Talk:Goku/Archive 2

message: I archived it. It was way too big.--Atomic-Super-SuitWhat Have I Done?!  01:08, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Archive 

message: I agree with the notion to split Goku's Dragonball GT adventures into a different article due to the non-canonical nature of Dragonball GT.  His adventures from all the movies could be inserted to said article. —The preceding unsigned comment was 
added by 4.252.208.18 (talk • contribs) .
:Sounds good to me, I agree, the movies and GT have no place in the canonical series, that is why this article was so long. But then some may argue about GT being canon, and it was decided a while ago that canon and non-canon couldn't be mentioned. To fix this problem, I think it's time that we do a Canon/Non-canon (Anime) Goku article and then maybe do a strictly canon (Manga) Goku article. It is a way to shorten it, and get more accurate info to the less educated readers. Majinvegeta
::This discussion happened already. It's in the archives, I believe a consensus has already been reached so this is a bit of the same thing as was discussed in the archive.--ASNTContributions  00:22, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with you. Just because you guys up top feel that GT is non canon does not make it. I don't see who made you the canonical experts. So Goku's adventures is GT is to remain in his article. Also remember it is a sequel to Dragonball not a filler. But the After-world Tournament should stay too since it is part of the Dragonball Z Anime. SSD4 10:53, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

text: Why would he need two articles? That doesn't make senseSUIT42 03:45, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Agreed

message: Why's that there? It was decided in the archives that the article be split up.--SUIT 07:03, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Not very good titles, though.--SUIT 21:29, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the feedback. Do you have anything useful to contribute? --Boradis 18:48, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

text: That sounds good to me. Or we could imitate the structure of a well-constructed article about a fictional character, for instance the first six sections of the Sherlock Holmes page. --Boradis 18:36, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plot tag 

message: Let's face it, Son Goku is the protagonist of every aspect of the series except the Garlic Jr. Saga and all three TV movies. The article we have is too long, I propose taking an axe to some of this unnecessary summary. A good article talks about Goku from an out-of-universe standpoint, which we only do to a very limited extent. Anyone have any opposition to this? (Instead, I'd write more on his heroic qualities, his similarities with Sun Wukong, Tongpoo, and Dragon Boy, how the character has affected popular culture, etc.) Thoughts? JRP 04:24, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This has been mentioned above--SUIT 04:26, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Summarize the whole series?

message: Why was the Angry Kamehameha removed from Goku's move list? Because it was named for the BT2 game? It is still a move used in the anime and manga. A move that defeated Frieza on Namek. Just because it was named in the BT2 game should not stop it from being put on this article.  
Heat P 07:11, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's just a Kamehameha launched from one hand.--SUIT 07:24, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

text: It's mentioned, though not by name: "In some instances, Goku has launched the Kamehameha with one hand"--SUIT 07:47, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

text: Seems like a good idea--SUIT 08:16, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Angry Kamehameha 

message: Well since the whole page has been cleaned up by User Majinvegeta, and it's now a lot more shorter and comprehensible it seems there is no point in keeping it, right?-Dark Dragon Flame 23:01, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree, it gets frustrating seeing that you've tried to shorten the article, and it still isn't short enough. --Majinvegeta 14:33, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Article Split Tag

message: Here's a few importants aspects that should be covered in the article.
*Goku's early designs and creation and how TongPoo, Dragon Boy and the real Son Goku influenced the character. Perhaps include a comparison picture of all three Toriyama characters.
*His growth into an adult by the end of Dragon Ball, his new Saiyan origins in DBZ and the Super Saiyan transformation.
*Toriyama's decision to retire Goku and impose Gohan as the protagonist, the relative unpopularity of Gohan compared to Goku and the eventual decision to bring him back.
*The end of the Dragon Ball manga and Toei Animation's decision to continue the anime as Dragon Ball GT and turn Goku back into a child.
It isn't really that hard. I'm pretty sure there's plenty of Toriyama interviews commenting about the character that could be used as references other than the fiction itself. Jonny2x4 22:35, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree, to add all this stuff that you've suggested would only make the article longer. Much of that stuff was removed because it made the article a mess and WAY too long. --Majinvegeta 14:37, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Suggestions 

message: :"He was also in a non-canon saga "Beautiful Treachery" where he meets Zarbon."
Does this refer to some specific videogame? Or what, exactly? --DesireCampbell 03:35, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's a saga in DBZ:BT2. Just needs to be worded differently, or something--SUIT42 03:44, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Odd line in 'Appearances in other Media/Videogames' 

message: :"(although on the Funimation official english site it incorrectly states Goku is eight years old)"
Yeah, Funi's websites for teh Dragon Ball series are terrible. Check out the description for Android 16:
:" Created by the evil Genius Dr. Gero, Androids 16, 17, 18, 19, and 20 are out to destroy our heroes on Earth. These Androids have amazing strength and enjoy devastation for its sake. The strong, silent type, Android 16 is an experimental model and is out to destroy whatever he sees.
:After meeting his demise at the hands of Cell, Bulma collects the pieces of Android 16 and reprograms him to fight on the good side. "
Yeah. Whoever edited the page was right - but it's unnecessary information. We can't add every piece of incorrect information Funi has added. We just give accurate information, and hope for the best. --DesireCampbell 23:45, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comment about Funi's website being wrong 

message: I will be cutting down the 'History' section considerably tonight. I expect this to be met with some criticism, so I am adding this not prior to editing, and will make the entire cut in one edit.
My reasoning is as follows:
*The 'History' section is extremely long, and while it gives great background information about the character, such information is not centric to the scope of the article.
*There are already articles that go over the plot in detail, there's no need for the same information to be repeated en masse for every character page.
*I will be including appropriate links to the main saga summaries, so interested parties can read further.
Comments or complaints should be noted here before reverts. Thanks You --DesireCampbell 03:51, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Don't Panic 

message: Woopee, the article's shorter, that's great, but there still aren't any references. We really should do something about that, I mean the information all came from somewhere, right? Daizenshuus, interviews, and the like.--SUIT42 05:41, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: unless you want to reference everything on this page to a particular part of the manga or a specific episode then i don't think everything could be referenced. (evirus)141.210.100.112 05:34, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  References 

message: I saw the name of Goku '孫悟空' was labelled in Japanese? I edited it and called it Kanji/Chinese because that is exactly what it is, its not 100% Japanese. It might be hard for some people to recognize but my language has hanji (Korean from Chinese) so I know which is which. ( Seong0980 02:46, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm... I replied to you here before I saw this.  –Gunslinger47 03:59, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: A problem

message: I've noticed that the Son Goku article has been trimmed very well recently, but do we need the "Behind the Child" and "Behind the Hero" sections? They seem very unnecessary, repeat information already covered in the individual sagas, and over all just weigh the article down. I say they should be removed. Deus Z 22:47, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I may not be a regular editor here (frankly, the size of the page and the amount of information on Son Goku that needs to be weighed for inclusion intimidates me) but I agree. Looking over those two sections, I think they should just be deleted outright, as everything Deus Z says appears to be true. Brevity is best, and Dragon Ball as a subject on Wikipedia is prone to peacock terms and fancruft. Those demons need to be dealt with mercilessly. --Boradis 00:03, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Too Long

message: :First off this article needs more pictures, some articles half this long have more pictures than this! Also why is the Main image allways being changed?
DBZROCKS 23:42, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, the article needs more pictures. But as you can see by the two banners at the top of the article page, the actual content needs a huge overhaul before we worry about aesthetics. Deus Z 07:46, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: True the content needs overhaul but pictures are part of it too, personally I find long articles with few pictures hard on the eyes DBZROCKS 02:03, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

text: That's the exact stuff that we are trying to avoid. Too much specific and detailed info leads to the article being jumbled and painfully long. I've seriously considered cutting the article down even more then we have. I think that a very rough explaination of what happens in each saga as relating directly to Goku is sufficient.--Majinvegeta 07:57, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Improvements! 

message: I just wish everyone would stop deleting the movie section, because it is true and Goku did face them (well, expect Bojack]]. SuperSaiyan Crash 19:56, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Movies 

message: I honestly think we need a serious picture change on this article, the last one we had was fine, not only that but it was drawn by Toriyama himself and is from the Dragon Ball World Book. This one I believe is horrible, it's difficult to see his individual appearence. I'm uploading another.....I can't stand this picture anymore even though I've tried reverting it numerous times. --Majinvegeta 07:13, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't mind :Image:SonGoku.jpg.  I prefer it over :Image:Gokubody.jpg.  Would it be possible to find a good one from GT (before or after he is a child). –Gunslinger47 07:55, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

text: What about this one? Or this one?--SUIT-n-tie 15:57, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Gunslinger47, I love that one. That was the one on the article when I looked at it the other day, and I think it is especially good because of the fact that it was done by Toriyama himself, and it is part of the Dragon Ball World Guide/Book. SUIT, I love the first one that you posted here, and I think that the second one maybe can be used later in the article. This article I think needs more pictures. Thanks guys, but I think others should see these pics before we make a final decision.--Majinvegeta 19:07, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed.-- bulletproof 3:16 19:18, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: What was wrong with:Image:Goku003.jpg?  I don't care who drew the current picture, it shows Goku standing off-center and it's very low-resolution. Surely there are better pictures than that. Deus Z 03:20, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: First off :Image:Goku003.jpg was distubing an having a Akira Toriyama Drawn picture makes the article seem closer to the source material.DBZROCKS 01:59, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Disturbing, how? the article should have indeed more pictures and I personally think Toriyama's work be should the one used in the infobox itself --Dark Dragon Flame 20:42, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well in my opinion opening an article to find someone Smiling at you weird isnt exactly wonderful and anyway:Image:SonGoku.jpg shows Goku's Trademark Orange Gi instead of Just his head. DBZROCKS 22:09, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh well either way Akira's job has priority -Dark Dragon Flame 19:50, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So do you agree we should use :Image:SonGoku.jpg? DBZROCKS 22:06, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

text: Actually seeing as the anime is basically the Manga in colored animation using it is more comon I can see throwing in a black in white manga image or two but in my opinion the Anime pictures are better. Its like asking if you want to see a black and white or color movie, color wins DBZROCKS 00:09, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We can use pics from the Dragonball World Book, all drawings by Toriyama, done in color. --Majinvegeta 02:03, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok as long as its in color because I know many people are turned off by black and white manga images DBZROCKS 22:35, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok then, Majinvegeta will you get the images or should I ask other users for scans? -Dark Dragon Flame 22:41, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Picture

message: I'm sorry, but I think we should talk about Goku's height once more again. I also want to believe Goku's height is about 170cm(5'7") as the Daizenshuu says as above. However, I found an interesting material saying that his height is 175cm. I wouldn't think highly of this if this claim is on a private homepage, but this fact that Goku's height is 175cm is on a Japanese wikipedia site. Because Japan is where Dragonball series were born, I carefully propose that Goku's height could actually be 175cm as this Japanese wikipeia page says. If his height is really 5'7" as the Daizenshuu states, someone must prove that 5'7" in the Daizenshuu is height of not 'growing' Goku, but 'fully-grown' Goku, and the content of the Japanese wikipedia page that Goku's height is 175cm must be retorted. Here's the site that insists Goku's height is 175cm.  
Besides, we should also consider that Goku's height is similar to Gohan's height. However, our wikipedia page is also saying that Goku's height is not 5'7" but 5'11" and so is gohan. Here's the page.
Please do make statements about this. --Hilight 06:44, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia, even the Wikipedias of other languages, aren't good sources for Wikipedia. We all know how unreliable Wikipedia is, as we're constantly struggling to delete or correct new crap. I doubt people who edit the Japanese Wikipedia are much different from people all over the world -- some of them are trustworthy, some aren't. If you don't have any OFFICIAL sources for this information, there's no reason to reopen the subject. The Daizenshu is official, so I say drop it. --Boradis 19:51, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, let's admit that wikipedia can be incorrect. However, every Japanese Dragonball site said Goku's height is 175cm. Not even one exception. You keep saying as if only you in the world has the Daizenshuu and I konw you will say that the fact every Japanese DB site says Goku's height is 175cm is NOT OFFICIAL. But don't you think some Japanese homepage makers too(who are greatly interested in Dragonball like you), have the DB Daizenshuu? How come you don't consider the possibility that there might have been an error translating Japanese Daizenshuu to English Daizenshuu? Other users(Majin Vegeta, Dark Dragon Flame) who thought Goku's height is 5'7" as the English Daizenshuu says like you, showed interst and respected my opinion, and agreed to figure this out together. However, you acted as if only you are the 'correct person' and told me to drop this, which made me upset. I'm not trying to bug you as you said to me at my page, but I'm trying to make information about Son Goku more accurate for everyone and this project. In addition, I'm just asking all of you to find this out together. I hope for many replies.--Hilight 22:52, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  About Goku's height. 

message: Do we really need all these Kamehameha Variations? A link to the Kamehameha page would better DBZROCKS 13:02, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree. I think that the original Kamehameha is sufficiant. We could say, "For other variations of the Kamehamaha used by Goku click here" or something, and have it link to the main article. --Majinvegeta 22:00, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

text: If they're too lazy to click on a link, it's not our fault. Besides, the page is long enogh as it is. // PoeticDecay 20:04, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Come on how hard is it to move a mouse half and inch and press a button? We should just add: Main article Kamehameha DBZROCKS 00:04, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kamehameha Variations 

message: This isn't particular to Goku, but I can't help but be bothered by anime exclusive stuff that is added to the Dragon Ball related articles. Fanboys, no doubt. I was just wondering if we should edit the articles to manga exclusive stuff and then have a separate section that does anime differences, etc. I feel that this is a constant arguement to get this stuff across. I work on other articles that are similar to "manga/anime" situations and this method seems to have worked nicely, everyone is happy and I don't feel like I'm reading inaccurate info. I wanted to discuss it first though. --Majinvegeta 22:00, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We can't really make them manga exclusive that would drive all anime fanboys to start vandalizing; what I think should be done is make them to be 50/50 half manga half anime, that would save us the trouble of having to deal with fanboys-Dark Dragon Flame 04:14, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Are there really enough anime exclusive Goku facts to warrant such a thing? I don't recall the anime treating Goku's story any different than in the manga, with the exception of the movies which are already seperate. Deus Z 06:43, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Manga true?

message: I was thinking about mentioning Son Goku's "rustic" dialect he speaks in.  I'm wondering where to put it.  I also don't want to bother writing about it if it's just going to be deleted.  His dialect always seemed to me to be a big part of his character.  Evan1975 05:16, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Goku's dialect

message: While I, and I'm sure others appreciate the new images (all similar in style, so as to clearly show the differences between the SSj levels), I would like to bring up a few complaints:
1. The SSj3 image: firstly, it's a mishmash of two images, and thus, isn't fit for encyclopedic inclusion. Secondly, it looks god-awful. Which, among other things, makes Wikipedia look like a joke.
2. There may not be a need to include these images. The same can be said for a lot of the SSj information, as it's already covered in Super Saiyan.
3. While the top image stays in line with the new SSj images, it's really not the best visual description of Goku (though the one before it wasn't much better).
As a side note, I've seen those black-backgrounded images before (as well as one for young SSj2 Gohan). Does anyone know of their origin? 
--DesireCampbell 22:06, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I reverted the images, none of them had a copyright tag. -Dark Dragon Flame 23:31, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[User:Golbez04|Golbez04]]'s new images 

message: To prevent trolls from editing it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.189.67.134 (talk) 18:14, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  After next reversion, can we lock this article? 

message: It's obvious this article has been the subject of some intense vandalism today. I've temporarily protected it. --Durin 02:13, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Temporary protection 

message: I don't know, I would think this page would have one. Infact, I think it did have one a while ago. Shouldn't we I don't know...add one or at least put it back? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by TheUltimate3 (talk • contribs) 21:46, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see how his overall personality is worthy of a whole section, plus it is pretty much covered in the opening paragraph. --Majinvegeta 14:10, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  why isn't there a personality section for Son Goku? 

message: What is Goku's power level? What is the unit of measurement? I would like to know this because someone keeps editing 9000 (number) to say that Goku's power level "is more than this." But they don't cite any episodes to support this, so we think it's vandalism and we revert it. I've probably already used up my three reverts on that. Anton Mravcek 14:16, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Goku's PL in the English Dub was 9000, but like 8,500 in the Original Japanese and the manga. --Majinvegeta 22:55, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The "information" comes from User:Karragin, who keeps adding it to the article on 9000 without citing any episodes or manga. ShutterBugTrekker 22:52, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Majinvegeta was talking about his Power level during his fight with Nappa--$UIT 01:10, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: An audio clip from this episode of Vegeta yelling "His power level is over nine thousand!" has become part of a popular internet meme. The user doing this is being stupid. Goku's power level far succeded 9000 before the series stopped using this measurment. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Animedude360 (talk • contribs) 23:06, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Goku's power level > 9000 ? 

message: I seem to recall reading something about Akira Toriyama having deliberately based parts of Goku's character on Superman. If somebody can confirm this and give a citation, that would be worth putting in the article. 71.203.209.0 00:31, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I unfortunately don't recall reading that anywhere even though the similarities between Goku and Superman are quite obvious. I do however specifically remeber Goku being an obvious spoof of Sun Wukong from Journey to the West (even their Japanese names are the same, Son Goku is the Japanese translation of Sun Wukong). Of course, Goku and Superman are constantly compared to one another by amatures and professionals alike. In Toriyama's other manga, Dr. Slump, there is a super hero character named "Suppaman", who is obviously a spoof of Superman --Majinvegeta 00:09, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Superman comparison 

message: Question and I believe I am right. Was Kami consider a master of Goku? If I am not mistaken Kami's symbol was on Goku Gi from when he entered the 23 tournament to when he trained with North Kai or was that his own symbol? If I am wrong please can someone let me know. Heat P 12:41, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kami the master