Talk:Gawain

message: 68.50.147.190 has an clear pro-Gawain, anti-Lancelot bias, as seen in his edits here and on the Lancelot. This is awesome, considering they are fictional characters, but his edits are little POV. I kept some of them but reverted the rest.--Cuchullain 00:48, July 17, 2005 (UTC)
Good many of the articles around here are too opinion based (look at the Disney page guy thought he was being funny or something).  Any ways its nice that someone is cleaning it all up.
Leon Evelake 03:05, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: July 2005

message: The article says this of Gawain: "His strength waxes and wanes with the sun; his might triples by noon, but fades as the sun sets." I changed it to "In some works, his strength waxes and wanes with the sun; in the most common form of this motif, his might triples by noon, but fades as the sun sets."
What the article originally said is true--often. But not always. First, the question of his changing strength is not even mentioned in a great many texts that feature him. Moreover, there are conflicting versions of this motif; the French Vulgate Cycle offers several versions: in some his strength increases until noon and wanes thereafter (as indicated in the article), but in other places it is the opposite: weaker until noon and stronger thereafter. Thus, “his strength always ebbed at the hour of noon, and as soon as noon had passed, it came back doubled, and he regained courage and confidence and strength.”  And in one case it increases until just noon, when it suddenly reverts to the original state and remains that way for the rest of the day. 
Of course, not all such variants need to be spelled out in the article; I could be picking nits. So my changes are minor: just a few words added in the interest of accuracy.Njl2 16:36, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Your edits are minor, but they make the sentence more correct. Clearly not all works include the strength thing, and some include some variation on the idea of his strength being tied to the sun. Good catch.--Cúchullain t/c 19:47, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Somewhat amusingly, in T. H. White's "The Once and Furutre King, Bors theorizes that Gawaine's nane "up north" would be pronounced "Cúchullain."  Thought you might want to know that.... 70.114.146.227 (talk) 17:22, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, 70.114.146.227 - that's definitely one of the great modern portrayals of Gawaine.--Cúchullain t/c 17:26, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gawain's strength 

message: There was a historical Gwalchmai son of Lot, both of which were kings of Lothian, then called Gododdin. Check this site. ---G.T.N. (talk) 23:30, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gwalchmai of Gododdin 

message: Noted Celticist John Koch has suggested the name could be derived from a Brythonic original *Wolcos Magesos, "Wolf/Errant Warrior of the Plain"Koch, "The Celtic Lands," p.267. but consider the possibility of the name being derived from *Volcumagios, the 'great one of the wolves,' 'the great one of the errant warriors' which, had it have existed, would likewise have rendered the form Gwalchmai in Middle Welsh by the regular phonological developments in Celtic.
:A second element *-magios would have produce early Old Welsh *-mai (later -vai), Middle/Modern Welsh *-fae (compare MnW cae "hedge" from *cagios. See Peter Schrijver, Studies in British Celtic Historical Phonology, Rodopi, 1995) .Cagwinn (talk) 22:17, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: ''Volcumagios''

message: Cagwinn is quite right, Lancelot is not mentioned in the Historia. In a sentence about what the Historia says about Gawain, it is irrelevant that other, different sources mention Lancelot. Let's let this be the end of it.Cúchullain t/c 00:27, 3 August 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you - I was beginning to lose all faith in Wikipedia! Lancelot first appeared in the works of Chretien de Troyes, which were written several decades after Geoffrey's Historia Regum Britanniae (written c. 1136); he is first found in Chretien's tale Erec et Enide, written c. 1170. Cagwinn (talk) 01:18, 3 August 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, the phrase specified is specifically summarising Historia, it doesn't have to mention how other sources describe Gawain's fdeath and the way it was written it misrepresented the text of Historia. Other stories about his death can be summarised in the parts treating those sources specifically. Also I am a little worried that some editors may not appreciate that Gawain is a legendary figure and there is no way to ascribe greater or weaker truth to any of the sources. ·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 19:40, 3 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: ''[[Historia Regum Britanniae]]''

