Talk:Copa Sudamericana

message: Is Copa Sudamericana the American equivalent to the UEFA Cup?  216.174.165.54 13:16, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not exactly. The now defunct Copa CONMEBOL was more like the UEFA Cup. However, Copa Sudamericana is the second most important club competition in South America, like UEFA Cup is the second most important European club competition. --Carioca 06:10, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Copa Sudamericana and UEFA Cup

message: I've considerably reduced the length of the last paragraph of the introduction while retaining all the information, because as originally written much of it was either repetition or simply taking a whole lot of words to give not very much info.  Here's the original paragraph, with problems boldfaced:
:The reigning champion of the competition is Brazilian club São Paulo, after beating Argentine club Tigre 2-0 on aggregate. Argentine club Boca Juniors is the most successful club in the cup history, having won the tournament twice. Argentine clubs have accumulated the most amount of victories with 5 wins while containing the largest number of different winning teams, with a total of four clubs having won the title. The cup has been won by ten different clubs and won consecutively once, most recently by Boca Juniors in 2005.
This reads like someone took a generic template and simply plugged in the appropriate numbers and club names.  "I have to have a sentence that reads 'the most successful club has been ____, who have won the tournament ____ times.'"  "I have to have a sentence that reads, 'the cup has been won consecutively ____ times, most recently by ____.'"  Once it's established that Boca Juniors are the only club to have won the competition twice, then they are obviously the most successful club in the competition.  Once it's further established that Boca won the trophy consecutively, then they are obviously the only club to have done so, and it's just bizarre to further call them the "most recent" club to have done so.  And once we're told that four different Argentinian clubs have won, then obviously that means Argentine clubs have won the trophy on five occasions.  I was able to trim the graph down to about half its prior length. Binabik80 (talk) 18:18, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, none of the facts stated in the original version is obvious unless you know the history of the winners, which, considering that it is on the intro, an average reader would not know. If you don't know the history of winners, then it's not obvious that Boca is the most successful club with two titles; it is not obvious that Argentine clubs are the most successful in the competition; and it is not obvious that since Boca won it twice in a row, they have been the only club to do so. These are things you would have to state outright. Digirami (talk) 07:37, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Intro paragraph about previous winners 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified