Talk:Mage: The Ascension

message: I noticed that listing all the Traditions, conventions and other detailed subdivisions in Mage is increasingly popular. However, later such lists haunt with lots of red links. Ie: what is the sense of Listing the Pharmacopoeists if there is even no article on Technocracy? Sorry, but even main Traditions have inadequate articles and links to them exist since 11 Oct 2003. Also, please check the target of links - Zaibatsu and Secret Societies probably don't point where they were meant to.
As I said before, I think that article on Tradition/Convention-level faction are OK but beyond that they are probably best suited as subsections of their respective Tradition/Convention. This is Wikipedia not encyclopedia on WoD only and thus minor items that have no chance to expand beyond the stub are likely to be voted for deletion. -- Forseti 09:33, 25 Nov 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  On factions list 

message: Much to my astonishment I've recently discovered that the article on Mage: the Ascension doesn't mention Ascencion at all! While we are at it, it doesn't elaborate on Awakening, Epiphanies, Gilgul and other "development work" thingies. Perhaps Spirituality section would be needed but I'm not sure how much detail should be put there - what do you think?
Also I suspect that reader knowing nothing on Mage would be thrown at deep water on History section - perhaps we should do some introduction on factions, chantries, mastery-apprenticeship and other social things. This could also include information on nature of Ascension War, namely that it is silent war not overt. Else the reader could imagine it as sort of heavy-militaristic manga bent on mysticism.
I'd have rather busy weekend but from monday I plan to develop the article somewhat so please give your thoughts. -- Forseti 23:52, 25 Nov 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spirituality and Society sections 

message: I'm not a regular Wikipedia user, and don't understand the conventions entirely, but am planning to look into the request for peer review for this article, and if possible do a significant edit of it. I haven't any better way to transmit the edit I've worked on than to include it here in draft form:
-Intro-
Mage: The Ascension is a role-playing game based in the World of Darkness, and is published by White Wolf Game Studio. The characters portrayed in the game are broadly referred to as Mages, and are able to perform subtle or outlandish acts of magic. The idea of magic in the game is broadly inclusive of real and imaginary mystical practices and other belief systems as well, so that many Mages do not precisely resemble modern fantasy wizards. Indeed, science itself is taken to ultimately be a form of magic. In 1996, Mage: The Ascension won the Origins Award for Best Roleplaying Rules 1995.
-Metaphysics-
The basic premise of Mage: The Ascension is that everyone has the ability, at some level, to shape reality. This capacity is dormant in most humans, who are known as sleepers. A mage is a character in whom the portion that shapes reality (commonly called the Avatar) is 'Awakened,' leading to the mage having the ability to change reality via willpower, beliefs, and specific magical techniques.
The beliefs and techniques of Mages vary enormously, and the ability to alter reality can only exist in the context of a coherent system of belief and technique, called a paradigm. Such a paradigm provides an explanation for how the universe works and the underpinnings of the understanding of how to change it. For example, an alchemical paradigm might describe the act of wood burning as the wood "releasing its essence of elemental Fire," while modern science would describe fire as "combustion resulting from a complex chemical reaction." Paradigms tend to be nuanced per the individual Mage, but the vast majority belong to broad categories of paradigm, e.g., Shamanism, Medieval Sorcery, religious miracle working, and superscience.
The majority of paradigms differ substantially from the consensus, or the accepted view of reality. Consensus is determined by the Sleepers who (though unawakened) through sheer numbers impart to reality its general rules. When a mage performs an act of magic that does not seriously violate this commonsense version of reality, in game terms this is called coincidental magic. Magic that deviates wildly from consensus is called vulgar magic. When it is performed ineptly, or is vulgar, and especially if it is vulgar and witnessed by sleepers, magic can cause Paradox, a phenomenon in which reality tries to resolve the apparent contradiction. Paradox is difficult to predict and almost always bad for the mage. The most common consequences of paradox include physical damage directly to the Mage's body or 'paradox flaws,' magic-like effects which can for example turn the mage's hair green, make him mute, make him incapable of leaving a certain location, and so on. In more extreme cases paradox can cause Quiet (forms of madness that afflicts mages and may leak into reality), Paradox Spirits (nebulous, often powerful beings which purposively set about resolving the contradiction, usually by direclty punishing the mage), or even the removal of the Mage to a paradox 'realm,' a pocket dimension from which it may be difficult to escape.
In Mage, there is an underlying framework to reality called the Tapestry. This Tapestry, or rudimentary fabric of existence, is constituted by distinctive divisions into different realms, such as the material world and various areas of the spirt world, as well as some of the fundamental rules of reality, including the essence of magic/what is real, in game terms 'quintessence.' Quintessence can have distinctive character, called resonance, including but not limited to dynamic, static, entropic, and other kinds of resonance.
Mage divides mechanics for magic into a system of nine Spheres (which are sometimes construed as in-character ideas as well, more on this later), with which a player can describe thier character's ability to do magic in a structured but relatively open-ended fashion. Their ranking with each Sphere determines how sophisticated their acts of magic in that area can be. For example, changing a sound into another sound is much easier that changing a sound into light, or (even more drastically) changing a sound into a rabbit. Because different mages study different spheres, their abilities have enormous variety. The general power a mage has to change reality (called Arete) also varies from mage to mage, and the process of slowly but steadily increasing that power through a process of personal enlightenment.
-History-
that the mystical beliefs of the common people were not only backward, but dangerous, and that they should be replaced by cold, measurable and predictable laws of nature and respect for human genius. They replaced long-held theologies, pantheons, and mystical traditions with ideas like rational thought and the scientific method. As more and more sleepers began to use the Order's discoveries in their everyday lives, Reason and rationality came to govern their beliefs, and the old ways came to be regarded as misguided superstition. However, The Order of Reason became less and less focused on improving the daily lives of sleepers and more concerned with eliminating any resistance to their chokehold on the minds of humanity.Knighterrant81 18:26, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Planning an Edit 

