Talk:Alsace–Lorraine

message: The article as written has Otto von Bismarck, then the Prussian Ministerpräsident (prime minister)and also foreign minister, opposing the annexation of Alsace-Lorraine in 1871. I've reviewed a number of sources on Bismarck and Prussian foreign relations of this period and can find no reference to such opposition. If he did oppose it and was overridden it would be an extremely rare example of such a reverse. Thus this assertion should be sourced or suppressed. If it is retained it should not only be sourced but should make clear how he was overridden and by whom. Will O'Neil (talk) 05:51, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Bismarck's involvement in annexation 

message: This sentence does not seem NPOV: "After the Franco-Prussian War in 1871, the Treaty of Frankfurt confirmed the return of these areas to the newly-founded German Empire." If the German empire was newly founded, how could Alsace-Lorraine have been RETURNED to this empire? Sounds like a German nationalist wrote this sentence.
Rescued this from HTML comments in the article, someone thought it was POV:
:External link 
:*http://www.elsass-lothringen.de/
--kudz75 05:39, 8 Nov 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: NPOV

message: paragraph states: "France is one of only two EU member countries (Andorra being the other) that refuses to sign the Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities, which includes guarantees of the democratic right to freedom of language."
Andorra is not an EU member. Further, the following is from Andorra page "...French also are spoken, although Andorra is one of only four nations (together with France, Monaco, and Turkey) that never signed the Council of Europe Framework Convention on National Minorities." 
Believe paragraph needs amending to drop EU reference and add Monaco. Tiddy 06:49, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've changed the section now. J-C V 10:46, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Contemporary History" 

message: Separated article of Republic of Alsace-Lorraine was merged. --Matthead 21:34, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The independent Republic deserves to be described here as it is an integral part of the history. As a separate article, it might be overlooked, and most of the content is redundant anyway.--Matthead 20:29, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

text: All that aside, we've lost any description of this region before and after the German Empire. Where will I find that? Kortoso (talk) 19:08, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: Here: Alsace and Lorraine (region)Blaue Max (talk) 19:21, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Merged Republic of Alsace-Lorraine 

message: How much sense makes this? Joining Switzerland? --Matthead 19:54, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Presumably a modification of Trotsky's "neither war nor peace" Septentrionalis 17:44, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  "Neither German neither French nor neutral" 

message: However, the assertion that Wilson or Congress supported the Soviet Republic of Alsace-Lorraine seems out of character. It requites documentation. Septentrionalis 17:44, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm removing this line. I have never heard the eighth of Wilson's Fourteen Points interpreted in any other way than a support for France reclaiming the territories it lost in 1870-71. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 22:54, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Wilson

message: Great article. Needs more references and/or footnotes/citations in order to reach B-class, though. LordAmeth 10:22, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Former Countries Project Assessment

message: This article looks over and dismisses the centuries of German/French fighting over this area. Both countries had wanted this area desperately as it was rich in natural resources and as such could be very valuable to both countries. There were centuries of enmity from each country to the other, and during world war II both countries fought over alsace-lorraine as a matter of national ego and pride. Acaeton (talk) 13:56, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
replies: text:  Never forget that Alsace and parts of Northern Lorraine were originally nothing but regions of German culture and language from the 10th up to the 17th century, which was conquered according to the expansionary politics of Louis XIV (who also planned to annex the rest of the Rhine's left side, including today's Saarland and Rhineland, and Luxemburg, which was part of the Holy Roman Empire, too - and being more of bilingual than Alsace, however also originally German, for a while also playing a bigger role in German history). People simply forgot their origin (as opposed to people e.g. in Rhineland, which also belonged to France for about 20 years) because they were not oppressed up to the French Revolution. Before the 17th century there was no kind of real mixture or transition of cultures. Even the French Wikipedia states the answer of Alsatians when they where offered to join France before they were conquered: "Niemals." Never. However, things have changed (would Polish Posen be German now like Alsace is mainly French, without World War I?), but this simple truth should not be forgotten. It's not propaganda, it is neutral, although people tend to see nothing but what they are accustomed to in the present. --88.78.118.14 (talk) 01:59, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: There is not an accurate reprentation of the German view

