Star.
London, England, 1803-04-05 00:00:00

editiLLIMENTART PituCE.LDIsGS.

HOUSE OF LORDS, MONDAY, APRIL 4.
The AT f OINILV Ott:rem. d hlr. ELSKINZ were heard
in toe C handos Peerage mule. The caufe wa, then ordered to
be further eonfidered to-morrow.

Severlt prWate Bala were brought up from the Commons.
an: read A firft tim-.

The Roman Catholic Teft Bill, the Woolwich Tru ft Bill,
and thc St. Giles's Burying Ground Bill were read a fecund Um*,
anti c,immitted fur to-morruw.

Mr BWNO brought up the PancrasWorkhoufe Bill from the
Commons, which was read a firft time.

THC MILITIA.

The Order of the Day being read for the Houle
to refolve itfelf into a Committee on the Bill for
enabling the Lords Lieutenants of Counties to in-
creafe the number of their Officers, and to accept
t .e fervices of perfons not qualified, &c. &c.; and,
sin the motion that the Houfe do now refulve into
the Paid Committee, _ _

Lord RONNE? rofe to exprefe his opinion on the
tendency of the prefent Bill, which he hoped the
Houle would indulge him in cluing, as he happen-
ed to be ahfent on the former lines of the dikut
lion. He was much concerned to obferve that the
original frame and fyllem of the Militia had ;sot
been adhered to. It was his with that its original
amount of men, and the principles upon which it
had been conftituted had never beendeparted from.
So late as the 'aft Sefton of Parliament, a Bill was
brought in by a Noble Relation of his, the pream-
ble of which (fated that it was effential to the Con-
flitution and the interefts of the country, that the.
Militia thould be officered by men of landed pro-
perty : where then was the continency of Parlia-
ment—where was the effential connexion of the
Militia, as formerly intlituted, with the Conflitu-
tion of the country, if the prefent Bill, as it now
flood, was permitted to pars into a law ? He was
a warns friend to the Militia as it was originally
inftituted : He could not endure to fee it converted
into a drill corps for the army : Such a degrada-
tion of it difgufted men of rank and fortune from
entering into it, or from taking a cordial interefl
in its welfare. In fhort: with the alterations which
were now made in its original principle and I'ol
tern, it mull be felt by thofe who were formerly
its bell fupporters, a teasing, vexatious, ungrate-
ful, and inglorious fervice. From the part which
lie had aged in the Militia, he could not be fuf-
peaed of any inclination to (peak difrefpeafully of
it ; but if the innovations now propofed to be made
in it, were to be followed up in the fame fpirit, he
fhould much rather, if other Noble Lords con-
curred with him in that opinion, move, or fupport
a Motion to the fame effea, that the Militia
Laws, as they originally flood, Ihould be repealed
altogether.
Marquis Towsts H IND obferved, that ash: might
be fuppofed to feel a parental folicitude for the
Militia, the Houfe he hoped, would allow him to
offer a few words in its fupport. Without a Militia,
wherevvere the means of our internal defence in
time nflwar ? In time of war the regular army
%%as on foreign fervice, or employed in the defence
of oar colonies. The Militia was therefore the con-
flitutlianal and domettie garrifon to which th-_,
country was to look for protection.
The Houfe having then refolvzd itfelf into a
Committee on the Bill, a flsort converfation en-
fued between Lords RADNOR, ROMNEY, and Ho.
BAIT, upon the wording of Come of the Claufes.
On the Claufe being moved to admit perfons un-
qualified to enter as Officers into the Militia,
Earl C AAAAAA on rofe, and oppofed it with great
warmth. The Clanfe went to (obvert the original
intlitution of the Militia ; it tended to take away
all diftinaion between it and the regular army—
its tendency would be, under the name of a Mili-
tia, to keep up in fall a (landing army, in defiance
of the Bill of Rights. But firong and infurmoun-
table as thefe objections mull be in the minds of
thofe Noble Lords who were attached to the Mi-
litia in its connitutional form and original frame,
yet to him they appeared to have but a fecondary
force, when he refleffed on the light in which the
Houfe mull be placed if their Lordlhips were in-
duced to affent to the prefent propofition. Parlia-
ment in its wifdom had but very lately fanaioned
the propriety, nay, the neceflity, of having men
of landed property, men who had a local and per-
manent iatere ft in a County, at the head of the
Militia of that County. What then would become
of the folemn pledge the Houle had given to the
Militia and the Public, if they were thus lightly,
inconfiderately, and precipitately to forego that
pledge, and adopt a meafure altogether inconfif-
tent with their former opinions, with opinions fo
recently pronounced and fo forcibly infilled upon ?
The Englifh Militia, if fuels a conflitutional force
was to be kept up, thould continue to have thofe
at its head who were moll interefted in the-defence
of the Country ; nor thould its fervices be called
for elfewbere, as had been done on a former occa-
Ann, not even to Ireland, as loch a change of its
d ninsition was wholly incnnfiftent with the inten-
tion of thole who entered into it in the expeelation
of remaining at home for the tole purpofe of inter-
nal defence.

