Star.
London, England, 1829-04-14 00:00:00

. 4.162410 Ibs.
seS4CMO Ib

Total . , . 4,547,550 lbs.
Now if he were to rest his-cue upon this statement
alone, he trusteJ it contained sufficient to induce the
•Holue to negative the Motion of the Honourabje
Member for Dover. Bat be would go further and say.
that on Other grounds he might answer them. There
were other causeaol. the evils which formed the sob. -
jest of complaint. He meant the extension of mean-
ifactories, the evils of which fell spun particular
tricts,aod on none,so extensively as Pan thisrmetropolis.
Trevituii to the year 1824, manufactories began to es-
iend.theinselves, not under cireamstaoces showing any
wholesome state of tradenot under circumstances of
as enviable nature; bet from the operation of cusses,
which, the Hon. Gentleman .himself must admit, did
not justify the increase. The extension of the stnann-
intones :begai under the nperatien.Of impolitic laws;
thmelayr.s bad hems repeel4d; area in their, repeal they
UndadVocatesfor.therr continuance and (*tension; but
it
.yrail remarkable that amongst the petitioners who had'
sent petitions to theHouse.and the persons who had made.
speeches in their favour. and arm:ipso those who had
addreesettrepresentations to the Board over .which he'
bad the,hosour to preside. he Could answer that since
the repeal of those laws,. there was not.one found
to give them on expcestiou of regret. The laws
to which be 4luded 'were those that fixed a wails=
.14 wages, and d d net leave the remuneration of &shout
.to be determined by the demand for it. With re.pect
'to otreimportant branch of theSpitalfielda manufacture
—bp meant the figured and fancy goods, which were
more than any others subject to the calls of fashion and
she caprice of change—lre believed the manufacturers
'there bad suffered considerably; bet it was to be rw-
leiritifethat the'eatent to which they had suffered was
.1.,*Y90.-Ilifi (*if ether places; and that these visitatiots.
1911.4 in them under the ioffeence of protecting laws, and
law sbem the authors of those impolitic laws were alone
tob!tm!. He had a mernoraUiluin connected with the
IP4l*. cod upon the contents of that he thought be
naght ask the. Hon.Georleasarr, whether the inhabitants'
;Itf Coventry were now of opiiiinn. that they bad suffered
tbe extent be spoke of from foreign competition? In
tic In4a3facture r f ribbons, competitien had created an
leipluientea to an catgut that u as nuw the boast 01 th

L ... ..

Ages, mama &lift

of whom bed said bins that; phople ',odd kerigi .kwow.
they were manwfactuved by dee same bands, or it the
same place. He knew that tbe• machinery' had else
bees changed, and improved: but this was the result'
with regard to the ribbons. The Hon Geodeman had,
Stated that there was a large. number of persons out
of employment. He believed the statement•was• some-
what coloured.; butudniuing k to be true to its full
extent, be.would dhow /bat the number of persons em.
ployed had more than propottionably Increased. Since
I8!4, the number of looms.had increased by•thevees•
her of 1000. 1n18634,tbe aumber. of silk amoufeeturera
in Coventry amounted ea 1001 in the course of
last year, there were- between 300. ad 400. In Man-
chester the distress.was also very great in•tbis branch
alone, but it proceeded. born the sun...4mm at the

•
others, and was not attributable to the bassist iDge•OCII

supposed to have been exercised by the .cliesses of his
Right Honourable Friend. • In .1823 these were not

twenty silk manufacturers; at present• there MOM
k above sixty. At. that ,time there were only shoat
five thousand looms within tea mike roaadldattehes-

ter; but in. the present year that number was nearly
double. In the year 1823 there was scarcely a single 'I
loom in Leeds, near -Manchester, bat at present thaw
u ere one thousand. There were, besides, immense
looms erected, and he need.nottell the Hoo.Gen=

