Talk:Wafah Dufour

message: Where did she live at the time of the attacks?
*  Guardian says "At the time of the atrocity she was living less than a mile from the World Trade Centre."
*  BBC says "Ms Dufour was in Geneva when the 11 September 2001 attacks on the US, masterminded by her uncle, were launched."
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Pbb (talk • contribs) 23:33, 23 December 2005
: She said she is a New Yorker, so she probably was just on vacation at the time of the attacks. --Pmsyyz 21:58, 25 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Location, location, location 

message: In the Observer interview, Waffah claims "I just got a glance and he turned his back because I was unveiled".  Calling this a "meeting" might be a stretch.  But the original wording of the article made it sound like they've never been in the same room, which is also inaccurate.  Magnus 15:54, 25 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It was her mother who wrote about OBL turning his back, because she was unveiled -- ironic if the CIA's claim that they discovered a cache of porn in his hideout was true.  Geo Swan (talk) 04:48, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Meeting Osama 

message: Roughly states the facts, undisputed facts, valid info, all are terms meant to be disputed, what is not disputed is the following:
1. We have to respect the fact that she was born in calif. and hence she is an American by birth, this doesn't discredit her or the article in anyway,
2. Wikipedia states that Arab American descend from a heritage that represents common linguistic, cultural, and political traditions. Arab Americans have a common linguistic background, she doesn't speak Arabic, and hence she is not an Arab American, otherwise we have to change the linked pages 
3. Yeslam Binladin is the half brother of OBN and hence she is the half-nience
4. Her not accepting her father's wish for arranged marraige shall be linked to some undisputed article of hers and not of the said Arranged marriage tradition itself
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.154.233.235 (talk • contribs) 17:21, 30 December 2005
:With respect to the your first point, she does "descend from" such a heritage, irrespective of whether she speaks the language herself. Her ancestors did, which is the meaning of descent. Your second point is correct, but your third point misunderstands how we link things here - someone clicking the term arranged marriage will be doing so to learn more about the specific topic, not to see an article of hers. If an article is cited to, this should be as a footnote. Cheers! bd2412 T 17:55, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: ** sorry to interrupt, and this 2 years after the fact, but technically she's only one quarter Arab even by descent; her mother is half Swiss French and half Persian and her father is half Yemeni and half Persian. It's safe to say she's American by birth, being half Persian, a quarter European, and a quarter Arab by descent. Persian is not the same thing as Arab. **--64.230.75.40 03:34, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disputing the "Undisputables" 

message: African-Americans are American by birth; none speak any of their ancestor languages nor observe any of their ancestral cultures, but it is still acceptable and proper to refer to them as African-American.  It is up to Ms. Dufour to change that characteristic of hers, but presumably she'd need to be more famous so that her insistance would be more readily accepted.
As I read the Observer article sourced here, I get the impression that it was her mother that briefly saw Osama, not her.
No attempt to discredit Ms. Dufour or Arabs or Muslims exists with this article.  Perhaps if you explain your objections more fully, other editors could understand exactly what your objections really are.
- CobaltBlueTony 16:41, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Refocus 

message: User:195.229.242.54  13:15, 3 January 2006 GMT
let me try to explain
By looking at the lineage of Ms. Dufour, by birth, she is half Arab, and half Swiss.
In Arab tradition, a son or daughter is lineaged to his or her father, unless otherwise he has no control on his or her up bringing
In Jewish tradition, it is the womb that carried the child which decides if he is Jew or not
Judging from her statements and actions, she is trying to distant herself from her first Arab half by doing the following:
*#-Running away with her Swiss mother at 10
*#-Taking her mother's family name as her family name, usually done with illegitimate children
*#-Exposing herself to media and posing as an American
*#-Appearing in magazines half naked, and 
*#-Distancing herself from Arab language, culture and tradition, in words and actions
All of the above will diminish the possibility of attributing her to her first Arab half, and would give more credit to her another half as Swiss.
As you mentioned in your comments, "It is up to Ms. Dufour to change that characteristic of hers" so have anyone of the writers of this article got any direct statement of hers if she wishes to be called Arab-American more than Swiss-American, or otherwise?
I believe that we should focus more on how much percent of her characteristics were influenced by her ancestors, and just lineage her to that ancestor and not pick the one we see more convenient for us.
If we do otherwise, it would be just as if we are trying to say, "Hay, we got one of yours and made her act as one of us"
After all, nudity is not sanctioned in any religion or culture, and it’s a fact that as humans developed since the time they got out of their caves, they cover more parts of their bodies, and not vise versa.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.42.2.21 (talk • contribs) 16:02, 3 January 2006
:Despite what she wishes to hide, or advocate, her decent and heritage exist nonetheless.  The use of the term Arab American as defined by Wikipedia remains relevant, even if she herself tries to refute such.  It seems to me that you are uncomfortable with her lifestyle being connected to her heritage in any way.  Unfortunately, Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy really doesn't give us much leeway in this; we are here only to document facts and present them as they exist, not as any one POV would like to see them.  (Believe me, I'm dealing with this issue now with other topics!)
:There are examples of other actors whose lineage is less known; significant lineage or familial bonds nevertheless are difficult to deny and genuinely not worth hiding.  In terms of your possible concerns with the association to OBL or Arab/Muslim traditions, consider this: her refutation of OBL's actions along with her estranged father's demostrates a familial disdain, and as such stands as a testimonial to both herself and her father.  Likewise, her distance from traditional Arab/Muslim customs is seen as a dismissal of them, not a relfection of their quality.  The fact that her actions are known to be divergent from a large majority of Arabs and Muslims makes clear what she stands for, as well as what Arabs/Muslims stand for.  No value judgement can be made by favorable or unfavorable editing here on Wikipedia.  The facts should remain the facts; Wikipedia is not responsible, nor does it want the responsiblity, for making cultural value assessments through the way in which it words its articles, and this is a large part of the reason that as an online encyclopedia, it enforces it's WP:NPOV policy.  I hope this helps clear up the intent of the edits made. - CobaltBlueTony 17:57, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure what your point is. Prehistoric people wore clothes while still inhabiting caves, although they didn't live exclusively in caves. There have been subsequent periods where people dressed in a manner that would be frowned upon by monotheistic religions. So your claim that, "it’s a fact that as humans developed since the time they got out of their caves, they cover more parts of their bodies, and not vise versa" is false. 80.47.161.126 13:58, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Re-Refocus 

