Talk:Michael Collins Piper

message: Only notices I find of death go back to this:  http://revisionistreview.blogspot.com/2015/06/michael-collins-piper-1960-2015.html which says May 30. I didn't find notice in Coeur dAlene papers. We must await an autopsy or better report. Are there better reports? Also, is it superfluous to mention that the conspir. sites posit it was murder (by heart attack)? GangofOne (talk) 06:29, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Did he die June 1 or May 30? 

message: * A) [a]s far as I can see all five conditions of that WP:V provision are met." 
:: I do disagree regarding at least two of those five conditions, to wit:
::::"the material is neither unduly self-serving nor an exceptional claim"
:: The material is extremely self-serving given that is quite hagiographical in nature and comes close to implying -- between the lines -- that his enemies drove him to his presumably lonely and miserable death
:::: "there is no reasonable doubt as to its authenticity"
:: Doubt is inherent when no reliable sources, only fringe websites and their mirrors report it
* B) RE: Wikipedia:Fringe theories:
:: "surprising or apparently important claims not covered by multiple mainstream sources" -- self-evidently uncovered in any, much less multiple, mainstream sources, which is the main problem. For instance, had any mention been made in msnbc or the the NY Times or even the ADL, that would have been more than sufficient for me, and I suspect, most editors.
:: "challenged claims that are supported purely by primary or self-published sources or those with an apparent conflict of interest"
====IN SUM====
::: I am not saying not to report his purported death but the dubious tags should remain in this case given the clear lack of consensus. P.S.S. I just did something which is inherently unreliable and OR, but I'll share. I called the Budget Motel in Coeur d'Alene and just asked the girl who answered the phone. Now I tend to speak quickly (New York City), especially when I am nervous, but I got the words out and she finally replied: "yes", and I assume she understood what I was saying. I added some more blather and thanked her and hung up. So I accept that he died but nonetheless, my own OR (do as I say, not as I do crap, LOL) notwithstanding, there is sufficient reason to maintain the  tags regarding anything to do with the death. 
::: I later checked with the local newspaper and spoke to an individual (let's just leave it at that, name and title not germane) who said that the death had been reported but as an unintended/non-suspicious death the decedent's name was likely not released by the police, possibly (IMHO) pending notification of next of kin. Now that I think about it, it's possible that the clerk who answered the phone at the Budget Motel knew of the death but not the name, I am thinking (in retrospect). The local police phone number is 208- 769-2300, if anyone is interested. I am not going to make any further inquiries. So,........ Quis separabit? 02:16, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  It could be if it is not true and/or there is reason to question the motivation, accuracy, and/or truth of said declaration. Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  There was doubt when his name does not appear anywhere but in sources you yourself admit are inadequate (see below; "I'm OK with keeping the  tags") Quis separabit? 07:15, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  What does this mean? Is this a reference to age 54? That's basic arithmetic, not synthesis. Besides, that precise age appears in at least one of the url links being bandied about, namely this one. Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

text:  I never questioned the May 30 date, so...........? Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

text:  I am glad you are OK with my suggestion re . Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Respectfully disagree

message: ::: I am not saying not to report his purported death but the dubious tags should remain in this case given the clear lack of consensus. P.S.S. I just did something which is inherently unreliable and OR, but I'll share. I called the Budget Motel in Coeur d'Alene and just asked the girl who answered the phone. Now I tend to speak quickly (New York City), especially when I am nervous, but I got the words out and she finally replied: "yes", and I assume she understood what I was saying. I added some more blather and thanked her and hung up. So I accept that he died but nonetheless, my own OR (do as I say, not as I do crap, LOL) notwithstanding, there is sufficient reason to maintain the  tags regarding anything to do with the death. 
::: I later checked with the local newspaper and spoke to an individual (let's just leave it at that, name and title not germane) who said that the death had been reported but as an unintended/non-suspicious death the decedent's name was likely not released by the police, possibly (IMHO) pending notification of next of kin. Now that I think about it, it's possible that the clerk who answered the phone at the Budget Motel knew of the death but not the name, I am thinking (in retrospect). The local police phone number is 208- 769-2300, if anyone is interested. I am not going to make any further inquiries. So,........ Quis separabit? 02:16, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  It could be if it is not true and/or there is reason to question the motivation, accuracy, and/or truth of said declaration. Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  There was doubt when his name does not appear anywhere but in sources you yourself admit are inadequate (see below; "I'm OK with keeping the  tags") Quis separabit? 07:15, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  What does this mean? Is this a reference to age 54? That's basic arithmetic, not synthesis. Besides, that precise age appears in at least one of the url links being bandied about, namely this one. Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

text:  I never questioned the May 30 date, so...........? Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

text:  I am glad you are OK with my suggestion re . Quis separabit? 07:11, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: IN SUM

message: I got a call (I didn't even know they had my phone number) from an editor at the local paper (Coeur d'Alene Press) -- a different one than the one I spoke with yesterday, who must have noted down my phone number. Apparently I ignited some interest in the story and this second editor told me that the paper will be publishing an "interesting" story about the death. He confirmed the name on the death certificate was Michael Piper. So, I am in Eastern Standard Time, and Idaho is a different time zone, so I am not exactly sure when the story will appear. It seems we finally are going to have a genuinely reliable source after all!! Quis separabit? 01:59, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  PSS: He asked me who I work for, and I told him that I am not a journalist and that all this originated over a Wikipedia article. I think he was shocked. Quis separabit? 02:00, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  THIS IS IT: the one and only reliable source in the entire article: Coeur d'Alene Press report on death of Piper. You're very welcome. Quis separabit? 15:16, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

text: (bolding added) - that's of course not the purpose of Wikipedia talk pages per WP:NOTFORUM: "talk pages exist for the purpose of discussing how to improve articles". --Francis Schonken (talk) 15:47, 4 July 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well, blame me then because that's how I explained my interest in the story. I didn't lie and pretend I am a journalist nor did I make up some fictitious publication. IMHO, regarding BLP (which includes recently deceased individuals), we have had to discuss the details of Piper's life and death to some degree while trying to improve this very dicey article. (And that is usually the case with BLP articles). Details are unavoidable. You also left this out: "The confusion prompted Wikipedia to flag the death information on Piper's page as unfounded and in need of citations" from the reliable source you just quoted. Quis separabit? 15:59, 4 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Interesting update

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Michael Collins Piper. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.mikepiperreport.com/Biography/BiographyIndex.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090610150339/http://www.adl.org/main_International_Affairs/iran_holocaust_conference.htm?Multi_page_sections=sHeading_5 to http://www.adl.org/main_International_Affairs/iran_holocaust_conference.htm?Multi_page_sections=sHeading_5
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 15:51, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Michael Collins Piper. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20040404020109/http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/zayed_center.asp to http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/zayed_center.asp
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 15:16, 27 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: The citation note here has got my attention;
"Piper wrote articles in American Free Press which alleged that the Mossad and the FBI conspired to set up the assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. Piper claims this was motivated by fear of King's anti-Israel statements combined with his massive grassroots power."
Piper may or may not have made this claim, but as near as I can tell, Martin Luther King Jr. was hardly the "Anti-Zionist" that people like him made him out to be. In fact there was some letter published online years ago where he replied to a young black militant discouraging him from being so hostile towards Israelis and Jews. ---------User:DanTD (talk)  14:28, 24 January 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  MLK Jr. Assassination theory 

message: There’s a link to “ADL Files Controversy” that goes to the ADL’s Wikipedia page rather than a page for the controversy 2600:1700:E71:90B0:A06A:38A3:F322:2762 (talk) 03:09, 17 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Incorrect Link