Talk:Kurdistan/Archive 5

message: I suggest to add Mannaeans article to the history section. The reason is that the center of Mannaean Kingdom was in Mahabad, a Kurdish city in western Iran, which is part of the geo-cultural region of Kurdistan.
 
Heja Helweda 17:57, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mannaeans 

message: So what do you think?--Kagan the Barbarian 14:25, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I repeat the infobox has to go. Which legal or Wiki language you want me to speak for you to do something about it. And the problem with the map is there is no consensus about it, choose from one of these ,  .--Kagan the Barbarian 15:59, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Aucaman 

message: Article is almost looking like a country article. What is trying to be done? --levent 23:26, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  kurdistan? 

message: is closing their eyes and ears to any kind of dispute and hoping to get this obviously idealogical page running as long as possible. The flag, the infobox, this page is a joke. I gave my reasons, remove the flag, remove the infobox. If you don't, I will, this page is not under your dictate.--Kagan the Barbarian 07:10, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The reasons have been explained. If you still have any concerns on this matter it is a good suggestion to ask a mediation. Diyako Talk + 15:10, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Diyako, I don't mean to be hostile but you have to compromise with people here and rid this article of seperatist undertones if you don't want to get it vandalized till the end of free editing in Wikipedia. Regards.--Kagan the Barbarian 18:31, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kurdish tactic on this article 

message: If you think that link to Britannica is a reliable source then why not add the info about origins of Kurdish people in Kurds article? It says ethnic origins of Kurdish people ae uncertain. 
Also that source does not give exact numbers for area, just an approximation. It does not mention anything about national anthem or such. It has no autonomy in Turkey. There can't be an native language for the area. What are the sources for these?
Why don't you just turn the page into a country article so people will understand that this is a joke and just laugh and pass on? --levent 15:31, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources 

message: All, please see the discussion at :Category talk:Kurdistan (Which articles should have the tag 'Category:Kurdistan'), and weigh-in if you like. Thanks, --Moby 14:04, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Which articles should have the tag 'Category:Kurdistan' 

message: Flying the Kurdish flag in Iran is nnot a criminal offence and the cited sources do not verify this. 69.196.139.250 04:53, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. Here is the correct link .Heja Helweda 03:52, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: I removed the invalid information under the flag

message: For people that are aware of this subject, they would clearly see that the map is pure properganda. It is also highlighting areas that have Kurds with 20% or less. These areas are not "Kurdistan." How can it be "the land of the Kurds" when they only make up 20-30% of the population of those perticular areas? I am specifically talking about Iraq and Iran. I am not to sure of Turkey's area. The map needs to be changed. This map is more accurate: Chaldean 03:50, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually you make a good point: this article and its contents are for people who are NOT aware of this subject -> It's a Kurdish propaganda article.  It's to legitimize their terrorism and separatism.  People from western countries will read it like it's a separate country under hardship.  I also objected to the map and the flag but I don't have wikipowers to correct the issue :)  --Gokhan 06:51, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: The Map

message: We live in 2006 not in 1800 , so please save it for someone else..
I don´t say anything wrong with Category Kurdistan or with anyother Kurdish categories.. But it seems a lot of people doo.. so the question is why??
OtrO DiAOtrO DiA 15:04, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  what? haven't you read all the dispute going on? It seems you didn't, since the answer to your question has been stated a million times. Nuage bulut 17:38, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  It seems everything is Propaganda

message: re:  It is a map with a more recent date (2002 vs. 1992) and I thought it a good addition. --Moby 03:40, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Good point, but could try to find one that is less ugly? (no offense) Also, I don't see a huge difference between the two maps. —Khoikhoi 03:41, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  True, the basic data seems just about the same and, yes, the map uses a less appealing style. I actually think that the more to-the-point style is better at showing the Kurdish region. Maybe the infobox in Kurdistan is not the best place for this particular image, but I believe the fact that the CIA continues to show basically the same region as "Kurdish" bolsters the claim that this is the region that is Kurdistan. Note also the inset caption characterising it as the traditional Kurdish-inhabited area. --Moby 03:57, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: True, but as I said before, it's kinda ugly. Could you find a nicer-looking one? —Khoikhoi 04:07, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  It does kind of look like drippings from a green candle. However, it is a valid and more recent reference. I'm going to drop this whole conversation on to Talk:Kurdistan and see where it goes. --Moby 04:15, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

text:  I think the map is omitting an isolated pocket of ethnic Kurds in northeastern Iran, but I guess it is OK. I think the Kurdish independance movements have no claims in that area whatsoever.
Ref 1 - travel map: http://geo.ya.com/travelimages/az-kurd-map.gif
Ref 2 - Iran ethnic map: http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/images/iran-ethnic-groups-2.gif
Hugo Dufort 08:31, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Kurdish Areas 2002 CIA 

