Talk:Ctrl+Alt+Del (webcomic)/Archive 1

message: Tim Buckley really needs a separate article, rather than a redirect. I see the option is open. Anyone got the free time and knowledge to do such a thing? RabidJackal 19:59, 5 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: What information do you to put in the article? Is he really worthy of a biography? --ʀ6ʍɑʏ89 05:08, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

text: I came here from the Penny-Arcade page, where it inferred that there's some sort of rivalry/animosity between Tim Buckley and the P-A guys.  As such, I was hoping for more information/citations about this.  Not sure if that would merit a full-article on Tim Buckley, but perhaps a call-out somewhere here would be good. -- Eddie Parker 18:41, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

text: One of the many reasons why it fails in comparison to Encyclopedia Dramatica--Tapok 09:56, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tim Buckley 

message: WRT the recent change to the url in the infobox_webcomic, I think that both www.ctrlaltdel-online.com and www.cad-comic.com are valid, and have therefore suggested in Template_talk:Infobox_webcomic that an optional alternate URL might be added. Guinness 16:47, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  URL in 'infobox_webcomic' 

message: *Who else here thinks so? I'd say wait until the story arc is over before we do that. --User:FazzMunkle
:*Pretty much all of the character descriptions need to be shortened. Zeke's description, for example, currently lists every subplot the character has been featured in for the past few months. And BTW, be sure to sign your talk page comments with four tildes. :) --Dynamite Eleven 17:12, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: *Good Idea. ;-) FazzMunkle 22:50, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I finally removed all of the recent Zeke subplot stuff. It still needs to be shortened, but at least it's an improvement. -^demon 04:09, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Description for Emma and Christian needs to be shortened 

message: The article says that Christian is plotting his revenge in the background and that there are signs that he is doing so, yet I have no idea what these signs are (I must be overlooking them.) Does anyone know? Deuxsonic 05:49, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: No. I'm removing it. I see no evidence of it, and I read CAD religiously. Plus, Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. -^demon 13:28, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: There was one edit that placed Christian as the mastermind behind Josh's takeover of Winter-een-mas, with the rationale being that the shadowy figure and Christian had a similar ring (for comparison:  and ), which was obviously not the case. Weird crystal ball edits like that always seem to crop up every now and then in this article. --Dynamite Eleven 19:50, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It's entirely crystal ball, as Winter-een-mas hasn't even really started yet this year, much less the obligatory WEMas comics. -^demon 18:14, 17 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plotting in background 

message: Today, some major changes were posted to the article. I reverted them, as they didn't reflect a consensus through a discussion on the talk page. Please take a look at the last version before my revert to see what it looked like. Sections were re-ordered, names were changed, and a new section was added. Once again, major amounts of plot was placed back into the bios. I've left a message for that user to please come and discuss his proposed changes, as they were 'quite' major. -^demon 13:54, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Major Changes - 21 Dec 2005 

message: Is CAD based in England or the USA or somewhere else?
*CAD is based in Connecticut (New Haven, I think?), in the United States. -^demon 16:54, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anyone Know 

message: This notice is concerning a recently concluded discussion about Chef Brian (see afd).  There was a clear consensus to redirect, yet it was unclear whether any material was worth merging.  In any case, said material can be found here. — FREAK OF NURxTURE ([ TALK]) 06:13, Dec. 26, 2005
A small question about the part in the wiki that says "though some sources state that the character is based on Brian Carroll, author of the webcomic Instant Classic, or Brian Clevinger, author of 8-Bit Theater and friend of Tim Buckley." Does anyone know what these sources are? - Kgazette 07:14, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chef Brian 

message: I think an consensus needs to be made on how the characters should be ordered in this article. I left the main characters with their own headings, but I consolidated the secondary characters and former characters into respective grouped sections (which, to me, seems reasonable). Plus, we really do need to keep a closer eye on this zeitgeist of subplot and crystal ball edits, as they seem to be popular. --Dynamite Eleven 18:14, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Character headings 

