The Sun.
London, England, 1850-05-01 00:00:00

TILE

SUN,

....
tv,
,t k,,
4104 existed fJr the salaries being
ng`'nl Low. The truth was, it was
harriesiratitote a correct comparison bF-
homer
of the two periods. The salaries patd
ha teriod were far in amount
a, n. Gentleman had any idea cf.
Vela whieli they were paid ; and one of
I te,,,pseaea3 in the public service was the
slid the substitution ' re -a,lar Lalaries
z,1,,, ofregular tea, s',!,l far than what was received under
f1i,,,, ibe old system had been put an end
dhe't the irregularities which took place wa-
ke, rope
if undue reduction took place.
t 4) a statement made by Mr. Bromley,
4°4 of chief clerk of stores in the Navy -
Itr, ft 011001. a year, from 1763 to 1784.
that
ttli4ro!or,ei,ort of the Committee on fees, raf/ ' Ur. Bromley was but 1001. a-yea ,
'4, i5ee41,,,,;(2"0/. a-year. S 3 that his actual
'llitteee'...',T salary of 1001, amounted to
',sac) i le the Year 1817, many yea's after
' broth° 'thed, the same Office was filled by Mr.
,04 other at a 6xed salary of 7401., being little
I/41 !.thirci (' ai l' the the Poluments reviously (m-
,il year
• it the scalep f salary
rn1849-50, o
eherlz ot the stores was fixed a t 504 to
Sacs 4141 to rise 201 a-vear until it attaoined
litatt, f 650/. When they compared
dl,hatt rti they then existed with the re-
'ille f 0 ''ati Since taken place, the differ-
the 004,11- to be enormous, though no doubt,
date
a,'" of salary for both periods was only `letail':ent inertaSe was very great.—(Hear,
i'lltlacite a great number of similar cases,
Ittetoot Nall be just the same. Then thered
prehileaplurality of offices. That system had
kaltltal t„ t4ao great extent; but it had now
',a- Ibis was another circumstance tha Ilia „a,4laparison of salaries now with times
' a 'e'a livould afford no true criterion of the
~,,,,e:oluotents which had really taken place.
tab Pt 41 done away with the systcm of
doe Ipe eev, kid they had at the same time
ilitetirDrreance of public duties—if Govern-
II leted `he •
s tzt, e practice of making
It' t 5 1)137:s-14'n the actual reduction would
to thewer,,than any return th_eamtaceoduldfubre_
.ota.,
4ite..4 9 bee must say, d
ethel int.: to amount of toreduction that
ela h o effect,, would be cruel and un-
'ettittigf4t degree. A. publication had been
'Alb „,°,,r,th the number of persons em-
alai "'ale service in France. The amount
bttlvEi't::al hot permitted to. be given,
.baur.t
Nihtt atell at 266 500 persons. rho !lc .
LtiPloyed
.eenld be formed of the number of per
jtptkrt,,ho,eitoaca,tille public service of this country,
about
, ,ts, 1,„ I Y employed was somewhereo
, a ..,ea, • ,
there
• ,estry i, ~, he did not really believe
11111
~ a tile world where the public service
; ,Isk ~ 30 fete , , small nest'
o 4 ) I,_ p%ons, and at such
how far
t7' sf aeb`ste would not presume to say
I'4'°lly rseris would be disposed to accept., ,S L.,°- a Person holding dace yet having
- Nll4 -°re than
he hoped Cite
life gi,e ~. coo department,
experience in
ttt taslit,a,no Credit if he said his
1;44 ih '-‘4 'nal that the servants of the publi.c,
tty 4 eakZugheat, were by no means an ove.rpaid
t°f ah oPtlee of v.n unwise redaction iin
the
pe 4
i. etatit public servant was, tba. h..
it tivsta "' tu lose the advantage of his Ee'
tkVatira establishments would get them awa?".,
I :;tiairlltsitle or Government to attempt •),
tk; saes,
toe ollara
repoy way to induce
,44 keeP tLeas -' to keep hero
we.
lis tsber and e • s His ex-
thatS public , at -tar remuneration.
the con-
the olhcor did :not lead him to . _
t()''ilf the ,P,,.',1?,11e departments were at all crier
.i.v'retairull,e service bad first-rate men, theyeasily
II d, ter it lest they they were not _
R wh.e sPoke froth
that
s' lea t, eoa experience when be saidxf,r_
~,,tlei.ot .-hdFil to discourage or damp the e in.
aa'ekiilslthhe servants would prove a real
,I 4 . e service He Lad always thought the
~•tif„agbt to the l
'Nfafaaelie , w
and-ifservices ala
'tit."' seta servants ; the public had true
At, ere ,to discourage them.
le 4-clalit
‘, and wished to retain them, they
firmly be-
m4ll b '34,1 tile lien• Gentleman's m
4-5% e - eau '
da)k de, ,se great and lasting
Hoetion, if car-
-414 n0t41146. public servants. The publicwbo
Y be better done by those
This
',Ole fett4 alld not heart service.. a
If In• Nil,
~,t4 be a sound principle—it was . :.'le-",.,ttle alt prix
.establishments acted upon, 'q had w„V 'ale business, they only got men
(Hear,
. Ci.,,tl;:etlatiekt,,..in their work, they would be
itl Pe,„,al netrailo work not well clone.—(Bear,
that
bible tv, Wish to express any opinion contrary
settl4" teltit "e Motion of the Hon. Member,
h '44 pr
her Majesty humbly
e.l lit the . esented to
th, (1 la
ever be be made of the salaries
service,
4 pki 1411 /."'ll be graciously pleased to direct
re 4,1 law
,''iera department of the public
. P rd b • `°ajust aad
of the
Ina ettgh A adequate reduction thereof,
a ,les,', ,'a to the efficient performance
ex-
t e-antirsty
his sentiments se.nt.itnents of the motion
doi 71/14itt a. opinion. Ile held that economy
as j'aelea ~e 4 upon, and practised consistently
now
/4r,j'a estale.' a/a that opinion Government _
ql.k,tit th',44ia, would continue to ' wish' 'Loose a other business,
' ati al; ~,
.). pass to the
motion which
act.
tla 4 to ,f`' negative directly a m act.—(fleas.)
he would
,?Ill'eva.., eeti;ure on Government,
t'slq 48 clhest
time the
pie Ri,o Gorton, hoping at the sal
up to
ssia,
to Government credit for acting 0_ _ _
kit 4! di dntaaking such reductions as were ou
of the
Oot•'', ee;a,",°, and efficient performance true
t1.141;41 eeitt.' "ing, in his opinion, the only
41'•)t,i-eklq,DN't, Y.--(Cheers.)
