Talk:Hoodie

message: Ok - how to put in that this is a Moral panic without using "it is believed by some to be..." when we can't back it up. We could also do with finding which tabloid newspaper started this off first. It won't have been Bluewater -> Blair. It will have been tabloid ->Bluewater ->Blair. These things don't appear from nowhere. Secretlondon 02:43, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Not sure about the tabloids, but a brief search of the BBC News website gave me much earlier references to hoodies being banned from shops, the earliest being about shops in Folkestone from  August 2003. Cohen the Bavarian 16:45, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Hoodies at Bluewater

message: Why is there no mention of zippered hoodies?  Is a hoody considered a jacket if it has a zipper? --Viriditas  | Talk 02:40, 7 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Good point. This seems to be more in line with the consensus on StyleForum. I have changed the definition. If you disagree, let's discuss it here. Kent Wang 01:12, 2 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  I am going to add a note about zipper hoodies because I saw some guy announce in a Youtube comment that a zip-up hoodie was actually a jacket. I doubt that any commenters from 2005 will take offense. (The styleforum link is broken. I will source my addition using contemporary articles.) Livin270 (talk) 21:53, 19 March 2021 (UTC)

text:  No they are not, at least not in America. I will add my note to zip-up hoodies under the American section because I'm an American and can't speak for anywhere else. If zip-up hoodies are called jackets anywhere, i.e. the UK or something, it would be interesting to get a note about that as well so that people know the regional distinctions. Livin270 (talk) 21:53, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Zipper 

message: As a U.S. resident, the apparent controversy over hoodies is absent here, and I was wondering about where it exists. Does anyone know of another place where hoodies are similarly stigmatized or if the controversy is confined to Britain? Cosmonot 18:04, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Ireland, to an extent. One of my local pubs has a 'no hoodies, no soccer shirts' policy. --Kiand 18:10, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Mainly the UK.  Some people wear a hoodie as a counter-blast to the increasing 'surveillance culture' that seems to be taking over here now.  I am 48 with a totally clean criminal record and no intention of doing anything to merit one, but often wear a hoodie because I am sick of constantly looking up and finding a CCTV camera staring at me.  It's not the camera - but the thought of the snide petty-official 'warden' sat at the other end that irritates me. 160.84.253.241 14:19, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Other countries 

message: I'm wondering about a more mundane controversy: whether "hoody" or "hoodie" is the more generally accepted spelling. Right now, the article implies that "hoody" is more generally accepted. However, Google reports "hoodie" being used more than "hoody" on the Web by about 2:1. Personally, I have never seen "hoody" used as the singular before I saw this Wikipedia article. It could be argued that this is a case of UK vs. US English, but note that even on Web sites in the .uk domain, "hoodie" appears to be favored slightly (about 55% "hoodie" to 45% "hoody"). —LarryGilbert 16:45, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I was just wondering the same thing. I've always seen it "hoodie" and also noticed the Google disparity. Sarge Baldy 08:06, 23 November 2005 (UTC)

text: Same here, I've only seen "hoodie."  Also, I think -ie endings look better on the page than -y endings, but that's far less relevant.  I'd suggest moving the page.  Borksamoht 08:29, 23 November 2005 (UTC)

text: Well, this can be solved with the reason I moseyed on over to the talk page in the first place… Doesn’t hoodie seem a bit informal to anybody else? What about hooded sweatshirt, which avoids the -ie/-y conflict? Wiki Wikardo 10:08, 28 December 2006
Hoody looked more correct for me at the time of originally starting this article (which I see has come along quite nicely), and I generally like shorter words, but if it redirects it works for me. Azoundria 04:59, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Hoody" vs. "hoodie" 

message: Where did this term come from? Am I correct in thinking it only became commonly used a couple of years ago? I had never heard it until . . . I don't know the exact date. Maybe 2002, 2003? Somewhere around there. Does anyone know when it began? Or when it began to spread? -Branddobbe 07:58, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: "Hoodie"

message: What about band hoodies (Hoodies with the logo of a rock band on)? I've seen them around for much longer than the 'chav' ones, and even though they're different (and often worn by people whose way of life is different), there's still some sort of stigma attached - I've receieved many dirty looks and had people (mostly older people) complain to me about wearing one on the odd occasions I've worn one. Possibly notable (not what happened to me, obviously, I mean band hoodies in general)?
And by the way, I think this whole hysteria over it is absolutely ridiculous. 80.6.98.250 11:44, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Band hoodies 

message: Should we consider semi-protecting the page to prevent the "male" obsessed IP address from making further changes? Addhoc 13:02, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The problem seems to have ended. Perhaps if it starts up again protection should be sought.Bobanny 00:18, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, looks like I was wrong. Yeah, semi-protection is probably a good idea.Bobanny 19:13, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protection 

message: No-where in the article is the historical derivation of the modern 'hooded jumper' with kangaroo pouch. I think US brand 'Champion' has been manufacturing the modern hood for much of the 20th Century - being the norm of 'boxing' training gear. Ideas? Ethikos 03:16, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  History - Who invented it? 

message: Just read through this article, and it is extremely focused on Great Britain. If I didn't know better, I would think that wearing a hoodie is looked down upon nearly everywhere in the world. I understand that there is a controversy in the UK and Ireland, but perhaps it should be made more clear that, at least in the United States, wearing a hoodie is not always perceived as uniform for hoodlums. 209.129.161.251 21:36, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Curiously we are told that it is in the US too (!) - there is a fake american english import "hood rat" etc in the popular press and we just got vandalism with similar. I think the reason why it is UK focussed it because of the moral panic - hoodies are a symbol as well as an item of clothing. An article on an item of clothing wouldn't otherwise get the attention. Secretlondon 04:05, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: However, It seems that the UK has a much more interesting relationship with the hoodie than America does.  In fact, I never knew about the uproar until I read this article, I just assumed that people wear hoodies because they are warm.  Is it offensive to wear a hoodie with the hood down as well?  While living in Fargo, ND I never see people wearing hoodies in the summer but always in the winter, usually under outer coats, because they help to insulate the wearer against windchill/warm the ears.  I do agree that the article is too focused on one country as it stands, but perhaps this could be better incorporated into the article as a whole. Zrekhan 16:02, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not offensive as much as class-connected. I think it is to do with the spread of US popular culture (branded sportswear being a culture import), tied in with the fear of (generally black) youths and the current fear of crime hysteria. We have a very high coverage of CCTV cameras and multiple crime "crackdowns" get votes. (I forget the number of crime bills in the last five years but it's loads). Wearing branded sportswear is deprecated in the UK - although if you read our chav article you'd think they all deserved it (chav is roughly urban white trash). The newspapers now refer to hoody wearing criminals as "hoodies". You get headlines like "Hoodie throws man off train", which is an incredible feat for a sweatshirt.. Secretlondon 16:48, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  viewpoint problems 

message: Who first made the sweatshirt hoodie we know today?
What region did it popularize in first?
Cultural significance and subculture scene association?
Variety of logoing, patterns and styles?
In media?
In pop culture?
This is a popular piece of clothing, it deserves more effort than it has received.
Also the section on England has to be modified and fit into a better narrative through the article. Too much focus. <Unsigned?>
Yes. These are the things I would be curious to know - but I'm not really sure where to look. Azoundria 05:26, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article is kind of crappy. 

message: In Saskatchewan, Canada a hoodie or hoody is traditionally known as a "bunnyhug" or "bunny hug". I added this to the hoodie entry but it was removed by an anonymous user. I'm not sure what source I would cite for this. On the Wiki, I found this page but it wouldn't really provide any further credibility. Thoughts?
:It's in The Canadian Oxford Dictionary as referenced on its Wiktionary page.Maguirer (talk) 07:53, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Bunnyhug" term 

message: I notice absolutely no mention of the large frontal pockets on hoodies - which are actually one of the most important features. I know when I created this article, that was the only thing I mentioned and where did it go?
I think we should agree on an official term for them, like frontal pockets or I heard someone say kangaroo pouch. What are the thoughts on this? Azoundria 05:24, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  It sounds like this user's experience was with the small, shallow pockets sometimes added to zip-up hoodies. This is a different pocket style from the "kangaroo pouch"-style large single pocket commonly found on unzippered hoodies. Livin270 (talk) 21:53, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Frontal pocket? 

message: Whoever tagged this with 
 was (ahem) spot on. You'd never know, reading this, about hoodies' glorious US history. They started primarily as an athletic garment and I do recall people wearing them, mainly boys and young men on sports teams, in at least the late 1970s. Their primary advantage was (and is) that they're good for wearing outside in cool weather as you can pull the hood up and stash your hands in the pocket when you get cold standing around waiting for things. And if it gets warmer, you can pull the hood down. It also has slightly scarf-like functions ... I used to wear it to keep my neck warm while skiiing.
Back in my teen years (the early and mid-'80s) the term "hoodie" had not yet been coined. They were just called hooded sweatshirts. They were never a fashion item and you would have laughed at the idea they ever would be. It was something you wore as very casual going out clothing or playing touch football or something like that. In my college years, I had about four or five different ones. Men always seemed to more attached to them (i.e., wearing them for years until they practically fell apart) than women. How can this article omit Adam Sandler's classic "Red Hooded Sweatshirt" song from Saturday Night Live? It captures everything hooded sweatshirts once were.
I have added this article to the hip-hop project to reflect its status as a current fashion item. Daniel Case 05:14, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: From the fashion project assessment department

message: All talk, none of this. Very frustrating. ALTON .ıl 09:12, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bizarre  

message: Here's a question I can't seem to find an answer for anywhere, so maybe somone in the UK can answer it... is this anti-hoodie sentiment extended towards all people who wear hooded sweatshirts, or only those who wear their hoods up indoors? I mean, I suppose there's no way of telling outdoors and in bad weather whos's going to take their hood down when they're in from the rain/cold, but do the clothing bans inside malls apply to the garments themselves or to the act of wearing the hood up in the mall? 68.236.159.105 14:24, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The sentiment is more concerned with outside actually as people are seen as hiding their faces from cctv cameras. I think the clothing bans inside malls are regardless of whether the hood is up or down. Secretlondon 00:13, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Question abou UK Stigma 

message: I have removed this, as I can't find any verified source on the net. The hoodie originally got its name from working men, anyway - so the claim is incorrect. --Lemons&Limes (talk) 13:45, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Hoodie being used as a female-only phrase

message: I can't believe a female has never donned one, if only in private. EdX20 (talk) 11:11, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Lemons&Lime, please cite a WP:RS source that says school uniform hoodies are for male students only, or that hoodies are more commonly worn by men. A picture or a personal site is not a reliable source. --Mosmof (talk) 23:47, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Worn by males only?

message: This article goes on and on about how evil hoodies are and hoodlums and theives use them so they've been banned by civilized society and are a symbol of moral corruption etc etc etc
But they're a staple of American casual wear. Looking around a classroom you'd probably see at least 40% of students with a hoodie close by. Most American youth use (sometimes layered) hoodies as heavy winter wear. No American would ever give a second glance because of a hoodie. They're perfectly normal, accepted, comfortable values well within the range of upstanding social behavior. And the article says absolutely NOTHING to that effect. In america, we wear them, we like them, and it's not a big deal. Maybe the brits are afraid of their fancy 100 trillion GBP webcam network not being able to see faces for hoods, but in america we wear whatever we want and (mostly) don't care what other people wear. 
So I tagged the article with . Someone please work this into the article- they are NOT AN ISSUE in the rest of the world. I added something at the bottom before and someone took it out, obviously feeling justified in removing non sourced material, as if it's really that important to mathematically prove a sweatshirt article. It's like I was trying to build a dam and I dropped a log in the water and he looked at the water flowing around it and said ITS NOT HOLDING WATER. TOO WEAK. And smashed the log.
:I came to the talk page to add this very sentiment. Here in the U.S. I've never heard of any sort of of discrimination against hoodies other than the distinction of being casual wear. My parents and even grandparents wear hooded sweatshirts so reading this article is more about controversy than the actual clothing item is quite bizarre.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.204.179 (talk) 04:46, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Very UK centric 

message: Hoodies have been common athletic and fitness attire in the USA for decades, since before Sylvester Stallone donned one in Rocky, as well as before the advent of hip hop or rap music. I mention this because there is far too much emphasis on stereotypes, and associating them with hip hop, in this article; at least from an American viewpoint. They are simply another type of sweatshirt, and are not anymore symbolic then crew-neck sweatshirts, but I suddenly feel dirty after reading this article, since I've donned hoodies while running ever since the seventies and never knew that anyone viewed me as a thug for doing so.
Rogun (talk) 14:11, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  The hoodie isn't just a staple for hip hop culture 

message: "Cameron also perpetuated the mistaken use of the word hoodie to refer to a wearer of a hooded garment, rather than the garment itself, a mistake that many older Britons now continue to make." Is it a mistake, or just an example of the flexibility of language, that the people wearing the garment are now known by the name of the garment? People wearing hoodies may not refer to themselves that way, but that doesn't make this use of the term a mistake. NelC (talk) 20:42, 21 September 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  UK use of the word 'Hoodie' 

message: has it been called a "hoodie" since it was invented in the 1930s?  i seem to only remember hearing this name in the last few years.  "hooded sweatshirt" before that?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.224.73.209 (talk) 02:17, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  etymology 

message: * How much in Britain, and elsewhere are hoodies allowed/forbidden for schoolchildren by school rules?:
*# For PE (physical education)?
*# As ordinary indoor or outdoor wear, in cold or bad weather?
*# As ordinary indoor or outdoor wear, at other times?
*: How much has long severe frost in the winter of 2009–2010 in Europe and the heavy snowfall of late 2010 in the United Kingdom changed these matters?
*:E.g. The JCB Academy in Rocester allows hoodies, but they must be a particular make of navy blue hoodie sold at the JCB Academy.
*:Anthony Appleyard (talk) 09:49, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hoodies at schools? 

message: A. It was invented and has been commonly and continually worn for decades before the slang term "hoodie" was adopted. Granted, referring to it as a "hoodie" is now fairly common among english speakers born since the 4th quarter of the 20th century, but older segments of the population may lack familiarity with the term while "hooded sweatshirt" or "sweatshirt" is more universally understood by those familiar with the garment. Also both, the majority of the items manufactures and retailers such as department stores and general non-specialy clothing outlets refer to the item as a "hooded sweatshirt" 
While wikipedia guidelines favor the most commonly used name, when that the use of that name is concentrated primarily among a particular geographic, cultural, linguistic or demographic population that the articles subject independent of then preference is given to the original, formal or technical name. An example is the sleeveless undershirt that is referred to commonly in the UK as a "vest" and by same age demographic that is familiar with the term "hoodie" in the US as a "wifebeater" but on wikipedia the conflict is avoided by referring to it as an "A-shirt" a much less commonly name that manufacturers and retailers use to describe the garment. 
B. While the information in the article may very well be factual, the misplaced weight and lack of perspective could mislead readers unfamiliar with the topic. While popularity of the "hoodie" among certain youth subcultures in the British isles may relatively recent. In the US where it was created, its post war ubiquity has continually grown as what is popularly considered  acceptable fashion increasingly became less formal. Currently in the US, "hooded sweatshirts" are very commonly worn by Americans either as athletic, recreational or casual apparel regardless of age, income level, gender, ethnicity, sexual orientation or political affiliation. Specifically among US teenagers/young adults, parents, teachers and police "hooded sweatshirts" are unremarkable and in themselves do not carry any specific social identity significance and may just as often be on the back of a model student, gang affiliate, socially awkward bookworm, or among those who identify with one of many often aesthetically diverse youth subcultures such as goth kids, scenesters, skaters, backpackers, crustpunks, grits, punks, surfers, neo-hippies, hardcore kids etc. In the US, far from being a recently introduced and socially contentious symbol, the "hooded sweatshirt" has for decades such generic staple in the American wardrobe that it could arguably along with the T-shirt, blue jeans and sneakers be considered part of the national costume of the United States.
C. The article is primarily focused on the social perception and cultural impact of the topic that is rather specific to the Ireland and the UK, rather than on the topic itself. A somewhat similar scenario might be as if the Dr. Martens article was instead titled "Docs" and mainly concentrated on the popularity and social impact the shoes had in the US in the late 20th century. This cultural significance of the "hoodie" in the UK and Ireland deserves a subsection in the article, with perhaps even a majority of the article's verbiage or a brief summery and link to a separate more in-depth article specific to this particular phenomenon.
173.133.130.151 (talk) 06:23, 10 December 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that the title needs to be changed to "Hooded sweatshirt," as this is the original name. I will start the process shortly. Regards,--Soulparadox (talk) 07:33, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The redirect has already been established, so it seems that "Hoodie" is the accepted title. If anyone knows anything more, please feel free to add to this thread. Regards,--Soulparadox (talk) 09:07, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Should we restructure this article and change the title to "Hooded Sweatshirt" or "Sweatshirt? 

message: From Slate: "When Did Hoodlums Start Wearing Hoods?". Most relevant paragraph here:
:The hooded sweatshirt doesn’t have the same long history as the hood itself. The Champion clothing company invented it in the 1930s. According to some, the hoodie was intended for warehouse workers in frigid upstate New York. That may be true, but the hooded sweatshirt quickly became popular with young people. Sears and Roebuck catalogs from the same decade offered hooded sweatshirts for $1 with the pitch “keep warm for winter sports,” and noted they were “great for boys.” (The hooded sweatshirt’s surge in popularity mirrored that of Mickey Mouse, who was born in 1928 and featured on sweatshirts in the same 1930s Sears spread as the hoodies.) Hoodies became associated street-toughs when Rocky captivated the American movie audience in the late 1970s. Some people began to associate the hooded sweatshirt with hoodlums in the 1970s, as graffiti artists and criminal gang members used them to hide their identities.
The linked New York Times article is probably even more helpful, though I'd like to get more sourcing on the claims made within. --Mosmof (talk) 23:10, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Possibly useful link 

message: Due to the Trayvon Martin incident, there's been a lot of focus on hoodies lately. Which is good for this article. Here's a really nice article on the history of the hoodie and its connotations:
* Trayvon Martin’s death has put spotlight on perceptions about hoodies
Should be useful for a lot of the info in the article already. SilverserenC 00:57, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Washington Post on history of the hoodie 

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message: This Statement from the New York Times is 100% Untrue and shows a lack of professional research when making claims.  "The hoodie took off in the 1970s, with several factors contributing to its success. Hip hop culture developed in New York City around this time, and the hoodies element of instant anonymity, provided by the accessible hood, appealed to those with criminal intent.<ref name="nyt" / Actually the hoodie is primarily associated with Hip Hop culture because Break-dancers wore hoodies to perform moves called head-spins, and hoodies made them easier, and more comfortable to perform. This is the truth. Although Criminals did utilize the instant anonymity that the hood provided, it is grossly inaccurate to attribute the criminal aspect to Hip-Hop as during the 1970s and early 1980s Hip-Hop primary popularized hoodies for Break-dancing purposes, and not criminal activity, as the "gangsta" element in Hip-Hop did not begin to surface until about 1987-1988.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.77.172 (talk) 15:26, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. WikiPuppies bark dig 17:34, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit request on 13 July 2013 

message: For those copyeditors who find the content spammy, I have nothing to do with any clothing brands, and do not even own a hoodie. The inclusion is based on the fact that it is a notable technological innovation. Thanks. Regards,--Soulparadox (talk) 07:35, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The recently added content would be better included in the Textile article, not here, since the technological innovation applies beyond hoodies. I favor moving the content away from this article. — RCraig09 (talk) 15:51, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I am not opposed to this if copyeditors believe this to be the most suitable course of action. Regards,--Soulparadox (talk) 00:03, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: A Google search for "10 year hoodie" turns up a link to a Kickstarter campaign, and several unrelated links to stores that offer 10-year guarantees on hoodies. I don't see any evidence that cotton yarn and a mock safety stitch are a "notable technological innovation"; rather, it seems more of an advertisement. A few users have removed this content, and User:Soulparadox keeps re-adding it as "an innovation in hoodie design", but I agree with User:Poiuyt Man's assessment in his edit comment: "Many hoodie manufacturers include unique features and innovations to differentiate their product; singling out a single product is simply advertisement." - Brian Kendig (talk) 16:02, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Wonderful  In addition your conclusion, I think that your Talk contribution to this thread is an exemplar for how contentious edits should be resolved. Not only have you undertaken substantial research and recounted the edit history accurately, but you have conveyed your position in a respectful manner. Thank you. Regards,--Soulparadox (talk) 14:00, 19 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Inclusion of "10-year-hoodie" technology 

message: There was an edit adding a Japan section that kept getting deleted because it was incomprehensibly written/sourced but it actually has some value. It essentially said hoodies are well-liked in Japan and notably feature in the Decora street fashion style which "originated in the late 1990s/early 2000s where a plain shirt and hoodie was often worn with short tutu-like skirts". Their sources were http://showstudio.com/projects/sportswear/hoodies-gary-warnett (didn't actually watch the video because 30 minutes of a guy talking about hoodies is not my style) and http://www.aka-hoodies.com/ I found another source that seems better for the Decora factoid: https://jpninfo.com/94276 May come back later and add this if no one else does. Livin270 (talk) 02:03, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Japan 

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thread_title:  A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion 

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message: The article's imagery was white- and male-centered. I introduced a woman and a black person wearing a hoody and tried to avoid stereotypical representations such as inserting the picture of the black person into the passage about crime in the US. Grizma (talk) 11:17, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Introduced a broader variety of images