Talk:Kingdom Hearts II/Archive 1

message: So, who wants to take on the job to merge the Xaldin article into this one? --nihon 08:11, 22 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Since no one else did it, I took care of the merge. --nihon 03:10, 24 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Xaldin merge

message: I didnt know wether to ask this question on the first Kingdom Hearts page, or this one, so I'll ask here, and if I shouldnt have asked here, I apologize. Wasnt there supposed to be a Kingdom Hearts TV Series, or a Kingdom Hearts movie? Whats going on?
* I don't ever remember hearing about an animated series, but there's a section about a movie on the Kingdom Hearts page. There is a manga, too. Geg 16:27, 6 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Kingdom Hearts TV Show/Movie

message: I know that Utada is singing the theme song again for Kingdom Hearts 2, and I know its named "Passion". But I was wondering, will there be a slow version of the song aswell as a remix, like they did for Kingdom Hearts "Simple and Clean"?
* It's certainly possible, but we don't know anything yet. --Soulsteelgray 18:49, 8 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Kingdom Hearts 2 Theme Song

message: Should it stay the way it is or not? Personally, I don't see any point in chaning it now. Even if it later turns out that, for example, Depp won't be providing the voice of Jack Sparrow, the warning is right up there in bold letters that the list is subject to change. It's nice to have a placeholder for future edits, anyway. Geg 22:41, 12 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: The English Cast

message: I was planning on changing that until I saw that it was KL who made it. Could you provide a link to where December 1, 2005 is the confirmed North American release date? Geg 21:13, 15 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Release date?

message: Does anyone think Sora will meet the BHK?
*Wikipedia is not a bulletin board or chatroom.  Questions like these belong in GameFAQs message boards.  Thanks. — WARPEDmirror 19:11, 1 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  BHK meets Sora? 

message: There's been alot of back and forth but wasn't the Steamboat Willie world a possibility and not a confirmed piece of information? Proof backing this up would be very much appreciated.
* Here's your proof. Soulsteelgray 00:02, 23 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  I don't think this was confirmed 

message: I was wondering...Port Royal is going to be a world in this game, but will it be animated or live action, as it was in The Curse of the Black Pearl? Scorpionman 19:16, 27 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Port Royal 

message: I would like to know why Namine has her own page with information about her, but Sora is limited to one paragraph per game.  As the main character of all three KH games, shouldn't he have his own Wikipedia page?
*I guess because no one's gotten around to making one. Geg 00:55, 12 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Sora's Page

message: GIVE A DECENT SUMMARY OF THE GAME. Don't add every goddamned detail of the trailers. NOBODY CARES. Readers new to the Kingdom Hearts series want a broad overview of what to expect from this game, not completely wanton speculation and information hidden in a overblown character list. We want people to read the article and be entertained by the prose, not be utterly disgusted by the shoody editing and format. Getting rid of the Character section would a good start. Send them to their own pages and make a link to there here.
Seriously, leave the little details to the fan websites; it's not our job. --Apostrophe 02:39, 14 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I completely agree. If you look at the article history, you can see it's updated 10-20 times a day with minute, fancruft-like, and unproven speculation. I know people are looking forward to this game, but Wikipedia is not a crystal ball and the article is a mess. ~ Hibana 01:50, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Looking at it now, I almost think someone needs to blank it and start over, then keep it on their watch list to quickly revert speculation/fancruft. This is what I've done with the majority of the Tekken characters as well as the Tekken film article (and all the actors who are supposedly playing them, even though no cast listing has been announced). It's annoying, but it's less annoying than searching Google and finding people citing Wikipedia as the "source" of information that was in all actuality fancruft from the beginning... </rant> --Locke Cole (talk) (e-mail) 10:44, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The next time the  tag is removed without justification I'll probably follow through on my blanking idea. This article is filled to the brim with fancruft and fan theory which is not appropriate for Wikipedia. --Locke Cole (talk) (e-mail) 12:57, 20 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that may be a little drastic. Yes, the article is very confusing, but that's just because there are a select number of fans making it that way. If the article were to be blanked and started over, it would look almost the same as it is now, since, as far as I can see, most of the offending content has been reverted/deleted away. Geg 18:42, 20 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: No, it wouldn't look the same because I would personally revert anything that was unsourced fancruft/speculation before it got a chance to get in and weave itself into the article. This is precisely what I've done on Tekken (2006 film), and whenever someone tries to add something unsourced I try to verify it myself, and if I can't, revert it goes (usually with a note asking for a source going to the editor). It sounds bad/evil, but it's better than what I ended up seeing: people were quoting the old Tekken (2006 film) as gospel saying it's cast list or storyline was accurate, etc. People were citing Wikipedia as a source elsewhere. This is why we can't afford to have articles like this with large masses of unsourced material; it flushes Wikipedia's credibility down the toilet. --Locke Cole (talk) (e-mail) 20:44, 20 November 2005 (UTC)

