Talk:Bucentaur

message: Hi, help would be much appreciated in translating the following Italian and Latin terms in the article "Bucentaur" into English:
===Italian===
*"La Nuova regia su l'acque nel Bucintoro nuovamente cretto all'annua solenne funzione del giorno dell'Ascensione di Nostro Signore" (book title).
::Are You sure about the word "cretto", wich in Italian does not exist? Perhaps "creato" or "eretto" could have a sense.82.89.204.1 (talk) 13:48, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the British Library online catalogue, that's how the word is spelt. The book is an 18th-century work – could cretto be an old-fashioned Italian word no longer used today? If not, what would the English translation of the book title be if the word was creato or eretto? — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 18:30, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

text: Jacklee's hunch was right: eretto is correct: these things happen with on-line scanning.Wetman (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It wasn't my hunch but that of the anonymous editor at 82.89.204.1. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 16:07, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Thanks for your input. I've translated the book title as "The New Palace upon the Waters of the Newly Built Bucentaur at the Annual Solemn Function of the Day of the Ascension of Our Lord". I believe the "New Palace upon the Waters" doesn't refer to a building, but is a fancy description of the Bucentaur itself. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 23:05, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree.--Broletto (talk) 08:46, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

text: Hi, Wetman. Thanks for providing translations for some of the Italian and Latin texts. I'm sorry I didn't spot your postings until now. In the book title ""Habiti d'hvomeni et donne venetiane: con la processione della serma. Signoria et altri particolari cioè trionfi feste cerimonie pvbliche della nobilissima città di Venetia", I was wondering if "serma. Signoria" was a term, with the full stop after "serma" indicating that it is an abbreviation of another word rather than the end of the sentence. Any idea what that might be? Also, do you know how "Forma in Frezaria al sol" and "sovraprovveditore" might be translated into English? — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 16:07, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Hi, thanks for providing translations for some of the Italian and Latin texts. I'm sorry I didn't spot your postings until now. In the book title ""Habiti d'hvomeni et donne venetiane: con la processione della serma. Signoria et altri particolari cioè trionfi feste cerimonie pvbliche della nobilissima città di Venetia", I was wondering if "serma. Signoria" was a term, with the full stop after "serma" indicating that it is an abbreviation of another word rather than the end of the sentence. Any idea what that might be? Also, do you know how "Forma in Frezaria al sol" and "sovraprovveditore" might be translated into English? Do respond on the article's talk page. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 16:09, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes. More correctly transcribed it would have been serma, meaning Serenissima Signoria. Frezzaria Sol would mean "Fresh Air Lane" if you were to translate it; that's the narrow street where the volume was printed in Venice.  The Wikipedia article Provveditore will explain the title at length: a sovraprovveditor oversees the performances of provveditori. --Wetman (talk) 20:52, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: That's great – your explanation clears up a few mysteries in the article. Thanks very much! — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 21:06, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: No, that won't work because the phrase "Forma in Frezaria al sol" in the  template is already inside footnote 9, and you can't nest a footnote inside another footnote. Also, I think it's better to add the interpolated words to the English translation since they were absent from the original Italian text. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 00:39, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

text: The Latin is "with one Bucentaur, solemn and artificial [presumably "skillfully constructed"], upon which he came to San Clemente, where a more important and more solemn Bucentaur had already arrived with his advisors..." The third one says "a discovery of the sculptor Antonio Coradini". The second apparently should be "quod Bucentaurus Domini ducis fiat per Dominium et teneatur in Arsenatu" (this bit of the article seems to have been taken from here and run through a translator). I suppose it means "...that a Bucentaur should be made for the Lord Doge for his rule, and it should be held in the Arsenal." I'm not good enough with Italian to attempt a translation of the book title. Adam Bishop (talk) 12:47, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, Adam. Thanks very much for this; I've updated the article accordingly. Would a better translation of the third Latin phrase be "invented by the sculptor Antonio Corradini"? Corradini was the sculptor of parts of the bucentaur, so the word "discovery" seems inapt. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 18:41, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, that's probably what it means. Adam Bishop (talk) 00:33, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd a' said "a well-wrought and stately Bucintoro", stately like a state coach. --Wetman (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

