Wikipedia talk:WikiProject EastEnders/Archive 1

message: Hi. I'm interested in joining. Is User:EastEnders the great the only member? --User:4836.03 Oh yeah! i am cool! 11:25, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

message: love to help! Sweetie Petie 22:09, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  I would 

message: I'm not a member of this WikiProject, but according to the article on Peter Corey he was a actor on EastEnders who played someone called 'Vic the Crusher'. However, I can't find any mention on the web. Is this true? smurrayinchester(User), (Ho Ho Ho!) 10:16, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Question 

message: Could I adopt the articles about the cast? (List of past EastEnders characters by year of exit and List of characters from EastEnders) even though they don't need improvement, I would still like to adopt them... is that OK? Trampikey 10:49, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi Trampikey - note that I just made a bunch of changes to List of past EastEnders characters by year of exit based on the books I have on the show. Let me know if you'd like any information from any of them (I have, sadly, pretty much every factual book on the show, even Public Secrets) Stephenb (Talk) 19:15, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Adopting an article 

message: Several EastEnders character pages have lists of family members, but each one seems to have a different layout. Can we work out a standard format for them all? For example, should we list names and put the relationships after them, or the other way around? Should italics and/or bold be used? I don't mind sorting them out so they are all the same... Sweetie Petie 14:40, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think it should be (using Ian Beale as an example):
*Father: Pete Beale
*Mother: Kathy Hills
*Children: Lucy Beale, Peter Beale, Bobby Beale
*Siblings: Donna Ludlow, Ben Mitchell, David Wicks
*Uncles: Ted Hills, Kenny Beale
*Aunts: Pauline Fowler, Maggie Flaherty
*Cousins: Mark Fowler, Martin Fowler, Michelle Fowler, Conor Flaherty, Elizabeth Beale, Tony Hills, Sarah Hills, Simon Wicks
With normal text for the relationship, and italics for the character's name. Also, the order should go: Father, mother, children, siblings, uncles, aunts, cousins, paternal grandparents, maternal grandparents. Is that ok with everyone? Trampikey 19:13, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

text: *That's fine by me, I'll even make a start today if I'm not too busy... Sweetie Petie 20:31, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

text: *Oh by the way, should I put anything in particular in the 'Edit summary' section when changing these sections? Sweetie Petie 20:44, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Father, mother, spouse, children, brothers, sisters, paternal grandparents, maternal grandparents, uncles, aunts, cousins. OK? Trampikey 22:23, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I do go on, don't I? :) Sweetie Petie 22:53, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Just to mention: "half-brother" and "half-sister" are both hyphenated. Otherwise, keep up the good work :) Stephenb (Talk) 19:08, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Yeah, go ahead Sweetie Petie! (Note: Half-siblings can be included in "Brothers" and "Sisters" because the EastEnders families are so mucked up! Trampikey 23:51, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Rather than adopt an article, can I adopt the family sections? :) Sweetie Petie 12:46, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Here's what I think:
*Parents
*Grandparents
*Great grandparents
*etc
*Spouse
*Children
*Grandchildren
*Great grandchildren
*etc
*Siblings
*Step/half-siblings
*Uncles/aunts
*Great uncles/aunts
*etc
*Nephews/nieces
*Great nephews/nieces
*etc
*Cousins
*Cousins once removed
*Second cousins
*Second cousins once removed
*etc
I'm happy with that, but unsure whether groups like "siblings" should be used or separated into "brothers" and "sisters" Sweetie Petie 19:24, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Characters' family members 

message: Hi.
I strongly oppose two of this Wikiproject's rules: it is 100% incorrect both grammatically and in general common sense to still use the present tense for characters that are still alive but have left. Why do you think that magazines, newspapers, and various other articles refer to, for example, Tracey-Ann Oberman as "Tracey-Ann Oberman, the actress who played Chrissie Watts, who was a fictional character on the BBC soap EastEnders" etc.? The fact is, she ceases to play this character. Chrissie Watts was a character in the past, hence why the past tense is used.
The second thing is about families. Rather than making things unnecessarily long like father, mother, brothers, sisters etc. I propose the following order under the family section of each biography: parents, grandparents, (great-grandparents), (great-great grandparents), spouse (NOT ex-spouses, since they are not family, are they?!), children, (grandchildren), (great-granchildren), (great-great children), siblings, (uncles and aunts), first cousins, (all other first cousins (i.e., first cousins once/twice/thrice etc. removed, then all second cousins, third cousins etc. in numerical order).
What do you say?
:I like your idea about the family order thing, and agree with your point on ex-spouses, and I definitely agree with the bit about past tense. Past tense should be used because the character was in the show but isn't anymore, therefore they were a character in EastEnders, making the statement "Alfie Moon was a character in EastEnders" true. However, "Alfie Moon is a character in the fictional world of EastEnders" is also true, but as he is no longer in the show, Alfie is a past character, and that's how we should write these pages, as we are talking about things seen on screen, not things that happen after a character leaves the show. Anyone else agree? Trampikey 03:17, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll just do whatever the WikiProject page tells me to do. I do agree though, it's better this way. Not sure why the present tense was being used for past characters but I did my best to keep it all in line... now I'll do my best to put it back the other way! :) Sweetie Petie 01:20, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Changes Need to Be Made 

message: Sweetie Petie, I know you mean well, but if people want spoilers, they can go to sites that were made to provide spoilers. I know it isn't against the Wikipedia rules, but the spolier tags here are hardly noticeable and people may not want to read about who is going to die. Please could you wait until after the event has happened to add it to the articles? Thanks Trampikey 03:15, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I wasn't adding the spoilers, I was just adding the spoiler warnings and correcting the grammar. I'll leave it to others to decide it the spoilers should be there or not. Sweetie Petie 00:47, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Sure, I'll delete them if I come across them. To be honest I have seen a few on here that I didn't want to see but without warnings I didn't know they were spoilers! But I will delete them now. Sweetie Petie 19:24, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spoilers 

message: Someone is repeatedly moving Kacey Ainsworth to "Soon to Depart" on List of EastEnders Cast Members, I just want to know if I have any kind of authority to stop this as I have adopted the article? I have given clear, rational, logical reason why she should not be in "Soon to Depart", but the mystery editor keeps moving her, and it's just a waste of my time! If the problem persists and I hae no authority to stop it, I'll just keep editing it back, but if there is any way I can stop it, I would really like to know! Thanks Trampikey 03:51, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Maybe, you can refer this problem to an administrator. They should be able to help out. --Siva1979Talk to me 19:50, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Little Mo/Kacey Ainsworth 

message: Just a question regarding these two characters (can't think of any others that might apply at the moment). They're being refered to here as Frederick and Benjamin, but I'm thinking they were just named Freddie and Ben. I probably am wrong, but is there any official confirmation? Sweetie Petie 19:42, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Freddie Mitchell is DEFINITELY Frederick, I'm not sure about Ben/Benjamin though maybe Stephenb can look it up in one of the books! :) Trampikey 09:55, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

text: Heh!  Ben is the only name listed (in two books).  I can't ever recall him being named Benjamin, but that doesn't prove anything (see how popular Jack is these days, which used to be just a diminutive of Jonathan)... We need to see the birth certificate :) Stephenb (Talk) 16:12, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

text: LOL well that's hardly going to happen, so should we just use Ben if we don't know for certain that it is Ben? 
(we MIGHT find out when he returns this year)
Trampikey 03:17, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

text: I don't think we found out yet, did we? :S Sweetie Petie 17:23, 7 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No, I don't think so... I think he's just Ben, but I found out that Freddie is Frederick after Charlie's dad Frederick... Trampikey 21:41, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I kind of assumed he was named after Charlie's father, but how did you find out for sure? Sweetie Petie 11:04, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

text: I remember Mo saying when she returned for Graham's trial, and also looked at the family tree and saw that Charlie's dad was called Frederick... Trampikey 11:18, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Freddie Mitchell/Ben Mitchell 

message: Can we have an Eastenders Barnstar? -- 16:06, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: And can it have Dot Cotton's face in the middle? Sweetie Petie 17:49, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I was thinking of the Square Street sign. Is EETG still around? --Quentin Smith 12:34, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Remember, we can't use a fair use image if we're going to use anything. I haven't seen EETG around for months, I was going to list him on the missing Wikipedians list but never got around to it. Sweetie Petie 14:56, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Not watching the programme, I wouldn't know, but are there Eastenders "colors"? They do well on barnstars. And I'll list EETG as missing… --Quentin Smith 15:34, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

text:  User:Jayjg said - "please read the instructions on top; under 1000 edits, edits very intermittently, and has been gone for under a month". Fair play. Is no longer classed as missing. --Quentin Smith 18:15, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: EETG's last edit was on 16 February, two and a half months ago. He only made nine edits this year. As for colours.... maybe grey??? You don't watch EastEnders??? How odd. Sweetie Petie 20:23, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Barnstar 

message: The List of characters from EastEnders claims an actor called Alex Coombs plays a character called Jake Jones. I have been unable to find any verification of this at all. Could someone please check?
Capitalistroadster 11:27, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Neither name is listed on the IMDb... Sweetie Petie 12:04, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: http://www.google.co.uk/search?hs=tGv&hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&q=%22Alex+coombs%22%22Jake+Jones%22&btnG=Search&meta= --Quentin Smith 18:15, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Alex Coombs as Jake Jones

message: Scarlet (EastEnders) on the grounds of it no longer being the E20.
:The article now needs a major update. Also, Angie's Den should be merged into it and a redirect created, as it was E20, then Angie's Den and then Scarlet. Sweetie Petie 19:25, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I've just merged the two - the article now needs expanding. Sweetie Petie 20:12, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Article moved

message: --Quentin Smith 12:16, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Category:EastEnders Work in Progress]] 

message: Agree, I think it's a valid enough category to create, and as we have 5 articles (with potential for more) that could go in this category, I don't see why not! Trampikey 13:34, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: (How many votes do we need and how long until we can actually make the category?) Trampikey 13:52, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: lol - don't ask me! We have 8 members so I guess if 5 people agree then we should do it. But personally I think we should just make the category, it's not really a major change like putting all character pages in family subcats. Sweetie Petie 13:59, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I get what you're saying, but most of the members of the project are inactive! I say we should just make it! Trampikey 14:02, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that was a great vote. Shall I do it or do you want to? Shall we vote?! Sweetie Petie 14:03, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

text: All done! Trampikey 14:11, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Agree --Quentin Smith 14:19, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vote: Creation of [[:Category:EastEnders storylines]] 

message: If not by family, how do we split this category? Comments suggested. --Quentin Smith 14:20, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually I had thought of doing the same as Coronation Street - having a subcategory for past characters. (see :Category:Coronation Street characters) Sweetie Petie 14:28, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: OK - try it! I don't know if they're "Past Characters" or not - can you fix that? --Quentin Smith 15:19, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Let's see what Trampikey thinks first... Sweetie Petie 15:22, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Why does it need to be split? It's fine as it is sn't it? (And any Coronation Street articles are a bad example, they're all scrappy and bad apart from the main Coronation Street one!) Trampikey 23:05, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I wasn't using Corrie's articles as an example, just the category... well personally I don't have a problem with the size of the category, so we can keep it how it is. I just wish it was easier to know when a new article has been made. Sweetie Petie 10:56, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

text: It is! When Gungadin makes a new article s/he never puts it in the right alphabetical letter, so it's always at the top in "*"... in future I'll post the new articles here in the "New articles" section, would that be good enough? Trampikey 11:20, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Well sometimes (s)he does, I think. But normally by the time I find them, they've been put in the right alphabetical order. We should use the "new articles" section more, I'll certainly use it in future. I have a list of EastEnders articles I need to check that I go through when I have more time... I've never even read the main EastEnders article, something I MUST DO!!! Sweetie Petie 13:35, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

text: I have, it's quite good... I think it shuld be a featured article lol! Trampikey 13:51, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Give me a chance to improve it first :) Sweetie Petie 15:04, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

text: I just spent nearly 2 hours (with breaks) reading and editing the main article... not that there was much wrong with it!!! Sweetie Petie 21:35, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Splitting [[:Category:EastEnders characters]] 

message: This seems to have turned into a three person WikiProject. I wish EETG was here. --Quentin Smith 16:22, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I know... well, Gungadin adds good content and The JPS is good with copyrights (also I like that we have an admin on the team), but it looks like without EETG it's just the three of us, really... And you don't even watch the show! Sweetie Petie 16:36, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I wish I had more time to help you all... but you're all doing a great job, keep it up! Stephenb (Talk) 18:03, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks... we wish you had more time too ;) Sweetie Petie 18:08, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Hmm 

message: I don't know if anyone has noticed but on some of the character pages, I've moved the vertical bars in the infoboxes to the start of the line. This doesn't change the box at all, but it helps to preserve it when people add content to the boxes, as sometimes they remove the vertical by mistake; my change will avoid this happening. Can we try to keep the userboxes in this format from now on?  Also, something seems to have changed on the EastEnders Character template, which means leaving a space between the infobox and the main article text leaves a space at the top of the article. I've removed the space on several articles too. Sweetie Petie 19:29, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, I'll do that too from now on! The space thing is because some people (including me sometimes) hit return after the infobox and leave a line. Trampikey 20:08, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Leaving a line between the infobox and the text didn't used to leave a space at the top of the articles, several spaces have just recently appeared! That's why I'm blaming the template! Sweetie Petie 22:01, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox 

message: What's the source for her living in Balham with Billy, Carol and Alan? Trampikey 19:06, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: No idea, but have added the  template to the statement. Better to mention it on the talk page of the article rather than here, as a non-member of the project may have the source. Sweetie Petie 19:52, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Do you mean http://www.bbc.co.uk/eastenders/eastenders/characters/character_content/character_blossom_j.shtml? I can't see anything there.
No its a book by Kate Lock called Eastenders Who's who, it has biographical history of most of the EE characters giving info on them from before the show and what happened after they left. published in 2000 . It says " the hint of romance between Felix and Blossom remianed just that, and Blossom has since returned from Israel and is living with Alan and Billy"  Gungadin 18:59, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Can you put the citation in please? WP:CITE--Quentin Smith 07:42, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

text: I did it Trampikey 10:11, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, an extract of said book can be seen here, containing the information about Blossom. Trampikey 18:57, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Blossom Jackson]] 

message: The article credits Omer Mustafa Salih as the actor, but Ive got a book that says that actor played Little Ali Osman. Just wondered if anyone had a source to suggest that its actually Hassan. Sometimes these books get it wrong, so i thought id check.Gungadin 17:51, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Scroll down a bit... Trampikey 21:56, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Can people try to cite the BBC in these things? I can't find anything actual, but a good start point is here. --Quentin Smith 06:42, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Hassan Osman]] 

message: Please go and vote to keep this article! Trampikey 16:13, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have voted, and added a source to the article. It is extremely important that we have sources for these future characters, so if anyone has any other sources, please add them too. Sweetie Petie 09:55, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

text: Nonsense - just don't see the point of these articles - but it is a shame to see trolling in action ... --Brookie :) - a will o' the wisp ! (Whisper...) 07:10, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

text: They did Freya Coltman-West, so thanks for sorting it out. And thanks to The JPS for his little note on the talk page :) Sweetie Petie 18:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Kept due to no consensus. I will tag as future product. --Quentin Smith 18:02, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Lauren Branning]] 

message: I got the lovely cds to help with this one. I was seeing too much "unknown" in the infoboxes, or blank spaces, so they've been made optional now (eg Gavin Sharp's dob is not known so now it doesn't show on the infobox). This means now we can take out all the "unknown" and "none" entries, which will make it look nicer. I don't mind doing that all myself. One question: what do you think of the infobox colour?? Sweetie Petie 23:38, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox again 

message: Sweetie Petie has been blocked indefinitely!! :( Trampikey 07:50, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm looking into it. I've unblocked him until I'm given a good reason not to. The JPStalk to me 13:40, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: After several hours digging, I've finally been given an explaination to as why Sweetie Petie has been permablocked. It seems pretty solid, unfortunately. It looks like he has been blocked for legal reasons due to a conversation by a user confirmed as him. The JPStalk to me 16:56, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Oh no!