Talk:Grand Orient of the Netherlands

message: What makes this organization notable?  WP:ORG lays out the criteria needed:
:A company, corporation, organization, team, religion, group, product, or service is notable if it has been the subject of significant coverage in secondary sources. Such sources must be reliable, and independent of the subject. The depth of coverage of the subject by the source must be considered. If the depth of coverage is not substantial, then multiple independent sources should be cited to establish notability. Trivial or incidental coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not sufficient to establish notability. Once notability is established, primary sources may be used to add content.
:The "secondary sources" in the criterion include reliable published works in all forms, such as (for example) newspaper articles, books, television documentaries, and published reports by consumer watchdog organizations[1] except for the following:
:*Press releases; autobiographies; advertising for the company, corporation, organization, or group; and other works where the company, corporation, organization, or group talks about itself—whether published by the company, corporation, organization, or group itself, or re-printed by other people.[2] Material that is self-published, or published at the direction of the subject of the article, would be a primary source and falls under different policies. 
:*Works carrying merely trivial coverage; such as (for examples) newspaper articles that simply report meeting times or extended shopping hours, or the publications of telephone numbers, addresses, and directions in business directories.
The Guideline goes on to discuss Non-commercial organizations:
:Organizations are usually notable if the scope of activities are national or international in scale and information can be verified by sources that are reliable and independent of the organization. In other words, they satisfy the primary criterion above. Other criteria are:
:*Individual chapters of national and international organizations are usually not notable enough to warrant a separate article unless sufficient notability is established through reliable sources. However, chapter information may be included in list articles as long as only verifiable information is included. 
:*Organizations whose activities are local in scope are usually not notable unless verifiable information from reliable independent sources can be found.
:*The organization’s longevity, size of membership, or major achievements, or other factors specific to the organization may be considered. This list is not exhaustive and not conclusive.
:**Even though the parent organization may be notable, individual chapters of national and international organizations may not be notable enough to warrant a separate article.
:**Local chapter articles should start as a section of the parent organization article. If the parent article grows to the point where it may be split to a new article, and notability can be demonstrated using the  general notability guideline, then it can be split.  This should occur as a top down process. See ,
It does look as if the scope of activities are national in scale, but the article fails the second part of the criteria: information can be verified by sources that are reliable and independent of the organization. At the moment, the article is all but completely sourced by the organization's webpage (the single exception being the citation to the UGLE website that supports the statement that UGLE recongizes it... which I do not think is notable in itself, and can be challenged as not being fully independant of the organization.).  We need independant third party sources to establish notability here. Blueboar (talk) 12:55, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for looking into sourcing ...  One thing to be careful of... Masonry in the Netherlands is fragmented.  Be sure that sources are talking about the Grand ORIENT and not the Grand LODGE (which is a different, rival body). Blueboar (talk) 14:32, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notability? 

message: Have they often been members of the Royal Family like the English Grand Masters?  Questions like that I am very curious about.--JaredMithrandir (talk) 21:26, 7 January 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  I'd like to know who the Grand Master have been? 

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thread_title:  External links modified