that the first influence of thou power hours was to throw
' a great portion of the labouring population out of em-
ployment. He bad hada litter consasunieatedaabins,
which had been written by a Uentlesnan °Crest Irr•
speetability and authority in Manchester, in which it
was said, "?be silk.taanafasture in Manchester and its
neighbourhood is tenfold what it was in 1118 s. but the
greatest increase has been hoar Alpcil 1828, to-Decent-
ber 1825: The House would see that was when that

almost infinite extension of -the tande.took piece.. The
leaer went on—o, MAssbester snake silk and cotton

goods, which are exported freely to North. ands
South America, but the present depression ban bee*
caused by over-production and excess of capital."....,
In Ma e.clesfie:d the. same dismiss (which he . deeply
regrettedexisted, and was produced by the sama
causes. In that town, in 1823, there were 3,000
looms; in October, 1028, share were 6,000; and ins
Faunal, 1829. there were 4,000. There was anothed
part of the country to which the Honourable blembwi
for Coventry. had teferted-..he meant the towns in Scoti
land where silk manufactures had Wallah° establisbellt
In those the trade had been greatly extended, and titer
furnished anotheir proof of what hebed before said. Is
Glasgow there were 3,000 looms in the year 1623, tints
since that period the silk gams: trade had increased to a.
considerable degree; audio Feb. 1829, they amounted to
7,000. In 1823 there were four silk manufacturers, at
present there sere ales and of 'ilk and canton mann/sc.:
tures there were 10. Ini'aisleythere were 11 silk asannfas-1
suers in 1823, and there were 30 silk manufacturers at
this time ; and where, in 1823, one bale of raw silk was
used, twenty were now employed. He thought he need.
not fatigue the House with more-calculations on the
subject. He would now advert to the. state of di -
tbrowsters, who bad never contended that prolsilitioas
were necessary for their protection, but abases,, if the
representations made were to be credited, required those,
prohibitions which they had never before deemed owes.;
airy; and they required prohibitions to a, degree that,
if given, would ruin the marsufaeturer himself. The
shrowsters and those who were interestedissisat branch
of the trade complained of the. redstaiow.of the ,duty
from 7s. 6d. to ss. a reduction made by a' Treasury Or.
der; and the Hon. Gentleman bad spoken of this in a
asepses to him (314 Vifitagerald) unintelligible, as if it'
Ned at one fell swoop deprived she trade of osie.third
of their vested property. A certain quantity of. foreign
thrown silk. superior to what could he obtaitted from the
English throwster, was indispensable tothemsaufacture
of pods in the higher branches of the trade. The profits
had been considerable at one time, but. that was before
the business bad been so much exteaded as it had been!
of late years-mn emission that had diminished the
amount of profit to the, master, and, by creating a very
large addition to the working hands,had also diminished
the valise ofiabour. Those who contended against the
measures that were proposed to be introduced three years
ago, said that France would undersell us; and they, therm
fore, asked for two years to prepare by drawing in their
advances on speculation, and by other means, and their
request was granted, so that it was not till 1826 that
raw silk was to be admitted at a low duty. It was
Curious enough that those per sons, *ho asked for this
delay of two years, were the first who were guilty of
an extension of the very means against which they had
said they wished to prepare by limiting their specula-
tions. He bad shown that the quantity imported was
one million and a half mere than in the preceding year,
calculating from April 1824 to Dec.lB2B, and he would
show bow this happened. These persons in 1825 addressed
Parliament, and said they could not compete with the
French manufacturer, because of the quantities of silk
with which they would be inundated from France at a low
duty, by which an immediate glut would take place, and
tb.y prevailed on Parliament to adopt a measure
which, in-the result, defeated the legal importation
by prescribing that now. but a certain length should
-be admitted loos the ports of this -country. They
were aware that the goods, prepared in France were
not of the prescribettgth, and that they could cot
be imported. .But .w i e these measures were under
consideration, the ...Preach manufacturer became
aware of what was • caking place, 'and success.
fully prepared another and a large quantity Of
goods of the prescribed measure. In the mean tinsetbe
goods first prepared bad been sold at a low ratevand
were smuggled into this couotry, sa that in the smolt
'themsanehsetwer had tontrieed to•enesse two foreign
stocks, with-which .they were completely overmattbeiL
He put it to the House, whether there could be any'
measure that could gperate more decidedly strata
the interest of those persons who bad authorised
suicidal a secomeneedetion ? 1n1824, the throwsterd
increased facie astablishments,wfoer having represented,
to the Governmeot thedilficultrof obtaining thrown silt
from abroad, in consequence of which the Navigation
Acts were relaxed, and the ditty wocreduced from seven
shillings and sixpence to five 'billings. a was idle and
aboard to think:ol6am able to as port/English thrown
4iik, wakes by the greater cheapness of our wort we
mould exclude foreign thrown silt Sven our market;
yet such had been the expectation of the English throw-
mgrs. He would our suite same facts as to the number
of throwing edits sad spindles since 1682. He should
mete that statesmen front reports wade to him flee or
cis weeks ago, 'which had been since confirmed at a
Miring of a Deputation of the Silk Trade with the
Members of theßoard et Trade. tie would take a number
of considerable tow's, which he asm red the House he bad
taken, not for the purpose of producing an effect, but be-
cause they were loge towns. They were 18 in number t
Saedbach, Congleton, Macclesfield. 31 iachester Glas-
gow, Paisley. Leith, Newcastle, Middlewich,
New ton. Middleton, from.. Bruton. Taunton, Sc. Al '
ban's, Watford, and Cnggleshall. In these towns, pre.
violas to the year 1824, there were but 780,000 spindlesii

