Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Mixed martial arts/Archive 1

message: An anonomous user has recently edited the names of several events on the list of PRIDE events page, most notably the GPs. Whilst technically I suppose he is right, (is each round known by another name in Japan?), do we want to keep their edits or revert? Unfortunately the edits have broken all the related the links so if we keep the new names the content will have to be moved and maybe some forwards set up at the old pages. Thoughts? --- Trench 20:03, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: He really should have made sure not to break the existing links, so you can feel free to revert. Alternatively, you can:
# Use both names (e.g. PRIDE 31, also known as PRIDE 31 - As Good As It Gets)
# Use piped links (e.g. PRIDE 31 - As Good As It Gets)
# Create pages for the links he created, and have them be redirects to the existing pages.
--CasualFighter 20:52, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well I've gone and reverted the careless edits.  Whatever is eventually decided on, if anything, we can't just leave the links broken in the interim.  I don't think there are even any alternate names for those events anyway.. SubSeven 21:13, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: PRIDE event naming

message: It looks like most pages do not follow the format we have outlined here. This may be because this format is not very convenient, and is too different from the record formats on places like Sherdog. Should we rewrite it? 
CasualFighter 20:39, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *I'm not sure - honestly if I were designing it now, I'd make it more like the Sherdog entry... I think the opponent is one of the key pieces of data on each row and should appear early.  I don't think it matters so much as long as we're actually editing though - MMA articles are (mostly) woefully underrepresented at time of writing.  I couldn't believe Matt Lindland didn't have an article, for example! — Estarriol talk 17:22, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Take a look at what I've done for Matt Hughes (fighter).  I have been doing people's records using this format and I feel it is better than all other formats I have seen around Wikipedia.  Personally, I'd also like to have a Weight Class column in there as well with so many fighters switching weight classes all the time.  It would be helpful for people looking at Randy Couture who want to see which of his fights were in the heavyweight division vs. light heavyweight, or for Matt Hughes to show that his last 2 fights were not in his regular weight class.  The only reason I haven't added theese is because the information would be very hard to compile, especially for smaller promotion fights. VegaDark 20:32, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

text: *We definately need a new template. Just my two cents, but I've been through many of the UFC fighters records trying to bring some resemblance of conformity to them since I found very few using the current template. I think this is because most fight records come straight from sherdog and the standard that is developing is easier to import and gives more relavent information. Following either format weight class shifts can be noted in the notes column, the addition of another column would not be advisible except for specific cases where people shift weight classes with almost every fight.Johnkinze 17:18, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Record Format

message: I intend to create a project box such as are listed on Wikipedia:Template messages/Talk namespace.  For this it would be nice to have a small and unique graphic (amongst projects - we can't use the yin-yang used by Wikipedia:WikiProject Martial Arts for example), preferably in SVG format.  We could also use this for a userbox — I don't use many of these myself but I have no objection to project userboxes.
Can anyone help?  I'm not much of an artist.  I may create the project box anyway, we could add the graphic later.  — Estarriol talk 18:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: We could always use the picture of Royce.. :) --CasualFighter 20:30, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

text: *LOL... it may well end up being of a fighter I guess.  I just wanted to avoid the arguments that would spawn.  :-) — Estarriol talk 21:57, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

text: * I've created the banner and the two stub banners using a smaller, edited version of the wrestling sculpture in the MMA article.  I had also considered using the fighter picture, I chose this one for now as it's more "classical" looking and less "reactionary".  We can change it in future, of course. — Estarriol talk 12:30, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd suggest a picture of a 6 oz. baby glove if the Greeks aren't going to work... hateless 05:47, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I like the baby glove idea - it's very MMA-specific. --CasualFighter 18:04, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I like the greeks, but I have no objection to the baby glove, if we can find a very good and clear picture of one that would convey in a thumbnail exactly what it is to an MMA newbie. — Estarriol talk 10:01, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That particular sculpture is absolutely perfect - I for one would prefer it was kept in favour of a glove. Slideyfoot 15:57, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I like the glove idea - it makes more sense for modern day MMA, but I don't really see a problem with the sculpture one we have now.. if this was an official vote I'd say I'm a weak yes for the glove. Skeletor2112 07:17, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wanted: Graphic for project box 

message: I'd like to see if we can form a consensus as to whether fight records should be listed with the earliest fights at the top, or the most recent fights at the top.  I personally find the Sherdog-style most recent at top to be more intuitive, but would like to see what others think.  Anyone?  — Estarriol talk 19:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: My vote is to put most recent fights first... In asddition to the obvious reasons, it will be a killer to create new tables otherwise, since most sources list the most recent fights first as well.--CasualFighter 20:29, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fight records - top down or bottom up? 

message: As well as the to do list for specific work drives of the moment, I have created Wikipedia:WikiProject Mixed martial arts/List of fighters that need full articles as the first of several lists to track the ongoing background need for article creation and expansion.  Lists of promotions, events, promoters and other personalities will follow. — Estarriol talk
*Promotions list now up too. — Estarriol talk 17:38, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Lists of work

message: Just to let you know that the nascent Ryan Bennett article is on AfD (it's been proposed for deletion on the grounds of lack of notability). I consider Bennett (and several other MMA broadcasters) to be fully notable, but I understand the challenge to his notability from those not familiar with MMA or sports broadcasting.
Should you have an opinion on this (either way, if you think he's not notable enough please say that too), please consider registering it on the AfD page, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ryan Bennett. — Estarriol talk 08:24, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Ryan Bennett]] on AfD 

message: Hi everybody, I just added myself to the workgroup, big MMA fan but pretty new to wikipedia so my apologies in advance if i screw anything up.  i'm pretty good with the history and fighter bios so should be able to add a lot.  thanks.  dan Danmeade 19:49, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi all, also just added myself to the group. I've created various articles on female MMA fighters (some more notable than others; got a bit carried away...), and I'm now working off the 'to do' list on here. So far, put something up on Yves Edwards, and currently preparing another on Mark Weir. Slideyfoot 15:57, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Great, welcome Slidey.  Mark Weir currently fights as a lightheavy in the UFC though? — Estarriol talk 11:46, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Introduction, and some odds and ends

message: Hey, I'd like to introduce myself as the newest member of the Project, and I hope to be of some help editing/creating fighter profiles and UFC events. First off though I have 3 questions:
1. Do you think it is a prerequisite to creating an article on an event that you must have seen it? Or could this article be put together from other internet sources (eg Sherdog) without having witnessed it?
2. Do you think that being a participant in one of the series' of TUF is enough to earn fighters the illustrious accolade of having their own page on the 'pedia?
3. Should the MMA fight record on a fighter's page include amateur or just professional fights?
Of course I realise these questions may stimulate differing answers from members of the project, but any comment is, as always, welcome!
Thanks for your time, --TheCooperman 21:29, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: In regards to your first point, I would say the most important issue is whether you have sufficient research to draw upon. If you haven't seen the event, but have a whole bunch of newspaper articles and interviews stuffed with pertinent information, then I would have thought thats fine. If you're just using one or two internet sources (unless they're extremely comprehensive), then probably not.Slideyfoot 22:42, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Good Evening

message: Hi.  I just wanted to let everyone know that in addition changing the link URLs that we previously discussed, I also added links in the articles (I believe they would be called inline links, but I'm not 100% sure on that because I'm still fairly new to this) to the UFC attendance, live gate, and fighter salary information.  I added the salary breakdowns for all the events that I have, and in doing so I noticed that many events (especially those in the UFC 45 to UFC 49 range) did not have any attendance information whatsoever, so I added the attendance information and created inline links to the Nevada State Athletic Commission web site on those pages.
Also, from the period of UFC 51 and on, there were a few pages that had incorrect attendance numbers, which appeared to be the numbers that Zuffa announced.  Those numbers are often exaggerated, and the legit numbers are released by the athletic commissions.  In any case where I changed anything attendance-related, I made sure to include an inline link to the NSAC web site.  Actually, even on most of the pages, where the attendance was correct, I still added inline links to the NSAC web site on the pages that didn't have them before.  Also, a few of the pages had the info in the infobox on the right-side column, but not in the body text as well, so in those cases I added a brief sentence to the body text with the attendance and live gate figures.
The total combination of this is that I think the pages have a lot more business information in the body text, between the attendance numbers, live gate figures, fighter payrolls, and TV ratings for the Spike TV shows, and all of the aforementioned things have inline links to the appropriate places for more information.  
The only thing now is that I could have added the attendance and fighter payroll info for UFC 43 and UFC 44, but there have been no event pages created for those events.  I don't know anywhere near enough about Wikipedia to be able to create new pages and list the results and all of that, but if someone else does that stuff, then I could add in the fighter payroll and attendance info for those events.  As for UFC 40, UFC 41, and UFC 42, it might be good to create little pages for those events, but the only info I have for those events is the attendance and live gate for UFC 40.  --Ivantrembow 10:36, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  UFC attendance info, live gate info, fighter salary info 

