Talk:Iona Institute

message: I dont believe this article should be deleted due to notability concerns. The Iona Institute is a new organisation, established circa 8 Jan 2007. I have included a link to an RTE interview on the institute and I am sure over time it will be the subject of "multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent". --Trounce 16:41, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notability 

message: I've added the above to the article in question. Autarch (talk) 18:14, 29 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Criticism and citations

message: A couple of things need clarification:
*It is opposed to the surrender of children for adoption by married couples under the proposed children's rights referendum  except where those parents have failed in their duty to their children - does anybody have a source for this claim about the referendum? Admittedly I haven't been following it, but a claim like this needs to be verified, surely?
*As present the children of married parents cannot be legally adopted in Ireland even if they have been fostered for years and have no contact with their birth families - a reference for this would be good too.Autarch (talk) 13:32, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Childrens referendum and adoption 

message: The phrase "religious segregation" is more derogatory than the term "denominational education", breaching WP:NPOV and WP:OPED.Autarch (talk) 16:12, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removal of WP:OPED and WP:POV 

message: According to WP:RS: Anyone can create a website or pay to have a book published, then claim to be an expert in a certain field. For that reason self-published media—whether books, newsletters, personal websites, open wikis, blogs, personal pages on social networking sites, Internet forum postings, or tweets—are largely not acceptable - this affects this article as one of the resources is a blog. To fit with WP:RS a resource from a RS would be needed - say, a newspaper of record.Autarch (talk) 16:15, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Blogs and WP:RS 

message: To keep the current page focused on its' topic, there is now a page on denominational education.Autarch (talk) 12:30, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Separate page for denominational education 

message: In practice, the difference between the above can be so small as to be negligible.Autarch (talk) 12:47, 15 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Think Tank vs. lobbying group 

message: The article currently says In 2008, the Institute organised a conference in support of denominational education, a system in which children are segregated according to the religion of their parents and which is used in over 95% of Irish schools. - this seems to be phrased to take a stance rather than reporting what sources say. The article on Denominational education mentions criticism of the system, but it is sourced. As this article stands, it seems to be a case of WP:SOAPBOX. Perhaps In 2008, the Institute organised a conference in support of denominational education, which has been criticised in recent years (with sources for criticism) would be the best phrasing.Autarch (talk) 13:34, 24 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Denominational education 

message: I want to explain why I am removing the last sentence of the "Criticism" paragraph. It fails WP:NOR and WP:SELFPUBLISH. The line is referenced to the Wikipedia editor's (Jaimehy) own Blog "Aggressive Secularist by Jamie Hyland" and was added by him--92.251.255.12 (talk) 10:39, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: It is more appropriate to remove the source and replace it with citation needed than remove all the text. IRWolfie- (talk) 00:47, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

text: I've reworked the article a little, adding some citations and working any criticisms into the article itself as appropriate. IRWolfie- (talk) 21:14, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Criticism: accused of disingenuously misinterpreting data 

message: This article seems to have a single-purpose account "looking after" it and adding lots of non-notable material. Perhaps a conflict of interest?  
* Criticism of Iona has been removed.
* Iona's statements/assertions are presented as fact rather than as opinion/statement/assertion.
* Reliance on primary sources.
BastunĖġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 13:15, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV 

message: There was a murder in Clondalkin on 12th January 2014 of someone involved with the Iona Institute: Man expected in court over chess killing (Irish Times), Victim of 'gruesome' killing after chess match a 'quiet and devout' man (Irish Independent), Man held in Dublin over 'ritualistic chess killing' (The Guardian).
My own instinct is not to mention the murder given WP:NOTNEWS. However, he is described in some of the above news items as a researcher for the Iona Institute and David Quinn is quoted expressing "shock and sorrow" concerning his murder, so he may have been a significant member, which might merit a passing mention.Autarch (talk) 02:57, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd vote to leave it out as it's not directly related to the Iona Institute or his work with them. --GeneralBelly (talk) 11:05, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Earlier today I noticed that his name appears at the end of the list of key people - presumably best would be to remove his name and make no nother change.Autarch (talk) 22:19, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Clondalkin murder 

message: Why does this keep getting deleted?
The Iona Institute is the trading name of Lolek Ltd, a private limited company set up in 2006. Controversy has arisen in relation to the use of the word "Institute" as the heading for a privately owned Catholic lobby. It has been noted that whilst there are no laws in Ireland as to the use of the word "Institute", in Britain for example, the company would not be permitted use of the term in compliance with the guidelines of the Companies House which states that the use of the term Institute "is normally given only to fully functioning organisations that are established in the field but operate under a different name" and that among other things "the range of activities may vary but institutes are organisations that typically undertake research at the highest level or are professional bodies of the highest standing" and "whether the institute provides training or activities that support qualifications provided by other bodies such as universities or colleges".  — Preceding unsigned comment added by SunnySideUp101 (talk • contribs) 18:48, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The material contains original research as well as blogs which are unsuitable for establishing weight, and of unknown reliability. IRWolfie- (talk) 18:56, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  I've found a reliable source for the incorporation info and the founding date of Lolek Ltd. This is definitely relevant, encyclopedic data - Alison ❤ 19:46, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Sure, no skin off my teeth if you want it. I had checked it up myself last year previously but couldn't deduce any meaning so didn't consider it worthy of much attention. Is there any relevant category for the infobox? As far as I can tell, the part about UK laws etc is original research. IRWolfie- (talk) 23:00, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Sunny edit

message: "Lobby group" throughout the article was changed to "organisation".  On reflection, I'm changing it back.  There is no way to join this "organisation" except by invitation, it would appear.  It is, therefore, simply a self-appointed pressure group.  The article should reflect that. BastunĖġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 20:03, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Organisation" vs "lobby group" 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Iona Institute. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article6888989.ece
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130926015138/http://www.education.ie/servlet/blobservlet/epl_primary_school_list_2010_2011.xls to http://www.education.ie/servlet/blobservlet/epl_primary_school_list_2010_2011.xls
*Added  tag to http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/comic-norton-shows-support-for-panti-in-rte-payout-row-29976200.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 13:47, 12 April 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 5 external links on Iona Institute. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071118175519/http://www.ionainstitute.ie/pdfs/civilunionweb.pdf to http://www.ionainstitute.ie/pdfs/civilunionweb.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150525161137/https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/418150/GP1_Incorporation_names_v5_4-ver0.29-4.pdf to https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/418150/GP1_Incorporation_names_v5_4-ver0.29-4.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150924002338/http://www.esri.ie/UserFiles/publications/SUB002/bkmnext206.pdf to http://www.esri.ie/UserFiles/publications/SUB002/bkmnext206.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090815224447/http://www.ionainstitute.ie/pdfs/NI_religion_poll.pdf to http://www.ionainstitute.ie/pdfs/NI_religion_poll.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071118175744/http://www.ionainstitute.ie/pdfs/Iona_Religious_knowledge_pollApr07.pdf to http://www.ionainstitute.ie/pdfs/Iona_Religious_knowledge_pollApr07.pdf
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:54, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This section on Iona's legal status mentions 'David Norris referred to "the so-called Iona Institute" as "an unelected, unrepresentative group of reactionary, right-wing, religiously motivated people".[18]'. This is not inl ine with WP:NPOVAerchasúr (talk) 12:28, 11 April 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: New talk page sections go at the bottom of the page. I am very familiar with WP:NPOV and it doesn't say what you think it says. Please also have a read of WP:IDONTLIKETHAT and WP:RIGHTINGGREATWRONGS. Your edit history over the last couple of days would suggest you might be here for the latter, removing referenced content that you don't like. Can you please stop? The status of the Iona Institute, its access to the media, and its charitable status are topics that have been covered by other notable people, and coverage - that is referenced - is most certainly WP:DUE. BastunĖġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 13:36, 11 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title: Alteration of Status 

message: I edited it in the first line to emphasise that it is a Christian group (rather than specifically "Roman Catholic"). As pointed out above a Church of Ireland Bishop is a patron implying it is not a specifically "Roman" Catholic group and emphasising that its values are broader Conservative/Christian values. I also added minor edits to the "status" section. I felt it lacked some context as to why the quotes were there. I didn't remove them since that did not seem to be the consensus.
I have since reverted an edit describing it as a "radical" group. I don't think that is an appropriate descriptor. Social conservatism was the norm and is still relatively mainstream (the Catholic Church is still an important/influential institution which is not usually referred to as "radical") and is the most accurate descriptor of their focus. The "purpose" could be simplified, their purpose is to promote and defend social conservative values but it is probably not necessary to copy/paste their "about us" section here. 
--Spaircí (talk) 13:03, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Being funded clandestinely by Russian oligarchs in order to pursue and promote a particular agenda that infringes on human rights might accurately be described as "radical", but yes, it would require a reference to be included. BastunĖġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 13:35, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent Edits