Talk:Zeila

message: The picture of the zeila coastline looks strangely like the Pao de Acucar in Rio de Janeiro with the Corcovado in the background.  I doubt that this picture actually is from the somaliland coastline. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Brandonwilson (talk • contribs) 20:31, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Picture of Rio de Janeiro? 

message: The section on Modern Times is totally disconnected from the rest of the article. It refers to a war with no explanation and which is not explained here nor described anywhere else. There is also no mention of the fact that the area is now administered by the unrecognised but independent Republic of Somaliland.Stuartsh (talk) 12:06, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Modern Times section 

message: Please, could somebody add a few sentences about the Zeila proposal of 1935? --Roksanna (talk) 22:06, 29 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zeila proposal 

message: Zeila was a stronghold of the Harla dominated Adal Sultanate. I believe the city was named by the extinct Harla people to mean land near water in contrast to gey which means town in Harla such as Hargeisa. An ethnic group called the Zay people are located in Ethiopia most likely scattered after Abyssinian-Adal war. The Zay language is related with the Harari language another tribe that were located in the capital of Adal called  Gey or Harar. Volunteering editors should find sources connecting the two. Kiziotherapy (talk) 10:57, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zay people and Zaila connection 

message: In the late 1980s by Barre/Morgan or in the early 1990s (which I doubt because fighting was not heavy in Somaliland). See the Spanish Wikipedia to see that the 1980s are more probable.Marcin862 (talk) 08:25, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  When was the town destroyed?

message: Avalites is called in the Peripleus Eritrea source. This Havilah is being used indisciminately and would like comments from neutral editors. Authorityofwiki (talk) 20:20, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: There's no issues with using both terms Avalite/Havilah however blanking is not acceptable. see this source  The exact location of Avalite is not known its disputed. Duqsene (talk) 21:23, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for posting your point of view Duqsene, I will wait for neutral editors to view the source(s) you provided for the edit you made, and that they(neutral editors) will see the source(s) and provide their analysis of the source and claim. Authorityofwiki (talk) 22:22, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd like to also add, it seems odd for this statement "In antiquity, it was identified with the commercial port of Havilah."  In "antiquity"(ancient times), and then it links to Havilah which goes back to Book of Genesis, referring to a "region" and then it gets limited to a "Port" town called "Zeila" in Somalia? This port town of "Zeila" may have been mistakenly named as "Havilah" by 1500-1800 European explorers, however the Ancient Greek traveler who wrote the Periplus of the Erythraean Sea referred to the area as "Avalites". This source  states:"From this place the Arabian Gulf trends toward the east and becomes narrowest just before the Gulf of Avalites. After about four thousand stadia, for those sailing eastward along the same coast, there are other Berber market-towns, known as the 'far-side' ports; lying at intervals one after the other, without harbors but having roadsteads where ships can anchor and lie in good weather. The first is called Avalites; to this place the voyage from Arabia to the far-side coast is the shortest. Here there is a small market-town called Avalites, which must be reached by boats and rafts." Authorityofwiki (talk) 23:19, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: More sources  and , Avalites is a Greek term, while Havilah is a Hebrew word.  The two are not necessarily the same thing.  What 1500-1800 Christian European explorers renamed or mistakenly named does not justify using their terms over the original text of the Ancient Greeks. Authorityofwiki (talk) 23:44, 16 December 2017 (UTC)

text: According to these sources, the two are not the same: 
    https://books.google.ca/books?id=irBUAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA619&dq=avalites+Havilah&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiq7tCrppnYAhUM92MKHZgoCJcQ6AEIWDAI#v=onepage&q=avalites%20Havilah&f=false  AND   https://books.google.ca/books?id=tABgAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA70&dq=avalites+Havilah&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjx79joppnYAhUG1mMKHfHfBZYQ6AEIQTAE#v=onepage&q=avalites%20Havilah&f=false
Peter K Burian (talk) 19:20, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

text: The two sources each say that Havilah was the predecessor of the Avalites. Duqsene (talk) 21:12, 20 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I read the sources and Havilah is being used indiscriminately. And Avalites is being used indiscriminately as well.  However, like Peter stated, the two Places are not the same. The Bibilical Havilah is Not modern day Somalia atleast there is no reliable source that says so.  Avalites however was used in the Greek source that pinpoints to the port in Somalia. Authorityofwiki (talk) 01:10, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  Quick searches says Havilah/avalite might be tied to Zaila.      Duqsene (talk) 02:23, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: None of those sources say "Havilah" equals "Avalites" or the Port in Somalia. Infact, they all seem to use weasel words to give some kind of connection. But all your sources say Havilah is closer to Iran or the Persian Gulf. Authorityofwiki (talk) 05:01, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

