Star.
London, England, 1821-04-06 00:00:00

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

stilts which their labours procliced, they were eon-
fined to a solitary, and truly a wise Resolution—
namely, That all game was the property of him on
whose land it was found." The Committee stopped
there. It was not true, that if the restrictions were
taken off, no game could be bad ; such an assertion
could be made only by those, who were ignorant of
the way in which game was procured,%iid who, on,
like him (Colonel Wood), were acquainted with the
practices of poachers—(A laugh).—The poulterers
.would have the game at any rate. The making the
sale of it unlawful did not diminish, the quantities
sold. This was comparatively a recent enactment,
and its operation hitherto had not been very success-
ful ale had said modern, because it was only so
late as the reign of George the Second that the sale
cf game was prohibited by law. But, though he did
not attribute much good to that law, he was not now
to be understood as advising its repeal. His sugges-
tion would be, to repeal the present law, and make
game private property. He would also mark more
strongly the qualification of a legalized sportsman.
At present, it was hard to say who was qualified or
who was not. He would not have two sets of laws,
one for the poor man and another for the rich. The
unqualified Gentlemen ought to be severely pu-
nished when they sported without a license. In ano-
ther view of the subject, he would raise the certifi-
cate from its present amount of £3 10s. to five
guineas. He censured the practice of families in
town buying game, who might punish for the mode
in which it was procured in the country. He also
objected that Gentlemen were in the habit of making
a sale of game, by exchanging it occasionally tor'
fish, venison, and other luxuries; but this was. in
fact, a sale of game, for the poulterer re-sold it again,
to others of his customers. The Game Laws were a
complicated subject, and he hoped that a Committee
of the House would be appointed to inquire wheie
the evil lay, and apply some remedy to it. He would
be the last man to limit the country Gentleman in
his amusements, and he regretted, with others, that
so many of his countrymen spent their fortunes in
foreign parts. It ought not, however, to be over-
looked, that though this was an amusement to be
kept up, yet it was also the means of crowding the
jails yearly with criminals, and that it was very Alen
the first step in vice. _ _

The Regent's Canal Bill was read the third time and passed.
Mr. DOWNIE presented a Petition from the Corn Mer-
chants and others therein concerned, of Stirling, against the Bill
for the regulation of the Corn Averages.—Referred to the Com-
mittee on Agricultural Distress.
Mr. Srrjeant ONSLOW presented a Petition from certain
Solicitors of Ireland, praying that the Bill now pending in the
Iloilo: for facilitating the admission of Attornies to practice in the
Courts, who had taken degrees in the Universities of England,
might he extended to persons having taken degrees in the Uni-
versity of Trinity College, Dublin.—Laid on the table.—lle
gave notice, that he would add a clause to the Bill to this effect.
A Petition was laid on the table from the Corn Merchants of
Glasgow, against the Corn Average Bill.
Mr. F. PALMER presented a Petition from the Agricultu-
ralists of Biggleswade, complaining of Agricultural Distress.—
lleferred to the Committee.
Mr. BASTARD vresented a Petition to a similar effect front
the Agriculturalists of the Southern parts of the County of
Devon.—Referred to the Committee.
Mr. H. CLIVE laid on the table the third Report et the
Commissioners on Weights and Measures, which was ordered

Mr. DOUGLAS (a new Member) spokes against
the motion, and declared that, to such an extent had
poachers increased, that if the restrictions were en-
tirely taken off, there would be no game left in the
kingdom at the end of a year.

to be printed.
On the motion of Sir Inns Wismar a Return was ordered
of the Amount of Customs collected at the different Ports of
Ireland for a certain time.
Sir J. MACKINTOSH gave notice, that on Tuesday next be
would move for leave to bring in a Bill fur the Reformation of
the Criminal Cude. It was his intention merely to have the
Bill brought in, read the first time, and printed, and to put al
the discussion till Thursday, the 3d of May.
Mr. C. CALVERT moved for a Return of the Number of
Prisoners confined, by order of the Court of Requests of South-
wark, in the Borough Compter, for the last three years, distin-
guishing the number in each year, and the amounts of Debts by

