Talk:Moringa oleifera

message: Support merge of Drumstick (fruit) into Moringa oleifera.  Badagnani 03:33, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge 

message: It was just the use of the seed in water purification that caught my attention. On that basis I have added it to :Category:Appropriate technology and also draw your attention to this WikiProject. Cheers, Singkong2005 13:36, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2010-02/22/how-a-seed-helps-purify-water.aspx  Angelo  21:52, 8 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  WikiProject International development 

message: hey there....i guess you need to give more details on transportation of nutrition to seeds.. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 210.211.130.191 (talk) 15:58, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  need more details 

message: I have been doing research on this plant for a project I am conducting. Of all the research I have seen no where has it been stated that spirochin is a toxic alkaloid, nor it is said to be in Moringa Oleifera. It has been announced to have been found in Moringa Pterygosperma, but studies show that it is not harmful. In fact, results show it could have positive pharmaceutical aspects. Could someone find the source of the previously stated data or update this page to the most recent findings? Sothisislife101 20:44, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, that statement was removed (along with some other content) in a funky way by 77.30.22.133 (January 27th), it appears to be an accidental edit to me. I just restored it. Here is reference for spirochin being harmful: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1924986/ "Even though the toxic root bark is removed, the flesh has been found to contain the alkaloid spirochin, which can cause nerve paralysis." -- though according to http://www.appropedia.org/Moringa#cite_note-0 "The presence of this compound is not worrying because large amounts are required to elicit deleterious effects, and spirochin even displays antibacterial properties when consumed in smaller amounts.". Another reference: http://books.google.com/books?id=C8xJE2NfQpIC&pg=PA217&dq=spirochin+moringa says "Spirochin, an alkaloid in the root, accelerates and amplifies the heartbeat at 35 mg/kg, but has the opposite effect at doses of 250 mg/kg or larger. It paralyzes the vagus nerve and other parts of the central nervous system and has an analgesic effect." --Mrienstra (talk) 04:21, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Of the sources you cited, appropedia.org doesn't satisfy the guidelines laid down in WP:SECONDARY for reliable secondary sources we can cite to support things we say in our article.  But Poisonous Plants and Animals of Florida and the Caribbean, David W. Nellis is probably such a source, subject to verification. I'd believe what Nellis says about the toxicity of Spirochin before I accepted what appropedia.org had to say on the topic.  However, we need more sources on this topic before using any of them to support statements about the toxicity of moringa or anything found in it, especially as moringa's already being promoted as a cure for various diseases in various "organic farming" websites.  Please review WP:MEDRS before proceeding with this part of the article.  Thanks for the work, it is appreciated!  loupgarous (talk) 08:19, 30 December 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disputed: Spirochin 

message: This article talk page was automatically added with  banner as it falls under :Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . Maximum and careful attention was done to avoid any wrongly tagging any categories , but mistakes may happen... If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot (talk) 01:41, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: [[WP:FOOD|WikiProject Food and drink]] Tagging

message: The leaves are not to be eaten during the monsoon season, this is not mentioned anywhere in your article. But every one in Southern India will advise that the Drumstick leaves should not be eaten during the rains, but drumstick is safe to be eaten. Is their any credible research on this aspect?? Pls help. Also check this link, 
http://www.herpes-coldsores.com/messageforum/showthread.php?35802-A-platter-specially-for-Karkitakam 
Thanks,  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.61.48.102 (talk) 08:43, 21 July 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  No warnings, if any, mentioned 

