Talk:Tipu Sultan/Archive 1

message: To quote from the article: "A rocket carrying about one pound of powder could travel almost 1,000 yards. In contrast, rockets in Europe not being iron cased, could not take large chamber pressures and as a consequence, were not capable of reaching distances anywhere close to a mile." But a mile is 1760 yards, so what is being asserted here? Too Old 05:00, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Weight of the rocket is about 2kg. With about 1kg of propellant. 50mm in dia about 250mm length, the range performance is reported 900mts to 1.5 km.  Wisesabre 06:10, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: So the rockets had about 1kg (2.2lb) of powder, not 1 lb. With this charge their range was between 6/10 mile (900 meters) and  9/10 mile (1.5km), probably in excess of 1000 yards (6/10 mile).  The contemporary European rockets possibly could match this, since their casings weighed less, so the same amount of powder might have driven them as far.  The comparison is indecisive. Does anyone know of an experiment to test the relative ranges of the two rocket types using the same amount of powder?  The American National Anthem refers to "the rockets' red glare" during the War of 1812, implying military useage.  At any rate the article might be in error. Too Old 02:16, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nonsense phrase 

message: Fatima is an old Arabic name (The Prophet’s daughter’s name was Fatima), so that would the mother’s given name.
Fakher-an-Nissa is Arabic and literally means Pride of Women; this would be a sort of title. You can either use her title by its own or call her: Fakher-an-Nissa Fatima bint FATHER_NAME.
I hope this information is useful, because as the article stands now it seems her exact name is not known! --DelftUser 19:04, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mother’s name 

message: Tipu seemed to be a great secularist. There is a Ranganatha swamy Temple standing right in the ruins of Srirangapatnam. Pity such a great soldier had to go like that. --Hydman 06:20, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Did you actually read the entire article instead of quoting a single line from it out of context? srs 10:58, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Religious persecution

message: Help wanted in dealing with a Tipu Sultan spammer
Every so often a spammer using an IP address that starts with 64.228.225. spams links to bogus web sites. I have tracked down and reverted all I could find, but I'm getting a little sick of tracking all these articles on my watchlist (it's up to 263 pages by now). Can I ask the regular, frequent editors of this article to keep an eye out for this person? If they hit again, please revert the edit and warn the spammer. If you have the time, check out what other edits they made that day and revert them as well -- or just let me know and I'll do it.
The link they like to add to this article is
:[http: // www angelfire com/co/begumnoor/tipu2 html Tipu Sultan Article by Jean Overton Fuller].
The real point of the link is to build search engine rankings for the commercial links at the bottom of the page; the same spamdexer is linking similarly bogus pages for Hindu mystical figures and U.S. country music stars -- all with the same links at the bottom of the page.
The spammer also recently created an account, User:Borgengruft.
For more info, see:
* Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive117#Link-spamming from someone in the IP address block 64.228.225.xxx
* Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive118#Update -- now using Borgengruft?
* User:A. B./To do list#Abusers
Thanks for your help.--A. B. 07:34, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Help wanted in dealing with a [[Tipu Sultan]] spammer 

message: To Tippy sultyn Fans again, who are defending that he was not a muslim fanatic, must know that what right did hydra ali and tippy sultan had to cease power, they call people who eat the masters given food and betray them as Namak Haram, they were just that, mYsore was doing extremely well without them and did exceptionally well after them, as usual most of his armys commanders were muslims and when they defeated Travancore maharaja they converted thousands of Nairs to Islam by force, and he had links with turkey, persia and other muslim countries.
About his contributions to temples, he was not giving his grandparents money but the money of the Mysore Kingdom, the maharajas money,its not a big deal, i am sure he would have given hundred times more money to the madrasaas and mosques, he built tombs and mosques in mysore using the stolen money of the Maharajas, so his fans what ever u thik he is he was definately a traitor and muslim fanatic. our so called secular leaders have made a hero out of a Villan.
vgowda
Dude! care 2 provide da documentation n u can type watever ye want in ur brains but not here...Mysorebhai 20:30, 14 September, 20:30, UTC
vgowda can be more refined but he has a point.  religious persecution by tipu is a well known, atleast much debated fact.  also his anti kannada stance is recent news and references can be found in any karnataka newspaper of the last couple of weeks or month.  and google for tipu's religious persecution am sure you will find lots of hits.  Sarvagnya 01:01, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  To Tippy Fans 

