Talk:Shōchū

message: What are the major brands of Shochu?
--
According to the Teikoku Data Bank, the top 3 in sales are:
1) iichiko
2) kanoka
3) iitomo
Otherwise I dont know, but for otsu shochu, I see Tominohouzan everywhere, and its pretty good.  Esp. their zenryokoji. Naerhu 08:41, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Brands? 

message: I have a bottle of Shochu complete with about 30 small pieces of what looks like gold leaf floating inside.
The bottle is branded 'Hakusui' and was a gift. Does anyone have information on the history and benefits of gold in Shochu?
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:Shochu and sake which are given as gives often contain a small amount of gold leaf, as you describe.  It's added to confer a feeling of luxury or a sense of celebration to the gift.  Gold in metallic form cannot be metabolised by the body so the health benefits are likely to be minimal. [User?]
:Sorry to burst your bubbles, but things like these are better on user pages. Also, who are you guys? Maccore Henni Mii! Pictochat Mii! 20:40, 30 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gold leaf in Shochu 

message: Shochu is the Japanese version of soju, a drink that originated in Korea.  Should mention of this be made here?  It is stated in the article for soju.  Also, in the article for the Chinese version of shochu, it is said that the Chinese drink has a distinct flavor that is similar to, but different from both soju and shochu.  Perhaps it is misleading to simply call it the Chinese version of shochu?
I do not know what think Koreans, but Japanese are not sure that where came from "Shochu". Usually they say, it come from Thailand, China, or China through Korea. (It is interesting that Japanese think that something new has come from not Korea, but China.) So it is not clear shochu is the Japanese version of soju. I think it was common drink in East-Asia. 86.101.91.207 12:58, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I read http://www.tomcoyner.com/moving_beyond_the_green_blur.htm , but it does not say Shochu came from Korea. The source is mostly about Korean Soju, and unrelated to Shochu.--Mochi (talk) 13:17, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origins and distinctions 

message: Since someone said that you drink it differently depending on the seasons, it would be nice to explain some examples of this.  Therefore, we won't look quite as foolish asking for something that is out of season. Thanks! 24.205.92.132 00:25, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Shōchū is drunk completely as the drinker wishes. In Kagoshima (in particular Osumi) it is drunk with hot water 80% of the time year round. Method of consumption can also change with brand, some brands are made to be drunk on the rocks, while other brands are made to be drunk with hot water.Myhomeuphere 03:50, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  How drink varies with season? please explain 

message: I don't think "The 1956 film The Teahouse of the August Moon portrayed an American-occupied Okinawan village rebuilding its economy with potato shōchū." under the Potato Shochu heading really adds to the article. Maybe under a new heading "Shochu in Western Culture" or something?? Myhomeuphere 07:43, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Most recent edit 

message: What about the Okinawan variety with the snake in it? Chris (クリス • フィッチ) (talk) 13:01, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  hebishu 

message: I would describe Kagoshima's potato shochu as having a liquorice taste, rather than an almond taste.  If find it much preferable to the standard shochu found in Tokyo.  --Westwind273 (talk) 20:48, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Taste 

message: The following sources are unreliable or unrelated and should not be used for Wikipedia. 
#
#:The Terms of Use says "The articles provided on this website are for entertainment purposes only and should not be relied upon for any purpose other than entertainment." Wikipedia's purpose is not for entertainment.
#
#: There is exactly the same description in both articles; "I was disappointed that the manager didn't offer us a glass of shochu for all the hard work we've done for his shrine." This description is a translation of Japanese document. So it cannot be the same unless either of them copied another or both of them copied other article. Thus, the history written in web site about cocktail should not be considered to be reliable. 
#
#:What I can find from this book is only the word "China" and "shochu".
#
#:This book describes only "Sweet potato shōchū". It says "The production of sweet potato shochu, which probably originated in Chaina, has been known since the 1700s.", however we are talking about 16 century.
#: －－ Phoenix7777 (talk) 07:10, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Unreliable source

