Talk:Thurgood Marshall

message: I've spent the last month or so rewriting Marshall's article, and I'd appreciate it if some talk-page watchers would take a look at my work: see User:Extraordinary Writ/Thurgood Marshall. It's not perfect, but I've tried my best to put together a fully sourced article that provides a more-or-less comprehensive overview of Marshall's life and work while remaining concise and readable for the million-some-odd people who view this page each year. I don't want to just move it into mainspace without getting the all-clear from folks on the talk page first, so I'd be eager to hear any and all feedback. Thanks in advance! Extraordinary Writ (talk) 00:14, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Just wanted to mention this again: I'd be glad to consider any suggestions or concerns regarding my rewrite before I incorporate it into the mainspace article. If I don't hear anything, I'll just be bold and assume consensus, but I'll still be happy to listen to any feedback, at any point. Cheers, Extraordinary Writ (talk) 07:19, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Just noting for the record that I've moved my rewritten version into mainspace. Again, I'd still be more than happy to listen to any thoughts and comments that talk-page watchers might have—please feel free to let me know if there's anything I've overlooked. Cheers, Extraordinary Writ (talk) 04:16, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Excellent work! I've added an interesting quote by Rehnquist to the "Retirement, later life and death" section. Equilibrial (talk) 10:53, 29 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rewrite 

message: Thurgood marshal was born Thoroughgood Bruh138 (talk) 21:54, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: We already cover that. See the infobox and Note a. --  Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 21:58, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Thurgood's Real Name 

message: Shouldn't Marshall's behind-the-scenes work for the FBI and J. Edgar Hoover (specifically to undermine civil rights activist T. R. M. Howard) be mentioned in this article, if only briefly? Source: https://www.newsweek.com/strangest-bedfellows-169718 173.88.246.138 (talk) 01:39, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Work with FBI and J. Edgar Hoover 

message: Hello fellow editors,
I hope this message finds you well. I'm writing to initiate a discussion regarding the terminology used in the Thurgood Marshall article, specifically the terms "African American" and "Black."
Recent discussions and guidelines, notably those in the context of legal definitions, suggest a more nuanced approach to these terms. According to 28 CFR § 42.402 (e), as referenced in the [Cornell Law School's Legal Information Institute](https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/42.402), the definition for "Black, not of Hispanic Origin" is a person having origins in any of the black racial groups of Africa.
Given Thurgood Marshall's significant contributions and his historical and cultural context, and he was born in American, it may be appropriate to consider if the term "Black" aligns more accurately with current understanding and definitions, rather than "African American."
This discussion aims to align our article with accurate and respectful terminology, considering both historical context and modern legal definitions. I believe it is important to address this in light of evolving understandings of ethnic identities.
I invite all editors to provide their insights and opinions on this matter. Should we consider revising the article to replace instances of "African American" with "Black" in accordance with the federal law definition as stated in 28 CFR § 42.402?
Looking forward to a constructive and respectful discussion.
Best regards,
Sleeplessmason (talk) 16:31, 18 December 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The Manual of Style doesn't give any advice on this particular question, so it's just left to editors' discretion. The article does use both "black" and "African American" in places; typically I just opted for the term that was clearest and read most naturally in context. It's not a hill I'm going to die on, but I don't see a strong reason to get rid of a term that is frequently used in reliable sources and unambiguously conveys the intended meaning. If your concern is about the term generally rather than this article specifically, you might consider bringing it up at WT:MOS, although I expect editors there would say that both terms are acceptable. Note that Wikipedia's style doesn't always match what US government regulations use: typically style guides and reliable sources more generally are given greater weight. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 02:52, 19 December 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with EW, and I'll add that I'm not understanding the argument. Other parts of the federal code use African American synonymously with Black. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 03:14, 19 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Discussion on Terminology: "African American" vs. "Black" in Reference to Thurgood Marshall 

message: Everyone, I don't know how to add a section to the talk page, so sorry for the inconvenience. The Wikipedia article states that Marshall was born on July of 1902, but a government article states that he was born one month earlier.Also, this is the best that I can cite, link is here: https://www.uscourts.gov/educational-resources/educational-activities/justice-thurgood-marshall-profile-brown-v-board — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:249:A00:8C30:3BAA:4756:6B06:4F08 (talk • contribs) 18:29, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Interesting. It looks like this is just a mistake by uscourts.gov: nearly all other online sources use the July date, and all five of the five print books I checked do too. I'm going to send them a message asking them to correct the error, but either way our article should follow the overwhelming majority of sources and use the July date. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 05:24, 17 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Birth date 

message: he was born 1907 40.130.101.194 (talk) 16:17, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
replies: text:  the sources support 1908. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 17:35, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 26 February 2024