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And partly it 's related to rhythmic structure in conversation , so , you know , you you t Yeah , this is d also um , people tend to time their their their , um when they come into the conversation based on the overall rhythmic , uh uh , ambient thing.

QMSum_87

Well

QMSum_87

Right.

QMSum_87

So you don't want to be c cross - cutting. And and , just to finish this , that um That I think that there may be an upper bound on how many overlaps you can have , simply from the standpoint of audibility and how loud the other people are who are already in the fray. But I you know , of certain types. Now if it 's just backchannels , people may be doing that with less intention of being heard , just sort of spontaneously doing backchannels , in which case that those might there may be no upper bound on those.

QMSum_87

I I have a feeling that backchannels , which are the vast majority of overlaps in Switchboard , uh , don't play as big a role here , because it 's very unnatural I think , to backchannel if in a multi - audience you know , in a multi - person audience.

QMSum_87

If you can see them , actually. It 's interesting , so if you watch people are going like Right right , like this here ,

QMSum_87

Right.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

but That may not be the case if you couldn't see them.

QMSum_87

But but , it 's sort of odd if one person 's speaking and everybody 's listening , and it 's unusual to have everybody going " uh - huh , uh - huh "

QMSum_87

Actually , I think I 've done it a fair number of times today.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

But.

QMSum_87

There 's a lot of head - nodding , in this

QMSum_87

Um.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Yep , we need to put trackers on it.

QMSum_87

In in the two - person

QMSum_87

Yeah , yeah , yeah.

QMSum_87

He could , he could.

QMSum_87

Plus plus plus the Yeah. So so actually , um That 's in part because the nodding , if you have visual contact , the nodding has the same function , but on the phone , in Switchboard you you that wouldn't work. So so you need to use the backchannel.

QMSum_87

Yeah , you don't have it. Your mike is

QMSum_87

So , in the two - person conversations , when there 's backchannel , is there a great deal of overlap in the speech ?

QMSum_87

That is an earphone , so if you just put it so it 's on your ear.

QMSum_87

or Cuz my impression is sometimes it happens when there 's a pause ,

QMSum_87

Yes.

QMSum_87

There you go.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

E for example.

QMSum_87

Thank you.

QMSum_87

you know , like you you get a lot of backchannel , when somebody 's pausing

QMSum_87

Yes. Right.

QMSum_87

She 's doing that.

QMSum_87

Sorry , what were you saying ?

QMSum_87

It 's hard to do both , huh ? Um no , when when when there 's backchannel , I mean , just I was just listening , and and when there 's two people talking and there 's backchannel it seems like , um the backchannel happens when , you know , the pitch drops and the first person

QMSum_87

Oh.

QMSum_87

and a lot of times , the first person actually stops talking and then there 's a backchannel and then they start up again , and so I 'm wondering about h I just wonder how much overlap there is. Is there a lot ?

QMSum_87

I think there 's a lot of the kind that Jose was talking about , where I mean , this is called " precision timing " in conversation analysis , where they come in overlapping , but at a point where the information is mostly complete. So all you 're missing is some last syllables or something or the last word or some highly predictable words.

QMSum_87

Mmm. Mm - hmm.

QMSum_87

So technically , it 's an overlap.

QMSum_87

But maybe a just a small overlap ?

QMSum_87

But you know , from information flow point of view it 's not an overlap in the predictable information.

QMSum_87

More , yeah.

QMSum_87

It 'd be interesting if we could do prediction.

QMSum_87

I was just thinking more in terms of alignment , alignment overlap.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Language model prediction of overlap , that would be really interesting.

QMSum_87

So so

QMSum_87

Well , that 's exactly , exactly why we wanted to study the precise timing of overlaps ins in uh Switchboard ,

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Right.

QMSum_87

Right.

QMSum_87

say , because there 's a lot of that.

QMSum_87

So so here 's a here 's a first interesting labeling task. Uh , to distinguish between , say , backchannels precision timing Sort of you know , benevolent overlaps , and and and w and and sort of , um I don't know , hostile overlaps , where someone is trying to grab the floor from someone else.

QMSum_87

Mm - hmm. Let 's pick a different word.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Uh , that that might be an interesting , um problem to look at.

QMSum_87

Hostile takeovers.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Yeah. Yeah.

QMSum_87

Well , I mean you could do that. I ju I I think that in this meeting I really had the feeling that wasn't happening , that the hostile hostile type. These were these were benevolent types , as people finishing each other 's sentences , and stuff.

QMSum_87

OK.

QMSum_87

Mm - hmm.

QMSum_87

Um , I could imagine that as there 's a fair number of um cases where , and this is sort of , not really hostile , but sort of competitive , where one person is finishing something and you have , like , two or three people jumping trying to trying to trying to , uh grab the next turn.

QMSum_87

Trying to get the floor.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

And so it 's not against the person who talks first because actually we 're all waiting for that person to finish. But they all want to be next.

QMSum_87

I have a feeling most of these things are that that are not a benevolent kind are are are , uh um are are competitive as opposed to real really really hostile.

QMSum_87

Right.

QMSum_87

I wonder what determines who gets the floor ?

QMSum_87

But.

QMSum_87

Yeah , I agree. I agree.

QMSum_87

I mean

QMSum_87

Well , there are various things , you you have the

QMSum_87

Uh a vote vote in Florida.

QMSum_87

It 's been studied a lot.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Voting for

QMSum_87

Um , o one thing I I wanted to or you can tell a good joke and then everybody 's laughing and you get a chance to g break in.

QMSum_87

Seniority.

QMSum_87

But. But. Um. You know , the other thing I was thinking was that , um these all these interesting questions are , of course , pretty hard to answer with , uh u you know , a small amount of data.

QMSum_87

Ach.

QMSum_87

So , um I wonder if what you 're saying suggests that we should make a conscious attempt to have , um a a fair number of meetings with , uh a smaller number of people. Right ? I mean we most of our meetings are uh , meetings currently with say five , six , seven , eight people Should we really try to have some two - person meetings , or some three - person meetings and re record them just to to to beef up the the statistics on that ?

QMSum_87

That 's a control. Well , it seems like there are two possibilities there , I mean i it seems like if you have just two people it 's not really , y like a meeting , w is not as similar as the rest of the of the sample. It depends on what you 're after , of course , but It seems like that would be more a case of the control condition , compared to , uh an experimental condition , with more than two.

QMSum_87

Mm - hmm.

QMSum_87

Well , Liz was raising the question of of whether i it 's the number there 's a relationship between the number of people and the number of overlaps or type of overlaps there ,

QMSum_87

Mm - hmm.

QMSum_87

and , um If you had two people meeting in this kind of circumstance then you 'd still have the visuals. You wouldn't have that difference also that you have in the say , in Switchboard data. Uh

QMSum_87

Mm - hmm. Yeah , I 'm just thinking that 'd be more like a c control condition.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Mm - hmm.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87

Well , but from the acoustic point of view , it 's all good.

QMSum_87

Is the same.

QMSum_87

Yeah , acoustic is fine , but

QMSum_87

If if the goal were to just look at overlap you would you could serve yourself save yourself a lot of time but not even transcri transcribe the words.

QMSum_87

Well , I was thinking you should be able to do this from the acoustics , on the close - talking mikes ,

QMSum_87

Yep.

QMSum_87

Yeah.

QMSum_87