Talk:Minstrel show

message: The lead now suggests that Black performers first began performing in minstrel shows after the Civil War. I believe that is wrong. There is no citation. The obvious exception that leaps to mind is Master Juba, who died in 1852. Our article on blackface says, "By 1840, African-American performers also were performing in blackface makeup. Frederick Douglass wrote in 1849 about one such troupe, Gavitt's Original Ethiopian Serenaders: 'It is something to be gained when the colored man in any form can appear before a white audience.' Nonetheless, Douglass generally abhorred blackface and was one of the first people to write against the institution of blackface minstrelsy, condemning it as racist in nature, with inauthentic, northern, white origins." I see no reason to doubt it. I am editing accordingly. - Jmabel | Talk 03:56, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You're right. I didn't even notice that an anon had rewritten much of the lead until I saw your post here. I've changed back a few other things here and there. Over all, his or her edits were not bad. — Amcaja 20:49, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Entry of Black performers 

message: What a crock!  Free negroes could not vote or own land, therefore they weren't "Americans."  71.240.17.138 11:18, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, you said pretty much the exact same thing when you signed in as Velocicaptor. Why don't you try to join the discussion above rather than just drive-by complaining? — Amcaja 11:35, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I erred by previewing my "edit" prior to logging in.  After I logged in, I clicked "save" without previewing (again) as Velocicaptor.  That was a mistake which displayed the IP number instead of my user name. I was disappointed, however it was my first "save" of the day, so I forgave myself.  Velocicaptor 14:22, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

text: I agree that it's a "crock" to claim that one isn't an American if one can't vote or own land. (I'd change my mind if there were a citation from a reliable source, though.) Lou Sander 12:30, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You are a gentleman and a scholar, Velocicaptor. (And there are damned few of us left <smile>). Lou Sander 15:25, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

text: People do not realize that each State in the Union determines who may vote.  Prior to the passage of the 14th Amendment to the United States Constitution (about 1870), some States' requirements  restricted voting to people who owned at least 50 acres of land.  That requirement kept some white men from voting, as well as "Free negroes."   Even in 2006, each State may enact laws related to voting which differ from the laws in every other State.  The same rule applies to laws relating to the consumption of alcoholic beverages, etal.  Velocicaptor 14:22, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Women were citizens, but didn't have the vote. The slaves weren't even citizens. Quite similarly to the situation of the slaves, few would refer to the unemancipated Jews of the 19th century Pale of Settlement as "Russians", but we would use that term for ethnically Russian serfs. - Jmabel | Talk 06:31, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Shoot from the lip articles

message: I removed a bit that claimed that the minstrel depiction of Stowe's Topsy character was the basis for the pickaninny stereotype. First, it needs a source. Second, I doubt it's true. Pickaninny characters are much older than blackface minstrelsy or Tom shows. Charles Dibdin was using the term in his black caricature pieces as early as 1788. (Nathan 28). It's possible that Tom shows were the first to present the fully realized stereotype, and that's worth noting, but, like I said, it needs a source. None of the major works on blackface minstrelsy (that I've read) mentions pickaninnies as a significant stereotype present in the form. — Amcaja 22:27, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Topsy and pickaninnies 

message: :By 1840, the minstrel show had become central to the culture of the Democratic party (Especially in the northern US). These shows gave whites of the Democratric party the images they needed to suggest that blacks should be governed more harshly and closely. "In holding the public infantilism of blacks constant, Northerners denied what was allowed in white aliens and male children-the possibility of political maturation-and thereby rejected environment as the source of the black debasement. According to popular culture, the Negro was not the creature of his circumstances ... In this way the popular arts and especially minstrelsy provided symbolic justifications for keeping the Negro in his place." Jean H. Baker (1983) p242.
I removed this quote from the lead section of the article. This information is already covered in the article (see the third paragraph of the "Height" section). It may need to be summarized somewhere in the lead, but I don't think the long quoted passage is necessary for this purpose. — Amcaja 00:24, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Baker quote 

