Talk:Revolver Ocelot/Archive 1

message: "After the events of Sons of Liberty, Liquid Ocelot went into hiding in the Middle East and has established his own version of Outer Heaven in his bid to overthrow the Patriots (ironically forcing Ocelot to betray his own superiors against his will)."
This is just bull. Cardboard boxA 23:48, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Removing part from GotP section

message: "However during the invasion his helicopter was shot down and he gained PTSD (or Post Traumatic Stress Disorder)".
This can't be true. Metal gear ninty 21:31, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot suffered from PTSD... WTF! 

message: In the original Metal Gear Solid game, Raven refers to Ocelot as 'General Ivan'. Is Ivan Ocelot's actual name, perhaps?
:No. "Ivan" is being used there as slang for a Russian. The same thing is done in Metal Gear Solid 2 (Vamp refers to Ocelot as "Crazy Ivan"), and the game's script in The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2 explains its use. - DoubleCross 23:26, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot's Real Name? 

message: The article says "At this point Liquid's dormant personality takes over Ocelot's mind and body via the arm (due to Liquid's cellular memories in his arm)". First of all, what is "cellular memories"? Secondly, what is the source on that that is how Liquid takes over Ocelot? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.81.45.10 (talk • contribs) 06:38, April 30, 2006 (UTC)
:A little searching on Google will give you the answer.  --DarkPhoenix 13:29, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that I have no answer to. In fact, I think that part should either be removed, or at least have a -tag added to it. It's speculative, at best. I don't remember there being any talk of this in-game at least, so I think a proper citation or reference is required. --DarkPhoenix 18:31, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

text: Well, there shouldn't be any original research on Wikipedia, and items of speculative nature should be avoided. So allowing people to freely write about their theories is generally not so good an idea. If, however, people can give verifiable and reliable sources to their claims, then I see nothing wrong about people writing about his arm. --DarkPhoenix 18:54, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cellular memories? 

message: "Ocelot continued his service in Spetsnaz until the collapse of the Soviet Union. Then he served OMON, the Russian Tax Police's elite swat team. Afterwards, he joined SVR, the Russian Foreign Intelligence Agency (successor to the KGB's First Directorate). However, he was unsatisfied with the new regime and left Russia. He participated in various regional conflicts (including the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan) as a hired mercenary,"
How can he have participated in the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan as a mercenary if he was a member of Spetznaz until the collapse of the Soviet Union? Likewise, I wonder about the sources and accuracy of the rest of that paragraph - it may be mentioned in his background in MGS that he served in OMON and SVR and that he considered FOXHOUND membership to be a great honor, I don't remember. Asterphage 21:51, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Later Career problems 

message: Under the tanker chapter section, it mentions "Ocelot is seen using injections of some sort to suppress the manifestations. " however, it merely looked to me as if he were roughly gripping his arm, as if physically wrestling with it, as opposed to injecting a subtance into it. I'm oingto watch it again, but this line appears suspicious to me, especially given his later statements that "the attacks" seem to occur so often due to Snake's presence (which is mentioned in the main article).
: I recently played Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty again, and it appears as though when it happens, Ocelot has some sort of taser-like device, which I would assume to be the injections.(Myscrnnm 16:50, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Arm Medication?

message: Can we change the first Revolver Ocelot picture on this article?  It's kind of an insult to him, and doesn't look like him at all.  It should be, in my opinion, the Liquid Ocelot picture from MGS4 when he's wearing sunglasses with his hand up in a fist. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Al11697 (talk • contribs) 
:I'd prefer to use the standard Ocelot picture until MGS4 is out, or at least nearing its release date. Besides, there's a pic of the new Ocelot under the MGS4 section anyway. -- Steel359 16:54, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Ocelot pic. 

message: I thought only Snake could "free" Liquid? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.93.101.150 (talk • contribs) 
:I'm pretty such either will do it. I'll read over the game script later to double check. -- Steel 11:53, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Later it is revealed by Liquid that the presence of Solidus or Snake is required to "free" him and allow him to posess Ocelot" 

message: The relevant discussion is here
(The Bread 03:58, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge 

message: im sugjesting that we not use the MGS4 pic for ocelot because we dont know yet if ocelot is being controlled by Liquid. -Sidmer
I say we just leave it, we don't want the same sort of argument as here
(The Bread 03:44, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot pictures 

message: About the header suggesting that Ocelot gets merged into a main character page.
Keep It Separate. Next to Solid Snake and Big Boss, Ocelot is one of the most influential characters in the series. Unlike all the other characters, Ocelot actually has depth and history to him, which helps to shape the entire storyline.
:Feel free to come up with some sources other than the games themselves, then. It's the presence or absence of sourced content that determines whether this is merged or not.  - A Man In Bl?ck (conspire | past ops) 04:27, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Feel free to come up with some sources other than the games themselves, then. It's the presence or absence of sourced content that determines whether this is merged or not. - A Man In Bl?ck (conspire | past ops) 04:28, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot article: Keep it separate. 

