Talk:List of Desperate Housewives characters/Archive 1

message: *How old is he? 16-18? In high school? Likes Danielle Van De Kamp ? --Brown Shoes22 16:35, 16 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Matthew is supposedly 16 when in reality Mehcad Brooks is 25. A huge age gap if you ask me. Sfufan2005 00:16, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh I was think why would a 25 old looking MAN like her?!--Brown Shoes22 23:17, 1 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Matthew said himself on episode 2-17 that he is 19, so there's your answer. Cheater1908 22:24, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Matthew Applewhite

message: Virgil Applewhite and Caleb Applewhite are the same person !--Brown Shoes22 04:13, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Virgil Applewhite and Caleb Applewhite ! 

message: Is there really a need for the Harper family. They are not recurring and will probably never appear again.--Dan777 17:04, 15 December 2005
:They may be guests some point on the show but I think it would be wrong to delete someone's hard work. I suggest we keep it. Sfufan2005 22:06, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Harper Family

message: *I Mess a EP ?--Brown Shoes22 20:46, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Todd Forrest is Paul Young's real name according to Mike in Episode 2.12 "We're Gonna Be All Right". Sfufan2005 20:48, 12 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Todd Forrest ? 

message: *Family Articles is the good idea. Foucs for the Housewives or cut out the Extended family parts: Uncles, Aunts, Friends, Cousins, poeple who worked for the main characters.--Brown Shoes22 08:18, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Too Big ! 

message: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think there's only ever been one reference to Susan's maiden name in the entire series.  Bremmer was her mother Sophie's married name sometime after Susan's birth.  And I seem to recall Susan's father's surname being Ross.  Anyone else remember this? — ArkansasTraveler 15:35, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's a question I also had but gave up. It's definitely not Bremmer since Sophie was married 3 times prior. Plus Susan's father's surname is Prudy. Sfufan2005 20:42, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, Susan's birth father's surname was Prudy, but that wouldn't have been reflected as her surname as she grew up.  Nothing turns up at the official site at ABC, but I'm almost positive it was mentioned during the eighth episode of the second season. —  ArkansasTraveler 22:32, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

text: Just for the record, Sophie has been married 4 times. Dan777 19:23, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Susan's maiden name 

message: *I split the article into Main families and Recurring families. The main families are the families that are the regulars: the families that have been here since day 1 e.g. The Housewives families:
**The Van De Kamps
**The Scavos
**The Mayers
**The Solises
**The Britts
**The Youngs
The rest are "recurring families" thus that title. Sfufan2005 21:53, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well the decision is not entirely up to you. You need a consensus. Plus a revert war isn't going to solve anyone's problems, now is it?  Sfufan2005 00:24, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If you have the Youngs you gotta have Mike. Dan777 18:12, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Excuse me! I think the proper word is "dictator" and I never said I was. I was just telling him that a revert war isn't going to solve anyone's problems. Plus that's an easy way to get blocked without fully discussing it. (I'm pretty much over that though since that was a few months ago) But still I don't need to be told by an ANONYMOUS USER what I am since I have been around Wikipedia longer than you. Sfufan2005 16:05, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Split article

message: First line of Susan's entry - Negative POV? Bswee 21:30, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, it's not quite neutral, I'd say. — ArkansasTraveler 16:01, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's definitely not NPOV: the words annoyingly self-righteous give it away. Should we change this? Sfufan2005 18:58, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Susan Mayer - POV? 

message: *I think the extended surnames in the headlines are extremely tacky such as "The Van de Kamp/Mason family" or "The Mayer/Bremmer/Flickman" family. This happened over the summer on the original character page and it looked horrible with the example "The Van de Kamp/Mason family and George Williams" which many editors did not like. Its better to keep the headings simple since we don't want all though names on the headings. Sfufan2005 16:14, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Surnames

message: I added a cleanup tag to the article after finding the following: 1) typos, 2) grammer error (e.g. Carlos Mother --> Carlos' Mother), 3) large blocks of text that would be much more readable if broken into several paragraphs. Antonrojo 00:46, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: GRAMMER mistakes? Dan777 15:14, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah, the irony. That's why I spellcheck my article contributions. Antonrojo 18:56, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: As of now, typos in the article have been fixed. Antonrojo 12:46, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know who was responsible for Carlos Mother but that was only thing in the whole article that was off. Dan777 16:27, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Cleanup Tag

