Talk:Dyer Lum

message: McElroy, "Debates of Liberty" says Lum was an anarcho-communist. The source being used in this article to say he was an individualist did not say that. It just said he was a contributor to "Liberty." That makes sense now, because the things in this article and his quotes didn't seem individualist to me. Operation Spooner 18:24, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm sorry, that was my mistake. The source said his relative worked for Gompers, an individualist anarchist, not that Lum was an individualist anarchist. Thanks for catching that. I have to question the appropriety of the "anarcho-communist" identification however — it seems to contradict his market-orientated philosophy as described in the Thought section. Can you provide the quote from McElroy? Skomorokh incite 18:43, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Here's one clue in his quote in this article: "The tradesman would find that production offered greater inducement than exchange..." Here's a quote from McElroy: "On the next page of Liberty, an article by Appleton entitled "The Boston Anarchists" spelled out the peaceful principles and policies of Individualist Anarchism, which stood in stark contrast to those of Communist Anarchism...In the same issue on the opposing page, The Communist Anarchist Dyer D. Lum complained that 'the ggrave situation in which the Chicago Communists' (if you will) are placed demands...more than dissertations or well-rounded and careful distinctions b 'X' [Appleton] between 'Boston Anarchists' and the 'savage Communists of Chicago." I'm reading that Tucker and Yarros were in disputes in Liberty. Tucker called the people at the Haymarket Incident fake anarchists, etc, and Lum didn't like that. Operation Spooner 18:56, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

text: "Lum was on cordial terms with Liberty...but he became severely critical of Tucker's stand on the Haymmarket Incident." That's McElroy too. Operation Spooner 19:04, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

text: I don't think we really need to debate among ourselves with a source is correct or not. It doesn't matter if it's correct. If someone says he was a communist and another source says he was an individualist, you just say "According to X, he was a communist, but according to Y he was an individualist, and according to X he was an anarchist without adjectives." Wikipedia is not about truth but whether something can be found in a source. Operation Spooner 22:59, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

text: People's views change over time too. Someone can be a communist yesterday but an individulist today. Operation Spooner 23:06, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So we're all agreed the lede should state simply "anarchist" and the disagreeing sources should only be mentioned in the Thought section?Skomorokh incite 23:27, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's fine, since it's so ambiguous. Operation Spooner 03:11, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ideological identification 

message: Lum discusses his view of rights in Liberty, vol. 6 no. 25, or #155. Jacob Haller 20:45, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lum on rights 

message: Presley, in Exquisite Rebel: Voltairine de Cleyre contrasts Lum's "mutualism" with Tucker's "individualism," and later describes Lum as an "anarchist without adjectives." Jacob Haller 21:03, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think we really need to debate among ourselves with a source is correct or not. It doesn't matter if it's correct. If someone says he was a communist and another source says he was an individualist, you just say "According to X, he was a communist, but according to Y he was an individualist, and according to X he was an anarchist without adjectives." Wikipedia is not about truth but whether something can be found in a source. Operation Spooner 22:59, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

text: People's views change over time too. Someone can be a communist yesterday but an individulist today. Operation Spooner 23:06, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: So we're all agreed the lede should state simply "anarchist" and the disagreeing sources should only be mentioned in the Thought section?Skomorokh incite 23:27, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That's fine, since it's so ambiguous. Operation Spooner 03:11, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Descriptions of Lum's views 

message: Nearly the whole second volume of The Alarm, edited by Lum, is available online. Enjoy. Libertatia (talk) 06:20, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lum's Alarm 

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