Talk:Bruce Perens

message: Bruce has edited this Talk page, and on one occasion the article, as User:Bruce Perens.  I added the template .  User:Pcb21 removed it with the edit comment:
:rm "Notable Wikipedian" notice - would be unfair to describe Bruce as a "Wikipedian" at this time given his concerns with the project licence)
I can see your point, but on the other hand, given that his one article-space edit so far is autobiographical it's sort of fair enough to let people know that he's editing his own article.   I think his edit is just fine and should stand; I just think of that template as one way to be extra-cautious about autobiography.  And it only says "has edited Wikipedia" in the text of the template; many other people carrying this template have made very few edits, and some have (usually much less reasonable) beefs with Wikipedia.  What do you think? — ciphergoth 15:17, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Heck, Daniel Brandt and Ashida Kim have that sort of message on the respective article talk pages, and both (apparently) hate Wikipedia to pieces. Maybe it's just the title of the template that makes people shy of using it - but on the other hand,  would not exactly be short and tidy... =) --wwwwolf (barks/growls) 09:41, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

text: That what is not needed?  The template or his consent?  — ciphergoth 20:47, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The template.  He made one article space edit and a few to this talk page.  I think it is a stretch to call him a wikipedian. Kotepho 21:28, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Notable Wikipedian? 

message: The fight to eliminate Morse Code proficiency testing for Amateur Radio licenses, which was the mission of No-Code International and the concern of much of the Amateur Radio world, has ended. We won. The U.S. gave up code testing, as did most countries. I hear Russia still wants its code tests, but that's about the only country I know of that does. - Bruce —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.81.245.138 (talk) 05:17, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Time marches on 

message: I removed "Politically, he favours a communist ideology, and pursues the destruction
of individual property rights through his advocacy of Open Source and Free
Software." - Bruce —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.81.245.138 (talk) 18:29, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Defacement 

message: I'm not sure what your intention is with this edit but I am unsure how noting that all the photos of him on Flickr show him with the same tie adds anything to the article. Furthermore, merely linking to pictures of him on Flickr does not represent a legitimate source as it's just a series of pictures. Thanks. Will (aka Wimt) 19:18, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That was a lousy edit, but Perens does seem to always were a tux tie.  I'm sure he has more than one, and I've no idea who knots it for him, or whether it's done wrong all the time, but it wouldn't be terrible to point out that this is a trademark of his style.  Here it is again:  Gronky 19:27, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah I'd be fine with saying it's his trademark style, though we would really be better with a reference to source who said that so it doesn't seem like original research. We certainly can't say it's the only tie he has though, because I have seen a picture of him wearing another one! Will (aka Wimt) 22:32, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Nah, it was probably the same tie but he put it on backwards.  I hear he's no expert at putting on ties. :-P Gronky 01:05, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hahaha yeah you do have a point there. :-) Will (aka Wimt) 01:10, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tie ownership 

message: FYI: I have four of those ties. I tie them in a half-windsor, as far as I'm aware. For me a Tux tie is like wearing a tartan tie would be for a Scott or a regimental rep tie would be for a... uh, I guess that's British. But none of that belongs in the Wikipedia, until some alternate reality in which I become a fashion model! - Bruce —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.81.245.138 (talk) 05:54, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Totally agree with you about not including the tie comment in the article - that's why I deleted it. On another point, assuming you are Bruce (and I certainly have no reason to doubt it), would you consider releasing this photo of you from your website under a free license of some description? At the time of writing, I note that someone has uploaded this image into this article, but the copyright status is listed as unknown and so the image will soon be deleted. It is also unlikely to qualify under Wikipedia's Fair use policy. Regards. Will (aka Wimt) 11:00, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I see that User:CGA has removed the image at your request, so no need to answer my question. Regards. Will (aka Wimt) 15:34, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Hi Wimt, i'm the person who uploaded the picture and i've emailed Bruce directly about me editing his page on wikipedia to ask him if he wanted me to add (or he wanted to do it himself) some more important and considerable issues about his life. ie: occupation date and place of birth in the box (which i just removed because it had no much sense without info) his resigning from OSRM and things alike (ie: OSI). i'm sure you've got the point. He replied to me kindly and gently saying that he doesn't allow us to upload a picture of him on wikipedia and that "he have issues" on the license of wikipedia. I'm going to ask him if i can quote the email here for cearness sake. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by CGA (talk • contribs) 15:42, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: OK I have tagged the image for speedy deletion as it has been removed from the article and is copyrighted. Will (aka Wimt) 16:01, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: No doubt we can get a revised version of GFDL out of FSF once the GPL3 work is over. FSF's work on GPL3 is of vastly higher quality than that in the original GFDL. A revised license will have clearer language and hopefully will actually qualify as "Open Source" under the Open Source Definition. Once a revised license is available, I think it would be advisable for Wikipedia to post a legal notice of intention to change the license, remove material from anyone who objects (which is unlikely IMO) and close out this issue. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.81.245.138 (talk) 04:45, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tie ownership? Don't you folks have something better to do? 