V 'l', 511ai,... eaving put the question,
t,t 1 oOpp
his that the
ke the li ', expressed opinion
lc, youor% G
to a vote
. tel, the 0 entlernan did not amount,
if it did? He
N,ttlal,„etlaern‘\z°,7!sament. But what '
the
elkxltamtoeti,i, 4111 not care a farthing whetherLaugh-
h"a el, "ered it in that light or not.—(
- of
Yki:Pllierir fteta the speech of the Chancellor
la at ) 404
„,,at there were to be neither
reductions
the Ex-
; kt,„:ts.tl dtutkl salaries. The Chancellor of
~,. ,___
of
tkl,,%tt NI :14 4 eeraparis between the anaire..
IN4 11-Y Etild those en
Great Western Rau-
-NI y. 40 ose of the
be-
analogy
44
1414 Cases bog.lll There was no
He had
at (i iti .4 ktaii---liot the least in the world.
7,
lilt, 44 00waY share in his life--(Laughte
elest-prs a stravv about the situation
inwhich
that
11‘ i
nag and eorapany had got itself, except.
0_
N,' '444. -,,euti,, - that" the fair salaries 1
4, 14,,_, . tance
cut down.
k), he ret qttatigable servants had been .41 ki•' had Peetedrailw d* trs in their private ca-
-1 ih ao ties:, aydirectors
they en-
atti ti, ia respect tuition in sayiug that e
wh
-11 business
lie°l, lattr,i, able men to transact their
of
ts,lteti", r0e.i,,,411er wards tocast them off because...
.er4 sleek;
manner in which
tlktki
arsee ita, gonad extravagant
deal had
vi, i th, " en conducted. A great
and
litatittai wh. reductions which had taken place,
what did
ie, reel had had been removed; but
v ill 4 0 ' Iletions amount to when the salarieshe.r
illy, 41100:leers in the state—men who passed their t:cji,lll ' 111 88' end
who lamentable' ignorance in ca-
business, I eta 0 , se
kith, an' business were untouched
,4‘ ,ill i''''.) ILI believed' in his soul that the
bactil'akse-t4(1,,,a4e0 of r Majesty's Ministers
t , act4a. that if it were not for the exertionso
'k ") oil ..._,''''.,g clerks the public business r
Oat . Atom ht =
the Treasury
t,i4 g er.) It was on
reasons
44tIltIlelaris:14 w,, as required. He saw
that
ki Xii, %lit - 41 the individuals who adorned
price vilti z(laa?.ta be reduced in proportion with 0_ c
kor, qieti4rter-) In former times a Chancellor.n of
Iht)lirsirt, eellid not stir abroad unlessw l
the
to 144'411earahl by four horses, but
ne
travel
tf, so,„ natal
class, kieutleamn opposite might and
ta,l4e. l'ti'eola be a'a, like any other passenger,respee..
itk,Nth ittre, ,tt bit the wiser. Now, with ,
ot,
'4 'lto "s`' need' the process 1
thr \ft 4 %mil ewornen, and .
their re-
ilti ~,\ istitt* x ad been recently adopted in
Oty 44441 1.)---he disapproved altogether of makingr.
ihea
„4! aarkarke table commodities for sale and bartre-
nd
jo, trctive pti "'tight be found for them at home, a
i, '4 marry'ees but for the vile 6 'A'ln of importing
blue 3' ' goods of the
di% bier„(anaa, e cheap and nasty _
.nlto
t'llitinl"`er)--and thus encouraging ht
of our
t4;pvt,,i, firtiz,haud embroidery. to the damage
that
st,' ~,,,40 11142, It was to the free-trade
stems
04. ''4ts, e' or the povert Ywhich our countrymen
\
11, ' "kip, ere laae • a-r -htery • Then,
bey a,,, a teas_ . tiring under.—.(Laughter.)
dm-
to eal,e;ll4 ti7:l',ll to the forthcoming nonsensical
,144 (la rd it ~.! Exhibition of 1851 "—(Laughter)—
Pa
whom
ita4 arty i aala duty to wary all persons with _
......
atelp t,aeodll'aetlee Writ t go near it—(Laughter)
• tist,‘'Nit„d could come aQf it.—(Laughter.) He had
k 11 t" Plac( • for the most
haseli '' ill e had told ,Istiere he resided
o to London
i, of 4tre et, is_ tne people not to g
__hihi-
'la t,') eat.l was a 1,41. --(Laughter)—because the. e.,-
41 -sh - "'inah 1 1 object of which would
11, t,l rttge , ug,t ie on y
and
°s he foreigner to send his cheap
(Laughter.)
hi Vde ,itli e
t.lqit'llle obit-.elf theY were not wanted--
'to his
,` pe; fif the opportunity to exhibit . .
Ntal et g decantillett of the foreigner's skill—so he put in
tp41„..,
_,r. --(Laughter.) Yes, a decanter—
;l4.on
ollikllea't ueettater, and the rice of the impositt _
irlthiteo--(lialighter.) Nopw, he asked, how wasa
list;44 iasilLtitrY, who was accustomed to eat roasto_a
'red .iii), t .A stron
after the manner fho
area %I, 5 Com et ale,
•gners w
dek,tt/Wh brP e with those nasty forehio
manefac.
el,' ieey .aliters sad and sour krout, and
(Lw d laughter.)
eta trea a. at sixpence a piece?--.-°° •
us me-
nit' as rude Waa too bad that the industrious
to get
ftlleelay,,,
wagon labourer who was unable
corn_
a'lle •ttio eahla.tet for a fair day's work, should b e
on
1;41) tettitaituptlite to fatten the set of idle fellowse.
com-
a, lit tihe:loas ewnell---aughter.) H
e w " fli't hestte
thttittitt ttaba
....o,llld be made, because self in
Th Honourable
tro e(ltill. for extt_ewould prevent -
be
thanks of
tip, P' for ut_f rdshire deserve.l t .
h he had
Ile fc, °Noma oe able manner in which i% 'NI t 44 40136 He hoped he would con-
(C tki ate it :' et
any
tii. 'ea, i 4 , , and, if so he might depend upon
114 NAll ti's shape 'which he
a 'lle oro Pe of a shot at the enemy,
pon Wev eoUld give hi
t - t‘l er, till k al.—(Laughter.)
He did
al), b e atoll_ ,t 1 that much impression could be made
sk,.. each. .),- aeons of lion. Gentlemen on the Tree-
llajOaleto 4 dissolution of Governmenuld be the
lee 4Se °.
Let th ,
hey
.. vtt who
~._ ere be a aissolution, and then tan ,
ntllloileeme io would come in and who wotaid go out d
TlQ4ot,upriataill•---(Alaugh.) They might then has",
!), f,t`teutte
ofg,t, independent Ministry, and an indepen-
IIN% tred k'emmons, for they had seen gh
th 411 eo e"--(tati ht
et th eluded, g er.) The lion. and Gallant GFri-
Nat,,e a ataid great merriment, by observing
kit
,saess,,a, wll3, to restore this country to her former
tpl)44tina ."
ake her th
surrou
tesa . shd , a envy and terror of . nd-
etteti oashiewb refuge and asylum far all who might be
beepkir, (peasiorr*?., was to stimulate the honest aodunre-
, b;_ pill,„„!et.o.pinion on the part of Hon. Gen tlem en.
