Talk:Marathi language/Archive 1

message: The great Tamil poet Subramanya Bharatha, also known as Bharathiyar,  was one of the first advocates for India'a independence from India, in addition to being a poet.  He sang a Tamil song about trade in India, in which he said that even Ivory from Salem in Tamilnadu could be traded for Marathi poems on palm leaves because those poems were so wonderful. This shows how much he appreciated Marathi poems. 
He also called Telugu as Sundara Telugu. People like Dinesh should learn to appreciate other languages too from this!
Sunil Kumar--68.197.128.134 21:34, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Ivory in exchange for Marathi Poems on palm leaves 

message: *The article has recently been edited with major updates in content.  This is greatly appreciated.  Yet it is now nescessary to copy-edit the article into more standard english. Thank You. Atungare 18:50, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Manual of Style

message: Dear dinesh,This is not the place to sing abt how ur kannada is old or nice,keep that with urself.Dont tell us that abt ur language here.We are simply not intrested.Marathi is GREAT language and Konkani is dialect of Marathi.U or even Konkani can accept it or deny it,but the history and truth will remain same!
Jai Maharashtra
(mahawiki 14:52, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Dinesh kannambadi we are not intrested in ur farce

message: Please be adviced that inscriptions are not Literature. Anyone who thinks Marathi inscriptions are the same as Marathi literature does not know much about languages. The earliest copper plate inscription (8th century) and 981AD Sharavanabelagola inscription from Karnataka are not literature. Literature is written on paper or leaves (as was the case of the oldest spoken languages of India which are Tamil and Kannada). It takes a very long time for a language to mature from an inscriptional one to a literary one which is why one hears of early	 Marathi literature only after 1200AD and mature Marathi literature from 15th century.	 
Konkani is much older then Marathi. Please refer to this issue in Dr. Jyothsna Kamat's Potpourri. 
:whoever has written this seems to be not interested in contributing to wikipedia. Unsigned comments might be considered as vandalism and do not need clarification. Moreover, the comments do not make any sense. They are irrelevant to the article. Try to be logical, and  don't make  claims based on based on your POV.--Sandipani 01:32, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Literature

message: Not for proof but to understand what is going on in prticipant's mind of this debate here on en wiki, please do define which specific konkani speaking geographic areas he is reffering to and how much percentage they are reffering to pure lingustics and pure politics.
:The Konkani language is spread over the western coast ,it is spread in many non-contiguous pockets. Starts with some tribal pockets in southern Gujarat and North Maharashtra where Kukna is spoken(Kukna is not recongised by ethnologue as a dialect of Konkani but is placed in the Konkani sub-tree). Pockets in Ratnagiri and Sindhudurg . Goa has a significant Konkani population(roughly 60%) . The Canara coast has the highest number of Konkani speakers, primarily centered in Managlore, Karwar and Updpi cities. kasargod in Kerala has a small Konkani population, then in COchin and Kozhikiode. --Deepak D'Souza 04:55, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
thread_title: Define Konkani speaking  areas

message: Mahitgar 14:35, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Comprehension of above points

message: Move 'Poets' under 'Marathi Authors'
:Now, there is no section with title "Poets", so OK --Sandipani 02:23, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Move 'Poets' under 'Marathi Authors' 

message: Some definitions (notably of the parts of speech) are written in Romanized Marathi. Is there any reason this should be so? Also, can we decide a standard transliteration format for use in this article?
--Kunal (talk) 17:47, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
thread_title: Transliteration

message: The items under 'Maharashtra Mandals yet to be classified' need to be moved under appropriate sections and then the section be deleted.
:Done by someone --Sandipani 02:25, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Maharashtra Mandals yet to be classified 

message: From the article -
"3. 'a' indicating a 'chandrakor' as in 'bat' (ba~t) does not get displayed, the one in 'ball' (bA~l) does get displayed. Marathi added 2 vowels, namely 'a~' and 'A~'. Hindi added only 'A~'."
What is meant here? That बॅट cannot be written?! :-)
Or that a word can not start with an ऍ (ऍक्सिडेन्ट)?
Please elaborate in the article and/or correct.
Thanks,
asnatu 06:12, 4 January 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  bat (बॅट) vs. beT (बेट) 

message: darwaaza (door) is not an Arabic word: it's probably  Persian, but I'm not sure. 
and dawakhaana... the khaana is not Arabic either, though dawa can be seen to come from the word from medicine. Someone else with more knowledge please correct this.
--Drmaik 10:43, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  mistakes in word origins 

message: I am currently working on this topic to make it more presentable. I will try to address all the issues displayed here. I have the following questions:
* I think the list of authors and poets should be moved to Marathi Literature because I believe it would fit the contents there. I need confirmation on this.
* I am not sure what these mandals are. Is it required to display every single mandal throughout the world? Nivus 12:08, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Clarifications

