The Sun.
London, England, 1844-03-19 00:00:00

' ment. He confessed that if the argument of consistency
was the only one which he had to urge, he would throw
that argument to the winds.—(Hear, hear.) If subse-
quent information had' convinced him that he had
formerly acted wrong, he should feel it his
bounden duty not to shrink from avowing that he had
chanrd his opinion. This question had been discussed
over and over again in the House of Commons ; it had
been repeatedly examined in Committees and by Com-
missioners appointed for the purpm,e, and they
had all uniformly recoiled' from the measure which
his Noble Friend the Member for Dorsetshire
recommended to the House.—(Hear, hear.) The point
before them was a very simple one ; it was as important
as it was simple. It was the point which was commonly
designated the Ten Hours' Bill. The question was
nominally whether they would take the step of restrict-
ing the hours of labour for young women to ten hours,
but practically and really the proposal was to limit the
working of the factories to those hours.—(Hear, hear.)
To that proposal the Legislature had hither refused to
accede. Some Hon. Gentlemen, in arguing this ques-
tion, had said in effect, " We are in a new and untrod-
den path ; we have sanctioned interference with factory
labour, and having done that we cannot go on too ra-
pidly." He confessed that he drew a very different
conclusion.—(Hear, hear.) Believing that they
were treading in a very peril us path he was
anxious that they should walk in such a path with
great caution.--(Hear, hear.) It was not enough to ask
him whether it was right that a woman or a young
person should be employed for twelve hours a day in a
factory. He was prepared at once to say, he wished to
God they could prevent it.—(Hear, hear, and cheers.) If
he could view the case as an isolated one, unconnected
with consequences, no one could be more anxious than
himself for the proposed alteration. But that was nut
the sole question before them.--(Hear, hear.) In all
human things good and evil were mixed together ; and,
as legislators, they would act a most unwise, and a most
narrow part, nay, they would act in opposition to
the interests of those whom they wished to
benefit, if they did not pause before the, came
to a decision. Honourable Gentlemen asked, what
was the great difference between ten hours and twelve;
and they reminded them that in the Factory Bill, which
had passed through that House, they had already li-
mited the period of labour to twelve hours. Now he
would state why, in his judgment, they had acted on
safe grounds in the course they had hitherto pursued,
and why he thought that the course now pursued was
one of peril. He believed that when.inquiry was first
instituted in 1833, it was found that all well conducted
factories in this country were not worked practically more
that twelve hours a day. If that were the Lase, so long
as they did not interfere with that arrangement, any other
regulations which they might adopt were likely, impera-
tively speaking, to be safe. What did they do under
those circumstances ? They applied their care princi-
pally tnchildren, and they regulated the hours of labour
in such a manner as to oblige the manufacturers to adapt
their work to the twelve hours' system. By doing that,
they hid doubtless, to a certain degree, raised the
charges upon the manufacturer, but still they never in-
terfered with the possibility of his working his mill for
twelve hours.—(Hear, hear.) He maintained that this
was a very important distinction.—(Hear, hear.) They
could not confine their views to this country alone in
discussing that subject ; they must look abroad.—
(Hear, hear.) The measure which they were now
discussing was to apply chiefly to those
vast and important branches of their manufac-
tures which depended for their existence upon the
export trade, which were subject in every instance,
and at every step, •to a very close competition with fo-
reign rivals.. And what was the case with regard to the
foreign manufacturers ? He apprehended that at that.
moment there was not a country in this world where
cotton manufactures were established, in which the
common period of working was not twelve hours a-day,
and generally more.—(" No, no," from Lord Ashley.)
His Noble Friend the Member for Dorsetshire expressed
his incredulity on that subject. He would be glad to
hear, from him if in any country in the world there was
a law which prohibited mills from being worked
more than twelve hours a-day ?—(Hear, hear.) Ile
would be glad to hear him mention any country in
which the mills were not actually worked twelve hours.
He would refer to one country—a very important manu-
facturing country—a country which, with respect to the
cotton trade, was one of our most dangerous rivals—he
meant the United States of America; and he selected
that country the more readily, because it was one in
which the competition was- not so intense as to drive
the population to subject themselves to intolerable la-
bour. What was the state of the cotton manufactories
of that country? Ile begged to quote the evidence of
a very respectable gentleman in America connected with
the cotton manufacture. He was asked what was the
number of daily working hours,' and his answer was,
" The actual number of working hours averages twelve
hours work at some seasons, at some seasons it is nearly
fourteen, and at other seasons it is little*more than ten."
—(Hear, hear.) Now he thought that the House would
at once perceive that they were taking a much more
dangerous step in reducing the hours from twelve to
ten than they had taken formerly in reducing them to
twelve: They were going on quite a new ground:--a
ground quite different from that which they had oc-
cupied in preventing infant labour from being unneces-
sarily severe and burdensome.—(llear, hear.) 1k would
not trouble the House by entering into the details of this
question, which had already been so ably dealt with by his.
Right Hon. Friend (Sir J. Graham). It was quite evi-
dent that the effect of the Noble Lord's proposal would
be a material diminution of wages.—(Hear, hear.) No
one who had any acquaintance with the manufacturing
districts would undervalue this effect.—(Hear, hear.)
The, seasons when distress and famine stalked abroad in
our manufacturing districts, were not seasons of over-
is ork, but seasons when there was a difficulty in obtain-
ing employment. It was then that disease was rife, and
crime was found to abound.—(Laughter.) And if, by
the mistaken legislation of that House, they should pro-
duce a real and permanent stagnation of the trade of this
country, they would inflict far more misery in a week
than they were now seeking to remedy.—(Hear. They
were told, to be sure, that manufacturers had always shown
a great disposition to amendment, and that this was a
reason for adopting the Noble Lord's proposal. Why,
manufacturers were, he imagined; much like other
people; nobody liked to be interfered with if they pos-
sibly could avoid it.—(Laughter.) He admitted that
the apprehensions witch the manufacturers had formerly
expressed with regard to the Factory Bill had proved to
be unfounded; but he did not think that they ought on
that account entirely to. disregard their representations,
especially if, on examination, they proved to be founded
on reason. He could not join his Hon. Friend, the
Member for Kendal, in regretting that Parliament had
ever undertaken to regulate factory labour; on the con-
trary, he thought that experience had shown that they
had conferred most important benefits on the
youthful population in the manufacturing districts
by Parliamentary interference; and he believed that
even 'the manfacturers themselves who had been most
opposed to .the change, were now convinced that such
was the case. But with regard to the effect which their
interference might produce on foreign countries, it was
highly important in his opinion' that they should not
take any rash or precipitate step.—(Hear, hear.) If
they saw them crippling their manufactures by unwise
and hasty legislation, it was very unlikely that they
would follow them in the same course.—(Hear, hear.)
Though the circumstance of great masses of people being
there congregated together gave facilities for the regula-
tion of labour in factories, yet there were circumstances
connected with factory labour which ought to make them
particularly cautious, and which ought to prevent them
from pushing the principle of interference to an unwise
and dangerous extreme.—(Hear, hear.) He did not
wish to introduce into that discussion any question
which might interfere with the dispassionate considera-
tion of this subject ; but there was one point involved
in that question, to which, from its importance, he could
not omit alluding. They had in this country established
a protective system ; in various ways, he would not
then say whether wisely or unwisely, successfully or
unsuccessfully, they had protected various interests
But there was one thing which they could not protect,
and that was their export trade. He warned the House
that if they adopted this proposal—if they entered upon
this new course of legislation, they would have to
adopt many other measures, or else see a degree of ruin
and misery inflicted on various great interests in this
country, which it wa lamentable to contemplate. He
would not follow the Right Hon. Gentleman (Sir James
Graham) in his description of the effect which the adop-
tion of the motion of his Noble Friend must inevitably
have, first upon the wages of the labourer, then upon
the profits of the manufacturer, and, lastly, upon the
general trade and industry of the country. But he found
the effect so clearly and ably stated in the Report of the
Commissioners in 1833, that he would take the liberty
of reading a very striking passage to the House. (The
Right Hon. Gentleman then read an extract from the
Report. It stated, that if the ten hours' system were
enforced, there might, indeed, be a temporary
searcity of manufactured goods, so as, in the
first instance, to occasion a rise of prices,
which might, as long as it lasted, allow of the main-
tenance of wages ; but this result could not in the nature
of things be of long duration ; the small factories would
soon be swept away and the more opulent would even-
tually share the same fate ; the ultimate result would be
a general recuction of wages.) In this the whole case
was so clearly, though so shortly, stated, that he would
be unwilling to weaken its effect by adding to it any
arguments of his own. He knew that those who took
the course which he was taking might possibly be
charged with inconsistency. He had cheerfully consented
to interfere with labour under certain circumstances.
He thought cases might be brought before
the House, so revolting, so shocking, so out-
traging to the common feelings of human nature, that
he would listen to no arguments against alteration, but,
rather acting from impulse than reason, he would feel
sure that he was right in putting an end to such abomi-
nations.— (Hear, hear.) With that view he had sup-
ported the measure of his Noble Friend the Member
for Dorsetshire last year, prohibiting the employment of
women and girls in mines. He had never regretted
having done so, and he believed that he never would
regret the course which he had pursued in reference to
that question. But he could not but feel that there was
the greatest danger, if they did not look well and cir-
cumspectly to consequences, that, with the best inten-
tions in:the world, they might strike a blow at the ma-
nufacturing interests of this country, and thereby
inflict injury on the working classes generally.—
(Hear, hear.) On these grounds lie was pre-
pared to offer all the opposition in his power to the
motion of his Noble Friend ; and he was prepdred.to
share with the Government the odium and unpopularity
which might attach to such opposition. He had seen no
reason, from what he had heard on that debate, to alter
the opinions which he had hitherto entertained ; he
felt bound, therefore, to give a decided vote against the
proposal of the Noble Lord.7-(Cheers.)
COLQUHOUN said it was no easy matter to meet
authorities so
.great and arguments. so strong as those
which had been urged against the proposal of the Noble