message: I'm not the one who added the too long tag however this page is getting a tad long. All for the good though, however I think our main players "the housewives" or every character who is credited and has played an important contribution to the overall story should have their own articles such as all housewives, Mary Alice, Andrew, Mike and Betty just to name a few. However if we do decide to do this we still should keep all characters on this page except that they will not have any information. The remainder of the characters should remain on this page such as any guest stars or minor characters.
For example: Bree Van De Kamp (see main article). Plus I recently discovered that Gabrielle already has her own article FYI Gabrielle Solis which is in pretty good shape for an example Opinions? Sfufan2005 04:08, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I've reduced the article size from 86 k to 58 k, if anyone would like to do any additional editing feel free. Sfufan2005 17:39, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Individual articles

message: How do you guys know that there is an "r" in her name? On the season one DVD the "English For the Hearing Impaired" spells it without an r, and so does IMDB, but tv.com and this site spells it with an r, and Mike and a few other characters do clearly articulate an r. I would find it hard to believe anyone would pronounce it with an r if it wasn't written with an r in the script, but they may have just heard the name before, and not thought about the r or lack of it. So is there a way you guys know? Emily (Funtrivia Freak) 16:04, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think although the name is Pronounced "Deidre" it's written or spelled "Deidre" with a silent "R". I'm not sure, but if you try to look up the name under "Deidre" with no R, you don't get results. So that's probably how the name is written. -- Omernos 17:21, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Deirdre or Deidre? 

message: And plasee update the article !--Brown Shoes22 15:39, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  How old are the characters now ? 

message: From WP:NOT 
"Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of items of information. That something is 100% true does not mean it is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia. While there is a continuing debate about the encyclopedic merits of several classes of entries, current consensus is that Wikipedia articles are not simply:
7. Plot summaries. Wikipedia articles on works of fiction should contain real-world context and sourced analysis, offering detail on a work's achievements, impact or historical significance, not solely a summary of that work's plot. A plot summary may be appropriate as an aspect of a larger topic."
It seems to me that this article now delves excessively into "plot summary," or "character summary," which, in the context of my point is more or less the same thing. Achievements, impact, or historical significance are not touched upon. 
Others' opinions on this point would be appreciated. Charlie 11:28, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have deleted some characters that are not needed such as "Rex's father" or "Carolyn's dog" characters of that nature or only characters that have appeared once and have not been mentioned ever again. Sfufan2005 18:20, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yep, that looks much better--thanks, SF--you are greatly appreciated! Cheater1908 19:55, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

text: Great! It's looking better: thanks for your work, and I hope I didn't offend anyone! Charlie 08:17, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Rupert (Ian's butler) had been added back but I deleted that because a new policy on this page is that we only add characters who appeared more than once.  We need to follow this guideline, and if anyone adds a character that only appeared once or was merely mentioned, it will be deleted.  Can we all follow this rule, please, thanks. :-) Cheater1908 05:00, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Has this article become excessive? 

message: There are two articles about Ian: Ian Hainsworth and Ian Hainsworth (Desperate Housewives).  I don't know how to delete articles, or even if I have the power to do so, but could someone please delete the article with the disambigution?  That one should be deleted to do Wikipedia's disambigution policy. Cheater1908 22:35, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem that just needs to be redirected to just Ian Hainsworth. Sfufan2005 22:41, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks! Cheater1908 01:34, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  2 articles on the same character! 

message: The Scavos adopted Kayla, therefore her page needs to be redirected, but Kayla Huntington is redirected from Kayla Scavo, so I can't move it.  Could someone be so kind to move it? Cheater1908 02:28, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kayla Huntington -> Kayla Scavo 

message: According to this week's episode, "Not While I'm Around" Gaby is still known by her married name "Solis". I think this should be changed because Gaby was only using her maiden name for the modeling shoot. In MAVO's (Mary Alice Voice Overs) she is still known as Gabrielle Solis. Sfufan2005 01:08, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Ya, I can see your point on that.  Mary Alice is the omniscient narrator.  Having said that, I'm neutral on the subject. Cheater1908 19:03, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Gabrielle Current Last Name

message: Amanda was added again, but since she only appeared in one episode and (as far as we know) isn't a relative of any of the main families - which currently are the two criterias of which at least one should be valid for the characters included in this artice.
The basic rule of only including recurring characters is imo quite important to stick to - in order not to have this article grew to big and thereby far to difficult to maintain.
However - I think it's worth discussing wheather or not we should include one time appearing relatives, or only characters who have appeared in two episodes or more. Personaly I prefer it the way it is now (even though I do agree that there isn't any really good encyclopedial reasons to do so), although I do understand the other opinion as well. 
Thaughts?
Pjär80 14:27, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Amanda and criterias 

message: The names of Sophie Bremmer's husbands and Ian's deceased wife Jane's family name has been added. Does anyone know what the sources for this is? Pjär80 15:40, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've deleted these names since they havn't been mentioned on the show, and there doesn't seem to be any source for them. Pjär80 15:18, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sophie's husbands and Jane's maiden name 

