The Sun.
London, England, 1850-02-22 00:00:00

RAILWAY AUDIT.

Mr. STANFORD gave notice that on an early day he
should wove fur leave to bring in a Bill fur the better
audit of railway accounts.
CHANNEL ISLANDS.

Mr. HUME rose to ask Sir George Grey, whether
the, Government had decided upon carrying out the
recommendations of the Commissioners for alteration of
the criminal law, and the mode of its administration, in
Jersey; and, if so, whether by Bill in Parliament or an
order in Council ?

Sir G. GREY said that the Government intended to
introduce some reform, but the scheme which had been
forwarded by the Commissioners bad been remitted back
t 3 them as not being altogether calculated for the
purpose.
In reply to Mr. HUME,
Sir G. GREY said the Government would have no
objection to lay the papers before the House.

SALVAGE MONEY.
Mr. STAFFORD wished to know whether the atten-
tion of the Admiralty had been directed to a circum-
stance :which had lately come to his knowledge
relative to a vessel that wag driven upon the west
coast of Ireland in a state of distress, but was saved
from destruction by a few fishermen. It appeared that
these fishermen had 8001. awarded to them tor salvage
money, but, in fact, only received lio/., the remaining
690/. being required to satisfy the Court.
Sir T. BARING said be bad not received any infor-
mation on the subject, but would institute inquiries as to
the truth of the statement.
LAW OF REMOVAL AND SETTLEMENT.

In reply to Mr. STUART WORTLEY,
Sir G. GREY said a Bill on the subject of the law of
removal and settlement was still under the consideration
of the Government, but they could give no assurance
that it would be introduced into the House this session.
DEATHS FROM STARVATION IN IRELAND.
Mr. P. SCOPE wished to know whether the Govern-
ment had received any information as to two inquests
which had been held in an union in Sligo upon the bodies
of two children, in which the verdicts were death from
stariatioo?
Sir WILLIAM SOMERVILLE was sorry he
could not give a satisfactiry answer to the question of
his Hon. Friend, but if his Hon. Friend would furnish
him with the facts of the case he would write to Ireland
and obtain the information fJr him.

COUNTY FINANCIAL BOARDS.
Mr. M. GIBSON presented a petition praying for the
establishment of county financial boards.

THE- FRANCHISE.
Mr. BRIGHT presented a petition from Mr. Charles
Hastem, residing at a place in Lancashire, complaining
that although he rented a house at ten pounds a year,
and paid a!I rates and taxe?, he was shut out from the
franchise, and praying f )1. an extension of the suffrage.

SE-AVE TRADE.
Sir E. BUXTON presented a petition from the county
of Cornwall, in the island of Jamaica, praying the House

•
to exclude Vie p7oeuce of slave-eneouraging
states from
British markets.
JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Dm
Mr. M. MII,M4:S obtained leave to bring in •""-
for the correction and reformation of juvenile offenders,
and the prevention of juvenile offences.
ECCLESIASTICAL COMMISSION.
Sir MONTAGUE CHOLMELEY said he had
sues
tended to have asked leave this evening to bring
a Bill to enable the Ecclesiastical Commissioners,
and ecclesiastical bodies, sole and corporate, lessors
of estates held for a term of years or on lirese
to commute their interest therein for an
annusi
rent charge (either fixed money payment or corn rent):
and to appropriate, at their discretion, the whole or a part
e
of such payment, for the augmentation of the livings at
the parish us which such estate is situated. Since, however,
he had given notice of his intention, he hadleen the rr
port of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners, in which certa.tn
recommendations were made to the Government, on Or,
matters which the Bill he contemplated embraced. II
the Government intended to bring in any Bill this St:
sion, founded on those recommendations, he (Sir M.
Cholmeley) would rather leave the subject in the haunt
of the Government, who were much more capable of
handling it than he was; and, if such was their intone
tion, he would withdraw the motion. it in
Sir GEORGE GREY said the Government had
contemplation to bring in a Bill partly founded on the
recommendations of the Ecclesiastical Commission
q;
and which ho thought would embrace the objects a tz
Hon. Member's motion.
AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS.—ADJOURNED
DEBATE. Several
Mr. DISRAELI presented petitions from
places in Buckinghamshire, praying that the petitione.er_
might be placed in the same favourable position as tn
rest of their fellowesubjeAs.
The orders of the day were then proceeded to, when%
Mr. A. STAFFORD said that ne had been exee.et_l,
ivr
ingly pleased in finding that the Ministry of the day hay
not refused their sanction to the complaint "t 1
had been made respecting distress in the agricultun;
diiaricts. Still more was he pleased when he ora"
that the two questions which had forced thernseldr
upon the public mind—namely, the existence of the te
tress and the continuance of it—had been publicly r!
cognised by the men in power. The existence odue:
distress was not denied, and the necessity for its ref
tb,
lion Lai been acknowledged by the Chancellor o
Exchequer.—(dear, hear.) That Right Honourable
t
Gentleman had declared that the only relief that be
could be obtained by the agricultural classes could
derived from no other source than a rise in Prnse
He thought that the Right Hon. Gentleman 0143°514
on ed them some explanation, at least of the advoc d
stage at which cheapness ceased to be a blessing ate.
becomes a curse. He had charged this side of the.
with deceiving the farmers by holding out de-
House,
lusive hopes to them of a return to protection.
will
thought that such an accusation came wld
a very ill grace from Gentlemen on that sit,
when they were for the healing up the faun
wounds, by foretellieg a '_rise in prices; kern gent le
men who were in the habit of valuing everything
re
its cheapness, it was something new to hear thew qb,
telling prosperity in consequence of a rise in prices., I.
Right Honourable Baronet had taunted his, l'°d
Friend with not introducing the subject of the ialdr,
settlement into his resolutions, but hi. Hon. Friend k,
Disraeli) was quite willing, if the House wenth,'.llbe
Committee, to adopt any resolution which teig"" je.
sett
thrown out with reference to the law of
ment, but he must remind the House that ausiii
alteration which might result in their statistics wo.te•
rather astonish Honourable Gentlemen 02P°6106
He must say, and be did so with great regret, et
when the Secretary fur the Rome Department brag':
forward the small number of paupers in thousli-
cultural districts as an argument vvlsy no ee the
etion should be given to the claims °4ferelf
landed interest, he, in his high position, : a
very poor inducement to the emplaYeafah at
labour in those districts to continue the system WI" d,
great inconvenience to themselves, they he t
al continue
heir
in order to diminish the amount of pauperism in gin
spectiva Fetishes. He certainly could not itnalio..
that they gave an °pp: tunity to an officer of the
that
vernment by making those exertions to say
tohietyhairdiasieininatit:.e—d(HtheaemroselTvehsey tohad
beenthe aseopna:
iedde rt
es tbti°b;
competition of the whole world, and hail been told that
it was to the interest of every one to buy in the cheap
market and to sell in the dearest; and when they
came distressed in certain districts, by acting °II to
principles laid down by the Legislature, and by tryingto
get the commodity of labour in the cheapest enarht3scl
Right Ron. Gentleman (Sir George Grey) sj„-eed
wholly oblivious to those great principles, and denial.
that wages bed been unduly reduced. That Big"
e" t to
Gentleman had, in feet, conceded the whole argail the
them, and ho thought, after the statement made Jd be
Hon. Member for Surrey the ether night
the clang-co be vrtnieeroell
convinced of his inconeistency, it not of o)
nature of the principles be advocated.—(Rear'7,oo
The Right Hon. Gentleman said the criminal ie;--the
were highly favourable, and quoted a charge the
Learned Recorder, in which mention was made, g° 9 as
extent of crime prevailing in the metropolis in •
compared with 1848, and showing that there had ~""eeeert
large decrease in the former years. He doubted, 11% cow
whether the Leaned Recorder would draw the sag bad,
elusion from this which the Right Hon. Gentietint:iminal
for in 1848 the Chartist disturbances made the eh` "e„,......
offences higher than they otherwise would have unet
ioto
ha(lilsedahra,
andearw.)hiaßhut
sahoSweecdtehahretivaranreabsaed been P" thin
tihne elcBr4esasethein rater for
county of Dumfries, which repres(lll4 d to
unte
e bed t&
232/. les w prcorpieley.
sltotl'enwaosnlya
tolr,:ntd that
~ tole the amount stolen in 184 e r-a •eht to
8.5/. Now, if the Right Hon. Baronet had aArit'light
draw conclusions from one return, surely he ha
°e ale 13s-.
to do the same from another; and the Right .14°,tice
react ought to see, from this, how very little! tteste
can bear upon the real merits of the case. cie9tert
hear.) 'The Honourable A; ember for Mann the
following the Bight Honourable Baronet, quoted
and
criminal returns for 1836 at 20,000 as the lowe6t,,‘oo
for 1847 at the highest, but the Hon. Gentleman shivoe
have remembered,
a stringentmemberctcl,wheanorch-aw
he did, so, that in tree
weitt hc
white 47
trade was in full operation, and anYlB tbat
elusion, therefore, was to be drawn from
it was one that would mileaee against his
(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Genaernang:lso told thorn
tbaE
when corn became remunerative crime increased, and 0
they were to draw anything from that argument' it.: t
simply that corn ought not to be grown at all excee-
adopted a tone which he (Mr. Stafford
a loss. The Hon. Member for Manchester T esdaYlaifig-
)onmasut
so,
Mena.
bers intended it to be the charmer's voice to lure Hon. 31:,),.0.
bers to vote with him, was the most extraordinary e-
duction he had ever heard. Whatever professions of sYnle.
patty might bo shown on the Ministerial side of the
House towards the sufferings of the agriculturafr
class, the Hoe. Member for Manchester did net disguise
that he cordially hated the agriculturists.—(Laughter')
He (Mr. Stafford) firmly believed the Hon. Member
hated them both individually and as a class. When t!3.0,,
Hon. Member said he was not the farmers' friend, P"
could understand from the cheers which that erf
pression elicited on that (the Protectionist) side
the House, how cordially they believed him.—(Cheer6l
But he (Mr. Stafford) would like to know whose frientg
the Hon. Member for Manchester was? How an„gb-oi
ought the Hon. Member to be with every 0311/ e-ci av
wished untaxed windows in his house, and who wa%uld.
repeal of the duty on paper. lie (Mr. Stafford)-foe-
charge the Hon. Member for Manchester wit id po-
getting now what he formerly said of the agricultur
pulation, when he designated them a hard-workinVitteo
If there had been any objection to going into Corn ibe
it must have been entirely removed by the speech be
Member fur East Lothian, who speaks so well "'"Tek.o
does speak that the whole House regretted that first or
so seldom.—(Hear, hear.) This was not the tlfoe
second time that this' subject had been broil
the notice of the House and the public. Ricardo.
culloch, and all the writers on political econorq;_ eige
unceasingly urged it, and the result of their inquier
esoPor
been that a fixed duty of from sa. to Bs. would be thhear)
sufficient protection for the agriculturist.—(flear'uld es
To this he would adduce an authority which Yr: _boo
there unquestionable. It was the evidence of on t.wo wee
word was always repeated in that House, and w2i'otion.
still a Member of that House. It was a coterou,.. wet a
brought 1460.,
which bore the date of the 22d January, 1846. e Veember
communication of the Right Hon. Baronet th Aretraot
for Tamworth. The Hon. Member then read an "there
that be
from a speech of Sir Robert Peel, to show he to
were peculiar burdens on land which 01.4 egteon.
.oene _a
compensated by some remission of fiscal endow
He was astonished that the Right Hon. Ge, tbil4
should have recourse to so poor an artifice cod
When his Hon. Friend (Mr.: Disraeli) introu,': oln
extensive measure the Hon. Gentleman aura it leer
was so gigantic a measure that he could not of la"'
When his Hon. Friend brought in a ineioulf.d:' ,414.
extent then the Right Hon. Baronet
sake ji)
it is only fourpence an acre, why be Rigs
e 6
t.
much talk about that ?" All that the P"a",,e
Stafford) could draw was the inference that iustics
i 7
Hon. Gentleman was at heart convinced of the
their claims, and as he had nothing better °foe the
condescended to artifices so poor as thoesee se 03ae"
Right Hon. Baronet had said, now that ali texe he tfaS
tp
ings were over of which they had heard so nitlehr'etern
glad to find that he had given up all idea of a'
eetiegae".
protection. True it was there had been those ratilwea
not stirred up by the landlords, as Hon- GI they were
posits, said, but by tenant-farmers—at which oteetira
asked to do their best to return to a ~103 gong'
system. On their first entering into t" defeated
they had introduced the subject, and had h, seel:he theme
by a large majority, and as they did not Wii_silbati ao-
ng
to descend to the level of a common eata shape'
eiety, they had introduced it in the pr lot bee.:• '
Now, what they said was, that the questil nvaeu that the
settled, and he began most strongly to bpi 'were of ,fobn
Noble Lord and the Gentleman opeete
d the asset t
same opinion. It had been declared, a
had not free trade in land. They s,aild'nd foi pleitV
had' never been controverted, that the,
right to deal with the commodity of
nted raY des'jeol
but you have tied our hands, and prefvere
until you roe
with my produce as I like, and thereleos,
1:ovr earl pee
with this question on your own princip
one
merely ovf
pounce it settled?" The question s
a not
notnestinntil„ge
diency, as it always ought to be, andbed the n-Mauch-egter
mere rule, which they could not or
_r for
to carry out. The Hon. M ne
COe3llllcl
not appeal
(Mr. Gibson) said he eepeat
rokte
00,a0 of brad 50 0
how they could make out
that be , with an
the House, and observed
store for d the
wag
oriebuistyli
during the present session, viz., the a h ward to !he lased
t Pas
Tenants' Compensation Bill. b that I
expression]dou ht about
tthhaeti their
here character,
were
two
at
tote
etcao_ui_ompl coupled
to
rn lite;
d .964
through the House last . trOdgQe- -
Bill ho would remind Hon. Aron e with soarceif
division, and when it had been re-1n

