The Sun.
London, England, 1844-02-14 00:00:00

at Clontarf were of a far worse character.--(Hear.) At
Cientarf not only were those attending to be marshalled, but
they were to be marshalled in military array—and those who
attended on horseback were to be forme into troops, each one
with 'its eAcers at its head.—(Loud cries of Hear, hear.)
It was true that after these first arrangements had been pro-
mulga:ted from the Corn Exchange, they were withdrawn—
and Mr. O'Connell had repudiated them.—( Hear, hear.)
Another order of proceedings was issued, in which " group"
was substituted for troop," and " wards" for " wardens."
Then it was that the chain of evidence desired by the Govern-
ment was perfected—then it was that they knew the time had
arrived when, with sureness and safety, they might pro-
ceed.—(Loud cheers.) They had then evidence, and evi-
dence enough, of seditious words and seditious inten-
tions to complete a charge of conspiracy. And
when the time had arrived at which they knew they could
safely proeeed, they had had time to bring to bear such a force
as might enable the Government to vindicate the law, and put
down that vile agitation and conspiracy, without shedding one
drop of blood.—(Loud cheers.) Now, with respect to the
latenessof the proclamation. The first notice given of the in•
tended meeting at Clontarf was on the 28th of September,
and at that time the Law Officers in Ireland thought the time
for action was come. On the 30th appeared the proclamation
of which he spoke. As soon as it was issued, it was sent over
by post, reaching London on Sunday, the Ist of October.
Lord De Grey was at that time in England on account of bad
health. He was in the neighbourhood of London, and was
immediately sent fir to town. He arrived, and a consultation
took place of all those Ministers who, being in or near
London, could be get together. They determined to place
the whole proceedings of the Attorney-General of Ireh.nd
before the Attorney-General for England. That learned func •
tionary took exactly the same view as the law officers for Ire-
land, and Lord Dc Grey at once quitted London for Dublin.
In consequence, however, of the alteration in the wording of
the order for the proceedings at Clontarf, to which ne had
already referred, it became a matter for consideration whether
some alteration would not be thus necessitated in the proclama•
tion. On Friday all proceedings were determined en and
adopted, by which an end was to be put to the meetings, and
prosecutions commenced against the chief conspirators. It
was necessary to proceed very guardedly, in order that they
might do so safely and effectively. The moment the procla-
mation was issued persons were sent into every part of the city
of Dublin to give circulation to, and information of it ; and
for thirty miles round Dublin, persons were sent on
horseback, in every road and direction, to warn the
country people of the intentions of the Government.
They also took care that they should have a competent force
on the spot, and the meeting was prevented without a single
accident. Before he proceeded to the trials, ho must say a few
words of the Attorney-General. He had no acquaintance
with him ; before he was appointed he had not seen him—he
had not even heard of him.—( A laugh.) It was his ignorance
of Ireland and the Irish bar ; but when he was appointed
they heard, even from their political opponents, the highest
praise of him—that they had chosen the best man they could
have taken for the office. The dismissal of the magistrates was
not put by the Chancellor entirely upon the question of re-
eal ; but on the declaration of the Ministers in this House.
Whey were fairly answered, and though it had been said that
they might not read the' newspapers, he thought that such
agitators were not likely to refrain from doing so. He then
came to the trials, and he defied the Noble Lord to lay his fin-
ger upon one part of the transaction that betrayed a disregard
of justice. With respect to the construction of the panel, it was
the traversers who objected to it; they objected to the old
one, because they thought it unfavourable to them. It had to
be made out by the:Recorder ; there might be great negligence
on his part, but the Government had nothing to do with
it. It was true some of the slips were lost, but in whosecharge
were they? In that of Mr. Magrath, and, he happened not to
be a partisan of the Government, but a Catholic. He then
came to the choice of the special jury. He apprehended that
the right of challenging the jury was given to the Crown for
the purpose of enabling the Crown to strike off such persons as
they might think unqualified or unduly bra sod. Now, they
had it on the affidavits of the traversers themselves, that two of
the twelve struck out were I'rotestants, ten were Catholics.
Of these, one was a Mr. Henrick, and it so happened that,
when Mr. Kemmis struck him off, he was under the impression
that he was a Protestant. Another was a Mr. Michael Dunn,
he belonged to St. Patrick's parish, and St. Patrick's parish
was fruitful in Michael Dunn's ; there were no less that four,
and it was believed that this one was biassed. He denied al-
together that the striking off of the names arose from any
feeling that the Catholics were not to be believed
on their oaths, but because it was supposed that
persons who had already declared themselves on one side were
not to be placed on the jury. He hoped they should hear no
