The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1853-07-12 00:00:00

MEETING YESTERDAY.

The monthly and special meeting of the Council (post-
poned from Wednesday last in consequence of the elec-
tion) was held yesterday, the Mayor presiding.
The proceedings, resolutions, and reports of the Finance
Committee comprised—Further consideration of report of
Surveyor as to ventilation of the Council-chamber, post-
poned at the last monthly Council ;—Report of Town-
clerk, according to the instructions of the Council at the
last meeting on the resolutions of the magistrates as to
the parochial business ; and further consideration of the
resolutions of the magistrates as to that business ;—Re-
commendation to purchase freehold property in Erskine-
street,—namely, a house and 1,458 square yards of land,
or thereabouts, for the sum of £1,525 ;—Recommenda-
tion to purchase the leasehold interest of Mr. Jas. Winkop
in a public-house, Hurst-street, for the sum of £6OO ;
Recommendation to grant the reversion of a house in
Oxford-street, for a parsonage-house attached to the
church of St. Stephen, Martyr ;—Recommendation to
increase the salary of Mr. Venn to £5OO per annum.

ENLARGEMENT AND VENTILATION OF THE COUNCIL
CHAMBER-PROPOSED ADMISSION OF THE PUBLIC.

Mr. Howsny, in moving the confirmation of the pro-
ceedings, would do so seriatim. The first was the report
of the surveyor as to the ventilation .of the council
chamber. He thought that the surveyor had advanced
sufficient reasons for making it appear clear to the council
that any enlargement of that room was quite unnecessary,
and that it could not be carried out without very much
interfering with the public business at the Town-hail.
He looked upon it that they were bound to adopt the
'surveyor's report.
The motion having been seconded,
Mr. WOODRUFF said that before the report of the sur-
veyor was adopted, perhaps the council would :.flow the
motion to be taken which he had upon the paper ; and per-
mission having been given, Mr. Woodruff brought forward
the following motion, of which he had given notice:—
"That previously to any arrangement be sanctioned
by the Council for enlarging or ventilating the Council-
chamber, the surveyor be instructed to report whether it
is practicable, and to what extent, to find accommodation
for strangers during the sittings of the Council, their ad-
mission to be regulated by orders from members a
the Council, or ticieets, as the ouncil may here-
after determine." When the question of vetirj-
lating the Council-chamber was last before the
Council, it would be remembered that Mr. Gladstone
seemed to have-sotte plan in his mind for enlarging the
Chamber, sso as to admit strangers. His (Mr. Woodruff's)
impression 'was, that the burgesses had a legal right to be
present during the deliberations of the Council, and that
it was against the spirit of the law to held their sittings
with closed doers. It was ',yell known, that most of the
corporations of England admitted strangers, and he
did not see why Liverpool, being one et the first
corporations in the country, should not adopt
the principle. He knew it would be urged by some
that his suggestion could not be carried cut with conve-
nience. Tie was aware it could not be done in that room,
lotit-he 'contended thatit could easily be'eacted by some
other arrangement. '''F!iey were there assembled as public
trustees, and if they -could by any meats afford conveni-
ence' fee the admission of the public, be hoped they would
not'new refuse to sanction, at least, the principle. tie
believed that the admission of strangers to their delittera-
Came was a question which the puhlic would properly
appreciate, and that a great number would avail them-
selves of it. As far as the principle was concerted, he
repeated that strangers had a right to demand admission
te their debates :; and he thought that if any person 'was to
carne and demand admission at the present tiros,, and if
the question as to his right of -admission was pz:1; to 'the
Town-clerk, he-would hardy take upon himself to -say
that the party -should not be admitted.

. .
The MATov..—I certainly- should, Mr. Woo off.
Mr. WoonuuFF : Well, lie -nevertheless tkought' the
public had a right to he present, and he hoped' ie Cozacil
would now admit the principle. Some gentiernerrmight
argue that es the reporters were allowed to bepresent,
there waa no necessity for admitting the public, but
whilst he admitted that they Tr.porters did justice to the
various rnemb-ers of the Council, and sometimes did more
for them 'than they were entitled to, newspaper reports
were necessarily obliged to-be-condensed, and conseuently
the public were not made- e equainted with all-that took
place. He therefore hoped-that the Council would affirm
the of his motion.
The 11i...Y0u inquired if Woodrzs intended the
motiara as an amendment.

Me. WOODRUFF replied-ir.the affirmave. -be:-.ause, he
remarked, if they adopted-thesurveyor's report; it seemed
to his that his motion wouizl be useless..

M. DOVER thought it bad better be considered as a
distinct motion rather than as an amendment.

Mr. ileaavalr, on the-same side, said Mr:Woodruff had
better allow the surverir's,report to pass, and then his
prorosai might be brought-forward afterwards.
The TnvN.CLERK said it might be necessary to explain
thotthis matter did not,now come before the'Council in
the,ordicary way. it was deferred at the last meeting of
the Council, and if the report was now carried, be was of
opinion that Mr. Weadtuf:'e motion would beltseless.
Mr. Woodruff's motion having been -seconded,

IVIr:P:CTON said he worild suggest to Mr:Woodruff the
propriety of postponing.h:s motion for the present. There
were many considerations involved in it. It was not
merely the enlargement of that room, -but an inter-
ference-with the various offices throughout the building.
The .-rp-,estion was whelker it would not, be better
to -remove the Council Chamber from • that building
altogether. (Hear, hear.' Very shortly .st. George's-
hen -would be completed, where there vrou'A be a fine
roman. and where every accommodation could be provided
for:what had been named by Mr. Woodruff. The subject
was one of great imvortance. and he thourht the Cottodl
would-be of opinion tbatit might be toroueht 'forward at a
wtorecomenient time than the present. "Whatever might
be done in reference to Mr. Woodruff's motion, it would
obviously require much consideration, whereas the gees-
Con of ventilating the council chamber wee a pressing
(roe. it seemed to -him •most desirable to-have the sur-
veyor's :plans carried out, and therefore he thought it
-uldl-e much better-that the Council should confirm the
yo:`-s report, End that Mr. Woodruff-should for the
present withdraw his motion.

Mr. Vt'OODRUFF then areed to withdraw the motion
for the present, in t ccordzace with Mr. Picton's sugges-
tion, believing that on the principle involved-in his motion
he had the Council with him.

The-surrevor's report, cct•taining a 13ugges!ion for the
better ,ventilation of the -council chamber,- sys.s then con-
firmed.

GISTRATES.

CLERKS AND TEE 'PAROCHIAL

BUSINESS.

Mr.. ECE.NBY next moved the confirmation of that part
of the Finance Committee's proceedings, recommending
that the salaries of Mr. Wybergh and Mr.(Garnett, the
maestrates' clerks, be increased £lOO a year each, in con-
sidmation of their undertaking to perform.the parochial
business of the parish, since'Mr. Lowncies had resigned
the v&gice el legal adviser.af the.parish.
Mr.. Alderman DOVER strongly opposed the motion,
and moved, as an amendment, that the salary of Mr.
Garnett be increased £loa year, and that of Mr.Wybergh
£5O a Tear. ,The office wklich these gentlemen Lad under-
taken to :fill, now that Mr. Lomules had- resigned, was
simply a sinecure, and these were not the damfor perpe-
tuating sinecures. He wor,id give them an illustration of
the office and- the nature ef the duties to be:performed.
Mr. Lqwndes' salary was Z4OO ,c year, but in addition
to this there wen distinct tharges made whenever there
was any parish business of the slightest consequence to
perform. In proof of this Le might inform the Council
that during the time he (Mr. Dover) occupied the office
of churchwarden and oversetr, he paid ,Mr. Lowndes
the sum of Zi,C3OO, in addition to the fixed salary
of £4OO. (Hear, hear.) The fie was, that the.ordinary
legal business of the parish wet in reality performed by
the cestry-elerk, .and not by the miagistrates'.clerks.
Mr. BRADLEY seconded the amendment.

Mr. Alderman PARKER remarked that, if the off:cc was
e sinecure, as ctated by Mr. Dover, it was inconsistent to
give any advance of salary at all. (Hear, hear, from Mr.
Bighatn.) He E,opect the motion of the ,chairman of the
Finance Committee would be put, in the usual way, znd
then he (Mr. Parker) altoOd have another amendment to
move on it.

-Mr. Avssoc agreed with Mr. Parker that, if the office
was a sinecure, Mr. Dover's amendment was inconsistent.
Besides that, it was invidious in making such a marked
distinction between Mr. Wybergh and Mr. Garnett. Mr.
Avison then denied that there were not legal duties to
perform. The question did not seem to be properly un-
derstood. The fact was that Mr. Lowndes, having re-
sigacd the office of legal adviser to the parish, the magis-
trates had appointed Mr. Wyberz,li and Mr. Garnett to
perform the duties. Theee duties, therefore, they would
have to perform, and would be responsible for them.. He
thought, considering all the circumstances, that, if the
Council was to give them anything,at all, it should be at
least, 41100 a year each.
Mr. BIGHAM denied the arguments put forward by
Mr. Avison, and contended that there ought to be no
advance whatever.
Considerable discussion followed, in which several mem-
bers took part.
Mr. CHARLLS TURNER said the question to him seemed
to be whether they were to have a legal adviser to the
parish or not. flt had been stated that the legal du-
ties of the parish were performed by the vestry clerk,
but the vestry cleric was not a lawyer. Now, Mr,. Lowndes
was a professional map, and all legal documents, connected
with the parish were sent to Mr. Lowndes,, and approved
of by him before the magistrates would act npon them.
The question then was, would they continue to have a
-legal adviser for parish business ? and if so, the next,ques-
tton was, who was to undertake the duties, and do it
economically ? As far as be.could understand, they could
not eompel the magistrates' clerks to perform those dutiee
without a special remumeration, and he did not think
that they could point to any other gentlemen more able
to perform them.
Mr. PKTON thought the question was not yet fairly
before the Council. It seemed to him that this natter
belonged priecipally to the magistrates, and was their
business only. He warned the Council against confirm-
ing the proposed advance to the magistrates' clerks ; for,
if they
beydid pass it, they might depend upon it that it
w
again and again agitated, and after all a person
to perform these duties would be appointed, distinct alto-
gether from the magistrates' clerks and in that case they
would find a difficulty in reducing the salaries of the ma-
gistrates' clerks if the proposed addition was made, His
pppo
areweitdnpf
o.aotr
tope n
a eiroedndi
theseduw cnaesodd,
to
ttttahi
hebaislt a
ne;koaifpnt
fewdereas
ssot
,bnc
oaouton
tus
tigobslft
eel twrti
,cbo,hie:
he
eiCouncil
is).
should appointed
oougt
tt
oo
dignityld b e
of the Council that the borough fund should be swelled
by the payment of such fees as were collected from this
source.

Mr. HoRNBY, in replying, agreed with Mr. Turner,
that the magistrates would not recognise any legal docu-
ment signed by Mr. Hart. It was in the power of the
magistrates to act upon the late arrangement and appoint
a person to succeed Mr. Lowndes, and in that case the
Council might again Lave £4OO a year to pay. The only
remedy for the evil complained of was that suggested by
Mr. Picton, and it was one which had frequently been
before the Finance Committee, and which they thought
of adopting.
After some farther conversation, Mr. DOVER agreed to
withdraw his amendment, as also did Mr. Alderman
FARKgA a further amendrueut7 On the [4:§l2:alacg ginu by