Talk:Pirahã people

message: I belive this article is far out of date. Anthropologist Marco Antônio Teixeira Gonçalves has studied the Pirahã people, focusing on mythology, cosmology, kinship, and social structure. The main refference is his ethnography, but he has over a dozen published works about the Pirahã.
* GONÇALVES, Marco Antônio Teixeira. O mundo inacabado : ação e criação em uma cosmologia amazônica. Rio de Janeiro : UFRJ, 2001.
a summary of his findings are on: http://www.socioambiental.org/pib/epi/piraha/piraha.shtm (in portuguese. Maybe someone could re-work it into an article
--Rogeriobwp 19:47, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Big Review Needed 

message: Where does the name Pirahã come from? It's apparently not a word in their language, so I assume it must their name from a neighboring group? Which one? Rigadoun 16:44, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Origin of name

message: Just a note about the language used in this article:
First, the idea that the Pirahã people are "incapable of learning numeracy" is debatable.  Prof. Peter Gordon at Columbia U. posits this claim, but Prof. Daniel Everett argues that the Pirahã are capable of counting; they just choose not to do so.  
Second, I believe it's unfair and elitist to refer to their artwork as "crude".  Definitions of aesthetics vary from culture to culture, so I think that using the word "crude" may be a bit of a judgement or labeling rather than a description.  Can we get a picture of some of their artwork to post in the article and simply state that they have little artwork and it's mainly used to ward off evil spirits?
: agreed on second point. it sounds like its just religious artwork so maybe it's not for aesthetic Ice Truck Killer (talk) 23:36, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neutrality and Cultural Elitism 

message: I am sorry if I am mistaken, or if this is seen as offencive, but I am suggesting that the article be re formatted to appear more like an encyclopedia article rather than a list. It should also include a larger section about the Pirahã's lack of numeric words, or a numeric system at all.--Whytecypress 23:58, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Format 

message: Could someone "in the know" provide an IPA spelling of "Pirahã"? I'd like to know how to pronounce the name. Simões (talk/contribs) 16:00, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't have an IPA spelling, but the New Yorker says it's pronounced "pee-da-HAN"...?  Pfalstad 16:20, 14 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Based on that, I would propose /pi.ɾaˈhã/ with an alveolar tap and a nasalized /a/, but I'm not certain.  Nbc7 18:26, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pronunciation 

message: This article states near the beginning that (presumably because of the low numbers) the culture is in danger of extinction, but the article on Pirahã language#Miscellaneous states that because of the importance placed on the language and near absence of bilingualism, that the language is in no immediate danger. It seems unlikely that the culture would go extinct but the language thrive, since (at least in this article) it seems most of the unique cultural characteristics are coded in the language. Neither claim has a footnote, how in danger is this cultural/linguistic group of extinction? Rigadoun  (talk) 17:39, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another contradiction 

message: This page is unbelievably out of date. Most of the factoids listed are in fact claims of Everett which many people disagree with, and in fact just this March (2007) by Andrew Nevins, David Pesetsky and Cilene Rodrigues provides a counter argument for just about every point in that list (Everett came out with a rebuttal paper about a month later though, and I haven't finished reading it yet). Both papers can be downloaded from the top downloads list at http://ling.auf.net/lingbuzz/ . —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.27.207.27 (talk) 02:49, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I admit some bias towards Everett (though unlike him I see Pirahã as posing problems that UG needs some (perhaps severe) rethinking to accomodate, rather than problems that invalidate UG), and I have not yet finished reading the aforementioned papers (I am but a lowly undergrad and have recently become interested in Pirahã), but many of Nevins, et al.'s claims are based on data Everett compiled in the 1980s, before his break with UG -- they are using his previous reasearch (biased towards fitting Pirahǎ into UG) to disprove his current research (which is biased against fitting Pirahã into UG).  It seems to me that this will be an ongoing debate until more fieldwork is done on Pirahã, and so for the moment, we should report data taken from the most recent credible fieldwork, which I believe to be Everett 2005.
Also, the references section ought to include Everett 2005, which is available from SIL online: http://www.sil.org/americas/brasil/PUBLCNS/ANTHRO/PHGrCult.pdf, and probably also Nevins, Pesetsky, & Rodrigues 2007 and Everett's 2007 response.  I will add Everett 2005; what do we think about Nevins et al.'s criticism and Everett's response? Nbc7 20:18, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I missed that Everett 2005 was in the Further Reading Section, and I apologize for failing to indent my second paragraph.  Nonetheless, should we add Nevins's criticism and Everett's response? Nbc7 20:20, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Very out of date 

message: If that means what I think it is, that is obviously vandalism, if not, someone should really clarify, because it seems to imply that they all suffer from an erectile dysfunction of some sort.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.74.115.171 (talk) 22:51, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: It is not vandalism. It means hard as in tough, resilient. --129.11.13.73 (talk) 17:57, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Desire to be hard" 

message: I wonder at this classification, since there is no discussion of sharing among the people. It sounds more like pure Libertarianism to me. Is there any research to support the classification? 
—Monado (talk) 20:30, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: As I understand, primitive communism is a technical term from Marxist historical theory like "feudalism" and "capitalism". I'm not sure there is a comparative term for liberal/libertarian theory that would apply here. --129.11.13.73 (talk) 01:18, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd like to delete this. I'm not a professional but have read a lot of anthropology, and in my experience this term isn't commonly used to describe hunter gatherer societies. It seems like a loaded term. I don't see any reason to put Piraha society in the framework of Marxist thought. And in the absence of a source that does so, it seems like a violation of WP:NOR.TimidGuy (talk) 15:48, 18 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Primitive communism? 

message: I propose that this article be rewritten to remove the inappropriate "gee whiz" tone and make it sound serious and professional. 203.118.184.16 (talk) 21:54, 25 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rewrite 

message: sorry, but the writing is a bit odd here.,e.g., why are they then called "Pirahã"?
Also, why does it then offer the quote ""Pirahã do not make canoes" ?
"Their culture is remarkably conservative" sounds like a statement of a political philosophy, It appears to mean they conserve resources, note the example given is evidence of a practice, not necessarily of a mind set or philosophy.
In general, the piece is interesting, but (sorry again) seems to draw too many conclusions from a limited set of observations.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.90.21.93 (talk) 17:51, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: the word "conservative" does not necessarily have anything to do with politics. See "environmental conservation" Cornellbob (talk) 21:19, 14 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  . The Pirahã people do not call themselves Pirahã but instead the Hi'aiti'ihi 

message: "Daniel Everett states that one of the strongest Pirahã values is no coercion; you simply don't tell other people what to do.[5]"
But later: "Everett brought in a master builder who taught and supervised the Pirahã in making a canoe, so that they could make their own. But when they needed another canoe, they said that "Pirahã do not make canoes" and told Everett that he should buy them a canoe.[5]"
79.33.108.101 (talk) 22:14, 30 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Not necessarily, in his book Everett suggests the Pirahã don't really consider him a person in the full sense, they see him more as a performing monkey or parrot, even after years of living with them... --86.171.23.24 (talk) 16:11, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Yet another contradiction 

message: What is grammatical recursion?  The link to recursion does not explain it at all.211.225.33.104 (talk) 09:24, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  grammatical recursion 

message: The information about the school is in a documentary about the Piraha that was aired by the the Smithsonian Channel last year. If that's considered RS, I'll find a citation for it. TimidGuy (talk) 15:40, 24 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Sounds like a reliable source to me. —Mr. Granger (talk · contribs) 16:32, 24 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. Have added. It's a fascinating documentary. TimidGuy (talk) 12:06, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  School 

message: What follows that statement can hardly be described as economical. Maybe another word is needed, or just give those same facts without being preceded by this statement, which in no wise fits the context.AtomAnt (talk) 00:23, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. Good suggestion. Have made the change. TimidGuy (talk) 09:40, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Their culture is remarkably economical." 

message: The quick facts box on the right hand side says their population numbers 200. The third sentence says they have more than double that at 420 in 2010. Neither have a specific citation. Does anybody know which number is most accurate to date and how we know?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Edleob (talk • contribs) 23:25, 23 September 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current Population  

message: Non primitive people, who simply lost their cultural wealth, due to their small number and form of social interactions.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:587:4113:1F00:D5CF:9E7C:8:923D (talk) 16:01, 11 January 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  neo-primitive people(s) 

message: Reiterating a question that was asked more than a decade ago: are there any sources on the origin of the exonym "Pirahã"? I cannot find an explanation through google, and I was wondering if an expert had a source for this. If easier, then what is the first recorded use of the word? AnyGuy (talk) 07:29, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origin of the Name? (Part two) 

message: There is also no source for this claim and that seems a serious and derogatory claim to make w/out backup. 192.69.180.187 (talk) 21:05, 14 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why does this article claim these people trade in Sex?