Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Television/Avatar: The Last Airbender task force/archive1

message: Where exactly are we drawing the line on this? I realize all shipping is off but other small things are everywhere.
Here are examples:
YuYan Archers using Firebending
Koh and Lu Ten's face
Ty Lee looking like an airbender
H2P 18:17, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Speculations 

message: Hey folks, thanks for your interest in this WikiProject.  The main WikiProject page still has a little way to go, but the most important sections (in my opinion, anyway) of the main WikiProject page are all ready up and I'd love to hear your thoughts on what we have so far and what we could potentially have in the future.  What should our focus be?  What would you like your involvement to be?  Say anything... ideas, problems, questions, hate-messages (hah)... what do you think?  Let's get a good discussion going!  And don't forget to add yourself to the members list. 
Oh, and if anyone would like to help complete the WikiProject main page (i.e., help create some templates for the WikiProject, create the /articles subpage, etc.), that'd be great too. :) Prototime 19:52, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm glad to join!  I think the first thing that needs to be done is to remove all of the cleanup tags from the Season One episodes (the hard way of course :) ).  The "adoption" idea will probably work wonders here.  I've actually started on the episode The Blue Spirit before this project began, and I still need to finish it up.  PCEevee talk 01:36, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

text: It seems things have really gotten rolling in my absence... excellent.  Let's keep it up! Prototime 16:43, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: And in the beginning...

message: Since the fair use policy prevents us from using any of the obvious ones, does anyone have any ideas for an image to use in the project banner template?  Kirill Lokshin 00:38, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmmm.  Could the four Chinese characters that appear between "Nickelodeon" and "Avatar" count as a logo?  They have appeared on all three shirts that are in the Nick shop.  It could be called synonymous with the title, but that's just a guess.  I'm not totally sure on that one.  PCEevee talk 21:42, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image for project banner? 

message: Would anybody mind looking at the The Blue Spirit article that I have been working on and review it in general?   I just want to know where to go from here.  PCEevee talk 21:52, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just needs some general neatness changes. You've got some loose sentences not with any paragraphs. Just as a quick glance it looks fine. Eban 21:04, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Q about The Blue Spirit episode

message: Just curious as to who it is that rates these articles.  Is it this project and we go off the guidelines set by Wiki, or is it someone else? H2P 13:37, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's done by the project.  I went through yesterday and tagged all the relevant articles I could find; but since I went through them rather rapidly, some of the ratings might be off, so feel free to adjust them as needed. Kirill Lokshin 13:43, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This is a great idea to incorporate.  Hopefully it'll give people a good sense of just how much work is involved to bring these pages up to par with the rest of Wikipedia. Prototime 16:56, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh it's not that much work.  Just, you know, some where around 55 articles once we make our own.  But, you know, who needs a summer break anyway H2P 18:08, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tagging Article Ratings 

message: I went ahead and made a seperate page for Princess Azula, though I've not yet finished correcting all the existing links, nor have I removed her from the Major Characters page. Eban 21:02, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Article 

message: I'm beginning to go through and add the  template to statements in articles needing it, since there are currently.... none, and it's really needed.  I'd recommend everyone doing the same to any statement they come across that looks like it needs it. Prototime 01:38, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I gotta find those 2 min commercials about the bending styles and their influences. H2P 05:21, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Will this work? http://www.nicksplat.com/Whatsup/200508/31000118.html H2P 05:24, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Those two minute commercials are on Nick.com.  They are:  waterbending, earthbending, firebending, airbending  PCEevee talk 11:57, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations needed 

message: Okay, I did a lot of work on Zuko. Most of it was in the Relationships (not Family) section. I pretty much tried to cite the major/significant interactions he has with each person in the context of how it relates to his specific relationship with them. Before I felt like they were mostly a mish-mash of relevant and irrelevant information, not terribly well-expressed and sometimes with what I felt to be very egregious omissions. I was pretty much trying to make each section adhere to its implied purpose: to elucidate on the nature of the particular relationship he has with each character. They could very possibly be further wikified and I tried to be as concise as possible without giving any relationships the shaft. Any thoughts are welcome since I more or less want to do the same thing in the Family section.
I also have my eye on his history which I have a real jones to put in chronological order since information revealed in season one (such as things from The Storm) has been fully integrated into that section, but information from season two (like things from Zuko Alone) seem much more tacked on. I just think it would be an easier read and better serve its purpose if it didn't jump around so much. Plus, the Personality section contains a lot of redundant information that honestly has nothing to do with his personality, really. Raceberry 19:15, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I haven't read the entire page, but I really like what you've done with the parts I have read, and I support your further efforts.  Maybe we can make Zuko a model page for what this WikiProject is aiming for in article quality, once article quality is complete.  I'll be sure to offer some other comments when I have time to fully critique the article. Prototime 04:08, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. Figuring out a style for the articles, so to speak, is what I was trying to do when I started working on it because I feel like having some uniformity and clarity of purpose with the character pages is a great starting place for upping their general quality. I'll probably be tackling the history and personality today. Raceberry 10:41, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Working on Zuko 

