The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1836-11-25 00:00:00

Nov. 25, is-36.

ra,..imitteach him in it. - Since then the' fashion had been to bring
Bibles to the ,chools_ ; and they all knew for what olw-ct it W s.
rh
e ce4ehratta; Mr. Locke was opposed- to using the as a
'cluail-haok: If they made so cheap the Word of Glad, they
it'i*:l,d:ced,itre,..:ante en- ectas ensued front making .oaths cheap,
Was glad goVernment bad interfered to take away-the
"sYs-
na.l°f "tbs. 'But a word about mutilation. Had the gentle-
men Education Committee brought something. into the
ti,('')l'oirris, and called it a Bible, and passed it off as such,
w
it 4; u d have been guilty of the moral turpitude, which the
• Mr. `Ghee- stands guilty of, and who would never
purify hiinll4lf as long 'as he lived. The Bible was never,
read hi the Church at 'all ; it was selections alone that
were read ; and, in certain instances, chapters were divided.
„a y Might call this a' mutilation. with as much propriety as
"”' called their selections a natitilation. They might as well
Say tiv,t the Jews mutilated the Bible—a book which was theirs
par excellence—a book by which they swore, whilst we only used
the New Testament. But they even did not encourage their
:A7)lg-hien to read the Bible till they were thirty years of age.
tttle time ilgo, there had been a gentlerrian,„a Rev. Mr.
,41e8, who had. omitted a certain part. of the lesson. in the
rel service, (a member, "No, no, his curate,") but, being
atnnunistied on this subject, he had made a public apology-'
',Ol he Was extremely sorry, and should never do so again.
Will Cie
tune he had met a very orthodox clergyman who had
'1(1 he thiinalit. it extremely inexcusable to take any liberties
rit,h the text', except in the passage—(here Mr. SMith quoted
chap.,22d verse.) He had rendered it " Every
ntie (hal:turned to the wall," but the word made use of was only
.aproper word in a proper
place. What would. he have said if
n. had come across such a passage as this, which he would read,'
te them ? (Cries or " No, no.") He begged their pardon, it
al., the Bible, and be would read it. , (Mr. S. then read several
e'sages picked out of the 23d chap. of Ezekiel, and Connected.
together as one verse.) if a man would shrink about the
/writer passage, what would he do about snch .a passage as this ?.
(Loud cries of " What part of Scripture?")
Mr. Councillor SMlTll.—Ezekiel.
'Mr. 'Councillor IttistfroN (rising and running, apparently
111 great excitement into the middle of the council.room,) re-
iterated a number of times, " Read your Bibles!"
his. Councillor SMITH continued.—ln regard to public
ovpeuintiuorne,tho say he could wish there was an opportunity of taking that
°Pinion ; and, if they did not precipitate the.decision, he would
such that Uefore that day six months they should have
an expression of public opinion as should settle the ques-
tion entirely, -whether the schools were to be abandoned or con-
tinued.. L:q them- not give up the, superintendence of these
schools. There' could not be any such good grounds for their
continuance as the voice of the Common Council iu their favour,
'rho were sent there by the pubiic ; and if they Aieunk from
that trut he thought they would be shrinking front their duty.
Mt-Councillor Hoes, as one 'somewhat acquainted 'With'
st,criPtural reading, denied that any such passage as that quoted
'",Y Mr. Setitli existed in the. Bible.

_ Alr. Councillor W. RUSHTON, running, as before, into the
nntldle of the council-roontiin great excitement, reiterated "It's
correct, I have no doubt ,if it."
I‘lr. Jas. HET WORTH said he felt constrained, from the ini-
tance of this subject nut to give a silent vote, but to express,
Ihqu;t}i very feebly, and. perhaps, its the opinion of some,- very
futilely, the sentiments which he entertained as to the must pro-
system. of religious education for the children of the poor.
;-te wished to divest the subject entirely of political associations.
