Talk:Týr

message: :"The Fountain of Tyr" was the alleged practice of berserkers of cutting off their own hand to use the blood from the spurting artery to blind an opponent.
I removed this for lack of reference (nothing was to be found on the web. is it in the Edda?) dab (T) 16:36, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I have never heard of it. I believe it is crank.--Wiglaf 20:02, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: seems like it.  it was here for 7 months. never cite WP as a reference... seems to strkie a chord, though ... dab (T) 21:55, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I guess the last link is the source of the info. Well, the fact that it is about Vikings vs. Romans is a tell-tale sign it is bogus. I have wondered about veracity of the fountain of Tyr for seven months. It is sad that Wikipedia is littered with things like that.--Wiglaf 22:23, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Haha.. I'm so glad these pages are getting more attention than they did a year ago. :bloodofox: 02:42, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "Fountain"

message: Consequently, the Tyr rune was carved onto spearheads and onto the hilts of swords, so that Tyr would aid the owner in battle. 
:I was unable to find a pre-700 example of this (n Looijenga). Maybe during the Viking Age? In any case, I replaced it with a reference to the Lindholm amulet. dab (ᛏ) 15:32, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I am afraid I lack a book on it at the moment. OlofE, who is somewhat of an expert on runes, wrote at Talk:Norse mythology:The most visible deity in runic text is Tyr. The name itself, and the rune, was used for a long time as an incantation of power. Many old inscriptions consist only of a tyr (T) rune, often repeated or multiplied (a stem with 7 bars on each side for instance). This is especially common in old, short inscriptions on weapons. The problem with Looijenga is that he he excludes the vast majority of runic inscriptions by limiting himself to the period prior to 700 and to the area around the North Sea (but as both of us know, limiting the scope is one of the major tasks when writing a dissertation).--Wiglaf 17:32, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: (Looijenga is a she, I think) that's right. Maybe I shouldn't have removed it. I readily believe the rune was used in this way, but I would have liked a rough reference as to when the practice was common. Often on WP, all things Germanic seem to be lumped together, and I have grown wary of general statements about "Germanic" customs. I have tried to find out about the practice of inscribing runes on swords, and it seems there is not a single example of runes actually being written on the blade. There are quite a few examples of runes on the hilt or on the scabbard, though, but most examples I have found seem to be names. I would just ask that the statement about the Tyr runes is re-introduced with a rough reference to a time period, and maybe a couple of prominent examples. dab (ᛏ) 18:10, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I am not sure I can satisfy those demands at the moment, but I am not insisting on having it in the text. I just thought it might be interesting to the general reader.--Wiglaf 19:01, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)

text: the "especially in old inscriptions" part at least seems unsubstantiated, however. because in a runic context, 'old' would certainly mean Elder Futhark / pre-8th-century. dab (ᛏ) 18:36, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, in my mind old inscriptions means prior to the 11th century when most inscriptions were made in Sweden.--Wiglaf 19:01, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: I see. this is probably a question of "Germanic" vs. "Norse" mindset. (the name Tyr is Norse, but the article treats the proto/pan-Germanic god). I suppose at the moment it seems probable that this use of the Tyr rune was common during the Viking Age, i.e. post-800, pre-1000. I have really had a hard time finding any swords inscribed with runes, no matter where (hilt, pommel, blade, scabbard...) dab (ᛏ) 19:09, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Runeswords

message: The reference at the end to Tyr being a god in "Bioware's Neverwinter Nights" is wrong. The game had no direct link to the Tyr in Norse mythology, but rather Tyr has been a god in the Forgotten Realms game world for many years, and that was drawn from Norse mythology. I'm not going to change it, but someone else should.
:I've altered the entry to reflect this. :bloodofox: 03:23, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Neverwinter Nights

message: There are two mentions of Tyr being identified with Mars, which begs for an explicit discussion in the article.  Is it merely that they're both war gods?  Or is Tyr descended in some way from Mars?  (I wouldn't think so.)
I would add that the picture is pretty, but it's not nearly contemporaneous; though its style looks to me like it was meant to look like it was from the 1100s, it's from the 1700s and is hardly an authentic source when considering any Tyr/Mars connection.  Tempshill 19:52, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The picture is meant as a decoration rather than an authentic source of anything (except 18th century Icelandic art). The Týr/Mars connection is old, though. Old Norse Týsdagr (English Tuesday) corresponds to the Roman dies Martis. - Haukurth 20:42, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The Latin word dies Martis was calqued into words akin to Tyr's day in the different old Germanic languages. Tyr is not descended from Mars, but had some similar traits, mainly also being a god of war. 85.226.122.237 13:19, 17 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tyr and Mars 