message: Character quotes have been added to the top of all of the character pages lately, but I'm not so sure that this fits encyclopedic entries.  Any thoughts on this? Prototime 03:42, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think this ties in with my questions about quotes on the episode pages.  Do we want these sites to look like magazine articles or as dictionary pages?  I say we make a Wikiquote page for Avatar and organize it by episode (still a limit of 5), and then remove all the quotes where they aren't necessary.H2P 05:46, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I don't hate the quotes at the top of all of the character pages/sections, but I do see how that feels more fansite-y than encyclopedic. I also agree with H2P that since Wikiquote does exist, there's no real reason to just list quotes on any Avatar-related pages unless they're embedded in the article. Raceberry 10:36, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I've felt iffy about them, too.  Yes, they're nice and decorative, but I agree that it makes them less encyclopedic.  I could suggest that they be moved to the middle of the article, but that wouldn't be a 100% fix either.  I support the Wikiquote thing, especially since everyone wants to add quotes to all the episode articles.  --Crisu 13:37, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

text: There's making a page look pretty, and there's making a page look pretty and have information. I have no idea where those cquote thingies fall into. Pacific Coast Highway (blah • typa-typa) 15:58, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If we want both informative and.. uh.. "pretty".. perhaps an option would be to replace the quotes from the character with a descriptive quote about the character. As a poor example, Zuko's quote could be what Iroh says in The Chase: "His life has recently changed, and he's going through very difficult times. He's trying to figure out who he is, and he went away." That rather describes him quite well. Though I personally think no quote is the best option. MOF 10:08, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

text: I tend to agree.  My thoughts are that despite potentially making pages look "pretty", quote shouldn't be included in encyclopedic entries in that manner; if nothing else, that's what Wikiquote is for.  Quotes seem to be everywhere on Avatar pages (particularly the episode summaries, unfortunately), but for a articles on an animated television series they should really be used sparingly, and they certainly aren't notable enough to be the opening of a page; in addition, their inclusion is based on someone's point of view. Prototime 05:20, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  So.. move to delete?  Is it hard to start a Wikiquote page?  Then if anyone happens to throw in quotes, we'll easy ship them off to the appropriate place.  --Crisu 03:30, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, there already is a Wikiquote page: Avatar: The Last Airbender MOF 03:46, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi guys I didn't actually contribute any quotes, I just formatted the ones I found on the pages, I do like the way they look, and the way they instantly define a character so I vote to keep. No reason for us to avoid pleasing aesthetics while maintaining npov. --Basique 15:35, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I really do not believe that these quotes instantly define a character, for what quote should be included for a character is something that is subjective.  For example, some people may think that the quote "The Boulder feels conflicted about fighting a young blind girl" defines the Boulder, "My aura has never been pinker!" defines Ty Lee, and "You must know the pain of losing a first born son... by sacrificing your own!" defines Fire Lord Azulon, but I certainly do not.  Now we could comb through every character's page and democratically decide on what quote "best" defines each character, but besides being impractical, that too is a subjective opinion (assuming a majority vote could even be reached for each character).  Thus, I see these quotes as point of view, and hence things that should be moved to Wikiquote. Prototime 16:18, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: *Move to Wikiquote; Pacific Coast Highway (blah • typa-typa) 03:27, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Hmm, didn't know the wikiquote thing was already up and running, I'll get started on moving all those tomorrow... er, today H2P 05:33, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll start helping in the moves as well. Prototime 18:42, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Never mind, on a rethink, they'd be more trouble than they're worth.--Fyre2387 19:37, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah I didn't really want to remove them, that was my favorite scene out of the entire series so far. I did it because I removed the quotes everywhere else. I can't remember, but I think someone else already switched all pages to have a Wikiquote reference. After being on Wikiquote, I've decided not to touch that anymore, it would require minute by minute monitoring to protect from: Incorrect quoting, no much quoting, and unneccary quoting even after I posted a guideline in the talk section. It's things like that that make me wish editing was only allowed for registered members. H2P 20:50, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Character quotes?

message: I'd like to suggest that characters titles be removed from their names--for example, making "Prince Zuko" simply "Zuko", "Admiral Zhao" simply Zhao, etc.  This is how many other fictional characters in other series and movies are handled on Wikipedia (i.e. Captain Jean-Luc Picard is a redirect to Jean-Luc Picard), and for a variety of reasons. Besides these titles not being an actual part of the character's names (even if they are commonly referred to it), in many cases their inclusion isn't consistent (i.e., if it's "Avatar Roku", shouldn't it also be "Avatar Aang"?"), it solves any problem concerning rank and promotion (i.e. no confusion over "Commander Zhao" and "Admiral Zhao"), and it in some cases it makes little sense to include them--for example, "Uncle Iroh" is only "Uncle" to Zuko and Azula.  On a more minor note, doing so would also serve to make the Avatar template navigational box less wide. Prototime 18:56, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that this would be best. Especially since, as you've pointed out, it's inconsistent. Raceberry 06:15, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

