Talk:Temporomandibular joint dysfunction

message: Why the "See also: Fibromyalgia"?  Can the resident expert/whoever added that (if available) please explain the relation I'm not seeing, and add that to the article? MCOTWnom
all very interesting, but why the first person?
Also, a definition of the disorder would be helpful. --AxelBoldt----
To my knowledge this is a "syndrome" and therefore the definitions consists of symptoms...
but a list of symptoms is also missing. RoseParks
The article on the Temporomandibular joint mentions the "disc" many times, and describes its displacement.  The disc is not mentioned ONCE in this article.  Something isn't right there. --Tedtoal (talk) 04:21, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: No fixed definition, but I've added a new definition section to show some more notable ones that have been offered. Fibromyalgia sometimes reported to be associated with TMD. New "normal anatomy section should help a lot with explaining what exactly the disc is, what the joint is etc etc. Any other explanations needed for this section let me know here and I try and put them in. Lesion (talk) 18:39, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why 

message: Recent edit adde to list of symptoms "Popping or clicking when the jaws are opened" and "Popping or clicking when attempting to chew".
* Are these not better categorised as features of TMJ subluxation ?
* Whilst subluxation may induce a "sprain" at the joint causing inflammation and hence an episode of TMJD, is not subluxation possible without having TMJD discomfort ?
* Should there be a separate article on TMJ subluxation, or is it better included in this article given that the consequence (TMJD) and its management are all discussed here ?
David Ruben  Talk  14:58, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I thought subluxation was considered a type of TemporoMandibular Joint Disorders, and would thus be appropriate to mention in this article (though it still having its own in-depth article). - Dozenist talk 01:33, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

text: I'm not a specialist but I would like to see subluxation in this page. And if it's really a detailed subject it could be a separate page also. At least there must be some sentences in this article about subluxation and this article must be linked from subluxation article. Iyigun Cevik 12:30, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

text: After further reading, I am not convinced that the term "TMJ subluxation" is in common use by mainstream medical sources. It might be a concept proposed as part of chiropractic medicine, but I would not include it with TMD mainly for the reasons above. Lesion (talk) 11:47, 5 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Issue of Subluxation vs TMJD

message: Does this article count as a stub?
Thank you for your question.  It does not qualify as a "stub" under the present wiki-definition.  Therefore I have removed the stub category from the article. pat8722 16:08, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stub? 

message: I am not terribly offended, but I feel the need to express this to you.  When it comes to facts about specialized fields, I understand that some knowledge taken for granted by the professionals may sound completely foreign to the general public.  Since you are unaware of arthrocentesis, I am assuming you do not have close ties to the dental profession.  If you have seen my user page, you would note that my main objective here is in the dental field, and I guess I take for granted that flushing out the TMJ as one avenue of treatment just makes sense.  Nonetheless, I feel it would have been considerate to keep a "citation needed" tag to the sentence so that us dental-minded wikipedians would have noted that there was a request for a reference for the information.  Otherwise, it would be more difficult to notice that the information was missing from the article, and thus more difficult to add a reference to that specific piece of information.  Again, I realize you may not know much about the dental profession, but it may be easier next time there is info you want verified to leave a message on a talk page of someone who is a dentist.  Thanks. - Dozenist talk 01:54, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Your assumptions are all wrong.  Of course I am "aware of arthrocentesis".  Your mention of it in the article lacked context, and still does, and will have to be fixed.  I hope, since you added it, you will make the time to place your addition into context.  As to sources, you will see I was held to provide a source on something pretty basic by one who represents himself as being a dentist. [], and I promptly complied. It's really not a problem to add sources, and you shouldn't feel insulted when you are held to providing one, particularly on a topic with as many contradictions and contraindications as this one.  pat8722 02:09, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think you misunderstand.  I deleted it because it was entered both without source and without context.  It survives only because you have added a source.  Without either source or context the material is misleading/confusing to the reader, at best.  It still is misleading, but the reader now has some protection in that they can view the source and assess its credibility.  Context is still necessary in the article, and since you are a proponent of leaving it in, I hope you will make the time to add the context, and including opposing treatment philosophies. pat8722 03:20, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

text: The solution, of course, is to reposition the mandible to its normal position using non-invasive technique (no surgery), and to correct the occlusal surfaces of the teeth, such that the mandible is guided back the correct position when the teeth occlude, as nature intended.  Arthrocentesis is obviously no more a "solution" for tmjd, than it would be for a dislocated shoulder.pat8722 15:02, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