message: Slowly making my way through all the UFC events using the template. Really just bare and bones, so any additional info on the pages is welecomed. Smoltz 07:34, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I updated the first few UFC's, made it through UFC 9 with pics and more details. Skeletor2112 06:35, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks a lot with the additional information. All I ask is that you format the pages into the match-by-match lising as seen in the later UFC pages. Just allows us to add even morei nformation. But yeah, thanks for all the new great info. Smoltz 03:57, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem - I was following the Wikipedia:WikiProject Mixed martial arts/Event pages format which says "If detailed match descriptions are not possible, a formatted table can be used." And since most of the old UFC's have no weight classes, and less is known about the detals of the fights - other than outcome, i.e. "Submission(armbar)" - I opted to use the table on some early ones.  If someone knows more detailed fight recaps, feel free to add them.  Skeletor2112 05:30, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I just say it for consistency's and convenience’s sake. If someone wanted to add more info it would be easier if the page we're already formatted for such situations. Also most of the other UFC events take on this format. Doesn't matter at this point, as creating the pages is the most important thing, but it's just creating more work later on. Smoltz 23:10, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I hear you, I have been updating the pages slowly but surely, and also re-watching all of those old events to add info, might take a while, but we will get every one up there! Skeletor2112 08:04, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early UFC pages 

message: We're starting to see quite a few links to fight videos being added, (by anonomous editors). I know the UFC has a strict policy of requesting all videos, even just featuring clips, are taken down.
Is it our policy to remove all video links unless we know for definite what the copywright status is? --- Trench 19:47, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: We have a policy that all video links that are copyright infringements should not be linked from WP, per WP:Copyrights#Linking to copyrighted works. Whether we should be so strict as to remove all links to videos, I'm not so sure we should pursue that, WP:Copyrights does say rank-and-file WPians should not be copyright status patrollers. I've personally have removed links to videos with highly questionable status, such as videos on YouTube of UFC/PRIDE broadcasts. Something like, say, Sean Gannon vs. Kimbo, I've let that slide. hateless 21:42, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

text: If a given fight is or will be commercially available in any form (PPV, DVD, TV, or anything else), then I think it's wrong to have a video link to it.  If it's a fight that is not and will not be commercially available in any form, then I think it's okay.  That's just my opinion.  --Ivantrembow 09:28, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Video links

message: It is listed fo deletion (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sakuraba versus the Gracies) on the grounds that its redundant with all its data already found on Kazushi Sakuraba and Royce Gracie, et al. I'll sit out and let others decide whether the storyline deserves its own article. hateless 19:36, 11 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Sakuraba versus the Gracies]] on AfD

message: I'm placing this article on AfD, because its a non-notable ranking system and website. The page creator has also been spamming various other MMA pages with links to his site. Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Top Fighter Standings and comment, thanks. hateless 19:24, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Top Fighter Standings]] on  AfD 

message: Was a decision ever reached about the subject of video links for MMA fights?  I maintain that Wikipedia should not be publishing links to videos of any fight that is, has been, or will be commercially available in any form (pay-per-view, DVD sales, paid Internet download, etc).  I think video links should only be posted for fights that have never been commercially released and/or fights where the event promoter/copyright holder specifically grants permission.  Otherwise, it's copyright infringement, regardless of how common it has become.
--Ivantrembow 07:44, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree 100% with this stance.    SubSeven 23:43, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thirded. We're not obligated to remove links the way we are obligated to remove inaccuracies, but I think its still the right thing to do in WP's interests. hateless 16:37, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Video links...? 

message: To help with editing fighter bios and for consistency's sake, I've created a template for external links to Sherdog fight finder. See Template talk:Sherdog to see how it works. hateless 22:47, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Template:Sherdog]] 