message: Metz was German (or dialect) speaking town at 1871 surrounded by french-speaking country  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.24.1.172 (talk) 00:48, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: This not true.  The poet Verlaine was born in Metz.  The Ecole d'artillerie was located in Metz. There was  |académie de Metz with French proceedings, etc.  --Pierre de Lyon (talk) 17:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Metz 

message: This article is indeed quite biased. "French troops arrived in Strasbourg". The submeaning of the whole paragraph is clearly "French troops occupied Strasbourg and annexed Alsace-Lorainne without the consent of reluctent inhabitants". It's ignoring the joy of the population in Strasbourg after Germany's defeat, the collective greeting for french armies arriving in Strasbourg, the enthusiasm about planned reincorporation in the French republic. It's ignoring the waves of alsace-lorraine emigrants to central France in both world wars, and that many resistants in WWII were of Alsatian-Lorrainian origin. Most of alsacians and lorrainians have always felt full-part french both in WWI and WWII.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Guigui169 (talk • contribs) 13:21, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nonsense 

message: Have Elsassisch ancestors, they were clearly German and spoke German. I find this article to be bias and slanting the French side. Most of my ancestors were from Elsass, Baden and Wuerttemburg and they all agreed that they were German.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.83.210.27 (talk) 16:19, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Nonsense II

message: The map "Sprachenkarte Deutschland1880.png" is currently used in this article. This 19th century map, made during arguably the height of (ethno-)nationalism in Europe; especially in newly founded Germany, is inaccurate. It shows Dutch as part of the German language; or rather, it shows German being spoken in the Netherlands and Flanders. Modern linguists, just like many contemporary French, Dutch and English linguists, have - in the past 130 years -  completely changed this image.
Let it be clear that I'm not trying to prove Dutch isn't German, which would be ridiculous as discussions involving "French is Italian" or "German is Dutch" would make about as much sense. I would like to see this map removed because it;
*Represents a biased (i.e 19th century German) point of view.
*Makes linguistic distintions which are completly obsolete and proven to be wrong.
*Offensive towards speakers of the Dutch language.
If someone would like to adapt this map to modern linguistics (which I think is possible as it seems to be in the public domain) then that's okay; but there is no reason, whatsoever, to keep this obsolete, inaccurate and offensive map in this article. I am removing it, until supporters of the map add their arguments in this section. Westbrabander (talk) 18:31, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The status of Dutch is completely irrelevant in this article. The map is being used here to show the linguistic boundary between High German and French in Alsace-Lorraine in the late 19th century. Whether or not the rest of the map is accurate plays no role. +Angr 20:01, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The map provides incorrect information. If you want a map to show that boundary, either find one that does without being inaccurate or make one yourself.Westbrabander (talk) 21:14, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

text: And as explained to you already, it's a period piece and understood to be thus. Now several editors have reverted you. You are now violating 3RR, I don't want to report you but I will if you continue.--Chris (クリス • フィッチュ) (talk) 05:00, 8 July 2010 (UTC)
replies: text:  I don't see the point: From a linguistic point, there are now four standardized languages of the westgermanic dialect continuum, which historically is called German, (a term, which is IMHO not correct and misleading). The borders of the dialects weren't so sharp one hundered years ago as they are today. But while the Dutch language evolved from the lower German dialect of Amsterdam, the modern German is a kind of esperanto between the other German dialects and never was spoken in any region. Modern standard German is in its origin an artificial language. The English term "German" for "Deutsch" is historically not correct. It's a little bit like "Romania": Historically Romania means the Roman Empire, later the Greek Eastern Roman Empire. Today, it means the country in south east Europe but also sometimes all countries with a romanic language. It's obvious, that modern Dutch and modern German are very similar languages. I am able to understand the sense of most Dutch texts without learning the language, which would be impossible for me with English, French or Hungarian texts, so there is a dialect continuum. --W-j-s (talk) 13:17, 10 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Usage of incorrect map 

message: This needs to be corrected:
"These territories had become part of Eastern Francia in 921 during the reign of King Louis the German, and later were included in the Holy Roman Empire."
Louis the German died back in 876, in 921 it was Henry I in East Francia who negotiated the treaty with Charles the Simple, king of West Francia that saw Lotharingia (much more than Alsace or the Reichsland Alsace Lorraine) becoming part of the east.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.77.207.130 (talk) 12:34, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  Early history 

message: It's important to sort out the mess that are the WWII articles.
All input welcome. Thank you. walk victor falk talk 20:13, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Talk:France during World War II]]

message: The article is about the Alsace-Lorraine an well-known wordstring, but yet, at the top of the article a link reads: "Not to be confused with Alsace-Champagne-Ardenne-Lorraine" Has I understand it, this one of the new French government-backed names banded about on the this wiki about the not long gone French border changes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Est. The link name should be overset with the name: Alsace-Lorraine-Champagne-Ardennes - which is less against the wishes of the folkes of Elsass Lothringen/Alsace Lorraine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Est
in Alsace and in Lorraine, the new region has frequently been called ALCA, for Alsace-Lorraine-Champagne-Ardennes, on the internet.
and...
Opposition
The merger has been strongly opposed in Alsace. The territorial reform law allows new regions to choose the seat of the regional councils, but specifically made Strasbourg the seat of the ACAL regional council—a move to appease the region's politicians  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:411:1600:226:8FF:FEDC:FD74 (talk) 04:06, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why an: Alsace-Champagne-Ardenne-Lorraine link and not: Alsace-Lorraine-Champagne-Ardennes? 

message: German-language Alsatian newspapers were also suppressed.
While they were not Alsatian, Metz-based Le Républicain Lorrain was actually founded in 1919, so under French rule, as a German-nanguage newspaper (the Metzer Freies Journal), with their present title as merely a French subtitle. They switched language in 1936, as far as I know of their own accord and probably in an all too understandable mood given the Nazi government of Germany at the time.--2001:A61:260D:6E01:A865:1FCA:DA8A:D95E (talk) 21:14, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
thread_title: Suppression of German newspapers (doubt)

message: When viewing the article, it states SpaghettiOs as the “ácan”. I’d change it but don’t have the knowledge to put what really belongs there.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2605:AD80:10:4AF6:8C82:4FD0:9260:7BE4 (talk) 09:53, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
thread_title:  Under Legislature, it says SpaghettiOs 

message: From a page of Servet-i Funun I found Alsace-Lorraine also had a landtag https://archives.saltresearch.org/bitstream/123456789/129156/549/PFSIF9170920A116.jpg WhisperToMe (talk) 02:37, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
thread_title:  Landtag 

message: Maybe you'll see it if I put it here,  please use edit summaries. —GoldRingChip 11:56, 3 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit summaries 

message: Hello! This is to let editors know that :File:The Geography Lesson or "The Black Spot".jpg, a featured picture used in this article, has been selected as the English Wikipedia's picture of the day (POTD) for May 16, 2023. A preview of the POTD is displayed below and can be edited at Template:POTD/2023-05-16. For the greater benefit of readers, any potential improvements or maintenance that could benefit the quality of this article should be done before its scheduled appearance on the Main Page.  If you have any concerns, please place a message at Wikipedia talk:Picture of the day. Thank you!  — Amakuru (talk) 13:05, 4 May 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Featured picture scheduled for POTD 

message: This update from three German articles on Alsace-Lorraine is intended to fill the hole in the history of the region while it was part of the German Empire.
I used Alsace-Lorraine (hyphen) rather than Alsace–Lorraine (dash) throughout because it seems to follow the MOS guidelines on dashes vs. hyphens, and I could find no other sources, including within Wikipedia, except this article's title (and references based on it) that use a dash in Alsace-Lorraine. I also changed German Straßburg to Strassburg since many people aren't familiar with the German ß.
GHStPaulMN (talk) 12:12, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
thread_title:  Update of 16 Oct 2023