Talk:Hells Canyon

message: I am a river runner and hydrology expert. I keep editing the article on Hell's Canyon on the Snake River because the flow rates are quite inaccurate. I remove the part that says "The Snake through Hell's Canyon generally carries more water than the Colorado River through the Grand Canyon". I have run both rivers and the Snake River IS NOT bigger than the Colorado River, according to USGS. Here is my source to the average flow of the Snake below Hell's Canyon Dam, which is about 11,000 cfs, compaired to a low average of about 14,000 of the Colorado below Glen Canyon Dam. User:Peckvet55 22:48, 13 Feb 2007 [source http://waterdata.usgs.gov/id/nwis/uv/?site_no=13290450&PARAmeter_cd=00065,00060]
:Thanks for explaining. I personally reverted many changes on that article by anon editors who blanked an entire paragraph without any explanation in the edit summary. Unexplained anon blanking looks like vandalism to me. Thanks for signing up for an account. This kind of discussion is better placed on the article's talk page. I'll copy this post there, and if you blank the material again, please fill in the edit summary. Thanks! Katr67 06:06, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Post copied from WikiProject Oregon talkpage

message: If you are the anon editor who keeps changing the article, please log in and discuss your proposed changes here. I see other editors have disputed your flow rate changes at Snake River--this issue bears discussing. Continuing to blank the material is not a good way to reach consensus. Thanks. Katr67 14:49, 1 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Peckvet55

message: In the 1950s the name "Hells Canyon" was borrowed from Hells Canyon Creek, which enters the river near what is now Hells Canyon Dam.  According to Carrey, Conley and Barton in their book, Snake River of Hells Canyon, most of the early explorers referred to the gorge as Box Canyon or Snake River Canyon, though a few locals called it the "Grand Canyon of the Snake." The first reference to Hells Canyon appears in an 1895 edition of McCurdy's Marine History of the Pacific Northwest.  In discussing the voyage of the steamboat Norma, the author writes: "She then bounded off, swinging into midstream and, like a racehorse, shot into the Hell Canyon…" The name was used by the Mazama Hiking Club in their 1931 bulletin. Bailey's book, Hells Canyon, was published in 1943. Senator Richard Neuberger of Oregon used it in several publications in the 1950s.  
The Hells Canyon area was once home to Shoshone and Nez Percé Native American tribes.  According to the Nez Percé tribe, Coyote dug the Snake River Canyon in a day to protect the people on the west side of the river from the Seven Devils, a band of evil spirits living in the mountain range to the east.  In the late nineteenth century, the military drove the Native Americans out and settlers began ranching and mining in the canyon.
Hells Canyon is one of the most imposing river gorges in the North American West.  Until a million years ago, the Owyhee Mountains acted as a dam between the Snake River and its current confluence with the Columbia River, creating a vast lake in what is now southwestern Idaho. When the mountains were finally breached, the Snake roared northward, cutting a giant chasm through the volcanic rock. 
Most of the older rocks we see in the canyon came from underwater volcanoes when Hells Canyon's terrains were part of an island arc in the mid-Pacific Ocean. These complex terrains glued themselves to North America about 150 million years ago as a result of tectonic plate movement. Vast areas were later covered with successive lava flows as recently as 6 million years ago. Uplifting from deep in the earth's core formed the Seven Devils and Eagle Cap Mountains, a process that continues today. The canyon itself is a result of both uplifting and erosion. One can see recent basalt flows, limestone formed on the ocean floor, ancient lavas, alluvial deposits, and the remains of primeval swamps that grew on the island surfaces.
The resulting canyon, roughly 10 miles (16 km) across, is not as dramatic as the Grand Canyon. However, when the surrounding peaks are visible from the river, the sense of depth is tremendous. The adjacent ridges average 5,500 feet (1,700 m) above the river.  He Devil Mountain, tallest of the Seven Devils 9,393 ft (2,863 m) towers almost 8,000 ft (2,440 m) above the river, creating the 2nd deepest gorge in the United States according to the Guinness book of world records (after Kings Canyon in California at 8200 ft).  The canyon plunges 7,913 ft (2400 m) from its summit to the mouth of Granite Creek, 6 miles (10 km) away, at 1,480 ft (450 m).
Starting at Hells Gate State Park (just outside of Lewiston, Idaho), it is 3 miles (5 km) to Asotin, Washington, 17 miles (27 km) to Buffalo Eddy, 26 miles (42 km) to the Grande Ronde River, 33 miles (53 km) to the Hells Canyon National Recreation Area boundary and the Oregon state line, 45 miles (72 km) to the Salmon River, 48 miles (77 km) to the Imnaha River, 53 miles (85 km) to Dug Bar, 72 miles (116 km) to Pittsburg Landing, 77 miles (124 km) to the Kirkwood Historic Ranch, 86 miles (138 km) to Sheep Creek Ranch, 88 miles (142 km) to Rush Creek Rapids, and 104 miles (167 km) to Hells Canyon Dam.
Sincerely,  Mattisse 01:01, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Moving unsourced section here from main article 

