Talk:Michael Jackson/Archive 4

message: In an effort to put equal weighing on music career and person life, I rewrote the intro but have not edited it yet. Before I do that I need to know what you think of this introductory sectence in regardes to NPOV.
Michael Joseph Jackson (born August 29 1958), variously known as The King of Pop or Wacko Jacko, is an American musician whose controversial personal life and successful music career have been at the forefront of pop culture for the last quarter-century.
Street walker 02:46, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: The Intro

message: In actually Michael Jackson has received 18 grammy awards. Check Qunicy Jones' awards and you will see that four other awrads have been put under Qunicy Jones' name, even though MJ's name is there.
Neverland
All over the walls of my room are pictures of Peter Pan. I've read everything that Barrie wrote. I totally identify with Peter Pan, the lost boy from Never Neverland." (Michael Jackson)
The first time Michael saw the beautiful valley of Santa Ynez, 150 kilometers away from Santa Barbara in California, was in 1983 during the production of the video "Say Say Say" with Paul McCartney. In 1988 he could buy the "Sycomore Valley Ranch" in neighbourhood to Ronald and Nancy Reagan. A new name was quickly found - Neverland Valley Ranch inspired from one of his most beloved books Peter Pan. Michael made the ranch to a kind of paradise. It's a full scale amusement park with Ferris Wheel, The Wipeout, Bumper cars and Sea Dragon. And it's also a colourful park with thousends of flowers, statues, little forrests and lakes. In a zoo you can find many animals like monkeys, lions, white tigers, elephants and many cats, who are living in the yalley. There is also an private film theater and, of course, Michael's house. Some people wonder about this "childishness". But Michael claims, that he compensates his own lost childhood. "Well, it brings out the child that lives in everybody. I love rides and things like that and I share it with the children." But he not uses all this only for himself and his own children. Every three weeks the parks opens the doors for ill or underpriviledged children.
Car bumpers enjoy!"People wonder why I always have children around, because I find the thing that I never had through them, you know Disneyland, amusement parks, arcade games. I adore all that stuff because when I was little it was always work, work, work from one concert to the next, if it wasn't a concert it was the recording studio, if it wasn't that it was TV shows or interviews or picture sessions. There was always something to do." "We have children that come who are - who intravenously - they are very sick, bedridden."
In Neverland "I'm trying to imitate Jesus in the fact that he said to be like children, to love children, to be as pure as children, and to make yourself as innocent and to see the world through eyes of wonderment and the whole magical quality of it all and I love that. And we'll have like a hundred bald headed children, they all have cancer, and they're all running around.
 
What Michael is thinking about art
I am committed to my art. I believe that all art has as its ultimate goal the union between the material and the spiritual, the human and the divine. I believe that to be the reason for the very existence of art. (1993)
Songwriting is a very frustrating art form. You have to get on tape exactly what's playing in your head. When I hear it up here in my head, it's wonderful. I have to transcribe that onto tape. "The Girl is Mine" wasn't completely what I wanted, but it's very nice. But "Billie Jean" is there. I worked so hard on that. I worked for three weeks on the bass lick alone. (1999)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about family
I love my family very much. I wish I could see them a little more often than I do. But we understand because we're a show business family and we all work. We do have family day when we all get together, we pick a person's house, it might be Jermaine's house or Marlon's house or Tito's house and everyone will come together in fellowship and love each other and talk and catch up on who's doing what. (1993)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about Cartoons
I'm a collector of cartoons. All the Disney stuff, Bugs Bunny, the old MGM ones. It's real escapism, it's like everything's alright. It's like the world is happening now in a far away city. Everything's fine.
I like Batman a lot... If I could choose one, it would be Morph, from the X-Men. He can become anything ... He constantly transforms himself. I think he can even teleport, which is interesting and exciting to me. He's not as popular as the others, but that makes him exciting. (1995)
I love movies my dream is to make films, not only act and sing but to produce them as well. And I love animation. (1995)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about himself
I do disguises for different reasons. I like to study people - be like the fly on the wall. Even if it's two old ladies sitting on a bench or some kids on a swing. Because I don't know what it's like to fit in an everyday life situation. (1999)
One time I was in a record store, completely disguised, and these girls were pulling out my album, talking all about me. I was literally next to them. It was wonderful. I loved it. But if I go out as myself, I can't have fun. People always say, "Why don't we just go to a party?" Soon as I step in, the party's over -for me. It's a party for them, but they are all putting their cards on my face, saying, "Remember me? I met you four years ago at…" and I say, "I don't remember." So I can't enjoy the experience. They play all my songs. I didn't come to hear my music. And everybody starts chanting "Dance!" "Well, I want to see YOU dance for a change." (1999)
I'm never pleased with anything, I'm a perfectionist, it's part of who I am. (1993) 
I believe in my work, like I said, I have great confidence in my dreams. When I have a great idea I have an iron will. (1995)
It's sad to get caught up in the past. That's why I don't put awards in my house. No gold records, no Grammys. They are in storage. I don't like to be puffed up with pride, 'cause i'd feel like I don't have anymore things to reach for. And that's not true. (1999)
Well, I usually am happy. I don't let anything get me down, no matter what. I like to hear the sound of water and birds chirping and laughter, you know. I love all the real natural, innocent things. I would never go to a party or a club. I did that when I was a kid, and I don't care to do it anymore. (1999) 
 
 
What Michael is thinking about being on stage 
When we do a concert, and there's like a hundred thousand people out there, and you see a sea of people singing there, all in unison, holding up candles, and, you go, wow! You know it's, it really makes your heart happy and that's what really makes me feel like everything's OK. (1995)
I wouldn't say I was sexy! But I guess that's fine if that's what they say. I like that in concert. That's neat. (1983)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about music
To be honest, my first love and appreciation for music was classical, in kindergarten. I used to listen to Tchaikovsky every day. The great writing of Richard Rodgers and Oscar Hammerstein, and many others. I love the showtunes. (1995)
We never had music or dance lessons in our house, ever. We were a family that sang all the time. We watched television. We would entertain ourselves... We would take all the furniture out of the living room and dance. I think you're pretty much born with a gift and you are compelled to create. That is what I have always felt. I remember making up songs when I was really little. I remember when I was little there was rain outside and we would make up songs. Janet and I would have a songwriting game while we washed the dishes...while we were cleaning. I think most kids don't do that these days. It was our destiny. (1995)
The process [in creating a ryhythm] is creating a vocal rhythm to a click track - which is a sound, a timed beat. And you're doing these mouth sounds to that beat. These sounds can be looped according to how you sample it in the computer again and again. This is your foundation for the entire track - everything plays off this. It's the rhythm, like the beatbox rhythm. Every song I've written since I was very little I've done that way. I still do it that way. (1995)
Music started with nature. Music is nature. Birds make music. Oceans make music. Wind makes music, Any natural sound is music. And that's where it started.. You see, we're just making a replica of nature, which is the sounds we hear outside. (1999)
I just try to write wonderful music; and if they love it, they love it. I don't think about any demographic. The record company tries to get me to think that way, but I just do what I would enjoy hearing. (1999)
I think the best work is coming, but I would like to go into other areas, not keep doing album after pop album. (1999)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about ignorance
I'm prejudiced against ignorance. That's what I'm mainly prejudiced against. It's only ignorance and it's taught because it's not genetic at all. The little children in those countries aren't prejudiced. I would like for you to put this in quotes, too. I'm really not a prejudiced person at all. I believe that people should think about God more and creation. ... Look at the many wonders inside the human body-the different colors of organs, colors of blood-and all these different colors do a different thing in the human body. It's the most incredible system in the world; it makes an incredible building, the human being. And if this can happen with the human body, why can't we do it as people? And that's how I feel. And that's why I wish the world could do more. That's the only thing I hate. I really do. (1984)
 
 
 
What Michael is thinking about religion
I believe in the Bible and I try to follow the Bible. I know I'm an imperfect person... I'm not making myself an angel because I'm not an ngel and I'm not a devil either. I try to be the best I can and I try to do what I think is right. It's that simple. And I do believe in God. (1984)
I pray every night. I don't just pray at night. I pray at different times during the day. When I see something beautiful, whenever I see beautiful scenery - like when I'm flying or something - I say, oh, God, that's beautiful. And I always say little prayers like that all through the day. I love beauty. (1984)
 
 
 
What Michael is thinking about animals
I find in animals the same thing I find so wonderful in children. That purity, that honesty, where they don't judge you, they just want to be your friend. I think that is so sweet. (1993)
God created animals and they are loving, they are beautiful. I feel the way anthropologist Jane Goodall does, or any of those naturalists. I don't find my interest in animal weird or strange at all. (1999)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about drugs
In the field I'm in, there is a lot of that and it gets offered to me all the time. People even go as far as to just... stick it in your pocket and walk off. Now, if it was a good thing, they wouldn't do that... I mean, would somebody drop something beautiful in my pocket and just walk off? But I don't want to have anything to do with any of that. I mean, as corny as it sounds, but this is how I really believe: Natural highs are the greatest highs in the world... Who wants to take something and just sit around for the rest of the day after you take it [drugs], and don't know who you are, what you're doing, where you are? Take in something that's gonna inspire you to do greater things in the world. (1984)
 
 
What Michael is thinking about politics
I never get into politics. But I think music soothes the savage beast. If you put cells under a microscope and you put music on, you'll see them move and start to dance. It affects the soul.... I hear music in everything. (1992)
 
