Talk:Poles in Lithuania

message: It would seem logical to make some mention of the Russian minority, which is almost as large as the Polish.
Why are all the external links to Polish sites, and none to Lithuanian sites?  Sca 20:19, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Certainly Russian minority in Lithuania is an important article waiting to be written, I'll add a note of that to the article. You will note that numbers in that article come from official Lithuanian statistical site; as for the lack of lt-language sites - well, I don't speak Lithuanian and Lithuanian editors have not contributed to that article yet.-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  20:59, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: 10-4 and Djiękuję/aciu! Sca 15:42, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Russian minority

message: I'm confused by this statement: "25 percent of the children born to monoethnic Polish families attended Polish schools. Fifty percent of them chose Russian schools, and only 10 per cent Lithuanian schools". 25%+50%+10%=85%, what happened to the rest ? Did 15% of Polish children in Vilnius not attend school at all ? --Lysytalk 20:49, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There were mixed schools, maybe attended those?--Lokyz 20:56, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Do we know what made these Poles send their children to Russian schools ? Historically Poles tended to strongly oppose any Russification. What happened in Lithuania ? --Lysytalk 21:02, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In fact almost half of lithuanian poles were concentrated in Vilnius (~25% of city population), where (as of 1980) only 4-5% chose Polish education language at schools. So in Vilnius ~ 20% of poles chose Polish at school. Why? In fact they were mostly using Russian at work and very often at home (like other slavonic non-russian minorities: Ukranians, Belorussians). Rural part of Polish community chose Polish ~60-70%. But even in towns with Polish domination share of Polish education language at schools was less then poles percentage. One of the important reasons to choose Russian was absence of Polish language college and university education in former USSR. Poles had no possibility get college/university education in Poland. First Polish Bialystok university small branch was opened in Vilnius in 2007 only.Bogomolov.PL (talk) 15:46, 11 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Voluntary sovietisation 

message: I'd like to remove the sentence "The same regional leaders later voiced support for Soviet coup attempt of 1991 in Moscow." Coup in Moscow is not relevant to the article about Polish minority in Lithuania. The only purpose of this sentence is to present the political views of then leaders of Polish party (was it a party?) in negative light. I may not sympathise with their views, but this is not the place to discuss political views on international events of Polish or Lithuanian politicians. It would be relevant if the sentence was about the view on the situation of Polish minority in Lithuania, not about the coup in Moscow. --Lysytalk 08:14, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Their views explain a lot about history of tension between Polish political parties and Lithuanian society.--Lokyz 08:28, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Then it would be interesting to explain why they chose to support the Soviets. Polish minority in Latvia did not. What happened in Lithuania to make Poles support Soviets then ? --Lysytalk 08:49, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I do not have any research ion the topic on hand, although it seems thet majority of Poles in Lithuania were throughly Sovietised and scared by communist leaders (most of them turned to be nowadays Polish minority leaders). This could explain rather high Polish attendance of Russian schools and in the pro-Soviet Yedinstvo organization, that was quite active in 1991 coup.--Lokyz 08:57, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

text: Yes, but there were Polish minorities in different parts of Soviet Union, and they never supported Soviets, only in Lithuania. It might be that the Soviets treated Poles differently in Lithuania and e.g. Latvia ? --Lysytalk 09:08, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The same regional leaders later voiced support for Soviet coup attempt of 1991 in Moscow. 

message: Lysy, why did you restore obviuosly dead lnks?--Lokyz 08:28, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, I thought I restored a journal reference, did not notice it had a link in it. I will restore it without the link then. --Lysytalk 08:47, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. No dead link anymore there. --Lysytalk 20:58, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There is a chance that those links will be restored by the MSZ, which is why I don't think we need to remove them. At the very least, please add removed link to talk so we can occasionally click on them and check if they have been unprotected.-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  21:14, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

text: Just a note that link rot does not mean we should remove the reference. First, the link may unrot, second, the links to MSZ bulleting were to online version of their print bulletin, so even if online source rots, an interested reader can go to original articles in either the bulletin or original journals (which were at least partially quoted in the reference description).-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  17:46, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Restoration of dead links by Lysy

message: I think that it's important to include some reference to the fact that some of the Poles in Lithuania are actually Polonized Lithuanians. Many of these Polish speaking Lithuanians do acknowledge that they in fact come from Lithuanian ancestry but speak Polish. There is reference to this in the Wikipedia Article "Ethnic History of the Region of Vilnius". This is the case with my grandparents who were both from Vilnius, spoke only Polish but in actuality my grandfather was Belarussian and my grandmother was Lithuanian. Sometime around the mid 1800's their families began speaking Polish over Lithuanian or Belarussian. I know many "Polish" families from Lithuania with the same history.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ma46323 (talk • contribs).
:This is already described in the 'History' section, which mentions the cultural assimilation processes of Polonization and Lithuanization.-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  10:32, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Could you provide some refs for that? You are certainly right that speaking a given language does not make one a full member of a given minority. I am sure we can incorporate this into the article, although you should be aware this is a touchy issue, as some (see Vilnija) are trying to score some political agenda points with related arguments.-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  00:33, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Some Could Be Polonized Lithuanians 

message: This article doesn't inform about religious life.Xx236 12:24, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Religion 

message: Reference 5 is in ref. 7.Xx236 12:29, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  The same phrase 

message: http://www.forumvilnius.lt/print.php?news.36 Xx236 07:18, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Interesting. Polish CBOS often runs studies on Polish attitude towards other nations (here is the 2006 study). I wonder if there are equivalent Lithuanian surveys?-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  16:23, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: PS. For those interested, Polish attitude to Lithuanian is relatively neutral (as many like them as dislike). Interestingly, it's the highest score from all Polish 'east' neighbours (all others are more disliked, including Baltic countries). This score (~35 in favor) has been relatively stable in 2000s, but has risen from 20-30 in the 1990s. The dislike score has also improved (dropped from 30-40 in 1990s to ~25 in 2000s). -- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk  00:36, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lithuanian stereotypes  

message: "This article or section may contain inappropriate or misinterpreted citations that do not verify the text." May? Xx236 11:57, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current situation 

message: It's a simplification or not true. Quite many of the Poles are of Eastern Slavic background, -icz names.Xx236 (talk) 10:14, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  for many centuries. 

message: I have attempted in good faith to keep the article encyclopedic by shortening the lead. I have not removed any information that is presented later in the article. We now have an awkward situation where duplicate information follows itself. Why? Dr. Dan (talk) 16:14, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Read WP:LEAD.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  17:59, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have read WP:LEAD, and I have read plenty of reference works in my time. If you think that the format of this article and the redundacy of the information is appropriate in the first two paragraphs of the article, be happy with your edits. It's hardly the only poorly written article in the project that needs attention. Hopefully a language barrier is the reason that my concerns are not acceptable. Dr. Dan (talk) 01:11, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't enjoy the repetition. The answer however is not to gut the lead, but the expand and rewrite the article so that the repetition is less visible - while the lead is as informative as possible.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  03:27, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I also didn't appreciate the redundancy, and therefore made the changes. The answer is not to gut the lead. The answer is not to gut the lead. The answer is not to gut the lead, but perhaps to remove the redundancy, and make the article more encyclopedic. Dr. Dan (talk) 04:15, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Redundant?

message: How many of them - one hundred, 100 000? Many centuries - how many is many? Xx236 (talk) 08:35, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps the entire sentence should be removed, since it's impossible to answer your question with any true degree of certainty. Dr. Dan (talk) 15:32, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: People of Polish ethnicity have lived on the territory of modern Lithuania for many centuries

message: Absolute numbers with Polish language education at Lithuanian schools (Raions rural schools):
*Raion name   Lithu.   Russian  Polish
*Vilnius ------ 1250 ---- 4150 -- 6400
*Salcininkai -- 500 ---- 2050 -- 3200
*Sviencienis- 1350 ----- 600 --- 100
*Trakai ------- 2900 ------ 50 --- 950
*Varena ------ 6000 ------- 0 ----- 50
*Sirvintos ---- 2400 ----- 100 -- 100
"Атлас Литовской ССР" 1981 "Государственный плановый комитет Литовской ССР. Министерство высшего и среднего специального образования Литовской ССР. АТЛАС ЛИТОВСКОЙ ССР. Главное управление геодезии и картографии при Совете Министров СССР. Москва 1981"  --Poeticbent talk 15:56, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Atlas of Lithuania 1981 data 

message: Germans were expelled but Poles allowed to leave. POV.Xx236 (talk) 12:59, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Soviet Union allowed to leave  

message: In which Lithuania? Ethnic or historical? Xx236 (talk) 15:49, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I think we still need articles on ethnic Lithuania and historical Lithuania.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  00:05, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  In 19th century peasants of Polish nationality started to appear in Lithuania, mostly by Polonization of Lithuanian peasants. 

message: An edit was made yesterday or today adding this statement: In late May 2008, Association of Poles in Lithuania issued a letter, addressed to the government of Lithuania, complaining about anti-minority (primarily, anti-Polish) rhetoric in media, citing upcoming parliamentary elections as a motive, and asking for better treatment of the ethnic minorities. The Association has also filed a complain with the Lithuanian prosecutor, asking for investigation of the issue.
Well...people issue letters to their governments all the time. Could we wait and see what the prosecutor's reaction is, what international reaction is, etc. Otherwise this is just passing news. Novickas (talk) 23:29, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I was thinking exact same thing. It's a case of recentism. Unless something comes out of the letter, I don't think it should be mentioned. As it says, elections are coming up and I don't see how this is any different from a standard campaign trick. Renata (talk) 02:49, 1 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Association of Poles is not standing up in elections, and as a complain of the representation of the largest minority organization in Lithuania, it should probably be noted in more articles than just in here.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  21:05, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Re recent events addition

message: In the last revision I edited, I found duplicate named references, i.e. references sharing the same name, but not having the same content. Please check them, as I am not able to fix them automatically :) 
* "ZPL" :
**  ZWIĄZEK POLAKÓW NA LITWIE. Encyklopedia Interia. Last accessed 20 January 2007.
**  AKCJA WYBORCZA POLAKÓW NA LITWIE. Encyklopedia Interia. Last accessed 20 January 2007.
DumZiBoT (talk) 16:08, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bot report : Found duplicate references ! 

message: Anon wrote: Lithuanian law stipulates that everyone who has citizenship and resides within the country has to forcibly Lithuanianise their name, hence why most of the above list of Poles have listed Lithuanian equivalents. No-one has any right to spell their name the way they see fit.. Can this be referenced? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  12:42, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: In Lithuanian the special linguistic rule of spelling Polish names really exists. So, every Polish name has equivalent in Lithuanian, but Lithuanian is the only official (this can be referenced) and all official documents are issued in Lithuanian. So the special spelling rule has to be referenced, I guess. Bogomolov.PL (talk) 22:27, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

text: Rewritten and referenced. It seems that Lithuania is the only country in EU which refues to allow its citizens to spell their names as they wish; note that any person, in Poland and elsewhere, can require their name to be spelled in Lithuanian alphabet and that request will be granted. But if a Lithuanian citizen requests that his own country spells his name in a different alphabet, he will be refused.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  18:56, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Lithuanization of names

message: Xx236 (talk) 10:32, 9 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current situation - ref error 

message: Renata, could you summarize the info that was removed and why? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk  16:37, 11 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of info 

message: Almost the same text is repeated.Xx236 (talk) 09:44, 23 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  A report by the Council of Europe 

message: That was a question posed to me by User:Kotniski yesterday in an edit summary of his. Let me give Kotniski the rationale regarding my opposition to this tendency, and to anyone else concerned. Why is it so difficult to understand that this is English Wikipedia. Most encyclopedias do not need to give a translation of the foreign language title of an article in its lead. Whereas I do think it's appropriate to give the translation of a geographical toponym, e.g., Warsaw: "Warszawa", Rome: "Roma", Munich: "München", in their native languages it is not appropriate to take the name of an article, like Poles in Lithuania and add "()", which btw is actually an incorrect translation of the title, The Polish Minority in Lithuania, that it follows. Especially in the lead of an article on English Wikipedia. Furthermore the argument that the article is about Poles and that it therefore justifies such an edit, is nonsensical. If for example the article regarding the Partitions of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth told us that they are known in Lithuanian as "Abiejų Tautų Respublikos padalijimai" or in Polish as "Rozbiory Polski", I would find that to be unnecessary overkill as well. As for the other geographical entities in this article, its the same old story. The capital of Lithuania is Vilnius, the fact that it is called "Wilno" in Polish is as important as telling us that the former capital of the Lithuania-Polish Commonwealth, Cracow is known as "Cracovie" in French. Dr. Dan (talk) 17:06, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree about the first part (we don't need "Polacy na Litwie" or the translations of such phrases as "Partitions of..."), but not the second. Polish names for Lithuanian places have, for obvious historical reasons, much more significance than French names for Polish places. And particularly in an article about the Polish minority in that country, readers are likely to be as interested in the Polish names for the places they inhabit as in the Lithuanian one. In any case it doesn't improve the article to remove such relevant information from it. (The same would of course apply to German names for places in Poland, etc. etc., in the relevant articles.)--Kotniski (talk) 17:22, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Glad that we agree on some aspects of the debate. This concept (and I mean that loosely) "for obvious historical reasons" can be a very thorny and contentious one, as is may be different in the eye of each beholder. For example, Jogaila was Lithuanian, Henry III was French, and Stephen Bathory was Hungarian, yet they were all Kings of Poland. This argument for "obvious historical reasons" becomes murky and allows for too much nationalistic POV pushing. It's much simpler to stick to using English and not worry about whether "our readers are likely to be interested in the Polish names for the places they inhabit". Poles inhabit "Nowy Jork" too.  Dr. Dan (talk) 19:05, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Only that New York was never part of any Polish State nor it had anything to do with Poland. Btw you have used this "it's teh nationalistic POV pushing" argument more than enough, time to get some new idea.  Dr. Loosmark  19:15, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Unfortunately Loosmark, "new ideas" concerning that argument are not likely to come from you . I also noticed that you've never contributed to this article, or this talk page before, either with your earlier moniker, or after you received your recent doctorate. But I know you enjoy interacting with me, following me around. Since your comments are usually all very pleasant, it's always nice to hear from you just the same. Sorry you plan to retire soon  Dr. Dan (talk) 01:17, 14 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  Unfortunately Loosmark, "new ideas" concerning that argument are not likely to come from you. True, but since it's you who are trying to axe out the Polish names I am afraid that the burden of proving a convincing argument for doing so is on you. The Nowy Jork thing was a decent try but you fell a bit short with it I am afraid. "But I know you enjoy interacting with me, following me around." Follow you around? Dan please WP:AGF, I am just trying to improve the project.  Dr. Loosmark  02:35, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

text: Please understand that Polish names in this article are not POV pushing, incorrect (unless they are) or irrelevant. They are highly relevant and likely to be of interest to readers. In the past I've seen you gratuitously removing Polish names from articles on places in Lithuania - this is damaging to the encyclopedia (just as removing Lithuanian names from articles on places in Poland would be). We must preserve good information. (Not necessarily in the leads of articles, but if you remove something from the lead, then at least incorporate it in another natural place in the article.)--Kotniski (talk) 10:12, 14 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: You bring up some interesting points. However saying that placing the Polish variants here is "highly relevant" and "likely to be of interest to readers" may not be the case. Please remember the topic heading, "How are Polish names irrelevant to an article about Poles?" The Polish diaspora, often referred to as Polonia, exists in many countries. In some places the minority is significant, in others not particularly so. If I'm not mistaken Curitiba has the third largest Polish colony (after Chicago) in the world. Informing our readers on English Wikipedia that the Polish version of that city is "Kurytyba" is not really all that necessary. Over a million people of Polish descent live in France, 10 million or so in North America, and on and on. Fortunately we have a Polish Wikipedia where lots of information about Polish toponyms are available. Pretty easy to find. Regarding my "gratuitously removing Polish names from articles on places in Lithuania", that stemmed from the fact that many editors (mostly Polish ones) decided that virtually every city, town, village, hamlet, and finally, "neighborhood" in Lithuania was fair game and "needed" the Polish variant to be included in the lead of the respective article. I found that a coordinated agenda was being implemented to this end. As for my removing lots of this undue nonsense being "damaging to the encyclopedia," I find that the gratuitous placing of this "information" to be more damaging. Kotniski, it got so bad that even the neighborhoods of Vilnius, had to have their Polish variant in the lead. Žvėrynas and most of the suburbs of Vilnius became battlegrounds of nationalistic POV pushing (sorry, but that was what it was). It became so bizarre that even pictures of Lithuanian neighborhoods, etc. had to have their Polish variant placed into their captions.  It took the EEML case to quiet all of that down, when many of the parties involved were banned and placed off limits on the subjects. Another incident involved the article on Kėdainiai where some 700 people of Polish ancestry live in a city with a population exceeding 30,000 people. That too "needed" the Polish geographical "variant" on English Wikipedia in the lead. Presumably, that entry was to inform our readers on English Wikipedia of this "highly relevant information and likely to be of interest to them." Since we seem to have a disagreement here, perhaps others can weigh in on this.  Dr. Dan (talk) 18:20, 14 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  The Poles in Lithuania are not Polonia and neither are they diaspora or a "Polish colony". Those people live in those lands for many, many centuries. Also those territories were at various times in history part of a Polish state. So please Dan stop mixing apples and pears in Randy in Boise style.  Dr. Loosmark  18:30, 14 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: O.K., I've been called a few choice things in the past. A "sword-wielding skeleton", is a new one. Got a good laugh out of it. Thanks, getting a laugh around here can be quite a good thing. So tell us just what the "Polish minority in Lithuania" is. Please don't tell us again how long they've lived in Lithuania or that those territories were part of the Polish State (somewhat debatable in itself). Of course the concept is clear as far as the words go in English, but explain why they are not part of Polonia. While you're at it Loosmark, just so I'm not comparing apples to oranges and staying closer to Poland itself, how do you view the Polish minorities in Belarus, Ukraine, and Russia? Certainly Poles have lived there for centuries. At various times some of these territories belonged to the Polish State. Jurij Bogdanowicz Otrepiew probably thought Moscow did. Always wondered if the anecdote that he was shot out of a cannon in a westerly direction was true. Dr. Dan (talk) 18:59, 14 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Would it be possible for you two to stop making personal remarks and address the issue? It doesn't really matter much whether the Polish minority is Polonia or not; the point is that this article is about that minority, so however few of them there might be or however they came to be there, the names they use for the places they inhabit are obviously relevant. As to the other place articles, adding information to the encyclopedia is not "POV pushing" - there's no point of view involved in saying that something is the Polish name for something (unless you claim that it is not the Polish name) - that's helping to build the encyclopedia. Whether it belongs in the lead or not is a question that can be addressed (I'd have thought that given Lithuania's history, in most cases the Polish names would belong in the lead according to WP's usual standards, just as German names belong in the lead of articles about places in now-Polish Silesia and Pomerania and so on), but it certainly belongs somewhere in the article, so just removing it is destructive.--Kotniski (talk) 07:29, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

text:  Dan seems that the difference between economic emigration, forced resettlement and minority originating from border shifts is unknown to you. Please do some research and then we can resume the debate.  Dr. Loosmark  22:11, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: How are Polish names irrelevant to an article about Poles?

message: Despite my view above about including Polish place-names in the article, I really don't see any justification for this continuous insertion of the phrase "Polacy na Litwie" at the top - not only is it not even equivalent to what goes before it, but it's just a phrase in the Polish language that has no significance (or if it does have some special significance, that would need to be properly explained). Can everyone see the difference between this and actual names?--Kotniski (talk) 16:17, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I believe that any article about an ethnicity should inform, how the people call themselves. "Polacy na Litwie" is, as far as I understand, such a name. Not "Polonia litewska" or "Polacy w Litwie". Lithuanian minority in Poland does not containe such name, Xx236 (talk) 12:55, 12 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I still don't think it's a name; it's just the obvious Polish translation of "Poles in Lithuania". By including it we're implying that this phrase has some special significance for people of that ethnicity, which as far as I know it doesn't (or if it does, we need a source and an explanation of the significance).--Kotniski (talk) 08:07, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: We have plenty of sources - see the names of organizations in Lithuania. Xx236 (talk) 10:38, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: "Polacy na Litwie"

message: Vilnius Region informs about pre-WWII period mostly, so the link isn't correct, rather Vilnius district municipality and Šalčininkai district municipality.
.Xx236 (talk) 13:28, 23 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:   Poles are concentrated in the [[Vilnius Region]] 

message: Whenever an etnic Pole and an ethnic Lithuanian or Russian meet, which language do they usually speak is it Lithuanian, Russian, English or some other language? Aaker (talk) 19:47, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lingua franca? 

message: http://wyborcza.pl/1,75478,11677174,Przeciez_jestem_Snarski__a_nie_Snarskis.html Xx236 (talk) 13:08, 8 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tomasz Snarski 

message: He is perhaps the most prominent POLISH figure from Litwa, isn't he?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.4.101.50 (talk) 05:18, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: @83.4.101.50 MICKIEWICZ did not hail from or was born on the territory of modern Lithuania. --YOMAL SIDOROFF-BIARMSKII (talk) 07:25, 8 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  ONLY THREE PROMINENT POLES FROM LITWA? HOW ABOUT MICKIEWICZ? 

message: The infobox says:
:Catholic Church, Judaism, Orthodox Christianity (98.6%). 
I am very curious how the census made ethnic Poles into Judaism. Can anyone provide a more explanatory info? Staszek Lem (talk) 21:24, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Judaism among Poles in Lithuania 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

message: Following WP:SIZERULE, this article should Almost certainly should be divided, as it is ~100 kB. I suggest creating the following articles: 
*Poles in the Grand Duchy of Lithuania (just like there is Poles in the Soviet Union; this article has the added benefit that it can be pointed to in Poles in Belarus)
*Polonization of Lithuania (just like there are the articles Russification of Finland or Russification of Belarus.)
I must note that there is the article Demographic history of the Vilnius region, which overlaps very significantly with this article.--Cukrakalnis (talk) 16:51, 5 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think that this article is too long for now. There is also an article Polonization which covers a similar topic as the one proposed by you. Marcelus (talk) 19:14, 5 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I second that Marcelus. The article is getting too long in my opinion. I tagged it. - GizzyCatBella🍁 12:23, 15 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposal to divide this article 

message: @User:GizzyCatBella  (link to the edit). The phrase Numerous of them have Lithuanian ancestry. is by no means , because multiple WP:RS next to the statement emphasize that there were once Lithuanian-speaking Lithuanians in those areas and there was no massive migration of Polish people into there, but instead Polonization (that's what is described in the section 19th century). Even User:Marcelus has to agree with me on that - he wrote it in the article.--Cukrakalnis (talk) 13:00, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: And that's already in the article~, both main body and the introduction. Marcelus (talk) 13:11, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Such a fact of important relevance deserves to be made clear to the readers, instead of assuming that they will realise it themselves. Cukrakalnis (talk) 13:20, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  It's clear already Marcelus (talk) 13:26, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Cukrakalnis and Marcelus - take a break from editing this article folks. Come back in a few days. - GizzyCatBella🍁 14:18, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  GizzyCatBella I don't edit because I don't have time lately, but I watch with horror the activity of Cukrakalnis, who not only obstinately tries to define Lithuanian Poles as polonised Lithuanians at the very top, but also starts to propagate the Zinkevicius pseudo-theory that all Poles with surnames ending in -wicz are Lithuanians by origin.Marcelus (talk) 15:19, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: As I said previously, Marcelus is on a , regardless of whether what is written is WP:RS or following any other Wikipedia rule. If he doesn't like it, it has to go, and that's it, regardless of the justification. Simply impossible to reach an agreement when that's the attitude. Cukrakalnis (talk) 15:42, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Regarding the introduction