Talk:Hennin

message: When I use google to search for "damsel hats", I generally references to this garment.
When I type in "damsel hat" as a search entiry into the Wikipedia, I don't get this page.
Also, this garment is a type of cornet, which seems to not be mentioned in anyway as entry on on the Wikipedia.
:It's a young article and additions are welcome. If you'd like to add something about it being a type of cornet, you're welcome and encouraged to do so! I've added a redirect from Damsel hat which will fix that search issue after the next search-database regeneration. — Saxifrage ✎ 15:25, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comments

message: Anyone know of a connection between the two? Funkynusayri (talk) 14:45, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Interesting - I think there are similar older Persian? or arab styles which may have had a role in the origins of both, but the Western hennin emerged from an evolution of increasingly fancy styles of head-coverings, although it does represent a bit of a leap. Johnbod (talk) 16:14, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Similarity to the [[tantur]] 

message: I have messed about with your edits here; Norris is a rather dubious source, and not only did the friar, or his army of urchins, use "hennin", but he seems to be about the only source that did at the time.  Pending seeing the very expensive book of Margaret Scott, knowledge in this area seems to have progressed little since 1819. Johnbod (talk) 04:37, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: My edit reported that friar Thomas Conecte had not employed the word, but gave the quote: but isn't he the source for the statement "recorded as being used in French in 1428"?  OED gives among the uses of cornet (all connected with "horn", naturally): "A form of head-dress formerly worn by ladies." The connection made with lappet seems unlikely on the face of it.--Wetman (talk) 05:24, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes - did you see the bottom where I added the actual source in the Chronique of Enguerrand de Monstrelet, with links to the full text in English and French. "Cornet" is variously described, but see chaperon (headgear) where "cornette" is well-established as the usual French term for the liripipe or trailing tail.  In female contexts the cornet, according to most sources, was a low cap that was under the "steeple" bit, and (less clearly) would extend out to make the lappet. The term remained in use into the 16th century (indeed 17th century America) for set-ups with no steeple, and seems to derive from "coronette".  If it comes from "horn", it is the earlier types of hair-in-net horns going 2 ways, as in the Arnolfini portrait.  See here for example.  Some sources do use it for the "steeple" as well, but as usual in 15th century fashion they all contradict each other.  I don't mind changing it, but I'm not sure I want to do so based on Norris. I'll copy this to the talk page, as it is may be relevant there. Johnbod (talk) 12:52, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cornet 

message: There is a suggestion that the hennin - along with the fashion  for pointy shoes - came ultimately from T'ang China,  taking centuries to work its way westwards. Anyone like to follow it up? Ammimajus (talk) 16:32, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: See 2 sections up. Johnbod (talk) 16:42, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: T'ang China

message: In Flemish, the family name Genin (pronounced Henin) was originally a toponym of about this period for someone from the Duchy of Hainault. Is it therefore possible the design came over with Philippa of Hainault, Edward III's wife, or her children, who had a close relationship with Flanders?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.29.210.34 (talk) 16:02, 26 June 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Etymology 

message: I'm going to take out the speculation about the influence of the Mongolian boqta. It needs better referencing, preferably something peer-reviewed. The present source is only a blog. It's an interesting idea. We should expect some overlap between eastern Europe and western Asia. But in respect of the hennin the chronology and regional distribution both seem to be against it. The invocation of Marco Polo as the agent of transmission reads like a predictable pop history attribution, but it's more than a century out, and the bold assertion that Polo brought a boqta back reads like a fictional embellishment. I don't see anything like that in Polo's own text and we lack much detail about his return journey, including his inventory. We don't need to posit an exotic outside influence for the hennin's development anyway: it seems redundant, as medieval women had always worn headdresses, and the towering hennin was very much of a piece with other extravagances of fifteenth-century high fashion. Lachrie (talk) 23:56, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Boqta (ku-ku) 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Hennin. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070404092438/http://cadieux.mediumaevum.com/burgundian-hennin.html to http://cadieux.mediumaevum.com/burgundian-hennin.html
*Added  tag to http://cleftlands.case.edu/hatskwcs1.pdf
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:14, 2 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: It reads:
"The word does not appear in English until the 19th century"  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.5.91.155 (talk) 06:28, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  English names for the headwear before the 19th century? 

message: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hennon  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.5.91.155 (talk) 17:15, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dutch roots of the word: Hennin