Star.
London, England, 1828-05-10 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

• . HOUSE OF LORDS, WIAY 9.
The Royal Assent was given, ht Commi•osion. to the Test and
cogvegnus-sEto !tepee VW I. dn. Life Annuities Acts 'Repeal
Bill; the .Stamps on Insurances lleductlpn Bill; the Cards and
Dice &dap Nicks Reduction' Bill; this Consolidated Fund Ap.
otosteo Bill; the Promises and Fitter:gement. Memorandum
DIIITIke !cot* Variance BSI, and n yen Private Bills.
The bards Cemtniatiossets were tha-Loaut Coancat.t.oa, die Earl
Of SPIAI22IIIIIIer and Lord Bisimat.
The Private Bills before the iteuie were, on the motion of the
Eallpf SnarrasaullY, forwirded Ktheir respective stages.
04 the motion of the Earl of Stearrassuar, a Message was or-1
derdd to be sent to the House of Common, requesting that leave
misfit be given ta C. Warrant, rim:pant-1. Cares, Esq. Members
d that House, to attend and given evidence before their Lordships
Ceipinittee on the Wept Tradai.
e Isle of Man Cern Bill was committed, and ordered to be
rearl a third time on Monday:
'lbe Bishop of LeNDC/N presented a Petition from the Dean
awd Chapter of the Cathedral Church of Hereford, against any
further toocession to the Roman Catholics. •
Lord KING presented Petitions, praying relief from Civil Dis..
abilities from the Ronan Catholics of Ashton .within Maccles-
field; from Down, in 'lreland, which prayed also for the Repeal
-Of the Vestry and Seb.letting Acts; from Boyle, in the cotinty of
Roieentanon • and from St. Ann's, Shatiwell, in the city of Cork.
Lard CLIFDEN presented similar Petitions from the Roman
CatboHc InhablUats of Enfield, Larpn-le.Moot ; of Bishop
Thornton, In the County of York ; of Easingwall, Stapleton, and
Scarborough, in the same County; of Biliingdon, Northumber.
had; of Kendal, Westmorland; and of Stbckhill, in the County
of
Lorrdk.
ItoCLARENDON presented a Petition to the same effect
Wolk the Roman Catholics of Carahakon, in the County of Surrey.
The Marquis of CLEVELAND presented a Petition from
Castledale, in the North Riding cf the County of York, praying fur
an Act to check the Importation of Foreign Lead.
The Nike of RICHMOND moved that the Petitions on the
table against the Importation of Foreign Wool, be referred to the,
Cutimittee on the Wool Trade.—Ordered.

MISSAGE FROM ?MB COMMONS.
blr. F. Learn, Colonel Camraux, and other Members, brought
up several Private Dills, which were suhaequently read a first times.
The Nlarquas of LANSDOWN presented a Petition from the
Physicians, Se. won., and others of the towns of Preston, Garstang,
and other places in the County of Lancaster, praying their Lord-
ship, to take into Quit consideration the difficulties which obstruct
the allay of Anatomy.
Lial FFAULA RS moved that a Copy of the Memorial of the
Country Bankers, addressed to the Lords of the Treasury, be laid
before the llouse.—Ordered.

111111111.111 BILL
The consideration of this question was then resumed, and the
examination of witnesses was proceeded is.
At nine o'clock, the Counsel in support of the Bill having closed
their evidence,
The LORD CHANCELLOR inquired of the opposite Counsel,
if they had any witnesses to call,and what course they meant to take?
Mr. Memos said he was not yet determined wlether he should
cell•witnesses or not ' • but at all events he should first bate to ad-
- diets she House, for which purpose he requested to have a couple
4 days to examine the evidence already adduced, after it should
hive been printed.
The LORD CHANCELLOR observed, that the evidence could
not be printed before Wednesday nest at soonest, and he should,
thesefore, think the subsequent )lOnday the most convenient day
for resuming this question. •
The further consideration of this question was accordingly post-
, potted to Monday week, and the House adjourned to Monday next.
HOUSE OF COMMONS.

The Seamen look the Chair this day at the usual hour, long be-
fore which every seat in the stranger's gallery was occupied. and
the body of the Wow nearly filled with Members.
A Messenger from the Lords requested the attendance of this
noose 4n the House of Lords, to bear his Majesty's Assent given
by' Royal Commission to different Bills.
The Smuts aura majority of the Members then withdrew,
'and were absent about a quarter of an hour.
Upon their return the Sri:mote informed the House that his Ma-
jesty's Astrid had been given by Royal Commission to the Como-
'Weed Fund Act, the Fire Insurance Stamp Act, the Corporation
and Test Act Repeal Bill, acsi several Private Acts.
Mr. Mclennan WOOD 'presented a Petition from the Inhabi.
tants of Sunderland and Newcastle, complaining of the conibina-
tiers of the coal-owners, and praying for a Committee of Inquiry.
After a short conversation, in which Sir M. W. Winer, Sir H.
Ilaimances, Mr. Hone, and several,otiter Alembers took part, the
Petition was ordered to lie on the table and to be printed.
Sir J. WROTTESLIKY moved for a copy of the Memorial of
Country Bankers; presented to the Lords of the Treasury the 19th
instant.—Ordered.
Mr. °TWAY CAVE presented a Petition from the Roman
Catholic* of Leicester in favour of the Roman Catholic Claim 4.
HOUL DSWORT H presented a Petition from Pontefract,
praying for the gradual Abolition of Slavery.
Mr. C. DUN DAS presented a Petition trumWalUngfoul against
the. AI-houses Limon% Bill.
• Mr. JEPHSON brought in a Bill for Amending the Law re-
lating to Distress and Replevin in certain cases in Irelaud.—Read
a first time •to he read second time on Tuesday next.
Lord STANLEY presented' a Petition front the Chamber of
Commerce, Manchester, against Restrictions upon the Importation
of Corn; and after a few words from Mr. W. WHITIIOng, Sir G.
l'eticres, and Sir C. Boaaact., it was ordered to be printed.
(hi the motion of Mr. Lame, several Orders of the Day were
P°s4loned•
Mr. WESTERN presented a Petition from a place in the
County of I•;ssti,agOttst Restrictions upon the Importation of Corn.
.the motion of Mr. Colman; Returns were ordered of the
quaruityof Wheat and Flour imported in the Isle of Man, and also
the qeantities rape/teal thence, front the lit December to the latest
pet lod in which the same could be made up.
blr. Id A CQ,USEN presented a Petition front Benjamin Willis.
Secretary of a Suciety meeting at the .Quireit's Head, Cornhill
agilioat sae Restrictive System as respected Cum.—Ordered to kit
an tires table.

CROWN SOLICIMLS llw
Mr. DAWSON brought up the Report on tkis which was
ordered to be lead a third time on Monday neat.

