Talk:Valley of the Fallen

message: For older talk see
*Talk:Santa Cruz del Valle de los Caídos
*Talk:Monumento Nacional de Santa Cruz del Valle de los Caidos
"Many of these prisoners never enjoyed freedom, since there were no safety procedures, so accidents were a daily occurrence and often fatal. During the 18-year construction period 14 workers died."
- That doesn't make sense.
63.215.27.199 03:51, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Untitled

message: Quote: "Those buried in the Valley of the Fallen, however, are thousands of Nationalist soldiers; the few former Republicans buried there were added among the collection of unknown soldiers assembled from temporary graves at the end of the war."
That's not true, most of thouse buried in the Valley are actually reds...: More than 30,000 out of 50,000 are republican soldiers. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 83.53.73.100 (talk) 15:09, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: "most of thouse buried in the Valley are actually reds"  I think the wording here makes it pretty obvious what this anonymous commenter's allegiances are. jae (talk) 12:18, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: User:Jae why are you replying to a 15 year old comment? Mztourist (talk) 07:54, 13 April 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article is lying 

message: I made a few changes today to the last version left by User:Camelotescorial. Much of it was commas and grammar/punctuation in general. Among other things, I also:
1. Switched the Franco reference back to a simple "dictator." That's the important title; adding "general" interrupts the flow of the sentence and isn't really important in an article that isn't directly about Franco (what next? "Spanish fascist Christian caucasian dictator Generalissimo Francisco Franco Bahamonde"?). Anyone who wants biographical information will click the link and will soon discover Franco's military credentials.
2. Removed the link to Basilica de la Santa Cruz del Valle de los Caidos. As you can see from this page's talk archives, it was decided at one point to combine the valley and basilica articles into one "Valle de los Caidos" article.
3. Removed the below text from the start of the article:
:El Valle de los Caídos redirects from here to the municipalities of San Lorenzo de El Escorial, Madrid, El Escorial, Madrid, Monasterio de El Escorial and La Granjilla de La Fresneda de El Escorial, Madrid
It's impossible to have more than one redirect target for one page; and in any case, it isn't true; that page doesn't redirect to any of those pages (it was a redlink when I found it; I made it a redirect to this page). I considered putting these links under a "See also" heading, but didn't see the point: there's already a link to San Lorenzo within the text, and there's a link to El Escorial within the text.
4. Changed the former "Basilica and cross"/"Basilica de la Santa Cruz (etc.)" heading to read "Basilica, abbey and cross" to more accurately reflect the section's contents. ``` W i k i W i s t a h W a s s a p 21:32, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edits of 9 May 2007 

message: What year have the monuments been built? When were they finished? It is not clearly stated in the article.  Ferred (talk) 11:09, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chronology of the monuments 

message: While helpful, this section in my view has no place in an encyclopedia. If anyone disagrees just let me know. I'll delete it in a week from this date if nobody is in disagreement.
:The Anonymous IP 86.45.134.172 might log in before doing a lot of deleting anywhere.--Wetman (talk) 09:57, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  [Visiting From Madrid] [Section] Proposed Deletion 

message: Removed reference to M Sullivan as not fully true and misleading - Franco's burial at the monument was decided 25 years after completion by the King of Spain. The dicator never intended to conmemorate his memory in a Monument dedicated to the fallen during the Civil War, as he was not one of them.
Removed reference to 20,000 political prisioners participating during construction as not an established fact.
Included Chronology and some factual data on the monument.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by El Cid Cabreador (talk • contribs) 14:02, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  [Editions March 2010] [section] 

message: Previous editions included links to exemplify one side of the public opinion, which claims that the partial closure of the abbey is due to a political decision of president Zapatero's government. The controversy includes opinions supporting that the closure is due to accident risk during the restoration works and that the political aspect is a misinterpretation. In order to complete the controversy picture, a link is added supporting also the second point of view.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.83.20.184 (talk) 09:19, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  [Adding links and more information to illustrate the 2010 closure controversy] [section] 

message: Given all the debates in recent years about the Valley of the Fallen, the word "somewhat" is very misleading and also quite belittling of those who feel very strongly that the monument is morally wrong. 
There are many who are outraged that the monument still exists and that its upkeep is funded by taxpayer money, many of whom have personally suffered during Francos dictatorship, or who have lost family members.
It is high time to revise this section and especially its title.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.244.73.58 (talk) 22:08, 11 December 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I've never been there, but the photo given here looks remarkably non-Fascist, remarkably "first-half 20th century Catholic architecture", compared with, say, the Vittoriano which was even only completed under Fascism, or, say, the Art House, Munich.--2001:A61:2127:AA01:207A:6328:11C4:BDF5 (talk) 00:07, 22 November 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: many catholics would not agree, because of the obviously faschist aesthetics of this „monument“. 89.14.27.20 (talk) 22:00, 16 July 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  "A somewhat Controversial Monument" - very misleading title 

message: In 1964, as a child of 11, I traveled extensively in Spain and visited the valley, both inside and walking the hillside above the entrance. When I commented favorably on the dedication to all the victims of the Civil War, I was told bluntly:
:(a) it was built as a mausoleum by and for Franco (11 years before his death!) and,
:(b) it had been built with slave labor, by political prisoners.
Since Wikipedia did not exist at the time, I was unaware of the need for a written source to be cited. Nonetheless this article should be cited for POV and not enough sources. Shir-El too 20:30, 29 October 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another 'inaccuracy'... 

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100124043715/http://www.ejpress.org:80/article/news/4262 to http://www.ejpress.org/article/news/4262
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20121011013341/http://www.intereconomia.com/noticias-gaceta/politica/mayoria-pp-rechaza-una-mocion-para-trasladar-los-restos-franco-20121010 to http://www.intereconomia.com/noticias-gaceta/politica/mayoria-pp-rechaza-una-mocion-para-trasladar-los-restos-franco-20121010
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20140219070409/http://www.intereconomia.com/noticias-gaceta/sociedad/patrimonio-nacional-sube-un-80-entradas-valle-los-caidos-20130504 to http://www.intereconomia.com/noticias-gaceta/sociedad/patrimonio-nacional-sube-un-80-entradas-valle-los-caidos-20130504
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thread_title:  External links modified 

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100227043353/http://www.fnff.es/francohombre_008.htm to http://www.fnff.es/francohombre_008.htm
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I have made the change today. Reuters states the legal mechanism has been put in motion to exhume remains and rebury elsewhere.  Mike Galvin (talk) 17:18, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Exhumation 

message: I propose that the section Exhumation and removal of Franco's remains be split into a separate page called Exhumation and reburial of Francisco Franco. The section is very long and quite hard to navigate so it meets the criteria for splitting and both the section and the incident itself, as well as the background and consequences of the incident, are very thoroughly cited so I would argue it meets the notability guidelines for its own article. Fiabx (talk) 21:57, 25 March 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed split: ''Exhumation and removal of Franco's remains''

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: Not moved. By weight of the arguments and policy, there is consensus that an official name change is insufficient without additional evidence that it has become the common name. (non-admin closure)   (talk) 06:52, 8 July 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Valley of the Fallen →  – WP:COMMONNAME, the official name has changed. — DaddyCell (talk)  18:07, 21 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 23 June 2023