Talk:Pandura

message: Well, we don't have to worry about cleaning up the "Macedonia" section (see previous "Cleanup" discussion). It was copied from here and so I've removed it from the article. The same editor who included this text also added numerous possibly unfree images to the article. -- Gyrofrog  (talk) 21:37, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The Turkish section was copied from here and I've removed the text. While it's a government website, it has a copyright notice, and I'm not sure whether works of the Gov't of Turkey are in the public domain. -- Gyrofrog  (talk) 21:52, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

text: The "Body of Tambur" section was copied from here and I've removed the text. For that matter, the website in question credits someone else for the text. -- Gyrofrog  (talk) 22:01, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyright violations 

message: This whole article is wrong. The Tanbour, Tanbur, Tambur is Persian/Kurdish (middle east) and the "Pandoura" is ancient Greek. I have played the Tanbur for 20 years and do not believe there is any person alive who plays the ancient Greek Pandoura (at least for the past 2000 years). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Johnyajohn (talk • contribs) 20:25, September 19, 2006
: Can you please provide some references for this claim, per the policy of Wikipedia:Verifiability? --Elonka 19:59, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Pandura (Pantur) is not greek. It is sumerian. Look it up. Greeks even claim that the bouzouki and the saz originated in greece while there is plenty of evidence that turks/mongols played and still play these instruments in central asia/mongolia before they even entered anatolia. Ibrahim4048 (talk) 09:30, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pandoura is ancient greek, not Persian. 

message: As an encyclopaedia it would seem appropriate to distinguish between things which, though bear the same name, are essentially different things serving different purposes. In the case of the Tanpura, I see absolutely no reason why the Indian version (which is arguably the most famous of all versions) is not only cited at the bottom of the page, but is also not given its own page to fully explore not only the physical parameters of the instrument itself, but perhaps more importantly, its role in the composition, and in the education of up-and-coming artists who, play it on stage to gain stage experience and assist the master. There is a lot of potentially valuable cultural and sociological data which is missing here and need inputting by an expert in the field.218.219.228.234 07:49, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Point of clarity 

message: Again I undertook some extensions and intended clarifications. Tell me if I'm cramming to much info in it.
cordially, (Martinuddin 16:50, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  section on Tanpura (tambura) Indian Classical Music 

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thread_title: File:Music lesson Staatliche Antikensammlungen 2421.jpg Nominated for Deletion

message: , Mauricio Molina's book Frame Drums in the Medieval Iberian Peninsula says "While it is also possible that the term pandero derived from the latin adjective pandus (curved, bent), the most current theory based on phonetic development from Latin to Spanish sustains that the word pandero comes instead from pandura pandorius. It also has been explained that the term pandura itself derived from the Sumarian pandur or pardur (little bow), which suggests that the pandura was an instrument that evolved from some kind of musical bow.  However, these words are never used in the Sumerian literature in connection with musical instruments. See H G Farmer. "An Early Greek Pandore," in The Science of Music in Islam. ed Eckhard Neubauer (Frankfurt Institute for the History of Arabic-Islamic Science at Johann Wolfgang Goethe University. 1997), 2/301. Organologists have commonly identified the pandura as a kind of Greco-Roman lute. Their conjecture is based on the description by Pollux of Naucratis (second century A. D) of the instrument as a trichordon (instrument of three strings) The pandura is rarely found in Greco-Roman literature or musical iconography. It was comprised of a long, thick fingerboard and a small resonating body. Representations in late Roman sarcophagi indicate that the instrument had three strings or more and was plucked with either fingers or a plectrum, It is also important to take into consideration that both Marcianus Capella and Isidore of Seville identify the pandorius with a wind instrument made out of cane. Isidore, quoting Virgil (Eel. 2.321, further ascribes the instrument's invention to the god Pan. and" Dougweller (talk) 17:49, 1 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: What does "these words are never used in the Sumerian literature in connection with musical instruments" mean? 173.89.236.187 (talk) 05:09, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Not Sumerian 