message: I really saw no significance in the listings of mandals on the Marathi language page. There was also no use for the list of authors to be on this page, it may serve a better purpose in Marathi_literature. If you are going to add it back please give a specific reason in this talk page. Nivus|(talk)|(desk) 07:30, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
replies: text:  I deleted some edits from the word origin section. There are enough words in the list to give an idea of the word origins from other languages. The content is quite large at the moment and it is unnecessary to continue adding more. Refining the content is always a better idea. Nivus|(talk)|(desk) 04:28, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Deletions

message: I just put together marathi literature stub template (see Batatyachi Chaal). I need a image for it. Any suggestions? - mskadu 00:01, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Marathi image for stub template

message: Help add input for Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Indic)--Dangerous-Boy 04:45, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Help add input for [[Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Indic)]] 

message: I went through about 80% of the article (I didn't get to the end) and cleaned up all that I could see on a first pass. I fixed some grammatical mistakes, took out a lot of irrelevant information (e.g. stuff about religious sects, how "close" the language is to Sanskrit, POV, etc.) and tried to clean up some tables and lists. The article still needs a lot more work, especially in terms of a real linguistic overview. I am a linguist but I am more familiar with eastern Indic languages so I don't know enough about Marathi to really add content. However, I will be checking periodically and if anyone adds on some interesting information, I'm willing to check that it is up to a high standard for linguistic analysis. --SameerKhan 23:48, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Also, I'm very interested in formalizing a consistent transliteration or Romanization of Marathi for this article, as has been done for Assamese, Bengali, etc.--SameerKhan 23:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Lots of cleanup 

message: It is horrible and a pity that till now the phonology part did not have transliteration in wikistandard International Phonetic Alphabet, and only in some casual romanization. Look at the article on Hindi, so much details it has. Cygnus_hansa 00:05, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: It's great that you added the IPA symbols. I'm about to add a phoneme inventory chart, and I'd love if you could help me with that too. Are you a speaker of Marathi? If so, that would make it a lot easier for me to ask which contrasts actually exist in Marathi and which are only preserved in the writing. --SameerKhan 00:16, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Though having lived in Mumbai for 4 years, unfortunately I know zot of Marathi. But I can easily tell you which Marathi sounds have become redundant in phonology.Cygnus_hansa 08:41, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

text: Yes ळ exists in Marathi and it is very much in use.(eg. बेळगाव(Belgaum), तळे(lake) सरळ(straight) It is also used in Gujarati.Why did u ask it?Anything special about this sound to find mention in this article? Mahawiki 14:27, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I am a Marathi speaker with study in Marathi Grammer; Marathi Language has only one variation,that is ळ Where as I am given to understand Tamil is having multiple prononciations of ळ.
Marathi does not have any extra sound of ळ and if any one finds ळ with dot/nukta (i.e.ऴ ) any where it has to be a typographic error or mistake inherent in transiliterating editor or input software.I e have encountered this problem with some of the editors.
I do not know what is exact IPA compatible for ळ.Marathi is likely to have hardly any of its own IPA scholors as of today.
Any way you will find soon more on this in this article about Marathi and its relation with other language in more details with proper scholorly references,please come back soon to check up.
Mahitgar 11:38, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

text: I dont know really the differnce between ऴ and ळ.Devnagari script has ळ and which is used in Marathi.I am not aware IPA sounds.But the ळ is used in Marathi, Tamil, Malayalam (prop in Telugu and Kannada too) and Gujarati. Marathi ळ is perhaps the counterpart of ള് ள் ళ్ ಳ.I am not sure. Mahawiki 07:29, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

text: Done - sooraj 17:09, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: IPA

message: The dialects section is getting way too long and distracts from the article. The information about each individual dialect can be put into another article ("Marathi dialects"?) or individual dialect articles ("X Marathi"?). Either way, it should not be included in the main article. --SameerKhan 18:22, 11 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Dialects 

message: I have added this para.Please do not feel shy of it.If Persian,Arabian or english languages have enriched marathi.Reverse is also true.I am finding someone is deleting the list of marathi words borrowed in english and keeping the marathi words borrowed from english or other languages.This is not fair .If someone has got doubt about these words,please discuss here .I am open to all suggestions.Please remember all languages are interocnnected .
kasar59.184.152.183 11:09, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: The words you mentioned didn't originate from Marathi. Most of them can clearly be traced back to their Celtic or Latin origins. Some of them can even be traced back to Proto-Indo-European, which of course is also the ancestor of Marathi. Those words never went the long way over Marathi. See Etymonline for the true etymologies of these words. — N-true 14:08, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

text: No one is against showing how words are borrowed from Marathi into other languages; the examples you gave, however, are simply not true. --SameerKhan 19:43, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: English words borrowed from Marathi

message: First learn signing in wikipedia properly and them complain!.Ignore the comments by Sawai Raja,if u dont like it.They are going to stay here as  representation of what Maharashtrians think.Turn a blind eye,if u dont like them.mahawiki 11:54, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Thank You, Fellow Indians

message: Dear all,
I have reverted and identified vandalism which are intrested in proclaiming how 'Marathi' is less important than 'their' languages,how Marathi has borrowed words from their languages etc.They want to endorse their lamguages on this article.I just have got acquained with few non-Maharashtrian users which also had edited out few glimpses of Marathi's glorious past.They were also keen to say the Konkani,which is supposedly a dialect of Marathi,is even more older than Marathi and that Marathi(and Marathi's literature) is not too old.
Its an earnest request to all Marathi wikipedians who are well-informed about Marathi language and history to carefully examine the article and find out other instances of vandalism,if any and also add the needful,if these vandalists might have edited out any.
This is a warning to all Non-Maharashtrian vandalists who come here to market and endorse their languages here,to stop and dont bother to edit this article again.
Jai Maharashtra
mahawiki 17:36, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: I have not edited this article very much at all, but I want to remind everyone that no-one owns this article. The term "vandalism" does not apply to content or POV disputes, which this seems to be. It's worth pointing out that, for example, ananás is the word for pineapple in Portuguese. I don't see how this "diminishes" Marathi in any way; no natural language is "pure", so to speak, and word origins from other languages are mentioned in many other language articles. Grandmasterka 03:53, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Vandalism on Marathi language page 

message: *Grammar==
Marathi grammar -*Delet:'is somewhat like that of'-shares simmilarities with other Indo-Aryan languages such as  Sanskrit and Hindi .
===contemporary grammer===
Here it is important to note that the contemporary gramatical rules stated by Maharashtra Sahity Parishadand endorsed by Government of Maharashtra are supposed to get precedance in standard written Marathi.Also it would not be out of place to mention a book about  'Marathi Grammer' written by 'Mo.Ra.WaLimbe'is  most circulated and  widely reffered in educational institutions.
===Sanskrit Influence===
Traditions of Marathi Linguistics and above mentioned rules continue to give special status to 'Tatsam'(Without Change) words borrowed from Sanskrit Language.This special status expects the rules for 'Tatsam' words be followed as of Sanskrit Grammer.While this supports Marathi Langauge with a larger treasure of Sanskrit words to cope up with demands of new technical words whenever needed;maintains influence of Marathi        
===Different Features===
*One of the unusual feature of Marathi Language, as compared to other Indo-European languages, is that it displays the inclusive and exclusive we feature, that is common to the Dravidian languages.(Please Give Citation)
That's not entirely true. Gujarati displays the same inclusive and exclusive "we" as well.
Shaival
*Changes planned by Mahitgar 07:34, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: planned changes to the article portions

message: *One of the unusual feature of Marathi Language, as compared to other Indo-European languages, is that it displays the inclusive and exclusive we feature, that is common to the Dravidian languages.(Please Give Citation)
That's not entirely true. Gujarati displays the same inclusive and exclusive "we" as well.
Shaival
*Changes planned by Mahitgar 07:34, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Different Features

message: I am not too worried of vandalisers because every thing remains in history.Personally I find POV and neutrality hoax tags  as needless policing.
Mahitgar 19:07, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: t

message: *We have updated the article about its antiquity with proper reference.
Besides we have updated status of Konkani langauge Vs Dilects view in balanced manner.
We do not see any reason why this tag can not be removed now?
Mahitgar 09:30, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Removal of Nutrality Tag Discussion

message: Marathi Sahitya Sammelans have been taking place since 18??.I just read about it in Marathi Vishwakosh.Although they might be regularly held from 19?? but they were held within gap of 2/3/4 years from 18??.I will bring the exact year tomorrow.mahawiki 14:49, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Sahitya Sammelan 

message: *Shivaji's inscription shown on the page is actually in Sanskrit and not in Marathi. It would be inaccurate to put the image there. The actual inscription is "Pratipachhandralekhaiva vardhishnurvishwavandita shahsuno shivasya esha mudra bhadraya rajate" Like the new moon ever growing and bowed to by all, the mudra (seal) of Shiva (Shivaji), son of Shah (Shahaji) shines upon.
Shaival
**Ok Shaival,lets get consensus from other users.Plz create a Wiki a/c for urself.
mahawiki 05:35, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Shivaji's Seal 

message: I have uploaded a Marathi signboard pic.A simiular pic is used in Kannada article.Plz let me know if it is relavant to this article.mahawiki 05:35, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Marathi signboard pic

message: Hi,
Can we add some info about Marathi authors? I've made a feeble attempt to do the same in the 20th century to present section, but I'm sure someone else can write it better. Thanks.
MaximvsDecimvs 15:37, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Alright. I've deleted the authors' list and put a link for Marathi literature in that para. MaximvsDecimvs 18:59, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Marathi authors 

message: Presently I have avoided including Author Names since
*There is a separate article  Marathi literature for this purpose.Which can include detail list of Authors
*Even before we include few mile stones we need to first improve article Marathi literature which is far behind and not comprehensive enough.
*Else where Marathi Wikipedians are doing effort in agreeng for consensus on Mile stones of marathi Literature. Let that effort take some shape before we include any more names in Marathi Language article.
Mahitgar 15:30, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Alright. I've deleted the authors' list and put a link for Marathi literature in that para. MaximvsDecimvs 18:59, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
thread_title: Main article [[Marathi literature]]

message: Wikipedia:WikiProject India/Translation--D-Boy 19:30, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  translators needed at [[Wikipedia:WikiProject India/Translation]]