text: If it's wikilegal (heh), after the blanking you may want to use Page Protection on the article until the game comes. A boatload of crufy anons will hate it, but it will atleast keep the article clean and keep Wikipedia as a reputable source of information on the game. ~ Hibana 22:58, 20 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Does Page Protection even work? It hasn't for me in the past. Geg 23:04, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: URRAGGH

message: Why, of all of a sudden, is the Kingdom Hearts 2 page getting so confusing. The other articles are cleaner than this! somebody stop making false sections and please use correct sections. We all love Kingdom Hearts, but for the Lord's sake STOP MAKING FALSE SECTIONS! thanks...--Cyberdude 05:07, 20 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Page is too confusing 

message: This is directed specifically to Locke Cole. You asked for references confirming the voice cast, so I provided two different sites that had voice cast information list (even though I wasn't the person who originally put "(confirmed)" by each of those names). As the article is already marked as being about a game currently in production (or at least not released yet, since it's likely being reproduced and/or distributed in Japan as I type), the voice cast section is certainly relevant. If the two links I provided are not good enough for you as far as showing the voice actors for the game, then please tell us what is. It would be far more effective for you to stop reverting the edits by everyone else and post your suggestion here: that you don't want the voice cast section. Then it could be discussed and a consensus could be reached regarding the matter rather than you just pissing off a bunch of people who are working to make the article better. --nihon 07:08, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I've already made mention of the requirements above (see the section titled "URRAGGH" and my replies). People must provide credible sources for information they add to this article. The sources you provided weren't credible: the first was a cast listing for the first Kingdom Hearts. The second link was an IMDb link, and IMDb is like Wikipedia; anyone can submit information and get it accepted. Simply marking an article as being about a future game/movie/product is irrelevant and does not override the WP:V and WP:NOR policies. Information must be verifiable and it must not be original research. Speculation is not verifiable and is original research. This article so far is filled to the brim with unreferenced and unverifiable speculation; I'm trying to stop more speculation from creeping in. Let whoever insisted on marking those cast members as "confirmed" provide their source and WP:CITE it. Otherwise, please keep the fancruft out. —Locke Cole (talk) (e-mail) 08:11, 28 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: References for confirmed voice cast

message: http://kh2.co.uk/image.php?view=kh2/scans/140.jpg --Apostrophe 19:53, 1 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Paine 

message: Article is protected due to edit warring. ≈ jossi fresco ≈ t • @ 04:38, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protected 

message: Sora can transform into supreme mode. He has white clothing and welds the Oblivion and the Oathkeeper. [Sora's Drive Forms]
Silentreaction 15:13, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Supreme Form

message: There isn't much info about the keyblade but there is a picture of it. [Ansem Report]
This Picture wont last though because with every new post, an article disappears from the page so go on the site as soon as you can!
Silentreaction 15:14, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: New Keyblade

message: Well, it seems the article was unprotected, so I've moved the temp rewrite into the main article. I notice a few people made edits right after it was unprotected; if there was anything important, please copy it back into the new article. :P —Locke Cole 16:20, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Unprotected

message: * Pence
* Olette 
* Hayner
**Hayner, Olette and Pence are Famitsu's English spelling of their names--which you can view by clicking on the links. Mirlen 03:07, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Original Characters

