Star.
London, England, 1819-02-03 00:00:00

mt. lidAs
.RL,r.v, having given a silent vote op
the former occasion, when the. Honourable Gentle-
man who had just left the House (Mr. Tierney) had
brought forward this question, thought it requisite
to explain the grounds of his present opinions re-
specting it. In the year 1313, there were three rea-
sons which operated to carry the restrictions:-Ist,
Foreign loans; 2d, The number of British travellers
who were spending their property in foreign coun-
tries ; 'and, lastly, The badness of the harvests.—
Pat now our armies have come home, our internal'
a!fairs are going on prosperously. 'What, then, are
'the causes which should continue the Restrictions?
Whenever the Bank resumes Cash Payments, the re-
venue must decrease; the House Should, tllercfore,
meet the means of guarding against the evil of a de-
falcation in the revenue; and in order to do this, it
appeared to him that some general system of taxa-
tion should be resorted to. One cause which should
prevent the immediate return to Cash Payments was
the consideration, was the Bank prepared to do so ?
There could not be any doubt that the Bank will be
;disposed to part with some of its gains, in order to
prbvide specie. It appeared to hiitt an mtwise mea-
sure to consent to pay small sums 4 but if the Bank
would pay in large sums, although the specie might
at first go abroad, it would in time return, and tile.
payment in 'specie would remedy itself. The Ilonourf,
'able Member next suggested the propriety of making
some great revision in the taxes by repealing the As-
sessed Taxes, and the House and Window Taxes,
which he estimated as amounting to about six millions,'
'and by substituting a tax which would affect the pro-
perty of the absentee, and of those who hoard up
wealth without distyibuting it fur purposes of gene-
. ral service. _

Mr. DERNAL (Member for Lincolu).said, he had
endeavoured to q ialify himself for the duties of that
Mouse, by bringing into it a small share of common
sense and a latter stock of independence—(Hear,
hear).—He was mn inclined to prejudice, nor had he
made up his mind.upon any coursewhen coming
into that - House-;-(Heer, -heir).—The , impression
which the'llight Honourable Gentleman's (Mr. Tier-
ney's) statement had made upon his mind, was not'
effaced by any thing which had fallen from the Ifo.
nourable Gentleman who sat down last, or the Nobie
Lord,- to whom he had paid the most serious atten;
tion. They had warned ns from taking a false step
in the apposed inquiry ; but it behoved us to be carer
fish that 'we were not; even now, making a hasty
_progress in these false steps—( Meer, hear,..4ear).—
The Noble -Lord had talked _much of " a legitimate
element," but he was at a loss to conceive the bean-
ing of these words. Theonly idea which he attached
to the term 'legitimacy, and which he should ever
advocate; was a legitimate metallic currency; not to
be annihilated, by a paper substitution, which, how-
ever we may dress np, waqted solidity, and owed all
its value to an association of ideal reality. The Right
Hon. Mover had been charged with an affected ob-
scurity in his statements, but in his mind, nothing
could be clearer, and he sought in vain among the
arguments of the Chancellor of the Exchequer a re-
futation of his statements.—(l-lear, hear.)—The Go.
verement did not really evince a willingness to go
into. the inquiry, though they professed .so mach in-
aerest in the result. He was of opinion that the
Honourable Member, by Lis Amendment, destroyed
the-original virtue'ef the proposition, and had so me-
tdiatiseci its terms as to destroy the effect. • He de-
ified that point of etiquette was the only matter of
issue; .for a Committee by ballot was such a one as
would satisfy Gentlemen entrusted with the dearest
iaterests of their constituents. He begged of the new:
Members not to be deceived by the shadow of a
Cornrdttte-;-Wear, hoer;)--and he would deem it an
abaadopinent of his duty if he did not support the
motion.of the Right Hon. •Gentleinan.---(llear.)