Barotiel biblelf and many tabors. plit Hon. Baronet
(alter * ellgVt attasion*tha naturatrafists apd general
claims of the Rosman taitholietWtrotteetlo) to argue in
favour of their demands, on the rano& of specific
conventions. Now, he had never thenght that the Con.
,stitution of .England recognized The abstract right of
any perums to the enjoyment of political power and
privileges, or even' to the:eligibility for such power ;
and until the Constitution was so changed, that there
remained no distinction between the owner of an estate 1
by copylsold, and him who
,possessed his property by
,freehold—till there was no difference with respect to
the right of voting between the freeholder to the amount
of 395. and the freeholder of 40s.—till the individual
possessed of an estate of 2901. could claim to sit in that
House, as well as he who had one of 30(11.—andsuntil
the alien-born inhabitants of this country were placed
on an equal footing'with the native-born inhabitants
(both paying the same taxes and obeyin the same
law)—he could not admit that the inhabitllits of Eng-,
land, as such, had any abstract right to eligibility for
political power and privileges. Dismissing. with this
sentence, the getteral and abstract claims of the Roman
Catholics (which he must do the Honourable Baronet
the credit to allow he bad himself very slightly in.
sisted on), he should proceed to a part of the subject
which, in the opinion of the Right Honourable Baronet,
was of greater importance—he meant the considerations
involved in the Treatrof Limeiick. He was satisfied
that no claims were now wiihheld from the Roman ,
"Oatholics which they were entitled to claim under the
,piovisions of the Treaty of Limerick. Whatever rights
might have been taken. from them, their continuance
was not goaianteed by that Treaty. In reference to
this point he contended, that up to 1792 (comprehend-
Mg a period of one hundred years from the chug of
,the
lieaty of Limerick) no claim similar to that now urged,
by the Roman Catholic' had been preferred apon
fisith of that compact. Besides, it was only the sense ,
which the parties to the Treaty had at the time of its:
stipulatioas that could satisfactorily explain the nature,
of those stimilations. The sense of the wasting of the,
Treaty entertained by third parties, living 'in another
age, and in a different country (however honest and
intelligent these persons might-be=and he by no means
agreed in the censure passed upon the 'character of
Bishop Burnett), could never be considered half such
good eaklence of its true musing, as was to be found
. in the opinion of the parties who had themselves made ,
the stipulations. who were uron the spot at the time
when they were agreed on, and mere deeply in-
terested in rightly understanding and linterpreting the
contract. He contended that no sus h claimruere
set
op under this Treaty by the immediate parties, as was
now attempted to be established by their de,cendants,
Further, let it be recollected what was the general
aspect of affairs in ['eland in the beginning of 1691, in
the course of which year this Treaty was agreed on. It
would be found on examination that though the citcum
stances of the English army at that period were not
very favourable, yet those ot the Irish army were, to
say the least, as ungovernable: In the 'beginning of,
1691, Lord Tyrconliel wrote to James the Second,
desiring succour, or else to be allowed to make such
terms for himself as he could obtain ; and on the 14th of
August, in the same year, wen he was dying in the
city of Limerick.
,his advice to the garrison was to
capitulate on the best conditions they could procure.
He (Sir It Inglis) used this argument in reply to those
who now stated that it was;. great object with William
to obtain possession of Limerick. and this the 'lrish
army being strong, and the English army a ealc.a.nd
dispirited at the time, that object could not have been
readily accomtilished by; force. Now, the contrary of
all this was the fact, and it was clearly demonstrable,
that when the English ermy appeared .before Limerick,
the Irish were not in a condition to insist upon terms,
beyond all measure so favourable, as it had since been
contended were then granted.? The Vtoveroniebt of
Ireland published a Proclamation on the 7th of July in
the year referred to, in which they gave notice to all
persons then in aims; who should speedily submit them
selves, that they should not be troubled by penal sta-
tutes, and that their Majesties would take measures to
obtain them such further securities a, might be necessary
for their safety. This was done in order to remove some
doubts that were at that time entertained on the subject'
of the punishment t.) be apprehended by those whO
should lay down their arms. Here then a provision was
made, not for privileges, but for pardon. But he Mid'
still-stronger grounds to rely: on—look not merely to
this particular Treaty, but cousider what wastftepature'
of the ter ms Afforded to other cities in the progress of
the campaign. But it so, it was a somewh it singular
tact, that on the 21st of July in tt.e same year, Water-
turd deniauded a guarantee for the private exercise of
religion, at the condition of ifs submission; and theA
de nand was :closed. A similar demand was made by
the town of Dungarvon, and the result was the same.--
Having refused the private exercise of religion to the,
City ot Waterford, the English army appeared before'
Galway—an important fortress, which possessed the'
me.us ot resistance, and therefore obtained better terms.
l'o the Clergy and Laity of that town, the free exercise
of their religion in private was conceded—lawyers were
Allowed to toll rw their profession—and estated Genie-
oleo received permission to carry s gun. These were
donai.lered favourable conditions. ?rhos it appeared
that the Irish army was not in a condition to extort

Y •
terms similar to those now said to have been secured,
not merely to the garrison of the city in question, but
tp 411 the inhabitants of Ireland by the 'Treaty tit Li).
Met ick. When De (iinkle approached Limerict, he bad
William's orders to conclude a peace—Wear). He
'reached Limet ic k Srptember; the garrison ps °posed
terms of capitulation, which would have "reared w
them aU.the rights of astir ProtestanilelloW subject'.
De Ginkleo replied, .41 am a stranger to the-constitution
Of England; but Iknow-the ter ms proposed would be
Itiesmaestent with My licinour to grant ;" he accompanied
this answer, by the erection of a new battery. He was
told by the Catholic Association, that were it not for the
Treaty of Limerick theprettent' King would be a petty
Prince in the North Of Germany. He would take the
honest sense not only of pisiticular articles, but of
,the
whole Treaty. Could it be believed, that in a Treaty
oue -article of which allowed 'atholics to wear swords,
4nd.cafq a gun and pievery privilete of subjects
was secured to thelllarjrit, Aril 141662'4d the Treaty
secured to the Cab *so privileges they enjoyed in
the reign ot Charles the Ileiond4 and the Honourable
Batt. contended tat rhe second atticle secured them
any dis jp.rfalarp on account ofitheir,religion. But
wits tWataft of the Catholics Ass the reign of
21es'ihe Sew ? The oath af supremacy was re-
Jired of every one possesii*a. Civil office, and ot
schoolmasters, though CatholreOnAght not have been
laded from Parliament. The Second article of the
ity granted to an Offinersaeturnins to their alteki-
, all their' estates, right's, privileges, and iminuni
and that they should be put iq plissession of anyof
A that were in their Majesties bands,* ia the bands
theiritnants. edilldiawase desk that this fa.
Ted to ananotiareiiitteti24'Prettiath article was, that
oath to be administered to Catholics should be the

000 aforesaid, and no other; that referred to OS oath'
Obi)*
talhleagdianonceae, toimenfliightletst.hemßistohoptheißruersort;atn
History was not published till long after the time.' and,
rerhencickewtoasc-
it contained in article not to be found in the Treaty,
which showed it was not to be implicitly relied on. Efitf
what was the interpretation of the British Pallianuenti
in 1692? They stated that the Treaty of Limerick,
allowed the Irish to reposseis the estates they had for-
feited.
What was king James's interpretation? .. A,'
curious document had been lately published, in whielt
he praised them for having secured the ex ,nisi of their
religion, their professions, and trades, and the possession
of their property. Was it possible that if James sup;-,
posed the Treaty had secured the privileges now con-,
tended for, he would not have mentioned it with warm
approbation ? He did not defend the *Parliament by
which the Treaty was afterwards violated; neither
did he defend the Parliament of King James; he
asked but for equal justice for both. He thought it watt,
evident that both parties to the Treaty knew thit there
was a hialier power to which it was subject for,raiific.a...
Lion. Could any one deny that King William endwoureil.
to procure favour foe hii 'Catholie subjects from his
Parliament ? Some of the articles of the Treaty, if they,
bore the construction now contended fot, were loam-
sistent with the law of the realm. When,.sonithc sur-
render of Canada to this Government, the.Ftench Mi,
nister proposed that the people of Canada should 'toy
the exercise of their religion as before the cession, the
Znglish Minister replied, that the King did not possess
the power to agree to that article. He. would grant,
toleration, but he could not do mote for Catholic.atib-,
jects ; and had the Treaty of Limerick.b.ee,u intended to
grant all that was now sought for under it, it would
amount to an exercise of the dispensing power which
had_heen abolished. With respect to the 'procireaings.
,hi the time of ,the Union, he thought it impossible to
,ptove that Mr. Pitt had given any pledge of commoni-
_caring a larger shareef political power to the Catholics
,than they before possessed. There was no pledge but,
that of personal cottcltict„ which Mr. Pitt redeersidd;
He could not pledge the Parliament—he could only
pledge himself; and if he had done so, all his pledges
14ste redeemed.. All that could be said,of that Govern-
ment was, that they took the benefit of the Insolvent
Debtor's Act. and returned to oftce when they found
they could not pay in full.—(A laugh). Lord Corn-
, wallis, in his letter to Mr. Plowden, said he was never
authorized to pledge the Government, that they would.
not take office it they could nut carry the Catholic
Question. He was therefore of opinion tha,t the'Catholics
could not make any claim under the Act of Union.—
And if on tlie..gtotuid of, natural right thetatholics
could dada, nothing,--af.on the Treaty oiLimerck they
could claim nothing—if under the Act of Union they
could claim nothing, be thought they had no claim on
air justice of the Parliament. If on the day of the Co-
ronation the PArliametu stated to the Sovereign the
sense-in which. they proposed the Coronation Oath, and
he wok it -in that sense, the Parliament could not
subsequently alter the sense of the Oath so taken—
(Mutts:ruts). But the sense of the Coronation' Oath
was to be found in the history of the Constitution, which
was essentially Protestant, in which state the Sovereign
was bound to preserve it. . He knew this* subject was
delicate, and he only alluded to it because, in treating
of the general questi )n, •he would not appear to avoid
it. But if there was no claim of jast ice, then the whole
question resolved itself into one of expediency. The
Sol.citor General fot Ireland had recommended to the
'House to take the untried course of concession; ballad
not Parliament for forty years been trying concession
without producing. or even approaching to conciliation ?
Dr. Butler, a Catholic writer thirty years ago, before
the Catholic appetite for political power was whetted,
had described .the Catholics of Ireland as enjoyirie
security under their vines ani their fig trees. He would
contrast with this the declaration of Dr. Doyle, that if
a' rebellion raged 'from Carrickfergui to Cape Clear,
not a Catholic Priest would denounce it from the a tar.
When the elective franchise was granted to the Catho-
lics, they expressed their gratitude for being restated ifs
the privileges of the Constitution ; but now, in their
Petitions, they speak of nothing but their exclusion from
thcenjoyment of their rights. He would ask, was Pro-
liament authorised to expect that they would ba more
'auccessful in securing the loyalty of the Catholics by
'farther concessions ? In was impossible to know the extent.
of the Catholic claims. Dr. Doyle asked, would emanci-
pation cure the evils of the tithe system ? Their vim-
plaints were published in a book, and circulated in Ire-
land as their manual—botahey were 'such as no Proms-
taut Parliament could grant. Mr. Grattan had stated.'
in his plate in the Irish Parliament, that he would grant
to tie Catholic every thing consistent with Notes-
mot ascendancy. Ile held, that where physical force so
greatly preponderated in favour of a sect differing from
the established religion, that it would be most dan-
gerous to add politicalpower. Ulm security was there
that the. Catholics would be satisfied with what was now
asked ? One Hon. Gentleman t. Id him that he thought
the Catholic religion ought to be established in Ireland
as the Presbyterian in Scotland.. He thought to grant
them what they asked would be to arm discontent with
power. Mr. O'Connell said, he would never be satisfied
with the rule of a foreign Parliament, and would insist
onithe repeal of the Act of Union. The Hon. Baronet
referred to the example of other countries where equality
• lof civil rights was admitted-.bat there was nu case
precisely analvoes.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT said, that he should take up
aslittle of the time ut the Houie as he possibly could
on this great question. He would not detain the House
by going back to the Treaty of Limerick,' but would
confine himself to the Treaty of Union. When lie (Sir

J. Newport), in that House, charged the late Lord ('as.
tlereagh with breaking faith wish the Catholics. the
Noble Lord rose with • indignation and denied the
charge, appealing at the same time to the late Mr. El.
.liott. who sat near him (Sir J. Newport), in support of
his assertion that no pledge was given. Mr. Elliott
said that there was no pledge, upon which the Noble
Lord vied is Hear, hear; on which his friend, Mi.
Elliott, continued, that he hoped the Noble Lord would
hear him out, ind he then said, that though ao pledge
was given, yet hopes and expectations were held out,
and it it had not been for those hopes and those expec-
tations, the great, measure of the Union could never
have been carriedr—iCherrs).. Under these cireum-
Stances. faith was broken with them most assuredly, and
the Noble Lord had not a:single word in reply to this
observation of his (Siii:-Newport'S) friend, Mr. Elliott,
who was as estimable& itin as ever held a sett in that
• ~..
House. ....„
Mr. DUNCOMBE (of Yorkshire} was:opposed to.tbe
motion, and. would not receive' any. aisertions of one or
two MeMberi Of ihe'CitholieAssociatinit, that the spirit
Of tie Catholic religion was. liberal: Ife.fookei :to the,
history, and to the unchangeableLa-aemper eailem,hpia it
of the Catholic teliac,i7i9n; for proof that their 4mi,sion
to a civil erinalitymitti the Proteitikitts:was fraught
with. danger to the .CoPiiitutiels. With respect the
Treaty ot Limerie kaeberentireirags eed•witlitthe *tic-
ttor General, that it could ittit kdniit ot theinterprcta-

