Talk:History of Kyiv

message: Comments (and especially references) about this somewhat dubious event are welcome at Talk:Kiev_Offensive#Recent_Irpen.27s_edit.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 22:22, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Destruction of Kiev in 1920

message: I changed "pro-Ukrainian" to "nationalist" for clarity. "pro-Ukrainian" implies that there were only two positions, the other one being, presumably, "pro-Russian". This muddles matters somewhat. The political landscape consisted of several dynamics: the pro v anti soviet aspect, the nationalist v non-nationalist bit, and the language problem (Russian v Ukrainian v Something in between). This seems like an excessively long explanation of a single word edit, but I think the merit is there. Terms like "pro-Ukrainian" can mean alot of things or nothing at all, and should be chosen carefully. If I missed the point (ie: the editor meant "intelectuals favoring the use of the Ukranian language" rather than nationalists), then the sentence should be reverted and qualified.
On a similar note, there ought to be some discussion of the interaction of Ukrainian and Russian in Kiev (and in Ukraine as a whole), in brief, because the question isn't simple. Ukrainian and Russian are not particulary distinct (meaning there is no clear geographical boundary that indicates "east of here:Russian, west of here:Ukrainian"). I'd go so far as to point out that almost nowhere in Ukraine is "text-book" Ukrainian spoken: the variations are great, progressing from "pure" Ukrainian in Galicia to "pure" Russian well within Russia itself. Between the two extremes, lies an entire spectrum that mixes the two in varrying quantities. Kiev Ukrainian lies closer to the Ukrainian end, of course, but is heavily diluted by Russian, this is not a simple product of the dominance of one language over the other, although this played an undeniable role, so much as it is the exponent of the normal interplay between the two.
Just a suggestion. 128.197.130.220 18:16, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Anonymous, please register. Now, maybe pro-Ukrainian is not the best way to say here, but "nationalist" is even worse. People who simply wanted to use Ukainian in the capital of Ukraine were usually not nationalist. I personally know of a person who came to study in the main national University in 70s from the small Oblast town (obviously Ukrainophone) only to find out that in that the instruction of the main University in UA was totally in Russian. Being just graduated from the Ukrainian schools, the need to "adjust" was not only difficult, but humiliating for him. When he graduated and stayed at the department as an employee, all he wanted is to keep speaking Ukrainian at work. While not explicitly prohibited from doing so, he was subtly pressured to seize all throughout his career. Now, maybe his story is an exaggeration but there are many more stories like that. My personal account is also not a veryfiable reference for an article but it is OK as an illustration at talk. Please give it a thought, register and welcome to to continue the discussion. --Irpen 19:18, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Pro-Ukrainian vs Nationalist

message: Would be appreciated. Hamm's 'Kiev: a portrait' ends in 1917: could anybody recommend any English language book or academic article which would have information on history of Kiev after 1917? I have access to a major US library center and would like to see if any book has information on the accusation discussed two sections above. I couldn't find a single useful book for 20th century history of Kiev in English using Google Print, Schoolar and Amazon. On the sidenote, I'd suspect there should be much more material written in Russian and Ukrainian. Unfortunately I can't help with that, as I have no proficiency in these languages,--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 19:30, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  More references for 20th Kiev

message: I have a book which mentions a "Kiev Massacre" of Jews that occurred in the 1880s. From this article I can only find the event in the 1940s. Does anyone have any information that might assist me? Thanks for replying via my talk page. – Freechild (¡!¡!¡!¡) 03:06, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The article about 1881 pogrom has not been written yet. But we have Kiev pogrom (1919) and Kiev pogrom (1905). --Irpen 04:23, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Question regarding an event

message: According to other quite reliable sources Batu Kaani (Khan) conquered Kioava (Kijev) on December 6, 1240 thus ending the Kijev (Kievan) Rus Principality. The Mongols devasted the mainly wooden town quite completely. One can read an eye witnesser describtion of the time five years later;  They laid a siege a long while vnto Kiow, the chiefe citie of Russia, and at lenght (December 6, 1240) they took it and slue the citizents. Whereupon, traveiling throught that countrey, wee found an innumerable  multitude of dead men skulles and bones lying here and there all vpon the earth. For it was a very large and a popolous citie, but it is nowe (1246) in a manner brought to nothing for there doe scrace remaine 200 houses, the inhabitants whereof are kept in extreame bondage. This by Franciscane monk Ion de Plano Carpini from his Finnish version text "Mongolien mailla" (On the lands of Mongols), also published in English with the title "The long and wonderful voyage of Frier Iohn de Plano Carpini".
Also the truth of the Soviet installed radio controlled time fused mines in Kiev in 1941 is much more interesting than in main article published typical Soviet War Propaganda based exaggerating version. The Germans lost total less than 350 soldiers (in the first main explosion in their local military adminstration center alone about 250 deads) and they managed to de-active about 85 per cent of the installed mines. I hope I have time to describe the full story why the Germans were able (with Finnish help) to prevent the total destruction of Kiev by these radio mines. Example of the German Engineering Troops work was the Kiev main Railway Station building, which in fact was exploded by the Germans themselves during theit retreat in October 1943. If someone is interested to see photos of the station building still standing intact on September 13, 1943 and the actual explosion they are available in page 164 in the "Lokomotiven ziehen in den Krieg Band 3" published by Verlag Josef Otto Slezak, Wien 1980. . The station building was built according to drawings made by Architect A. Verbiski in 1932. After the war it was completely rebuilt by the Soviet Union. On page 161 are photos of the Dniepr southern railway bridge between Kiev II and Darnitsa as repaired by the Germans taken on March 7, 1943 and after it was exploded by the retreating Germans on September 29, 1943. The northern railway bridge was photographed on May 25 and October 7, 1942 in page 161. This bridge was opened into service by RVD Kiew on December 15, 1942. More photos are available in Band 1,  Wien 1977, pages 151 and 155 taken during the German evacuation of Kiev in September 1943.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.112.87.13 (talk) 06:01, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Some corrections to the main article 

message: What improvements do we need to make so this article is excellent enough to be featured?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.166.100.2 (talk) 12:24, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: The intent is to make this a [[Wikipedia:Featured Article|Featured article]].

