Talk:Giuliana Sgrena

message: 80.202.223.175, in 
Do you happen to know who made this statement then ? This information (citing Calderoli) was on Le Monde, which usually don't say things without some care, so if you know better I'll trust you of course, but if you just edited it because it sounded too much like Pier Scolari, it might have been actually correct initially. Rama 15:10, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: Oh, OK; I think that I put it back into the article while organising the various declarations of Italian personalities, so perhaps you might want to give it another edit -- obviously better you do it than me, my Italian is not fluent. Thanks very much ! Rama 17:56, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  It wasn't Calderoli who said that... 

message: What's a fannal? 66.60.159.190 20:14, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: probably "projector", badly translated. Feel free to change if it's not a direct quotation of an English-speaking personality (which it seems not to be...) Rama 20:25, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: fannal

message: The current article says that the Italians are claiming that more than 300 shots were fired, but only one hit the man who was killed, and further down it says "The identity of the soldier who fired remains unknown.".  Are we to believe that only one soldier fired 300 to 400 rounds, and that, of the 300 to 400 rounds, only one hit the man who was killed?  66.60.159.190 20:16, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
replies: text: the sentence "The identity of the soldier who fired remains unknown." seems to be less precise than the others. Yet, Fini, after hearing the testimony of the surviving agent, said that the shooting had lasted between 12 and 15 seconds (you can easily send hundreds of bullets in the air in such a time); also, I read somewhere that about a dozen impacts were on the car. It's highly probable that most of the firing was supposed to be warning shots, but I'll leave the conjectures to the experts who have the evidences and knowledge... Rama 20:23, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)

text: For what I have read, the car bears a dozen impacts. If this is the car, they are only visible from the other side (with makes this photograph moderatly informative, I hope that most illustrative ones will be available) Rama 22:27, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Contradictions in the present wording

message: Can this allegation be substantiated?  RickK 07:48, Mar 10, 2005 (UTC)
:If you mean whether references can be found, there is one in  The Observer, for instance (though I have seen this in numerous places). Our article on Wikinews also mentions this, they probably have references as well (I find it difficult to reach Wikinews at the moment). Rama 08:52, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: "US forces confiscated cell and satellite phones from the car's occupants in the immediate aftermath of the shooting."

message: Italian government published a report  (pdf, in italian) that disputes conlusions of US report and many speculations and news published in these days; for examples,  it denies the existence of satellite pictures, and it affirms that there are discordances on the car speed between us soldiers. also, it blames that scene of the killing has been altered before the investigations. I'll check for a english translation. GhePeU 21:43, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title:  US report officially rejected by italian government 

message: *(U) A forensic examination of the car was performed after its removal from the scene. This analysis disclosed 11 entrance bullet holes. They are consistent with 7.62 mm bullets. Three bullets perforated the front section of the car at the bumper, right head light, and right fender. Two bullets perforated the windshield. Six bullets perforated the right side, right door, right front and rear passenger windows. No bullet holes or ricochet damage was noted on the car’s undercarriage. (Annex 1I). 
*(U) The trajectory analysis demonstrated that all 11 bullets came from one point of origin. The actual distance from the car to the machine gun could not be conclusively determined because of several variables: the grade of the curve and curvature of the roadway; depressions or elevations of the terrain; the lateral movement of the car; human reaction time, modulation of speed and braking by the driver; a flat tire; and lateral and vertical movement of the machine gun. The security situation at the incident site prevented examiners from visiting the scene. (Annex 1I). 
If the car was traveling towards a stationary vehicle along a curving road, i.e. not parked in parallel vector of the car's movement, then you would not expect all the shots to have gone through the dead front of the vehicle. There is not evidence that the car was shot from the side, the rear side, or the rear. TDC 21:54, May 2, 2005 (UTC)
I would also add the part about the "crime scene disturbance":
*(U) Ideally, the scene of the incident would have been preserved as it existed immediately after the shooting was over and the car had stopped. Doing so would have allowed the initial investigators to get precise measurements on the distances and locations of the significant objects involved in the event. An initial on-site investigation was conducted, but a number of circumstances that occurred on the site prevented the incident site from being treated as a sterile site. Both HMMWVs involved in the blocking position were moved to transport Ms. Sgrena to the Combat Support Hospital in the International Zone. Further, the scene was not deemed to be a crime scene, and efforts were made to clear the roadway. As a result, the car was moved from its position, per the unit’s Standing Operating Procedure on Consequence Management, before a location using a global positioning system could be obtained. At the direction of the Commander, 2d Brigade, 10th Mountain Division the car was placed back in the position that was thought to be its actual stopping point based on eyewitness testimony and digital photographs taken of the car before its initial removal from the scene.  
This shows that there are no accusations of tempering with the scene in the US Army report (it says nothing about other sources). Rama 22:14, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: US Army's forensic examination

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