Talk:Farsiwan

message: I removed this image since Parsiwans aren't really distinguished seperatly from the Tajiks by their appearance, but rather by religious sect. Also because not all Heratis are Farsiwan. The common consensus is that most of Herat is Tajik with a Shia (Farsiwan) minority. I'll keep it here. If you disagree please let me know and I'll place it back.
--Behnam 11:10, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Most original hertais (not migrants from elsewhere) are Shia and I no none that call themselves Tajiks. --Babakexorramdin 15:33, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

text: Actually there is more Sunnis in Herat than Shias. Besides, the term Tajiks is not exclusively for Sunnis, it is used for Farsi-speaking people east of Iran regardless of sect. Even Shia Farsi people in Iran can refer to themselves as Tajiks, for example Saadi Shirazi often calls himself Tajik in his poems. Farsiwan usually refers to the Shia Tajiks. The Shia Farsiwan are also ofcoarse Tajiks, (e.g. Saadi Shirazi, Latif Pedram, etc) --Behnam 20:36, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image of Herati traditional dance removed for now 

message: This article as of January 2008 stated a population of 900,000 Farsiwan without citation. However, the Encyc. Iranica gives a figure of 600,000. L. Dupree, "Afghanistan: (iv.) Ethnography", in Encyclopædia Iranica, Online Edition 2006, LINK.  Keeping in mind that the Encyc. Iranica article was written in 1982, and that a systematic census has not been held in the country since 1980, exact figures about the size and composition of the various ethnic groups are not available. BBC News - Afghan poll's ethnic battleground - October 6, 2004  Hence, 900,000 may be correct given 25 years of growth, or refugees leaving Herat for Iran or elsewhere may have stabilized that figure at 600,000 or even reduced it.  Because of this uncertainty, I have used the 600,000 figure for which we have a citation with a clarifying (est.1982). --Bejnar (talk) 18:26, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Robson, Barbara and Lipson,  Juliene (2002) "Chapter 5(B)- The People: The Tajiks and Other Dari-Speaking Groups" The Afghans - their history and culture Cultural Orientation Resource Center, Center for Applied Linguistics, Washington, D.C., [http://worldcat.org/oclc/56081073 OCLC 56081073, gives a figure of 500,000. --Bejnar (talk) 18:40, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Population

message: Request for comments on whether the Farsiwan of Heart and Farah provinces are distinct from other Tajiks?:
*Statement in favor of distinction: The Farsiwan of Heart and Farah provinces of Afghanistan and their neighbors immediately across the Iranian border have been identified by ethnologists as a separate group from the generally urbanized Tajiks of Afghanistan.  Unfortunately, the word Farsiwan means “Persian speaking” so it has also been used, non-ethnologically, to refer to Tajiks in general.  The Encyclopedia Iranica lists separate population figures for the Farsiwan and the Tajik, and points out that In the literature they are often mistakenly referred to as Tajik. The majority of the Farsiwan in Heart and Farah provinces are farmers, not urbanized. There are also linguistic differences.  The Farsiwan are Shiite, not Sunni as are most Tajiks in Afghanistan.  There are also linguistic differences.  --Bejnar (talk) 21:22, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Heratis are urbanized. Herat is a city. The Encyclopedia of Islam, which is more established than Iranica, states: RealAfghan112 (talk) 21:25, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Are Farsiwan distinct from other Tajiks?

