Talk:Against Me!

message: What's so historical about The Distillers?
: Or the Hives for that matter. On that note, wtf, this article has some POV problems. "not-so-punk acts like Mandy Moore and Spongebob Squarepants"? That's merely the biggest one. wilhelm 22:28, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Initial

message: Whats with all the talk of 'best work' about all the early albums and then the talk of selling out. It's not written in a generic style - it's all very subjective and without any references. Sounds like someone with a grudge. Fuck-off Hipsters. -- ben
*Find sources that say Reinventing Axl Rose isn't their best work, and that signing to Sire didn't represent selling out, and then you can put them in the article yourself. Everything stated in the article is backed up by legit sources. Nowah Balloon (talk) 05:34, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd have to agree with Jackknife. He shouldn't have to fine a source saying that it's not their best work, especially if there's no source for it being their best work. I don't even listen to this band but that caught my attention. It's definitely POV, and without a very clear source there's no way it should be in there.Tithonfury (talk) 21:05, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Selling Out Bullshit 

message: I don't think that Against Me! as Tom Gabel's solo work started in college apartment complexes.  My understanding is that he started it while still in Naples (a number of my friends recall seeing him playing outside of shows, and sometimes seeing them with Tom and various people on buckets)
I doubt that this statement in the article is true and should be changed or cited, because if it's false, it obviously doesn't belong in the article. KurtFF8 05:20, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  College Apartment Complex? 

message: Going to take that link from the External links... it2's just weird and irrevelant in my opinion.
QzarBaron 21:10, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dirty Deitrich AM! Electro Dance Hits 

message: I've seen people say here and on the WTO Ministerial Conference of 1999 protest activity page say that "Baby I'm an Anarchist" is tounge-in-cheek or sarcastic. Is there any evidence of that? I thought it was serious, a bit funny, but serious. So do at least two of my friends? Perhaps my being an anarchist biases me into actually thinking it's serious, but yeah...The Ungovernable Force 04:08, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm sure it's possible that there are some tounge-in-cheek aspects to it, but Tom Gable (who I assume wrote the lyrics) has said before that he is (or at least was) an anarchist, so I'm assuming that the message of the song, while being portrayed as tounge-in-cheek, could also be serious at the same time. KurtFF8 18:40, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

text: regardless, that wouldn't make the song toungue-in-cheek, it would jsut make it hypocritical. toungue-in-cheek means to me that Gable disagrees with anarchism, which I would doubt.. I'm gonna change it. someone else can confirm later, if they want. --naught101 10:43, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

text: lol, yeah, sell-outs, I know. It's always annoying to see a good band go the way of commercialization. Alas, we lose another one to the dark side. Anti-flag really upset me too with all their punkvoter drivel (actually, punkvoter made me upset with a lot of bands), not to mention signing to a major label, sounding worse and becoming supposed pacifists (they had the song "kill the rich" and now they have a song called "Power to the Peacefull"). Somebody shoot me please! The Ungovernable Force 07:42, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Antiflag was never anarchist though. They said they were anarchist in their music but real people who have actually talked to them have said they were pretty reformist. One of them in the band was a Leninist though. Leninism is almost bad as capitalism so I think its better that they sell out anyways lol. Good band though
-FionMacCumhail 03:41, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

text: If he didn't mean everything he sang in the song, then maybe it could be tongue-in-cheek - for example, the bit about smashing the Starbucks window strikes me as sending up anarchists a little... Also, I think Leninism is far worse than capitalism - it's nothing more than repressive state-capitalism. At least capitalism has some freedom... Supersheep 11:42, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Maybe he was saying something along the lines of [this], which is a criticism of the black bloc actions at Seattle. Just a thought, we'll need someone who knows more about the band to help out. Supersheep 11:59, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, people on songmeanings.net are pretty divided.  I think until they say whether is was sarcastic or not, we won't really know. I think people just interpret it the way they want to, because it can be twisted either way. It seems obviously pro-anarchist to me, but that's very likely just because I'm an anarchist. Oh well. Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 06:14, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  It seems mocking to me, and I'm anarchist too - obviously Against Me are from the peaceful end of the anarchist spectrum, or didn't think that a violent response to police brutality was appropriate... Supersheep 15:42, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

text: Although I'd agree with your interpretation of hyperbolic, I think that unless the band made/makes some kind of statement about their intent, then we shouldn't speculate since it's really contensious and not incredibly obvious. Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 22:58, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it's kind of shallow to think that just because a band signed to a major label it makes them any less of an anarchist than they were before. I've talked to Gabel because he happens to be my first cousin, on a regular basis. And his views on having a band are pretty simple in that, not everyone in the band is an anarchist, so he never really viewed Against Me! as an anarchist band. And I think a lot of people lose sight of that. Sure, Gabel wrote some anarchist songs on their early recordings, but you must remember, that was a totally different situation in which it was just controlled by him and one other member who probably agreed with him fully. Tom still claims to be an anarchist, but is also a very lucid anarchist. He's very realistic, and keeps things in perspective. I think to call a band to sell out would say that they have abandoned their former ideals, and honestly, Against Me! as a four-piece band never really stated all-out that they are an anarchist band. However, "Baby, I'm an Anarchist!" does sound like a tounge-in-cheek ballad. I don't think it's saying that anarchist beliefs are moronic, however. I think it's just pointing out the difference between liberals and far-leftists and anarchists, and how they are ironically commonly associated. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.236.57.67 (talk) 04:57, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sarcasm? 

message: Who's this Vanessa character? I'm not saying she doesn't exist but whereas all the "Associates" are well established as working for the band (see the We're Not Going Home DVD), I've never seen mention of her before.  Perhaps an interview link or something would be helpful.--AgainstSteve 17:24, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vanessa?  Who is Vanessa? 

message: i don't consider this band as an anarkopunk band. Is it ok to remove it from that category? thanks for your input. Cacuija (my talk) 03:00, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, unlike the edit I just congratulated you for, I'm not quite so sure about this one. They used to say they were anarchists, didn't they? I don't listen to them much though, so I'm not the expert on this band. I'd say keep it in, but just weakly. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 05:32, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not an expert myself.. but they could say they are anarchists (at an personal level), but .. can a band who signed for Fat Wreckords and tours with NoFX be considered anarcopunk.  They have more relations with other comercial punk bands than with anarkopunk bands.. i don't think they are anarkopunk at all. IMHO the just happen to play a style of music which can be considered "punk rock", rock, folk-punk (you name it) and they call themselves anarchists. That doesn't put you in the anarkopunk category. The bottom line is, besides what they say they are and their music style, what facts make them "anarkopunk"? Tell me what you think. Cacuija (my talk) 15:21, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: First, isn't it anarcho-punk? As for the stuff on record labels, Propagandhi is on Fat Wreckords too, but I've never seen anyone try to say they aren't anarchists because of that. It seems a little improper to say a band isn't anarcho-punk just because of that. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 19:55, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You might be right about the record label and i don't know propagahndi, but you still don't answer my last question. Cacuija (my talk) 22:41, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, sorry about missing that part--I had 5 minutes till class started so only had a minute or two. I'd say any band that is made up of anarchists, blends that into their lyrics and plays punk music of some kind. For myself personally, they should also be active in political/social movements related to anarchism and should be trying to live consistently with their beliefs, but that's my own personal view and I don't think it's a good measure of whether a band should be included or not in an encyclopedia. Case in point--well, this one. I might have considered them anarcho-punk earlier on, but they do seem to be really selling out in my opinion. I wouldn't really consider them that great an example of an anarcho-punk band, but they do probably meet the basic definition for on here. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 04:01, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: By definition (note that i don't like "book" definitions) from Anarcho-punk: "Anarcho-punk is a part of the punk movement consisting of groups, bands and individuals promoting specifically anarchist ideas.". note the "promoting". Can you tell me how this band promotes anarchism?, again, at an individual level their members may consider themselves anything, at a group level.. i don't think we can consider this band anarcho-punk. Still my question remains unanswered "besides what they say they are and their music style, what facts make them 'anarkopunk'?".  thanks for your feedback, - Cacuija (my talk) 04:40, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  "Besides what they say and their musical style"?  Why leave out the two most imporatant aspects that define an anarcho-punk band?  They even have a song that mentions Anarcho-punk.  I fail to see how they are not anarcho-punk.  Just because they are now on a major label doesn't take away what they stand for (or even if they no longer stand for that, the majority of their music and message does) KurtFF8 20:56, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

text:  You still don't answer my question. So, based on your point of view, shall we place The Sex Pistols in this category? Cacuija (my talk) 03:03, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  No, The Sex Pistols have a different musical style, and don't really hold anarchist views (to my knowledge) and those are the two things that distinguish a band as "anarcho-punk" from what I understand that genre to be. KurtFF8 04:42, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

text:  Musical style has nothing to do with anarco-punk.. You just have to play punk, or something like that and even if you play other music style, and you want to consider yourself anarcho-punk, i think it's perfectly fine. it is the attitude, For instance Catharsis is hardoce-metal IMO, they are anarcho-punks. The point is. Against me! as well as The Sex Pistols play "punk" music, and they might say they are anarchists or have songs about "revolution" and bla blah's. that doesn't make them anarkopunk. So in my opinion your "musical style" point is not valid, and your "don't really hold anarchist views" apply for boths. Please, someone show something that verifies that Against me! say they consider anarco-punks... something else than just a few (if only one) members say "we are anarchist" more at an intelectual level. Otherwise, i will be removing them from :Category:Anarcho-punk Category until someone provides a valid source. Thanks, --Cacuija (my talk) 16:23, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  On another note, can we agree that they are actually a punk rock band? I've changed the intro paragraph to mention that. Artiste-extraordinaire 23:58, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anarkopunk? 

message: Does anyone know if that's the correct spelling of that guy's name?  I'm not seeing any reference to a Tom Serick in relation to Against Me!...other than a link to this article. --adamh 11:52, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tom Serick (spelling?) - Manager 

message: On the "Freegan" article, it says the drummer wrote a pamphlet in 1999 advocating freeganism as an appropriate lifestyle.  It certainly goes to the politics of the band, and so I figured it could be included somewhere in the article.  Whatcha think?72.78.179.244 (talk) 22:21, 4 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why Freegan 

message: I'm a little shocked that Tom Gabel doesn't have his own article. With all of the interviews available, the arrest, and marrying Heather Hannoura, one would think that it would be fairly easy to do (and interesting to read). Somebody should get bored and make one.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.21.184.251 (talk) 05:05, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tom Gabel wiki? 

message: How can I stop Tom Gabels name from being redirected to the Against Me article when you search his name, so that I can make one specifically for him.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sam Wanamaker (talk • contribs) 01:06, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, I just made the Tom Gabel page. It's pretty bare (it's very difficult to find any biographical info about him), so PLEASE contribute if possible. --TrafficHaze (talk) 02:26, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tom Gables own Article 

message: Hey folks, I can't edit this page as it is locked, so I just wanted to request that someone add a comma to the second to last sentence.
"That May Gabel publicly came out as transgender, having dealt with gender dysphoria for years."   With those three capitalized words in a row, I had to read it several times to figure out that it meant the month of May, rather than addressing Gabel as May Gabel, as though that was the new name she has chosen. I suggest, "That May, Gabel"   or even, "On May 9th, Gabel"
Just a suggestion for readability72.74.134.42 (talk) 00:02, 10 May 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: by the addition of a comma ("That May, Gabel..."). The specific date is unnecessary and refers to the date the article was published, not necessarily the date he gave the interview. --IllaZilla (talk) 02:27, 10 May 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copy Editing 

message: I wanted to bring this up in case anybody opposes it, but somebody changed all of the references to "Tom Gabel" in every related article to "Laura Jane Grace." While that's fine for Transgender Dysphoria Blues and anything post-transition, the use of "Laura Jane Grace" in, say, "I Was a Teenage Anarchist" is factually wrong. For instance, this section: "The music video for the song features Laura Jane Grace in traditional punk clothing running through a park being chased by a police officer." This is incorrect, since it leads the reader to believe that the video features Grace post-transition, when in fact she was still Tom Gabel when it was filmed. The same goes for all of the album credits. In each of the album, Grace was still credited as "Tom Gabel," and wasn't credited as "Laura Jane Grace" until the most recent album. So unless anyone has any reasonable objections, I'll be changing these back shortly. Rwiggum (Talk/Contrib) 09:21, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Read Wikipedia:Gender identity. Georgia guy (talk) 14:01, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Fair enough! Thanks for clarifying. Rwiggum (Talk/Contrib) 19:30, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with 'Georgia guy'.  (My own beloved transgender sibling prefers to be called by the pronouns of present gender for present, future, and ALL of past, and it appears to me that this is the dominant preference among transgender people using the English language.) Acwilson9 (talk) 04:17, 15 June 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pre-transition articles 

message: Please.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:30A:2E07:A1E0:8F6:D7AA:31D1:7CAE (talk) 17:02, 7 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Any chance we can change the picture to a picture of the band after the start of her transition? 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on Against Me!. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100322193144/http://www.againstme.net:80/splash/ to http://www.againstme.net/splash/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110226134706/http://www.againstme.net:80/news/21371/ to http://www.againstme.net/news/21371
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20140125040154/http://music.cbc.ca/ to http://www.music.cbc.ca/#/blogs/2012/5/Against-Mes-Tom-Gabel-Comes-Out-As-Transgender
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: So, information about the new album is out on digital stores:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/shape-shift-with-me/id1128572771
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01HO1A1DI/ref=dm_ws_sp_ps_dp
I don't really know how to create articles so I thought I'd just throw the info here.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.41.226.180 (talk) 13:32, 18 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Album: Shape Shift With Me 

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100517034845/http://www.againstme.net/events to http://www.againstme.net/events
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121012160132/http://www.interpunk.com/item.cfm?Item=198920& to http://www.interpunk.com/item.cfm?Item=198920&
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110927045943/http://thepunksite.com/interviews.php?page=againstme2011 to http://thepunksite.com/interviews.php?page=againstme2011
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thread_title:  External links modified