Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ice Hockey/Team pages format

message: I was wondering about this for weeks. Should we remove all those Stanley Cup champions succession boxes from the NHL team pages? For example- at Montreal Canadiens, Toronto Maple Leafs and Detroit Red Wings (with honorable mention to the Boston Bruins and Edmonton Oilers), they seem to clog up the bottom of the page (also makes the page longer them needed). What everyone's views. GoodDay 16:38, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Nope I think they are fine where they are. There are only a few cases where they get that long so I don't see it as an issue. --Djsasso 16:43, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

text: The Canadiens is the only instance in which it gets a little long. Perhaps they could be put into a template and be hidden by default on just theirs? IrisKawling 23:35, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll go for that idea. GoodDay 00:04, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

text: I don't really see where the issue is to begin with. Its not adding any load time really cause there is very little text to them. And having to scroll down is not really a big deal. For the sake of uniformity they should stay just how they are. --Djsasso 02:06, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Personally, I can't stand them.  What do they add to an article?  Why is it important to note on the Calgary Flames article that Edmonton won the cup in both 1988 and 1990?  Also, why does it matter on Sidney Crosby's article who won the Calder Memorial Trophy the year previous and following?  IMO, succession boxes are simply filler used to add irrelevant information. Resolute 03:52, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Changed my mind. Perhaps it's best to remove them. Krm500 is correct, the Stanley Cup championship years are already listed at the top Infobox. GoodDay 20:44, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I see your point, but it allows people to follow the succession of champions throughout the years. I think it may serve as a metaphor by "linking one story to the next". Maybe I'm just full of shit, but that's me. Darthflyer 03:54, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

text: I don't agree with that. When I look at a team page being able to see who they replaced as the Stanley Cup Champion and who replaced them or if they repeated as being a very worthwhile thing. I personally like succession boxes as long as they are sorted properly on the page. For me its not about seeing that they won the championship because as you mentioned that's in the infobox, but more about who came before or after them which I do find very relevant. --Djsasso 23:11, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Isn't that what List of Stanley Cup champions is for? Resolute 23:18, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You could say similar things about everything on a team page. Information is going to be duplicated in places...if I am just focusing on the Montreal Canadiens I don't want to have to jump to multiple pages. --Djsasso 23:20, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

text: I can do without the succession box. IMHO, it's useless. Gmatsuda 02:57, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I could do without succession boxes.  They look tacky (something you'd see on a high schooler's web page) and stumbling across ones that haven't been updated isn't good.  I know its sacrilege, but I prefer the templates.  They can be updated quickly, and universally.  Before someone trots out the Derek Jeter example - I am not in favour of over-templating, with every team and championship, but they look much better and are easier to maintain than succession boxes.  Canada Hky (talk) 16:28, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I just saw that this was three years old, disregard.  Canada Hky (talk) 16:29, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Stanley Cup Champions succession box

message: Good luck everyone. I'm through with these diacritics usage disputes. So much for compromising. GoodDay 23:39, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Please see my comment on the projects main talk page. --Krm500 23:43, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

text: We did compromise on player names. Place names was something we never discussed cause it is already covered by an overall Wikipedia policy as mentioned in KM500's note on the main project page. --Djsasso 23:47, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You forgot to add the 'diacritics' to this WikiProject's example Current Squad place names. It will help make things clearer, to all editors. GoodDay 17:54, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Nevermind, they're already there. GoodDay 18:29, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Diacritics compromise policies

message: Could someone (familiar with symatix) add Denis Savard and Tony Esposito to the Canadiens 'Honored members' section. Afterall, the policy is full inclusion. GoodDay 23:05, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I brought this up on April 20th, yet know one added them. GoodDay 23:07, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Montreal Canadiens]]

message: Is the flag next to the player his country of current citizenship? I use Alexei Ponikarovsky as a case in point. His birth place is listed as the USSR, but he has the Ukrainian and Canadian flags next to him in the table, since he holds dual citizenship. (He was recently naturalized as a Canadian citizen, per his article.) This isn't touched on in the text, so I figured I'd ask for clarification. Thanks. —C.Fred (talk) 03:38, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We use the flag of the country they have played for in international competition, otherwise their birth country or a country where there is a source that they actually have citizenship from. --Djsasso 04:25, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Does not look good with two flags in the table. I'll remove the Canadian flag, otherwise there's a risk we'll see thousands of this example since many, many players have dual citizenship. --Krm500 11:38, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We should add some text about it to the manual if we want to get rid of dual flags in tables, infoboxes and other narrow places. --Bamsefar75 12:59, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I believe the second field was added for players who have played for more than one country internationally. I can't remember who the example was off the top of my head but he played for Russia and Latvia I think it was. Or Nedved who played for Russia and Canada. --Djsasso 17:37, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Which flag in the current roster table? 

message: Hi, just seeking clarification as to why "Canada" and "USA" do not directly follow the state/province listed in the place of birth column. Is this only for North American roster listings?--Lvivske (talk) 06:43, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: We've had a war or two over this in the past, IIRC, and the weight of the argument seemed to rest on the fact that omitting the country name for US/Canadian geographic locations is common practice in North American hockey media -- thus, omitting it in North American teams' roster listings seemed in keeping with that practice.  There's no ambiguity introduced since no states and provinces share a name, and in 90% of cases, the citizenship flag matches the birthplace anyway (the occasions where it doesn't is a whole other issue). VT hawkeyetalk to me 00:14, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Since previous "consensus" was mostly based on the fact that official sources used to ommit the country, how valid is it now that official NHL team pages do list the country : http://hurricanes.nhl.com/team/app?service=page&page=TeamPlayers&type=roster ? The points you make about ambiguity and flags are valid but would apply to other countries all the same. Bohdan80 (talk) 10:05, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually it was based on the fact that most hockey media (north american and european) omit the country. This has still not changed. -Djsasso (talk) 12:23, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Looking at previous discussions it does appears official NHL team pages were one reason. It also appears there was in fact no real consensus. Bohdan80 (talk) 17:37, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Omitting Canada/USA from roster templates? 

message: Toronto, Canada & Louisvill, United States, is how they should be done. GoodDay (talk) 18:40, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: City & Country for all

message: Wowsers, the sub-branch of WP:HOCKEY seems to have been abandoned. GoodDay (talk) 05:33, 29 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ghost town