message: From what I heard (as I followed the idea VERY closely), "Telos", not "Ascension", was the tenth sphere, and even had a rulebook associated with it. I had long thought, on my own, that the tenth sphere was 'Connection', and saw a Virtual Adept site with it's own interpretation (something about data manipulation). In fact, the sourcebook named "Ascension" mentions Telos, avidly, as the name of this elusive sphere. --Ayelis 17:28, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: In the final book, there were three possible interpretations of the 10th sphere. However, since its use was stated, in the same book, to be entirely optional, coupled with the fact that every Tradition had their own interpretation of the 10th sphere(before the Red Star even appeared), there are infinite solutions, or none at all, depending on the Storyteller. As a Storyteller myself, while I haven't gotten to this part of the metastory(if I ever do), I don't think I'll implement it other than possibly having factions continue to war over this 'new' topic. Urbandale (talk) 10:54, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tenth Sphere: Telos? 

message: Here is the infromation from Verbena for later merging.
The Verbenae, more colloquially known as the Verbena, are a fictional group of witches and neopagans. They are a tradition of mages in Mage: the Ascension, a role-playing game created by the White Wolf game studios.
They are known for their knowledge of herbs and the use of blood magic.
Speciality Sphere: Life.
The Verbenae believe Life is sacred, and to be prized above all things. That being said, these primal sorcerers work magic the way they embrace life- with determination and raw passion. They embrace suffering as readily as comfort and enlightenment, and aren't afraid to make difficult choices.
The tradition traces its path from a group of primordial Awakened known as the Wyck, whom they believe carried the knowledge of magick across the globe.During the late Middle Ages many of these were burned at the stake as satanic witches, hunted tortured and burned.Over the centuries it took for witch-craze to die down, the Wyck came to practice their arts in secrecy and became known for dealing with their foes harshly. Thus the Verbena were born.
On the whole, the Verbena tend to be more passionate, honest and forthright than many other mages. Unlike their Hermetic and Celestial rivals, the tradition balances strong male and female aspects, rather than favoring a patriarchal ideal. They are most at home with the Dreamspeakers of all the other mage groups, and most hostile towards the Technocracy's Technomagicks and bully tactics, though Nephandi also rank among their top priorities.
Web Warlock (talk) 13:21, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: If you are still active, would you be able to cite a couple references on that? I'm making it my mission to put together a page for each Tradition and Technocrat house, one for the Hollow Ones, the Ahl-i-Batin, and the Crafts. If you were able to slap some on(from any core/splat book, it doesn't matter), it would lighten my load considerably. Thanks!Urbandale (talk) 10:57, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Verbena 

message: These entries are all beautiful, but they seem to go very deep into the game and its mythos. Why not give the game a Wiki of its own and links here to that? All this great material would go from borderline "fancruft" here to Featured Content on its own Wiki! --65.37.105.102 (talk) 14:53, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Pretty much anyone can go make a Wikia and add whatever they want to it so... usually if someone feels a need they should get the ball rolling rather than ask others to. 184.145.18.50 (talk) 10:46, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm in agreement with 65.37.105.102. I'm a new editor, but this article seems bloated in terms of plot and rules summaries. It's clear that a lot of work went into these sections, but they're largely too in-depth for an encyclopedia. --That334 (talk) 16:27, 4 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mage: The Ascension Wikia 

message: One of the faction that is often listed in many pages of this wiki regarding Mage is "Crafts". I have no idea who or what theses peoples are, but whenever I try to access "Crafts (Mages:_The_Ascension)", it redirects me directly to Mage's main page, on which the only reference toward what the "Crafts" are is a link.. that leads me to the very same page.
Either remove any reference toward "Crafts", or expand in the same page.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.104.154.254 (talk) 17:58, 30 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Craft faction 

message: Should we mention that fans often abbreviated the revised edition under this names? I'm reading it is significantly different from 1st/2nd ed in terms of character power, limiting spirit magic and stuff. Not sure what the 20th anniversary is like. 184.145.18.50 (talk) 10:45, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Mage Revised

message: Hi sorry I was just doing a copy edit and I kept seeing the use of the word sleepers over and over again, but I don't think it was ever mentioned in the article? If it is in there somewhere it would probably be helpful to put it before the first mention of it being used.
Hope this helped! Jillfantastica (talk) 04:36, 29 January 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sleepers?