).'teteratliatltOt t o 14:a41.
SoT stated that it had very seldom
'alber tas that ,I. ocid, comprehensive, and terse a
kip 01' () f Which had been made by the Hon.
post %red . It ordett-
t,,,, with t Ire. The contrast that it presented
Ikata,;_h marrellly of the Right lion. Gentleman
114 ed, and he was certain bad made an
UP% the ,
•
- 111144 9f 1199. Quweeng.,„..

WIIDNESD AY EVENING, MAY 1, 1850.

had said that he thought it would be an erroneous ex- i tailing the salaries of those servants. What he objected of the Exchequer, and as if it was their business to Paint the position of the chief clerks and virtual Ministers 0
pectation on the part of the public if they were led to Ito in the motion of the lion. Member was, that the mo- in rosy hues the prospering fortunes of a flourishing State in Downing- street, nor upon the statement of the
suppose that any great relief could be afforded from a Lion did not allude to the possibility of reducing the communitY.—(Cbeers and laughter.) In the meantime lion. Member for the West Biding, that he would not
reduetion of the salaries in question. With respect to number of the public servants, but awelt only on the whilst the Hon. Members and his friends were claiming vote for the motion because it, would affect the wages of
the changes made in the excise duties, t'to duties on I reduction of their suleries. The Hon. Gentleman and credit for getting up a now agitation, a change had come the country. Wages were already affected, and they
glees, and the auction duties, it had been said that the Lis party had supported the motion in a wey which al- over the fortunes of the classes with which they who sat believed that there was no part of the community who
expectations he had suggested had not been fulfilled. moot led him (Mr. Cobden) to infer that there was a on that (tho Opposition) side of the House were con- would not in that respect be affected. Hon. Members
He begged to say he thought that his anticipations in conceeled sting in the resolution, and that it was meant fleeted. They teund that in consequence of their di- might try to avoid the consequences of the motion, and
these matters had been to a great extent borne out, for as a retalietion for the fall in the price of certain corn- minished means they were unable to meet the charges to evade the responsibility which hung over their heads,
the abolition of the glass duties and auction duties had modities.—(iler.) lie had heard with much satisfac- which the Legislature had imposed on them, and they but they could not evade it. Na man in that House
enabled them to effect a considerable saving in their tion the speech made that evening by his Hen. Friend naturally sought relief in a legitimate way, .oft The'redue- could evade it, arid least of all those clamorous
establishmeuts. By a return made in 184 G it would be the Member for Montrose (Mr. Hume); and it certainly then of expenditure, as leading to a reduction axation, Patriots who founded institutions and societies
found that every anticipation which be had entertained appeared tri him that everything in that speech had gone was the means of relief which first suggested itself. In tor financial reform, who entered that House and pro-
had been fulfilled. He had stated that he thought the against the motion of the Hon. Member far Oxfordshire. accordance with that sentiment, they (the Opposition) Posed, in unison with those institutions, impracticable
reduction of those duties would afford a great oppor. His lion. said that the wages and the sale- had proposed and supported various propositions. They propositions, and that moment they were brought to a
tunny of diminishing the establishments which they ries of personsemployed in the public offieas were not in (the Protectionists) had been subjected to imputations pint at which they must decide upon' a definite sum,
were then obliged to keep uP. And what was the result? general excessive, while he added that those persons from Hon. Gentlemen, some of whom were so distin- levied for a particular object, fled from the test. Neither
Why, no less than 450 persons had been discontinued might be reduced i umber. But the Hon. Member for guished as to occupy seats on the Treasury bench. He the plea that the Government was in Barger, and that
in the particular departments alluded to, and a Oxfordshire had loots ight of all that, and had only pro- did not refer, of course, to those unfounded Statements wages would be affected, nor any other shadowy subter-
savine of no less than 52,0001- had been effected posed a sweeping reduction of salaries. The note Mein- which, it
an excited ta quoque, were excusable at a late fige that might suit their purpose that night, would re-
for the country. That did not show that the expecte- her and another Hon. Gentleman who followed him hour of the night in a debate. But when the Noble vent them being condemned by the general voice ofpthe
dons which he had held out were not fulfilled, That s-emed to have gone out of their way for the purpose of Lotd, because they had given votes the object and effect country.—(
Cheerte) He did not know, and he did not
the Government desired to maintain those offices alluded at aeking him or haying stated that the best mode of of which were to remove burdens from the community, care what might be the causes of the universally au,.
to for the purpo.ie of patreueeee he thought was as en- reducing the national expenditure would be by effecting charged them with the intention of breaking faith with knowledged distress which many Gentlemen had referred
tirely unfounde las it was unjust to accuse them of keep- a reduction in our armaments. The Hon. Gentleman the public creditor and destroying the finances of the to. He had his own opinion on the sele;ect. Like the
ins up the army and navy in order to find places, for the appeared to think that he (Mr. Cobden) had said that no country, he made an imputation which Was little autho. Honourable Member for Oxfordshire, he aid not sup_
younger branches of the nobility. So far from wishing reductien could b ade except in our arneame.eits. But died by facts, and had supported it by an allegation pose that it proceeded from one particular cause. He
to increase the expeates of the Treasury department, he what he had said-in 1843, and what he then repeated, which was purely imaginary—vize.that he and the gen- had no doubt that an evil BO complicated, so general,
thought every Chance
of the Exchequer would be was, that no material reduction could be made in tleman who usually acted with him had voted for the was occasioned by many causes; but he thought that it
most anxious to make as many
of
Chet ons as he could. our expenditure—no reduction such as would be repeal of the window•tax. Now he maintained that they might be traced to one predominant cause, the conss-
Having heard of the ammuut of the rein f voluntarily fhlt at the fireside of every fimily in the country un that side of the House had given no votes for the re- quantal of which were injurious, and which would be
made by the Government, and having had proof of their if that costly item, our military establishment, was mission of taxation _which et
not authorised by ultimately more than injurious.—(Hear.) But what he
de4re to carry out all fair retrenchments, he did not de_ to remain unfouched, What were the reductions the state of the public finances; neither had they given wanted to call the attention of the House and the coma-
sire to imply the sort of reflection upen them which which had been effected since he had made that any without a due consideration of the claims of the try to was this, that the result was no longer ques-
that motion would be likely to cast. He thought the stet 'meet? Why, he had found that in the year public creditor. But he admitted that their votes tioned. At first, when they talked of distrees, they
Government had given profs of their desire to reduce 1848.49 the expenses of our military establishments, bad also been guided by a duo consideration to the were told there was no distress, and that the country
every expense which might be reduced. The present including the expense of the Kafir war, had amounted claims of theirsuffering constituents. The Tory party were- was prosperous. They were now told that it Was true
motion had no reference to the salaries of great offices. to 18,700,000ie wl'i'e the whole of the estimates now charged by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman the that there was very great distress, but that it was not
He could confirm from long personal experience ell of the present year, for the army, the navy, Member for Sheffield with "nev-bern z.al for atone- occasioned by any legislative measure, but by railroads.
