Talk:Paul Goma

message: Lately, User:Dahn does not bother to explain his moves. He reverts everything! So Goma got an editing war because Dahn wants to fight. Does he have any friend out there to tell him to stop? (Icar 11:44, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The editing war 

message: Does anyone has an idea how to find a picture of Paul Goma that has a free license or can be used under "fair use"? -- AdrianTM 07:56, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Picture

message: AdrianTM asks: "added more books, grouped the translations together (any idea for better arrangement?)" First of all, since these are all books by the same author (the author being the subject of the article), it seems to me that his name is no longer needed in that list.  As for books with various versions and translations, 
I struggled with this dilemma too, when starting the list.  One could  try sublists (using ** for double indents).  Alternatively, just list the several versions (without the , etc tags, leaving the title to explain what language the first edition was in). See for example the list of books for Virgil Gheorghiu that I've drawn -- not sure this is the best format, one could surely improve on it. I guess it's all trial and error at this stage... Turgidson 01:44, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Better this way? I still need to find some titles in other languages. -- AdrianTM 02:14, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks much better, yes. The hierarchical model rulz!  Turgidson 03:18, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Books

message: That doesn't sound like a right translations, should we use the Romanian name for the University or try a better translation? -- AdrianTM 16:58, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It actually is the standard translation. Dahn 17:08, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. Then it's a non-issue... -- AdrianTM 17:27, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Translation help: "Faculty of Letters"

message: This needs to be stated clearly: Goma does not go about requesting his citizenship legally. He is not "prevented" (as the DYK entry wrongly states), he is not ignored by the Romanian gvt until citizens sign a petition: citizens signing petitions are basically requesting that Goma be an exception to the law. Whether he is entitled to it or not is not material for a discussion here - let's however make the legal situation clear in the article, so we don't end up with a half truth. See for example here (scroll down). Dahn 19:38, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that Goma is not requesting his citizenship back "legally" because he says it was taken away "illegally" from him (some people are like this: "why should I ask for something that should be mine anyway") I don't know all the details though and not sure how to handle this in the article, if you have some direct quotes about the issue and relevant info please add them. -- AdrianTM 19:44, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, I think that the best way to phrase it is to include how Goma feels he is an exception to the law (since both his replies and the link above at least indicate that the law requires paperwork to be filled). Now, again, he may be right or he may be wrong; either way, nobody is preventing him from obtaining it. Dahn 19:53, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think the article claims that. It just noted "no further advances" in the matter. -- AdrianTM 19:54, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, the DYK nomination does. And I think we should include all circumstances for this in the article (i.e.: why Goma thinks the law does not apply in his case, and Goma addressing Băsescu + the fact that Băsescu replied and his reply remains undisclosed). That way, we don't leave room for interpretation. I'll do so in the future. Dahn 20:03, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, I'm not responsible for DYK nomination, but I do agree with you, we should list all circumstances (as I always militate ;-) -- AdrianTM 20:05, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Get a Mac!  Sorry, I could not resist the gibe.  But, in all honesty, I also lost some edits (very frustrating when that happens!), but not due to a crash -- basically, Macs never crash :) -- but because of edit conflicts, in fact, on this very same article, when trying to edit at the same time with AdrianTM.  There must be a jinx!!  Turgidson 05:12, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Or... use Opera (under Linux). Sorry, could not resist. I never lose text with Opera even if there's an edit conflict I can just go "back" and I have my typed text there. Sorry Turgidson for making you lose edits, I should have put that "inuse" tag, but my edits were not quite planned. -- AdrianTM 05:19, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Citizenship

message: This is a Romanian author, most of the references will be in Romanian unless they are from a book that's translated to other language. Is Romanian something that cannot be checked? I mean, I understand the idea to provide English references when they exist, but this case is about a Romanian author and his books and articles published in Romanian. -- AdrianTM 03:44, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, if people think a reference is dubious they can place a reference-check tag to ask people who know the language to check it, I think that's the normal procedure when there are no English references available. -- AdrianTM 03:51, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, and for all it's worth, the article has an external link to a site in English (the short bio from IMDB).   Moreover, as mentioned in the article, one of Goma's books ("My Childhood at the Gate of Unrest") is translated into English (see here, for example).  Having said that, I agree that it would be good to have more references in English. But, as AdrianTM says (if I understand correctly), it does not seem reasonable to make that into a sine qua non requirement.   Turgidson 04:05, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's pretty much what I wanted to say. It would be nice to find English references, but it's doubtful we'll find many. -- AdrianTM 05:11, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  A scan over entries returned by a Google search shows a number of English references for the controversies section.  It would be helfpul to add these to the citations.  70.114.132.23 11:39, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I've added two English references.  I hope more will be added.  — ERcheck (talk) 11:54, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: POV concern, Romanian references

