Talk:Anne Marie d'Orléans

message: In reply to the message you just left on my talk page: Much of the added material is redundant, excessive, or trivial. I've already recorded repeated objections to
#unsourced allegations (e.g. that seem unprecedented, unlikely, or undocumentable) are apt to be deleted unless precisely sourced  
#redundancies (if it's in a box on the page, it's apt to be deleted from the text): 
#excess (details which belong in another person's article [e.g. parent, spouse, child], or which describe hard-to-verify details [e.g. "She felt envious": unless it's an attributed quote from a diary or correspondence -- how is it possible to know what someone who died hundreds of years ago "felt" or "thought"? Let's stick to what they verifiably said or did]), 
#gallicization (names and titles when combined, OK [but members of dynasties that ruled outside France -- Lorraine, Savoy, Modena, Bouillon, Monaco, etc -- shouldn't be gallicized, except for cadets born into a branch naturalised in France]; but just for the sake of a more "French" sound or "feel" to the article -- not usually, and subject to deletion). Please don't use sockpuppets. I look forward to better mutual cooperation -- and better Wiki articles. Thanks. FactStraight (talk) 13:11, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Redundant & trivial content

message: Surname is d'Orléans, not of Orléans - *of* is used in a title, such as, Gaston de France, Duke of Orléans etc...  Changing name in title of article, and will do same to others in the Orléans family which seems to be extremely messed up. Frania W. (talk) 23:21, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
thread_title: Name in title

message: Anthony Appleyard, 
Why all these sudden moves on the "de France" & "d'Orléans" articles with no prior notice? 
We went through long discussions months ago & now all is being changed with no notice.  
The surname of members (children of the king) of the senior Bourbon branch of the French royal family was "de France", up to & ending with Charles X, and eventually his children who were born "d'Artois". The next & last king to reign was Louis-Philippe d'Orléans who took the title King of the French. From the generation of the children of Philippe de France, duc d'Orléans, brother of Louis XIV, the Orléans branch took the surname d'Orléans, all the way to today (legally, as it is the only surname they are allowed to use in France, (a surname like that of Charles de Gaulle: are we going to change it to Charles of Gaulle?).  In other words, "'Orléans" is a surname, and so is "de France", not only something to put after a title.  As an example: 
*Louis-Philippe d'Orléans, duc d'Orléans, in French, becomes
*Louis-Philippe d'Orléans, Duke of Orléans, in English. 
The daughters of Louis XV were all surnamed "de France" and were addressed to as Madame + used baptismal name (which may not have been the first). They were not given the title of "princesse" as is given them in en:wiki.  Children of the king & members of the king's family were "prince/princesse du sang" but, the only members of the king's family to be princes of anything were the eldest males of the "Condé" & "Conti" families who were "prince de Condé" & "prince de Conti", their respective wives being "princesse de Condé" & "princesse de Conti".  
The daughter of Louis XVI was Marie-Thérèse de France, and was addresssed to as Madame Royale.  May I point out to you that while you have changed her to Marie-Thérèse of France, you forgot to change "Madame Royale" to "Royal Madam" or "Royal Mistress" or "Royal Mrs." or whatever proper English should be. 
Bathilde d'Orléans, the sister of Philippe d'Orléans (Philippe Égalité) was not a "princess d'Orléans". She did become a princess when she married the prince de Condé. Accordingly, she should be Bathilde d'Orléans, princesse de Condé, in English: Bathilde d'Orléans, Princess of Condé.
I simply do not have the time right now to go through all the past discussions on the subject & bring them to your attention, but it is becoming tiresome & depressing to do so much work and then, months later, have someone come & erase it all as if previous editors were ignorami & their work worthless.  
When such moves are planned, a notice should be posted at the talk page of each article because all cases may not be the same.  Some of the Orléans women of the 17th century are being given the title of "princesses" in en:wiki, which is totally wrong. Only the children of Louis-Philippe I, king of the French, (1830-1848) were princes & princesses d'Orléans (not de France) 
Please feel free to bring this to whichever talk page the discussion is taking place.  
Best regards, --Frania W. (talk) 07:01, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Message copied from [[User talk:Anthony Appleyard]]

message: In spite of the discussion taking place here, a former anonymous IP, who just signed up under the name Seven Letters, is doing a mass move of Orléans articles with no prior notice to respective article pages. --Frania W. (talk) 03:30, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Frania, as mentioned to LPC on my user talk page, every single one of the moves I performed was undoing a copy/paste move that LPC performed. Those copy/paste moves that LPC performed were done right after an administrator undid his undiscussed moves. Therefore all of the articles should be restored to their names, as is standard. This is all very evident and apparent in LPC's contribution history. Just take a look, please, before it is painted to look like I am in the wrong. Thank you! Seven Letters 16:50, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
thread_title: Mass moves undertaken by new (former anonymous IP) contributor

message: I find the text added by LouisPhilippeCharles to be trivial, or at the very least not neutral. Text like "Though not as beautiful as Marie Louise, she was still attractive." does not belong on Wikipedia. This page isn't meant to be a memorial or anything like that; it should be neutral and to the point. And stuff like "But things soured when her husband became overly involved in state affairs, forgetting about his devoted wife." makes this article seem like more of a soap opera than an encyclopedic entry. I'd say most of that text needs to go. — HelloAnnyong (say whaaat?!) 02:11, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Hey everyone, let's not forget the three revert rule. You're both coming up on it, so now is the time to stop warring and start talking. I find FactStraight's edits to be mostly correct, though I'm wondering why the date and place of burial were removed. I'm also curious why the lead was trimmed down in this edit; per WP:LEDE, the lead is supposed to be a representation of the contents of the article, and I find that the trimmed down version is just too small. Other than that, though, I'm fine with the edits. — HelloAnnyong (say whaaat?!) 22:04, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: One problem with these articles (especially on female royalty) is that all too many sources are soap-operas. We should try to do better, but it's an effort. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 00:58, 10 August 2010 (UTC)
replies: text: Can someone please tell F.S to stop being such a child! He seems to think that categories and a template are regarded as trivia – it is dull now! It is even more amusing to see that these categories are not even correct (i.e. the dates are wrong) which proves completely he is just trying to be as difficult as possible! He is making himself seem a fool Monsieur le Duc (talk) 08:00, 31 August 2010 (UTC)
thread_title:  Third opinion