Talk:Tvrtko I of Bosnia

message: I am not sure how tough criteria are, but I believe that there is enough reasons to propose this page (and maybe couple of other GA on subject of medieval Bosnian history, too) for WP:SEMI level of protection. This "Good article" wouldn't last a month without one particular editor who is continually (for months and months) forced into clean up's, reverting and undoing, while dealing with "unregistered editors", and editors with single-purpose accounts without Userpage, who frowardly engaging in edit warring with clearly disruptive edits, but also possibly in "IP hopping" (using different computers, obtaining new addresses by using dynamic IP allocation), or other address-changing schemes such as IP "address spoofing".--౪ Santa ౪99° 19:35, 7 March 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree.--Miki Filigranski (talk) 02:53, 16 January 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Candidate for semi-protection? 

message: According to Royal charter issued by Tvrtko I he is King of ""Срблнємь и Боснě и Поморих и Западнимь Странамь".https://www.researchgate.net/publication/331382367_Povelja_kralja_Tvrtka_I_Kotromanica_Dubrovniku_Zrnovnice_10_april_1378_-_Trstivnica_17_juni_1378_The_Royal_Charter_of_king_Tvrtko_I_Kotromanic_issued_to_the_Ragusan_commune_Zrnovnice_10th_April_1378_- or in English: "King of Serbs and Bosnia and coastal and west sides". It is wrong to state otherwise and is not supported by historical documents. Loesorion (talk) 15:12, 27 October 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: It's usual to leave off new additions that are contested until consensus can be reached on the talk page, per WP:BRD, etc. The charter was issued to a particular town and the titles used might be limited in use to certain charters to certain areas. The English translation isn't good: "west sides" would read better as "Western Lands"; "Pomorikh" (which seems a better transliteration; you have "Pomorje" in the article) might be better translated as "the Coast" or as part of "and Coastal and Western Lands" (there's also apt to be confusion with the Bulgarian town of Pomorie). Dhtwiki (talk) 16:07, 27 October 2020 (UTC)

text: And Henry VIII called himself king of England and France but we use the conventional title in the lead, not whatever tickled his fancy centuries ago. The full title is elsewhere in the article. The lead is not the place for a full title, and this article as a whole is not the place for promoting nationalist rubbish. Surtsicna (talk) 22:07, 27 October 2020 (UTC)

text: Nobody is going to read a ten thousand character wall of text. Surtsicna (talk) 14:21, 29 October 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I read enough of it to know that there still has to be a word other than "sides" used to translate the title. "West side" usually denotes a part of a town, rather than a country (e.g., the musical and film title West Side Story): the term "sides" is too local. Dhtwiki (talk) 16:09, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

text: Yes, it's obvious that "west sides" refers to extensive areas, and that is why it's inappropriate for reasons I've already given and have been confirmed by a published translation of the phrase as "Western Provinces". Where the idiom is wrong, context matters little. Make it the right English idiom. Dhtwiki (talk) 18:45, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  King of Serbs and Bosnia and coastal and west sides 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
* 
Participate in the deletion discussion at the . —Community Tech bot (talk) 12:55, 9 January 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

message: It is said in article "In 1377, he had himself crowned king of Bosnia and of Serbia". This is so wrong. No king ever crowned himself as "king of Serbia" back then. Tvrtko crowned himself with title "King of Serbs of Bosnia, and of Sealands, and of Western Lands". Which is in line with the title of the kings of Nemanjic dynasty, since they also never got crowned and used title "King of Serbia", rather "King of Serbian lands, of this, of that etc." We got his title from a primary source which is Tvrtko's royal Charter to the Dubrovnik which he issued 1378. where it states:
"Такође затим и мени, своме робу, за милост свога Божанства, дарова да ми процвјета изданак племенито укоријењени у роду мојему и удостоји ме двоструким вијенцем како бих обима господствима управљао, прво испрва у богомданој нам земљи Босни, потом пак господ мој Бог ме почастио да наслиједим пријестол прародитеља мојих, господе српске, зато јер ти моји прародитељи, у земаљском царству царствовавши, и на небеско царство преселили се бише.
Ја, пак, видјевши земљу својих предака остављену након њих и да нема својег пастира, идох у српску земљу, желећи и хтијући оснажити пријестол родитеља мојих. И тамо ишавши окруњен бјех од Бога дарованом ми круном на краљевство прародитеља мојих, да будем у Христу Исусу побожан и од Бога постављени Стефан, краљ Србима и Босни и Поморју и Западним странама. И потом почех с Богом краљевати и правити пријестол српске земље, желећи што је пало уздигнути и што се разорило оснажити."Aryanprince (talk) 13:16, 24 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: You made wrong translation of the mentioned text, it would mean King of Serbs (Serbia) and Bosnia and Sealands (Dalmatia) and Western regions (Western Bosnia). There's no "Serbs of Bosnia...".--Miki Filigranski (talk) 14:42, 24 December 2022 (UTC)
thread_title: Title

message: was held in the fall of 1377 (probably 26 October, the feast day of Saint Demetrius) 
this is bad translation, please check serbian version
26.10.1377 on Mitrovdan i monestry Milesevo its correc 87.116.165.208 (talk) 02:01, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mistake 

message: I would like to add the details of Tvrtkos Croatian origins! His father was the son of Prijezda I founder of the Kotromanici dynasty! judging by his parents ethnicity he was Croat! He also used the title of Ban! Which is only used in Croatia 78.0.55.150 (talk) 16:44, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tvrtko Kotromanic 

message: The coin depicting the coat of arms with the fleur-de-lys needs a source. The picture in question comes from a series of (relatively speaking) newly struck coins, modeled after a coronation ducat allegedly found in Mileseva in 1935. However, I have not personally been able to find any image of said original, and the coronation ducats and coins of the Kotromanic dynasty that are preserved look vastly different. This image is, most likely, a modern reimagining, and I have not found any basis for it in contemporary sources.
I will put a "citation needed" remark under the image, and if anyone has any literature on the subject (or even better, access to either the monastery or any relevant museum) some extra info would be great. Vampsvamp (talk) 12:09, 12 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tvrtko's coin 

message: There's a mention of Slavonia among Tvrtko's conquests, but this is incoherent with other descriptions. While the medieval meaning of Slavonia was much larger than today, it was largely towards the west, not towards the south. Does someone have access to the full text of Fine (1994) page 398? @Surtsicna added this back in 2016. --Joy (talk) 18:48, 3 April 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: In the meantime, @Norden1990 posted some links in the discussion Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bosnian-Hungarian War (1387-1390) where I read some machine translations that mention how flags of Naples were raised in the Syrmian and Slavonian counties, but I still didn't find clear explanations of where Tvrtko may have invaded to his north, rather mostly to his southwest. --Joy (talk) 13:26, 6 April 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  mention of Slavonia