The Sun.
London, England, 1868-04-29 00:00:00

-SPIRIT OP THE PUBLIC JOURNALS.

The Times wants to know when the debate on the Irish
Church is likely to end. The same arguments, or apologies
for arguments, have been advanced night after night ; and
if there be no sense of shame preventing men from saying
over again what has been said a dozen times already, and
in some of the dozen probably better than they can hope
to say it, the same arguments may be advanced in nights '
still to come in almost infinite series. There is, however,
always a compensation somewhere, and it has been fur-
nished in a quarter where it may have been least
expected. The Commons spent another evening in
debating Mr. Gladstone's first resolution, but the Lords
managed to make any further discussion on the third
"i•esolution almost, if not quite, impossible. We
should have said " quite," but that we know there is
no certain limit to the power of human talkativeness.
Lord Derby asked Lord Russell what Mr. Gladstone
meant to do with his resolutions, and how he explained a
statement in his recent speech at St. James's Hall. Lord
Derby had translated the request to place the Irish tem-
poralities at the disposal of Parliament into a request to
suspend them at the pleasure of the House of Commons.
The misunderstanding is almost incredible, but it has been
sedulously inculcated for some time past upon all who
were disposed to accept it, and Lord Derby was misled,
with many others. If words have any meaning, placing a
piece of patronage at the disposal of Parliament must
signify a readiness to consent to any disposition of
it that Parliament—in other words, Queen, Lords,
and Commons—may advise, and the third resolution
does not request or suggest anything more. If the
resolution should be adopted, it will be the duty
of a constitutional minister advising a constitutional
monarch to recommend a gracious reply that the Queen
holds her prerogatives over the Irish Church at the dis-
posal of her Parliament and people. Until Parliament
has passed some bill the course of patronage will remain
unchanged. When a measure shall have been assented to
by both Houses, it will be for the Crown to follow the ad-
vice of its Ministers. All that the resolution asks for is
freedom to propose and discuss a disestablishment of the
Irish Church, non obstante jure coronae, and, as Lord
Russell expressed himself, the Queen would not be justi-
fied in suspending a single bishopric or benefice in
Ireland unless an Act of Parliament had provided
that it should be done. It follows that the alarm
felt by Lord Derby and others that the Crown
would be placed in a dilemma by being asked by
the House of Commons to override Acts of Parliament
by a resolution of one branch of the Legislature is terror
at a mare's nest ; and it may be hoped plat after its hol-
lowness has been exposed no attempt will be made to
revive a belief in it in the House of Commons. It is only
charitable to pass over in silence the rest of Lord Derby's
speech. Those who choose to refer to the report may
discover to what lengths of imprudence a peer of long
experience, but emancipated from the responsibilities
of office, can run : we shall be content with the compen
sation we have already deduced, that this debate in the
Lords must prevent any debate on the third resolution
in the Commons, and the most perverse of intellects
cannot pretend to misconstrue its purport again.
Mr. Gladstone's special dread at present is what he calls
an abstract resolution. Do what he will, his proposals of
legislation can practically go no further until a new Par-
liament is called ; but his is a temper to be swayed rather
by sentiment than by actualities. So he will persevere
with his resolutions, and on the back of them produce a
bill, with its three readings, its committee, and interlocu-
tory•discussions, let whatever else go to the wall. At the
end, the bill, if it reaches the Lords, will be .rejected by

them to see what a new Parliament may say on the
subject. We do not know that any harm would follow all
this were it not for the possibility that the practical settle.
ment of the question will be postponed by such ill-judged
perseverance.

The Post observes that the arguments advanced against
the practicability of the disestablishment of the Irish
Church may be very quickly disposed of. It is absurd to
say that if the interests of a nation demand the adoption
of a particular course of action no way can be found of
giving it practical effect. The-simple question to be de-
termined is, whether it is expedient that the Irish Church,
as an establishment, should cease to exist. Such is the
tenour of Mr. Gladstone's first resolution ; and if it be de-
termined in the affirmative nothing remains but to cast about
for the means of effecting that object. The latter part of the
problem may need careful and anxious consideration before
a satisfactory solution can be attained, but a solution of
some sort is not the less indispensable. This matter
scarcely comes under the consideration of the committee
in the present debate, and we shall not anticipate b)
canvassing the considerations which it involves. At pre-
sent, all the House is called upon to affirm is that a gross
injustice is complained of by the Irish people, and that it
needs a speedy remedy. Judging by the tone of the de-
bate, no doubt can exist respecting the reply which will
be given by the committee. It seems to be felt upon all
hands that the resolution must be met by a direct affirma-
tive or negative ; and we therefore congratulate the public
on the fact that there is no prospect of one of these un-
satisfactory compromises which please neither one party
nor the other.