more of their having a packed jury, since all their object was to
secure to the accused a fair trial before God and their country.
So much for the trials upon which the Noble Marquis had
founded almost all his attacks on the Government. They
stood upon their defence here, and he said that this trial was
conducted with as much fairness as any trial was ever con-
ducted. They had done nothing unfair to procure a con-
viction, and the jury had only done their duty in returning their
verdict against the prisoners. He would leave it to the judg-
ment of the people of England, who, though they did
not actually hear what was passing in that House,
were made acquainted with it in a very short
time. He would leave it to the people of England to say
whether they were not acquitted upon this point. One word
of Mr. Smith, the Attorney-General. He lamented that he
should have placed himself in a position in which he could be
justly accused of indiscretion ; but he would leave it to their
Lordships whether there was not a point beyond which provocation
ould not be borne, and whether this gentleman was not sub-
jected to it ? And now, all this having passed, the majesty of
the law having been vindicated, let them look forward and see
%%hat could be done in the way of improvement.—
( Loud cheers.) With respect to the system of letting
lanl in Ireland, there was a necessity for inquiry • it
would be desirable that in letting land, the landlord should do
justice tc the tenant. The next great question as to Ireland
was that of the registration. With respect to counties, a new
eonsideration of what was considered the beneficial interest,
would probably lead to a diminution of the number of voters
•r. counties. With respect to the towns, what the Government
intended to do was this : at present it was necessary, in order
to be able to vote, that the voter should have paid the poor-
rates, the taxes, the borouth-rates, and some other rates.
They proposed to remove this restriction, and to enable the
person to vote if he had paid only the taxes and poor-rate.
With respect to the question of national education, it was cons
templated to take measures for the better education of masters
and mistresses, and also for the better visitation of schools.
The next question to which they meant to direct their attention
was to after the existing law so as to enable money to be lodged
in trust, to be applied to the purchase of houses and glebes for
the Roman Catholic clergy, so that if a perm wished to make
an endowment of lands to a certain priest officiating in a cer-
tain dialed, he might be enab'ed to do so. This led him to
the question of religious equality—putting the Roman Catholics
of Ireland on a complete footing of equality with the members
of the Established Church. Now at the time of the Act of
Union, the Established Church was acknowledged by that
great instrument, and this country was therefore bound
to support that arrangement. It was also acknow-
ledged, at the time of the passing of the Emancipation Act,
and the present Government were not prepared to take any
steps that might endanger the Established Church. They
would afford every facility to the Roman Catholics, consistent
with the maintenance of the Establishment; but with respect to
producing an equality, bow, he asked, was it to he effected ?
The Noble Lord then referred to the various modes which
had been pointed out of producing that result, and stated that
the resent Government could not give its countenance to
any of them. There was one subject which he had almost.
foegetten, it was that of Dean Holt Waring. His Noble
Friend had spoken of that person as having gone to attend
a meeting surrounded by a great crowd—a description which
would apply well to the manner in which the Romish (and he
did not use that term in an offensive way) clergy went to the
repeal meetings at the head of their parishioners. But if Mr.
Waring did act in that manner, on the occasion of a meeting
in favour of the Legislative Union, why, all he could say was
that he had acted improperly. Another accusation against the
present Government was that the majority of the Irish
people were not well disposed to the present Government. He
admitted it. But England and Scotland, which constituted
the majority, supported them, and they did not rule by a
minority. They had done their utmost to gain their favour ;
but tney (the Irish people) did not like them, and would not
support them. He was glad that his Noble Friend had
brought forward his motion, as it gave him an opportunity of
stating the views of the Government. They were the Minis-
tera of the Crown, and it was their duty to maintain in violate
the union between the two countries, to preserve the authority
of the Throne, and they were determined to support her Ma-
jesty in her resolution to preserve the supremacy of thel aw.
After a few words from the Marquis of NORMANBY in
explanation,
The 111Arquis of CLANRICARDE said that there was
much in the tone of the Noble Lord (Wharncliffe), with
whom he was highly gratified, but he regretted extremely that
he could not go further, and agree with the greater portion of
what the Noble Lord had said. He was pleased with the tone
of the Noble Lord's remarks, but he could not forget that a
similar tone had been often observed before, and that the deeds
that followed were by no means consistent with the words.
'With respect to some of the appointments of the present Go-
vernment in Irelani, the Noble Lord said that he had never
heard of them.

