Talk:Dmitri Linter

message: Your references contradict eachother. ITAR-TASS confirms that he was arrested on 28th, _after_ 2 nights of rioting, which is supported by Estonian media reports. Edgar Vares-Barbarus 14:42, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that this only proves that Estonian authorities organized this kidnapping, but latter were forced to acknowledge that this man was arrested. Probably they wanted to kill him. Vlad fedorov 09:27, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Paranoia. Estonian laws allow for 48-hour detainment - if police presents valid enough evidence to back up their claims within this time, the detainment will be prolonged by court (else the suspect will walk free) That's why the vast majority of detained rioters walked free the next morning - court considered the evidence on hand at the time insufficient for full arrest. It appears that Linter was detained on evening of 27th, with court accepting the evidence presented on 28th. Edgar Vares-Barbarus 12:36, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Did I mention paranoia? Edgar Vares-Barbarus 12:36, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Timeline

message: There are no non-Russian sources verifying this. Considering that otherwise Estonian newspapers have followed arrest of Linter very closely and reported every detail, several of these claims are rather questionable.
For example, the claim that "After two hours after his detention Linter appeared in the Mustamäe hospital under an intravenous line." is a lie, he was taken to the hospital because he claimed to have "various ills", he was given a full medical and declared healthy (). Also, the arrest was announced on the same day, not next day (same source, also Russian sources). DLX 19:43, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, the original source with interview of Marina Linter, weekly Den za Dnjom , specifically mentions that the article is based solely on claims by Marina Linter and although she has promised to present the evidence to the journalist, she has not done so. She claimed to know the name of "psychotropic substance" injected to Linter, but refused to say that, the name of the doctor, but "couldn't remember". The article ends with a statement by journalist, repeating again that Marina has presented no evidence and the story sounds more like a bad spy novel. I couldn't find the story from the website of that weekly, as apparently they don't release full stories there. There are two Estonian translations (, ), but no English one, unfortunately. DLX 20:05, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Please read over your arguments again - they are discriminatory at least. Russian and Estonian sources are not reliable? Have ever read "Ilyad"? So, if it is written on ancient Greek it is not realible here? Please, familiarize yourself with WP:RS prior to editing in Wikipedia. If you have something to add to the article - add it, but don't prevent other users from doing it. Vlad fedorov 09:24, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So far Estonian sources have been very reliable and reported only facts, whereas Russian sources have reported every rumor as a fact, as long as it is defamatory - such as that the Bronze Soldier was sawed into parts, exhumed bodies where thrown out, statue won't be put up again, police attacked peaceful protesters... do I have to continue? DLX 09:30, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Considering that in Estonia secret services are "preventing manifestations" (see you blog source below) why should we trust to such sources coming from totalitarian Estonian state? Your generalizations on "reliable" Estonaian sources are as ridiculous as your POV pushing in the article. We all seen how your police was beating protesters and by the way a lot of your policemen are writing about beatings in their LiveJournal blogs. Would you deny beatings despite revelations about this by policemen in their blogs?   You won't win this dispute by revert war. Vlad fedorov 12:20, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not protesters - vandals and criminals. Some of whom were paid to "protest" (the guy responsible for offering money was arrested together with Linter). And there are no "secret services are "preventing manifestations" ", this is not Russia. DLX 12:35, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Materials released by the prosecutor's office confirm that the payments were funded by Nashi, who ordered Mark Sirők to pay 80 EEK per hour to people for standing in the "memory guard" pickets 8–22 until 9 May. 62.65.238.142 (talk) 15:39, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

text: As long as I am a lawyer, I could tell you that criminals are sitting in the jail by the definition and couldn't walk on the streets or take part in manifestations. Second, your naming of some people as "criminals" is absolutely antidemocratic pattern of behaviour and is a libel and defamation - law-breaking behaviour. There is presuption of innocence in the Constitution of Estonia and you should abide your constitution, if you are citizen. Only court could name someone as "criminal". It is outrageous that a citizen of a country which names itself as "democratic" violates its own Constitution and behaves like a citizen of totalitarian state. As for "paid", as long as we know Estonia receives large subsidies from EU. So, your reference to "paid", unsupported by any evidence, is a typical "look who's talking" case. Vlad fedorov 12:42, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, yes, I forgot, looters and thieves are heroes in Russia. Sorry, my bad, won't happen again. DLX 12:44, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

