Talk:Arvanites/Arianitr

message: :This is an archive of comments removed from the main talk page Talk:Arvanites because they were considered trolling. Lukas (T.|@) 08:48, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comments removed from main talk page

message: I've tried to make some changes here but i guess I’m out of luck. 
Can’t hide the fact that I’m new here and I’m in the process of learning. With that said when I get to the point that I’m fomtrable I shall make things happen. 
I want to point out that many things mentioned here are not true. 
Why do the websites of Arvanit-es in Greece are removed so many times? I tell you why, cause there will you find the true answer in regards to them. 
I don’t understand can people behave in such matter. Is it their ignorance? 
If you speak something very similar to English, daaa guess what the person  it's either Irish, Scottish, or American English. 
Arvanites speak a dialect of Albanian (and that's what they are). 
I'll catch you back! 
ArianitR Added as User:136.216.75.6 on 09 March 2006, 08:16.
Hi, welcome back, we can discuss these things in a civil manner here, no problem. The problem with your previous attempts was that you were making unexplained wholesale reverts and were trying to create cut-and-paste forks, which is bad. Anyway, let's move on. About your questions:
* What references to websites of Arvanites in Greece were removed from this article? The only one that I ever saw was that of www.arvsynel.gr, which is currently included, but expresses a POV very much opposed to yours.
* It was the result of a long previous debate on this talk page (please read the archives) that Arvanites should be described here according to how they see and define themselves, and all references agree that the overwhelming majority of Arvanites in Greece firmly see themselves as Greeks and do not wish to be associated with Albanians in a national or ethnic sense. If you have evidence to the contrary, cite sources.
* As for the language, yes it is a form of Albanian, and it's clearly described as such (noting, again, that many Arvanites don't like to hear that very much). 
I can't understand what you were trying to say about English above.
As a sign of your renewed resolution as a good-faith editor, could I ask you also about a clarification regarding the pages you created (Arvanite flag and Arvanite Alliance). This is the time to either tell us where you got that information from, or to admit that you invented it. Come on, 'fess up. If you come clear now, we'll just forget about it.
Oh, and please, sign your contributions with four tildes (~~~~) when you edit talk pages; that will automatically insert your proper signature and time stamp when you save. 
Lukas (T.|@) 08:44, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Arianit Comments 

message: Lukas,
Absolutely I agree. We (you and I) should let Arvanit-es themselves decide how they feel about themselves and let them decide what they are. 
What I said above, I was just quoting at the time President of the Arvanites in Greece, A. Kola. Who by the way wrote in details in his book “Arvanites and the origin of Greeks”. If you just read his book you will find the truth! I bet is going to hurt you! 
He openly was claiming to be Albanian (the greeks call Albanians as Arvanite due to the language barrier) as he was their President. So where’s the logic for you to say that Arvanites are Greek?? That is so juvenile of you! (Actually is the chauvinistic attitude, I get it). 
Let me tell you something my dear neighbor: There are many things that have happened lately (good things) and more are to happen. Not just you but all Greece will be shocked of what is about to happen!!!!!
Now tell me what’s so hard to understand that Arvanites are Albanian? I mean have you ever met and Arvanite and asked him in what language he speeks to his parents at home? Please ask him!!!! Just don’t get upset with the answer! 
Your proud Arvanite!
Me, Arianit
:The book by Kollias (not "Kola") was used as a source for this article already. I haven't read it myself, but several Greek contributors have and have quoted extensively from it. Let me correct you on one thing: Greeks do not call Albanians Arvanites. This just shows that you know very little about the situation there. As is clearly pointed out in the article, Arvanites themselves and other Greeks usually make a clear distinction between "Alvaní" (i.e. Albanian nationals) and "Arvanítes". All the sources I've seen agree on that. From what I understand, Kollias makes the same distinction.
:Now, please be specific and say exactly what Kollias says about Arvanites that isn't represented correctly in the article?
:And by the way, I'm still waiting for your explanation about the "Arvanite flag" and the "Arvanite alliance". If those are related to the "things that have happened lately", I'm waiting with bated breath. Not.
:Although I personally would certainly have no problem if there actually were some (fringe) group of Arvanites who actually identified as Albanians. If you have evidence of such, present it. 
:Lukas (T.|@) 16:29, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Arvanites (for Lukas)  

