Talk:Double bass/Archive 5

message: I do believe that in the early days of Jazz, a man called Bob Haggart invented something called the syncopated triple slap technique. THis is described in his book on Bass playing. This does sound similar to that technique which User:Badagnani describes and I think therefore should be included in the article. I can provide a ref if needed!--Light current 23:26, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: A couple of years ago at the National Folk Festival in Bangor, Maine, I saw a young double bass player in an acoustic rockabilly-style group at a party at the hotel one night playing in this style.  It was my impression that in that style of music he was playing it's not as syncopated as in some of the early jazz recordings.  He was basically doing what is described in the article:  plucking as normal for the first and third beats, then "filling in" with one, two, three, four, or more "clicks" in between."  Occasionally I think he would do some sort of reversal or displacement, where the clicks came on the downbeat, somewhat like what some funk drummers will do to switch the beat around for variety.  I was told that this young player had devoted his life to the study of this style of double bass slapping, and that he was known as an expert on this.  I don't know who this player was or what the name of his band was, but I suppose there might be some way to find out.  Perhaps with his help a separate article on the double bass slapping technique could be created and the information moved there to shorten the double bass article.  Badagnani 23:44, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Jazz may go back at least to the end of World War I, with James Reese Europe's military band (which didn't really swing, but contained many elements of later jazz).  He had various society orchestras which were ragtime-based over the preceding decade as well.  Badagnani 00:15, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

text: OK, I called the National Council for Traditional Arts and found that the group I saw was from Maine, the leader being the rockabilly guitarist/singer Sean Mencher.  The bass player was Shane Kiel (from the band Two Timin' Three, formerly of Massachusetts and currently of Austin, Texas).  In the audio tracks on their MySpace page, the "drums" you hear (there is no drummer in the band) are actually played by the bass, using a virtuosic "slapping" technique.  Blows my mind.  Give it a listen.  http://www.myspace.com/twotiminthree  http://www.rockabillybass.com/cgi-bin/discus/board-profile.cgi?action=view_profile&profile=shane-users  Badagnani 20:42, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

text: If you saw the guy live you would certainly use the word.  I just listened to all four songs and only two have the multiple slaps between bass line notes (the fourth, and, to a lesser extent, the third).  I would argue that, of the four, the fourth track's bass part is virtuosic at least as regards this difficult technique.  The bass players I've worked with, while great, have had trouble consistently doing one slap between bass line notes, let alone three or more at a fast clip.  The bass parts in the other two songs here are not "virtuosic" in my view.  Badagnani 20:59, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Slapping 

