Talk:Zim (Invader Zim)

message: There are no citations for this article, I suggest you get a source.WikiChicken81112 (talk) 21:28, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: [''Citation needed'']

message: Sorry to previous author(s), but this page was a mess IMO. Lots of unfounded speculation about the character, some stuff that probably belongs better in either the Invader Zim mainpage or a spinoff page - is there one for the Irken race?- and a lot of quoting and general fluff that really didn't belong. I  tried to tighten it up and get it to focus just on Zim himself. --J. Random Lurker
*You did a fantastic job, IMHO. J Random Lurker...don't I remember you from the old Zim IRC channel? --InShaneee 06:10, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Explanation of heavy editing 

message: Should these count or shouldn't they? I have seen the Mopiness of Doom material from my previous edit cut out, but The Trial material was left intact. IMO, we can't have it both ways. Do unfinished/unproduced scripts count, or should it be limited to only material that actually was animated and appeared in episodes? If that's the case, several of the Zim pages will need to be scaled back as a large amount of the 'backstory' and background information came unofficially from staff members to fans, rather than being presented in the body of the show proper. Any thoughts on this? J. Random Lurker 01:51, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unfinished episode scripts? 

message: oh, yeah I took out the "Mopiness" part, since that episode, along with several other season 2 episodes seemed pretty inconsistent with the rest of the series.  I guessed at the time that keeping "The Trial" would be okay since it provided some interesting background on Zim's past, but if you wanna go that way, it's fine too.  
Yes, you are right that a good deal of Zim facts were never shown in the actual episodes, but I would take some of the stuff that staff members were saying with no more than a pinch of sand.  I've read some interviews with the creator and various crew members, and a lot of the little details and bg were never offically canonized, but those were just working ideas that they were thinking of just possibly incorporating if the series progressed longer.  So, for that reason, a lot of the outside information could be less than pertinent.
I am also adding a paragraph in for Gaz in the relation section, just to round off the major characters.  I'm pretty sure I hit the whole Zim/Gaz thing on the nose (I even tied in the progressive stupidity theme!), but you can tell me what you think of my insights.
-KneonMunky
*I've removed the Zim/Gaz section in its entirety. The only evidence there was even the slightest thing going on between them is in various fanfiction, which is not appropriate for mention on wikipedia. --InShaneee 19:50, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Here! 

message: *Okay, well you do have to acknowledge this: There are two different suns from which Zim is orbiting.  Looking into season 2 we can still see episodes like "The Girl Who Cried Gnome" in which Zim IS scheming on his latest situation, no Dib- everything is perfect.  He seems to have everything check-mated, happily ready to leave the rock he's on- absolutely no conscious thought of waiting for his nemesis to show up and stir matters.  But then, what do you know, Dib hits the scene, Zim's day is in utter ruin now!  I could go into more examples from episodes like "Room With a Moose" (Zim does state that he would prefer a pleasant mission w/o Dib), and "Plague of Babies" (Gir makes the quip that more than just that baby knows Zim's identity, but Zim retorts by saying that this is actually something serious).  So, in spite of whether one prefers the internally motivated portrayal or not, citing that ONE script would be inheritently bias on characterization, as it is only shedding light on one side of the coin.  In short, Methinks the article would do just fine without the reference.
                 -GetthatNaeonMonkey
*and the fact that the episode in question was written later than those examples I gave Ms totally irrelevant.  Being the casual project that the show was, time really never was a factor in progression.  The show in essence, was  basically a fanfic convention, in which Vasquez was on the most part lenient on what could be written for his creation.  If a key staff member wanted to do their own thing at one point or another, it would likely have made it into the show eventually (particularly true for the second season, of course-those guys just to DULL the chararcter's edge, bast..).  You can probe into commentary, and look up any interview yourself if you don't believe me.  But the point is that a spin put on a character later on is really no more vital than what has been done for the individual in the past. We already know that there was no evidence of character development by the time of "that questionable episode," so we have to assume that the characterization was an insert. (so don't even think of making the argument that the episode being written later makes it a more official interpretation of Zim.)
                -radyactive Neaon Munkey
* I'm not interested in arguing or in 'being right'. That serves no purpose to the wiki. My only concern is to create a balanced, accurate page for Zim's character. Therefore I am going to bleach out all references to any external relationships (Gir, Dib and Gaz included) and retool the section to focus exclusively on Zim's basic personality. Neither the Gaz nor Dib pages take any 'relationship' into account, and I think it could be argued it doesn't belong in Zim either. Having a 'relationship' section only invites shippy arguments of this type anyway. J. Random Lurker 19:01, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Yeah, but..

message: In the paragraph about his resorcefulness and ability to make plans, I feel that the part about his escaping Foodcourtia should be removed. Because it was told to him, it doesn't really show much. Instead, his plot from Dib's Wonderful Life of Doom should be used. 24.34.98.16 (talk) 23:02, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Should we switch out...?

message: I found a book in the bookstore called Not Just Cartoons: Nicktoons! by Jerry Beck. I'm not going to buy it and join the project, but I will ask the other members to get the book so that they can add real world information about various fictional characters.
This makes the creation of separate articles for *many* fictional characters feasible. Having information about the development of the character will make the articles satisfy Wikipedia:Notability (fiction)
WhisperToMe (talk) 04:21, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: A source that could be used: Jerry Beck's Not Just Cartoons: Nicktoons!

message: The article is currently tagged for copy editing. However, there are other problems, such as fancruft. I have done what I could.--Anon423 (talk) 02:25, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Removed the copy edit tag. But the issues are still there.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Anon423 (talk • contribs) 18:34, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Copy-edit