Talk:Iran naming convention

message: why delete this page when there are other pages that follow suit in much the same way (GNU/Linux vs Linux naming controversy being a prime example). I vote to instead mark it as a stub for expanding. User:Genjix
I agree. I found the article to be enlightening and informative, so I'm not sure why we'd want to get rid of it. Can someone explain the rationale behind wanting it deleted? It's a long enough piece that it doesn't fit into the Iran page. Matt Deres 20:44, 28 July 2005 (UTC)

message: This article was nominated for deletion but kept by default of no consensus being reached.  See Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/'Iran' or 'Persia'? Which One Should be Called? for the archived discussion -- Francs2000 | Talk  15:34, 7 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: VfD Discussion

message: Iran was always used by the locals to refer to the land (hence the word LAND) of Persians (Parsi's), in similar fashion to United Kingdom being referred to as the land/kingdom of the British people. The people of Iran have always been known as Parsi's (english translation being Persian) since the nomadic roots. However, during the islamic conquest, the Arabs attempt to take out the letter P from the Persian alphabet resulted in most people referring to Parsi as Farsi. To sum everything, Iran is the name for the land of Persians/Aryans. In the same respect as the people of UK being referred to as British people, the People of Iran should be referred to as Persians. This is the only geographic and historically correct term. Infact, the term Iranian is incorrect in many ways although ignorantly being used. Some similar examples to help you grasp this fact, are Dutch people from the Netherland (You wouldn't call the Netherlandis or Hollandians), the British etc. --Sina7 00:29, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Why discuss, its simple to understand Persia and the land Iran

message: This page needs a bit of improvement in copyediting...and could stand to use a clear picture on the current status of the debate. --Dpr 05:13, 2 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Editing

message: _ _ I redid the former lead section, not only to conform to MoS, but for NPoV purposes: it is wildly inappropriate to construe our love for lk'g terms to articles as requiring or even permitting lk'g the first refs to Iran, Iranian, Persia, etc, in this article to articles we would normally lk them to: this is an article abt whether those patterns of lk'g in some sense reflect bad usage!  For purposes of the new one-'graph lead section, they are just words.  The charitable interpretation of what i eliminated is that an editor made the honest mistake of too rigidly applying routine practices beyond their reasonable scope. (While i have no evidence for the uncharitable intrepretation -- an intentional attempt to tilt the "debate" by begging the question -- IMO the editor responsible should forgo indignation over any false accusations of that intent that anyone may lodge.)
_ _ The new section i added uses, i hope, all those terms, unpiped, to demonstrate a common-sense (i.e., unresearched) account of the state that is in some way subject to someone's hope of a change.  (Sorry for my vagueness; haven't read & won't read the debate! Language mostly changes by itself, not by debate, and they'll know it (even) in Peoria when any change has occurred.) I may not have gotten the details right, but (even the begging of the question aside) the article looks silly discussing what the usage should be without documenting what usage is.
_ _ I also added near the end of the article some excessive material from the Dab page Persia, which someone tried to turn into a mini-article; it is probably mostly suitable here. --Jerzy•t 16:44, 4 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Established English usage" section 

message: There are a number of issues with the language section. Could someone knowledge comment on them?: 
  
the official English name of the language is "Persian", and not "Farsi" 
:English has no 'official' arbiter. This sentence needs to say which organisation has decided that Persian is correct and Farsi isn't. 
  
