The Sun.
London, England, 1857-03-06 00:00:00

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he authorities there, and to (1.-eZ.,en;
Lances of the case. Des the o:.: '-'-7' - feWe...._,Leiit.
slii ; course, or what course does he hid to ittke? Shave
eeard a great deal about cembinatiet of pirzeias and the
necessity of an appeal to the country, but an appeal to
the country cannot lead to any result till the end of May.
What is to be goirg .11: is Chine iti the meantime ? What
was the purport of the vote on Tuesday? Was that vote
intended to reverse the policy which has been pursued in
China or not ? If that vote meant anything it meant that
this house would not be responsible for the conduct of
Sir J. Bowring with respect to the Arrow. I apprehend
that if that vote is to be taken as a reality and to have a
practical result, the noble lord is bound to tell us before
we separate this very day what course he intends to tale
in consequence of that vote. I say, provide first of all
for the security of Englishmen in China. You have a
forceto do that. But let the noble lord tell us what are his
ulterior intentions with regard to China, and what course
he intends to take with regard to thegovernment of China.
It seems to me that be intimated on Friday night a very
proper course to be taken with regard to the government
of that country. He sail that before these unfortunate
iccurrences took place he had made a proposal to the
French Government, and was contemplating one with the
American Government, with a view to making ageneral re-
presentation forgreater commercial fac lities. Toat appears
to me to be the best practical way of extending our in-
fluence in China. It has al ways appeared to me that in
order to do that it was necessary to clear the ground
from past proceedings, and to renounce she illegal posi-
tion taken up by Sir J. Bowring. The vote of this house
has pronounced against those proceedings. You have
now placed yourselves on legal ground, and you can go
to those governments and ask them to co-operate with
you. I believe they will cc -operate with you on your
new and legal ground, but that they would not have done
so so long as you were contending with the Government
of China on the miserable and illegal grounds which have
been repudiated by this house. Now, sir, I have only
risen to ask the question which I have put to the noble
lord. Ido not intend to complieate it with the general
election, Ido not fear a general election. I predict
a winnowing and remodelling of the state of patt-
ies in this house. (Hear, hear.) But there was one
point in the noble lord's speech which certainly did
puzzle me. He said the country would be able to judge
cetween his administration and some administration
in posse, formed from amongst right hon. gentlemen
opposite. Now, I do not know how the country can
judge between the noble lord and the right hon. gentle-
men opposite. So far as my observation gees, I have
come to the conclusion, that I consider the noble lord at
the head of the Government to be as good a Tory as any
rght hon. or hon. gentleman opposite, and whether he
sits on that side of the house or on this will not make
any great difference to the liberties of the country. I
ask the noble lord what is the course he intends to take
in consequence of the vote on Tuesday night ?
Sir C. WOOD—It is not my intention to re-open the
debate, and I am plaid that my hon. friend (Mr. Cobden)
is at last aware that there may be some increased dan-
ger to the lives of our countrymen in China from the
vote of STues'.lay night. I only wish that be had
thought of that before. (Cheers.) I rise for the
purpose of informiee the house of the steer t.l the
vessels in China and the measures adopted. I hope
the efficient measures taken will prevent the dangers
apprehended from producing any ill effect. There is a
large frigate at Canton (as was understood), an-
other at one of the northern ports, and another is on its
way. By this time, or in the course of this month, three
large steam-frigates, and seven or eight gunboats will are
rive in the river at Canton. A laree frigate and two other
vessels Will arrive in the course of April, and two more
in the month of May, or in the month of June. Those
orders had been issued previous to this debate, and quite
independent of it, and I can only assure my hoe. friend
that Government are taking rne3sures for sending further
means to China, for the purpose of defending, as far as we
can, the lives and property of Englishmen in China.
Sir J. WALSH was one of those who veted for the
motion, hut be should be sorry if the effect of carrying
the resolution 'should be in the slightest degree to hinder
tier Majesty's Government from taking any steps neces-
sary fir the protection of the Jives and property of Eng-
lisemen in Coma.
Mr. DEEDES said the noble lord bad stated the course
be intended to take with regard to public business, and
he entirely concurred in it, but he wished to ask the
not le 1 ird, or some member of the government, what
course they would take with regard to private business ?
In June, 1847, a resolution was cairied to the effect that
any railway or ether private bill which had passed the
sec mi reading, or any subsequent stage, or had been
referred to a select committee, might he resumed at the
same stage in the n,xt session.

