The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1839-12-13 00:00:00

TOWN COUNCIL PROCEEDINGS.

- m—
. ..i The adjourned ineetn-`of' the Town Council was held on
Wednesday, in thaTown.hall. , JiistuA.WALMESLEY, Esq.,.
the Mayor, presided.
1.. z .
'ADF:R'''SIi7N OF WARDS.

The MAYOR' reportedAhat the following gentlemen had
been appointed by the. councillors aldermen of the several
wards :—Evetton, Joseph Hornby ; Scotland, Thos. Holt ;
Vauxhall, -Thomas Braley ; -St: Paul's, Wm. Purser Freme ;
Exchange, Robert Roskeil ;. Castle-street, Enoch Harvey ;
St. Peter's, Thomas Lcatborn ; Pitt-street,. Thomas Booth ;
Great George's, Richd. Sheil ; Rodney-street, Eyre Evans ;
Abercromby, .Thomas Brockhurst Barclay ; Lime-street,
William Earle ' • St. Anne-street, Robt. term ; West Derby,
James Moon; South Toxteth, Geo.. Holt ; North Toxteth,:
Christopher Hird Jones.
The MAyon then presented a memorial from certain in-
habitant's of Hill4treetland the-rieighbehrheed`(as a-couriter
petition to one presented at a previous meeting), stating that
Mr. Harrison's flour-mill in Hill-sireet was not a nuisance.
There were 128 signatures to the memorial.
The-MAYOR said that it was also his duty to announce to
the council that a very old servant of the corporation, Han-
nah, the sword=bearer, died on Tuesday at one o'clock.

• lIODNEY-STREET WARLI-7-THE DISPUTED SEAT.
The MAyoi said that the nest business on the summons
was that relative to Rodney-street ward; and as it was a legal
question, the Town-clerk would state to the Council the par-
ticulars.

The TOWN-CLERK said that he had deemed it to be his
duty to take the opinion of counsel, as to whether Mr. Law-
rence would be the member for Rodney-street ward, if the
Court of King's Bench should decide that Mr. Harvey was
disqualified. He had consequently submitted a case to Mr.
Starkie, Queen's counsel ; Mr. Wightinan, Queen's counsel,
and Mr. Crompton, assessor of the borough. The case be-
gan by stating various sections of the municipal act (sec. 37,
42, and 51), and also of the amended act (sec. 8 and 4.)
Then it went on to state that on the Ist of March, 1838, Mr.
Harvey was elected one of the revising assessors of the bo-
rough of Liverpool ;—that on the Bth, 9th, 11th, and 13th of
October, in the same year, Mr. HarVey held the court for
the revision of the burgess list,'with the Mayor and the other
revising assessor,• upon an understanding between the two
political parties, by which each had chosen an assessor with-
out contest ;—that on the 18th- of the same month Mr. liars
vey addressed a letter to .the Mayor and Council, resigning
his office, and requesting them duly to record and notify his
resignation ;—that on the 24th of the same month a Council
was held., when the letter notifying the resignation was react.
Then followed a copy of the bye-law, ordaining that the fine'
on a person not accepting the office of assessor should' be
£25, and that the fine on resigning should be the sane as for
not accepting. Then the case proceeded to state, that on the
25th of October Mr. HarVey paidthc fine of £25, and after
wards went on thus : .

About the month of May, 1838,' Mr: Harvey had been re-
quested by certain burgesses of Rodney-street Warc4 to be.;
come a candidate for that ward, at the election of the Ist of
November, in the same year, and consented to become so.
. On the 3d October (five days before the revision- court),
he published in the newspapers an address offering himself
as a candidate to the burgesses of Rodney-Ared Ward, and
.he immediately began to canvass the burgesses of the- said
ward.

• A
controversy arose as to his eligibility, both in the news-
papers which are daily published in the borongh, and in con-
versation with the burgesses. , The oneside contending that
Mr. Harvey could not legally revise the burgess-list and then
resign, and become a candidate for a ward, the burgess-list
of which he had revised ; and the other Party contending that
he had such right.
The facts of Mr. Harvey having held the'office of assessor,
of his having revised the burgess-list after he had offered
himself as a candidate for the office of councillor, and of his
having resigned the assessorship after revising the burgess-
list, were matters of notoriety in the borough.
At the election on the Ist November, 1838, Mr. Harvey
was returned the councillor of Rodney-street Ward, by a
majority of the burgesses of the ward.
There were only two candidates, Mr. Harvey and Henry
Lawrence, Esq. No notice was given by the party of Mr.
Lawrence to any of the voters for Mr. Harvey, that he was
disqualified, during the continuance of his office as revising
assessor, unless the discussion and notoriety already stated
could amount to such notice, or be equivalent thereto.
In the present Michaelmas Term (November, 1839), the
Court of Queen's Bench granted a rule absolute for an in-
formation in the nature of a quo ?currant°, against Mr. Har-
vey.

to copy of the shorthand writer's notes accompanies this
statement.]
On the 20th instant (November, 1839), a letter from Mr.
Harvey was laid before the council as follows :

[This letter has previously been inserted in the STANn4n.n.]
After having referred to several cases for the guidance 01
counsel, the case proceeded

It may be argued that eTery person must be presumed to
know the law, and in this case the facts were notorious. It
will therefore be for consideration whether formal notice was
necessary to make the votes for Mr. Harvey lost voles.
Supposing Mr. Harvey to suffer judgment, as it appears to
be his intention, it will be for consideration how far that
judgment would be conclusive to support the seat of Mr.
Lawrence ; if counsel should .be of opinion that if Mr:
Harvey was in law disqualified, Mr. Lawrence would stand
returned, notwithstanding the want of formal notice.
On the hearing, a point was made as to no acceptance of
the:resignation by the council appearing, but it is apprehended
the right to resign could not depend on whether the council
accepted the resignation or rejected it. The council in ex-
preSs terms did neither, properly avoiding any part of the
proceeding. Another point may be, whether as the new
office of revising assessor was created by the Ist Vict.
passed after the act, giving power to resign corporate offices
the office could be resigned ; but it is supposed the sth and
,6th Win. 4th, and the subsequent acts would be construed
altogether as one act.

You are requested to advise, whether (supposing judgment
of ouster on Mr. llarvey's default), the propercourse will be
to proceed to a new election or to consider Mr. Lawrence
elected..

And if a new election be the proper course, you are re•
quested to advise upon the following sections of 5 and 6 Wm
4th, .c. 76, and the amendment act.