message: Can a nutritional profile of the plant and/or the plant parts please be added. Until this information is placed and verified, this article is likely to generate disagreement.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.210.161.143 (talk) 01:09, 7 November 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: That's one example product from one manufacturer. We would need a good secondary reference to state that it's a "majority element" in the supplement industry (doubtful that exists). I'm not even aware that there is significant agricultural production that would supply commercial demand. Reference for that? It remains a fringe topic and ingredient, in my opinion. --Zefr (talk) 20:28, 15 July 2017 (UTC)
replies: text:  Yes, but someone else should do the work.  That's why I asked.  The article states that cultivation has recently begun in the USA (in Hawaii), so the topic is 'current' or a recent development - not something I see as fringe at this time, if it's only a 'mention'.  If that were a topic for developing as a later article, we would want to see research on the mechanisms of how moringa acts inside the human body (if it also acts as a water filter externally). MaynardClark (talk) 20:33, 15 July 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nutritional Profile 

message: Hello, Some minutes ago i corrected a mistake in a reference. And this mistake back again where it was... User Zfer please take a good look at my correction on the reference. It points to the original source of the article - http://www.tfljournal.org/article.php?story=20051201124931586&query=%2BA%2BReview%2Bof%2Bthe%2BMedical%2BEvidence%2Bfor%2BIts%2BNutritional%252C%2BTherapeutic%252C%2Band%2BProphylactic%2BProperties.
The source of reference at the moment is going to a very poor website that had nothing to do with the research and article
The reference in cause
^ a b c Jed W. Fahey (2005). "Moringa oleifera: A Review of the Medical Evidence for Its Nutritional, Therapeutic, and Prophylactic Properties. Part 1.". Trees for Life Journal.
This is an article and research from Trees for life jornal and is where the link i post, point at.
Thanks  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.247.81.115 (talk) 21:53, 20 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unused references

message: Moving sections from the Article to here for editing and sourcing --Zefr (talk) 13:24, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Unsourced conjecture & folk medicine

message: Together with two colleagues I would like to add some agricultural information to the site. We did only minor changes to the existing parts. Please check out a draft of the page on my user page "user:Anbruu/sandbox" and feel free to leave some comments.  —Preceding undated comment added 16:09, 27 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Try adding common names of the tree in countries where it is used most commonly for food. For example: Hindi sahjan, Punjabi surajana, Marathi shevga, Malayalam muringa, Sinhalese murunga, Filipino malunggay, Thai phak i hum, etc. Instead of say, French or German, which are mostly just direct translations of the English names.-- OBSIDIAN†SOUL 21:34, 27 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: That's a good point. Thank you. We will change this. Anbruu (talk) 12:10, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: The agricultural information looks generally good. A minor suggestion is to follow convention in subsection headings for use of capital letters and scientific terms, e.g., pH. In the Etymology section, we do not need its name in different languages, as defined by the English Wikipedia, WP:EN; also, displaying names used in various languages is not etymology, so let's stick with what the section title defines. Other pages have seen endless additions of names in different languages, serving no purpose to English users. I also suggest limiting the crop production comparisons, as this also invites comparison and competition among provinces/states in different countries, with little useful information to the general user. --Zefr (talk) 17:25, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: As an English user, I would just like to point out, Zefr, that I do use those additions of names in different languages, in order to help me search the foreign-language internet. To use one example, it is annoying to have to individually go to the Bengali Wikipedia page and copy the page name there just to look up a Bengali recipe, especially if Bengali Wikipedia lacks a page on the topic. I may not speak a word of Bengali, but Google does; unfortunately, Google can't help the way English, for example, doesn't distinguish between trees and fruits. If others are annoyed by use of space for non-English names, perhaps they could be a collapsible sidebar, below scientific classification.69.5.152.24 (talk) 16:22, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

text: You are right bout the etymology section. Because there are hundreds of names in dozens of languages and local dialects, it's not useful to add them all in Wikipedia. We therefore added an external link to a page where they can be found. The link is now part of the introduction because the names don't really belong into the etymology section, as pointed out. Anbruu (talk) 09:52, 3 December 2013 (UTC)

text:  Regarding the problematic of yield competition we changed it so that only one country per yield (leaves, fruits, oil) appears in the text.PhilBu (talk) 09:59, 3 December 2013 (UTC)

text: I would disagree. Especially in plants which are not native to English-speaking regions. The majority of readers would search for it using the native names, not the less familiar English names which are mostly only used by botanists anyway as the plants themselves are not known to most English-speakers. Not saying you add all of them, but a few of the most prominent languages in countries where they are most commonly consumed are good enough.-- OBSIDIAN†SOUL 10:12, 3 December 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Please see WP:NOTDICTIONARY. An English encyclopedia is not obligated to publish terms in non-English languages. --Zefr (talk) 16:59, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  additional information 

message: This page contains both imperial and metric measurements, and needs to be one of the other.  I am not familiar enough with the plant itself to confidently amend these.  
Rather than stating months of the year during which it can be harvested, the seasons should be given, as it's going to vary from one location to another.Maxwellsubmarine (talk) 19:58, 18 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Page needs uniformity 

message: I just added a small paragraph to reference a new study that highlights some anti-cancer properties of the moringa extract (see http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3991666/) although my change got reverted by BattyBot due to "Rv - sourced to primary, not WP:MEDRS".
I realise that preference should be given to peer reviewed, non-primary sourced documents, but does it really mean the study does not even deserve to be mentioned in the article? I suppose I can reword it, if the original wording looked like it was giving too much weight and mention that it's just one in-vitro study?  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Smartial arts (talk • contribs) 13:06, 22 April 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: It shouldn't be mentioned. WP:MEDRS is quite clear about this: "Primary sources should generally not be used for health related content, because the primary biomedical literature is exploratory and not reliable". Alexbrn talk|contribs|COI 13:17, 22 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anti - cancer properties 

message: While I understand the desire to not make claims that aren't backed up, changing "Medical research and potential adverse effects" to "Preliminary research and potential adverse effects" makes it hard for the reader to know what the topic of the section discusses. There are a number of kinds of research mentioned in the article. Rather than just reverting, I'll request that you give it another try. There's nothing POV about trying to tell the reader what sort of research is discussed in the section. The section is about medical research. Sometimes research shows that an effect is validated, other times that it's not. There are instances of both in the section. Simply stating that it's about medical research makes no claims whatsoever about the results of the research. Would you give it another go, please? Waitak (talk) 16:15, 1 August 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Much better, thank you. Waitak (talk) 18:34, 1 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Research section title 

message: The article Moringa contained a lot of content that is specific to Moringa oleifera.  Since it would be more appropriate here than there, I have removed it from that article.  But since it is redundant to some of the content here, I don't want to paste in directly in.  So I am placing a copy of it below so that any editor can look at it and merge any content they find useful into this article.  Deli nk (talk) 12:08, 10 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Content from [[Moringa]] 

message: So no one's going to mention the claims of quackery surrounding this plant? No mention of the shady person who created the hype around the Moringa tree and gave it all the superlatives?  No mention of his shady past?  No mention that his company is the source for all the material and claims worldwide?  No mention of the Noni juice scam? Of the this guy's shady MLM company and its history with the FDA as claiming it as a medicinal cure for the worst sicknesses (and to several of them together!)?  No mention how they were stopped after illegally exporting it and illegally advertising it falsely as a medicine? No mention how these people sidestepped that through companies overseas growing and distributing it with the original company's help? How about the scandalous distribution in 3rd world countries and dictatorships where extremely poor people are extorted out of the little they have and get this instead of food(!)? What about all the strawman websites and videos about "the Moringa hoax" all parroting the original claims  -sometimes battering the competing distributors and their methods of distribution, sometimes claiming directly that it's not quackery and other times just ignoring the question and going into glorifying claims about the Moringa and its derivatives?  And there's much more.  So no one is going to mention that this entry is under category:pseudo science and category alternative medicine?  Will there not be any section about the controversy? פשוט pashute ♫ (talk) 23:17, 25 October 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Please put up a suggested edit, with sources, here, and we'll have a look. I was not aware that there is/was a hoax attached to the plant, and I have seen a few studies supporting some of the claims, e.g.   an    etc  Ratel (talk) 08:30, 26 October 2016 (UTC)
replies: text:  I wasn't aware of any hoaxes either. Regarding your claims about people being extorted out of what they have, I honestly have trouble believing this. Moringa oleifera is prolific anywhere that the temperature doesn't ever get below about 5C. I've personally seen the leaves available for very little in markets all over the Philippines, for example. The seed pods are available for cheap in almost any Indian market. Again, I've seen this with my own eyes. Given all that, I'm having trouble understanding how anybody could extort anything from anyone in the developing world. The tree is highly nutritious, widely available and easy to grow for anybody who wants it. The standard method for planting them is to cut off a twig and stick it in the ground. I've personally watched them grow two meters in a single growing season. Waitak (talk) 22:02, 26 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Moringa Quack medicine? Hoaxes? Scams? 