message: All members had been found & confirmed by those playing the game over at KHI forums and AC.Net forums as well.
-In order-
*Xemnas
:Weapon: Sabers
:Power: Darkness
*Xigbar
:Weapon: Ray Guns
:Power: Time
*Xaldin
:Weapon: Lances
:Power: Wind
*Vexen
:Weapon: Shield
:Power: Ice
*Lexaeus
:Weapon: Tomahawk
:Power: Earth
*Zexion
:Weapon: none
:Power: Shadow
*Saix
:Weapon: Sword
:Power: Moon
*Axel
:Weapon: Chakrams
:Power: Fire
*Demyx
:Weapon: Sitar
:Power: Water
*Luxord
:Weapon: Cards
:Power: Illusion
*Marluxia
:Weapon: Scythe
:Power: Nature
*Larxene
:Weapon: Daggers
:Power: Lightning
*Roxas
:Weapon: Keyblade
:Power: Light
====Xehanort and Xemnas====
*The only thing known about the Enigmatic Man is that he wields Energy Sabers. It is also speculated that there is #0 ranking.  This speculation is based on the New Ansem Reports here. Mirlen 08:35, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Organization XIII

message: *The only thing known about the Enigmatic Man is that he wields Energy Sabers. It is also speculated that there is #0 ranking.  This speculation is based on the New Ansem Reports here. Mirlen 08:35, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Xehanort and Xemnas

message: Absolutely great. Preferably we'd have an article to link against, but pictures will work (they just open the discussion up to subjectivity/speculation). If you look at my edit here, you'll get an idea of the kind of sourcing I've been talking about. Another good example would be Blu-ray Disc (note the links to make it easy to verify most of the article). Preferably each paragraph (but at least each section) would have at least one source to verify what's said in it (be it that a specific character or locale is in the game, or that a certain gameplay element behaves a certain way, or so on). If we can get this article up to a verifiable level, then get it unprotected, we can apply WP:V more easily on future anon edits (if they don't provide a source, and if you've never heard of what they're claiming, revert it with a demand for proof; if you have heard of it, provide a source yourself). Feel free to add back any content you believe these sources confirm to Kingdom Hearts II/Temp. If I get a chance I'll try to help as well. =) —Locke Cole 04:32, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Discussion

message: ===DISC-1=== 
* 01 Dearly Beloved
* 02 Passion (Orchestral Ver.)       
* 03 Passion ～opening version～       
* 04 Lazy Afternoons       
* 05 Sinister Sundown       
* 06 The Escapade
* 07 Dive into the Heart -Destati-       
* 08 Fragments of Sorrow       
* 09 Tension Rising       
* 10 Kairi       
* 11 Missing You
* 12 The 13th Struggle       
* 13 Roxas       
* 14 Sora       
* 15 The Afternoon Street       
* 16 Working Together       
* 17 Friends in my Heart       
* 18 Magical Mystery       
* 19 A Twinkle in the Sky       
* 20 Hollow Bastion       
* 21 Scherzo Di Notte       
* 22 Laughter and Merriment       
* 23 Desire for All That Lost       
* 24 Organization XIII
* 25 Gearing Up       
* 26 Shipmeisters' Rhapsody       
* 27 Blast Off!       
* 28 Asteroids Away!       
* 29 Crossing the Finish Line       
* 30 Forbidden Waltz
* 31 Dance of the Daring       
* 32 Hesitation
* 33 Dance to the Death       
* 34 Beauty and the Beast       
* 35 The Home of Dragons       
* 36 Fields of Honor       
* 37 Apprehension       
* 38 Vim and Vigor       
* 39 Cloudchasers       
* 40 Olympus Coliseum       
* 41 The Underworld       
* 42 What Lies Beneath       
* 43 Villains of a Sort       
* 44 The Encounter       
* 45 Mickey Mouse Club March       
* 46 A Walk in Andante       
* 47 Monochrome Dreams       
* 48 Old Friends, Old Rivals       
* 49 Floating in Bliss       
* 50 Winnie the Pooh       
* 51 Bounce-O-Rama (Speed up ver.)
===DISC-2=== 
* 01 Isn't It Lovely?
* 02 Let's Sing and Dance!       
* 03 Swim This Way       
* 04 Part of Your World       
* 05 Under The Sea       
* 06 Ursula's Revenge       
* 07 A New Day is Dawning       
* 08 Nights of the Cursed       
* 09 He's a Pirate       
* 10 The Corrupted       
* 11 Hazardous Highway       
* 12 A Day in Agrabah
* 13 Arabian Dream       
* 14 This is Halloween       
* 15 Spooks of Halloween Town       
* 16 Adventures in the Savannah       
* 17 Savannah Pride       
* 18 Confrontation       
* 19 Space Paranoids       
* 20 Byte Bashing       
* 21 Sinister Shadows       
* 22 The 13th Dilemma       
* 23 Showdown at Hollow Bastion       
* 24 One-Winged Angel       
* 25 Battleship Bravery       
* 26 Sacred Moon       
* 27 Deep Drive       
* 28 Riku       
* 29 Courage       
* 30 Disappeared       
* 31 A Fight to the Death       
* 32 Darkness of the Unknown       
* 33 Passion ～after the battle～       
* 34 Fantasia alla marcia for piano, chorus and orchestra
* 35 Destiny Islands       
* 36 Hand in Hand       
* 37 Dark Horizons       
* 38 Dearly Beloved -Reprise
===Discussion=== 
*So that's it, then. BHK's name is officially Roxas. Here's the URL since this person didn't post it: http://www.toshiba-emi.co.jp/vmc/artist/others/toct25871-2.htm Also, I like how they misspelled "Deep Dive". Geg 23:45, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Original Music Soundtrack

