Talk:Kent State University at Stark

message: The fact of the matter is that the purpose of such templates is to connect "similar" articles; that is to say articles where the subjects are related.  The template has a link to Kent State University Stark Campus, so Kent State University Stark Campus  should have the template on its page.  The template is about all notable things Kent State. Kent State University Stark Campus is one of the notable Kent things. I'm really not sure how to make this more clear.
*Template A links to articles A, B, and C.
**Articles A, B, and C should all have Template A on them. §hep  •  ¡Talk to me! 04:04, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Bottom line

message: Please do not keep putting it on, unless you can make it ONLY a link to Kent. 
The many bars about housing, athletics, etc. is completely irrelevant to Kent Stark and only serves to confuse the two.  Information about life on the Kent Campus may as well be about the University of Kentucky or Ohio State.
Thanks  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Purocafe (talk • contribs) 18:03, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Again you are missing the point of the template.  It is to connect all things Kent State.  The articles on each regional campus (there is currently just one article) contain all the information you have addressed.  As I mentioned before, see Ohio State University, Newark Campus for an example.  The template is very clear that the Kent State Stark article is part of the Kent State series, which it certainly is since Kent Stark is a regional campus of Kent State, not an independent university which just happens to share the same name.  The article on Kent State Stark goes into greater detail on the issues specific to its own campus, but that doesn't mean there can't be a connection to the greater university since Kent State Stark claims attachment to it, not only academically, but advertises that students can begin any of Kent State's majors at Kent State Stark.  Now perhaps the template can be reworked or modified, but just get used to the fact that Stark is a regional campus and Kent is the main campus, so yes, it is going to have much more mention and be much more notable than Stark.  The template is to point out all notable things about Kent State University, most of which ARE at the Kent campus since it accounts for some 22,000 of the university's 33,000 students.  You really need to look at more examples and study the purposes behind templates and the relationships between articles. --JonRidinger (talk) 18:09, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Please also understand that the template can be modified and expanded as needed.  If something is notable at Stark, it will be included, whether it be research, campus, programs, whatever.  Right now, the only things notable about the Stark campus as far as Wikipedia is concerned are that it is a four-year school and a regional campus of Kent State University.  Further, the University System of Ohio template should not be placed on this page because neither the template nor the article it connects to involve Kent State Stark specifically: it involves Kent State University, which Stark is a part of. Other regional campus articles also do not have the USO template on them, only the article about the main University itself (like Ohio U., Ohio State, Miami U., etc.). --JonRidinger (talk) 18:37, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

text: And with WP:NPOV we don't really care who we offend unless it's a BLP.  Also, since you obviously have a WP:COI please step away and clear your head before making such statements. §hep  •  ¡Talk to me! 19:05, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

text: I agree...this goes along with what I have been saying.  The template is for all things notable at Kent State University, regardless of which campus it comes from.  At this point, the most notable things do come from the Kent campus because of its size compared to the other campuses (Kent campus enrollment is around 22,000 while the next biggest campus, Stark, is just over 5,000) and the fact that many (though certainly not all or even most) of the regional campus programs feed into programs at the main campus. It's one university; 8 campuses.  As more articles are written about aspects of the regional campuses that have sufficient notablity, they should be included in the template under the appropriate category (the categories can also be modified, expanded, or eliminated). Perhaps we can reword the main article to differenciate between the "main" or Kent campus and the other campuses, though the regional campuses are mentioned in the main article.  As I understand it now, all classes of all majors offered by KSU are available at the Kent campus; this is not true of the regional campuses.  I do hope to start articles for the remaining regional campuses as well.  --JonRidinger (talk) 16:47, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

text: Oh, but I have checked my facts.  Everything I have said comes from the KSU websites; all of which are interconnected.  Kent State University is an 8-campus system, but the Kent campus is most certainly the main campus.  Students at all campuses can begin most of KSU's 282 majors; but only at the main campus can they begin and finish all of the majors.  That's not to say the regional campuses don't have their own unique programs; they should be spelled out in their articles and linked to the template as neccessary if they are notable.  No one is disputing that.  The Stark website says the following here: "Kent State University Stark Campus offers a variety of academic options for students. We have 11 bachelor degree programs, a professional M.B.A. program, a masters in education in curriculum and instruction and three associate degrees which students can complete in their entirety at our campus. We also offer an opportunity to begin coursework in many of the 282 academic programs available at Kent State University."  That doesn't mean that all the regional campus programs are feeders into the main campus, but they can be, as I said and the websites support that.  I don't place things in the articles without sources; different than posting opinions here.  I don't have personal experience with the regional campuses...all I go on is the information provided.  As I've said before, and other experienced editors have backed me up here, is that the template is for all notable things Kent State University.  No one can argue that many of the most notable aspects of KSU are at the main campus, due to it being the oldest and by far the largest of the campuses and also the administrative center.  And, as I've pointed out, notable programs at the regional campuses CAN be placed in the template if they have articles or at least the potential.  That's not "Kent-centric" that's realistic.  Stark has its own administration, yes, but it is under the main administration that oversees all campuses.  Please also try to state your opinions without using personal attacks. --JonRidinger (talk) 13:54, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Other template examples with similar regional campus setups like Kent (i.e. a large main campus with smaller regional campuses) include :Template: Ohio State University and :Template: University of Akron.  When I initially created the template for KSU, I used the Ohio State one and :Template: University of Michigan as examples. Also, the "tilt" towards the Kent campus isn't just because articles have been created, but also because they were notable enough to be created.  Programs exclusively at the regional campuses that are notable should most certainly have their own articles and be placed in the template.  Right now we just need to create articles for the remaining regional campuses and expand all of them so we can get to the point of creating spin-off articles where appropriate.  Does anyone think we could start a Kent State University Wikiproject, similar to Wikipedia:WikiProject Brigham Young University? --JonRidinger (talk) 02:02, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Kent State University template

message: #1...there is some question as to whether the seal on this page is A) an actual seal of KSU-Stark and B) if it violates trademarks.  The image is not tagged as a copyrighted image and is "self-made".  While this may be true, because it uses elements of a trademarked image, the KSU seal, it likely still falls under trademark.  Further, I have never seen any of the branch campuses use a seal other than the one used for all of Kent State that says "Ohio 1910" at the bottom.  If they use their own versions, it certainly isn't on any of their websites or literature I have seen.  This series of pictures from the KSU-Stark website shows the main seal used in commencement and for speakers.
:I'm also not sure the picture of Dr. Boze on this page or her bio page Betsy Boze are allowed either.  Just because someone uploads an image does not mean they have the rights to release it into the public domain.  It's allowable if the actual photographer uploads it.
ANSWER PHOTO:  The photo was taken by Kent photographer Bob Christie and uploaded either by him and/ with his written permission to use it for this.
:This needs to be stated somewhere that Bob Christie took this photo and releases the rights of this to the public domain.  The current photo tags do not say this. --JonRidinger (talk) 04:32, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The link provided does not work.  I wasn't making references to architechture...the official seal of Kent State University is featured on podiums and hanging on the wall in the background of a commencement (as I pointed out from these photos in a previous post), hardly elements which would be difficult to change if Stark did indeed have its own official seal.  Regardless, if Stark does, it is copyrighted and the current image on Wikipedia Commons is incorrectly tagged as a public domain image.  Further, Kent State Stark is still a part of Kent State University, so until it becomes completely independent, the main KSU seal will supercede the Stark seal just like it supercedes the seals of the Honors College, College of Nursing, etc.--JonRidinger (talk) 04:32, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: This is not an "old policy" as it is dated January 2008.  This policy is exactly what is on the current article.  You kept attempting to remove the first instance of the phrase "Kent State University Stark Campus" which was what was the problem.  Notice there are no other uses of the full term in the entire article (other than titles), nor have I or any other editors tried to add them.  Our edits have been in harmony with the KSU guidebook in first using the full official name for the page title, the infobox title, and the opening line, and then using a shorter approved name throughout the article. --JonRidinger (talk) 04:32, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

text: As another editor also pointed out, the powers that be at KSU-S do not make decisions on the content of a Wikipedia article.  Until their own communications make it official, the article is still titled "Kent State University Stark Campus" since it is the official name used by KSU and KSU-S on their own site, so that phrase needs to stay in the opening paragraph.  You'll note that throughout the rest of the article, "Kent State Stark" is the used phrase, since it is by far the most common. --JonRidinger (talk) 04:14, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

text: "KSU-S" is a phrase I used in this discussion for a small abbreviation.  You will not find it anywhere in the article ever.  The phrase "Kent State University Stark Campus" is, however found on Stark websites and the very guidebook you referenced states that the official name of all the regional campuses is "Kent State University xxxxx Campus". --JonRidinger (talk) 04:32, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