The Daily News commends to the country the speech o:
Lord Derby on the Irish Church question. If Lord Derby
is right, London, Manchester, and Birmingham had better
mind their own business, make money to maintain the.
Irish garrison, and leave the affairs of the. Irish Church
alone. The Lords will take care of that question. Reso
lutions of the House of Commons are mere " wast
paper." A statesman supported by a majority of the
House of Commons may propose the disestablishment of
an alien Church in Ireland, but what then? Upon such a
measure " the two Houses of Parliament would be irre-
concilably at variance. Lord Derby no doubt spoke the
sentiments of his party, and is ready to oppose the pre-
judice of the House of Lords to the deliberate reason of
the conntry ; but we believe he would be utterly disap-
pointed. The majority of the peers would, no doubt,
make a good fight for a system which at present acts as
a bulwark against the great wave of justice and equality,
which threatens to overflow them ; but they would not
place themselves in permanent antagonism to the House
of Commons and the country,

The Herald lays down that if the debate of these two
nights has served no direct purpose, has brought out nc
new arguments, and thrown no fresh light on a subject
already pretty thoroue-hly discussed, it has dispelled the
doubts which certain Radicals professed to entertain as to
the earnestness and constancy of the Conservative party.
Though conscious that the cause was prejudged, and defeat
inevitable, they have made a gallant fight in defence of
their principles, and of that institution which, beyond all
others, is bound up with their firmest and most cherished
convictions. It was the purpose of the Liberals to dis-
hearten the Church feeling of the country by the sugges-
tion that it had no real hold upon the House of Commons,
and that the Tory party, though they felt obliged to give
their votes to the cause of the Church, had it not suffi-
ciently at heart to give it an active support. That fiction
cannot be repeated. The country knows noiv that the
Conservative party is unanimously and heartily in earnest
on the subject, and needs nothing but the cordial and
vigorous support of the Chnrchmanship and Protestantism
of the nation to reverse the snatched decision of a mori-
bund Parliament, and save the endowments and the status
of the national religion.
The Standard notes a point which appears to have beer
established by the Fenian trials. Henceforth less impor
tance will be attached to Queen's evidence, or the betrayal
of criminal plots by those who were in the secret of them,
participated in their criminality up to a certain limit, and
then turned round with a treacherous disclosure either to
save their own lives or in the hope of reward. It is clear
that, throughout the recent investigation, the oaths of the
approvers were treated with contempt and regarded as
worthless, except where they were supported by irrefra-
gable and disinterested testimony. Men of the Vaughan
and Mullany stamp might put the police on the scent but
here their utility ceases, and the moment they asked the
jury to follow them into the private chambers of conspi-
racy the jury flatly refused, and preferred to leave the
conspirators unpunished to listening to the sweating of
individuals whose motives were as mean as their characters
were bad, and who came into court, where six human
lives were at stake, soddened and bewildered with drunken.
11C83. Are we, then, to conclude that it was impossible to
have unearthed more of the mystery? Five months have
elapsed since the atrocity was perpetrated ; the police
have had unstinted means of Pursuing their researches
and yet the issue is as we see it.
The Telegraph wants a detective force that is a reality
and not a sham. The present detectives are, in most
cases, not only dullards but dunces, and have worked their
way up principally in much the same fashion as the non
commissioned officer, regimentally known as " an adju
tant's, corporal," works his way up to be sergeant-major---
by bringing as many charges and securing as many oonvic
tions as he canwbilein a low grade, by obsequiousness tohis
superiors, by sedulous "booing" and" booing," until at last
he finds himself in a halcyon state of plain clothes, with a
revolver in one pocket and a pair of handcuffs in the other.
We do not want these half-educated and more than half.
corrupt incapables. We want men—men of lynx-like
sharpness, of ferret-like activity, of hull-dog-like tenacity.
They are to be had. Many a sharp attorney in this
country, whose over-sharpness has led to his being in
temporary difficulties—many a gentleman at large now
Jiving on his wits— might be quietly, discreetly, and most
advantageously utilised when affiliated to a genuine de-
tective force. Half a dozen shrewd and educated agents
such as these would have found out ere this a hundred
times more than we at present know about the leaders of
the Fenian conspirators.
The Star declares that Spain is on the verge of a revolu
Lion. No one can tell how soon or in what way the storm
may break out, but coining it assuredly is, or all the signs
I'v ~rl:ieli melt forecast the political inture are delusive.
Of the great revolutionists of our time, two, Narvaez and
O'Domo.n, r, dead ; I.:Tarter() is worn out and laid on
the shelf • Prim p., in exile, watching doubtless with keen
and stead,-eye thc 4,l.ances alli I changes of the situation.
The revolution may be simply a political change—it may
be a great tempestuous uproot lug of all the old conditions,
social, political, and ecclesiastical. if one were to jtul,ge
roughly by what Spain has borne, the length of time she
has borne it, and the utter failure of all superficial and ad
ministrative changes all revolts of generals, all palace
revolutions, and Ministerial coups ditat to effect any sub.
stantial improvement in her state, one might infer that
the revolution, when it does come, will be profound,
sweeping, and perhaps even terrible. Bid it may be that
some central power of cohesion, some new impulse and
opportunity towards co-operation, may bring the diffused
but
arnneneeesatLa h n
Liberalism of 'Spain into an active and ruling
9f revolut n
ion, get rid of despotism without the agency