Talk:Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots/Archive 1

message: Sockatume 18:15, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Source

message: Does anyone else fuckin wonder if this is going to be the final MGS? Or at least maybe the last one in this continuity? With Snake's age accelerating, unless he finds a miracle cure of a fountain of youth (type of thing), how much more could Snake go on possibly do you think? I think its very interesting.--Kiyosuki 04:21, 18 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think this is one of the final series in storyline of MGS but like MGS3 a new MGS will come which will play with a different Snake or timeline. But man seeing this series of Metal Gear Solid makes me hate my self for buying a xbox, ow well I'll just buy a PS3 for this one. Baku87 22:45, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: The final Metal Gear Solid?

message: Ack. I'm not surprised that IGN managed to string out an "absolutely everything we know about MGS4" article to four whole pages. It was 95% prior knowledge, of which a good deal was wrong (they completely missed Vamp's survival). Cheers to whoever removed that link. Sockatume 01:05, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: That IGN article with speculation

message: I just removed this section from the article:
During E3 2005, there was an announcement video that uses the MGS3 engine which is a promotional trailer for MGS4, but it turned out to be a silent-comedy-added-with-laugh-track-and-background-50's-music with using MGS characters/enemies as the Kojima Productions staff. It turns out that Kojima will direct the game (Which had a huge round of a applause in the movie), but it turns out that Solid Snake was Raiden taking off the mask and giving us a stereotypical "handsome guy" wink (Then the audience in the trailer was disgusted). But then it moves on to the next scene where Raiden and a Sam Fisher look a like trying to take over the "MAIN CHARACTER" chair (Which is a main character for MGS4). After the goofy fight, the Sam Fisher look a like turns out to be Solid Snake in a MGS3 Sneaking Suit smoking his cigarette while he's on the "MAIN CHARACTER" chair. After that, it shows the MGS4 logo and it shows Snake walking away turning the lights off. But the trailer ends by showing Raiden getting up, and the screen goes black, but we can hear he's sitting on the "MAIN CHARACTER" chair with a "Ding" noise. It turns out to be that it's a possibility that MGS4's gonna have multiple characters to use.
The E3 2005 trailer looks like some kinda 50's film quality, there's not even a single dialogue but there is alot of humor in it, more like a 50's Comedy Theatre Play. The trailer basically shows us a humourous view of what's gonna be in MGS4.
Besides being way too descriptive and redundant, it's obviously not written very well (informal speech and so on). I decided to be bold and just get rid of it. If anyone thinks it can be fixed up and put back, go for it, by all means. - DoubleCross 09:02, August 16, 2005 (UTC)
gh
:I must agree, it appears to be an unrevised interpreation written by a child who is watching the video as he types. It states only opinions and would be better interpretated, structured and placed into the article as seperate information. Also on a personal note i believe his concepts were incredibly incorrect and did not attempt to scratch the surface of the video. If anyone considers rewriting it note such opinions as "The trailer basically shows us a humourous view of what's gonna be in MGS4." are quite obviosuly written in the obvious and with no thought. For example in this case, though a small proportion of game play is shown, the video actually documented the people behind it and the cast, as it used MGS2 characters, not updated models. The humour is both commonplace at E3 and Kojimas personal lighten the modd attitude. etc etc. I agree wit hthe removal and hope my words are considered in the event of a rewrite. --The Pain 23:49, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  E3 2005 trailer desc. section 

message: :The September issue of Official PlayStation Magazine contains a handful of details: "describing the Kojima Productions title as "a cross between Rambo and Black Hawk Down," with Solid Snake apparently dropped into an urban warzone with artillery going crazy around him, taking out his cover. Buddy AI is said to be crucial this time around, while a new camera system will reportedly be an essential part of the experience."
Is the punctuation in this paragraph as it should be? Not having a copy of this magazine to check, my intuition leads me to think that it should read as follows:
:The September issue of Official PlayStation Magazine contains a handful of details: describing the Kojima Productions title as "a cross between Rambo and Black Hawk Down, with Solid Snake apparently dropped into an urban warzone with artillery going crazy around him, taking out his cover. Buddy AI is said to be crucial this time around, while a new camera system will reportedly be an essential part of the experience."
Note the removal of two quotation marks. However, as I say, I can't be sure it doesn't read like that. If it does, who is the magazine quoting? Shouldn't that be noted? Anyway, I'll leave this for someone else to pick over. - 210.49.214.102 08:19, 1 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Odd paragraph