;t‘had grieved.b.ina much, its the.course of the discussion, to find
that. polities had been so mixed up with it. Education, he
tiPughta was better freed front politics than associated with
to 1'",7!----(Plear., hear.) A good deal had been said with regard
the system
Clergy, as being politically-opposed to the schools, and to
system of educatiou• practised in those schools. Surely
R'utlenien might .be permitted to entertain a difference of
000puitt4itortiytounc,
thatl very important subject,—to feel and to express
reitard for the adVantage of the pourer classes of their fellow-
withont having their motives maligned and their
conductmise,onstrued. ( Ilear.) It was a very singular fact,
that only one clergyman of the EStablished Church seemed to
I:trott.ise the present system. It was noavery likely that all the
j"r'YelLiverpoolihould simultaneously be actuated by political
11 I`)tives, or unsound views of education, and it was singular that
Is one clergyman alone should be the advocate of that which
theY ' • toast cued the best. Without entering iutodetail he would
take the liberty to remark, that had he lived is hundred miles
'Pin Liverpool when the new systeM of education was intro-
'eed into the Corporation Schools, and elk the clergy— taking
into consideration the wide diversity of characters, and the
inane circurnstantials in whichahey differed, the many points
°,, doctrine on which they were not agreed—if he had been
told that they had simultaneously. deserted the system, and
,11e alone reinaiued behind to sustain the whole burden upon
hie_ single shoulders, he should certainly have concluded,
withcut much need of investigating into detail, that that one
eslergintati was wrong and the others right.--( Hear, hear.)
glad he judged otherwise, he must-have considered Mr. Asp-
hall to be something more than man. However unsupported be
alD,.ight. stand in the opinion, he maintained that the Bible was
Lae only standard book on which the religious and moral edu-
talion of any class could be safely 'founded. It was a book
Which ought to be used as a schol-book during school-hours;
and he believed, if this single concession were made, in rela-
!lnen to the Corporation Schools, it would be received as a beat-
ing measure, afrt the cominuuity at large would at once coalesce
and agree in the beneficial character of an education so admin-
istered; (Hear, hear.) Under the old Corporation the Bible
was, he believed, read as 'a .school book. What was the conse-
quence? That the Homan Catholfcs could not avail themsel-
ves of the benefits of the education so supplied. The Roman
Catholic children, therefore, did.not attend. Here a principle
of justice seemed involved. The funds, by virtue of which the
education-was communicated, had been contributed by the
Whole of the community,—Catholic as well as Protestant; and
it was thought only. fair and right that all who contributed to
those funds should, in their appropriation, derive a common be-
nefit from them; whether in the mode of education or any other.
But were Roman Catholic children debarred from attending?
(Yea, yes!) 13,y what law? By what rule? He supposed
their conscientious scruples prevented them. Was he right or
:long? (Cries- of " Right " Wrong!") If he was wrong
e wished to he corrected. If there existed any rule whereby
the Roman Catholic child was prohibited entering those schools,
he said it was an iniquitous rule. (Hear, hear.) He believed
he was kept out by the circumstance of his scrupulously and
coaticientiously believing it wrong to go into a school where the
whole Bible was read. (Hear, hear.) They had been at-
tempting te• rectify and to give a broader basis to
the education of the poor;—(Hear;)—and in order to con-
ciliate the Homan Catholic--to give him the opportunity of at-
tending those schools by removing the obstacle presented by his
Conicientious scruples— they had taken away the Bible. as a
school-book (luting school hours. (Cries of No! no!" and
I,` Y,",s yes !'') The Catholic had, in consequence, come in ;
'tut, what had the Piotestant children done—or rather the Pro-
testant parent on behalf of his children ? He- had said, " I
cannot permit my child to be taught in the schools, now that the
it-ible as a school-look, has been taken away ; and I cannot
conceive the:; the. whole necessary course of religious education
can be accomplished and fulfilled by Scripture extracts." The
natural all et lreen, that tlie Protestant children hail retired
tr ae those schools.: How stood the Council then? Could they
that their funds were apinslied to the general use? True, the
Protestant had excluded hunself, by not accommodating his
Principles to the rules. True, the Roman Catholic hadtloue the
same. They were in the very same dilemma still—just in the
dine Position la which they had been. (Hear, hear.) With
regard to Bible education, he thought, without any reference to
Politics, save those politics taught by the Scriptures themselves,
thEtt it was a very proper book for the purpose, and the only
aolid basis on which a religious education could be grounded or
'Promulgated. Reference had been made to Locke—L-a great
authority, he admitted ; he had been quoted as disapproving of
else familiar use of the Bible as a school-book. But what did
,Isocke say of the Bible ? He gave it this eminent character:
It has God for its author, it has truth, without mixture of
errorfor its matter—and it has the final and eternal salvation
o‘r man for its end." (Hear.) Now was this a true description?
was this a book to be *repudiated from their schools ? He
thought-nut. He did not see how they were to extricate them-
from their dilemma, without placing the Bible as a school-
"uls in their schools. If they did so he thought Protestant and
Catholic ought to be well satisfied. He was sorry to have trou-
61?d them even with his few remarks. He hoped be had not
liven effence to any. He could have wished the question ar-
geed without reference to Toryism or Liberalism, municipal re-
f nan or any other measure, but with a simple desire to consider
the,best mode of education to be adopted in the schools, and
with an earnest and anxious wish which they ought to feel for
.:11-riet ,f theer:alatioo of the temporal and eternal welfare of the chit-
poor, without any regard whatever to sect or party.
