Talk:Heat (1995 film)

message: Common mistake in the synopsis: the girl that Waingro maybe kills (nothing is seen on screen, it's pretty sure he hurts her but we don't know if he kills her) is NOT the same girl whose murder Hanna investigates after. Hairstyle, hair color and skin color are completly different: the prostitue has straight and somewhat bleached hair whereas the murder victim has black cornrows or braids and has a darker complexion.
It could be an earlier victim of Waingro or something completely unrelated. Watch it again if you don't believe!  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:E0A:475:BE90:71BF:8599:3DB9:A5CF (talk) 18:35, 15 July 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: THANK YOU!! I just watched the film and noticed this immediately. It's backed up by how the policewoman says to Vincent on the scene that the killing resembled at least two other murders of prostitutes in the same area. Imo it makes sense that Waingro had killed several prostitutes (same modus operandi) - hence, i wrote that on the plot synopsis. 222.152.26.228 (talk) 10:52, 19 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  NOT THE SAME GIRL 

message: Please give credit where its due by adding Danny Trejo's character
I agree with the above that the plot description leaving out Danny Trejo and listing every other major actor is a problem. I'm not sure the best way to solve it, however; since Trejo's character's name is also Trejo, crediting the character as "Trejo (Trejo)" seems needlessly confusing, but crediting with the full name "Trejo (Danny Trejo)" deviates from the last-name only format of the rest of the section. In fact, since the page already has an extensive cast section, I'm not even sure listing the actor names in the synopsis is appropriate see: Wikipedia:How to write a plot summary. Anyone have a good idea how to address this? Barring some other idea, I will delete all the actor names from the synopsis and let the cast section speak for itself. Mr Subtlety (talk) 18:15, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: You're talking about different things. This is a years-old unsigned comment that is probably referring to a complete absence of Danny Trejo being listed at all, not about the incorrect use of the names in the plot section which was added against MOS guidelines a few months ago by a new user here. Problem solved. JesseRafe (talk) 18:29, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hey 

message: On the main page there are two quotes by McCauley, but I have no recollection of those quotes being used in the movie.
: The first quote is spoken to Eady, at her place, after the disastrous bank robbery, in reference to the death of Cherrito (Tom Sizemore).  The second quote is in the trailer, maybe not in the final cut, will have to check.  These quotes hardly add to the quality of the article anyway.  Slowmover 15:28, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  McCauley "Qoutes" 

message: I've just given Heat's precursor, L.A. Takedown its own entry as I felt it needed one. If anybody else has more information on it please feel free to add more to it. -- J.D. 12:11, 30 April 2006
Unaccountably, the article includes no mention of LA Takedown, an oversight mow remedied by me in the Background section. I could not, however, get the link to the above page to come out right, so if anyone would like to assist in this, by all means have a go at it! Orthotox (talk) 08:28, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  L.A. Takedown 

message: Just wondering if someone can identify what shotguns is used by Mykelti Williamson's character in the shootout scene and what by Wes Studi's character in the hotel door breaching scene?
: Thats a great point!   I wondered why on the elivator Studi ejects his rounds from his shotgun, and then load more.    I believe he loaded breaching rounds, which are lead powder encased in wax.   These are used to break the hindges of doors without harming anybody inside.
                                    Addition To Cast
Xander Berkley-Ralph
It's a Mossberg 500 - I've added The guns of Heat to the External Links section. Here's the bit about the Mossberg.  Crserrano 01:52, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Guns used in Heat 

message: I like the screenshots, especially the one of pacino going nuts ("She's got a great ass"!), but I think there are way too many screenshots, and the captions are mini paragraphs. This is my favorite movie, but I think they make it look way too cluttered. CynicalMe 19:05, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Too many pictures

message: The authorities that investigated what's known as the North Hollywood shootout believe that the two suspects used the shootout scene in Heat as training and inspiration.  Does anyone think its inappropriate to mention that fact in this article?
:That is true, i know alot about the North Hollywood shootout, and yes they did use Heat as a training video, i think its worth mentioning it, Dep. Garcia 20:56, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  North Hollywood Shootout 

message: Surely it's more accurate to describe De Niro's character as a Robber than a Thief? --Charlesknight 22:32, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Thief ? 

message: What happend to all the information? Who are these people deleteing it? Its happening all over wikipedia on movie pages, people delete trvia and interesting facts. WHY? Since when is too much information bad??? This is Wikipedia, not Britancia for gods sake! People like this web-site simply becasue it does provide a lot of information that others wont.
     Yeah, the trivia is what I come here for. I know what the film is about. Don't cut the  
     interesting stuff
Trivia is discouraged by Wikipedia and the only "trivia" that was on the page was comparing the ending scene to a scene from another movie and noting that it "seemed" like it was inspired from it.  If you want trivia, go to IMDB. Slinky317 (talk) 17:50, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Slinky317 may be right, but his tone and attitude toward new comers is what turned me off of editing Wikipedia. It's fine that he believes in the editing standard as it applies to trivia, but telling new folks to 'go to IMDb' is the same as telling someone to leave Wikipedia. Why not direct these new or uniformed folks to the appropriate policy pages so they can raise their concerns there. Or is it just easier to snipe someone's hard work? Creating an inviting atmosphere is one of the many ways that editors can encourage new thoughts, ideas and the continuation of Wikipedia.72.23.80.194 (talk) 03:09, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why has so much info been deleted 