message: *So that's it, then. BHK's name is officially Roxas. Here's the URL since this person didn't post it: http://www.toshiba-emi.co.jp/vmc/artist/others/toct25871-2.htm Also, I like how they misspelled "Deep Dive". Geg 23:45, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Discussion

message: I thought it would be good to point that Kingdom Hearts II got a 39/40 (after all the gossips and reverts the previous version of the article had about a perfect score). -- ReyBrujo 03:44, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Famitsu score 

message: I actually watched through the credits and jotted the names down...man, did that take a long time.  Anyway, the cast list was too long in the article so I cut down the list...
Here's the full VA list:
Japanese language version
*Miyu Irino ... as Sora
*Mamoru Miyano ... as Riku
*Risa Uchida ... as Kairi
*Koki Uchiyama ... as Roxas
*Iku Nakahara ... as Naminé
*Akio Otsuka ... as Ansem & Xehanort
*Kazunori Sasaki ... as Hayner
*Hayato Taya ... as Pence
*Yuka Hirasawa ... as Olette
*Toshiko Sawada ... as Maleficent
*Minoru Uchida ... as Merlin
*Mayumi Suzuki ... as Mulan, Ariel
*Kōichi Yamadera ... as Mushu, Donald Duck, Beast, Sebastian, Genie
*Shintaro Sonooka ... as Captain Shang, Lock
*Yutaka Oda ... as Yao
*Ryusei Nakao ... as Ling
*Kozo Shioya ... as Chien-Po
*Osamu Kobayashi ... as the Emperor
*Hiroshi Fujioka ... as Shan-Yu
*Eri Ito ... as Belle
*Kazuo Kamakura ... as Cogsworth
*Masashi Ebara ... as Lumiere
*Kimiko Fukuda ... as Mrs. Potts
*Takako Kondo ... as the Wardrobe
*Yasunori Matsumoto ... as Hercules
*Ichirō Nagai ... as Philoctetes
*Rika Matsumoto ... as Megara
*Kyusaku Shimada ... as Hades
*Yakashi Aoyagi ... as Mickey Mouse
*Yutaka Shimaka ... as Goofy
*Kaneta Kimotsuki... as Jiminy Cricket
*Yuko Mitsutani ... as Minnie Mouse
*Mika Doi ... as Daisy Duck
*Roko Takizawa ... as Chip
*Minoro Inaba ... as Dale
*Kujira ... as Ursula
*Kazuhiko Inoue ... as Eric
*Taro Ishida ... as King Triton, Eeyore
*Takuya Kaihoko ... as Flounder
*Hiroaki Hirata ... as Jack Sparrow
*Daisuke Hirakawa ... as Will Turner
*Saori Yumiba ... as Elizabeth Swann
*Haruhiko Jo... as Barbossa, Scar
*Masachika Ichimura ... as Jack Skellington
*Yuko Doi... as Sally, Shock
*Yuji Mitsuya ... as Dr. Finklestein, Timon
*Toru Ohira ... as the Mayor
*Hiroshi Hatanaka ... as Oogie Boogie, Pumbaa
*Tomoaki Nagae ... as Santa Claus
*Mitsuru Miyamoto ... as Simba
*Riko Hanamura ... as Nala
*Ryuji Saikachi ... as Rafiki
*Tomie Kataoka .... as Shenzi, Kanga
*Ben Hiura ... as Banzai
*Hiroshi Tsuchida ... as Tron
*Tetsuo Kanao ... as Sark
*Ikuya Sawaki ... as MCP
*Sukekiyo Kameyama ... as Pooh
*Mitsuru Ogata ... as Piglet
*Naoki Tatsuta ... as Rabbit
*Toshiya Ueda ... as Owl
*Tessho Genda ... as Tigger
*Masaya Sugimoto ... as Roo
*Mahito Tsujimura ... as Gopher
*Shinichiro Miki ... as Aladdin
*Kaori Aso ... as Jasmine
*Akira Takarada ... as Jafar
*Akira Kamiya ... as Iago
*Yu Hayashi ... as Peter Pan
*Keiko Yamato ... as Chicken Little
*Ryutaro Okiayu ... as Setzer
*Takashiro Sakurai ... as Cloud
*Maaya Sakamato ... as Aerith
*Ayumi Ito ... as Tifa
*Yumi Kakazu ... as Yuffie
*Kazuhiro Yamaji ... as Cid
*Toshiyuki Morikawa ... as Sephiroth
*Hideo Ishikawa ... as Leon, Auron
*Mayuko Aoki ... as Selphie, Yuna
*Takehito Koyasu ... as Seifer
*Rio Natsuki ... as Fuu
*Kazuya Nakai ... as Rai
*Ikue Otani ... as Vivi
*Marika Matsumoto ... as Rikku
*Megumi Toyoguchi ... as Paine
*Keiji Fujiwara ... as Axel
