Talk:Lists of horror films

message: I made a start to this list based on the content of Horror films and the corresponding category, but I'm sure many more can be added. -- RJH 21:02, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: I was looking at the list, and since it's getting complicated, would it be worth cleaning up mildly? I was thinking of arranging films like this perhaps, like in this example for 1964.
===1964===
Title                          	Director              	Country                    	Original title
2000 Maniacs                   	Herschell Gordon Lewis	USA                        	
At Midnight I'll Take Your Soul	José Mojica Marins    	Brazil                     	A Meia-Noite Levarei Sua Alma
Atomic Brain, The              	Joseph Mascelli       	USA                        	
Blood and Black Lace           	Mario Bava            	West Germany, Italy, France	Sei Donne per l'Assassino
Color me Blood Red             	Herschell Gordon Lewis	USA                        	
Devil Doll                     	Lindsay Shonteff      	UK, USA                    	
Evil of Frankenstien, The      	Freddie Francis       	UK                         	
Face of the Screaming Werewolf 	Jerry Warren          	USA                        	
Flesh Eaters, The              	Jack Curtis           	USA                        	
Gorgon, The                    	Terence Fisher        	UK                         	
Kwaidan                        	Masaki Kobayashi      	Japan                      	怪談, Kaidan
Masque of the Red Death, The   	Roger Corman          	USA                        	
Onibaba                        	Kaneto Shindo         	Japan                      	鬼婆
Spider Baby                    	Jack Hill             	USA                        	
Tomb of Ligeia, The            	Roger Corman          	USA                        	
Would this work? If it people like it, should there anything else be added to the list? or taken away, anything? Andrzejbanas 06:35, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Re-arranging

message: Title                          	Director              	Country                    	Original title
2000 Maniacs                   	Herschell Gordon Lewis	USA                        	
At Midnight I'll Take Your Soul	José Mojica Marins    	Brazil                     	A Meia-Noite Levarei Sua Alma
Atomic Brain, The              	Joseph Mascelli       	USA                        	
Blood and Black Lace           	Mario Bava            	West Germany, Italy, France	Sei Donne per l'Assassino
Color me Blood Red             	Herschell Gordon Lewis	USA                        	
Devil Doll                     	Lindsay Shonteff      	UK, USA                    	
Evil of Frankenstien, The      	Freddie Francis       	UK                         	
Face of the Screaming Werewolf 	Jerry Warren          	USA                        	
Flesh Eaters, The              	Jack Curtis           	USA                        	
Gorgon, The                    	Terence Fisher        	UK                         	
Kwaidan                        	Masaki Kobayashi      	Japan                      	怪談, Kaidan
Masque of the Red Death, The   	Roger Corman          	USA                        	
Onibaba                        	Kaneto Shindo         	Japan                      	鬼婆
Spider Baby                    	Jack Hill             	USA                        	
Tomb of Ligeia, The            	Roger Corman          	USA                        	
Would this work? If it people like it, should there anything else be added to the list? or taken away, anything? Andrzejbanas 06:35, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[1964 in film|1964]]

message: I reverted the edit of adding Jaws 2 into the list, because the reason given was IMDB, and wikipedia does not accept that as a valid source. Thanks!!   - Hairchrm   04:13, 17 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  rv 

message: I think that the users must be very careful when they revert the content of any page.  
First, the edit of adding Jaws 2 had a link to the wikipedia page Jaws 2, where there's plenty of information and sources (30 sources) about the movie, therefore the editing was incorrectliy reverted, against wikipedia principles. I recomend to read Contributing_to_Wikipedia, specially the part of “point out problems”, as wells as Help:Reverting, specially the part of “Don’t’s”.
Well, concerning to this page, I have not seen any editor that cites his o her sources (in the page o history page) in order to considerate a film as a “horror” film. I know the rules for citing sources, but there’s no chapter in the page to cite sources, and the “edit summary” must not be long (if that's the case, almost all the content is susceptible to being deleted). As the “horror” is not an “objective” element (for example: some people consider that some film is a horror film, but others consider it a sci fi or a thriller), the most accessible reference for the users is the IMDB (and other specialized pages) because has complete and neutral  information about movies, regarding the particular view from the users. This is to observe the “neutral point of view”, one of the five pillars of wikipedia. 
Finally, if some wiki user o editor wants the sources about what kind of genre is the movie Jaws 2, and don't want to see the IMDB as a source, well, here they are (and I transcribe the "genre", as it appears):
*Horror/Monster Film/Natural Horror  http://www.allmovie.com/cg/avg.dll?p=avg&sql=1:25913 
*Action/Adventure and Suspense/Horror  http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1800082750/info  
*Thriller http://www.bbc.co.uk/films/2000/07/14/jaws2_review.shtml  Thriller
*Horror/Susp  http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/jaws_2/  
*Horror/Susp http://crazy4cinema.com/Review/FilmsJ/f_jaws2.html  
*Horror  Wikipedia page about Jaws 2
Good day. Omar1976 22:39, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  About the last comment and the deleting of Jaws 2 

message: Altough IMDB says it’s an Comedy / Fantasy / Horror (in third place), reviewers classified it as a comedy: a) Crazy4Cinema says it’s a Comedy/Afterlife; b) DVD Verdict, Comedy; c) AMG, Comedy/ Fantasy/Black Comedy; d) Rottentomatoes, Comedy.
:It's got that Haunted House and spook vibe to it, but it's just more of a fantasy vibe to it. I wouldn't be against taking it off the list. Andrzejbanas 20:59, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Is Beetlejuice an horror movie?

message: A remake of this movie is on the list for both 2007 and 2008.  I'm not sure which is correct, or if either of them are, so could somebody look into this?  Also, I've noticed a lot of other things that may or may not be correct (ex. a movie titled "Wedding Slasher" that came out within the past couple years), and I think this article may need some clean-up.  --Mears man 02:59, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Creepshow

message: The list is getting long, and before it gets tagged with being a too long of an article. I've taken some attempt at creating a new style for the article.
An example of it is Here.
If no one is really against this, i'll start implanting it later, comments anyone? Andrzejbanas 09:05, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: New format

message: I have now finished most of the (current) large-scale edits to these lists, there are a few pages with Allmovie refs to convert and a couple with film titles which need bold-italic format.
I would like to improve the consistency of film list formats generally and I have been merging good features of other lists as I notice them. Please have a look at List of science-fiction films of the 1970s which has a lead setting the list contents in their context and a section of notes for awards etc. Such information looks like a useful addition to the horror lists too. The sections there conform (with empty sections omitted) to the common pattern of:
* See also, for other relevant wikipedia articles
* Notes, for additional information related to inline links
* References, for references supporting article content related to inline links
* Citations, for book etc citations used by short-form references
* Further reading, for relevant books etc not part of an inline link
* External links, for relevant online resources not part of an inline link
See also MOS:APPENDIX. In order to make it easy for us to add notes as necessary, and to increase consistency among film lists generally, I will start renaming the current Notes sections References.
There is a new feature for notes: if we use group="lower-alpha", they get nice[a][b]... links. I've done this for several articles so far without problems and recommend this approach.
I will continue to add the full width navboxes at the end of the lists, now including the Horror fiction links which are already on this top-level list. It seems better to have a double blank line before these, to give some separation from preceding references. The first list with this most recent set of changes is List of horror films of 2002.
From now on I will post comments relevant to all the horror film lists on this talk page. --Mirokado (talk) 18:26, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm late to the party, but great work on this list. It's nice to have someone work on these articles other than myself and uhh..random vandals! I agree with most items you are saying, and I'll try to expand and add citations as per stated. Andrzejbanas (talk) 05:04, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Consistency 

message: I very much like Mirokado's suggestion of including headings at the top of each horror film list.  I suggest we take it a step further and coordinate the content with the horror film article, much as has been done with the science fiction film article, and include "See also" links at the heading of each history subsection of horror film.  There is some ambiguity in the post-1950s, where the lists that have been split into individual years.  I think having substantial text for each individual year would be overkill, so perhaps we should only have text headings in the decade index pages (like this one). - Sp4cetiger (talk) 22:17, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: You have made a good start with these introductions. Well done. I agree with keeping them at the decade level. --Mirokado (talk) 20:20, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Headings 

message: I've been going through the lists and removing entries that seem out of place.  I have excluded the following types of media:
; Television Serials and Miniseries
- I have excluded both TV serials and individual episodes of these serials.  The former clearly don't belong on a list of "films" and the latter, although not terribly different from film shorts, would add far too much clutter to the lists to be useful.
; Documentaries
- Although interesting for the progression of the genre, documentaries about horror don't qualify as horror films themselves.
; Non-horror Films
- This is the most difficult one, as genre is a subjective thing and different sources give different genres for each movie.  My general rule of thumb has been to look at all of the usual sources for general movie info (IMDb, Allrovi, and Rotten Tomatoes) and if none of them give horror as a genre, I just remove it from the list outright.  If Allrovi lists it as horror, I leave it on the list and use that as a reference, otherwise I leave the reference blank until a more reliable source can be found.  Any movie I've removed can of course be placed back in the list if a reliable source is found listing it as horror.
Media I have included on the list but which could be debatable include
; Made-for-TV Movies
- These movies are numerous and often very low-impact, but there have been a handful (e.g. Stephen King's It) that are notable within the genre.  At least one list has excluded these movies, so other opinions are welcome.
; Direct-to-Video/DVD
- Again, these movies are numerous and generally low-impact.  This often includes sequels to obviously-notable films, so it is not uncommon for them to have their own Wikipedia page.  It is primarily for this reason that I have left them in.
; Film shorts
- It's likely that many of these don't meet the Wikipedia notability criteria, but this is time-consuming and difficult to determine on a film-by-film basis.  The main argument I can see for including them is that they were key to the very beginnings of the horror film genre, with such films as Le Manoir du diable (1896) and Frankenstein (1910).  Not wanting to remove those films from the list, I decided to retain film shorts, but again there is room for debate.
Let me know if anyone has any objections to the above criteria, otherwise I think we should consider them general guidelines for the lists. - Sp4cetiger (talk) 04:07, 23 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Your criteria look fine to me and are leading to sensible decisions. It is perfectly reasonable to keep shorter films from the earliest decades for the reasons you state. --Mirokado (talk) 20:24, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Types of media to include 

message: As with any page, sources for movies in the list have to be reliable (WP:RS), but I haven't found any one source that can be the go-to for all movies that belong on this list.  The closest is Allrovi (formerly allmovie), which has a huge database of movie info and has been deemed reliable by the Wikipedia community.  If that fails, some online alternatives include the American Film Institute, DVD Verdict, and Bloody Disgusting, all of which are considered reliable on WP.  IMDb certainly has the largest database of all, but is largely user-generated and cannot be considered reliable.  The general procedure I've been following for sourcing is detailed below:
;Films without existing Wikipedia pages
If there is an Allrovi entry that includes at least the title, year, and genre (horror), I will use it as a reference.  If any of the other info (cast, director, country of origin) is missing from the Allrovi entry, I blank those fields in the table and wait for a second source to be added.  If the film was entered in a year that disagrees with the Allrovi entry, I move it to the appropriate year (even if IMDb disagrees).  If/when the film gets its own Wikipedia page, detailed discussions about the appropriate film year should take place there and later be implemented on the list.
A lot of the films that have previously been entered on the list would be unlikely to be recognized as notable by the Wikipedia community and therefore don't belong on the list.  I try to get a rough sense of this from the IMDb entry, looking primarily at the number of critical reviews that are linked there.  If the film is getting minimal critical attention and I can't find a reliable source for the listing, I remove it.  I won't object to anyone who replaces such a film, so long as they provide a reliable source to accompany the listing. 
;Films with existing Wikipedia pages
The main difference here is that I strive for internal consistency as to the film year.  Whatever year is listed in the article, I try to find a source that matches that year.  As I mention above, I think the appropriate place for such discussions is within the film article.  In the rare circumstance that I can't find a source that agrees with the year given in the article, I will go in and change the article, accompanying the change with a source.  
Comments/suggestions are of course welcome.  Sp4cetiger (talk) 10:07, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Sourcing

message: I have recently added sort keys to the title/name column of List of longest films by running time and List of dance companies. This works quite nicely and it is only necessary to add the key to titles which start with something like "The". If we do this to these lists we could make them sortable too. Clearly that would be a substantial set of edits which should be done consistently, so I would update my "little script" to do the hard work, but I don't want to start if other editors prefer unsortable lists anyway. Please respond here to say whether you would like this change or not. --Mirokado (talk) 17:01, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: This would be helpful for articles that are single year, but could mess up with films that are the full decades. I'm for it for the articles on the individual year articles. Andrzejbanas (talk) 23:37, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  OK, I will do that when convenient (probably not for a while now, but it is not urgent...) --Mirokado (talk) 10:19, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

text:  I've updated List of horror films of 2011 to be sortable with sort keys for the titles, but I'm not sure how useful this would be without more work. The director and cast columns sort by first names which makes the sorting not very useful (a bit easier to see if more than one film has the same first director or actor I suppose). The country column does not sort as each line has just an icon, no text. In the notes it may be useful to be able to group similar notes by sorting. It is of course possible to add keys to the other columns (last name of first person, first country name), but that would mean adding several keys to each line which, although possible and perfectly easy by script, would make normal manual updates rather burdensome. I will leave things as they are for now and await comments from other editors. (Adding the keys for the titles is less obtrusive as many titles do not need an extra key). --Mirokado (talk) 21:52, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

text:  I've just noticed a template, , which manages the keys better than the raw code I was using (see updates to the other lists mentioned above). However, there is not much benefit in having just one column sortable and adding sortability to the other columns for these particular tables would be too obtrusive, so I will revert the current sortability changes, it will only affect two or three pages. --Mirokado (talk) 21:53, 11 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sortable tables 

message: I will be making some table source updates to List of horror films of the 1920s (not too long, currently stable) to improve WP:ACCESSIBILITY and WP:MOS compliance. Please pay attention to the format of the rows if updating the content. Once (if) we are happy with these changes I will roll them out to all the lists with the help of a "little script" as before. I will post any progress reports here and of course comments here also welcome. --Mirokado (talk) 12:25, 18 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Accessibility, MOS compliance 

message: I have just gone through the lists making a few updates along the way, in particular making the allrovi (earlier lists) and allmovie (current lists) urls consistent. I will update the 2012 list correspondingly once it has settled down next year. I clearly stopped paying attention with the last couple of edits, with incorrect edit summaries and an unintended trivial change for the 2012 list. Sorry.
Allrovi/Allmovie re-rebranded their site as Allmovie a year or two ago. The current lists are using the allmovie url, earlier lists continue to use allrovi. --Mirokado (talk) 12:34, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Latest changes 

message: Maximilianklein (talk) 23:33, 5 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, I missed this while taking a little wikibreak. That looks to be the case: do we want to do anything as a result? Ext link? --Mirokado (talk) 17:15, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: WorldCat Genres

message: I have just noticed that one of the sublists was updated to define DEFAULTSORT and manage the categorisation better, see List of horror films of 2010. I will apply the change consistently "soon" but not just immediately. --Mirokado (talk) 17:13, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Now done for 1960–2013. Earlier list are by decade and not affected. --Mirokado (talk) 23:59, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  DEFAULTSORT, cats