Talk:Hairpin turn

message: I'm British, and a brief survey of my family found that not one of them uses "switchback" to mean "hairpin turn"; we just use "hairpin [bend]". For example, a road near Bewdley, where I live, is locally known as "the switchback", but that is because of its undulations, not its hairpin turns - it can't be, because it doesn't have any hairpin turns! Presumably this designation is actually derived from the use of "switchback" (at least in British English) to mean a fairground rollercoaster with alternating rises and dips.
I've got no problem at all with the use of "switchback" in this article being left where it is (though I'm rather less convinced about the redirect from switchback itself), but is shouldn't be assumed that "switchback" and "hairpin" are always interchangeable. As an example, see under "switchback" in this American/British dictionary.Loganberry (Talk) 23:58, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The OED's quite informative. There are two different things involved: zigzag roads, and undulating roads. I'd rewrite this article, but I can't quite visualise its fate as anything but an intricate explanation of English/American terminology. What would we do if an Australian or South African chanced to read it? The sentence or two on their function are conjecture, which I'm not qualified to replace. Njál 21:12, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's interesting that in Britsh England "switchback" refers a road that undulates up and down.  That wouldn't make much sense to an American.  We use swtichback mainly for trails, I'd say more for the segments of trail than for the turns that connect them.  Here's a picture. Dicklyon 21:36, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "switchback" is the term I've always used for this type of road pattern ascending a steep slope, "hairpin turn" I've never used and would associate with the turn itself, not the general road pattern .... if it's a question of regional variations, I'm in Ontario (which does not generally have this type of road) but spent most of my life (and studied physical geography) in British Columbia (which has many switchbacks) ... in neighbouring Washington State, switchback was also used in the same sense ... so I'm surprised that "hairpin turn" is the name of the article, and "switchback" is a synonym mentioned in passing deep in the text, I would have expected the opposite, or at very least a switchback redirect page  J Edward Malone (talk) 17:07, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Use of "switchback" 

message: A 'highway' is a big road, isn't it? It makes me think of long, wide, straight roads going for miles through empty American desert. Not a very good choice of term for an article illustrated by three pictures of European mountain roads.
:Actually, in America a highway is a road that goes a long distance.  Many old US highways are still 2-lane roads, and some have switchbacks.  Probably even more true for state highways. Dicklyon 21:41, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I reworded things a bit.  I hope it helps.  The lead sentence makes it clear that hairpin turns are also known as switchbacks, especially when applied to trails instead of roads.  If it's not clear, work on that. Dicklyon 21:28, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, Dicklyon. I've rewritten it to make all the different uses clearer — could you check that the American bit's not misleading? (Oh, and I'm still not clear what it meant by 'stairway.' Something like a ladder?) Njál 22:03, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know that "by analogy with switchback railways" is correct.  Quite possibly the term went the other direction.  In a railway, by the way, switchbacks involve reversing the train, not turning it.  Dicklyon 00:18, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  'highway' 

message: I don't agree with the move that was done without discussion.  In US at least, hairpin turn is much more common; I've never heard hairpin bend, in spite of what the OED may say. Dicklyon 00:18, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I moved it back. Dicklyon 02:12, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: move to Hairpin bend?

message: I added a section on motorsports since hairpins are a common feature on road racing tracks.  I also linked to the illustration of Riverside Raceway found on the hairpin article. A suggestion might be to replace it with a photograph of an actual racetrack hairpin if a suitable free one can be found, instead of the track map. Nibios 21:24, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Motorsports

message: "Sections known as hairpins are also found in the slalom discipline of alpine skiing.  A hairpin consists of two consecutive vertical or "closed gates" which CV==Skiing==
Sections known as hairpins are also found in the slalom discipline of alpine skiing.  A hairpin consists of two consecutive vertical or "closed gates" which must be negotiated very quickly. (Three or more consecutive closed gates are known as a flush.)
. (Three or more consecutive closed gates are known as a flush.)"
Well, hmmmm, "which must be negotiated very quickly"... Well no... You,ll negociate them as you like as long as you win, is  in'it ?
Ericd (talk) 15:33, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Skiing

message: The coordinates need the following fixes:
* Write here
Gu3ud1 (talk) 05:08, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: This does not seem to be a request for the correction of coordinates present in the article. I'm guessing that it's a request that the location be added to the list of examples in the article. Since that's not the purpose for which  is intended, I'm tl'ing the template to remove this page from :Category:Talk pages requiring geodata verification. 17:37, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

text: Ah, now I see the coordinates in the image caption. You seem to have fixed them yourself, so all is well. Deor (talk) 18:04, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

text: The above coordinates of the Col de Braus photo were wrong, corrected them to 43° 51′ 58″ N, 7° 22′ 50″ E 195.56.155.161 (talk) 11:13, 9 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Coordinate error 

message: The article Dead Man's Curve has developed independently of the Hairpin turn article here.  The former term is in common use in the United States, but does not seem to be prevalent elsewhere in the world.  Usually a WP:MERGE would be appropriate, but the merged article would be quite long, and give undue weight to the US examples.  I suggest instead that most of the US examples in this article be moved to the Dead Man's Curve article.  The US coverage here would be trimmed to perhaps a few most salient examples of worldwide significance.  The orphan Netherlands example from the Dead Man's Curve article should be moved to here, as well.
In the meantime, I have Wikilinked the articles to each other, and clarified the word usage.  Reify-tech (talk) 19:44, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with the non-merger, but for a different reason: The terms are not necessarily interchangeable. A hairpin turn refers to the geometry specifically, generally 180 degrees of arc or more; a "Dead Man's Curve" is noted for being deceptively sharp or otherwise hazardous, but number of degrees varies and usually does not approach 180, at least in the more famous examples (e.g. the Cleveland curve is less than 90). Mapsax (talk) 14:00, 13 August 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree with Mapsax. I'm sure there are regional variations. I spent some years on the west coast of the US, and the terms were not interchangeable there. The most famous Dead Man's Curve in the LA area, the Sunset Blvd bend where Mel Blanc crashed, is less than 90°. Kendall-K1 (talk) 13:52, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

text: I spot-checked a dozen of the "dead man's curves" and less than a quarter of them were hairpins. So the usage seems correct. But you're right, we do need a good source. I searched around but couldn't find anything reliable that gives a definition of "dead man's curve." Kendall-K1 (talk) 21:31, 9 March 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Parallel article, "[[Dead Man's Curve]]"

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