Talk:Melodic hardcore

message: there is a large population of bands sprouting from the north-eastern United States.  It might help to note in text.
bands-to-add:
Sinking Ships
Go It Alone
Comeback Kid
(add more if you have more)
24.4.12.213 09:42, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: North Eastern US bands

message: I added a distinction between melodic-metal core and Hard-core.  
I find it useless. They are like day and night. by Geekermo.
I'd say that Husker Du is post hardcore... which sits niceley between emo and melodic hardcore.
It may be a good idea to make the distinction between Melodic Hardcore and Melodic/Hardcore. I personally found it rather confusing.
I took off "With less aggression". Just because you hold your notes out a bit more and have a dedicated song structure doesn't mean it isn't angry. OhDoTell (talk) 08:33, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Distinction

message: Maybe I'm way off..but...Husker Du is barely a punk band.  Can they really be considered a melodic hardcore band???
Not really, they are post-hardcore...New Wave some may say. They started the emo thing. by Geekermo.
-krm
Husker Du was definitely a punk band, at least up to Flip Your Wig, and arguably beyond that.  Their early work is hardcore, and circa Zen Arcade they could certainly be classified as a melodic hardcore band. Nick 03:37, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd say Nick is right- their early material constituted some of the earliest examples of melodic hardcore music; elements of Bob Mould's guitar style (the top-string drones) were expanded on by Brian Baker with Dag Nasty. To Wesley: it's not all about references- if you were there, you don't need a reference. I'm sure someone could dig out an old zine from the early 80s and point to a relevant quote if that's what you require. Most 'references' on wikipedia with respect to punk/hardcore point to ill-informed quotes by music journalists or self-appointed 'punk-critics' reared on Blink182 who are in no position to comment.Sausage & tomato 01:04, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Husker Du? 

message: they are certainly melodic hardcore during the no wings to speak of/satellite years era?
--
I agree and would like to add that Down should be understood as probably a good example.  It's the one band I thought of after reading all of this page.  Please consider the first album!  It's surprisingly so similar to Hopesfall, too.  It's neat to make that comparison when I'm really more of a metalcore, death metal, thrash -loving person.  But I certainly find interest in Down and Hopesfall.  BTW, good point!
--The battlesound 08:10, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hopesfall 

message: Come on guys, they are not melodic hardcore. NO WAY, NO. First know the roots and then edit the article, please. by Geekermo.
A Wilhelm Scream are a melodic hardcore band stylistically, and they also define themselves as playing music of the genre. Anti-Flag, on the other hand, are not. They are a pseudo-political pop-punk band. - Callan (220.240.83.157 07:33, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Strung Out, Willhelm Scream & The Killing Tree removal 

message: theyy all dress simlar and have a similar apearance yes, but how does new found glory and anti flag fit into melodic hardcore i mean you got stuff like the gorilla biscuits and rise against then you have new found glory ?! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.37.156.131 (talk) 23:45, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: simple: NFG and AntiFlag aren't melodic hardcore, and whoever included them hasn't a clue what he's talking about.Sausage & tomato 01:07, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  i dont understand how all these bands are melodic hardcore 

message: I mean...NoFx is one of the most influencial melodic hardcore band worldwide...Why they aren't even mentioned in the article?
And what about Lagwagon, No Use For A Name, Strung Out, Venerea...?
Simone 87.14.240.178 23:06, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Those are punk bands.
NoFX were a poppy Thrash/Metal/Punk band with cheesy bits (apart from the REALLY early stuff which was just crusty hardcore as far as I remember, not heard maximum rock n roll or anything like that in a while) which evolved into a Pop Punk/Ska/Reggae/Dub band with cheesy bits when Hefe joined. They never really sounded anything like Gorilla Biscuits or Dag Nasty or anything like any of the more musical hardcore bands. --AnRK 01:13, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

text: I've added NOFX to the list, because Peter Jandreus's Swedish punk encyclopedia defines melodic hardcore as established by Bad Religion and NOFX. The ref is in the article. Aryder779 (talk) 14:28, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why not NOFX? 

