Talk:Samogitian language

message: If ė̄ is supposed to have a macron (U+0304), why does every instance of it in this article and on the entire Samogitian Wikipedia use a combining overline (U+0305)? —Typhlosion 22:55, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Combining macron vs. combining overline 

message: as they were bordering each other for several hundreds of years... Kazkaskazkasako (talk) 09:12, 4 February 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: How du you interprete "Lithuania Minor"? This did never exist but is an invention of some political dream dancers of the 19th century. Perhaps you mean the northern part of East-Prussia inclusive Memelland which belonged to Germany and was officially called Prussian-Lithuania because of so many imigrants from Samogitia and Lithuania. The prussian-couronian-latvian dialect of Memelland was highly influenced by the Samogitian language but not at all by the Lithuanian language. Kaubri (talk) 17:01, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Are there any links between Samogitia and Lithuania Minor? 

message: IP 212.12.209.182 removed Lord´s Prayer in samogitian language. Why??? Kaubri (talk) 16:51, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Lord´sPrayer

message: For foreigners who don't know the facts about lithuanian chauvinistic politics:
Samogitian language realy existed and still exists! But, couse of lithuanians (Aukštaitē | Highlanders) chauvinistic politics since XIX century and by other historical events such as world wars, occupations our ancestors language is rapidly dying. There were moments when 's authorities silently prohibited to use Samogitians name in historical sources. Samogitians had to be considered as lithuanians. It's probably the same political tactics which were used since XIII century by Vytautas the Grand Duke of Lithuania to absorb Samogitians and their lands, by spreading word to whole Europe that Samogitians are the same lithuanians, and speaks the same tongue. But there are none written sources by Samogitinas, which could confirm or deny. Some says that Samogitians didn't use writing language couse of their religion (paganism), other says that all written sources were destroyed in order to delete Samogitians from history.
The last time when Samogitians and Lithuanians were naturaly considered as different nations was during Russian Empire census at 1897. Close to 500.000 citizens of Lithuania were enrolled as Samogitians Source in Lithuanian lang.
Here is the fact, that Samogitian duchy was separate from Lithuanian duchy, also there are mentioned Deltuva duchy, which were between Samogitians and Lithuanians. Source Source 2
Moreower, standardization of Lithuanian language (which base was chosen as the lithuanians (Kauna Aukštaitē: Suvalkā) language) drasticly reduced and still reducing the number of people who speaks in Samogitian language. The new generation, especialy kids feels shame to speak in this tongue, because they are tought at schools that Samogitian language is farmers language... But this "farmers" language is not understandable for 90% Lithuanians, and this makes it unique as separate language not an dialect.
Lithuanian linguists are changing historical place names of Samogitia, they are renaming and standardizing toponymies - destroying historical heritage. Source
Even today the historical facts in many historical books about the Battle of Saule or Battle of Durbe are distorted or corrupted. There are told that lithuanians have fought these battles... but it's not correct, there were conflicted situations between Samogitians and Lithuanians at these moments. Samogitians could also become known as lithuanias since 1251 at best, when
Mindaugas the Grand duke of Lithuania killed Vykintas the Grand Duke of Samogitia and joined lands. Vykintas 
*Battle of Saule
For e.g. i've red tons of literature about the Battle of Saule (1236), but there was only half sources which were historicaly correct: Samogitian forces which were led by Vykintas the Duke of Samogitia fought and won against Livonian Order, NOT THE LITHUANIANS! 
The name of Lithuania | Lietuva | Lietva | Litva:
Lietuva is derived from the word of lieti (in lith.), leiti (in sgs.) in englis it means unite or merge.
Lithuanians tribe was only the union of few minor tribes of balts at I-V centuries AD. Ltater, the union of tribes had grown, at VI-VII Lithuanians merged with Aukštaičiai (Highlanders): Deltuviai and Nalšėnai tribes. From these times Highlanders became know as Lietuviai (lithuanians). Same happens with Samogitians, when Highlanders (lithuanians) and Samogitians unifies at 1251. 
The union of baltic tribes is called Lietva-Lietuva.
PS. I'm Samogitian and I love Lithuania with it's history, but can't tolerate the lies, falsification and the chauvinism. I'm not blind like most lithuanians, i can read and i understand, that the current situation is a threat for Samogitians to become extinct as the Curonians and Prusians.
Velks (talk) 23:43, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  This article is chauvinistic! 

message: As is mentioned in the article, Samogitian is treated as a language by most linguists outside Lithuania. As far as I can see, the reasons behind it being treated as a dialect within Lithuania are largely political. These reasons should be enough to rename it. Another reason is that it may be confused with the dialect of Lithuanian spoken in Samogitia.  In any case, the article as of now is confusing, because it treats the language as both a language and a dialect. Whatever the outcome may be, it should treat the language as only one of these. My vote goes to it being treated as a language, for the reasons mentioned above. CarlosJalisco (talk) 14:26, 8 September 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Noone? I would like to have a couple of users agreeing with me on this before doing any changes. CarlosJalisco (talk) 22:04, 10 September 2019 (UTC)
replies: text: Well? I've asked two times. CarlosJalisco (talk) 17:43, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

text: I am a historian, albeit not of Lithuanian history but I am a native speaker of Lithuanian (I grew up speaking it in the US). I do not speak Samogitian although I have heard it spoken. It is my firm opinion, based on what I have learned about the language as well as about what is considered a dialect in other languages that this is a distinct language, intermediate between Lithuanian and LatvianKvarnelis (talk)18:43, 20 October 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Samogitian being treated as a dialect 

message: It appears that the table showing the alphabet is missing the new letter õ. TooManyFingers (talk) 09:18, 12 July 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Samogitian alphabet: New letter? 

message: This article misuses IPA [brackets] to give what appears to be the spoken names of letters of the alphabet in Samogitian orthography. Conversely, apart from a few random instances in the copy mostly relating to /ɤ/, there is no IPA in the article at all. There’s a lot of focus on how different letters are written, but none at all about the phonology of the language, not even a listing of phonemes. Virtually all talk of sounds is described using the language’s own orthography, which makes it virtually useless for someone who doesn’t speak the language. It needs to be in IPA. Kokoshneta (talk) 10:38, 16 December 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  IPA bracket misuse and missing IPA 

message: :The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 
The result of the move request was: MOVED.  User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 02:24, 17 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: Samogitian dialect →  – Mutual intelligibility =/= dialect per se. It's fair enough that the Samogitian speech is considered a separate language by some scholars in and outside of Lithuania, as mentioned in the article. Some examples describing the relations between Lithuanian and Samogitian would be Latvian and Latgalian, English and Scots, Czech and Slovak, German and Bavarian, etc. Ентусиастъ/Entusiast (talk) 14:32, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

text: This is a contested technical request (permalink).  — Amakuru (talk) 11:20, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: , Yes, I know that the page was moved from Samogitian language to Samogitian dialect long time ago but per me it's better for it to be reverted back to the original name, i.e. language, not dialect. At the very least pure linguistic objectivity requires it. Moving the page to Samogitian dialect was totally unneeded and most importantly unobjective. Of course, the POV that treats the speech as a dialect will undoubtfully be mentioned in the article. PS There's a Samogitian Wikipedia on top of that. As for the RM, I never dealt with such things and so don't understand very well the whole RM thing and its variations. I'll be glad if you give me an idea how to make a propper RM if this one isn't such. Cheers. Ентусиастъ/Entusiast (talk) 17:02, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
replies: text:  Suport I agree with your stance. This is an RM now, and it'll run it's course in about a week and someone will come along to close it. -Kj cheetham (talk) 17:10, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Requested move 10 June 2022