Talk:Greek Cypriots

message: One interesting legacy is that many Greek Cypriots adopted the Muslim title of "Hadji" (bestowed upon
 Muslims who have completed the hajj to Makkah) to indicate that they had completed a pilgrimage to
 a significant Christian religious site. Hence, many Greek Cypriot surnames begin with "Hadji-,"
this is not a cypriot characteristic, it is common in all greek speaking areas. Mavros 15:02, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Legacy

message: According to Eurostat 2010 the population of Greek Cyprus is 796.000 of which 670.000 are Greek Cypriots
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/cache/ITY_OFFPUB/KS-SF-10-045/EN/KS-SF-10-045-EN.PDF   —Preceding unsigned comment added by Siras (talk • contribs) 04:08, 25 November 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: NOTICE: This talk-page section is a good object lesson on how NOT to participate in Wikipedia discussions. It appears to have been created in 2010, following one older section, and preceding *another* older section. (I'm not even bothering to pay attention to whether the immediately surrounding contribs are in the wiki-relevant (counter-listserv) order.) The merits of its content may be low or high, but the carelessness of placing it *between* older contribs is stunning, and invites anyone not doing exhaustive analysis to presumptively assign low credibility to its contributor. (The inclusion of the URL with a (to me *moderately* official-sounding) EU URL is *far* from enuf to recommend it as a probably-high-reliability resource for our editors.)--Jerzy•t 06:09, 23 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  670.000 Greeks Cypriots

message: I think we should write how Greek Cypriots call themselves (Ελληνοκύπριοι) and also how Turkish Cypriots call them (Kibris Rum). Thus we can link to to the article Rûm. --Kupirijo (talk) 11:15, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the the formal name is Kıbrıs Rum not Kıbrıslı Rum. --Kupirijo (talk) 21:48, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:    Our colleague Kupirijo had used the west-European or cosmopolitan letter "i" in spelling the Turkish word, but 5 months on has learned of, noticed, or either chosen or learned to type or paste, the "Turkish dot-less i" character), and now taken up that desirable practice. This change is helpful, and deserves the praise of us, Kupirijo's colleagues.--Jerzy•t 05:15, 23 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Add names is Greek and Turkish 

message: I think mentioning Achaeans and Myceaneans in the same sentence is a bit redundant. They are after all the sane people, I think. --Kupirijo (talk) 11:18, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm, Zorba seemed to suggest they are all the INsane people!--Jerzy•t 06:14, 23 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Achaeans and Myceaneans 

message: Misleading map of cyprus showing 1973 population. By that time, most of the Turkish Cypriots had moved into small enclaves and had abondoned thier land. This picture presents a misleading Point of View.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by WillMall (talk • contribs) 19:51, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Misleading POV map

message: hi all - nice article btw - I have hidden the sentence that describes the Greek Cypriot population as "80%" as there has been no citation added since Jan 2009. The numbers cannot be taken simply from the Republic of Cyprus census as this is lacking in many ways and in no way accurately summarises the population of Cyprus. The survey did not include immigrants to the North of Cyprus of British, Russian etc nationality, nor does it include many of the "illegal" Turkish immigrants.
THe biggest problem is that it does not seem to include many of the Turkish Cypriots who have legitimate claim to citizenship
Chaosdruid (talk) 20:27, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Hidden comment

message: Hi all
THe census of 2001 amended in 2005 gives the Cypriot figures as "Country   of birth: by major age group, April 2001" at 77,676
I appreciate the number may be higher but it seems bizzare that the statement of 200,000 is deemed to be true, let alone an increase to 300,000
CAn someone try and clarify please ? Are the figures currently in the article reporting "Of Greek Cypriot descent" rather than "Greek Cypriot". Obviously if you are born in the UK you are not Greek Cypriot.
ThanksChaosdruid (talk) 20:24, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  From the census in 2001 amended in 2005 (yes I know its a while ago lol) 

message: i took the liberty of removing a link about "Holiday villas for rent in cyprus, paphos". also, the US population source is a facebook group, and i can't find the relevant info in it (although i may have missed it). k kisses 00:38, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  deleted link/facebook source 

