Star.
London, England, 1820-07-26 00:00:00

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.al, ‘66S, ,

ing, as woulsteerte be deter other potter the licen-
tious Press fromfollowing the example.
Lord CASTLE'REAGTI said, he enseeired there
could not exist two opinions as to the Disore of ph
publication which had been brought alider`their %at-
tention that evening ; and whatever observation he
might have to make to the House on the course he
thought ought to be pursued on the occasion, he
trusted no one would be induced to think that any
one felt rime indignation than he did, at the attempt i
which had been made to prejudice a case. at present'
pending in the ordinary course of justice—(Hear,
hear; hear). As to the publication in question being'
a libel no one could entertain a doubt; and tite only 1
circumstance for their consideration was, whether
any and what -proceedings should be taken by that'
House with respect to it; and whether that pointed
out by the Honourable and Learned Gentleman, was
the proper one? And he must here observe, that
because the House was about to rise,-which required

that immediate application, if any, should be made
to it on the subject, that there were no other means
• of dealing with it. He understood the case had ex-
cited the attention of the Attorney-General; but, if
in the conflict of libels, his Honourable and Learned
Friend should not have it in his power to put this
down. and even if the Attorney-General had not
thought proper to follow the individual in question,
he begged to remind the Honourable Member that j
there were other means fully adequate to meet the
case. He would not go into the nicety of the Ho-
nourable Gentleman's argument, that because the'
Bill pending in the other House might come down
to them, therefore that House was identified with the,
Lords in the proceeding. He wished fully to be aii-
derstood, as neither vindicating nor calling upon the
House to pass over this flagrant offence. But be
thought the Learned Gentleman, by taking this step,
had placed the House in a painful situation ; and he
must say, that he did think the Learned Member,
when he made up his mind to call for the interfet ence
of Parliament in this case, might have cast his eyes
round to see if there were not. other places equally
fit, and more convenient to take notice of it. He
thought, that if he was in the habit of reading the
ordinary Prints of the day, he might have found
more than one—or indeed, he would ask him to name
one day on which he had seen the Prints of this coun-
try, and had not fourd in them libels of as flagrant
a nature, and of as dangerous a moral tendency as
the one he had brought forward—(Hear). He could
not understand how the Ilonourable and Learned
Member could sit by and see the witnesses libelled
that were to be adduced in the present case—their
lives menaced, and mobs raised in the country by,
these writings, and yet be content to take up one, and
leave all the (Awls. The 11c:use should .act with
an even ha d; and he must protest against one inte-
reved pe s it being made the sole object of their plc).
tection, whilst the others were left unheeded, though j
equally requiring it. Even the Court itself was run
down, and the witnesses who were under its prolec-
tion were pointed out as fit objects for assassination !
He could have wished that this case, with the others
of a similar nature, had been left to be dealt with by
the Officers of the Crown and of her Majesty. He
could have wished that their labours for the Session
had been closed without their attention being called
to the disgusting spectacle of the Press of this coun-
try—one which was in such a state of baseness and
degradation, as was disgraceful to be tolerated in any j
civilized nation. If the Learned Gentleman, whose'
motion was before the House, had performed this
duty a little more diligently and equitably, he would
have fount, some of the Papers, libels of a more
direct nature than that he had brought forward. He
Teed not have used very extraordinary diligence to
have found the jurisprudence of Parliament attacked
in the grossest manner. Since this matter had been
before the llouse, he (Lord Castlereagh) had paid
more than ordinary attention to the su'sject ; and in
Inoceeding to point out to the House some of the
glaring instances of licentiousness which had occur-I
tcd in the courc of his examination, he should merely
premise by saying, that if Pat liament should think
proper to vindicate one patty, it was their ditty to
'vindicate all. He should not make any formal com-
plaint on that occasion, being •?nerelll desirous of
pointing out the deep wound which wits inflicted by
the licentiousness of the Press, anti which was one
lamentable proof of the disgrace which it had brought
on itself. The Noble Lord then quoted, from theist
number of the Examine, , the following passage :
" This is what a true House of Commons would have done ;
but when that House is for :Ise main part composed of venal
Boroughmongen, grasping I'iacom:li, greedy adventurers, and
aspiring title hunters —or the representatives of such wurtnits—
a body, in short, cot:tabu:l,- a far greater portion of P.:blic Cri-
minals than of Public Guardian,, what can be expected from it,
but—just what we have seta it SO readily perform?"
