Talk:Boxing Day shooting

message: Why is this subject notable? Maybe someone can explain it to me... --Mista-X 12:04, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Speaking as a Torontonian, it was the random and senseless nature of her death that makes her notable. It hit us hard. Handguns are illegal in Canada, and gun crime up until recently was rare by the standards of comparable US cities. So Creba's death really hit home, and made a difference to the way people here think about street violence and its prevention. Hope this helps you understand. -- Clippership (talk) 15:47, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Second thoughts: subject is not notable, her death is. In fact it's the shooting that's the real subject. Two years after the incident now, and new information that is coming out is not about Jane, but about the young people who have been arrested and are now working their way through the justice system, plus the related community movements (Green Apple Project, Guardian Angels). So I've de-biographized it. Clippership (talk) 13:19, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That doesn't really cut it for me. I'm a born and raised Torontonian. Been here my whole life, and have never left. In fact, I live in Riverdale, the location of Creba's school and have been a resident in this hood for about over a decade. I also grew up in the downtown area. I feel sorry for her, her friends/family, etc. but the only reason this was a big deal is because it effected white people. Shootings like this have never been unusual in the GTA. But this happened to a white girl and it happened in a space where middle-class white people enjoy their shopping, on a European origin holiday (more whiteness). This is why it was blown out of proportion by the media, and why there was "outrage". Of course there has been outrage about violence in the Black community, not just at the people in their own community, but to the cops who harass and brutalize Black youth. Did any media pay  much attention? This was even the subject of discussion in the U of T course Equity Studies. It is definitely a great example of systemic white supremacy in Canada. As well, the neo-nazis have really loved this incident and have used it in their propaganda. Too bad this isn't in the article. The Guardian Angels are a reactionary organization and won't do much good in Toronto. The tried coming here years ago, they failed then and will fail now. Not only that there are other community organizations that will work against them. They don't address the root problems of criminality, violence, inequities and oppression anyways. They simply try to bully people and will be looked at as snitches and impostors by most people. Another thing, not all hand guns are illegal in Canada. As well, guns aren't the problem anyways. Not that I don't think those guys are idiots for blasting in the middle of Yonge, but I don't think harassment of communities, beefed up law enforcement, "tougher" laws, etc. is very helpful in the long run. In terms of notability, the subject Jane Creba is fine as a subsection of this article, but not by itself, and certainly other than this being a tragedy that happened to garner a lot of media attention, it is not as notable as say the racially sparked riot of '92, or the worker's Days of Action that shut down the city, etc. which don't even have articles. Hope this helps you understand. --Mista-X (talk) 06:20, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wow. Thanks. Got it. I don't have the sensitivity to racial issues (because I'm white and middle class and generally don't have to deal directly with the crap) and I really appreciate your taking the time to explain it. I wonder if there's a place for this in the article itself? To get it on the main page we have to be able to cite discussions/research elsewhere. What do you think -- a section on the systemic racism aspects? I think it's interesting and worth including if we can find the research and citations. Clippership (talk) 15:04, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

text: Yet again I see the race-card pulled, this time to justify the killing of an innocent teen. So because she was senselessly killed by some primitive Black gangbangers with no concept of civility it's not notable. Mista-X the only people you have to blame are yourselves. I was raised in Toronto, every school I've been to that had a proportion of Black students was subject to unprovoked and seemingly randomn violence, apathy, lack of academic achievement etc. I've seen it first hand. And because so many in this "community" commit crimes it's only reasonable for Police to increase their presence. Think the man is "hatin' on you", stop committing crimes and start behaving like reasonable people and not engaging in wild shootouts in the city core shopping center. Koalorka (talk) 02:23, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: For a guy that smells of fascism/WN and seems so keen of guns I'm not surprised that you would try to pull such reactionary comments. Firstly, calling them "primitive" you reveal yourself as the racist you are. If someone started blasting at you would you simply duck and cover if you were carrying? Or would you pump back some of that H & K or Walther (my favs too) in the name of your white race? BTW, I'm not a Black nationalist or whatever you thought, but your second fav, a white communist. As for violence at the secondary school level, I've seen it at every school where the income of the population is low, rather then the cultural/ethnic backgrounds of the majority students. Certainly more violence exists in communities that have been treated violently and exploited; and I think one would only need to travel to Native communities to confirm this. It's much more rational then your little hierarchy view of "races" that I'm sure you have in your head, adolf. BTW, the police "presence" in this instance took increase at Yonge, not a Black community, so your point is moot. In any cae, the police just cause increased violence and are simply an armed gang of their own, filled with bullies and white cops who run the show with some of their tokens and uncle toms. BTW, the man doesn't hate on anyone except those he can't control, which is why capitalists love fascist so much when things get sticky. I'm sure you have no problems taking a comfortable seat behind your pig masters anytime you feel threatened by the Black community or antifa, though, right?  --Mista-X (talk) 23:36, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: An accusation of racism, white supremacy, Nazism and all of those having no relevance to the article or my comment. You've shown your true colours as a bigot and Marxist extremist. I'll be submitting an AN/I report. Koalorka (talk) 19:41, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