message: Facebook and Amazon are not reliable sources! Can someone please change this, otherwise I will. Thank you.Turco85 (Talk) 14:55, 8 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  population in info box 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This section does not seem to have anything to do with the history of the Greek Cypriots. In particular it does not establish a connection between the Greek Cypriot people and that period. 
It mentions how archeological evidence suggests an unsystematic Greek settlement of the island which occurred from 1400 BC and how that accelerated further down-the-line but it makes no effort to establish a link between the modern Greek Cypriots and the "Greek" (Mycenaean-Dorian) cultures to which reference is being made.
Have there been any studies that establish a direct, unbroken ethnolinguistic heritage between the Mycenaeans, Dorians and the modern Greek Cypriots?
Maybe in the meantime this section can do with a disclaimer (does one exist?) that says "although this is being used by XXXX to suggest a connection no actual connection has thus far been established"? 
Perhaps the ambiguous usage of the word Greek here could also do with a revision? Nargothronde (talk) 07:47, 22 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you proposing that the ancient Cypriot Greek population has nothing to do with its modern descendants? Aearthrise (talk) 19:31, 22 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Not agreeing with any of your suggestions. Greek history in Cyprus began with Mycenaean/Achaean Greeks, and even the genetics of Greek Cypriots show such influence. There is no requirement for them to speak a Mycenaean (Arcadocypriot/Achaean) Greek dialect for such information to be justified in their article. There is an unbroken Greek ethnolinguistic heritage. Also, you misunderstood what the paragraph says about the Dorian invasion in the southern Greek mainland and Aegean. If anything, more information should be added for the Hellenistic/Roman periods, and the early adoption of Christianity in the island. 62.74.15.65 (talk) 19:53, 22 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: There's a difference between modern Greek history and Greek history as is being referred to here. Mycanaean / Achaean / Dorian etc history began with Mycanaean / Achaean / Dorian etc history. The same as how modern Greek Cypriot history began with modern Greek Cypriot history, which in-turn traces itself to modern Greek history, which in-turn has the same trappings of not being ethnically / linguistically / culturally etc connected to the Mycanaean / Achaean / Dorian etc people. The genetics of the Greek Cypriots also do not show a direct, unbroken, matrilineal or patrilineal link to the Mycanaean / Achaean / Dorian etc people, who, by the way, since we're on the topic of genetics here, were clearly an imported steppe people and culture themselves, not some ethnically homogenous race (and they knew it too). The same trappings unfortunately also apply to the language, which is not even an indicator of heritage as you are trying to assert. If that were true then the Turkish Cypriots would have as much as claim to connection to the ancient Greeks and their language etc as you try to assert the Greek Cypriots as having. Nargothronde (talk) 15:07, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

text: Perhaps one of the other key issues I'm noticing here is that the ethnogenesis of the Greek Cypriot people (and in particular the extent and meaning of any connection with that period) is not a topic that has had any empirical study committed to it. At least as far as I'm aware. But as far as this section goes, bottom line is, there are no sources to substantiate a connection between the Greek Cypriot people and that period. If such a connection can be made and supported with multiple strong, reliable and cross-verifiable sources, then there would be no problem. Nargothronde (talk) 15:21, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

text: You're starting with the assumption that there was an ethnic-linguistic-cultural group during that period that identifies with a direct unbroken continuity with the modern Greek Cypriots. Nothing in this section supports that. Nargothronde (talk) 14:56, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: No, there is no difference. Modern Greek history is a branch of the broader Greek history. Mycenaeans/Achaeans and Dorians are also part of that same broader Greek history. Even in antiquity, just because someone might have been Ionian and the other Dorian, it doesn't mean they were not ethnically/linguistically/culturally connected, as you seem to be suggesting here, just because the language (for example) of the vast majority of modern Greeks (including Greek Cypriots) originates from Koine Greek, which in turn originates mostly from Attic-Ionic Greek, and not Mycenaean/Arcadocypriot/Achaean or Doric. As for genetics, i don't know about matrilineal haplogroups, but many of the main patrilineal haplogroups presented in the Genetic studies section are also found among ancient Greeks that have been tested. For example, the most common haplogroup of Greek Cypriots is J2a-M410, which is also a common haplogroup among ancient Greeks. There are more haplogroups that they share. Of course, this doesn't mean that all J2a-M410 came from Greeks (some came from Neolithic/Bronze Age Anatolians and Phoenicians no doubt), but when you compare it with autosomal results which are discussed in the same section, it does indicate influence from Mycenaean/Achaean Greeks, among others. Cypriots are included in the modern populations that are least differentiated from Mycenaeans Greeks. Also, they show close affinity to Calabrian (southern Italy) people, with experts saying that it can be explained as a result of a common ancient Greek (Achaean) genetic contribution. By the way, you also don't know what you are talking about when you say that Mycenaeans/Achaeans and Dorians were imported steppe people and culture. You make it sound as if the steppe influence was huge, when it is proven to be very small. For example, according to the article about Mycenaean Greece, Mycenaeans only had ~3.3–5.5% Eastern European ancestry that is attributed to the Indo-Europeans of the steppe. Most of their DNA came from Neolithic farmers, as is the case with modern Greek mainlanders and Greek Cypriots. So no, autosomally at least, there is no huge influence from Indo-Europeans. The influence is mostly linguistic and cultural, but even for these, pre-Indo-European people like Minoans probably had an equally important influence. I am not going to look for sources because this discussion is a waste of time, and it is very obvious that you are not here to improve the article, but to push a certain POV. But as an example, even Britannica says that Greek Cypriots descend from "a mixture of aboriginal inhabitants and immigrants from the Peloponnese who colonized Cyprus starting about 1200 BCE and assimilated subsequent settlers up to the 16th century."  By aboriginal inhabitants they probably refer to descendants of Neolithic farmers, and by 1200 BCE Peloponnesian immigrants, they certainly refer to Mycenaean Greeks. 62.74.19.244 (talk) 20:53, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  History Section "Ancient Cyprus"