Whether the election must be proceeded to within ten
days, or at the time of the annual election.
[We omit the sections referred to.] Then followed the
opinion of the counsel, which was in the following terms
We are of opinion that after judgment of ouster, Mr.
Harvey must be taken to have been disqualified ' • and, if so,
the only question is, whether the votes given for Mr. Harvey
were thrown away, so as to leave Mr. Lawience a majority
of legal votes ; and it seems to us, upon the whole, that
although in,. the...reported cases-upon the subject there b.
usually been an express notice of disqualification, although
no express notice ever be proved, it is sufficient to nullify his
vote ;—and, in thi present instance, we think that the cir-
cumstances would be sufficient to warrant a jury in finding
that the voters for Mr. Harvey had knowledge of circum-
stances which, according to the opinion of tbis Court of
Queen's Bench, are sufficient to disqualify him. We think,
therefore, that the proper course will be to consider Mr.
Lawrence duly elected.,
(Signed) T. STARK lE.
W. WI Mini AN.
CHARLES CROMPTON.
Inner Temple, Arm,. 29, 1839.
The TOWN-CLERK then proceeded to say that it was his
duty to advise the council to adopt the course recommended
in that opinion : and he might state that the return made by
the alderman and
.assessors of the vvartl,,on the occasion of
this election, was as follows :—At: the close of the poll, at
four o'clock,.for,Mr. Harvey, 274; for Mr. Lawrence, 265,
showing a majority, for the former, gentleman of 9. This was,
doubtless, in the nature of a return to the House of Com-
mons by the returning officer. The return of the borough
officer was similar to that, inasmuch as it is stated who was
the successful party—who was elected'. The return stated
the fact of there having been two candidates, and the numbers
polled by each ; and if the opinion of the counsel applied to
were to be considered as law by the council, that return of
the alderman and assessors was in fact a return of Mr.
were lost
'vboetecsa.usein maiulkawi4 the votes given to Mr. Harvey,
a return of the two contending
parties, the municipal return differed in this respect from the
parliamentary one, inasmuch us, in the latter case, the clerk
would have been ordered to attend with the return, and then
one name would have been obliterated and the other put in.
But this return of the alderman an assessor showed on the
face of it that Mr, Lawrence was the party duly elected.
Another duty ordinarily remained to be clone. A return of
the persons elected was to be published by the mayor not
later than two o'clock of the clay next but one succeeding the
election. This, bewever, related to boroughs not divided
into wards. The succeeding clause in the act, relating to
boroughs divided into wards, gave the alderman and assessors
the same power as the mayor had in boroughs not divided
into wards. This duty ought to be done within two days ;
if it could not, then as soon as possible. The not doing of
it, though it might be a ground of complaint against the
parties not doing it, could not invalidate the return when it
was made. Now, he apprehended .that the only act which
remained to be done was the publishing the election of Mr.
Lawrence. No act remained to be done by the alderman
and assessors. Their return,
.coupled with the opinion of
counsel, showed that Mr. Lawrence was the person elected.
Mr. EVANS, as alderman of the ward, moved that the
council should comply with the advice given by the Town-
clerk. Mr Lawrence, in all probability, would have the
right to assume the seat after a certain time, but he could
not do so without the acquiescence of the council.. He (Mr.
Evans) therefore moved that the council, in as far as it de-
pended upon them, should declare Mr. Lawrence one of the
representatives of Rodney-street Ward, and that he be ad-
vised of the same. .
Mr. JORDAN seconded the motion. 't

Mr. RATHBONE asked the Town-clerk for an explanation.
It appeared that this was a case which had not been recog-
nised in the municipal reform act, and he would wish to know
whether the council would not act wrongly in taking a part
for either one or the other of the claimants. In his opinion,
the case was one with which the council had nothing to do.
It ought to be left to the mayor and aldermen to make the
return, and when that was done, all that. the council could do
was not to object to it. • .
The TOWN-CLERK was of opinion, that it was not neces,
sary that the case should be provided for in the municipal
act. It was quite clear, in common law, that a person who
had been decided to be, by the—Court of Queen's Bench, an
usurper, ought to be ousted. The question then was, as it
was essentially necessary that one return should be made.
who was to sit? Would the council admit or reject Mr.
Lawrence? The motion of Air. Alderman Evans would
come to that point ; and the council must inevitably come to
the decision to adopt one course or the other. If any person
choose to oppose the return of Mr. Lawrence, the course
was open for him to do so.

Mr. RATHBONE said that the point at issue was, whether
the council was bound to come to the decision or not. The
question was, whether Mr. Lawrence should not be allowed
to take his seat in silence, and without the council making it
an act of their own.
The TOWN-CLERK could not see that the determination
of the council to consider Mr. Lawrence as accepted could by
any possibility prejudice the council, or any member of it.
He thought that, if couched in the words of the opinion of
counsel, there could be no:objection to Mr. Evans's motion.
Mr. RATHBONE observed that that would be going con-
trary to the course usually adopted. When members came
in at the late election, the council neither accepted nor re-
jected.
Mr. CURRIE would venture to ask a question. The Town-
clerk had said that he had considered it to be his duty
to advise the mayor to publish Mr. Lawrence as returned
for Rodney-street Ward. Now, he wanted to know whether
that circumstance would not, in the opinion of the Town-
clerk, be sufficient to give validity to Mr. Lawrence's elec-
tion, and to'authorise him to come and take his seat.
Mr. G. HOLT said that if the motion were put, it implied
that they had the power to negative. Now, was that the
fact? He imagined that they had no such power; but he
asked the question for information.
Mr. BLACKBURN observed that the opinion of Messrs.
Starkie, Wightrnan, and Crompton was not a decision of a
court of law ; it Was merely their opinion of what would be
the decision of a court of law, if the matter were referred to
them. And the question now was, should they be satisfied
with th,t decision thus given, or should they take up such a
position as to force Mr. Lawrence to obtain a higher autho-
rity ? The tenor of Mr. Evans's motion acquiesced in the
law as given by the thred counsel, and the adoption of that
motion, or something like it, was tantamount to saying that
the council acquiesced in it with Out going to a higher o.utho-
rity, He thought that they 'should do that.
Mr. Hucii IIoaNUY was sorry to differ from a gentleman
whose opinion he so highly esteemed as that of Mr. Black-
burn ; but it appeared to him that the subject was one with
which, in its present stages the council had nothing to do.
He should vote against any step being taken in this matter

by the council. It appearcd.to him that they had, under the
circumstances, to consult with their legal adviser, the Town-
clerk, as to what would be' the'prokr course to pursue. If
his advice were•follgwed, and Mr.- I4awrence came into the
council-chaMber, then, if the council said nothing, there
would be aiivend of the matter:-

Mr. COG!,AN. thought that if the opinion of the eminent
counsel, 'as read by the town-clerk, be the law of the land,
'then it was peremptory that 'Mr. Lawrence should take his
seat,.whatevep oppositipn they might make to it. If he (Mr.
Lawrence) were the sitting member by the law of the land,
he.CoUld claini silt in the same manner as any other re-
gular. member. It was not in their power to reject him, and
if so, where was the necessity of confirmation ? lie should
call it‘ a matter of supererogation. They should receive him
sub silentio.

