House Of Commons, Friday,...
The Times, 1824-02-21T00:00:00

.ir Jtl[fI.N NEW VPORI presented two petitions, praying tor a redluction ot the dut: oa leather. the one fronm Drogheda, and the o'ther from Clonmel Sir NV. G WISE brought in a bill for establiNhing a new theatreat thelteatharn, wvhich wtas read a tirst tite. ('OAL DU'TIES. Petitions vt-aving fior the repeal of these dutiec were presented f-onm the follow'ing places:-from the village of Abridlge, in Essex, h- Sir E. Hsavry, from the town of Greenwich. bv Sir E. K ArTC IBIly. from the town of Hertford, by Mr. Nlctiot.sox ('%LVgRT: from the ward of Bishopsgate. bv Mr. Altderman Woorn from the town) ol' Newprt, in Cornvall, by Alr. 1;AT7F. fiom the parish of BerMonDlsey, bv Mr. H. St:MrNitt f om Exeter, by '-Ir. (Co'IT'tTg',l- ; fitnn Norwich, by v ir. Wmt. S AtIrT ;, frtim the ward of ('Corriill, by Ir. WV. NstT. TrIstS ; and f-orn si parishes in Devonshire, bv Sir T. ACL.AND. .LIC'ENSI NG DUTIES. PetitionA were presented agninst these duties from the innkieepers of til following places :-uf Winchester, by Sir E. HI. EAST, Ot a town in S 'otInd', bv Sir. KgXx\-rFDu' of St. Luke's, Chelsea. I.ev ir. 'ByNG of Peterborougli, by Mr. SCART.TTr' anti oi ]luti.ngdon. bv Lord AXCRAM. DUlTY' ON WOOL. Mr. T. IV, ILSON presented a petitioni froim the mercaniaits, fac- t irs, and t-aders of London. against the tax on the importation of to- aeien wool. Mr. ROBERTSON observed, that if tie landed gentlemen zihtli understood their owit interests, th1ey would not permit this t Lto; remain any longer in existence. Cotnnnerce antI agriculture v-ere now so intimnatelv unitetl, that any measure wlichl teas injurious t i the one, necessarily provetl in the losig run injtirious to tite other. Now there could be no doubt that this tax had been verv dletririmental ti the woolleo-manut'acturers of the country for the ruttirm for the I ist vear showed that the quantity of' woollens exported had fallen olore than a quarter. Indeed, it had occasionedl them to lose the t-ade of the greater part of the continent. In Italy there was much c iarpsewoolsrown.Our*nanufacturers,beforethciin) osition ofthis tax, -ere accustomed to take nearly ihe whele of it iii return for the coarse n ollenz which thes exported to that country. The tax ott imported s ool hiad convpellesl thetm to relinquish the *[talian market; andI the o=nequence was, that the Italiai states hut prohihited our woollen gsods. At Trieste we had also been driven ottt of the fiertian mar- k-t: forthe coarse wool wiich we had fortiterly takien fromr the d'alersof Dalmatia and Turkey, was now put into the hannds of %;erman mranutacturers, and so workedl up for the continental maer- I et. The honotrahle mentber theni proceeetle to argue, that the *'lete,t of the country required that our A oollen gnods stnuld be left Es free front taxation as possible. 'The United States of America, 'hen they first asserted their freedom, contained 2,000,000 of inha- hitants at present thc5 contained about 10,0(t0,t)00. Now, these Sates would purchase woollen cloths of uis if tihey could get them E' a Inw rate; but could not, if they 'vere obliged to buy them a- a high rate. The sante was the case with the people of &3uth America. In a fe.w years we should have in those roun- triesa population of i,f'300,000, eager to purcltase our woollens, if re could sfford to sell tePm at a moderate price, and inca- p ble of taking them, if we demanded for them a lligh price. h-e therefore conjureLl the Ministers, as they valted the sta- p:e trade of the country, to t:tke off this tax, or else to be prepared fr the rest of the world comnbining together for its utter tlestrLction. I: some tax of this nature were necessary to the Protection of the a,-ricultura.l interest, he ha4 no objertion tr, give it them:; for he was ?,tre that some other t3x rnight easily be devised, which woutld be b 'neficial to them Witho,theing in jutioui to tle restof the communitv. Mr. Alderman THO IM PSON deprecated the impoliev ofputtiig a hich thtty upon l hew article, and attributetl the present depressed -a-te of the woollen tmanufacturers entirelv to the operation of this Orpressive tax. He tnerefore irtLttetf that it wouIld be taken off in ti e corurse of the session, as also the duty upon raw silk, whic' he cuisidered quite as impolitic. 31r. Alderman WOOD comtendel, that the Chancellor of the Evcheqtner would greatly mitfiake the interests of the cootttrY, if he p rmined thib tax to continue a Year longer. Sir JOHN WEROTTESLEY called the attentiort of the house to tihe circumntances unier whichi this tax liad been imposed. Thev w )tld aU recollect that in the year 1819, whent the country was in a state of profound peace, and also in daily expectatian of a consi. d.rable remission of taxation. 3,000,0001. of new taxes were unex. p -ctedly imposed upon iL Of this sum, part was raised bv the imt pi.ssition of a duty of i9. fid, a bushel ott Ilmalt; and as that tax wa9 thotght to be detrimental to the agriculturis!r, it was thotgilt proper to give thern a: a counterpoise to it. a protecting duty against the importation of foreign wool. Now a conriderable portion of the Tr alt duty had already been taken off; and if the bon. Member for tI e city wottlil assist him in taking off the reman ing sixpence, he wiuldin his turnassist thelIonourable rrember to get rid of this trx on wool. T ne petition wai read, and ordered to be prirned. COURTS OF .JUSTICE IN IRELAND. Sir JOR. N NEW PORT having understood that thei tquiryinto tbestate of tle courts of lusticein Ireland was at an end, beggedto ask the rieht honourable geonleman oprosite (:.Ir. Peel) whether he wsk rightly informed as to that f&tct ? He also wished to know what steps had been talen, so far, for carrying the recommendations of the cornmis*ioner5 into execution ? M r. PEEL said, that the inquiry had been a very valuable one; bi t its labours cartainly were at an e-nd. The comnmission hadl closed or. the Ist of the present month. Hee understoodl that considerable penmsp in all the courts had been tnade towaTds carrying the re- e:mmendations of the commissioners into effect. As regartded the fees of the Court of Chaticery., all the substantial part of the work -is done; and active measures were takine both in the Court of inss St Bench and the Ctourt of Common Pleas. C,O.MMITTEE OF SUPPLY.-ARMY ESTOUATES. The house havints resolved itself into a committee of supply, Lord PAL'IERS-TON rose to bring forward the atrms esti- bates for the year. The printed estimates, as threr appeareti before thbe house, contained a proposed increase in our militarv force of six ewrw regimen7t, upohe the existing establishment, be.sides 200 mets added to each of tli Lltree veteran battalions-thrmina an increased force of 4,560 troops, and ani increased charge of 1.58,000l.; but st4ice those estiinates had been printed, certain facts had come to his (the nohle lord's) knowledee, which enabled him to deduct 55,0001. fistn the money vote, and so linit the increased expense to 103,4641. The addition contemplated 'to our land forces would be accotmtitetl for in a very few words. It did niot arise otit of any apprehension that the peace of Europe would be disturbed, or any alarm for the cntinued tranquillity (internally) of England; but it atose out of ., view-of the present state of our WVest India colonies; and the c.ndition of those colonies he thought too important to be discussed a a collateral question. Every attention had been paid to economv Lanthe arrangement of the proposed increese. The officers of the six "-w regiments were to be all taken from half pay;- nor were there to t e-ariy-prornotions from regiments already existing, although (Go- ver-neint bad mnade that regulation with much unwillingness. Our -~cdTusi:ad force, then, he would consider as tis be increased by an addition of1,P800.tnen. The increase of charge, in the first itistance, would stand at 172,0001.: against.which. was to be set a saving (by ta5cg ofiesg Fron half-pav) of 18,0001. Of this expense, about .i9t,0Ml. o.140,0001. was thie,cost of the new regiments ; and the ae<aT. for regiments whichliad last year been charged uvoti the Este-ndiaaCompany, but whichl, having since arrived in England, czasneiupOn the government establishnmeit. Upon the itemn of staff ,,,riee ! ofndia) an increase would appear of 5,.00]. This arose =z.n the appointmet of.fan additional generatonfier in Ireland axiirorn eertain eeseas beihn not vincluded in -the etitnate for ~-'. ' :f'which b rormerly been carried to other accountm. In '4e p'blic departments there ivas a diminution of 1,8001. In the me- 82aciier, a diminution of 5841. In the volunteer corps, a triflirng di- m,iruition. The third cleas of estimates, taken upn the printed paper, Id-be found t0afford adiminntior of 29,0001., to which lie meant a farther abatemelntolf fi50001., nsaking upon the whole an bmf~,h30l. sileiltoyal Ifilitarr- CoUeg d darge, there of- iin~1ij of 161 Od &e anthe t!neral Offilcer.lpay,a diminution of- s3601;ad he. meant fatrther- to abhtd,ttt00ooL n POD. Ihis item, with a ie* to casual reductions which 'might be expected to take glac. Thegarrisons at home and nbroad were nearly thesarne as .ntheIastyear-small diminution of 1901. A diminution of 1,8001. rmla be fbund gaitst the fuiL pay of retired officers but sinoe ethe ertirnate had bOen ptinted ho had found he could lessen that-charge n,0OL more. Thethalpa7 tndf nilitary allow-uncesan abatewnent 17,W in heestimate ; to wHich he shotsIl.0;a lsin.r abauement of 4%0001. ; makcing f7,001. altogether. On the f'orelgr IlhaiC ay a diminuition of' 2,0001. In Pensioners of Chelsea and Kimainham Hoptl,nearly the- same a-s last year. Out-pensioners, a dimi- ntoof5,0001. ; which s6emed little.; but expense hadl been pro- duced by thie arrival of' somne regimnents from In.dia. Tn the Military Asylunm there was an abatement of 2,2001. On the' Widows' Pensions, an increasqe of 3,6001.: the house would be aware that widows of half-pay officers were enititled to pensions all well as the widows of those on full pay. On the Compas.4ionate JlAst, from freshica%c.A, an increase of 6,50101. Superannuation allowances, Ain increase of' 3,6831;, partly, occasioned by the transfer of charges tot tmfro oher accounts. The Exchequer Fee, which was thlst artcl i the third class of estimatee, remainedI at the samte sum, withiin a trifle, as last y'ear; and, on tlie Vreteran, Battalions in Irelatid (which formned the fourth clas.s), there wras an incerease o (f 19 60MI The state of the account, therefore, takeni altogether, I woulA shiortlv come to this-increased number of mern, 4,580; increased charge (in gross) lb11,0001. From this amounit, hiowever, there was to be' detlucted....first the 55 0001. which he hiad muention- 'ed, reduciing. the suLM to 103,061. ; antA next, a suim (in the way of balance) to be set ofl, of 60,0001., which was. paid by the East Inaia Comipany for the half pay, and Pensions of troops employed in thieis territories, but wicih beng (undter act of Parliament) paid into the Exchequer, went to the aceouint of the Wavs and Mehns. '[his easnn of 60,0001., to whiich, the armiy estimate was entitled, redlueed the year's increase (withi 4,400 men additional) from 103,0001. to 43,0001., andI hie should conclude, therefore, by moving, as his first resolution before the house, " that a torce of not exceeding 73,341 regutlar troops, and 3,354 mien in Veteran Battalions in Irelanid, should lie grantedl, exclusiive of force-s in India, for the service of the succeedin year. Mr . l 1 U5l was not of opiniion thiat the noble lard's exposition ha atsatorily accounted, or laid a foundation, for thie increase be meditated. He had heard nothing fronti the noble lordl to induce him, a., regardled his own voite, to support a standinAtg army of 73,000 men. It hiad olily, been pecuiliar circumistances which bad led the houise to sanction she continuance of ouir existing establishment last year; and lie had looked with confidience to a reduction of 5,000 mnen, or l;.000, rathier thain an incerease, in the present year. An adldition to the na,vy had already this session bean grantedl ; and the IProposal of' thie noble lord], if thie house woutld Iisten to it, gave us lin fewer than 233,000 usten his arms. Now, to what pairpose-for whiat esisdwas this tmmnense estabolishmienit, in tunie of peace, to be iajistasined ? oni the irontitirit, tIte Kinig's -speechl assuredl its, there wasV eVery aPPearance of' COntinuied peaie. Icelandi e We hadl tfroops enough in Irelatid already, anid too many, for they did nmis- chief' lBut it was said thait 'ke wanted m-en i'n the West Indies. f lew nianny? say, for argument's sake, 3,000 or 4,000. And was oitr existitig establishmnent so low, that we could not afford ;uch a force w'itbcut augmenting it ? Butt he was out of patienice to hiear alwavs the old remnedy-sending out troops to the WVest India islandls! Ministers ought to have spoketn out bef'ore this periodi of the session, and to have said whiat eventuallv was to be done asito thrise isilands. Ministers ouzht to s'peak onttt he repeated, before t[ttt alienated the mrinds of the colonists. They, oughit to say at onnt', "; W1e mean, to liberate the slaves," or 11 NV~e do not m-ean to liberate them ;' and not give Opptortunities to desig.ning individuals, as he heard that suchi existedl, to lpnt Else propeties, and even thie lies o the wvhite inhiabitants in jeopardy. Te lhonourable memi- ber the"n complained of the iniperfect stat'eof the estimate laid be- fore the house. loti, miemibers mnighit as well hiave no estimate before thiemi ntahl,as one in whiceh thte noblelord was to miake such altefations. Thie honourable gentlemian concluided by mroving, thie following reso- ltittion- "That as hisNMajesty was graciouisly pileased in his speechi fr-om the tltrotie, to inforiii thec hiouse that, "at nio fotmner period hias there prevailedi titrouigliout all classes of thiecoimniuility in this islatid, a mnore clieerfuil spirit of order, or a more lust sens'e of the atlvantages whichi unider thie blessing of Providlence they eniiny. - In I relatid, wlhich has for some time pjtast" Isen the subject of hiis Majesty's particular solicitutle, there are many int"ictstiots; of aniendotent, andi his Majesty relies upon youir ctiftinuted endea- vours to secure the welfare atid happiness of that part of the Utiited Kcitigdom, "tHis Majesty has commnanded us, fuirther, to itiforns youi, that he has every reason to believe that the progress of our in- ternal prosperity'and imrprovemetit wrill not be di .sturbed by any irnterritVtoni of tranquillity abroad. Ii is MajSesty continuest tI receive fromi the Plowers, hiis allies, angenerall~ from- all Princes and States, assurances of thieir earn est desire to maintaini anti cultivate ishe relations of fr-ienidshipi Iith his MNaj esty.' Thisi C'o;sni'ittee caninot, thierefore, agree to any iticre:ase of tuse numiiber of'thie armyv since last year, but are of opin-ioni that , a tand- ingr armiy of 63,t1tl reegulars, ex'clusive of 19,0010 of artilery, veterans, ant(i Marines, ilow emibotlied, anid a