Sir C. BURRELL objected to any change in the
present Game Laws. He thought that, in the de-
pressed state of the country, it would be unjust to
deprive the country Gentlemen of their only solace
and comfort—(A laugh).—As to making property a
qualification for killing game, he thought more in-
convenience would arise from inquiring into this test,
than existed under the present system. It would be
also most unbecoming and offensive, when a country
Gentleman had asked a friend to his house, to inquire
of him, in the first place, whether his property was
such as to qualify him for killing game?
Mr. LOCKH ART reprobated the conclusion to
which the former Committee had come, who had
made game property, but had not given any opinion
on the most difficult part of that question, namely,
to whom that property belonged. He admitted that
the great preserves supplied the poachers daily, but
he did not think making game property would cure
the evil. There could be no preserving game with-
out supposing it some sort of property. With regard
to what was said of the poachers having no distinct
idea of whom the property was vested in, and their
urging that as a justification for their trespass, he
thought that was a sophisticated argument, suggested
by the ingenuity of country attornies. If game was-
made property it would lead to numberless incon-
veniences. At present the greater part of the pro-
perty of land was in the lessees—the farmers—and,
he asked, would the House give to the farmer the
exclusive property of the game ? Another incon-
venience arising from snaking game property would
be, that the inhabitants of cities and large towns
would be absolutely debarred the recreation of shoot-
lug, as they could not set their foot on any man's land
without incurring the consequence of a letter from
an attorney.
Mr. BENET? (Wiltshire) was averse from in-
creasing the severity of the Game Laws; for he
thought too many commitments had already taken
place in consequence of their operation. What be
would suggest would be, that game should be made
so cheap that it would not be worth the poacher's
attention to run the risk of procuring it illegally. He
thought great good might be done by a Committee,
and he would therefore give the motion of the Noble
Lord hi; support.
Mr. COKE, jun. spoke against the Committee. He
thought no good result could flow from it. He was
no advocate for the present Game Laws, but he would
not, on any account, give to the sports of the country
Gentleman a sordid character—(Hear, hear).—The
present system was full of inconsistencies and incon-
veniences, but it was of long standing, and,he did
not think this the time to make any alteration in it.
It was not only due to the country Gentleman, but it
was also good policy riot to circumscribe him of those
amusements which attached him to his country.
Mr. WARRE thought that no legislative measure
would put an end to the practice of poaching ; for
though some families might, from scruple, abstain
from purchasing Game, yet so strong was the temp-
tation that the majority would be ready to purchase
it, not caring how it was proctsred. He was for the
Committee.

Dlr. HU hIE postponed the motion which stood for yesterday,
and which lapsed in consequence of the House not meeting, to
Tuesday next, respecting the disqualification of Officers belong-
ing to the Ordnance Department from sitting in that House.
The Committee on the Stamp Duties Acts was postponed
to this day.
Mr. LUSHINGTON laid on the table an Account of the
Produce of the Excise Duties.
GAME LAWS.
Lord CRANBOURNE rose to bring forward his
motion, of which he had given notice, for an altera-
tion in the Game Laws. He was sure the House
would agree with him, that that state of the law
with resi.ect to Game, which filled their jails yearly
with culprits, without producing any diminution of
the.crime, required to be substantially altered. After
a few further observations, the Noble Lord moved,
that a Committee be appointed to inquire into the
state of the Game Laws, and report their observa-
tions to the House.
Sir J SEBRIGHT seconded the motion. He

