Star.
London, England, 1820-07-07 00:00:00

. .
•, who declared tt to be bis iotenton 'to Oen his
tdatent, the House divided—
Foe Earl Gases Amendeient
Against It - -

. --,st

•
The origin:lllroom was then carried, and elsi
House adjourned.
The
Home
weeHOoeUeepSEiedOeFotilCOeMqeMareOeNte
to five in balloda
for a Committee to consider the merits of the PetitilM
the return for the Ear& of Aberdeen.
The names of the Contritittee are as follow:
T. S. Rice, R. Price,i Williarn Rickford, X H. Trews*, R. P.
Scadamore, J. Carter C. Tulk, W. L. Mabaley, J. Inner, T
H. Cakraft, & C. Cocks, J. H. Blair, and J. P. 'Grant, Essirs.
Lord C. Fitzroy, and the Earl of dountcharles.
Lord RUSSELL postponed his motion for an Address
for shortening. the trait of imprisonment of &I M. Lopez, el;
Tuesday.
On the Motion of Lord DIOUNTCHARLES, Accouuti
were ordered of all Tuuber imported into Ireland Tor the last
ten years.
Mr. W. PARNELL brought in a Bill for ameWlng the Tani
with respect to the removal of the Irish Poor from kinglaed to
belatitis which was read the first time.
-MANUMISSION OF SLAVES.
Sir J. MACKINTOSH, adverting to the notice which he
bed given on this subject yesterday, thought it necessary, in or-
' dler to guard against the possibility of being misunderstood, to
I ante a little more plainly what his object was. The Motion then
related to the existence of certain Laws and Regulations in
his
Majesty's Colonies, with respect to the power of Masters to
Manumit Slaves—laws which were often in their operation crud
with respect to the Sloses--unjust to the Owners of them, as
well as injurious to the puce and order of the Colonies. His
object was to move an•Addrese to his Majesty, praying that he
would be pleased to signify to the Governors of the Colander to
recommend the gradual repeal of those laws by the respective
Legislatures. Ile should be sorry, indeed, to be thought carp
ble of entertaining a wish for the sudden emancipation of Slaw*
fur he thought it a measure that would be the most injurious to
the Slaves themselves.
Mr. BERN AL was rare that no one could think for an in-
stout of imputing to his Ilonout able and Learned Friend a pro-
ject which was not highly proper.
PARLIAMENTARY REFORM.
• Mr. HOBUOUSE presented a Petition from Major John
Cartwright, upon a subject of the deepest importance, name'.,
the Constitutional Reform of the Commons House of
menu In that period of the Session, and in consequence of the
nature of the objects upon which the House was engaged, he
' would not take up the time of the House by any detailed state-
ment; which would only be proper where it was intended to fol-
low them up by more distinct measures. The Petition referre
to the unconstitutional interference of the Peers of the Realm
* the Election of Members to serve in *ornament. From the
earliest times up to the present, statutes bad been made, among
*hick was that of Westminster, guarding from inch interference
k the choice of their Representatives by the People, and he
wissid remind the House of a Resolution passed at the cam.
Haencement of every Session—" It is a high infringement of the
liberties and privileges of the Commons, for any Lord of Par-
liament or any Lord Lieutenant of any County, to concern
themselvesi in the Election of Members of Parliament." in
1793, a Society, consisting of some of the first characters in the
country, represented in a Petition to that House, that 150 of the
Members were returned by means of the interference of Peers,
and this statement they were ready to verify upon oath. They
had shewn, that out of 154 Borough patrons, 71 were Peers.
This number was subsequently increased to 95, who returned
directly or indirectly Members to that House.
The Petition was read, and ordered to be printed.
MONARCHY OF SOUTH AMERICA.
Sir ROBERT WILSON seeing the Noble Lord (Castle.
reagh) in his place, wished to ask hint a question of considerable
importance to the mercantile and political interests of this coun-
try. He wished to know from the Noble, Lord, if Govern-
ment had received any official communication of a proposition
on the part of the French Govenunent,not only to recognize the
independence of South America, but to place a Member of the
House of Bourbon on the Throne which it was intended to ere:t
in that country?
Lord CASTLEREAGH said, that in the present state of the
information in the possession of Government, he should declice
answering the question of the Honourable Member.
THE QUEEN.
