Talk:Imam Rapito

message: I see on these sites that the trial is scheduled to begin in June 2007. But that date has passed. I am interested to know, did it begin? Thank you. Sunbeam44 09:57, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No, the trial si still waiting for the costitutional court. Teardrop.z 18:01, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Did the trial begin? 

message: Question: while this info: "(and alleged former Albanian national intelligence service asset)" is certainly important, do you folks really think it ought to belong to the intro? It is not prooved, and is quite peripherical to the Imam Rapito case, isn't it? Diplomatic incidents between US and Italy and internal relations between various bodies in Italy are here more critical, aren't they? Tazmaniacs 20:56, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Albania 

message: i took 
* Preliminary investigative magistrate Chiara Nobili of Milan.
from the investigative staff cause she is not. she is not actually a "investigative magistrate". that point to inquisitory legal system wich is not the case. i keep a record here. i'll see how to complete this section and how to translate the italian magistrates "names" and functions.Teardrop.z 19:44, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Dramatics Personae

message: i think we should put the "ongoing" alert into the article as it is in the italian page.
i wrote an intro to the article. i think it's the most recent and complete summary about the Abu Omar Case.
IT IS IN ITALIAN, because my enghish is not that good. it is in my userpage User:Teardrop.z/Abu_Omar#Abu_Omar_Affair
there are a lot of link to italian press, something from the EU Parlamient [you can find that in english too] an more.
i hope somebody can help me rendering it in good english, it could be used as an intro to this article.
Teardrop.z 21:12, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I changed the intro, please review english grammar and words i choose!!Teardrop.z 01:11, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro 

message: === Investigation staff ===
* Prosecutor Armando Spataro.
* Prosecutor Ferdinando Pomarici
=== Indicted persons ===
Indicted persons include the following:
==== Sismi ====
The following persons from Italian military intelligence agency Sismi, have been indicted:
* General Nicolò Pollari, former director; resigned November 20, 2006.
* Marco Mancini, director of operations.  Mancini has been jailed.
* General Gustavo Pignero, in charge of SISMI operations, Mancini's superior; placed under house arrest.
*Renato Farina, vice-director of Libero, recruited by the SISMI in 2003. Reached a plea bargain with Italian justice.
==== Carabinieri ====
* Giuliano Pironi, nicknamed "Ludwig", a junior ROS (Special Forces of the Carabinieri) officer recruited by Lady; participated in Omar's arrest. Reached a plea bargain with Italian justice.
==== USAF ====
* Lieutenant Colonel Joseph L. Romano III, commander of 31st Security Forces Squadron at Aviano Air Base at the time of the abduction and former commander of 586th Expeditionary Security Forces Squadron at Camp Bucca, Iraq, now working at Section 31b the Pentagon.
==== CIA ====
The indictments referred to persons operating under the following names.  At least eleven of these names appear to be aliases and are regarded by Italian authorities as being "untraceable": some have received Social Security Numbers only in the last ten years, and some have addresses that are post office boxes in Virginia believed to be used by the C.I.A.  The rest appear to be legitimate identities.
* Monica Courtney Adler
* Gregory Asherleigh
* Lorenzo Gabriel Carrera, b. 1/29/1971, TX.
* Eliana Castaldo, b. 11/14/1969.
* Victor Castellano
* Jeffrey W. Castelli, Rome station chief, responsible of the CIA in Italy until 2003, and Lady's superior; now believed to be at Langley.
* Drew Carlyle Channing
* Sabrina De Sousa
* John Kevin Duffin
* Vincent Faldo, b. 1950
* John Thomas Gurley
* Raymond Michael Harbaugh
* James Thomas Harbison, b. 1948
* Ben Amar Harty, b. 1944; of Arabic origin.  
* Brenda Liliana Ibanez
* Anne Linda Jenkins, b. Sept 24, 1946 in Florida
* James Robert Kirkland
* Robert Seldon Lady, Milan station chief, reputed leader of the rendition.
* Cynthia Dame Logan
* Betnie Medero-Navedo, b. 1967; Second secretary at the U.S. embassy in Italy at the time of the kindapping; now First Secretary at the U.S. embassy in Mexico."La justicia italiana emite una orden de arresto por secuestro contra una funcionaria de la embajada de EEUU en México", Crónica Rebelion, April 19, 2005  
* L. George Purvis
* Pilar Rueda
* Ralph Henry Russomando
* Joseph Sofin
* Michalis Vasiliou, b. 1962, in Greece.
=== Counsel ===
* Nasr's counsel is Egyptian lawyer Montasser el-Zayat.
:Who is missing? Such lists are not that bad, IMO (in my opinion)... as long as they are kept at the end. They allow for various levels of reading (one may read only the list to see who is involved). What do you think? Tazmaniacs 19:11, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dramatis personae 

message: * Nasr's counsel is Egyptian lawyer Montasser el-Zayat.
:Who is missing? Such lists are not that bad, IMO (in my opinion)... as long as they are kept at the end. They allow for various levels of reading (one may read only the list to see who is involved). What do you think? Tazmaniacs 19:11, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Counsel 

message: Is it Indymadia a good source?
my intuition never trusted it a lot.
the abduction part point to the right ordinance number! but i don't realize the torture part, addressing "US code". i'll check it later. Teardrop.z 13:30, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia sometimes use Indymedia as a source, depends on the matters. In any cases, the statement "photos have appeared on the Web" is neutral and allows the reader to judge for himself. Personally, I think you should read Indymedia as Wikipedia, and, to some extent, as any news report: on a case by case basis, with caution. The Indymedia article (I've read only the first half) is quite detailed, and provides links to news source (just as Wikipedia) . The Spiegel article is interessant, and points towards a direct responsibility of Condoleeza Rice, citing an article by Matthew Cole in GS in March. Tazmaniacs 19:11, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: when i write wikipedia you can read it as the Gospel;) ok, maybe not the gospel;). i'll chet it out better. i collected so many source;( i have hundreds of page to read, a book to find, and some people to ask about. i think we have now enought material to make a great enciclopedic article. so i'd just concentrate on putting all sections up to date and at the best prose we can. does anybody have anything to argue if i eventually move the "investiation on nasr" on his very page? Teardrop.z 00:46, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem for moving part to Nasr's page, just maybe keep a short sentence here (articles are supposed to be autonomous on Wikipedia). Tazmaniacs 22:08, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's worth pointing out that Lady is not actually wanted in the United States.  The photo is a graphic used by Indymedia to illustrate their story, nothing more.  Ford MF 05:49, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, it boggles my mind that Wikipedia would ever use Indymedia as a source, since it's basically a journalism Wiki, being completely open source (and often not even requiring registration), and Wikipedia has explicit rules about not using other Wikis as references for information.  Yet somehow Indymedia is okay?  Weird.  Ford MF 06:01, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not "Indymedia", it's on a case-by-case basis. This particular article is quite researched and has links to Der Spiegel & others articles. Furthermore, I'll point out that in anti-globalization events, journalists from important media sometimes get their information at... Indymedia centers! As I say, it's on a case-by-case basis. Tazmaniacs 16:33, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Journalists sometimes get their information from Wikipedia too.  That doesn't mean Wikipedia is an acceptable source for a newspaper article, just that some journalists are really bad at their jobs.  Ford MF 04:31, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bob Lady Pic