The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1841-01-29 00:00:00

mons, and, with regard to what the mayor had said about
the report having been lying in the Town-hall since Satur-
day, ho could only state that the fact had never been com-
municated to him before. Now, he did not recollect that
the words " to determine upon the report," which were in
the present summons, were ever in a summons before. lf,
indeed, it had been said, • to determine upon the report now
ill the town-clerk's office," he would have found no fault,
because htrwas only sorry that he had not received the in-
formation about its lying in the town-clerk's office in time
for it to be of use to him.
The TowN-CLux said that the standing orders showed
that the report would be open for inspection for the space of
two days. The whole subject was at present under the con-
sideration of the council, and would reniain so if the question
were carried that the report be received. Whether it would
come before the council again, would determine on the sort
of resolution to which the council would come upon that
occasion. With regard to what Mr. Sheil had said about
the summons, he had added the words " to determine," but,
although inserted, they were not obligatory.
Mr. EARLE said, that as he had been instrumental in
having the committee appointed, he wished to express his
satisfaction at its having led to the present favourable re-
sults, particularly as a mode seemed to have been at length
adopted for settling the question without entailing the ex-
penses of litigation. Had such a mode been adopted before,
vast sums of money would have been saved. (Hear, hear.)
• Mr. IsAAc HoLstus stated, that the trustees of the late
Duke of Bridgewater were willing to let entrances be made
from the Bridgewater Dock to the King's and other docks;
and if this were so, he hoped the Dock Committee would
take the circumstance into their consideration, as great be-
nefits would be likely to arise in consequence of such en-
trances being made. 1
The MAYOR said, that in the discussions which had taken
place last year with the Duke of Bridgewater's trustees,
every friendly disposition was shown on their part to enter
into a mutual arrangement for the benefit of the dock estate,
and that be was sure Mr. Holmes's suggestion would receive
that attention from the Dock Committee to which it was
entitled. He (the mayor) begged now to ask whether there
was any objection to the report read being received? (Se-
veral voices, " No, no.")
Mr. HENRY HOLMES said they were all unanimous on
the subject of receiving it.
Mr. EVANS begged to put a question. As the object of
the report was to allay or prevent opposition, he asked any
gentleman connected with the warehouse interest whether
that object had been then effected ; and he wished to know
if there was any body to speak for them in the council?
Mr. HAABORD was quite prepared to answer for them, and
to express his answer as laconically as the question had been
put. In the first place, he would say that Alderman Evans
had heretofore protested that he would oppose any conces-
sions ; and, in the second place. that as the warehouse own-
ers had not as yet received the report, they were not enabled
to say whether they would accept it or not. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. EVANS then proceeded to say, that whatever might
be the result of the report, and that whether the council di-
vided on it or not, he could not pass the arrangement over
without declaring that it was anything but satisfactory to
him. He looked upon it that they had got opponents who
had wriggled everything out of them without giving them
anything in exchange. The council were now called on, not
only to bind themselves, but to bind posterity, not only to
bind the present Dock Committee and council, but future
Dock Committees and councils. He questioned very much
whether the legislature would consider it right, or whether
they would quietly permit an interdiction of improvements
for twelve years with a town like Liverpool, which was the
great commercial arm of the whole empire, and which was
advancing with gigantic strides. He could not believe that
the inhabitants of Liverpool would look on with patience
when they found warehouses rising in the Harrington and
Herculaneum Docks, and that they were interdicted in the
middle of the old town—the place of all others which in
equity ought to precede every other part in improvements—
(cries of " Hear, hear, hear")—and he believed that the first
warehouse that would spring out of the earth in the Harring-
ton or Herculaneum Docks, would cause warehouses to be
raised up about the Old Dock of Liverpool. But why should
any obstacle be placed in the way ? If it were right that
warehouses ought not to be built, why not confide in the
wisdom and equity of future dock committees and councils ?