text: It's pretty hard not to agree to this. MOF 05:54, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Very good; I will start the process of having the names changed shortly. Prototime 05:13, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Character titles

message: Since usage of the WikiProject's "To-do list" hasn't really skyrocketed, I thought that I should bring this up.  There are numerous pages out there relating to the show that need to be fixed (or created), as we all know (or else we wouldn't be having this WikiProject, of course), and if utilized, the To-do list can be a powerful tool to help us in our pursuits because it makes clear to all WikiProject members what pages need work, and what work needs to be done on these pages.  As such, I'd like to strongly encourage everyone to identify articles that need work and place them in the "Open Tasks" pane of the To-do list for all to see and hopefully take-up working on.  I've gone ahead and moved the To-do list to the top of the WikiProject page to put greater emphasis on it and also make it more noticeable to everyone.  (Also, it's fine if you remove the articles that are currently listed; those were mainly just up to be "fillers" to make everyone look good when I first created the WikiProject).  The To-do list can be a great help to us; let's not pass it up! Prototime 06:18, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This is getting annoying. How are we supposed to make these pages better when we are constantly having to babysit them from idiots who keep adding speculation and pointless crap? No wonder Wiki gets knocked down for it's ability to let everyone edit.H2P 17:15, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "To-do list" usage

message: I've noticed many articles have something along the lines of this, taken from Katara#Toph: "The two have been recently at odds with each other after Toph refused to help set up their campsites." Now, I'm of the mind that saying "recently" or some such referring to episodes that recently aired is inappropriate, but I thought I'd get a few opinions here before going through and removing all instances of it.--Fyre2387 18:52, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: How about we change it to "as of EPISODE". I do agree that the way it's currently worded it makes it sound like a news article rather than a reference. H2P 20:45, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Recently"? 

message: Ok guys, I'm finally gonna start work on the Avatar creatures. Now, per some other talk page, I'm only going to include creatures that don't exist in our world. Now all I gotta know is how you guys want me to organize them. Should it be by book and then by name like the Minor Characters page or does anyone else have an idea? H2P 05:32, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: About how many unique creatures are there?  If not too many, then perhaps just an alphabetical listing.  Otherwise if there are as many of them as there are minor characters, then I'll vote for the book-then-name format.  --Crisu 13:29, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: There are about one-two per episode H2P 19:40, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I say use an alphabetical listing.  Many of the creatures reappear throughout the series, and it seems less useful to split up by the page via season-appearance. Prototime 19:47, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

text: This all sounds great to me.  I'm not an expert in requests to include info from third parties in Wikipedia in this manner but I think that what you have done largely fulfills the requirements (Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission).  -You may want to make the GDFL terms a bit more clear to them, but, I doubt it should be a problem.  Sounds pretty good to me. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 05:42, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Creatures 

message: The following message from redsparta comes from Talk:List_of_minor_secondary_characters_of_Avatar:_The_Last_Airbender (hopefully me copying this message isn't plagiarism as well, lol):
"It has recently come to my attention that a bunch of the bios and the like were copied and pasted directly from Nick's new Avatar site by Father's Wish. The bulk of it were exact replicas with no more than one or two words changed, maybe a name. I recently went through and tediously changed as much as I could but I have a feeling it's going to stop anytime soon judging from the "Secret of the Fire Nation, Part 1", "Secret of the Fire Nation, Part 2", "City of Walls and Secrets" and episode list pages and the neglectation (is that even a word) of many warnings to stop and, as of now, no response from his talk page. I have seen the same act of plagiarism added to the Earth Kingdom and Fire Nation pages as well. --redsparta 10:30, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I just realized, while I was going through User:Father's Wish's talk page my comment was not there, niether was it in the history. The only explanation I can think of is it must have gotten lost in the shuffle as I submitted it not long after I reverted and deleted as much as I could of the plagiarised text on "List of Avatar: The Last Airbender minor secondary characters" as, not long after that, I was having much trouble even getting some pages to load and some of my recent edits wouldn't show up until they were done upgrading the severs Thursday night. --Redsparta 22:15, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That sucks.  Recently though, I posted a comment on his talk page myself concerning the massive plagairism and the Distant Horizon "source"; you can feel free to add any comments to mine, if you'd like. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 05:31, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I really don't think he's listening to our polite objections anymore H2P 05:34, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Plagiarism

message: What in the world is this? It has an IMDB entry, but it seems to be totally manufactured...anyone have a clue what the story here is?--Fyre2387 22:18, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: As far as I can gather from forum posts, it is only an IMBD entry, and nothing proves its existence. And pardon my french, but what the hell is going on here lately?!  A slew of unverifiable information,tons of plagarized info from Nick.com, edit-wars spanning numerous pages... Prototime 22:39, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I've gone ahead and proposed both this page and Tales of Ba Sing Se for deletion. If someone removes the tag from a page, which wouldn't surprise me we'll have to go through the lengthy, "controversial deletion" process, which would be unfortunate. Prototime 23:03, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Hopefully this won't end up going through the votes for deletion process, although I have a sinking feeling it will. If it does, though, I'm fairly certain the community consensus would be to delete.--Fyre2387 03:27, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[When there was you and me]]??? 

