The Sun.
London, England, 1850-05-15 00:00:00

tained 443. The Hon. Gentleman had alluded to the
mode of taking the averages.' It was, however, more
!lupe tent to eori.idr,r the great question under discussio.o
its
aitlsaegteinner;al Lear ings than to consider it in its sal
arid therefore he should confine himself t°
th,,t form of discussing it. He was ready to edro.it
with the lion. Gentleman opposite that there svas not in
the el, • antry at this moment that universal prosperitY
which every Hon. Member on either side of the House
r ould wish ; but then thi re was this vvonderfu
andl dis-
tineti,,n between the suffering undergone now tbat e
underwent in former times—that whereas formerly th
fo the
cuff ring was all confined to the working Portf°n
population, the poor, at present it was felt solely by
the higher and middle classes.—(Loud cries ef "N°,
no," and "Hear, hear.") An Hon. Gentleman
after
the
other side of the H said that the question, after
all, would have to beouse settled on the ground of the inte-
rests of the working classes ; on that ground he (31br'
Wilson) was willing to meet it, and to OOP':
test of the condition of that class to its settlemeet.
January last, long before the Hon. Member for Bert'
shire had made his motion on tbe subject, the Govera-
inept had laid upon the table of the House certain returnF!
showing the state of pauperism in the whole country !of
the first week of the present year, in cemparison wita
the similar period in the three preceding
wever, that
Noble Lord in the other House • suspecting, how eve the
tbese re' ,erne were of a naaire too favourable t
Government,
moved for returns for the middle of the
number °._
past quarter. These returns showed the
paupers receiving out-door relief and in-door relief
England and Wales in the middle of February, anclhiehig
was the result. In the corresponding week 0f t—se
Y

years there %sere:— Total'
Oat-door Paupers. In-door Paupers.
08,000
1847 a. 729,000 ~. 179,000 a• .993,000
1848 ... 824,000 ... 169,000 ..• 0'43,000
1849 ... 784,000 159,000 ..• e",,,000
1850 ... 748,000 ... 142,000 ••• ye" wag
So that in the vaunted year of 1848, when w"ebet
er of
100 s. per quarter, there were a far greater num_ssiou
paupers than in the present year of alleged deer bad
bee
and distress, and the total pauperism of the eountrY
could
been reduced from 993,000 to 890,000. No (sue,. ibis
deny, therefore, that whoever were suffering al . the
moment from the change that had taken Plaeeeresses
commercial policy of this country, the poorer ,
an
were not those persons, They had been told by
HoutiuraWe Member (Mr. G. Berkeley) that the °dieted
wee: di-appointed of that immediate prosperitY Pre reale
by the Free-traders.—(Hear.) Could Ilehee,?eh at
Members overlook one of the great causes w`
e, the
this moment affected the middle classes? Could they the
discover one °lcoac
great cause in the years 1845-6 f.e
existing mischief. He had been told that in settle could
ties, anti among the rest Lincolnshire, that you
not name a person who had not suffered from r",
onlr
speculations.—(Oh, oh; no, no.) Mind he did nn'tea jo
charge the agricultural classes with having sPecula,er, in
railways ; he was aware that Liverpool, Manchestb, or
short all the great towns in the north were as rauu than
more, engaged in the same kind of speculatioonbitubis
were teo,e in agricultural counties ; but though the
the
might be so, it was impossible to blind themselves
hffer,
f ict that this was one of the great causes of that 914 00
ing which had been wholly charged to free trade. pc.
had been furnished by the Secretary of the St°°k were
change with this statement :—ln 1848 there „ere
147,000 men employed on railroads. At present -seas
were only 45,000 men—so they had 100,000 Inehanee
employed now than before, owing to the discontinnwer,
of the construction of railway os. In 1846 there, ett ,
nine main lines, which had expended 51,000,0; s e
which had an income of 2,700,0001. In 1850 the we!
lines had expended 102,000,000/., and their incon3e
°ray .
2,200,0001, b 'ing 500 0001. less than when they ht!ed that
,xpended 51,000,0001. Therefore it might be sal"joed
51.000,0001. had been recently expended which retn'eota
absolutely unproductive. This alone ought to he sot
cliaive reason for a great portion of that suffering °jos.
which the country was now labouring. The d ito"
Gentleman (Mr. Sanders) alluded to the diminishe
ear•
portation of ,rain in this compared with 104 Iwo
Nothing could more strikingly show the benefits 000
trade. The Hon. Member told the House the b Ae
harvest was defective in 1838, and in consequencegige
had an importation of 5,500.000 quarters of fs)rthsa
corn. Why, what other object had free trade just
this ? Then the Hon. Gentleman said the harve3t.
year had been larger, and the importations had trado
quently fallen off. This was the very object fre ifiree
sought to accomplish—to equalise the seasons. ,;eiv.
trade did that it attained the object it had in `" of
They had been asked what evidence existed
ors
increased consumption during the last three lea, ,
al tHe found during the last six months that o
1,000,000 more quarters had been imports
611111-d n'tity
in the corresponding period last year, the bad
of home-grown wheat taken into consumption., that
increased. The calculations in his posamion shove" bad
during the last six months 1,269,000 quarters maleor
been taken into consumption than during theoora .
ponding six months of the previous year. retr
bers and other parties, from their own personal 010%61
tams, and from inquiries of bakers, have ascertel'ithiS
that a larger consumption of bread had taken Plasecentlee
year compared with former times. The Hon. ta,e-oat
man (Mr. Berkeley) had stated that the English in .
would be undermined by the United States. He ue-h at
his hand au account of the sale of four cargoes of w. heat
sactlosts
from America. The accounts were genuine tran
not hypothetical calculations. The cargoes were 4'oo
bushels each ; the loss on the voyage was 357 bushelos*. O. •
cost of bringing the wheat here and thelossadded ib'ther
per quarter to the selling price. The result of the is
cargoes was nearly the same. Now, by the last accecl•
•trom the United States, the price at New York was 4'4,90a
good white wheat. So, adding the cost of carriage
sn
loss, it could noz be sold at a profit here for less toed
565. per quarter. The circumstances he had s",„aeet
would account for the fact that at the present ra°Tht-
fl ur was no leis than 3s. per barrel dearer is New.„d
leans than at Liverpool. The four cargoes all sustalvr"ee
I. se. One cirgo the cost was 9351; the produce lot
714 d ; so the loss was 2211. The second cargo ;0,
4551.; the third 2371.; and the fourth 2881. And Ilelje
altenbers must further beat in mind in mind that tier
wheat was bought in America when prices were I°ol
than now, and sold here at a time when the price it
4s. higher. It' then, the present prices did not alterAti
was his belief that we would see a considerable titts°.; of '
of wheat shipped from England for the consaraPeta,)
the petiole of the United States.—(Roars of laughay,
Hon. Members laughed; but we had done so taire:fthe
though Hon. Members did not seem to be aware tea
tact. The Hon. Member (Hr. Saunders) had objecgo,
to taking the averages of the last ten or twelve Yeast,
He could not understand why this objection should eltbe
and why the lion. Member should wish to go back 000
year 1825. The Hon. Member was, perhaps, not °bed
that the condition arid character of the continent Profs
very much changed of late years. In the Rhenish, re
vinces, for instance, which once produced a surfuea- '
care, there was now no surplus, owing to increaseugos
pulation and increased manufactures. The lion. ""ro•
tleman said, under free trade we should stimulate 1001
duction, arid so we should have increased supplies from
abroad. If they gave higher prices they woula
atereased foreign cultivation; but this would not WI of
if higher prices were not given. Ifso, then the wile/um
the data on which he had based his calculations for
u
last ten or twelve years were correct; and therefore, 0%,
less you increased your prices, you had no right te tt
pees increased importations. All he would say vvi/9e'to
was a most unfair, a most unwise thing for the finssiree
attempt to say that the experience we had had of ,00,
trade presented a satisfactory solution of the eineesUtee
He denied this was so. He was not content to tax° of
years 1848-49 as a fair criterion of the average Priceere
wheat in future, when they saw, whatever parties —no'
in distress, that the working classes were now better "0,
that they were a few years ago.—(No.) If Hon- °f r
bers did not pay regard to returns, he knew of 00 °
lib.
criterion by which the question could be tested. ,bs
returns from the poor-law unions, which were out o`,
tat
control or influence of Government, and from lair -If
thorities, were the authorities on which he relied' to
any better could be produced, he would be haPP4 se
adopt them; but till that was done he must rely 011 "fee'
we had. Whatever might be the defects of free trail
..,e0
whatever the consequences which had flowed from I,°",be
prices—still he maintained the working people ot 101
kingdom were better off in every respect now than
were in former times.
Mr. HERMES said that the debate had been so Pio':
tile in admissions, he hoped they would come to Ober
common agreement on the subject. The Hon. Men'
Haetie) said that if the present state Of t'te. 0-
continued for three years he would become a Pr°;-014
tiouist, while another Hon. Member (Mr. SlaneY)o-rtie
he would have objected to the repeal of the %id
laws, on the ground that a protective duty was recl-,- ial
for the agricultural interest, by reason of the seise
burdens ter which it was subjected. Why, that pas all
very essence cif protection.—(Cheers.) That w'"„eiel
they claimed, namely an indemnification of their sP-retl
burdens. The Hon. Gentleman who spoke last o° eh
into a very elaborate statement to show that, I'll%loo
the times were now depressed, they would mee/I-ere
better, by which he meant better prices. Wes :eject
ever such inconsistency, seeing that the avoweu leaf
of those who advocated a free trade in corn 'Otani
prices and abundance of toed. That the Govertaion
should withhold their consent to the proP-oor
before the limier., he confessed he vrto me'
prised, recollecting as he did that on a former boa
morable occasion the Noble Lord at the The
of the Government proposed a fixed duty of 8s; the
anewer given upon the subject by the Noble Lord ; .(mr.
delegtees who recently waited on him was, in hise,ord
tierriee'sopinion, wholly inconclusive. The Noble
stir
said teat) ithout going into other considerationsid ea`
posing the price of cern to to 585., a law that vin,ll reao,
duce the average to 50e. would be well taken; vv,useaseal
if the price were 425., the law which would raise it
that
tho
425. to 50e. would be ill taken. But he remernbeir°t, ad'
the Nenle Lord at the time he proposed an Bs. "Ile'r, re'
mitted his opinion to be that 565. was only a fa
mune rating price for coin. The agriculturists n°7 etion
demanded 50s. Why then should there be an onieree.to
to relieve the agricultural interest to that wish- the
raise the price of corn to 505., being 6s. below We- pee:
Noble Lord adrnittea was a fair price. As for the:enteo
sea law thing only an experiment, he totally chi°, the
from tare proposition. Almost from the ronaleeljeeatne
Amt came iuoe force its deplorable effects "„„trY,
visible upon the agricultural interests of the c°`"tbein
All that was now dour was to invite
ecess;
to confide in the prophecies of future suo be"
but he, .or one, was certainly indisposed to d° so;bee°
cause the vest prophecies of the same party had ri-disar
fulfilled. He believed there were none more e the
pointed with the results of free trade in corn turi,
advocates f the rea asures themselves.—(tlesr'ot °`
believed all r that the: e was not a person in or tbse
office who, if he could have foreseen the effects vf:ouedi
measure, would have had the courage, or the ~.riod
no,s, to have supported it. Within the short ece ban
its ,operation the prices of agricultural prQu'4,oooll
fallen 20, 25, aye, 30 per cent. Sex° WO Pr°r