message: What's the difference between the two genres, I mean punk rock is a less extreme genre of hardcore punk,  but hense the title melodic hardcore, and with some bands like Rise Against or Crime In Stereo its hard to tell.
:There's a big difference. Listen to Uniform Choice's 1st album, then listen to Rise Against and tell me they're the same style. Hardcore has an identifiable passionate urgency that is immediately recognisable; melodic modern punk-rock doesn't to any comparable extent.Sausage & tomato 09:41, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  melodic hardcore/Punk rock 

message: Why was the example of Rush, Alex Lifeson, and their song "Free Will" taken out?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.199.217.240 (talk) 08:05, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  the dead kennedys and the offspring (up to and including smash) are good examples of bands that played with more complex harmonics. it's maybe not as genre-defining as was suggested, though. perhaps it's something that suggests a stronger affinity with noise rock. there's a slew of contemporary acts that use the technique, though. one is loma prieta.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.48.181.24 (talk) 06:53, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rush 

message: seriously, fall out boy? somebody please explain to me why they should be on that list71.193.243.217 (talk) 22:17, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fall out boy? 

message: Melodic hardcore is a fusion with the speed and energy of hardcore punk and the melody and harmonies of pop punk.
Seriously, do lifetime or kid dynamite sound like bane or comeback kid?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Himynameisnick (talk • contribs) 16:56, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah! Also, in what way is Have Heart 'melodic' it's clearly modern hadcore punk. They're just another one of these bands like Comeback Kid and Bane  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.147.70.88 (talk) 20:36, 11 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Difference between melodic hardcore and modern hardcore punk 

message: Shouldn't pop punk be listed in the infobox as a source? I feel like people on this page want to differentiate the two, but Blush's book cites the Descendents as the beginning of melodic hardcore, and they're also widely considered as a pop punk band (I have more than one magazine source substantiating this). Aryder779 (talk) 19:35, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pop punk 

message: Can metalcore and post-hardcore really be described as derivative forms? Neither was incredibly melodic very often until relatively recently and post-hardcore came into being at about the same time as melodic hardcore. (Albert Mond (talk) 08:22, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I thought the idea was that Post-hardcore Melodic Hardcore and Emo are derivatives cause they all evolved out of hardcore and during the 80's Jonjonjohny (talk) 10:32, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Derivative Forms 

message: Has whoever edited this page ever heard melodic Hardcore? There is nothing pop punk about it. Go listen to BluePrint of the Fall, no voice of mine by strung out, give it all, society etc. No pop punk riffs, not derivative form, nothing.--115.240.117.52 (talk) 16:14, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Pop Punk?

message: I added some bands to the list recently, and someone deleted them, because they don´t have an article. Why?! Those bands are melodic hardcore though. I thought it´s the information which that list has to impart, it´s not just a collection of band links.
More Than Life for example. I never heard a band having that pure melodic hardcore since times and you deleted them ?!?
By the way, I have to complain about the bands posted at the top of the discussion page.
For The Fallen Dream
It Prevails
Misery Signals
The Ghost Inside
Those bands are NOT melodic hardcore, they´re metalcore. Well, It Prevails and The Ghost Inside have some less melodic HC elements, but they´re bad examples. Melodic hardcore don´t has to be hard all way. Listen to Strike Anywhere, and you know what I mean.
Some good album examples:
Rise Against - Revolutions Per Minute
Comeback Kid - Wake The Dead
More Than Life - Love Let Me Go
Miles Away - Endless Roads
and eventually
Strike Anywhere - Iron Front
Some of you guys really have to listen to that great genre...  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.155.187.173 (talk) 17:48, 17 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bands got removed from the list...? 

message: Sum 41 is one of the most steriotypical pop-punk bands out there, and is in no way hardcore. Rise Against, however, was very much a melodic hardcore band, fitting the exact definition of a melodic hardcore on this page, especially in their albums Revolutions per minute, The Unraveling, and Siren Song of the Counter Culture. I am assuming that people editing this page are very biased towards the mindset of their latest two albums when deciding if they fit the description. I have little knowledge of Sum 41's past, and they at one time may have very well been a melodic hardcore band, so if this is the case, you must accept Rise Against to the list. --184.57.178.125 (talk) 20:44, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: When i added sum 41 a year ago i noted in brackets next to the band on the list the two albums which are melodic hardcore. rise against are prominant modern Melodic hardcore band and its weird they arn't involve. To be honest this list is completely unsourced and people just add bands when they please. Jonjonjohny (talk) 07:50, 21 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why not Rise Against inclusion, yet Sum 41 is included? 

message: Can someone take all the metal-core bands out of the list of bands, bands like Counterparts, The Ghost Inside, Hundredth, Shai Hulud, Misery Signals, It Prevails and For The Fallen Dreams sound nothing like the sound described in the article and they have nothing to do with hardcore. They are melodic metal-core because they are metal-core with some melodic elements. The argument of the sound changing over time is just plain wrong, when bands still play the "original" sound and new bands play a completely different sound that has nothing to do with the original one, they shouldn't be grouped together. Also there is no references to these bands playing melodic hardcore, so I don't understand why there are on the page. Rosscowderoy (talk) 02:35, 20 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metalcore bands 

message: lets blank the list of supposed melodic hardcore bands. That was ranging out of any melody like post-hardcroe, screamo and metalcore. I mean come on? Touche Amore? Shai Hulud?, are you high? you're just adding what you please just because. Lets concentate on developing melodic hardcore's article rather than add unsource and outlandish examples to the list. basicly the list has got very long with neither citation and no grouping. So we could base it on the band listing on Sludge metal. But that is if people can find the sources, dont just add bands to it. Jonjonjohny (talk) 09:57, 20 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  List of melodic hardcore bands 

message: It might help future discussions to note that there are essentially two distinct genres to have been dubbed "melodic hardcore".
The term was originally applied to a group of hardcore punk bands in the 80s who had begun to use clean vocals, melodic hooks, and whatnot. Bands like The Descendents, Bad Religion, Lifetime, and 7 Seconds; and later bands like Ignite and H2O. They sound a lot like pop punk (Not a disparagement, just a fact.) in part because many subsequent pop punk bands were heavily influenced by them.
The term has also been applied to a largely unrelated movement of hardcore bands, mostly coming out of the Youth Crew revival of the 90s, who incorporated melody into the guitar style in a particular way. (It's to hard describe in words, but it's pretty obvious what I mean if you listen to the bands.) Bands like Bane, Champion, With Honor, Comeback Kid, Have Heart, Verse, FC Five, etc. This is probably what most people today are referring to when they say "melodic hardcore".
Most argumentation in this article's talk page seems to be people talking past each other because they're using "melodic hardcore" in two different senses, and don't realize it. To people familiar with the modern usage, bands of the older style are "Just punk rock; not hardcore." To people familiar with the original usage, the newer bands are "Just modern hardcore; not melodic."
It's unfortunate that the same label has been applied to two different subgenres, but it's just how it is, and people who want to think themselves "in the know" should probably be aware of this reality.
Perhaps the article should better clarify all this? As it's currently written it looks like it's trying too hard to connect two largely unrelated subgenres, as if the later one was a direct outgrowth of the earlier one... and everyone's ears are telling them otherwise, thus the confusion.
Of course, bands are increasingly blurring the distinction between the two, an example being With Honor's album "This Is Our Revenge" (which incorporated melodic vocals into a band that was originally only melodic hardcore in the later sense of the term). So that sort of thing oughtta be mentioned as well.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.218.24.11 (talk) 00:00, 1 March 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I see where you're coming from, but in order to be used for the article, your thesis has to be verified by some sort of reliable source, otherwise it's just original research (your own analysis of the bands' sounds). Do you know of any articles, books or reviews that mention two different categories of melodic hardcore, or that (as you're implying) older melodic hardcore bands did not influence later ones?--MASHAUNIX 19:34, 1 March 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  README 

message: Shouldn't there be a individual subject on Easycore as Easycore is a form of Melodic Hardcore yet more specific as it is specifically Pop Punk that incorporates Metalcore like growls and Breakdowns.  Da260712 (talk) 20:29, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I Second this motion, easycore and melodic hardcore are extremely different genres and I don't understand the current redirect.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Issan Sumisu (talk • contribs) 20:42, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Easycore 

message: Hi guys. I'm pretty sure that whoever created this page is somebody from brazil because here we had the unfortunate idea of calling every genre as "melodic". Like instead of saying Power Metal we called it "metal melódico", and this was the same think literally with every genre.
I think this definition is pretty much irrelevant to people from the anglosphere. And noticed how there's not one single reasonable source calling bands like nofx, bad religion, pennywise, etc as "melodic hardcore" bands. Even the links that try to link such bands to the genre dont have such information.
This is my suggestion, not only remove this page, but any reference to melodic hardcore from english wikipedia  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.113.238.184 (talk) 06:53, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not a real genre, rather a brazilian invention