Star.
London, England, 1816-04-30 00:00:00

CLERK TIIE PLEAS IN IL:ELAM:I.

Mr. Ps;;El. rose, pursuant to not c to move fi.r
leave to bring in a Bill for securing the fres of the
above office. I le said he was anxious, in consequence
of what had passed on a preceding evening, to talc.:
the earliest opportunity of explaining the nature rind
of
jec.t of the proposed r•il. It was matter e,f flvt, •
Tlety, that upon the death of the late Earl ot B ,;;-
irghaa hire, the.effice of Clerk of the Pleas in lre-
hind bee tme vacant, and it was a statics o: eqtril no-
toriety that the office itt.elf was one er?iich Parhan.t. t
Lid 'declared required Ti Right 1-iro.
Baronet, the Member for Wateiford, bad draws
attention of the lionse to that offite in the entitle tt
the last scsslen, and a pletlge was then given, that
whenever h shiluld become vacant PAW rwaivircs
would be adopted for its revision. When the LAI
Bnekinthamshire died, he certainly thought tha tls•
right of app einiment to the cifize rested in.the Crwae
and it was his intention to fuitil the pledge for regu
' lating it before any aprintment was nude:
mean time, however, did Chief Baron of the hi
Exchequer conceiving the right to belong to hiin, itsd \..
nominai'd a person to the office, and the worst!. •
nee had her re.. ulatly sworn in.—(l/ear, hear!)—'
Tile 11,11 which lie nicatit to propose visuld uot"
fere in any way w;L-1 that appointment, as the qu:s.
tion wlittlier the heiongcd to the Crown or to
that individual would be detetmined by the deciriou
of a Court of law. But then, when it was consi.
dered how great a delay might arise before that deci-
sion was given, and the great extent of emolanierss
attached to the office, the legality of many el whit t
was much doubtcd, a question naturally arese
what way they were to be eiisposed ot. respezt
to the Crown, no appointment would be ma f.: by it,
except for the mere purpose of trying the right, aid
therefore, whoever the person might be so app hinted,
he would have no claim to the lees or emoluments.
He certainly could not think it would be expedient
to leave profits so immense at the uncontrouled

.serving them-a-War, Aear).
efore, to propose bringing in
ide, after a certain day, to be
profits of the office should
!ueetion was decided in a
al the right of nomination!'
t fees would be compelled,
'tarter, to give an account
my them into the Treasury.
necessary, meanwhile, that
should be made for those
, of the several offices, and
that, he thought, might be left to the discretion of
the Irish Government. Those were the objects of the
Bile With regard to the principle of vested rights, he
did not see how it could apply in any manner to the
moot questioa. The office had been declared,long
40, fit subject for regulation. Besides, conside-
table doubts existed as to the legality of many of the
feti, and certainly whatever might be said about
vested rights generally, it could not be pretended
to urge a vested right in favour of emoluments which
might be declared, in themselves, illegal. The Right
Honourable Member then concluded by moving for
leave to bring in a Bill for securing the Profits of die
(Ace of Clerk of the Pleas in Ireland, while the right
ef appointment to the said office should remain in
Sir.J. NEWPORT expressed his satisfaction at
this nature of the Bill, as he was convinced that the
upon the question of right, would be much
• more speedily obtained, by impounding the fees
' meanwhile. The abuses of the office were great.—
The emoluments had been stated to amount to nearly
impel) per annum, of which three-fourths were il-
legal. Yet, he remembered when he mentioned those
abuses last Session, a Right Honourable Gentleman,
whom be then sale opposite to him, denied their
possibility, and accused him of exaggeration. If no
other benefit than the present were to result from his
motion for hit:miry, he should always reflect with sa-
tisfaction upon hiving made the motion.
Mr. PEEL begged it to he understood, that while
be admitted the illegality of many of the fees, he was
by no means prepared to state the precise extent to
which they were illegal.
Sir J. NEWPORT explained.
Mr. B. BATHURST denied that he had accused
the Right Honourable Barnet of exaggeration, in
what related to Ireland. if he remembered rightly,
be admitted the probability that he was correct in
that point, from the greater opportunities which he
bad of acquiring information. What he complained
of was, the sweeping nature of his censure, as appli-
.cable to all the offices both in England and Scotland.
Mr. L. FORSTER said, he had no hesitation in
affirming that he was within the limits when he fixed
the amount of fees at £e30,000 per annum, the great
majority of which would be found to be illegal.
(linir,, hear. )
Mr. HORNER said he perfectly agreed in what
had fallen from the Right Hon. Secretary for Ire-
land, except in one instance, to which he should al.
lade. He had taken a correct view of the principle
upon which Parliament ought to act in the present
instance, which, he admitted, was a particular one.
With regard to vested intereas, he (Mi. Horner)
bad in general ht-ea disposed to carry his opinions
Upon the inviolable and sacred nature of those inte-
rests much farther than most of his friends by whom
be was surrounded. But it would be utterly ridicu-
lous to talk of any vested interest in this case, or to
suppose that the person now holding the vffice had
any right to the emoluments, which was beyond the
cantroul of Parliament. 'With respect to the Bill, he
saw no reason why the operation of impounding the
fees should net commence from the day of the Earl
.e Blckinghamshire's demise. Neither could he see
as every one was agreed upon the necessity of
tegalating the office, that regulation should not take
place inane:littely. There was no occasion to wait
for further i;:quiry. They already had enough be-
fore them to proceed upon. He trusted, therel4:rc,
that some measure of regulation would be arloptLd in
the course of the present Session, and that one im-
portant pin r,t that regulation would be to prevent
the office horn beint; a strrecure, by not allowing any
Berson to Lott. it who should reside in England.
Mr. FALEI. said, it was certainly his •intention to
give ;lie Dill a et? o' Ilect:ve etr.ct, and to impenod
the fees horn the d,;y of the Earl of Buckiny,hom-
shire's death. With regard to regulating the office,
,he thoright it wonld oe better to wait until the Report
of the Commissioners of Inquiry was before the
House.
Mr. LIORNER admitted the validity of the ob-
servation made by the Right Honourable dcritleman,
but trusted the Commissioners would be enabled to
make a special, report upon this particular office.
Mr. FORSTER said, he had no doubt they would
be able to lay a very comprehensive and detailed re-
port before t,.e House in the course of the present
te;sion. The abuts which had been detected were
of a nature difficult to get ,tt. A mere table, sliming
the amount r,f fees tect ivcd, would convey no sort of
iolomation. The in what were called official
practices, and those practices consisted in the Mile-
noisy by which fees could be enormously augmented.
fie would mention as one instance where the fee of
the Error Court, charged for %issuing a sins-
of error, had been enlarged by a varietyof
; ways to no less a .:,um than seeeta to the
bout the performance of any additional ser-
(ear.) The Honourable Member then entered
lable length into a detail of the abuses exist-
: Courts of Ireland, and expressed his hope,
!xtent and variety of these abuses would be
logy for the delay which the Commissioners
iged to tneur.
1.11,A,1 SNIITH and Mr. Powsozeax expressed
satisfaction with the exertions of the Com-
toissioners. Mr. Ponsonby particularly stated, that
the Judges of Ireland were totally ignorant of such
abuses existing, as he knew well, from his having
bees a short peried a Judge in that couetry. He was
glad the comenission had's° far proceeded, and with
the most heartfelt thanks to them for their industry
sod diligence, he hoped the Report would be pro-
duced before the end of the Session.
Mr. PRESTON said a few words on the sante
abject, when leave was given to bring in the Bill.
A long and desultory discussion-took place respect-
ing the Grand Jur y presentments of Ireland, when,
ou the motion co Coolest, a Committee was ap-
pointed to make eerie provision for regulating those
PPoictmems.—Adjourued at half-post tea o'clock.

posal of
hisu r-eci
was object, therefi
Bill which should provide
therein named, that the F
be impounded, till the qt
1,4 coat of law as to who had
1;‘, The persons receiving the
st the expiration of each qi
of their amount, and to pa
It Of course et would be n
eome adequate provision
who performed the duties
-1 .els•

]s.(d.iut
le writ of
enicus
or, will
s —Glee
bider
• a the
- the ex
e apoh
ere ot)lig
• Mr. WI,
%hi. high