message: What about them? Are they going in an article of their own, or in the CAD article?Ghent 15:50, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It might be "just" premium content, but there's going to be a 4-minute animated video every month. Either way, they should have a section of their own. Ghent 16:28, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

text: * I have no problem with that.  :)  Wikibofh(talk) 18:15, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

text: *No, it shouldn't be given its own article. Think about it logically - How many people who don't read CAD are going to watch the CAD animated series? Awnser - None. None or very very few.
I wrote a summary for the first episode.  I think that CAD:Animated deserves its own article because after a few episodes, this page is going to be too long and too broad.  What do you think? --ʀ6ʍɑʏ89 21:27, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

text: There are more episodes that bring the current count to 12, it's just that adding the info would expand the CAD page to stupid lengths. This is why I revive the proposition to have a CAD Premuim wikipedia page. --Garfunkle20 08:08, 7 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, this needs it's own page - articles who have sections which grow in content, just like this, are normally moved to their own pages, and the content on the parent replaced with a short blurb about it, and a link.  Think about it this way - this article is about CAD the webcomic; the other article can be about CAD the animated series. --Haemo 21:00, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Animated Series 

message: Do the characters in the strip age, or are they perpetually set at a fixed age (like in other comics)? Recent edits seem to indicate that they DO age, although I can't figure it out. --Dynamite Eleven 03:24, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Age? 

message: We all know that Ethan and Lilah are to be married. However, I believe it is impossible. This comic   shows that Ethan is already married, to his...windows XP. Any thoughts?
:One can't marry an OS. Enough said. --maru   (talk)  contribs 19:24, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: One word: OS-tan. I think we've got that sorted. Rockhound 16:57, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: But it makes you wonder... if it really WAS the actual box (with the CD)and not an OS-tan... how did he consummate the relationship? The hole in the middle of the CD (Kids, if you don't understand this, ask your parents!) Veinor (ヴエノル) 22:40, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The FAQ has already answered this! :p --Laugh! 03:24, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Marriage

message: Ive added this page to the Request for Comment listings.
Winter-een-mas was supposed to be merged into this article, but there information is non-existant. There are now groups across the country celebrating it, as well as EB Games recognizing it, and I'm pretty sure they are a nation-wide chain of gaming stores.
I understand there was a previous agreement to merge them and delete winter-een-mas, but I believe the information has increased and that decision is no longer good, and the fact that the information isn't here because whatever merge may have happened was useless.
Liastnir 12:28, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Request for Comment: winter-een-mas 

message: Some of the character articles are getting pretty large, so I think it could be a good idea to make some of them into individual articles. Cyclone49 06:00, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: –Abe Dashiell (t/c) 07:16, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

text: *I have redirected the Ethan MacManus article back to Ctrl+Alt+Del for the reasons I mentioned above and also for the points brought up in WP:CRUFT.  –Abe Dashiell (t/c) 16:14, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Individual Articles? 

message: Tim Buckley (artist) is frequently used as a place for people to air their beefs against him.  The accusations are either unsourced or poorly sourced and concern matters that do not meet Wikipedia's inclusion criteria.  In accordance with WP:LIVING, I've been removing the material, but it's becoming a chore keeping it compliant with policy.  On Sunday I protected the article from editing, but this is not ideal.  What I want to do is turn it into a redirect to Ctrl+Alt+Del.  After all, this is pretty much the only subject that makes him notable, and we've done the same thing with many other webcomic authors.  I'd like to do this by the end of the week, so if someone wants to add an author section to this article, now would be a good time. Thanks. –Abe Dashiell (t/c) 05:12, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Redirecting Tim Buckley's article here 

message: Is there a CAD userbox out there? If not, I'll try to make one --Garfunkle20 14:27, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: CAD Userbox

message: Shouldn't we put Brad Pitt into the 'Characters Who No Longer Appear' bit? He's featured in several comics, including  and . So, shall we?
*He counts as a celebrity guest so probably not. Stu42
*Other than those to examples I don't remember seeing him so he's not really a Character more a Cameo. ≈ Seraph 31 21:00, 5 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That is not Brad Pitt but rather Brad Pitt playing the character Tyler Durden from Fight Club. Chewbacca1010 05:21, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Brad Pitt

message: I removed the criticism section, for the same reasons it was removed from the Tim Buckley page when it was up. People use a "critisicm" section to voice personal distaste for the strip and/or its creator, often laden with opinions and no facts or sources to back it up. The latest iteration went so far as to suggest what other people did or did not enjoy about the strip, and what the strip is supposed to be. This does not belong in an encyclopedic article. Let's not make Adashiel lock this page down too because of this pettiness. If you don't like the comic or the creator, just don't read it. Thrindel
*I think Criticism should be mentioned because CAD and Tim Buckley more than pretty much any other Web cartoonist is disliked in the webcomic community, for various reasons. Not to say that there should be a page of people going on about how much they hate the guy, but I think not mentioning this would be missing an important part of this Wiki. Can you agree that with a lot of other people have been criticized, such as Charles Darwin, do you think this should be left out of his Wiki?
** Why is the fact that some people don't like his comic encyclopedia-worthy? For any webcomics, nay for any thing in the world, you can find people that dislike it, for any number of reasons. The point is, you want to make comments like "Tim Buckley is disliked more than anyone else in the webcomic community", but you can't prove that. Personally, I don't believe that's true at all, and I see no evidence to support it. So what if Penny Arcade doesn't like CAD? That makes perfect sense to me. CAD is competition, so it's only logical that they'd try to tear it down. It's business.  Thrindel
*** Generally there IS no beef between competition other than Tim Buckley, I think the closest you would find to such beef would be "tycho and gabe" Calling some other web comics noobs, but then I think if asked they would say that they actually respected and enjoyed those webcomics. You may say "hey this is no fact" But think it is clearly fact Scott Kurtz have clashed with Tim Buckley several times on forums, where Tim Buckley was accused of plagiarizing etc. It is not the fact that people dislike his webcomic that is note worthy, but the fact that he is both often accused of plagiarism, and also generally disliked as a person, often by fans he somehow mistreated. This IS very unusual for a webcomic [will adds links later, for the statement that tim buckley is disliked in the webcomic community etc(not saying that EVERYONE dislikes him, of course not, but a lot more than any comic i can think of)etc]
**** Unless you manage to hold some sort of poll that extends to the entire webcomic community, there is no way you can gather evidence to support your claims. And if you think there is no beef in webcomics besides with CAD, you need to read more webcomics, and more importantly, you need to read more webcomics forums. Squidi, for instance, is easily hated more than Buckley, and for more concrete and proveable reasons. Kurtz is hated by a great many people for his attitude. Even PA has a huge share of detractors. If you bothered to look, you'll find that any webcomic/webcomics creator is disliked by certain people somewhere. It's common, and it's a fact of life when you put your stuff up on the internet. It's not unique to CAD, so it isn't noteworthy.
***** I think thats just unfair. There are rivalries in the webcomic world but they still remain friendly with one another. When did Tim Buckley do something to piss anyone off,  If you can find that piece of evidence i will believe you but till then i believe the criticism section has to be given a pass.Someone mentioned plagiarism but i don't see any of that in Buckley's works. Like any good webcomic it remains unique in its own right.  
But perhaps most important to keep in mind are the legal ramifications. All of these "rumors" that you want to post could be considered libel, and would probably place Buckley in a position to take legal action against Wikipedia to have them removed, if he wished. Once again, I refer you to the previous ruling by Adashiel.
Also, a quote from Jimmy Wales, the founder of Wikipedia:
:"I can NOT emphasize this enough. There seems to be a terrible bias among some editors that some sort of random speculative 'I heard it somewhere' pseudo information is to be tagged with a 'needs a cite' tag. Wrong. It should be removed, aggressively, unless it can be sourced. This is true of all information, but it is particularly true of negative information about living persons." [2]
He considers "no" information to be better than "speculative" information and reemphasizes the need for sensitivity:
:"Real people are involved, and they can be hurt by your words. We are not tabloid journalism, we are an encyclopedia." Thrindel
In my opinion, this is one of the few, if not the only, webcomic that absolutely needs a criticsm section. Not only because of most people's dislike for the formulaic nature of the strip (which is a criticsm and alone merits a section) but for the infamous actions of Tim Buckley, including the plagiarism, the WoW fiasco, the general distaste with which he is regarded by other members and fans of the webcomic community. Tim - er, I mean, Thrindel, you seem to ignore the fact that even if it isn't true that the majority of comic hate is directed towards CAD and its author, there is still a significant amount, and that deserves mentioning in the wiki, especially since CAD is, at least among everyone I've ever spoken to it about, a comic characterized more by the animosity surrounding it than by any actual merits of the strips posted.
Cheers. -Shanko Butcho  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.208.165.232 (talk) 21:23:55, August 19, 2007 (UTC) 
:If you can find a reliable source for any criticism of Ctrl+Alt+Del, please add it.  But if you cannot, it does not belong here. =David(talk)(contribs) 21:34, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If it's "entirely subjective," as you say, then it does not belong on Wikipedia.  I suggest you take a look at this page again; forum posts do not count as reliable sources, and blogs rarely do.  Besides, finding posts on the forums for rival webcomics decrying it?  You can't honestly believe that's unbiased.  It would be acceptable to post a criticism section if you had information from multiple, verifiable, reliable sources about his negative activities or critical reception. =David(talk)(contribs) 15:36, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Criticism 

message: I had to get rid of the plot elements in the character descriptions, because it was getting to be too much (and it looked rather unencyclopedic). Really, the character descriptions should be about the characters, and not about everything they've been doing in the strip for the past several months. --Dynamite Eleven 04:29, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plot elements in character descriptions 

message: Needs a huge tidy-up...the episode "summaries" should maybe even be moved to a new article. ~ Gromreaper 08:08, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  CAD Cartoon 

message: Tim Buckley has said that he is going to be writing a comic called Analog and D+Pad, it will follow the characters Ethan, Lucas and co, however they will be super heroes. Will this be part of the Ctrl+Alt+Del page on Wikipedia or will it have it's own page?
Cover artwork "Analog and D+Pad cover art" ≈ Seraph 12:32, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Analog and D+Pad 

message: Did Buckley ever say that the tagline was a reference to The Hip? 'Cause I'm pretty sure it's not. As I understand it, Ctrl-Alt-Delete is an American webcomic and while the Hip are quite popular in Canada, not many have heard of them elsewhere. I think someone just made this up. Is there a newspost that Buckley did that can back this up? Chewbacca1010 23:57, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Tragically Hip?

message: I'm removing the following text ("and perhaps mental instability, as she only answers in one word sentences and enjoys seeing Player 3 set on fire") from the Player's description. She has had all of two lines, and all of the players (Save 3) are violent; not enough evidence of mental instability, unless they're all unstable (Which they are, but do we really have to say it?). Eltargrim 03:34, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Player 4

message: By which I mean, as opposed to say, Barry? Scott gets very little screentime and with the exception of maybe two story arcs, he is rather unimportant to the plot, seems more like a minor or supporting character.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.119.64.233 (talk • contribs) 18:23, 20 December 2006
:That's a good point. Scott hasn't been much of a major character lately, and it looks like the only reason we've billed him as a main character is because he happens to be one of the housemates. But you're right; Barry's done more than Scott these past few strips. --Dynamite Eleven 22:27, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is Scott really a main character? 

