Talk:Cradle of Filth/Archive 2

message: I have rewriten the opening paragrph to confirm to a more npov view, I can only hope that it will please everyone. It would seem to me that this is a page which is frequently vandlised, as every time I have visted it, it seems to have a completly different article. Avador 15:08, 27 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Opening Statment

message: Is there any reason why the bands on the 2003 Ozzfest not listed in the touring partners section? Technically they are indeed touring partners, right? Archenhaust 21:07, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Touring Partners 

message: According to www.metal-archives.com , Dave Pybus is back in the band and Charles Hedger is not in it anymore, So I put their names in the propper places. Ladysway1985 05:20, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Band Members 

message: Why add current tour dates? This is completely beside encyclopedic value. There are other websites to provide that sort of things. --Steerpike 21:54, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree. Tour dates seem like irrelevant information to have in an encyclopedia.Matthew king 02:16, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Tour dates! 

message: I was reading an interview where it states that Dani Filth's favourite band is The Misfits. But on here it says different. Would anyone help clear this up? TearAwayTheFunerealDress 16:24, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yep I saw something like his favorite band was Emperor. I'd like to know where you saw that it was The Misfits. That's interesting though. Robobot569 12:11, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

text: I have read on many occasions that The Misfits were his favorite band, although I cannot remember the sources (The Haunted Angel 17:11, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Google image search suggests you're absolutely right. Fixed. You could have done that!  Cardinal Wurzel 09:18, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Trivia

message: Fair enough using a band pic instead of one of just Dani, but I don't think that's the current lineup.  That was my thinking behind using just a frontman pic - band pics will constantly have to be changed to keep on top of their revolving-door membership, but if we can stay on top of that I guess it's the better option.  Was just being lazy!  Also, photos need to be properly tagged - it looks as if Wikipedia will remove the current pic within a week.
Cardinal Wurzel 09:21, 8th February 2006 (UTC)
----
Its not the current lineup, but I liked it better... If you dont you can change it back I dont mind.
I will fix the wrong tagging thing, sorry. Im off to that now.....
--Andy5190 23:12, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Band photo

message: Hey guys. I recently added Dave Pybus (Herr Pubis) to the Discography under Roadrunner Utd, as he plays Bass on one of the songs. It occured to me then, should this really be mentioned on the Cradle of Filth page? I know that ⅓ of the band plays on album, but it is not a Cradle album. If the whole band played on the album, that'd be ok, but as it is just two of the guys, I suggest moving it off the page, and instead putting it under the Discography (that probably doesn't exsist) for Dani and Dave. I'm not to bothered either way, its just an idea. The Haunted Angel 22:48, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Roadrunner United on Discography? 

message: Hallo mates, its been quite sometime since I have been around these parts, and let me say, the article is coming along great! (Much appreciation to Cardinal W) I was just looking it over, and I think that splitting the Misc section into 3 parts would be Reasonable. I think their should be a Demos section, Bootleg section, and a Misc section. Whats everyone think? ~Andy Blak 19:51, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sounds like a plan!  Cardinal Wurzel 20:35, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Aye, Captain! I will get to work on it! ~Andy Blak 00:35, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bootleg section 

message: I don't know, just my opinion because it was more representative of how the band looks (closer up). -Iopq 06:46, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I totally agree... BUT that picture was really out of date.  It's an almost totally different band now.  So whoever changed the pic probably does have the right idea, I think.  Hopefully as more promo pics emerge for the new album over the next couple of months we can find something better again.  Cardinal Wurzel 21:48, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I am back. And I am going to make a new, updated pic! Keep your eyes open. Hey Cardinal, whats up, bro? -Andy Blak 23:07, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I liked the older picture better 

message: Please stop "fixing" the header capitals, according to WP:MOS, only the first letter in the header should be capitalized unless there is a noun in the header. Michaelas10 08:51, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Please stop 

message: I simply corrected the album release date, as listed on the Cradle Of Filth website. It was pushed back a day and is now set to release on the 17th, rather than the 16th.
Changed back to 16th as per Roadrunner UK site86.139.75.177 19:03, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Album release date 

message: someone take the religious shit off the titles of the sections. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.63.207.14 (talk • contribs) 
Done.  Again.  Cardinal Wurzel 09:50, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: christian shit

message: An anon just moved Adrian Erlandsson from current members to former members.  Might just have been vandalism, but if it was a good-faith edit, is there a source for info that he's left the band?  I couldn't find anything.  Google search comes up with nothing, nothing on the official Filth site, or their MySpace page, or Adrian's own site or MySpace.  Anyone heard anything?  Cardinal Wurzel 23:00, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Blabbermouth posted about it yesterday:   -- seems to be legit. 138.227.189.9 14:57, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Erlandsson

