Talk:List of religious sites

message: The diagram should be reversed right-to-left, as the entrance to the tabernacle and temple faced to the east.  I recognize that the diagram is not specifically drawn with compass directions specified, but I feel it would be better.
Unfortunately my HTML-fu is a little weak and rusty these days, or I'd do it myself.  Maybe I'll come back. Jdavidb 15:21, 31 Mar 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Reverse the diagram

message: I believe that the Manti temple of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints also has a Holy of Holies off the celestial room, but it is not used as such - though it is not used for another purpose either. But this is just from memory - any other thoughts out there?
This might be an overly narrow view of what the Holy of Holies is for.  Yes it's where the President of the High Priesthood (and of the Church) confers with the Lord, but it is also used for the ordinance called the "second anointing," and other temples have rooms specially set aside for that purpose.  Furthermore, the Celestial room today fills a role analogous to the Holy of Holies during the presentation of the Endowment.  Like I said, I think the definition used here is overly narrow.
I recommend splitting the article into two and adding a Most Holy Place (Latter Day Saints) article, as there are two different places as well as different religious traditions involved. --Shirahadasha 01:53, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Split the article and created Most Holy Place (Latter Day Saints). --Shirahadasha 06:39, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

text: With the article being reconfigured to encompass "multiple religious traditions," having a Most Holy Place(LDS) is now redundant.  Keeping with the pluralism of this new configuration, I fleshed out the Latter-day Saints section.--Rojerts 20:15, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Without the redirect of Holy of Holies to Most Holy Place, it is incorrect to label the Salt Lake Temple, or the Holy of Holies within that temple, to be the Most Holy Place for Latter-day Saints.  Removed.  See Holy of Holies discussion.--Rojerts 00:45, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  LDS Holy of Holies 

message: The sentence "The Jews consider this blasphemous" was recently added - is there a reference for this - as I have not heard of this before today? Trödel|talk 12:33, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Traditional Judaism to this day does not permit saying or writing the tetragrammaton in ordinary contexts. Accordingly, it would be appreciated if editors not use the name directly. --Shirahadasha 02:01, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

text: However, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia and must describe the subjects it covers accurately. When describing a religion, it shouldn't ascribe to the religion a claim that members of the religion wouldn't themselves use or agree with. Would you be equally ready to agree with a claim that, for example, the Pope worships the Buddha, on the similar grounds that Wikipedia isn't censored and what Catholics believe simply doesn't matter? The issue isn't whether or not Catholics would consider this sacriligious. The issue is whether the article would be accurate. Same here. --Shirahadasha 21:37, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Blasphemy? 

message: Removed a claim in the article stating that the Holy of Holies was at the "center"e. The Talmud provides very precise dimensions, Tractate Yoma, for example, provides dimensions indicating a clear Jewish tradition that while it was centered North-South, it was placed significantly to the west on the East-West axis. In light of this tradion, a claim that it was at the center not only should not be taken as fact, in the absence of a source the claim should be deleted. Note that the diagram reflects this assymetry and shows a location which is clearly well to the west of center.  --Shirahadasha 07:16, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Location in [[Temple in Jerusalem]] 

message: This article's religious POV appears to take a position based strictly on the Hebrew Bible, which provides for the building of a tabernacle in the Wilderness. But traditional Judiasm relies on an Oral Law, the foundation of the Talmud, which contains much more detailed directions about the building of the Temple in Jerusalem. According to Orthodox Judaism, these instructions also came from God. I would suggest somewhat more careful language here. We could say things like "according to the Hebrew Bible, God said", which would then permit language like "according to the Talmud, this really meant..." --Shirahadasha 01:50, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Religious Interpretation 

message: Removed the following material, all of which appears to present a (non-Jewish) WP:OR perspectives that the Ark in a Jewish synagogue is comparable to the Holy of Holies in the Temple in Jerusalem. There are resemblances, but one just isn't the same as the other. No branch of Judaism would find the sort of analogy this article claims. Orthodox Judaism would say the Holy of Holies is irreplacable, while Reform Judaism would say it is no longer relevant. Sources need to be supplied to support these claims -- and I challenge anyone to find mainstream Jewish opinion that does so. 
:Within Judaism all synagogues are constructed in such a way that the most holy spot is the "Holy Ark" in the sanctuary. The place where the Torah scrolls or Sifre Tora (Biblical: סִפְרֵי תּוֹרָה Sip̄rê Tôrāh) are stored is known as the "Holy Ark" or Aron Qodesh (Biblical: אֲרוֹן קֹדֶשׁ ʼĂrôn Qṓḏeš). It is usually built along the wall of the synagogue closest in direction to Jerusalem. This spot is considered to be somewhat analogous to the original Tabernacle's and Temple in Jerusalem's Qodesh HaQodashim — the Holy of Holies. During all Jewish services in all synagogues, the worshipers face in the direction of the Holy Ark, which contains the holy Torah scrolls belonging to every Jewish congregation. When the Holy Ark is opened so that the Sefer Torah may be taken out for Torah reading, all worshippers (except the elderly or ill) usually rise as a mark of respect for its holiness and importance. In Orthodox Judaism, the Ark is regarded as being only a faint echo of the Holy of Holies in the Temple which is regarded as retaining a much higher degree of sanctity. Reform Judaism, which regards the Temple in Jerusalem as an archaism, sees synagogue Arks as largely or wholly replacing the reverence formally due the Temple.
:detailed account of the service (avodah) of the High Priest in the Temple in Jerusalem is read on Yom Kippur in Orthodox Synagogues, and some Conservative synagogues (at least in part). In many Orthodox synagogues (and some traditionalist Conservative synagogues), worshippers recite and mime the act of sprinkling blood at each traditional sprinkling point, and postrate themselves fully on the floor at points in the service when the High Priest would mention the Tetragrammaton, the only time in Jewish services where Jews practice complete full-body postration. The service includes a poem about the radiance of the High Priest upon exit his successful exit from the Most Holy Place, which is compared to the beams of light the Bible ascribes to Moses' countenance upon his return from Mount Sinai. Orthodox services also add prayers lamenting the destruction of the Temple, and praying for the speedy rebuilding of the Temple and the restoration of sacrificial worship.
:Tnere are actually numerous mentions of the Holy of Holies in Jewish Services. There are references to it all over Psalms, for example. This material simply duplicates material covered in the Yom Kippur article -- can simply reference it.--Shirahadasha 06:19, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: In Jewish synagogues

message: The heading of this article says:
"For the term Most Holy Place as used in the King James Version of the Bible, see Holy of Holies."
But the term "Most Holy Place" no longer appears anywhere in the body of the Holy of Holies article.
And mention of the idiom was also removed from the Holy of Holies article in its 21:49, 14 October 2007 edit.
I have heard that the repetition of a word in Hebrew is intended to be an emphasis of the word.  The following repetitions appear to have that intent ( http://www.tentmaker.org/books/asw/Chapter5.html ):
*servant of servants (Gen 9:25)
*Holy of Holies (Ex 26:33)
*Heaven of heavens (Deut 10:14)
*God of gods (Deut 10:17)
*Lord of lords (Deut 10:17)
*Vanity of vanities (Eccl 1:2)
*Song of songs (Song of Solomon 1:1)
*Prince of princes (Dan. 8:25)
The emphasis on the degree of superlative intended by the Hebrew construction may be missed by those who are unaware of the idiom.
Perhaps the "of" in these translations is a concession to ease of reading in English?  Might they also be translated, "Holiest holy [place]", "Vainest vanity", etc.?  "Songiest song" doesn't flow at all in English, but would that convey the intention of the Hebrew construction?
http://bible.cc/ecclesiastes/1-2.htm
: they are not only vanity but vanity of vanities, the vainest vanity, vanity in the highest degree.
http://bible.cc/songs/1-1.htm
:This title denotes its superior excellence, according to the Hebrew idiom; so holy of holies, equivalent to "most holy" (Ex 29:37); the heaven of heavens, equivalent to the highest heavens (De 10:14)
Discussion of the King James translation as "Most Holy Place" and the idiom could be helpful somewhere.  Both were mentioned in the Holy of Holies article at one time, but they were removed during restructuring of that article. -Ac44ck (talk) 04:37, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I added a subsection to the Judaism section in the Holy of Holies article.  I had reservations about mentioning the KJV Bible in the section on Judaism.  Maybe that statement would fit better elsewhere in the article, though it is quite relevant in the subsection where the idiom is discussed. -Ac44ck (talk) 16:11, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  reference to Holy of Holies was broken by editing there 

message: I think the mention of Varanasi as the holiest place in Hinduism is plainly wrong. Hinduism doesnt have one holiest place but consider many. One thing about Hinduism is freedom of choice and there are many holy sites equaly 'holy' if you have to say. I recommend that we remove the mention of Varanasi. Abhask (talk) 17:42, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hinduism 

message: In this section, we have the statement that the Church of the Holy Sepulchre represents over 1.5 billion Christians or 25% of mankind. 'Mankind' is estimated to have around 6.7 billion people (POPClock). This means that 1.5 billion, give or take, actually represents 22% of the world's population. I understand that there's a certain interesting point in thinking that almost a quarter of the world is comprised of Catholics/Orthodox Christians, so I left the 25% in the paragraph. But because it is isn't quite 25%, I modified the statement by adding 'almost'. This preserves the notion of 'a quarter of the population' but adds that it isn't quite a quarter of the population. Ultatri (talk) 18:55, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Catholic/Orthodox Christianity Section: '25% of Mankind' statement 

message: What about the many indigenous groups out there, many of which have sacred sites of their own? Take, for example, Crater Lake in Oregon which is considered the most sacred site of the Klamath people. Shouldn't they be considered, too?--174.59.220.52 (talk) 11:26, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Per the notability guidelines as long as there is significant, independent, reliable secondary-source coverage of the subject there is no reason why you cannot cite sources and add this in. Peter Deer (talk) 12:06, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Outside of Major Religions 

message: "List of significant religious sites"? Wikipedia calling anything "sacred" seems like a bad idea to me. --82.152.179.249 (talk) 22:54, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rename for NPOV? 

message: The article seemed to be too biased towards Christianity, with reference to the amount of information available on the topic. I propose moving all the information on Christianity in a separate article titled "List of significant religious sites in Christianity" and having only a transcribed version of the same in the current topic to protect it from being too biased towards any religious faith  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.194.102.49 (talk) 10:28, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Christianity bias 

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message: The information provided on the most recent edition of this article concerning the LDS church provides a more basic Christian perspective on the LDS church. As well, the addition of the Sistine Chapel to the secton on Roman Catholic religious sites is to emphasize the importance of the Holy See in Catholicism, not to mention the fact that the Papal conclave occurs here.
--108.207.218.55 (talk) 16:36, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent undoing ot the 2:09 April 10, 2012 update 

message: It would be nice to add some African religious sites like those of the Oromo people of Ethiopia, Lake Hora. Many exist, just want to remind editors here that to not forget poor old Africa. And there are those in Islam like Toubaa, Senegal. I would love to help but let me start by suggesting. --Inayity (talk) 20:05, 27 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  African religious sites anyone? 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Bethlehem is a sacred place in Christianity. It is where Mary, the mother of Jesus was born. 65.78.2.156 (talk) 00:26, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bethlehem 

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