Template talk:Cite news/Archive 1

message: Don't worry, this is not a physics problem.  I am using this Cite_news template to cite news sources such as USA Today and Austin American-Statesman.  In reading the discussion above, it seems as though we are to use the "work" parameter for the name of the magazine.  
If that is the case then I think the instructions for this template are deficient.  The currennt explanation is:
:work: Such as a column, sub part of issue, multi-part work.
That does not sound to me like it is the place to put the name of a magazine or newspaper.  Is this where one should put New York Times when referencing a story from that paper?  If so, then I suggest we change the description to say:
:work: Such as a magazine or newspaper name
That seems to me to get more to the heart of how this template would generally be used. Johntex\talk 01:29, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Absolutely not. The "publisher" field, despite its name, has always been intended to be used for the publication. It answers the question "Who ran the story we are citing/linking to?" Also, metadata for the publication was linked to this fields when COinS tags were added to the templates months ago. Circeus 04:23, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, that is what I used to believe too, but there are two discussion sections here on this page: Template_talk:Cite_news#.22work.22_or_.22publisher.22.3F and Template_talk:Cite_news#Publisher_italics that contradict that.  If you read the second section, you will see that within the past couple of months we actually changed the template to no longer italicize "publisher".  So, if one wants the name of the publication to be correctly italicized, one now has to put it in the "work" field. Johntex\talk 15:14, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Indeed; the consensus appears to be strongly against Circeus's interpretation (and not just here, but at talk pages of related templates).  I've updated the wording of the documentation. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 22:32, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Definition of work

message: How would one cite a news story written by muliple authors? Is it as easy as:

Which would look like: 
-- Joebeone (Talk) 16:12, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, that's ok. As a side note: see ) for a more complicated mechanism to handle multiple authors. There the authors are usually written as last, first. But doing as you wrote above is ok. --Ligulem 16:25, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

text: The coauthors= field of  has long since been added to this template. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 21:19, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Multiple Authors?

message: Is there a reason that there are no wikilinks in the date-parameter, while there are some in the accessdate-parameter? So "date=July 2006" becomes "July 2006", while "accessdate=July 2006" becomes "July 2006". If no one objects, I'll remove the linkage in the accessdate-parameter, because currently it produces redlinks like "July 22, 2006". --Conti|✉ 21:53, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I do object the removal of the link on accessdate. This would break existing calls. Specify the accessdate as YYY-MM-DD (as required by the docu above on this page here), then there is no redlink. This should be kept consistent with ,  and  (and others). Also, "date" must not be linked in the template code. Otherwise calls would break too, because some editors want that linked and some not. See also the discussions on the other citation templates and on this talk page here. "date" can also be somewhat uncertain, that's why it cannot be linked in the template code. For example, if you know just the month and the year but don't know the date of the month. This shouldn't happen on accessdate, because this is always a full exact date, as we assume the editor does know when he accessed that link. --Ligulem 23:07, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, must've overlooked that we should the YYYY-MM-DD format, the link works with that format. I didn't knew that 2006-05-31 will become 2006-05-31, so nevermind, then. --Conti|✉ 23:22, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

text: Never mind, I'm a moron - found the original discussion. RJASE1 20:56, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Date vs. accessdate 

message: We're discussing what a more integrated template could look like: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Unreferenced GA#New template proposed. Please comment if you wish. - Samsara (talk • contribs) 19:53, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New template proposed: distinguishing news vs. abstract vs. full text

message: Can an admin please link accessdate - This needs to be a link so that the date preference of users will display the date the way they prefer. --Trödel 01:14, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Thx - --Trödel 01:37, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm interested to know why this was unlinked, especially considering discussion a few sections up about whether or not it should be linked or not. Jude (talk) 09:13, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Was apparently a uniateral edit from User:Kaldari. He/She wasobviously not aware of the non-context reasons why this date is linked. Circeus 13:59, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Link accessdate 

message: Several other cite templates allow an additional parameter of format to indicate where a given URL links to something other than an html web page (see Template:cite press release). The explanation given in these other templates is:
 **format: Format, i.e. PDF. Don't specify for HTML (implied as default). 
Should/can this be added to this template - template is currently protected, but as a 1st attempt I think the following code would work: David Ruben  Talk  01:03, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: URL & Format

message: May I kindly ask an empowered soul to change the template according to what I wrote at User:Ligulem/tlim? Example what should be done here . --Ligulem 15:34, 16 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. --Conti|✉ 15:59, 16 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  New template limits 

message: I note there is a language field to denote the language an article is in. What about a field for the orginal / translated language title? Intangible 19:22, 16 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Just use the original; even if you are a fluent speaker of both languages, Wikipedians have no way of knowing whether your translation was accurate. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 21:03, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Translation language 

message: Many newspapers now put articles into archives which are accessible only through paid subscriptions or per-article fees.  Editors often add a citation when a news story is fresh and freely available, and then the article moves to the paid archive.  What is the best way to indicate, in footnotes referencing those articles, that an article is available online only for a fee?  The information is still available, but the reader has to either pay the fee or find it the old-fashioned way, at a library with newspaper archives (microfische, or whatever).  —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 18:46, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This was recently discussed elsewhere and the concensus seemed to be use the site to the fee locaiton but warn payment required or fee so some poor dialup person doesn't wait 30 sec only to find out they have to pay. --Trödel 04:03, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I suppose I was wondering whether there was a way to include this in the template. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 04:06, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  Good question - I can't do it since they locked these down - but a "format" parameter is included in other cite templates and it is a good place to put fee required or something. --Trödel 04:10, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I don't have a sufficient understanding of template syntax to add that parameter myself, but if you want I could temporarily unlock the template so you could make the change (assuming that you can do it without affecting the existing usages). —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 04:28, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry I missed your message - went to bed - I would want to test it on :Template:X2 or in my userspace to make sure it worked - so that the change would be one edit - because of the number of articles that use this template - we don't want to be experimenting on it. --Trödel 01:18, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

text:  I've already made suggestion & request to add 'format' parameter above with a (?good) guess at the markup required - but no one obliged - see Template talk:Cite news#URL & Format. David Ruben  Talk  00:31, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

text: What if the news article is not on the official site, but can be found on http://web.archive.org? --ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 02:36, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Indicating news stories from paid archives 

message: Please do save the content I prepared at  (in my sandbox) to template:cite news. Please use an edit summary "cats and interwikis moved to ". Thanks. --Ligulem 10:11, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done. --cesarb 22:09, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Moving cats and interwikis to doc subpage 

message: Can someone add "authorlink" option to this template? I'm trying to add a link to Pam Shriver in refs of Justine Henin-Hardenne article. It seems to be available in some cites like book and conference but not on some... —Jared Hunt September 6, 2006, 09:28 (UTC)
::Have you tried author=Pam Shriver? That'd make the author name a link. --Bobblehead 12:36, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I guess Shriver, Pam works. Authorlink wouldn't be a bad idea either though. Thanks for the tip. —Jared Hunt September 6, 2006, 14:24 (UTC)
Done. --Ligulem 09:52, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  The authorlink option

message: Could someone change the languages so that they are in the format of Template:Languageicon? – Zntrip 01:01, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: This has been discussed on Template_talk:Cite_web#Language_icon (rejected) and Template_talk:Cite_web#Language (done, on a trial basis). Per the latter, no complaints received so far. --Ligulem 08:13, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Yeah. It's a bit odd. The consensus finding over multiple templates could be improved. Last problem was on Template_talk:Cite_book#Language_parameter (Ruud objected changing cite book to match cite web). I'm a bit unsure how to proceed now. --Ligulem 10:43, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

text: cite web does not have any language icons, it only shows the original language as free text of the parameter value and encloses this in  brackets. Or am I missing something here ? David Ruben  Talk  21:51, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, that's what I ment. The template isn't used, but the same style is. – Zntrip 23:14, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

text: Concur that the two templates should do the same thing. We can almost certainly just borrow the code directly. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 21:48, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

text: It's worth noting that the language parameter of  is currently under discussion at Template talk:Cite web#Parameter language. RossPatterson 21:36, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It appears language is still bold in Template:Cite web. There should be consensus for a change like this. Cheers. --MZMcBride 02:36, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

text: I agree, but seeing that this issue has been brought to attention previously several times and on all occasions was met with no opposition and few or no comments, I will insist that the edit be made or reasonable objections be brought forth. – Zntrip 04:57, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text:  Done. Cheers. --MZMcBride 03:23, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Thank you for the edit, but I think I forgot to mention that it also needs to be in bold face to match :Template:Cite web. – Zntrip 04:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The code was copied directly from Template:Cite web. Cheers. --MZMcBride 21:42, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Ah, I did not see that Template:Cite web had been changed, thank you. – Zntrip 22:00, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Languages 

message: Any interest in adding the International Standard Serial Number to this template?  It seems to be a ISO standardized index number. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Alan.ca (talk • contribs) 
: I was just going to suggest the same thing.  issn= would be better than id={{issn.... — Omegatron 03:49, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: It's already in there; see older thread on same topic. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 22:07, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  ISSN 

message: *no:Template talk:Cite news
--Lipothymia 01:04, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Done
*sl:Predloga:Navedi novice
**Done—Phil | Talk 12:28, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Interwiki 

message: Can anyone explain what seems to be an error in the auto footnote numbering using  blah .    When I highlight the superscript 1 it says "Go to #_note-0 on this page" instead of note-1.  Any reason? --mervyn 14:10, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Looks to me like the page you're looking for is WP:VPT or WP:FN. Circeus 19:38, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Error in footnote numbering

message: Other than allowing the order of the source details to be rearranged, what does the template do that the ref-tags don't?
Peter Isotalo 16:29, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: This is often used with the ref tags. It standardizes the order of the elements and the punctuation between them, and (I've read) other sites can more easily "read" the elements if they're discrete and separately identified. --zenohockey 01:53, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Function? 

message: Shouldn't this either be always on or always off? Is there a style guide on use of curly quotes? --Random832 17:18, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: WP:MOS#Quotations. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 21:56, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why is "curly" a parameter 

message: Can this be fixed? When URL entered for "authorlink" parameter, displays as 
[Firstname].  I think it should show [Lastname]
;authorlink with first and last
My main concern is when entering first and last parameters, template displays first as authorlink. I'm pretty sure this is wrong.
 
;authorlink with author = "Firstname Lastname"
Given just author parameter, the template seems to snip the first name. This works pretty well if in "Firstname Lastname" order, as long as there is no middle name or initial.
 
;authorlink with author = "Lastname, Firstname"
But template doesn't guess (from the comma) author name is in "Lastname, Firstname" order.
 
;authorlink with author, first & last parameters
Entering an additional parameter for author does not fix the problem (regardless of author order relative to first and last). If last were displaying correctly, author probably should not override it anyway.
 
/ edgarde 21:25, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Okay thanks. / edgarde 23:38, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  URL in authorlink replaces author surname (<samp>last</samp> parameter) with first name 

message: Why does the date part need 2007-05-12 while access date only need 2007-05-12 (to become 2007-05-12).  Shouldn't they be the same.  I request a change! SpecialWindler 07:50, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: The accessdate will always have day, month and year, so it is automatically wikilinked to allow user date preferences to work. The date part might only have a month and year (for instance) and so is wikilinked by hand when there is sufficient info. Trebor 12:18, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Weird 

message: Towards the end of the COinS tag:

replies: text: Yep.  Fixed. — Omegatron 02:13, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Error in the COinS tag? 

message: Why can't this template be substituted? Savidan 02:32, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Also because then the entirety of this monstrously messy template is included in the article, causing confusion and agony. --zenohockey 04:02, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Indeed. Subst'ing this would be a terrible mistake! — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont]  ‹(-¿-)› 22:22, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Subst 

message: From Template:Cite web:
*archiveurl: URL of the archive location of the item (requires archivedate)
*archivedate: Date when the item was archived (requires archiveurl), in ISO 8601 YYYY-MM-DD format, e.g. 2006-02-17. Must not be wikilinked; it will be linked automatically.
It would be useful to have these same parameters available with this template. News items often become dead links, and while sites like http://www.archive.org make the recovery of these articles possible, the original url should also be referenced to provide readers with complete source information. Template:Cite web seems to have done this one exactly right. Copy and paste, please? --HailFire 21:53, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: If consensus develops to do this I'll edit the template. But first it needs to be discussed, implemented, and tested. Then add an editprotected tag; the point of that tag is for quick admin attention, which is not needed here yet. — Carl (CBM · talk) 22:16, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll second the suggestion and strongly endorse it.  I can't see how it would be particularly controversial, and and at the moment, I'm being forced to either misuse  or not use citation templates at all in such cases, so I'd say that it would be extremely useful.  I'll make an experimental sandbox version if nobody else jumps on this.  Xtifr tälk 22:57, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

text: While a good idea, I haven't actually seen too many news sources that are in the Internet Archive.  —Dispenser 07:09, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

text: There are some minor changes to to the  archive support being discussed at Template talk:cite web#accessdate option.  If and when it crystalizes, I'll port the changes over to this template as well.  RossPatterson 22:33, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've applied your trial User:RossPatterson/cite news template to a few Internet Archive linked cites at Barack Obama. Looks to be working just as needed. Will switch to the regular :template:cite news when the archiveurl and archivedate parameters are available there. Thanks. --HailFire 16:51, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Done. Cheers. --MZMcBride 21:48, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

text: Done. Cheers. --MZMcBride 01:48, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Add archiveurl and archivedate parameters?