Talk:New Haven Line

message: Why is this box on the Metro North New Haven Line page? Jd2718 03:51, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Northeast Corridor Box? 

message: The lead of this article is written about New Haven Line trackage. Is there a reason to believe that readers will come here looking for trackage info, and not service info? Otherwise, "The New Haven Line runs from New Haven, Connecticut, southwest to Grand Central Terminal." Jd2718 03:55, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Service vs Trackage 

message: Could we have a source? Jd2718 02:54, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Fairfield Station? 

message: The idea that Metro-North is going to take over Shore Line East is at best speculative. Neither the governor's budget proposal nor press reports of legislators' press conference Feb. 8 make any mention of such a proposal. If you have information beyond this, please cite sources. InkQuill 03:49, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The Conneticut Department of Transportation oversees ALL SLE and New Haven Line (in Connecticut) operations.  Metro-North operates the New Haven Line between Greenwich and New Haven, and Amtrak operates SLE between New Haven and New London.  ConDot owns all SLE equipment and roughly 64% of the New Haven Line fleet, and the trains run in pool service.  For example, SLE equipment can often be seen doing the midday shuttle on the Waterbury Branch. All M2/M4/M6's are kept west of New Haven because they cannot make the voltage change just east of New Haven, and all of SLE's equipment runs east of Stamford only because they do not have third rail capabilities to enter the Park Avenue Tunnels.  This is done because of mechanical constraints, not because they are owned by two separate agencies. M8's will begin testing in the summer of 2012 on SLE for possible through service from Old Sadybrook to Grand Central TerminalCluefinder42 (talk) 00:48, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metro-North taking over Shore Line East 

message: Why isn't a line about this within the scope of this article? The council is specifically concerned with the New Haven Line of Metro-North. I find this explanation for deletion inadequate. InkQuill 03:56, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The article is about the line itself. Governance falls to Metro North and the State of Connecticut, the entities with which the Council would interact. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jd2718 (talk • contribs) 04:28, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Connecticut Rail Commuter Council 

message: The infobox has forced the first section to the below its bottom. I mistook the cause of the problem, but reversion is no solution to ugliness. DCDuring 20:21, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Ugly Layout problem

message: The picture which identifies the New Haven Line at Stamford is incorrect. That station is New Haven, and the train is the Shoreline East. It should be removed. Yaletiger (talk) 14:41, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Hate to say this, but you're wrong. Shore Line East has never used a P32AC-DM in New Haven colors. And the coach shown is from the Metro-North pool, Shore Line East uses the unique Mafersa coaches these days. And though fuzzy, at full size one can see that the sign on the platform reads "Stamford". Most importantly, though, the uploader himself states he was at Stamford when the picture was taken. I would think he knew where he was. oknazevad (talk) 16:16, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Picture of Train in Stamford

message: An image used in this article, , has been nominated for speedy deletion at Wikimedia Commons for the following reason: Copyright violations 
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thread_title: File:NJT Arrows III ALP-44.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

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thread_title:  External links modified (February 2018) 

message: Here's a 2015 AutoCAD-made Metro North Track and Structures Dept book of Track Charts, Interlocking Diagrams and Yard Diagrams - http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/2647944-Operations-Metro-North-Railroad-Track-Charts.html As you can see there is a direct link to the PDF as well if that works better. Hope it's of use. I'm not very good at adding citations, nor did I write any of the article as of yet. 2601:19A:4400:218C:120B:A9FF:FE61:EFBC (talk) 14:14, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I have added it to the article. Thank you for the link; it's very useful. epicgenius (talk) 01:04, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for adding it, Epicgenius. Glad it is useful. - Chris 2601:19A:4400:218C:E0BC:6FC8:46B7:B7E5 (talk) 18:36, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Suggested URL for Adding Citation (Particularly for Control Points, Track Layout Details, etc) 

