Talk:Podcast/Archive 7

message: The above IP posted an external link to voices.com, I explained my edit in the notes. Voices.com is based out of London, Canada. Using a quick DNS IP search with that IP shows that the IP originates from, suprise, Canada [City: London, Ontario]. Testerer 02:21, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  RE: 129.100.67.169 and the Voices.com link removed 

message: I have proposed I Wikiproject for podcasting.  If you're interested, make sure to add your name unser 'interested users'.  The list is in alphabetical order, so jsut scroll down to see.Ganfon 20:18, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Podcasting Wikiproject 

message: For the longest time there's been some internal copy that has been helpful for people to avoid listing the hundreds upon hundreds of Podcasting Directories within this article that is merely intended to tell people about what podcasting is. 
  	Please do not add links to individual podcasts, podcast software, podcast cons or podcast directories (including Podcast Alley). Links should only be here if they help explain *what* podcasting is. External links should explain podcasting in more depth or from a different angle than Wikipedia can, they should not simply be a repeat of this article.
I really agree with this statement, I think others do also, so I think it is fair to restucture the external links accordingly. I think it would be a big mess if there were tons of directories included in this article. itunes isn't listed, I think that is a good thing because you don't have to understand itunes to know what podcasting is and how it work, which this article explains pretty clearly. Any comments or concerns, would be glad to discuss it. It did recently strike me that someone may read the subsection of the external links titled Lists of Podcast Directories. This may be a bit confusing as it is intended to list actual lists of directories. Directories of Directories, if you will. Not links to one specific directory. I'll try and explain it better in subtext. Testerer 07:10, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please read carefully, RE: Podcast Dirs in Ext Links 

message: This article is one that people love to vandalize and edit based on their feelings, and often emotions. One of the oldest arguments around the term "podcast" has been its Etymology. Someone recently deleted this line 
"The term "podcast" is derived from Apple Computer's mp3 playback device iPod."
This is in my mind, slightly questionable, but considering popularization, it's probably true, and should be kept. That is why I undeleted it and included it in this edit. I also tried my best to come up with (hopefully ultimate) solution to please everyone, but still be true to both history and reality. I really wish there wasn't a drastic need for people to claim the etymology of this word, but it is very important to accurately reflect the history of the term, and thus, my edit falls back on both nature and the word "pod" itself, no doubt a reason Apple chose the term, it's previously understood meaning. I'd consider this to be a significant edit so I'd be interested in feedback. Have no problem with it's removal, but this always seems to be a hot issue related to this article, the name. Yeah, it's got something to do with the ipod, but because the word or notion of "pod" wasn't created by Apple, I think we have a duty to try and bridge the gap, if you will. So this was what was added.
"However, known synonyms for the word pod are capsule, case, container, hull, husk, shell, and vessel.http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pod#Synonyms A pod is obviously a container of some sort and the idea of broadcasting to a container or pod correctly the describes the process of podcasting.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Podcasting#Mechanics More about the name itself can be found in the History of podcasting article." 
I really tried to reference this section, so much of this article isn't referenced at all, especially any connections to the ipod itself, or other origins. Any thoughts?Testerer 07:20, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent Edits 

message: hi,
there is a new podcast portal, its for hebrew users and it will be nice to get a link to it too.
the url is http://www.icast.co.il
the name of the site is "icast the israeli podcast"
18:20, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  new link 

message: I've seen lots of recent edits, major, unsubstantiated edits that I believe are not helpful to readers.  Please take part of the discussion on the talk page. I'll revert most of the edits that seem arbitrary. Thanks for being a part of the process. As always this is a very popular, often disputed article, so I hope that everyone discusses all major changes thanks! Testerer 05:49, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lotsa Edits, no discussion? 

message: I realize I reverted some edits but wanted to give one more, symbolic example of the problem with the recent edits and "simplification".
"A podcast is a media file, such as audio, that is distributed over the Internet, either through being downloaded like any other file, or to people subscribed to the podcast's feed."
This isn't entirely true at all. What about people who download podcasts through Bit Torrent? This is an example of where attempts at simplifying something will often erase some of the most important details. The 2nd half is also a bit flawed. Subscription and downloading though important, are not ultimately linked. I subscribe to many podcasts and are alerted to when new enclosures are released on each feed, but as a user I get to decide which I download. Because I subscribe does not mean (or anyone else) downloads. Maybe this is the best thing about a podcast? Like a blog you can subscribe and know when something is new, but you can decide to download or not. Of course the automation from Feed -> Computer -> Mobile Device is important, but it is well explained and mentioned already. OK, that is enough for 1 night, I just wanted to give another explanation of why I reverted edits to help others understand. Testerer 06:19, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  One more example 

message: I removed the subsection that discussed the supposed "name controversy" but was only really substantiated by the opinions of one person. All of that Leo centric info can fairly be placed into his article but it really makes a mess of this article. Another thing, the subsection titled 
"Podcast trademark claims and disputes" is also quite uninformative and not really related to Podcasting itself. There might be a need for another article on Podcasting Trademark and Legal Issues, but should the main article, already a bit lengthy, grow with each bit of gossip and every rant that someone goes on. There was no name controversy and readers may not need to know (or care) about what companies allegedly received C&D's for trademark infringement. Any attempts at slimming down some of the excesses in this article would surely be a boon. Testerer 05:31, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed Name Controversy

message: I'm sure theres no way in hell the apple crowd is going to accept this but podcasting refers to broadcasting from a Line6 pod and the term has been around since 1998, the ipod didn't exist until 2001. It's not ipod although I'm sure 99% of all people would be hard to convince otherwise. Pod = 1998 line 6 pod - recording equipment. Mithotyn 03:54, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Except that the domain name was registered in 2002, one year after the arrival of the iPod, and even then, it had no content on it until 2005. Check it out, dude. (2002, 2003 and 2005, respectively.) --MarkKB 08:21, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Origin of term wrong 

message: Does anyone know about new taxes? I've got something here. Should we mention this in the article?--Popopp 18:00, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  taxes 

message: Is a podcast normally just audio alone, or is it video? The article does not say.
It depends on the podcast feed of course. A podcast is really just a way of sending and receiving information.
Testerer 03:31, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article does not say what type of media is usual 

message: I was about to point my listeners to this article for info about podcasts and non-iTunes ways of subscribing and to my horror found that a part of this entry reads more like an ad for iPod/iTunes. I understand the danger of products advertising here but I feel there are at least 5-6 (Nimiq, Juice, Doppler, RSS Radio, iPodderX, AmaroK) established podcatchers that should be listed here. I'd be happy to do it if there are no objections.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dominiklukes (talk • contribs) 10:34, August 24, 2007 (UTC) 
Ok, I went ahead and did it. Please expand or expunge as you see fit.--Dominik Lukeš 10:53, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  More info on podcatching clients needed 

message: It seems as the constant need to rewrite this article continues as i've (and others who i will not name) have been lax is watching its' evolution. Not only has it grown superfluously, it also has some misinformation, more than just a bit I'm afraid. A few examples in a section I recently edited.
"In other words, a podcast is a collection of files (usually audio but may include video) residing at a unique web feed address."
In other words? This is a needly, duplicitous and most importantly, incorrect definition of the primary subject matter. A podcast is not a "collection of files" it was previously defined in this article to be something different altogether, although I realize this paragraph was added probably added to clarify a poorly written first definition. Uh, a Podcast is not a Webcast. And a podcast is most definitely not "residing at a unique web feed address". 'A podcast is a file distributed through syndication feeds, typically multimedia files, typically through RSS. Podcasting boomed as a result of RSS adoption (and ATOM but by and large RSS 2.0 is more widely adopted). The term "podcast" also refers to a Program or feed that distributed through syndication feeds. It is quite simple why are people confusing readers by being so obtuse?
"People can "subscribe" to this feed by submitting the feed address to an aggregator (like iTunes - software that runs on the consumer's computer)"
Why is itunes linked to again and again in this article, much work was done to keep commercial interests and establish product neutrality and integrity here. Not to mention that itunes is not truly an aggregator so much as it is a "podcatcher"- you can't subscribe to feeds for blogs or photoblogs or photocasts etc. "Consumer's computer" Bleck!
"When new "episodes" become available in the podcast they will be automatically downloaded to that user's computer." 
On iTunes by default the might?!? This kind of narrow viewpoint compels me to work more on this article. Readers are not getting an honest explanation of much as it is currently written. It is the user's choice of course whether or not have files downloaded automatically when their feeds are updated. Of course it isn't mentioned but podcasting also allows the user to automatically move files to a portable device. 
"Unlike radio or streaming content on the Web, podcasts are not real-time. The material is pre-recorded and users can check out the material at their leisure, even offline."
This is also not entirely accurate. Many podcasts are recorded live and then later syndicated. You can indeed listen to a live "podcast" and then download the podcast of that program at another time. 
This is just a start, this article is a mess. Managing Podcasts on your ipod? Why was the RSS logo removed when it's pretty much the standard icon to click on to reach a podcast feed? 
Testerer 03:25, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  What happened to this article- again 

message: I've done a significant edit of this article, I've stayed away from some obvious areas because they tend to be more divisive and may not be as important to readers as far as knowing what a podcast is. I have however removed a lot of spam, plenty of misinformation by some contributors who have not widely explained the mechanics and basic syndication/podcast related concepts. You can't tell people that when they subscribe it's automatically downloaded. You have to be honest and say that it's a choice. If you honestly didn't think to mention, you probably don't need to be editing the article for podcasting. It has long since one of the most volatile and constantly vandalized articles I've seen on wikipedia. To anyone editing, reversing, changing, expanding this article I ask and remind you all to please remember something.
if you change the article and include new content, you need references, if you don't have a reference for wild claim, it will eventually be deleted by a responsible user
Also please remember that wikipedia is a big, big place. This article is to explain what a podcast is and what podcasting is. Just that. Please try and help to keep this article honest, neutral, accurate and concise. 
One last comment and then I'm off, can't wait to see what other's think always ready for feedback on fresh edits. 
Use this discussion page when making any major edits at all
You can help justify and explain your edits by using the discussion page. It helps document the thought process which, in my opinion, is particularly important in forming an accurate article on a subject that cannot merely be defined with just a few words. When the article swells but the number of references doesn't it's never a good sign.
Thanks again, goodnight.
Testerer 04:01, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Post edit comments 

message: Recently user Clpo14 reverted some of the edits I had done to clean up this article, again with out any regard for the appropriate discussion page. I've reinstated the logo however left the bit about Dave Winer out in trivia, though it was accurately referenced and removed without any reference as to why that was inappropriate. Please do not remove relevant RSS/syndication related and referenced information from this article. The vast majority of the world's podcasts are syndicated through RSS. If you do no think the near universal logo for Podcasting/RSS (orange square w/ waves or a square with those waves) is relevant to podcasting than you probably shouldn't be editing this article. Podcasting goes hand in hand with RSS and ATOM, please include the corresponding icon for ATOM and OPML if you think appropriate though OPML might not be at this time. Again, please use the discussion page for these sort of edits. It is a good fair, positive way to improve the article. Undiscussed, unreferenced changes will likely face reversion. Thanks again.
Testerer 03:06, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I wasn't aware I had to present my edits to anyone in order for them to be accepted. I removed the RSS icon because this is an article about podcasts, not RSS. While many podcasts are indeed distributed via RSS, that alone does not justify an RSS-related image. RSS is only barely connected to podcasting. Any images should be directly related to podcasting. The RSS icon does not represent podcasting, ergo it doesn't belong.
clpo13
"RSS is only barely connected to podcasting."
With all due respect I think you should back away from this article. RSS is the primary means of syndication for the vast majority. It's made possible the podcasting boom. A few notable Podcasters who've chosen, stuck with and supported (most of whom use the icon on their page btw) are as follows; Adam Curry, Leo Laporte, Chris Pirillo, Chris Ludon, Steve Gillmor, Kevin Rose, Michael Gartenberg, David Winer, Robert Scoble, Podiobooks.com, the entire TWIT network, all of Revision3, Podshow, Nobody Likes Onions, every major(and minor) podcast directory on the Web, myself, pretty much every podcaster out there swears by, uses, supports and seeks to promote RSS. To say that RSS is only barely connected to podcasting is unfounded and perhaps a bit naive. 76.23.215.101 15:13, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Fine, whatever. Clearly we disagree, but I don't care that much about this topic to push the point further. You win. --clpo13(talk) 17:32, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please use the discussion page