Talk:Microsoft Visual C++

message: I've done my best to clean up the "history" section, which used improper tenses & had other grammatical mistakes - as well as some very strange, mangled HTML & Wiki code - but someone with better knowledge of the history of Visual C++ could probably help improve that section quite a bit. Keithius 22:17, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: History

message: Article states that although the "C++ Toolkit 2003" lacks the "Platform SDK" and the debugger, these are  "available as separate downloads."      From context one would assume these are available for free download.  I wasn't able to find a debugger available for free download at the Microsoft Developer Network download site. 
If there really is a free debugger available for download, I suggest adding an external link  as has been done for the "C++ Toolkit 2003".  If not, the article needs to be corrected.  Note:  The latest version of the "Platform SDK" has debuggers for 64 bit code, but not for 32 bit code.
:See Debug Tools For Windows .
:It was available as a separate download when Visual C++ Toolkit 2003 was released.  Now it is only included with the SDK.  I'm not sure the best way for Wikipedia to address this; it seems appropriate to be period-correct given the Toolkit is no longer available for download either.  The Windows 11 SDK does include the 32 bit debugger, and the 64 bit debugger can be used to debug 32 bit code. Malx (talk) 23:41, 5 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title: Debugger available as separate download?

message: How is syntax hilighting an advanced feature? Or two-macine debugging? This smacks of marketing (or sycophancy) to me. -Ahruman 09:47, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Go ahead and remove the "marketing language," but syntax highlighting is a feature.  It used to be advanced back in '93 or '94, but it's not anymore.  So go ahead and remove the text that says the feature is "advanced," but it is still a valid feature. — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:12, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV? 

message: I was just reading the article on [GNU Compiler Collection|GCC] and found it much more detailed than this article. Can this article be brought up to the same level of detail, or does the closed-source nature of MS VC++ prevent that? It seems that it shouldn't.
69.61.169.217 18:46, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  More Detail 

message: Right now, QuickC redirects to this, but QuickC isn't really covered in this article. Would it be better to split QuickC off into a separate article? --Improv 05:20, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've created a stub article on QuickC — wm243 | Talk 20:46, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  QuickC 

message: The Wikipedia entry reads: boasts advanced features such as syntax highlighting.... This expression doesn't sound very encyclopedia-isch to me, rather more like marketing speak. Esp since quite a few users of other fine editors and IDEs might believe that syntax highlighting is quite normal and not very advanced at all...
:See my response in the NPOV section above. — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:13, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Boasts Advanced Features 

message: "The compile and build system feature, precompiled header files, "minimal rebuild" functionality and incremental link: these features significantly shorten turn-around time to edit, compile and link the program, especially for large software projects."
:While it is certainly true that these features significantly shorten compile and link times, I'm wondering if Visual C++ now supports distributed builds or multiple processors.  Last time I checked, MSVC would only use a single-core processor at a time and was unable to distribute the build to other computers (such as distcc), though this could possibly be added by third-party components.  The end result, of course, was that full builds are often significantly slower on MSVC than with other build environments.  If MSVC does not make use of multicore or multiprocessor computers, we should probably mention this limitation.  I'm not sure if it is worth mentioning the lack of support for distributed builds, though.  Comments?  --Yamla 17:00, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: VS2005 supports multi-processor builds, as long as you have multiple projects without dependencies between them: e.g. if you have one project producing A.lib, another producing B.lib, and a third linking them together in C.exe, then it can compile A and B in parallel on two separate processors/cores; but it can't compile half of A's .cpp files in parallel with the other half (unlike distcc), and it has to wait until they're both finished before it starts building any of C. 80.177.163.133 20:01, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: In addition, Visual C++ 2008 also supports intra-project multi-processor builds: with the /MP option set to use N processors/cores, when compiling a single project, N source files can be compiled in parallel. --82.250.149.4 (talk) 20:52, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Shorten compile times

message: See Talk:Microsoft Visual Studio‎. --Stefán Örvarr Sigmundsson 03:35, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article name 

message: It's not clear to me what the C++ compiler does exactly.  From personal experience I believe that the earlier versions of C++ up to version VC6 primarily generated native code, such as .EXEs, .DLLs, etc., but with the advent of the later versions bearing the .NET label, from the article, it's not possible to determine if the compiler generates Common Intermediate Language for output or if it's a native code compiler or if it does both.
I agree that this should be clarified as many people, esp. at release, believed you could only target .NET given the name "VS.NET".  You can, of course, generate IL or native code.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.41.222.1 (talk) 02:33, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Compiler Output is Unclear 

message: Well I wanted to do some research on Microsoft C and was redirected here. But there is nothing here about pre "Visual" MS-C/C++!. The history section begins with Visual C++ 1.0.
There is a link called The predecessor to Visual C++ was called Microsoft C/C++. - but that one is red. So where is the information on pre "Visual" MS-C gone - and more importantly: Why was I redirected to a page where the requested information clearly isn't available?
--Krischik T 07:19, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  (Redirected from Microsoft C) 

message: Hey everyone, there is a RISC edition of Visual C++. I believe it can target RISC systems and run on them. Its for the Alpha AXP, MIPS and PowerPC. It runs under any win32 system.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by MichaelCody89 (talk • contribs) 03:10, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: It runs on the corresponding RISC system.  Those compilers do not run under any win32 system (ie., Visual C++ did not support cross compilation from x86 to Alpha, etc.) Malx (talk) 23:43, 5 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  RISC Edition 

message: A table of the values of the _MSC_VER predefined preprocessor value for different versions of the compiler would be most useful.  (Actually this would more accurately give an indication of the "compiler" version which for VC++ 10 indicates that it is 16.00.  A table of the complete values is a good idea.  This is what I know:
VC6    1200
VC.NET 1300
VC2003 1310
VC2005 1400
VC2008 1500
VC2010 1600
02:45, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  _MSC_VER information 

message: The comment about MSC 1.0 not being K&R sounds unnecessarily negative to me.  First, I am not sure there is a strict definition of what K&R C is but the Lattice compiler supported the exact C language as UNIX compilers of the time did with a few extensions (such as allowing the $ character in identifiers).  Some of the "normal" UNIX library routines (like strcspn) were not implemented but in many ways the library routines provide were better than those that became part of the defacto standard (ie, K&R) and later C89.
I ported a lot of code from MSC 2.0 to MSC3.0 in 1985.  In many ways the new compiler was a backward step, with inferior code generation, optimizations, and library functions.  But it was more compatible with UNIX compilers of the time being basically a port of Microsoft's Xenix compiler.
BTW I have never had any relation to Lattice apart from using their compiler under MSDOS and AmigaDOS.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by AndrewWPhillips (talk • contribs) 03:09, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The definition K&R conformation comes usually from the C style that was used in the first revision of the Book "The C Programming Language" from Brian W. Kernighan and Dennis M. Richtie. This book was the de-facto standard before the ANSI C standard was formed. At that time, usually all C Compiler developers tried to follow that book, until ANSI C was there. The second revision of that Book is ANSI C conform. --IT-Compiler (talk) 22:23, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  MSC 1.0 was not K&R 

message: Shouldn't this article cite the target platform MSVC supports? In the whole article there isn't a single reference to "ARM". 188.218.163.90 (talk) 12:21, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Hm. x86, x86, Itanium... no, ARM's not mentioned. Aren't there versions for PowerPC too? I'll fix this when I can actually write properly (a.k.a. not midnight). --EM64T (talk) 00:38, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Target platforms 

message: The first 2 issues paragraphs cam be simplified as "No ABI compatiblity". Why make it an issue when the C++ standard says otherwise? Does a common programming mistake qualify as an issue for each and every C++ compiler?--Skyfiler (talk) 22:10, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Issues for whom? 

message: Visual C++'s c99 support is being further developed (seemingly due to customer pressure to support libraries like ffmpeg) - http://herbsutter.com/2013/09/09/visual-studio-2013-rc-is-now-available/ , http://blogs.msdn.com/b/somasegar/archive/2013/06/28/cpp-conformance-roadmap.aspx .
86.147.250.157 (talk) 09:16, 9 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  C99 

message: It is true that including C# in the list of languages that Visual C++ is implemented in would constitute WP:SYNTH, synthesis of that the Visual C++ IDE mostly or completely overlaps the Visual Studio IDE and that Visual Studio is partially implemented in C#. However, it is misleading to list only C++ based on lextrait.com, the personal website of someone in another country. I suggest either deleting "Written in" completely from the Infobox or adding a "Better source" template to the existing lextrait.com reference (along with explanatory text in that template that C# is also likely another implementation language, which it almost certainly is). Michaelmalak (talk) 18:33, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Programming Language 

message: Does anyone know which version of Visual C++ runtime is shipped with each version of Windows?  If any are shipped and installed by default, then please create a section similar to .NET_Framework#History.  Thanks!  • Sbmeirow • Talk • 05:14, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: There was usually no runtime in the first releases of Visual C++. The C++ compiler produced native machine code and didn't use a .NET runtime. The latter came years later. --IT-Compiler (talk) 22:28, 4 May 2022 (UTC)

text: I've done some ad-hoc and not systemic documentation for this in a blog post at http://www.malsmith.net/blog/visual-c-visual-history/ .  In the early days it wasn't at all systemic.  It's actually very hard to catalog exhaustively due to minor differences (not all versions of Windows 95 included the same set), and some runtimes were added by optional components, notably Internet Explorer, so the same base version of Windows with different components or versions of IE had different CRTs.  Also, note that it's not guaranteed that a CRT in an earlier release is still included in a later release. Malx (talk) 23:55, 5 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Which runtimes are shipped with each version of Windows? 

message: No new features are listed under VS 2012 and 2013 in history. Just the version numbers are listed.No new C++11 features are listed. But in the 2005 and 2006 section the exact ISO C++ features are listed. 
Go To Case 1 (talk) 22:20, 25 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  No New Features in VS 2012 

message: There is no Burger King (fast food) restaurant in my country 'A'. Burger King has a restaurant in a neighboring country 'B'. The 'B' country is on good terms with mine and thus I can visit the Burger King restaurant over there easily.
Can Burger King now claim, since they're feeding some people from country 'A', that they are supporting/established in Country 'A'? No.
Similar situation is seen with Microsoft's C standard support. C99/11 is country 'A', C++11 is country 'B' and microsoft is Burger King.
Since there is a some overlap in the standards of C++11 and C99/11 and that C++11 compilers(that Microsoft has) can compile C too, they want you to write your C code on a C++11 compiler, pretend you're really coding in C and let them tell you that they worked hard on supporting the latest C standards.
They have recommended C developers to rename their file to .cpp to use the latest compilers.
references:
http://herbsutter.com/2012/05/03/reader-qa-what-about-vc-and-c99/
Microsoft just hates C and they have totally ignored it since C90. But admitting that upfront will be damaging to their sales.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.43.186.25 (talk) 07:57, 10 July 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:   The great gimmick of "support" for C standards later than C90 

message: I edited the "controversy" section to include a more direct link to the VC++ dev manager's comments, and also to note that the offensive CRT function was removed. The latter doesn't have an online attribution--it makes news when Microsoft does something to raise suspicions and drive conspiracy theories, but not so much when Microsoft fixes it :)
Full disclosure: I am the PM in charge of most of the VC++ command-line tools (though not the libraries). I try to be extra fair and balanced slightly away from favoring Microsoft when editing Wikipedia but I understand if people would question my motivations.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Apardoe (talk • contribs) 00:08, 18 August 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, but are there any webpages on microsoft.com that states this was fixed?  Please add it to the article or drop the URL here, then I'll take care of it.  Thanks.  • Sbmeirow • Talk • 04:47, 18 August 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Controversy 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Microsoft Visual C++. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://archive.is/20120530/http://www.lextrait.com/Vincent/implementations.html to http://www.lextrait.com/Vincent/implementations.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20050814234847/http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifeobsoleteproducts to http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifeobsoleteproducts
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 19:39, 10 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Microsoft Visual C++. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://archive.is/20130211131045/http://examples.oreilly.de/english_examples/9780735618848/cd_contents/Readme.txt to http://examples.oreilly.de/english_examples/9780735618848/cd_contents/Readme.txt
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 11:33, 29 January 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified (January 2018) 

message: Microsoft Visual C++ 2015 Update 1 redistributable package miss changelog and the content of this update. --Starscreams6667 (talk) 05:05, 3 September 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Microsoft_Visual_C%2B%2B#32-bit_and_64-bit_versions|32-bit and 64-bit versions section]]: Microsoft Visual C++ 2015 Update 1 release notes. 