message: As according to: Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons: Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material — whether negative, positive, or just highly questionable — about living persons should be removed immediately and without discussion from Wikipedia articles, talk pages, user pages, and project space.
According to http://www.codon.org.uk/~mjg59/bruce/ and various other places, Bruce isn't necessarily seen as "a prominent figure" by members of the open source community.  If this fact isn't agreed upon by other "prominent people, then at the least it should be sourced.  I've removed it for the time being.
There are other statements in this article which could benefit by references. Jarich 04:48, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Please flag them with . Lentower 15:20, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material  

message: Jarich - the material at http://www.codon.org.uk/~mjg59/bruce/ seems to be mainly ad hominem, and seems to be retaliation for Perens' action against the Novell-Microsoft agreement - some of the folks on that list are known to be Novell employees. In addition, the material at codon.org is generally unknown, for example a search for links to it on Google yields no references and similarly google news shows no stories referencing it. Perens action was very strongly supported, with 3449 signatures as of this morning at http://techp.org/p/1 and IMO the Open Source community sentiment generally in his corner.
There is material to support the contention that Perens is a leader, including such things as the Novell-Microsoft protest, his many speeches and appearances (how many folks get invited to speak to UN meetings?), and his historical role in the movement. References for this material are widely available.
OpenSourcerer 12:59, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Ad hominem?

message: Can someone please fix the imagemap issue around the movie from UN WSIS? It's not in the wikitext, but in some aspect of the wiki software. Len Tower, whoever removed the movie was probably not vandalizing but was attempting to address this issue.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.81.245.138 (talk) 23:16, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks.  Then whomever did that should had: said so in an edit summary (there wasn't one), and perhaps uncommented the image and commented out the video.  It could be fixed by others, as I suspect it's a problem over all of en.wikipedia.org.  I suggest it be left alone for at least a day, unless someone is a wiki software expert.  I did notice the imagemap problem after i did the revert, and assumed it was a temporary software problem and would be fixed. Lentower 00:36, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I just reverted a change on the video template, which cured the bug.  see Template talk:Video#bug in imagemap change. Lentower 00:50, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Bug report with video

message: Hi Folks,
Someone's been doing some historical revisionism. I did not create "the basis" of the Open Source definition as suggested in a recent revision. I created the full document in its exact text. I created the Debian Free Software Guidelines first, and then there was the meeting at which Christine Petersen suggested the name "Open Source" that is referred to in OSI history - I was not there. The next day Eric Raymond called me and brought me in to the formation of OSI. I created the Open Source Definition by a simple removal of "Debian" and replacement with "Open Source" where appropriate. Really just a string substitution. The text stayed entirely the same.
As stated I did not make up the name. The folks at the meeting the day before I was involved did not participate again. - Bruce
: My apologies. No revisionism was intended. Use of the passive voice there was an oversight on my part. TCC (talk) (contribs) 04:25, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Very well. Sorry for being so steamed, but the recent edits (some before yours) were getting rather far from reality.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.81.245.138 (talk) 04:58, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Historical revisionism 

message: I changed the tense describing Bruce as a leader in the open-source community. He used to hold leadership positions in notable parts of the open-source community like OSI, Debian, etc., but it doesn't seem that he has positions of similar stature now. PuerExMachina (talk) 22:48, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: "Leader" is a peacock term in the first place. I've rewritten it to say "programmer and advocate", both of which he still is. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 23:00, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeh, but there are people who are programmer and advocates in their basement and no one's listening.  We need to say something to indicate that he gets paid to travel around and newspapers print what he says.  I do agree though that "leader" doesn't fit him so well.  Influential? --Gronky (talk) 08:01, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  That's adequately covered over the course of the intro. There's no requirement to boil the entire article down to the first sentence. I don't even think "influential" is required: the Richard Stallman intro is well-written and gets away without it, and Stallman has certainly had more influence than Perens. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 18:30, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