Mr. S. HERBERT—Before any answer is given to
that question, I wish to call the attention of the govern-
ment to the fact that the question of my hon, friend the
West Riding has not been answered. I apprehend the
circumstances in which we are placed are very peculiar.
You have had precedents of an appeal to the people by a
minister placed in a minority, but you will find on al
previous occasions it has been a question as to some sub-
ject of legislation on which the opinion of the cluntry
(
couldjat once be obtained. In this MVO the House of
Commons has expressed an opinion adverse to the Go.
vernment, as to the or;gin of a war now carried 00.
Clearly, therefore, if no pledge is taken from Government
that the war will not be continued by the same individuals of
whose conduct it has already given an unfavourable opi-
nion, the vote come to wilt be nugatory. Now my hon.
friend who sits beside me (11. Ir. Cobden) did not eay that
he apprehended, in consequence of the vote that was
given, there was danger. What he said, I apprehend,
was this : that Govern neat considered there was danger ;
and he wished to know, therefore, looking at it qt. that
point of view, whether they were prepared to take any
steps to r-m .dy it? I repeat the question. I ask what
steps are taken to prevent the danger which those who
have read the papers to-day will see already exists ? You
have seen the state of things at Hong Kong, and the state
of feelir.g at Singapore. There is danger, not in conse-
quence of Lthis vote, but what I am alluding to is the
danger which naturally followed from the state of things
at Canton ; and what we wish to know is, what is Go-
vernment going to do during the long interval that will
elapse before Parliament can again be assembled ? Is
the Government about to continue the war with the
same object, that is, for the introduction into the
city of Canton of Sir John aiwring, and is the con-
duct of affairs out there, b • it for peace or for war, to be
left in the hands of a man who, in the opinion of the
House of Commons, has by his want of judgment or ca-
pacity brought about a state of things which is so dan-
gerous ? (Cheers.) If it is any convenience to the
Government to do so, in order to enable the noble lord
to answer this question, I shall be glad to move that this
debate he adjourned.

The SPEAKER intimated that the right hon. gentle-
man could not do that, but that the noble lord had a
reply.

-Mr. S. HERBERT—Then I trust the noble lord, or
some member of the Government, will answer that ques-
tion, but I trust the noble lord.
Sir G. GREY—Io answer to the question of the hon.
member (qr. Deedes), I may say it is the intention of
Government to propose a course with respect to private
bills simil Jr to that which has been adopted before—viz
a resolution having the effect of placing bills in a future
Parliament in the same position that they would have
been in had not the progress with them been interrupted.
With reference tothe questions which have been addressed
to the Government by my right hon. friend, I have no
hesitation in saying that I think he made a most entire
misrepresentation of the ground of the hostilities, .when
he assumed that the Government are carrying on the
war for the mere purpose of introducing Sir J. Bowring
into Canton. I have no hesitation in saying that the
Government have bad their attention most seriously
directed to those circumstances calculated to induce
alarm, the accounts of which have been brought by the
last mail to this country, and they cannot but feel that
the danger to be anticipated is likely to be aggravated
by the decision of this house. With that conviction
intend
expressed not
by o
this house as to send out orders to s
forced upon them, the Government feel it is their duty
Thnaesybe do
been —as it was their duty before, but is still more their duty
anton
which
now—to take every precaution to protect British interests
faanrdtoßritish honour
the
in
opinionCthe authorities there
to act in accordance with the feelings of the hon. gentle-
man, the member for the West Riding
of Yorkshire.
They think that to direct our officers there to abandon
the demands which they have felt
to be their duty
to make, and to abstain from sending out the means of
enforcing those demands, would be to sacrifice the honour
of the country. With an appeal to the country before
them, they will not shrink from the responsibility of tak-
ing those measures, and of issuing those directiors, which
they think are consistent with the honour and dignity of
the country, and for the pro tec tio a of lives awl property
—I will not say of the British only, but of all foreigners
residing in China. With respect to ulterior measures,tint I
West
can only say the hon. member for the
citdonseqg had
nce
no right to assume that the Government,
in
which was of the vote, had abandoned the intentionm
inti-
mated by my right hon. friend near e,
of placing our
relations with China on footingatefr of a permanent charac-
ter,opinion afford the best
and which would
in h
nee of the calamities that have
security against a recurre
taken place there.
Lord J. RUSSELL—'I really wish the Government
would enable us to understand what are the objects which
they say they
desire to accomplish. We are about to un-
dergo a process of what Mr. Fox and his friends used to
call a penal dissolution. We have come to a certain vote,
and the House of Commons is to be punished for coming
to that vote. That is plainly the situation. Well, the
noble lord.at the head of the Government says he cannot
effect the object without the assistance of the House o
Commons. He asks us to pass certain votes as lightly as
we can, and to grant supplies in order to assist him to
make an appeal to the country. The right hon. gentle-
man opposite (Mr. Disraeli) said that, for his part—and
suppose speaking for those who act with him—he had a
disposition to give facilities for that purpose. But surely
if the' house is to give those facilities, there is some fair-
ness in asking for an explanation of the policy which is to
be pursued during the three months that will elapse before

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