message: There seems a lot of speculation about medicinal benefits. Currently the article states there are none. YET in these review articles (more recent than the ones cited as of now in the wikipedia article) there are several antimicrobial and anti cancer properties stated. http://article.jddmc.org/pdf/10.11648.j.jddmc.20170304.12.pdf
and http://www.allresearchjournal.com/archives/2016/vol2issue8/PartH/2-7-178-878.pdf also mentioning a use is https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ptr.5325 and http://imperialjournals.com/index.php/IJIR/article/view/4911 THESE seem to be bona fide peer reviewed journals. 
I have not the time to evaluate all these and do not want to spend time in an edit war. But they are secondary sources supporting medical efficacy, at least antimicrobial activity with a derived moringa product which works.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.249.23.158 (talk) 02:17, 16 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  medicinal benefits or not?? 

message: Sources that could be useful may be added here for eventual incorporation. Auree ★★ 12:44, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sources 

message: Reminder per above discussion with User:Zefr: Favor secondary research from journals with an acceptable impact factor. When discussing biomedical properties, avoid non-human studies and favor reviews from MEDLINE-indexed journals per WP:MEDRS; potential clinical findings should be substantiated by systematic reviews or meta-analyses of human trials. Editor input on the encyclopedic relevance and reliability of these sources is always appreciated. Auree ★★ 19:34, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Phytochemistry and biomedical properties 

message: To  - This edit and its sources are not reliable. The sources do not meet the WP:MEDRS standard. This is just Ayurveda quackery nonsense. You have reached WP:3RR with no talk page discussion to gain WP:CON.  18:21, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Have you done a search in Google scholar or PubMed?--Trickipaedia (talk) 18:27, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: There are no WP:MEDRS-quality reviews to indicate that moringa is good for anything except as a food source in regions with malnutrition. Zefr (talk) 18:37, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: This link used in the article as a reference lists numerous medicinal uses and related studies. Should this link also be removed as a source?--Trickipaedia (talk) 18:49, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: CABI is a reliable source for botanical content. It is not a WP:MEDRS source, and is not used to imply or support medicinal uses.  Zefr (talk) 19:20, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Why did you undo this?  This is not medical content but a biochemical/microbiological one. Also, more importantly, are you the final authority on this page? Or is there a Head Moringa Boss in Chief I can talk to?--Trickipaedia (talk) 22:38, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Insufficient evidence for antimicrobial effects of leaf paste 

message: ´Sadnessly´ it is (from) an online-shop, but is very correct titled as knowledge-site there, the article there. 
I post the link to the german site and a link to it as translated site to english. German https://www.naturalfoodshop.de/wissen/4379/moringa-der-wunderbaum, english http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.naturalfoodshop.de%2Fwissen%2F4379%2Fmoringa-der-wunderbaum. 
Alone the sources of the sayings noted there, I think, are to recommend. 
--Visionhelp (talk) 18:16, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Interessting Sayings and Sources