thought that any alteration in those laws must be a
benefit; for a set of laws more cruel, inefficient, and
altogether more repugnant to the human mind,
could not exist.
. Sir J. SHELLEY begged to remind the House,
that a Bill was brought in some time since for a
similar purpose by the Honourable Member for
Ilettfordshire, and even backed by his great talents,
it failed. But the Noble Lord, seeing that that Hon.
Member missed his fire, would whip up his jacket,
and have a shot at the laws himself. He disapproved
entirely of the motion, and would give to it every
opposition in his power.
Sir J. YORKE said, that he was neither sports-
man nor killer of game, but was an eater of game I
laugh).—He was not at all thankful to the. Hon.
Member for Corfe Castle, for the Bill which he in-
troduced for the amendment of the Game Laws, for
he believed that since the passing of that Bill, he
(Sir J. Yorke) had not had a second course dish at
his table—(A laugh).—He should hope, that in any
Bill brought in upon this subject, a clause would be
introduced, which would enable a man, when his
wife would say to him, " My dear, what shall we
have for dinner ; shan't we have some game ?" to
reply, " Aye, my dear, we shall have a pair of par-
tridges"—(A laugh).
After a few words from Mr. Winssr,
Mr. BANKES stated his objections to the motion.
He thought the Noble Lord laid no ground before
the House for this particular measureso He had
considered the subject of these laws with great at-
tention, and was of opinion that no alteration would
place the country under a better system of Game
Luis. He would have no objection to have a Bill
brought in for the amendment of a particular part
of the Laws. If it was left open for every one to
kill.,tame, there certainly would be an end to
poachers, but not a pheasant would be alive in the
country in twelve months hence. It was necessary
to keep the game for
.certajaisersons only, for the
amusement of fowlinkc Was one of the inducements
which endeared the English Gentleman to his home.
taking tha.t.away4e..'was. placed bekaw persons
of4tis own own classep;gl .1401: other- countries in.
Europe' He was a.gamsythe motion.
Colonel WOOD was one of the former Committee
vlsiC44atanclMade their Report to the House on this
subject. and which Repoli sem lying on the.table.—
He had no great respect for the memory of that
Committee, for, in plain turd], very many of the
suggestions which he (Colonel Wood) made to them,
they entirely disregarded—(A laaz,h).—As to the re-

' Lord LOWTHER spoke agaimt the motion,
Mr. HARBORD said, a More absurd, more unjust,
or more unnecessary code Orlavii never were framed
than the present Game Laws, They had produced
hardships and perjury without end, and for what pur-
pose? . For the exclusive preservation of that to a
few which ought Co belong to aW—(Ticar,. heizr).—
' He would vote for the Committee, hoping that some-
thing might be suggested in. their stead. He thought,
at least, that they might be so simplified, as that the
offences under them might be better understood. It
was said, indeed, as a reason for keepiag the Game
exclnsiveist.hat the country Gentleman was strongly
attache.) to his country. Touching this argument he
(Mr. Harbord) would say but a word, which was—
that if a Gentleman had no inducement to keep him
at home but the recreation or shoeting pheasants,

. recommend a Tar on Hot and Green-hott•e,, as
in
'substitute for the Tax in question. He wculd re.
a
not have
,h).ave anything to regret
commend to his Ho noura..le Friend (Str. Careers) to
tiilsLoacobrieund absence—(Hear,
I postpone the Motion till after the Report of die
divided, when the numbers were—
RNE replied.—The House then

- . 52 '

Agricultural Committee.
Mr. DAVENPORT said he should vote for there-
peal ; buthe wished the Motion to be put off till tilt
Report of the Committee had been made.
Mr

a. lIENETT (of Wilts) said, the Tax amounted
to two and a half per cent. on Agriculturists. He
thought Hot-houses already sufficiently used. He
should support the Motion.
Lord BELGRAVE, from under the gallery, also
supported the Motion, and took the opportunity or
asking the Chancellor of the Exchtsuer, whether it

- -
was true that the Colleges and Public Seminaries did
not contribute their proportion to the Window Tar?.
If it were so, he should shortly submit a Motion oft
the subject, conceiving that the exemption Was ets;
tirely improper.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER sai,l
undoubtedly the
.Colleges did pay Vk indow Tax,
being rated in proportion to the number of apai
ments in occupation.
Mr.on C.
aJa
understanding
nsdeeing
ingthtah.te:atrees uponmp‘ervthheiocif:trlilb:ellse lliuogosev;
and
of the Report, the Chancellor of the Exchequer would
be disposed to extend relief to the Agricultural hoe,
rest, by a modification of ring
heavily and mischievously on them, would have Da
hesitation in withdrawing his Motion—(Hear, hero
from Lord Castlereagh).
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said
that the Committee on Agriculture might attach
much importance to this Tax, and he therefore wished
to wait for the Report; but if pressed, he should o%
pose the Motion.
• Sir THOMAS LETHBRIDGE stated, that lutist
part of the country with which he was acquaints:l,
the repeal of the Tax in question would be a mighty
boon. lie was afraid that the Report of the Agnad-
ttual Committee would not be soon nude.
• Mr. GIPPS wished the Member for Cumberland
would wait for the Report of the Committee.
Mr. RICARDO should vote for the repeal of thk
Tax, upon the same principle that he had voted for
the repeal of the Malt Tax ; not that they were bad
Taxes in themselves, but to prove to the countrythe
the House was attentive toecononsy —(1 lear,hear),—.:
If it were true that the Monarchs of Europe had be.
come corn-merchants, he thought there soul.' bet
better chance of making a good bargain with them;
but as they would only take bullion, which we lad
not to give them, it was a srong reason why wesboali
grow our own corn.
Mr. BARING thought that the HOWOrable
net (Lethbridge) who had voted all the Loans toGo-
vernment, came now with a baj grace to cheat: (ft
he could use no milder term) those frani whom the
money had been borroWed-L(//eardkotri---The
Sinking Fund had been wholly abandoned try the Sir
nisters of the day ; and he wishid. to get rid of Air
delusion with which it had heereserrounded. Butte)
say that there should 'be no Sinking Fund, .was
same as to say there should be no public credit; or,
in other words, that we should go on to borrow at
long as there were fools to lend—(fharo hear),,—.No
one had asserted that the repeal'ot.theTat..would
afford *material relief. The great security of the coot.
try .was in its &dances and, in-the event of a war, it
would. be of more advantage thrvour armies or flees.
Mr. CALCRAFT was as anxious ys any ms i a
keep up the finances of the country; hut he must look
to thelneans-ef the country,_ to see if a,serplus fool
could be keet.np. At the present time he, tnougbt
this .Tai should be given up. He would look*
if redwetiomt.yould" not be made.its the Army Ad
Dravyi:ssidshr that way a Sinking. Fund be kept op.
Money' was iii ch safer in the-hands of 'the People
than in Atie.hands of the Corttmissioners for the Rs.
duction or the National Debt. In consequence d
what .had fallen fronr.the Chancellor of the Enke-
quer, he should recommend the motion to be aids-
drawn: A sum fully eqoal,to this Tax, or the Mak
Ta, might be saved by reduction.
Lord MILTON was.of opinion that public cask
would be better supported by leaving the money Ind*
pockets of the people, than by taking it out of thew.
He thought Ministers were not aware of cheated
of the distress. He feared too much importatownt
attached to the Agricultural Committee. But that
Chancellor of the Exchequer ought to have formal
an opinion of his own. He would recommend to&
'Chancellor of the Exchequer to allow the Bill to be
brought in, and the second-reading not to be ptetsi
till a Report should be made from the Coalmine.
Ile had bend, that in one of the Southern Cowin ,
a large track of land was about to be abandoned by
the tenant, in consequence of the operation-4 dig
Tar. He thought the repeal of this Tat would ben
gre;itre.rebuoolinl‘toEtNliefefaltnnitchrischdauntythta of
ot
give
M
esviityal.t Tmz
im
should the Committee delay their Report to.a digit
period, he should feel himself at libertyagaitstobrig
the subject before the House.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUEI
wished to wait for the Report of the Committee, w
see if he was justified in taking so glat.a sum bew
the revenues Of the country.
Mr. BRIGHT' would oppose any attempt Wob'
I stitute another Tax for that in question.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCIIEVPRo---ti.
he would reserve to himself the power Of rari-i.
another Tax, and tile House would have icicles,'"
to which of the two-it would prefer.
. Oh
After a few words from Mr. 1). BROWNE and
C. SMITH, •
should
dbAe said,LgTivHenObllyPthc,
hathiaticeulni!eris
ofa
thedisu'Ene
ic
pitag..:
as to the abandonment Of the Tat; he should 4101...
the House.
The gallery was cleartedv trstaodivisiontwokisli
and the Motion was..withdrawn..
CAM VAYNIESTS.
On the Order ortte Ds' wing movedhif
rrir,
House going. into at f..:onxirittee tbe `"".
Payments Bill,
bjeet to be 41.
Mr. BARING conceited the.;ll .6
importance,consider it.
l
ittstjlotelzi‘fimitiostveeitn.ttbreuaat tah4e.iinisntol
licsect Of tif)riL°
the Committee to reconsider the Pt A 4
19, with
Id hxe ton
a viewv to ablelo .d
which c
the Act Act u
of the public intetqt, • . • • . • aritEi
The CHANCELLOR ,
hoped the House would adhere to the tviiiin ee.reitt; b

