Talk:Kiel mutiny

message: This page contains some errors; see November Revolution, chapter sailor's revolt: the mutineers were not carried to Kiel, the number of killed is not correct, Steinhäuser survived, the firts soldier's council was not formed by the III. squadron, the prisoners were released by the gouvernor... --Kuhl-k 22:20, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I suggest that this article is deleted, because the events are already covered by the november revolution article. --Kuhl-k 22:24, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

text: It was not until today that I realized that you like to keep this article. So I added two important scientific references on which I also based my remarks above and those parts which I wrote for the "German revolution". Kuhl-k (talk) 19:00, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

text: If you want to go down to very prime cause you have to look far beyond that. Just have a look at this part of a lecture from Hans-Rudolf Boehmer (Viceadmiral rtd., German navy inspector 1995-1998):    "Imagine the imperial navy officers, mainly being of bourgeois origin, had recollected the liberal, national disposition of their fathers from 1848 and had put themselves at the forefront of the sailors' mutiny in Kiel - an Admiral had proclaimed the republic and carried away the German bourgeoisie - maybe German history had by that time starting from Kiel taken a more fortunate course. But exactly this is unimaginable, because with the foundation of the Empire Bismarck had once and for all dishearten the German bourgeoisie, or as Graf von Krockow puts it in his biography about his peer Bismarck: 'It was not until Bismarck that he had stolen the nation, so to say as a thief of format, from the encampement of civil liberty and carried it over to the conservative adverse encampement.' Since the foundation of the Empire national attitude has been equalled to Kaisertreue (loyalty for the Emperor). Thus Kiel's most important contribution to German history, the outbreak of the 1918 revolution will be viewed here at the Niemannsweg [street in the former officers' town quarter in Kiel, KK] until today as an embarrasment rather than as a necessary decisive turning point of German history." From: Hans-Rudolf Boehmer: "Kiel und die Marine", lecture at the RC-Kiel, May 2005 Kuhl-k (talk) 19:08, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

text: "During the night from 28 to 30 October 1918..." That must have been a long night, lasting three days! It should be "29 to 30 October". TDKehoe (talk) 18:34, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

text: The Background -- morale section starts "Following the Battle of Juttingland in 1918"; Is this meant to be a reference to the very famous Battle of Jutland. That happened in 1916 (and does have a page in Wikipedia). But I can find no reference to Juttingland - even as a  place name. This is an area where I have no expertise and I may well be missing something.  alacarte (talk) 13:55, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Errors 

message: In Wilhelmshaven we had a "pure" mutiny of soldiers without any attempt to gain power. In Kiel, where there was a large number of workers, (Wilhelmshaven did ot have such a number of workers) we had a rebellion. The soldiers were supported by the workers and both took over the military and political power in Kiel. They also initiated the council movement (14 items of Kiel, were taken as an example by many councils).
Parsecboy deleted text which is supplied by the German Bundesarchiv together with the photo. The full text reads:
Description: Zentralbild/IML Novemberrevolution in Deutschland, Mit dem Aufstand der Matrosen und Arbeiter am 3.11.1918 in Kiel beginnt die November-revolution. Am 6. November greift die revolutionäre Bewegung auf Wilhelmshaven über. UBz. den Soldatenrat des Linienschiffes "Prinzregent Luitpold" (Our photo shows the soldiers council of the "Prinzregent Luitpold"). Extra information: Matrosen vom Linienschiff "Prinzregent Luitpold" an Deck des Schiffes mit Tafel "Soldatenrat Kriegsschiff Prinzregent Luitpold. Es lebe die sozialistische Republik"
The photo shows the soldiers' council of the "Prinzregent Luitpold" possibly in Kiel. We should not delete the text but could probably transfer the photo to the paragraphs regarding Kiel. --Kuhl-k (talk) 11:53, 8 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  uhh, it started in Wilhelmshaven, not Kiel 

message: In the discussion below we had two contributors opting for 'revolt' instead of 'mutiny'; two resources were given that Kiel experienced a revolt rather than a mutiny (one of them: wikipedia German Revolution of 1918–19 -> chapter 'Sailors' revolt, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Revolution_of_1918%E2%80%9319#Sailors.27_revolt
There was one contributor opting for Kiel mutiny, WHY was this minority vote followed without giving any reasons? --31.16.202.124 (talk) 18:35, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: In short: because "Sailors' revolt in Kiel" is horribly awkward. The primary concern of the nominator (and those participating in the discussion) was the fact that the events at Wilhelmshaven were not as important as those in Kiel, and having "Wilhelmshaven" in the title was strange or even idiosyncratic. "Kiel mutiny" is the most common name for this subject in English, and infinitely more succinct than "Sailors' revolt in Kiel," which almost sounds like a machine translation of "Kiel mutiny." I made an executive decision (there's a massive backlog at WP:RM these days) and moved the article accordingly. If you have a problem with this move, you are free to start another Wikipedia:Requested move entry. --Hadal (talk) 08:16, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sailors' revolt in Kiel vs. Kiel mutiny 

message: I want to delete the text "At the outbreak .... to ... oncoming transport." and replace it by a new one. The former text was based on literature from the 1930s. Especially the book written by Erich Czech-Jochberg: Die Politiker der Republik (1933) cannot be seen as a genuine scientific source. He doesn't use any verifiable source in his book but praises Hitler as the saviour of Germany. There is scientifically sound new literature available (Dirk Dähnhardt: Revolution in Kiel, 1978), which is based on research in the German military archive (espaecially pages 67, 74, 82 ff.). --Kuhl-k (talk) 10:15, 14 March 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources from the 1930s 

message: I've gone over the article and improved some phrasing issues, nothing major. As such I don't see the need for a big copyediting banner at the head of the article anymore.
--Doncurzio (talk) 18:30, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed copyediting banner