text: It's not a typo.  "Ham" is slang for "amateur radio operator", although it is probably poor style.  The plain English terminology should be used instead of jargon. — QuicksilverT @ 01:14, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is vs Was 

message: Quote
"Perens is also a ham"
Unquote
>_> I think someone had a good laugh with this typo.
Dwo shwoom (talk) 00:03, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's not a typo.  "Ham" is slang for "amateur radio operator", although it is probably poor style.  The plain English terminology should be used instead of jargon. — QuicksilverT @ 01:14, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  What the... ? 

message: Someone has added "and Raymond" to the sentence distinguishing Perens' views from Stallman's. Another sentence explains Raymond's views. Since I got here in an attempt to verify or debunk a claim that Raymond is notable primarily for self-publishing, I am not sure waht to do about this. I do begin to see the point. At a minimum, the first reference should give the full name and link to the Eric A. Raymond page. I question the relevance of Raymond's views in a section devoted to Perens', where they get half the content. Sure both were involved with the OSI, but Raymond has his own page already.Elinruby (talk) 20:03, 3 November 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Viewpoint section 

message: It looks like he's about to puke in the current video thumbnail. Someone fix that.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.169.146.68 (talk) 01:54, 18 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: It's a random frame from the video, automatically selected by the software.  A better still image should be found and the video should be relocated elsewhere on the page, or merely mentioned as being available on Wikimedia Commons. — QuicksilverT @ 01:14, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox photo 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on Bruce Perens. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090224044617/http://technocrat.net:80/d/2007/12/3/31038/ to http://technocrat.net/d/2007/12/3/31038
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090223025543/http://technocrat.net:80/d/2007/8/17/25151/ to http://technocrat.net/d/2007/8/17/25151
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090319124730/http://technocrat.net:80/d/2007/8/17/25148/ to http://technocrat.net/d/2007/8/17/25148
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090204002109/http://perens.com:80/works/articles/EIF2/ to http://perens.com/works/articles/EIF2/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090223025659/http://technocrat.net:80/d/2007/8/17/25169/ to http://technocrat.net/d/2007/8/17/25169
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090223025914/http://technocrat.net:80/d/2007/8/17/25149/ to http://technocrat.net/d/2007/8/17/25149
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20131104135143/http://perens.com/works/articles/State8Feb2008.html to http://perens.com/works/articles/State8Feb2008.html
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 15:15, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The first footnote references /https://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/09/business/technology-champion-of-open-source-is-out-at-hewlett-packard.html which is dead. 
It's at e.g. https://web.archive.org/web/20210330145430/https://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/09/business/technology-champion-of-open-source-is-out-at-hewlett-packard.html
:Fixed, thanks. Schazjmd (talk) 14:00, 5 August 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another external link to modify 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Bruce Perens. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.ageofpeers.com/resources/transcripts/transcript-bruce-perens-about-marketing-open-source-software
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100331083827/http://perens.com/works/testimony/PerensJMRI.pdf to http://perens.com/works/testimony/PerensJMRI.pdf
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 18:54, 26 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Bruce Perens does not want his birthday on his Wikipedia article. See https://twitter.com/BrucePerens/status/1055354331048796161. atoponce (talk) 07:19, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm more concerned that the cited ref doesn't even seem to support the date at all. Instead, it only says that he was 44 years old (article date is September 9, 2002). That is only sufficient to narrow it down to an approximate 1-year window. Our article actually previously had that until the specific date was added in this edit that did not add any further reference. Should we go back to that previous content (per WP:DOB guideline) as an age/approx-year (but not month/day)? DMacks (talk) 07:47, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text:  (forgot to include the ping in previous comment). DMacks (talk) 07:49, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text:  According to the quoted tweet, he claims the edit was made with malicious intent by someone who purchased private data to get access to his birthdate. If the year was on the article previously, and is publicly available, such as in the NY Times article, then it seems fitting to restore the year, while leaving out the month and day. atoponce (talk) 08:06, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. DMacks (talk) 05:30, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Birthdate Removal