The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1836-11-25 00:00:00

TOWN COUNCIL PROCEEDINGS.
. s #• On We.leestlA- las* t w
he Ciaitll met accordiug to adjOittf.t`Pi•
-- -mein; fel- nil' porpusellif discussing a motion brobight forward
by Mr. Councillor Birch, the effect of which was to dispose of
e C.alifratimi Schools, they heviug become mere places of
tarialiktlecatihe, which was what they had previously endea-
• +erred toavoitl. The Irish system of eiltic,ttion.put-sued in them
i 'levier, had the effect oral-lying out Your-fifths of the Protestant
i
s.:. children who hart heretofore.. them, and converting
them into `shoo;., for the educatiou of the children of Roman Ca-
tholics—thus in tking a large portion of toe tultabitants of the
town contribute towards that from which they erived no beneti+,
ai ull which as the prileips m l complaint aga tho old system.
liiik
Cotatitleretle exeitetnt was oi-casi4tied its t e town with re-
gard to Ae. Get otilor Birch's motion ; and Mr. qouticillor.
• frathbo • wrote a tSreular letter to the.meinbers of the Culled!,
• calliAg tunisly ere thee relttien member's tt' it to resist the
motin, not ~ vi Ad this ret:k.ru to' "poaular Humour," atol
deciujill, that, hey iii jeod Fr, "ilie4iThonentr (the Tories)
had only to sago the Atcee. and threain to beat the reformers
,0- at,the rteThetiatt,- triostt euitering toe discussion at once a
pur 1 rty aelpolitical one, rind' by this ruse, and appeal to.
.
tliApoii cal fedi Ags of the Ina iurity of the Coutici!, endeavouring
.+'PreatilaLhat systein.which it as more than doubtful the coin-
ig in set% iand the awakened Meßugs of the p:!',,lic against the
ifs id haves induced them to reject. 'eider these eir-
c„. :it needed no phet to predict the issue. Ou the
appe r ince of OW litulillr; the lie'V. Hugh APNeile felt hint-
self ceded nip ilk reply to some of the stateliteurg_as regarded
the system pt gpi ; anti he arldressed a letterTeuffnug powerful
ekiiit hi t 11,.1111k swgred arguusts, chtitliug himself to the
feasibisity or 0,11 wig! of the Irish system. A coasiderable de-
gree-of eleiteineAt consequently pervaded- the public mind.
e Tie Cou, rout S excessivilyeewded, there being 56 mem-
tierspresent out of the 64. v
• 'e •i 'us t'' ' l'' commencement et the adjourned discussion,
.1..1 yes- sat, hal redipowd sever4oupottnicatious,
4f e Town C k said ha ietter be d' eft of before the
ssionl,l2winenced. •
The M Irit teen r 411 a contipunication frets a itemtfettman of
the ham.. • Coates, irpeetinLthe gensumption of gases and
oth..?i• v.
44
as an mule to pie ehtnicul inautifactories.
-r. , ,tn, nicati was referred to the Improvement Com-
mittee.
The 111.1/21c a' •eived another coniinuoicataiii front a gen-
tle+ (if MEI ne ooT+lnstall, itt,Sir Thomas'lrßuildings, on
ate joe! of
.:ning 'the street,. This was also referred to
4 4,0
t ciao vement I',ll,l!nittee. •
comentale-ation froaia gentleman, named Henderson, with
resspent to a ).ot of grond firm lervatory, was referred to
the, 'itiat44 4 'oturnittee.
T
Tlie•OVV. CLfittK said t according to notice A they might
e
not, to appoint •i o to act as High Colorable, for
pluases of he W Ra at the Alagistra*'s clerks
lir
,1,1 tiAlln.eppei t at vo,rposelor the County Rate, and
as the' ce o of any emoloeirse thillowoultd perhaps
, • to ,put% Tow elk treing aplibiEted.
. . 0 ,er w• eto Mb and le iippoitainetit with conse-
que t en•
44,.. rte's r tne government of the criminal prisoners in the
g. Gaol, anti .which had been submitted to. Lord J. Rus-
sell,. and with very slight alterations approved of, were referred
to,the gaol:committee.
a uni-roits of INK DOCK IiSTO.TE.,
The TOWN-4;1.8RK said that, pursuant to notice, the town
council had now to proceed to the appointment of four auditor,
. tothe dock estate. By the dock act the council had to appoint four
auditors to act vt ith eight other auditors appointed by the rate-
payers. The gentlemen appointed ought nut to be members of
the cetineil. There was no act against it ; hut it would not he
proper, as 0 matter of principle, that the trustees of the docks
sisould audit their two accounts.
Air. Councillor J. N. Woon begged to propose the names of
Lour gentlemen every way qualified for the office, viz., Mr. Ro-
bert., Begot, Mr. Hewson Dutchman, Mr. Henry Sandbach,
and Mr. T. Brockleh tuk.
These names were then put seriatim. -On Mr. Henry Sand-
birch being proposed, -
Mr. Alderman EyKc EVANS, seconded by Mr. Councillor
Maxwell, begged to Move, as an amendment, Mr. Thos. Holt,
of C00114.'11.
Mr. Couticillor BOLTON said it was a very Unimportant office.
All they had to do was to see that they had vouchers for every
payment. '
Mr. Alderman Eva Ni persisted in his motion. Mr. Holt was
an excellent accountant, and it was desirable to have him in
reserve.
Mr. Councillor J-N..Woon then withdrew Mr. Henry Sand-
bach's name, and Mr. Holt was appointed.

bearings, he hoped it would not be ill received if he modified his
forme, resolution. He should.ropose that, instead of the school&
beimidisepsed-of, theybeatentinued under their present sy'stein,
and thataither schools should be built as early as possible, which
should tot conducted on the principles which weie formerly
maintained in the corporation schools of the borough. He was
induced re hope that by this very simple arrangement the object
they haiku view would be attained, and that they Would set at
rest for ever this extremely vexatious questiou. By this art
rangement; those who objected to the Irish system might send
their children to the other schools, and those who objected to.
the use of the. bible might take advantage of the Irish system.
He did not know that any christian sect could but he satisfied
with one or other of these modes. He ought to state that he
hadconsutted the Town-clerk as to the legality of the erection
of other schools, and lie was happy to sac, without entering into
the question, under the sanction of the l'otvn-clerk, if it shoula
be deemel desirable by the council to acciede to this proposition,
there would be no legal difficulty in suet? a measure. (Hear.)
He hoped, and trusted, that this proposition would be fairly and
favourably considered by all parties, and to tout party which
was familiarly styled the liberal party, it seemed to hitn, it could
not be otherwise than agreeable, because it would be the means
of extending to an incalculable degree the blessings of popular
education, which would lead to the- improvement of society anti
the happiness of the 'people. Those gentlemen who tinned a
part of the council, if they were disposed to act in the true spirit
of party might vote against it, because they would bring on the
council great disgrace to vole otherwise, but he was constrained
to think• that they would not act in suet' a mode. He'wai pre-
pared to give the saute credit to them that he claimed for him-
self; but he thought their good sense of what was due to the
Hannan Catho:ics -would likewise bear in mind what was due to
their constituents, lie was extreme') anxious that this ques-
tion should be peaceably disposed of He really cured nothing
about party benefits. They were well enough in their way, but
when placed in competition with the peace, and happiness, and
contentment of society, they were, in his estimation, weak' and
valueless, lie trusted that the excitement which had been kept
up by this question would cease. Political excitements were
quite enough ; but if they promoted these religious dissensions,
toev would keep the town in a continual broil. In conclusion,
he begged to propose, "That it was just and proper that the
benefits of religious instruction should be open to the poor of,
every denomination; and, in order the more effectually to pro-
mote this object, it was expedient to erect additional schools, to
be conducted on the practice of the former corporation schools
of the borough." (Cheers.)
Mr. Councillor J. SMITH bad considered the subject in ail its
• bearings; and conscientiously Believed that the present system,
of religious instruction, introduced into the schools, had been
fairly tried, and had signally failed. (Cries Of " Hear !" and
" No, no !") Gentlemen said 4‘ No. no!" he said " Yes,
yes!" - Convinced that the plan of religious educationintro-
duced might answer extremely well in a Catholic country like
Ireland, but that it would never suit the feelings or taste of a
Protestant people like the English—firmly convinced of this,
he saw no better method that could be pursued to allay the
religious ferment in the public mind, than at once to adopt
the plarT fil Mr. Birch. It must be evideoll to every one,
ifroin the results iratjte late tiainicipalAilection •that the Irish
systeilftwas .a eh 071 uupopulairone. Tfirvoice of the people was
against its introduction. (Cries of ".No.") And they might as
well endeavour to stem the tide of the organ as to stein Go tide,
of public opinion. He would repeacit—t he voice of the t eople
was against them. Its advocates might deny the fact ; but only
let them continue the experiment to the lst of the following
November, and he would venture to predict that they would be
convinced of it in a manner that could nut be mistaken of
the truth of his assertion. Taking all these matters into consi-
dot atiun, he most cordially supported the motion of Mr. Birch,
because he censidered. it the only method by which they could
consign to the doom of oblivion the demon of religious discord;
and the only means to infuse into the minds of contending sects
and parties charitable feelings of harmony and peace.
Mt. Councillor 131.ACKHURN here rose, and ,vas immediately'
followed by Mr. Councillor J. Cropper. Mr. Blackburn then•
said, a Member wished to move an amendment. Out of courtesy
he did not object to concede to his request.
Mr. Councillor J. CHOPPER said Mr. Blackburn might make
it perfectly agreeable. He only did so iu order that Mr. Black-
bunt might have an opportunity of replying to his amendment
in his speech.
Mr. Blackburn then sat down.
