Talk:List of enclaves and exclaves

message: I bashed this together out of Enclave and Exclave, removing repetitions.  I fully expect disagreement with some of my classifications, so go to it!  —Tamfang 05:09, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for doing the bashing.  Putting the lists in a separate article has been needed for some time. --Jonrock 22:28, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

text: No. Hope this helps. —Tamfang (talk) 00:25, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Organization 

message: This seems extremely dubious.  Under one of the main legal theories employed at the time of the U.S. Civil War, secession is illegal, so Louisiana never seceded, and thus Winn Parish remained part of Louisiana along with the rest of the state.  Under another of the main legal theories, states have the right to secede, as they are sovereign entities.  Counties, however, do not, so Winn Parish, under this view, remains a part of the sovereign state of Louisiana, and joins the Confederacy with it.  Note that the former theory was certainly under operation in counties in a similar situation - the northwestern counties of Virginia, which were, until 1863, recognized to be part of "Virginia," which was still in the union.  I think this example should be removed. john k 16:29, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If pre-existing sovereign status is necessary to secession, the Declaration of Independence is void.  I don't think any of the parties in 1861 would subscribe to such a theory, though Lincoln tried to have it both ways.  —Tamfang 17:27, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Winn Parish, Louisiana 

message: This might be an extreme example, but the headquarters of the United Nations, located in New York City, is considered international territory, but is completely surrounded by the rest of the city.  Anyone agree to adding this on the list?  --Geopgeop 13:01, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The land on which the headquarters is built is still under soverignty of the United States ; its extraterritorial status doesn't differ from regular embassies. — Poulpy 13:47, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[United Nations headquarters]]

message: Does anyone know if Roosevelt Campobello International Park qualifies as an en/exclave?
:I do not think it is. While both countries run the park, I doubt that Canadian sovereignty was given up when the park was started. (Shocktm | Talk  | contribs.) 03:31, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Roosevelt Campobello International Park]]

message: Rincón de Anchuras is part of the spanish province of Ciudad Real, that is between the provinces of Toledo and Badajoz:
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:Note that this fact (also requested in Section 17 below) had been shown in the list at some time much prior to this date.
:Jeff in CA 18:47, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Someone modify it: Rincón de Anchuras 

message: Is Omaha, Nebraska Airport a sub-national en/exclave since it appears you need to go through Iowa to get there?
:No it is not. You can get to the airport form the rest of Nebraska without going thru Carter Lake, Iowa - The most convenient way may be thru there, but it is not the only way. Carter Lake, Iowa is listed here  under Subnational "practical" enclaves and exclaves. (Shocktm | Talk  | contribs.) 03:30, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Omaha Airport]]

message: Found a couple, as listed. Accessed via Multimap. Can anyone do a link? I haven't got a clue about computing, so Unsure how to do that. There also more 'practicals' in Wales, but I haven't got round to doing them. These are mainly farms near the Dee in North Wales. I think Scottish and Welsh enclaves are important for this article, as they are separate countries within the United Kingdom. There are plenty more in English and Scottish local government, too. RAYMI.
---------------------
:In the list of pene-exclaves and inaccessible districts, the following items, which were added quite some time ago, appear for Wales:
:* Wales:
:** In Flintshire, on the Dee estuary, there are several bits of marshland that are separated from other bits of Wales.
:** There is also a small area of land south of Wyastone Leys which is inaccessible from any other area of Wales directly by road, being separated by land and the River Wye.
:** There are several small areas north of the village of Part-Y-Seal are inaccessible from Wales directly, these include one farm, two river banks and a small island in the River Wye.
:** National rail services connecting north and south Wales must pass through England.
:This seems like a reasonable sample to address what had been proposed for the "practicals" in Wales.
:Jeff in CA 00:48, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  English/Scottish practical enclaves 

message: Should the headquarters of Nike recieve any mention?  They are completely surrounded by the Beaverton, Oregon, but remain outside the city. --Max  Talk [ (add)] 04:46, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I guess that, after all this time, not receiving an answer constitutes the answer .  Jeff in CA 18:20, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nike 

