Talk:Sikhism/Archive 3

message: "The sixth guru, Har Gobind, was responsible for the creation of the Akāl Taḵẖt (throne of the timeless one)."  CORRECT
"The Akāl Taḵẖt serves as the supreme decision-making centre of Sikhdom and sits opposite the Harimandir Sāhib."  CORRECT
"The Sarbat Ḵẖālsā is a gathering of a representative portion of the Ḵẖālsā Panth."  CORRECT - EACH GROUP SENDS SOME SELECTED REPRESENTATIVES ALONG WITH A SPOKESMAN.
"The Sarbat Ḵẖālsā historically gathers at the Akāl Taḵẖt when there is a need to discuss matters that affect the entire Sikh nation."  YES - MEETINGS ALSO OCCUR ON VAISAKHI AND DIWALI.
"A gurmatā (literally, guru's intention) is an order passed by the Sarbat Ḵẖālsā in the presence of the Gurū Granth Sāhib."  CORRECT - THE ROLE OF THE JATHEDAR OF THE AKAL TAKHT IS NOT TO MAKE ANY DECISION BY HIMSELF, BUT TO HEAR ALL SPOKESPEOPLE AND ANNOUNCE THE CONSENSUS DECISION THAT HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED.  IF REVISIONS NEED TO BE MADE TO AN INITIAL DECISION, THE SIKHS ARE CONSULTED WITH AGAIN.
"A gurmatā may only be passed on a subject that affects the fundamental principles of Sikh religion."  THE FUNDAMENTALS OF THE SIKH RELIGION ARE ALREADY WELL-ESTABLISHED.  SIKHISM IS A WHOLE-LIFE PHILOSOPHY.
"A gurmatā is not binding on all Sikhs unless issued directly by the Akāl Taḵẖt after which it is known as a hukamnāmā (literally, edict or royal order)."  FALSE - A GURMATA IS BINDING ON ALL SIKHS.  A GURMATA IS ONLY ISSUED BY JATHEDAR OF AKAL TAKHT ANYWAY, SO HUKAMNAMA ISSUE DOES NOT COME INTO THIS.
"A hukamnāmā represents the "will of the Sikh community."  FALSE - HUKAMNAMA IS MEANT TO REFER TO A HYMN FROM GURU GRANTH SAHIB GIVEN AS AN ORDER FOR ALL THE SIKHS (LITERAL MEANING IS 'WRITTEN ORDER').  RECENTLY PEOPLE ARE USING 'HUKAMNAMA' INTERCHANGABLY WITH 'GURMATA' TO REFER TO ORDERS BY JATHEDAR OF AKAL TAKHT, BUT ORIGINALLY THIS WAS NOT THE CASE.
I am leaving for India soon so I wish everybody the best of luck for the next month.  The more participation with this article, the better it is.  I encourage as many people to participate as possible - leave a comment if nothing else.  --hardeep 04:52, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Review of Decision Making Section 

message: Hi,
I'm going to incorporate Hardeep's comments and do a final copyedit.  Then I'll ask Rama's Arrow to do a copyedit, after which I'll put this baby up for nomination as a FA! Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 22:39, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm on the job. Rama's Arrow 23:14, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Final Push to FA 

message: Please vote here: Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Sikhism. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 00:19, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article is now a Featured Article Candidate 

message: There is no excuse for personal attacks on other contributors. Please do not make them. It is your responsibility to foster and maintain a positive online community in Wikipedia. Violations of this policy may result in a block of your editing privileges. ≈ jossi ≈  t • @ 16:09, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Personal attacks warning 

