Talk:FC Bayern Munich/Archive 1

message: Does anyone know the letters for Austria. I thought it was AUS but that's Australia as you see in the reserve squad list. Kingjeff 01:30, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: AUT - . The complete list of countries can be found here: ISO 3166-1, I just dicovered that yesterday with Salihamidzic in Bosnia/Herzegovina. Poulsen 09:26, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  '''Austrian flag''' 

message: I've moved this article from FC Bayern Munich back to Bayern Munich, where it has mostly been for a long time. Wikipedia conventions are to use either official names, or most common English names, whichever is most appropriate. Bayern Munich is the name universally used in English, and Bayern München (or more completely FC Bayern München) is the official name in German. Either of these would be appropriate as far as I am concerned, but FC Bayern Munich makes no sense, as it combines the "FC" prefix from the official German name with the English form "Bayern Munich". — sjorford++ 10:57, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's wrong. FC Bayern Munich is the official english name of the club. That's why I moved the page to that title. check the official english homepage of FC Bayern Munich: . Please move the article back to FC Bayern Munich (proper official names should be prefered over common informal names in this encyclopedia imo).--BSI 16:45, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article title 

message: If so then someone should add info about it..
thanks -Anthony- 11:00, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Do they have a mascot? 

message: Anybody not okay with me archiving up to this point? I will not archive 'Article title' as I think it is still useful and 'Do they have a mascot?' as it is still recent. I'll do it in a week from now. OdinFK (talk) 09:58, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Archive 3 

message: Who is this guy? And why should he be part of the roster? According to  he isn't. Last thing I heard was that Dreher plays for another year. --jaellee 09:53, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Thomas Kraft 

message: There is a new task force related to Bayern Munich. Anyone interested can come here and check it out. Kingjeff 23:08, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Task force 

message: Added a possible image of next years formation, it is possible and based on their history. Go to http://www.football-lineups.com/ to see. Dpool2002 23:31, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lineup 

message: ===Compliments===
Please use a level 4 header which means using 4 of = on each side of the header. Kingjeff 12:57, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Compliments and criticisms for the Good article nomination 

message: Please use a level 4 header which means using 4 of = on each side of the header. Kingjeff 12:57, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Compliments

message: Please use a level 4 header which means using 4 of = on each side of the header. Kingjeff 12:57, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Criticisms

message: why were some players removed? can they be put back in please, where are the kovac brothers?? they were an integral part of the team.
First of all, I don't think the Kovac brothers were on there to begin with. Second of all, not every single player is a famous past player. Kingjeff 21:00, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  famous past players 

message: * The lead para is too short. When was the club formed? who formed it?
* "Bayern Munich is Germany's foremost football club" - pick your issue (1) violates Show, don't tell policy (2) POV statement. either ways, this phrase is not required
* 'FACT' tag needs to be resolved
* Is there a reason why "history" section is third section. I would like it to be the first section
* Bayern Munich was founded in 1900 by members of a Munich gymnastics club." - how many? what was the main reason
* "Bayern's first success came in 1926" - jumping from 1900 to 1926 directly does'nt look good. how did the club hold-off for 25 years?
* the entire history section has just one reference. in fact, the entire article has just 3 references. more needs to be done to validate each of these statements
* the article needs copy-edits in almost all section. sample of sentences that will have issues during GA/FA reviews:
** "Sensationally, they made it to the Bundesliga in 1999, and managed to stay in the top flight for a second season."
** "These days Bayern considers itself a national club,"
** "has become something of a thorn, but for the most part for Bayern, the real rivals these days are the great clubs of Europe"
** "However, most of the actual power is exercised by another former player, Uli Hoeness, who is officially deputy chairman of the executive board of the AG; his position is best described as general manager"
** "Bayern Munich have been in a busy mood during the summer, as they seek to build a stronger team."
** "On what is reported to be a summer spending spree, Bayern have proven that they can compete financially with the wealthy European teams, with outstanding profit during a losing campaign and a completely different approach to transfer markets. All in all, their spending spree on all their winter and summer signings amount to an estimated $94 million."
* The history section has 2 paras on signings after the 2006/07 season - something that could have been dealt elsewhere
* How can you have "famous players" of the past without wikipages for them
* Please add timelines for former managers
* Please add a para on the stats rather than have a header and a link to another article
* How can the first captain of BM not have a wikipage
The article has good content but lacks in references and writing skills and hence the article gets a 'failed GA' for now. Lot more work is required before the article gets GA/FA. Once these comments are worked on, please ping me and i shall be glad to evaluate the revised page. --Kalyan 18:06, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  GA review comments 

message: I'm pretty sure Luca Toni hasn't switched nationality.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.23.201.181 (talk) 16:51, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  All the players are brazillian... this has to be a bug. 