message: is not an exclave, but is connected to San Diego proper by a thin strip of territory in San Diego Bay. Deleting. Hmmm...I guess I should have pasted into the Practical section. Done.
:San Ysidro and Imperial Beach are connected with the main body of the City of San Diego by a peninsula that has the Silver Strand (San Diego), the former Coronado Island/North Island, and the San Diego-Coronado Bridge over San Diego Bay. Coronado Island and North Island are no more because sand dredged from the bottom of the bay was used to enlarge tthem and to connected them with dry land via the peninsula to the south. The only question that remains is this one: Does the U.S. Navy's Naval Amphibious Base Coronado interrupt this connection? I doubt that it because there is a public highway across the base.47.215.183.159 (talk) 21:32, 21 September 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  San Ysidro, California 

message: These two countries regard their (otherwise unrecognized) territories as PROVINCES of their respective nations, rather than outlying territories. Despite the fact that these are unrecognized by any other nation, these, I believe should be listed in the exclave section, with an accompanying note. I am aware of all other nations' Antarctic claims, these differ in an EXCLAVE sense, as they are not 'provinces', but overseas territories, in the respective opinions of other claimants. The aforementioned South American nations' governments regard their claimed Antarctic to be inherent parts of their states. I am also aware they overlap......... RAYMI 80.68.39.212 10:25, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Argentine/ Chilean Antarctic Territories. 

message: Shocktm has stated that "Island do not count as exclaves unless they are in the territorial water of another country."  It seems to me that this would only preclude them from being enclaves, but they could still be exclaves.  My thinking on adding Guadeloupe, Martinique, and Réunion was that their territorial waters were not contiguous with the rest of France.  The same is true for French Guiana.  I wanted to get consensus before I made any additional changes. --Lasunncty 17:28, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Island by there very nature are exclaves and general are not listed. Many countries have islands that are outside of the 12 nm Territorial waters limit or even outside the 200 nm Exclusive Economic Zone limit. If you just count the entities outside the EEZ limit you would need to add Hawaii, Easter Island, Canaries, Azores, Bornholm, Galapagos, etc. - at least two dozen places by my quick counting. Figuring out all of them would be difficult (one would have to place a standard, which is always debatable) and could be considered WP:OR as I do not see a list out there that lists them. -- (Shocktm | Talk  | contribs.) 00:13, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Islands by their very nature, in general, are neither enclaves nor exclaves. An enclave is a territory entirely surrounded by another territory.  An exclave is a territory legally or politically attached to a main territory with which it is not physically contiguous because of surrounding alien territory.  Therefore, the exception for an island would be, as stated above, an island surrounded entirely by the territorial water of another country (example: Malawi islands).  None of the cited examples (Hawaii, Easter Island, Canaries, Azores, Bornholm, Galapagos) is surrounded entirely by the territorial water of another country.  On the contrary, they are surrounded entirely by their own territorial water.  (Note that islands divided between two or more sovereign entities are pene-exclaves.) Jeff in CA 16:32, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Put another way, in answer to Lasunncty, for these cases to be exclaves, their territorial waters would need to be completely surrounded by the territorial waters of one or more other countries, rather than international waters.   Jeff in CA 18:26, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  French [[overseas department]]s 

message: You have other here: 
Anchuras is part of the spanish province of Ciudad Real (At its northwest), situated between the provinces of Badajoz and Toledo.
-----------------------
:Note that this fact (also requested in Section 9 above) had been shown in the list at some time much prior to this date.
:Jeff in CA 18:45, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anchuras, Spain 

message: In "Inaccessible Districts" Cambodia's Prasat Preah Vihear should be included. It can only be approached through Thailand. The World Court disallowed Thailand's claim in 1957. Thailand was so sure it would win the case that it allowed ownership go to arbitration rather than remain as disputed territory.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.136.71.55 (talk) 11:58, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Added as of this date. Jeff in CA 19:14, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Prasat Preah Vihear 

message: A section of the New York City, NY, USA Borough of Manhattan (and, thus New York County), that was separated from the island by the construction of a canal, and later joined with the Bronx Peninsula. Now even though it is physically attached to the Bronx and uses the Bronx' divisions of the NYPD and FDNY and has a Bronx area code and postal Zip code, it is still, technically, considered part of Manhattan.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.197.237.135 (talk) 22:59, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Marble Hill, Manhattan]] 

