Talk:Korwin coat of arms

message: The surnames of the families entitled to Korwin coat of arms were 100 more or less. In the list edited in this article (and in the sites availables on line) there are much more, 165. It seems that the list of surnames of Korwin I and Korwin II are currently merged (some sources name a Korwin III also). Those sites use to say they do not have enough information about the surnames entitled to Korwin II or Korwin III or they do not have nothing at all. Also, the confusion between Korwin and Slepowron coats of arms (and theirs many variations), make the things worst. (There are variations with the field of green, yellow and blue... and Przykorwin coat of arms, and if Materna is a Korwin or Slepowron variation... et cetera!). 
In this context to use the Ostrich feathers (usually three, but sometimes five) or the Raven in crest (standing quiet or with its wings extended for flight); as the raven in the escutcheon facing right or left, may be a matter of taste rather than a claiming proper--Gustavo (talk) 01:45, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Alternative crest of Korwin coat of arms and the right to use it  

message: There are misunderstandings between Korwin coat-of-arms as variation of Ślepowron coat-of-arms and “Korwin” as alternative name to Ślepowron coat-of-arms.  
* There are Terajewicz, Terajowicz h. Ślepowron in A. B. Winiarski’s work.
Nevertheless Terajowicz is considered Korwin in R. Jurzak’s “Genealogia Dynastyczna - Dynastic Genealogy” and Terajewicz - Terajowicz may be easily confused. So “in dubitas pro reo”...
--Gustavo (talk) 04:05, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  May be not a “Korwin surname” properly, but included in [[w:pl:Korwin (herb szlachecki)]] 

message: * Drużyński h. Ślepowron (in T. Gajl, A. Znamierowski, and A. B. Winiarski works) it seems not to be Korwin – this surname was edited by an anonymous (88.156.89.129) in 26 październik /October 2007 in w:pl and the same guy (88.156.89.129) in 30 Oct 2007 in w:en. I deleted it but I am open to discussion.
--Gustavo (talk) 04:12, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: * Anyway the "Ślepowron/Korwin usual confusion" allow to include it in the list.--Gustavo (talk) 15:50, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  May be not a ”Korwin surname” at all, but included in [[w:pl:Korwin (herb szlachecki)]]  

message: * Łopuszański h. Sas (in T. Gajl, A. Znamierowski and A. B. Winiarski works) it seems not to be Korwin  at all. - edited by an anonymous (83.144.72.148) in 1 listopad/November 2006. I didn't include it but I am open to discussion.
--Gustavo (talk) 04:14, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  May be not a ”Korwin surname” at all (rather a “Sas surname”), but included in [[w:pl:Korwin (herb szlachecki)]] 

message: * Binek – it seems not to be in on-line armorials at all.
This was edited by an anonymous (87.205.249.255) in 2 grudzień/December 2008: "Binkowski (a także od tego nazwiska skrócony Binek)", roughly "a short form of Binkowski" (???). Binek is a surname currently considered in use by about 1900 people in Poland .
* Mikke - it seems not to be in on-line armorials at all. 
Astonishing it was included and deleted several times in w:pl surnames list. 
The issue concerns about Janusz Korwin-Mikke, a controversial Polish journalist and politician, however so many editions may refer to a political-war in Poland rather a real looking for genealogy-heraldic sources.
"Korwin-Mikke" may be also (or may be not) a double-barreled surname rather a form of "Crest-Name" (the Polish-gentry style as an alternative to "Name h. (herbu/coat-of arms) Crest"). Mikke is a surname currently considered in use by 120 people in Poland .
* Muecke - it seems not to be in on-line armorials at all. It was included anonymously and deleted later in w:pl surnames list. It seems that nobody use the surname Muecke in Poland currently, but there are a few in Germany . 
* I didn't include them but I am open to discussion.
--Gustavo (talk) 04:24, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Surnames not available in any on-line armorials at all, but included in [[w:pl:Korwin (herb szlachecki)]] 

message: * Noskowski z Noskowa or Noskowski - there is no source currently available on-line to this surname as entitled to use the Korwin coat of arms.
Nevertheless, Łukasz z Noskowa was a scholar and chancellor of the Cracow Academy see Chancellors of the Cracow Academy – currently Jagiellonian University (1500-1599) - ennobled (circa 1526) and entitled to Korwin coat of arms (Chancellors and scholars of the University used to be ennobled). 
In Kochanowiczów herbu Korwin say "Wizerunek herbu korwin znajduje się na płycie nagrobnej Lukasza Noskowskiego (zm. 1532) w kościele Mariackim w Krakowie." rougly: "Korwin coat of arms can be found on the tombstone of Łukasz Noskowski (death 1532), in St. Mary's Basilica, Kraków."
But may be, he never used the surname "Noskowski" really. He could be "Korwin z Noskowa" or "Noskowski z Noskowa h. Korwin", or he didn't get descendants (so his surname disappeared), or even more, perhaps he was ennobled with another surname, etc.
In 16th century Poland-Lithuania the style and title of ennoblement (nobilitacja) carried on the use of a Coat of arms and a Surname, sometimes gived by the Crown and sometimes self-gived (usually taken from his estate). 
Polish-ethnic burghers and peasants didn't use surnames yet. Sometimes if the new-noble already had a foreign surname or nickname (Polish-German burghers mainly) he could get a new surname considered "more Polish".
Many foreign nobles re-ennobled (indygenat) in Poland did the same - i.e. 
* German "Löllhöffel von Löwensprung"  turned on "Lelewel  h. Loelhoeffel" (also said Lelewel coat of arms), 
* French "Andrault de Buy" turned on "Antonowicz h. Andrault de Buy", 
* Italian "Torelli" become "Poniatowski h. Ciołek" (Italian vitello/torello, meaning calf/little-bull is cielę/ciołek in Polish), etc. etc. etc. 
Anyway, available on-line are: 
Noskowski h. Dębno, Gryf, Łada, Rawicz, Zaremba (T. Gajl's work). 
Noskowski, h. Gryf, Łada, Rawicz, Zaręba (A. Znamierowski's work).  
Noskowski h. Dębno, Gryf, Łada, Zaremba (A. B. Winiarski's work). 
Noskowski ze Srzeńska h. Łada and Noskowski h. Rawicz (E. Sęczys' work). 
No "Noskowski h. Korwin". Not yet... I hope that an article about Lukasz z Noskowa will be written in w:pl in future. 
* Meantime I choose Noskowski z Noskowa to avoid misunderstandings with the other Noskowski families.
--Gustavo (talk) 04:55, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Special case: ''Noskowski z Noskowa'' 

message: * Please see User:Gustavo Szwedowski de Korwin/Heraldic clan Korwin
This user-subpage is far to be closed and I am open to discussion. Plese see also w:pl:Dyskusja:Korwin (herb szlachecki)# List of surnames with references
--Gustavo (talk) 05:23, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  User:Gustavo Szwedowski de Korwin/Heraldic clan Korwin 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 4 external links on Korwin coat of arms. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added  tag to http://herbyszlachty.pl/herbarz/herby_nazwiska.php?lang=pl&herb=korwin
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100413232228/http://www.ornatowski.com/index/herbarzrodowy_f.htm to http://www.ornatowski.com/index/herbarzrodowy_f.htm
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*Added  tag to http://herbyszlachty.pl/herbarz/herby_nazwiska.php?lang=pl&herb=przykorwin
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100324192949/http://webpages.charter.net/mroman/roman.htm to http://webpages.charter.net/mroman/roman.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090926231739/http://szlachta.org/lista_czlonkow.htm to http://szlachta.org/lista_czlonkow.htm
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thread_title:  External links modified