracy or concision for the article. :bloodofox: (talk) 21:30, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I see a bunch of poorly research stuff has accrued since my reboot of the article (or, really, just reducing the article down to a sentence or two) that saw some heavy pruning lately. It's good that the article is getting attention and that we're developing it further. I note that there's a lot more modern media out there employing the figures that we could add to the article and we could expand the Paracelsus section a lot. :bloodofox: (talk) 23:59, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: It's a work in progress, not the end product.  Eric Corbett 01:23, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Good. Please stop restoring unreferenced and inaccurate material in the mean time. :bloodofox: (talk) 01:27, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Do you really believe that you're being helpful?  Eric Corbett 01:32, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I could ask the same to you. As you've apparently recently found the article (I cleared it of nonsense some time ago), I suspect that you're still working out the details of the topic, but this begins with Paracelsus and develops into literary works from there and into modern material like, say, video games. Conflating what was and is not the work of Paracelsus is unhelpful, as is throwing around ideas like 'folk tradition' where it doesn't exist. :bloodofox: (talk) 01:34, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Please refrain from adding inaccurate and unreferenced material to the article. It doesn't help. :bloodofox: (talk) 01:39, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: What "inaccurate and unreferenced material" are you claiming that I've added?  Eric Corbett 02:05, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

text: Let's face a few unpalatable facts here Bloodofox. The state you left the article in was an absolute disgrace; everything that's happened to it since is an improvement.  Eric Corbett 02:08, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Check the diff. See those sections with no references you keep editing? As for my edits: I've simply scraped stuff that was unreferenced, while you're here adding information about Undines as "minor deities" (seriously?). If you can find something to complain about that I've "added", bring it up, specifically. Otherwise I'll just pently show that you're learning about a topic as you're editing it and you act like an offended school boy, resorting to childish insults, when you're called out for making a mistake. :bloodofox: (talk) 05:33, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Go ahead. You've got away with your ignorant insults so far, so I suppose you will again. I've tried to explain your misconceptions about the nature of undines below; you might learn something by reading it.  Eric Corbett 20:28, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent Cleaning House 

message: Soooo first things first, we need a scholarly source discussing paracelsus I guess.....Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:25, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Why? This article isn't about Paracelsus.  Eric Corbett 20:26, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, it's where things start anyway. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:32, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Not really, things start way before Paracelsus. The story of the undines is in fact rather a simple one. Ancient philosophers were aware of the classical elements, Paracelsus didn't invent them. Oriental philosophers developed the idea of nature spirits, which spread to Europe and which Paracelsus was aware of. The contribution of Paracelsus was to devise a classification for those nature spirits aligned with the four classical elements, undine being one of them and comprising a whole range of water spirits. Then writers began to develop the undine as a water nymph in its own right, as in Fouqué's Undine, which is where we are today.  Eric Corbett 12:49, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah yeah, but the idea would be the development of the attributes. I concede that I haven't read Paracelsus so don't know what is there and how much we can embellish that bit before adding subsequent material Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:12, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: That's one aspect to be covered, certainly. But this storm in a teacup blew up while the structure of this article was still being developed, as if it was already the finished piece of work. That's why the ignorant rantings of Bloodofox were so galling.  Eric Corbett 13:34, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: A paracelsus expert source?

message: Worth adding - a famous piano piece from his Gaspard de la Nuit. Johnbod (talk) 09:46, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ravel 

message: first did a novel called Undine, second wrote a poem called Undine, and Giraudoux's play about Undine is famous 92.41.64.113 (talk) 19:26, 4 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: any lakes Unda, Undina`s depression in Russia 176.65.113.96 (talk) 12:01, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Olive Schreiner, Renee Vivien, Jean Giraudoux