message: I've read about a statue of Tyr wearing a horned helmet that was unearthed in Zealand, Denmark in 200 BC. I've also seen photographs of this statue.  Unfortunately, with a google image search I'm having trouble finding a decent photo of the original statue but plenty of apparent reproductions from your usual New Age merchants.  However, I can't seem to find too much information regarding it outside of where it was found and the supposed date. If it's to be trusted, I think a photograph of the statue would be quite appropriate for this article. :bloodofox: 04:33, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There were no cameras in 200BCE though...120.29.109.137 (talk) 04:26, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

text: It's a nice statue, and if you can get hold of a free image, it would be perfect on horned helmet and Pre-Roman Iron Age, but I have serious doubts that the statue can be identified with "Tyr" in any sensible way. The statue itself is notable. The "Tyr" identification is likely  New Age merchants' fiction (200 BC is Proto-Germanic. If anything, the statue depicts "Tiwaz", but since it is not labelled, this is simply free guesswork). dab (ᛏ) 08:20, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: As it stands, Tiwaz currently redirects here. In fact, I think I did that. :) What do you think about a passing reference on the page about the statue sometimes being associated? It was found in Denmark and it seems to be intentionally missing a hand. What else is it going to be? Of course, I understand that this isn't the place to decide that. However, there is the similarity and maybe it deserves a mention? :bloodofox: 17:10, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll be glad for a discussion of the statue. I agree that the missing hand is a strong hint. Where did you read it was dated to 200 BC? If we can identify it, we can certainly draw a connection. To begin with, you'll need its inventory number, and you may be able to google it on a museum homepage. If the museum exhibits it as "Tyr" that will be good enough. What museum is it in? dab (ᛏ) 17:38, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: ah, I found your source,  This piece depicts the god with battle-ax, and replicates a bronze original dated circa 200 BCE, from Zealand in Denmark.; we could email sacredsource.com and ask for identification. Their Odin Thor and Freyr  are nice too, and they are straightforward to identify, actually dating to the Viking Age, they would be nice additions to the respective articles if we can find free images. dab (ᛏ) 17:55, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have added a bit about the Thor statue to the Thor article and also sent an e-mail to Sacred Source to see if they know what museum it is in and/or an inventory number or, really, anything else outside of the location where it was found. I couldn't really find much of anything on the internet about it either after looking around for some time. So far, no response but I'll let you know when I get one. :bloodofox: 06:34, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

text: I received a response from the company today. Unsurprisingly, they didn't know anything about the statue outside what was provided to them. I'll keep looking and ask some friends. :bloodofox: 21:07, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

text: If you are talking about Turmar (April-May), remember that is in the relation with Saint George (none other than Hercules). Tyr is not the greco-roman Ares-Mars, is in fact Hercules. The roman's mistake regarding Tyr-Mars is similar with another: Odhin-Mercury. Bigshotnews 02:05, 10 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Tyr statue

message: Use of the symbol as a racist emblem is documented here. I wasn't sure where to cite so please feel free to transplant the reference where appropriate. Angrynight 01:27, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello angrynight, I've removed your reference from the article because it's already covered on the main article for the rune. All we need here is a small summary of the rune and how it relates to Tyr. :bloodofox: 01:38, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Citation

message: The characterisation of Germanic intentions as genocidal and the pretensions to actually know the intent behind different types of bog sacrifices are going to require citation. I am somewhat familiar with the migration era legends, and to say definitively that they represent this or that about bronze age and early iron age cultic practises is a matter of interpretation, not established fact. --Fire Star 17:32, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup notice. 

