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London, England, 1817-06-12 00:00:00

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THURSDAY, JUNE 12, 1817. PINCE SI:A/EY-PENCE. 1
1

PARLI 4 MEIVTART PROCEEDINGS.

forwarded to the Learned Gentleman who presented
it. He should wait to ascertain whether the Noble
Lord would accept of bi; suggestion.
I `fir FRANCIS riLlif DETT thought it neceseery
Ito ma's; o,me ohcervet ons, because acts cf arbitrary
i power were ie.-et? Lily ceeseieg in and augmenting
unnicerf, and at e_ time when there was nut tle
!shadow of a pretence fat .• ey departure from the es-
i retblidied laws of the realm. /.14: therefore hoped the
Noble Lord wnnl.i not alter his rnoika, or cease to
seek for inhumation on the actions of an Pedminis-
tration, assuming, a, he believe,!, an authority they
did not legally possess, even thl der the pnwers gietot4:d
by t!'e late Act ; and send:ir.r persons away to dls. -
taut prisons, to a:!gravate ail the evils of confinement.
He recollected, that when a minion similar to the
present was made ie the year 1757, the House did
not refuse a list of the names called for, though it w.ts
then urged, that if Ministers abused the authorite
vested in them, they would be liable to the p-nalty of
an impeaclimeht. However, when the Act expired,
a Bill of Indemnity passed, which :hewed ttiet the
Ministry had at least been acting culpably enooph to
require an indemnity—(Hear, barn,)—and mace
more se than the perms who bad been their victims.
Whatever pretences mii,ht be made about plots erd
conspiracies, there never was any reason for exclude:is,.
the unfortunate men who were now undergoing their
trial below, frnm all intercourse with the rest of the
world ; and the doing so was a gross violation of the
confidence the House had placed in Ministers, and
'hewed how necessary it was the House should be in-
tormed of the names of persons committed, in order
that they might know they were not entirely forgot-
, ten, and that there was still some protection for them.
The Right Hon. Gentleman had talked of the re-
sponsibility of Ministers, and of the burdens thrown
upon them, and the miff...rings of Gentlemen in office,
instead of reflecting on the sufferings of their 'victims,
while the Noble Secretary of State was perhaps at
the moment riding in the Park, though a notice of
this motion had been given a week since—(hear,
hear.)—After such a notice, and on a subject so im-
portant, his non.aiteedance was a great disrespect to
the House and a neglect of duty : but if the Noble
Lord had been present, he could not have given the
shadow of a reason why a list of the names required
stioulel be thus refused. It was the more hard, as
these unfortunate peione: world bees much debarred
of all legal remedy as those who were cenntieo ;a
the year 1797. But he hoped Mat the Heuse- would
net, without strong reasons, oppose the 'motion of the
Noble Lord. With respect to the ease cf Knight,
there was no torture equal to so!itary confineme:a.
If these men were innocent, and if the Secretary of
State, who ought to have no manner of concern with
the mode of a criminal's confinement, interfered and
directed the meek of it, which was done truly under
'the most despotic Govemments, this was 4:1 addi.
tional reason for persivieg to call for the names that
had been required, aid he hoped the House would
not allow Ministers to continue imprisoning indivi.
duals without a shadow of pretence for so doing.
Mr. CANNING said, the speech of the Noble
Lord, and t::at of the Hoeoerable Baronet, by far
the'greater part, alluded :n the confidence the House
WAS pleased to impose on the kaecutive Government,
or rather, to the great burthen that it had been pleased
to impose on them by the extraordinary powers which
Ithey were called nn to exert through the unparalleled
circumstances of the times. The Honourable Ba.
ronet had endeavoured to persuade the House to re-
pent of its decision. and to doubt whether it was not
worse than granting the power at all. Such suspi-
cions were calculated to give to the disaffected iiew
spirits and new courage it the present moment—a
moment more dangerous and alarming than any that
had yet arrived. Was it pretended not to be a mat-
ter of notoriety that this very day had brought to
the metropolis accounts of the perfection of those
very plans which these measures were intended to
frustrate and prevent ? At this very moment the
Noble Lord, if he persisted in his motion, as well as
the Honourable Baronet, would endeavour to per..
suede the House, that the power given to the Mi-
nisters to protect the Constitution was monstrotely
granted, and that the trust ought to be recalled, be.
cause it had been monstrously abused. Such insi-
nuations would give unjust countenance to suspicions,
for which there was no possible foundation. Thee
was no disposition to conceal from the House o,e
non set of the persons imprisened, the fact of the
plecce in which they were confined, or their agns.
If it were to form a ground of suspicion, w.ooe
would be the data that could be grunted to secure a
true and just return, aril a clear cemporis ..n wi..q
facts as they should be hereafter established ? Bin if
the names were given, it would tend to afford intelli-
gence to the disafic:ted at tiro country, through the
medium of that i-loe,!•, ;t: a .moment when partial
atte,as were still t,.leing pia e. He would
thenot
opnre....
mine to anticipate what eetilo be the report of the
ptr,eiotnCootmtihireitHueietvoar.t,:hoerf;.
josere
Ac:.ee isßint; oeas
the
ex,
Lion rni;lit erejudg: the report of the Committee, hi
....iiliout sayteg 'v `tat the decision %night
be,
we:ice:in reasons for attesting t in no
present state. i
it't h:.r' •?_
i-rt!, hoe ee:r. could not but think
utat the Noble bald was net aware of the extent of
consequences that night arise from the entertain-
'
stlhoento
tit such a motion, and the arguments by which
the lliter.urable Barone:. had supported it. Such art .
affirmation of this motion vertld teed to create an
addithinal number of deluded victims, and afrerd
encouragement to disalcction, which it most be stir
enaeirneus object of the douse to alley. He should
therefore most; as en amendment to leave out the
words is Names and descriptions," and to add, " An
account of the number ut petsens now in cianfire-
neeit, with their ages, and the (lacer where they are
1 coniined.".

HOUSE OP LORDS, JUNE It.

Comma were heard In continuation, and finally, respecting
the tipped Came of Johnstone v. Cheape, Wentyss, and others.
'Judgment postponed.
Counsel were In lihe manner heard nut in the Irish Appeal
at Ann Hamiltou widow, and others sr. Swansea, Ms
Eittleitor of R. P. :shinn, and the consideration of judgment
postponed.

•Tl,e Metropolis Paving Bin was returned from the Commons
►y Mr. M. A. r.TLOR and other., with the acquiescence of
that House to the Amendments made therein by their Lordship'.
Lard DUNDAS presented the Report of the Bill for repeali.,g
the Kent Coal Meters' Act, which was agreed to by the House,
and the Rill ordered to be read a third time to-morrow.
The LORD CHANCELLOR stated, that as the Court of
Chancery could not, from a particular circumstance, sit in Ps
usual place of bolding, in Westminster Hall, for a short time,
be should propose, that the House should sit to morrow, as well
as Friday, on judicial business, and that some future day should
be given from that part of its btuiness to the Court of Chancery
in lieu thereof.

The arrangement seeming to meet with perfect concurrence,
it was tacitly assented to by their lordship‘
'I hr Irish Saving Banks' Bill was brought up front the Com-
mons by Sir lons NewroaTt and the Newfoundland Marti Ages
Bin by Sir 'Asses GRAILIM siusl others, and were both severalty
read the first time.

Adjoutord (tor Judicial business toTen o'clock) till Tchmorro

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

The LARD MAYOR was sworn in, and took his seat. Ple
appearrd at the table in his robs), and was Introduced by Mr.
Your SONS', and Mr. CAtTellT.
_ _

Mr. BARCLAY moved for the revival of the Committee on
the Nips relative to the Commercial Docks in the Parish of kw
thethithe, which, after a few words from Sir LOW GRAHAM,
Mr. P. Moulin, and Mr. SHAW Ler tvaa, was agreed to.
General THORNTON brought up the Dill fur abolishing the
Flogging wt Female Offenders, which was read a first time, and
ordered to be read a second time on Tuesday next.
The West India 'J'rade kill was read a first time. To be read
a tecuod time to-morrow.

The Irish Baring Bunks' Bin was read a third time, and passed.
In a Committee on the Home-made Wines Acts, Mr. W.
SMITH made some observations on the necessity of reducing the
Licences. The Resolution fir suspending one-third of the limy
was agreed to.

Th; Report on the Irish Recognizance, Bill was brought up
and agreed to. The House wen: into a Cotnntlare on a ebtuse
recommended by the Report.
Mr. COURTENAY presented a Petition front the Merchants
and Dealers in Cape Wines, praying that the encouragement
of Importation may be continued. Read, and ordered to lie ou
the
In a Committee on the Suga: Banat/ ACie, a Duty of 424.
was agreed to on all Sugars Exported, being double-reined, and
not flayed.

t,RIS MESS OF STATE.

Lord FOLKSTONE said he rose to make a Mo-
tion nearly similar to the one he made on Thursday
last. It was for a return of the persons imprisoned
under the Acts of the present Session, which he con-
ceived it was highly necessary to'have, previous to
the agitation of the question for renewing the Sus-
ension of the Habeas Corpus Act. The Noble
Lord (Castlereagh) objected Last week to such ski
motion, as being inconvenient, by putting the tvo
Sterna* of State, as it were, on their trial, by di-
vulging *mists which ought to be concealed. This
was most-entraordinary; bet it mould net be urged

. . _
shin it would be dangerous to the persons confiriel,
however much it might be to Ministers. However,
the House having rejected his former proposition, it
was now in his power to put the motion in another
shape.. He should therefore move for a list of the
number and names of persons committed under the
late Suspension of the Act. If. the number should
be small, he should argue, that there was ne access ty
for the suspension. It large, he should argue that it
would be Improper to give such powers to Ministers
to suspend the liberties of a whole people, the country
being at the time, generally, in a state of tranquillity.
In the present instance, as far as his knowledge went,
there was no person of any rank or consequence in
society yet apprehended on charges of treasonable
practices. He bad applied to see a person in Reading
gaol, named Knight, but was refused ; and front
some letters which be had seen of this person, he
should rather !appose him a lunatic, and that bis
mind might be deranged by his distress. Of the
others, one was a journeyman cutler and the other a
journeyman tailor, whom the jailor described to him
as the most simple and inoffensive people he had ever
met with. They were in such distress that they had
not a farthing of money, nor even a change of linen,
and these were the dangerous persons on account of
whom the liberties of all the people were to be sus-
pended. He considered it to be a great aggravation
of their distresses to be removed for 200 codes from
the place where the accusation was laid against them,
which prevented them from corresponding with their
families. One of them sent a letter to his wife with
a petition on his case, and she was so poor that she
could not pay the postage and forw4rd the petition.
After some further observations, the Noble Lord
moved for a fist of all persons detained in Great Bri-
tain under the authority of an Act passed in the pre-
sent Session of Parliament, by warrants ficm the
Secretary of State or six Privy Councillors, including
their names, occupations, descriptions of their per-
sons, itc. &c. -on suspicion of conspirii.g against his
Majesty's Government.
1 Mr. H. ADDINGTON, in the absence of the
Noble Lord (Castlereagh) who was scarcely ever
from his seat, except when detained by ill health, or
bis official duties, would state his objections to the
modes; but hoped it would not be supposed that
they arose from any apprehension of inconvenience
arising to his Noble Relation, from performing his
arduous and responsible duties. The parts to which
b•alsoeld have no objection were, the number of per
sons who had been confined under warrants of the
Secretary of State, nor to their ages, and the places'
Alga confined. But he submitted whether it would
int be injuvioss to those persons, if their names were
io be returned and made public at the present time,
He would wait to know whether the Noble Lord
would shape his motion asccordingly, otherwise be
should move an amendment to this acct. He then
alluded to the petition sent by Knight. which wa.
.conveyed to the wife of the individual; but as the
postage came to 18s. she could not pay it. A copy,
however, having come to tbc Home Office, it was

Mr. PONSONBY wn.s a g,,nd deal surpre..l :t
what had passed. Toe F'glit item. Gerid?l7l4l '7...3:
surely feel no disposition to diCt;Uje LIII
t.nimirase di:offtztion : but wha:

IM hi:);r
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