Lord WHARNCLIFFE—I said I had not heard of Mr.
Smith, as I did not frequent the law courts.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE—The Noble Lord might
have frequented the law courts without hearing of Mr. Smith.
But he must say the Noble Lord had made a most inefficient
answer to the charges brought forward by his Noble Friend
(the Marquis of Normanby). The policy of the pre-
sent Government was to exclude Catholics, and there•
fore the Irish, from a perfect equality with the rest
of the inhabitants of the empire. If these meetings
had been illegal, he thought that it was foreign from
the spirit and principles of the British Constitution to
allow them in the first instance to be holden without
reproof, and then to pounce upon the holders of them without
any previous notice or intention. He certainly thought that
the jury had found a conscientious verdict. Although he felt
perfectly convinced that the jury returned an honest verdict,
yet he should say that he was sure some of those gentlemen who
were indicted for a conspiracy had not the slightest notion that
they were guilty of it; and he was sure that this was
the opinion of the great majority of the people of that
country. He should next allude to the celebrated
Clontarf proclamation, and he considered that to be,
in the manner in which it was issued, most unjustifiable.
If the Government could not have issued it at an earlier date
than the day before the meeting was appointed to be held, he
thought it would be much more becoming of a Christian Go-
vernment to have allowed one meeting more to be added to the
number which they had previously permitted.--( Hear. )
If her Majesty's Ministers were determined conscientiously to
uphold the present system of national education in Ireland
they ought to appoint to Church preferments those persons
Rho would act in harmony with such a system of national edit-
cetion. Rut he thought it was evident, by recent appoint-
tuents to Church preferment, that those who were thus
lately
appointed were the very persons most opposed to the
system—persons distinguished by their hostility to national
education, as at present administered. As long as Government
gave their patronage thus, he (Lord Clanricarde) was sure
that the system of national education in Ireland could not be
properly carried out. With respect to the Landlord and
Tenant Commission, it was stated by a Noble Lord that no
injustice should be done to the landlord ; at the same
mideo it
should be remembered that no injustice ought to be
to the tenant.—( Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord referred
to the relative position of landlord and tenant in England.
It eat said that the proportion of rent from the soil in En...
land was one-third of the produce, and in Ireland two•thirea.
Now he (Lord Clanricarde) would engage to show that there
were tenants in Ireland, not one here and there, but many,
very many, and of a class, too, not holding beneficial leases, who
had mtde considerable sums of money, paying cheerfully and
comfortably to their landlords the rent agreed upon. lie did
not allude to farmers having their hundreds of acres, hut to
cotters renting thirty, twenty, arid even twelve acres of land.
Now w hen he knew these facts from his own experience, he,
for one, neither would join the outcry raised against the land-
lords of Ireland, nor permit that outcry to go uncontradicted.
Why, had the landlords of Ireland no higher motive—were
they actuated by no nobler feelings—their own interest would
hinder them from pursuing any course that might be of in-
jurious tendency to their tenantry. Therefore, he did say
that the Landlord and Tenant Commission, having been
issued at a time when great crimes had been committed in Ire-
land, those crimes being in connexion with the holding of land,
that such was a most rash proceeding on the part of the Go-
vernment, subjecting the landlords of Ireland—as it did—to