message: Hi there, it looks like the status of binary compatibility has changed since VC++2015.
[[ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/cppblog/cpp-binary-compatibility-and-pain-free-upgrades-to-visual-studio-2019/#binarycompat | This page]] seems to suggest that binary compatibility is now (As of October 2019) being maintained between VC++2015 and future versions of the compiler.
Therefore, I think the section on binary compatibility needs review.Russetrob (talk) 19:25, 29 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Binary compatibility since VC++ 2015 

message: The https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Visual_C page contains mostly the same information as the "Microsoft Visual C++" one, and it may be worthwile to merge both these articles together, and transform the Microsoft_Visual_C one into a redirect to "Microsoft Visual C++" instead.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.252.199.22 (talk) 21:23, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Microsoft_Visual_C article duplicates this one 

message: The MS Visual C++ page mentions the whole history of the Microsoft Visual C++ product, **including** its predecessor Microsoft C (versions 1.0 to 6.0) and Microsoft C/C++ version 7.
In order to improve the accuracy of the following article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object_Windows_Library that says (section "History", 2nd paragraph): > In 1992, Microsoft introduced MFC as part of Microsoft Visual C++ 7.0. [...] where here, the phrasing "Microsoft Visual C++ 7.0" should be changed to "Microsoft C/C++ 7.0" (and making link to the visual C++ page mentioned previously).
By the way, it should be mentioned that the existing page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Visual_C is mostly a duplicate of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Visual_C++ ...
1. Reasons for Microsoft C/C++ 7.0 historically related to MS Visual C++: - see the already-existing history on the Visual C++ page; - https://winworldpc.com/product/microsoft-c-c/7x that mentions: "Later versions were rebranded and renumbered as Microsoft Visual C++ and were bundled with Visual Studio or the SDKs."
2. The fact that in 1992 there was no Visual C++, but only MS C/C++: - Steven Sinofski's book's chapter https://hardcoresoftware.learningbyshipping.com/p/012-i-shipped-therefore-i-am
188.252.199.22 (talk) 5:17 am, 13 March 2021, last Saturday (7 days ago) (UTC+8)
: MS C/C++ should probably be severed from the MSVC++ article, as MS also created Quick C, which was also succeeded by MSVC. -- 65.93.183.33 (talk) 7:25 am, 13 March 2021, last Saturday (7 days ago) (UTC+8)
: Moving this discussion from Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Redirects and categories#Redirect request: Microsoft C/C++ 7.0 (permalink).  ~ Aseleste (t, e | c, l) 12:28, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  VC/VC++/QC/MSC/MSC++ 

message: These are different products. Microsoft C was usually developed for DOS and run in DOS and usually was there to compile C code for DOS. Only the last two versions also supported C++ code. Visual C++, that also supports C, was developed for Windows. In my opinion, we should create for Microsoft C its own article and separate that from Visual C++. It will also remove some clutter from that article. --IT-Compiler (talk) 22:35, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Microsoft C is not the same as Microsoft Visual C++ 

message: I don't think it's consistent to label Visual C++ 2022 as "strictly 64 bit."
Visual C++ 2005 is a 32 bit IDE that can execute either a 64 bit or 32 bit compiler engine, each of which can generate 32 or 64 bit code.
Visual C++ 2022 is a 64 bit IDE that can execute either a 64 bit or 32 bit compiler engine, each of which can generate 32 or 64 bit code.  (I don't know why there's a 32 bit hosted compiler in this package, but it's there.)
It looks like Visual C++ 2005 is considered "32-bit and 64-bit" based on the compiler and target platforms, but Visual C++ 2022 is considered "strictly 64 bit" based on its IDE. Malx (talk) 00:05, 6 October 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Strictly 64 bit