message: There seems to be tendencies to edit this (and other DH articles) with events that has yet to occur. This is problematic, given that details on upcoming episodes might change before the episode airs, or that they might be just wrong (as was the case with the details given on the character "Lamar the Limo Driver" in this article). Also, expressions like " he will appear in the next episode" hardly is encyclopedical.
Therefor I strongly suggest that we don't add anything to this article until it's been shown on the show. Also - in order to keep the editing easier (and the value of this article higher) I've noted in the header which episodes are included. Pjär80 15:26, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Upcoming episodes 

message: Gabrielle referred to herself as Gabrielle Marquez last night.  I personally think that we should move her article back to Gabrielle Marquez.  I know Mary Alice has referred to her as Gabrielle Solis after her divorce, but I don't think we should go by that, because Mary Alice has been wrong before (she said in the season premiere that Alma left Orson because she was unhappy and she felt trapped but it turned out that she only left Orson because she found out about his affair and she wanted to matter to him, so Mary Alice lied to us!).  Thoughts? Cheater1908 00:46, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gabrielle Solis -> Gabrielle Marquez 

message: I changed the tense of George Williams (Desperate Housewives) to fit WP:WAF#Presentation of fictional material. All Wikipedia articles about fiction are supposed to be written in present tense:
"By convention, these synopses should be written in the present tense, as this is the way that the story is experienced as it is read or viewed. At any particular point in the story there is a 'past' and a 'future', but whether something is 'past' or 'future' changes as the story progresses. It is simplest to recount the entire description as continuous 'present'.
".
--T-man, the wise 00:48, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Tense

message: I've incorperated some of the articles who dealt with individual characters in this article. The characters who have been moved here either:
*1: Only had a few sentances in their original article (Sophie Bremmer and Detective Ridley) and thus not being large enough to claim individual articles.
*or 2: Was to minor to be of sufficiant common intrest (including characters only appearing in three or four episodes of the series: Sister Mary Bernard (3 episodes), Carolyn Bigsby (4), Rick Coletti (4), Maisy Gibbons (3) and Art Shephard (4)).
The amount of character pages had become far to extended, and (as pointed out in other places) the quality of the Desperate Housewives character pages are generaly not sufficiant. Given that the summer hiatus is coming up it's a good time to get into discussion how to best keep a good quality of WP:s DH articles. 
As of the character pages I'd say that characters appearing in less than eight episodes (roughly 1/3 of a season) ought to not have their own articles, but be included in List of Desperate Housewives characters, with the exception of characters of significant instrest (foremost the leading characters' family members), and that no character with less than five appearances should have their own article. This is the way it looks now, after my edits mentioned above.
And this is the episode account for characters, excluding the main characters, as of the first three seasons (69 episodes):
*21 episodes:
**Karen McCluskey 
**Ida Greenberg
*18 episodes:
**Ian Hainsworth
*17 episodes:
**Felicia Tilman
*11 episodes:
**Justin
**Kayla Huntington
*10 episodes:
**Noah Taylor
*9 episodes:
**Ed Ferrara (no article)
*8 episodes:
**Martha Huber 
**Nora Huntington
**Xiao-Mei
*7 episodes:
**Gloria Hodge
**Alma Hodge
**Victor Lang
**Dr. Ron McCready
**Detective Ridley
**Dr. Albert Goldfine
*6 episodes:
**Dr. Lee Craig
**Father Crowley
**Juanita Solis
**Yao Lin
**Sophie Bremmer
*5 episodes:
**Stu
**Travers McLain
**Detective Sullivan
**Nina Fletcher
**Detective Barton
**Vern
**Alberta Fromme
**Ralph
**Jerry Shaw
**Peter McMillian
*4 episodes:
**Reporter
**Rick Coletti
**Samuel "Sam" Bormanis
**Eugene Beale 
**Pat Ziegler
**Carolyn Bigsby
**Art Shephard
*3 episodes: 
**about 25 characters
Given this statistics, one might argue that Ed Ferrera should be transfered to his own article, but otherwise I think the current arrangement is a good one. Pjär80 01:05, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edits 

message: I've intergrated "Susan's family" and "Mike's family", following their marriage, as well as added Victor's known relatives to the "Extended family" part of "Gabrielle's family".
To my knowledge there is no source for either Gabby nor Susan that they have changed their last names (wich isn't done automatically when a woman is married), and until such is found, we ought to keep their former last name.
Thaughts? Pjär80 23:35, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Season 3 Finale updates 

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BetacommandBot 05:13, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Matthewapplewhite.jpg

message: For reasons given above #Edits, I've redirected Nina Fletcher to this article. If anyone don't agree with this, share your thaughts here. :) Pjär80 18:37, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nina Fletcher