message: FC Hollywood is another nickname for FC Bayern. It is not one the Munich fans would like to use themselves but everyone in Germany with a slight interest in football knows to whom this nick refers to. Is a nick of this type supposed to be listed? OdinFK (talk) 07:11, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  FC Hollywood 

message: How does it make sense to have a section for noted players which refers to past players only and a section for notable past players. Also the noted players section is so short, that it feels more like a trivia section. Actually considering the content of the noted players section it should probably be a section for honours won by individual munich players.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by OdinFK (talk • contribs) 07:20, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Noted Players vs. Notable Past Players 

message: I heard he joined Bayern Munich. How come he isnt on the page?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.122.246.229 (talk) 05:53, 7 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Joseph Nwgenya 

message: I just added, that the article meets the following criteria for a B-class article:
2 (reasonably covers the topic): I think the article is actually quite comprehensive. As I'm new to the community I have no experience with such things, but I think it might be good enough for GA in this criterium. I discuss these things in more detail in the next section though.
3 (defined structure): In recent days I did some rework on the structure but essentially the article has a section for everything of major importance about the club:
-The introduction is nice if you want a very quick general overview over the club.
-The history is quite comprehensive. Still expandable but that's probably better for the history-article
-The stadium part could have some more words about the Bayern premises at the very beginning, but other than that I find it sufficient
-The club and its vicinity also covers club culture, which is quite natural as it is not easily distinguishable. Actually the amount of info covered is just right for a section. I wonder if one could find an even better name, though.
-Organization and finance seems to be quite short to me, but it definitely covers the important things.
-Amateur Sports might get a few additional info but not much. The big other departments are covered in other articles (women's department is still missing) and the minor departments don't need a lot of coverage I guess.
-Training facility is the part which I'm most unsure about. Just comes to my mind that one could probably have a section about "Bayern Premises" with subsections "stadium", "training facilities", "club center" or so. The club center is actually not covered at all.
-Honours is not exactly beatyful but it serves the purpose (for now...).
-Players is just data (which is fine), but really good in my opinion.
-Coaches covers what there is to cover.
-Presidents is the one section where I'm not sure whether it should be in the article at all. It is really not that importent and most names don't have articles anyway. Seems to be rather useless data for most people. A table in the statistics section should suffice.
-Captains could be a subsection of the players' section. It seems to be quite lonely there at the end.
-For the statistics part I don't miss anything which I would want to have in the main article.
5 (appropriate supporting material): There are a few pictures I think would enrich the article but those would suffice for FA and are not available at the moment: Team photo (with recent trophies if possible), coaching staff photo (there is one on the FCB site, I'm not sure whether that can be taken due to rights issues; I really have no idea there), captain's photo (when the new captain is announced).
1 (citations): There are some, a lot more than before actually. Sufficient for B-class? I guess so but second opinion would be nice.
4 (grammatics): I'm not a native speaker. I think it's fine but anyway can a native pls check that?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by OdinFK (talk • contribs) 13:01, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  added criterions met (2,3,5) 

message: I see that now Ronaldinho is part of the team? I cannot find any rumors anywhere about ronaldinho coming to bayern.TauntingElf (talk) 18:14, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ronaldinho? 

message: In case you're wondering about the status of Stephan Fürstner, too. I copy this from a short conversation between Kingjeff and me:
K: I noticed you reverted a deletion on FC Bayern's wikipedia page. Do we know if Stephan Fürstner has been loaned out to any club like Christian Lell went to FFC Koeln or like Mats Hummels did to Burussia Dortmund?  Kingjeff (talk) 17:48, 21 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Kicker Sonderheft for the 2008-09 season has him as not part of the squad. As the magazin is a high quality source and the Bayern Website says the same, I will remove him from the squad. OdinFK (talk) 10:27, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stephan Fürstner 

message: As it was mentioned two (?) times in the review I'm wondering how to write this, without suggesting unfair treatment.
What happened is: Bayern applied for a license to the Bundesliga, when the Bundesliga was incepted. As the DFB had 46 applications and only 16 slots, some teams would be in the league and other teams would not be. There was no fixed way to qualify, but the DFB had several criteria.
The most important regarding Bayern was, that five clubs from the south would be members of the Bundesliga. As Bayern had finished 3rd in 1962 and 1963 in the Oberliga South, and had also won a German Championship, it would have been the more or less logical conclusion to include Bayern in the Bundesliga. Another the criterium, which the DFB apparently found of major importance, was, that a city should have just one team in the league. As 1860 won the Oberliga South in 1963 the DFB preferred to include 1860 in the Bundesliga, despite the fact that there were several other criteria which would have favoured Bayern.
You cannot really say that this decision was unfair. The DFB decided, trying to do the best for the league. On the other hand it is also wrong to say "Bayern did not qualify", because there was no way to qualify. So what should one write instead of "was denied membership", which is correct but suggesting unfair treatment??
Regards, OdinFK (talk) 17:11, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, given that fuller explanation, how about the following wording: "When the Bundesliga was formed in 1963, five teams from the Obersliga South were admitted. Although Bayern finished third in that year's southern division, another Munich team, 1860 Munich, had won the championship and the DFB preferred not to include two teams from one city." Is that an accurate summary? 4u1e (talk) 16:41, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: For a shorter version (for the lead) I would just say: "Bayern were not selected for the first year of the Bundesliga." 4u1e (talk) 16:42, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The DFB set up a point system which included the final league positions from the last twelve years. The five clubs from the Oberliga Süd with the most points were chosen for the Bundesliga. Bayern wasn´t among the top five so they were left out. --Hullu poro (talk) 14:59, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I would like to have some source for that. The way I depicted the process is quite exactly what Dietrich Schulze-Marmeling writes in "die Bayern". The book is a good source for most stuff, but if you have something better, I would like to change the article accordingly. It is not too different in the end, but still it should be corrected if it is wrong the way it is. OdinFK (talk) 16:25, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: If Hullu Poro's version can be referenced, my original suggestion ('did not qualify for') would be the most appropriate. With an eye to GA, suggest that my second suggestion above ('were not selected' - which can be ref'd, or so I understand) be used for now. 4u1e (talk) 09:25, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

text: Okay. Are you sure, that the ranking was based on the last 12 years? My source says 10. OdinFK (talk) 15:07, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Grüne says that the ranking was based on the last twelve years. --Hullu poro (talk) 15:40, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Denial of access to the Bundesliga 

message: Whoever is thinking about adding Thomas Müller to the squad, as has been done several times now: Please don't! He is not part of the squad. I know that he played against Essen in the DFB-Pokal, but he is part of the second team. He can play for the first team if necessary, but he is not part of it. Thanks, OdinFK (talk) 23:19, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Correction: He played against Erfurt in the DFB Pokal and he also was subbed in against Hamburg on Day 1 of the Bundesliga. Just saying. Madcynic (talk) 11:12, 18 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: True. The Bayern squad features just three strikers this season, though: Toni, Klose, and Podolksi. As Toni is injured Müller gets promoted from the second team. He will probably make some games this season, but he is not part of the squad anyway. OdinFK (talk) 11:25, 18 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Thomas Müller 

message: Stating the Ultra scene is well-organised is only half of the truth.The club fights Schickeria on all costs. Members of SM are not allowed to get season tickets.Never heard that anywhere else,so without telling more about it one could think SM is welcome at the club. -Lemmy- (talk) 20:47, 24 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Supporters 

message: I know there was a discussion about the reserve players being on the senior team roster and as far as I can see on the main article, they are not included. So why are they listed on the squad template? Hubschrauber729 (talk) 06:17, 11 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Squad template 

message: Hi Wiggy!
Are you sure that the full official name is "Fussball-Club Bayern München e.V."? Though I find it hard to dig up some real good evidence, the name really seems to be "FC Bayern München e.V.". While the "FC" is obviously shorthand for "Fußballclub" I think that only the short version "FC" is part of the club name, making it "FC Bayern München e.V.". Even if I'm wrong on that part I still suppose, that the name is "Fußballclub" and not "Fussball-Club". If you have better sources please drop a link. Anybody else is obviously welcome, too.
Thanks and Regards, OdinFK (talk) 11:04, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Grüne's Vereinslexikon gives "Fußball-Club", which is the common usage throughout the country for "FC" (i.e. Fußball-Club Bayern München e.V.). That reference provides the official full name for each team that it lists as well as the club's common and historical names. I'll have to scan and post a typical club listing so everyone can see what's what. This weekend sometime .... Wiggy! (talk) 11:43, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Club Name 

message: Hi!
The honours section gets kind of crowded with all those friendly honours and youth championships, etc. Wouldn't it be preferable to put the full honour list into another article (I would do it if you agree)? These local and friendly honours are not really that notable and should not be in the main FCB article in my opinion. I think it is done quite well in the Real Madrid article although I don't know whether Runners-up should really be considered an honour. Would you?
Also I wonder if the number of honours really warrants its own article. Right now I would move the stuff into an new section in the FC Bayern Munich statistics article. OdinFK (talk) 13:14, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I think honours would be too small of an article. I would put everything into a new section inFC Bayern Munich statistics while keeping the the Bundesliga trophies, DFB Cup trophies European Cup, UEFA Cup trophy and Cup Winners' Cup trophy in the main article. Kingjeff (talk) 19:42, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. (Hope you don't mind me indenting you, Kingjeff) Madcynic (talk) 20:07, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem at all. Kingjeff (talk) 20:17, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. Added a real introduction, too. OdinFK (talk) 07:29, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Honours 

message: Is it true that Kahn and Effenberg were joint captains from 1999-2002? I did some looking up and could not find anything about it. Any sources, or does anybody at least think he remembers this having been so? Also do the former captains really belong into the article? The article is already cluttered with statistics and tables, especially towards the end. And finally is it a good idea to assign the Hall of Famers to more or less random decades? Despite the obvious shortcomings of that approach I don't see any real advantage to that at a mere 15 players in the Hall of Fame. OdinFK (talk) 07:03, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Captains 

message: Hi,
could someone maybe make a new third shirt? It isnt white/red anymore.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.171.96.225 (talk) 16:31, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  2010 shirts 