imputations of a very serious character, and which they did
not, by any means, merit. He would say a few
words, and a few only, on the subject of the Poor-law Inquiry,
in which was recommended a series of measures which, if acted
upon in a combined form, would be of the most etsentlal service
in remedying some of the most crying afflictions of Ireland.
He alluded to all the remedies suggested, for they were all
valuable, but he especially regarded with favour the recom-
tnendations as to emigration and a sustained system of public
works.—( Hear, hear.) These reports were in their Lordship
library, but he very much doubted whether many of their
Lordships had taken the trouble to consult them—he doubted
eveh if any of her Majesty's Ministers in that House had done
so.—( A laugh.) Let but those recommendations he put in
force contemporaneously and on a clear intelligible principle,
and they would soon be satisfied that they had hit upon a most
efficacious remedy for many of the most deep—seated grievances
under which the sister country suffered. In conclusion he
would say, that no one could consider Ireland at the present
time to be under any civil government whatever, and the
Ministry were not going the right way so to place it. The
only way in which they now kept it tranquil was by an immense
army—that army rendered necessary by their own intolerance
and misgovernment.—( Hear, hear.)
The Earl of RODEN said, when he entered the House he
had no intention whatever of taking any part in the debate,
and now that he'did so, he was urged to it only by the personal
allusion which had beets made to him by the Noble Marquis
(Clanricarde). That Noble Lord had charged him with find-
, ing fault, on former occasions, with the late Government on
account of the various agitations which existed under them,
and of not finding the same fault when those agitations
existed under a Government carried on by his own political
friends. It was his duty, disapproving as he did of those agita-
tions, to call t heir Lordships' attention to them, and he had
ever done so, without any regard to what Government was in
power, if that Government, in his opinion, did not exert its
powers to discourage and suppress those great evils. In these
respects he had never been influenced by party views, but solely
by a desire to berfefit the country in which he lived. On the
very first day of the last session he had given notice that he
should put a question to the Ministers on account of the agita-
tion for the repeal of the union. He had done so, and the mat-
ter passed by. Towards the close of the session, however, he
again found it his duty to follow that course which lie always
had followed, and to call the attention of the Government to
what was going on in Ireland. He could appeal
to his Noble Friends behind him as to the consis-
tent course he had ever pursued in these mat-
ters—( Cries of " Hear, hear")—and therefore there was not
one single ground for the charge which had then been
brought against him. He would now beg to say a very few
words indeed on some of the remarks which had fallen from
the Noble Marquis (Normanby) who introduced the question.
He had listened to his very able speech with great attention—a
speech of great talent and much information, with respect to
that country with which he had for so long a time been con-
nected. Throughout the whole of his speech the Noble Mar-
quis seemed to have taken it for granted that all the people of
Ireland approved of the course he had taken when Lord-Lieu-
tenant of that country. The Noble Marquis laughed, but that
was the drift of all he said. But he (Lord Roden) would tell
him that a very large and influential portion of the Irish people
differed widely from him in the estimate which he had formed
of his era n Government, and who now traced the miser-
able condition in which Ireland was to the unhappy
course pursued by him. They consitiersd they were
now reaping the effect of that wholesale discharge of the
gaols—( Loud laughter)—which had been the distinguishing
feature of his painful reign in that unhappy country. The
Noble Marquis had also used very strong language towards the
Government in the course they had pursued in removing from
the Commission of the Peace the magistrates who had made
themselves parties to the agitation for the repeal of the union.
But had the Noble Marquis dismissed no magistrates? Indeed,
he had ; and for no conduct which involved or compromised
the integrity of the empire as repeal did. One magistrate
was dismissed from the Commission of the Peace by the Noble
Marquis, simply because his lady appeared in public with an
orange riband round her neck. Returning to the subject of
the conduct of the present Government, he must say he was one
of those who greatly censured them for their inactivi. But after
what had fallen from the Noble Lord (wharncliffe)
he was willing to admit that he might have been wrong, and
that the Government had in the end acted most effectively.
There was an old adage, " better late than never," and he
was willing to acknowledge that the results of the trial would
produce the best effects on the tranquillity of Ireland, and ma-
terially conduce to the strength and happiness of the empire.
The worst of all was that the question of repeal had been
made a Roman Catholic question—the effect of which in Ire-
land had been, to engender the belief among the masses, that
the upshot of the whole would be the downfal of the Pro-
testant, and the ascendant) of the Roman Catholic religion.
He wished to say one word as to the conduct of the Irish Attor-
ney-General, and then he would no further trouble their
Lordships. On the grand jury, in the recent trials, were
three Roman Catholics, and they of course, before commenc-
ing their important duties, had taken a solemn oath to keep
their own and their fellows' counsel. No sooner was the
bill found than one of the Catholics thus sworn
to keep his own and fellows' counsel came into the box, and
said he was dissentient to the finding of the Bill.—( Hear,
hear.) Was not this sufficient to make the Attorney-General
doubly careful in the striking of his other jury? Had he not
been so, after such conduct, people would have said he was not
an honest man nor an honest functionary, and that in his
heart he did not desire to get a verdict against the tra-
versers.—( Hear, hear.) The Noble Marquis (Clanricarde)
having alluded, in somewhat taunting terms to his (Lord Ro-
den's) opposition to what was ealled the nes ional system of
education, he would just state in reply that he had taken the
course he had done without any party feelings whatever, and
solely because by that system it was proposed to rob
them of their greatest treasure and their truest blessing—the
unmutilated copy of the Bible.
The Earl of DEVON said he wonld state very shortly the
course which had been adopted by the Commission of which he
was the head. On the Ist of December he went to Ireland,
and remained actively employed until the meeting of Parlia-
ment. The course they had taken to obtain information was
to issue circulars to all bodies of jurors, and to every Protest-
ant and Roman Catholic bishop, requesting them to aid and
assist in procuring information ; arid he was happy to say that
in every quarter they me t with most kind answers from all par-
ties, and all parties seemed disposed to assist them in their inquiry.
They had felt it their duty, whilst sitting in Dublin, to exa-
