The Sun.
London, England, 1844-06-14 00:00:00

_EL SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING. JUNE 14, 1844.

they believed would effect that improvement, and at the same The Earl of WILTON presented a petition from the
time show a proper consideration for existing interests. He Chamber of Commerce of Manohester against the
knew not what might be the effect of a combing-
Birkenhead Docks Bills.
nation of personal interests against the measure, but . niroßT Du riE,-;.
Lord MONTE AGLE then rose to bring for ward the
the Goveroment had only acted from a sense oif
motion of whieh he had given notice, for a Committee
public duty in prop ising it. To that principle they
to inquire
.into the emosct of the present system of
steadily adhere. If any difficulty should be thrown in the way
import duties. The proposition he had to make was
of the u'timate success of the measure, the House, and
not the Government, must be responsible; and if the
Government should fait, and it should be proved that for an inquiry into a subject which deeply con-
increased issue had led to illegitimate speculation, termed all her Majesty's subjects, and in making it
caused by that issue, they would have the satisfaction he did not call on their Lordships to come to
that they had offered advice, and proposed measures, cal- any resolution of a definitive kind. He wished
culated, as they thought, to avert such a calamity.—( Cheers.) to remove from their Lordships' minds any im-
pression that might exist that this question
ought to be considered as a party question. It was
They were not wild enough to suppose that they would, by any
measure, prevent speculation, but when speculation proceeded
Fmritombroutigtehtinfolorotivraierds bpyrtohsiemoutaesdahpyarttyhequceosmtiomnitateteaollf.
from undue issue, they proposed a measure calculated to check
that issue. When speculation arose from other causes,
1829, the present Government had drawn several of
that spirit of speculation was frequently aggravated by
their conclusions. It was not consistent with the fact,
a paper currency. It was not in their power, nor
had they any wish to check legitimate speculation; he admitted
that they could not counteract illegitimate speculation, but yet, or with Parliamentary usage, to represent his motion
he asked them not to aggravate its evils by refusing to check as a party movement, or one directed against a par-
those which were properly within their jurisdiction. —(Cheers.) i titular interest. It was enongh for him to say that all
Mr. W. WILLIAMS suggested that the debate should be his interests were bound up with the agriculture, and,
adjourned. He supported the Bill, but he should wish to have in the very first outset, ho would admit that there were
an opportunity of stating his views on the subject.—( Cries of many evils and inconveniences wick required reform, in
respecti to the commercial and. manufacturing. policy of
"Divide, divider " Go on.")
Col. SIBTHORP, in consequence of the refusal of the
toe country, as well as in respeat to agriculture. Many
Right Hon. Baronet to accede to the proposition of the Lon-wise and competent alterations had been made in the
don bankers, was determined to support the motion of the
Hon. Member for Lambeth, out of justice to that respectable tariff by the present Government, and, that being the
body, the country bankers. He would sooner place his chest, case there could be no objection to a general revision
with low 04. in it, in the hands of a country banker than in the of our commercial regulations.—( Hear, hear.) But it
Bank of England—the monopoly hank of the country.— was said that property would be endangered, and that
(A laugh.) He was astonished—it anything could be called our commercial transactions would be undermined by
astonishment in these times—at the conduct of the Hon. the House acceding to his motion. He thought, how-
Member for Montrose, and the Secretary of State for the ever, that there could be no more seasonable time
Home Department
to a, both
ap y oer curf whom had, in 1826 y
, showed
lly sth
p em
oke - fir the inquiry than the present. He would admit that
no financial alteration should he hazarded, unless the
selves so wedded p renc that the
in favour of the 1/. notes.
Exchequer of the country was in a condition to meet the
Mr. PLUMPT RE complained of the oppression which the
country bankers would suffer from the Bill ic, its present shape consequences of the change. The result of the tax upon
--an oppression which was aggravated by the belief, on the income, whiith, instead of producing only 3,700,000/, as
part of the country bankers, that the nigh; Hon. Gentleman had b en anticipated, produced 5,250,000/, rendered the
would, at least, leave them in as good a position as he had the present period especially favourable for altering the
found them. taxes which were imposed upon a mistaken supposition
Mr. MUNTZ said the only point on which he differed from that they were useful in protecting agriculture. He
the Right Hon. Gentlemen was on the standard of value, which thought that he could show that these duties were no
could never be made to work with the present corn-laws. protection at all.—(Hear, hear.) It might be supposed
There was one point which had fallen from many Hon. Mem-
sera in the course of the debate in which he fully agreed, and
that the discussion of such a question to
that was, that in every measure which had been proposed they such an assembly as their Lordships ; but he thought
had failed most entirely.—(Hear, hear.) Whether they that the Legislature ought to examine abstract queStions,
were to succeed in this he would not say. It was to guide them in the application of particular measures.
a very serious consideration, and in many minds The Noble Lord then referred to Adam Smith and other
it was a very anxious one, seeing that the present measure econotnic authorities, who held that all taxes which pre-
was brought in under the auspices of those who had introduced vented the interchange ofcommoditiesbetween twonations
the previous failures. He should not think ef saying more at was injurious to both. There were three kinds of duties
that late hour of the night, but should reserve a more detailed to which he wished to call the attention of the House.
explanation of his opinions for a future stage of the Bill. One was a duty for revenue merely, which every subject
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the House di- bound to submit to, as his share of the general
vided, when the numbers were—
For the resolution
Against it
Majority — 155 to prevent the competition of foreign untaxed produce
The Bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be with the taxed produce of home. The case of hops was
committed on Monday. one in point. For the purpose of revenue the Legislature
Sir R. PEEL said that the Dissenters' Chapels Bill must imposed a high duty upon hops, and it would be there-
have precedence on Monday. fore roost unjust to allow the hops of France to be im-
DUCHY OF CORNWALL. ported witheet any countervailing duty, But if you di-
Sir R. PEEL moved for leave to bring in two Bills—one vided society into ten classes, and protected one, then the
for defining certain rights in the Duchy of Cornwall, and
nine would have to pay the tax of that one, and if the
another f r empowering Prince Albert to sell and exchange
whole ten ,were protected, then things would be
certain lands in the Duchy.
The other orders of the dayk. i were then disposed of, and the
exactly as before, except for the distinction and
House adjourned at Two o'clocnconvenience occasioned by an unavailable impost.
It was matter of wonder that a system so objectionable
in itself should have been so long continued : nothing
could justify its continuance. It was to be regretted
that this question of protection had been so long mixed
up with party considerations. He believed that the par-
ties who now supported the sliding scale would not do
so if they were not bound to it by party considerations.
He was, however, ready to admit that they had made
considerable progress in this subject, for which he had
to return his thanks to her Majesty's Government. He
thought that no one could deny that the inquiry for
which he was asking would be productive of good. The
Right Hon. Gentleman at the head of the Government,
in introducing his tariff, said that he brought it forward
to remove prohibition, and to relax taxation. He said
he intended to relax the duty on raw materials,to reduce the
duty on articles partially manufactured, and to reduce
the duty on colonial produce. Now his (Lord Mont-
eagle's) object in moving for this Committee was to see
I how far the intention of her Majesty's Government had
been carried out. He admitted that the abolition of the
duty on wool was one of the most beneficial measures
which had been adopted by her Majesty's Govern-
ment. Why then could the same principle not
be applied to other articles of consumption ?—(Hear,
hear.) There were protections on the statute
book, which were of the most absurd character. We
exported, for instance, annually, an immense amount of
cotton manufactures, and yet there was a protecting duty
on articles of that description coming from the Conti-
nent. The state of our tariff was a continual reproach
to us, and we could never expect to see 'commercial
prosperity until it was thoroughly revised. It might be
argued with respect to the regulations as to the impor-
tation of sugar, that there was only a difference of Id.
per pound btween colonial and foreign sugar; but their
Lordships should recollect that the matter was not to
be judged by the amount of duty imposed, but by the
amount of sugar which was kept out of the market.
Nothing could be more utterly absurd than their ab-
staining from importing slave-grown sugar, because it
was polluted with slavery. Why, they took it from
Russia and other places in exchange for their exports,
and in prooortien as they Wok this sugar from other
countries they encouraged slavery in slave countries.
They were to admit Louisiana sugar where slavery ex-
isted, and they even refined slave-grown sugar here and
exported it to their colonies, so that it appeared they
hod a conscience in England, but had no conscience in
their colonies. He would now pass to the subject of the
timber duties, with regard to which they gave facilities
for the introduction of an inferior article to one of
superior quality. The Noble Lord went on to show
that the system of protection adopted in favour of Cana-
dian timber had been productive of the most pernicious
consequences, had destroyed the export trade to Sweden
and Noiway, and the Baltic trade in general, and gave
them a bad,
article in the place of a good one. But the
inconsiderate repeal of the timber duties subjected them
to a loss of 1,000,000/. It had also a most disastrous
effect on the cooperage trade of the country. The next
disadvantage that those protecting duties occasioned was
the diminution which it caused in the home production.
If they left the imports free the exports would take care
of themselves. The Noble Lord referred to the opinion of
Mr. Deacon Hume on this point. Another great disad-
vantage of the protective system was the impulse which
it gave to smuggling. He would only refer to Spain to
show how smuggling was encouraged by high protecting
duties. The Contrabandista system prevailed there to
the greatest extent, and Spain was thereby a loser to the
amount of 3,000,0001. M. Blanqul showed that
the same result had followed from the same cause in
France, and he need hardly remind their Lordships of
the effect of high duties in this respect in this country.
It appeared from the returns of the French Customs that
3,500,0001b5. weight of silk were entered for exportation
to England, and instead of the English Custom-house
giving something like a corresponding importation, it ap-
peared that only 1,875,0001b5. came there, so that
1,713,0001b5. must have been smuggled, thereby
occasioning a loss to the revenue of 1,092,0001. Ho need
only refer to the Statute-book to prove the extent of
smuggling in this country. He would remind their
Lordships of the case of Lord Ellenborou.gh.—(" No,
no," from Lord Colchester.) He could assure his Noble
Friend he did not intend to wound his feelings. What
happened to Lord Ellenborough might have happened
to any one of their Lordships. He had been travelling
in France, and in his carriage was found some smuggled
lace,which had been concealed there by one of his servants.
The result of this inadvertent act was,in point of law,the
forfeiture of his horses and carriage, with everything
that it contained. But, perhaps the most serious evil of
discriminating duties was the internal, divisions which
they introduced. Let them consider what use had been
made of the prohibition of the export of Irish cattle to
this country, and the manner in which the wool trade
of Ireland had been dealt with to keep alive dissensions
between England and Ireland ; and in this country at
this very moment they had the Anti-Corn-law League,
and the Protectionists arrayed against each other, and on
both sides imputing corrupt motives, which, perhaps,
had no foundation. But, however they might deal with
their own productions, he contended that they had no
right to burden other countries by their vicious legis-
lation, which caused other countries to retaliate and to hold
up their legislation, as he said before, as an object of
scorn to Europe. If such were' the consequences which
flowed from this protection, could they expect that the
Government, or the Legislature which continued such a
system, would enjoy the confidence of the country ? It
might be an easier thing to frame a just system at first
aeryti maiiigy, t h
for
rtiie prepare
adoption the way,
ofa
new and better system.—(Hear, hear.) He had taken
gra-
dually,
than to correct a bed system which had existed for a
long period ; but this was no argument against in-
quiry,snaoferldery7
aathi impartially,
some instances from their own system of laws ; he
would now advert to similar mistakes made by
foreigners, and see whether they were not equally perni-
cious. The first case which occurred to him was that
of the United States. From the year 1789 to 1807 the
foreign commerce of the United States was tolerably
free. During that period, when there was not such a
word as protection upon the statute-book of Congress ;
and the progress of the United States in wealth and
power and commerce was exceedingly great—(Hear)—
no argument was more frequently used than this, that
althouch protection might not be justifiable in the matu-
rity of things, yet protection was very necessary at the
outset, and a great many fanciful illustrations were
brought forward to elucidate that point. Now, let them
look at the imports of America as xhibiting
the capacity of the people of the United
States to enjoy the comforts of life. From
'1789 to 1807 the population of the United States
was 5,300,000, and the value of the imports ninety one
millions of dollars, showing an actual consumption of ar-
ticles of import and luxury, brought from abroad, equal
to about sixteen dollars and a fraction per head for the
inhabitants of the United States. In 1807 the system
of non-intercourse eommenced—then came the war, and
in 1816, what was called the restriction system was
brought into operation, In 1828 it was carried out to
the full extent—and what was the oonsequenee 9 Why,
that, in 1830, instead of each citizen of the United
States having at his, command various comforts and
luxuries of the value of sixteen dollars per year, he
could only obtain a quarter of that spnoont. Reotric-
tinni Whieti yq intended foF Protection,led to the crip-
plink of foFeigo trade, and injury to all the inhabitants
of that country. Then came the Compromise Act.
Thep could 'not he More co,ncliisive woof of the luju-
oioostipos nil the pfotectivO a)r4foni,,
example et AMericao 4 was dOnerou spo-
tic
stip,t4, hot tile despot might, 'by- pionit,ibilietiit,u,bbijoen an
swtaistee thanedsyusutelimghwteansmeaadme asnucsertvlioe4nVto the vilest, lowest,
and most personal motives, and became mixed up with
ears 1841 and 1842,
imports which ought to
he ell partywoulddcioymi spi oanr
es .
thle' a kaivnegr a he einirp

HOUSE OF LORDS, June 13

Their Lordships assembled at Five o'clock.
The Marquis of EXETER, presented 140 petitions
from various places in favour of protection to agriculture.
The Earl of SEFTON presented a petition against
the Birkenhead Decks Bill. .

The Duke of RICHMOND presented several peti-
tions in favour of protection to agriculture.
The Marquis of NORMANBY presented petitions
from Nonolk, praying for an altration in the laws re-
lating to coursing.
The Duke of RICHMOND inquired whether there
was any objection to the return of the number of convic-
tions under the Act alluded to by his Noble Friend ?
After a few words from the Earl FITZHARDINGE,
Lord WIIARNCLIFFE said ho was not aware of
any objection to the returns.
MOROCCO AND FRANCE.
The Earl of CLARENDON begged to call the atten-
tion of the Government to the occurrences which had re-
cently taken place in Africa. The friendly disposition
of the Emperor of Morocco to this country, and his
constant deference to the advice of England, had not
prevented his proclaiming the " holy war" against
another European power, the ally of England. It could
not be supposed that the Emperor had taken that
course with the sanction of the British authorities.
Howeier, it was now beyond doubt that he had made an
invasion of the French territories in Africa, and that the
war had commenced. With respect to the murder of
the Spanish Consul at Tangiers, it was the fact that the
man was killed in an affray brought aboutby his own con-
duct, and for which the authorities were not in the least
responsible. It had been supposed, but he did not
mean to say that it was the case, that the Spanish Go-
vernment had been incited to declare war by France ;
but it was a curious coincidence that, after this, relations
of a hostile character should so soon take place
between France and the Emperor of Morocco. They
might have been the result of accident, but they
gave a colour to the idea that France desired to see
Spain engaged in hostilities with Morocco. It was most
desirable that the line of coast now possessed by the
Emperor of Morocco should be in the possession
of a friendly Power, because it was from
thence they derived their supplies fee. Gibraltar.
He could not conceive what object France could have in
engaging in hostilities with Morocco, which must be in-
jurious to France. lie wished also to hear a contradic-
tion from the Noble Earl of the statements which ap-
peared in the French papers, that those hostilities were
excited by her Majesty's Consuls on the coast of Barbary,
one of which, Mr. Drummond Hay, had been particu-
larly mentioned. The questions he wished to ask were,
whether or no the expedition to b sent from Spain
against Morocco had been abandoned? —whether hostili-
ties had actu illy eemtnenced between France and the
Emperor of Morocco?—and whether her Majesty's Con
suls on the coast of Barbary had not taken means to
prevent a state of things which must prove injurious to
British interests.
The Earl of ABERDEEN said he would endeavour
to give an answer to the three questions put by his
Noble Friend; but, in the first place, he would say he
could not conceive any exercise of the power and influ-
ence of that House more useful than the interference to
prevent the occurrence of hostilities in every part of the
world.—(Hear, hear.) They should be equally anxious
to restore it wherever it was broken. They had, within
the last month, been the means of preserving peace be-
tween two States, at a time when it was seriously threa-
tened; and though, from the magnitude and power of the
States themselves, the war might not be important, it
certainly would have brought on calamities most ime
portant and extensive in their results—he alluded to
the dispute between Sardinia and Tunis.—(Hear.)
His Noble Friend was wrong in supposing that the only
cause of quarrel which existed between Spain and
Morocco was in the death of a Spanish Consular agent.
There were various complaints, into the justice of which
lie would not enter, but they arrived at such a point at
last as to threaten immediate hostilities. His Noble
Friend said, that he nould not conceive it possible that in
the present state of Spain she would declare war against
Morocco unless she were prompted thereto. He was
surprised that his Noble Friend appeared so ignorant
of the Spanish character. This question was not only
altogether a Spanish question, but the truth of it was
denied over and over again both to the British and
French Ministers at Madrid. They were kept in igno-
rance of the intentions of the Spanish Government until
what was called the ultimatum was sent to the Emperor
of Morocco. The Emperor desired the mediation of the
British Government with the view of bringing this dis-
pute to an amicable settlement, and her Majesty's Mi-
nisters offered the exercise of their good offices for
the same purpose to Spain, and it showed how little
the Government of France had to do with the question,
as the French Ministry. also pressed upon. the Span-
ish Government an acqutesence in that offer; andethere-
fore, as both had agreed to accept our mediation, be
might venture to anticipate a settlement would be ef-
fected of that dispute between Spain and Morocco. If
his Noble Friend had asked him yesterday whether hos-
tilities between France and Morocco had occurred, he
should have said that they had not, and that they were
not probable, and although a skirmish had taken place,
nothing which could be called war would, in his opinion,
follow; and he had this reason for that belief, that the
force assembled by the Emperor of Morocco on the
French frontier vas diminished to one-half in the course
of a fey days preceding the events which had taken
place, and the French authorities in Algiers were as
much taken by surprise as any one else by the incident
which had occurred. It was clear that the Moors were
the aggressors. The affair was brought about by the
fanaticism of a small body of cavalry who approached
the French encampment more from curiosity than any
other motive, and were thereby drawn into the affair.
He agreed with his Noble Friend that war with the
Emperor of Morocco could not be desirable to the
French Government, and he thought they might look
for a continuance of those relations which, if
not friendly, had been peaceable between .the Em-
peror of Morocco and the Government of Algiers.
The Emperor of Morocco was the sovereign of the most
fanatical Musselmans in the world, and how far he
could control the excitement of his own people, or deal
with the formidable personage who, when driven
before the French, took refuge in his terri-
tories, might be a matter of doubt. But he
(Lord Aberdeen) had received no information of any-
thing like a declaration of a holy war, or that would look
as if the Emperor of Morocco was prepared to un-
dertake a war of a serious description. He did not be-
lieve that such would take place ; hat if it even did
take place, he need scarcely say that it would take place
not only without the slightest encouragement on the
part of this country, but in spite of every endeavour that
could be made to prevent it. He could not question
what ho knew to be the intentions and wishes of both
Governments; and with regard to the conduct of the
British Consuls, he had received that very day equivocal
testimony in favour of those to whom allusion had been
made, His Woble Friend had alluded to the statements
that appeared in the French papers, He (Lord Aber-
deen) could only say that there was not the slightest
foundation in fact for supposing that her Majesty's
Consuls on the coast of lierleary any tiling whatever
to do in creating these disturbances. It might bp that
the weiters in those French journals had for their object
rether the oyerthrey of the existing Government in
Francs than thp ereatien Qf a heetife Feeling betweert the
peel* hoth countries, although he hadito doubt tho
thete was a lerge class in Franco to` whom statements of
the kind Judea to wave i;;Ot '444CPOptillitgt 'here wPig
journals in this country also, on which side he would not
say, which probably had the same object in view. Ho
could only say that there was not the slightest founda-
tion for the charge made against her Majesty's
consuls 911 the coast of Barbary.--(Hear, hear.)

have been admitted with those which were actually ad- T effected. Under such a system as prevailed at present
witted. In woollens there ought to have been received, . foreign countries could not be induced to grow corn for
according to the average of the preceding period, the them, and the people of this country would have barely
value of 4,257,0001 There had only been received to depend on their own produce. The Noble Earl
1,400,0001. In worsteds there ought to have been re- ' had referred with satisfaction to the reduction that had
ceived 5,000,000/., whereas there had only been received been made in the tariff. He was rejoiced, also, at those
456,0001. In cotton there ought to have been received : reductions upon a different ground—on the ground
6,000,0001., whereas they had had only 2,723,0001. Silks 'that correct principles had been recognised, and not
had fallen from 9,000,0001 to 2,000,0001 ; linen from that paltry reductions had been made. The Right Hon.
3,000,000/. to 1,1)00;000/, and in short all th great arti- Gentleman at the head of the Government• would not
Iles of consumption had diminished under the system of have made elaborate theses for the purpose of those
protection. What had been the working of the system little reductions, if he had not some higher object in view.
in France.? France had been extremely eager last year The Right Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Peel) knew well that
for the admission of machinery from this country, and, the population and productive power of thiscountry were
to their honour, the present Government gratuitously re- daily increasing, and that it was necessary to accommo-
pealed the export duty. France then imposed a heavy date their system to the change of circumstances. No
protective duty on yarns. The effect of that was to one was found to defend monopoly ; but they were
cramp the trade of her own weavers. But no always told that, if they carried free-trade into effect,
sooner was machinery admitted from this coun- they would injure the revenue and render themselves
try free from duty, than there was a cry unable to pay the public creditor. It was not against
for protection amongst the French machine-makers. A taxes and revenue that the free-trade principle was
new protection was asked for against English iron. The directed, but protection in favour of particular
effect of that protection was to destroy the French wine classes. It was a fallacy to pretend that free trade
trade. Thus they went round in a vicious circle of pro- would abolish the Customs' duties, because those duties
tection, and injury was done at every step, not only to were uniform, and the proceeds went into the Treasury.
the whole people, but even to those for whose benefit Their obligations to the public creditor ought to have
the protection was intended.—(Hear, hear.) 'But he the effect "of making them more careful not
had hitherto looked only at the evils of protection. to impose taxes for other purposes unnecessa-
Fortunately, owing very much to the legislation of rily. He was sorry to see that the doctrine
Noble Lords opposite, they were not without instances of retaliation appeared still to find favour amongst
of benefits derived from acting on good principles many intelligent classes in this country. Ti.e
with respect to this matter.—(Hear, hear.) In mode of retaliation selected generally tended to injure
1820, the Prime Minister of England, Lord: Liverpool, themselves as well as foreigners. By imposing retalia-
stated in that House that be wished there had been no tory duties they compelled themselves to buy dearly what
such thing as a silk trade. Yet what were the facts re- they might otherwise buy cheaply. If other countries
specting that trade? It employed capital to an amount refused to take their manufactures in exchange for their
of 12,000,0001 a year, the greatest portion of which was own produce they must seek to attain their object by
expended in wages 'of labour.—(Hear, hear.) There other means. All attempts of foreign countries to in-
never had been a trade so much the victim of protection jure them were greatly assisted by a system of protec-
as that of linen ; but, after withdrawing the protection of tion. Free trade was the best means of promoting peace
4,000,009/, the trade had reached, in the, north of Ire- amongst the nations of the earth—far better than corn-
land, the highest state of prosperity, and the fabrics pro- mercial treaties, which were always accompanied with
duced in that part were equal to the finest productions distrust, and in which one of the parties always consi-
of Cambray.—(Hear.) In the case of West India produce, dered himself either a victim' or a dupe.—(Hear,
the protective duties had failed. After the abolition of hear.) He should rejoice if it were proclaimed to
slavery and the equalisation of the duties upon East the world that henceforth they would engage
and West India sugars, introduced by him in 1834, the in no more commercial treaties.—(Hear, hear,) They
West Indiacolonies had improved in their prosperity, and owed some reparation to the world for the bad example
he had lived to see the day when those who anticipated which they had hitherto set them. He believed that the
only their own ruin from those measures, acknowledged carrying of the motion would be the prelude to a change
that they were the most benefited by them. With re- which would be most beneficial to all commercial
spect to the article of zinc, the reduction of the duty nations.
from 18s. to 25.• had led to the introduction of that ma- The Earl of COLCHESTER said that if mankind
terial into many important branches of manufacture. were likely to forget their jealousies he should concur
He had laid before their Lordships the whole of his with the Noble Earl in the sentiments which he had
facts, and all he asked of them was to give him an op- expressed ; but, believing that such a result was not to
portunity of laying the evidence before their Committee, be expected, he could not agree with the principles of free
and he humbly prayed them to give him their support. trade. He thought it would be very unwise to derive
p
Fortunately for mankind there had been twenty-three colonies of the discriminating duties which at present
years of general peace, and during that time the several existed, in the uncertain hope that they would eventuall
nations of the world had been cultivating branches of be benefited. y
industry, of which England had before the exclusive The Duke of RICHMOND was very much surprised
possession. Why, then, should the industry of England to hear from the Noble Earl (the Earl of Clarendon) that
be excluded from a fair competition?—(Hear, hear.) the agriculturists had it all their own way. If he stated
America, France, and Switzerland, had become our that against farmers, they would tell him that he must
rivals, but he believed that if the industry of England have dreamt it. Would any man say that the farmer
were free it would be able to maintain itself against that
competition. The Noble Lord concluded by moving the was not taxed more than any man in the country? The
that a Select Corn- farmer who did not make 3001. a year by his farm, paid
resolution, which was to the effect
more than the manufacturer who made 30,000/.—(Hear.)
mittee be appointed on the import duties, with the view
He did not at all like the speech of his Noble Friend the
of considering the effect produced by protective duties Vice-President of the Board of Trade—(Laughter)—and
on foreign commerce.
in voting against the motion of his Noble Friend (Lord
Earl DALHOUSIE said that he had to claim the in- Monteagle), he only said that whilst he disliked the
dulgence of their Lordships in answering the able and Government much, he liked his Noble Friend less.—
elaborate speech of the Noble Baron, but he hoped he (Great laughter.) It was said that the country should
should be able to show that the motion ought not to be not be dependent upon foreign nations for the supply of
agreed to. The Noble Lord stated that there was more food. But, he would ask the House, was it the way to
than one precedent for the course which he was taking. make the country independent to ruin the farmers ?
He stated this with perfect accuracy ; but surely the (Hear, hear.) He was an agriculturist, and he did not
Noble Lord must recognise a vast difference between deny the interest which he had in agriculture. But hes
the precedent which the Noble Lord had quoted and the believed that the whole object of the
free traders was to
course which the Noble Lord was then pursuing. One reduce the wages of the labouring people. It was the
of the precedents which the Noble Lord had cited was opinion, he was happy to say, of the great body of the
the appointment of a Committee, on the motion of a Noble labourers that they were better in their present
Marquis opposite (Lansdowne) ; but it must be remem- condition than they could be under a system of
bered that that Committee was appointed immediately free trade.—(Hear, hear.) His Noble Friend
after the conclusion of a long war. That Committee, it had referred to the embarrassments of our commerce,
was true, under the circumstances, produced beneficial with America, and had argued that those embarras-
, results ; but those circumstances were very different to ments were owing to our corn-laws and other protective
those under which the Noble Lord now moved for a duties. But was not the fact notorious, that to obtain
Committee. The Noble Lord then referred, as a pre- the produce of America we sent out hard dollars, and
cedent, to the Committee upon this subject which was got bad bills in exchange.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.)
appointed in 1839. This Committee also produced He for one would never consent to a reduction of pro-
most beneficial results, but it was appointed at a time tection to agriculture; and he would also support the
when no inquiry had been instituted for many years. protection of the manufacturer.—(Hear, bear.) The
Our commerce had for many years been in a state of agriculturists were restricted in many respects. They
distress, owing to disturbances in the colonies, and a con- were prevented by an Act of Parliament from growing
tinuation of war in the East and in China. Those tobacco.—(Hear, hear.) Let the free-traders take away
evils had now, however, passed away, and now, those restictions before they attempted to make the
when the commerce of the country was just people of this country dependent upon foreigners for the
emerging from the effects of those evils, the Noble Lord supply of food.
came down with a motion for inquiry. It was unrea-
The Earl of WICKLOW would not intrude upon
sonable for the Noble Lord to launch into a new in-
their Lordships, but thought if he gave a silent vote, his
quiry before the policy adopted by her .Majesty's Go-
motives and reason would be misunderstood. He en-
vernment, two years ago, had been fully and properly
tirely agreed in all the arguments of his Noble Friend who
tested. The Noble Lord had said, that owing to the brought forward this motion, but he did not think that
surplus that existed in the revenue of the country, now the Committee could be granted without creating great
was the best time to inquire into our commercial system, alarm and embarrassment.—(Hear, hear.) He must say,
with a view to the reduction of duties. The Noble however, that he fully concurred in ail the opinions of
Lord ascribed the surplus in the revenue to the income- his Noble Friend, and in none more firmly, than that
tax and the Chinese money. Why, this itself was an
abstract principles must always be applied with caution.
answer to the argument of the Noble Lord. The ia-
come-tax was temporary, and the Chinese money had There was really no difference between the principles
arisen out of a fortuitous circumstance, and, therefore, laid down by his ' Noble Friend and those acted upon by
could be no grounds upon which to make any investiga-
the present Government. The• difference was one only
as to time. He felt that the Government was acting so
tion into our commercial system, with a view to a re-
diction of duties. The Noble Lord had instanced man wisely, that whilst he agreed with the theory of his
Noble Friend, he was compelled to give in his adhesion
cases in which duties ought to be reduced; but they
to her Majesty's Ministers, who were earrying out the
Noble Lord must have forgotten, when he did so, the
same theory with sound caution.—(Hear, hear,)
declarations which were made by the Right Hon.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE rose to support the
Baronet, the First Lord of
,the Treasury, when
motion of his Noble Friend. He thought the Noble
he introduced his tariff. That Right Hon. Gentle- Earl who had just sat down, and the Noble Duke on the
man -then stated that the Government were
cross bench, ought to vote for this motion, inasmuch as
desirous of making large reductions in the their speeches were both made up of arguments in its
duties on many articles, but that, owing to favour. The necessity for this inquiry was made the
the large reductions which were already con- more apparent by the fact that within the last five ears
templated, it would be impossible to make the full reduc- y
five distinct failures had taken place in attempts tc ne-
tions which they were desirous of' making, and therefore gotiate with respect to our commerce with foreign coun-
they had determined to apply the reduction to those arti- tries. He believed that the only means of relieving the
tiles which were of the most pressing necessity. The '
Noble Lord had referred to the question of sugar at
commerce of this country from its distress would he fur
gth
the Legislature to place it in a state of freedom.
considerable fen ; but as that question would soon It was said that things which the Government had
come directly under the consideration of their Lord-
touched were in a settled state. So far from things
ships, he did not feel that it was necessary for him to being in a settled state, he believed that not many hours
follow the Noble Lord in that part of his argument. had elapsed since the person highest in authority on
There was another- point to which the Noble Lord had those subjects declared in another place that they wore
referred, and that was the question of the duty upon
in a transition state with regard to sugar.---(Hear,
timber. The Noble Lord complained of the reduction
hear.) That was the comfortable state of settlement in
which they were in.—(A laugh.) In every ease wherein
of the duty on colonial timber. Why this, was some-
thing like inconsistency in the Noble Lord, seeing that
when the Government with which the Noble Lord was free trade principles were carried out they were followed
connected was in office, the Noble Lord himself advo-
ortwith the best results. The question of sugar was a most
an subject, and the people of this country had
The duty on staves he (the &r 1 of Dalhousie) thought,t
cated a reduction in the duty on the article of timber. imp
more right to complain of the character of the legistation
of the country in respect of it than any other subject.
pressed heavily on the coopers of the country, and he
for one would be glad to see an opportunity arise of re-
This country had the most extended commerce. What
lieving that branch of the trade of the country.—(Hear, was the result of that ? It was that the labourer of
hear.) The Noble Lord had dwelt at considerable such a country was not able to consume one-half of the
length on the question of prohibiting duties, and
sugar that was sent out to the Cape of Good Hope.—
taunted the Government with maintaining them. Now
(Hear, hear.) Yet the people were told to be proud of
he (the Earl of Dalhousie) thought the Government,
a system which took away from them the benefits of that
since their accession to office, had not shown a disposi-
extended commerce.—(Hear, hear.) How was it pos-
tion to uphold prohibitory duties, but on the con-
Bible they could be believed to be sincere in their legis-
trary had in many cases proposed their abolition. lation with regard to sugar ? because while they professed
The reductions made were very considerable in many to be guided by principles of humanity they yet seemed
i alone.
instances, and even in this very session a reduction was
to consider thenterests of a particular class
made to the amount of 450,0001., upon wool, and coffee, (Hear.) But lie thought that all due consideration
and other articles. Taking this, in connection with the should be given to the West India interest. What they
reductions made two years ago, amounting to 1,200,000/, ought to do was to facilitate the introduction of
it was evident her Majesty's present Government were
Africans into the West Indies, subject to no other con-
&sirens of giving every extension to trade consistently ditions than that they should not proceed to the Woo
Indies without proper precautions being taken tea pro-
with existing interests. He had now gone through all
the gronnds upon which the Noble Lord had founded
vide them a suitable means of transit, and allowing
his motion, and he trusted that, for the benefit even of
them free liberty to go back to Africa when they pleased.
those who were engaged in trade, their Lordships would
He heard with great pleasure the sentiments of the
Noble Earl; "and if this country arrived at a, atate of
prosperity, it was, as Lord Liverpool said, in spite
reject the motion of the Noble Lord.—(Hear, hear.)
The Earl of CLARENDON said he did not blame great
of their prohibitory system.—(Hear, hear.) He should,
the Noble Earl for not having fully answered the speech
of his Noble Friend, which was so abundant in argu-
with great pleasure, support the motion of his Noble
ment and so conclusive in its logic, that it was impos-
Friend, and he recommended its adoption to their Lord-
sible to give a complete reply to it. But it seemed, at ships.=(Cheers.)
all events, that in principle there was little difference be-
The Earl of WINCHILSEA said that, in the present
tween his Noble Friend and the Noble Earl.—("Xear
artificial state of this country, it would be impossible to
,
hear," from the Duke of Richmond.) His Noble Friend apply the principles of free trade, however well they
on the cross benches was evidently of the same opinion, might be adapted to a new state of society; but, borne
—(A laugh.) But it was impossible for his Noble Friend down as they were by the national debt, how could they
to be long in the office which he now so creditably adopt the principle of free trade ? It was the
filled without coming to the conslusion to which the duty of every Government to, encourage home
Production • and he found that the same els,
Noble Earl had evidently come. And they were re-
t.em was adopted 'thregard to the
wilily
quisite in the present state of this country. Nobody
interests of other countries. They were so burdened
could look to the state of the labouring population of
this country without seeing that it was absolutely notes with taxes that protection was necessary to enable them
sary to remove the strictures on trade, however they
to pay those taxes. In his opinion the home market and
the colonial market would be amply sufficient to mein-
might differ as to the time or mode in which they were
so to be removed. There was only one branch of trade to fain their prosperity, without any referenee the
f
which he would refer, which was omitted in the list of foreign trade at all. For this reason he should oppose
articles enumerated by his Noble Friend—that was the the motion of the Noble Lord.
E cotton trade. In the commencement of that trade it Lord MONTEAGL replied.
was subjected to fiscal regulations, but as they were re-
Their Lordships then divided, when there appeared—
moved the trade increased, and the prices of cotton Contents—Present 3B
..“
goOds were lowered till they were made accessible to Proxies 376
7
the poorest of the people.—(Cheers.) Well, after such
Not Contents—Present
an instance, how could they refuse to proceed in the
course which had been followed by such results?— I);urea
(Hear, hear.) His Noble Friend had alluded to the silk —lB4
trade. When Mr. Huskisson resolved to reduce the Majority against the motion lO9
silk duties he was hooted and pelted on his way to the The Vinegar Duties Bill then went through Cosa-
House of Commons, and was called the hard-hearted mittee, after which their Lordships adj num"

Minister, but in spite of all the predictions which had
been hazarded as to the evil result of his measure, he
persevered, and the consequence was, that instead of the
silk trade suffering fresh mills had been built, the con.
sumption of silk had been increased twelvefold, and
Manchester, instead of employing 3,000 in the trade, gave
employment to 15,000, and the silk manufactured goods
had been raised from 450,000/. to I,6oo,oool.—(Hear,
hear.) He would not allude to wool, or coffee, or sugar,
for his Noble Friend had so exhausted those siAbjects
that he found it as difficult to folik-iw him as the Noble
Earl did to answer hina. He would only say a few
words, and they shotild be with regard to the corn-
laws. He confessed he ho seen nothing in the state
of affairs to induce him to ;titer the opinions he held, and
had so often exprussed on the subject. The evils of this
law were as great as ever, and might burst upon them
any day. They made the supply of fool for the popu-
lation dependent on the barometer, ;nd if. they had two
or three bad harvest, most deeply founded insti-
of the people. They had had now two good harvests, of
tu t ito would be powerless in
tcoo:nna;ia.e:taci t44hina,tgrh;sre:_deue(mrireiaennaderse,
continuance of' them? TherAk were serious, appreheiasions
more than average prodraeusimch,eiclkbpuv;nocao'liitil
entertiined with .fespec
1839, when eCPe
cthtias
hear).--and he 'regretted that past
,xi)Pr.ol,e9 not
tof such gbelmott;i,aprtcloivii6.ll,oe:
41:
iQuntry was on the verge of bankruptcy, and when they
were obliged to apply to the Bank of France for assist-
ance, from which he believed they could exreet no
assistance now, even if they were te. submit' tO the
national dishonour of applying for*. They hid dabbled
with the sliding-scale, but no ;malt' ehange had been

Lang LONDONDERRY'S NEW WORK.—We are
requested to state that Mr. Colburn, of Great Marl.
borough-street, has this day published the Marohioness
of Londonderry's " Narrative of her Visit to the Courts
of Vienna, Constantinople, Athens, Naples, &c.," in one
volume, Bvo., with portrait, price 14s. bound, which eau
now be had of all 'booksellers. Mr. Colburn has also
just published:--2. The seventh volume of Miss Strick-
land's " Lives of the Queens of England," containing the
sequel of the Life of Queen Elizabeth, and the coraplat
e
Life of Anne of 'Denmark-3. " The Bridal Pr Melch,a,"
by Mary L. Boyle, ss. 6d. bound
,nnd A s oust and
cheaper edition of " Frederie'* ttbe, Cgreat, his and
Times," edited by Tlkopa,,a,s, Qam..Pb3g, r 2 vols. small
Bvo., 21s, lotniX.
A wets was held bn Tuesday evening, 11th
instant, at the
taking Reading, for the purpose of
tieconsideration the objects and 'intentions
ational Animals' Friend Society, of Exeter-hall, J.
SettaltiAk in the chair. The meeting was ably ad-
dressed by Messrs. May, H. May, Rev. W. Legg.. 1%.
Carroll, Esq., Rev. J. Statham, and other gentlemen
and ministers, and resolutions passed in praise of the
cause a tthis very valuable Institution, whose exertiop4
have been lately directed to the great cruelty sp, preva-
lent in the county of Berkshire. TWA. .-kneeting sepa-
rated highly gratified with the eren;.ng's proceedings.
PUBLIC-HOUSE LlcElia44.—lt is said to be in eon,-
templation vviselhe Whole system oV4o.4..snsj.tig inns
and public-houses during the nett rmion. tqa.,,,e„t,
so as to' place' it on a similar fopting to, that now in
practice on the Continent. by which the revenue will be.
greatly increased,ind monopolies to a very great extent
done swat with.-=lpswich