Talk:Rasm

message: Maybe I'm mixed up, but the image appears to be irrelevant. The rasm are the 18 basic consonant forms, without the i'jam dots that distinguish the rest, correct? This kufic manuscript has i'jam, but they are thin black lines very close to the letters, not the large dots we're used to. — kwami (talk) 05:55, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Never mind, I found a different image. — kwami (talk) 06:19, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  dubious image 

message: Can anyone tell my why the encoding of Kaf chosen is U+06AA swash kaf instead of regular kaf, U+0643?
Thanks, Pimrietbroek (talk) 13:43, 13 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  encoding of Kaf 

message: Am I guessing correctly that there is no standard unicode for Rasm?  
- Are there any better options than the unicode characters listed? I'll add some footnotes on other uses of the characters, but I don't feel qualified to change any, and i don't really have any better ideas for nun or ya, but I wanted to highlight it as a point to discuss.
Kaf ك - why  swash kaf? would Farsi kaf be suitable? (see above "encoding of Kaf")
Nun ن - In the table they seem to have used the Urdu vowel nasalisation mark ں ںـ ـںـ ـں (nūn g͟hunnah, unicode 06BA "ARABIC LETTER NOON GHUNNA"), which as stated in the footnote displays with a dot in the middle and final position in most fonts. There is no unicode middle or start character for the Urdu ں because it usually only appears at the ends of words. (But the only other option I can find is "U+08BD ARABIC LETTER AFRICAN NOON", which is included in very few fonts, tends to not connect properly even if it is included, and on the rare occasion it does connect, it shows dots in the final and middle position.) There was a proposal to "Encode a new DOTLESS NOON for Koranic and historic usage" in 2012, but it seems no character was added, unless if was "African noon"? https://www.unicode.org/L2/L2012/12381-dotless-noon.pdf 
Ya ي - The character in the table is ى ىـ ـىـ ـى Alif Maksura. It does at least display correctly in every font, but searching a dictionary for words written with it will treat it as Alif instead of Ya.  
Dotless ڡ and ٯ - "U+066F ARABIC LETTER DOTLESS QAF" and "U+06A1 ARABIC LETTER DOTLESS FEH" definitely the best options because the alternatives "U+08BB ARABIC LETTER AFRICAN FEH" and "U+08BC
ARABIC LETTER AFRICAN QAF" don't join to other letters properly in any font i have tried.
Irtapil (talk) 17:06, 3 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  choice of unicode characters 

message: I tried to add as example to "Digital example: Compare the Basmala" with the ijam but no vowel diacritics, to show the way most modern secular documents are written. But I am not Muslim and I am new to learning Arabic, so i think i am out of my depth. There are too many unusual diacritics, like the ــٰـ dagger alif and ٱ hamzatu l-waṣli. I'm not sure if these should be left in or removed? And it's probably not a phrase that would be written in the modern style? If it's appropriate and possible can someone more knowledgeable than me please add it? Or give an opinion on whether any of these are correct:
:1. بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
:: Spell check likes that one. I based it on the version with full diacritics, removed everything, and replaced Allah with what i got automatically from ا ل ل ه (the usual way to type that ligature).
:2.  بسم ٱللَّٰه ٱلرحمٰن ٱلرحيم 
:: Based on the full diacritics version, but leaving the alifs alone.
:3.  بسم ا‌لل‍ه الرحمن الرحيم 
:: Seems to be the same as the first, but this time i based it on the rasm version and added ب ن ي in place of the dotless forms. I wasn't sure what to do with اللہ but weirdly the version of اللہ changed automatically to the standard version when i pasted it here.
Irtapil (talk) 10:29, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  can Basmala be written in modern secular style? 

message: I have added extension characters " ـ " between the two ل characters in the lines that are supposed to omit diacritics. So we get لـله with no diacritics instead of لله with the shada and dagger alif. (Just opening those sections for source editing was converting it to the ligature with diacritics.) I tried zero width joiners "‍"  a couple of ways ‍‍ but they didn't work in context, i still got the ligature with the diacritics or it didn't join. If someone has a better idea, please update it. Irtapil (talk) 06:06, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I fixed it, let me know what you think. — LissanX (talk) 09:45, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  thanks, did you use the zero width joiner character? weirdly it displays as the ligature in the edit window, but then if i save it, it's unchanged, i checked on a different computer and got the same. Irtapil (talk) 01:12, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  yeah I used a zero width joiner. I’m editing on a mobile device and it displays the same on the edit page as it does the article page. — LissanX (talk) 01:22, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I tried changing it to a visible version ‍ but it ended up all jumbled in the wrong order, so i just added a comment/note. It seems to be ok as long as i don't edit that word, goes back to non-ligature when i save. On the off chance anyone knows what's going on, both computers were running chrome on windows 10. Irtapil (talk) 16:08, 7 March 2020 (UTC)

text: @LissanX I solved it, it works if you add the extension character الـلـه on the keyboard on this device it's with the vowels. (But bizarrely ى  isn't connecting in any of the examples when viewed on this phone.) Irtapil (talk) 20:44, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  لل‍ه ligature 

message: For the examples, wouldn't Arial work? i've left it alone for now because of the warning message "" but as far as i can tell there's on need  for obscure fonts, Arial is available on almost every computer and has dotless ba  and joins it properly . Arial also has the other dotless characters and swash kaf  (but those aren't used in the examples). Tahoma does too,  but Tahoma probably looks too modern? Irtapil (talk) 05:19, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I personally think Arial looks better and more true to the kind of script used to actually write rasm. — LissanX (talk) 09:42, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  compared to tahoma, or compared to those defined in the current first "digital example"? Irtapil (talk) 09:44, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

text:  As in "font-family:Scheherazade, Lateef,'Iranian Sans'" should we changed to Arial since most readers will have that? Irtapil (talk) 09:48, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  For me the digital examples seems to be rendering in Arial, just larger. Personally, I’m in favor of going with Arial. — LissanX (talk) 09:51, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I added Arial font. I decided to leave most of the fonts there, i think sometimes fonts get installed with only a subset of characters? so they might have Arial but not the Arabic bit? Irtapil (talk) 16:11, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  it's unnecessary to use obscure fonts for examples? 

message: This character ى  we are using in a few examples is not connecting properly when displayed on the Wikipedia ap my phone. It's just an Arabic terminal Alef, so there is no good reason it shouldn't, it's not even connecting to the letter before. Is anyone else having issues? Is there anything we can do to improve it, it's fine in most fonts and my phone doesn't have any touble dissiplaying this character in other aps. It seems to be picking a Persian or Urdu font to display it maybe? Irtapil (talk) 20:41, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  ى not connecting