message: I was just surfing on Amazon and came to this page:
http://www.amazon.com/Lipslide-Sarah-Cracknell/dp/B000006ZKZ/ref=m_art_pr_1/103-8847686-2095834
This version of Vempire is missing Ebony Dressed for Sunset as the opening track. Is this a rare import or a goof or what? The label is Gut and not Cacophonus. I wanted to include this on the discography page, but this one confused me.  (unsigned by Archenhaust)
It's just a weird mistake.  Bad, mixed-up listing that conflates the Cradle album with a Sarah Cracknell one.  I just looked her up (she used to be in St Etienne - I remember them!) and Gut is her label.  Cardinal Wurzel 07:45, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Question Regarding Vempire

message: Shall we just use  the Cradle logo as the pic in the infobox?  It would avoid this problem of having to change the photo every time the line-up changes, and is probably safer in terms of Wikipedia's draconian copyright rules anyway...  Cardinal Wurzel 10:36, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's usually routine for band pages across Wikipedia to have a pic of the band on the infobox, so I personally would want to leave a band pic there... however, I would not be opposed to having to keep updating the pic, if we left an older pic there, I wouldn't be bothered, as long as we said underneath "Cradle of Filth 2004" Or "Cradle of Filth 'Nymphetamine' line-up" or something along the lines. The Haunted Angel (The Forest Whispers My Name) 21:10, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

text: I quite like the logo, but again I prefer the band pics. Also, the Dragon logo, despite being a Cradle icon, if we were to have a logo instead of the band pic, wouldn't it make more sense to have the main 'Cradle of Filth' logo/flame writing instead? Sorry if it sounds like I'm bitching at every idea you raise, having a logo is certainly a good idea in comparison to having to keep updating it, but alternatively an older picture from one of their albums could suffice, but as long as we stated that it was an older band line up.... but then we'd have the problem of having the main picture on our page as being out of date =\ What a pickle... The Haunted Angel (The Forest Whispers My Name) 23:47, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem - just a thought.  It's back how it was now, with a slightly modified caption.  Cardinal Wurzel 10:02, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Great. I think that we should leave it like this until a new album is released, not keep updating it every time someone leaves with a new member that will only appear in live shows, the albums are only really important mile-stones for updating the band lineup. Oh, sorry if it sounded like I was bitching at every idea you bought up =\ The Haunted Angel (The Forest Whispers My Name) 13:11, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

text: I'll leave a message there, see if that will discourage them at all. And if they do change it, we just revert it back =D The Haunted Angel (The Forest Whispers My Name) 15:03, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Lol - you're too nice =P The Haunted Angel (The Forest Whispers My Name) 17:53, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Main page pic

message: Does anyone here know if Bam Magera had anything to do with the collaboration of Ville Valo with Cradle fo Filth on Thornongraphy? Bam is friends with both of them so I wonder if he brought the two of them together.
~ Archenhaust
:Personally, I doubt it, but there's been no mention of Bam having anything to do with Cradle outside of Viva La Bam, or at least, none that I know of. ≈ The Haunted Angel //The Forest Whispers My Name// 22:12, 1 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bam Magera and Ville Valo 

message: "The lead singer from the band Dani Filth is in another band called Cradle Of Dirt. They are a new band and will be releasing an EP soon. The name of the band is similar because they wanted it to be like eachover."
OK, a simple Google search for "cradle of dirt" yielded THREE results, none of which were remotely related to Dani Filth. I'll remove it.
:Pure vandalism, the person who put it there has been warned. ≈ The Haunted Angel //The Forest Whispers My Name// 15:24, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Cradle of Dirt????

message: What's all this "Drink bleach" business?  Dani mentions it in an aside on Live Bait / Heavy, Left handed, and a Google search pulls up a lot of people referring to it but nobody actually explaining it.  Sounds like it's something to do with Dani flippantly claiming to drink bleach in order to get his voice like it is - is that right?  Anybody confirm it, with a source? Cardinal Wurzel 08:36, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I have no source for it, but I HIGHLY doubt that he would do that, probably a sarcastic comment that he once made. (Sounds like him). Maurauth 11:36, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

text: Heh I didn't mean to imply that you did thing that ;p But there's lots of people that would believe it if it's written. Maurauth 12:15, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Drink Bleach

message: Ok so i think alot of people will laugh at me because of this, but this is for those people that have not yet figured out.
I did a google search, dictionary and other searches to figure out what this meant and could find no possible answer when suddenly it hit me
read Dani's line from Damnation and a Day's Hurt and Virtue 
Rebles truced
with Feriluce
(in truth few could resist)
Feriluce is simply Lucifer almost backwards. Lucifer means Light *Luci* Bringer *Ferra*.
But what he has simply done is reversed it Ferre Luci which would make him not the "Light bringer" but merely the Bringer of Light. That to me kind of changes the name alot. 
tell me how much you laughed because you already knew what it ment.
216.201.194.106 18:26, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Lol, don't be so pessimistic. But nah, I didn't know that. Often when I see a word in Cradle lyrics I don't understand (which is somewhat frequently) I assume that because Dani does alot of research for his songs, it's the background for some story I'm not familiar with - usually ancient Religous stories, or maybe something by Lovecraft. Still, very nice interpretation :D ≈ The Haunted Angel 17:55, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Haha, just call me Haunted if you want, most other people do. By the way, try and sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~) after each post :) ≈ The Haunted Angel 18:08, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Feriluce and what it means 

