The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1836-06-14 00:00:00

MENTS.

Lord JOHN RUSSELL moved the order of the day for taking
into consideration the lords' amendments on the Irish municipal
reform bill. It was his wish on that occasion to avoid indulging
in any remarks calculated to excite exasperation on a subject
on which so much interest had been felt, but he could not consent
to barter away the privileges of that house, to diminish the
rights of his Majesty's subjects, or to impair the well known
principles of the constitution. They, (the House of Commons,)
in legislating on the Irish corporations, had sent up a bill to the
House of Lords, founded upon the principles adopted in legis-
lating for England and Scotland. The bill was returned to
them with its title altered, its preamble changed, and of 140
clauses, 106, in.substance, were omitted and others introduced
in their stead. Of the origival bill little was to be found in the
bill returned to that house. There were three courses which the
house could pursue—first, to reject the amendments of the lords
altogether, with the view of introducing a new bill—second, to
restore all the original parts, and reject the amendments—the
third, partially to disagree with the amendments, and restoring
the principle of the bill, but not insisting on it in its original
frame. There was a fourth course, which he could not mention
in connexion with those, as he not only would not adopt it him-
self, but he was certain there were few members who would,
were he disposed to propose it, assent to the adoption of the
lords' amendments as they stood. Were they to do so they
would surrender altogether their pi ivilege of deliberation, and,
instead of entering on the consideration of bills, at their differ-
ent readings, and going into their minute details in committee,
they would be content to say they would adopt any bill from the
lords, however totally altered it may be in title and nature, and
by one single vote dispose of all the great questions brought
under their consideration. They would thus at once surrender
their rights and privileges, and he should indeed be unmindful
of the character of that house, and its connexion and station
with the country, were he to propose so dangerous and humiliat-
ing a course. His lordship then proceeded to state the general
effect of the alterations, upon which he dwelt at considerable
length. In describing the course which he thought it advisable
to pursue, he said that he would venture to propose the substi-
tution of other enactments for those contained in parts of
the bill now before them, by which he hoped to be able to in-
duce the legislature to reinstate those clauses which it was
originally the intention of that house to embody, in their bill.
With this view, he should propose that the great towns, which
stood in schedules A and B, should be placed in a single sche-
dule. These towns were—Belfast, Cork, Dublin, Galway,
Kilkenny, Limerick, Waterford, Clonmel, Drogheda, London.
derry, in all eleven, including Carrickfergus. There was
another proposition he should make with that view—it was, that
it might not be advisable that the lesser towns in schedule C
should be placed out of the bill which was finally to be adopted
by the house. He had said that he never couldassent to such a
bill as that which had been brought down to them from the
House of Peers; but it was now rendered necessary that he
should propose some measure which was framed, not exactly in
the same way as the bill which they had, in the first instance,
sent to the other house, but which should effectuate the prin-
cipal objects which government had in view when they proposed
the bill originally. It would be necessary so to frame this bill
that it should secure some form of municipal government to all
towns of a certain size, and possessing corporate property.
Ile should propose that to these towns, to the number of 20,
should be applied to the provisions of the act of the 9th of Geo.
IV. in the first instance, and that they should be placed under
the management of commissioners intrusted with powers to
such an extent as should, as soon as they possessed commis-
sioners chosen in this instance by the £5 householders, possess
and enjoy the means of governing themselves. He should have
stated that the right of voting in the first class, or schedule A,
was to be conferred on inhabitant £lO householders. Thus
the second schedules would contain towns having not the right
to elect a mayor, and common council, but possessing the right
to elect commissioners under the 9th of Geo- IV., so as to regu-
late within themselves the watching, paving, and lighting of
these places, and the rates for the accomplishment of these
civic purposes. These commissioners, it might fairly be ex-
pected, since they were elected by the town population, would
have the confidence of that population, and would be naturally
anxious to promote the welfare and local interests of that com-
munity. In a third shedule he would suggest should be com-
prised certain towns whiso were comprised in the second section
of the former second schedule, such as Naas, 'foam, Wicklow.
The remaining ones in which it might so happen that they pos-
sessed better corporations, or the inhabitants were not disposed
to incur the expense of electing commissioners, such as had
been ereated under the 9th of George IV. in various places,
might either voluntarily undertake the election of such com-
missioners, or else appeal to parliament, stating that it was not
desirable to have a corporate form of government, in which
case the legislature would not object to abolish altogether those
municipal forms of government there as in the case of Belturbet
and other towns of that class. With respect to the other parts
of the bill it would not be necessary that he should detain their
attention with many details. The same alterations as to the
appointment of the quarter sessions, and of a recorder in the
towns, were introduced, still the spirit of the original bill of the
commons was preserved. It was the opinion of his Majesty's
ministers that the appointment of a recorder in those towns
should remain in the Crown ; so thought the lords in their bill,
and confirmed the principle by placing the nomination in the
Lord-Lieutenant in all towns which are counties. He thought
from what he had now said it was not necessary he should go
any further in pointing out the differences between the bill they
should send to the House of Lords for their approval. The
difference, it would be observed, was wide indeed. He was not,
in the alterations he should submit to the house, prepared to
adopt the principle of abolishing all these corporate authorities
as recommended, and destroying all those local governments;
nor was he for vesting the government of these places in com-
missioners appointed by the crown. The general reasons for
his refusing to adopt the changes suggested by the lord's amend-
ments, were principally founded upon constitutional strong
objections. They were framed not upon a principle recognized
by the law of England. On the discussion of the municipal
corporations bill for England, even the right hon. gentleman
opposite did not attempt to maintain that, bad as our old cor-
parations were, if they were not reformed, they ought to be
destroyed —(hear). In conclusion the noble lord, after moving
that the amendments be read a second time, said the first three
clauses were not of much importance, and they might be passed
over, and he should therefore move that the fourth clause in
the original bill be restored.
Sir WILLIAM FOLLETT in an eloquent speech urged on the
house the adoption of the lords' amendments. The bill could
only create so many normal schools of agitation, and agitation
was the greatest misery now besetting Ireland.
The debate was continued with great spirit until twelve
o'clock, when it was adjourned. At that hour the house was
also adjourned.

HOUSE OF LORDS-FRIDAY.
STAFFORD DISFRANCHISEMENT BILL.

On the motion of the Marquis of CLA N RICA RDE, counsel were
called to the bar of the house in support of this bill. After
some discussion as to the election upon which it was proposed
to rely upon for proof of general bribery and corruption, the
hearing of counsel was postponed to Wednesday.