His Rol•al Higlinefs the Duke of CVSIEFRLAND
was anxious to exist:A; his opinion of the Bill, if
he could ventute to do fo in ippolition to the
Noble Lords, to whom the Militia service was fo
much indebted Ile could not agree with them
that there was any thing unconflitutional in the
claitle to which they appeared to be much averfe;
did he imagine it to be tinconflitutional, he fhould
be among the molt forward to join in their
nppnlitinn ; but flit meaftire, in his way of view-
ing it, has no Inch tendency; it only propofed that
in cafe a fufficicnt number of officers could not be
found to El! up the vacancies in the militia of a
particular County, that gentlemen from the adja-
cent Counties might he invited to accept them—
and that fhould a fufficient number of that defcrip-
tion he not readily met ssith, that a choice might
be made from among the officers of the regular
at my. As far as the intention of the clank went,
is a. perfetlly in the fpirit of the ennflitution ;
an J .1, in cafe of a fuddea emergency like the pre-
fem, in times when the country was threatened
wit:: an hofile invafinn, Mould not every means
►e rein: -ed to Or organizing and flrengthea-
ini the r means of oar interns Je-

fence? No man could entertain greater refpeft for
the militia than he did: no man could more highly
value their patriotic ardour and martial fpirtt as
eminently evinced during the late war; but Cutely
it did nut derogate how that opinion to exprefs a
with that at a critivti junaure like the prefent, the
Militia might receive come addition of military
talent and experience from the regular army. As
to extending their ler vices to' Ireland, he could pot
look upon it as departing from the fpirit of their
in tlitution ; fince the union the two countries tbould
be looked upon only as one, and the Englifb
Ihould be emulous to protect Ireland, as the
Irith Militia &mid be eager to defend England,
whenever either fhould be attacked.
_ _ -

Lord RD/4NET thanked his Royal Highnefs for ,1
his good opinion of the Militia, but he muft till 1,
perfill in his objeCtions to the prefcnt Bill.
Lord RED f. s oat E thought the Noble Lords who
oppofed the Biil, confined their notions of the kr-
vice of the Militia on much too narrow a ground.
There was a diftiniftion which they wholly omitted
to make, which to him appeared an effential one,
viz. between the Militia as conflitined in time of
peace, and the Militia as appointed in time of
war. In time of peace it might be proper rigidly
to adhere to its original inftitution; but in time of I
war, and on fuddcn and great emergencies, there
rules could not be fa aridly adhered to—any de-
viation from them might be called for and jußified
by the imperious neceffity of the circumftances of '
the moment. As to the claufe being contrary to
the Bill of Rights, the Noble Lord (Carnarvon)
would recoiled that the Bill of Rights rerpeited a
time of peace, and not the exigencies of a war—
and
when the Noble Lords ferioufly confidered the
circurnftances in which the country was now
placed, they could not well help acknowledging
the propriety and neceffity of fome meafure fimilar
to that now propofed; fuch at leaf} was the light
in which he was induced to view it.
The Earl of WESTMORELAND entered into a va-
riety of arguments in fupport of the Bill.
Lord LIMERICK raw no reafon why the fervices
of the Englifh Militia fhould not be extended as
well to Ireland as to Scotland. They were both
equally integral parts of the United Empire, and
equally entitled to affiftance from this country.—
The arguments of thole who oppofed this princi-
ple, and who contended for the propriety of con-
fining the fervices of the Militia, would operate
with jolt as much force for the propofition of li-
miting their exertions to their rerpeCtire counties.
This might anfwer very well for a police, but
would form a very ineffeCtive army. After expa-
tiating for fume time on this point, the Noble Lord
called the attention of the Houle to the conic-
quences which refulted from the voluntary atten-
dance and altivity of the Englifh Militia in Ireland
during the late dillurbances—an aCtivity which
tended more than any other circumstance to at-
tach the people of that country to this, and to ren-
der the Union popular.
Lord RADNOR difapproved of any change in the
Militia fyftem which fhould produce a departure
from the original principles of the inftitution.
• The Duke of CUMBERLAND, in allufion to the
expreffion drafting, ufed by a Noble Lord in the
courfe of the debate, and applied to the Militia,
begged to obferve, that as the Militia-men, who
entered into the army, and went to Ireland, vo-
lunteered their fervices, the term dreig was not
properly applicable to the cafe.
Lord Caamaavor maintained, that in transfer-
ring the Englifh Militia to Ireland, the contra&
entered into with them at their enrolment was
broken—in his opinion molt unwifely, and fuch
he was much afraid it would be found, fhould we
have occalion for the fervices of the Militia, in re-
finance to a foreign enemy on our native foil--
The bond of local attachment was broken, and
the influence which heretofore arofe from the affec-
tion of the tenant-foldier to his landlord-officer was
completely diffolved. Such at leaf would be the
effeds of this Bill.

Lord Bot.row Rated, that its the capacity in
which he should have to execute the provifions of
this Bill, he would not feel himfelf juilified in re-
ceiving Officers of the line into the Militia, unlefs
in cafes when proper perfons qualified by property
could not be found.

The Marquis of SLIGO fupported the argument,
that the Militia of England fhould be occafionally
transferred to Ireland, and that no dillindion in
this refpe& fhould exill between the two countries.
He fincerely wi(hed that their interefls fhould be
in all cafes confidered the fame, and that their in-
Ititutions Mould be in every inllance affimilated.
If not, the Union would appear but on parchment.
He knew that an identity of interas and laws was
the general with in Ireland. It was the fentiment
expreffed by the Irith people fo far back as the
well-known meeting at Dungannon, and he was
perfuaded, that whatever the newfpapers might
lay, it was (Lill the prevailing opinion.
After Come farther convei cation, in which Lords
RosiNEY, PELHAM, HOAAP.T, and GRANTLEY took
a part, the feveral claufes were agreed to, the
Boole refumed, and the report was ordered Co be
received to-morrow.