Mr. JOHN SMLTH said that Mr. Lawience could not enter
the council without signing-the declaration, and how could
,he sign it ule< Sunimoned to do so, by some such a motion
as th4t of 41r., vat
' Me.'CuVitto;itcrtiglii ibeie ought to be a fresh' publication
of the return in which it declared that Mr. Lawrence was
the sitting.member..
Mr.-BoLToN said it had been decided that Mr. Harvey
was unqualified because of his having been an assessor ; but,
was it not equally a question, admitting that, whether Mr.
Lawrence was the member? He reasoned from analogy.
Petitions 'against returns were frequently presented to the
House of Commons ; committees reported on them, some-
times 'deciding on the person who ought to be the sitting
member, and sometimes not. It often happened that a fresh
eiection had to take place. In his opinion, it was a question
whether Mr. Lawrence was the sitting member, as well as
whether Mr. Harvey could or could not be a candidate. The
council ought not to interfere at all, either to forward or
frustrate.

The TOWN-CLERK said that it would be for their determi-
nation whether a fresh publication of the 'return were made
or not. The legal course of proceeding would be, if Mr.
Lawrence's seat were disputed, to apply to the Court. of
Queen's Bench for a mandamus. He had stated, at the out-
set, that, as he conceived, the duty of the mayor would be to
publish that Mr. Lawrence was duly elected a member of the
council for ,Rodney-Street Ward ; then, that being done, it
would become his duty to summon Mr. Lawrence as a mem-
-ber Of the council. Mr. Lawrence would then attend, and,
,
if he met-with no opposition, would take his seat. He thought,
at frrst„tliat, that, cnorse might very properly have been
adopted, and at present he could not see that any injury
would result frinnit •, but he now professed'himself a convert,
and thought, it would be safestto adopt the recommendation
'Which had been made, to let the mayor, acting on such legal
advice as- he Might think necessary, declare Mr. Lawrence
elected, and then let him, be summoned in the-ordinary way.
Mr. EVANS said that that would be to transfer to the
mayor ,the authority takeir from the council—authority to
take themost derided step--to declare who was elected, which
was going the whole of the length. He would just make one
remark with regard to what had been said by Mr. Rathbone.
One might:suppo.q! that he-bad-referred to Mr. Lawrence as
if he was to .come there by beat of drum, in a different man-
- nerto any other member ; hut it ought to be recollected that
if there,was ah eitraprdinary)thode of bringing a person into.
the Council, there were alspextraerdinary circumstances at-
tending the case, which gaveiriSe to the proposition. He had
consulted with.Mr...Harviy on-the sobject that-morning, and
he (Mr. Harvey) held the same . opinion which he (Mr.
Evans) had then offered to thecouncil. What had been pro-
posed would leave thelitatter of law' to go on ; -but. who was
'to pay the expenses ? Mr. Harvey: would, pot, and it would
be a new thing for the council to defend a seat which had
been relinquished. He (Mr. Evans) looked_upon it as a
most extraordinary course in the council to give, up to the
mayor the power of inviting that Member--Lto transfer to the
mayor the power,-as it would seem, of issuing a writ on his
own authority. .He looked upon it that if Mr. Harvey, or
any person on'the part of that gentleman, were to resist Mr.
Lawrence, then it would certainly be well for the council to
remain-neutral—tolie in abeyance; but when Mr. Harvey
had altogether giVen up the seat, and the seat was de facto
vacant, then the wisest and most generous act, in his opinion,
was to do that which had been recoinniended.
Mr. BArni3oNE was as anxious as Alderman Evans to do
everything in a gracious way. He only desired that the
council-, should not commit itself. if Mr. Lawrence were
elected, he should be as happy to see that gentleman in the
council-Chamber as any of their own members; but he
wanted to protect the council from taking an unusual course.
Mr. Alderman BOOTH said it struck him that the course
would be to publish the return, as in all other cases.
G. HOLT.—Let the alderman and assessors publish
instead of the mayor.
Mr. BLACKBURN said that gentlemen argued as though the
decision of counsel were binding upon them. Now, the
council had to decide that.

The MAYou.—Am •I to understand,' Mr. Evans, that you
withdraw your motion ? •
Mr. EvANs.—l will abide by the opinion of the council.
(Cries of " Withdraw.")
Mr. BRIGHT -said it seemed ,to be almost unanimously
agreed that Mr. Lawrence should be the member, and he had
no opposition to offer ; but it seemed they were to receive
the opinion of three barristers as binding in law. It had not,
in his opinion, been sufficiently shewn that the burgesses of
Rodney-street Ward had voted with a perfect knowledge of
the disqualification of Mr. Harvey. They had, in fact, voted
under the idea „that he was perfectly qualified. • Again, it
was stated by the Town-clerk that neither Mr. Lawrence,
nor an agent of Mr. Lawrence, had put any question, at the.
• time of the election, as to the eligibility of Mr. Harvey.
Therefore, it was. only an act of justice to the burgesses that
they should go to a new election. This was his decided opi-
nion, although he was only a humble person amongst them.
Mr. JORDAN said that there seemed to be no difference
in the council, except as to' the legality of the mode which
was to be pursued; and he thought that they ought to act in
such a manner as the 'town-clerk could recommend.

Mr. Alderman S E for his own part, could not tell bow
the council had got involved in such a discussion as this.
Here were two gentlemen disputing about a seat. Now, why-
not dispOte up tethe:Poinfat.which it would be eompulSory
on the conucil.to receive? They were no way.i involved in
the defence of one, nor opposed to the other,
Mr. CASE said that many gentlemen were a►guing on false
premises altogether... .A'Aleeision- had been taken, as he un-
derstood ; and it was quite clear that Mr. Harvey was not
the member for Rodney Street Ward. -Although the whole
process in •the court of;law:had not been coippleted, yet there
was a decision of the Court-of Queen's Bench that Mr. Hai.,
vey was not the councillor. ' What followed then-? why, then
came the question, who was the member? Was Mr. Law-
rence the memher, ingouseqpence of the votes given to Mr.
Harvey -being thrown 'away,' or was there to be a new elec-
tion ; That was the point which the council had to consider.
The Town-clerk had given it as his opinion that the. regUlat
course would be to admit Mr. Lawrence, in consequence of.
the-votes given to- Mr. Harvey having been thrown. away.
-Now, would any member object to that course, that being
also tha opinion of those barristers that that was the legal
course ? He asked, would .any gentleman object to that
course or not?

- - .
The TOWN-CLERK said that he would endeavour to explain
himself more fully. The first opinion had been obtained by
him on the 29th November although he did not think it
pfoper that that opinion should be made public until after
Judgment was pronounced. Judgment having subsequently
been pronounced, the next course was to call in Mr. Harvey
on the one side, and Mr. Lawrence on the other, and read
the decision to them, and that he had done, acting in concur-
rence with the mayor.. How then did matters stand ? There
had been fa judgment pronounced against Mr. Harvey, and
that was conclusive as to that fact. If Mr. Lawrence did not
go before the Court of Queen's Bench, his right was not pre-
judiced; for the question was bet Ween Mr. Harvey and an
inhabitant of the borough, who filed the information. Mr.
Lawrence,
.then, if the! opinion of the three barristers were
correct, would be right in demanding his seat ; and the coun-
cil would have to consider, whether they would deem it ex-
pedient, with that opinion before them, to oppose the ad-
mission of Mr. Lawrence. Then with regard to the course
which ought to be adopted under these circumstances. Here
was a return, signed by the alderman and assessors of the
ward, which, coupled with the opinion of counsel, meant that
Mr. Lawrence was returned. Therefore the alderman and
assessors had done all that was incumbent upon them. Well,
then, if the mayor was advised that by law Mr. Harvey was
disqualified, and Mr. Lawrence elected, it became the duty
of the mayor, for which he should seek no authority, to cor-
rect the erroneous publication made by him of Mr. Harvey's
return, Therefore, he was not in any way committing the
council by a new publication. The council had no occasion
to give the mayor authority on that point; it would become
his duty, if he were satisfied with the legal advice. If so, in
due time Mr, Lawrence would make his appearance there
and take his seat, He (the town-clerk) had only one word
further to say, that in the situation he was placed, he must
either have advised the council or the mayor to publish that
Mr. Lawrence was duly elected, or, in ten days, to order the
alderman and assessors to proceed with a new election.
Mr. J. N. WOOD dared to say that the electors of Rodney-
street Ward would have no objection to a new election ; for
they were prepared to return Mr. Lawrence by an immense
majority. (L augh ter.)
It was then agreed that the course recommended by the
town-clerk should be followed, namely, that the mayor should
publish an amended return. .

ALLEGED NUISANCES.
The memorial, signed by forty-eight persons residing in
Hill-street, Mill-street. and the neighbourhood, complaining
of a. nuisance caused by Mr. Harrison's steam flour mill, in
Hill-street, together with the counter-memorial, previously
alluded to, and the deputy town-clerk's report thereon, were
then read. The deputy-town clerk reported that the com-
plaint, from the persons in the immediate neighbourhood,
was well founded, although it might be quite true that many
persons who had signed the counter-memorial felt little or no
inconvenience, they residing at a greater distance. The
principal sources of complaint were the noise and vibration
caused by the working of thc. engine, and the smoke issuing
from the chimney.
Mr. SMITH said that, as lie understoOd, no greater smoke
was caused by Mr. Harrison's mill than 13y any other steam-
mill in town, and he asked what would- be the consequence
if this was deClared to be a nuisance, and the dealers in grain
were obliged to go to .a distance to get their corn ground.
Bread would become dearer, and the council would bring
odium on itself. .fie moved that no information should be
laid at present, especially as he understood that Mr. Harrison
agreed to do all that he could to abate the nuisance.
Mr. BUSHELL Seconded the motion.
Mr.-Alderman EARLC recommended the council to be ex-
tremely cautious in interfering in these matters. The imple.-
'Melds of wealth ought to be tolerated, whatever little dis-
conifort might be caused to those persons living in the
,neighbiniring houses. There was one quality which he
deemed necessary to constitute a nuisance, and that was the
unhealthy tendency of the work or process complained of.
Now, it seemed that
.there was nothing of the sort in this
nuisance; and if they went on the mere pled of discomfort,
they might hinder the going on of a brewer's dray, because
of the noise which it occasioned; they might hinder the
opening of a butcher's shop, because the objects exhibited
in it might not be agreeable to the sight.
After some conversation, the general opinion seeming to
be that the nuisance was not of such a nature as to call for
interference, the subject was allowed to drop, on the under-
standing that Mr. Harrison would make the alterations ne-
cessary for lessening the smoke.
The report of the Deputy Town-clerk, on a memorial com-
plaining of a nuisance caused by the chain cable manufactory
of Mr. Willidm Gibson, in Bridgewater-street, was then read.
It appeared that there were in the works seventeen fires,_ all
having a distinct chimney, and many of them very low. Mr.
Gibson, however, had agreed to make such an alteration as
would materially abate the nuisance, namely, by turning the
small chimneys into the larger one.
It was moved by Mr. JOHN HULMES, seconded by Mr.
PLATT, that Mr. Gibson should be requested to make the
alteration.—Agreed to.

, APPOINTMENT OF COMMISSIONERS.
Four commissioners under the pilotage act were then ap-
pointed, in place of Messrs. Charles Lawrence, Vincent
Higgins, John Cropper jun., end George Ramsden. The
gentlemen appointed were, Messrs. Sandbach, Mather, Bu
shell, and Quayle.
Mr. Hugh Hornby was appointed commissioner under the
Wallasey embankment act, in the room of Mr. C. Lawrence.
Mr. Barclay was appointed a member of the St. George's
Hall Committee, in place of Mr. C. Lawrence.
THE SCHOOL QUESTION-PETITION OF THE PROTESTANT

OPERATIVES.
Mr. ISAAC HOLMES, having been called upon by the
Mayor, rose to bring forward the motion of which he had
given notice, relative to the memorial agreed to, at a recent
meeting in the Music-hall, and signed by two thousand and
fifty-six persons. Mr. Holmes said that a petition emanating
from such a body, and so numerously signed,. was, in his
opinbn, deserving of the utmost attention. He himself was
present at the meeting where the memorial was adopted, and
a more unanimous or enthusiastic assembly he had never
witnessed. There were probably from fifteen hundred to two

thousand present, and the resolutions were carried with such
acclamations as could scarely be described. He was fully
aware that the subject matter of the petition would again
come under the consideration of the council, when the motion
for erecting new schools was brought forward, and he should
not, therefore, enter into it at much length ; but he was pre-
pared, when the motion was brought forward, to oppose it
on the grdund that the corporation had in reality no surplus
funds to appropriate to the building of new schools. That
he was correct in the assertion' he well knew ; for, in making
it, he had the full concurrence of an auditor of he higlicst
ability, Mr. James Bunnell, who agreed with him in stating
that, during the last year, the council had expended fifteen
thousand pounds more than their regular income. The last
time that this subject was discussed, the member for Lime-
street Ward recommended that the gentlemen on his (the
speaker's) side of the house should state What would satisfy
them. Now, he could not take upon himself to do so—he
could not answer for the whole of the church party for he
knew they had differences upon minor points, and even though
they were to have a meeting at the Angel, perhaps they
would.still be unable to agree upon those points : for, there
were many among them who would not be satisfied, like cer-
tain persons, with being mere cyphers, and they would per-
haps fly off at a tangent. But, though they differed upon
minor points, they were unanimous on the great point recom-
mended in the memorial, which was, that there should be
separate schools in which the authorised version should be
taught. With respect to that petition be must observe to the
council, that there was not in it a single word about the mari-
ner in which the present schools were conducted. The me-
morialists merely came for Ward to ask that, if new schools
were to be built, they should not be similar to those already
in existence, which the petitioners consider anti-scriptural,
but that they should be schools where the authorised version
was read and taught. He himself opposed the schools, be-
cause in them were men taught the tenets of a sect so bigoted,
that they think none can be saved beyond their pale. They
seemed to consider that a sort of circle had been drawn
around their sect, in the interior of which alone light was to
be obtained, and that beyond it there was nothing but dark-
ness. It had been stated in that room, and, he believed,
never contradicted, that when, some time ago, a question was
put to a councillor as to why the Lord's Prayer could not be
used in the schools; he replied that the rtOrnan Catholic
priests said that they could not allow the children of their
flock to act with Protestants, even though it were to repeat
the Lord's Prayer. What ! was there a sect which con
ceived that the vault of heaven was a vault of brass, through
which the prayers of a protestant could not penetrate, and
that if the prayers of a catholic ascended to heaven in con
junction with those of a protestant, the ears of mercy would
be closed ? If such is the case, but I sincerely hope it is
not, what are we to think of the opinions of the cathaicS of
Liverpool? For my own part, as I have already said, I
should be satisfied with the exclusion from the schools of all
catechisms, or I should be equally well satisfied to give up
the present schools entirely to the Roman catholics ; but I
do again contend that Roman catholics and protestants ought
not to be mixed together for the purpose of education ; and
from the opinions expressed by him with reference to catho-
liciSm, I should think that that is the opinion of the member
of Lime-street Ward, if he would give his candid opinion
upon that point.
Mr. BLACKBURN.—That is not true.
The "VI ATOR.—Youshall have an opportunity of speaking,
Mr. Blackburn. I hope you will allow Mr. Holmes to go on
without interruption.
Mr. BLACKBURN. When a man outrages propriety so
much as he has done, I am bound to stand up.
The MAYOR.—He gave his own opinion merely of what
you thought.
Alr. ISAAC HOLMES.—Mr. Blackburn, if he (the speaker)
were to judge from his (Mr B's) pamphlet, seemed much
afraid of popish theology. It was nearly thirty years since
he (Mr; H.) had attended dissenting • chapels ; but he must
say that when he did attend them, he heard the " scarlet lady"
vituperated more bitterly than he had ever since done. There
was a hymn composed by Dr. Watts sung in those chapels,
and he himself .had tuned it up, which invoked vengeance
upon her. It ran as follows :
" Great Babylon that rules the earth,
Drunk with martyrs' blood,
Her crimes shall speedily wake
The vengeance of our God."
This was sung at baptist and independent chapels ; but lie
would recommend that in future it should be altered thus ;
Great Babylon that rules the earth,
The liberals' joy and hope,
We'll teach her tenets in our schools—
We'll bless and laud the pope.
He muse say that, as a member of the church of England,
he had never heard such vituperation, such rancour towards
popery, as in the baptist and independent chapels, arid he
had been in the habit of attending, sometimes one and some-
times the other. (Laughter.) Those days, however, had
passed, and he now found that the great supporter of Babylon
was the attender of those chapels which he had formerly
attended. But it ought not to be forgotten that this was a
protestant country, and that the council was a protestant
council ; for, although there were members of different
persuasions, and although there were Roman catholic mem-
bers, yet they were only admitted on taking an oath that
they would not do anything against the protestant church of
these realms. Mr. H. concluded by moving the following :
" That in all schools henceforth to be erected at the expen: e
of this council, the authorised version of the scriptures be
taught to all the pupils or scholars therein."
Mr. GEORGE WRIGHT seconded the motion.
As no person rose to offer any remarks, the MAYOR asked
whether any gentleTar.l had any observations to make.

Mr. BOLTON.—We have completely discussed the question.
(Cries of " Vote Vote.")
Mr. BLACKBURN said that he had no objection to go to the
vote at Once ; for he had no anxiety to go over a thrice told
tale. He would, however, make a few observations. There
were- three reasons why the council should reject the motion
before them. In the first place-It was a disingenuous motion ;
it aimed at one-thing, while it professed anOther". In the se-
cond place it was an unjust motion ; it called upon the coun-
cil to do that, the doing of which was essentially contrary
to the dictates of natural equity. In the third place it was a
persecuting motion ; it called upon the council to inflict un-
merited injury on a large portion of the community, whose
affairs they were bound to conduct with justice and imparti-
ality. Any one of these reasons was sufficient to induce the
council to reject the motion, and the three combined were
sufficient to insure its rejection by a large majority. He had
no apprehension, that while 4those who wow' had the ascend-
ancy in that council continued to have it, there would be passed
a resolution of which it might with truth he said that it was
disingenuous, unjust, and persecuting. What resolutions
might be passed when a certain party, who looked forward to
a majority, had obtained the ascenda,ncy, he would not say.
Mr. Illitekburn-proceeded to dwell at,-,,,01e length on each of
the three teas s.. . lie. said that Holmes knew that if
his motion were passed, not a single child would read more
.of the authorised version than he now did. The children had

free access to the authorised version, and used it upon all
occasions, and it was as fully taught them as in the
national schools, or in- any other schools. There would
be no gain whatever; and the only object was to exclude
the Roman catholics from a participation in the funds
from which all should benefit. The motion was brought
forward under the specious guise of teaching the children
the scriptures. Why not have honestly said, that in all the
schools hereafter to be erected, the Roman catholics
should be excluded ! That was the real aim. (No, no.) He
who desired the means desired the end ; and the supporters
of the motion knew that if their object were carried out, the
Roman catholics would be excluded. Now, that would be
an act of injustice ; for all parties ought equally to partici-
pate in the corporate funds devoted to education; and the
council cduld not, on principles of straightforward equity,
do anything of the kind. Then, the object was a persecuting
one ; it was a bill of pains snd penalties, to exclude Roman
catholic children from the schools ; and he was sure that the
council would sanction no such thing ; it would go on with
the system that was so well adapted to all parties, and to the
benefit of all-parties. It had been intimated that he acted
contrary to his own secret convictions, in advocating a mix-
ture of children of different denominations. He threw back
the imputation, and asserted that he acted with perfect con-
sistency. Because he advocated that mixture, it did not ne-
cessarily follow that he approved the opinions of Roman-
catholics. It was not, however, the business of the council
to say who was right and who was wrong, but to deal justly
and fairly to all, leaving all in the enjoyment of their own
opinions. It had been boldly said that they taught the tenets
of the church of Rome. He denied that. They did not
teach any religious tenets, as a council. Gentlemen did not
understand 'this' or they were determined not to understand
it.' An hour a day was set apart for religious instruction,
during which hour the various denominations could send
clergymen to administer religious instruction according to
what plan they liked. The council did not say that the ca-
techism should be used, or that it should not ; but they left
the matter in the hands of - the parties themselves. The
speaker went on to contend that this was a system which had
met with advocates among eminent churchmen, and in par-
ticular he cited the opinion of Dr. Daniel Wilson, the Bishop
of Calcutta, who had sanctioned the establishment of schools
in the East Indies, in which religious education was divided
into two branches, special and general. The church cathe-
chism was not enforced, and Roman catholics were allowed
the use of the Douay Bible and the Rhenish Testament. In
fact, the system was there carried out to a greater extent than
here, and the bishop had even gone to a length in liberalism
that he (Mr. B.) was not prepared to go.
Mr. SANDBACH rose to move an amendment, which, whe-
ther it was accepted or not, he wished to place on record.
He proceeded, in the first place, on the principle which Mr.
Blackburn had laid down as that on which the present cor-
poration schools were founded, namely, that all the inhabi-
tants had an equal right to participate in the benefit of the
funds devoted to education. In the next point for which he
should contend, he differed from Mr. Blackburn entirely.
He maintained that the present system did not afford an
equal advantage to all classes. The objection made to the
old schools was, that they were exclusively confined to the
Church of England, and he contended that the present
schools were in the same position—they were alike exclusive.
(" No, no," and " Hear, hear.") He thought that the
memorial before them afforded sufficient proof of his posi-
tion. He did not contend for the catechism being used in
the schools—for the Council, as then constituted, could not
prescribe the teaching of any form of document—but he
thought that the Bible stood on a different footing, as every
one must admit that, being the book which had been given
by a Power above all for the benefit of all, the Council, if it
were bound in its public capacity to provide education for
those who had not the means of obtaining it, were bound
above every thing to provide that which was the most impor-
tant of all education. He considered it as proved that
schools conducted on one system could never meet the wants
of a whole community. Mr. Sandbach alluded to his hope,
expressed at the last meeting of the Council, that the amend-
ment he should bring forward might be accepted as a com-
promise, and said that he approached this subject more cool-
ly than the older members, who bad been so often engaged
in this discussion, and without connection with either party.
He did it in compliance with a promise made to his consti-
tuents. The amendment moved by Mr. Sandbach was as
follows :—" That all the inhabitants of the borough have an
equal right to participate in the benefits of the education
provided at the charge of the borough fund. That very large
numbers are, by their conscientious objections to the system
of education pursued in the present corporation schools, vir-
tually excluded from any direct participation in the benefits
of it for their children. That, in order to afford all the ad-
vantages which are now confined to those who approve (or
whose scruples are not such as to compel them to forego the
use) of the present schools,—that the new schools, about to
be erected, be conducted on a different system. That the
chief and paramount object in the future corporation schools
shall be to instil into every child a knowledge of the Divine
Revelation contained in the New Testament, and that every
other kind of useful knowledge be made secondary and sub-
servient to that."

Mr. CASE said that he would second the amendment with
great pleasure, if it referred to a new school, and not to all
the new schools about to be erected. It had been determined
some time ago that two new schools should be built. Now,
he wished to know whether Mr. Sandbach wished to interfere
with the system in those two schools ?
Mr. SANOBACH said that his amendment had reference to
those.

Mr. CASE then declined to second the amendment.
Mr. COOPER, however, seconded it.
Mr. BLACKBURN wished to know whether, by the Bible,
Mr. Sandbach meant the authorised version ?
Mr. SANDBACH replied in the affirmative.
Mr. Alderman FREME—Then the amendment and motion
are the same thing.

-.I\iTifODGSON-did not think that either the motion or the
amendment was a matter.of much importance ; 'for the fate
of both was well known beforehand, He said that the gen-
tleman who had spoken in favour of a mixed system of edu-
cation seemed to be undecided as to what was wrong and
what was right—what was truth and what was error. He
would ask whether, in mere temporal matters, the gentleman