~, ~

;i!1I

Re the year 1329 them liilleetbleimetownfl,ll3o,ooo,,
Made: an incentillifi4olllllllo. He admitted that, pro.
,lour to the yderlo2ll, all the "ladles were employed,
:end he believed the Profit* were eery grew, while is
this year many were °Misplayed; hot even if 300.000
'were in thatstate, it Would show no ditoinution in the
real extent of employment, but pfitethetontrary. The
itmuber of. mills at that time was 175, Ur present it
was 266. Was it necessary tread& miste' to %stove whit
be hadalmady said, that the-evils now felt by the silt
an.anuFacturers arose from overtiading? It might 'be
Mild by some persons, end he believed it had ken
'said, that the competition et the throwster Was an a&
tantage.to the manufacturer. They would find that
that competition bad produced an Opposite effect ; for it
bad sent the throwster into the minim for raw sick, as
a rival (or the manufacturer; notes his dependent. Thep
had been told, but be did not think it would be found
to be true,• that the interesti of the manufacturer and'
throwstm were inseparable; iThe course the House
-might follow would be• short and simple, because, •to
preserve the home market and to obtain a foreign mar-
ket, it was necessary only to give the manufacturer the
raw material on the same terms and of the.mme quality
with the manufactuter of France, and he (bIE. V. F.)
believed they would have no competition to fear. He
knew none wise dreaded, whether as it regarded capi-
tol, machinery, or successful execution of work andel...!
taken; and that spirit of improvement, which the my.
competition 0f1824 had first created, was a proof of
what he said. —He knew the importance to the silk
manufacturer of being able to select his silks ; but he
knew not if that was 'not an advantage for which the
manufactuter might be required to pay too dearly.
Ha would net attempt to separate the interests of 'the'
manefactuters and: throwsters ; for theettlettion of one
would not be confined to him alone, but MOM estud to
the other. In all publications which treat of the fines;
class el goods, the finer thrown silk was treated as indis-
pensable. Au atgenseut of strong seasoning deduction
'was to be derived frosirthe 'relative quantities imported.
Taking the duty ht ss. end the expense of throwing in mad.
importing from-Italy at 35.1 d. they amounted together to
more thanis. H. assumedthet the Eaglish throwster
could not produce it ; and be and those who contended
for further protection contended that the introduction of
Piedmont silk was- necessary for the finer fabrics, and
that it would displace a certain portico(' of the silk he
now throws. If be believed the argument of the Hoe..
Member for Coventry, or /ether of those who furnished
him with his arguments, the vesuk would bets displace
that portion of French manufactoredsoods introduced'
into this country, to the prejudice df the'English Meth
factnrer. instead of displacing the foreign thrown silk,
it would displace the foreign wrought manufacture.
First, it was obvious that if a Urger portion were
not brought in, the Eaglish tbrowster would not
be injured. He would find in the larger quantity-
he .throws a compensation to restore the trade—
to remove the prevailing apprehensions. The Ho-
nourable Membeetoafessed that on this subject the
difficulty was the greatest that presented itself; but bet
was prepared to recommend a reduction of duty en
foreign thrown silk. ' He was aware he should be toM
that to effect his own principle. his proposition did net'
go far @sough ; but if be could deal with this sobjfiml
as if -it were new, and without regard to existies
interests, be should not recommend a gradual advance
tothe principle, but proceed to it at once; as it was,
be must submit to be taunted by the Honourable
Gentleman opposite (Mr. Heme)s that be did not go far,
*sough. lif be pliaodguilty.t. this charge, however,
he ought to be treed from the accusation of the Hon.,
Memberfor Coventry t and surely it was not unless-
pones& to make as advance towards a great principle,.
and to go as fat towards it as circumstances would al-
low. Is so doing he begged to be understood that mei.•
thae he, nor those who acted with him in Parliament,-
were pledged to any future wets& Let it nor be slid
hereafter that. on the faith of duties yet remaining. ore
speculations bad been entered• into. Fosse individuals
bad gone the length of telling him that they bad a right
so the protecting duty of seven shillings and sixpence;',
but it most not be 'permitted that Parliament slaseldl
be deemed pledged' to anything, but to listettfik
mane which, under eircamstances,might appeal
bast calculated to prommethegeneral advantage ef the!
trade. The throwster was under a mistake if he thought
the duties would affect him in the way anticipated... 1 7
Some persons were of opinion that be could go on viith.'
out any protection; others. said"that two shillingi'
would be sulkiest; but if it were hereafter found that
the home manufacture was injured, it would be netes-I
nary to go further, not for the sake of the strantrfetterer
as agaiost the tbrowster, but for the asked both. - He
would state why the Ihrowster was mistakes is cow
tending that the measure of his price of throwing
ought to be the measure of the protecting duty.—
He forgot the important filet. that, in addition to the Su
duty, there was the whole expense of • the Italian
thiamin ; so that the protection, in point of fact, was
81. ld. He took the expense ,of throwing in Italy at
21. 9d.; some. asserted that it was only 2-. 6d. and
others that it was 35.; but he adopted the medium,
although some throwsters asked a protection of 6d.
He did not think he need enter into much argument to
show why be did not confirm such a rash and extra-
vagant expectation. At such a rate the throwiters
slight go orr presperously enough, but the snanufattu-
ren could not survive. The manufacturers and the
throwstetscombined in advocating a protection of 95.6 d.
only son the supposition that Government adhered to
the prissiple of prohibition. He was authorised by the
calculations of a gentlemen of considerable mercantile
infotantion.a stern ("poem of the principles of flee
trade—to state, that Italian thrown silk arrived in this
toy charged with an-expense of is. Id: in addition
to thuds, of 5.. With regard to tram, be bad been
informed by another.gentlensaa, that be had lately pus.
chased a queotitrof rawsilk in Loedoo, half was throws!
into tramin Italy, and half in England; and the Italian
afilli cost him is. 10d. more than the English tramp..
Oa the grounds stated, therefore, be should propose le
reduce the duty upon thrown silk from ss. to 3s. 6d. at
'from Ss. to 2s. and the duty on singles would be:
lowered to 11.8 d. The whole question resolved itself
into one short statement---that, under existing circum-
stances, Goviimunent was bound to protect the home.
manolactorer and the home market, by as high a pr0..1
Wain deity as could be allowed; but the amount
of that duty must be Aimited by a regard to the
temptation held out to the smuggler. It was not
The I.gal, but the contraband- importation, that the
Ws" had to feat; and the protection to the throw.
seer NUM not be so greet as to risk the mom
illicit importmionsand thus to bring the costrallend ae.
tide into the home market. He had thus, stated the
principle on which protectioo could be extended to the
tbrowster and t.) the British manufacturer.; .het
'had not yet toothed the subject of drawback'.
He was about to propose the admission of the prig.
ciple of a drawback on home maeufectured silk, in
&Mount equal to the duty on the foreign thrown silk•
employed in it. It was quite obvious, that if the
home manufacture were protected be a duty levied

S

On -foreign' mitt.—if It were desirable tii lave and
to escaping. an -eiport -trade, it was necessary to do
more. Here he must be permitted to remark, that
those who bad introduced former: measures upon the
thine principle bad been taunted with holding out
the espectation of a great ex ion trade. It could
ant be fait ly imputed to them that they had expressed
confidence in such a result. It is the principle (said
the Right Honourable Gentleman) of export trade to
discharge the goods of Widely, and it was not difficult
to prove that the duties on foreign thrown silk are of
ibis nature—on exportation they become transit du-
ties. No man will pretend that an export trade cats exist
on transit denies, and no man could expect to hey
transit duties on such an article. I am aware that I '
'shall be met by an objection as to the identity of the
salk exported. When the proposition was first made to
ialciw is drawback, i felt that difficulty so strongly
that 1 at once negatived the recommendation; and until
Peery late period ['continued of the same opinioo. But
I think, under
,present circumstances, the House will
deem it immaterial if there be a substitution; say, that
substitution may possibly be advantageous. If by the
allowance of drawback we possess r urselves of any
'market which calls not sot the finer order of fabrics,or of
that which employs the finer thrown silk imported, it
is obvious that thatportion of the finer silk imported
Will be applied to' some article of manufacture to be
comumed at home, to the ekclusion of foreign fabric..
Parliament has already. on ,more than one occasion,
acted upon the ptinciple of allowing drawbacks on
articles exported, without reference to their identity.
It will be recollected that t'.e sugar refiners were per•
mitted to take foreign sugar into their works for the
purpose of refining, it for exportation; but they were not
required to export the identical sugar, but an equal
quantity. In another Act, now expired, wheat was
allowed to be taken out of bond and ground for ex-
portation; quantity, without reference to identity,
these satisfied the law. It may be said, that we are
under this difficulty—that persons might avail theitt-
se.ves of 'these drawback,, as they have done of others,
Tor the purpose of fraud, by Obtaining w draw•
back exceeding the amount of the duty paid; but I
propose to reserve the right of receiving the drawback
to the person who has paid the duty, so that the Tian.
tity exported may be en itten off the quantity imported;
the drawback will thus be paid to tne importer when
he beams, an exporter—or, in some cases, to his nomi-
nee. I only margin the Honourable Gentlemao—wboae
dissent I anticipate to this proposition from the meaner
in which he receives it—to consider the
.particular .cir-
cumstances under which the proposition is made, and
to allow it at least a. fair consideratioo. The amount of
the drawback will be the amount of the duty on the
foreign silk consumed in the manufacture of the article.
It is obvious that if, with the aid of foreign thrown silk
free from duty, we can raise up an export trade, which
we could not do with English thrown silk alone, foreign
material will be brought into the country in the nice*.
sary quantity. Oa the other band, if English throwsters
continue to improve until they can throw cheap enough
for exportation—exportation will increase, and the
amount of drawbacks paid will increase also. I was quite
aware that I must not be surprised if. when I made
this proposition, it should startle some Honourable
Gentlemen who take a different view of the question
—bat they must bear in mind the peculiar circum-
stances of the.country. This is a manufacture which, in
the home market, you are obliged to protect; and if
you would have an cleat trade at all, you cannot hope
to obtain it in any other way than by concurring with
this proposition. The arguments I have stated will, I
think, take it oat of the class of those propositions
which some Hors. Members characterise as the visions
of Political Economists. I come now to a not 104 its-
portant branch of the subject, which embraces most of
' the considerations urged by the Honourable Mover. I
consider it more importing thin any thing el e I have
offered. I allude to that which regulates the competi-
tion in the home matket between the foreign and do-
iiestic manufacturer. To that regulation of the duty I
diode's I look`at the best, as the only means of putting
down contraband trade in this country. We are told by
the fietiouraide Member for Coventry and others, that
the danger to the English manufacturer and to.the
1 interests of all parties. concerned arises out of the great
quantity of ameggled goods imported. The Hos.oor able
Moira refused to the pmout of legal importatitels, as
they appear from the Custom-house returns, and he
truly sepiesents that have increased this year to six
hundred thousand pound:. He toldns likewise that he
thousbt the' amount of smuggled silk three times as
great; so.that the whole quantity imported, legally and
illegally, was abOut two millions. I was prepared to
contend that the common opinion as to the amount of
smuggled silks *as far beyond the reality 1 knit the
*tenement of the Honourable Member on this point is so
extravagant, that what appeared to me before eiegger•
atlas now actually assumes the appearance of truth.
Mr. FYLEIt—The Risk Hasoreable Goodman le mistakes s
I said that the smuggled goods were to twice she meat et die
geode legally imported. .
Mr.VESEY FlTZGERALD—Notwithstanding the
observation of the Hon. Member, he was prepared to
say, and to prove if it weie necessary, that great tsar
geration prevailed on this subject. He bad paid retry
attention to all that was said and written on the matter;
be carefully weighed every suggestion which had been
thrown out for the prevention of smuggling ; and be was
satisfied that as to stamping (weirs goods, it toeld be
no security whatever to the English manufacturer; for
example, the stamp might be forged,aod although, the
Commission of such an offence in England mightesubject
the guilty party to a considerable degree of 'mistimes%
it did not happen to be the same in foreign collective.
The stamp might be affixed at Calais,Harrre, or Eheppes
and how were the guilty parties to be come at ?, .It
was very well known that the manufacture of silk. was
greatly dependent upon caprice and fashion i and that
being the case;the stamp would give au opportuoity of
pre-emption to the foreign article. Who, then, would
be the first to complain of it? why, no doubt, the trade
itself. Such was the case iethe lace manufacture of
Buckinghamshire; and there the manufacturers applied
for the repeal of the stamp duty, because they mild not
sell their produce for French, The extent of prolec-
don was certainly to be tonsured by the difference is
the price of labour in different countries, besides taking
into calculation all .other reasonable disadrfoilagas at"
tending any given article. At one time the protection
to this trade in Epgland wis l$ per cent..-at anethafs
pp the proposition of his Right Honourable Frieod (Mrs
Residues) it was raised to $0 per cent. ed wilierelle.
but the trade suggested that 0 rated ditty should APO
be taken Into coundet ation. and without *IAA tbe.dity
would reach nearer 42 than $0 per cant.. This al"
forded, however, no fair play, and &rote naturally /IN
suited an increase in the contraband trade, which . by a
fair scale of protecting duty it wakthegmeral object to
pat down. He r , to return. ib..agh am alto-
glherp to the, pr ' le, laid :loarn, by his Right Hon. Opsed
&send (Mr. Ho* 'soon). 'lt was said that the real es.
pease of smuggling was from ten to fifteen pet
gem i boy from the best information be was enabled