message: Have you noted that there is a little resemblance between Ocelot and the Ninja Null? Also the voice is similar. Could be him.
Black Dollar 19 November 2006
:It's not him.  Null is actually ol' Frank Jaeger himself.Maetch 18:22, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Ocelot at MPO

message: Why does it redirect me to the Revolver Ocelot article when I run a search for, "Liquid Snake"? Liquid Snake is a completely different character, and there is hardly any mention of him in this article. I vote we give Liquid his own article, or if he already has a bio in one, redirect to that. --YoungOcelot 00:09, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It directs to "Liquid Snake" just fine for me. Kakashi-sensei 09:03, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Liquid Snake

message: Koji Totani, the original Japanese voice of Revolver Ocelot, died a few months before the production of the E3 Trailer, which may explain why Banjo Ginga's (Liquid's) voice was used instead of Ocelot's own voice.
First of all, this is just a guess. Second, we all know that it was Liquids voice that was used in the end of Metal Gear Solid 2. Therfore I remove that. This should also mean that "Liquid Ocelot" is more of Liquid than Ocelot. [14:02, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I put it back in, but rewrote ir to make it sound less speculative. If you recall back in MGS2, you'll know that Ocelot's mind switches back and forth between his own self and Liquid's. Just because Ocelot was taken over by Liquid at the end doesn't really meant it was written to be permanent. However, in MGS4 he has shown no sign of original self, only Liquid's.Jonny2x4 03:34, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That was an excellent change. BTW, I always thought that the change was meant to be permanent. If you recall the beginning of MGS2, Revolver Ocelot was back as himself right after the Tanker incident. In the end horewer, Liquid Snake seemed to having all the time in the world to seek out and destroy the Patriots. But that is just speculations... [18:57, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Liquid Ocelots voice, again. 

message: Out of curiosity, why has the discussion been archived? I'm saying this here because when I went to the article, it said not to edit that one and to instead talk on this page.(Myscrnnm 04:05, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on this page. And to answer your question, this discussion has been archived because it is old. Greg Jones II 21:09, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Question

message: We seem to have lost all of the images on this page, probably because some fucking bot deleted them because of a typo in the rationale or some such that didn't get fixed by some arbitrary deadline because not every page is watched 24/7. Anyone have any good replacements?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by TheWarlock (talk • contribs) 15:22, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  images 

message: I removed the info from the database about Ocelot's arm in MGS4 being prosthetic and him actually being possessed in MGS2. The database is written to try to avoid spoilers for people how haven't completed MGS4, so that information is unreliable in my opinion. 08:33, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: That makes no sense. Because something is blocked because it could spoil people who haven't finished the game, it's unreliable? Try harder. --213.204.223.34 (talk) 08:38, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The database unlocks information if you load a completed MGS4 file.  It clearly says that Ocelot's Liquid personality was a product of nanomachines, drugs and self-training - he taught himself to think that he was Liquid.  There was no actual control from Liquid's arm. 193.132.145.152 (talk) 10:51, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Liquid's arm/prosthetic

message: Ocelot didn't "think" he was posses, he actually was.   There is a point in the Tanker part where you hear both voices AT THE SAME time, "Get out of my mind, Liquid!"   That's an in game fact so that needs to be mentioned in the article.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.222.209.60 (talk) 03:32, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Liquid in MGS2

message: He is never actually Liquid Snake, the story has never been updated since MGS4 came out. It still says he was taken over by Liquid Snake, when of course he was faking it the entire time.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muisee (talk • contribs) 02:18, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  He is never actually Liquid Snake 

message: Did Ocelot ever find out that he was the son of The Boss and The Sorrow, and vice versa?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.215.28.242 (talk) 14:37, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot and The Boss 

message: In Metal gear Solid 4, in the debriefing, Big Boss clearly states, that the Liquid Ocelot Persona was in Fact Ocelot all along. The Flashbacks even Show MGS2 Images.
However this was likely not Kojima´s original intend, hence the 2 Voices in MGS2. What still is a problem is the arm exchange. My guess would be, maybe the Liquid Ocelot Persona got somehow out of control? Or maybe, the Arm was trying to rot. xD 87.174.221.27 (talk) 13:10, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot was Liquid? Or not? 

message: I don`t understand the problem with Liquid Ocelot, if Ocelot was possesed by liquid, if he was faking or if the arm was roting, is clearly stated in MGS4; Liquid DID choose Ocelot as a host, to control him, so he could find out about The Patriots location, but in some point betwen Sons of Liberty and Guns of the Patriots, Ocelot REMOVED Liquid`s arm and replace it with a super prosthetic and to complete his and EVA mission of destroy The Patriots created by Zero, they with Nanomachines and psychoteraphy created the Liquid persona inside Ocelot, so "Liquid" could be a threat to The Patriots and give Snake a chance to destroy them.
Anyone who has played the game and payed attention to the cinemas know that, as for the voices, the Liquid Ocelot Persona having Ocelot voice, that`s because the Voice for the Japanese Liquid died, so in honor to him Kojima productions decided to eliminate Liquid`s voice in America too. Zidane tribal (talk) 18:48, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Play the game before posting something 

message: Actually that is incorrect. The japanese Voice Actor of Ocelot died and instead Banjo ginga, the japanese voice of Liquid , portrayed Ocelot. However originally Liquid Ocelot was intended to be voiced by the seiyu of Ocelot. Since Pat Zimmerman (the english voice of Ocelot) didn´t die, he portrayed Liquid Ocelot in the English version as originally intended. And I did play the game, but thanks for making the suggestion :) I even played it more than once :).
I have to apologyse for a grammatical error. that wasn´t trying to rot, but starting to rot.^^
87.174.192.118 (talk) 13:26, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Do some research before posting something

message: Hope this helps you guys understand the whole Liquid Ocelot thing:  http://mgarsenal.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=heaven&action=display&thread=4441   MGS2 possession was real.  MGS4 was an act.  Hence Liquid's voice in MGS2.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.161.203.11 (talk) 22:33, 10 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  MGS2 vs MGS4 Liquid Ocelot - Clearing things up 

message: The history if this user speaks for itself he can`t be reasoned with, in his latest edit he personally attack me, and i took it to a admin. i don`t want to make a edit war over something we had agreed a while back, i just hope the IP user stops and submit his opinion to a proper debate in this very section as stipulated in the many guidelines of this project. Zidane tribal (talk) 21:11, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  70.126.138.182 

message: Just need to point out, the page is completely inscrutable to anyone who has not played any of these games.
for example:
After Snake uses the FOXALIVE virus to delete the Patriots' AIs, Ocelot challenges Snake to a fistfight and appears to die from exhaustion after the final fight. But It's later revealed that Ocelot's possession was deliberate via self-hypnosis and nanomachines in order to serve as Liquid's mental doppelgänger to trick the Patriots' AIs,[12] and that Ocelot's death was actually caused by the new FOXDIE strain that was injected into Snake by Drebin.[13]
What is FOXALIVE? who is Drebin? he is mentioned only this one time, he doesn't have his own page, honestly I feel if you want to catalog characters in videogames, you should be doing it on a video game wiki. I understand having imaginary characters like tom sawyer, or an article on megaman, but you have an article on sniper wolf, probably one of the least remembered bosses in that game, next to vulcan raven. meanwhile, psycho mantis is mia, even though he's the only remotely interesting one thanks to the unique gameplay mechanics the battle used. 32.213.196.222 (talk) 22:48, 20 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  This page is a mess 

message: I've recently been thinking of adding Ocelot to either :Category:Fictional gay males or :Category:Fictional LGBT characters. It's been confirmed by Hideo Kojima himself that Ocelot is in love with Big Boss; in The Phantom Pain, Ocelot even admits his feelings for Big Boss during Quiet's torture scene. Also, if you wait long enough while Ocelot has Snake in a headlock during the final boss of Guns of the Patriots, Ocelot actually kisses Snake on the cheek. Smijes08 (talk) 04:10, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Then we would really that source from Kojima.Tintor2 (talk) 15:51, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: The phrase is incomplete. Read it as "we would really need that source". Find the source, add it to the article and categorization would need to follow. Dimadick (talk) 17:24, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ocelot is gay