Talk:American Quarter Horse/Archive 1

message: I've noticed that many of the breed articles are kind of scattered and not all that well-written.  It's sort of like everyone threw in a paragraph or two on their personal thing, but no one has taken a look at the whole.  I'm taking a stab at cleanup on this one, I'm not a QH expert, so factual errors on bloodlines will have to be for others to fix, but I am a historian and a horse person, as well as an editing geek, so hopefully the changes I've added will improve readability, neutrality, and such. I also suggest more external links and references be added.  Montanabw 19:48, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Old talk

message: "In addition, it has also been proven to be a very useful horse in the sport of Bullfighting.  In Portugal and Spain, they have been known to mix the breed with Lusitanos, making it an exceptional cross-breed.  The combination of the two gives the beauty and bravery of the Lusitano, while the strength & speed is from the AQH."
I am also putting back my "external link" of our site as proof of what I am taling about.  We are in the sport of "Bloodless Bullfighting" here in California.  We give much care to our horses as if they were our children.  While the Lusitano horse is bred for bullfighting, we lean towards acquiring a few AQH's as they have shown great strength and endurance in the arena.  One of our best bullfighting horse is an AQH, which is highly wanted by a LOT of people from the European countries.
Here is our site...
California Bloodless Bullfights
Our site is video and image driven.  It's much easier to show a video of a horse rather than trying to explain in so many words how great the horse is.
Thank you in advance for taking the time to read this.
Kind Regards,
--Webmistress Diva 10:38, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia is not a soapbox.  Will revise accordingly.
No, Wikipedia is not a soapbox, but some people only write what is "common" and not ALL of the facts related to.  It seems that you or whoever took off the bloodless bullfighting portion, because one might think it to be "controversial" rather than a "FACT".  Well, here's fact for you.  Our AQH is one of a kind, and wanted by so many, that one of the top bullfighters in Portugal purchased him from us and already has made headlines.  So, if you are going to talk about the breed, you sometimes have to go to the extent of showing a sample of a horse that exemplifies what you are talking about.  Because a lot of times it's all "mumbo-jumbo" and nobody knows any better other than what they are reading.  Wikipedia is similar to the encyclopedia where it should be able to educate a person and NOT exclude real facts.  And because this is the "internet", it's easier to include a lot more information than your typical encyclopedia.
The reason why I push for "Bloodless Bullfighting" is this.... unlike the traditional style in Spain and Mexico, the bulls at Bloodless Bullfights in California are NOT bled, NOR are they killed at the end.  And because they are not bled, it takes an extremely brave and talented horse to outrun and outsmart a bull.  In addition, the bloodless bullfight truly shows the art and skill of both the horse and the horse rider.
Does any of this make sense?  I hope so.--Webmistress Diva 03:13, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I added the following paragraph... 

message: I think horses are interesting and an amazing species, but American Quarter Horses are highly liked among Americans and over-sea horse-lovers. Lots of horse racers like to have an American Quarter Horse because they are breed to run the quarter mile. These horses have proven themselves what they were breed for.
The American Quarter Horse can range from 14.3 to 16 hands in height. They have a wide range of colours also [ any solid ]. A proven fact of these beautiful horses that they can run a quarter mile faster than any other breed. I can't believe in that last discussion the person asked if anyone even liked American Quarter Horses. To me that is just the outrageous comment I have ever heard about horses. In conclusion I think all horses are great horses are like people they have feelings and senses too. They are a very important animal in the world.
Nikky Furrie
for more comments and information on horses please contact www.stcgirl33@yahoo.com
:just cleaned up formatting of the aboveMontanabw 23:02, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  American Quarter Horses and Horses, In My Opinion 

