Talk:Superhero/Archive 1

message: This is an archive of discussion on the Talk:Superhero page that began before 2005
The list of obvious superhero predecessors failed to include Dumas' Count of Monte Cristo, the obvious inspiration for Batman and many other superheroes.
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The word "superhero" itself is a trademark held jointly by DC Comics and Marvel Comics.
This is common wisdom, but I'm not sure if it's correct.  The US Patent and Trademark Office doesn't appear to recognize it.  Search for Superhero.  (If the previous link doesn't work, try starting a a nwe search here
Searching the Marvel (example Google search) and 
DC Comics (example Google search) web sites doesn't turn up any such claims.  DC Comics copyright and trademark page doesn't have anything about the superhero trademark.
In the absence of actual evidence, I've removed the sentence.  If there is evidence it should be provided and the sentence updated to clairify in which countries the trademark is valid.  Listing registration numbers would be useful as well. 
- User:Alan De Smet 2004-01-29
:From http://www.uspto.gov/main/trademarks.htm
:Word Mark SUPER HEROES
:Goods and Services IC 016. US 002 005 022 023 029 037 038 050. G & S: PUBLICATIONS, PARTICULARLY COMIC BOOKS AND MAGAZINES AND STORIES IN ILLUSTRATED  FORM [(( ; CARDBOARD STAND-UP FIGURES; PLAYING CARDS; PAPER IRON-ON TRANSFER; ERASERS; PENCIL SHARPENERS; PENCILS; GLUE FOR OFFICE AND HOME USE, SUCH AS IS SOLD AS STATIONERY SUPPLY;] NOTEBOOKS AND STAMP ALBUMS )). FIRST USE: 19661000. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19661000
:Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING
:Serial Number 73222079
:Filing Date July 3, 1979
:Current Filing Basis 1A
:Original Filing Basis 1A
:Published for Opposition June 9, 1981
:Registration Number 1179067
:Registration Date November 24, 1981
:Owner (REGISTRANT) Cadence Industries Corporation a.k.a. Marvel Comics Group
:and DC Comics Inc. CORPORATION DELAWARE 575 Madison Ave. New York NEW YORK 
:10022 (LAST LISTED OWNER) DC COMICS PARTNERSHIP BY ASSIGNMENT NEW YORK 1700 
:BROADWAY NEW YORK NEW YORK 10019
:
:(LAST LISTED OWNER) MARVEL CHARACTERS, INC. CORPORATION BY ASSIGNMENT DELAWARE 10474 SANTA MONICA BOULEVARD SUITE 206 LOS ANGELES CALIFORNIA 90025
:Assignment Recorded ASSIGNMENT RECORDED
:Attorney of Record JONATHAN D. REICHMAN
:Type of Mark TRADEMARK
:Register PRINCIPAL
:Affidavit Text SECT 15. SECT 8 (6-YR). SECTION 8(10-YR) 20020819.
:Renewal 1ST RENEWAL 20020819
:Live/Dead Indicator LIVE
:(Hope this helps...) -- Yekrats 20:46, 31 Mar 2004 (UTC)

message: I question whether it is appropriate for Spider-Man to be considered of a superhero diverging from the norm.
What I mean is that that character has likely become one of the most influential models for superhero characters since his creation.  Since his creation there have been numerable superheroes with troubled psyches, personal and personal lives.
In short, far from diverging from the norm of this kind of character, he seems part of it.
User:Kchishol1970
:I think the section about examples of divergent character works well as a clarify-er for the list of common characteristics, which, if taken as a whole, describes the "classic" superhero formula of the 1940s. Because Spider-Man is a clear deviation from that mold, I think it fits that he is listed under divergent character examples. If we ditch him simply because he his type has become quite common, then we should probably ditch Wolverine and the anti-hero blurb as well. 
:Maybe a sentence pointing out that Spider-Man/everyman-superhero mold has become common and a few examples is needed. In fact, I would be in favor of rewriting the entire Spider-Man blurb as "makes mistakes on a regular basis" seems too vague.
:However, if you feel strongly about ditching Spider-Man in this section, I could accept it.
:User:Rorschach567 - 9.12
::How about we create a new section?  In addition to a character types on the basis of their abilities, we could have an additional section on personality types.
::What do you think?  If you like the idea, any ideas of how to elaborate on it?
::User:Kchishol1970
:::Hmmm… not necessarily a bad idea. I could see a few problems however:
:::1) There are some personality characteristics covered under the list of common characteristics (moral code, willingness to risk life without reward) that seem basic to the classic superhero character and a section on personality subtypes could confuse that.
:::2) While some personality traits are basic to the classic superhero or basic to larger subtypes like the anti-hero, it seems like, for personality subtypes, there could be as many as there are superheroes. I couldn’t see a definitive list of personality types as I could a list of ability types. Anti-heroes like Wolverine and Green Arrow are somewhat easy to pick out as are “bad girl” types like Witchblade and Psylocke but most other categories, such as everyman superheroes like Spider-Man or The Thing or scientists like Iron Man and Bruce Banner or boy scouts like Superman and Captain America that would seem too subjective, overlapping in the case of too many superheroes and might describe a character under some writers and not others. 
:::3) This article already is pretty long.
:::If you would like to attempt a section like that, give me some more details on just what subtypes you would include and how you would deem who goes where and I’ll give you some more feedback.
:::User:Rorschach567
::::Branching those two sections out into a separate article on superhero archetypes would actually be quite helpful.  It would be nice to have the current archetype section revised so that it wasn't quite so directly based on the Champions "character classes". -Sean Curtin 00:42, Sep 18, 2004 (UTC)
:::::I actually like the Champions motif. It lets people know that we are not just making these up as we go along.
:::::- User:Rorschach567
::::::Yes, but those particular selections and names are only directly relevant to Champions.  Giving the Champs themes such an exclusively prominent position in the article is pretty arbitrary.  -Sean Curtin 06:04, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC)
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What a superb entry. This is what Wikipedia's all about.
--Smallbone10 23:01, 17 Sep 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is Spider-Man a divergent example or the norm?