'dile a number of persons there, but they had issued their
circulars, by which they had made it known that it was their
intention to visit various parts of the country, and to make the
examination on the spot. He hoped to be again in Ireland in
March to proceed with the inquiry; and the relations of land-
lord and tenant would then receive their closest at-
tention. He did not go to Ireland to ascertain whether
the landlord was wrong, or the tenant was wrong,
but to ascertain what there was in their subsisting
relations which led to such a lamentable state of things. It
would be their duty to point out to the Government the best
means in their judgment of removing and alleviating the dis-
tress which pressed down the agricultural population. With
regard to the appointment of a secretary, they had chosen one
who, though perfectly unknown to the Commission, was well
informed on the subject of inquiry, and it was but justice to say
that they had reason to be pleased with their choice.
The Marquis of WESTMEATH defended the conduct of
the Government, and thanked them for the course they had
adepted in putting down the agitation. As to the objections
with regard to the striking the jury, the Government had no-
thing to do with it. He defended the Attorney-General,
stating, that he opened his case in a calm and temperate man-
ner ; his speech was a pain statement of facts—free from any
flowers of eloquence. He thought 105 Members were enough
to represent the interests of Ireland; and expressed himself
indignant that an English Marquis, having no connexion, by
property, with Ireland, should get up and read them
a lecture on the state of that country.—(Hear, hear.)
He repelled the insinuations that hat been made against the
Ii ish magistracy, and thought they did not come from the
Noble Marquis with a very good grace. 'l he Noble Marquis
had alluded to the increase of the burdens of Ireland caused by
the poor-law, but he did not tell them that it was a Whig
measure, originated by a very confident ex-:Minister—(A laugh)
—whose reliance on himself had been very well described by the
Rev. Sydney Smith.—(A laugh.) That measure had come to
a complete stand still. He had opposed that measure, which
was only suited 'o a country where there was a money pay-
ment for labour. He described the land let on the system of
" con-acre" to the peasantry as let entirely by the middle-men,
and not by the landlords. He reminded the House that the
history of Irish grievances had been entirely, or almost entirely,
taken from the great leader of the agitation himself. It was
by him the people were told how to think and feel on
the question of their grievances. He knew the
people of Ireland, and he was sure that many of the humbler
classes looked for nothing more anxiously than for protection
against the extortions of the repeal exchequer. He described
the people as quite under the control of their priests, and these
had almost all joined the agitation. HSknew one honourable
exception—he was a priest who was educated on the Conti-
nent, not at Maynooth ' • he refused to allow the rent to be
collected in his chapel, and he was suspended by his Bishop.
The agitator boasted of his connexion with the clergy, and
used it as an additional means of gaining influence over the
people. 'the Noble Marquis described the opinion on the
Continent to be almost universally against the policy of the
Government with respect to Ireland. This arose from the
fact that all Europe took their information and opinions on
this subject from the French press, influenced by the Catholies.
He wished that some one abler than himself would take the
pains of informing the people of Europe, by the same means,
of the true state of the Protestant interest in Ireland. The
only authority on the question at present seemed to be the his-
tory of Ireland by Mr. O'COnnell himself. Their Lordships,
therefore, might judge of the degree of authority to be attached
to it, as to matters of fact. lie concluded by thanking their
Lordships for the attention with which they had heard him.
Lord HOWDEN said that connected as he was by birth
with Ireland he could not refrain from expressing his regret
that the Noble Marquis had thought it his duty—or he would
rather say had thought it expedient—to bring the present mo-
tion before the House. As he had brought it on, he (Lord
Howden) should feel it his duty to vote against it, not that he
did not agree entirely with the Noble Marquis in his wish that
Ireland might share every equal right and equal benefit
with England, but because he thought his motion
was ill-timed, and being ill-timed it was mischievous.
It was particularly mischievous at this moment, when he might
say that it was backed up in Ireland by circumstances which
might—he did not say that its object was to—embarrass the
Government.—( Hear, bear.) And knowing, as the Noble
Marquis did, the acuteness and intelligence of the people of
Ireland, he must be aware that no other result could spring
from it. At that late hour of the night, it was not his inten-
tion to follow the two Noble Marquises through the details of
their brilliant speeches. As the Noble Lord on this side of the
House had said he should only make some general observa-
tions—(A laugh)—and these he should confine to a few of the
remarks made by his Noble Friends. They were mischievous
in this, that they laid all the crying evils of Ireland to the door
of the present Government; and that every thing wrong,
even to the faults in the management of the late
trials, ought to be imputed to them. He had no doubt
that his two Noble Friends would give their
strenuous support to the motion, from an idea, perhaps, that
it was necessary by a parliamentary vote to awaken the fa-
culties and stimulate the slumbering energies of the Govern-
ment. They thought, perhaps, they were supported by sine
man in Ireland, who had never allowed an opportunity to
escape, when he could by any chance express his hatred and
contempt of their party. It would be disagreeable to himself and
to them, and at the same time offensive to the House, were he
to repeat the expressions, the course and illiterate epithets—
( Great laughter)—by which that individual had designated the
Whig party.—(Cheers.) But, perhaps they would allow him
to state something that individual had said of the same party
in a festive moment, and as it was of the nature of an anecdote,
it might perhaps relieve the tedium of debate.—( Laughter. )
He said that the party to which his Noble Friend belonged
were like old hats that they stopped windows with—( Great
laughter)—that they were nothing, but they served to keep
the other party out. If the Noble
Lords were satisfied with
this description, he did not wish to diminish that satisfaction.
He hoped the feeling might shed its charming
them while they continued to sit on the shady
House.—(Laughter.) He (Lord Howden) had no connec-
tionti with her Majesty's Government, still he should notice the
the two accusations brought against it ; one of them was, that
there was a total indifference to the affairs of Ireland in those
constituting the Government—that, as far as Ireland was con-
cerned, it was a do-nothing Government ; the second accusa-
tion was, that there existed in it an actual hostility to Ireland;
this was asserted by the Radical portion of the opposition party
Now, could any man believe, that at this timeof day, and at such
a juncture, in the state to which that country bad been brought