message: Kurdistan has to be independent, Im not a kurd my self, but everyone in the world needs an proper identity, nationality, I hate all occupation of etnic peoples land.
--why are you shouting "I know nothing yet I comment here" ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.107.207.137 (talk • contribs) 
Only once all people are identified as equal, will there be true everlasting peace. Pure inuyasha 21:26, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Independent Kurdistan  

message: Do we really need to use the EB as a source for this article?  As an encyclopedia its surely not good form to source from other encyclopedias.  Barnaby dawson 17:59, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  EB 

message: There seems to be consesus that "Kurdistan" is not a nation or anytning like that and shouldn't be presented as such. I have a problem with the sections Geography, Climate and (to some extend) Historical attractions, since they are - or should be - well covered in the articles of the nations the Kurds inhabitates. Right? Medico80 16:09, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sections should be deleted 

message: In this this edit, way too much POV was added, such as:
Another militant terrorist group, the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), has fought an armed campaign in Turkey, Iraq, Syria and Iran for over thirty years. In Turkey, more than 30,000 Turkish people where killed as a result of the terrorist actions of PKK.
Also references of Armenia, Kurdistan in the Ottoman Empire -- they were all deleted. I suggest we start from reverting the anon's edit, then adding the deleted information, but it would take too much work to individually undo his edits. —Khoikhoi 03:57, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Praytell, how is that POV? It's just pointing out the facts. I can provide sources for that 30K, even from Wikipedia: Abdullah Ocalan for one: Approximately 30,000 people were killed by PKK as a result of these attacks between 1984 and 2003. You have a funny way of detecting POV, in that it's quite wrong and you're reverting factual adds, which is against WP policy. MonsterOfTheLake 01:10, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reason for revert 

message: کوردستانKurdistan
(Flag of Kurdistan)
(Coat of Arms)
National Motto:  National Anthem:  Ey Reqîb
LocationParts of Turkey, Iran, Iraq, Syria and Armenia
LanguageKurdish کوردی
CapitalNot Established
Capital's Coordinates  N/A
Largest CityArbil or (Irbil)
Area - Total  - % waterRanked (?)th 190,000 km² - 390,000 km²74,000 sq.mi-151,000 sq.mi NA
Population- Total (2006Est.) - Density Ranked (?)th 25-37.5 Million “Inside Kurdistan”  (?)
Time zone(UTC+2 to +3)
I made this info box for the Kurdistan Article, I put it up but "Khoikhoi" told me that I damaged the Kurdistan Article with it. I think it looks much better than the infobox on the Kurdistan article right now. I don't know about the map, I made it with Photoshop trying to as accurate as possible, any suggestion's or comments is appreciated. Another thing I noticed is the population figures are incorrect. On the article "Kurdish People" it has the following estimates. 
Turkey  14  -  22  Million 
Iran    4.8 -  6.6 Million
Iraq    4   -  6   Million
Syria   0.9 -  2.8 Million
Armenia 42,139
Georgia 34,000 - 60,000
Do the math and you get 25 - 37.5 Million People. But this guy keep's telling me that my information is incorrect and I need to support or give sources which I did when I posted the changes to the article. So I think some of this information needs to be updated. 
Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by D.Kurdistani (talk • contribs) 00:24, 20 August 2006.
:Hi D.Kurdistani. First off, the infobox seems to be based off . We don't want to fool readers into making them think something Kurdistan is not—it's a geographic and cultural region. Secondly, your map appears to include Baghdad and Hatay Province in Kurdistan, and I just think that the one we have right now (drawn by the CIA) is going to be the most accurate. As for the numbers, not all Kurds live in Kurdistan. The numbers at Kurdish people are for Kurds worldwide, not just in Kurdistan.
:Anyways, I apprecaite your efforts, but you have to understand that this is a sensitive subject and controversial changes are most likely going to be reverted. —Khoikhoi 00:50, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Keep this for possible future use (though the map needs work IMHO)!  If (admittedly biased) authors like Peter W. Galbraith, Kevin McKiernan and others are right, it won't be too long. For significant Kurdish areas outside of Iraqi Kurdistan you could use a diagnal stripe shading perhaps? Hoping you can use this infobox one day! Khirad 08:32, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: InfoBox

message: Now one has to show passports when entering the Kurdish part of what used to be Iraq from the rest of that soon to be ex country. So Kurdistan de facto exists. It is just a question of when any other state will recognise this.  This will only create more distability as the Kurdish minority in Turkey will wish to secede and become part of this 'new' putative state. But if the 40 million Kurds get a homeland it will be worthwhile. SmokeyTheFatCat 19:59, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Existence 

message: After reading all the contributions on this talk page and then checking the article with reliable sources, i can safely say that the factual accuracy of this article kurdistan is disputed. Lets try to solve the problems in this discussion page, instead of  pushing POV. E104421 22:03, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. --K a s h  Talk | email 08:16, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: factual accuracy