Talk:Waiheke Island

message: Lots of local musicians, potters and sculpters on the island (including me: http://www.solharris.com) - have a look at www.waiheke.co.nz
Cheers
Sol Harris
:Well, unless they are individually notable (wouldn't know), there should not be a LIST on here at all. But if you have for example a website listing many Waiheke island artists (or a website covering Waiheke art, preferably not too limited on a very few people), we would certainly like to link to something like that. MadMaxDog 09:59, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Correcting myself, after learning a lot more about Wikipedia in the meantime, we could only link to something like that under certain circumstances - such as the link being non-commercial and relatively wide in application. MadMaxDog 08:21, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Where are the weblinks to musicians? Potters? 

message: Does this really belong/need to be here? The event lasted approximately one week and was not much more than a news item, nothing that has had a lasting impact on the island. Seems strange to have something of significant impact to the island (Matiatia redevelopment) followed by something who's long term effects (or interest) are about nil. Countrymike 18:22, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Be Bold and condense it. Or expand other parts. MadMaxDog 03:31, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I also vote for removing this, because it's essentially a news item, from 2005.--68.111.174.11 (talk) 08:11, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Foot & Mouth 

message: There needs to be a pronunciation at the beginning of the article. I looked up the exact pronunciation on an NZ forum, and found two Waiheke residents offering 2 different pronunciations: one was "Why-HECK-ee" and one was "Why-HICK-ee". Then, on the radio, I heard the news-caster (from Auckland) say "WHY-hick-ee" (notice the emphasis on WHY). Is this because of differing accents? I've even heard Americans/Aussies calling it "Why-HEE-key", and am thoroughly confused now.--68.111.174.11 (talk) 08:14, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: Its going to be hard to get an OFFICIAL reference for any one pronounciation, I guess. Ingolfson (talk) 05:19, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Actually, the New Zealand Oxford Dictionary provides both correct Maori pronunciation, and typical vernacular pronunciation for. Firstly, as Maori exhibits syllable timing (that is no real syllable stress), any pronunciation with emphasis on the second syllable is wrong, so the news-caster is closest to being correct. Secondly, the second and third syllables should be the same (because they're written the same). Thus, it should be something like Why-heh-keh. Your observation about Americans (who say it like it rhymes with Waikiki in Hawaii) matches my observations. I'll add the IPA to the article. --Limegreen (talk) 11:28, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Waiheke Pronunciation 

message: Here is a proposed beaches section/list. Please expand it until it's ready to be posted:
*Oneroa Beach - (pronounced: "OH-ner-oh-uh) the main beach on Waiheke Island, located along the northern side of the town Oneroa.
*Little Oneroa Beach - a small, secluded beach at the east end of Oneroa Beach, separated by a protruding cliff wall.
*Palm Beach - (add description)
*Blackpool - (add description)
*Surfdale Beach
*Onetangi Beach - a 1.87km long, north-facing ocean beach. For many years it has been the site of the Onetangi Beach Races.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Countrymike (talk) 22:44, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Main Beaches (work on this section here) 

message: I have removed the "translation" and explanation of the word that names the island. First, a read of Williams Dictionary (the most definitive authority other than native) will show far more meanings to the words "Wai" and "Heke" than ebbing waters. Wai is also a form of memory, and Heke is a migrant or party of migrants, and one "meaning" that circulates the island is that it is a place of migrants remembering who they are... which given the number of new-age people who come to the island might be more accurate, albeit just as fanciful.
The story I deleted (that it came from a Maori urinating on the beach) is umm, a bit strange when one thinks about it. Unlike the prudish Victorian Englishman, for Maori peeing on the beach would hardly merit naming an island. The story also tends to be demeaning, the sort of thing an unhappy person might quote not out of historic accuracy, but to be mildly insulting.
However, what is more important is that the local historian, Paul Monin, conducted extensive research of the extant documents (in NZ the Maori court records are an invaluable source of historical documentation) and concluded that the devastation wreaked by Hone Heke on the local Maori (Heke got guns and his utu [revenge] was fatal) resulted in any Maori who would have known the naming origin to have been killed before records were collected. He writes: "Sadly, much of the traditional history perished along with the Ngati Paoa elders who fell victim to the ravages of disease introduced by Europeans about 1975 or to Ngapuhi aggression during an early round of the musket wards in 1821. The chain of oral transfer from generation to generation, critical for the survival of Maori heritage, suffered major fracture and the damage was not reduced by European failure to promptly record knowledge extant during the first half of the nineteenth century" (page 14-15, Waiheke Island - a history by Paul Monin 1992 
The fact that some more recent sources, like Reed, repeat made up stories does not give them sufficient standing to be quoted in Wikipedia. Other stories say it was named after the cascading waters of Whakanewha Regional Park. Another says it was a stream at Onetangi. See http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~nzlwihs/History/FunMap1948/TheStoryOfWaiheke.html that quotes a 1940's tourist map "The Maori name for the Island is “Te-Motu-Arai-Roa” meaning “The Long Sheltering Island”. They also called it “Motu-nui” or “Great Land”. The name “Waiheke” comes from a stream at Onetangi where seamen were accustomed to call for fresh water. It means “Cascading Waters”."  (Note: Motu means island, not land. And Heke does not mean cascading)
According to the historical society (http://www.waihekemuseum.org.nz/) "The “long sheltering island” was already known by Maori as Waiheke when European visitors first asked for a name. The full name, Motu-Wai-Heke means island of trickling waters, or descending waters. (The Maori word for cascade is hukere). The deep forest litter absorbed the heaviest rains to be slowly released in trickling streams of pure clear filtered water. The island was widely known among Maori for its abundant water. In 1820, James Downie, the master of the store ship HMS Coromandel made a chart of the Tamaki Strait and the Coromandel coast. He labeled the island Motu Wy Hake, spelling the name as he heard it."
If there is a need to explain the name, the Historical Society's account is probably the most likely, but unless it is documented, it still may not meet the standard of an encyclopedia.
Akonga (talk) 00:13, 20 December 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Meaning of the name Waiheke 

message: "The local marae is on ancestral Māori land that had been promised to be set aside as Maori Reserve land and returned to Ngāti Pāoa, but remained owned by Waiheke County Council. " 
This appears to be propaganda as opposed to historic fact. The marae was begun in 1981 by a collaboration of Pākehā and Māori at a time when there were few Māori on Waiheke, but significant respect for them by the local peoples. Subsequently, in 1984, a different action was taken in regard to the Waiheke Station on the eastern end in which locals (again predominately Pākehā) confronted central government over disposition of the Scott Farm, which had been taken for unpaid debts. The locals asserted it should be returned to tangata whenua (the term "mana whenua" was not used in those days), but as the subsequent part of the paragraph explains, Ngati Paoa was unknown. 
How can the land owner, Waiheke County Council promise the land to Ngāti Pāoa when (a) Ngāti Pāoa was not known and (b) in 1981 the Waitangi Tribunal was effectively inoperative. The Tribunal did not become active until 1984, three years after the Piritahi marae began.
The marae's web page explains: "Piritahi Marae stands on a Auckland Council reserve and was built through the hard work of many in the Waiheke community including both Maori and Pakeha. The Marae is a nga hau e wha in that it welcomes peoples from all the fours winds and is not a tribal Marae. Due recognition and is respect is paid to Ngati Paoa as Mana Whenua and the interests of the wider Pare Hauraki iwi. It is a relatively recent Marae that has been developed and built as a community Marae with its first building starting construction in 1981.
I have just placed a "citation needed" comment for now, but unless it can be proven, it reads like propaganda not historical fact.
Akonga (talk) 22:03, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
replies: text: The current wording was added by an anonymous (IP) editor on 4 February 2022. Previously it said "The local marae was not ancestral Māori land held in Māori title but belonged to the Waiheke County Council." You can restore that text if you believe it to be more accurate.-gadfium 00:05, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
thread_title:  Māori–Pākehā relations