message: Can anyone find some info about Ostinato being published first in Romania? -- AdrianTM 05:15, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Is not the same with "Camera de alǎturi, Bucharest, 1968.", right? -- AdrianTM 05:16, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Ostinato published in Romania first?

message: honorary citizen is mentioned 3 times in the current version and twice in the last by Khoikhoi, who protests aginst alleged lack of sources. Maybe one should first read an article one is told to revert... Icar 14:07, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nonsensical revert by [[User:Khoikhoi]] 

message: I do not want to get caught up in the dispute concering reverts to this page.  But, for the record, I checked a couple of months ago (when I worked for a while on this article) that the information about Goma having been made a honorarary citizen of Timişoara is correct.  There are many sources for this.  Instead of listing them, let me provide a transcript of the actual decision by the mayor of Timişoara, Gheorghe Ciuhandu, as found here:
:ROMÂNIA JUDEŢUL TIMIŞ PRIMĂRIA MUNICIPIULUI TIMIŞOARA CABINET PRIMAR 
:Bd. C.D. Loga nr. 1, Timişoara, tel: 0040256 – 409363, fax0040256 – 409635 , 
:e-mail: gheorghe. ciuhandu@primariatm.ro internet: www.primariatm.ro
:Către Domnul Paul Goma
:Stimate domnule Paul Goma,
:În conformitate cu prevederile art. 50 din Legea nr. 215/2001 privind administraţia publică locală, modificată şi completată de Legea nr. 286/2006;
:Vă comunicăm:
:HOTĂRÂREA NR. 1/30.01.2007 – privind conferirea Titlului de Cetăţean de Onoare al Municipiului Timişoara domnului Paul Goma.
:Hotărârea a fost adoptată în şedinţa Consiliului Local al Municipiului Timişoara din data de 30 ianuarie 2007.
:Hotărârea menţionată poate fi accesată şi pe site-ul HYPERLINK "http://www.primariatm.ro" www.primariatm.ro.
:Cutuma Consiliului Local Timişoara este ca, după acordarea lor, titlurile de Cetăţean de Onoare să fie înmânate direct, în şedinţele Consiliului Local. Dată fiind situaţia excepţională în care vă aflaţi, ar exista două variante pentru a vă înmâna acest titlu: ori să aﬂteptăm până la o dată la care veţi putea să veniţi în România şi să vi-l înmânăm într-o şedinţă a Consiliului Local, aﬂa cum facem de obicei în astfel de cazuri, ori să vă trimitem Diploma de Cetăţean de Onoare printr-un serviciu de curierat. Aşteptăm propunerea dumneavoastră vizavi de modul în care doriţi să intraţi în posesia acestui titlu.
:Cu respect,
:Gheorghe Ciuhandu,
:Primarul Municipiului Timişoara
I didn't check the link www.primariatm.ro but I guess, if one wants to make 100% sure, one could look for this email from Ciuhandu to Goma there.  Turgidson 14:26, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I guess that sources it. Note, however, that this should go hand in hand with a mention of the Jewish Community's protest (which is, incidentally, the main topic of the link you provide). This article is still filled with half truths: I have provided sources in the hope that someone else would help me clarify certain issues, but it seems that no such story gets to have two sides until I intervene (and, when I do, there's the usual scandal and vicious personal attacks). Dahn 14:35, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I agree, both sides of the story should be given.  In fact, the article has the sentence "In February 2007, the Federation of Jewish Communities of Romania and the Israeli Embassy protested against the distinction, arguing that Paul Goma is the author of multiple antisemitic articles" which pretty much balances things out (as it stands now), though of course, one could conceivably expand on it (especially if more info is added about the honorary citizenship).  In the meantime, I checked that Gheorghe Ciuhandu is indeed a known public figure, with a wikipage (sorry, never heard of the guy before), so I think I'll go ahead and mention this in both the article on Goma and on him (after double checking things on the  www.primariatm.ro to make 100% sure, I don't want to make a mistake), since it looks newsy enough to me.  Before I spend too much time on this, does anyone see any reason not to mention this story in more detail in respective articles (again, one can add countervailing points after that, if one wants, I have nothing against it---in fact, I think it's the right thing to do in such a situation)?  Turgidson 14:58, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I for one do not object. In fact, I would like you to intervene in expanding or rephrasing other issues in the Controversy section, if you should want to. I have confidence that you can provide a neutral overlook. I can and will provide more detail myself in the future (i.e.: if I am allowed to). Dahn 15:13, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  OK, I'll see what I can do.  But there is that much one can do at once -- and there are competing interests both here at wikipedia (and in real life) that I find more gripping.  I need some time to look at this, and to familiarize myself better with the subject before contributing further, but if anyone appreciates it, I'll do it. And I'll be happy to collaborate, and seek whatever thougthful compromise can be found on this touchy subject -- within the time constraints that I mentioned. Turgidson 15:21, 6 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Timişoara 

