The Sun.
London, England, 1850-03-13 00:00:00

lie officers? If it were so, would it not be much better
to let tee Her. Member for Oxfordshire (Mr. Henley)
bring f rward the motion of which he had given notice,
and have it discussed upon its own intrinsic merite than
cull-an-ass that discussion by any vogue or eeneral reso-
lutiote such al the one before the House? Whatever
his Hon. Friend might say, he (Sir R. Peel) did not be-
lieve :lilt he intended to dialieish the confidence of the
public creditor—he did not believe that he ietended to
reduce the civil list, and that he concurred io the posi-
tion taken by the Hon. Member for the West Riding tie
other night, that an engagement having been contracted
by Parliament with the Crown at the commencement of
the present reign, that that was a solemn engagement
which we were bound to maintain.—(Hear.) Would
the House bold out an expectation that there should
be -a reduction in the military expenditure? Why,
what was the vote which it came to only that morn-
ing? On this, Tuesday night, the 12th of March, they
were called upon to eneoura„;e a general expectation in
the country that adequate means should be forthwith
adopted to reduce the expenditure of' the country, and
he found that that very morning the House of Commons
refused to diminish the effective strength of the army
below 99,128 men by a majority of 223 to 50. That was
the vote which the House had come to. Tbus they had
excluflel the public creditor and the civil list, whilst the
question of salaries had better be maintained for separate
consideration.—(Hear, hear.) The other great items of
the public expenditure were the army, navy, and
ordnance—chiefly the army and navy; and they ap-
proached them on this day early in the evening, having
at a very early period of the morning declared by a
majority of 223 to 50 that the effective force should be
maintained at 99,128 IMP, which governed the whole
expenditure of the army estimates; and at a late hour
that morning had determined by a majority of 117 to 19
to maintain a force of 39,000 seamen and 11,000 marines,.
—(hear, hear.) Now he was decidedly in favour of
the policy and necessity of retrenchment. He believed
there were many taxes which now pressed upon the
energies‘of the country, and diminished the comfsrts of
the great mass, the reduction of which, if it could be
effected consistent'y with good frith and the
public security, would confer inestimable benefit.
Nay more, he believed that in time of peace, and
ie order to carry out the principle of retrenchment, they
must consent to incur some risk.—(Hear, hear.) If they
chose to declare that they would have their garrisons
and fortifications in a complete state at all times, he ven-
tured to say that no amount of annual expenditure
would be sufficient for the purpose. If they adopted the
opinions of military men, who slid they would throw
upon Parliament the whole responsibility of a war sud-
denly breaking out, and the consequences which might
result therefrom, they would overwhelm the country with
expenditure, and he thought, theref ire, that the Govern-
ment aught to feel assured that the House of Commons
would protect them if they did incur, with respect to
some of our distant possessions, a portion of that re-
sponsibility which must be incurred by making a saving,
and their not being f end in a state of preparation in

the event of a sudden attask. lls went further. Baum
pirate si pacem veils was a maxim which could not be
contradicted; but at the same time it was one which
must be received with great qualification and reserve.
With respect to many of our means of defence, they
could not be called suddenly into action. They must,
theref ire, be always maintainel, even at a period
( f peace, in a stets of efficiency. But he be-
lteve3 they consulted their true interests and the stre lgth
of the country by husbanding their resources, and trust-
ing to those latent and dormant energies which, when
called out, would rally this gallant and glorious people
around the national standard, and enable us to set at
defiance all the insults or menaces of foreigners.—
(Cheers.) lle agreed that the maintenance by foreign
p )wers of such enormous establishments ought to act as
a warning as well as an example. Foreign powers
might be impressed with the idea that they thus rendered
themselves exempt from attack, but be believed that the
system overburdened their people, and that no greater
benefit could be conferred upon the human race than
those powers consenting to maintain their relative posi-
tions towards each other, and each reducing its army.—
(Hear, hear.) It was the aggregate of their military
force which was undermining the very foundation of
their prosperity, and the financial trial, when it came,
would be a most severe one. His opinion was, with re-
ference to all the powers—Russia, Prussia, France, and
Austria—that if they had but the good sense to maintain
their relative strength, and put down some portion of
the enormous expenditure which they were at present
incurring by the mainteuance of their armies, thay
would not diminish their security, but greatly contribute
to their prosperity. Still, the example which they set
could not be disregarded; and if they chose to have
those enormous establishments, it did impose upon this
country the necessity, he would not say to make corres-
ponding preparations, but at least not to diminish its
force to the extent to which we should diminish it if all
fear and apprehension of a sudden attack were altogether
removed. These were his views with regard t this
question. But he did advise the House of Commons
to apply itself to economy in practical details, and not
to give votes on one day of 223 to 50 in favour of the
maintenance of an army of 100,000 men, and of 170 to
19 in favour of 39,000 seamen and 11,000 marines; and
on the very same day to come to a general resolution
justifying a general expectation on the part of the
country that some great reduction would take place.
On these grounds, then, he could not vote for the finan-
cial part of the motion of his Hon. Friend. He be-
lieved that, if carried, it would end but in delusion, and
that the House of Commons would say, " Hero we
have performed a great work ; we have come to this
glorious resolution; and, reposing upon our laurels, we
need not apply ourselves to the active and somewhat in-
vidious duty of attending to economy in smaller
details."

Mr. NEWDEGA.TE would support the motion, be-
cause it was justified by thecircumstances of the country,
and intelligible in itself. Notwithstanding the asser-
tions of Hon. Gentlemen opposite to the contrary, it
was well known that a large majority of the labourers
of the country were dependent on agriculture for sup-
port.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet the
Member for Tamworth contended that the low prices of
agricultural produce were not caused by his free trade
measures, and 3 et those measures were passed avowedly
to produce low prices. It was amusing to hear the
Right Hun. Baronet taunt the Hon. Member for West
Surrey with inconsistency.—[Sir R. PEEL denied that he
had done so.] If the Hon. Member for West Surrey
proved an advocate of free-trade doctrines, the county
would probably not return him again to enlighten the
House by his eloquence. With respect to the pressure
of taxation during the war and in no present day, it
would be found, if the difference of the currency were
taken into account, that the taxation of 1813 did not ex-
ceed that of 1849. If the population had increased one-
third, agricultural produce had been reduced 47 per cent.
in value since 1813, and the exports had diminished 70
For cent. in value. He concurred in what had fallen
from the Right Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Peal) as to main-
taining the requisite establishments, but he could not
acquiesce in the attempt to fet aside the consideration of
the question before the House.
Mr. EVELYN expressed his intention to support the
motion. He hal been sent to that House to support re-
duction of expenditure, which appeared to, afford the
only chance of reli f to the country.
Colonel SIBTHOR2 supported the moron. As re-
garded the vote of that morning referred to by the Right
Hon. Barone, (Sir R. Peel), they had the consolation of
reflecting that it was the very hither of j.nconsistency
that made the charge. The farmers to a man would pat
their shoulders to the wheel for the purpose of shoving
the present Ministers from their places, but not with the
view of putting the Right Honourable Member for
Tamworth in their position with his friend and ally
the Member for the West Riding of Yorkshire as
Chancellor of the Exchequer. Those genalemen who
now voted for Government, expectants of office, or pro-
bably paid for their support, would be the t rst to retract
their errors on the hmtings and Like protection for their
watchword.

Colonel THOMPSON had felt himself gomewhat in

the predicament of the navigator, who, when asked to ,
jein in some doubtful religious ceremonial, said, "If
this is the devil, I worship God." Ho had some idea of
offering his vote on the other side of the 'Louse under a
similar protest, and would probably have done so had
he heard nothing but the speech of the Honourable
Mover. But what was to bo done with the speech of the
Honourable Seconder, who, with all the eloquence
for which ho was remarkable, impressed. the House
with the idea that every one who voted for the motion
must be held as voting to raise the price of corn ? The
bait was reduction of taxation ; the hook protection to
agriculture. The Honourabe Seconder avowed the
otj,:et, without any appearance of disgrjse ; and ho
(Colonel Thompson) must, under these ath•cumstances,
he permitted to decline voting with the other side of the
House.
Mr. WOOD observed, that when he fotend a Member
so distinguished as the llonourable Member for West
Surrey, than whom none knew better how to assert what
he meant, proposing an a'ostract resolutien which con-
tained nothing but a political truism, he was obliged to
ask whether it did not mean something else.. By far the
larger number of there who had supported the motion
had spoken of the dismal position of the fa.erners in con-
sequence of free trade ; and at all evearts one party
might allege,
were the motion carried, that it recognised
.a right in the farmer tole() protected, ea 'Mist another
might interpret it as heralding a real red action in the
military establishments. The latter supp, asition would
be an entire delusicn, because the Honot ruble Mover,
when an attempt was male to effect reds iction in the
army, walked out of the House. There an impene-
trable mystery about the motion ; but then to was not so
with respect to the views of those who supported it,
though four or five Members on the ot'hez side had
voted for retrenchment. He should suppori, the previous
question.!
Mr. STAFFORD regarded the observations of the
Hon. and Learned Member (Mr. Woo d) as a sign
of the times. The meaning was, that !so would n, t
vote for the motion because not only he, !out everybody
else, must agree with the principle it asst ated. On the
present occasion, as when the motion of the Hon.
Member for the West Riding of York> hire was dis-
eusset, the Government availed themselv ea of the dif-
ferent patties for tte purpose of deft sting each in turn..:
There was a good deal for reflection, soanething for
mieth, but very little for hope, in such a :its to of parties
as the present. The time might not be very hr distant
—nearer than many likel to contemplate --when those
who represented the agricultural interest • in that House
might be compelled by the stress of cii eurnstances no
longer to consent to keep any Governmee .5 in power by
that balance of parties ; and when such ot itseations might
be broached as the Noble Lord himself w, mid ho the first
to regret. He repeated it—when they • ?laced the agri-
cultural community of this country in s neh a position
a; to feel that their property was being destroyed by
the legislation of the Government, ihey would nut
have that attachment to the arist eeratie" (if they
pleased) to the expensive institutions c f this country, of
which they had hitherto been the foi :emost champions.
The Bight Lion. Baronet the Member (or Tamworth said