Mr.CANNlNG.—Although all the arguments on
the question now propounded for the decision- of the
House might be better postponed till the Report of
that Committee which it was proposed to appoint,
and although with this view he would now trespass
but a very short time on the patience of the House,
yet, he trusted, it would be felt that after the appeal
which the Right lionourable.Gentleman (Mr. Tier.
ney) had so civilly Made to him, he would
acting fairly by himself or by the House, if he did
not shortly state the grounds on which his vote would
be -given.- The question on which- the sense of thie
House was to betaken, seas not whether the restric-
tion ought to be continued an such grounds as were
matter of coalmen notoriety, or on such as each Mem-
ber might lay don for himself on the ialormation
and research into the subject . which his industri. ,
might afford. it was-not whether the restrictit
should be continued without .any:inquiry being
tuted under the direction of-the House; but, being
on all sides resolved that such aniaquiry,should
made, the only point at issue was, howthe inquiry:
should be made and how the Committee should be
ecistituted? After the speech of the Right Bonotir-
able Gentleman, whose motion was before. the House,
and after the course which the debate had taken, it
was impossible for any man who had considered this
great subject, however imperfectly, .not to NIS
thought what opinions he would take into the Cobb-
mittee, and to What result he would most fondly
wrid
anxiously look. For himself helod alt ays viewed
the Restriction in one -light. From the time when
it was first adopted, he. had considered it as a
great departure from the principles of our mone-
:ar) system ; and he had always looked with 'great
solicitude to the period when it could be removed.
He could assure the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite,
that he himself, and all those who sat beside him,
when they- last year proposed the further continuance
of the restriction for a limited period, they thought
they did so for the last time ; and up to a very late
period in the autumn, at least till the month of Oc-
tober, they saw nothing to make it necessary to ap-
ply t 3 Parliament for another renewal of it. Since
then, however, circumstances had arisen to produce
an honest and conscientious conviction, that a farther
renewal would be necessary. though they trusted but
for a very limited time,-a time so short as to make it
evident that a sincere belief was entertained that the
opening would take place at the time fixed in this'
further renewal. With this conviction, first, that it
would be impossible for the Rank to open atthe dme
now fixed by Act of Parliament; but withahe equally
strong conviction, that the winding up of those un-
foreseen circumstances which had made the coating?
ance necessary last yew., would soon remove
a!1 dife.
ficulty on that ecore.VLookieg'to as early a paticat

at the beginning of the year 1820, Governnititt meant '
to propose to Parliament that the restriction should
be continued till that time without any inquiry. And
here, to put the Hous? in possession of a complete
detail of all the circumstances which brought the
question to its present aspect, he must state that .
which his Right Hon. Friend (the Chancellor of the! i
Exchequer) and his Noble Friend (Lord Castlete:tgh) I
I
had omitted. The period to which Government at
first meant to propose the continuance of the restric- '
tion, was the Ist of January, 1820 ; then they fixed '
upon the month of March, as more desirable from .'
the probability that Parliament might then be sit- 1
ting ; and at the same time another intention was )
eatertained—_hat if next year any thing should I
occur to disappoint their expectatians, no farther 1
renewal should take place without themselves origi- '1
eating a proposal in Parliament for the fullest inquiry.
In this disposition the Session was opened. On the ;
very first night of the Session the Right llon. gen-
deman gave a notice, evidently with the view of an-
ticipating any notice from his Right Hon. Friend
(the Chancellor of the Exchequer) on the same sub,
ject. , But there was not on that account any dispo-
salon to change the intentions of Government. Next
*day however, a circumstance arose which had the effect
of inducing a change in their councils—namely, the
communication from the Bank. But instead of im-
puting this change to any subserviency on the part of
Government to any body 9£ men, let it only be con-
sidered in what a laew situation the Government was
placed by such a communication. In all the discus-
sions as to the removal or teoewal of the Restriction,
a constant admission had been emnlously and stn.-
diously made from both sides of the House, that
there was a disposition on the part of the ,Bank to
remain passive, in the hands of Parliament.. But how
different was it when the Government was given to
understand by the Bank, itself, that at the. period to.
which they proposed to limit the Restriction, it was
,not likely cheek could be removed. The Right Hon.
Gentleman taunted .his
,Bight , Hon. Friend for his
easy,• facile, and flexible concession to the Bank.—
,But how would the Right Hon. Gentleman have
tauntedihimr.if being in possession of such a corn-
imspication, he h;d, gone on .to propose the continu-
ance of the Restriction, without any proposal for
'that inquiry which was Ivislied by the_Bank itself. It
would have been dealing unfairly by the public and
Ilre,Bank, if after such a communication his
•Right
Honourable Friend had, on the one hand, persevered
in his course, or, on.the other hand, had changed it,
and concealed the motive. , In, such circumstances
his Majesty's. Ministers bad but one clear course to
pursue, to eualale them to meet all the taunt's of the
Right Flopourable Gentleman, namely, to bring be-
fore the public that fair and frank communication,
and say that it had induced them to change their in-
tended course. In stating thus the season which had
induced-Government to follow the course. they were
now pursuing; he had anticipated the question as to
the propriety of a Secret Committee. The change
was made in compliance with the express desire of
the Bank. If the affairs of the Bank were to be exa-
mined, the CoMmittee must be a secret one. With
that, must come the ballot, and on this the Right
Honourable Gentleman had revived the trite and
worn-out jokes ,about: balloting,- with which the old.
Parliament had been quite svearted,'but which it'we's
thought might be borne by a new one--:( LaulAter.)
In what did an appointment of a Committee &y bal-
lot differ from any other mode? • In one respect it
was better, because it gave Members an Opportunity'
of judging consecutively of the meritkof the various
Members proposed. For what purpose had ballots
been originally resorted to? Why, to destrOy in-
fluence—.(Hear, hear, bear.) He knew places where
ballots were resorted' to for this very purpose, and
whet e, if that mode of appointment were relinquished,
f. there would be no end to the complaints ofjelluence.
!Grant it, that they had no secrets with new 'Mem-
!bets : some would receive lists of Members for a
Committee from one side of the House, and some
from the other side. It had been the practice to
hand about lists on both sides of the House, and in
his younger days in the House it was constantly
so One. Then the young and inexperienced Mem.
'I hers, for whom the Right Honourable Gentleman
!had so much concern, (Laughter) might consider in
private, in their closets, if they pleased, and there,
'caliing if: ti'e aid of friends .as young and as tender
es themselves, they might staike out and insert in the
list such names as they pleased; and then, he would''
ask, when these lists, so corrected or altered, were
put into the glass, how was it to be known how
each Member, had niodifisd his list?—(Hear, /war.)
•Dat ha must telktlae
.young Members that they did
not yet know all the joke about balloting. There
Nees yet another' joke--a very old one, it was true ;
' hilt' still it isasaasie which bad very °free been tried,
and•whiclt nsighs be ventured on a new Parliament;
for, it was only-necessary for some Member on the
other side 'of the House to get one of the lists banded
aboet 9n this aide, and then, rising in his place, lie
is graVely to propound a question to the Speaker,
whether it be allowable to offer a wager in the
House ? and is only prevented by the answer of the
Speaker,-from wagering that he would read the
names
.ot,the C.Citnnuttee before the ballot for its ap-
pointment is begun, and: then very solemnly" he is to
read the list. 'Phis never fails to convulse the House.
The task generally falls on some Member on the se-'
cond bench on. the other side ; who that might be on '
this occasion he could not yet guess—(Lasieter.)—
Ilewould be sorry, however, if what he had now
said should have the effect of preventing the joke.—,
But without anticipating or trenching on the preroga-
tive of the Members to Whose lot the delivery of this!
piece of wit might fall, he would venture to state!
whom such a Committee ought. to contain. Such a'
Committee would,' in his'opinion, be ill formed if it;
did not compromise every Member, of whatever party,
to whom common fame would point es having turned
his attention to the study of the questioo. He would
consider such a Committee ill formed if it did not
include the Right Hon. Gentleman and such a pro-
portion of those Who sat around him, as would with
him feel that he was not unsupported; and also if it
did not contain a similar proportion of those on his!
(Mr. Canning's) side. of . the House, net. exceeding in I
number those on the other side; he Would say too,
that such a Committee was arconstituted, if in ad-
dition•te . such ss he had mentioned, it did not cone
%in a,uusnbetaoia impartial men 'unattached to either
-tv, - so that the proceedings of the, Committee
--at bee: contest of political. parties when it was

'4eished to he a search Mier political truth (gedr, be
For his own part, If he were to haee the honour or
being A Member. of this Cnmarittee. I c would -carry
into it a sincere desire to find, not the shortest but the -
safest mode of attaining the object they ha,l in view.
And here he must say, that he was glad that the
course was so far changed that an inquii y was now
to take place. Since the meeting of Parliament the
old controversies on this great question hal been re- •
vived. A new flight of pamphlets had lighted on. •
the town. In this state of things it was evident, that
.where a dispute On such.a subject was so warmly
carried on, it must be decided somewhere, and surely
no /Slue was so 'fit for the decision as this Houses In
some of the pamphlets 'whichhad appeared, he foutui
the doctrines and method of his old friend Cocker
maintained •and pursued with great vigour la others-
a very short and summary mode was proposed kr
attaining the end in view. Front the opposite et-
tiernes he recoiled with equal horrnr and repugnance..
But seeing these conflicting schemes proposed amt
canvassed, he was glad that a full, ample, ensile
wished he might add, impartial discussion Was to
take place, foe that he hoped would at length settle
the public mind.—(ilear, hear, hear.) The Right
Hon. Gentleman (:•Ir. Tierney) might t:erhaps re-
collect that he(Mr. Canning) had always been against
fixing a precise and limited pet iod beyond which the
Reetrietion should not in any case extend. And he
would nay, even now, that if his own mind was made
tip as to the nropriety of opening the Bank at ern
particular periodnyet, if he then'aund in mercantiie
men -A strong persuasion that the measure would be
'attended withinimieent danger, and a tendency from
that persuasion to create a danger which was only
apprehended, he would, under such circumstances,
rather defer than precipitate the measure. Froni that
difficulty, however, they -were at present relieved,
and he rejoiced in the appointment of the Committee.
In the course. of the debate the question had been
asked, how the exchanges operated against the re-
sumption of cash payments? To this it had been
answered, that the amount of the issues by the Bank
regulated the rate of exchange, and that if the issue!.
were diminished, the etcharge might turn in our fa-
vour. On this point, however, there were conflicting,
opinions. His own opinion certainly was, to dims-
nish the issues would have that effect ; but at what.
cost ?—(1-lear,hcer, hear). He did not start this with
the view of labouring the point ; but when, it was
' considered what effect such a diminution would pro-
duce on all the complicated concerns of the country,
he must confess he could not so easily see his way
through ail the difficulties that must occur. One
Honourable Member said that he would not hear the
Rank state their case to induce Parliement to pro-
long the Restrictioa. But it 'was not for this pur-
pose that the.inquiry was proposed. His Faaht 130.
nourable Friend had said that he changed his course
in consequence of the communicatimbirom the Bank.
The main consideration in this view was that the
Bank now gave its opinion, for. the first time iitfri
years. This was a new feature in the case. His
Right Honourable Friend then said he took the Bank
at their word, and would have an inquiry. This in-
quiry must be secrht—and why ? for the s.:ke of the
aank ? All its concerns must be inspected—all its
transactions with Government—all its preparations
for payhig'in specie—and were these At subjects for
an open inquiry ? Great fault had been found with
the partial experiment of opening the Bank 411816.
He himself had hailed it as a most wise and prudent
measure ; but, on a retrcespect,he thought differently.
Front the experi nice of that trial, itwas a planwhich
he would not adeihe should be attempted againne.
What had beta the result of the first attempt fe With-
out adding one grans of gold to the circulation of the
country, it had cog the Bank five millions and a
half. And yet eve:y bodyhtt the lime thought it a
wise measute. if cite Back erred in it, they erred
not only with ene sage, but with all mankind—and
no one was then more ready with his praise than the
Bight Hon. Gentleman. " Here is a fine Bank,"
said he, " that Las wisely and prudently began gee-
dually to resume its cash paernents, and thue leseea
the evils of a sudden change, both to itself and the
country." But when the result spewed that the ex-
periment failed, the Right Hon.-Gentleman turned
upon the Bank, and all the gratitude which he owed
to it was thrown of it--(Lair The two Com-
mittees—that proposed by the Right Hon. Gentleman
and the other by his Right ..Hon. Friend, were now
not only before' the new Members, but also befo:e
the House. In the former the affairs. of the Beek
could not.be examined ; in the latter, that examination
was a principal reason fur appointing the Commit-
tee. Between these two the House mite choose.
But in an inquiry relating to the resumption of cash
payments; he did not understand how the affairs of
the Bank7could be . left out of view. There was no
form, no style, no phraseology belonging to our lan-
guage which could enable the• Committee to avoid
Mentioning -the Bank in their Report. The Bank
must inevitably be its great thente. In the beginning,
the middle; and the end—in eve y sentence, the sank
must come in. How the Right' HonOurable gentle-
man would propose to get oventhis difficulty, he did
not understand; but his metion reminded him Of two
rival theatres in a country tonal, at which the only
play which could be Fr:hi-mei was Hamlet. At
length one of them, to !ileac tonic variety, annotmeed
this play with the attractive tar eelty of leaving out
the character of Hawk. This was oast the plan of
the Right Honourable Genatenan, Who called 'open
the House to vote for the plan of leevieg out the
principal character—(Laug/der, and loud cheering.)
Mr. MANNING said the Bank had proposed no-
thing with a view to their own interests. This was
a great national question. The Noble Lord truly
said that it involved considerations so great that the
Bank was but as a fly upon the wheel. The Right
Honourable Gentleman thin Tierney) said the Baek
had acted very foolishly in issuing gold in 161 S ;
hut it might be recollected that it was hailed as an
omen that the Bank were in earnest. They were 'a
earnest, and not only at that time, but clown to the
latest period which had been mentioned. But the
Right Honourable Gentleman said, that at the very
time when the five millions and a half of gold, were
issued, the Bank were so far from being in earnest,
that they had not diminished their paper issue..
The very contrary . was the fact, for the Bank lard
at that time diminished. their paper issues. The
issues of the Bank from January to June,. 1818,
were 27,954,000 and in the half year from July
to December, they were reduced to 2ei,487,000/.

.~~

---r
7 system ; and he had always looked with great this occasion he couid not yet guess—(Lasigerer.)— CLIC itugaiL • WSW .11.0“..,, Iko ,a . • •• .310 S. 4111.-1.4 Wirni , I 1
rcitude to the period when it could be removed. He would be sorry, however, if what he had now the House to vote for the plan of leaving out the •
could assure the Bight Hon. Gentleman opposite, said should have the effect of preventing the joke.— principal character—(Laughter, and loud cncerfng.)
st he himself, and all those who sat beside him, But without anticipating or trenching on the preroga- Mr. MANNING said the Bank had proposed no.
I
ten they last year proposed the further continuance tive of the Members to Whose lot the delivery of this thing with a view to their own interests. This was
the restriction for a limited period, they thought piece of wit might fall, he would venture to state a great national question. The Noble Lord truly
eT did so for the last time; .and up to a very late whom such a Committee ought.to contain. Such a said that it involved considerations so great that tile
Trod in the autumn, at least till the month of Oc- Committee would, in his opinion, be ill formed if it, Bank was but as a fly upon the wheel. The Right
ber, they saw nothing to make it necessary to ap- did not compromise every Member, of whatever party, Honourable Gentleman i,Mr. Tierney) said the Bark
yt3 Parliament for another renewal of it. Since to whom common fame would point as having turned had acted very foolishly in issuing gold in 1618 ;
1,1
en, however, circumstances had arisen to produce his attention to the study of the question. He would hut it might be recollected that it was hailed as an I ' i
honest and conscientious conviction, that a farther consider such a Committee ill formed if it did not omen that the Bank were in earnest. They were 'a
newal would be necessary. though they trusted but include the Right Hon. Gentleman and such a pro- earnest, and not only at that time, but down to the
r a very limited time,.a time so short as to make it portion of thoee 'who sat around him, as would with latest period which had been mentioned. But the
. . )
'ident that a sincere belief was entertained that the him feel that he was not unsupported; and also if it Right Honourable Gentleman said, that at the very
I
.iening would take place at the time fixed in this did not contain a similar proportion of those on his time when the five millions and a half of gold, sere
\ "1 et
irther renew. With this conviction, first, that It (Mr. Canning's) side. of the House, net, exceeding in issued, the Bank were so far from being
in teams:, 1 • :
w
unld be imporaible for the Bank to open: atthe time number those ou the other side; he would say too, that they had not diminished their paper issues.
nye fixed by Act of Parliament; but witletheegually that such a Committee was aconstituted, if in ad- The very contrary . was the fact, for the Bank had
Tong conviction, that the winding up of those un- dition•te . such as he had mentioned, it did not con-. at that time diminished their paper issues. The
weseen circumstances which had made the coning- Min a nuMber:o impartial men unattached to either issues of the Bank from January to June,. leis,
nee necessary last yew. would soon remove aft la. party, so that the proceedings of the, Committee were 27,954,0001. and in the half year from July
culty oil that ecore.Viadokieg'to as early a peti • • alight sot be•a: contest of political. parties when it was to December, they were reduced to 26,487,000/.
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