who had spoken with so much ability, as he often did (nil
Blackburn), would exercise the same indifference with regal";
to the opinions of persons entering that chamber as he ha"
expressed with reference to spiritual matters ? Was he '0
indifferent about the concerns of eternity that he would g°
pari passe with that which he conceived to be damnable
error ?
Mr. CURRIE hoped that the dominant party in the coun-
cil would continue to be so, because he was of opinion that
they had advocated the cause of truth snd justice. He coin-
plimented Mr. Sandbach on the independence manifested by
him on this occasion, and was happy to sea the calm mannetri
in which the discussion had been conducted: He supporte
the system pursued in the schools of the corporation. f
Mr,, Alderman EARLE- felt deep interest in the welfare o
these excellent and scriptural schools founded, as they wt:te'
upon true Protestant principles ; therefore it was i
he could allow the question to go to the vote Without saying
at the
same word. He was certainly of a hot temperament, but,
same time, he wished to keep his temper. Bilt when there
schools were assailed by gentlemen appointed to teach the
way of truth, he hoped, if he happened to lose his temper, h, e
should be excused on that ground. He would not Lurks
the
question. Had the petition come from a body of his fellow
townsmen who spoke their own sentiments without being.
under the control of any priestly influence, it would be the
d if
the duty of the council to hear what they had to say, an
their request could not be complied with, at least to give
them a courteous reply. But it came befcre them under 11°
such circumstances. Much bad beeu said about the petition;
but he was certain one-half of the signatures had been signel
by one hand. (Hear.) Talk of two thousand having slg"e, ,
inpo,oble
it ! Why he Would answer for it thet not one thousand Ilan'
(Hear, from the whin.) It came into the council chamber
with a letter recommending it to special notice from the Rev.'
Hugh M'Neile. (Hear.) That gentleman bad been their
greatest enemy, but fortunately, he had not injured thew la
Mr.
the least ; but at all events, it was quite clear that
APNeile thought his•writing of a letter with it would in"
troduce the petition with some weight. Before, however,
he sat down he should prove that that letter ought to have
no weight whatever. The petition in short was the result of
one of those Amphitheatre fasces in which the rev. gentleolo!
was accustomed to play the prim° ti, (Cries of oral)),
He was ill order ; he was speaking facts, and should sees,,
nothing but facts, of the people who i. lived the;emountehanx
tricks, whether they wore a black or a blue coat. The rev.
gentleman'S vanity was insatiable e he went about the county
S
denouncing them (the corporation schools, we suppose) an f
he very rarely did so without showing a striking example
fd
tile little attention he paid to that book to which he accused
them of paying -no regard, the Bible. tie said.that the r,ev't
gentleman seemed to pay so little attention to that book tll
o me m g it almost s aspect that he had nothing but a inuti,",
fated copy of it in his own library-a copy from which all
those texts that enjoined. peace, charity, and a•ood-will tot,-
wards all men were cut out. He (Mr. Alderman Lane)
tie
call to mind the Fisher-street story. What was that don"
, II
for? W. hy merely to give the rev. gentleman an opportull--..
to malign the Rolnan Catholics, and of bearing false witniel
against them. The other day, at Sheffield, before a Wee` "
Protestant slobs, he ridiculed a worthy and excellent towns"
man, who had done much fcir the education of the hewer
orders : there the rev. gentleman told a story not founded in
fact. A minister of truth ought not to do these timings ; but
he (Mr. Earle) had a much graver Charge. He was speaking
on these points because the Tey'. kentleman had "attacked
for he (Mr. Earle) was in his own place here, and he could
i
not answer Mr. M`Neile id his pulpit. Upon one ocessiot
he used a base insinuation against a worthy man in the coestin-
eil—Mr. Blackburne, who answered him in his excellent " ve„.
fence of the Liverpool Corporation Schools " page 14. ".",:;
M`Neile had said that Me.-Bitekburne had' questioned the
authenticity of the Gospel of St. Mdrk.—(The speaker be';
read Mr. Blackburne's answer to the allegation, which an's°
amounted; in substance, to no more than that the alleged,
sertion was a calumny.) What honest man, proceeded rot
Earle, could stand under such an accusation as this?
1 • to
the rev. gentleman had not dared to open his lips, in rel'.!' r
it, from that day to this—and so he looked upon every Ole
opponent. If it should be said he had an unworthy antsil;
nist, and kept silence from that circumstance, there oue!1,1,„.
something in that, but who did not know the integrity ot 0-" d
Blackburne'a character?. He (Mr. Earle) need not deft to
it. _Thus Mr. M`Neile had, from that day to this, refusedfor
give an honest man the only recompence he could give ,
having calumniated him—that of acknowledging his errors
and expressing his regret for having fallen into it. This "a
thew:
the man, and such was he who would lead the governiinai
astray upon the subject of education, and have the edueatiml
of the whole children in the town under his sole control' le
man who had been guilty of this double dealing.—Pir• 9r cl
here referred to his notes, and continued.) No ; he never a,,,
moral courage to reply,though considered by some of his frie
..,
so lion-hearted. He (Mr. Earle) did not know whether alit' ge id
tleman had read the trash uttered at that meeting ; it wawaij
to have been received with uproarious applause, and he had
no doubt it was, for the bulk of the meeting was coinP°i,at
of the old freemen of Liverpool, and every body knew w ,
their uproarious applause was. Ile would venture to
,st.
there were not a hundred persons there who could write tn!,,
names. Mr. M`Neile insisted, as usual, that the Bible li",
excluded from the corpora Coe schools, end. talked some, lit',
sense about the corporation to tithing heresy and inhuether
and bowing down to images, and he knew not what u ~,i-friathy
friathy trash, but such it was. Now the Bible told us oti-rst
derstand and examine before we blanied—to Understand,' this
and then rebuke. That was the Bible, he believed. 113'.ined
truth-loving divine ever yet eatered the schools, csauL" gr-
and understood them ? Dr. Tattershall was the only Ina!' e'
m,
titular intelligence among these fanatics who met at the
,o,
phitheatre, and he said that the Bible was in the schools. deal
he (Mr. Earle) . would take the Doctor's word a gretatisleee
before he would take Mr. M`Neile's. Did Mr- I\i ‘
ov
acknowledge the divine truth—" Train up a child ill the
~'
he should go, and when he is old he wilt not depart frow i(tied
or did he deny it? If he did not deny it, he himself atliu-i„ $
a striking instance of the truth of it, for lie was b°llo,l here
country where nothing but religious discord existed,
d,
and
hatred between Protestant and Catholic was petlictuste e rev-
in which the rev. gentleman had been brought up. T
.), heel
gentleman still maintained the hatred in which he liaue tee
brought up. If he wished to see children brought 14).11001s.
way they should go, let him go into the corporation
He would there see the pleasing spectacle of a niu'ucbrisr,„-,°gf
children of all denominations joining together, and tied ; he
uniform pleasure from the instructions they recei‘ee, Too-
