Talk:Lady Shiva

message: clarify the issue in question, but the idea of him losing one battle and almost winning the other doesn't make him the best. And if he wanted to save her soul by dying, why did he try killing her in the first battle? And if Batgirl actually defeated Shiva, and Dragon almost did, how is he the best? --DrBat 19:49, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: R.Dragon

message: Batman himself once said that The Question is one off the best marcial artists in DC Universe. He is also known as one of the best students of Richard Dragon and, as the mais page itself says, the standard Lady Shiva uses to measure her own skills. He deserves to be in the best fighters list, even more tham Nightwing.
It's not a list of "best fighters".  It's a list of fighters that might be the best.  Neither the Question, nor Black Canary, nor Nightwing has ever beaten or stalemated anyone on the list.  Being someone's best student or someone's measuring stick is not enough to be considered the best.  If the lists are to stay on wiki at all (and for all the arguments they cause I think they are just barely useful enough to be worth it) there needs to be some measuring stick to decide if a character can be on the list.  Beating someone else on the list makes the most sense.  Anything short of that is likely to make this degenerate into message-board like fighting, which has no place on wiki.D1Puck1T 07:30, 8 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia is not a message board, please do not use it as one.  The point of the talk pages is to discuss why changes should be made to pages, and to try to get a consensus on what to put on a page.  Yelling at other posters is not the way to convince them you are correct.  To answer your question: I did not interpret the fight in "55" as being easy.  Yes, he nearly killed Shrike.  I believe that just showed that he had been pushed so far that he was willing to keep attacking an opponent he had already defeated.  As for "91", what we saw of the fight was indeed largely in Dick's favor.  However, Shrike did land two good blows.  The last of his attacks that we saw even slashed through Nightwing's face.  When someone's attack is inches away from being a lethal blow, that is not "no serious problem".  After the face injury we do not see the rest of the fight.  Yes, we know Nightwing wins, but we do not see how difficult it was, how long it took, how many blows Shrike landed, etc.  Compare to Shrike's performance against Batgirl.  First blow to save Tim.  Second blow (using Shrike's own shuriken, caught in midair) cuts a major artery in a way that isn't lethal, but prevents Shrike from running away - she wants to interrogate him.  Third blow breaks his arm and disarms him - she still just wants to interrogate him.  Fourth blow knocks him out when it's clear he won't talk.  Shrike's down in 4 moves, with the implication being that she could have taken him out sooner if she didn't want to interrogate him first.  He didn't land one finger on her, she didn't break a sweat, and she was bored.  Nightwing was almost in the exact same position, wanting information from Shrike.  We do not know how many moves it took for him to defeat Shrike, but we do know that Nightwing did not walk away from the fight calm and uninjured.  I like Dick, but the fights against Shrike do not make him look as good as Shiva and Cassandra.D1Puck1T 05:09, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Question 

message: The latest Birds of Prey (93) insinuates the Prometheus defeated both Batman and Shiva, What comic was that in? Does it count since he uses technological means to be a martial artist? --Outlawpoet 05:41, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Prometheus 

message: In the arc that the Joker killed Jason Todd, Batman defeated Lady Shiva in a hand to hand combat.
In that fight, Batman admitted that Lady Shiva is skilled than him, BUT he is stronger, and win getting close enough to he uses immobilize her using brute force. So, it's true that Lady Shiva is better with martial artist techniques, but it doesn't mean that Batman or other character can't defeat her in a hand to hand combat.
-- Carlos Eduardo da Cruz Cunha ,May 3,2006 - Brasília - Brazil
That isn't what happened at all, Carlos. Shiva and Batman fought but she was knocked out from behind by Jason Todd. Batman has admitted in the past that Shiva is a better martial artist than he is and thinks the same of her daughter.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.114.17.243 (talk) 06:48, 20 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Batman 

message: Shiva status seems to be droping fast looseing all these fights; Cassandra cain TWICE, both fights with Batman and Prometheus ended with her on her back from one hitter quiters and her not landing a single hit. And don't care how you look at the last fight she had with Dragon, she LOST, Dragon had her primed and ready to deliver the Leopard blow when some henchman interfered. She was gone, it was dump luck that kept her alive. Think of it like this, if your get your ass kicked up & down and by chance a rock or whatever falls from above and knock the other guy in the head disorientating him and then you gain the upper hand knock him out you still got your ass whooped, you just got lucky is all. So when do we get to see were the inigmatic Constantine Drakon rates with some of the real heavy hitters on the charts. When does he get his crack at Shiva? Is he suppose to be a meta the way moves so fast u can't see him Nightwing99
The DCU considers Shiva the worlds most feared assassin and one of the top martial artists and IMO since all these things are subjective to writers (who are as susceptible to fan-wank as the rest of us) and people's abilities flip flop in differing continuities, that's as source as we're gonna get.  Frankly, Nightwing99, I'm seriously starting to consider you a Troll.  Remember, Wikipedia is about working together and having your work edited by many people to come to a consensus as to what is factual and what is not.  -- Ipstenu 14:05, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Constantine Drakon 

message: As I'm sure everyone is aware, Wikipedia does not host original research; this includes synthesis. As such I have removed the unreferenced section concerning 'greatest martial artist'. Save it for the fan forums. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 14:16, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Martial artist nonsense

message: This article needs the B-Class checklist filled in to remain a B-Class article for the Comics WikiProject.  If the checklist is not filled in by 7th August this article will be re-assessed as C-Class.  The checklist should be filled out referencing the guidance given at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Assessment/B-Class criteria. For further details please contact the Comics WikiProject.  Comics-awb (talk) 16:56, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: WikiProject Comics B-Class Assesment required

message: As this B-Class article has yet to receive a review, it has been rated as C-Class. If you disagree and would like to request an assesment, please visit Wikipedia:WikiProject_Comics/Assessment#Requesting_an_assessment and list the article. Hiding T  15:03, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: C-Class rated for Comics Project

message: Did any but me read the new 52 Nightwing 00 where Batman was battling Lady Shiva forcing Dick Greyson to put on his Robin suit for the first time in the new 52 verse.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.142.183.23 (talk) 00:02, 12 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: New 52

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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