Star.
London, England, 1819-07-07 00:00:00

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I • e .. . .
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lor6-, - - ment it would be obviously •irapinpar to introduce- returns
.murder
that the number of convictions for the law frequently prevents the perpetration ci- crime; ' I
aired nronwthe Protestant lasseaters of the Town of Kendal.—! any proposition upoo SLIM e a 'abject.* mentioned, But wail whith took place during the first period and that a law often seems to be useless, oily because dig
Read, and ordered to lie on the table. the unanimous feeling and impression of the, namely, during the first thirty years after the Revo- it has completely produced the effect contemplated he
EXCISE PENALTIES. Committee, that no measures should be brought for- letiosii was 129 ; and the number of executions for by it. I will not detain the House at present by in. he
Mr. WILLIAM SMITH held in his hand a Peti- ward on a question of this nature, until time should murder during the same period, 87—that the num, quiring if this argument be well grounded. Irene tis
tion from Jeremiah Abel, a small farmer in the county be afforded for the most ample - enquiry, while nci bee of convictions for *Murder which took place dur- applicable at all, it is applicable only to those me. tier
of Norfolk, now a prisoner in the jail of Norwich, measure ou tto be adopted without the most deli. ing the second period mentioned, namely, from the spicuous crimes the penalty attached to which e ge. in
for penalties in a case of smuggling to the amount of berate disctsioll. It would, indeed, be highly unad- year 1755 to the year 1784, was 67 ; and the num- nerally known. It must be wholly inapplicable to Oil
£l,OOO, but which had beers offered to be compro- visable to impose any measure at a time or under ber of executions for murder during the same period, those obscure laws, obscitre crimes, and obscure le, rs
1. mised for £3OO. The Honourable Member said that
lee knew nothing of the character or conduct of Je- circumstanets plies might give rise to otjections fo- 57—and that the number of convictions for murder rallies, the very existence of vhich it requires e..
, traordinary effoet on the part of the most accuree ni
reign to the merits of the case, and which, although which took place during the third period mentioned, tee
e' i remiah Abel, farther than what was set forth in the so foreign, might produce impressions unfavourable namely, from the year 1784 to the year 1814, was and well-informed lawyer habitually to remeree; In
1 , Petition now about to be presented to the House; but to the principles of the measure itself. Hence the only .54 ; and the number of executions for murder and which are rarely mentioned but bydhose ishe an
this important fact he could state, that the truth of Committee has abstained, as it does at present ab- during the same period; only 44.—50 that the House wish to produce an impression unfavourAie to ,he hi
the.allegations against the Petitioner had been denied,
to agree to a compromise on any account what-
and. that an alibi had been proved by seventeen affi-
davits, affirming tivt the Petitioner, when charged
with the violation of the law, was at that time 6=
that ahese affidavits ought to outweigh the testimony
of an individual informer. The Petitioner further
t.
ever; but that the Counsel, in direct opposition to his stain, from proposing any measure to the considera- will observe, with reference merely to the number of character of our general cede of lawn (Hear, „ sn
tion of the House. The Committee has been anxiously convictions and executions for murder, that during I will not read the list of the Acts of .Parliame, 1 f
occupied for the last three months in collecting every the last thirty years .that number has fallen in the that description, which the Committee propose ~
Y variety of evidence applicable to the case. It has proportion of more than two to one, as compared Parliament to repeal._ The Statutes to whirr 1: a
particularly devoted itself to the examination of those with the number in the thirty years immediately Committee wishes to direct the attention the 1I ~,
persons who were capable of giving information that subsequent to the Revolution. That, however, would are divisible into two classes, respecti. which
could be relied upon, with regard to the effects of be a very weak and insufficient mode of stating the Committee proposes that .two Bills she I be intr. -
capital punishments upon the morality of the country. fact. When we take into our account the great in- duced in the next Session. The first Class consise f
The proceeding sof the Committee have, indeed, crease of population in the kingdom, and more esete- Acts, constituting misdemeanors, which having ns. :
been mainly pointed to ascertain, by direct evidence cially in the districts surrounding the capital—when come matters of indifference, or nearly so, it is pie- .d
•F
a
n
miles distant from the scene of action. He thought
of
1
stated, that he had given instructions to the Counsel
g
no
.r
instructions, consented to the compromise for the
and detail of facts, what degree of validity realty werecollect the rise and growth of a great city on posed entirely to repeal :—the second class cons:: is in
belonged to the reasons generally urged against the the Southern bank of the names, in Surrey—and
.Acts for the capital punishments comprehended, i i d
smaller penalty. This was a plan of delusion, as he
1
t
was informed, sanctioned by the Solicitor of the severity of capital punishments, that Is, whether the when we contemplate the narrow space into which which it is proposed to substitute either traiisptea. •
Board; for when this unhappy victim gave his con- practical experience corresponded with the general this large, increased, and increasing mass of human tion or hard labour, at the discretion cf the Jude_
sent, on the understanding that all further prosecu- reasoning. With this view we have taken the testis' beings is crowded, we mast be compelled to acknow- giving that discretion in the most ample nianese
tion was to cease on agreeing to the compromise, the ninny of a number of persons connected with the ad- ledge that the crime of murder has actually dimi, Sir, there is one part of the evidence taken before C•le
• Solicitor then proceeded for the reduced penalty and ministration of the laws. In this important branch niched in frequency in the latter of the two periods Committee, to which I wish more especially to c ill
the expenses of the prosecution. But this fact was of the enquiry indeed, we have made considereble which I have just described, in the proportion of the attention of the Ikuse, as it relates to the diseies. .
better known to the Gentlemen on the opposite side progress, and collected a variety of very satisfactory three or four to one. Although such are the facts to which I have already alluded, between those n,
(the Treasury Bench). After this compromise, which information. But still our information is incom- as manifested in the Returns from the Home Circuit, the one hand, who, with me, are ofeepinion that tee e
the Petitioner was never called upon to pay, and af. plete, and with a view, therefbre, to acquire farther it does not appear that there has been an equal di- undue severity of law encourages, 'rather than re- . ,
ter the lapse of more than a twelvemonth, the Peti- and complete information on this as well as cn other minution of crime in the City of London. At the presses crime, and those on the other hand, who hole
tioner was seized, or arrested, and sent to Norwich important paints, I hope the House will be induced same time, the facts as they have been stated to the that if to any, however few cases of a particular na- al
jail, where he had remained in close confinement for to accede to there-appointment of this Committee at Committee, with reference to this metropolis, are of tune; capital punishment ought to attach, the dent::- v
the last sixteen months. The Honourable Member the commencement of the next Session of Parliament. considerable importance with reference to that view ciation of that punishment sbould be allowed to exist %,
e
said he was empowered to prove these facts, if thezi
But although our enquiry has as yet been incone- of theaubject. It appears that the number of con. on the Statute book, with reference to •all crime of
. House chose, at the Bar. The Petitioner had been plete, although we require to examine still farther victions for murder in the City of London, from the that description, as a terror which they think' opera- C:
charged, in the year 1816, together with several
evidence before we can finally determine upon the year 1751. to the year 1784 was 71 ; that the number tive in diminishing the frequency of its occurrence. it
' others, with the act of smuggling, and he had contra- best course to be recommended for the adoption of froaf 1781. toil 814• was 66 ; and (which is well worth The evidence illustrative of this subject has been pre-
, dieted the allegations by an alibi of no less than 17 the House, I have the satisfaction' Id state, that 1 the attention, of the House) that the number in the duced by'the examination, for the first timer of the a
• witnesses. The Honourable Member moved for leave am enabled to sheer, that the Committee has made years ISIS, 1816, and 1817, was only 9 ; whereas the very persons who sue the most intiinatel acquainted il
t, to present the Petition. such progi ess as fully to justify those who voted number in the three years immediately preceding it with it. By the examination en- those who suffeeloss io
• The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER lead against the Noble Lord's proposition for mixing this was fourteen. On estimating the convictions for when thefts or forgeries are committed; by the exami- •Li
no objection to the receipt of the Petition, and to its subject with that consigned to the Committee ap- murder in the City of London for sixty years, naoon of those who prosecute when crimes ofthat na i
lying on the table. But the Right Honourable Gen-
pointed to inquire with respect to the state of pri- that is to say, from 1755 to 1815, it appears that tare are prosecuted; by treeeimination of those who e
thation ehe a
tleman
entertained very powerfulpprnss
setts. Experience has, indeed, most clearly demon- the average annual number is about nine.— are witnesses; by the examination of those who sit as
unless the Solicitor of the Board had very strong rea-
prated that such acombitiation would have been ex- Now, Sir, I have no means of comparing this calcu- jurors; by the examination of all these and other par- .
sons against -the allegations of the Petitioner, they tremely inexpedient. For although two distinct Corn- Cation with the sate of morals with reference to this ties, the Cammittee has tried to ascertain the effect pro.
