Talk:African-American culture/Archive 1

message: There is a bit more to black Americans than religion and food--this article needs work.
I disagree completely with the comment at Deeceevoice's edit.  African American music is a subcategory under African American culture, and it quite rightly rates its own entry. Of all the possible splits, I think this one and History make the most sense. There is enough material out there for a separate entry on African American literature as well.Quill 00:42, 8 Nov 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: There is no disagreement between the two of us when it comes to the subject of African American music.  It should be quite clear the disagreement is about the unfortunate hack job done on the article, which had more integrity as a whole.  The article itself makes only a passing reference to African American music as part of an examination of African Americal culture. Appropriately, there is a link to a more substantial article -- as with many of the other subheads and topics featured in the AA article.  Oddly enough, there is a link to a nonexistent African American Church, which is a curious notion, given the religious diversity in the AA community.  Why such a clumsy division with clumsy introductory lead-ins to the hacked-off parts?  Because it was felt the AA article was "too long." (What?) deeceevoice 11:22, 9 Nov 2004 (UTC)
replies: text: When you've been around Wikipedia a little longer you'll realized that linking to entries that do not yet exist is one way of noting a subject so that you yourself or someone else will notice its absence and write on it at another time.  And you've GOT to be kidding--why is the African American Church a curious notion?  Are you referring only to the name?  By  all means change it if you'd rather.  I'm honestly not sure what your contention is.  I'm referring to what has traditionally been referred to as The Black Church in America, not one religion, but a de facto cultural institution with a huge and influential history. It has nothing to do with the fact that African Americans belong to several different religions.Quill 21:41, 10 Nov 2004 (UTC)
thread_title: Article content concerns

message: I have started an article on African American vernacular dance, in part as a way of expanding issues which developed in the lindy hop history and lindy hop articles. This article is really just a beginning point, and certainly need more work. Some of that material might be of relevance to this article, or perhaps - more likely - some of the folks contributing to these African American articles could give some useful feedback/contributions to the dance article? Thanks in advance. PlainJane 11:52, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: African American vernacular dance

message: Here’s a curious case:  The Hymnal 1982 (American Episcopal) and Lift Every Voice and Sing II both call them ‘African American Spirituals’, but Wikipedia refers to them by the old ‘Negro Spirituals’—Why?  Maybe pipe [Negro spiritual|African American spiritual] or MOVE and pipe: [African American Spiritual|Negro Spiritual]?  Opinions? Quill 00:51, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)
thread_title:  Spirtuals - more trouble with nomenclature 

message: Can someone help me out here i was under the belief that the majority of slaves brought to America were originally from the west coast of Africa, an area dominated by Animist beliefs compared to eastern Africa where Islam was more predominant. Therefore did muslims actually make up a siginificant porportion of slaves? I've read articles claiming that on occassion there were slavemasters reporting of educated slaves who spoke arabic, but that those only represented a small minority of the greater slave population.
:For starters, check out the article on the Islamic influences on the blues (melisma).
:Recent scholarship suggests that the influence of Islam and the presence of Africans in the Americas who were Muslim were far more pervasive than originally surmised.  Lots of old churches in the South were built facing east (towards Mecca).  The name Bailey, which was/is a prevalent one is thought to be from "Bilali", after Bilal, the Muhammad's black second-in-command (so to speak).  The tradition of women covering their heads.  Do not underestimate the extent to which Islam had spread to West and Central African cultures by the time of the trans-Atlantic slave trade -- an unfortunate occurrence, some historians think, because it was conflict over the spread of Islam that weakened traditional African societal structures to such a point that made them vulnerable to the slave trade, which, incidentally, went deeper into the interior of Africa than most people generally think.  Captives simply were marched to the coastal areas.  A quick Google of the subject should reveal ample information.  I've been intending for some time to revisit this subject here and in the section regarding religion, specifically, but haven't had time.  deeceevoice 05:55, 5 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Many other churches face east as well. , , . I don't see the "Visitors to Sapelo Island are always struck by ..." as convincing. Jim Apple 21:19, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

text: See also Cathedral diagram#Liturgical east end Jim Apple 23:01, 2 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pervasiveness of Islam in Slavery? 

message: Is it POV to call Nation of Islam a "cult"? Also, I'm sure there are plenty more African American Muslims who are part of mainstream Islam than those who would consider themselves part of the NoI. --Revolución (talk) 07:31, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Nation of Islam

message: This article needs art , literature , and music sections. --Revolución (talk) 01:00, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Art / Literature/ Music

message: I've yet to find any articles in Wikipedia dealing with naming practices of "African-Americans". I'm referring to certain names like "Shaniqua", "LaToya", "Tomeka", etc etc given by blacks in the US to their children; names that are almost exclusively applied to black children, i.e., rarely occur within other groups in the US. I'm curious as to what their (diverse) origins are. Can anyone add any info regarding this? And I'm sorry if the examples I gave aren't totally accurate. --Cotoco 21:39, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Disclaimer, I'm a European American married to an African American. My understanding is that the habit of using made-up names for one's child is not just African American but African American and poor. It's true to say "An African American mother is more likely to name her daughter Shaneequ than a non-AA mother," but the sentence misses the role of "class" or "status" in the equation. The practice of naming one's children names that don't mean anything in your own language (e.g., Mary, John) is unique to literate societies that have a sacred scripture in a language other than their own, such as Europe and India. Nonliterate societies, and socieities in which the sacred scripture is also the language of the people (e.g., Arab-speaking Muslim cultures) use  regular old words for names, such as Dances with Wolves or Servant of God ("Abdullah"). To some extent this is original research on my part, but someone else besides me has got to have made the connection, too. Jonathan Tweet 21:23, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Naming practices 

message: I removed the almost year old cleanup tag and replaced it with . This article does not need any cleanup as far as I can see. The only thing it is missing is a reference section. If any one feels differently, go right ahead and replace the cleanup tag, all I am doing is going through the old backlogs and putting more specific tags or doing the fix-up myself. Eagle talk 05:23, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ceanup tag 

message: I have altered the definition of African-American Vernacular English to reflect that in its main article.  After doing a number of reverts due to the slightly contraversial way the piece in this article was worded I thought it would be better to clear it up somewhat.  Was hoping that this would not cause issue - it was done in good faith to stop this section being a target for vandalism. --Twigletmac 16:28, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Language

message: I think this article meets all the criteria for a Good Article.  I really liked it.
If I had to make a criticism, it would be that the History section of the article lacks a subsection on Afro-American culture up to 1930.  The way that section is written makes it sound like African American culture began with the Harlem rev.  I know that you cover earlier history in the various other sections, but perhaps a subsection describing development up to 1930 would be appropriate.
An issue that isn't discussed explicitly in the article (I am speaking as an absolute tyro in the subject) is the cultural diversity of slaves.  The article presents "African culture" as though there was one such thing in all of Africa.  Perhaps a couple of sentences describing some of the various origins (Swahili, Bantu, Islamic, and so on) might be in order.
These two comments do not impinge on my opinion that the article, as it stands is worthy of GA status.
--Ravpapa 15:50, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  I vote Pass 

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