message: This is a really great start on an article, but it seems like a lot of the sentences are ambiguous or unclear.  I’ve gone through and tried to fix some ambiguities, like the ones below.
:“The versatile Quarter Horses is also shown in English disciplines, driving, and many other horse activities.”
What is this sentence trying to say? That the versatility of the QH is demonstrated by its use in English disciplines? That the “versitile QH” is also used in English discipline?  Also, “horse activities” makes me think of the activities horses do on their own, such as eating, rolling in dirt etc (lol), so I’m changing it to “equestrian events.”  
:“Commonly believed to be the world’s fastest horse…”
Commonly believed by whom? (See WP:CITE) I’ll try to find a citation for this, unless someone already knows of one.
:“One of the most famous of these early imports was a Thoroughbred grandson of the Godolphin Arabian, Janus, foaled in 1746 and imported to colonial Virginia.”
This sentence is unclear: Was Janus foaled in 1746, or was the grandson? Was the Godolphin Arabian named Janus, or was Janus the grandson?  
After some research, I’ve reworded it to this:
:“One of the most famous of these early imports was Janus, a Thoroughbred who was the grandson of the Godolphin Arabian.  He was foaled in 1746, and imported to colonial Virginia in 1756.”
and hopefully it’s clearer now. I'll keep working on it, and if I've misinterpreted a sentence meaning, please feel free to fix it.Tanyia 19:34, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks like some good edits, my earlier edits of what was a complete disaster of an article were only of the most basic "cleanup" variety and I didn't dig too deeply into the overall article to fine-tune some of the weaker spots.  I'll look over your changes more carefully and if I see room for improvement will make a few tweaks.  I thought I had a cite in there to where QH's have been clocked at 50 mph, but maybe that's on the horse article or the horse racing article...check...seems like I saw the stat on aqha.com Montanabw 23:01, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Sentence Structure

message: I just looked at AQHA.com to get a citation for "4 million horses wordlwide," but they say there are 3,224,096 horses registered worldwide, so I've changed it.  Was the 4 million including something other than the AQHA registered horses? Tanyia 17:46, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If that's their official count and you've cited it, then let's keep it. Montanabw 03:35, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

text: Well, there are probably a considerable number of unregistered horses, but I don't know of any study attempting to estimate the count of these. Deco 11:14, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think technically, an unregistered horse is a "quarter-type" horse and not officially a Quarter Horse--at least, I am sure that's the registry's position.  Usually a registerable horse that is not registered is that way for a reason--it's a cull and considered unsuitable for registration (by its breeder, at least).  This would be true for any breed.  For Wikipedia's purposes, we need to cite verifiable information, so I support using the figures of the AQHA, who, presumably wants there to be as many Quarter horses as possible to boost their claim of being #1. ;-)  Montanabw 21:49, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

text: There is probably room here for a small section on the American Quarter Horse breed in Australia.  (FYI, there is also a separate article on Australian Stock Horse, too)  The EI issue is not breed-specific, so irrelevant here, though I think there may be an article on equine influenza in here somewhere, check :Category:Horse diseases) Feel free to either draft something here or just do an edit in the article and if it needs some work, the rest of us will tweak it as needed.  Try to have some footnotes so we can verify the sources.   Montanabw(talk) 04:30, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Number of Horses Worldwide

message: Would the hind quarters of a quarter horse be only one-sixteenth of a horse? Wahkeenah 00:13, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: <GROAN!>  Montanabw 06:00, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Oddity 

message: Removed all references to bloodless bullfighting.  This is a repeated instance of POV pushing of what is obviously your own personal business.  You have repeatedly been violating any number of wikipedia policies with this, across multiple articles, and in absence of citations to verifiable references other than your own self-promotional materials, this material is nothing more than a POV soapbox and business promotion.  I really do not wish to submit this issue to formal arbitration, but you really have to let it go. YOU CANNOT PROMOTE YOURSELF ON WIKIPEDIA!!!  You must have a neutral point of view.  Go fix the bloodless bullfiighting article, list all the breeds you want to there, but leave these breed articles alone, please. There are probably 10 quarter horses in the country that are trick horses or whatever too.  We don't put in a laundry list of every last thing you do with horses.  Montanabw 04:10, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  NO POV Pushing 

message: I owned 2 absolutely beautiful quarter horses until 1994, in belleville and then hudson, mi.. Due to hardships of a personal nature I had to sell them.It was like selling 2 of my kids- it was horrible!!Their names were "Guys Tuff Doll"(Tuffy) and her son "Tuffs Little Bit" (Little Bit or Bit).Tuffy was a bay and had deformed front teeth when I bought her.We felt it was probably a shoeing "issue" that lead to her teeth being knocked sideways ,as she was terrified,to the point of hurting herself or the farrier. With ALOT of gentle working ,and coaxing ,and grain rewarding,and going through many farriers we had her nervous but o.k. to stand still and be shod within a year.(Finding a gentle farrier was a big help too.)Her son was a butterscotch color with red-blonde mane and tailand was built like a tank.He was born in winter and had a terrible foal diease that normally is fatal. But I was out in that barn ever 3 hours holding him up-quite literally- so he could nurse.He got so heavy that i had to sit on 5 gallon buckets and prop him on my knees as he ate.Within a month he was able to finally stand-wobbly- and eat.So needless to say he bonded with me as well as his mom.They were truely my babies.I had the name of the person they were sold to , but she moved, as did I,and I lost track of them.Im hoping that someone who may know them , or about them,will see this.Im not seeking to do anything more than see if they are o.k. If they have a good home ,Id be happy.I realize they would be old ,if theyre still alive. ANY news would be greatly appreciated.Please, if you see this,PLEASE pass it on to friends as the more people who see this the better chance I have of hearing back from some one.Thank You, Carol Riffle.My e-mail is cr2008mi@yahoo.com for any news.24.11.44.56 (talk) 18:43, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: You need to contact the American Quarter Horse Association, they may be able to help you. THis is not the place for that sort of thing, unfortunately. Ealdgyth - Talk 18:46, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  looking for 2 horses 

message: The compact body of the American Quarter Horse is well-suited to the intricate and speedy maneuvers required in reining, cutting, working cow horse, barrel racing, calf roping, and other western riding events, especially those involving live cattle.
I'm not going to put too much time into the presentation.  Someone else can clean it up if they think it has merit.  Otherwise, allow it's delapidated condition as an indicator of general disagreement or disinterest.
Attempting to identify a breed for a novel that would be suitable for long distances across desert terrain, and someone suggested Quarter Horses.  I'm here to verify that they are suitable for long-distance travel (as previously mentioned) and discover in the 1st paragraph it does not appear so.  They "specialize" in short, high-speed activities.  Like Cheetahs, who have an extremley high level of energy for a short duration.  Cheetahs lack stamina for this reason.
Do Quarter Horses lack stamina also, and for similar reasons ?  I would assume so, so I'm looking to confirm this.
But can't because of the quote above.
"Working Horses" are used for all of those things.  They are used for all of the skills that are listed, but the article seems to treat these as if they are separate and distinct elements on a list, when if fact they are held together by a common denominator which is that all of the "show" events are specfically designed to proove that a particular animal (and therefore it's assumed the bloodline) will be suited for actually working on a real ranch, and is not some investor's idea of a long-term retirement income source.
All the skills are part of the larger whole.  The entire point is to breed these horses to WORK.  Putting some effort into conveying this notion seems like a good idea to me, because the way it is constructed currently throws all these things into a common list as if the relationship of the elements to each other is instinctively understood, and it is not.  Most people reading this will not know this until now, this very moment.
1)  That's worth something; providing information most people will not know as an aside to providing them the information they knew they didn't know, and came looking do discover.
2)  I have a huge ego, and would like to see my suggestion adopted so I can tell all my friends how great I am.  Or, if you reject me, I'll badmouth wikipedia and everyone associated with it forever.  (Or at least until one of my suggestions is adopted, and then my opinion of you-all will change immediately.  Might as well be now, eh ?
3)  I could be wrong, but I happen to live in Texas where these things still happen.  Maybe not as much as in Wyoming, but then Wyoming doesn't have oil.  It's like Belgium; sort of a "non-state".  (Bonus points for those that get that one...)  The "things" I refer to are situations where real working animals are still used.  Whether or not they are actually necessary is a good question.
4)  To present the information in an incorrect manner is going to give the impression that it was written by some elite, effeminate danday with a fancy tie and part-time call girl for a girlfriend, instead of by a man or woman that knew the subject-matter first hand.
5)  I'm tired of thinking of more items to add to this list, and to be honest I've forgotten what this was list of, and I'd rather not go backwards, so instead I'll just end it here.
````Jonny Quick  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jonny Quick (talk • contribs) 07:25, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reorganize the Physical Attributes and Behaviors between Work and Not Work