large force of militia and volun. teer-s ready oni any emergency to be emlbodied, are sutficietit, tinder ,%ll the cire'tnimtasscss of the cottntry, to be kept op. Sir. BROI)EN said, tie us-ual course was to) miove eitlier a re. ~luctien of' the number of imeni, or the amioutit of' the expeisse. Mr. HUMIE wishied the words of' Ihis resolution to be retained h e iould) therefore Propose it is as an amendnietit on the original reso,lution. The question was accordinglyvso puit. Mr. GIORDON said, the noble lora (Palm-erston) hadl given as t4e Principal reason for an increated f'orce, the slate of the colonies alid thiouigl lie (Mr. Gordon) wscat ot desirous to be numberetl iiitthat unhtappy class of persons calledi IetIdi prpitrs(loi twste custwm at presenit for every hindto bus, yt a li Isd sme est India nroperu.v he was anxius o epres lla oinin ot te sbject. It appeared tfiat 2 500 menhai ale.iy bensett t th ~VstIndies, in anticipation Z? he roteof tis eenin, thugh he obl rdn haRd weith great prudence ibsilnd fom hteirtislonof he elcate topics connected witht that suibject a nd hie (Mr. Gordon) heartily whished the hoanourable tiiemiiber for Aberdeen htd followed tlint examnple : but it appeared. to be 1:;s wisli to initroduce a clebate on Wlest India interests, whiich every other person deemned desirable to be avoided. The litonourable meniber wvished his Majesty's ministers to speak. out on the sutbject; svhilsit he ( fIr. Gordoni), oft the contrary, would v6sh tlient not to spseak at all, but rem-tin quiiet, wehen lie trusted that all would end in peace and tranquillity. He wished the liouse to be convinced that it was not alone ots the ground of thie ll'esit india colonies, that the increase of force was necessary, for latst y'ear, from the state of the continent of Euirope, every onie agreed in the necessity of a large ferce ; and he could not see any, tIliing either looking to Greeceor Spain, fromi whiichi it could bear. gited thlat there was not isow a.s great a chance of this country being involved its war as there weei at that time. -Sir W41I. DP CllESPIGNY, in a few; wordls, recoisimended mioderation ott thie subjecL Of the WVest Itidia colonies. CGeneral GjASCOYNE said, that when he consiaered the addi- tion of colonial territory acquired by this counitry since the peace, lie teas inure tItan ever convinced thiat the army had been too much reduicedl. Whets he nieitiioneel, thiat there were some regiments which had] reraitled abroad 18, 20, andl 24 years, without beuing relieved, the huuse wrotild be convinced of the nece.ssitv of some co'urse beingr dotdfr the attainitnent Of that obj'ect. TPhe lion. memnber here :,Iread rn a return, the nusmber of years whiich several reymnents lintl been serryitig in the East Indies; and asked, if it could he borne that these mieritorious niien shouild be banished from their native rouitiry' for a longer period of time titan thiat which was itifhicted ssasptiniqls,neni oni felons?P It was not,thent, for theWiest Indies alone lint ani isicrease oh l'otce ss'as necessary, but oni account of our other axtens ive colonies, in justice to whlichi, ar well as to the soldiers to Whiom we %vere so much indebted, it wras proper that the force should ae au4mented. '['le hoa.irent. tAlr.lissie) said, that if Ireland wvere traisqoillized, thiere would be no necessity for tlse increase ; but had here been any maide suggested for obtainingr that desirable end, or s'..ss it likely 'Oon to occur, and were the exitgencies of the West JIn- ~lies to wait till Ireland shiould be settled ? As to the militia and !-hmanariy, the lion, member shioutld recollect, that the services of haitsdesriptioli of force seas not usuially called for, without there was iii actual diankger of invasion. On the whiole, he cosusidered the inz crase was necessaryv andI he rejoiced that hiis Majesty's ministers iad conse to the same conclusion. Mr. WVOD E H O USE hiopedl, thlat whenever the subject ofthe \Vest Indies camne before thk house, it would be temperately discussed. Dao the subject of' the force serving in tlie IVest Indies, there was in one regiment stationed at Barbadoes, a return of deaths of 20 officers and 500 mnen. ThLss regim-ent wvas sent out, not as a relief, but a-, a reinforcem-ent, antd they were forced out by, the cry For reletutioit at home at an unhealthy period; and to that circurn: stanceealenewas the great mortalitv'tohe attributed. Hiewould ask, therefore, if these sveretsotrircumnstan'ces worthv of the considcrbLtion 3f the house? Tue accuracy of' hit stateinetit lie could vouch for.; as lie had received the cominunication from -a gaillant officer, some timie since a issember of that house (Siir Herbert Taylor). The toit. memnber for Aberdeeni ,poke of the gentlemen who sat on hi.s (MNr. Wlodehouse's) side of thie hoiuse, as it' they never thought for themselves; but, according to his expretsion, "1 Follotw my- leatler" was the ordler of Cthe day. He tlMt. WIodlehouse) did certainly, in comumon with others, support his - Mlajesty'.s Go- verrimetit against the rEduction which took oDlace some' time ftssce ; and hie still retained th-, opihion, whbich he tfhen entertained, that the reductions in the naval and military establishmients had been -carrierd too far. He knew that a great deal of constitutional reasonsing, mnight always be brouight forward on the subjiect of A standing army ebit C itoae would not ba led away bk' it fromn judging of ieneesity arising frcom chiange of circsttsiistnnces and the variations of society. If the honourable miember for Aber- deen wnald tread that path, let himn place himself uhdaer proper gaidance. A noble baroa in another place dtd not. con-sidter thesi-silitary force of the CountrY aa ausy ground of danger-, and lin fol- lowing his opinien, thie honourable memlber for .Aberdleea tieed not fear ithe coisititution or liberty of thle country svould be overwhelmed'. Mlr. BERNAL, said, thaCtethen troops were sent to the WVest In- dieS) Particularly to Jas-naira, it aid happen, he kiiew not how, that they, were not puit into those quarters whiere they couldl be seasonsed to the climlate, but were genierally quartered near Port Royal, or Kingston, instead of being selit into the healthy climate of' the coun- try. Bes4ides this inattention toj the quartering, the troops were fre- qitetlysett ot a animpope sesonof thle y-eat. WNith respect to relifs,he gred wth mtcho' hathadbeen stated by his, honouir- ablefri it (enerl Gacoya.) Iter wa~a sytemof favourit.. fainextndin tocertin ~imets,cahe icrk"regiments; ..... E. tnat .Was demolished, thiere never could be-a ..p'e'r'fe-ct sysStem of relief,. He believed that his Royal Highness the ?ommander_in.chief was doing his endeavours to put an end to it, ho that every regiment in the service would noq have to take its turn of duty. He agreed with much that bad fallen from his lion. friend the member for Aberdeen; but thought he was in the habit of Opposing miany of the measures of ministers, lie should riot oppose the prescnt vote, lest it shiould embairas4 those arrangernents which circumnsarices had reuidered necessvry. lie did not mean to say a word on the subject of the West Indies, thoigh indoubtedly the time woumd coine when silence would be criminaL t IlMr. HOBHOUSE said he felt it necessary to apologize for offer- ing himself to the honse on thep6emsnt occasion, as lie was aflraid hia sentimentawere so ex-traordinary,hat they were not only uslkely to nnd muels'sympatily in that hoises but, he was sorry to say, even iuCtle counitry at large. (A laugiu.) But he thought