Talk:Etheric plane

message: " Some theosophists held that the vital force could be identified with "N-rays". This notion, named after the city of Nantes where the radiations were "observed" by physicist René-Prosper Blondlot in 1903, have long since been debunked in mainstream physics.
Modern theosophists sometimes claim that the ideas discussed in this article are related to a contemporary area of fringe science, modern Aether theories. Even fringe scientists are likely to disavow such a relation, and few if any physicists would recognize theosophy as closely related to physics.
However, there are plausible alternative explanations - which includes the model of a dynamic ether with density proportional to the density of any physical substance occupying the area of space concerned, increasing around large bodies such as stars and planets, acting as a refracting medium and affecting the speed of propagation of light and electromagnetic forces, etc. - for all the experimental data and astronomical observations currently cited in support of the special and general theories of relativity, and the internal inconsistencies and unwarranted assumptions of standard relativity theory have been pointed out by dozens of scientists.  "
:#  Einstein's relativity theory vs. the ether from a Theosophic viewpoint (rev’d 09/05)
::Inserted these 3 paragraphs initiated by user Hillman (1st and 2nd paragraphs), and completed by myself (3rd paragraph) at the related article Etheric body, as it contains relevant data to understand the several viewpoints of different sectors in our society about the subject of the present article. --GalaazV 02:04, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Relation to physics 

message: Please donnot change section   without discussing it first and providing sources (afterall this is an encyclopedia, not a a private homepage)! I've requested sources () to those comments lines that I see as private and distorced comments: failing to do it, those lines should be removed. This should be understood as a measure to avoid the repetition of the previous edit and biased war by "scientific gurus" elsewhere...
Some users seem to still have not learn to make the distinction between an encyclopedia, which collects data from ancient times till now in every known and relevant issue in all fields of human activity, and the science: if you look at the Wikipedia's "Main Page" you'll see that "science", whatever the relevancy you give to it, is just one of the fields of human activity). --88.214.128.30 21:46, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
replies: text: Reworded section to "Etheric plane's relation to physics" as it presents sourced descriptions, and also both pros and cons views. --88.214.131.117 22:47, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
thread_title:  Criticisms and etheric plane's relation to physics 

message: The sentence "In this connection, aether is perhaps radiative heat like that of the sun, which is able to propagate in empty space." reads like a supposition. It is not clear whether this is claiming that this view was held by the ancient Greeks, or if it is some editor's personal interpretation (which would be original research), or if it's simply a metaphor (which should probably be rephrased). — Gwalla | Talk 02:47, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
thread_title:  Unattributed hypothesis 

message: HERE's WHY this piece was taken out:
Some theosophists held that the vital force could be identified with "N-rays".
Weasel.
Like modern astrology and astronomy, these concepts of the ether and an etheric plane probably share a common origin.
Personal research. 
Contemporary fringe physicists in their theory of a dynamic massfree energy aether,Aspden, Harold, The Physics of Creation [i.e. Chapter 7: "Aether Structure"], 2003, (pdf available)Wilcock, David, Light on Quantum Physics sub-divided into different levels of density, present very similar notions to the theosophic understanting about the ether.Pratt, David, The Theosophical Ether
Self-published not notable, not authoritative.
This conception by these physicists describes how the invisible, not measurable, ether creates, permeates and interacts with all matter. According to these theories, it has a density proportional to the density of any physical substance occupying the area of space concerned, which increases around large bodies such as stars and planets; acts as a refracting medium; and affects the speed of propagation of light and electromagnetic forces, etc.Aspden, Harold, Aether Science Papers, , 1996 (html and pdf available) However, these claims do not accord with the mainstream scientific understanding of electromagnetism and gravity, whose standard model, among other unexplained critical issues concerning fundamental particles, has been also unable to explain the gravitational force. 
Belongs in "luminiferous ether". 
This new conception of the aether in physicsCorrea, Paulo & Alexandra, Why Speak of an Aether, 2001Mishin, Alexander M., The Ether Model as Result of the New Empirical Conception, International Academy of MegaSciences, St. Petersburg, Russia (html available) presents what its authors regard as plausible alternative explanations for all the experimental data and astronomical observations currently cited in support of the special and general theories of relativity and, simultaneously, they hold, shows the internal inconsistencies and unwarranted assumptions of Einstein's theory,Correa, Paulo & Alexandra, A running commentary on Einstein's "Aether and the Theory of Relativity" which had been already pointed out by various physicistsAspden, Harold, Physics without Einstein  - A Centenary Review, 2005 (first edition Physics withour Einstein in 1969), (pdf available)Wilcock, David, The breakthroughs of Russian astrophysicist Dr. Nikolai A. Kozyrev (1908-1983) and theosophistsPratt, David, Einstein's relativity theory vs. the ether, from a Theosophic viewpoint (rev’d 09/05) during the 20th century.
More fringe theories, self-published and off-topic. This all appears to be a personal free-association on the word "etheric". I am suprised there's no account of ether-sniffing and the ether-either debate!! Redheylin (talk) 20:07, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
replies: text: The above has been removed because it is entirely unsourced. Please note that the article above relies far too strongly on personal synthesis of primary sources. To improve it, in the first place, greater reliance should be placed on later Theosophists who have a historical overview, and upon academic sources that have reviewed the literature, I think. Redheylin (talk) 22:22, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Etheric plane's relation to physics

message: According to the Esoteric Christian tradition, Essenian and later Rosicrucian,  It also teaches that, in order for the human being to be able to adapt to these new etheric conditions, it is necessary to develop a body, named Soul body (the correct translation of Paul of Tarsus' "soma psuchicon") or the "Wedding Garment" as taught in the Holy Scriptures, eg.:
*"The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, (...) And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:" (Matthew 22:2,11 KJV) 
*"And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." (Revelation 21:2)
*"For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked." (2 Corinthians 5:1-3) 
However, it also conceives that before entering New Galilee - as mankind walk forward to the understandings of universal brotherhood, during the next six centuries toward the Age of Aquarius - the spiritual sight will start developing allowing human beings to perceive the so-called "dead" living in the supraphysical planes.
:The above has been removed because it is entirely unsourced. Please note that the article above relies far too strongly on personal synthesis of primary sources. To improve it, in the first place, greater reliance should be placed on later Theosophists who have a historical overview, and upon academic sources that have reviewed the literature, I think. Redheylin (talk) 22:22, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
thread_title:  Esoteric Christian tradition 

message: I should hugely apologize for my extreme idiocy and absent-minded 
rudeness; I had signed up an account here, and reading through 
(well, more like skimming through) barely half of all that I 
should have read before I took any action,... I took action. I 
had previously been under the impression that each of these 
article pages were the work of a vast many, and had no idea they 
were works of individual people. Assuming this, like a moron, I 
had posted up an external link on your very nicely done page 
(and some others for which I should apologize to their respective 
creators for) without asking. Someone named Consumed Crustacean 
had taken the links down, and explained things to me in polite 
detail, that I should come to you first and discuss the addition 
of such links, here, on a talk page, as is apparently explained 
in the parts of the orientative reading, that I neglected to 
fully read through when I first opened my account here. Had I done 
so in the first place, my rude mistake could have been avoided. 
(There's still much for me to read, I'm ashamed to say... still 
reading it now.) 
I feel like a complete @$$ and I'm really very sorry. 
As it turns out, according to the discussion on the WikiProject 
Occult discussion page, the article I wrote detailing a technique 
to be able to see the aura with the unaided eye was not acceptable 
for use here due to the article's whereabouts (anyone can write 
about anything there without verifiability), the fact that every 
thousand viewers on that page makes writers earn a few pennies 
(unrealized fully by me until recently), and that it's "original 
research". 
Once more, my deeply sincere apologies. It was never my intention 
to overstep my bounds and scribble over anyone's art/hard work. 
I'm very sorry.
Coeur-Senechal (talk) 09:42, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
thread_title:  A heartfelt apology...  

message: The main body of this article has several instances where there are noun/verb agreement issues. The page's chief editor should proofread it for correctness.Brakoholic (talk) 16:15, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
replies: text: I think there is no such chief editor. The issue you refer to is instead an inherent problem of many fragmented edits in a rarely edited page. Instead consider WP:BOLD. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 17:35, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Grammar

message: The fourth paragraph in the intro, the one that starts
:The majority of modern
and ends with
:and other technological applications.[12]
boastingly tries to allege that "the scientist do indeed not know everything" and then blarghs out with allegations about physical phenomenons that might explain why the theosophists are right (without a milligram of scientific research) without actually making a case for such explanations. The paragraph is a pseudo-scientific grand-conspiracy hint, and as such just plain stupid. There is no connection between the referred unsolved problems in physics and the etheric planes theorized by the theosophists. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 17:35, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
replies: text: I propose rewriting it. It should be a wellcited defence from the theosophists, the various defences should be arguments publicly and citably used. The lack of scientific support for the existence of etheric should be an irritant to the theosophists, so it must be addressed. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 18:08, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
thread_title: Intro boastiness

message: Hello,
Whoever added the Rosicrucian teachings - big UPs.
There is much confusion between the "astral" and "etheric" (Steiner);
"subtile" and "causal" means the same thing for the Luciferian textbooks (Bailey).
The most revered GaYaTRi mantra begins with Booh BooVah SVaHa,
these are the purest sounds to relate the the two:
Booh is what already exists, the physical
BooVah is what exists "in the heart of man", the dream-astral subtile,
SVaHa, one's own normal existance in a balance of the two.
I understand that the Theosophical "seers" may have been much excited by direct insights of the atomic realm, but to postulate that there are two or more imaginary realms ("planes") is pure social mother-f*cking.  I don't want to get too negative here.^[ AboutSchmidt ]
Astrological ideas also need not apply for "causal" status - it is only our collective, reasonable will in individual freedom of philospohical understanding (of the subtile) imho. 
Here in Canada the problems are extremefied by "yoga" trends, people taught they can "stimulate prana" with breathing and the like.  Prana is a global thing, the whole causal "etheric plane" is contracting on itself like Doctor Octopus' out-of-control reactor... his poor Wife!
- Dzialal Kool  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.60.229.92 (talk) 13:54, 10 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Snakes on a Plane 

message: This page is a start on the topic, covering headlines of history.  What's missing is the history of TWO etheric planes.  First a lower frequency etheric "plane" where the phenomena of UFOs, acupuncture meridians and Steiner's "etheric formative forces" are most active, the "health aura" and "pre-physical body," where the physical phenomena of "pins and needles" is expalined.  Second a higher frequency etheric plane where Jung and Joseph Campbell were hanging out, the level where "Scripts People Live," Greek, Roman and other mythologies live and where super heroes live, archetypes of all kinds, including the Goddess, the Mother, the Womb of Creation, Zen Buddhism and the Cornucopia of ever-flowing creation-into-fom.]
Citation for corroborating claim that etheric energy flows in acupuncture meridians:  The great advantage with knowing about etheric energy is that this vital life-giving energy holds the key to vibrant wellness. Vital life energy or etheric energy is present in all effective healing systems. In acupuncture, it is the "qi" energy that is enhanced or balanced in its flow along acupuncture meridians. It is the healing energy transmitted in distant healing. It is the same healing energy that is passed to the recipient in Reiki or Polarity Therapy.
http://www.spiritualdynamics.net/free/thefifthelement.htm 
After moving from the single etheric plan concept expressed clearly on this page, to a two-fold vision of higher and lower frequency etheric activity, eventually the topic evolves to perceiving nuances of etheric activity on ALL levels of Creation, physical, imaginal, emotional, mental, unconscious; finally, to how the etheric body is the 'body of connectivity' the story teller, making up stories of how all adjacent parts wish to fit together; and in the human being come to a point where the ego can say, "I am." 
I believe a closer reading of the topic clearly reveals these suggestions.  Creating citations will be a nightmare.  Would be good to re-organize the topic categories so a more complete picture of the etheric can be documented and citations added ~ Healing Toolbox
- MrX 23:06, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
thread_title:  Headlines of history