Talk:Diabetes/Archive 4

message: ===Diabetic Nutrition===
According to recent studies, chromium may prevent diabetes from occurring, and can help diabetics maintain optimal blood glucose levels when taken consistently. Says biochemist Richard Anderson, of USDA's Human Nutrition Research Center, "In almost every study where we gave chromium, we got better control of glucose with less insulin." Chromium is relatively inexpensive as a nutritional supplement.
Some studies suggest that one to six grams of cinnamon daily can lower blood sugar, and recent studies in Japan have shown that consumption of two teaspoons of apple cider vinegar before a meal can counteract the effects of white rice on blood glucose levels. Andreas 21:29, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Chromium 

message: According to recent studies, chromium may prevent diabetes from occurring, and can help diabetics maintain optimal blood glucose levels when taken consistently. Says biochemist Richard Anderson, of USDA's Human Nutrition Research Center, "In almost every study where we gave chromium, we got better control of glucose with less insulin." Chromium is relatively inexpensive as a nutritional supplement.
Some studies suggest that one to six grams of cinnamon daily can lower blood sugar, and recent studies in Japan have shown that consumption of two teaspoons of apple cider vinegar before a meal can counteract the effects of white rice on blood glucose levels. Andreas 21:29, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Diabetic Nutrition

message: The section on the history of this condition begins, rather surprisingly, with reference to diabetes in modern times. References to a disease which could now be termed diabetes mellitus have been found in Egyptian papyri, and in ancient India, it was noticed that flies were attracted to the urine of diabetics. In the sixteenth century, Paracelsus believed, erroneously, that the urine of diabetics contained too much salt, an error later corrected by the seventeenth century physician Thomas Willis, who first discovered the it was not salt, but sugar in the urine of diabetics. By the end of the nineteenth centur, French physicians had distinguished beween "diabetes maigre" and "diabetes grande", a distinction between diabetes in underweight and overweight individuals which, albeit with qualification, can be considered the a forerunner of today's distinction between Type One and Type diabetes. Various forms of treatment were suggested for diabetes prior to 1921, including the low-carbohydrate, low-calorie diet advocated by Frederick Allen, which would at least extend the expectancy of insulin-dependent diabetics a few, if not many, years at a time when it was a fatal illness. All this information is typed in here because it has been omitted from the section on history, and I shall look forward to a medical historian's efforts to extend this section. A. Carl 19:33, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Expansions to the section on history are possible

message: The two French physicians I was thinking of were Bouchardat and Lancereaux. It was really Lancereaux who was the significant pioneer here, making, in 1870, a distinction between "diabetes maigre" and "diabetes gras" which can be taken as an early fore-runner of the modern distinction between Type One and Type Two diabetes. A. Carl 12:38, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Bouchardat and Lancereaux

message: I wish to add the following article:
A pilot study for Australia`s first clinical trial to evaluate the effectiveness of traditional Chinese exercises in preventing the growing problem of diabetes has produced startling results.
http://www.acupuncture.com.au/research/article18.html
Then give us the citation to a published study instead of linkspam. Thanks. alteripse 12:38, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New external link 

message: How about adding gastroparesis to complications? Jack Daw 21:17, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it's a good idea as it's a major problem when it happens. However, we've already got a large introductory article and explaining what's going on would take a goodly number of words. No idea how to solve that, save perhaps an article on diabetic complications with the details. But this risks the problem of ending up with an article which is mostly pointers to other articles. This is essentially pointless for an introductory article of first resort. ww 22:47, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Add Gastroparesis to Complications? 

message: This has been revised and restored after the deletion just prior to this post. Some mention of this issue is appropriate in this article for seveal reasons. First, there is alot of quackery surrounding diabetes and some evaluation of the propsects for a cure would be useful to readers in avoiding being quacked. Second, an actual prospect of a cure is serious and several lab research schemes are underway. Third, the proposed schemes are themselves fasinating, if only enough to justify a few words. Fourth, though not currently in clinical practice, the subject is intersting in its own right. ww 04:55, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I find the "quacked" argument very compelling.  Rklawton 05:03, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: curing diabetes section

message: Recent edits removed the list of major complications from the intro. This left the article seeming to concentrate almost exclusively on sugar control. This may have been the approach in treating cases in the 1980's and early 1990's, but now is of almost secondary importance for those working in developed countries.
Of course there may be life-threatening presentation of typeI's or chronic ill health seen prior to type2 diagnosis. Likewise immediate ill health if hypo or hyperglycaemia. But with patient self-monitoring, modern drugs (oral & insulins) and HbA1 tests, reasonable control can be achieved. At this point the patient is not "unwell" from diabetes. Excessive attention to improving a "moderately controlled" to a "tightly controlled" patient generally does not then improve the patient's sense of immediate "wellness" (especially if treatment-related hypos start to occur). Of course tight control improves longterm outlook for microvascular disease, but what is most likely to kill a diabetic is the increased risk of macrovascular cardiovascular disease. So if the choice is "good" or "very good" control, it is probably more important to be addressing a patient's smoking, blood pressure & cholesterol. Certainly more of my time with those with diabetes is spent worrying over preventing MIs, renal failure & blindness, than the last decimal place of their sugar results. In the UK, the Quality Outcome Framework points (with associated income) awarded to General Practitioners for managing diabetes reflect the multiple of risk factors that must be monitored.
As a UK diabetes expert (a co-author of one of studies cited), once only half jokingly observed, in 20 years time diabetics might be more properly managed by cardiologists rather than endocrinologists obsessed with laboratory reports of sugar levels. His definition of diabetes, at a talk to GPs about the importance of addressing cardiovascular risks, was "Diabetes is a potentially terminal cardiovascular illness in patients who happen to have raised blood sugar levels".
The major complications of diabetes therefore I believe are so important as to deserve inclusion in the introduction to this article. David Ruben  Talk  03:19, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I was the editor who originally listed the major complications in the intro. Most type II diabetics do not die from HONC but from macro- and microvascular disease. That is intro material. I agree with David that this material should be reinserted. JFW | T@lk 22:07, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Intro