The Sun.
London, England, 1850-08-02 00:00:00

LAW OF LANDLOaD AND TENANT.

Lord MONTEAGLE then rose to move, " That an
humble address be presented to her Majesty fur a Com-
mission to inquire and report on the state of the law of
landlord and tenant in Great Britain and Ireland, show-
ing the differences existing in the laws as affecting the
two parts of the United Kingdom." Ho said this sub-
ject had been for many years betore their Lordship=. A
Commission was appointed in 1843 upon the subject,
which made its report in 1845, than which no other ever
did more evil or less good. He thought so important a
subject should not be left in a state of uncertainty. The
great evils of the system arose out of the injustice and
confiscations of former times, and from the penal laws,
for although these causes might have been removed, the
effects remained. Up to 1849 they were extricating
themselves from the difficulties they encountered in
Ireland. Many of the upper classes were broken by
famine, and many of the middle class were reduced to
the pauper class. Had it not been for the measure
of 1833, the pauperism of England would have in-
, creased. There was a duty and obligation to deal with
the subject in a somewhat; different manner in Ireland
Ho had endeavoured to show that the mode of dealing
with property and the landlords was encompassed with
difficulty. The occupiers and the owners were frequently
at variance, and legislation between them was must diffi-
cult, for it might be injurious to both parties, If there
was any one thing which a purchaser of land should
know, it was under what law he purchased. He hoped
that the subject would be wisely discussed next session.
But before they proceeded with legislation for Ireland,
they should make themselves welt acquainted with the
analogous law of England. He wanted, therefore, upon
'the table of Parliament, upon the highest legal autho-
rity, a report showing the exact state of the statute law
of the two countries, that they might select from both
laws with discrimination. Mistakes upon this subject
wore made by most eminent persons, as appeared a short
time ago upon the examination of Sir Edward Sugden
before a Commission of Parliament. What he stated in
reference to the law of distraint between the two coun-
tries to be an anomaly was, in fact, the clasest identity.
Well, if mistakes might be made by so eminent a per-
sonage, they might be made by others. The Noble Lord
here pointed out some of the differences between the laws
of the two countries. What he proposed would be a
foundation for remedying these differences. He con-
cluded by moving the resolution of which he had given
notice.

The LORD CHANCELLOR said that such a report,
however desirable, would be impossible to be obtained in
any useful or available form. The law must be gathered
from judicial decision, and the statutes and the construc-
tion of the law must depend in many cases upon parole
evidence and their Lordships' decision. The law of
landlord and tenant was a vast subject, and contained
under many branches, and in many volumes. There
was the law of ejectment, the law of distress, and the law
of waste. The latter was a most complicated head.
There was the law of forfeiture, and a vast variety of
other heads, and the more learned the expositions the
greater would be the length of the report. Any one
given head would be vast enough; but to ask for a gene-
ral statement, without reference to any particular branch
•f the law of landlord and tenant could, even if it were
possible to supply it, from the uncertainty of decision,
lead to no practical result. By directing attention to
specific heads the object of the Noble Lord might, to
some extent, possibly be effected He suggested the
withdrawal of the motion.

Lord MONTEAGLE said that the Noble and Learned
Lord had to some extent misapprehended his object,
which was generally a description of the statute law of
hoped
theplain,p et
dsv ot
hcaotutnhter
accessible,ems
oar
tnei
dopneincwttsingoelulli
dg
intelligible
1 concurredinorrdais .and tenants in a
Heintbhyerethfoerire
Lordships, as he intended to enter on several particular
cases relative to the landlord and tenant question.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE said that he con-
sidored that the it.forrnation already obtained through
the medium of Committees was far more facile from
remedying the, existing evils that prevailed relative to
the landlord and tenant case in Ireland; and also he
felt it his duty to state that he perfectly concurred with
the Noble and Learned Lord (the Lord Chancellor)
when he stated that the present motion was too vague,
and teat there was a necessity for some specific motion
for the purpose of remedying the law of landlord and
tenant in Ireland, as he considered that the motion then
before the House would add to the complexity of the
present difficulties. Independent of the hopelessness of
any good result arising from the issue of the Commis-
sloe, he believed that there would be another mis-
chievous tendency, namely, that is would he the foun-
dation for exaggerated reports of the interference of
Parliament on this question. and, moreover, he thought
that any change on the principle of property would be
bad, as the law on that point was common to England and
Ireland. He regretted much that he had to oppose
the motion of the Noble Lord, because he was singularly
attentive to the business of that House and to the welfare
of this country, and more particularly to that of Ireland,
but he qprehended that the Noble. Lord did not foresee

the mischief which his motion would create thtougbout
Ireland.w. Ac such a motion would tend to itterfere
posy
itthe forms of government, he felt it his duty to or
The Earl of GLENGALL said that he epprehodea
that the House shoul i know what v.-as the ;tete of the
landlord and tenant law in Englanderd Ireland lefore
tt, could decide on the system sueed by the Noble
Lord in his motion. Ile should at the same time e%.•
press his regret that the Government had expressed th,eir
(I . erit to assimilate the law between the two eouatr76,
whilec,ni on other occasions he had frequently beard sob
Def:e and such a principle urged by sheen to
be
would-. While he dissented from the pst motion..l,r
3. say that ho considered that one in owe sPecol,n,e
andl,ea,rned Lord (the Lord Chancellor) would lend.p.l!
able.cno aid to facilitate such, as he felt convinced frora li,oir:
t wledge of the state of Irelanclethat some Cot:0300d
should,, be issued. He attributed much of the ere
feeling of the people to the negligence of the VT's,
Pr '53, rill°, while they were afforded faeilt'eb,
yert when any
ntheevne never
referred
Irish question was broagb
fo ward (with the exception of Dolly'A 1311;1
or
:we da tfoaisrerveeproarlt
lotnogbe given. The Noble .
livereds in that House; and on the following rnorninet
hi astonishment,. did not find more than seven theOlt
lines in the newspapers. Again, he adverted to er..,
and excellent speeches (10.
respondents designating them as bilious phi
who took"
•ttdico '
and from
blue-books into the sterile parts of fre.ler,u,'
them gleaned what suited their preJ „t the
make a pamphlet, or a column or two for sorae v et§
morning papers. Who. ho asked, were the inforrav_
the Pr'
of these correspondents? The)' were generally -
too
aporietors of hotels, or their waiters, and very frqtecer
mo peasant dressed something between a guern,,,F:„d the
and a member of the swell mob. lie then eli.,,,,elbHuier•
exertionsyo of the Secretary for Ireland (Sir Pie,T:e bad
_,lll .) who had materially improved some 0' the
of the country. He hoped that sow oPecl
tionT would be brought on instead of the prese
at. dojo
The raction was then withdrawn, and their Lior
adjourned.
----see'
'

- HOUSE OF OF CO2II,IIOIVS, Hugest "
THE RANELAGH SEWER. dr
Mr. B. OSBOR.NE said he had the other tisi;oe.
seintel a petition from the inhabitants of Chafes' ey
Prr.ing of this open eewer; and a 3 be underst°i(ltt, of d
he
begged
of cholera had taken place in the 'lei? ..1. :Sll'
begged to ask the Noble Lord the Member I.'ooo
monthofse (Viscount Ebrington) whether the COO°
wers intended to close it up? 006
in V.,i_scourr EBRINGTON replied that the 91.legefie the
Lee petition respecting this sewer, presented, wrf3ie es
[-lon.r and Gallant Member, disclosed a state. °tee seo
stbate
t•o means new, as the sewer had ()Len in its ILe., et
Sewers
rfor nearly a csntury past. The Cr
ioto
,bhis• , s did intend to take off the matter that wsee J. but
ewer, by diverting it into another chai.utreees.
o,7J:could not adopt the suegestions of the Pelv) Oa;
P ••IsLIAMENTARY VOTERS (IRELAIN, , 1 th'
on
m( uthsee
subject
ont7eqeut
.e.S, ir W. SOMERVILLE appeared at tbc te iio;!t3g'
eosft athcisonßfieirle, nee ( n the
A considerable number of lion. Members ''.9 e and
• onferet'"
appoin'el to meet their Lordships in c
siel,l,t,he
retired for thatgaill.
purpose. the
After an abseace in the Royal GallerPre rhea
bees ofP 01
conference of aboutreturned,
when n3 i n u t e 5 .
,_ gollb'froo
SOMERVILLE reported to tflureessid •
part of Le
theey had. declared their r' wens why ther 01 Jess°
the
hamendments made in the Bill, and left thee_
their Lordships for their consideration.
Mr. HARBOUR DUES. 011.061
MACKINNON, in reply to. Si: Gkarreesittlte)dreigt°o
that the Committee on harbour due,,.. :iiiii an.
1 yeti
abolish all such ch.
taken
vessels el •• • -s charges both 011 r"'il' d eot, 95
thalt'corfinllgoir\e'rningz on. tPc'onk slertahteioy ol.'a
BARON L. ROTHSCHILD. Le, Dett3lit
Mr. ANSTEY begged leave to ask the Sou A' ci to Pi
the heed of the Government ens whether b inteneeectillg tijoef
caseon t the
ef
tßabelreonn of
Lt h.
slat'
their meaning. 14-04 9
enThuseseh,iltdh,eaurai,:gaiu,toio:
er,71.000 I
Lord JOHN RUSSELL replied thtit, beeseldbeZ eig
Marylebone
a similar question b the Hon. .13aroneti9ed° they eelti°4-10'
that morning, and he pronsts gee, . d
he laid on the table at five o'clock, so ths„t e teallre;
ts should have time to consider: thera. '-th? teetePro-;
however, great consideration, and were 99 oily.
fully prepared as yet, but there could he 13° 4- he ,
to the nature of them, and he could titssilsretol require
Member they would be sufficiently clear au site
no explanation. ea 00014,1;iiti
the sense of
Mr. ANSTEY then
gaveof the
viberpoeoPle,
s eere, now
The CHANCELLOR of the EN.-.Cll'4'
h ePtifiti°lo.
plyw to the same Hon. Gentleman, said tsetellerooellitri
uced the r
andgoing France. The French Gu'vernicent -9 e;'. a
reductions, though not, perhaps,
d . r and made t f°l
Paris from 10d. to S.,' coca
to such a° ell hi
was desirable. ice gi•fg the
the Hon. GOULBURN, in referance to thu 13°11,00 e °O9 it
suggested
place
t h
ohilarlon. Member for Youghal, respectinggeedaPieso
wouldits postponement 00trilrasseig rode'
• . e House in very etdh9 hart
to-sight or to-morrow, a bets ee-1
left t so many .saens 000
Own. ~ ohoerslne the
eeec
..rsiity of
Lord J. RUSSELL acquiesced in t,"jotsbr,',e bees,
male University the Right Hon. Gentlemen the ce•ottle '-
Cambridge, and believed j plitb,
After g y unfair to brine- it ou until enderrj, A. od.
and 'iSticr Ba. fie:lllw, otordtshefrsjainmeMeffelictn,instelleirr.eoalig.t'beeilit'ff
Gentleman to postpone his metiers, t'
consented to postpone it until Ilooddle' ',l,oftbe se WpuceBREACH OF PRIVIL° lhe•
Mr. H. BERKELEY called the attenti° elf' ebjec;
yeomanry,
to a subject which personal! concerned iciej:' the;s-elf 9`
thcthVa
orefport of his speech a few evenings eg°,;"o-sragci 001
he was made to spe'sk u'seje he "et tbe
mentioned
Somersetshire Yeomanry, althger,pohe 1011
one word of that coils. ,of thee,ool,;
North ' Somersetshire Yeoman y end not lit •eie'e'S
the adjutant of the latterrp'ublished °, rowed diced
hut
dieting his statement. He (Mr. BeriteleYier 000°0,1
thewrote a letter in reply, stating that 110 °felt ds9 1400 °
corps at all; but in the Times of that and F ;poi.
abusive and blackguard letter—(Laughtem'e hirie'cl. toe
" Order,
e”onosrder 1
"e
—appeared from the lie had Ili 0
n 0 would not think the terms oesg
strong, when he read the publication. , each Le,
101/rooo'
Lord JOHN MANNERS said OP eet t
was offensive d IL' rer
and unparliamentary, au e 0 of
Gentleman was out of order. the itec
Mr. BERKELEY said he would withdra the
et „set-
t t"' • le"' 1.
sion as it
was considered an offensive one, d 0
doeis
the
the letter gave him the lie direct, and °c.d. esot° es the
thelowimn most offensive terms, as would aPPe°' eoot''i
• lie g.l-7" Lately there appeared in yo,lir the lie ere
- official.' Now I must asp lainly give vel ee,, le,
to Mr. Berkeley's statement espectiug the essli eleo
of the West Somerset regimentr of yeoo339rieeede,coo. cable
any case where the members thereof hafe the ll
tupon to aid the civil power. Had he taken (re o
o refer to the statement of the Lor oeute
rile t!fi• et
theman) and Sir George Grey, in 1847, daily eollei or;
hread riots in this county, he certain hos :OW
have had the unblushing impudence so t')..:(olll,,jet'
t 4 presented facts. One thing is certainly crop (13114) ore
as maginative powers of the lion. Geng efee ttalicee I()
ointhat
the recent debate, a total disregard lea le thel
bring
‘at order which generally tends in the •ejadettilte
ring odium on the originator, rather than ote , 0001
parties to whom he referred. With reg°,,rd,e;:regitue ,Oies;
riots, his statement of the conduct 01 this 0-frier
bar 00 " pet° ea'
pure fiction, as not a single I
IN ena or, JP „
received
• marching orders." Novi ha (.' veyer,,ope,
had only again to state that he l-
l- e' ,ob
tioned directly or indirectly teeaidelit''l/
setahiro Yema ll and rid se
nry at a , : ile ,e/
was advised that the letter was the pr,°,oo, Ibe
breach of privilege, and deeply affecting . git j ~,f,
debate
—though he felt ass red, did he hrili 10,10'0"
as such, the House would.viundicete its peea eh B IV
declined doings f flh ea. ese
so, and contented 11013b,t it the vrli
that
explanation, because he believed t. „, to,e 0.,
editor of the paper who would be brought' "iriet 013 IV
and not the writer 5 00/•/ tt°
of the letter. ItsVl be sh , ik e,
that that course should be adopted. ~ e bee
'es,
therefore, press tlie matter in that direet(o"e'reet 0/9,i000
he
will wrote the letter be a man of co, ceese le
pr
he be sorry for the violent and improPeogeter 1
besutsed; but if be be a low ruffian--(l),e,(lieliii °l's
Mrwia7rito treat him was with contest:Wt. issiori 04
e NEY, as one who held a 00303 otitil
corps. of care' bore '
yeomanry for man .
y y
their efficiency and good conduct.
The see. ef°
pet then droll) d. Or i
HUDSON-43e ' COMPANIr• tbe We,
AI
Mr. GLA ' to elts ,e 1
DSTONE called attention. _ tee _.• • tee
laid on the table of the House, respectinegtereas lf,
the H e
u son B 1
ay Company to the instnells e to all of f 110
now possessed dhi ted to heiti it
an- w-.ch purp9r . ees e es
an addresslime to the Crown voted in the lass be she pa ,
'lf. He believed the Noble Lona at t dti,' Pc
- hi, 0 of ~s
Government most grossly nag next r seseiod oetay
,111 would take the earliest opportunity ON eto ilia acct
n _ ent to call the attention of the gous woes-
_Lord J. RUSSELL said that he vidull eplf>
of his Noble Friend on the subject. ~0 of sn6tiorlpe
On the motion for going into C00:01133'f -0. 133' iir
, Colonel VERNER made the followahTeeted Itllfdit);',
' That as the statements contained in the r 0 Goal
No. 297, .
- and in the petitions before the 4
otlo ' 4
• I:4l3l*ga'. fleilre`
the Waterford, Wexford, and Dublin of riti 10
and the proceedings of the Commissioners._ loa ei.f
concern the • ' nel te'' • lea
privileges of this Nouse a ..., De lend
its Members end officers, that an inel.lolJee 00004
thesaid printed papers and petitions, sloi,rreetiiese
documents, impertent to the shareholdere,
,f!'10 elo..'olde'j
the offices of this House, and ordered hietreo to olio
el
b re
the 22d of March last, to be pro3uced. ..- ert ste ,
• of t" 0 seeeelle
measures for the betterection
prot ,of eubh, to
shareholders, and the carrying. out u o'. aOO tete
and resolutions sanctioned by this lOUs , lit', i$
for th - 1 sal( loss." iod. ises.'r,
Mr.toot
of Alive
LA BO UCHERE opy sed the
were: no other reason, that this F•.
louse
the 15t refeOry ee:„.
would_ll, be sufficieet to induce the House to 0 Ye Ole
li
reerupon an investigation which
sou
o'oo4,
il ahle time. But besides that, he 01" „f disPhe cLoo
oughtme not to enter into an examinatiood `'.. 01.7 50, 01
pane.—(Cries
the directors and the shetehol ey at teeof
of " Hear, hear;') If the eefove eats
the Coe • - laid teoe be
imittee would have ter sts eid ~s,
would be the statements and the &an • sqo ilep,
ton 1,0 A 07
the parties at issue, and that in his 01''': to t' ets pe
As „Ile t
mere waste of •
time.—(Hear, heir) eOP teat 111 e
tiunse with respect to the abstraction of foY r ei ot
111 officers of that House, h had 01119. "tee be ee 0,
roe 00'
whole • e
of had been investigated 01.' er, 0 00 40,
House of I4rds, who had in their rePr ef thiel'ese 'her
the .1-
b 1g h tes t imputation upon any otfice. of I" OS'
neate - cise
For his '
own part ho indignantil rel',„.„s I,OG '
putations._(liear, hear.) There ''"