Talk:Transcendental Meditation/Archive 10

message: This is the full text of the Denaro affidavit (its not even that, apparently, but something "equivlaent" according to Denaro, as found in the TM-EX archives. These are in turn, financed by the rival meditation gruop mentioned as being a "breakaway" TM group). Note point 23: "In his more subtle and very sophisticated way Maharishi Mahesh Yogi and his charlatanism is [sic] a far more destructive and dangerous cult leader than Jim Jones who induced more than 900 people to commit suicide in Guyana."  Any mention of Denaro should quote this sentence in order to provide balance (as in an example of his extreme bias).Sparaig 22:15, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Denaro says that this isn't the actual affidavit?TimidGuy 22:42, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: He says at the end that it is the equivalent of an affidavit.Sparaig 23:22, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Denaro revisited 

message: Please see User_talk:Tanaats#Article splits.  Do we want to agree to do what Dreadlocke suggests?  Tanaats 04:17, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, Tanaats. Will check it out this weekend and get back to you.TimidGuy 16:31, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cosmetic changes to the prior article split? 

message: The section is about Tax-fraud. Orme does not address that, he addresses the issue that Denaro is claiming the research is flawed, which is not claimed in that section.Sethie 16:55, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Removal of Orme

message: TimidGuy, in the sentence "For nearly eight years, professionals who practice Transcendental Meditation include Gary Kaplan, professor of neurology at New York University School of Medicine, Ramani Ayer, Chairman and CEO of The Hartford Financial Services Group in Hartford, Connecticut, Bob Brown, Former Division President, Ziff-Davis Inc., and James Krag, M.D., Fellow of the American Psychiatric Association", why do you say "For nearly eight years"?  It seems that most of those folks have been meditating much longer.  And we could probably just start with "Professionals who practice..." anyway and let people see how long they've been practicing from the cite. Tanaats 21:40, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Apologies. I really appreciate your catching that. Thanks so much. And again, thanks for all that you do to improve the quality of the articles. You've done a lot of excellent copyediting.TimidGuy 22:13, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks!  Tanaats 23:03, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  For nearly eight years... 

message: Ummm there are maybe 10 live discussions going on on this page- how about slowing down a bit?Sethie 00:46, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Deleting Denaro

message: The Jama article makes it clear this was the 2nd such deception to Jama, and that the New England Journal of Medicine had suffered the same transgression. Why remove a cited fact? Sethie 00:46, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The second instance was completely unrelated to JAMA. You'll need to read that again. TimidGuy 02:28, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: "Submission of the "Letter From New Delhi" was not the first time JAMA was uninformed about an author's connection to the Maharishi's organizations. THE JOURNAL had previously published a letter praising the beneficial effects of TM (JAMA. 1989;262:2681-2682) written by Brian M. Rees, MD, MPH, who gave the Rees Family Medical Clinic, Pacific Palisades, Calif, as his affiliation. Rees turns out to be the medical director of the Maharishi Ayur-Veda Medical Center in Pacific Palisades. " When I re-read this, it all seems clear to me. Sethie 05:10, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: =Why removed cited facts

message: I've been harping a bit on the need for reliable secondary sources. I wanted to point out that the JAMA article is an excellent example of a reliable secondary source (even though it was sued for libel). The article claims deception related to publicity surrounding Ayuyr-Veda products and services and then gives a number of examples. This is the kind of corroboration and analysis that a reliable secondary source should use. Plus, JAMA is a reputable publication. Its bias is toward allopathic medicine, of course, but it's undeniably one of the top medical journals. TimidGuy 02:58, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reliable secondary sources 

message: Pouncingtiger, please discuss with us before making any more massive deletions. Tanaats 07:36, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's been a busy night here, Pouncingtiger! And yes, Wikipedia is a whole different world/culture/pheonomen, etc. I have been doing it for over a year and still can't make heads or tails of it. :) Peace!Sethie 09:06, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Surprising to see some newbies show up. Seems like ultimately it will be useful to have a variety of perspectives. It's mostly just been the three of us in recent months. Thanks, Tanaats and Sethie, for not attacking the newbies and helpfully pointing to specific guidelines. TimidGuy 12:06, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sheesh! 

message: I've mentioned a number of times that one goal I have is to rework the section on research so that it better represents the more recent research, espcially the NIH-funded research that has appeared in the past 10 years in peer-reviewed medical journals. To that end, I've added subheads as a first step in rewriting that section. TimidGuy 15:49, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Cool! Tanaats 19:40, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, gosh, thanks for your support. Sometimes I feel like any change I make will automatically get reverted. Appreciate it. I hope I'm able to improve that section, but it will likely be gradually over the coming couple weeks.TimidGuy 22:13, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Added subheads to research section 

message: Hello 151.202.185.21... Please hang a "fact" tag on unsourced statements if you want to challenge the statement.   That gives editors a chance to find a cite.  Thanks. Tanaats 16:54, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem.  Want you wanted to was to use "==TM and Religion==".  I've fixed it. Tanaats 19:03, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please use "fact" tag first 

message: Good additions on the research. Tanaats 22:45, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks much, guys. I really appreciate your support. Yes, the study specifically found reduced death rates. I can point you to the PubMed abstract if you like.TimidGuy 12:52, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

text: And thanks, Tanaats, for inserting the subhead in the states of consciousness section. I like it. And thanks for your ongoing cleanup of the article. TimidGuy 16:07, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Your're welcome! Tanaats 16:11, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Good additions