Hear.)
Mr, Councillor Borarom said there were two causes why they
could not, as conscientious parents, send their children to the
termer scheols; the one was, they were constrained to hear the
reading of the authorised version of the Scriptures; in the next
Place, they were instructed in the Church Catechism. He was
trot quite sure that they were expected also to attend church.
These, he thought, were satisfactory answers to the questions
Which bad been asked. They had also been told on a former
occasion of the uhttiutilated word of God. What was the pure
dad unadulterateda,wortl .of God :I That was the question.'
what were the Scriptures? The Scriptures were taken from
manuscripts of ancient date. ...The authorised text was derived
frosts their collation. •There were about this time about 150,000
versions of the Scriptures--essentially the same in substance—
h4l. Yarying everysone of them in small particulars. The Ca-
tholics had as ,much right to assume the Douay version to be
correct as we have the authorised version; and the manuscripts
°R which it is founded are, in the opinion of learned men, the
best authorised front which the Douay version is wade. He
uade. He
elated this fact—he entered into no particulars. It was
also ktiowe that many of the clergymen of the Church of En
land had felt a difficulty in the version we have, and had, by
their owii learning, produced many new versions, There was a
gentleman who had examined WOO manuscripts, and had
l'Oblished a new Version under the late Bishop of Oxford's
81.tetiOn. They knew that Archbishop Newcome and the cele-
brated Mr. Wakefield had done the saute. There was a differ-
or opinion on what was the version ; and therefore Catho-
sTs Were as much justified in their version as we were. It was
%so kuotvn that there was much question about the authenticity
;the Scriptures. Many bad denied the authenticity of the
,tnels and the Revelation ; and a gentleman of the Church of
ngland and others had contended that all the Scriptures were
contained in the. Gospels and in the Acts. The statement, then,
0) Passionsmutiled word of God, sled unworthy appeal to
nand rejudices of the peop Ha should pow se-
t...user-11 to a few observations of Mr. Bitch's. He confessed he
tiot prepared for so great a
.proposition as he had made.
h..nlYtt had done away with exclustveness in this schools.
.They
t.,7`. (hunted all parties. Formerly they were only admissible
wou,.?? part—a section—the
reproChrc of England party and he
sys"tlct say there was a peculia priety in introducing. this
etn, Which was called the Irish system. from the great num-
"er of Irish with which the town abounded. Mr. Birch had
why Protestant Dissenters did not go to these schools.
chtlY..elt had schools of their own, and he was glad to find that the
drn.l: P. of England were going to do what the dissenters had
ta,„ fifty years ago. The Irish were the poorest classes in the
N'', and-there was a greeter necessity for making ample pro-
_;,ll for the education of rank; and the people attending
.i,Le schools must he chiefly Catholics. (Hear, hear.)—
a„„Y shad also had much boasting of what the Church had
a„
cueue. They had done a laudable act, because it was
.( done with their own money. It was not like the appro.
le„"_, Win of the public monev—ot the corporation funds, for the
pulauenewonlent of the church. (Hear.) There was not a dissenting
worship in Liverpool which bad not expended two or
had (lines the money. He did not mean to disparage, but be
heard
it described as a wonderful act of munificence. But
ot pc
.t was, they were the wealthiest people in the town; and
sav, that, comparatively speaking, they had done
thstras
Pris.; )1 s
Mr Councillor Birch proposed to have schools on the
feral es tormerly practised. He was surprised at this. En-
Lt the teaching of the catechism, and going to church, was
system which a COS ect view of a fair and honourably
micas of the funds 01' the corporation would suggest ; 'rind
tieserefore lie was very much stasssised to hear him maintain it.
Chad been very mush (11,i ( tic think that the schoolsinlet
thsahanth I sillily P • Ithe '
tiii 'ne( ; st.l toei nv,e, entertained question that
o to was conic. A sufficient tiuie had not elapsed fur giv-
ssf4l°. sYstem a fair trial. The system of education in these
reu,.l.
on;
Wouldffinr gc 10).
S wag ct In e rill principle of justice - SlS-
in
which it looFstiper;s:ied vsgas"'freind-ad on injustice. anCi if
thr,„
rpiopltsseaalr:;it,. tie added cm the old in i eciple,
erectiun, awl such an tnjust uppli-