message: Could their be some kind of similarity between the two, I know Geoffrey took some of the ideas of Arthur and Knights of the Round Table used ideas from the Magna Carta to use as a basis for a better society for England, some of the writings in the Magna Carta:
"....Custos autem, quamdiu custodiam terre habuerit, sustentet domos, parcos, vivaria, stagna, molendina, et cetera ad terram illam pertinencia, de exitibus terre ejusdem; et reddat heredi cum ad plenam etatem pervenerit, terram suam totam instauratam de carucis et waynagiis, secundum quod tempus waynagii exiget et exitus terre racionabiliter poterunt sustinere.
Heredes maritentur absque disparagacione, ita tamen quod, antequam contrahatur matrimonium, ostendatur propinquis de consanguinitate ipsius heredis. 
Vidua post mortem mariti sui statim et sine difficultate habeat maritagium et hereditatem suam, nec aliquid det pro dote sua, vel pro maritagio suo, vel hereditate sua, quam hereditatem maritus suus et ipsa tenuerint die obitus ipsius mariti, et maneat in domo mariti sul per quadraginta dies post mortem ipsius, infra quos assignetur ei dos sua.
Nulla vidua distringatur ad se maritandum, dum voluerit vivere sine marito, ita tamen quod securitatem faciat quod se non maritabit sine assensu nostro, si de nobis tenuerit, vel sine assensu domini sui de quo tenuerit, si de alio tenuerit. "
In English:
"....caught from the land of an heir who is under age, shall not take from the land of the heir nothing but reasonable produce, reasonable customs, and reasonable services, and that without destruction and waste of men or of things, and if we have committed the wardship of any such land to a sheriff, or to any other who is is responsible to us for its revenues, and he has done of prison, or the destruction of waste, we take of him amends, and the land shall be committed to two lawful and discreet men of that fief, who responsible for the issues to us or to him to whom we have assigned them, and if we give or sell to anyone the the wardship of any such land, and he has therein made destruction or waste, he shall lose that wardship, and it shall be transferred to two lawful and discreet men of that fief, who shall be answerable to us in like manner as is aforesaid. 
But he that keepeth, so long as the custody of land, he shall maintain the houses, parks, preserves, ponds, mills, and other things that belong to that land, from the revenues of the same land, and restore to the heir to the full when he comes of age, to have been rebuilt to their own land with plows and the whole of husbandry, according to the that the season of husbandry requires and the revenues of the land can reasonably bear.
Heirs shall be married without disparagement, yet so that before the marriage is contracted those nearest in blood to the heir. 
Widow, after the death of her husband, shall forthwith and without difficulty have her marriage portion and inheritance; pay nothing for her dower, or her marriage portion, or of his inheritance, the inheritance which her husband and the same is held on the day of the death of her husband, and let him abide in the house of her husband for forty days after his death, within which time her dower shall be assigned to. 
No widow shall be forced to marry, long as she wishes to live without a husband, in such a way, however, must give security that she will not marry without our consent, if she holds of us, or without the consent of the owner of which has kept it, if she holds of another."
It kind of reminds me of the characteristics of Gawain for use of a true hero and a need of good quality and peace in the land.
Robin Hood has many characteristics with Gawain as well, defender of the poor, and rightful Baron of his lands which were stripped from his own title, after coming through the crusades, and both gained allies in order to subdue tyrants, sounds familiar.--74.34.86.196 (talk) 15:12, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Geoffrey of Monmouth released the Historia Regum Britanniae c. 1136; The Magna Carta was issued in 1215. Cagwinn (talk) 18:27, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Gawain and Robin Hood influence

message: Now that we've moved beyond the above silliness, I've been doing a good bit of work on the article. I've found a number of problems in going forward. Many of these are do to my edits from many years ago, back when inline citations were a suggestion and not a requirement. While all of that material was verifiable, the lack of citations evidently led other editors to add their own over the years. I've discovered that a lot of the citations that have been added are incomplete, inadequate, or otherwise problematic. Where I'm able I've tried to incorporate valid material into my revisions, either by keeping valid citations or replacing troublesome ones. Additionally, the presentation is all over the place. I think I've made a good start, and I'll do more this week, but any input is welcome.Cúchullain t/c 03:40, 28 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Recent work

