Star.
London, England, 1811-05-07 00:00:00

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( Hear, Lear, hear,)—As to what l;ad been said re-
specting the price of corn, he was ready to admit that
the prices fixed by the legislature for the importation
of grain might have eehanced it, since there had
been censidetable importations of corn ; but those
importations had been made under a choice of evils
--the fall of exchange, or a scarcity of grain. He
bad advised the importation of grain, without which
the quarter's loaf would indeed have been at 2s. 6d.
He was therefore ready to take his full share of re-
sponsibility on this head. The comperative value
of our exp.nes and imports had also been wrongly
stated, as the balance amounted to a mere nullity.
Many if the statements as to our exports and im-
ports were extremely unsure. Last year, for instance,
some of tle,e exports were returned on our hands ;
some of them were confiscated by FofeignStates,'and
in various cases sums of money were expended to
rescue other portions of them from the destructive
grasp of the Tyrant of the Continent ; so that, in fact,
furnished no criterion of our exports and imports.—
The nature of our exchanges was likewise variable.
Since the Frescis had been driven out of Portugal,
the course or exchange there had highly improved, as
be learnt from some mercantile correspondence which
he had seen. (lie :r,Near.) Perhaps the Hon. and
Learned Gentleman (Mr. Horner) was not prepared
to hear, that the great capitalists were directly oppos-
ed in opinion to his propositions ; and yet from a long
intercourse with them, with capitalists emieently
great, he could assure him of this fact. Respecting
any attempt at restoring the payments in specie, this,
depending on circumstances, could not properly be
enacted before those concomitant circumstances were
fully in contemplation. There was such a train bf
errors in the very Report itself, upon which the
Honourable and Leerned Gentleman's propositions
were grounded, that the House ought most maturely
to consider how far it was authorised to sanction
them. The price of gold was stated one year to be
£4. 10s. whereas it was XI. 2s. Even as to what
was called the reasoning of the Report, it continually
differed from itself : when they came to that part
which was termed its experience, however, where he
Lad the advantage of recurring to facts, these made
still more completely against the theoretical proposi-
tions of tke Honourable and Learned Mover ; and
Le (Mr. Rose) had no objection to commit those de-.
tails to him, that he might not be obliged to trouble
the House with them. Fairly and reciprocally exa-
mined, the amount of notes and gold warranted no
such deductions as had been advanced ; whilst the
. fluctuations in exchange completely distanced all the
theories they had heard. Any alteration in the ex-
changes was unaffected by, and independent of, the
issue of Bank paper ; for the exchange had on the
whole been uniform, occasionally favourable, and ge-
nerally stationary. Other circumstances were to be
considered. 11;11s of exchange were now so circui-
tous, that much was lost in the mode of their nego-
tiation ; while, at the same time, our foreign ex-
penditure (about twenty-four millions) created de-
and necessarilyera drained the cotry of its gold. The
home market was not the twentieth part of the
home consumption. It had been stated that the
price of all commodities had risen, and that the
price of gold had in like manner rose; but whilst the
price of other ankles had doubled, the price of geld
had been found stationary. France, however, had
more than kept pace with us in this rise ; if there was
one seventh advance here, there was, he knew, one
tenth there. Silver, he would affirm, in coin, would
never fetch so much as silver in bullion. Were it not
tiresome to the House, he could refer to the evidence
of gentlemen ( Aaron Goldsmid and Sir F. Baring)
which proved that gold had got up more in 1762 and
Se and towards the close of the American war; and
that, in the want of gold, an increased circulation of
Bank notes was recommended. Continuing to re-
probate various parts of the Report, the Right Hon.
Gentleman (Rose) denied erur foreign expenditure to
have been borne out by our exports, of which there
was ample proof in the events of the year 1796. The
merchant would export, if he
could pay by bills or
bullion, and, if not so, by bankruptcy. According
to one foreigner, whose evidence was so much relied
on, the only remedy was fraud and perjury, and this
he stated stiffly ! Respecting that part of the Report
which recapitu'eaed .the history of the Bank of Eng-
. land at the time of William HI. their lending of 'no-
pies, their rates of interest, and the assistance they gave
to Government, and the falling of their notes, he was at
someloss to know where this information had been glean-
ed. [Mr. Horner said from Somers'stracts.] ifso,
he did not think that the Committee had dorrejustice to
itself in blindly taking such evidence, and which, at
least, was little applicable to us. The Acts of the 7th
and Bth of William and Mary ordered the value of the
guinea, at first, to 265. and then to 225. This, ne-
vertheless, was the identical Parliament whose exam-
ple we were now called upon to follow—a Parliament
which, allowing the Bank to increase their capital,
also authorised the Bank to augment its issues. So
much for our looking back to the good old times, and
endeavoeir:ng to emulate our uncorrupt ancestors ! It
v; es not less extraordinary that an enlightened Com-
mittee, appointed to examine into such a question as
the present, should have terminated their labours by
mistaking every fact of importance, and admitting
evidence of which they had no substantial proof.—
There were circumstances connected with the Ex-
change, which were not necessary for him then to go
into ; but with respect to the Bank Directors he did not
know he it was possible to invent any new mode by
which they could govern. themselves, In his own ()pi-
llion there were not the least, grounds for suspicion
against the conduct of the Bank Directors, and the
way its which the Honourable and Learned Gentle-
man had stated it, in one of his last Resolutions ; he
conceived such a regulation would be attended with
very injurioesconsequences ; for instead of the Bank ex •
ercising any discretion in the matter, it would be vested
in the hands of exchange merchants. The next question
was, whether there had been an excessive issue of Bank
.paper? and upon this point the opinion of the Bullion
:Committee was, that the amount of discounts had
, increased since 1796: From 1802' to 1809, the in-
crease was as follows :—in 1802 they amounted to
$1".0 V 064 and in 1809 to $17,964., makingan increase
.
Of little more than $300,000 in eight years, and then
came the question whether there had been a greater
*ssue of Bank paper than was actually called for. It
ewes admitted on all hands, there had been a great
eceeeee of Bank ?Ater, and upon this Mint he tv,