Mr. Councillor J. CitoppEa said he did not wish todetain the
couneil long. With the early part of the remarks of Mr. Birch
he entirely concurred ; but he was very sorry to see that he had
changed his views since the last occasion, and proposed another
motion, leaving altogether the one which he had had the plea-
sure of seconding. He conceived that he was acting on prin-
ciple when he proposed that the corporation schools should be
sold, because he conceived that the corporation never could
conduct schools on any principle which would be satisfactory to
the whole population, and on that ground he felt it his duty to
stand forward and support the resolution which he had seconded
un a former occasion. The strongest reason that he had urged
against the sale of the schools was, that it would be a concession
to popular clamour, and give the conservatives a triumph over
them and make the corp Oration a laughingstock. Now, if they
had done wrong, as Bible Christians it would be the strongest
proof of courage to retrace their steps. (Hear.) He thought
he had done wrong when he allowed the introduction of that
system' into the schools.; and, in order to put himself right he
would move, "'That it be au instruction to the Finance Com,-
mittee to sell the schools on a 75 years lease, or for a specified
sum; that they be sold separately, and with the stipulation that
they be continued as schools for the education of the poor."
Mr. Councillor EDWARD CROPPHH, as no one seconded the
motion begged leave to second it. He did so as a matter of
principle. He felt bound to get rid of any system which ex-
cluded the Bible, (Cries of " Oh.") •
Mr. Councillor H. La wnsNcs suggested the propriety of
postponing that amendment until Mr. Birch's motion had been
disposed of. He considered Mr.• Birch's inution as well cal-
culated to still the public ferment and give general satisfaction.
Mr. Councillor Botrost conceived Mr. Blackburn to be in.
possession of the chair, and as such, moved that heproceed.
Mr. Councillor BLACK HORNE would take the liberty of mov-
ing as an amendment, the following ;—" That the conduction
of time schools be continued under the direction of the e luca-
tional committee. appointed for thelrmanagement." He sliou:d
not offer any apolo • for taking the liberty of intiuding himself
again on th on this important subject. The deep in-
terest tie felt in education generally, and the active
part which ad a en i his 1. ,in the management of the cur-
poratitn •tool • at idis
0 • exeu.•. mem the pr.posttion
•had been • ci ~• 0.0 e should re,ervlr
himself, • on it. When a prep.-
lit ion was.. 'ran:. • I. se e schools altogether, he
could not be content ve a silet ote on the question. It
he understood rightly the gargunient of the councillor for Cas-
tle-street ward, he had rtsted his argument chiefly on two
grounds. He trusted, he would not consider it unfair, if he
should allude to what had been published on the question. The
first ground was, !hat these schools were opposed by public
opinion, and the second was, that they were strictly, arterial!,
sectarian schools. He would say a word on either of those sub-
jects. He apprehended by "public, opinion,' they were to un-
derstand, in the present instance—and the councillor for North
Toxteth had adopted his opinion—was meant the opiniou of the
majority. He would grant that this system bad been most
vehemently opposed by a very influential, aud powerful party,
usually denoininated the high church, and tory party. They
were well aware that it would be so. Every one must have
known that that
.party was most strenuously opposed to this
system, from the very first hour of its introduction, with one
brief execetion. He alluded to the period durkg which the
Peel and Weiling,ton administratiou was in office During that
time the opposition to this system ceased for a while, and when
the ministry in power announced, as they did, that they in-
tended to continue the system, and to make larger grants of
money in support' of it, than had been granted in preceding
years, then this violent opposition hail sank down into oblivion.
But the moment ,Sir Robert Peel, and his party were driven
.trout power, it was re-urged, With all the cant about excluding the
Butte, iu order to annoy a patriotic ministry. He was snare,
un moving the resolutiun for the introduction of the Irish sys-
tem into the corporatiou schools, that it would be neeessary to
count the emit, and anticipate the oppotiition they had expe-
rienced. lie hail done so; a,,cl he felt there ens 110tbing in
that opposition which ought, he contended, to have the slightest
influence on their opinions. That opposition was precisely
What they ought to 'expect--neither more nor less. It was tree
indeed, that some few indivainals, who had not usually acted
with that party, along with the infiu..to a they had, had been
drawn over iii them, a few of those who were usually found
among the ranks of the reformers, Hut they were iutluenced
by mistaken noti6ni, an I 'were 'under a delusion; and lie 'eli-
te! tained no doubt of their return to their former opinioue.
(Loud cries of lie .i.) it %%us tviter ad that the majority of the
Peoide were agattist them; ammo tin iippeal hail been made, on
ethiritilr"ll..,,,),;'‘ri, s
"e•ctasion, and On the present °erasion; by the cOun•
1.161.ty Ward to the filets of the late election, At
..: the Lute late eleetion, the refuriiiers had returned a majority;
so that, even taking that as the criterion, there was nu de.
dishy a evidence that the majority were Against them. And
he would take the liberty
•tion was not the only questio,,f usoliViu's'ghitt-hhuitt thhaed schhceonoleng:lie'as--
voured to mike a point against them. Had there been liO effort
in relation to the ;mike question ? Had theme been no attempt
gni IV, mode
c oe
n et hh iee.fi fiscoreect ofii,e,:eht, lei
oieux Theire irir•eisreiltilf:)beLltahlialsite
jbluvolitlity:i.,n mindttielep vrtel repressing
wereinvig-
crime i' (flea..)
, very expedient tacticians. They knew linw to take advantage of
pal ticuiar circumstances in their favour; and they were not
over•niee about the means. (Hear.) While one party were
turning up the whites of their eyes at the sad enormity of the
exclusion of the Bible (ruin the schools, anotherliiatrh tythweekreeelrpaeiris-
together, and coquetting
rqi fuestalliiiiitgi it feastingas,ncdonte mni ng the police, and all fur the love of Con-
servatism, and for the love of the Protestant cause ! (Loud
cries of hear, and laughter.) A coueideratile degree of outcry
raised by the party might be-attributable to this. It was not to
be wondered at, especially when they took into consideration
that the trininph of their own party, at the first municipal elec-
tion, bad lulled Manyeof the wards into a state of unwise and
false security, and aroused the opposite party to the use Of these
means in order to secure 'success. But, after all, where was the
evidence that the public voice was against then ? So far from
that, he would venture to contend that the contrary was the ease.
Wits it not -a fact that a very considerable proportion of the most
influential members of the Church of England supported and
approved of these schools. He maintained that to he the taut
iii opposition to the opinion which his friend the inetnber thr
Castle-street Ward had urged ; and an immense majority of
Dissenters highly appreciated aud valued the importance of the
system, and had continued to do so from the very first moment
of its introduction ; and the Roman Catholic population were
with them as the heart of one man. They hailed the establish-
ment of these selections as an immense benefit to them; and it
was an evidence on the part of England towards Ireland. that
the union of Iceland with Englund was something more then a
name. (Hear.) The noise the party made was uo proof of
their numbers—no 'proof of their strength—(hear)—on the coll-
trHry, violence and vehemence were pretty plait' indications of
their want of power; and whet) they considered that public
meetings against the system were got up for the pin pose, and
the lashing it had received from the pulpit, they might believe
that it was a proof that the opposition to it was limiting hi its
effect and dying away. ( Hear, from Mr. Councillor Egerton
Smith.) lie contended that the first argument adduced had not
time weight that its propounder attached to it ; and so far from
there being any reason to aleilish the system on that ground,
they had every encourage meet to persevere in it. Suppose they
were to change their course, as the mean, of securiug peace,
slid to pot an end to religious discordant' strife in the town, did
flier think that any such t ffect would follow ? DIN any man
imagine that the opposition of the Tory party to the members
of that Council would he changed ? So tar from that being the
case, the very circumstance of cm-wetting to public opinion
would have the effect I,f furnishing them with new and additional
at guntents to oppose them, and taunt them with pusillanimity,
and Wu tip this as a plea of their total want of principle, and
of Omit preference of place to the maintenance of those princi-
ples wh!,•11 they held to be Tight. and on that ground as un-
worthy of public confidence, mind deserving to be excluded from
the council.: And what would they
pleased, ieyegaasieniy it
didpeac
not
purchasedotfoi
low thaint
such a mode? If one party were
every body would be pleased. Would their friends who had
supporteen them lie perfectly satisfied ? Suilt:rwofruoin;
thp,e,nachee the-
only effect would be, that, instead of being attacked bm.those
who here aid trust be their enemies,
tacked by their friends; tend, after being guilty of that weak-
ness, atoll subjerted to other eomplaints, they would find that
they had not conciliated those Avisu would he Let eVel opposed
. .

AIR. PARLOUR'S CLAIN.
The Tod x-cesex said Mr. Parlour's claim remained yet
unsettled, and it sect, fur the cousideration of the council whe-
ther they would refer it to the watch committee, it having for-
wetly had the management of the inquiries which had ended iu
the removal of that officer.
The claim was then referred to the watch committee.
The l'owe-ct.etite said that, according to the municipal act,
an alderman must annually be appointed for each ward to exe-
cute the duties required from aldermen for the respective wards.
It-would be proper, therefore, he understood, that at the next
council meeting the councillors should come prepared to assign
an'alderman for each of the separate wards.
THU CORPORATION scitoui.e.
The Met Yoe said that, all the trifling matters having now
been gone through, he should call upon Mr. Rainsdeu, who had
a petition to present on the subject of the adjourned discussion.
Inn Councillor RAM/MEN said he had a memorial to present
from'the inhabitants of the North Toxteth Ward on the school
question. The sentiments it expressed were the sentiments of
a large and influential body of men professing reform principles.
The memorial purported to be from a public meeting held on
the 22d day of November, and stated that the memorialists, hay-
the heard with regret of the proposal to sell the corporation
-schools, trusted that such a measure would not be adopted, as
-it would reflect great discredit on the council. It stated the'
alerm to be very great in the ward lest the schools should be
given up, as there were no hopes that the surplus funds of the
corporation would provide a substitute.