message: The Canyon: The Canyon is mostly public land, much of which is designated wilderness. The Canyon is massive, arid, and provides extremely stark, spectacular scenery. Solitude can be hard to find at peak use times; there are numerous jet boats, especially below Rush Creek. The lower river is often crowded on summer weekends. Few roads enter the Canyon, and those that do exist usually require 4-wheel drive.
Drainage Area and Average Annual Discharge: 92,960 square miles (241,000 km²) and 27,500,000 acre-feet (34 km³).
Peak Recorded Flow: 195,000 feet³/second (5,500 m³/s) (June 18, 1974) at Hellers Bar.
Fishing: Fishing is good for trout, bass and catfish. Occasionally, steelhead and salmon are caught, although the fishing for these species is best described as 'fair.' Fishing for the legendary Hells Canyon white sturgeon up to 15 feet (5 m) in length is catch-and-release.
Wildlife: Many Bighorn sheep, ospreys, eagles, chukar partridge, and deer inhabit the canyon. Additionally some turkeys, elk, bears and otters live in the canyon.
Boating Difficulty: Class III-IV. Most of the difficult rapids are at the beginning, then the pace of the trip slows considerably. The two major rapids, Wild Sheep and Granite Creek, should be treated with respect, especially at high flows. At high flows these rapids can easily flip the largest rafts. Those with kayaks and other small boats can portage these rapids. The remainder of the trip, while still offering some exciting rapids, is mostly serene. To avoid the slower water in the lower Canyon, many boaters take out at Pittsburg Landing (mile 32); roughly half of all trips end there.
Trip Length: For those traveling the river, there are variable lengths of trips one can take, depending on taste and choice of shuttles.  Pittsburgh Landing is 32 miles (51 km), Heller Bar is 79 miles (127 km); both have road access.  Other length trips 60 miles (100 km) to the confluence of the Salmon River, 72 miles (116 km) to Cache Creek are possible with a jet boat shuttle.
Boating Season: April - November. Since the dams were built, flows are usually highest in March and April, with the levels gradually dropping into late summer. However, releases fluctuate in order to assist salmon runs. For current information, contact the U.S. Forest Service, or you can call an Idaho Power recording that gives the release from Hells Canyon Dam: (800) 521-9102; in Idaho (800) 422-3143. Releases from Hells Canyon Dam often fluctuate widely, so camp well above river level and tie your boat securely.
Recommended Boating Levels: 5,000 - 40,000 feet³/second (140 to 1,100 m³/s). High water begins around 30,000 ft³/s (850 m³/s).  Skilled boaters can run at higher levels, but the danger increases.  Flows at the put-in vary from 5,000 ft³/s (140 m³/s) to over 50,000 ft³/s (14,000 m³/s) and average roughly 8,000 to 35,000 ft³/s (230 to 1000 m³/s).  At mile 60, the Salmon River adds a significant volume: 50,000 ft³/s (14,000 m³/s) or more in late spring and early summer.  Be warned that strong eddies occur at all flow levels.
Boats: Rafts -- Boats larger than 16 feet (4.9 m) and up at high flows; afternoon upstream winds can be a problem in the flat lower sections. Open Canoes -- Anyone, including experts, should think twice before attempting the big rapids at the start of the run; scouting is a must.
Water: The water is not fit for human consumption. The river gets warm 70 °F (20°C) in summer.
Camping: The dams have trapped sediment and dam releases have eroded the beaches, so much of the camping is on grassy benches above the river. The Salmon River brings in large amounts of sand, beaches -- especially beaches appropriate for large parties -- reappear. There is no camping at the Hells Canyon put-in, and camping is restricted to one night at Granite and Saddle Creeks. Boaters must carry out human waste, and float boaters must show proof of approved receptical prior to launch. Campfires are prohibited year round. Because of fluctuating flows, camp high above the river.
Hiking: Several trails follow the river and climb side creeks (Granite Creek is a favorite).
Sincerely,  Mattisse 01:04, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: it may be hard to source a lot of that stuff, and most of the article focuses on the river when the canyon area itself is much different, mostly extremely rugged, steeply mountainous and rocky. I spent a couple weeks there, flown in by chopper on a wildfire crew. the part about the bears is dead on. One thing they missed is the rattlesnakes, at least when it's warm. Plenty of rattlesnakes. If you like having to go around rattlesnakes and trip on rocks, Hell's Canyon is the place. Not really joking, cause I like rattlesnakes, and plan to go back when I can to see them again.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.170.64.63 (talk) 04:33, 27 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Moving unsourced trivia section here from main article 

message: Hells Canyon was featured on Man vs. Wild last night, and someone added an unreferenced mention to the page. At first I started to write it up proper, and here's what I had:
:==In the media==
:In January 2009, Hells Canyon was featured on the Discovery Channel series Man vs. Wild.
But this just didn't seem to fit with the article, nor did it seem especially important to note that Hells Canyon was once mentioned on the teevee. YMMV; if there is more to be said about Hells Canyon's media profile, perhaps this will be of some use. WWB (talk) 21:15, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  ''Man vs. Wild'' 

message: Kings Canyon in California is listed as 8,200 feet deep (described in Wikipedia as "one of the deepest"), whereas Hell's is listed at 8,000 feet. Both are river gorges, so I'm not sure how the claim to being the deepest can be sustained. --Metatree (talk) 22:20, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Here's a link noting that King's Canyon is deeper: http://www.sequoia.national-park.com/info.htm --Metatree (talk) 22:38, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Deepest?

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20101203161920/http://www.fs.fed.us:80/hellscanyon/about_us/establishment.shtml to http://www.fs.fed.us/hellscanyon/about_us/establishment.shtml
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thread_title:  External links modified