=== Sources ===
*Mjcafe.net] - All quotes acquired from this site.
Barney's Musical Castle 'LIVE' was Barney's Concert and international
*This is Wikipedia, the encyclopaedia.  For the collection of quotations, see Wikiquote. Uncle G 18:04, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Important

message: *Mjcafe.net] - All quotes acquired from this site.
Barney's Musical Castle 'LIVE' was Barney's Concert and international
*This is Wikipedia, the encyclopaedia.  For the collection of quotations, see Wikiquote. Uncle G 18:04, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources 

message: This is a collection of what other celebrities have said about Michael Jackson. 
AJ (singer; Backstreet Boys)
He is what every artist looks up to...to be... one time become the next King of Pop. 
[source: Pro7; World Music Awards 2000] 
Dr. Eugene Aksenoff 
Just last month I saw Michael Jackson again. He was in Japan with his children. Prince, his 15-month-old son, had high fever and cramp. Michael had not slept the whole night. He's really devoted to the children. 
[source: Reuters; August 1998] 
Anastacia (singer)
Actually, when Michael Jackson called, it was all leading up to the fact that when I did the show "The Cut", which was the star search kind of show, I was proposed to by a lot of record companies being interested in wanting me to sign with them. In the process of all those meetings and stuff, I was meeting with MJJ, so it was inevitable to meet the presidents of all of these labels because I was starting to get to that point. Michael Jackson was one of these people that I had to meet, as well as Tommy and Bob Jamieson and the presidents of all the great record companies, so it really was a professional situation. It wasn't like "I'm a really big fan and I want to have you autograph everything that I own", it was a phone call of admiration from a performer to a performer, as a president to an artist wanting to be signed, as an artist looking at what a label has to offer, it was that kind of conversation, but what a light conversation! He was laughing, I was laughing, we were having a great time. It was so wonderful to be able to speak to him. He's so inspiring and what a genius! Forever I'll remember that I got to speak with him on the phone. If I never get to meet him or even work with him in the future, it's the beauty of being able to be recognised by something like that. 
[source: Radio Undercover] 
During an online chat Anastacia did at MSN she was asked which artist would be a dream come true for her to work with: "There's so many. I think any artist would be a dream, but it would fulfill a dream to be on the stage with Michael Jackson." 
[source: Anastacia] 
David Arquette (actor)
I remember when I first saw the Michael Jackson "Thriller" video. I couldn't believe that a guy would go out and put so much into a video, and the zombies and all that stuff. I believe it had a solo impact on my decision to be involved with the "Scream" movies. 
[source: MTV; March 2000] 
Fred Astaire (dancer & actor)
You are a hell of a mover. Man you really put them on their asses last night. You're an angry dancer. I'm the same way. I used to do the same thing with my cane...You're a hell of a mover! 
[source: The day after seeing MJ perform at 'Motown 25'] 
Dallas Austin (songwriter/producer, worked on 'HIStory')
Working with Michael is a different type of work. You're pressured timewise, but not by creativity or money. So you're left with mad freedom. You'd think he'd be very controlling, but if he likes you enough to work with you, he wants your expertise, not just another Michael Jackson record. "Heal the World" and "Stranger in Moscow" from the HIStory record are, like, the makeup of Michael. I think he's taken on the responsibility to make changes in the world. He's the only real superhero. Think about it. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Jennifer Batten (guitarist on several MJ world tours)
He completely changed my life, you know, I was doing the L.A. club scene, just trying to make ends meet and BAM - I'm on a paid vacation around the world having just the time of my life playing in the biggest band in the world. And yeah, I'll always feel an intense gratitude and love for him for that. 
[source: Entertainment Tonight; July 16, 1997] 
Tracy Bingham (actress)
Question: What are you looking forward to tonight? 
Tracy Bingham: Actually, you know what...I have never ever met Michael Jackson. I love him. And just being in the same room as Michael Jackson is enough for me. So I can't wait to see him. 
[source: Pro7, World Music Awards 2000] 
Rabbi Shmuley Boteach
We talk about everything from love and relationships to spiritual healing. I have great admiration and respect for Michael. From what I gather, he is very unfairly represented. His kindness strikes me more than anything. He is extremely interested in spiritual things. I’ve been to Michael Jackson’s home and I’ve given him lessons from the Torah. It’s not that he is interested in converting. He just has avery admirable interest in learning. When I speak with Michael about Judaism, he just wants to hear more and more. It’s not that I am such a great teacher. It is his sincere curiosity. I don’t think you should judge Michael by his eccentricities. Who isn’t eccentric? 
[source: ABC News, CNN, WENN; October 1999] 
BoyzIIMen (R&B group)
We share his concern for the children who have been innocent victims of war and, who have suffered because of the horrors of war, many of whom are without families, food or homes. We applaud Michael for his sensitivity and efforts. 
[source: Universal Records Press Release; July 1999] 
Brandy (singer)
Michael Jackson, he is just like; he is the king of it all. Everything that everyone's doing now, he's already done. He's opened a lot of doors for a lot of artists today. 
[source: VH1's special "100 Greatest Artists of Rock & Roll"; May 1, 1998] 
Garth Brooks (country singer)
With that numbers stuff [record sales], you just have to take it with a grain of salt. Yeah, you feel proud, but the true guy in you has to say 'Come on ... You're not really on the level of the Beatles.' For me as a fan ... the Beatles, Michael Jackson, you can stick Elvis Presley in there, James Taylor, Billy Joel and 100 more guys in there that I think are on a level Garth will never get to 'cause I'm such a huge fan of these people. 
[source: Reuters; May 1998] 
Naomi Campbell (supermodel/actress, appeared in 'In the Closet' video, 1992)
Michael is very involved and on top of everything he puts his name on. He's shy and sweet, considering all he's accomplished, but he's a prankster. When I was doing the video, we had water pistol fights. He's a perfectionist. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Niel Rogers Chick
Michael has always been one of those artists that I personally cannot believe. I can't believe how great he is, and I quite frankly have always been in awe of Michael's talent. 
[source: VH1's special "100 Greatest Artists of Rock & Roll"; May 1, 1998] 
Ice Cube (rap artist)
[About the 'Thriller' video:] I was glued, I couldn't believe what I was seeing. I would just sit there and wait days and days and days to see the "Thriller" video again. I couldn't wait to see it again from start to finish. 
[source: MTV; March 2000] 
Macaulay Culkin (actor)
In an interview published in the New York magazine, actor Macaulay Culkin described Michael Jackson as among his very best friends in the world. "We had very similar experiences in childhood. We're both going to be 8 years old forever in some place because we never had a chance to be 8 when we actually were." They first became friends when he was 9 and he and his family were invited to Neverland. Culkin said, "It was a child's dream, with every kind of soda in the world there, every kind of candy. A two-floor arcade, a carnival and a movie theater" 
"Neverland is still the only place on earth where I feel absolutely, 100 percent comfortable." 
[Source: New York magazine May 7,2001] 
Dalvin DeGrate (Soul/R&B group 'Jodeci')
Michael is my favorite artist. I formed my harmonies and melodies based on his music. 
[source: Billboard; April 2000] 
Kevin Dorsey (HIStory tour assistant musical director)
He is such an open person when it comes to his creativity, umm, he expects nothing of us that he doesn't expect of himself. 
[source: Entertainment Tonight; July 16, 1997] 
Missy Elliot (rapper)
I don't look at it as he is not the hottest thing any more - I look at what he's done as a groundbreaking artist who opened a lot of doors for black acts. Michael Jackson is still amazing to me. 
[source: Entertainment Weekly; November 1999] 
Kenny Gamble (producer on the Jacksons' 'Destiny' album, 1978)
When we took Michael in the studio tooverdub his voice, he had so many different ideas about songs, writing, and producing, I told him he could really record himself. He was very curious about a lot of things. He's a creative, spiritual, caring person. Nineteen eighty-one's "Rock With You" is the most what Michael's about. I really believe he and Quincy have a magic together. Michael is a miracle. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Genuwine (R&B singer)
If it weren't for Michael Jackson, a lot of us wouldn't be here. People talk all this junk about Michael, but he's cool with me. He opened a lot of doors for the rest of us. [I] knew what I wanted to do this the night I saw Michael Jackson on the 'Motown 25' TV special. He's the one that made me realize that was what I wanted to do. 
[source: September 1997] 
M.C. Hammer (singer)
Just a phenomenal artist, the [word] speaks for itself. You don't go much beyond Michael Jackson when it comes to performing and making good records. 
[source: VH1's special "100 Greatest Artists of Rock & Roll"; May 1, 1998] 
Mary Hart (co-host of 'Entertainment Tonight')
It's a pretty awesome experience to watch him rehearse. He knows exactly what he wants and how to get it. He's very much in charge. 
[source: while visiting tour rehearsals in Pensacola, Florida; February 1988] 
Heavy D (label executive, rapped on 'Jam,' 1991)
I was in California the first time I heard Michael Jackson wanted to record with me. I was, like, Nah, no way, he's too big, it can't be true. Then I got a call from Michael's people at my hotel telling me he was interested. But I still wasn't believing it-I thought they were setting me up for a TV practical jokes show. So me and my partner go to the place, and while we were waiting we were talking and cursing up a storm-I was thinking that if it was a blooper show, they wouldn't be able to use it. Then Michael called and said he was on his way. When he got there he was just, like, `Hey, how ya doin?' 
Michael's just as regular as everyone else. We talked about all the normal stuff guys talk about. He's real smart. People forget that he's the most incredible entertainer we've seen in our lifetime. His name is Michael Jackson, not Super Michael Jackson. He makes mistakes just like all of us. My favorite Michael Jackson song is "Music and Me." It's an old one, about him and his music, his love for music, and the time they've had together. It's like a song that would be sung to a girl, but it's all about music. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Darrin Henson (choreographer)
Question: Did you go to a dance school and if so...where? 
Darrin Henson: No, I studied all Michael Jackson's videos and that is how I got my moves. 
Question: Darrin, has it been intimidating to work with people like Prince and Michael Jackson? 
Darrin Henson: No, Prince is a great dancer and a great person. He knows what he wants and can move great. Michael is also a great dancer. He loves to listen to the moves and then, in seconds, he is dancing just like you want. 
[source: Monday Night Backstage Chat at Voice of Dance; 2000] 
Andy Hernandez (rock group 'Kid Creole & The Coconuts')
As a performer who believes in injecting high energy into a show, I can appreciate more than most what goes into the making of a Michael Jackson performance. The dictionary should contain another word that means 'great, superb, professional, energetic, entertaining' and that word should be 'michael-jackson'. 
[source: after attending a concert of The Jacksons in Philadelphia; September 1984] 
Cynthia Horner (editor of 'Right On!' magazine)
He's usually quiet and rather humble. However, it may sound strange to say but people feel energy drwaing from him, almost as though he's endowed with superhuman powers. People are usually so struck by him that they cannot even speak. Indeed, Michael weaves a magic spell over his fans. Michael seems to be more open and outgoing around children, especially those he knows very well. Michael Jackson on stage is as good as it gets! 
[source: after being backstage at a concert in London; 1988] 
Leon Huff (producer on the Jacksons' 'Destiny' album, 1978)
When Michael and his brothers first came to Philadelphia, Gamble decided to walk them from the hotel to the studio. As they were walking, they were rushed by a group of girls. The brothers escaped by going into a movie theater. Once they made it to the studio, these girls camped outside the studio-and this was for a six-month period. To see 100 girls laying outside a studio at 3 and 4 in the morning for Michael and his brothers was something else. 
My favorite Michael song? Nineteen eighty-seven's "Show You the Way to Go." 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Jerry Inzerillo (US millionaire & hotelier, long-time friend of MJ)
While the artistry of Michael Jackson is so celebrated... his empathy is not recognized as much as it should be. 
[source: October 1997] 
John Isaac (photographer)
It's all lies. A lot of it, they just make up stories and that bothers me, and I am sure it bothers Michael so much. 
[source: Entertainment Tonight; July 15, 1997] 
Janet Jackson (singer, MJ's sister)
Some days ago he had someone send me an enormous basket, full of candles (he does it all the time) with, in the middle of it, two magnificient dogs. It was adorable! We have been brought up like that: We are trying to find our places but we adore each other. 
[source: press conference in Paris, France; August 25, 2000] 
2001 - Janet Jackson spoke about brother Michael in two interviews that aired in spring of 2001: Prime Time Live, and MTV Icon. Janet speaks about her family, Michael as a father, and the life changing advice she received from brother Michael. We have excerpted portions of these interviews. 
Jimmy Jam (producer/songwriter)
Michael's the most intense person I've worked with. For him, everything is about the music and how to make it better. He also makes work a lot of fun. He's a kid at heart-his office is not like a normal office. He has all the kids' toys. A lot of times we'd be in session, in the middle of playing a video game, and he'd be, like, "Well, we got to do this. But go ahead and finish your game, though-I don't want to mess your game up. 
The thing about Michael is his talent. If you put Michael onstage without the explosions and the other dancers, he'll still command the stage. 
There's a song called "Childhood" on the new album, and I think for the first time, Michael has put a lot of his feelings on record. That song, for right now, defineswhere he's at-the way he feels about himself and the way people feel about him. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
JC (singer, 'N Sync)
I would love to record something with Sting or Seal. We all dream of recording a song with Janet or Michael Jackson. 
[source: dpa; February 2000] 
Rodney Jerkins (music producer)
I was a huge fan of Michael since I was a little kid, I followed his career...everything he's ever done........He is the best, there's no other artist at his level, and I worked with many, he is great to work with because he knows exactly what he wants. 
[source: April 1999] 
I'm blessed to even be in the position to work with the greatest entertainer of all time. Just to be working with him is a phenomenon itself, you know, a dream come true. [...] You have people that grew up with Mike that wanna hear him do the "Off The Wall" and "Thriller" type stuff and we are gonna do that but at the same time I'm also trying to do things that kids of today, that don't know who Michael is, will understand. That he is the greatest. 
Interviewer: So, does Michael come into the studio with a surgical mask on? 
Jerkins: No, no. Michael is probably more human than any of us at this party. And that's what a lot of people don't know of. You know, I really know Michael. [...] So it's my responsibility to - we don't want to change that - you know. Not just be a producer in the studio but also be the friend to Michael and say: "Michael, it's cool to come to this party here tonight. It's cool to hang out with me, you know. They are not gonna bother you if you hang out here." [...] I've taken him to places where ... you know parties .. and a lot of people are coming up to him and it gets hectic and I understand why he kind of stays in. But at the same time, you know, he is feeling more comfortable to even step out now. [...] He is a good person. He is not what everybody wants him to be. They want him to be a wacko. You know how it is once you are so successful. They have to find where they can pull you down. He's not like that." 
[source: The Doug Banks Show; February 2000] 
Elton John (singer, songwriter)
He is a very smart cookie, Michael. He knows what he wants, he knows what he is doing. I have nothing but admiration. Also, he is a very kind person. 
[source: VH1's special "100 Greatest Artists of Rock & Roll"; May 1, 1998] 
Quincy Jones (music producer)
Introverted, shy and nonassertive. He wasn't at all sure he could make a name for himself on his own. Neither was I. 
[source: Life magazine September 1997 special issue - "Life Legends: the Century's Most Unforgettable Faces"] 
Michael can go out and perform before 90,000 people, but if I ask him to sing a song for me, I have to sit on the couch with my hands over my eyes and he goes behind the couch. He is amazingly shy. What people forget about him is that for the first time, probably in the history of music, a black artist is embraced on a global level by everyone from eight to 80 years old. People all over the world, especially young people, have a black man as an idol. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
R. Kelly (singer/songwriter/producer, worked on 'HIStory')
[...] I grew up with the music of Michael and I've been inspired a great deal by Michael. To actually have him call me up, call my management, saying he wants me to do a song for him was a great inspiration for me to go forward in my career. And up to the day I met him it was like a big countdown. I think it's normal when you grow up to the music of someone that has been there so long and is so large. To meet this person and knowing that this person depends on me. When an artist calls a producer he makes himself dependent on him to become # 1, to get something that comes out as a track. At this time, Michael Jackson depended on me to make something come true for him. 
I remember a funny thing about him. I had ordered Chinese food and had put up all these Walt Disney cups all over the studio because I knew he was a big kid. I knew that. Everyone knew that. And I also got my little dog because I knew he loved animals. I couldn't afford giraffes, but I did have a dog. It broke ice and we talked. And I went to the bathroom and my manager came with me, and I remember that I fell to the floor because I just couldn't believe it. But I got back up and straightened myself out because I realized that I had to be professional. [...] It's always great to work with someone who is wonderful because they bring you forward. Michael was very humble. He also didn't wanna change anything. Some artists want to change songs so that they like them, but I don't go for that. I don't want to destroy the magic. I don't like messing with the magic and what you risk to reach something is what you need to keep it. Michael figured this also. 
[source: VIVA; October 1999] 
I thought it was funny when I told Michael Jackson I didn't want to fly, and he was giving me reasons why I should. I kept looking him in the eye, and I kept saying "uh-huh, uh-huh" and "oh, I see," knowing all the time that I would not be getting on a plane. Working with Michael was definitely not just another day at the office. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Question: So it was cool working with Michael? 
R. Kelly: I was so nervous, I was afraid I wouldn't be able to finish the project. When he first got to the studio, something weird came over me. Michael was another level, and it was a hell of a level to go to. But passion took over, and it put a shield around me and allowed me to be just a normal guy who felt like he worked with Michael all the time. 
Question: Was he really receptive, or was he, like, "No, muhfucka, I've been doing this for 30 years." 
R. Kelly: He was never that. That's why he's been here for 30 years. He was more humble than me-got up under my wing. He wanted to know what it was I wanted from him. And if he could give it to me. 
Question: How did that feel? 
R. Kelly: Everything Mrs. McLin told me was true: I was born for this. I was ready. I didn't know that until I met Michael. My teacher told me when I was 15 that one day I would work with Michael Jackson, that one day I'd produce him, and that Quincy Jones would come to me for songs, and Stevie Wonder. I haven't worked with Stevie yet, but she told me these things would happen, and to see them come to pass is amazing. 
[source: VIBE magazine; March 1996 
Jonathan King
Michael should have swept the board. But, this year it was the A&M and WEA record companies' turn to win and that's why Sting and Paul Simon got their awards. But you should have seen the look on their faces aftre Michael stole the show when he sang 'Man In The Mirror'. It was a look of absolute pure sheer horror. They were transfixed ny his real talent and mortified when they compared it to their own stars. It comes down to a choice between the music industry and Michael Jackson - and I'd rather have Jacko any time. 
[source: Grammy Awards; March 2, 1988] 
Ed Koch (former mayor of New York City)
He really is the supreme theatrical dancer - like Fred Astaire. 
[source: NY Post; March 1988] 
Sean Lennon (singer - son of John Lennon)
If it wasn't for Michael Jackson, I probably wouldn't make music now. Thriller changed my life completely." 
[source: 'US' magazine; October 1998] 
Vincent Mantsoe (South African dancer/choreographer)
I have always been inspired by TV. There used to be a ballet on Sundays, and I used to watch the Fame series and, of course, all Michael Jackson's music videos. But most of all, I have always been intrigued by The Dance Theatre of Harlem's Dougla; somehow it really got inside me, my mind. 
[source: South Africa's Sunday Times; February 2000] 
Ricky Martin (singer)
I need to thank my teachers. I need to thank the legends of pop. I need to thank Elvis, the Beatles, Michael Jackson, Madonna. Thank you so much for being leaders and teaching me the beauty of pop. 
[source: Reuters; while accepting an award for his hit "Livin' La Vida Loca" at the 1999 MTV Video Music Awards] 
Whoa, talking about Mr. Jackson, all my respects. He definitely has a lot to do with my career. He's the legend; El Maestro, you know? From him, we learn a lot, and definitely he will always be a part of my life. 
[source: MTV USA; November 1999] 
All that I know comes from Michael Jackson. 
[tv interview on channel RTL9; Dec. 2000] 
Jaqueline Kennedy Onassis (former 1st lady of US, editor of Moonwalk)
What can one say about Michael Jackson? He is one of the world's most acclaimed entertainers, an innovative and exciting songwriter whose dancing seems to defy gravity and has been heralded by teh likes of Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly. His public is perhaps unaware of the extent of his dedication to his craft. Restless, seldom satisfied, he is a perfectionist who is constantly challenging himself. To many people Michael Jackson seems an elusive personality, but to those who work with him, he is not. This talented artist is a sensitive man, warm, funny, and full of insight. 
[source: forward from 'Moonwalk'] 
Tatum O'Neal (actress)
I never worked with Michael, but he and I had a really wonderful friendship when I was 12 and he was 17. He used to dance with me, we'd talk on the phone all the time, and he'd say how funny it was that I was 12 and I could drive and he was older and couldn't. Michael used to come to my house when I was living with my dad, and I remember him being so shy. Once he came into my bedroom, and he wouldn't even sit on my bed. But another time when he was over, he played the drums, my brother played guitar, and someone else played another instrument, and we had a jam session. I had the tape of it, but I lost it somewhere. 
When I was 12, he asked me to go to the premiere of The Wiz with him, and my agent at the time said it wasn't a good idea, maybe because they felt he wasn't a big enough star yet. He never talked to me after that. I think he thought I just canceled, but it wasn't me at all. I was a child doing what I was told. I want you to print that, because I don't think he ever knew that. I lost touch with him because of it, so I don't really know him anymore. But I love him; he's one of the nicest, most innocent people I've ever met. I love "She's out of My Life" because I think it describes our friendship at that time. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Teddy Pendegrass (musician)
People like Michael come along once in history. He's a bonafide superstar. 
[source: VH1's special "100 Greatest Artists of Rock & Roll"; May 1, 1998] 
Prince (singer, songwriter)
Asked by a reporter if he could take Michael Jackson in a fistfight Prince laughed and quipped "Michael's not a fighter, he's a lover." (which refers to a verse from the Michael Jackson and Paul McCartney hit duet 'The Girl Is Mine' from 'Thriller'.) 
[source: Rolling Stone; press conference in New York on May 17, 2000] 
Ronald Reagan (former president of USA)
To Michael Jackson with appreciation for the outstanding example you have set for the youth of America and the world. 
[source: The Presidential Award; 1984] 
All over America, millions of peole look up to you as an example. Your deep faith in God amd adherence to traditional values are an inspiration to all of us, especially young people searching for something real to believe in. You've gained quite a number of fans along the road since I Want You Back, and Nancy and I are among them. Keep up the good work, Michael. We're very happy for you. 
[source: in a note to Michael who suffered severe burns during the filmimg of a Pepsi commercial; February 1, 1984] 
Little Richard (singer, songwriter)
Michael is fantastic. I love him. He is a great artist, one of the greatest entertainers I've ever seen. 
[source: VH1's special "100 Greatest Artists of Rock & Roll"; May 1, 1998] 
Teddy Riley (writer, composer & producer, worked on 'Dangerous' and 'HIStory' albums)
I wrote 'Remember the Time' when Michael [Jackson] told me about falling in love with [Debbie Rowe], the woman he just married. I don't know why he didn't marry her the first time around. 
[source: Los Angeles Times ; December 1996) 
He's the greatest. Innovative. Black. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Jessica Simpson (singer)
Question: Who would you most want to do a duet with? 
Jessica Simpson: Some of my favorites...I was thinking about this the other day. Michael Jackson would be the ultimate. I wouldn't mind Celine Dion or Shania Twain, either! 
[source: Zoog Disney; June 26, 2000] 
Slash (Guns N' Roses guitarist, played on 'Dangerous' and 'HIStory')
He's a fucking brilliant entertainer, a complete natural. He's the only guy I've ever met that's real-for that kind of music. I grew up listening to the Jackson 5. I used to love "Dancing Machine. 
We've been friends for a while, so he just lets me do what I want to do. I get a basic framework, and I just make up my part and they edit it. I wonder sometimes what it's gonna sound like, [Laughs] but every time, they do a great job. He's very shrewd. He's got a great, sarcastic sense of humor. People always ask me, "Is he weird?" Well, he's different. But I know what it's like to be weird, growing up in the music business. 
I have to admit working with Michael Jackson is different than working with your basic, gritty rock 'n' roll band. One time when I went to play for Michael, he walked in with Brooke Shields, and there I am with a cigarette in one hand, a bottle of Jack Daniel's in the other, and my guitar hanging low around my neck. And he doesn't care. That's not the way he is, but I don't have to change for him. He accepts me for what I am. 
[source: VIBE magazine; June/July 1995] 
Steven Spielberg (film director) 
Michael Jackson, the star, is a phenomenon. The hat, a single glove, white socks and black loafers. He is mysterious. Theatrical. The consummate performer. From the way he moves, to the Neverland he's created as his home, it's as if he's an illusion. 
The Michael Jackson I've had the pleasure of knowing for 13 years is without affectation, and is not an illusion. It must be hard for Michael to know how much the world wants to knwo him, to be like him, to consume him. He's wisely created his own world in which to preserve the most honest parts of his identity. Those are the parts we love the most. 
Michael has heightened sensitivity for the crying needs of this world. Through his Heal the World Foundation, he works to preserve this planet's most precious resources - children, and the environment. He feels much of the same responsibility a parent feels - his children are all of our children. Michael brings so much to so many, he is one of the world's most precious resources himself. 
Guided by his creative forces of passion, joy, work and genius, Michael has gone aftre his dreams and shared them with all of us. I can't wait to see where he chooses to take us next. 
[source: HIStory booklet] 
Elizabeth Taylor (actress)
Everything about Michael is truthful. And there is something in him that is so dear and childlike - not childish, but childlike - that we both have and identify with. 
[source: Talk magazine; October 1999] 
Michael Jackson is, indeed, an international favorite for all ages, an incredible force of incredible energy. In the art of music, he is a pacesetter for quality of production, in the vaguard for high standards of entertainment. 
What makes Michael more unique may be the fact that all of his accomplishments, his rewards, have not altered his sensitivity and concern for the welfare of others, or his intense caring and love for his family and friends, and especially all the children of the world over. He is filled with deep emotions that create an unearthly, special, innocent, childlike, wise man that is Michael Jackson. He is so giving of himself that, at times, he leaves very little to protect that beautiful inner core that is the seence of him. I think Michael appeals to the child in all of us. He has the quality of innocence that we would all like to obtain or have kept. 
I think Michael is like litmus paper. He is always trying to learn. He has one of the sharpest wits, he is intelligent, and he is cunning - that is a strange word to use about him, because it implies deviousness and he is one of the least devious people I have ever met in my life. 
Michael is highly intelligent, shrewd, intuitive, understanding, sympathetic, and generous to almost a fault of himself. He is honesty personified - painfully honest - and vulnerable to the point of pain. He is also very curious and wants to draw from people who have survived. People who have lasted. He is not really of this planet. If he is eccentric it's because he is larger than life. 
What is a genius? What is a living legend? What is a megastar? Michael Jackson - that's all. And just when you think you know him, he gives you more... 
There is no one that can come near him, no one can dance like that, write the lyrics, or cause the kind of excitement that he does. When I hear the name Michael Jackson, I think of brilliance, of dazzling stars, lasers and deep emotions. I think he is one of the world's biggest and greatest stars, and it just so happens that he is one of the most gifted music makers the world has ever known. 
I think he is one of the finest people to hit this planet, and, in my estimation, he is the true King of Pop, Rock and Soul. I love you Michael. 
[source: HIStory booklet] 
Usher (R&B singer)
I study legends because I want to be a legend - Frank Sinatra, Fred Estaire, LL Cool J, Michael Jackson. That's who inspires me. 
[source: USA Today; October 9, 1997] 
Hype Williams (video director)
The choreography [in Thriller] is tremendous. It's a new appreciation of how dance can move a music video. He wasn't just a tremendous artist, tremendous performer, it was amazing how ingenious was he to foresee that music video could be anything you wanted in the beginning. 
[source: MTV; March 2000] 
Stan Winston (movie director)
I stand here and say he's a really great guy. 
[source: special screening of 'Ghost' at the opening night of the 1997 Palm Springs International Short Film Festival; August 1997] 
Will Smith About Michael Jackson
In an interview with Teen Hollywood (August 2002), American actor Will Smith, who portrays Agent Jay in 'Men in Black II,' was surprised to find himself intimidated by Michael Jackson's physical presence on the set. 
"The persona that is created of Michael Jackson is very different when you're in a room with him, when you're talking to him. He's very funny. He actually fights. I was surprised. He's like a blue belt in Tae Kwan Do or something. I'd just done 'Ali,' and I felt that Michael Jackson might be able to hurt me. That dude looks sharp. He's a fast mover. You see how somebody could dance and move that good and do those spins. That takes strength man." 
 