message: The listing of enclaves and exclaves (and especially pene-enclaves and pene-exclaves) at a subnational level has gotten out of hand.  There are too many of these for Wikipedia to have an exhaustive list.  I think I could find half a dozen more just in Los Angeles County.  The Kentucky Bend is notable.  Nothing else within the USA rates inclusion in this article, save broad statements about Indian reservations and such.     Randall Bart    Talk   06:52, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Local enclaves and exclaves 

message: Dubrovnik is listed as both an enclave and pene-enclave. It can be argued whether it is a proper pene-enclave or not, but it is obvious - even from the text of its "enclave" listing - that it is not an enclave. (It borders two foreign states and a sea.) So I'm removing it from the enclave list.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.155.151.233 (talk) 19:52, 5 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dubrovnik 

message: Would a section on fictional 'claves be worthwhile?  I have in mind Passport to Pimlico and The Diamond Age. —Tamfang (talk) 04:39, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  'claves in fiction 

message: *"Close to Narvik  in Norway, a road enters Swedish territory. It does not connect with any other Swedish  road before it enters Norwegian land once more."
Since the road is linked with other Norwegian roads, this seems more like a territorial dispute to me... KingM (talk) 07:55, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Have you evidence that Norway claims the land around the road? If not, it's not a dispute. —Tamfang (talk) 20:58, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Never heard of such a dispute. After all there are no border checkpoints between Norway and Sweden so it really does not matter. As a matter of fact there was once a small Swedish village (I do not remember the name) which was only accessable from the Norwegian side of the border. It was the only place in Sweden where road traffic at that time flow on the right side. I think it was connected with the Swedish road network shortly before the switch-over to right-side driving in 1967. But they did not have to make two switch-overs. --Muniswede (talk) 21:21, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Narvik 

message: By the definiton provided in the lede of this article both Liberty and Ellis Island are exclaves/enclaves of NY in NJ. Are they somehow different from the 1st entry on the page? (below) One is surrouned by territorial waters, while the other surrounded by territorial land. As now written it would be correct, or is there some aspect that would make the statement untrue? 
* Argentina — Isla Martín García () is surrounded by Uruguayan territorial waters in the Río de la Plata. In addition, the Argentine islands of Apipé () and Entre Ríos are surrounded by Paraguayan territorial waters in the Paraná River, as are some small islets.
:No, they do not differ from this or any other entry on the list.  You notice that in this entry for example, It does not begin with "Argentina-Uruguay/Paraguay" or something similar.  The pieces of land here belong to Argentina, so only Argentina is used for the beginning of this entry.  In the same way, Liberty Island and the original portion of Ellis Island belong to New York, so only New York was listed.  The description that follows is where the rest of the information gets placed.  By rewording the entire entry, you have removed the link with the map and the information about the counties (higher-level administrative divisions than cities).  If you want to add the information about the cities, that is fine, but do not remove the other information that is already there.  --Lasunncty (talk) 07:50, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Liberty Island and Ellis Island

message: They're extraterritorial.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.68.197.211 (talk) 23:42, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Embassies are not temporary exclaves 

message: I'm scrolling through topo maps of the Mississippi (on mapper.acme.com) looking for places anomalies in State boundaries.  The northernmost one I've found is in Madison County, Illinois, just above the Missouri confluence.  Dunno if that's worth mentioning. —Tamfang (talk) 21:11, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  The meandering Muddy 

message: where would Gitmo fit in the definision of enclave/exclave if at all? Its seems to be an extra territory, but I have seen some maps reference it like an enclave like Alaska. Need some clarification, and were would other overseas territories/claims of the USA and other nations fit?--71.236.0.245 (talk) 07:36, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: See Guantanamo Bay Naval Base.  It's a "perpetual lease".  Cuba remains the theoretical sovereign, though US has jurisdiction. —Tamfang (talk) 02:40, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Guantanamo Bay

message: Would Grand Isle be considered an exclave of Jefferson Parish?  Grand Isle is located across Barataria Bay, which I'm guessing would be considered to be state waters.  The only access to Grand Isle via land is through Lafourche Parish. Gregdanielsonjr (talk) 15:40, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The USGS topo map doesn't show a hole in the county, and I've never heard of a piece of a State (other than Alaska) that isn't jurisdictionally part of some county. —Tamfang (talk) 07:52, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  Er, county-equivalent. —Tamfang (talk) 07:59, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

