Talk:Fredy Montero

message: What proof is there that Fredy is on a loan? I'd love to see some. In Seattle, the speculation about Montero's status is that he is part owned by Sounders FC, and part owned by somebody else. Musskel (talk) 16:39, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's right there on Seattle's website: http://www.soundersfc.com/Team/Players/Freddy-Montero.aspx. "Signed on loan". --JonBroxton (talk) 16:44, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Good call! Updated. Musskel (talk) 16:56, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Loan? 

message: Would it be appropriate to put in "Honors"? If so, his Spanish article has the mention but I would hate to screw up the translation: http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fredy_Montero . Looks like he was the highest scorer in a couple competitions which sometimes gets mentioned.
Distinción                                 	Año
Goleador del Torneo Apertura (13 goles)    	2007
Goleador del Torneo Finalización (16 goles)	2008
Cptnono (talk) 04:48, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's already mentioned in the prose. Having a table saying it as well is a bit repetitive. --JonBroxton (talk) 18:07, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Aha! So it is. I noticed most Articles on the English Wikipedia format it as bullet points (Alan Shearer#Honours). I think it is better aesthetically than the table  but I don't want to be repetitive.Cptnono (talk) 18:15, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Honors

message: 2 anonymous sources say there is an investigation and it is alluded to but to save any confusion I changed it to ".. woman has accused...". Investigation has not gotten far for assault and "no crime was commited" regarding the stalking but did not want to clutter the article with too much preliminary info.Cptnono (talk) 17:51, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Should have looked here before I rewrote the section, but I removed the stalking allegation since the police determined no crime was committed. As you noted adding in the "no crime was committed" to the stalking part gives the allegation a bit too much weight, but leaving it out gives the false impression that he's still under investigation on the stalking charge. --Bobblehead (rants) 22:46, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I put in the Times source in since it was updated. It states the "stalking" was in Bellevue when the other sources said it was in Sammamish during the host family's kids soccer game. Doesn't sound like it is being pursued, though. Times is good about updating though so whichever one is correct will be in the source soon enough. I hope this is garbage and won't need expansion.Cptnono (talk) 23:00, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: After reading WP:BLP and WP:SOURCES I question whether or not it's even appropriate to have this mentioned on Wikipedia.  At this point the only facts are that a police report has been filed.  No charges have been made and the investigation is ongoing.  To try to post "facts" on Wikipedia in real time about alleged crimes committed by a living person seems reckless to me.  I think it should be removed until some real "facts" are available.--SkotywaTalk 04:32, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia is not for news and it is not a crystal ball and blah blah blah but this is obviously noteworthy and a single line does not overweight the article. I'm sure we can keep it in check and update it as appropriate. Already we have made sure to not add paragraph after paragraph (haven't checked in the last couple hours) so I see no concerns.Cptnono (talk) 05:26, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

text: FFS, you're like lightning bobblehead! I think I got the edit first but you got the link here first!Cptnono (talk) 00:22, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Heh. I was just going to update the article to show no charges were to be filed. I wasn't going to delete it.  I think this falls into a bit of a BLP grey area. The fact that he was under investigation for rape is easily verifiable and it was fairly well covered in Seattle and Toronto news sources as well as the MLS, so one could argue that it should be included on verifiability grounds.  --Bobblehead (rants) 00:30, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure of the notability guidelines but it was definitely covered enough in the media. It kind of sucks for the guy if he didn't do it to be tarnished (1 line is all it takes sometimes) but thats the way it is. I don't mind reinclusion with a line follow-up.Cptnono (talk) 00:32, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Notability isn't for determing content of articles, just whether the article should exist at all. Content of the articles is covered by WP:BLP and WP:Verifiability. Problem is, anyone can file allegations against smoeone and then run to the press with the allegations. one could argue that including the allegations in a single sentence section gives them undue weight and therefore should not be included. I'm fairly sure that few people will even remember the allegations in a few years, so leaving them out is also an option. --Bobblehead (rants) 00:42, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I think what I was trying to get at with "notability" is that this allegation is verifiable but is it important enough to go in. Agree with the weight issue but if this allegation was that important I think we could allow for the potential balance concern. I'm on the fence. Either way is OK with me so maybe some others will chime in and help find consensus. As long as it isn't obvious inserting of headlines I'm fine if someone really really wants it in.Cptnono (talk) 03:44, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think the notes about allegations should stay in the article.  What's verifiable about this is a bunch of information about something he didn't do (or wasn't charged for at least).  I would say the only reason to keep this around (or more likely add it back later) is if he has a later pattern of behavior that could be tracked back to this notable event.  For now I'd say remove it.  It'll always be in the article history and mentioned on the talk page in the event that this was just a harbinger of further bad behavior.  For now though, can we give him a vote of confidence and remove it?  It would be a shame if Wikipedia is partly responsible for unnecessary and unwarranted "haunting" from this event after he has moved on with his life and doesn't have repeated investigations or offenses.  This, I think, is part of the spirit behind some of the guidance in WP:BLP.   --SkotywaTalk 06:04, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: well said.Cptnono (talk) 06:29, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Alleged Crime

message: SI article says Seattle's breakout star Fredy Montero admits he's using MLS as a stepping stone with the quote "I'd like to play internationally for Colombia, and also on a club in Europe,". It is important enough to go into the professional section but I am a little biased and am having a hard time coming up with an appropriate line. Anyone else want to?Cptnono (talk) 04:27, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: SI Article

message: The recent edit by Sid1977 is pretty badass. However, it is an awful lot of information that may not have great historical value. I am also concerned that upkeep will faulter sooner or later throughout his career giving undue weight to a few single games. Is there a way to paraphrase the first half of the season in a more concise form? Kind of a crappy of me to ask with the massive amount of work the additions must have taken. Also, some fo this info would be great in the '09 season page where such a focus would be better. I also won't change a thing since I may be concerned for no reason and this detailed content may be a good thing.Cptnono (talk) 04:17, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Now in '11. Yeah, time to rework everything at the end of the season.Cptnono (talk) 04:57, 20 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Expanded content

message: I'm not familiar with where to get info on South American players, but I've asked for a citation for the caps. This is because the previous figure of 4(1) appeared to include the match against Catalonia, which was not a full international. I've reduced his caps to 3 matches with no goals, but I'd still like to see a citation for this: for all I know, other non-full internationals might have been included in this figure. Pretty Green (talk) 07:08, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Dude, we have plenty sites that show how many matches he's played and how many goals he's scored.  His profile says 4 caps but it doesn't say anything about him scoring for Colombia.  So, we're just gonna go with 4 (0) for right now. – Michael (talk) 14:51, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: International caps citation

message: Is there any indication that "Jr." is part of his full name? "Jr." is not common in spanish naming customs, at all. The spanish equivalent is "h.", but that can only happen if he and his dad share all four names, which in turn can only happen if his father's mother's first surname is also Munoz (like Fredy's mom). That seems very unlikely. Digirami (talk) 07:00, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Good inter-wiki example is José Francisco Cevallos, who has a son with the same given names and, obviously, the same first surname. Because of that, his son is commonly referred to as José Francisco Cevallos, Jr. But legally, neither have Sr. or Jr. as part of their name since they do not share the same second surname. Digirami (talk) 19:47, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Full name 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 4 external links on Fredy Montero. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121014110112/http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2009053089_webmontero14m.html to http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2009053089_webmontero14m.html
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thread_title:  External links modified