message: *http://www.photographersdirect.com/buyers/stockphoto.asp?imageid=2793476
*http://www.biblelandpictures.com/gallery/gallery.asp?action=viewimage&categoryid=62&text=&imageid=14159&box=&shownew=
*http://www.photographersdirect.com/buyers/stockphoto.asp?imageid=2793477
:File:Sumerian pandura.png is clearly from  although it's interesting that it is called there a harp. Your rename is clearly original research. I note that 3 of the files you uploaded there have been deleted, one of them as recently as the end of November. Dougweller (talk) 17:04, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Note that I only wrote the bit starting "Noting that", which Samizambak transferred here from their talk page. Dougweller (talk) 16:31, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

text: No one is denying these exist, but your first link is to someone's personal website which we would not use as a source. Dougweller (talk) 16:26, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Harp]] or [[Pandura]] ? 

message: *http://www.zwoje-scrolls.com/zwoje35/text11.htm
*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyres_of_Ur  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Samizambak (talk • contribs) 10:01, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: No one is denying these exist, but your first link is to someone's personal website which we would not use as a source. Dougweller (talk) 16:26, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Real Sumerian harp

message: *https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/MandoraSamizambak (talk) 16:16, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mandora 

message: https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bandurria_(instrumento_musical)Samizambak (talk) 16:18, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bandurria 

message: http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/25222335?uid=3739192&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=21103217785137  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Samizambak (talk • contribs) 16:34, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Which says "it has been surmised" but then dismisses the surmise by saying "no such words have come down to us in Sumcrian which actually indicate an instrument of music." Dougweller (talk) 17:08, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pandura 

message: *http://www.photographersdirect.com/buyers/stockphoto.asp?imageid=2793476
*http://www.biblelandpictures.com/gallery/gallery.asp?action=viewimage&categoryid=62&text=&imageid=14159&box=&shownew=
*http://www.photographersdirect.com/buyers/stockphoto.asp?imageid=2793477
What is the name of this musical instrument? Samizambak (talk) 17:13, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Please don't post to my talk page and here. We can only say what its modern equivalent is called unless there is an inscription on the sculpture naming it or a clear textual description elsewhere naming it. As there doesn't seem to be, we will probably never know what the musician called it. As the source you provided above says, there aren't any known Sumerian words describing musical instruments. Which is why we can't say pandura is the Sumerian word for a musical instrument. Dougweller (talk) 18:38, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

text: Then you need to cite a source to that effect. Otherwise, it's original research. -- Gyrofrog  (talk) 20:01, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: And they are not qualified to say what the Sumerian word is. How many times do I have to tell you? I note that you still haven't gone to WP:RSN to ask. You need specialists in Sumerian, not a "Jack of all Sound and Interaction, amateur whale watcher, dilettante rhythmanalyst. Copenhagen, Denmark." or a professor of acoustics with an academic background in electrical engineering. Dougweller (talk) 21:36, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Harp]],Gudi,[[Pandura]] ? 

message: SintirSamizambak (talk) 09:16, 11 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Guembri (Sintir) 

message: Francis W. Galpin's work, you can get information about the Sumerian Pandur.Samizambak (talk) 23:17, 29 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Francis W. Galpin  

message: I am concerned that the instrument in the image thumb is being labeled a pandura. While the pandura certainly predates this artwork and (this being from an area conquered by Alexander the Great) could be ancestral, many of the images of panduras we have show a long necked instrument of about a yard length. The instrument in this picture has almost no neck (in the same way that the oud has almost no neck). Should this be labeled pandura? I have been careful when using the image in the history of lutes not to name it.Jacqke (talk) 03:34, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  File:Indo-GreekBanquet.JPG 

message: I have wanted to submit these images to wikipedia for this article but don't own them and am unable to go to the museums where they are stored. I am submitting a link to this set of images for researchers of this article. The determination to call these panduras is entirely my own. Set of pandura images. Jacqke (talk) 04:06, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  photos of pandura not on wikipedia