message: The following text has been added by , but its inclusion is disputed:
It looks like too much detail for a minor incident, and most of it shouldn't be placed in this article, as per  Wikipedia:Neutral point of view#Due and undue weight. This may also be related to WP:TOOMUCH (about too much detail). Most readers don't really want to know about the details of a single incident if they are specificially looking about information on the New Haven Line. epicgenius (talk) 01:10, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: We're not disputing that this is an important event, or that Senator Blumenthal held the hearing. We are disputing the inclusion of technical details. We're asking, why does the average reader care about the technical details? It's publicly available, and it's probably interesting to you (or other people with similar interests), but take a step back and think about whether other people might find it interesting. You have to remember that Wikipedia is targeted toward the layman, so such a technical report wouldn't be appropriate for an overview article like this. epicgenius (talk) 12:41, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  September 2013 electric failure 

message: What is the point on the list of including stations that haven't existed in decades? For example, the Norwalk station I removed today has not existed since 1936. It was not replaced by another station in the same location. Today it's a tattoo parlor. If we're going to keep this sort of trivia, are we next to include this  as a prior tenant of Grand Central Terminal? My point is that "historic stations" should be a subsection (3.3?) but causes confusion in the main list. Markvs88 (talk) 01:01, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Personally, I think that if a former station is on the same site as, and immediately precedes, an existing station, it should be on the list. (For instance, Grand Central Station and Grand Central Depot, but maybe not Norwalk & South Norwalk). In addition, the table indicates former stations with no current successor in gray. This is consistent with pretty much every other article on US commuter rail lines on Wikipedia, e.g. Harlem Line, Main Line (Long Island Rail Road). The currently-operating stations are indicated in white or some other light color, and because of the gray color scheme, it's easy to distinguish closed stations from current stations.This should keep in mind that the article is also about the history and the physical line, and not just the current service pattern. As inconvenient as it might be to have former stations on the station list, it will be even more confusing to maintain two separate lists of stations. The current list shows where the former stations are located in relation to the current stations. Separating the lists will create no such distinction.And, now that I think about it, we already have subsections for the branches, so the historic stations would be sub-sub-sections of the main list. I think the current alternative is probably less confusing given the circumstances. since the closed stations are clearly indicated. epicgenius (talk) 13:14, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I could see keeping a prior name if the change was a recent one, but after a few years or a decade it really should be removed IMO. Most people think of anacrhonisms as being useless or just plain weird. Imagine someone talking about the Baltimore Colts or Hartford Whalers as if they were still playing. I just don't see the value-add of having the list include former stations, since the wide majority of the population wasn't even born when most of them existed. Such information could be in a sub-section, and most certainly belongs in their own pages and/or town pages of course. No one is listing John F. Kennedy International Airport as Idlewild Airport on flight destinations. Likewise, the list still lacks the Norwalk Wall Street station, so why have one and not the other... ? IMO this makes the list unweildly. Best, Markvs88 (talk) 15:51, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: This article is about the physical infrastructure of the New Haven Line, which includes historic stations and not just about the current route patterns. The former stations are already listed in their respective town articles, but they need to be listed here as well. Having it in the main list is better, for consistency and because it is easier to read one list than two. I do agree on removing former names, though.As for the Norwalk Wall Street station - it is listed in the Danbury Branch article. The three branches all have their own station lists; this is only for the main line. epicgenius (talk) 17:37, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I have added the three branches' station listings to the article.As a side note, lists of closed transport stations and lists of all other closed/defunct objects, buildings, properties, etc. aren't directly comparable. For the lists of stations on a given train, bus, subway, etc. route, the closed stations are part of a physical station succession. For instance, Wall Street was physically located between Norwalk/South Norwalk and what is now Merritt 7. It isn't possible to do the same for other entities such as sports teams, or even skyscrapers. They can have a time-based succession based on whether a sports team or building existed beforehand/afterward, but you can't say "The next building on XXX street is YYY". However, it may be useful to consider minimizing historic details in the station lists, and include only station name and years of operation. epicgenius (talk) 18:35, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stations 