bad come to on a fottner evening by a large majo-
rity. He should not then enter into details on the
ojlislect, hot should propose to adjourn the debate
w Mond:tv.
Mr. ELLICE would follow the example of the
Chancellor of the Exchequer, if another discussion
100 to take place..
Mr. BENNETT could not conceive why the sub-
ject was started, if it was not to be brought forward.
Mr. ELLICE thought the question of the Timber
Duties was of such moment that it should have the
precedence.
On the motion of the CITA NCELLOR of the EXCISE-
WEB) aheauhject was then put off till Monday.
TIMBER DUTIES.
Mr. BARING presented a Petition from the Mer-
chants of London trading to the North of Europe,
raying that the Timber Trade with the American
CAionies and the North of Europe might be placed
co the same footing, by a proportionate adjustment
of the duties.—Laid on the table, and ordered to
be printed.
In answer to a question from Mr. J. P. GRANT, it
was stated by Mr. ‘Vata.ace, that communications
had been received from the Swedish Government on
the subject of the alteration of the Duties on Timber.
The House then went into a Committee, when
Mr. WALLACE said, he would not long detain
the House on this subject. There were so many ob-
jections to the proposed amendment of the Timber
Duties, that he was of opinion they had struck upon
the fairest line between all parties concerned. The
alteration proposed was taken from the hest evidence
before the Committee ; and on those grounds he
could make no concession as to the present measure ;
because, however useful to the Revenue, this propo-
sition world shew no disposition on their parts to give
an advantage to foreign commerce. It was found
necessary to lay a Duty on Colonial Timber, in order
to satisfy the Northern Powers, who mi 'ht prevent
us from getting any timber from their States. He
had received above 100 schemes ; but they all agreed
in one thing, and that was, to bring about a mono-
poly of the trade with Norway. The measure now
proposed would give some advantage to Russia, as
compared with her competitor Norway. Russia had
for some time possessed' these advantages ; and it
would be hard to deprive her of them. As far as the
propositions wade to him went, the whole of this
trade would be thrown into the hands of Norway.—
All the evidence in favour of the North American
Timber trade seemed to originate in the bad debts of
Merchants who had been engaged in the Norway
deal trade. Norway had had her full share in this
trade for a number of years. He therefore thought
that some relief should be given to the Russian Trade
and that of Norway at the same time. Under the
plan he had to propose, Norway would have £l. 121.
and Russia £l. 13s. which would be as equal as
could be. The proposition of a Noble Lord, if ad-
mitred,. would give double the advantage to Norway;
and, consequently, the effect of it would be, to give
her a perfect monopoly of this trade. It was neces-
sary to grant an equality to Russia; for, otherwise,
we might find that Norway might become incapable
of supplying us with Timber. An Honourable Mem-
ber had proposed to take no Timber from our Colo-
nies alter the year 182.5. He thought that consider-
able protection was due to the Shipping Interest, and
to the Colonies of this country. This measure was
intende 1 to convey that protection to those interests;
and would he fair both to the Powers of the North
aid to our oon Colonies.
Sir H. PARNELL had heard nothing to alter his
opinion on this subject. The 'Right Honourable
Gentleman had taken no notice of the Tax on the
consumer of deals in this country ; and the whole of
bis proposition went to give Russia an advantage
over Norway—(Hear, hear).—He was ready to agree
to the removal of the Duties on linen, by transit,
and he would agree to the removal of the Duties on
Norway Timber; nor did he see any reason why
the Duty on hemp should be continued He thought
there was no necessity for any protection to the Arne-
tican Timber Trade; not could it be done without
imposing a Tax on the consumer in this country.—
The system of the Right Hon. Gentleman would
raise the price to the consumer of Norway Timber
from 20s. to 255. per load.—(Hear,hear).—He should
propose an Amendment on the Resolution which was
moved on the previous debateo which would give
time for seeing how far this measure should be
adopted as a matter of expediency. He saw no rea-
son for introducing the cubic measure as to deals.—
He moved, that after the sth of January, 1825,
the Duty on foreign Timber should be £2 per load
of 50 cubic feet, and £2 ss. for every load of deals
of the same contents.
Mr. H. G. BENNETT seconded the motion, and
he was anxious to stand up for the great principle
of a free trade, which could alone extricate us from
our present difficulties. They ought to look to new
sources of trade, by which alone they could get an
increase of Revenue ; which could not be done now
by additional Taxation. The Canada Trade had
only commenced since 1807, and then it was, not
given to them as a fixed system of trade. It had
levied a Tax on this country of several hundred
thousand pounds; and now it was time to revise the
system ; to legislate for England, and not for Russia
and Norway—(Hear, hear).--But he thought he
could shew that the Russian and Norway Timber
could be brought into this country at half the price
of Canada Timber, without loss to the Revenue.—
He thought the New Zealand Timber had as good
a right to be brought into this country as the North
American wood. But in order to benefit the Lumber-
men of Canada, and another set of Lumber-men at
home, the country would' be taxed to the amount of
1-500,000 a-year. This Tax was not paid to the
State, but put into the pockets of individuals. By
the Tax laid on in 1807, we had driven the cheapest
and the best Baltic Timber out of the market, to
make room for the American Log. The plan of his
'oble Friend (Lord Althorpe) would he the fairest
and most equal of all ; but the Right Honourable
Gentleman was determined still farther to drive the
best and cheaatst Timber and Deals from our mar-
s:et. It would save the consumer between three and
4300,000 a-year, and upon that he would stand.—
He did not expect the Timber-men and Ship-men
should tale at all for the public interest, but for their
own: bat he did expect that the Right Hon. Gentle-
man should care for the public interest.
Mr. K. DOUGLAS said, the Duties on the Tim-
ber of the North of Europe were imposed much.

