Talk:Edoardo Agnelli

message: who the hell writes this crap. everybody knows that Islam prohibit commiting suiscide. its impossible that he commited suiscide. most probably he was killed for a reason or another. his family clearly hates him and they do have connections with the mafia. this article lacks too much detail to be of any real use. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.36.32.29 (talk • contribs) 00:24, 7 August 2006
old page needs a re-write —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.142.27.37 (talk • contribs) 00:25, 7 August 2006
We don't know for certain that he did actually convert to Islam. Even if he did, he may not have remained a Muslim for the rest of his life. In any case, whilst Islam is interpreted by most to absolutely prohibit suicide, there are, nevertheless, known cases of Muslims who have committed suicide. Not every person who belongs to / follows a religion actually adheres to all of its rules, all of the time. Nietzsche 2 (talk) 02:24, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Conversion to Islam?

message: This article seems very sympathetic towards the Agnelli family (phrases such as "There are only so many disasters that can hit a dynasty, and the Agnellis have had most of them twice"). This does not sound very neutral to me.Frickeg 22:44, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neutrality 

message: I have removed the prod tags on this article because the subject clearly has plenty of significant coverage in reliable sources to establish notability, and the conspiracy theories make him more notable, not less. I shall be expanding the article over the next few days using these sources:
*http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/main.jhtml?xml=/health/2000/11/17/tlital17.xml
*http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2000/11/16/wfiat16.xml
*http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_product=PG&p_theme=pg&p_action=search&p_maxdocs=200&p_topdoc=1&p_text_direct-0=0EADE72FDB3BCFC8&p_field_direct-0=document_id&p_perpage=10&p_sort=YMD_date:D&s_trackval=GooglePM
*http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-1895404,00.html
*http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summary_0286-10547147_ITM
*http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/1990/09/10/73985/index.htm
*http://www.iranmania.com/News/ArticleView/Default.asp?NewsCode=37789&NewsKind=Current%20Affairs
*http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,998610,00.html
*http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-67303377.html
*http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/features/article2783545.ece
*http://www.americandaily.com/article/10850
*http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=4423
*http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=lPLd5wGuRqgC&pg=PA82&dq=%22Edoardo+Agnelli%22&num=100&sig=LbqswZVUvxknmzzSWsx3bdrvAUc#PPA82,M1
:Phil Bridger (talk) 09:59, 30 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed deletion 

message: Though his death was ruled a suicide, what kind of injury etc was fatal? Did he drown, or die of some kind of physical impact? It is important to clarify the manner of death, especially when there is confusion / conflicting reports regarding the matter. What, specifically, were the results of the post-mortem and inquest? Nietzsche 2 (talk) 02:34, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Manner of death

message: IP editors have been changing "the death was considered by Italian investigators to have been suicide, but there is a theory in Iran that his death was orchestrated by Israeli agents" to "the death was considered by Italian investigators to have been suicide, but is thought to have been orchestrated by Israeli agents". This gives the impression that this is a generally accepted view rather than a fringe opinion, so shouldn't be presented in this way. Also I fail to see the relevance of his uncle and cousin dying of cancer, or of the ethnicity of his nephew. I'm reverting back to the prvious version. Please discuss here before trying to make such a change again. Phil Bridger (talk) 14:45, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: If this is a view accepted by many then please provide reliable sources in support. Saying "it is thought that" without saying who thinks it is weasel wording, and implies general acceptance. Why do you keep removing the information about who thinks this? The source quoted states that this view originated in Iran - why shouldn't that be stated in the article? And information about the deaths of his uncle and cousin and the ethnicity of his nephew is only relevant to this article if reliable sources have made a connection with Edoardo Agnelli's death. Phil Bridger (talk) 17:58, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

text: I removed the link to iranmania.com as it has been blacklisted as a malware site (see: MediaWiki_talk:Spam-blacklist#iranmania.com).  This makes the speculation unreferenced so it has been removed as well.  If you wish to add the material, it will need some reliable sources per WP:OR. Phil153 (talk) 20:09, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Conspiracy theory

message: It seems to me that the more notable of the two people with this name is the one with the page name Edoardo Agnelli (industrialist). He played a major role in the development of both Fiat and Juventus, achievements that would seem to far outweigh those of the subject of Edoardo Agnelli. I would propose moving Edoardo Agnelli to another title (suggestions welcome) and moving Edoardo Agnelli (industrialist) to Edoardo Agnelli. Another alternative would be to make Edoardo Agnelli a disambiguation page with qualified titles for both subjects, as has been done in the Italian Wikipedia - see :it:Edoardo Agnelli, :it:Edoardo Agnelli (1892-1935) and :it:Edoardo Agnelli (1954-2000). Phil Bridger (talk) 20:09, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Edoardo Agnelli (industrialist) is surely more important, not so sure about notable. But I don't have a problem moving him to Edoardo Agnelli. I would offer Edoardo Agnelli (Fiat heir) as a title, but I understand it's a bit awkward since he wasn't really a heir. I'm not a fan of disambiguating by DOB-DOD, like the Italian WP format. I also don't like two-person dab pages when a hatnote on one can resolve the same problem. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 21:02, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Which Edoardo Agnelli should be the primary article? 

message: How do we know the pics really represent who they purport to represent?--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 23:09, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: This image from a reliable source looks very much like the person in :Image:Edoardo-Agnelli.jpg and in the background (top right) of :Image:Edoardo Agnelli.jpg. The person in the foreground of :Image:Edoardo Agnelli.jpg also looks like this picture of Khamenei. I don't quite know how we can verify the precise correctness of the caption of the latter image, but I don't see any reason to doubt it. Phil Bridger (talk) 23:39, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's the caption information outside of Khamenei that arouses my suspicions. The only reliable source we have that attaches Khamenei to Agnelli is the Belfast Telegraph which says "met Ayatollah Khamenei in Iran and reportedly converted to Islam". Is this sentence combined with the reliability of  enough to establish that the barely perceptible pic really includes Agnelli? I don't think so. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 23:49, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I've retitled it. He appears to be waiting in line to meet Khamenei, who is moving in from the left as various people, including Agnelli, are lined up for a "meet and greet" event. This is consistent with what the reliable sources say. There is no visual evidence that this has anything to do with 'offering Friday prayers'. It may or may not have, but the context suggests otherwise. The children are holding out pieces of paper (autograph hunting?). Paul B (talk) 17:31, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article pics 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I have put a "neutrality" tag on the "Death" section of this article. Far too much prominence is given to conspiracy theories, which seem to rely on Eduardo Agnelli being heir apparent to Fiat, which he certainly wasn't, rather than the more prosaic, mainstream, view that this death was suicide. Phil Bridger (talk) 18:52, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neutrality 

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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion 

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