text: Another Torontonian here. From what I read, Mista-X wasn't trying to "justify the killing of an innocent teen". He was basically saying that Torontonians don't care as much if an innocent black kid gets shot, compared to an innocent white kid. The Jordan Manners shooting was notable enough that it also got it's own article. He was black, and many people were saying that the media coverage of the incident was "too much". Then again, it was the first shooting death to happen in a Toronto school. Black youths are undoubtedly responsible for the majority of the killings in this city. Last year, about 60-65% of the murders in Toronto were commited by blacks. Even though you think that police should increase their presence, the fact is that we live in a very safe city. Take a look at Crime in Toronto if you want proof. Blackjays1 (talk) 06:49, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Notability

message: The wording "Toronto police have since launched Project Green Apple (named after her favourite food[6]) to help control the amount of violence in the area." raises my eyebrows. What area? There has never been a lot of crime and violence in downtown Toronto, other than your everyday misdemeanors, even in Yonge streets seedy days of being not much other than porno and head shops. There is so much security and police presences, surveillance, etc. this "Operation Green Apple" sounds like a P.R. stunt. Maybe someone should actually explain what it is or else change the wording in the article. --Mista-X (talk) 06:52, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Good call. Closer reading of the source shows that the project was specifically to work on this case, not to "control the amount of violence in the area". Clippership (talk) 14:57, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Operation Green Apple

message: I would like to see a source that the Guardian Angels have over 100 members, and then what does that mean? They have 100 people on a list that paid a membership fee or whatever? Or they have actual people patrolling the streets? If so where, because I have not seen or heard of them. I can also buy a black belt online, does that make me deadly? It also seems that they went broke, their forum appears dead, and their Canadian website seems to have no recent news about Toronto. --Mista-X (talk) 06:52, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Did a little research and hopefully have clarified things a bit. Clippership (talk) 15:09, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Guardian Angels

message: It should be called Jane Creba murder.  Jane is the victim here, the article should be about her.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.237.123.46 (talk) 01:34, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: In this case, the shooting is more notable than the victim. Jane Creba redirects here anyways. Blackjays1 (talk) 07:28, 10 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rename article 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on Boxing Day shooting. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100405225828/http://ca.news.yahoo.com:80/s/capress/100401/national/boxing_day_shooting to http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100401/national/boxing_day_shooting
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 19:56, 14 January 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified  on Boxing Day shooting. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070312124109/http://www.ctv.ca:80/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060613/police_raids_060613/20060613?hub=TopStories to http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060613/police_raids_060613/20060613?hub=TopStories
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080507054155/http://www.ctv.ca:80/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051227/toronto_shooting_update_051227?s_name=&no_ads= to http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051227/toronto_shooting_update_051227?s_name=&no_ads=
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070312124238/http://www.ctv.ca:80/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051227/toronto_shooting_update_051227/20051227?hub=Canada to http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051227/toronto_shooting_update_051227/20051227?hub=Canada
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060406181608/http://www.ctv.ca:80/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060315/jane_creba_update_060315 to http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060315/jane_creba_update_060315
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:42, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 5 external links on Boxing Day shooting. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160114195612/http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/story.html?id=c3538f2d-886b-40d9-a662-a0da3bce453b&rfp=dta to http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/story.html?id=c3538f2d-886b-40d9-a662-a0da3bce453b&rfp=dta
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060613/police_raids_060613/20060613?hub=TopStories
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051227/toronto_shooting_update_051227?s_name=&no_ads=
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051227/toronto_shooting_update_051227/20051227?hub=Canada
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060315/jane_creba_update_060315
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 05:40, 24 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified