Talk:Alexander Dukhnovych

message: Dear Riurik, you asked me to give some links where you can see that the name of Duchnovich was Alexander(aleksander), here they are:,,(a.d are initials of Alexander Duchnovich),(chose Великы Русины on left side, then go down: you will see the article named:о. Александер Духновіч)
Regards--Rusyn 10:43, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Again, he is not exclusively Rusyn - Ukrainians of Transcarpathia believe him to be Ukrainian as well. Also, he himself believed Rusyns to be part of the Russian nation. And in his later publications in the Russian language he does use his Patronimic.--Hillock65 16:53, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Alexander or Oleksandr?

message: Duchnovich is obviously a rusyn poet and writer.He was born in rusyn populated region of Slovakia, and has written many rusyn patriotic poems : Ya rusyn byv jesm i budu, podkarpatskiji rusyny.... In Ukraine, rusyns are still not recoginised as a nation, so, there, Duchnovich is considered as ukrainian; maybe because of that the information on this page about the nationality of Duchnovich is false... --Rusyn 11:05, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You should also note that Dukhnovych didn't believe Rusyns to be a separate nation either. He had always been a Moscowphile (Rusophile) himself and believed Rusyns to be nothing but a part of a greater Russian nation. Near the end of his life he didn't even write in Rusyn language but in proper Russian language and in Iazychie, a peculiar mixture of Slavic languages. So, his contribution to Rusyn language is minuscule if at all. As far as the nationality of Rusyns, it is still a highly controversial question as even the majority of people in Zakarpattia believe themselves to be part of the Ukrainian nation as Hutsuls and others. The article should remain neutral because views on Dukhnovych are different, and it should accurately reflect Dukhnovych's negligible and virtually non-existent contribution to a Rusyn culture which he indeed didn't believe to be a separate entity at all.--Hillock65 15:31, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There seems to be too much emotion in this discussion but too few facts. First of all, let's deal with facts. And the fact is that the major part of the present day Ukrainian nation at one or another point in their history called themselves Rusyns (Ruthenians). Among them, notably is the classic of Ukrainian literature Ivan Franko, who also thought very highly of his fellow Rusyn Dobriansky. Secondly, even according to your figures (which need to be verified) the overwhelming majority of people in Transcarpathia believe themselves to be Ukrainians. Why and how is beyond the scope of this discussion. Thirdly, you seem to contradict yourself with assertion that there were no Ukrainians in Transcarpathia before 1945, and then you mention "Voloshyn around 1930". He was the leader of Carpatho-Ukraine state, that incidentally had the same state symbols and the state language that the present day Ukraine. And all that was before 1945! I think we need to be respectful of other people - if you are using the argument of "artifitiality" of Ukrainians in Transcarpathia be prepared lest the same argument should be used against Rusyns themselves. Needless to say, it is counterproductive and leads nowhere. Let's agree to differ: you have every right to consider him Rusyn, that's fine. But also be considerate of other 950,000 Rusyns (according to your figures), who believe themselves to be part of the Ukrainian nation and as such have every right to consider Dukhnovych their national Ukrainian poet as well. --Hillock65 20:50, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  And who says he wasn't a Rusyn?! Then call yourself Carpatho-Rusyn and leave Ukrainians and Rusyns alone.--Hillock65 04:40, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

text:  What you are exhibiting is intolerance and prejudice even if it comes from someone, who considers himself a Rusyn. The majority of people in Zakarpattia consider thmselves Rusyn and Ukriainian - and that is a fact. You have no right to tell them that they are not what they believe to be. That's their business, not yours. You have to learn to respect other people, even if you disagree with them. And what evidence do you give of Duknovych being considered much inferior to poets from Ukraine? That is outrageously inaccurate. Ivan Franko considered him one of the best Ukrainian poets. If you want to call him Carpatho-Rusyn, be my guest, for all I care you call call him Russian poet and writer too (which he was by the way). The fact is millions of Ukrainians and Rusyns in the past centuries and now consider him Ukrainian. They are the majority. Whether you like it or not you will have to get used to it and respect it, just as Ukrainians respect some Carpatho-Rusyn calling him their poet as well. Exhibiting intolerance and prejudice is not the way to prove a point.--Hillock65 04:40, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

text:  Please take a note of the reputable sources and read the text carefully. It is not claimed that he was Ukrainian, his heritage is equally shared among Ukrainian and Rusyn nations. --Hillock65 17:23, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rusyn or Ukrainian? 

message: A page has been renamed again without any consultation or warning. This is very uncivil and disrecpectful to other editors. Doing major changes without discussion will lead nowhere and is very counterproductive. If you disagree with something there are ways to settle a dispute, including discussion and other means. Please be considerate of other users.--Hillock65 04:43, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Moving and renaming pages 

message: Please note that the two are not identical. In the article about Rusyns it states that they are:
a modern ethnic group that speaks the Rusyn language and are descended from the minority of Ruthenians who did not adopt a Ukrainian national identity in the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. Because an overwhelming majority of Ruthenians within Ukraine itself have adopted a Ukrainian identity, most modern self-declared Rusyns live outside Ukraine.
Therefore renaming every Ruthenian into Rusyn is a flagrant violation of the NPOV policy. Ruthenian is a neutral term that was common both for Ukrainians and those, who consider themselves Rusyn, erasing it and pushing a nationalist propaganda is changing the spirit of the article and contradicts with well known facts.--Hillock65 13:48, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I have to put the tag NPOV until this issue is resolved.--Hillock65 13:49, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV: [[Rusyn]] vs [[Ruthenian]]