Talk:Phil Taylor (darts player)

message: Added this tag as some events listed in "Outside darts" are totally irrelevant and possibly even nonsense (don't think he's Graham Taylor's cousin). Is each tv appearance he makes worthy of adding in here? Would think that a paragraph on his Eggheads appearance is way over-the-top and should possibly only appear in a forum discussion. Seedybob2 15:07, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: See WP:TRIVIA; there are ways for cleaning this sort of thing up; there's been a lot of consensus progress on what is and isn't trivial in the last 2+ years. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(Õلō)ˀ  Contribs. 22:15, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Questionable importance/Relevance tag 

message: It annoys me that people like Chris Hoy have three good races and receive a knighthood and yet this man has been on the top of his sport for 20 years and is a model sportsman and professional and probably England's greatest ever sportsman (if you count darts as a sport) and still receives not even an MBE or any recognition for his acheivements from the queen or even from terrestrial TV channels like the BBC.84.67.53.0 (talk) 11:00, 12 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  OBE/MBE 

message: So what is it, Phil? Mike Gregory? Dennis Priestley? John Part? Raymond van Barneveld? It seems like Taylor gives a lot of contradicting statements.
It's very easy for the WINNER to declare someone as the "greatest player" or something as the "greatest match". However, Taylor has also stated that the PDC Championship Match against Raymond van Barneveld was the greatest final he had ever been involved in. And he lost there. So what is it? Like I said, it's very easy for the winner to praise the loser. But to be a gentleman in defeat? I think he only ever afforded that to 2 out of those 4. And both of those are among his best friends... 68.200.98.166 (talk) 03:24, 5 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: See below. This article would do really, really well to stop focusing on subjective and mutable notions of "the greatest" anything, and get back to reporting reliably source facts, which is what an encyclopedia article does. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(Õلō)ˀ  Contribs. 22:15, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  After a final which Taylor still lists as the favourite of his career 

message: This article was tagged for evaluation of copyright concerns in July 2010 based on its resemblance to the official site. Investigation reveals that this content almost certainly originated on Wikipedia and was copied from here. 
Let's take the first paragraph of the suspect source:
While there is no archived version of that page, we can examine the evolution of the content.
In nascent form, it appears in December 2003, here:
The first major difference is the second sentence. This was added to the article in July 2008, here. First, it said, "His early working career consisted of making ceramic toilet roll handles - earning no more than £52 a week at one stage." In the next edit, the IP changed it to read, "His early working career consisted of him making ceramic toilet roll handles - earning no more than £52 a week at the time." The fact that the content was added nearly five years later makes it less likely that it was copied from the source.
Smaller changes are also visible. 2003's "moments of unemployment" becomes "spells of unemployment" and 2003's "practice" becomes "practise full-time" in May 2009--after almost five years. (Practice became practise somewhat earlier.) A few weeks after creation, "he came the attention" becomes "brought him to the attention". 
It is very important to investigate copyright concerns when these are detected to ensure that we protect the project, copyright holders and our content reusers, and I appreciate the contributor who brought this matter up for evaluation (who also noted at my talk page the possibility of reverse infringement). Evidence suggests that the official site copied the content from us rather than the other way around. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 19:55, 23 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Copyright concerns

message: Should this section be removed? Here are some reasons why:
* Unreferenced
* Too short
* Pointless
What do you's say? Mr.Kennedy1 talk  12:57, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The split needs to be mentioned since Taylor was part of the breakaway, and it is a significant moment so should have it's own subsection. Should be easy enough to reference and I have no concerns over it's length. wjematherbigissue 08:59, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Split in darts 

message: Why does it say in the lead he had 8 spells as World No. 1 and in the infobox it says he has 7. Which is it? Mr.Kennedy1 talk  08:06, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  World No. 1 

message: I think there is a bit too much focus on the period since 2006 (when the article started) – and it has the potential for exponential expansion. This can be addressed by losing quite a lot of details about various matches and lower level tournaments – wins are listed in their own section and it is unnecessary to go into such detail. The alternative is splitting these out into separate "Phil Taylor in xxxx" articles and expanding with full details. wjematherbigissue 16:50, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Support: Yes, then you could make performance tables for that year etc. Mr.Kennedy1 talk  17:11, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