that had been said in justNeation and approbation of the and the ordnance, amounted to only 14,300,0001. That my." The advocacy of economy had been considered Well, he asked, who was responsible for railroads?—
conduct of those who filled the offices of Government tact, he thouht, afforded a strong justification of the by that Hon. and Learned Gentleman as something fo- (lit'ar.) Why. those great men who ought to be the
in the public department of the State. He would statement he had made in the year 1843. lie believed reign to the nature of their great political connexion. guides of the House, their tutors in political instruction,
ask the House to look to the changes which took that a considerable reduction in the national expenditure He (Mr. Disraeli) would like to know what great linen- and the guardians of the public conduct. Did they not
place with respect to those public departments. Suppose might be effected by a change in our system of pensions cial reductions had been made inthis country in modern stimulate railroads in that House?—(Cheers.) Did they
a new Government came into power, how much must and superannuation allowances. He did not see why times except by the Tory part; his
He did not take the violent step of making the attendance on
they not depend, for a certain time, on the knowledge there should be sperannuation allowance for any civil not refer to times far remote, but if Hon. Gentlemen Railway Committees compulsory, in order that no time
and experience of those who filled responsible situations servant. The case of such a person was totally would run their eye over the history of this country might be lost in forming competitive lines? Were not the
in public offices?—(Hear, hear.) Let them take the different from that of a man who had had his limbs from the period alter the independence of the United young etas of England admonished not to lose their time
case, for instance, of the late Mr. Brookbanks.—(Hear,) shattered in the military service. He did not see why States uP to the passing of the Reform Bill, they would in making speeches, but to devote their time to Railway
Did,
note very Chancellor of the Exchequer who had any civil servant who, during 30 or 40 years, had been find that every great measure of public economy and Committees? Was not that the advice of great statesmen?
ever come into office know how much he ought to rely in the receipt of a good salary, should have a claim on financial reform had been effected by the Tory party.— Well, what was the conduct of the great middle class, who
Ironical cheers.) Why, what did they do when they ought to be the governors and guides of the country?
on the experience and knowledge of a gentleman like the country for a pension during the remainder of his (
passed the Reform Bill? They destroyed that Govern- It used to be said that the time was come when England
that?—(Hear.) Let them go through all the public life. Reference had been made to the Select Committee
offices—it would be found to be rho same. An Hon. which had been appointed the other day to inquire into meat which they were now obliged to bring forward as was to be governed by a few great towns, but that
Gentleman had said that the rule now of all the public the salaries of the higher class of public officials. He had the model Government of political frugality.—(Hear, was when shares were at a premium of 150 per cent. It
offices was increased work and diminished pay. And voted for that Committee, althought it had been opposed hear.) The Right Honourable Gentleman the Member was then that it was said there should be no House of
certainly if the number of papers now passing through by his Hon. Friend the Member for Montrose. His Hon. for the University of Cambridge (Mr. Goulburn), who Lords, and the House of Commons must b© recomitructed. • '
the Treasury were compared with that c.f twenty years Friend said he did not see any use in a Committee. But was then Chancellor of the Exchequer, might look back What had been the result of the superior energy, enter-
since, it would be admitted that the duties there had he (Mr. Cobden) could not agree with him upon that upoa his career as one which was not at all common in prise, and sagecity of the great middle class, especially
more than doubled. It had been said that the officials point. The Committee of the import duties, fur which our times—a career in the course of which be had twice in the great towns of the north of England? Why, it
there did not work enough—that they did nothing his Hon. Friend himself had moved, had done more than effected a great reduction in the interest paid for the appeared that more than 100,000,000/. had not only been
at night ; and several allegations of that kind any other to carry free trade. And, agair, he believed national debt. Yet the House d just been told of lost in railroad speculations, but lost, it appeared, by
had beets made. Ile would nek the Noble Lord that the Committee on the African squadron would ulti. the new-born zeal" of the heartryy.(ier, hear.) not keeping accounts. And theta were the men who
the Secretary for Foreign Affairs whether the ser- mately lead to the removal of the African blockade. The The gentlemen who passed, or who were the creatures had been all over England denouncing the farmers, be-
vices of the gentlemen in the public departments report of a Committee might not by itself benproductive of the Reform Bill, had produced a Parliamentary Go- cause they cultivated land without keeping accounts.—
with which he was conversant were not always of any important matt
; but the evidence totsbrough before vernment which the Hon. Member fur Moetrose knew, (Laughter.) Well, what was the predominant cause of
available at all hours, and whether they had not always a Committee often influenced public opinion
cheerfully given their assistance whenever called upon material extent. He felt great regret in differing upon disasters to the country; and the Hon. Gentleman, no to support the motion of his Honourable Friend to-
by their sueeriors.—(Hear, hear.) What was the posi- that occasion from his Hon. Friend the Member for doubt, looked back with saiefaction to the time when night? He thought it was mainly occasioned by that
lion in that public department? A young man was Montrose, whose labcurs in the cause of economy no one he found more economy in an unreformed Parliament legislation of 1846 which affected the interchange of
placed there for two or three years on a small salary, could doubt or mistrust. But it appeared to him (Mr. than had ever been effected by a reformed Parliament. the most important eommod,ties between different
not calculated to meet his expenses, and ether some years Cobden) that upon that question his Hon. Friend had Those gentlemen who had received their education in countriee. (Hear, hear.) He ;had always been
of service he received an allowance of 2001. per annum. made a speech upon one side, whiie he was about to reform and financial associations, and who did not of that opinion, and he bad always expressed that
Now it was net the amount of labour which was to be vote upon the other. For his humbly objected to a ro. condescend to look into the history of their country opinion. The Noble Lord had said to the Tory
considered s 0 much as the amount of trust reposed in duction of the salaries of the class of Govern- beyond a few years back, now came forward and an- party, "If such are your opinions, why don't you brina
those parties.—(Hear, hear.) The Szcretaries of State merit clerics; he objected to the reasons given for that flounced that they could not support a motion which had forward the question ? " Gentlamen on his side of the
could not discharge their duties without entrusting most reduction; ho did not wish to ace blame cast upon fiee Public economy for its object, ascause it had originated House were quite aware of their deficiences ; they were
important state secrets to many individuals not in therms.. trade by making it the pretext for curtailing the emolu- in the new-born zeal of the Tory party I What was the often reminded of them by the eminent, honourable, he
session of more than 5001. a year.—(Hear.) It was ments of useful public officials. Heedid not wish to motion of his Hon. Friend? It was a motion might almost say illustrious persons about them ; they
not, then, the quantity of labour that was to be borne in make it appear that this country was less able at present in perfect accordance with many Parliamentary could not attempt to rival others in eloquence and pelt.