message: Is there any actual meaningful difference between Shōchū and Soju? What makes them different, other than the language being spoken or the country in which they are made? –BarrelProof (talk) 17:11, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: As I stated in above "Origins and distinctions" its more logical that it comes from China and Korea rather Thailand. Why would Japan take on the Chinese and Korean name, meaning and pronunciation if it comes from Thailand? Im not Korean or Chinese and Im not taking any sides here. But it doesn't make any sense that Shōchū came from Thailand and was named the same as in China and Korea? More logical would be to name it after the Thai word, เหล้าชนิดหนึ่งในประเทศมุสลิม witch translates to "a type of alcohol in Muslim countries". Shochu has the same meaning as shaojiu or soju. Both Soju and Shochu is made from sweet potato, barley or rice.  - Fniss (talk) 16:18, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I notice that this article contains a significant emphasis on kōji, whereas the Soju article doesn't mention it at all. That would seem to be one way that the products might be (at least sometimes) different. Can someone please comment on that? If there is no real difference between the products other than where they are made, this should be stated in the articles. —BarrelProof (talk) 17:11, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Shochu is not soly made in Japan. It is also made in Korea and exported to Japan such as Jinro or Kyogetsu. Also how 80 proof baijiu is basically the same as shochu? Then you should mention Vodka as well. We need a reliable source to mention that. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 11:06, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I see, so baijiu/shaojiu is higher in alcohol content. (This article says that shōchū is typically 25% abv, and that 35% abv shōchū is not uncommon; the baijiu article says that baijiu is generally 40-60% abv – so, yes – that seems to be a difference.)  But is there any real difference between shōchū and soju? One difference in style appears to be the extensive use of kōji in Japanese shōchū production. —BarrelProof (talk) 17:44, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

text: I see. So it sounds like there is no fundamental difference (as a matter of definition, aside from typical quality) between shōchū and soju, and that both are (at least sometimes) produced using Aspergillus oryzae (a.k.a. kōji).  But fermentation can also be accomplished by using yeast. However, my understanding is that Aspergillus oryzae (a.k.a. kōji) is not the same thing as yeast, and that it produces a spirit with a different flavour. —BarrelProof (talk) 17:34, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: AndrewHKLee has clearly problem. The user confused "Aspergillus Oryze" with "yeast". "Aspergillus Oryze" convert ingredients to sugar and "yeast" converts sugar to alcohol. Moreover the user's explanation implies all Spirit like Gin, Vodka and even Ethanol are the same as Shochu. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 09:51, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Phoenix please moderate your tone.  Your hostilities are inappropriate.  While you are right about Aspergillus Oryzae's role in producing alcohol from grains, nonetheless it is used all across Asia including Korean soju which was the Barrelproof's question which originated this current line of discussion.  Furthermore, distillation process from weaker alcohols may be the same for vodka and gin but the ingredients and methods for production for gin and vodka are very different from sochu/soju.  Your comment about ethanol is downright inflammatory.AndrewHKLee (talk) 20:21, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

text: Aside from the tone, I now see that I wasn't properly discussing the role of kōji in the process (although I'm pretty sure AndrewHKLee understood it). The kōji primarily converts complex starches into sugars that are then converted by yeast into alcohol/ethanol. Other sorts of distilled spirits (e.g., malt whisky and bourbon whisky) use different methods or different source grains to make sugar available for yeast fermentation. The ingredients and the kōji (and the aging methods, as applicable) presumably produce a spirit with a different flavour profile than such other spirits. —BarrelProof (talk) 05:35, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I found a RS on the difference. They use not only Aspergillus oryzae but also Rhizopus in China and Korea. The grains they use are different too. See . Oda Mari (talk) 14:54, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, Mari. The file is Power Point and this Google Quick View is easy to read. "Korea: Naturally propagates genus Rhizopus or Aspergillus in wheat, Japan: Artificially propagates pure cultured genus Aspergillus in steamed rice" in page 9 shows the major difference. Page 11-12 shows making of nuruku (Korean koji) and koji. Korean nuruku doesn't care much about the mold than koji. This is the reason why shochu article emphasize koji. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 23:10, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: That's not entirely correct.  Koji is called Nurukgyoon in Korean.  It's the same fungus cultivated and used for thousands of years by both Korean and Japanese without knowing exactly what it was.Melonbarmonster2 (talk) 03:39, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

text: Soju=Sochu... it's basically the same beverage made with different local ingredients and methods.  Polish wodka vs. Russian vodka... English bitters vs. Bavarian brews... and so on.  You're basically converting.  Traditionally both uses rice or other available grains, polished and steamed translucent, bugs to convert starch to sugar, yeast to convert sugar to alcohol. At this point you have sake, cheongju, makgeolli, etc..  You distill this and you get soju/sochu. Rest is marketing and breweries trying to add glimmer to their product but it's really not rocket science.Melonbarmonster2 (talk) 03:29, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: @Melonbarmonster2 I undid your addition. The route was different. See this and check 소주 at here too. The Doopedia article says "외지(外地)에서 전래된 소주를 일명 아라키주[亞刺吉酒]라 불렀는데, 이는 증류주의 발생과 관련되는 것으로서 페르시아에서 처음 발단되었다고 한다. 이것이 동방으로 오게 된 연유는 몽골인[蒙古人]이 페르시아의 이슬람교 문화를 받아들이면서 증류방식에 의한 술을 함께 들여온 것이 계기가 되었다고 본다. 증류주를 아랍어(語)로 아라그(Arag)라 한 데서 몽골어로는 "아라키[亞刺吉]"라 하고 만주어로는 "알키", 한국에서는 "아락주"라 하였다. 지금도 개성지방에서는 소주를 아락주라 한다. 소주류가 원나라로부터 전해진 이래 재래주와 함께 그 제조가 고려 때부터 성행할 만큼 소주류의 종류도 여러 가지로서 고급주·약용주로도 사용되었다. 당시의 소주는 순수한 곡식으로 만들어서 맛이 좋았으며, 한편으로 그 맛이 순하고 청결하여 이를 이용하는 자가 많았는데, 증류주이기 때문에 값이 비쌌다고 한다". Both are Korean sources. Oda Mari (talk) 05:41, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Any real difference between Shōchū and [[Soju]]?

message: I removed a table that was under its own subsection and I see that Phoenix has placed it back and then accused me of 'disruptive editing'.  Is there some sort of fighting going on here that I'm not aware of??  I'm not an avid editor so please let me know if I'm not understanding something.
As far as I understand it, use of primary sources to draw conclusions or implications in text is not allowed according to WP:PRIMARY.  I think secondary sources for statements regarding sochu consumption is fine but I'm uncomfortable about editors drawing conclusions about sochu consumption using government tax stats which is primary source.AndrewHKLee (talk) 18:08, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm afraid your understanding of Primary Source is wrong. Gov. data is usually regarded as RS. If you disagree. please ask at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard. Thank you. Oda Mari (talk) 18:37, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

text: AndrewHKLee, please don't remove other editor's legitimate edit without the least knowledge of Policies. The source are reliable and I didn't "analyze, synthesize, interpret, or evaluatel" the source. I just cited the numbers described in the source. Even without a good knowledge of Policies, if you had a common sense, you never thought the government statistics should not be used in Wikipedia. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 11:02, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: May I suggest that we please try to maintain a higher standard of civility to the tone of conversation here? —BarrelProof (talk) 22:22, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Primary Source

message: In the description, it talks about satsuma imo (potatoes) being the main/primary ingredient ingredient.  That is kind of misleading.  To make a niggling point, the main ingredient is water, and the primary ingredient is rice.  It might be better to clarify the description by adding a bit more description of the process.  eg Steam rice, add koji, finish primary fermentation (Ichijimoromi), steam potatoes, mix and move to a secondary fermenter (nijimoromi), and then finish fermentation (sanjimoromi). Pizzamancer (talk) 06:41, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: imoshochu

message: Can anyone tell me what are the intrinsic differences, if any, between:
# ...the sugarcane-based shochu and rum? 
# ...the potato-based shochu and vodka?
Thank you.  Boneyard90 (talk) 15:29, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rum? 

message: The Article was very careful not to mention China in its history. LAWL. 108.65.248.139 (talk) 04:49, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  this article is basically trash 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on Shōchū. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20060217025854/http://www.fukuoka-now.com:80/features/article_display.php?fn_code=429082 to http://www.fukuoka-now.com/features/article_display.php?fn_code=429082
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20050307194210/http://www.denen-shuzo.co.jp:80/chisiki/tisiki07.htm to http://www.denen-shuzo.co.jp/chisiki/tisiki07.htm
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Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 13:59, 7 January 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Is this what he actually asks for, at 5:05?
Drsruli (talk) 20:43, 30 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cowboy Beebop Episode 2 

message: Translate 174.55.203.39 (talk) 23:42, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shōchū 

message: This article should be added as a subsection of shochu, since shochu is just the Japanese name for Soju after it was brought over from Korea. We don't have a whole separate article for udong vs udon. 2603:3006:1082:B000:645C:9E37:D8B9:7D41 (talk) 02:25, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Shochu and soju have very different histories and production methods. There is no need to merge them.--SLIMHANNYA (talk) 09:48, 29 January 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: And Japanese shōchū did not come from Korea. Rather, most modern Korean soju is produced by large companies, and the process is directly based on the modern Japanese kōrui shōchū (multiply distilled shōchū) production method. In other words, most modern Korean soju is a derivative of Japanese shōchū.--SLIMHANNYA (talk) 05:28, 4 February 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  merge with soju?