Talk:Five precepts

message: What about Pancasila as the five principles of Indonesian politics? Adam 00:27, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There was a dab notice, but Sacca removed it on Sep. 28. I have restored it.—Nat Krause(Talk!) 02:46, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Indonesian politics dab? 

message: The article is restored to the name of The Five Precepts, to keep it in order with The Eight Precepts and The Ten Precepts. ALso pancasila is rarely used, five precepts is frequently used. pancasila is a disambiguation page now. Greetings, Sacca 03:44, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Please don't use article titles that begin with "The ...".—Nat Krause(Talk!) 04:00, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It appears that The Eight Precepts article is now entitled Eight Precepts.  Might this motivate a new assessment as to whether or not this should be moved to Five Precepts?  With metta, Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 02:30, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The...? 

message: I thought that on a new moon day and a full moon day that lay buddhists kep the 8 precepts. is this not true? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.142.86.186 (talk) 20:11, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: For Theravada Buddhists, this is true.  See, for instance, the WP article, Uposatha.  As for Mahayana practitioners, I have no idea. Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 02:43, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  5 precepts or 8 precepts 

message: I'd like to suggest three changes:
# Create an introductory section: I think this article's first paragraph is a very good introduction to the article -- if it would also simply include a summary of the Five Precepts along the lines of: "The Five Precepts are commitments to abstain from killing, stealing, sexual misconduct, lying and intoxication."  The subsequent paragraphs prior to the "Chinese version of five precepts" are of course extremely valuable but, for me, are no longer introductory in nature.
# Create a "From the Pali Canon" section: My main reason for this is that I'd like to include some information from the Pali Canon, e.g., as to why the Buddha asks his followers to abstain as opposed to making traditional commandments, per SN 42.8, Sankha Sutta (e.g., Thanissaro, 1999); or, what is meant by "sexual misconduct," etc.  Given the article's current structure, it's not clear to me where it would be best to insert this information.
# Find citations for or delete the current third paragraph: The current third paragraph states: "The Buddha is said to have taught the five precepts out of compassion, and for the betterment of society. Thus they are to be undertaken voluntarily rather than as commandments from a god. The precepts are intended to help a Buddhist live a less complicated life, so that they can progress more easily on the Path." Some of this sounds like it could be from the Pali Canon, some from Mahayana texts, some from an earnest, beautiful, personal exposition.  Any citations?
Thanks for any feedback.  If I don't hear anything in a week or so, I'd like to go ahead and make the above changes.  Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 02:25, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi Larry, I changed one phrase only, something like “less complicated life” to “a life free from remorse” as it is the latter which supports concentration. Dhammapal 09:53, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: After over three months with no objections, I went ahead and implement (1) and part of (2) above. Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 17:45, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro & Pali-specific section? 

message: This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 04:29, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  WikiProject class rating 

message: Does anyone know for certain the earliest source of the exact 5 Pali precepts as stated in this article (which replicates how they are shown in various contemporary puja manuals, e.g., Ven. Eligirye Indaratana, 2002, p. 2) ?  For instance, are they in the Pali Canon?  I'm aware of the following:
* these training rules are mentioned in a variety of canonical discourses but, in such contexts (e.g., where they are often identified as part of a greater-than-five set) are phrased differently than as stated in this article (e.g., without sikkhāpadaṃ samādiyāmi at the end) (ex.: DN 32, under "Pañcata"; and, MN 9, as part of 10 unskillful acts)
* the 10 precepts (e.g., with a different third precept from the 5 precepts) are stated in Khp. 1.2 (e.g., Thanissaro, 1994)
* I've seen a couple of allusions to panca-sila and panca-sikkhapada in the Canon (e.g. in the obscure SN 37.24 in Bodhi, 2000, p. 1289, referring to a woman's virtues; the Pali's here, para. 305).
* the Abhidhamma Pitaka's Vibhanga has a chapter entitled, Sikkhāpada-vibhaṅgo (e.g., Vbh. 285), which enumerates the five training precepts but, again, absent the full language used here (i.e., no samādiyāmi).
* a search with the La Trobe University search engine appears to locate a match to this particular phraseology in the 12th c. AD (post-canonical, post-commentarial ;-) ) Upāsaka-janā-lakāra ("Ornament of Laypeople," abbrev. "Upas").
So, I've yet to come across these full blown statements (e.g., Pāātipātā veramaṇī sikkhāpadaṃ samādiyāmi) in the Canon; and, I wonder if the Upas ref is the earliest known context.  Thanks for any help! Larry Rosenfeld (talk) 11:53, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Earliest source for verbatim 5 Pali precepts? 