%)

Slot,
fr the only observation made upon it came.
1,"„n1 th. Honourable Member for Occkermoutn
entees,l-sf°,n.oura.ble Geoutionasn had total pi,-eitehce-
,l,oll ee thee. proce 'times on the gamceaess
a(1,1" now relt the House just to see bow the Her.
the ul-tein hiresslf hrel deah with that question durnlg
Lo
list five }ear lie found that in March, 1845,. the
°D. GP had given notice for a Cominthee
^lithe ,
the ',I-nine-laws, arid in obedience to a suggestion of
Who t'lghf Hon. Baronet the Member for Temworth,
nlitteasthen at the head of al, Government, the Coal-
4nd tl; VC"
appointed. The Committee sat till July,
ge°tirecommended its re•appuirdant; but. the lion.
ten "man the Member f Manchester had in the mean-
atlcie either found his thirst cool or his difficulties increase,
tiehe never reevsd for the to appointment of the Coin-
,n'tet' during 18,16 or 1847. In February, 181 S,
.he
!eettintned 1.4 inquire', of the lion. Gen:leuaan what his In-
tel e as, and his answer was. that hoe,
the 'n eagased in the cousidsration I growth of cotton in Indie. That might hove been
ifneci'lilet ay teplenation ; bet at all events, offer so
tailed conideration, he eoped the floe. Getirlsmin hae
that question. In March, 1848, the Hon. Gen-
an raw. (1 fur le to bring in a Bill,
Iluusati innendineut ssw-as. propoeed that the
should adjourn, which was carried, and
e naysteriou dist peat e I, and it had net been
b°4l'l.of.'inBP• Nov;,-) his Pllon. Friend the Member f
*poi
Lath' • 're, not making such great professions,, had
4,4te.ileterval brought in a practical amendment o, the
ite,„(tws brought
was carried, and had since been. found
sere to
exceedingly well.—(Hear, hear.) So that if they
the: to go by that test, the Hon. Member for Man-
ile-„•traold come off very poorly indeed.—(Hear, hear.?
(ate 47 came to a subject on which the Secretary of
the eer thu home Department had compleine t
etober for Buckinghamshire had touched butg.
1140,lightl3; tae Was sorry the Right Honourable Gee-
nad so closely fellovved the example of the
410ts-"rable MeMber far Buckinghamshire. Anything
-„B3,eagre niggard than his allusions to Ireland,..
eh "I\r• Stafford) had never heard.—(Protectionist
Iltterisd.' it would be his painful duty to enlighten the
e:11 the state of Ireland—at all events, on that.
iy with which he was intimately connected—in
tßtia der tnat the Irish Members who intended to
local
til4lBf any reconsideration of the poor-laws and
ti otl real property should be able to get up in the
thous: "(1 6.3? vela th believed the present state o
kick a°llairY shoyuld eycontinue.—(Hear, hear. lie
ttssienthe establishment charges in Ireland
4,00„'; to 289,0001 He took the law expenses at about
the
41
* rate at 41,0001.; and
.4•111.
e collectors' poundage
Bend ration of justice at about 55,0001. He prboe-
kis flu. addition to that, that 90,0001. should
emigration ; 490,0001. was the amount
eh h aeon
:ft
alien.
Proposed to be granted to Ireltan_ d..
-;3111, C otopl, tely satisfy them of the truth o his
would then read to them the commu-
°,ttie highly respectable Roman Catholic mole-
'isa',"°,,Whose word they might place the utmost
fer' the Hon. Gentleman then read the letter,.
i4lh taTi°4liB his statement it appeared. that in a parish
f'r which he had acted . as clerk,
wad off the applications for relief which
edetermined to reCuse—fo
r it was a di-
i'hur.leSsnd°ie'dthe Poor-law Board to deny all relief to
167°,8elieu' Paupers—the consequence_ had been that
to t the union the relief had been reduced from
120- 120 e
ael 0 week. Through that regulation upwards
old bodied labourers had been put on the list.
xt passcounty to the of Limerick, whence
4 guard. 'Anions had been forwarded from the board
te•
hilterse 418 to the Noble Lord at the head of the
;" tlee:, in which the idea that pauperism was on
1;441'118e was filly refuted. Ile would ask the
rya
11°11. Gentleman the Secretary for Irelandd w
,4r4tener received in'ormation from Ireland, whether
armedB of Limerick had not been paraded' by bands
liji'P;, °lens whose' cry was, "Bread or Blood !" and
e' been hom, not only. the police but the military
T 6 llo~Pued out. This rule of the House refused
b Cevereistal to be separated from this question.
av:i'd that Ireland, once injured by an Eng-
-er° of monopoly, was now suffering :qua ly
mote of free trade—equally a victim, though
Qstoitie 110501,, but yet not less noxious, system.
ke'" '4°n. Gentlemen opposite, that the question
0 try too momentous to be decided by a single
qicr; and that they should continue,
1115:11 14-.4 their power, to try and save themselvesasiar
;4it lairi friends, if friends they could be calledha,fte;
S;/ :I,,age at public meetings.—(llet.ir, oar.
:,,,Plis°„ltle still continue to contend that immediate
i,tl:4-I.(4lglit not to be the sole rule which ought. to
1itt",4410-:4tkegislature ; that with kingdoms, as with in-
Oase. " Cheapest bargain often proved the dearest
tBtes 80c1 that a Legislature which only considered
Vteat-4ts of consumers did not deserve thatlleelairo
beiges: Which they ought to possess.
I;Blsy,.."ed that they were an increasing party in the
4,141, ent Perty not pledged to this or thatiesport
tl'toNt',,"„e'PlY, and he truste I irrevocably, pledged to
nnd comprehensive policy which had con-
rlt resources of this groat nation.—(Cheers.) _
asttfetis and Sir J. GRAHAM, at the conclusion of
elediatel:44's Gentleman's speech, rose together,, an
call: re were calls for each. The Speaker,
ti,,it'trn;eedaitleyd,tlPon Sir James Graham, and Sir Robert
skt: Jtemee'elY gave way-
!le,lt Iv h,4z 13 GRAHAM then proceeded to observe
ill L 4 ti,4-147'th great diffidence that he intruded himself
las"tet:e`4°use, but if it should be the p:easure ofsi the
14 '4 -eat. his Right Honourable Friend the ern-
linefeh Bfiesvorth, then he wonid at once give way.—
etailia) was not aware that it was the inten-
Van Right Honourable Friend to offer any ob. -
kkeN t 4 the 'louse at that hour, arid it was only in
)(a. be' to the call of the Speaker that he
-ea _
risen a second time.—(Hear, hear.)
thought it most desirable that
ythey should '
it 41 the 'll' as possible the precise subject
,t 1 %Ili were to discuss,. and, therefore,
'ts biles 441 follow the Honourable Gentleman who
,41„k1A,„ aat down into the game-laws, t e
!It,As Bill, and much less should he dis-
Vitteetstien of landlord and tenant in the question
'i'boe: which was more germane to the matter they
'isP,tan,„ t° debate.—(Hear.) agreed with the Hon,
ill 1.1011: that the question lthey
ie
badto discuss was a
In &e n°. If he thought it was to be narrowed
"ti,ge limits of the motion introduced
Itt:c1111 'Onotirehl Member for .Buckinghamshire
NtB.otdin"ajavv:.l beta et fecctly willing to rest his vote on
Right Hon. Baronet the
rk, 7, f speech theof
ith „tae for the Home Department.—(Cheers.)
4te,,Satitv'gard to the landed proprietors of Ireland,..
114 I th'e !`) lays that he was not deficient: in ad-
qtilhis tnterests of that country as much as he pos-
even at the sacrifice of his own; because
Mei% that the maxim of the preference of the good
'tt `4e4el should always acted upon. lie looked
Sillei°Rh'st4iB or this question as too narrow. for the oh-
:t Chat theuY the Hoe. Mover (Mr. Disraeli); yet he
1,,,1e,.! same time say, that he believed. that thisthe
►of",",,t)f a series of questions, all tending to
f;"l,e Past policy of the country, fir he con-
,tt et (h.; ,e Past
only a fragment of that large measure
f
sell bat Disraeli) proposed lest year. He was o
101 the Ho Mover intended to transfer to the
t/I‘4"tl Pund n'
not elafey ,only the poor-rate, hut the.
la tit t• the highway-rate; for ho (Mr. Disraeli)
tyl,,N.ty,,ti' the sake cf argument, ho would bring
ander the consideration of the House,
tt Ogaetthe would also present to the notice
tf 1(1 1' a. very important subject, the malt-
-0 the u m of 20,000,000/, tri,be trans-
*nn Itted-tax about to become a subject
Ci.S°ll 4°ll, Which he look° upon
kinf hr 7 r t importance, for it involveads the
hiii_tlet:ettinootti-A°4tiPtua.tsget'le.tapaorsicya of, this country, and would
question. of change with re-
00r ministration. This was plainly intelli-
10b tesy from the speech of the H.ou. Mover, but
OtOtit 'Peeeh of a Noble Duke in another. place
It et hie
y ys of h. hdlond), for that Noble Duke saidthoat.
Party was to throw not the present G.
'lll-ciidstiti!o dissolve Parliament, for purposes which
h,144:al es-" ails but which he believed would not ble
Vestk's Would be impossihle, considering the,
10 7 top ris of the great mass of the !lettere
lo hfbgaaevae-
iPse,,,tyc'tectionists' principles, as such wotru
tstitVfli "4 of the past policy of the country. t, ttt . He
fot7ik(Ce (tiht woUld better become those ono3u.rable.
itosseria,--0 Protectionists) that they should openly
siejnYale,;aelitiOns, than to be thus maskingf them;
Itti!tel4 Of th" that they could as well move for the re:
4'4/4 l'etZ,°Pinion of the House without a Com.
Ikkt'r attiVt, and he therefore did not see the requt-
a, motion. He would next rt for to the
flaNs' Lem', eloquent speech of the Hon. Member
(Nt;"18f1 (air Charteris); but he should say.
1):11:1 ''eh *
Nat j• the itrteris) seemed to
ps''lte'Llttftfrei BPeech of the Hon. Member (Mr. Dis:
'v I'4 I) 3g to the establishment charges, there ap i,t11% 1m 0 ha
- re►ea toespect of them a want of due control,
ter, "leLtee clangorous and prodigal expenditure.
bra Idsaipintraericement of a series of transfers, and
ypl c4",t11-„!esny,,8110111(1 be violated, it would lead to den-
orliy:u with the Hon. Member for East Lo-
la k 8 Whit question could on'ly be settled on prin-
Cfl:tine °NO3:I and justice, and that the burdens which
lekt es to remove were quite insignificant if the
kdllltettr.) 4'4 settled on those great principles.-
111P1sr.h8d vette could not deny that recent legislative
Las 'tee, an 4ected the lauded interest to a consider-
eh:44l'4l4,4 itoPeied upon it difficulty and distress;
'4'-'l,yet—ekivert agree with the Hon. Member for
N,,14 thek 1,-4t (lir. Disraeli), when he said that with
4111 ‘ttleat:urthens which it was proposed to remove,
Let' far Wspe feria'
ye whether the benefit to be con-
-Ittat4oBeta liven to the landlord or the to
silliOtiejeeffher did he think that the tenaetd-
thae*tet Tit:Rtee hi that opinion.—(Hear, hear,
darit
Piet
cle:reßiebt Lion. Baronet then proceede
in
10 (Offaly., a'e of 15 per cent. had taken a
Ire a,: the agricultural districts. In Scotland,
es op Or excellent management of the poor, the
tQll4Bset4Pletts had diminished.—(Hear.) "The gees:
BoPs4Betisietem'yylf. would they consent to a reversal
140I'seet t„sTicy in respect to taxation, and would
lir 18erty Ptece a large portion or the burdens of
41'4 ht,y titt°ll those article, of primary necessity from
Lbw's chose
tNow, to that ques-
'il was not h • itx' ? that
aqui esthete te pronounce the opinion
tta,'Rhs erNitity or, justice in such a proposition.
i •alo 'e Rouge
kiD '01!:a ti had would agree with him that inch-
‘tys4alll,4
4relend4retteen carried to
.demonstration beyond
kai'•t,, tre,
.s „
°et% 'since the income- ex had been
411,4,e,0rt, reduction had taken place ; that text,
lee " ill, i ts?l, and when it came to be re none 1441%11,444 n hie opinion, be the proper time to ad-
spht 'lB tifl and there were burdens
fote°noes,Zeyttailily required to be relieved. The
~,1111,1111°11 sshie, 'o Baronet having alluded to the de-
-414e1et4,,s
t;,l,,,,intif,ellowed in the currency, consequent
tlithee se letie,':ll in 1819, and which the country
uha
heed'feud said they would now, by the
kee dice' 'n'ish tWee making, `gfie '.ulsy,o fall into a not
k•
121 bet and enumerated eleven articles,
bricks, butter, cheese, soar, tes,