The councillor for North Toxteth Ward then said he could
say a great deal upon this subject; but, on presenting that me-
morial, he thought it proper to be as brief as possible.
Mr. Councillor PLATT begged to 1• e:se that the memorial
be
-received ; aria, in doing so, he wiiithr,..ay a few words ou the
subject. His mind had been considerably alarmed by the dif-
ferent reports that had come, and also by the letter which he
hail read about the exclusion of the bible Irons the schools. In
order to relieve his mind he had visited these schools ; ;it'd, he
was happy to say, the: so far.es he had gone, the reports were
utterly unfounded. The bible was in use, and had never been
excluded ; and not ouly so, but, in the South Schools, it was
highly gratifying to see .a Protestant clergyman reading and
explaining the bible to the children, an act which redounded to
the credit both of the head and the heart' of that gentleman—
Mr. Aspivall. That gentleman had assured him that he daily
read and explained the bible, to the children. He did not stand
there as an advocate of !he Irish sys:eut of education any more
than he did of an English or Scotch system of-education : but,
ts, his mind, this system appeared to work extremely well, and
he could not imagine anything more applicable.
:Ir. Councillor E. Sill rn said, with regard to that meeting
he relieved there was much agitation in the town on the subject,
and he should move, if it were likely that the schools were to be
dune away with, that their verdict should be delayed a month,
in order that the public might have an opportunity of express-
. jag what their sentiments and feelings eere. They would then
• set that the opinions expressed at the Amphitheatre and other
places by political partisans were not the opinions of the ma-
jority of the inhabitants of the town. ( Hear, hear.)
iii Councillor Bmncis was then called on by the Mayor. He
s.i,i, when.•hrehed addressed the council before on the subject
the schools, he iiiici,entered very fully into-his reasons for be-
hoving, that it was most desirable that they should be disposed
:,r, under certain revelations, providing for their continuance
heesefter as sentineries. Siuce that time he had most anxiously
eed carefully re-considered the subject, and although he did not
in •end, on that occasiou, to propose precisely the seine motion
it, he had done before, yet lie was as firmly persuaded as ever,
ti,,,t. it was Hot only: impolitic and unjust, but that it was atiso-
,eeely iinpessible to persevere in conducting the schools much
• - I tosser exclusively on the present system. He had in this ques-
tinti etidenyoured, by every means in his power, to divest hints
acct of party bias; and he helived he might say with truth, that
he had .net indulged Au any rancorous or political allusions.
'Notwithstanding which. it had been said, that he had been in-
floeured by a dread of incurring unpopularity, and a fear of
offeteling the Conservative party. Against charges so general
•ead e •;tvy as these, it was extremely difficult for any 'sun to
urelertake to deieijd himself. As thr any personal feeling and
desire of populerOtv, the very humble station which be was till-
ing its that emitted would ever prevent him from presuming to
think about such a thing as impularity. It seemed to him to be
ridiculous. And as to env fear of offending the opposite party,
lie could only se‘, that whilst lie was anxious to give a becoming
-Consideranou to the opinions ef others, he did not think he had
ever, in ;hitt eounciletelt aiiv great concein as to what party
migoi please, sir offeutl. But as a eefereuce had beeu
inede to their t otai courage on this question, they would pet -
net him to observe this--that he thought moral courage was
always moat
powerfully exhibited when it urged, as in his case,
the prosetutiou of what- he •tek to be his dimly, am/ opposed
to, the opini.tus. of his own parrs, and the itheina-
t"."S of hie its mind. (ileac, hear, and atm.) He
coral assts •e them that he was net inseusible to this feeling
bet 4 he did feel a fear, and be was out ashamed to mention it—a
fr tr ui encouraging a spirit or os.*tinnte rejection of the ascer-
taiued wishes of the public. ( Hear.) He feared to forfeit the
ehereeter of that ceuecii an the putilic evimation by a pertina-
cions ac:iierence to an acknowledged error, and, moreover, he
feai•ed tit supply the opponents of liberal institutions with a
pro argument against reform, by showing that an ass'etri-
b, Chosen, hacl.found an exclusive system iu opera-•
lien in the seleiele antl.had replaced it by another system still
mitre excTiiiisc; blear, hear, hear.) The most popular
arguments b had heard against the proposition he had intro-
duced into the council consisted merely in the aseeteion that
theesystein adopted in the schools had not yet had a sufficient
trial, and that the opposition to it had origivated and was still
earrie.d on from piety and painted motives ; but that in a very
shoit period the religious scruples of the protestant, would tbs.
appear when the advantages derived from the present system
were seen. He was perfectly willing to give the gentlemen
who used these arguments the utmost credit for sincerity, but
he must ea'; that the arguments themselves were of very little
value. It was very true, indeed, that the cry against the council
had been swelled by the shouts of many who took very little in.
terest in the question, (hear.) but to urge that the great body of
the, people of Liverpool was instigated by a criminal desire of
tinges the sacred mime of religion merely for the purpose of in-
jut ens! the reputation of that council, seemed to him to attribute
to the town, a most iniquitous principle of action, and, at the
same time, to raise that council into au unnatural degree (d. im-
portance. ();fear.) It was his opinion that in the breasts of
a large portion of the people there existed st firm and penile. eat
hostility to the present system. lie did believe that the pro-
testant dissenters generally would not resort to the arc heels.
He was saL:sflial that the idea of amalgemating the different
sects of ielieion, however it might be entertained, would never
be carried into, effect. It was a very common practice with
T11..1 dissenting from the opinions of others to say that the
epiaiees of their adversaries were religious prejudices.. Now
if were lair ie, .reference to one, it was fair as regarded
the a hole; and the advocates of this, system, when they alluded
to e;eir opponents as persons under the influence of religious
eireindices. ouebt not to forget that the same observation might
with eque! justice be applied to themselves. There was no
more pre,ir.eti ::ee friends of the Irish system of education
asserting that. Imre wouli reconcile the protestants to the system
thou these aould have been in the clergy asserting the slime,
%,:tlieregent to opposition to the old system, and that time would
tho catholi,s to the indiscriminate use of the Bible,
(d5%r.) i.e truth was, and there was no use in attempting to
irp's.lttise it, that religious principles and prejudices were early
Pd. and he did not believe when enre them were fixed that
h"Y earthly
Power would remove them. It was a smiles of sa-
tiei
eu.":,,,arlti.er than of pleasure to hint thSt the settlement of
,e,„17 en oppohrtat? been so long postponed; because it hail given
iur rellevine the 4" of consi,:ering of the most desirable Means
Alti.ineh his object
front the difficut:ies 'which tesisted,
been on the former oeewalt,PreeiselY the same with ulna it had
Got, • he,iadaije mind a when he had attempted.fil•rftrinte
nt, sae au.cs,moish wrest it!ieiree of agitation. rent
should
i.ne, as he. ha,d had ninae sr. .1,L!1, ay very different means.
''."6,asts the question in all ire

RE LIVERPOOL STANDARD.

• -
them, and who were their natural enemies, and offend these
who saonsatatea the vary ai,aeays of their strength. ( Hear:) Ile
hail hitherto viewed this arguinerit With relation to numbers as
something based on a solid prieciple; but he did not consider
this ariatneant based On a solid principle at all. lie did not
consider that gentlemen who took seats iu that room, as repte-
sentatives of different constituencies, came there as delegates,
as automatons, as unteasoning representatives of the opinions
rof others. tle contended that this was not a correct theory of
epresentation at all; it was impracticable; &train order to;
carry out this system, they must poll out every member of the-
constituency on every question that would arise. A man who
came there as a aepresentetive,,atele there because the person•
whit chose him tied confidenee in his integrity and judgment;
and he came there authorited and 'entitled to form his own
judgment on every question trot - ~' ,'.'ore him, and to act
en that judgment, (" Hear," Iran Mr. Councillor E. Smith )
'They were not intended to go there in slavish submission to
their constituents, He had already contended,- and'-he trusted
successfully, that the majority were with. thene He entertained
that, opinion most firmly from an inquiry pretty extended as to
the state of public opinion. But, were it otherwise—were it the
fact—and were they assured of it—that the majority of the pet)...
ple of the town were opposed to those schools—he did not see
why they should concede to their abolition. The question was,
were these schools useful, and valuable, and calculated to pro-
mote the best interests of the.cominunity ? And, if they could
satisfy themselves on that paint, their course was clear—their
duty was plain and obvious=-it became their duty nal vote for
their continuance, be the consequences what they might. And
a man was unworthy of a seat in that council-room who was not
prepared to say—" Farewell to office and farewell to power, if
they could not be maintained with consistency to principles
based on justice!" The second argitinent which had been
rested much on was the fact asserted by the councillor fur
Castle-street, but not proved, that the schools were sectarian.
After all, he did not know whether he regarded them as secta-
rian in their very principle and uatirre, or whether he considered
them as having become so itepoint of tact from the state tf feel-.
ing and practice of the town, ' lie should beg to offerau obser-
vation or two op both these positions; and, first, as to the fact.
There. were at-present in the sehoels cennected with thecor-.
peration about 1,310 children, In the whets, of that number he
bet. ved he Might, assume (and he was under.the mark) that
2r r ere protestant and 1 050 Roman Cathelic children—a eery
y y proportion of protestants. Whit they considered the pe-
culiar circumstauces of the case-ahe granted that
gthiee dispropor-
tioniudividu4
seas very
.ctinsiderable--but *heu they considered thea
i
circumstances, it wai not so great-as-might have been expected..j
lie begged natant to their recoltectiou the circumstances whiclrl
existed when'- first these schools had been called Inas existence,d
When' they were fiat opened, they had not a sin
in the schools to direct the in. The individuals who ltatprlvieusly
haul the inairageinent of them gave up their nianagehent a day
or two before they wet e opened; awl they had not th sli assistance. In-addition to this, the indivaluals whaiatd pr est.
lv conciliated the schools ' re ianne7l.• ely inetaliaci oto s
anis Sof a liar- kind a-.