time. of the Hon. Member for Westminstv. A,
Pict's pledge of Faseancipation, the lionse show
in mind that Mc. Illas never discessed the q
without a view to full severities being the 'trees,
attenclaiit upon it, • With regard to. the .Co,.
Oath; he reminded the House of the emphatic wnr,
his, hue Majesty. a that he.vapnlia lay, his head
block for the welfare of his' subjects.' but wool)
'violate his oath by granting the Catholic Claims."
King who took that oath must be a better judge
import than Lord Liverpool, or any other Mini.
Ca;muted that the large majority would convince
tholics of,lreierid that the people of England I
aisated.one jot of their hostility to the principles
Catholic religgion. •
Mr. V. STUART said, that he felt bound to
the motion of the Honourible Baronet. He
the feeling of the Irish peopae was strongly in fin
the measure to which it was preliminary ; and
'feeling had been etpressed strongly in that Ht
the great majority of the Irish Members, it al
that it must beßritish feeling that was opposed to ,
,cession. This he thought unjust, for they were
cising a poWer against the Irish Catholics, whir'
could never have possessed but for the Union,
which Union, it should be aemembeied, was ap-
Airier the impression that emancipation would
—:(Cheers.)—Of one thing he was certain, that
to Ireland posteised a legislature of her own,
ion, however tardy, was sure to be gained
(Rear, hear).—Emancipation must still follow,
sane the Union its circumstances Mere changed,
ciliation, he repeated, must come. and if it
granted now, it must- be granted heieafter,
.pponents would be so.-situated as to be neither
require securities for themselves, nor to entitle ,
selves to thanks for the concession—(Great cheers)
Even now the (lambed gone by when the measure,
be accepted altogether as a bcfon, for so strong
Catholics become, that they would now perceive
for conceftion in their qwn strength, rather than
liberality or kindness of their opponents—(flu,
ing).--Was' it likely that the Irish, who were
shrewd *Units' to a proverb, would agree to
the advantages they possessed without • acqut,
equivalent? No, there could be no agreeisent
the proposed advantages were not mutual. The
ments used at the Union were, 41 If you assist
plans I will enable you to accomplish yours, and
your emancipation." After blighting her pro
however,t,d destroying her hopes, this countr
turns round, and says, " Sweet love, we are mini
He wouldeonly say, that if equality of rights
tended to them, then would divisions be donee,
all classes would become bound in a moral
which would enable them to present to foreign
an aspect which could not fail to Tltite them i
spect of the world.
&Ir. L. FOSTER was the first perion, abow
ago, to point out to the House the•danger of
the Catholic priesthood to a share of the Com.
and that they would employ their spiritualsauthority
forward their political interests at Elections. His c
were denied at the" time, though he said he wr
for Catholic Emancipation if its advocates pu
fears to be groundless. He would not oppose
pation, if he thought the Catholic Representatit
confine themselves to Catholic affairs. He sail
.fully aware that the annihilation of the Catholic
ciation would follow the passing of Emancipatit
it would very soon spring up in a new form-10
and more extended objects. Nor did he blat
Catholics for only acting consistently with
sacred principle of their faith—the increasing
pbrtant and temporal influence of their Choir
principle actuated them at the late Elections, al
actuate the 60 or 70 Catholic Representativesal
return. These Representatives would be
noxious to the Catholics than the Protestants,
not implicitly follow the bidding in every..poi
what would be the effect of this infusion upon
)store? Certainly the Catholics would not
citadel of the Constitution by storm, hut they
would, undermine it by stealth—(Hear). To be
Right Hon. Friend (Mr. W. Horton) was prov;
a security—namely, that of excluding Cath(
voting in cases in which the Protestant Church
cerned. But if that security sati,fied the Hi
)thought they treated the Catholics at present
injustice. How was the House to manage
case were before the House.—or was it to be
that the Roman Catholics could be friendly to ,
blished Church ? It would soon follovt that there
be. in fact, two Established Churches, and an •
to the discontent and misery of Ireland. The '
tion.of England had a decided- opinion on ,
which he trusted she would retain as long astibeai
Christian, though he had heard. the contrary assertei.
`by some at the Catholic advocates. Though he could
not shut his eyes on expediency, he must say, it WAS the
crime of the age to view every question through Lir
medium of expediency, arid not through principle—
(Hear.) With respect to the two other great
nations, the Baptists and the Dissenters; he had the -opi
tunity of putting the same questions, and received
same answers. The case was widely different asst.-
spected the Church of England, and he never would
hear it said there was no difference between
Church* of England and that of )Rome, witlaeg
raising his voice against such an assertion. One of
his arguments against the proposition was, that it would
lead to this consequence, that. all the political
would attach itself to the latter Church, and that the
members of that Church would never test until thu
religion had the ascendant. In expressing these opinions,
perhaps he might hot represent the place he now fere-
tented much longer, but even that should not: deter
hta
from expressing his opinions on the subject-opin°'
which he had entertained for twenty years. thiler
Gentlemen, might take what course they liked ; it they
conscientiously believed they were securing the tr
quillity of .Ireland by supporting the motion, let IN!'
proceed—he did not wish to share in their glory, nor
voting against it should he secure censure. He
be content with acting with a conscientious feeling,
with having done his duty.
Mr. DOHEItTY offered a few words in explanatl
in which he assured the Hon. Member he had "at
luded to him in an invidious manner.
Mr. WILMOT-HORTON—When I state that ti
is the first time since I have had a seat in this
fI
that I have had an opportunity of expressing my
vents on this subject, I oust that the House aill lel
ror a short time, a small portion of its attention.' Sir,'
:Hon. Friend Mr. Foster, who has just now addressed
!douse, appears to me to have taken up a train of
N.ilich, if followed up, would insinuate the
darmoig principles.—(Hear, hear). He admits au
• haractetistics of the present unhappy Govettlalt
..eland; he admits that the Priesthood extrciseJ
.ractical interference in the last election ; he adrurtr
orrectite:s of the statements made by the Veto,:
lamb:nor Kerry, and tells -you th;c it you CI
rm
.3 Ihiai to the Citholics,,all the present pad sy
thrcushout liclatid srtll be aggralaLed•

to mi.,
luld brae in
q• eM44IR
lecessaiy f
Wolialinn
veneris of
d orb the
Pallid rlrnt f
be." Thi
te of ite li
inister.—..
wince the •
i had tux
les of the
stippori
thought
favour or
d as that
Joule
appeared
D the coii.
'ere tier_
Lich they
lion, and
agreed to •
Id follow:
It as long
concee:
at last,
although
f• Emen.,
: were not
When it,
er able to
de theni.
1
tore could
g had the
ve masons t
lan in the
'eh cheer.
a people
ultimate
miring aq
ent where
rhe aigu.
me in iny
tad Engel%
prospect', .
tatty that
allied:— •
I were ex.
away, and
ral union
gn notices
in there,
tat 20 yens
admitting
institutioo,
uthonty to
!is opinions
would vote
proved his •
to Emaoci.
:ices would
aid he was
Colic Asia
Cation, but
I.—for new
blame the
the Simi
ng the int.
ich. Ina
and would
they week'
more ob.
it they did
(Ant. lint
i the Log is.
t take the
might, and
be I've bit
raided with
rol:cs from
wascon-
House, he
with great
if 4 iith
e expected
o the Ella
Pere *oul
an increase
Consciiu
a religion,
as she was
ry asserted
h he could
, it WAS the
lirough uir
reinciple—
at denorn-
the .Oppor•
.ceived the
:tent as It'
veT would
t ween the
withig
r. One di
'at it would
tical poled
nd that tbe
until dad
se opinions,
now regre-
t deter him
;—opitrons
rs. after
ed ; it tiler
the lia'
let them
rry, nor by
He should
reling, and •
tplanationr
to that flit
my sentr
wit: lrnd,
dressed th'
nits au iM
aLeti.

I

......t state of. things easnot continue; and if wha:
he It onsitr.,l3!e and Leaf ned Gentleman telt us he truly
iii, fpioion, t.e most wish us to restore the forme' state
of v, 1 , gs, which, although he does not allude to it, is
[he only logical conclusion at which his argument can
se--(dear, hear). The Honourable Member to.
the close of his speech adverted to some opinions
which have not been presented to the House;
:trough I think it at all times inco,.ventent to
any tiling said out of this House, he is wet-
do so. But with respect to the opinion he has
ided to, he must give me leave to say, that
ere not addressed to him. I never supposed
iourable Member would be satisfied with any
whatever. 'lons of security would not, I
inced, satisfy him—(hear, hear, and laughter).
ion was not offered to those who have steeled
ids against all change whatever. It was offered
large portion of the community out of doors,
ink the present state of things to be lamented,
to yield every thing to the Catholics that may
inconsistent with the security of Protestantism in
sense. The security I proposed was offered to
ideration of those who entertain feelings such
as I have described, and not to those who have the
feelings of my Honourable Friend, who, &pin his
Tech to-night, has convinced me no securities would
satisfy him. He dreads the shocking result that must
follow the introduction of a certain number of Ca-
*lie Members into this House, and he detailed
is us the whole process by which they were to sap the
Mrtdations of the Church. The utmost he would grant
was a short space before the dreadful catastrophe was to
take place. I feel none of the Hon. Gentleman's ap-
prehensions, and am confident there is no responsive
voice to them in the breasts of the people of England.
My Hon. Friend objects to Ibis concession being made
Du the principle of expediency ; if it was made on mere
expediency 1 should object to ii as much as himself ;
but lam satisfied that the claim is founded in equity
and justice, and it is on that ground I yield to it. Ea-
- ' here backed up by right. The Hon. Mein-

sed to

Fortuna, Deasy eclogue lacunas—
;trues the line hich precedes li—
nemen babes, st sit pruderatia—{Loud cheering).
lrned Gentleman, the Solicitor General
ided the people, as regarded this subject.
First, there were those who wished
they were ; second, those who were for
tbolics their rights; and.third, those
living a state of things long since passed.,
necessity for this division, and think it.
more convenient, as well as the more cowl.
Jig upon the people as consisting of two
are prepared to grant the concessions,
ithout securities, or those who will not
any consideration whatever. My own
hays never disguised is, that the only
. be found in the cessation of religious
'Cheers). On the other hand, I cannot
-iysell that a great portion of the peo-.4
retry are not prepiqed to take the saint
subject as myself, but who look with
-oistibliehmeat.of some security, which
, that in removitethe disabilities
Abele fellow countrymen, they will not
Protestant Established Church. With
other class, who resist all concessions
putting a.ide the question of security, it
my thing to them having that object in
Ise seeming to me to consist principally
patties. I think some course ought to
itch its feeling upon the question of se-
licertained. 1 must confess that.! am
with the rbsiespect, it I Essay so call
Baronet, whir test night opened
iced this subject. The desirableness of
secwuy that would minify both Ca-
rmen:tots, has been acknowledged by
able men who have sat in this House.
Wiese name must 10 dear to' all ince-
adllisqueitiOn. hat given it the
audios ity.--(The Hon. Member here read
• one of Mr. Punsonby's speeches, es-
ientleman's Opinion on the desit able-
some security Which Catholics could
J: give, an.cl Piotestants confidently ac
then. supported by this authority, that the
tie sicatitresthat may be given by the Ca-
accepted by us, is well worthy of the con•
House; and 1 trust that 'those HOli.
Iv/ refrain from granting what the CI.:
a doubt of the possibility of establish..
! will agree to the erotica that has
into a. Committee, where the poiot,aday
discussed than now. I must take leave
Hon. Gentlemen who just now spoke,
se Catholics would not receive this con-
atitode. Sir. lam satisfied that the
not yet passed ; but I am also satis-
delay the payment of this long standing 1,
circuantances will arise which wilt
consideration of gratitude out ot the question.
to trespass longer on the time, of the
aject which has been so often argued with
vit. It would be presumptuous in me
time by the repetition .of arguments
handled so much more ably than I can
It ro with delight that I assent to the
Honourable Baronet to go into a C6an-
trust the means will be foetid of con-
with emancipation, and that thus we
to settle a question which in any other
impossible to settle to the satisfaction of
because if, on the one hand, I grant that
Catholics ought to have certain rights, so
consider that the jealousy of ten millions
ightb in ?ranting those lights, also to be
account. If the proposition of the Pro-
easonable. I think it as much entitled to con-
: advanced by the Catholics—(Cheers).
MACIN fOSH should pronounce a libel
he believed that England, in its greatest
wasopposed to the great question of civil
ream Statesman ot the empire bad sup
would be little less titan a miracle to
people were opposed to it. The power of
',veiled abroad had produced this effect-
and.Learned Member then pruecadsd
to Si, Francis Burdett, who, in spirit
at, Lad dune his duty to the State is
which he had submitted to that House.
Ireland could not have been carried
lout the aid of the Catholics--they
...ces under the faithof promises made hy
Government, and now, twenty-seven yeses
they cause ,td that House and asked hit
those rights which had been abrogated
:slued Friend, the Solicitor (humid,:
... more calm and worthy man he knew:
spoken on the subject of religious liberty.
ISir would ten his :Hon. and
iend That :Aglow liberty was may. um,

Are no disabilityt h 3 inillticuity, no erchision ezistei
When a man, in slimier Winds, was not legally dis
qualified horn holding any appointment. A dish cx
eluded on the ground of religious differences' *We
mai ked out—the state coisidered him unfit for an Ace
of trust. This might differ in principle from then auto
de le," but not in humanity. The Learned Gentle-
man proceeded to remark, that Lord Somers had fre-
quently been quoted ih that House, but he would say
;bat the opinions of that NJWe lord, in his work, did
not apply to the Catholics,
that
to the Dissenters. He'
would quote the opinion of that Noble Lord on the sub-
ject of religious disqualification, on that auspicious day
in which his-Majesty had given his Royal assent to the
Bill for the repeal of-the Test and Corporation Acts—
.a day on which the Dissenters returned to that station
which they had never forfeited. The Learned Gentle-
man then read an extract from the work in question,
Which said that the greatest punishment to an English-
man was to be deprived of the power to serve his King
and country. He felt due gratitude to the wisdom co.fl
our ancestors; but no phrase was so infelicitous as that
which had been applied to their laws on toleration.—'
Darkness was only removed by the progress of reason.
It was not more than 250 years ago that a Dissenter
from the Established Religion was punished with death
—not more than two hundred years ago two Arians
were put to death. This period had passed away,
and now it had come to this, that some persons still
wished for restriction, when almost every State in Eur
rope tolerated religious opinions; we had come to a tifne
in which no man was excluded from either civil or
military employments. Such was the state of things in
the aubitrary States of Russia and Austria. In Saxony
and in Bavaria, where there was a mixture of religious
opinions—of Catholics and Protestants—they were all
equal. England and Holland bad followed in this
glorious path, but Holland alone retained her position
under the illustrious star of the House of Nissau. Eng.
140, he grieved to find, under the House of Brunswick,
had almost alone fallen into the rear of tolerant notions'
—thicase of Sweden the Learned Gentleman was not
s e particularly acquainted with, but of Denmark he
could speak—that in London he had met an Ambassa.l
dor from that country of Irish extraction. Religious,
disabilities then were confined to England and Spain,'
and we had for our only ally, the Government, it such
it might' be called, of Ferdinand the Seventh. By
shutting the door to persons of a different faith,
we enuangered the seculity of the best gem of the
Crown, the allegiance of the people. For 729 years,
the Irish had supplicated for an equal proportion of
English laws and English rights. By refusing them
we had, to the shame of England, mole that which was
the strongest the weakest. This fact we now felt in
divided Governments, in distracted Conntils; and by
and bye we shall feel it in the beggary 61 the labouring
portion of the English, from the influx of the Iriih poor,
torced to this country to work at a price :warmth star-,
nation, in consequence of the mil-administration of the
Government of Ireland. This stile' was now nearly
strived. Would they, under such circumstance',
now make a stand ? He felt more strongly than he
could express the debt due to Ireland for *the long op-
pression she had undergone, add when he considered
the charaCter of the . oppr6o9.—Ossittlie opessed—the
one the most free, and the *Wise most brave, it was
without parallel. The Liarited Gentleman then re-'
furred again to the Test and Corporation Repeal Bill, and
siiid that this measure was no triumph over the Church,
but it arosetruin the age we live in. A.gveat debt of
gratitude was due to the Church on this occasions, which,
'notwithstanding the taunts and slanders -levelled at it,
bad nobly acted.,, The Church deserved to be supported
and secured, What were the best means to effect that
'object_? Front conversation which had taken place on
the Test Acts.we learnt something. We learnt that
Dr. Marsh ,had, in a letter, ;expressed an opinion that
be kiiew not what evil the repeal of the Catholic Claims
would produce ; but perhaps as great an evil as the re•
peal of the Test Acts. , You mightziant the Catholic
claims, but destruction would follow the repeal of the
Test Acts. Neither Jews hot Turks could produce an evil,
equal to the repeal of these Acts. Tke Learned Gent.
then proceeded to say, that some meet by compromise
should be taken to allay the ferment which at present
existed. But tests in religious matters were objectionable.
The Bench of Bishopsweeld, be was sure, temperately
consider, as they had done in the case of the Test
Acts, the shame which a test imposed upon .2 man's
religion, which was the greatest consblation of his breast.
Religious liberty was dearer to man than any thing,
and the time might again come when England 'would
occupy her former station in this :glorious cause. In
civilized times men threw off grosser tonsiderations,
and looked to the enjoyment of the libertrof thetnind.
He would ask what was the application of the principles
of religious liberty, if not in their full enjoyment? In
thecase before the House, he agreed with the Honour-
able Member, that we were pot dealing with a commur
pity, but with a nation—a nation distinguished by an
encompassing frontier, and renowned at once fog
their oppression, their virtues, and their .bravery.—..
Tim grand question was, whether there should be a
union in the British Islands, or a civil war in Ireland?
Of all opinions be had ever heard, the doctrine of
trillion, that a time more favourable, and so on, might
come, to do justice to Ireland, was to him the most ob.
jectionable: was this the pretext for keeping up armies
in Ireland? It seemed that certain individuals 'Were
not disposed to concede the quetion until it became a
favour-or a grace, when it would lose all its healing
power. We owererit appeared, preparing to do what.
was formerly done in America. The symptoms now
before us would provoke a foolish Government,
'and would instruct a wise one. By refusing .conr
ciliation, the state of Ireland became more and more
deplorable. The Honourable Member for Ripon, had
said that he 'would not yield these points, but that the
Irish refight take them from us by force. When. he
(Sir J. Macintosh) heard this alarming declaration,
from so moderate and
_considerate' at man as the Hon.
Member—an invitation to the Irish to wrest- their
rights fiom us by force of arms; he was astonished.
,Ireland, however, was in no state to take the re—
commendation, but she was proceeding in a man.'
ner which would. unless the laws were altered, re.
duce England to the' same level. Thus ultimately
the Irish were sure of °Mewing their demands.—
'The Right Honourable Gentleman .(Mr. Peel) had,
..said, on the result of the division on the Test Acts,
that it was impossible to form an esclusire admi-
nistration., This declaration he hoped would produce
concession, or it was possible that a Minister of State
might very suddenly be convertedfrom the security in
which be indulged. He contended that at least the
Roman Catholics ought to be placed, in the same skim-.
tion in which they were in the reign of Charles If. as
regarded political rights; and that the ablest writers
alter the revolution, Dr. Brown and others,had contended
that theTrealy of timer ick bad been violated as regarded
the, conduct; observed towards the. Cathelicii—i(Heaf).
Also 0111 L no body of .men'.could be more 'interested,
in tkevanting the CatholiC Claim'. tbatkilli.llD lesiang,
Church of liefund ; the atibilitY or tlidt , .would

be "stained br continued connexion, and that would be