text: This page does not belong to Kent State Stark in any way...it is about Kent State Stark.  And really, even for those people to post they would also have to cite external sources as Wikipedia is not to be a "primary source," just like we have asked you to do as well as write neutral, encyclopedic content...see Wikipedia:NPOV.    Basically, if it isn't published somewhere, it can't be a source, even if Dr. Boze herself edits the page.  We are not second-guessing their edits since they have not edited the article, we are second-guessing your edits.  Edits with proper sources won't be removed...see Wikipedia:Sources.  You being at Stark does provide you with a closer perspective and maybe access to additional printed sources (books that may not be online, for instance), but being able to edit is irrelevant to where we are since the same characteristics need to be present on all pages: verifiable encyclopedic content that is well written, unbiased, and from reliable sources. You really need to study out the Wikipedia guidelines and policies if you really want this article to be a good article.  Right now it is far from it. See :Category: Wikipedia official policy. --JonRidinger (talk) 04:32, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Two items 

message: Just a note for anyone who could help; we need to standardize and expand the citations and combine repeated sources.  See WP:CITE#Citation Templates, using the "cite book", "cite web", and/or "cite news" templates.  I'll do what I can! --JonRidinger (talk) 15:31, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources 

message: Thanks for all the images that have been uploaded for this article.  My only worries are that the images need to directly relate to the content and that they are truly public domain images.  Also watch out for putting too many images on a particluar page.  Be careful with pictures of living people too.  See WP:IMAGE for more guidelines.  Also, be careful using logos.  Even though KSU-Stark is accredited by the AACSB, the use of the AACSB on this article violates copyright and fair-use rules as far as I understand them since this article is about Kent State Stark, not AACSB.  Wikipedia articles are not for promoting their particular subject, just information about them.  If anyone has anything else to add, please do!  It is nice to see this article grow and mature slowly but surely! --JonRidinger (talk) 01:19, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Images 

message: Kent State Stark is accredited by AACSB and is encouraged to use the "Accredited" logo.
Refer to the AACSB details of using the logo for details.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by BVBoze (talk • contribs) 02:15, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: While your edits are well intentioned, your comment speaks for itself: "Kent State Stark is encouraged...".  This is not Kent State Stark.  This an article on Wikipedia that is about Kent State Stark, so the use of the AACSB logo doesn't apply here; use of it is licensed and encouraged on Kent State Stark's own website and publications and this article does not fit into those categories.  Again, please refer to and become familiar with Wikipedia's policies on images and logos. --JonRidinger (talk) 03:07, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  AACSB Accredited 

message: The image :Image:KSU seal.png is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here.  In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page.  Please check
:* That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's description page for the use in this article.
:* That this article is linked to from the image description page.
This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --23:43, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:KSU seal.png

message: Although the general term used for the campus is "Kent State Stark" or "Kent State University Stark" the full name is still "Kent State University Stark Campus" according to the University's most recent style guide in relation to all the regional campus names as seen here on pages 12-13.  Examples from the document include "Always write out in full and capitalize; subsequent references should be capitalized: Kent State University Ashtabula Campus"; "The lecture is at the Kent State University Tuscarawas Campus"; "Kent State University Ashtabula Campus," and yes, there is also reference to "Kent State Stark" in the same paragraph, meaning "Kent State Stark" or other examples like it are acceptable shorter versions of the name.  Now, first, we need to understand that the KSU style guide doesn't necessarily have to apply here since this is Wikipedia, not Kent State University.  This seems to be an instance of a "preferred" short name, much like KSU now prefers to be called "Kent State" in short instead of just "Kent" like it was in the 1980s and 1990s.  However, we do have at least one user who insists that the full name is not used at all anymore and is constantly editing this article to remove "campus" from the infobox title and introduction.  So, I throw this out to any editors: should we change the article title to simply "Kent State University Stark"?  "Kent State Stark" and "Kent State University Stark" seem to be the most common, though "Kent State University Stark Campus" is the full name and is hardly unused.  I did a simple Google of "Kent State University Stark" and virtually every instance returned that phrase with "Campus" attached.  My vote is obviously to keep it as is and I have not seen any official documentation from Kent State or Kent State Stark that the "Campus" has been dropped from the official names of the regional campuses.  Other opinions and reasons would be appreciated.  Thanks!  --JonRidinger (talk) 02:20, 30 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Official name consensus 

