Star.
London, England, 1810-03-03 00:00:00

• .
..be Noble Lord were so in his place, be thould
or twn to him ; a he wa.s not, he should Imkrely mows
•e, he DOW ceived.—Ordered accordingly ; read, and
e table.
tionon of Mr. FOSTER, a Committee was appointed
:;.oec:l,:g the state of commtmication between Shrews-
H 0.% heasl, for the accommodation of travellers, and the
on the turnpike-road fund.
FERGUSON presented s petition from the bleachers
td cotton in the counzy ot Fite, praying to be allowed
,howback on the importation of starch, ashes, soap,
istutte, r.d other bleaching materies, as allovred

Niit uati• Earl cf autthain* due great- Ina, who
raised England to the zenith of her glory ; wbeaayes
tions had called fertlt thegraeittode stud adatiratitia of
a whole natioit, and who had so far enobled the title,
of which he was the first, weareri. .that 'however
might subsequently have been anllied, it w
still command the veneration of posterity ;-a—lit
had been said by that illustribus Statesman-1'
That he had not been long in Office • before
he found the ground was rotten under his• feet."
—That great man too had asserted boldly and
with impunity, though nbw it was considered so
heinous a Libel that,--.“ there was a secret some- ;
thing behind the Throne greater than the Throne
itself." By a strange fatal* of the son of that en- 'I
lightened Minister, it appeared formed now a part of !
that secret power by which his patriotic father was i
turned out of office'. There had always been a secret
something about the Throne by which the efforts of
every Government had been at times counteracted.—
However incessant the toil to weave the web, in one '
night, one hour, this invisible power was able to un-
ravel it. It was like
•
--- the drudging Goblin sweat
To earn his cream-bowl, duly set ;
When, in one night, ere glimpse of morn,
His shadowy tail had thresli'd the corn
That ten day•slabouriss could not end; •
And, stretclid out all the chimney's length,
Basks at the fire his hairy strength ;
And, crop-full, out of doors he fl'ngs,
Ere the firsecock his matin rings !
The feelings of his Majesty ought not to be unneces-
sarily violated by complaints, hut when such an in*
stance of secret influence was found, he thought die
King'sc yes should be opened to the circnmstance.and
that he should be told the British Constitution knew
nut cf ostensible servants of the Crown. It was the
duty of that House, by recording on their Journals
the transactions, and by taking other necessary steps, i
to guard against the recurrence of such a circum-
stance. Lord Chatham had not only sinned against
the Constitution, but his conduit had been so repre-
hensible as to tend to create divisions between the
army and the navy, and thus bring new disasters on
the country. It was the glory of late years that the
two services were on almost every occasion combined
on the most cordial co-operation. Those mutual com-
plaints which formerly arose out of differences to
which thousands of our warriors were sacrificed, were
now scarcely known, and the army and levy in their
operations were always found united heart and hand
in the common cause. Lord Chatham had openly
extolled the conduct of Sir Richard Strachan. Those
expressions of approbation he had subsequently con-
tradicted, long after the conclusion of the Expedi-
tion ; and that too at a time when no inquiry was in-
tended (for he knew that Ministers were-determined
not to grant an inquiry). The Gentlemen opposite
did not know at that time that an inquiry would
he wrung from them; they were not aware of
their weakness. Under these circumstances, Lord
Chatham, three days before the Meeting of Parlia-
ment, at a time when he knew no inquiry was in-
tended, had crept in a covered private manner to the
King, to stab the Constitution ; or, if not to stab the
Constitution, at least to stab the character of a gallant
Naval Officer. Why was not the narrative made
public before ? Lord Chatham thought it complete
in October ; but he had kept it back, because he
wished it to go iu with the narrative of Sir Richard
Strachan. He did not then know that an Address
would be presented to the King on the subject ; nor
did he know that Sir Richard Strachan would be
called on for any such narrative. When asked if he
had heard that Sir Richard Strachan had been called
on for such a paper, he had answered that he had
not. lle stated that he had reserved his narrative,
that the two might go in together, yet subsequently
it appeared on Lord Chatham's being interrogated
on the subject, that he did not think Sir Richard
Strachan had such a one to send. On this sub.
ject he would say little., it spoke for itself, and re-
quired no comment. Would it be said that Lord
Chatham did not mean to cast a slur on the cha-
racter of Sir Richard Strachan, when in no less than
twelve places he threw direct blame on his conduct ;
could it be thought that the Noble Lnrd threw his
firebrands in sport ? A full exposition of all these cir-
cumstances would he trusted guard against those fa-
tal consequences which might otherwise have been
eepected to result from such conduct. He hoped the
army and navy would continue to be united on all
occasions. He would not detain the House longer
on the subject. He felt some anxiety on the occasion,
bor. it was not the anxiety of doubt or of fear, or if of
either, it only proceeded from an apprehension that
he had not done the subject justice—that he had
omitted to state something that ought to have been
II
mentioned. He thought the House could not object
to the resolutions he had to submit to them. If they
did, if they stopped short of passing a vote of censure
on such conduct, he thought they would act incon-
sistently, and would lose the credit they had gained
by their former vote, but agreeing to it, they would
prove to the country that they had not (as they had
been represented to be) been wholly unworthy of
their confidence. He concluded by moving,
" That John Earl of Chatham, having requested permission
of his Maj..sty to pro cent to hint a narrative of his proceedings,
did the I.lth of January privately submit to the King a paper,
bearing date the 15th of October, purporting to be a narrative of
the rp)cectlings of his Majesty's land torces under his command,
of which he withheld all knowledge from his Majesty's Mini-
ster-, and the Admiral commanding the naval part of the Expedi-
tion, whose conduct he had implicated in no fewer that twelve
rim of his narrative, and that on the 10th of February it had
been returned to him, in consequence of a request from him to
that effect, and that the sante was .:gain tendered on the 14th of
February to his Majesty, having been altered, by the omission of
a paragraph, containing an opinion, the substance of which, from
the examination of Lord Chatham, they had not .been able to
aicer :dn.
" fiecobdly, That It is the opinion of this House, that John
'Earl of Chatham haying thus acted, had been guilty of an uncon-
stitutional abuse of the privilege he enjoyed of having access to the
-Throne, which could not but tend to be highly Injurious to the
,public service."
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
complained that a most unfounded misrepresentation
had been given of his conduct. He had contended
that it was inconsistent to ask a Cabinet Minister to
recall what by oath he was forbidden to disclose.—
:With respect to the inconsistency imputed to him in
voting against the Address after he had Stated it to
be proper to address the Throne on such occasions,
the Hon. Gentleman himself did away the charge
while he made it. He had said that he would always
maintain that right, but always contend for the using
of it with discretion. Saying this, he admitted it to
be a fair question, whether. or not that.was a time at

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having excited a good deal of laughter,
)RD AI)VOCATE OF :sCO pleasantly oh-
Gcnilmen
which suppose this article was
r a oject, certatnly was not in the con-
ef the petitioners.
trj; \EY movea fcr a copy of a letter from the Secre-
.
",r :L.) :he luspector General of Hospitals, dated July 8,
Irdered.

NOTION OF CENSURE.
sehIITBREAD rose to make the motion of
he had given notice. He said, it was just
ass since he had the honour to address the
a paper or papers, of which
the SLbject of
agreatr reason to believe that some use had been
/ha W 2 ; not proper or constitutional ; and his
icaoce the House to vote an
than 1M Wa
) his M.nesty, praying that he would be
pleasedgra-
to order those papers to be laid before
woe lie then contended, that the House not
id the r:eht, but that it was also a duty in-
et cn them, to call for those papers; and to
ircostsl honour of the House, they did on that
sae that the papers ought to be produced ;
conseyeence of the Address then agreed
ek tee eeswer that had been returned to that
ash he thought it a duty incumbent on
to found the Resolutions which he should
is have to submit to the consideration of the
His endeavours, on that occasion, had been
etly successful, and the vote of that night
form a proud political era in the history of this
T, on which posterity would look with reve-
and 7.e.Tect, and would feel the deepest grati-
hr the vigilance, firmness, and patriotism dis-
on that eight by the House of Commons. In
Irlv part of the inquiry, when an answer was
:d from a certain personage who happened to
'vivo Councillor, a difficulty had been started
R;ght Honourable Gentleman opposite to
and hy his Majesty's Law Officers, as to the
of coonining a Privy Councillor, who by his
:as bound to keep the secrets entrusted to him
A capacity ; but the Right odon. Gentleman
told the House, the difficulty might be easily
oiree for it was only necessary to address• his
4 on be occasion, and he would be advise:l to
ante with the objection, by releasing such Privy
idler from his oath. The right he contended
Ist ; the discretion it was their part to consider
occasions, and to use it, ia a greater or less
as 'according to the opinion they anrertained
of
Oa e5:6,4 of enforcing the right. But, on the
rses; cl thi, day sehsnight, the Right Hon. Gentle-
oise who It .d been so favourable to addressing on a
haustoccasion, enpcsed the address w hied the House
led sr hones:l-ably for themselves voted, and would
love remolded them that it was necessary, noteith-
easing the right, to pause and ascertain whether, in
%Ted discretion, they would address his Majesty for a
pper et papers which might never have been in exist-
ence. "In the pr, sent case, however, (said Mr. Whit-
latal),es ail 'know that John Earl of Chadians did,
titan ur.coatitotional manner, take his minutes and
Noss to the King, and has thereby committed a
grez: offence against the Constitution, and it becomes
the duty of the House to shew its sense of such pro-
ceedings." When the House reflected and took into
this consideration the difference of what had been
said by the Noble Lord in the ex tmination of the
•27tii February, compared with that evidence 'which
ia Lid given on the d February, had he been an
cidinasy witness, the House would not now have had
sccasiou tc be debating what they would do concerning
it ; they would have felt their way at once ; but being
a Peer of the realm, it was not by a course of ordinary
proceeding the House could express their sense of his •
toaduct. It al neared, he said, that Lord Chatham,
rithout any communication of his intention to any
*a his colleagues in office, had, on the lath of Jo-
tsary, made a ccrnmunication to his Majesty 4-
soscoon: the Expedition to the Scheldt, be deli-
vsreg into his Majesty's hands a narrative of the
pr;cecdings in that Eapedi tic!) . It appeared also
that this oar:dive continued in his Majesty's posses-
soa from the said 151 h day of January to the I.lth
cf February. Till the 7111 of February it l:iy there
tneasturbed. The Earl of Chatham himself had,
tisheg ail that time., never tltcui;ht ot any alteration
losn; necessary ; and the reasons he had stated for
whiiiun to have it agaia, and to make any altcra-
scss, were so dill-et-ere that nu man could tell what
meant. On the 7th of February, it appeared,
',sorest, that he dnired to withdraw the nail a-
ties ia ordsr to make alterations io it. What that
ottsatioa was, the Noble Lord would not say ; hut
le believed it was to alter an opinion that was given
!oval-kis the latter part of it. On the 10th ot Fe-
L'usry it •a as asked for ; on the 12th it was trans-
Load to Lord Chatham ; and on the 14Th it was
'eso hadered to his Majesty, who erdercd it to he
ie:7l;nto the hands of the Secretary of State.—
.1e- apression " tendered" had struck him (Mr.
1 Notbsead) and he had in consequeoce asked if the
PirP' , thus altered and amended, had ever passed
into tit• hand ? He was answered—" No ; it
ltd not." A..ins it rppeared Lord Chatham had
rioehuected a paper, in which the character of Sir
icreou Schacht:llllA been implicated no ihwcr than
tWciae times, which had been withdrawn from his
,
`43lsszY for the purpose of having, an opinion insert-
ed therein, which he had no doubt went to inculpate
theadilant Admiral. It had been left 2.3 gays in the
11all7va el. his Majesty, then withdraw n to be corrected,
"'id
as,ain " tendered" to his Majesty till the 14th
of FOort:try, when it was given in, in an amended
s,:ate,;uld then, without passing into the hands of his
Malest:, communicated by the consent of Lord Cha-
en.
if" to Ministers. At the present crisis, towards
tse dose of a lcmreign, our Sovereign was so blessed
'ls to be better loved -perhaps than any Monarch who.
Ilmleeer sat on the throne before him. The virtues
which so eminently distinguished him were all his
Zellr.,:u.dr if he had any faults, for those faults, from
e of our Constitution, his confidential Mini-
sters were responsible. What had however been the
conduct of those about him during the period he had
besA
sea,el on the throne ? It had heeu said by

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Which it ctilcl ' tiled with diseretlion iHe therefore of the slip a. their colleaotte, and seer tvd h'm as dthiekiugat could consistently oppose it.— ipeace.oitering to the people, for tract. misconduct -
With-. -TMect., the motion, he hoped the House which ought to have visited in ven,-;:ance. the whole '
woutd tVot. bp ro:A eiipitate, and vote the lent-ions' of his Majesty's Government. He had no ditlicuity
proposed
he iVith qut due consideration. '' On Thursday, in saying, that under such circumstances in a ba-
wla was informed that notice had been given of lanced case, he would support a colleague. He
such a motion, he had asked of it was just that the begged not to be misunderstood ; lid did not mean to
evidence given at.that Bar should he canvassed before 'say, if a colleague wars wrong, he should tinder any
it had been printed. ft was not fair to select 'one or circumstances be supported. But in a balars ed case,
two questions froth the evidencee'for. the purpose of where a colleague was merely in error, he thought,
creating a discussion. If that course were to be pur- deserting his cause, he should be exposed to more
sued, of what use was it printing the minutes of the merited reprobation than could otherwise fail to his
evidence, as Gentlemen, who on thatatcount did not share. Justice, decency, and propriety, alike called •
regularly attend, could not be prepared foi the cle. on them to.post?orte coming to a decision on the re-
bate ? The Hon. Gentleman had seemed in Sortie solutions that met ; he therefore concluded by rnov-
measilre aware of the impropriety of taking up the Ing an adjournment of the debate till Mondey.
subject in such a manner, as he had expreaea an in-. • Idr. BRANb thought it was net so much of a, per. •
tendon of putting the evidence out of the cliteatioo. sonal as a constitutional question.. •If he were in 'of-- •
But had he not raised considerable prejndices against" fice, and a friend of his acted so, he would disdain
the individual whose conduct he had so fully diScus- him as a Colleague, -The qtfestion was more serious.'
1 sett by contrasting the evidence given by him oldie than Gentlemen might think. A secret influence bad
23c1 with that of the 27th, where it appeared to be of letig surrounded the Throne. The greatest orator.
an unfavourable nature ? Was it too much to require this country had produced( Mr.Biirkejhad pennon noel'
(even if every one there was acquainted with the evi-' that secret influence to be dangerous. He wasfor Ole'
dence) a short time to consider of it ? Would it be early decision, thoughitpostporiement were necessary.
well to hurry themselves on an occasion which might to the due considerauen of the subject, he should •Ja
tonsign the character of an individual to such obloquy the last man in the world-to oppose the adjournment.
as the resolutions went to throw on the Noble Lord ? He was averse ito personal questions, but when a fa-
What advantagestould there be in passing those re- vourite at Court was seen prejudicing the Sovereign
solutions on a Friday„ 'that might • not be gained if again* the Navy, he had lees objection to such aties-.
they were not decided.ontill Monday ? Would it not Lion than he should have under almost any other cir-'
better tospostpeosifeni adorn, that' dry might cutnstances. He concluded, supporting -the -nooka,.
least have the appearance or considering the sub- Mr. BATHURST begted leave. to oar at few
ject before they rive their vote ? It was not well to observations. If it'was cofteeivett that thettestiot
decide on that evidence which had only been put into was one of great constitutional importance, and &trite
, ' their hands since entering-the Hisuse that day. The affecting the character and honour of the person-im-
Hon. Gentleman had commented on the evidence plicaied in the resolutions, it would be advistatee
given by Lord Chatham tin tbe t'Jd and 27th Fehru- that the question should be disposed of in the manner
ary ; but could it be suppose4thit the House-was pre- least liable to objections. He therefor*, thought, as
pared to enter into the subject ! -If the conduct of the e‘riaence had not been printed and distributed
the Noble Lord had been such ,as bad been limn:lied last night, it would be boner to postpone the discia--
to him, he should think the resolutions submitted to' don for a night or two. If the Right Hon. Gen*.
the 'House not sufficiently severe If Lord Chat- man (Mr. Pto-ceval) had moved tfie previous ques-
ham had endeavoured secretly to blast the character arm, he could not have brought himself to assent to
of *Sir Richard Strechan, he would readily pdmii a motion which might get rid of the oriend ques-
that neicensure the Hotiee
.could past on such con- tion-; but as it was merely for adjourning the debug
Iduct would be too severe.. But Was there- any thing till Monday; he should' agree to the proposition. lit
in the conduct of Lord Chatham that could give a thought'that a short delay was due to the great laii
colour to the charge ? Was there any thing in bi> portance of the question, whether as perfectly affe.;t:
choketer that could justify such an imputation. Ht ing the Noble Lord who was the object.of it, or fa.*
'wild hate them try it by dates and by 'circuit constitutional point of view; as affecting the puts.
.staiiiii. 'lf it hid been his object to , gratify any memoirs, law of the country.
maligiant motive (he was not then speaking. as to Mr. WHITBREAD rose to shorteat the debate,
the propriety of his conduct), be was of opinion he and•save the tune of the House, by stating the view , • '
would have adopted very different measures. He whichh-! now tookof the subject. The Chancellor of the
was not the advocate ór the Noble LOrd ; under all Exchequer .appeared to him to take that ground been
the circumstances, lie thought his conduct in spre lithich alone any cavil could be raised against his rim-
senting the Narrative such-as no matt could IhO. don; in stating that he had not given the House yes-
roughly approve—(Hear, Hear, Hear,)—but it 're= terday to understand, that be intended to bring on the
=tined to be seen what degree of mature he 'pistil, minion this day. whether the papers were distributed
deserve. He would try the dates to see whether or tiot or ode. He certainly had not expressed himself peei-
any malignant motive towards Sir Richard Strachan tive on the subject; but conceiving that they would
could be fairly imputed trim. If the Narratift be distributed, he went oat of the -House for some
was intended to injure the' cter of -that 'Officer, time, and called at the Vote Office to learn whether they •
why in the 'name of fortune coltitaa4 sense did he keep' were distriliuted or not. Upon hi:return to the House,
it back at all ? On what prinilplelould it be supposed' his friends told him that it had been settled in his ab-
that he delayed to present it till the 15th of January t once, that the motion should positively come on this
If it were intended to injure Sir Richard Strachan day, and in that persuasion he had irmained in the
privately, would Lord Chatham ever have recalled it House till a late hour. He thought, however, that
with a view to have it published ? For the situation when hr constructed his Resolutions in such a manner,
is which the Noble Lord stood, he (th: Chancellor ot that they alluded-to nothing which passal in the evi-
the EXcheteuer) fat Missal' to be in some degree re. dance riven taro* the fritiefeacept one welitarypitssago,
sponsible ; and unless his mind changed very much, which' Members could be informed of in the twinkling
he would never place an Officer in a similar situa• of an eye, there would have been no objection on this
tion, to unite in himself the Cabinet Minister with ground. The only paseage in the evidence cd the F.Ttli
the General Officer. The inconveniencies arising which was alluded to, was that in which his Lordship
out of that circumstance, which he had not antici- stated, " that he did not know what alterations had
pated, were of such magnitude (though there was been made in the original plan." Now although the
nothing unconstitutional in such an appointment), papers containing this evidence had not been printed
that he would never again blend the two characters. Ind regularly distributed, yet the evidence itself was
if at a future period a Member of the Cabinet should :n writing on their table ; and as thesmaterial part
be thought a proper person to conduct an Expedi- of it was not more than seven lines in length, he
tion, he would wish his functions as a Cabinet thought that any Member could, at a single glance,_
Minister to be suspended for the time. The Noble have this information. When the Right Honourable
Lord, acting as he did, was certainly not correctly Gentleman, however, proposed toudjeurn the debate
right, but it was not fair thence to argue that on till Monday, it would be recollected that at the time
of his making that Motion, he gave notice that it *bra
any question lie could give advice without his col.:
leagues being acquainted with the circumstance.— his intention, upon that day, not to rneej the question
fairly, but to endeavour to get rid of it by moving
He might have been in some degree driven into the
measure by the popular feeling excited against him. the previous question. For fear, however, that it
It was not too much to say, that after the evidence might be said that he took the House by surprise, he
had been given 'at their Bar, the current of public in= was pot% ready to consent to the adjournment wail
dignation running unjustly strong against him (unjust Monday, on the express condition, however, that it
it was, for he contended that there were no reasons should be perfectly understood that it. should on that
for imputing misconduct to him), it was not uana- day have precedence of any other business.
