The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1839-08-06 00:00:00

PRIVILEGES OF THE HOUSE.

Lord J. RUSSELL having moved the order of the day, for
considering the petition of Messrs. Hansard, rose for the
purpose of bringing under the consideration of the house the
steps which it might be expedient to take with regard to the
notice which had been served upon Mr. Hansard, that an
action was to be proceeded in against them for publishing
the proceedings authorised by the house. Without entering
into the question of law, he must say that such an opinion
as that propounded by the Chief Justice struck him with
astonishment, and convinced him that it would not be right
to entrust the decision of their privileges to a court of law—
(cheers)—because the very narrow and contracted notions
which appeared to prevail in the Court of Queen's Bench,
if allowed to be carried into their full effect, would entirely
deprive their house of the most useful and most important
of its privileges—(hear, hear)—and might prevent it from
obtaining for itself, and communicating to the public at
large, that general information which was necessary for the
maintenance of the authority of this house, and the satisfac-
tion of the public in general, who watched its proceedings.
After stating the facts relative to the publication of the re-
port of the committee of the Lords, on New Zealand, the
noble lord asked why had Mr. Polack passed over the oppor-
tunity of commencing proceedings against the publication,
by the House of Lords, and reserved himself until the publi-
cation by this house. He did not wish, however, to transfer
the vindication of their privileges to the House of Lords.
(Hear, hear, and cheers.) He would say, that, having or-
dered the publication themselves, it was their duty to take
such proceedings as might be necessary for the complete vin-
dication of their authority. In what manner should they
proceed ? Should they again instruct the Attorney-General
to appear in the Court of Queen's Bench, and state their
grounds and reasons on which they rested this claim of pri-
vilege? It must be obvious, that. such a course would be
merely degrading their privilege, and could only lead to a
humiliating result. (Loud cheers.) They had done that
which was necessary to justify themselves on the grounds of
prudence and forbearance. All that now remained to them
was to adopt some other course of proceeding, in order to
vindicate their privileges by proceeding at once against the
first person commencing the proceeding. (Hear, hear.) By
the resolution which he was about to propose, all persons
would have notice not to commence these proceedings ; and
if they proceeded in opposition to the resolution of the house,
by proceeding with this action, they would have had due
notice of the consequences. He thought in this manner they
ought safely to protect the Messrs. Hansard against any
consequences to which they might be exposed. It was ne-
cessary the house should enter into a resolution, in order
that Mr. Shaw (Mr. Polack's attorney) and the public might
be informed that the house thought it necessary to vindicate
its privileges ; and if he should then proceed, he would be
summoned to the bar, and committed for a breach of privi-
lege. He should now move that Messrs. Hansard, the
printers and publishers of the reports of the minutes of evi-
dence on the present state of the island of New Zealand,
communicated by the House of Lords to this house on the
ith August, 1838, acted under the orders of the house ; and
that to bring, or assist in bringing, any action against them
for such publication, would be a breach of the privileges of
this house. (Hear.) He should also move another resolu-
tion, instructing Messrs. Hansard that they be directed not
to answer the letter of Charles Shaw mentioned in their peti-
tion, and not to take any step towards defending the action
with which they are threatened in the said letter. (Hear.)
Sir F. BURDETT could not help feeling the extreme diffi-
culty of the ease, but agreed with the noble lord that the
house ought to possess whatever power was necessary for the
proper performance of its functions ; and he should not,
therefore, oppose the resolutions, which he thought rational
and consistent with the proper respect for the liberty of the
subject.

R. 1-Inilacifrl&A.Wad UntatToirldriggroeiore
the house, .he then advised the house, if another case should
occur, not to appeal to the Queen's Bench, but to assume
the vindication of their privileges, (hear, hear,) which course
appeared to have received the sanction even of the court on
the decision which it had come to. He, therefore, asked
whether they ought to permit Messrs. Hansard again to
plead, or to determine on the vindication of their own pri-
vileges ? (Hear.) The House of Lords, in printing their
report, had taken the course which it was suggested this
house should take, that of not giving the names of the par-
ties. The house, therefore, had judged wisely in ordering
the publication ; and, at all events, their order ought of it-
self to be a sufficient justification of Mr. Hansard. He
would suppol the resolution; and, if it were disobeyed, he
would follow it up by that commitment for contempt, which
the judges themselves had admitted to be legal.
Dr. Lus tsInToN was of the same opinion, and thought
that the views of the judges had been quite as narrow and
contracted as Lord John Russell had described them.
After some further discussion,
Lord Jour Ryss E 1. said, that since he had last addressed
the house he had received a letter purporting to be from Mr.
Polack, and stating that though the attorney, Mr. Shaw,
had been originally instructed to sue several publishers, and
among others Mr. Hansard, yet damages having been reco-
vered in one action (against the Times), Mr. Shaw had been
desired to abandon all further proceedings, so that his letter
to Mr. Hansard was without authority.
The gallery was cleared for a division, when there appeared
—for the resolution, 120; against it, 4; majority in its fa-
vour, 116. _ _ _

The committal of the Birmingham Police Bill was, on the
motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, postponed till Friday.
The Tithes' Commutation Acts Amendment Bill was read
a second time.

The Highway Rates Bill was read a third time, and passed.
The committal of the Poor-law Commission Continuance
Bill was postponed till Monday.
After some other business of no general importance, the
house adjourned at half-past two o'clock.

HOUSE OF LORDS.—FRIDAY.
On the, motion of Lord REDESDALE, the turnpike tolls
bill went through committee.
Lord BROUGHAM read the series of resolutions which it
was his intention to move, " On the administration of jus-
tice to Ireland," declaratory of what ought to be the case
regarding the challenging of jurors, the conduct of crown
solicitors and prosecuting counsel, the enforcing of the at-
tendance of witnesses, the duty of the executive in pardon-
ing criminals, or commuting sentences, the expediency of
first consulting the judges who tried, and their notes, &c.
Lord Bwouonnm, in consequence of the rejection of the
slave trade (Portugal) bill, on Thursday night, anti to avert
results that might otherwise ensue from such rejection,
—moved an address, praying her Majesty, by all means
within her power, to negotiate with the governments of
foreign nations of Europe, as well as in America, for their
concurrence in her efforts to put down the traffic in slaves ;
and also that her Majesty would be graciously pleased to give
such orders to her cruisers as might be calculated to put a
stop to such traffic, particularly under the Brazilian and
Portuguese flags; and assuring her Majesty that their lord-
ships would assist in any measures she might adopt for this
purpose, and concur with the other house in such measures
as might he deemed requisite for such purposes.
After remarks from Lord Melbourne, the Duke of Wel-
lington, &c., the address was agreed to.
The Earl of WARWICK adverted to accusations that had
been preferred against him for his statements respecting the
Birmingham affair, and declared that he was prepared to re-
peat and substantiate them.

Lord DUNCANNON moved the second reading of the re-
gister of births, &c., bill.
Lord LYNDHURST moved, as an amendment, the second
reading that day three months, which was carried on a divi-
sion 469 to 38.

The jurors and juries (Ireland) bill, and some other bills,
were forwarded a stage ; the second reading of the public
works, (Ireland) bill was deferred till Monday; the metro-
polis police bill was read a third time and passed ; and the
report of the " City Police" bill, was presented and agreed to.
The consideration of the municipal corporations (Ireland)
bill, again called forth discussion; the Lord CHANCELLOR
moving amendments on the report.
The amendments were opposed by Lord Lyndhurst, the
Earl of Westmeath, and Lord Ellenborough, and were sup-
ported by the Marquis of Lansdowne and Lord Wicklow.
The proposition of Lord LYNDHURST for the rejection of
the amendments was carried by a majority of 64 to 37. After
some further discussion, the report was agreed to, and the
third reading fixed for Thursday next.
The Canada government bill and the custody of infants
bill were both read a third time, and passed. After the
transaction of the remaining business, their lordships ad-
journed, at twenty minutes past ten.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—FRIDAY.
Captain Hamilton, the new member for Aylesbury, took
the oaths and his seat.

Mr. T. DUNCOMBE presented petitions on the subject of_
the new poor law, containing, extraordinary statements, and
that excited marked attention.

Sir It. INGLIS gave notice that early in the next session
he should direct the attention of the house to the state of
religious education in this country.
Mr. Hu ME gave notice that he should persevere in moving
his amendments on the further proceedings regarding the
Admiralty Court bill, to reduce the proposed salary, and to
disqualify the judge for holding a seat in the house after the
present_parliament.
Mr. HUME inquired whether 80 or 90 persons had been
transported from Canada to New South Wales, by Sir J.
Colborne ?
Mr. LA BOUCIIERE explained the circumstance, admitting
that such was the fact ; and stated that he was ready to pre-
sent the despatc'ves, detailing that conduct, with which the
government vver,: satisfied.
Sir R. PEEL expressed the hope that parliament would not
he allowed to sep trate without the expression of• thanks to
Sir J. Colborne, for the manner in which he had taken on
himself and conducted the government of Canada.
Lord PALmEitsToN repeated, in answer to Sir R. Peel's
inquiry, that the government had no official information as
to the proceedings against English merchants, and the seizure
of opium in China, although there was reason to believe that

the Chinnie government had realized the threat of adopting
severe steps regarding the opium trade.
Sir R. PEEL having instituted inquiry on the subject of
the Ameri,mn boundary question,
Lord PALMERSTON stated that a commissioner had been
appointed on each side—that a convention was requisite—
that then it was requisite to have some sanction from the
state of Maine :—in the meantime, the British government
had availed itself of the opportunity to send a person to col-
lect more correct topographical information on the subject
than was previously possessed.
Sir R. PEEL inquired whether there would be any commu-
nication to parliament regarding the war in the east?
Lord PALMERSTON answered that he apprehended such a
course would not he practicable. There were communica-
tions between the several great powers of Europe ; and al-
though it would not be expedient, or agreeably to the usual
course, to give the details now, he might say that they were '
all agreed in the necessity of preserving the integrity of the
Turkish empire. His lordship added, in answer to Mr.
Hume's inquiry, that he had not yet been able to peruse Dr.
Bowring's reports ; they were yet in manuscript, but no
doubt they would be printed for the parliament.
Lord J. RUSSELL, in proposing that the house resolve into
committee of supply, to vote £75000, went into lengthened
detail to show the necessity for an " increase of the army ;"
and the resolution (after the amendments of Sir E. Cod-
rington and Mr. Hume had been negatived) was eventually
agreed to.
Mr. LEADER again brought forward the case of Lovett
and Collins, after which the house went into committee of
supply.
Lord J. RUSSELL withdrew (after a division) the Bir-
mingham Police Bill, and moved for leave to bring in a new
bill, " for the establishment of a police in Birmingham ;"
the former bill was to sanction a grant of money. The mo-
tion was agreed to (also after a division,) and leave given to
bring in the bill.
On the motion of Dr. LUSHINGTON, a committee was ap-
pointed to examine the Lords' journals regarding any pro-
ceedings for the suppression of the Portuguese slave trade.
Mr. BARING brought in the " Birmingham Police" Bill.
Read the first time, and ordered to be read the second time
on Wednesday.
Adjourned at a quarter to three o'clock till Monday.