The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1841-06-08 00:00:00

iained by you if you believed that episcopal ordination was

lot an institution of Christ

With regard to my

have no sympathy ei

sentiments I beg to say, that 1
with the peculiarities or the ten-

dencies of the Oxford Tracts

obscure the tr

church authority, the

y contain heresies which

and with respect

ggeratc the scripture view of an

ordained ministry and its powers, as to substitute the priest
and his ordinances for the Saviour and his grace.
On the other hand I could not be a consistent minister of
the christian church and believe that the jarring multitude of
sects with which this land is disgraced, have any claim to
the character of christian churches. Every Sabbath I pub-
licly declare my solemn belief that there is but " ONE Catho-
lic and Apostolic Church ;" the people unite with me in
" From all heresy and scuism, good Lord de-

praying,

liver us

I have not yet learned to despise the solemn admonition,
" I beseech you by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that
there be no divisions amongst you."—" Mark them that
cause divisions, and avoid them." I dare not forget that

" sects" are mentioned amongst the " works of tie flesh,"
and that " those who separate themselves" are denounced
as " sensual, having not the Spirit." My Bible has taught
me that the will of our blessed Lord is, " that they all may
he one as thou Father art in me, and I in thee"—that is one
in external operation, as well as in internal affection

same blessed word teaches me that there is ONE BODY as
well as one Spirit, and that to rend that body would be to
" divide Christ." That body is an external visible society
under one united government. " The body of Christ" the
church is that external society which is governed by the law-
ful ministry, God bath set sonic in the church, first
apostles," &c.... - . .

Men may call it illiberal or not, but I have too much re-
♦erence for God's word to shrink from stating his truth.
That there are many pious persons in England not in com-
munion with the church is true. With many of them I re-
loice to hold profitable intercourse. I number them amongst
my dear friends, and look forward to spending eternity with
them. But as I neither believe in Protestant nor papal in-
fallibility, I can reconcile this with the firm conviction that
such persons are living in sinful schism, in being united with
unscriptural sects. 1 believe they are like an esteemed
teacher of old, who, though " eloquent and mighty in the
scriptures," " instructed in the way of the Lord, fervent in
the Spirit, speaking and teaching diligently the things of the
Lord," yet needed an Aquila and Priscilla to " expound to
him the way of God more perfectly."

i in scripture is an assembiy of persons collected
id rul.cd over by a lawfully ordai

1 ministry.
From the.time_of the apostolic commission, in Mat. 28, 19,
all nations" are put under the apostles

Ld of time

.nd their successors, consequently there is no room fo.r other

bodies not governed by apostles.
The apostolate was not a temporary office, nor wzs it con-
fined to the twelve. By a reference to your Greek Testa-
ment, you will find that the office was delegated to others,
and intended to be permanent
" He gave son

:ostles, &c., till we all come to the mea-
sure of the stature of the fulness of Christ."—Eph. iv. 11,

Epaphrodit
ii. 25.

:us was the apostle of the Philippian church.—
Your messenger."—(Greek—Apostle.)

Silvanus and 'I

Timotliy:areexpressfy declared to be " Apos-
-1 Mess. i. 1.. and 2., 7.

ties of Christ

stleship in Ephesus

ice in Crete
ling presbyte

C care of

Titus ex-

to him was committed

ri every church,

" stoppiog the months of unruly and vain talkers." Having
thus the charge of the churches of Crete, it would obviously
be sinful for uny one to intrude into the office of the mi-
nistry unordained by him.

'There is not a single example of any other ordination or
mode of church government in the New Testament than
apostolical, or in modern phraseology episcopal. You will
in vain look for a presbyter ordaining his fellow presbyter.
The " presbytery" spoken of by the apostle, included the
apostles, as you will find by comparing 1 Tim. iv, 14, with
2 Tim. i, 6. Indeed the word is no where else used in scrip-
ture, but for the highest ecclesiastical court, including the

high priest.
A scriptural ministry must be threefold

Apostle or Angel In modern Bishop
Bishop or Presbyter {Priest
language.
Deacon Deacon.
If a layman cannot ordain a minister, apostolic succession
is essential to an ordained ministry. An ordained minister

must have received that ordination from other ordained
men, and those again from others, and so progressively up to

That the Church of England is a church of Christ you ad-
mit.

