Talk:Ferrari Berlinetta Boxer

message: The picture of 512BB is representing a modified version, not the original one. Please replace with a correct image.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.61.119.4 (talk) 11:05, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Discussion 

message: I've deleted the words about sales in the USA: "No BB was ever originally sold in North America, as Enzo did not believe it to be worth the cost of complying with the extra environmental and safety regulations. However, third parties made conversions, and quite a few of them are now in the United States."  There's no citation for this, and I've found two current sales contradicting this: http://www.classicandperformancecar.com/ferrari/512/ferrari-512-bb-lhd-in-maldon-essex-united-kingdom/246917/ad ("The example offered here is a 1981 left hand drive 512BB in Rosso Corsa with Black Leather, sold new to Mr James Landrum of Pittsburgh Pennsylvania") and http://www.classicandperformancecar.com/ferrari/512/ferrari-512-bb-1980-in-netherlands/268844/ad ("This BB was delivered new in USA, and came to Europe in 1992"). --Phil Holmes (talk) 10:56, 4 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sales in the USA 

message: For over 10 years there has been back and forth on this.
I assert the manufacturer's documentation at the time of production clearly indicates "BB 512" and "BB 512i" as the names of the cars, not "512 BB" and "512 BBi".   The Ferrari website (Past Models section) unfortunately uses the BB/BBi "nicknames" and every once in a while someone (expert or otherwise) comes in and changes all the refs.   Both references from a citation perspective are "valid".   The question is:  which is more appropriate here?  I argue that the website may change but the immutable historical artifacts that describe the models use BB 512 and BB 512i.
Comments?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Buzzm (talk • contribs) 01:54, 23 December 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: I understand what you mean, and I agree that period factory literature puts the "BB" first. However, in cases like this where there are multiple common names for something, my view is that the article should mention all names in common use. There's a couple sections in the Wikipedia policy/manual of style that touch on this, see WP:OTHERNAMES, MOS:LEADALT and perhaps WP:POVNAMING. For example, one could say "Factory literature at the time of the model's launch refers to them as a BB 512/BB 512i, however other sources in the automotive press commonly use 512 BB/512 BBi nomenclature." This could be readily cited from both the manufacturer's brochures/manuals and the numerous sources in the automotive press, Ferrari website, auction houses etc that use the "incorrect" name. Just like the section in this article about the origin of the BB nomenclature, I've found that the best way to avoid edit warring and periodic reverts is to clearly state the existence of common alternate names in the text and explain their origins/use as much as can be supported with reliable sourcing. While I admire the passion for  correctness, my interpretation of wikipedia best practice is that if multiple reliable sources consistently use alternative names for a subject, it is probably worth noting in the article. As an aside, the official Ferrari history website is not the best source at times, but I don't think that changes my conclusions here as there are plenty of other reliable sources that put the BB last. Prova MO (talk) 16:24, 23 December 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: To be clear, I have no issue with keeping BB 512/BB 512i as the primary nomenclature for these cars in the article. I think that is the right course of action. I'm just suggesting including an acknowledgement in the article text of the widespread use of the alternate "512 BB" nomeclature. Prova MO (talk) 16:42, 23 December 2021 (UTC)
replies: text: User:Prova_MO Your observation is reasonable and you seem to have a good deal of experience with the pages for the older Ferrari road cars. In the absence of a "second opinion" I always try to drive (no pun intended) to the absolute objective references.  I will add some minimally distracting/confusing text around this.  Buzzm (talk) 23:00, 27 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  512 BBi vs. BB 512i 

message: The engine is not technically a boxer, it is a flat 12. Ferrari told people that BB stands for berlinetta boxer because the car was actually named for famous actress Bridget Bardot. 174.49.8.136 (talk) 16:35, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: This account of the name's origin is already discussed under the existing BB Acronym section of this article. Prova MO (talk) 20:36, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  BB does not stand for berlinetta boxer 

message: Just mentioning that over the past 2 to 3 years, the layout of this article has improved.  In particular, I like the aesthetic of each variant (365,512,512i) having a main pic, description, then a modest gallery with comments about the features.   Personally I am not excited about the yellow-green 512i in the grey market section because it shows no EPA/DOT mods (esp. side marker lights) but it is a ... rare .... color. Buzzm (talk) 11:29, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm going to go ahead and remove that photo of the green car. Like you said, it has nothing to visually indicate it is a federalized/grey market car. So it's not helpful for that section and the caption calling it a grey market car seems like WP:OR. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice to have a photo of some of the more drastic federalization modifications that were occasionally done like impact bumpers. Unfortunately no such photos exist in commons as far as I can tell and cars with these modifications are becoming rarer as they are returned to factory specification. At least the red BBi has side markers from federalization. Prova MO (talk) 14:35, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nice formatting everyone