Talk:Ganon/Archive 1

message: There is a cult following and worshipping ganondorf - there are several sects in the uk and america. This is a valuable edit and shouldn't have been removed.
:Cite a source or your edits will be removed again. Setokaiba✌≝ 20:31, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ganondorf Cult 

message: He's the last boss in that game.  No one's played it?
I have.  --Luigifan 01:43, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Four Swords Adventures? 

message: Someone added that most clones will be removed or given a new moveset. If no one can provide a source for this, I will remove it. Supermariorobot 21:19, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  SSB: Brawl 

message: Shouldn't Ganon's history be expanded upon on the Ganon page? it stops abruptly at the beginning of TWW.
I know,due to timeline theories, that you can't explain which happened first to Ganon after TWW, but you can metion it, saying that you're not sure of which event comes first.--Superbub
I'm going to change the section, so if anyone wants to change it back, inform me before doing so.--Superbub
:I'm considering removing that huge portion about TWW in Character Background because no one knows for sure how it fits into the timeline.  It doesn't make any more sense to add it than it does to add a longwinded recollection of the events of any Zelda game that Ganon was featured in except OoT Xubelox 07:11, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think we should surely discuss his role in a very narrow sense, with at best an extremely brief summary of surrounding events and setting. Deco 07:15, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  history 

message: I always thought his sword was based on the sword he used in the promo video of the TWW (before it went cell-shaded); that battle were a Realistic Ganondorf and Link fight. Whereas in the article about SSB:M the sword just comes out of the blue.--84.27.22.112 16:01, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It wasn't a promo for TWW.  It was just something to show off the GameCube's capabilities. Xubelox 23:56, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ganondorf's Sword in SSB:M 

message: However, he was somehow able to manipulate the evil wizard Agahnim to fulfill his agenda in the Light World (Hyrule).
Doesn't this imply Ganon isn't Agahnim and thus conflict with the Agahnim article, which states: Agahnim's status as Ganon's second self is subject to some controversy, but both images and dialogue in A Link to the Past, which is to be taken as primary canon, shows that they were the same being.
:Well, I think it refers to the fact that exactly how Ganon managed to be Aghanim doesn't make sense within the games own laws. Ganon was trapped in the Dark World and couldn't get out. That was his entire goal. There has been some discussion and speculation about this, on Zelda storyline debates, though. Some feel Aghanim could be an astral projection or a Phantom Ganon (same attack pattern too). Some feel he may be a wizard who Ganon possessed. Some feel the uncanon Soul Calibur II games try to explain that a wizard/priest fell from grace after affected by the Soul Edge's evil, giving Ganon an opening to control him. All these go with Ganon's dialogue, that he is Aghanim. 
:Exactly how, however, isn't the place for a Wikipedia article, which is why fan theories aren't discussed in the article. Perhaps it would be best if someone simply used the in-game dialogue to let the reader assume what they will. ~ZytheTalk to me! 11:16, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ganon and Agahnim 

message: It's spelled that way in the first and second Japanese games, I would think they know how to spell their own characters' names. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.163.218.70 (talk • contribs) 
:The first two games also had Link finding "All of treasures" and a guy named Error.  It's just something that was retconned, like the spelling Hyrulian. --Sparky Lurkdragon 12:34, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Besides, the Katakana used to spell his name in Japanese does not place two "n"s next to each other.  -SaturnYoshi THE VOICES 14:41, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: "Error" wasn't really a mistranslation, actually. That's just his name. Panserbjørn 16:00, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Some people think it's a mistranslation of Errol, which is a real male's name. Jeff Silvers 11:06, 23 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Why is "Gannon" a misspelling? 

message: Just a quickie. Couldn't a more up to date profile pic of Ganon be used? The curreent one is *very* early 90s. Surely a OoT or WW would be better suited? 83.151.197.97 16:07, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Really, I think the new picture looks better, but it's by no means any more accurate than the previous one. Don't confuse aesthetics with accuracy. (OOT =/= end all, be all of canon). -- Digital Watches! 23:12, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Goofy pic 

message: I think that if the page for Link can get FA status, we can get this one up to speed as well. However, there are a few things we should consider in order to do this. Firstly, maintaining NPOV. I'm not just talking about the multi/single Ganon argument, it's also the entire personality section, which has a lot of obvious unnecessary commentary on the character {Stuff like "Manifestation of pure evil," and things that are entirely interpreted.), should be revamped, if not removed, and the storyline sections are far too long-winded and read more like a story than an encyclopedia article. One idea may be just to use the Link article as a model, as far as section layout, writing tone, and length/precedent of what warrants inclusion. We could also use some more real-world information about the character, as this article seems to focus exclusively on in-universe information. Either way, this article needs to be cleaned up. -- Digital Watches! 23:10, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The personality section isn't speculated, but it's very slanted. And that's not my main gripe. Just because all the information is correct doesn't mean that it all belongs in an encyclopedia article. The descriptions of all storyline details, including all the in-game plots, take far too much liberty with the form of the prose, making it read more like some sort of epic than an encyclopedia article. Almost every section could stand some MAJOR trimming. Again, I think that we should follow the example of Link's article, as it was and still is a Featured Article, and being a character page from the same universe, will be fairly close to the ideal structure for this page. As it stands, the article is long-winded, hard to follow, and contains only in-universe information. I've said it before and I'll say it again, just because the article is entirely factual does not mean that it shouldn't be modified. In this case, extensively. I need sleep. -- Digital Watches! 06:56, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Let's make this article generally better. 

message: I think that Ganon can fit the category of fictional mass murderers. Anyone else agree?- Darknessofheart
I do agree to this, but only somewhat. Ganon does evil things to get the things he wants, but he never is actually seen killing anyone. In fact, the closest time Ganon ever came to killing anyone is when you're fighting him. He will hurt people to get the things he covets, but he never actually killed anyone. sean7gordon@epix.net 11/13/06
Uh, Ganon has killed alot of people throughout the games. It has never been SHOWN but it has been mentioned. The composer brothers were murdered by Ganon, in A Link to the Past the king was killed and it states that almost all the knights of hyrule were wiped out in the battle of the seven sages, an event that Ganon was behind. The knights of Hyrule in Ocarina were destroyed as well as in Four Swords, though they were replaced by dark versions in that game. Each game states that many were claimed in some event which was orchrestrated by Ganon. Naborru said Ganon stole from women and children and even killed people. So saying that Ganondorf has not killed anyone is like saying Link is not a main character. Ganondorf is directly and indirtecly responsible for the slaughter of thousands perhaps millions. Alright, I have no proof his murders go that high, but he's defiantly killed enough to be a mass murderer. -Darknessofheart
Yeah, I recently played the games and watched some videos, and you're right! I was wrong. sean7gordon@epix.net
He is not a mass murderer. A nazi soldier who has killed people is not considered a murder. It is the same with Gannon. He is evil, but he kills for political purpose (someone who wants to ruel the world and has a horde of minnions is a dictator), therefore he is a fictional genocidal warcriminal, not murderer.
First of all, just because he wants to rule the world does not make him a dictator; it makes him a megalomaniac. Also, he is a murderer. He has murdered countless people for simple reasons. I can count at least a dozen direct murderers he commited with his own hands. The rest are thousands upon millions of people he slaughtered in these insane wars he started. I'm sure he killed alot of people himself there also. Ganondorf is a mass murderer; there is no political purposes. He kills for two things; power and revenge. Power because he wants to control the world and revenge for his life in a hell spawned desert. Those are not political reasons, he has shed oceans of blood for his own purposes and his alone. This is the villain who shed his own henchmen's blood to obtain the Triforce and have all its' power for himself. If that's not murder, then what is. He has murdered the king a few times in the series and executed other individuals just as a demonstration of his power. He's a vicious and sadistic mass murderer. Naboru stated that he stole from women and children and killed countless people. He did it because he felt like it; that's plain out murder. Look, I see your point and your right in some instances. But saying Ganondorf isn't a murderer is insane. He kills because he wants to and he does; it's all for power and revenge.-Darknessofheart
Well said.203.53.167.180 22:47, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Category 

message: We have 4 pictures of Ganon from Ocarina of Time in this article, and the recent Ganon picture change should really be reverted.  Also, that TP image really sucks. 199.126.137.209 10:30, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Yeah, there's some persistent editors and their sockpuppets that stick a whole load of images of OoT Ganon everywhere because they have no concept of fair use images, or how an article should relate to a character. No one canon depiction is more important than another. I  removed some of the unnecessary (albeit pretty) official art for OoT Ganon and that HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE n64 graphics Ganon picture. Just because OoT is a lot of people's favourite, does not make it the "main" Zelda game. Bah. I suppose I'll be monitoring the article extra closely. ~ZytheTalk to me! 11:55, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Images are really beginning to clutter

message: I just deleted that picture which supposedly portrays Ganondorf in Twilight Princess. The picture cannot be proven to actually be from TP, and was of poor quality, so I should think it won't be missed. General Aurum 23:09, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  TP Ganon Picture 

message: Do you all know how Ganondorf transforms into Ganon at the end of OoT? Well, I hear that the only time that Ganondorf's shape would change is in the Dark Realm. After all, Link turns into a rabbit there. Please respond!
:The Triforce of Power is what allows Ganondorf to change shape at the end of the game.  At the time of Ocarina of Time there was no Dark Realm.  The Sacred Realm became dark due to Ganondorf being trapped there by the Seven Sages.  -SaturnYoshi THE VOICES 16:31, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Ganon in Ocarina of Time 

message: The sub-section in the "Biography" section which goes over Ganon's role in "The Twilight Princess" is pretty much how each game's section should be. A short, concise description of Ganon's role in the game without flowery wording, minute details, or giant chunks of text. If we could make each game's section read like the Twilight princess one currently reads, we'd be a huge leap closer to FA status in my opinion. -- Digital Watches! 22:43, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I very much agree. ~ZytheTalk to me! 21:47, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

text: Well, I guess "I like" is horrible wording on my part. I meant to say "That's how the article should be." Because really, it's not about preference. -- Digital Watches! 03:29, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  I like the LOZ:TP section. 

message: Someone put this in the article:
Ganondorf is really a nice, elderly woman whom goes around patting small children on the head and handing out freshly-backed, warm, chocolate chip cookies. She loves to go skipping through the park and chucking bird seed at the pigeons, and loves to watch as they flock around before she gets out her bazooka and eliminates them all!!!
Now I'm no genius, but I think this is incorrect. Roxyr 17:10, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Vandals

message: To whoever keeps putting this in, Ganondorf has NOT been confirmed for Brawl. If anyone sees him being in Brawl edited into the article before he has been confirmed, be sure to remove it right away. Thanks! Comrade Pajitnov 20:21, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Super Smash Bros. Brawl

message: I was the one who made the background information, but some of you people are adding too much. First of all, making compasrisons between Ganondorf and other nintendo villains in pointless, also this is his backgorund in the series, not his background as a nintendo villain. We all know he's one of the baddest of the bad ect. but, don't put such an underlined suggestion, it sounds riduclous and written very poorly. "Ganon is unique as being one of the more darker ones", that does not belong their and is simply an opinion. Ganon is a great villain, but adding all this is making this section sound horrible and is a waste of space. If anyone is going to add anything, make it short and something that is revelant to the section. Listen I'm going to change it to make it shorter. No  more Ganon is nintendo's #1 villian or he's more evil than this villain bullshit.- Darknessofheart
:Reverted way back.~ZytheTalk to me! 22:45, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Problem is, overly creative adjectives are inherently POV. I would never describe Ganon as "psychotic". ~ZytheTalk to me! 14:47, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Stop adding so much information 

message: Whose brilliant idea was it to use the image that
A. We're already were using for Twilight Princess,
B. Does NOT need to be that big, and
C. Barely shows any of him
As the main picture for the article, and in doing so, also removes the only image of pig-ganon (As represented in the majority of the games) we had? I've had it with this bias for post OoT Ganon. -- Digital Watches! 08:29, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I put it back, but perhaps the pic will heve to be protected to prevent this from happening again.  -SaturnYoshi THE VOICES 08:48, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Looking at the history of the picture the same user changed the picture again. it has already been restored but I agree that it need to be protected and maybe the user that is changing it blocked. This is getting redicious. --67.71.76.49 01:11, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Agreed. Anyone know of a mod that responds fast and will check this out? -- Digital Watches! 01:18, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Umm. More on this image dispute... 

message: I find over-contraction makes each section as useless as the run on game summaries. Should we perhaps establish a consensus on how much detail each section deserves so that the decision can be more effectively enforced and so also there is consistency and viable information?~ZytheTalk to me! 00:29, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I think 3 paragraphs per game should be a MAXIMUM if we're going to set it down as something. Digital Watches! 05:09, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I think TWW section was better when it was slightly longer. Otherwise I look at it as, "How about we leave it at 'Ganon appeared and Link killed him'..."~ZytheTalk to me! 08:30, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  2 paragraphs per game? 

message: Okay, I'm not sure why, but will the people who keep saying that he died, and lost the triforce of power, please stop. That is completely speculation, and doesn't belong in the article. It should and will be kept neutral until this can be further elaborated upon. Until then, please stop saying that he died. -Chao9999 04:14, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Twilight Princess