Talk:Bubbles (Trailer Park Boys character)

message: Hey there, guy, stop redirecting the article without providing justification. You claim it's due to an AFD, but I looked and there isn't one. Stop vandalizing this article immediately. Thanks in advance.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.107.188.130 (talk) 22:08, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Continued Redirection

message: This article is currently being cleaned up. Currently, I'm trying to pare down excess information, and clean up the format, as well as adding sources and references. Notability is still being established. Kinsloft (talk) 03:42, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Reading the guide on in-universe writing seems to suggest that this article is clearly not written entirely in-universe. There are several mentions of Bubbles being a character, of the events occurring in different seasons of a television show, and so forth. Kinsloft (talk) 01:49, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Article Cleanup

message: Hi, I'm , and I've volunteered to take on this mediation case. I think I'm pretty dispassionate and enjoy resolving disputes, so I'll try to get yours settled. From what I can see, this is only a dispute between two users, unless I'm missing some discussion elsewhere. Kinsloft is currently trying to keep this as a standalone article on the merits of their cleanup efforts, and Eusebeus is attempting to merge/redirect what they consider useful information to List of Trailer Park Boys characters under the aegis of WP:PLOT. Have I gotten anything wrong? If the parties can agree to the scope of the dispute, we can move forward from there. east718 // talk // email // 00:12, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, for the most part, that sums it up, however, the scope seems to be a bit more than this article at the moment, and his edits do not appear to be constructive to any of the articles. Case in point, in this edit and this edit, he has left incomplete sentences, removed references that are still in use, and then proceeded to add tags that are inconsistent with the actual nature of the articles in question. Kinsloft (talk) 01:41, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: That is correct - and see the related issues at characters pages for Julian and Ricky - let's add them to mediation as well. My "unconstructive" edits may be related to the sudden reversion of a longstanding redirection to the LOC by an anon contributor, (now logged in above) who made undiscussed edits, ignored WP:BRD when I reverted back and then chose to accuse me of vandalism - and in fact is still accusing me in so many words of vandalism, which is frankly maudit f(*& de c(*& behaviour of a c$#(*&d, pardon my French. But accusations of vandalism are completely unacceptable here.  Eusebeus (talk) 19:24, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not too concerned about Julian or Ricky at the moment; individual articles can stand or fall on their own merits. We can address the other articles later, if you wish. From my reading of WP:PLOT, the article must be written an out-of-universe perspective, and secondary sources should be used to cite material of the sort listed in WP:WAF#Secondary information (this is simply an extension of our verifiability policy). I'm going to go looking for a few possible sources to use. Lastly, can I request that comments such as "his edits [aren't] constructive" etc. be avoided by everyone? It's a matter of effective discourse and professionalism that we refrain from personalizing disputes and treat each other with courtesy. east718 // talk // email // 02:05, 18 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: From my reading of WP:WAF, I feel the sources I've added to the page satisfy primary and secondary sources, and that the article did adhere to the section about plot summaries in accordance with WP:NOT#Plot. I feel that if an editor disagrees with how much of that accordance is being met, then the ambiguous language in use should be modified, rather than removing entire sections of the article, which helps contribute to the article as a whole. Kinsloft (talk) 02:16, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

text: I am. I would like to get this resolved before I continue the effort of improving these articles. Kinsloft (talk) 13:04, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mediation 

message: I see no material here that cannot be adequately covered at the LOC; the notability, fictional, reference, & in-universe concerns remain unaddressed. As we all know, absent a solid foundation of real-world notability, be it as a meme, merchandising, referential or totemic figure, demonstrable real-world cultural significance etc..., individual spinouts are justified in the case of length. This, however, usually trips up against WP:UNDUE. As has been well-established at the talk page of the failed FICT debate, the LOC is a generally agreeable middle path for fictional topics, where the principal focus is the in-universe characterisation of the subject. Since the focus of the three main characters of TPB is (and should remain) their in-universe characterisation, this is therefore best treated at the LOC. As also was generally agreed at the failed WT:FICT, the accumulation of fancruft, unencyclopedic trivia, excessive fictional biographical material and other such content is highly discouraged per the clear terms elaborated at WP:NOT#PLOT; the use of a centralised LOC for in-universe content offers a practical and manageable mechanism for containing such material. As a result, it seems to me that as no compelling case has been made for the restoration of this material based on a real-world notability of the character, this should be redirected to the LOC. I will post this to the other character pages as well, since it applies equally. Eusebeus (talk) 15:42, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: As interesting as all that is, I don't see how the talk page of a so called failed debate really matters. There needs be no compelling case for the "restoration" of the material, as there was never a consensus to remove it. Out of universe notability can be established here. Kinsloft (talk) 23:27, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Redirection