The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1841-01-12 00:00:00

Aaron a member,

and render his assistance to the council,
Is to the conservat

;enerall

SE, in reply to. Mr. fawrenc, owed it to himself
to explain his motives for what might be considered his hasty
retreat from the council. He felt that if he voted upon the
question he should be placed in a very awkward and unplea-
sant situation. If he voted for one gentleman it might be
said that he had voted through fear, in consequence of the
castigation he had got ; if for the other it might be supposed
he voted through pique. He therefore thought it the wisest
way to withdraw from the council, and not vote at all. With
regard to what had been said by Mr. G. H. Lawrence, he
was willing to receive his apology as it was intended. Before
lie (Mr. Case) was elected, he declared to his constituents
that he would not carry his political opinions into that coun-
cil, and that he would not be biased by the votes of any man,
or any set of men. He subsequently made the same declara-
tion in the council, and it was for the council and the public
to judge how far he had carried that determination into effect.
He declared again, that in discussing questions before that
council he would not allow his political opinions to interfere
with such discussions, or tointerfere with his own judgment ;
but that he would give an honest vote upon every question
brought before him. If any measure was brought forward
likely to conduce to the substantial interests of the town,
whoever brought the question forward, or by whatever party
it was supported, he would vote for it. He had intended to
have withdrawn from the committee appointed on Friday
upon the municipal registration question. He now felt it
a duty which he owed to the council to remain where he was ;
but he begged it to be understood, that he did not consider
himself placed on that committee as a political partizan. He
claimed the right of freedom of speech and freedom ofjudg-
ment : he would always exercise the right of private judgment,
and whatever he thought conducive to the interests of the
town, upon that and all other occasions, he should feel it his
duty to support. He hoped, after these remarks, that the
council would pardon the step he had taken in what must be
considered a hasty withdrawal from his seat on Friday.
Mr. ISAAC HOLMES would occupy the attention of the
council but a very few moments. It was stated in the Liver-
pool Journal of Saturday, that he bad said the contest for
Scotland ward had cost the conservatives £7OO. He had said
nothing of the sort. What he had stated was this, that he
had no doubt the payment of taxes in that ward would be
£7OO, but he knew well that it had not cost the conserva-
tives a seventh part of that sum.
The MAYOR said it was gratifying to him that the words
uttered by Mr. G. H. Lawrence during the heat of debate
had been recalled, and that he had in the most honourable
and frank manner expressed his regret for them. It was
equally honourable in Mr. Case to receive the explanation
now given ; and further, he (the Mayor) thought that in
leaving the Council in the =miner he bad, Mr. Case had
pursued the course which he ought. He (the Mayor) would
mention, in connection with the subject which was to be
brought under consideration, that he had received a com-
munication from the secretary to the Paving and Sewerage
Board, requesting that he would read to the council a memo-
rial which they had agreed to at a meeting on the 7th inst.
The Mayor then read the document, which was to the effect,
that the board would oppose any bill for the'erection of
warehouses in the dock quays, in which provision was not
made for the assessment of no property to the parochial rates.
Mr. JOHN HOLMES moved that this memorial be referred
to the Finance Committee.
Mr. EARLE suggested that it would be premature to refer
the memorial at present, as it was possible a committee
would be appointed to consider the whole question.
Mr. GEORGE HoLT said it would be well to remind the
council that the corporation of the dock estate severed,
lighted, and paved tncir own property, and that they were
empowered to do so by act of parliament. If the parish
wished to assess the warehouses which were to be erected,
and to subject them to the sewerage, lighting, paving, and
other rates, he did not think the corporation of the dock
estate would object, because they would be relieved from the
expense, as, of course, the parish would not make an assess-
ment without doing the work.
The Towx CLERK mentioned that on referring to the pro-
ceedings of the council on the dock bill, he found that the
clause relating to the parochial rates was already referred to
the Finance Committee. It was on this clause that the
points which formed the subject of the memorial arose.
On this explanation, the memorial was referred to the Fi-
nance Committee.
Mr. EARLE then rose to move the resolution of which he
had given notice. He said that when the subject of going to
parliament for a new dock bill, which was to include the
building of warehouses, was first mooted, the promoters of
the measure must have been aware that it would meet with
a very decided opposition from no inconsiderable portion of
the inhabitants of this town. He thought, therefore, that it
would have been only prudent in them to have adopted some
conciliatory steps towards their opponents. Conceiving,
however, that they were all-powerful upon the subject, they
thought fit to proceed with the measure ; and the very cir-
cumstances which were predicted, of which they were warned,
and which it required no uncommon sagacity to foresee, took
place, namely, a vast and useless expenditure of money, the
introduction of measures hostile to the interests of the port
by other parties, and to. crown the whole, the loss of the bill.
These results were predicted, and they took place. He
thought, how ever great the faults of gentlemen might be,
they would not much dispute those of the dock committee.
He thought, too, that a man shewed his wisdom by learning
from experience; and he hoped that the lesson which had
been taught to some of his friends in the dock committee
would not be lost upon them. The object of the motion
which he had put on the books was, that some conciliating
measure should be adopted which should prevent the recur-
rence of the evils of last year : and if it should be met in a
spirit of fairness by all parties, and by a determination to
make some amicable arrangements, his grand object would
be accomplished. He had oo wish to say more upon the
subject, than merely to move for the appointment of a com-
mittee, reserving any further remarks he might deem neces-
sary for his reply. He begged to move—
" That the dock bill, as it now stands, be referred to a
special committee, to inquire, consider, and report whether
alterations cannot be made therein to prevent all reasonable
opposition (the Dock Committee not being restrained, in the
meantime, from any measures necessary for the prosecution
of the present bill), and that it be an instruction to the spe-
cial committee to proceed, with all diligence, and report it to
a special council, which the mayor is hereby requested to
call as soon as the report is prepared. And that it be an in-
struction to the Dock Committee, in the meantime, to post-
pone all measures in parliament not absolutely necessary."
Mr. JouN SMITH seconded the motion.
Mr. EVANS expected that when Mr. Earle got up, they
should have had great professions of candour and sincerity
as to his object, but now he had spoken outright like a ware-
house owner ; now, all that " raw-head and bloody-bones"
kind of language, which was usually thrown out, of his (Mr.
Evans') being actuated by inconsideration and rashness, and
also by an undue exercise of power, was found altogether
unnecessary to support his motion. But, no matter what
the council went to parliament for, any dock-bill would be
opposed by the Cheshire people, and ley those who wanted
to obtain exemption from their charges. It was perfectly
well known that a clause in the last bill had very nearly been
carried for exempting the Cheshire people from their rates,
and therefore Mr. Earle had no need whatever to be so hard
upon the committee. It was an unavoidable consequence of
every hereafter attempt to promote any improvement what-
ever in the port of Liverpool—at least by parliamentary
means. Before he went any further into the question, he
should like to put two questions. He wished the mayor and
town-clerk to decide whether the'discussion the council were
apparently going upon, ought to be confined to the expediency
of naming a committee or not ; the next question was, whe-
ther the council was to have any definition of the powers
intended to be conferred upon the proposed committee?
The MAYOR.—Do you wish to have the town-clerk's an-
swer to those questions?
Mr. EVANS replied yes. If the powers of the committee
were defined, it would narrow the question considerably ;
but if they were not, an old aad already well discussed sub-
ject would be re-opened, and they might be detained there
till night. He had, however, no apprehension of a discus-
sion ; for there were either collectively or separately, points
in the case of the dock committee, on which he should be
content to rest the whole question of the expediency, and
also the rectitude of the plans. He desired these two ques-
tions to be answered, because there were two or three points
that in all lilkelihood would arise in the course of the debate,
which he wished to touch upon by anticipation.
The MAYOR said that if Mr. Earle had any special plan to
propose, with reference to the object of the proposed com-
mittee, the present would be a convenient time for him to
explain those objects. To appoint a committee generally
without defining the objects for which that committee were
to be called together was unusual; and probably the council
would expect from Mr. Earle some definite declaration of its
objects.

Mr. EARLE did not know what right the council had to
expect such a declaration from him now, as he had already
stated its objects.
The MAYOR said the council knew, generally speaking.
that the contest was, warehouses or no warehouses upon the
dock quays. (Cries of " No, no." He begged to be allowed
to state the question in his own way. That was the plan,
perhaps with some modification.
Mr. EARLE did not know why there should be so much
fencing in this matter. He was not aware that he made pro-
fessions without being ready to abide by them. He was not
desirous of keeping anything concealed, or of bringing for-
ward measures, as he bad been accused, with any under-
handed view. He would give the council his honour, that
his sole wish was that the question might be settled or com-
promised. He did not pretend to say that warehouses should
not be built at all, nor did he mean to say that Mr. Evans,
in this his favourite project, bad not the welfare of the town
at heart. On the contrary, he believed Mr. Evans to be im-
pelled solely by a desire to promote the interest of the port,
but at the same time he must have the liberty of doubting
the wisdom of the steps he would take for that purpose Not-
withstanding what he (Mr. Evans) had said, he (Mr. Earle)
thought the measure of last year a very bad one, and one
which had brought a great deal of mischief upon the town.
He (Mr. Earle) wished for a committee to be now appointed
to take the whole matter into their consideration, with the
view of bringing about some conciliatory measure which-
should prevent useless litigation as well as expense, and
enable all parties to unite for the good old town. He did
not know that the council had a right, or that The Mayor had
a right, to say that the question was being brought forward
now with a view to quash the warehouse bill altogther.
Mr. YATES said the Mayor had not said so.
Mr. EARLE repeated that no such idea had ever entered
into his mind.

The MAYOR observed that he had merely thrown out to
the council, that Mr. Earle might have some general view or
plan in proposing that it a
committee be appointed, and he
wished him to explain in order to promote a conciliatory
disposition on the part of the council. His (the Mayor's)
impression was, that Mr. Earle bad some distinct place to
propose to forward the settlement of the question, for which
no man in the council had a more sincere desire than he (the
Mayer)_ had.

Mr:MELLoa thought that Mr. Earle, in justice to the
council, was bound frankly to tell them what was the object
of the proposed committee.
Mr. EARLE had already told the council, as plainly as he
could, what the object was. He did not know how to speak
more distinctly than he had. He wished gentlemen to meet
one another in the spirit of amity-upon this question. There
were certain points in the dock bill not agreed upon by one
party, and he conceived that if some modification on these
points could be accomplished by means of the committee, the
bill might go through parliament without expense. That
was his view, and the notice expressed it clearly enough.
Mr. EVANS was about addressing the council, when
Mr. EARLE again rose, and in reply to some remark which
we did not catch, expressed a hope that the council would
say that he had been explicit in explaining what was the
object of the committee. _ _

Mr. EvANs—then proceeded to address the council, which
he did at very considerable length. He said that when he
had risen to put the questions he had proposed, he did not
refer them to Mr. Earle. Mr. Earle 's motion was before
the council in express terms, and he (Mr. Evans) wished the
town-clerk to define whether that motion permitted or not
any discussion. Now Mr. Earle was the last man in the
.council to give the information, because the notice was out
of his hands ; it was before the council in words and in print.
The only motive he (Mr. Evans) bad was, to save time, by
narrowing the question to the consideration of the propriety
or expediency of naming a committee or not naming a com-
mittee ; but if the matter was left without explanation, of
course he must go on. This proposed committee, as he ex-
pected, was to be allowed to take the bill to pieces, and to
make any report of it they pleased. Novi there could be no
question of what must be the real object of all this. Mr.
Earle might not at the moment feet it ; but he (Mr. Evans)
had all along heard out of doors they were preparing to crush
it in the council, and to bring hack those proceedings which,
according to all former practice, had been closed for ever.'
They wished to give a kind of constitutional guard to the,
revocation of this practice, in order to overthrow the WI