Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Archive 1

message: Ok, I've been sketching on this project for a while, as seen on the history page, but I think now is the time to make it official. Spread the word, and start making contributions to the project and football articles! -- Elisson • Talk 18:59, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Starting up 

message: What do you think about the idea of placing  on top of every talk page of articles related to football? Is it overkill or is it a good way of spreading the word? The Wikipedia:WikiProject Ice Hockey is placing their banner on every hockey article they come across. IMHO, I think it is a good idea, but shouldn't be overdone. A good start would be placing our banner on the major article's talk pages, such as Talk:Football (soccer) (duh) and Talk:Football World Cup, and as you come across other football articles, placing the banner on them too. No need to rush out and search for football articles to place the banner on just to boost your edit count. Suggestions? -- Elisson • Talk 19:28, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think that's overdoing it. I saw that when that hapenned for hockey, and didn't think it worked well. --DR31 (talk) 23:07, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Template:football]] 

message: Hi. I just noticed this project on the main football page. I was wondering if I could get the :Template:Women's football posted to the page as a template for use in (obviously) articles on women's football? - Master Of Ninja 00:41, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll expand this project to include (hopefully) all templates in a few days, or weeks, so don't worry, it will be mentioned somewhere. :) -- Elisson • Talk 09:04, 17 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[:Template:Women's football]] 

message: Hadn't had much feedback since my last comments so I've set up an Article improvement drive under the project.  I decided on an article improvement drive rather than a COTW as the voting system lets us keep articles there for as long as people want it to be there and vote for the same article week after week, solving the "should it be weekly/fortnightly/monthly" question quite well.  I've set the bar for nominations to stay up very low, we can raise it when we get a few more collaborators and nominations.  
If there are any improvements you can make, be bold, and please nominate or vote for something to help get it off the ground.  
CTOAGN 10:01, 27 July 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article improvement drive 

message: Hi. I just saw that User:Wonderfool added the French Football WikiProject. The list of recent articles has some articles which could easily be translated and imported. I've started (trying to) translate some dealing with women's football. Just to bring this new source of potential articles to everyone's notice. - Master Of Ninja 21:52, 31 July 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Nice one.  My French is a bit rusty but I can help out with French to English translations if you need a hand.  CTOAGN 20:59, 6 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Importing articles from the French project 

message: For the past month, the Football World Cup article has been an edit war revolving around the third place finish at the 1930 World Cup. Does anyone want to step in and try to regulate it? It's getting ridiculous. --DR31 (talk) 15:51, 14 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I've just requested the page to be protected since it long passed the grounds of being reasonanle  (with several 3RR violations) and well, generally lame.  wS;✉ 22:38, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

text: Indeed, no (I was fooled by the number of successive edits about that which in practical terms isn't that different from a 3RR), and I've scratched that from the RFP. Still, the page should have been blocked eons ago so that the issue could be properly discussed and a consensus reached. I'm trying a solution that might end this once and for all, 'to. wS;✉ 00:22, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Edit war at [[Football World Cup]]

message: There is an anon user, who used to be 85.165.217.156 and now seems to be User:SndrAndrss and 85.165.212.241 who is hell-bent on updating World Cup and Euro rosters... Incorrectly. This past week, I reverted Football World Cup 1994 (squads) at least four times after he repeatedly changed Stig Inge Bjørnebye's club. All attempts to contact him went for naught; so I asked User:Dale Arnett to protect the page. Since then he has moved on, first to 1992 European Football Championship (squads), where he did correct one spelling mistake but again, seems hell-bent to change it according to whatever his "correct" idea is. He also added links to non-existent squad pages (since reverted) at Football World Cup 1986, Football World Cup 1990, and 1988 European Football Championship. Previously, he has also tried to change stadium locations at Football World Cup 1994 to incorrect ones. I'm gonna be out of town for a week, and frankly, I'm really tired of reverting this guy. Any help would be appretiated. --DR31 (talk) 21:12, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I'll keep an eye open. I've also contacted admins on the IRC channel so they'll hopefully check him out and ban him if he does anything more. -- Elisson • Talk 21:30, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, sorry for butting in. Anyway, I stumbled upon this page from somewhere else and wanted to clarify an issue Stig Inge Bjørnebye. I've got a Norwegian book (VM i fotball 1994 by Jon Michelet and Dag Solstad) - which clearly states that Bjørnebye played for Rosenborg and not Liverpool during the 1994 World Cup. This Norwegian website (stats provided by a prominent Norwegian newspaper - Aftenposten) seems to confirm that he was contracted to Liverpool, but also played eight games for Rosenborg - suggesting a loan deal. I don't know any more than that, I was too young, but maybe this book was the source of previous edits? Sam Vimes 22:02, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: He might have played on loan with Rosenoborg then, but Liverpool owned him from 1993 to 1999. But that's not the point; if the anon user in question offered the same information, at least some discussion could take place (although Liverpool is the better option here IMHO). http://www.planetworldcup.com/CUPS/1994/squad_nor94.html, which I used for the rosters, also says Liverpool. But he just refuses to communicate. Whatever the cases is, Raducioiu was not on West Ham until 1996, Foxboro Stadium is not located in Boston (which some sources could claim, but it's just not), etc, etc, etc. --DR31 (talk) 22:15, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I see your point. I'd say it's a bit extreme to protect the page, though, but if you're really tired of the content dispute I can understand it. It prevents legit editors with a source (me, for example ;)) from updating it. Btw, if you used that page for the rosters, you should really have put it on the bottom as a source. I still think "Rosenborg on loan from Liverpool" would be the best solution - I'll see if I can dig out some old Norwegian newspapers to solve the conundrum. Also, I'll take your word for the Foxboro thing - again, my book says Boston/San Francisco etc., which is probably the result of trying to convey location to ignorant Norwegians who have no idea where in the wide expanse of America Foxboro is. Sam Vimes 22:26, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: At this point, since there is a legit source saying that he indeed was on Rosenborg... I don't know. Constant reverting of his crap (and Bjørnebye/1994 rosters were just the most blatant issue, which in retrospect turned out to be not the best example) just got too tiring. As for "on loan"... I think we would then have to include EVERY player who was on loan prior to that tournament for consistency. DR31 (talk) 22:36, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

text: I see the problem. As said - sorry for butting in, I just want the info to be as correct as possible :) Sam Vimes 22:39, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Don't be sorry... Good to know he wasn't hallucinating about something. DR31 (talk) 22:46, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Well, maybe him getting an user page will help. :) Sam Vimes 22:49, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

text: after a session of searching on soccerbase I've reverted the lot. Oldelpaso 17:03, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Help request

message: Yesterday I created a page for the forthcoming FIFA U-17 World Championship 2005 and edited the Awards section for the page FIFA U-17 World Championship . Since I'm new to Wiki and therefore new to this great project. I want to find a template to follow, but i cannot. Current international tournaments are in different styles. For instance,
the introduction page
*Football World Cup
*European Football Championship
*Copa América
*European Under-19 Football Championship
the details page
*Football World Cup 2002
*Football World Cup 1998
*2004 European Football Championship
*2005 European Under-19 Football Championship
*FIFA U-17 World Championship 2005, the one i edited, derived from the above pages
It's better to have the same(or similar) template for these tournaments, at least for those uncreated ones , isn't it? i know there's a template for listing the Finals and the 3rd-Place playoff matches in every tournaments of the same competetion, but it seems not enough.
As for the names of these competetions, i also suggest we all follow the same naming conventions.
Zeeel 10:35, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Sorry for not answering this until now, must have missed it earlier. I agree with everything you say and this is the page to come to. Hopefully we will be able to establish a more in-depth manual of style for tournaments later on, until then, just keep the page nice and clean (as you have already done). :) -- Elisson • Talk 17:14, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Template for international tournament needed 

message: Anyone who can spare a minute to help the janitorial side of things, please go to Talk:Scarborough Football Club and vote on/discuss a proposed move to Scarborough F.C. for consistency's sake. Thanks. Qwghlm 23:28, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Scarborough Football Club]] 

message: Robin van Persie is being repeatedly vandalised by an anonymous IP address (82.16.142.131) to add some non-notable joke fanclub. Up until now I've been fixing it myself but I'm going to be away for a few days. Can someone keep an eye on it for me? Thanks. Qwghlm 08:35, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vandalism 

message: As you can easily see, there is a lack of standardization for the way to represent the team rosters. A number of several examples could be found here:
* AC Milan;
* S.S. Lazio;
* A.C. Parma;
* US Città di Palermo.
I guess that we all should make a unique standard form to represent the team squads, to be used for all the football articles. Other brand-new proposals are well accepted. Ciao. --Angelo 20:37, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: This should be discussed on the Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Clubs of Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Clubs, as that manual of style handles the question. The standard used on that page can be seen in use on for example IFK Göteborg. -- Elisson • Talk 20:52, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  Thanks. Now I have correctly opened this discussion on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Clubs. --Angelo 15:07, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text:  This means that I am proposing to improve the current team squad representation standard, and implementing it in all articles. So, folks, I am waiting for your proposals and comments here. Any suggestion is welcome. --Angelo 14:28, 12 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  A standard for team squad representations 

message: Arsenal F.C. has been nominated as a Featured Article Candidate. Comments and criticisms are welcome. Qwghlm 12:46, 12 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Featured Article Candidate 

message: User:Jeffmilner created Template:Infobox_Football_(soccer)_stadium and started propagating it. I personally don't like it and think it has some features that are downright useless (Surface???). What do you guys think?
--Sebastian Kessel Talk 23:16, 14 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I created Template:Football stadium a while ago. I agree that there are too many variables. Most things should be mentioned in the article itself, with just the most important facts being present in the infobox. -- Elisson • Talk 23:25, 14 October 2005 (UTC)

text: Have to say that the first template by User:Jeffmilner seems overly complex, and that the variables demolished etc. are not really needed. Template:Football stadium seems a better one. Maybe try and get User:Jeffmilner involved? - Master Of Ninja 05:58, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: There is possibly a need for two templates - one for football stadiums that are currently in use (and don't need the closed date, etc.) and one for disused or no-longer existing ones (which will). But yes, Template:Infobox_Football_(soccer)_stadium has far too many unnecessary variables (surface - always grass, construction cost - inflation will distort the figure, architect - often there have been more than one, former names - rare, tenants/owners - some are owned by their occupiers, others leased). Can someone be bold and come up with a list of variables they think should be included? Qwghlm 11:02, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I think the template created by Elisson does the job well. The other template will have a lot of blank fields in far too many cases. Oldelpaso 12:44, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: *Sigh* - I guess as a consequence of unbridled enthusiasm I went and changed a lot of pages with a template that isn't exactly to everyone's liking. I should have come to this page and talked about it first. I wanted to use a template that was already in circulation but I couldn't find anything for "soccer" stadiums. Therefore I created my own new template based on a template I saw used in another sports stadium posting. Once I had spent all the work making it up and adding it to a bunch of pages I discovered the Template:Football stadium but pressed ahead - I guess because of all the work I had already invested.  So the question is now, should I go back and revert all my changes? Should I just modify the Template:Infobox_Football_(soccer)_stadium removing some of the fields that are extraneous, or should I do something else? I like the look of my new template (obviously biased opinion) and I do think some of the extra fields are nice - like former names. Jeff 18:36, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Jeff, next week I'll revert the Argentine stadiums back to what they were until we stabilize the template, unless we can reach a consensus before then. --Sebastian Kessel Talk 23:48, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

text: Just to chip in that some work in tidying up things is always good. I think the problem is that the template will have too many blank fields as someone else has mentioned. Some of the other information can easily be put into the main text (or ?maybe a secondary template??) No need to go reverting or changing things just yet. If we can reach an agreement of a standard taking everyone's opinions into account, we can then gradually move things over to the new template. - Master Of Ninja 14:35, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  New Template?? 

message: --Angelo 21:16, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[England national under-21 football team]] 

message: After a long discussion, I guess it is time to approve the new standardization for football team squads. It has been discussed on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Clubs. It would be characterized as follows:
* The graphical appeal is the one shown on the talk, but divided in two column, in the way proposed in the talk itself;
* Loan information will appear just for incoming players, because the other ones actually are not part of the team;
* Captain and vice-captain information should appear, of course when they are retrievable;
* No 2nd nationality info for players;
* No non-english spellings for player names;
The templates to be made up are explained on the talk too. --Angelo 21:16, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I have done kind of a simple template implementation, based on the ideas developed on the talk page. You may find it into my sandbox. Take a look and tell me what you think about. Ciao. --Angelo 20:39, 29 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi, just to let you know about a small problem in the new squad template!  Please, have a look at K.S.V. Roeselare where the club infobox and the squad are not compatible.  Thanx, Julien Tuerlinckx 11:29, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Removing the width="100%" text in Template:Football squad start would solve that problem, and is highly advisable IMHO. Qwghlm 11:38, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Fixed. --Angelo 11:56, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Great. I've put it into use at Arsenal F.C. - if it's good enough for a featured article it's good enough elsewhere. What needs to be done is to add some documentation to Template talk:Football squad player on how to use it - I can do that if you like. After that it can be propagated elsewhere. Qwghlm 12:30, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

text: Am now (slowly) ploughing through changing FA Premier League team squads changing them... Qwghlm 23:01, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: All the Premier League squads which used simple squad lists have been updated (the more complex ones I have left alone). I'll have a start on the SPL and Championship squads later. If anyone's interested, I used a Python script to scrape out the relevant data from the existing lists to make the job easier.Qwghlm 12:25, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

text: I have already updated all the Serie A articles. --Angelo 00:31, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I am on my way for Jupiler League articles guys, I bet I won't have too much "competition" so I am going very slowly.  Julien Tuerlinckx 00:42, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: I finished with a little help from User:LimoWreck. Julien Tuerlinckx 18:06, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

text: i am going to redo the other variable, i dont know about anyone else, but i find it a bit useless to have a variable called other and then restrict it's use to one of two pre-set conditions that call on another template to display the display the exact thing you just typed in, if you wanted to set a specific variable system, other is not the lable you should use, it only confuses people that are not fimilar with the temple and do not know where to look for instrustions. I 'll set it where it will not be dislpalyed if not being used, will keep the spacer, and will include the  ( ), but will aloow for the addation of other information, like loan in/out, suspension, or other info that would pertain to the player. This will allow the space to be more flexable, be more of an other varialbe, and elimniate to redundant templates in the mean time. --Boothy443 |  trácht ar 05:40, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Fine by me. The new way is more flexible and closer to how I envisaged it in the first place. Qwghlm 12:25, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  New squad list representation template? 

message: I made the Template:nft which cold be very useful. Writing  will link to the Brazil national team. There was a place to put all this templates around here, but I can't fnd it. --Wonderfool t(c) 14:08, 29 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Nice. Since this is mainly an aid to writing articles and unlikely to change format, I would recommend using the form  which will directly convert it to the wiklink text in the article (rather than maintain the curly-bracket form). Qwghlm 16:45, 29 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah this is a very good thing.  Thanx, Julien Tuerlinckx 16:47, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

text: great. --Monkbel 13:52, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Nice, I just thought it was sometimes a bit strange to have only Country in the text so I think it's a good thing.  I'll try it, even if it might sometime be quite long.  By the way I don't get the "subst" thing.  Can anyone show an example? Julien Tuerlinckx 15:35, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: If you add  to an article, then that template value stays in the article's source text, so when someone else edits it they will see . If you type , then the Wiki will substitute the template's contents into the source code directly, so all future edits of the source text will have Brazil - IMHO that will probably make more sense to future editors of the article not familiar with the nft template. Wikipedia:Transclusion_costs_and_benefits#How_substitution_works has more information. Qwghlm 15:51, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Ok I got it.  Thanks a lot, Julien Tuerlinckx 16:12, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Template:nft 

message: What about a template for the players' career? Like "Year" "Team" "GP" "Goals" or something like that.
I'd be available to put it into some player's articles. --necronudist 13:07, 5 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: It already exists, see Julio Cruz for an example. --Angelo 19:16, 5 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I've found it just few hours ago. I'll use that, thanx. --necronudist 21:02, 5 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Players' career template? 

message: I just made this page, but stumbled when it came to colour schemes, being all numbers. The shirt colours can be found at The homepage. --Dangherous 17:36, 5 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Moor Green F.C.]] 

message: An anon keeps trying to get messages about Liverpool being the most successful club in England into the intro. I've made three reversions in the last 24 hours, so can somebody revert it back and keep an eye on the page for me?
Thanks,  CTOAGN (talk) 16:33, 15 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  POV-pushing on [[Manchester United F.C.]] 

message: As the England and Argentina football rivalry article is a great one IMHO, but not the only international rivalry worthy of an article, I'd really like to see articles on Argentina and Brazil football rivalry and Germany and the Netherlands football rivalry, to mention two. What other rivalries on this level are a must have? -- Elisson • Talk 00:22, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Hi , France and Italy football rivalry is another good one (think about games during World Cup & European championship)Dingy 02:36, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: We could talk about the Lowlands football rivalry because it is a very old rivalry (first match in 1905) and you can also remember WC94 and 98... Julien Tuerlinckx 00:08, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Country rivalries 

message: Sorry, I don't know where to place this, but here's my question. As an amateur soccer player, I was wondering if perhaps someone could create an article listing various soccer commands and perhaps their meaning, such as 'man on' or 'cross' or stuff like that. This could also be translated into other languages. Thanks for reading. Gflores Talk 03:20, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Well I'll start one but I'm not sure eventually where this will move over to wiktionary (or however it's spelt). Here: Football (soccer) terminology - Master Of Ninja 09:00, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Request for article 

message: The Guardian is currently running an article in its football section which refers to two Wikipedia articles (Tottenham Hotspur F.C. and Athletic Bilbao) in answer to a question about the origins of club colours. Oldelpaso 09:16, 26 November 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Guardian football section references two Wikipedia articles

message: I know that freestyle soccer and tricks in general are very popular in Europe and in soccer commercials. Perhaps there should be some mention of it somewhere? Gflores Talk 02:32, 5 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  Request for an article: Freestyle soccer 

message: Someone is removing some articles from this category (e.g. Luc Nilis and Gilles De Bilde).  How could we stop this? Julien Tuerlinckx 18:32, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: [[:Category:Football (soccer) strikers]]

message: I was toying with the idea of doing an article with a list of the team dresses/kits of all national teams, using Template:Football kit. It would be similar to gallery of sovereign state flags, but with football kits instead. What do you think? Is it a good idea? Should I go for it, or cancel the project? • 辻斬り? 21:14, 14 December 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Cancel it. It wouldn't be worth the time. Who should constantly keep it up to date with the changes on the national team pages? -- Elisson • Talk 23:57, 14 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  List of national football team kits/dresses/colours 

message: I was looking through Hungary-related player, stadium and club pages and found they are more or less neglected. (Which conforms to the present state of Hungarian football but that's another story.) So I've decided to fix and expand as many entries as I can. This will include the one on Ferenc Puskás, based on the aforementioned German article and the [|biography] published this year. I'm glad to find this project. --Biziclop 11:24, 18 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Hungarian football

message: Plays out again in 2015-16. Maybe anyone want's to have a look about my changes there. -Koppapa (talk) 09:54, 3 April 2015 (UTC)
thread_title: [[Eredivisie (women)]]

message: Me again. A few weeks ago I uploaded two images to Commons which allegedly show football player Abby Dahlkemper (then of the UCLA women's soccer team and now signed with the Western New York Flash). Judging from the UCLA roster of 2014, however, shirt number 21 seems to have belonged to Megan Oyster (current Washington Spirit rookie). Considering that both players kinda do look alike... is the original file description wrong? --Headlocker (talk) 15:45, 16 April 2015 (UTC)
replies: text: great photos! It does look more like Megan Oyster to me when reviewing google images and the 2014 roster. I'll be working on Dahlkemper's article soon.Hmlarson (talk) 02:15, 30 April 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Files in [[c:Category:Abby Dahlkemper|Commons category:Abby Dahlkemper]] 

message: The article about Zhao Lina, a GK for China, has been nominated for deletion. Please consider sharing your thoughts on the matter at this article's entry on the AFD page. Hmlarson (talk) 08:18, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Article alert: [[Zhao Lina]] up for deletion 

message: The article about Australian player Jessica Humble has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to join the discussion at:
* Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jessica Humble (2nd nomination)
Hmlarson (talk) 00:50, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
thread_title:  Women's football/soccer player article up for deletion 

message: A discussion is taking place as to whether the article :Jenna Fife is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.
The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jenna Fife until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.
Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. — Cirt (talk) 21:23, 6 April 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Nomination of [[:Jenna Fife]] for deletion