message: Hi, I'd like to nominate this article for FA in the not too distant future. Comparing FC Bayern Munich to other club FAs it apparently needs some restructuring, though. It is not that I think each club FA needs to be identical or even closely similar in structure. The Bayern article has some highly unusual sections, though, and when I think about it, other articles probably don't have these section because they don't really belong into a very good article. While the article will not change fundamentally it is still kind of a major overhaul and I thought to discuss that here first. So what do I think has to change?
*It is generally unusual to have a "Recent seasons" section in the article. I even remember somebody critizising this article for that, but I don't remember when it was. Anyway, a link to the seasons article is probably more adequate. The data is rather ephemeral and the interested reader can easily be directed to the list with the full information. It also removes a table from the article (and many wp-articles are table-heavy anyway; this one is no exception) 
*The captains should be moved into the Bayern Munich statistics article. That one should probably cleaned up, too, but that is a different story. I don't really see how this helps the casual reader and it is yet another table in the article.
*Notable past players then would go handily into the Players section.
*Colours and Crest sections should be merged. While these sections could have a bit more information they are basically okay right now I suppose. Only this two short paragraph Crest section is a bit pathetic and if both sections were merged we had a fine section which were thematically coherent, too (see Norwich_City_F.C.#Colours_and_Crest).
*Training facility. Does this really belong in the club article? Right now I don't know where to put it otherwise, but to me this seems to be marginal information.
*Other sports. I know I created that one, but I don't really think the way this information is presented right now is adequate. Especially the number of players is highly ephemeral and I don't see how it enlightens the reader. On the other hand I think if those other departments are presented the reader should have a grasp of how big they are. So just mention the number of teams? Any other suggestions?
*The last part of the history section needs some rewriting. I don't think this is very controversial because that part is overfull with recent data just like so many other articles.
I think some of these things could be explained better, but --apologies-- I just don't really know how right now. Although it is not your duty to figure my ideas aout, I hope you get what I mean. Does anybody oppose or have some suggestions? Regards, OdinFK (talk) 20:55, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually the "Charity" section is totally unusual, too. I don't know whether other clubs participate in charitable activities (i guess so), but it doesn't seem to be as marginal as several of the other sections. This should have an impact on how the club is perceived by someone reading the article. So in my opinion this information is relevant enough to stay. OdinFK (talk) 09:44, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Restructuring towards FA 

message: Why is Jean-Marie Pfaff nowhere mentioned?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.241.13.38 (talk) 21:04, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Where would you like Jean-Marie Pfaff to be mentioned? He's not a current player so he can't be added there. The section on Notable past players clearly indicates that it is the list of players in the FC Bayern Munich Hall of Fame which can be found at the club's hall of fame page. Feel free to press the club into adding him to the hall of fame. In the intervening time, you might want to add him to the list of FC Bayern Munich players. With 156 appearances, he qualifies for addition to that page. Unless he did something outstanding for the club, I can't see him being listed in the prose sections. So where would you suggest we add Pfaff? --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:29, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jean-Marie Pfaff 

message: is the club's official name.  The article title should really reflect this. — [Unsigned comment added by Sueisfine (talk • contribs) 17:10, 25 April 2010.]
:the club uses the name "FC Bayern Munich", so that's the official english name. It's a topic that has been discussed in the past, accompanied by various page moves, eventually leading to the solution used now (official english name used as article name, official german name mentioned in brackets).--BSI (talk) 15:42, 25 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Since no one else has weighed-in I'll back BSI's comments and point out that when an acceptable exonym exists it should be used. In this case, that would be FC Bayern Munich. However, we could use () after the English subject name has been defined. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 18:58, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Something similar was already in the lead. I modified it to use the language template. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 19:00, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  FC Bayern München 

message: What is the rationale behind deleting the ongoing results? I don't understand why it's being repeatedly removed. If it's bad, fix it, but don't delete it. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:18, 27 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The rationale is, that the history section is there to cover precisely that: The 'History' of the club. Match by match coverage of the ongoing season is not what is supposed to go in there. That's what the season articles are for. OdinFK (talk) 11:24, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  But once a match has been played isn't it history? --Walter Görlitz (talk) 12:19, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure is. Everything that has happened is history if you care to use this definition of the word. But to go to the extreme, you sure don't want to have every line up Bayern had in friendlies in 1912 in the main article. On the other hand that Bayern made it to the Champions League final this season definitely belongs into the history section in the main article. While I don't think that each intermediate result belongs in there,  which occurrence is significant enough is open for discussion of course. OdinFK (talk) 17:27, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  What was being added was current and informative. After the campaign is over, a shorter paragraph can be crafted. I have done this myself for my local club. However, simply deleting the information as it is added is, I feel, heavy-handed and should not continue. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:47, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Often the additions are written in a bad style and the spelling is horrible. I admit that I'm not always in the mood of doing extensive corrections, especially if I think that the added information is to detailed anyway. --Jaellee (talk) 20:28, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Then fix it, don't simply delete it. Currently there is no information regarding their Champtions League final berth. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 20:48, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think so. What about On the 27 April 2010, Bayern beat Olympique Lyonnais 3-0 after winning 1-0 in the first leg. That result sent Bayern to the UEFA Champions League Final 2009-10.? (I fixed a typo and the date in the meantime.) --Jaellee (talk) 22:00, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Champions League results 

message: Bayern are not yet champions. They have a lead of 3 points and 17 goals (see here) and I agree that it is very unlikely that they lose the championship, but it is theoretically still possible. So please refrain from adding the championship yet. --Jaellee (talk) 20:16, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. My mistake. Totally forgot that there is a slim possibility of placing second. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 20:49, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Champions 2009–10 

message: Rensing and Görlitz (no relation) will be released at the end of the month. However, until then they are still members and should stay on the roster. That is also the case on the official roster site. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 14:46, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: While it's disappointing to see someone who shares my family name be cut from my second-favourite team, we cannot cut them from the roster until the source removes them. I have seen many news sources indicating that they will be cut as of today, but we must follow Wikipedia rules on sources. I will not revert any removal though even if the source doesn't show it. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 18:16, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Release at end of contract 

