Talk:Belle Vue Zoological Gardens

message: This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as stub, and the rating on other projects was brought up to Stub class. BetacommandBot 02:40, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: WikiProject class rating

message: This article says that a ride was purchased from London Festival Gardens when it closed it 1977, but the Battersea Park article says that the Gardens closed in 1974. Is 1977 right? --Malleus Fatuarum (talk) 13:59, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: Yup, that's what my research says. As the Battersea Park article wasn't cited I amended it. --WebHamster 14:06, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
replies: text: I've just done a quick check on Google and can only find one mention of a 1974 closure. In fact the entry in the WP article looks like a straight copy and paste from the above site. --WebHamster 14:12, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Gardens and amusement park 

message: I came across an article in the Guardian Archives from April 1st, 1926, searching under William Gentle. It is a report of an early shareholders meeting. It answers my question above. I thought it may be of interest to editors of this article. You can get a 24hr free pass to the sie by entering, if I remember rightly, "ARCHIVRFREE" in the appropriate space - if the code's wrong, you can find it by searching on Google. hjuk (talk) 12:28, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
thread_title: Guardian Article

message: I was looking on Google books and came across this  which is rather interesting - it's all about the pyrodamas at Belle Vue in the 19th century. A google books search on "Belle Vue Zoological Gardens" comes up with quite a bit of informationRicherman (talk) 23:03, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I had referred to them, albeit in minimal detail, in the fireworks section. I've called them fireworks, the references I had called them both. TBH I didn't really spend a lot of time on the section because I was trying to get a minimal amount on the page about everything and I had yet to cover the 50s and 60s era with the dancehalls etc... I've been otherwise distracted of late otherwise I would have filled everything out in more detail. Belle Vue and Broughton were very much in contest with each other and Jennison was always trying to find ways to outdo them, hence the pyrodramas. I do have a lot of info in the books in the bibliography that I haven't touched on yet, but when I get a chance I will indeed have a butcher's through google books with the link you gave. I have had a quick look and yes it does look interesting. So much so I was going to have a stab at buying the book from Amazon UK, until I saw the price! £165.29. Yeah right, I'll have two :) --WebHamster 23:25, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh well, just as well there's a free preview! It looks like the pyrodaramas of that time would make a decent article themselves - it seems that's how Pain's fireworks started out. I was looking for information on the Broughton Zoo when I found that - I'm sure it would be worth a small article - I seem to remember seeing a map of the Broughton Zoo in Salford Local History library and it's mentioned in a few google books. Good to see you back on this article anyway. Richerman (talk) 23:46, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks, I've been meaning to as there's an awful lot I haven't added, but real life isn't giving me the opportunity to sit down, do the reading then convert that into adequate prose for the article. The books are on my shelf just longing to be read. It's not helped of late my dissatisfaction with the project as a whole, but hopefully I'll soon get my act together. This is a pet project for me, along with the Jennison family themselves. I started a userfied subpage article on John Jennison but as in the main article I haven't got round to filling that out either. But yes I agree, the Belle Vue Pyrodramas would make a good article in its own right. --WebHamster 11:11, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Pyrodramas 

message: Alan Kidd in his book Manchester: A History states that the zoological gardens at Higher Broughton closed in 1840 and the Jennison aquired it's stock. Kidd's book is a general one, so may not be correct or may be missing some details (maybe the place at Higher Broughton was reopened) but the above quote doesn't seem quote right. Nev1 (talk) 14:19, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I'm not certain that Kidd's right in this case. Manchester Zoological Gardens appears to have closed down in 1842. Perhaps worth an article in its own right ... --Malleus Fatuorum 14:36, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Fair enough, I have found that on at least one occasion before (relating to Manchester Cathedral in the same book) he has been inexplicably wrong. Nev1 (talk) 14:39, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Financial difficulties

message: He says that New King's Hall at Belle Vue was "the leading boxing venue in Europe". He's not specific, but this was probably in the 1930s which was the "golden age" of boxing in Manchester. Perhaps not enough to add to the article now, but if more can be found it would make a nice quote. Nev1 (talk) 14:29, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Stackhouse and Hyams say much the same thing: "The 1920s were a great time for boxing in Manchester, and Belle Vue became one of the best venues in Europe." Things seem to have gone downhill after the Second World War, but there was still a world title fight between Willie Pastrano and Terry Downes held there in 1964. --Malleus Fatuorum 14:51, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Also from Kidd

message: Please be aware that some of the wording I've used is used deliberately so as to avoid infringing the copyright of the reference source I'm using. I've noticed that when other editors are copyediting the article they are changing the wording back to almost the identical wording used in the reference sources. Please don't change things merely because you think they look better when worded differently, you could actually be changing them to the version I've tried to avoid. If you don't have copies of the reference source could you please be very careful when making subjective edits. Thanks. --The Pink Oboe (talk) 15:21, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: If the editor making the change hasn't actually seen the original version and therefore can't be copying it, then there can be no question of copyright violation. Sometimes there are rather limited ways of stating a simple fact. That's one of the downsides of the increasingly onerous "one citation per sentence" brigade. I think it's rather absurd to avoid the best wording simply because you didn't think of it first. --Malleus Fatuorum 15:49, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I have to agree on the absurdity, but my point wasn't about the individual editors breaching copyright, it's about the end result making the project breach copyright. After all, copyright is copyright regardless of whether its infringement is deliberate or not. Anyway, I just thought I'd point out why occasionally my wording is a little awkward. I went to great pains to make sure that I wasn't copying the sources word for word, even though it was a pain in the ass sometimes. --The Pink Oboe (talk) 16:58, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't think anyone could be concerned about the odd sentence or two closely reflecting the text of a cited source, particularly if it's accidental. I get concerned when I see passages of text that have clearly been copied, not just a few consecutive words that appear to best express the idea. --Malleus Fatuorum 17:25, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Copyediting 

message: This is one big ol' article! I think Kings Hall deserves its own article by itself. Do we all agree? It's so famous Rod Stewart performed there on many occasions! Evangp (talk) 07:44, 25 March 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: If you can find enough reliable material on Kings Hall then go for it. It wouldn't make any difference to the size of this article though. Malleus Fatuorum 21:01, 2 April 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I was thinking about copying and pasting the info from this article to Kings Hall main article as I think there is already enough info to merit its own article. All I can add differently is an extensive list of performers. Would this be okay? Evangp (talk) 21:05, 2 April 2013 (UTC)
replies: text: I think you'd need more than that, otherwise the article would very likely be nominated for deletion. You might try looking through the MEN archive and see what you can find there. Malleus Fatuorum 21:20, 2 April 2013 (UTC)
thread_title: Kings Hall

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message: /--Johnsoniensis (talk) 16:39, 9 October 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Showcase