message: First of all Mysorebhai and Tippy hero, mind ur language dont show off ur culture and upbringing to the whole world and ur jehadism and fanaticsm will not run here, truth hurts sometimes but u cannot supress the truth . Tipu was a muslim fanatic and was Anti Kannada and ur shouting here will not change history, so go and put whatever u want in Ladens or Saddam hussains articles ur current heros, ok.
--vgowda
: So if we can put some credible references to this it would be great. Then it can be referenced and put in the article and there would be no need to get into discussions over this. Everyone on this page is not in Karnatka and would not have access to the kannada news articles. Haphar 11:44, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: So true.  Only acceptable citations will help.Kanchanamala 04:34, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  To Jehadi Fanatics of Islam

message: Tipu Sultan was certainly the greatest. He was a great nationalist. He kicked away the Mysore kings and became a GREAT SULTAN !!!!! He brought the great language URDU to foolish Karnatak people speaking old bland Cannad language. The beauty of Urdu language floored many Cannad people and they adopted Urdu and became Muslim. Tipu didnt force anyone to become Muslim. He was a great king. He did the great work of making "Kafiristan Karnatak" into "Dar-Ul-Karnatistan". Thank him for the riches he brought to Caranatak. Otherewise what were these Cannada people doing. Poor people were slaves to the Marathas and Nizam. After Tipu, the Mysore Rajas again became slaves, this time of European British. But still Carnatic government dont make justice. Urdu should be made Carnatik state's official language. Fools, stop badmouthing the gr8 Tipu Sultan.
ALL HAIL THE GREAT TIPU SULTAN !!!!
DOWN WITH THE CANNADDA FANATICS !!!!
Tipu Beat Cannad
:This is not helping anyone. If you could keep running down other communities it would help. Tipu does not become great by degenerating other communities or language. I think it takes away from his greatness to have someone run others down.Let's be fact based, please give your sources for your claims, and go easy on the aggression. Haphar 15:35, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Tipu The Greatest

message: The very claim that Tipu Sultan is the "Father of Modern Rocket Science" is laughable.Any reasonable person viewing this article would immediately see this claim for the absurd level of jingoism it touts. As a practising physicist, I find this statement so ludicrous that the only words I can think of to describe it are Wolfgang Pauli' famous 
"NOT EVEN WRONG". It is pure junk science at it's finest.
First of all, the very claim that Tipu used "rockets" as weapons of war is unsourced and dubious enough to warrant a special mention in my professor's classes on spotting pseudoscience. I've seen the Doordarshan TV show by that Shahbaz Khan guy where they showed this rocket stuff and, even at age 12, I could see it for the nonsense it really was.
Tipu Sultan was no scientist and he did not have the background in basic empiricism that led the ancient Chinese to discover primitive rockets in the first place (and even THEY used it for entertaintment, not as weapons).
Even if we buy into this rockets crap, it would not be Tipu Sultan who get's the credit, but the minister or worker or somebody who figured it out under his command. Do we credit Eisenhower with being the "Father of the Atomic Bomb", or do we reserve the credit to Oppenheimer, Einstein, Feynman et al?????
To make this claim is, quite frankly, insulting to the years of experimental research work that led to the first rocket engines developed by Tsiolkovsky (the REAL father of rocket science). Please provide VERIFIABLE and RELIABLE sources per WP:Reliable Sources that attest to the claim that Tipu even had access to "rockets" and then please change the title to reflect a more balanced section (assuming that you people can find any proof of this "rockets" fable).Hkelkar 06:01, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, User:Nobleeagle pointed me to the ref from where the "Father of Rocket Science" balderdash was plagiarized. I also found some slightly credible refs that state that rockets were used by Marathas and by Tipu (though frankly, calling those glorified firecrackers "rockets" is still pretty ridiculous). While I stand corrected about the use of rockets, the section was plagiarized copyvio from the article. Plus,calling him the "father" of rocketry is pretty laughable so I merged the section with an earlier one where the rocketry thing was better discussed.Hkelkar 07:33, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The designers of modern state-of-the-art airplanes do not belittle the earlest attempts made at making a craft fly.  Let us also not belittle the early efforts in India made to use the principle of jet propulsion in warfare.Kanchanamala 04:55, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: So ridiculous that it defies reason

message: Is it verifiable that Tipu was involved in the construction of these gardens?  I thought they date from Krishnaraja Wodeyar IV.  --BostonMA 12:34, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The Krishnarajasagara Dam and the Brindavan Gardens go together.  Kanchanamala 06:40, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Brindavan Gardens]] 

message: Mujeerkhan, in your most recent revert, you removed a number of fact and citation needed tags.  That may not have been your intent, you may have simply wanted to make other changes, and the fact and citation needed tags were deleted as a side effect.
I truly question some of the assertions made on this page.  That does not mean that they are false, however, I would like to see some verifiable sources.
For example, it is claimed that Tipu was responsible for the establishment of a church.  That would be an interest fact given that Tipu was a Muslim.  If it is indeed the case, then it should be possible to produce a reference from a reliable source.  Further, if he did establish a church, it would seem that the name of the church would be something appropriate to include in an encyclopedia article.  What was the name of the church?
Similarly, it is claimed that Tipu was involved with the construction of Brinddavan Gardens.  Again, I am not claiming that is false.  However, I was under the impression that the gardens were  constucted upon completion of the KRS dam.  It may be the case that there were gardens existing there before the dam was constructed.  But it would be nice to see a source substantiating that fact.
Please respond to the issues I have raised.  Sincerely, --BostonMA 14:27, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you for the link.  I note that the article to which you linked has a date of August 12, 2006, and it does not list its references.  I therefore took the liberty to look at Wikipedia's own article from August 7   and noted the very strong resemblence between the two.  It seems not beyond the realm of possibility that the article you cited took its information from Wikipedia.  (I have seen that happen a number of times before).  I would be very much more convinced if you could show a reference to Tippu establishing a church that gives some sort of "trail of responsibility".  That is, a reference that gives its own references, or at leasts names a reputable scholar as the source.  Again, I am not saying the information is incorrect, only that I am not convinced that the majority of experts in the field, in this case historians, would give credence to this story.  --BostonMA 14:51, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Deletion of fact and cn tags 

message: :The present ref does not say that Tipu founded the Jacobin club, only that he was a member.Hkelkar 02:31, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Rubbish. Nowhere in either of the references is the word "founder" even mentioned.Hkelkar 05:55, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I am perfectly within my rights to point out gibberish when it is there. Since it is a comment on content, not on contributor, it is neither incivility nor a personal attack. The fact remains that 90% of the article is balderdash, hooey, jive, bakwaas, drek,and other similar such descriptions from any number of languages that anyone can think of. What's more. the edits are colored by the worst case of religious/nationalist fundamentalism I have ever seen on wikipedia so far. Any reasonably intelligent person viewing this article would keel over and die of laughter at the obvious propaganda being touted here. This does not help the credibility of wikipedia as a legitimate source of objective information.If something is not done about this I am going to have to request for full administrator arbitration here.Hkelkar 08:46, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Since I did comment on content and not on contributor, this warning is bogus and, in on itself, a personal attack. I am reporting this immediately.Hkelkar 23:09, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Jacobin club

message: Wikipedia:No personal attacks SAYS "Racial, sexual, homophobic, ageist, religious or ethnic epithets directed against another contributor" amounts to NPOV.
your remarks" nasty breed of localized Islamist tribalism at work"  and "but the fundamentalist nutbags reverted it anyway" to other members,does certainly amounts to personal attack. Please see Wikipedia's no personal attacks policy. Comment on content, not on the contributor; personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Note that continued personal attacks may lead to blocks for disruption. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. Thank you.  
Mujeerkhan10:45, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well you (or your sockpuppet) made attacks calling me "Hindutva" despite the fact that I am not even a Hindu. Plus, I didn't direct my ire at anyone in particular so how do you know I was referring to you?Hkelkar 08:35, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: another personal attack

message: This discussion has gone ashtray and way beyond the purpose to which it was intended for.So all users can you all please help in developing the article and not quarelling among ourselves as this will leave us in a qaugmire!
Mujeerkhan18:00 September 2006 (UTC)
::Well I'm sorry if it "hurted" you. But you must understand my position if you think calmly. Why don't you simply compare this travesty of an article to other articles about similar historical figures like Charlemagne,Robert I of Scotland, William Wallace, and many others and maybe you can see the problem here. None of those articles mention praise words in the first person, and any controversy associated with them is discussed and listed. In particular, look at Richard I of England and his antisemitism Richard I of England#Anti-Semitic violence, in which two views are presented.Hkelkar 11:27, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I respect your contention. However, if we succumb to these type of intimidation tactics by religious fanatics on wikipedia, then this encyclopedia will lose all credibility. Bear in mind that Richard the Lionheart is also considered a "Holy man" of sorts by many English Christians (he fought the crusades which was a holy war in christianity), yet christians would be offended by allegations of antisemitism towards him but that does not prevent scholars from editing the article appropriately. The same rules apply here also.Hkelkar 12:28, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: all users

message: I absolutely agree with Hkelkar we cannot let History to be corrupted by some Muslim Fanatics who claim Tipu as a saint and a good Ruler. Tipu was religious fanatic and was hell bent on destroying Kannada culture, the engraving on his grave says that Tipu died for iSLAM WHAT PROOF ELSE THE Jehadi Muslim fanatics need that he never cared for his people his only love was to save his illegal rule of Mysore and spread Islam . 
.vikramji
tipu was found here , "The interior of this chamber till the reach of the arch is decorated with paintings that resemble the stripes of a tiger. While Hyder Ali and his wife's tombs are covered with velvet cloth. Tipu's tomb is covered with cloth that appears like tiger skin. The corridor houses the tombs of Hyder Ali's family members. It is heartening to note that the paintings inside the chamber have never been subjected to chemical treatment. Footwear is strictly prohibited in and around the tomb" there is no mention of grave carvings as you mentioned 
Shezaad786 23:34, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I agree with [[User:Hkelkar|Hkelkar]] 

message: Some fanatic who cannot digest truth has deleted the Anti Kannada material , I have put it back and i warn the fanatics from deleating it,.vikramji
Could you please give a verible source.
Mujeerkhan 23:30, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Those are not "proofs". They are counterarguments. Counterarguments can, of course, be offerred provided you don;t take a biased position on them (as you just did). Might want to look up the dictionary meanings and wikipedia policies regarding several points of contention here.Like I said, nationalist/religious jingoism hard at work.Hkelkar 18:31, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

text: Vikramji the link does not seem to work, can you get some other source or a better link for this ? Plus can you tone down the comments a bit, they are inflammatory, the same point can be made making it less POV. Haphar 11:03, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: IU agree with Vikramji's premise but also agree with Haphar that present tone of the edits are too inflammatory and needs to be made more NPOV (look at the history for my last edits and check).Hkelkar 13:05, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

text:  Go to the page Vgowda user page and it says "I am Vikram Gowda from India".  So, when someone with the same first name and a similarly abysmal standard of english, coupled with a fiery need to defend this article against an "anti kannada" bias - vikramji suddenly appears on the scene .. well, I think vikramji is just User:Vgowda operating under an alias.  This article is becoming unusable - there are far better ways to resolve these differences than carry out edit wars based on statements based on poor research, or even on unsubstantiated folklore, liberally peppered with abuses in ungrammatical english.  srs 10:32, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Anti Kannada 

message: I absolutely agree with Hkelkarand EyeSerene, people have the right to know the truth, ONLY TRUTH PREVAILS IN THE END, Tipu was brave no question about that , but that just does not make him a patriot or national hero as his rule of mysore was itself illegal and was against the wishes of the people. He was desperate to retain his rule and  nothing else, His atrocities against the Nairs of kerala and Kodavas of coorg is well documented in the respective articles. The few Fundemantilist fanatics want to hide this , and Mr mujbeerkahn, just having same name does not mean Vgowda user page and me are the same , i have been here on wikipedia long before any of u, so stop finding excuses and come out of your inferiority complex and accept the fact. Dont act like the Taliban.
vikramji
How many proofs do you guys need! Another nasty remark "fundamentalist" which agian is an NPOV if u cant digest the truth then pls keep in ur own body. user gowda is no other than but Hkelkar himself.And if you are him i am sure you want to make some more idoitic comments
USERS Kathanar,Ben W Bell talk, Bodhidhamma,Hornplease have given several warnings to Mr Hkelkar in just 2 days for vandalising and spreading fundamentalism! all users pls check talk page of Hkelkarremarks against Kancha Ilaiah , Votebank, Godhra Train Burning, Indian Buddhist Movement ,Shudra ,Dalit you will surely find something worse! he is trying to spread fundamentalism himself.
Naziakhanum19:57, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: All right. Another personal attack to be reported.Hkelkar 21:35, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Plus, the same users have been warned by Ben W Bell (an admin) for vandalism and personal attacks. I believe you are twisting the facts to smear me and trying to tout an agenda of hate. This will be filed as a complaint, of course.Hkelkar 21:48, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Fundamentalist Propaganda 

message: If Tipu fought the British only for his kingdom, so did Rani of Jhansi. So if Tipu is not a national figure, please apply same rule to Rani of Jhansi. Let's try and be balanced here, sure we do not have to glorify Tipu, but there is no need to run him down ( based on political stances rather than history) either. Haphar 06:53, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well the Rani of Jhansi article does not refer to her as a "patriot" in the first person nor make laughable claims about being a "linguist". What's next, are the Mujahids going to give Rodney King a PhD???Hkelkar 07:08, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I did say both sides need to tone it down. And Rodney King would get is more likely to get a Phd from nation of islam rather than the mujahids. Haphar 09:01, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Neutral

message: I think Mujeerkhan,Hassan,iFaqeer,Mysorebhai,Tipu Hero and Naziakhanum are all sock puppets of the same person, which i guess is Mujbeerakhan,can somebody verify he computer ID's please. Somebody tried to put in a Caste angle to Religious presecution of Hindus. 
*Vikramji
 This is your last warning.I am not a sock puppet and please can you be more civil by signing in properly and put date, time etc.  and stop using calling me as "Mujbeerakhan" as it has some other meaning and you are purposely calling me by that name.  
Mujeerkhan 20:53, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sock Puppets 

message: Firstly,
Mr Mujebrakhan is hell bent on distorting facts by claiming that Kannada was not suitable for administration, he should go and read History books before coming to such stupid and baseless conclusion, kannada has been the administrative language of many great empires like the Rastrakuta, Vijayanagar, Hoysala and Kadamaba to name a few even before advent of Islam and when the Arabs and probably Tipu's ancestors were living a life of Nomads. Kannada language is one of the most advanced and sopisticated languages in the world, Mujebrakhan probably doesn't know much about Kannada or Karnataka , but still he claims he knows everything about tippu.
Secondly, About the claim by Mujebra that Tipu,s army consisted of people from backward casted is absolutely ridiculous and shows his castist attitudes, The mysore marajas themselves were from Yadava/Kuruba clan and does that mean they were backward, He is creating many lies to prove  wrong as right.
Vikramji29 sep06
There is no point in talking with you and i am going to file a complain against you
 
Mujeerkhan 20:46, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Racist vandal (see contribs+vandalism reverts by other users) reported.Hkelkar 12:10, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Update:User:Ismael Tarkan has been indefinitely blocked from editing wikipedia.Hkelkar 12:45, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

text: I have already started the process in mediation. There is a 5 day wait time. The page is here:
Wikipedia:AMA Requests for Assistance/Requests/September_2006/Hkelkar
Hkelkar 12:29, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well the term "Mohammedean" is generally used by scholars to refer to Muslims so I used it also. There was no insult implied, nor did I make any claims that Muslims "worshipped" Mohamed. Plus, I'm sure that Jews, Hindus, christians, and Baha'ii would feel the same way about being routinely called "Kaffir" or "Dhimmi" of "Dar-al-Harb" yet the terms are frequently used by Muslims.Hkelkar 12:49, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Update:User:Goingindia has been indefblocked as an abusive sock of indefblocked User:Ismael Tarkan.Hkelkar 00:37, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

text: First of all, it is so bad that Muslims in Karnataka speak Urdu. Their mother-tongue is Urdu. Which gives them a different identity, an identity of Muslims in a South Indian state Karnataka speaking North Indian language. I mean, Muslims in Kerala speak Malayalam, Muslims in Tamil Nadu speak Tamil, Muslims in south Gujarat (esp. in rural areas) speak Gujarati, Muslims in Maharashtra (other than Bombay) speak Marathi, Muslims in Bengal & Bangladesh speak Bengali, Muslims in Assam speak Assamese and/or Bengali, Muslims in Punjab speak Punjabi but Muslims in Karnataka do not speak Kannada. If they are sons of the soil (aka local converts) then why did they leave their local mother-tongue and if they are invaders/migrants then why didn't they adopt to the local Karnataka language. I wonder.... Who failed whom here ? I think this has led to polarisation in the state. I mean, if you want to keep religious communalism at bay, you need to have something common, and the lowest common denominator is language. Then why is it not seen in Karnataka ? Or do Karnataka's Muslims still believe that Urdu is their Qoum ki bhasha ? That too when Urdu is a slight deviation of Apabhramsha with Persian/Arabic words thrown in. Hmmmmm....It's an interesting topic....  Ration Shopper 18:43, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The Tamils who immigrated to the Kannada land a long time ago, speak both Tamil and Kannada.  Likewise, in addition to speaking Kannada, the Andhras speak Telugu, the Marathas speak Marathi, and the Marwaris speak Marwari.  Why single out the Muslims of the erstwhile Mysore if they speak Urdu?  Mysore has been a cosmopolitan region since the time when Bombay(Mumbai) did not even exist.Kanchanamala 00:30, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "Why single out the Muslims of the erstwhile Mysore if they speak Urdu?" Because they're trying to impose their language upon others, not live in a "multilingual" cosmopolitan culture.Hkelkar 00:46, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

text: Not true, my friend, not true.Kanchanamala 10:45, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: See posts above by the likes of Tipu Hero etc. Anyways let's just agree to disagree here. Hkelkar 12:53, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Distorting Facts 

message: here are some additional refs:
"Annual reports of the Portuguese Franciscans in India, 1713-1833" by Achilles Meersman P238.
"The Colors of Violence: Cultural Identities, Religion, and Conflict" by Sudhir Kakar P17
Now bear in mind that this book opposes Hindu Nationalism and is critical of it in general
"Kerala Under Haidar Ali and Tipu Sultan" by  C. K. Kareem (A Muslim, no less!) P 187
"The Protected Princes of India" by William Lee-Warner (Page 71) 
http://books.google.com/books?vid=OCLC00185953&id=GciCSpe1OOMC&pg=PA1&lpg=PA1&dq=The+Protected+Princes+of+India
I ask that these also be cited.Hkelkar 02:31, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: More Evidence to back Tipu Sultan's Persecution of Hindus

message: I found an interesting video on Tipu Sultan's rocket and how it created fear and panic on the British. Its taken from History channel. Hope this video does not breaches wiki policies.
[]
Shezaad786 22:31, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: And the quotes from actual scholarly books (instead of the Libertarian hoopla of the "History Channel") listed above will also be a good thing for viewers to see "from their own eyes"[sic].Hkelkar 05:54, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Nope. I wasn;t "barrded"[sic] for significant periods of time at all, but you will be if you go at this rate. I don't care what textbooks say. Most textbooks are politically correct trash anyways. Plus the mediation cabal is going my way. If you vandalize the article despite the results of the mediation I can and will file an RfA and get you banned. I have already addressed the partisanship of the tipusultan.org ref in the AMA request.Hkelkar 11:32, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

text: hah! 3 hrs is nothing! Plus, your ringleader BhaiSaab was blocked for as long (and his block log is worse anyway).Hkelkar 11:39, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Since I did not violate any wikipedia policies I will not apologize for that. I have read the same kinds of Indian textbooks that you have and they are mostly pure trash. They are written by leftist committees and whitewash a lot of Indian history for the sake of political correctedness. The writings are skewed and poor. Some textbooks in some states are okay, but the national board textbooks are garbage. They are as bad (if not worse) as American textbooks.Hkelkar 12:28, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Tipu's rocket

message: Its been proved that Mujbeerakhan has been creating sock puppets (see the warning on his home page) and as i guessed before it was right and i suspect Indiandesi is also his creation, so he is the ring leader and he is the member or members as well. since it has been proved who was vandalising the article, i insist on including tippy's Anti Kannada Stance in the article--Vikramji 18:07, 9 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another Creation 

message: The other two sock puppets of Mujeerkhan are Hydman and True Indian, since its been found out that Mujebrakhan has be creating sock puppets , he is been lying low and ithink might creat more sock puppets. More over he has repeatedly used abusive language against me and Hkelkar through his numerous sock puppets, he has also been using very abusive and foul language then tries warning and mediating between his own sock puppets which is very disgusting. Can you please block him for ever.--Vikramji 10:00, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Master Tippu Puppeteer 

message: Hello - I have been asked to carry out advocacy regarding this article by Hkelkar.  Having considered this dispute carefully from a neutral standpoint, I have come to what I consider to be a fair conclusion.  I would like to offer some advice for good article writing:
* Always source statements WP:CITE and cite them appropriately.
* Always ensure that you include verifiable statements for anything you say (WP:V)
* Always ensure that you edit from a neutral point of view (POV) (WP:NPOV)
* Always think before pressing "Save" - is your edit likely to flare up strong opinions?  If so, then before making it you should leave a note on the talk page, and wait for an appropriate length of time before editting (ie - until you get some replies (or a few days)).  Remember that edits can easily be carefully thought out and saved in a text file, before copy/pasting into WP
* Never get into any form of edit war.  If you make an edit which is reverted by another user, follow WP:0RR and initiate calm discussion on the talk page to build ocnsensus before editting again
* If another user is incivil towards you, always try to follow WP:CIVIL and reply in a calm manner.  If attacks continue, report to an admin
* Discuss all major (proposed) changes on the article talk page.   
I would cordially request that all editors of this article follow these recommendations to the letter, in orderthat we might make this article go forward with more information, not remain stuck in the past.  Please remember that no-one (and no group of users) owns an article - it is improtant to respect this if the encyclopedia as a whole is to move forward.  On the subject of sockpuppetry, the proven case at WP:RFCU against users including Mujeerkhan (see Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/mujeerkhan) is not, in my opinion, relevant, as long as those usernames follwo my guidelines above.  Should personal attacks against other users continue to stem from these accounts, I can forsee that an admin may implement an indefblock.  Finally, if I may, I would like to suggest that a 0RR policy be used on this article.  This means that if someone edits in a way which you disagree with, DO NOT REVERT!  Instead, intiated discussion here or try to re-word their edits.  Please do not allow any more edit wars to break out.  As a reminder, any sourced statement which is from an allowable source (WP:CITE) can be left in an article.  If editors can find counter arguements (sourced, of course), they may add them to the article with links.  Oh - and before I sign off, can I just say that the quotation mark images, when used in articles, can look bad - please consider just using "..." :).  I hope that you consider this advice, and follow it -- Martinp23 18:58, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Advocacy report 

message: The Padishah declaration and his motives behind the French alliance are also mentioned in Sharma's book Chapter 5. In addition, pages 64 and 65 summarize letters written by Tippu to Zaman Shah of Afghanistan that demonstrate his intent to create a rigid Islamic state with himself as Padishah.Hkelkar 09:13, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I disagree. I think that the compromise that Sikanderji and I have reached is fine. This issue is a central debate regarding Tipu Sultan and it must be featured accordingly.We have cited a representative cross section of views concerning this matter, and not the whole shabang, as it were. The section looks okay and relatively non-partisan right now so please don;t mess with it. Oh, and PLEASE SIGN YOUR POSTS. Thanks.Hkelkar 04:23, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: You're free to edit whatever the hell you want. You can't remove any sourced edits as that would be Wikipedia:Vandalism and will be dealt with accordingly. You must adhere to WP:RS and WP:V in all your edits. Rest assured, I will be monitoring them diligently and will unceremoniously revert any edits that do not adhere to these policies. If you adhere to them then you will have my eternal thanks and respect as a fellow wikipedian.Hkelkar 04:49, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Please don't lie/ I was never blocked for vandalism but for PA's. removal of ANY reliable sources is vandalism. memorize that, okay?Hkelkar 05:29, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Plus, my sources in this article are published goo-old-fashioned paper books that are right beside me on my desk, not "Google books". Don't try to deflect the issue and worm your way into vandalizing.Hkelkar 05:31, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Padishah

message: Mujeer, don't you think this is a slightly anachronistic term? Tipu ruled as a despot, like all his contemporaries. He certainly wanted to drive the British out of India but had no qualms about allying with the French. To use a post-independence term which entitles people to special quota on railway bookings seems a little tendentious. I'm also puzzled by the reference - Brittlebank's book only has one volume, and I don't believe she uses the term "freedom fighter" at all except to describe how Tipu is seen in nationalist historiography. Sikandarji 12:05, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: "Freedom Fighter"

message: Not a single word about his legacy in the entire article. Like the shah Jahan article which deals half its space to dubious sexual conduct ignoring the rule and legacy that most history books would say, this one too deals more about his controversy and other trivial matters than about his legacy or any other important matters. No one even bothered to add up some images either, and that is quite shocking considering that so many have been pushing their POVs on here. Idleguy 18:06, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Mum about his legacy 

message: This introduction is very fragmented and contains short sentences stacked on top of each other that make it sound quite awkward. Also, some of the sentences are placed so that they can unintentionally mislead the reader. For instance: He was also a strongly religious man. He built a church, the first in Mysore, at the request of the French. makes it sound as if he was Christian.
Another sentence that seems incomplete is about him being proficient in languages that he spoke, which should be extended to say exactly which languages he did speak. Aslamt 02:50, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Misleading parts in the introduction 

message: Yousaf465 has inserted a statement right at the top of this page that, "Tipu's grand children do have a link with Pakistan so don't link him with India only." 'subhaan-allah'. It can be safely assumed that most Pakistanis are descendants of ancestors who were not only Indians like Tippu, but were originally Hindus. With the creation of Pakistan out of India in 1947, Indians, who opted to live in Pakistan, certainly did not lose their proud Indian heritage. One should not lose sight of the fact, however, that there was no Pakistan during the time of Tippu Sultan. The history of Pakistan starts in August 1947. The cruel history was created, not by Muslim Indians, but by Indian Muslims. I strongly suggest that Yousaf's changes at the top of the page are reverted.Kanchanamala 19:43, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Tippu and Pakistan