message: The first sentence in the article currently is "FC Bayern Munich" redirects here." That doesn't really make sense. FC Bayern Munich doesn't redirect anywhere, because this is the very article named "FC Bayern Munich". "Bayern Munich redirects here" would make more sense. I mean it's just nitpicking, but I wonder if there is a policy on this kind of statements and what it would be. For comparison, if you visit Real Madrid C.F. they use the formulation that makes sense. Well, I just saw it and to say that again, it's nitpicking, but shouldn't we change that? OdinFK (talk) 20:30, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The article used to be called FC Bayern München and FC Bayern Munich redirected to it. Since the page was moved, no one has noticed. I'm sorry. I also added links to the women's team, second team, and junior team. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:42, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  FC Bayern Munich redirects here 

message: there now appears to be two different halls of fame. One at http://www.fcbayern.t-home.de/en/company/club/hall_of_fame/index.php and the other at http://www.fcbayern.t-home.de/de/verein/ev/hall_of_fame/index.php I don't mind going with the German hall, but we have to change the reference. And then we have the problem that it's not an English link, but on a German club article, that's to be expected. Perhaps wording to indicate that both exist but that the German hall will be more up-to-date than the English translation. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 23:50, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  HALL OF FAME 

message: FC Bayern Munic will sign Manuel Neuer from FC Schalke 04 to replace Hans-Jörg Butt as the starting goal keeper. He has agreed to a five year deal and is undergoing medical examination at Bayern Munic as of June 1st 2011. He becomes the second summer signing after the club previously agreed a three-year pact with Rafinha. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arun1151 (talk • contribs) 
He's actually #3. Nils Petersen signed on May 19. All transfers are official on July 1. Kingjeff (talk) 19:47, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Manuel Neuer to Bayern Munic 

message: The current squad listing can be found here.  Aside from the changes that will go into effect on July 1 (Neuer, Ott, Rafinha, etc.) the article here is current to June 30, 2011.  Please wait until July 1, 2011 (even if it's 12:00:01am in New Zealand) before changing the squad.  That seems to be the current consensus and is why the page is protected.  Thank you.  <B>Erikeltic</B> (Talk) 21:16, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current squad 

message: On June 7th former Schalke 04 goalkeeper, Manuel Neuer signed a five year deal with Bayern.
Hawksku999 (talk) 15:28, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: , and article protected to prevent more edit warring. Feezo (send a signal | watch the sky) 17:12, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request from Hawksku999, 9 June 2011 

message: please add manuel neuer, rafinha and nils petersen to the squad, as well as taking out miroslav klose, thomas kraft, hamit altintop and andreas ottl from the squad
186.85.136.72 (talk) 13:51, 19 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: These transfers do not take affect until 1 July, as stated above. Sir Sputnik (talk) 13:58, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

text: Not done: pending consensus for the change. — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 13:05, 20 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request from 186.85.136.72, 19 June 2011 

message: New Transitions In Team, Current Squad Need To Be Changed.
Engineer-Ibrahim (talk) 20:45, 23 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The squad changes do not take effect until July 1, 2011.  Please see above for more information.  <B>Erik the Red</B> (Talk) 21:15, 23 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request from Engineer-Ibrahim, 23 June 2011 

message: I think I know what's going on even though no summaries are being left by either editor. In German, the field is known as "Olympiastadion" which in English is "Olympic Stadium". There's no need to differentiate it from Berlin's because it's understood as the one in Munich because of its location to the club. However, in English, that association isn't immediately obvious and so it's best to leave the city's name in as an adjective. However, as a compromise I would suggest ". I would even edit the paragraph to read "Bayern has played its home games in the Allianz Arena since the beginning of the 2005–06 season, Bayern plays its home games in the Allianz Arena. For the 33 years prior, they played in the city's Olympic Stadium." --Walter Görlitz (talk) 02:18, 24 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Olympiastadion München 

message: I would just like to be informed what determined whether a team with a city which has a different name in their own language than in English, will be referred to with the city name of the language of origin or city name in english?
I understand why Moscow are being used since they are using a completely different alphabet and that AC Milan and Genoa CFC is actually called that for historical reasons even in Italy despite the cities being named Milano and Genova there, but what are the reason behind the following:
Use of the English name of the city:
 Bayern Munich (instead of München) 
F.C. Copenhagen (instead of København)
Use of the name of the city from the language of Origin: 
Napoli (instead of Naples)
FC Köln (instead of Cologne)
AS Roma (instead of Rome) 
Sevilla (instead of Seville)
IFK Göteborg (instead of Gothenburg)
To me it seems that as long as a team is not from a country that has a completely different alphabet (and by that I do not mean only a few extra letters) or a club is actually named after the english name, the most common is to use the name of the city from the country of origin, but Bayern München and F.C. København seems to be an exception from this?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Neberu (talk • contribs) 15:07, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Unlike the clubs listed above, Bayern Munich have localized exonyms while the clubs listed above don't and use the endonyms. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:41, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nomenclature 

message: --212.139.252.54 (talk) 03:39, 16 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Conspiracy theories have no place in an encyclopedia. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 04:01, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

text: Sure it did. Do you have any news reports to back this? --Walter Görlitz (talk) 20:02, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/latest-news/top-stories/a-history-of-leeds-united-violence-1-2171900# --Boogiejuice (talk) 08:26, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  Wonderful. Since it's "A history of Leeds United violence" save it for the Leeds article not this one. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 18:40, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

text: But this article is about the senior mens club, not about individual matches or the supporters of other teams. Sorry you don't see that. I'll see if others in the football project agree by alerting them. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 19:20, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  It also appears that you're directly copying material from sources such as  which is a copyright violation. Feel free to paraphrase the material, but don't lift it directly. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 20:44, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  Now I see copyright violations from here as well. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 20:46, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  direct quotes are not copyright violations.--Boogiejuice (talk) 21:17, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  True. But you were copying and pasting more than just direct quotes as the links show. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:25, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

text: Now. But not here and not here, which was an earlier edit. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:34, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  thanks for correcting me, the previous posts were far more interesting and only well known facts.--80.42.150.162 (talk) 14:59, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infamous 1975 European Cup Victory causes riots in Paris. 