message: "En stundum vakti hann upp dauða menn or jörðu, eða settist undir hanga; fyrir því var hann kallaðr drauga dróttinn eða hanga dróttinn."	
Sometimes even he called the dead out of the earth, or set himself beside the burial-mounds; whence he was called the ghost-sovereign, and lord of the mounds.
Hmm... The English translation above doesn't fit with the Old Norse, it must be a translation of a text which had "hauga" and "hauga dróttinn". Anyway, hanga" is the genitive plural of the word 'hangi', "a body hanging on a gallows". Haukur 16:48, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: you are right, and I shouldn't have made the edit. "god of the hanged" just sounded a bit strange, but I suppose having been hanged himself made Odin something like a patron of the hanged? In any case a literal translation is preferable when in doubt. dab (ᛏ) 20:39, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: IIRC, the name "god of the hanged" derives from the fact that only Odin received sacrifices through hanging.--Berig 09:54, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Quote from Ynglinga saga, regarding Hanga-týr 

message: It seems to me that there is a linguistic similarity between the two above. It might offend Modern mores suggesting that Celtic God and a Germanic one may have the same basis, but they both have common attributes. the "Tis" at the end of the former and the "Ti" are surely cognate? Brendandh 00:27, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *t and *t doesn't correspond for Germanic and Celtic languages. Germanic *t corresponds to Celtic *d, and Celtic *t corresponds to Germanic *þ. According to the comparative method, Týr would correspond etymologically to Irish Dagda. 惑乱 分からん * \)/ (\ (< \) (2 /) /)/ * 14:27, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: in fact, just the -da of Dagda :) --dab (𒁳) 11:41, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If that were true, where does tuatha fit in? Tuatha is taken to mean 'tribe' or 'people' as is 'teuton'; ultimately both stem from Proto Indo European *teuta meaning 'tribe'. I think you dismiss links between the two gods too quickly and with incorrect information/reasoning.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C6:6519:AB00:418B:FEB1:80D2:4BD3 (talk) 14:51, 25 April 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Toutatis/Tîwaz

message: The article was using all three forms of this name interchangeably, and confusingly. I cleaned it up by leaving the link to" Fenrisulfr", but using "Fenris" everywhere else, since that's the name I'm most familiar with. Of course, I don't know jack about any of this, so if someone who does wants to go in after me and change it, please make sure you're doing it in a way that doesn't reintroduce the confusion.
71.212.19.193 16:53, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fenrisulfr/Fenrir/Fenris 

message: Father of Tyr is Odin, mother is giantess Hrod. Hrod is wife of Hymir. That's why Tyr once was called son of Hymir.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.86.230.114 (talk) 08:13, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  PARENTS 

message: I think Tacitus has mistook Tyr-Tiwaz for Tuisto. First man -Mannaz is sooner his son,then of unidentified Tuisto.11:09, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tiwaz is Tuisto 

message: There is a famous Kipling poem about Tyr sacrificing an eye (rather than an arm) to kill a wolf.  It has been set to music a few times.  Should it be mentioned in the article? 69.228.171.150 (talk) 03:14, 1 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kipling 

message: In lithuanian father is "tėvas".
pronunciation "teiwas" and "tėvas" is very similar.
"father" ("tėvas") and "god"("dievas") concept (in ancient Lithuania) are associated.
the Tiwaz rune is very similar to the mark of the god in old baltic religion
Maybe it's just a coincidence?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Freelogin (talk • contribs) 20:36, 17 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: That would need a proper etymology.  In a parallel example Greek 'theos' and Latin 'deus' both mean 'god', and looks similar but aren't actually related.  So, maybe you're right, maybe not.  Ekwos (talk) 23:02, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Teiwaz - Tėvas? 

message: I've been searching for ancient representations of Tyr in the archaeological record. All I have managed to find on the internet is this commercial site which claims their statue is a replica of one found in Zealand (Denmark) and dated to 200 BCE : 
http://www.sacredsource.com/Norse-Tyr-statue-7/productinfo/NTY/
I can't find anything else about this statue except commercial websites selling this replica. It would be nice to have more info on this and perhaps a picture of the real thing. Does anyone have info on this? Munin75 (talk) 16:39, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Damn, I just noticed this was discussed above. My bad :/ Munin75 (talk) 16:42, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: This is indeed a Bronze Age statue, and one of a number of similar objects. I think that this particular one may be housed at the Nationalmuseet in Copenhagen (at least I seem to recall seeing it there...). Next time I am there I will take a look at it. :bloodofox: (talk) 15:15, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Archaeology 