message: Sikh , non-sikhs or anything else, please comment on the following. REMEMBER THIS IS JUST AN DISCUSSION NOT PROTEST OR POINTING OUT OF FAULTS OR CRITISISM. I am just an 18 year old boy who has no resources and want to discuss the following with responsible, intelligent people in a FRIENDLY manner.
The Sikhism scene in punjab is quit worsening these days.I mean Sikhism was Made to remove all the flaws and meaningless rituals of the society then but now people are building more of these just by wrong interpretations.
REMEMBER ITS JUST A DISCUSSION
*Guru Nanak Dev ji made the whole religion to remove belives like IDOL WORSHIP . But i've heard gurudwaras that keep Datun (kinda toothbrush) near the Guru Granth Sahib, Bath the whole Book (and flow it in water when it gets old) and thousands of people bow down to the book with their head covered and do not turn their backs toward the book ( with all my respects) as if all the gurus are actually in it . TELL ME ISNT THIS IDOL WORSHIP ITSELF ? what else did guru nanakji proved when he moved the whole Mecca along as the muslims moved his feet . We are idol worshiping . GURU GOBIND SINGH JI says Guru maane Granth ( Guru = Granth - a holy book). Its a metaphor. You can evaluate it as if the Granth is the next and only guru. But their also lies a deeper meaning that Guru is as diverse , powerful and true as a granth 
*Caste and groups have flourished to an unimaginable level. We now have diffrent types of sikhs - Jatt Sikh , Ravidasia Siikh etc etc. Even today in the rural punjab , its still unimaginable that a intercaste marriage occurs. Why is that happening. Instead of resolving the issue of caste we are impowering it by stating that Jatts are the real sikhs because they are brave or something like All minorities or low castes are the real sikhs because the Panj Piyare( the 5 chosen ones)  were all those. Isnt this a strict violation to the sayings of the GURUS . 
*I DEEPLY RESPECT PEOPLE KEEPING ALL THE K'S but Why do we only consider only Turban wearing men, who dont cut their hair , keep a kirpan , wear a kada ,etc etc to be a Full Sikh. Does the Guru Granth Sahib state somewhere that a sikh should do that? Did gurunankji or his followers said that ? Come on they were Saints and they had their lifestyle so as to appear a man of god (or saadhu,sage ,saint whatever you call it) to the public then.That is why their depiction in art resembles a sardaar. All the other people in the baani like Guru Kabeer Das and Guru Ravidas etc are not considered SIKH and their followers are Denied the facilities of SIKH COMMUNITY . We have Gurudwaras where the priest denies holy rituals (marriage , crimination ) just because the person is a MONNA ( dont keep the K's). That really is depressing. Have you Honestly seen any MONNA reading the guru granth sahib ? no right !! Why ? Because they are not allowed to .WITH ALL MY RESPECTS Is the Beard or the turban going to read the baani ? SIKHISM WAS CREATED TO REMOVE DISCRIMINATION AND WE ARE ONLY PRODUCING IT MORE.
I know Guru Gobind Singh ordered that but it was then to make the KHAALSA , an army . These were so designed to make a strict code of Discipline in the infantry . I BELIEVE IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RELIGION. Beside WITH ALL MY RESPECTS Guru Gobind Singh ji's Baani is not even in the Guru Granth Sahib , his baani is in Vichtra Natak and other similiar installments and he even goes to a point cursing everyone who calls him guru shall go to HELL. He only considered himself of being an army leader . So why a discrimination is a Sardaar and a Monna