message: It's the case that Norwich City F.C. were the only English team to beat Bayern at the Olympic Stadium.  However, is it not also the case that, at the time of writing, they remain the only English team to beat Bayern at home?  Has any English team yet beaten Bayern at the Allianz Arena?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.141.33.138 (talk) 23:06, 27 April 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: According to UEFA, no: http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=1789583.html --Jaellee (talk) 22:27, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: as of now, arsenal did in 2012-13, chelsea drew them/won after penalties (though at "neutral allianz arena" in the final), 04/05 was still played at the olympiastadion. (not counting friendlies). bolton drew them in munich in 07-08 uefa cup group stage. 92.196.61.124 (talk) 17:49, 8 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  History 

message: As far as I see, FC Hollywood is an ironic title the FC Bayern had in the past. Even if you may hear it now and then, it is neither a nickname in the strict sense nor is it current. -- Zz (talk) 12:59, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: That was the first name by I which I knew it. It may be pejorative, but it was commonly used in the 70s. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:15, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text:  you don't believe that yourself do you? even now that name is almost never used. every once in a while in the yellow press, not in the football context. you could equally well use "scheiss-bayern" as a nickname, it's used even more frequently than fc hollywood. still noone would consider it a nickname. 92.196.61.124 (talk) 17:51, 8 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nicknames 

message: Bayern-Real Madrid games are not the most played matches in CL any more, Milan-Barcelona has played 15 games, as of this season.78.133.15.67 (talk) 10:10, 19 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rivalries section 

message: Allianz recently made a purchase for EUR110. Now the shares are: members 75%, audi/adidas/allianz all 8.33%
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/insurance/10632357/Allianz-takes-8pc-stake-in-Bayern-Munich-football-club.html
Utopial (talk) 15:58, 23 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Ownership needs updating

message: Page states "FC Bayern is currently second in UEFA's club coefficient rankings", but the list at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_coefficient#UEFA_Team_Ranking states that they are third.
Sk8r2000 (talk) 18:01, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: A proper reference would be www.uefa.com/memberassociations/uefarankings/club/season=2014/index.html. Walter Görlitz (talk) 18:59, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: It depend on what list you go after. On UEFA coefficient article we use reliable Kassiesa which immediately adds bonus points for reaching next step in competition while the UEFA source hands them out at the end of the season. UEFA are also very slow to make updates and often dont update at all at the beginning of the tournament. QED237 (talk) 23:02, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I would say the besdt is probably to remove "currently" and change after every season like "after 2012-13 season BM was ranked as second team in UEFA coefficient ranking". Especially sine "currently" imposes this being updated regurlarly on wikipedia and that is not the case. Perhaps it can even take years before it gets updated next time. QED237 (talk) 23:05, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Done. There hasn't been any objection to Qed237's suggestion in three days, so I have implemented it, after copy editing it a little. If anyone is unhappy with the wording, just let me know and I can change it. — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 03:17, 24 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Protected edit request on 21 March 2014 

message: Julian Green's nationality should be changed from German to American.
70.162.49.233 (talk) 03:51, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. --Mdann52talk to me! 08:33, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 27 March 2014 

message: I just reffed the latest change in "FIFA Nationality" for Julian Green. So his entry is accurate as of today. But the "Current as of" cite at the top claims the list is current as of yesterday, based on a retieval of a team website retrieved in October 12th.  Given how often this subsection would need to be updated to keep it current (i.e. nearly every day.) I think the whole "Current as of" heading should be deleted.  It can rarely be considered reliably accurate unless someone checks the team web page daily. What do others think? David in DC (talk) 18:50, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Changing the heading to "First team squad" and keep the as-of date seems reasonable. Mentoz86 (talk) 19:19, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

text: First of all he has said he wants to change teams but ut has not been done yet, an application will have to be sent in to FIFA first and that will be done the upcoming weeks. And by "we" it is WP:Footy that always uses the FIFA nationality which is defined as the team the player last played for, and Green most recently played for Germany. It was the exactly same ase for Diego Costa a few weeks ago when he made his debut for Spain. QED237 (talk) 23:22, 18 March 2014 (UTC)

text: It isn't official. When he stops onto the field for the US Mens National Team, that's when we change his nationality, not when he purportedly applies to have his nationality changed. Walter Görlitz (talk) 02:39, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

text: At the time I write this, I had only see one reference, at the subject's article, of a rumour supplied by ESPN that he had provided the change. No other support existed. :WP:AGF. Walter Görlitz (talk) 14:58, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

text: Yes seriously. If you're not familiar with the concept of time I could explain it to you. And further to the idea that he should now be considered an American, I can't remember when it was, but FIFA has turned down the request to transfer on a handful of occasions. I doubt that this will be one of those though. Regardless, we don't indicate citizenship until the player plays for the side. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:49, 19 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Fifa.com is using a US flag. Is that not official? Julian Green - fifa.com--24.253.243.188 (talk) 02:45, 19 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  No. They have used that since he was born there. Until he plays for a senior national men's team it will remain at the birth nation. Walter Görlitz (talk) 02:57, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