text: I suppose it would arguably be one, although the state waters thing is questionable. Chipmunkdavis (talk) 07:56, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: By the "theory of bridges" discussed in Section 42 below, Grand Isle would be a pene-exclave of Jefferson Parish.  Jeff in CA 18:55, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Grand Isle, Louisiana]] 

message: The definitions need to be improved. There is no minimum or maximum size for an enclave or exclave. If the definition is met that is all that is needed.  Nipsonanomhmata  (Talk) 11:51, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Size has nothing to do with it. Do you have proof that these villages are not part of the TRNC? That's what an enclave would need. Chipmunkdavis (talk) 12:08, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: They are ethnically not a part of the TRNC. Moreover, the "exclave" is politically connected to the Republic of Cyprus (by voting) and by funding. The TRNC does not fund the schools in Rizokarpasso. Nor did it pay for the electricity for Rizokarpasso (for the majority of the time since 1974).  Nipsonanomhmata  (Talk) 14:16, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Ethnicity has little to do with modern states. In addition, voting does not make something an exclave, neither do political connections or funding. Embassies are run through the politics of foreign governments, but they are not exclaves. An exclave is a defined area which is jurisdictionally part of a territory it is not connected to, such as the Cypriot towns in Dhekelia. These greek villages are not exclaves by any POV, the TRNC considers them to be full parts of the state, even if the inhabitants are not granted full citizen rights. Cyprus considers them to be a full part of Cyprus, along with the whole TRNC, and therefore not exclaves. Chipmunkdavis (talk) 14:21, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: If they are not enclaved or exclaved ... why are they called "The Enclaved". That is what they have been known as since 1974.  Nipsonanomhmata  (Talk) 13:35, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I reckon it's a poetic term based on the idea of an enclave, as an analogy. Chipmunkdavis (talk) 14:59, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Definitions of enclave and exclave

message: Added June 12:
** In West Springfield, Massachusetts, there are 5 exclaves of the other New England States (Connecticut, Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, and Vermont) for the Avenue of the States portion of the Big E fairgrounds. This is part of the 6 State Fair which all New England states contribute. The land underneath each of the buildings representing the states belongs to the state in question. You can walk to each of the six state buildings and purchase, among other things, lottery tickets from each state.
As in some other cases, the question must be raised: do the other states have jurisdiction over these patches, or only property rights? The latter seems more likely, so I'll remove it pending documentation. —Tamfang (talk) 18:43, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: According to The Big E, the other states do police these patches during the fair. I've rewritten the paragraph rather than remove it. —Tamfang (talk) 18:47, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  These are definitely not enclaves; at best, they are fantasy exclaves.  If one were to consider these as exclaves, then analogously, on presidential inauguration days in Washington D.C., Pennsylvania Avenue would consist of exclaves of about 10 different states.  You could even extend this concept to college football games where the coach of an opposing out-of-state team is accompanied by members of the state police of that school's state; the sideline area of one team would be an exclave (and an enclave). Jeff in CA 15:40, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  New England fairgrounds 

message: Although "Akureyri municipality now controls the islands of Hrísey (as of 2004) and Grímsey (as of 2009)," and "although these two islands are roughly 35 km and 95 km from the city," they are in no way enclaves, exclaves, pene-enclaves or pene-exclaves. They are merely distant islands and therefore inaccessible. But so are thousands of islands around the globe that are not listed here.  
Similar to Hrísey and Grímsey, other divisions of Iceland control the islands of Heimaey, Hjörsey, Brokey, Flatey in Skjálfandi, Flatey in Breiðafjörður, Æðey, Málmey, Papey, Viðey, Surtsey, Vigur, Elliðaey, Bjarnarey, Engey, Álsey, Langey, Suðurey, Drangey, Eldey, Hellisey, Kolbeinsey, Geirfuglasker, Hvalbakur, Lundey, Brandur, Súlnasker, Geldungur, Hani, Hæna, Hrauney and Grasleysa, although these islands too are away from their main divisions.
Similar examples in other countries:
* Hawaii controls 132 islands in the Hawaiian Chain.
* Alaska controls the Aleutian Islands and Little Diomede Island.
* Florida controls the Keys and the Dry Tortugas.
* North Carolina controls the Outer Banks.
* Massachusetts controls Martha's Vineyard.
* Washington state controls the San Juan Islands.
* California controls the Catalina Islands and the Farallons.
* Chile controls Easter Island.
* Ecuador controls the Galapagos.
* Australia controls Tasmania. 
* France and the Kingdom of the Netherlands control undivided islands in the Caribbean that are integral French and Dutch municipalities.
* Denmark controls Greenland and the Faeroes.
* Greece controls hundreds of Mediterranean islands.
Are any of these islands pene-exclaves?  The answer is NO.  If Hrísey and Grímsey qualify, then we also need to list all these and many, many, many more. (Hey, Indonesia!)
Jeff in CA 08:18, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Iceland 