message: I turn my back and look what happens!  I was going to comment on a version of the page I printed last week, but that page is in the bit bucket.  Okay, so some off-the cuff notes on where the page is now.  Some of these may be blunt, inflammatory even, so take them with a grain of salt.  Some of these reinforce discussion above (to the extent that I have scanned it)
*Overall the page is cleaner.  Maybe a little too clean for my taste.  Prose is now quite simplistic in parts.
*Quite a few wikilinks have been lost - arco, pizz, bow,  in section 0 for a start.
*In Section 1 (history) too many one-sentence paragraphs.  Bad writing.  It reads as a list of dot-points supporting an argument as to why (or why not) the bass is really a viol.  Or not.  IMHO a bass is a bass, and its form and construction is a result of a range of influences and traditions, based on what worked (bassists like it when luthiers make playable sweet-sounding instruments, and so they spent their money there).  Might be an idea to mention octobass here in passing.  (and where is my quadrabass???)
*Section 2 (terminology). Formal instrument name subsection is terrible.  Is it derived from italian, or is it the size, or does it double?  I always thought it was the "doubling" but not from a 'cello POV.  In a harpsichord and organ, you often use a combination of registers - pull some levers that double any line, usually with an octave displacement.  But this is not called double on the pipe organ or harpsichord page, so my version of this myth is flawed too.
*Section 3 (design) is good.  Drop sentence with explicit reference to "websites quoted below", or at least get the referencing working properly.  Which websites, and are they quoted (or merely listed with hyperlinks).  Look up the current WP guidelines and decide whether to have a direct link to the external site or an internal link like "... see the external links below"
*Section 4 (Tone) why is the only reference point the electric bass?  Comparison with 'Cello would also be useful.
*Section 5 (construction) disagree totally on pegbox being important.  It is a 20C innovation.  Basses existed before then with friction pegs (I've played one).  Machine heads are not what makes a bass a bass!!  What is important to the sound of the bass are the arched belly and to a lesser extent the arched back, coupled via a soundpost. (some basses have flat backs).  Front is usually 1-piece, but back is often 2-piece.  Extremely anal nit-pick: weight not mass determines the need for a robust spike.
*Section 6 (strngs) is OK
*Section 7 (tuning).  Maybe drop 5ths tuning, unless you can come across a good reference for it.  Could be merged with prev section.
*Section 8 (pitch).  Is OKish.  I am getting tired.  Clarify: Bottesini as composer or player?  Change "concertos" to "solo works".  Maybe call section "Pitch and notation".  Drop "extreme" as tenor clef is used for a 2-octave range on G-string.  Picture of clef could have open strings and approximate upper range notated.
*Section 9 (technique).  drop inside leg measurement.  typo: inefficient -> insufficient.  Is there a page on general string technique so that we are not reinventing the wheel?  (vibrato, bowing, pizz)  Much of classical technique has gone astray.  Probably worth mentioning that bassists often use multiple fingers to stop a single string, unlike other stringists.
*Section 10 (Bows).  Nice section.  I think this section should be earlier, with other "physical" aspects.  Maybe after strings.  Put length of bow in first paragraph.
*Section 11 (problems).  Is this section here just so people feel sorry for us??  If this section stays in, can it be put in a more positive light?  It could be useful to cross-reference the 4ths tuning to the problem with "reach".  Carbon fibre and fibreglass variants should go alongside plywood in construction.  Andrew's recommendation: get rid of this section totally, and distribute between technique and construction.
*Section 12 (modern playing styles).  Here "modern" is ambiguous.  There is modern art music, modern popular music.  Just list them all (arco, pizz, variations on pizz) under "playing styles" or "technique".  Also note that many playing styles attributed to popular music (slap pizz) were known in classical music (partic 20C art music).  Other classical playing "styles" are col legno, sul tasto, sul ponticello, but I guess they should fit in "technique".  Andrew's recommendation: merge with technique
*Section 13 (classical repetoire).  I like this section.  Ah, memories (I am not an active classical player)
*Section 14 (DB in jazz).  A bit short.  Here you could actually bring in influential players, as they correspond to classical repetoire and composers.  Mingus mingus mingus mingus mingus!!  Maybe a description of styles of bass line other than walking bass, and how this has developed as jazz has freed up from 1950 on.
*Section 12 1/2.  Before the current section 13, we need a section DB in classical music, explaining its role in the orchestra, chamber music, and solo (rather than just a list of repetoire).
*Section 15 (DB in bluegrass) I don't know much about BG apart from Edgar Meyer.  I'll duck this one.
*Section 16 (DB in popular music).  Can we have a term other than "popular music"?  Jazz was once popular (snif).  The role of the DB in rockabilly was partly put down to R+B and country - the first mention of these forms of music in the article.  I know the DB was used in R+B, but country??  I have an allergy to country music, so don't ask me.  Trim paragraph on EB to a sentence that describes DB being replaced by EB as it more suited aspects X Y and Z of the music.
*Section 17 (Bassists) either we don't include any names, or we include some jazz bassists and others that people think are noteworthy.  Otherwise links to lists of players.
OK - the above are some quick gut reactions for others to mull over their worth, and to incorporate into future edits.  Some of these are corrections that are quick to make (I would have made them, but I was not in "correcting" mode) and others require a bit more careful planning and thinking.  HTH!  Andrew Kepert 10:52, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Comments on progress 

message: I changed the reference to Jaco Pastorius where it used to refer to him in the career section as a composer. Jaco did not play the double bass so I substituted him with Dave Holland, who is a better example of a jazz bassist/composer in this context.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.162.211.30 (talk) 04:35, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Substitution of Jaco Pastorius

message: There should be a differentiation between double bass and upright bass, so we should split this page into two. Although generally the same physically, they serve a different function. Most bassists in other genres do not call it a double bass because the "double" term is irrelevant. The instrument's role and function is different. The Double Bass should retain the classical content while the content for jazz and various genres should be moved to an upright bass page.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.194.236.218 (talk) 15:37, 16 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Double bass comes from the Italian "contrabasso". The double part means twice as low as bass range instruments. DavidRavenMoon (talk) 00:17, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Upright Bass

message: I'm reposting this so I don't delete the source in case someone wants to use it for something else:
"Tuning in fifths can also make the instrument louder, because the strings have more common overtones, causing the strings to vibrate sympathetically.Taking the Fifth: How Tuning in Fifths Changed My Experience Playing the Double Bass, Dennis Masuzzo"
This is just not true. There are more common overtones on open strings, but as soon as you finger a note, this commonality disappears. The same commonality can be accomplished by playing a fifth interval on a fourths-tuned instrument. This source is a player with much more experience than I, but he is not a physicist and his understanding of the physics of sound is very limited. Conical Johnson (talk) 05:00, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I've occasionally tuned in fifths over the years and noticed that it certainly sounds different, but in any case, this sort of assertion comes under the category of "original research" until someone can cite a respected source on this matter. Thus Wikipedia-wise, the topic seems to be moot. JacquesDelaguerre (talk) 17:12, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Fifths tuning pseudophysics

message: Here is where we will put together a list of issues and strategies, based on comments made above.  Feel free to add to the list, or to add signed comments against each item.  I have only started this as a template for me or others to proceed on. Andrew Kepert 01:21, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Problem: some inconsistencies with depth and treatment of different musical styles. Andrew Kepert 01:21, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Suggestion: Sections "DB in classical music", "DB in jazz", "DB in bluegrass" etc covering (in paras or subsections) the role of the DB in that field, repetoire, styles, influential musicians. Andrew Kepert 01:21, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

text: *Problem: muddy POV of origin of bass construction. Andrew Kepert 01:21, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Suggestion: real research, or reference to real research (rather than folklore). Andrew Kepert 01:21, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Strategy to improve the article 

message: In the article, it jumps from jazz to bluegrass to early rock and roll.  But the link is the early rhythm and blues of Louis Jordan (very popular throughout the 1940s), which did use a double bass to great effect.  Bill Haley copied Jordan's basic style years later.  This should probably be added in the early part of the "pop" paragraph, as Jordan is generally credited as being the bridge between jazz and rock and roll.  Here's an article about his bassist: http://library.missouristate.edu/meyer/speccoll/Bartley/pages/playing.htm  Badagnani 20:53, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Please add it! 8-)--Light current 00:44, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rhythm and blues 

message: That is one fantastic photo!  Badagnani 22:54, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. I had to crop it out of a picture off of a magazine cover. — ßottesiηi (talk) 23:30, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Is it my imagination, or has that bass that Foster is holding got a shorter than normal neck> 8-?--Light current 00:38, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

text: It really doesn't look all that short to me, and it could have something to do with the perspective of the shot. — ßottesiηi (talk) 00:43, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New jazz photo 

message: I am wondering about the credibility of A New History of the Double Bass saying that the double bass is the member of the violin family. Does the double bass really have the internal structure similar to that of violin, viola, and cello, and different from that of viola da gamba? And all the viol-like features of the double bass 
(i.e. sloping shoulders, tuning in 4ths, etc.)-- are they merely modifications to make the instrument more convenient for playing? (i know the German bow system is not)
P.S. All your bass are belong to us!!!!
['frαs.ti] 20:45, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I am not familiar with the internal structure of the viol da gamba, but the internal components of a bass are almost exactly the same as the other members of the violin family. Of course there are differences in structure and support that allow for the increased size, but they share many basic pieces. One difference is the back; a lot of basses are flat-back, as opposed to being swell or round back like all violins. But this is due to the size, and there are also a lot of round-back basses as well. The structure of the bass is still changing, luthiers are always experimenting with new designs. — ßottesiηi (talk) 21:18, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  internal structure of double bass 

message: Why is the "usage" change not discussed here?  "Use" is better than "usage."  Badagnani 23:19, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well then change it. It is not discussed because I wrote "per peer review" in the edit summary. I guess I figured that you'd look in the peer review and see that it says not to reuse the article name in the section titles. (If for some reason that seems like it should have read in an angry tone, re-read it in a happy voice, because I'm not trying to be angry or anything). — ßottesiηi (talk) 23:42, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Why not use a smiley face? :-) or 8-) to indicate emotions--Light current 23:04, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Usage 

message: I created this diagram from a picture of my own bass. Anybody think it should go in the article somewhere? The image to the right is not full-size, obviously. Just click on it. — ßottesiηi (talk) 22:33, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I like your diagram Bott. However, I would make a suggestion that maybe you could label the upper and lower 'bouts'? THen I think it would be an asset to the article (as any good diagram is) 8-)--Light current 23:02, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: How does the new version look? — ßottesiηi (talk) 17:56, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Diagram 

message: Hi, I am the one who put the Jazzbass.jpg picture on the jazz section a few weeks back. It's a picture of my friend Rudy, a jazz bass player from Indonesia, well he's not really renowned internationally but quite renowned in Indonesia. I took that pic during a practice session in his studio in Bandung, Indonesia. Anyways, I think the pic is good to be put in the jazz section because it shows a playing technique that is distinctively jazz. Current porter picture, albeit historical, does not show he's playing a bass. So I would like to propose to also insert my picture in addition to the current jazz picture. My picture is not copyrighted anyway, and i think it explains the technique better. Thanks! Meutia Chaerani 10:12, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks!  I thought this about your photo as well; it shows a jazz bass player "in action," doing an upper register pizz. solo.  Badagnani 10:25, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Chaerani, Could you tell the reason for his strangely coloured bass?--Light current 15:19, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Ahh! I see 8-?--Light current 22:33, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I think it's fair to say that a very high register pizz solo is more typical of jazz than classical (though I don't have time to do a statistical analysis of jazz and classical compositions) :)  Badagnani 18:07, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: OK — ßottesiηi (talk) 18:57, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I reapply the jazzbass.jpg picture into the jazz section, as agreed under this discussion. Besides, per Wikimania conference, it is agreed that it is preferable to use open sourced photos (as in the jazzbass.jpg) instead of copyrighted fair-use photos (as in the Porter's photo). Meutia Chaerani 13:42, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jazz Bass pic 

message: Is intonation more difficult on a double bass compared with other string instruments because of its size? It seems to me intonation as such, ie producing  a note to the required pitch, is not really related to the size of the instrument, otherwise one could argue that a cello is easier to play in tune compared with a double bass because it is smaller, and a violin even easier.  Yes, the positions for the fingers are further apart, so to play the same range of notes as a violin one needs to stretch their fingers and move their hand over wider distances but that is that is not intonation. LDHan 04:39, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's my experience--primarily because in faster passages the entire hand (and arm) must jump up and down the neck, often way up the G string.  With the violin passages can be played with much less movement of the hand and thus the intonation is easier.  Part of it is probably the thickness of the bass strings as well.  Let's see what some of the other bass players here have to say.  Badagnani 04:50, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: One could also say that intonation is easier on a double bass because the wider distances give a greater margin of error. LDHan 05:04, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

text: That's a good point, but one that is belied by the severely out of tune bass player we've all heard (and whose sound unfortunately lingers in our minds)!  :)  Badagnani 05:09, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm lost. Are you talking about a particular bass player? Gnome 05:28, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, isn't perception of pitch less accurate at low pitches? LDHan 05:38, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with LDH, perception of pitch is less certain at low frequencies. On the DB, although the distances are greater along the strings, most bass players do not purposely jump up and down the neck, they use all 4 strings! Intonation can be a problem very high on the neck, becasue the notes are so close together. But on a violn, they are even closer! I think Badagnani has just been listening to a rather unaccomplished player!--Light current 11:17, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If you're a bass player I'm sure your ear develops as you learn the instrument and one can start to tell when they're out of tune more easily, or at least in my experience. If you have develop a good technique (you know, practicing and doing what you're supposed to), it would be easy to remedy this. The instrument physically is harder to play, and it's been one of the most discouraging instruments to learn. It's huge, it's a pain to carry around, and that sure does make it difficult to learn how to play, or at least it did to me. But it doesn't matter. Stop wasting time trying to find an excuse for a problem and just fix it. In the end something you're not used is going to be harder at first. 66.32.69.231 (talk) 17:24, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Intonation

message: The PNG file that shows the range of the double bass needs to be corrected. Double bass music is written an octave higher than it actually sounds, which causes the pitches of the four open strings in the diagram to be an octave higher than they actually are. The user that uploaded that PNG needs to add an 8va below the open strings for the diagram to be accurate.--Markjdb 15:25, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, playing range is wrong. Whats shown is the written range. Can someone fix this? I cant! 8-(--Light current 21:42, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The article on the Hungarian Wikipedia has a correct one. -- FrostytheSnowman ('sup?) 00:28, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

text: Changed image. The previous one was . I changed the image to , which has a 8vb below the open strings notes. -- FrostytheSnowman ('sup?) 01:48, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

text: Thanks for fixing! 8-)--Light current 01:52, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Range picture 

message: Since playing my EUB regularly now for about 9 months, I have developed a sore neck on the left side when I rotate my head to the left. i went to the doctor and he said it was due to the action of the left arm in playing the bass. He recommended an excersise with the arms thet make it look like Im doing the funky chicken dance. Anyone else had any similar problems?--Light current 11:26, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Can't say that I have. If you are developing soreness, there is probably something wrong with your technique or you're holding too much tension or something another. There are whole classes you can take about the body's mechanics while playing and how to play more efficiently and correctly. - ßottesiηi (talk) 18:42, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

text: You may want to check this out:  It was in the latest edition of the ISB magazine. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 02:12, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I went to the doctor the other day, he couldn't stop laughing. I asked why this was, he said "You see that guy that just went out? He'll be doing the funky chicken for hours" Gnome 03:17, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hahaha -- ßottesiηi (talk) 14:35, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Playing hazards and the funky chicken 

message: Article says that DB s  have always used M/C heads. Im sure I read somewhere that old DBs had pegs just like other members of violin family. Any comments?--Light current 01:11, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pegbox 

message: It says that a citation is needed for the line below, but in reality this is common knowledge among bassists and will be found in most any source.
Historically, strings were made of gut, but since the 20th century steel has largely replaced gut due to its better playability.
Well, if most any source will do, why not just cite one of them?  I, for one, do not use gut because of its short lifetime when exposed to moisture, not its playability. DaveCW (talk) 08:55, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Strings section citation not actually needed 

message: Sometime in my absence from wikipedia, all the images from the bow section disappeared. Anybody know what happened to them? -- ßottesiηi (talk) 02:07, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  bow section pics 

message: Some of this page (esp. the Origins and History section) appears to be copied from this web page:  which carries a copyright notice.  I suppose it's possible that they copied it from here.  Anyone know for sure? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.204.170.66 (talk • contribs) 
:That actually appears to be copied from wikipedia, as I have seen that prose actually developed and written here over time. It's not a copyright infringement for them to use it (all wikipedia articles are licensed under the GNU Free Documentation License), although I am curious as to their claimed copyright. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 21:44, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think it's fair that they're claiming copyright over something that was collaboratively written here.  What can we do about it?  Badagnani 22:02, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, you can email the email address that I found for them (info@ibay-hk.com) if you want. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 22:22, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: They have also used the photo of my Double Bass, which I put up as GFDL.  I will e-mail them. Andrew Kepert 03:34, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Why, those f*ers!  Badagnani 03:35, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: See Talk:Double_bass/Copyright_notice for my e-mail.  8-) Andrew Kepert 04:00, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No news yet -- see User_talk:Bottesini#Bass_page_copyvio.  However, I will draw from Wikipedia:Standard GFDL violation letter next time, and one of you might like to use one of these letters as the next step -- it gives them a softer option to fix the problem, if they are prepared to wear a "GFDL" and foreign copyright notice on their site. Andrew Kepert 09:32, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Further update: I found WP:MIRROR has a place to put lodge GFDL violations. Andrew Kepert 09:47, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Last one for today: http://musical-instrument.koopal.com/ and related sites are also ripped from WP.  I put a suggestion on Talk:Musical instrument for a contributor to follow it up. Andrew Kepert 10:25, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Plagiarism/Copyright Issues? 