text: No. He hasn't played for them yet. When he actually gets minutes in a competitive match we may change it. Just to clarify there are several points in that sentence. He has to play during (minutes on the field, even as a substitute, it's not acceptable for him to be on the bench during a match) the USMNT, (although a junior US side would also qualify) in a FIFA-recognized competitive match (not a friendly, not a training match, not an inter-squad game). I believe that this was alluded to above if not outright stated. Essentially, if he shatters his legs tomorrow (not that I wish that on him, it's just a scenario) and it ends his playing career, he'll be recognized as a German since he did not meet the requirements for being recognized as a German. At least that's my understanding. Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:28, 24 March 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  So if he plays against Mexico on the 2nd that won't count either because it's a friendly? Is the World Cup the next matches that could qualify?--24.253.243.188 (talk) 16:39, 24 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current squad? 

message: I think it should be mentioned that some fans of the club has been recognized in media for taking a stance against extreme right politics (racism, antisemitism) and discrimination against homosexuals. I know this is a controversial topic. Therefore I simply suggest an edit.
The latest news:
http://www.tz.de/sport/fc-bayern/suedkurve-fc-bayern-klaren-botschaften-gegen-rechte-hooligans-meta-4341075.html
Additional sources:
http://www.abendzeitung-muenchen.de/inhalt.fc-bayern-gegen-nazis-und-rassismus.bbe5522b-444f-4ad0-a75b-2aabcf008c4b.html
http://www.sueddeutsche.de/muenchen/ultra-fans-des-fc-bayern-im-zweifel-rot-1.2107815
http://www.abendzeitung-muenchen.de/inhalt.gedenken-an-ehrenpraesident-kurt-landauer-fc-bayern-zeichen-gegen-antisemitismus.e95a2e45-0598-4032-8821-d364068c36c5.html
/EriFr (talk) 13:03, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fans recognized for stance against extreme right politics (racism, antisemitism) and discrimination against homosexuals 

message: The last paragraph of the intro currently reads "After the 2012–13 season, FC Bayern was ranked second in UEFA's club coefficient rankings[12] and first in IFFHS's IFFHS Club World Ranking." Do we want to keep this? Having the ranking after the 2012-13 season in the intro feels very arbitrary to me. I don't know if we want to have anything like this in the intro at all, but if we do, then it should be either the ranking after the last completed season (2013-14) or the current ranking, right? OdinFK (talk) 21:49, 7 January 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  UEFA / IFFHS ranking in the intro section 

message: What defines a "historical kit"? SLBedit (talk) 08:38, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Historical kits 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on FC Bayern Munich. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20080815023121/http://www.fcbayern.t-home.de:80/en/company/club/other_sports/index.php to http://www.fcbayern.t-home.de/en/company/club/other_sports/index.php
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I just want all the senior bayern munich players to be listed.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eosunde7143 (talk • contribs) 14:41, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: We should always follow the sources which in this case is the squad list at Bayern Munich homepage. Qed237 (talk) 15:08, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bayern Munich 

message: I have some confusion as to why my edits keep on getting reversed.  Fabian Benko, Milos Pantovic and Philip Steinhart do not play for FC Bayern Munich.  They play for FC Bayern II and FC Bayern Youth (Benko).  As for the other three, they are officially on FC Bayern professional contracts, but they have been "demoted" as per the footnote.  Those three don't practice with FC Bayern and are only permitted to do so when they are "recalled" which is only in the situation of injury.  If you'll notice the footnotes, this is all explained.  Then someone comes along and posts a footnote from Bundesliga.de that lists the roster.  However, this is inaccurate information.  That is a list of all that have at any point been given a jersey and dressed for a game.  They do not play for Bayern, rather Bayern II or lower and have been given a "try-out" deal to promote them.  
This is analogous to the way the NHL runs contracts.  There are several players that have pro contracts, but have been demoted to the farm club.  As an example, the NY Rangers and the Hartford Wolfpack.  Players are recalled for injury, but otherwise play for the Wolfpack.  They may have a Rangers contract, but receive a different salary when called up to play in the NHL.  
There is no reason to misinform the general public about "first team" players when it is well documented that none of the following are permanent fixtures on the "first team" of FC Bayern:
Lucic
Steinhart
Pantovic
Green
Kurt
Benko
Gaudino
Again, I only see this as a misrepresentation of the facts. In the spirit of keeping Wiki fully accurate, I recommend these individuals be removed from the "First Team" listing as it is simply not accurate.
Furthermore, the three footnotes at the top of the section misdirect readers to different theories/explanations.  It's not standardized and not congruent.  It's contradictory to say the very least.  FC Bayern site says one thing, AZ says three have been demoted, and Bundesliga.de shows all that have dressed.  
Clarification is much appreciated.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.58.72.94 (talk) 02:24, 19 November 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: It is that they have dressed for the senior side that explains why some editors have added them to the senior roster, and they have done it with references. I'll let other editors determine if they should be listed here on the first team roster. You have not provided specific references which is why I would revert such removal of content. Not explaining why the edits are being made is another reason why I would revert edits. Walter Görlitz (talk) 05:07, 19 November 2015 (UTC)

text: They are sourced and have been in the squad this season which normally supports the inclusion of the players. As affects all football articles, I suggest that you can inform Wikipedia:WikiProject Football about this discussion to see if more editors have something to say about this. About blocks I have given you a message at your talkpage on how it works, and I have just given you standard warnings and not any personal attacks. Sorry if you feel that I have been attacking you in any way. Qed237 (talk) 13:31, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  FC Bayern Roster edits 

message: Work this out without edit warring, please. --NeilN talk to me 21:36, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Fully protected, 4 days