message: Does anyone recall the name of the girl who appears on the cover of the album Nymphetamine? I absolutely know I read the name before, a long time ago, and I google image searched her name and it was most definately the same girl, but I can't seem to remember the name anymore. I tried google and yahoo, but all it gives me are weird MySpace page links, and peoples blogs about their girlfriends, and album reviews. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.98.146.96 (talk) 23:41, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nymphetamine's Cover Girl 

message: I recently went through the whole article and properly cited each of the references. In future, if anyone has any references to add, please put them in :Template:Cite web format, instead of just pasting the URL between the <ref> tags. ~Spebi 07:36, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  <nowiki>{{cite web}}</nowiki> tags 

message: :GA review (see here for criteria)
#It is reasonably well written.
#:a (prose):  b (MoS): 
#It is factually accurate and verifiable.
#:a (references):  b (citations to reliable sources):  c (OR): 
#It is broad in its coverage.
#:a (major aspects):  b (focused): 
#It follows the neutral point of view policy.
#:a (fair representation):  b (all significant views): 
#It is stable.
#:
#It contains images, where possible, to illustrate the topic.
#:a (tagged and captioned):  b lack of images (does not in itself exclude GA):  c (non-free images have fair use rationales): 
#Overall: 
#:a Pass/Fail: 
Her are some things to fix before nominating again.  Get rid of the trivia or merge it into the main article; trivia sections = bad.  Get rid of the excessive lists at the end (we don't need to know every collaboration, tour partner, etc.).  The genre in the infobox is "Disputed".  Fix that.  I don't really care what you put, but for all someone reading that knows, they could be a ragga group.  At the very least, they're some subgenre of rock, so put that.  Almost none (if any) of the images have fair use rationales.  Add them.  There isn't a single citation in the entire history section.  ShadowHalo 06:55, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm ok.. I cannot find the message I left so I'll assume good faith and presume you're correct. I hope you realise though that linking to lyric sites violate copyright and commercial links also cannot be used for citations. As concerns GA status, good luck bringing it up to the required standard. It does not meet the standard yet, though hopefully your reviewer will help you with some decent feedback when he fails it and you'll actually use it.  asks for retrieval dates and not even these have been added, and the article is full of weasly terms. If you wish to know what annoys me, it's the fact you've renominated the article and haven't even been bothered to address the concerns already highlighted in past GA reviews. You mentioned on my page about the past two GA reviews, but you haven't even addressed their concerns, and are therefore wasting GAC's time - address people's concerns, and nominate after that. LuciferMorgan 19:01, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: SeizureDog's third point was the following - Fix statements like "Global sales were impressive." It really doesn't help just to source the comment, you need to show how they sales were impressive and not just tell us that they were. See Wikipedia:Avoid peacock terms. This is a prime weakness of the article, and this is mainly why the article will fail GA. It also is full of original research, and needs major work. LuciferMorgan 19:26, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

text: I have no problem in you moving the discussion to the main talk page of Cradle of Filth if you wish, and I'll get that list to you. I'll add to it over time etc., but if you have the Baddeley book that might do you a few favours. And on another note, you're very perceptive - I am very busy, but with off Wiki stuff (webzine work). LuciferMorgan 20:10, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Okay, I think I've dealt with all that now.  What next?  And where's a good source for album sales figures?  Oh, and I think you've got the wrong end of the stick a bit re the gavin Baddely book.  Lucifer Rising isn't a history of Cradle or anything; it's about satanism and popular culture.  They're just mentioned in it in passing.  His "Gospel of Filth" is in the works, but it's not out yet. Cardinal Wurzel 18:35, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: About that, the "upcoming book" tag was removed by Maurauth on the Gospel of Filth article, as he claimed the book was out... I take it he's mistaken? ≈ The Haunted Angel 23:10, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Amazon said it was out, but that could have been a mistake. ≈ Maurauth (nemesis) 23:23, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Righty, well I havn't really been following that much, and I havn't seen it on sale, so I'll assume it ain't out yet - I'll put the template back up :) ≈ The Haunted Angel 23:27, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

text: It's officially out on October 31st 2007 according to the publisher's official website. Most sites are just copying their date off Amazon, which is incorrect. LuciferMorgan 16:09, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Failed GA

