Wikipedia talk:WikiProject NASCAR/Archive 4

message: Decided to archive the talk page, as it was 57K (recommended size is 32K or smaller) That, and it was a touch too long to be useful. It is still available here, and as its template states, feel free to "revitalize" any topic, by copy/pasting here. -slowpokeiv 19:52, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Another archive here. Recury 16:41, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Another archive here.  Y'know, it's gotta be a good thing when the length of time covered in the Archive keeps getting shorter and shorter.  -- DiegoTehMexican 19:03, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Archiving

message: OK, it has been a while, and is now done.  now exists, but needs to be used. All should be able to be migrated with little effort, but be aware that all stats must now be series specific. (That is, Cup_Wins must be used, not Wins) -slowpokeiv 12:54, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I asked this on slowepokeiv's talk page, but I should ask it here too - should we develop a "joint" infobox template with WikiProject Formula One, for drivers like Juan Pablo Montoya and Tony Stewart, who have raced in F1, NASCAR, and/or IRL? -- DiegoTehMexican 19:03, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: As I stated on my talk, I disagree with the melding of the two infoboxes, for the main reason that I don't want to say that one is more important than another. (I do however think that discussion is good, and agree with bringing it up and discussing it here.) Also, the list of crossovers is relativly short. (I only know 2 or 3 drivers to have done the sunday double (Indy 500, Cocacola 600) and I think just as few who have raced F1 and NASCAR. -slowpokeiv 02:22, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I also disagree with melding the infoboxes for the same reasons as Slowpokeiv. I would have posted it last night had my Wi-Fi been working better. The only infobox combination that could possibly make sense in my mind would be IROC, but I think they should remain separate. Royalbroil Talk  Contrib 04:08, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Driver Infobox Template

message: Someone has requested a merge of the following four articles: NASCAR Canadian Tire Series, CASCAR, CASCAR Super Series, and NASCAR Canada. I suggest all comments be left on the talk page for NASCAR Canadian Tire Series. Would someone please point all of the merge discussions to my comment there, for my Wi-Fi internet connection is nearly dead with rain moving in. THANKS! Royalbroil Talk  Contrib 03:33, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Merge request on [[NASCAR Canadian Tire Series]]

message: I took an image of what I believe is a replica of his car. You can find it on my flickr account here. What does everyone think about using the image of the replica in his article? I have a few more images of other replicas, but the cars are smaller (and thus may not work). Royalbroil Talk  Contrib 06:14, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd say replica is better than none, so long as it's clearly labeled as such, but actual image is better than replica. Just my .02 -slowpokeiv 23:01, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Image of Ralph Earnhardt

message: Beginning cross-post.
:See Wikipedia talk:Version 1.0 Editorial Team#Stablepedia. If you wish to comment, please comment there. ★MESSEDROCKER★ 02:52, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stablepedia 

message: The main NASCAR article is currently about 44kb long.  It contains a lot of information regarding the point system, and saftey.   Since these sections contain information that are nearly universal to all series, I propose that these be moved to a new article specifially for NASCAR Rules and Regulations.  This would make the main article focus more on buisness and history, while leaving details about NASCAR racing to a new article where they can be expaned.  The new article could also host information about tech inspection, race weekend procedures, and the colors of flags.  Your feedback is appreciated. Mustang6172 08:46, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sounds like an excellent way of dividing the article. The new article should point of the differences between series where there are some. Please note that there is already a Wikipedia article on the colors of racing flags that is far broader and incorrect for NASCAR called Racing flags. Royalbroil T : C 23:19, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Sounds good to me too, and possibly the Criticism and History could be condensed and moved as well. (I mean, come on, there's more about the criticism than the history... Not saying that we should censure, but we should add to the history, and we shouldn't do that on this page, as it's already too long.) -slowpokeiv 01:53, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

text: Seems like it would work well to me. I just wouldn't capitalize Rules and Regulations, unless NASCAR has an official publication somewhere that is called that. Recury 17:01, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: NASCAR Regulations article proposed