Professors of the language frequently rebuke those who do not refer to the language as Persian in English. 
:Who are these professors? Is it referring to professors from the 'Academy of Persian Language and Literature'?  
Ashmoo 23:24, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Simply, if one looks at English dictionaries published before late eighties and early ninties , one does not find the word "Parsi" or "Farsi" in any of them. My Oxford Advanced Learner Dictionary published in 1990 does not have the word "Farsi" or "Parsi" but it does explain "Persian" as an adjective for Iranians and also the name of language of such people. The word "Farsi" appeared in recent dictionaries in response to the use of the word by many Iranian immigrants to the west who did not know the actual word to describe their native language in English. If one looks at some of the government forms in English speaking countries such as US and Australia one  can see the forms have an item for native language as Persian (Farsi) for that matter. 203.48.45.194
Ashmoo, you are incorrect: Link to the following: http://heritage.chn.ir/en/Article/?id=88
"In English, however, this language has always been known as “Persian” (‘Persane’ in French and ‘Persisch’ in German’). But many Persians migrating to the West (particularly to the USA) after the 1979 revolution continued to use ‘Farsi’ to identify their language in English and the word became commonplace in English-speaking countries.
In the West when one speaks of ‘Persian Language’, people can immediately connect it with several famous aspects of that culture and history such as Persian Gulf, Persian Carpet, Persian food, Persian poetry, Persian cat, etc. But “Farsi” is void of such link which is only obvious for people in Persia (Iran) and a few other nations in the Middle East.
The Academy of the Persian Language and Literature (Farhangestan) in Tehran has also delivered a pronouncement on this matter and rejected any usage of the word “Farsi” instead of Persian/Persa/Persane/Persisch in the Western languages. The first paragraph of the pronouncement states: “PERSIAN has been used in a variety of publications including cultural, scientific and diplomatic documents for centuries and, therefore, it connotes a very significant historical and cultural meaning. Hence, changing ‘Persian’ to ‘Farsi’ is to negate this established important precedence. Changing ‘Persian’ to ‘Farsi’ may give the impression that it is a new language, and this may well be the intention of some Farsi users…”
Fortunately 'all International broadcasting radios with Persian language service (e.g. VOA, BBC, DW, RFE/RL, etc.) use “Persian Service”, in lieu of the incorrect “Farsi Service.” That is also the case for the American Association of Teachers of Persian, The Centre for Promotion of Persian Language and Literature, and several American and European notable universities.'  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.34.60.168 (talk) 23:06, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

text: I edited the section, and it seems pretty neutral now; I made the changes based on what was said on this page. Someone can put the notice back on if they feel the section still needs to be neutralized.--Parthian Scribe (talk) 09:46, 14 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Persian Language section

message: Why is the image Image:Yek toman qajar.jpg keep getting deleted?
It is essential in my view that it be used in the article.
The image demonstrates that the name "Iran" was in official use even before 1935, despite the name "Persia".
Thanks.--Zereshk 00:10, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Image

message: I believe the title of the map is misleading or false. It states it originates from the year 200BC by a chap called Eratosthenes. On viewing the map it appears from the lettering and terminology to be more or less late last century and printed in London ? Should it not be titled correctly in a subject that is obviously important to many people? ~~Signed J.Cornish~~
(This was a question that was posted on the actual article. I moved it here.)
:It's a modern reconstruction, obviously. Let's change the caption. Lukas (T.|@) 08:17, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Map of Iran commonly used on this and other pages covering this subject 

message: i do not have access to kasravi's books. but i remember a discussion on this matter and i guess it was claimed that he was supportive of the name Iran. is there anyone who can update my knowledge on this?--Xashaiar (talk) 06:57, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  ahmad kasravi 

message: There are quite a lot of uses of the name "Iran" in English literature starting about 1800. McKay (talk) 05:57, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early English usage. 

message: There is no reason for this deletion.  The source, Hooman Majd, is notable author and there is no reason to delete his arguement. --BoogaLouie (talk) 18:53, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's an opinion, not a fast. Therefore, it does not belong here. --KneeJuan (talk) 01:19, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: What reason do you have to call it "an opinion" rather than a considered judgment based on the sources knowledge of the Iranian diaspora? Majd has spent much time in Iran and the US (is a native speaker of English), has written for a bunch of US periodicals, and has enough credibility and experiance to have "served as an advisor and translator for two Iranian presidents, Mohammad Khatami and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad."   --BoogaLouie (talk) 22:31, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: revert of addition

message: I think it's better to have two separate pages (instead of merging this one with name of Iran which focuses on the the word "Iran" and its historical usage among Iranians). Alefbe (talk) 18:25, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: merge?

message: It's better to move this page to Names of Iran (and expand it to also include other historical names in other languages, including Arabic and Ottoman Turkish). Alefbe (talk) 20:40, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Move and expand