message: I'm starting to think so. In general, it does not seem like there is a need for records to be posted on WP bios and the inclusion of the bios are causing a few problems.
* Sherdog and FCFighter do a much better job at updating records than we do
* If records are already presented quite well on Sherdog, why bother presenting it here?
* Records are presented very inconsistently throughout WP and it's almost hopeless to convert all of them into one consistent layout.
* Record tables are so wide that it may interfere with infoboxe and causing overlapping tables or an ungodly amount of whitespace needs to be added to accommodate both tables.
* Boxing, the one sport most like MMA, do not have record tables for boxers on their bios.
I'd like to propose we do the following:
# Get rid of the MMA records section on all bios
# Consider adding a link to infoboxes that will link to the appropriate Sherdog or FCFighter records page
# Keep any accomplishments/awards/championships section, make sure succession tables are at the bottom of the article per WP convention
# Make sure the Sherdog link is included on each and every bio page. 
Any comments? hateless 07:37, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I see where you are coming from, not every fighter has one, and the overall inconsistancy of record boxes is a problem.  But I do find myself referencing them often - and having an easy, linkable database of who fought who where and when, and what happened is a very usefull tool, IMO.  I know Sherdog owns at fighter records, but aside from who won or lost, they give no real bio information about the fighter, or any kind of detail regarding the fights.  With the Fighter Bio record tables, it is easy to see who the fighter fought, what event they fought at (both hopefully with links to find more info on the opponent, or the match itself). It may become a problem with fighters like Jeremy Horn or Dan Severn, who have a crapload of fights, but in that case, it's easy to create a See ___'s record link (like discographies on band pages, such as Iron Maiden).  Maybe we need some kind of template, or infobox-style formatted record box, somthing official.  Skeletor2112 08:37, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

text: *I don't think we should avoid putting record tables in articles on the basis that the info is duplicated on Sherdog & elsewhere. As mentioned above we can't rely on Sherdog always being available. I agree there is a lot of work involved, this was also the case for the event pages, but I think it's worth the effort. After the event pages have been completed we could focus our efforts on the MMA record tables, maybe deciding on a final format for the tables. --- Trench 20:56, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

text: I think having tables on the page is more useful than just linking to Sherdog's records, since all the opponents' names, event names, etc. can be linked to their respective Wikipedia articles.  I end up making use of this quite a bit. SubSeven 08:01, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Are MMA records in bios useless? 

message: There's a category for boxers called :Category:World boxing champions. Should there be a similar category for MMA title holders, such as weight class champions in UFC and PRIDE? Shawnc 02:54, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category 

message: The "parent" Wikiproject Wikipedia:WikiProject_Martial_Arts appears to have ground to a halt - Any participants here want to get it rolling again (and up to the higher standard that you've developed here) ? -- Medains 09:02, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Wikipedia:WikiProject_Martial_Arts]] 

message: Has anyone seen the Danny Abbadi article? Seems it got speedy deleted, even though he would pass WP:BIO easily... hateless 04:30, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've left a message about this on the person who deleted the article's talk page asking for an explanation.  You can look at the deletion log of a page if you need to find this in the future. VegaDark 04:43, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for checking, it appears to be back up although without explanation. I'm guessing the deletion had to do with some angry comment on the talk page about Abbadi not deserving an article because he hasn't won a UFC match. I'll familiarize myself with the deletion log. hateless 16:49, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Danny Abaddi

message: We have some wonderful stubs about the weight classes in MMA and it would seem that they're not being correctly referenced.   I have noticed that on the main project page and in the fighter bio template, it simply says the weight class in double brackets, such as welterweight, when it should be welterweight (MMA) or, better still, welterweight.   I don't want to tread on toes and just change it so I thought I'd post here. Crazyknight 10:20, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just to note, per the style guide, MMA should be written out, so articles should be named something like Welterweight (mixed martial arts), and eventually they should be moved. Other than that, I wonder the value of having 7 or so weight class articles (which repeat alot of content, ie, weight class names varies between orgs and sanctioning bodies) when one all-encompassing article would work fine. hateless 18:31, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: A fair point.   However, while we have them, should we at least not use them? Crazyknight 09:26, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Weight class errors 

message: I created a Steve Mazzagatti bio and now some people are trying to delete it! I thought he would be part of this project? Dumbwhiteguy777 00:55, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, they deleted it. I still have the article in a text document. What should I do? Dumbwhiteguy777 00:55, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Help! 

message: As part of my growing hunger to do more (MORE, I TELL YE!) I have looked at Travis Fulton's page.   Now, this is a problem with other fighters such as Chris Lytle, who have both boxing and MMA records, but is there a combination info box?   I have tried to build one but I'm just cobbling together a templates in a somewhat haphazard way, not actually knowing what I'm doing and I don't even understand how to create a template because all the FAQs cover easy stuff like links.   Any help would be greatly appreciated.   If you feel I shouldn't do it and should go with two seperate boxes, fine.   Just please let me know. Crazyknight 00:12, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have created a template through cobbling together and blatant plagiarism and put it up at Template:Combinedfightingrecord, as I had no idea what to name it. Crazyknight 10:00, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Combination info boxes 