message: I'm going to request a move for this article to something else, but I just wanted some input as to what you guys think would be a good name for it. It at least needs a comma between France and Sr per Wikipedia:Naming conventions (people), but I thought maybe saying "Bill" instead of "William" might be appropriate since that is usually how I see it written. It could also go to Bill France since that is what he is often called, but I am starting to think that might be better left as a redirect. I guess I am leaning towards Bill France, Sr. right now, but what are your thoughts? Recury 15:29, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that most people know him as Bill France, Sr., so I'd move the page there. — BrotherFlounder (aka DiegoTehMexican) 15:32, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Bill France, Sr. I always disliked naming the article William France Sr. too, and I thought about having it changed. I like Brother's new name much better too. Yea, brother! - Royalbroil T : C 23:28, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: All this talk about Bill France Sr. inspired me to write the Bill France, Jr. article! I nominated it for Did You Know, so please add to it. Thx! Royalbroil T : C 03:30, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[William France Sr.]] page move 

message: Do we need a WikiProject Motorsport for collaboration on topics that affect all motorsport articles? I came across Wikipedia:WikiProject_Rugby - the purpose of which is to "maintain its children Wikiprojects: Rugby league and Rugby union as well as recognising, organising and improving the common areas between the codes." Now we have a lot more Motorsport WikiProjects covered than two and I sometimes think stuff such as the UK country discussion on the F1 Wikiproject applies across several others. I'm posting this on the F1, WRC, NASCAR, American Open Wheel Racing, A1GP and IROC to get people's opinions. Your comments are welcome! Alexj2002 21:10, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm in. I am a member of three of the WikiProjects (IROC, NASCAR, and American Open Wheel). I am knowledgable and often work on areas of racing that lie outside these specific genres, like midget cars, off-road racing, sprint cars, non-NASCAR stockcars, national series that tour local tracks in the United States, and other national series in the United States. These "missed" areas could be managed/organized by the meta-WikiProject. A meta-WikiProject to encompass all types of racing is needed. Royalbroil T : C 02:35, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

text: WP:MOTOR created - please add comments and suggestions to it's talk page. Alexj2002 11:33, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Need for a WikiProject: Motorsport?

message: Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 19:29, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wikipedia Day Awards 

message: *The January 16 AfD page has two Dale Earnhardt-related breakout articles nominated for deletion.  The nominator feels the parent article has enough detail on these two controversies, and says nothing more needs to be merged.  These are at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dale Earnhardt: Controversy over the cause(s) of his death and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dale Earnhardt: Autopsy photographs controversy.  Please consider reviewing these and the parent article, seeing whether these topics merit more than is in the parent article, and commenting in the AfD's, including adding sources if you think they should be kept or if you think more should be merged.  Barno 17:40, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *I strongly endorse Agne27's creation/merge of Death of Dale Earnhardt, and I agree with the above comments, particularly the last sentence.  This was one of the most noted individual deaths in years, having plenty of influence on the sport, with enough published in reliable sources for a breakout article.  Barno 14:24, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

text: *I also strongly endorse the Death of Dale Earnhardt article. Very well written and complete! Royalbroil T : C 19:13, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  2 Earnhardt breakout articles nominated for deletion 

message: Does everyone know that there is an award for WikiProject NASCAR? It was approved through the whole process to! I recently created a subpage for it. There is a link to the award on the members page. It is used for rewarding WikiProject NASCAR members for their service, a special contribution, or whatever you deem appropriate. Enjoy! Royalbroil T : C 01:58, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject NASCAR/Award]]

message: Check out Talk:Winn-Dixie 250 presented by PepsiCo. I could have sworn we had discussed this before and decided that not including presenting sponsors in the titles was the way to go, but I can't find the discussion anywhere. Anyway, stop by and let me know what you think. Recury 19:20, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Presenting sponsors in article titles 

message: An infobox that would organize all of the NASCAR pages would help. Maybe something like is done for MLB, NHL, or the NBA pages on wikipedia. I think it would help like NASCAR pages together better. Benje309 02:38, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: NASCAR Infobox