Scripture teaches that the church is one body; therefore
she is in this lend The Church of Christ. I call upon you,
Sir, to show me the other body which can claim to be a
christian church, with its scriptural ministry and scriptural
government.

The present question is nat one of doctrine,

)line. I beg again to repeat, that 1 do no
rethren in Christ, who, through

it is simply of

.christianize

false teaching, have

fallen into the sin of schism. Of some of them for zeal, for
and devotedness to the Lord's service, 1 shall
_ to be a humble imitator. But this shall never,
I trust, delude me into an approval of their sinful schism.
That He may speedily come who is to be the repairer of the
breach and the restorer of paths to dwell in ; and that in that
day we all may find mercy of Him, is, Sir, the earnest
prayer of your obedient servant,

JOSEPH BAYLEE

ROMISH CONTROVERSY

TO THE REVEREND DR. BUTLER

Sir.,—You have already stated, in your published lecture,
that you considered your coming to Liverpool " an excellent
opportunity to discuss the points of difference between you
and your Protestant friends."
In the same lecture you say, " I require, as a sine qua non
condition, that Mr. Baylee be competent to meet me in dis-
cussion, and also to answer my published lectures." Upon
that condition you declare that you will be " ever found ready
to discuss with hini the points controverted between (Roman)
Catholics and Protestants."
I hare now, Sir, publicly answered your lectures, and have
offered you an undeniable test of competency. That test I
beg again to repeat. lam willing to submit to a public ex-
amination by you on the following subjects, provided you
give me the same opportunity of publicly examining you :-
1. The English Bible.
2. The Hebrew Bible and Greek Testament.

3. The Gieek Septuagint, with its influence, and that of
the Hebrew language, on New Testament Greek.

4. The Latin Vulgate, and the influence of its phrases on
some modern errors. _ _ _ .

5. The Chaldee, Samaritan, and Syriac Versions, as found
in Walton's Polyglott.

6. The influence of the Jewish and Heathen Philosophy
on Christian Writings. _

7. The opinions of the principal ecclesiastical writers, and
the history of the Christian Church.
I write not this, Sir, in any vain-glorious boasting. I have
reluctantly offered this test upon the advice of valued clerical
brethren ; and I feel it right to say, that with regard to the
Samaritan and the Syriac, my own acquaintance with them
is, at present, but that of a student. It i►, however, sufficiently
deep to ascertain, that, in the remarks which you borrow
from others, they have misled you into a misquotation of
Bishop Walton and a mistranslation of the Syriac Testament.
When I offer such a test of competency you cannot plead my
unfitness for controversy. I therefore call upon you to re-
deem your pledge, and offer you three modes of discussion :

1. To DiFEID.YOUR owN PRINTED LECTURES

I am prepared to prove that you misstate Protestant doc-
trines, that you mistranlate Scripture, that you contradict
the Father's, that you contradict yourself, that you teach
heresies, that you degrade Christ to the rank of a created
angel, and that you violate the creed of Pope Pius.
If it would be inconvenient to you to bring these solemn
charges to a public test, I offer you a second mode of trying
the claims of the Church of Rome.
2. I am ready to prove
THAT A DECREE Or A GENERAL COUNCIL CONDEMNS
THE POPE AS A DEGRADED BISHOP;
and that
Romish priests exercising their ministry in this country
are intruders and schismatics.
3. Or, if you prefer the original terms proposed by me, I
am ready to prove
That the Church of Rome has 'apostatised from th• true
faith of Christ.
2. That Romish priests, exercising their ministry in this
country arc schismatics.
3. That the Church of England is the only branch of the
Catholic Church existing in England.
If you refuse to meet, not only Englishmen, but thinking
Irishmen also, will come to the conclusion that you know
that Romig) doctrines will not hear the light of God's
word, and will see the reason why " vicars apostolical" and
others prefer discussions, without an opponent, within the
walls of a Roman Chapel, to a fair, open discussion with a
competent clergyman.
Trusting that this correspondence may be directed by a
gracious God to the opening of the eyes of many now involved
in Papal and other darkness,
I am, Sir, your obedient Servant,
JOSEPH BAYLEE.
Parkfield, Woodside, June 7, 1841.