text: I am not Russian, so I don't understand why you resort to personal attacks on Russians. As far as I remember history, when Estonia was a territory for Teutonic order, aborigenes of these lands also were referred to in Order documents as pagans and bandits. It is sad that you repeat medieval occupier's pattern of behavoir. Vlad fedorov 12:59, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: POV

message: I understand that Mr Linter may be one of several "leaders" (or notable activists) representing the movement. --Camptown 10:54, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: One of several, aye. He's been active for quite a while before NW was founded, of course. Here's a quick peek into his Latvian  period: http://www.allaboutlatvia.com/article/604/the-latvian-connection. Edgar Vares-Barbarus 22:56, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh how nice - blog entry as a source? You must be at big rats with WP:RS. And by the way I like this qoute "In May 2005, the security services prevented a manifestation before the Latvian embassy in Estonia...". In "democratic" countries such as Estonia, secret services are acting to prevent manifestations? Perhaps it should go to Human rights in Estonia. Vlad fedorov 09:32, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. The Balts who wrote this made a good job in presenting their state as an "ethnofascist" police state. -- Petri Krohn 01:04, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The 'manifestation' was unsanctioned, and designed to be disruptive. Not acceptable. Edgar Vares-Barbarus 12:39, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: The leader? 

message: There's a factuality question tag next to the statement of Mr. Linter's Russian ethnicity.  What is the question here? Digwuren 07:24, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Linter is a Russian activist, but Petri Krohn pushed to add an word "ethnic". It could be not correct as by some sources Linter himself has claimed to Estonian, some sources have said he's Jewish origin. However, it's up to Petri to prove the ethnic origin of Dmitri Linter. I personally propose to remove both, the tag and the word "ethnic".80.235.65.41 07:52, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Find those "some sources" first. Digwuren 09:38, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

text: Linter is of Russian heritage, but a natural born Estonian citizen, as his ancestors were citizens before WWII.  'Ethnic' is not entirely irrelevant, as it helps disambiguate between the two meanings of 'Russian'.  Maybe word it something like 'a Russian activist of Estonian citizenship'? Digwuren 08:05, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ethnicity 

message: Sorry that I write on Finnish!
:Anteeksi hr. Petri Krohn, mistä olette keksinyt, että Dmitri Linter on juutalainen immigranti? Jotkut virolaiset luulevat, että Linter on juutalainen sukunimi, mutta se voi olla (myös virolainen) mikä tahansa. Linter sanoo itsensä virolaiseksi, vaikka ei puhuu lainkaan eestiä (ilmeisesti isä on virolainen?). 
:Olisi hyvä jos tarkistaisitte sen, väärälla tietolla (tai huhuila) ei ole Wikipediassa paikaa!
Katsokaa tätä videota http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_pWFAirJto&mode=related&search=, onko todella vaaleantukkainen mies juutalaisen näkyinen? 
::Bennov 23:05, 15 June 2007 (UTC+3)
The "Jewish immigrant" part was added by an anonymous vandal.  Linter was born in Tallinn, and thus, not an immigrant; furthermore, he has at least one ancestor that was citizen of Estonia before the Soviet occupation, and thus, he is a natural-born citizen.
Face-analyses to determine someone's ethnicity are inherently unreliable and not recommended.  As for Jewish ancestry, it is certainly possible Linter has some, but without sources it's at best speculative, and his public identity does not appear to mention it.  In any case, it's of minor significance. Digwuren 09:37, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jewish immigrant? 

message: The Finnish Wikipedia categorises Linter as an Estonian politician.  I believe this is misleading, as Linter has never held a political elected seat, and does not have political influence.  It may be prudent to remove the category, and go for 'Estonian activist' instead. Digwuren 09:46, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Status 

message: The article is very one-sided.  It focuses on the arrest and charges, but says nothing about what lead to the charges. 62.65.238.142 (talk) 18:13, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV again 

message: first of all it needs to be established according to whom the subject is a "Victim_of_Estonian_political_repression". For second its still an opinion not a fact. And therefore creating such a category and adding the subject into it is a violation of WP:NPOV.--Termer (talk) 19:30, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category:Victims_of_Estonian_political_repression