remembrance so much as the great extent of honourable than it had been before the adoption of free trade to pay precedents —in perfect accerdance with many mo- td sagacity and forethought, but at all events they •
confidence reposed in such men—(Hear, hear)—and those who were engaged in its service; he did not wish lions which had been made by Members of were not weak enough to allow their campaign to he
he thought it would be most injurious to the to see any class excluded from the benefits which free the Tory party within the last fifty years. It chalked out for them by their opponents.—(Hear, hear,
public interests of the country to undervalue or trade was, in his belief, calculated to confer; and he was much more than that: it was a motion in perfect Iv- and laughter.) However, he would tell the Noble Lord
underrate the services of those who, if they should therefore give his vote against the motion of the cordanco with the exigeacies of the times.—(llear, hear.) very candidly why they did not bring forward the ques•
had not the fortunes had at least the feelings of Hon. Member for Oxfordshire.—(Hear, hear.) That motion, however, bad encountered the anticipated lieu. They did not think it was a question to be
gentlemer. For his put, he had great ples sure in bear- Mr. HENRY DRUMMOND expressed his surprise opposition of many eminent individuate. It had been settled in the House of Commons.—(lleir, hear.)
in; his testimony to the efficiency and fidelity of those that so profound a political economist as the Honourable opposed, of course, by the Right Hon. Gentleman the They thought, that whatever the decision of the House
who filled the subordinate offices of our public service. Member for the West Riding should have referred to Chancellor of the Exchequer, who at the beginning of upon it might be, it could not be satisfactory to the
—(llear.) They were worthy of great trust. He had the case of the agricuAural labourer in the way he bad the session—only a few weeks ago—announced that country. It seemed incidental to- human nature
rims had fallen below the mark which he had autici- that wisdom was (wily to be acquired by adversity ;
heerd in other They
of means existing for acquiring done. Tile Honourable Member ought to be aware that P
a knowledge of important secrets and documeuts; but the case of the agricultural hammer was a peculiar one, pated, and who had' the hoaourable courage to confess and when the country had arrived at that pitch of suf.
he had never known an instance in this country of any because the effect of the poor-law was to prescribe for teat he trusted a rise would soon take place, but who bad ferieg which should teach it the great lesson, he
such imputation on the honour of a public man even in him a minimum of wag's below which it was impossible that night vindicated his opposition to the motion by his had no doubt the country would settle the question
the humbleet
lingo
he hear.) When he had the to go .—(Hear, hear.) The Honourable Member also researches into the books ..,f the Maryleboue Vestry, tor itself, without troubling him or the Noble Lord at
honour of filling the office of First Lord of the Trea- did not seem to be aware that the amount of wages which Proved that prices had risen. That was the must all in the matter.—(Hear, tear.) Sure he was that no
Bury, he had been allowed 300 e a year each for the F a paid to individual labourers was no criterion of the important part of toe statistical information of the Right other settlement of it would be permanently satisfactory
twee; of two private teeretaries. Of course he was emount of wages which labourer;, in general, earned. Hon. Gentleinan.—(Hear, hear.) Then came the oppe. to the couLtry.—(Hear, hear.) Whichever way the
obliged to take those gentlemen from the Treasury and In . many parishes, where sthe wages appeared statue of a still more important party—that of the Right Howe might vote, the people out of doors would be die-
he could say that if they had 10,000 L a year they could to De high, great numbers or Persons were wholly Hon. Gentleman the member for teamworth; and ter- sati,fied. Even supposing a substantive motion for the
not perform their duties with more zeal, fidelity, and unemployed, and, consequently, the amount of tainiy, as far as his observations went, they were retracing of their steps in commercial legislation were,
quite uuanawerable, because the theatre on which the as desired by tbe Noble Lord, proposed to aassemblyel
efficiency than they had done.—(Hear, hear.) Now if wges paid ought to bs considered with reference
the present motion meant anything, it meant that there oaths whole population of the district.—(Hear, hear.) Right Honourable Gentleman had played was of a lie pledged the other way, and even supposing it
ought to be a revision of the salaries of such men as It really would be satisfactory if Ministers would mired, although of a classical character—it was con- proposers would not achieve a result which, as prudent
these; and he felt bound to oppose it, because he have the kindness to declare, once and for all, whether fined to Downing-sliest. One would have supposed men, they should desire to accomplish; because it was
thought it wuuld inflict a wound on men to whom the the country had gained or lost by their measures. from the observations of the Right Honourable Gen- by slow degrees, by the salutary experience of suffer-
public were under great obligations. He admitted that To-night the House had been informed that the coun- tleman, that the subject of the motion of the lion. lug, that the various classes of the community must
in forming new establishments it was a fair con- try had not gained a farthing; whereas, at the begin- Member for Oxfordshire was to curtail the salaries of arrive at that charge which assuredly they Would )3 -
sideration to be taken into account that the prices of nines of the seseion, it was asserted that our gain those mysterious and rare individuals who were virtually and-bye arrive at.—(Heer, hear.) Before ho sat down
provisions were lower now than they had been formerly; amounted tit not less than 90,000,000/.—(Hear, hear.) the Government of the country. The Right Hon. Gen- he would make one observation which he thought the
but in considering.the case of those who had spent some Perhaps the question was an open one with the Minis- tleman had -referred tot he late Mn. Brooksbank, as if Noble Lord would do well to reflect upon before be
20 years or more in the public service, he did not think try, and they had not, yet arrived at any satisfactory con- they were about to invade the innermost sanctuary of again talked of ideas of this kind coming under the
that was a matter which ought to be taken into account elusion with respect to it. His reason for thinking it Dewniegtstreet, and to deprive gentlemen who din- read of a wildgoose chase. It seemed to be the convic-
just now. A Committee had already been appointed just and politic to reduce salaries rather than to dimi- charged responsible and important duties, and were en- time of the Noble Lord and his friends that the notion
for inquiring into the salaries of the higher class of pub- lush the number of persons employed was this:—There trusted with most important secrets, of the rewards which of a recurrence to the com
mercial system that had been
lie officers, with a view to ascertain whether or not it had taken place a general reduction of the prices of ar- th bad so dearly won. The Right Hon. Gentleman abrogated was perfectly. insensate, especially so in a
Was advisable that those salaries should be reduced, tidies of consumption—a reduction brought about not by bud argued the whole case as if they were merely deal- country where democratic sympathies so greatly pre-
Now he should state his opinion upon that subject with- any partial cause, but the result of a system in which ing with some 100,000 d or 200,000/. a year. Was that veiled as, very fortunately, they did in this country.