message: I checked again the reference "Tismăneanu, in (Romanian) Armand Gosu, "N-am avut de-a face cu Securitatea", in 22, nr.849, June 2006" and to me it seems that Tismăneanu said very clearly what the reasons were for dismissing Goma, he even enumerate them. 
What User:Dahn keeps reverting is a pretty close version to what Tismăneanu himself said. Dahn uses in this case an interpretation of what Tismăneanu said instead of using what actually Tismăneanu said, I'm a little bit disappointed since Dahn in other cases made special point of promoting the exact information, not the interpretation of it, while in this case he acts exactly in the opposite manner. As I said before, I don't care much, I think both variants are kind of OKish, but to end this revert war I suggest Dahn read again the reference and accept the version with what Tismăneanu said, not what he implied. Thanks. -- AdrianTM 16:57, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm trying to make it sound more like what Tismăneanu said, if this doesn't work maybe we should just translate and quote him, can we do that, at least in that case there's no place for our POVs. I still like better my former variant with "who explained the exclusion based on Goma's questioning of Tismaneanu's moral and scientific credibility" than "who explained the exclusion based on Goma's questioning the moral and scientific credibility of the president of the Commission", but the later one is probably closer to what has been said. -- AdrianTM 17:20, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Since I see the revert war continues...

message: Dear Sirs, Paul Goma is a Romanian citizen, as shown here. The blog is of a Romanian MP, former Minister of Economy and Finance in Tariceanu government.
The english translation of the article (google):
„A laudable action has been started recently to request the return of Romanian citizenship writer Paul Goma, one of the most courageous dissidents of communism. This initiative was supported by a petition addressed to Parliament and signed by hundreds of personalities of Romanian culture and a political statement in the Chamber of Deputies.
I made ​​the necessary arrangements with the Ministry of Justice - National Authority for Citizenship and the Ministry of Interior - General Directorate of Passports. By letter no. 689084/21.10.2011, MIA - DGP communicate, following our request, as Mr. Paul Goma included in the records of the authoritative status of Roman citizen, according to art. 34 of Law 21/1991 Romanian citizenship, in other words, his Romanian citizenship was never withdrawn.
This does not mean, however, that steps on granting respect and support owed ​​to a great Romanian patriot, as Goma should not continue”.--Mahetin (talk) 20:57, 22 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Romanian citizen

message: For better quality freely licensed images of Mr. Goma, consider taking snapshots of this interview --damiens.rf 08:56, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Freely lincensed images 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Paul Goma. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071012140044/http://www.ziua.net/display.php?id=169748&data=2005-02-17&ziua=2bd5b7026bde1020c81c2fd5eb84e9c0 to http://www.ziua.net/display.php?id=169748&data=2005-02-17&ziua=2bd5b7026bde1020c81c2fd5eb84e9c0
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071008065724/http://www.revista22.ro/html/index.php?art=2802&nr=2006-06-16 to http://www.revista22.ro/html/index.php?art=2802&nr=2006-06-16
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 15:05, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018)