Talk:Muslim professions

message: I think you have to include Ibrahim, as well as do Christians and jews...otherwise there is a flaming issue, where Jews can "claim" Abe as like... the first Jew or something... its "all in the family" any way...
:No, I think Muslims are intelligent enough to recognize why he should be kept off, and laugh at Christians or Jews who make a big issue of including him "as" a Jew.  Which, technically, he wasn't, since he came from Ur.  Now Jesus was a Jew.  LOL.  This argument usually gets a big laugh in the mosque, I understand.  Don't take it seriously.  Muslims don't.
:Christians don't claim Abraham was a Christian. DJ Clayworth 21:15, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)
thread_title: Ibrahim

message: I might suggest a better title: Famous Muslims List of Famous Muslims Prominent figures in Islam]
... you get the idea.... I was sure this wasnt a list of all muslims from the beginnng of time to the present.. but the title did get my hopes up.
See Wikipedia_talk:Naming_conventions ...
Souldn't this be 'list of famous muslims'? Ilyanep 02:57, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: List title

message: I find a recent edit saying (+More list of muslims, specifically terrorists) really worrying. This isn't a collection point for anyone the media has reckoned is a member of Al-Qaida. I don't see how this list can be point of view. 
People will add those they have heard of - which in the western media is going to be terrorists. Secretlondon 23:49, Dec 12, 2003 (UTC)
*I'm trying to find other Muslims, such as politicians to balance this out. For instance, how come Saladin wasn't on this list? WhisperToMe 01:19, 13 Dec 2003 (UTC)
replies: text: Aecis... you asked this question below and I answered you... I don't see what posting it multiple times will do.  See my answers to you below. gren 18:33, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah, you are the poster of the untagged comments ;) Aecis 19:54, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: No, no, it's tagged... it's at the bottom of section Terrorist list right now O_O gren 20:17, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Terrorists

message: I think we need to make conventions for this. I'm inclined to go with "Family name, Given name" since List of People does that.  As of now there is a mix even between whether to sort by first or last name (at least in entertainers).  Which brings up the point... where are sources for Dave Chappelle, Richard Thompson, John Coltrane, and probably more being Muslim.  It could very well be right but I never knew (which means nothing), and it is not listed in their articles.
 Talk of Richard Thompsopn and Islam in case anyone has a great urge to write some about it on his meager page. gren
I think that a sort by date would potentially be more useful.  Also, if names had blurbs about who the people were, this list would be more useful.  But frankly, having a list that is this broad is somewhat silly.  I won't protest because there seem to be many such lists.  But a list's usefulness goes down as the number of names in it goes up, especially with no descriptions.  That is, why don't we have List of Americans, or List of Chinese Speakers, or List of (insert similarly broad category here)?
Couldn't this all be better accomplished with categorizing of people's names into category:muslims and subcategories? --jacobolus (t) 11:07, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sorting 

message: I am removing this tag because it was done by an anon-editor with around 10 edits and no explanation.  Also, one of his edits is adding "Pedophile" to the Muhammad article.  I think it's safe to say that his edits can be reverted.  If anyone else has comments about the tag or wants to keep it feel free to talk about that here. gren 20:28, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Totally disputed 

message: I understand JuanMuslim's purpose in adding this category but it's inherently POV (and in some cases redundant).  Wasil ibn Ata fits into both Controversial figures and Other Theologians and Philosophers.  To Shi'a many Sunnis can be controversial... and this of course goes both ways.  I understand why this was put... however, it's not a suitable category title.  I didn't have a huge problem with militants (though I think it was somewhat POV) but since it was deleted in a VfD when the same was done for list of Christians I don't believe we can do it here either.  I think the best solution (until we got a better proposition) is to leave them in the others section. gren 21:16, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Controversial figures 

message: Reading over the various comments makes me realize just how crazy we can be at times. We all come here from various backgrounds, etc. What amazes me is the lack of mainstream Muslims within the list. The Muslims most likely to make the list are those who make it to the evening news. Nevermind, the many other Muslims who are admired by the mainstream Muslims around the world. And, yes, Muslims would include Prophets Abraham and Jesus (peace be upon them) as major religious figures in Islam. --JuanMuslim 03:34, Jun 23, 2005 (UTC)
:Well, one problem is the demographics of the people editting this page.  Most are from English speaking countries (which makes sense) and most English speaking countries do not have Muslims on their lists of prominent national personages.  The Prophets are a debatable matter which... I'm sure someone would complain about... but I'd see no problem adding them if there was a disclaimer that added "claimed by Muslims and the Qur'an" or something like that to make sure people don't think that wikipedia is calling them Muslim.  So, most people know Bin Laden because he altered the landscape of New York... people don't know of Ibn Hazm because he... well, he wrote a few books in Al-Andalus... and, who cares about that now.  It's a sad thing but time does erase importance... we have a longer article about the 2005 trial of Michael Jackson than we do about the Battle of Badr... more about Ali Sina than Ibn Hazm... the list goes on... we can't help but being somewhat chronocentric and even locale-centric for the sheer reason of access of information. gren 03:51, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comments 

