Talk:Droppin Well bombing

message: Hi there, 
first of all Wikipedia is wonderful, well done!
I am a bit concerned that the information is factual, when I looked up Droppin Well Bomb I noticed there was a part saying the building was of poor construction leading to deaths. I have a report saying the exact opposite that because of the generous use of steel in the building, many lives were saved. I edited the page but was amazed to find it had been changed hours later. 
I think in historical matters such as this, independent factual reports should be the preferred source.
What is the procedure if an edit is basically libellous?
All the best,
Christine
:Hi Christine. You're better raising matters like this on the article's talk page, ie Talk:Droppin Well bombing. What is the source/report you have for the steel construction? Stu ’Bout ye! 15:19, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: Is the NIO report publically available? Online anywhere? I can't find it searching Google. Stu ’Bout ye! 15:49, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

text: Sorry, I object to this change which is contradicted by reliable sources and have removed the offending sentence entirely. Irish News make no claim that the construction saved lives, in fact "Because of the bar's construction the impact of the device was magnified causing a build-up of gases which brought the building crashing down" implies the exact opposite. John Bowyer Bell's "The Irish Troubles" (page 656) says "This time the luck of the Irish worked to British disadvantage: the explosion jarred back the outside wall and the entire prestressed concrete roof slab crashed down on the crowd. It too most of the night to dig out the survivors". These unsourced assertions cannot stand in the face of this evidence. O Fenian (talk) 16:13, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

text: I don't think there will be a way to upload the report as a source. Wikipedia's policy on verifiability states that "Material challenged or likely to be challenged, and all quotations, must be attributed to a reliable, published source." If this report has never been published, then it cannot be used as a source on Wikipedia. Wikipedia:Archives as sources may have gotten round this problem, but it failed to be adopted as a policy. So as a primary source, it's not an option by my interpretation. I'm not doubting that the reports exists, but Wikipedia has to be based on "verifiability, not truth". However a secondary source might be found. ie, if a newspaper reported on the NIO report and you can find that, then it could be included in the article. But as the sources O_F has mentioned contradict the NIO report, both would have to be mentioned. Probably. Stu ’Bout ye! 22:09, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
replies: text: OK, perhaps I am being a bit thick here. I have just checked "Brits" by Peter Taylor, which basically says that the bomb took out a support pillar which brought the roof down. So regardless of whether Bowyer Bell, Taylor or both are correct, I do not understand how the construction of the building saved lives. The only way I could see that statement being true is if the roof had not collapsed, and therefore casualties were limited to those actually caused by the bomb itself and not a prestressed concrete roof falling on people. O Fenian (talk) 22:23, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

text: The point about the verifiability policy is that facts stated in articles should be easily verifiable by anyone. If the engineer's report isn't publically available, then the facts it contains are not verifiable. The report being distributed doesn't make it publically available, as it would only have been circulated to certain people. This is just my understanding, you could raise the issue at the Reliable sources Noticeboard. Maybe government produced reports are available somewhere, I just don't know. Again, it's verifiability, not truth that matters. If the report had been reported on by newspapers, then it becomes verifiable as old newspapers are available in libraries etc. Stu ’Bout ye! 09:50, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Moved from [[User:Imogen31|Imogen31's]] talk page

message: The following coordinate fixes are needed for
Droppin Well (now 'The Well Bar & Grill'
55°02′28″N 7°00′36″W
—46.23.67.139 (talk) 14:50, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
replies: text: The coordinates you've given above are identical to the ones that were in the article. I've emended them to indicate the location of The Well Bar & Grill (formerly the Droppin Well). Deor (talk) 17:04, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
thread_title:  Coordinate error