Talk:Automated manual transmission

message: Quote:
Despite superficial similarity, clutchless manual transmission differ significantly in internal operation and driver's 'feel' from manumatics, which are automatic transmissions (using torque converter instead of clutch to manage the link between the transmission and the wheels) with ability to signal shifts manually.
I disagree with this statement.  Manumatic is an obsolete form of semi-automatic transmission and does not have a torque converter. Biscuittin (talk) 20:49, 11 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Whether you disagree or not, the term is often used by the automotive press to describe a torque-converter-based automatic transmission with selectable manual upshifting and downshifting, in the model of Porsche's Tiptronic. Examples are found here, here, here, here, here, here (in hyphenated form), and here. That, if you're keeping score, is a selection from all four of the major US automotive printed magazines, plus the highly-respected Inside Line from Edmunds.com and the start-up Winding Road online magazine. That's a broad consensus among industry-watchers. Sacxpert (talk) 07:02, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Manumatic

message: The article does not fully describe exact details of its operation. 
1. What happens when a car with a semi-automatic transmission brakes to a stop when the transmission is in manual mode (i.e., the driver is expected to upshift and downshift)? Will the car stall if the driver does not shift to neutral? Similarly, will the engine lug/stall if the driver keeps it in too high a gear for a particular speed?
2. While upshifting or downshifting, does the driver keep the accelerator pedal depressed like automatic transmissions? In that case, does engine control take care of controlling fuel injection during the time window the clutch is being hydraulically engaged (so that engine does not rev high under no load or partial load)?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.65.27.201 (talk) 02:07, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Semi-automatic operation

message: Does this article refer a type of automated manual transmission, with an electronically actuated, hydraulic clutch, controlled by computers and a servomechanism? The clutch is basically hydraulically or mechanically/electronically actuated, making it automated, but the driver can still take manual control of gear selection if needed to, hence the term "automated." I realize the term "semi-automatic" may also be used to refer to a similar purpose, since "-semi" from Latin means "half," and since these transmission do have automatically actuated clutches rather than a manual clutch pedal, I guess it sort makes sense, and some of these transmissions can operate in a fully automatic mode, I guess that's hence where the term "-semi" (automatic) comes from. Since these have electronic or hydraulic mechanical clutches rather than manual ones, it sort of makes sense. Would Automated manual (AMT) be correct to use in this context? It does refer to a standard manual transmission, just with an electronic or hydraulic actuated, automatic clutch, rather than a manual one, hence everything is "automated" rather than fully "automatic." (Davism0703 (talk) 19:30, 24 February 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Please be aware that the term "automated manual" is under discussion at Talk:Semi-automatic_transmission#Automated manual.  Stepho  talk  22:46, 24 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Auto/Automated Manual transmission. 

message: Having watched this subject on the Semi-automatic_transmission page, I think this is a huge improvement.
However this page and the wider subject is still presented with the wrong perspective. It reads like it's been written by a mechanic for other mechanics. The general populace of the planet usually do not care which car components are involved, and where they seek to learn, their path will start with "What happens when I put the car in D".  Such is missing, and at the moment the people who buy care to drive them, and advertise them for sale, will find little of this information useful. CarbonPepper (talk) 10:21, 4 September 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi CarbonPepper. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I agree, the article has greatly improved recently, but there is still room for improvements regarding how it explains the basic principal to the casual reader. Cheers, 1292simon (talk) 01:40, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Too technical 

message: It would be useful to include in some general article a comprehensive and well-defined classification of transmissions. What do you think of the following?
*Manual transmissions: Non-synchronized and, synchronized. Modern ones may include technologies that improve the shifting such as Toyota's iMT (not to be confused with the semi-automatic term) or, the synchronized down shift rev-matching system.
*Automatic transmissions: Automatized clutch and gear shifting functions.
**Hydraulic automatic transmissions (HATs): Current ones have several "internal" clutches not accessible to the driver thru pedals. These are the oldest "commercially successful" kind. Also known as Torque Converter automatic transmissions.
**Manumatic transmissions (MMTs): The modern usage of the automotive term manumatic denotes an automatic transmission that allows the driver to select a specific gear, typically using paddle-shifters, steering wheel-mounted push-buttons, or "+" and "-" controls on the gear selector. The driver often does not have full control of the gear selection, as most manumatic modes will deny a gear change request that would result in the engine stalling (from too few RPM) or over-revving. Some transmissions will hold the requested gear indefinitely, while others will return to automatic gear selection after a period of time.
**Dual-clutch automatic transmissions (DCTs): They might have several clutches too but they are grouped into two parallel sub-systems. No torque converter, clutch packs instead. Most dual-clutch transmissions have also a "manual" mode which requires the drives to select gears via paddle shifters; so, if that is the case, a DCT might be identified as as a sequential clutchless transmission. Besides, internally they are implemented with two separate clutch systems for odd and even gear sets. The design is often similar to two separate manual transmissions with their respective clutches contained within one housing, and working as one AUTOMATIC unit. So, due to the way they are implemented, some people do not classify them as automatic transmissions but as AMTs.
**Continuous Variable Transmissions (CVTs): No regular clutch but a centrifugal one. Many currents CVTs "fake" gear shifting to offer a "sport mode". In that case, they provide sequential upshifting and downshifting controls which allow you to "jump" from one point to another in the torque continuum. For that reason, they might also be classified as an AMTs.
*Semi-automatic transmissions: In the broad sense, it is an umbrella term for non-sequential and sequential clutchless manual transmissions and, automated manual transmissions. In the strict sense, the term refers only to the first.
**Non-sequential clutchless transmissions: The clutch is "internal" and its behavior is governed by the car, not the driver. The driver selects the gears and the transmission does not require him to choose gears sequentially. Example: Hyundai and Kia's iMT.
**Sequential clutchless transmissions: Similar to the previous one but there is no way to skip gears. Used in race motorcycles and cars.
*Automated manual transmissions (AMTs): It is a manual transmission with an automatized clutch (which is not accessible to the driver through a pedal) and an ASSISTED or AUTOMATIC gear shifting function. If the second function is assisted but not fully automatic, an AMT cannot be classified as automatic but as semi-automatic. If the latter function is not implemented, they are simply clutchless transmissions. Most modern implementations of this transmission function in a sequential mode, where the driver can only upshift or downshift by one gear at a time. However, this is not the case for all modern transmissions. For example, BMW's "SMG" and Ferrari's "F1" transmissions can skip gears on both downshifts and upshifts, when selecting gears manually via the steering wheel-mounted paddle-shifters. Example: Toyota's MMT. For background, there are two types of AMTs: single-clutch and dual-clutch. Single-clutch AMTs are older, lurch-prone and generally unpleasant; the good news is that only the Smart Fortwo and some exotic sports cars use them. Dual-clutch AMTs, on the other hand, are designed to eliminate lurching, and the best units provide incredibly quick yet perfectly smooth shifts. Most current AMT-equipped cars use dual-clutch technology. AFAIK, the 1st transmission capable of operating this way was the 1942 Hudson Commodore Drive Master which, in fact, had 3 modes: manual, semi-automatic and automatic. So, the Drive-Master might represent another category on its own.
I think transmissions should be classified depending on how they function and not necessarily on how they are implemented as some modern transmissions resemble manual transmissions but function as automatic ones.
George Rodney Maruri Game (talk) 09:16, 19 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  A detailed classification