Talk:Debi Gliori

message: The only reference for this page is a broken link. Some more new references should probably be found. Alphius (talk) 20:10, 18 September 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: Fixed using the Internet Archive's Way Back Machine. Have also rooted out as many reliable references from google as I could find. Esowteric+Talk 13:54, 27 October 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  References 

message: was censured in May 2012 for attempting to remove a controversy section from the stub article about Debi Gliori.
I believe that Bryony24 acted in good faith, following a sustained campaign of alleged internet bullying / stalking of the subject, Debi Gliori by another involved person's fans. This culminated in articles written in the press and the inclusion of the controversy section which the subject attempted unsuccessfully to have removed.
The entry, originally added by  at 10:53, 9 May 2012, has been repeatedly added and removed since that time.
For Debi Gliori's side of the story, see Fiddle and pins: The Tobermory Cat, the trolls & me (25 October 2012).
Regarding the allegation of stealing ideas: these allegations are groundless. You cannot copyright or fake-trademark something well known in real life, in the public domain and generic like "The Tobermory Cat" any more than I could the Loch Ness monster. In any case, Saki wrote about a cat called "Tobermory" prior to his death in 1916. For the full story from The Chronicles of Clovis, see "Tobermory" by Saki.
Regards, Eric: Esowteric+Talk 19:46, 25 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: It's gone now, and I think it should stay gone per WP:UNDUE - Alison ❤ 19:58, 25 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text:  Many thanks. Esowteric+Talk 20:00, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

text: Since the article is no longer a stub, and since the controversy has now been covered in detail in The Guardian, perhaps the controversy should feature in the article? Please feel free to comment or revert. Regards, Eric: Esowteric+Talk 19:05, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

text: I'm aware of the possibility of infringing WP:UNDUE, but I can see no easy way to achieve balance and clarity, if the controversy is to be mentioned. Have begun a Reception section above Controversy and added several reviews. There'll also be a favourable review from The Times to add on Saturday 3 November 2012. Esowteric+Talk 19:17, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

text: A review of The Tobermory Cat in The Times on 3 November 2012 also leads with the controversy, adding to its notability. 12:19, 3 November 2012 (UTC)

text: And BBC Scotland on 7 November 2012 covered the story of the Tobermory cat, a book signing by Debi Gliori in Mull and the copyright dispute. Esowteric+Talk 11:22, 8 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Controversy 

message: This just came in. Bit of a game changer: Guardian: Cat at centre of bitter children's book scrap Regards, Eric: Esowteric+Talk 15:50, 30 October 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Since the article is no longer a stub, and since the controversy has now been covered in detail in The Guardian, perhaps the controversy should feature in the article? Please feel free to comment or revert. Regards, Eric: Esowteric+Talk 19:05, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

text: I'm aware of the possibility of infringing WP:UNDUE, but I can see no easy way to achieve balance and clarity, if the controversy is to be mentioned. Have begun a Reception section above Controversy and added several reviews. There'll also be a favourable review from The Times to add on Saturday 3 November 2012. Esowteric+Talk 19:17, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

text: A review of The Tobermory Cat in The Times on 3 November 2012 also leads with the controversy, adding to its notability. 12:19, 3 November 2012 (UTC)

text: And BBC Scotland on 7 November 2012 covered the story of the Tobermory cat, a book signing by Debi Gliori in Mull and the copyright dispute. Esowteric+Talk 11:22, 8 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: 30 October 2012

message: In the interests of fairness, I should report that an anonymous IP user raised issues about my conduct in this Wikipedia article at the Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. See the now-closed and archived thread they started, entitled "Editor of story is cyber-bullying me, I believe the author's fans are using the wiki for cyberabuse against an involved party". Esowteric+Talk 12:11, 5 November 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: The controversy section in the current article seems to me to be well-balanced and accurately sourced. However this incident is recent, and perhaps with the passage of time its relative significance will fade and the article will need to be revised with regard to undue weight policy.Anonymous watcher (talk) 22:47, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  Issues raised at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents 

message: The "involved party", artist Angus Stewart, recognizing the damage that this has done, has recently issued a heartfelt plea for the issue to settle down. Many people, including Debi Gliori are thankful and grateful for this manly approach:
He writes on his Facebook page for "Tobermory Cat":
"[Tobermory Cat] May we close this thread please. I would rather like things to settled down. It seems my idea to follow the process of creating a celebrity cat turns out to be an extremely dangerous and damaging idea. It has caused a great deal of hurt and I want no more of it. My understanding of what is and what is not acceptable is misguided. It has been extremely hurtful to Debi and she does not deserve it. I met her once and she does not deserve to be hurt by my work. I don’t like that. I am guilty of following an idea too far - the fog came down and I forgot about where I wanted to go. The good thing is Debi's book came out and its a good book and will give more pleasure to more people than this page will do if this is the way its going. Good things can come from difficult beginnings and truly hope that is the case for Debi’s book. I need a bit of time to think about this so if possible could everyone take a bit of a deep breath. Time to think about good stuff not bad. I would really appreciate that. Sunday [3 November 2012] at 12:20am · Edited · Unlike · 4"
Please can we allow this issue to settle down? Esowteric+Talk 09:36, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  [[Debi Gliori]]: Can we let this matter settle down, please? 

message: Ms. Gliori's blog describes the first meeting as an epic battle. She claims he was digging into her life and lunged at her, both of which are absolute nonsense. She claims she "snapped" and that "Hugh dug his heals in" when they should have just left. She mocks the importance of Facebook in Mr. Stewart's life claiming that it's insignificant in hers. Then her official line is of a victim whose very existence is threatened by the internet. Maybe if she had stayed on topic about the idea that was or wasn't stolen instead of Mr. Stewart's character her argument would be sound. Instead she just goes to her mob of fans' lowest instincts, which is the very same accusation she makes against Mr. Stewart, both are guilty of appealing to their fans for action when they should have resolved the matter amongst themselves. It also seems that she was very hostile towards Mr. Stewart before he took any action against her. What should be noted is that this story has been made into an issue of cyber-bullying by the press and not copyright and Ms. Gliori seems, so far, quite happy to go along with this. I think that it's important to note that the current flavour of the month for the press is "Cyber-bullying" and editors should be wary of any bias in the press because of this.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.243.171.14 (talk) 13:17, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Thank you. I will copy and paste this into the ongoing AN/I thread. Regards, Eric: Esowteric+Talk 13:22, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Statements by 41.243.171.14 #2

message: "controversy" sections rarely make encyclopedic articles, particularly in articles about living people. In addition, the section in this article appears to rely on a lot of original research based on primary sources. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 22:50, 8 November 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: Thanks. Given the deletions you made to the Reception section, I would agree with WP:UNDUE. However, please also see the "Undue" sub-section in this ongoing AN/I. Regards, Eric: Esowteric+Talk 07:26, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

text: Have removed the controversy section per WP:UNDUE and added bulleted list to Media reception without comment. I am concerned, however, that readers will be left with totally the wrong idea about the unproven allegations of IP theft. Anyhow, please fight this out amongst yourselves. Esowteric+Talk 08:11, 9 November 2012 (UTC)
thread_title:  NPOV 

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thread_title:  External links modified