message: Lasunncty is absolutely correct in pointing out in an edit that  the following enclaves are not enclaved by the subdivisions that surround them, and, therefore, those subdivisions should not be listed in the "Enclaved by" column.  However, so that this information is not lost, I have stowed it here.
Enclave              	Enclaved by     	Surrounding subdivisions
Artchvašen (Bashkend)	                	Tovuz and Gadabay Districts
Roetgener Wald       	(Liège province)	Raeren and Eupen municipalities
Mützenich            	(Liège province)	Eupen and Waimes municipalities
Ruitzhof             	(Liège province)	Waimes and  Bütgenbach municipalities
Jeff in CA 14:12, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Surrounding subdivisions 

message: The enclave near El Piro is shown by Bing Maps as bordering both Chiriquí and Veraguas Provinces.  However, maps at Wikimedia Commons show El Piro as a definite enclave within Veraguas (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2a/Panama_-_Ngobe_Bugle_-_Muna.svg) because of a boundary defined by a stream. Bing does not assign a border line to the stream.  Note that on the Bing aerial view, one can readily see and follow the stream boundary that is indicated in the svg map. It barely avoids the border with Chiriquí Province, so I think this is Bing's miss. 
Jeff in CA 03:21, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Subnational enclave in Panama near El Piro 

message: I know this is extremely controversial, but shouldn't Crimea be added to the list of "Potential exclaves pending international resolution" ?
2A02:1205:5029:30A0:A857:54FA:D26E:9DA4 (talk) 19:32, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Crimea 

message: The above is listed as both an exclave and a penne exclave. It can't be both. Which is it? I reviewed Google Maps and if Google Maps is correct, Jungholz is definitely not an exclave. Could we try to bottom this out? User: Jeff in CA reverted my removal of Jungholz from the list of exclaves. Frenchmalawi (talk) 13:13, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: I would add that my remarks above do not have anything to do with "quadrapoints" or some concept like that. I plainly state that according to Google maps there is a physical corridor of land connecting Jungholz with the rest of Austria and on that basis it is not an Exclave. My other point is als that it can't be both an Exclave and a Penne Exclave. Is there indeed a corridor of land connecting it to the rest of Austria? If so, it can't be an exclave.Frenchmalawi (talk) 13:16, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: At the micro-level, Google Maps of international borders are inaccurate.  It really seems as though someone re-created the borders on Google's aerial photos by using a light-pen to make dots while looking at a normal map, and then connecting the dots with line segments (e.g., see the Google line in the Rainy River between Minnesota and Ontario – it bisects many islands when in fact the real border avoids all islands).  In a section of Google's Rio Grande mapping, there are even tiny pink dots that were made manually that show up at a certain level of zooming-in on the international border. In the case of Jungholz, Wikipedia references a 1958 topo map that indicates the Sorgschrofen summit by a small dotted-circle beneath which the map is "whited-out." This little section of the whited-out border happens to correspond to the gap that appears in the Google map at the mountain's summit.  One can readily view the discrepancy by finding Jungholz on http://mapper.acme.com and comparing "Map" (Google) to "Mapnik" and "NexRad."  In addition, the treatises by Whyte and Vinokurov are unwavering on this.   Jeff in CA (talk) 13:35, 4 May 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Of course, one could also go to the actually boundary cross, and also look at the historical maps and such, with the help of the site we link to at Jungholz: http://jungholz.enclaves.org/. The inaccuracies and guesses in some maps can be ignored when there is an actual border treaty to refer to. --jpgordon::==( o ) 14:35, 4 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Jungholz]], [[Austria]] 