message: I added in the comment about Kojima stating that he's unsure as to how many years MGS4 takes place after MGS2. It's stated in an interview with him in the January 2005 issue of PSM, page 25. I can quote it if anyone wants to see.
--24.76.109.236 01:01, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  X Years After the Big Shell 

message: I am researching info on the Meme Gene Scene themes of the MGS Series. I wonder if anyone could give me some ideas on where to find some information on these concepts as they relate to the games. The research is going to a report I am doing for school, but if it is sufficient I may add it as some extra details for the Metal Gear Solid articles. Thank you for any help you are willing to offer.
HiddenMask 15:38, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Meme-Gene-Scene

message: The article says "Colonel Campbell has also been confirmed to return for MGS4."
Where is this confirmed? What is the source on this?
:Yah that was recently added by someone, and I dont see it sourced/cited so it should be deleted unless that can be confirmed, because I highly doubt it. captbananas 18:32, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Colonel Campbell in MGS4? 

message: Thought I'd post it here. http://www.elektr1k.com/metalgearsolid4e3.divx
Takuthehedgehog 20:18, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  E3 MGS4 trailer

message: Kojima has confirmed that Snake is 43 years old during MGS4, meaning MGS4 takes place in the year 2015, six years after the Big Shell incident.
Why does the article then have have to speculate whether the baby Raiden is holding in the art is his or Olga's?
I mean, the baby looks way too young to be neither his nor Olga's. Had it been his, the baby should be like, what, 5 years old? And had it been Olga's it should be, what, 7?
-- Because at the time the promotional poster was released they still weren't sure how much time was going to have passed between MGS2 and MGS4 to fit everything in continuity. Lilinka 21:41, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The baby Raiden is holding in the art 

message: So... Is Hideo Kojima the only director; or the co-director? First, the article states that he announced co-directing -- then, it gets confusing, when it says that he "himself will be directing." Yet; the information-bar on the right still lists him as co-director. Oh, and speaking of co-directing; I've noticed that the new trailers for this game are very cinematic; and have this new depressed feeling to it -- I love it. Maybe the new director and Kojima  makes a great team; originally, I only wanted Kojima to direct it. Now, I'm starting to like the new guy. 67.164.209.137 21:29, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Both Kojima and Murata are directing. That's what was originally announced, and what has been listed as such in all the game's trailers (E3 2005, TGS 2005, E3 2006). Whoever added that at the bottom was mistaken; I'm removing it now. - DoubleCross 02:59, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Directing 

