Star.
London, England, 1829-02-18 00:00:00

%lull refer him to the consequences of driving to de-
.pair seven millions of people, after their hopes had
been now relied to better prosppts. Let him look to
the con equences of such • came. The shipwreck
m ght Cher, indeed. become too general—(Cbeers).
The EArl of FALMOUTH said. that he would have
Answered the observations made by the Noble Lord on
Friday had not the H use broken up helots he could
find an opportunity. He had been actuated by no other
motive in making the remark he had done than the fear
that the constitution was in danger, and feeling that. as
a Peer of the Realm. he was called upon to state his
sentiments free and unshackled upon a subject that
deeply involved the prosperity of the State—(Hear).
Earl GREY—If the Noble Earl viewed the situation

in which the country was placed in its true light, and
the increased diggers resulting from the withholding
any longer from the people their common rights and
privileges, he would see that there was good ground for
fear. He saw no such objection to the used the term.
The first principle of our nature was that of self-preser•
vation, and this principle was put intooperation by fear.
The same rule should ever guide the Ministers of the
State, first to see the danger, and then wish to avoid it.
He acknowledged that he did fear the consequences of
keeping a nation any longer in suspense; and it was
from that principle that he gave his heartfelt support to
the measure recommended by his Majesty's Ministers.
The Duke of WELLINGTON said, that after what
had pasted on the last evening, he should not have felt
himself called upon to say more on this subject, nor
should lie have troubled their Lordships a second time
in reference to it, had it not been for the manner is
which the Noble Lord (Falmouth) had put the charge
of intimidation against his Majesty's Ministers. The
Noble Lord had said that the manner in which they
had conducted themselves in reference to this question
was just as if they had said to the Catholics “ If you
give us leave to knock. you down, we shall ;afterwards
give you up all that you demand." Now he (the Duke
of Wellington) begged to assure the Noble Lord, that
as to a bargain, Gr commutation, or agreement with
any persons, his Majesty's Ministers had made none.
They came forward to that House, as he had said yes-
terday, uninfluenced by any body ; the measures which
they proposed they proposed upon their own responsi-
bility, and from their sense of what they thought was
due to the country, and to the happiness, the peace,
and tranquillity of the empire at large—( Hear). The
Noble Lord had, upon this and former nights, discussed
the majorities which had appeared upon the Catholic
question in the lionise of Commons, and in this House.
at different periods during the last 20 years. Without
entering into the calculations of the Noble Lord, he (the
Duke of Wellington) must say that he thought the No.
We Lord had arrived at a very erroneous conclusion.
The Noble Lord should have borne in mind the great
majorities by which this question had been frequently
carried in the other House, and he should, in parties.
far, have considered the very large majority which ap.
peared in the Commons in favour of the consideration
of this question in the year 1812. The Noble Lord
should have considered that op to last year, and by their
last votes. the Home of Commons was opposed to this
House on this question—the majority of the House of
Commons being of one way of thinking, and the House
of Lords being of another way of thinking. With such
a state of things before him, he (the Duke of Welling.
ton) was to come forward at the commencement of the
present Sessional Pao !lament, to communicate with their
Lordships and the other House of Parliament, and to
ask their advice upon the state of Ireland. Now he begged
t.i know, if, by acting up to this course in the Government
and in Parliament, there should exist one opinion in the
Commons, and another opinion in the Lords, the Go-
vernment having no opinion at all—(a laugh)—he
would ask whether that was not a state of things
which should attract the serious consideration of the
G ivernment, with a view to the adjuttment of th;s ques-
tion? This he would say, that he c,.uld not take into
consideration in the Cabinet any question whatever
which was not iilluenced in some way or 'other by the
state of the Roman Catholics of Ireland, and the dif-
ference which existed on the subject between this House
and the other House of Parliament. That was one of
the evils which he (the Duke of Wellington) and hi.
colleagues took into their consideration when they
offered that advice to his Majesty which. he had been
pleased to accept—(Hear). If the Noble Lard would
but for a moment look to the difficulties which were
attendant upon this question, not only in that pare
of the empire which it mote immediately concerned,'
but in this also—if he knew the difficulties which
arose from it in Parliament and in Council—he
would see many reasons for bringing it to a final
decision, without having had recourse to the unworthy
motives which he had attributed to his Majesty's
.Mi-
nista,. lie (the Duke of Wellington) would say this,
that it required more firmness of character is his
Right Honourable Friend in the other House to come
forward as a Minister of this country, abandon opinions
which he had hitherto maintained, and to urge upon
Parliament the adoption of this measure, to which he
had been always opposed—to abandon, as it were, his
political existence in order to urge on Parliament this
measure—it required, he repeated, more firmness of
character on the part of his Right Honourable Friend
to do that, than to adhere to his old and long-cherished
opinions on ihe subject—(Hear, hear). It requited, he
would again say, mote firmness of character in his
Right Honourable Friend to cast away all his fr rmer
notions, and to follow new opinions, when lie conceived
that their adoption •as absolutely necessary for the
Constitution and the security of the State, than to have
continued in thtt course for deviating from which he
lad subjected himsi If to the attacks of the Noble Lord.
He (the Duke of Wellington) begged pardon for haying
a second time trespassed on the patience of their Lord.
ships on this subject; but a charge so unworthy and
so urjust against any set of men as that which hid
been preferred by the Nuhle Lord against his Majesty's
Ministers, he could not suffer to pass unnoticed or with-
out contradiction—(Heal).
DANGEROUS ASSOCIATION SUPPRESSION BIM
Sir A. Gamer, and others (torn the Commons, brought•up the
Dangerous Association Suppression Bill.
Read a first time on the motion of the Duke of WELLING-
TON, who gave notice that be would on Thursday nem move the
second trading of the Bill.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE, adverting to the mea-
sures understood to be in the contemplation of his Ma-
testy's Government, said, that the general feeling or
the nation was, that nothing less than a total revolution
was projected. He could never be brought to consider
that a departure from the principles of Protestantism
was other • ise Vials a total revolution. The Bill which
had just been br, ught up and laid upon the table was
one of the very highest importance in wha ever point of
view it migl t be considered—whether as an infringe.
ment upon the liberty of the subject, or as preparatory
to a p trticrilar ulterior design, which was attributed to
the Noble D Now he wished to pot a question or
two to that Noble Doke, naus:ly, whether the Bill in
question was introduced fur the purpose of acquiring a
more arbitrary poser than that at present enjoyed by
the Emotive? On this he would take leave to observe,