Talk:Pete Doherty/Archive 1

message: This article appears to contain a huge amount of material and information which is not verifiable according to the guidelines set out by wikipedia. I think this article needs some sort of cleanup/sift through to remove all information which isn't referenced accurately. I'll happily take on this task when I have sufficient time (may not be for a few weeks), unless there are any objections? At present much of this article reads more like an internet forum than an encyclopedia article. Super Ted 13:44, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have now extended the biography considerably and implemented a referencing system. It would be useful if any new additional material added is referenced and if assistance could be provided referencing existing material that is currently unreferenced that would be great. Super Ted 17:46, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources and referencing 

message: This is a good article - clearly written by someone who knows a fair bit about Doherty - but the tone is not quite right for an encyclopedia entry. It's a bit adulatory (which is fine - nothing wrong with enthusiasm!), but it would be more credible if it was more objective. Also, some discussion of recent press coverage of Doherty's relationship with Kate Moss, and his ongoing drug problems, would be interesting. Rayray 16:27, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: How about making the Controversy and Arrests section into some form of table or at least some form of organised layout? If not a lot of the events need to be rewritten to make more grammatical sense. I've already changed one but felt I should maybe get a group consensus before embarking on the rest. Any objections? Super Ted 12:35, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I split up arrests and controversy and tried to re-write the arrests section so that it was slightly more narrative and less of a cumbersome list.  I also added skeleton sections on his time in Babyshambles and the Libertines.  The arrest section still needs work, though.  Should we list all of them or not?  I appreciate the need for a comprehensive list somewhere, but I think it ruins this particular article and should be drastically pruned. OneVeryBadMan 07:31, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Excellent job! Thanks for helping out. I've just split the arrests and controversy sections you created into the years the dates fell under. I agree that it still needs pruning drastically. Perhaps a seperate article could exist for all his arrests etc, not sure if thats in keeping with the ideals of wikipedia though :S What do you think? Super Ted 15:37, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

text: NB: Just had another look at the article and reformatted the sections. Think it looks alright now actually. Any comments? Super Ted 20:39, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

text: I'm amazed that reformatting can make such a difference. It's dramatically better. OneVeryBadMan 03:43, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Wow. It's amazing what some ppl can do in 3 weeks. Nice... feel kinda bad for not helping out; i posted the cleanup tag and the promptly forgot about it. whoops.  Soulchild 10:29, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Cheers buddy, don't worry not being around. Wouldn't mind some help with bulking the article up a bit now tho. Eventually, I'd love to see it reach Featured Article status but that could be a long way off yet. Think we could do with adding more on his prior relationships. Just realised there are some glaring holes in his biography, such as his child, his prior relationships etc. There's not so much information around on the net about that kinda thing I don't think, but I'll do my best. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Any other suggestions? Super Ted 13:23, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've started a Personal Life section for his child and one of his prior relationship. He may have had more that I don't know of; sifting through mounds and mounds of tabloids to find proper information can get a bit dreary after awhile. That said, there isn't much, so if anything knows anything more then go ahead. As for other suggestions, I suppose we could add something about his intellect. The Rolling Stone article touches on this, and I'd add it on but unfortunately I've wandered back onto this page in the middle of an exam period so at the moment I have to prioritise. If someone else could do it I'd be grateful. Soulchild 22:11, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup? 

message: How do the ridiculous British libel laws apply to Wikipedia? As an American, I don't feel particularly compelled to restepc them. In any event, pop stars and other irritations are common fodder for gossip columnists and whoever else and I don't think we ought to worry about libel, just accuracy or veracity or whatever you want to call it. Kate Moss has unbelievably horrible taste in men, and why does a guy so scrawny and tiny get into fistfights? It's not rational. Is there a Wikipedia standard on how much blathering and speculation we should include about pop stars and models and famous goons? I don't suppose we have a shortage of space.
Typical bloody American.
:Yeah, what the fuck are you wittering on about? If we did have a shortage of space, you're mindless, boring ramblings would would the first to go. You know this is a universal site? Just because you don't respect (or more likely understand) British laws doesn't mean they shouldn't be on here. Bloody yank, (yerr, mutter mutter) with yer hamburgers and yer sidewalks and yer inflexible, overrated constitutions and yer sneakers. And who, I ask you, WHO re-writes Fawlty Towers with Basil as a woman?--Crestville 13:40, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  What is the deal with libel? 