 
  
 
=== Sources ===
*[MJCAFE.NET] - All quotes are acquired from this website
*[MJFANCLUB.COM]
=== Sources ===
http://www.cardinalspellman.org/
*This is Wikipedia, the encyclopaedia.  For the collection of quotations, see Wikiquote. Uncle G 18:06, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Quotes about Michael Jackson]] 

message: http://www.cardinalspellman.org/
*This is Wikipedia, the encyclopaedia.  For the collection of quotations, see Wikiquote. Uncle G 18:06, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources 

message: Why do people keep lower michael jackson sales? It to do with race? People provide fansites or biased websites the Elvis and Beatles sold 1 billion records, no one lowers their sales. Where's the source or weblink for your so-called official, you've lowered all sales of all his lp's! Sales on French site and MJ Stats correspond what mre you do want!!!!
:Whoa... erm... here you are . Street walker 11:27, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: GLOBAL SALES!!!!

message: Why is information on the 2005 trial doubled up, tried to delete it but my edit was reverted. There is repetitive information on the trial as features in the main michael jackson article (which should focus on his work) and michael jackson (personal life). The information on his trial should be put in michael jackson (personal life) with the other contraversies. Talking about trial in midst of musical biography, causes the article to be biased. What do other people think? Holla back?!!!!
*There is a dispute as to whether Michael Jackson (personal life) ought to exist as a separate article. android79 22:21, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  This dispute now seems to be resolved.--Manboobies 00:47, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Child Molestation Trial: 2005

message: Please source all relevant sentences that are in the article. I see multiple sentences with "fact" in two "{" and "}". I fail to see how this is adequately sourcing material. This is not good enough in an article where I see rampant rubbish in every other sentence.--Manboobies 21:55, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Wait, typing "fact" just makes the article say citation needed. I appologise for making this rash statement. Instead I request a deadline for information to be sourced to be appointed, then if missed, the information deleted. --Manboobies 21:58, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yup, that's exactly the point of .  android79 17:00, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What's the dead-line for un-cited information that has a  tag? Street walker 13:29, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "fact" 

message: This image looks like a photoshop job. Did Jackson actually dress up like this at some point for a photo shoot? Regardless, the initial photo of Jackson ought to be one that's reasonably recent. android79 17:02, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Here are some images I uploaded which could be suitable to use in the intro. They are all recent, and show Jackson's current appearance.
*:Image:Mjinvinciblephotocolour.jpg
*:Image:Mjghosts.jpg - all though it is 8/9 years old, it still shows Jackson's current appearance which hasn't changed dramatically in these 8/9 years, and it is a good photo
*:Image:Msg1.jpg - From the MSG concerts in 2001
Which one do you all like best? Currently, I have put Image:Mjinvinciblephotocolour.jpg in the intro because android79 said he/she likes that photo because it
s a reflection of his current looks, which I agree with.
Sincerely,
Street walker 11:27, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

text: I like what's currently there. The second one you mention is a tad... scary. The third is really good but unfortunately we can't see his face in total. android79 13:37, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Image:KingJackson.jpg]] 

message: No, it was not fine the way it was. Please don't blindly revert, Kelvin Martinez. By reverting to your preferred version of the intro, you also added back in a dubious,  unsourced claim (). The version you reverted to also has bad capitalization (prepositions like "of" are never capitalized, even in proper names).
I changed "concocted" to "given to him by" because "concocted" has a negative connotation, which I believe is a bit POV.
I changed the lengthy series of "singer-songwriter, actor" ad nauseum to "entertainer" because brevity is always good in the introduction. "Entertainer" encapsulates Jackson's career nicely, and the reader gets more detail on his various endeavors later in the article. This has been brought up before, and no one objected to my removal of the excessive occupational descriptions on this talk page.
We can discuss the last two items here; I won't change them back for now. android79 20:25, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "We can discuss the last two items here; I won't change them back for now." I am more than willing to change it for you. It read much better that way IMO. --Manboobies 07:10, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm going to change it back. Having a long list of Jackson's occupations and roles only encourages people to add more; at some point, someone added father. Entertainer is much better. android79 13:35, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

text: On the topic of "Whacko Jacko" - should it be mentioned that Jackson stated, on public TV in 1997, his wishes that the media and the public refrain from using this title saying "I'm a Jackson not a Jacko, and I'm not whacko"? Street walker 11:16, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Both of the nicknames ought to be sourced and explained in detail, but probably not in the intro. If you want to find some sources for both "King of Pop" and "Wacko Jacko", including the fact that Jackson (obviously) doesn't like being called WJ, go for it. I tried finding a good authoritative source for both of them but was unsuccessful. I'm not sure which section it really belongs in; maybe personal life? android79 13:35, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  My recent changes 

message: I think a date should be set for the removal of unsourced information. I suggest 1st August 2006, but I'm not unwilling to discuss. I think August is plenty of time. IMO that would reduce the size of the article dramatically, and wouldn't be too bad considering it would all be unverifiable info being removed. August would be time enough for the majority of correct info to be sourced via news sites, credible bio's and Amazon book links and ISBN's of written sources. This article needs that level of detail to resist vandalism.--Manboobies 07:23, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations Required, date set for removal of unsourced sentences? 

message: The opening paragraph states that Michael Jackson is the 'biggest selling solo artist of all time', with sales of over 300 million.  Wikipedia itself can't agree on this (see Best selling music artists), so I've toned it done a bit by saying he is "one of the biggest selling solo artists of all time". Is that a problem? Proto t c 15:08, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Not a problem with me, though prepare to be reverted by POV warriors. The "best-selling of all time" thing is so meaningless and so unverifiable that I don't think it has a place on Wikipedia. android79 15:29, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  That List of best-selling music artists is allways being edited by die-hard fans of Elvis, The Beatles, Jackson, ABBA, Zeppelin etc. to put their favourite band on top, so you can't use it as a source to belittle Michael Jackson. The World Music Awards base their awards on sales and in 1996, and again in 2001, they awared Michael Jackson the "best selling artist of all-time". You can't argue with that. So I'm changing the intro as to make it more accurate by putting back "best selling artist of all-time". Street walker 07:08, 6 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Who's belittling Jackson? I'm belittling the fanboys who care so much about their favorite artist that they feel compelled to muck with Wikipedia articles to put said artist at the top. The veracity List of best-selling music artists appears to be highly disputed, and it has no sources. Unless the information can be verified, it shouldn't be used in that article, or in the intro to this one. android79 13:18, 6 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  'Biggest selling solo artist of all time' 

message: Just so no one changes the approximate worldwide sales figure in the intro, I thought I would write up a breakdown of his album and singles sales incase anyone has any doubts.
OFFICIAL MOTOWN SALES FIGURES
*ALBUMS (all figures as of 1990)
**Got to Be There: 4.1 million
**Ben: 4.4 million
**Music & Me: 1.9 million
**Forever Michael: 1.6 million
**The Best of MJ: 2.2 million
**One Day in Your Life: 1.5 million
**Farewell My Summer Love: 2 million
**Looking Back to Yesterday: 0.3 million
**The Original Soul of MJ: 0.4 million
**Anthology: 2.6 million
:TOTAL: 21 million
*SINGLES (all figures as of 1990)
**Got to Be There: 2.2 million
**Rockin’ Robin: 2.8 million
**Ben: 2.8 million
**I Wanna Be Where You Are: 1.3 million
**With A Child’s Heart: 0.3 million
**We’re Almost There: 0.4 million
**Just A Little Bit of You: 0.8 million
**Ain't No Sunshine: 0.3 million
**Morning Glow: 0.015 million
**Music & Me: 0.012 million
**Dogging Around: 0.005 million
**One Day in Your Life: 1.7 million
**Happy: 0.1 million
**Girl You’re So Together: 0.09 million
**The One You Love: 0.001 million
**Farewell My Summer Love: 0.8 million
**Twenty Five Miles: 0.010 million
:TOTAL: 13.63 million
OFFICIAL SONY SALES FIGURES
*ALBUMS
**Off The Wall: 16 million (as of 1996)
**Thriller: 54 million (as of 1997)
**Bad: 25 million (as of 1996)
**Dangerous: 27 million (as of 1996)
**HIStory: 32 million (as of 1997)
**Blood On The Dance Floor: 4 million (as of 1997)
**Greatest Hits (HIStory disc 1): 3 million (as of 2001)
**Invincible: 5 million (as of 2001)
**Number Ones: 6 million (as of Dec 2004)
**Ultimate Collection: 0.25 million (estimate as of 2005)
**Essential MJ: 2 million (estimate as of 2005)
:TOTAL: 174.25 million
CURRENT BEST ESTIMATE SALES FIGURES
*ALBUMS
**Off The Wall: 20 million
**Thriller: 60 million 
**Bad: 29 million 
**Dangerous: 32 million 
**HIStory: 36 million 
**Blood On The Dance Floor: 7 million 
**Greatest Hits (HIStory disc 1): 3 million 
**Invincible: 8 million 
**Number Ones: 6.5 million 
**Ultimate Collection: 0.25 million 
**Essential MJ: 2 million 
:ESTIMATED TOTAL: 203.75 million
*SINGLES (US only)
**1979-1990: 17 million
**1991-1997: 14.5 million
**US:WW sales ratio: 1:3 (approx.)
:TOTAL: 31.5 million * 3 
:= 94.5 million
*ACCUMULATIVE SALES
**Motown albums: 21 million
**Motown singles: 13.6 million
**Sony albums: 174.25 million
**Sony singles: 94.5 million
:OFFICIAL ACCUMULATIVE TOTAL: 303, 380, 000
::- 174.25 million
::+ Estimated album total: 203.75 million
:CURRENT BEST ESTIMATE TOTAL= 332, 850, 000
Source of information
Keep in mind, the Motown sales figures have not be renewed since 1990. All of his solo Motown albums have been reissued on CD since then so I suspect the sales figures for these albums could have risen significantly.
The Sony sales figures have not been renewed since 1996/1997 for the most part. Off The Wall, Thriller, Bad and Dangerous were all reissued as Special Editions in 2001 so I suspect that would have boosted their total sales figures significantly.
Michael Jackson's accumulative sales figure could be up to or over 350 million by now. But we must keep everything sourced, and that means using the official sales figures (even if they are out-of-date). So we must use the dated 300 million figure over the more plausable 350 million figure. But 300 million is still impressive none the less.
Street walker 08:23, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Michael Jackson's worldwide sales 

message: Original text:
::"Physical appearance
::Michael Jackson is 5'10" (1.78 m) tall and has an androgynous image which means his appearance has blurred the conventional barriers surrounding gender, race and age in society."
"Androgynous" only denotes a blur between genders. (from "andro" -- "male" + "gyno"--female). this bit needs to be edited for clarity. While it's true that Jackson has altered his appeareance to such a point that his age, race and gender are all ambiguous, there are separate words to describe the bits about age and race. "Androgynous" can only be used to describe gender. 
Also, I wonder why this bit about his appearance shifts from present to past tense? 
Ckamaeleon 01:27, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Physical Appearance -- call for cleanup 

message: In know it's nice to know who Michael Jackson's influences are, and who he has influenced, but is this paragraph necessary? The intro is long as it is, I think the paragraph that says his full name, DOB, line of work and musi styles, and the paragraph about his accomplishments should stay, but the influences and the paragraph about the trial should go. That's just my opinion. I wont remove anything until we reach some sort of consensus. Street walker 06:28, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Influences 

message: This article has been tagged with "clean up" and "inappropriate tone". Can someone specify which areas need to be cleaned up, and what areas are written in an "inappropriate tone"? - Street walker 11:46, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Again I ask, what is it that is said in an inappropriate tone? How can it be fixed, if no one knows what needs to be fixed? Street walker 14:36, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm going to remove the notice if someone can't justify why it is there. Street walker 04:30, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup?.... Inappropriate tone?? 