out any hesitation. His opinion was, that those who Ministers and gentlemen opposite were now triumph- the case? On the contrary, had not the Hon. Member Ile would remind the Noble Lord that there was a na-
filled the highest offices of the state in this country did ing.—(Hear, hear.) Man, like all animals, was grega- for Oxfordshire, in his ingenious and thoroughly trust- don, a nation not second in power even to our own great
not receive an amount of remuneration in the slightest rioue, and there were only two ways of moving grega. worthy argument, shown that they would have to deal and powerful nation, where the reaction so ridiculed had
degree greater than that—he would not say to which they rious herds—you must attract them by the clover in with an amount of not less than 7,500,0001.? Now, did actually taken place; that nation, moreover, being one
were entitledbut than that which the public interest front, or impel them by the goad behind. Now, he the observations of the Right Hon. Gentleman apply to in which the democratic influence was immensely more
required should be attached to the situations which they was for a strong government; he cared not whether that theme?—(Hear, bear.) The Right Hon. Gentleman powerful even than it was in England; he spoke oh the
held. While he entertained that opinion, he also believed it were monarchical, constitutional, republican, or any- had drawn a most interesting picture of himself, over- United States of America.—(Hear, hear.) Before the
that those who filled subordinate offices in the state were thing else.—an Governments in this coun- whelmed with the cares of state, and supported on each Noble Lord again told them that a recurrence to the cum.
at least equally entitled to consideration and protection; try bad bean strong in Pest years, by bribing the side by a private secretary—the one with 300/. a year, mercial code under which this country so long and so
and with that conviction he should vote for the motion boroughmongers—by bribing the Lord Lonsdales.--pee and the other with 150/. Now, what would have been greatly prospered was a wild phantasms, to be rejected
Which implied that the sense of the House ought not to Memberimmediately behind Mr. Drummond here uttered said it' Lord Hardinge, after one of his great victories, hy every sane man, let him reflect that the phantasm&
be taken on the PrePosal of the Hon. Member for Ox- en exclamation which caused considerable laughter.] had written home a dispatch, in which he stated that in was accepted in America.—(llear, hear.) In a House
fordshire.—(Hear, hear.) It was unfortunate that the Honourable Member should the thick of the fight he had been supported by two where there was such frequent eulogy of American in-
Mr. COBDEN said that
oftke °nlY argument he had have interrupted him in the midst of a compound sub- aides-de-camp, the one an ensign and the other a lieu- stitutions, and American conduct, and American inlet-
heard advanced in favour the motion then under their stantive.—(ek laugh.) He was saying that former Ad- tenant—that they were men in whom he had greatly Int, he might fairly expect that the admirers of Ameri-
consideration was that the salaries of public officers ministrations found it necessary to bribe the borough. trusted, and to tne faithful fulfilment of whose arduous can politics would in time also become admirers of A.me-
should be reduced' in proportion to the reduction which mongers, in order that they might be able to carry on the duties be was much indebted, that they had almost Ea- rican economies.—(Hear, hear.) lie for one was not
had of late years taken place in the Price of commodities government, and now Ministers must the bribe financial crificed, and had certainly hazarded their lives in that desirous that the great and inevitable reconstruction of
of every description. Now, if he were to admit the va- reformers for the same purpose. The great lords and great victory, but that he had a most painful feeling our commercial system on principles favourable to native
lidity of that argument, he should be a party to a ge. the arittocracty, it seemed, had a monopoly of the army, when he remembered that one of them had only 300/. industry—not to the cosmopolitan interests, so dice.,
neral reduction of wages in this country (Hear, hear) and did not want commissionerships and smaller offices; and the other only 150/. a year?—(Cries of " Oh, oh I" quently and so sincerely advocated by the Gallant
—for that would naturally be regarded as a war on but the financial reformers did want them for their friends and " Hear, hear.)' lie maintained that the cases were Colonel—should take place in any other way than in
wages, lie objected to any proposed reduction of wages and relatives—(Hear, and laughter)—aud therefore quite parallel. But ho would ask, did a young man who the United States, as the consequence, merely, of sharp
hy a BWeeping tote of that House—first, because he there would be plenty of speeches from those gentlemen desired the post of private secretary to a Minister of experience, and under the influence of popular senti-
thought it would be imPractieahle, had nest, beeause he out of doors in favour of retrenchment and economy, State look to the immediate wages be received ? No: ment.—(Cheers.)
believed that no ground had been shown fur such a ree whilst, in that House, they would vote only in favour he looked to the immediate reward cf the confidence of Lord J. RUSSELL said, that at that hour of the
duction. It had been stated by the Hon. Member fir of impracticable propositions, and when a practical ro- his chief, and to the future rewards which were open to night he would endeavour to confine himself closely to
Oxfordshire, th since the years 1828 and 1829 there position, like the present, happened to be brought for-
at him. That, therefore, was an amiable but ad captandum the motion before the House. The Hon. Member for
had been a general reduction in the prices of articles of ward, they would be all found voting with Ministers answer,which had nothing whateverea do with the motion Oxfordshire proposed an address to her Majesty for a
consumption in this country. The !lon. Gentleman had against it.— (Hear.) before the House. After the Right Hon. Gentleman revision of all the salaries in every department of the
aelealated in Yet:onion at from 23 to 25 per cent.;
and gip WOOD said, that free trade had had the happy followed the Hon. Member for the West Riding. The public service, with a view to reduction. His first objec-
t, e had argued that there ought to Lb a proportionate effect of making, not only the Hon. Member for Ox- Noble Lord the other night seemed a little angry with tion ta the motion was that it was unjust.—(Hear, hear.)
reduction in the amount of wages. But he (Mr. Cob- fordshire, but the constituents whom he so able repro- him and some of his friends for having gone into the When he moved for a Committee in a firmer session, he
den) did not see that that consequence necessarily tel. seated, economists; for a farmers' club established in same lobby with the Hon. Member for the West Riding stated that the Government had made a revision of the
lowed from those premises. There might h'aavae" bc-tea' a Oxforshire ;„I. the avowed object of maintaining agri- sail his friends. He seemed to think there was some- department of Stamps and Taxes, and that many re-
reduction in the Price of commodes in consequence cultural protection had not long since dissolved itself, thine. very dangerous in being connected with duetions had been made in that department; to the
of improvements in the mode of producing
them; the farmers declaring that the question of protection was such
allies. The Noble Lord during his varied career amount of 250,0; he stated the number of persona
ironmongery might be theeper in consequence of the at end. The present motion was not so rough and rude had had groat experience; and one would have supposed who had been reduced in thet department; and ho stated
discovery of the hot-blast, and, corn might be cheaper in its form as that proposed by the same Hon. Member he would have been the last person to find fault With likewise that with respect to offices belonging to the exe-
in consique3ce of the employment of guano and the last year, which contemplated the reduction of all salaries such " compact alliances. —(Hear, hear.) But the eutive Government a careful revision had been already
adoption of a system of efficient draiggge•—(Cries of to the extent of 10 per cent. The Right lion. Member Noble Lord need have no serious fears on the subject. made in several of them; that in the Home-o_ffihceenannielare
" Hear, hear," and " Oh, ob. e
in ',
But if the cheapness for Stamford made an excellent speech against the Hon. Those votes had already effected a salutary purpose. the Treasury very considerable reductionns d
was dwing to disheverie3 science, why, he should ask, Member's motion last session, in the course of which he. The House had that night had a frank avowal from the in the numberfh of persons amp peye d dhathat nail the
ought not the WeekiingidiaLseei! a%well as all other mem_ showed that out of 23,000 persons employed in the civil great leader of the Financial Reform Association that a other o'c were to ,esubjected 'ar reductions.