message: As has been mentioned,  , along with a slew of anonymous users (which are almost certainly him as well), has recently been going through and adding a massive amount of unverifiable information to Secret of the Fire Nation, Part 1, Secret of the Fire Nation, Part 2, City of Walls and Secrets, List of Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes, and Earth Kingdom, as well adding as a massive amount of plagairized information to List of Avatar: The Last Airbender minor secondary characters, Earth Kingdom and Fire Nation.  In addition, two new episode articles have popped up, Tales of Ba Sing Se and When there was you and me, both of which originate  (sfrom unreliable sources.  It's interesting to note that the creators of these two articles are both extremely new users, and have done little else;  created Tales of Ba Sing Se, and  created When there was you and me--check out their contributions pages to see what else they've done on Wikipedia, which is nothing.  Sound suspicious? I'm beginning to wonder if at least some of these accounts are owned by the same person.  Is there anyway this can be checked out? Prototime 23:44, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: So we've got some Sock accounts running around destroying our pages? Great. H2P 03:28, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I haven’t been able to keep proper track of these issues (only so many brushfires I can try and throw water on at once) but if they are doing Sock attacks, it can (and should) be reported here: Wikipedia:Suspected_sock_puppets.--Fyre2387 03:35, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Gotta love the internets. But seriously, this whole adding original research (and like the When there was you and me nonsense, which smells a lot like someone's fanfic) needs to end. Have we tried protecting/semipreotecting pages yet, or it's not that bad? Pacific Coast Highway (blah • Closed Captioned) 03:57, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Firebender is semi-protected, but as far as I know its the only Avatar-realted article that is.--Fyre2387 04:03, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Your welcome :-P H2P 05:25, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I believe Aang's page is as well.--Redsparta 04:26, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

text: It's definetley getting to the point where more pages should have this.  If the anonymous users (who are almost certainly  keep attacking pages like List of Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes, I'll be requesting semi-protection for some of the pages, and full protection if it comes to it.  This is becoming very tiredesome. (Also, in regards to the socks, I think we should probably wait and see if any further evidence surfaces; I'm not sure we have much of a case, yet). –Prototime (talk • contribs) 04:54, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Source of recent controversies

message: A couple of discussions have been starting with aims of (hopefully) ending some of the recent controversies plaguing the pages.  It'd help greatly if you could add your input to these discussions:
*Talk:List of Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes#Request for Comment: Verifiability of recent additions concerning the recent additions to the page and others with information sourced from a Distant Horizon forum post
*Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tales of Ba Sing Se: for the deletion of the article Tales of Ba Sing Se, which is based entirely on an IMDB entry
Thanks. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 04:10, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Ned's notice has gotten a 24-hour ban on that IP; I updated the link.  --Crisu 17:15, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Meh, his IP rotated, he's editing the article again. Totally ignoring the consensus on the talk page, unsurprisingly.--Fyre2387 17:59, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it's safe to say that this is now an issue of vandalism via WP:V violation and being against an established consensus, as such I wouldn't worry about the 3RR when removing this guy's statements. Just be sure to note this discussion in your edit summary so admins can understand what's going on. Someone also might want to request temp. semi-protection for the list of eps, which will make it so that anons can't edit. -- Ned Scott 20:22, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd request the protection myself, but I gotta run back to work. Best of luck.-- Ned Scott 20:32, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Because the anonymous user has completely disregarded community consensus, I have requested that List of Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes be semi-protected; see Wikipedia:Requests for page protection#List of Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes .28edit.7Ctalk.7Clinks.7Chistory.7Clogs.29.  And thanks for requesting this user get blocked for violating 3RR, Ned... hopefully, between all of this, it'll send a message to this user and we'll finally get some results. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 22:43, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I really hope your protection thing works Proto. It's getting annoying having to babysit these pages. Oh and by the way I still need input on a question I posed about the creatures page (^) and I need help trying to figure out what copyright I have to give on the card pictures I posted on the Minor Characters page. H2P 22:23, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

text: It's always good to make a step in the right direction. Hopefully this will all end soon. Pacific Coast Highway (blah • Closed Captioned) 04:51, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: hopefully this will help. --Redsparta 05:05, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: sigh. Now it turns out they created a new page titled "List of Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes2" and they changed link to the episodes list on the Template:Avatar page to there instead. I reverted it back but this is getting really old. --Redsparta 05:29, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: A number of anonymous users, and two new users have been doing this and vandalising the Secret of the Fire Nation, Part 2 and Tales of Ba Sing Se pages lately.... it doesn't require much to figure out who this is.  I'm reporting sock-puppetry to Wikipedia; I'll have a link to the report soon. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 05:31, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I wish you better results than I've been getting. --Redsparta 05:43, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I doubt me saying anything is going to work, but it'd really do both of us a lot of good if you'd just stop. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 05:58, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: At what cost?  Losing your Father's Wish account and all the others, so that you'll never have the ability to contribute any other truth to Wikipedia in the future, just over this one instance? –Prototime (talk • contribs) 06:14, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: You know what, I believe you when you say that the information is the truth, but you still broke the rules, and we didn't. If you don't want to play by the rules then go to another wiki. -- Ned Scott 06:26, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I don't need to sleep H2P 06:59, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: This is pathetic...he's vandalizing the TfD vote, for God's sake...--Fyre2387 19:38, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Your input is needed!

message: Please see and contribute to Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/Father's Wish, if you'd like... –Prototime (talk • contribs) 07:03, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not sure if the admins just can't do much to block him because of the dynamic IP, or if they're not understanding that the user can easily evade blocks.  Hopefully Prototime's evidence page will make things clear. -- Ned Scott 07:10, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I really hope so.  Unfortunately, I must be off to bed... I hope that things will have greatly improved by the time I check this tomorrow. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 07:20, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Are talk pages eligible for s-protect?  If not, we can still request to s-protect the Wikiproject page.  --Crisu 03:18, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: So, have we won? H2P 05:23, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd hope so. It's past 1:00 am here in New York, and I need to sleep. Pacific Coast Highway (blah • Closed Captioned) 05:33, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Rest easy my friend, it is my shift anyway. H2P 05:37, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

text: I too really hope so, as I too am planning on heading to bed shortly, but as far as tomorrow goes--I'm not putting my guard down just yet. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 05:42, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Despite the user's claim to give up, he's still at it, creating new accounts and vandalizing pages.  Not surprising. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 19:53, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

text: The case has been accepted; see Wikipedia:Abuse reports/Father's Wish. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 00:33, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Regarding the current insanity

message: Yes, I have stopped already, so all the other vandals that aren't Chicago IP-based aren't me. 69.214.221.232 05:47, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Good to hear. –Prototime (talk • contribs) 02:07, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stopped 

message: From the WikiProject main page:
---
Structural guidelines encompass guidelines for how information relating to the show is broken up and distributed by categories, articles, sections, and templates, as well as the format for all articles within a category and the format for all templates. These guidelines are detailed below; feel free to discuss them on the talk page.
Format guidelines for the articles within the below categories are currenty under discussion:
*:Category:Avatar: The Last Airbender characters
*:Category:Avatar: The Last Airbender episodes
*:Category:Avatar: The Last Airbender nations
---
The aim of this discussion is to finalize a uniform page structure for all pages within their respective Avatar sub-categories.  It'll require some reworking and rewriting of current page sections, and everyone's input is a necessity in making this decision. Let's start hammering these out.
===:Category:Avatar: The Last Airbender characters===
Personally, I really like the work Raceberry did on the Prince Zuko page, and would love to see a similar format applied to all of the Avatar main character pages.  The way the pages would be layed out would be like this:
*History
*Story
**Book 1: Water
**Book 2: Earth
**Book 3: Fire (in the future, of course)
*Personality
*Family
**"Family member A" (if relationship to family member is notable)
**"Family member B" (if relationship to family member is notable)
**(etc.)
**Other (would denote any minor relationships with family members, if applicable)
*Relationships
**"Relationship A"
**"Relationship B"
**(etc.)
**Other (would denote any minor relationships, if applicable)
There could also be some necessary exceptions, like maybe an "Avatar" section for the Aang's page, though maybe these things could be subsections as well.  Also, I'm not really sure how to incorporate the "bending" sections that (only some) character pages currently have; maybe the "Personality" section could be renamed "Character", with two subsections: "Personality" and "xxxbending".
What are your thoughts on how these pages should be set up? Prototime 22:17, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well with all of the main characters being benders besides Sokka, why don't we just make a second catagory for bending information and just omit it from Sokka's page? H2P 05:26, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I'm good with that template.  And would it also work to have a Bending section on Sokka's page but talk about how he doesn't have the ability (and instead put all of his "He's just as a capable as a warrior and engineer" stuff there)?  --Crisu 13:29, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

text: How about a more general section labeled “Abilities” where we can discuss bending (what they bend, how skilled they are at it, and so forth) when its applicable along with any other skills or abilities they may have, such as weapons they may be able to use, things like that. --Fyre2387 15:53, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: That sounds good to me.  And for characters who have bending abilities as well as other notable abilities, i.e. Zuko's firebending abilitiy and his sword-fighting ability, this Abilities section could be further broken down into subsections. Prototime 19:43, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If we're in agreement, then, I'll start integrating this new layout (and of course, I hope everyone else does the same!)
===:Category:Avatar: The Last Airbender nations===
Here is what I suggest for the structure of pages in this category:
*Geography
*Culture (could merge content that's currently in "Appearance" sections into this section, as it really desribes the citizens, not the nation)
*Government
*Military
**Army (if applicable)
**Navy (if applicable)
**Other (if applicable)
*Locations
**Cities
**Landmarks
**Other (if applicable)
*Influences
*Notable figures
Of course, this is just my suggestion.  What are your thoughts? –Prototime (talk • contribs) 01:17, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Discussion on "Structural Guidelines"