higher than was absolutely necessary to protect nun'
North American Timber Trade. The only object of
the Committee, therefore, was not to force the peo-
ple of this country to use bad American Timber in-
stead of that superior article which was brought from
the Baltic. At the same time 14 was satisfied that
the trade with Canada would continue to a very
Large extent, even after the imposition of Duties on
the Timber from that part of the world. He could
not agree to the Amendment • but he confessed that
the explanations of his Right Honourable Friend were
not satisfactory.
Sir M. W. RIDLEY said, the Lumber-men of Ca-
nada, as they bad been called and the Shipping-men
were both great interests ; and-he could not consent
to destiny them for the interests of the consumer.—
[Here Mr.W.WILLIAsts was taken ill, and conveyed
out of the House.j—After order had been restored,
Sir M. W. Ridley continued, and said, there were
articles fur which the Canada Timber was alone ap-
plicable ; and he thought the duty proposed by the
Right Hon. Gentleman would have the effect of
forcing it to be employed in matters to which it was
not applicable. Canada Timber was not liable to the
dry rot in its own country ; and the reason that it ac-
quired that disease was by its being immediately put
on board ship, and deprived of the free circulation
of air after being Boated down the rivers of Canada.
He had received assurance from several Canada
Merchants that, under the proposed additional duty,
not a single ship would be employed in bringing
timber from that country. There were about MO
sail of shipping employed in this trade, which con-
sumed 1:374,000 in provisions and hemp ; and if this
additional tax were laid on there would be a loss of
£150,000 a-year.
Mr. SYKES objected to all the proposed Amend-
ments, as well as to the measure itself; on account of
the loss it would be to the Shipping Interest. Getting
an article cheap was not always the most material ob-
ject; if it was, what would become of the cam Laws?
Lord ALTHORPE said, persons engaging in mer-
cantile speculations must take their chance of gain
or loss. It was not because our merchants had a
debt due to them in Norway that.the advantages of
the Norway trade were to be given to them. Neither
must other Interests be sacrificed for the sake of the
Shipping Interest. The Shipping Interest made great
sums during the war; and it must now take a chance
the other way. The Noble Lord gave notice he
should have a motion to propose in a future stage of
the proceeding.
Mr. F. ROBINSON inferred, froni the extreme dif-
ferences of opinion upon the motion, that his Right.
Hon. Friend was . right in the principle of.:thai_rno-
tion. He thought, that as the Colonies were integral
parts of the kingdom, they ought,to betretateaLseith
corresponding attention. He thought 411&4t that the
Shipping'lnterest ought to be consideAtilstrfOly*,,
having been the foundation of that.marinA, .
4' Whose Bag had brav'd a thousand years
The battle and the breeze!"
With respect to the scale of his Right Hbn. Friend,
lie wi.hed to keep the names of countries out of the
question. He did not propose it as a measure preju-
dicial to Norway and beneficial to Russia, but as a
measure generally beneficial to the Empire at large.
Mr. BARING defended the evidence given before
the Committee, which he considered as fair and can-
did. Oae maxim was established as sound, namely,
that commodities of great consumption should he got
from that quarter where it could be obtained best
and cheapest. With respect to the Colonies, he did
not believe, from what he had seen, that the Timber
Trade was beneficial to the Colonists. He had re-
marked on the conduct of the Lnmber-men, as they
were called, and they were, in fact, a set of idle, dis-
solute vagabonds, who, being able to earn in two
days sufficient to supply their wants, were idle,, ig-
norant, and mischievous, during the other five days
of the week. The Hon:Gentleman then proceeded
to examine the subject of the Duties proposed, and
the different Amendments, and declared his opinion,
that the wisest course would be to adopt the propo-
sition of his Honourable Friend, Sir H. Parnell, and
say, an equalization of Duties, and equal trade with
all the world.

