Star.
London, England, 1810-02-23 00:00:00

: That wheri'Donartre ptossedect VD at.
Span.
cics Austr a there were two lines of policy marked
t for our Ministers, 'neither of 'which, though ob•
Is did they think proper to fellow.
have They ought
promPtly aided .A.ustria,Or availed thenntalves
,f the Austrian war to expel the French force from
; they
• pa,n- But attempted .nothing that 'wisdom
W sanction or the counts-pig/wove. Every thing
indeed which they did attempt was marked by imps-
(lace and, mismanagement ;: their whole career be-
mod, as the universal opi_ IStsin of the public pro-
-024 a fetal want of judgment, foresight, and
an
„woo. r ; and, as the climax of error, they now seem-
tesolved to defend Portugal, according to a phtn
of defence, too, which was perfectly impracticable.
was utterly
F
ridiculous to suppose, that the
la° 1.
erasof the Count La Lippe, as to the practicability
of defending Portugal from invasion, could now be
tee upon. In fact, nothing could be gained from
Me attempt, and the danger was certain. We should
•be allowed to retain Portugal, under our present sys-
tem, just so long as Bonaparte thought proper. Yet
the patrons of that system, the present Ministers, still
called for confidence ; and amidst all toe calamities
2CCU •
ululated under their auspices, they had still the
hardihood to speak of gaining for the -country. « But
!would ask," said' the Noble Lord, " What have
they gained i" The Noble Secretary of State boasts,
si at our country has obtained a higher character than
a ewer possessed before in Europe : which, by the
way, ',deny. But I would ask him, Has he gained
bis object ? Has he reduced the power of the enemy ?
If I were to ask a chess-player whether he had won his
game, and he were to answer me that he had got a'
Took, or he had got a bishop, what should I think of
his answer ? Precisely as I do of that of Ministers to
this House; who, when asked whether they have won
their game with the enemy, reply, that they have
d honour, laurels and fame ; that still they are
*5,,,._-they have lost their game—for the last
two years they have gained nothing. Their admi-
nistration has, in fact, been marked by, the defalca-
tisn of every foreign hope, and the reduction of every
domestic resource—they who vaunted of their reso-
lution to protect and liberate the Continent, have only
succeeded in bringing danger close to our own shores
—and why ? because they sacrificed their duty, and
the interests of their country to their personal ambition
and personal cupidity. While they covered the coun-
try with their tax-gatherers and supervisors, who
erre almost as great nuisances as the plagues of
Egspt, they aggravated the insults and injuries they
inflicted upon the people, by most wantonly squall-
derino the produce of their exactions. Yet, these were
the Midsters who called fur confidence ; while he
was certain that he was speaking the language of
ninety-nine out of a hundred of the whole popula-
tion of the country, when he asserted, that such Mi-
nisters deserved reprobation and punishment.
Lord SIDMOUTH was of opinion that Govern-
ment had neglected to avail thernielves of the favour-
able opportunity for striking a decisive blow. He
should feel much reluctance at withdrawing our suc-
cours from Portugal, if without too great a risk and
bavock we could assist her with any prospect of suc-
cess. Her long attachment to this country, the sin.
verity of which, had been so forcibly evinced at dif-
ferent periods, which he instanced most particularly
in 1762, that we ought to feel it incumbent upon us
to afford her eves y assistance in our power. He
wrisunwilling to accede .to the amendment, as he
thought it would he an unjustifiable action to with-
draw our uoops before such a measure became abso-
lutely necessary. He, however, thought they ought to
be well informed as to the co-operation they were to
expect on the part of the Portuguese. Government'
,:could be careful not to add to the weight of the bur-
den already borne by the people ; and to lighten the
present as soon as possible. He would withhold his
consent to the Address • and he thought his conduct
both parliamentary and constitutional, when he de-
clared, that, giving it his assent, he threw the whole
of the responsibility •on his Majesty's Ministers.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE expressed his
surprise at the allusion of his Noble Friend to the po-
licy pursued in 17G2, when the circumstances of the
country and of Europe were so materially different,
if not directly the reverse of what they were at the
?resent day, when we had a vigorous Administration
a home, and an important intiuence abroad. It was,
Sae felt, somewhat singular, that upon the very same
'itemises that were stated by his Noble Friend, he
should come to quite an opposite conclusion. For he
could not reconcile it to his mind to repose any confi-
dence in Ministers, who, according to his Noble
Friend's confession, were not entitled to it (Hear,
hear)--he could not trust to the judgment or respon-
sibility of men whose misconduct had involved 'the
country in a series of disasters and disgrace-but it
seemed that they had some intention of taking a new
course--so it appeared were the Portuguese, for they
were beginning to form an army. He had heard of
an old l'hilosopber, who observed; that it was the
characteristic of a foolish man to be always beginning,
and he could not help applying the observation to the
leoitinings of Ministers and the Portuguese army :
for himself he had no hesitation in stating, that Por-
tugal ought not to be retained, that nothing but dan-
ger and loss was to be calculated upon from the at-
tempt, and that any delay to abandon it could only
test upon the same irresolute, culpable policy, whith
produced so much mischief in the retention of Welch*.
Ten, after the impossibility- of holding it, without more'
sacrifices than it was worth, became quite glaring.
Lord HA RROWBY deprecated the idea of tying
the hands of Ministers, while they were permitted to
hold the functions of Government. If they were un-
worthy to be trusted, let an address for their dismissal
from office be at once brought forward ; but while
they retained office, let it not be attempted to injure
the country and them by depriving them of the means
cf discharging their public duty. If it were deter-
ranted to abandon the Peninsula, it'ought to be done
at once, and the Portuguese left to make the best
terms they could with the enemy. But if the Portu-
guese were to he protected, the vote proposed by the
Address was indispensible to that protection. No
doubt should be allowed to exist on such a subject. The
Noble Lord then proceeded to animadvert upon the
administration of those who were so anxious to dis-
Place the present Ministers, and concluded svith ob-
serving; that if these persons were to succeed in their
Object, the country could not, from their former cone
duct, be very sanguine in its hope of their capacity
to manage expeditions, tr to. promote our foreign in-
Lutace.