•ci would have afforded relief long ere now. mittees were appointed, each of which has, I believe, crime, in any of the other capitals of Europe ; first, dued by the denunciation of capital punishment, whe-
MreWILLIAM SMITH affirmed that it was well been remarkable fur the most assiduous investiga- because there is no city in Europe the population of they it tends to deter persons from the commission of
s . known that more than a twelvemonth had elapsed .r.
tion, neither has yet been able to come to a conclu- which amounts to a million ; and, secondly, because crime, or enables malefactors to escape with impuakr.
l; between the compromise and the personal seizure of sive Report. But this is not at all to be wondered there is no city in Europe whence it is practicable to With this purpose the Committee entered on the ea- e
i the petitioner. So enormous a degree of private in- at, considering the various and important matter obtain such accurate returns as those with which the mination of several sorts of witnesses.° We did not
i• justice he had scarcely ever heard of. The Honour- about which each Committee was called upon to in- Committee has been furnished by the City of London; examine the JUdges of the land, front considerations
n.)
able Member had, besides, the affidavit of a most re- quire. As to the Committee with which I have had but this I may say, without fear of contradiction, that founded on the dignity of their enttions, and 'on the
(the de that he
spectable
person, stating, ponent) had
the honour to act, I take leave to say, that its dili- that calculation shews the security of life against vio- feelings of delicacy and respect due to them. In e
• t conversed accidentally with the informer that very
n - lence in this great metropolis to be, if not complete, thought it would be unbecoming us to call on tnese •
ft. night, at the very time when the act of smuggling stitution is respectable. I have never, indeed, met as nearly so as can in any place or condition of so- learned and venerable individuals- for an opinnei
was sworn to be committing, and that the informer, with a body of gentlemen more decidedly superior to ciety be expected. From that calculation it is evi- on the propriety of continuing a description of punine 11
who swore that he saw the transaction, was at least
I every thing like party feeling or influence. But were dent thatethe chance every year is 500,000 to 1 against ment, which they would perhaps almost immediately
i
thirty riles distant. From all these considerations, it consistent to mention the names of the gentlemen the murder of any individual—a chance so remote, afterwards be required, in the discharge of their due-,
• there was not a single ground for the charge. It had most attentive to the duties of the Committee, that that a very small premium indeed would be required to direct to be inflicted. It appeared to us to be re- ,
originated in renege, private malice, or was the off- superiority would be readily admitted. The evidence to cover the risk by those who engage in pecuniary pugnant to all notions of prudence and decorum to
spring of gain by law expenses. for which we sought at the outset of our inquiry was speculations on such subjects. Sir, it is also to be re- expect a condemnation of the law from those who •
i.
Tl:te_P•tition Wll 2 VOGOiTC4I, read, ordered to lie nn principally were documentary, that is, with respect to the collected, that there is another circumstance to be appointed to administer it. Not being free to
?the.table, and to be piloted.
commitments, convictions and executions throughout taken into the account, to which, however, I confess condemn it, their commendation, had they corn- •
MR. O'HANLON. -the country—and With a view to the attainment of that other Members of the Committee have been dis- mended it, would have had no weight ; for what va-
Mr. BROUGHAM wished to state hii reasons for such evidence, we had recourse to all the public posed to attach more weight than I myself have. In lue can attach to praise when there is no liberty to i
l Honourable and Learned l'i not having presented a TrOion this Session from his
Wald, Mr. O'Hanlon. He offices connected with the several departments of considering the security possessed for life in a great censure?—(Near, hear). On those grounds, there-
public justice. We have, indeed, searched in every city, in which that security exists principally .in the fore—on the grounds of consideration and respect for al
noticed, that he had bein unfortunately prevented direction with all the assiduity in our ponser, and I humanity of the inhabitants, and is little attributable those dignified individuals, and not from the slightest It
. ,
I II front his attendance for two or three weeks, on ac-
count of indisposition; and that when he returned to have the satisfaction to state, that we are enabled to any supposed restraints resulting from a system of distrust of the soundness of their judgment, or of the
to communicate a greater body of authentic, va. police, it has appeared to several Members of the value of the information which they were capable of
n
•
his Parliamentary duties, he found such a variety of luable, and various information on this subject than Committee to be indispensible to compare the secu- communicating, the Committee, after much delibcra- _A
immediate and unavoidable engagements, as to have has ever yet been laid before Parliament—(l-Im,- ) rity enjoyed with the restraints imposed. Unquestion- tion, determined that it would be unfair and unbes
entirely precluded him from turning his attention to The returns which we have received'under this head ably it is the object of all legislation on this subject, coming to examine them. With respect to those t
the case of his Honourable and Learned Friend, till s
with respect to London and Middlesex are peculiarly to afford the greatest security with the least restraint. learned persons who have retired from the judicial
the Session was too far advanced to hope fee the de- s f
eitsfacsory. We have indeed received complete re-, Those Members of the Committee to whom I allude, bench, they appeared to us to be placed in a very
sired effect. Suffice it, however, now to intimate, t
turns of the commitments, convictions and executions ate of opinion, that we' must consider the existing different point of view, and we accordingly desired
that he intended, at an early period of the next Ses- in those important districts, from the year 1694 to security for life in the metropolis, with reference the attendance of five of those learned individuals—
sion of Parliament. to present a new Petition, which, the g
year
1814 ; these Returns forming a most valu- to the existing improvement in its police. It has been namely, Lord Erskine, Sir William Grant, Sir Vicary
he flattered himself, would produce some satisfac-history of the Criminal Laws of ate years,for instance, that theday police of the Gibbs, Sir James Mansfield, and Sir Alan Chambre.