. 'lei rh wh ya .
% ,
a may used. es dr iy• re-
sellitinits t to sAfusrs a ' placards were
stuck about, sigelitM, clergymen, the "people not
them;to go to and' holding-nut- th , .spit., and inducement
D!
that some. would speedily be open .ands, the managemeht of
the teachers, and-iu additionro 0
. , • - - "The pulpit, dna! celesiaitic".
resounded against/them. And, ' addition to all this party op-
position, a most violent exciteasent took place in the immediate
neigh/aunt-hood ofihe it:hue:its—an excitement so violent amongst
the vulgar rabble that it taAs foutel.necessary to call in the aid of
the police before the c ldreu could get safely to the schools;
and it was not till at& vidual tied bean brought before the ma-
gistrates at the police ffice That anything like quietness was
obtained. To say tha under such circumstances us these the
number of 250 children of pratestant parents had attended them was a great triumph of the principles they ' had maintained.
Ile maintained that it was a fair evidence and a decisive.proof
that if they would 'only persevere the time was not far distant
when their popularity would 'far increase and a fair number of
both denominations of christiatis would attend them. So far
was it from the truth, that the establishineut of these schools
was a complete failure, that the very 'opposite was the truth,
and it might be asserted that the effort to put them down and to
excite-prejudice against them had of itself completely failed.
Another question of more importance was the principle —" were
they or not sectarian in their essential character ?" Now, they
would bear iu mind that they were produced in Ireland for the
very purpose of providing au education fok all the peopleaain which both protestant and catholic might, without any compro-
mise of painciple, be educated; and' the question simply was this—" Does that system provide a means of education and a
plan of general instruction in which prottistants and Roman
catholics may join without any compromise?" That was the
fair question; and he maintained that these schools did present
a system iu which protestants and catholics might participate
without the slightest compromise. (" Hear, hear," from Mr. E. Smith.) That was the question. Upon the question,
whether the protestant children had or had not the free use Of
the authorised version of the Bible, such as protestants ought to
require, or not? He would treat this on a simple ground.
Let them first inquire what it was protestants ought to require.
Surely they ought to be satisfied with the peculiar enjoyment of
the scriptures. Surely protestants would not say that they had
a right to make their consciences the standard of all other
men. They would not say, he apprehended, that they were
entitled to demand that every man should think precisely as
they did ?If this were demanded—if this were a matter of
conscience, and if that were called protestantism, then all
compact was at an end. But he considered that this argument
was not worthy of the smallest attention. Then as to the fact
that protestant children bad not the free use of the Bible in
these schools. Facts had been declared that day which render-
ed it unnecessary for him to make any statemenion thissubject.
It was a question of fact of which every man might be satisfied
if he pleased. He would tell them them that the Bible was
used.for one hour of every day in the week—that the schools
were open, and surely protestants ought to be satisfied with
this. It had been made a point against them that, in intro-
ducing the. Bible into these schools, they had departed from the
system they had professed to have adopted, and it had been en-
deavoured to shut them up in a dilemma by stating that they
had not introduced the Bible, or, on the other hand, that they
had not iutroduced the Irish system. He denied both the:se
asmertioes. And, with respect to the system, he would maintain
in opposition that it was perfectly consistent both with the ori-
gine! plan presented to the public by Mr. Stanley, and it was the
aelaai practice et those schools in Ireland which-were now adopt-
ing the system and used the scriptures. Vas there not a very mate-
rial difference between enforcing the use of the Bible and prohibit-
ing it ? Suppose he had a hundred children, and he was to say
to them—"We do not make it a rule—we do not compel you
to read the bible, but we strongly recommend it to you to read;
and, if your parents are willing, facilities are provided fur your
reading it." He did not in that case enforce the reading of the
Bible, but did he forbid it? (Hear,) The line of distinction
was most obvious. This was the distinctiou—the Is ystem
did not prohibit the Bible—it did not-fdebid it, evens to the
catholics it was not prohibited but by the 'opposition of their
parents. And it was a fact, end ha ventured to assert it in de-
fiance of all contradiction, that if, in these cot poration schools,
conducted.un this system, a Roman Catholic were to bring his
child, and say, " I have no objection to my child reading the
authorised version of the, bible," theme would be nothing in-
compatible with the system in that child mixing with the pro-
testant children, and reading the ecriptures with them. They
had a right then to say that the bible was nut. excluded. He
trusted the principle would never be maintained in that council
of forcing the reading of the scriptures. That was not probes
(autism, but persecution. (Hear,) In a letter vrhith had been
addressed to that council, they had been endeavoured to be
placed in a dilemma ; on the one hand, of abandoning the
Irish system, or, ou the other, of not introduciug the bible into
the schools. in that letter, was a letter from Mr. Stanley, to
the Duke of Lienster. There was one passage in it to which
he must- beg leave to draw their attention. Speaking of the
Kildare Place Society, he says :—" The determination to en-
foree, iu all their. schools the reading of the holy scriptures,
without note or comment, Was undoubtedly taken with the purest
motive,* with the wish at once to comet religious with moral
and literary education, and, at the same titne, not to run the
risk of %Sturating the peculiar feelings of iiny seceby catet-he-
tical instruction, or comments which might tend to subjects of
polemical controversy. But it seems to have been overlooked
that the principles of the Roman Catholic' church (to, which,:
any system intended for general diffusion throughout Ireland,
the bulk of, the pupils :utast necessarily, belong) were-totally at
variance with this principle; and that. the indiscriminate reach,'
jug of the holy scripture, without note or comment, by children,
must be peculierly obnoxious to a chtirch which denies, even to
adults, the. right, of unaided private interpretation of the sacred
1-entitle with respect to the articles of religioua belief. Shortly
after its institinisin;althotigh the society prospered and ext.-aided
its oporatioas uniter ahe fostering care or the legislature this
vital defect began to bri'notii•erl. and the liannan,,Catholic clergy
begen to exert themselves- With,iiirergy and success against a
system to which they.wereonatentaeapie opposed, and which
they feared might lead lit its results to preselatisin, even al-
though no sitch ebjecCwerisacnilierniplated by its promoters."
Now, that determinatiunatoatautorce- the reading of the scrip-
tares was the cause of the'llutui-e of the Kildare Place Society.
He saysa" The vital delete otthe Kildare-place Society was
the itidiscrimate reading f the bible in school' hours," , No, the
(..,_
vital detect was the dkerininittien to enforce its reading.. There
was soinethiug apparentlydisingentions in this. There was the
leaving out sif the subsequent argument, which constituted the
very essence or the letterthe deterininetion to enforce, not the
leaving out; and, there ere, it was with a view to put an end to
this state of things thaathe uew system was adopted, and it was
found to be all that . was necessary. A great stress, he was
aware, was laid iuvvitish)h,iosrtaihltieg.egt,:titrferh:lrneyhoeezanfr.e.t)ihi e,,,
el/ termsait
slues"school hours
they were told that the bible was not read in "school hours;"
and, taking the -resolution of thwcouncil for a guide, there was
some plausibility in that. Perhaps it would have been wise if
the council had used such a ternaasa"geuertiattellio-olhenrs"—
sonsething to have conveyed the idea that. there were other
school hours—plain and simple language to convey a plain and
simple idea. But they had not ,expected, dr prepared tor the
subtlety of their opponents, when they saw the effect that had
been produced by the use of the ingenious term of "school
hours-" By the cautious use of that term tt passed for the as-
sertion that the bible was not used at all, and made that impres-
sion en the public mind, and, in consequence of that, it all-
, 6tisli:tivbeteurieleiee,
It
flwsaa:i hsysee
pitipio:
eauostdrepiritugasedndesoluauf.
eddirio,eendigup:iaiiiiininudig, deceivingeitils,e;sr.d,euiervs!:iispe escape,
h, e
becausetpa
ut Idbi eiiriepec.utbwalAihnceillit:
pivHihmeieet.
to them as taught the schools, it served them
tpoios:sy—"Oh I but it is not iu the tanned home." The age of
ut
corn schools,r,compromise
i
not d:ifrareelut:othses; not vet passed away,:and at that rate they must
". What is • ?'' f
11,hili:ilegi;:sfAtjrrur, ocastliet,:l;'yu:a:nsynCts,ttlioefr'sstat":::e :emir! smell nasaus:eweta,e" every
'tante 'unlessit were
(Leta cheers.) II; would trot deatsainugthhteinti'
" school hours."
by such contemptible arguments. Thin' letter concluded in a
style of denunciation.' It must convince eaery gentleman is ho
sat to that council, that the divine judgments were Hut at the
disposal of the writer of it. He supposed, if they were, he for
tale, anthill who sat in that council who de'red to think differ- would fall under the writer's ban.. The subject was too
solemn to be dwelt upon; but no man could read that letter—
without being constrained
tno°aSbehli:iribiteheineitnifiloMt snotlutinidiejlTelegUtielennt—which it breathed—thus to
hurl the thunderbolts of ettinipotentahlviilei:rriig:ennairmioic,ne,brnuuttitsataaeiiinnosstft
ttthhheee
osdtt,is,)
aPptiie'n
sel
traesanrsnad
and
dlrbeeaces°tisil)n:terns:
etneentTnntediorlesa,fttoeetb.dv(u:e?ditalt:(istooun nl fel,: i7t
hli
e tßargehtin. toh
. themesiie sanc-
tioned
ottit.
tthnect
c,
tiiimortnvuentitiyn,
withoutpoint
contended,
principle, these'' e ischoolstohearil in
sectarianclassesr'i
se linfe
teadadthurearethat
any exception.
and let a roan have religion or no religion, he was at per-
that they: were open to
per-
fect freedom to • have his chilaren educated iii these seminaries
was nPt
;ills' egiPrioeu' ground
in the
,sliyhtest degree fit'ren! tt
without departing
a -.tubjerarhat°ifnttir'raat"
rdian knot' on
way,—while it provided religious instruction for all, it terceallit
dsteYhunlecitteeelm.hl aae:—.ngeeotd'hrim.du itia(rn(Li'tdok:u!utdortc,—trhfiheeisitsitgo low. t rid of theirdi ffi cultism, and in this
on none,—it dealt with individuals in such a nianifei; itleit!ir
a valuable education for his children. Had it }melt a fact that
left every man free, and it tendered to hnu, at the salve time,
not one simple. Protestant child had eutered there scheolsnip to
that hour, gtouuded on principle he would stet have given hisnute

fur their discontinuance even in that case; much less uow, when
about a iil.h part ~f the whole uumber were already Protes-
tants, antishe had hopes that they would ittcrease. And tied the
whole children 'been the pour children of Iristi Ittenan Catho-
lics, be must houestly say, that .he neither admired the charm.-
ter nor envied the feelings of that man who could dissent limo
their admission into these schouls,—whe could dissent trout
the assemblage of a Dumber of children together in these schsols,
who were the most deserted, in order to secure to teem habits of
order and of propriety—broug,ht together to fit them for useful-
ness in future life, aud, at the same time, to give them habits of
order, decency, and propriety. To acquire a knowledge of the
Lemke of Genesis, Luke, and the Acts of the Apostles. present.
ed a scene at which indeed bigotry !night frown, but at which
truechristian philanthrophy would gaze with emotions of delight.
He had thee endeavoured to inset the principal objections which
his friend; the member for Castle-street Ward, had raised, on
introducing the motiou which he had now abandoned. Ile must
make ;slew observations on what his esteemed friend, the mem-
ber for South 'l'oxteth Park, had said; he had contended that
education was not a matter in which they could interfere. Now,
'he was very far front agreeing with hitu on this subject. They
were authorised by the municipal act to employ the
surplus
funds for the good of the town, and in improving the condition
of the inhabitants. Was the education of the !war not good';
Was there no advantage in employing a small portion of
this sum for such an object ? (Hear, hear, and loud cheers.)
So far from agreeing with him, he was of opinion that they had
done well and wisely. They had done well in beginning with
the education of the lower ranks; and he treated and hoped that
they should yet realise the object which had been adverted to
some time ago by a councillor for Abercrowby Ward. (Dr.
Carson, on the subject of establishing a university.) 'l'heir
neighbours at Manchester were now directing their attention to
the establishment of such au institution; and with regard to the
schools themselves, he trusted they should never rest satisfied
till they had carried them to the highest point of efficiency.
Why should not Liverpool have her normal schools as well as
Edinburgh? Why should they have it said that the schools
existing here were obliged to send to thee north fur teachers)
There was a great demand for teachers throughout the kingdom,
and it was an object worthy of ambition' to ;stake these schools
capable of sending out future teachers--sources of benefit to all
the country, and spreading abroad information in emery direc-
tion. They had been told that "the intioductiou et this system
was a "feeler,',' in order to• ascertain whether the people of this
Country were ready to adopt a system so favourable to popery.
{A laugh from Mr. E. Smith.) - Now he had had the honour of
introducing this system first to tbe'Education 'Committee; and
he had strenuously advocated it, and he should continue to do
so, and he did not hesitate to say that he gloried in it. He was
perfectly willing to allow that it was a feeler on his part ; and he
hoped and believed that it would extend all o'er the country.
(Hear, from Mr. Councillor E. Smith.) If the system were
ight.iu one part of the country, it could not be morally wrong
n the other ; and there they were bound to consent, where
esa n ' „,,,,,,,r eats to its
,e4lishinents in th
otpt er sited
estautta ex sued it wit esirab inn' . ' tholics and map
contender, that this system
should be extusted, in every part of the empire ; and he trusted
that the future historian would have to.record that that council
had been the first to make theiexperiment. He regarded it as
an human- to have made the experiinent ; mini he trusted it would
succeed. Let them not tell him that there was any danger to
penes:autism from an union of catholics and protestants. Let
them not disgrace protestantisin by tellites him any such thing.
If he thought there was any,danger to protestantism—to the
view,: he entertained—from associating with catholics, he would
instantly go otter himself' to the Roman Catholic faith. That
system which would not bear examining must be wrong. (Loud
cries of " Ilear."i He did not know any thing why he should
be afraid to admit the system to a fair trial. If this should fail,
he should begin to suspect that it was contrary to truth. What-
ever was the opinion on this point, that was not the place to
discuss it; they were not met there for that purpose. But this
he would say, "great is the truth, and it will prevail." The
education of the human mind would render them capable of
exttruining, the subject for themselves. They were aware that
from its first intruductiou to the present period a great majority
of the clergy of Ireland had been strongly and violently opposed
to this system of education. There had been from the first
some honourable exceptions—some men who had seen its value.
They had joined in giving the board their support, and he was
happy to say that their number was on the increase; and there
was some hope that the opposition to it in Ireland would be
greatly abated, if not put an end to. They would remember
that the Rev. Charles Boyden had been sent aver some years
ago as a delegate from an orange society. That distinguished
and talented gentleman had altered his views upon this subject,
and, wilt some slight qualification, had given in his adhesion
to the system. The clergy of the'diocese of Kilmore had re-
cently had a meeting with a view to take into consideration this
subject, and though he believed that that meeting had expressed
itself hostile to it, yet he maintained that it was a circumstance
showing that there was a skaking in the opinions of men on
this subject on the other side of the water. It was not at a time
like this, when the strenuous opponents of the measure were be-
ginning to relax, that that reform council should now concede,
because they were simply charged with the enormous crime of
giving a good education to a few Irish Roman Catholic chil-
dren. (Hear.) The question that they had to decide that day
regarding these schools was one of great importance. The
council stood iu a responsible situation, he contended, with re-
gard to these schools, and the eff"ct to be produced by its
decision would be considerable. He had no doubt their oppo-
nents were anxious's- watching what that decision would be :
that decision would be watched through the length and breadth
of Irelised. Let them look at the state uf that counts) at the pre-
sent moment—let them contemplate its writs of rebellion where
the tithes were got in, and tell him whether the establishment in
that country had any popularity to spare. He weuld ask the mem-
bers of the council at the present moment whether it was wise dud
discreet in them to deprive them of the addition of education in
the schools? They were in a predicament when it was wise to
conciliate—to do ail that laid in their power, as individuals, to
soothe the feelings of irritation, which but too justly existed' in
the minds of the Irish people in relation to this country. It
behoved them to show attention to every mode of conciliating
religious differences, and he couteuded they could do so in this
instance with perfect consistency. Was it not infinitely better
that these schools should remain open, and accessible to the
!nob catholics, that, when the poor peasant, driven from that
land, came accrpss, and set his foot on our shores—goaded, per-
haps, by some tithe process—was it not desirable that there
sl;.tuid exist one institution to which he could go without being
told that lie was a proscribed man, and cast out of society, be-
cause he professed an erroneous faith?—that he could go to
such an institution, instead of'being frowned away as an alien
in language, and religion? He timid advert for a single mo-
ment to the proposal brought forward by his friend. flis ob-
jection to the non-adoption of that course was, that they should
be establishing. strictly sectarian' schools, on the principles for-
merly adopted—schools which would excite strong opposition.
And they wou.d be exclusive schools. His second ground of
objection was, that he gathered from the whole tenour, and
course of the present schools, that they were not sectarian—
that they were open to protestants, and Church of England pro-
fessors might attend them, and obtain all the advantages of
bible reading as effectually as in the schools which formerly
existed. On that, he contended, the whole issue depended, and
he contended that, these schools were strictly neutral, and
freely open to all denominations. Such were some of the views,
and feelings by which he had been actuated in standing forward
as the humble, aud unworthy advocate of these schools. Such
were some of 'the hopes in which he had ventured to indulge
concerning their future usefulness to this great population, aud
to this great country. It depended on the votes of the mem-
bers of the coucil on that day, whether these hopes were to he
realized or not. To the refinmers of that couneil he apptaled
for their vote. On them depended whether these schools should
be continued or not, and he knew they would notillisappoint
him. He knew that they would not, coned by the malignant
howl (If faction, shrink, and cone down from the lofty elevation
ou which they stood. He sat down in the perfect confidence of
their votes—he sat down confident that they would have the
admiring view of the empire turned towards them for the noble
example they had set of philanthropy, and patriotism, and of
enlightened chrietianity. (The honourable member sat down
amidst loud applause, to which Mr. Alderman Stuart tusinly
contributed, by vehement clapping of hands.)
Mr. Councillor RATHBONE said he was quite aware, after this
very brilliant, and, to his mind, povverftil and logical address, of
the disadvantages be laid under in bringing► before them dry
details of facts. lie had put these facts into writing, because he
was shvere they would be criticised—not according to their in-
tention and meaning, but according to verbal criticism. [Mr.
Councillor Rathbo.ne then proceeded, with great rapidity and
some indistinctness, to read his speech. The reading of this
speech wits precisely what the speeker had predicted it. name-
ly, a very "dry" affair. From the rapidity and indistinctness
with which•it was spoken the reporters gave up the attempt of
taking•notes, and the council appeared to pay very little atten-
tion to it. We have, however, copied the "authorised version"
from the second edition of the Telegraph, to which paper we
have reason to believe the manuscript was furnished.] The
Whitten speesh begun, " In seconding the amendment of my
friend' Mr. Blackburn, which I
do most cordially, it is not my
intention to trouble you with a long reply to the circular ad-
dressed to you by the Rey. Hugh M'Netle, as I have only a few
facts to oppose to his long columns of suppositions. The reso-
lution past by the Education Committee on the 15th of June,
was to set apart certain hours "fur the formation of Bible
classes, mmd other religious instruction." On the sth of Jnly
the hours for religious instruction were changed ; but as the re-
solution merely, altered the hours, the nature of the religious
justl4,6on was not again specified. Whether the resolution
passed in Council specified the Bible classes particularly, I do
out remember; if Dot, it was an omission; but the intention
has been clearly stated too often to be misunderstood. So Much
rm. ~,, r roes—our practice I will giye hereafter. The second
esisson le supported with a similar inattention to
the laws of
idence, and refers to what Lord Stanley has written on the
.ICilda-re-strest Society, not choosing to meet the fact of what the
Board themselves have declared to be their intention, and the
provision they have made to carry that intention into effect.
The preface to the selections, and for which a Protestant Arch-
biseop, of piety and leaf uing, is responsible, especially declares
that the object of the selections is to promote the reading of the
Bible. In addition to this, the Board provides hours for reli-
gious instruction, which instruction common candour might
have led a Protestant Clergyman to suppose a Protestant Arch.
bishop would not consider complete without the use of the Bible,
even had it not been declared that the selections had this object
in view. The following are the. rules of the Irish Board on this
subject :
na Head.—Regulations of the schools as to tuition, &c.
Rule I. Such extracts from Scripture as are prepared under
the sanction of the Board, rvav be used, anti are earnestly re-
commended by the Board to be used during those home allotted
to this °ninnies, school system.
2. One (lay in each week (independently of the Sunday) is
to be set apart for the religious instruction of the children, on
which day such parsons or other persons as are approved of by
the parents or guardians of the children, shall have access tn
them fur that purpose, whether those parsons have signed the
original application or not.
3. The managers of schools arc also expected, should the
parents
of any of the children desire it, to afford convenient op-
portunity aim fecility fur the saute purpose, either after or be-
fore the ordinary school business (as the managers way deter-
wine), on ether days of the week.
4. Any arrangement of this description that may be made is
i, be publicly notified in the schools, iu order that those chi's
then, avd those only, ntay be present at the religious instruc-
thin, whose parents and guardians approve of their being so.
5. The reading of the Scriptures, either in the authorised or
Donau version, is reearded 64 a religious exercise, and, as such,
is to be confined to those times which are set apart for religious
instruction- The Caine regulation is also to be observed regard-
ing prayer.
Lord Stanley sneaks of the determination "to enforce the read-
ing of the Serietiires,"
" without note or comment," as the
" vital defect" of the Kildare-street society. The Irish Boxed
think it wiser ''to proinotel."` strongly recommend," and pro-
vide hit
for the
comments. Bible to be read, when the clergy may give
their own Perhaps, with our national jealousy of
compulsioti, particularlein religious concerns, they may Not be
mistakee in their view of the likeliest means of promoting
ticripturai 'education. , The I;(..'kt pitragrripli, like. those before,
is suppoeitionse--"Poused to bets.. sl seated that ceitain means
had f,een found successful " iujirraly implanting religious prin-
ciple" in the children of even corrunt parents. If this is out
"an inward and spiritural change," I'd° not know what is. I
leave without comment Loth what he assutnes as being neglect-
ed In" amuse not inserted in my letter, aud, the cousequepee of

Nov

23 036.;

• .
tharneglect denounced against the schools, as a specimen of h;s . '
caudoer a a chanty. Tile next paragraph ie already ail:towed ; seats, beeause this prieeipie is not reeogni>ed. Whether
lee
tn.otir eweernment (ski our mitiLsters reit scarcely mu/ nlag,
the selections eie not iinsewted or ;Hest as substitutes, but as en- wlegs, they tremble on Mei:. eerier. bee saes this great
m 1",,,,,
couregentents or aids to the reeding of the Bible. As the i which is woitten keine scith feu/JO/fierce in Christian co ;opt
children are all taught by thsir Hem clerg'ymen, apart from the lis nut reeuenived by theM. And theityls the principle a. re,
lest, I de net see how one sit readinw the whole Bible eel' in- ' the Iris", system is the beat graft etheee, yet as the nto"e9,i7eii(
tertere with another set readiug only half. The rev. gentlemen of these seheols is takers out of the publie puree, and de'l'te. t.
asks hew he an
iiistruction is " secured," and seems to tholics, and Proteetante have all conirib sted ; to take e
is
toi
glory in the etntwe that tes cannot secure the clergy doing . Ana for the support of the schools—the principle itself to
their duty to our protestant 'children. 11 this be a subject of gild it is this itself that causes the anarchy and confUsitn! _
re
rejoicing with him, he is t.velenne to it.
tii
me.r,is,,tde,t triltseleto::
justi il,net:et,,oamndm,e7iNalittionnzottrfiutlhr,satadsibcteieny,
gtlivlanoto
lu the South Corpora-
tion Schools we have one drew-beck to his gratulatinus on this
point, for there a clergyman et' the 'Amen of Etigiand does his I council retawny to the shouts u.f. this corporation—Net
..
duty fearlessly and zealously. We are grateful to hint for his 1 situded mue will not pacify the inhabitants of this ttnen;feir
assieratice, we respectfully seek the assistance of others, but if i not conciliate /eon ueiiersally, becaitue you are not ',. "? ,
refused, we will endeavour to train up the protestant children i Me first preiciple to which I have already allude"
Teo
in the way the parents (to Whbni the responsibility legally as 1 cries of " Qeestien."o 1 shall now beg leave to
sub
shall well as rightfully devolves) wish them to go. Ido not wish to 1 the amendment which I have to snake en this , 'e-Lef
undervalue the services of the clergy, but if they stand aloof it 1 "That the Council are most anxious that all the chituttehe
shall be our aim nut to neglect our duty to our protestant 1 poor in this town should enjoy, to the fullest extelt.tt s,
brethren. We may hope, with the blessing of Providence, our mount blessings of education, and they would gladly
this
labour will Out be in vain, and may recollect for our encourage- themselves uf the corporate funds iu furtherance of
.i,
meet, under their opposition, that ever y effort for the spread of and beneficent object, were it possible to do so without v,..'utioi,
the Bible or tl.e education of the poor has been at first opposed I the sacred rights of property, and sapping the foun,°!„„
by the great body of the clergy. Who next charge is where I 1 justice, teeth moral and divine ; but, as guardians of 07,r,pgi
bring the Bible and Bridewell in 'opposition. The rev. die- purse, this Council can never consent even for the att,n
putant prudently states that he is ashamed to argue against of su great a public blessing, to take from funds, the trustv
such a charge. The next is a personal matter, and is easily
teat
of all denonetnations, the means of 'Maintaining ",
settled. The rev. denunciator, claiming more than the infaili- teat of education ethetever, which, in its practical effect.
Cov
bill!). of the catholic church, judges motives, and speaks of my' be partial and exclusive in regard to the benefits it miglt 011
having taught the Church Catechism "as a principle of expe- on any community. They will, therefore, forthwith offer..ciet
diencv, supetseding practieally the principles of conscience arid school-roams, at a reasonable rent, to any individual or s..udoce
truth.'" I never said, as he would make it appear, that 1 who will engage to afford a comparatively gratuitous elude;
taught as truth " what I believed to be ft sehood and idolatry." , tion to the puor children of this town on equally, ;eel!
I never hart the presumption to state tharl thought the worship principles with those which have been reoently cetabil'ectict:
of my l'Onitarian fellow- Christians was idolatry. In these this council iii these school-rooms, with the right of inlat, tb,!
matters I own no human controul, and seek none over others. of a committee appointed by the council to see titiese
The members of the council will remember that I distinctly object of diffusing education amongst the poor is ettla't
stated I had heard the children their catechisms, simply My object, I hupe, has betas clearly understeod. I sari tit_ tet
requiring the words of the book where I did not agree with it, Ceunci/ may set a noble example °fins/ice and uprightness/1w)
and endeavouring to enforce and illustrate it where I did. herfetbeic-men ; and I shall be exceedinaly proud if this gfc.,ii it
My principle is, that the reeponsibilitv rests with parents, as to noble town was the first to announce to the world us reYal
the peculiar religious faith in which their children are to be righteous dews to all our fellow-men,"
elle
educated; that my (hay, as a member of a committee for the The M A Tun inquired if any one seconded Mr. Itawr
mantigenient of schools paid for, and belonging to, all sects, is Ilevevortife resolution ?
or
to see that the wishes of parents ate fulfilled, and, under no
Is,'S) one, however, rare to second it, sad the amendment
pretence whatever, to interfere with those wishes This leaves sequently fell to the ;round.
u sufficiently heavy responsibility, and appears to Inc the line
of conduct most consistent with my views of the weakness and
ceedeno,,
Mr. Councillor LA3SELL begged to offer a few realest:ll,i:
SUpport of the aßlendinent. [Mr. Lassen then pro
frailty of erring men. Air. 51'Netle in his closing paragraph, read a-speech, wine'', like the previous one of Mr. Itatbb° tie
declares his ngness to acknowledge his ertors. if convinced appeared to be little attended to by the council. We el'ewsi
he is wrong. Let me ask why, previous to writing his letter, authentic version" of this also, the manuscript of which„fp
he did not go to the schools and learn for himself what is the sent for insertion in the second edition of the Telegraph.] of
fact respecting the schools, of which he has spoken and preach- had neither read nor heard any aegionents which would in re
ed sO much; aud even now, as far as 1 know, he has only been him to vote that the schools he dispoled of; On the cOnYeawl•l
ito one of them, and not to the South School, where he might he trusted the council wesuld nut abandon Mtn patronage" :,.st
havieenej a ptstor of his own Church and learned from him the cationsln this town esialtsh they had enjoyed for 'nearly t''.lol
realllittW of tie might, pwrdiaps, have satisfied turn- centuries. Since the year '1565 the corporation of Wiverl'isof
self and those friends he so modestly styles "the Protestant ins had contributed to the supporrof a free school until the dent
tilligence" of the town of Liverpool, that their "scriptural pre- the late master, which happened
.in 1805, and then the site -,
dilections" need no longer "array them in hostility" to the the school-house being wanted fur the enlargement of the 01,10
schools. Our present concern is not, however, Gentlemen, tvlint Coat Hospital, the building was demolished. At that time 1,5
is the Irish plan of education, nor whether our schools are real education of the poor had not sp many advocates as it has 050 s
Irish schools, but what is the Liverpool Corporatiori plan of edu- and no steps were taken till 1825 to reptile() that school vrithed
cation? What are its schools ? Shall they be continued ? If other; but owing to the gradual progress of opinion the coupe.
they ale continued, shall they be iin the present plan ? The determined to erect the schools which are now in existet'iit
present plan is to make religious and moral trainiag, not teach- The exclusive constitution of the old council was a suffirte
say, our first object. To give the best general education, both
reason fur the exclusiveness of the schools; but tirnee Re's
intellectual and iiioral, with reference to their future prospects
changed. They have descended to us as truitees for a Plow
in life, till the last of the school-hours each day, and devote that benefit—even those who oppose the system adopted in lc-
last hour partly to peculiar religious instruction under their school
respective ministers; partly to general religious instruction, s concede the principle, that they can no longer be eXe, 0
sive. All systems of education which are not based on religrio
under the teachers of the schools; and thus, to make the schools are decried throughout the land; they are denounced foal' ws
desirable to all,—and they are desirable, and desirable lev, both bench and hoot the pulpit, and he humbly coincided with '''o3
Catholic and protestant. In the South School, to whit sub- general voice. It was to meet this feeling that the Irish sYstcwl
committee I belong, our numbers are in the had been established. It had been stated that it bad pten,
GUls' school.—Protestant.. 70
abortive. He found, however, that in the report of 161:10.
Cath01ic....144—T0ta1..214 tilr. L. here read the first report of the Commissioners for k'''der
Boys' school.—Protestant.. 63
eating the Poor of Ireland.] On this repent, published by °r .
Catholic....lsl—Total..22l of parliament, he was more disposed to rely than upop ale stglor
Is this a Sectarian, or exclusive school e The sub-division of tions of individuals, who, with strong prejudices, looked at
! the Provident District Society in which that school stands con- abuses which cannot but creep ;n rather than to the benefit!
' tains 28 families, visited by the society; of these 15 are Catho- which are sure to be confeered. They were told that their Of
lie, 5 Protestant, 2 mixed, 6 unknown. When we consider the serials would not amalgamate—that was a strong word—tbne'e
large proportion of our poor population, which is Ctseholic, and associated. They.hed in the South School 130 peotestants as
the large provision which is made for Protestant education, we 300 catholics associated together in the perusal of the script°
tnust admit we have our full share of Protestants notwithstand- lessons as furnished by the board. He found in this flee
55 ing the unscrupulous clamour, by which it was sought to deter "nese selections are offered, not as a substitute
herehe 5507
t
them from eutering our schools. They have been called Ca- volume itself, but as an introduction to it, in the op of thieluf
Mai. Schools. The Committee, the masters and mistresses, are leading to a more general and profitable peiusal tit the \Vow! ,
all Protestant, and a considerable proportion of the scholars. God. The passages introduced have been chosen, not as hell;
It is true, that the Catholic children receive instructiwn from of more importance than the rest of the Scriptures, but mired
their own ministers during one hour of the day. Does this con- as appearing to be mast level to the understandiugs of chilurio
stitute them Catholic schools? What is the religious instruc- and Youth at school, and also best fitted to be read under I,:
lion given ? Again, I must speak from the school I know best, directions of teachers not necessarily qualified. and certaiil
First, the Bible is road by all Protestants, who can read every not recognized, as teachers or religion ; no passage has eithues
day in the authorised version, either to the Rev. Mr. Aspinall, been introduced or omitted under the influence of any vatic
to a visitor, or to a teacher. Mr. Aspinall devotes the first hair tar view of Christianity, doctrinal or practical.
hour, to the girls, the second half to the boys, every day. The 'Besides these works on the ordinary' subjects of educatiori
other half hour is devoted to catechism, explanation of the col- we have compiled and printed two numbers of a series Of lee' r
lest, hearing it and the scriptures committed to memory, in- sons from the Holy Scriptures, one from the Old, and the °the,
struction in eastern manners, customs, esc., esc. The younger from the New Testament; and we propose to go on adding. ';
protestants have the same religious instruction in substance, them, until we complete a copious abstract of the narrati!,
varied in manner according to their age. The catholics aro, at parts of the Sacred Volume, interspersed with suitable PP,'
the Caine time, in a different part of the room, receiving from ages from the poetical and didactic parts uf it. We proceeel ea
their ministers instruction in the Douay version of the bible or the undertaking with perfect unanimity, and anticipate, fr°'
catechism, or preparing for hint under their own monitors ; or the general circulation of the work, thetb,
best results.'
likely to
else are joining in the general religious instruction under the Surely it was anticipating an evil which was not ,.
teachers of the school. They rind by singing a hynin, in which happern—that the little children would imbibe evil from rest'
children, teachers, and ministers !trail denominations unite. In ing such lessons as those which had obtained the sanction of thet
cuPtirmation of what I have stated, I beg leave to read a note 1 thrtte Christien denotninations. It had been so often stated ths
have received from the Rev, James Aspinall, in reply to one the 'Bible was read, that it was not necessary now for him to re"
which I addressed to him : -
peat it. A very prejudiced man once asked if any good thil
'Mr DEAR Stin—ln your note of yesterday you ask me to could come out of Nazareth; and he was invited to come an
state to you, first, generally what portions of the scripture the see, and examine the pupils for yourselves as to their Bible
protestant children have read with me at the South Corporation knowledge. He did not mean to say that this was the best Per
Schools, and secondly, to particularize what portion of the saute sible system that might be devised; but it came to them under they have read. day 6y day, during the last week, the sanction of high authority, and Let them have time to proet,.'
• With regard to the first of the in its children have whether it would answer their wishes or not. The applicati°es
gone through with me the gospel- td 0 St. Luke, and for admission to the South School, uutwithstandin all opposiici
that according to St. John, and also e book of the Acts of the Lion, were in the ratio of about twenty Der week,-and it would
Apostles. They are now oecup• reading tine huuk of Gene- soon be filled; and he was confident tbat,auyiulaginary cif'
sis, of which they have neatly the close. ' was mere than counterbatanced by the Positive good which Was
ion, the last week's reading obtained. Were the Cuuucil, be asked, aware what these
' With regard to your seems
has been as follows ;—On IVlonda , the 41st chapter of Geuesis; schools cost ? Let them not then throw away their schools,
on Tuesday the 42d; on Wednesday the 43d; on l'aursday the which were au honour to the town. Grant to their comruittets
44th; on Friday the 45th. It may be as well to add, that on their confidence for another year, and give them a fair chance
itlondity, in addition to the scripture reading, they repeat and of success. If the schools became after all exclusive, alter the
are examined as to their understanding ()fate collect of the pre- plan. He entreated the Council nut to yield to the clamour
vious Sunday. On the other days they also read a portion of which had been raised, but steadily to persevere in the indepen`
the church catechism, or read in a little work entitled 'The dent course they had adopted, and the opposition would grade-
manners and customs of the Jews,' which is of the greatest use ally subside.
in enabling them to understand many passages in the bible, the Mr. WALMSLEY said, after havingtaken mach personal inter-
whole point and force of which depend on a thorough eumpre- est in the management of these schools, I ate rout eoutent, when
pension of these subjects.
they are concerned, to give a silent vote, especially as consider
'Of course, the Scripture reading with me, to which I have the result of your deliberations on the subject this (lay tube of the
referred above, is entirely out of our authorised versien of the
of the
Bible. I would also have it understood, that when I tai utmost importance to the rising generation. Before coining t°
talk any cio. may be well to advert to e inciple it •
children reading such and such portions of Scripture, Ido not wiled'onc thelus Counncilit (with th the
e exception of Seven of its membersh);
limit the phrase to mere reading. I intend it to signify that it is a few months ago, came to the unanimous determination 01
explained to them as they go on, while they are examined as to throwing open the Corporation Schools for the education of the
the proficiency which they have made, and required to compare children of the poorer classes, and to bear in mind the injury
one passage with another, and to acquaint themselves must that would be inflicted on so great a number of our fellow-crea-
thoronghly with its contents, historical, doctrinal, and moral. tures, by again per their portals to be closed Against par'
It may not perhaps be for me to say so; but Ido hope and think Ocular sects. If I rightly understood Your wishes, and- Ibe
I perceive in the children a manifest and decided improvement they were in accordance with tny own, these sehoots being public
in their acquaintance with and understanding of the scriptures; property, were to be applied in the manner beet calculated to
so much so, indeed, that I cannot help fancying that it would conduce to the genernl good ; to the purpose of giving those
amply satisfy even those who are now the loudest in their vppo- who were otherwise unable to obtain theta (withonedistinctiols
sition to the schools, could they happily he induced to visit them, of sect or party) the inestimable blessings of education ; none
and calmly and dispassionately examine and inquire into what were to be excluded. I would ask had any been excluded r
has been accomplished in bestowing on the children that reli- Have not your wishes been carried fully and literally into effect?
gious and scriptural instruction of' which they profess themselves Are there not at this moment children of various religious de'
to be the eager and zealous champions.—Ever believe are to be notnivations receiving those instructions which
.are calculated
Most truly yours, ' JAMES ASPINeILL. to snatch them from the pathi of vice, and lead them into those
' Abercrombie-square, Nov. 22, 1836.'
of virtue? There are now in these schools 1300 childreu, mostly
I can only, in conclusion, again express the earnest wish, that of the very lowest order, and, if we may judge of the future by
in the moral and religious education of the people at least party the experience of the past, the change that has taken. place
zeal or religious bigotry may not interfere. The field is suf-
ficiently within the last few months, the general improvement in 'the
wide to allow room for all; the results hitherto have morals and behaviour of the childre augur a benefit to societt
been sufficiently discouraging to make the trust presumptuous equal to the most sanguine expectations. To your decision we
diffident in asserting that the way has yet been discovered in must bow, hut consider, I entreat you, the result of selling these
education to effect the religious and moral elevation of the peo- schools; it will be again to ee'etwe to vice and ignorance a greet
ple; yet no one will deny the all-importance of such a disco- number of these poor childien, whose hopes and expectations
very. Those who are pioneers in this work in simplicity and you have been pleased to raise to better things. I trust you
sincerity are entitled to encouragement, and even if they fail, will not blast these hopes, these reasonable expectations of the
must be useful as a warning to others." He was very much effects of Christian charity. Sow not again the seeds of disunion
obliged to them for the kintinette with which they had listened and hatred amongst those whom we have, endeavoured to teach,
to this, and he begged to second Mr. Blackburn's amendment. to love ad respec t each ! ememb tha he re'
Mr. Councillor LA wititm7l4: Hay wostl'il spoke as follows: tards then progress of intelloth erect counteßnanceser
crime,t andwho is him,
Mr. Mayor and gentlinen, tbough l hare to propose an amendment self the greatest of criminals to a state t Who are the come
also, and also on the originUl motion, as well as on all the amend- plainauts against the system adopted ? l'huse who are rich in
silents that are parsed; yet I feel that in doing so I would not this world's goods! Those who have numerous schools at their
trespass for a moment on the time of the Council, or disturb the good command ! Duise who for years have, for the benefit of one
understending which I hope prevails amongst the ernerilyof.e gen- sect exactee ill ing t fer denoruinee
acme,' in this council with regard to the,c schiede, wholly impressed lion,! Thosd eth whounw have berienbute rom
the loudestevery oth
in thinr reviling&
as they are that they are most ezccilent in their nature. If I had against the ignorance their Roman catholic brethren, and
f
the powers of oratory o the greatest and most of
excellent men, i who :Mould have been the first to rejoice in the fact of the
'would devote those powers to speak highly of these schools. lam sacred volume being introduced amongst them through the me-
happy to have heard a most excellent account if them from our dium of these schools. Should political feetiugs or fear of losing
jeetworthy friend Mr. Blackburn. Ile has been eloquent on the sub- some popularity have any effect upon you, be assured they are
, out he has not uttered one word in praise
er these schools in delusive! Do you expect any abatement of hostility I, y re--
liefwhich Ido not concur to the veryintlest extent. It is my firm be- tracing your steps? If so, you will be lamentably disappointed ;
that there never were schools instituted, either in this or any the opponents of reform will not hate you less, and the true
other country, which were destined in their nature to produce so friends of liberty will despise you. You will throw another
powerful engine into the hands of the enemies to:reform, and
much general good effect as the schools are. Burning as every
word of Mr. Blackburn was with zeal on this subject, 1 say,ji ' 1 you will blast the brightest hopes of the advocates of civil and
possessed language still more potent, I :could use it with full e ict religious liberty,
to maintain the importance el these schoule'sas liteY now exist. 1 Mr. Councillor Enanwore SMITH said, as the representative
would say more, Tit were only to convince the gentlemen here how of a large ward, comprising a great body of the poorer inhabi-
deeply lam enamoured of these schools. But as I have an amend- tants of the town, he felt deeply intereeted in this question--
meet to propose, I shall refrain, There may be good of every kind From what he had heard he had very confident auticitiations
anderif every character. But the object is not merely to have yood— that the result would be satisfactory. The question they were
we ought to have good to begin with—we ought to here good in its met to consider was one of very great importance. In the first
legitimate principle—in its linindatiuns of justice it ought to carry place, it was important to the Council, as regarded their own
out the good, not only to the present generation, but to generations character and consistency; aud, in the next place, it watt one
of mankind yet to be borer ; and if the schools be not founded mi the of the most vital importance to numbers of poor children in the
ferensolid basis efjustice, it will—the object we contemplate will be dif- town,—the children of nbutit 60,000 inhabitants ! who, if not
tto this Kew, and will, in time, become a nuisance, and, per- brought to some school of religious and moral education, would
haps, a pre;isdice to soeiety. There is s mode of conveying instruc- become pests to society : and these persons were of a class whw
aim which is countenanced by revelation itself—there is a made of e.t.a(' not afford to pay any thing, even the raoderate pittance
doing it which comes home to every is' oral feeling; and I regret proposed by Mr. Lawrence Heyworth. In the next place the
that this is the only omission that my learned friend, Mr. Black- subject was
of importance collaterally. The cry which had
turn, has left out in his powerfUl argument on these schools. It is been raised against the schools was not confined to Liverpool.
the voluntary principle. And if that hook, the Bible, be of any It was part of a system to bring the municipal act, and those
use at oil, it is of use in directing us in all the pursuits of life in who supported it into contempt. Ft had been assumed in that
which we engage. NOW, it haebeen clearly shown by evere man room that the public voice was against them. He denied it, --
that has apetc..,, 0,, this subject to-day, that religion is inkimately he only wished it to be put to the test ; and, as he had said bee
interwoven with the instruction we can communiCUte to our fellow- fore, be should certainly have felt it his duty, if the event bad
creatures. There is not an individual who has addressed us this tnade it necessary, to move that a mouth be allowed, to allow
day who has not this combined object in view. Now, as we aro all the public mind to speak on the subject. (Hear, and cheers.)
Bible Christians, it behoves es therefore to look at these rules which He had happened to be present at a meetiag,—and he was
ate laid down in the Scriptures for the regulation of our fellow- proud to say—a meeting of an incipient Operative Reform Ase
men. If we do not this—if we set the Bible aside, and adopt cur sociation, and had heard some very intellignnt speakers allude,
• lead of the Bible as our guide, we then make a ,to the subject,. and he was convinced if they canvassed the town,
own opinions, ins
from religion. itself. I would paint out the they would find nine-tenths of the intelligent part of it in file
eery serious departure
passuges whieh relate to this in the Bible. In the Pentateuch your of the system they were supporting. It would be exceed-
there is not an instance in which the voluntary principle is not ad- ingly wrong in him to attribute unworthy or uubecoming nlo"
vised, by whieh means knowledge was to be obtained. That lon- tives to such men as Messrs. Cropper. He knew them to he
image runs thruugh the whale of the Levitical law. This is the excellent urea in the distribution of their wealth, with which it
reliyiou, part of the subjeet, But there is amoral part. We are had pleased God to bless them ; but he was sorry for a moment
to consider that the brut, that support these schools are drawn from to find them going in the train of a man who called himself a
the purses el every denomination of Chrestians. In Liverpool the bosom friend of the forger M'Ghee. (Hear.) It was a political
larval. tin Y Party. Perhaps maiweuvre—nothing more. The system of selections they de-
corporate Jima: cannot be spent to
. ...
existed j
I cried was sanctioned by a Protestant Archbishop—a very ernt,
gentlemen would tell you they are not exclusive, because, children
de-
af every denomination of christiens can yo to These schools—tlnere j tient man—sanctioned by the Duke of Wellington, Peel,- and
Stanley. And gentlemen who said that this system was suitable
yet that kad not the, same advantages and privileges in this respect. ' for Ireland, end not for nngland, made a most strange an-
is no one prohibited. Now, I knew no school that has ever
I never heard that the Catholic schools prohibited and prevented j nouncement. IL was like saying that these persons had lent
Protestants from attending them, though they were so; or that themselves to a compromise of Christianity, and that they had
Pro/want srheols preveeted and prohibited the children ef Catho- j allowed a system in Ireland which was not fit for Protestants in
tics because they ewe so, • m ;laser heard of an exclusive school. i England. Ile wished to say something about Scripture read
What I now understend from
,ao exclusive school is, where it does j ing. He would state that there was more Scripturesreading
not plohibit children by the authority, but by the repugnance that i under this than under any former system. He had himself been
hich prevents these • • ' I d . He took them to
patents from brought up under a vet y ort lo ox parson.
exists in the breasts ef parents. w
i'l d I
he hear
xendin.q their breasts to the ,rhoott. I ty o point out this de- Church twice nu a Sunday ; but on no other dal would.
feet? Because it is universal in every
it attempt to provide educe- ' the Bible in the schools. The Rev.. Mr. Monk, who nowaSbias.
lion for the public in the means el apl! limy muney which is left in figuring in public, never introduced the Bible at all, while
with it-ehe
~,,,,, 1„ podic bediese and it cannot
.be said, without doing injus- ter of the Royal Institution. He had been taxed .
that it was true.
tire tir parties,by those who are lef lin Mill of 0
pliotiC properly. 1 IleVvr denied' it—and he took it for granted
Bibles to school.
era ',ewe/sided, from our common nature, whether i look at this lie knew that people had been desired to bring
making use of.
council, as beginning in bringing forward the reeounition e this in order to defeat the argument be was then
he had
to all nortie. if /look .
the school,-and been
principle of doitr.t; Jusliee . . .
to Ireland 1 see One person bad brought a Bible to
• of is, eayritgoe tithes is 1 •7" ,
bp, att. h 1 •
the efieet there ,-1 . , - had n - occasion to
that e o
and his parents.
1tt:74,01, from out ',lv", chl""lt ""t"tifioal Ibis reirsore 4f I look ering it--they did not use it awe school-book,
. -.