Star.
London, England, 1827-05-16 00:00:00

id tile the taw predate df
Id the globe, end send it back again in the
ed form. Dr. Johnson bad defined calico to
in fabric-ashe would presently show that
omposed of Indian materials, it was ma-
here, and sent out for the consumption of
t steam-engine bad triumphed ever every
When they reflected upon its powers,
the energy with sehtch this country had
in), they should consider whether they
sound in duty not only to this country,
hives of India, to replace to the one the de-
erroneous legislation, and to compensate the
calamities and the mortifications of foreign'
le would now proceeJ to sbew the progress
'isle of this country with India had made
ar 1814. He regretted that the returns were
o a later period than 1822, but he should
,o sheer an astonishing improvement during
period. The annual export of glass and
on the average of years from 1801 to 1810
. The average of the ten years ending with
1,0521. The Hon. Member here proceeded
1 other statements, but from a tumult to
ndeness of some of the strangers in the gal-
se we were prevented from accurately taking
. The exports of cotton goods was the most
exemplification of the benefit of free trade.
to 1810 the exports of cotton goods was
reragc 55,1611. average during the
wing with 1822, wits 568.5001. anJ the ave.
two yea: s 1824, and 1825, was no less than
The next remarkable illustration of his
as in the article of sugar. The import of
ugar to Eigland, from 1801 to 1810, was to
ot 77,3251. From 1814 to 1822. the annual
177.9791. But the average of the two fol-
-1829 and 1824, was 244,3281. Now un-
these statements exhibited an immense in-
trade between this country and India, and
would have been much greater, if we had
to all sound principles of policy, determined
igher duties should be charged upon all tro-
tions, which were the growth of the East
hest Indies. He could not conceive upon what
policy or of justice this difference was
he East Indies was as much a part ot the
se West. It was as much entitled to the
its interests. From the extent of its popu.
ded greater commercial advantages—ad-
ich could never, from the very nature of
aped, unless upon the principle of recipro-
the duties then imposed upon East India
not prohibitory, arose from the great de-
mirk to maintain commercial intercourse
miry, and still more perhaps from the low
our in India. Such duties imposed upon
of any other part of the world would have
tory, and in this instance he believed they
ed to be so. The duty on East India
E. a ton more than on West In !la. On East
the duty was 281. more. On cocoa also
ow 71. On rum, very little he believed was
a the East Indies, II s. 6d. per gallon. On
was an ad adman duty of W. more. It
rely be said that this was acting on a prin-
ce; it rather 'hewed an utter indifference
)les of justice and sound commercial policy.
treatment which caused the separation of
merican Colonies. The total amount of
imports her 1824 was 4,355,4371. and f, r
3861. He begged leave to draw the a tea-
:loose to one particular article, sugar, that
general consumption, and the consumption
eht be very greatly increased. He was
hat the produce of the West India Colonies
e consumption of this count' y, and that,
!price here must be regulated by the pia*
markets of Europe. It was well known, that
he disadvantage of an additional duty of 10s.
of East India sugar had lately found its
)ra the East Indies, and sold rapidly. It
td no effect in diminishing the price. It
ought, therefore, that sugar was as bad as
to be, and that there could be no probe-
increase,' importation of East India sugar.
different opinion. He thought the consump-
be greatly increased, if the people of this
having the markets of the East thrown open
re enabled to send their manufactures there,
pay for the sugar they consumed. The ace-
option of sugar in England was 29111 b. per
Ireland 615. Now if-Ireland became, as it
nod government, a manufacturing country,
prevent the consumption from being as
ts here? To encourage manufactures was the
t'..r the evils which afflicted Ireland. If the
could thus find sufficient employment, it
me a tower of strength and a mine of wealth.
manufacture was finding its way there al-
as he heard, a great deal of cotton yarn was
rer to Belfast to be wove. The evils of Ire-
f India, arose from the same causes, excess
on, and its natural consequence, low wages.
n principles of justice and free trade with
would establish themselves in the hearts of
and continue to retain their affections, even
the course of events, the country might, at
t period, fall under the dominion of another
The surplus population of India and of Ire-
, by a sure course I f policy, be employed in
applying each other. His object was to move
t Committee, as the only means by which
could obtain full and accurate information.
great impediments were thrown in the way
rate trader, by the commercial residents of
troy, who made advances to the inhabitants,
it means shut up the trade in a great mea-
union of trade and Sovereignty were inconr-
thts was a subject which it was highly ins.
inquire into. This plan would have the effect
ig its advantages to the Eastern Archipelago,
is of which were similar to those of India.
the time was not far distant when the mono-
trade with China would be broken up, but
:t to the Indian Archipelago the same diffi-
not exist. The duty on sugar from the
;co was completely a prohibitory one, being,
d, 641. a ton. Mr. Crawford, in his evi-
se the Lords' Committee, said that, pre.
le late alterations, British manufactures were
sown in that quarter of the globe ; but now,
no Lady was seen without some cotton of
anufacture, and a large portion of wool-
s the use r f the later article, Mr. Crawford
Ph, the rains which prevailed at certain
le went on to say, that the progress of free
astonishing; that in 1816 a thousand pieces
overstocked the market of Java, but that in

41828, fifteen thousand pieces wets sold in eneseqeMted
of the reduced price. This trade might be increased to
any extent, if the inhabitants had a medium of payment
through the disposal of their own produce. Another
nod,* for his proposing a Committee was to inquire
ions the emporia of Sineapore, and Prince's Island. He
believed the emporium of Sincapore, though he could
sot pretend to be in possession of accurate information,
eras conducted on sound principles. It was important
to inquire into these emporia, for through them a very
extensive trade might be carried on in spices,a monopoly
of which the Dacia endeavoured to secure by confining
their growth to certain islands, and destroying the
gee in all the other islands. Mr. Crawford writ of npi-
Ilion that a beneficial trade with China could be carried
on only through these emporia. It was merely in refe-
rence to them that be should make one or two obser-
vations with respect to the China trade. It was a sin•
guise fact that Canton was not skinned in a province
which produced um. The 'nowise, of which black tea.
was the growth, was four hundred miles distant from
Canton, and that in which the green tea grew, between
seven and eight hundred miles. The tea VC bri brought
to Canton either by land carriage or inland navigation,
and the difference of cost at the place of its growth,
and the Awe where it was sold was SO per cen,. The
carriage to Java from the place of growth was vsry
little more thin to Canton. This was sufficient to
shew how much more advantageously the trade might
be carried on through emporia. He bad now stated
the,general outline of his plans, and he felt confident
that the appointment of this Committee would be pro-
ductive of very great benefit. By opening the trade
and acting upon a more liberal commerc al system,
they would give confidence and happiness to their sub.
jects in India, and what was of perhaps s ill greater
importance, open a source of employment for the over•
grown population of Ireland. It was not by drawing
a revenue from India that they could benefit mate: ially
either themselves or that country, but by giving to it
the benefits of Int.extencted commerce. As the question
was one of justice, of policy, and sound principle, one
affecting the vital interests of the ertspite at large, he
trusted the House would not refuse this inquiry. By
agreeing to the Committee, they might lay the founda-
tion of the gre.test benefits to India, to Great Britain,
and to Ireland. The Honourable Member concluded by
moving ,t That a Select Committee be appointed to
inquire into the trade between Great Britain and India."
Mr. SLANEY seconded the motion. He must pro-
test against having this considered as a merely com-
mercial question. It must be considered In reference
to another important consideration, namely, what was
to be the future Government of one hundred millions
of people? It was always thought that mental im-
provemeut depended much on physical improvement;
and what could more tend to physical improvement
than the increase of trade and commerce. Mr. Gibbon
observed, in reference to India, that the richest and most
extensive provinces of the Mogul Empire belonged now
to a company of merchants in an obscure island in the
Northern Ocean. It had been treated ever since they
got possession of it as a mere dependency. He trusted,
however, that in the progress of time this great country
would have the honour of transpl toting her free institu-
tions to the heart of India, as she bad before to America.
Mr. LESTER supported the question. The repeal of
the high duties on East India produce was called tor,
first, by consistency, fur it was inconsistent to adopt
towards India a principle different, to that on which
they acted with respect to other countries. It was
called for by justice, for it was unjust to tax the whole
community heavily for the benefit of one particular
class—the West India planters. It was called for by
policy and humanity. When their owa manufacturers
were suffering from want of employment, was it not
inhuman, by keeping up an artificially high price of
sugar, to prevent them from mixing one drop of sweet
with their bitter cup?—(A laugh). This high price of
sugar became accessary to the slave trade, and was
maintained in defiance of public opinion. If the people
were not righted they would soon right themselves by
a nonconsumption agreement. What would then be-
come of the whole West India property? It would be
swept away as lin an earthquake. Nothing could make
the present Government more popular than agreeing to
this motion. He wished sincerely that they might be
popular, for they afforded some ground to hope that the
great question of Catholic Emancipation, the sine qua
nom, without which the trancpSillity of the empire could
not be secured, would be at length successful. By act.
ing upon these liberal principles they would secure the
esteem, the love, and confidence of the country.
Mr. HUSKISSON said the Hon. Gentleman who
spoke last did not seem to be aware of the conclusion
to which the Hon. Mover (Mr. Whitmore) came. His
Hon. Friend only proposed the appointment of a Select
'Committee, but the Hon. Gentleman proposed that the
duties should be immediately equalized on East and
West India produce. In the event of Parliament not
consenting to this proposition, he threatened the West
India Proprietors with a nonconsumption agreement.
This plan of a nonconsumption agreement had been re-
commeaded some time back, but if acted upon at all it
was very unsuccessful. for the consumption of sugar had
greatly increased. That of last year had exceeded the
consumption of any antecedent year, and brought in a
clear revenue cf five million. after payment of all draw.
backs—(Hear, hear). He fully concurred in the prin-
ciple that it was the duty of Parliament to open, where it
could be done, new channels of trade, as well as to
increase facilities in the old. When pro/mulls were
made in Parliament tending. or supposed to tend, to
such ends, it was usual to assign as one ground of in-
quiry the prevailing distress of the manufacturing in-
terest. Whatever might have been the case some time
back, he was happy to have it in his power to inform
the House that, at present, things were much altered
for the better—(Hear, hear). In Lancashire and the
other manufacturing districts there were great imp.
toms of improvement in every branch connected with
the cotton trade. Numbers who were out of work some
time back were now in full employment, and their em-
ployers were able to find a market. Those who had been
long suffering under severe privations, were able by their
industry to procure those comforts to which they were
formerly accustomed. With respect to the question
itself, he fully concurred in every principle laid down by
his Hon. Friend (Mr. Whitmore). Agreeing, however,
in the principles, the House must be aware that it was
always a matter of great importance when a material
change was to be introduced, to adopt such a course of
proceeding as would be least injurious to existing in-
terests, and to establi,hments in which property to a
large amount had been embarked fur many years. It
was the duty of Government to watch every opportu-
nity for opening the channels of trade, but they were
bound also to regulate their conduct so as not to sacri-
fice one interest while they were promoting the views

`of mother. the /Cut Indies might be rieh hi all trOis
pical profluctions, bat they Most consider that before
they had recourse to the East Indies fot their prodac.
tions, they had encouraged the growth of similar pro-
ductions in their West India Colonies. They were bound
therefore in justice to consider the effects to which and-
den changes were likely to lead. When the trade to the
East was first opened,what they brought from there was
not sugar, or raw silk, or cottons The trade was carried
on principally in goods manufactured in that country;
for there they were obliged to pay in the precious me•
tale obtained by the sale of their own manufactures in
other parts of the world. It would be cruel if those
who hitherto supplied them with the raw material for
their manufactures were now, on a sudden, to be shut
out from any of the benefits they had previously en-
joyed. It should be recollected that very important
changes had taken place since 1813, in the trade to the
East Indies. Relaxations since then were gradually
introduced, and by the recommendation of the Board
of Controul, further concessions were obtained towards
opening ete trade. It was cheering to hear the are-
merits of the Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Whitmore),
with respect to the increase of the trade, and be had
no doubt that it would increase 'rill further; but if,
is any further relaxation that might be proposed, they
were entirely to throw other interests out of considera-
tion, they might infl ct evils in one quarter, which
would more than counterbalance the good done in
aanther—(Hear, hear). He could assure the House that
this subject had received from him the most anxious
attention, and he was not without hope of bringing it
to a satisfactory result. The trade of the East and West
Indies might under proper regulations go on together,
without mutual injury; but by forcing measures they
might run the risk of producing serious evils to one,
without adequate benefit to the other. It was truly
observed by his Hon. Friend (Mr. Whitmore), that the
monopoly of sugar did not greatly enhance the price of
that article. Their Colonies istoduced 50 or 60,000
hogsheads more than was necessary for the consumption
of this.country. This, together with the sugar of the
Br azils, of Cuba, of St. Domingo and other islands, found
its way into the general market of the world; and the
price in the general market of course regulated the
market here. The monopoly therefore could have but lit-
tle if any effect. He must entirely reject the argoment
drawn from slavery in favour of the importation of East
India sugar. He was al little a friend to negro slavery as
any man, but he did not think the quantity which could
be brought from the East would have any material
effect. If he thought so abundant a supply, as greatly
to affect the price could be obtained from thence, it
would be a matter for consideration. If an abundant
' supply could be had from the East Indies at a low price,
why was it that other countries did not import it ?
There was nothing to prevent them from going to Cal-
cutta or to the Eastern Archipelago. He felt convinced
that the importation here would not be much increased
by taking off the duty. The fact was, that East India
sugar was brought here as a sort of dead weight and
could never reach this country in large quantities, unless
other branches of their teade with the East were greatly
extended, and that sugar was brought merely as ballast.
—He must, however, admit that the present state
of the law, as it respected the sugar trade and
drawbacks, was not quite the most satisfactory. The
subject was beset with difficulties. His wi.b was Co
advance the interests of ail parties with as little
prejudice as possible to any. He should not think it
advisable to embark in so large an enquiry as this pe-
r od of the Session. It would not be the best way
either to remove prejudices or to quiet apprehensions,
and no real progress could be made until that had bee%
done. In his opinion the trade to the East and West
Indies might be gradually extended without injury to
either. He would not say that the existing difference
of duty on the article of cotton was not a fit subject for
reconsideration. It was clear that the trade with the
East Indies could not be extended unless the popula-
tion there had something to offer in exchange for Bri-
tish manufactures. He thought, therefore, that cotton,
the production of that country, ought to be placed on
the same footing as that which was the growth of other
parts of the Britian dominions. Silk was another article
worthy of serious consideration. Material alterations had
been lately made in the state of the law, ash affected the
raw silk of India. He believed that ere long, in conse-
quence of the changes in the trade at home, the manufac-
turers ofthis country would be able to export silk goods
advantageously to India. Thus they found from experience
the salutary effects of occasional alterations suited to
those changes of circumstances which were the result
of accidental discoveries, or of improvements made in
one country while another stood still or perhaps retro-
graded. If such changes were not met by accommo-
dating the laws to them, but by persisting in making
permanent those rules of Government which were well
suited to a different state of things, they should be
taking the only way to drive their commerce and manu-
factures from the country—( Hear, hear.). This applied
to the altered state of India, as he trusted he had shewn
to the House. With respect to the other part of the
Hon. Member's speech, he was aware of the immense
number of islands which opened a prospect of a great'
extension of commerce to this country. He would
state—and with some personal satisfaction—that those
two emporiums of the commerce of that part of the
world, the ports of Sine ipofe and Mahratta, were,
under the arrangements which the East India Com-
pany seemed disposed to adept, to be placed is all
respects in the situation of per feet free ports. The
effect of this system as far as their experience of
it at present went, was satisfactory—but what would
be its effect upon the trade of India and China here-
after he would not take 'upon himself to say. He
looked to it for the greatest advantage in the employ-
ment of the British flag, and he looked also to the be-
nefit promised by the great intercourse likely to take
place between the western part of America and the
eastern part of Asia. But he would leave it to the
Honourable Member himself, whether it would be
more expedient to appoint the Committee now, or
postpone inquiry until they had ascertained how far
the experiment should prove successful, and how far it
could be extended? He thought the inquiry would be
made with much more advantage when they approached
nearer to the period when the whole question of the
renewal of the East India Company's Charter must
come under the consideration of the House. If, there-
fore, he opposed the motion, it was not because he dif-
feted with his Honourable Friend upon his principles,
for he was as anxious as he to carry those principles
into operation as fast as was consistent with the due
consideration of existing interests—but because he
thought this was not the best time for going into the
subject. There was only one point upon which he dif-
fined from the views taken by the Hon. Gentleman,
and that was as to the benefits to be desired by

Ireland From the extension at die gist triclit tteiltlir
that part of the empire. lie would not now go into the
circumstances which had hitherto prevented Ireland
from becoming rich in her commerce and her mann-
factures. But be those circumstances what they might,
be did not see how the extending the trade of India to
that country could be of more advantage than its eaten.
%ion to any part of the realm. The improvement of
Ireland must depend upon the introduction of that state
of comfort and confidence in society which alone cold
attract manufactures and make them flourish. Manure&
tures were already beginning to be established is Ire.
land, and he hoped they would be successful and pro.
gressive. He did not think !hat the manufacture of
sugar world be advantageously encouraged there, as
an Hon. Member had recommende '. Upon the grounds
he had stated he must oppose the motion, under the
conviction that this was not the time for inquiry, but
without denying that it would be necessary hereafter.
He agreed with him in principle, and wished to see the
commerce between this country and its eastern posses.
%ions placed on the least restrictive footing that was
practicable; but the proper time for doing it would be
when the charter by which the present rights in that
empire were held should come to be reconsidered by
the House.

Lord MILTON said, that if the Right Hon. Gentle-
man had opposed the motion on principle, he should
have voted for is, and have recommended his Hon.
Friend to take the sense of the House. But as the
Right Hon. Gentleman had only objected to the time,
be thought his Han. Friend would be best furthering
his own object by leavirg the subjection in the hands of
the Government, whose intentions seemed to be so much
in unison with his wishes.

Mr. PHILLIPS said, he was happy to be able to con-
firm what had been stated to the House by the Right
Hon. Gentleman as to the late improvement in the ma-
nufacturing districts. The Hon. Member read extracts
from a letter he had recently received, stating that the
manufactories were working night and day without
being able to meet the demand ; that wages were ad-
vancing, and that there was more employment than
hands. He had never taken a desponding view of the
(distress which had been so long suffered, and he sin-
cerely hoped the present change would be permanent.
He entirely agreed in the object of the motion ;
after the satisfactory explanation of the Right Hon.
Gentleman. he thought it ought not to be pressed.
Sir C. FORBES said, he had heard with the greatest
satisfaction the clear and (=did statement of the Right
Hon. President of the Board of Trade—(Hear). He was
delighted to find so much attention paid to so important
a subject. because the mere mention of the name of In-
dia usually cleared the House of half its Members. He
would only say, that deeply interested as be was in the
welfare of India, he would leave this great question
with the greatest satisfaction in the hands of the Right
Hon. Gentleman.

Mr. SYKES thought an extension of our trade to the
Ent Indies would materially benefit the Shipping In-
terest, which was suffering severely. He was not in-
sensible to what had fallen from the Right Honourable
Gentleman, and if his proposition were carried into
effect, he had no doubt the trade and commei ce of Eng-
land would be greatly benefited.
Capt. ROSS said, be fully concurred in what 'had
been said in favour of free trade, as fir as its principles
sho.rld be safely introduced, and with due consideration
of tslose interests which had so long existed in the West
India Colonies.

Mr. W. SMITH saw no occasion for postponing the
que tion five or six years. The Right Hon. Gentleman
said, the period of renewing the Company's Charter
would be a fit one to consider the subject. He differed
on that head : he thought the subject ought not to be
so long delayed. The interests of commerce demanded
immediate investigation. If, howevei, his Hon. Friend
withdrew his motion for the present, his Majesty's Mi-
nisters might, and he had no doubt they would, give
that early attention to the question which its great ins.
portance demanded.
Mr. BERNAL expressed his surprise that his Hon.
Friend the Member for Norwich, should have gone into
what he conceived so irrevelent a matter as that of
Mauritius sugar. He was the more surprised, too, be-
cause he remembered that his Hon. Friend did not vote
against the admissiOn of sugar from that colony. Hs
entirely dissented from the proposition that cotton could
be more beneficially cultivated in the We►t Indies than
sugar. He regretted that his Hon. Friend should have
so far departed from his own general candour, and he
would say from the usual course suggested by the rec-
titude
of his mind. as to bring in these common-place
topics of violence and abuse upon occasions like the
present. He was provoked to makethese observations,
for he would not sit still and hear insinuations thrown
out against that body of which he was one, without re-
pelling them.
Sir R. FA RQUHAR said he was surprised to hear the
allusion to the Mauritius question from the Honourable
Member for Norwich, when he recollected that the Ho.
nourable Member opposite (Mr. F. Buxton) made a
speech of two hours length advocating the policy and
justice of admitting the sugar of that colony. He de-
fied the Honourable Member or any of his pasty to
prove that one single slave had been introduced into the
Mauritius since 1820, with the exception of one ship(
which, in the year 1825, was run ashore by one of his
Majesty's cruisers, and there burnt. While he W. a s there
no slaves were introduced. and the present Governor
had pledged his honour as a gentleman and a soldier
to the same fact. He defied the Honourable Gentle.
m n to bring the least evidence to support the assertion,
but that of discarded officers of the Government and
perjured soldiers.
Mr. BUXTON thought that he had great reason to
complain of the speech of the Hon. Member for Hythe.
If he (Mr. Buxton) followed the dicta:es of his feelings,
he should at once proceed to controvert the arguments
of the Hon. Member, and to dispute his statements.
He could not, however, then enter upon the subject. as
it was foreign to that which ought to have been strictly
under the consideration of the House—(Hear)—but, he
would tell the Hon. Member, that when the proper
time came he would not shrink from his duty. bat
would be prepared to maintain the charges which he
had brought forward on a previous occasion. But let
him not be misunderstood—he had never asserted that

the Slave Trade was now being carded on in the
Mauritius.

Sir R. FA ILQUH AR—Jo Yon did."
Mr. BUXTON denied that he ever had. He bads,. •
ierted that it was carried oa while the Hon. Member
was Governor; and be had no means of knowing whe-
ther it hAd been carried on since. And when the Hon.
Member said that during the time he was in office, be
had even overstepped the law to bring offenders to
justice, he (Mr. Buxton) only wished to remind she