message: Unfortunately, interesting as the point is, saying that Barat and Doherty's relationship is "widely rumoured" to be "homerotic" is still probably libellous. Where has this rumour been printed? All I can find online is an interview in which they *deny* any homosexual overtones to their relationship. Perhaps it might be better to cite examples (ideally specific instances!) - kissing, microphone sharing - as described later in the article? Otherwise, the rumours are just a rumour, and not the stuff encyclopedias are made of. I don't mean to be nitpicking, but this is worth getting right. Rayray 28 June 2005 08:17 (UTC)
This is interesting material (ditto the rentboy reference) but, in my opinion, needs to be supported with citations (official band biogs, press clippings, etc.) or else it might possibly be libellous. Rayray 12:07, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Homo-erotic relationship with Carl Barat

message: from 
http://www.pete-doherty.net/
Jackliddle 23:10, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think so, at least not in the current version. I think the earliest version of this article was largely copied from a single interview, and the website you mention above, but I rewrote and restructured the current edit. Happy to address this issue, though, if you can point out the particular areas of concern. Thanks. Rayray 09:20, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed, a lot of stuff looks like it came straight off the Bio page, about his early life and his good grades, the "two year old son", maybe a citation link to the bio page for that info would suffice?  I also agree that there has been a great number of changes since then, although the structure remains similar --  this page needs a better structure and more on his work with The Libertines (much more then just two sentences).  I'd reccomend chapter listings but it's hard to disconnect say "The Libertines" and "substance abuse".  --Poorpete 14:31, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: I'm not sure about more info on the Libertines here - the linked Libertines page ought to cover most of the information about the band, I think (although I don't feel strongly about it). I'm not sure the content of a biography, unless it contains substantial new research (like the recent Dirk Bogarde book) can be copyrighted, presuming that it's based on fact. Also, most of the information in the original version of this article crops up in similar form in several sources - the Independent interview, for example, which unfortunately now seems to have disappeared. I'm guessing both the pete-doherty.net article and the independent interview are partly based on Doherty's official press biography. As for the structure, it probably could do with more work, but as it's basically chronological, doesn't seem too controversial to me. Anyway, look forward to seeing some further revisions! Rayray 15:11, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Possible copy vio

message: I have made a few minor adjustments, such as For Lovers being essentially a Wolfman single, pete is technically credited as a feature.  Also Babyshambles have only one single so far, Killamangiro, the song Babyshambles was released as a Peter Doherty solo credit.
As for the homo-erotic rumour, it has been widely published in the NME and has indeed been put to both of them as a question in an NME interview around the time of the March 2004 Libertines UK tour.  I have a picture of them microphone sharing which illustrates the homo-erotic nature as described, from the 2003 gig in Chatham immediately after Pete's release.
To add to this, I (not the person who made the other changes) have deleted the link to "Bisexual musicians" from this page as Pete Doherty is not bisexual.
-- There are many pictures of them mic-sharing in many concert photos.  Indeed, this is not uncommon behaviour among musicians.  There have, however, been brief allusions to homoeroticism, but hardly enough to constitute a serious concentration on it within this particular article lest it misrepresent a very strong former friendship (proven several times over) into something more than that (extremely circumstantial and dubious).
He said he was a gay rent boy in his book and his girlfriend said she caught him with guys and had mmf threesomes with him so yeah, he's bi... openly. I'm putting the link back. Zythe 15:06, 14 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  A few minor amendments 

message: Apart from a brief bit in the opening there is nothing about Kate Moss. The lack is glaring. Can it be fixed? SqueakBox 16:22, 2 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Moss

message: I think this article could do with being shorter, and having less trivia in it. I'd like to rewrite it so that it say:
1. Who PD is and why he's significant.
2. What he's done.
3. Where people can find out more information.
I'm not sure that there's any value, for example, in an exhaustive list of his live performances and various arrests.
Would people object? --Rayray 16:42, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Too much trivia - does this article need weeding?

message: Do you think it’s important to add a section or reference to his politics and activism? I’ve read interviews were he claims to have taken part in anti-capitalist protests on May Day, he references them in the song “time for heroes”. And the song “walking away” comments on his ‘socialistic views’. He also participated in a “love music hate racism’ gig.  --Monty Cantsin 02:51, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Politics?  

message: While Doherty may be included on the list, I don't believe is is generally associated with being a 'Northerner' - clearly he has made London his home and was raised in many different places. I believe it should be removed. --Breadandcheese 10:09, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Link to North East England musicians 

message: How do u pronouce pete dohertys last name is it doHerty or doCherty??? i know its doherty but my friend thinks its docherty please help us work out whos right or wrong thanks beki
From people talking on the radio I believe it to be Doe-erty User:Matt.whitby
Definately Doh-herty. Super Ted 12:36, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: His name is definitely pronounced "DoCK-er-ty."  That is how he says it, and he ought to be the authority. OneVeryBadMan 06:21, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

text: It must have been many years since you were at school with her.  In the Rolling Stone profile (ninth paragraph), the reporter specifically notes that it is pronounced, "Dock-erty." OneVeryBadMan 00:04, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pete Doherty 

message: I'm half tempted to add 'Category:Railway accidents' to this article :) exolon 03:05, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Better not... 

message: Substituted at 20:37, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Assessment comment