--As the Honourable and Learned Gentleman (Mr.
Wetherell) thought that that House, having searched
the Lords' Journals, became bound to protect that
House, he thought he might also extend his protec-
tion to the House of Commons. Upon looking a'
little farther he would find, so late as the 25th inst.
in a Paper called the Republican, die following gross
libel upon Parliament and the Sovereign, viz.
.4 We have very little hopes that the Divorce Bill will be
rej2cted in such a Parliament as the present, because we know,
and have seen, that they are sufficiently profligate and servile to
act against the clearest testimony of innocence and right. Still
this will matter nothing: the King and Parliament must wipe
off the disgrace which has so long hung about themselves before
they can disgrace the Queen in the public mind. 'lh more she
suffers, the more will she be endeared to the Nation. There
never was in England a Monarch more suspected and despised,
nor a Parliament more notoriously profligate than at present.—
Was it not that they hold the purse strings of the Nation, they
would be kicked out of allpuwer in a few hours, and fairly
swept out of the country. At present their doom is sealed, and
the herald approaching with it.
oat of the question: the Queen is to be tried by brtbed and par-
tial Judges, every man of whom is in some measure dependent
on ha persecutor, and the evidence against her will be paid for
in proportion to its strength. On all trials of this kind, gold is
a mast powerful evidence, and the Queen has no gold at her
command to support her. Innocence, courage, and honesty,
form for her the only. barrier against the influence of a million
of money, if a million could purchase her condemnation."
—ln this way was this august Tribunal handled.—
In another number, speaking on the same subject,
this Paper says :
" Thus it was with her Majesty's Counsel, they were conti- 1
Li:ally interrupted by one Lord Toespord or Spiritual or the
other, so that any adroit they could have made in the behalf of
her Majesty, was destroyed by the mock forms of this House
of Lords. It Is really nanseous to heat those old jades talking
about justice and purity, it is just as if the inmates of a brothel
should quarrel among themselves which was the most virtuous,
and compain of a departure from the paths of virtue and
morality.
0 The House of Lords, as men veteran in profligacy, has

bid what little seem of sbame-h might have possessed upon the
self, and is about to proceed, naked, and without further hesi-
tation. iire trejoice at it, beelines it is now about to inhibit is
mit in that aerator to the world whisk it has lately practised
• • . The oseaption of the Parkas asst will in future be
• • oily seets as thq arm at noon day, bet will be too glaring to
be clouded or ihided by any matter, however dame."
• " The eardrhas groaned under the curse of Monarchical Gs-
vantages much sno long. Civilisation has draggled against it
almost in vain; and Nature herself seemed almost to despair of
shaking it oft But the usonatabical form of government is like
every other vice, it will-destroy itsalt in the course of time, even
if no opposition be made to it. The vices of the English Monar-
chy are evidently precipitating it to a crisis and a downfaL"
The Noble Lord then read-an extract relating to
the conviction of Carlile, of too gross a character td
be here repeated.—=These passages, with which he
had troubled the House, would shew the lamentable
state to which the Press of our day was reduced. He
must remind the Honourable and Learned Gentle-
man, that Parliament was not confined'to the view
of the case Which. he bad taken ; it could not interfere
to protect her Majesty,,, without also extending its
protection to the witnesses, to the Judges, and to the
Court. If they Confined themselves to the insulated
case now brought before them, it would shew that
the House of Commons cared only for one ofthe in-
terests concerned ; that it did not care for the pro-
ceeding itself, nor for the Judges, nor for any other
party whose interests were equally involved....fle did
not intend to oppose the motion before the Rouse;
but if the House should adopt the-proposal of the
Learned Gentleman, he should certainly think it his
duty to follow up the prosecution of the publication
alluded to, by moving that a sweeping instruction
be. given to the Attorney-Gmeial4 to pursue the
Prints to which he had just called the attention of
the House. He did not mean, however, to infer that
the Attorney-General would nut have prosecuted, of
bis own accord, every one of those infamous libels;
but that House must shew that it directed its atten-
tion-'to the whole 'sphere of these offences. He t. usted
he had shewn as much disposition as any Member
could shew to condemn thedilsel in question, to which
he was not disposed to give the smallest counte-
nance. It was foralle.flonse to determine whether
it became them to order a prosecution for that libel;
but Wit did, he should feel it to be his duty to deliver,
in the other publications which he had cited, for the
same purpose.
