Talk:Women in Refrigerators

message: To anyone who's interested--this was done to correct the terminology, references, and url references for the site 'Women in Refrigerators' (as the term was originally coined). No offense was intended to the creators of the original 'Girlfriend-in-Refrigerators-Syndrome' entry. Significant portions of the entry have been incorporated into the new entry, along with several corrections, and some historical background for the term and the site that was created in support of it. Hopefully, this will be alright with everyone involved. Thanks for your time! Fcr 07:00, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Women in Refrigerators vs. Girlfriend in Refrigerators

message: What's this about Rachel Summers being "lobotomized"? There's no mention of such an event in her own article, and I don't remember it. She's also possibly the most powerful telepath in the Marvel universe, which would be quite impossible for somebody who's been lobotomized. 71.236.33.191 18:35, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm removing that one, since other than being on one website there is no reliable citation for it. -- Noclevername 20:54, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Rachel Summers lobotomized?

message: I edited the the section on Gwen Stacy to reword the phrase "editorial mandate". This phrase makes it sound as though the editor of Amazing Spider-Man dictated to the writer that he must kill off the character. However, this does not match the accompanying reference. Rather, the referenced webpage indicates that the writer made the decision to kill off the character (at the artist's suggestion) and this idea was supported by the editor. Granted, the source indicates that untenable editorial restrictions influenced the "authorial cowardice", but this is distinct from an "editorial mandate". After an unsatisfactory first attempt, I have now changed it to read "editorial reasons". Not much different, I know, but I think it more accurately reflects the source. --GentlemanGhost 00:12, 5 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I was under the impression that they killed off Gwen Stacy because they knew they couldn't keep them from being married forever, and they didn't want to risk Spiderman's status as a tragic hero by letting him be happy for once - leaving them with little choice but to either force them into a break-up that would seem unnatural or to shove her into the refrigerator. "Gwen Stacy Syndrome" seems to be more about offing somebody to either make writing easier or to escape a corner than to provide motivation and trauma. Fdgfds 13:58, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Unfortunately, the link that was originally used as a reference for this  has gone dead. Someone replaced it with a different link, but didn't correct it in the references section. As I recall, according to the old link, it was the artist who suggested killing her off, which the writer thought was a good idea, largely for the reasons you mention. As the current link indicates, the editorial staff also didn't want a married Spider-Man because it would not appeal to kids. --GentlemanGhost 12:15, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Now that I know about the Internet Wayback Machine, I was able to find an archived version of the original link. Even better than this would be the Comic Buyers Guide article which the writer of this webpage mentions. Apparently, they researched the decision to kill off Gwen Stacy. I'm not sure when that came out, but this webpage was written in 2003 and the author described the article as "recent". --GentlemanGhost (talk) 16:22, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Gwen Stacy Syndrome

message: Steve Trevor was gratutioustly killed offed one year before Gwen Stacy was, if not more. 03:01, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Forerunner to Gwen Stacy Syndrome

message: I remember viewing the site years ago and seeing a section which used writer/artist John Byrne was used as an example of someone who consistantly uses the Women in Refrigerators plot device. Somewhere along the line this part of the website was deleted. Does anyone know why this was the case and should this be included in the main article? Artemisboy 22:51, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: John Byrne Examples Deleted

message: I undid the recent (January) move of this article to Women in Refrigerators (comics). As there is no other notable article or topic with this name, disambiguation is unnecessary. --GentlemanGhost 12:44, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Page move

message: Could editors who work on this page please take the time to CITE their statements? There was a long process to even keep this article on Wikipedia that involved lots of reasoned debate and a considerable number of citing of sources. It's become disheartening to check in on the article from time to time and find more and more unsourced material creeping in. PLEASE cite your sources! Fcr 03:32, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Mike Grell says she wasn't raped here: http://www.mikegrell.com/mikegrell/feature-longbow.jsp , which is an article written by him and located on his official website.  There are plenty of fans who continue to believe that she was raped, contrary to Grell's insistence otherwise, but it's clear that in his mind she was not.  I added a statement clarifying this to the article, but my sentence structure is somewhat clumsy.  Maybe someone else can improve it; nonetheless, I think it is important to note that the writer/creator did not intend (or at least claims not to have intended) to imply that Black Canary was raped. Bananafish00 23:00, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Citations

message: Would the attacking e.g. of a female sidekick (Like what happened to Jubilee couint as an example of this?  Emma Hordika (talk) 15:26, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Probably, but that's a question for a forum, not for Wikipedia. --GentlemanGhost (talk) 22:39, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Female Sidekicks

message: Re: The metatextual part. Seems original research to me. Hal hates Major Force for many reasons; one because he killed his friend's girlfriend in the fridge. Smashing MF with a ring-created fridge would be irony to him, a logical extension of the story's circumstances. As for Bulleteer, her house guest went evil and attacked her. Most houses have fridges. Lots42 (talk) 12:50, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Original research?

message: You forgot to mention the original depowerment of several Golden and Silver-Age female comics characters. One was WONDER WOMAN of the late 60s.  (1) Diana Prince looses her powers through some infraction of conduct in Amazon law. She is also exiled, and loses her memory and ability at martial arts. While her title comic book continued for a couple of years, she acquired a fabulouse contemorary wardrobe(all white, in which she had to do battle in,) a mostly noir and supernatural theme to all her stories; and a strange little china-man who trained her to regain much of her mortal physical ability and confidence. (These changes had the editors desired effect of forcing Wonder Woman out of the JUSTICE LEAGUE roster for much of the 70s.)
(2)Supergirl. Linda Danvers' superpowers go awry and leaves her sporadically super-charged (This was in tandem with the Jack Kirby-inspired powering-down of Superman in the early 70s.  The appparent vunerability of Supergirl made for some pretty adult story-lines for that era, taking the character out of her rather goofy malaise. Oh, and yes, she also obtains a rack of racey, provocative new costumes.
(3) Black Canary. It had seemed confusing whether or not Dinah Drake retained her "carnary scream" power. She still seemed to have them in the Justice League (of whom she, and Zatana filled the immeasurable void left by Wonder Woman). Dinah seemed too pre-occupied playing nurse-maid to the increasingly self-destructive Oliver Queen and Roy Harper to be an effective crime -fighter. (Actually many would figure that Ms. Drake would have been so fed-up with these two misfits, she could have comtemplated suicide and put herself in a refrigrator to be discovered by the two just to spite them for the misery they caused her).
(4)Bat-Girl. Albeit, in the late 70s and 80s, Babs Gordon is made an invalid by the Joker.  Before that, her responsibilities as congresswoman limted her activities.
(5)Wonder Girl. along with the 70s "TEEN TITANS",Donna Troy, as traumatized as the rest of her team-mates over an unstoppable political assasination, decides to retire from super-heroics and takes up with her co-horts to become social workers(?)
(6)Giant-Girl(of the original"DOOM PATROL"). After their demise by their arch-foe, she is the only one who never returns from death, as inexplicably all the males do.
(7) Duo Damsel(formerly TRIPLET GIRL). Well, that'll teach ya: The price of getting too romantically involved with either Superboy, or Lar Gand (Mon-El)is DEATH (of multiple personalities)!!!
(8) Sue Richards' pregnacy need not be reviewed here, although in hindsight I wonder if the editors at Marvel weren't reacting to the late 60s Young Republicans\Nixon backlash of the so-called femmensit movement. I would also put "THE WASP"  in thsi category.  I didn't read enough of her comics to find out why she seemed to "fade away" as the 60 wer coming to a close.
(9)HAWKGIRL. Strained under the shadow of her husband.
(10)Finally, Electra and the Black Widow. I lump these two because they haven't been given their propers either among female characters. One was killed off then brought back in posthumous, narrative retrospective.  The latter never achieving the status of full vigilante.
The only exception to this neudering of female characters was (11)LOIS LANE. In fact being that she never had any powers to begin with placed her in a rather unique advantagefor an upgrade as an action character. The persuit and death of her young sister, Lucy, sends Lois into a spiralling fugue state in which she rejects Superman, quits her job at the Daily Planet, walks on the rain-soaked streets of Metropolis in a daze, gets mugged in an alley, but is instantly delivered by three bouty-licous "liberated babes" who later offer her food, lodging, and companionship. She then emerges as a crusading free-lance vigilante-reporter (in hot pants and platform-spiked shoes, I might add,) kicking butt, but still still snubbing Superman.  That series' plotline also ran a couple of years, and I'll bet JACK KIRBY  had a hand in this also as the plot-lines intersected his "fouth world' revison at DC comics.
So, there you have it.  the "GIRL-IN-THE-REFRIGERATOR" PHEMNOMENA would seem almost a staple in comics as 'cops and robbers!  [[Special:Contribution] (User talk) 02:03, 5 February 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The WiR website may be missing examples, but this article isn't the place for updates. This article is to provide an entry for the website itself, not to offer corrections or debate the merits of its content. Fcr (talk) 04:45, 14 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Neglected mentions

