Talk:RCTV

message: I'm removing mention of the referendum which Reporters Without Borders claimed, since Venezuela's info minister claims they were lying.  Further, Wikipedia's own entry on RWB casts doubt on its bias within Latin America.  -- Tayssir 02:06, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: There is a BBC headline about a protest in Caracas over RCTV.  Can someone quote it onto this article?  --DanCBJMS via 134.117.168.237 06:34, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Reporters Without Borders

message: Please, verify the credibility of the Human Rights Foundation. Its president Thor Halvorssen is (or was) member of an "advocacy group" per request of Carlos Ortega (former labor movement president) and Carlos Fernández(former head of chamber of commerce) who were the leaders of the 2002 strike/lockout, a failed attemp to overthrow Chávez government. JRSP 23:20, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Verify credibility of this organization

message: I propose we rename the Criticism section into something along the lines of Opposition and/or Shutdown controversy given the current happenings with RCTV, or at least make it a subsection. And why haven't I read anything on the mass protests against its shutdown? Reuters article on protests Franck Drake 06:04, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Current Event Status & Proposed Renaming of section? 

message: I updated some, had to mention briefly two things, first as of Saturday RCTV has shut down its live internet stream, and for those broadcast history buffs (like me) had to make mention of the final program airing on RCTV.
On a personal note, someone should know where to send the idea to 1BC to have RCTV FULLY on the internet as well as on cable/satellite.  The protest got a bit tense by the way and water cannons were being used, Im providing "Live" Instant coverage as I am watching the live feed of Globovision of the demonstration, hope its ok Lugnuts6 23:42, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  RCTV Update

message: I found this Youtube clip of RCTV's last 12 minutes. Maybe we can write more about its final minutes. It appears like Guardian messed up the order of events in the last broadcast in an article about RCTV closure(there is a link to it at TVes's article)... Tarmo Tanilsoo 13:07, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Final moments 

message: Needs to be cleaned up and re-written for neutrality. There are egregious violations on both sides. Notably, single sources that are part of the controversy are used as authoritative (ie HRW) and statements of support are not sourced. Thanks!--Cerejota 11:47, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I also notice some weasel-wording and original research. Please, don't!--Cerejota 11:49, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shutdown section 

message: Article: The truth about RCTV (29-May 2007)
CaribDigita 14:11, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Not a reliable source.  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:42, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  RCTV failing to pay taxes to the Telecommunications Commission 

message: According to this BBC article (fouth section from bottm) RCTV is still avaliable on cable-tv. To me that would disqualify it from beeing called "defunct". --Jonte-- 19:08, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That is my understanding, but it is defunct in terms of what it used to be (the most popular TV station accessed by "most" people).  Consider which segment of the population watched it most, and which have access to cable TV in Venezuela.  It's effectively defunct, although theoretically still operating; not sure if that can be fixed from the sourced material?  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:10, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  But the main problem is that the article then cofirms that the station was "shut down" by the government while it in reality only lost it's service on the public tv-net. --Jonte-- 19:38, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Based on my personal knowledge (without combing the sources), I believe you are correct and the wording should reflect that.  What it means is more brainwashing of the masses, as they have less access to cable tv, and in my personal experience, RCTV was the more preferred at lower incomes (not sure if there is a reliable source to back that up, though).  Anyway, as to whether you can adjust the "defunct" in the text, it's a matter of what the sources say, but I think you're correct.  If there is a source which explains how this impacts the lower income groups, it would be good to explain that. (It's also probably part of why Chavez chose RCTV and not one of the other channels. It's all in the same vein as the indoctrination that is now beginning in the schools — start with RCTV, the channel watched by the popular classes.)  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:46, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Well, I am just as biased as you, as a Chavéz supporter I am happy that RCTV finally lost their license after repeted violations agianst the regulations. But our personal opinions should not reflect a wikipedia article. We must make them as neutral as they can get. --Jonte-- 20:16, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: As I said, your text should say what the sources say, not what we know to be the case, in the event reliable sources haven't reported it (I don't know if a reliable source reports on the population segments that are affected by the RCTV shutdown).  By "regulations", I'm assuming you're referring to the restrictions Chávez put on freedom of the press, so that he couldn't be criticized.  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 20:27, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Sandy, the law that allowed Chavez to do this is from 1987, long before Chavez was in power. You are obviously not neutral on this issue, and perhaps it would be best if you let it go for a day or two. Zocky | picture popups 15:54, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Reliable sources for your edits, please.  Thanks, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 20:17, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

text: That could be because of 2 things. 1)He wants America's good will at any cost, or 2)He'll clamp it down the same way he clamped down on RCTV. No new licence. Much more legal (if any of them are) this way.DARK 15:22, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Is RCTV shutdown? 

message: There are four stubby sections in the middle of the article; each of one sentence or less.  They should be merged to one, with the correct use of combined templates at the top of the section per WP:GTL.  A section for one sentence doesn't look good for an article linked on the main page.  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:25, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Stubbiness

message: I am a bit concerned that this article is starting to suffer from Recentism. Almost a third of the article now is about the recent shut down. Perhaps some of this detailed content should be moved to May 2007 RCTV protests (and that article could be renamed to something more like 2007 RCTV shutdown. Thanks. Zzyzx11 (Talk) 19:26, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree, but ... Might make more sense to do that after it's off the main page, because it will just get added back in while it's there.  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:29, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recentism 

message: Can anyone explain the neutrality tag on the Reasons section?  What important information is left out, given undue weight, or what imbalance needs to be addressed (please provide reliable sources backing up claims).  Unless specifics are provided, it can't be addressed. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 20:42, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Neutrality tag explanation needed 

message: Venezuela is in the midst of a socialist revolution in which a broad range of industries deemed central to the peoples interest are being nationalized . Some mention of this seems appropriate. Lycurgus 21:35, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Context

message: I find this section pretty misleading. Reasons:
* On the first paragraph it says "thereby forcing the channel to cease operations on that day." and quotes a BBC article. This is false, the decision forced the channel to end its over the air transmissions, which is extremely different from ceasing operations. Evidence to that effect can be seen on YouTube (for example )were editions of the News segment of the station can be seen.
* In the second paragraph it says "Venezuelan Supreme Court of Justice (TSJ)—controlled by Chávez allies" uses the relationship with Chavez to create the impression that the decision is unfair or illegal. Should be rewritten so that someone without knowledge of the Venezuelan situation does not get the impression that the decision is unfair because of them being Chávez's allies. Perhaps quote the  real reasons for being unfair or illegal. 
* "Supreme Court ordered RCTV to stop broadcasting as soon as its license expires and approved the government's takeover of all of its equipment and stations, though it would review the station's appeal of the decision." The takeover was temporal pending the appeal from RCTV. The article must state that.
* "...preparation for its forced close-down on Sunday," Extremely misleading, the channel was not closed down, its lease on a public frequency elapsed. Closing down implies being out of business. Although someone could argue that taking the frequency might lead to being forced out of business it is not the same thing. RCTV can continue to air in cable networks which is a proven business model and therefore does not automatically imply being forced out of business. Besides, the government decision did not force them to take down its Internet stream, they chose to do it themselves and the article does not reflect this.
--Carlos5678
: How could they be able to broadcast without equipment? Tarmo Tanilsoo 11:44, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Only the equipment used to broadcast in open air TV was taken by the government, the equipment required to produce TV was not taken. --Carlos5678 200.84.244.180 19:21, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Shutdown Dispute

message: I noticed that RCTV's Internet stream is working, but I don't know what channel it does show... Tarmo Tanilsoo 12:16, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Internet stream 