ferred to the opinion of Sir Francis Borings-who
sail, that an iacreased trade and revenue must ne.
cessarily increase the circulating medium ; and to
elucidate this opinion, he cited the experts of 1798
end 1810: in I'9B the exports were £26,000 the
issue of Bank of England notes was £12,000,000
in 1310, the exports were upwards of 650,000,000
more than double the former year ; and the issue of
Bank paper was only £22,000,000 ; thus theincrease
of exports was upwards of £24,000,000, while the
increase of bank-notes amounted to no more than
£10,000,000. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman
saw no reason why the Bank of England notes should
not be restrained ; but if they restrained the issue of
Bank of England notes, they would have much worse
paper in their room. The Honourable and Learned
Gentleman says, 4, let us have a New Company."
The country already knew what the Bank of Eng-
land had done, they knew their conduct up to the
present moment ; they well knew that a given quan-
tity of commerce in time of war must necessarily in-
crease the quantity of money for carrying it on, on
account of the increased price of freight, of insur-
ance, &c. and again -upon this point Sir Francis
Baring was of opinion that the circulating medium
must 'consequently be reduced, and that an increased
exportation, must be subject to long credits and
other circumstances which will naturally affect the
state of exchange. But if they were to check the
Bank paper, they would check their commerce,
their exports, and the rate of exchange. And af-
ter the evidence before them, he left the Committee
to judge whether the circulating medium was in
that state which would' allow such a check ; to fetter
the issue of Bank paper, would, in his opinion, be a
most dangerous experiment. He gave the fullest cre-
dit to the ability and talent of the Hon. Gentleman ;
but from what he had state/ to the Committee, he
thought there was conclusive evidence that the Bank
of England had nothing to do with the rate of ex-
change ; but the Committee had come to a Resolu-
tion directly contrary to evidence, except es to the
Continental merchants, and partially as to the opinion
of Sir Francis Baring. The Continental merchants
had stated that the issue of Bank paper had nothing
to do with the rate of exchenge„ hut prevented the rise
of it. The gold, to be sure, might have been expor-
ted, and this against the law ; but if they could not
permit the exportation of the gold,the restriction on the
Bank paper was of no use. Therefore, he contended,
that the evidence was in contradiction to such exten-
sion ; and by adopting such a measure they would only
encourage a system of fraud and perjury. Sir Francis
Baring was not for any direct and positive law to com-
pel the Bank to return to payments in specie ; he
thought it a good measure, whenever it could be done
with propriety ; and therefore, to pet aside the evi•
dente of those Gentlemen who had given such satis-
factory answers to questions suddenly put to them,
was highly unjust, and confirmed him in the opinion
that no positive time should be fixed to compel the
Bank of England to revert to the issue of specie.—
With respect to the publication of his Honourable
Friend (Mr. Huskisson) he had the fullest convic-
tion that his motives were as honourable as he
(Mr. Horner) thought them right, but he could not
help saying that if would have been much better he
never had given these opinions to the public.—
He was perfectly persuaded that it was impossible for
malice itself to invent or impute any bad motives to
him. If a publication of this kind had come from
any indifferent hand it might have been otherwise,
but his character and experience and his high official
situation gave them a weght and consequence which
was of a dangerous tendency. In speaking of the
Bank of England, he (Mr. H.) said, that it might be
that the Bank was wrong in limiting their issue to
commercial men. That they might have been indis-
creet, he admitted, but they never endangered the
property of the Public, and by shaking a long-esta-
blished usage, he thought they would get into diffi-
culties which would prove insurmountable. He wish-
ed not to be considered as the advocate of the Bank,
but if the Bank Directors could not justify themselves,
he would not stand up in that House to defend them.
The Bank could not find the specie to pay the de-
mands upon it ; if they could find it at any expence
whatever, he thought they ought to do it. Their
profits were large, they ought to do this, and the
House ought to assist them ; but they were not told
what were the means of procuring it, and his perfect
conviction was, that the gold was not to be had in
the present state of the country. But it was said,
that by sending out the commodities we can spare to
Aft ica and America we would procure gold in return,
but surely they could not get that without an equiva-
lent; they could not send more goods than there was a
consumption for,and as to procuring specie, it could not
be gothere, foreigners bought it up wherever they could
find it, at the tate of 14, 15, and 16 per cent.
above the current price, and there were Gentlemen
iii
that House who well knew that their directions to
their Brokers was to pay one shilling more than any
body else, and to get the gold at any rate ; he there.
fore felt the most perfect conviction that the gold was
not tobe procured, and,even if it was, the country could
not be the better tor it, for if it should be sent to the
Mint to be coined, the moment it came into circula-
tion it would be again melted. The monstrous and
tyrannical measures of the Continent were directed
against this country in this way ; the object was to
destroy the last germ of resistance to that tyranny.
If any mischief was to be done to this country, let it
be the effect of the enemy, and not our owna--let us
not destroy our prosperity by our own acts. Upon
the whole he saw no practical good could arise from
the measure, but much practical mischief, and there-
fore he opposed the proposition of the Honourable
and Learned Gentleman.
Mr. THORNTON was of opinion that paper cur.
ttncy had a constant tendency to excess. Nothing,
he conceived, was more opposite than the comparison
which had been instituted bet Ween the present bank-
ing system and the scheme of Mr. Law ; and this
circumstance considered, it was the duty of Parlia-
ment to see that the Bank should not lend at too
low a rate of interest, than which nothing was more
calculated to promote a tendency to excess, which, if
time permitted, he could prove to the House by the
statement of a variety of particulars. The Hon,
Member here went into a long description of the
banking system in Paris, arguing, by analogy, as
to the probable effects of that received in this
country. He observed, that there was, indeed, a
specific difference between the Bank of England and
MO of the coati4 .0144 Aig 14 44 Wen 0:4411

THE EVENIN6 S'T.Ali.

LONDON.

TUESDAY, MAY 7.
PRICE OF STOCKS THIS DAY AT ONE O'CLOCK.
Cons. money 651—for account, 65+1—Reduced 64j
4 per Cent. 7911-5 per Cent. Navy 9614.
Ex*beg. par to 3s. prom.—Bonds 238. 24a. pretu.

His MAJESTY walked yesterday as usual, before and
after dinner, accompanied by General GWYNNE.
By a vessel which has arrived at Plymouth from
Cadiz, information is received that the expedition of
7000 Spaniards, which sailed from thence on the 15th
ultimo, had effected a landing near San Lucar, and
were marching for the Guadiana, to co-operate with
a division of the British and Portuguese army.
A Gentleman who left Bayonne on the 28th ult.
states, in addition to the above, that the Spaniards
had occupied Figueras, a strong and important for-
tress in Catalonia, after an obstinate resistance on the
part of the French and Italian troops who garrisoned
it, and who, to the amount of 3000, had been made
prisoners of war.
Some private advices from the coast of France also ,
state, that BONAPARTE had finally determined upon
war with Russia, and was about to set out to join the
army destined to act against that power. &femme,
it was added, was appointed Generalissimo of the
armies in the Peninsula ; and this statement derives
I some credit from the report of MAssaNA's recal, which
has been spoken of at Lisbon.
Other letters state, that an universal spirit of dis-
content prevails amongst the French towards the go.
vernment of BONAPAItTE. The bankruptcies, both
at Paris, and in other large towns in France, have
been very extensive, and, in the large mercantile
houses, to a very great amount.
This morning a Mail from Cadiz arrived, brought
to Falmouth by the Carteret packet, in ten days. The
intelligence from the South of Spain is highly grail-
fy ing—the French being every where reduced to ex-
tremities. The Portuguese papers received itsterday,
however, contain the latest intelligence on the subject
of the operations in the immediate vicinity of Cadiz,
as will be seen from the following extracts :
" ELTAS, ARRIL 22.—Letters from Algarve positively irate,
that the Army of General Buick, which disemlnaked in Aya-
rnonte and Cartaya, amounted to 12,000 infantry, and GOO horse.
Generals Zits as and Aan►lsAGA, are Generals of ditision
in
this Expedition.
" We are assured they will raise the siege of Cadiz, as they
are able to reckon upon 10,000 men, ready to act is the com-
bined movements upun Andalusia.
" LISBON, APRIL 27.—Generals Baittatkiaaos and Zavas
af4 en gat svyal road ei Srfiltst" .
. -