message: So is this topic on women killed or depowered or women killed or depowered to further a male character's story? The article is contradictory. Lots42 (talk) 12:46, 24 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Clarify

message: I've read through all the comments on the WiR site and none of the comic creators accused her of feminism.  Better source?--96.25.191.170 (talk) 23:59, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Accusations of Feminism?

message: Per one of the creators of WIR (Beau Yarbrough), the website has moved from http://www.unheardtaunts.com/wir/ to http://www.lby3.com/wir/.  I do not have privilege to edit the page, though (not enough edits). DanCrank (talk) 16:45, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: WIR website moved

message: It has been suggested to merge this article here but there seems to be no discussion set up here - anyone care to comment?--   🍺  Antiqueight confer 10:21, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Women in Refrigerators Syndrome]]

message: Is there a reason Robert Harris is singled out in ? For that matter, is there a reason the section discusses him at all? Judging by what’s written there, outside the site he’s only notable for a minor fan-submitted Marvel character. If I’m wrong to remove the paragraph, please improve it with answers to these questions. Thanks. —67.14.236.50 (talk) 00:12, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rob Harris under “Notable alumni” 

message: Hi Gang.
I removed this paragraph:
I went to clean up the year-old who-tags and checked the source article.  But the Guardian article that's linked does not actually say what's it's being held up as a reference for.  It kind of implies it, but for the most part it's talking about a greater shift in market demographics.  If the paragraph isn't referencing the Guardian article to discuss a definable group of people within the context of this phenomenon, then it probably shouldn't be here.  I think the existence of both the WIR website and this article talking about it adequately conveys the fact that people are critical of the phenomenon.
Cheers!
Reve (talk) 18:38, 20 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of final WIR Syndrome paragraph. 

message: Two references are provided for the statement that universities list WIR content as relating to pop culture:
* http://www.wsu.edu/~amerstu/pop/comix.html
* https://web.archive.org/web/20071012225358/http://perrymoorestories.com/content/hero.asp?id=superheroes
The first link is dead.  Here's a live version of the page:
* https://culturalpolitics.net/index/
There's no indication that it's related to any university.  
Here's an archived copy of the original page:
* https://archive.is/20120805193120/http://www.wsu.edu/~amerstu/pop/comix.html
This appears to have been posted as a personal page at Washington State, which I don't think reasonably supports a claim that "universities" list this content.
Nothing on the cited "perrymoorestories.com" supports the statement regarding universities, but the "perrymoorestories.com" page is cited on the corresponding French wikipedia page https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Femme_dans_le_frigo to support the statement of a connection between women in the fridge and the concept of gay death.
With at least the one statement about universities gone, some additional examples of references in mass culture would be desirable, even with the statement about the concept of gay death added.  The section becomes pretty weak otherwise. Fabrickator (talk) 00:58, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  References in mass culture 1st paragraph 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: to be merged.. Consensus found in merging both into a singular article Women in refrigerators, with the trope article being the base.  – robertsky (talk) 07:32, 5 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 14 December 2023