There was another matter that he considered concerned the
character—he would almost say the honour—of the town ;
for, to go up to parliament with a plan for a new dock, mu-
tilated as it was, was, in his opinion, to exhibit a monument
to the eyes of the legislature, the British empire, and indeed
all Europe, which were looking at them more than they were
aware of—a monument, he repeated, of an unworthy subser-
viency to interests which, if they had any equitable claim,
would have found supporters. He had a firm reliance on the
integrity of Lord Lyndhurst, and he would be content—
much as he disapproved of his political character, if they put
him in his official situation, subject to his official responsi-
bilities—to place the utmost confidence in his rectitude and
correctness, and to Lord Lyndhurst and Sir Robert Peel he
would confide the whole adjustment of this question. So far
from apprehending weakness in the quarter alluded to in
committee, he looked there for his strength, and was sure he
-would find it -Oleic. He had remonstrated with the sub-
committee for overrating the power of the opposition, and he
had begged of them not to come down, as it were, to zero,
while they were getting nothing for it, and they then rose to
blood-heat.
The MAYOR rose to order. These observations would be
very appropriate when the report came under consideration,
but at present they were ill-timed.
Mr. EVANS said he was referring to the course pursued by
the committee who had framed the report, and he desired it
to be taken as his protest against parts of that report. He
reserved to himself the right of addressing the council here-
after upon their having limited the number of warehouses,
because they had narrowed into so small a basis that, consi-
dering what they had given up, it was scarcely worth while
to go to parliament.
Mr. EARLE hoped he would have the right to reply to
these observations.
Mr. EvANs begged he might be allowed to proceed.
Mr. EARLE said he was anxious to have the fullest dis-
cussion.
The MAYOR said that the observations Mr. Evans was
then addressing •to the council would be exceedingly well
placed if a moticu had been made for the adoption of the re-
port, but, that not being the case, they were out of place.
Mr. EVANS was sorry to differ in opinion with the mayor,
but if they came there, as he had heard it once said in Scot-
land, " to vote and not to speak," or, if it was the opinical
Scot-
of the council that he ought not to proceed, he would sil
down.
The MAYOR asked whether Mr, Evans meant to propose
any motion against the reception of the report ? because, if
so, he might proceed.
Mr. EVANS thought the mayor had no right
atpopdroorifovvreehe toihm
into that at the beginning of his observations.
was rvtatnioonts. The subject
council,e
d
to which
and,
nh
de
though
gh hi s addressingre ma
rhkismms
f
he maintained that he was not going into irrelevant matter:
Mr. BUSHELL asked the town-clerk whether it was not
competent for any member to speak on a motion that was
made?

Mr. EVANS said he would bring his remarks to a close, in
consequence of what the mayor had stated, but that he would
first offer one observation in reply to what fell from Mr.
Isaac Holmes, about the Duke of Bridgewater's trustees.
To that project they had given every attention, but they
found it to be impracticable, because an amount of money
was asked to effect an improvement that no man in his senses
would say it was worth. (Hear, hear.)
The MAYOR asked if Mr. Bushell wished to put the ques-
tion to the town-clerk which he had asked shortly before?
Mr. BUSHELL replied in the negative, but said that he was
surprised at the course Mr. Evans had pursued ' • because,
according to the word of the report, it appeared to have been
unanimously adopied, and that no division whatever had taken
place upon it in committee, whereas it now appeared, in point
of fact, that there had been a very great division on it, not
perhaps in numbers, but certainly in opinion. What did the
report amount to ? If Mr. Evans was candid in putting forth
the opinions he had then expressed, why did he not embody
them in the report received ? And if he was candid, and that
in fact he was laughing in his sleeve at what Had taken place,
then he (Mr. Bushell) would say, that the opinions contained
in the report and the opinions held by Mr. Evans were as
contrary as white was from black. He (Mr.: Bushell) con-
fessed that he was in a dilemma with regard to the report
under present circumstances, because, at first 'he was glad to
find that an unanimous opinion was come to in the committee,
but now he was astonished to find that that opinion was not
unanimous.
Mr. EARLE said that with regard to what Mr. Evans had
said about not allowing warehouses to be built, he had one
observation to make. If the proposed transit sheds answer-
ed, there would be no necessity for warehouses ' - if not, it
was more than probable that warehouses would be built.
The report was then unanimously received, a slight altera-
tion in one of its provisions being first agreed to without ob-
servation.
Mr. H. HORNBY then rose and said that the following re-
solution, which he had great pleasure in proposing, had been
just placed in his hands :
" That the reference recommended in the report be made
to the Finance Committee, subject to the reconsideration by
this council of the whole matter, if the object of conciliation
be not effected."
He would not trouble the council with any observations on
this motion, but just to notice a remark which had been made
use of by Mr. Evans. He (Mr. H.) thought the committee
had not shown any unworthy subserviency to private inte-
rests, as had been alleged by the gentleman in question. It
was true, he (Mr. H.) admitted, that some advantage would
arise to local interests, by reason of the time originally in-
tended for erecting the warehouses being postponed, but it
was only using a proper regard to those interests, that no un-
necessary or undue haste should be used in bringing the
bwarehouses
reasoninto h
abte ihneg
w.
as(h‘lveilalritighteoacro.)nceld to
It
was
was en
a tpo eneed_
would be adopted.
Mr. J. SMITH asked whether the resolution was in strict
order, for he thought they had already disposed of the busi-
ness of the day.
-- Mr. H. HORNBY said that the resolution was in accord-
ance with the latter part of the report.
Mr. J. SMITH understood that they were merely called on
to receive the report on that occasion.
The TOWN-CLERK replied. The council had then to de-
termine whether they would receive the report in whole or in
part.

Mr. JOHN HOLMES then seconded Mr. Hornby's motion.
Mr. SHELL moved, as an amendment, "That the report be
taken into consideration at the next meeting of the council."
He was induced to move this amendment in consequence of
what had been stated at the commencement of the report—
namely, that it had been agreed to without a division. Now
he would put it to any plain man whether that was not the
conclusion to which he would arrive on reading the passage
in question? He was never more astonished, therefore, than
when he heard Mr. Evans say, that he disagreed with the re-
port, a fact which plainly proved that it had not been unani-
mously adopted. -It was the duty of the council, under those
circumstances to devote a little time to its consideration.
Mr. EVANS wished to say a few words with regard to the
want of unanimity in the council. It was only on one point
that he had reserved his right to dissent, on every other he
had acquiesced with the rest of the committee, and, there-
fore, the argument raised by Mr. Sheil had a very limited
and narrow basis to go upon. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. R. GLADSTONE said that the observation alluded to
in the report was merely intended to convey to the council
the unanimity that prevailed in the committee.

The MAYOR would further state that there had been very
considerable discussion on the subject in the committee, but
that all minor matters were merged into a general agreement.
There were certainly some strong expressions made use of
by members on both sides, but as those 'expressions had sub-
sequently merged into a mutual agreement, it would not be
judicious, perhaps to allude to them on that occasion.
Mr. BUSHELL said it occurred to him that the motion be-
fore the council held out a premium to the warehouse owners
for further opposition. He asked when this question was to
be settled ? The appointment of the committee hid cer-
tainly weakened the strength of the warehouse owners, inas-
much as there were six warehouse owners upon it who were
now committed to the principles contained in the report.
The effect of the motion, however, would be, to hold out a
premium to further opposition.
Mr. YATES seconded Mr. Sheil's amendment. He thought
it would be rather unfortunate were the council to express its
approbation of the report, because it would be well to know,
in the first place, if the warehouse owners would withdraw
their opposition, and by adopting Ml. Sheil's amendment,
there would be plenty of time for ascertaining that fact. If
they would not withdraw their opposition, it would be unwise
to adopt the report ; for, although he wished the matter to
be settled, he could not agree to what was proposed in the
report, except on the ground of giving up largely for the sake
of conciliation, and to prevent injury from being done to the
port of Liverpool by reason of nothing being effected. He