Mr. RICARDO said, the Report adopted, as an
established maxim, that we should buy our commo-
dities where we could get them best and cheapest.—
It then went on to state, that the timber of Norway
u as better than that 'of America, and cheaper also.
Yet the Report then went on to recommend the impo-
sition of such Duties as would force the country to
purchase timber from that quarter where it was worst
in quality, and highest in price. The Hon. Gentle-
man then proceeded to review and comment on the
Report and the recommendation of the Committee,
and strongly urged a flee trade.
Mr. MAR RYArr defended the Shipping Interest.
He contended that from the course of political events,
from our recent declaration respecting Naples, which
would not be soon forgotten by the Allied Sovereigns,
it could not be expected that we should long maintain
peace ; and, therefore, to preserve and encourage our
trade with our own Colonies was political. Our trade
with our own Colonies, and our own ships, was, in
fact, our own trade, of which we could not be de-
prived, whilst our trade with Foreign Powers and in
foreign vessels was most uncertain. The present pro-
position was intended to give a manifest advantage
to Norway, who already possessed greater advantage
than she ought to do. The Hon. Member then en-
tered into a review of the subject and the arguments
advanced, and contended that 10s. a load was as
heavy a duty as the American timber could bear.—
Ile contended that the ships employed in this trade
were of the best quality.
Mr. T. WILSON was anxious to deliver his send-
ments, as lie had been a Member of this Committee.
He confessed he had an interest in this question, still,
he contended, he was to the full as independent as
the Member for Shrewsbury. The Hon. MeMber
then proceeded to defend the Shipping Interest, and
to contend for the necessity of encouraging our sea-
men. If this country should be again at war, he was
convinced money would not be wanting, but money
would not make seamen. He thought the Canada
timber would bear a duty of 10s. but a duty of 20s.
would ruin the trade altogether.
Mr. F. LEWIS wished for an equalization of the duties.
Mr. WALLACE replied, and observed, that If there was aa
error in the present plan for laying on the duties, it could be
easily corrected subsequently.
Mr. J. P. GRANT would propose anew scale of duties, but
would reserve himself for the Report.
Mr. WALLACE wished the lion. Gentlematito move now.
Mr. GRANr was prevented from doing so now by the forms

of the notise:—,--The Conunittee then divided, when • th 6
numbers were—

For the ftesolndons - 71
Against them - - - 24
Another ditrision took place on an Amendmint by Sfr 11.
PARNELL, which was negatived by a Majority of 150 to 51.
The other Orders were then disposed of, and at lhlf-past
Two the House adjourned.

THE EVENING STAR.

LONDON.

FRIDAY, APRIL 6, 1821.

We are without any more recent advices from
Italy than those which we announced yesterday ; but
we have received letters of antecedent dates, from
which we subjoin some extracts, which are not with.
nut interest, and may serve to supply some links in
the chain of recent events: