The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1841-08-27 00:00:00

'hen the noble lord

.t dowp, the gallery was cleared fo

division, and the result was--:;'
For the address
For the amendment
Majority for the amendment

HOUSE OF COMMONS.-

-TUESDAY

Mr. M. PHILIPS moved. the address in answer to her
majesty's speech, and in doing so allUded slightly and in a
congratulatory tone to the foreign policy of the country. tic
then enlarged upon the state of our commercial relations, and
contended that unless we itered our import duties in some
Iv wit'

_wars, and more espeeiah; respect to the duties on
sugar, we could not hope to renew our treaty with the Brazils
under favourable circumstances. In adverting to the corn
laws, he assured the house that upon no previous occasion
within his recollection had there existed such depression and
misery as now prevailed throughout the manufacturing dis-
tricts—depression which might be removed by an alteration
of the corn laws, because those laws affected manufactures
and commerce in more ways than one. They tended to de-
range the currency by leading to the exportation of gold, by
which, as a necessary consequence, trade was completely pa-
ralysed. He was of opinion that the best mode of relieving
the distress of the manufacturing districts would be by
throwing down all obstacles to the extension of the manu-
facturing industry of the country, and in so doing the landed
interests would find that they had conferred upon themselves
the most lasting benefits. The hon. member concluded by
moving the address, which was, as usual, an echo of the
speech.
Mr. DUNDAS shortly seconded the address.
Mr. S. WORTLEY then rose to move an amendment to the
address. Her Majesty's ministers had, he said, appealed to
the country in support of their measures, and he, under the
peculiar circumstances attending his return to that house,
could scarcely be considered presumptuous in thus early pre-
senting himself to their notice, giving as he did by his very
presence in the house an answer on the part of an important
portion of the country to the appeal which had been made to
it by the government. (Cheers.) Concurring, as he did, in
the views of hon. gentlemen on his side of the house, and be-
lieving those views to be in accordance with the feelings of
the great majority, not only of his own constituents, but of
the country at large, he felt himself called upon to ask whe-
ther it was meet that her Majesty's ministers, under the cir-
cumstances in which they were placed, should be entrusted
with the future conduct of the affairs of the country, or whe-
ther they should be permitted to dictate the answer to her
Majesty's speech. The hon. gentleman then went through
a slight history of the whig administration since 1830, when
Lord Grey's government stated that their course would be
one of peace, economy, and retouch In the first, that of pre-
serving the peace of the world, they had most signally failed,
as was evident from the siege of Antwerp down to the war in
Syria. In the second they had also disappointed the hopes
of the country. In the third they had redeemed their pledge,
though even in that respect many people thought they were
actuated by their wishes to keep out the tories rather than by
any wish to keep faith with the people. The hon. gentleman
next adverted to the mode resorted to by the ministry for the
purpose of keeping themselves in power, by the immense
amount of patronage which they had created, and which, if
they had been permitted so to do by the conservatives, they
would have carried to a still greater extent. He then con-
demned the course pursued by the government respecting the
budget, though he admitted there might be something for-
gotten that the noble lord at the head of the government had,
in the other House of Parliament, in reply to a question,
declared that he proposed the fixed duty on corn as a pro-
tection to the agriculturist, while the noble lord opposite
(Lord John Russell) declared, at the same time, in the
House of Commons, that he intended the measures con-
nected with the budget as a blow against all monopolies.
Under all the circumstances surrounding the present govern-
ment, he thought it was the duty of the house to inform her
Majesty, before they assumed the responsibility of entering
upon the business of the nation, that they had not confidence
in her ministers. (Cheers.) The lion. gentleman concluded
by moving, as an amendment, the insertion of words to the
effect that the house begged most humbly to represent to her
Majesty that they had observed that the public expenditure
exceeded the public income, and that they would adopt mea,
sures to remedy the evil ; that they were sensible of the im-
portance of the considerations to which her Majesty had
directed their attention, but that, in deciding upon the course
which they might deem necessary to pursue for the interests
of the country, they felt it their duty to submit to her Ma-
jesty that it was essential, towards obtaining a satisfactory
result to their deliberations, that the ministers of the crown
should possess the confidence of the house and of the coun-
try, and that that confidence was not possessed by her Ma-
jesty's present ministers. (Loud cheers.)
Lord BRUCE said that he represented a large seaport town,
and he had no hesitation in saying that his constituents
adopted to the fullest extent the sentiments embodied in the
amendment just moved by his hon. friend. (Cheers.) Un-
less the decision of the last parliament, as to want of confi-
dence in the present government, were cancelled by the
decision of this parliament, it would not be consistent with
the dignity of the house to canvass any distinct measures
brought forward by ministers placed in such a position. The
noble lord concluded a pointed speech against the govern-
ment by seconding the amendment to the address.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said he was at a loss to understand
the policy of the amendment which had been moved. It
certainly declared a want of confidence in ministers, but it
gave no indication of the policy to which it was intended that
it should lead. The right hon. gentleman defended the
conduct of the government, which had, he said, conducted
the affairs of the country in a spirit of economy, and which
had succeeded in preserving the peace of Europe with
scarcely the slightest interruption. He then entered into a
defence of the necessity of ameliorating our commercial re-
strictions, and quoted a variety of returns relating to the
tricks played in striking the averages of the sales of corn, in
order to show that gamblers and speculators could deal with
them as they liked, and without the slightest reference to
the interests of the landed proprietors ; from which fact he
inferred the expediency of altering the sliding scale, and es-
tablishing a fixed duty, although he only then asked the house
to pledge itself to an early consideration of the question.
He rejoiced that the time had at length arrived when the
house would decide as to the persons and principles by which
the country was to be governed, but he hoped thrt ample time
would be taken to discuss measures of such importance.
The country would not be satisfied if the house decided only
upon the persons without at all deciding, or even indicating,
the principles upon which the Government was to be in future
carried on. Unless something of this kind was disclosed be-
fore the determination of that debate the country would be
disappointed, and their debate would be considered as a mere
party struggle. The right hon. gentleman concluded by ex-
pressing his conviction that the measures proposed by the
present Ministry must ere long be adopted,- and that, by
whatever Ministers they might hereafter be proposed, they
should meet with his support.
Mr. DISRAELI support the amendment, and condemned
the use which had been made by the present Government of
her Majesty's name, and the position in which they had
placed her by their very last step, in bringing a speech from
the throne with no other view than that of laying the basis
of a nascent opposition. _ _ _

Mr. BERNAII said, that the attack upon the whigs came
with a bad grace from the hon. gentleman, who had con-
tested a borough on whig principles, and had taken certifi-
cates in his pocket from Mr. Daniel O'Connell and Mr.
Joseph Hume. Although he must himself stand or fall by
the West India interests, yet he would forego his monopoly,
and could therefore come fairly to the consideration of the
monopoly of the landed proprietors. He wished his brother
monopolists, the landed proprietors, to follow his example,
and accept the 8s fixed duty in time, lest they should find,
ere long, that even that duty of 8s should become " fine by
degrees, and beautifully less. '
Commodore NAPIER eulogised the Government and sup-
ported the address.
Lord POLLINGTON supported the amendment, and said
that he would leave the Ministry in their anticipated defeat
to the consolations which were indulged in by their journals
—that, if no longer a Government, they would be, at all
events a formidable opposition. This he admitted, for they
were like those eastern barbrians who, when defeated by the
Romans, were still formidable from the poisoned weapons
which they flung behind them. _

- -
Mr. ROEBUCK ran over the various sins committed by the
present ministers towards the people who had plated them in
power, and contended that all their errors were attributable
to their having walked too closely in the steps of the con-
servatives. They had lost the confidence of the country,
which they could only hope to regain by a long course of
virtuous conduct in opposition. (Cheers and laughter.) They
had asked the country, "Do you like us ?" And the coun-
try had answered—there was no use in disguising though he
regretted the fact—the country had answered, " We do not."
He wished to be understood, when he said the country, that
he only referred to the constituencies—and by those con-
stituencies the ministry were told that its services were no
longer required. The hon. member then taunted the con-
servatives with the use they had made of the poor-law at the
late elections, and taunted Sir R. Peel with holding a position
which compelled him to be silent, while his party were making
a use of that bill which he knew in his heart was descipable
and base. With respect to economy, he thought that the
charge of want of economy against the ministry was just ; but
then it was to be remembered that their evil genius was on
the other side of the house, for if they proposed anything
savouring of economy they would be sure to have hon. gen-
tlemen on the opposition side of the house stating up, like
the keys of a harpsichord, to talk of the honour of England,
the army, the navy, and the ordnance. (A laugh.)
When the hon. gentleman sat down a cry of " Divide"
arose. and the gallery was ordered to be cleared, but
Mr. MUNTZ presented himself to the house, and said that
although he thought the repeal of the corn-laws would pro-
duce a reduction of wages, yet the people would not be suf-
fered to remain in their present state of starvation, and some-
thing must be done to give increased employment to the
labouring classes.
Mr. EWART then rose, and moved the adjournment of the
debate.

Sir R. PEEL said he acquiesced in the adjournment on the
grmind that the Speaker had been in chair since 12
o'clock that day.

The debate was accordingly adjourned

HOU S WOF LORDS.—WEDNESDAY
Their Lordships did not meet to-day.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—WEDNESDAY.
The adjourned debate on the address was resumed by Mr.
EWART, who said he warmly concurred in its general spirit,
and entered upon.a 'lengthened justification of the principles
of free trade, and of the measures founded upon those prin-
ciples by her Majesty's ministers.
Captain HAMILTON said the real point at issue in that de-
bate was, whether or not the present ministers did or did not
possess the confidence of that house. Any discussion upon
the corn laws was totally foreign to this point, and he would
therefore refrain from entering upon that topic, and confine
himself to the simple declaration that he had no confidence
whatever in her Majesty's present advisers, and should there-
fore support the amendment.

Mr. WARD, in supporting the address, took an opportu-
nity of referring to the period when the ministers were com-
pelled to abandon the appropriation cause, and insisted upon
it that they should then have resigned, as at that
.period no
ministry could be found bold enough to take office upon.the
principles of increased expenditure, a diminution of the Irish
registry, which he presumed would take place if the noble
lord opposite (Lord Stanley) acceded to power, and the main-
tenance of that monstrous grievance, the Irish church. The
honourable gentleman then asserted that the crops were
likely to fall short by one-eighth of the average, which
swaory, would
troentdheer
eaxntent
o exportationftwo omf preciousitilitieons, ino
rd
meertaltson escueps:
ply the deficiency. The consequence of this would be
r ai
in
g tradeem e n t
nonf
dt hme
nenunr
fraeent y , and consequent
curers ; all of which
cwamnouhinladervrbaietsasabmvieocinddteesd if a steady trade in corn existed ; because
in that case the foreign corn would be paid for in manufac-
tures and not in gold. In order to show the check to trade
occasioned by the present system he instanced the case-of a
Sheffield merchant, who had sent a consignment of steel to
America on speculation. It sold well, but he could only ob-
tain payment in flour, of which he took two ship loads. One
of the ships was lost, and as it was insured it was very well
paid for : the other ship load was warehoused for twelve
months, and then sold at a loss of lOs per barrel. This was,
he contended, an unnatural state of things which should no
longer be permitted to exist. The hon. member then ad-
verted to the difficulty the right hon. baronet would have in
governing Ireland, and said he saw every reason to regret
bpye cttbeed
Catholics,t at country.
and
not be
arvi
nhgt
he must necessarily throw him-
selftha
bno
eny
e. cohbnaa
finr
aog
ene
ne of
few ministry
oa
fs
into the arms of the old orange and Protestant party of
ttlrinbaesstreardiess
he
out any measure beneficial to that people. Foreseeing all
that country, who would foil him in every attempt to carry
the dangers likely to accrue from such a state of things, he
must give his vote in favour of the address.