message: I am in the process of categorising motor racing infobox templates to make them easier to find and manage among all the various projects. Would you guys like your own sub-category of Motor racing infoboxes? You have quite a few templates, so it make sense to file them someplace. Regards, Adrian M. H. 23:21, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I say yes. Royalbroil T : C 00:42, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll sort that out today then. Haven't seen anything of you for a few days. The trivia contest going well, I hope? Adrian M. H. 14:53, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's done. Infobox and series templates can be found at Category:NASCAR_infoboxes, which is a sub-category of Category:Motor racing infoboxes. Adrian M. H. 15:07, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you Adrian!  That should prove useful.  Barno 05:20, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Categorisation of templates 

message: *See :Talk:NASCAR where I've suggested an article on safety developments in NASCAR (where such advances weren't just "...in racing" in general).  I'll look for more sources that we might use, besides those I've added in a few articles.  Barno 05:17, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Safety in NASCAR article proposed 

message: So I was going through a few Category:NASCAR articles the other day and I noticed that we have two articles on the Lucky Dog Rule.  There's Lucky Dog pass and Lucky dog.  I've put merge tags on them, but no one is on the talk pages and I'm not sure which one to use.  Lucky dog has the better article, and Lucky Dog pass sounds like a better title.  Opinions on what to use? Mustang6172 03:28, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry. I saw the tag and I didn't have a preference or comment. You definitely should merge the articles of course. You could also use "Lucky Dog Rule" (if it is indeed a rule). The only thing that comes to mind it that "Lucky dog" would be accidentally found easier. That's a somewhat of a bad thing. I have a very weak preference for "Lucky dog pass". Royalbroil T : C 03:38, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

text: I guess I would go with Lucky dog just because adding "pass" or "rule" on the end would be kind of interpretive; I don't think NASCAR actually has a set name for it. Besides, when announcers use the phrase, they almost always just say "Lucky dog." It's just a phrase and not a proper noun, so don't capitalize "dog" or "rule" or "pass." Recury 14:19, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Strong support for merge.  The rulebook does not use the term "Lucky Dog".  That was purely an informal term used by the TV broadcasters (to the point of becoming the default way of referring to the rule), until last season when Michael Waltrip's sponsor Aaron's threw the network some money to show a logo and call it the "Aaron's Lucky Dog" each time.  But there's no better search term, so I would go with Lucky Dog (uppercase D since it's used as a title, especially in the past year, not as a literal phrase), and no "rule" or "pass" since a minority of searchers would try one of those ways first.  Barno 00:47, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: This discussion shows that there definitely needs to be a number of redirects. Royalbroil T : C 01:23, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Sanity Requested

message: I'm not sure what the proper name it, but I'm talking about the box of links for teams on the bottom of many pages, like the one I made for Roush Racing awhile back.  These have popped up for nearly every team, but they all look rather bland.  I am working on a more colorful version in my sandbox right now: User:BrotherFlounder/Sandbox2
Please let me know what you think and feel free to edit it yourself.  — BrotherFlounder 18:26, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I like the amount of color used in the Roush Racing template. The current version in your sandbox is WAY too colorful for my taste. Royalbroil T : C 22:23, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Team Linkboxes 

message: :From Wikipedia talk:WikiProject NASCAR/Standards which now redirects to WT:NASCAR. Airplaneman  ✈ Review? 03:22, 16 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Table format is a valuable addition for Schedule 

message: Why was  created? If they just wanted the manufacture, they could have added it to the current team template. --D-Day 23:41, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. We need to all use a single owner userbox. I think that you should propose deleting it. Royalbroil T : C 00:38, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Owner Infobox 

