Talk:Spartan Executive

message: I was thinking of inserting specs from Jane's AWA as we do not have a source quoted (anyone recall where they came from?). They call it just Executive, with no 7W but dimensionally its the same.  However. Jane's has it with a P&W Wasp Junior (R-985) SB of 300 hp (which sounds more like Junior A), and they list correspondingly lower performance. Is this a variant that should be listed?TSRL (talk) 20:47, 10 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Engine 

message: An IP editor has been edit warring for months to include "A Spartan Executive is featured at the beginning of the 1951 sf film When Worlds Collide", without any refs to back up that this is correct or to allow anyone to determine if this was a significant film role. As per the consensus at WP:AIRPOP we no longer include popular media trivia in aircraft type articles to avoid exactly this type of problem of filling up aircraft type articles with film trivia, instead it has all been moved to Aircraft in fiction. This statement was moved to Aircraft in fiction some time ago, but later deleted from that article due to a lack of any references cited there. As per WP:TRIVIA Wikipedia is an encyclopedia and does not include trivia. As per WP:V it does not include unsourced content, because it is not verifiable. To avoid an endless edit war I have tagged this trivia for a ref needed. I propose that this be removed and if this IP continues to edit war I propose that the page be semi-protected. - Ahunt (talk) 13:28, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know how to provide the citation/reference that you want for the film. It was reviewed in the press in 1951, and has been reviewed in digital media since, but no reviewer has ever commented on the Spartan Executive, since reviewers are presumably interested only in the science fiction in the film, and not the aircraft. I have looked at the section in Wikipedia on Aircraft in Fiction, and I can see several mentions of, say, B17 Flying Fortresses in films, without exact citations. Yet nobody is seriously disputing that these aircraft are B17s. I can only suggest that anyone interested in the Spartan Executive can watch the film at many free websites and they will immediately see that it is indeed a Spartan Executive. You can cross reference these with several more recent 21st century videos of the Executive viewable on YouTube. Admittedly it is only a very brief appearance at the start of When Worlds Collide, but it is the only one that I know of in film made at or near the time the aircraft was being produced. It has some good shots, both inside and outside the cockpit, and I think it should be left to stand as I uploaded it, though perhaps with a comment from yourself. 86.20.171.127 (talk) 23:00, 18 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for taking the time to reply. If the Spartan Executive isn't a primary character in its own right (as the B-17 is in Memphis Belle) then it shouldn't be listed. A brief appearance isn't notable in itself (though it is interesting to me that it appeared in the movie). That was the consensus the wiki aviation project has reached. The problem was that if you allow every appearance of something obscure like the Executive, then you end up with droves of F-16s and MiGs, overwhelming their pages, and it becomes hard to rein the fanbois in unless consistency is maintained.NiD.29 (talk) 00:15, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The other problem as I mentioned at User talk:86.20.171.127 is that without a reference there is no way to confirm this is an Executive and not some other type. You just saying it is, is original research, which is specifically prohibited on Wikipedia. So what we have in total is a brief, non-notable appearance, with no references. That adds up to "it doesn't belong" on Wikipedia. - Ahunt (talk) 01:36, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The movie is available online - definitely an Executive, however it is seen for all of about 5 seconds in two shots, with the pilot describing it only as a cabin monoplane. No registration was visible, and its role was exceedingly minor - ie it was even replaced for the second leg of the pilot/gopher's trip by a Lockheed Constellation. I didn't check to see if it showed up in the credits but that isn't likely. Had the registration been visible there might be a source to it being in the movie.NiD.29 (talk) 04:45, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Well if it was a five second incidental appearance then it certainly is not a "significant role" and doesn't rate a mention on Wikipedia, even if we had a reference. You can't use identifying the aircraft yourself from the movie as a reference due to WP:OR and we have removed several other mentions of other aircraft for the same reason in the past. The posting of the movie on-line is probably a copyright violation and thus runs afoul of WP:COPYLINK which rules out referring to the on-line verson. I think we can close this discussion out and remove it. It has already been removed from Aircraft in fiction again as lacking a ref. - Ahunt (talk) 13:08, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

text: We certainly can, and I'm exhausted! But thanks anyway, NiD.29!  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.20.171.127 (talk) 00:40, 20 November 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Trivia