message: This is a dispute about how the proper name "Tipu" or "Tippu" should be spelt in the article.
Statements by editors previously involved in dispute
* Most contemporary English sources; including local museums, books, encyclopedias, and other scholarly works choose to spell it "Tipu" and that is why it should be spelled that way. --Aslamt 05:38, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  RfC: Spelling of Tippu vs. Tipu Sultan 

message: Can I add a section on Tipu's persecution of women. There are sources which supports the claim. I am giving it here right now.
1) https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.31945/page/n100/mode/1up
2) https://archive.org/details/TigerOfMysore/page/n227/mode/1up
3) https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.72774/page/n80/mode/1up
I am having more but check it out... Mahusha (talk) 06:16, 19 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Can I add a section on Tipu's persecution of women 

message: Tipu was a tyrant and religious bigot. His atrocities and persecution of Hindus and Christians in Malabar, Karnataka (Coorg) and Tamil Nadu wee well documented. He was a Southern version of Aurangazeb.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.169.179.4 (talk) 12:33, 11 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: Tyrant

message: I'm reverting all the edits made by Gauravsarai because, unfortunately, they appear to be guided by their own opinions and motivations (see the edit summaries)  rather than on a dispassionate reading of history. For example, Tipu Sultan's rule was like Talibani rule, warlord is a better term, Why not add all the world events here which happened during Tipu's childhood, emoving content without reference (whole of article looks biased with repeated mention of Tipu making Mysore an invincible power), looks like this article will end up giving him credit for creation of Justice league as well. This is unfortunate because some of their edits are probably good ones but, in a volunteer environment like this one, it is impossible to separate the good ones from the bad ones. I urge Gauravsarai to discuss their edits here on the talk page, get consensus, and then make changes. --regentspark (comment) 01:35, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes a lot of his edits were really good ones, I will find some time to restore them. But there are also other edits that are really not enough and he will have to provide reliable sources on talk page for disputing them. Geunineart (talk) 03:29, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gauravsarai edits 

message: It is believed by 
some that William Congreve (1772-1828), who developed the 
modern rocket, first saw the weapon while fighting against Tipu. 
There is no evidence to support this belief. In fact, there is no 
evidence that Congreve ever came to India. It is true that the use of 
th rockets in India was known in Europe at least since the 17 Century 
and experiments on its development were going on even before 
Congreve started his own. After many trials and demonstrations 
Rocket developed by Congreve was first used by a British warship 
in 1806 during attack on the French port of Boulogne. It was used by 
the British army in the Battle of Leipzig (1813) and the Battle of 
Waterloo (1815). Congreve himself never gave any credit to Tipu 
for his interest in rockets. It should be noted that Congreve was an 
ingenious inventor and had several inventions to his credit such as a 
process of colour printing, a gun recoil mounting, and a new form 
of steam engine. Suppose that the story of the proverbial apple tree 
is true. Would it not be foolish for someone to give the credit for the 
discovery of gravity to the owner of the tree because the apple 
falling from his tree led Newton to discover the phenomenon? It 
would be equally foolish, even if it were true that the rockets fired 
by Tipu's soldiers led Congreve to develop the weapon further, to 
give Tipu credit for its invention. There is no doubt that Tipu did not 
invent the rocket; there is no proof that Tipu's rockets gave 
Congreve the idea to develop his rockets.
Rockets have been in use in India for well over a hundred years 
before Haidar's birth. If you want I will give here. Mahusha (talk) 06:38, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
replies: text: Mahusha, you should propose modifications to the text of the article with reliable sources. Merely recounting conclusions based on your own research is not helpful. Please read WP:OR. --regentspark (comment) 13:44, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tipu as a rocket man😂😂 

message: Dear Sir,
:There is wrong fact mentioned on wikipedia that Tipu sultan has forcefully converted 200 Brahmins to Islam, No such evidence is present in Gazette of Maysore or British India Library, Kindly delete this information from your website with immediate effect, Your prompt reply on this matter will be highly appreciated Amjad.siddiqui1984 (talk) 16:03, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Why should we remove it?  It is cited to what appears to be a reputable source. Magic♪piano 16:52, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Deletion of Wrong fact about Tipu Sultan