message: I removed this image.
thumb|left|250px|Charles Knipp, a white gay man who dresses up in blackface as a character he calls "Shirley Q. Liquor," whom he describes as an “inarticulate Black women on welfare with 19 kids". In 
spite of Black protest, Knipp routinely performs his  minstrel show for a predominately white gay audience in  West Hollywood. 2007
This seems beyond the scope of this article, which is about a theatrical form that has died out rather than blackface in general, which persists. Instead, the image would probably be a better fit for our blackface article. There are also fair use concerns, but perhaps those can be sorted. -- Amcaja 02:25, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Charles Knipp 

message: The stuff about hokum and W.C. Handy needs to have a source citation. Can one be provided in the next couple days? If no, the material should be removed. — Amcaja 03:30, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent additions 

message: How about a discussion of the similarities to how today's pimps and hoes entertainment industry plays a similiar role to minstrelry: reinforcing stereotypes such as a perpetual adolescence.
:Please sign your contributions by striking the tilde key four times. If you have any good printed or Internet source for that statement, you might want to add it, although it seems a bit off the subject. Sincerely, GeorgeLouis (talk) 05:44, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rap Music 

message: This song could represent symbolism between men and when and the act of minsterlry There are the lyrics to the song. Could be added as just a "pop-culture" quick refrence. MikelZap 01:29, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No, thanks. Minstrelsy is, by definition, popular culture. Long lists of trivia and "popular culture" sections in articles are usually frowned upon. See WP:AVTRIVIA. — Amcaja (talk) 09:30, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A song by Cartel - A Minstrel's Prayer 

message: I've added a new article on the Rabbit's Foot Company / Rabbit Foot Minstrels, which it seems to me should be linked into this article as a post-1900 development of the black minstrel show tradition.  There is a reference here in the Legacy section to Ma Rainey, one of the most prominent performers with the Rabbit Foot Minstrels, but I'm (uncharacteristically!) reluctant to edit this article as it's getting well outside my areas of knowledge.  Can anyone help here, eg by putting in a clearer reference to how the black shows developed from the late 19th century into the first half of the 20th ?  Ghmyrtle 11:31, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm. From the article you wrote, it seems to me that the Rabbit's Foots were more of a variety troupe of the kind that replaced minstrelsy rather than a minstrel troupe per se. However, Watkins mentions the company as signficant for beginning the careers of several notable black performers, while noting that they added lots of other stuff to the standard minstrel fare. Feel free to add something to the Legacy or History section. — Amcaja (talk) 12:20, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks.  I've added a sentence or two.  Ghmyrtle 14:11, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[The Rabbit's Foot Company]] 

message: "Performers told nonsense riddles: "The difference between a schoolmaster and an engineer is that one trains the mind and the other minds the train.""
Maybe not a great joke, but not nonsense.MarkinBoston 02:35, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A small thing 

message: It is stated that the tradition of blacking up goes back to Shakespeare's Othello (1604). This is backed up by reference. However, Shakespeare's earlier (1590s) Titus Andronicus also has a 'Moorish' character who would have been played by a white actor in blackface. My amendment was removed, with the comment "that's not what Watkins says; please don't change referenced material". Might I suggest that although the tradition does go back to 1604, it goes back even further as well - so Watkins is right, and so am I. Widmerpool 02:55, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The problem is that the sentence you changed draws from material in Watkins. If you have a source that pushes the blackfaced Shakespeare characters back further, not only the prose needs to be changed, but the reference to Watkins needs to be changed to reflect the source from which the material was drawn. In other words, I'm just trying to make sure the references in the article continue to say what the article says they say. — Amcaja (talk) 08:47, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Othello, and referenced material

message: Good article but needs stuff on minstrelsy in Britain Canada Australia and elsewhere. IN Britain it was massively popular in the second half of the nineteenth century Johncmullen1960 (talk) 07:28, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry, just saw your note here. You're right, but for the most part, the performers in Britain and other places were mostly Americans on tour. — Dulcem (talk) 07:47, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  international side 