coffee, sugar, currants, and raisins, which enter so much
into the comforts and necessities of the poor; and asked
the House if it was going to again impose heavy burdens
on those articles fur the t enefit of real property.—( Hear.)
Then there were a -Few other articles which he would call
the poor inan's li ixuries—those narcotics in which he
sought a short obliviousness of his cares, and which com-
prised tolaeco, spirits, and beer—and were they, he
would ask, pi eparc d to impose heaver restrictions on the
use of those luxu.7ces of the pcor? Would there, he
would ask, be either equity or justice in transferring the
burdens cf the land( al interest to those articles? The
Right Honourable :Baronet then referred the attention
of the House to w hat might be done by the landed
interest to alleviate their own burdens, by the applica-
tion of science in, the cultiva'ion of their estates,

and by great care in the management of them, end
instanced his own t state as an example on this subject.
By care, and by ere at attention, and by the application
of science, he had succeeded in reducing the local
burdens to which he ; estate was subject, and in making
his tenantry compel atively comfor t Alla. With e;pact
to bricks and timber , he showed, as tegarded the landed
interest and the pub; tic in genera!, the great injustice of
levying and keeping up a tax on these articles, operating
as the impost did against all improvements, and he
should certainly like to see the existing tax entirely re •
moved front them. lie though'. that the House, in any
course which it wigi it take in the adjustment of the
burdens, ought not lose sight of the int crests of the
poor; and while tie .se who were in favour of the recent
legislative changes h. ad the gnat body r f the community
we h them, he felt :that they were strong, and had no-
thing to fear; and to those who would return to the for-
mer s; stem of re! traction, and had not the community
with them, he woued say, they were weak and powerless,
and bad no chance of a return to that system.—(flear.)
Speaking from cep mience, he could state that in his im-
mediate neighbourhood there had not been any reduction of
wages. The furmerte and employers of labour had nut
reduced the remune ration for employment; and all the
articles of first necessity being cheap, he never recol-
lested on his own estate so much happiness and content-
ment among the wor king classes. Alluding to a remark
made the other even] ing by his Honourable Friend the
Member for Surrey, respecting the manufacturing and
commercial classes— a remark that he had heard with
deep regret—the Rig lit Honourable Baronet said that it
was his most anxic us wish and desire that all classes
should be united, wed the policy he had ever adopted he
believed in his heart. and conscience to be that which was
best calculated to p remote that end. If they looked to
the city of Glasgow, which was next in importance to
the metropolis, the y would find, on the authority of the
sanitary report of t he town council, that that city, which
last year had been d risited by an epidemic, was now free
from that afflictions, trade and confidence was restored,
money was cheap a nd provisions low, the merchants and
the manufacturers were full of hope, feel the workmen
fall of employment. —(Hear, hear.) He knew how dan-
gerous it was to deal in prophesy in that House, but
still he coefelently declared his belief that, when the
revenue of the coun try had improved, when the com-
mercial and manufeet uring classes were prosparing,when
property was improving in value, the owners and occu-
piers of the soil wool I not long remain the only class
subjected to suffering .—(Hear, are Having thanked
the House for the ind ulgeace accorded to him while he
had so long trespasses, i on its time, the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman concluded by stating that for reasons assigned—
reasons which he bet; eved to be conclusive—he should
vote against advancic g one step towards the considera-
tion of the motion pt oposed by the Honourable Gentle-
man below him, and to give the proposition at the outset
his decided oppositime—(Ceeers.)
Mr. GLADSTONE said that, concurring with kis
Right Hon. Friend he the general opinions he had ex-
pressed with regard e the effect of the recent commer-
cial policy, having vet ted with him since the advent of
the present Govern= ‘nt to power on every question of
importance iffectine- t oth the trade and internal economy
of the country, anceet taching the greatest weight to his
authority, even ine ee endently of the ability with which
he had enforced his arguments, he felt it incumbent
on him to state briefly the reasons which actuated
him for the vets he intended giving, inasmuch
as that vote would be different from the vote of his
Right Hon. Friend.—(Cheers from the Protectionist
benches.) The Rig be Honourable Gentleman wished to
impress the House erith the conviction that they were
not really canvassing; the details of the proposition of
the Honourable namber Buckinghamshire, but a
change ef Aetrinistrastion, the transfer of eighteen millions
to the Consolidated Fund, and the reversal of free-trade
policy. Now, in the vote which he was about to give,
he confessed he could. not see any of those things. With
respect to the charge of Administration, he should say
that even such a contingency should not exercise any
paramount influence in the determination of a claim
which was viewed as a claim of justice on the part of a
great portion of their fellow-subjects. But, if he un-
derstood the Right Ho nourable Geatleman the Secretary
f e. the Home Department, that was not the ground taken
by the Government, fees be had told them that when the
financial statement of the Chancellor of the Exchequer
was moved they could I then consider the points of the
Hon. Member for Beckinghamshire's proposition, and
that those who now voted against it could, if they saw
reason for changing t heir opinions, then vote its adop-
tion. This showed pre tty clearly that the question was
not one for change of Administration. Then with re-
gard to the alleged re: ult of transferring eighteen mil-
lions to the Consolidaead Fund. He met that statement,
firstly, by disputing its, accuracy; and in the next place,
by maintaining that, irrespective of all threatened ulte-
rior measures, they should consider the proposal of the
Hon. Member for Bet ckinghamshire on its merits, and
not withhold that which was just and reasonable because
the motion might be f )flowed by that which was unjust
and unreasonable.—(hear.) With regard to the Right
lion. Gentleman's statement that the adoption of the
proposition would be :a reversal of free-trade policy, he
wished to state distinct ly that if—
Sir JAMES GRAB AM interrupted his Right Hon.
Friend for the purpose of assuring him that ht+ had not
made any such statement, or at least, if he had done so,
it did not express the sentiment he intended to convey.
What he wished to tke understood as having stated was,
that he considered tb e proposition would lead to a re-
versal of the relief now afforded to the labouring classes.

Mr. GLADSTONE rejoiced at the explanation, and
felt happy that an acci dental expression had misrepre-
sented the opinion of his Rie,ht Hon. Friend. His views
of the Hon. MemberN motion were so weak, after the
gigantic picture drawn by his Right Hon. Friend, that
he telt almost ashamed to occupy the attention of the
House, but he desired it to be understood that in sup-
porting the proposition for a Committee he did not
in any way intend to deliver up his discretion to any
specific proposal, nor to bind that discretion with
respect to the terms LeC the three resolutions which the
Hon. Member fur Buckinghamshire had announced,
nor to any ulterior measures which in his judg-
ment ho might subsequently bring forward.—(Hear,
hear.) He meant simply to pledge himself to this ex-
tent, that presuming tb ere were portions of the charges
of poor-rate and county-rates, which might be trans-
ferred to the Consoli dated Fund without abandoning the
advantages of local legislation, he was willing to go into
Committee for the purpose of considering and deter-
mining which of those charges might with advantage,
and a due regard to the great principle of local control,
be transferred to thee Consolidated Fund. There was,
in his opinion, direct connexion between the motion and
their commercial policy, and he considered that its
favourable consideration would have a tendency to
weaken the agitation for a restoration of protection.
He supported the mot ion on the very ground which his
Right Hon. Friend intended opposing it, namely, on the
principle of justice. It was impossible to look at the
tax levied for the support of the poor without being
convinced of the inequality of its pressure. They
could not, it was true, have an exactly equal tax, but
then there could bo ,en approximation to that equality
of pressure. The olhjection of impracticability cod not
apply to the motion :of the Hon. Member for Buck-
inghamshire, because that proposition affirmed the un-
equal pressure of the rates. Neither was the question
ono between labour •and property, but between certain
descriptions of property on the one hand, and certain
descriptions of property on the other. His Right Hon.
Friend had asked what party would be relieved oy the
change proposed? and he (Mr. Gladstone) was not a
little surprised at the -estimate he (Sir James Graham)
had formed of the _immediate effects of the motion.
Looking at the relation between landlord and tenant
respectively, they could not in their consideration of this
branch of the qu. stroll pass by the yeoman and inde-
pendent small farmer class, who, under present circum-
stances, had peculiar claims for support. His Right
Hon. Friend admitted that the holders of leases of the
tenant-farming class would during the continuance of
those leases get the benefit of the change. Then came the
case of the tenant-at-will. Looking at the relation exist-
ing between the landlord and his tenants, not in a legal.,
but in a moral and social point of view, he believed that
the tenant-at-will would not be deprived by his land-
lord of the benefit of those changes. The tenant-
farmer
and the independent yeoman, then, were the class
that would be benefited. But supposing that after a
time the whole benefit came to the landlord thereof,
his Right Hon. Friend would not argue that such a re-
sult
should be considered a valid objection to the propo-
sition. If these were objections to the scheme, the
Right Hon. Gentleman then proceeded to show that
there was not one of them which with equal force might
not be urged against an equalization of schedule A in
the Property-tax Bill, which the Right Hon. Member
for Ripon admitted pressed unjustly on the agricultural
classes. and ought to be removed. With regard to the
financial objections urged, that they should have before
them a statement of the year—know the available
surplus, and the relative claims that different classes
and interests might advance previously to the consi-
deration of the proposition, he met those objections
by stating that he was prepared to advocate, or at
least t consider the claim on the• ground of justice.
But, independently of this circumstance, he men-
tioned that there were considerations of policy which
might incline the Government, and those who did
not object about the abstract justice of the motion, to
give it a fair hearing. Admitting that there was much
prosperity in the country, he could not shut his eyes
to the fact, that in the agricultural class there was se-
vere struggling going on, and that the farmers were man-
fully exciting them Aves; and though there might be
some whose hearts had already given way, and who had
prematurely learned the lesson of despondency, still the
great mass of that class were engaged in a struggle
which they supported with all the energy they pos-
sessed. Ho would not discuss the large and over-
whelming questions mooted by his Right Hon. Friend.
Whether the effect of agreeing to the motion would have
the effect of overthrowing the Government, and trans-
ferring 18,000,000/. of taxation to the Consolidated
Fund, ho would not discuss. He was contented to vote
on the motion as it stood before the House, and in it he
saw no indication of such overwhelming changes. The
Right Hon. Baronet, the Secretary of State for the
Home Department, certainly did not look upon the
motion in the same light as his Right Honour-
able Friend, for he_
_distinctly stated that when

the surplus revenue was ascertained it would then be
proper to consider how it could best be appropriated.
He trusted that considering that protection had been
taken away from agriculture, the House would treat the
motion in a liberal and conciliatory spirits He appealed
to those who had gained a great triumph by the recent
commercial policy which had been adopted to support
the motion, on the ground that it would tend to remove
a fair cause of complaint, and render the cry for protec-
tion less powerful than if this inequality was removed.
To those who were animated by an abstract sense of
justice 1;3 appealed, because he believed the claim was
just, and he believed the motion also deserved the sup •
port of those, who though they might sympathise with
an abstract and mathematical justice, could yet sympa-
thise with the gallaut struggle whims the farmers and
yeomanry of the country were now making, and with
the condition of the peasantry throughout the coun-
try. For his own part, he gave the proposition his
most decided and cordial rupport, because the result ( f
the debate on his own mind hay] been, that in all sub-
stantial points, tan propoeltion itself, and the reasons
adduced by the Honourable Member who moved it,
had heel fully and reasonably sustained. (The Hoe.
Gentlemen sat down amidst loud cheers from the Pro-
tectionists.)
Mr, J. WILSON joined issue with those who sup-
ported the motion on the ground of its justice, arid con-
tended thut the inequality of a tax on property was
sooner or later lost in the transfer of it to new proprie-
tors. Ha came to another point much insisted ou by
lion. Gentlemen opposite. It was said that inasmuch as
landed proprietors inherited those charges under a pro-
tective system, they hail as present to meet a new and
unforeseen difficulty. But he denied that the protective
system had been a real advantage to the landowner;
and he was also prepared to deny, or at least very much
to doubt, that the removal of that system had been a
real disadvantage to the landowner. The Hon. Gentle-
man the Member for Northamptonshire (Mr. Stafford)
had asked what was the cause of the present depression
in the prices of agricultural produce? Now, in reply to
that question, he should endeavour to show that the pre-
sent prices were of an exceptional and accidental charac-
ter, and that they were duck as no prudent land-
owner or farmer, and still less such as the Legislature
could proceed to act upon. He should first, however,
observe that, at some former periods, and more especially
in the year 1836, greater distress and a greater depth of
despair prevailed among the cultivators of the soil in this
country than that under which they were at present suf-
fering, while he had reason to know that the agricul-
tural labourers had largely benefited by the cheapness of
all the chief articles of subsistence. He had spent a por-
tion of the recess in the county of Wiltshire, a county
by no means remarkable for the flourishing condition of
its labouring population, and yet he had received there
as unequivocal admissions of the improved condition of
the labourers and of their families at the present period
as any that had reached him from the north of England.
But he repeated that, as regarded the prices of corn, wo
had of late been living under very exceptional circum-
stances, and he should endeavour to prove that statement.
The first feet to which he would call the attention of the
House was, that the farmers of this country were at pre-
sent suffering, not so much in consequence of the harvest
of 1849, or of the prices which were the result of
that harvest, as in consequence of the bad harvest of
1848. Unfortunately we had in this country very scanty
means of knowing the yearly amount of our agricultu-
ral produce. But we had data sufficiently accurate for
the purpose of his argument. He found that the quan-
tities of cora sold in the 256 towns from which the ave-
rages published in the Gazette were taken, had been as
follows in the last four years, each year commencing on
the Ist of September, and ending on the following 30th
of September:
1845-46 ... 5,929,788 qrs.
1846-47 4,995,518
1847-48 ... 5,450,631
1848-49 ... ... 4,298,901
It appeared, therefore, that in the year 1848.49 there
had been sold in those 256 towns nearly 1,200,000 qrs.
less than in the preceding year; and as the quantity
sold in those towns was supposed to represent one-
fourth of the entire quantity sold in the country, the
total deficiency in the sales throughout that year
amounted to 4,800,000 qrs. Now, taking the value
of that deficiency at 455. a quarter, which was the
average price, the total loss t a the farmers in that
way must have amounted to 10.000,000/. But the crop
so sold was not only deficient in quantity, but was also
deficient in quality; and the total loss which it entailed
on the farmers, as compared with the produce of the
preceding year, might, he believed, be fairly calculated
at 15,000,0001. Th et was one ground fur his opinion
that the present circumstances of the corn trade were of
exceptional character. He should, however, further
observe, that the greatest amount cf agricultural distress
prevailed in those counties in which there had been the
greatest deficiency in the crop of 1848. The average
deficiency throughout England and Wales had been 20
per cent., but in Bedfordshire it had been 28 per cent.;
in Cambridgeshire, 30; in,Suffolk, 25; in Worcestershire,
33; in Sowersetshire, 25; in Wiltshire, 22; in Berk-
shire, 26; in Devonshire, 40; and in Sussex, 45; so that
in Sussex, where agricultural distress was at present most
acutely felt, the deficiency in the harvest of the year 1848,
as compared with that of the preceding year, had amounted
to more than double the average deficiency of the whole
country. During the same period wo had had an
enormous importation of foreign-grown corn; but he
believed no lion. Gentleman would contend that too
much had been imported for the consumption of the
people. Let it be remembered that, after that large
importation we had very little corn left in our bonding
warehouses. It was said, however, that foreign corn
was displacing home-grown corn in our markets. But
that statement could not be accurate, for in those 256
towns there had been 2,000,000 quarters of corn sold
this year, as compared with 1,700,000 quarters sold last
year. Now, let them look at the countries from which those
large supplies of foreign corn had been received. He held
in his hand returns showing the various countries from
which we had derived our importations last year; and
he believed that the details of those returns would show
that the importations had taken place under circum
stances which Isere not likely to be permanent. Perhaps
the House would be surprised to learn that the country
which had sent us the largest amount of corn last year
was France. The following was a list of our importa-
tions of wheat from the chief countries from which we
had last year derived oar foreign supplies:—