message: While the quickbio template is an excellent tool for creating quick, concise and informative pages, I've noticed that in the assessment stage they're getting rated as Start-class.   Is this due to a limitation in the template or the way that they're being used?   If it is the former, is there a set of improvement criteria so we can raise the quality of the articles?  Sorry for caning the talk page but I always seem to have questions. Crazyknight 12:58, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Start-class are for articles too large to be stub articles and not quite the close-to-Good quality articles that B-class articles are. Mostly, they are Start-class because of lack of substance, lack of sources, or are just badly-written. I don't think those faults are inherent to the template, although the template should go through a few reviews to see if it follow WP:MOS. I know certain items (ie, all-caps section headers, links in headers) I've corrected already, although I haven't really given it a through look-through.hateless 00:29, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Limitations of the quickbio template 

message: Hi guy's, I recently made my first wikipedia article.
K-1 HERO'S
What do you guys think? 
Oh yeah, hello! RobMasterFunk 01:57, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That's nice, you beat me to that article. Now we just need to link to it from K-1 and other MMA articles. Shawnc 10:47, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: My first wikipedia article! and hello!

message: I just made a Renato Verissimo article.  I've been editing wikipedia for a little while, but I've never made an article before, so I kinda faked a lot of it.  Also, I'm not sure how the project management notes what needs to be done and what is done, so basically, I'm asking if the article looks OK to you guys, and if not, what should I do differently if I make more? Gnfnrf 20:52, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Renato Verissimo 

message: hi, just created a userbox for UFC fans, tell me what you think †Bloodpack† 19:41, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: well? †Bloodpack† 21:10, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks good. VegaDark 21:53, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  UFC userbox 

message: I was reading Hateless' talk page and saw a discussion between him and Skeletor212 about collaborations.   We all go off and do our own thing, updating fighters we like or promotions in which we have an interest.   I do it myself, with Cage Rage or British fighters like Ian Freeman.   I absolutely don't want to pressgang or bully people into it but, personally, I'd think it'd be a great help if one of the more senior editors would lay down a plan for taking some of our better articles, such as the UFC article or the flagship MMA article, to good/featured article status.   It seems that throughout this project's existance, it has been considered a priority to do this but it hasn't been done.   I'd be willing to do extensive editing to help, as I think I've shown with my task of cleaning up the references on the PRIDE article.   Let's face it, we'd all be happy when one day you go to the Wikipedia front page and see an MMA article that was gotten to FA status by us. -- Crazyknight 11:56, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sounds like a good idea.  We would have to leave messages at all the members' talk pages about the collaboration.  I'd personally like to get Randy Couture to GA status, I don't know if anyone else wants to add in their recommendations on what we should collaborate on first though. VegaDark 18:39, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I like the idea, seems if we could marshal some force behind one article we can bring more depth rather than the wide breadth we have right now. I can see we may need a benevolent dictator coordinator to work on this subproject, someone who would accept nominations for the "featured" page and decide which one would be it for the month. That person will also probably be the one to leave messages on individual member pages, although I can see a small team could help in that work. And by no means am I nominating myself for this position, I don't know if I have the time to do that kind of work right now unfortunately (although I'll continue to edit as I do presently). hateless 20:58, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It occurs to me that a responsible editor would be required for a page to get it into the same voice.   Reading some pages, they're a mess.   "...an almost similar style of fighting to UFC"?   What was the "writer" saying about PRIDE in that sentence?  Absolutely nothing and this is why it was edited away.   Herein lies the problem with Wikipedia; a simple sentence is bastardised by anonymous meddlers, so, in a way, it almost feels like we shouldn't even bother.   However, undeterred, I would say we could make a simple start.   Would it just be possible to throw a section up on the main project page?   "MMA Collaboration of the Month", get people to go to the talk page of the relevant article, set up a to-do list and just get on with it section-by-section?   If everybody is responsible, properly sources things and writes clearly and concisely then there would be less work for the editor.   However, still, I feel on said to-do list, somebody with some amount of experience would need to lay down a template we should follow to get the sections up to scratch.   As has been said, it's quality of writing and sources.   So, we could put the section on the project page, put a group of nominees for expansion and then get on with it. -- Crazyknight 15:55, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Stolen shamelessly from Wikipedia:WikiProject Football, I have put an Article Improvement Drive together.   It's now on the project to-do list.   Put any nominees for improvement on the article and lets get it started.   Once a nominee is chosen, I'll put together a collaboration page and we can get started. -- Crazyknight 15:19, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks good.  now we need to alert all the members...guess I nominated myself. VegaDark 21:18, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done, notified everyone except Crazyknight (who obviously knows about it :) ) VegaDark 21:54, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Tremendous.   Thanks to you and Hateless for your help in this matter. -- Crazyknight 22:42, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

