The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1841-11-16 00:00:00

TO CORRESPONDENTS

We have received Mr. Jones's tragedy of " Regulus." It
will meet with early attention.
If the communication of " P. S. J." is found suitable it
shall appear on Friday.
The letter of " A Conservative" we hope to find room for in
our next. Our correspondent would greatly oblige us if he
would curtail his communications. We should be sorry to
refuse them insertion, but they would be much more read-
able if shorter.
Owing to the length of the Council Proceedings and other
local matters which could not be conveniently deferred, we
were unable to forward the papers to our subscribers by
the first post.

Ebt Eibtrpool &tanbatt.

TUESDAY MORNING, NOVEMBER 16, 1841

It is a favourite position in the liberal school of eco-
nomy, that trade and labour should be as little as pos-
sible interfered with by the legislature, and it has been
the policy of our rulers of late years to reduce the
theory to practice. To the position as it stands we are
willing to subscribe; we would desire human liberty,
in all respects, to be as little circumscribed " as possi-
ble ;" not only in matters of trade, but in those of
politics and morals, should we rejoice to leave men to
act at their own discretion, and subject to no orders
for their wise and peaceful guidance but those of their
own consciences. But it is found impossible, in prac-
tice, to dispense with some interference—the amount
depending chiefly on the disposition of men to obey
the laws of natural equity of their own accord. Some
of the experiments of relaxation have not been attended
by the most favourable results, and would lead us to
call again, not, perhaps, for the old system of restric-
tion or of supererogatory watchfulness in all its bur-
densome details, but for a superintendence and a con-
trol exercised by some third, disinterested party, which
would obviate the evils which have been found to ac-
crue from a system without any. There is an admitted
necessity for such control in the case of factory child,
ren ; it is not denied, in their case, that the legislature
ought to put in exercise a controlling power, because
such power is designed for the protection of those who
are too feeble to protect themselves, and has been
found, by every consideration of humanity and justice,
to be most imperatively demanded. We are not aware
that any of the free trading economists go the length
of saying that griping factory lords or unfeeling pa-
rents should he left to deal with the bone and muscle
of their infant operatives quite according to their own
views of the case, whatever difference of opinion may
exist as to a ten-hours' bill, or minute regulations
connected with the supervision of the relation subsist-
ing between the employer and his youthful body of
workpeople.
Now the control peremptorily required in this case
is not a thing to be desired in itself—an institution
which one would desire to multiply; but experience has
shown that it is absolutely necessary. Here the free
trade principle of the economists fails, and cannot, by
any means, be carried out in the existing state of so-
ciety.

We give this as our first instance, because it shows
an exception to the rule free from all rational objec-
tion : it shows that the weak need protection, and that
there is a principle of humanity which is at all times
superior to the maxims of mere economy.
We would revert, in the next place, to the results of
that great experiment which was made in favour of the
ad libitum system, by abolishing the laws against com-
bination. With all due deference to the philosophers,
that experiment has been, in our humble opinion, a
failure, and has done much more harm than good to
trade, and the operative classes themselves. It would
be interesting to enter fully into this investigation, but
it is beyond the scope of our immediate purpose. We
merely throw out the hint, that if the operatives who
have bound themselves to the laws of trades' unions,
and have been punctual in paying up all the demands
of their several councils—who have been faithful in
standing out with their brethren when they received
the order to " strike," or in maintaining others in that
untoward position—were to compute their gains and
their losses in hard cash, they would probably find but
a very small balance, or more likely none at all, in fa-
vour of combination. As to the interest of masters,
and trade in general, there can scarcely be a doubt of
the great and manifold injuries which operative combi-
nations have inflicted upon them.

This case differs from the first to which we have ad-
verted, inasmuch as it is not the operatives who seem
to need protection, but the master. Shall we be told
that the masters are sufficiently protected in their
own powers, and want no assistance from the legisla-
ture ? We say, that supposing they were, it is not for
the government to stand by, and see workmen combin-
ing against masters, and masters against workmen, and
the interests of society in the meanwhile greatly suffer-
ing, and take no part in the business.
We have had a signal proof of the self-righting
power which the masters do possess, when vigorously
put forth, in the recent contest of the masons with the
architects of the new houses of parliament, Messrs.
Grissell and Peto. In that contest the combination of
the workmen has utterly failed ; Messrs Grissell and
Peto have been enabled to dispense with the services of
the combinators, and the object of the strike has been
frustrated; but, we ask, does this fact afford any suffi-
cient ground for the non-interference of the legisla-
ture ? The limes, last week, in allusion to this ques-

tion, says—
" Much as we regret any of these large combinations on
either side, we cannot be surprised, we cannot blame employ-
ers, if they also unite to quell, at all hazards, even by throw-
ing a whole trade out of employ, an authority which, if al-
lowed fairly to get head, threatens to destroy the possibility
of carrying on business at all. Nay, we shall be even asto-
nished at their apathy, if some such vigorous measures against
strikes, and those who support them, are not forthcoming.
havinglt caon
their
e ibre
private
ran
supposedrthgaernn
that they
will resign themselves to
s with their workmen regu-
lated by a council, or committee, or union, drawn from those
very workmen with whom their variances arise. * * * *
What we are now opposing, and what would make it impos-
sible for the public to enter upon the right and wrong of the
particular quarrel, even were it dubious, is this--an organi-
zation of working men (an organization not thought of on
the master's side) in order to seize on an authority destruc-
tive of our present industrial and even political framework,
and acting by these ' strikes' as their ordinary weapon. This
is such a revolution as not one, or two, or three cases of in-
dividual wrong, but only general and flagrant and hopeless
oppression can excuse. And it is from their acknowledged
connexion with this organization that strikes are consi.
dered as they are—the seditious movements of a seditious
party."

And again :
" If worluneo will combine against their employers, their

employers mu g,l combine against them. If ma proscribe
masters, roastei,s tumst proscribe men—commcp cause on
one side involves common cause on the other. Incalcula.
bly mischievous as such a feud would be, it is y'et the least
of two mischiefs."

We quote these passages because they seem to argue
that the ad libitum law may remain just as it is, and
that no court of appeal, no authoritative arbitration is
necessary in such cases ; but such doctrine will
scarcely hold good in a civilised state of society. Ope-
rative combinations are extremely injurious, and it is
no excuse for the ruler's non-interference to say, that
masters may follow the same course in their own de-
fence; it is his duty to provide a remedy, either by re-
storing the ancient law and making combinations un-
lawful, or by instituting a court for deciding such
causes, or by. some other means. In the present state
of things the operatives make laws for their employ-
ers, and, in their attempts to enforce them, entail an
incalculable amount of mischief on themselves and
others; and this is unquestionably a state of things
which ought not to be suffered to continue.

" The church has done it"—cries old " • George
Williams"—the church has done it ; it has openly
identified itself with toryism ; aud this movement of
the church must be considered by the friends of im-
provement and reform as a declaration of war, and"—
hear this ye tories, and tremble—shake on your
Olympus, and let all Thessalia quake—" I (George
Williams) will not fail to RESENT IT!" But now
query—Good Sir, is it the church that has identified
itself with toryism, or toryism that has identified itself
with the church ? Pause for a moment, sir, before
your resentment lights up into a blaze, and do not
confound the innocent with the guilty. Had you been
in the neighbourhood of the Town-hall, or St. Peter's
Church on Sunday morning last, you would have seen
a sight that might well have raised tbis question in
your mind. You would have seen a marvellous revival
of the olden time; the insignim of authority brought
forth from their hiding place—the decent ensigns of
rank and office, which the rampancy of a levelling,
vulgarising faction would sweep entirely away, restored
to their rightful possessors—the mayor and corpora-
tion of Liverpool proceeding in their official capacity
to the Parish Church, attended by such a cortege of
the wealth, rank, and respectability of the town, as no
ordinary occasion could have collected, and greeted
on their way by a countless multitude of the inhabi-
tants, in holy-day attire, anxious at once to gratify
themselves with a sight now unwonted to their eyes,
aud do honour to men about to discharge a duty in
which they deeply sympathised, and of which they
entirely approved—had you, we say, Mr. Williams,
been a witness to this interesting specta,-le, you might
well have doubted whether there was not just as much
truth in the converse of your proposition as in the
proposition itself. But we have no fancy for splitting
hairs ; we shall freely concede that the church—the

church by her influences, or the church by herself has
done it—that is to say, restored the ascendancy of
toryism; yes, we shall concede this even at the risk of
drawing down upon us the bolts of so awful a thun-
derer as old George Williams. And the tories, we are
happy to say, are grateful ; it is one of their first acts,
in this town, to give honour to whom honour is due,
and at the " Protestant altar" in the church of their
fathers, to make their acknowledgments to the Most
High. The radical scribe might have been a hearer
of the interesting discourse delivered from the pulpit
on the occasion, or he may otherwise be enabled to
collect its purpose—and we beg him to remark that he
will find therein no apology to any fellow mortal for
giving all the praise to Almighty God. Apologies of
this sort belong to another system, and are among the
fruits of another regime ; we allude to an occurrence
now prettily well known, but so well worth remember-
ing, that we shall make no apology for briefly setting
it forth in this place. Be it recollected, then, that the
notorious Mr. Daniel O'Connell is the first Popish
Lord Mayor of Dublin under a reform act of parlia-
ment, and that on Sunday week last, being the first
Sabbath after his election, he proceeded in his red
cloak, cocked hat, and state coach of office, with all
the eclat and notoriety which a prodigious mob could
give him, to attend mass at a Popish house of
worships in open violation of the act of parliament
in virtue of which he was constituted mayor ; that
his dutiful church received him with special honors,
and undiminished ardour, whilst he was thus engaged
in doing obeisance to her, and despite to the laws of
the realm ; that a priest named Miley preached a
sermon on the occasion, full of the most exasperating
allusions against the Protestants, and, exulting in the
triumph which his church witnessed that day in the
presence of a devout son, who enjoyed the high office
of Lord Mayor of the city, said, that he felt so trans-
ported with delight, that even at the risk of offending
that eminent individual, and seeming to detract from
his merit, he must ascribe the accomplishment of so
great a work to Omnipotence alone !

The absolute deification therefore of this bold, bad
man is, it appears, postponed to another opportunity,
and in the meanwhile the ecclesiastical trumpeter apo-
logizes for not putting him quite on a level with the
Supreme Being ! Such, Radicalism, be thy fruits ;
there are no such blasphemies to be heard in the train
of her now triumphant antagonist. We do not refuse
to ascribe honour to individuals; such honour as their
faithful services deserve, we cheerfully accord them ;
but we ascribe all with due submission and deference
to a higher power, and we bear in mind that when
making our acknowledgments to the most deserving
individuals, there is a reserve to be made on the score
of that influence which the church and our principles,
when rightly used, place at their command. The
Radical scribe then is welcome to proclaim that " the
church has done it," as long as he pleases; we thank
him for the acknohledgment ; his testimony is valuable;
we shall compound on cheap terms for all his resent-
ments.

But there is a wide difference between that which is
achieved by what we may call a principle, and that
which is wrought merely by men. We are not, as
others, thank God, the slaves of a spiritual despotism.
What our church achieves, she achieves by the influ-
ence of reason—by the intervention of a written law,
which all alike are bound to obey; she subjects none
to the caprice of a living, varying, and variable autho-
rity. Her influence is the influence of freedom, and
our love and obedience to her, are those of willing
freemen. Therefore our enemies think to taunt us in
vain. We care not how often they repeat " the church
has done it ;" yes, the church has done it, and round
the church we rally. She has taught us to conquer,
and we are neither so foolish, nor so ungrateful as to
desert her banner.

* See his letter in the Mercury of Friday

The proceedings of the Council Meeting, yesterday
will be found at length in another part of our papery
and we have no doubt will be read with general satis-
factiion. Although naturally of an exciting character,
on account of the importance of the subjects to be dis-
cussed, yet on the whole they were marked with con-
siderable temper; and notwithstanding the continual
endeavours of Mr. William Earle to embroil its deli-
berations, by those interferences in which he delights,
and which, coming from any other and less distinguish-
ed individual, might be deemed impertinent,—we are
confident that, after a few explosions, the business of
the Council will be permitted to progress smoothly and
decorously. _

It will not be necessary for us to indulge in any
lengthened remarks upon the debate, if we may be
permitted to apply to the Council in its present state
of discipline a term so formal. We cannot, however,
entirely pass over the effort of Mr. Bright to establish
for himself a fame, more permanent than, we fear, the
possession of the Gibraltar of St. Peter's Ward is likely
to be to him. Like many other "liberal" luminaries,
Mr. Bright appears to be afflicted with the most pro-
found ignorance of the state of the party to which he
belongs, as well as of the subject upon which he
essayed to be at once eloquent and argumentative.
The repeal of the Test and Corporation Acts—the
passing of the Municipal Reform Bill, and other
measures of the "liberal" kind, have nothing earthly
to do, we can assure him, with the system of education
to be pursued in the Corporation. Schools. It is quite
true, that it was the design of theframers of the Muni-
cipal Act, to place the management of our Corporation
Schools, and every other corporate establishment, in
the hands of such philosophers as Mr. Bright himself.
But unfortunately, that act was based upon the prin-
ciple of reprebentSioh. The community at large, to

whom those sehool2 bektrig, were the power who were
to determine the system upon which they were to be
managed; and the community has spoken out upon
the subject, with a distinctness which renders it im-
possible to mistake the nature of its determination, and
against whose power not even " Gibraltar" itself has
been proof.

The people of Liverpool will not be bound down,
even by acts of parliament, upon this question. It
entertains an utter disrespect for the march of " liber-
alism ;" and will Mr. Bright, an admirer of the principle
of self-government in local laffairs, ,maintain that the
community has not a'perfect right to set up its own
will against even so great an authority as Mr. Bright's
philosophy ?
,We trust not.

Well,—the meeting of the Council is over; the
Education Committee has been chosen; and the Con-
servative body in the Council has not fallen in pieces,
but is still in possession of an unbroken front and a
resolved and united mind. The representatives of the
Conservative and Protestant people of this great town
have neither allowed themselves to he hurried into
ultra measures upon this important question—as has
been sanguinely anticipated by one portion of their
Radical opponents—nor deterred by the sarcasms and
the sneers which have been levelled at them by another
portion into a course of truckling and dangerous com-
promise. The system of education provided for the
children of the poor in our Corporation Schools will,
for the future, he one based strictly upon the unadul-
terated religion of the Bible; and whilst we cannot but
contemplate, with unaffected satisfaction, this important
boon to the public, we have an ample guarantee in the
constitution of the committee itself, that the change
will be effected without unnecessarily grating upon
the feelings or offending the prejudices of any sect or
party.

We never anticipated for a moment that there could
he any compromise of principle, on the part of the
Conservative majority in the Council, in the settlement
of this important question ; and we do not now fear,
with the materials of the committee before us, that the
plan of education to be provided for will be other than
satisfactory to the great bulk of our fellow-townsmen.
To some Conservatives, perhaps, the names of a few
of the gentlemen appointed may, in the first instance,
be a little distasteful ; and the impression may exist
that conciliation has been carried too far in submitting
to their appointment. But these impressions, we are
satisfied, will vanish when the details of the system in
contemplation come to be discussed, and their bearing
and principles to be explained ; and we trust we need
not do more than request of our fellow-townsmen to
approach their consideration in a dispassionate spirit,
and to weigh well the whole circumstances before
forming a judgment as to their propriety and justice.
We may repeat, that upon no plea can we admit of
the sacrifice of a principle by the Conservative body
in the Council, in the settlement of this question. The
direction taken with respect to it by the mind of the
community is too distinctly marked and powerful to
allow it to be evaded. The system of education to be
provided must be essentially and entirely Protestant
and Scriptural. We must have no delusion—no milk-
and-water admixture—no extracts—no halting between
semi-infidelity and the full and free admission of the
Christianity of the Bible into our schools.

With respect to the particular mode by which this
result is to be pursued, we shall not at present venture
to obtrude any sugestions of our own upon the com-
mittee. The principle we have already pointed to ; and
it has been, in addition, commented upon in our
columns by abler pens than our own, prompted by
minds more fitted to deal with so momentous a sub-
ject. Would that the committee, or at all events the
Conservative portion of it, would take counsel with
respect to its details from those whose avocations and
course of mental discipline ha:•e rendered the con-
sideration of such subjects more familiar !

" Despair! Who talks of despair to the Reformers of
Liverpool ? We have been defeated this time, but we will
struggle on until Victory shall again side with us, and For-
tune, 'alter her fickle desertion of the righteous cause, once
morn smile upon it. Although, for a season,

" .Our legs are smitten off, we'll fight upon our stumps "
Valorous exceedingly, most profound Albion ! Ex-
cellently well pumped forth out of the deep into which
Whiggery has fallen ! We question whether Barnaby
Rudge's raven could have done it better. " Who
talks of despair to the Reformers of Liverpool ? "
" Polly, put the kettle on—never say die ! "

Our gibing contemporary of Monday, like a certain
illustrious ex-Minister for Foreign Affairs, has fallen
back for consolation, during the present untoward
state of politics, upon his recollections of the classics.
" Hilli-onnee Palmerston " and .6 Fides Achates,"—
from henceforth let yours be the loves of the angels !
" Arcades ambo "—brothers in misfortune and in
classical lore, be ye ever associated together on the
shady side of politics—twin glowworms, shedding
your mild light upon the darkness o? your benighted
party. " Hilli-onnee Palmerston"—" Fides Achates."
Prodigious !

THE BRAZILIAN QUESTION AND THE
" MANCHESTER GUARDIAN."

The Manchester Guardian has a long article on Saturday,
in reply to a few remarks which we offered in our last upon
the subject of our relations with Brazil ; and although we
have bestowed some attention upon the lucubrations of our
contemporary, we really cannot discover that he has thrown
much light upon the question. The tone of our article has
not pleased the Guardian. We indulge, it appears, in " bad
jokes," and are not so attentive as we might be to that sto-
lidity of style with which our contemporary is accustomed to
dole forth his profound observations upon " grave questions
of national policy." But, with this exception, we are at a
loss to perceive in what we have offended ; and certainly we
cannot admit that in one position the Guardian has met us
with a refutation.
Our contemporary, in the article which called forth our
remarks, was anxious to represent the possible raising of the
import duties, levied under the present Brazilian tariff, as
likely to be influenced by a spirit of hostility on the part of
the Brazilian government towards this country. We doubted,
and we doubt still, whether that government will be influ-
enced by any such feeling ; and we are still of opinion that,
in attributing such a feeling to it. " the wish," in the mind
of our contemporary, was " father to the thought." There
was a " flippancy of tone"—if we must retort upon him—in
'the Guardian's article, which certainly did not lead to the
supposition that the retaliatory legislation spoken of was
viewed with any great dissatisfaction ; and when we bear in
mind the fact that the very course represented as in contem-
plation by the Brazilian government has been pointed out to
it by the organs of the whig party in this country, we can
really reconcile ourselves to the " decency and propriety" of
having imputed satisfaction to the Guardian in remarking
upon it.
Upon the main question between Great Britain and the
Brazils we are not at all moved by the Guardian's remarks.
It is not a question of merely commercial policy ; and were
it even so, we cannot see that it is at all necessary to adopt
the Guardian's views. The choice is given to us between
two great markets for our manufactures—our own free-labour
Colonies, and the slave-worked and slave-importing country
of Brazil. We know that by transferring our custom from
the former to the latter we shall rivet the fetters upon the
limbs of millions of our fellow beings without adding one
benefit to the trade of Great Britain ;—that, in fact, we shall
virtually proclaim to the world that the' great experiment of
negro emancipation, in which we have made so noble a
sacrifice, is a failure; and, although temporarily, we may
experience an inconvenience from perseverence in it, we have
no fear that the mind of the nation can be wrought upon to
abandon it as yet. _ _ _ _

The Guardian is anxious for " the benefit of our cogi-
tations " upon the effect which the imposition of heavy
protecting duties have upon the " revenue and commerce "
of countries generally. It is scarcely worth our while to
enlighten our contemporary. We may state, however, our
opinion generally upon this point. We do not think that a
government should legislate for " revenue and commerce"
solely. Nobler and higher purposes should actuate us ; and
upon this particular question the government of Great Britain
would, in our humble opinion, be strangely wanting in virtue
and manliness if it omitted any opportunity of declaring its
firm determination to persevere in the course which it has
entered upon to discourage the consumption in Great Britain
of every foreign product which is raised by the toil of slaves.

ABSTRACT OF THE LOG OF THE "COLUMBIA"
STEAM-SHIP, CAPT. C. H. E. JUDKINS,
From Boston, U.S., and Halifax, N.S., to Liverpool.

Nov. I.—Sailed from Boston at 3 p.m.
2.—Running for Halifax.
3.—Arrived at Halifax at 7 a.m.
4.—Sailed from Halifax at 41 p.m. Passed the Britannia
at 5 p.m., going into harbour, all well. 6 p.m. Sambo Light
bore W. by S. 9 miles, from which we took our departure.
s.—Distance 210 miles. Wind S.E. Strong breeze, and
squally.
6.—Wind S.S.W. Steady breeze, and clear weather.
7.-211 miles. S.S.W. Moderate and clear.
8.-244 miles. S.W. Fresh breeze, and cloudy.
9.-244 miles. N. Moderate and clear.
10.-232 miles. E. Moderate and cloudy.
11.-226 miles. E.N.E. Moderate and clear.
12.-252 miles. N.W. Strong breeze and cloudy wea-
ther, with a long swell from N.W.
13.-262 miles. N.W. Strong breeze and cloudy wea-
ther, with lightning and rain.
14..-242 miles. N.E. Strong breeze and clear. 5 a.m.
Cape Clear Light bore N.E. by E. At S p.m. abreast of
Tuskar.
15.—Off Holyhead at 4 a.na•, and arrived at Liverpool at
11 a.m.

A MOUNTAIN of FAT.-Mr. Dawson, of the George the
Fourth, Leonard-street, Derby. whose hog pig was slaugh-
tered a few days ago, weighed the enormous sum of 9861b5.,
or 123 stones 21bs., 81b. to the stone, London weight.—
Derby paper. [Which is the mouotain—Mr. Dawson, or
his pig n