message: If you want to discuss making changes to the article after your changes were reverted (multiple times), here is the place to do so. First, we need a reliable source to add new material; can you find one? Second, your wording is awkward, bad English and un-encyclopedic, so we should discuss that. Ogress 19:34, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Five Precepts added by ShinKaiRyu 

message: when we say "Musāvādā" we are saying we do not tell lies ,that does not mean we are going to tell the truth always. Sometimes telling the truth  also not the right thing, telling the truth is also has to be carefully done.if the truth something that hurts other person you should not tell that thruth.And also it is important to note that 4th Precept ,"Musāvādā"(මුසාවාදා) includes  four Precepts.
#"Musāvādā" (මුසාවාදා)  abstain from false speech. ( but does not mean telling the truth always)
#Parusha waacha (පරුෂා වාචා) Saying something that hurts other person.
#Pisunaa waacha (පිසුනා වාචා) Carrying tales around.
#Sampap palapaa  (සම්ප්‍රපප්‍රලාපා) Saying truth but useless and misleading others.--RsEkanayake 01:47, 3 September 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  4th Precep, abstain from false speech does not mean that we should   tell the "truth" always. 

message: Are the references to the bhikkuni sangha in the article's introduction a) relevant; and if so, b) better served as a section of its own?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.25.175.114 (talk) 15:24, 5 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bhikkuni sangha 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Searching Wikipedia for the Ten Precepts redirects to this page, and there are multiple pages (such as "Anagarika" and the "Ten Precepts (Taoism)") with links that redirect here, but the words "Ten Precepts" are actually not found anywhere on the page. Why were all references to this concept removed from this page? Should this article be updated to include them again or should those links be fixed to direct somewhere else? 142.163.89.41 (talk) 20:51, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: In my opinion, the ten precepts are a different set of rules with a different religious context and history. They can therefore not be included in this article. Unfortunately, in English language, there is not enough coverage by secondary sources to warrant a separate article. I therefore suggest to rewrite the ten precepts in Buddhism on the disambiguation page, and link it to Samanera instead.--Farang Rak Tham  (Talk) 09:09, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

text: Done.--Farang Rak Tham  (Talk) 09:16, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Where did Ten Precepts go? 

message: Correct me if im wrong. But if this article is a GA. Shouldnt its rating for WP Buddhism and WP Philosophy also be GA instead of C? Wikiman5676 (talk) 02:22, 4 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: It should. Thanks for the catch.--Farang Rak Tham  (Talk) 11:08, 4 June 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rating 

message: Not sure whether I am doing this correctly but have repeatedly tried to edit this page without success (always reverts back!). The description of the 5 precepts and associated terms here is completely inconsistent with Theravada so the page needs to disaggregate comments that are Therabada and the following (which may be Mahayana, I don't know, but are definitely not correct from a Theravada perspective:
1. Precepts are 'prohibitions'
2. Karma is retribution
3. The precepts are required to become a lay disciple
1. It is very clear from the Pali texts, which are as close as we can come to the Buddha's original teachings, that the precepts are not like the 10 commandments. They are not prohibitions. This is clear from the very text of the translations further down the page, which I agree with, that state these are self-imposed "training rules". In Theravada Buddhism, there is no way any being, even a Buddha, can prohibit anything. Buddha states quite explicitly that he is not a creator God, is not the being who imposed the rules of the Universe (or Samsara), he just reflected on how things work and he advised us on a guide to action that will help you in Samsara- but it is up to you. This is a very important point and if not the same in Mahayana schools this discrepancy needs to be made clear, rather than state prohibition as though it is an agreed point in all the Buddhist schools.
2. Karma or kamma refers to action, not the 'reward or punishment'. The effect of the action (kamma) would actually be the vipaka rather than the kamma. Also, it is not a matter of retribution, which is part of the Abrahamic paradigms' approach to the Universe and not Theravada schools. There is no reward or punishment, there is only cause and effect. Again, this might seem pedantic, but it is actually a critical element of Theravada Buddhism so please highlight that this term is contested by Theravada Buddhism
3. There is no concept of "being a Buddhist" in Buddhism. There is no Pali word for being a Buddhist or being a 'non-believer' in Buddhism. There are words for both these labels in all other major world religions, so it is understandable that words are attributed to Buddhism, but they are not there in Theravada Buddhism. You can follow the precepts, or not follow them, or call yourself a Buddhist, or not call yourself a Buddhist....none of those has anything to do with Buddhism, its all about you. There is no consecration or confirmation process. You don't have to do anything in Buddhism- you have agency to make your own decisions. These concepts are critical to the Theravada school of Buddhism  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hasantha Gunasekera (talk • contribs) 05:29, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: , Wikipedia is an encyclopedia that summarizes reliable fact and important opinions, usually derived from mainstream scholarship and journalism. It's not just writing what you think. See WP:RS.--Farang Rak Tham  (Talk) 08:03, 27 January 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Multiple errors here in relation to Theravada Buddhism