text: Sounds like a great idea guys, lets get some of these articles elevated!  I just went through the trenches getting Megadeth up to FA status, so I have a good idea what is needed.  One of the most important aspects (aside from well written, compelling prose) is inline citations.  Everything needs to be easily verifable, and with the rise of MMA (and MMA news stories) in the past few years, it shouldn't be too hard.   Skeletor2112 05:12, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Good Article status for our top articles 

message: I am not the best article writer not even a ok one but I do know how to edit. Haven't done much yet with username did so before under my works IP. Anyway Shonie's page is due for updating. The show is finished and it doesn't even show what happened on his own page. Would one you who is more eloquent please update his page from the show. --Xiahou 02:52, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done.  Also covered Mikey Burnett while I was at it. Gnfnrf 03:15, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

text: Thank you sir --Xiahou 01:06, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shonie Carter page 

message: Should we begin to archive some of the old stuff on the main project page?  I trimmed down the "To-do" list, as a lot of that stuff was from June 2006, and had been completed.  I made the list into more of a general list of tasks, as opposed to a mini talk page, which it was.  Also, what should we do with old stuff from the "ongoing work" and "completed work" sections?  Maybe we could use a "Articles improved by this project" subpage, or somehwere that we can begin to archive some of this old stuff.  Skeletor2112 12:16, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Archiving main page work

message: With just a little help the List of UFC events could get up to featured list status. I have requested a peer review that can be viewed here: Wikipedia:Peer review/List of UFC events/archive1. The lead needs to be longer, but I'm not sure what could be added to it.
*Just from looking at the other featured lists, a couple of things I think need to be included (which I might do myself, time permitting), to be a featured list:
**First and Upcoming dates of the events
**Mention the move from Tourney style (UFCs 1-10?) to set fight cards 
**What is available is tape and what isn't from the UFC website
**Photo as suggested
**Move the note
**Total Number of events listed
Smoltz 04:19, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: List of UFC events

message: The first collaboration has been selected, the flagship article Mixed martial arts.   Please head over to the article's talk page and contribute to the to-do list so we can raise standards.   Also, nominate for the next article.   Adopting a general rule from other collaborative efforts, articles with fewer than 3 nominations are barred from being renominated immediately.   Sorry Randy Couture and Joachim Hansen fans, they didn't pull enough votes in but you can try again next time. -- Crazyknight 22:35, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article improvement drive 

message: There are a number of photos from UFC Fight Night 7 at this page. They're all in the public domain because they are the work of a US Government employee. If anyone is looking for free photos to add to an article this might be a good place to look. I've already added on to the Karo Parisyan article. Lewis 23:31, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Wow, very good find.  I've uploaded :Image:UFC-Octagon-USMCPhoto.jpg and will look through the rest to see what else we can use.  VegaDark 00:22, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok, I've now added :Image:ShonieCarter-WeighIn-USMCPhoto.jpg, :Image:JoeRogan-USMCPhoto-Cropped.PNG. :Image:DanaWhite-USMCPhoto-Cropped.PNG, and :Image:ShonieCarter-USMCPhoto-Cropped.png.  There are a few more of Dean Lister, Mike Swick, and Diego Sanchez that could probably be cropped and used as well if anyone else wants to bother.  I might add them later if nobody else has. VegaDark 01:29, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Anything usable for the mixed martial arts page? i.e. pictures to fill in gaps like standup fighting or clinching techniques? -- Crazyknight 01:43, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  For standup, try .  For clinching, try , unless you want a striking clinch, not a takedown clinch, in which case I didn't see a good image. Gnfnrf 03:56, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  UFC Fight Night 7 Photos 

message: Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 19:26, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wikipedia Day Awards 

message: Should the two/three grand prix events that PRIDE holds per year be collapsed into one page (per year)? For all intents and purposes, they are more like three parts of one larger event than three separate events. Right now it seems as if there isn't a good reason for the tournament brackets to be on the Finals events instead of all of the pages, other than because it's redundant, even though each event has as much claim to the bracket as any. IE, if we were to discuss the 2000 GP DVD box set, it would make more sense to discuss it on a 2000 PRIDE Grand Prix page than on one of the other ones. I don't think there's any policy involved here, it just makes more intuitive sense for me.
In the same vein, if we do have IFL event pages, they should probably be all aggregated into a season overview page rather than individual pages. hateless 20:34, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: For Pride Grand Prix events I agree that a single page makes more sense.  For the IFL, I'm not sure.  I'd template it off of how other team sports are done. Gnfnrf 04:13, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  PRIDE Grand Prix events 

message: In MMA, arm reach has become increasingly relevant as the value of striking has been established. Why isn't it recorded in the Statbox? It's more of a constant than many other stats. The only question is how to select a standard for measurement, but I think wingspan from fingertip to fingertip is reasonable, since many MMA events publish that information. Hexrei 09:00, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The problem is, while many events do list reach in their tales of the tape, I've never seen it defined in the event.  We would be guessing if we assume that different events are measuring it in the same way.  Also, I don't know of any easily verifiable source that offers comprehensive reach data.  Gnfnrf 16:40, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Statbox: Reach? 

message: I'm having a discussion with User:68.159.17.189 about the appropriateness of using ivansblog.com links as source attributions, despite the discussion on this page above. If anyone could, please check out the debate here and comment. I can personally live with any resolution as long as a real consensus is reached. hateless 00:21, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Appropriateness of ivansblog.com links 

message: Dose anyone know where on the site this info about notable judoka was added from? If so can it be referenced because it's like an advert at the moment. --Nate1481 14:41, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The rankings are from MMAWeekly (here), but I don't believe MMAWeekly has any fighter background info on their site outside of the occasional feature article. I'm sure the list can be referenced (ie, Parisyan and Yoshida are very well known in MMA circles for being judo practitioners and use those techniques regularly in MMA competition), but not via MMAWeekly. hateless 17:41, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  MMA weekly.com ref in [[Judo]] 

message: There has been some debate as to which events should be included at the List of PRIDE events. Please see the talk page there for details. Lewis 06:58, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  List of PRIDE events conflict 

message: Jon Fitch has been nominated for deletion, if you have an opinion please comment at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jon Fitch. Thanks. hateless 19:32, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Jon Fitch]] on AfD 

message: The fight record of Matt Hughes keeps being changed around by different editors.  Sherdog says 40 wins, UFC.com says 41 wins, and his personal webpage says his record is 42-5 but only accounts for 40 of his 42 wins. I've explained my reasoning of why I think we should use Sherdog's record at Talk:Matt Hughes (fighter), and if we can come to a consensus on this it would be nice so people don't keep changing his record. VegaDark 22:10, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Matt Hughes fight record

message: They have Koschecks weight class as middle weight and it states that TUF #1 was LHW and MW when it was LHW and WW (welterweight)170 lbs —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 198.53.128.199 (talk) 18:07, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Koscheck weight class error  

message: Some here may or may not be interested in this.  The Kimbo Slice article is up for deletion: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kimbo Slice (2nd nomination) SubSeven 07:50, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Kimbo Slice]] AFD 

message: I nominated UFC for a peer review here, just for kicks and to see what holes are left in the article. It seems to me that this article among those in our scope is furthest along in the journey to FA status, so it might be time to patch up the holes in the article and see if we can send it to the main page. hateless 01:23, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Peer review for [[Ultimate Fighting Championship]]

message: Almost every article I read about MMA fighters or professional wrestlers have problems with neutrality. Phrases like "devastating kick", "humiliating loss", "dominated the first round", "thoroughly dominated the fight", "vicious high kick",  etc. are numerous, and rarely come with an attribution to a reliable source. This should be something we look out for and correct on sight so that we can improve the quality of these articles. Sancho (talk) 23:38, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neutrality 

message: I have spent a lot of time getting most of the IFL fighters a wiki page.  I don't have a lot of wiki experience so some might have some flaws.  If there are any other IFL fans out there i'd appreciate the help, thanks. Themmachamp 20:59, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: International Fight League

message: I recently added Frank Mir's WP page for an assessment and I noticed that someone added Evan Tanner to that list as well, the only problem is that the request for Tanner's page was added back in December and still hasn't been assessed. So my question is, do the pages on the list ever get assessed?
Thanks
Takedashingen620 06:31, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi Takedashingen620, do you want to start a push with me to assess and improve a bunch of these articles? I'm a bit busy with school for the next week, but I'd be up for getting this project going. There's lots of room for obvious improvements in this project. I can review the Frank Mir article next weekend. Sancho 07:03, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have assessed a decent amount of fighter bios and usually do when I notice they are unassessed, but I haven't for a while.  I can help out doing some more. VegaDark 10:59, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Requests for assessments

message: Discussion: Talk:Mirko_Filipovi%C4%87#External_link_to_discussion_forum_and_Youtube_video. I thought I'd be on a Wikipedia:Wikibreak this week :-) Oh well, I'll still try. Sancho 08:50, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please join this discussion at the Mirko page 