message: The list is a mess. An alphabetical order of the listed people should be respected. Normally, the surname should be the basis of this order and not the first name. For instance, Al-Baitar should come before Ahmed Deedat. There are some exceptions as for Abu and Ibn where Abu comes first as in dictionaries. Cheers -- Svest 11:35, 28 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alphabetical order 

message: A large number of converts are listed in the list. There's a lack of consistency in terms of that sometimes the name at birth is used while the name after conversion is used in other cases. I believe that both names must be listed because of the fact that most people do not recognize the same person by the 2 names. Some people would not immediately know that Yusuf Islam is just the same as Cat Stevens.
I suggest the creation of a table in which we can have 2 columns for both names. Cheers -- Svest 19:42, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Converts/aka 

message: The list needs to take time/time period into more consideration. There should be some way of organizing the list of muslims into subcategories, such as historical and contemporary, but not necessarily using those two terms. For example, the Muslims could be listed within time periods, such as within centuries. Currently, within the Other Theologians and Philosophers section, we have Ahmed Deedat, Al-Ghazali, Al-Farabi, Hamza Yusuf, Ibn Khaldun, Sherman Jackson, and Jalal al-Din Muhammad Rumi. And, within historical figures -> politicians, the politicians listed include people who have been dead for hundreds of years and people who won't die for several years. Anyway, the muslims within that particular subcategory aren't all people you'd consider historical.--JuanMuslim 09:54, 9 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Time - past and present 

message: I noticed that there's a template that lists the wives of Muhammad (saws). Check out Template:WivesMuhammad. I think it would be a good idea to have two distinct templates for Sunni Muslims and another for Shia Muslims. Maybe for at least important historical figures. --JuanMuslim 03:57, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Muslim templates 

message: Yesterday, I created the List of Muslim athletes. The sports figures section was getting too big. I think we should divide the List of Muslims into various sublists - lists within the main list. I like how there are "sublists" found within the List of Jews and List of Christians articles. --JuanMuslim 04:53, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  List of Muslim... 

message: This article oughy to be called List of notable Muslims and not List of Muslims. ≈ jossi fresco ≈ t • @ 17:05, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I totally agree. Can you move it Jossi? Cheers -- Svest 17:32, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the list should be consistent with the naming of the other two lists - list of christians and list of jews. --JuanMuslim 20:00, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes Juan, you got a point as well. I think what is important is to include only notable people. I believe we are doing so. I don't see non-notable people on the list. I am changing my mind as the article would be broken out anyway. So there is no problem keeping the original title. Saludos cordiales -- Svest 20:07, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, and non-notable Muslims can be weeded out from the list. It will also make naming easier, for example. List of Muslim athletes as opposed to List of notable Muslim athletes, which under the other line of reasoning would be the appropriate title. --JuanMuslim 20:12, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Absolutely. Actually this list is made for notable people. Svest 22:51, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rename the list? 

message: The titles need revision. Some have to be renamed for making it easier to read (i.e. Early....after the Prophet has to be just Early... as that mean the same). Other theologians should be renamed Modern theo in contrast with traditional.
There are so many redundancies. A person should appear in one section. If he/she was involved in more than a field than he/she has to be listed in where he/she was mainly notable (i.e. Avicenna is found in theologians instead of medicine section that doesn't exist yet) (Al ghazali is listed in both traditional theo and other theo). Svest 22:56, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: The changes you made have enhanced the list. Maybe I'm thinking a little too ahead, but many Sunni Muslims today are called traditionalist and others modernist. So maybe, different terms should be used when referring to the types of theologians. Maybe early (you're already used that term though) and contemporary would be better choices. --JuanMuslim 04:35, 18 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Sections titles and redundancies

message: Im going to be bold an reorganize a bit. Feel free to comment. --Striver 03:01, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Being bold