message: Alaska seems to be an exclave.  if Oman's Musandam is an exclave, then surely Alaska is too.  both are bordered only bordered by foreign nations and the ocean.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:18A:8100:9BDA:A8AD:5E88:B20A:8C53 (talk) 18:07, 16 August 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: What you describe is a pene-enclave, land that borders one foreign territory and its own unsurrounded territorial waters. Both Alaska and Musandam are listed in the section on pene-enclaves. Jeff in CA (talk) 03:21, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: This list was recently changed to separate the concept of the "semi-enclave" from the section on "pene-enclave," with which it had been co-mingled. Both Alaska and Musandam are, in fact, non-sovereign semi-enclaves. See Talk:Enclave and exclave.Jeff in CA (talk) 02:27, 12 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  what about Alaska? 

message: The following is copied from Talk:Beecroft_Peninsula:
"Because of the association with the nearby Jervis Bay Territory and because it is occupied by the Navy, there is sometimes the mistaken belief that the southern strip of the peninsula is a part of the ACT or a separate Commonwealth territory. Therefore, I have removed the entry regarding the Beecroft Peninsula from this list.Jeff in CA (talk) 01:55, 12 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Confusion between Australian Commonwealth Territory and Commonwealth Land 

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replies: text: The earth-info.nga.mil link is now at geonames.nga.mil.  The bibbmonroebattle.com link still does not work (archive gives an error).  The viewer.nationalmap.gov link was not actually dead.  The transport.ie link is now at irishstatutebook.ie.  --Lasunncty (talk) 01:09, 25 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I have here a tourist map of Sicily, which shows at least two provincial enclaves:
* Resuttano, which I added because its article and that of its province mention its exclave status.
* San Biagio (far from San Biagio Platani), , apparently an exclave of Palermo, about which I can find no information.
—Tamfang (talk) 18:23, 13 October 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  San Biagio 

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replies: text: I was able to update some of the links to avoid using the archives. --Lasunncty (talk) 09:35, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 4 external links on List of enclaves and exclaves. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130721153434/http://www.asil.org/pdfs/insights/insight130115.pdf to http://www.asil.org/pdfs/insights/insight130115.pdf
*Added  tag to http://topre.ru/publication/621.html
*Added archive https://archive.is/20130911105701/http://www.macon.com/2013/09/10/2656658/georgia-justices-consider-macon.html to http://www.macon.com/2013/09/10/2656658/georgia-justices-consider-macon.html
*Added  tag to http://www.historicmapworks.com/Map/US/501978/Hutchinson+Township%2C+Page+069/Rolette+County+1910/North%20Dakota
*Added  tag to http://forum.politik.de/forum/archive/index.php/t-72855.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110928052457/http://politicom.moldova.org/news/moldovaukraine-relations-interview-with-andrei-popov-205196-eng.html to http://politicom.moldova.org/news/moldovaukraine-relations-interview-with-andrei-popov-205196-eng.html
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replies: text: I found updated links for some of these.  For the politik.de link I found a possible alternative here, although this seems to be quoting another source, so I didn't include it.  --Lasunncty (talk) 08:25, 6 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The Lado Enclave, listed among the historical enclaves and exclaves, wasn't an enclave because it bordered more than one country (Egyptian Sudan, Uganda and Congo Free State); it wasn't an exclave because it bordered with its mainland (Congo Free State). It was just an extension of the mainland, directly attached to it. Maps prove it, please remove Lado Enclave from the section. Thank you.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pcr land (talk • contribs) 17:27, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lado Enclave not an enclave nor exclave 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 10 external links on List of enclaves and exclaves. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20131014182310/http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/124/16973.pdf to http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/124/16973.pdf
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140718023835/http://www.wdbj7.com/news/local/three-voters-in-radford-will-cost-montgomery-county-thousands-of-dollars/26851698 to http://www.wdbj7.com/news/local/three-voters-in-radford-will-cost-montgomery-county-thousands-of-dollars/26851698
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replies: text: I found updated links for many of these.  --Lasunncty (talk) 16:11, 26 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: Although this isn't a major edit, I don't want to make cruft, so I thought I'd gain consensus first.
What would these examples count as using the list which shows the 5 different types:
* East Moor, Worsley, Salford (a street only accessible via Bridgwater Road, Tyldesley in Metropolitan Borough of Wigan - housing estate built circa 1992) (It's on Street View, but not sure if this is original research to add to the list.
* Parts of Ince-in-Makerfield that were only accessible via Ashton-in-Makerfield (relying on a now-deleted Geocities site that is no longer online, not even the Internat Archive, would this be original research as a source? I can't find much about these).
* A road in Warrington (think it was Common Road) that you have to go through St. Helens to get to (on the road to Newton-le-Willows)
* A street in City of Manchester (Winterford Road) which has streetlighting lit by bordering City of Salford (highway through another's territory possibly?).
I wasn't sure what qualified so am asking here. --Chelston-temp-1 (talk) 17:54, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I strongly doubt that these examples meet the list criteria for this article (note that "highway through another's territory" is not a category included in this list). It appears that your angle is that these roads and streets are inaccessible areas. However, what commonly makes an area inaccessible is precisely the lack of roads. Finally, none of these (as you have described them) appears to be completely surrounded by another administratively equivalent area or areas, so none is an en/exclave. Jeff in CA (talk) 12:22, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  What would these examples qualfiy as? (Enclaves that are not exclaves, enclaves that are also exclaves etc.) - need to check first. 

