The Sun.
London, England, 1850-07-10 00:00:00

AUSTRALIAN COLONIES BILL.

In answer to a gnestim from an HON. MEMBER,
Lord J. RUSSELL said it was his intention to re•
print this Bill with the Lords' amendments.

DEATH OF THE DUKE OF CAMBRIDGE.
ADDRESS OF CONDOLENCE.

Lord J. RUSSELL said—before the regular businets of
the House was proceeded with, he considered it his
duty, in consequence of the lamented death of
the Duke of Cambridge, to move an humble
address of condolence to her Majesty. The Noble
Lord, after paising a high eulogium upon the late Duke,
moved the address.

The Marquis of GRANBY seconded the address,
which was unanimously agreed to.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL then moved an address of
condolence to the Duchess of Cambridge.
Mr. DISRAELI seconded the motion in a most feeling
speech.
The address was unanimously agreed to.
NATIONAL REPRESENTATION.
Mr. LOCKE KING the❑ rose to move for leave
to bring in a' Bill to make the franchise in coun-
ties in England and Wales the same as that in boroughs,
by giving the right of voting to all occupiers of tene-
ments of the annual value of 101. He asked, ho said,
for no great measure of reform. He merely wished to
do away with an existing anomaly. He would take
the boreugh of Reigete, in Surrey, and ask why should
a Id/. householder of that borough have a hundred and
nine y-eighth share—for there were only 193 electors—
in sending a jMember to that House, whilst a person
living in a larger and better house at Croydon, and pay-
ing something short of 501. a year, was not allowed to
have a six-thousandth share in returning a Member for
East Surrey.—(Hear, hear.) He held in his hand a list
of twenty-two boroughs which sent forty-two Members-
to the House of Commons, and in none of which did the

which they had in view was an equalisation of the taxes.
He should be exceedingly glad if we could have an equalisa-
tion of the taxes—( Hear, hear)—and he hoped that the Go-
vernment might be forced during the next session of Parlia-
ment to bring forward some general and homogeneous system
of taxation by which we should be freed from the anomalies
under which we laboured under the existing system. - (Hear,
hear.) But he really believed that gentlemen who took
upon themselves the trouble of perambulating and agi-
tating the country had ulterior objects in view; he be-
lieved that they desired to effect some more sweeping
change than a mere equalisation of the taxes. They wanted,
they said, " equality, which, of course, meant equality of
property, or, in other words, the destruction of property—
(No, no)—and consequently there would be nothing but
starvation for all.—(Hear, hear.) There could be no doubt
that they wanted "equality," as that word was understood
in France. They wanted to introduce a system ba,ed on a
thorough contempt for the experience of mankind.—(Hear,
hear.) They wanted to evolve out of their own brains a
scheme of government which should set the experience of all
past, as well as the present time, at defiance. The Hon.
elember concluded by saying, at the same time he did not
think the motion of his Hon. Friend involved all the en-
larged views which he ( Mr. Drummond) had taken of the
question of reform as it was dealt with by Hon. Gentlemen
on the Government side of the House. As it stood upon the
paper, the motion was simple enough. It was the same that
he had advocated previously, and therefore he could not re-
fuse to advocate it now; but while he gave it his support, be
begged it to be distinctly understood that he did not do so
with the same views as those who merely regarded this mea-
sure as a narrow point of the wedge which they were desirous
of inserting for the purpose of effecting changes of a far more
important character.
Lord DUDLEY STUART rejoiced that the Hon. Gentle-
man was at alLevents going to support by his vote, if not by
his speech, the cause of the people. The Hon. Gentleman as-
serted that the advocates of liberal measures desired a repub-
lic. He entirely repudiated the charge; nor did he think that
such a thing as a republic was desired by the people of this
country. All they sought was a full and fair representation.