Quarterr.
France ... 742,023
Prussia ... 618,734
United States . . 617,131
Russia ... ... 600,375
Hanse Towns, and Rostock and adjacent ports 498,983
Belgium ... ••• ... 366,095
Holland ... ... 308,482
Now it should be borne in mind that notwithstanding
our large importations from France, that country was
itself usually an importing country; and that two years
ago she had been actually compelled to se arch the whole
world for the surplus necessaries for her people; and
after having reminded the House of that fact, he
thought he was justified in stating that that was
an exceptional circumstance in our importations during
the last year. As regarded the different countries he
hadementioued. he should proceed to inquire what had
been in each of them the average price of corn during
the last eight or ten years, in order that he might
ascertain how their importations might influence the
prices in this country. With respect to the United
States, however, ho should observe that he had been un-
able to obtain any account of the average prices on
which ho could rely; and he should, therefore, merely
observe that the prices there were at the present moment
above the prices 'in England, and that from a country
with such growing wants and such a high rate of wages
as prevailed in the United states we could not expect to
receive large importations of corn, except in yeara when
the prices here should become exceedingly high. But
let them look at the case of France. From that country
we had received during the last five years, the following
importations of corn 1849, 742,023 quarters; in
1848, 320,010; in 1847, 179,259; in 1846, 73,774; and
in 1845, 35,809. It therefore appeared that our impor-
tations of corn from France had last year reached a
most unusual amount. HO held in his hand a return
showing the average price of wheat in France since
the year 1838; and that return he should proceed to
read to the House. In 1838 the price had been
465. 9d. per quarter; in 1839, 535.; in 1840, Ms. 6d.;
1841, 43i. 6,1.; 1842, 465. 9d.; 1843, 495. 5d.; 1844, 475.
3d.; 1845, 475. 3d.; 1846, 575. 6d.; 1847, 695. 7d.;
showing an average price for those ten years of 51s. 2d.
per quarter. It was true, however, that that price had
fallen in a most extraordinary manner during the last
two years. He found that in the year 1848 the average
price of wheat in France had amounted to only 395. 9d.;
and in the year 1849] it had only amounted to 335. 9d.
There had, therefore, been a fall, after the lapse of a
single year, from 51s. 2d. to 335. 91 That, he felt jus-
tified in stating, could only be regarded as a very ex-
ceptional circumstance. It was well known that on an
average of years France imported more corn than she
exported; and he therefore said that our recent impor-
tations from France could in no way be taken as a cri-
terion of our trade in corn with that country. Then
again, let them look at Belgium, from which our impor-
tations of wheat during the last five years had been as
Qrs.
1849.. .. 306,098
1848... 178,399
1847... ... 27,469
1846... ... ... 3,063
1845... ... 983
Notwithstanding the large amount of those importations
last year, Belgium was a corn importing country, and an
Act was actually in the course of being passed in Bel-
gium for putting an end to a corn law which had been
established there some years ago, in imitation of our
former sliding scale, it having first been found necessary
to suspend that law from year to year. He could not
think that Honourable Gentlemen opposite need be
alarmed by any large importations of corn we could re-
ceive from Belgium. He did not wish to say a word
that could be considered derogatory to the character of
the very industrious and inoffensive people of that coun-
try; but he certainly did not believe that they could
prove very formidable competitors to the *English
farmers. He found that in one of the most important
districts of Belgium—the district of Malines—the aver-
age size of the farms amounted to only eight acres,
while out of 13,000 holdings not less than 7,000 con-
sisted of less than two acres of land.—(Hear, bear, and
a laugh.) Surely the English farmer, with his great
resources, could meet the competition of a people so
situated. He found that the average price of the quar-
ter of wheat in Belgium during the ten years from 1839
to the end of 1848 had been as follows:

S.
1839 ... 55 3
1840 ... ... 51 6
1841 48 0
1342 ... 53 0
1843 ... 46 9
1844 .. ... 42 6

1845 ... ... ... ... 49 0

1846 ...

... 58 0

184:7 ... 74 6
18 48 ... 43 3
Showing In average for tho ten years of 525. 2d. But,
during th e Last three months, the average price of wheat
in Belgiu at had amounted to no more than 38s. 311.
Then, alp he said, they had to deal with exceptional
cireumsta ni:es. He next came to Holland ; and from
that coon ti y he found that our importations during the
last five 3 43 ars had been as follcws

Qrs.
1./149 ... •• • ... 308,482
1.1 48 . • •• ... 163,978
18 47 ... ... ... 11,800
18~ t 6 ... ... ... 473
18;4 '•5 ••• ... ... 1,614
In Holland. the average price of wheat during the last
ten years 7,1 id been 54i 4d a quarter; and it was well
known that that wr,s as importing rather than an ex-
porting cot to try. He should next pass to the importa-
tions from:Prussia and the surrounding districts, of
which the gnat part was Hamburgh. Our imports
from that aiskriet had been in—

Qrs.
184) ••• ... 498,953
1 ;48 ••• ••• ... 532,559
1847 ••• ••• ... 154,839
184 6 ..• ... 126,573
18,45 • ... 154,271
The avera: ;sti price of wheat at Hausburgh from 1839 to
1848 had b tm—
••• 503. per qr.
1840 ... ..• ... 40s.
18 41 ... •,. 575.
18 42 ••• 365.
18 4-3 ••• ••• 355. 9d.
18 44 ••• 295.
18 45 •••
18 46 51s.
18 47 •-• •.. ... 48e.
18 I 8 ••• 45:.
showing an overage price of 444. 9d. But last year the
average price had fallen to 375. quarter. It had been
said that `wheat could be purchased at an exceed-
ingly low rate in Prussia Proper; but he found
that in tb at country the average price of wheat
on the spilt was 365. a quarter, while the average
price at ~:Dantzic was 495. 6d.; and allowing
4s. for the cost of freightage to this country, that wheat
could not be sold here without any expense for landing
warehouses, ,and other charges, at less than about 545. a
quarter. Than again, he could perceive nothing is the
price of corn in the ports of the Black Sea which ought
seriously to Warm our farmers. But he might be asked
to what he WO uld attribute the present low prices in this
country ? To such a question he would, in the first
place, reply, ill at they were owing to the excessively high
prices which. had prevailed here in the year 1847, and
which had giv,sn an unnatural stimulus to the cultivators
of the soil Vas all the great wheat growing countries of
Europe. In the second place, he must attribute those
low prices, to. the convulsed state of Europe during the
last few yeatei, which had deranged all the ordinary
operations of commerce; and, in ,the third place, he
would attrib'ste them to the alarm and the agitation
which prevaeled amongst the agricultural classes, and
which deterred capitalists from investing ther money, sti
they would otherwise :have done, fa the purchase of
agricultural rroduce. But after having taken a minute
and careful ,survey of the whole of that bnbject, he felt
convinced that the English farmer, from the great ad-
vantages wh;,ch he enjoyed in the possession of large
capital, and proximity to the best markets in existence,
could successfully compete with the a,griculturists of
any other position of the world.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. BUCK said that the free-trade law had been the
cause of ruin and desolation not only to the farmer and
the farmer's :%.ebourer, but also to the shop-keepers in the
agricultural towns, and that much as they had suffered
already he fenced that they would suffer more before a
remedy Ras applied to their distressed condition. He
had attentively listened to the speech of the Honourable
Gentleman vtiho spoke last (Mr. Wilson), and he could
not in it find anything that related to the resolution be-
fore the Hon so, but he should allow that it was in unison
with the spe aches of those Hon. Gentlemen who, for the
purpose of cnrrying their free-trade measure, travelled
the country north, east, west, and south, and thus created
division and difference between the landlord and his
tenant, and when they failed in effecting this, they
brought ruin. and disaster on both. He would appeal to
their consciences, be would appeal to the honour of
honourable men, and ask was justice done to the land-
lord, the tenant, or the labourer, by this measure of free
trade? Did he need an answer he had only to look
to the distress and dismay that prevails throughout
all the agricultural districts of England, Scotland
and Irelaiid. As to the predictions cf the
Honourable Member, he, and he believed all of
his party (the Protectionists), held them in sovereign
contempt, for he had not heard one argument from the
free-traders that had the slightest tendency to remove
his fixed impression, or that seemed to wish to remove
distress and desolation from the country. The alarm
generally entertained, did not originate from a competi-
tion with the United States of America, but it arose
from the idea of placing the free-born Englishman in
competition with the serfs of Poland, a system that he
feared would ultimately banish the pride and stay of his
country to a foreign district, or force him to spend. the
wretched rem; tinder of his life in a workhouse. He con-
tended that if proper encouragement were given by the
Legislature, deist it would be found that there is not one
labourer too in uch for this country, and that all could be,
satisfactory to all parties, well employed. Again, he
would call the attention of the House to the financial
condition of the farmers, who state, that when they
came to the examination of their accounts, they found
that they had lost one. third of their capital since the
passing of those destructive free-trade measure. Add
to those losses the consequence of a bad harvest in this
country, and of a good one abroad, and be would ask
whet then would be the price of British produce ? He
believed that it would be the means of reducing the price
of wheat to the low sum of four shillings per bushel,
and would also create regret in the late and present Go-
vernment, for persevering in so unjust a policy. They
were told on the other side of the House that the poor-
rates were decreased, but he was in possession of a re-
turn which would show that everything tended to depress
the landed interest. From all appearances he saw no
reason to hope that the landed interest would be very
much better next year than in the present; on the con-
trary, he apprehended they would be very much worse.
The House should take care that they did not, by their
acts, depress the labouring interest more than it was at
present depressed; they should remember that it was to
that interest that this country was mainly indebted for
its greatness, and they might depend upon it. if they
continued much longer to neglect that interest they
wwoouulldd
feanild.anger the monarchy, and this great country

".
Mr. GRANTLEY BERKELEY felt that it would be
presumption in him to attempt to reply to the arguments
of the Right Hon. Baront t (Sir J. Graham), yet he felt
that he would not be discharging his duty to those with
whom he was connected, if he did not give some expres-
sion to his opinions on this subject. The Right Hon.
Baronet had said that in the county of Cumberland the
wages of the labourers were not decreased. However
that might be, he (Mr. G. Berkeley) must say that the
benefits of free trade, of which the Right Hoe. Baronet
had so much boasted, had nut yet reached the counties
of Gloucestershire, Wiltshire, and Hampshire. In those
counties he knew the labouring classes were in a most
distressed condition, and that the tenant-farmers had no
alternative with respect to the employment of them but
to discharge them altogether, or else employ them at
half wages, and the labourers in reply to that
expressed their desire to work at half wanes rather
than be discharged. The Right Honourable Baronet
had expressed his opinion that the' benefits of free
trade would be felt in the
" long run." Now, what
the Right Honourable Baronet meant by the " long
run"—(Laughter)—he could not say ; but this he
knew, that it had already ruined the tenant-farmers. He
(Mr. Grautley Berkeley) was a
tenant-farmer himself,
and he felt the bad consequences of free trade very •
severely. With respect to the gentlemen of the " Man-
chester School," he must say to them that they knew no
more of farming than he knew of the manufacture of
cotton. To the Hon. Member fur Westbury (Mr.
Wilson), who said he had adopted Wiltshire fir his
county, he would say it mattered not whether he adopted
Wiltshire, or Wiltshire adopted him. But this he must
Kay, in reference to a statement of the Hon. Gentleman
as to the excellent condition of the labourers in that
county, that they were actually working for six shillings
a week. With respect to the cotton trade Of Manchester,
ho felt that the House and the country were not yet in
possession of the real facts on that subject. And now
he would ask, what
1,1 the Government done for the
country 2: They had just done this—they had given the
e noisy" gentlemen of the Manchester school " ginger-
bread" to stop their mouths, and had taken from the
farmers the flour that made it.—(Laughter.) The Hon.
Member concluded by stating that he should give his sup-
port to the motion, from a sense of its justice and a con-
viction of its necessity.
Sir R. PEEL said—Whatever other motives I might
have for wishing to address the House on the subject
which has been brought forward with great ability and
with equal temperance and moderation, the necessity
which I feel to take a course different from that which
has been taken by my Right Hon. Friend the Member
for the University of Oxford is a sufficient reason why I
should not wish to arrive at an opposite conclusion from
him without explaining the grounds upon which that
conclusion is based.—(Hear.) Fur my Right Hon.
Friend I hare the greatest respect and esteem. I was
associated with him in the preparation of those measures
to the effect of which he partly attributes the conclusion
at which he has arrived. From him I derived the moat
zealous and effective assistance, and it is some consola-
tion for me to hear from my Right Hon. Friond that
although upon this particular motion we have arrived at
different conclusions, his confidence in the justice of
those principles upon which ho contended for the com-
mercial policy which of late years has been adopted,
remains entirely unshaken.—(Hear, hear.) Before I
address myself to some remarks of my Right Hon.
Friend I wish to state, with respect to the agricultural
interest, that I do not deny that it is suffering consider-
able distress—(Heat:, hear)—that fur that distress I feel,
on every account, the warmest sympathy. (An Hoer.
MEMBER on the Opposition benches—" Oh dear!"—
(Laughter and cheers.] I think the House will be of
opinion that I take the most becoming course in passing
by without further notice the inarticulate sounds with
which the Hon. Gentleman has greeted me.—(Cheers.)
I wish to consider this subject with the respect to which
it is entitled from the rnaenitude of the interests involved
in it.—(Cheers.) I believe those inarticulate sounds are
about as powerful as what the Hon. Gentleman might
say in support of them—(Hear, and laughter)—but I
shall not be disturbed by thorn ur prevented from enter •
in into the consideration of this subject with that tem-
per which ought to regulate this discussion.—(Hear.) I
know not why the Hon. Gentleman should doubt my
sympathy with the agricultural interest.—(Elear.) My
own interests are intimately oonneeled with its prospe-

rity, and this I must say, that if any measures to which I
have been party, however convinced I may be of the gene-
ral policy and general benefit which would result to the
country from them, have affected any special or pecu-
liar interest with distress, the greater is the sympathy
which I should feel.—(Cheers.) I say this also, that if
it be true that the occupying tenants of this country
are unwilling to reduce the amount of labour, if they
are making exertions to prevent that distress from
which they may he suffering from visiting those on
whose labour they depend, they have on that account an
additional claim for our respectful consideration of their
distress.—(Hear, hear.) Ido not indeed, while I admit
Oe distress that prevails, view it with apprehension aid
despondency. I regret the condition of the agricultut al
interest. I do'relieve there are special and peculiar
causes affectitee that interest.—(Hear.) I think it was
impcv ible to 17sten to the speech made in the course of
to-night by the Hon. Member fin Westbury without
feeling that there was a strong presumption that, at the
present moment, there are peculiar causes rf depression
and distress. I refer also to the frequent occasions upon
which during the maintenance of protection Ca; Crown in
the Speech from the throne spoke of the distress of the
agricultural interest. But, as I believe that now, when
protection has ceased, some of those causes which affected
the agricultural interest during the existence cf protec-
tion are again operating, so do I trust that there will be a
recovery now, and I do hope that those who profess to
feel a deep interest in the prosperity of agriculture will
not prejudice theircause and affect their interest by the pro-
pagation of endue alarm.—(llear, hear.) This course
had been taken on former occasions. Now I see that
course taken. I see professors of agriculture in Sc
land telling the Scotch farmers, the producers of oats,
that Indian corn can be introduced into this country at
12e. per quarter ; and that it is utterly impossible for
them to compete in the market with the productions of
the United States.—(Hear, hear.) They are giving
them that information as to the price at which Indian
corn can be imported at the very time when, instead of
12s. a quarter being the price at Liverpool, Limerick,
Cork, or Dublin, you find that the price of Indian corn
is fluctos'ing probably between 275. and 31s. per quar-
ter. I was not present during the early part of the
speech of the Honourable Member for Northampton.
shire. lam told that in that speech he made a personal
appeal to me, and asked me on what ground I thought
there was an undue depression of the price of agricul-
tural produce. I think there is, probably, an undue
depression, because I find in commercial countries,
and countries which have the advantage, if they
consider it to be so, of protection, the same depres-
sion of price, and the same complaints which exist in
this country. I find that the depression of price exists
notwithstanding the markets of England have been open
—(Hear, hear)—notwithstanding that there has been an
unusual demand for that agricultural produce. I find in
France, in Belgium, our nearest neighbours, each country
having, until a very late period, a law giving ample pro-
tection to native produce, their agriculture extremely de-
preseed in price, and their occupying tenants complain-
ing of the impossibility of cultivating land. I say there
does appear, then, to be pervading many countries of
Europe the same cause of depression of price of which
WO have complaints in this country. Whether or no
some causes may not affect them, whether or no suc-
cessive harvest of three or four years may not have sti-
mulated production, whether or no the price of corn may
not have been depressed by an unusual harvest following
successive years of scarcity, I will not undertake to say;
the fact remains unquestionable that in many coun-
tries of Europe, having the advantage of protection
there were the same complaints of the lowness of
prices and the distress of the agricultural interest. Since
I entered the House two documents have been put into
my hands which bear upon the subject. One is a trade
circular, issued at Antwerp, dated Feb. 9, 1850, and it
refers to the state and prospects of agriculture in that
part of the continent. The circular says:—" At our
to-day's market the trade generally ruled dull, and the
turn in prices was in favour of the buyers, though we do
not expect an important decline, the value of the corn
being already too depressed to pay the rents of our
farmers." The other document is a paper of similar
description, bearing the same date as the former, and
issued at Nantes. This circular states: —" Prices of
corn are for the present very low everywhere in Europe,
but, taking into consideration the good quality of some
produces of our growth, and of our best brands of flour,
combined with the low freight obtainable now, we con-
sider that our tnerket deserves the attention of every one
willing to risk interest of money at a low rate against
the chacces of a rise, whilst a further decline is quite
improbable, as needy sellers have everywhere disposed
of their crops, and also noticing that the continuance of
the present prices in this part of France would soon in-
volve the rum of the landed interest." Hero are two
countries which have the advantage of free entry into
the English market, combined with protection of native
produce; and when I see it stated that in them
the price of agricultural produce is depressed to such a
degree as that it is alleged the farmers must all be
ruined, it leads me to the conclusion that causes other

than the removal of protection here have mainly contri-
buted to the production of our distress; and I say, also,
it is probable that the same cause which has produced
our depreciation of prices is operating generally
throughout a great part of the continent. There is one
circumstance which relieves my anxiety for the condi-
tion and prospects of agriculture; I witness with the
greatest satisfaction the increasing consumption of the
people.—(Hear, hear.) It is in the tendency to in-
creased consumption that I see not only an indication of
general prosperity, but I hope also of improvement of
agricultue. In the course of the last year, in addition
to a great consumption of native produce, the people of
this country have not only imported, but consumed and
paid fur, by the produce of their own labour, 5,600,000
quarters of wheat.—(Sear, hear.) This consumption of
foreign grain has not diminished the consumption of
wheat of our own production. In 1849, as compared
with 1848, there has been an increase in the consump-
tion of British wheat, and concurrently with that the
enormous consumption of 5,600,000 quarters of foreign
wheat his occurred.—(Loud cries of "Hear.") Ob-
serve, I do not speak of Indian corn, or oats, or rye, but
of the noblest grain, nam'ly, wheat—has there been
this increased consumption?—(Cheers.) By whom has
that wheat been consumed?—(hear, hear.) If we are
seeking for proofs of the improved condition of the
country, why need we refer to any other details? Is not
the simple fact I have stated sufficient in itself to deter-
mine the point?—(Cheers.) 5,600,000 quarters of fo-
reign wheat have been imported, paid for, and consumed!
—(Cheers repeated.) By whom? Not by the upper
classes. I will venture to say that the quantity of
bread eaten by the arisOcracy has little increased in
amount.—(Hear, hear.) The quantity consumed in
their establishments has little increased. Looking to the
middle classes—to those who are in a state of compa-
rative affluence—the probability is that in times of pros-
perity their consumption of luxuries increases, but not
materially their consumption of the great elements of
human lite.—(Hear, hear.) No; this increase of con-
sumption has taken place in consequence of the better
condition of those who live by labour.—(Cheers.)
You cannot have an increased consumption of
millions of quarters unless you have millions of
mouths to eat them.—(Cheers.) I want, then,
no other indication of general prosperity—excepting of
course the agricultural class, whose distress I admit—l
want no other indication of the general ease and increas-
ing comfort of the people than the striking fact that
there has been an increase in the consumption of bread,
and bread of the best quality, which is perfectly unpa-
ralleled in the history of this country.—(Hear, hear.)
Well, then, if you can only continuo that consumption—
if, by your legislation, under the favour of Providence,

you cart maintain the demand for labour and make your
trade and manufactures prosperous, you are not only in-
creasing the sum of human happiness, but are giving the
agriculturists of this country the best chance of that in-
creare l demand which must contribute to their welfare.
I cannot but think that when we look to such masses of
population as are collected in places like Manchester,
Birmingham, rind the great iron districts—when
we con6lder nnzt is the nature cf the demand for

agricultural produce—that it is nut limited to corn,
but extends to meat, milk, cheese, butter, and
other articles—l cannot help thinking, I say, that,
taking into consideration the capital and skill of
our agriculturists, and, above all, ..-:the natural and
local advantages enjoyed by them, they need not fear
corrqetition with the agriculturists of any other country.
—(Cheers.) When I gave my assent to the address in
answer to the speech from the throne, it was not my be-
het* that the later cast any slight on the distress of the
agricultural interest. I understood the speech from the
throne to a lmit the existence of that distresii, and to ex-

press sincere regret at the circumstance. If I had not
put that con►truction upon the Royal speech—if I had
thought that it was open to the objection of treating the
complaints of the agriculturists slightingly, and imply-
ing that they were ill-founded and unworthy c.f notice,
the address to the throne would not have received my

support. I now apply myself to the speech of my Right
Hon. Friend the member for Oxford University, and
will proceed t) state the grounds on which I have come
to a conclusion different from that at which he has

arrived. My Right Hon. Friend takes up the motion
of the Hon. Member f Buckinghamshire, and
says he is at perfect liberty to dismiss all ex-
trinsic considerations connected with it, and to
consider it only as an abstract proposition. Now,
there I differ from my Right Honourable Friend. It
it is all very well to say to a young Member of this
House, " I make a proposal for the House to resolve
itself into Committee, in which the whole question will
be open for consideration. Go into Committee; hear
my proposal; reject what is objectionable, and modify
what is capable of modification. Do this, and you will
conscientiously discharge your duty; and, even should
you agree to no part of my proposal, you will at least
have the merit of showing your sympathy for the farmer."
But what constrection will the occupying tenant and the
agricultural interest generally put upon the motion of
the Hon. Member? How may their hopes be excited
with respect to it? I must do the Hon. Member for
Buckinghamshire the justice to say that he is not
chargeable with any attempt at deception.—(Hear, hear.)
But lion. Members must consider the circumstances
under which wo are discussing this question.—(Hear,
hear.) I am not now certain what was meant by the
amendment to the address on the first tday of the
session; but I thought that th© issue taken on that
amendment was whether protection should be renewed or
not. The Hon. Member for Northamptonshire has to-
night fairly stated that that was the issue then
raised, and that, the Lords and Commons having de-
cided the question n the negative, he does not advise
his friends to occupy the House with needless debates,
which must end in nothing. In fact the Hon. Member
evidently looks upon the question of protection as de-
eided.—(No, no.) I do not mean decided permanently;
but I am sure that if the Bon. Member who cries No"
had heard the speech of the Hon. Member fa. North-
amptonshire, he would have inferred from it that, as far
as the present Parliament is concerned, he deems the re-
vival of protection hopeless.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon.
Member for Buckinghamshire now makes a motion for
the purpose of giving the agricultural interest the COM.

pensation to which he thinks it is entitled on account of
the removal of protection. Last year the Hon. Member
contended that the amount of burdens unfairly borne by
the landed interest, including the land-tax was not less
than 14,000,000/. This session the lion. Member, with per-
fect propriety, comes forward and says—" I will not, on
this occasion, brirg forward my extended scheme—l con •
fine my proposition at present to the removal of taxation,
unfairly bearing on the agricultural interest t the ex-
tent of 2,000,0001.; but do not be deceived—this is only the
first of a series of measures—(Herr, hear)—others will
follow incorporating the same principle, and after you
have consented to these measures, I will avail myself of
the earliest opportunity of renewing the pretsctien to
which the agricultural interest is entitled.--(Cheers.)
The Honourable Member has given us distinct notice
that the success of his present proposal will not close the
account, and that it is not a measure ith which the
agricultural interest oncdst to be satisfied; that it is only
a partial and a small instalment, and that if we pay the
int.taltnent he will prosecute the claim f,l. the rernaindt r.
—(Cheers.) My Right Honourable Friend, therefore,
cannot say that he is d ceivcd by this meet' es
hear.) Now, let ns see what the proposition of the
Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire is, Rod whether its
adoption would really be,ictit the class for whose ad-
vantage it is intended. I wish to consider the proposi-
tion relatively to its hearing on the finances of the
country. The proposel made to us is this, that previously
to any exposition of the financial condition of the
country by the Chancellor of the Exchecuer we shall by
a vote of this Honsc determine that 2,000,000/ of feee.
tion shall be placed as a charge on the Consolidate
Fund. For the sake of simplifying the matter I will
assume that the balance in the Exe'requer is exactly
2,000,0001. I beg the House to consider the effect which
the success of the Hon. Member's motion must base
upon the financial prospects of the year, and also whether
it would benefit the class which it is intended to serve.
I am asked to consent to the first of a series of measures
whichimmediately appropriates the whole of the surplus
of the present year, and prospectively appropriates the
surplus of several succeeding years. Is this course of
proceeding desirable even for the interest of the class
whose cause the Hon. Member advocates, and which I ,
admit to be labouring under embarrassment? I under-
stand that the Hon. Member has declared out of this
House that one great source from which he anticipated
relief to the agricultural interest was the maintenance of
public credit, thereby lowering the rate of interest,
and giving landed proprietors facilities for re-
lieving themselves from the charges to which they
were now subjected. Although I differed from the Hon.
Member as to the mode by which he would constitute a
surplus, yet I thought there was great force in the sug-
gestion. If, without augmenting taxation, you can
maintain public credit, support the price of the funds,
and thereby diminish the rate of interest and enable the
landed interest, by perfectly legitimate means, to relieve
itself from a portion of its difficulties, you doubtless
achieve a great object. My Hon. Friend the Member
for Surrey said, the other night, that we ought to have
settled the mortgage question before repealing the corn-
laws. Is he going to settle that question by destroying
our surplus?—(Hear.) My Hon. Friend, of course,
meant it to be understood that the landed interest have
heavy mortgages upon their property, contracted, let
me observe, under a system of protection.—(Hear,
hear.) What a picture of landed property did he draw!
He pictured to us estates so overburdened with debt that
their owners could have no alternative but to sell their
property. From what period do these incumbrances
date Can there be a stronger argument against pro-
tection than is furnished by my Hon. Friend's account of
the present condition of landed property ?—(Hear,
hear.) Admit the account to be correct, you want to
enable landed proprietors to borrow money at three per
cent., in order to pay off mortgages which are now car-
rying interest at ai or 5 per cent. Is the way to do
that to tell the fundhelder that all the surplus of the
present year shall be appropriated, and not only that,
but to give notice that whenever we have any surplus
for some time to come, it shall be appropriated in like
manner, and the amount charged on the Consolidated
Fund ?—(Cheers.) I regretted to hear my Hon.
Friend speak so lightly of the maintenance of public
credit. Let me tell him that if any measure should be
adopted whicb would have the effect of destroying con-
fidence in the funds and in the maintenance of public
credit, it would furnish but a short-lived triumph. The
same blow which strikes the public creditor will reach
the landed interest.—(Cheers.) Looking at the bear-
ing of the proposal before us upon the financial condi-
tion of the country, it would be a most precipitate anti
unwise act on the part of this House, in the absence of
any official exposition of our financial state, to appro-
priate the whole of the present surplus, and to pledge
itself to a principle involving the appropriation of the
surplus of future years. There are two questions to
be considered—first, whether we shall maintain a surplus
and thereby raise the price of funds and benefit the agri-
cultural interest in the way suggested by the Hon.
Member for Buckinghamshire, by enabling them to
borrow money at a low rate of interest, and, secondly,
in the event of its being determined not to maintain a
surplus, how shall we apply it in the remission of taxa-
tion so as to confer the greatest amount of benefit on all
the interests of the country, the agricultural interest in-
cluded? But the proposal of the Hon. Member for
Buckinghamshire would at once preclude me from enter-
ing upon the consideration of those two questions.—
(Hear, hear.) My Right Hon. Friend the Member for
the University of Oxford desires a revision of taxatior,
and says he hopes to see the duty on timber, and the
duty on bricks repealed at an early period. How can
be hope for that if he leaves no surplus?—(Cheers.)
Without a surplus, how is it possible to make a re-
mission of taxation? How can you remit taxes which
undoubtedly bear upon the agricultural interest if
you pledge yourselt to transfer charges borne by
real property to the Consolidated Fund? I must say
that there are considerations of the utmost importance
connected with the question of the reduction of taxes.
Look at the duty on bricks. I must declare, most re-
spectfully. to the agricultural interest that it; by any
transfer of taxation to the Consolidated Fund, you pre-
clude the Chancellor of the Exchequer from fairly con-
sidering whether or not the duty on bricks can be re-
pealed, you are taking a course most injurious to your
own interest.—(Cheers) See how unfairly the duty
on bricks operates in different parts of trio country. '
Those parts cf the country which abound in coal, and
have also the advantage of stone, possess every facility
for the construction of houses. Other parts of the
country, possessing no coats, and having no command
over stone, are obliged to depend upon bricks ; and a
heavy excise-duty interferes with the building of houses
for the poorer portion of the community. If we could
get the duty on bricks removed, at a cost to the Exche-
quer of 600,0001., it is my deep conviction that the agri-
cultural interest would be more benefited thereby than
by the success of the present proposal. All real property
would benefit by the repeal of the brick duty. Look
at the influence of the duty on the sanitary condition of
towns—a subject to which public attention is closely di-
rected at present. I cannot conceive that anything would
tend more to the improvement of towns than the removal
of this duty. The direct interest that the agricultural
classes have in enabling the landlord to improve the
farm-buildings of the occupying tenant, has also been
adverted to. I do believe that that improvement of farm-
buildings by the landlord, far the advantage of the
tenant—for the preservation of implements and for the
feeding of cattle—will be one great cause of agricultu-
ral prosperity—(Heir, hear)—that it will be of the
utmost importance.—(Hear, hear.) But these benevo-
lent designs of the landlord are now counteracted by
an Excise duty on bricks— (Hear, hear.) What has
been the consequence of the removal of Excise du-
ties ? Why, you are not to estimate the advantage
merely by the relief from the pecuniary burden.
You have the officers of Excise interfering with
your operations—(Hear, hear)—the regulations pre•
venting the construction of the article except according
to a certain size—(Hear)—there is the constant fear
of a prosecution for fraud—there is the impediment to ,
the exercise of ingenuity.—(Hear, hear.) Remove the
brick duty, and let them make bricks without requiring
their being nine inches long, and so many inches wide,
and so many inches thick—(Hear, hear)—what an im-
mediate direct advantage would the agricultural interest
derive from such a removal of a pecuniary burden, and
from such an encouragement to the exercise of industry.
—(Hear, hear.) Now, I don't know whether Hon.
Members generally have tread the papers laid upon the
table almost since, or not above two or three days before,
the Hon. Gentleman made this motion—papers relating
to a question of vital importance to the condition of the
country—l mean the operation of the law of settlement.
—(Hear, hear.) The consideration of that question will
be forced upon you. It would be premature to enter
upon it now; but I wish you would read the able reports
that have been made by the gentlemen who have been
instructed to inquire into that subject, and you will
understand the difficulties which arise at present
from the want of cottages for the labourers
in certain districts.—(Hear.) You will see what is the
effect upon the health and comfort of the labouring poor
from the very imperfect dwellings in which they now re-
side.—(Hear.) You will find accounts that, in some
instances, labourers come to the farm on which they are
employed upon donkeys, in consequence of the distance
of their residence from the place of their employment.—
(Laughter, and loud cries of "Hear.") These things
are not, and I am sure they ought not to be beneath
your consideration.—(Cheers.) If such is the condition
of the labourer, that in order to have employment upon
one farm there are more than twenty donkeys upon
which the labourers ride to that daily employment—(A
laugh)—it may be a subject for ridicule, but it is one
that suggests topics for very serious consideration.—
(Cheers.) There are other men whose strength is
exhausted by the length of the distance which they have
to come to labour; and others are forced into villages
where they are paying 41. or 51. a year for their houses.—
(Hear.) Well, encourage the construction of comfort-
able cottages by removing the brick duty.—(Cries of
" Hear.") Alter your law of settlement, so that there
shall be no discouragement to their Sliding those
etcom-
fortable habitations.—(Hear.) Consider the
tlement in conjunction with other matters. Blauwatk
oysfoau
admit their importance—if you admit_ they are p
by a sudden
series of important considerations, dmo
notthe consideration
vote to-night preclude yourseltfh from
!hone
of taxation.—(Hear, hear.)
bcwhetherasrpreispeaking
you
nug may
o f •
anot advance
the In e pbyresaewntisentaretemoisfs
upon the extent to which essitongoivfetaaxilaytioopninciaonn
public revenue, I certainly,
the breefrocri
wait to hear the financial statement of
period. Next year the
the Chancelslohrallof the Exchequer.—(Hear, hear.) We
peculiar
aceqUestion of the income-tax must be brought under re-
etew.—(Hear.) It may be of the greatest importance
to reserve for consideration whether it shall be con-
tinued ; if continued, what shall be the modifications
made in it. But by the decision of to-night you will
compel the continuance of the
.you do not, d
of
" No," and "Hear, hear.") Nay, but if
then you mean to revive the import duties upon food.
—(Hear, hear.) I entreat my Right Hon. Friend to
consider that. If you mean not only to appropriate the
surplus for the present per, but the surphie of Atm

years, and also mean to take a course which shall his-
pause with the income-t ix, then indeed you do manifest
what is your intentu.n—(Hear, hear)—urged by my
lion. Fritnd the Member for Surrey (Mr. H. Drum-
mond), that upon every article imported from foreign
countries there should be a duty.—(Hear.) Those views
of my Hon. Friend must be carried out if you appropri-
ate your surplus and also refuse the income-tax.—
(Hear, hear.) But my Hon. Friend says that the great
struggle is between capital and labour, between money
and Ilft • It is an epigrammatic way of stating his views.
—(A laugh.) Ile is the great advocate for labour against
capital, and for life against money. And what is the
practical course which he advises us to pursue? To re-
move the taxation from capital and to place it upon
labour.—(Hear, bear.)
Nay, more—my Hon. Friend
says, " I never will be satisfied until the labourer can
hake his own bricks, collect his own hops, brew his own
malt." Welt, then, why won't my lion. Friend " never
rest satisfied" unless the iebourer can eat his bacon
without paying e duty if he gets it from abroad—(" Oh!'
and" Hear, hear )—nd his bread also ?—(Cheers.) The
advocate for labour against capital, for life against money,
the man who says, "we never shall hear the last of
it until the labourer can gather his own hops from his
hedge and make his own bricks," won't allow us to reties
the duty upon bricks.—(" Hear," and dissent.) I say you
are tnkiiig a course which makes it impossible for you to
do sc.—(Hear, hear.) If indeed you say you are care-
less about public credit—(Hear, hear)—you may do all
these things; you may appropriate surplus and repeal
im.:otne duty also; but I say you will make it impossible
to maintain your obligations to the public creditor if you
make these extensive alterations.—(Hear.) But now
let us ate what this proposal will be so far as the interest
of the occupying tenant is concerned. I will make ne
dist:netion between the occupying tenant and the owner.
My belief is that the occupying tenant would, for the
present at least, derive some benefit from this measure.
I do believe that there is, on the part of the landed pro-
prietors, that feeling towards their tenantry which
would lead to that—(Hear, hear)—even if, according to
the strict rules of economical science, they might be en-
titled to increased rent.—(Hear, hear.) I will waive any
advantage to the argument, then, upon that point; I
will admit that this is a plan from which the occupying
tenant might derive advantage; but let us estimate the
full amount of his profit. This is also a proposal to re-
lieve, not the land, but real property, from a charge W
which it is subject; the charge I assume to be
2,000,0001., which is to be transferred from real pro-
perty to the Consolidated Fund. Just let us consider
some of the circumstances connected with this. As has
been said repeatedly, this is no tax upon land exclue
sively—it is a tax upon real property; and the propor-
tion in which land has contributei to this tax
has been gradually diminishing; in consequence of the
increasing prosperity of commerce and manufactures.
that portion which falls upon other descriptions of real
property has been increasing. If you bad made an es-
timate with respect to the payment of these 2,000,00 a
in 1826, when the land paid 69 per cent., you would ha,*
f ,und 1,380,0001. of the 2,000,0001. paid by the land; in
1833, 1,260,0001.; in 1841, 1,040,000/.; and in 1849, only
900,000/. of the 2,000,000/, would be paid by the land.—
(Hear, hear.) So that since 1826, in consequence of the
improvement in manufactures and eommeroe, and the
increase of houses, there has been a gradual tendency,
as things have existed and as they now continue, to re-
lieve the landed interest by transferring this charge to
other property. There is an increase of population;
there is a diminution of charge on account of the poor,
a diminution of charge owing to the diminished price of
provisions; there is the reduction of the price per head
of those you maintain, from 13s. to is.; there are abate-
ments of the charge upon the land; but at present, of
the charge of 2,000,001)1. you will purchase a remission
of 900.000/. for yourselves by relieving another descrip-
tion of property to the amount of 1,100,0001. Now, will
you let me elk you what claim for relief has that
other description of property?—(Hear, hear.) It is not
land; no doubt it is real property, but it consists of
houses, of mills, and manufactories, the owners of which
have been directly benefited, according to cur own ad-
mission, by those recent changes in your legislation.—
(Hear, hear.) Up to the present hour we have beard
that the landowners have been sacrificed to the mill-
owners; that the Manchester school have been predomi-
nant; that they have gained great advantages; that the
reduction in the price of provisions has been for their
exclusive benefit. Well, in order that you may gain a
remission of taxation yourselves to the amount of
900,000/. a year, you are going to relieve others whose
position i 3 directly opposite to your own—namely, the
owners of this other description of real property,who have
benefited by this legislation, from larger burdens they
are now bearing—burdens which are constantly increas-
ing upon them, to the reduction of those which are borne

by you. Now, what reason i 3 there for this? Aud will

the occupying tenant be benefited by a change which
is cerainly to remove 900,0001. from the land, but which
will remove from this other description of property
1,100,0001. that the occupying tenant with others must
make up by taxation?—(Hear, hear.) What is the
amount of the benefit which any occupying tenant can
receive? I admit to you, for the sake of argument, that
the benefit is exclusively for him and not for the land-
lord. What is the amount of it? It is about 3d. or
in the pound—but he will have to beer increased taxe
tion in order to make up that transfer of the 1,100,0001.
to the Consolidated Fund.—(Hear, Lear.) What, then,
is the position of this ocupytng tenant ? You are pre-
venting the consiitei a ion s.f a remission of the tsxes
which bear upon him ; you are going to reduce the
amount of his present payments to tr e extent of 3d. or
4d. in the pound, but that advantage must be diminished
by the increased charge which he will have to bear in
order to make up far the loss caused by the tram fer of
the 1,100,0001.—(1Iear. hear.) It is my firm persuasion
that the occupying terant will derive no benefit wha'-
ever—(Hear, hear)—none whatever which can compen-
sate him for the loss to which you are about to subject
him.—(Hear, hear.) I say, therefore, that this proposal
is in itself an impolitic one, even so far as it concerns
the interests of those whom it is especially ietinded to
tenefit.—(Hear, hear.) My beliet is that agriculture—
the landed interest —the occupying tenants will find
their advantage much better consulted by leaving it open
to consideration whether any remission of public taxa-
tion shall be made which unduly presses upon them,
and that can be removed, than by merely taking this
small per-tentage upon what they pay, aed preventing
the consideration of all those other questions which are
of so much pressing interest. So far, therefore, as their
interest is concerned, I decidedly object to the proposal.
I object to it upon another ground—that it is a reversal of
that financial policy upon which we have been acting for
some time past.—(dear, hear.) I must maintain that in
1842 the apportionment of public taxation was most un-
just; that Jasour was unduly burdened; that there was
scarcely an article which entered into the consumption
of the poor man which was not heavily charged; the
cheese, the butter, the bacon, the pork, everything that
he consumed, if brought from a foreign country was sub-
ject to high taxation.—(Hear, hear.) The price of those
articles has been reduced, according to your own admis-
sion. Reduced by what? Reduced, I presume, by free
competition, by the unrestricted import from foreign
countries of that produce upon which he lives. Now,
your are about to remove from real property a charge of
2,000,000/., and tainaposeit upon those whose condi-

lion You cousidered in !x43, whom you thought unduly
aggrieved by the pressure of texation,whorn you sought to
relieve, whom you did relieve, and whose affection and
gratitude you received in return.—(Hear.) Some com-
plain of the tea duty, others of the soap duty, others of
the window-tax; you are preventicg the consideration
of all these questions by appropriating this surplus.
You are preventing the relief which it might be pos-
sible to give—relief much mere valeshle, much more
extensive—by transferring this charge from tee quarter
where it is at present borne, and placing it upon the
consolidated feud. I object to the justice of that trans-
fer.—(Bear, hear.) Ido not say tl.at there may not be
some burdens now borne by the land in respect of which
there might not be relief ; I admitted in 1816 that I
thought the land was unduly burdened, that I thought
the apportionment of taxation was not just.—(Hear,
hear.) I attempted to give relief by transferring the
whole charge of criminal prosecutions, the whole charge
of the Irish police, half the charge of medical relief, the
charge of schools, to the consolidated fund. Well, lam
not prepared to say that full and complete relief was
given in that respect—(Hear)—l am not prepared to
soy that the charge for vaccination, or the militia, or
the registration, does not fall within the same principle.
But I know this—that you would laugh at me if I were
to go into the Committee which the Hon. Gentleman
moves, and then to say—as my Right Hon. Friend pos-
sibly may—" I think there is a capital case made out
for the vaccination charges being transferred to the
consolidated fund, but, I am sorry to inform the occupy-
ing tenant that I have no other relief to give him."
(A. (A. laugh.) Even if I were to say that lunatic asylums
are within the same principle, and the charge for
them might properly be transferred to the consolidated
fund, I know that I should hear from farmers
that I gave a most decisive proof of being fit to be en
inmate of ono of these asylums by making such
a'proposition after the hopes which had been excited.—
(Laughtt r and cheers.) Sir, my main objection to this
proposal is, as I said, that it is a reversal of our financial
policy.—(dear, hear.) I believe the welfare
of this
country is intimately connected with the ofindus-
tryrelitefe
from taxation.—(Cheers.) Ibelieovne hnenre promote
is
no
ti
more powerful instrument by which
contentmentatio3 and peace
and a swfaheo live
t i
o ywith
labouryour l legis-
llation,
it
we, s -
the lauded proprietors—that the aristocracy of this
country are willing to submit to any sacrifice which shall
e
relieve from taxation those articles
upon which
they
than by convincing thoses
depend for subsistence.—(Hear, hear.) I believe you
thaa,vaeroensped the full advantage of the remission of such
ti : (Hear, hear.) I believe you have had during
the last three or four trying years more contentment,
more submission to privation—(Clear, hear)—more un-
affected loyalty—(llear, hear)—more of refusal to listen
to the designs of seditious men—(Hear, hear)— .f men
agitating for their owe benefit—(Bear, hear)—than you
could have expected under any other state of things.--
(Hear, hear.) The burdens you may intend to impose
may be light; this " first of a series of measures" may
in a small degree affect the labour and industry of this
country; but you will be alarming those who labour by the
indTatiou of repentance as to the course you took.—(Hear.)
The relief you give will be Lund inadequate; there
will be a fresh demand; your intention of subjecting to
duty everything which comes from foreign countries
will be fortified by the proof of the little advantage that
you will derive from this small modicum of relief ; and
you will probably end, if you are strong enough to pre-
vail, by the re-imposition of duties, if not corresponding
in amount, at least in principle, with those which were
removed in 1842, and by the system of commercialpolicy
which hal been since adopted.—(Hear, hear.) I ear-
neatly and sincerely deprecate that course.—(Hear,
hear.) I deprecate it as unjust in itself—(Heer, hear)
—I deprecate it as impolitic from its tendency to shake
confidence in your deliberations.—(llear, hear.) Sir, I
have been for the last three or four months exposed to
charges, as the House is well aware—to the revival of
charges of haring acted ItufaitkfUllY Ind treithrously

