Talk:Vorlon

message: I actually generally disbelieve the whole Kosh poisoning routine in the Babylon 5 pilot movie. If JMS had made that after the series I would have thought him mentally incapacitated, or assumed there was a really cool subplot that I missed involving Kosh building a fake humanoid limb capable of converting poison into something that effects a being of energy and having an excuse to blurt out "hi, you're gunna be valen!" while not wondering why his request for privacy while boarding the station was ignored and somehow bypassing his encounter suit to shake hands.
I'd remove the
"A poisoning incident involving the first Vorlon ambassador to Babylon 5 proves that Vorlons do possess a physical body of sorts." line for the moment...
:I changed it to "suggests" from "proves". See if it reads better. -- Grunt (talk) 01:28, 2004 Aug 19 (UTC)
::Well, like a number of pilots, there are things that are substantially different from the television series that follows.  For example both Star Trek pilots and the Cosby show pilot were different in a number of ways than the series that followed.
::JesseG 03:50, Mar 5, 2005 (UTC)
----
I believe the Technology - Space Vessels section could be expanded.  I would write it, but I can't recall enough of the details to write with confidence.  Namely, these topics can be addressed:
*Vorlon vessels are more than just life forms.  They are intelligent to a degree and may be telepathic, singing in passengers' minds while they are in stasis.
*Vorlon vessels, at least Kosh Narenek's transport, are bonded with their lone pilot, and if the pilot dies, their reason for being is no more.  Kosh's transport committed suicide by flying into the sun.
*Vorlon vessels have shields, which are beyond the younger races' technology.
*Vorlon vessels use gravitic propulsion and have artificial gravity, technologies they gave to the Minbari.
*Vorlon vessels use jump point technology, which got the younger races into space.
--Bastian227 18:18, 26 Oct 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: I didn't edit the article because I'm not sure anymore, but I thought there was another sighting of a Vorlon outside of its "shell" and not taking the form of someone's father or something, but of a being of light.  I thought G'Kar saw him briefly as G'Quan during the Dust to Dust episode when he had entered Mollari's mind with the Telepathic Mindwalk Dust, and Kosh stopped him.  It led to the story thread where G'Kar is incarcerated and eventually writes the Book of G'Kar.  OK, most of the time Kosh was taking the form of G'Kar's father, but I thought he also appeared as G'Quan at one point.   —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.169.144.171 (talk) 02:45, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Kosh appears as G'Kar's father, dying. Then as an unnamed Narn. Then finally as G'Lan, the angelic spiritual being associated with G'Quan. That unnamed Narn might well be G'Quan, but no source has ever actually come out and said so. 131.96.47.17 (talk) 04:00, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Didn't Kosh appear as G'Quan to G'Kar? 

message: This is a relatively minor point, so I thought I'd bring it up here. In Star Trek: Voyager's third season, a race known as Species 8472 was introduced. Foundation Imaging, which produced the CGI effects for Babylon 5, was contracted to design 8472's ships. With their deadline fast approaching, Foundation decided to give the Vorlon's ships new "skin" textures, modify their wire-frames a little, and pass them off as the ships of Species 8472. Additionally, Species 8472 themselves are re-textured and modified Shadows. CNash 00:04, 12 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Unless you can back up such a bold statement with some kind of reference, it has no place in the article. --8472 17:06, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Star Trek connection? 

message: I think the problem is all the stuff about Vorlon planet killers and whatnot. I propose to remove that unless others object. This isn't really the place for fan-boy stuff, fascinating as it is. There are plenty of B5 Tech sites out there (to which this article can/should be linked). Nothing on the TV show goes into depth about size and firepower, and the arguments over whether planet killers are "a mile big" or "actually blow up planets" are not really enlightening or important to the drama of the show.
It may also be worth combining some of the Lyta/Sebastian stuff into the bit about the Vorlon homeworld; rolling biotech into spaceships; and tidy up the bits about nature and biology (which are surely the same?).
Cheers, Neale Neale Monks 20:44, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleaning this artcle up 

message: There are lots of statements in these sections that need references. Please consider adding them. For example, where in the show do we learn Ulkesh's ship re-builds itself? How do we know a transport is 131 metres long? If these statements are going to be made, they need to be referenced to either the episode (thus: The Coming of Shadows) or to a book (thus: Babylon_5_Novels%2C_novelizations%2C_short_stories%2C_and_comic_books).
What doesn't really count are fan sites, personal speculation, and so on.
Cheers, Neale Neale Monks 15:20, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've done some work on the ships, and if no-one objects, I think we can removed the "clean up" tag at the top of the article. Please do add more information and references, but please make sure you do quote some meaningful source, like an official website, a book, an episode, or whatever. Cheers, Neale Neale Monks 11:57, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please help with the ships section 

message: There's no need to have anything on the White Star here; there's a perfectly good page for that ship. If you have information to add on the White Star, do it there, not here. Cheers, Neale Neale Monks 15:34, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  White Star 

message: :Image:B5 kosh01b.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
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BetacommandBot (talk) 06:21, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:B5 kosh01b.jpg

message: I removed the following paragraph.
:Vorlon territory is known as the Vorlon Empire. Despite being called the Vorlon Empire, it is unknown if there is a Vorlon Emperor, though there is a High Command. The Vorlon Empire maintains a strict policy of isolation. No ship entering Vorlon space returns; the Vorlons claimed attempted expeditions had met with accidents and suggested that no more expeditions be sent into their territory.  The Vorlon high command is ruled by 12 Vorlon Lights Cardinal.  The Vorlon Empire is protected by a very powerful network, rumored to be generated by telepaths enslaved at the event horizon of hyperspace windows.
I can't find any information about any of this; it looks like someone's fanfiction ideas. If someone has sources for any of this, please do put it back in the article, but I'm pretty sure absolutely nothing was ever revealed about the internal structure of Vorlon governance. grendel|khan 06:24, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: All the B5 pages suffer from heavy fanfic and in-universe prose. It will take a long time to fix. Btw I added a line about Vorlons' true appearance based on the (now deleted) vid of the fight between Kosh/Sheridan/Lorien and Ulkesh. I tried to make sure that description doesn't go further than what the episode actually shows. 131.96.109.200 (talk) 20:24, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed "Government" section. 

message: :Image:Truevorlon.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot (talk) 02:27, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Truevorlon.jpg

message: :Image:Vorlons.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot (talk) 03:15, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Vorlons.png

message: Vorlons have wrists/hands in their true form. This is necessary, because the doctor that treated Kosh for poison had to locate the concentration of poison at the source of the poisoning. He couldn't have done medical work on an illusion, so Kosh had to be somehow 'allowing' him to see the real thing. Therefore it's without a doubt that Vorlons do, in fact, have wrists and hands in roughly the same place as humans. 76.231.44.109 (talk) 09:27, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: This speculation is entirely plausible; I think you're almost certainly right. However, speculation and original research has no place on wikipedia. 131.96.47.17 (talk) 04:04, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wrists/hands 

message: Throughout the article it is stated that other species see the Vorlons as holy beings due to their genetic manipulation. Apart from inducing telepathic development in the younger races, I don't think they did much more in the genetic development sense. It is hinted that they did tinker a lot with the culture of other species to enforce their status as "holy beings". Due to Kosh's alleged exhaustion after being seen by several dozen people while saving Sheridan and to the fact that everyone (except Londo, likely due to the influence of the Shadows over him) saw a winged figure of their own race which they associated with various religious figures, I believe that it is much more likely that said effect is due to a psychic hypnosis. Being seen by so many Kosh would need to influence a LOT of people at once, which could be challenging even for a Vorlon, considering the power of the image he needed to imprint. This is reinforced by the fact that when Kosh's leftover piece jumped to fight the new Vorlon ambassador, everyone saw what is generally assumed to be the true form a Vorlon. If the image was due to previously implanted programming, then everyone would've again seen the angelical holy visage they were used to. Since the Vorlons in question were too busy, you know, killing each other, at that particular point in time they wouldn't care too much for appearances, another indicative that it's probably a conscious effort - 90.200.164.69 (talk) 22:45, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: In series, that's the way they put it, so that's the way it belongs in this article. Unless you can find a reliable source that says otherwise, it's just fan speculation. 131.96.47.17 (talk) 04:05, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vorlon Illusion