message: I am a bit surprised by the Norwegian name for Týr being given as Ty. Since Týr is hardly a common subject of everyday conversation, I accept the possibility that this may have changed without me noticing, but I am Norwegian and I have never heard the version Ty. In books, in conversations and in primary school classes on Norse mythology I have only ever come across Tyr. On Norwegian Wikipedia the article on the god himself is titled "Ty", but in the article on Norse mythology he is listed as Tyr, which makes it all the more confusing. Can anyone enlighten me on this point? Has there simply been a spelling change I have missed, or what? Maitreya (talk) 07:43, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The Old Norse form of the god's name is Týr and all modern Scandinavian forms stem from this. Maybe they've just dropped the nominative -r in this case? :bloodofox: (talk) 15:12, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm just wondering when this might have happened, or if Ty is perhaps a regional variant that I'm not familiar with, because honestly, before reading this article I would have had no idea what a fellow Norwegian was going on about if he came up to me and started talking about "Ty". Maitreya (talk) 06:40, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm also Norwegian, and I've always heard him referred to as "Ty" in Norwegian. The 'r' is a nominative masculine ending, and if one were to keep those for the other gods, we would've had "Thorr" and "Odinn", so the dropping of the last 'r' is congruent with naming conventions. It occurred during the transition from Old Norse to Middle Norwegian after the Plague, I believe. It's why one says "tysdag" in nynorsk. Not sure why we say "tirsdag" in bokmål, though.
Sir Godspeed (talk) 01:49, 6 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Norwegian Name 

message: I'm removing the link under the See Also Section to the comic "Ink Pen."  The link would be more appropriate in a separate section titled along the lines of "Týr in Popular Culture" or the like
Sxoa (talk) 11:05, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removing Ink Pen Link 

message: It has a source (of sorts!!) but is far too unscientific. Tyrol couldn't possibly be from Tyr-Ull, as neither of that is High German or Italian! The Mummy (talk) 19:38, 5 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tyrol, delete from list of toponyms? 

message: Substituted at 09:26, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Assessment comment

message: Just wanted to note that Tyr is included in :Category:Sky and weather gods but the article doesn't seem to touch on either concept.
:My guess is due to the connections with Dyaus (and thus with Zeus and Jupiter), but I don't remember any references to Tyr as a sky god in the myths aside from that, so beats me. RoninMacbeth (talk) 00:10, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Listed as Sky and Weather God but article doesn't explain why 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: i've been trying to look for a source showing Tyr (or his proto-Germanic cognate) of being the once-chief deity of the Germanic pantheons, but I can't find any. Can anyone please help with that? RoninMacbeth (talk) 00:07, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello, Ronin. There’s nothing from the historical record that flatly states that Tyr was once a chief deity among the Germanic peoples. This is presumed due to the etymology of the god’s name, which indicates that he is an extension of a central Proto-Indo-European deity (see dyeus). I’ll bump a rewrite of this article up in my priority list. :bloodofox: (talk) 01:48, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for that. Also, should I change the part where it says Tiwaz was overtaken in authority by Odin during the Migration Period? Tacitus' Germania says "Above all other gods they worship Mercury..." Tacitus does still seem to imply that Tiwaz was still of great importance by his time, though. RoninMacbeth (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 20:55, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem, Ronin. There's no need to modify this article as it exists—it has quite a few problems. However, prompted by your comments, I'm currently preparing a rewrite of this article. You can read my draft as it progresses here: User:Bloodofox/sandbox. :bloodofox: (talk) 21:00, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I've launched a rewrite of the article in line with our approach to other figures form Germanic myth, including Odin and Freyja. I'll be adding more to this in days to come. :bloodofox: (talk) 23:47, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: The article is now in a stable state with all major points covered. I'll be adding more as time permits. :bloodofox: (talk) 22:57, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Help With Source 

message: Does anyone know what Týr is holding in his right hand in the Trollhättan bracteate illustration?  --Invokingvajras (talk) 17:06, 27 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Trollhättan bracteate

message: Should this page explain how the deity is related to chi?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.131.235.234 (talk) 08:07, 17 December 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Related to what? Chi as in life force? Catfish Jim and the soapdish 08:17, 17 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Chi Can