Talk:Anti-Zionism/Archive 3

message: Im an anti-deletionist, unless its not true. That particular fact seems to me needs some checking, but getting in an edit war over it is just an excuse for not bringing facts to the table. I think it should stay - and both must expand upon it - heck, judging from previous articles, it could be an article on its own. 
Also, I want to have a consolidated talk page for all of these -- we should do this at Talk:Wikiproject:Arab-Israeli conflict, - a Village pump or better yet a Arab-Israeli conflict/Oasis (Shorties: WP:AIC WP:AICO) -戴眩sv 19:31, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: Using Chomsky as an example here is misleading.  Chomsky has advocated virtually the same thing for the region since before Israel was a state, up to this day.  Neither the 1960s nor Palestinian activism during that era caused Chomsky to take the positions that he does. DanKeshet 03:44, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)
Chomsky was born in 1928 - you are familiar with his views as a teenager? Adam 07:04, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)

text: Without evidence to the contrary, I can only believe what he has to say about his views himself: he says that his vision for the area hasn't changed much since he first lived there in the pre-state days.  Read in in A Chomsky Reader, as quoted on Noam Chomsky.  Indeed, it would seem strange for somebody so immersed in Zionist culture like Chomsky was to not form an opinion until decades after he had lived in the place.  More to the point, though, is there any evidence that the 1960s and the Palestinian movement were the spurs to Chomsky's views?  Surely we can find an example of somebody who definitely was so influenced.  I thought I had a great quote from Huey P. Newton comparing the black liberation movement to the Palestinian movements, but I can't find it straight away. DanKeshet 07:17, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)
Huey P Newton is Jewish? Adam 07:30, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)

text: (: Sorry, of course not.  I didn't think about how you were looking specifically for Jewish intellectuals, I was just thinking of influential people from the era... :) DanKeshet 08:26, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)
I thought we were discussing the sentence ending "a permanent reservoir of anti-Zionist sentiment among western intellectauals, including even some Jews such as Noam Chomsky." If you want to replace Chomsky, you have to nominate another prominent anti-Zionist Jewish intellectual. I don't think Huey P. Newton makes the cut. Adam 11:43, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)

text: If we only want Jews--and I have to ask, why?--then I guess we either have to find another or provide some evidence that Chomsky became an anti-Zionist intellectual because of " the repeated disappointments of Middle East diplomacy, and the successful portrayal by the Palestinians of themselves as the victims of a western neo-colonialist plot to plant a Jewish settler state in their midst".  Also, FWIW, Chomsky says that his position (against a Jewish state, for some sort of Jewish homeland) used to be called a Zionist position, but is now called an anti-Zionist one. DanKeshet 18:37, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)
This argument is getting much more complicated that in needs to be. If you don't think Chomsky is an appropriate name to put in that sentence, suggest a replacement. Adam 23:46, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: The Grand Mufti