message: Wafah Dufour/Binladin hardly qualifies as Arab-American. Yes, she is American, as she was born in the United States. However, her mother is half-Iranian, half-Swiss; her father is half-Iranian, half-Arab (of Yemeni origins). So, she is as Arab-American as she is Swiss-American (by heritage). She is ethnically Half-Iranian, quarter-swiss, and quarter-arab. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vossoug (talk • contribs) 05:57, 15 January 2006
:I've heard other people described as more than one type of hyphenated american on Wikipedia.  See Soledad O'Brien.  TastyCakes 04:35, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ethnic Heritage 

message: If she's a singer-songwriter, shouldn't we get a listing of her material? That is, unless she hasn't released anything yet.-RomeW 21:08, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: As far as I can tell, the only thing she's done is four demos that have been released on her MySpace page.  All references to her being a singer-songwriter seem to be unsubstantiated by any actual singing or song-writing.  Much like Paris Hilton, I am at a loss to figure out what this woman actually does for a living.  Brash (talk) 06:49, 11 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Discography? 

message: http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=oddlyEnoughNews&storyid=2006-03-13T133256Z_01_N10281478_RTRUKOC_0_US-LEISURE-BINLADEN.xml
this article is from a trusted source but both articles contradict each other in certain parts. One is the musical influences, another is the name of her mother's book. Can anyone clear some of this up for me? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Whoscheesemine (talk • contribs) 19:01, 13 March 2006
:Link is dead now (goes to www.reuters.com), but name of her mother's book is "The Veiled Kingdom" by Carmen Bin Ladin,  Published by Virago (C)2004, . GraL (talk) 13:21, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: He mother also wrote "Inside the kingdom: my life in Saudi Arabia" Publisher Warner Books 2004, , 9780446577083 GraL (talk) 14:19, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Who to beleive? 

message: article lists birth year as 1976 but is in the 1979 births category — Preceding unsigned comment added by T1980 (talk • contribs) 16:37, 6 May 2006
:She was born in may, 1975. I'm not sure where those other dates came from... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fallout boy (talk • contribs) 03:58, 5 October 2006
Her own home page says she was born in 1979.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.34.22.27 (talk) 01:02, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  contradiction 

message: What is up with the  tag?
Instances of the tag tell readers to look to the talk page for an explanation of the concern that triggered the tag.
Whoever placed that tag had an obligation to explain why they placed it here.  It doesn't look like they have done so.
I read, on WP:AN/I, that we should feel free to excised orphaned tags, like this one, without warning, 24 hours after they had been placed.  
Instead I will call on whoever placed it, or agrees with its placement, to explain it.  Heck.  We don't even know if the contributor who placed it thought it was biased in favor of her, or biased against her.
Cheers!  Geo Swan (talk) 06:54, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  {{tl|npov}}? 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 8 external links on Wafah Dufour. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Replaced archive link http://www.webcitation.org/5ztBXEikE?url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10587661 with https://www.webcitation.org/5ztBXEikE?url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10587661 on http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10587661
*Replaced archive link http://www.webcitation.org/5ztB4uyGH?url=http://www.perthnow.com.au/entertainment/perth-confidential/osamas-niece-heads-this-way/story-e6frg30l-1111115491725 with https://www.webcitation.org/5ztB4uyGH?url=http://www.perthnow.com.au/entertainment/perth-confidential/osamas-niece-heads-this-way/story-e6frg30l-1111115491725 on http://www.perthnow.com.au/entertainment/perth-confidential/osamas-niece-heads-this-way/story-e6frg30l-1111115491725
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.sify.com/news/meet-the-other-much-misunderstood-bin-laden-clan-news-international-lfgqkehiaga.html
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.boston.com/ae/celebrity/articles/2006/03/11/da_vinci_code_trial_winds_down/
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/03/11/1141701725809.html
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=%2F2005%2F12%2F24%2Fworldupdates%2F2005-12-24T042201Z_01_NOOTR_RTRJONC_0_-229299-1&sec=worldupdates
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/200806413514733
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.nme.com/news/wafah-dufour/42661
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 04:50, 30 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified