Talk:Raiden (Metal Gear)

message: To anyone who cares: Plz., revert the page to it's previous version. It has been vandalized over and over, through the past days. I could do it myself, but I don't have enough time. --Zephir 00:34, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: page is being vandalized over and over again.

message: In the trailer for guns of the patriots it shows Raiden back looking like a cyborg ninja but what I find awkward is that he is not using the high frequency blade, in fact he is using two different swords and a knife. The sword we see him use is a long rough steel blade with a grip. I would like to know what happen to Raiden's HF blade.  --(ryo)
Yeah, that struck me odd too. I mean, the H.F. Blade is the Sword of Swords, soo naturally we'd assume he'd be using it... unless one of those swords IS the H.F. Blade and it went under a redesign or simply looks different because of the major graphical differences between MGS2 and MGS4
: I agree with the second theory. It could merely be the same high-frequency blade but with a different appearance due to Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty and Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots being released SIX years apart. (Myscrnnm 04:14, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't see why they'd need to be the same H.F. Blade. It's not like there's only one, they are probably manufactured by ArmsTech or Tokugawa Heavy Industries or one of the other fictional MG companies. Gray Fox used on as well, after all. WtW-Suzaku 21:45, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

text: Gray Fox's sword is also a high-frequency blade, but it's an older model, with a cable that connects to his exoskeleton, presumably for a power source.(Myscrnnm 20:54, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: sword in metal gear solid 4 guns of the patriots

message: Raiden is rumored to be Link from Legend of Zelda, as they both are similar to each other. Link never talks, and Raiden usually misinterperates what Colonel Campbell says sometimes(ie:Colonel says nodes, Raiden misunderstands it as nerds) meaning they both have little knowledge of English., and both are highly adept at sword use.
C'mon, who is supposed to beleive this tripe. Metal gear ninty 21:53, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Far-fetched

message: I've included some references, but this seems to have jumbled things up, I'm new here so I don't know how to correct this, so could someone fix it please? Metal gear ninty 11:04, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  References Jumbled 

message: Is it of any note that it is often speculated that the GBC Metal Gear game may have you playing as Raiden, unbenknownst to players. He is reffered to as 'Jack' a few times, and the popular internet ruling is that this was the 'vr' mission Raiden did prior to Big Shell. 
Think it's worth it?03:24, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metal Gear Intergal (GBC) 

message: Again, I like this section, but it needs a reliable source. This Geocities site is not a reliable source.
In contrast to the American reception, Raiden was quite popular in Japan, probably due to his deeper voice given by Kenyu Horiuchi in the original Japanese version (in contrast to Quinton Flynn's more effeminate voice acting in the English version) and a generally more mature portrayal in Kojima's original script.The Importance of Voice Acting. Featured article from Muni Shinobu's Metal Gear Solid site An androgynous appearance is also generally more acceptable in Japanese pop culture. Despite his relative popularity in Japan, Raiden's negative reaction among English-speaking gamers prompted Kojima Productions to alter his character design for Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots.
Please don't replace it until you have added a proper source. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:52, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed some unsourced text 

message: Can we please not use this image for the infobox? His effeminate appearance is a major part of this article's focus, and as such we should not use an image that completely conceals same. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:52, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree that the image should show him with a mask on, since Raiden typically shows his face. 12.219.74.52 15:33, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I prefer to use the latest incarnation of the character over the oldest, but whatever suit your tastes. At least don't discard the image I've uploaded. I put it there to give a full body shot of Raiden's new looks. Jonny2x4 05:00, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: [[:Image:MGS4 Raiden render.jpg]]

message: I would like to know who these people are.  The 'new way to perceive Raiden' is very in line with the notions of the worldwide guerrila-style warfare that Liquid Snake (through Ocelot) apparently begins to unleash, "drop by drop," upon the world. --75.2.21.90 11:04, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "Some believe the new image hollow"

message: First, about Raiden's voice. I don't see it noted anywhere that Raiden's Japanese voice actor has a much deeper voice than Quinton Flynn. While we don't know for sure what the exact reason for the different voice is, we do know that Kojima did cast Horiuchi himself, and we know he didn't cast Flynn, which to me indicates that he had intended for Raiden to have a deep voice (again, that's my opinion, but it is definitely true that Kojima did handle the Japanese voice casting, while INTAC handles the English voice casting). Anyway, why isn't any of this (at least the fact that the Japanese Raiden has a much deeper voice) mentioned in the article (under "Character development", perhaps)?
I do see that this was mentioned in a deleted paragraph, but I think the fact that he has a deeper voice in the Japanese version should definitely be put under "Character development".
And regarding his popularity in Japan. I changed "Raiden was quite popular in Japan" to "Raiden was more well-received in Japan". You can see that in the 1UP.com interview Kojima merely says "there are actually many people in Japan who like Raiden", while he also says "But the fans ended up not liking him" (note that he says "the fans", and not "the Western fans"). Also note that on the Japanese Wikipedia, Raiden doesn't have his own article, while Solid Snake, Liquid, and Solidus, as well as Big Boss, Ocelot, Otacon, and Campbell all have their own articles. Quite popular? Hardly.
-71.80.31.42 08:12, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Popularity and voice in Japan 

message: Do we have any cites that state that this is an intentional connection? - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 04:25, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ghost Babel connections 

message: If Raiden went through the Tanker incident in VR, why would he believe that Snake destroyed the tanker rather than Ocelot? For that matter, why would the Patriots let him learn this at all?
--Pika132
:One presumes that he went through an edited version. It isn't made clear. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 06:23, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tanker incident in VR? 

message: "Raiden's uncle is Solid Snake by law due to his relationship with Solidus Snake."
Solidus didn't officially adopt Raiden; he found him and took him under his care, training him to be one of his soldiers. So, Snake is not Raiden's uncle.
Although not by law, Solidus does think of Raiden as his son, and the only father Raiden knows of is Solidus. So, Snake is Raiden's uncle as much as Liquid is Solid's "brother".
Ya the above poster did clearly say, "law" so Indeed Snake is Raiden's Uncle and Naked snake is Raiden's grandpa lol Otaconx
I wish Snake was my uncle imagine how fun family reunions would be minus teh fact snake killed off half of them and Ocelot would have to be there because Liquid. GamerSam 13:31, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Uncle? Nah

message: Can we get a source on this claim " It has been recently confirmed by Lead Character Designer: Yoji Shinkawa, that Raiden is indeed a Cyborg like Gray Fox, and the only things still human about him are apparently his head and spine. He commented that Raiden is "falling apart"" —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 209.112.147.54 (talk) 00:59, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It was in the official Kojima Report podcast thing with Yoji Shinkawa as a guest, relatively recently. You could probably find it with a quick search. WtW-Suzaku 21:49, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Citation. 

message: Recently i read to an article about raiden's uniform. It says that raiden cant live without the suit... My question is: What really happened to raiden? I looked everywhere to find an answer but unfortunately i found.. nothing.So?! Why he cant live without the suit? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.78.230.234 (talk) 15:26, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: We don't know yet. It will be revealed in Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots, which comes out later this year. (Myscrnnm 04:09, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  What really happened to Raiden? 

message: I would edit this out completely. The artificial white blood is not likely a specific referance to Oxycite, and is much more likely a direct referance to Policenauts, where several characters have artificial white blood, usually referred to as "Milk Blood". This is one of several referances to Policenauts in the MG series, another of which being Tokugawa Heavy Industries itself, which is plastered all over Raiden's new exoskeleton. WtW-Suzaku 06:56, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Either one is just speculation without a solid source †he Bread3000 07:35, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Better to just remove the Oxycite thing altogether, then. WtW-Suzaku 19:46, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Oxycite Refernace

message: If you take a look at the individual storylines of Frank Jaeger and Jack, you'll discover they are EXTREMELY similar. 
Both of them were child soldiers, and were aparently so good that they both got nicknames for their deadly nature, Jack the Ripper and The Frank Hunter. Also, both were aparently in perfect soldier experiments, Frank's perfect soldier experiment explained in Portable Ops, and the side objective of the patriots in the Big Shell incident as Jack's. Both found some sort of salvation from these projects due to the current Snake (Naked and Solid). And the most oveous one, both becomeing a Cyborg Ninja. 
I dont think this is a quincidence. Hideo Kojima must have purposely made these two individuals to be this similar for some reason. The question is, what is this reason? Perhaps it will be revealed in Guns of the Patriots.--CloudHiro 08:33, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jack and Frank's simlarities 

message: "Raiden's real name, Jack, was taken from the name of Leonardo DiCaprio's character in the movie Titanic. Concurrently, his love interest in the game is named (Rosemary) after Kate Winslet's character in the film.[3] His role and status were also likened by the designers to those of the jack in a deck of playing cards, with Fortune representing the Queen, Solidus Snake the King, and SEAL Team 10 the expendable "spot" cards."... ok what? Raiden wasn't even take from that. Some Survey thing,that why Raiden was made a character--Hitamaru 23:05, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: ... Huh,wut? 0.o i don't think kojima named him after a dude in titanic. That would say they name the jack dude in Pirates of Carribean after Titanic. It's jus fan fiction and some nutty titanic fan. even tho imo the movie was horrible.--Hitamaru 22:52, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

text: MGS1 has Hal and Dave (2001: A Space Odyssey), and MGS2 has Jack and Rose (Titanic). It's definitely intentional. Philip Reuben (talk) 12:59, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Titanic thing

message: Can some get a pic of him and move the current raiden pic to the big shell chapter.--Hitamaru 22:52, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Why? The MGS2 Raiden is the original and came long before the MGS4 incarnation who is basically just Cyborg Ninja 3.0. Jonny2x4 (talk) 05:17, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Picture of New raiden 

message: Does Raiden know about Ocelot/Big Boss's plan in MGS4? Does he know it was all fake so Snake would do what he did and stop the Patriots from stopping them? If so, it should be mentioned in the plot points.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Muisee (talk • contribs) 02:09, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Does Raiden know about the entire plan the whole time? 

message: I think that something about "Les Enfants Terribles" should really be added.  It has to do with everything about Raiden's past and his character.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.144.34.90 (talk) 02:02, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Les Enfants Terribles 

message: "He may actually be the first official Snatcher in the Metal Gear universe." Am I just not getting the reference here or is this pure graffiti? When I searched for Snatcher all I found was some silly old game.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.94.26.214 (talk) 18:18, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm sorry, but the phrase "silly old game" tickled me! ;) Snatcher was a game that Hideo Kojima developed after the original Metal Gear. It was a graphic adventure influenced by cyberpunk media (meaning primarily movies) like Blade Runner and Terminator, centered around cybernetic organisms (part robot, part organic, you know) killing and replacing humans, and was pretty good for the time. The Game included References to Metal Gear, most notable a small robot called Metal Gear Mk. II - back in 1988. After that Kojima went on to do Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake and went on to include references to Snatcher. If you call Kesler/ Kasler in the final match with Big Boss, he'll tell you, that Big Boss is rumored to have been revived by the snatcher program, where cybernatic parts replace vital organs. This was a complete in-joke, of course, but the guy making the MGS4 Database took this a bit too serious and incorporated in it, meaning that this is now unfortunately canon.87.174.211.241 (talk) 19:46, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Snatcher? 