message: I believe that the controversies surrounding the Star Wars character of Jar Jar Binks and the Transformers 2 characters of Mudflap and Skids merit a brief (maybe 2 sentence) mention in the middle of the Legacy section, perhaps after the paragraph that mentions Spike Lee's Bamboozled.  In the cases of both The Phantom Menace and Transformers 2, a number of mainstream critics accused the films of practicing thinly-veiled minstrelsy.  Though the characters (in both instances, CGI animated creations) were not extraterrestrial aliens and therefore obviously not explicitly African-American, these critics alleged that their characterizations were "coded" as black, trading heavily on long-standing stereotypes, "borrow[ing] heavily from the genre of minstrelsy."  Links for possible citation: Racial Ventriloquism, Jive-talking twin Transformers raise race issues.  Whether or not one agrees with the critics' allegations, they certainly provide good examples of the NEW forms charges of minstrelsy have taken, and that the tradition's legacy remains highly controversial.76.90.175.151 (talk) 02:20, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jar Jar Binks and ''Transformers 2'' 

message: I have added tags as requested.  Many of these are likely to be repeats of passages already cited, but it is best to support statements about popularity, style history of performers and troupes, etc. Jezhotwells (talk) 20:04, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: * I've added references for things I had at hand from my own notes for the Blackface article. I'll try to get to the rest of this some time in August (2009) if no one beats me to it. User:Dulcem added most of this material, so I've left a note on his user talk page hoping he might have more of this at hand. I'm pretty sure all of the statements are accurate, and should not be difficult to cite for. - Jmabel | Talk 05:33, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

text: *: I've now addressed more than half of what was asked for. I'm still trying to track down good sources for the rest. - Jmabel | Talk 01:56, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citation tags 

message: One of the problems here is that the article deviates from Minstrel Show, and slops over into vaudeville, which may be understandable, but then into radio show (Amos and Andy). While this could be addressed in a higher level "Negative portrayal/stereotypes of African Americans", it seems out of place at this article. Off WP:TOPIC IMO. Student7 (talk) 22:16, 16 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Overlapping material

message: Although originating in the US, the minstrel show was popular and influential and knew its own specific development in other countries, notably the UK. 90.61.81.191 (talk) 07:22, 11 March 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  outside the US 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 3 external links on Minstrel show. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140927230547/http://black-face.com/minstrel-shows.htm to http://black-face.com/minstrel-shows.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140927230547/http://black-face.com/minstrel-shows.htm to http://black-face.com/minstrel-shows.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070313225042/http://www.iath.virginia.edu/utc/onstage/films/mv03hp.html to http://www.iath.virginia.edu/utc/onstage/films/mv03hp.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 21:30, 12 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Minstrel show. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060910112327/http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/railton/enam358/minstrel.html to http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/railton/enam358/minstrel.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090326133827/http://etd.lib.fsu.edu/theses/available/etd-03312006-171940/unrestricted/pds_dissertation.pdf to http://etd.lib.fsu.edu/theses/available/etd-03312006-171940/unrestricted/pds_dissertation.pdf
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 06:32, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Minstrel show. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090109044327/http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/1978/3/1978_3_93.shtml to http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/1978/3/1978_3_93.shtml
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:20, 12 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: I recently added the word "racist" to the lead sentence of this article. It's already garnered its first removal (and restoration). Anticipating more removals, here's a pre-emptive argument for why the word more than just belongs there, it needs to be there:
FACT 1: The lead paragraph should summarized the article. (see MOS:LEAD)
FACT 2: The lead sentence should tell people what the topic is. (see MOS:LEADSENTENCE)
Multiple sections establish the racist content of these shows and current lead:
does a decent job of summarizing what the article later describes. However, read the lead sentence in isolation without the word "racist":
A person reading just this lead sentence is simply left with the impression this was a type of entertainment. How lovely! I like entertainment too!
Sarcasm off now, the bland description as "entertainment" is so generic as to not summarize the article appropriately. I'd go so far to say that intentional or not it'd be a whitewashing of the history of minstrel shows. A person might argue that the rest of the lead paragraph repairs the deficiency but we must remember, the first sentence does often get shown in isolation. For example in search results or mobile apps. In other words, our lead sentence really is important and ought to summarize the topic appropriately. 
The article > lead paragraph > lead sentence structure often works best when the each is written as a "condensed" version of the former. The lead sentence without the word "racist" was breaking this chain because it contained no hint of the racist nature of the shows that was established by the lead which in turn was established by the article. If the description of a form of entertainment revolves around making fun of a specific group of people yet the description doesn't acknowledge this, this would be an editorial failure. Jason Quinn (talk) 01:50, 2 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: This seems commonsensical and clearly in line with policy. Thank you  got this detailed explanation.  EvergreenFir (talk) 04:36, 2 January 2021 (UTC)

text: The wording of the lead had been in place for many years, and changes should have been discussed here first, rather than imposed.   The addition of protection for the new wording, and the inclusion of HIDDEN TEXT (in capital letters, no less!) simply gives the appearance of an unwillingness to discuss alternative wordings.  Ghmyrtle (talk) 09:04, 23 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: A discussion, which was made contemporaneously with the first edit, is literally right here at the start of this thread topic. If you think all changes to Wikipedia require consensus first, you have a misunderstanding how things work. The problem with the old lead is enumerated in my discussion above. That discussion began three weeks ago and nobody has provided a single counterargument to its inclusion, either here or in the edit summaries since. Beyond "that's the way it's been", you didn't provide a good reason to restore the word either. If you believe so, you are warmly invited to provide a counter-argument to the above and provide an argument why removing the word "racist" makes a better lead. I fail to see how it would given the current text of the article. As for the hidden text with capital letters, this form of source note is ubiquitous on Wikipedia and nothing unusual so don't make it out to be something nefarious when it's not. Further, as the text prompts people to go to the talk page and to establish consensus, a process which necessitates discussion, saying it shows an "unwillingness to discuss alternatives" doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Jason Quinn (talk) 13:18, 23 January 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I accept I misread the date of your first post in this thread, which I wrongly assumed had also been earlier today.  (01:50, 2 January 2021  >  04:36, 2 January 2021 >  07:14, 23 January 2021)  I missed it first time round.  Had I got that right, I probably wouldn't have intervened.  Ghmyrtle (talk) 14:17, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

text: If no consensus is reached, the status quo is usually retained. See WP:NOCONSENSUS. In this case, that would be to keep the word "racist" since at least somebody agreed with my argument and a decent amount of time had passed for objections, long enough for a new status quo to be established. (As for your personal litmus test, I note you didn't respond to my argument so the word would still stand by your own criteria.) I've read your arguments. I was waiting for others to reply but your new comment forced to me to chime before I wanted. I think your points have only superficial merit and completely miss the forest for the trees. Feels to me you are arguing to a conclusion for the lead rather than making sure the lead reflects the rest of the article. Ultimately, Wikipedia depends on reliable sources for the information contained in its articles. There are numerous statements in this article that note the racist nature of the shows that are already either directly sourced or supported by surrounding material that is directly sourced. Unfortunately a lot of the books are not available for preview on Google Books. It would be nice to add  to these references because they help for these kinds of disputes. A search has found many websites however that would be used for sourcing in the article that attest to the racist nature of the shows. I haven't been editing much lately for lack of time but I intend on adding some references to do just that when I get a chance. Perhaps taking a step back will help you. These shows were basically made to depict African Americans by whites in blackface often for cheap laughs based on stereotypes. That was the bread and butter of these shows and that is what you are arguing cannot be called racist. Yes, there's elements of a "moral conclusion" here. Yes there may have been acts that were sometimes parts of these shows that were not racist. But none of your points convince me these shows cannot be called racist in a way that passes solid editorial judgement. In my opinion, removing the word "racist" from the lead would make the lead sentence inconsistent with the rest of the article. Jason Quinn (talk) 02:02, 3 February 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Since the article originally didn't have the word racist in the lead sentence, I thought the "status quo" would be to not have the word in it? Since you started the discussion, and then proceeded to edit the article before a consensus was reached. Maybe I'm missing something. At any rate, I would think the lead sentence is supposed to indicate its intended purpose, and explain its effective result later on. For example, all articles I find that talk about dictators tend to lead with "...the former president of X nation...", and the fact he is a dictator is buried very far down in the article. While my knowledge of history is limited, and I encourage anyone to educate me if I'm mistaken, I believe the primary purpose of minstrel shows was entertainment, one of the foremost sources of entertainment in 19th century America, and quite a lot of pivotal actors of the early 20th century started their careers in minstrel shows (such as Al Jolson and Bing Crosby). Minstrel shows were absolutely racist, which majorly contributed to its decline, but my understanding was that was more of a byproduct of the culture it originated from, not its primary purpose. Of course, I understand that that kind of argument can also be used for whitewashing history, for example, the statement that "The CSA's primary purpose was state rights", which we know is false. However, it was my understanding that wasn't the case for minstrel shows, so that is why I would not have been in favor of keeping the current lead sentence LutherVinci (talk) 01:31, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

text: Note: edit request template removed. IP, please reach consensus before using the edit request template. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (talk) 07:49, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

text: I did indeed come here while watching “White Christmas”, to see exactly what “minstrel show” meant. And, yes, I was surprised to see it being referred to as “racist” entertainment. At this current time, when there is deep division concerning things like racism, sexism, and anti-trans, I’d recommend extreme caution in applying those charges. The risk is that the credibility of Wikipedia is undermined. That is certainly the case for myself, on seeing this “racism” reference. Having read the WP article on racism it’s not at all clear that the word can be applied to an entertainment genre, and trying to do so may well be a category error. Nevertheless, that is relevant when considering whether the charge of racism should be in the article itself, not the lead. Whether the word should be in the lead is largely, as the original commented argued, down to whether it is in the article. In other words, claiming racism in the article may or may not be valid, but while it’s there, mentioning it in the lead (modulo weight considerations) is not unreasonable. In summary: I strongly object to a charge of racism in the article, at very least without counter arguments also being there. HOWEVER, as long as it is there, it’s hard to object to it being in the lead. 45.51.100.70 (talk)  — Preceding undated comment added 03:34, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pre-emptive argument for the word "racist" in the lead sentence 

message: Remove last sentence of Music and Dance paragraph 3: "This was the first large-scale appropriation and commercial exploitation of black culture by American whites." 
Minstrelsy was not the first large-scale commercial appropriation of black culture by American whites. The development of plantation rice agriculture in South Carolina and Georgia during the 17th and 18th centuries was the first large-scale appropriation. Fideanimo (talk) 16:07, 7 February 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: . I'm hesitant to perform this edit as the current statement is sourced. Do you have one or more reliable sources to support claim your counterclaim? I'm also worried that the sentence and your counterclaim are using "appropriation" in a differing sense of the word or how plantation rice agriculture was black culture and how it was appropriated. Please re-activate the edit request when you've replied. Jason Quinn (talk) 03:47, 8 February 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 7 February 2021 

message: The conclusions drawn from a reactionary attitude and misunderstanding of the term should be removed as original research, as should all the original research in the article. White slavery does not refer to the race of the enslaved, but the manner of their enslavement. As I've said before, Slavs have very pale skin and American attitudes about slavery are very ignorant of world history.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.77.228.219 (talk) 05:57, 10 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  "white slavery" 

message: This article contain examples of many citation formats, from the simplest ref tags to short citation templates. I have fixed a number of the latter which were not working due to mismatched between the inline tags and the listed references. A consistent format would be beneficial.--WriterArtistDC (talk) 22:18, 21 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citation formats 