message: Here is what I suggest for the structure of pages in this category:
*Geography
*Culture (could merge content that's currently in "Appearance" sections into this section, as it really desribes the citizens, not the nation)
*Government
*Military
**Army (if applicable)
**Navy (if applicable)
**Other (if applicable)
*Locations
**Cities
**Landmarks
**Other (if applicable)
*Influences
*Notable figures
Of course, this is just my suggestion.  What are your thoughts? –Prototime (talk • contribs) 01:17, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[:Category:Avatar: The Last Airbender nations]]

message: Since as of late we’ve had some debate over how to list Avatars in pages for nations and bending types, I thought we ought to take the discussion here to come up with a solution , rather than continue edit warring. First, I’d like to apologize if any of my edit summaries came off rude, I’ve had something of a stressfully day and wasn’t, perhaps, as civil as I should have been. Nevertheless, we do need to come up with a solution.
Now, here’s what, in my opinion, would be the best way:
For the nation pages, only list an Avatar if they were from that nation. It seems to me this is the most accurate way to do it. For example, as a fully trained Avatar, Roku could, no doubt, do Airbending, Waterbending, and Earthbending. However, he was still a citizen of the Fire Nation, and not a Water Tribesmen, Air Nomad, or Earth Kingdom subject.
The bending arts pages are, however, less cut-and-dry. After all, it is true that Avatars can, by default, bend all elements. I do have a thought, though. From what (admittedly little) we’ve seen of Avatars, they seem to use their “native” elements the most. That makes sense, since that’s what they grew up learning (remember, under normal circumstances, one isn’t told he or she is the Avatar until their sixteenth birthday.) Remember, now, that these sections are labeled “Notable -benders”. I would make the argument that Roku, for example, would be notable as a Firebender certainly, but not really as an Earthbender.
Now, this is all just my opinions. Any input from anybody else would be great.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 23:28, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Listing Avatars 

message: http://www.animationinsider.net/article.php?articleID=1126
I e-mailed this guy and he assured me that Nick allowed him to see the show before hand: 
:"My name is Aaron H. Bynum, and I am the editor-in-chief/Content Administrator for AnimationInsider.net.  We have been online since summer of 2003; publishing news and reviews information regarding the Eastern and Western animation industries.  None of the information we publish are rumors; we only publish news articles or review articles based on information derived from official materials (press releases & media kits, interviews, licensed domestic releases, &c).
:I did receive official rights from Nickelodeon to review the content of AVATAR: THE LAST AIRBENDER, episodes #212 and #213; for all legal purposes.  I apologize if you have come under scrutiny for searching for a means to validate the information you are receiving, with little to begin with. 
 
:Due to the fact that Episodes #212 and #213 will not officially air on Nickelodeon until September 15th, I have appropriately noted in and around my review article that said article contains spoilers"
Now, we've been having a lot of trouble recently with people posting "hacked" information about these episodes. This review is mostly point of view, but the facts are there and we should decide what to do with them. We could make a coming soon page, such as Harry Potter Book 7, or we could ignore it all together. But apparently we do now have titles: The Serpent's Path (which according to this guy's review sound like a sexual innuendo) and The Drill.
I consider this in no way a victory on the side of the sock puppets that harassed us, but I have a feeling we're gonna hear from them again. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 04:09, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Secrets of the Fire Nation 

message: No offence to you guys, but I'm gonna take a break from updating for till atleast Tuesday. Our watched sites are going to explode due to the new episode and I don't want to deal with that stress of all the reverting. I'll nit pick randomly when I get bored but there is no way I'm gonna stay real active right now. We should get into a better flow as the two new episodes become old news. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 02:11, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Taking a Break 

message: should we give Mai and Ty Lee their own pages like Azula? Or are they still considered secondary characters? --Piemanmoo 09:06, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Depends, WP:FICT says "If an encyclopedic treatment of such a character causes the article on the work itself to become long, then that character can be given a separate article." If the amount of text is encyclopedic then yes, but if it's just long because someone wrote a lot of stuff, then no. Hope that helps. -- Ned Scott 09:23, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think "upgrading" them to primary characters would be necessary at this point. We really don't know enough about them to have a full article like that.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 15:11, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  suggestion 

message: Hi. If you still have work to do tagging talk pages and assessing articles, my AWB plugin might be of interest to you.
The plugin has two main modes of operation:
*Tagging talk pages, great for high-speed tagging
*Assessments mode, for reviewing articles (pictured)
As of the current version, WikiProjects with simple "generic" templates are supported by the plugin without the need for any special programatic support by me. I've had a look at your project's template and you seem to qualify.
For more information see:
*About the plugin
*About support for "generic" WikiProject templates
*User guide
*About AWB (AutoWikiBrowser)
Hope that helps. If you have any questions or find any bugs please let me know on the plugin's talk page. --Kingboyk 11:56, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Tagging talk pages and assessing articles

