Talk:Conditioned taste aversion

message: *Both articles talk about the same thing and both have good info that can be supplemented. However, both titles are valid according to dictionaries and encyclopedias of psychology. So, I don't know which one to pick.--Janarius 13:45, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge with [[conditioned taste aversion]] 

message: 1. “Taste aversion” and “conditioned taste aversion” are not the same thing, not in terms of behavior. The expression “conditioned taste aversion” implies learning, while simply “taste aversion” doesn’t. It has been demonstrated that animals reject innately certain substances, such as quinine. Therefore, aversion to a taste without the intervention of learning is possible and common. That’s why CTA memory is sometimes referred to as “taste recognition memory”, pointing to the fact that the rejection to a taste has been acquired.
2. CTA may or may not be classical conditioning, but for different reasons. Indeed, in CTA learning the taste is the CS, the gastric malaise the US, and the rejection of the taste (aversion) the CR. CTA may not be a classical conditioning because the CR is not a reflexive response. Also, CTA may not be classical conditioning because of the need of only one pairing between CS-US to elicit a robust CTA and, finally, CTA may not be classical conditioning because one may place several hours between the stimuli to be associated (by the way, that’s why many researchers acknowledge CTA as a very useful memory model, because it provides the ability to experimentally separate the elements involved in the acquisition phase of memory). But CTA is still regarded as a classical conditioning because it follows other properties of classical conditioning, such as stimulus generalization, and the need of several unassociated re-exposures to the CS in order to extinguish the learning. 
3. For me, the fact that CTA can be learned without the requirement of cognitive awareness is not futile. There is experimental evidence that rodents may still acquire CTA even though US is injected when the animal is deeply anesthetized with pentobarbital. But a closely related learning, the attenuation of neophobia (which refers to the opposite effect to CTA, i.e., acquiring preference for a new taste when it has not been followed by gastric malaise) is prevented by pentobarbital anesthesia applied up to one hour before the first presentation of a taste. This evidence suggests that the nervous system processes acquired aversion and preference in different ways. In fact, it has been demonstrated that both memory processes (CTA and attenuation of neophobia) involve similar as well as dissimilar molecular dynamics. What I do think is futile is the affirmation that “Conditioned taste aversion illustrates the argument that in classical conditioning, a response is elicited”
4. The body does not “handle reflexively” the CTA learning! Taste information is conveyed to brainstem structures by the VII, IX and X cranial nerves, while visceral information is taken by X cranial nerve also to brainstem areas. From here, both visceral and taste inputs ascend to the gustatory insular cortex and other structures such as the amydgala. However, it is not known yet where visceral and sensory inputs become associated. By definition, a reflex involves only peripheral processing. So, CTA cannot be just a reflex; instead, it is a learning processed centrally.
5. Finally, the very key features of CTA, such as the need of only one pairing as well as the possibility to separate stimuli for hours for CTA to be established, are mentioned only as “interesting notes”. These characteristics are far more than that. They give CTA exactly the importance as a memory model it has. And in the “applications of taste aversions” section is omitted the largest use given to this learning: its importance as an experimental memory model. Indeed, there are many labs around the world that make use of CTA as a memory paradigm, and research on this model usually is done in order to explore the acquisition, consolidation and retrieval stages of memory formation more easily.
So I strongly suggest this article to be re-written. SchwarzeSchlange 00:10, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not ridiculous, the definition of classical conditioning is that it is established over a number of trials and can be extinguished.  This is not the case for taste aversion, nor for a fear of pain, therefore they are not classical conditioning.  There is no discussion, debate or arguemnt on this any more than there is over the definition of a verb or adjective. --80.42.240.179 16:46, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No, it's not ridiculous, it's just poorly argumented. And it's pointless and sterile being dogmatic about definitions. Keep in mind that theory must match facts, not the opposite. Even though CTA does not fulfill the classical conditioning checklist features in full, it does so in many other characteristics. Definitions of natural phenomena must be capable of being corrected, expanded, or even completely discarded in order to be useful. SchwarzeSchlange 16:59, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Some considerations 

message: No explanation is given for the idea that '... an external stimuli would not produce an internal response, and vice versa' (last paragraph). Neuroschizl (talk) 15:18, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Garcia's study