House Of Commons, Wednesd...
The Times, 1824-02-12T00:00:00

A per-sor [rio, tne bank presented a com-. of all correspondence :.n I:it I:v ta'ken place between the Directors of the B .n}, the first Lord ou tne i'reasury, and the Ghancellor of the Exchcquerj relative to aLdvarces of money rmade by theBank to Government upon cxche, quer biUs, within tbe, last vezr.i-.rdered to be printed. ,Mr. Serzeant ONSLOJW brought in a bill to reperl the usury hIews It *a-s read a iirst time, and ordered to be read a snecond time o: Mortl;a ext. J -r t Alderntaii BRYDGEfS presented thrce petitions, prayirog for thzc rcp,-al c -'hr t;hi * -.'n j iniported into 'the port of London. The peit- tos were irons the wvards of Uridge, Cheap, and Viftry. -Tl:eV W*ere ordered! to be printed. *Mr. 'MABELlhlY moved., that there be laid upon the taNe of rthe-bouc .n account of thq atoSS and net rrvc-c:e of Irelnd, from Lbe 5th of Jar,.ry. 17f1. down to the time of the 13hion. stating the rate of its collection, together wit:. an account of its fiuided and an fa !.: detl dc:;t during t.t: periud, d istinguishinag the cost oF maoage- :.ent, &a , ! .gc.r ihe ansnat ct po :ulation in eacb year, as I<:r as thn Sa2:1 can be ascertainied: and lso the like accounts t"n~ the tune oi the C r.n i~t: dow tO the Year i:'lti, whenl the conso. ihtLtio!, .s t he E::liish a,- l hlsh Exeiequers took place. Ile had ,orun.-aurtte to tYle Ci3anec'lor of the Ek;ehejuer nis intention of utkn.!ng thecse luasti;l5, and het beii ved that the tight hon. 3-eni2tnean had :io o:-jec:ion to the principi-, of themrt, though he lierhips nmight have so::ne donbts as to the fac-litrof predocing thern. For himself, Ihcd ~.hu. tha: th.ri wo5uldz be ujo dif'lcultv if any shoutld arise, he wouldl framle them in suich a shaptc as the right hon. wtentlen'.an -aight think moSt likc'y to obv`ate it. As he was now on his egs. hc wu::. 1 take adv.:ntage of th)e oppnortunlity to .ask- the eight horcurahie entlmcnan whether the balance shect, wottainill; an ahstract o :' the hIiancial ac^ounts Jib the 3 ear. Was ready fbr de- I:very amnotg memibers. It was i .p-etant th;;at it sh1ould be in gc- necal circ,attOn a-.nong tueno betbre thei 23d, when the right hon. 1rnr. hap;oli`cdliT to detadl to the itoo:se his financkil plans for the entsuin.g yrear. The (.fiANi''l.l,OR R' ot thc EXCHEQUER, in reply to the qnt:tion which hati beene put to hin, sakd that t!e balancesheet, al- luded t,s 1h thle hoooatablc mgtt:brr. was naot at presenlt readr~ foe d2istribution. but wouhlti be so some davs before the S3d. With regard to the returns moved for by the honourable gentleman, L2ehad nzo objection to the princt Pl of F-ranting the:; hot as they went bak to so fen:ote al period as 1791, he was afraid that they could niot be drawn up as accurateiy iY might be wished. Mlr. MABERLY reiterated his behet' that thesc returns could2 be msade out without any difficulty. 'T'he returnis wcrc then .oder-d. The (.;I&N'CELLOR o:' the EXCHEQU,IER, in pursuance of an order of :he hotuse. laidl cerTain estimatcs upOn the table.-They tvcrc ordered to be printed. CXolonlel DAV-i Bi gave .oticc. that he shoul1d mlove to- morrow for ctrtaim return:s Teladtve to th e dutie, of customs and excise. lie would makc use of this opportnnity to put a Iquestion to the honourable S:e-ret3ry of the Treasurr. Jr Ilight, perhaps, be it the recollection of some members of tbe house, that tw'o years ago lie had submitted ta it some rcsolu- tions. for the purpose of shorting that a considerable saviagmtight be eftected for the public bh a corsolidadion of the revenue f 1eus. to;tia attd excise. Last vear, he had put a qtiestion to the honour. able secretary, for the prtrpose of learnin-g whethecr the Government entcTtained any intention of carrying his plan into effect, and he un. Iderstood the hon. secretary to reptly, tbtat tile plan 'eat then in pro. press. 3i- htad since under:stood, that tip to the present mnoment no improvement had been iade in tihe collection of this part of the re- venule. XNow., as he uinderstooti thee sev-eral hundred thousartd pountds aL year might be savedl, and great inconvenience spared to the mer- chant, by thc plan which he ha; sugeested, he now wished to know wvhether any changes had takenl place in the old systemz or, if any wecre to talke place, tehen they wouhlt he carried into efiet ? . Mr. BIEIRIES thought that the hon. gentlemian bad misun. derstood w hat haod fallen fromn hhn upon a tbniner occ;tsion, He had never said that thne plan of the honl. gentleman w;as in progress. 'lc had only said that the Lords of the Treasuryhad directed their attentionl to ia. le then entered into somre details to eaplaire wPhy the ultimnate consideration ef that plan had been so lonr delayed, and concluded by observing, that he trusted that he shotils be able, before long, to give the hon. getitleman a more satisfactory- answer. Colonel L7AV IES.-" In this session ?" Mr. HE;RRIES replied, that he could inot pretend to fix any exact time, inasmuch as it trould depend on the report of twvo dis-. tince comoudissiona, to *vhom the business had been refersed by tile Lords of the Treasury. Colonel D.AVI1ES then said, that he should bring forwvard an cx., press mo.ion upon this subject. CIRCULATION OF BANK, NOTES. MIr. MAN.NNI^NG addressed the house, but in a tone of voice so lo-w, that much of w hat be said w as very indistisctlv heard -in the gallery. We understood him to say, that he wvas not in -the house on the precedingr day, wvhtl his honoarable friend the member for Peu)rhyn (MIr. Cirentellh had mzoved for a returnt of the total vweekly amount of Bank notes attd Batnk post bills in circulation for the last year. lieshould certainly have oppeosed the nsroion had he been prosentm but he had been prevented ttom being sO, by hav ing to at., tend in another place upon a subject which he considered to be of vital imnportance.. Hecwould nor ask the house toi rescind the order w hich it had yesterday given, though he must be permitted to ques- tion the right of the house to call for such returns at.the present pe- noed, wlteitthe restriction act of 17977 had expired, and ca.sh pay- ments were resumed. UJnder the restriction ace, sucht retuns might be very proper; but he could not see that tie house- bad- any more right to dlemand themn<ow ol the Bank, IihaD they n3d to detniaaii ttheot of any private banking house. Hle should be happy to give the information in questionl to any gentlenian as privateinfomsation; buit he couhld qo consenlt to give it tbexn ta ptthicinformation, osit wvould establish a very imnproper precedent aa. far as related to:tbeR Bank. MAt, GRENFELL miiaintained, that in the present state of the comuntry, tand in the frequent connexmon wthich--existed belwoeen the Govermluent and the Bagnk, rt w.as importa7t' to the house tb knove what were the amounit of the Banst's issues. Could his hon- friend after reancting ont the millions which the house mutually intrarsteel tom tihe Banki, pire:end to assert that it-had no dght -tohbave satis- factorye acourcs ? His hon. friend had alluded -to what bad been fhe case before the passing 4f t7ie testriction act in 1,'97. jiewas aware tha.t at the period tO wtinch-his hon. friend refer-reel- else Bank had n9t bcen accustomed tDoprodacoitsaccounss; *bui he veag of opi. ninn tbtatit wouldbave beeni greatly to te -Interest of-the-public if it had. Imr all p.-obability that- catasttophe would not have taken pleet in 1797, which he, for one, shouid always deplore.. - I-J wrnde .thsdotse vetions nOt frome ny illtwild to aceanti butfe twn ae on..- scientionis desire to disehar-be ens duty.- He-shoutonsee-.tn uprblci -tdnisy ofaputting the questtyn at restrbtpheen his hont:bviendtand hirnself;~ nd he thesefore gave esdtice,tbat he woslt en o8as;iynezt Tnioy~ for a return hf the other papsexs relativo to the Bank, wbich he hiad beenia in he habit of demandm,nfoe several years now past. QUAL1FICAT10iT OF JURORS. . AMr. NWESTE RN then rose to ask leave ro bring in a bill relatinig 'to the qualification of ji.xrors, but spoke in so low a tone of voice that 'very"few of his observations were audible in the galler-y. We un-I dezstcod hinm to saly, that the alteration whichi he bad to Rropose was only of a trifling nature, and perfectly free from objection on the score of principle. It was to introduce into the difFerentcounties of Egadthe annme qualification for jirrors as now existedi in London coporate tow-ns of the empre At p eet no, peso was eligible as a jur-r in the different counties of Englanrd, wh did, not possess a freehold estte in thefti~ to a certain amount;' and the con- sequence wens, that individluals, who, from their rank, fortrite, and intelligence, were psarticularly qualified to fulfil such duities, were excluded, or rather excused, from performting them, because-tbey did not possess the requisite quzintsty of freehold proVerty. The hon. miember r.$hen stat-id the variouis clauses of his bill, and saidI that the meas,ure which he had to propo,se,besides adapt.in~ the respon- sibility of serving on ,juries to the property and respectabiiyo h popuL.tion in a more just zlitlo, would ihclude a trifling alteration as ito the aiie reqird by the existing regulations ; andI hei trusted thiaf it would have tihe effrect of calling forth-an enlightened and extremely eligible clatss of persons to serve on juries who were at present ex- eludted-who were yet very well abl to add to the support andj strength of those laws which had raistd this country to the proud station which we at present held among the nations of the world. The right honotreable secretary had informied the lhouse last even- ing, that the object of the bill whichi it was his intention to introduce was the consolidation of numerous lAws which were now scattered over the statute-book. Buit, in fact, although) in all times, fr-om the Conquest down to th~e present moment, the legislature had turned its attention occasiotially to this subject,there was very, little to complain of as to.the vagueness of the law ; for there was scarcely anly law respectming junies whichi was not comprised in those two acts passe in the 4th and 5tii WVilliamn and Mlairy, and the Ist Oco. II. Cer- tainly, as fl-r as urincipile waIS COncerned, there was nothiing to be found outsidle tl iose two acLs. He wou.ld not detain the hause I longer at pi~csent. but reuerv5 himself for anly discussion whlich miight arise uponl the details of the hill. for the bringing in of which hie now asked the permission of the house. Mr. LESTER secon(led the moetion of Iiis hon. friend with much cordliality. The principle upon which the qualification of jurors had benfed miht ecasdanrh antiquated prejudices of' the *feudal sysiem,. and. was totallv at variance wvithi the present advanced state ofour civilization, because it went to exclude a large body of men who were not only- well quiali fied by education, station, and in- tellect, but were also willing to take their share in the buirdensome duties of that service. Another strong recommendation for the adop- tion of this measutre was, thte prospect of speedily establishing a thiird assize. ThismrfessurL would render the duties ofjuries in the aggregate less onerous with a therd assize,than before thiey- had been with only two. It would remove the only, obstacle which at present imipedled the esta- blisihment of a thirdI assize. Hie did not anticipate aniy diflialtdy upon this last point oni account of the judgesi; for, without adding anv' e-xpense in the way of salary, or a single memiber to thie numiber of the judIges, it was only to 'make a more economical ust of thieir judlicial means-it was only to dispo,e with m-ore prudence of their judicial forces. Thiey had only- to get rid of the unaccouintable re- spet which had prev~ailed for thie numiber friur, as being rhe best: suited fur judlicial decision. Why it should be so, any inuore titan five, th-ee, or one, he could not dliscover. As it was an even ; number, it wouild seem to be le:ss ~uiterl for decision than thiree, whicb,..i it case of differing opinions, must leave a majority. It was clear thatfourjudgs wee no necssar tosit in eachi couirt and, for..I tunaely or te prsentquesion tecuastom upon whichi that numbr pevaledwas y io neaninvriablc. The number lhadhbeen redcedwitin he imeof ega meory frm sc t seen down to tha reucion terecold e onetothepln o laving thre tbr'-e judges whose services wouild be available for the circulit on te third,assize, without proclucitug the least inconvenience to thebui ness of Westminste--hall. Upon) thec question of thie usefutlness of a third assize, there could not be a rloubt remaiiiing. The late pro- ceedings at Hertford, whiere an) atrociousmurder was visited with the penalties of thie law some months before the trial could hlave rollte on bstt for the OCCUrrenc-e of the new assize, was clear evidence of tht usefulness of it. Great imiuortance w4as given to thie proposition of his honourable friend, by die establishmenit of the thiird assize, to whichi he considered.it ass miost suire anti safe stepping-stone. Mr. J. M ABE RLY could not but contemnplate griut inconveni- ence in the intruductionl of twvo bills at tite sante tiune, otto fromt thie honourabI e nietber for Essex, and one frorni ite right lhonourable Homie Secretars-, upon the sante subject: tor. oinly let the hiouse con- -.ider what would be the relative situation of the two) bills. That wlhich was now about to be proposedI to the hiouse by the hliotourable member for E-sex would, in all probability-, mieet wisti little or no objection, and would perhiaps speedily obtain the royal assent. Then wotuld rome the hill of the righit honour'able secretary, which, he had informed the house, was to consolidatte all the exis3ting laws respecting juries. Bv that tiune there woiuld be one law too much, and the~ urinciplc utuon wrhich the right honour- ble secretary propose-d to proc'eed would'be directly violatedI by thir mnere existenlce of thjis 'One hutw. .'t1r. W%ESTERN' (as we understood) undertook that no inconve- nience, like that which hiad been anticipated by liis honourable friend, should arise from the introductioni andi progress Of lila bill. Mr.LJOCK HART would not oppose tie introduction of the bill. It was a measure which requiredI great deliberation, and it was import- ant that tile houseshouluhlbear the observautionsof all thentembers uipon it. The remarks of an bun. netimber upon the general compositioli of julries were such. that he could not yield ui, entire concuirrenice to them. Hfe could not agree that rthe old'principle of juries was founded in prejudice, or that it was nierely, an error of' the feudal sys;tem wyhich conifined the selection of zpcial juries to the class of fre'ehold- ers. Ife rather thouight that their ancestors liad acted frons a just and proper sense of the subj-ect. Experience had shown that the view which had been taken of the subject in ancient runes was a oauind one, and perhaps the best whi,h couild be dlevimed to pro- tect people froin the encroachments of drspotism-.-to secure the rights of subjects against the power anti itifluaence of the Crown, and the interests of their property, from injustice one aimong an- ther. Th-e name of prejudice coul'd only be ascribeci fairly to that which had produced ev dently, bad consequences ; whereas that sys- te-t hail proved to be efficient above all othiers, in opposing the in- tellect and public v-irtuie of the community to Itbe tyranny of rulers;- it hiad secured to aes the uniy free cotistitution, wonsityiv rX te namre, which existed in the world. Ile did not feel incline'd to oppose the proposition of the honourable gentlemnan, because it seton to place rthe system of juries in, a position nmore fairily propoirtionied t'o rtie property and intelligence ot' Ite people. All lie feared was, that the class by~ which that most invaluable blessing had been. niaintained hithierto, might be too far overlooked. He admitted that tlhey miight not equal in expertness and inigenuity some of the enilighten-_ ed classes which the kingdomn contained. TPheir understanding was of a pecuiliar k-ind--a sort of -tir iniertihv, which was inot qualified to runafter i-he prevailingv follies and fanciesof tlte-tiimes.Theold yeoman weas a sturdyv chiaracter, not easily to be nioved even Ity the threats of power,whien power was niore dangerous titan in these days, as; miany, Instances in history proved, Ilie wished the hiouse to guiard itself' agaitist the escluision of that old and valuable characte~r. Inri ttat poirnt of view he dreaded any alteration which weouldl indace a laxity of attendance by the yeomnen upon the assizeanid sessionis courts; and it wvould be seen'in the course of the discussion upon the tietails, hiow far they ntight expect that result, by an alteratio-n wifich trmade per- sonal property an equal qualificadior,-with real property. in the qrauli- fication of jurors. TherTe was anothier consideration, of vital nimport- ane as to this part of the subject, wvhich wass, that the attendance of the yeomen on the assize courts, to witness the admninistration of .justice, was of trite griiatest service in enlightening thieir minds eupon the subject of thecir just irights, by whiichl meal's they- were enabled to enhance, en returning to their hiomes, the comnion sqtoc-k of' commioti sense, whichi had supported the prosperity and hnappiness of thte country in mimefs past, and contributed greatly to its pre3ent gclory and strength. I dIlr. PEEL had no intention in rising to oppose the bil. ButI tsr,re was one thiing connected with the propositions of thie honour- able MeMber for Essex well worthy of cotisidleration. He allud(ed to the extent of the new qlualificationi. Untdoubtedtly, any alteration ium this essential branch of' the l-aw m-ust be conducted with great cauition. The observations of hiis hon. friend, the mneiber fior Ox- ford, might be carried out to a conclusion whichi was~rather nopos to his avowe(i opinion : for, if by the attendance of this clas`;s of yeomnen upon thie courts iii the country, constitutional knowledge andraionl espctforth intiutinsofthe country were aug. mentd amng he popl, thy wre lkel tbe so much rthe imure incresed y atmittig somanymoreclasses ; and thieref'ore procedingby tat agumet, n cass of proprietors shoult~ be refrre, s n clsson he thr