places ;
they acted in those-places ? Their conduct, particu-
larly in retaining Walcheren, after the main objectQf
the expedition was found unattainable, was most cri-
minal. It was, Twill say, as a lawyer, a murderous
act. Awl yet they challenge, it seems, a motion for
their dismissal. Such a'motion is, indeed, suspended
over their heads, and GOD knows it is of little conse-
quence whether they, are on or off. (4 laugh.) But
as to the retention of Portugal, it is stated, that a. na-
tive army is collecting in that country, and our money
is to be sent there for its support. What fatality !
There really seems to be a sort of predestination
which I will leave to the Reverend Bench to explain,
that whenever the French take any country or any
prisoners, they shall have some of our *money also.
I can hardly account for the infatuation which pos-
sesses those men' who suppose they can defend Portu-
gal, by sending a supply of British money there. It
might as well, in fact, be expected to accomplish
that by sending over the Woolsack with my Noble
Friend upon it. (4 laugh.) The Noble Lord con-
cluded with stating his intention to vote for the
Amendment.
The Earl of BUCKINGHAMSHIRE vindicate 4
the opinion arid consistency of his Noble Friend (141
Sidmouth).
Lord HOLLAND animadverted upon the con.'
duct of Ministers with regard to Spain and Portugal,
and expressed his regret that a' more enlarged and li-
beral system of policy had not been acted upon. If
the privileges of freedom had been communicated4O
the Spaniards, he was persuaded that the strugg
of that people would have led to a very different re-
sult from that which now seemed too probable. When,
he mentioned freedom he wished to be distinctly
derstood as meaning that description of freedom for
which he always had been, and always should continue,
to be, a warm advocate. His opinion uniformly was,
that freedom could not be too democratic, because the
basis of the Government could not be too broad for its
own security and strength, and for thehappiness and
defence of the country. Had the Government of Spain
rested upon this principle, he firmly believed that the
Spanish nation would have triumphed over the attacks
of Bonaparte.
Lord DARNLEY 'supported the Amendment.
The Ministers had almost destroyed three armies in
the course of twelve months, and had within that
period and to little or do purpose, expended more
the military and pecuniary resources of the country,
than any of their predecessors had done in the course
of ten years. Under these circumstances, their Lord-
ships could not give them their confidence in the fur-
ther prosecution of this line of policy without inquiry.
A division then tookplace.