text: I got summoned here by WP:FRS, and from what I can see, User:Duqsene started this dispute by unilaterally changing Avalites to Havilah in this article and is the only user here who supports using Havilah here. I agree with the other users so far in that they are different places and that we should revert back to using Avalites in this article, especially as Havilah appears to have multiple meanings. Iffy★Chat -- 11:10, 4 January 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I have edited the lead with citations. I think mention of both identifications with context is appropriate. We do not have to present the identification with Havilah as credible. The identification with Avalites is not certain either. It has been identified with Assab and with a village near Obock. Srnec (talk) 19:10, 6 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Havilah versus Avalites 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I think it should be added onto this page that many classical scholars noted Zayla as the ancient town of Moondus. I have many sources attesting to the fact. They also state from Zayla you can see the cover of an Island (Which fits with the island of Sa'adiin, which is off the coast of Zayla) . Quote from source below. Aqooni (talk) 05:24, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title: Moondus

message: Zaila is the city of the Berbers located on the African coast.  It is desert for two months and is located close to Maqdashaw.  The people who live here mostly just eat camel skin and fish.  This town is very dirty and many people can not handle the stench.  The town is very dirty and smells very bad because the of the camel blood and fish guts.  The people of this town slaughter the animals they eat right in the streets and leave all the remains to rot, causing the stench.  When the travelers got here it smelt so bad that they decided not to stay in the town.  After they had seen how dirty and smelly it was they decided to stay a night at sea.  They only stayed close one night and continued to travel the next day.  They could not stay any longer because this clearly was the dirtiest town in the world.  Zaila is located in the northwestern part of Somalia.  It is located on the coast and surrounded by water.  After the civil war in the 1990s the city of Zaila fell apart and was destroyed causing many residents to leave the area.  Now that Zaila is a run down town many people are funding to try and rebuild this town.  This town now has only 18,600 residents.  This city also only has 5 schools with only a little over 400 students in all of them combined.  Zaila has never been a popular place for visitors and as of today is very run down.  The Travels Of Ibn Buattuta Makayla1015 (talk) 13:51, 27 April 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. L293D (☎ • ✎) 14:07, 27 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 27 April 2018 

message: Linkjan2014, please use the talk page before reverting content. This is blatant disruptive editing now. EELagoon (talk) 06:42, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Undone 

message: User:MustafaO How can you decide batuta is talking about Somali when only Berber is mentioned, explain here. Please understand according to wikipedia policy the source needs to include what you're proposing to be in the article. The current source in the article does not claim Somali founded the city and certainly not that a specific sub clan (Dir) were the founders. Post the exact text here. Magherbin (talk) 11:10, 25 February 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Berber should be the only thing mentioned if Ibn Batuta said Berber, including Dir or Somalis is original research since he didnt mention Dir nor Somali in his texts. For your information, dark skinned berbers exist in North Africa too, they're not Somalis hence coming to that conclusion is not warranted. Magherbin (talk) 20:15, 31 October 2020 (UTC)

text: The dispute is not about whether Somalis lived there or not, the dispute is the claim that Dir/Somalis are founders of the town, this is not found in any reference. Zeila is an ancient town, the ethnic groups that lived there or "founded" it wouldnt even exist today in Zeila. Rome for example was founded by the ancient Greeks not Italians. We need the source that explicitly claims what you're introducing into the article. Magherbin (talk) 20:55, 31 October 2020 (UTC)

text: Traditional is fine however what do you mean by ownership? Do the Dir clan administrate Zeila currently? We shouldnt use terms like "owner" to describe ethnicities controlling a city. The line can go something like the '"majority of inhabitants of Zeila are dir or zeila is administrated by dir.."' etc Magherbin (talk) 21:45, 31 October 2020 (UTC)

text: Ok remember to cite the proposal. Magherbin (talk) 21:03, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

text: What you posted on the talk page and what you added into the article are two different things. Magherbin (talk) 02:02, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

text: I opened a discussion on this noticeboard , dont change it back until the dispute is over. Magherbin (talk) 09:55, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zaila founders 

message: kayd 41.79.199.40 (talk) 18:52, 6 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  kaydh 

message: Zeila was always located inside "Somaliland", and the "Afar people" used the city as a proxy to propagate their interests in the region.
Djibouti and Zeila were both inside the Ottoman Eyalet of Habesh, which was mainly inhabited by Afar people.
Afar people had always used Somaliland as a proxy, until their country known as Djibouti was established. 20:08, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Afar territory 

message: Change Hegira to Hijrah اخسجہ (talk) 13:06, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. (@اخسجہ) lettherebedarklight, 晚安, おやすみなさい 12:37, 19 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 18 June 2022 

message: In the intro, for the second paragraph, please add that it is one of the oldest cities on the East African coast.
https://www.somtribune.com/2015/10/25/somaliland-notes-the-town-people-of-zeila-in-historical-pictures/ 2600:100C:A203:FD7F:FCC5:744C:531D:8BC0 (talk) 06:39, 22 October 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: @2600:100C:A203:FD7F:FCC5:744C:531D:8BC0 Please follow the request guidelines and specify a verbatim copy of the updated text. I am also unsure about this source, it's quite a mess of a webpage. It's completely unclear to whom the quote in question can be attributed. Actualcpscm (talk) 15:00, 11 November 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request