Talk:Caning

message: This passage claims that caning was known to the French at one time as 'the English vice.' I know that the French once attached this label to homosexuality in general. I question whether it is accurate to use it specifically for caning, unless there is a source for that. Marty55 00:38, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Re: Judicial Use 

message: I am worried by the inclusion of a weblink at the bottom of this entry to www.corpun.com. In my opinion this website glorifies the caning of children and sadism in general --  to the point of being pornographic. I refer you, in particular, to the commentary that runs alongside footage of a judicial caning in Malaysia.
New British legislation will bring websites like this one into a very grey legal area, if not ban them outright. [Unsigned and undated comment from 2007 or earlier]
:Which legislation? twitter.com/YOMALSIDOROFF (talk) 19:45, 21 September 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: That question has already been asked, over six years ago (see next item), and no reply was forthcoming. -- Alarics (talk) 05:20, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Disturbed 

message: I am the editor of www.corpun.com.  My website does not "glorify the caning of children" or anyone else, and it also has nothing to do with sadism or pornography. As anyone can see who goes there, its purpose is to provide factual documentation about corporal punishment of various kinds. To take the example to which you refer, my page about judicial caning in Malaysia simply describes the context for a purely factual documentary video, it does not "glorify" the procedure, indeed it warns viewers that that particular material is not for the squeamish. I am not making a value judgement about it one way or the other. You may well personally disapprove of the fact that Malaysia does this but that cannot be a reason for censoring information about it.
What "new British legislation" are you talking about? Ffaarrrreellll 21:57, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reply to the above 

message: I think this whole section is a bit misleading. It talks about various different sorts of cane with names like "senior cane" and "reformatory cane" as though these had some standard or official meaning, but cites no sources for these rather sweeping claims. Wouldn't it be better
just to say that a punishment cane can vary greatly in size from perhaps X cm long when typically used on small children, to Y cm long and Z cm thick when used judicially in Singapore or Malaysia?
I wonder if it is also worth stressing that the word "cane" in this (essentially British) context means something significantly different from what the word tends to mean in American English. A punishment cane is generally thin, swishy and flexible, typically of rattan; whereas in US usage the word mostly seems to refer to a thick, rigid stick as in "walking cane" or "(blind person's) white cane" (these things tend to be called "walking stick" and "white stick" in British English) and hence e.g. the confusion over the so-called "caning" of Senator Sumner, in which (so I understand) he was hit in the legs with a rigid walking stick simply as a physical assault rather than a punishment -- not really much at all to do with "caning" in the sense meant here. 
I would also get rid of the BDSM references, which have nothing to do with corporal punishment.
Ffaarrrreellll 22:35, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Cane types and terminology 

message: Do people really think the external link of the video is necessary?  I'm leaning towards no, but I'm open to being persuaded.  WLU 16:19, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'd say the photo on the page is enough. The video seems like too much information, IMO. kawaputratorque 18:07, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Disagree. twitter.com/YOMALSIDOROFF (talk) 19:54, 21 September 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Link

message: Please see... the reason for merger is tivial. 222.225.124.80 09:47, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Should it be merged with the page on corporal punishment?  It is naturally a sub division of it surely?
* No, CP is large enough in scope (and controversial!) while caning can also be ractices for other purposes, such as SM games Arcarius (talk) 07:53, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merge proposal 

message: I had started work on an edit and had been about to add some more references but see it had been deleted.  No reason was given, but could be because I had not added references which is fair enough. Quite a few men mention having got the cane in autobiographies etc. Shane Warne did in a TV interview with Michael Parkinson. Shall put back up unless the anonymous editer strongly objects. Informed Owl (talk) 04:58, 28 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps there is (for want of a better term) a conflict of interest here in that I posted the paragraph on the article on the first page.  I would sugges though that rather than just remove it (as one anonymous poster and one named poster have done) that this be discussed on the talk page first.  Am not going to go putting markers or protections on here, but would suggest that discussion rather than unilateral removal might be the better way forward. Informed Owl (talk) 20:01, 1 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  U are right: David Niven, Roald Dahl and Eric Blair have almost identical anecdotes about caning -- I think at least 2 of the 3 say that they still felt it occasionally years later. Perhaps no one who went to British schools avoided it in those days.--Jrm2007 (talk) 07:06, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Famous men who mention getting the cane

message: This still needs tidying up.  THe dates when it was abolished in the UK should be added - it was banned in state schools before it was in private (fee paying) schools as far as I am aware.  Informed Owl (talk) 12:27, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: All that information is now to be found at School corporal punishment. Alarics (talk) 20:10, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Use in schools

message: The article says that only men are caned in Malaysia. However, there is a possibility that this will change, or was never true - see Kartika Sari Dewi Shukarno. Orthografer (talk) 15:36, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: That case is a sentence of "light caning" by the religious courts, something quite different from judicial caning by the criminal courts. I have added a sentence to the article to clarify this. Alarics (talk) 16:18, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Malaysia 

message: The following section was removed because "Disproportionate to mention this one case out of all the millions of cases in different countrires":
:In 2010, Sufia Begum, a woman in Bangladesh, was publicly caned for an alleged affair by a Muslim cleric and village woman applying Sharia law, in defiance of the Bagladeshi law. About one week later the victim was hospitalized and died four weeks later. While the family claims that the caning was the cause of her death, the police who arrested the two people who caned her indicate that it is not established that the caning was the cause of death.
Well, it may be "disproportionate" to mention a case (although I am not aware that there are millions of deaths), but I have not found any other information about caning taking place in Bangladesh (BD), did not know that caning was against the BD law (although WP has a footnote:" The above list (of countries that allow caning as a judicial punishment) does not include countries where a "blind eye" is sometimes turned to unofficial JCP by local tribes, authorities, etc. including Bangladesh...") , that caning  nevertheless is still done under the Sharia law in BD, and that the BD government persecutes alleged perpetrators.  All these issues are raised by the case and deserve to be heard. Does the section belong here, or should it be the start of a Caning in Bangladesh article (it is against the law), or filed under her name as her case has gained notariety? Just aside, I wonder what the mortality rate is for contemporary caning of women and men.Ekem (talk) 01:54, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no "mortality rate for contemporary caning". Caning isn't something from which people die. In the case to which you refer, the family is reported to have asserted that the woman's death was caused by her illicit punishment, but that has not been confirmed. I would oppose the idea of an article called "Caning in Bangladesh". There are "Caning in Singapore" and "Caning in Malaysia" articles because caning in those countries is an official punishment, a very specific and institutionalised procedure, and very heavily used. Bangladesh isn't a caning country, it just has some local village elders in rural areas who are out of control and operating beyond the law. Although the BBC put "caning" in the headline of its version of the news item, the word used in a fuller and more local version of the story is "whipping", see http://bdnews24.com/details.php?id=182005&cid=2. According to that version, the woman was "whipped 40 times with 'Dorra' (local whip)". Earlier mentions of similar goings-on in Bangladesh, e.g. in the US State Department Human Rights reports, all appear to refer to "whipping" or "flogging", see http://www.corpun.com/rules.htm#bangladesh. This doesn't belong in the "Caning" article at all. -- Alarics (talk) 17:25, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: "Village elders tied 10 canes together and beat her legs," police chief Azizul Haq Sarker said to the AFP." If it is one cane it is caning, if it is 10 canes it is whipping? Ekem (talk) 15:35, 22 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: That's right. "Caning" is with a single rattan cane. -- Alarics (talk) 18:16, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

text: It's also worth bearing in mind that the "tied 10 canes together" wording used by AFP is probably the wrong use of the word, quite likely because of mistranslation into English. I should think it was probably just "10 sticks", or maybe 10 branches of a tree, which would make it more like birching than caning. -- Alarics (talk) 16:45, 23 December 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Intro now clear, "single" cane.Ekem (talk) 03:35, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Caning in Bangladesh

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Having a look at the description of the external links, shouldnt they be removed because of the depiction of real violence?--2003:72:4D1C:A100:786B:B78:1813:DA24 (talk) 14:19, 3 February 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Suitablitiy of external links