Talk:Dayalbagh

message: I am adding these additional citations to prevent future vandalism and provide a one-stop avenue for anyone wishing to know more about the importance of the matter.
# PhD student rape case transferred outside UP, May 1, 2017. Times of India []
# Supreme Court of India orders transfer of Neha Sharma murder case trial outside UP, Apr 30, 2017. Times of India []
# Neha Sharma murder case: Charges framed against lab technician for tampering with evidence, 28 November 2016. Indian Express. []
# Neha Sharma murder case: Agra court sends prime accused to jail, 30 May 2016. India Today []
# Family of girl raped, killed in Agra lab wants case shifted, 29 May 2016. Times of India []
# Research scholar’s ‘murder’ in Agra: Being pressured to withdraw case, says victim’s father, 25 May 2016. Indian Express []
# Neha Sharma murder case: Agra court sends prime accused to jail, 13 May 2016. India Today []
# Agra Lab murder: Court order arrest of Neha Sharma murder accused, 12 May 2016. Times of India []
# Fellow student murdered Neha Sharma: CBI, 7 January 2016. Times of India []
# Researcher murder:CBI files charge sheet against prime accused, 6 January 2016. Business Standard []
# Agra lab murder: CBI files chargesheet against 2 in Neha case, 5 January 2016. Times of India []
# 2 years after student’s murder in Agra university lab, hacker held, 6 October 2015. Times of India []
# Neha Sharma murder case: Probe with no end?, 9 January 2015. Times of India []
# Agra lab killing: 4 days after wife’s death, accused allowed last rites, 9 January 2014. Indian Express[]
# CBI team reaches Agra to probe into scholar's killing, 4 September 2013. The Pioneer []
# CBI to investigate Agra research scholar’s death, 8 August 2013. Indian Express []
# Agra research scholars murder: UP recommends CBI probe, 25 July 2013. Indian Express []
# UP CM recommends CBI probe into 3 murders, 25 July 2013. The Tribune []
# Youth claims to have witnessed murder of Agra research scholar, 18 July 2013. Indian Express[]
# Neha Sharma murder case: Court rejects bail pleas of 2 accused, 16 July 2013. News18. []
# Neha Sharma murder case: Bail pleas of 2 accused rejected, 16 July 2013. DelhiDailyNews. []
# Ex-Director’s grandson, aide arrested, 26 April 2013. Daily Excelsior. []
# Laboratory of murder clues, 25 April 2013. Indian Express []
# `Not sure whether Neha was raped before death`, 25 April 2013. Zee News []
# Agra: Neha murder case solved, 25 April 2013. iNextLive []
# Agra researchers murder: Student,lab technician held, 24 April 2013. Indian Express []
# Agra researcher murder case: 2 sent to police remand, 23 April 2013. Web India []
# 2 arrested in sensational Neha Sharma murder case in Agra, 23 April 2013. Web India []
# College Trust Chairman's grandson arrested for killing girl in Agra over one-sided Love!, 23 April 2013. India TV []
# Parents of Agra researcher want CBI to handle murder probe, 22 April 2013. Indian Express []
# Brahmin Sabha demands CBI probe into Neha murder case, 17 April 2013. Daily Excelsior []
# Jammu girl’s murder still unsolved, 13 April 2013. Daily Excelsior []
# JKP team to visit Agra, 2 April 2013. Daily Excelsior []
# Forensic experts begin probe into researcher's murder case, 1 April 2013. NDTV []
# Cops release sketches of Agra murder suspects, 25 March 2013. Indian Express []
# J&K to send police team to UP, 21 March 2013. Daily Excelsior. []
# Agra murder: Cops suspect academic rivalry, 19 March 2013. Indian Express []
# Killer chased Agra researcher around lab: Cops, 18 March 2013. Indian Express []
# Agra Murder Case: Student protest in Agra, 18 March 2013. India TV []
# Agra: 24-year old woman scientist murdered, 17 March 2013. NewsXpress []
# Woman researcher brutally killed in Agra institute, 17 March 2013. Times of India []
# Question Hour: Another Nirbhaya murdered (March 16, 2013)- Part 1, 16 March 2013. NewsNation. []
# Agra Girl student found stabbed to death in her college lab, 16 March 2013. India TV []
# Agra: Girl student found dead in her college lab, 16 March 2013. News18 []
# Case discussed in UP Legislative Assembly, official link []
Resources in Hindi:
# आगरा में शोध छात्रा की हत्या का मामला विधानसभा में गूंजा, Jagran [] 
# शोध छात्रा की हत्या को लेकर कार्यवाही स्थगित, Hindustan []
# आगरा पीएचडी छात्रा मर्डर केस: नए सबूतों में उलझी पुलिस, News18 IBN7 []
# PHD छात्रा मर्डर केस: लैब टैक्नीशियन और छात्र गिरफ्तार, News18 IBN7 []
# PHD छात्रा मर्डर केस: पेनड्राइव के लिए हुई नेहा की हत्या?, News18 IBN7 []  
# छात्रा मर्डर केस: 2 लोगों पर अटकी पुलिस के शक की सुई, News18 IBN7 []
# आगरा छात्रा मर्डर केस में शक के घेरे में दो लोग, News18 IBN7 []
# आगरा: लैब में पीएचडी छात्रा की हत्या में एक गिरफ्तार, News18 IBN7 []
# आगरा PHD छात्रा मर्डर केस: लैब टैक्नीशियन गिरफ्तार, News18 IBN 7 []
# बसपा ने वि.परिषद् में उठाया शोध छात्रा की हत्या का मामला, BSP India []
# शोध छात्रा हत्याकांड पर फूटा आक्रोश, Jagran []
# शोध छात्रा की हत्या के दो आरोपी हिरासत में, IANS []
# आगरा में छात्रा के कत्ल की दास्तान सुन अखिलेश की आंखें नम, NewsOneIndia []
# आगराः नेहा के घरवालों को पांच साल से इंसाफ का इंतजार, MSN []
# सीबीआई ने दर्ज किया शोध छात्रा की हत्या का मामला, NavBharat Times []
# शोध छात्रा हत्या की जांच को सीबीआइ का डेरा, Jagran []
# शोध छात्रा के पिता को जान का खतरा, Jagran []
# बलात्कार के बाद बेरहमी से हुआ था नेहा का कत्ल!, Hindustan []
# आगरा के हाई प्रोफाइल नेहा हत्या कांड में सीबीआई ने दाखिल की चार्जशीट।, SamacharDuniya []
# एक तर्फी प्रेमको नतिजा, Kalika FM Nepal []
# लैब में शोध छात्रा की हत्या मामले में रिटायर्ड आईएएस का नाती भेजा जा रहा जेल, Bhadas4Media []
# नेहा शर्मा हत्याकांड में सुनवाई अब 22 जनवरी को, Amar Ujala []
# आगरा में चर्चित नेहा हत्याकांड की सुनवाई 22 को, Hindustan []
# बहुचर्चित नेहा हत्याकांड : सुनवाई आगरा न्यायालय में, पिता की याचिका खारिज, LiveNewXpress[]
# नेहा शर्मा हत्याकांड में अब चार्जशीट की तैयारी, Amar Ujala []
# नेहा शर्मा हत्याकांड में अब उदय स्वरूप को हिरासत में लेने की होगी सुनवाई, Samachar Dunia []
# नेहा शर्मा हत्याकांड :सीबीआई ने दाखिल की चार्ज शीट, TheIndianXpress []
# उप्र के 3 मामलों को सीबीआई जांच का इंतजार, Deshbandhu []
# आगरा में शोध छात्रा की कालेज परिसर में हत्या, TaazaSamachar []
# बहुचर्चित नेहा हत्याकांड : कोर्ट से आरोपी को दिया एक हफ्ते का समय, EENaduIndia []
# शोध छात्रा हत्‍याकांड: सीबीआई जांच की सिफारिश पर उठे सवाल, Dainik Bhaskar []
# शोध छात्रा मर्डर में 3 संदिग्धों के स्केच जारी, ZeeNews []
# शोध छात्रा की आगरा कालेज में रेप और हत्या, MeriBitiya []
# दुष्कर्म पीड़िता के पिता ने चिट्‌ठी लिखकर लोगों से न्याय दिलाने की अपील की, KhaasKhabar []
# आगरा: डीईआइ में शोध छात्रा की निर्मम हत्या, सड़क पर उतरे छात्र, AjmerNaama []
# आगरा: कातिल के गिरेबां तक ऐसे पहुंचे रहे हैं पुलिस के हाथ, AjmerNama []
# आगरा में छात्रा की हत्या के विरोध में हंगामा, VirArjun []
# शोध छात्रा की हत्या के दो आरोपी हिरासत में, DeshBandhu []
# शोध छात्रा हत्याकांड में तीन संदिग्धों के स्कैच जारी, Dainik Tribune []
# आगरा शोध छात्रा हत्याकांड की जांच सीबीआई के हवाले, IBN7 []
# आगरा के नेहा हत्याकांड में उदय के साथ संधू पर भी आरोप तय, Raftaar []
# नेहा शर्मा मर्डर: केस दिल्ली ट्रांसफर करवाने वाली याचिका को सुप्रीम कोर्ट ने किया ख़ारिज, LiveNewsUttarPradesh []
# नेहा हत्याकांडः उदयस्वरूप का डीएनए मिला, Patrika []
# आगरा: लैब में पीएचडी छात्रा की हत्या में एक गिरफ्तार, News18 []
# आगरा में शोध छात्रा की कालेज परिसर में हत्या, NDTVIndia []
# पांच माह में बदल गया लैब का नक्शा , Amar Ujala []
# आगरा कोर्ट में होगी छात्रा नेहा शर्मा की हत्या के मामले की सुनवाई, Sanjeevni Today []
# छात्रा की हत्या के बाद आगरा में बवाल, Amar Ujala []
# नेहा शर्मा हत्याकांड में पिता की गवाही सात को, Hindustan []
# आगरा के डीईआई शोध छात्रा नेहा शर्मा रेप केस, AgraBharat []
# सीबीआई करेगी नेहा शर्मा मर्डर की जांच, NavBharat Times []
# नेहा शर्मा हत्याकांड में सीबीआइ ने दर्ज किया केस, Dainik Jagran []
I hope this will be enough for every one.
JusticeNeeded123 (talk) 09:29, 15 March 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Resources and additional citations explaining the relevance, notability and importance of the Neha Sharma murder case 

message: I am not sure it is correct to say that the "suburb" entered "the national spotlight" based on what appears to be an unfortunate event that happened 5 years ago, and has been extensively discussed in the talk section below. While anyone certainly sympathizes with the family of the victim(s) of this crime, I am not sure it is appropriate to include this section. Essentially, it looks like we have a "stub"-class article about a "suburb in India", with a full section entitled "controversy" that is a collection of local news articles about a crime. Furthermore, based on the text, I am not sure what the ``controversy" is exactly, as "controversy" means "prolonged public disagreement or heated discussion". While one could include a list of crimes committed in any geographic location, township etc., I am not sure that this is the current practice followed by Wikipedia. (Statistics on murders and violent crime I guess could be included?) So propose I deleting or editing the new section. But I leave it to more experienced editors to take the final call, since it appears the user who added the section has an emotional interest in this issue, and I do not wish to upset them/enter in a prolonged debate.
Nilpotent137 (talk) 15:51, 13 March 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Edit/Remove new section Controversies? 

message: I am deleting the Neha Sharma murder case section for the following reasons:
# It is news-worthy for the people in Agra (for sometime), but not a major section in the article
# It occurred in the DEI campus and not Dayalbagh (the ashram) per se
Detrainman (talk) 03:28, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neha Sharma Murder Case 

message: AgraNewsObserver:
I am not going to edit the page right now, because we are in disagreement.
To clarify:
# I fully support transparency and justice in Neha Sharma's trial
# I wish that maximum penalty is given to the culprit(s)
# Some of your claims are allegations, and not facts till proven in court
# It appears that you do not like the Dayalbagh and Dayalbagh Educational Institute, and you are influenced by your feelings
Please read this:
# Go on other institute wiki pages and check if they have murders listed on their page.
# Go on any page about a suburb, and check if they have individual murders listed
# You will find that they don't have murders/crimes listed. This is not because the editors are insensitive, but because Wikipedia entry about Dayalbagh is intended be an encyclopedia, not a murder list
Finally:
# Create a separate Wiki page called "Neha Sharma Murder Case" and update it regularly
# If required, I will keep reverting your edits, till the end of the world.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Detrainman (talk • contribs) 19:12, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Neha Sharma Edit War 

message: If you are unable to achieve consensus, can I suggest you seek an experienced editor to review the discussion and who might come up with their thoughts on how to proceed? I have used this approach previously to good effect. Flat Out let's discuss it 04:57, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Content dispute 

message: I suggest that contributors familiarise themselves with WP:BLP policy before adding such material. Much of it seems to be sourced to scanned sources uploaded by unknown persons - this is never acceptable as (a) it braches copyright, and (b) it is impossible to verify the authenticity of the content. I suggest that anyone wishing to include material related to the murder in this article starts by linking here the necessary sources to establish that the murder case is of direct relevence to the subject of the article - and note that translation may be required for anything not in English. If it can be estanblished that this murder is relevent to the article topic at all, it will of course be necessary to discuss it only to the extent that due weight requires. This article must not be used as a coatrack for off-topic material, or as a means to disparage the subject of the article by implication. AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:20, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  I have deleted the 'murder case' section for gross violations of [[WP:BLP]] policy 

message: The section does not say that the accused is the murderer and is in line with NPOV. A lot of what is in the section can be verified at http://www.indianexpress.com/news/laboratory-of-murder-clues/1107266/0 . To verify the rest of the content, I request users having knowledge of Hindi to read the eArchives of Amar Ujala Agra edition dated 16th March to 30th April at http://earchive.amarujala.com.
I also request Andy to suggest better ways to source content published in print newsp apers.
AgraNewsObserver (talk) 15:39, 15 July 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Readding Neha Sharma murder case. 

message: People are getting quite excited about not getting this case added to wikipedia. Steven Colbert said that "Reality has become a commodity" for a reason. Out of curiosity ... did Andy ever get back to you about a better way to source content? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.125.121.9 (talk • contribs) 02:26, 30 August 2014‎
:Given the complete lack of evidence from published reliable sources so far provided that this murder is actually of direct relevance to the subject matter of the article, there appears to be nothing to add. AndyTheGrump (talk) 02:31, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
replies: text: The sources you name may well be reliable for some things - they can however only ever be reliable for things they actually say. What specific content from which of the sources you name establishes that this murder is of significance to a general article on the Dayalbagh colony? AndyTheGrump (talk) 03:01, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

text: And how exactly does that establish that a general article on Dayalbagh should include this murder case? It doesn't, as far as I can see. It is an article about a murder. Which accordingly says where the murder took place (though it actually names the  University rather than the colony, and the headline reads 'Jammu Research Scholar’s murder in Agra'). Which is normal for articles on murders. Our article on Delhi doesn't include every murder that took place there, does it? To establish that this murder is significant to this article, you need to show that sources providing a general discussion of DayalBagh discuss the murder, rather than showing that sources discussing the murder name the place it occurred. AndyTheGrump (talk) 03:43, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

text: I used the term colony because the article does - it obviously doesn't mean 'colony' in the usual sense of the term. As for adding content to the article on the institute, the same point applies - you need to provide evidence that the murder is considered significant in general discussions of the subject. AndyTheGrump (talk) 05:02, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

text: My reaction to you reposting a gross violation of multiple Wikipedia policies, which had already been discussed in depth on this very page a year ago (see above - though I have every reason to suspect you have already read it) was entirely appropriate. And stop trying to put words into my mouth. I have said nothing whatsoever about the article being 'misleading'. And no, I agree to nothing - you have yet to provide the slightest evidence that any sources discussing either Dayalbagh or the Institute consider this murder (or rather alleged murder) relevant to a general discussion of the respective subjects. Wikipedia does not routinely cover murders (they are sadly far too common to be notable by default), and when we do, we do so based on evidence that the murder itself meets our notability guidelines, in an article on the subject of the murder. We do not use other articles as a coatrack for coverage of non-notable murders, and neither do we use such unfortunate events as a means to manufacture an imaginary 'controversy' about the actual subject of an article. If you believe the murder meets Wikipedia notability guidelines (which I would have to suggest is debatable) you should create an article on it - one compliant with policies, rather than the half-baked concoction of innuendo you have been attempting to foist on this article. If the murder merits and mention in either this article or the one on the institute at all, it will merit nothing more than a senrtence at most - and only that if proper sourcing can be provided to indicate its direct relevance. AndyTheGrump (talk) 06:11, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

text: Since you have yet again grossly violated Wikipedia policy, I have nothing further to say to you. You seem utterly incapable of complying with a simple requirement that you do not make unsourced assertions of guilt, have gone out of your way to misrepresent what I have said, and have completely refused to even attempt to provide the evidence that this alleged murder merits inclusion in the article. Your violation of WP:BLP policy will be reported, together with a request that you be blocked from editing. AndyTheGrump (talk) 08:41, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
thread_title:  Readding Neha Sharma murder case. 

message: Since this page is being repeatedly targetted by vandals, I am creating this new section so that they can express their point of view as to why the controversy section should be removed. Explain yourself before removing the section. 
AgraDEIstudent (talk) 08:49, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Section for Discussion to prevent vandalism on the Controversies section 

message: It seems the name "Dayalbagh" refers both to a specific Ashram and to the locality in Agra surrounding that Ashram. Perhaps this should be clarified in the article.  NooneEdits (talk) 05:23, 12 May 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Locality vs Ashram 

message: To further clarify:  The locality called "Soami Bagh" ("Soami's Garden"), the former home of the late Shiv Dayal Singh and the present location of his tomb-shrine, is currently owned and controlled by the twin organizations known as the Radhasoami Satsang Central Administrative Council and the Radhasoami Trust (called "the Council and the Trust" for short).  Its next-door neighbor "Dayal Bagh" ("Dayal's Garden") is owned and controlled by the organization Dayalbagh Sabha. Dayal Bagh and its founder-guru Sir Anand Swarup, Kt. were broadcasted to the Western public by Paul Brunton in his famed A Search in Secret India.  Sir Anand Swarup received a knighthood for the massive social construction work performed at Dayal Bagh.  The two rival organizations, Council/Trust and Dayalbagh, are both alive and functioning.  Their major dispute is based on two differing views:  The members of Council/Trust claim that Council/Trust is the "parent stock" of Radhasoami (-debatable), and hence must be the ruling entity of Radhasoami.  The members of Dayalbagh Sabha feel slighted by the religious hegemony which they feel Council/Trust is imposing. Also, the members of Dayalbagh Sabha want access to the tomb-shrine of the revered Shiv Dayal Singh. In this light, Dayalbagh Sabha organised "SPIRICON 2010", a conference of various organizations who revere Shiv Dayal Singh (boycotted by Council/Trust), to promote mutual respect and to petition access to the tomb-shrine of supreme guru Shiv Dayal Singh. Oliver Puertogallera (talk) 00:25, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  More clarification 

message: Now, I am no expert on this topic. But it seems that the inclusion of this murder has been continuously deleted from this page. The current reason is “removed as an isolated incident.” However, that doesn't meet any of the removal reasons per WP:RVREASONS, so I assume it's best to WP:IMPROVEDONTREMOVE. I would say that this removal is controversial, and there should be discussion (and hopefully some sort of consensus) before it gets removed again.
The explanations on the talk page of reasons for deletion seem to be old, and there seems to be plenty of national Indian news reports covering this incident over the course of many years (as seen above). The event seems significant enough, and it’s not as if the argument is about this event being its own article topic when it is just a single event. However, I personally am not sure if this event belongs on this type of page, since crimes usually aren’t included on the pages of the place they were committed, unless a crime is incredibly notable (e.g. Martin Luther King Jr.'s assassination under Memphis, Tennessee#History), or the location itself is known for crime (e.g. Baltimore#Crime). Even then, individual crimes don't have their own sections, and they instead tend to have a line or two written in another section.
In summary: I think this event is somewhat notable. I don't know if it belongs here. At the very least, the way it is currently written gives it undue weight, and it should not be under a section called "Controversial", since that's not using a Neutral Point of View (see: WP:SUBARTICLE#Breaking out trivial or controversial sections). 
I'll try to change the tone of the article so it is more neutral. And unless anyone has any objections or comments, I think I will either rename the section "Crime," or move it to be under the section "Dayalbagh Educational Institute." I think there should be some discussion about whether or not it belongs better just on the Dayalbagh Educational Institute page or somewhere else on Wikipedia. But overall, I think its inclusion warrants further discussion on the talk page. - Whisperjanes (talk) 19:21, 12 February 2020 (UTC)
thread_title:  Reverted deletion of Neha Sharma Murder