with the Government of the country where they were
established. These latter issuid their notes on the
account of the Government, and without receiving
an interest ; but the Swedish Bank was an exception,
the Company hid issue their paper at an interest of
5 per cent. which had accordingly become excessive.
It was a principle laid down by the celebrated Adam
Sthith, correct, he was disposed to think, though he
could not acquiesce in all the doctrines of that writer,
that if there were a single bank established in a given
place, without fear of competition, it might arrange
the price of every markew.ble commodity within the
1 sphere of its circulation. He would ask, whether the
Bank of England did not, in some measure, resemble
such a one in its present state—whether it had not a
kind of monopoly of the currency of the metropolis
productive of the same effects ? He was ready to
admit that some inconvenience would be the result
of restoring things to their pristine situation ; but if it
were to be maintained, that therefore so desirable an
object were to be neglected—that no evil was to be
incurred, howsoever great the balance of good might
be, he was not sure that it would be at all useful to bring
the artillery of ratiocination to bear in such a case.—
The objection of the Right Hon. Gentleman, that I
the Bank would find a difficulty of procuring gold in
i T HTORBAY; MAY S.
sufficient quantity if the restriction were removed, pro- 1 his day arrivedis Maiesty's schooner MULLETT f
h r
ved too much if it proved any thing. It might be true ! mouth with stores for the Signal 1).-;st at Berryhead. from
.
Pl.
that gold was enhanced in price all over the world, as Hi, Majesty's 0-12 ARIL r Kits*, Capt. CO/Its, Wit the vil:;n
el; the East India ships, wind bound.
IbltrigMor
war arrived
Yhe:e.
this morrin* tram
had been stated; but if that were the case, yet we were
to consider whether the increase had not taken place
The SaArtowt Pa
in a greater ratio in our own ; and it we found that !
Lisbon.
bs.he has been seven days on her passage, and Curs—
it was dearer here by twenty per cent. than paper, it ,
was our duty not to permit it still further to increase.. qwuiethntefie si.olpFniottltezooffrai raetceeanntddaatceo. She s. led in company
The arguments we would advance against a change which have stood up Channelg for Portsnnivouoyth l'itglhit tA
hP°:'".
C CliAl E.,
would otherwise be every day gaining an addition of Is guns, and the Mt; ta.s. r schooner,sailed 1 • • last right for l'ortr
strength, and if it were allowed the evil must be con- ' mouth, with alike( of light transports under their convoy front
(siderect as altogether irretrievable. It was for the this
ands PY'orrttliale.—Trther are e
Goi.dirrtiitsned it to take reinforcements to Spain
c brig
.of war is still waiting bet
consideration cf Parliament whether they would main- for the Messenger who •isto go out in her, with dispatches le.:
taro a standard, or whether, in order to keep up prices ' Calz —Wind N.W.
at home, she would suffer an unlimited augments- I
and A b—
led the Cecilia was lost yesterday near this port,
drowned
the Master, his wite and child, and four of the crew wve
tion of the circulating medium ? There was no ° rowned ; only two seamen were saved. Arrive.' the Span' I brig
prospect of peace, that therefore was not an event, Esperanza, after being taken by the Admiral Martin French
to which we should look as the termination of an vat,,er, and retaken by hie Majesty's ship Su es NON. Thessiirs,i-
evol which bad no necessary connection with it.— DION has also detained the American brig ltose In Bloom, trnco,
We should set about the work immediately ;—it oatYv°eZra.re 'for
JeArdnaral
and an
privateer had taken the brig
English brig float R. iis Lit.eiro.—
should he prosecuted with caution and temper, but The cosis;al4l. guseyn:barin. . L has sent in; French brig, name un.
also with earnestness. Was it acting like persons pos- known.
sessed of common sense to leave every thing to chance,
and not stretch forth a hand to preserve ourselves from
the ruin that seemed to approach us ? As far as law
was connected with the question, he would rather
have left it to the management of persons more capa-
ble than himself ; but there was one circumstance so
obvious as to strike the least observant--how far were
the penalties to extend by which we were to curb a
traffic so difficult to be detected. It was likely to
become every day an object of greater temptation,
so long as the gains were slight. The penalty might
be an equal proportion, but paper might and would
under the present system be so depreciated, that in-
dividuals possessing property of a certain description
could preserve themselves from ruin only by resort-
ing to it, and it was dreadful to contemplate the ex-
tent of punishment to which it might be uecessary to
have recourse. He could not, with sufficient earnest-
ness, exhort the House to embark in this work while
it was yet time. If he might borrow an illustration
used by Mr. Berke, on a similar occasion, 6, if light
were not admitted through appropriate apertures into
an edifice, it would force its way through chinks and
crevices."
Mr. VANSITTAP.T rose amid a general cry of
Adjourn ! upon which
Mr. WHARTON moved that the debate should
be postponed till to-morrow, and that the Committee
ask leave to sit again.
The House having
.resumed, the Chairman report.
ed progress, and obtained leave for the Committee to
sit again to-morrow.—Adjourned at half past One.

THE ARMY.

Thursday one Officer and upwards of MO cf the
West Norfolk Militia, quartered at Yarmouth, vuluu-
teereal into the 54th Regiment of Foot.
Yesterday the Judge-Advocate, Sir Davis) BAIRD,
General FINCH, and several Officers of di,tinction,
assembled at ten o'clock in the morning, at ChAwe
College, in order to proceed on the trial of Colonel
Jorixs•ros ; but there not being present a sufficient
number of Members to constitute a Court, they ad-
' journed- tritiPthis morning, at ten o'clock.
The following General Orders were issued by Lord
WELLINGTON, during the late pursuit of MAshRNA:
" Adjutant-General's O cr, Lo sa, March 16.
" The Commander of the Forces return; hi, 'thanks to Ge-
neral, Staff Officers, and Troops; for their cx.rl;cnt conduct in t:.e
operation of the Izst ten days against rite enemy. He requests
the Commanding Officers of the 43d, 52d, and 95th Reginirr..s
to name a Serjeart of each Regiment, to be recommended for
promorloti to au Ensigncy, a., a reitissen of the partir.Le appear
tion of the Centirtander of the Fen:: of the cocchc.t cf thcce gra Pe.
&emu."

NiIV4L INTELLIGENCE.

• PORTSMOUTH, MAY 6.

Arrived his Majesty's ships Cu aIIAWIEE and AcuATrs from a
anise, and several transports from Lisburn.—Sailed hi. Nl,jest)'s
ship VENGLUK, 11AWF11, 501.111 A, Menu SA, and NALCISiUS or
a Cruise.