text: There are two more Latin book titles that require translation. Hope you can help:
*"De origin, situ et magistratibus urbis Venetae".
**"Concerning the origin, site and magistrates of the city of Venice"
*"Habiti d'hvomeni et donne venetiane: con la processione della serma. Signoria et altri particolari cioè trionfi feste cerimonie pvbliche della nobilissima città di Venetia".
**"Dress of Venetian men and ladies: with the procession of the serma [the solemn marriage of Venice and the sea, I think]. The Signory and other particulars, that is, triumphal entries, feasts, [and] public ceremonies, of the most noble city of Venice"--Wetman (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

text: — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 04:30, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The second one is Italian (about men and women's clothing during public ceremonies?). The Latin one is "on the origin, site, and officials of the city of Venice". Adam Bishop (talk) 09:06, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Oops, didn't realize one of them was in Italian. Thanks for providing the English translation of the Latin title. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 15:20, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Translation of Italian and Latin terms 

message: *"La Nuova regia su l'acque nel Bucintoro nuovamente cretto all'annua solenne funzione del giorno dell'Ascensione di Nostro Signore" (book title).
::Are You sure about the word "cretto", wich in Italian does not exist? Perhaps "creato" or "eretto" could have a sense.82.89.204.1 (talk) 13:48, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the British Library online catalogue, that's how the word is spelt. The book is an 18th-century work – could cretto be an old-fashioned Italian word no longer used today? If not, what would the English translation of the book title be if the word was creato or eretto? — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 18:30, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

text: Jacklee's hunch was right: eretto is correct: these things happen with on-line scanning.Wetman (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It wasn't my hunch but that of the anonymous editor at 82.89.204.1. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 16:07, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Thanks for your input. I've translated the book title as "The New Palace upon the Waters of the Newly Built Bucentaur at the Annual Solemn Function of the Day of the Ascension of Our Lord". I believe the "New Palace upon the Waters" doesn't refer to a building, but is a fancy description of the Bucentaur itself. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 23:05, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree.--Broletto (talk) 08:46, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

text: Hi, Wetman. Thanks for providing translations for some of the Italian and Latin texts. I'm sorry I didn't spot your postings until now. In the book title ""Habiti d'hvomeni et donne venetiane: con la processione della serma. Signoria et altri particolari cioè trionfi feste cerimonie pvbliche della nobilissima città di Venetia", I was wondering if "serma. Signoria" was a term, with the full stop after "serma" indicating that it is an abbreviation of another word rather than the end of the sentence. Any idea what that might be? Also, do you know how "Forma in Frezaria al sol" and "sovraprovveditore" might be translated into English? — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 16:07, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Hi, thanks for providing translations for some of the Italian and Latin texts. I'm sorry I didn't spot your postings until now. In the book title ""Habiti d'hvomeni et donne venetiane: con la processione della serma. Signoria et altri particolari cioè trionfi feste cerimonie pvbliche della nobilissima città di Venetia", I was wondering if "serma. Signoria" was a term, with the full stop after "serma" indicating that it is an abbreviation of another word rather than the end of the sentence. Any idea what that might be? Also, do you know how "Forma in Frezaria al sol" and "sovraprovveditore" might be translated into English? Do respond on the article's talk page. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 16:09, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes. More correctly transcribed it would have been serma, meaning Serenissima Signoria. Frezzaria Sol would mean "Fresh Air Lane" if you were to translate it; that's the narrow street where the volume was printed in Venice.  The Wikipedia article Provveditore will explain the title at length: a sovraprovveditor oversees the performances of provveditori. --Wetman (talk) 20:52, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: That's great – your explanation clears up a few mysteries in the article. Thanks very much! — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 21:06, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

text: No, that won't work because the phrase "Forma in Frezaria al sol" in the  template is already inside footnote 9, and you can't nest a footnote inside another footnote. Also, I think it's better to add the interpolated words to the English translation since they were absent from the original Italian text. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 00:39, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Italian

message: *"cum uno artificioso et solemni Bucentauro, super quo venit usque ad S. Clementem, quo jam pervenerat principalior et solemnior Bucentaurus cum consiliariis, &c".
 
*"quod Bucentaurus Dominions ducis Fiat for Dominium et teneatur in Arsenatu".
*"Antonii Coradini sculptoris Inventum".
Thanks very much. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 04:18, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The Latin is "with one Bucentaur, solemn and artificial [presumably "skillfully constructed"], upon which he came to San Clemente, where a more important and more solemn Bucentaur had already arrived with his advisors..." The third one says "a discovery of the sculptor Antonio Coradini". The second apparently should be "quod Bucentaurus Domini ducis fiat per Dominium et teneatur in Arsenatu" (this bit of the article seems to have been taken from here and run through a translator). I suppose it means "...that a Bucentaur should be made for the Lord Doge for his rule, and it should be held in the Arsenal." I'm not good enough with Italian to attempt a translation of the book title. Adam Bishop (talk) 12:47, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, Adam. Thanks very much for this; I've updated the article accordingly. Would a better translation of the third Latin phrase be "invented by the sculptor Antonio Corradini"? Corradini was the sculptor of parts of the bucentaur, so the word "discovery" seems inapt. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 18:41, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, that's probably what it means. Adam Bishop (talk) 00:33, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd a' said "a well-wrought and stately Bucintoro", stately like a state coach. --Wetman (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

text: There are two more Latin book titles that require translation. Hope you can help:
*"De origin, situ et magistratibus urbis Venetae".
**"Concerning the origin, site and magistrates of the city of Venice"
*"Habiti d'hvomeni et donne venetiane: con la processione della serma. Signoria et altri particolari cioè trionfi feste cerimonie pvbliche della nobilissima città di Venetia".
**"Dress of Venetian men and ladies: with the procession of the serma [the solemn marriage of Venice and the sea, I think]. The Signory and other particulars, that is, triumphal entries, feasts, [and] public ceremonies, of the most noble city of Venice"--Wetman (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

text: — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 04:30, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The second one is Italian (about men and women's clothing during public ceremonies?). The Latin one is "on the origin, site, and officials of the city of Venice". Adam Bishop (talk) 09:06, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Oops, didn't realize one of them was in Italian. Thanks for providing the English translation of the Latin title. — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 15:20, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Latin

message: Hi, it would be great if someone could help provide English translations of the following Latin phrases which appear in the article:
*Navilium Duecentorum Hominum – name of a ship.
*Desponsamus te, mare, in signum veri perpetuique domini ("We wed thee, sea ...") – said during a ceremony.
Thanks! — Cheers, JackLee –talk–</span> 07:28, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Translation help sought 

message: First image on this article does not relate to the stolen painting, which is as shown here:  
I have therefore removed the respective noteIn March 2008, this painting and another by Guardi, together worth £10 million, were seized in the UK by the police at the request of Italian authorities which alleged that they had been illegally exported from Italy.. from the image. I discovered this whilst creating a new article for Guardi's work. The confusion I believe was generated by the wrong title--Smintheus Fellin (talk) 16:16, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wrong painting quoted on 1st image 

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080619192330/http://www.webjewels.it/Bucentaurs.html to http://www.webjewels.it/Bucentaurs.html
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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that :File: will be appearing as picture of the day on February 25, 2020. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2020-02-25. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page so Wikipedia doesn't look bad. :) Thanks! Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:14, 17 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:File:{{Remove file prefix|Canaletto - Bucentaur's return to the pier by the Palazzo Ducale - Google Art Project.jpg}}]] to appear as POTD soon