Talk:Marion Zimmer Bradley

message: The "Last Whole Earth Catalog", August 1972 edition, page 218, contains a
letter from MZB about the possible dangers of home birth without access to
professional medical assistance; it describes the near-disastrous birth of
her third child.
69.72.24.37 (talk) 11:52, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. —  (e • t • c) 13:05, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Semi-protected edit request on 12 June 2014 

message: Patrick Breen would like his current name to NOT be linked to his birth name on his mother's wikipedia page. I have done that on the current page; if there's a way to remove it from the older copies, could an admin do that? I hope his privacy can be both respected and protected.
Zentomologist (talk) 23:27, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Son's Request for Privacy 

message: Bradley was a powerful influence on Neo-paganism, yet there was only a passing mention with none of her actual accomplishments listed. I've listed several of them with citations (and ran it past her daughter first, to make sure I wasn't putting up anything the family had requested not be posted). Zentomologist (talk) 04:18, 23 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Religion section 

message: The reference to the allegations of sexual abuse has been removed from the lead by Sandstein. The reason given was "Considering that these accusations have just been made, they are not yet a prominent enough part of her bio to be mentioned in the lead." 
I disagree with this. I think it is important that such controversial developments are reflected in the lead and I have not found anything in the Manual of Style (Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section#Biographies_of_living_persons -I am aware that MZB is not alive any more, but it is the most closely fitting section-) that something should be kept out of the lead, because it is too current. Also it should be noted that the allegations have been published on June 10, even if they have only been picked up by the Guardion on June, 27. 
If you believe the allegation should be kept out of the lead I would like you to post your criteria of when/under what condition they should be included. Thank you for your input.
Sirana (talk) 16:24, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks for the ping. This isn't a BLP issue, as the subject is dead. Per MOS:LEAD, "The lead ... should define the topic, establish context, explain why the topic is notable, and summarize the most important points—including any prominent controversies. ... The emphasis given to material in the lead should roughly reflect its importance to the topic, according to reliable, published sources." The abuse allegations are a  prominent controversy, but they are based on a single blog post a day or so old. This means that they can't be seen by reliable sources to be as significant as the whole rest of Zimmer Bradley's biography put together - but that's how the lead would have appeared, judging by the length of the text added. Moreover, the lead is supposed to be a summary, but the text added would have been as long or longer than what is in the main article about the allegations. In brief, the text I removed from the lead would have given the issue undue weight within the lead, and would have looked like WP:RECENTISM. I imagine that if the issue keeps receiving coverage in mainstream media, a brief mention in a (somewhat expanded) lead would be appropriate.  Sandstein  17:31, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Wikipedia should be very careful about including something "based on a single blog post a day or so old" in the article at all. We aren't news media. Jonathunder (talk) 17:52, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

text: Thank you for the swift reply and clarification, Sandstein. If there is more coverage about this I will expand the part about the allegations in the biography and add a summery in an expanded lead, if that is warranted. I would wish to add that this is not "based on a single blog post a day or so old". The Guardian article that is referenced is not only based on the blogpost (which was written on June 10) but also on comments Moira Greyland has made directly to the Guardian and the story has since been reported by the Washington Post.  as well.Sirana (talk) 19:21, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Your Washington Post link takes us to a piece by Alyssa Rosenberg who "blogs about pop culture for The Washington Post's Opinions section" as indicated there.  It's an essay, not a news article. Jonathunder (talk) 19:31, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Allegations of abuse in the lead 

message: Nothing is said here of the frequent criticism that MZB, especially in later Darkover works, seemed to excessively dwell on male homoerotic encounters. I haven't read up on her stuff in ages, but I recall this being a big "why we're not reading 'Darkover' any more" issue among fans in the late 80s, early 90s.  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ≼  01:22, 9 October 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: If you are suggesting that it be added, it will need to be reliably sourced or it will just be POV or OR. I doubt that it was a big enough deal to have been covered in anything that would qualify as a reliable source. Meters (talk) 02:22, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

text: How would you define "excessively"? The late '80s were quite homophobic. VasyaPetrovna (talk) 01:29, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Homoeroticism 

message: I don't know how to indicate this in a citation, but footnote #18 ("Marion Zimmer Bradley In Her Own Words") leads to a dead link.
:The Stephen Goldin site has been mirrored at http://deirdre.net/stephen-goldin-mzb/ - I'll update links in the article. Argyriou (talk) 18:43, 27 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead link 

message: For split. It needs to be redirected to its special bibliography page.The Mad Hatter (talk)
*Oppose. Readable prose size of page is 19 kB, far below the 50 kB line that WP:SPLIT even begins to consider too big, and I don't see any justification for a WP:FORK based on content. —swpbT 18:34, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: Split

message: No mention in biography of marriage, 25 year relationship to Walter Breen?  Nor, in the section on accusations of his convictions for child abuse.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.243.51.140 (talk) 01:15, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps you should actually read the article? Their marriage, separation, and divorce are all covered in the very first section Marion Zimmer_Bradley#Biography. Meters (talk) 01:24, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Biography 

message: Currently in the Bibliography, the Shadow's Gate series is annotated as (ghostwritten by Rosemary Edghill): the link is to an extended interview with Edghill (real name eluki bes shahar [sic]).
The process "Edghill" describes is one of her revising and expanding unpublished manuscripts by Bradley, with the latter's full co-operation. My feeling is that this does not constitute "ghostwriting", but rather co-authorship, albeit with one collaborator uncredited on the published books, and suggest that the annotation should be amended accordingly. The Rosemary Edghill article lists these books as being written "with Marion Zimmer Bradley". {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.200.129.143 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 19:51, 29 October 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: In the absence of any response (either pro or anti) over a period of 8 months, I'm going to go ahead and modify the article accordingly. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.125.73.1 (talk) 13:48, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Ghostwritten" inaccurate? 

message: >>Noted for the feminist perspective in her writing, her reputation has been posthumously marred by her daughter Moira Greyland's accusations of child sexual abuse, and for allegedly assisting her second husband, convicted child abuser Walter Breen, in sexually abusing multiple unrelated children.
These weren't just "accusations". They were founded in fact. Her reputation was only marred by her own actions. Why is this written in a way that blames these victims? 71.121.233.132 (talk) 05:31, 9 September 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: I strongly agree and just changed this LeslieCarr (talk) 06:40, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Wording is Odd