The Sun.
London, England, 1868-06-24 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT

HOUSE OF COMMONS—This DAY.
The SPEAKER took the chair at twelve o'clock.
ELEMENTARY EDUCATION BILL.

Mr. A. BRUCE said that this bill stood for a second
reading this day. Ho much regretted that the hopes held
out by the Government of introducing a large measure on the
subject should not have been realised. The object of the
present bill WAS to give large powers of action without
interference of the Government, but giving that power
where circumstances called for its exorcise. Ho
could not agree with the honourable member for
Caine that the State should enforce a system
of secular education. The principle on which his bill was
founded was to lcavo the parents themselves to decide on
the kind of school and the character of the religion., in-
struction to be given in it. Under all the circumstances,
it appearing impossible to succeed in passing the
bill during the present session, he should by permission of
the house withdraw it.

After a discussion upon the general question of educa-
tion amongst the labouring and agricultural population,
the bill was by leave withdrawn.

SEA FISHERIES (IRELAND) BILL.

Mr. BLAKE moved the second reading of this bill, the
object of which was to protect tho sea coast population of
Ireland, to prevent trawling in bays and estuaries,
and to grant loans by Government to fishermen similar to
those made to occupiers of land to enable them to prose-
cute their calling with effect. The hon, member said the
bill was a most important one, but it would be utterly
useless if it was passed without the clauses empower-
ing the granting of a loan. He was afraid
that it would be almost too much to hope
that the bill would pass during the present session,
but hoped the noble earl would assent to the principle of
the measure by agreeing to its second reading, and that
during the recess the Government would take the matter
into their consideration, with a view to legislation next
year.

Lord C. J. HAMILTON seconded the motion.
The Earl of MAYO said he did not think it would be
advisable to go forward with the bill at the present period
of the session. He fully recognised the importance
of the subject, and although he wished to do
all in his power to improve the condition of
the Irish fishermen, he must say the languishing
condition of their trade arose from the fact of there being
little or no local demand for the produce of their labours.
Next session, it was most likely he should have to present
a measure for the better regulation of deep sea, as well as
inland fishing—(hear, hear)—which he hoped would result
in success. He could not, however, hold out much hope
that Parliament would over sanction the proposal of loans
to fishermen. He fully admitted the principles of the bill,
and should not oppose its second reading, but it must be
clearly understood that ho did not give his consent to the
whole of the provisions of the measure.
The bill was then read a second time, and ordere] to be
committed on Monday next.

The Larceny Bill was read a second.
The other orders of the day were then disposed of, and
,he house adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS-LAST EVENING.
PUBLIC SCHOOLS BILL.

The house went into committee on this bill.
The discussion was resumed on the Gth clause, and it
was marked by the stand that Mr. Newdegate made in
favour of the old governing bodies in preference to the
new. The hon. member divided the house on the ques-

tion, when he received the support of 9 members, 133
voting against him.
Another amendment being made to the clause,
Mr. ACLAND said the bill was for the purpose of re-
gulating seven public schools which wore for the gentry
and the clergy, and he hoped they would not be placed iu
a worse condition than other similar establishments.
Mr. LOC EE denied that the schools under considera-
tion wore established for the wealthy classes alone. They
were for rich and poor, for all alike, and any attempt on
the part of the commissioners to appropriate these schools
entirely to the rich alone would be most unjust, because it
would be utterly opposed to the foundation on which they
were, in the first instance, established. He should vote
for the clause as it stood.

Mr. LIDDELL said there was no bar whatever to any
boy presenting himself at tho competitive examination for
admission to Eton. The only qualification necessary was
that he should bo a British subject born in wedlock.
Mr. NEWDEGATE said that by the bill as it stood the
local rights of the middle and lower classes with respect to
these schools would be infringed, without the slightest
compensation being given ; he could not help thinking it
was unfair to do so without giving something in return.
The clause was then agreed to, as were clauses 7,8, 9,
10, and 11. .