message: Speculative Concepts seems to be nothing more than a section devoted solely for wild, irrelevant speculation, and mentions information already seen in other parts of the article. Also, it's rather poorly written. I quote:
It is possible that Solid Snake has aged faster than the other cast members due to the FOXDIE virus he contracted in MGS.
:Covered under Timeline setting, which has a more in-depth analysis, I think. 
The small Metal Gears (Gekkōs) shown in the trailer are shown being cut by Raiden's sword. When they are cut, blood comes shooting out and flesh can be seen inside. It is possible that these creatures were created with the help of nanomachines, re-organizing a organic being into a more robotic looking form.
:Basically a description of what Raiden does during the trailer, and an example of the poor writing I mentioned. This paragraph also mentions animals being somehow morphed into Gekko with the help of nanomachines. Nothing in the trailer suggests this, other than the fact that they're Metal Gears and somehow have organic legs. The blood they gush could also be that fake, nanomachine-filled blood that Raiden had coursing through him during MGS2. It's pure fan speculation that has no place in the article.
In an early poster for MGS4 (seen at the bottom of this article) Raiden is shown holding a baby. It is possible that the baby is the son, or daughter, of Solid Snake. The child could have been cloned in a similar way to how Solid Snake was cloned from Big Boss. As a plot device for a sequel it is possible that Raiden will train the young Snake Clone, this would be one way to continue the series after the death of Solid Snake. The baby shown in the poster may also be the orphaned child of Olga. This would seem to be a more reasonable conclusion at first, however, if she was born at the time of MGS2 she would have to be older than the baby in the poster.
:Again, more poorly written fan speculation. Raiden holding Snake's baby? That's funny, considering Snake cannot have offspring. The paragraph mentions the baby being cloned from Snake to cover up the aforementioned bullshit, but then takes a nosedive by saying that as a plot device for the "sequel" (which has yet to be even mentioned by Kojima), Raiden will train the Snake clone to drag the series forward. This seems like it was written by a desperate MGS fan trying to spark some discussion and speculation. The section has no place in the article. I actually Wikified some parts of the section, but upon close inspection, I realized it was pure speculation. I ask other users for their input on this, although I think the situation has little room for discussion.--DethFromAbove 00:27, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's some horrible stuff. And you're right, there is little room for discussion here. Thanks for getting rid of it. - DoubleCross 23:41, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Fishy Section

message: How about some spoiler tags? 22:06, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Spoiler

message: Do we need the "Timeline setting" section? As it is established earlier on that it will take place 6 years after the Big Shell incident, Unless people Object I vote for the removal of this section. Help plz 20:14, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Does anyone have any concrete proof that the game will actually take place six years after MGS4? All we have to go for is Kojima's reflection of himself in Snake, which I don't believe was supposed to be interpreted literally. Jonny2x4 01:37, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: One interesting (well, maybe not) thing about what Kojima said is that he's not even 43 yet, considering his birthdate is listed as August 24, 1963. Of course he was probably just rounding up,  but I wonder if that says anything about his statement (regarding Snake). - DoubleCross 03:24, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: 6 Years After Big Shell

message: While I think this article is very informative, it's also a disroganized mess, talking about every piece of detail about the game in the "Known details", with no sense of organization. I'm organizing based all the information based on general details revealed in interviews and such,, details revealed during both trailers and specific details about the game's plot and characters. I'll appreciate if anyone can help me out here. Jonny2x4 02:19, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've chopped out most of the reduntant info and cut it down to basic and useful facts; it's not the wallowing great guide to everything MGS4 it was, but this is an encyclopedia, and it should be readible and concise. Still needs formatting better and adding a few nips and tucks. Especially the "Sense", "MG Mk.II" and "Continuing The Bloodline" bits, that should be subsections of Gameplay.Hyperspacey 18:28, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cleanup 

message: At the end of the extended trialer from 06 it says konamia productions 1987 2036, could the 2036 mean anything to the game? Just thought i would point that out. To find this it is at time 12:16 of the trailer... ~REexpert44~ REexpert 18:55, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Something i noticed...

message: Reckon we can take down the Clean-Up tag yet, or does it require more work?
Hyperspacey 09:07, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see anything else that could possibly be trimmed out/down.--DethFromAbove 05:24, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I've gone and taken it down, although someone may put it back up (The Bread 03:26, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tidy enough yet? 

message: I hear a lot of talk about a promotional picture showing Raiden holding onto a baby. I've looked everywhere for this, but can't find it. What search term should I google for? Can anyone link me to this?
There appears to be a big time gap between Guns of the Patriots and Sons of Liberty; that's a lot of potential time wasted for possibilities of more sequels; unless they decide to make future games be prequels to  Guns of the Patriots. Is there a general consensus among fans of the approximate time gap between the two games? It has to be pretty long, as Otacon and the colonel look a lot older than they did. Maybe at least 20 years?
Regarding Raiden; how was he able to train in VR missions simulating Snake's missions? Doesn't Raiden's chapter take place immediately after Snake's Tank Chapter mission? How was there enough time for there to be a VR mission programmed after Snake's mission, just in time for Raiden to train with it? Another thing I've read about Raiden is that he has artificial blood even back in Sons of Liberty; what does this blood do? Why doesn't Snake train in VR missions as much as Raiden, and genetically/physically modify himself to the level of early-Raiden, so that they are comparable in terms of physique? It doesn't seem to me like Snake is afraid of modifying himself too much; he is often injected with nanobots.
Another thing that confuses me is why Gray Fox or Raiden (the early AND future Raiden) are so much better soldiers than Solid Snake -- I mean, he's supposed to be a clone of the greatest soldier of the 20th century (possibly greater than Big Boss), and Raiden could probably defeat him easilly based on skill. The early Raiden seems to still be a much superior soldier than Snake, even when he's so much younger, and without an exoskeleten suit! Snake has trouble taking down multiple enemies, and relies on stealth. Raiden doesn't need to, as he often makes multiple enemies down at a time; and with his exoskeleten, he can defeat multiple mini metal-gears; in the trailer, all Snake could do is run and try and lure them away! So doesn't that make Raiden or Gray Fox (with the suit) the better soldiers? How exactly is Snake the greatest soldier of the century? Maybe he needs to train as much as Raiden did in VR missions... 24.23.51.27 20:11, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I dont have time to read your long post. But heres the image. Also heres the revision it was from -- Psi edit 03:56, 18 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Questions 

message: Could we please minimise the number of edits of the following nature:
- Adding on sections saying "Kojima says Snake won't die, but he also said he might, so we don't know". We know we don't know! If we knew we'd have added a bit in saying if Snake lived or died (albeit in spoiler brackets).
- Waffling on about stuff that might happen, extrapolated from guesswork based on the trailer, and posting it as fact. Discuss it hear, maybe, and we can reach a concensus about whether its geniune or not, hmmm?
- Amazing insights like, "Snake will face a number of giant robots", "Snake will fight mercenaries armed with modern weaponary" and "Snake may fight people he was once allied with". C'mon, guys, this info belongs in the series page, it's like sticking a section in the Mario Galaxy page about jumping on enemy's heads and mushrooms making you grow.
Additions are nice, but the reason this page is very concise is because i) it's an encyclopedia article, not the MGS4 Speculation Thread on Gamesradar and ii) the game's only been unveiled in two trailers and a tiny amount of hinting from the developer. Facts only on the main page, let's discuss stuff on discussion, hmmm? I don't want to see this get another CleanUp tag after I spent three hours condensing it.
Hyperspacey 15:14, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Speculation, rambling, and daft information in general 

message: Seems a pretty dumb title line, something like Returning Elements would be better. (The Bread 04:47, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Continuing the bloodline 

message: ----
in the 6 min tgs trailer at the end there is a young snake , i think it is a clone of solid snake....
yeah he looked sick cant wait to find out who exactly he is one critisisem all though he looks like snake he has no bandana lol its like tradition User:Kami-Sama
wounder if he's on solid snakes side all against him alswo he weres the same kind of outfit as snake . User:Kami-Sama
I dont think that it is a new person.  I think it has something to do with his camo suit. If you notice at the beginning of the trailer when snake gets up from playing dead and his camo suit changes back, the dirt or age spots on his face disappear.--Hasty5o 21:01, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Young Snake in TGS trailer 

message: Someone has vandalized the plot section as far as I can see. Could someone please fix this? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.96.10.251 (talk • contribs) .
:In future you should feel free to repair vandalism yourself, you don't need to be registered to change things.Hyperspacey 21:38, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Plot Vandalism

message: Does anyone know if a release date is planned for this game yet in the U.S.? this game is going to single-handedly (is that even a word?) make me buy a PS3, i heard rumors that in the trailer from E3 '06 that you could see a 777 flipped upside down, implying that MGS4 was slated for a 07.07.07 release (July 7th, 2007) i probably would buy my PS3 when this game came out (if the 777 rumor IS true, i would assume the PS3's price would drop)
:I doubt that. I believe GameSpot said that they are planning on releasing it at least Q4 2007 I can't confirm this at the moment, but that is what KojimaProductions said. 75.28.39.120 03:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Release Date?