Dr. LUSHINGTON said, that he felt it his duty
to state why he had not come before the House with
some specific complaint regarding this atrocious
paragraph. The paper in question had been put
into his hand some days ago by an Hon. Friend, who
had directed his attention to it—and lie had also re-
ceived information of it from other quarters. On
reading it, it excited such indignation in his mind,
that he determined to give it his most particular at-
trntion. But when he considered that the paper in
question was, in all prosability, an obscure country
paper, with little or no circulation, and that it would
be nothing to repress its malice unless that of a part
of the Metropolitan. Press was also checked, it ap-
peared to hint to be inconsistent with the dignity of
the Queen to take any notice oEthis Western Lumi-
nary. He recollected also, that when his Noble
Ftiend, the Member for Aylesbury (Lord Nugent),
had brought the Morning Post and the Courier
before the notice of the House (the first for stating
that the Queen ought to suffer, it mattered little whe-
ther as a criminal or a martyr; and the latter, for
inserting calumnies against her Majesty almost as
atrocious as that on which they were then debatirg),
little indignation appealed to be excited • within the
walls of that House. When he considered, too, tha-
these papers, as also others which generally sup-
ported the measures of Government, and which were
supposed to be, in a certain degree, under its in-
fluence, were suffered to go at large with every sne.
cies of libel in them which could disgrace her Ma-
jesty or injure her cause, it appeared of little conse-
quence to him whether the Western Luminary met
the punishment it deserved or not. Indeed, he
thought it better to let the writer of that paltry
paper, in his greedy anxiety after base lucre, die in
the oblivion to which his demerits were certain to
consign him, rather than to call him from it into
notoriety by a - efforts which he might make to
punish him. Had he, however, thought that, by at-
tacking that reptile, he could have silenced the ma-
lignity of other scribblers, he would boldly confess
that, unpleasant as it would have been to him, for
reasons which lie would afterwards state, to call
down the vengeance of the laws on the public Preis,
he certainly would have attacked him. His lion.
and Learned Friend had stated, that the offence of
that individual consisted in branding her Majesty
with criminality before she had been brought to trial.
He agreed with him fully upon that point; but had
her Majesty had no guilt imputed to her, no crimi-
nali,y alleged against her, without a trial and before
conviction, except in the public papers? Would she
now go to her trial in the same predicament and
under the same advantages with which any other
individual would go to it? No—slichad already
been treated by the Government as if she had been
convicted—she had been deprived, by its orders, of
all the honours due to her rank and sex—she had
been disgraced in every way which their ingenuity
could invent—they had erased her name from the
Liturgy—(Hear),— whilst her trill' was pending,
Without informing her what were the charges of
which she was accused, without telling her who
were the persons who took it upon themselves to
accuse her, without confronting her with those who
were said to be the witnesses of her shame, without
giving her an opportunity of refuting their testimohy,
and without permitting her to speak in her defence!
Under these circumstances be could not hap asking
the House what opinion they would have formed of
his judgment, if, after all that had thus occurred, he
had called upon the House not to take any notice
of The Post, The Courier, or even of Fly:stars
Western Luminary?—(Cheers). True it was, that her,
Majesty had been most shamefufly calumniated—
true it was, that her case had been most strangely
and unwarrantably prejudiced ; but it was not by anv
of the paltry publications of the day, but by those
who exercised a much more 'powerful and extensive
influence—(Cheers). Such was the view which he
bad taken of the subject, and such as it was, be had
submitted it to her Majesty, who fully concurred in
the propriety of it. With regard to the Press in ge-
neral, he had always considered that any attempt to
restrain it must be attended by great rnisclef.
Whenever he had beard accusations preferred against
it, he had always said, that subject as it was in its
licentiousness to do great harm, it was still always

stations,t i n g under
the to
productive of greater advantages ; and -that, when
once attempts were made to fetter it, there could be
no telling where those attempts might end ; for;
without a Ness entirely and absolutely free, it was
impossible that the liberties of this or any other coun-
try could long exist in 'safet,j'. Whilst he was thus
stating his opinion of the public Press, he felt it ne-
cessary to add, that he would not suffer such publi-
cations as those which the Noble Lord opposite had
read to then% tn.go•anpurrished. He would leave it,
however,
Mwaieshicth's.atLtaacwheOdffitocerthe a
ir c
do their duty in regard to them ; and would not leave
responsibilityo his
it to any individual who might think fit to prosecute
them without 'being under that responsibility which
they were, and without having the same means of
obtaining accurate information. Everything, how- 1,
ever, must be completely altered before her Majesty
should ever, by his advice, resort for protection to the
lower Courts, when she ought to be placed under
the protection of the highest—(Cheers). If Govern-
ment had protected her Majesty up to the time.of trial,
and bad not treated her as guilty until she had been
regularly proved so,the case would have been different.
He agreed with the Noble Lord as to the propriety
of protecting all the witnesses from insult, nn which-
ever side they might be; and could see nothing but
disgrace and infamy attaching to thesountry, if the
witnesses who came to it were to be in perpetual
danger of their lives, and were not allowed to give
their evidence free from any bias or embyrassment
whatsoever. He would take that opportdYsity of in-
forming the House and the Country that her Majesty
had not read any of the publica;ions alluded to by
the Noble Lord, and that she would not read any of
them, either before or during the trial. If the Law
Officers of the Crown were determined to fix upon
any publications of that class for prosecution, he
hoped that they would not be of that description
which had been selected two or three years ago. He
alluded to some prosecutions against the Morning
Chronicle and other Papers, in which so much doubt
existod as to the offence, that acquittals necessarily
followed. Prosecutions against the l'ressought never
to be instituted, except in extreme cases, and where
the obtaining of conviction was almost rendered a
moral certainty.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL observed, that he
could not avoid expressing some surprise that his
ilonourable and Learned Friend should have selected
this particular case for the animadversion of the
House. No opportunity had yet presented itse'f of
instituting a prosecution, or of putting in exercise the
powers which were entrusted to him. An ex qfficio
information could not be filed until the ensuing Term,
which would not comnience till November next. Ii:
had conceived that credit might be given to him for
not being disposed to overlook any of the positive
duties belonging to the office which he had the ho--
nour to hold. With relarence, however, to -the ob-
ject of the prosecution which was now recommended,
the House must be aware that the relief would come
rather tardily, inasmuch as it could not be had till
the month of November. He did not state this as
an excuse for his not proceeding against the author
of this scandalous publication, but merely to shew
that the proposed remedy must be of slow attain-
ment, and therefore in some degree inefficient. He
had filled the situation of Attorney-General only for
a short time; but during that period he had acted
upon the rule of never instituting a prosecution, ex-
cept when he was satisfied in his own mind that he
should be able to procure a conviction. By this rule
he had guided his official conduct, and in every pro-
secution which lie had commenced, he had obtained
a verdict. He took no credit to himself for this suc-
cess; and he believed that such was the -state. of the
Pres., so great the ma s of libels which inundated
the country, that if more prosecutions had been insti-
tuted, more convictions must have followed. The
Hon curable and Learned Gentleman (Dr. Liishing-
ton) had not confined himself to the question imme-
diately before the [Luise, but, as on some former oc-
ca ions, had reiterated various charges against his
Majesty's Government—charges which he (the At-
torney-General) conscientiously believed had not the
slightest foundation. The Honourable And Learned
Gentleman had said, that the Queen was treated as a
convicted person, and that she was not to expect re..
dress. This was a painful subject to expatiate on,
and he had already deprecated its introduction. He
could not but regard the present motion zs an at-
tempt to raise a prejudice against his Majesty's Go-
vernment, which was discharging a painful duty,
undertaken with deep reluctance. With regard to
the omission of her Majesty's name in the Liturgy,
he, for one, was prepared to say that it was perfectly
justifiable in point of law. If the Queen's name had
been inserted, after serious charges bad been pre-
ferred against her=charges supported_ by evidence
that could not be overlooked—the impropriety might
have been considered just as great ; and if it were said
that, by omitting her Majesty's name, condemnation
had been pronounced, with equal reason might it be
urged, thAt its insertion would have been to declare
that all the charges against her were groundless. If,
therefore, any disrespect had been shewn towards her
Majesty, it was to her conduct, and net to the inten-
tions of his Majesty's Ministers, that it ought to be
ascribed. The course pursued by the Honourable
and Learned Gentleman might be extremely proper
and becoming, as the Queen's advocate, but it did
not savour much of that judicial impartiality, which,
on such an occasion, ought to characterize a Member
of Parliament. It was incumbent on them all to
preserve their minds free from all bias on this dis-
tressing subject, and they were bound to act with the
utmost caution, before they lent themselves to any
popular outcry. They would at once prejudge the
case, if they were to lend the sanction of their autho-,
city to the numerous and sweeping calumnies whjch
were mow propagated in all directions. Although he
strongly disapproved of the libellous publication
which had been brought under their notice, he would
say, that, in point of virulence, it would bear no com-
parison with many. other publications, which, under
the mask of advocating the Queen's cause, had no
other end in view than to produce a revolution,—
He had himself seen placarded in the public streets, '
bills and paperWthe most infamous description, put
forth evidently- for the direct purpose of influencing
the due course of justice, and prejudging the merits
man (Mr. Wetherell) must, as.he appr ded, have
of the case. The Honourable and ' Gentle-
&zed
also 'seen theae placards, now posted up in every
quarter, and dEsigned to intirnidite, not only the

4.,
witnesses who Were to give evidence, but t!:e Jud, cs
who were to decide upon it. The lizeriticu,, ess'
the Press was carried .to such an extreme, it wei.t ,
far beyond all its former limits, that he feated Ca,
arm of the law Iva% scarcely strong enough io re.
press it. It was, towever, his duty to mAke tLe
tempt ; and be trusted that he should not be * ni.
dered remiss in its discharge, and that he should uat
be represented as having slept at his post, because :*
had not hitherto commenced proceedings in cases a
recent occurrence. Highly as he valved the tree it

of the Press, he was sure that no Iloitourasle ecru.
bet could look at these mischievous and co::tem:s.
tible productiotA without feeling that they ee-cwrisi
the severest animadversion. If, however, he act; !a
institute% prosecution iii e've'ry instance in which :!1,4-
proceeding would be justifiable, and would seen; to
be called tor, his whole time wcitild be occupied
the employment. With regard to the question inrtr
immediately before them, he was of opinion that the
publication complained of ought to be tithe,: with
legal punishment ; but he did not think the
able and Learned Mover had satisfactor ly rove,'
that it was a breach of the privileges of tbat
Mr. TIERNEY said, it was his intention to Cr;;iiite
himself strictly to the question, and to avoid rl,r et.
pression of any sentiment as to the me. its of that
im-
portant matter on which they might hereafter be
called upon judicially to determioe.• Ile certaiii:),
could not regard this as a breach of their privilegt.i,
and thought the argument in defence of that prop*,
sition a great deal too refined. It reste eiairely
their general knowledge that the House of L'rd, Pm!
commenced a Parliamentary proceeding w ith tek:-
ence to the conduct of her Maje,ty. This kticiw;e4te
they had not acquired by a solemn message, but, as
must be presumed, from an inspection of the Lords
Journals. By these it appearet, that the Lord,, for
reasons best known to themselves, had intioduced a
Bill for the Queen's degradation ; but it (ha nut ap.
pear that this Bill would certainly pass, or that it
would ever come before the House of Coon mous.—
The whole argument in support of the motioa
it for granted that the Bill would inevita,ily be seat
down to them, but he could join in no such pi esttrar-
tion. If the publication complained of was a b7e.tea
of privilege, it was a breach of the privileges of
other House, not of their own; and he must dec,.irl.
his idability to comprehend the overstrained leas° ;g
which would represent it otherwise. Whenes,
House directed the Attorney-General to prosecute, it
took upon itself an odious and invidious office, be.
cause it sent an individual to trial un.ier the heavy
disadvantage of an .opinion expressed by the
against him. He must repeat, that they lc,lew no-
thing of the proceedings in this case except from ti.e
Journals of the other House; and, on the fullest con.
sideration he could give to the subject, he was in-
clined to think that the wisest course would be to
withdraw the motion. -
Lord ARCHIBALD HAMILTON denied that
what had been said by his Hon. and Learned Frienit
(Dr. Lushington), in disparagement or condetnnatioa
of the proceedings of his Majesty's Ministers, was
tended to raise or inflame any public prejudice. it
was nothing more than a fair statement and reir...sen-
tation of their conduct. The Hon. and Learned Gen-
tleman (the Attorney General) was not, he thougl.t,
remarkably happy in his argument, that the inset-ma
of the Queen's dame in the Liturgy would have pre-
Vrented them from giving credit to the charges ag.tinst
her. Such a doctrine was fundamentally erronee::,,
and nothing was more certain than that an accmcd
person ought until conviction to be treated as in:in-
Deaf : but the offer of £50,000 a-year was a proceed-
ing quite as inconsistent with the present proseculion
as the insertion of the Queen's name in the Lituroy
could have been. It appeared, in the course of t'i:c
late negotiations, that the omission did not arise ot:t
of:the charges, and would not be affected by their ic-
es*. He admitted that many gross and malignant
libels had been published, but the authors seemed to
have caught the infection from his Majesty's Mini-
sters, and to have improved upon their example. In
the endeavours made to pervert the irritation cf the
public mind, his Majesty's Ministers had been most
ablecoadjutors. By the systentwhich they had adopted
they had armed one branch.:of the Royal Family
against the other, and made the triumph—if triumph
it could be called—of one branch consist in the other's
degradation. With regard to the libel in question, it
was so gross as to be beneath her Majesty's attentior.,
and calculated to be detrimental only to its author.
Mr. MAXWELL thought it would be a violation
Of the duty which they owed to the country, not to
take the most prompt course of punishing the author
of this wicked publication.
Mr. WETHERELL said, he inferred, from what
had fallen both from the Noble Lord and from the
Attorney-General, that it was the intention of the
latter to proceed against the authors of this scanda-
lous libel. If he were right in this understanding,
his object was answered ; but with reference to the
censure which had been passed upon him for select-
ing this particular, case, he did not think it indicated
a great deal of the Noble Lord's usual amenity. TLC
Noble Lord had called their attention to other pub-
lications directed against the Monarchy, and again-t
the religion of the country ; but his own Attorney-Gc-
neral had admitted that he had not seen those publi-
cations. He could not agree with the logic of the
Noble Lord, that he was acting in a partial manner
by bringing this question under consideration. It
was not his business to animadvert on every libel that
might be published, or to propose an inquiry irtn
every disturbance which might happen at Dover er
elsewhere; he was neither the shadow nor the fag tii
the Noble Lord, nor was he constantly engaged LI
hunting after libels. This occupation he left to clic
Attoeney-General, and was perfectly satisfied with
having obtained the general and unequivocal opirica
of the House that the publication of which he corn-
plained merited the severest animadversion.—Ti::
motion was then withdrawn.

Lord CASTLEREAGH gave notice that he should,
to-morrow, move the adjournment of the House 6:1
the 21st of August.
Mr. CALVERT gave notice of a Bill for nc:t
'Session, to regulate the Fees of the Court of Requests
in Southwark.
Mr. Alderman WOOD presented a Petition, signet
by G. EdmOnds, on behalf of a numerous Meetill4
at Birmingham, at which Meeting the Petitioner
acted at Chairman. He was aware that it cou:d
only be received as his Petition ; but as the langoyc
of it, though strong, was not disrespectful to t.;,2