Talk:Swedish language/Archive 2

message: There's a claim about "stød", or glottal stop occuring in some dialects of Scanian, but with no kind of reference. Considering the notions of many that Scanian could be considered a dialect of Danish, I suspect this notion has come along for the ride. Using a glottal stop instead of accent 2 is a distinctly Danish feature, so I'm surprised that it would be present in a Swedish dialect. It would be very helpful if at least the location (with some sort of reference) of these archaic dialects could be mentioned.
Peter Isotalo 08:25, May 15, 2005 (UTC)
: Aha, I thought you wrote this and assumed you had a source for it (which is why I left it be). As I wrote in my comment, I hadn't heard the claim about this in Scanian before. --Fred-Chess 09:23, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Glottal stop in Swedish 

message: Somewhat unrelated, there is a program on SVT2 right now about expressing clearly. 
: SVT2 Texter för medborgarna - direktsänd språkvårdskonferens 
: 10.03-15.00 Direktsändning från en konferens arrangerad av regeringens klarspråksgrupp. Medverkande bland andra Olle Josephson, chef för svenska språknämnden, och Catharina Nyström Höög, forskare vid Uppsala universitet. Dessutom delar justitieminister Thomas Bodström ut priset Klarspråkskristallen. Reporter Karin Andersson. 
--Fred-Chess 10:34, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Now for something completely different 

message: I've just done a round of wikification, rather strictly adhering to the principle that the first instance of a term should be wikified. However, I haven't delinked wikified the second instance in cases where it appears in a later section more closely related to the topic (e.g. vowel, orthography. There were other examples of this already present in the article. Does anyone feel that a strict wikilink-each-term-only-once rule should be excercised? / Alarm 10:30, 24 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think this is a strict Wikipedia rule? Not unless it gets annoying.. I would rather prefer new links for every section. --Fred-Chess 10:45, 24 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wikification 

message: I've taken out part of a sentence on Gammalsvenskby in the section "Swedish speaking minorities":
::which survived until the Russian revolution when its inhabitants were deported to Sweden in 1929 in the purges of the Stalin era.
I don't think what happened could be classified as outright deportation. As the article on the subject says, it was the villagers who pleaded for the right to leave the country, actively supported by a Swedish movement. Some later chose to return to the Soviet union (where they were indeed severly affected by the Great Purge of the Stalin era, which took place in the 1930s rather than in 1929). Rather than elaborating on this rather marginal subject, I think we can keep this short here. / Alarm 10:42, 24 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Gammalsvenskby]] 

message: There is info in this section that is useful while the section itself seems superfluous. Part of it belongs in History and some of it in Geographical distribution. Could the Finland-Swedish part be summarized? I'm not sure if I'm too keen about finlandization either. While I do understand some of the frustrations of the Swedish-speaking minority in Finland, it seems to occasionally result in fairly obvious POV here on Wikipedia.
Peter Isotalo 13:21, May 24, 2005 (UTC)
:I think a section on the position of Swedish in Finland today might be warranted, although it might be slightly shorter and possibly moved to a subsection of Geographical distribution. However I would say that the part about Estonia and Gammalsvenskby is even more marginal and could be more heavily pruned. / Alarm 14:20, 24 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't get the sentence about Finlandization. I looks like POV and doesn't make sense. I think it should be removed unless someone have some referenses for it. bbx 23:32, 26 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, it makes no sense to me either. I suggest removal. - Mustafaa 17:34, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Swedish speaking minorities 

message: I have added a map distributed by the Schildts company depicting in red the areas where Swedish-speakers are dispersed in Finland. Eric 11:09, Jun 19, 2005 (UTC)
* That map was a copyvio. I have re-drawn it on a Gnu licensed map, and changed the links. --Janke | Talk 14:35, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Finland-Swedish distribution map 

message: Please provide some form of references for the claim that Bokmål and Nynorsk are classified separatly as an East and West Scandinavian langauge respectively. For further discussion, please reply at Talk:Scandinavian languages, where this has already been discussed for a while.
Peter Isotalo 19:11, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unrefenced classification of Norwegian 

message: It seems that someone takes ISO 639-2 code for Swedish (swe) for the real SIL code (SWD). Pay attention, that even if you download language code tables from ethnologue.com (in association with SIL), they provide ISO 639-2 codes, and so it can't be a reference for the SIL code. That's why I have to revert the SIL code to SWD again. — Oleg326756 07:51, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  SIL code 

message: :A change that separated Old East Norse (Runic Swedish/Danish) from Old West Norse was the change of the diphthong æi (Old West Norse ei) to the monophthong e, as in stæin to sten. This is reflected in runic inscriptions where the older read stain and the later stin. There was also a change of au as in dauðr into ø as in døðr. This change is shown in runic inscriptions as a change from tauþr into tuþr. Moreover, the øy (Old West Norse ey) diphthong changed into ø as well, as in the Old Norse word for "island".
Actually, the lack of diphtongs is not a feature of East Norse! Indeed, we can find perfectly preserved diphtongs in Gotland, in Finland and in Norrland and until at least 13th, and probably even until 14th, century they for sure existed in large parts of Eastern Svealand as well. (Remember where the swedish speaking finns come from and when they migrated.) I propose that references to East Norse and West Norse are removed here and that one simply mentions that a monophtogisation process occured in Old Swedish. 
A second thing is that it is hardly true that one only had the process au > ø as in dauðr > døðr. (Whatever this means - ø without a length mark ´ or doubling øø suggests a short vowel here which contradicts the fact that au was effectively a long vowel.) In large parts of Sweden the au first turned into a levelled öu (here ö denotes [ɔ], i.e. same vowel as in Old Icelandic lönd 'lands') and then into a monophtong öö (i.e. [ɔː]). The au > øø evolution was a pure danish one which spread northwards, especially amongst nobles and literates (and in the end, though probably quite late, also amongst ordinary peasants).
Jens Persson (130.242.128.85 20:41, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Diphtongs and West Norse vs East Norse 

message: There is a non-standard pronunciation warning on Mikael Åkerfeldt. I am not familiar enough with Swedish to transcribe this name into IPA. I was wondering if any editors on this article could lend a hand. Thanks!.--Andrew c 00:53, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  IPA for Swedish name 

message: I have added a reference regarding the official language vote: . The article mentions "en kombination av kvittningsfel, feltryck och skilda uppfattningar" (roughly, "a combination of pairing-off failures, misvotes and differing opinions"), but I believe the latter two reasons are in relation to the second vote, the one regarding the status of Swedish in European Union. See  for the full vote results (small dictionary: röst = vote, nej = no, ja = yes, frånvarande = absent). If the link is broken, search for "Betänkandenr" KrU04 at , year 2005/06.
I also removed the reference to 2003/04:Kr280 since it is only one of many mentioned by the parties m, fp, kd and c in reservation 1 at  (in Swedish). (If you wonder why mp, who later voted with them, didn't join the reservation: it is because they don't have any ordinary members in Kulturutskottet (the Cultural Committee)).
Regarding a future vote (mentioned in the next sentence), the article  might be of interest.
-- Woseph 12:20, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Isn't it "Betänkanden"? 惑乱 分からん 14:58, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Official language