message: I have re-reverted User:Bejnar's recent revert, because it was no improvement of the article. It took back the article to a weaker version, partially ignoring the attached sources. Tājik (talk) 16:36, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The word Farsiwan is used both narrowly and broadly.  However in most English language sources it is used narrowly.  Therefore the lead should express both usages. Please restore.  The version that Tajik is supporting is not balanced. --Bejnar (talk) 22:34, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  We can try to find a better intro. Except for the U.S. Library of Congress, I have not found any important source claiming anything else. First of all, "Farsiwan" is a Persian word and has a literal meaning: "Persian-speaker" - nothing more and nothing less. That information, too, has to be mentioned in the intro. Tājik (talk) 22:42, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: You need to look at more of the references, for example, most population figures for Afghanistan ethnic groups (as bad as they are) use "Farsiwan" in the restricted sence.  It is generally only Persian speakers who use it in the broad sence.  See also the old Army Handbook for Afghanistan.  --Bejnar (talk) 22:46, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  I know what you are saying. But the fact remains that in Persian - and that is the language from which the word is derived - it simply means "Persian-speaker". That's why I have written the original meaning of it in the lead, while explaining the general and specific meanings of it in the body of the text. Tājik (talk) 22:49, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: This is the English Wikipedia, not the Persian or Farsi. --Bejnar (talk) 19:13, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

text:  Bejnar, you blindly revert sources. If you want the specific meaning, then just rewrite the text, but do not delete sources that have actually nothing to do with the discussed topic. You have deleted a valid source and then put a "fact" tag into the text. what purpose does that have?! Tājik (talk) 23:47, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent edit 

message: The term "Dari" isn't used in this article. It should be added, and explained. Badagnani (talk) 04:21, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: The term is used in the article. See: The Farsiwan sometimes speak a dialect more akin to the Darī dialects of the Persian language, for example the dialect of Kabul,[10][11] as opposed to the standard Tehrānī dialect of Iran. Tājik (talk) 13:14, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Dari]] 

message: Surely, the "Farsiwans" (and the "Tajiks" too) can be understood in both broad or narrow senses. But let's talk about the most useful senses. Great information can be found in maps by M. Izady at http://gulf2000.columbia.edu/maps.shtml and much information can be inferred. Refer to these maps: 1) Afghanistan, Ethnic Groups (detailed), 2) Afghanistan, Religions (detailed), 3) Afghanistan, Languages (detailed), 4) Afghanistan Cultural and Historical Zones, and 5) Persian Language Distribution.
Parsiwans (in the narrow sense) are Persian speaking Imami Shia farmers or urbanites without any other ethnic or tribal affiliation. If Afghanistan didn't come to existence in the 18th century, these people would live in Iran and would be no different than other Persian speaking Iranians (or "Persians"). By the way, mind that Izady notes there is no "Persian ethnicity". So the Parsiwans are in fact Persian speaking Iranians in a cultural sense or "Persians".
The Parsiwans can be found in southwestern (Sistan) and western (Khurasan) Afghanistan, then in the plains of northern Afghanistan (Balkh) and in southeastern Afghanistan (Kabul, Logar, Ghazni and Kandahar areas).
In Bukhara in Uzbekistan, there live both Sunni Persian speaking Tajiks and Imami Shia Persian speaking "Ironis". These Ironis are another example of people that would be called Iranians or "Persians" if Bukhara would belong to Iran.
Tajiks have their own Tajik ethnicity. They live in northeastern Afghanistan (Badakhshan) and some adjacent areas in central Afghanistan and around and in Kabul. Tajiks are Sunni Muslims. 88.103.175.144 (talk) 23:22, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Farsiwans = Persian speaking Imami Shias outside without other ethnic affiliation  

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello I am a tajik from ghazni afghanistan, I have no idea why this page exists. It seems to be another one of the many misconceptions outsiders have regarding afghanistan. I was born and lived for 15 years in afghanistan, never did I hear that farsiwan was a distinct ethnic group, or did it only refer to shia persian speakers. I am from ghazni and i am a sunni, but I was still refered to as a farsiwan. Farsiwan is just the term pashtuns use for persian speakers, infact its the corruption of the persian words farsi zaban (persian speaker). If farsiwan just refers to shias in western afghanistan, then why are all tajiks in afghanistan also refered to as farsiwan, why are sunni tajiks in northern afghanistan, southern afghanistan called farsiwan. Encyclopedia iranica is not a legit source in my opion, it says tajiks only inhabit badakshan province, if thats the case then why are tajiks the second biggest group inside afghanistan (30-40%)?. 1DHNK1 (talk) 10:14, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Farsiwan is not a distinct ethnic group.