bars of the community 'e '-'e yen*"ted by their introdue- service of the Government, 20,000 had incomes under proposition of e a sweeping nature' —never mind Ws (Hear, hear) lie Was surprised, therefore, to hear the
tion? Hon. Gentlemen opposite spoke as if el classes 100/. a year. It was therefore evident that the reduce reasons—should not receive. his support.—(Hear. hear, Hon. Member for Montrose now making the statement
in the country had of late years suffered redactions in lion proposed by the Hon. Member would chiefly apply and laughter.) That was something which the Proteee that the Government refused all revision.—(Hear, beat)
their incomes. But he dented that that had been the to persons in receipt of very moderate incomes. Persons tioni,ts pad effected, and as there would necessarily be He had, moreover,
ffi recently Proposed a Committee to
cafe; lie denied that rents had been reduced.—(Haar, in the civil service of the Government were very far from great anxiety telt by her Majesty's Ministers to &Frame consider the o teal salaries of persons holding seats in
hearsj Ile debid thet asi..te and he would distinctly say that in the
antral rule there had of late being extravagantly paid. It came within his own public business, it would be gratifying to them to tind that the two.nonste.s,ofjudicial officers, and of the diPlomatie
years been a reduction 0I rcatti in Emgland, In the north knowledge that gentlemen who had started from the there was now not the slightest- fear that the " sweeping establifsb
ehdleeits readiness to do
of England he might say
.there had been fee, snots retitle- Universities with him and entered into Government motions" which used to occupy the notice book, and pro- face 0 airletheoenlretovispiroonpna!reeaandyadedffreeestaed,toantdheofctrhoewure
fari-
lion, and ho did not anticipate a reduction. But so far „ffiees in preference to professions were now, atter craetinate the termination or the session—such as the Sion g
gon",nas though no revision had taken place, was an
' n wa
thui rc eh ohf at': edomnoee
was it from being true, that a reduction of prices lines.. many years' service, in the receipt of only 2001. or 300/, motions for the repeal of taxes, the extention ohf the fraarn-
sarily led to S redlietion 4)f wages, that he main- a year. Looking at the ominous introduction of the chise, and the like—would be ever again
they
ht tioirrwufeada. usonjinasut_cihmzEPauenatdart,iwhonehaincE hilascithoefmaGraunavifetrs!et
tabled the tendency vtaS the very reverse. The re- word n wages" into the motion and arguments by which by Hon. Gentlemen opposite, because (t
duction o# lerien led td en increased demand, and it had been supported, the country WOuld look upon its tionists) had established this great political thraudth•that more.
'occa- lion of the lion. Member for Oxfordshire, made, be it
the increased de
mend produced a tendency to an adoption by the House as a declaration that wages must when a liberal motion was prosed parried.it_
prnert
revision
nailer
dntutaconhdtcohitrecrueudmtmsotas.ntcpeoss,sible extent in the
(Cheers, remarked, after the Hon. Member had heard a
advance of wages. Hon. Gentlemen opposite seemed be reduced in consequence of the adoption of free trade, atonally the chance ofT being
an
w reaping peatedly from the Government its determinatiounretO
to be ignorant of the fact that there had of late and, under these circunastances, he felt bound to vote and great laughter.) hey
years ekiated a gonefal tendency to an advance of wages ageinet the resolution.reduction.(blear, hear.) The only con-
thii eoariatiy; ffut he could say, without fear of con- Mr. DiSRAELI—There was one thing at least upon hthaed to " the new-bora zeal 'of elusion to be drawn from the Hon. Gentleman'e motio
tradiction that daring tire feeent rtahpaitdnrfe;hutltrseoafeivteheir tactics, wara' n dee
la! ns
ft suribtcanidrael,bareieentn;erirmse.
diminution of the prices which the House *and the country were agreed, notwithe financial reformers mudstelatrafuatstatalevbelnetery.y
hear.) The pro- fidence in the proposals of the IGhaotverhnemellnetd, annucletehinlal
of commodities, there had existed a tendency to an in- standing some delicately-toned dissentieut murmurs that party who for
that
crease of wanes among the very persons by whom the which had been breathed that evening, namely, that the louring to effectlt ay b'ect..--(lleart
then, was to ask the House be conceived it to be the duty cf the Government to re-
coteradditieebbad been produced. Among the operatives pressure of taxation on the country was excessive.— position of
his
whether they could not effect a retrench- sort to soccer her mode of revision.—(" Hear," from Col.
in Leicester and in Nottingham, there had of late been a (Hears hear.) From all classes of the community, from to consider
e 7,500,0001. Who doubted Sihthorp.) The Hon. and Gallant Member, with his
stieceseidn of ettikes, and an increase of wages unknown all partiee in the State, from every part of the kingdom, went with regarddi e tutß the Government said, " Leave it accustomed candour, accepted that interpretation. But
for fifty years treforee---(Hear, hear.) _How, then, could the declaration was heard that retrenchment was not only that they coui _
.0 it.„
But the Protectionists had of- the motion contained something more than this. It
Hon. Gentlemen opposite come forward and say that the desirable but necessary--(Hear.) The Hon. Member to us ;wea 11 drienjd,
it to them, and instead of accepting the would be, in his opinion, an objectionable proposition
s that the wages had taken a leading fered to leave
country was in such a state of distress ages of for the West Riding and his friends
should bet he t. They offer the Government had appointed a Committee.— did it merely extend to the Government of the day,
nereons employed by the Govermen
of reduced? part in encouraging the cry for re reric mn •
pub ,e He observed that the Chancellor of the but it further proposed to have an accurate revision of
They neifelt te well tell him that the wages the agri- announced that a vast measure of reduction of the pu ic (Hear, hea .e The Rinht pub
cheered. , Hon, Gentleman was, the salaries and wages in every department of the pu.
