Talk:Sephiroth (Final Fantasy)/Archive 1

message: The descriptions in the Biography section concerning the events in Nibelheim are not a mistake, nor are they incorrect. The information detailed therein comes from Last Order: Final Fantasy VII and Before Crisis: Final Fantasy VII, which presents the current canon version of these events.
I would have to disagree.  I don't think the events in the Nibelheim reactor have been retconned, seeing as how the Final Fantasy VII Advent Children: Reunion Files book states in the Last Order section that Cloud's memories are quite messed up (or something to that effect) and that Last Order is one possible interpretation of the Nibelheim incident.  Please correct me if I have misstated anything, as I do not have access to my Reunion Files book at the moment.
Chibi Gohan 08:05, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Nibelheim flashback

message: Alright if it doesn't mean cleanup then just what the hell is this supposed to mean?
"The Final Fantasy VII story line is extremely diverse and still leaves many questions; this, however, is a collection of ideas about Sephiroth, one of the most interesting villains of the Final Fantasy series, no matter how assumptious they may be."
D. G. 13:01, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: You know, perhaps we should just yank that paragraph. --Paul Soth 02:46, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup 

message: If "Jenova" isn't a portmanteau, that should probably be fixed on Jenova too... -Silence 19:18, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Jenova is probably a portmanteau (unless someone has a better theory where the name comes from), but if you're going to describe it as a portmanteau, you have to say which words it comes from. More than one. Important distinction. Anyway, I hope the wording is less clumsy these days as is. --Wwwwolf 11:09, 22 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  The edit I was responding to did mention the two words that Jenova may be a combination of: Jehovah and Nova. But OK, that doesn't have to be mentioned on this article, I just wanted to make sure we didn't say anywhere that it's a portmanteau if it isn't. -Silence 05:36, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jenova 

message: Someone added an entire section for Dirge of Cerberus just to mention the rumor that Sephiroth "finds a new vessel to inhabit" (the mysterious fellow in the trailers). While this is certainly possible (since Sephiroth just REFUSES to die, and all), I think this is inappropriate for the article at this time, so I've removed it. Hopefully ya'll won't find this objectionable... -Reichu 06:06, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Some people just don't get that Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. I'll put money down that he'll show up in some shape or form. Until then... ~ Hibana 01:41, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dirge of Cerberus 

message: Someone advocates in the article that 片翼の天使 (katayoku no tenshi) does not refer to something with just one wing, but something with "wings on one side". I'm not sure if this is entirely correct... I'll admit I'm not fully qualified to make a definite accessment, but I've taken the liberty (with the help of an old friend ) of looking for related uses of 片 kata- ("one-sided") + "body part" to see what the term precisely implies. Apparently, kata can imply the possession of only one of said body part (as in a leg or an eye) or is used in reference to an action in which only one of the available parts are employed (carrying something with one hand, baring one shoulder, hopping on one leg). I think this adequately demonstrates that whoever made this comment in the article was mistaken on the usage of the prefix kata-. Sephiroth is STILL the "One-Winged Angel" and it STILL doesn't make any sense (at the end of FF7, anyway). I'll fix this later unless someone objects.
Also, I've made a proposal for the Sephy page in FF7 talk. Take a lookie, please. ^_^ -Reichu 18:11, 18 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Katayoku no tenshi 

message: I've tightened the "One-Winged Angel" section up a great deal, which consisted of fixing some errors, rearranging some sentences that were totally out of place, adding information where needed, removing some pointless speculation, adding opposing views to relevant speculation, and generally making it more coherent and encyclopedic.
I also changed Sephiroth's birthplace from "Unknown" to "Nibelheim." Ryu Kaze 06:11, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hold on, Sephiroth was born in Nibelheim? Are you sure? I thought he was 'created' in a generic Mako reactor. I didn't think it was confirmed to be the Nibelheim reactor. --JiFish(Talk/Contrib) 14:33, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  One-Winged Angel Section 

