Star.
London, England, 1816-02-28 00:00:00

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People free only in name. The Hon: Gentleman
then adverted to the force kept up by the • Allies in
France; which, he said, had no other effect than to
render the' Government of the Bourbtans unpopular
in France. If, however, we had imprudently hound
ourselves to support thirty thousand men in France.
why not hale foreign soldiers there, and recall our
own troops. and disband I.em ? This would not only
be e more constituti;aval measure, but a nit*, econo.
Mical, one. also. The lion. Gentleman then pro-
ceeded to take a revieWinf the proposed establishment,
which, he contended, was far beyond What was ne-
cessary ; and, if agreed to, would be laying the (min-
. datiesi,for overthrowing our Constitution, and esta-
blishing a Miltary Despotism on its rains.
Mr. YORKE, in explanation, denied that he had
"It"• 1 on the necessity of an increased peace estab-
hdiment in consequence of an increased population.
He had merely asserted, 'that the constitittional.dan-
ger of a standing army was considerably lessened.
when counterbalanced by a numerous and martial
people.
Mr. ROBINSON said, the preSeist question was
not whether we should have an establishment of not,
but how far, in a constitutional view, we might go?
—An H .nourable Gentlemen had allOseed that
some establishment was necessary, he was -therefore
astonished that Honourable Gentleman should have
declared be would hear no min on the subject. Per-
haps, however, the Honourable Gentleman and his
friends were right, for if they did so to a close exa-
mination, he ( Mr. ItobMstin) was convinced that
the Honourable Gentleman and-his friends would be
repted. both horse and foot. Mr. Robinson. said.. Gen-
tlemtm *ere very partial to drawing comparison's be-
tween the present estimates and those of 1791. without
considering that the establishments .of that year were
the establishments of a, year after seven years of peace.
And further, Gentlemen always wished to take the
present proposed establishment as a permanent peace
rshrolibli Trent, which it by no means was. The Right
Honourable Gentleman then went into
,a review of
the proposed establishment, which he said was, in
his opinion, called for by change of circumstances;
but before Gentlemen could judge of the
.necessity,
they must hear and compote existing circumstances
with those long past. He was also convinced, that
when the subject should have been faitly discussed,
the people of England, who when left to themselves,
always thought right, would also determine in favour
of the proposed cstabljAhrlent. With respect to the
endangering the Consiittition„ or the freedom of the
• country, he had as high A value for these as any man
could have. He believed it was owing to our being
an free that we wer.: so great a eerple, and that it
was only by our continuing Ireeahat we could conti-
nue great. He did not consider that our freedom
would be at all elidan.,ertd by agteeing to the Esti-
mates now before the 'House ; and feeling that they
were necessary tor the h.inour and interests of the
;country. lie should givettieurhis conscientio.us support.
Mr. FREENIANTLR conceived an establishment
of 13 )0 U men -,:miacitly. injurious t 9 the lilortieetsi
this c, untry. Iltit independent of that consideration,
the Huns should previously inquire what the expenses
of such an establishment may be. He would there-
foie remind the House, that, in 1786, Mr: hit re.
ct mtnended the appointment of a Select Committee
to inquire mol the revenues and resources of the kin -
d gym, (NI which he proposed the necessary and suitablel
• establishment. He contended that, notwithstanding
the repre,ent..tions of Ministers, the proposed est&
blishment must be permanent, for the Noble .Lord
opposite had stated, that in consequence of the in-
creased military spirit of the Continental Powers, it
would be necessary to keep up a proportionate
strength in this country. But he would ask, what
power in Europe had become of late more than usually
military ? It was not Rupsia, nor Prussia, whose late-
rests were ever supportea by her military strength
—Fr 'nee was less military than usual, and Austria
seemed hardly to have changed her policy. What
then was there in the state of Europe to,justify the
increased military evablishments of this country ?
He obo reed, that our taxation in time of peace would
amount ,o seventy millions; and it would astonish the
House to learn the immense sacrifices already made
in direct taxation since the commencement of the re.
volutionary war. Since the year 1795 to 1815, the
amount of direct taxation was One Thousand and
Thittyahree Millions! and that, united with what
had been raised by Exchequer Bills and other indi-
rect means, amounted to Seventeen Hundred and
Fifty .M.llions! I The expenses of the War Offices
were enormous, and should .he abolished. The coun-
try lost more in that way than was received by the
Bank for managing the national debt.
Lord BINNING thought the arguments of. the
Honourable Gentleman called strongly on the House
to gn into the Cotrimittee, in which it might be sheWn
whether the economical arrangements he had recorn:
mended were practicable or not. Instead of this being
u acherne to throw Om us the trammels of a military
despotism, lie coutended that, in a Committee it
would be she wn, that-the establishment proposed was
necessary for the maintenance of our liberties. It was
not on account of our increased population that in
increase of our military force at home was necessary
but nn account of the increase of our dock-yards and
arsenals ; and if in 1791 our military force was
17,000 men, surel y ::.;•.,000 men were necessary now.
To put Jown our force in France would amount to
a confession of weakness to foreign nations, for the
debates of that House reached all the nations on the
Continent ; and it would be most impolitic to sheet
So much weakness to them.
Sir ROBERT HERON agreed with the Right;
Hoo. Gent:ern:m.(Mr. Itobinsot.) who had supported
his views with no inconsiderable ability, that this was
only a question ,!ei2,ree. For no one would con-
tend that we should have no standing ariny what-
ever ; but there was a considerable difference be-
tween the amount of force which the circlunstances
of the country appeared to require, and that now pm-
/insect. But white he agreed with the RIM Hon.
Gentleman, he was •quite at issue with the Noble
Lord who spoke last, and who professed to think Mat
;le proposed military establishment was in ho dearse.
calculated to entlatiger the Ceiotitution indliberties
of the people e•tiir it was fern a strogg impression of
that Oat ger that lie felt it. his duty to oppose the
priecipie aid devilopement of the measure which Mi-
nisters announced Altar hilentit3l 30
.press upon the
use. He could not see the propriety; of ititeilag
taco the details tot such a treasure, convinced, as be

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