message: The description of the condominium waters of the Gulf of Fonseca might be easier to grasp if the "eastern" and "western" sections were described instead as "inner" and "outer". Thus:  —Tamfang (talk) 22:16, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Good suggestion. I have made the change. Jeff in CA (talk) 22:28, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gulf of Fonseca 

message: Here's a funny one.  Dover Street is entirely in Oakland, California, though it appears that the houses on its west side are in Berkeley.  Dover Street is crossed by Fairview Street.  The block of Fairview east of Dover is one-way eastbound.  So you can leave Dover Street to the east without leaving Oakland, but to enter Dover Street you have to come in from the west through Berkeley.  (I'm getting this information from OpenStreetMap; can someone confirm in person?) —Tamfang (talk) 23:01, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  hemi-pen-exclave 

message: ----Bancki (talk) 12:06, 25 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Xàtiva]], València, Spain 

message: "the westernmost section of the city of Allentown is a pene-en(ex)clave connected at a quadripoint"
1) I'm not really finding this quadripoint, but my eyes aren't the best ever. 
2) What I quoted just seems kind of sloppy. What is a "pene-en(ex)clave? Is there some other way to put it? YellowAries2010 (talk) 04:29, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Using the source referenced for that entry, the quadripoint is not visible unless you enable "Incorporated Place" under "Governmental Unit Boundaries" > "Features" in the layer list and zoom way in.  As for the definition you're asking about, see the top of that section.  --Lasunncty (talk) 09:52, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Allentown 

message: Accompong is an autonoumous state since 1739.http://www.jnht.com/site_accompong.php
Since 2009, they have an elected Head of State https://www.accompong-gov.org/accompong-head-of-state and 2016 their own Monetary Authorityhttps://www.accompong-gov.org/bank-of-accompong.
They also house the Headquarters for Economic 6th Region of the African Union, as recognized by the African Union ambassador to the USA.https://www.accompong-gov.org/maroon-legacy
Spiddyock (talk) 14:00, 13 January 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Accompong 

message: I could not verify the new en/exclaves you added for Virginia.  Do you have a source?  --Lasunncty (talk) 05:08, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Virginia en/exclaves 

message: Regarding your recent edits, I'd like to share my opinion as to why I think the previous version was already correct.  Because of the border between Baganuur and Khentii Province, Ulaanbaatar as a whole should not be considered an enclave of Töv Province.  I think Central Ulaanbaatar and Bagakhangai should remain in the "enclaves that are also exclaves" section because they are portions of the whole.  Similar examples of this in the table include Minsk, Bremen, and Tashkent.  --Lasunncty (talk) 06:09, 10 October 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I apologize, I misread the history.  Thanks for your response.   I kept your addition of Baganuur but restored central Ulaanbaatar to where it was.  --Lasunncty (talk) 04:08, 11 October 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ulaanbaatar 