t o the interests which—(The conclusion of the sentence restrictions on commerce to abate the motives for enter-
was drowned in loud cries of " Hear, hear.") Well, at prise and encouragement to perseverance and industry.
opinions
least so far as intention is concerned, I entreat you to —(Loud cheering.) These, Sir, arthe
which, upon a deliberate
which
consider whether I could have any personal—(Cheers) I adopted some years ago, and
—or political object—(Hear, hear)—in giving the review of the condition of the country,
T
_o these opinions
have been con-
counsel which I gave and in recommending the mea- firmed by all subsequent experience.
sores which were adopted. With regard to other I adhere, and I hope I shall not live to see the day when
charges or other language—admitting that there ought to the House of Commons will retrace its steps.—(The
be, with respect both to the conduct and the motives of Right Hon. Baronet resumed his seat amid loud and
public .men, the utmost latitude of discussion—l shall continued cheering.)
not complain of any terms which have been used. The Lord JOHN RUSSELL said, before the House came
only charge that I shall refer to is one which was brought
to a division, it was his duty to state, why, as a Minister
against me by the Noble Lord the Member for Notting-
of the Crown, be felt it incumbent on him to resist the
haeashire (Lord IL Bentinck), who not only imputed to
motion of the Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire. The
me misstatements, but who publicly declared at a meet-
ing in his county that I had a private and pereonal in- Hon. Gentleman had proposed to go into a Committee
terest in recommending those changes of the law which to consider the poor-rates and other burdens affecting
I had proposed in 1846.—(Cheers.) Sir, I think it would the landed interest. The Hon. Gentleman had told
be as well if we abstained in our political controversies them, that if they so went into Committee, he should
from imputing to each other dishonest motives.— propose three resolutions, the effect of which would be
(Cheers.) I should be disposed to give to the Noble to transfer to the Consolidated Fund the whole ex-
Lord, in any course he might take, credit for the purity penses of the poor-law establishment charges, and some
of his motives, even while I felt it my duty to censure half-million of other charges. The Hon. Gentleman had
and denounce that course.—(Cheers.) But the Noble said, that upwards of two millions would be so trans-
Lord has not treated me with that consideration. He f erred ; and then he went on to state that this was the first
not only thinks that my course has been most impolitic of a series of measures which it was intended to propose,
and most unjust—he not only thinks that I was un- with the view of lessening the burdens on land. He
faithful to the interests I was bound to protect—(Cheers objected tot he propositions, in the first instance, because
and counter cheers)—but he says that I was influenced he thought the allegations were founded on an injustice.
by considerations of private, paltry gain in advising the If it had been established that this sacrifice was just,
repeal, of the corn-laws.--(Cheers.) And the Noble then why, he asked, should not the remaining ten
Lord founds his charge against me on this allege- millions which the Hon. Gentleman contended were
Lion—that my interest in funded property far exceeded unfairly planed on the agricultural interest also be
the interest 'Mich I had in land.—(Cheers and laughter.) transferred to the Consolidated Fund? The claim of
The Noble Lord had, it appears, condescended to make justice—if claim existed—applied to the whole twelve
inquiry into my private circumstances, and undertook td millions, as well as to the two millions which the Hon.
inform those who listened to him at the meeting that my Gentleman proposed to transfer. The Right Hon.
interest in land was only one-fourth of the interest I had Gentleman the Member for Ripon was fully justified
in the funds, and that, therefore, I had a direct pecuniary when he said that the Hon. Member for Bucks contem-
motiveimadvising the repeal of the corn-laws.--(Cheers.) plated that this was not the only charge unduly affect-
Well, lam sure, Sir, Ido not deprecate any reference ing the landed interest, but that twelve or fourteen ma-
to mrprivate affairs which the Noble Lord may think lions would follow the proposal that was made. In the
it consistent with his public duty to make. I may say I next place, he (Lord John Russell) did not believe there
shouldhaveborne with much less calmness andequanimity was any justice in this claim. He did not think, if they
the charges against me if I deprecated inquiry and exa- compared the whole burdens of this country laid on va-
mintition into any act, public or private, connected with rious classes, that there was that unfair pressure on: the
the discharge of my duty to the Crown.—(Cheers.) landed interest which the Hon. Gentleman asserted.
But this I think I have a right to complain of—that the Let them consider how far the other classes, as cora-
Noble Lord did not act fairly—that, if he thought it pared with the agricultural classes, were affected by
fitting to charge me with personal motives, and founded taxation. With regard to the legacy duty, it did not
his charge on circumstances of a private nature, he affect landed property, while it applied to personal pro-
should, I think, have made himself intimate with the perty. There were also the excise and customs duties.
facts, and not have preferred charges on assumptions Having shown that the claim was not founded in justice,
utterly-' and totally erroneous.—(Loud cheers.) Sir, I he asked, was it expedient to make the transfer pro-
shall not trouble the House with reference to private posed. As a Minister of the Crown, he was not bound
matters; I shall only say on this point, that if the Noble to presume that there would be a surplus revenue of two
Lord happened to state exactly the reverse of what he millions, ort hat the House would deal with that sum as
did say he would have been much nearer the truth.—
available, and if there were not those two millions,
(Gheers and laughter.) I hope, therefore, that however then the Honourable Gentleman would have to pro •
ungrateful he may think my course, or however impo- pose new taxes, but further than that, he
litic, he will at least acquit me of any intention to derive must say, that having increased the debt of this
personal gain from the policy I have pursued; and in country within the last few years, it would be their duty
future, before you denounce the conduct of any public to see that any probable surplus over expenditure should
man as treacherous, let me advise you to place your- be applied to the diminution of the debt, as so increased.
selves in thelsituation in which that public man was In the next place, supposing that the House was to de-
placed, and to consider the duties which devolved upon cide that the whole surplus should go at once to the re-
him. •When I .and those with whom I acted in concur- vision of taxes, he did not see that they were called upon
reties', my valued friends and colleagues—when we de- to decide:at onceithat the whole of the revision should be
termined that it was our duty to propose to the Legisla- on the taxes of real property, and thus preclude them-
ture the repeal of the duty on food we were threatened selves giving any relief to those engaged in industry.—
with a+ortentons and most grievous calamity, and it (Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman whomade this pro-
was impossible for us to know to what extent the din- position said he did not ask for relief for the great landed
order which affected the food of a large portion of the proprietors, but for the 240,000 small proprietors, the
people-of Ireland might go. We knew this, however, yeomanry of the country, whom he professed to repre-
that in Ireland alone 4,000,000 of men depended on one sent. Well, then, how would his proposal affect them as
article of stibsistence. We knew that that article of sub- compared with the removal of other taxes? In the evi-
sistenco was seriously threatened, and I must say for one deuce given before the Lords' Commttee, he found
that I did feel it my duty as a public man to take pre- that the present taxes oa stamps were in the following
cautions, even should they turn out to be superfluous, ratio:—On 501. there was a duty of 30 per cent.—upon
agairse the occurrence of a calamity which might be fatal 12,5001. 1 per cent.—upon 25,000/., 15s. per cent.—and
to the peace of the country, and to the existence of upon 100,0001. a duty of only 12s. on the 1001.—Hear,
many thousands.—(Loud cheers.) Nay, more, I did hear.) It appeared, therefore, that the small landed
believe it would not be conducive to the interests of the proprietor who wished to effect a mortgage for 501 would
agricsaltural classes themselves to see the effect of disease have to pay in stamps and law charges a duty of 30 per
and famine, and yet refuse the natural remedy—namely, cent., while the rich and large proprietor who might effect
increased supplies of the means of subsistence. I did a mortgage of 100,0001. would only pay 12s. percent. He
also feel, Sir—this duty once removed—that in the thought it was nut consistent to ask the House to come
state of public opinion and of public predilecti,.n which to any resolution which might have the effect of pre-
existed, a conflict for the revival cf it would not be for eluding the Government from proposing, or the House
the interests of the landlords.—(Cheers.) The Noble from making, any revision of those taxes which would
Lord opposite (Lord J. Russell) had come to the same lighten the unequal burdens which pressed upon the
conclusion. He did not, I believe, intend to emhaerass small yeomanry themselves. He did not mein ti cuter
the course of Government; but he had also come to the upon topics which had been so ably treated by the
conclunion that the duties on corn ehould be repealed or Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Ripon, or the
suspended, and that after their suspension their revival Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Tamwoite. There
would-be impossible—at least impossible without a con- was only one thing in the speech of the Right Hon.
flint which would be injurious to the interest of those Member for Ripon which he felt compelled to notice,
for whose advantage protection was established.— which might otherwise give rise to very serious appre-
(Cheers.) Sir, it was my sincere belief—l thought it hensions in one of our colonies. He meant the proposal
my duty—a duty I owed to God and to my country—if that a tax should be put upon colonial timber.—(Hear,
there was a chance of famine, to take the precau- hear.) He would not they discuss the question whether
tion which alone could be taken, and to suspend the Parliament had done rightly in reducing the duty on
daties.-I(Cheers.) I did conscientiously believe that Canadian timber to one shilling per load. The act had
after that suspension it would be most unwise to been done, and considering that in 1843 the Canadians
give a pledge for the revival and renewal of those had been induced to expect the; they would have a pre-
duties as they then stood. I may have been mis- ference in the corn market of this country—an expecta-
taken, Sir, but all subsequent events have confirmed tion which had been disappointed by subsequent legisla-
my impression that we were not in error, tion—he did think that it would now be a great injustice
and that the course we have taken has been a wise one. to levy any further duty upon timber. But reverting
—(Cheers.) But if it had been mistaken, would I have to the proposal of the Hon.- Member fur Bucks, he
had any personal or political object to gain in for felting repeated that its adoption would preclude them
your good opinion—in relinquishing office—in exposing from taking nay steps to diminish the debt which had
myself to the abuse and vituperation of those who had been contracted within the last few years, and would
been my friends, and—infinitely more galling and more also deprive them of any opportunity of reducing the
painful—in losing your confidence?—(Loud cheers.) taxation, which now pres,.ed either upon the industrious
But I must submit to it, and, submittirge I declare that or the propertied classes. It would, he thought be wiser
the interval which has passed has only confirmed my to wait until the fir ancial statement for the year we;
confidence in the prudence of the course that was laid before the House, and ti ey were in a condition to
adopted in pursuance of the policy of those commercial judge of the whole case, before they came to any resc-
principles which .voro acted on subsequently to 1312, and lution :Jet:fetes% The Right Honourable Member for
to which the prevent Government has, infinitely to my the Oxford University had said that his Right Honour-
satisfaction, steadily end consistently adhered.—(Cheer- 41.1 e Friend (Sir G. Grey) stated that the resolution
ing.) Sir, I agree with the lion. Gentleman—l am no would not preclude them from considering the pro-
enemy to the landed interest; all my prejudices, sympa- priety of transferring these charges to the Consolidated
thive, and interests are connected with it—l agree with Fund; but then his Right Honourable Friend stated,
him, that the land is the stable basis of the countrj.— that he merely meant certain small charges which could
(Loud Protectionist cheering.) I should deplore the day be more t ffectually dealt with in that way, but which
when the land lost its legitimate influence, but ray belief would not be of any great advantage to the agricultural
is that that day will never come. My belief is that the land classes specially. Nor, indeed, did he think that real
will always retain its legitimate influence. Why, you property was a species of property that had any special
are now exclaiming that if there were a dissolution of claim upon them for relief.—(Cheers.) Besides this it
Parliament, and new elections took place, so predomi- was not certain that this remission would in the slight-
nant is the influence of the land that you would re- est degree benefit the tenant-farmers, fur whom it was
turn a. Parliament which should revive protection.— ostensibly asked. But there was another circumstance
(Loud cheers.) I totally diffor from you with respect to of great importance, which must not be overlooked
that result. It is my firm belief protection never will in considering this question, and that was the in-
and never can revive—(Loud cheers and counter-cheers) creased expenditure which would be caused by the
—but you convince me you think the just influence of transfer proposed. As long as that expenditure was
the land is not diminished when you prophesy that you defrayed out of the local rates, there was a guarantee
can restore protection .—(Renewed cheering.) The for economy, and a strong disposition on the part of
lapse of time, the progress of public opinion, the altera- guardians to use it, which it would be very difficult for
Lions of institutions and manners, make great changes in his Right Hon. Friend, the President of the Poor-law
the causes which contribute to the influence of landed Board, to enforce if the whole was transferred to a ge-
property. It would now be utterly impossible to clothe neral fund. But besides the transfer of the establish-
the land with the privileges it possessed at the time the meat charges, the Hon. Gentleman proposed to transfer
feudal system was imposed. All institutions have alike the casual poor.—(Hear, hear.) He had heard that
been compelled to change and modify the grounds on proposal with great surprise, because, if there was one
which- they maintain popularity. Queen Victoria can- class of poor that was liable to increase more than an-
not speak to the House of Commons in the tone in which other, it was the casual poor. Upon a former occasion,
Queen Elizabeth addressed thorn; but I doubt whether Mr. Ward had stated in that House that the cost for the
the influence of Queen Victoria, though great preroga- casual poor had increased in Sheffield, in the course of
Lives of tee ICrowa have been relinquished—l doubt if a few years, from 131. 15s. to 5001—(Hear, hear.) He
her influence in your affectionate attachment and willing, did not see how his Right Hon. Friend could control or
obedience is not greater than that which Queen Elisabeth- check expenditure in that class. It could only be
enjoyed.—(Loud and universal cheering.) So it has been done by vigilant local control. He came to the
with the privileges of the aristocracy—so it has been with conclusion, then, that it was not desirable to make
the privileges of the House of Commons. There was a the proposed transfer, either on account of the
time when he who fished in your ponds would have been
apprehended and punished for a breach of privilege.— charges themselves so proposed to be transferred,
(Laughter.) You made wise concessions to justice—old or on account of the increased expenditure it would
' occasion. But there was another part of the state-
abuseseare gone, but has your legitimate influence de .-
melit which the Honourable Gentleman had made, and
creased? No, but it has been derived from other sources.
Your willing abandonment of what could not be justly which had also been made by others holding the same
maintained has given you ample compensation in views, which deserved serious consideration. The Hon.
the
hearts of the people; and so it has been with the land. Gentleman said that this must not be considered as a
payment of the whole debt due to the landed interest,
The froward retention of old enactments and old privi-
but merely as an instalment, and had intimated that he
lege; would only undermine, not sustain your power. was prepared with a series of measures to follow this as
But the time having arrived when the relinquishment of further instalments of the assumed debt. Well, were
protection was more for your permanent advantage than they prepared to adopt these measures.— (Hear, hear.)
relining it after a severe struggle, my belief is that, The Right Honourable Member for the University of
by relinguishing and by giving to the poor and to the Oxford, said he was not, and that agreeing to one did
labouring classes jibe advantages of unrestricted imports, not imply support of the others. But that it was part
by doing it ivillingly, when there was no immediate pros- of one consecutive policy was akown by the speech of
sure upon you, when there was no threat, no menace, the Hon. Member for Bucks, and by the views of those
you have received ample compensation in the point of in- by whom he was supported. The petition presented by
creased influence and authority. Your great influence Ron. Member from his own constituents prayed for
cannot be diminished. It is founded en ancient institu- duties on all articles of foreign] import, cii course in-
tions-ein the nature of the Constitution, and in your eluding corn. The measure, therefore, was intended, in
high character, and depend on it that it will not be the first place, to lead to the placing the poor-law este-
abated because you have refused to receive pecuniary bitshment charges on the Consolidated Fund, and in the
advantage by increasing the price of corn, and reviving next
place to lead to the restoration of protective duties.
the restrictions on the rood of the people.—(Cheers.) I
felt sure your interest was intimately connected and in- He must confess he was considerably surprised at the
manner in which the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr.
terwoven with the general prosperity of the country. It
may be premature now to decide on the ultimate results Gladstone) bad argued this question. He said
of the policy we have pursued—(Cheers)—but • give the Protectionists the first of these series
not entitled prematurely to condemn it.--(Cheerosa)arel of measures in oiler to weaken their chance of its
restoration. The Right Honourable Gentleman was
am speaking at a moment when the exports of mandae-
celebrated for his logic at the University, he now
luring produce in this the first year of free trade in corn
have exceeded by 10,000,000/. the exports of the last represented, but he must certainly say that such logic as
year during which restriction on food prevailed. lam that was widely different to anything he had ever heard
before.fro The usual process was to prevent an opponent
speaking at a time when there is general contentment
and submission to the law, when crime has been dimi- themlrtitiing any advantage or accession of power, but
nished, when prosperity has been increased, when there process.e Honourable Gentleman would reverse that
has been an increased consumption of food—if you lf the House was to agree to go into. Committee
no doubt the Protectionists would immediately intro-
will not admit that all these have been the results duce some measure
Ri
ht
tr the restoration of the duties on
Y food, which the
of our commercial policy you cannot deny that the
sisted in abolishing.g If they gave such paltry relief,
Honourable Gentleman had us-
have been effects concurrent with it.—(Loud cheers.)
refuseda s it wouldthe be
restorationconsidere do
fb by them, as
ohnotteww million,
would that
tabuidt
I don't taunt the Honourable Gentleman for not
bringing forward the question of protection • but Ido
deplore that 'there has not been, and. is not likely to be, weaken or allay agitation in the country. He believed
on the contrary, that this agitation would La ten times
an opportunity for testing, by discussion, the merits of
tthuat great question. It is, I cannot help feeling, unfor- greater than now. Though he confessed he under-
nate• that, by some direct vote, we cannot decide
stood the object of the Honourable Member for Buck-
whether protection shall be revived or not.
It would be inghamshire, he could not understand those who, being
important to set at rest the minds of the occupying against the end, yet voted for the means.—
tenants on this subject—it would be important to en- (Hear, hear.) The agriculturist's might think the Go-
courage them to apply themselves to the improvement distress, and
of the land.—(Cheers.) I wish the landlords wouldonly
understand that it is by improve at by thHe sincerely sympathised with
vernment was insensible to their
refused them relief.
tion of skill, by facilitating the exertions'
of hise applies-
tenantry, that distress, but he believed that they would
.. noth only
that he must rely for the ability to meet foreign
compe-
tition, and that he must abandon the hope of protection. seriously disappoint them, but seriousAtly itnojuthree
htuerdmouist
such a resolution as that was passed.
di-
-(Cheers.) My firm belief is that protection isante-1815, less than
on the land, he would state, that while. 28. 3d. c-f the
nable; but lam sorry it is not brought to the test by rent taxation fell upon real property in
distinct motion by which the opinion of the House af
the land had also
one-half fell upon it in 1849, and as .
Commons could be ascertained. If it were broughto risen in value, he did not see any just ground in the pro-
forward, I should then state at length e posal now made. The true interest of the landed pro-
forward,
ou which I adhere to the principles prieto
commerce, rs of this country was to encourage manufacturi,s
'
on which I acted in 1842, and on which I and to promote the General :prosperity of the
should implore you not to check the confi- country. because nobody would more largely participate
denee that has been reposed in the justice and wisdom in it than they would. If they did this, it they bent
of Parliament. I should ask you to trust to the revival their energies to the improvement of the cultivation of
of agricultural prosperity, by continuing the encourage- the land, instead of employing their time and money in
men; of labour, by increasing the demand fur your pre- au agitation which a Noble Duke hat avowed was in-
duce, by tended to turn a Government out of office and restore
removing every remeret of restriction, by
giving to this great people, possessed of such advantages protection, they would most effectually promote their
as no other own prosperity.—(Hear, hear.) The continuance
country in the world enjoys—in the com-
mand of s,kill, of coal, of capital—of every element of of this agitation could only tend to prolong
prosperity--a free supply of food; I should implore you the distress that existed, and to unsettle men's
to trust; to these privileges,awe. If it was terminated, he had no doubt that
~...-3- •
'the agricultural -classes would act as Mr. Lind-
to your superiority, and all
Lind-
these "tiell"Tantfiges, and never again to seek by I