Talk:Dawson College shooting/Archive 1

message: I think I would like to leave a little small message here.  After being at Dawson for a time, I feel it's like a second home.  I was part of Dawson life, being part of the clubs, events to even down to student politics.  I do also contribute information to the Dawson College main Wikipedia site.  Though, I was planing to visit Dawson before I head to work around noon today, but I got late in my plans, but when I got home and ready to go there, I saw this news.  I was shocked.  I don't know if I felt lucky that I was running late as planned, but if I did, I would have been in the middle of it, as I always hang around the 2nd level.  Though, all my friends, classmates and the peoples I know there for many years are safe, but it breaks the heart to see such events unfolds.  (TuxedoInferno 22:07, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I understand your need for grievance, but wikipedia isn't the proper place for it. Possible keep it in talk pages? Sod Aries 20:23, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: A message...

message: Is this notable enough to be on the main page? --Gregorof 18:29, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe. It's a school shooting and it's all over the news. 204.52.215.107 18:32, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

text: http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Shots_fired_at_Montreal_college --Qviri (talk) 18:58, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

text: The problem is that we aren't Wikinews, and Wikipedia is also not a breaking news source. This should be on the main page of Wikinews, but I don't think it should be on the main page of Wikipedia, at least not for a little while. --Coredesat talk! 19:06, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  It's the main story on some news sites (CNN, Google, Fox) but not most/all (BBC, MSNBC, Yahoo).  --Interiot 19:23, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Sorry, Where can I find the request? --Gregorof 19:52, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Wikipedia:In the news section on the Main Page/Candidates#September 13.  --Interiot 22:08, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: main page?

message: We need new catagories, :Category:School shootings, and :Category:Dawson College 132.205.45.148 18:39, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I definately agree we need a School Shootings category, but what could we have in the Dawson College Categeory? --Gregorof 18:42, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well for starters, Dawson College and this article. 132.205.45.148 18:58, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure, I'll work on it. --Gregorof 19:09, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

text: We don't need a School Shootings category, as :Category:School massacres already exists, of which most are shootings. Bwithh 19:44, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks didnt see that. --Gregorof 19:51, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Would it be a msassacre if less than 5 people are killed? 132.205.45.148 19:53, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: School massacre defines it as "an incident of attempted mass murder involving at least one actual death that occurs at a school".  So I suppose yes it is. --Gregorof 19:57, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

text: I agree --Gregorof 20:16, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Needed: categories

message: As this is currently far far better than the Wikinews article on the same incident. 
(I would suggest that the content/perspective of this article mostly belongs on Wikinews only, except that I don't think many people read Wikinews....)
Bwithh 19:44, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I disagree, this as an encyclopedic tone as for the Wikinews article, it was first-hand journalism in that it appeared after the shooting and is thus necessary as an archival record even if it is short. For the idea of transwikiing, then that is pure non-sense, it would be like moving the Polytechnique article to like Wikinews (if we could go back that far). Lincher 20:16, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There are parts of this article which are clearly non-encyclopedic in tone: e.g.  Students have been encouraged to contact loved ones to assuage fears. Local media have reported that police have established phone numbers at which loved ones can gain more information are +1-(514)-280-2880, +1-(514)-280-2805, or +1-(514)-280-2806. The Montreal General Hospital has also set up a hotline, which can be reached at +1-(514)-843-2839. plus a couple of the photos. This wikipedia article feels like something like journalism. The wikinews article (like most wikinews articles) feels like a summary of mainstream news reports. And I suggested COPYING the article to Wikinews, not Transwiking. Bwithh 20:57, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: At the very least, copy the contact info to the Wikinews article. --Coredesat talk! 21:57, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Recommend copy this article to Wikinews

message: Um randomly why is the shooter's haircut being described as 'retarded'?  I mean, it may well have been but that's not the NPOViest way of putting it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.226.18.35 (talk • contribs) 
:I think I saw that in an eyewitness quote somewhere. --Kizor 23:16, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, it was an eyewitness description. -- Reaper  X 23:28, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Regardless, I dont see it as being a neccesary inclusion --Gregorof 00:47, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Haircut 

message: i'm watching the breaking news right now, it says that the surete du quebec reports that they believe that there was only one gunman, and that they shot and killed him. also the injury reports are: 11 injured, (8 critical, (4 in er, 3 stable)). the gunman began shooting in the cafeteria. gunman wearing black french shirt.65.94.244.233 21:22, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Working on it. Can someone improve the image layout, while we're at it? I'm hopeless with images. --Kizor 21:41, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: (this is updated info live from CBC) note that i mispelt, its trenchcoat not french coat. atleast 20 taken to hospital, 11 to montreal general hospital, 6 critical, 3 people operated on, 3 people waiting for surgery.. he started shooting outside, nearby alexis neon plaza, then moved on into the cafeteria of dawson. all witnesses say they saw only one gunmen, same description. police cant confirm that there were more than one gunman, but its still a possibility. shooting started at 1pm. gunman with black boots and machinegun and rifle. 2 police officers already on scene when gunmen made first shot, telling him to drop gun. cellphone lines overloaded. roads + some metro stations barricaded, large perimeter. alexis neon plaza, dawson evacuated. 12:44 police came on scene saw someone shooting on wall of dawson.65.94.244.233 22:16, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just a correction of spelling, "Alexis Nihon". 66.130.236.213 01:43, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Not all witnesses all said there was only one. Many people said there were multiple gunman, which restarted the stampeding around. Disinclination 03:01, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: incorrect info

message: hi, i've been working on the montreal article recently, and live here. have added a temporary redirect to this page. thanks everyone for putting it up and refining the breaking story. two of my friends teach there, and it's a bad day when you spend part of it trying to find out whether your friends have been shot (they weren't). -- Denstat 23:00, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That isn't necessary. The Montreal article has nothing to do with the shooting at Dawson College. ♠ SG →Talk 23:44, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: no, but people who hear about a shooting at a montreal college are going to google and hit the wiki montreal page, and have to search for mention of post-secondary institutions in a very long article. that's the reality of google combined with the relevance of wikipedia. as i said, it's temporary, and if i have to spell it out, a compassionate gesture. it will be changed back as the timeliness fades. -- Denstat 02:35, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: First, that's not a redirect, that's a hatnote. Second, I don't see the relevance, really, as anyone hearing about this on the news easily heard the "Dawson College" name as well. Third, I see it was removed after about 90 minutes, which is longer than I thought it would last ... --Dhartung | Talk 04:16, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: thanks for the head's up about the term hatnote, new to me -- already realized it was not a redirect. do you only listen to english news? when an international news story breaks, i always put myself in the position of someone who may hear it in another language, or reduced to much less information in other countries. dawson has a great number of international students with family elsewhere, so you might reconsider who you mean by "anyone". i take encouragement from section 5.5 in hatnote, and absolutely would never bother with wikipedia again during a similar emergency. peace, out. -- Denstat 04:50, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: temporary redirect from Montreal article

message: "As of 4:30pm local time, a police spokesman has confirmed the involvment of one rocker, and that gunman was shot and killed by the police." in the shooter section... rocker what? --jess 01:11, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sneaky vandalism ;) It has been fixed. --Deenoe 01:14, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Shooter

message: It smells the semi-protection soon if you ask me.
I wish. --Deenoe 01:23, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No, many anonymous users are adding good information to the article. The vandalism isn't too bad right now. ♠ SG →Talk 01:25, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Fair enough, but definately worth considering if it elevates. --Gregorof 01:27, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: My cousin was in Dawson College when this happend... If her life would of been taken, I would take personally care of this guy saying the gunman was armed with a big penis! Such an insults for the families... --Deenoe 01:31, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

text: If users want to make useful contributions, they can create an account ;) --Deenoe 01:33, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  A relief.  To vandalize such a tragedy is disturbing.  Best to see it blocked for the time being. --Gregorof 01:35, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I was expecting the sprotection to last 1-2 hours, just to dissuade the vandals... nope, an admin removed the sprotect right away. --Deenoe 01:38, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That administrator was me. I don't think the vandalism is unmanagable at the moment. --HappyCamper 02:15, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Unmanagable.. no. Insulting for the families? Yes. --Deenoe 11:39, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  There's a weird smell in the air... 

message: "The Dawson College shooting occured on 13 September 2006, from 12:45 to 13:15 EDT"
* Why are we using military time here? NorthernThunder 02:10, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Military time? 

message: In this article, it seems to say that the shooter killed himself, whereas the article states otherwise. Also, this states that 4 people were killed. What is the current information that is available? --HappyCamper 02:24, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: We shall go with what police and hospital officials tell us. The only reports of speculation that should be used (if at all) are ones from the "main" news corporations, such as the CBC, BBC, etc. -- Reaper  X 02:37, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Conflicting reports