*Ginpei Sato ... as Saix
*Yōsuke Akimoto ... as Xaldin
*Kenichi Suzumura ... as Demyx
*Joji Nakata ... as Luxord
*Hochu Otsuka ... as Xigbar
*Norio Wakamato ... as Xemnas
*Genzo Wakayama ... as DiZ (Ansem)
Mirlen 04:23, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Ugh..  this reeks of original research, but I'm reluctant to remove it if it's true. I just wish there was a verifiable source for this listing (besides having the game in-hand). If you can find reliable sources to support any of these, it'd be most appreciated! —Locke Cole 07:47, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, whoops.  Sorry, I'm still sort of new to Wikipedia editing so it gets some time for me to adjust...*looks at cast list* Looks like somebody added a LOT more (I do not think we need 'additional voices' listed on there)...I too, am reluctant to remove it (partially 'cuz I spent some time putting it together).  Hmm...would reliable sources include KHU or some good, reliable KH fan site?  Or does it have to official? Mirlen 07:51, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: We'll leave it alone for now, the game just came out (unlike the US release which is still a few months away), so this kind of info should be verifiable pretty quickly. I'm not sure if KHU passes as reliable or not (Apostrophe seems to have a better handle on verifiable sources for KH-related info). Check out some of the links used as sources in the article already though, and if the info comes from a site like that (preferably not by a forum poster but as actual news or info on the site itself) then that'll do for me. And it's OK, not trying to scare ya off. =) But part of Wikipedias credibility (or lack thereof to some) comes from our ability to provide credible/reliable sources. —Locke Cole 07:55, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Hopefully, somebody won't be lazy and wil type up that list from the booklet *grins.*  Okay, I'll check out the sources.  And no, you're not scaring me off.  Wikipedia's rule of having reliable sources is perfectly rational and logical one, I feel stupid not thinking of that, actually.  Although it's pretty obvious that if the cast list was copied directly from the credits in game, it'll be the truth--but in such cases, common sense must be abadoned for solid, rock-hard evidence. Mirlen 08:27, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Japanese Voice Cast

message: Are we sure that's a world all to itself? For all we know, it could just be another part of Twilight Town. It probably is since you ride a train there instead of using the Gummi Ship. The same goes for Castle Oblivion. Does that really count as a real world? Geg 16:07, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yah, I left it there for a while so that the user would stop reverting my edits. I've removed it now --Apostrophe 00:29, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: About "The Mysterious Tower"

message: Since Scrooge McDuck is my favorite character of all time, I must know the truth. Is he really in KHII, and if so, does anyone have proof of it? Thanks. Rampart 04:30, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: He is in it. He appears in Hollow Bastion, in a quick cutscene. I don't think he spoke though. I could go back to the town and get a screenshot if I find him. Want me to do that? --Zeno McDohl 01:29, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Scrooge McDuck?