Did any one think that the House of Commons, as at present
constituted, enjoyed the confidence of the people? The mo-
tion was a step in the right direction, and he would therefore
give it his support. He regretted that his Hon. and Gallant
Friend (Sir De Lacy Evans) had withdrawn his more com-
prehensive measure. He wished to see the franchise bestowed
on all who contributed to the poor-rates. With respect to the
charge of agitation, they were determined to agitate till they
had secured a fair representation ; and he felt convinced that
the agitation would ultimately accomplish its object. Did the
Noble Lord at the head of the Government think the repre-
sentation in a satisfactory state? Plainly not; for he had let
drop a few significant words not long since which indicated
an Intention to enlarge the franchise. The people now de-
manded the boon quietly and calmly; but were they sure
that this feeling would remain the same in troubled times?
The true policy of those who wished to maintain the country
in a state of prosperity was to grant this measure, and grant
it in time. He hoped his Noble Friend would take this oppor-
tunity of declaring his views, and would promise some great
measure for the enlargement of the franchise in the next
session of Parliament.—(Hear.)
Mr. NEWDEGATE said he was not go'ng to vote in
favour of the motion, although it had been advocated by an
able and intelligent colleague of his on that (the Opposition)
side of the House. What did be find? He found a sweet
unanimity prevailing on the other side of the House as to the
first resolution. Bat beyond this the unanimity entirely
ceased. No less than three qualifications were proposed, and
he and those who sat on the same side with him had there-
fore a right to expect from Hon. Gentleman professing liberal
opinions that they shou'd at least agree amongst themselves
as to what they really wanted. This movement appeared to
him to be simply an attempt to put the screw on the Noble
Lord at the head of the Government. He (gr. Newdegate)
was by no means bound to defend the Whig-Radical Reform
Bill of 1832.—( Hear, hear.) Neither was he precluded from
considering any well-directed extension of the franchise,
being one of the old constitutional Tory party so much de-
:Tired by some Hon. Members. This much, however, he would
say—he would vote for none olthe propositions of Hon. Gentle-
men opposite until they knew what they wanted themselves.
Then it would be time enough to consider what their *state-
ments were worth. For his own part, he did not believe in
the existence of any extreme anxiety on the part of the
people for any such change. He was perfectly ready to
admit at the same time that that House did not possess the
confidence of a large portion of the people, who had repeat-
edly expressed their desire that the Government would afford
them the opportunity of expressing their opinions by the
selection of their representatives according to the existing
forms of the constitution; but there was nothing like the ex-
pression of a want of confidence in those forms, or of the pre-
sent qualification. He could not agree with the Noble Lord
who had last spoken, that because the people were at this
moment quiet and contented, this was the time for disturbing
their tranquillity by introducing a measure for the alteration
of the franchise. There were already disturbing elements
enough. Until an appeal had been made to the country by
a dissolution, he bad a right to say that all these proposals
for a change, coming from the opposite side of the House, ex-
pressed an extreme want of confidence in. their own position
with respect to the present constituencies.—(Hear.)
Lord J. RUSSELL said he should vote against the present
proposition very much upon the ground which the Hon.
Member for West Surrey had assigned for supporting it.—
(Hear hear, and a laugh.) The Hon. Member said he did
not think any considerable mischief could arise from it, be-
cause at this period of the session it would not be possible
to do more than lay the Bill on the table of the House. To
deal in so trifling a spirit with the large and important
question of the franchise, would be neither becoming to
the character of that House rior fair to the people. This
was quite a sufficient reason for voting against the mo-
tion, without entering into the merits of the particular pro-
position involved in it; and he felt, moreover, justified in
refraining from entering upon it, because its supporters had
hardly gone into any arguments having the least refer-
ence to that proposition. If they were to deal with the
extension of the franchise, it was not in the middle of July
that they ought to begin.—(Hear, hear.) He had been
invited to a discussion, into which he should certainly not
enter at any length, having on a former occasion delivered his
opinions fully to the House. The supporters of the motion
had treated of matters not at all before them on the present
occasion, such as the number of electors and their represen-
tatives, and the usual arithmetical calculations had been
gone through, to :show the disproportion which existed in
some instances. This was all perfectly true, but it was
really time for those who insisted so much on bringing
such facts constantly before the House, to point out what
inference they proposed to draw from them. - (Hear, hear.)
But if equality ought to be the rule, then he asked them to
show the House a plan of those districts into which they
proposed to divide the country. Let them exhibit a plan
of the squares and parallelograms into which they intended
to divide the country, and then the House would be able to
see whether the sort of representation they wished to give
was the sort of representation the country wished to have
—(Hear.) He required this the more because he saw the
Hon. Member of the Tower Hamlets left out of the represen-
tation of counties, as if they had no importance, had no right
to vote, and possessed no claim to respect. In making the
county division, they said—put the towns on one side, and
put the boroughs on the other. They appeared to forget
there were such counties as Lincolnshire and Devonshire,
which had 40,000 electors—a sufficient number to be repre-
sented in that House, and to have their feelings, their senti-
ments, and their views represented in that House, and repre-
sented in the divisions which took place in that House.—
(Hear, hear.) He wished the whole of the statement to be
made, in order to see how they proposed to disfranchise large
counties, and what additional weight they proposed to give
to small boroughs. He begged, when they next brought
forward the argument, that they at the same time would
bring forward their scheme, so that the House miseht see
whether it was compatible with our form of Government.
And, without entering into the question as to whether the
House altogether represented the people—whether there were
not some inequalities in the representation—and whether
equal representation might not be preferable to the
existing system, he did say that the people were deeply
and thoroughly attached to the present form of Government
—(Hear, hear)—and had always made it a condition,
in any reform that might be contemplated in the constitu-
tution of that House, and the mode in which the people
should elect their representatives, that this reform should be
compatible and consistent with‘a Monarchy and a House of
Lords, which form, as well as the House of Commons,
fundamental portions of the constitution. And when the
Hon. Member for the Tower Hamlets, and other Hon. Mem-
bers, again brought forviard this subject, ho hoped the
House would first require them to state what plan they
proposed, and next if the result of the proposed plan
would be agreeable to the wishes of the people—namely,
whether it would conduce to the maintenance of the pre-
sent form of government. lie did not wish to add anythi
to what he had before said one the same subject.—(llear.)
The lion. Member for the Tower Hamlets said, unless we
came forward with a pledge of some plan of reform to be
determined npoa during the Parliamentary recess, and to
be brought forward early next session, he and other Hon.
Members would lose confidence in the Government, and
then government would no longer exist. He did not
see why Government should give such a pledge and
frame such a plan in order to bring it forward
next session. If the Government had not the confidence of
that House—if Hon. Gentlemea thought a change in the
Government advantageous, let it take place. That was the
natural course of events. They would then see their plan
of Parliamentary reform brought forward by those in whom
they could place confidence, and brought forward in a much
better way.—(Hear, hear.) He had nothing further to say
4 with respect to the motion, except that he could not see

number of electors exceed 400. The aggregate of elee.
tors to those boroughs was 6.885, or, upon an average,
163 electors to each Member; whilst in the West
Riding of Yorkshire 36,000 electors were represented by
only two Members in that House. Ho thought, then,
that as a matter of justice the county constituencies
should, v t least, be put upon the same footing with
the borough constituencies. If they were deter-
mined to keep the great body of the people
outside the pale of the constitution, surely it would
have been batter to have continued the old rotten
borough system, with its avowed oligarchical, aristo-
cratical domination. The inequalities which 'existed in
the Parliamentary representation of this country were
shocking alike to common sense find common justice.
The measure which he now proposed would remove one
great anomaly, and palliate the sense of injustice which
was created in the minds of tens of tbsusands of persons
who were quite as fit to enjoy the franchise as those
upon whom it was conferred by the Reform Bill. His
proposition would also test the sincerity of Hon. Gen-
tlemen opposite who still clung to protection, and did
not hesitate to assert that the great body of the people
were in favour of a bread-tax. It would give them the
means of trying that question, and trying it with an
extended suffrage in those very districts where they
said the greatest amount of distress prevailed. For his
part, he was quite ready to put that question to the
great body of the people, the consumers of articles
which, formerly taxed, were now duty free; and he had
no doubt if that question were put, the verdict of the
people would be one by which the important question of
plenty and prosperity, with the assistance of truth and
justice, would be permanently, end he hoped for ever
established. In conclusion, the Hon. Gentleman moved
for leave to bring in a Bill "to make the franchise in
counties in England and Wales the same as that in
boroughs, by giving the right of voting to all occupiers
of tenements of the annual value pf 101."