message: Hello, everyone,
since Avatar is going into it's third season, information on the characters grows and grows. There are almost no citations in the character articles, sooooo ... can't we make somehow make a citation so we know from which episode the info comes from? I think that would greatly reduce "wishful thinking" and assumptions, as articles tend to get undermined by this. Any suggestions? --Plumcouch Talk2Me 17:47, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: If by wishful thinking you mean speculation, believe me that's pretty much all I do. I don't hardly ever add additions, I just keep the pages clean of speculation and nonsence while leaving additions as well as grammar changes up to the other various editors that come by. When you mean citation, however, I don't know what more we could do other than providing a link to the episode that the action happened, which normally we do (In Episode X, Character Y did this. or As seen in Episode A). Please explain a little further as too what it is you want us to do. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 19:37, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

text: I'd personally prefer in-prose citations whenever possible. Having a number (or even worse, a cite needed tag) after every other sentence disrupts the article and makes it harder to read, especially if you're using a screen reader or something similar.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 15:25, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citations and episodes 

message: I’ve been looking through our articles on episodes, especially the more recent ones, and the “Notes” sections are getting really long. I’d like to get input about shrinking them a bit. My thinking is, these notes should be strictly about the episodes, not about locations, characters, creatures, and so on. All those things have their own pages. For example, City of Walls and Secrets has four notes describing Ba Sing Se in some way. Ideally, all that would be in the description of Ba Sing Se elsewhere (see the other section I’m making in this edit for that.)--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 00:33, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This is only getting worse. I'm going to start working backwards through the episodes removing stuff from notes that belongs somewhere else (and putting it there if it isn't already there.)--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 16:58, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've been removing unneeded notes for a while now. People keep putting them back. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 22:41, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  “Notes” sections on episode articles 

message: With so many episodes set in Ba Sing Se (two already, and from the looks of things several more) we have a lot to say about it. I’m thinking it warrants an article of its own. Anyone object?--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 00:33, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: unless we've reached an Avatar limit on Wiki, the more pages the better. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 02:11, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: According to the Nick.com site (go to the site, then change Avatar2 to avatar for my source for this info) there will be 6 more episodes inside Ba Sing Se. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 03:14, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just thinking, even if Appa's Lost Days are counted in h2p's episodes in Ba Sing Se, that means that their is still one episode left to happen there. (2 + 6 - 7 = 1) Cnriaczoy42 21:23, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New article: Ba Sing Se 

message: Yeah, they look cool, but I'm not sure all computers pick them up and because of that I question if they should be there. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 02:48, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Some of the Indian articles see (Shahrukh Khan or Akbar) have Persian, Urdu and Devanagari scripts. The template for Asian (or rather Chinese) actors has a place for the traditional Chinese (see Jackie Chan for example.) No one seems to bother and the Asian actor template is generally used. I don't see a reason for the Chinese characters to be deleted, since all the "real persons" have their names written out in Chinese, no matter if people can read it or not. Best regards, --Plumcouch Talk2Me 13:37, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chinese characters 

message: Wow, we have a problem here. If you go to the main Avatar article, you see the problems easily. Almost all the pictures (I uploaded the Iroh, Katara, and the new HD Map ones, they should be fine or atleast only need minor changes) need their citations changed with a fair use rational, screenshot copyright, and permission by the person(s) that captured it. I already know that all the creatures pictures need changes so that it's AvatarSpirit.net not .com and I've sent an e-mail to Firebender.net for permission but there are a lot of pictures that should be combed over as it is a requirement for feature article approval. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 14:54, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: As of now, all images on the minor secondary characters page have fair use rationales for that page. And it only took about 50 edits to do it. Also, I'd like to remind everybody to make sure that, when you upload an image, you categorize it into . A lot of the pictures I did today were not there.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 18:23, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Last night I fixed all the creatures images, something I had been putting off. A reminder that if you upload a creature image it would be nice to put that AvatarSpirit.net gave me permission to use them. They were upset in their last e-mail that pictures were being taken from their site without permission. I sent a recent e-mail to them in hopes to assure them that this topic is being worked on currently. As per Firebender.com, they are closing their site and the only way to contact the person is through their forum which I did not join yet. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 18:36, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Image citations 

message: You wanted help in the Spirit World article. You got it, bud. T.z0n3 23:35, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Yo

message: Hello. The WikiProject Council is currently in the process of developing a master directory of the existing WikiProjects to replace and update the existing Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory.  These WikiProjects are of vital importance in helping wikipedia achieve its goal of becoming truly encyclopedic. Please review the following pages: 
*User:Badbilltucker/Culture Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Culture Directory 2, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Philosophy and religion Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Sports Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Geographical Directory, 
*User:Badbilltucker/Geographical Directory/United States, (note: This page will be retitled to more accurately reflect its contents)
*User:Badbilltucker/History and society directory, and
*User:Badbilltucker/Science directory
and make any changes to the entries for your project that you see fit. There is also a directory of portals, at User:B2T2/Portal, listing all the existing portals. Feel free to add any of them to the portals or comments section of your entries in the directory.
The three columns regarding assessment, peer review, and collaboration are included in the directory for both the use of the projects themselves and for that of others. Having such departments will allow a project to more quickly and easily identify its most important articles and its articles in greatest need of improvement. If you have not already done so, please consider whether your project would benefit from having departments which deal in these matters. 
It is my hope to have the existing directory replaced by the updated and corrected version of the directory above by November 1. Please feel free to make any changes you see fit to the entries for your project before then. If you should have any questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you. B2T2 21:07, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry if you tried to update it before, and the corrections were gone. I have now put the new draft in the old directory pages, so the links should work better. My apologies for any confusion this may have caused you. B2T2 23:52, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Project Directory 

