Talk:Plato von Ustinov

message: There seems to be no proof that this person ever existed. There is no information on Google (except for results from this dumb Wikipedia stub). If this is not a fact it must go ASAP. IZAK 03:22, 22 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Ever existed?

message: *Hi, If you do a Google search http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&q=Ustinov%20Park%20Hotel%20Jaffa it gives 410 references.
Among them government sites like http://www.tel-aviv.gov.il/English/Tourism/Sites/AmericanGerman.htm and the best hotels, such as the “Do Park Hotel”, owned by Baron Ustinov (Grandfather of Peter Ustinov, the actor), which was renowned for its large, beautiful garden, where monkeys and parrots roamed free and the archeological museum in it., etc. I can not believe they all lye, although it is probably easier to verify facts from Israel than from Australia. abakharev 03:35, 22 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ustinov Jaffa 

message: Why was this person Israeli? Do we know he lived until 1948? gidonb 02:45, 7 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the website of the Evangelical Beit Immanel group[], which currently runs the old hotel as their "Heritage Centre", his name was Baron Plato von Ustinov and he settled in Jaffa in 1878. Their page about the history of the centre states that "In 1888 Ustinov married Magdalena, the daughter of Hall. Magdalena was born in Ethiopia and together they had four children, their eldest son Joah being the father of actor Peter Ustinov." The page also states that the Ustinovs left Jaffa (and probably Palestine) already in 1913. So, irrespective of what is true or not, this article should not definitely not be part of the "Category:Israeli people stubs" or "Category:Israeli people". Not only had the Ustinovs left more than 30 years before the creation of Israel, but being born-again Christians trying to convert Jews to their form of Christianity, they would have been alien to everything Israel stands for. I'll remove those two category links. Thomas Blomberg 14:05, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Israeli people

message: What happened to his first wife?
-- 84.180.243.159 (talk) 18:14, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Family

message: Much of this article is about the parents of Ustinov's first wife, whom he later divorced.  They may merit their own article, but this article should be about Ustinov, not his in-laws.  Pilch62 (talk) 03:32, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ustinov, not Metzler 

message: The article says :
Ustinov decided in 1875 to convert to Protestantism. He had been baptized as a Russian Orthodox, and being a Russian aristocrat, his conversion would mean losing his estates and status, as all the tsar's Orthodox subjects were forbidden to convert[8]. Ustinov sold his estates to another aristocrat in 1876, before his conversion became known. Queen Olga of Württemberg, herself a Russian Orthodox, arranged for Ustinov to be naturalised in the Kingdom of Württemberg and become a German citizen. His status was confirmed as a Württembergian rank, and he became Freiherr (Baron) von Ustinow.[9]
There are some false data in this paragraph that have to be corrected asap, as :
* In fact, as the Lutherian baptism was accepted by the Russian law at this time as equivalent to the Orthodox one (as many members of the (Germanic) Imperial Dynasty were born Lutherians), so there was no real need to conversion.
* Furthermore, according to the Russian law at the time, children from a wedding with parents having different religions would follow the husband's one, but, in reality, boys were often raised as Orthodox, while the daughters kept their mother's religion.
* All the serves were emancipated In Russia in 1866. So there were no "so-called noble" estates anymore in 1875, and, furthermore, the Russian law regarding nobility always made (since Ekatherina II) a strict distinction between land and its owner's status : Until 1861, a honorary citizen (= State burgherSee [ https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D0%BE%D1%87%D1%91%D1%82%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%B3%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B6%D0%B4%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B5_(%D1%81%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B5)]) or a simple free farmer could freely own an estate and have it cultivated, but only by free people, no serves. 
* The Ustinovy were never ranked as aristocrats, but only as simple nobles, with a very recent commoner background : Their entrance into the hereditary dvaryanstwaRussian nobility. dates back from 1801, when Mikhail A. became a Collegiate assessorSee the table of ranks. to be definitely confirmed as a hereditary noble in 1823See their page in the official Russian Empire Armorial : . .  
* The Ustinovy were never ranked as barons in the Russian nobility, as their official coat of armsSee [ http://gerbovnik.ru/og/v54/1437232479.jpg]., obviously designed for Mikhail Adrianovich Ustinov, clearly shows that the founder of this family was a very wealthy commoner before becoming noble then knighted, while performing important administrative functions For instance, looking at the elements of the shield  :  *A black eagle wing (up, left), symbolizing the State Councillor (granting hereditary nobility ; had to be registered by the Senate)  *A silver star on a blue pannel (up, right), meaning the founder of the family was knighted (Order of Saint Vladimir, which automatically granted hereditary nobility to the knight and his descendants (no special registration was needed there as the newcomer was immediately registered as a knight by the order administration))  *Two crossed golden crops + a golden bee (down, right), usually used as symbols of social success and wealthiness for merchants (lots of ennobled burghers in Russia had such symbols in their coats of arms)  *A simple knight crown topping the shield, but not the typical crest that symbolises the status of baron.... 
So the explanation given here for this conversion seems wrong and should be corrected--Floricord (talk) 11:48, 21 November 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wrong information about Ustinov's conversion to Lutherianism