Talk:Rugby union gameplay

message: Data taken from rugby union article as it was too long and needed its own article.GordyB 20:09, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

message: First off, excellently written article. Thanks to all who contributed. Watching the current 2007 WRC, I still have a few queries - maybe they're in the article and I missed them, but if not...
* When a player picks up the ball from the rear of a ruck, they're usually careful to have one foot in front of the ball, and one behind. Why is this? Is it simply to make the subsequent pass easier, or is there a rule about this?
:No rule, it's just easier.GordyB 23:38, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: You can take a quick line-out if no opponents are in the area. This is what happened.GordyB 23:38, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

text: You can punt pretty much any of the time. Off the top of my head I can't think of a situation in open play where you could not punt.GordyB 23:38, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

text: Like a fair catch in American football. You get to make an unopposed catch if you are within your 22 metre line. It's to discourage teams from attacking solely by kicking (since the defenders can defend easily by calling for the mark).GordyB 23:38, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: A slight clarification for those using American football as a comparison: in American football the catcher signals his intent to make a fair catch and once he's done so it's an offence to tackle him; in rugby (union), the catcher can't call for the fair catch until he's in the act of catching the ball, and he can be tackled while attempting to do so; it's not an unopposed catch and it's only an offence to tackle him after the ref has blown his whistle.  Also, until relatively recently it was possible to call for a 'mark' outside one's 22;  as I recall, this was the case during the 1987 RWC. - Jimmy Pitt (talk) 19:58, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ruck clarification? 

message: Hi All!  Great article,  although there is nothing to say how the game ends.  I have to explain this to my friends every time the clock hits 80 mins and the game continues.  At this point in the game all kicking by the defending team stops, IIRC all penalties are still played except for ones that kill the ball.  I did start to write a section on this but abandoned it as I didn't feel it explained the possibilites well enough.  Games that ended in this way and are good examples of the rule in force IMO are RWC 2007 Scotland v Italy QF(?) and Canada v Japan.  And the RBS Six Nations Scotland V England 2008.  (in both the Scottish games Scotland were leading with Italy and England respectively within a converted Try for the win. Italy and England in both games had possession of the ball at the time the clock ran out.) If any once has links to videos of the ends of those games the rule can be seen in action very clearly. (Moncky (talk))  —Preceding comment was added at 07:53, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Ending a Game

message: The article claims the advantage rule sets Rugby apart from most other sports.  A quick google reveals water polo, soccer, league, korfball(!), intercross, AFL and possibly the GAA games to use similar advantage rules.  Not exactly set apart.  I'm taking it out. 210.9.136.59 (talk) 14:08, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Advantage 

message: According to the article, "A little known rule is that if a player touches the referee with the ball, it is seen as infringment [sic] and so a try is awarded." To the best of my knowledge, and my looking through the Laws of the Game, this is not true. As such, I am removing it. If anyone can verify this rule, please feel free to add it back , with a source this time. Draganta (talk) 14:53, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Not really correct, and only so if the referee actually obstructed the ball from being grounded. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/international/4805596.stm It's fairly trivial anyway. Swiss09 (talk) 22:52, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Penalty Try 

message: The section at the end of this article on proposed changes seems to be out of date.  The ELvs have been enacted and some of them are being dropped at this stage.  I'm proposing that this section be deleted with a link to the ELVs article itself. Input would be welcome. Thanks!
GainLine ♠♥ 09:50, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: You're right, that section's pretty out of date and several of the laws are dropped.  Not sure if it should be deleted though, I feel it's still relevant to the article and a brief summary would be useful.  Might clean it up a tad when I've looked up exactly which laws are in/out. Swiss09 (talk) 22:44, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Section on Possible alterations to the laws

message: This article used to be called "Playing rugby union", which described what the article was about. Without any apparent discussion, someone has renamed it. "Gameplay" is not the same as "playing the game" and, indeed, almost every definition of "gameplay" that I can find relates to computer games, which is misleading in this context. --Jimmy Pitt (talk) 14:53, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article name 

message: I am proposing a complete restructuring of this highly important article. At present it is very disjointed and shows the signs of numerous editors working very hard, but the cohesiveness and flow has been lost. At this level (this is a main article that links directly from Rugby Union and as such is an anchor article for the rugby union subject) readers learning about Rugby may not realise the variations of 15's, sevens, and even Ten a side, so I think a broad view of gameplay is generally needed.
The draft structure (please make suggestions and alterations) I would propose would be something like this.
:Preamble: High level overview of game (played on a field, where objective is to score points, timeframe). Short historical perspective.
:Objective of game: Score points by tries or goals. Point values could go here.
:Field and equipment
:Game Structure: (introduction to game structure of the men's elite level 15 a side game to be followed by in depth explanation of each part of the game) Ball is kicked to begin play, receiving team attacks by running (including passing) or by kicking the ball forward. Defending team attempts to stop attack by tackling, or re-taking possession of the ball. General play continues until there is a breakdown, whereby play is resumed by one of numerous setpieces.
::Start of play the kickoff
::Receiving the ball: Player in possession of the ball, has three options run, pass or kick.
:::Running with the ball(the is more of less the running game section) players runs with ball in hand until he is tackled or scores a try, leaving out all the nuances of what happens IF he drops the ball, or passes forward, or is offside, or ... (in other words leave infringement discussion till later). The reader is still learning what SHOULD happen in the game.
::::The tackle
::::The ruck
::::The maul
::::The try
:::Passing the ball
:::Kicking the ball
::::Kick into touch
::::Drop goal
::::Marking the ball
::The setpiece: explanation of when setpieces are used: restart, boundary infringements, handling infringements. (penalty infringements can involve these setpieces so I propose giving them their own section AFTER this section)
:::Restart Kicks: kick after score, and kick from 22
:::Scrum
:::Line-out
::Penalties: Introduction of how penalties are awarded, and the various types: free-kick, penalty and penalty try.
:::Free-kick and Penalty: Choices available: quick tap, kick for touch (and line-out), scrum, and kick for goal.
:::Penalty Try
:Officiating
:Substituting players
:Foul Play
:Variations each section should detail the main differences to rules and gameplay. Highly nuanced differences belong in a sub article
::Sevens rugby
::Age variations
::Womens (I am not familiar with rules, so am presuming there is some difference to the male game)
I think that this type of structure is far better than the mish mash of what is there now.SauliH (talk) 05:13, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article restructure 

message: The article claims that "the majority of progress is made by running to make ground, being tackled,and recycling the ball" (or something similar). This is a common way of gaining territory, but there are many others (making line breaks, kicking to touch, kicking for other players to chase, rolling mauls, and probably a few more I can't think of at the moment). Territory can even be gained when you don't have the ball if strong tackling keeps the opposition behind the gain line. Surely it depends on the team how they attack?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.6.96.22 (talk) 15:29, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dubious statement 

message: I would like to split this into two articles. One about the laws of the game and the other about gameplay. There will be some overlap, but I see the gameplay article describing how the game is played in a user friendly way, while the laws will get more into the technical details. AIRcorn (talk) 11:59, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Done here Rugby union laws AIRcorn (talk) 13:52, 3 September 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Rugby union laws 

message: User:SauliH initiated this over a year ago and has created a rough outline at Talk:Rugby union gameplay/Sandbox. He has been inactive over the past few months and I would like to get something done for the World Cup. To fit in with the recently created Rugby union laws I propose to make this article focused on gameplay. It builds on SauliH's but cuts out the laws when possible. I see the following sections:
;Objective
:See also to laws, pretty much a copy paste of that section with a few tweaks.
;Running
:Compare smash and bash styles with guile and speed, step, swerve, goose step, hit and spin, low drive
;Passing
:Describe different types of passes; draw and pass, dummy, skip, spiral, flick, dive, pop, double around, cuts, switching
;Kicking
:Clearing (touch or downfield), box, bomb, chip, grubber, crossfield, drop goal, place kicks
;Tackle
:Ball and all vs around the legs. Objectives for tackler (getting the ball) and tackled player (recycling the ball, staying on feet until support arrives)
;Ruck
:Pick and go, counter rucking, slowing play (both teams)
;Maul
:Rolling maul, ripping the ball free, preventing the ball from coming free
;Scrum
:Promoting a side, disrupting opposition ball, stabilising you own ball, 8-9-10, 8 off the back
;Lineout
:Deflection, drive, competing for the ball, not-competing and facing opposition, throwing to front or back, quick lineout, short lineout
Please add anything else I may have missed. AIRcorn (talk) 23:46, 3 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Back for a short visit after a break, and nice to see the work done on this page. Great work! SauliH (talk) 14:13, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article Restructure revisted 

message: Although there is a section on "Objectives", the concept of a try is rather buried inside the text.
I think that this article needs a section on "Scoring" which includes clear, itemised descriptions of tries, conversions, and penalties.
However, I don't feel qualified to write it!
Macboff (talk) 19:27, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Scoring