message: The Meadowlands service was discontinued. It suggests: "Upon arrival at Grand Central Terminal, take the subway (purchase a MetroCard separately), or walk (about 20 minutes) to Penn Station, located at 7th Avenue and West 34th Street. The most direct subway route is  42nd Street Shuttle to Times Square, then the downtown  one stop to 34 St. Penn Station."--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 21:26, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, thanks. I was going off the recent addition by  (which is wrong, now that I've seen the text you're referring to). I can't find a reliable source for its end date, however. epicgenius (talk) 22:06, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Meadowlands 

message: The first sentence says, "... runs from New Haven, Connecticut, southwest to Mount Vernon, New York. There it joins the Harlem Line..."  I'm not sure that's correct.  As far as I can tell, the point where the two lines actually join is in The Bronx, although little bits and pieces of the junction might be in Yonkers.  The borders between Mt. Vernon, Yonkers, and The Bronx is crazy convoluted, but the junction is definitely not in Mt. Vernon. -- RoySmith (talk) 03:54, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mount Vernon? 

message: I'm a bit confused by your revert of my assessment of this article as B class. While not perfect (someday I'll enlist your help to get it to GA), it seems to me that it generally meets the B class standards at Wikipedia:Content assessment. Certainly, at 4,500 words and 90 citations, it's more than start class. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 16:44, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree.  I'm not an expert on the quality rating system, but this is clearly not "start class".  I've reverted the most recent change. -- RoySmith (talk) 16:51, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: It may be long, but it is of very poor quality. The history section is nearly completely non-existent, the section on operations is basically all uncited, the rolling stock section likely doesn't even belong in the article, and is biased towards recent rolling stock procurements, and the expansion section is too large, and includes many dead projects. I can see an argument for C class, but not B class, but then again, I rate my own works very harshly.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 18:26, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I won't quibble about B vs C.  And, yes, I agree that this suffers from the common flaw of adding lots of trivia only of interest to enthusiasts instead of building a coherent story which will of more interest and value to the general readership.  But it's clearly not start class ("developing but still quite incomplete. It may or may not cite adequate reliable sources"). -- RoySmith (talk) 19:17, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Page rating 

message: With reference to the above thread about the page rating, getting this to GA seems more important than arguing about where it is now.
If we wanted to make a push to get it there, where would we start?  Is there some standard outline for what a GA railroad article should look like?  Based on List of United States commuter rail systems by ridership, if the New Haven Line were broken out by itself, it would be the 6th largest commuter railroad in the country.  So it seems like it should have a better quality article. -- RoySmith (talk) 17:37, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Kew Gardens' work on Harlem Line is a good reference point - except for a couple unreferenced tables at the end and a lack of images, it's GA quality (and near FA quality) already. For this article, we definitely need longer history, and to focus in on the commuter rail history. Discussing long-distance services operating over the line is important, but the vast majority of traffic has been local for a long time, so the long-distance info can primarily be on the NYNH&H article. More focus on mainline service, less on branches (they have their own articles) and special services. General cleanup of the rolling stock and expansions sections. I can help with much of that over time, but I don't have the NYC-area historical knowledge that Kew Gardens and Epicgenius have. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 21:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Road to GA? 

message: The distance from New Haven Union Station to State Street station is only about half a mile, not 1.7 miles. The total length of the line would therefore be about 72.7 miles, as indicated in the station listing section. Not sure why, in the lead and the drop down map in the infobox, the line is said to be 74 miles long, and the distances to NH Union and State are listed as 72.3 and 74.0 respectively. Mirza Ahmed (talk) 21:55, 18 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  74 miles long? 

message: See page 16 of https://archive.org/details/OhioBrassCoCatalogueNo141914/page/n21/mode/2up RoySmith (talk) 00:12, 25 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Some old photos