Talk:Variations and Fugue on a Theme by Handel

message: When I made changes and additions to the article this morning, I wasn't aware that some of what had been posted by others earlier was plagiarized. If I had, I would have noted that a fact upon saving the page. The original source is at http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/variations-and-fugue-on-a-theme-by-handel/. I hope my re-writing has reduced it. A major re-write might be worth doing. -- deschreiber  —Preceding undated comment was added at 14:15, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: What you've found there is one of the countless wikipedia copycats that crawl articles and copy them verbatim. It's totally legal, too. --Blehfu (talk) 17:12, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  reporting plagiarism 

message: I'm puzzled by the request for citations for simple, well-known facts such as that Brahms was a serious collector of music manuscripts or that he incorporated older compositional practices into his own music. I can run off, flip through a source here or there and, with some effort, find a passage to reference in a footnote, but aren't these facts of common Brahmsian knowledge not needing a footnote, just as I wouldn't expect to footnote the name of his father, the number of sets of variations he wrote before the Handel Variations or the fact that he disliked "the music of the future"? Would I, for example, need to footnote a "claim" that many of Beethoven's manuscripts verge on illegibility? Deschreiber (talk) 14:05, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I have a reflex when it comes to encountering a certain tone of writing. There's another party involved in writing about him or analyzing music. As for the name of Brahms' father, being a serious collector, and the illegibility of Beethoven's manuscript, no reference necessary, but disliking the "music of the future", especially if it is from a direct quotation, I think deserves a citation. I will remove the cn tags, but still feel that citations would be helpful. Wikipedia:When_to_cite Wikipedia:Cite_sources#When_to_cite_sources --Blehfu (talk) 15:23, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

text: I'll go look up some references (or perhaps supporting facts?), even though I believe Brahms's historical position is almost defined by his opposition to the school of Liszt and Wagner; it is a thread that runs throughout his biographies; however, I will defer to your judgement. I'll also look for the tone that caught your attention. As I wrote, I admit I was aware of some raggedness in the transition at those spots. Deschreiber  —Preceding undated comment was added at 17:18, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  citations needed? 

message: I didn't change any text, just sorted it a bit, sorted into some sections. Tovey and Swafford quotes look good in the header. --Blehfu (talk) 04:42, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  New sections 

message: I removed a paragraph relating to one of George Henschel's anecdotes about Brahms, per this edit summary. Judging by George Henschel's text, it happened a full 15 years after Brahms composed the Variations and Fugue on a Theme by Handel. It's probably illustrative, but doesn't fit chronologically. Graham87 05:44, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of paragraph