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on FC Bayern Munich. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20120829215815/http://www.dfb.de:80/index.php?id=512334&no_cache=1&action=showDay&lang=D&liga=dfbpokm&saison=12&saisonl=2012&spieltag=6&cHash=bd6b659e9564f537931dda472ddfdf1e to http://www.dfb.de/index.php?id=512334&no_cache=1&action=showDay&lang=D&liga=dfbpokm&saison=12&saisonl=2012&spieltag=6&cHash=bd6b659e9564f537931dda472ddfdf1e
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Does anybody know when Bayern adopted Mia san mia as a slogan for the club? I don't remember them using it in the 90s. It was probably pushed in the mid 2000s, but I couldn't say when. I ask because the slogan is not mentioned even once in the article despite the club marketing it quite aggressively. No matter what you think of the slogan, not mentioning it is just wrong (or an oversight) in my opinion.
A fortunate coincidence might be if it was adopted around the beginning of the Schweinsteiger/Lahm/Ribery/Robben era. The history section is getting unwieldy, especially the last subsection of it. Seperating it between the ending of the Kahn/Effenberg/Scholl era and the beginning of the Lahm etc era would make sense. This would make the whole section more manageable and the Kahn/Effenberg/Scholl era subsection might be cleaned up some more to get it closer to an actual history section instead of an in-text listing of titles. OdinFK (talk) 11:47, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I personally think that it's not worth mentioning. It's just marketing, nothing else. Every company has such slogans and usually they getting changed by time. There is nothing substantial behind it. DrunkenGerman (talk) 13:59, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with that only partly. The slogan might be pure marketing, but in the very least it says something about how the club likes to be seen/sees itself. I am also not aware that they had such a slogan before, so at this point we cannot really say that Bayern changes the slogan all the time. OdinFK (talk) 21:03, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah but it's like every other company slogan. A lot clubs came up with such slogans since the 00s, it's just a sign that their marketing has become more professional. Like every other slogan it's used to communicate a brand's message. DrunkenGerman (talk) 23:10, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: The thing is that "Mia san mia" has long been associated (positively and in criticism) with Bavarian patriotism (or "Mia-san-mia-Bavariandom") apparently long before its association with the FC Bayern...--131.159.76.34 (talk) 15:09, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  ''Mia san mia'' and history section 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I try to be polite about it: A few days ago I edited  the section crest with the following result: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=FC_Bayern_Munich&action=historysubmit&type=revision&diff=816563083&oldid=816561381
User S.A. Julio, forthwith referred to as "Julio", reverted, to boot in an absurd way, including spelling errors.  Please understand, that probably somewhat comepetent users have s/thing better to do than doing Wikipedia 24/7.  
Julio according to his edit thinks, Bayern united from 1906 to 1919 with Jahn, therefore one crest for that period. No, Bayern was with Münchner SC  earlier on, that's where they changed their colours from Bavaría's white and blue to red (and white?). Here you can see the resulting logos.  The 1920 to 1925 stuff there you can forget: they where as such designs for needle you got for 100 matches, and stuff like that. In 1925 - celebrating independence and 25 years they introduced https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bayern_Herb_(1923-1954).png 
That stayed on until 1954 when they introduced the current model, which in between got some cosmetic changes.  Here https://trikotsammlung.wordpress.com/page/2/ and if you know ho2w to search you see the thing going on and on. Yes, there were diffew4ren shirt badges, which however is a different issue (see eg. Germany shirt badge and association crest)/. "Clubzeitung" was the official  journal of the club.  They did not print bliue, because this would have been fat more expensive if you have any idea about printing back then
That's all the time this is still worth  for me.
PS: The Marmeling book cited as source has no ... ing information on the issue.
Oalexander (talk) 13:48, 23 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: I was surprised by both edits: yours and S.A. Julio. There was nothing wrong with original logos and the revert really wasn't well explained either. The logos don't really need to be there at all, and without a thorough discussion of them, they're just pretty pictures. Unless they're something more than that, we should just remove them all. Walter Görlitz (talk) 05:07, 27 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Crests 

message: Really? 1860 is currently (2017/18) playing in Regionalliga (level 4) which is not a professional league. Nevertheless there players are professionals. But which club is number 3? All other Munich football clubs  play in amateur leagues. There is SpVgg Unterhaching in league 3 (in former times in 1. and 2.Bundesliga) but it isn't a Munich team. Unterhaching is a municipalityof its own and not part of Munich.ManfredV (talk) 21:31, 27 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Bayern is one of three professional football clubs in Munich." 

message: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=FC_Bayern_Munich&curid=172326&diff=835939844&oldid=835919735 ? Walter Görlitz (talk) 18:02, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  unexplained removal 

message: Add Bayern's 18-19 3rd kit .Grunthog (talk) 08:39, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kits 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:
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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion