Template talk:LayTheravadaRebirth

message: Just wanted to briefly explain the choices for this template's current content to both temper and allow for rationale discussion regarding future possible changes to this template.
The template is primarily based on the Dighajanu Sutta's second section where the Buddha advises Dighajanu that the four conditions conducive to a householder's having a fortunate future life are accomplishments in saddha, sila, caga and panna.  The Buddha then elaborates that saddha refers to having faith in the Buddha's own sublime qualities and accomplishment; sila refers to the Five Precepts; caga refers to open-handedness, charity and almsgiving; and panna refers to the ability to discern anicca (impermanence) leading to the ending of dukkha (suffering).
So the question becomes how to translate this into a template (if one is so inclined!).  The first simple approach would be to simply map:
* saddha = Buddha refuge
* sila = 5 Precepts
* caga = open-handedness, charity and almsgiving
* panna = seeing anicca and the end of suffering
With this basic idea, I added English translations (faith, virtue, generosity and wisdom).  Then the following changes were made:
* Saddha: Many texts state that Buddhist faith involves faith in the Triple Gem, not just the Buddha.  (Perhaps the fact that the Dighajanu Sutta only identifies faith in the Buddha possibly dates this sutta???)  So, I initially changed this to "Triple Gem" and referenced the Velama Sutta.  However, "Triple Gem" might be relatively obscure for some readers and, frankly, it's being a singular item did not balance well with other table items; so, I expanded it to "Buddha · Dhamma · Sangha" and then wikilinked this entire expression to the Triple Gem.
* Sila: I played with the idea of adding "right livelihood" (for instance, supported by Bodhi [2005]'s commentary to the Dighajanu Sutta), but decided it was too sprawling a term, not directly identified in the suttas in question and possibly seemed to suggest that the other parts of the Noble Eightfold Path did not apply; so, this was taken out.  Then I decided to add "8 Precepts" since this is frequently mentioned as a householder duty, and I referenced its usage from the Dhammika Sutta.  (The fact that the 8 Precepts are not mentioned in the Dighajanu Sutta might again suggest that this sutta predates regular Uposatha recognition??? [Yeah, I know, such speculation is probably groundless ;-) ])
* Caga:  I then decided that caga was far less familiar to most practitioners and readers, so I changed it to the much more familar and similar dana.  This also allowed for the condensing of the table by changing "generosity (caga)" to "giving (dana)".  Additionally, for me, the phrase "open-handedness" is vague and, in my relatively limited knowledge, does not readily resonate with other suttas; so, I deleted it from the table.  I kept "Charity" though because so much of the Sutta Pitaka's notion of giving seems to be around "Almsgiving"; so I thought the Dighajanu Sutta's mentioning charity is worth noting.
* Panna: A momentary inclination was to cryptically put "anicca" and "dukkha" here, but this appeared too abstruse to me.  So, I then decided to expand "the cessation of dukkha" to include the entire arc of the "4 Noble Truths."  I then replaced "anicca" with "Vipassana," which involves the ability to see impermanence.  However, I then decided that vipassana is really a meditative practice conducive to the realization of anicca as well as dukkha and anatta.  So, I expanded anicca to ti-lakkhana (3 Characteristics) and decided to add the finally category of Bhavana (see below).
*Bhavana: As indicated just above, this was added to realistically account for the general understanding that anicca is apprehended through mental development, usually "vipassana."  So, vipassana was added.  I then thought of a number of suttas which mention that metta practice is also conducive to a fortunate future rebirth, although a number of suttas make the caveat that metta without wisdom does not lead to long-lasting happiness in future lives.  Thus, I added metta plus vipassana and cited the Velama Sutta (which is not yet on WP nor on ATI but is referenced elsewhere, such as Bodhi, 2005 and at www.metta.lk [AN 9.2.10] and which can be found via a Google search) which also recognizes that metta is not as ultimately liberating as "the perception of impermanence."  As for why "MIND (Bhavana)" was chosen -- it's simply that "MENTAL DEVELOPMENTAL" is way too long and "(Citta)" is too concrete.  (I hope this makes sense to those familar with Pali -- if not, let me know and I'll expand.)
And there you have it.  Hope this rationale makes sense and this template seems worthwhile.  Please write here or on my talk page if any questions or concerns or arguments or other feedback.  With metta, LarryR 18:10, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rationale for template's content 

message: The Dighajanu Sutta lists the four conditions conducive to a fortunate future birth as:
*faith
*virtue
*generosity
*wisdom
I stuck "mind" (i.e., mental development) after "wisdom" so that the original Dighajanu Sutta conditions would remain adjacent to each other; however, given that is really a precursor to the attainment of true wisdom (e.g., apprehending anicca in all things), I've decided to move the "mind" category before "wisdom."
In addition, the Dighajanu Sutta does not explicitly state that these conditions are in some kind of developmental order.  Yet, there is a standard ordering of a number of these conditions.  For instance, the three bases for the performance of meritous deeds (see AN 8:36 or AN 8.4.6, "Punnakiriyavatthusuttam - Meritorious actions") are listed as: 
*giving 
*virtue 
*mental development. 
Also, the Threefold training lists the training in the order of: 
*virtue
*mental development 
*wisdom.  
Thus, to reinforce the order of these two common overlapping concatenations of conditions, this template's ordering will be changed to:
*faith
*giving/generosity
*virtue
*mental development/mind
*wisdom.
(In other words, I'm swapping "virtue" and "giving.")  My one regret about this ordering is that it separates the "faith" (the 3 Refuges) from "virtue" (the 5 Precepts) since these two verbal expressions are together the basic tenets of all Buddhists; but, templates are full of trade-offs :-)  
LarryR (talk) 03:25, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ordering of conditions 

message: It seems to me the template does not only apply to lay people, but also monastics. The practices and qualities listed are broader than only lay practice. I therefore propose removing the word lay from the title of the template.--Farang Rak Tham (talk) 13:36, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not only lay people