message: Oh Jon, please!  You SO need to get over this!
I thought that this was finally resolved with all the links to the web page, official publications, and yes, even the blasted logo on the podium at official events.  At least it was resolved to everyone else's satisfaction.
Despite your esteemed estimation of yourself, you really aren't the arbitor of Kent State University naming conventions.  Let them call themselves whatever they want here.  The Kent State Stark or Kent State University Stark names are totaly consistent with reality, their web presence, their publications, etc., etc.  
We all understand that you like the old name for some reason.  But times have changed and so has their mission.
TerriThomas (talk) 08:02, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm sorry, I didn't see any other consensus on the "name change" here and the link to the "blasted podium" wasn't posted on this page, it was posted on another user's talk page in response to a question/comment I posted, which leads me to believe that the same user may be using multiple accounts.  If that is a false accusation, I apologize, but I am suspicious.  Again, it is obvious the campus prefers "Kent State University Stark" or "Kent State Stark", however, Wikipedia naming conventions are what I'm concerned with here.  In this case, based on documentation from Kent State University (in the link I provided to their 2008 style guide) as well as the always popular Google search for the most popular usage, "Kent State University Stark Campus" is not only still the "official" or full name of the campus (as well as the format for all campus names) but more importantly, it is also still the most commonly used name by third party sources in identifying the campus, which is important in naming articles on Wikipedia regardless of official names or preferred names.  The shortened versions "Kent State University Stark" and "Kent State Stark" are obviously the preferred names as evidenced by the seal and the logo.  It's along the lines of the Ohio State University article where a debate raged for months about the inclusion of "The" in the article title.  The result was that while "The Ohio State University" is the official name of the university, Wikipedia naming conventions won out in the title which generally discourages using "The" to start an article title.  Again, if experienced, third party editors feel we should change the name of the article to "Kent State University Stark" I will go along with it.  Until it is changed, however, the title of the article is still Kent State University Stark Campus, so it needs to remain in the infobox title as well as in the opening line, which as I've pointed out countless times, is the only uses of that name in the entire article.  The rest of the article uses "Kent State Stark" mostly.  Again, the "mission" of Kent State Stark is irrelevant to the name of this article as is the campus's preferred name since this is an article about the campus, not by the campus. Please become familiar with Wikipedia policies, particularly the naming conventions and avoiding conflict of interests, before simply assuming that I'm doing this because I "like the 'old' name."  Other editors' comments would be also be appreciated.  --JonRidinger (talk) 13:43, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

text: Actually, I have provided evidence for why I believe what I do and that I'm after consistency in Wikipedia naming conventions, not simply "my preference" for the full name.  Hardly "bullying."  I was not claiming a consensus had been reached if you read my comments; I am looking for one from additional editors, particularly more experienced and third-party editors who have no connection with KSU.  It is obvious what you feel about it and what I feel about it, so when that happens, we ask for help from those not involved as heavily in the article.  --JonRidinger (talk) 13:43, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:   The name, revisited 

message: Please do not remove templates unless the problems they are there to help with have been resolved.  For now, there is a refimprove template because several sections do not have any references at all and a cleanup template because there are a number of organizational problems such as the lead, small sections, order of sections, and general content.  Some of the existing sources need to be checked to make sure they are still valid, and others need to be placed in the appropriate citation template.  There is also promotional language that needs to be addressed to make the article more neutral.  --JonRidinger (talk) 07:04, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Templates 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 7 external links on Kent State University at Stark. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added  tag to http://www.kent.edu/rpie/enrollment
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110715164748/http://recordpub.com/news/article/4691733 to http://recordpub.com/news/article/4691733
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080828011446/http://www.presidentsclimatecommitment.org/summit/registered.html to http://www.presidentsclimatecommitment.org/summit/registered.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081204160206/http://11thhouraction.com/my-comments/39 to http://11thhouraction.com/my-comments/39
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080525093931/http://www.indeonline.com/local_news/x170772889 to http://www.indeonline.com/local_news/x170772889
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20081231155452/http://uso.edu/network/usoSchools/regional/kentstu/stark.php to http://uso.edu/network/usoSchools/regional/kentstu/stark.php
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080513105808/http://yourcorporateu.kent.edu/ to http://yourcorporateu.kent.edu/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100711085751/http://www.sbnonline.com/Local/Article/13284/65/146/For_the_asking.aspx to http://www.sbnonline.com/Local/Article/13284/65/146/For_the_asking.aspx
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 13:40, 4 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified