Talk:Presbyterian polity

message: Please, someone add something about the ordination of ministers in presbyterian polity.  This is needed for discussions of church polity elsewhere.  I understand that ministers are ordained by ministers in this system.  Not by bishops, as in episcopal polity; not by congregations, as in congregational polity.  Or are there members of the Presbytery who are NOT ordained ministers, but merely ordained "elders"...?  Forgive me if I am muddled so that my question is bad... Please set me straight.  Thanks  Emyth 01:21, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, ministers are ordained by a presbytery. Ordained ministers and ordained elders may both be members of a presbytery. I'm no expert on the ordination process as such, but I'll see if I can write something. Anyone else? Blarneytherinosaur 08:00, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: In the Church of Scotland, although ordination is an act of the Presbytery (ie by decision of Presbytery) and the Presbytery assembles for the service, only ministerial members of Presbytery lay hands on the candidate. I believe that in the PC (USA) elder members also lay hands Slackbuie 14:21, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

text: There is supposed to be little distinction between ministers of word and sacrament (teaching elders) and elders (ruling elders) except that the presbytery must consist of at least as many elders as ministers, and the synod and general assembly consist of exactly the same number of ministers and elders.  At least, this is the case in the PC(USA). Sterrettc (talk) 23:53, 14 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ordination of Ministers 

message: I have removed some internal links that seem distracting to me.  I have also made a couple of new pages that redirect here: Presbytery (presbyterian church) and General Assembly (presbyterian church).  A redirect at Kirk Session already exists.  Consider these as placeholders for the articles dedicated to those courts that Blarneytherinosaur suggested.   I tried to tidy the disambiguation pages at Presbytery and General Assembly to reflect this.  --Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 14:59, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Articles for individual bodies

message: Do presbyterians in some countries call their teaching elder Pastor?  (As did George Gillespie.) If so, then lets make this article reflect that, to make it more accessible to readers from those countries. --Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 07:23, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes. In the denomination I attend most ordained men use "Rev." and are called ministers, but some are called "Pastor". It comes down to preference. (It is often unordained men in temporary positions of ministry are called "Pastor"). However, I imagine that in other Presbyterian denominations calling all ordained minsters "Pastor" could be the practice. Blarneytherinosaur 07:32, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

text: After replying to the References section, I realised that the reference I directed you towards, The Form of Presbyterial Church-Government deals with the ordained minister of the word and the sacrament under the heading "Pastors". If the writiers of the Westminster Confession called minsters "pastors" I would think that the term would be widespread. Blarneytherinosaur 07:40, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Pastor

message: Here are a couple of references a simple google search uncovered.  I do not know if they are authoritative, or wholly accurate.  I am sure that your local minister and elder will have better books in their library.  Failing that, this list could get a knowledgeable person started on sourcing the many facts in this article.
*http://www.covenanter.org/AMason/publiccovenants.htm Archibald Mason, 1799
*http://www.covenanter.org/GGillespie/miscellaneousquestions/ggilles15.html 'Of Uniformity' - George Gillespie
*http://www.bpc.org/reading_room/books/miller/ruling_elder.html The Online Version of The Ruling Elder by Samuel Miller, D.D. 
:especially http://www.bpc.org/resources/books/miller/elder09.html CHAPTER IX. THE NATURE AND DUTY OF THE OFFICE.
*http://www.covenanter.org/JMWillson/Deacon/deacon2.htm Chapter 2 The Nature of the Deacon's Office - JAMES M. WILLSON, 1841
*http://www.upper-register.com/other_studies/hodge_elder.html The Nature and Warrant of the Ruling Elder in the Ecclesiology of Charles Hodge - Lee Irons, 2003
*http://www.upper-register.com/other_studies/eldership.html Theories of Eldership: A Study in Presbyterian Polity By Lee Irons
*Also see Philip Morgan and Thomas Campbell, interesting figures in reuniting presbyterian polity with congregational polity.
::Should be Philip Morgan at
::http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4158/is_20051021/ai_n15721867/print 
::and Thomas Campbell (Restoration movement) --Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 16:45, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "It has taken seriously the position of the parity of elders, making a distinction between the two classes of elders, teaching and ruling.  It has self-consciously taken a more democratic position (rule from the grass roots up) on presbyterian governance in contrast to a more prelatical form (rule from the top assemblies down)."
*There seem to be more online books at http://www.reformed.org/ but there seems to be some bug in my browsers that stops them displaying.
*Finally, I feel tempted to add this highly disrespectful popular poem
--Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 07:24, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

text: For when your browser is working, may I suggest as a reference The Form of Presbyterial Church-Government, one of the additional documents from the Westminster Confession. I intend to scour it for information when I have the time. I would imagine that all of the Presbyterian churches with British links would take their form of Presbyterian polity from this book. Blarneytherinosaur 07:36, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

text: The current church law texts of the Church of Scotland can be found on their website at . Hope this is useful to folks Slackbuie 14:25, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: References

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thread_title:  External links modified