message: * James D'Arcyin Gawain and the Green Knight (2002 animated film)
* Murray Head in Gawain and the Green Knight
* Miles O'Keeffe in Sword of the Valiant
* Liam Neeson in Excalibur
* Robert Gwyn Davin in First Knight
* Anthony Hickox in Prince Valiant
* Joel Edgerton in King Arthur
* Noah Huntley in The Mists of Avalon
* Sebastian Roché in Merlin (film)
* Eoin Macken in Merlin (TV series)
* Clive Standen in Camelot (TV series)
:Although, above are all well related actors, if there was ever a really close interpretation of the character Gawaine, some have speculated to be Orlando Bloom as his portrayal as Balian of Ibelin, in the film Kingdom of Heaven, fiercely loyal to his promises and defending his kingdom throughout more than one war, and finally keeping the peace and fortune of the kingdom to his death, to be by far a more accurate character of Gawaine as some would say. --74.34.74.56 (talk) 08:33, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: We don't need a list like that in the article. We already have a section on the more noteworthy portrayals.Cúchullain t/c 17:28, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Portrayals in media

message: Why in the world is he related to Dutch French folklore when he originally Welsh and Scottish folklore. Is there any legit source of folklore about him coming from France. --Oh goes the waterhole (talk) 04:49, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Never mind. There are sources of Celtic folklore traveled down into France and into Germany and there are sources coming from Italy as it is shown in the beginning of the article. True there is a similar stories in Greek mythology about the Theseus relation to the sword and the stone and Arthur as both founders of new nations.--Oh goes the waterhole (talk) 15:37, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: While Gawain was big in Dutch literature, I don't believe he was very prominent in folklore per say. The two are different things. I'll remove that category.Cúchullain t/c 20:53, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text:  I really don't understand what you are trying to say, Oh goes the waterhole...the article very clearly states that one scholar, Lauran Toorians, believes that Gauvain is a Dutch name in origin and that the character was introduced into Arthurian literature by a substantial number of Flemings who were settled in Britain in the middle ages. This theory has not gained wide acceptance among Arthurian scholars, but you do often find it being mentioned these days as a possible alternative explanation for the character, other than the standard line of thought that he is derived from Welsh Gwalchmei. Cagwinn (talk) 15:31, 27 January 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Gawain Gwalchmei, does respect with other nations such as Dutch mythology, so I rest my case, it's a melting pot of ideas Geoffrey made, although I hope the source above may help more about his mythology.--Oh Goes the Waterholes (talk) 19:30, 27 January 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Dutch & Other Folklore

message: "In some spin-offs, Sir Gawain is the Green Knight." I've never heard of this, and the lack of examples and citation given makes this a throwaway sentence that, while interesting, offers little substantive information. All adaptations mentioned later in the article make no reference to Gawain as the Green Knight, as far as I can tell. Can anyone find these spin-offs back up this sentence? (Apologies for my lack of Wikipedia editing knowledge)--140.104.201.101 (talk) 12:44, 29 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I also question this, I've never heard of it. The term "spin-off" is also strange to me. Did the person who originally wrote this mean modern, non-faithful works like Monty Python, or did they mean older derivatives like The Greene Knight? Either way, I think that it probably doesn't deserve to be in the opening section since the later article doesn't follow up on the idea. -- DrDoog (talk) 00:32, 13 July 2016 (UTC)

text: I've removed the sentence.  Rojomoke (talk) 11:36, 13 February 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Introduction: Gawain as the Green Knight 

message: It obviously should be fixed by adding the relevant content that is otherwise exclusive ton the lead section. The references should also be moved to the body, as the lead should bhe only a short summary of the actual article. --94.246.150.68 (talk) 15:55, 15 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Florence, Lovell, and Gingalain" and Gawain's sisters are only mentioned in the lad, nowhere in body 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: It and the article need to be rewritten. SNAAAAKE!! (talk) 20:24, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  The lead contains exclusive content, instead of just summarizing the article 

message: Namely https://kingarthur.wikia.com/wiki/Gawain so someone might check it out for validity (much of this stuff has been entirely unknown to me), and add refs or request them when needed. SNAAAAKE!! (talk) 22:18, 13 January 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  I expanded the article with content based on a Wikia article 

message: Este tema me confunde mucho. Porfavor hagan el esfuerzo de hacer un árbol genealógico o algo. Christian Alexis Arroyo Ortiz (talk) 07:16, 16 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: A genealogical family tree might help. However, it would require that someone take the time to construct one. That's the hard part. Dhtwiki (talk) 08:44, 16 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  La Familia de Gawain