Talk:Ode to a Nightingale

message: The person who wrote that has taken the fact that Keats refers to it as 'bird' out of context. In fact the only time he says 'bird' is in the seventh stanza, where the actual quote is 'Thou wast not born for death, immortal Bird!'. He even capitalised the word.
Also, 'deceiving elf' does not refer to the nightingale at all. Instead it refers to the 'fancy pants' (his imagination), mentioned a line before, which 'cannot cheat so well' (cannot be true reality). He is saying his imagination is a deceiving elf 'as she is fam'd to do'.
The nightingale is the vehicle on which Keats' imagination rides to forget his world. He is in constant awe of the bird throughout the poem. Saying he does not simply because he refers to the bird's song as a 'plaintive anthem' is unsubstantiated. It is once again taken out of context. The last stanza is Keats' feelings on leaving the world of the nightingale ('thy plaintive anthem fades/ Past the near meadows; over the still stream..'). The previously stated 'high reqiuem' is now referred to as 'plaintive anthem' simply because he is sad that it is fading away.
------------------
Keat's view of the bird does change in the poem, actually.
Keats realised he has been hoodwinked by the final stanza hence 'bird' instead of one of the more complimentary descriptions used earlier on. In the seventh stanza he is envious of the nightingale's immortality. In context that refers unfavourably with the more complimentary phrases used elsewhere. Note the use of cheat in "the fancy cannot cheat so well" in the eighth stanza. This is a pejorative phrase, indicating that he is irritated at the bird for cheating him. Once Keats leaves the state of negative capability he realises that the song is simplistic, why else would he refer to it as plaintive instead of 'high requiem,' used just one stanza before, while he was still in negative capability? He is sad that he's lost the ecstasy, but he knows it will return ("adieu" rather than a more definite form of farewell).
'Deceiving elf' does refer to the nightingale: look at light winged "Dryad of the trees" earlier in the poem.
Possecomitatus 15:24, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [Untitled]

message: Where on earth is there a "direct reference" to the death of Keats' brother Tom? I might accept that there may be a biographical connection, but it is in no way "direct". Could somebody explain that more precisely?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.6.139.208 (talk) 18:53, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree-- the text itself never mentions Tom, and to say that it talks about his personal experience without any contextual evidence is absurd. I am going to change that sentence.Mrathel (talk) 17:54, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Death of Keats' brother Tom 

message: This article needs major work. At best, it has only a few sentences that can be considered encyclopedic, and it can not be allowed to stand with only one referenced source. I have been working on a few other odes by Keats, and I will get to this one when the time comes. Please feel free to add sources in the mean time, and I will check back to see if I can offer any help. This is probably one of Keat's most critically acclaimed poems, and it should not be hard to get real sources for each section.Mrathel (talk) 17:58, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Major Overhall 

message: Anyone who doesn't hear the melodious devices of sound in the Nightingale ode has a tin ear. Lots of alliteration, assonance, and onomatopoeia--is that what it's called? ("the murmurous haunts of flies on summer eves" Again, if you can't hear the flies, you've got no ear.) Nevertheless, I find the elaborate discussion of long and short vowels unconvincing. And the spondee is a characteristic variation in English language iambics, I would guess no more prevalent in Keats than in Shakespeare. 
Sure, the poem deals with so-called negative capability, but it is primarily an attempt to illustrate a Romantic epiphany as in Emerson's transparent eye-ball, Whitman's experience in Section 5 of Song of Myself, and the missing but remembered "glory" in Wordsworth's Immortality Ode.Jim Lacey (talk) 19:56, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, according to W. J. Bates, it is more prevalent in Keats than in other poets. And to say that Keats is doing what Emerson or Whitman is doing is quite wrong. They may have tried to copy something off of him, but he was far more classical and British, and they were later. Ottava Rima (talk) 20:59, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sound and Sense 

message: The incorrect italic title (see for example the other odes) is being imposed by the inappropriate book infobox. Perhaps someone knows a quick way of fixing this. Spicemix (talk) 20:06, 28 October 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Template:Infobox poem ? Martinevans123 (talk) 20:15, 28 October 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Italic title 

message: Is there an available facsimile image of the first publication in Annals of the Fine Arts? The image of the original manuscript clearly shows that the original punctuation was:
:"Fled is that music? do I wake or sleep?"
When did the colon and dash appear? Martinevans123 (talk) 21:00, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:   ''Annals of the Fine Arts'' 

message: You raised a logical question in your recent edit summary: "how can 8% be seen as an example of "relying" on spondees?" Spondees (depending upon how you count them) can be relatively rare in iambic pentameter, and the source (Bate) shows that Keat's percentage did go way up at this time (from 3%-ish to 10%-ish). Bate does not use the word "rely" but does use the word "abundant". I think, since the implication is that these spondees are not just happening, but are used for effect (generally "slow", "expansive", "heavy"... these are my own interpretations), and the extracted lines (to me) exemplify this, that "rely" is not crazy. Cheers. Phil wink (talk) 18:02, 18 January 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmmm, well that seems to make sense, I guess. I'd be happier to stick closer to Bate's word "abundant", if at all possible. But I realise that would probably require a slight rewrite. The general reader will have no idea about "(from 3%-ish to 10%-ish)" and so may be left wondering, as I was, where this "reliance" comes from? Just my take on it, that's all. Thanks for asking. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:08, 18 January 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Phil, I think your latest change is a great improvement. Much clearer now, to me at least. Many thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:39, 18 January 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Relying" 

message: The hologram says "the nightingale" As title, but on Google and else where it's ode to "a" Nightingale. Why? 110.227.125.91 (talk) 15:31, 13 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is the hologram real 

message: The ode is actually very long but the hologram in 'poem' section is only like 1/3 of the poem... Rest? 110.227.125.91 (talk) 15:32, 13 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  The full poem 

message: Is it thy or my in the first lines... 110.227.125.91 (talk) 15:38, 13 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  The language of holograph 

message: The poem is possibly somewhere written around a forest, then forest area. As the ode says fade away into the  forest dim... 110.227.125.91 (talk) 15:40, 13 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Suggestion