Talk:Germantown Baptist Church

message: -Megachurch status -
:: I have to seriously doubt that seven thousand members left the church when only approximately 1,500 voted for the proposal.  And I'm not picking sides here.  It just doesn't seem probable.  I imagine attendance is down since all of this is so recent, no senior pastor, staff jumping ship etc.  People tend to forget very quickly, though, and once GBC rehires staff I bet the numbers will go back up pretty quickly.  That huge building, basketball courts and baseball fields aren't going anywhere. User:Sweetmoose6
- the article from the Commercial Appeal is no longer linkable so that is why I placed the whole article on there (i know it was large but i thought it to be important in telling the story) 
::That article probably does paint a good story, but I also think it casts Dr. Story in a rather unfortunate light given that he did give almost a quarter century to the church.  I don't think he or even his enemies would want his reputation maligned over some probably regrettable descriptions.  What is in the in the public record doesn't always have to be reprinted and in this case it is probably better to leave the simple description in place.User:Sweetmoose6
- where are you getting your 150-7000 fact from? All the information I have read has the growth of Dr. Story's tenure to be closer to 5 or maybe 6 thousand. 
::I thought I read 7,000 in an article.  If you can find a different source and cite it then change it by all means.  I just thought that it was accurate.  If it is not it should be changed.User:Sweetmoose6
-Dr. Story's comments were much more than just "absolutely an abandonment of everything Baptists are."...and the point that he made them as a guest and invitee to a publicized church event was paramount. As to whether or not his comments were inflamatory or not, they have already been published as public and national record. I think if you are going to list that Dr. Shaw is going to be "marred with ..." then you need to do the same with Dr. Story's legacy being marred by his inflammatory comments. 
::I meant no disrespect to Dr. Shaw by the "marred with" statement.  I think I used the word unfortunantly before that, and also described him as a sincere and charismatic leader who brought many new programs to the church.  He will have to live with his decision, however, and it ended up dividing a church he had been hired to shepherd.  If I am missing something please correct me, but I think that a massive church that splits under your leadership would "mar" the perception of your leadership there.  I think he made a lot of right choices and is probably a better person than most of us, but the church still split and many people suffered from it.User:Sweetmoose6
- I to am sure the church has had many controversies over the last 160 years but you have to admit that none of them was anywhere close in the magnitude of this one. Its like saying that you shouldn't talk more about Hiroshima because there have been other explosions in the history of the world.
::You're right, its just the amount and tone of the conversation I'm worried about.  I don't want bitter church members and former church members thinking they can fight their war or take pot shots on this web page.  Every place has its problems, this is one GBC will quickly recover from and move on.  I'm sure this is a big deal to the church now but I doubt it will be five years down the road, unless that area dries up economically which is an entirely different subject.User:Sweetmoose6
- as far as quantifiable numbers are concerned, as a former member who watched this thing go down first hand and kept all the information both online and written articles, I can tell you for a fact, and have the bulletins to back it up, that as of May 1, 2006 there were more than 30 full time ministers on staff and as of September 1, 2006 there were at least 20 less including but not limited to all 5 student pastors, 4 of 5 children pastors, all 6 of the 7 leadership team members, all 3 worship leaders, and the head of the counseling ministry. I think this constitutes the use of the word "many", or "most", or even "a bunch of". If you post the numbers of 7,00 members in your article then all you have to do is subtract the number currently listed on the back of any bulletin which hovers around 1,800 - 2,000, give or take, to see that once again the use of the word "many" is quite viable. I think the numbers are notable to help present the average reader with the scope of the aftermath.
::You may be right, but if I am not mistaken (and I could be) that the 1,800-2K is attending per Sunday.  I think that is usually what it is although I could be wrong.  I'm not sure I've ever seen churches post the membership in the bulletin.  As for the staff, I did haer that quite a few left.  Whether that is something to be proud of is quite another conversation.  As for how many, I don't know.  I imagine the big names left, but what about the sound guy, and the janitor, aren't they staff?  So when you say most, I'm sure most of those who were with the administration, so to speak, left, I'm just not sure they represented most of the staff because I would assume the church has a huge amount of lower level staff.User:Sweetmoose6
- just in case you want to add it in...the reconciliation group was called Peace Maker Ministries.
::Okay sounds good to me.User:Sweetmoose6
- you might want to also add that savegbc.com has evolved into a book that can be purchased as a plan to win back your church. www.gbcsaved.com
::Didn't know that.  How much do you know about the save GBC thing?  My only intent was to create a fair summary of the conflict and move on to other things related to the church.  I assume you left because of the incident.  I think the Bellevue site has quite a write up on their save the church group.  I did not want the GBC site to be like that.  That was part of the reason I deleted the Dr. Story article.User: Sweetmoose6
:::The www.gbcsaved.com site contains MANY errors and unverifiable statements.  I am a current member of GBC, voted against the proposal, but I do not agree with most of the content on the gbcsaved site.  I have met the gentleman who put these materials together, and while his heart means well, he does not have enough fact or direct experience to be making these statements. (unsigned comment)
:::The GBC controversey was NOT about calvinism, nor PDL church strategy.  The GBC controversey was simply a struggle between 2 powerbases that were headed in different direstions.  The entire debate was about who gets to control the property.  While I was angry with the departed administration, I do believe ALL will benefit from this split.  GBC is recovering nicely 1 yr later.  The splinter church has found a stable home at Briarcrest Christian School, and hopefully they will have a building program soon.   
(unsigned comment)
::::It would be beneficial to sign your comments so we know who you are. I will only say that after reading all that occurred I find the whole situation sad, and hardly an exhibition of the type of love that Christ envisioned, yet an example for many.Sweetmoose6 (talk) 04:53, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: GBC Response

message: Because it is causing a Checkwiki error #70: "ISBN with wrong length", I removed the ISBN from the entry:
A History of Germantown Baptist Church, Turner Publishing, ISBN 81-86066
I have tried unsuccessfully to locate the correct ISBN on the Internet. Is the exact title specified in this entry? A few books exist with similar titles such as History of the German Baptist Brethren Church or A history of Second Baptist Church of Germantown. Who is the author? Ultimately, when I google either "A History of Germantown Baptist Church" or "A History of Germantown Baptist Church. Turner Publishing", I get only one hit--this article. Knife-in-the-drawer (talk) 16:56, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bad ISBN