message: Is that serious placing Fernando Grillo before Gary Karr and Edgar Meyer?  Is he a more prominent player, with more experience and notability than those two?  Badagnani 08:48, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No, he is not. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 21:37, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Ummm... vanity? -- ßottesiηi (talk) 22:31, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Neither do I. I'll drop him a line as well. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 23:11, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fernando Grillo 

message: The picture for the tuning of the bass needs to be changed to reflect its actual pitches, which would mean that the notes need to be lowered by an octave. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Markjdb (talk • contribs) 23:46, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah I forked that off the french wikipedia a while ago. I'll make one myself. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 00:53, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. -- ßottesiηi (talk) 01:13, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  another diagram change 

message: Does he really belong alongside bassists like Bottesini and Simandl? Mehta is FAR better known as a conductor; the only time I've ever seen/heard him play bass was in a video of the trout quintet on youtube. His article doesn't even mention the fact that he's a double bassist...I would think that any addition to the list should be based on their contributions to the bass, instead of music in general (ie conducting).
Markjdb 21:42, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  zubin mehta?? 

message: :Okay, this is a really dumb reason to add another section to the discussion, but I swear I've heard the Double Bass referred to as a Floor Bass, along with the other names listed. Is this a real term? Albino Bebop 02:28, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Are you thinking of a ground bass? Markjdb 23:25, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

text: "double bass is derived from the tuning of one octave lower than the cello." This needs to be reworded - too many people are confused thinking that the cello and bass have the same strings with the bass strings being one octave lower. Farful 10:25, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Terminology

message: In order to trim the size down a bit, should we just list repetoire, instead of giving a small description about quintets, concertos and such?  Kntrabssi 09:26, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Size 

message: Listen Badagnani 00:19, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spice Girls "Wannabe" on 10 double basses 

message: "The wire wrapping is gold or silver in quality bows..."
I know very little about bow or instrument construction, but I question this statement.  If something is "gold or silver" it is usually for decorative and/or price-inflating purposes, not for "quality" purposes.  I highly doubt that there is some particular tonal or structural quality shared by gold and silver, but not shared by any other (cheaper) metal. --74.229.197.48 01:40, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The wrapping length (both the exposed length and how far it extends under the leather cushion) and material may be used to adjust the balance of a bow, since a gram or so near the end makes a difference to the feel of the bow, in how it tracks on the string, and how it performs in various lively techniques. Typically, a maker will use a "finer" metal on a higher-quality stick, "labeling" it in this fashion. Of course, label inflation is not unknown, but the material of the winding, and more importantly, the metal of the frog and screw button mountings, do have some significance regarding bow quality. __Just plain Bill (talk) 13:26, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  Bow price. I've played plenty of bows without any obvious signs of valuable metal or other ornamentations. The reverse may be mostly, true, however. A bow maker is not going to waste valuable metal on a stick he considers inferior. However, a first class bow can have none of it and still be a first class bow.Tom F. (talk) 14:53, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Silver is actually extremely common in bass bows, not even really expensive ones.  $350 and more will typically use silver.  It is used to add weight and balance to the bow.  Seriously, do any of the people editing this page even play bass, it's kinda an embarassment  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kazkev92 (talk • contribs) 18:10, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Quality Bows" 

message: In light of a severe lack of references, I have taken this article to Good Article review. --Lenin and McCarthy  |  (Complain here) 19:31, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The article has been delisted - find the archived discussion here. Giggy Talk 00:58, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Good Article Review 

message: The double ASS is generally & possibly mistakenly, regarded as the only modern descendant of the viola da gamba family of instruments, a family which originated in Europe in the 15th century, and as such it has been described as a "bass viol."
I figured I had better change that...
71.74.13.103 09:38, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: What makes you think that's a typo? I think there's a different name for that ... +ILike2BeAnonymous 17:42, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Minor typo corrected 

message: Ray Brown is "known for his virtuosic bowing technique"? "the Fritz Kreisler of jazz double bass playing"? If ever a citation was needed, it's here. Wikipedia's page on him doesn't use the words "arco" or "bow" anywhere. I'm a huge fan of Ray Brown and don't remember ever having heard him play arco. http://www.musicianguide.com/biographies/1608001296/Ray-Brown.html tells us that "His arco {bow} technique is excellent, though he seldom reveals it. " I got excited watching a YouTube video of the Oscar Peterson trio where Brown picks up a bow... and after using it to check his tuning he just puts it down again. In a jazz bass method book I have by him, there is a picture of him using a German bow, but again, I have yet to actually *hear* him use one. If there are a few examples out there, I'd love to hear them, but as reputedly the most recorded musician in history (because of all of his studio work), there's not nearly enough recorded arco work from him to justify the claim that he's "known for his virtuosic bowing technique."  Bobdc 21:43, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Removed pending source being provided:
  Badagnani 00:04, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ray Brown arco? 

message: Discussion of the infobox that just showed up is at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Musical Instruments. __Just plain Bill (talk) 23:04, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox 

message: There is a music clip from the German Bottesini that we could use as a listening clip, so users could hear what a bass sounds like?  Also, I'm sure there are many freely available jazz/pizzicato sound clips?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.114.127.171 (talk) 19:15, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  music clip 

message: I changed the fingerings image, because I believed the other one was a bad example.  Also, it was a poor image (taken of music with camera).  So, I uploaded a new one with an excerpt of Tchaikovsky and added the fingerings with lilypond.  What do y'all think?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Michael miceli (talk • contribs) 07:09, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Not much; I removed it. First of all, it's too small at its small size to really see anything. And it's not particularly useful and is actually misleading: so far as I know, actual orchestral music doesn't contain fingerings. That's left up to the player's discretion (unless you're talking about a grade-school orchestra). +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 07:17, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Other strings often have bowings determined by the principal player in the section, & sometimes fingerings, don't they? Basses also? If so, a good-quality image of a part marked up in pencil might be appropriate, but not a lilypond pretty-printed one. (By the way, Michael, I think lilypond and sliced bread are both right up there near the top of the pantheon of Admirable Things...) L2BA, your first point cuts no ice with me-- the full size image is only a few clicks away from the thumbnail, but I still think deleting the image was the right thing to do this time. __Just plain Bill (talk) 19:14, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: In reply to the second point, no; at least for real (i.e., adult) orchestras, no string parts contain fingerings. This is something you'll find in parts for elementary-school players. Bowings are put in in pencil (and subsequently erased) by the section leader or concertmaster (or "leader" if you prefer). But not printed in the part. +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 19:53, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It seemed that there was a need for a page with explained fingerings.  I thought it would look more professional than the elementary bass part with fingerings written in that was up before.  Maybe something else would be more appropriate like an etude (it could be larger)--Michael miceli (talk) 20:49, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Rather than an etude, I'd rather see an actual (interesting) orchestral part, as marked up by an actual principal bassist, but that might be tough to find as a free image, since printed scores & parts tend to be copyrighted, sometimes rented copies, depending on how any given orchestra's library works. I suppose an etude with some teacherly fingerings and shifts written in would do, but not for every note, as in the previous photo. Not really sure we need such an image here anyway, but open to being persuaded. __Just plain Bill (talk) 17:48, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

text: I'd like to see nothing there, thank you very much; this is far too trivial to even merit inclusion in the article. Bass fingerings are very much a personal choice, and I seriously doubt that many professional players even bother marking them in their parts. Again, this is elementary-school stuff. +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 21:27, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

text: Add to that the fact that a lot of basses are played outside an orchestral context, without even paper to write the fingerings on... works just fine for me, to have nothing there, thanks. __Just plain Bill (talk) 03:01, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

text: I know many professional double bass players and principles who, when first receiving a part, are required to fill in fingerings and bowings.  However, I can see where a whole page with complete fingerings would be overkill.  I was just trying to replace a very elementary and poor picture.  So, I guess what I am saying is if there is an excerpt or something to show anything about the bass my lilypond experience is always welcome to help out. :-D --Michael miceli (talk) 04:31, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  New fingerings image 

message: :Image:Bill Haley and the Comets.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot (talk) 04:28, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:Bill Haley and the Comets.jpg

message: The discussion here seems to reflect a shocking ignorance of language and how it works, as well as the purposes of an encyclopedia. Words mean what people use them to mean. Bass fiddle, bass violin, and bull fiddle are entirely legitimate and commonly used terms for the instrument, especially in certain cultural circle. To label them "inaccurant," "incorrect," "ignorant," "undignified," reflect blatant prejudice, as well as a misunderstanding of language, of encyclopedias, and of the notion of ignorance, and, more importantly a misunderstanding of the principle of neutral point of view. People who come to an encyclopedia looking for basic information on topics should at the very least have access to information regarding various terms used for things that are covered. I am going to restore all the alternative names and I hope that there will be a discussion based on the values of information and language rather than that of blatant prejudice. Acsenray (talk) 15:17, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Let's get real here -- the alternative names are perfectly legitimate and should be noted

message: Hi, I believe that we should set a high standard for the external links section (for the Wikipedia guidelines on External Links, see WP:EL) Ideally, the External Links should be non-profit, educational or scholarly websites with a variety of quality resources and information on the topic. Along with other editors, I always remove advertising websites from the EL section, whether they are major online retailers or small indie instrument makers. However, with the Bluegrass webpage now in the EL section, we have a "grey zone." The bluegrass webpage does have resources on playing double bass. However it also has a large advertising sidebar on the left-hand side of the page, and a number of smaller "business card"-sized advertisements along the right side. I think that there are enough high quality non-profit, non-commercial websites out there that we should remove website links that have significant amounts of advertising......................................Is the Bluegrass webpage a non-profit webpage that has advertising just to cover its costs, or is it an advertising webpage that uses bluegrass content to draw webhits and make money? We don't know. But I think that we should err on the side of caution, and on the side of setting a high standard for the External Links section. Comments?OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 19:16, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The site seems good. Badagnani (talk) 19:20, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links: remove Bluegrass webpage? 

message: correct me if im wrong, but isnt the double bass also used in many black, death, and symphonic metal songs? Chipthief00 (talk) 16:53, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I wasn't aware of significant use in metal - in my experience, "double bass" in a metal context usually refers to a double bass drum setup.  But if you can provide reliable sources for the use of double bass in metal, it can go in the article.  TSP (talk) 17:41, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  other genres 

message: I have started a new wikiproject, WikiProject Stringed Instruments. I am looking for 2 other coordinators to help it get started. Apply on my talk page by answering the following questions.
1. Edit count, how long you have been active on Wikipedia.
2. How often you edit string-related articles. (Scale of 1-10)
3.  What you hope to accomplish if made coordinator.
Please post by March 1, 2009.
ṜedMarkViolinistDrop me a line 19:38, 12 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: So how did that go anyway? Willi Gers07 (talk) 19:29, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, I have a bit of a concern about edit counts being used as a measure of the quality of an editor. Some editors (myself included) have an inflated edit count, because we make lots of little edits and save often. However, there are also editors who will write entire articles "offline" and then save once. Doing a whole article and saving it as you go could net you 100s of edits. Yes, in a rough way, the edit count can give you a sense of a person's involvement, but I would rather see, as the first credential, something like "significant contributions: articles written, substantial edits, or substantial overhauls" rather than edit count.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 02:28, 23 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Wikiproject