Talk:Croatian Parliament

message: Are any seats reserved for minority groups? This claim is made (uncited) in Germans of Yugoslavia#Croatia. Purgatorio (talk) 17:52, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Reserved seats?

message: Hi. I'm currently copyediting the page, and have run across one problem with the punctuation. Most places, there is no "serial comma" (the last comma in a series, before the "and")... but it's present in a few places. Should it be there or not? (For instance, is it used in formal Croatian writing?) I haven't changed it in either case. Thanks! Allens (talk) 17:28, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Standard Croatian does not use such a comma, but I suppose that has nothing to do with English in the article, right?--Tomobe03 (talk) 17:45, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I suppose not necessarily - it depends on its likely degree of influence on people from Croatia writing in English (there's that thing about "linked to the subject of the article". The other way to decide such questions is by looking at the first major contributor's way of doing things; looks like Joy didn't use the serial comma in the initial version of the article, so I will accordingly remove them. Allens (talk) 20:00, 9 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Serial comma? 

message: Is Sabor/sabor normally capitalized in Croatian? It is in the Croatian translation, but not in the infobox. Allens (talk) 18:12, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: It's capitalized when it's used standalone, but in the phrase "Hrvatski sabor" it's not. And just to confuse you a bit more, when that phrase is used descriptively in a sentence, it's possible to use "hrvatski Sabor" correctly. :) --Joy [shallot] (talk) 20:43, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, fascinating ;-} I have decapitalized (not sure if that's a neologism...) it in the initial translation... thanks! Allens (talk) 21:46, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox capitalization 

message: In response to a "clarification needed" tag containing text: Are these actually reserved for members of these minorities, or are the minorities simply the only ones involved in voting for them? And, BTW, what about people with descent from more than one group? As it happens, I've known a Serbian-Bosnian couple, albeit in the United States:
Eight members of the parliament are elected by voters belonging to 22 recognized minorities in Croatia: the Serb minority elects three MPs, Hungarians and Italians elect one MP each, the Czech and Slovak minorities jointly elect one MP, and all other minorities elect the final two MPs. Voters are listed in the voter register which is in turn compiled from birth register data and other registrar office documents amending the birth register information. One item in the birth register is nationality - which need not be declared, or may be declared as unknown. During elections, a voter who has declared nationality as one of 22 recognized minorities in Croatia or as unknown/non-declared is offered a choice of voting for a minority list or a territorially appropriate (by constituency) general election list. For instance, an ethnic Italian who is a citizen of Croatia may vote either for an Italian minority representative MP or for a general list of candidates running for office in his/her specific constituency. An ethnic Croat citizen of Croatia and citizens of Croatia who are not Croats, and who have declared themselves to be of an ethnicity which is not one of the 22 recognized minorities in Croatia (e.g. Canadian), may vote for a general list of candidates only. Those citizens of Croatia who have declared their nationality as "non-declared" or "unknown" may opt, at the polling station, to vote for a general election list or any minority list.
The above is also found in Elections in Croatia and referenced there. I can add this to the article, but I'm not sure if this would add too much or not. Any suggestions?--Tomobe03 (talk) 14:24, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Hmm... "minorities (including undeclared or unknown)" could be one modification. (Sounds like mixed-ethnicity children would generally be "undeclared" or "unknown", although I can imagine some constitutional legal fights over this...) The above doesn't quite answer the first question, regarding if only members of minorities can run on minority lists or whether it's simply that the minority voters are unlikely to vote for non-minority candidates. In other words, it's specifying about voters, not candidates. Allens (talk) 16:20, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh right: Article 17 of Members of Parliament Election Act says: "Pravo predlaganja kandidata za zastupnike nacionalnih manjina i njihovih zamjenika imaju političke stranke, birači i udruge nacionalnih manjina." which translates into: Right to nominate candidates for representatives of national minorities and their deputies is conferred to political parties, voters and associations of the national minorities. - which is quite ambiguous in Croatian as well as in English: It's clear that national associations (NGOs) of the national minorities may nominate a candidate, but it is unclear if any group of (100) voters may nominate a candidate or do they have to be voters of particular nationality - however the latter seems logical. As far as the parties are concerned - in practice those are largely national minority parties, but other parties are known to have nominated candidates and won seats in the constituency - e.g. a HNS seat in the current Sabor was gained in Czech/Slovak minority representative election. As far as mixed ethnicity is concerned - the thing is quite common in northern part of Croatia where a significant proportion of population has some Hungarian or German ancestors, but from my personal experience those people are largely declaring themselves as Croatian. Still, nearly 100,000 people did not declare their nationality or declared their ethnicity as "regional" - e.g. such a person living in Dalmatia might declare him/herself a Dalmatian as provided by Croatian legislation, but this type of declaration allows voting for a minority election list of choice. In addition, applicable legislation does not permit declaration of mixed ethnicity, but allows changing of that information at the registrar's office as many times as desired. Such non-restrictive provisions actually do not prohibit declaring anything as nationality, so arguably it is possible to indicate that one is "Serbian-Bosnian" or any other combination of nationalities. For instance, 2001 census recorded declarations of nationality including: various American Native Peoples (which they were not), hamsters and penguins (which they were definitely not). Still all those, including "Slavonians", "Istrians" etc are registered as undeclared/unknown and are allowed to choose any minority or general election list for which they may vote.--Tomobe03 (talk) 17:33, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I am reminded of the Jedis in the UK. Thank you for the clarification; I hope how I've now modified it (including a footnote regarding the uncertainty about the minority candidates) to correctly but succinctly represent the situation. Allens (talk) 21:18, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: To clarify the above cumbersome clarification: It is unclear whether nominating voters need be members of a particular minority, but the legislation does not require the candidate they nominate to be of a specific ethnic group. For instance, Czechs and Slovaks elect a single representative and therefore some candidates will be Czechs and some will be Slovaks. It is even possible to nominate e.g. a Croat or Italian to stand in election for Czech/Slovak MP, but I don't think anyone will be nominated that way simply because it would be sort of hard to win that way - just imagine a Frenchmen standing in German presidential elections or vice versa.--Tomobe03 (talk) 21:20, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Got it, thanks! I've revised the note accordingly. (I asked partially because the US system does actually require that a modern-day president be a US citizen from birth - there's been some controversy over that at times from political nutcases... In contrast, most other offices have no such requirement; an Austrian-by-birth (Arnold Schwarzenegger) was governor of California for a while...) Allens (talk) 21:55, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Minorities clarification 

message: The Seats won in 1990–2007 parliamentary elections by individual parties table lists exactly that - seats won in elections and does not account for any changes of party affiliations between elections, so if that's OK, I'd simply remove the clarification needed tag. Alternatively, I could add an appropriate note in the last row of the table spelling that out.--Tomobe03 (talk) 20:58, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, definitely remove the clarification needed tag - the note sounds like a good idea. Thanks! Allens (talk) 21:06, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Seats won table clarification 

message: The clarification tag pertains to electoral system applied in the 1990 elections. That consisted of single-seat constituencies and all 80 seats in the Social-Political Council of Croatia, all 116 seats in the Municipalities Council of Croatia and all 160 seats in the Associated Labour Council of Croatia (since Parliament had three chambers at the time). A candidate receiving 50%+ votes in the 1st round won outright, if none did so, all candidates receiving 7%+ votes went to the runoff, and candidate winning plurality won the seat. This is explained in wikilinked Croatian parliamentary election, 1990 article, so I'm unsure about need to add much of this to this particular article beyond that there were two rounds of voting. Any suggestions?--Tomobe03 (talk) 23:06, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The single-seat constituencies pertained to 50% of parliamentary seats - the other half was elected through election list nominated in a single constituency encompassing the entire country.--Tomobe03 (talk) 11:01, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I think what's in the article now is a fine level of detail - good job! I cleaned it up a bit, mainly working on shortening it, and I think it'll work fine. Allens (talk) 14:36, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  1990 Elections 

message: There's an article on the next Croatian parliamentary election, which is directly relevant to this article. Therefore it can be a useful link to readers, and I don't see any way it harms being there, regardless of how far in the future the election is. It's just a link, so I'm not going to care much discussing this, but I don't see the disadvantage as opposed to its possible usefulness. Regards, SPQRobin (talk) 18:06, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: It should have been in there already. I'm thinking the editor who was reverting you thinks that the link is invoking early elections, but it does no such thing. The next election article always exists, because the schedule is known. --Joy [shallot] (talk) 18:55, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  The schedule is not known. The President of the Republic sets the date of the next elections according to Constitution of the Republic. Today we know that there will be no early elections. The next election link should be later, maybe in the last year of the current mandate. So on the 4th December 2014. Tuvixer (talk) 21:08, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  It's known insofar as we're certain that there will definitely be a next Croatian parliamentary election, so there's no apparent benefit in avoiding to mention it when the article is there. --Joy [shallot] (talk) 19:59, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

text:  The link being there does not imply at all that early election will be held. Depending on Croatia's electoral law, the article can be linked with "2016 or earlier" or "Next election" or similar. SPQRobin (talk) 20:13, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Both, "2016 or earlier" and "Next election", are ok. Maybe "Next election" is better.  Tuvixer (talk) 23:11, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
replies: text:  Ok, thanks, I added it with "Next election". SPQRobin (talk) 15:46, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Next election link 

message: Now by my opinion, the listed parties should be changed. The names are to long. So should it be changed by Croatian Party of Pensioners to HSU and Croatian Democratic Union to HDZ, or Croatian Party of Pensioners to Party of Pensioners and Croatian Democratic Union to Democratic Union? --Tuvixer (talk) 00:11, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Infobox 

message: User CentreLeftRight changed the block "Political groups" and showed there the results of election. But I am sure that it is needed to show current composition of groups. At first, the changes happen after election, MPs can switch groups. At second, let us show each party separately, but not in electoral coalition.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Olek Bokhan (talk • contribs) 22:35, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Political groups 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Can't we wait for 7 day that the issue is resolved and we see who supports the government when the Parliament votes on new minister? Changing everything now is just speculation, so please refrain from unproductive edits. Thanks --Tuvixer (talk) 15:55, 8 June 2017 (UTC)
thread_title:  Government/supporting the government/opposition 

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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: Hi LeoC12,
people in Croatia can either be independent or a member of a political party. A political party can propose people for an electoral list in an election (in this text, an "election" is referred to the 2020 parliamentary election in Croatia, unless otherwise stated). People on the electoral list proposed by a political party don't have to be a member of that political party (e.g. Marija Selak Raspudić in the 1st electoral district) or can be in a different political party than the one that is the proposer of the electoral list (e.g. Josip Salapić in the 7th electoral district). Apart from the fact that a political party can propose people for an electoral list, so can multiple political parties propose the same candidates, under one electoral list (i.e. coalition). Apart from political parties, voters can also propose an electoral list if they collect at least 500 signatures from the voters from the electoral district they want their electoral list to be held in, provided that the electoral district is not the 12th electoral district, because special rules apply to that electoral district (in any case, that electoral list is called an independent list). Similarly to the statements before, people in an independent list can either be independent or a member of a political party.
I believe that any connection about electoral lists should be ignored in the Croatian Parliament article, because information about electoral lists are already in the 2020 Croatian parliamentary election article. So, once the election is over, those candidates get in Croatian Parliament with a specific political party (not the electoral list proposer, but the political party they are the member of, as explained before). Of course, if they aren't a member of any political party, they are classified as "independent", regardless if they were on an electoral list proposed by a political party/parties or voters. In Croatian Parliament, 3 or more members of Parliament (MPs) can form a parliamentary club, whether they are independent or a member of a political party. Parliamentary clubs can, similarly to the electoral lists, have MPs which are not part of the political party of the majority of the club (e.g. Goran Dodig is in a parliamentary club whose majority of members are in a political party he is not a member of). Although MPs in a parliamentary club can have similar ideologies with the rest of the MPs in that club, that doesn't have to be the case (e.g. in the 9th assembly of Croatian Parliament, Furio Radin was in a parliamentary club whose majority of members were members of an oppositional political party, while he supported the Government).
That said, if an MP is in a parliamentary club, that doesn't mean he has the same ideologies as the rest of the parliamentary club. As such, I believe that people who are independent, but part of a parliamentary club, should be clearly marked as "independent", because if they "agreed" with something as the majority of the members of the parliamentary club they are in, they would become a member of the political party of the majority of members of the parliamentary club, and not continue to be an independent politician.
Locky74 (talk) 18:20, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Political groups in Croatian Parliament