Talk:Omar Torrijos

message: I want to make it clear that I rather doubt the circumstances of Torrijo's death claimed by John Perkins, but I certainly agree that the paragraph as it now stands should be part of the article.CSTAR
Noriega, in his book, says that many were suspicious about the circumstances of Torrijos' death. --Herschelkrustofsky 02:08, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not simply "do you believe it or do you not?", I believe that it was an assassination by the CIA or some subsidary simply because of circumstance.  Torrijo, as well as his Ecuadorian counterpart, both died in plane crashes less than a month after meeting with corporate officials from America, who were angered by their plans to nationalize oil and other prime resources.  Once, I would dismiss it as coincidence, but it also happened in Iraq, Iran, Ecuador, Guatemala, and Torrijo's successor in Panama.  It isn't coincidence when it's happened seven or more times.
Cam 04:54, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Of course it does, the United States would never harm a fly, let alone assassinate its political enemies. Never.
Rob  —The preceding  signed but undated. 
The citation for the quotation below is incorrect as are the facts presented. United States Special Forces personnel were NOT permitted to go to the crash site by the government of Panama.  The helicopter was turned around mid flight and returned to Ft. Gulick then home of 3/7th SFG.  I can however tell you that US News & World Report erroneously reported that US SF recovered the crash site.  I did not save the magazine.  The citation is "I was there at the time and have personal knowledge of this non-happening."     
"The crash site was located several days later, and the body of General Torrijos was recovered by a Special Forces team in the first few days of August.[3]  (Spanish) El País (Spain) article from August 15, 1981."
The article cited above states that Panama rejects the theory that sabotage was responsible for the plane crash.  Pilot error is their conclusion.  I along with CSTAR do not believe that to be the cause of the crash. Jogershok (talk) 19:32, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Torrijo's death 

message: I extremely doubt anything Perkins wrote about Torrijos, if you read his book he paints Torrijos like a paragon of virtue.  His description of Torrijos pretty much lost all credibility he had with me regarding Panama, or well, anything.  A lot of people (including me) believe it was Noriega who had the bomb planted, based in part on the accusations of Diaz Herrera to La Prensa.  Noriega said it was the CIA.  Cute.  Noriega was the CIA's guy.  But I don't think he did it on CIA orders.  Torrijos, while a dictator, could at least play the populist role, and while not the most subtle operator, he was far more palatable to our interests than Noriega.  Noriega (and Paredes) were the only ones that really stood to benefit from this, and it fits Noreiga far better.  Aapold (talk) 13:53, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: CIA or Noriega?

message: -US offered to return the Noriega documents to Panama in 1993
https://www.bu.edu/ilj/files/2014/05/Cox-THE-LOST-ARCHIVES-OF-NORIEGA.pdf
-A summary of Noriega's documents was publicly disclosed albeit heavily redacted; they do not appear to reference any assassination allegations despite revealing other incriminating info.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1991/09/04/noriega-defense-team-vows-to-detail-secret-us-deals/4e867106-d992-40c1-af3f-954f9ddb3377/  
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 221.124.40.227 (talk) 13:25, 19 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title: Recent cuts

message: Most people probably don't recall that Boris Martinez briefly was in charge before Torrijos deposed him.  I don't think he even has a wikipedia article. Aapold (talk) 19:09, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Preceded by Boris Martinez

message: The aircraft crashed during "severe" weather. I've been flying the Twin Otter half my life in the winter storms on the North Norwegian coast. I've flown it over the Norwegian sea outside the Lofoten islands of north Norway during a full storm. The twin Otter was the work horse of the Norwegian coast a thousand kilometers above the arctic circle and had two serious accidents (both due to human error) during its decades of service. So, Yeah. sure it crashed "during severe weather conditions"  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nunamiut (talk • contribs) 22:35, 11 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Thought and note for posterity... 

message: I added this note, thought I'd cite (sort of) and add a few notes that aren't really relevant to the article.   My grandfather (Manuel Celerin) in Panama was for a time a school inspector in various interior provinces, and on one notable occasion visited a school in Veraguas where Torrijos' father, a colombian immigrant named José María Torrijos, was supposed to be teaching.    He found the students in the school, but no teacher.  Inquiring, they told him to look in the local cantina, and he found him there, drunk.   When informed he was going to be fired, José Torrijos begged him to not do so, pleading on his knees, for the sake of his large family (12 children) that he supported.  My grandfather  relented, promising to return a few weeks later to check on his performance (he had to travel by horse to these locations).  He (my grandfather) was transferred to the province of Panama almost immediately after that and never got a chance to follow up. 
Omar Torrijos made a point later of visiting the town in Columbia where his father originally came from, and donated money for the construction of a school in his name.
Aapold (talk) 00:52, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Torrijos' Father (José María Torrijos Rada)

message: there are almost no sources, and Mitrokhins book shows him as a Soviet pawn.Tallicfan20 (talk) 04:47, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mitrokhin's book, plus no citations 

message: I felt as though information was lacking regarding Omar Torrijos. I feel more information is needed regarding his life than his death.
Tlshaman (talk) 17:59, 14 March 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Article update

message: :Torrijos died shortly after the inauguration of US President Ronald Reagan, just two months after Ecuadorian president Jaime Roldós died in strikingly similar circumstances. Like other Republicans when the canal treaty came before the U.S. Senate, Reagan alleged that Democratic U.S. president Jimmy Carter had "given away" a U.S. asset—the Panama Canal and the Canal Zone. In the 1976 Republican primaries, Reagan claimed regarding the canal: "We built it, we paid for it, it's ours, and we should tell Torrijos and company that we are going to keep it."[15]
:Antipathy within the Reagan administration can also be adduced from Torrijos's sympathy (and rumoured support) for Nicaragua's Sandinista National Liberation Front, whose popular revolution in mid-1979 had toppled the U.S.-backed Somoza dictatorship.
He didnt die "shortly" after Reagan's inauguration.  It was 6 months later.  The paragraphs seem to exist to give life to a US/Reagan angle on Torrijo's death. (Apparently over "revenge" for the Canal Treaty, which seems implausible.) In any case, I don't see how very much of this should be kept in the article.  Perhaps one sentence relating to fingerpointing in US' direction, but no more. 
Also, I don't see anything here (or online), regarding any investigation of the crash.  Typically, it would be pretty easy to determine, from the debris pattern, if a plane crashed intact or if it exploded mid-air.  Was there any official investigation?  I recently watched "The Dictators Playbook S01E04: Manuel Noriega" and it was claimed (without any references, unfortunately) that "foul play was ruled out." Albeit, I don't see how any independent body could have performed an investigation while Noriega was in complete power there.  Especially when Noriega might have actually orchestrated it himself: he had the means, opportunity, and a huge motive. --Petzl (talk) 21:03, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Speculations On Crash section: regarding Reagan; regarding crash itself. 

message: Yeye is a term to describe a preppy person who thinks of themselves as special because of affluence. Rabiblancos is more literally anybody who is light skinned and/or white. 73.7.106.236 (talk) 19:07, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rabiblancos and Yeye are not even remotely the same thing