message: This is a request that editors please stop stating that most of the forms of Sephiroth seen throughout Final Fantasy VII were astral projections (the Ultimania Omega Guide has identified most of them as being Jenova's body and pieces of its body), and that they also not change the descriptions of Kadaj, Yazoo, and Loz in Advent Children to identify them as Sephiroth clones. This is false. They are manifestations of his will and spirit, for he was able to pull out of the lifestream before being diluted thanks to his strong will, as has been gone over repeatedly on many forums across the internet since September, and was even documented extensively in an essay by a fan:
http://faqs.ign.com/articles/657/657331p1.html
The film even calls the trio "shinentai" ("body of thoughts/will"), and is mentioned in that essay. Please be aware of these things if you weren't before, and please cease and desist. We wish to keep this article as factual as possible, and while any and all attempts to contribute are appreciated, it's better to err on the side of caution when dealing with controversial matters that you don't have a reference for.
The reference for this info, by the way, is the FFVII Ultimania Omega Guide, Advent Children itself, and The Distance, the making of Advent Children. Ryu Kaze 00:40, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Advent Children and Manifestation Sections 

message: The new Jenova section seems a POV to me, especially the "The real Sephiroth was killed by Cloud before the game even began" section. Nothing in the game (as far as I remember) evidencies that Sephiroth is merely a manifestation of Jenova's will. Any thoughts?
:Doesn't FFVII Ultimania say that Sephiroth was controlling Jenova, since his will is apparently stronger? urutapu 13:48, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I got rid of that section. And, yes, the Ultimania Omega does say that. Ryu Kaze 14:25, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  possible POV 

message: Within the article, it is stated that Tifa takes up the Masamune upon finding her father slain outside the reactor chamber.  However, earlier in the game (i.e. when President Shinra is found dead at his desk), it is also stated that only Sephiroth can wield the Masamune.  Also, the sword that Tifa picks up is much SHORTER than Masamune; that sword is longer than Sephiroth is tall.  Should we change this?  --HubHikari 23:48, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't fully understand the flash back sequence, early in the game Cloud tells the story but is then regarded as incorrect later in the game, especially in Cloud's Mind part. This needs to be verified.--Andeh 10:19, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's explained early on Disc 2.  Cloud is a failed Sephiroth clone made by Hojo, either using the body of the young Shinra trooper named Cloud Strife after he collapsed at Nibelheim, or simply by creating a brand new body.  During his escape with Zack, this new Cloud seems to be mentally disturbed and have no personality.  Zack loans him an outfit, talks to him about becoming a mercenery, and was once a SOLDIER.  The new Cloud, not having a memory or personality to speak of, convinces himself he was in SOLDIER and takes on a lot of Zack's personality traits.  He's like a dry sponge.  (This is explained in a hidden cutscene available late on Disc 2; go to the Mansion Basement after Cloud rejoins your party)  After Zack is killed, Cloud meets Tifa in Midgar, and she starts to awaken memories of the original Cloud - the one who joined the Shinra regular army after he washed out at SOLDIER and was too ashamed to go back home.  Then Jenova begins to move towards the reunion, and Cloud chases what he thinks is a ghostly Sephiroth around the world (Disc 1).  But he's not really chasing anything, as Jenova explains at the altar where Aeris dies:  Cloud is a puppet, a Sephiroth clone, being drawn to Reunion like all the others.  This is why Sephiroth is able to control Cloud - Sephiroth isn't really "there" because he died 5 years ago (his body is in the North Cave).  What appears as Sephiroth in Discs 1 and 2 is simply Jenova using Sephiroth's form.  To make a long story short, the version of the story explained in Cloud's Mind in Disc 2 is the correct version.  The version he tells in Kalm and Nibelheim on Disc 1 is a delusion he subconsciously made up out of memories of Zack, because he had none of his own.  Does it make more sense now?  Kasreyn 16:28, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

text: No.  The fact that no one can use Masamune still holds true.  Tifa sure didn't have much luck with it, did she?  Masamune's Sephiroth-only nature isn't based on something that prevents anyone else from picking it up.  It's just such an unwieldy, point-heavy blade that only Sephiroth is strong enough to use it properly.  I'm not that strong a guy, and I'm sure I could pick up a claymore.  It wouldn't do me any good, though, because I wouldn't be strong enough to swing it.  The same principle applies to Masamune, except that no one but Sephiroth would have been strong enough.  Tifa could pick it up, but she was as harmless as a kitten with it.  As for judging by the appearance of the sword, that's a bad idea.  Remember, the characters' heads in those sequences are bigger around than their torsos due to the stylistic choices made by Square!  But in the CGI movies their proportions are more realistic.  So we clearly can't judge from the in-game graphics things like length and other physical dimensions, because they could all just be stylistic changes for the moment.  Official Square literature discusses Masamune, and we should stick to that.  Kasreyn 16:28, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

text: This is well and good, Kasreyn, but the dimensions of their heads and torsos remain consistent throughout, right?  Given that, I think it is fair to say that the sword Tifa picks up is definitely shorter than Masamune, Sephiroth-only aside.  --HubHikari 20:30, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, one example is how, no matter what sword you have equipped, when Cloud is in a cutscene it always shows the Buster Sword.  I think it's clear that in cutscenes they feel free to superdeform the characters and take stylistic liberties.  Also, note that Tifa fails in her attempt to use the sword; Sephiroth then takes it and uses it.  He is not seen carrying any other sword in the sequence, and Tifa says "Sephiroth did this" when she sees the sword by her father's body.  How could she have known Sephiroth did it - unless the sword lying by her father was the one which could only be used by one man?  I'd say some application of Occam's Razor is warranted here - the simplest explanation is that Square intended that sword to be Masamune and simply changed its appearance for stylistic reasons.  The more complex explanation is that there was a whole different sword, identical to masamune except for length, which Tifa could instantly tell by appearance belonged to Sephiroth.  That seems to assume too much.  Kasreyn 22:59, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Actually, Cloud was a real person all along. The game reveals that the same Cloud who grew up in Nibelheim was the same one who Zack talked to. Sephiroth lied. Cloud had no personality at the time of Zack and Cloud's escape because he was suffering from Mako poisoning, which drowns out an insecure person's mind due to all the memories held within mako. And as for Sephiroth's sword...is it really shorter? I never noticed any difference between the field model of the sword in that scene and later in the game. It's obviously supposed to be the same sword, even if the field model looks inconsistent with the battle model. --Made2Fade 20:36, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nibelheim Reactor Sequence 

message: Isn't Sephiroth an albino? He vaguely looks like one, white hair, bluish eyes, and other traits of albinism.Triple-Quadruple 00:28, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's more like he's the perfect villian bishounen.  Silver hair seems to be a real anime pretty-boy trait.  Besides, there's been no such official statement on his being albino or not, so it'd probably be safe not to add that.—urutapu 01:09, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: He likely inherited his silver hair from Jenova, who was a spacefaring alien, so probably not. --Made2Fade 10:59, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Albino 

message: Ok a theory section is going to have to be made for this one.
1. Uncited and pure speculated statements riddle this article
2. Player theory's
3. inaccurate information
I already made an edit but its not enough and I dont want to start making major edits or deletions through the entire article so instead id like to ask for a theory section to be passed here. Ill give it a week all who agree please state it Kara Umi 14:25, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think there's any legitimate reason to include a player theories section.  Any information that looks like original research should be tagged with a cite needed.  If a source is not found, the claim should go.  The article is too long as it is.  Only details from games, books, and movies within the Compilation of Final Fantasy VII and Square's Ultimania Omega Guide should be considered canonical.  All claims which do not derive from those sources should probably go.  I've written a guide to FFVII and have beaten the game about 15 or 16 times, so I know a good deal, I also have a copy of Advent Children...  if you have any questions over whether something really happened in the game or Advent Children, just ask and I'll be glad to help you.  :)  Kasreyn 17:24, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

text: P.S.  Allow me to amend myself:  if a third party makes a worthwhile (ie. notable) claim regarding the character, that could be included even if it isn't an official Square publication.  Material like the bit on the Kabbalistic origins of the name "Sephiroth" are interesting but hard to source.  You were right to remove it.  If a third party has noted the similarity of the words, we could cite that.  I find it an intriguing example of the careful thought Nomura put into his character design, and it would be nice to find a way to keep it if a source could be found.  Kasreyn 17:31, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Theory 

message: Sephiroth is a strong influence toward gamers and non-gamers vastly 
and also for the physical artwork designers i feel his character status will not disapear without a fight they gave him a great ground in the future as in the song "one winged angel" he does not wish to die so he becomes angry and raged and in all the characters in the world of gaming never will
:Ehh, what?  Can someone translate this for me?  --HubHikari 15:25, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't want to speak ill of the author of the original comment, but I don't think they're very skilled with English.  I, too, am unable to make out what they're trying to say.  That, or it was generated by an automatic script.  Kasreyn 03:05, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  His mental existance for almost everyone 

message: Will whoever added the NPOV tag please explain why they feel this article violates WP:NPOV?  I see the above section by Seancdaug, but it seems to refer to weasel wording and fancruft, two issues which are only partially involved with NPOV.  We need to have a real discussion of the article's alleged NPOV failure, or else we need to take the tag down.  Kasreyn 04:47, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: My specific problems (which I did mention above, actually, though I focused more on the weasel words there) is in the overabudance of meta-textual interpretation. This isn't exactly a fancruft issue, and it goes beyond weasel words. The appearances section is the worst offender, but it's not limited to that: the manifestation section states, as fact, what is, to my knowledge, interpretation. The brief section on OWA has some shining examples, too: "...adding to Sephiroth's mystique...", and "...a sort of mystic and terroric feel, as something of a 'Deus Celebri'...". The interpretation itself is problematic, that much of it is unlabelled as such is unacceptable. Does this explain it a little better? – Seancdaug 05:34, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure does, thanks for explaining...  I'm certainly not against a trim, the article has swollen dramatically in recent months.  How about you prepare a "trimmed" draft, removing all the POV crud like "Sephiroth's mystique", and link it here and we'll all go over it?  My guess is a great deal of the extraneous material can be trimmed without upsetting anyone; most of it seems to be added by the anons who wander in and add their personal opinions.  Cheers, Kasreyn 05:43, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll see what I can do. It might take me a while, though: my wiki-time will be limited in the next few weeks. If anyone else wants to make an attempt to whip this baby back into shape in the interim, feel free to do so. – Seancdaug 16:59, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV? 

message: I'm just adding this here because I changed this on the main page:  Seph's attack in KH is called "Heartless Angel", not "Sin Harvest".  Lance Bass (ugh) mumbled his damned line.  He's saying "Descend, heartless angel!", but the only syllables he doesn't mumble are "scend" and "har (mumble) est", so it's been widely mistaken for "Sin Harvest".  As Safer Sephiroth in FFVII he uses Heartless Angel, which reduces you to 1 HP (I'm not sure, because he's only ever cast it on me once, but I think it only targets a single party member).  I have heard on the Gamespot forums that Tetsuya Nomura himself has confirmed that the attack's name is "Heartless Angel"; most of the better gaming sites seem to refer to it as such.  I will attempt to track down a source on Nomura's having said that.  Kasreyn 22:58, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well I agree with you on the attack "Heartless Angel" in both FFVII and KHII; however, there is no proof to my knowledge that Lance Bass mumbled that line. In fact, in the Brady Games strategy guide it is even mentioned that particular attack is "Sin Harvest." Also, another issue that came up was that since there was no Japanese version of Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts and he spoke English in Final Mix then it is possible that Sin Harvest was only in the U.S. localization of Kingdom Hearts. 15:28, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Localization, now I think you're on to something, that could explain the confusion.  After all, Square is notorious for changing the FF games a great deal for the American release...  why should the KH series be any different?  Still though, when I listen to it, I can clearly hear him say "Descend", now that I know to listen for the soft first syllable.  Turning the volume up helps.  Cheers, Kasreyn 00:21, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kingdom Hearts attack:  Heartless Angel 

message: I was wondering:  how old are the mass of tags at the top of the article, and can any of them be done away with?  Are there, for instance, ongoing debates over NPOV, weasel words, and writing style?  Because currently not a bit of the article is "above the fold"; all the reader sees on first load is a pile of tags.  Kasreyn 08:34, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Profusion of tags? 

message: Does anyone know Sephiroth's eye colour? It seems to change between green and blue, and I'm not really sure if they're meant to be green or not. Can anybody shed some light on this? - The preceding comment was made by Grevenko Sereth 0:04, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: See this external image:   Or this one:   The correct term for that shade is turquoise, which is a sort of green-blue.  It could  also be considered a near-cyan.  Yet in Advent Children, I think his eyes were a much greener shade.  Of course, that was after his physical death and reincarnation as a Jenova-entity, so I'm sure he could have changed his eye color (he was able to grow wings, after all!).  I would put turquoise for eye color, or failing that, green.  Kasreyn 01:02, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

text: If you see here -  Sephiroth's eyes are a silver/grey colour, however they change to a green/blue colour in combat. I think that the mixed influence of mako/Jenova changes his eye colour in a similar fashion to the SOLDIER's eyes glowing. Kat33auS 05:40, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Sephiroth's Eye Colour

message: Sephiroth did not kill Aerith. The assertion, "Aerith was murdered by Sephiroth" is made in the Biography section of the article. This is entirely wrong. Further down in the article, under Manifestations it is stated, "All manifestations of Sephiroth seen throughout the game — excluding flashback sequences and his real body at the Northern Crater — are Jenova cells manipulated through Sephiroth's will to take his shape." This is correct, and therefore Aerith was killed by Jenova in the form of Sephiroth.
I understand why it would be said that Sephiroth killed Aerith. It is easily the most dramatic moment of the game, and ranks high among "great moments in gaming". Also, it looks like Sephiroth, is being controlled by Sephiroth, and is killing main characters like Sephiroth wants too-- so why not just say it is Sephiroth? It wasn't though. It was a Jenova-cell puppet.
I'm not really saying it should be changed or the picture removed (Actually I think its a good picture to have in the article), just pointing out that it is not accurate.
This is my first Wiki post ever, so any mistakes or presumptions on my part are not meant to offend. Thanks. CennB 05:29, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Now you're just splitting hairs. --Paul Soth 08:22, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

text: "Factually", don't you mean "technically".EAB 04:05, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sephiroth killing Aerith 

message: This threw me off completely and needs to be corrected; 
Quote" He is delayed by Gaara, whom Sephiroth is disarmed and wounded near-fatally by. Zack, a fellow 1st class SOLDIER, arrives to stop Gaara, but he too is dispatched and sent reeling from Jenova's chamber." EndQuote.
Gaara is from Naruto, so unless I'm missing something why in the bleeding hell is he even mentioned on this article? RBlowes 07:43, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vandalisation/splinching? 

message: Why is nowhere in the article mentioned the fact that the name "Sephiroth", although being incorrectly used as a character name (it actually is a plural form) is a central concept in Qabala (or Kabbalah), the main system of Jewish occultism/exoterism?
Massimo80 03:31, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I mentioned it when I did the first major revision and expansion of the article (before it was just a sentence). Looks like it got lost over the past two years. Anybody got a good reason not to mention it? --Paul Soth 09:52, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. --Paul Soth 14:46, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Qabalistic references 

message: Here's a few thoughts I had after reading the article.  I may change some of it myself later if there are no objections:
* I think the "Dirge of Cerberus" section should just be a small part of the "Other Appearances" section.  Also, the info conflicts with info in the opening paragraph.  "He was also only mentioned by Weiss in Dirge of Cerberus: Final Fantasy VII" vs. "Sephiroth appears in a flashback scenario when Lucrecia slumps over and starts to see what her future son would do later on."
* In the "Other Appearances" section at the end, the article mentions a Sephiroth MUGEN character.  I think it's mostly pov, and mentions other unrelated characters (Evil Ryu, Tom Hanks, Marvin the Martian etc.).  I don't think powerful MUGEN characters are notable, as a great deal of them are.  Maybe it could at least be trimmed down?
* How about mention somewhere of that Sephiroth appearance on Robot Chicken?  Could go nicely in "Popularity" section.
* Hate to say it, but the Spoiler Warning needs to go up higher.  "He is also responsible for the death of a major protagonist".  It's still a spoiler.  "a major protagonist" even links to the page of said protagonist.  Granted, it's hard to read a Wikipedia video game article without ruining the plot, but a spoiler is a spoiler.  Personally, I would like to see any spoiling plot removed from the opening paragraph.  *Phew* --ScarletSpiderDave 08:08, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I did a few spot edits, but a lot more needs to be done. I mean, the flow and wording of the biography section has become a mess ("What have you done with my article!?! Gah!") I mean, a lot more has to be mentioned about JENOVA for starters. Yes, she has her own article, but we can mention more here. Also the wording should be a bit less stylized. I'm going to look it all over again. --Paul Soth 14:52, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  A few Suggestions 

message: An anonymous person just added a link to a Wikia page. It's very similar to the Wiki page. Should it be removed? Kat33auS 08:38, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It is a transwiki project, designed to be a more fan based wiki of a certain subject.  It probably does not have to be removed, but should be modified to look better. MythSearchertalk 08:51, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  External Links 

message: Edit performed by Joeymx 10:04, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image used by  

message: Take a look:
However, "Sephiroth" was actually Jenova's body taken over by Sephiroth's will and remolded in his image as his puppet in order to find and retrieve the "Sephiroth Clones", individuals who had undergone the same cell injection procedure as Sephiroth to prove Hojo's Jenova Reunion Theory.
Does this mean that in the Midgar part at the beginning of the game, when there was blood all over the floors, and loads of dead guys, that it was Jenova (appearing as Sephiroth) who killed them all? Or was there a third Sephiroth (seeing that it couldn't be the one encased in the Mako in the Northern Crater)?
And how did Jenova gain Sephiroth's sword the Masamune? Surely it would have passed into the Lifestream with Sephiroth at the Nibleheim incident? Or was it "part" of Sephiroth's puppetry of Jenova?
I think the clarification of this detail should be added to the article. :D —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Robertcathles (talk • contribs) 18:35, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: EDIT: Plus, How does this explain the battle sequences - does it mean that Joenova changed shape when Sephy killed Aeris? And how did Sephy manage to carry Jenova's "arm" when on the boat to Costa Del Sol? - Surely then the Sephy puppet would have been missing part as well? --rjcuk 22:27, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that FFVII:AC answers some of these questions. The Masamune sword is part of the puppetry. I think that it must have been Jenova in Sephy's image all along. Or was it Jenova controlling Sephiroth? And was Cloud part of the Reunion, or did he go to Jenova/Sephiroth of his own will? Maybe this is getting a bit off-topic of 'suggestions' and more into 'original research'. I'll shut up now. --rjcuk 11:42, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Was it Sephiroth or Jenova who killed the Shinra guards? 

message: I don't know if this page is acceptable by wikipedia's standards, but nonetheless it mentions that Sephiroth was designed by Yoshitaka Amano. On the sephiroth page in discussion, citation is needed at that reference, so perhaps the pages i'm suggesting could be used for that citation - http://internal.tbi.net/~max/ffxart.htm http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0023923/filmokey http://www.answers.com/topic/sephiroth-final-fantasy-vii Tresmius 14:50, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citation on Yoshitaka Amano 

message: May not be as important as I make it seem, and while it's a good image, the picture of Sephiroth stabbing Aeris may be a bit of a give-away if someone hasn't played FF7 before (or watched Advent Children, where it's made pretty clear she's dead). 
And, I know that stabbing doesn't necessarily indicate that he kills her, it -IS- a fairly important/unsuspected moment in FF7. Hanzolot 05:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I see no problem in this.  Square originally intended to let everybody know this happens.  If you insert disc 2 and press start game, it will show this movie clip, with Sephiroth stabing Aerith in the back, then asks you to change the disc.  It is not a spoiler to tell that it happens, it is a spoiler if one tells how and why.  MythSearchertalk 02:50, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spoiler Alert?