text: Oppose. The objectors "when the article started" is plain wrong, as the article started with Taylor's birth and include the events that led to Taylor's becoming a professional darts player. I've removed the Recentism tag. --Philcha (talk) 13:49, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recentism 

message: The 2006 and 2007 seasons are short enough, and the 2010 looks likely to be short enough, so splitting out these seasons would likely be unproductive effort at no benefit to readers. The 2008 and 2009 seasons may have better case, but: splitting can make the content hard to read; I'd I'd look first at ways to make the sections  on the 2008 and 2009 seasons shorter. --Philcha (talk) 14:21, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, we could do that by cutting trivia out and making sentences more compact. Mr.Kennedy1 talk  14:26, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Proposal to split some sections into separate articles

message: I did not make the table, it was made by Slash99 in May 2010 and he put it into the article but Hippo43 removed it saying "I removed this. As we already have an extensive infobox, a table of performances in recent years, and tables about his world championships, I think it's probably unnecessary". I cannot see why he removed it, I think it is a brilliant table because it does not promote recentism and is very well laid out and useful. Mr.Kennedy1 talk  18:14, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I have to say I don't think we need a timeline for every single major tournament unless we have a separate article for that kind of thing. As such, I have reduced it to just the World Championships and moved it to that section. wjematherbigissue 19:04, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: i'm not going to change it back because the last thing I want is an edit-war but i'll give an oponion on it. Are you sure this is the best decision because this is a great table with all the majors and it is detailed and clear. Mr.Kennedy1 talk  20:00, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: At my screen resolution, it is big and cumbersome, and not particularly clear. I also do not think it adds significantly to this article, since it does duplicate a lot of what is already there in other sections. An article specifically about Taylor's achievements and tournament record would undoubtedly benefit from it, but I think we are already overloaded with statistics here. Incidentally, I think that once this article is up to scratch, such an article will probably be justified. wjematherbigissue 20:18, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I understand how different stuff looks on screens of different sizes, i'm on a laptop at the minute with a small-ish screen and when I go to my compter which has a big screen, everything is completely different so I understand that it might look bad on your screen, so I think we can leave it the way you have it. Mr.Kennedy1 talk  20:29, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Performance timeline 

message: This article is very long (80 KB or 80,000 B) and according to WP:SIZERULE, it should be split into seperate articles. Here is a piece from WP:SIZERULE:
Readable prose size	What to do
> 100 KB        	Almost certainly should be divided
> 60 KB         	Probably should be divided (although the scope of a topic can sometimes justify the added reading time)
> 40 KB         	May need to be divided (likelihood goes up with size)
< 40 KB         	Length alone does not justify division
< 1 KB          	If an article or list has remained this size for over a couple of months, consider combining it with a related page. Alternatively, why not fix it by adding more info? See Wikipedia:Stub.
What do you's think? Mr.Kennedy1 talk guestbook 16:09, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Just as an outside opinion, i think the section on tournament wins / world championships / high averages could be moved to a brand new article titled Phil Taylor career statistics or something like that.  That would cut the article in half. Monkeymanman (talk) 16:15, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the "tournament wins" section is redundant, as every win is in the infobox too. Armbrust Talk Contribs 21:36, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The tournament wins section needs to stay because Wjemather is changing the infobox by removing alot of the info. Mr.Kennedy1 talk guestbook 15:27, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: It could still be given its own article.  There is enough info there to justify it. Monkeymanman (talk) 18:16, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with Monkeymanman, an article for his career statistics would be suitable. We should wait until we get it up to GA first though. Mr.Kennedy1 talk guestbook 19:38, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, now that the GAN review is over (failed unfortunately) we should proceed with the career statistics idea. Where do we start though? Mr.Kennedy1 talk 23:20, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: you could create a sandbox page for the tournament wins / world championships / high averages. Monkeymanman (talk) 12:08, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article size 

message: Instead of explaining what a leg and set is in brackets beside where it is mentioned, why dont we use notes for explaining that sort of stuff. It would look alot better than it is now. Mr.Kennedy1 talk 11:09, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Would improve the flow that way, especially as you have a wikilink to sets as well. 16:06, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notes 