by the inflammatory speeches made both in Ireland and in that
House, by persons who were not responsible in situation, and,
therefore able to say anything that suited their views. While
the Government was responsible for all they did, and milieus
lest even their indiscreet expressions should produce mischief,
at such a juncture, did not their Lordships think that Ireland
must be the last thought at night and the first thought in
the morning, of any Government whatever ?—( Cheers. ) There
could not be a more insidious manner of agitating a high and
noble spirited people than by telling them that they were
neglected by the Government of this country. Why, at pre-
sent, two-thirds of the business of Parliament consisted of
Irish business, to the exclusion of many pressing matters of
their own. He did not find fault with this. He thought the
state of Ireland, and the happiness of the people demanded
and required all their consideration.—( Hear, hear.) But was
it possible to conceive that there was any object in the minds of
the Government, even for the sake of their own security, and
their own peace—he would put it even on the most selfish
ground—could they have any permanent object, both for their
own welfare and that of England, but the tranquillisation of
Ireland and their own consequent security ?--( Hear, hear.)
He would ask them what could be the use—there might, in-
deed, be a party use ; but that he would not impute to the
Noble Marquis—what we could there be in adding, under any
pretext, agitation to agitation, and embarrassment to embarass-
ment?—(Loud cheers.) The wording of his Noble Friend's
motion was much more inoffensive than he could have ex-
pected : nay, he would go further, he believed that it was
much more inoffensive than the Noble Marquis intended it to
be three or four days ago.—( Cheers and laughter.)
The Marquis of NORMA NBY—No, no.
Lord HOWDEN—He assured the Noble Marquis he was
merely expressing his epinion. He believed that the motion of
the Noble Marquis was generated and carried out even to a
very protracted period of his gestation—(Laughter)—under the
idea that the late proceedings in Ireland would have had a
consummation very different to what they had.—( Hear,
hear, and great cheering.) But now that the law in Ireland
had vindicated herself, by her own right hand, he did hope
with his Noble Friend, and with the utmost sincerity, that all
just complaints would be attended to and removed from that
country, and that its happiness might be promoted by every
means. But he believed:that a necessary condition of the hap-
piness of the people of that country was the insurance of its
tranquillity. Ile had no hesitation in following what had
been said by the Noble Earl who moved the address in reply to
her Majesty's speech, though he then highly disapproved of
any allusion to such a topic as impolitic, but he had now no
hesitation in saying that, that if by any chance, at any future
time, any measure were wanted for securing the
welfare of Ireland, by giving strength to the Crown
and peace to the subject, that call would be responded to.
It appeared to him that the people might be divided into two
classes, the deluders and the deluded. Among the latter
there were many persons full of the purest love of country,
and to whom alone was wanting the instinct of self-preserva-
tion which nature seemed to have given to every other crea-
ture. For it was his opinion, that though the union was de-
sirable, it was hilt a secondary question to England, whereas
it was, in his opinion, a question of vital importance to Ireland,
for he was sure that if they cut the tie which bound them to
England—if England should leave them to themselves, not
fifty years would roll over before " that flower of the earth,"
would be plucked by some not friendly hand ; and that
" gem of the ocean," would be set in the crown of a stranger.
—( Hear, hear.) He asked their pardon for trespassing
upon their time, but there was something so unfortunate in the
time chosen by his Noble Friend for his motion, that it forced
him (Lord llowden) to express his opinion in condemnation
of it.
After a few words from the Marquis of NORMANDY and the
Marquis of WESTMEATH,
Lord BEAUNIONT said that when his Noble Friend (Lord
Vtiliarncliffe) sat down, he felt great pleasure and satisfaction
at his speech. Ile felt pleasure at the proof his Noble Friend
had given of the intention now entertained (for now was the
time) of proposing a remedial measure for Ireland ; and this
pleasure was increased by the reflection that the Noble Lord
had satisfactorily exploined a circumstance which had been
often alluded to. By that explanation the conduct which he
(Lord Beaumont) had thought proper to pursue was justified.
The explanation he alluded to referred to the jury panel in
Ireland. That explanation rendered him (Lord Brougham)
satisfied with the conduct he pursued towards his co-religionists,
in persuading them not to attend the meeting which had been
called on that subject. He regretted, however, that he must
say that feeling of satisfaction was shaken by what had fallen
from the Noble Earl ( Roden) opposite. The Noble Earl
justified the Attorney-General for challenging the men on
the jury-list, not because they were repeaters, but because they
were Roman Catholics.

The Earl of RODEN said that what he had stated was that
the Roman Catho:ics were taught to consider the repeal ques-
tion as a religious question—that if they got the repeal the
Protestant religion would be destroyed and the Catholic re-
ligion established in its stead, and that that being the general
opinion of the people, the Attorney-General was bound to
take care not to have put into the jury box to try the question
any person who had imbibed such a prejudice.
Lord BEAUMONT—Does the Noble Earl mean to say
that if the jury bad consisted of Roman Catholics, there would
be no difference in the verdict?

The Earl of RODEN would not say that.
Lord BEAUMONT justified the Attorney-General in ob-
jecting to every person tainted with repeal. He would go fur-
ther. He was not quite certain that a person being a Roman
Catholic, might not be considered as a repealer, because some
of the repeaters had boasted that the majority of the Roman
Catholics were with them. But that objection was made to
the persons on the list previous to their being sworn. He did
not believe that the Attorney-General would imply that they
were sworn they would not act contrary. The Noble Earl
would not go so far, and that was his (Lord Beaumont's)
ground of complaint. With regard to the question itself, he
disagreed with his Noble Friend (Lord Howden), for he
thought this was the fittest time for the present motion,
when the dignity of the law had beer, vindicated. With
regard to the proposition of payment of the Catholic
clergy, he could not say he approved of it.—( Hear. )
He should brit fly advert to the subject of the Commission lately
appointed to inquire into the tenure of land in Ireland. Upon
that matter it was possible that a spirit ought to be awakened
which would extend to England. The same thing might. be re-
quired at the hands of the Anti-Corn-law League.— ( Hear,
and laughter.) He fully agreed in the principle of his Noble
Friend's motion, and he thought a more fitting opportunity
could not have been selected than the present one to decide
upon the; merits of a measure to ameliorate the condition of
that country. —( Hear, hear, hear.)
Lord CAMPBELL rose amidst much noise and confusion,
and said, that it thought it would be much more convenient to
their Lordships if this debate were to be adjourned.
Lord BROUGHAM said he should most cheerfully assent
to the proposition of his Noble Friend. Still he thought
that as it was now twenty minutes before twelve o'clock, and
as their Lordships were not a very over-worked body—
( Laughter)—he thought that they might afford to devote to
the consideration of such an important subject as this their
time until at least one, or perhaps two o'clock ; perhaps they
would doso if they did not imagine that some Noble Lords, who
might imagine they could enlighten the House upon the sub-
ject, were absent.
Eventually, upon the motion of Lord CAMPBELL, after a
few words from the Marquis of NORMANEY in explanation,
and from the Duke of WELLINGTON, concurring in the pro-
priety of adjourning the debate, the House stood adjourned to
next Thursday.

IMPORTANT NEWS FROM
PORTUGAL.

Lisbon papers of the sth inst., with letters of the
7th, have been received. These papers contain very
important intelligence. For some past the Septem-
brist party have been collecting money for the pur-
pose of bribing the troops, in order to effect another
revolution.

News was received at Lisbon, on the 6th inst , of
the revolt of the 4th Cavalry at Torres Novas, who
have declared against the present Ministry. It
appears that the revolted troops have left that
town, headed by Cezar de Vasconcellos, and pro-
ceeded in the direction of Fundoo. It is re-
ported, too, that the garrison of Elves have
revolted and killed the Governor, and similar
rumours are in circulation respecting the troops at
Santarem Abrantes, and in Algarve, but all these want
confirmation. Last night the troops in this city were
under arms, and an extra number of sentinels were
posted in different places, who loudly challenged
every passer-by, and obliged him ,to walk
on the other side of the street. During
the night a number of arrests took place. Amongst
the persons arrested were Rio Tiuto (lately the
editor of the Nacional), Baron da Foscoa, Leonel
Tavarez (formerly a deputy, and a leading man of
the Septembrist party), and the Colonel of the sth
Caqadores, all of whom are now secured on board the
Diana frigate.
As a measure of precaution all the arms in the
naval and military arsenals have been removed, and
placed on board the ships of war.
The Government are taking the most energetic
measure, and have applied to be armed,
Ist. With extraordinary and discretionary powers.
2d. Suspension of the habeas corpus.
3d. Suspension of all newspapers except the Diario.
4th. Authorisation for the loan of 2,000 contos.

MARKET NEWS.-(THIS DAY.)

CORN EXCHANGE-WEDNESDAY.

The arrivals of English Wheat having been very scanty
since our last report, the show of samples was small. All
descriptions met a steady demand, at fully Monday's ad-
vanced rates. In foreign Wheat, a fair business was tran-
sacted, and the quotations had an upward tendency. The
Malt trade was somewhat inactive, yet previous rates were
supported. Oats, Beans, Peas, and Flour were quite as dear.
ARRIVALS.

Wheat. I Harley. Oats. Fleur
English. 2,630 qrs. 7,440 qrs. 3,260 qrs. 480 sacks.
Irish - 270 11,020
Foreign. 1,9(0 980 - -
Malt, 5,380 qrs.
WAITECHAPEL.

We had only a moderate supply of each kind of Meat, while
the general demand was steady, on the following terms :
Beef from 2s 8d to 3s Gd ; Mutton, 2s 6d to 3s 8d ; Veal, 3s 8d
to 4s 8d ; and Pork 2s 8d to 3s 10d per 81bs, by the carcase.

LLOYD'S SHIPPING.-( THIS DAY.)

LONDON, FEB. 14.—Wind S.W., light breeze and hazy.
SCILLY, FEB. 10.—Arrd. Black Cat, Patras, for Liverpool,
with loss of sails, &c., and two men overboard; Invincible,
Newman. Marathousie.

DARTMOUTH, FEB. 13.—The Mantura, Weekes, from Pa-
lermo to London, which put into this port on the 9th inst.,
with loss of bowsprit, &c., is ready to proceed.
GuAvENI), FEB. 13.—The David, of Newburgh, was in
contact off the Shears 9th inst., with the Whitton Castle,
Butcher, and receivcd some damage.
PORT:MOUTH, FEB. 13.—Wind, E.N.E. to S.E.—Arrd.,
Oriental (steamer), Alexandria.
PLYmouTtt, FEB. 13.—Wind, .E.—Arrd., Hymen, London,
for Lima.
LIVERPOOL, FEB. 13.—Wind S.S.E., light.—Sld., Severn,
for Bahia ; Enterprise New York.
HULL, Fun. 13.—Wind, S.W., light breeze.—Arrd., Ganges,
Blyth, St. John's, New Brunswick.
HAIM-1(71T, FEB. 13.—Arrd., «William Savarick, London for
Middlesborough, with damage, having been in contact, off
the Nore, with a brig.
GUERNSEY, FEB. 10.—S1d., Louisa, Havannab.
JERSEY, FEB. 10.—S1d., Courier, Madeira.

The Hon. Francis and Lady Ann Charteris arrrived at
Farrance's Hotel, Belgrave-straet, on Monday.