able acquisition to the
i
tory effect. of the country. Those in whose department it lies, in City of London has been put on its present foot- Circumstances rendered the attendance of Sir Vicary
Sir GEORGE HILL complained that the charges i
the City of London, to furnish information of his ing. For myself, however, I frankly confess, that Gibbs and Sir William Grant inconvenient; but we
had been so long hanging over the Lord Chancellor natute, have, I must say, been most ready to afford I have always doubted whether that destruction of have reason to believe that those learned persons ad-
and Attorney-4Jeneral of Ireland. As individuals,
the Committee every assistance in their power. I am the feelings of independence and self-respect, the here to the opinions which they have expressed on
however, it must be perfectly indifferent to them ' happy, indeed, to bear this public testimony. to the best guards, allow me to say, of public morality, the subject in this House. It also appeared, that it
when the charges were attempted to be substantiated.
. . meritorious conduct of these Gentlemen, who will, I occasioned by vexatious- and numerous restrictions would be inconvenient to Sir James Mansfield and
Mr. BROUGHAM said, lee had taken the allege-
doubt not, continue to prosecute their diligent in- on human conduct, is not more powerful in the Sir Alan Chambre to attend the Committee, and
times on the authority of the Petitionet, and he had • untilßeturns le d the production, than in the repression of ctime—(Hear.) as it did not appear that those learned persons had
: reason to, believe them. He understood that the hili quiry their arc comp te up to
latest period. With regard to the Home Circuit also At the same time, it would be very improper, were formed any decisive opinion on the subject at is-
persons named did not dispute the facts, and the
we have acquired a great deal of accurate infiwnia- I not to state that the views on this part of the sub- sue, the Committee, in consonance to their wishes,
charge rested u pen an argument founded on those facts. tion, for which we are much indebted to Mr. Knapp, ject of several Members of the Committee, for whom abstained from pressing their attendance. Sir
.
. ' Sir GEORGE HILL did not know whether the the Deputy Clerk of Assize for that Circuit. From I entertain great respect, differ materially from my Archibald Macdonald had the goodness volunta-
.
• Lord Chancellor and Attorney-General affirmed or that Gentleman we have had Returns,of the Com• own. By the Returns which have been received by rily to attend the Committee, and his evidence we
:n ' denied the facts.—The conversation then dropped.-
mitments, Convictions and Executions from 1689, the Committee from the Western Circuit, it appears consider to be of very great w&ght and importance;
, , MR. ALEXANDER LAMBE. which was the year after the Revolution, up to the that in that district there has been at least no increase the House will perhaps, therefore, pardon me if I
n On tke motion of Mr. WYNN, Mr: Alex. Lambe year 1717 ; also from 1755 to 1784, and from 1785 of the crime of murder. For the last fifty years, state briefly its substance. It is the opinion of' Sir
was brought to the Bar to be reprimanded for de- to 1814. But through the medium of this Gentle- the annual number of convictions for that crime in Archibald Macdonald that the infliction of capital
• • stroying certain Papers, which it was probable the man's laudable industry we hope to have the chasms the Western Circuit has been pretty nearly the same. punishment on crimes, not of the most atrocious ne-
'l House would have required to be produced at the Bar, alluded to filled up, and we shall then be in posses- So that on the whole, Sir, it clearly appears, that tore, renders prosecutors reluctant to proceed, wit-
I I • Mr. Lambe leaving been produced at the Bar, ••
eon of a complete Return of the Administration of .however the people of England may leave been op- nesses reluctant to give evidence, and Juries reluctant
e The SPEAKER proceeded to reprimand him, ob- the Criminal Law for ISO years. The Returns of pressed by -distress, and however they may have been to convict ; and, therefore, that the chance which a
' I serving, that under all the circumstances the House the Western Circuit have also been pretty full and driven by indigence to the commission of crimes of criminal has of escaping with impunity is greatly in-
did
t the Papers was a wilful contempt, but that it arose yet required to complete the returns from the other character for humanity, for repugnance to shedding crimes. It is his opinion, that against treason, mute _
from an anxiety on the part of Mr. Lambe not to circuits. But it is remarkable, that we have as yet .blood, fur abhorrence of cruelty. To that charac- der, arson, and crimes of that description the punish-
commit a breach of professional confidence. It was, received no information whatever from Ireland. No ter, untainted by any temptation which the circum- ment of death ought to be continued; but forty
however, a high offence, and under other circum- notice, indeed, has yet been taken of the orders trans- stances of the times might have been supposed to years' experience convinces him, that with reference
stances would have been severely visited. mined by the Committee to that part of the Empire, generate, they are now, as ever, entitleda-(iear, to crimes unattended with atrocious or violent cir-
,
Mr.Lambe was then discharged, on the payment and this is seriously to be lamented, for it is much hear).—Sir, I could not omit the opportunity of cumstances, the existence of that punishment is inju-
,
4 his fees.
