Talk:Abraham Lincoln/Archive 3

message: Tell me about Evil Lincoln. I know he exist. MegaloManiac 17:48, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Evil Lincoln 

message: I've restored the talk page you deleted. Please edit more carefully. --jpgordon∇∆∇∆ 22:15, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  talk page restored after innocent mistake by user 

message: === Abraham Lincoln death "photo" proven at least not to be a fraud. ===
Photograph.....or well done engraving?
 
Abraham Lincoln ..."the day after he was murdered.."
Source: From the private collection of the Bachelder family,
If authentic, this "Lincoln in Death" Photograph or engraving is over 140 years old, it is believed the *photograph was taken through his shroud, or a veil out of respect yet still alowing the photographer John B. Bachelder to get his work done in a respectful and dignified fashion, it was actually a common practice of the day, when death photo's of famous and family were far more a common place event than they are today.
In the book by Osendorf he claimed the photograph of Lincoln taken by John B. Bachelder the noted photographer, artist and engraver in Washington D.C. was taken in the White House within 24 hours after Lincolns body had been taken there, this photograph has been taken by many as authentic, and by the entire Bachelder family within a day of Lincolns assasination and their relative John B. Bachelder, re: Lloyd Ostendorf's book Lincoln's Photographs: A Complete Album" photograph # "0-130")
From the book: "The reverse of this photograph of Lincoln in death bears the inscription: "Lincoln photograph taken by Uncle Bachelder after Lincoln died. "The life-like quality and photographic perspective is evident in the image even thought [sic] some retouching has been applied. The exposure was evidently taken under poor lighting conditions and under difficult circumstances; the task was obviously undertaken in purposeful secrecy."
The facing page reads: 
"A post-mortem portrait..."An extremely rare carte-de-viste discovered in the estate of artist and engraver John B. Bachelder. "The heretofore unpublished photograph of Abraham Lincoln seen at the right was taken on approximately April 16, 1865, after the President's death. Apparently, it was to serve as a model for the death-bed scene produced by Bachelder in collaboration with Alonzo Chap-pel." 
Whether it's a etching of a photograph of Lincoln or third generation copy of a photograph is not yet known with absolute certainty, but the likeness to the deceased President Lincoln is uncanny in its resemblence!
That truth cannot be denied!...
Bachelder was either the greatest engraver of all time or one of the worst photographers it seems!
Look to the photo's honest portrayal of him, there without a doubt is that the true face of Abraham Lincoln, seemingly was only ever "captured" really well in a photograph.........
... and while there isn't a painting in the world that gets his "look" so to speak.."just right" as a photograph did for one reason or another, this fact supports the genuineness of the "photo" in question even more.
(Fore~instance...Think of how similiar Mathew Brady's incredible sittings with Lincoln for instance, conveying the same true face many times in lucky and many moments of time, captured in photographs by him.)
Yes, The serine sadness in his face there,...sadly it is real, it is he, Lincoln, and b.t.w. it is and was not placed here out of morbid interest or fraud, it is here now asking for a new plea on it, for truth, justice and the American way!
*Bachelder was both the present artist in the death room at the White House as well as one of three photographers present with Lincoln in the room on April 16th 1865 day, as President Lincoln was being embalmed, dressed, and made prepared for his long ride back to Springfield.
*... That he (Bachelder) knew the man Lincoln's face, even in death is so hauntingly plain to see!, That he did this picture and did it well....he knew his subject, just how can that simple truth ever be denied, whatever one will say to the contrary. My proof's are both logical, and encyclopedic and so are "gut" feelings....used and recognised by Law Enforcement agency's with high regard! 
Truth is truth...however one arrives at it.
(Cathytreks 15:42, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Lincoln Death Photo, Part 2

message: Photograph.....or well done engraving?
 
