The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1846-01-13 00:00:00

EDUCATION COMMITTEE

The proceedings of the Education Committee comprised
recommendations to increase the following salaries, viz.,
Mr. Harris, second master at the North School, from £6O
to £BO per annum ; Mr. Pinckney, assistant master, from
£25 to £3O per annum. The appointment of Mr. James
Lees, as master of the Evening School for adults at the
South School, at the salary of £25 per annum ; and of
Mr. James Riley, assistant master, at £2O per annum ;
the consideration of which several matters was postponed
at the last monthly council, pursuant to the standing
orders.

The following summary of attendances at the Corpora-
tion Schools during the last month was read :

NORTH SCHOOL. SOUTH SCHOOL
183 245
98 179
181 142
464 566

I n (ants ......
Total .......
On the books

A sbort discussion took place respecting the salaries,
the general opinion seeming to be that they were in-
adequate, but it was considered advisable not to interfere
with the arrangements of the committee, and the proceed-
ings were confirmed.

The proceedings, resolutions, and reports of the Gaol
and House of Correcti'n Committee were confirmed, corn-
prising the appointment of Charles Rayner as chief clerk
in the room of Mr. Estell resigned, at the salary of £lOO
per annum.
. .

The other committees' proceedings—Town Hall Estab-
lishment, Health of Town, Borough Court, and Church
Expenditure—were confirmed.

FERRY COMMITTEE-THE LANDING STAGE

The TOWN-CLERK read the proceedings of this commit •
tee, from which it appeared that on the 15th ult. a deputa-
tion from the Commissioners of Birkenhead, consisting of
Messrs. Potter, Laird, & Green attended the committee to
express their opinion that the public convenience would be
better consulted by the erection of two additional landing
stages in lieu of the large one now in course of construc-
tion, which should be divided into two, and that there
should be additional flights of broad steps in the wall.
There would then be four landing stages, three of which
it was suggested should be appropriated to the ferry boats,
one to be exclusively at the use of the Monks'-ferry and
Woodside boats, and the other for the use of sea-going
steamers. The chairman of the committee stated to the
deputation that the committee had only the regulation of
the landing stages now in use, and that the one now
constructing was unde- the authority of one of the Dock
Acts. The deputation stated that no obstacle would
be opposed to any alteration by the Birkenhead Com-
missioners, and they expressed their conviction that
the large stage would be inadequate to the public
accommodation, and that the Dock Trustees would
be compelled to afford more. The deputation having
withdrawn, the Committee came to the following resolu-
tion :—" That it appears to this Committee desirable that
this important subject should be fullyconsidered, in order
to ascertain whether sufficient and proper accommodation
can be afforded to the public, and at less cost, by means
of additional landing places, in lieu of the large stage now
Proposed, and that the Chairman and Mr. Aikin be re-
quested to bring the subject before the Dock Committee."
Mr. PARKER.—Did the deputation state what the com-
missioners will pay towards the expense?
The TOWN CLERK.—NO.

Mr. PARKER ex pres Fed his coniriceion that they never
would be satisfied whatever might be done by the Corpo-
ration, and he hoped the Council would not entertain the

subject.

Mr. MANN moved the confirmation of the proceedings.
Mr. HORNBY asked whether any steps had been taken
by the committee to ascertain whether the alterations
could be made in conformity with the wishes of the Birk-
enhead commissioners, and at the same time in compli-
ance with the terms of the act of parliament?
Mr. AIKIN said he regretted to find that the chairman
of the Ferry Committee was not present; hut at the same
time he was well pleased that the question had been put.
Mr. Nicol, stated that Mr. Nelson Wood, the chair-
man of the committee, bad desired him to mention that he
would have been present, but that he was obliged to attend
another meeting of which he was chairman.
Mr. AIKIN, in continuation, said, that inasmuch as he
was named in the resolution with the Chairman of the
Ferries Committee, to make the communication to the
Dock Committee, the Council would expect that some-
thing should result from that communication. The com-
munication was made. He, was making it verbally when
the Chairman produced a copy of the proceedings, which
he read from the chair of the Dock Committee. This led
him (Mr. Aikin) to urge for that which he bad already
urged in the Council, and more at length before the Ferc y
Committee, the very great benefit that would result to the
public, and the great saving of money, as regarded the
Dock expenditure, upon this large stage, the and less im-
pediment to the navigation of the river, by the adoption
of the suggestion. But whether this could be accom•
plished or not, it was clearly his opinion, and the opinion
of practical men, that the representations of a deputation
so respectable as those who waited upon the Committee,
should receive every possible attention. In consequence
of the discussion which took place, a question arose
whether the application could be legally entertained—
whether the clause in the act of Parliament having im-
posed upon the Dock Committee the necessity of making
•a stage, it would be safe to touch the subject at all. It was
agreed eventually that the Town-Clerk should confer with
the Dock Solicitor upon that subject, that if they found it
could legally and properly be done, they might put them into
the way of doing that which in itself presented'fio great a
desideratum. As he said before, he was about to make
this comunication to the Dock Committee as from the Ferry
Committee, when the chairman produced and read from
the chair a copy of the committee's proceedings, which
had been sent or delivered to him by Mr. Wood. The
chairman having read that communication, and it appear-
ng to present the sum and substance of the whole affair, he
(Mr. Aikin) moved, "the communication of the Ferry
Committee having been read, resolved, that the Dock So-
licitor be instructed to confer with the Town-Clerk upon
the subject." Nothing could be more sa'•e or simple,
and it was also agreeable to the arrangement of the Town-
Clerk with the Ferry Committee. It was, however, with
some surprise and astonishment that he saw Mr. Nelson
Wood, who was his colleague, move that the subject
should not be entertained ; but at the request of the de-
puty-chairman Mr. Wood withdrew that motion, and his
(Mr. Aikin's) stood in its naked shape as he had given it,
seconded by Mr. Henderson. The chairman, however,
refused to put it, because he said he had not read any
communication from the Ferry Committee, and then he
argued that he was not to call that a communication
which he had just -read, unless it was signed by the
Town-Clerk and the Committee's Clerk. He (Mr. Akin)
urged that a communication made by the Chairman of
the Ferry Committee was made in the most formal man-
ner; but in order that that puerile difficulty might be got
over. he (Mr. Aikin) requested that Mr. Wood would
make the communication in such phrase and form as
would be consistent with the views of the Chairman of the
Dock Committee. He said, " I have already made a
communication," and as Mr. Wood could make no other
than that which had been made, Mr. Henderson with-
drew his seconding of his (Mr. Atkin's) very simple pro-
position. But even if the suggestions of the deputation
did not present any of the advantages which they did, he
contended that in common courtesy they were bound to
send a regular and proper reply ; but instead of so making
a reply, he (Mr. Aikin) found by the public papers that
the Chairman of the Ferry Committee had made some
verbal communication on the other side of the water, to
the effect that the Ferry Committee had no jurisdiction in
the matter—that it belonged to the Dock Committee.
He (Mr. Aikin) contended they had jurisdiction in the
matter, for it was their peculiar privilege and duty to do
everything in their power to facilitate the landing and em-
barking of passengers, and if that great object could be
accomplished by a more simple and less expensive mode
than the plan of the Dock Committee, it was their
bounden duty to entertain it. He meant to say this,
that the communication to the Dock Committee was made
in the most correct form that it could be made in, and
that it was got rid of in the childish and puerile way he
had described.

Mr. MANN stated there was no arrangement agreed to
in the Ferry Committee that the Town-clerk should seek
an interview with the Solicitor to the Dock Estate. It
was a suggestion to, but there was no adoption of it by
the Ferry Committee.

The TOWN-CLERK mentioned that it was proposed he
should see the Dock Solicitor, and he stated in answer to
it that the Dock Solicitor would not see him unless he
was so instructed by the Dock Committee.
Mr. MANN added that the Ferry Committee were not
agreed as to the desirableness of the Town clerk having
an interview with the Dock Solicitor.

Mr. Ai KiN.—Oh, clearly so.
The TOWN-CLERK.-It was proposed in the committee
I should see the Dock Solicitor and Mr. Mallaby. I said,
of course, Mr. Mallaby woulJ attend by order of the de-
putation, but Mr. Worthington would not unless in-
structed by the Dock Committee.
Mr. MANN said the deputation stated that the Birken-
head Commissioners would be satisfied with the ex-
clusive use of one stage, but would all the other parties
interested be satisfied with the use of only half a stage?
As to the obstruction to the navigation by the intended
stage, he was sure it would be as great from the three
stages as from the one, for they would take up quite as
much room ; whilst in the opinion of practical men, it
would be impossible to work them in the same length.
Vessels could not work between the landing stages and
the pier-head whilst there were steamers lying there at the
same time. He was of opinion, therefore, that upon the
merits of the case, the question would have been lost in
the Dock Committee.

Mr. MOORE said he felt it incumbent upon him to say
a few words on this question after the observations which
bad fallen from Mr. Aikin. The Council might suppose
from what had been stated, that every opposition had
been offered to this matter by the Dock Committee, and
more particularly by himself. He begged to say he would
not call it a perversion of facts—but it certainly was not
what he underitoed to be a correct narrative of what bad
taken place i❑ the mater—far from it. He ( Mr. Moore)
appealed to every member of the Dock Committee present,
who had been present on that occasion, whether what had
been said was a fair statement of the case or not. Mr.
Aikin bad alluded to some document put into his ( Mr.
Moore's) hand, as coming from the Council, and said he
( Mr Moore) refused to put a resolution in the Dock
Committee, because it referred to that document. He

did not refuse to put the resolution to the Committee
because he left the matter in the hands of the Committee
but he did suggest the impropriety of proposing such
a resolution referring to such a document, which
was not a document but merely a narrative of what
had taken place between !certain parties in the Ferry
Committee. The document was handed to him by
Mr. Nelson Wood, before the question was brought on,
in order that he might give any information to the
mittee. But it was no document. It a
In fact, it was no more than a mere n
had taken place, v 11.( h he (Mr. Moor ,
!nation of the Committee ; and, therefor
as every man would in his place, to put
stating the impropriety of the resolution so referring to a
memorandum as a document coming from that Council.
If this were to be done, where would it stop? It was,
indeed, nothing more than waste paper, and it belonged
to the gentleman who handed it to him, and he might
take it back, he said, if he pleased, on which Mr. Wood
said, " Please to hand me my parer." He took it, and
put it into his pocket. Then Mr Aikin made a statement.
from which different inferences might be drawn by different
parties, but it so happened he was totally at issue with
Mr. Mann and Mr. Wood, both members of the Ferry
Committee, as to the course that ought to he adopted ;
and as to any recommendation from the Ferry Com-
mittee for the two legal advis-rs tc
ment ever came before the D
deed, did the resolution of t
the Town-clerk was to st
subject. It was true that

n of what

' read for the infor-
" obiected,

Commit

esolution.

e. Nor, in-
ee atate that

ies on the Ferry

course was recommended L.
Committee, but there was no
There was not one word upon the „
tion. The Dock Committee, then, to(._
which was open to them in the matter. M.
entered into a history of the landing•stwe nc
gress, observing that it had been stated by the c
in a committee of the House of
would have the most efficient landing-5,..b
the Mersey, and that money would be no cons._
Mr. Cubitt bad designed one, which had had the app.,
bation of the Council, of the Lords Conservators, and of
the Admiralty ; and the Dock Committee could not meddle
to alter or deviate in any way from that stage, which had

tion t

Comma

t effect

MoOre then

in pro-

aintnittee,
that they

ge.ever seen on

ration

been so approved, without going
again. The Dock Committee determined ups
carrying out that which they had engaged to do
they were doing it now. But though they s-' '
not for us to take the initiative in any
changes which the Birkenhead Commis-
yet if they think it desirable that ar
made, they should communicate
mittee, and the Dock Comm'
it rests to carry out this
tend immediately to it wit
ever." To this Mr. Aikin
that. Why? Because they refused to
Moore) as Chairman of the Dock Coma
quence of the treatment they bad reg•-•
before. (A laugh.) In answer to that h.
word to say, which was that he had nevi
ionfs
pbencsti nseosms
e;
palnadn s t
ahta tt
hteh ()Du go
ch
kt hce
oy
mwme
irteteoen,
se ec;th
ce
gentlemen in his life upon any deputation or a.
the
Dock Committee received no answer to the invitation,
and they never came. Far be it from him to sand in the
way of anything being done to meet the wishes of the
Birkenhead Commissioners. But he did not look upon
the landing stage as not concerning them half so much as
the town of Liverpool: in making the best landing-stage
they were promoting the best interests of the town of
Liverpool; for by facilitating the landing of passengers, they
would be bringing all the residents on the c" •
river to spend their money here. With that
Dock Committee were carrying out what they consiu,
to be the best plan ; and they were determined to carry
out the Act of Parliament in the fullest and m
manner possible. But suppose tL
nitiative and propose to the Ferry Cu,
kenhead Commissioners to make a change in the landings
stage, and say,'` we shall save money by making three
stages instead of one"—whst posit,
when they went to Parliament tbis yeal
said money had never been a consider
that their only wish was to give the best accornmou.,
and to spare no expense ; and what position would they
be in if they went to parliament with such a proposition
as the present emanating from them ? (Hear 6^`

faithfully
nd

Iterations or
ra may wiah,

jib the Dock Com-

upon whom alone

would at-
ion what-

1 conse-
ved at his hands
had only one
r met those
fleeting
iced to

side the
view the

Ice the in-
r the Bir-

Won with them—
tion

Mr. AIKIN said as a charge bad been bia
him of haiing perverted facts, c
ment totally different to the fac
who made the charge to tell the
instance in which he had depart(
due to the Council that one of its met
charged to have it stated how, and a
perverted or misrepresented facts ?
either be substantiated or withdrawn.
Mr. MOORE said he was quite ready. He would ask
any member of the Council whether the version given by
Mr. Aikin of what had taken place in the Dock Com-
mittee left the impression upon their minds of what bad
actually taken place? Mr. Aikin stated that he (Mr.
Moore) had produced a document coming from the Town-
Clerk or the Council. That alone was an answer to him ;
for he (Mr. Moore) produced no such document, and he
accounted for it bystating it. had been put into his hands by
Mr. Nelson Wood. Nor had he charged Mr. Aikin with
perversion. He said he would not call his statement a
perversion, but that different inferences and impressions
had been made on his mind and would be made on the
minds of the Council by the real state of the case. Nor
had he refused to put the resolution ; but he had sub-
mitted to the Dock Committee the impropriety of putting
such a resolution as relating to a document which was no
document at all.
The MAYOR stated that this was a question for the
Dock Committee, and what passed there could not be
discussed on these proceedings. There was no document
mentioned in the Ferry Committee's proceedings as being
presented to them, but Mr. Wood and Mr. Aikin were
enjoined to bring the resolution before the Dock Com-
mittee as individual members.
Mr. MOORE observed that that made all the difference
between a document and waste paper.
Mr. HORNBY said this discussion was a complete waste
of time. Whether the Dock Committee had acted pro-
perly in refusing to have the motion made by Mr. Aikin
submitted to it, was not an affair of this Council, for the
Council had no power to interfere with the proceedings of
the Dock Committee, except when they were regularly
brought before it. His (Mr. Hornby's) individual opinion
was, that Mr. Aikin's motion was of no consequence
whatever, whether any communication had been made or
not. It was for the Dock Committee to entertain it or
not, as they pleased; and if he (Mr. Hornbv) had been a
member, he should have refused to entertain it himself,
not upon the grounds on which it was refused, but upon
the ground of the Birkenhead Commissioners having re-
uonenwceitohf
somethk
e Caeilrimngatnheoyf
manner, had a perfect right to refuse to lifdcl fteulniseteeDdrtotaociikiehdColotdomwamanriytdtcseoehmimimn.uenoAnicsialeytgi Committee treated in that
communica-
tion with the body so treating them. Whatever might
have been the conduct of the Chairman towards the Bir-
kenhead Commissioners, so long
the Dock Committee, that Committee,
that he was treated with proper respect.
had stated it would be unwise for the Dock Committee to
take the initiative in making alterations in the landing
stage, but it appeared to him that the initiative was now
taken by the parties who introduced the clause into the
bill, namely, the Birkenhead Commissioners ; and it was
desirable that as the Dock Committee we: e about to go to
Parliament, they should make some amicable
ment with the Commissioners.
Some further discussion followed, during which Mr.
MooRE again denied that he bad charged Mr. Aikin
with a perversion. The proceedings of the Ferry Com-
mittee were eventually confirmed.

it of having

against

ade a state-

ul:on those

It was

being so

n that member bad
The charge should

as he 'was Chairman of

ere bound to see

'he Chairman

rrange-

CORONER'S ACCOUNT

This account, amounting
to be paid. .

to £137 14s. 1(