Talk:Cosmotheism (classical)

message: Please provide some evidence/sources that "Classical" Cosmotheism exists independent of the cosmotheism of Pierce. --BM 19:39, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Perhaps it would be more accurate to say: "Cosmotheism was a synonym for Pantheism until its meaning was hijacked by White Supremacists." --Goethean 19:47, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I must say that I've never come across the term outside Wikipedia.  It isn't mentioned in the main philosophical text on the subject of pantheism, Michael P. Levine's Pantheism: A non-theistic concept of deity (1994, London: Routledge).  I'm inclined to suggest that this be made a redirect to pantheism. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 20:24, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I've never heard of it before either. --Goethean 20:27, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: That looks right to me.  Shall we wait a day or two to say if there's any objection from people who are actually involved with the page, and then do it? Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 08:21, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: I'm inclined to think that the nature and tone of this response makes it count as evidence for making the page a redirect.  I did do a Goggle search, with the results that I mentioned above.  The claims made by 216.45.198.137 are thin, to say the least. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 19:22, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: Oh good grief; "LOL! :D"?  (And what did your first sentence mean?) If "cosmotheism" is part of ancient thought, what exactly is the reason supposed to be for Google censoring it?
How about this reason?
http://www.nationalvanguard.org/printer.php?id=4789
If Google is, as you claim, censoring pages for political reasons, and this affects the hits for 'Cosmotheism', then you agree that cosmotheism is political rather than religious? Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 20:57, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: A search for "Jan Assman" plus "cosmotheism" gets exactly two hits on Google, both reviews, neither supporting your assertions. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 16:52, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: I have just e-mailed Prof. Assman to ask him if he would be prepared to look at the article and at this discussion (I've provided the URLs) and give his opinion. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 17:10, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: What any of the above has to do with pantheism is anyone's guess. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 17:23, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: I haven't heard back from him yet, but what I've seen about his work suggests very strongly that he'll think most of the stuff on this page, and from our anon on the Talk page, is nonsense.  And my general view is the same as yours.  Still, I'll reserve judgement for the moment.  Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 18:22, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Does this exist? 

message: This (omitting salutations, etc.) is the full text of Jan Assman's reply:
:“thank you for alerting me to what is going on in the internet. In taking up the term 'cosmotheism' from Lamoignon de Malesherbes who seems to have coined it in 1782 with regard to Pliny the Elder, I had no idea that there was such a thing as a "cosmotheism church" founded by an extreme right wing American Neonazi. Only the internet creates such a neighbourhood  with people and ideas with which one would least wish to be associated. It is perhaps important to stress the fact that terms such as pantheism, monotheism, polytheism and, of course, cosmotheism are not antique.”
That is BS! You could have written such "nonsense" yourself,
for all we know. Let Jan Assman write his own post, right here,
and without your having edited it. The term "cosmotheism" is far 
older than "1782 and Lamoignon de Malesherbes who seems to have coined it in 1782 with regard to Pliny the Elder", it is actually
an "archaic" term or is ancient Egyptian-Greek. The "Cosmotheism Community Church" was not founded by "an extreme right wing 
American Neonazi", whatsoever. That is really just deliberately
and factually-incorrect political slander. And while it is true
that the terms such as "pantheism, monotheism, polytheism" are not antique, however, the term "cosmotheism", actually is "archaic"
or it actually is "ancient". Prove to us that Jan Assman wrote
this for himself, as you have lied and have not shown your own 
factual sources and your citations before "reverting" before.-ANON
It doesn't get us much forrarder, to be honest (though it's nice to have confirmed what I hadn't in fact doubted, that Assman is innocent of any taint of Pierce's poison).  My position is still, then, to merge whatever of this article is of any interest with pantheism, and redirect this article either there or to Pierce. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 18:40, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It's hardly worth replying to this, but if you want to check with Prof. Assman, hs e-mail address is on the Heidelberg Website, which is where I found it, and you can ask him yourself.  It would be pretty stupid of me to make such an easily refutable claim. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 16:14, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: I agree. A single sentence in the pantheism article on Pierce's unique usage of Cosmotheism might be helpful for the wayward. --Goethean 19:34, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, I think that it's time we did that.  Which do you think this should be redirected to: pantheism or Pierce? Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 15:10, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

text: Pantheism.  I think there is one sentence in Pantheism about "cosmotheism".  It should be expanded slightly to state that while "cosmotheism" has sometimes been used by academics and others for forms of pantheism, it has most recently been used mainly for the sect originated by Pierce, etc, etc.  --BM 15:35, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, I'll do that then. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 16:14, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Prof. Assman's response 

message: It's been determined that 216.45.221.155 (talk · contributions) is in fact Paul Vogel.  I've banned 216.45.221.155 for an initial period of 24 hours until I can ascertain the proper procedure with an IP-address sockpuppet of a banned User. Mel Etitis  (Μελ Ετητης) 21:14, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: 216.45.221.155/Paul Vogel