Talk:AS Val and VSS Vintorez

message: I think this page needs a citation as to where one can get information on this new AS Val variant that can hold 30 rounds of 9x39mm ammunition. It certainly sounds interesting, but I would definitely like verification on this. 
Even so, I'm surprised the Russian military has BOTH the AS Val and the OTs-14 Groza in circulation. According to the Groza's page here on wikipedia, it can do a great deal the AS Val can't, including mounting a grenade launcher, using a bayonet, being transported in a special carry case, and indeed duplicate some of the Val's other features, like using a scope and a suppressor. If indeed the Groza rifle uses 75% of the parts for the AKS-74u carbine, then it could be made more cheaply as well by re-using those same manufacturing plants and machines instead of making and using a dedicated plant just for the Val rifle. 
I know that when lives are on the line, ineffective or obsolete weaponry is often quickly discarded (though I still don't understand why the 9x18mm round is still in service despite being clearly inferior to the 9x19mm parabellum round), and given how strapped-for-cash the Russian military is, they could save some money by discontinuing the Val production and maintenance and devoting the freed-up manufacturing capacity and budget to Groza production. 
If indeed the "newer variant" of the Val is real, then its higher magazine capacity than the Groza might be reason to keep it around over the Groza, but we still need a citation for it.  I'd like someone with the right knowledge to clear this up for me. 
74.12.129.101 (talk) 19:23, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: New variant

message: Please stop deleting Georgia from the users section. This weapons is frequently used by the Georgian police in raid operations and it is also in the inventory of the military special forces. TheMightyGeneral (talk) 13:52, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Deleting users 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Most carbines have barrel length of less than 16 inches and AS VAL is way below that so shouldn't it be a carbine? All Nite (talk) 06:37, 26 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Because that is how the Russian manufacturer categorises the 'AS special assault rifle'. The manufacturer's official classification of the AS 'Val' is a special assault rifle. For any firearm to be categorised as an 'assault rifle', it must be chamber in an intermediate calibre. Assault rifles must also be capable of select-fire (fully automatic/burst-fire and semi-automatic). I provided a source of a video made by 'Forgotten Weapons' talking about the history and design of the AS Val, VSS Vintorez and other 9x39mm chambered weapons. Guns & Glory (talk) 04:46, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why is the AS VAL classified as an assault rifle even though it only has a barrel length of 200mm? 

message: The listed literal translation for the weapon's Russian name is "special assault rifle". In reality, avtomat is Russian for "machine" or "automatic". While the word has been connoted with assault rifles thanks to the AK, it doesn't necessarily refer to an assault rifle. It really refers to automatic weapons in general. A better literal translation would be "special automatic" or "special submachine gun" (especially seeing as it is more SMG than AR, I think. R. A. Simmons Talk 17:24, 9 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Literal" translation 

message: I'm personally in favor of a change to distinguish the "official" acronym name from the "informal" name. Although it is not so critical or damaging for some people to continue thinking they are the "full" names, it would be beneficial to clarify that they are two distinct names and would not subtract from the clarity of the title. People who search for 'VSS Vintorez' will not be confused by 'VSS "Vintorez"' and think it is the incorrect page.  KnowledgeableHrvatica (talk) 01:14, 26 July 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  AS Val  ->  AS "Val" or AS/Val