message: You see Lukas that’s what burns you from the inside and proof of that is your respond and reaction!
A.	Kola in his books he tells the truth and that is the reason he was killed by the greek ultranationalist reason being they didn’t want to know the truth. (just like yourself)
Lukas, first of all A. Kola in his books describes in details based on facts that who indeed are the Arvanites, their origin and on the other hand he parallelly connects that with the greek coexistence in the Balkans peninsula. The Greek origin it’s explicitly described and that very well explains the greek chauvinistic attitude towards minorities in Greece. 
You too my neighbor live in a dream world but soon you shall wake up. 
Let me point out that the Eurovision is bringing lots of surprises for my fellow Arvanites!!!!! Just be patient! 
:::This is to inform you, ===Arianit===, all your comments have been forwarded to the appropriate people who follow any potential threats that might arise from your comment below:
::::"Let me point out that the Eurovision is bringing lots of surprises for my fellow Arvanites!!!!! Just be patient!"
:::The proper authorities have been notified, your ip addresses can be traced. Your not as anonymous as you think on the net. Southwestern ----- 17 March 2006 (UTC)
The reason I refer to him as A. Kola because that is his real name in Albanian. Every time he met with different delegations in Albania or US that’s the name we went by. By the way that is his real name. The greek officials change every single name to where it sounds greek. Although his books translated in English – his name figures as A. Kola. 
Just to clear up the confusion: Arvanites and Albanians are Illyrian Descendents and based on the territory they were located (migrated) they got named differently (whatsoever very similar). Arvanites in greece and Arbereshe in Italy are of the same tribe its just that they are named different. After all you call yourself Greek the Turks call you another way, do you understand?? 
As far as the Arvanite flag I got that from somewhere! It does symbolize the suffering of my people! The name for the party Arvanite Alliance is not decided yet whether is going to be the final one. Although it will have “Arvanite” in it.
Historians and Time will explain many things and actions I did in this Great Encyclopedia! Soon!!! 
Change is not made without inconveniences even from worse to better!! You shall experience inconvenience, after all change is going to take place!!!!
Let me know if this is enough!
Your Arvanite Neighbor,
Arianit
:The above post shows that the writer has little clue to what Wikipedia is actually about. Everything must be sourced and referenced and justifications such as "I got that from somewhere" (re the rvanite flag) are not acceptable. I'll ask again - where did you get it? Provide a source. 
:Similarly, Arianit proves himself to be disingenuous in regard to the Arvanite Alliance. In that article, he claimed the party was founded in February 2006 and gave no indication that the name was temporary. Here he now states that the "name for the party Arvanite Alliance is not decided yet whether is going to be the final one".
:As for the comment: "Historians and Time will explain many things and actions I did in this Great Encyclopedia! Soon!!!" I doubt that mate, I really do. --Damac 08:14, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it will be legitimate to remove any further trolling from Arianitr from this page on sight, and move it to his talk page or some other place of safe disposal. Lukas (T.|@) 08:23, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proud Arvanite (that 

message: Guys,
Hold your Horses!!! 
I understand there are many greeks here and that’s all they do is brainwash people! For greeks they will not deny that every single person on earth has a greek heritage.
What is so hard to understand about the Arvanite Flag? Let us, Arvanites decide what flag we want for us! That will be the new party flag. Let me know if I need to talk to you guys like I talk to little kids. Let me know if you want me to write that in greek for you? 
The new party that is going to represent Arvanites in Greece will be made public soon. 
When you greeks have time, please read To Ethnos and see what’s going on … 
Proudly from Athens, your Arvanite neighbor …
Arianit
:It's not just a Greek/Arianit issue. I'm not Greek but I find that your contributions are not suitable for an encyclopedia.--Damac 12:09, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ah come on, lets give our Albanian "neighbor" a break. After all the Albanian "allies" have joined the good fight against their Muslim brothers in Iraq. <sarcasm> Very soon these quaint and colorful tribesmen will control the heroin and hooker traffic in all of Iraq. The insurgents will find their vehicles and weapons stolen, their sisters in brothels from Oslo to Dubai, and their territory declared, as is most of the known world, part of The "Greater Albania". Get ready for the Pax Albanica. Arianit, you're an ignorant fool. BONK 12:09, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Arvanite  

message: Ethnos is available online at http://www.ethnos.gr/default.asp?catid=5345 - of course there's no mention of an Arvanitic political party.
Aristeides Kollias in his book supported that both the Greeks and the Albanians descent from Pelasgians (who he identifies with ancient Greeks and Arvanites). If you ever read his book, you might call him ultranationalist too (judging from the previous comments here), however this was not the case - Kollias wasn't affiliated with any sort of "Greek extremists". talk to +MATIA 11:29, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Of course time is on your side... As you can see I haven't written the article, I haven't gone to a library and I haven't read the book. talk to +MATIA 18:07, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  clarifications