Talk:Tim Johnson (Illinois politician)

message: If someone wants to create a paragraph or two about his Illinois house record, I will not object to re adding the following trivia, which I just remove from the lead paragraph. It certainly doesn't belong in the lead, and only becomes noteworthy when talking about the 2000 campaign or his 1980 term in the Illinois house. Since this article talks about neither, I don't think it should be in the lead. --Dual Freq 02:48, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The October 2000 issue of Illinois Issues reported that in 1980, Johnson lodged a paper clip into his voting button so that he could vote along party lines while out of the chamber.
*I disagree; I think it is relevant. If nothing else, it speaks to the fact that he's an elected official, yet couldn't even be bothered to show up to vote. I'm pretty sure I saw it even referenced in a campaign commercial from the last election. It is a bit trivial for the lead section, and not important enough for a section of it's own. I've renamed the first section to "Congressional career", and dropped it at the end of that section. eaolson 03:28, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Only one problem, it wasn't during his congressional career, the source says it was in the Illinois house, the state legislature. It also says it was used in an opponents campaign commercials during the 2000 election. Do you really think that an encyclopedia would print a 6 year old accusation by an opponent about a 26 year old activity in the state legislature? The only way this item has any context is in a detailed section about his time in the legislature. Adding it in its current form lends undue weight to it. If it is notable, it is only notable in the context of the 2000 election, which is barely mentioned or the context of his 26 year legislature tenure, which is only mentioned in passing here. --Dual Freq 11:05, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, the source doesn't even take a position on if the paper clip statement is even true, it simply describes a campaign advertisement. --Dual Freq 11:28, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

text: It is notable insofar as it speaks to the character of the man.  Note that the source never questions the veracity of the photo.  That it happened to be brought to the public's attention by the advertisement does not strip the issue of its noteworthiness.  That said, its position at the top of the article did lend the issue undue weight, and moving it to the section concerning his congressional career without tieing it in to the race was inappropriate.  Cleaned up the ref and citation, moved into seperate subcategory along with one other point about his early legislative career.  Hopefully someone will have a source or two that can speak to his positions and actions in the Statehouse, but at least there's something now.  MrZaiustalk 01:09, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, there's something there now, its explained at WP:NPOV#Undue weight. Is this "photo" a re-enacted photo to "simulate" a historical incident or a real photo? Campaign advertisements are known for dramatizing things there is no info on if this was a real photo from the source. Also, which button is the "vote along party lines" button, I thought it was yes or no, not vote democrat or vote republican. To represent 24 years of state legislative service with a single incident smacks of bias to me. I'm sure it will be in his Britannica bio. --Dual Freq 01:24, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Contacted article's author (now with the Chicago Sun) for clarification, and, if he has one, a second source.  That said, it is my opinion that the undue weight given to the paperclip issue was  greatly diminished by moving it out of the introduction.  The point continues to merit coverage, insofar as his 26 year tenure in the Statehouse warrants any coverage.  It is the only truly unique and interesting point I've ever seen made about his service there.  As far as other encyclopedias go, Johnson probably doesn't merit coverage at all in the Encyclopedia Britannica.  To date, no article about the man exists in that publication. MrZaiustalk 03:29, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This is increasingly unlikely to be relevant, but the Johnson campaign responded to media inquiries about the "paperclip incident" at the time by pointing out that most of his electoral challengers since 1980 had tried to use it against him, and the voters had never cared before, so they would not care now.  Obviously the results bear this out, though his victory margin over Kelleher was the smallest of any of his victories (53/47), for what that is worth about this issue (not much). 174.21.85.194 (talk) 05:12, 21 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Paper clip line

message: I don't really care about the issue; I don't think it's unreasonable to mention that he goes by "Tim" at least sometimes. One of the recent reverts says he uses Timothy on his official website, which is at least in part incorrect. As you can see by his bio page , it consistently refers to him as "Tim". eaolson 04:44, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What triggered my revert-reflex was that the change was made in the opening of the article and the name in the infobox, both of which should match the article name.  Wouldn't do any harm to refer to him as "Tim" elsewhere in the article. MrZaiustalk 04:51, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "Tim" vs. Timothy

message: Is there more information about his military experience? Did he graduate West Point, and serve in the Army? Should he be place in :Category:Members of the 110th United States Congress who have served in the United States Military? Isaac Crumm 15:29, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Military

message: The section on his political positions gives little information on what he has supported, what he has sponsored, what certain groups say he's done right, and only information on liberal groups giving him low ratings on various issues (not surprising because he's a Republican).  The section needs to be more balanced.---Gloriamarie 17:34, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Got some sources on what he's actually done? If so, you should definitely add them. Any excessive focus on criticism has more to do with the fact that it's easier to find than anything else. I dug around a little before the election, but wasn't able to find much, especially in the big news sources. Still can't find anything but passing reference to elections and a couple old press releases on Google News' archives. Made slightly more difficult by the Senator of the same name. MrZaiustalk 18:04, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Undue weight/bias

message: Any updates? MrZaiustalk 22:45, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Only that I added an otheruses template to distinguish him from the Senator Tim Johnson of S.D., and did likewise on Tim Johnson (politician)  ;)  216.201.119.71 (talk) 21:42, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: 2008

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 5 external links on Tim Johnson (Illinois politician). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20061013222810/http://www.vote-smart.org/bio.php?can_id=BS024447 to http://www.vote-smart.org/bio.php?can_id=BS024447
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20061028190357/http://www.house.gov/timjohnson/about/index.shtml to http://www.house.gov/timjohnson/about/index.shtml
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060601042330/http://www.opensecrets.org/bigpicture/stats.asp?cycle=2004&display=A&type=R to http://www.opensecrets.org/bigpicture/stats.asp?cycle=2004&display=A&type=R
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120406081506/http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entries/report-gop-rep-tim-johnson-to-retire-suddenly to http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entries/report-gop-rep-tim-johnson-to-retire-suddenly
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20091119145247/http://www.hrc.org/about_us/7194.htm to http://www.hrc.org/about_us/7194.htm
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The article mentions that Tim has nine children, but does not mention their mother's or Tim's wives' names, which seems like an unusual oversight. PlaysInPeoria (talk) 03:53, 20 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Personal Life