message: In Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada, the town of Petty Harbour–Maddox Cove (surrounded by St. John’s and having a seacoast) is one of the few entries in the semi-enclave section, which focuses on the national level. The similarly positioned city of Santa Monica, California (surrounded by Los Angeles and having a seacoast) is in the pene-enclave section. There may be other similar examples. What are some thoughts on the classification of these municipalities? Jeff in CA (talk) 20:14, 6 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Another similar example, which an editor just moved to the semi-exclave section, is an exclave of Tumaco in Colombia, named San Juan de la Costa, between the Pacific Ocean and the municipalities of Francisco Pizarro and Mosquera. Jeff in CA (talk) 02:18, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I attempt to resolve this by moving Santa Monica to the subnational semi-enclave section to be along-side Petty Harbour–Maddox Cove. On the other hand, I removed the exclaves within Colombia, Indonesia, and Isle of Man that were listed in the subnational semi-exclave section and placed them in the pene-enclave section. (Two of the Indonesia exclaves were already listed there as pene-enclaves.) There are numerous subnational pene-exclaves with sea access that are currently and exclusively categorized as pene-exclaves and not as semi-exclaves. Jeff in CA (talk) 03:39, 21 August 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sub-national semi-enclave vs. pene-enclave? 

message: It shouldn’t be in semi-enclaves since a semi-enclave does not mean “part of a country separated from the rest of a country” Masterball2 (talk) 05:38, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that’s exactly what other semi-enclaves listed in “Non-sovereign semi-enclaves” along with Alaska are. They all have unsurrounded sea territory.Jeff in CA (talk) 20:04, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alaska 

message: Would the Dominion of Newfoundland count as an exclave of Canada during the time if it being a dependent territory? CommandGenius1 (talk) 23:02, 1 February 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: If it shared a border with Canada, then no. Jeff in CA (talk) 00:50, 2 February 2023 (UTC)

text: What about it leads you to suggest it was? —Tamfang (talk) 02:38, 25 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dominion of Newfoundland 

message: Not sure if OpenStreetMap counts as a reliable source, but I have discovered these exclaves/enclaves:
* Pleckgate Road, in Ribble Valley is only accessible via a road in the Blackburn with Darwen district and entirely inaccessible via the rest of the borough of Ribble Valley - https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/53.77336/-2.48520
* Part of Wiggins Lane (named Berry House Road) is a part of Scarisbrick parish which is only accessible via Burscough or Rufford and entirely inaccessible from the rest of the Scarisbrick parish - https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/53.63700/-2.87401, https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/53.63502/-2.87169 and https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/8224286#map=14/53.6357/-2.8767
* East Moor in Worsley, Salford is only accessible via Mosley Common, Tyldesley, Metropolitan Borough of Wigan = https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/53.50918/-2.42168 and https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/146657#map=16/53.5101/-2.4213
I do not know if these meet the criteria for reliable sources, or what to classify them as - if a more expert editor could help me, it is appreciated. SCXV1986 (talk) 10:33, 29 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  What enclaves / exclaves would these count as? 

message: Reverted:
* 
As far as I can tell from OpenStreetMap, neither Viesca (which is east of Torreón) nor Tlahualilo surrounds anything. —Tamfang (talk) 02:37, 25 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: The part about being surrounded is not correct, but Torreón does appear to have an exclave: .  --Lasunncty (talk) 11:27, 26 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Surrounded by both Viesca and Tlahualilo, although I'm not sure whether that's very interesting given anything without a coast is surrounded by some other land areas. CMD (talk) 12:02, 26 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Tlahualilo does not even share a border with Torreón, so I just cut that info out rather than list the three or so other municipalities that do.  --Lasunncty (talk) 08:07, 27 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Torreón 

message: So in this article it states: "Therefore, Vinokurov applies a quantitative principle: the land boundary must be longer than the coastline."
But we have a problem here. Coasts are fractals, therefore all coasts have an infinite length. While land borders are typically well defined and do have a set length, they will always be less than the coastline because the true length of any coastline is infinite. Coastline paradox.
We need a better definition for semi-exclaves because this definition does not work. Once we have a working definition it would be nice to put the definition of all of these terms at the top of the page in a separate section for easy reference. Stidmatt (talk) 20:47, 3 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Coastline paradox