cultural labourefe bed been reduced.—(llear, hear.) expenditure was absolutely necessary, and,to do the Hon. Exc
bt, glad to get rid of the question by This
transferring tic service. Let him first advert to the salaries. . n
Now, he could ssaly that for the last fife years agricultn- Member for the West Riding justice, it must be admitted no dou
sibility of Minist C •
ers to a ommittee. proposal as to salaries must be taken in oonjunetao_
• different position fter the recess than the respon
roc laboiltefe ha ' been placed in aT from that, he no sooner entered the House a r rhe Chancellor of the Exchequer denied having with the motion which the Hon. Member for Oxford -
any other class of wages in tbis cournetdry.o,ed
The had, he proposed a resolution
atoeiwhichthe epithet"sweep-dfe
g cheered.] The Right Hon. Gentleman's voice was too shire made last year, in conjuction with portions of his
during the whole of that peeled,
belled thue to such a ing," which it now appe t.•
hthe Hon.i Gentleman_la
hter.) agreeable to him, it was impossible to mistake it.— speech that evening, and in conjunction, too, with
_h the
state that their wages only enabled m.to obtain a liked, was felicitously applies le.—( ear, d
an
uagnother (Laughter.) lie assured Honourable Gentlemen declaration just made by the honourable Mem-
seanty subsistence for themselves and their families. There could be no doubt, also, that amongst
We Riding who had an abstract admiration of retrench- ber for Buckinghamshire. The declaration was
That Ee ealled the elavery state of wages. He did not class with which the Hon. Member for the
par' nt but wh f'd f•h t ' th tth hd b a great reduction in the
me ~ 0 were a ral to vote or it, ta it was a ere a een
blame Hon. CidntietVern apposite for that—it had been a was not very closely connected, although be w 55
a as disa reeabl down sale- rices of the necessaries of life,
• and that there-
life,
g the last fifty years. tially so—namely, the agricultural class, there existed. ge to him as to them to cut p ortionable reduction in the
general rule in this country doling to which they nes ; but had not society arrived at such a state in fore there should be a prop , „...
When the price of food rose, the gt. .
wa ea of the agricul- sincere conviction that the public burdens
vous character. The England that they were forced to take that step? That salaries of public officers.
hear.) 'Jae would ,
tutal lettouters were raised in propor ion, and when the were subjected were of a very grie
was the cause the
was question, and that night they would be made to at once, that the reduction
..
the Government had
made
labourers were r®- stion then naturally occurred—what nterely different Principle —(Hear,
price of food fell, the wages of re que , ,
did .
were never able to of this?—how it happen that if 1184-50 a country answer it.—(Bear, —Meter, hear.) Allusion had been made to had gone on an e
d done was this:—Whenever
duced in proportion; 30 that unit ear
havin hear ) What they had they
d uantit had greatly increased, whose capital, the dreadful position of a clerk with 1001. aye g •
ptirehelse more than a certain e 9 .y of food. whose population .. I mutated whose corn- 10 or 20 per cent. taken from him; but was his position found that mores arsons were employed than were wanted
riots he maintained that, it was said, bad aurprising y emu , vice, they had
But oven itt the agricultural dist . reduced the number by
duction of money wages, merce was vast, and whose manufactures were so in- worse than that of the labourer ?—(llear, hear.) The for the public ser
d otherwise
notwithstanding some partial re was alleged) so prospering, should be lion. Member for the West Riding said be would not superannuations an to the necessary point;
the labourers and their families, had been, on the whole, genious and (as .make-re uc
d dons according
of 'and that 11 to the current price of
f life would b ' If
moderate ice
better fed since food had been sear a nst,
ashoulde combine to tell the Legislature that 'ustice because it would be a condemnation of the new necessaries o e, in ,is opinion, unfair and
et bog
in the year 1847—the boasted yhoti agricultural pros- classes in it ,
not nly grievous but intolerablei— js
stern'. He would tell the Hon. Gentleman that this new unjust to that gre.y of persons who were employed
perity.—(Hear, hear.) He said t a .
the reduced price their burdens %sere o 5'
During several years the Legislature not a condemnation of the new system; but it was one in the public service.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon.
of commodities afforded no reason whatever why the (Cheers.) ld Mem er
b for Tamworth hadsaid
esolution calling on the had been engaged in reducing that class of of the consequences of it. Its condemnation wou
House should pass a sweeping r •Its person having experience in the b • service would
pu he
which pressed moat sensibly on the come in due season.(Cheers.) But one of the resu .
1
genera reduction of the taxation I,hen he commended
Government to enter on aso highly the services of those gene
to theposition f industry. er many years past million after of the new system wee, that- they were all obliged, in
wages of labour. Let them look of springs o tleman who were permanently employed in the public
ere Hon- Gentlemensop- million of taxes had been removed from the shoulders consequence of the increased burdens of the people,
to
de artmerits.
clerks in government offices. W tr . New, P As to the comparison set up by the Hon.
clerkshat class with which the Hon. Member for the West examine the public expenditure of the coun y
posite aware of the number of those who re- oft td this Member f Buckinghamshire
or between those gentlemen
nnected.—(Hear, hear.) Nearly 9 000 000/. here was 7,500,0001. to begin with. ale wante ,
ceived salaries less in amount than the wages paid to many Riding was co . . ~ .
.He did not what and,
a generals aide-de-camp it was altogether
skilled artisans ? He found from
(Hear, hear.) aof taxation had d .
been remitted, the object of that ream- fairly to be understood out of doors.
of the Right futile. —(llear, hear.) It was these gentlemen,
civil employes themselves sion being to make the bur en of imposts more easily them to run away with the sentimentality
and sup- in thevarious de
pamphlet put forward by the permanent
he M ceber for Tamwortb,. service of the departments,
on a different question from that then
under the coast- borne by the favoured class, and when all that had been Hon. Gentlemen t e ,11 and in- who carried on the whole machinery of the gevernmerat,
of
duration of the House, that among upwards 13,000 done the Hon. .
Member for the West Riding and his pose that they were dealing with a very sulfa
hard-
ow. the chiefs of which were liable to change with every re-
Government clerks, upwards of 8,000.
_were receiving friends came to . parliament and said, "Only repeal the significant sum i d'stributed among a very
, such thing. Ile estimated volution of opinion in or out of the House. It was esee
and we will beat the world." Well, the corn- working`men. They were no
under 100/. a year.— (Hear, hear.) Did Hon. Gentle- oorn-laws would probably lead to a sential to the public service to have men of such expo-
of those clerks laws werere ealed, but the world was notyet vanquished. that _the motion, if carried,
men opposit® propose that the salaries _
r This being the state of affairs, the lion. saving ni 1,0,90,0004 per a.
should be reduced? (l hear.) He agreed with —(Chee s.)on their conduct would
judgment UP departments; and he venture to say that were the
ot the Member for the West Riding, and his friends, who, out those who would forma.
those who thought that among a large proportion h t important questi
• h regard to t tf on were present Government to go out of office in consequence
civil servants of the Goner the salaries were not of doors were proud of being thoughththe leaders of What !het night wit
ed ti nof ex- hard-w rking men, who were suffering hardly. The of any vote of the House or other circumstance, and
excessively high. He also thought that the would have they called a new m. ovement for t e_
themselves
ue o
in the House m°llit not be permitted to ride off from the come- lion. Gentlemen opposite were to succeed them, they
a better chance of reducing their expenditure by dual- penditure and taxation, had conducted ' Tote upon the sentimental (Inception of would not be in office a =single day before they
Wishing the number of the public servants than by cur. HOUBO that evening as if they were so many Chancellors (maces of their To
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