message: i removed links that were duplicates, to definitions of words i think can be commonly assumed as understood, and for dates and years where the event listed were not in those articles. the last should be carefully checked before added. i notice a lot of articles link to a year, when not really appropriate. as always, if i inadvertently removed a link that someone feels is relevent, i wont revert (at least without a good solid reason), and apologize in advance for not seeing the relevance.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 20:13, 23 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Excess links 

message: * 07:36, 2 August 2007 Alex Bakharev protected History of Kiev  (attack of Kyivization puppets [edit=autoconfirmed:move=autoconfirmed])
As the above semiprotection was some time ago I'd like to discuss whether it's still necessary.  As well as welcoming comments from regular or sometime editors I've also notified the protecting sysop, .
--TS 04:38, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Semiprotection review

message: Kiev was not the capital of the proposed Grand Duchy of Rus since it was never ratified. It was a part of the Treaty of Hadiach but when it came to ratification at the Sejm, this point was unilaterally eliminated, making the whole agreement a farce. So it is totally wrong to argue with this ratification even if there is no doubt it took place.
My pointed source is:
Т.Г. Таирова-Яковлева Иван Выговский // Единорогъ. Материалы по военной истории Восточной Европы эпохи Средних веков и Раннего Нового времени, вып.1, М., 2009: 
Под влиянием польской общественности и сильного диктата Ватикана сейм в мае 1659 г. принял Гадячский договор в более чем урезанном виде. Идея Княжества Руського вообще была уничтожена, равно как и положение о сохранении союза с Москвой. Отменялась и ликвидация унии, равно как и целый ряд других позитивных статей.
Professor Tairova-Yakovleva is not pro-Russian, she was honored by the former President of Ukraine Victor Yushchenko which is shown here.
Moreover, the Russian garrison of Kiev commanded by Knyaz Yuri Baryatinsky never gave up Kiev so it was not just de jure not the capital but also de facto!
I want to appeal to Mibelz and Galassi: Please, respect the rules of Wikipedia! Either you can disprove what I've written or not! 
Sources about the ratification of the treaty ARE NOT sources about the ratification of the Grand Duchy of Rus and Kiev as its capital! I expect sourced quotes that are as concrete and pointed in this issue as my source is. --Voyevoda (talk) 08:17, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Fictional Grand Duchy of Rus

message: Is this some propaganda or what?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.21.92.185 (talk) 23:55, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: corrected! HammerFilmFan (talk) 18:04, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Magyars/Hungarians are turkic people? 

message: Both this article and the Kiev article have versions of the same statement:
*Kiev None of Polish-Russian treaties concerning Kiev has been never ratified.Eugeniusz Romer, O wschodniej granicy Polski z przed 1772 r., w: Księga Pamiątkowa ku czci Oswalda Balzera, t. II, Lwów 1925, s. [358].
*History of Kiev Noone of Polish-Russian treaties concerning Kiev has been never ratified.Eugeniusz Romer, O wschodniej granicy Polski z przed 1772 r., w: Księga Pamiątkowa ku czci Oswalda Balzera, t. II, Lwów 1925, s. [358].
These statements do not make sense because they have a double negative.  I imagine that they mean something like: "Not one of Polish-Russian treaties concerning Kiev has been ever fully ratified by the Russian Government."--Toddy1 (talk) 19:41, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Statement that does not make sense 

message: What is missing from the recently created city timeline article? Please add relevant content. Contributions welcome. Thank you. -- M2545 (talk) 14:35, 19 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Timeline of Kiev]] 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: There is no "Kiev", only Kyiv, as the main article on the city is titled, along with everything else associated with it.
See: Timeline of Kyiv—Preceding unsigned comment added by DanyloPushkar (talk • contribs) 18:47, 12 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rename this article 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) Jack Frost (talk) 04:18, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: History of Kiev →  – I don't think there's much to say. The article on Ukraine's capital has been titled Kyiv for a while, and relevant articles about the city such as Name of Kyiv, Kyiv Metro, Kyiv Oblast, Kyiv metropolitan area, Subdivisions of Kyiv, Transport in Kyiv and Timeline of Kyiv use this name too. It only makes sense for this article to use Kyiv as well. Super Ψ Dro 19:40, 12 August 2021 (UTC)

text: *Would you also prefer History of Beijing to be named History of Peking? If not, what do you consider the differences to be? Also, what guideline leads us to prefer names that represent Russian pronunciations? Largoplazo (talk) 21:39, 12 August 2021 (UTC)

text: Support per everyone else's arguments. We call it Kyiv, so name everything Kyiv. aeschylus (talk) 14:07, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 12 August 2021 

message: Despite the obvious consensus in the recent discussion, the page was not moved to History of Kyiv. What is the reason for that?--RicardoNixon97 (talk) 06:23, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Page not moved 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion 

message: How should we spell the name of the subject in this article?
# Same as the article title, Kyiv
# Kiev
# With both spellings, applying the decision for RfC: Kyiv/Kiev in other articles (11 November 2020) section-by-section
# Other
 —Michael Z. 03:21, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  RFC: How to spell the name of the subject in this article