On clause 12 a discussion arose upon the desirability of
the head master of a public school keeping a boarding
house, during which Sergeant Gazelee said ha had been
educated at Winchester, knew the value of such an ar-
rangement, and he hoped the house would put a stop
to all pettifogging arrangements, by which things were
seldom altered for the better.

The clause was ultimately agreed to, and ordered to
stand part of the bill. .

Mr. K&RSLAKE moved an amendment to clause 14,
to leave Harrow School out of the bill. Ho said the in-
habitants of Harrow objected to t le establishment of a
middle-class school as a kind of compensation for the
breaking up of the John Lyons school at Harrow, as origi-
nally founded. He contended that the alteration of the
foundation of that school was most unjust, and therefore
he moved his amendment.

Mr. GOSCHEN objected to the amendment. He thought
the best results would follow the alteration of the founda-
tion, because, as matters at present existed, families well
able to pay for the teaching of their sons availed them-
selves 9f them to obtain a gratuitous education for their
children. (Hear, hear.) He denied that any valuable
privileges were to be struck at by the bill, but all that was
sought to be done was to compel persons who could we'
afford it to pay for the education of their children. (Hear,
hear.)

NEWDEGATE made a similar appeal for the in-
habitants of Rugby. lie said they viewed with great
alarm the proposal to estrange them from the privileges
they had so long enjoyed with resp3ct to the education of
their children at the school founded at Rugby by Law-
rence Sheriff.

Sir S. NORTHCOTE said he thought provision in the
bill could easily be made to protect the rights of persons
living in the neighbourhood of Rugby and Harrow.
The amendment was withdrawn on the understanding
that the subject would receive reconsideration.

The other clauses were under discussion at seven
o'clock, at which hour the sitting was suspended until
nine o'clock.

At the evening sitting,

Lord ELCHO moved an address for the appointment of
a Royal Commission to inquire into and report upon Eng-
lish military organisation, in so far as it related to the
establishment of a sufficient and economical army of re-
serve, and the means it offered of speedy and efficient ex-
pansion to meet the requirements of war, more especially
for home purposes. Contrasting the inferior position of
this country, in point of defence, with that of Continental
nations, the noble lord remarked that when Englishmen
saw that their estimates amounted to fifteen millions ster-
ling, and asked what they had to show for it, they were
naturally,inclined to think that their military machine was
neither as efficient as it might be made, nor as economical
as it ought to bo. He strongly advised a stringent and
searching inquiry into the whole matter.
General PEEL admitted that there was no question
more worthy the attention of the house than the condition
of our army of reserve. He also agreed with Lord Elcho's
conclusion that the present was a most appropriate time
for its consideration, inasmuch as the country was not
suffering from either the hotor cold fits which had hitherto
regulated our military preparations. Entertaining the
hope that the foreign policy which had of late years been
adopted of not interfering in the affairs of other nations
would be persevered in, he nevertheless thought that
when other countries were arming to the teeth
they ought not to neglect putting themselves
in a perfect state of defence, and not trust
to the forbearance of others. The question of
any reserve, however, was ono of the matters referred to
the Royal Commission for recruiting, which sat two years
ago And had reported fully upon it. There was, conse-
quently, enough known of the subject without having re-
course to Royal Commissions. Besides that he was dis-
inclined to transfer the responsibility of the Government
to a commission. No doubt the system of any reserve
was defective ; and he hesitated not to say that he
would never have consented to the reduction of the esta-
blishments of the line regiments to 600 men each if he
had foreseen that he could not rely upon the reserve
when the necessity arose to bring them up to their fu)"
complement.

A somewhat technical and tedious discussion was car-
ried on by Gen. Dunne, Sir H. Verney, Col. W. Patten,
Mr. Ilayter, Mr. Bathurst, and Col. Jervis.
Sir J. PAKINGTON replied, and contended that the
real object of the motion was to induce the Government
to resort to the system of conscription, on the ground that
the voluntary system was not sufficient to provide for the
defence of the country. He could not fora moment
countenance the idea of resorting to anything like con-
scription, w'qicla Jo Ool,ioyed to be jpaccoolary. surd