Talk:Ithkuil

message: :There exists no human who can speak Ithkuil, including its creator: “I don't speak Ithkuil, never have, never will, never claimed to.” — said John Quijada .
I don't think it will be possible to cite a source for this anymore, since the Zompist BBoard thread in which it was posted seems to have disappeared.  Google doesn't index the message board threads there, as far as I can tell, so there's no cache.  I don't remember what the date of the posting or the title of the thread was, now. --Jim Henry 22:45, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I remember I saw it there. But the threads are gone. I think WebArchive doesn't collect dynamic pages. Ypou may ask the author, he had made few fixes here. Pavel Vozenilek 05:30, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unable to cite source since it is gone now 

message: "The most remarkable aspect of Ithkuil is that it is the only life-threatening conlang."
I've contacted the originator of this quote, and he requested that it be removed. It's funny and clever but notably non-notable. --Ozy 00:11, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: in that case it should be notable for its non-notability. Bob A (talk) 16:55, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Removed quotation 

message: http://dedalvs.conlang.org/smileys/2008.html
The Teonaht page mentions it.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.93.209.161 (talk) 08:00, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: I've argued about this with David Peterson before, saying that it's misleading and unhelpful to call his critical essays on conlangs "awards".  That said, however, I think the series of essays published as "the Smiley Awards" is one of the best original critical writing on conlangs to appear in recent years.  These articles are not just casual blog posts.  Admittedly they're self-published on a website, but from around 1998 to 2007, and again since then, there were no print magazines dealing with conlangs as far as I know; for the last ten or twenty years *almost all* critical writing on conlangs, the most deep and thoughtful stuff as well as more casual writing, has appeared either in web fora or mailing lists or self-published websites. --Jim Henry (talk) 02:08, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  2008 Smiley Award! ~:D 

message: Sarah L. Higley's Hildegard of Bingen's Unknown Language has a discussion of Ithkuil along with several other notable modern conlangs; it's discussed more briefly than Sylvia Sotomayor's Kēlen or Paul Burgess's mna Vanantha, if I recall correctly getting about a paragraph.  I don't currently have a copy of the book, or I would add a reference to the article myself; someone with access to a copy should do so whenever it's convenient. --Jim Henry (talk) 00:55, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  Another source and piece of evidence for notability 

message: What does the apostrophe here mean? I thought this stood for palatalization, like with <ʲ>, but how can one palatalize a retroflex like [ʂ]? Wisapi (talk) 17:29, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: It indicates an ejective in IPA, you may want to check out that page. All phonology sections on Wikipedia should have /ʼ/ indicating ejectives and never palatalization. --JorisvS (talk) 17:50, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: To complicate things a bit, the Ithkuil retroflex sounds are actually retroflexated alveolar soundsIthkuil site section on its consonants, so technically they should be palatalizable. --JorisvS (talk) 18:48, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: I don't know what "retroflexated alveolar" even means! Couldn't it be that the column is saying that the affricates simply have an alveolar plosive element with a retroflex fricative release (e.g.  as opposed to having a retroflex plosive element (e.g. )? — Æµ§œš¹ [aɪm ˈfɹ̠ˤʷɛ̃ɾ̃ˡi] 01:13, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: The same description holds for all the retroflexes, not just the affricates, so let's analyze it. The full description the site gives for /ʂ/ is a "voiceless apico-alveolar retroflex grooved sibilant fricative". Let's first notice that it is apical and second that it is alveolar. This would let us believe it's a simple [s], weren't it for the word retroflex. Okay, the article on retroflexes isn't all that straightforward and seems to give two unrelated manners: blade of the tongue bunched up (okay, here I don't know the difference with "domed", which is mentioned on Coronal consonant), and with the tip of the tongue curled up. I'd make from this that Ithkuil /ʂ/ is similar to [s], except for that the tip of the tongue has to curl up toward the alveolar place of articulation, meaning that the middle part of the tongue has to go down a bit for this to be possible, compared to the fairly flat tongue for [s]. --JorisvS (talk) 11:26, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Yes, I think you're right. Swedish have an /ʂ/ when /r/ assimilates with a following /s/, such as in "kors" [kʰɔʂː] cross in parallel with an /ʃ/ used variously for "sj" in northern dialects or "tj" in southern, never overlapping. The tongue is held as in /s/ for /ʂ/, but "blade of the tongue bunched up" seems how I pronounce it. The sound of it is considerably thicker and lower than in /ʃ/, making them clearly distinguishable. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 13:59, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

text: The answer is in fact much simpler. When the author says retroflex he means laminal alveolar. He even can't pronounce his own conlang, many sound examples are clearly wrong.--90.179.235.249 (talk) 03:49, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  ʈ͡ʂʼ 

message: I think it is important to mention clowns somewhere. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 14:36, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Clowns

message: John Quijada recently gave a talk on Ithkuil at an interdisciplinary conference in the Russian Republic of Kalmykia.  It's probably too early for any articles about the conference to appear in the press, and they probably won't appear in the English-langauge press.  I'm not sure if it suits to cite Quijada's web page about the conference; it would be better to cite an article in the Kalmyk or Russian press, if one appears.  http://www.ithkuil.net/kalmykia_forum.html
--20:02, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Recent conference presentation 

message: After Quijada revised his site 15 July 2011, the older material, including some examples and all the material on Ilaksh are gone from his web site.
I have updated some of the links and marked some as dead, but I haven't done anything to the examples. Johan G (talk) 08:02, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
thread_title:  July 2011 revision of John Quijada's web site 

message: The example sentence is not notably more compact than its English translation, and in any case expresses a simple enough sentiment. That rather repudiates the 5-times faster claim, doesn't it?
Also, there is another conlang that was constructed to be so syntactically complex no human could think or speak in it. It used the idea of recursive stacks. Can anyone remember its name?88.110.112.231 (talk) 17:36, 11 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Both sentences are in fact noticeably shorter than their English translations. --JorisvS (talk) 17:42, 11 January 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I counted the syllables of the sentence about the car. The Ithkuil version has 40 syllables, while the English has 66. About 30% shorter. — N-true (talk) 20:44, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  S-W 

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thread_title: File:Ithkuil sentence.ogg Nominated for speedy Deletion

message: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2012/12/24/121224fa_fact_foer
regards
Paranoid Android1208 (talk) 14:19, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  something to (maybe) improve the article   

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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090607204552/http://www.ithkuil.net/ithkuil-ch2-morphophonology.htm to http://www.ithkuil.net/ithkuil-ch2-morphophonology.htm
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thread_title:  External links modified 

message: The vertical boustrophedon text is from the old version. For example: /ɤ/ is ë, and it's not in new Ithkuil. It needs replaced.
いくらBraden1127 イクラLet's Discuss It! ꅇ 13:18, 18 March 2018 (UTC)
thread_title:  Outdated content