text: There you go, making groundless assumptions and insults again. The point is to improve the article, and where you are the propronent of keeping something in, it is only fair to expect you to add the context, so as not to mislead/confuse the reader.  You open yourself up to insults worse than the one's you are making. Of course, it's because I know the factors that "may cause tmjd" that I proposed that you place "context" into the article relative to your addition.  Since you are in agreement that "context" is important, you evidence you understood why I deleted your "uncited" reference to it.   Rather than making statements that you possess knowledge/expertise, you could you could place what you believe to be "context" into the article, particularly since you have now publicly acknowledged that you understand the significance of "context".  You do not disagree that "arthrocentesis is no more a cure for tmjd, than it would be for a dislocated shoulder.  Since you are the one keeping a reference to arthrocentesis in this article, it seems only reasonable that you should make the time for adding the context that would make it other than misleading and confusing for the reader.pat8722 15:11, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I point to what I have already said earlier: "Well, I have looked at that section of the article and it seems to have perfect context to me since it is one form of treatment."  And I cannot understand your sentence, but, in order for clarity, arthrocentesis can "cure" tmd because tmd is nothing like a dislocated shoulder. - Dozenist talk 15:54, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Your statement that "arthrocentesis can cure tmjd" would never survive in the article.  Why place falsehood on the talk page? If you want to defend arthrocentesis as "a cure", make your allegation in the article, so I can delete it is as being unsourced. (It is one thing to claim arthrocentesis will alleviate symptoms, and to loosely associate it's use with first "manipulating the jaw", another to claim arthrocentesis is a "cure for tmjd".) Your statement that "tmjd is nothing like a dislocated shoulder" is equally ridiculous - the majority of cases are best understood by the general public when comparing tmjd to a dislocated shoulder, in that the solution is to reposition the mandible to its normal position using non-invasive technique, followed by the additional step of correcting the occlusal surfaces of the teeth, such that the mandible is guided back to the correct position when the teeth occlude, as nature intended. pat8722 16:26, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, you again demonstrate you have no idea what you are talking about.  I have no "allegations" and everything I am saying is supported by the medical/dental community.  The general public may compare tmd to a dislocated shoulder, but they are in fact nothing alike.  You would know all this if you were an expert in the field. - Dozenist talk 00:21, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Arthrocentesis

message: Twice now, Jersyko has reverted my edits of sourced material. The information I have added to the article is undisputedlytrue.  "TMJ Syndrome: The Overlooked Diagnosis, A. Richard, D. D. S. Goldman Virginia McCullough" is a reliable source for the information that meets all Wiki citation criteria, and was duly cited.  Unless you have a source to counter my source, please do not delete this material, as to do so is Wikipedia:Vandalism.pat8722 19:26, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: How dare you call my edits vandalism.  The source violates WP:V, which calls for reliable sources.  The source is not reliable becuase it's not peer-reviewed, unless you consider the author's secretary (who is one of the only "sources" cited in the article) to be part of the peer-review process. - · j·e·r·s·y·k·o talk · 19:32, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: A. Richard, D. D. S.

message: Not looking for a dispute here, but I was wondering if there was someone who could provide more information on the different classes of TMJ disorder? My PCP just told me my jaw was slightly misaligned due to probable TMJ disorder and referred me to a dentist. When I made the appointment they asked if I was "class 1", I told them I guess that's what I was going to them to find out...  I'm guessing my problem developed from grinding and biting habits I have due to OCD and anxiety disorders, so if anyone has information showing a relationship between the two I'd like to know about that as well.thanks!Polyphonickat 18:36, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not sure, but might have been telling you the type of occlusion you have rather than TMD. It is possible they were talking about the RDC/TMD classification (but these are called groups not classes). It is very likely that many other classifications exist, I've put the RDC/TMD in detail because it seems to be fairly modern and highly used in research studies. If I'm wrong about that and I've given a minor classification too much weight, please feel free to edit. Lesion (talk) 18:43, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Classes??  

message: Could semi-major (one tooth was completely horizontal and set in deep into the jaw bone) impacted wisdom tooth surgery promote TMJ? 
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.120.93.246 (talk) 11:54, 9 July 2007
:It sounded v unlikely when I initially read the unreferenced comment in the article, and I was waiting to delete it, but then a few sources stated this apparently is sometimes the case, with dental extractions generally and not just the wisdom tooth extractions, or indeed any dental treatment. Combination of (i) holding mouth open for a long time and (ii) possible parafuncitonal foces exerted on the TMJs themselves during a tooth extraction this is why the dentist/oral surgeon supports the jaw with their non working hand while removing a tooth-- to try and transfer some of the forces to their own arm. Lesion (talk) 18:07, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Past Wisdom Tooth Surgery 

message: I would hazard a guess that, like me, most people accessing this article will be sufferers or possible sufferers from this condition rather than experts. From that perspective, it seems to me that three issues are far from clear, and that clarification would be of great benefit:
1. From the article, it would appear that TMD comprises the incorrect movement of the mandible in a fore-and-aft direction - but can this also occur laterally, i.e. in such a way that the jaw displaces to the left and/or to the right? My condition seems to have begun as the former (characterised by clicks and pops, as described here), but has now become the latter (characterised by numbness/temporary seizing of the jaw).
2. Again from a lay perspective, what about consequences of TMD? It occurs to me - and I must stress that it occurs to me simply as a lay person - that this disorder could trap not only nerves but also blood vessels. If so, what further symptoms could result?
3. Could TMD result from difficult wisdom tooth extraction? 
(In my case, the wisdom tooth had to be cut in half laterally, using some kind of disc cutter, after which the front half was removed. Removal of the back half required a further cutting in half of the remaining tooth in the same way).
It could be that these issues might be answered by an expert contributor, and/or that there could be a reference to a related wikipedia article addressing these issues, if such exists. This could be a great help to non-expert readers.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vvmodel (talk • contribs) 22:40, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Areas where clarification would help 

message: For the last few days, I have found it painful to open my mouth very far. Also when I first wake up, I find it painful to close my teeth together, but this goes away after I force them closed a couple times. Do I have this disorder? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.87.219.217 (talk • contribs) 
Not enough info for diagnosis, but if I were to guess, I would say no.  More likely that your wisdom teeth are giving you trouble and you are suffering trismus.  However this is a guess and in no way constitutes a diagnosis.Dr-G - Illigetimi non carborundum est. 18:46, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Do I have this?

message: This statement is in the introduction: "Because the disorder transcends the boundaries between several health-care disciplines — in particular, dentistry, neurology, physical therapy, and psychology — there are a variety of treatment approaches." There are no citations for this statement, and no references to many of the areas in the Treatment section. I especially feel to see how psychology comes into play, unless to deal with possible depression from the disorder. However, I don't believe that is direct enough to be mentioned, though a short mention may be warranted with a citation in another area of the article. This is only my opinion, and so I'm not willing to be bold here. - Cyborg Ninja 22:07, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: My interpretation of the literature is that there is more evidence for a psychosocial basis to TMD than most other theories. Psychologic interventions are also sometimes used to treat TMD, sometimes shown to be more effective than occlusal splints. Maybe this is why psychology is included. Either yourself or someone else down the line trimmed this statement and now it includes only neurology and dentistry. It is still there and unreferenced. It sounds very grand but yes now I agree we need a source. Lesion (talk) 18:29, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Areas of treatment 

message: Temporomandibular_joint_disorder#Relocating_a_dislocated_jaw sounds a lot like a how-to medical treatment guide. Is this really appropriate for Wikipedia, especially since it has no citations as to its origin, veracity, or safety? --Mr.98 (talk) 11:12, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's definitely problematic. Wikipedia is not a how-to guide. Even if the information were 100% reliable and safe (which I have no way of knowing one way or the other) it's against policy. 173.66.178.54 (talk) 01:37, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Since this concern has not really been addressed since Mr.98's comment back in October, I have raised this issue on the talk page for WikiProject Medicine.  Please contribute to the discussion there. --Nick—Contact/Contribs 04:07, 25 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Problematic section  

message: This article seems to have been tampered with by persons with financial interests in a given treatment. CranioSacral therapy supposedly "taps into natural rhythms," which is utter poppycock to anyone with scientific or medical training, and the only citations for Feldenkrais methods employing a "unique" understanding of neurology led to a site selling the treatment!   —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.192.90.110 (talk) 17:41, 14 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Treatment section 

message: I've added a couple more books, both with google previews. Have at 'em! LeadSongDog come howl! 19:43, 21 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Refs 

message: This looks like a product, not a modality. It is mentioned four times in this article. And the article it links to has one reference to medical sources.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.187.99.79 (talk) 03:28, 22 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: It's still advertised on wikipedia-- biofeedback headband. I have half a mind to AfD that page it is blatantly COI. I added a few medical sources about biofeedback for TMD having no evidence, and the creator of that page deleted my edit very quickly. Strongly suspect a COI (I'm finding it harder and harder to assume good faith the more pages like that I find). The reality biofeedback is just not routinely used for treating TMD. Maybe in research land, but not in the real world. Lesion (talk) 18:33, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Biofeedback head band advertisement 

message: According to the article on Arthrocentesis, it is not the same as joint irrigation. Arthrocentesis means to extract fluid from the joint. Joint irrigation means to inject fluid into the joint. Irrespective of the effectiveness of various treatments listed under "Long-term approach", or whether these paragraphs are organized poorly or well, the correct term as presented under "Long-term approach" is Joint irrigation, not Arthrocentesis (joint irrigation). Friendly Person (talk) 20:22, 29 October 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Be that as it may, maxillofacial surgeons call the operation "TMJ arthrocentesis" when they flush out the joint, correctly or incorrectly. The other procedure is arthroscopy where a camera is inserted into the joint, but this also involves some flushing of hte joint and can be therapeutic as well as diagnostic in some cases. Lesion (talk) 00:58, 3 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Arthrocentesis nomenclature 

message: Somewhere along the line, the article lost many citations to Moseby that were present in this version from 2006. If someone's feeling industrious, there's room for restoring them. LeadSongDog come howl! 17:03, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks like we still have a few of these references to that textbook. Ideally they could be combined into one reference. I would like to add that there are many textbooks entirely devoted to TMD. I would avoid these as much as possible since they tend to be, unfortunately, a platform for a single author, or a small group of authors, to present their own personal views of this condition rather than the mainstream view, e.g. in independent systematic reviews. I've read a few of these in the past, and some are written like religious/esoteric works rather than having any evidence base. You finish the book thinking you are a world expert, and then you read the next one and you find everything is different, even the most basic aspects. It is expert opinion rather than real evidence based medicine. I think would be ok to reference textbooks that were not focused entirely on TDM, like oral pathology/medicine textbooks, since these are likely to be more mainstream than the sub-sub-specialized books. Lesion (talk) 13:59, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lost citations 

message: Im trying to help/treat my TMJ, and having to go to over a dozen different pages to find out what thrown out words mean is frustrating beyond belief.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.57.53.3 (talk) 00:36, 4 November 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I started a new definitions section which should help. This page needs a lot of work. Lesion (talk) 00:52, 3 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Simple English Version? 

message: ==="Temporomandibular joint disorder" much less notable name than "Temporomandibular joint dysfunction" in medical publications===
I used all the search terms I found for this disorder on pubmed (crude, but better than nothing imo)
Search terms                                       	# pubmed hits
"temporomandibular joint dysfunction"              	4806
"temporomandibular joint dysfunction syndrome"     	4560
"temporomandibular joint pain dysfunction syndrome"	76
"temporomandibular pain dysfunction syndrome"      	19
"temporomandibular joint disorder"                 	154
"temporomandibular joint syndrome"                 	109
"temporomandibular dysfunction syndrome"           	11
"temporomandibular dysfunction"                    	319
"temporomandibular disorder"                       	770
"temporomandibular syndrome"                       	18
"Pain dysfunction syndrome"                        	386
"facial arthromyalgia"                             	9
"myofacial pain dysfunction syndrome"              	19
"craniomandibular dysfunction"                     	141
"myofacial pain dysfunction"                       	34
"masticatory myalgia"                              	12
"mandibular dysfunction"                           	273
"Costen syndrome"                                  	6
"Costen's syndrome"                                	74
*"In general, the term PDS is commonly used in UK while other terms such as myofacial pain, mandibular dysfunction, facial arthromyalgia, and masticatory myalgia are widely used in other countries." Al-Ani 2009 (Cochrane RV)
* "Temporomandibular joint disorders". ICD-10 Lesion (talk) 12:33, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I am more certain now that such a section is required for understanding of the later concepts that need to be discussed in the article, particularly the "causes" section. I will try to condense this as much as possible as I know we should not have lengthy digressions from the main topic. Lesion (talk) 00:10, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Improvements 