For the Original Proposition. ,
Present .59
Proxies 65

For the Amendment.
Present 42
' Proxies 32

1.M......,0

124
Majority 30.--Adjourned.

i••••••

LIST OW THE MINORITY.' • -
PRESENT.
Ilcbester
Cowper
Grosvenor
Bredalbane
Headfort,
Bristol
Bulkeley
Dundas
Cessna
Holland
Lauderdale
Grenville
St. John
Besborough

Gloucester
Norfolk
Somerset
Stafford
Lansdowne
Grey
Spencer
Roselyn
Luean

Derby
Donougbmore
Thanet
Albemarle
Hardwicke •
Essex

TankervUle
Duncan

PROXIES.
Arson
Carnarvon
Montfort
Cholmondeley
Hereford
Grey de Ruthyn
Glastonbury
Shaftesbury

Ashburton
Devonshire
St. Alban's
Grafton
lute

Darlington
Stawel

Buckinghain
King

Searborongh
Glildford
Berkeley
Bolingbroke

Fortescue
Carlisle

Charlemons
Townshend
Braybroke
Mendip
Crewe

Eglington
St. Vincent
Cork and Orrery
Somers

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

.. _
the Pettrevenie di*. evening, re-
*as ' Initiation of trade,
1y one way or other,
the Gentlemen at
probably imagined
, as long as it was at-
place (Hear, hear).
House, that the Dis-
foriy days after the
, thirty days had al-
'hour or day of delay
the country. The
Modon, be was per.
J turn out the:FreSeilt
succeeded to their places
surely not be to than
sich extreme **atty. He was therefore
st 'the Speaker's leaving the Chair, that the
House might proceed to discuss the subject relating
to the Distilleries.
Mr. WHITBREAD observed, that the Right Ho-
nourable Gentleman intended to pay him and his
friend's an ironical compliment, by stating that they
had in view the dismissal of the present Ministers,
which they considered would be for the good of the
country. Their object was 'not only the removal of
Ministers, but also their punishment. The Honour-
able Gentleman had asked, if it was important whe-
ther that object should be accomplished on Monday
or Tuesday ? He would say in reply, that it was very
important indeed, because, at this moment, Ministers
associated with Earl Chatham, the Master-General of
the Ordnance, and Lord Multrave, the first Lord of
the Admiralty. After what appeared before the Corn- th
mittee of Inquiry, and who were now concerting pro- sup,
jects for-sending out troops to Cadiz, and taking into to u
the -pay of his Majesty' 30,600 Portuguese troops, convet
could the Honourable Member deny the fact? Mr. cditsared_,...i'
Whitbread observed, that he and his friends had ~,,,,17,:y'L
been accused of wishing to obstruct the public busi- those oils°,
sens, by postponing the Distillery Bill. This was a Sir JOHN .
misrepresentation, and no such -thing. If the House. Lord in a :peer-
-1 proceedeF.l in the inquiry in the Scheldt Expedi-
if o ‘t it
vre:f feradnd
lion now, it was agreed tha the Committee should venue of that count,
break up at eight o'clock, w n the matter apper- Mr. DUNDAS fol,
taining to the Distilleries might commence, and he termination to spew tk
appealed to the Hotise if that was not an hour who acted from a sense ,
when business of importance was often,
,if not Mr. BOYLE maintain'
usually brought forward. The Ministers seemed hlbition to Ireland.
to wish to go on from day to day with the Corn-Mr. Mr. atATTAN conteno
flict an immediate injury on it
mittee without making any progress by studied de- Eugland and Scotian d
, by des
signs, arts, devices, and mechanical process. The England and Scotland now dens
House must recollect what occurred on the pre- so large a portion of their subsiste,
ceding evening. It had come to a vote to prdceed , Sir W. W. WYNNE objected to
on the Inquiry this day at four o'clock, and to conti- I" t°t••
nue in a Committee antil eight, he therefore wished he to Glreneland. eral TiAßli.nEtTe ONtsvnof'sthwedergtheempik
the House to preserve its honour and consistency, and to be sacrificed to the interests of four mit
not rescind a resolution which it came to on the for- Mr. WINDHAM supported the proposit.
crier night. It would be also recollected that one of ' Mr. LESLIE FOSTER argued agaiast ti
the Honourable Members on the Treasury Bench at - elm to Ireland. By adopting such a p
a quarter before ten o'clock, observed that Gentlemen 4 indeed secure a mouthful at the s
had not the physical strength to proceed farther, and et the risk of future scarcity. .
'
objected to the calling in of Sir Lyre Coote. How- .very respect, and ought to
-sued. Should the Irish V
ever, being run to a division, the Secretary of State -owe be Impossible to
for the Home Department got up and made a speech -e necessarily pecan
of considerable knoll, he would not say with a view
to speak against titne. If he were to follow the ex- of the
ample, he would oppose the Distillery Bill in every
stage, and prevent it from being passed ; but he de-
clared, on his own part, that though it' was now a
quarter past four o'clock, if the House would resolve
itself into the Committee of Inquiry on the Scheldt
Expedition, he would move that it be closed at eight,
for the purpose of the House then proceeding to the
business of the Distilleries.
Mr.'STEVEN said, it was now obvious that the
object of Gentlemen at the opposite side of the House
was to turn out Ministers, and put themselves in their
places, for which they seemed to languish as much as
a lover for his mistress ; but haw far the country
would benefit by the measure, he would not say.—
The public business he would, however, assert was of
much greater importance to the country, and he hoped
it would not be postponed to qualify their natural
impatietice to get into place.
Lord GRANVILLE LEVESON GOWER con-
sidered the proposition of Lord Porchester very fair,
after the vote of the preceding night.
Lord PORCHESTER was anxious that the Com-
mittee should sit till eight o'clock, that it might re-
ceive the evidence of Earl Chatham, who was then i
in waiting and indisposed. His Lordship was willing
to be examined until that hour, and he lett to Gen-
tlemen to decide at which side of the House the im-
patience lay.
Mr. MANNERS SUTTON opposed the motion.
It could not, he said, be attended with any public
inconvenience the postponing the inquiry for a few .
hours, while the business before, the House was of the ..-...?—.--
most pressing importance to the country. ' TO THE EDITOR OF THE STAR.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
rose, amidst cries of Question ! question ! and said, SlR—Through the medium of your paper, I beg
be could not help making some observation on what leave to state the situation of a certain class of Officer's
had fallen from his Noble Friend (Lord Gower)
in his Majesty's service, the circumstances of which,
on the present question. He regretted that his
on a caudid representation, I am induced to hope,
i
Government will take into consideration ; I allude to
Noble Friend had not been present in the House
the Quarter-Masters of the Army. All Officers (ex-
at the commencement of the debate, to have heard
t either promoted or receive advan-
the threat held out by an Honourable Gentleman
cepting them) area
pay after serving a certain number of years. An
opposite. The question before the House was
not now one of mere precedence, as to subjects Ensign may look forward to a Company in the course
of eight or ten years. Surgeons in like manner re-
of discussion, but whether the House were to be
threatened and intimidated by the menace of har-
ceive advanced pay according to the length of their
rassing divisions--(Hear, Hear.)—and by decla-
services. Adjutants are atonce appointed with Bs.6d.
er
rations, that if they did not now go into the Corn-
each p day, besides rank for promotion. Lieute-
mittee, all other business will be retarded, and no-
nants of seven years standing receive an additional
thing will be done. This was the threat of the Ho-
shilling per day. And in this manner all Officers in
nourable Gentleman, and if the House yielded to it, the Line (excepting Quarter-Masters) have channels
through which, either by length of their services or
they would show that they surrendered the right of
managing their_own deliberations, and submit hence-
otherwise, they can obtain promotion, and many other
forward to the dictation of the Honourable Gentle-
considerable advantages. In short Quarter-Masters
are the only Officers without any prospect of fume
man as to what course they were in every instance to
advancement in the Army, or reaping any benefits
follow.—(Thar, hear.)-1f the House did not mean
from their long services. lam induced to think that
to abandon their rights, he trusted their vote would
chew the Honourable Gentleman that they were net-
Quarter-Masters being thus situated has been an over-
cher to be threatened nor controuled in their proceed-
sight, as they were lately allowed to hold a second
ings.—(Hear, hear.) commission, and were promoted as vacancies occur-
Mr. TIERNEY-spoke in favour of the motion. red. A Quarter-Master, under the present circuits-
Mr. LONG said, the question for the Committee stances, may pass 30 or 40 years in the Army, and
of Inquiry sitting this day, at four o'clock, was nega- when rendered incapable of serving, is under the ne-
tivedcmity of retiring oil half-pay, which does not exceed
in the Committee last night, by a majority of
one. But when the House was resumed, without tle pension now granted to Serjeants, after serving 21
offering any argument, the motion was made again, years. It is therefore hoped that Government will
when it was only carried by a majority of two. be induced to adopt such steps as may lead to improve
The question being loudly called for, the House Quariarausiire situs4ol,_kroin
divided, For the Chairman leaving the Chair, 19111-e- '-- I iloti'. •10' •
.., I .ft I , •4a. il.l-ft wit •,+ • * • 4'o 00 . . -
4tEainst it 180—Majority ille: . , • Ai oda StiLlOnli -
I I ... •
• • • ft
• •
• I ' • I. .
• a ft,
.s - •

Luray sat,.
On the mode of Rrli isor. the Hotta weer into a Csonssit-
tee oh thaDistillery Bill, the Act for prohibiting • its linputtatioio
of Spirits front Deland, and an Instruction to exrenti the lib'
Ireland, being also referred to the aame Conuniiiee.
Mr. ROSE then stated that the circumstaneNt of England
Ireland were widely different. In Ireland theme's' a„superulhAi -
iititrpty of grain; in England and Scotland it we, quite ii.e
itiras nest, thereat his intention to (move thax i+.e
Bill 40 extend to Irelan3; bet, in lieu thereof, to mars throw
onneboasce of the Act prohibiting the importation of spaitstrons
Sir J. NRWPORroggtosed this measure es repugnant sel tha
act of Union. It was hatratg fair to allow the Imperial Parlie-
ment, by a forced interpretation of the spirit against the letter of
the act, to explain away the work of two independent Perliaments
Lord A. HAMILTON contended, that it had been agreed -try
Mr. Rose himself, that his .aziotios for extending the Bill to Ire-
land should take the precedence.
After soma conversation, Mr. Rose acceded; and withrew his
motion.
Lord A. HAMILTON then moved, that the Bill do extend to
Ireland. If there was such 2 superabundance of grain in Ireland,
his Lordship asked, bow- it hippened that special 'latices wen:
granted to import grain into this country from Enact ?
Hon. C. H. HUTCHINSON opposed the resolution, as ktju-
rious to the agricultural interests of Ireland. -
Mr. FITZGERALD argued on the same side. There bed
been a deterieraiion of revenue to the amount of one million ice
consequence of the suspension.
Sir C. BURRELL was against sacrificing the general interests
of the country to the particular interest of any part.
Sir ROBERT PEELE could not perceive the justice of the
complaints of the Members for Ireland. That particular country
bad no right to a peculiar advantage, at the expense of Einglend
and Scotland. He maintained that the House ought to considet.
the situation of the manufacturing classes of the community, es-
pecfally that of those in the North of England,who were but just
recovering from the severe pressure they felt is -coast:gots= of
the late high price of provisions. They were in a greet osionsre
supplied from Ireland; and unless the prohibition was intioaded
to that country, they would be reduced to the most perihelia in-
convenience. If the proposition was adopted, the supplieipro-
cored from France might be got (ruin Ireland, and the Welt-In-
dia planters would have the benefit of the restriction all over the
number, and it was much better to promote their interests than
those of Bonaparte.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT opposed the resolution of the Noble
Lord in a speech of great ability and animation. He stated, that
if it were agreed to, the effect would ultimately be to couvnt the
tillage of Ireland into pasturage, and wholly to destroy the re-
venue of that country.
• Mr. DUNDAS followed on the same side ; expressing his de-
termination to shew that there was at least one County Member
who acted from a sense of general, and not of particular interest.
Mr. BOYLE maintained the expediency of extending the pro-
hibition to Ireland.
Mr. oftATTAN contended on the contrary, that it would in•
ilia an immediate injury on Ireland, and a permanent injury on
Eugland and Scotland, by destroying the sources from whieb
England and Scotland now derived, and might hereafter derive,
so large a portion of their subsistence.
Sir W. W. WYNNE objected to the prohibition of distillation
ii, tots.
General TARI.ETON wished the prohibition to be Wended .
to Ireland. The interests of twelve millions of people ought nut
to be sacrificed to the interests of four millious.
Mr. WINDHAM supported the proposition.
• Mr. LESLIE FOSTER argued against the extension of the
prohibition to Ireland. By adopting such a proposition, Great
Britain might indeed secure a mouthful at the present moment,
but it would be at the risk of future scarcity. The energies of
Ireland were great in every respect, and ought to be stimulated
and called forth; not repressed. Should the Irish be prohibited
from distilling from grain, it would be impossible to supply the
deficiency which such a measure must necessarily occasion in the
revenue.
Sir THOMAS TURTON was for the extension of the prohi-
bitten.
Mr. WESTERN could not concur in inflicting such a penalty
on Ireland as that proposed by the Noble Lord.
Mr. FULLER, in a short speech, which kept the House in a
roar of laughter, contended (as we understood the Hon. Gentle.
man) for the extension of the prohibition to Ireland.
Sir JOHN HALL also supported the necessity of extending
the prohibition to Ireland.
The Committee then divided.
For Lord A. Hamilton's Resolution GS
Against it - - - - - - - 110
Majority against extendhib the prohibition to Ireland —44
Mr. ROSE then moved a resolution " that it was the opinion
of the Committee, that the Act of the 411th of his present Ma.
jest), (the Act for prohibiting the Intercourse of Spirits between
Great Britain and Ireland) be further continued."
After a short discussionAin which Mr. PARNELL, Sir J. Naw-
PORT, Mr. FOSTER., Mr. HUTCRINSON,Ind Mr. W. SMITU, par-
ticipated, the Resolution was agreed is without a division.
The House having been resumed, the report was received, the
eesolutions agreed to, and it was ordered " that it be an instruc-
tion to the Committee on the Distillation Prohibition Bill, that
they should make provisions in conformity to the said resolutions:.
On the Motion of Mr. ROSE, the House resolved itself into a
Committee on the Distillation Prohibition Bill, in which clauses
correspondent to the resolutions just agreed to were inserted into
the Bill.—The House having been resumed, the report was order-
ed ' be received to morrow.

, ,


1...

. to .
On the Motion of Lord PORCHESTER, the House resolved
itself into a Committee of Inquiry into the policy and conduct of
the Expedition to the Scheldt.
Strangers were immediately excluded.

I

QUARTER-MASTERS.

Lord ERSICINEtiiged-their Lordships to refi Wished to hate thelifeten
that not merely the eondect of Ministers, .but that 110114 the'Distiadries,"stres, a n
their LordsWpi &hits— elvea;-wait upon .triel on this oc till W not deterteitied iftitieditetd,
casion ; and the probable result of that trial,. be Aided prOduce confisiens; Which.
an enlightened connu7,. was entitled to the most dee opposite side of the 'House
rious consideration. Ministers,' it appeared, pursu was promoting, the public , a
the old course upon this 'O4CeSiOn. Instead of vindi tended with their -getting to p 1:
'eating themselves 'they endeavoured 'to` crimina It was necessary to inforia the H
their predecessors. But if their predeCetiors wefe dllery. Act now in force expired f
-really criminal, why do not these Ministers who were; commencement of the Sessibn ;
in possession of every information and docnment re-, ready elapsed, and a single 'hot]
ferring to their official conduct, do their duty, and 'might be highly detrimental to
Make that criminality Me subject of prosecution ?—.l Gentlemen who supported the in
This, however, (said the Noble Lord) was not their; fectly aware, were anxious to to
object. They did not want to vindicate the cause tr *Ministers; but whether they succe
the public, but to get into our places; and how have. ,on Monday or Tuesday, could an
they acted in those places ? Their conduct, ualtica, a Matter of such extreme anxiety.