message: I was asked to take a look at this article. Overall, its a pretty good article. Could still use a bit of work before going for GA again. Here's some advice (note: I wrote all this without seeing the comments above):
*Given the overall length of the article, the lead should be a little longer.
*Get rid of the "Roughly speaking" in the lead or reword the sentence.
*Switched refs to WP:CITE format.
*The article overall very much lacks sourcing. Of 12 in line citations, 10 are in one sentence (and 11 are in that paragraph). The rest of the article really needs in line citations.
*Per WP:MOS, citations come after punctuation.
*All of the fair use images on the page need rationale.
*The Trivia section, basically, do what the tag says.
*Consider combining the following sections: Films, Television appearances, & Books.
*I don't think the Related artists section is needed. At the very least, consider making the Bands covered and Collaborations sections into a 2 column table.
*You have two References section. This needs to be fixed. All references should use the WP:CITE format.
Hope this helps.↔NMajdan•talk 21:12, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: More advice

message: Not everything was addressed from last time:
*Images still need fair use rationale. Too many album covers cluttering up the page. 
*No images of the band?
*Fix statements like "Global sales were impressive." It really doesn't help just to source the comment, you need to show how they sales were impressive and not just tell us that they were. See Wikipedia:Avoid peacock terms.
*Instead of one of the many album images, a picture of one of the shirts mentioned in "The Music for Nations era" would be nice.
*Please replace all curly quotes (’) with straight quotes ('). The curlies feck up in my browser.
*Tidy up your citations. Use Template:Cite web
*You should really try to get an audio clip of one of their songs. You really can't understand what Cradle of Filth is without hearing them. I remember someone telling me to listen to "Haunted Shores" and then latter learning that all of that gibberish screaming was actual lyrics and just barely believing it.
It's close, it just needs a little more work. You can contact me again when you think it's ready.--SeizureDog 06:12, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Another fail

message: I remember clearly stating not to use lyric sites (read Wikipedia:Copyrights and commercial sites (read Wikipedia:Spamming) such as Amazon.com as sources. I'm telling you one more time as I'm going to remove them, but should they be re-inserted I'll have no choice but to report such behaviour to ANI. LuciferMorgan 17:02, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm ok.. I cannot find the message I left so I'll assume good faith and presume you're correct. I hope you realise though that linking to lyric sites violate copyright and commercial links also cannot be used for citations. As concerns GA status, good luck bringing it up to the required standard. It does not meet the standard yet, though hopefully your reviewer will help you with some decent feedback when he fails it and you'll actually use it.  asks for retrieval dates and not even these have been added, and the article is full of weasly terms. If you wish to know what annoys me, it's the fact you've renominated the article and haven't even been bothered to address the concerns already highlighted in past GA reviews. You mentioned on my page about the past two GA reviews, but you haven't even addressed their concerns, and are therefore wasting GAC's time - address people's concerns, and nominate after that. LuciferMorgan 19:01, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: SeizureDog's third point was the following - Fix statements like "Global sales were impressive." It really doesn't help just to source the comment, you need to show how they sales were impressive and not just tell us that they were. See Wikipedia:Avoid peacock terms. This is a prime weakness of the article, and this is mainly why the article will fail GA. It also is full of original research, and needs major work. LuciferMorgan 19:26, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

text: I have no problem in you moving the discussion to the main talk page of Cradle of Filth if you wish, and I'll get that list to you. I'll add to it over time etc., but if you have the Baddeley book that might do you a few favours. And on another note, you're very perceptive - I am very busy, but with off Wiki stuff (webzine work). LuciferMorgan 20:10, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Okay, I think I've dealt with all that now.  What next?  And where's a good source for album sales figures?  Oh, and I think you've got the wrong end of the stick a bit re the gavin Baddely book.  Lucifer Rising isn't a history of Cradle or anything; it's about satanism and popular culture.  They're just mentioned in it in passing.  His "Gospel of Filth" is in the works, but it's not out yet. Cardinal Wurzel 18:35, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: About that, the "upcoming book" tag was removed by Maurauth on the Gospel of Filth article, as he claimed the book was out... I take it he's mistaken? ≈ The Haunted Angel 23:10, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Amazon said it was out, but that could have been a mistake. ≈ Maurauth (nemesis) 23:23, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Righty, well I havn't really been following that much, and I havn't seen it on sale, so I'll assume it ain't out yet - I'll put the template back up :) ≈ The Haunted Angel 23:27, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

text: It's officially out on October 31st 2007 according to the publisher's official website. Most sites are just copying their date off Amazon, which is incorrect. LuciferMorgan 16:09, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Advice from Lucifer

message: This is a list I'll update of things that need fixing...
*The largely self-produced album led to Cradle's U.S debut,[10] despite criticisms of its sound quality.[11]
The sentence is worded weasly. If you wished to comment on concerns regarding the album's sound quality, instead of saying "there were criticisms of its sound quality" you would say "Critic Pedro Azevedo of Chronicles of Chaos webzine criticised the album's sound quality, citing "production faults"". LuciferMorgan 20:24, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay, I think I've dealt with all that now.  What next?  And where's a good source for album sales figures?  Oh, and I think you've got the wrong end of the stick a bit re the gavin Baddely book.  Lucifer Rising isn't a history of Cradle or anything; it's about satanism and popular culture.  They're just mentioned in it in passing.  His "Gospel of Filth" is in the works, but it's not out yet. Cardinal Wurzel 18:35, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: About that, the "upcoming book" tag was removed by Maurauth on the Gospel of Filth article, as he claimed the book was out... I take it he's mistaken? ≈ The Haunted Angel 23:10, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

text: Amazon said it was out, but that could have been a mistake. ≈ Maurauth (nemesis) 23:23, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Righty, well I havn't really been following that much, and I havn't seen it on sale, so I'll assume it ain't out yet - I'll put the template back up :) ≈ The Haunted Angel 23:27, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

text: It's officially out on October 31st 2007 according to the publisher's official website. Most sites are just copying their date off Amazon, which is incorrect. LuciferMorgan 16:09, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: List

message: The cover art is lacking in rationale specifically for use on this page, and I am wondering exactly whether it is needed. What grounds do you see for including it? As far as I see, there is no discussion of the cover art itself, and so the usage of it here appears to be entirely decorative. What reason is there for keeping it there? J Milburn 17:48, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Great, now we have but one picture in the article save the Dragon one. Well, at least the Vestal one was the best one there anyway. We need more pics now =/ ≈ The Haunted Angel 19:15, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: What happened to the "2006 tour line-up" picture? I thought good old Cardy had permission to use that picture from the photographer (Cindy Frey, I think). Stupid wikipedia copyright junk! Death2 01:33, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

text: Oh, I see, I replied to something old... :) Emmaneul (Talk) 10:59, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is the cover art strictly needed? 

message: I was just reading St. Augustine's Confessions for a class and found the following:
But it becomes an obstacle if he thinks his view of nature belongs to the very form of orthodox doctrine, and dares obstinately to affirm something he does not understand. But such an infirmity in the cradle of filth is sustained by mother charity, until the new man 'grows up into a mature man and is no longer carried about by any wind of doctrine' (Eph. 4: 13).
(V. vi (10))
Just thought this might be helpful to y'all in some way. 
-Richard Paez. University of Florida English Department. richardpaez@gmail.com  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.34.159 (talk) 22:41, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Wow, that's pretty fucking cool! I thought Dani was just sitting around one day and thought "Hmm, Cradle of... Filth! That sounds cool!" Hehe ≈ The Haunted Angel 19:21, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I heard their band name was originally going to be "Manger of Filth" but they weren't allowed to play shows with that name or something, so they changed it... which may not be true but it makes sense to me. No source. = ∫tc 5th Eye 20:35, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Band Name 

message: I've taken this to the talk page at WP:ENGVAR to see if we can get a consensus.  It's about 50/50 so far.  Cardinal Wurzel 11:50, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Is/Are

message: shouldn't the category :Category:Roadrunner Records artists be added to the page, since they're signed to roadrunner. Balthazar (talk) 03:59, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah - go ahead and add it if you wish. ≈ The Haunted Angel Review Me! 16:24, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Category 

message: What does the medieval order have to do with Cradle of Filth, nowhere in this article does it mention, is it a fanclub or something, it just shows a picture which claims to be based off of the medieval one (which its clearly not, the Order's symbol uses an Ouroborous dragon with no circle around it, no moon, its not even culturally the same kind of dragon from what I see from the Austrian Museum sketch). I'm deleting until you give a reason for the picture, and drop the "a slight adaptation of the medieval original." unless they actually have a source (OMYGOD yes, sources you lazy potatoes) from Cradle or their representitives saying its a modification of the original.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.207.191 (talk) 09:28, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Roffle... ≈ The Haunted Angel 20:03, 4 March 2008 (UTC)
replies: text:  Call your American police all you want, besides I usually buy what I download, if its worthwhile, too many videogames are $80 and not worth $20.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.207.191 (talk) 10:52, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

text: Not one that involves me in jail, no.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.207.191 (talk) 07:32, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Order of the Dragon 

message: Anyone know where Damnation and a Day stood on the top 200? It's not listed on the album page..
:According to Rockdetector it got to number 44 in the UK and number 140 in the US.  Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 21:45, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Damnation Chart Position 

message: The picture at the top of the page is fake. It's like action figures or something. Someone should replace it. CheesePiggy (talk) 06:24, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Definitely looks real to me. = ∫tc 5th Eye 07:19, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

text: You can't use promotional / professionally-taken photos, such as that one, under free use, since free photos are available (i.e. live pictures). = ∫tc 5th Eye 03:06, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

text: But the picture has to belong to you.  Or failing that, the person who took it has to waive all rights to it and allow its free distribution.  Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 23:06, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  The Picture 

message: Is it alright if i add some other bands associated to cradle? Chipthief00 (talk) 21:47, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Of course, as long as they have shared members. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 22:10, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Along those lines, I have a few to add, also ≈ The Haunted Angel 17:47, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: right, shared members as in have been listed in both bands. my bad. Chipthief00 (talk) 18:53, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: No problem. ≈ The Haunted Angel 18:55, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Associated acts 

message: I was just wondering if "Bitter Suites to Succubi" should be relisted as an EP? It seems to confuse people that there are 9 albums listed as studio albums, yet only 8 (including Godspeed) are actually studio albums magnius (talk) 13:40, 25 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: EP's

message: please someone re-section this article doing the sections like
Early days(1991-1994)
The Principles Of Evil Made Flesh(1994-1996) etc.
so it will look better.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deathmagnetic08 (talk • contribs) 17:40, 25 July 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  new sections 

message: Really, what happened to the genre boxes on *EVERY* band? I don't know where else to ask about this, but since this page seems to see a lot of activity, I'm guessing that someone here might know..Zaruyache (talk) 01:01, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Here's your answer ≈ The Haunted Angel 02:06, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Good riddance, too. = ∫tc 5th Eye 03:42, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  What happened to the genre box? 

message: Shouldn't there be a section about his obvious changing in styles over the years, and especially the drastic change visible (or audible) over their most recent works?  With Midian Dani's style changed to a more pronounced, "cleaner" style than previous works.  Damnation and a Day continued on that style, although with better production.  Nymphetamine showed a continuance from the previous style, although with some experimentation with "cleaner" vocals, like on "English Fire."  Thornography brought a very different style to Dani's vocalizations, or atleast to the way the the vocal tracks were mixed during recording sessions.  Growling became less prevalent, with more high-pitched yelling becoming more prominant.  The general sound of Dani's voice also changed with Thornography.  It just sounded different.  That style was continued on Godspeed on the Devil's Thunder..
Any thoughts on expanding on this charcteristic of the band?  Zaruyache (talk) 01:25, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The fact that Cradle have evolved from a black metal-esque band over the years has been mentioned, and I think that this would be included in such mention - anything else could be considered WP:OR ≈ The Haunted Angel 01:31, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

text: Sounds like original research to me, but if you can find a reliable source discussing Dani Filth's vocal changes, please feel free to cite it. --Stormie (talk) 23:37, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

text: Dani sings most of the the last album with clean voice, but growls it on stage. At this point of COF's history we can wonder why he didn't growl on the original records of TMAOO, and if the next album will be recorded with clean voice too. Nico92400 (talk) 12:39, 3 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dani's voice progression 

message: I quit the vocalist sarah from the band members seccion because she is not more with the band now, Dani fire her from the band because she wanted too took the principal vocal place. Go to the ofcial web.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Digimortal (talk • contribs) 17:02, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Official site still lists her as a band member. Unless you have a source that you can link, please do not remove her again. magnius (talk) 20:09, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sarah 

message: I'm wondering why two of the previous members are listed under "Former Member" while the dozen other former members are listed in its own article?
And why is Rosie Smith listed there? She only contributed as a live member...
Ahoibakk (talk) 19:59, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Member section 

message: Re the brief albums-only discography that was added and then removed.. agreed, Cradle of Filth discography covers the details well, and to a level inappropriate to the main article. But it does look a little strange to have a section which consists solely of a "Main article" link and nothing else.
I took a look at the first 5 bands/musicians in the Wikipedia:Featured articles list - AC/DC, Alice in Chains, Audioslave, Black Francis and Kate Bush - and all five of them have a discography similar to the one Hobosapien20 added (although as a bulleted list not a table). So, taking this as the standard for featured-quality music articles, I have restored that brief album list to the Discography section. --Stormie (talk) 21:28, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Discography 

message: The link to the album midian actually takes you to the page of midian, not the album. someone might want to fix this  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.230.215.189 (talk) 03:47, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: --Stormie (talk) 04:39, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Derrrr 

message: I've removed this section, since there's an entire separate page for past members, and only including six out of the possible 30-odd isn't really on: surely saying those six are more notable than any of the others constitutes somebody's POV?  If there was a way to change the heading to say "selected past members", that might be another matter, although I'm still not sure how you could encyclopaedically justify more significant notability of some past members over others. Thoughts? Magnius has blanked his talk page and refused to deal with this question, despite flinging around accusations of vandalism. Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 20:08, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: They are all notable past members, and you should have discussed this as soon as your opinion was challenged.  The past members section is a valid part of an infobox, it wouldn't be there otherwise. We should come to an agreement over which members are worth including and which ones not, rather than just wiping the lot. Certainly, if they have appeared on a studio album then they are in in my opinion. magnius (talk) 20:52, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Past members in the infobox

message: Cradle of Filth has a movie called Cradle of Fear and I fail to see it mentioned anywhere in the article.
BallBoo (talk) 13:09, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: It's mentioned in the "Music for Nations era (1996-2001)" section. magnius (talk) 13:30, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  A Missing Video 

message: Why is Dimmu Borgir mentioned in the infobox as a related article?
I see how they are associated acts, for in both bands' long histories I'm sure they've shared some members, as have many more European metal bands. But I don't get how and why only Dimmu Borgir should be mentioned in the infobox.
Am I missing somehting obvious here? Is Dani Filth also secretly Shagrath or something obscure like that? Please enlighten me! Thank you ^^ Snikch (talk) 07:52, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: After perusing List of Cradle of Filth band members and Dimmu Borgir, it looks to me that the sole connection is Nicholas Barker. "He was the original drummer for British metal band Cradle of Filth, playing on the first three albums. After leaving in 1999, he joined Norwegian symphonic black metal band Dimmu Borgir." --Stormie (talk) 05:00, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Relation between Dimmu Borgir and Cradle of Filth 

message: The picture on cradle of filth's page that features a nun masturbating is very offensive to some people and every time it was removed it was not vandalism. This needs to be taken off.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 152.157.170.81 (talk) 22:13, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Well the fact is that this is Wikipedia not a church. Since one of the biggest things about this band is their effort to offend the majority, the picture needs to stay. The incidents involving the shirt were a notable part of the band's history and are more than worth mentioning. So, deleting the picture with no more reason that it hurts peoples' feelings is indeed vandalism.Korylytle (talk) 05:12, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

text: This has just been anonymously removed again - along with all text relating to it - so I'd like to echo the above, and add that, last time this page was peer-reviewed, it was recommended to us that we include this information and an image to illustrate it. This is a significant part of Cradle's history; it's certainly true that, especially in the 1990s, a lot of people who'd never heard a note of Cradle's music were still aware of the band because of their merchandise, and this is absolutely the most notorious / infamous example. People seem keen to remove it because "it might offend others" (it's never caused offence to the actual remover, you notice). My feeling is that someone likely to be offended by it would be unlikely to stumble across this page by accident. You'd have to actively be looking up Cradle of Filth and this image for the purpose of feeling offended, which would kind of make you the butt of the joke... Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 09:01, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: '''''Offensive Picture'''''

message: I recall the genre section mentioning a demo called total fucking darkness, which was reminiscent of death metal. I know we can't include it without reliable sources, but does anyone know if there is any truth to this claim?
[Unsigned by 75.34.20.83]
*Have a listen and see what you think: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEtNeFHbTpw     Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 09:20, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Total Fucking Darkness 

message: I did some much needed revisions and updates on the member page. updated the timeline, extended the members by year to incude 2011 line up changes, added sarah jezebel to the EP's (she was a member at the time, so idk why she wasnt on there already) , included the labels of which each release was released by(i know its not 100% necessary, but it gives the reader an idea of what members were associated with what labels), added that mark newby-robson was credited for orchestrations even though he was listed under keyboards, mentioned that all of the fictional jared demeters contributions to V empire were written and perfformed by stuart, who was also lead guitarist. Jared demeter was played by more than just the 2 mentioned, however this list is a mission for a different day. I Also mentioned when members used other names on recordings so as to match the actual album credits, such as dave pybus who was credited as Herr Pubus on Nymphetamine. Please have a look and tell me what you think. I couldnt find credits for evermore darkly, so i credited it to ashley ellylon since she was the keyoardist/backing vocalist at the time (at least i think she was). if this is incorrect, feel free to correct it.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.193.126.189 (talk) 04:17, 14 December 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  The members page 

message: Just FYI: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Martin Marthus Škaroupka. My proposed solution is to convert the band members section in this article into subsections with a short summary of the notable members and a short description of the others. - filelakeshoe 15:41, 15 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Band members 

message: Matiasmoritz, I do not believe we need all of the former members on the main article, especially given the fact that there are so many of them and that we have a whole article dedicated to them here. Please stop edit warring. – Richard BB 20:25, 30 September 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't really care. Short answer no, but if it keeps the peace it's not like them being there is terrible. They're kind of current members... Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 18:46, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll assume there's no consensus, and leave it as it is. – Richard BB 21:31, 2 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Listing former members 

