Talk:Celebration, Florida

message: Oh, and the best person on here, besides the random IP attacks, is Mhking has actually went as far as to continue to modify my PERSONAL page and spam it unmercifully. --Meleniumshane90 (talk) 02:08, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Please do not make untrue charges regarding my edits. My edits to your talk page have been to restore warning templates as governed by Wikipedia policy. In addition, my edits regarding the removal of spam links here are governed specifically by Wikipedia: External Links in keeping with Wikipedia's Policy. Your false charges are unwarranted and unappreciated. --Mhking (talk) 02:13, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Accusation (irrelevant to talk of community)

message: I removed some language which I thought sensationalist about the CC&Rs (Covenants, Conditions & Restrictions) associated with Celebration, as I don't think it's at all material to Celebration. 
Comparison of Census/American Community Survey numbers on housing construction and these estimates of [community association governed housing] show that a consistent 30-50% of new houses built since the 1970s have community associations attached, with a total population today of nearly 55 million Americans. Many subdivisions without community associations still have CC&Rs, but in the absence of an HOA there is no enforcement authority. Attached housing is rarely fee-simple, and accounts for nearly half of housing starts in America; single family houses in planned communities with common areas (e.g., recreational amenities or private streets) account for additional millions of new CC&R-governed houses. Some surveys relate that 80% of residents of these communities have never read their CC&Rs.
Homeowners' associations are indeed ubiquitous in many of the nation's fastest-growing cities, particularly in the Sunbelt and even more in Florida and California. A search of new homes for sale in Kissimmee County in the Orlando Sentinel shows that every single one is in a planned community.
Pretty much any development built in the Sunbelt since the 1980s has restricted house colors, and almost all urban historic districts (like the one I live in) do the same. This has NOTHING to do with the architectural style, or with New Urbanism, or even with Celebration: Modernist high-rise condos in New York City and schlocky golf-course retirement villas in Phoenix alike come with a thick book of CC&Rs, regulating everything from curtain colors and the age of permanent residents to the the number and type of dogs permissible and the placement of outdoor grills or signs. Some CC&Rs, notably the racially restrictive covenants that ensured segregation in the urban North and West, have been ruled unconstitutional by federal courts, but otherwise they are a legal part of everyday American life. --Paytonc 01:36, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There is quite a difference in saying that CC&R's are "ubiquitous in all suburban development" and saying that they are common in subdivisions with areas held in common or in urban historic districts. A large number of suburban developments have neither common areas nor "thick book of CC&Rs". Where is your 95% figure from? Of the six home sales I've been involved in here, all in suburban subdivisions developed since 1910, exactly zero have had restrictive design covenents. Perhaps you are confusing CC&R's with municipal zoning authority? While it may be considered "inflammatory" to say that buyers "must sign" these restrictions, it is patently factual while your arguments for removing the language are unreferenced and, from my experience, spurious. If I'm just completely out of touch, at least have the courtesy to reference an authoritative source. --Dystopos 00:32, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, the 95% was made up. Perhaps I've just always lived in cities where HOAs are indeed ubiquitous -- Raleigh, LA, Boston, and Chicago, where most new housing is built either in planned communities or is in condominium form. Re-read the edited comment, please, and the edited article: all of that is factually correct, and puts Celebration into better perspective. I still do not think that this is at all material to Celebration: the new home construction market in places like Orlando is dominated by golf-course planned communities like Celebration, complete with CC&Rs that regulate house paint, yet critics want to pin Disney or New Urbanism as being the root of these. (For what it's worth, most Florida zoning laws demand that stormwater retention ponds be maintained by HOAs, not by municipalities.) Also, I am not confused about zoning vs. CC&Rs; I'm an urban planning researcher. Oh, and what's this "authoritative source" you mention? --Paytonc 01:31, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Pretty much anything published and verifiable... not "made up" would be authoritative enough. In the end, our goal is to put Celebration into a factual and neutral perspective, not a better or worse one. I am not of the "Blame Disney and the CNU for everything bad" camp. I took more exception to the claim in your edit summary than to the content of the article. We're probably more on the same page than it seems. Let's just agree to be fair to the subject. --Dystopos 01:50, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: CC&Rs

message: I visited on a partly cloudy day, so the images aren't the best, but I hope these help illustrate the city a little.  I wish I'd taken more of the wide variety of home styles (not just designs) in the city.  --Bobak 00:43, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Those are great photos! Winter light can be quite a challenge. --Paytonc 19:31, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Added Images

message: Why is there absolutely no history provided re: the creation, development/planning, and intent of the community? Or why Disney has largely pulled out of it? Everything anybody would go to an encyclopedia article to learn about is conspicuously missing! --ChrisStansfield 19:34, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I was going to ask the same? how was the city formed? by whom? when? with what motivation? I don't have a clue. --BBird 21:40, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

text: The Celebration Chronicles and Celebration, U.S.A. go rather in-depth on its history until the start of the century, so I'll probably check those out at the library and add information about it within the upcoming weeks. While I am at it, I will probably clean up the article; it's too listy and, as stated above, is not structured like a traditional city article. --Slof 06:43, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Some of the history was there but has been pulled out (by others). That data could fill a book itself (and has). I think the reason there hasn't been a big effort to keep it is because it is all documented in 1 or 2 books about the town and we would just be re-creating the content here. Some of it should really be here though - the disputes with the school system, the lottery, the Zeus computer, the changing hands of Max's cafe', the removal of Disney from the water tower, the failure of Goodings. It's all interesting to read and well documented. --KeithBarrett (talk) 15:57, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: History Section

message: Does any public transportation operating in or around Celebration? --Simon Bar Sinister 02:01, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Lynx has a bus stop near the Hospital. Other than that there is no public transportation. There were a few attempts, including a nice trolly, but they did not commercially succeed. I always wished there was a simple, 2x a day shuttle that stopped at each village, downtown, the hospital, and the water tower plaze. --KeithBarrett (talk) 08:17, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

text: Celebration is connected to the WDW property. Is there any chance Disney could extend one of its shuttle buses into town? That should be enough to get people out to one of the major transit centers. 
Why haven't they considered extending the monorail?173.60.95.232 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 01:35, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Transportation Sub-Section

message: The excess external links are considered spam links (per Wikipedia: External Links). Please do not continue to add them. --Mhking (talk) 03:09, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: External links

message: A census from 2000 is just plain lazy... especially because there are well documented sites about Celebration. With a population of over 4000 as of December 23rd, 2008 why is it still this way? And why is the page locked from adjustments?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.130.194.30 (talk) 02:30, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: (New comments go at the bottom of the page - I've moved it down).  I reverted your change, since "4000" is clearly an estimate and not an actual count.  The figure from the last census is just fine -- unless the Census Bureau has an updated figure, or you have a locally generated number with a reference behind it. --Ed Fitzgerald t / c 03:24, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Census Update

message: I'm not sure there are enough examples to warrant a "In Popular Culture" section but it should be noted that UK band Chumbawamba, known most famously for their song Tubthumper, wrote a song about Celebration, Florida entitled "Celebration Florida" on their album WYSIWYG. The liner notes for the album have a couple paragraphs of commentary regarding the town, starting with the phrase "From the people that brought you Mai Li". It's a bit much to copy here but in any case, perhaps this should be mentioned in this article at some point. --VarunRajendran (talk) 12:27, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: (See comment above about new comments going at the bottom of the page. I just moved yours down as well!) --bluegreen (talk) 23:47, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  There's also the other album listed at the top of the article, a satirical mention in the musical Avenue Q's song "Special," and a piece in Studio 360's "American Icons: The Disney Parks." Calbaer (talk) 23:28, 2 February 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: In the US version of The Office in the episode "Crime Aid", Andy Bernard tells his then-fiancee Angela Martin that he intends for them to move to Celebration in order to escape Scranton's non-existent crime wave.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:346:C201:60C0:B936:F040:E628:BE9C (talk) 16:50, 2 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title: In Popular Culture Section

message: This is a quotation from Villages:
What is Mirasol? --bluegreen (talk) 23:47, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Villages Sub-Section

message: The information in the following article could address some of the concerns addressed above about a lack of information with regards to the town's history: Town that Disney built has first homicide.  The murder or lack-thereof could also be mentioned on the page with this site as a reference. --bluegreen (talk) 23:47, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Recent Homicide and Subsequent News Coverage

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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