Abraham Lincoln ..."the day after he was murdered.."
Source: From the private collection of the Bachelder family,
If authentic, this "Lincoln in Death" Photograph or engraving is over 140 years old, it is believed the *photograph was taken through his shroud, or a veil out of respect yet still alowing the photographer John B. Bachelder to get his work done in a respectful and dignified fashion, it was actually a common practice of the day, when death photo's of famous and family were far more a common place event than they are today.
In the book by Osendorf he claimed the photograph of Lincoln taken by John B. Bachelder the noted photographer, artist and engraver in Washington D.C. was taken in the White House within 24 hours after Lincolns body had been taken there, this photograph has been taken by many as authentic, and by the entire Bachelder family within a day of Lincolns assasination and their relative John B. Bachelder, re: Lloyd Ostendorf's book Lincoln's Photographs: A Complete Album" photograph # "0-130")
From the book: "The reverse of this photograph of Lincoln in death bears the inscription: "Lincoln photograph taken by Uncle Bachelder after Lincoln died. "The life-like quality and photographic perspective is evident in the image even thought [sic] some retouching has been applied. The exposure was evidently taken under poor lighting conditions and under difficult circumstances; the task was obviously undertaken in purposeful secrecy."
The facing page reads: 
"A post-mortem portrait..."An extremely rare carte-de-viste discovered in the estate of artist and engraver John B. Bachelder. "The heretofore unpublished photograph of Abraham Lincoln seen at the right was taken on approximately April 16, 1865, after the President's death. Apparently, it was to serve as a model for the death-bed scene produced by Bachelder in collaboration with Alonzo Chap-pel." 
Whether it's a etching of a photograph of Lincoln or third generation copy of a photograph is not yet known with absolute certainty, but the likeness to the deceased President Lincoln is uncanny in its resemblence!
That truth cannot be denied!...
Bachelder was either the greatest engraver of all time or one of the worst photographers it seems!
Look to the photo's honest portrayal of him, there without a doubt is that the true face of Abraham Lincoln, seemingly was only ever "captured" really well in a photograph.........
... and while there isn't a painting in the world that gets his "look" so to speak.."just right" as a photograph did for one reason or another, this fact supports the genuineness of the "photo" in question even more.
(Fore~instance...Think of how similiar Mathew Brady's incredible sittings with Lincoln for instance, conveying the same true face many times in lucky and many moments of time, captured in photographs by him.)
Yes, The serine sadness in his face there,...sadly it is real, it is he, Lincoln, and b.t.w. it is and was not placed here out of morbid interest or fraud, it is here now asking for a new plea on it, for truth, justice and the American way!
*Bachelder was both the present artist in the death room at the White House as well as one of three photographers present with Lincoln in the room on April 16th 1865 day, as President Lincoln was being embalmed, dressed, and made prepared for his long ride back to Springfield.
*... That he (Bachelder) knew the man Lincoln's face, even in death is so hauntingly plain to see!, That he did this picture and did it well....he knew his subject, just how can that simple truth ever be denied, whatever one will say to the contrary. My proof's are both logical, and encyclopedic and so are "gut" feelings....used and recognised by Law Enforcement agency's with high regard! 
Truth is truth...however one arrives at it.
(Cathytreks 15:42, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Abraham Lincoln death "photo" proven at least not to be a fraud. 

message: Harold Holzer is a well known Lincoln Scholar yes, but has been accused by some Lincoln Researchers as being both a liar, and a perjurer about the Bachelder "Lincoln Death Photo" for reasons unknown.
The question should be, why would THAT be so?, 
Why is it that Holzer to this day, ignoring so much of the scholarly research regarding the Bachelder family's Storys, Photograph's and Accounts of the incidents surounding it?
So many papers and thing's taken in their own words, and pen by hand, and the photographs , some of which the three originals are now missing, which were all put together by Ostendorf, with the exstreme care and deliberation and love of a lifetime, his honesty shows.
Whether there was a personal enmity or not out of jealousy on the part of Harold Holzer towards Orstendorf and his amazing find perhaps, If Holzer (hypotheticaly of course) is lying about the entire matter on all key points, sadly the world may never know!, for its hard for the dead man, Ostendorf to defend himself today, and the sources and means he used to prove the validity of his research, but others are hard at work even as we yabber on about it right now.
(Cathytreks 18:09, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The "care and deliberation of a lifetime" by Ostendorf is now to be made into a lie?, Like hell it is!

message: The link to "Criticisms of Lincoln's Presidency" was altered to "Neoconfederate Attacks."  This aspersion is unscholarly and unacceptable in the context of an encyclopedia article.  First, many of the writers who challenge Lincoln's presidency are not affiliated with any neo-Confederate groups.  Secondly, the derisive retitling of the link is an obvious attempt to cast a shadow of doubt on the academic legitimacy of those who don't agree wholeheartedly with all aspects of Lincoln's agenda.
So much for "freedom of speech." (Chuckicks 10:17, 7 May 2006 (EST)
Origin of Honest Abe 
Honest Abe, Abraham's nickname was from his days as a wrestler. One many sites, such as 'http://www.biogs.com/famous/lincoln.html' it states that he was a wrestler. Further information, however can be found in 'the History of Professional Wrestling' and in a exhibition somewhere in a American museum. If I recall orrectly, it was Cleveland.211.28.125.161 21:18, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "Neoconfederate attacks"?