Talk:Vezina Trophy

message: Moved from main article:
[added by Robert A.: do you agree?] Starting with the 1982-1983 season, the goal keeper judged the best in terms of his ability, skills (and not only on his goal average) gets the trophy...
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Totally unrelated to the article per se, but I am just interested if anybody knows: why did the NHL switch the criteria for the Vezina AND create a new trophy (Jennings)? Why not leave Vezina's criteria the same and have the Jennings Trophy be for the new criteria? I'd be interested to know if anybody with some hockey history background could answer that.
The Vezina was one of the oldest and most prestigious awards in hockey, so I would imagine they wanted to prestige of the name "Vezina" to go along with the voting for the most outstanding goaltender.  §daemonw  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daemonw (talk • contribs) 00:45, 15 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: I don't really understand the problem with saying "Player still active in the NHL" instead of just "Player still active". The pros of the first version is that it leaves no risk of misunderstanding since there are other icehockey leagues and some players may still have an active career in any of these. What is the big con with saying it? JdeJ (talk) 20:04, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Player still active

message: Quote: "Under the original definition, there would often be multiple winners from the same team during one season. In the 1973-74 NHL season, Tony Esposito of the Chicago Black Hawks and Bernie Parent of the Philadelphia Flyers finished tied for the fewest goals against, the only time that there would be a tie between two players from different teams."
Under the old definition, the Vezina went to the team that allowed the fewest goals that season.  Up until the mid-1960s, teams generally used only one goaltender, so his name was engraved.  After that, any goaltender who appeared in 25 or more games was listed on the trophy. This is not so much "multiple winners," but rather shared credit.  1973-74 was simply the first time that two teams tied for the lead in fewest goals, and it happens that both were one-goalie teams.WHPratt (talk) 17:40, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Needs Rewording

message: To answer the question posed above: The Vezina trophy had a long history, but it was generally considered a weakness that it honored the team first and the individual indirectly.  A team's primary goalie might have been the best in the league, as measured by individual goals-against average, but if the team's backup goalie(s) allowed too many goals, the trophy might go elsewhere.  Supposedly, it was Glenn Hall vs Terry Sawchuk vs Jacques Plante, head-to-head . . . but the race also included inivsible records of the Detroit and Montreal backups who filled in for a few games compared to Hall (who always played every game).  The subs could decide the race for the stars.  
There were numerous campaigns to award the Vezina in the same manner as the Hart.  When the last of these succeeded, the historic Vezina got the new and popular criterion, and the new Jennings Trophy picked up the less-highly regarded team criterion.WHPratt (talk) 17:40, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Jennings vs Vezina

message: The criteria for winning the Vezina must have changed before the 80s. In the first season, Hainsworth was not the goalie who gave up the least goals or had the lowest goals-against average. I'm not surprised it's not covered in this list. The NHL and the HHOF web sites only mention the change in the 80s. I think we will need to update the history of the criteria for winning. I'm going to start researching this from old newspapers and sources. Any suggestions about any books that discuss the history of the trophy? ʘ alaney2k ʘ (talk) 15:44, 20 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: This should have been an RFC. Hainsworth, the first winner, did not have the lowest GAA. It was definitely the "most valuable goaltender" criteria at first. Certainly, it would always closely track the lowest GAA, but at first it started out like today's criteria, then became simply GAA. For another thing, both NHL.com and legendsofhockey.com are filled with errors - see the listings of the years for Hall of Fame induction. ʘ alaney2k ʘ (talk) 14:53, 21 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: For example, look at the induction date for Dan Bain, Art Ross on legendsofhockey.net - it says 1945, but they were actually inducted in 1949. You can find that out by reading the HHOF's own book on honoured members, which lists 1949, disagreeing with their own web site. You can also see on legendsofhockey.net that the O'Brien was awarded in 1918, 1919 and 1920, when it was not awarded, as the NHA had suspended, and the Canadiens held onto the trophy. ʘ alaney2k ʘ (talk) 15:09, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

text: I believe the references and the previous version of this page showed that the award was given to the goaltender playing the most games for the team allowing the least goals during the regular season.  This is consistent with why Hainsworth won the Vezina in 1927.  There is no need to introduce a 1946 separation when the criteria was the same before and after.  The discrepancy in perceived criteria was mentioned in the previous version of the page as well.  99.246.116.118 (talk) 02:15, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  No, there were no references at the time of the donation stating that it would be based on the team. None of the references at the time show that. ʘ alaney2k ʘ (talk) 03:42, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  Maybe not specifically indicating team but more and better references show that it was for the statistically lowest goals against average than a vague subjectively chosen "best" or "top" goaltender.  In 1946 the criteria wasn't changed, just clarified which doesn't deserve a break in the list.  Hainsworth won in 1927 for the exact same criteria as Hodge in 1964, whereas Bower only won in 1965 because it had changed to allow multiple winners.  99.246.116.118 (talk) 06:29, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  It was clear in 1927 that it was for the goaltender. It changed to an award based on the team in 1946. Of course, by then, teams were regularly using multiple goaltenders. It would be useful to get a date for when they allowed multiple goaltenders on the trophy. And the 25 minimum. ʘ alaney2k ʘ (talk) 14:20, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  I have merged the lists and the notes. This should be satisfactory for everyone. ʘ alaney2k ʘ (talk) 14:45, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  criteria for winning 

message: I removed some shading that showed the Vezina winner also winning the Cup. I'm not against it per say, but here are a couple of things 1. This is about an individual award that adding Cup winners seems a bit unnecessary since its about the individual and not their teams overall performance. 2. while that not be a big concern to me the real reason I removed it was that it was only done to the recent winners section if the coloring is going to be added it needs to include every winner and not just the ones from the modern era of the trophy.  Showing only 4 or so guys skews the perception especially considering Jacques Plante's first 5 wins all happened in the same year the Habs won the Cup. --Mo Rock...Monstrous  (leech44) 19:09, 12 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Player also winning the Stanley Cup in the same season 

message: The trophy was named after Georges Vézina, a French-Canadian whose name is written with an accent, as reflected in his own Wikipedia page. I appreciate that the NHL has dropped the accent from the name of the trophy in English, but the man's name should still be written with an accent in this article. I tried editing the correct spelling in today, but user Ravenswing reverted it back to the incorrect spelling with no accent. Eulalie Écho (talk) 17:11, 1 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Vézina with an é

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thread_title:  External links modified