message: So, I'm new to this project, so please politely remind me if I make the occasional stupid mistake.
Anyway, the Earthbender, Airbender, Waterbender, and Firebender pages all have drastically different page setups. I was wondering: is there any agreed-upon template for these? If there isn't, I suggest that we come up with one pronto, because currently the '-bender' pages are quite confusing. Sandmouse 15:26, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: OKay, since no one seems talkative right now, I'll propose one myself: 
*Origin & History (Badger-moles for earthbending, the moon  for waterbending, etc.)
*Fighting Style (The Martial Art it is based on)
*Forms (i.e., for waterbending, there would be Northern, Southern, and Swamp styles)
*Tecniques & Weapons (for Airbending, there would be the glider and the air scooter; for firebending, lightning would be here, as well as Zuko's flame-swords; one for waterbending would be healing, etc.)
*Culture (Agni Kai for firebenders; that airball game Aang taught Sokka; the Earthbending game the kids were playing in Iroh's tale. Also would include Elemental Symbol)
*Notable ___benders (self-explanatory; replace ___ with Earth, Fire, Water, or Air)
Anyone have any other suggestions? Sandmouse 02:03, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bender Templates 

message: A new proposal regarding some restrictions for fair use images has been put forth. Seeing as this proposal would, if passed, have a major effect on several Avatar-related articles, I figured some of you guys might want to give some input.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 19:10, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  You guys might want to throw in some input on this... 

message: Getting kind of long, and most these people I never actually see edits from. Is there a way to prune it? H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 20:44, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps we could put a message on the user talk pages of less active members, asking if they still wish to participate in the project. I agree something should be done, though, I've not seen edits from many on the list in a while, and it would be nice to have an accurate number of how many people we really have working on Avatar articles.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 20:50, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Members List 

message: Should there be an article on Avatar fandom?
Richardkselby 20:25, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: To put it bluntly, No. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 23:47, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Reviewing that article (Harry Potter fandom), the Harry Potter stuff is a whole different league. All an Avatar one would really be is a shipping guide and a list of fansites.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 03:31, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

text: I still really don't think its notable. I mean, if Wikipedia had fandom articles for every show made, it would just get absurd. Harry Potter is one of the most popular book series of all time. Avatar is nowhere near that.--Fyre2387 (talk • contribs) 04:33, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Fandom

message: Beginning cross-post.
:See Wikipedia talk:Version 1.0 Editorial Team#Stablepedia. If you wish to comment, please comment there. ★MESSEDROCKER★ 23:24, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stablepedia 

message: As many may know, somebody looking to find out about the show will want one article in front of them giving them a full description of why they should watch it. However, current fans who need more information on an epsiode or character will look for an individual article on the subject. Therefore, the main Avatar article ( Avatar: The Last Airbender ) should have a brief description of every character and epsiode, a full description of the shows creation, etc. (since it is a TV show article) and links to the seperate articles for every character, epsiode, etc. This may seem as if it has already been done but the main thing missing is the episodes in the main Avatar article. There is not even a list of the episodes, let alone a short description. In addition, Appa and Momo are rarely mentioned in the article even though they have a big role in the show. 71.247.34.36 15:28, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The episodes are fine with a separate article. It's pretty easy to click a link to find out. And Appa and Momo are mentioned frequently. Though they are not main characters. Appa even has his own article now. -Dylan0513 16:20, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Avatar Article 

message: Does airbending have any sub-skills? No airbending sub-skills were shown in the series (possibly because Aang is the only airbender in it), so we have to assume that airbending does not have a sub-skill, and thus all that "each bending style has a sub-skill unique to their element" statements in other bending articles have to be removed. Sure, we know that the fire nation has electrokinesis, waterbenders have vitakinesis, earthbending has ferrokinesis, but until it is proven that airbending has a sub-skill, to say that each element has a unique sub-skill is purely speculative and should not be in Wikipedia. What do you guys think? - Stretchyrubberbands( Tell me how to overcome my stupidity) 17:28, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sub-skills for Airbending? 

message: Just a reminder to everyone. Too bad I'll be missing it because I have to stay at the office. Can someone please send me the episode? Or at least post it on Youtube? - Stretchyrubberbands( Tell me how to overcome my stupidity) 16:44, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: YouTube doesn't allow that anymore. Just torrent it. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 23:30, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Season Finale Airs Today 

message: Hey i saw all those userboxes that were on the site and well I did not quite fit with any of them so I made my own.

Not sure if anyone else would want to use it but if you do, be my guest.
Tell me what you think.
:I'm guessing that could be the template for the peace loving hippy non-bender :-P. H2P (Yell at me for what I've done) 03:04, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: meh mabey 8-) Phoenix741 03:09, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Userboxes