Talk:Numbers (TV series)

message: The website link given in the right side bar is, effectively, dead.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.102.89.109 (talk) 00:27, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dead Link 

message: It is incorrect to name the article "Numbers". The substitution of "3" for the "e" was always part of the shows title. I'll paste a link to CBS as a reference at the bottom. If I can figure out how to rename, I'll do it myself, or perhaps someone else would like to do it. Of course, perhaps someone disagrees, but in this case correcting Numb3rs to Numbers is actually incorrect!  Link: http://eyelab.cbs.com/update_02_05/index.html BashBrannigan (talk) 05:18, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Numbers is not the name of the show. Enigmamsg 04:56, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Nope, per MOS:TM we should not be substituting letters with numbers however the title is styled: "choose the style that most closely resembles standard English, regardless of the preference of the trademark owner".  The show is called "numbers" not "numb-three-ers".  See Se7en, etc.  --Rob Sinden (talk) 08:56, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: We are not substituting anything. The show was always called Numb3rs. It was never called Numbers. Look at the CBS website. Enigmamsg 17:10, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Netflix lists it as Numb3rs as well.  For what that is worth.  Dbrodbeck (talk) 20:34, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Pretty sure it's listed as that everywhere. That's the actual title. The example of "Se7en" is different, because they had alternative names. The movie poster on the page even says "Seven". Numb3rs is never referred to as "Numbers". It's not a matter of the preference of the trademark owner. There is no "preference". Preference comes into play when there are alternate spellings. That is not the case here. There is only one correct title. If you're not going to use the correct title, you may as well call it "asparagus". Enigmamsg 22:52, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Again, "choose the style that most closely resembles standard English, regardless of the preference of the trademark owner".  "NUMB3RS" is NOT standard English, and in standard English, it is pronounced "numbers".  --Rob Sinden (talk) 08:49, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

text: And here are links to The Hollywood Reporter, TV Guide, Deadline, Chicago Tribune and The New York Times referring to the show as "Numbers".  --Rob Sinden (talk) 09:10, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: Not the first factual error the New York Times has made, that's for sure. They got the title wrong. I think CBS would know the name of their own show. Enigmamsg 18:46, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

text: The guideline is at MOS:TM#Trademarks that begin with a lowercase letter.  As for the reason, you may have to search the archives.  --Rob Sinden (talk) 11:42, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: It doesn't matter what the "official" title is.  We use standard English.  Again, "choose the style that most closely resembles standard English, regardless of the preference of the trademark owner".  --Rob Sinden (talk) 09:11, 14 January 2014 (UTC)

text: And if you get here by typing Numb3rs, then you have been redirected and you have found what you need, so there is no problem.  That's what redirects are for.  --Rob Sinden (talk) 09:33, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: It needs to be worded neutrally, which it wasn't, and it wasn't properly completed.  You also !voted for both oppose and support!  --Rob Sinden (talk) 13:50, 14 January 2014 (UTC)

text: Also, an RFC probably isn't appropriate - try a WP:RM.  --Rob Sinden (talk) 13:52, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: I still feel that it isn't worded neutrally. It conveniently omits the fact that WP:MOS guidelines are crystal-clear as to what the title should be. This is an attempt to circumvent the normal procedure of proposing a change to the guidelines and allowing the preferences of a handful of editors override site-wide precedent. Such a scenario, while not impossible, would require an unusually compelling argument. Joefromrandb (talk) 20:48, 5 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Title wrong 

message: *Numb3rs is generally used by many reliable English-language sources and is specific enough, which helps the reader. SciGal (talk) 18:08, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh and Numbers (TV series).  Per MOS:TM. -- MisterShiney ✉  13:24, 2 February 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Again, we do not source style, but rely on our own WP:MOS.  --Rob Sinden (talk) 11:43, 5 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: Survey

message: There has been much debate over which spelling is the common name for the show.  I ran a search on Google, and this is what I found.
Google Results (Accessed 31 January 2014)
*Numb3rs -wiki = 5,060,000 results
*Numbers +"TV series" -wiki = 6 results
*Numbers +"TV show" -wiki = 40 results
Google Books (Accessed 31 January 2014)
*Numb3rs -wiki = 4,870 results
*+Numbers +"TV series" -wiki = 1 results (was not relevant to the topic)
*+Numbers +"TV show" -wiki = 1 results (was not relevant to the topic)
Restricted Google Results
Restriction--site:.edu (Accessed 31 January 2014)
*site:.edu +Numb3rs -wiki = 4,760 results
*site:.edu +Numbers +"TV series" -wiki = 155 results (Most results are not relevant to the topic.)
*site:.edu +Numbers +"TV show" -wiki = 1 result
Rationale:  First, the restriction "site:.edu" does allow access to scholarly works.  Second, the show is set in academia.
Restriction--site:.gov (Accessed 31 January 2014)
*site:.gov +Numb3rs -wiki = 3,110 results
*site:.gov +Numbers +"TV series" -wiki = 155 results (Most results are not relevant to the topic.)
*site:.gov +Numbers +"TV show" -wiki = 142 result (Most results are not relevant to the topic.)
Rationale:  First, the National Science Foundation had awarded the show's creators with National Science Board's Public Service Award in 2007.  Also, the show is set in the FBI and has referenced the CIA, NSA, NTSB, CDC, NASA, and FermiLab in various episodes.
Restriction--site:.org (Accessed 31 January 2014)
*site:.org +Numb3rs -wiki = 189,000 results
*site:.org +Numbers +"TV series" -wiki = 68 results (Most results are not relevant to the topic.)
*site:.org +Numbers +"TV show" -wiki = 643 results (Most results are not relevant to the topic.)
Rationale:  I wanted to incorporate any results from academic professional organizations that are not listed under the "site:.edu" restriction.
SciGal (talk) 19:48, 31 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: This section was originally a section at the bottom of the page. I have moved it to be a subsection of the RfC, so that the closer will consider this analysis in his or her close. Cunard (talk) 10:36, 2 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  For your curiosity 

message: I'm trying to find which episode that has Charlie explaining to a class of students about how to choose between three doors,(like a game show) to decide which door has a car behind it. After picking a door and not finding the car, another chance to pick another door is offered. After picking another door the "picker then has the opportunity to change his mind. The question; does it improve your odds to change the decision or not. I remember that it's better to change your mind, but I can't remember why! Can you tell me which episode that was? Thanks,174.19.197.97 (talk) 05:41, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The Monty Hall problem is discussed in episodes 113 and 321.  Dbrodbeck (talk) 11:54, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Episode? 

message: I just added something of interest to the article. SciGal (talk) 22:19, 7 February 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  New addition to the article 

message: Series 3, episode 12 ("Nine Wives") has a vulture attacking the unconscious girl on the roadside. But it is a White-backed Vulture (Gyps africanus), range Africa. Why didn't they use an American vulture such as a Turkey Vulture or Black Vulture, either of which would have been realistic? Ptilinopus (talk) 20:29, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Out-of-place fauna 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

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