Talk:Mohawk people

message: the language of the mohawks is alive and always has been alive. today, the young people have taken it upon themselves to learn and teach the language where our elders have failed to do so. It is taught now at home and in the schools, beginning with a childs preschool years. no, it is not dead or extinct nor was it ever. more whitemans propaganda. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.212.224.193 (talk) 23:40, 19 February 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It is certain that use of little known kaien'kéha (eng. Mohawk) was discouraged on work sites, where English and French managed dangerous situations and environments. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.84.2.75 (talk) 16:59, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The Rosetta Stone project estimates that among 80,000 Mohawk descendents today, 4,000 are fluent in Kanien'kéha. An increasing school exposure is going to see this number increase. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.84.2.75 (talk) 17:50, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Iron workers and language

message: Can someone clarify the following sentence: One large group of Mohawks, who were expelled by the United States as traitors were given land by the British Governor Craig and imposed to French speaking Quebecois who were refused new land because of not being English.? I would do it, but I don't understand what it's trying to say. What does "imposed to" mean? — Pburka 1 July 2005 02:31 (UTC)
:I have removed the latter half of this sentence as it makes no sense. Morgan Leigh 03:47, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: This sentence, even in revised form, seems to indicate that the Mohawks of Kanesatake, Kahnawake, etc. only arrived after the British conquest.  But the article on [Kateri] (beatified 17th C catholic Mohawk) says that she lived in Kahnawake in the 1680's.  I always thought Kahnawake was the result of Jesuit proselytising in the Mohawk valley.  So the Craig reference seems very wrong - I am removing it for the moment - besides being couched in racist terms ("British Governor Craig," "imposed to Francophone Quebecois" etc.), clearly a holdover from racial tensions in 1990 over the Jacques Cartier Bridge blockade.  Jackmitchell — Preceding undated comment added 02:18, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Who is Craig? Governor Frederick Haldimand intercepted the only "large group" migration of Mohawk and other Haudenosaunee citizens into Canada, giving them almost 1 million acres in Ontario (today reduced to 45,000 acres). The relationship between 'visiting' Caucasians and 'indigenous' Americans is complex and includes many diverse, competitive colonial groups stealing over 5 million square kilometeres of land. Please refer to http://www.tolatsga.org/iro.html where you will find detailed the centuries of forced displacement of Mohawk north from present New York State into present Canada well explained. The Mohawk Nation was settled for at least 1,000 years in up state New York - formal relations existed with many bordering Nations. People often confuse Mohawk physical presence with the presence of any of six American Nations making up the Haudenosaunee democracy. The Haudenosaunee territories included many less politically sophisticated Nations in the present states of Minesota south to Missouri, east to Virgina, north to New York. Caucasian occupiers engaging military in their attempts to secure American land, often 'confused' the hostility of subject nations and retaliated against the Haudenosaunee. In the 1700's Haudenosaunee Chief Joseph Brant, had earned a reputation for enforcing treaty agreements at a time when colonials were busier breaking than forming agreements. Brant escaping caucasian attacks in retailiation for the aggression of the Mingo Nation, hundreds of Kilometers west and south in the Ohio Valley, accepted a parcel of land called Six Nations in present Ontario. Chief Brant helped fortify Canada against early Caucasian invasions from the south. For two centuries following the creation of Six Nations, a northern outpost for the Haudenosaunee territories, Chief Brant's community became increasingly important. In mid-late 1800's Caucasian influx into New York State became (according to the Caucasian administration there) "unmanageable". Essentially, hoards of migrating Cancasians poured into New York state, bypassing arranged settlement offices and pushing the largely peaceful Mohawk off of their settled lands into Canada. Canada had established Six Nations to manage earlier migration, but the new influx was far too massive for one reservation, so many smaller reservations were setup along the St. Lawrence. Great Lakes reservations were also used. All of these reservations were placed on the Canada US border. In most reservations a previous small Mohawk presence had been established around Jesuit missions. French settlers in some areas tolerated Mohawk who peacefully cleared small plots where they live today, like the Mohawk in New York and Vermont. In most areas, Mohawk were not tolerated, and the colonial 'encampment' policy was the outcome for the majority. ... Incidentally, and unfortunately it was in part unfounded Jesuit fear of Mohawk potential involvement in scalping of missionaries and settlers in the Ohio Valley a half Century before Brant's migration that began forcing the six Nations of the Haudenosaunee north. In addition, Mohawk respect of the Haudenosaunee, dictated that they avoid further stressing their western American allies. Caucasian intolerance of pre-existing Haudenosaunee democracy coupled with expanding colonial competition worked together to squeeze the once vast Mohawk territories into a handful of miniscule reservations. ... I hope this broader snapshot helps clarify your rather vaguely stated issue involving Caucasian and American citizens of North America. Feel free to use this paragraph. 24.84.2.75 (talk) 21:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

text: While the Mohawk had used the St. Lawrence Valley for hunting grounds (likely defeating the St. Lawrence Iroquoians centuries before), Kahnawake, Kahnesatake, and Akwesasne (also known in NY as St. Regis Reservation) were established along the St. Lawrence River by Mohawk and other First Nations in association with French colonial settlement and Catholic missions: Kahnawake in 1719, Kanesatake in 1717, both near Montreal; and Akwesasne further upriver in the 1740s by a group of Mohawk from Kahnawake. Parkwells (talk) 14:37, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Clarification?

message: The flag that was briefly at the top of this page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Mohawk-flag.jpg / http://crwflags.com/fotw/flags/ca_mohak.html) is representative of the Mohawk warrior society, and not the Mohawk community as a whole. The individual Haudenosaunee nations' flags are variants of the Haudenosaunee nation's flag: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Hauflag.png . The St. Regis band council probably has its own flag as well. There is nothing wrong with putting the flag of the Warrior society in the article next to text about warrior societies, but considering there isn't even mention of Haudenosaunee warrior societies on wikipedia yet, I think that should wait - putting the warrior society flag on this article gives a very wrong impression. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Brianski (talk • contribs) 09:51, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Point taken; thanks for taking the time. El_C 11:24, 30 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The Mohawk Warrior society is a known terrorist organization in Canada.  They are responsible for the death of Corporal Marcel Lemay and a seventy-one-year-old World War II veteran.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.43.140.143 (talk) 11:29, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: 'Kay. By that standard, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police is also a known terrorist organization within the Canadian borders for they are responsible for the deaths of many Canadians, specifically Indigenous folks. Indeed, their history of domestic terrorism is well-documented (pay particular note to pp. 19+, including pg. 30-31's description of intentional terrorism across Inuit Nunangat). So, unless you are prepared to say Brydon Whitstone and Rodney Levi in the same breath (or keystroke) as Marcel Lemay, you best understand what sort of ideology you are implying with this comment. Danachos (talk) 15:38, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mohawk warrior society flag 

message: "The Mohawk Nation, as part of the Iroquois Confederacy, were signatories to the treaties concluding the Congress of Vienna in 1837.". Congress of Vienna took place in 1814-15. I doubt whether any Native Americans were present in Vienna because the congress took no decisions on any American borders. This sentence needs changing anyway because the date is obviously wrong. I would suggest deleting it and rephrasing the next "five years later" setence.
I suspect that if the Mohawks were present at any European treaty negociations it must have been the Treaty of Ghent of 1814 which ended the War of 1812. Great Britain tried to create an Idian buffor state and therefore could have included some Native Americans in its delegtion. However, I cannot find a cource confirming this, also. Friendly Neighbour 19:42, 8 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I corrected the section as this "facts" are almost certainly not true, and the congress date is evidently wrong. Friendly Neighbour 06:02, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Nope.  The Congress began in 1814-15, but its endless meetings took place for years and its final documents were signed in 1837, when among other things the title of Holy Roman Emperor was done away with and the title of Austrian Emperor endorsed as a sop to retain the dynastic dignity of the former holders of the HRE title, the Habsburgs (by said document; they'd created the title themselves in 1804 but it was not recognized as such, formally, until the closing of the CoV) and various German duchies were elevated to kingdoms, or merged into larger units.  The Congress functioned something like the League of Nations, though less formally so, from 1815-1837; but 1837 was definitely the final year of the Congress, and its summation (according to A.J.P. Taylor anyway, as well as Colin McEvedy). By the way where I first heard this was during colour-commentary to the Oka Crisis.... Skookum1 23:07, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The title of emperor of the HRE was abolished in 1806, the title of Emperor of Austria started about then, and the final act of the congress of Vienna was signed in june 1815. This is a tall tale. 184.160.153.51 (talk) 01:46, 5 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Congress of Vienna did not happen in 1837 

message: Can someone inform me if people belonging to the Mohawk nation were employed as construction workers on tall buildings? I have heard a story that they were chosen for this task because they possessed the ability to work at great heights without vertigo or acrophobia being an issue. If someone can veryify this and add a piece to this effect to the article, this may be welcome. Perhaps if there are members of the Mohawk nation themselves who could verify this (possibly even some of those putative former construction workers?) then this would add considerable weight to what I have heard. Calilasseia 21:59, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yup.. If someone wants to expand from this, that would be great. - TheMightyQuill (talk) 01:41, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Mohawk Contributions To Modern Society

message: For dedicated editors of this page: The "Related Groups" info was removed from all  infoboxes. Comments may be left on the Ethnic groups talk page. Ling.Nut 20:30, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  "related groups" info removed from infobox 

message: I haven't added citation yet, but here's some generally credible sources:
*The Smithsonian institute:
**http://www.sites.si.edu/exhibitions/exhibits/booming/main.htm
**http://www.nmai.si.edu/press/releases/2002_04_15_Booming_Out.html
*NPR:
**http://www.npr.org/programs/lnfsound/stories/020701.steel.html
*Book:
**http://books.google.com/books?id=eGXeFCkTmlgC&pg=PA95&lpg=PA95&dq=mohawk+skyscrapers&source=web&ots=4Nh6nE8cZl&sig=KbXhqmjqgBA1KEE8jMGbDQ_a2KA&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result  —Preceding unsigned comment added by DragonSlaveII (talk • contribs) 04:28, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Skyscrapers

message: Getting 'steely' about what we do!
Say a Montreal Iron Worker comes to Vancouver to work steel. Does he or she have to go back to college? Do we keep that displaced job title? Two legitimate questions arising from a potentially racist identity. This author prefers clear communication that avoids hurt and disgrace, and feels (no doubt with many others) that this is a legitimate concern. Perhaps the best course for Wikipedia is to change that title to "Iron and Steel Workers", and change every internal document use of iron into "steel". We do live in the 21st century after all. This will respect the noted history involving the deaths of many Mohawk "iron workers" early in the last century, while giving our people credit for their contribution to current construction!  comment added by 24.84.2.75 (talk) 18:03, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Iron and Steel Workers 

message: :. As original members of the Iroquois League, or Haudenosaunee, the Mohawk were known as the "Keepers of the Eastern Door", who guarded the Iroquois Confederation against invasion from that direction. (It was from the westward direction that European settlers first appeared, sailing up the Hudson River to found and inhabit Albany, New York, in the early 17th century.)
The implication of the sentence in parantheses is that the origin of the "keepers of the Eastern Door"/guarding the confederacy against invasion from that direction term/context is connected with the arrival of Europeans in the early 17th Century.  Does the term only date back that far??  i.e. was it only created in response to the arrival of the strangefsrs at "the eastern door" or is it older than that?  If it's older tahn that, teh material in parantheses is synthesis, "connecting two dots to make six more".Skookum1 (talk) 15:33, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I took out the sentence about Europeans, as the Mohawk were Keepers of the Eastern Door against tribes in New England before English and Europeans arrived.--Parkwells (talk) 22:38, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Synthesis in intro?

message: what is with the box at the bottom of the page listing proposed Canadian provinces? What does it have to do with this article? I will remove it soon if no one objects with a legitimate reason for keeping it.Camelbinky (talk) 19:47, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: That box is of spurious origin and its existence/deletion is being debated...placing it here was inappropriate, for sure; although during the Oka Crisis and also during the Spicer commission the creation of various micro-provinces was proposed as a solution to native claims and also rural self-rule....but it's not in the article, and "proposed provinces" is a highly POV subject to start with, the template will probably be deleted.....Skookum1 (talk) 20:13, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: it is there due to the content in Proposals for new Canadian provinces and territories, about the events around the seperation of Québec from Canada.. basically many indigenous leaders in Québec (including Mohawks) stated that if Québec left Canada, they would leave Québec and join Canada as a new indigenous province, named Kanienkehaka. --Dalar (talk) 23:14, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: yes, I remember all that....but did that box have anything in it about proposed new provinces and territories?  Don't think so....Skookum1 (talk) 04:41, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Canadian Provinces? 

message: The section has nothing to do with the Mohawk Nation and is filled with errors. The Casino and Gaming operations discussed belong to the St. Regis Mohawk Tribe, a federally recognized Indian tribe, and should be moved to that Article. The Mohawk Nation is not, and has not been in negotiations for a Casino in Sullivan County as mentioned. The Mohawk Nation is not party to the gaming compact between New York State and the St. Regis Mohawk Tribe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.53.21.62 (talk) 21:42, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of Section on Casino 

message: I notice that there is no section describing the form of warfare or the practice of capturing and torturing opponents. It is pretty clear from the contemporary english and french accounts, that one of reasons the Mohawk were feared was their practice of eating the hearts of butchered captives. Vontrotta (talk) 21:55, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  "man-eater" name 

message: It sounds odd to me, that quill work and using sinew as stiching thread would be introduced to the Mohawk only after they started wearing cotton shirts and woolen trousers.I am not an expert, but this is like one is saying: Later muskets and winchesters where introduced, after which the use of clubs, spears and bow and arrow gained in popularity.
Later dress after European contact combined some cloth pieces such as the males ribbon shirt in addition to the place of the deerskin clothing, and wool trousers and skirts. For a time many Mohawk peoples incorporated a combination of the older styles of dress with newly introduced forms of clothing.
According to author Kanatiiosh in "Hodenasaunee Clothing and & Other Cultural Items" Mohawk as a part of the Hodenasaunee Confederacy: "Traditionally used furs obtained from the woodland, which consisted of elk and deer hides, corn husks, and they also wove plant and tree fibers to produce [the] clothing".
Later Sinew or animal gut was cleaned and prepared as a thread for garments and footwear and was threaded to porcupine quills or sharp leg bones, in order to sew or pierce eyeholes for threading.''''
Guest--78.94.210.180 (talk) 13:45, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  About Clothing 

message: I think the name of this article should be changed. "Mohawk" is not the name the "Kanien'kehá:ka" use for themselves - it is a name given to them by the Narragansett, an ennemy tribe, and is meant as an insult. We should consider renaming this article and references to it to Kanien'kehá:ka or maybe the easier transliteration Kanienkeháka or Kanienkehaka. TheAnarcat (talk) 14:34, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Have you read WP:TITLE? What part of that do you think justified changing the name? Shouldn't we get them to change their name first, since they call themselves the Mohawk Nation? Or do you think it's important that we use a name they don't use for their nation? Isn't it a bit patronising to suggest we avoid the name they use? Dougweller (talk) 15:42, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: And I've removed the template as it might be seen by members of the Mohawk nation as insulting. Dougweller (talk) 15:44, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  The "Mohawk" name is an insult 

message: I've removed them all as unsourced & dubious. Native American Justice  By Laurence French, 2003, gives 25,000 in the US and Canada..
This gives a few figures for the 90s (note 'small' population in Brooklyn). They aren't in the 2010 census. Dougweller (talk) 11:38, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Population figures 

message: This is not factual "Beginning in 1669, missionaries attempted to convert many Mohawks from paganism to Christianity".  To label the Mohawk belief structure as 'paganism' is a point of view from European Christianity.  The Mohawks had their own name for a monotheastic creator(Hahgwehdiyu).  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.45.177.221 (talk) 15:04, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: "Paganism" not factual

message: I just scanned the list of people, seems incomplete.....there was an Olympic paddler, I think his sport was, who was one of the Mohawk commentors on Newsworld during the Oka Crisis, can't remember his name, but he's not the Olympian who's the only one on the list so far.  I'll look over the Canadian Olympians categories and see if I can pick him out.Skookum1 (talk) 04:39, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  notable Olympian missing.... 

message: I'm sure I've remembered her name right, and it surprises me she doesn't have an article....I'd thought she became an MP; she was the spokesperson for the Mohawk Woman's Council during the Oka Crisis, who performed negotiator/intermediary roles between the Mohawks and the SQ/Cdn Forces and also for the media.  I'll try and get a stub on her today...surprised she's not here already.....and there's articles on some of the Mohawks involved at the standoff at Kahnesetake, I'll add them after looking at the Oka Crisis article to find their names/links.Skookum1 (talk) 04:47, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Here are some bio-links if anyone wishes to start on her article.....I'd only have time for a raw stub. from MontrealCTV, the Assembly of First Nations, CBC and there's lots more.Skookum1 (talk) 06:01, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Page has been created, Ellen Gabriel. Tradereddy (talk) 16:15, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Ellen Gabriel]] 

message: There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Chipewyan people which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you.  —RMCD bot 09:30, 12 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Move discussion in progress

message: There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Cayuga people which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you.  —RMCD bot 18:44, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Move discussion in progress

message: If I am not mistaken, the Pequot wars pretty much finished the Pequots. It was by New England colonialist (Ct,Ma, and Plymouth) with some help by Narragansett and Mohegan Nations. Which ambassador was killed is unclear, and it seems to be unlikely to have been by the Pequot people. Needs to be removed.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonathan Ames Fuller (talk • contribs) 03:12, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe some confusion from this? Snippet only, but The Red King's rebellion: racial politics in New England, by Russell Bourne 1990- Page 131 "After the Pequot War — which, as seen, was fought to put in place an English-Mohegan monopoly where once the Pequots held sway — the Pocumtucks suffered for their ages-old antipathy to the Mohegans. ... historian suggests — the Pocumtuck-Mohawk connection snapped in 1664: that summer the Pocumtucks committed the international crime of murdering a visiting princely Mohawk ambassador."Dougweller (talk) 15:04, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  In 1664, the Pequot of New England killed a Mohawk ambassador, starting a war that resulted in the destruction of the Pequot.  

message: I scanned the article and didn't find significant instances of "inappropriate or misinterpreted citations" or "weasel words".  Rather than just remove the hatnotes I'll let someone more knowledgeable take a look. Peter Flass (talk) 00:15, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  hatnotes 

message: I recalled this event when it occurred,  The cite is "Group from St. Regis to return to land of Mohawk ancestors|Indians buy 322 acres of land for a fresh start|Hope to leave St. Regis troubles behind|Syracuse Herald Journal|Sunday, 9/12/93" but this isn't online so I don't want to ref something I can't read.  Also, does anyone know if anything ever came of this?  Is it still active or not?  I added a paragraph, but if it's a dead issue it should probably be dropped. Peter Flass (talk) 01:14, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mohawks in town of palatine NY 

message: Substituted at 00:18, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Assessment comment

message: It's been touched on here in the Talk section, but it seems like the Etymology section of the site should at least make mention of the Mohawk/cannibal connection - separate from the question of whether the people practiced cannibalism or not. I have seen some sites claiming that the name given to the people by a competing tribe means "bear people," but still more reputable sites claim it means "flesh-eater." The Merriam-Webster dictionary says "Mohawk" means, literally, "cannibal," and cites usage dating back to 1640.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by SlickVicar (talk • contribs) 14:31, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Etymology of "Mohawk" as "cannibal" 

message: From the lead: "The name means "People of the Flint Place."" Which name? Mohawk or   Kanien'kehá:ka?--Khajidha (talk) 13:12, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Clarification 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Mohawk people. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130906230147/http://www.kahnawake.com/ to http://www.kahnawake.com/
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 21:43, 3 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified (February 2018) 

message: I didn't feel comfortable making the change, but maybe "The Mohawk people (who identify as Kanien'kehá:ka)[...]" could instead be something like "The Kanien'kehá:ka ("People of the flint"; commonly known in English as Mohawk people)[...]". This would be to put the indigenous name first, even as the page title retains the colonial European one for ease of searching. There are certainly other pages where this is done, for example at Joseph Brant. 76.69.155.96 (talk) 19:27, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Old suggestion but , makes total sense WikiFouf (talk) 06:46, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lede wording: Mohawk vs. Kanien'kehá:ka 

message: I think it's important to note that the Eagle and Silver Chain design is specifically the emblem and flag of the Tyendinaga Mohawk Territory in Canada. As such, I don't think it can properly be said that it represents the Kanienʼkehá꞉ka as a whole. Would moving elsewhere from the infobox be best? I think at the very least we should include a note of its origin so as not to be misleading.
———Iguanaparrots (talk) 06:37, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Flag Accuracy? 

message: I think perhaps "adopted" is inappropriate as terminology in cases of forcible abduction, often involving rape.
(Sorry for not being logged on, away from my normal computer.) 73.214.96.211 (talk) 18:11, 16 July 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Adopted" seems incorrect.