more important to obtain such information from Ire- stating the gratifying truth, that whatever the popu- rious, rather than beneficial to the community. The
, 1 ' THE PENAL CODE. land, than from any part of England, with the cir- lation of this country may have lost, it has not lust next class of persons examined by the Committee
Sir JAMES MACINTOSH brought up the Re- cumstances of which Parliament is already so much a particle of that dearest and most valuable of its consisted of experienced Magistrates. who, engaged
port of the Committee appointed to inquire into the better acquainted. But let us hope that this defici- possessions—its reputation for national humanity ! as they constantly are, in the examination of accused
state and effects of our Criminal Laws, which was ency will be supplied by the next Session. The in- (Hear, hear, hear),—Sir, I proceed to advert to the persons previously to their committal, have more direct
ordered to lie on the table. quiries of the Committee have been directed to two second topic, for the elucidation of which the Re- access to a knowledge of all those circumstances ot
• Sir JAMES then rose and spoke to the following ef- great objects—first, to ascertain the state of our na- turns that I have mentioned were sought by the which it is indispensable to be.informed in an inquiry
• feet:—ln moving that this Report be printed, I think it tional morality—and, secondly, what Criminal Laws Committee ; namely, to.ascertain as far as such Re- of this nature, than even the Judges of our Criminal
•t proper to explain the reasons why no proposition has are useless or mischievous, and may be conveniently turns can be supposed to assist in ascertaining, what Courts, or any other description of individuals. Dr.
. ' yet been submitted to the House upon the recom- dispensed with. As to the first object, the House will Statutes, constituting capital felonies, have proved -Colquhoun, who was for 27 years a Police Magistrate;
- mendation of the Committee from which it proceeds. hear with pleasure, that the information ccmmuni- useless, or have become obsolete. In making this informed the Committee, that in his opinion, the exis-
, The Committee have, I can assure the House, from cared to the Committee is of the most grateful de- inquiry, we assumed as a principle, that the conti- tence of capital punishment for the crimes to which I
the moment of its institution, applied itself with the seription. It is indeed peculiarly honourable to the nued existence of laws, which had not been executed have alluded, 'frequently prevented convictiens.—
" utmost diligence to the important object of its inves- character of the country, for I have great satisfaction for above a century, could not be considered as very In that Gentleman's opinion it is inespensible to pn-
tigation, emir* applied itself unceasingly to -carry in stating, that this information is such as folly to necessary—that laws which had slumbered so long nish treason, murder, arson, burglary, &c. with death.
its labours to a termination. It had, indeed, enter- justify the statement of the Noble Lord (Castlereagh), could .be considered only as an.incumbrance to the But he expressed his persuasion, that the public mind
rented the hope of getting through its enquiries atan that crimes of an atrocious and violent character Statute-book, and as bringing en the Nation impu- revolts from the infliction of that punishment in cases
earlier period; and until those enquiries were closed, have very materially diminished in this country, onions of a more sanguinary nature than it deserves. not attended with circumstances of violence or atro-
or at least arrived at some degree of maturity, it was The Returns which the Committee have received 'Sir, lam aware that there are Honourable Members city. Dr. Colquhoun's evidence is confirmed by that
deemed inexpedient to submit any measure to the from the Home Circuit are in that point of view ea.' who will not coincide in the justice of this . remark. of Mr. Mainwaring, a very intelligent Magistrate fin
' •
contederation of this Boron; and at the present mo- tremely curious and interesting. It appears by those I am aware that it may be argued that the terror of t e county of Middlesex ; as well as by the Otti en'
.