Talk:Pope Benedict XVI/Archive 2

message: Post replies to the main talk page, copying the section you are
replying to if necessary.  (See Wikipedia:How to archive a talk page.)
Please add new archivals to Talk:Pope Benedict XVI/Archive08. Thank you. Bratschetalk random 22:03, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
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Is it unproteced yet? Because I still see the notice on this page, but about a minute ago I tried clicked the "edit this page" button which was still available and it took me to the edit page. I did not try to submit my edit because I had nothing useful to contribute. 68.126.102.143 22:58, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

message: From a estrategical and PR point of view, the election of Ratzinger as pope is a huge mistake. Choosing a pope that is fairly easy to attack (being a nazi and all) WILL make protestant churges grow to an historical number of followers around the globe. No wonder some people say that the Holy Spirit does not read the news. 200.31.163.246 22:07, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: This is not a discussion page on the Pope. You might easily find discussion boards to voice your opinion. --Maxl 22:14, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: PR Commentary

message: I get a "page protected" message but I can see that others are editing the page. Adam 22:34, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't know, I see the page as protected as well. I guess it was protected just a few minutes ago. However, since it's not listed in the Protected Page, I really have no idea why it's protected. -- KTC 22:39, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  The page has been vandalized just a short period of time ago. It's ok it's protected at this time. --Maxl 22:49, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: What is going on?

message: I think this page needs a controversy section.  It could include more information on this pope's nazi history as well as his anti-contraceptive and anti-gay beliefs.  I uploaded this letter: , which is quite staunchly anti-gay and I think that's important to note here.
Oh, and why is the page protected?  >_<  Quasipalm 22:46, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Controversy

message: What is going on is out of order and I suspect in contradiction of various wikipedia policies. I have bought the locking of this page to Wikipedia:Requests for page protection, where it should be discussed. i hope the people locking are not editing, and will scrutinise closely. this article needs opening now to everyone to edit. That way we keep our reputation as a source of up to date material and utilise the great energy to edit this page, --SqueakBox 22:48, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
I wholeheartedly agree with SqueakBox.  I just looked through the page history and the "vandalism" was no such thing.  Small inaccuracies does not equal vandalism -- and the few times something started being entered with POV it was quick removed.  So what's the problem?  Quasipalm 22:53, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. -- KTC 22:57, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: I agree Nunh-huh, the purpose of the locking feature is not to allow admins to edit the page in relative peace. That may not have been the reason the page was locked, but if that's what's going on then it's against the spirit of Wikipedia: This encyclopedia is meant to be edited by the masses, not by an elite few, and admins shouldn't take advantage of the lock to get priority for their edits. If a page is locked due to constant vandalism or edit war then nobody should be editing it, like Nunh-huh pointed out. If it's locked due to technical problems like the duplication bug, then that should be fixed and then it should be unlocked. -Eisnel 23:48, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Page Locked Unfairly

message: The page was locked i think because some idiots were vandalising the page with anti-german phrases and slogans. I saw these but they were removed quickly so may not have been noticed.
There are people watching the page to revert vandalism. The positive effects of keeping the páge open far outway the brief vandalisms, --SqueakBox 23:10, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
*I would not be surprised if this talk page has been blanked by a vandal. You know what, it might have been, already, since I tried to edit something, then the page went blank except for two words "Seig Heil" in all caps. Zscout370 23:33, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  vandalism 

message: The official Vatican site says BENEDICTVM XVI. But the Latina article is Benedictus XVI. What gives? —Cantus…☎ 23:08, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
: See Talk:Pope_Benedict_XVI/Archive01#BENEDICTVM_XVI. / Alarm 23:12, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Pope_Benedict_XVI/Archive01#BENEDICTVM_XVI - "Benedictum" is the accusative case, as in "We have pope B. XVI". The normal citation would be nominative case, "Benedictus" (User:Sk4p) Gestumblindi 23:18, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Name in Latin 

message: Why is it notable that he put the papal robes on over his black sweater? And why the assumption that he forgot to take the sweater off? Maybe he was cold and consciously chose to leave it on. And what difference does it make anyway? --Angr/comhrá 23:39, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree.  If no source is found that indicates he forgot, or that it is some sort of a no-no to wear a sweater under the robe, then that comment needs to come out.  Johntex 23:44, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Unless this can be shown to be taboo, it is largely irrelevent. Rje 23:51, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)
***I agree, but just like with the 'outrage' over Dick Cheney's outfit at the Auswitz Memorial, it will take a few days for the fashion police to look it over. Zscout370 23:59, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I've removed the reference to the black sweater.  If anyone finds a source that shows it is relevant they can put it back.  Johntex 00:27, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  The black sweater 

message: At various times this article has said Pope Benedict XVI is the seventh German pope and at some times it has said the eighth.  Sometimes the article has even said both at once with one number in the into and the other in the body.  Is he eight if we count Adrian VI and seven if we do not?  If that is the case, then a simple "eighth German pope counting Adrian VI" will suffice to clear this up.  Johntex 23:49, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Is Stephen X, who was a Lorrainer, also to be considered a German pope?  Can somebody list out the eight? john k 02:17, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Seven or Eight German Popes 

message: :As it has been previously discussed, is not his first Christian name correctly spelled "Josef?"
::Not necessarily. German uses both spellings. --Angr/comhrá 00:24, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: German Christian name

message: Is there any likeliness of a coronation instead of a mere "installment"?
*I know the ceremony will be full of pomp and circumstance, but we will have to just wait and see. Zscout370 00:51, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Papal Coronation

message: In the latest (typically Wikipedian) raging controversy about Adrian VI's ethnicity, I thought à tout seigneur, tout honneur, let's hear what the Dutch have to say about it. Here are quotes from the four largest Dutch newspapers published today:
*De Telegraaf: "Het is de eerste Duitse paus sinds Victor II en de 264e opvolger van Petrus." (for the millions of us who sadly do not speak Dutch, that means "He is the first German pope since Victor II, and the 264th successor of St Peter").
*NRC Handelsblad: "De laatste Duitse paus was Victor II, die regeerde van 1055 tot 1057. Sinds 1523, toen de Nederlander Adrianus VI paus was, tot 1978, toen de Pool Karol Wojtyla paus werd, heeft de rooms-katholieke kerk altijd een Italiaan als paus gehad." (i.e.: "The last German pope was Victor II, who ruled from 1055 to 1057. From 1523, when the pope was the Dutch Adrian VI, until 1978, when the Pole Karol Woktyla became pope, the Roman Catholic Church always had an Italian as pope.").
*De Volkskrant: "Ratzinger is de eerste Duitse paus sinds Victor II (1055-1057) en de 264e opvolger van de apostel Petrus." ("Ratzinger is the first German pope since Victor II (1055-1057), and the 264th successor of the apostle Peter.")
*Algemeen Dagblad : "Het is de eerste Duitse paus sinds Victor II (1055-1057)." ("He's the first German pope since Victor II (1055-1057).")
Does that settle it? or do we want to be plus royaliste que le roi? Hardouin 00:57, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It is only too natural that Dutch newspapers tend to claim Adrian VI for the Dutch only, as well as the German newspapers (Spiegel, FAZ etc.) call him just a "German". Both viewpoints are understandable. I think the solution of calling him "Dutch and therefore considered German at his time" or something similar should work. Gestumblindi 01:05, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Let's hear what the Dutch have to say about it 

message: Anyone know all ten languages that he speaks? 
68.230.39.252 01:01, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Languages

message: Frankly, I'm glad that we have a new Pope. This hubbub will die down soon, and everything will be as it was. Pope John Paul II was dying an old man: he was in a terrible condition, he couldn't talk, and he was almost in a vegitated state. I realize that since Benedict XVI is old, people might be talking about the new Pope's death as soon as they are done talking about John Paul's, but at least all of the Christians are at rest.
That's all I have to say.
--bobbo king 01:31, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)
*I think Benedict XVI will do a good job, but with this process taking place, I began to fully appreciate the steps and the various ceremonies that take place from the death of the Holy Father to the conclave. I will remember this experience when the election of the next pope takes place. Zscout370 01:42, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Finally this business is over...for now 

message: I removed a slew of copyvio images from the article.  Images from the Holy See would be preferable as a legitimate fair use claim can be made, ripping off AP and Reuters images from various web sites is not a legitimate fair use claim.  --Wgfinley 02:21, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyvio Images 

message: I'd like to see sources cited for this, as it has been pointed out that this may not be entirely accurate. -- Grunt 🇪🇺 02:22, 2005 Apr 20 (UTC)
I've never seen anything of the sort before.  I removed the reference to a Jewish mother - half Jews weren't allowed to join Hitler Youth, for one thing. john k 02:29, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  "First Jewish Pope" dubiousness 

message: The Latin language has five cases for nouns: nominative, accusative, dative, ablative, genetive.  This man's adopted name is "Benedictus" in the nominative case and "Benedictum" in the acccusative -- I think; correct me if I'm wrong.  Which case is appropriate depends on context.  When a cardinal said "Habemus papam ... Benedictum XVI", the accusative case was used because it's the object of the verb "habemus".  But nominative seems right in the first paragraph of this article.  (I'm rather illiterate in Latin, to say the least; it's one of those languages I can occasionally understand, but not speak, so I could have this wrong.)  Michael Hardy 02:32, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, if it's accusative, it's -um; if nominative, then -us. Thus, "Benedictus Papa est" -- subject, thus acc. "Habemus Benedictum" and dative "Benedicto biblam do" (I'm giving Benedict a bible) --Zantastik 02:51, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Benedictus, Benedictum

message: removed an rather odd picture that was posted in the place of the previous actual picture of the Pope.
Not that I condone that sort of thing on Wikipedia (my precious), but if you had a look at the cover pic of "A New Pope" on www.smh.com.au, you might have a giggle like I did!  The framing of his arms - just like a hood!  So appropriate!  Tez 04:15, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  odd picture 

message: Here's something he recently wrote:  --Zantastik 02:49, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  A good source for writing about him 

message: I'm hardly fluent in Latin (barely remember my single university course!) but according to the Vatican website his reign name in Latin is "BENEDICTVM XVI", romanized that would be "Benedictum XVI" would it not?  Why does the page say: "officially in Latin Benedictus XVI"?  It would seem to me that even if Benedictum is technically incorrect it is his official name.
Gabe 03:04, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Latin name