message: Do we need / want an "in popular culture" section? I always think those are really lame - especially when there's only one item in them. Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 18:55, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Cool, nobody cares so I'll delete it. The IT Crowd stuff is on the Nymphetamine page anyway. Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 08:18, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, the only reason most people in the UK outside of metal fandom have ever heard of CoF is because of the IT Crowd references. --Ef80 (talk) 23:21, 17 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: That's an incredibly sweeping statement. Can you substantiate it? People outside of metal fandom who watched The IT Crowd, sure. But "most people in the UK"? Really? Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 05:25, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: It would have been more accurate to write any people in the UK. This isn't an attack on CoF. The various metal genres have zero exposure beyond their various fanbases and the whole point of the IT Crowd joke was that the character was a great fan of a bizarre sounding band of which the audience would be completely unaware. CoF are now familiar to lots of people thanks to the joke, most of which have never heard a note of their music. --Ef80 (talk) 12:15, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text:  Yeah, I'm sure you're right; I'm not really arguing. It's just that, as I've said before, it's weak to have an entire 'in popular culture' section that's only got one entry. And those lists are always really just 'we spotted this thing we like in these other things' anyway. I guess we could feed it into the paragraph on the Roadrunner years and Nymphetamine, in the way that it's mentioned on the Nymphetamine page itself. But it just feels a bit, "so what?" They were namechecked on a sitcom. Yay. Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 21:27, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: There you go; I added it. Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 21:31, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title: In popular culture

message: Darren J. White (also Ex-Singer of Anathema) never played drums. Metal Archives is also wrong on that. Original Drummer was "Darren Garden" it seems: demoarchives.com/Bands/Cradle of Filth-Eng/cradle of filth.asp. 193.67.103.254 (talk) 15:02, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: Cheers for that. Have corrected the members page. Looks like the confusion is they both go/went by "Daz". Plus White did some vocals on Cradle's first album, and Cradle covered an Anathema song, so there's also that relationship that's obviously lead everyone astray! Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 07:34, 15 April 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Darren White 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Is it just me or are there way too many pictures in this article? We could probably easily cut 5-10 of them.172.87.33.194 (talk) 15:25, 13 May 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: I do agree, there is too many. As it is focusing on the band itself, I believe it should have pictures of the band performing. Though, I can compromise and say that the picture of Dani Filth can remain on the first subsection about the band's early years, as he has been there since the band began - but I won't rule out maybe one of two pictures of current or former members. Every other picture should placed diversely left and right, that's my suggestion. HorrorLover555 (talk) 18:16, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: The Jesus is a Cunt shirt should also remain, given the controversy surrounding it. — Czello 18:36, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Number of images 

message: For many years, just like with Darren White, there is an unclear status on Jon Kennedy, being a bass player in 1994-1995 and in 1991-1992. Was he an original bass player for Cof or not? Original bass player's name was also Jon, but i can't recall his last name and i'm pretty sure these were two different persons. Another reason is the latest statement from Was Sarginson, he told that "Dani was doing high screams on the first demos way before even meeting Jon Kennedy". The only demos where Robin didn't play bass were the first two. 31.207.230.72 (talk) 18:46, 6 December 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: what's more, Dani Filth reffered to Kennedy as "their third bassist" in his farewell instagram post to Jon. 31.207.230.72 (talk) 19:43, 7 December 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Just having a look at Dani's Insta post you mention, and he actually didn't write the bit you quote - he's re-posting from a French Cradle of Filth account run by someone else. Interestingly Dani's post and the original don't quite match. The original says "Jon was @cradleoffilth 's first bassist, participating in several of their demos and was also called back to replace Robin "Graves" Eaglestone during The Principle of Evil Made Flesh Tour." Dani's says third and omits the line about demos. So it appears that Dani is correcting the original there and that - you're right - Jon Kennedy is the third bassist and therefore not the Jon that played on Orgiastic Pleasures Foul. But it's a slightly clumsy edit since Dani's version still says JK was "called back" - back from where? (I guess it should be "called in"?) You don't say where the quote from Was Sarginson comes from. I had a quick scrub through the Scars & Guitars podcast from 2022 but I couldn't immediately find it there (although I could easily have missed it). Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 13:49, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: Yup, looks like someone editing List of Cradle of Filth members at some point weirdly decided Jon Pritchard and Jon Kennedy were the same person. I've now separated them. Cheers for spotting that. I don't usually get involved with band member stuff. Too much like hard work. Cardinal Wurzel (talk) 14:04, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
replies: text: what's more, SJD herself hinted that Jon was never an official member of the group. He filled in for tour and yes, performed on the first version of Dusk..., but wasn't legally considered a member. So i feel really confused about that. Maybe he was supposed to become one, but left the band too shortly. Maybe it's now appropriate to list him in a members section since his contributions, but technically he wasn't a member durning his tenure in a band. 31.207.230.72 (talk) 14:28, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

text: Was Sarginson wrote that in a comment section of Scars & Guitars podcast with Sara Jezebel Deva. His profile is PappaWas1975. I also remember metalarchives CoF's page had two different profiles for the bassist in 1991-1992 and 1994-1995. Not sure about now, but funny enough, Darren White was listed as their drummer for years there. 31.207.230.72 (talk) 14:14, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Jon Kennedy