Mr. HUME seconded the motion. The Hon. Gentleman
said that the Noble Lord at the head of the Government had
declared that he was willing to go in the path of reform,
but he had never yet stated to what extent ha would go.—
( Hear, hear.) If the Noble Lord was really favourable to
progress, in what way, he asked, could progress be made
with less risk and less danger than that proposed by the
Hon. Member for East Surrey ? The Hon. Mmber simply
proposed that, whereas 101. householders were now allowed to
vote in boroughs, the same privilege should be extended to
householders of that amount in counties—and be ( Mr.
Hume) regarded it as an act of justice to give them this pri-
vilege. He hoped the Hon. and Gallant Member for West-
minster (Sir De Lacy Evans) would postpone the amend •
ment of which he had given notice, and allow the decision of
the House to be taken upon the motion of the Hon. Member
for Surrey.
Sir DE LACY EVANS said that if his amendment should
be thought to interfere, upon a division, with the motion of
the lion. Member for East Surrey, he would at once comply
with the wish of the Hon. Member for Montrose. At the
same time he would beg leave to make a few observations in
support of his amendment, after which he should be guided
by the opinions of his. Hon. Friends near him. The propo-
sition he had to make went considerably further than that of
the Hon. Member for Surrey, though in his opinion it did not
go by any means far enough. He concurred with Mr. Hume
in thinking that there was no ground for alarm in an ex-
tension of the franchise to registered household suffrage.
It would be in the recollection of the House that the Re-
form Bill was not accepted by the Reform party in the
country as a settlement of the question, but only as a corn-
premise, to prevent the disturbance of peace and tran-
quillity. It was taken simply as an instalment. But
even if it were an adequate measure of reform at that
time, it would not be a sufficient franchise now, for the
twenty years which. had elapsed since that period had
witnessed a greater advance in population and in intellectual
and moral improvement in all classes, and in the humble
class particularly, than had ever before taken place within
a similar period in this country. The amendment of which
he had given notice contained three propositions. He pro-
posed to " render the payment of any income or property-
tax a qualification to vote for Members of Parliament for
the county or borough in which such payment shall have
been made, provided that no person shall be so entitled un-
less he shall have been resident for the space of twelve
months preceding within the said county or borough, and
shall have been duly registered ; also, to render the pay-
ment of poor-rate as occupier of any premises rated as of
the net annual value of 5/. or upwards a qualification to
vote for Members of Parliament for the county or bo-
rough .within which such premises are situated, provided
the person paying such rate shall have occupied such
premises for twelve months preceding, and have
been duly registered ; also, to render deposits in savings
banks of a certain amount a qualification to vote for Mem-
bers of Parliament, with the provision of twelve months'
preceding residence, and of registration ; and of twelve
months' preceding duration of such deposits." He consi-
dered it an unsafe state of things which at present existed in
this country, with their legislation not in accordance with
the spirit of the age, and' a majority in the House of
Lords opposed to a reform Government. Even that House
(the Commons) was too aristocratic to fairly represent the
feelings and opinions of the people at large. As an instance
of the working of the system, he might mention that the late
Mr. Robins on one occasion, when advertising a fine estate
that he bad for sale, recounted, amongst its other advantages,
that its owner enjoyed political influence over 1,200 indepen-
dent voters. With respect to the amendment of which he
had given notice, he wished to know from the Speaker
whether, if he moved it, it would prevent a division being
taken on the original motion—a result which he had certainly
no d sire to effect?
The SPEAKER said that would depend entirely on
whichever the House would adopt, whether the amendment
or the motion.
Sir DE LACY EVANS was afraid that the House would
not adopt the amendment, and he begged therefore to with-
draw it.
The amendment was accordingly withdrawn,
Mr. ALCOCK pointed out the great hardship inflicted by
the present electoral system on respectable inhabitants of
towns, who in consequence of dwelling in houses under 501.
a year rent, could not vote for the county: Such a state of
things ought no longer to be allowed to exist.
Mr. G. THOMPSON said it would be easy to show, from
evidence accumulated since the Reform Bill, that of all the
electoral systems in the world that of this country was the
most unequal and absurd. The great majority of the bo-
roughs having small constituencies sent Members to Par-
liament, whose elections were not contested, because those
boroughs were the property of rich commoners or peers,
whose nominees they were to all intents and purposes.
While such a state of things existed there was not a Minister
sitting on the Treasury bench in that House who was really
responsible to the country; for when Ministers represent-
ing large constituencies were rejected by them, they did not
lose their office, but went to some pocket borough to be re-
turned to that House—ejected from Westminster they
went to Harwich, and they were no more responsible to
the public at large than if they had returned themselves to
the House, and walked through those doors by hereditary
right. In the list of boroughs, he found that the fifty largest
did not return more members than seventy-one of the
smallest, though they contained seven times more electors,
more than six times the number of the population, and
seven times the number of houses rated to the relief of the
poor. The result of the system was, that there were voting
in that House, and voting upon all the most vital interests of
the country, 82 Members representing 58 bo-oughs, whose
united constituencies amounted to only 19,282 voters, or 68
less than the number of voters registered on the electoral
lists of the Tower Hamlets in 1847. What chance was there
for any liberal measure, or any liberal Government, in a
House so constituted ? Would the Noble Lord (Russell) be
frank enough to tell them how, in the present state of par-
ties, he meant to maintain his ground—how he meant to
secure to the country the benefit of past legislation? The
Noble Lord could not effect either object, and the country
felt it ; and he could assure the Noble Lord that if he had no
intention to improve the representation of the kingdom, he
and his adherents must give way to a stronger party, with
whom, though the independent Members had not much
sympathy, they would be obliged to vote, as they would be
ready to vote with any party who recognised the right
of the people to have something like a fair represen-
tation in that House. He trusted the Noble Lord would
not let the session close without giving the country some
assurance as to his intentions on the sub;ect—some pro-
mise of a measure of electoral reform. Among the work-

ing classes there was no diminution in the feeling in there could be any possible advantage to be antiCipated, con-
favour of extending the franchise. Government could not eidering this was July, in bringing the motion— (Hear, hear.)
take a wiser course than to occupy the recess in mature Mr. BRIGHT did not think the near approach of the
ing some great scheme of Parliamentary reform. But if they termination of the session was a good reason for not enter-
persisted in maintaining silence on the subject, they would taining the motion. Nor did he think the Noble Lord's way
betray the cause of reform, and deserve the censure of the of treating the question was altogether satisfactory or suit-
people,—(Cheers.) able. The Noble Lord had complained that the speeches
Mr. H. DRUMMOND said the Honourable Gentleman on the question were not to the point. But the Noble Lord's
who had just sat down spoke of having tested the feelings of whole speech had no reference whatever to the question. If
the people of this country. He might have said with more the population of England were dropped from the clouds at
propriety that he had been, not a tester, but an exciter of the present moment, without any representative government
their feelings.—(Loud laughter.) He (Mr. Drummond) the Noble Lord with all his courage—which he exercised
had no doubt there was excitement in the country, for that always most fearlessly when wrong—(Hear)—v7ould not
party to whom the Honourable Gentleman said the Noble venture to recommend the system of representation which
Lord owed his situation had come forward and plainly now existed in England and Ireland. What he and others.
avowed that the measures which they looked for were for asked, was not a total change of the existing system, but
the purpose of establishing a republic. (No, no.) An such a correction of the present inequalities as would
Honourable Gentleman opposite stated, at a certain meet- make the representation nearer that which it ought
ing, that he had armed himself with many extracts from to be. What was wanted was to make the borough
the speeches of the Honourable Member for Buckingham- and county system of qualification equal, and if the Noble
shire, and remarked that they were handy as pocket-pis- Lord had not an unchangeable hostility to an extension of the
told to fire off as occasion might serve. Taking counsel representation, he could not refuse to support the moderate
from that Honourable Gentleman, he (Mr. Drummond) proposition of his Hon. Friend. If the present proposition
had also about him some extracts from the speeches of were carried, the effect would be to bind the people more
Honourable Gentlemen opposite. Some of those Gentle- closely to the constitution as it now stood.—(Cheers.) The
men would probably feel themselves somewhat enebar- Noble Lord, the rejected of Devonshire, twice elected and
rassed when they heard those extracts retorted on them. once rejected by Devonshire,to its discredit, had felt the pinch
They might feel somewhat like the " struck eagle," of a narrow constituency there. He had been opposed by
when he— the power of the Church, who raised the cry that he was
Views his own feather on the fatal dart about to bring the Pope into the country again, and to burn
That drinks the life-blood of his bleeding heart. heretics.—(oh, oh). Had there been a wider constituency
Keen were his pangs, but keener far to feel the Noble Lord might have remained the representative of
He nursed the pinion that impelled the steel." one of the largest counties in the kingdom. The Noble Lord
What did Honourable Gentlemen opposite meanly "liberal said the people approved of the present constitution.
measures?" Did they mean any other than those which He did not credit the assertion. - (Cries of -" Oh oh!)
would exclude the Crown and tvie aristocracy ? They had There was not more than one person out of every seven who
charged Honourable Gentlemen on the Opposition benches were represented in this country. It was natural that the six
with not having had the courage to advocate distinctly unrepresented should feel discontented with their position, and
within the walls of that House those principles which they should look to other countries where reforms had occurred,
had advocated in the country during the last vacation : but and desire to see the same reforms extended to this country.
that surely was an imputation which could be fairly brought He would adviee the Noble Lord not to refer to July as a rea-
against themselves on the question of the extension of the sou for not entertaining this important question. He was
franchise. Their speeches were evidently delivered with satisfied, if the mction of his Hon. Friend were taken up, it
the view of pleasing their constituents. Now, his belief would give general satisfaction to the country.
was that no man could do his duty in that House who Mr. L. KING, in reply, said that independent Members in
stopped to deliberate whether the votes that he might give that House were very badly used. They were always
or that the speeches which he might make, would taunted for not bringing forward specific plans, but the
please his constituents or not.—(Ctleers.) And his ex- moment they did so the Government intervened and pre
perience whilst he had -a seat in that House convinced vented them from carrying them on. The Noble Lord was
him that those amongst them who were the least attentive hampered by two parties—the one for progress, and the one
to, and who were the most dead and insensible to, everything which desired to see things remain stationary. The cons&
uence was that be did nothing. He could say to them, in
worthy of the name of duty were the men who had been q
influenced by the petty vanity of desiring to have a seat in the language of Captain Macheath—
that House. And he also believed, that when the Govern- "How happy could Ibe with either,
ment desired to carry any measure of reform, such men were Were t'other dear charmer away •
the greatest obstacles with which they had to contend. The But while you both teaze me together,
advocates of this extension of the suffrage said that the end To neither a word will I say."

Mr. GRATTAN said that the Noble Lord bad been
taunted with treating the subject in a rather jocular
manner; for his part, he preferred a jocose to a morose
Minister.—(Hear, hear.) But if they complained of the state
of the representation in this country, let them recollect that -
in Ireland there were 7,000,000 of people, out of which
there were not 70,000 individuals who had a vote. The people ,
of Ireland would be satisfied with the constitution of
England, but they should receive it; and they would be
satisfied with nothing less. What was their position ? They
had sent up a Bill to another House in which they declared
that there should be an 8/. rating. In defiance of their
wish a 151. rating had been inserted. Did the Noble Lord
mean to be rieden over after that fashion? He called upon
English gentlemen to stand up for their rights, and not to
permit themselves to be thus trampled upon.
Mr. DISRAELI then rose and said—l have to apologise
to you, Sir, and the Hon. Gentleman opposite, for attempt-
ing to rise after he had concluded his reply; but, as the de-
bate has been re-opened, and as it has assumed a new as-
pect, I hope I may he allowed to say a few words, although
it was against my original intention to do I find that
an English Reform Member finds fault with the English n
Reform Act, and an Irish Reform Member finds fault with
the Reform Act for Ireland. We who sit en this side of the
House are not responsible for either of those Acts. The
Noble Lord has a deeper personal and political in'
terest in them than we have. In listening to the observe'
tions which have passed during the debate, I have been par'
ticularly struck with the want of comprehension, which
exists as to what our constitution really is. I have
always believed that gentlemen on the other side of the
House, whatever might be their opinion with respect to the
franchise, considered that the constitution had been modi-
fied by the privileged classes, who enjoyed their privileges
for the general advantage of the community. We have e
Throne—we have a House of Peers, spiritual and temporal--
and we have a House of Commons in possession of certain
privileges. You may increase, enlarge, or diminish those
privileges, but still they are privileges which have always
been enjoyed in the history of this country by a limited per'
tion of the community. We know well what has been the
result of such a constitution, whatever may have beat its
material. It has been established on the aristocratic prince'
pie in the widest and the noblest sense of the term. I have
elways heard it taught by gentlemen opposite that political
power and political privilege was obtainable by every honest .
and virtuous artisan under the old system, whatever numbs!,
of classes the community was divided into. No class we"
deprived of the privilege of electing its representatives—from
the proudest manorial lord to the humblest artisan in Eng-
laud, all were represented. Some years ago, less than
quarter of a century, you thought proper to terminate that
scheme, and it was so by the Noble Lord the First Minister
in his official capacity The measure he proposed was ac'
cepted with enthusiasm ; it was supported by many gentle'
men who were then Members of this House, and there is 33;
gentleman opposite who has not acquired his seat throng
the instrumentality of that measure. They are therefore rr,
sponsible, and ought to be grateful, for the Reform
What is your position now? There are a great number I.'"
gentlemen who are diScontented with that settlement—gee-
tlemeu who were ready to vote that black was white in it*
support when proposed—gentlemen who went to the country
fur the whole Bill and nothing but the Bill. They were rei
sponsible; no doubt, they had maturely weighed the effe°
and the attendant , circumstances which would be cense.
quent on that great political change in a great country'
They no doubt said, We are going to effect a great change in
the fortunes of a great country. We will take care not to
adopt any measure without due deliberation and careful iA°.-
vestigation. We will do nothing rashly, but what we .7n
will be permanent and lasting. It has happened, howevel
that ever since this Bill, the whole Bill, and nothing SlO,
the Bill was adopted, there have been nothing but complaie
of i:s working. Gentlemen are always quarrelling with thee
political arrangement which sent them to this House. .;
know that I speak the feelings of many Members on tb
side of the House when I say that I have no super%o
tious reverence for the Reform Act. I was not in see
House when it passed, but if I had been I should haye,
opposed it. It wss a settlement brought forward be' ~e,
party to whom I should have been in opposition from his of
rival associations. No doubt, in the supplementary views
that case, the interests of party were not neglected. I do o'o
attribute any blame to such a proceeding. If gentleltei,
ever have the opportunity of carrying a measure of t",e
kind, which I believe they never will, they will be quite se;
titled to do the same. But the interests of your party "(ere
then provided for in the measure you accepted with eee;
thusiasm. I think it a matter to be regretted that ly
should have destroyed the privileges of the workif,
classes, who were represented under the old system, witte
cut finding out some compensatory scheme ?
provide for the loss. But who voted against the work Blip
Why the gentlemen who went for the Bill, the whole Pi w
and nothing but the Bill. What I rise for now is to Wiese,
what Hon. Gentlemen mean. If they mean to say we cans
longer endure the ancient constitution of this countrr"...,
constitution modified by the political estates of the realm If
why then I say you propose a revolation.( Hear, hear.) ee
you are prepared to do so, why come forward with your
plication for a 10/. franchise in a county, a resolution sviqb.
is always met with a congenial amendment which is wt 00
drawn if found conven ant. But none of you do this. rleort
of you declare that every man is entitled to the suffrage. ey,
the contrary, several of your leading men have made deo!' of
tions hostile to such a proposition. I remember a speeceej
the Member for the West Riding to such an effete, 111:t.
the Hon. Member for Manchester has put a limit uP0e,12,11
There is not one of you who says that a man of full age 000;
be entitled to the franchise. Bring forward your measlireo
tell us what you mean and what you want; and theism,
will be prepared to meet you. By the settlement which ter
Noble Lord proposed, he immensely increased the nurou.
and the importance of the Commons of this conntri ee
Great and, on the whole, beneficial changes have 11!b.
the consequence of that measure. Although the Ftles
lie benefit had been the main object of the setsl`
ment of 1832, yet it was also made in a supplement re
sense in favour of the power of the party to which ve?:ie
opposed, and by the machinery of the Act, the beneilleo..
conferred should extend in a relative proportion as the Porte
lation extended. One would have supposed, in listeningsre
the speeches of Honourable Gentlemen, that eighteen Ye:es
ago the House of Commons had actually decided the 3111`11
ber of electors who were to vote. But what have I heat e
both in this House and out of it? That there was eceie
working man who was virtuous arid industrious that e°'ol
not obtain the franchise. Well, and are the peoplemie
England so besotted that they cannot make the effort, ',ego
that they find it necessary to propose some such measure..o
this? I am for the system which would establish in 50
country a free Government which has confidence ill .0•
energy and the higher powers of man. Gentlemen
,;pf
posits would degrade man to the franchise .insteau
raising man to it. lam for a free aristocratic countrille,
(Ironical cheers)—free, because it is so. Those Ge,e
men who jeer are ignorant that I use the word not in to
limited meaning but in its noblest sense, which lee
achieve the best and to accomplish the best —(Cheetilel
We have been told that we are to look to France, aid
that by. the Member for Westminster, who has ear
us that in Paris there are 70,000 electors, while lie has
7,e00. But he forgot to tell you that for every Fe.„B"ters
elector there were two bayonets to keep him down. bee the
got that the electors who sent him to this House were
see,
men who for centuries sent men to this House whose 115`;0e
will live in the history of this country—the men who So to
Mr. Fox, Sir Francis Burdett, and other illustrious nenleol
maintain the struggle for liberty. To draw a eomeareige
with such a life and such a history with that of a for `ee
country was a degradation which I did not think that ero
a reformed House of Commons would tolerate.—(Cbeelloi
Sir, I have been told that it would be a good thing to aseee
the Government to fight this question out with their trieets
porters, and in Parliamentary tactics it would have 1' 00
so ; but I have nothing to do with them. I hav' ee'
superstitious reverence for the Reform Bill, but ewes
spect the verdict of the nation. Although that arlsneg
ment was made to promote the attainment of sqo
power and gratify the lust of Whig ;patronage, still he, fed
contented to abide by it. The Reform Act had been rall;:e4
by the consent of the nation, and should not be diste,moo,
on idle grounds. You disturb it; but what is the reaelsee
cret of all these July motions? Why, you do not trask,p)
constituencies which sent you to this House.—(llear, hieiee
You know well that if you appeal to that privilege 9, set;
people, enlarged as it was by the Reform Bill, not one
of you would be returned—(Laughter and cheering) „toe
you think you can in this way manage your constitueor
You think that by thus cobbling and changing, and verse
ing and polishing, the people of England will still stlfiehrerei.,
to continue Members of Parliament.—(Cheers) Tw"elis"
not the slightest chance of it—(Cheers)—for I believe owe
if the electors of this kingdom consisted of every full-grater
subject of her Majesty, you would still be sent:off.—(Lantir,
and cheers.) I do not believe that a 101., or a
a 2/. franchise, or universal suffrage itself, would save Yew e
(Cheers ) I believe that the great mass of the Pe°Poets
England would remain faithful to the traditionary i°l‘; re'
of Englishmen, and declare that, whatever might bet
litical manoeuvre—whatever might be the nature of the.ooole
chise—whatever might be the scheme which Vol; be I°c
adopt—they would be for the monarchy—they woulu 101
the empire—they would be for that constitution whiebesool I
them free and made them eminent; and that thee' toe 0
give a great national verdict against that levelling Oro eer
political tergiversation of whieh you are the sworn
porters.—( Hear, and cheers.) 00.;
Sir B. HALL remarked that it was usual, when selieeao;
Gentleman brought forward a motion for the consiueo*o 13
of the House, that after the discussion of that Mot!, she",
1
reply closed the debate.—(Hear.) In the present easso
was a departure from that custom—( Hear, hear) orap
traordinary departure.—(Hear, hear.) His 11°0'.n