message: Why the Combat Sambo fights are not into MMA personal fight records, see Fedor Emelianenko for example. Combat sambo championships are very popular in many countries around the world and there are many famous participant from the MMA-world. The rules are purely MMA, there are strikes stand up, ground-and-pound, submissions and all what we need to add the combat sambo in the MMAs. I think that is hybrid style or MMA (particularly the combat sambo) judging of the sambo's history. See what is the Sambo too. ProfMA 16:28, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Consensus has been to base fighter's professional MMA records on reliable websites such as Full Contact Fighter fight database and Sherdog's Fightfinder.  I don't know of a consistant and reliable database which contains Combat Sambo fights (and even if there was one, I imagine most Combat Sambo is amateur, not professional, in nature.)  If you do know of one, please post about it here so we can discuss it. Gnfnrf 20:01, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Combat Sambo 

message: See Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard#User:Burntsauce for a discussion concerning an editor removing un-sourced information from pro-wresting articles. The consensus seems to be that this is an improvement. It is also a reminder that WP:BLP requires us to remove unsourced material from a biography of a living person. A quote from that policy: "Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material — whether negative, positive, or just highly questionable — about living persons should be removed immediately and without discussion from Wikipedia articles, talk pages, user pages, and project space." Let's really focus on this (improving sourcing) when reviewing and browsing MMA articles. Sancho 03:20, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  A nice wake-up call. 

message: Are these really necessary? I mean, under the category section, there are the same links. I don't even use the See also section, I use the categories at the bottom of the page. So I ask, are these See also sections really necessary? (MgTurtle 17:10, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've seen your recent changes to a bunch of the articles. I like the change... less redundancy, more standard. Sancho 18:50, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  See also Section 

message: Does anyone have an opinion on the IFL fighters' records? Should the results have links to them? Such as * Bart Palaszewski (6-1) (LW) def John Gunderson by decision (split) (04/07/07)like this format or like Bart Palaszewski (6-1) (LW) def John Gunderson by decision (split) (04/07/07)this format? Understand the difference? I don't know how to put into words.Sorry. (MgTurtle 17:49, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I like the version with links. Unless it's a red link to an article about fighter that you can reasonably expect to not have an article any time soon. Sancho 18:50, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  IFL 

message: Many fighters don't have their MMA records on their pages or they don't have the full record. Vernon White needs his record on his page and Jeremy Horn's record doesn't include some of his earlier fights. Can we do something about this? (MgTurtle 16:51, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have my concerns about fighter records being necessary (see above), I still don't think having a complete table of records is necessary nor allowable per WP:NOT#IINFO. I would ignore Jeremy Horn's record, maybe place a disclaimer about notable fights. hateless 16:59, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

text: I think having the fighters' full fight records is extremely important information to include, as long as it is sourced. VegaDark (talk) 06:49, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

text: The color is great. Subtle, but informative. Sancho 21:18, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  MMA Records 

message: I have requested that the article David L. Abbott be moved to Tank Abbott. Vote and / or discuss here. McPhail 18:01, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Proposed move 

message: New created & shiny needs a little filling out & will need maintenance. --Nate1481(talk/contribs) 15:32, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Portal:Martial arts]] 

message: How do I join and help? Send a msg please.
MMAfan2007 18:07, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Just add your name to the list of participants at the project page, and add this page to your watch list. Then start helping out :-) Sancho 18:17, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  How do I join? 

message: Hey all, make sure to put this page on your watchlists Wikipedia:WikiProject_Mixed_martial_arts/Article_improvement_drive to help coordinate project collaboration in specific article improvement. That page was quite out of date as of this morning, so I wrapped up some old discussions and made a new nomination for an article improvement drive. Let's try to select one every week. I think this page might have gone out of use since the page might not be on all of our watchlists, but it's a good thing to have. Sancho 18:55, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article improvement drive 

message: Can someone view the discussion section of UFC 74? I left a question there. It will only take 60 seconds.
MMAfan2007 18:57, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Done Sancho 19:07, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  UFC 74...help 

message: What are the thoughts on this idea... for each week long improvement drive (Wikipedia:WikiProject_Mixed_martial_arts/Article_improvement_drive), we choose a most valuable contributor and award some token that they can display at their user page. I still have to think of what kind of award we could give out. There are a bunch of examples at Wikipedia:Wikiproject_awards that other awards are using. Suggestions please :-) Sancho 04:53, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Most valuable contributor award