Talk:List of largest cities throughout history

message: i came across this site http://geography.about.com/library/weekly/aa011201a.htm and i thought it's interesting that there's a list of all the most populated cities since the dawn of civilization. I'll work on expanding this article when i have more time. Meanwhile if anyone can help expanding it please do.
Oh yeah, I didn't copy and paste the entire list from the site, I put together the table myself and reorganised the structure. Oidia 05:00, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: I'm still working on it

message: Hi, i have trouble putting text below the table in the main article. Everytime I add new headings or texts underneath the table, it always ended up showing above the table. Can anyone please help me with putting the Reference down the bottom? And after I put together the table I'm kind of stuck on writing the main body, anyone suggests what to put in there? Oidia 02:49, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: I need some help

message: I just stumbled upon this page, which seems like a great idea.  If I could make a suggestion or two, though, I'd recommend taking a look at the Wikipedia:List_guideline and formatting this page more like other Wikipedia lists (Including changing the name to "List of largest cities throughout history"). Elijahmeeks 04:32, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll see what I can do to help, though I've never worked on lists before. Elijahmeeks 15:09, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: This seems valuable

message: Everything here should be moved to Historical urban community sizes if it is not so already.Gabriel Kielland 07:25, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Since no one has made any further suggestion, nor has anyone talked about it, the article should not be merged. And I have removed the template. Oidia (talk) 01:27, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I am opposed to a merger because this article is long enough to survive on its own and it discusses another topic. --96.232.60.31 (talk) 00:23, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: There is a better article on the same topic

message: to everyone who contributed to and improved this article so much :) Oidia 12:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Thanks

message: George Modelski estimated the population of Knossos at 15,000 for the years of 1700 B.C. (6th largest) and 1600 B.C. (9th largest), at 50,000 for the year of 1500 B.C. (2nd largest), and at >10,000 for the year of 1400 B.C.  He also estimated the population of Athens at 100,000 for the year of 400 B.C. (one of the 9th largest).  On the other hand, Tertius Chandler estimated the population of Knossos at 20-24,000 for the year of 1600 B.C (8th largest) and at 30,000 for the year of 1360 B.C. (9th largest) in his book published in 1987.  He also estimated the populatio of Athens at 155,000 for the year of 430 B.C. (3rd largest).
There may be some dispute over the populatio of Knossos, which did not have city walls.  But in most of the case the city size of Knossos is estimated to be around 100 ha or more, where more than 50,000 inhabitants can hardly live.
For the Athens' case, 350,000 is not the estimated population for the city of Athens, but for the whole Attica.  Recent estimates are even lower than 100,000.
http://www.princeton.edu/~pswpc/pdfs/morris/120509.pdf
Ehrenberg's estimates for Athens are: 120–150,000 (in 480 B.C.); 215–300,000 (in 417 B.C.); 115–175,000 (in 400 B.C.); 170–255,000 (in 360 B.C.); 135–190,000 (in 313 B.C.).  Gomme's estimates for Athens are: 317,000 (in 432 B.C.); 218,000 (in 425 B.C.), 258,000 (in 323 B.C.). According to Modelski, "These are estimates for inhabitants of the Athenian state; only two-fifth of these earlier on, and one half in the latter fourth century, would be living in the city)."
Anyway the source of the population that Den123456dk has given for Knossos and Athens is not Modelski's nor Chandler's book.  For the addition of Knossos or Athens, the fourth column should be made, but better estimates or references should be taken into consideration to make another column.Aurichalcum (talk) 10:46, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Population of Knossos and Athens estimated by Modelski and Chandler

message: I changed the current country from West Bank to Israel. The West Bank is in Israel even if it is under the control of the Palestine Authority, which, incidentally, only exists as an Act of the Knesset. Therefore the authority derives is power by virtue of an act of Parliament, the Israeli parliament.--Degen Earthfast (talk) 14:03, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Jerico

message: I'm confused why my change (Created External links section and added relevant external link) was reverted. I believe the external link is valuable in that it presents the data on this page in a visual form that will undoubtedly be of interest to visitors to this page. My change was reverted immediately and with no reason given. I'm relatively new to Wikipedia edits, so please let me know if I made a mistake in the way I did this, but please _do_ let me know, don't just revert a good faith edit without giving a reason! Thanks, Markinvancouver (talk) 01:18, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: The maps are misleading and in contradiction with the article. The worst example is Setubal 1600 BC. Gabriel Kielland (talk) 13:03, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well, many of the Chandler's estimated populations of world urbans are indeed questionable, but are still referred in many research papers. For the Setúbal case, he probably estimated the population of Zambujal of the culture of Vila Nova de São Pedro. I rather support to keep the link to the map.Aurichalcum (talk) 13:45, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Confusion about reversion of change 

message: I think different dates in the same century should be joined together. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.35.29.211 (talk) 18:54, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  There is too much lines ! 

message: hey there - great article
however i'm sure there should be Aztec populations in here as well
ta (Bkat004 (talk) 15:17, 29 July 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Aztec 

message: I am missing some entries from Ethiopea, Mexico, Peru.
Helenuh (talk) 01:11, 14 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  American and African cities 

message: Given the current (literal) breadth of the article, the desire to avoid text wrapping, and the majority of text on the current page, I'm standardizing the usage to . Given the initial formatting of the page, I do understand if a consensus might form to use  but kindly establish it first & switch all the dates. If we do go back to that way, one way to shrink it & make it less obnoxious is to use smallcaps as in this comment. — LlywelynII 03:36, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: WP:ERA

message: Don't go before the relevant text. Ever.
If you really want it to be on a different line, use  before the ref formatting. — LlywelynII 03:36, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Footnotes

message: On a similar note, this is an article about cities not population numbers: the cities should lead in the tables. — LlywelynII 03:41, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Table formatting

message: It doesn't make sense and it is not scalable to have columns by authors. The authors/books should simply be cited by the numbers. I would rather suggest the same format with simply cities and years, split in separate tables by epoch, similar to Historical urban community sizes. I would go further suggesting that the two articles should be merged.--Codrin.B (talk) 19:20, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Doesn't make sense to have columns by author 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: See WP:RSN#Sources for List of largest cities throughout history. Doug Weller talk 21:19, 27 December 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I am not sure that this is a case of dubious sources, it is made apparent that these are estimates by specific authors and not concrete fact.Adamm321 (talk) 21:21, 15 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dubious sources 

message: It stands to reason that "Tertius Chandler, Four Thousand Years of Urban Growth: An Historical Census, 1987" supersedes "Tertius Chandler and Gerald Fox, 3000 Years of Urban Growth, 1974". I suggest removing the "Chandler & Fox 1974" column. –dlthewave ☎ 23:51, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chandler sources 

message: The table is currently an absolute mess. I am not much familiar with table formatting, can someone fix it? Gotitbro (talk) 03:12, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Pinging previous contributors . Gotitbro (talk) 03:14, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm afraid I can't be of much help, I did some cleanup a while back but I'm not very good with table formatting either. –dlthewave ☎ 13:12, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Ditto, sorry. Useless at tables. Doug Weller talk 19:52, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

text: Why is it an "absolute mess"? It looks pretty good to me, the only issue I immediately noticed is that when the fourth column was removed, per  above, at least one row (1962) was left empty. Any rows without figures should be removed I suppose. – wbm1058 (talk) 04:40, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  I am seeing population numbers in the location rows and vice versa in the population rows here on my desktop, with Chandler being completely. I guess you are right that this diff caused it, if someone could fix it that would be great. Gotitbro (talk) 06:40, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Table 

message: I was wondering if Ollie Bye fulfilled the requirements to be a reliable source that could be included as its own source. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kptMVQRud5c Please reply what your opinion is. I will add him as its own column if there are no objections to this addition.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.180.22.221 (talk) 22:01, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: He's not sorry. We need an academic source for this. --HistoryofIran (talk) 21:41, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ollie Bye As Source? 

message: You have to explain how a city of 3.15 square kilometers can accommodate a population of 500,000 people, even in the slums of modern Africa or India, or in the high-rise housing of Hong Kong.There will not be such a high population density.
Whether the city's population can exceed 100,000 is still debatable, let alone a figure like 500,000, which is simply unrealistic. 完颜吴乞买 (talk) 02:32, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Population of Carthage? 

message: China's "Warring States Period" is seriously underestimated, and the number of large cities in this historical period far exceeds that of the Han Dynasty, the Three Kingdoms, and the Jin Dynasty that followed...
Estimating the size of the population of ancient cities is difficult because of their age and varied architectural styles. But the city floor area does not lie, and if the city has a large floor area, it proves that the city has a large population.
临淄齐国故城，姜子牙建起“东方古罗马”_腾讯新闻 (qq.com)
For example, Linzi, the capital of the ancient Qi Kingdom, has an area of 16 square kilometers, which is almost the same size as the Roman city.
艰辛四十载 再现纪南城 (kaogu.cn)
There is also the capital of the ancient Chu State, Ji Nancheng (Ying), which covers an area of 16 square kilometers.
Dong Hailin, Li Guang, Li Ya's book "Handan Places of Interest" 2011 edition, the book on page 50 records Handan, the capital of the ancient Zhao State, with a construction area of 18.88 square kilometers.
中山古城遗址保护规划出炉 曾出土万余件文物(图)-中新网 (chinanews.com.cn)
Lingshou, the capital of the ancient Zhongshan Kingdom, has 46 square kilometers of ancient city ruins, but this is not exactly the city part, including mausoleums and some military buildings.
开封城墙的变迁 (zhihu.com)
The capital of the ancient Wei state, Daliang, covers an area of more than 20 square kilometers, but unfortunately the city is now located 10 meters underground in Kaifeng City, and the excavation has not yet begun.
《河南文物之窗》——郑韩故城-河南省文物局 (henan.gov.cn)
In ancient times, the capital of Han (Han) was Xinzheng, with an area of about 16 square kilometers.
党报头条｜一座古城，诠释传承 (baidu.com)
Jucheng, the capital of the ancient Ju Kingdom, was also a large city, and later became the capital of the Qi State, expanding its area to 25 square kilometers.
In addition to the above, Mudu, Shouchun, Gaotang, Xiadu, Luoyang, Jinyang, Diqiu, Suiyang, Jimo, A, Pinglu, Jicheng, Yong, Chen, Xianyang, Ye, etc., were all considered larger cities at that time.
Estimates of the population of ancient cities are obviously unscientific, but the size of the city's ruins will tell us the answer. 完颜吴乞买 (talk) 03:14, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  China's cities from 500 to 200 BC are underestimated