hand shouldi be excluded. The hnourble emberfor ssex proposed, hovwever, to extendI the qualification now fixed inra to personal property, atid he gave-for emanniples the cases of borouhsand corporate towns. lie would advi'se that hoti. -genit. to conside whether it would be safe or expedient to take an v particular amouint of property for the mneasure1 of qualification, attd&if that modie of fixingsP standard wvas not likely toc introduce too large a class, He dioubted if in practice it would not al1so prove to he a very embarrassing rule to go by. The hon. gent. proposjed that the possession of' 1001. of personal property shouldi not onlybe a sufficient qualification, but that the owner should be en- title~d. or, if he pleased, compelled, to servye on the ituries. But would it not be a very delicate point to leave to the subordinate officers of an aihor .borongh to ascertain- whethier or not gacli man clairutinr' or being, cmpelled to serve was worth 1 001.? [dIr. Western 5aa across the table "400.` ]It was no matter-he was arg-uing upon the principle which implied somethiing too inquisitorial in the functions of the suimmoning officers. Surely it wouldl be better -,~o adopt some known test by which qualificationis weore now ascer- tajt,ed-eitber the book of assessments to the piarochiial and couinty rates, Pr those of Parliamentary taxation. Every one rated at 1001. or 20101. luOuse renit, should be eligible. There were othner qunestions of difficult erqlution weliceh wouild meet with proper discussion whien th house shotild come to the details of tire bill -,into which it would be very inconveruient to go during the absenee of the Attorney and Soliciior-Cseneral. The bill mnight be introduced and allowed to progress till the adjustmjent of the committee, and rest there until the arrival of the bIl of whichi he hadi given notice at the same stage ; at wbich uime, to save rthe inconvenience to which allusion. lhad been made by another hion. meinber, if the house thought, fit, the bill of the lion, member for Essex fitight be incorporated witht the other.-Leave given to bring in the bill. Ar. W'vrESTERN moved for returns of the convictions and sen tences passed in the home circuit daring the last year, distinguishing those who had been convicted for the second time, the nature of their offnces, and the liunishments to which they had been semitenced.- iOrdered. TREATMIENT OF CATTLE. Mr. MARTIN moved (pursuant to notice) to amend the act of lest s,.'ssion, against the ill-treatment of cattle. As he anticipated no opposittin, the honourable member said hc should trouble the house very shor3lV in the present stage of the proccedings,. ie saw no reason whr arnimals in general, whether cats, dogs, or moak.es, shonuld not bo protgctesl agaitst barbarous treatment, as well as cows andi'orsea. ("Or rits F" from some hon.imember.) Toratshe did not at present apply llie self. (A laugi.) But there wasa latecase-he believ- edit waswelalknown-in which a fishmionger hadscaldedladogto death. It was a com onQf trick with cooks andbutchers,ifadog strayed into their shop, to rub the animal with some- preparation of vitriol, and ttirn him out in that condition. Only a few weeks since, a set efruffians had amnused t4neeselves with driving some worn-out horses into a fire,; and he llimself remembered a case in which a wretch had,ghstsd a fire under a horse, and actually kept it up until the bowels were burned out. Thehon. niember farther quoted a vatietv of instances in which barbarities of a very horrible description had been perpetrated upon animals; and concluded by stating tksat his object was to make such conduct misdeflarnuour.-Leave was given to bring in the bill. BEAR AITING Mr. MiARTIN moved for leave to bring in a bill to prevent bear- baiting and other cruel practices. Mr. PEEL was filly dis ed to do justice to the hon. geutle. Ina hQm i bhit htc M r..% .W.t . i tho CilJla iple OCth 'ia which hi meditated. The measure, if it was good for any thing,. o0ght to go a great deal farther than the hop. 'gentlermn ptoposed to carry it. If be meant to say that, a3 a principle,, no pain should. (lawfully) be inflicted upon animals, except such as was necessary to. destroy them for the sustenance or convenience of man, then he kAIr. Peel) could understand wh-at was meant. But then the- same principle which was to apply with respect to beart-bait-' ing, ought to preventw cock-fighting, bawking, hunting, partridge. sh oting or angling. . He did not vindicate acts of cruelty, which he was afraid too ofteni were committed ; but he resisted a partial measure-a law for the poor, an, not for the rich. He repeated,that he thought what were called the sports of the field-the preservation of which had repeatedly becn usrged against proposed alterations in our game laws-he professed that he thought every one of those di- versions-es open to tfie cbarge of cruelty as the vulgar pastime at- tacked bfthe hon. gentleman; anpd, 'as regarded the questioii of right, thatmiust abs@lutely be put out of the questioa. We could show very little rigkt when v e inpris..ed a monkey in a cage, and showed him -about the street for a pecuniary consideration-an in- ftiction not fair 8hort of that which was put (in baiting) upon the bear -not to rely upon the suggested probability, that the bear took plea- sure in the operation. (ear, and laughter.) AlJr. IIARTIN felt greatly-disappointed in being opposed by the right honourable secretary; but was convinced that he bad thesense of the kingdomn in his favour, le had received letters upon the sVbject from every 'part of England; and he did reqaest gentlemen who were inclined to oppose him, to witness one of the displays ir question, before they compared tnem with such field sports as shoot- ing and fox-hunting. Besides, he wished to do good as far as his proposal went. If he could not abtlish craelties altogether, he would get rid of as- many of them as he could;and he would first attack those grosser and more atrocious exhibitions which depraved the morals, he sincerely believed, as well as the feelings of' the lower orders. There was another circumstance, too, connected with the right hon. secre- tary's opposition, to wbich lie felt it neessary in a single word to ad- vert. kull-baiting, which the hon. secretary's principle was bound to support-bull-baiting was already an offence by the law. W'as the hon.secretary aware,tltat a clause in the act of Parliament calledl the " Marvlebone Act" prevented the pastinies which he supported from becing carried on in that parish ? Now, did the hon. secretary mean to repeal the clause to which he adverted ? and if he did - not mcan to repeal it, why not extend the regulation ? lie should say nothing of the police question -connceted with the present proposedI measure; but it was notorious that the houses at which the bear- baits. &c.* took place, were kent bv people of the worst character and iteuliented by the greates'vagabonds in town. ir. ROBERtTSON submitted, that sthe hon. gentleman (Ur. Iartin) had all the effec; of his bear-baiting bill in the bill which he had already obtained leave to bring in. Mr. MIARTIN agreed in that suggestion, and, withdrew le motion. LEGACY DUTY. ilr. flUME moved for returns of -various descriptions connected. with the annualamount of the legacy duty in Great Britain and Ireland, and the manner of its collection. The very principle of the legacy dutv, it being a tax upon capital, was open, as it struck him, to decided objcction ; and from its amount, which for the year 1U23 was 1,793.0001., aind between the years 1797 and 1823 no less thean 22,124,0001., it would be seen that it fornied no ight questioti fbr tile consideration of the house. There were other circumstances, however beyond the amount of the legacy tax, andl contiected with tie iode of its collection, which tendedl to make it a grievous and vexatious imiposition. Owing to the mismanagement of' the persons to whom the business of' collection hatl been intrusted, there were cases in which duties had beeti left unclaiumed for fourteen or fit'te years, which executors were now called upon to pay, where legatecs liad died or disappeared. Hle (MIr. Humne) really was of opinion, that the officers of' Govern- maent were bound to take the consequences of their own neglect and omissior; and that the statute of limitations, which barred anv claini after six vears' silence by an itidividual, ouight te extend to debts due, or clainmed by the servauts ef the Crown. Another objection which lie should take to the present iorm of collection, ;was the unnecessary delay which oc- curred between ithe grant of probate, frequently. and' the report of the sala:e to tie Statiip-office. There was nothing, as far as he could discover, that should prevent probates or letters of administration in Fngland, or" inventories,"as they were called, in Scotland, from being reported within 48 hours of the time of their being granted. By the present practice, people were detained in town, verv often to serious inconventieice * and the public further lost the advantage which resultel generally from the carly collection of a tax. MIr. Hlume concluded by moving for papers calculated to show-firt, the annual amount of revenue derivet. to the country from the legacy duty; and secondly, the number of probates, inventories, and letters oftadministration, granted (with notice of unsettled cases) fromn the (late of the act 20th (;eo. 111 up to the present tinie; and further, tbr certain papers connected with arrangements in the collecting oflice. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would not trou- ble the house at present upon the policy of the legacy duty; the question, however, was one of' some importance, because it paid inore titan a million a year to the revenue. WVith respect to the claims for arrears, lie was prepared to admit that there might have been cases of hardship, and that the faults had lain in an imperfect arrangenient (at the beginning) of the law. Since the year 1812, however, sueh measures had been adopted ats ivould pre- vetit the future occurrence oF similar irregularities; and, with re- spect to the cases alrcady in question, the 'I reasury had taken such steps as he hoped wouldf remove all further occasion of complaint. Mr. W1'ARRE menitioned the expedition of proceedings (as re- garded report of probate, &c.) which had been suggested by Mr. Hunie. Thic CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER Paid, that he would look into the practice. Mr. GRATT'AN rose, pursuant to his netice, to move for co- pies of the proceedings before a coroner's jur on an inquest held on the body of' one N'l.lan. It appeared from the inforination whici the hon. gentleman had received, that the unfortunate sufferer was an agent eniployed in the collection of rents, in the baroiiv of ttrath. bane. lie ices reurniig ro his home, when he entere-d a public- house, here hemetactseveral of thetenants from whom he was to receive rent. Two police-officers came afterwards into the same liouse, and cauised a rcot and ah''ay, in the course of which the agent was killed. The honi. gentletnan- said his information went onto state, that an inquest liad been held on the body, ar which two sur. geons attended, wto swore that the death of the deceased was occa- sionedl by an inflamniation of the bowels ; and that upon this evidence, the jury acquitted the police-officer, notwithstanding the dying de- claration of the victim,whosaid that he had been killed by the police- man. The lion, gent. did not know v-:hethuer the police-man was still at large, or wchether any proceedings had 1seen taken against him, lie as,however,inducedtomake the present niotion inthe hopeof' z.alling the attention of the n:ag4istrates to the conduct of this descrip- Lion or men, wh'o in the county where this transaction occurred were notorioust'or the conmissioti of violent and illegal acts. They were often taken up, sometimes removed; but never that he had been able to learn, discharged. 'I'he consequence was, that the pub- lic liad no confidence in the adIministraition of justice, as regarded thieni; and it was with a view to remedy the existing abuses, by the adoption of some ulterior measures, that he tiow moved for copies of the proceedings on the coroner's inquest held on the body of Mlichael M'Can. lr. HUlM E seconded tire motion. Mr' GOULBURN thought, that withiout going into the facts of the case, the lton. gentlentan would agree that it was not at present advisable to adopt such a measure as he had proposed. lie had received nro itifbrnation from Ireland respecting this case; but even supposing tie statement of the honourable gentlen:an to be, as it rrobably w.s, quite correct, stiul lie thouglht that upon general principlrs, his motion ought not to be acceded to. Atl individtial came by his deatlh in a public house, and the Coroner's Jury were of opinion that lie dietI in the course of nature. Suppose the police- officer had actually iittirdered this titan ; he (.Mr. Goulburn) would aAk the honourable gentleman? whether he thought by the publica- tion of the evidence o0i the inquest, he was more likely to obtain justice on thie criminal, or whether he would not rather enable him to shape his def'ence so as to evade it. The honourable gentleman knew very well, that the verdict of the iury did not prcclude the tial of the police officer, and even at this moment he might have been indicted by the family of the deceased, or the local government might have interfered, if they saw any necessity for doing so. He would ask t.he lon. gentleman, knowing, as he did, the state of the partof lrelandnouw alluded to? whether he did not think thatthe pub- lication of the evidence whicn he now sought might not be highly injurious, by giving the accused an opwortiunity oh getting out of the way, or adopting soImeC of the othei expedients which were too frequent in that part of the country fbr eluding the pursuit of jus. tice ? He was as anxious as the honourable gentleman could be to see the police officers punished whenever they acted improperlv, and no less desirouis that they should be proweted in the faithful dis- ciharge of their duty. M\lr. GRATTAN was only desirous to excite a proper attentioti to this subject, and if the right honourable gentleman would pro- mise to take the case under his own care, and adopt such proceed- ings as might be necessary, he woutld gladly lee it in his h.nds, and withdraw his motion. Ur. tGOULBURN *vould not pledge himself to commence a pro- secution in a case of which he knew nothing, but he would make inquiries into it, and what the justice of the affair required should he done. Mr. GRATTANexpressel himself.satisfied, and withdrew his motion. * SUPPLwY. Upotl the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EXCIEQUER, the house resolved itself into a committee of sopply.i The CH A NCELLOR of the EX C EQUER moved that a sum of 33,6o3,0001. should be voted to his Mlajesty for the discharge of outstanding Exchequer bills. Alr. UU.I E wished to know whether it was the intention of the right hon. gentleman ihat these bills should bear the same rate of interest as hitherto, or whether any reduction was to be niade in them. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER-said, thatthe question of iiiterest could not in any wiay apply to the suto in the vote nowv before the committee; and he was not, perhaps, at this mo- ment at liberty to give an answer to the hon. gentleman's question. At no distant periodl he should have to advert to the subject, but he was not willing now to say any thing wlhich might have the effect of exciting erronevtus expectationis. Mcr, flUME thou`g-ht no -ine could be more fitting for the ques- tion he bad put than the present; but if' the right hon. rentemnau felt any delicacy aboutt answering it, he should press it no further. Air. HERRIES ssid the hon. gent. mistook the nature of the vote. It was for replacing the bills voted last year. The interest upon those bills was fixed, ar. could not now be altered. There eould be another vote, at some future tine, fbr the new bills; and then would ocepr the proper opportunity fbr discussing the question of the in. terest.-The vote was then agreed to. T'he CHANCELLOR of-the EXCHEQUER then wioved that a sum of`368,1001. should be granted for paying sff the Exchequer bills voted for public works, fisheries, and building additional churches. dllr. H UAIE asked if this sum was included in the miUion origi- nally granted on account of the new churches ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCtlEQUER said part of it was included in that sum.-Agreed to, On the motion of the CHANCELHLOL of the Exict- vzit5; 1,600,0001. was granted' for paymnent of the intercst of Exchequer bills up to 1824, and 2,000 0001. for- dischargink the -like amount, granted in the supplies for 1823. - Mr. HUAIE expressed hinself not quite satisficd with the ex- -nlanation given to the question he had previously put respecting thle interest, MIr. HERRIES expl ined, that. the bils- to which the hon. gexrt.'s question applied, nad been lssuetd at a cettain rate- of inter- est; they were issuedone year, and discharged the nextt when they cameim ton e paid this year, the amount -of the interest they were to bear would be fixed. The motions were then agreed to, and the house retumned. The report was ordered to be boulight up to-morrow, and leave obtained to s:t ona on P4dqy Sif C. LONG bsoulhtup.-virous army estimate,wbhich were or- dered to lit On the tab e,mad to be printe . A OIr, GOULBURN said he liad the sanction of a noble lord (Lord Althorp.Uto move for the reisdiiding a motion he hArdmade last night, for a rettsrn -df the numberDof acres belonging to the Churie'h iv Ireland, and to.substttnte for it a motion for an account of thie number of acres belon ngto'tlse Church in Ireland, distinguish- ing -such parts as weere glee land, and susch as were uncultivated. T he otsnal motion vvs then rescinded, and the amended one Mlr. GQUEBURN gavenotice of his ntention to move onMon- day next .for leaveo brgin a bill to compel the residence of the clergy of Ireland. Mr HERRIES moved for awrit for the election of a representa- :tive for county of West Meath, in consequence ol"tbe death of G. Rochfort, Esq-T-Ehouse then adjourned. IhOUSE OF 1OMON. D i EDESDAY, FEB. 11.