Talk:Guantanamo military commission

message: The section of the article I just tagged is pretty terrible. It is basically a soapbox for lashing the procedures that would have been used in these commissions. It needs to be dramatically rewritten to:
#Not be a list of bullet points
#Contain inline citations for each claim that is made
#Get read of the weasel words like "Other elements that may have compromised the fairness of the commissions are"...
#Substantiate that those features render it not a court martial by referring somewhere that says that courts martial have each and all of those features.
The lead of the article also needs to be a considerable amount better than an uncited quote from something the ABA released once. -Splash - tk 15:43, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  {verify} 

message: Is there any info on the burden and standard of proof the commission will use in reaching its verdicts (innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt?), including presumptions of fact that may be made on the evidence?--Shtove 14:16, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Here's a reference to these matters  on the official website - it's under the date 23 Feb 04.--Shtove 14:55, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reaching verdicts 

message: There are a couple of rewrites needed.
===Military tribunal===
I left a note on Talk:Military tribunal.
Military tribunal has, in recent months, become almost entirely about the Guantanamo military commissions, giving short shrift to military tribunals in general.
===personalities===
This article needs a rewrite too.  
Too much of the article is about the people involved.  Particularly since there are going to be more detainees charged.  This material should be spun off into a separate article.  Ditto with the lawyers.
===Guantanamo military commissions versions 1.0, 2.0, 3.0===
The Bush administration is working on version 3.0.
version 1.0 had 6 commission members, and a chief prosecutor who told the other prosecutors that the commission members had been particularly chosen because they were sure to convict, no matter what.
He also told prosecutors not to worry, but all the evidence that might suggest the suspects were innocent would be classified as secret, so the suspect's defense team wouldn't get access to it.
When the memos from the three prosecutors who wanted to quit were leaked, the chief prosecutor was fired, and allowed to quietly retire from the military.  The number of commission members was reduced, and the role of the commission president was rewritten, from first among equals, to a non-voting judge.  That was version 2.0
Now we are working on version 3.0.  The wikipedia's coverage of the Guantanamo military commissions should, IMO, make this clear.
Cheers!  --  Geo Swan 12:32, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rewrite needed 

message: The Bush administration is working on version 3.0.
version 1.0 had 6 commission members, and a chief prosecutor who told the other prosecutors that the commission members had been particularly chosen because they were sure to convict, no matter what.
He also told prosecutors not to worry, but all the evidence that might suggest the suspects were innocent would be classified as secret, so the suspect's defense team wouldn't get access to it.
When the memos from the three prosecutors who wanted to quit were leaked, the chief prosecutor was fired, and allowed to quietly retire from the military.  The number of commission members was reduced, and the role of the commission president was rewritten, from first among equals, to a non-voting judge.  That was version 2.0
Now we are working on version 3.0.  The wikipedia's coverage of the Guantanamo military commissions should, IMO, make this clear.
Cheers!  --  Geo Swan 12:32, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Guantanamo military commissions versions 1.0, 2.0, 3.0

message: Can we please get this verified?
* The lawyers who have been approved report being unable to see their clients for over six months because the Department of Defense was playing games over providing translators.  The lawyers had to provide their own translators.  They weren't allowed to use DoD translators.  The lawyers had to get their translators approved by the DoD.  And they reported that the DoD kept telling them that they couldn't clear any of translators they were proposing.
* Detainees lawyers have reported that Military Intelligence had been conducting charades where MI officers represented themselves as the detainee's lawyers.
* Detainees lawyers have reported that the detainee's interrogators and guards had been warning the detainees they couldn't trust their lawyers because they were all Jews.
I'm no fan of the absurd and unjust "trials", but that doesn't mean I particularly like "facts" that just muddy the waters. Provide a source or don't add it to the article. cf WP:NOR and WP:V. - Ta bu shi da yu 01:36, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unsourced material 

message: Where/how can Col. Kohlmann's 2002, Naval War College paper on the Guantanamo Military Tribunal process be accessed?
Please see: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/13/us/13gitmo.html
Thank you for any research assistance you may provide.
P.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Prevenient (talk • contribs) 19:56, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Research: Col. R H Kohlmann, USMC -- Chief Judge, Military Commissionsl Guantanamo Naval Base 

message: I was updating Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and related articles in preparation for a possible ITN item about their guilty plea, and noticed that Mohammed and the four other indicted men (Ramzi Binalshibh, Mustafa Ahmad al-Hawsawi, Ali Abd al-Aziz Ali and Walid Bin Attash) aren't listed at Guantanamo military commission#The accused.  Is there a reason for this?  Are they being tried under a different system?  If so, do we have an article about it? —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:01, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, et al. 

message: I think this article is currently too long, and tries to talk about too many things.
I think it should be forked.  
===Individuals who faced charges before Guantanamo military commissions?===
This is one portion of this article that could be forked, leaving a smaller, more focussed article.
===Officers presiding over military commissions?===
The section on commission members is too difficult to complete.  Initially the names of all the commission members were to be unpublished.
But, during the commission version 1.0, when the commission members were being challenged for bias, all their names came out.  
But I haven't seen any of their names published since the first batch.
===Commission version 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0===
There have been three versions of the military commissions.  There were some changes between the Presidentially authorized military commissions cancelled in 2006, and the Congressionally authorized military commission described in the Military Commissions Act.
But the changes that followed the mass resignation of Prosecutors in 2004, during Fred Borch's period as chief prosecutor.  I think of those as military commission 1.0.  In version 2.0 and 3.0 the Presiding officers role is very similar to those of a judge in a conventional court.  And the role of the commission members is very similar to  that of a jury.  But in version 1.0 the Presiding officer, while he or she was the most senior officer, and was the only lawyer, was a full voting member.  And there were twice as many commission members.  Geo Swan (talk) 02:15, 17 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Forking?

message: There have been three versions of the military commissions.  There were some changes between the Presidentially authorized military commissions cancelled in 2006, and the Congressionally authorized military commission described in the Military Commissions Act.
But the changes that followed the mass resignation of Prosecutors in 2004, during Fred Borch's period as chief prosecutor.  I think of those as military commission 1.0.  In version 2.0 and 3.0 the Presiding officers role is very similar to those of a judge in a conventional court.  And the role of the commission members is very similar to  that of a jury.  But in version 1.0 the Presiding officer, while he or she was the most senior officer, and was the only lawyer, was a full voting member.  And there were twice as many commission members.  Geo Swan (talk) 02:15, 17 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Commission version 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0

message: There has been no response, one way or the other, to my suggestion.  So I am going to go ahead and fork off an article on just the individuals who faced charges.  Geo Swan (talk) 21:56, 13 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: No response

message: I know there has been no discussion on this for the past year, but this article should redirect to Office of Military Commissions.  There is no legal entity known as the "Guantanamo Military Commission."  (http://www.defense.gov/news/commissions.html)  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paratrooper450 (talk • contribs) 14:48, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Redirecting? 

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message: New declassified document describing CIA, Saudi government, and FBI involvement.
https://web.archive.org/web/20230415095116/https://www.floridabulldog.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Canestraro-Declaration-dated-20-July-2021.pdf
https://twitter.com/LPMisesCaucus/status/1648262213214392320?s=20
https://www.spytalk.co/p/exclusive-fbi-agents-accuse-cia-of?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email SirDoomsdayBro (talk) 15:00, 22 April 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  New source: 2016 declassified document