message: This page is all opinion from one source, the news York times. Which is not news. The entire page should not be on Wikipedia 2601:1C2:1700:31E0:CD29:7A3C:125D:FAF9 (talk) 17:18, 26 December 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: The article is well sourced, with references to dozens of sources (none of which are the New York Times). Danski454 (talk) 19:04, 26 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 26 December 2021 

message: Although it's hard to imagine that anyone would disagree,  calling it racist in the opening line is an opinion not a fact.  People can draw that almost inevitable conclusion by reading the definition. They do not need editorializing forcing it upon them from the opening line. 2601:8C3:4001:9220:154A:DCFE:A56:3096 (talk) 12:52, 27 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the  template. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 10:51, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 27 June 2022 

message: The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
* 
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 15:21, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

message: Calling it 'racist' is a value judgement that is just one example of the utterly laughable nature of Wikipedia claiming to be an 'encyclopaedia'.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.79.154.173 (talk) 21:19, 12 September 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Totally agree.  Just nauseating sanctimoniously judgmental propaganda that has no place in something purporting to be an encyclopedia.  To think that I used to actually make donations to Wikipedia. 2001:8003:1C26:DC01:1A2:EBDB:D257:D89C (talk) 23:56, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  'racist' 

message: We have to reach a consensus for either use or not use "racist" in the lead sentence. Otherwise the original version - w/o "racist" - must be reestablished.
Albeit eliminating "racist" would be a shame. since it does unveil (some!) truth. Still - it's unacceptable for WP to have someone insert a loaded word in a lead sentence; get into a diverse discussion (see below from 2021 and onwards); and finally lock the door for further changes.
Me being a professional jazz musician, amateur historian and philosopher, honorary city council member of a definitely "left" party - I have several questions and finally a solution to this to sketch out.
1) Were minstrel shows considered racist in the 19th century?
2) Besides being "american" and "entertaining" - is "racist" the appropriate and third adjective to define minstel shows? Is it possible for something be racist and entertaining?
3) In sight of racist crimes - like e.g. Belgians cutting arms of black workers in Congo contemperaneous - calling mostly amateur theatres from travelling people "racist" is sort of relativating Organized Crime backed by racist ideology, isn't it?
4) Would one call the likes of Josephine Baker, Greta Garbo, Brigitte Bardot, Madonna, Elvis Presley, Mick Jagger, Janelle Monaie, James Brown, David Bowie, Lady Gaga  "sexist"? Or rather a Culture Industry (Adorno, Horkheimer) fostering sexist and racist stereotypes? A future generation might do so, still would have to admit it was not considered to be fully dominating at the time being.
That brings us to a sketch of a solution: Since it all seems to come down to a cultural and moral Century-Bias, I would strongly advise to keep "racist" in the leading paragraph however not in the first sentence. After the (felicitous) description including the ridiculization of stereotypes, something like:
"Nowadays this is (clearly) considered to be racist - however at the time being theatrical (entertaining) aspects dominated."
From there move on.... Haegar's (talk) 11:40, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: As with most Wikipedia articles, the content should reflect how reliable sources view a topic, not how our editors view it. While I personally find blackface performances to be much less disturbing than racial segregation and lynchings, the long-term view on minstrel shows should be determined by the available sources. Dimadick (talk) 13:05, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Consensus for use of "racist" 

message: The inclusion of the word "racist" in the first sentence of this article -- in combination with the lock against editing -- would seem to be a violation of the alleged Wikipedia fundamental principle of NPOV.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.253 (talk) 01:03, 23 February 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV 

message: I suggest condensing the article by one third - eliminating all the repetition. The same ground is covered over and over. Anna (talk) 22:23, 25 July 2023 (UTC)
thread_title: Ten years later there still is so much repetition

message: on the first few lines please change theater to theatre. 100.12.99.228 (talk) 22:25, 29 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 29 January 2024 

message: Disney’s Song of the South should be added. Superherosaturday (talk) 20:20, 4 April 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Why? There are no minstrel shows or blackface in the film. Dimadick (talk) 04:16, 5 April 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Motion pictures with minstrel show routines