Talk:Sweeney Todd: The Demon Barber of Fleet Street

message: Citation needed here! A Google search for "RJ Blindside" yields few results: this Wikipedia page, and its copies on abitabouteverything.com, explodingproduce.com Answers.com! Does this company even exist? ▫ UrbaneLegend talk 10:56, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: RJ Blindside - who? 

message: This was a mess. Several facts were mentioned multiple times, and the "synopsis," far longer than the Wikipedia recommendation, was ridiculously lengthy and detailed, including everything except the stage directions. I pared it down to a concise description, removed duplicated data, and reorganized everything into chronological order. Hopefully this version will satisfy even the most finicky editors. SFTVLGUY2 20:29, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: * Generally much better.  I readded the infobox with the image incorporated. -- Upholder 21:01, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

text: * I would have liked at least some idea of the scene structures and plot to have remained - now it's just generic. Any chance of a compromise - an edited (but not destroyed) plot summary - please? (1st April 2007)81.86.132.52 23:00, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

text: * I would also like a revised plot analysis. Remember, concise is not a synonym for castrated. --24.94.142.242 00:41, 6 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Article clean-up

message: :Image:GeorgeHearn2.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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thread_title: Fair use rationale for Image:GeorgeHearn2.jpg

message: Gigantic kudos on the restrained, well-written summary. Oh, but I do agree with the above that a more in-depth description wouldn't be out of place. Anchoress 05:35, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Summary 

message: An editor added  some details to the summary recently, and I deleted a phrase describing Tobias (at the end of the show), concerning his hair. There is a phrase in the MTI plot synopsis: "Tobias appears, his hair now completely white from shock.", which is perhaps where the editor's addition came from (I always say I don't like to read into anothers' mind, that goes here as well). I did not see the original but I have seen something like 4 or 5 different productions of Sweeney Todd, and I can't say that I remember anything at all about Tobias' hair turning at the end. However, if other editors think it should be there, by all means return it. It certainly does enhance the final image of Tobias. JeanColumbia 11:31, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Recent edits

message: I think this is now the Gershwin Theatre?  -- Ssilvers 21:59, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes--George Gershwin TheatreJeanColumbia 23:08, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Uris Theatre

message: An editor added:
:During the Fourth Season of The Simpsons, in the episode "A Streetcar Named Marge", there was a song called "Oh, Streetcar!" about New Orleans being "home of pirates, drunks, and whores," among other things. In the commentary of the Fourth Season DVD Jeff Martin, the writer for that episode, said that this was intended as a spoof of the opening number in Sweeney Todd. This got the show in trouble with New Orleans. In response to the complaints, the producers "apologized" in the blackboard gag of the next episode, as Bart writes, "I will not defame New Orleans" to defuse the whole controversy and it did eventually blow over. 
This was deleted.  It may be interesting information, since The Simpsons are an important cultural barometer, but it is too long and repetitive.  Also, it fails to show how the song was a parody of the opening number in Sweeney Todd.  If we delete the last sentence of it, which has nothing to do with Sweeney, and explain how "Oh, Streetcar!" parodies Sweeney, then I think the reference could go under the heading of "Cultural references."  I would shorten the whole thing as follows:
:The episode "A Streetcar Named Marge" from the fourth season of The Simpsons, includes a song called "Oh, Streetcar!" about New Orleans being "home of pirates, drunks, and whores."  In the commentary of the Fourth Season DVD, Jeff Martin, the episode's writer, says that the song was intended as a spoof of the opening number in Sweeney Todd. [did he say why?/explain how it is a spoof] 
Best regards, -- Ssilvers 20:28, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Cultural references

message: Is everyone ok with the move of "Sweeney Todd (musical)" to "Sweeney Todd, the Demon Barber of Fleet Street"? --DrBat 17:17, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: How about "Sweeney Todd, the Demon Barber of Fleet Street (musical)"? At the moment, a search for 'sweeney todd' (all lower case) returns a list of related articles, and for consistency with "Sweeney Todd, the Demon Barber of Fleet Street (2007 film)" this article should perhaps maintain its disambiguation in the title. Feyrauth (talk) 07:39, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with your suggestion, or perhaps simply 'Sweeney Todd (musical)'. My question is, why does the film's title use a colon, but the musical's name uses a comma to separate from the subtitle? As far as I've seen, both are shown (on posters, playbills, and such) as "SWEENEY TODD The Demon Barber of Fleet Street" (albeit the text 'Sweeney Todd' sometimes not in caps), often with the subtitle 'The Demon Barber of Fleet Street' shown in smaller print below 'Sweeney Todd'. Mizu onna sango15/水女珊瑚15 15:20, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

text: Support "Sweeney Todd, the Demon Barber of Fleet Street (musical)", for reasons of consistency, locatablity and correct title use. Rotovia (talk) 01:44, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

text: I support Rotovia (ergo, my opinion is slightly changed), for reasons of consistency and to avoid mix-up, especially since the new film. However, I am still confused by the use of the colin versus comma. On the film's DVD case and on the title card, the title contains no punctuation between "Sweeney Todd" and "The Demon Barber of Fleet Street" (Musical as film). Thus, why are the titles of the film and musical written in the way it is? Mizu onna sango15/水女珊瑚15 01:54, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Title 

message: "In 1846, a young sailor, Anthony Hope rides a ship into London."
What's the source for this?  Is it from the script?  The String of Pearls was published in 1846, the Sweeney Todd page varies between "a historical figure who committed his crimes around 1800.", and "appearing in various English language works starting in the mid-19th century", but is never so specific. PRB (talk) 11:09, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  1846 

message: I do not consider the vocal ranges given in Stage Agent to be reliable.  Discussions among the editors at WP:MUSICALS have consistently concluded that vocal ranges in articles about musicals are generally not helpful.  We have not made this into an "official" guideline, since there may be some musicals for which the score's vocal ranges are so clearly well-established that noting the vocal range may be of some value.  I do not feel strongly about this one (it is often played by opera companies, and I doubt that different productions change keys too often), and I don't see any egregiously ludicrous designations, but if you think about calling Johnny Depp a bass-baritone, I think you will see that it is kinda silly.  -- Ssilvers (talk) 15:13, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Johnny Depp a Bass-Baritone? That is rather silly. :P But, I don't see what harm it does to mention vocal ranges for operas and stage musicals, (etc.) only. Mentioning the vocal ranges for the characters in the film adaptation would be useless, and is generally unverifiable, as whether Johnny Depp is a Bass-baritone or a tenor doesn't really matter, but, on the other hand, whether or not George Hearn/Len Cariou is does, therefore I say keep, as it is useful and verifiable— it's all just a matter of finding reliable sources to back it up. Unless this goes directly against Wikipedia policy, there's not much reason do delete. --Mizu onna sango15/水女珊瑚15 19:20, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

text: Do you have a reference source to back up your claims? The one cited in this article says otherwise. --DAJF (talk) 05:39, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

text: Yes I do. Its says Mrs. Lovett is a contralto. . Tribal44 (talk) 17:09, 6 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: That's the revival version with Patti Lupone. They transposed the music down for her.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.152.189.93 (talk) 23:09, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

text: It might not be accurate. Check with the admin. Tribal44 (talk) 18:37, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

text: How do I ask an admin? lol  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.81.204.94 (talk) 05:11, 7 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Vocal ranges

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thread_title: Image copyright problem with Image:Sweeneylarge.jpg

message: The synopsis added on October 6, 2009 (by IP 71.184.148.68) was a cut& paste from the MTI Shows synopsis @ []. That is a copy violation per WP:COPY and so I have reverted to the previous good synopsis. (FYI, the Terms of Use on the MTI site states, in part: "All materials and content contained in any MTI Site, including without limitation all text, data, images of any kind, audio, video, site design, and software (collectively, “Content”), are the copyrighted property of MTI, or its subsidiaries or affiliated companies and/or third-party owners. All trademarks, logos, service marks, trade names and trade dress are proprietary to MTI, its affiliates and/or third party owners, and unauthorized use thereof is prohibited by law. You may not copy, reproduce, transfer, republish, upload, post, transmit, broadcast or distribute Content in any way or in any media now known or hereafter devised except for your personal, noncommercial home use only...")
JeanColumbia (talk) 10:58, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: October 2009: Copy violation

message: Okay, so I've noticed that individual characters in the musical seem to have their own articles, and that every main character save for Anthony has their own article. I seriously think that these do not meet standards of notability - Pirelli, for example, is a fairly minor character who dies halfway through the first act. Unless someone can greatly expand on different versions of the character (if they even exist, more on that later), then perhaps that'd be useful for comparison. As it is, the articles serve no purpose other than to give brief snippets of the plot of the musical, and only the musical.
Furthermore, some of the articles are just inaccurate. The article on Lucy Barker is probably the most glaring, because it assumes that the events of the musical are part of the typical Sweeney Todd legend, when in fact the revenge storyline is present only in Bond's play and Sondheim's musical (and the movie based on the musical).
Obviously, characters like Sweeney Todd himself and and Mrs. Lovett may warrant articles, and maybe even other important characters such as Tobias Ragg (who does figure into other versions of the legend), but I think the number of articles here is rather unnecessary. 24.152.189.91 (talk) 07:55, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Overload on Character Articles 

message: Trying to do some general tidying of this article – some of the additional productions and additions seem to be getting out of hand. A big part was reducing the "productions" section of the infobox. Here it is, saved for posterity:
By my count, that was 27 productions – I think that's too many for an infobox where readers need a "quick clip" of the article. My general removal methodology was twofold:
# If it wasn't mentioned (or wasn't mentioned extensively) in the prose of the article, then it didn't belong in the infobox.
# Productions that maintained generally the same staging or concept were only listed the first time. This cut out the first U.S. Tours and some others. (Although the 2005 Broadway revival was an exception to this rule – although it brought the staging over from the 2004 West End production, I think it's Tony Nominations make it a little more nontable.)
I'm totally open to suggestions on this. If there's a good reason one of the above productions should go back in the box, let's talk about why! --omtay38 19:43, 27 May 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox Production changes 

message: How come George gets so little credit, both here and on the other Sweeney Todd page ? He's not even listed there, and barely listed here. He did a great Sweeney, both on Broadway and touring and in the SF concert version with Patti Lupone (tho I think Angela Lansbury's interpretation was more suited to the spirit of the musical, even though Patti Lupone is generally wonderful.) Can someone with more experience correct this miscarriage of justice ? 210.22.142.82 (talk) 12:52, 24 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  George Hearn 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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message: The current plot summary is roughly 1,600 words long. The guideline for musicals caps out at 1,100. While I recognize that this is not cast in concrete and exceptions are always possible, the current summary seems to be overly detailed.
Thoughts before I begin trimming? - SummerPhDv2.0 01:42, 1 May 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Summary length 

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