it the duty of -members of that house, when there was a wantof popular feeling, or an excess of it, to lead the public mind; and it became every pablic muti5 to tell the people what was the dift'rence between himself and his constituents.: He, perhaps, should not-have spoken on this occa- sion, were it not that it oight appearcthere was some diHFerence be- tween his precern settinseiita i and- those expressed by him last session. IHe had before said, and he could stot tdo often repeat it, that our position wa. not such as became' this mighty nation: we might have given the law.to all Europe, in- stead of truckling to others. He confessed hiriself an aav6cate fir wiar, if the aggres,sion on Spain could not have been p'revented with. aut it; buit as' ve ha-d not hadthe hontouruof standing in thatattitude We- ought - not- sow to be called. upon topa-y for an anny sRhich was' kept up, not to terrify or annoy tyrant. abroad, but'to Iceep down hc people at home. He (5Mr. fIobhouse) reading history, ins he bought every Rnghiahman tised to read it, feand, fromrt&i exDp- ience of all age, that standinmgarmiW'had always beets cim: sloyed for the purposes of tyrant --How chasiked itatst 'betlie sentiments, when EngUshmen can come to the conclusion that usenestlons to the standing army are. rnere matters of course, n th only discussion arising.oaofit'are qestions of horu the trOOs vre to ~e:perqbk ;isIlst. the great- constitutional qt'les- darefilt i tie O.p _ce r arelb,to inataini a great standinig army,, is'passea'li vithloitttbiseitraui. The noble Ilo~(Palmengton) now -came-to ask for-an increaseor 4,000 men, as ffThat were a merei trifle; kbutdid lse.re*ibimher-that, ucriod whien tlte greatest change wok plize in the politic4 f Euro'pe, and vet onily laltf that ihum- ber was atdded to our force? In 1792 and' 119.3 the noble lord was aware of the greAt change whicb took place in tle ms pecls of the then cabiniet and though In 1791, Air. Pitt had ams guaranteed the continuance of peace, yet it was then thoighit neces- sary to Increase our militarv establishmient, and 2,000 mien was all the addition yet the lioble'lord, at this tlime when by, the fling's .speech we wer~e-told there neVer wats a tmime when there w'ai so little apprehension for tho continu]ance of peace, and tise hon. Secretary for Foreigni AWairs had stated that for all that lie saw there wa's no danger to be apprehended fromn foreign ag.gression-yet at tIlsi time the noble lord com-res forward and demandts an increase of 4,000I men because there are disturbances in the colonies9. For En'glanid and Ireland we had A force of 42,000 men, and if it were hnecessary to send additional troops to the W1est Indies4, it seemed to him that they could be spared from that nitmber.. In 1818, though we had 26,000 men on the ce,tablishment, yet 18,000 only were actually iii service ; an hnw ad the manufacturing districts in suchi a state that it coultd hardly be said that a civil war would not break out within 12 mionths ; andi -yet l,ooo Intl) were t-hoght silficient for the protection of the coutntry; and isow, when, from his Majesty's speech, there never was so little danger of peace beingdistubed; 0,000are thought niecessarv. The standing armyIn herignof Charles IfI. was proposed to amnount to 6,00 men an yetthepenisioned Parliamnent of that arbitrary monachrat prliaentyvhose subserviency hiad branded it withi infmy o al utue tme-was not base enoulgh tapermit the ex- istece f sch foce.From the first tinie that he had opened his mnouth in that hiouse, he had always expressed his opinion, that it was, necessary to keep a jealous and vigilant guardA against the attempts whichl were conistantly snak-ing to Increase the stanid- inig military force of the counitry ; tsnd to the latest hour of his life lie should continsue to e"press the sime opinion. It miust be obviouis to every, ian who would take the trouble to ex- amille it, that nothiing could be more dangerous than thie success ot' suchi attemp!S; the hiistory of every counttry in wliceh they hiad been effected, proved that their' natural tetsdencev w'a.s the subversion of con'stitutionis; and lie had no doubt, thiat if it was not checlked, it wouild also overturn the constitutionz of Eniglasrd. Tue noble lord hiad not given the liouse any sufficient reason for the aufisnentatidn of the forces whicls lie had proposed. It was not pre- teli.ied to be necess1rY for thle angmentation of tranquillity. Why, thien, were 20,000 maen W~anted? W rhy was a greater force necessary at this period of profound repose than the usuirper Cromwell had kept up for the purpose of maintaining by the sword tiet rule which he had obtained by the sworil l-is didl not mean to deny that some force was always necessary- fromn whichi the reiitforeenieists required for else service of the colonies lisould be drawn ; but it did not follow tha suh frcemigt nt b liite. f in the vear 1818, 18,000 menwer fond uffciet, hy as t popoednow to increase them Looings hadidwithanxity nd ialosV at all attempts likethis hecoul nO hel regettng tat ie hd nt the valuable assstaceof om ofis ses fieds,aswell as of other honoutable membes who usually expre'?sed th-emselves. unfisvourably to suchi anesriensaons as that which lisowas stow opposing. The liop.mresi- her for -Norfolk (.Nr Wosdelonse), wlso was one of that class of per- sons commonly most zealous to aid suchi oppositions,--he mneant the countrygentlemrn..and who, if they, were not induced by a wiser and more extensive view of the dangers with wlichb a%tandinginilitary force was fraught, had in general at least a strong insthttct whiceh promnpted the'm to the protection of their owii intere-sts fromi ithe mischievous conse4ienceeof such a force_even that hon, tisemnber was found to Id'cr th irposed addition to the standing ary twa lee thttesare of I reland rendered a large militarv force always neces- Rary : lie called upon the house to conisider thi8t it belioved thesii to showby hei vot ofthi nigt hw mch they sttoisglit it neces- tar tht achaigeshuldbe aden te ystem whichi had been acted lyontowrdsthatunfrtuate ounry.I-le wrished miost heartily :hatthe ovement insead f awaysatteptig so Ptitt own tite revihng isontnt threby ore, oud ateptto remove the suse ofthos dtconente Hewishd tat releand should no Onrger be goiwrned like a Conquered country, nor the English in1- labitantsl of it raugist to consider themselves as colonists, wvho :ould only hold possess,ion of it by means of an extensive faction snd by the maintenance of an armitd force It was proposed to sent? tForc~, of 80,000 mien to Ireland ; thith, togrethier witi t he veomnanry, mnd the police there, to say notlsing of th~ e miilitia, wyoul,l make a'n irined power of 50,110, wbirls could always be made effective, and iv which simple enigine of state -we thiought to justity all the wrongs writh whiceh we had so long afflicted that usilsappy, country. Itsttead if pursuing this intention, .he shiould reromusneisml such a chn1e of he insans by sehich that country was governed, as wvould enNeb us' o etuploy a diminution of force. The priniciples which hiad hithierto s)een acted upon had all failed, but lie was convinced that a difierent 'ate would attend different principles. if the Government, insteadi if force, would try the efficacy, of persuasion--insteatd of thie systenm if restriction, would adopt that of' a liberal anid Impartial dis. -ensation of public -favours, lie had a perfect conviction that hey wouild do m-ore towarids restoring content and traisquillity o h eple of Ireland than they coildl ever hope to do even iny tiel ore they now proposed to senii thiither. He regretted o find that the people of Etigland were not sufficiently jealous if tile increase of ithe military strength. Formierly, o'ne spirit lervadedi the wlhole nation on thist subject, and there was ito tiisan rho did not louidly exprems hisi detestation of a standing erniOr ki.rong thie honourable memnber's own constituents, whot, hie wouldi akle the lIbet of sayving, were as, feelingly alive to the preservation If lth cost=uion as any partt of the coron~isnitv. soine alatsit was a this roonsettt etster,taiiied,with respect to the pi-tject of niskisig bar- ack inthever -hartof estinser.It was said that its that ~so whrlshadfornery-len es'tedtothe amuxseroetits of the rosi, i wa no luendd t prvise fr the residlence of a force rhiel migt bemadeto o raw thepeope if ever thieir rights I houd rsin incolison it~hepreensonso~the Crown. He lioped idn, whether it was really else iiitention o?oetsissenttocivrt hKig's5 ew% itonlilitsrTy barracks ? It was necessary, or at Seat it was fair, that if this was intensded,it shzould be known; for he -oudd a&sure the noble lord that it wouldl smake no small stir-het moped in- the metropolis, but certainly in that part of it wlhich was nost nearly interested in the sutbject. Alany, of his Constituents hail ormplained to him of die pecuniary detrimient which thscyex- jencd b' te shttig u thethoougfare at the AMews'. 'i'his rae ertinl Un ustilale; ut f bcaue it had been suffered.the1 sobe lrd hou~itthepeole oul tael endure thc buildinir of sarrcks hereer te Goernmnt igh think fir, he would find sisssl mitakn. Ie newtha th nble lord had on a former -cesin wheis speakhin on tesbect of inland barracks, despisect he atquated authiority ofBaktone, and opposed to it thte ours nligtene wisdm ofthe )resent age. He be~gedt anio fo rie legthat hichitshadtroubiled the committeeI so hissub~ct; bt h cold ot uffr the Opportuniity whicht ras nw aforde himof epresing lis opinions osi tile aitS- nenatin f te iliaryfoce-piions Nvhich evess if h"eI houldhave ie inst'orune t holdthem in~', 1s wa ever- heleAs conviticed wer uc asdeplcoere tlhe preservation of he constitution. Teabsec o anofthe hon. members who -sually supported the view wihhe hdtknof titse que.stion, was, mon~ nany lamentable proofs of the habito supinereeas andl in- f ens,ibility to this subject, which wa gadal creepinF on wliere had never before been received. eshudvote with Iisis hon. ricnd (Mr. Hunts) for the propose amnment. and if it had bien xteiaded to sendiiig the whole army out of Englaind,ant evn h 'Duntry under the protection of the civil power only, he wul hav'e' .ols illinglv' supportea it. Lord`PAL.iER-STON replied. As far -as lie h-id bees able D collect the opinion of she house, the hon. members for ii'estmin- tsr and Aberdeen were, the only gentlemnen who i-ntended to oppnose 1 he vote ;it was therefore unnecessary foLr hlim to enter furthier isnro lhe discussion than to answer some of the objections which they, had aised. In the firstI elae the hots, member for Aberdeen had seemed.I a consider the reinforcements for the West India service necesSaryt ar althatigh he had in the early p art of his speech deniedt thiis, he .ad afrerwattds coniceded it. But he said, that lite had Consented to h6 estimaties of the last yeat only because it was then expected that he country miglht be engaged in a war, and but for that prolability, I re wouild have proposed a reduction to the amoujnt of 10,000 men. rhe honourable gentleman might perhaps allude lo an opinion en- ertainea lay himself and his friends ;buit his lordship felt it rieces- ary, on his. own nt,to declare that such en expectation formed no )art of the grounds o whichs he had solicited the vote Of last Year. )n the contrary, the Government then declared its resolution of re- nainini ~eIcl nurladhecldot believe that the house hiad seen inue oegre to thie vote for any such Teason: lie was, quite itire that it-.s suCh hatd bee-u propo-ed 'by hlim. Wihat were the ncaas by which the hon. gentleman would have thereductio. whicls se recommensded effected? In Iteland hie was of tviniols, that'ifI :ertain measures wer ao ted he military force at present ther nigh be ithrawnand ppled t thereiforcemrent, of the colonial ervie. id n~ an i hi sesesbeleve, that if the Cathiolic luetie wee st a nat o:mrro, i wuld have such a niore than na1ic ff,ttupn Ielad -tht he oreenplayed there Tnight be afel reove atonce 'Ihe on.memer next pioposed, that a educton shuld b madefrom he caalryand the Guad.Ile Lord Palmerston) was prepared to contend, that there was nor a ,arger,,nifmber of man irs the~e regiments than was fa irly. proportion- to At flnfsttry of the linie; and that it was impossible to reduce hieit Without ahedi reducing the efficiency Of that establishment, ehbich even in times of peace, it was nt~cessary to keep up, that ar- airs miight be formed if war should break otit. 1'lse lon, member tad alluded to the militia and yeomnanry ; but he knesw 'very -well hat eiter f toseforces could its aniy way be made scrviceable for olopal rinfrcemsits Stll, e sa~ tbfnthng could be done fromn any infhea sorce th aumenatin othermy snightbeeffected at aless b~pese,andt~it Isted o ~hnewregments, additionsi mighit be madeto hteld oes Ie LssPalmsstd)wias quiute aware that larzee reglntentailttsblismelitiWaeltessrK~O5 vein ~roportionthan small ms s; but from the nature of the colonis _ed inuarner in whlichl h%e forces were distr ibutedi an additio of50 mets to teach regimnent, slthouigh it would increase the nutmerical force of the estabiialinient., would-uot add to, its distposiable force, because tise addlition would be stade in many places where it was not wanteil, and in others it would be inade.u.te- The expense at which the new regiments ivere made was only that of the officers' and this, it mnust be remem- iered,was lesis than It might sepni to be, fot they were supplied from he hall.pay list, and the additional expense was therefore only the lifference between full and half-pay, which was not, as the term vould isnply one half, but in some instances a third, aad in others sly a foNrti. The: hon. meniber unidertlhe gallery (MIr. Bernal) hadq "mplaiinedolttlbe system, of qjiarteying irgops in. the NVest lndiss was niijuffi,tly attended to. The healthiiiess of the bar- rsAcks% had, bawever; longDoccupied the attent.onof the Government, and rreat paillS hlad beei takerby -sending competentinedical men to efaminclethin, t'o pry&ure the jest opinions respecting each sta- tion. .- (Il (Ltrd Patn'riston) ias aware that sooie statiotis had been foandutnfavourable.to thlte-heallth of the troops. The -Governmwent has been engaged in makifg-a*arangen emintg with the leislative body Df theisland of Jamaica, to alter those stations; and although some iifficulties had arisen, he could ssuTe the hon. member aind the htu.4e, that the subject fiad been' no neasis lost sight of. With respect to the fime nd sdaons'at*which troops were seilt to tihe lVeat Indies, itr w& truec hat it was extremey dbsirable the rein- forcements should arrfve'there at particular periods of the year. The regikent' tis-which-hiihono6irable friend hehind (MAr. Wode- house) hd allhdtd, had unavoldably - been sent vLnder- very unfa- O6ab lecirbmrnstarsces ~ 1ut s wasn on of the prejudical conse- qtaences arising fron the face in the coloniprs being brought to so low nit amoult. thit *F 'a reinforcement became imuiiedi- irely necessas'4 tters t -n'rneri 'of7siplislyitiK it, bit by sendnsg a regitent: fromn hine; whetn perhaps -the Government mtuld' not 'control; the- period of its arrival. The hoTioarable smnmhtnb for WY esfiinsiar hadl -sid.at he wai in the -ole pos- essioniofpkeetlii9optiitfla6sontc iates'iefore the hoouse. He Lxord Pdralerson) did not thiik- by the hon. member's aijarienhts B this wvessizig hews, at all iakely to lst- the possessioni of those pmiins; st- d i r!i* bwn 1?the Lod rlsneerttonh a5 he would ttillirtgly zoV beha6si. smbes oftc she cx si,e-edit to which they Were entitled, should say not a ward against them. It wasby no means his wish to ridicule that proper constitutional jealousy with which the people of England had always regardel the esta- blishment of a standing.army; but he would put it to thehonourable Kentleman, or to those who were sincere adsiirers'and 'well-wisheis of the constitution, whether it was not better to reserve the expre.s- sion of their opinions on the subject to a fitting opportunity, and whether they did not, in t'act, throw ridicule on the cause they wish- ed to support by introducing those opinions upon occasions to which Ah~lr.iHOB2SE said that tbe noble lord for the purpose of rounding a period, had exaggerated what had ?allen fromrhim. He did not say that he was in the sole possession of the opinions he had expressed; and at all events the noble lord might have donejustice to the conscientious rnotives which prorripted that expTession even though it had been a.s ill-timed as he seemed to think it. l e was quite satisfied notwithstanding tie ridicule. which the noble lord thought his (ifr. flobhouse's) injudicious supp6rt had thrown upon constitutional principles, that they remained unhurt by it- He was sure he had done those principles as little harm by hiis support as the noble lord had done by his attack. Colonel DAV'IES thoulght the estimate an extravagant one, but he was still not prepared to go the full length of the motion. M2r. II[;MfE replied, the ground upon which he had proposed his I tnotiosn remained ulnshaken by any thing he had heard i'rom the no- ble lord. He regretted that upon this occasion the benches below him were empty, and that be was deprived of the support he looked for from those hon. members who had usually advocatetd the same side of similar questions. He, however, lcft themotion widhthecom- mittee, satisfied that he had done his duty. General GASCOY'NE explained. Slr. CALCRAFT, having formerly voted for the reduction of the n,ilitary force witih those of his hon. friends whose absence his hon. friend (Mlr. Hume) had just regretted, felt himself called upon to say that he did not think the proposed addition for the service of the colonie4 could be opposed upon the same grounds. He had, in concert with those lion. friends, voted for reduction until the force of tLe country had been retduced to such an asnount, that he thought it could not oe brought lower: beyond this, he ats-i not preparedl to go, and this l.e thouight sufficiently accounted for theabsence of those fioll. iniemiibers. Thie conimittee then divided : the numbers wve-e For the amendment. 10 I Against it 10'2 1 3ajority, 92. The original resolution wVas then carried. The followinig voles were then agreed to without opposition For defraying the expenses of the statf(exhiusive of India), 92,2971. 1os. fid. Ditto Ireland, 24,72.51. 8s. 5d. For defraying the expenses of medicincs anid surgical instru- ments, 12,8221. 5s. Ditto Ireland, 4,5581. 12s. 6d. For the volunteer corps, 134,0001. Ditto Ireland, 19,3431. 12s. 8d. For the troops and companies recriting for the East India Cons- pany's service, 20,2581. 2s. Id. Royal iNilitarv College, 11,4231, 19s,. Id. Army pay of (heneral Officers, 16f9,1701. Garrisons oi' Great Britain, 29,6351. 13s. IOd. Ditto Ireland, 5,5561. 18s. fid. Full pay of retired officers. lZ4,442l. Os. ltl. Half pay and military allowanices, 838,8921. 4s. 6d. Foreign half pay, Ill ,2i01. In-pensionersofChelseaand Kilmainham Hospitals,46,3991.8s.l d. (ut-pensioners of Chelsea Hospital, 1,2191,4171. Ils. hlid. Royal Alilitary Asylum, 23,8CI1. 5s. 3d. ~Vidow*' pensions,l134,2611. C'ompassionate list and pensions for wounids, 186,3841. 13s. 'Jd. Su!perannuation allowances, 41,9481. 13s. 7d. Ditto Ireland, 5.-2921. Ifs. 4d. Exchequer fees 33,0001. L ord PAl,,IEAS'TON then stated that he hadl no further votes O move. NAVY ESTIMATES. Sir GEORGE ClAERK moved thathetsum of 53,286fl. Ss. d. se granted to defray the salaries anid contingent expenses of the Ad. niralty Office. Air. H UME took that opportunity of callingr the attention of the ionourable baronet to a subject which was not coitiected wiLh :he vote before the commitiee. He understood that great dis- ;atisfaction existed amoFg the lowrer class of workmeti in the lock yards, on account of the reduction whichi had been made n their wages since the conclusion of the war, which re. luction they coticeived to be much greater in proportion to the sInount of iheir weages than the reduction wvhich had taken place in lie ralaries of the persons who held sittations above them. He did lot know whether the attention of Government lIad been called to he circumstance; but lie had received information to the effect which ie had stated. Sir (;. CLERK saidl he was itot aware that any dissatisfaction Pre- ,ailed amotig thie workmnen in the dock-yards, and he was sure there vas no ground for any. The following votes were then moved and agreed to: For tile salaries and contingencies of thie Navy-pay-office, !7,7941. Is. Gd. Salaries and contingencies of the Navy-office, 57,M01. 15s. Ditto of the Victuallitig-office, 33,4471. l0c. Ditto of the Dock-yard at lDeptford, 17,8151. 10s. bd. Ditto of the Dock-yard at Woolwich, 1!9,3641. 10s. Ditto of the Dock-yards at Chatliam, 24,8651. 1Os. 2d. Ditto of the Dock-yards at Sheerness, 1,5341. 13s. Ditto of the Dock-vards at Portsanouth, 35,4951. s. 2d. Ditto of the Dock,.yards at l'lvmouth, 31,2-261. as. 8d. Ditto of the Drock-yards at Pembroke, 6,4901. 10s. Ditto of theoutports 3,2111. lls. 2d. MVages to artificersantalbourers employed in his Majesty's Dock- ,ards at hutme, 476,4001. Charge for timber and all other materials, for the building, re- airing, atid filttiig his .ajesty's ships, &c., .507,0001. Upon the lact vote being propiosed, ?llr ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ h, t'Tt1 l 1ttoS-lfritr l, 0I-n ---osl on he subject of the sWrv-rom B'a.,..,~h. ,.n~, Sir BYAM&I MAR*IN replEed, that the immersion of the vwood n salt water was no0V practised, and the stse of coal-tar discon- inued. For thle latter circumstance he as we understood) wac orry * because lie believed that the use of coal-tar was attendedl with good effects. It was quite certaiti that the dry-rot had reatly decreased since the termination of the war and he was con- itnceed that the ships which had beeni built since that period would ave a longer duration than any which had been constructed before- n consequeticee of the allusion which had been made on a former iceasion to Alr. Burbidge's book on the dry rot, he had taken the rouble to read that work through, and lie did not hesitate to say that t was false from the beginning to the end. (A laugi.) SI r. HU ME observed, that he coultl not voucb for the truth of all hat Mr. Burbidge had advanced, but there certainly were some of iis statements whichi deserved to be seriousil considered, and lie in- etided to bring them unler the notice of the house at a future pe- iod. I-le wished to receive information on twoother points-name- V. whether the uLse of' foreign timber had been abandoned in ship- ;uiding; and whether, in the contracts which had been madeby ,overnment, it had becn stipulated that the timber should be elled in winter iistead of the sumimer Sir B. MARTIN said that Government had contracted for both arei m and niative timber, but that no stipulation had been made hat it shoult be felled at atty particular period. l'Vhen the lion. nember shoultd b.in,g the subject of tthe dry rot before the house, he Sir B. ilartin) would be able to show that the dry rot had been lOst destructive to our siiippiug dluring the last 150 ycars4 and that C had only begun to disappear since the conclusion of the war. Elear, hear.) Sir .1. W ROTTESLEY said, it was of great moment that the ak employed in ship-building should be felled in winter, as its dura- ility was thereby greatly increased. The following vote wvas agreed to:- Charge for pilotage, Exchequer fees, &c., 40,0001. The nex: vote was- Foreiga vards, salaries. &c., 52,8021. 