message: I removed the line "Michael Jackson used to rape Chris Morgan and Adam Yahnke in the ass" which was quietly added below the 1964-1975 section. Some people have too much time on there hands! :(
Futurefate 01:54, 18 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, that happens hourly in this article. --Crnk Mnky 22:07, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Small Edit 

message: Just out of interest why has he been moved in here. Those things that he does when he goes high in recordings are 6th octave but has he actually done an E6?
I think whoever put it their got "whistle register" confused with falsetto. Street walker 02:17, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well there are two definitions of "whistle register". there is the voice like chest, head, falsetto, mixed, middle, etc. and then there is the range of notes starting from E6+. If you sing high enough with any voice(falsetto, head, or superhead) that it will sound about the same but for my voice in superhead to start sounding "whistle-like" i need to sing to about F6+. But since it officially starts at E6, if Michael ever sang that high it makes him a singer of the whistle register capability. 67.181.94.96 00:32, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If you can find a studio or live recording in which he sing higher than E6, and upload it as an ogg file, then you can put Michael Jackson back in the whistle register category. Street walker 06:13, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

text: I don't doubt that he can go higher than E5 but the Wikipedia along with other sources say in his vocal profile that high range went up to E6. 67.181.94.96 05:05, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Whistle Register 

message: Im sorry guys, but this article has gone from bad to worse over the last couple days. Shortening the article is a good idea, but i think you've removed the wrong portion of the article. For some odd reason most of the biographical info is now missing, and now all thats left is a loose description of Jacksons albums and touring dates. It barely reads like an encyclopaedic article on an individual should. A better choice in my opinion would be to move most of the album info to a separate page and keep the personal and biographical info on the main page. Makes more sense doesn't it?--King G 11:27, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think it makes more sense because Michael Jackson is a musician. You need to have info about his musical career on this page. As I said before, and I'll say it again, there is alot of info about his personal life (the good, the bad and the ugly) on this page. I don't see why over time we can't improve this article so there is even more info about his personal life instead of reverting it. My main problem with the article was that it had his music career and then his personal career in two different sections on the page. It should all be mixed in. I think we should stick with what he have now and eventually make the personal stuff more detailed. But then again, we have to try to keep it from being too long. Street walker 11:45, 24 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just a note that Michael Jackson is just as famous for being a musician as he is for his personal life, and therefore they both deserve equal coverage on his article.  Now, as far as moving overly lengthy parts off to sub-articles, that may be okay, but there is no reason to think that we should be trying harder to move non-music related material off to sub-articles but not music related material. Peyna 02:16, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of personal life 

message: I don't like it, it's a very bad shot of him. No other famous celebrity who's had a mug shot taken of them has that photo at the top of their article. It doesn't even represent his current looks, because most of the time he looks alot better than this and did look better than this during the trial. Even in photos from the unreleased "One More Chance" video that was filmed on the same say, he looks alot better than this. Street walker 07:21, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Shame on you. It's the photo shoot at the police station, when michael was arrested years ago. The criminal number of Jackson is cropped at the bottom. Please someone change it --tikky 10:36, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Why do people keep changing the photo? We shouldn't have a fair use image as the lead. I don't even think the Vibe photo qualifies as fair use. What gives us the right to reuse pictures from a magazine's photo shoot? There must be a GFDL photo of Jackson somewhere. Rhobite 17:10, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro image 

message: The International Federation of the Phonographic Industry (IFPI) has just published its updated list of the 150 highest selling artists ever. IFPI has finally come up with a list of the top-selling acts in History. Its about time.
The top 10 is as follows:
# The Beatles 40 400,000,000 UK 60s (1962-1970) Rock/Pop Guinness/EMI 
# Michael Jackson 14 350,000,000 US 70s-00s (1979-) Pop/R&B 
# Elvis Presley 150 300,000,000 US 50s-70s (1956-1977) Country/Rock 
# Madonna 16 275,000,000 US 80s-00s (1984-) Pop
# Nana Mouskouri 450 250,000,000 Greece 60s-00s (1959-) Pop
# Cliff Richard 60 250,000,000 UK 50s-00s (1959-1969,1977-1979,1986-1999) Rock/Pop
# The Rolling Stones 54 ~250,000,000 UK 60s-00s (1964-1981) Rock
# Mariah Carey 14 230,000,000 US 90s-00s (1990-) Pop/R&B 
# Elton John 43 ~220,000,000 UK 70s-00s (1972-1976,1989-1991,1997-) Pop
# Celine Dion 21 220,000,000 Canada 80s-00s (1990-) Pop Music/Pop
Source: IFPI http://mjtkop.com/home/ http://www.madonna.com/
Come back when you have a source thats not the wishful thinking of a Michael Jackson Fanclub--King G 04:03, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Michael Jackson highest selling solo artist ever. The Beatles Highest group seller. 

message: I think the whole controversies section should be merged into the biography section, in the relevant era. I also think the sub-sections in the Biography section should be renamed. I'm pretty sure we can come up with some creative titles. It's obvious that 1958-1975 should be titled The Jackson 5 or something similiar, perhaps Role in the Jackson 5 (like the Beatles section in the John Lennon article). I don't know what to title the other sections without naming them according to his musical releases of the era (e.g. 1982-1985 becomes Thriller: 1982-1985). But many users have commented that it makes the article appear more like a discography than a biography. Any thoughts? Street walker 09:07, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Michael Jackson#Controversies|Controversies section]] 

message: What do you think of the current state of the article? What I did was create a sub-article called History of Michael Jackson and then sumarised the info on the main article. I also creates a sub-article called Artistry of Michael Jackson (his musical career from singing and dancing to songwriting) and Controversy of Michael Jackson and summarised these two sections on the main article. I used The Beatles as blue print as that article is a feature article and was on Wiki's main page once over. My opinion is that the recent changes to the article have made an improvement. I also asked a few people what they thought of it now and they seem to like it more than the previous version (with the timeline) and the previous to the previous version (with the two huge sections on music and personal life). So now I want to know what you all think and what improvements you can make to this article. If there's no complaints, I am going to re-submit this article for FA nomination. Street walker 10:14, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  People's opinions of how the Michael Jackson article stands as of now 

message: I've changed it to History.  It looks much, much nicer.
CommKing 20:54, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I though HIStory would be better because of his album called "HIStory". Any is you think "History" is better that's fine. Street walker 22:09, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  HIStory 

message: With the release of this song, will someone add that Michael Jackson is now Muslim?
:Firstly WTF? And secondly, Raymone Bain denied rumours that Jackson is a muslim. Street walker 08:14, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Give Thanks To Allah 

message: Let's talk about the "disputed" neutrality of this section. What's disputed and what isn't NPOV? Let's discuss what can be changed/improved about this article. It frustrates me when people put templates like this at the top of article but don't discuss why. Street walker 08:06, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What song are you referring to? Street walker 06:28, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Michael Jackson#Artistry|Artistry section]] 

message: For boxed sets and double albums with a running time that exceeds 100 minutes, the RIAA multiplies shipments by the number of discs (or its tape or vinyl equivalent). Source
HIStory sold 18 million copies, and had 2 discs with a total running time of over 100 minutes, there for it's sales figure is 36 million. Street walker 08:42, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Show a proper source and I'll accept that. I need a RIAA source not from some aol homepage Funky Monkey 08:47, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If you can get on the RIAA site, let me know. Street walker 11:46, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

text: That is the most "official" sales number available for HIStory. The 36M figure is a guess, most probably made by a fan, and it comes from mjinf.co.uk. 28 million was the figure in 1996, it's been ten years so I assume the number has increased quite a bit. But 28m is the latest, most "official" sales number available for HIStory, so we have to go with that one. We can't go with a guess made by a fan-site. Street walker 11:54, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You use this site for a lot of your "sources".  http://mjinf.co.uk/HIStory/HIStory.htm.  This says 18 million. Funky Monkey 11:56, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's a guess, fo to the page it says "best estimate". There is no place for estimates on this article. Let me remind you who this article is about... Michael Jackson! And Michael Jackson said his album sold 28 million so I'm gonna change the figure (once again) to 28 million. You can't dispute what the guy who we are writing an article is about says. In the end, he is the #1 source for all information. He is like a first-party source (or whatever it is you call it). If you were writing an article on Paul McCartney. The #1 source you would want for all information is he man himself. Same applies for Michael Jackson and his article. If he wrote this article, it would be a lot more accurate than if you or me wrote it. Street walker 13:06, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Best estimate is better than "Your" estimate.  Sales figures changed back to 18 million. Funky Monkey 01:42, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Streetwalker, that's ridiculous to assume that Michael Jackson is always going to be right.  It would be fine to have him quoted as saying those figures, but there's no reason why he should be infallible.  In fact, there are a lot of reasons for him to want to distort those figures. Ahalterman 02:08, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

text: Source??  Funky Monkey 11:24, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

text: Sorry, you misunderstand me. I am after a source which states what you have stated above namely "HISTORY is a double album not a single one, ESSENTIAL is a single album even if there are two disks inside the box, why? Because it's contracted this way between artists/record co. There is of course the 100 minutes limit for asserting. However before their releasings, artists signs contracts on such double or single so as to get paid on royalties twice :
- double discs set (single album) : artist get paid each time one box is sold
- double discs set (double album) : artist get paid TWICE each time one box is sold
HISTORY Vinyl edition is a 4 disks packed but still counted as 2 albums inside not 4 so 2 disks sold for each.
Actually HISTORY is a 2 albums packed in ONE BOX (one "best of" disk + one new song disk). This box has sold 3.5 million in the US, that's why RIAA certified HISTORY having sold 7 million copies (check RIAA website). Another example with "All Eyez On Me" of 2PAC (double album not single) and many other albums are certified this way."  Funky Monkey 12:44, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Sorry but the first "source" you give is an online ticket agency!. The RIAA page says nothing of the sort that you claim.  With regards to your second paragraph above, regarding it being hard for you to give sources, I'm afraid it is an essential part of wikipedia.  May I direct you to WP:Cite Funky Monkey 14:18, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  HIStory album sales 

message: I've create a test article which we can use for developing Michael Jackson's biography before editing it into the main article. Go here: User:Street walker/Michael Jackson test article. Please offer any suggestions you may have by editing the test article in order to improve it. Once we develope a well written test article we can edit it into the main article.
Obviously this article needs a re-write, but it can't just be the work of one person or you face the problem of bias. As a group of editors we need to improve this article. Problems with this article:
*Neutrality
*Referencing - we need a better way to reference information in the article
*add to this list if you know of any major problems this article has
In re-writing the article, I think we should look at Johnny Cash, Miles Davis, Bob Dylan and Kylie Minogue, as these are solo artists who have feature articles written about them. So reading those articles would be a good way of finding out what makes an article about a solo artist a good article. 
I really think the article should read like a biography. However, because people complain I've had to make a seperate section for controversy, and because its bias to talk about his controversy and not his music I made a seperate article for artistry as well. But eventually, these two sub-sections will have to (well, they don't have to, but it'd be nice) be merged with the biography (except for artistry which can be cut for all I care). So we need to seriously discuss, as a group of editors, how this article should be laid out, what sections deserve sub-articles, what sub-article can be merged etc. We need to think about what definately need to be said in Michael Jackson's biography, we need to think about what is legit information and what is crap (e.g. Michael Jackson kidnapping his own children, which believe it or not someone actually tried to put in this article and claim it as legit news, lol). I would love it if people actually participated in a thorough discussion of this article. So this is what I think should be included in this main article (feel free to disagree and discuss):
*Intro
:What we have now is, IMO, a perfect introduction. My only comment would be that in the paragraph discussing the alleged child sex abuse, other Jackson controversies should be mentioned to even up the content of musical accomplishments and controversies.
*Biography
:What needs to be said
**Birth date, birth place, family
**Jackson 5 beginnings, Joseph's strict upbringing
**Move to Epic Records and the launch of Jackson's solo career
**"Flings" and the success of the Thriller album (including Motown 25 and the moonwalk)
**Mid-1980's musical career (Victory LP and tour, We Are The World) and controversies (Purchase of the Beatles catalogue, Pepsi burning)
**Caption EO, dramatic change in physical appearance and bizarre tabloids stories (e.g. Hyperbaric chamber, elephant man bones), Bad & Dangerous albums (they were release fairly close together, so they should be discussed fairly close together)
**Purchase of the Neverland Ranch (although not called that at the time of purchase, which naturally leads to inviting child over for sleepovers, which naturally leads to the 1993 allegations, which can possibly lead into the HIStory albums (as it was a retaliation of what happened in 1993 and 1994)
**Marriages and children
**Late 1990s decline (decline in sales and decline in popularity), Early 2000s record label battles
**Berlin 2002 "baby dangling" controversy, Living with Michael Jackson, 2003 allegations
**2005 trial (probably deserves a whole section to itself, would you agree?)
**Post-trial life (everything significant that happened after the verdict)
So then the biography should be all that is needed on this main article. I think if we explain everything well enough, there should be no need for History of Michael Jackson and Controversy of Michael Jackson. I feel confident that we can write a 32KB article that explains everything that needs to be explained about Michael Jackson in the most concise terms. But I also think articles like 2005 trial of Michael Jackson, Michael Jackson controversy in Berlin and anything else that was a significant event in Jackson's life. Eventually, every sub-article that stems for the Michael Jackson article can be delted, merged, redirected, whatever, because it will all eventually be explained (in concise, yet fulfilling terms). So now give me your ideas. Please participate in this discussion as something desperately needs to be done about this article. Street walker 12:27, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Having the subarticles is fine, let us reduce the size of this main article to 32 K by moving content to them.--Patrick 23:02, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: What has happened? This article is now completely too large and has spiralled out of control.--Manboobies 00:37, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

text: Oh, and he forgot Michael Jackson home, recreation, friends, charity as well...--Manboobies 15:56, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

text: I suggest you stop giving advice to other users like you're some kind of superior, and instead give advice about this article and how to improve it. We need to discuss improving the article, not spend wasteless minutes impuning other users. Stop telling me what to do, and ask yourslef what YOU can do to help this article. Street walker 06:08, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Everything I just said will help in improving this article, by helping you (its most frequent editor) make better edits. Anything I could or would do to edit would be to no avail if you continue editing it and splitting it off the way you have. As my original comment says, I will give you advice, but I don't have time to write a 40K+ article on Michael Jackson (I can do it, but it will take several days--several days I don't have). I can, however, give advice, educate, and make some edits here and there, once you've first built a foundation to work off of.--FuriousFreddy 00:21, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

text: Utter rubbish. I agree with FuriousFreddy. I'm starting to believe you hinder this article.--Manboobies 15:35, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: 'Utter rubbish'? Please don't make personal attacks! Streetwalker has being improving the article the way he knows best. In my personal view and I'm sure the view of other folks, he's done absolutely nothing wrong. If there's something that you think shouldn't be, lets just discuss it and fix it. Afterall, articles like these change about a million times a month. NO NEED to play the blame game. --161.74.11.24 16:01, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

text: I agree with Manboobies and Freddy. The article is getting rather out of control, and frankly, of poor quality. It needs a major rewrite based on reliable sources. The split-out into subarticles was poorly handled and recovering any sort of meaningful set of Michael Jackson articles from that mess is going to be difficult. Initially, I believed Street walker to be a POV-pusher, but I thought he had come around recently to understand and accept NPOV. Given the recent activity on this article, I'm beginning to think, at best, he's let his status as a Jackson fan unduly influence his editing here, or, at worst, he's shifted back into POV mode, only more subtly this time. android79 16:19, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Again I'm going to say, this is a talk page for Michael Jackson not a talk page for Street walker, and we should be discussing how to improve it, not complaining that it needs improving. Street walker 21:48, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Identifying a problem is the first step in finding a solution for it. android79 22:32, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Basically, I'm only interested in improving this article and I don't care for pathetic personal attacks. Why are you here? To improve Wikipedia or insult its users? Street walker 07:34, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Obviously, the latter. The above is simply my honest opinion of the situation, and nothing more. android79 12:16, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

text: I'm going to post parts from the sub-articles here that are sourced or I know are true based on common knowledge into a section in my userpage. That'll also be a good way to learn how to create a sub-page in my user info, then we can look at those. Then I can take the sourced parts of the main article. Then we can vote, rating them out of 10 for relevance in an article that needs to be 32 KB. This is my idea anyway. If this seems overkill, let me know. I don't want to take over the article.--Manboobies 16:46, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Good idea! Nice to see some positive work going into attempting to improve this article. Street walker 21:48, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: We need to seriously discuss re-writing this article

message: As per this AfD, I merged content from Michael Jackson (personal life), but since I don't really know the history of this article and the circumstances surrounding the apparent POV fork that the source article is, I just pasted the contents (and fixed the Wikicode) to what looked like an appropriate place. Please feel free to move these sections to their proper place or even revert my changes, if you wish. --Deathphoenix 21:40, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merged content from [[Michael Jackson (personal life)]] 

message: If there is an article on the Jackson 5, none of it needs to be covered in this article, it can just be linked too, surely? The Jackson 5 part of this article could just become a stub linking to the bigger fuller one.--Manboobies 00:44, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The Jackson 5 is an important part of Michael Jackson's biography because it tells of how he got started in the music business and evolved into a solo artist. Street walker 21:59, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Jackson 5

message: *I see the "32 kB" limit being discussed quite a bit here, and I'd just like to remind everyone that 32 kB is not a hard-and-fast limit; our goal here should be to improve the readability and structure of the article, not to reduce it to some arbitrary size. Wikipedia:Article size has some good info on this. Keep in mind that "articles greater than 50KB, and even in excess of 100KB, have been made into Featured Articles." android79 13:32, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  A note on article size 

message: *I've changed this:
::1.1 Early beginnings 
::1.2 Success and controversy 
::1.3 Early 1990s allegations 
::1.4 Marriages and children 
::1.5 Decline and record label troubles 
::1.6 Living with Michael Jackson 
::1.7 Trial and acquittal 
:To this (with explanations in brackets):
::1.1 Early beginnings: 1958–1980 (same as before)
::1.2 Success & Controversy: 1982–1989 (same as before)
::1.3 Allegations & Decline: 1991–2002 (The allegations naturally lead to the decline, which wasn't 1997-2002 but more like 1993-2002)
::1.4 Trial & Acquittal: 2003–present (Living With Michael Jackson led to the allegations, which led to the trial, which led to the acquittal, so these sections should all be one)
:The reason I did this is that I believe that some sections were too small and should be merged, and looking at other articles I've found that it is perfectly reasonable to have lenghty sections. Having 7 sections with a couple of paragraphs in each is a bit silly IMO. Anyway, I think having 4 sections (with the titles they now have) works better. I think it looks nice and tidy having beginnings, success, decline and trial. It leaves room for the next "chapter" in Michael Jackson's life, which (I don't want to jinx him by saying... BUT) I believe will be called "1.5 Comeback". Street walker 13:12, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I merged 7 sections into 4, read my reasoning before reverting 

message: The links at the start of each section were very useful. Street Walker, please put them back.--Patrick 14:24, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see why when they are all in the see also section Street walker 16:08, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It is good standard practice to link a section to the "main article(s)" about the subtopic(s).--Patrick 18:13, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Links at the start of each section

message: *How do you guys think we should reference info on this page? I think the current referencing style (i.e. blah, blah, blah [1].) looks a tad messy. I was thinking we should make every reference a foot note, that way the [1] thing will still be there, but it will be smaller (e.g. blah, blah, blah [1].) and hopefully wont look as messy. What do you all think? Street walker 13:25, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Referencing style 

message: **I added some samples. I didn't know how many to add so I just uploaded samples of all his solo number one songs. I hope that's OK, or are 12 samples too many? Street walker
**I added a paragraph to the intro that was (for some unknown reason) removed a while ago (lol, it was probably me). Street walker 06:14, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Featured Music Project evaluation 

message: These are the music samples currently on the page:
Which samples definately should be here and what samples should not be here? I think Don't Stop, Billie Jean, Beat, Bad, Man In The Mirror and Black or White definatley need to be here as they are (arguably) his biggest and most famous hits. Discuss. Street walker 06:21, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: All of them are fine.--Manboobies 19:45, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd say get rid of "Dirty Diana", "Ben", "I Just Can't Stop Loving You", and "Beautiful Girl"; add "Got to Be There" and "Smooth Criminal" instead --FuriousFreddy 18:12, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Music samples 

message: In 1993, Jordan Chandler, the son of former Beverly Hills dentist Evan Chandler, represented by civil lawyer Larry Feldman, accused Jackson of child sexual abuse. In 1994, Jackson settled out of court with the accuser for a reported USD 20 million and was not charged[55].
It is possible to source the part about dentistry which is true. It is contained in the GQ article. I suggest somebody who has it scans it and uploads, or we find a website that still has it. The GQ article is incredibly well written on the part of Mary Fischer. It will benefit this article. --Manboobies 20:23, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "Was Michael Jackson Framed?" GQ article Street walker 22:01, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  FIND THE SOURCE FOR THIS PART 

message: Somebody replaced http://www.guinnessrecords.com/content_pages/record.asp?recordid=50890 saying he had 50 million sales to a fan site saying he had 60. A fan site is not a good enough source for this information. I am going to revert all those changes. I appologise if the IP address is not Street walker as it will revert some of his changes too, which were in the middle. If it was you street walker please discuss this with me as you are changing sources to POV which is no good.--Manboobies 22:31, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think it was me because I agree that we should go with the "over 50 million" figure rather than "up to 60 million". Street walker 08:08, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Who has just replaced Guiness with a fan site?

message: While this edit is certainly better than many of the previous versions, the dubios use of a biography from a fan forum isn't going to help this become a featured article anytime soon. Also, things that are general knowledge common sense facts (like when people released albums, or when people signed record deals) don't need to be footnoted, and you certainly should never use the same footnote twice (that's what "Ibid" is for.) --FuriousFreddy 18:10, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ugh. 

message: See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Religious beliefs of Michael Jackson. Johnleemk | Talk 13:49, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Religious beliefs of Michael Jackson]] merged here 

message: See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Michael Jackson home, recreation, friends, charity. Johnleemk | Talk 13:51, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Michael Jackson home, recreation, friends, charity]] merged here 

message: LOL... wtf? Is this vandalism or what? I wouldn't know, I was just here to find the Michael Jackson who worked with Solomon Asch researching conformity... Sam Spade 15:02, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  question about another article maybe incorrectly related to Jackson because of vandalism 

message: How much of this is relevant? I see most of it through-out the rest of the article anyway. Is this section really needed?
*It's relevant, but it doesn't need it's own section. I merged most of into the intro, but some parts were irrelevant so some trivial stuff got the cut. Street walker 06:05, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Personal Life 

message: I just read some of comments that people were saying aobut the subject in this talkpage.
People were went to saying that "Michael Jackson himself approves the website – that, right there, presents a problem. If only "Jackson-approved" material gets posted to the site, then its status as a neutral source of information is in question. android79 22:34, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: May I point you to WP:RS before making such claims regarding sources.  Funky Monkey 14:24, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I am very well know those rules, and this is why I am asking to stop the nonsense. The cached MJJSource.com perfectly fits as reliable source in no less degree than any source, say, for Madonna and Rolling Stones articles. Either Madonna's and RS' articles should be cleansed of nearly all information, or MJJSource.com is reliable source. No third variant, sorry. DenisRS 00:08, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nonsense about sources has to stop 

message: This article is pretty much unreadable because every sentence is followed by an ugly "citation needed" tag. The lead section alone has 12 factcheck tags. Some of these are for uncontroversial, well-known facts such as the location of Neverland, and the assertion that his sleepovers with children have been (gasp) controversial. You don't need a separate citation for every claim made in an article. Don't get me wrong, Wikipedia:Verifiability is a requirement, but a readable article is also important. It is unrealistic to insist that each clause of a sentence should be backed up with its own evidence. I'm going to remove some of the sillier factcheck tags, such as the one next to "Jackson's relationships with children, both his own and others, have been controversial", and common knowledge statements such as Jackson's appearance in Captain Eo. At one point, there was even a factcheck tag on Jackson's DOB. Has that ever been disputed? Rhobite 21:24, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. I have never seen so many factchecks in an article, and it looks awful. Destroy as you wish. Cdcon 22:00, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

text: I appologise as I am responsible for some of these in an attempt to source what has been said.--Manboobies 02:36, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unreadable 

message: It's been said on various jackson related articles on Wikipedia that Sony haven't given any accumulative worldwide sales figures for Jackson. However, while checking out Sony's official site for the Visonary video singles (check here), i noticed this sentence: 'An instantly identifiable voice, phenomenal dance moves, stunning musical versatility, and a wealth of sheer star power have seen him sell out stadiums across the globe and generate record sales in excess of 135 million around the world'. This is obviously a very far cry from the 300-350 million that fans have estimated, leading to the problem now of which number should be used. It's probably a better idea to discuss this first, rather than change it now and spark what will likely be a massive edit war.--Count Chocula 03:35, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, I'll start the discussion off. I like that number, it's from Sony's own reps, and it's much more reliable than a "estimate" by, well, I don't even know where that number comes from, the estimate links to the bottom of the page, which links to itself (WTFLOLOMGBBQ ;)???) --Manboobies 08:04, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

text: Well, figures from MJJ Productions are no more biased and no less objective and official than figures from Epic Records. The same is for Darkchild productions, which receives money from Invicible wholesales (11 million, not 8 or whatever). So we have official sales from MJJSource.com (which is archived and can be linked directly via Internet). So there no sense in those "135 million", whether "+" is added, or not; it is outdated information. We have *official* up to 200 million Epic solo records. Just count 2+2. DenisRS 00:59, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

text: For Con -- since Darkchild Production's or MJJ Production's information is no less official than from Epic Records. DCP and MJJP are the companies which receive fees and are responsible to government for taxes (just try to claim more than you have, and find out what is tax checkup is). Publishing that information on a company owned website very well guarantees that overall this information is correct. In fact, the information, published by ER/Sony BMG is outright incorrect, there are up to 65 million of albums missing, and 70 million singles. DenisRS 02:11, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Bit Odd 

message: This article has finally been properly referenced, I now going to take a well deserved nap. I hope that everyone who voted against the article for featured article status because it wasn't properly referenced will retract their votes. Anyone who is reading this, please go to this article's feature article candidate page (found at the top of this talk page) and vote for this article to become a feature article because many users have put countless hours into improving this article and it now lives up to Wikipedia's standard. Street walker 08:16, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article has finally been properly referenced 

message: Hi, Street Walker, you removed information on the current legal action by Deborah Rowe to get custody rights to her 2 children  Street Walker Removes essential info from MJ article Wikipedia Diff of yesterday to the point it was changed . I have put them back. They are essential to the article being unbiased. I have also removed data regarding the case from the history section and moved it as it doesn't belong there. Thanks --Manboobies 19:40, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  small quibble over removal of relevant information 

message: Michael received 17 Grammys... not 13!!!!
*Best R&B Performance, "Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough"
*Album Of The Year ? Thriller 
*Record Of The Year ? Beat It 
*Best Male Pop Performance ? Thriller 
*Producer Of The Year (with Quincy Jones) ? Thriller 
*Best Male Rock Vocal Performance ? Beat It 
*Best Male R&B Vocal Performance ? Billie Jean 
*Best New R&B Song ? Billie Jean 
*Best Recording For Children ? E.T. The Extra Terrestrial Album
*Best Home Video ? The Making Of Thriller 
*Record Of The Year ? We Are the World 
*Song Of The Year ? We Are the World 
*Best Pop Performance By Duo Or Group ? We Are the World 
*Best Music Video Short Form
*Best Video ? Leave Me Alone 
*Living Legend Award 
*Best Music Video (short form)? scream
::Grammy website says otherwise. Are they out to get Michael? No. I've answered that for you. No need to reply. --Manboobies 18:13, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Michael's Grammys 

message: I can't be hassled to work out how to strikethru this. Just pretend it's striked thru, innit. --Manboobies 18:24, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Altering Nicknames without group consensus. 

message: According to the RIAA Michael Jackson is the 14th best selling artist of all time,  .  Before we change all the "best selling" enries in the article, and start numberous edit wars, could we have a discussion here first.  Funky Monkey 21:16, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Biggest selling artist. 

message: I don't think the intro is too long. He's had a very long career. If anyone else agrees and removes the intro tag, i won't complain. --Manboobies 21:51, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've trimmed some of the detail —it was way too long. You guys even went into details and quotes. That's not how an intro is written. Oran e  (t) (c) (e) 14:56, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  intro length