Talk:Mark Howe

message: I've thought for many years that one of the biggest HHOF screwjobs was that Mark Howe hadn't been a first- or second-ballot inductee.  Well done.   ῲ Ravenswing ῴ  12:53, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Now this is more like it. 

message: Centpacrr, I know you're not a fan of WP:V, and place greater reliance on your personal friendship with hockey figures, but this is why we check things first, and an example why personal recollections aren't reliable.  It took me all of 20 seconds to toodle over to hockey-reference.com and verify that Howe is, indeed, the career leader in shorthanded goals by a defenseman.  Paul Coffey is the next highest with 20.  I expect that Howe was unaware of it because it's not the sort of career record that gets bruited about; I remember vividly the interview with Val Fonteyne in which Fonteyne was startled to find he'd been the least penalized player of all time.   Ravenswing   13:34, 16 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't have a problem with including information like this as long as it is reliably sourced. I did not find such an "official record" listed by the NHL for career SHGs either by player or by position, and so asked Howie about it when I had dinner with him last night in the Flyers pressroom before their game with the Red Wings if he knew anything about his having such a record. He said he did not, and that he only knew that he shared a Flyers single season record for SHG with Mike Richards. What was there before had no sourcing. As you have now added a link to one (which is all that WP requires for such an entry) I see no problem with including this information even though the NHL does not list SHGs by position among its official records. I've sent Howie an email letting him know that he holds this unofficial NHL mark, however you should also be aware that Howie did not play his entire career as a defenseman but was also a left wing for a good bit of it as well. I have therefore sent him a note asking if the change from left wing to defense was made while still in the WHA, or if he played wing in the NHL as well. Centpacrr (talk) 14:42, 16 March 2016 (UTC)

text: * He played some at left wing -- not much -- his first couple seasons in the NHL, which I took into account; he scored four SHG in those first three seasons, which even had he been credited as a left wing in all three of those years would still put him comfortably ahead of Coffey.   Ravenswing   16:09, 16 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: *That being the case, listing the number of SHGs Howie scored in the NHL as a defenseman as "28" as making him "career leader for shorthanded goals by a defenseman" with that number is really speculative and unproven if there is evidence that he may have scored one of more as a forward, and that caveat should therefore be included in the entry if it is to be retained. I'll await to hear what Howie says in response to my email before deciding how to do that. Centpacrr (talk) 17:07, 16 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: *Per email from Mark Howe on March 16, 2016: "I played about 4 games while with Hartford at LW and also spent about 10 games as a Flyer on RW with B(ob) Clarke. A (Coach Bob) McCammon experiment that went awry." Entry annotated accordingly with explanation and wikilink. Centpacrr (talk) 21:19, 16 March 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shorthanded goals record 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: No no no!! Mark Howe cannot have ANY rookie records from his 1979-80 inaugural season, since WHA players were not considered "rookies" in 1979 when WHA and NHL merged. (For example, Gretzky's 137 points in his first NHL season is not a rookie record for that same reason - Selanne's 132 points is.)
----  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.240.253.128 (talk) 02:11, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  There has been a terrible mistake!