message: Heat is based on some real life experiences, but I don't have time to add this now:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XU5Rfm57XFY&NR=1 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.210.45.20 (talk) 04:35, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Here's more trivia 

message: :Image:Heatposter.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:17, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Heatposter.jpg

message: :Image:Heatposter.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:18, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Fixed. Rationale given. --J.D. 18:46, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Heatposter.jpg

message: :Image:Heat001.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:18, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Heat001.jpg

message: :Image:Heat001.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:18, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Heat001.jpg

message: :Image:Colville pacific.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 04:44, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Colville pacific.jpg

message: Could someone write a quick para and link to the North hollywood shootout which was apparently inspired by the bank robbery/gun battle in this film?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.207.2.2 (talk) 16:16, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[North hollywood shootout]] 

message: I've trimmed the plot summary extensively, but it's still too long at about 1140 words. --Tony Sidaway 21:09, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Plot summary

message: :Image:Heat20qi.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot (talk) 22:18, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Heat20qi.jpg

message: Took this out on suspicion of OR, fancruft, totally unsourced, crystall balling and advertisement
-----
Though it was only a moderate success when it hit theaters in 1995, Heat has developed a devout cult following. Its deep characters, clockwork-like plot, and intense violence have earned director Michael Mann's three-hour-long crime epic many fans, more than a few of which are game developers. Indeed, the ultradifficult bank robbery level of Grand Theft Auto: Vice City was a direct homage to the film, featuring copies of the hockey-mask-and-coverall disguises worn in the beginning of Heat and re-creating its violent street-shootout denouement. 
Now, it appears Heat will be getting a more direct game adaptation. Today, the hybrid entertainment company Titan Productions announced that it has reached a deal with Regency Entertainment, the Hollywood production company that owns the rights to Heat, to publish a game based on the film for "next-generation consoles" in 2007. 
According to Titan Productions, Mann is in talks with Gearbox to oversee the game's development. There's also a good chance that many of the movies' stars will be lending their voices and likenesses to the game. Titan claims it is in "advanced stages with representatives for Robert De Niro, Al Pacino, and Val Kilmer to be part of the video game sequel." 
According to a statement by Titan, Heat: The Game will be a prequel or sequel to the film. If the game is a sequel, De Niro's character, Neil McCauley, will appear in flashback, perhaps in the form of training missions. If Pacino declines to get onboard, it would be a sequel that would have a new detective chasing down McCauley's crew.
----
It may be reinsertable as a footnote paragraph with sources. MickMacNee (talk) 11:48, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  removed section about 'sequel' (a game) 

message: I agree with this removal because the assertion of similarity is based purely on  original research.  In particular, critical appraisals such as interpretation of the theme of a film should cite a reliable source.  The decision to put weight on matters which may be superficial (the occurrence of the name Vincent in both films, for instance) should also be sourced.  Without a source it's reasonable to conclude that the emphasisput in the article may be unjustified.  If Mann has discussed the purported similarities in writings or in interviews, or the similarities have been remarked in critical appraisals in reliable secondary sources, then we can mention those facts.   --Jenny 12:52, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You are frankly wrong, and have completely misunderstood the purpose of the original research policy. The source for all "claims" are the films themselves, which is specifically allowed as being primary source material. The "claims" of similarity are not outrageously POV statements that require third party independant sources, which is what reliable sourcing is truly for, not to support banal fact checking. In fact there are no claims or assertions being made at all, just factual primary source based observations. As such, they possibly come under the rules against trivia, but even that is a weak claim given the strong intersections here. I fail to see what this ridiculously over-zealous campaign is hoping to achieve with regard the aims of wikipedia. Frankly, you and the others seriously need to go and find something better to apply your policy wonkery to, as you haven't achieved anything of great merit with this removal without discussion, but you have reinforced the self evidently poor interpretations of what is important to Wikipedia in other less experienced editors watching, and who infact actually look to have initiated this lame edit war in the first place, over a section that was stable for a very long time. MickMacNee (talk) 13:14, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I removed it again as its clearly trivia and original research. From the comment here and the article's edit history that's clearly the consensus of the editors. Please do not try to own this article Mick. Seek consensus before re-inserting the section. Aaron Bowen (talk) 07:09, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not owning this article, it is not my problem of so many people clearly don't have a good enough grasp of policy. Quite clearly with the same director this is clearly not trivia, but no doubt none of you are big enough to admit you are clueless, note even the lack of a reply from "Jenny". MickMacNee (talk) 10:20, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Removal of "Similarities to ''[[Collateral (film)|Collateral]]''" section

message: this page used to be alot bigger and had more images, alot more. Seems like somone didnt use the proper rationale, someone else could do it though? It was a really cool article, pretty bare now. ΤΕΡΡΑΣΙΔΙΩΣ(Ταλκ) 01:00, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Unfortunately there are restrictions on image use, basically you have to come up with a good reason to use an image. To be completely honest, often times you need a phoney baloney, contrived explanation as to why the image is desperately needed. Aaron Bowen (talk) 08:02, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah I guess but I also mean there used to be a lot more information, like a proper look at Manns thinking behind the film and the importance of the music (Heat (soundtrack)). now its about a third of what it was, its a shame and I do not get why it was almost all taken off. ΤΕΡΡΑΣΙΔΙΩΣ(Ταλκ) 19:25, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wow 

message: Yesterday, I changed in the plot summary "Together, the two men share a final, quiet moment of reflection and understanding as McCauley dies." to "Together, the two share a final, quiet moment of reflection and understanding as McCauley dies." as both subjects of the sentence are not both males. 129.97.185.42 (talk) 20:02, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: They're not?? 64.208.152.155 (talk) 01:01, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Subtle Mistake 

message: In the hope that the current edit war about the content of the Starring field can be concluded I offer Merriam-Websters (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/starring) definition of Starring:
"to feature in the most prominent or important role". I believe that definition is an argument for limiting the list to Al Pacino, Robert De Niro and Val Kilmer. Lklundin (talk) 22:39, 11 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: You're correct LKludin, Natalie Portman, Tom Sizemore, Ashley Judd are not starring roles. Tom Lennox (talk) 10:47, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: That is actually termed as the phrase "Starring Role", vs. "Starring". I mentioned this in the edit notes. Srobak (talk) 06:03, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current edit war about ''Starring''

message: Right, this is happening again. Can we get a show of hands for who wishes to stick with the consensus formed above, and who doesn't? I'm for keeping it at DeNiro, Pacino and Kilmer, and no more. GRAPPLE X 17:49, 10 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: "Starring", again

message: Yes I know the difference. "Minute" details would be Natalie Portman's suicide attempt or Kevin Gage's side steps as a serial killer. And even these "minute" details, I believe, would belong here. If your intention is to highlight that the only important point in the plot is the rivalry between two mutual nemeses, then you don't even need the rest of the plot in the first place. The plot according to your philosophy should be summarized in a single paragraph.
However, if you accept this as a choral, multilevel movie (which it is, if only for its long cast of known actors, its overlapping of different plot lines and its 180-minute span) then you should accept the inclusion of the different levels at some point or the other. 
This article was once longer and more complete and for some reason it has been mutilated to such an extent that the film's undeniable artistic significance is currently misrepresented. Walter Sobchak0 (talk) 01:32, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Per WP:FILMPLOT, plot summaries should be 400-700 words.  Given that Heat is a bit longer and more intricate, that rule could be fudged a bit, and the summary extended.  However, your edit brings the summary to 1234 words, which is never necessary.  We don't even need to mention the editor analysis you added to the plot summary.  If you edited more than once every few months, you'd probably be a bit more familiar with the policies that us regular editors enforce.  So, in conclusion, you get reverted again. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 10:32, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Sorry Sobchak0 - but I have to agree with COM on this. The details you are adding are doing less to contribute to the article as a whole as an information resource about the movie, and more for plot unveiling and "Cliff's Notes" - which are two entirely different things.  The general idea of the plot is already there, and facilitating it further would only serve to itemize rather than generalize it. WP is not intended to be a novel, or even a Cliff's Notes type resource.  You can look at other movie and tv show articles for examples of this, where even important details are omitted from them, yet there is still a vast amount of non-plot related, encyclopedic reference material about it.   As WP is a consensus-based reference, I urge you to see what kind of other comments people post here in regards to adding to the plot (or detracting from it) prior to making any further edits to the plot section.  Feel free to edit other relevant areas of the article however.  Srobak (talk) 13:53, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

text: Your vast array of strawman arguments basically tell me you understand that you are in the wrong (as other editors seem to agree).  I consider this matter closed. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 14:16, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Crotchety Old Man: 

message: If you want to reduce this plot to a 1000-word one (which I guess would be your notion of a compromise or a common ground) I think you have far more intelligent ways of doing so. For one thing, this plot has lots of unfounded statements which could be contested (such as Knowing he has more in common with McCauley than anyone else in his life...), whereas my previously erased contributions contain several plot points which are actually relevant (such the ones in the paragraph starting with "By means of a clever ruse...". And if you think McCauley's shadow on the terminal ground is extra, I also think that the "restless SWAT officer" portion is extra as well and should go. Etcetera
So yeah, I've got no problem in plot-trimming (although I just don't understand why it should be trimmed) as long as it's done reasonably. 
Walter Sobchak0 (talk) 13:16, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Sorry Sobchak0 - but I have to agree with COM on this. The details you are adding are doing less to contribute to the article as a whole as an information resource about the movie, and more for plot unveiling and "Cliff's Notes" - which are two entirely different things.  The general idea of the plot is already there, and facilitating it further would only serve to itemize rather than generalize it. WP is not intended to be a novel, or even a Cliff's Notes type resource.  You can look at other movie and tv show articles for examples of this, where even important details are omitted from them, yet there is still a vast amount of non-plot related, encyclopedic reference material about it.   As WP is a consensus-based reference, I urge you to see what kind of other comments people post here in regards to adding to the plot (or detracting from it) prior to making any further edits to the plot section.  Feel free to edit other relevant areas of the article however.  Srobak (talk) 13:53, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Your vast array of strawman arguments basically tell me you understand that you are in the wrong (as other editors seem to agree).  I consider this matter closed. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 14:16, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Oh and by the way 

message: I have about had it watching people change the genre tag back and forth. Let's get this hashed out on the table and be done with it. IMDB lists the primary genres for the movie as: Action | Crime | Drama | Mystery | Thriller
Under the "more" link - it includes several more - to the count of 80.  Obviously that is absurd for this article. I don't see any reason we can't appease everyone by including the primary 5 listed above.  Your thoughts?  Please remember this is a consensus, and further editing needs to be withheld until a consensus is reached. If further edit warring continues on this item prior to that determination, then I will start the steps necessary to get the page locked up until people can calm themselves down.  Srobak (talk) 21:01, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I view it as an action crime drama.  Not so much mystery or thriller. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 21:31, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  I agree with you - but some of the more recent edits are even going back and forth between action and crime. LOL  Would you be adverse to having multiple genres if it included both action and crime and perhaps others as indicated my IMDB or valid genre tags in recent edits?  Srobak (talk) 21:45, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Goodfellas is listed as a crime drama, and I'm sure there are other examples that list multiple genres, so the precedent is there.  Too much going on in this movie to pigeon-hole it to one genre.  Crotchety Old Man (talk) 21:52, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Heat is not an action movie, it's more of a drama. Rolaye With Cheese (talk) 00:33, 24 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: To not consider this an action film is absurd. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 02:03, 24 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's a drama with action elements, but hardly an action movie, Crotchety Old Fart (talk) 00:43, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh Tom Lennox, you aren't even trying anymore. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 00:48, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

text: To expand, "action crime drama" is a mouthful, and that particular term appears to be neologism.  From what I can tell, Heat is more strongly tied to "crime" than "action" or "drama". Erik (talk) 20:00, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Agreed - Action Crime Drama is indeed a mouthful, and clearly does not apply to this film. The referenced link to action film doesn't give proper justification to the genre label it has received here.  A search of Warner Brothers DVD website - the studio who released this film - has it classified as "Genre:    Drama,    Suspense/Thriller" (http://www.wbshop.com/Heat/1000025421,default,pd.html).  This can and should end all debate about this issue.  I will forward this info to Steve - who invoked the protection on the article. Srobak (talk) 20:12, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: What is your take on "crime film", though?  I provided search results backing its inclusion in that genre. Erik (talk) 20:14, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: While I agree with you that it is indeed a crime genre film - it is hard to argue with the actual studio that released it, no? :)  Srobak (talk) 20:20, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Seems like the studio would be a "primary source" in this case. :)  For all we know, it could be software limitation (as in not having the genre to categorize there), where a whole bunch of reliable secondary sources perceive it as a crime film. Erik (talk) 20:23, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Your call - I don't mind the addition of it - I think it applies, really. I would cite it however if you do, just my $.02.  I would think that even with software limitations it would be listed in crime and drama before thriller/suspense. Srobak (talk) 20:26, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I notified people at WT:FILM about this discussion and one for The Godfather.  We'll see what they think. Erik (talk) 20:28, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Just by doing some google books searches] i'm finding many studies of the films of Michael Mann refering to the film as a crime film. In the Encyclopedia of Film Noir it is referred to a "crime procedural" , The BFI Companion to Crime refers it to a "heist film" , in Now in Theaters Everywhere it's referred to as a "heist film" and part of Mann's series of crime films, , The Scarecrow movie guide refers to the film as a "crime movie" . New York Magazine refers to the film as both an "action film" . Allmovie refers to the film as a "thriller, action, crime thriller and police detective film". . The book "movies of the 90s" calls the film a "thriller". . The book "Thrillers" by Martin Rubin refers to it as a "heist" and "police film" . From these sources, most sources refer to it as some sort of sub-genre of the crime film. If there is still no consensus, I suggest examining these definitions of action films, thriller films, and crime films. Cheers. Andrzejbanas (talk) 20:57, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Any opinion on the releasing studio's genre classification, Andrzejbanas?  Thanks   Srobak (talk) 21:01, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

text: I'm for crime film, crime thriller or "heist film" myself from my research. Having more then two genre's in the intro is quite a mouthful. Andrzejbanas (talk) 21:03, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Heat is just a thriller as The Godfather is a comedy. 189.18.208.218 (talk) 17:59, 1 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I just found the article calling the film an action film. OK, there are action elements. But this is also a crime drama. The script calls it a crime saga. Anyway, here is the compromise: call it an action film/crime drama OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 19:41, 30 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: what is the consensus on genre?OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 16:10, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

text: It is not clear what the consensus is. Could someone tell me what the genre consensus is? OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 22:27, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd just call it a crime film, seeing as most sources call it that way and crime drama redirects there. Perhaps add that it's a heist film. There seems to be no consesus on this, but nobody has been participating in the discussion for a while, so I guess it's up to us. Daß Wölf (talk) 23:31, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Good. I am willing to compromise and call it an action/crime film, but there are various editors who believe it is solely an action film, but these people aren't participating in the Talk page discussion. Do you agree that we can call it an action/crime film?OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 17:48, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe heist/crime film would be better. While there is some shooting and killing, this is a far cry from the likes of Transformers or Lethal Weapon. I'm fine with action/crime film as well. Daß Wölf (talk) 21:43, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The genre issue continues to be a problem. I believe that the word "crime" should figure at least somewhere in the genre. Other editors want to call it an action film. Can we restart the genre discussion and get a consensus?OnBeyondZebrax • TALK 21:27, 8 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  Variety calls it a crime film with action highlights: .  Therefore, I vote that we simply call it a crime film.  This over-categorization of films needs to be nipped. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 21:59, 8 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I will change it to a crime film, but it will only last for a few minutes. There are editors who feel very strongly that this is an action film.OnBeyondZebrax • TALK 20:32, 9 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well, we can always hold an RFC if necessary.  That would establish a stronger consensus. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 22:36, 9 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Film Genre 

message: Let's discuss here if the mainline genre should be crime thriller or crime drama? For me it's a drama, not so much thriller. 201.68.195.208 (talk) 21:25, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: NOTE: The above user is a sock-puppet of the infamous Pé de Chinelo.  Do NOT attempt to engage him in discussion! Crotchety Old Man (talk) 21:31, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

text: You're a very annoying user, firstly, you think dakota fanning is an action movie actress, second, you remove adventure from jurassic park. 187.35.32.13 (talk) 21:56, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Genre is being discussed in the section above, and the article has recently been locked due to stupidity.  Discuss it in the provided section above, and do so prior to further genre change edits. If this continues I will push hard for a perm protect. Thanks Srobak (talk) 17:42, 30 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Crime drama or Crime thriller 

message: On 29 Jan 2010 Andrzejbanas added a plot tag, which says that the plot is too long.
WP:Filmplot suggests a length of 400 to 700 words but accepts that this may be too short for some films, which have complicated or unconventional plots.
When the tag was added the plot was 1,294 words long and is now 1.167 words long.
When the tag was added there clearly was some unnecessary content in the plot (e.g. 'leaving McCauley clinging to life in the fields of the adjoining runways. McCauley tells Hanna "I told you I'm never going back". Hanna answers "yeah".') and a number of sections have been reworded to be clearer as well as shorter.
Having just watched the film (which is almost three hours long as well as being pretty complicated) I don't think that the current plot is too long.  I don't think that there are plot elements included that could be removed without impacting on the effectivness of the summary.  That is unless it is taken down to paragraph or two.
So any objections if I remove the plot tag?
FerdinandFrog (talk) 12:12, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plot Length 

message: An editor has asked me to justify the refimprove template I added to the article, so here it is: the article currently has only 8 references, fully half of which are for the real crime section.  This is woefully inadequate. ---RepublicanJacobiteThe'FortyFive' 16:53, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: How so? The rest of the material that would be referenced would come from the actual movie itself. The only material requiring reference is that which is outside the movie - of which there is very little of and is pretty much referenced. Srobak (talk) 17:35, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

text: I have to agree with Srobak.  At a quick skim through the article the only factoid I found that could use a citation is the bit in the lead about it being a remake of a previous movie of Mann's.  The plot summary is a nightmare but that's a different beast that doesn't involve references or a lack thereof. Millahnna (mouse)talk 17:58, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

text: Edit, I suppose the fact that it's based on Chuck Adamson's experiences could use a ref too.  Although that's such common knowledge I hadn't thought about on first read. Millahnna (mouse)talk 17:59, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: More references are available here.  There are also books about Michael Mann which will cover Heat. Erik (talk | contribs) 18:58, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Alright... but I guess my question is - what specifically needs to be further referenced, and is outside of the plot section of the movie?  Srobak (talk) 19:02, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: RepublicanJacobite, I think you may want to use the  template instead.  Like Srobak said,  is about existing content in the article lacking references.  I assume from what you said that you want more content about the film and with citations. Erik (talk | contribs) 19:09, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Refimprove 

message: I was surprised to see no mention that Heat is referenced and parodied by a section of Grand Theft Auto IV. Surely there must be many other references to this movie in other media? Stroller (talk) 21:48, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Such a section can only be added with very good references.  This video game example seems trivial. ---RepublicanJacobiteThe'FortyFive' 21:51, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  References in popular culture 

message: I'd never heard that Heat was based on the experiences of Miami Vice writer / Mann consultant Chuck Adamson, but I found a newspaper review of the DVD commentary which verifies the claim, and added it. And the box office details I found through Box Office Mojo, no problem. Agreeing with perspective from April that the article is otherwise well-enough cited, I'll remove the template from the top now. However, I do agree the plot summary is too detailed -- but it's an intricate story, so scaling that back will be a challenge. WWB (talk) 03:14, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations for intro section 

message: I think this movie should be included in the cat:Gangster films, I have found sources http://www.people.co.uk/celebs-tv/films/reviews/2009/01/04/movies-in-2009-93463-21015660/ that mentions it as a gangster film. Heat is more of a gangster film than No Country for Old Men. Chigurgh (talk) 22:04, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: People magazine isn't a film magazine. This is hardly a good source for genre. Find better ones. Andrzejbanas (talk) 22:55, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

text: These sources list heat as a gangster filmhttp://www.observer.com/node/42193, http://lethalbunny.com/2010/08/01/kane-and-lynch-2-demo-review/, http://www.essaypride.com/essays.php?free_essay=715221&title=Grand-Theft-Auto:-Vice-City
How can NCFOM be a gangster film if no gangsters appear on screen and Heat not be one? Chigurgh (talk) 23:28, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: There are no gangsters in Heat, not even implied.  In No Country for Old Men, the assassin works for gangsters, and we actually see them. ---RepublicanJacobiteThe'FortyFive' 23:34, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Neil is a gangster. Also... SOTL is a horror film film but Heat not a gangster film? From what I know, there are no vampires, wolfes, ghosts or possessed entities in Silence of the Lambs either. Chigurgh (talk) 23:41, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: You are confusing horror with supernatural horror.  And, no, Neil is not a gangster.  Yes, he is a career criminal and a professional thief, but he is not a gangster.  Please learn the differences between these different genres. ---RepublicanJacobiteThe'FortyFive' 01:51, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

text: Those sources seem to be from sites about video games. Find a film oriented source. Andrzejbanas (talk) 02:58, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

text: The genre of the film has been discussed at length earlier on. You can see it here in the talk page, far above. I don't even agree with the consensus, and it isn't even in accordance with what the releasing studio classifies it as - but as WP is consensus based, despite my providing sources from the releasing studio itself - certainly not from pop culture magazines or video game magazines - it sticks. A lot of people have come to the article over the years saying this genre or that, but you are the first ever to come in saying it is a "gangster film". To that effect it is also the 3rd different type of genre you have tried labeling this film with - seeming as though you can't decide which genre it should be.  Best bet is to just go with the consensus. Srobak (talk) 15:26, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gangster film 

message: I noticed this article is in need of a shortened/revised plot summary. I'd like to contribute my version which is just under 700 words but includes much more of the plot points skipped over by the current article. Please consider it and if there is consensus here I'd like to replace the existing plot summary (or can I just edit it without consensus if there is a note asking for it?). My proposed version is in the extended content below: KeithLD (talk) 18:31, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Vast improvement.  I say go for it and let the copy editors drop in the make small tweaks where they feel it warrants it.  For whatever it's worth, when articles are tagged as having overly long summaries like this, you usually won't get much of a fight if you just rework it and drop it in.  You only ran into it on Inception because there was a lot of conversation to get to the summary they have at all.   Millahnna (talk) 09:05, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  revised plot summary  

message: I would like to revisit the issue of the genre.  I do not see this as an action film.  There are action sequences, yes, but this is predominantly a crime drama.  The concentration is on the characters, not on chase scenes or shoot-outs.  At any rate, I would like to hear from other editors on this.  It looks like the last discussion of this was 2+ years ago.  I am not interested in an edit war, nor in starting an argument, I would just like to hear some other opinions. ---RepublicanJacobiteTheFortyFive 01:38, 21 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Action film? 

message: I boldly removed the cast list, arguing that it is needless repetition, since all the important cast members are identified in the plot.  I was reverted, with the argument that cast lists are standard in film article.  True enough, but they are not required, and there are film articles that do not have them.  Considering that the cast list in this article is a constant source of trouble, with different editors revising it fit their own view of which castmembers are more important than others, why not simply remove it, and be done with it?  Any thoughts? ---The Old JacobiteThe '45 04:06, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It is entirely needless. The cast should be given in the plot section in context (see Eraserhead for a featured example of this), not dumped in a context-free list. We're not IMDB. Something which adds nothing to the article, and only serves to attract edit warring, should be cut out with extreme prejudice. GRAPPLE X 04:40, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: In a fully developed article the cast list should be in its own section, and cast names/links do not appear in the plot section; see WP:FILMPLOT.  Beadmatrix (talk) 11:56, 25 April 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: There's nothing in WP:FILMPLOT to support that opinion, and having seen multiple FA-class film articles use the plot section to show the cast, I'd say the opposite is quite true—a fully developed article should use the plot section to show which character is played by who. At the bare minimum a cast section should support this use, not supplant is (see Manhunter (film), an article with both cast-in-plot and a cast section, which does the desirable thing of using a cast section for more than just a listing of names). GRAPPLE X 21:32, 25 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cast list 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on Heat (1995 film). Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20121113061141/http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http:%2F%2Fwhitelodge.no%2Fblog%2Fdet-store-kuppet%2F&sl=no&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8 to http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwhitelodge.no%2Fblog%2Fdet-store-kuppet%2F&sl=no&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 04:27, 28 August 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Inflation calculation error in first section 213.48.106.145 (talk) 15:17, 29 November 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: What is the error exactly? Daß Wölf 23:17, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. -- Dane2007 talk  19:55, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 29 November 2016 

message: Can we please have some kind of discussion on this instead of back-and-forth edit warring?  I don't see what was so wrong with crime film, which is what we came up with two years ago in a prior discussion. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 12:53, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, crime film.  The previous discussions can be seen above and were mostly ridiculous.  Crime film suffices. ---The Old JacobiteThe '45 13:18, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think there's much point in us starting these discussions. It's the people who won't come here that want to change the status quo... Daß Wölf 03:10, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Probably so. ---The Old JacobiteThe '45 13:24, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with all above. Crime is fine, but I don't see any of thriller, action, or drama being wrong in a vacuum. Obviously we should avoid the edit-warring, but I don't believe more than two genre words should ever be used unless the film is truly (and notably) genre-bending, such as Shaun of the Dead (ha, which I just checked and that itself has only one genre in the opening line). JesseRafe (talk) 14:52, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Genre 

message: As with all other remakes, I have noted this movie is a remake in the leading paragraph. Damiantgordon (talk) 12:47, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: L.A. Takedown

message: Recently, Das Wolf removed the action categories from this film, I've reverted him, I want to know if there is a consensus whether Heat is considered an action film, this https://www.allmovie.com/movie/v135459 considers Heat action. Deloop82 (talk) 18:24, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Apologies for my re-revert, I didn't notice you started a talk page discussion before I checked my watchlist. There are some disruptive editors who insist on adding various genres to films and never discuss it on talk page. Two sections above you is a discussion prompted by the last time this happened. Regarding the genre, WP:FILMLEAD states that the article lead should limit itself to the primary genre, and besides categories should be limited to those that can be verified by article text. It helps prevent category inflation -- past a certain point adding more categories becomes less useful for navigation. I surmise this is why it was decided to go with "crime film" alone. Daß Wölf 18:47, 28 October 2017 (UTC)

text: Pinging ,  &  who participated in the previous genre discussion. Daß Wölf 02:47, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  I saw the edit, but I didn't want to say anything about it because I'm kind of tired about debating this film's genre.  But, yeah, we came a consensus that Heat should be described as a "crime film", since that's the primary genre (per MOS:FILM).  As far as categories, I think that "crime film" is generally good enough, but if there's a consensus to include others, that's OK.  I personally would just stick to the primary genre.  By comparison, calling Star Wars a comedy film would not be indefensible, but it would put way too much emphasis on the comedic elements when it's clearly a space opera film. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 07:45, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

text: I support the previous consensus.  The emphasis is on the crime, not the action, which is secondary. ---The Old JacobiteThe '45 11:50, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: This, as a concept, is tedious. I'd put my personal limit at two genres, because that fits the prosody of when we hear two genres combined enough, they become their own genre: romantic comedy, action comedy, action adventure, psychological thriller, crime thriller, etc. However, "action crime" and "crime action" don't fit this bill, and there was a lot of brouhaha over "action" earlier. As long as the genre includes "crime" and as long it's stable and as long it doesn't grossly violate the MOS, it's cool with me ("Crime thriller" cooler with me, as there's so much tension). Per Dass Wolf, there are a LOT of very adamant genre warriors out there, not just on film articles, and I wager a lot of page-watchers are understandably very quick to revert as another iteration of a previous blocked vandal. JesseRafe (talk) 13:52, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Action film 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Heat (1995 film). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150727005754/https://thedissolve.com/features/movie-of-the-week/882-the-long-warm-up-to-heat/ to https://thedissolve.com/features/movie-of-the-week/882-the-long-warm-up-to-heat/
*Added  tag to https://m.cinemascore.com/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080906230258/http://free.financialmail.co.za/05/1209/leisure/fmalala.htm to http://free.financialmail.co.za/05/1209/leisure/fmalala.htm
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 00:24, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: In section Factual basis, please change "in an 1995 interview" to  "in a 1995 interview". 5.151.0.108 (talk) 11:07, 24 February 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Done DRAGON BOOSTER  ★ 13:40, 24 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 24 February 2018 

message: TMS Entertainment, is a Japanese animation studio founded in 1964. TMS is one of the oldest anime studios in Japan; best known for produced numerous anime franchises such as Lupin the 3rd, Detective Conan, Bakugan, D.Gray-man, and Sonic X and feature-length films Akira and Little Nemo: Adventures in Slumberland, alongside animation works for western animation such as Animaniacs, Batman: The Animated Series, Ducktales, Spider-Man: The Animated Series and Disney's Adventures of the Gummi Bears.
The company has animation subsidiaries collaborating in conjunction with the company, Telecom Animation Film Co., Ltd. (テレコム・アニメーションフィルム Terekomu Animēshon Firumu), which co-animates shows with TMS. 
i found out that this company was involved with this film thanks to idmb, check it out:
https://www.imdb.com/search/title?companies=co0064579  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.72.210.21 (talk) 05:15, 19 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  TMS Entertainment's involvement in heat (1995) 