tural for the Noble Lord to think it would not be General GROSVENOR said, that he was perfectly
prudent to produce his case or defence, before he convinced, that the more the character ot his Noble
knew what counter-statements were to be made, that Friend (Lord Chatham.) was sifted and examined, the
such might not appear to answer his. Again he more would the House satisfied with the conduct
wished the House to observe he was not the advo-. of the Noble Earl: 1
cate of the Noble Lord ; though in the view he took General LoFrus said, that :hi *certainly 'fiaa
of his conduct be could see error, he could: not consent understood that the House had an assurance froti
to bestow the epithets proposed ; lie could not accede the Honourable Gentleman's (Mr.,Whitbritd's) troll
to the resolutions. He did not wish to evaOe the mouth, that the guestion would not have come oir
subject, he merely wished to give the House a fair this night.
opportunity of reviewing the evidence. Be had no 'The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
objection to state what line of conduct he inte was ready to give the question the precedence on
nde
pursue on Monday. He should move the previous qu, s Monday ; but at the same time he observed, that there
tion. The narrative had been spoken of as if it ha. was a notice of a motion of the Honourable Baronet
been constructed with a view of creating differences (Sir Francis Burdett), for that day.
between the Army and Navy ? There were no more Mr: CREEVEY, in the absence of the Honourable
grounds for such a statement than if the substance of Baronet, postponed that motion till Thursday, and
the debate on Mr. Whitbread's motion was adjour-
Thethat Narrative had been given in evidence at the bar.
Honourable Gentleman had stated the paper to tied till Monday.
have been drawn up by the Noble Lord, at a time TREATY WITH PORTUGAL. .
when he knew that Ministers were deterniined to The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
grant no inquiry. He denied the truth of that asser- wished to postpone the consideration of the question
Lion. It was determined to give the House such pa- which stood for this day, because no opportunity had
peps as would prove that no culpability attached it- been afforded of laying the papers relative to the ee-
self to the army or navy long before the paper was pence of maintaining the troops proposed to be token
delivered. It was for the House to determine on into the pay of Great Britain on the table. He hoped
calling for more ; but, unsolicited, it was lee intention they would bore-ady on Monday, and as it was desi-
of Government to give some at least. ' Gentleenen, rable that the discussion should not arise until those
however, on the other side, thought they had nothing papers had been received, he should propose that the
to do but•to wait to see what Government did,' and consideration be put off till Friday next.
then, whatever line Of conduct they might adopt, con- Mr. PONSONBY thought that it would be better
demo their measures, and assert, that had the con- J that the further discussion of bis Honourable Friend's
trary course been pur,sued,all would have been well. motion shouldnot be prevented on Monday, and there-
-If the Noble Lord (Chatham) had merited the im- fore was ter the delay proposed, •
putations thrown out agaihet him, he (the'Cliantellor The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
of the Exchequer) would • h4'ire said, that he ought was desirous that nothing should-intervene to prevent '
no longer to haie been a colleague of hii. But under the discussion.
the present ',CirOnnstances, if 'Ministers had acted 1 After eime further observatitts from Mr RTDIM
so, and. said he. should no longer have remained. and Mr. PONSONBY (Who wished it to be understood
one ot theitnunilitr, it NvOld directly have been im- that the Inquiry into the Scheldt Expedition should
puted to them that ifiel hacl 04sscly takeo advantage ' stand for Tuesday, provide,: the debate on Monday

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whew