.sklatirfloy granting these claims which were alike called
'fa* policy and justice. Ile condemned *allusions
that• had been mode to the suppOsed opinion of the
Crown. It was the height of pi Timm ption to do so, and to
do so was an offence. He contended for the fire will of
tne Crown—(Hear)—and that whatever might be the
opinion of the late Government, it was a maxim of the
Constitution that supreme power could not bind its suc-
cessor. As to the 04th, it was vicious in its nature if it
bound to the doing of that which was wrong. In con-
clusion, he trusted that relief would be extended to long
suffering. Ireland, and the empire thus strengthened.
Mr. Secretary PEEL rose with all the diffidence which
a person who held the opinions he entertained must
Amorally feel. The fight Hon. Gentleman had told
*am that the advocacy of ttu-se laws wide.' supported
the Protestant cause appeared to him to be censurable,
bat whether it was so or not (and he denied that it was),
the House would certainly allow that it was the duty of
one, who thought as he did, to rise and vindicate bi.
opinion, and that no one ought to prevent him, and
those who took the view that he did, from doing their
duty and standing forth as Ministers to state dispassion=
ately, but firmly, what was the true state of the quest
tipn. if one thing produced more displeasure thaa
another, it was the painful task * tieing to repeat so
often his opinions, and the grountls of his opinions to'
what he felt to be a reluctant audience. The grounds
and principles upon which his opinions were established
had been explained by those whose abilities were greater
than any be could lay claim to. He could have no do'.
sire to 'obtrude himself on the House; but he had bees
personally alluded to by the Honourable Baronet, with,
whom the discussion'arose, and every man in his limo.
tion must feel that he had no alternative. The Host.'
Baronet, indeed, had made a personal appeal to him mil
that pact of the quett.on, which it was impossible for
him to avoid considering the weakest part of the Hon.
Baronet's argument. The Hon. Baronet considered the
question on the broad ground of justice, and claimed
-the assent of the House to his proposition, on a states
ment that on one occasion a solemn contract was es-
tered into, which must be considered binding on the
contracting parties. The Hon. Baronet called for his
(Mr. Secretary Peel's) assent upon the assertion he was
said to have made, namely, 4,1 f it appeared by the
Treaty of Limerick that privileges were granted which
remained not in the possession of the Roman Catholics,
'it would materially .alter his view of 'the subject."—
He gave that pledge, and was ready to abide by it. He
admitted to be true the terms he had stated, but he re.
quired a strong case to show that the privileges claimed
bad been withheld. He had referred to the Treaty of
Limerick over and over again, and was prepared to say,
that if he was placed in the situation of arbitrator, un-
der a Warm obligation to decide, and upon his sense of
justice bound to declare whether that Treaty bad given
the•rights claimed, he should say, No. Of all the points
presented to his mind free horn doubt, the point' raised
on the Treaty of Limerick was the clearest. It was not
possiblelor any one who bad read the Treaty with im-
partiality, to feel that there was the least shadow of
pretence for saying, either King William or the Roman'
Catholics understood that they were to have admission
to offices, or the privilegiof sitting in Parliament. Nell
therofthose points could be claimed by that Treaty. It
was impossible to read the first article of the Treaty of
LiMerick, and say it. included the whole population Of
iteland.. The Right flea. Secretary felt that the claims
.Ise had mentioned involved considerations independent
of those suggested by the Right Hon. Baronet. In cow
seqtience of the alleged breath of taith on the part of
those who made the Treaty, he was called upon to de-
fend the characters of great men. He considered it his
duty to -rescue from the implied stigma of the Hon.
Wironet names hitherto held in veneration. King- Wil-
liam, Lord Somers, Mr. Pitt, Lord Cornwallis, and
Lord Castlereagh, bad been misrepresented. He rose
to vindicate them against the ignominy which had beep
attached to their names.. If the Hon. Baronet could
prove that King William gate the Roman Cdholics
I privileges of every kind, without takineany thing from
them but the Oath of Allegiance, the Honourable
Baronet loaded that great Monarch and his Whig
Ministers with infamy, and so far from being of
glorious memory, it would be memory that ought to
be detested. But King William and the able Ministers
of that day were not subject to the odium. Neither
King William nor the Roman Catholics contemplated
the privileges which the Hon. Baronet would concede.
The Hon. Baronet had contended. that Roman Catho-
lics were to be admitted to all offices and- seats in Par.
Hameln, without any other security than the oath of
allegiance. Could the Hon. Barohet really suppose
that King William, after the able 'support of the Pro-
testant interest, and his victory over the power of the
Popish party, could have agieed to a contract which
must have given the Roinan Catholics perpetual
ascendancy ? It was too absurd to entertain the
proposition . fur one moment. He did not wish .to
go into all those transactions connected with the
Treaty or Limerick, which had been loaded:with
execrations by the Roman Catholics themselves.—
It was unnecessary and unfair to .6iing the coa-
.cluct of individuals under discussion; but. when he
fouod histot ical facts discos ted, and an ingenious gloss
put upon events to answer political purposes, he was
unavoidably led to a statement of the truth. This was
the last time he intended to seter to the Treaty of Lime-
rick, and should dot have referred to it on this occasion
if he hafi nocj,e;ii challenged by the Hon. Baronet, who
bad argues that the first part of the Treaty stienla:ed
that the Roman Catholics should enjoy such religious
pi ivilegis as.they enjoyed in the reign of Charles the
First. Was it possible the Roman Catholics could have
tested their claim to religions privileges on-such vague'
words ? A Right Hon. Gentleman said there were no
disabilities on account oft eliginn, and that assertion was
made on the authority of Lord Somers, who had said in.
:capacity to bold offize was the greatest stigma that could
attach to any man. Lord Somers and others who were
present at the conference in 1672, said there was no
doubt the incapacity of setting the Crowd was next to
'death. Did the Right,Hon. tientlemau mean that the
toleration of which Lord Somers was speaking. sent to
the extent of giving the full possession of political pri-.
alleges ? Lord Somers and the Whig authorities held
that tiring restrictions upon persons..holding places or
trust was so- much allowed in legislation, that every.
Government might put restriction on persons-holding
places as they might think fit ibut penalties and pu-
nishments were of a different nature. PoFery had
been looked at with great suspicion by the Legi.la,
tare, and the!-efore a difference had been made- in
ingislatioo between Papists. aud. Protestant Dssenters;
'however bad theyomay have been. . The Right: Ho:
nourable Secretary read extracts, to show that
:the
iocapacity-to•voltich Lord • Somers. referred was not
a disqualification arising front not taking an oaah...-
171:1648,,11ie Roman Catholics concluded a Treaty
with the Marquis of ()doom], 'and the first article'
that Treaty, ;is not to be considered with telerellt;''
the present, stato.ol the law,; but'the
'they looked for religious iibitty at char time. r

. „

~~

T:inis'f,eo;init,iitetneee
sots
Protestant
articleaak tnnn 0
teott
nlfwisee,tramteniti sfot4eh.misting
ni reptd l%w, thick Itatikruked the ii-
otemacj of Queen Elizabeth, and the Aft fie vippratkokair
C,thnllc said, Do
in their religion. The words
first article of the"r
tllTTttl):llh.eriaatisviittt'lieeyntwhSßn.ofea4tYs:l:::::
Catholics went to the .Margois
what their privileges were to be.
Hon. Member fur Dublin on
swerable. A Proclamation was

his Majesty said, as soon as a
atoned he would procute for seanwity
for the performance of their religion. At the sieve of
Limerick one of the terms offered by Sir Toby Adder •
was this—That liiSh lietnan Catholics should be
to political offices.• General Ginkle refined to sweet*.
:that proposition, on the ground that it was-not consistent.
with the Bfitiall Constituti,sn. They tl?ert :rat the Tsitelvo
Articles. Was it possible to believe that King Wit
under those circumstancest'promised to givel
lk. admission to places of high trust. and pi* the
Legislature? , The charge against King *AVOW '
that after a promise to give the Roman CathOlici ,iidm
sion to offices and Parliament, he in a few weeks after. _
passed a Bill in England to .exclude them. The fact
was, no such privileges were granted. The question
of the Treaty was considered, and the Tory' .P4lrtjr.
contended that the provisos in the Treaty were in. :
be observed; bot the right of the Catholics to.sit
in Parliament never *as di,cutsed. He (Mr. Seek.
tary Pee) had come to a conclusion in hitrolfht.tfiat
it was not intended to call the Roman Catholicstn Per-
Bement. On bringing in a Bill tor abrogating the Oath
of Supremacy in Ireland, hi 1691, a conference hat
taken place between the two HOiltei..ittid the Erakof
Rochester, wl.o was the Chaireisarifco- the Committee of
the Lords, had insisted on the-proposal which had been .
made to abolish the Oath of Saprentacr in belittle
On that occasion the Earl of It•chesttr, reportedfrona
the Committee the reasons for the Lords. insisting'ob -
their Provisos in the Bill, for abrogating the •Oath. of
Supremaey in. Ireland, and appointing; other -oaths.
The reason read as folloaeth :—'• Because'tliey find;by
an Article of the Treaty, made fOr the sorreiider..of:
Limerick, which was biought to the Lords by the .Ear.l
of Nottingham, and is now, by their Lordships order,
delivered to you, the subject matter of those Pioeisto
was therein agreed to: and. their considering of Vilaat
advantage and importance the reducing of Ireland bath
been to the public peace and. security •of all ,their
Majesties' dominions, they conceive that it will' not .
be of so ill consequence to rilloW. the liberty pro- ;
posed in the Provisos, as it might be not, to..oappost
the public faith given upon so great an occasion as the
final conclusion of the war. in ,Ireland, by which that .
kingdom- hash quietly and entirely subriAtted toftleir
Majesties' Government," which was agreed to, as lt,cosipp
in from the Committee. The Treaty then was Wider
consideration, and there never was
..any attettartioare.
yoke it. The Tory party did take.tbemeasorkinialhEit
consideration, and did not see at that time the vibration
which is now complained of. TbeiHon. Baronet bad
contended that a promise to consider the Roman Catholic
Claims had led to the Uniop. He had do doubt that
the Roman Catholics thought the ptising of the Act of
Union *mild facilitate the consideration of theiftlaims ;
but he denied that either Mr. Pitt, Lord Owlets's!), or
Lord Cornwallis, eOtated into any engagements on the
subject, that coold Matzke Government of theta/ell.=
day. They were bqould toreeema these'great-noeskti
the odium a. Label! to theasly the Honouratilitaarooes.
It was said Mr. Pitt resigned in consequent d slip-
posed obligation to concede the Catholic Claims. Me. Po t
and Lord Cornwallis distinctly denied that they did .re-
sign on that account. These positive declarationsiin
the face °lslay. were more entitled to confidence than
the inlessooss drawn by the I4onout able Baronet. An
1801, when Air. Pitt resigned, ..he stated that be had
given no pledge, and used these words in 1805opoi I.
never, at any pan of the, discussion of oil peak*,
gave any pledge, but remained perfectly tree acrd tsar
fettered." Vali% Pitt, in 1805, declared he had' given
no pledagg it was impossible to • say the House did
pat then egos' to the question free and uirfettered..--
The strongisst-declaracion on the 'Alia was one he
could trust with unbounded confidence.: Loid Caritle-
reagh, in 1810, in his speech in that House, said, ...Lord
Cqgnwallis never conceded any. pledge, or snowed-
ant promise to. be siren. Thir have the Mena! of
proving by a coadomemissaims-sweeired.from.ttfat Noble
Lord. • The prineigskrammildo.Lord Cbrnwallis went
Trak that it ought to be speramesimmewtbe pare of the Leeiebneat.
When it was known that Mr. Pitt bad resigned, he, LordUastles
realls, sent to Lord Cornwallis, conceiving that the catholic bridy
would haves meeting- on the subject. Lord Cornwallis said this
He had long held it as.his private opinion, that the lame of the
Catholic. of Ireland upon Mr. Pitt's retiring from use, might be
necessary for the.welfaro of Ireland, but he had btaastrkt ite eels
conduct, and had carefully abstained from any explanation,46 oder
that, no expectation might banked by him in the Raritan:Catholics.
Through the Whole course of the Udine, which was in discussion
two years, no favourable auurances or promises were. made to the
Nomad Catholics. Was it possible that Lord Cornwallis could
have made that statement if any expectation had been held out to
the Roman Catholics, which could* operate at the. present day
as the slightest fetter upoc the judgment of Parliament ?. Lord
Castlereagh said, in 1510, that, so anxious were the Government
not to mislead the Roman Catholics, that. they newer gave them
reason to know whether Mr. Pitt was likely to bring on the
Catholic Claims. In cetiseqttence of that mode of proceeding,
the interest of the ltoman Catholic bitty was secured, and that
of the nation. So little did they expect Mr. Pitt to take their
claims in his hands, that he believed it was a matter of arrpelee
*ben they knew his intention. The Right Honourable Secretary
placed the most implicit confidence in these declarations, sail
he did think, with reference to the Union, that it did not staled
any proof of a promise or undertaking to concede these. elelnas.
Looking to the state of Inland, ie might be seasonkbk;. to
suppose the King of England might say, be expected they
would derive benefit froth' the &nt.'s Constitution'; but it was
not to be supposed the King intended io admit Roman Cathodes
to offices mid the Parliament. He knew that Mr. Pitt would never
have used equivocal language to entrap the Kitig into a measure
Which he knew was repugnant to the Royal nand. If the contract
described by tlit. Hun. Baronet really had existed, it ;would have
been observed bet be could not.adenit that the terms of the
contract bore:die Construction the fionourabk Baroett had put
upon it. The Right Honourable. Secretary considered this crea-
tion in Point of policy, as it affkiell` the .Constitution of this
country.. He thought the removal of ell disabilities 3114 .the ad-
tuiasion of Roman catholics to Parlitimene, would make a dit-
feeedce-in the Coettituti 1 arrangements 01 the country. Is
"was nilklng an important change in•the Policy adopted at the
Reiolution. ' It wai the intention at the Revolution to mix the
Prinestint religion with the constitution of the State, and it was in.
itedidea to exclude Roman Catholics from-AIM, ender that Omni.
tutioli. Ibe nigh: Ilepts: Gentleman adverted to the Act for re-
tbk'Sacraincrital Telt:- and observe*diale no one could be
taunted with incondst%pcy, w hen be supported diet •Act and opposed
rho motidti befuretthe'Honee. The Noble Lotd mho advocated tbas
diciaCaredt hteilhaet•44le.Clainaliai.l. "Hurl). siseu"thilreo4gneteatntuy that
'ttbostiltternettellist,lt' jranotesting so their disl agates/ the errors of the
Chuieleof 'Mine; were eiwaysco be''cousklee;sl as standing in a
very differentllttlation• from the Roman .Ceiholic. h they re •
moved ill dfillfilifita train the Ilmistan Cattcs, they tools away
die chi' icier theyeotsseant policy of the Revo-
Intion seei'to atakeilhielind a Protestant State, and ft lost thaq
Caariclit *flier iMiltd even distinctibn between the professor'
thAt'taidkatiti'dtbere. • They weft told the Catholic religion was
i itiei,drieets to Medea by the light of the sun. How dist
•-kitateritat 'fist 'change hi-the Christian tenets of the Roman
qttlit .telfition bad Oitstsibeen edicted by the wise eherfsll9,s
''
.-Olin motif these restrainu were
.reisserid, bow
•

I,

T'

,~

I~'

Art tre-,—k
wards she
et
• nd, alth,
allude to
come to
thus
thel *el
the
writ' s
smconvit
opinic
tneir tpini
.0 thlr.ll
itro dun
aad wish
lot be ins
43 best s'
the cunvt

and justice, ana
pediocy is here bi
bet pas said--
Nos facimuv, I
Bet be has torgutti
Nollum numen
The Hon. and Lear
lot inland. divided
iota twee classes.
thisgsto remain as
conceding tl.e C'!ti
sponse for reviv
I do not see the eel
%AM be the more
Mt way, ut loukini
classes; those who
other with or with
grant them upon at
opinion is, and I hi
title security will h
dicincuuns--(Chie
disguise fedIII
plc of this coutury
wear of the subject
finny for the am
sill 'slum them
shieb slim -thew
anger the Prol
respect to the oth
Foo principle, pui
n vain to urge an,
ow. This, House
those two great
taken by which
j might be ass
Moire satisfied I
• it; anti which the
tha detute, treated
dimming sone 5
*Min and Proir
use of the most a
Ponstvtibi, w
wed is the mere
Night of his stubs
as gimlet trotn
restive ig-that Gt
ass of finding sic
nancienttuusly gii
apt). I say, theft
inestiou of the sec
,and accep
sibration of the k
!ditchers rho non
tubes wish, from
tog such security,
*anode, to go it
; bosom properly C
; to dlf with the I
r who said that the
nuioa with gratil
▪ tate tor that is I
. fad, that it we del
d• ebt much longer
r Pet Use considerat
law unwilling to
&use, on 'a suojet
ilolsonce and wil
arrest your ti
`belt have been t
I ?mend to do. I
ii.otion of the He
mince, where I tr
r rating security w
, Illy be enabled tc
▪ 'ay it will be inn
I 4;1 say of aU, be
11 millions of Cat
r *Me other, 1 cor
a Ntestants out
re 141 into the acc
2 4.egans be reasons
raderanon as that
St JAMES M
a to the country it I
• fen lit of glory, w
of teem. The gier
Oared it, and it
61t1 that the pet),
is 1414 wbich trave
se Ikt Hoaquiable
%Pr a tribute
d, *Llov Pl otesta at
se %proposition tri
hr :11. Union with
effect withou
"twlord their office.
se Ihr British (lose
'dirt tbi Union, tl
a 4 leara4l of MOW
As Hi, Hon. and Le,
Ile Whom a nu
de Ti had spoken
no ',it (Sir
h<' Mined l'iiend 41

riqe which tnkegwirlir
k•
accOrtilws Rev, ‘,
natural anotwee, sank4k4
were: not to •be diner ktnits
were strangeOhln in tit
Limerick. tu#
s uf orrnoa=
)e. Theist
I that Ttitaltr'tiiit'aiiiiA
was midi id Mt,. *lid'
P4l liameot bestir!:,'
for them further Wletwity