*the purest thing i found in the granth was to get the essence of god through a guru in person. but we are neglecting this and we are bowing our heads to a book ( I dont want to hurt anyone , i state this with all my respects for other people's belives). No body needs to technically go to a gurudwara , you can have god right next to you when you are meditating with the purest devotion right in you home just with a help of a guru. But what are we doing. We are Making the golden temple more GOLDEN when the money could have flourished 1000s of poor poeple's home and doing all the Sharaahn (stuff in the outer world) . I mean out of 10 sikh people i meet only 0.5 know what a guru is and what meditation is.( but that can be true maybe in only my case and maybe i havent met the more of those people) . We are wearing a turban, keeping all the K's and doing every thing worldy while deep inside our hearts we are becoming more political, more corrupt and more proud and egoistic. Something has to be done about that. I and my fellow youth have the power to bring back the True meaning of the word SIKH - a student.
Anudeep Toora - A sikh only at the heart but a monna at the world
=== Comment 1 ===
I'll quickly respond to your points.  Remember, my response is only a quick one, so I may have missed some points.  Anyhow, I'm not entirely certain that wikipedia is the best place to present a discussion of what you have mentioned (though I will give it a try) : 
*Guru Nanak Dev ji made the whole religion to remove belives like IDOL WORSHIP . But i've heard gurudwaras that keep Datun (kinda toothbrush) near the Guru Granth Sahib, Bath the whole Book (and flow it in water when it gets old) and thousands of people bow down to the book with their head covered and do not turn their backs toward the book ( with all my respects) as if all the gurus are actually in it . TELL ME ISNT THIS IDOL WORSHIP ITSELF ? what else did guru nanakji proved when he moved the whole Mecca along as the muslims moved his feet . We are idol worshiping . GURU GOBIND SINGH JI says Guru maane Granth ( Guru = Granth - a holy book). Its a metaphor. You can evaluate it as if the Granth is the next and only guru. But their also lies a deeper meaning that Guru is as diverse , powerful and true as a granth
> I'm not sure if this is idol worship as such.  Idols are usually statues and the like.  According to Idolatry, it is important to realise that it is not merely sufficient for an idol to be present during worshipping in order to be labelled an idolator - one has to actually worship the idol itself.  Now, it is an interesting issue as to whether Christians are committing idolatry when they attend mass/congregate in front of the bible, etc... However, you see my point - if people read a book so that they may worship God, this should not be labelled idolatry (though, if people don't understand the contents of the book, and therefore end up falling into the bad habit of idol worship, then this is a different matter - but, just as most Christians would say that they can read the bible and understand it, so might most Sikhs state that they can understand the read contents of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib).  
*Caste and groups have flourished to an unimaginable level. We now have diffrent types of sikhs - Jatt Sikh , Ravidasia Siikh etc etc. Even today in the rural punjab , its still unimaginable that a intercaste marriage occurs. Why is that happening. Instead of resolving the issue of caste we are impowering it by stating that Jatts are the real sikhs because they are brave or something like All minorities or low castes are the real sikhs because the Panj Piyare( the 5 chosen ones) were all those. Isnt this a strict violation to the sayings of the GURUS .
> This is probably a completely random observation.  I doubt that Sikhs will speciate into separate genus and separate racial groupings due to a lack of intermarriage (well, it takes a little time for that to occur).  By what I understand, most groups already have something of a tendency to speciate and assortatively mate by their own natural inclinations anyhow (see, for example Intelligence Quotient or Eugenics).  Still, your points above are an interesting observation.  Are you saying that Jatt Sikhs have a higher IQ than all the other groups? : )
*I DEEPLY RESPECT PEOPLE KEEPING ALL THE K'S but Why do we only consider only Turban wearing men, who dont cut their hair , keep a kirpan , wear a kada ,etc etc to be a Full Sikh. Does the Guru Granth Sahib state somewhere that a sikh should do that? Did gurunankji or his followers said that ? Come on they were Saints and they had their lifestyle so as to appear a man of god (or saadhu,sage ,saint whatever you call it) to the public then.That is why their depiction in art resembles a sardaar. All the other people in the baani like Guru Kabeer Das and Guru Ravidas etc are not considered SIKH and their followers are Denied the facilities of SIKH COMMUNITY . We have Gurudwaras where the priest denies holy rituals (marriage , crimination ) just because the person is a MONNA ( dont keep the K's). That really is depressing. Have you Honestly seen any MONNA reading the guru granth sahib ? no right !! Why ? Because they are not allowed to .WITH ALL MY RESPECTS Is the Beard or the turban going to read the baani ? SIKHISM WAS CREATED TO REMOVE DISCRIMINATION AND WE ARE ONLY PRODUCING IT MORE.
> It would help if you typed more coherently and avoided capitals.  The part about being denied access to the facilities of the sikh community does sound quite bad.  I'm sure that that sort of thing shouldn't be allowed and that you should complain to some official body somewhere (just send them an email or write them a CAREFULLY crafted letter, and everything should turn out just fine).  
I know Guru Gobind Singh ordered that but it was then to make the KHAALSA , an army . These were so designed to make a strict code of Discipline in the infantry . I BELIEVE IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RELIGION. Beside WITH ALL MY RESPECTS Guru Gobind Singh ji's Baani is not even in the Guru Granth Sahib , his baani is in Vichtra Natak and other similiar installments and he even goes to a point cursing everyone who calls him guru shall go to HELL. He only considered himself of being an army leader . So why a discrimination is a Sardaar and a Monna
> Completely confused by what you have stated here.  I reckon that, given that the 5 K's were introduced for the first functional Sikh army within that part of the world, there is probably an interesting link between religion and warfare - something about using the innate energies of religious conviction to make for a more potent fighting force.  I think that the samurai were into that sort of thing.  As was some German guy during the period of the 1940 who wanted to join religious conviction with the miltary powers of production of the state....Anyone remember his name?
*the purest thing i found in the granth was to get the essence of god through a guru in person. but we are neglecting this and we are bowing our heads to a book ( I dont want to hurt anyone , i state this with all my respects for other people's belives). No body needs to technically go to a gurudwara , you can have god right next to you when you are meditating with the purest devotion right in you home just with a help of a guru. But what are we doing. We are Making the golden temple more GOLDEN when the money could have flourished 1000s of poor poeple's home and doing all the Sharaahn (stuff in the outer world) . I mean out of 10 sikh people i meet only 0.5 know what a guru is and what meditation is.( but that can be true maybe in only my case and maybe i havent met the more of those people) . We are wearing a turban, keeping all the K's and doing every thing worldy while deep inside our hearts we are becoming more political, more corrupt and more proud and egoistic. Something has to be done about that. I and my fellow youth have the power to bring back the True meaning of the word SIKH - a student.
> Do you reckon that we need a link to a live English translation of the SGGS?  Anyone out there know how to do this?
Anudeep Toora - A sikh only at the heart but a monna at the world 
MrASingh 11:32, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Please Comment

message: I'll quickly respond to your points.  Remember, my response is only a quick one, so I may have missed some points.  Anyhow, I'm not entirely certain that wikipedia is the best place to present a discussion of what you have mentioned (though I will give it a try) : 
*Guru Nanak Dev ji made the whole religion to remove belives like IDOL WORSHIP . But i've heard gurudwaras that keep Datun (kinda toothbrush) near the Guru Granth Sahib, Bath the whole Book (and flow it in water when it gets old) and thousands of people bow down to the book with their head covered and do not turn their backs toward the book ( with all my respects) as if all the gurus are actually in it . TELL ME ISNT THIS IDOL WORSHIP ITSELF ? what else did guru nanakji proved when he moved the whole Mecca along as the muslims moved his feet . We are idol worshiping . GURU GOBIND SINGH JI says Guru maane Granth ( Guru = Granth - a holy book). Its a metaphor. You can evaluate it as if the Granth is the next and only guru. But their also lies a deeper meaning that Guru is as diverse , powerful and true as a granth
> I'm not sure if this is idol worship as such.  Idols are usually statues and the like.  According to Idolatry, it is important to realise that it is not merely sufficient for an idol to be present during worshipping in order to be labelled an idolator - one has to actually worship the idol itself.  Now, it is an interesting issue as to whether Christians are committing idolatry when they attend mass/congregate in front of the bible, etc... However, you see my point - if people read a book so that they may worship God, this should not be labelled idolatry (though, if people don't understand the contents of the book, and therefore end up falling into the bad habit of idol worship, then this is a different matter - but, just as most Christians would say that they can read the bible and understand it, so might most Sikhs state that they can understand the read contents of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib).  
*Caste and groups have flourished to an unimaginable level. We now have diffrent types of sikhs - Jatt Sikh , Ravidasia Siikh etc etc. Even today in the rural punjab , its still unimaginable that a intercaste marriage occurs. Why is that happening. Instead of resolving the issue of caste we are impowering it by stating that Jatts are the real sikhs because they are brave or something like All minorities or low castes are the real sikhs because the Panj Piyare( the 5 chosen ones) were all those. Isnt this a strict violation to the sayings of the GURUS .
> This is probably a completely random observation.  I doubt that Sikhs will speciate into separate genus and separate racial groupings due to a lack of intermarriage (well, it takes a little time for that to occur).  By what I understand, most groups already have something of a tendency to speciate and assortatively mate by their own natural inclinations anyhow (see, for example Intelligence Quotient or Eugenics).  Still, your points above are an interesting observation.  Are you saying that Jatt Sikhs have a higher IQ than all the other groups? : )
*I DEEPLY RESPECT PEOPLE KEEPING ALL THE K'S but Why do we only consider only Turban wearing men, who dont cut their hair , keep a kirpan , wear a kada ,etc etc to be a Full Sikh. Does the Guru Granth Sahib state somewhere that a sikh should do that? Did gurunankji or his followers said that ? Come on they were Saints and they had their lifestyle so as to appear a man of god (or saadhu,sage ,saint whatever you call it) to the public then.That is why their depiction in art resembles a sardaar. All the other people in the baani like Guru Kabeer Das and Guru Ravidas etc are not considered SIKH and their followers are Denied the facilities of SIKH COMMUNITY . We have Gurudwaras where the priest denies holy rituals (marriage , crimination ) just because the person is a MONNA ( dont keep the K's). That really is depressing. Have you Honestly seen any MONNA reading the guru granth sahib ? no right !! Why ? Because they are not allowed to .WITH ALL MY RESPECTS Is the Beard or the turban going to read the baani ? SIKHISM WAS CREATED TO REMOVE DISCRIMINATION AND WE ARE ONLY PRODUCING IT MORE.
> It would help if you typed more coherently and avoided capitals.  The part about being denied access to the facilities of the sikh community does sound quite bad.  I'm sure that that sort of thing shouldn't be allowed and that you should complain to some official body somewhere (just send them an email or write them a CAREFULLY crafted letter, and everything should turn out just fine).  
I know Guru Gobind Singh ordered that but it was then to make the KHAALSA , an army . These were so designed to make a strict code of Discipline in the infantry . I BELIEVE IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RELIGION. Beside WITH ALL MY RESPECTS Guru Gobind Singh ji's Baani is not even in the Guru Granth Sahib , his baani is in Vichtra Natak and other similiar installments and he even goes to a point cursing everyone who calls him guru shall go to HELL. He only considered himself of being an army leader . So why a discrimination is a Sardaar and a Monna
> Completely confused by what you have stated here.  I reckon that, given that the 5 K's were introduced for the first functional Sikh army within that part of the world, there is probably an interesting link between religion and warfare - something about using the innate energies of religious conviction to make for a more potent fighting force.  I think that the samurai were into that sort of thing.  As was some German guy during the period of the 1940 who wanted to join religious conviction with the miltary powers of production of the state....Anyone remember his name?
*the purest thing i found in the granth was to get the essence of god through a guru in person. but we are neglecting this and we are bowing our heads to a book ( I dont want to hurt anyone , i state this with all my respects for other people's belives). No body needs to technically go to a gurudwara , you can have god right next to you when you are meditating with the purest devotion right in you home just with a help of a guru. But what are we doing. We are Making the golden temple more GOLDEN when the money could have flourished 1000s of poor poeple's home and doing all the Sharaahn (stuff in the outer world) . I mean out of 10 sikh people i meet only 0.5 know what a guru is and what meditation is.( but that can be true maybe in only my case and maybe i havent met the more of those people) . We are wearing a turban, keeping all the K's and doing every thing worldy while deep inside our hearts we are becoming more political, more corrupt and more proud and egoistic. Something has to be done about that. I and my fellow youth have the power to bring back the True meaning of the word SIKH - a student.
> Do you reckon that we need a link to a live English translation of the SGGS?  Anyone out there know how to do this?
Anudeep Toora - A sikh only at the heart but a monna at the world 
MrASingh 11:32, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comment 1 

message: I wonder that external links provided here are not of all the popular or useful site. I added 2 external links of 2 popular sikh matrimonials websites that provide free service, but someone removed them. I request you not to remove these, www.sikhmilan.com & Gurmat.com. They are very useful to sikhs.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabhroo (talk • contribs) 23:38, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Dear Gabhroo such links are not in accordance with Wikipedia policy. Please [Wikipedia is not] for some hints why adding such sites is not allowed. That aside, Sikh matrimonial side has nothing to do with Sikhism article. Regards, --RoadAhead Discuss 23:48, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Indeed. The links do not belong in Wikipedia; external links should provide information, not a service. (It doesn't matter if the service is free.) Please read the policy on external links. --Bonadea (talk) 05:32, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why less External links 

message: A quick perusal of Islam's commandments on sexual practice can be found within the below wiki articles.    
Islamic sexual jurisprudence, Sexuality in Islam and Islam and sexual techniques.  
Apparently, that particular religion provides very clear, direct and unambiguous interpretations of what sexual morality is.  It would only stand to reason that the SGGS also contains similar directions (as do other religions such as Christianity, Islam, etc...).  
MrASingh 11:28, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: What is Sexually Moral, and what is not Sexually Moral.  

message: Has anyone thought about doing something along these lines for the following Guru Wikis? : 
Guru Nanak Dev
Guru Angad Dev
Guru Amar Das
Guru Ram Das
Guru Arjan Dev
Guru Har Gobind
Guru Har Rai
Guru Har Krishan
Guru Teg Bahadur
Guru Gobind Singh
Back to work....
MrASingh 21:30, 05 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: The Geneology of the Gurus

message: Well done everyone.  Sikhism is now a featured article on the English Wikipedia!  Now I'm trying to get it on the front page of Wikipedia. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 23:36, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Congrats to all those who worked on this! -- Sundar \talk \contribs 07:26, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Congrats indeed ! Gurm 00:09, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sikhism is a featured article 

message: Apart from a few random mentions in the archives about how it's advisable for people to take off their Kirpans when making love, and some (ill-phrased, and ill-responded to) questions about sex, sexual ethics don't appears within this article at all!  This seems to me to be highly unfortunate, I'm sure I remember it being in mentioned in the bible that bestiality (sex with animals) is pretty bad (I think they call it 'evil'), as is sex with one's siblings or relations (equally evil in sikhism I hope).  Then there's the issue of positions to take (ever heard of the 'missionary' position? - the Christians invented that).  And let's not forget that the Jews have some interesting genetically based dating agency (which allows them to direct genetically compatible sexual partners to one another in the event that they have something like Tay-Sachs disease), called 'Yor Sherom' (or something else like that).  I even remember reading that a bunch of Nobel prize winners were selling their sperm for quite a low price (I'm sure that the Sikh elders in the Golden Temple would be happy to do this, but are there any Sikh Nobel prize winning sperm samples that can be catalogue ordered online?) 
Let's face it, the Christians and Jews are currently way ahead of everyone else - do Sikhs have anything like what I'm mentioned (the dating agencies I know of don't carry out IQ tests, let along genetic tests).     
Given the amount of sexual advice that Christians and Jews get (and how many more of them there are than there are Sikhs), there should be way more Sikhs on earth than a paltry 20 million....From the   looks of the wiki site, Christians and Jews have to work with a whole lot more in the way of sexual ethical guidance and codes to make sure that they don't offend God, or partake in 'abominations'.  
Basically, there's a massive hole in sexual ethics, and someone needs to fill it in (prefarably with God-faring morality).  Then there are issues concerning sociobiology (yes, I've been thinking about Sikhism and Islam recently, and how, compared to a lot of other religions, they aren't that different in some senses).  Particularly, the issue of women - within the Punjab region at least, women don't walk around quite the way that they do in Western countries (that is, in the significantly warmer climate of Punjab, women actually wear clothes).   
Anyone got any constructive suggestions here?
Anthony-  I don't see how having dating services for specific religions shows an advancement in society.  As far as I'm concerened, Jews and Christian's just thrive on sucking money away from misinformed people, which should be considered a sin.  Besides, since when was religion about being "better" than other reigions??
If you have any comments, let me know.  antboy824@hotmail.com
Anthony- Sexual advice is needed for perverted and mentally imbalanced people. Christianity, Islam and Judaism have heavy code in their books about sexual behavior.  These abrahimic religions force either complete veiling of women (as in islam) or no clothing at all (as in christianity). In either case, the nudity of christian women makes their men horny and veiling of women in islams make mullas deperate (Pakistan has largest traffic access to pronograhic sites in world). A balance is required in clothing and I am sure that people of punjab are adequately dressed to suit social and climatological needs of region.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 118.94.20.81 (talk) 07:25, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Needs More Sex  

message: Does anyone have any information on Sindhis and Sikhism?  I've been reading how a large portion of the Hindu Sindhi population revered Guru Nanak and how Sikhism was quite prominent in the Sindh prior to partition.  Any further expansion on this could be good for the article. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 23:32, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sindhis and Sikhism 

message: In my opinion the Wikipedia article on Sikhism should only be about religion and not about community, politics, or people. Hence, please consider moving sections such as Growth of Sikh Community, Political Advancement, and Sikh People into a separate Wikipedia article titled Sikhs. These topics have nothing to do with religion hence, they should be moved out. By including such topics, this article is become confusing, unclear, and opens a can of worms by inviting extraneous debates like "Hinduism and Sikhism are same."
Also, the last sentence of the Political Advancement section reads: The Akali Dal started a non-violent movement for Sikh and Punjabi rights, but was brutally suppressed by India. If nothing else, PLEASE be factually accurate. Khalistan movement was anything BUT peaceful. In any case, since this article is mainly about religion, please move this to some other article.
About relationship on Hinduism and Sikhism. They are separate faiths. However, there is a common history together; hence, a section on History of Sikhism religious movement with respect to Hinduism and Islam would be nice to see. One could address issues such as "Hinduism and Sikhism being one" and "Sikhism being a protector of Hinduism" in appropriate language and tone under such a section. These are common day debates and hence should be properly addressed. For references, please see:
1) http://www.rediff.com/news/1999/dec/20varsha.htm
2) http://www.kashmir-information.com/ConvertedKashmir/Chapter14.html
The links to Sikh Gurus under the section The ten gurus and religious authority should be replaced by a brief biography of each guru giving a brief summary of their life and works and then including a reference for further information. Just including the links doesn't do justice.
Please consider keeping this article purely religious by moving non-religious issues out of this article. Thank you for creating and maintaining an excellent (besides reservations pointed out above) writeup on Sikhism.
24.5.120.23 07:30, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Some general notes]]

message: Hi,
If there is enough support, I'm thinking of starting a Wikiproject for Sikhism.  If you are interested in joining, please say so below! Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 18:53, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sikhism Wikiproject 

message: + a lot of Assumptions made in both the comments. Haphar 23:13, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Pls check history for Aryan818's original comment

message: I hate to point fingers but I have read what ARYAN818 has said (e.g. calling Sikhs "Khalistanis" and then following up that comment with "I know you probably all are"), he is obviously racist against Sikhs (and is probably a member of those RSS idiots.)
Sandeep S K 19:46, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi Sandeep - whatever issues ARYAN818 may have, you must definitely not take the same path. Please go through WP:NPA and WP:CIVIL. I don't think you should speak of the RSS as "idiots" or accuse somebody of being "racist." If his comments are prejudiced, he's already been reprimanded for that. This Fire Burns Always  19:53, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This Fire Burns Always is right. I said the wrong thing which may have offended other users and I have broken the rules that you pointed out. For that, I would like to apologize to you and anyone else that I may have offended (including ARYAN818 and the RSS). I would also like to retract the whole sentence of "and is probably a member of those RSS idiots" as it was out of line.
Sandeep S K 20:17, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

text: No problem - most users here have and still make this mistake quite often. I still lose my cool a lot frequently than I would like. Think no more about this - happy editing! This Fire Burns Always  20:22, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Im racist against all SIkhs?...I never said all Sikhs...I said that for the people who are obviously biast on Sikhism and Hinduism...These guys have done little or no reading on Hindu scripture and yet form opinions...and most people who do this are people who want Khalistan...thats a fact....but hey I said sorry and i apologized....and by the way...i go to Gurudwara so please dont say im racist against sikhs...read everything i type instead of picking apart a few sentences ARYAN818 21:34, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

text:  I do not know of anyone on this page who wants Khalistan. And the accusation was made when Sukh, Rama's Arrow and myself had enrolled on the Sikhism project. So as per Aryan all or some of us are "Khalistani's".  The comments on not reading scriptures and having an opinion- that can be applied to a lot of people who have an opinion on Sikhism and Islam too.  Haphar 09:03, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Racism