message: Don't get me wrong - I don't want to imply it ain't notable. But what references do we provide for it? Seems like ALL the 'references' we provide are links to CAD site only... MadMaxDog 12:25, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Notability

message: The images for the "Player" characters (1, 2, 3, & 4) do not have copyright tags on them, and could face deletion.... -- Sarrandúin [ Talk + Contribs ] 02:33, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Character images 

message: Under the Winter-een-mas section, there is a reference to the story arc called "A Winter-een-mas Story" entitled "The Seven Days of Winter-een-mas". Nowhere in the strip does it say that each spirit represents one day. Further, in the most recent strip, another spirit is introduced, the Spirit of Retro Gaming. I'd make the changes to the article, but I'm not really up for an overhaul of the entire section, besides, I wanted to see what others thought of this.
Scorp Stanton 05:38, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Seven Days of Winter-een-mas? 

message: Dell filed a legal action against a number of people and firms. CAD was included in the list though not a lot of other info is given. 209.87.247.50 19:06, 20 February 2007
:It's the Inquirer. I don't think it should be taken seriously. There's nothing there to even suggest that the Ctrl Alt Del in the defendants list is meant to be this webcomic.
::Not only that, but they called Tim "TRAVIS BUCKLEY". That's not his name.--156.56.154.3 23:30, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dell Lawsuit 

message: I noticed that a large majority of the links under 'References' (47 of them, to be exact) are links to specific Ctrl+Alt+Del comic strips. While each of these may contain information or events that the article mentions, I feel that a single mention of the Ctrl+Alt+Del comic itself would suffice as a reference. I figured offering it as a suggestion would be appreciated much more than just blatantly removing 47 references. ChimuKun 15:49, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There are several hundred strips in the archives. Telling people to find the reference themselves is something that I would not support. mrholybrain's talk 17:15, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

text: I agree with mrholybrain. References to an exact strip is often needed when talking about a certain event or character. --Darksun 02:12, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  References 

message: I have some ideas, we should split the article into Winter-Een-Mas, List of Ctrl+Alt+Del characters, List of Ctrl+Alt+Del: The Animated Series episodes, and possibly Ctrl+Alt+Del: The Animated Series.
— Joe Jacard 01:29, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: As good as the comic is, its wiki page isn't nearly long enough to justify more than one page. Redraf 02:10, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

text: I think we should go for the split. ≈ Seraph 22:48, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with the Spilt. This article is far to cluttered. --Garfunkle20 01:56, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

text: I agree with a split,as long as there is only 3 pages: Ctrl alt del comic,maybe Wintereenmas and Cad Comic the series. Those 2/3 would be enough Kaankav 17:44, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with a split, but I'm not sure the Wintereenmas page is necessary yet.  I agree with comic, animated, and characters at this point.  Those are the three splits that might support enough content for their own pages. Emilio8605 04:57, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wintereenmas is part of CAD. It may have a life of its own, but doesn't warrant a page to itself. There just isn't enough material. Reanef 18:34, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

text: With the new pages, shouldn't there be stuff removed from the main one. The characters list should be shortened to less detailed descriptions of the main characters and the pictures should be removed.72.39.141.251 02:46, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Split

message: http://churchofgaming.com/ Are we going to mention this at all? -- Phoeba WrightOBJECTION!  08:32, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Church of gaming... DOT COM! 

message: The image has merit; it shows practically all the major characters in the series and fits well in the cast section. I don't see why it should be removed as long as its use in the article is appropriate. --Guess Who 15:02, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's intended to attack the creator of CAD by using frames in which the characters all have similar facial expressions. If Tim makes an image that has a significant amount of characters in it, we could upload that, but otherwise we should avoid making mashups of characters, especially when they're created to insult the person that made them --Lie! 17:09, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image:Ctrlaltfaces.png