message: If we can't "connect the dots" on the Datanalysis survey, an alternate solution is to delete all info about the Datanalysis survey (since the suggestions above are that it's allegedly biased).  There's an alternate source today, a Hinterlaces survey showing 83% opposed.  http://english.eluniversal.com/2007/06/01/en_pol_art_eighty-three-percent_01A878331.shtml  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 01:10, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: This article  reports both Datanálisis and Hinterlaces forecasting a close race in the 2004 Recall Referendum. Contrast this with Seijas predicting Chávez winning in almost all States as it actually happened. Just in case, Seijas is not pro-Chávez, he's more related to AD. JRSP 01:59, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: As long as you can source it, it seems reasonable to add that these firms have been off before.  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:03, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  In fact, they changed their forecast a few days before the Referendum, pointing towards a Chávez victory. BTW, the Datanálisis poll also said that there was not a big concern about loss of freedom of speech, the main concern was the telenovela JRSP 02:22, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: That doesn't surprise me; I'd consider that addendum a good addition, if others agree.  SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:27, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Alternate solution

message: I mean the May 2007 RCTV protests, about the role of students, concerning freedom of speech in te country. My note is in the talk page of that article.
--Alex Coiro 06:13, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  There is nothing said about the student protests 

message: Shoudnt a new article be created about the shutdown- a seperate article? Arigont 16:50, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Article 

message: I'm not sure Condoleeza Rice is the best person to illustrate "international criticism". Outside of a minority of Americans her administration is regarded around the world as reckless and imperialist. It would be better to have a quote from a somewhat more neutral organization like Reporters Without Borders (although even they have problems), or from a European leader.
Eleland 13:48, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  I doubt that a majority of Americans regard their own government as reckless and imperialist.  Quoting her is just fine.  Kevinp2 15:48, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  And a majority of Russians do not regard their government as reckless or imperialist.  Why do we not put in a quote by Vladimir Putin? 74.210.53.170 19:49, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

text: Wiki readers need to know what the US says (since Chávez targets the US in his foreign policy) *and* they need to know what broader international opinions are; one doesn't preclude the other.  Although it happens in this case that most are in sync. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 16:38, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Condi Rice quote 

message: I think the background section could be shortened. Must of the info in this section is available in the 2002 Venezuelan coup d'état attempt article. This section can be summarized to focus in the relation between the role of RCTV in the coup and the loss of its license. JRSP 21:35, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Background section is too long

message: Following sentence from header sparked questions
Currently, RCTV continues to broadcast over the internet, and remains popular with viewers through this medium.
Well, station's internet stream is not working and their schedule hasn't updated since closedown. This sentence needs to be changed or removed unless it is verified. I understand from it like station is transmitting all its programs over the Internet, however I find no ability to watch it, only El Observador is available through Internet. Tarmo Tanilsoo 15:48, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  RCTV broadcasting online? 

message: The article sources that "RCTV also maintains the right to transmit TV programming via satellite and cable, both of which are widely available throughout Venezuela". According to all the numbers that I could find, this is false, at least in 2003-2004. The three largest cable operators account for 595.000 accounts , and the total multichannel penetration (Cable + DTH digital Terrestrial + Satellite) is 25.5%, which is anything but "widely available" (it is comparable to Greece and Spain, which, from completely different reasons have low penetration rates as well. I would agree, it is higher than much of South America, but South America has a very low penetration rate altogether) . --Xanthar 13:38, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Both "widely available" and "this has limited impact, because of a low penetration rate for cable" are POV. I think the article should just say "RCTV also maintains the right to transmit TV programming via satellite and cable". Any qualification of low/high must be supported by (and attributed to) reliable sources and not by editors' opinions. JRSP 15:43, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Cable is widely available in Venezuela???

message: In the last revision I edited, I found duplicate named references, i.e. references sharing the same name, but not having the same content. Please check them, as I am not able to fix them automatically :) 
* "RSF" :
** 
** 
** 
DumZiBoT (talk) 23:13, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bot report : Found duplicate references ! 

message: Yep, It got closed again, it isnt streaming anymore and the site is down  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.109.41.148 (talk) 05:14, 24 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Closed Again 

message: I know it's a major episode, but the amount of detail on this is huge. It may be trimmable (there's a lot of coup background), but maybe a better solution would be to move it to its own article. There's a lot of overlap with media representation of Hugo Chavez, for instance. Rd232 talk 14:20, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: ah, just found (up this page) May 2007 RCTV protests which any spin-off of the licence episode should surely be merged with. PS In Jan 2010 RCTV broadcast the current Fedecamaras President calling for a "military solution" to the current political situation.  I think if that happened in the US, they'd be off air before you can say Guantanamo... Rd232 talk 14:24, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  2007 loss of licence 

message: Why should be it be considered as a reliablly unbiased source of information (except for the illustrating the government's stance)? It is run by pro-Chávez apologists with ties to the Venezuelan government. The site presents itself as independent and "unbiased" when it is in fact it is not.
201.208.1.34 (talk) 09:44, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: That's just not true. News and opinion are clearly distinguished, and opinion is generally not un-critically pro-Chavez (the odd one that is sticks out embarrasingly). It reports facts which the international media virtually never report (just as the Venezuelan private media don't). Actual contradictions between VA and other sources are rare because the others just aren't interested in reporting the details. I'm reminded of that US quote about people being part of the "reality-based community". It's well established that the Venezuelan media try to create their own reality (cf Dingles 2005, Columbia Journalism Review), and the international reporters move in those circles and basically go on that. Rd232 talk 10:42, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  It's quite true, and has been discussed many times on Wikipedia; please stop introducing sources with a known bias.  And, RCTV has been well covered by international media, so your argument about Venezuela media doesn't hold up. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 11:27, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  if it's been that well covered then you'll have no trouble at all sourcing the same information from AP etc. Be my guest. Rd232 talk 11:40, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

text: Are you kidding? Venezuelanalysis do the exact same things that you're doing right now, which is overrepresent the government viewpoint (in an overly positive light that echoes the government line), whitewash any criticism and discredit, straw-bait or misrepresent those who criticize. 201.208.1.34 (talk) 09:03, 1 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Venezuelanalysis is a pro-Chávez site

message: I removed the text attributed to Mark Weisbrot, from the Guardian opinion piece. ("Economist, and Venezuela scholar, Mark Weisbrot said: "In Washington DC, if I try to broadcast on an FM radio frequency without a legal broadcast licence, I will be shut down. When this happens in Venezuela, it is reported as censorship. No one here will bother to look at the legalities or the details, least of all the pundits and editorial writers, or even many of the reporters.")
Reasons are:
# I don't think that opinion pieces are good sources, except for the author's opinion. In this case, Weisbrot already has a clear opinion on this issue, so his is not of a neutral economist, as seems to be implied. That is not to say that his opinion is unfounded, and his scholarly articles are certainly good WP:RS. But this case seems to be "supporter of Chávez says RCTV takedown OK". Well, yeah.
# The quote fails my personal idiot test. If the ABC news broadcast license were not renewed in the USA, and there were potential political reasons, it would be a massive scandal. So Weisbrot's comment doesn't seem useful at all to include in this article.
I am going to be without internet for a while after today, but those are my two cents. Awickert (talk) 15:51, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I agree with you that the quote should have been removed. However, as far as your second point, if ABC violated all sorts of FCC regulations, refused to pay taxes and fines, and openly participated in a coup attempt, I don't think there would be a big public outcry over press freedom if their license was not renewed. There would probably be (as in the case of RCTV) a lot of complaints about favorite TV shows going away, but I don't see people construing it as a "civil liberties" issue. Anyhow, just thought I'd point out that this wasn't a "decision not to renew due to political reasons", as much as a "decision not to renew due to repeated and egregious violations of the law". -- Jrtayloriv (talk) 17:53, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Weisbrot quote 

message: Article states "Since its return, RCTV has become the most watched channel in Venezuela (despite being on cable). Only 30% of houses have cable in Venezuela but the total amount that view RCTV is higher than all viewers of TVES, Venevision, and all other channels. In Caracas and in Valencia twice as many people view RCTV than Venevision.[93][verification needed]. I think someone requested verification because the link is broken. New link to the same article is here: http://fher-caminante.blogspot.com/2007/07/rctv-en-primer-lugar-de-sintona-en-su.html
I hate Chavez, but I don't think this source validates the point the above paragraph is trying to make. The source article was written in 2007, immediately after Chavez closed RCTV. My Spanish is intermediate; I only understand ~90% of the article. The problem I have with using this article is that it's statistics and numbers are only snapshots in time. It appears that on one day, "Caracas RCTV logró 22 por ciento, seguido por Venevisión con 13,6 por ciento y Globovisión con 7,4 por ciento. Valencia respondió con 19,5 por ciento a favor de RCTV, mientras que Venevisión obtuvo 10,4 por ciento y Globovisión 2,4 por ciento. En Barquisimeto la sintonía de RCTV se ubicó en 23 por ciento, mientras Venevisión fue vista por 15,2 por ciento y Globovisión por 9,2 por ciento." I don't think that the Wiki article correctly portrays the intent of the source article. The Wiki article makes it appear as though RCTV has had and still maintains higher viewership numbers than the other stations. If this was the case, the author of the source article would have said "Caracas RCTV ha logrado...." or "Caracas RCTV lograba...." But as the source article is written, on one day at one point in time, "Caracas RCTV logró..." --160.133.1.228 (talk) 15:52, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: In any case, source is a blog so it does not comply with WP:V and WP:RS. JRSP (talk) 20:15, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  RE: Verification Needed 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to  on RCTV. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add  after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add  to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive {newarchive} to http://www.mre.gov.ve/Noticias/A2007/caso_rctv/PRESENTACIONARGUMENTACIONCASORCTV.pps
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).
Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 23:25, 29 February 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 12 external links on RCTV. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070902120507/http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=20218 to http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=20218
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070916192754/http://www.petroleumworld.com/SF07050601.htm to http://www.petroleumworld.com/SF07050601.htm
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120825131253/http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/financialpost/story.html?id=b933e559-6697-4d8a-a270-51b9a1e7be56&k=39793 to http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/financialpost/story.html?id=b933e559-6697-4d8a-a270-51b9a1e7be56&k=39793
*Added  tag to http://politica.eluniversal.com/2007/05/25/rctv_ava_estudiantes-de-la-uc_25A874209.shtml
*Added  tag to http://politica.eluniversal.com/2007/05/25/rctv_ava_ucevistas-protestaro_25A874355.shtml
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070928061613/http://www.sipiapa.com/pressreleases/srchcountrydetail.cfm?PressReleaseID=1828 to http://www.sipiapa.com/pressreleases/srchcountrydetail.cfm?PressReleaseID=1828
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070901111430/http://english.eluniversal.com/2007/05/18/en_pol_art_insulza%3A-rctv-case-w_18A870835.shtml to http://english.eluniversal.com/2007/05/18/en_pol_art_insulza%3A-rctv-case-w_18A870835.shtml
*Added archive https://archive.is/20130122060100/http://english.eluniversal.com/2007/06/11/en_pol_art_insulza-hopes-venezu_11A883121.shtml to http://english.eluniversal.com/2007/06/11/en_pol_art_insulza-hopes-venezu_11A883121.shtml
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070617073637/http://www.freemedia.at/cms/ipi/statements_detail.html?ctxid=CH0055&docid=CMS1180432968135 to http://www.freemedia.at/cms/ipi/statements_detail.html?ctxid=CH0055&docid=CMS1180432968135
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070701220243/http://caracas.usembassy.gov/news_en.asp?news=114 to http://caracas.usembassy.gov/news_en.asp?news=114
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070703162210/http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/news-1773--12-12--.html to http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/news-1773--12-12--.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070624125601/http://www.noticias24.com/actualidad/?cat=16 to http://www.noticias24.com/actualidad/?cat=16
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100116074924/http://www.freerctv.com/ to http://www.freerctv.com/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070705132422/http://www.rnv.gov.ve/noticias/docs/libro_blanco_RCTV-Web.pdf to http://www.rnv.gov.ve/noticias/docs/libro_blanco_RCTV-Web.pdf
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 15:31, 18 September 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  External links modified