Talk:Kaliningrad

message: It seems strange that there is no demography section with statistics about how many ethnic russians, germans, poles, etc, actually live in the city.
:: Given that the place was emptied of Germans in 1945 and settled with Russians you'd expect there to be only Russians except for the 'odd' foreigner who married into Kaliningrad. I think Russia wanted to sell the exclave to Germany or a neighbour of the place in the early 1990s but nobody wanted to buy. "What are we supposed to do with half a million Russians?" Since then the place has been rebuilt more and more and is popular with Russian holiday makers. They now get their gas from Russia through a new pipeline - and all is well apparently. As someone from Abkhazia, whose status is 'open', said 'what do you want, we eat, the children go to school ....'. 
:: In order to destroy Königsberg in 1945, Sweden breached their neutrality and let the British Lancaster bombers land and refuel. 2001:8003:AC60:1400:80:8612:7E9:8687 (talk) 06:24, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
replies: text:  Do you have any proof of that? The wiki article clearly says they took off and landed back in UK. And they certainly didn;t need to land in Sweden to bomb Berlin.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.44.211.137 (talk) 15:54, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

text: You stole my suggestion! --108.45.56.173 (talk) 19:11, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: No Demography section

message: I am in the process of conducting some research about the region. Specifically, the role it plays in both conflict and cooperation between Russia and the West. I will be updating this page within one month. If there is anything you would like to see added to this page, chances are I will be coming across the data.
QatBurglar (talk) 22:55, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Present-Day Kalingrad

message: The figure 316.000 in main article is wrong. The offical German statistic shows:
Stadtkreis Königsberg 193 km2 Einwohner 1.1.1940 372.270. I correct this in the main article.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.112.188.135 (talk) 10:32, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Königsberg Pre War Population

message: Can anyone add information about the percentage of speakers of each language in Kaliningrad if possible, or some idea as to how prevelant Russian, German, etc. are in the region? Paxuniv (talk) 18:38, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Languages

message: Could someone sort out the mess on the left hand side adjacent to the temperature table?  It is beyond my skill level!  I have since noticed that the mess in is Firefox and Safari but not in IE or Chrome, and that quite a lot of information is missing in Firefox, obviously a formatting issue.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.0.221.95 (talk) 09:37, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Layout

message: The article mentions a 2002 Census determined 78% Russian ethnicity and 0.6% German; an intriguing result albiet the article mentioned the USSR Russified the population.  Here you have a nation founded and existing for nearly 700 years as part of the Germanic state and in a mere 57 years nearly all Germans there cease to exist.  What happened?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Micael (talk • contribs) 03:07, 24 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It is in the article: "The remaining German population was expelled from 1945–48." Please read Expulsion of Germans after World War II. Fentener van Vlissingen (talk) 04:01, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

text: It's called Ethnic cleansing.  Erikeltic (talk) 11:57, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: No. "Expelled" is to remove by force - by definition, the German population was not "asked."  This was part of the Stalin regime's setting up buffer states, security areas, and wholesale moving the borders of Germany away from that of the USSR. - HammerFilmFan  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.111.21.24 (talk) 15:55, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

text: Agree with you, but this article is not the place for it.  This article is about the new city built on the ruins.  That detail belongs either in the konigsberg article or (more probably) in a special article. Roger Pearse (talk) 16:35, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Startling Omission

message: Related to traveling from the rest of Russia to Kaliningrad by land through the EU, the article says that Special travel arrangements for the territory's inhabitants have been made. Can anybody expand that, here or in other article? --Anna Lincoln (talk) 08:47, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I found them here to be the Facilitated Transit Document (FTD) and Facilitated Rail Transit Document (FRTD), the documents needed for the transit. --Anna Lincoln (talk) 09:03, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

text: The legislation implementing the documents is here. --Anna Lincoln (talk) 09:08, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Traveling to/from the rest of Russia by land

message: The "Military" subsection includes this sentence: "Since 1991 there have been rumors that the Russians have transferred numerous tactical nuclear warheads to the exclave." 
Even though there is a reference, it is still admittedly a reference to rumors and I believe the whole sentence should be deleted. 97.125.48.202 (talk) 06:37, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: "Rumors" present in the article

message: The sentences "The city is famous in the history of mathematics in connection with the famous Seven Bridges of Königsberg problem. The solution of this problem by Leonard Euler was the beginning of the branch of mathematics known as graph theory, and the first example of methods which were to form the mathematical discipline of Topology." are in contradiction with the article "Seven Bridges of Königsberg" which contains the sentence "Euler proved that the problem has no solution.". Tis is confusing.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.89.11.183 (talk) 08:46, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: On Eulers solution of the "Seven Bridges of Königsberg" problem

message: This Greek name seems a bit odd. I respelled it with a K...
Anyway, there's no corresponding name on Greek Wikipedia. It's spelled "Καλίνινγκραντ" (Kaliningkrant) and Καίνιξμπεργκ (Kalinixmpergk) or Καινιξβέργη (Kainixberge) for Konigsberg.
Is this correct or relevant?
Cheers, Cashie (talk) 03:56, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: No: "Καλίνινγκραντ" (transliteration: Kaliningkrant, transcription: Kaliningrad) and Καίνιξμπεργκ (transliteration: Kainixmpergk, transcription: Kenixberg) or Καινιξβέργη (transliteration: Kainixberge, transcription: Kenixberyi) for Konigsberg. -- PhJ (talk) 13:42, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Calininopolis (or Kalininopolis)

message: The History section of the article is marked with a neutrality dispute from 8/2010, but I don't see any comment on the discussion page dated from then that flags specific areas for neutrality.
:IMHO the current section is factual, if a little bit terse when describing the transition from Russian to German population (per 'Startling Omissions' above). Does anyone want to take a stab at trying to fill that in a bit more without recapitulating the full history of ethnic cleansing during and after WW2, or is there a consensus for leaving it and clearing the neutrality tag? Willhsmit (talk) 19:19, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Seems reasonable to me.  I think the tag should be cleared.  That said ... the section could probably be abbreviated.  All that it really needs to say is "Kaliningrad was formerly Konigsberg, and was populated by Russians after the German population was expelled."  The rest belongs to the Konigsberg article, IMHO. Roger Pearse (talk) 16:34, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title: Neutrality dispute August 2010?

message: I find it quite odd that this article makes such a radical break between the pre-war German period and the post-war Soviet/Russian one. This is very different from the approach taken in the articles about the cities that became part of Poland, such as Stettin or Breslau. Those cities, much like Koenigberg, were also incredibly destroyed and completely ethnically cleansed.
Globo (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 06:01, 28 July 2011 (UTC)
replies: text:  Kaliningrad/Königsberg was conquered by the Red Army and Germans driven out. Breslau was allocated to Poland by the Yalta or maybe Potsdam conference or both, and emptied of Germans only in 1946. That was an orderly ethnic cleansing while Kaliningrad was not, from what I have read. Breslau: I know because I have a relative who was born there and spent two years as a hungry toddler (aged 4 to 6) on the roads and in trains until the family reached Germany proper. East Germany. Soon they had to move again, fleeing to West Germany. Wars impact on people. 2001:8003:AC60:1400:81E3:7ACC:4412:7B77 (talk) 03:43, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Odd inconsistency

message: Kantgrad ---> Kaliningrad
*This information should be merged, and the article Kantgrad redirected to this article. Vanjagenije (talk) 19:04, 25 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, i will merge myself and I'll redirect Kantgrad to Kaliningrad. Vanjagenije (talk) 01:13, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Proposed merger

message: The name should change to History of Kaliningrad, and I think Koenigsberg should perhaps link straight to Kaliningrad. The consensus is that Kaliningrad is the current name for Koenigsberg. Troy does not link directly to the first five civilisations,  it is confusing to use different names for articles on different time periods of the same city.♥ L'Origine du monde ♥ (♥ Talk♥ ) 00:26, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Name change to History of Kaliningrad 

message: - may be notable enough to warrant discussion in the article. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 09:56, 18 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I added a paragraph about it. —rybec 20:55, 18 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: High traffic on Polish border

message: The article states the name was changed to Kaliningrad in 1946 in honor of Kalinin following his death, which was in 1946. There is no source for this information. I have a source claiming the name of the city was changed to Kaliningrad in 1947, not 1946: The Amber Room: The Fate of the World's Greatest Lost Treasure by Catherine Scott-Clark and Adrian Levy, New York 2004. Here is a quote: "It is from Kaliningrad, the Soviet name for Konigsberg, given to the city in October 1947 following the death of Mikhail Kalinin, chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet." Scott-Clark doesn't have a footnote for this statement, but her work is heavily footnoted throughout, and I assume she got this year right.
There also seems to be some confusion in the article about which year exactly Kaliningrad was officially incorporated into the Soviet Union, from the Soviet perspective, and focuses instead on what the non-Soviet Allies were willing to grant rather than actual votes and measures by Soviet parliamentary organs for, for example, applying the Soviet constitution inside Kaliningrad, naming it an oblast and incorporating it into the RSFSR. These matters need better sourcing if the article is to meet the minimum requirements for a true history and encyclopedic content. Hypatea (talk) 16:43, 25 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Date of Name-Change

message: It would be helpful if a clear statement to this effect was at the beginning of the article.  It would also be useful to state ways of getting from Kaliningrad to the main part of Russia.
A better map showing this would also help.
Marvin Kornblau  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.90.79.66 (talk) 15:52, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Kaliningrad is not contiguous with the rest of Russia

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thread_title: External links modified

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thread_title: External links modified

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thread_title: External links modified

message: *Tétrault-Farber, Gabrielle. "If Russia Gets Crimea, Should Germany Get Kaliningrad?" (Archive). The Moscow Times. March 21, 2014.
*Beyer, Susanne. "Resurrecting Königsberg: Russian City Looks to German Roots." Der Spiegel. July 25, 2014. Translated by Daryl Lindsey. - Originally in German in German in issue 28/2014 (July 7, 2014)
Deutsche Welle had "Kant Serves as a Cultural Bridge" but the article gives a 403 and there's no archive. Other articles have a preview: "German Foreign Minister Fischer is scheduled to open the first Consulate General in Kaliningrad on Thursday, the 200th anniversary of the death of philosopher Immanuel Kant, the city's most famous son."
WhisperToMe (talk) 10:29, 16 May 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources about Kaliningrad 

message: The first line or two are a bit inconsistent.  The Russian version of Kaliningrad is followed by the IPA; the Russian version of Konigsberg is followed by a transliteration.  and do Poles and Lithuanians not say "Kaliningrad"? Or is it identical to the English? --Richardson mcphillips (talk) 17:47, 11 January 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  IPA and transliteration of names 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: used to be the most heavily militarized area. What about today?Xx236 (talk) 07:41, 17 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Military 

message: To be updated.Xx236 (talk) 07:44, 17 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Small border traffic law 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: This article has unfortunately come under fire from an editor who has apparently been so reluctant to discuss content and act upon consensus that a blocking procedure was used inappropriately. The two complaints, apparently triggered by that editor's preference for American English, were essentially "I don't see it" and "I wrote this so keep your hands off". These are both unhelpful attitudes. When something is not understood, that is not a reason to undo another editor's good faith contributions; the appropriate response is to engage in conversation on the talk page. The appropriateness of European English to this particular article, and the lack of a plausible cause for employing American English, are both covered in some detail in the discussion above and wilfully ignoring this is not helpful or constructive. Asking or expecting other editors to avoid contributing in deference to an earlier contributor is  attempted ownership of content, and that's a cardinal sin, as any experienced editor should be well aware. Input from other editors to repair the damage done to this particular article would be appreciate. The transgressing editor may unfortunately have to be the subject of a formal complaint if malicious behaviour reoccurs.HughEverPulsatingBrainThatRulesFromTheCentreOfTheUltraworld (talk) 12:04, 8 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Your block was perfectly appropriate, and your claims that this very talk page has consensus for usage of British English is are ridiculous.--Ymblanter (talk) 12:09, 8 October 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Hello, , sorry to be summoning you again so soon, but there appears to be a sock puppet of this now blocked account. The editor has returned to this page to change the EngVar again (), and is doing so on at least two other articles as well (see 1 and 2). The user at the time of the earlier block stated he might set up a new account and you cautioned him about doing so here (adding a ping to original blocking admin ). The editor continues to make the argument that everyone else is mistaken, despite clear policy explanations. Laszlo Panaflex (talk) 13:51, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  I reverted the first edit, but I can not revert the second edit, this must be done manually, and I totaly do not have time this week.--Ymblanter (talk) 22:05, 2 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for  copying me in, Laszlo. 'Happy to confirm no socks were harmed in the making of this article! I honestly can't imagine why or how anyone would see this article as appropriate to set in US English, but a glimpse at this section of the talk page is surely to enough to convince anyone that an edit war is indeed likely - so I shall gladly walk away.ByzantiumLives (talk) 12:30, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
replies: text:  The user has been blocked as a sock--Ymblanter (talk) 20:28, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit warring 

message: There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Königsberg which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you.  —RMCD bot 22:46, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move discussion in progress 

message: https://nypost.com/2022/10/05/czechs-troll-russia-with-mock-annexation-of-kaliningrad/ 66.190.13.201 (talk) 06:29, 7 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  context for current protect status, if anyone was wondering 

message: Kaliningrad and obwód kaliningradzki (the Kaliningrad Oblast) — these names should no longer be used in Polish. Instead, we should use the names Królewiec (Königsberg) and obwód królewiecki (Königsberg District). This is the latest recommendation of the Commission on Standardization of Geographical Names Outside the Republic of Poland.
For the city with the Russian name Калининград (Kaliningrad), only the Polish name Królewiec is recommended and the use of the name Kaliningrad in Polish is not recommended, and for the administrative unit in which this city is located and bearing the Russian name Калининградская область (Kaliningradskaja oblast') it is recommended the Polish name is Królewiec Oblast and it is not recommended to use the name Kaliningrad Oblast in Polish.
The recommendation to move away from Russian names in favor of Polish ones was justified by the commission: the current Russian name of this city is unrelated to either the city or the region and commemorates the criminal Mikhail Kalinin, who signed (among several other members of the Soviet Politburo) the decision to murder Polish officers in Katyn in 1940.
The recommendations come into force today, May 9, 2023.
Unfortunately, the name Kaliningrad is still used in many languages and on many maps.
In many languages, including Polish, the name of the Ukrainian city is Odessa, but in many languages, including Ukrainian, the name of this city is Odesa, therefore, one should also consider changing the name Odessa to Odesa. Mir.Nalezinski (talk) 19:05, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: That article is titled Odesa since July 2022. But Kaliningrad is internationally recognized as in the Russian Federation, so this article is not likely to be renamed. Not sure that Polish legal acts on the naming of a Russian, formerly German city are notable enough to include in this article.  —Michael Z. 20:29, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

text: What the Polish government decides to call a Russian city has no meaning. The name of the city was not changed by the relevant authorities, so it will remain as Kaliningrad here. Also, this is enwiki, so what is used in Polish is especially not applicable here. And it's worth noting that political views do not belong on Wikipedia. michael60634 / talk / contributions 05:08, 11 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  If Kaliningrad is to be called Königsberg, maybe we should change Odessa to Odesa? 

message: Poland is using Konigsberg as the official name of this place again. 47.187.199.76 (talk) 02:29, 11 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: What the Polish government decides to call a Russian city has no meaning. The name of the city was not changed by the relevant authorities, so it will remain as Kaliningrad. michael60634 / talk / contributions 05:04, 11 May 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: But now Medvedev has responded with a threat to Poland. Queue reliable sources appearing in 3, 2 . . .  —Michael Z. 15:17, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

text: Königsberg is the name of the city, and "Kaliningrad" is just a Russian creation. Eurohunter (talk) 11:57, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: Russia is the legal owner of Kaliningrad. So its legal name is Kaliningrad. 110.142.86.86 (talk) 23:53, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Poland 

message: There seems to be an error in the quoted population size.
The text states in the first paragraph that the population in 2020 was 489,359. Ref [13] links to census data from 2010 of 941,873, and 2021 with 1,029,966. Is there any reason not to quote the 2021 figure? This would put into sensible context the urban figure of 800,000. Cypherspaceman (talk) 16:37, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Population size