Mr. HOLFORD brought up the Report of the
Committee appointed to examine the Journals of the
House of Lords, in order to ascertain whether any
and what proceecings had taken place in that House
with respect to her Majesty, and to report their opi-
nion thereupon to the House. The Report set forth
the recent proceedings of their Lordships with re-
spect to her Majesty, and contained her Majesty's
Petition, the prayer of which was negatived by their
Lordships; and the Bill which had been brought in
against her Majesty, a copy of which had been or-
dered to be handed to her by the Deputy Usher of
the Black Rod.
Lord CASTLEREAGH then rose, in pursuance
of the notice which he had given last night, to more
to defer the order of to-morrow for the adjourned
debate upon the subject of the King's Message.
Though this motion did not stand first on the Orders,
yet he thought tbat he was entitled to bring forward
the matter of it under the head of another notice,
which stood first, namely, for a motion on the
Queen's Answer to the Resolution of the House, the
subject of which he would let fall to the ground. In
doing so, he thought it most convenient to recal the
attention of the House to the situation in which they

were placed.
Mr. TIERNEY thought he was justified in inter-
rupting the Noble Lord, for the purpose of asking..
did. the Noble Lord abandon his first notice? and it
so, he (Mr. Tierney) thought that the Noble Lord
was not warranted in skipping over the notice of his
Honourable Friend (Sir R. Ferguson) with respect to
the Milan Commission for the purpose of getting at
a notice which stood last in the orders ?
Lord CASTLEREAGH said, that he made the
exposition of the course he intended to pursue, last
night, more for the convenience of the House, than
with Lview to give any formal notice of a particular
proposition. He submitted to the Chair, that he was
at liberty to bring forward the subject of the last
notice, if it was contained in the first, in the same
manner as if the latter notice was not given at all.
The SPEAKER observed, that it was impossible
he could- give an opinion upon the subject. Tile
giving notices at all was mere courtesy. The terms
of the first notice, no doubt, were sufficiently etleral
to include any proposition with respect to the Queer'
but then the difficulty was, whether or not the Nob:e.
Lord, after having given two distinct notices c'
motions on the same subject, the one standing at the
head, the other at the bottom of the paper, was a:
liberty to couple the two together..
Mr. CANNING said, that the opposition to t.'
course proposed to be pursued,'arese from his Nob
Friend's unnecessary candour in giving an ex 1'
nation. Such a mode of taking advantage of a dis'
position to accothmodatioa, as that which he now
witnessed, was not calculated to produce a repetition
of those instances of candOur.
Mr. ABERCROMBIE admitted that the first notice
of the Noble Lord was sufficiently general to inclua
any proposition respecting her Majesty.
Lord CASTLEREAGH said) that nude, the 44'

currutinees he was perfectly content to alloVr the lion. undeestood by the House. The imputatiob +mini
Member to proceed with his motion. out against Ministers, by the Honourable Member,
MILAN COMMISSION. ; he (Lord Castlereagh) would leave to the consider-
Sir R. FERGUSSON rose, in pursuance of notice, ation of the House, to whom he would confidently
to bring under the consideration of the House the trust for a more favourable interpretation of the con-
subject of the Milan Commission, and in doing so, duct of Ministers throughout the whole of these pro-
be assured the House that nothing but a strong sense ' ceedings. He should therefore confide himself to the
of duty could induce him to overcome his reluctance simple motion before the House; not, however, be-
to undettake the task. His repugnance was increased cause he was desirous of withholding any inforina-
by the consciousness of his inability to do justice to tion from the House of which he was possessed.l
a subject so very important in every point of view, Whatever might be the suspicions of the Honourable
and pregnant with such serious consequences to the Member, either as to the mode or principle of that
Government of the country. Had Ministers pursued Tribunal of Inquiry, which he was pleased to call a
a different course from that which they had selected, Commission, he (Lord Castlereagh) would assure the
these discussions, so unhappy on every account, would House, that he never was engaged in a transaction,
never have taken place. Had they not sanctioned the circumstances of which he could publish with
'the omission of her Majesty's name from the Liturgy less reluctance than those of the present one. As
all woulci have been hushed. But they adopted a far as he knew those circumstances, he felt confi-
diffel et& conduct, fatally for the tranquillity of dent that they would bear the light—(Hear, hear).—
the country—(Hear, hear, hear).--Even after they But he was sure the House would consider that to
irad advised this unjust measure, it was in their be a most singular proposition, which called for cer-
power still to recal their acts, and recommend the taro information, at a time when proceedings ,were
restoration of her name to the public prayeis.-.- going forward,• which would inevitably involve the
This omission no one attempted to justify, with the exposure of that very information. Anything more
exception of a Right Honourable Gentleman oppo- subversive of the principles of justice, and so inju-
site (Mr. Canning) who had said, that the withdraw- rious to the impartial termination, of a judicial-course
erg her Majesty's name from the Liturgy, was a part of proceedings, was never exhibited in that House;
of a system which it had been thought proper to and he was certain, that to the understanding of the
adopt with respect to her Majesty. The Noble Lord Hon. Member himself, such must be the view of the
(Castlereagh), bad said, that unless her Majesty had proceeding. He (Lord Castlereagh) should there-
conic to England, no proceedings would have been fore prorose, as an amendment, the previous ques-
thought of against her—so that in fact, her crime don. He did not wish to wrap up the acts of Go-
y, as the setting her foot in England—(Hear, hear).— vernment in secrecy. But he was anxious to avert
The moment her Majesty had committed this crime, a proceeding which would only give to the House a
the Green Bag, with its odious charges, was brought premature and partial view of circumstances, the
down and laid on the table. But the feelings of the whole of which would come before them afterwards
House were so decisive against the entertaining of its in the regular time. He had no hesitation, however,
contents, that it was deemed expedient to aaandon in stating, at present, that the knowledge of the
the proposition for taking it into consideration. In facts which irnmediinely formed the ground of the
consequelice of this hostility, the Noble Lord, to use charges against her Majesty was not the result of
an expression of his own, " turned his back upon any gratuitous efforts, or fishing out by the Ministers.
himself," and said of his own motion, that it was On the contrary, the outline of these facts reached
" derogatory to the dignity of the Crown, and inju- Government from so many grave quarters, and offis
rious to the best interests of the country."—(Hear, cial sources—in short, they were of such notoriety,
hear)—llowever, it was reasonable that the Public that it was impossible for Ministers to resist giving
should be made acquainted with the source whence them the deepest consideration, unless it were este.
the documents were obtained upon which the charges blished, that they might shut their eyes to transac-
against her Majesty were founded. He (Sir R. ter- dons which deeply involved the honour of the Crown,
gusson) should therefore state to the House that, on account of the repugnance which they might feel
which perhaps was known to many by rumour, but in other respects, to entertain these serious and re-
'-hick he had reason to believe was entitled to credit.. pulsive transactions. Ministers could not have slept
Ile should be glad to hear the statement contra- upon the information, and they would have been
dieted, for there were many characters that stood wanting in their duty, if they failed to take tip the
implicated in it—(Hear, hear).—lt had been gene- matter as they had done. He would be prepared to
Tally it.l..lefst3od, that some time ago a certain' num- chew hereafter, that the departure of the individuals
her of perso.-.- from this country were employed to from this country, for the purpose of inquiry, which
go to Milan f r the purpose of obtaining information was erroneously called a Commission, for it had not
with respect to the Queen. He believed that the the seal, or any other of the appendages c-f a Corn-
credit of this invention was not due to Ministers, but mission, was proper. Assuming the proceeding to
to a Gentleman holding a high official situation in be proper, the next question for consideratim was,
the country ; in short, to throw away all unneces- as to the mode of executing the Commission.—
WI delicacy upon the subject, the Vice-Chancellor The Honourable Member would have an opportu-
was the individual who first proposed the Commis- nity hereafter of being convinced, that all the in-
sion—(Heer, -hear).—lf he (Sir R. Fergussan) was formation was not drawn from Italy. The Commis-
wrong in the imputation, he should toe happy to be sion, if so it was to be called, was instituted upon the
set tight, At all events, it was very well understood principle of uniting legal intelligence, industry, and
that this Gentleman took great pains to make him- skill, with a view to separate truth from falsehood,
self serviceable in the affair, and that he at length Nor was the Commission confined to Milan, but ex-
succeeded in finding out the project which had been tended to all Europe. He hoped he need not assure
since acted upon. The Vice-Chancellor etat pro- the Honourable Member of the indisposition, of Mi-
poled, as the head of the Commission, a Gentleman nisters to take any step that was not perfectly con-
-.Oro had practised with reputation at the same Bar sistent with the principles of British justice; and
v ids himself. The Commissioner, however, it was when the opportunity should arrive, he had no doubt
discovered, was ignorant of several of the languages of being able to prove that such an indisposition was
of Europe, an acquaintance with Which might have entertained and acted upon by Ministers. He would
been necessary to the purposes of the Commission, submit to the House, that it was impossible for Mi-
and therefore it was expedient to make use of the nisters, when facts and communications were flowing
aiterposition of an interpreter—(Hear, hear).— in upon them, to avoid instituting some proceeding,
Another Gentleman was then added to the Commis- which was calculated to satisfy, from its character,
t'on, whose name he did not know, nor did he care the minds of those most concerned in the result of
to know it—(A laugh).—This corps rfespiona,ge pro- the inquiry. The Honourable Member had spoken
ceeded to the discharge of their mission, and were of the Vice-Chancellor,_ and certainly there was no-
employed fior some time, when the great commander thing in the conduct of that Gentleman calculated
lia;sell, the Vice-Chancellor, thought it necessary to blemish his character. Certainly there was no
to look after his little army of observation! That ground of objection to his being employed in 1818,
Gentleman did assuredly go to Milan, and returned or before it, by Ns present Majesty, then Prince of
to this country on the 19th of December, 1818. With Wales; and certainly, in any event, he (Lord Castle-'
respect to the expense of the Commission, he under- reagh) was yet to learn, that there was anything in
stood that it was very great. Whether or not the the conduct of that distinguished lawyer, connected
tribunal under the Commission was open or secret with this transaction, inconsistent with his character.
be did not know, but he was convinced that the On the contrary, the interference of such an indivi-
existence of it was known to Ministers, and that it dual might well be considered as a pledge for the in-
was impossible it could go on without the knowledge tegrity and propriety of the proceeding in which-he
also of the Aust, ian Government. Again, he believed had engaged. The Vice-Chancellor had applied
he was correct in stating, that the Report of the to Mr. Cook to superintend the Commission. He
Commissioners was received by the .slinistets a year (Lord Castlereagh) had not the pleasure of knowing
ago. Here he begged to deny that the hostility this Gentleman; he saw him but once, but cer-
expressed against the whole proceeding, was merely tainly he never saw an individual better calculated
ex idle clamour, confined only to a few persons. to excite favourable. impression than this Gentle-
-It was no such thing. The outcry against it ex- man, by the respectability of his appearance, and
tended from the Land's End to the Or kney Islands. the gravity of his character !—(Loud laughter).—
The question was not whether or not the Queen was Certainly the Gentlemen opposite must admit, that it
guilty—but whether or not the highest subject in the would be highly improper to have sent a young Gen-
realm should have that justice which was not denied tleman upon such a mission, who might indeed have
to the meanest? Was this justice extended to her? been more enabled to get into secrets of that nature.
It was not. She was first unjustly treated by having He could not imagine a character more suited to the
her case pre-judged by the conduct of Government nature of the task, than that of the individual who
towards her; and next by the Bill, which, as it ap- had been employed. As to his ignorance of foreign
peared from the Report on the table, was brought languages, did not that fact convey an assurance
into the Lords. Returning again to the subject of that it was not intended that this Gentleman should
the expense of the Commission, he understood it arrive at his objects by the arts of insinuation. He
amounted to no less a sum than £33,000, of which (Lord Castlereagh) would assure the House in the
£ll,OOO were drawn during the first five months.— strongest manner, that no injunction—no caution
New he would engage for half this sum, employed had been omitted by the Government against receiv-
in buying up affidavits amongst some of the rascally ing, or being prejudiced by hearsay statements ; and
people of Italy, to blacken the character of every wo- he was sure that when the information came before
man in the country !—(Hear, hear). And it was upon the House, that there would not be a second opinion
thtse affidavits that a Queen's character was to be as to the sincerity with which Ministers had urged
b:asted!—(/car). In stating what he had so far their injunctions; and, above all, the impression that
stated, he had been actuated solely by a sense of duty, the individuals going out would derive any advan-
end havi:ig performed his painful task, he should tage from succeeding in making out matter of charge
tcntent hitriselt by moving— against her Majesty! He was satisfied, in short, that
" That an humble Address be presented to his Majesty, pray- as soon as the whole of the case was laid before
it; him to give directions to the proper Officer to lay before the
'louse Copies®, all Cummission or Commissions, Instruction or ,
them they would see reason to respect the principles
Instructions, which have been issued by his Majesty's COM- and the mode in whicy the proceeding was carried on.
tread, since the departure of her Majesty the Queen from this —He hoped he had sufficiently repelled all insinua-
Leedom, is the year 1814,f0r the purpose of taking depositions, dons against the character of Mr. Cook. He was unac-
tar otherwise makitig inquiry,. respecting her Majesty's conduct,
tegcther with the amount of all sums of money, and by *hem conapanied on his mission by a respectable Solicitor,l
with whom he (laird Castlereagh), was also ac-•
they were issued, to the same end."
Lord CAS'I'LEREItGH was sure the House would quainted. Upon the question of remuneration he
concur with him in thinking that it would be Only a could only say, that the Gentlemen engaged onehe
waste of time to enter into any detail of the circum- occasion had only received the incidental expenses.—
stances of the proceedings against her Majesty, as The whole detail of those expenses would be brought
undoubtedly an opportunity would arrive when such before the House in due time ; and it was only right
a detail would be made, and when alone it would be that as the Queen was to be allowed the expenses at-
weer to make it, with a view to its being completely tending the defence, that those Amid also be allowed

-,

• • • oici .ci. •14 1:i
`bought n or
.the impels& egra tog er. t
were allowed, if a Bill of this nature were suffered to
pass Into a lawi he contended that the tawi:oir
country would be totally subverted, and no man i
the kingdom would be safe—(clear): They had A
right to know who the author of this measure wa5....: •• .)
That individual was answerable to the House 14
another point of view, perhaps Ai important as those
hi had mentioned s—he was answer able as tht enemy'.
of the Sovereign ; for no man could tell what situa•
tibn the King must be placed in before the Bill passed:
Whatever Ministers might state, this was a mere prim
:rate charge: it was the King *anting to get rid of
the Queen—(Heal',hiar); Ministers knew there was
_ _
no

•. , •
ivikh were ereiteit liji rbcntirsg evidence td sfiistaia
the allegations of the charge against her Majesty.—
There was no mystery whatever in this kralisaction ;
the whole would be fully developed. He toeteeivei,
however, that the gallant Officer and the Gentlemen
on the other side, were disposed to give it.the lilt of
a- party question—(Hear, hear). 'They wished to
hurry his Majesty's Ministers into an inquiry on col.-
lateral points, before the principal question could be
well commenced. In fact it appetred that *the gal-
lant Officer was, as it were, anxious to drag then Into
it. Surely they ought, in decency and fairness* to
wait the result of the proceeding now pending in
the other House, before they put either himself or
his friends upon their trials—(Hear, hear, hear).—
If Government did then give the necessary explana-c
tions, thete might, perhaps, be some grounds for the
animadversions of Honourable Gentlemen opposite.
He must protest against the principle acted upon in
the present instance. Was it at a moment when a
solemn inquiry was pending respecting the conduct
of the Queen, that his Majesty's Ministers were to be
called upon for their defence, and placed, as he had
already observed, upon their trial ? • He sincerely
deprecated this mode of proceeding, as it necessarily
obliged him to give garbled and partial explanations,
in order to vindicate the characters of most respect-
ab!e individuals from foul imputation. He thought
he should best consult the disposition of the House,
not by voting in the negative on this motion, but by
moving the preyious question as an amendment. He,
trusted this would be a caution to Honourable Mem-
bers on the other side, and that they would not in
future suffer their zeal to get the better of their un-
derstanding—(Hear, hear). He hoped that the House
would not, by acting on the principles recommended
by the gallant Officer, permit the character of Parlia-
ment to be lowered. He claimed ne indemnity for
Ministers : all he desired was, that no accusations
should be made till the hour arrived for meeting them
fairly by an open explanation.
The question having been put from the Chair,
Mr.CR EEVEYsaid,notwithstanding he might incur
the displeasure of the Noble Lord, and notwithstand-
ing the protest and the warning the Noble Lord had
given to the House, would maintain that the propo-
sition of his gallant Friend was a perfectly just one,
and the time precisely that in which the motion
ought to have been made. His gallant Friend had
riot precipitated his motion ; he had delayed it till a
certain proceeding took place in the other House of
Parliament. So anomalous a course was, perhaps,
never pursued upon any former occasion. The queen
of this country was criminally proceeded against—
and how? By ,the introduction of a Bill, in which
she was called by the most infamous and scandalous
names. Neither her Majesty nor that House had any
information on the subject; and, under these circum-
stances, his gallant Friend said what he conceived to
be most proper—" Let me see the foundation of this
measure. if you make a charge of this nature, let
me see your infernal Milan Commission, or whatever
Commission it may be, on whose statement it is
founded." It was quite a novelty, a thing hitherto
unknown to the Constitution of this country, for the
King to authorize a Commission to hunt a object
with Lawyers, Attornies, and Spies, assisted by the
Emperor of Austria, through every part of Europe!
(Hear, hear!)—This, indeed,- was quite a novel system.
It was dangerous when any responsible servant of the
Crown was placed at the head of such a proceeding;
it was much more dangerous when a person like Mr.
Leach—he begged his pardon, he should have said
Sir John Leach—who was not a responsible servant
of the Crown, organized a system of espionage
against any individual of this country ; but it was
still worse when a person, placed in the situation of
Ithat Gentleman, inflamed the feelings of particular
persons, by stating to them things of a doubtful na-
ture, but which were calculated strongly to excite
their passions—(Hear, hear).—They had a right, he
contended, to have this Vice-Chancellor before them
—(A .laugh).,—He would maintain that he was a dis-
turber of the public peace of this country—(Hear,
hear, and Order).—He would shew how he was a
disturber of the public peace. In 1814, all the un-
happy differences between his Majesty and the Queen
were supposed to be settled : an arrangement with
respect to money matters took place; and his Ma-
jesty's Ministers negociated with her for leaving the
country. It was quite impossible that the Noble
Lord opposite, or the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr.
Canning), considering the feelings he had expressed
towards the Queen, emit( have again awakened those
differences which were thought- to have expired.—
Who then had done it? It was the Vice-Chancellor
who had kept alive the vindictive feelings of his
Majesty towards the Queen—(Cries of Order, order).
He was not out of order—he would contend that it
was the Vice-Chancellor who had kept alive the vin-
dictive passions of the King against the Queen !—.
(Hear, hear, and Order; order).—lf the feeling were
not vindictive, he did not know what the word "vin-

crime cognizable bq law, and therefcre they
sought to relieve him by Bill. He must then appear
as a private individual when he came to Parliament
for relief; and when he came before that House to
be released from his wife, he must come like all per-
sons applying for relief to a Court of Equity—with
clean hands !—(Order). He owed all this to Sir John
Leach—(Order, order), When a case of that nature
came before them, they must use the words of Jesui
Cultist when the woman was taken in adultery—,
" Let him that lath no sin cast the first stone !" It
Lwas, as he before observed, the Vice-Chancellor who
lrad placed the King in this situation. They were told
1 that there must be no recrimination in this case. He
knew that no such word was allowed in a Court of
Justice; but, as he had before stated, when his Majesty
applied to that House,he must come with clean hands.
The Bill declared her Majesty to be guilty of add.:
tery ; and when that measure came before the House,
it would be their duty to inquire, whether, when the
Princess of Brunswick, the cousin of his Majesty,
came to this country to espouse him, he was not him,
'self then living in adultery ?—(Order, order). Of this ,
he was sure, that the King had been placed in his
present situation by the officious adviser to whom be
had alluded. He saw the proceeding with pain and
regret from the beginning ; and when the Message
came down he warned the House of the situation in
which it would• place the country, because he was
certain that the course adopted on this occasion, that
of proceeding by Bill, would not only overturn the •
laws of the land, but would shake the steady, sober,
moral habits of the Peopll! (Hear, hear).-Lboking
Ito the case in every point of view, there was, in his
opinion, an absolute necessity for the production of
this Milan Commission, in order that they might
properly know the author of these Unfortunate tits
cunittances—( ( fear, hear).
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, but the
House did not divide, The previous question was
carried without a division.
HIS MAJESTY'S MESSAGE.
Lord CASTLEREAGH rose and said, that it
would be inconsistent with his feelings as-aprivate
individual, and his public duty, to suffer such ob-
servations as had been made to pass unnoticed. He
did not interrupt the Honourable Gentleman, but he
protested that no oneracquainted with the transaction
to which he had so alluded, could breathe a sugges-
tion of the kind the House had heard. Nothing.was
ever more foreign to the mind of an august Personage,
under all the painful circumstances in which be had
been placed (and never were those circumstances
more painful)—nothing was ever more opposite to
his mind than a vindictive spirit. The very reverse
was the temper which he had displayed. And he
stated it to his honour, that whatever sense he enter-
tained of the injury he had suffered, however much
his private feelings were aggrieved, he had cordially
lent himself to every effort that had been made to pro-
tect.the country from the evils of the inquiry which
had been forced upon it. That Personage had acted
throughout with the utmost forbearance ; and, if it
was to be sought whence the necessity for public die,
closure arose, it would be found not in him, but in the
nature of the case, and in her Majesty's resolution.—
The Nation, indeed, ought to be grateful to its So-
vereign for the disposition he had evinced. He would
add nothing more. The indications with which the
Honourable Gentleman's speech was marked- by the
House, conveyed its sense of it. more forcibly than
any animadversion he could use..—(Hear, hear!)—
The Noble Lord now went on to the Course of 00.
ceeding which it was proposed to adopt on the Order
of the Day for taking up the King's Message, in cona
sequence of the proceedings in the Upper Hewed
He took a review of what had been done since the
Message had been brought down, the Address in
consequence, and the postponements, to afford time
to effect a compromise, and avoid disclosure and
discussion, and the calamity which had fallen upon
them. By the Queen's answer, they were placed in
a new situation, and he had felt that it became him
to name a day on.which to lay the charges before
the House, subject to an understanding, that if any
proceedings were adopted in another place, they
, might think it advisable to alter their course.
thought it would be more consistent to give the lead
to the Lords to examine evidence on the Bill before it.
On these grounds, he conceived it would be better
that her Majesty should repel the charges where they
were instituted. • He had no better plan to offer, stud
theretore proposed to desist. The only question was;
what the House ought to do in accordance with'the
view they had taken of the question from the begin.:
;sing? It might perhaps be desirable to adopt rather
, a suspensive than a conclusive measure ; especially as
' they could not foresee what turn the discussions else=
where might take, and what it might be necessary
for them to do. He instanced several occurrences
which might be grtanids for wishing that the subject
had been left open—the Lords discontinuing on
grounds not satisfactory to the Commons—the House
wishing to take cognizance of the Bill, if sent down
to them, and the evidence—or the inclination. if it
failed, to eiamine into the conduct of Ministers, to
see how far their proceedings were justified. On
these grounds, he submitted that the Order of the
Day for the reconsideration of the Message might be
read, and postponed to the 15th of August; by which
time it might be supposed the Lords would have made
,sufficient progress to enable them to take up the ques.
don. If the House v.'as 'not sitting at the time, it
would become a lapsed order, and ;night be resumed
when they met. The Noble Lord moved a postpone-
ment accordingly.
Sir M. W. RiDLEY objected to the proposed course,
and thought it would be more equitable and just not
to keep any ulterior proceedings suspended over the '
bead of the accused in this House, when her case bad
,been fully brought to trial elsewhere. Alluding to
the preceding debate, he declared that he could not

dictive" meant—(Hear, hear).—Several years ago
the Queen was prosecuted ; she' left the country ;
after a long absence she came back, and now she
was prosecuted again. If this were not vindictive
he did not know what was. But now for the result
of this Commission. By the aid of his confederates
,--the Emperor of Austria, Italian spies, English
lawyers, and English money—he contrived to have
this bag filled and brought over. It was cleai, how-
ever; that it was not wanted : it had been in the pos-
session of the Ministers of the Crown for these twelve
months, and, they had never made any use of it.—
This shewed that they considered its contents as of
a private nature, and not as state evidence against
the Queen. If they thought otherwise, why did they
not prosecute her at, once ? Instead of doing, that,
'they negociated with her at St. Omer's and in this
country ; and it appeared on the Journals of the
House that the business was in fact a family difference.
But the Queen, it appeared, would not consent to the
propositions made to her. That was her crime at
present. Her first crime was having placed her foot
on the English shore, and her next, a determination
not to leave it. This Vice-Chancellor was again an-
swerable to the House for. his conduct on this point,
because they were called on to assist in the utter sub-
version cl the law of this country, and to adopt a
completely anomalous proceeding in consequence of
his conduct. Secret evidence had been taken by a Se-
cret CommisOon ; 'and, after twelve months had
elapsed, it was laid before the Lords, who, without
any examination of witnesses, had finally adopted
certain cherges against the Queen. A Bill was then

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