•m
IMMORAL PUBLICATIONS

TO THE EDITOR OF THE LIVERPOOL STANDARD,

in a Christian society, as I do, my mind has
oftentimes been shocked by the exhibition of immoral cheap
publications, such as the " Penny Satirist," and others of
the same class, calculated, in a very eminent degree, to de-
moralise the rising generation, and the lower order of society
generally. But what are our magistrates doing, not to put
an end to the sale of such things on the Lord's day ? I assure
you, Mr. Editor, that in my neighbourhood they are placed
in the window of a small shop on the Sabbath day as on every
day in the week. Now, sir, if this be.reform, my aunt says
the sooner we get quit of it the better, and she is doing all
she can to persuade her friends to vote for the conservatives
in the expected election, who, she says, will instantly put a
stop to such work. Perhaps you will let this go into your
paper on Tuesday, and oblige A CONSERVATIVE.
[We are glad to see that people identify conservatism with
an abhorrence of immorality. Our present incapables care
nothing about the profanation of the Sabbath, or the circula-
tion of the most abominable trash, provided that is only be-
spattered with a due proportion of abuse of the " tory aris-
tocracy," or of any interest which Englishmen, " as they
ought to be," hold dear.—ED. L. S.]

LIFE-BOATS ON BOARD STEAMERS

TO THE EDITOR OF THE LIVERPOOL STANDARD,
SIR.—I venture to suggest, through the medium of your
paper, the expedience of every. large vessel, especially steam-
ers, being furnished with a life-boat. In cases of wreck or
other emergency, it might be made available to the convey-
ance of a whole ship's company to shore, when all other
means of escape were cut off; and if even it should fail of
rescuing persons, it might prove serviceable in preserving
valuable documents, 4^c., and in putting an end to the ago-
nizing suspense of relations and friends, and the anxious spe-
culations of a sympathizing public, by informing them of the
situation of a vessel, and the expected destiny of the crew
and passengers.
I am not aware of any ship er steamer being thus provided.
I
f, however, my ignorance of nautical affairs misleads me, is
his respect, er there is any thing whieh risderi tiro wthrOlein

or n hint imprseticabls. ee of yrpir eorres/losldacte
will, perhaps, be good enc,iign to sail:if; n,c en these paints.
Should I, on the other hand, have been sufficiently fortunate
to originate an idea which may be improved upen, and be-
come useful in its results to humanity, I shall be truly grati-
• •, your obedient servant,
Bedford, June 4th, 1841. - R. P.

lied ; remaining, s

in many Meatless

II be glad to lea

that the praetioe

Our correspondent
which he recommends
sorted to. Several of the liners front this port to

for anything v. e know to the eon-

uwanely re-
New York,

carry out life-boats, and,
trary, the custom may be very general

is worthy of universaladoption.—

--......cb.

LORD SANDON AND MR. (

seggesti,

TO THE EDITOR OF THE LI

WELL

STANDARD

5111,—The appoachinv, general electioa out
upon the consideration of principles. What
that Lord Sandon and Mr. Creswell ou:ht

to put rasa

a argued

to be o-

turned again as the members for this

he is lord, and the otl-

e becaa's

because

arisen for reference to principles 1

a case has

the friends .f those

estimable gentlemen. On general print
purpose to treat of the matter of their ret

is:, therefore, I

with which I take the liberty of t

in the present

I shall, for the present, defer tile aonsiderartlOrn of Lori
Sandon's qualifications. That be is a lord is no objection at
all, with all deference to the dogmas which old Cal. Williams
is in the habit of setting up. His lordship possesses that to
which the addition of a title certainly gives more influence,
but which, without the title, would, in this country, make
the way to one. Never let it be forgotten, that the highest
ranks in our aristocracy—an aristocracy unequalled in for-
tune, intellect, and energy by any of any age or nation—are
open to all who possess the ambition, united with the neces.
sary activity, to enter upon the golden path. Lord Sanalon
is just such a man as would have achieved these honours ;
that he has been born to them is indeed " an accident of
fortune ;" but because he is the subject of such an accident
is no reason why he should not have a honest desire to serve
his constituents. These are only a very few suggestions which
I recommend to enter into a consideraticn of principles;
others which shall embrace a larger latitude I purpose, Mr.
Editor, to defer till a future number of your useful paper.
As to Mr. Cresswell, it seems that it is his misfortune to
be a lawyer. Until Lord Palmerston and Sir Joshua Walms-
ley were thought of as the members for Liverpool, people
were in the habit of deeming clients rather than lawyers
unhappy, and to condole with one with much more sincerity
than the other, when they were dismayed at the approach of

some impending calamity. it is of course nothing that Mr.
Cresswell has fought his way through a host of competitors,
whose talents need no praise, to a station which the majority
of our judges have not had the power to hold. It is of
course nothing that he is possessed of powers of uncommon
application, preventing him from having his attention dis-
tracted by any multiplicity of business, and a mind which
enables him to grasp the most comprehensive subjects in all
their details with a tenacity more than equal to all their
complexity. It is of course nothing that he is of invaluable
assistance to his noble, and I hope future colleague, in the
consideration of all legal matters appertaining to Liverpool.
It is of course nothing that' he is, almost without exception,
the most rising man of the day, for a comparatively young
one, and rapidly winning his way to the very highest offices
a subject can hold. It is of course ire

that he is mi.

nutely acquainted with the history, mann2rs, religion, and
interests, internal as well as external, of his country. All
these are as nothing, because Cresswell has had the
misfortune to be bred a lawyer, and to have become an emi-
nent lawyer, too. The fact is, that some lawyers of less
repute have had more to do in depreciating the merits et
the learned gentleman than most people are aware of. Pre.
bably, Mr. Editor, you will ned

;tand this allusion

As to lawyers having seats in parliament,-that question
has been long set at rest, and why Mr. Cresswell's opponents
should attempt to revive such exploded doctrines, I cannot
conceive, seeing that the world very generally had given
them credit for being what is culled "liberais." The sans
objection, with variations that an ingenious man would MA
no difficulty in making, might serve against corn dealers,
sharebrokers, railway speculators. and also speculators in
national offices, of which class, hitherto without an appro.
priate name, there is no lack in this country. The true
design of the objection is what is called "clap-trap," a term
that explains itself, and will be best understood by these who
make most use of it. The cry for a repeal of the corn-laws,
for an abolition of church rates, for the ruin of our West
Indian colonies, and many others prevalent at this moraeat,
each and all are a specimen of " clap-tra9."
I have thus ventured to suggest one or two general prin-
ciples for the consideration of your readers ; and trusting
they will not be without their influence,—l am, Sir, yours
most respectfully, PENSATORD.
7th June, 1841.

MIVEMSSII

PAUSIERSTONI.kNA

(For the Liverpool Standard.)

INTERCEPTED PROTOCIA

(No. 3.)

MY VERY DEAR KNIGET,—Whilst there it; nothing whisk

I, in conjunction with her majesty's gorernmeut, deprecate

more than the introduction of religions matters in pelitics,
yet I must confess that there is something important in Um

hint contained in your last despatch with reference to my
personal opinions upon the subject of religion ; or rather, as
to which are the best to be adopted as canvassing opinimut.
But I must drop the diplomatic tone. I would at ernee pro-
fess popery, as you recommend; but really I don't think
that the Romanists themselves care much about the wen,
provided they secure the measures which they require. Yon,
Sir Joshua, for instance, call yourself "a consistent thumb-
man ;" and does the most rampant Roman for a moment

doubt that you will advance the views of his church less
effectually than if you had kissed the pope's great toe fifty

times, or gone down on your knees in the kennel, before the
popish bishop, like that vagabond O'Connell, whom (between

verb says,

`needs must when the devil drives" ? It will, I

trust, be quite sufficient that I am a member of that govern-
ment which is willing to wink at the doings of the ribbon
conspiracy in Ireland, and patronizes the repeal agitation,
whilst we have declared ourselves ready to deal " heavy
blows and great sliscouragernents" upon the Church of Eng-
land. This, with the destruction levelled, by our anti-corn-
law measure, against the Irish landlords, ought surely to
satisfy old Mother Jezebel, as your M'Neile calls her, with-
out any conversion. I would make the sacrifice, however;
but I don't think there is much to be got by it !
I think the best canvassing topic for eject, will be the
cheap bread cry and my foreign policy—(which, you must
admit, has been surprisingly lucky)—if that confounded
Eliot don't put his foot in it again, and let those pig-tailed
Chinese get the windward side of him. That Lin, whe
bamboozled him about the opium, was rather a sharp fellow,
considering he bad not had the advantage of a regular diplo-
matic education, such as I can boast of; and this Yeshin

may be quite as slippery.
I have just received a letter from some of your local
" pathriots," as Dan calls them, whose name I don't at this
moment recollect, (but it had " secretary" at the sad of It,)
requesting to know precisely what amount the Treasury will
allow for " resurrections" and for " making safe." I don't
know what he means by "resurrections"—suppose it's some
contrivance of those artful dogs, " their riverences"-•-but
am quite acquainted with the meaning of "making safe."
I have been practised upon myself in this line. Whoever ks
is, the fellow must be a most egregious puppy—(yon knew
the meaning of the word " egregious," Sir Joshua, from the
derivation e grege—but, by the way, I remember, your
Latinity is not cultivated fully)—his secretaryship, however,
must be a great noodle to suppose that " OLro P,►se," as my
family call me, is to be caught in that way. No, no;
'• Litera scripta manet"—Latin again, confound it. I shall
refer him to you, Sir Knight. You are aware .what sum is
at my disposal, and must manage it as you think best. I
suppose the fellows think they are to have money by hods-
ful ! Between ourselves, Sir Joshua, secret service is pretty
well sweated already!
I don't think the Welsh would do yon much service in the
way of debating, for those stupid dogs, the reporters, couldn't
spell it. Bob Macauley tried some Hindoo one day, but it
wouldn't go down at all. A strain upon the Welsh harp
might perhaps cause a sensation at the drawing-room; belt

the House of Commons don't like Welsh, since Brummagem
Muntz introduced his goatlike physiognomy amongst us.
They say his beard furnished the model for Tassand's figure

of my old friend the Pasha ; but I scarcely believe it

I'm getting quite gossiping you see, and am in better spirits
than I was a few days ago. What peen geese be some of
these country squires—Handley and the rest of them !
Adieu, Sir Knight, Your faithful friend, and
PAls.
Downing-street, 3d Jane.

House of Cornering, IS pin

I open my despatch to communicate a caution upon tke
subject last alluded to above. That Frenchifieel fellow, Lir.
pent, has been making a precious bungle of it at Nottingham
—confound that place ! It 'll be the ruin of us yet. For
goodness' sake, Sir Joshua, do be careful in your tactics Is
THE BRIIIERT DEPARTMENT!

Thursday morning,

The overland mail is in, and that stupid Elliot has upset
all. Don't mention myforeign policy if you can avoid it
but what the deuce else can you mention, that will help me ?
We've blown up the Bogue Forts, you will see, and Aucklawd
has furnished us a flaming despatch from the " swot" de-
partment ; but it won't go down. Confusion upon that
China! "Tea and sugar" has upset our admix
We are in perfect desperation'

Yours, Ste

THE SAME TO TEE SAME

Downing-street, Saturday morning

Yaier deaoei RI rg

MY DEAR KNIGHT,—We've tried everything, sad yet
we're beat after all upon that unlucky motion of the baronet's.
Her Majesty's ball on Thursday night we thought would have
saved us this crowning blow. What's to be done ? We must
pass the bribery prevention bill before we dissolve ; Peel won't
let us shirk that : and what is to become of all our plans for
propping up our strength in the new parliament, I can't tell.
Oh—if some lucky " Rathcormac affair" would tura up :
But those confounded vagabonds of Dan O'Connell's think
of nothing now but shooting landlords ; and that kind of
pastime of theirs don't help us a bit. We've lost his high-
ness of Hanover too ; Etz was a capital Bard for electioneering
with, and we daren't try the " Oxford" business again. That
pretty " starling" of ours is comfortable enough in Badlans,
and may sing for lifetime his " can't get out," as plaintively
as Sterne's bird ; but he'll scarcely find another ready to
purchase " meat, drink, washing and lodging" at the saute
price. It's " all up" I'm afraid !
I can't tell you yet what Lord John will resolve upon.
He's taken time to think about it till Monday. 14 the mean.
time, look about you. The dissolution will tens
like
thunderclaP• v
—I4OIM•IDS LTLICeI *VD A Statrattgy-'I
is oar last chance. Oh that sonfonnded Charlenlet nod
his Chinese fumble!

Wande

part tam!!
which we

tain, and

Mr. Hal