message: I have today started working on individual race pages starting with the 2006 Daytona 500 and the 2006 Auto Club 500.  I will be working my way through the 2006 season in the days and weeks ahead.  All comments are helpful Jsydave 23:54, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think that this is necessary - these races are covered in detail on the 2006 in NASCAR page, and most races are not noteworthy enough to have their own pages.  Certain ones, such as the 1992 Hooters 500 and the 2001 Daytona 500 are probably noteworthy, but not every single race.  — BrotherFlounder 03:10, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Appreciate your view, however this was something I found a rather glaring omission so before adding the pages I looked up the archived discussions on this talk page - Archive 3 has an entry on individual race pages and my view was that the consensus was broadly positive and would allow the 2006 season page to be less cluttered by removing the excessive detail from the season page - if you're looking up season stats i can't imagine you could care less who didn't qualify for this race or that - that level of detail surely cannot be noteworthy at a season level - certainly no more so than who finished 11th in a given race.  As I said above I appreciate the feedback and since I'm new around these parts of the Wiki I'll hold fire for now on the remaining race until I receive more views here. Jsydave 09:42, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: My first thought was no, don't create them. I, in fact, had nominated the 1990 Daytona 500 article for deletion almost a year ago (it was created by a vandal). But I see slowpokeiv's point about wanting to lessen the size of the 2007 in NASCAR file. How would the 2006 in NASCAR article have been decreased in size if there had been an article written about each race? I want some discussion as we decide. Good call on very notable races, BrotherFlounder. I would add the 1979 Daytona 500, of course. Royalbroil T : C 18:53, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

text: Perhaps removing the silly season stuff could be a start. Not of all that is really notable for inclusion in the season page. Inclusion in the driver/team articles should be fine. --D-Day 19:48, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

text: Well given my work has received a fairly negative reaction, despite the previous discussion, I'll leave you guys to decide what race articles you wish to write as I can't help with this - I have seen very few races ever. Thanks for the comments. Jsydave 15:31, 17 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It isn't that you do a bad job of writing, it's the idea that we are not necessarily sold on. Royalbroil T : C 19:45, 17 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Appreciate that and I don't take it personally. I just can't help you move forward the way you want it done Jsydave 15:48, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

text: It's not just Formula One either.  Moto GP has them as does IRL (although both are incomplete). A1 Grand Prix has them.  On the other hand there's several series that do not apart from notable races - Le Mans Endurance Series comes to mind.  At the end of the day I'm happy to oblige.  I've designed a tool for the purpose so could assemble the remaining 41 race pages moderately quickly, using the official NASCAR results pages and by copying across the existing race recaps.  I'll take a look at the race pages too but since I'm pretty new to NASCAR I doubt I can add much other than a superficial edit and update.  Perhaps at the end of my work adding the pages, you can decide whether to ditch the race pages en masse or to cut down the race elements on the season specific pages.  Finally, I've noticed that someone added a (very detailed) race page for the NASCAR race just passed - a good example of what is possible. Jsydave 16:17, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

text: Noted and comments appreciated (even if I did not get to read them for a couple of months afterwards!!)  It is a huge task but one I have written a tool for, although I see today it needs a touch of refinement as it is removing leading zeros from car numbers (eg. 07 becomes 7).  Have added tables for all 2007 rounds, that did not already have them, prior to this past weekends race and will commence again on 2006 shortly. Jsydave 12:38, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Individual Race Pages 

message: Is it really necessary to list ALL of a driver's wins in NASCAR? It seems like fanboyism to me. I'd like to see a policy where only a driver's wins in a MAJOR race are listed, or they are just summed up generally. (I.E. two wins in 2004, five wins in 1996, etc.) --D-Day 15:12, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Lists like that are unnecessary.  Racing-Reference already does that in far greater detail than is needed or could be done here.  — BrotherFlounder 17:30, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I would go a step further. The only place that should mention a win is in the text, and in the infobox if it was the Daytona 500. Royalbroil T : C 22:04, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wins on Driver Pages 

message: Should winning the Daytona 500 be added to the driver's infobox? Please vote and comment. 
*Yes. It is the jewel crown in NASCAR, and a driver's career is judged by the number of Daytona 500 wins. Royalbroil T : C 12:57, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll add on to my statement.  Every time Daytona 500 rolls around, all the talk is about how the race is the most important.  But when the Brickyard 400 rolls around all the talk is about "what's the bigger race, Daytona or Indy".  And usually the drivers that started out in open wheel say Indy.  And the Indy 500 is still more popular than the Daytona 500 when mesured with an international audiance.Mustang6172 05:23, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

text: I am doing an add-on with my statement. If any of you watched Speed Channel last night, Ward Burton put it into the best words "Even if I do not do a single thing in racing again, I will always be introduced as the 2002 Daytona 500 winner." Now, I don't know how that would reallly be a weak statement there at all. Not only that, but everyone who is a race fan, and everyone who has ever followed NASCAR, knows what the Daytona means to a driver. More so than the Indy 500 means to Indy Car racing.--Kranar drogin 22:43, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Daytona 500 win in driver's infobox

message: *The article List of films featuring automobile racing has been nominated for deletion at the February 23 AfD.  This isn't strictly relevant to our project but you might want to join the discussion and help the proposed solution (add movie articles to a category, and write articles for missing race-flicks) if some of these movies are your old favorites.  Barno 00:55, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  movie list proposed for deletion 

message: Please state your opinion in the discussion. The Category is maintained by this WikiProject. Royalbroil T : C 20:39, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[:Category:NASCAR films]] proposed to merge into parent auto racing category

message: Hi, I'm currently making some changes over on the WikiProject Motorsport Assessment Page. Look in the statistics section. Only 240 articles have the template WikiProject Motorsport on it. I'm thererfore going to propose something (I think this has been discussed a while back). Can every single Motorsport article have the template on it's talk page. My reasoning for this is that some drivers have only the Formula One template on the article. However, surely (by the way, this goes for virtually all articles), they haven't got to Formula One someway. They haven't just been thrown into F1, I don't think any drivers done that. They've gone through other forms of Motorsport. Therefore, surely the Wikipedia Motorsport template is needed for every single Motorsport article?. I'm going to do a vote on this (on this page, plus the Motorsport project and all the child projects) so we can get a decision on this. By the way, don't bother voting on different projects, as only one of your votes will count! Davnel03 16:53, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There appears to be concensus on a new template that would be added to drivers in multiple disciplines like Mario Andretti and Juan Pablo Montoya. The creator assured me that it will work with the importance sorting categories in WikiProject NASCAR. You can find the discussion here, along with showing the template in action. Royalbroil T : C 13:39, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Changes in Templates 

message: Hey there...After reading the NASCAR entry, the basis for this project, I really think that its time that we take a good look at that article. It has been vandalized numerous times and has things that needs to be updated and/or copyedited...it needs to be cleaned up and get it up to the level of the other major sports in this country.
Benje309 00:36, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:   A time to clean up 

message: What is the name of the green template that marks that an article is in the process of being written? I remember seeing it being used on one of the WikiProject NASCAR articles by one of the WikiProject members. It applies to a discussion that I'm involved in on WikiProject American Open Wheel Racing. Thanks in advance! Royalbroil T : C 13:19, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Work in progress template

message: The category has been merged into its parent category :Category:NASCAR drivers per this CfD discussion. D-Day and Casey expressed concerns about how it impacts other parts of this WikiProject. Would you give a detailed explanation of the exact problem so someone can attempt to repair it? Royalbroil T : C 21:01, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Category:Former NASCAR drivers

message: *Only a little of his racing was NASCAR-sanctioned, but NASCAR Modified fans should recognize that Dutch Hoag was one of the most notable modified drivers.  I'm starting a draft article at User:Barno/Dutch_Hoag.  Please come and improve the article or suggest sources.  When it's decent I'll move it into article-space.  Barno 23:29, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: *Article moved into article space at Dutch Hoag.  Barno 01:06, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dutch Hoag 

message: I've recently created :Category:1950 in motor racing - :Category:1968 in motor racing. So, feel free to add any relevant articles or subcategories into these new categories. -- DH85868993 12:24, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  19xx in motor racing categories