19s. Mir. HU'',E asked whether any person had been sent out to Ber- nuda, to ascertain whether that island was a proper station for hipping ? Sir G.CLERIC replied,that Ar. Jessop had proceeded to Bermu- la, and reported favourably of that place as a station for shippin - .Mr. HIE inquired whether no other person besides op bad been sent olit ? Sir G. CLERK said, that he could rely upon the experience anod ibility of Mlr. Jessop. Mr. BRIGHT thought that it was desirable that Bermuda shoudi is speed'iy as Possible be put in a state of defence. He did not ,now whetner the attention of ministers had been called to aui esta- Aiushnientlo the south of Florida. He thought that Government sught to form an establishment to counterbalance that of the Ameri- *ans in some part of the Baliama Islands. Sir G.COCKBIJURN stated, that Government could not object to 'he Americans forming establishutents where they thought proper in he territory aliluded to ; but it was their (the Government's) duty to ceep an eye upon them.- The -vote was thIen agreed to, as were lthe following ones VictuaUing yards, salaries, &c. 72,6691. 12s. AIedical establishinents, salaries, &c. 52,4061. 17s. Ild. Royal itaval college and school of naval architecture, 6.1771.12s.6d. Wages to officers- ship-keepers, and men belonging to vessels in srdinary, 10,217 s. S.d. Victuals to officers, ship-keepers, &c. ba,4211. ils. Hired packets, 4,0001. When the last vote was proposed, lr. HUME asked what packets the were?P Sir (1. CLERK said, that the vote wsas sequired to defray the expenge or the packets appointed to carry tCe foreign mails from FMaliouth. The suits used to be expemided by the post-office, but it was now made an item in the navy estimatei. Air. HU1M, thoutvhn the Post-office ought to have the oontrol of the packets. He could see no reason why the itEeR should be placed in the navy estimates: it Only tended to create confusion. ' h Sir GEO. CLERK said that it was part of the new plan whic ltad recently been adopted, to substitute vessels of war for the packetf, in the event of the breaking out of hostilities, which would pre- vent those delays which frequently occurred daring the last war, when the packets were obliged to wait tor the c?- oy of King's ships, or run the risk, of beitig captured. efl -rel tihogt tohat the hotourable gentleman's proption , so far would only tend to make them the more compiex. Mr. ROBERTSON did hope that the hon. neupber for Aberdeen would not persist in his opposition to rlie plan which in this in- stance had been adopted l y His Majesty's Government. It might be well to remark, that one of the first motions made in the Congress of the United States of America, after their independence had been recognized, was the adoption of a similar kind of service. The pninciple of it was e constant emnployment, witbout any addi- tional expense t'o Ge,eiment, of a number of naval officers, whose services would always be immediately available in time of war. Ir. I1UShE pressed the moatter no further, and the vote was igreedt to. Upon the resolution in respect of the grant of 911,0001. for half. pay to flag officers~, &Ic Mr. CALCRAFTC begged to observe, that he thought the case of midshipmen was a very hard one as to halt-pav. What- ever bad been theit services, or however they might be enti- tied by their skiil annd merit, it was often totally out of the power of the Admiraltv to grant them any promotiOII. Now, it upDeared tohim that it would be but fair and expedient to select a certain number of midshipmnen, on the principle, for example, of lengti of service. At present, very many in this class of officers were obliged to turn their attention to some othLr emp1oinent for subsistemee and thus vere lost, meritorious individuals tnough they might be, to the service for ever. (Hear, hear.) He eoneeWed thar-a eertain roportion might be selected, to whom half pay shoultl be. #1eii (tnd the whole amouDt could be but .mall) as a retaining fee whcn; ever the counstr ml ht reqire their services. Sit GEOROiE CLERK thought the objectvhieh the honour3blM gentleman bad in view well deserved the most serious eona4esta dion; biat it wras sxirrtnded with nany difficulties; and he is riot thln1tce mtode'ugested by the hotourable kentleman tlSe-most eligible for effectingl hls .purpose. The fact was, the Admiralty bad given employment-to altnostall-mldshipmeen whe had lately passed theirexaminations; andpromotions-had been made that included almost all thQse who had passed examination before the year 1814. AIr. CALORAFT was not at all tenacious sbout the mode of carrying such a pl into effect, provided so. important a principle was recognize he 'Admiralty would find no difficalty in obiama ing an annual grant of 6,0001. or 7,0001., which might be a fuflicient fund for the half-pay in question. Sir GEORGE COCKBURPN, rather in his capadity as an ofEier of the royal navy, 'than as a Lord of the Adtmiralty, returned his sincere thanks to the hon. gent. (Mr. Calcratt) for the very great at. ention which beat all times paid to this service; but he wast of courseaware. -that, of itself, the Admiralty couild not carr's into effect the sort of measure proposed. Air. HUME1 beged to ask whether the half-pay officers of tire navy !tood opw in the sarie situatiOn as they did at the end of the American war in this respect-were tbey, permitted to enter the merchant scr*icee? Mlight lieutenants, M: exampreI acept the command of private ships without running the hazard on losing their naval commissions ? Sir 0. COCKBURN replied, that with the leave of the Adrii. #- tv lieutenants might command merchant vessels. The leave of the Xdmiralty was necessary to be previously obtained, becaupe by thedoriginal half.pay regulations,and the rule established irn the reigh of Charles II.. halfpay officers were required to reside at some one or other of the se-pots ; and if they wished to reside abroad, wvqre required to obtain previouslf, a letter of leave fromn tbe Admiralty. The same priricipie was nOt held to atply to captains or superior officers, nor as to lieutenants, even 'wtth respect to the command of smaU pacicet vessels, th e commanders of w hch were paid by the contributions of passeagers-a mode ef remuneration that did n6t appeaistfflciently respectable for offbcers bearing commissions in the roval navy. lMr. HUME\3 snsderstoes that hall pay officers had to give each a fee for his letter of leave. Sir GEORGE CLY1XK.-Yes, on obtaining them. Alr. HUMi E considered this to be a great hardship. In a certain number of years' (he had been enabied to discover) these fees amounted to nearly 19,0001. But since officers in the army obtain_ ed leave to fside abroad without the payment of any fees, why were oicers of t-! navy to be sub'ected to such a tax ? 'l'he f'ollowing resojua2oins were tjieii agireed to:- X13fi,299 l6s. Id., to deh5y the charges of superarnnuations and pensions to officers, their widows anid relatives. ?1500, for bounty to chaplains. "7,000 in aid of the compassionate 11s.. *'pon die vote being moved of 80,001 fo.L defrayine the deficien. cies in the funds of the charity for the relief of `lhe widows and or. phans of commissioned and warrant officers of the -oyal navy, *4ir, flUMlE said, the lionourable and gallant ot,-er opposite had been understood upox a former night to say, that ft,astt7s of thle nary had not bten more generally promoted o,L account of tin'r nop being able to pass their exa%inations. Now he (hMr. Hume) ct*l- sidered this das.s of officers to be a highlv meritorious set Of Stigs0 (Hear.) He found their total number, as it stood in the last list; to be .l;S since which list, 76 of these had been set aside. Feshaps it would be better to retain them for the service of the public, wken their experience alid talents might be needed. There were now left, therefore, 475 masters, '6i0 of whom were at present employed in the merchant service, or subsisting on the very small half-pay allorecZ then. If these mien should be wanted, so small wvas the encourage- mnent held out to them, that it might be a question how far they would be disposed to return to the tcrvice. Theirs appeared a case of considerable hardship. (llear.) Sir (G. COCKKBURN observed, that if lie had been represented to have said what hail just been imuputed to hiim by tie hon. imesn- ber, he could only' say, that if persons would look for information to that source which was constantly, and for the purpose, giving a wrong representation of what fell'from gentlemen in that house, he was not answerable for sucH error. Whrbat he really did say, on a former night, was, that the masters of the navy were a most useful set of mssen. It was then obsered to bim, that original. Iy, every master who chose it. and was judged sufficiently qualified, might rise to the rank of lieutenanit, but that that sort of promotion was now put a stop to. His (Sir George Coe'kburn's) answer was, that masters could still be promoted: and were now occasionally promnoted; and that at one time only, an interval of two years, oc- curring about 20 y'ears since, had this rule been interrupted. That with regard to other petsons rising to be masters, aisd he r-eanl sea- men of course, no restriction was imposed upon their promotion, but their sustaining a very strict examination as to ability. TlIs be stated at the time: and if he was wrongl)' reported, as he generay was, it waas no fault of his. A* r- .1 TUIME had seen no report of the honoumble and gallant of- ficer's speeclh, but such had been his understanding. The house then voted 290,0001. to make good the deficiency in the funds for defraying the charge of out-pensioners to Greenwich Hos- pital. ?107,383 1 IS. Id. for pensions, superannuations, and allowvances,to secretaries, ler'xs, and othlers in naval offices, in I-eu of balf-pay. ?10,000 for ship-building ini the East Indies. ?1l27,500 for defraying the expense of repaisaissni improvemenits. ?N255,000 for the purchase of provisions for trOO'jS and garrisons on foreign stations,and for the convict service, and the value of retous for troops to be embarked on board ships of war and transports7 It per estiimate prepared by the Conmisssionoers of the victualin ?188,300 for the charge for transports. Ailr. flUMIE thought that against the names of individuals wbo were superannuated, the tenn of their service ought to be affixed. Arriongothernames under the charge of 167,0001. he observed that Df T. D. Boswell for instance, with a pension of 5131. a-year. MIlr. H.ITSKJS!ON saw no objection to the ado p on of the honourable member's suggestion. As to Mlr. Boswell, he was 75 'ears old when he was superannuated, and was the brother of the iiographer of Dr. Johnson. 'le wvas a very wvorthy man. After orme furtherremarks by illr. H um E The Ciei`!SMtAN reported progress, and asked leave to sit again; Ul ^ '- 'FINlANZaX' rfls.5 i t5i sM^i-'~' The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER having moved hat the house shouild on Monday resolve itself into a committee on he act respecting the f,ux per cent.. duties, took tee opportunity of ;iving notice, that he should on the same evening submuit the state- nent hemeant to make relative to the finanial state of the country 'hear, hear), as the occaSion wyould be more convenient than woula be furnished in the committee of ways and means. Ilr. Sergeant ()NSLOWV, on the suggestion of Mlr. Calcraft, postponed the commitee on the usury laws until Friday next. AMr. HOBHOUSF moved for the copy of any letter which may have been issued during thelast year by the Board of Taxes to the ieveral surveyors in England, ordering a general survey of houses and taxes.-Ordered. Mr. HE RRIES moved fur the coapy of a Treasury letter and mi- nute of the 10th of Decemnber, 18'23, on the subject of the survey directed by the Commissioners of Taxes, to be made of the sur- charges on the inhabited house tax ; and also for the copy of the letter of the Commissioners of Taxes, dated the 30th of Decenmber, 1821, on the same sabject. Alr. HUSKISSON presented a petition from the tobacco-manu- factirera of Liverpool, praying for a reduction of the duies on tobacco. The petition of several individuais, pravin. for leave to bring in c. bill for making an archway under the bed of the Thames, was re- ferred to a committee. Thie other orders of the day wvere disposed of; and at a quarter past It the house adjourned until Monday next. I,IST OF THE MINORITY Of 10, who voted for Reducine the preposed regular AMilitary Establishment from 73,000 to 63,000 men. Grattan, J. Jshnson, CoL. Palmner, c. F. WII'Sil sI W. Guise. Sir xv. B. ingilby, Sir WV. Wood, Matthew Teller. HObhouse, J. C. Ii,,nek, J. B. Willialis, IV. Hunie, J. LIST OF THE IIMAJORITY Of 38, who voted on the 19th of Febrasry against the production of a list of the number of Catholics appointed to oftice in Ireland, in 26 denartments under Gyovernment, since the passing of the Act in 1793, which opened the door to offices of emolument and ho- nour to all classes of Catholics, except to the partic'slar offices vm.- der that Act enumerated. Astley, Sir J. D. Gilbert, D. G. ommaney. Sir S. Tremayrie, J. ii. ltrogden, J. Harvey, Sir E. IV. Trench. V. WY. Brownlow, tC. 1rhebr. t. Palrterston,LordWallae, Right Bturgh, Sir U. sill. Right Hion. Peeli. Rt. n. I lMo. o.Her` T. Canining, G. Sir G. F. PhWfimor'e, J. WVetherell, C., SO- Cholmeley, Sir M.Ilusvkisovn, RighipChrPsippe, E. llcitor-General Cler, Si CL i-Io. IV Potmsi, P. U. Wynn, Sir WV. IV. Cooper, R. B. terris, 3. c'. tohinson, Right Tellers. Copley, Sir j. 1-lorton, R. W. Hion. F. G.lr. Co,urtenay, T. P. Itnatehbull, Sir E.Ross, C. T)awson,CI. Rt. Denison. W.3. Long, R!ght Hnn.Sandon, visenuriTtGoulbilrn, Right Forbes, Sir c Sir c. Somervnllv, Sir R. Hon:lH. Freensantle,Wv. H. Morlaiid, Sir s. B. M1. LIST OF THE MINORITY Of 11, who voted with Mr. Grattan for the production of a list of the number of Catholics holding offices in Ireland, in 26 de- paTtments. Bro%vne, Dom. Hamilton, Ld. A. Hiume,J. W'ood. M. Cav,end.s,~ Lord iiobhnuse, J. C. Lambp, H-on. Oi. Tellers. H1. F. C. Hthi-llstein,ton. Itne k. J' B. Althorp. vis. En I.A.'.N. A C. ewport, Sir i. Grattan, J. lit 'VF, OF e( IONa.'; PrITnA. Tn T1. 91r .