message: I used all the search terms I found for this disorder on pubmed (crude, but better than nothing imo)
Search terms                                       	# pubmed hits
"temporomandibular joint dysfunction"              	4806
"temporomandibular joint dysfunction syndrome"     	4560
"temporomandibular joint pain dysfunction syndrome"	76
"temporomandibular pain dysfunction syndrome"      	19
"temporomandibular joint disorder"                 	154
"temporomandibular joint syndrome"                 	109
"temporomandibular dysfunction syndrome"           	11
"temporomandibular dysfunction"                    	319
"temporomandibular disorder"                       	770
"temporomandibular syndrome"                       	18
"Pain dysfunction syndrome"                        	386
"facial arthromyalgia"                             	9
"myofacial pain dysfunction syndrome"              	19
"craniomandibular dysfunction"                     	141
"myofacial pain dysfunction"                       	34
"masticatory myalgia"                              	12
"mandibular dysfunction"                           	273
"Costen syndrome"                                  	6
"Costen's syndrome"                                	74
*"In general, the term PDS is commonly used in UK while other terms such as myofacial pain, mandibular dysfunction, facial arthromyalgia, and masticatory myalgia are widely used in other countries." Al-Ani 2009 (Cochrane RV)
* "Temporomandibular joint disorders". ICD-10 Lesion (talk) 12:33, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: "Temporomandibular joint disorder" much less notable name than "Temporomandibular joint dysfunction" in medical publications

message: There are 4 or 5 cochrane reviews dedicated to this topic . We should be using the highest quality available evidence instead of outdated and/or primary sources. Lesion (talk) 00:49, 3 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cochrane reviews available 

message: * AADR position statement http://www.aadronline.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=3465#TMD Lesion (talk) 15:53, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Useful sources

message: Per WP:MEDRS, the following may be unsuitable sources and need removal, ideally without losing the content they currently support, instead supporting it with suitable secondary sources. Lesion (talk) 11:25, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Remove primary sources

message: We have a "Temporomandibular joints" section which really is about the normal anatomy and a "teeth" section which really discusses causes, although it is not placed in the causes section. I think it would be good to have a short "Relevant anatomy and physiology" section. At least one reader above stated that they disliked having to visit other pages so much to understand this article. However, since we already) have (or at least should have) focused articles on the aspects of normal anatomy and physiology of relevance here (mastication, temporomandibular joint, occlusion, muscles of mastication, etc), then the need for such a section is called into question.
:I am more certain now that such a section is required for understanding of the later concepts that need to be discussed in the article, particularly the "causes" section. I will try to condense this as much as possible as I know we should not have lengthy digressions from the main topic. Lesion (talk) 00:10, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Normal anatomy section

message: Frankly, there is no such thing as "neuromuscular dentistry"...by this I mean it is not a recognized subspecialty of dentistry in any country that I know of. Occlusal adjustments are no longer considered appropriate treatments for TMD by the vast majority of dentists or other clinicians who manage TMD. There is no evidence base and multiple prominent sources have discouraged the continuing use of occlusal adjustments in TMD. As to TENS for TMD, at least this is not likely to cause any permanent damage (although local skin reactions can develop where the electrodes are placed), but I wonder if there is really any evidence for this? Lesion (talk) 16:43, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed merge with [[Neuromuscular dentistry]] 

message: * 
I feel the edit by  places undue weight on a surgical procedure that is very rarely carried out for TMJ-PDS. It is also entirely related to the USA, and therefore of no interest to most readers. Matthew Ferguson 57 (talk) 01:59, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree, summarized and moved to a subpage. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 12:28, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Joint replacents 

message: For the section on management, I have an idea from my own experience, which of course I can't directly add to the article. I think I have a mild case of TMD. At my dentist's suggestion, I went to a softer diet. For some folks, a fully soft diet is best (eg baby food and smoothies). I have found by experience that I don't have to go that far, but I do need to avoid crunchy foods like raw carrots and heavy-chewy foods like crusty bread. Also, I need to eat with smaller bites, more slowly, and with care. I would be very surprised if there isn't a good ref. for ideas in this category for people with TMD. However, I don't know what the ref. is, so I'll let some other Wikipedian find it and write it up. Oaklandguy (talk) 21:51, 17 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should add a subsection about softer foods & smaller bites when eating 

