Talk:Pharyngeal consonant

message: Can someone please tell me why pharyngeal plosives are now thought to be impossible? --JorisvS 17:16, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the article on the cough reflex, it's glottal, and apparently plosive, seeing as how the actual sound is caused by the release of pressure after the articulators part (glottis opens). LokiClock (talk) 06:05, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It is possible to pronounce a Voiceless pharyngeal stop.--Adamsa123 (talk) 22:32, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you sure it isn't a strongly pharyngealized voiceless epiglottal plosive? --JorisvS (talk) 09:08, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: What are the epiglottal consonants exactly? from this audio example (Listen) which is supposed to be the example for epiglottal stop, it's sounds like a hard voiceless uvular stop [q]. The same thing with the epiglottal fricatives, they sound like a deep [χ] and [ʁ]. also this chart state that voiceless pharyngeal stop is possible to pronounce.--Adamsa123 (talk) 10:24, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: They can be considered further back than pharyngeals (which are further back than uvulars). They are articulated with the aryepiglottic folds against the epiglottis. --JorisvS (talk) 10:36, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: But you are aware they sound similar to the uvular consonants right?. anyway i am certain it's not a pharyngealized voiceless epiglottal stop. what is impossible is a voiced pharyngeal stop--Adamsa123 (talk) 10:47, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that's not what the article says. So, do you have an RS that says what you say? --JorisvS (talk) 19:25, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Which one? that the epiglottal consonants and uvular consonants sound similar or that a voiceless pharyngeal stop is possible to pronounce.--Adamsa123 (talk) 20:14, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, the possibility of (voiceless) pharyngeal stops. --JorisvS (talk) 21:55, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: But according to this chart it is possible right?. The white areas are possible consonants and the grey areas are judged to be impossible. by the way is pharyngeal stop is written in IPA as (Q)?--Adamsa123 (talk) 22:09, 19 July 2012 (UTC)

text: Hmm, how about this. A Pharyngealized example (Listen)--Adamsa123 (talk) 22:29, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The former sounds like a nasalized voiceless aspirated velar affricate  to me. The latter, I think, sounds like a (slightly rounded) voiceless epiglottal affricate . There is definitely frication in both. Note also that a "pharyngealized pharyngeal ..." is not possible, just like e.g. a "palatalized palatal ..." is not possible. --JorisvS (talk) 12:53, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Well in my both examples there is no frication at the velum or uvula. It is somewhere between the Uvular consonants and Glottal consonants. When i try to make this into a frication, i pronounce a Voiceless pharyngeal fricative. the "Pharyngealized" example that i mentioned before is what i pronounced when i tried to make this into a plosive. my first examples was voiceless pharyngeal affricate.  Example without the long vowels  A Pharyngeal affricate  i tried to make it plosive  It may sound like a voiceless uvular stop, but it isn't.--Adamsa123 (talk) 16:39, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

text: The Epiglottal consonants really confuse me. First of all i am very familiar with the pharyngeal consonants. As a kid i could pronounce both Voiceless and Voiced pharyngeal fricative softly. Now for the Epiglottal consonants from this two examples which one is the Voiceless epiglottal fricative? : Example 1 (deeper ħ) Or Example 2 (strongly pharyngealized χ).--Adamsa123 (talk) 12:50, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The former sounds like a voiceless pharyngeal fricative to me and the latter like a voiceless epiglottal fricative (albeit computer-generated). I suspect the "soft pharyngeal" could be the epiglotto-pharyngeal, but I could well be wrong. At any rate, I can make a 'soft' (i.e. not raspy) heavily fricated sound by doing something in my throat and have also managed to make a softer but distinctly different sound by greatly lessening the frication of the voiceless pharyngeal fricative. --JorisvS (talk) 11:28, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The "soft pharyngeal" is how the Arabic, Mizrahi Jews, Chechen people ,Kurds and Circassians pronounce it. Anyway it's clear to me now which one are the epiglottal consonants. So in the end voiceless pharyngeal plosive is possible to pronounce--Adamsa123 (talk) 18:11, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, that has become clear to me :). --JorisvS (talk) 21:35, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

text: After I learned that a voiceless pharyngeal plosive was possible and manage to pronounce it, it was also easy for me to pronounce a voiced version. Your sound file could well be of one, but I'm not yet sure. --JorisvS (talk) 09:51, 29 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Pharyngeal plosives

message: How helpful it would be if pages on such topics presented the actual sounds in sound files.
:Ah, but the pages for the individual sounds do, as per usual. LokiClock (talk) 06:01, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sounds 

message: חית
| 
| the letter 
isn't the symbol used there a taw instead of a ḥêṯ?
:Arabic is written right to left. The taw is for the [θ]. LokiClock (talk) 05:54, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Eh, that's Hebrew, not Arabic. Just sayin'. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 19:56, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

text: The symbol in red is heth: see the character under "Hebrew" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heth. Notice the loop on taw: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taw  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.254.27.123 (talk) 18:30, 3 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wrong Symbol? 

message: Shouldn't it be two different articles? One defining epiglottal consonants and the other refering to pharyngeal? Sure, the epiglottis is placed in throat but it's still different consonant, IMO. 79.185.239.190 (talk) 22:56, 10 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Esling (2010, cited in the article) seems to (partially) disagree. Peter238 (talk) 16:50, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Separation of the article 

message: I think the audio samples of the pharyngeal fricatives and epiglottal trills are currently a mess. Perhaps  and  are the pharyngeal fricatives and  and  are the epiglottal trills?--Adamʂa123 (talk) 21:11, 14 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: None of them are trills. The first two indeed sound more pharyngeal and the other two do sound more epiglottal (or epiglotto-pharyngeal?). --JorisvS (talk) 08:48, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Or perhaps  is an epiglottal fricative or trill?--Adamʂa123 (talk) 12:51, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: That sounds like a fricative trill (a voicless epiglottal raised non-sonorant trill). There is clearly both a fricative and a trill component. --JorisvS (talk) 13:04, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I can hear a weak trilling on the fourth recording, and the fifth recording is indeed a fricative trill. Peter238 (talk) 16:49, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Isn't the variation in the sound just a slightly variable constriction? --JorisvS (talk) 16:52, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure what you're asking. After a second listen, the fourth recording does seem to feature two slightly different sounding versions of that sound, the latter of which sounds a bit like a failed attempt at pronouncing a flap (rather than a trill), or something like that. Which phonetically is nothing more than a type of fricative. Peter238 (talk) 17:00, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Fricatives are the part of a continuum from almost no constriction to fully constricted where the constriction is enough to produce turbulence, but not sufficient to fully block the airstream. That means that at the same point of articulation one fricative can have a slightly smaller air passage than another fricative. And these sound slightly different. Could it be something like that? --JorisvS (talk) 17:08, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: That's probably it, yes. Peter238 (talk) 17:11, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Is it me or the audio samples for the epiglottal consonants sound extremely similar/the exact same?! MacySinrich (talk) 18:20, 22 January 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Audio samples