must also examine them, and he would find them highZaird go
'ficient in every part of the Bible. If Mr. M`Neile w oil
there lie would see these things • and if, after that, anYee to
could deny this, he (Mr. Earle) said, he was a disgra _4,
human nature. This was the excellency of the systenoa:l7o
after all, the meeting was merely a political meeting) moils
clearly s ^ wit by the concluding remarks. Mr. leg o 0
told them to turn out of the room and exhibit thenases;e_o.o,
ir
the day o the election ,_ andthus the cloven foot was itlere
Mr. M`Neite was a bold man at this time of day, when..ora
was so much schism amongst themselves, to come geoid
It
and have the question discussed at that council rneetitte•oll
was a very extraordinary proceeding, he thought. 1,, were
recollected the manifesto of the clergy when the sehoo.',itergi
established. They were then bound to see that the le ssol
and church catechism were the very first thirea ;
that if they did not insist on that, they would be acting wful
trary to their duty to God and to their sovereign. H° ate lo•
a precipice did they now stand on ! In their (7
eollegr
_lad,
stitution, professedly belonging to the church of Jleuegd alr-
they had thrown over the catechism ! Why, his, fi
slid`
Smith shuddered at the thought of it. (Lauhter.) ,Ile,„ over
at the thought of time church ministers having thlre`"(mr.
the catechism, and being on that terrible brink. "%el not
Earle) was warm, like his friend Mr. CUrrie, and he et,' eon-
and th )0,,.
help it. (Laughter.) Now, Mr. Wray was perfee-*:, did
sistent in all he . did, and though he (the speal;_Ti eon-
not admire that gentleman's bigotry, he admired i'''„f the
sistency. He- could not say so much for wanY'ed tc;
others. How did those gentlemen who were oirsesorleita
him get out of the difficulty ? These fishermen, °_,.e sure 11.„
as they told us from the apostles of old, but he seas i„ the!:
could not trace their descent from any resernblaitelesieilw
character, were at present fishing and bobbing for Look sui
and Presbyterian gudgeons, and they baited th :r_ wie
cordingly.. They knew the gudgeons would not bite, salvo;'.
it. But what a compliment did they pay to therin not iiut
are worth nothing to us but for your money, we w too gre'l
rogues, and are going to upset the church, or Ye hind tn
mit you upon our committees. No ; you are eithere
are to
be
honest, and would see the rogueries we play
~/,,or
scenes"— ~ it the "'Mb
Mr. R. GLADSTONE rose to order. He pui- to . do jet
whether the Collegiate Institution had anything to
the subject under discussion ?
t en
, ou tion
will no att Mr. Earle, (loudly)—I am speaking to the mo 'Pt
Mr. Gladstone (vehemently).—Sir, y
to put me down by bullying. d which
siere i
l' they - the
ought not to be tolerated in that council, and 1 -„ - „..ith
Mr. SHELL said that he had heard vvords uttere-; e-
peated he would bring them before the council, "
Lome,name of the person using them, whoever he was.,
~_e wor_r.
The MAYOR.—What was it ? He had not heard toire, 31
Mr. SHEIL.—The word " bully" was made use i u/
Gladstone. it
The MAYOR.—I did not hear it. • 11 to del at
Mr. SHELL.—Mr. Gladstone is too candid a ma
_ea la ,
The MAYOR.—I did not hear the word bully,
,fe otreti
sure, if Mr. Gladstone did use it, he will withdraw, ant
sive expression. I have not heard from Mr. Earl,
ji?„ v,;rnali
expression unbecoming him. Mr. Gladstone
t the
withdraw. considers
allied by
Mr. ROBERTSON GLADSTONE said, he c
subject of the er /°) sac
Mr. Earle, in the most unwarrantable mannd, • , ,
sured -11 fof
posing that some concession had been grante_
eel_
alatter.(r.
proceeding ought, with Mr. Earle, to have b 1
d sarcasm- ,J:1`0,
commendation rather than for his anger an
to the Insia,_,
Collegiate Institution had been intrudu° suP'
Earle had not been called on for contribution to ,e bude
01',
tion, nor had the majority of that counic:.
1111:(reusaa;e
objection to withdraw the expression hell a
that thins .gl lies
provided it was conceded by the counci
..,__, ;
_her
which had fallen from Mr. Earle had juettityne,,r,ot a at) those
application of it. It was only the othertdo , rip, tha Lege
of this council was told by one opposed n
be very nicejer au
trusted.that the councillor who had called /press'
who used hard words ought themselves to
the e
this occasion, would be equally particular in t I
„o Oa e
the
to Ord be
made use of.
have taken no part which is not perfectly _
impartou
.e besrd
you should withdraw. Do you withdraw
‘,O, have The MAYOR.—You will do me the justice tOes:l thin-
cl
Mr. ROBERTSON GLADSTONE.-1 do; but I - ao
, tte, •
what I have just stated."' . that to
,erlc,
coming before the council, has laid himsestiba conatu
open to 114 he
The MAYOR.—Mr. INl`Neile by writing.
and any member is entitled to make - -Mr,
that ; a
chooses.
Mr. ROBERTSON GeansToNE.--
coinpetent ev.,olly,
M`Neile is a public man, but amply h
wese,„, judi m
himself whenever he is attacked. He, o c' lei 4
•eicNei eel.
is not the Collegiate Institution.
but Mr' -t the '''''
I grant o &leo
Mr. GLADSTONE.—I grant that ;
ver, is 11°-
Ins
legiate Institution, d with that
competent to defend himself. He,
The MAYOR.—Mr. M`Neile
'is connected
a __ion. ror I
• et under disc sa
tion ; ' owe
tion,_ and that bears on the subje . protec ~.„ dsto
for your
..., eita 0.
Mr. EARLE.—I thank you, sir, friend tbe co to
should be sorry to quarrel with lily
fully ready
But, at the same time, I am
they are sueo
_event , _
duct of the clergy, when I see that
their power to P',,,t ittli:
howe
us, and that they had done all
eixeeent
as it i,earlaiviis
u_.
carrying our object into effect,e t ft to
Lau ileter-5
overeign. Iwi 00 tter
their duty to God and their
ill stick W the rat this Icel.
not always pleasant to hear th
that. lam like a terrier, w
I Litt: Mr. Currie, that
~ angr.Y vie/
Mr. BUSHELL agreed
at sides without im,had in_ of
ought to be discussed on 9
bd
that the end th.enY the spiivieieo
ings, for he was convince
eh more effect il_,, the re ,1:10
might be advocated with
intileeling than :i e"
("I consulted° Pe
it
good temper, gentlemanly Holmes :
1101111 ES 11 .
truth told— 11
to lOW tilYt
course was adopted.
Bush drools leap
f cuurs los') '•
for a season, because he (11 •
the s.
influence every,ens of
had an opportunity of visiting
some
deb
dell
.1" the oPi"w lie
nions out of doors must in sobe ue'a
ect not to take _ „Lich eii
but it had always been his
upon the subject, he sholuflldirhave advised him had n° opt-
to hear
eaestdd, „iv
evidence be, :s own It I,e
could, to collect all t 1._.1 to draw 1 i
i,;„ broug they;
from the facts before him
t should be a.g% before
iceeer
others but to judge for
sions. When this subjae
id lay his "'Pre and ;PritY i°
fore the council, he should
er they 'nigh" great insilauell 0
and the town, and, whatev
those °f thee -tcd, inasu' ailing
much they might differ fromwoui _
ihiniself ;
dbe need 1n5,.140
that room, lie trusted they
honest opanon-, the Caller, iher, 1 ed,
11 regard to ,i. sobsci f „cern t
like party spleen.
1 W'rt,, to say, he w"hc'sni was "°,l of t"
roum.a..i9i, over:
to which, he. was WWI)/ the ratec l
they would be hone
one of those who, so far a was theot beautiiidis vf tii:i
_. : 4 and uninfl9iate liie 03
fblea vhich
cared nothing, if the Bible,
e„ which. er, the lia'llie cared
c.....,a up -J. In. .
catechism, and the
raised, were pu,.
structure had been e ts of the'
chisur....vi i 3
children, with the comi_n
done,
~ the ote
not, provided this were do ti r teachers hicu _ 0 re,

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