message: I`m sorry but where does it says he is of African descent? Zidane tribal (talk) 06:49, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Only because he fought in the Liberian civil war, that`s not proof he is of African descent. Zidane tribal (talk) 06:53, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  African American category 

message: could his name have anything to do with the WW2 IJN Fighter aircraft the Mitsubishi J2M Raiden(Thunderbolt).....this aircraft was(and its probly just a coencidence) ...codenamed "Jack" by the allies in much the same way as the A6M Zero "Zeke" and G4M "Betty"
i just figure 2 Raiden/Jacks is either wierd or genius for hideo kojima..you decide lol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_J2M
Tony Spike  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tony Spike (talk • contribs) 18:03, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Already added with a source.Tintor2 (talk) 00:22, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  another correlation to Raiden? 

message: Hi folks,  I just wanted to ask, for the sake of having a good article, what's the deal with Raiden's sacrifice in MGS4?  I haven't involved myself in the MGS world for a while, but I remember him dying (more or less), and I also remember, and have read here, that he needs that suit to live.  And yet, doesn't MGS4 have a happy ending where he has his arm back and no suit and what not?  How is this explained in the lore?  In advance, I apologize if I added this wrong, but I'm no good with wikipedia.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.92.133.164 (talk) 21:33, 24 April 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: His "human suit" was just a disguise. He was this close to dying in MGS4 but made it out alive. The problem is that we cannot list everything he does per WP:PLOT. Regards.Tintor2 (talk) 00:05, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Raiden's Sacrifice in MGS4

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: CC-BY-SA declaration; text in this section removed from the article by me; I've left it here in case its removal it breaks any references. Baffle☿gab 02:41, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: Removed text

message: (removed because it's not primarily about the subject character):
Capcom expressed concerns when adding a new protagonist to the series Devil May Cry in the 2008 installment Devil May Cry 4. Fearing negative feedback as in Sons of Liberty, producer Hiroyuki Kobayashi said Capcom aimed to make newcomer Nero fun to play like returning Dante and intended to make him stronger at some point.
</blockquote>  Baffle☿gab 02:41, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
thread_title: From Reception --> Critical reaction

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message: this is commonly discussed, but many people say this isn't Raiden (despite the character playing as snake having the same name). I am aware of the common name, but c'mon, they were in development around the same time and its stated that Raiden went through snakes missions in VR, as well as the nameless character, who speaks to you all through out Ghost Babel, says something along the lines of "you will be in action very soon" (I cant remember exactly what he says, but its similar to this).Theres too many things adding up to just be a coincidence, right? 2A02:C7C:7A80:7500:F844:5A65:A37F:A155 (talk) 18:49, 15 February 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: As you said, Jack is a common name. And in the series, it refers to at least two characters: Big Boss and Raiden. The problem is for Wikipedia standards, you need a verifiable source (WP:V) that definitively says "Raiden is THAT Jack" And Wikipedia doesn't allow original research per WP:NOR either Something129 (talk) 19:42, 15 February 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: I saw your undo of my edit, I fixed the sources to be in line with standards. I think it's important to include this information, as it is somewhat relevant, and not doing so will lead to further vandalism. Ludensg (talk) 20:09, 15 February 2024 (UTC)

text: This has already been addressed in the article. There's no need to change the official first appearance based on speculation. So long as this is up to dispute and interpretation, it can't be added as official information. Remember that a Wikipedia article has neutrality as its top priority. If one day Kojima, or another reputed source comments on this, then this can be re-considered. Ludensg (talk) 19:55, 15 February 2024 (UTC)

text: I say that since such franchise is know for tricking the audience, it would be better if we had confirmation Kojima or other staff members. Venom Snake was assumed to be the original Big Boss in all of the trailers until the Phantom Pain added a scene that revealed he had nothing to do with the other Snakes.Tintor2 (talk) 21:08, 15 February 2024 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree, there's also the fact that all of this speculation and debate might have been intended as part of a meta-game mechanic, which I think is why it was worthwhile to address it in the article. But yeah, setting this as official information without official confirmation seems a bit silly to me. Ludensg (talk) 05:04, 16 February 2024 (UTC)
thread_title:  Raiden in Ghost Babel