message: Addition to Impact section regarding video games. There is no mention of the Payday series of games (Payday: The Heist 2011, Payday 2 2013), whose majority of content is arguably based on scenarios in the film if not at least in part. See: 
https://www.digitalspy.com/videogames/gamescom/a336972/payday-the-heist-inspired-by-heat-dark-knight-says-developer-gamescom-2011/
https://www.vg247.com/2013/08/13/music-to-heist-to-payday-2s-musical-masterpiece/
There is literally a level of the game called "Heat Street" in which the player engages police in an shootout though an urban city environment in a manner very similar to the downtown LA scene. 68.39.130.255 (talk) 21:14, 24 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Please format your desired text in a way that makes sense, illustrates the notability of these video games, and clearly demonstrates what was drawn from the film using the sources you have. I can't speak for any other editors, but if you do that satisfactorily, I may add it where appropriate. But note that Wikipedia is not the place for "arguable" assertions, but only the well-cited and inarguable facts of an encyclopedia. Thanks! JesseRafe (talk) 13:02, 25 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Several voice lines from the game are directly taken from the film, "the action is the juice" being a prominent one.  In the First World Bank job in the game, if you wipe out all the security guards before the first police assault wave arrives, and there's a bot in the lobby, it will climb onto a desk and make the famous "Don't try being a hero" speech.  Additionally, the aesthetic of robbing the bank while in suits and gloves, along with all the weapons used in the film, and the magnetic drill from early in the film, are all used prominently in the game.  The 4-man crew idea could also be taken from the game, though it could simply be a balance issue.  A legacy skill in the game was called Kilmer, as per the actor in Heat.  GenSec armored van livery is inspired by Gage Armored Transports from the film, and there is a prominent side-character named Gage in the game as well.  The armored transport heists in the game both pull directly from the armored car robbery in the film, in blocking the road with an ambulance and in ramming the car off the road.  If you purchase the Expert Driver asset for a heist in game, the name on the driving license is Neil McCauley, per the character from the film.  A number of achievements in the game also are direct references to the film.  71.85.220.255 (talk) 23:55, 31 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 24 October 2019 

message: I have unprotected this article as per a request at WP:RFPU. If further protection is required, please register a new request at WP:RFPP. Chetsford (talk) 00:47, 23 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article is now unprotected 

message: when did shooting start? All I can find is that the final airport showdown sequence was shot in the same week as the Unabomber scare at LAX (28 June 1995) and that the entire shoot took 107 days.Point of Presencetalk 21:09, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Principal photography 

message: Hallo.
I add to the cast Mrs Begonya Plaza, at the role of Anna Trejo, the wife of Trejo in the movie.
Why is this delete it?
The actress is at a lot of scenes 141.237.121.89 (talk) 12:13, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  why someone delete my extra info? 

message: Would like to see Tom added to the cast list - was the 'desk clerk/lapd undercover officer' at Waingro's hotel...He was in 2 scenes and his 'inability to recognize McCaulley' led to McCaulley killing Waingro...  Tom is a retired LAPD Captain and good friend of Michael Mann's.  He's also listed as a technical adviser on the film per IMDb and was the unnamed "LAPD Commander" who drove Mann around the city so Mann could get a feel for LAPD Crime scenes prior to the shooting of the film.  I worked for Tom in the 90s and he was a good Commanding Officer...I tried to add him in as a cast member this morning and the edit was removed... thought I'd throw this out there for consideration...*** edit*** ooops, I see that he was added underneath the main cast - as an additional - Thanks!! Sorry -- if it was there prior to this morning... I must be getting old
https://laist.com/news/entertainment/michael-mann-al-pacino-and-robert-de-niro-reflect-on-heat-20-years-later Toastt21 (talk) 20:03, 20 June 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I had moved your edit to the lower portion in this edit, as it was a minor and un-named role. I reviewed the article you posted a link to above and did not see any mentions regarding Tom or his off-screen role as you mentioned.  If we can find some citable sources that meet WP:RS standards it can certainly be added.  As with most of Mann's films - there is a long list of technical advisors - which is why they are so good, so if we start down that path it would probably be best to include more than one to kick things off - just my $.02. Picard's Facepalm (talk) 14:12, 21 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tom Elfmont - cast member and technical adviser 

message: I read the wiki article about the Norco shootout in 1980,  and feel that the depiction of the get-away and shootout bears similarities to the depiction in Heat. I couldn't find any sources with a short Google search but maybe someone can find something. 84.215.194.129 (talk) 09:43, 11 February 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Watched a YT video about it at YT Link and can't see much similarity at all beyond multiple men robbing a bank and then engaging in a shootout.  They didn't have body armor, there was no vehicle pursuit in Heat, no heli was shot down in the film, and the pursuit didn't involve multiple officers heading into the desert.  Maybe others will - but I'm just not seeing much of a connection. Picard's Facepalm (talk) 14:56, 12 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Norco shootout