message: I've had a quick look at the info box and it says TMJ falls under the "speciality" of "gastroenterology". I'd assume the speciality is neuromuscular, I'm pretty certain than it's nothing to do with the digestive system though. I've been unable to edit the article as I can't see the "speciality" section, if someone could do so it'd be of benefit to the article. Arkhangelsk185 (talk) 20:43, 12 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: This field is autogenerated from ICD codes I think. Hence most oral pathology is considered under gastrointestinal pathology. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 22:48, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

text: You do find some oddities that is for sure, thank-you for edit and your prompt response it's sincerely appreciated. Arkhangelsk185 (talk) 23:14, 12 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Orthopedics or OMFS would make more sense to me than gastroenterology for TMJ dysfunction though a case could be made for neurology/psych too I suppose. TylerDurden8823 (talk) 23:15, 12 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: It's mostly dentists that deal with this in my experience. But yes also omfs, oral medicine, etc. Not sure orthopedics would be involvd in this condition. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 23:35, 12 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: In certain cases it's feasible that they could be if there were significant osteoarthritis of the joint, but I agree it's largely dentists, OMFS, etc. TylerDurden8823 (talk) 23:54, 12 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gastroenterology? 

message: This is the preferred UK and US term according to http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/temporomandibular-joint-disorder/Pages/Introduction.aspx and http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1143410-overview --Espoo (talk) 18:05, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Did you look at the two links above? They show this is also the term preferred in the UK because otherwise it wouldn't be used by the NHS. --Espoo (talk) 18:42, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: This one link doesn't hold immeasurable weight. One website affiliated with NHS doe not make a term official for the UK. And coincidentally one could very easily find many other "NHS" sources which use different terms. I've read literally hundreds of sources on this condition from all around the globe. Perhaps "TMD" is becoming in more wide use in UK and europe generally in recent times, but it is by no means the only term used. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 18:45, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: This is not "one website affiliated with NHS"; it's their official website, so you can be sure they specifically decided that this is the term they prefer! Anything else is speculation until you show us a different NHS URL. --Espoo (talk) 18:49, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: NHS choices is not the official NHS website. As an NHS employee I can assure there is no offical website. In response to a request for more sources, I've already referred you to the section "Definitions and terminology". Matthew Ferguson (talk) 18:55, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: As you can see by the name of the URL, nhs.uk, this is the official public website of the NHS. What they choose to use there is an official public terminology choice. --Espoo (talk) 19:01, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: NHS choices doesn't define a standard medical terminology for the NHS, let alone the UK as a whole. NHS choices is mainly a repository of contact details for NHS services to help the public access them. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 13:49, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  proposed move to [[temporomandibular disorder]] 

message: To refer to this condition as TMJ is incorrect. TMJ is the abbreviation for the joint itself. Matthew Ferguson (talk)
:When we have a very reliable source saying that this is the common name for the condition, it's a very bad idea to remove that edit and the source! Wikipedia is not a medical journal -- according to our manual of style, we are at the very least supposed to mention the most common name in the first line. In fact, the article should even be moved to that most common name, but there may be a special guideline for medical topics. --Espoo (talk) 18:47, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: If we look up "TMJ" in any medical dictionary or reliable scientific source it will give a definition about the joint not this condition. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 18:53, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: That's not the point. We also have to tell our readers what the common colloquial names are. And you are hopefully not serious in questioning the authority and seriousness of the National Institute of Dental and Craniofacial Research, are you? --Espoo (talk) 18:58, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes but people do use TMJ as an abreviation for the condition and the NIH supports so I am okay with it  Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 14:03, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Some "people" i.e. some patients not professionals, incorrectly use TMJ to refer to TMD. TMJ is temporomandibular joint. I'm OK wih including this point but must describe it as an incorrect colloquialism. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 18:21, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: The lead should be a summary. That discussion IMO belongs in the body. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 01:05, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

text: "lockjaw" is a closer synonym to trismus not TMD. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 18:19, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes agree. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 01:04, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Synonyms

message: To make the claim that it is known as lock jaw one needs a good reference.
This is not a good source Is Lockjaw the Same as TMD?. In fact it look fairly spam like.
Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 14:02, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: "lockjaw" is a closer synonym to trismus not TMD. Matthew Ferguson (talk) 18:19, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes agree. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 01:04, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Lock jaw