message: I think that the PDC career section has a very bad flow. It is badly affected by the short paragraphs. Does anyone have any suggestions on what to do here? Mr.Kennedy1 talk 17:56, 5 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Phil Taylor#PDC career|PDC career]] section 

message: Hi, I will need a little help with the copy edit of the article please.
*"a game which is first to three legs of 501" - No idea what this means so unable to improve it for clarity.
Thanks --Diannaa (Talk) 03:21, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: A leg is a single game in which a player must get from 501 to 0. A set is when a player must get to 3 legs before the other player. Mr.Kennedy1 talk 10:10, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Good, so the first to win three sets of 501 points each will win the game match. --Diannaa (Talk) 15:17, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

text: OK Correct me if I'm wrong: The words "leg" and "game" are interchangeable. The scoring is sorta like tennis. Win games (also known as legs) which are grouped into sets. Win a specific number of sets to win the match. So "(a game which is first to three legs of 501)" could read "(each set consists of three legs of 501 points)". Please verify before I put this in the aricle. Thanks. --Diannaa (Talk) 15:36, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: You nearly have it, I wish I could explain it better but i'm useless at English. It dosen't have to be three legs as the set could end 3–2 which makes it five legs. Would using the term "best of five legs" be better. Maybe you could word it better though. Mr.Kennedy1 talk 18:50, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Best out of five is the way we would word it in Canada. I will figure out the wording for next session.--Diannaa (Talk) 22:11, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

text: A 132 checkout is finishing the leg with taking out 132 in three darts. I will put an example in so maybe you can understand better. Taylor is on 132 and in three darts he gets down to 0. Do you get it now? Sorry again for the bad explaining. Mr.Kennedy1 talk 18:50, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes; he had 132 points left to go and he did it exactly in three darts (the number you throw on one turn). The "checkout" is the sport-specific terminology which we will have to define so now that I know what it means I will figure out the wording and place it in the article. Thanks. --Diannaa (Talk) 22:11, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Exactly. Mr.Kennedy1 talk 07:02, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Copy edits are all done. Good luck with your next GA nomination. Regards, --Diannaa (Talk) 14:41, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  October 2010 Copy edits 

message: I mostly fixed an wp:accessibility issue caused by creating two long br lists: one for the years, and one for the results.  this is problematic for many reasons.  the biggest issue is that when you cut-and-paste the content, it doesn't line up, since the data is not logically aligned.  the second problem is that it is nearly impossible to read the wikitext.  the third problem is that the list will not be in alignment if the browser decides to wrap the entries in the wrong place.  so, the fix is to replace this with an inner table.  in  they fixed this by using more fine-grained input with years1, years2, years3, ...  however, in the absence such a feature in the infobox, I simply replaced it with an .  19:10, 22 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Using long br lists 

message: On the Infobox it says 3 but lists 4 different years. Mobile mundo (talk) 17:31, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: From what I can find he won the WSOD in 2006 and the US Open in 2007, 2008 and 2010. I've changed it to four. I didn't follow PDC darts back then so I'm not sure what the difference between the tournaments is. Spc 21 (talk) 17:57, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

text: Thanks (Mobile mundo (talk) 18:22, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  US Open/WSOD 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:24, 11 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The list of major titles won adds up to 83, not 85.
Please amend BRACK66 (talk) 00:52, 31 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Phil Taylor (darts) 

message: In their first ever meeting Rob Cross beat Taylor in his farewell game in World Darts Championship final on January 1st, 2018, so it is not true anymore.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Runningwithhorses (talk • contribs) 2 January 2018 (UTC)
:Done. GedUK  11:45, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  "No player has a winning head-to-head record against him" 

message: No one calls him that, his page should be called Phil "The Power" Taylor  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mrmariomaster (talk • contribs) 08:33, 11 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Phil "Philthy Animal" Taylor 

message: John Lowe had a televised nine dart finish in 1984, so it's incorrect to claim Taylor had the first. 203.123.96.110 (talk) 11:01, 27 February 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  First televised nine dart finish 

message: The infobox here is perhaps the longest I've ever seen for a sportsperson, or indeed anyone. Opened this page on mobile earlier, and it severely reduces the ease of reading the article. Considering the article is extensively long, as well a there being a separate article purely for Taylor's career statistics, should this be completely revamped? Likearaisin (talk) 00:46, 3 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox far too long?