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he could -depend. Thus five informations had bees
filed against Cat lile, as the vender of a seditious puk.
lication, because Sherwin, the printer, could not lk
found. The regulations in the Bill, upon this and'
other points, would, he trusted, have the effect of
checking the circulation of these poisonous publica-
. tions, of which there had, lately, been so lamentable,
• au inundation, and he trusted also that their Lord-
ships would not hesitate to pass it, seeing, as they
must, that blasphemy and sedition had entered• into
a conspiracy against the Religion and the Cunstitu-i
tioh of the Country, which could only be effectually
put down by the strong arm of the law. His Lord-,
ship concluded by moving that the Bill be read a
second time.
The Earl of DONOUGHMORE—Ministers have,
then, at last wound up, to a happy and appropriate
conclusion, by this attack upon the freedom of the
Press—those measures of indiscriminate coercion—
that systiun of pains and penalties which they had
devised against a suffering and a prostrate people,
and which have been carried into complete and un-
relenting execution by overwhelming majorities in
both Houses of Parliament—those ready instruments'
in the hands of the servants of the Prince Regent, to
keep his Majesty's subjects down—that best of all
possible arguments, in the opinion at least of the
Noble Knight of the Thistle on the Cross Bench, ia,
favour of their own- practice, whatever that practice
may happen to be. Such are the true characteristics
of the,e fearful measures, as they have stamped
themselves on my mind, in impressions never to be
effaced. But what is the light in which we are called
• upon to view them by their authors and abettors on
the other side of the house? Instead of a successful
- attack upon the Iherties of all the people, and in
some of the great essentials, too, which I believe its
my conscience they would have achieved, the Noble'
Earl with the blue ribbon has not hesitated, to take cio-1
slit for these enactments, as a mild system of reme-
dial measures—measures of peculiar grace and mercy
' towards the whole community, necessarily called for,
for the protection of the faithful subjects of the State,
against the inroad of certain impending dangers,
which, however, have come into existence —havebeen
born and bred, and have arrived at full maturity,
during the very short period which has intervened
' since the last prorogation of Parliament. If Minis-
ters had been aware of the impending storm, is it,
possible that they could so far have neglected their
duty, as to have sent the Members of both Houses'
home; without giving them some authentic intima-
tion of the dangers with which the country was en-
compassed ? For such an authoritative caution we
should have naturally looked to the Speech from the
Throne on closing the Session. Is there a syllable in
that speech, to prepare us for the terrible tale of dis-
affection, and insurrectionary movement, to which
we have been called together tiMisten?—As Minis-
ters could have had no possible interest in conceal-
ing from the Parliament the existence of those dan-
gers, if they had really conceived them to exist, I have
a right to take it as an acknowledged fact, that there
was no other feeling but that of loyalty and affection
towards the Crown and the Government, in the
_ minds of the people in the month of July last. And
is it not making too great a demand upon our cre-
dulity, for Ministers to call upon us to believe, that
in four short months this mushroom- rebellion has

sprung up, and has already assumed so formidable
an appearance? What, then, is the rest* of allthis?
My Lords, I do not feel myself entitled to believe
that disaffection has taken deep root, or 'that it has
.extended itself widely. lam not bound to give im-
' plicit credit to the representations which Ministers,
think fit to make in their places in Parliament, and
that garbled statement which they have presented to
both Houses with so much form and solemnity. I
think it my duty to reject it, because it is offered as
conclusive evidence against the people of these
countries, tor whom evidence was offered to be pro-
duced at the bar of both Houses of Parliament—

(hear).—But Ministers refused to hear a word in
their defence, and are now prepared to complete this
'the last act of outlawry against them, on the more li
uncorroborated statement of their inveterate pro-
secutors, the Ministers of the Prince Regent, and
without a tittle of such evidence as would, or ought
to be received, in any Court of Justice—(Hear).--
My first and main objection then to these measures,
of which that before the House brings up the rear, is,
because a sufficient Parliamentary ground has not
been laid, to authorise so serious a proceeding as the
stripping the subject of any part of his constitutional
privileges. I have another objection against the con-
duct of Ministers, in urging the enacting of these
heavy penalties as general measures, because, upon
the Chewing of the Ministers themselves, they were
devised as the cure for insubordination and turhu-

lento in a very few districts only, and those very
pa4icularly circumstanced—and because Ministers
have, notwithstanding, prevailed upon the Parlia-
ment to pass a general sweeping system of coercion
against the whole community. I have a further
ground of objection, because Ireland hat been in-
cluded in the wide spreading proscription—whereas
ber acknowledged tranquillity and peaceable de-
meanour ought to have made her a very unfitting
object for any new measures of severity, and inas-
much as the present measures cannot by any possibi-
lity affect her present situation, or even bear upon
her former habits, when she deserved less well of the
general community than she does at present; and
because there has been nothing to justify suspicion
against her in the remotest degree, or at all to pre-
pare her for this cruel infliction, except, perhaps,
her having been recently honoured by the panegyric
of the Ministers. Because, at t season of extraordi

nary and almost unexampled pressure and suffering,
Ministers have closed their ears against the distresses
of the People. I have an additional reason for ob-
jeaing to these measures, as those of unmixed seve-
rity, when conciliation could have been at the same
time so benignantly and so .beneficially applied.
Rut further, the very principle on which these mea-
sures are founded, strikes my mind as in the highest
degree objectionable, inasmuch as they draw a wide
• demarcation between the different orders in
between the many and the few, the rich and
the task-masters and the effective part of
.elation, teaching to the People this worst of
possible lessons, that in the eye of the Parliament
least, their interests, and those of the higher or-
,consistent with each other—and again, be-
these their lines of demarcation, Ministers

have overlooked tlaatrost appropriate of all distinc-
tions, the separation of file innocent from the guilty:
My Lords, I object to the whole of the machinery
with which Ministers have preceded and accompa-
nied these extraordinary measures. They have taken
the Head of the State from that dignified retirement
in which he is placed in the sanctuary of the Consti-
tution, from which he is produced to the view of his
People in his own proper person, only for the, pur-
pose of exercising the high function of giting or re-
fusing his sanction to the enactments of both Houses
of Parliament ; or the higher function still, of dis-
pensing the heavenly prerogative -of mercy. But
Ministers have broken into the sanctuary. They have
brought the Illustrious Person forward to give a
precipitate approval of the massacre of his father's
subjects, and to influence thereby, as has been too
fatally proved, the conduct of Magistrates, and, as I
fear, of Juries too ; thus closing the door of justice
against the unfortunate victims in the tragedy which
was exhibited at Manchester, on the 16th of August,
last. And lastly, I object to those measures, be-
cause some of their most eloquent advocates have
thought it indispensable for them, in arguing their
necessity, to vilify and degrade that important part
of the Constituency, the People, even below the
humble rank which chey,are acknowledged to hold
in the community of the State. This may, perhaps,
have been a popular topic for the moment, accord-
ing to the extra-aristocratic feeling of the present
day. But thii argument, if it deserves the name,
could surely have been intended for no other purpose,
but to exhibit thetappy dexterity of the eloquent ap;
tist in the most vivid colours, whilst he left the case'
just where he found it. But, according to my view
of the subject, the just composition of-the State as-
signs to that reprobated thing, the People, no incon•
siderable place. The People form the great body of
the social -community. It is from them that it re-
ceives its form and consistency. They are the sinews,
of the nation's strength in war ; and in peace, the'
humble instruments of its commercial prosperity. It
was that reprobated thing, the People, which fought
uathrough the long and arduous contest which has
crowned with glory- the British and the Irish name;
and has borne the triumphal car of Waterloo's disl
tinguished Chief to conquest and to immortality!
The Duke of ATHOL obset ved, with reference to
the expression of the Noble Earl, that the over-
whelming majorities in the two Houses had been the
fit instruments of Ministers in passing through these
measures, that it was an expression 'improperly ap-
plied. Did the Noble Earl mean to disparage the
conduct, pi arraign the motives, of those Noble
Lords who had conscientiously come forward with
their votes in support of the Government at' crisie
of great public danger? - He could for himself say,
that he had most conscientiously voted for these
measures, being thoroughly satisfied in his own mind
that they were imperiously required by the state of
the country. The Noble Earl and others might
have come to a different conclusion ; but surely when
the Noble Earl claimed the right of opinion for him-
self, he ought not to impeach the motives of others
who conscientiously differed from him. He was
satisfied, however, that these measures were called
for by, and would prove highly satisfactory to, the
great majority of the country. And whin 'hop 'nor
ageun, he had no doubt be should be.enabled to con-
gratulate them on the success with which these mea-
sures had been attended; they would operate, as in-
,deed they had partly already, to give strength to the
loyal and well-disposed, to assure the timid, to rescue
the seduced, and to show the really disaffected, in
that paucity of numbers and -strength, which, when
they were stripped of the aid they derived from the
want of measures like these, would, he had no doubt,
be found to belong to them. As to inquiry, it ap-
peered to him perfectly unnecessary; he was fully
prepared on the first day of the Session to vote for
Measures to repress the evil, because he was satisfied
Of its existence from the notoriety of the case. In-
quiry must unavoidably have consumed much time,
and in the interim the Radicals•might have assumed
a position that would have beer. of-serious importance
to the Country. As to -the distress of the People,
which was undoubtedly in some instances great, he
~ th ought that Ministers bad shewn every disposition
Ito alleviate it, and he was satisfied, that by their con-
duct, with regard to these measures, their popularity
had been greatly increased.
• The Earl of DONOUGHMORE, in explanation,
said, that he should disclaim nothing, but, on the
contrary, wished every word that had fallen from
him to be understood in its full force. He appealed
to the House whether he had given any Parliamentary
offence in the expressions he bad used, or stated any
thing that could be mistaken for such by any man
capable of feeling the force of an argument? No
misunderstanding on the part of the Noble Duke
should induce him to adopt any change in that steady
line of conduct which he had heretofore pursued, or
to disclaim any thing he had said, as he was con-
scious of having said nothing of which he ought to
repent.
The Duke of ATHOL, in explanation, admitted
that there was no Parliamentary offence in the lan-
guar - of the Noble Earl.

age
The Earl of HARROWBY defended the Govern;
.rent against the charges of the Noble Earl, and
maintained that sufficient warning had been given of
the circumstances of the Country in the Speech from
the Throne at the close of the last Session. Warn-,
ing was also given in the letters addressed to the
Lord Lieutenants of Counties, and the Proclamation
respecting Seditious Meetings. In answer to thear.
gument, that if Ministers were then aware of the
danger, they ought to have brought forward their
measures at the moment, he observed, that no one
could have anticipated the occurrences which took
place during the Recess, and that Ministers, by wah-
ing until now, only shewed a disposition to trust t•
the existing laws, as long as they could do se with
safety. Besides, the refusal of the Noble Lords on
the other side to assent to them even now, was a proof
of the difficulties that must have attended their pro.
posal at any former period. He concurred with the
Noble Duke (of Athol) in thinking that the majorities
in favour of those Bills mere not confined to the two
Houses of Parliament, but combined all the sound
part of the community. lie was justified in saying
so, when he found that, with the exception of London.
Westminster, and Southwark, no Petition or Remon-
strance had wen presented against them. The silence
of the People could not be disputed ; and if ever
these was an occasion to which the hackneyed quota-.

.on "dum tacent clamar. r might kit applied, it was the
occasion of ivhich he was speaking. Prom this, dis-
position he augured favourably of the future tran-
quillity of the Country, and thought that G 3,011-
ment, by looking the dapger in the face, had pur-
sued the only practicable measure of conciliation,
that of providing for the safety of the well-disposed
subjects of the Crown.
The Earl of DONOUG H MORE repeated, that he
was sorry Ministers had done nothing. in the four
months that they had known disaffection to exist—
but lr..td at last thrown themselves behind Parliament,
and not used the power vested in them.
The LORD CHANCELLOR denied that Minis-
ters were chargeable with the attempt to separate
the rich from the poor, or to divide themselves from
the People of this Country. In the part which he
had himself taken during these proceedings, he was
influenced by a wish to support the true interest and'
real happiness of the People, and to defend their
liberties as established by law. Upon this principle
he considered, that the meeting of Parliament alone,
even if no such Bills had been passed, a great bless-
ing. Before Parliament met, they had heard of the
legality of such Meetings ar that of Manchester, but
no man in either House had dared to defend or asse:t
such a doctrine; it wasiaeard of no more. Liberty
and Death was a motto much insisted on in other
places; he hopad, that as long as Englishmen were
Englishmeo, they would prefer death to the surren-
der of their liberties ; but the liberty to which he
alluded, was not the liberty designated by black and
'bloody flags, or contained in the principles of Uni-
versal Suffrage and Annual Parliaments. He would
confess that he had fears for the constitutional liberties
of Englishmen, before Parliament had met, but since
their meeting these fears had vanished, as he found
that the great majority of the People had confidence
in Parliament. They were told that the Bills inter-
fered with the Right of Petitioning,•*ltile on the
contrary, they protected that right, by putting an end
to those Assemblies of intimidation, by which the
right was abused, and in effect prohibited. The Bills
to prevent training and the possession of arms, were
also necessary, for the intention of the Meeting at
Manchester, and other simultaneous Meetings, was
to subvert the Constituted Authorities. Private
drilling was in itself an overt act of High Treason,
and though the Bill of Rights recognized the pos-
session of arms by the subject for his own defence,
it also asserted the right of the Legislature to inter-
fere when they were intended for other purposes.
He was no Whig, in the meaning of some Noble
Lords, but he hoped he would still continue, as he
had always done, to act upon the sentiments of Lord
Somers and the principles of the Revolution. The
truly great men who took the lead in that transac-
tion, displayed a fearful reverence for the Constitu-
tion, and a determination not to go one inch further
than the necessities of the time required. They were
now discussing a Bill with reference to the Press, the
importance of which was such, that he could not
give a silent vote upon the subject. But while be ad-
mitted that the liberties of Englishmen were greatly
promoted by the Press, he was anxious that they
should not be destroyed by the same power ;- and he
believed, in his conscience, that the Attorney-Gene-
ral could not p.n....eft. gfeed:eines. nna hl atephemime.
works with effect, without the assistance of such a Bill.
The case was perfectly new. During the time that,
be (the Lord Chancellor) had filled the same (Ace,.
waggon loads of papers were not sent through the
country to be distributed on the highways, and in-
troduced into the cottages. But it was stated, that
the two cases ought to be separated. They could
not be separated.—the ease was one and the same.—
it,was seditious blasphemy, or blasphemous sedition.
Such were his conscientious opinions. He might, pos-
sibly, be wrong ; but as he thought he was not so,
he knew enough of the People of England to be cer-
tain that they would do justice to his motives.
The Bill was read a second time, and the House Adjourned.

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