The Sun.
London, England, 1850-02-08 00:00:00

IRELAND.

Mr. FAGAN wished to kaow whether it was the in-
lention of the Government to introduce a Bill to assi-
milate the law respecting the recovery of small debts in
Ireland to that of the County Courts in England? Also
whether they had any intantion or bringing forward a
fiscal Bill, a Sanitary Bill, and a Medical Charities Bill,
during the present session?
Sir W. SOMERVILLE said be could not undertake
to say there was any intention, on the part of the Go-
'vernment, to bring forward a Bill to assimilate the
law in England and Ireland for the recovery
of small debts, but the subject had been much
discussed by them during the recess. The other Bills
(he was understood to say) were under the consideration
of the Government, but he could not promise when they
would be brought forward.
THE MINT.
In reply to Mr. HUME,
Lord J. RUSSELL was understood to say that a Bill
was in preparation in regard to certain alterations con-
cerning the Mint.
LORD J. RUSSELL AND MR. lIORSMAN.
Mr. ROEBUCK said he wished to put a queztiou to
the Government respecting a letter which hail appeared
in the newspapers, signed " E. Horsman," because he
thought it concerned the honour of the House;
and it seemed to him that the sooner an ex-
planation was given the better it would be for
the Government and all parties concerned.—(Hear.)
This letter charged the Noble Lend opposite with some-
-thing like fraud upon the House, with having given a
promise to as Honourable Member in his place
in Parliament, and afterwards wilfully breaking it;
but, lest there should be any misunderstanding about
the matter he would read the words of the Hon. Gentle-
'man the Monster for Cockermouth, whose name he
found appended to this letter. The Honourable Gen-
tleman then proceeded to read an extract from Mr.
Horsman's letter, addressed to his constituents, in
• which it was stated, in reference t,.) the Ecclesiastical
'Commission Bill, that certain amendments were sug-
gested to Lord John Russell by Mr. llorsman and
'others, which the Noble Lord, after a consultation with
the Arch bishop cfCanterbury, adopted, and promised that
they should be introduced into the Bill. The Bill in
consideration of this promise w as delayed for some time,
but eventually it found its way int) Committee at a late
hour of the night, when some amendments were
introduced which Mr. Horsman _ and his friends

supposed were those which had Lena promised,
and the Bill went through Committee pro
d'orma, without notice or comment. When, however, the
I till was re-printed with its amendments, it was dis-
c avered, that the promised amendments were not in it,
a .nd Mr. Horsman, as an excuse for not seeing that they
vere introduced when the Bill was in Committee,
I stated in his letter that he should have as soon have
: thought of keeping a watch on the Prime Minister t)
15oe that he did not steal his hat, as to watch the intro-
(Auction of amendments into a Bill aftr they had
been promised and adopted by the Minister.
Ho heard the Hon. Gentleman the Member for Cocker-
f mouth some three evenings ar, when he brought on the
:motion respecting this matter, :ay that he repudiated
;.his charge. The charge NI 11S one which affected
Übe dignity and honour of this House, and it should
answered at once. It was a lett,.r signed with the
n 4 me of the Hon. Member for Cockermouth (Mr. Hors-
mi le), charging the Noble Lord, three weeks before the
ast erabling of Parliament, with what ho (Mr. Roebuck)
thi mght was something like fraud.—(Hear, hear.)
e would now ask the Hor. Gentleman opposite 1
Ir. Uorarean) whether or not the ebtirge which he

consumption would relieve them.— (Hear, hear.)
Ho knew it would be said that, to a certain extent, the
poor at present. were relieved from paying rate upon their
houeee. In Lancashire, for example, out of 340,000
rate-Tayers, 50,000 were excused, arid out of the total
annual property rated for the relief of the poor, amounting
t) six millions and a-half, 369,000/. was excused.
The Hon, Member then proceeded to read a quantity of
returns of the number of houses excused from taxation
from rates in the severel counties, showing that about
one-third were relieved from fiscal impositions, and
then proceeded to say : Now those houses
were excused under an Act of the 54th George
111., c. 170, an Act which, while it contem-
plated a relief to the lower classes, had, in fact, been
instrumental in occasioning many cases of delicacy and
much distress.—(Hear, hear.) Every person who desired
to be excused was obliged to come before the over-
seers, and prove his poverty. Tho entire amount of the
exemption under this Act was not less than 600,0001.
The poor man who happened to have some money in the
savings' bank never was excused; there was no pre-
mium for prudence and providence. He thought that
the et:empt to pass such a measure as that proposed by
the Honourable Member for Hertford would be
pernicious in the extreme. He would prove the fal-
lacy t f the principle of that measure in a
very short time if the House would listen to him.
The ratepayer as well as the landowner had prejudices
on this subject; they both looked upon the owner of
cottages as an enemy instead of looking upon him
as he really was, a public benefactor. lie
it was who conduced to the promotion of
morality, by providing for the poor labourer a de-
tached dwelling for his family. If a gentleman should
build a house for poor labourers, it would be very unjust
to impose upon him a tax fir that house, whether he ob-
tained a rent or not. In many parishes there were comfort-
able and very pretty cottages built for labourers, but the
supply of cottage dwellings was deficient. The
greater portion of these cottages wero built by
speculative persons, and the effect of imposing a
tax on the owners, would be to discourage these
persons and to diminish the supply of dwellings for the
poor. He would not now enter into the question as to
whether the tax upon land was ultimately paid by the
owner or the occupier—he believed it was paid by
the owner ; but this was evident, that the pos-
session of land was a monopoly, but not
so with regard to houses, because as the supply
increte ei the rent decreased, and if by taxing those
houses they interfered with the enterprize of the specula-
live builder, the supply of houses would diminish, and it
appeared that even at present the supply of houses was
diminishing rather than increasing, and the poor
were consequently driven to immoral and crowded
lodgings ; therefore it was desirable by re-
lieving small houses of taxation to induce specu-
lative builders to increase the supply of those
houses. He knew that some persons were opposed to in-
cruLe the number cf small houses, because such incie Ise
tended to increase the population; he had thought that
notion had been exploded, but he would ask the sup-
porters of that doctrine whether pauperism was not
increased by crowding the poor into bad houses,
and whether the supply of good houses would not tend
to diminish it? In a sanitary, in a moral, in an econo-
mical point of view, he was convinced that an increased
supply of small houses was desirable. That was the
opinion of the Noble Lord the Member for Bath (Lord
Ashley), as he had gathered from a speech of his re-
cently delivered at a meeting at the London Tavern.
The adequate increase of dwellings would decrease pau-
perism and crime. The palaces of the Sovereign were
exempted from this tax. Now, he called upon them to
do f ,r the poor man what they did for the royal palaces.
The wealthy man's personal property was exempt from
taxation. Why, then, should not the dwellings of the
poor man be exempted from this local taxation? All
mines, except coal-mines, were excused. That wcs real
property. Why, if the proprietors of that property
should be excused, should not the poverty el' another
class excuse them? It would be a simple thing to draw
a line between the houses, and say that houses cf such
a rental shall pay 'and houses of suoh another rental
shall not pay. In the Own of Liverpool, out of 42,000
houses no less than 32,000 houses were excused upon
one ground or other. Thus unjustly did the existing
law work. More than three-fourths of the houses
were excused. He did trust that the House would con-
sider and deliherste on this subject. He asked them
to elevate the condition and moral character of the poor
by attention to their wants, and by passing measures
with that tendency. The masses of the population
around them were in a very fear fed condition. In France,
social convulsion and disaffection to the Government
had sprung from neglecting the means of reconciling
the poorer classes and improving their condition. This
neglect had conduced to acts of rebellion and insubordi-
nation. He concluded by asking leas) to bring in the Bill.
Mr. FAGAN, after a pause, seconded the motion.
Mr. A. STAFFORD hoped the Hon. Member would
not attribute any want of courtesy to him if he proposed
to take the divisors on the Bill at the present stage, which
the Hon. Member had selected as the opportunity for
taking the discussion upon it. The Bill was so short
and the question so plain and easy, that the House
would be as well able to form an opinion on the propriety
of affirming or rejecting it now as on the second reading.
The present inclination of the House was by no means
to diminish the property subject to taxation, and, if the
measure proposed by the Hon. Gentleman was adoptel,
its only effect would le, not to relieve the occupier, but
to increase the owners' rents.—(llear, hear.)
Sir G. GREY observed, that the Hon.' Gentleman
(Mr. Scrope) had communicated to him his intention to
ask for have to introduce his Bill, which he (Sir G.
Grey) was prepared to accede to; but, after the course
he bad taken in raising the whole question at issue when
stating the principle of the proposed measure, the House
could not be better informed upon it than they were at
present—(Hear, hear)—and, although he had not pro-
posed to oppose the introduction of the Bill if it was
pressed to a division now, he must vote against it. He
quite agreed with the Hon. Member in the importance
of doing everything in their power to improve the
dwellings of the poor.—(Hear, hear.) It was satisfac-
tory to observe what had been done in the metropolis
and most of the large towns in that direction. After the
perusal of all the Hon. Gentleman had aritten with so
much ability on the subject, he was unable to arrive at
the same conclusions, for he believed the Honourable
Gentleman's project offered a premium for the erection
of a lower class cf houses—(hear, hear)—and if
the standard of rating was fixed at a high rent a much
larger amount cf property would be exempted than
would be at a:l desirable. The Hon. Member, in writing
of the mode in which the existing law worked, brought
an argument of a convincing nature against his own Bill,
for he declared that cases occurred where the owners of
cottage property constituted a majority in the vestry,
and carried an exemption from rates in their own
favour. [Mr. Sexes.—" That's not general; it's only
a particular case."] Believing the Bill would have a
most prejudicial effect on the object of the Hon. Gentle-
man, he must oppose the proposition now, as on every
former occasion, and vote against it if it was forced to a
division.

had lately marts was one to which he now adhered, and
what stees were about to be taken to satisfy the country
and this House that the charge was or was not true?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said, as the Hon. Gentle-
man had come down to this House tur the purpose
of reading a paper making a personal attack on his
(Lord John Russell's) character, he thought it would
only have been right and proper for the Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. Roebuck) to have given him some notice.
—(Cheers.) He (Lord John Russell) said this
was the more necessary bemuse he had never
read the production to which he had re-
fsrred.—(Cheers.) He was told that there was an
attack upon his character signed by the Hon. Gentle-
man, and he (Lord John Russell) thought that if he
had an attack to make, that he would come forward
in this House, and then he (Lord John Russell)
would have been ready to answer it upon
the particulars so stated.—(Loud cheers.) He (Lord
J. Russell) had never read the le'ter in question; he
asl heard in conversation some small parts of the state-
ment which the Hon. Gentleman had made. Now,
with regard to this particu'ar &negation, although
he could not say his memory would enable him
to answer as to the particular transaction that took place,
he would state generally what had been his course on
this subject upon the matter which concerned the com-
position of the Ecclesiastical Commission, which
very much affected the state cf the Church.—(Heir.)
The Hon. Gentleman had totally omitted one part of the
matter, and that which he thought to be a very impor-
tant part. He was unwilling to refer to the circum-
stances, but after what the Honourable Gentleman had
said there was no other course left to him.—(Hoar.)
In 1846, when he came into office, aftcr much conversa-
tion with some persons connected with the Ecclesiastical
Commission, and also with some persons emi-
nently connected with the Church, he became
exceedingly dissatisfied with the constitution c f that
Commission. In the following session, therefore, in
1847, he introduced a Bill with a view to appoint a
chairman of that Commission, of course paid by the
State, without whose presence no business whatever
was to be transacted. Another provision of that
Bill was, that fur the future ; the office of
treasurer and secretary should never be held by the
same person.—(Hear, hear.) Shortly sfer that Bill was
introduced I received a notice from the Archbishop of
Canterbury that it would be seriously opposed
In the House of Lords by members of that
Ecclesiastical Commission.—(Cries of " Hear.") On
this course being taken, he saw that there was very
-little
chance of success for the Bill. The matter was then
noticed by the Hon. Member for Melton (Mr. Denison),
and seeing the line adopted by the Archbishop of Can-
terbury, and that he refused to give his assent to the
Bill, he (Lord J. Russell) had thought it his duty to
move the appointment of that Committee.—(Hear, hear,
and cheers.) With that appointment the Archbishop
had nothing whatever to do; laded it was totally con-
trary to his wishes—(Cheers)—and h 3 mentioned the
matter because that Committee had originated with
himself from a dissatisfaction with the working
of the Ecclesiastical Commission.—(Hear, hear.)
He would now pass to the statement of the Hon. Gen-
tleman that he (Lord J. Russell) had been appealed to
in respect to the difference between his Bi!1 and the
report of the Committee, and that he had been re-
quested that the Bill should be altered. After com-
municating with the late Archbishop of Canterbury
and the Secretary of State, he found that
both those gentlemen put a different interpretation upon
the recommendation of the Committee to what that Hon.
Gentleman did; but still he had thought it expedient to
make some alteration in the Bill. With regard to
the other points, he certainly did not concur with
the Honourable Gentleman, nor did he exahtly
remember the words which he had used,
but he did not think he had said more than that the sug-
gestions of the Hon. Member had been considered, and
that the Bill would certainly be amended. At this stage
he (the Noble Lord) had found, on communication
with the present Archbishop of Canterbury, that that
Prelate, as well as many other Bishops, had a decided
objection that more than one paid Commissioner
should be appointed, as the revenues of the Church would
thus be applied to purposes for which it was not origi-
nally intended. lie (the Noble Lord) had always wished
to carry with him as much as possible the prelates and
dignitaries of the Church, for otherwise he had felt that
that there never would be that entire harmony between
the two bodies as was necessary for their proper working.
He ought to have explained to the Hon. Gentleman (Mr.
Horsman) perhaps sooner, how far the suggestions which
had been made had been varied; but it did appear to
him that the letter of the Hon. Gentleman was the re-
sult of excited vanity, that nothing should be done un-
less he knew of it.—(Cheers.) He (Lord J. Russell) II as
not going to resent the charge which had been made;
he would only say that ho despised such a charge—
(Cheers)—he would not go into a detailed proof of what
had taken place from that day for a long period. Ile
must say that having been a Member of that House for
many years he would certainly be unworthy of the
position which he held if he were capable of a disgrace-
ful fraud for the purpose of deceiving the Honourable
Gentleman about the composition of the Ecclesiastical
Commission.—(Cheers.) The alteration of the Commis-
sion was made so far a matter of patronage, that it was
thought the heads of the Church, especially the Arch-
bishop of Canterbury, for whom he had the highest
respect, and who was anxious fur reform, should be con-
ciliated, and should be induced to give their support and
good will to the measure.—(Cheers.) These were the
motives which actuated him, and he did not know
that he would be required to give any further explana-
tion.—(Cheers.)
Sir GEORGE GREY bad seen the letter, and
ho had briefly referred to it the other night in
his reply to the Honourable Member for Cocker-
mouth. It was with feelings of shame and astonish-
ment that he had read the charge, not however
with astonishment that the charge should have bean
made, but that it should have been made in December or
January last in reference to a transaction which, accord-
ing to the Hou. Gentleman's own statement, occurred in
the course of the last session of Parliame,.t, nay, six
weeks before its termination, every night of which
six weeks his Noble Friend and himself
sat upon the very benches which they now occupied.
Now the lion. Gentleman might have made his charge
in that time, but it would not have served his purpose;
he wanted this charge of a direct breach of
faith for a winter letter to his constituents.
He would not detain the House by going
at length into the charge, but ho would content himself
with distinctly and unequivocally denying the imputa-
tion which the Hon. Gentleman had thought fit to cast
upon him.—(Cheers.) lie never had the slightest
reason to suppose his Noble Friend intended
to shirk any amendments; on the contrary,
everything was done to secure the conve-
nience of the House. The Bill was committed pro forma
on the 14th of June, and reported ou the 20th of the
same month, so that there was ample time between then
and the end of the session to discover any omission, and
again he must repeat his astonishment that thech arse was
delayed till December or January.—(Hear.)
Mr. HORSMAN observed th it the Noble Lord, and
still more the Right lion. Baronet who had just sat
down, had introduced a good deal of feeling and warmth
into the discussion—(Oh, oh!)—but ho should take an
entirely different course, and content himself with simply
confining himself to facts and evidence.—(Oh, oh.)
lie wrote that letter deliberately. He knew the high
position of the parties affected by this charge; he knew
the sympathy that men standing in their posi-
tion would command in the House when charges
SO seriously affecting their character were
made against them ; and he knew that he
must prejudice every impartial and high minded man in
the House by the boldness and the gravity of the
charges which he (Mr. Horsman) made. lie knew
also he might have the greatest difficulty in sub•
stantiating those charges, if he was pressed to
substantiate them. He know, if he could not
substantiate them, he must be held mad to
have made them. Knowing all that, feeling it, and
foreseeing it, he deliberately made that charge, advisedly
published it, and he stood there in the pc eeence of that
House to avow, to tr &ntain, to reiterate, and to offer to
prove it. He left this matter in the hands of the House,
thinking ha had a right to claim the protection of the
House, while he, a private Member of that House, en-
di avourel to prove that charge; but he left it to the
House to decide what he was to do.
Lord J. RUSSELL—The Hon. Gentleman had said
that Le hal made charges which he had that night re-
iterated, and he complains that ho had been unfairly
dealt with.—(Cheers.) It would appear that the Hon.
Gentleman had written a letter to his constituents which
has been the subject of some comments in that House.
What he thought was, that it the lion. Gentleman had
any complaints to make the best plan he could
adopt was to come down to that House and move for
the appointment of a Committee. He might say
for himself that ho would not oppose it, and flu hoped
the Hon. Gentleman would make something out of it.
The SPEAKER then put the questioe, but it not
being seconded, it fell to the ground amid much laughter
en all sides of the House.
EXEMPTION OF HOUSES OF SMALL RENTAL
FROM TAXATION.
Mr. POULETT SCROPE rose, amidst much turmoil, ,
to move for the introduction of a Bill for the exemption
of small houses from taxation; but said, that in the THE HUNGARIAN WAR.
present temper of the House he did not expect to get a Lord DUDLEY S UART rose and said—Sir, I rise
bearing. Those parsons who had road the reports which to make the motionofwhich I have given notice, fur the
had been presented to Parliament for the last few years
would agree—he would appeal to the reports of the production of certain papers with regard to the negotiations
Poor-law Commissioners, of the Board of Health, and by this Government in respect to the late war in Hun-
above all, those able letters which had appeated in gary, with regard to the occupation of the principalites
the columns of the Times under the signature of of the Danube, and with regard to the demands by
3. G. 0.," would agree with him that there was a great
deficiency in the cottage and house accommodation in lassie, and Austria for the extradition of the Hungarian,
this country. The consequences of this were not only Polish,i and other te fugees; and also for some other
physical sem/engin thc masses but alio moral degradati papers. In making this motion I feel that no apology
Legislation had hither to been confined to drainage and is due fur the motion itself on account of its great im-
the supply of water, but though he did not unde-rvalue portance, although far the mover many apologies may
these advantages, they would be insufficient unless more be requisite in consequence of his inability to do justice
accommodation and space were provided for the dwellings
t) so large and so important a subject—(Hear,
of the poor. He did net ask the Legislature to provide
better sites for these dwellings; but he thought' it hoar)—but, Sir, I do not find that, any other
might with propriety be taken into
considera- gentleman who has directed his attention to the matter
tion, whether or not the restrictions which was disposed or prepared to bring it forward; and I
pressed upon them could not be done !away with. think I have consulted the convenience of the house
The mode which he would adopt for removing the evil and the progress of public business better by seizing the
would not be so much by any specific legislation by earliest opportunity for the purpose of bringiog it on,
removing restrictions which were imposed by the build-
ing of houses, for then the principle of supply and demand than by e aiting to a later period in the seision, when
would be sufficient to remedy the evil. The law of other measures shall have occupied very much the at-
sthettlement, fur instance, was ono of the main cause; of tention of the House, and when it may be still more in-
disposed than it usually is to bestow any part of its time
certain class of
e evil which he was now bringine, under the considera-
tion of the House and he, therethre, houses should be exemptsoposed that a
from local on other topics. Sir, I have to ask for irdJrmation upon
taxation, believing that the poor would be relieved
subjects which have excited, and continue to excite, the
i
thereby in the same manner as the abolition I greatest degree of interest in this ccuntry and through-
or removal of any other tax upon articles of ' out Europe. The Lord at the head of l'oreign

Mr. SLANEY gave every credit to the Hon. Member
for Stroud fir his Le3evolent intentions, but the best
attention he (Mr. Sianey) could devote t) the question
had convinced him that the proposed Bill would lower
and depreciate the condition cf the poor.
Mr. SCROPE certainly had not expected that leave
to bring in the Bill would have been n fused to him. His
statement was only intended to explain the principles of
the measure, not to raise any argument on the question
at large. He owre3 the opposition he had met with was
what he had every re aeon to expect in a House composed
of landowners and the reprtreatativel of ratepayers, It,
was impossible but that a feeling of bias should to pre-
valent iu a House of that nature.—(" Oh! oh !")
Mr. V. SMITH rose to protest against the Hon. Gen-
tleman's attributing any unfair bias to the House be-
cause they happened to be almost unanimous against his
proposition, so that he could only find a stc.,nder by
courtesy. The Hon. Member put him in mind of the
unlucky juryman whose lot was always to get into the
box with 11 of the most obstinate men in the world.
The fact was there never was a time when so much at-
tention was paid to t':e condition of the dwellings of the
poor. The Bill proposed would work the greatest in-
jury, and would only raise the rents; for even now there
were cases where the owners of cottage property having
obtained exemption from rates at once laid the amount
on the rents.

Mr. HUME, of his rorsonal knowledge, could cor-
roborato the last statement of the Right lion. Gen-
tleman (Mr. V. Smith), and was persuaded the proposed
Bill would open a door to abuse. There was a grf ac
desire abroad to see the physical_ condition of the working
classes improved, atd many person's who wsro anxious
to area comfrrtable cottages for them would be content
with es litt'e as 2 per cent. Ile thought those interested
is the question might with propriety make application
to Government to assist them by tsking the duty off
bricks—(llear, hear)—which weighed considerably
against the erection of substantial cottages, as well as by
repealing the window-tax. Such measures would have
far greater effect than the Bill of the lion. Gentle-
man, which would only lay the ground for abuse and
j obbing.
Mr. BROTHERTON said, thct in the borough which
he had the honour to represent there were 10,000 houses,
and of that number 9,000 were under the value of 10'.,
ale] therefore exempt.
The motion was then put, and negatived without a

Affaire, as on a former occasion, a few years ago, es,
plained with great clearness the principles
foreign affairs are managed under the English Constr
tntion; and he told the _House Oa', under that consts;
upon whic,`
tution, the largest discretion was always granted to l!e
Majesty's advisers in the conduct of diplomatic
tions in relation to foreige affairs, but at the same time
that that discretion was subject to the revision of I.er;
liamenr, and that that revision should not be exercise!:
unless Parliament was furnished with full and amp'.
information. On the occasion when my Noble Frier
made those remarks, and which I have repeated near yt
I believe, in his own words, he added that the country
was a good deal in the dark with regard to the transac;
tions to which he referred ; and I must say that. t.ht.
country, with regard to those transactions to wn.ll"
the papers I ask for refer, is at this moment considerae 1.,
in the dark. I want some light—l want some juror°,
,_,,a
tion. I think the country has a right to be informed as
to the part which the Government has taken in all ffi !_l!
matters referred to; for, as was said on the other sde IF
Queen's SPeel
the debate on the Address, and as the
yearly told us, we were not at war. It indeed resettled
seh all
to some very delicate transactions which had been '
without the public peace being endangered, at whic
._.
sides of the House and all parties expreesed their s.an.,
faction. But with regard to how those matters had
.71,;
and tiil.l7.
settled we have not yet been told one word;
that we have a right to be furnished with the we':
year b;
ample information. Sir, during the last
war has bean carried on in Europe which ttcy,
excited in the minds of the inhabitants of thicou overdone
perhaps, more interest than any other war has
.as
in which we ourselves were not directly 80
dbeen
principals ; and no wonder that that should haste
0,0
a desPrr"oo
the case, because that war was carried on by
Government, for the purpose of putting down '
pveeroyp
which they had enjoYec.l,_!.
long as us. Hungary has always been an indepennf;
les,imainldar of
to doeuprrioviwnng, them of a free constiatu!io_ng
country ; it has never been conquered. It has o,l"eir,
been independent de jure and de facto until last 5811ahmerY
when it was put down by the power and the treete ~.,
of Russia.—(Hear, hear.) The Hungarian inonsfef,
was originally elective. Ferdinand tho First, is.";
brother of the Emperor Charles the Fifth, nt
elected by the Diet in 1526. He took the 01:0'0
to the constitution, and all his successors have Ids his
the same oath, except one. Joseph 11. followe
example, and Joseph was never crowned, and
cognised as their king. It must be borne in Min('
~,,00,
Hungary and Austria have had nothing' in OE7
ei
except their sovereign, and have not been more uheltet:
than the kingdoms of Hanover and England. The kg of
ditary prince in the German States, the Archdn , to
Austria, was not King of Hungary till consecratebno.
I'resburg with the crown of St. Stephen on his far, le
In 1687 that crown was declared hereditary in the 7723
descendants of the house of Hapsburg, and Tn.'s! er
the Pragmatic sanction extended it to L'e"- :be
and the devoted fidelity with whin
secured
ered
Hungarians maintained that arrangement sec"has
to Maria Theresa, not only the kingdom of hung The
also the other dominions which she inherited• title
neviertbrac;
heiress of the house of Hapsburg was known by theetset
of the Queen of Hungary, that being the most in3P°L Or
of all the countries over which she ruled,
her successors obtaining the title of Emperor ot usbo
many, the title of King of Hungary was eclipsedbirchteh
more astounding appellation, yet it was Hungary 0 00.
was still the chief source of their power; for f,"„sity, of
Emperor
with history are well aware that the dig 'At
Emperor of Germany was nothing but a shadtralso
the beginning of this century, when the
'le
or °I
empire fell to pieces,. the modern title of Erg) rof
Emperor his
Austria was introduced, but tho
L[,
cAlwii
aeaunsus stillttgrtaaihalreliya.ai,Ding
idon
ofga3dweei
whom
derived his
geaharlhirsd)e
~a, greatest
c therefore,hp, owiwsheers
orco....ifkt brne°o:3otr
0::
rf a, aoi i
and thoug,;ler•
and not the .I,'''r it was
' Austria. which was re all meaet. At any rate; e" roY°l
' as the King of Hungary that he was able to .die
power. Joseph 11. ettemt tsd to destroy the Co shin'
ec-
ktinono.adeldVgheaitiihmapapaeiniieidigt,heexnac?teld'hforeDshiet, refnsing from
his successor, Leopold IL, who declaregdutahlniegesn!!;ereif
was• a country free and independent in her entire subject
of legislation and government; that she was not sil'jibt4
to. any, other people or any other state, btqsteocs
and
should have her own separate I,oestr
and her own constitutior and should, kings'
quently, be governed by her' own hereditary ed
legally crowned in accordance with her own tlaws'
eetber
a ny
the customs of Hungary, and not according to " the
iato
and
custoslnoflBH4Banrgeatorpawwesre introduced
constitution
they passed both Chambers also, apnadssreedeetihYeedPthie4r4lcialb
assent. Some were rather declaratory than nr„,,.'„a•srY,
• was the ono which enacted that the Ministry er LA-iiirticto
should be responsible to the Diet. Civil and 1),:f Jan'
equality were established without distinction " from
guage or of creed. The privilege of exeraPtifiges ob°
I direct taxation was taken away from the n°l'^-oubli°
.before possessed it, and participation in 'IV
imposts was extended to all Hungarianl•li, eel
labour rent was not only done away with eiltiret'e'Wer.
the lauds which the peasantry held upon that tenn•-fotioo
given up to them as their own property, comPeerideerli
being granted to the landlords. The suffrage, ',,antle°
confined is the nobility, was extended In c,:i prciai
to all persons possessed of real or person to ll'i
at, personsd property; r e
acrlleimsi
ovswi
tno,r,grekag iuniol
working
regularly
perty of the value of 301. a year ; in town 4,000'
yrizasonysea hrolfdLionnag
Thesetorefoa votede having
h yt h
e H lettersoo s
ejeitobi
eco
TI Or:
moos were sent up erzlegoerciefp`cioraleasigts.
to the House cf Lords, and " "C
..,Orson
solved the royal _ assent from the Sovereign in r- 60101
Presburg, on the 11th of April, 1848. The fignigaatr'rtif
in carrying
out these measures t 0 -Icoasts
of reform, a° e. in accordance • with the spirit and letter of their uir
tution, but still it did
not protect them from tye:
constitutional, and •
violent acts on the art of t'''' sr'
ror of Austria. Croatia had p _
._ out,,
fir eight centuries upon the been unitedo_o7oa
.100 f;
eight centuries, a period lo most intimate
of
Olive
ion er than that et, _
arose
0,
between Wales and En l Some disPn,7,e, aria con'
tween the two countriesg land
erhaps sotettiob 1 •
sequence of a measuree lefly,
I)
cf the Diet, VP ptir
traduced the Magyar language tie co,
liarnentary debates in the into
House of h he,
hineoenns, hatred of Latin, the language viuw-ivber
previously used. But the Court of Arienant'„,, gr
osystem of government was to foment theta disri"-.03" Oh
f3aiantefi Jellachich, the colonel of a Croatian re V got
Croatia that is to sa, governor of ertt•gacister,:
this o
Rasappointment being countersigned by n° rio'ng.B-
- Neverthelessethe . ' vv" I 6)
, Hungarian ,;0,,
~,.
conciliate the Count did
, not object to receive
_'„, engy
the Minister • •
invited him to communicate with r,--7reatif,'
regard to the convocation ef the assembly of `-'" eifi'
het le sr
where be was to be installed. He replied to fe- aA'
his/. ,a 1
tation by for's' lel.the
n ing Croatian assembly f° -pow'
claowmmunication with the Ministry and declaring refer
°
en(
euion all parsons who should presume to niail.it.:aart
to ti!y connexion between Croatia and 1-`ti thi
The Minister called upon Jellachich to retr,,, 100 t,
tutr and t' •
_,. ne Viceroy ordered an inquiry t) w.-aer
d into the matter, and sent out a Conialissiowever,
investigate the conduct of the Ban. He wx1,,,,13:00,
driven 1:,11
the
mask, and
by force, and Jellachich having'" he '''°
and disclosed the nature of tile Pe"'ibetwl
tended to, pursue, by • , • don - 0
usc.aring a Bowe joss bi,
Hungary and Croatia.—(hear, hear.) SAct gilY,i.--
has been • •
stigmatieed as a repealer---(2'• -ell i'-11:0
somo
ipersonF, probably because flini Abe ~ A
that t e most odious the could
aset- the
cou in .4
him, but there •is no truth whatever 00,
statement—whether it is a rill
ll°
.d°
complimentary te I 01
~
Hono r u able Friends behind me may very like °stn./
it, or whether it be one of opprobrium „ nth th°
perhapsi think it, there is no truth wliatevsrs Pst.eil
charge.—(Hear, hear.) Koesuth wished to have -eenit.
iwnistthituAtaions for a country which had Lever bee°. 1,, fad
Austria and the real J llachle lee
repealer was e lega to
he wished by force and violence, and not by , pore r
constitutional measures like those of K ssuth, i° -e-o ile
0 Red t ral
Croatia from Hungary, which fad been un ocee
since the fourteenth century. He convoked 0
crisisrnr.
assembly of Croatians in June contrary to the ,"
,i, al law, but on tho 29th th ' li* of Ilungal' hi°
Ae
e mg ~has. oct
e.,mperor Ferdinand, by an autograph letter 1., er,
calling together that asse bl •
m y. About Item, 0
a conference of Hungarian Ministers vels,4 by ass
Jelle '
. cinch did not appear there, an,"„l, b 11,:i:
royal ordinance, dated tfelOth of June, Jebia't-9,,ie•eln""'
suspended from his office, and the General 11, didelir
declared his appointment illegal; but Jellaell'e: itau ;°,
Isubmitu to this—he said Croatia was no longer "Creat
e!'
I nory; but there was a powerful psrlY jilt, of
who published a formal protestagainst the ac-- '0
lachich, and declaring their MO ' the
de,iro to Val ee,
they always had been, united
to IfungsrY* flat) i'‘:;l
serfs who inhabited the north bank of the I)°,°,-effee"';
instigated
by Austrian iefluence to become 01:11--at to
andh although it was only within a fox year, „`-to,e,t9:
ad been settled in the country in very siva, -,„oaa
they now demanded a to gove" agi-
r
separa . , , 00 p
~tly
and the horrors which they committed • or P s
probably anything that r • this a
as been known ill ~101,1„,j,
other country.--(Bear, liter.) I hold in 01 sin to e
book written by an Hungarian lady who vit/gsd,tlls
country at ti.e time, and is h re. fte--/7
who now e
seat 01
teens
Pulszky's book gives a most int( reet'ng acen.,mor
transactions,f and is just appearing; but i• ros ~
lavoured with a sight and a loan of it Prey'? aof the
ITing brought out, end I will, with the perraissintrocittes
ouse, re asi a short passage with regard to theZpieo
committed by satellites of the Austrian Gni°.
that time:--

tej thelli:
"The sad consequences cf this plot nlaniffeft than°
delves everywhere, but nowhere more dreade'll
the remote mountain district of ZalatwucYra!
,„djeali
iS.S
" The civil officers of the
rounded by wildly EinaticalsWe Farts 0
...-in hartbeir
achs, arras
this state of thin.,7, above 1,200 faithfuls ervant!. of
ibil
sovereign assembled. The were of all ran!sf,tainried Vo
highest to Vie lowest, old and young, aeeelnr„rpoSet;
their wives and children. All joined in the Pr-oheni'vl
proceed together to the town of Enyed, at senile" he 11.; 0
distance from Zalatuya, to be sheltered fre—ntoe -4,1)00
hordes, which were ready to attack every iher 1,,a5
chanced not to be Wallach, and who wore nnc)froal /I ;
is peasant's coat. It was yet at some distaneerest troheo
wive when the officers were overtaken by a great
li 0
of armed Wallach-. Not willing to oppose
00arcttho
pretended to be actin.. in the name of the In the; 1:0,
negotiation {i'a3 entered upon. Its result wa°l nitolce,,
emigrants agreed to deliver up their swords 0.0",,,ted fill'i
under condition that they should not be preve'-`_og 0
freely proceeding to Enyed. BE fure the dibarnu e
.
completed the evening had come on. areif' the
.4 Several carriages were laden with the 0
..,
they waited for dawn t) continue their journeiLood!
night the Wallachs sent a messenger to the .w_ ir,011:
who was an Austrian c,ffic, r, Waer!, .The nle'd
'' Ole'
NO- at they should do ' with their prisoners. he vire
sengpr returned with the laconic reply, ' l'u t
clt tlis
to death.'
" When the peremp'ot y ord r
riotous of marderiar,r„irs; pt 0
people itself w a thuqc.:,er-trucl, and "

Aleo de•----------___________
Naito" one eoern ,
tees "'• lloth , ?Led to break the pie lee kf a free ' j ovcd fir centuries—they, like Us, heing anxious to adapt of putting down liberty arises, then her self-possession, I
ate, , , parties hesitated fur seine instants to their constitution to the times in which they lived, and say, seeces to abandon her, and then she seems no longer
telrea; J decide st
4atne .11 teetion. hla, at last the disarmed act there- to make it of practical utility—being anxious to asivanee to act by slow and crooked means, but comes forward
tett .eircuinstene Slowly the precession advanced until safely and gradually, and being reformers and not revo- promptly and impetuously in order to destroy all really
egaelleedi w,,_ ee, which has never been pstedei ly as int;onists, ceuld not be content with such a constitution sound and wholesome reforms wherever she fleets
' lt• " considered by the Waliache a signal to as that; hut, above all, they coal:1.11w. a-cept a con- them. In 1791, what occesioned the last partition in
iliull.°"' followed ,
tare
.. Laed me a horrify ing stitutioa which had not ben agreed to by Poland? The introduction of a reform so well con-
ete ere cud scene. One part of the all the different orders of the state, but was sidered end so promising in all its provisions as to call
A ere Pointed na fielded to death, others pierced through only granted as a favour by the Sovereign, and, being so forth the eulogies of all writers and speakers. who have
Ret. insegled ,911,ntalthetieles. Some hanged on trees granted, might the neat day be withdrawn.—(ficar, lived ever since. In 1829, why did she interfere with
e. e buroe With hay-forks • others thrown into eitt been) When the Diet saw their legitimate Sivt - Turkey? Because she saw Turkey engaged in intro-
'llterci " "der blocks e "
retied down upen them. 'Wo• reign deposed, the succession of his heir set aside, and &icing salutary and staple reforms ieto. the state. In
111°4 (heard, ens were mutilated and murdered in the the none, heir, instead of corning to Fresbere, to take the 1848, we find she interfered in Moldavia for the same
inspTh aguggibratanner, oath, as his predecessors had done, pouring foreign reeson ; and inlB49,only the other day,w hen Huegary put
etaseeter of Zai er laded long. Roiebeel, a Germain the troops into the couLt-y, and every compait between f ,rth the most legitimate of all claims to carry forward
g 4to e atuya
1 g thei teeaughters not wham clung his wife and two the house uf Hapsburg aed Hungary broken, that constitution which the eeeple all enjoyed, Russia
:saw in. prospect a great coestitutio.nal country, and she
tog or urealf 1• , seeing any ossibility of avert- they adopted the precedent set them by um
seat dm:strew
ulathfaant3, drew out hia double •a t C • Mors and Lords of England; and they immediately lost no time in pouring in her hordes of
pee° , which, um s
I'f• se%_,ll first h 4. his Companions, he had retained, dee,lared the throne vacant, and the further armed barbarians to crush the cause. Sir, I rejoice thatl
tit,' ••,iu, lain or° daugi t,rs loaded again, shot his line of Hapsburg to be for ever extinct. No Republic the magnanimity of the Sovereign and the prompt La-
dtetapt, in j? killed himself. 'The haste and the (a- was proclaimed, as again and again has been said. Toe cision and energy of my Noble Friend at the head of
the''llis beelich he achieved this awes! deed, red tendency of the Hungarian people has always been Foreign Affairs have caused. Russia to suffer a cheek
to surlrible 1-7 "certain, his mutilated wit', survived monarchical; their Acts run in the name of the King such as she has not. experienced for a long time.
thenitilbout 170 tpastroPhe, and related it. Of 1,200 per- until the 4th of March. " Governor- Prosident,"dhe title The Cz tr must, indeed, at this moment bit-
koat eeetaradesdenelined wounded amongst the bode of given to Kossuth, is one well-known to the constitutional terly repent that .he ever acted in a way
OE4' , diem ,—` these survivors, about 70 or 80, history of Hungary; but Hungary would have been at once eo. revolting and stupid as to claim
;elves br' oleedine ettle°, one, the who of the jute . willing to receive any prince as their king, who in his the extradition of the refugees from Htingary.
(ari burgfromwas triumphant,hadeverythingh) eggates of the fortress of Gyula Jet 'lnes rantees that he would adhere to the letter and way, his army cannel all before it, by its numbers and
IderseeceeePid.eslirtethe commander of this place, -Which spirit of their law ; and, without foreign inter- by the bribes which were scattereJ; and being so sue-
'lie reedictinis'„eee Austrian troops, drove the ax. vention, there is. no doubt, that Hungary in her cessful, ho managed to stamp out liberty is Hungary,
4111111° 'lee re•(;•it" blowe from the gates, where, after righteous purpose would have succeeded. In fact they he. established a hold on the Danubian provinces; ever) -
~i,greeed. eel entrance, they had sunk powerless had all been successful; there wore scarcely any Austrian thing smiled upon him; but when he came. t) those
les here het troops leL in Hungary, they had been successively brave but unfortunate refugees in Hungary, in order to
1,
1,11_4 fors
rater; sortie months
were punished.by the Austrians, beaten, until they could only hold one part of satisfy his thirst for vengeance, he found a Noble
ti a 4 en'alaitt by General
later, Puchner was driven from the kingdom—a narrow strip of land—and then Sovereign. on the throne of Turkey, who magnanimously
see 4araissail h'eaeral Bem, and Csanyi as Hangs. Prince Schwartzenberg adopted the suicidal pc- decided to act in opposition to his nefarious designs.
ese Porpeoe,o Y, sentenced several of the' instieators Hey of calling in the Russians. Hungary still, His ambassador showed an insolent tone and bearing,
tll,egpesdee tire ;Ls, of the above-mentioned bioodshed'te be however, opposed him, but not all the valour and courage and had the audacity to appear in person before the
04 -pers a respondents of the Austrianarty filled of their native generals could prolong the contest with Sultan without uncovering his head.—(A laugh.) The
11492tiati t 4'60 countries with declamations on any chance of success. Not the flower of the Hunga• language employed by him was most offensive, and
des ; I eel. eirerisei "
. Flltar LE Ye is • rise generals, aided by the intrepid and daring Bem, or though it has been said that the Russian ambassador
Jest ion wee' a true picture of the .e horrors. A the experience of his countryman Dexibinsky, or the did not exceed his instructions, I have reasons for be-
les' aid the sent from the Diet to Vienna on the sub- ardent courage of our own countrymen, General 'loving that such was not the case, but that he was ordered
tf plireteete. were formally received b the King and Guyon, could prevail agaimt, the Russian to employ almost, the very terms. and language that
fee Pagan, And now the National Assembly hordes, aided by the broken forces of Austria, be did. The Emperor was determined to succeed, and
seeteise, has elected by the
ektigilethe Arc;id°Peened at Presburg noenwthea 2d of jugly could not prevail against the overpowering influence of powerless, because the Sultan was supported by the
'lse.- aatee f,-,-,1" StePhanproZunced a speech in the the intervermon of Russia, which is most pernicious, determination of the Government of this country.t I. say
ueeesispressetci the throrn, and in that speech the and will be found to militate against the interests of then,. honour to the Sultan, I say honour to toe Brins.h
134 hie eiPeedene his unalterable determination t m maintain Europe at large. The movemeet and cause of Hungary Minister who prevented so foul. a deed disgracing
dis-
h trio:4l.ly slide of Hungary, and uphold all the laws, had t sleets deep root in the minds ( f every civilized country. I know, Sir, many friends of Russia are 's-
hun% 80:4iMatising the sots of Jellachich. Soon country ; its example would have been followed on all posed to eulogise
.what they call. the moderation of the
12atie/13,8ent, eit,'; necessary laws were sent up fir the sides, and free trade established all over the world Czar. in having desisted from his demands, but he has
:Wee ;aeeuta" not, answer was given, and the Diet would have been the end ef the struggle. simply taken a leaf out. of the book of the fox, and find-
llye' of lion,theL6aded by the President and a large This will he seen if one of the papers which I have ing he could not obtain what he wanted be.cause. the
',tea.'" eve d"duu'e of Commons, to obtain some moved for shall be laid upon the table of the House. British fleet was in the way, he altered his intentions.
4Witlegqlo4 seaelnive one only was given,' and whilst the Besides this, Hungary would. always have been an effi- That was the true reason why he made the best he could
sges, riegu,gai Vienna with the Minister, the King, dent barrier on the side of Russia; but now should there of his position, and said he would be content with some
"eel e: and de lig them, sent a letter, dated 31st of ever arise any dispute between Austrian and Russia, smaller concession. Though I have spoken in strong
7.te pe of isaseerassed to, the Viceroy, declaring that there is not the least doubt but that Hungary would take terms of laudation of the determination not to give
'esise'alited t-em by which a responsible Minister had up arms on the side of Russia, so gnat is the hatred and up Kossuth and his bravo followers to the
lito d of the. (0) Hungary _ fury of the Czar,. I cannot say that I am
by the administration of the horror which Austria by her infamous conduct has ex
Ptieebcleti clot hountry, i,f its finance and its commerce, cited in the breasts of the Hungariann so great as to by any means satisfied with the result of the
they colit.r,. ached from Austria, had been made and cause that nation to throw itself into the arms of its negotiation. lam not convinced that the fleet at the
The Were al, to the Preematie Sanction, and once-hated enemy. Sir, Ido not hesitate to say that Dardanelles has obtained all that ought to have been.
eeg it was declared null, user() is, and of no effece this interference on the part of Russia in the affairs of obtained—that all. has been accomplished that might
ia tegravate thnaolinced that the Kin' was determined Hungary was a flagrant violation of the law ot nations; it have been accomplished. Although the Hungarians and
1,14441144 : laws and subject ever one in Hungary was an interference in the affairs of an independent na- Pelee were not given up Ido not think that the people
;RNee Altoriwer of Viena. Ile-reYwas the cause tier, with which Russia had nothing whatever to of this country will be satisfied with the fact that the
•gaet; •Ma th' r"i was determined that all the laws do. The pretust put forward by the Emperor Poles are still expelled from Turkey, and.
.wilt most
44 41111.: constitution should not be carried into for this intrusion had not the slighesi foundation. likely arrive here before long in a state of pitiable indi-
emit:, and moreover that Kossuth and his brave compa-
tthiehaPon° et! was determined to have those laws In the whole Hungarian army there were not above g
wig two hadeh" was exactly the same sort of quarrel 4,000 Poles, and of these not 40') came from Russian Po- nions arc to be kept in prison in Turkey for a consider-
% VII butle-ad in this country, and which led to civil land. The Emperor had not the slightest shadow of a able time. Ido not think the people of this country will
Mete Y Nero a countries the King was determined to right to interfere, even admitting the right of the ruler be satisfied with that—they . will not be pleased to find
el)4tli adetereagetis,:et and in bo•h co tries thepeople of a country to call in foreign aid to tell what he may that the Emperor of Russia in this, at least, has
"118 4-. tilt• pined
to begoverned' ' only b the consider a rebellion—a right, Sir, which lam very fir Pal his way, because no doubt his aim is to prevent
ti his coerced " coul&not be said that the yEmperor from admitting. Even admitting this right the Emperor them coming to this country, for he dreads the effect
11115etts. °ph tree will
the Hunarians, for he came of Austria
.had no right to call in Russian aid. to interfere which their presence will have upon public opinion. I
eat g
to Presburg, and granted his between him and Ilungasy, fir he was neither the de must say, therefore, that I think the Noble Lord ought
"hors,e „aotia ey as on the first occosion • on the second, i Lire nor the de facto King ot Hungary, for the reasons to produce to the House all the information for which I
het bye spe'QuenPrY, he was at occasion;
a, when he an- which I have already detailed. I have ' also. some aper• have asked with regard to this transaction, at least so
eetig J els Vices to be made from the throne to be to move for regarding the Danubian provinces ofP eVal: far as the refugees are concerned. The Speech from
41 up,COttear, "r°3h As to the pre' erne of the laws lachia and Moldavia. Some two years on one pretence the Throne tells us that the differences terminat id satis-
tOly ;,:' so ec•icito the Pragmatic -Sail-m.6;n, there never Or another, Russia had interfere fin tie affairs of those factorily ; but we want to know what has been done,
'feet, Related of foundation. The Pragmatic Sanction Provinccf. The people of that country had effected some and I say the House has a right to know what has been
11% 'talent tao order of .
successeon. It was an act
alt'- at the and reforms, and, es usual, Russia was desirous of putting done in these matters, in order that it may exercise that
re, e timenothing mere, and the order ( f soccer- down anything' which partook of' the net ire of reform-, supervision over the acts of the Government which the
ttr ,ed wit., v teat protection was taken, bad not been Unhappily sho succeeded, the country returned Noble Lord (J. Russell) has on former occasions stated
.lifer that tel It was not interfered with until long to its former state, and the Turkish Govern- to be its right and duty to exercise.—(Elear, bear.)
die 1.46 ban
oEmperor had abdicated not until ment was prevailed upon to sign some sort of Let us know what has been done, and I
tieitiotegr°lle, r°riteuser had renounced his' claim to a treaty called the Convention of Belta Liman, tell the Noble Lord that all that was required has not
„"11 et. had e ' until after the next in sue- by which it was stipulate I that neither Russia nor Tar- been done; therefore let us know why it has not been
s' the isaltine ;tilt forward claims with an inten- key should have more than 10,000 men in those princi- done, and let us be assured that all that could be done
ORlie 4th ef— :it), not until after the constitution palitiee. But even then Russia did not abide by her own has been effected.—(Hear.) I hope that the Noble
'tat 44 'o• 'larch, which swept away all the convention of the Ist of May. The troops were not yet
eta, all the institutions of Hungary;
lg • e oe at was not until . • , , , papers•
withdrawn. One of the which I sheet move for I are sure he will do right to the country by so doing,
sgte et sehe things that the throne was declared va- on this occasion is a circular letter addressed by Count and he will give rue leave to say, that it is both essential
altrigettie sae:losing these laws were opposed to the Nesselrode to the Europsan Ambassadors on the subject to the House, and exceedingly desirable for his own
hty ii 4 ON g'ction, what force had it in Hungary unless e f this occupation, an extract from which I am character as a Minister, in order that he may stand
etllllehtlloegrethe Diet? None at all. It was notes- enabled to read because the Noble Lord had real right with the people, and continue to enjoy that good
ttitcteitnittY. Validity.
"414 have an have the sanction of the Diet before it it in the course of last session. This circular opinion which lam happy to know be has now long en-
hear)—that he should afford ns all
The three estates of the realm states that " from the moment that in Moldavia and jeYed—(Hear,
i() 'eer, `ti it had a ri hteither to abrogate it
g Wallachia law shall have established, and guaranteed the information which I have felt it neces-
Ike ithy °r to int
ee lige to . reduce other laws partially tothetroops
,-
e - ssry and consistent with my duty to require.
e e pee° thee lt, or to pass laws which, pt' Ina
• mediately the strictly defensive position which I the more earnestly call upon my Noble Friend on this
geteree,ettee es, did pass,had effect u •t. they occupied before." Now, Sir, I ask the Noble Lord occasion, because, in former times, he has been extremely
"410 to tii Litt the reform carriedn° b t DL°llwitss whether he thinks hat a sufficient guarantee for the energetic in pressing other Governments to produce si-
y
to them th ee pragmatic Smiler information; and over and above this, ho has made
ge, " Itela - °Untie: f c Sanction wets just as if e
King peace of these provinces has been given? Has the Porte a
,tes 0o loon 1=1:e,
se ter having given the royal assent e g
sufficient uarantee? The Noble Lord knows how anxious it his boast that the Governments to which ho belonged,
Otte' the " e , ' ,should have trio. Ito set aside that Porte is to have the
the Sublime Convention
of more than any other, furnished information when it was
-4 me - Pea that it ' Bette Liman carried out, and yet after this declaration
eged of at.-..(u was coietrary to the law f e required by Members of this House.—(Hear.) I trust,
rued
th PoteeoN ear, hear.) Jellacbetch, formally de- N I I 'll •b • believed that Russi
e(`,cunt eSSe roe ea,wi it c
..a still
therefore, that we shall have on all these subjects full
Lel elt ' was, neve th le s allowed to hold it.retains no less than 4b,000 men in those provinces? The and complete information, which may enable us to form
Ills that It
'• • r s ' Diet Noble Lordthe head fthe F • Department,in a just and correct feeling upon them; for sure lam thst
a ale e tee Iri Ministry resigned. The dc-at o Foreign
ells. us aws which lied bean in vain presented
ivite-hich 1)14 in force
te . regalcrossed provisionally, and meanwhile .
Member for Youghal (Mr. Ansley), stated his convic- will not be satisfied.—(ll(ar, hear.) Therefore I
1 teeeal, the Danube at three different points, WM that these Russian troops would speedily be with- think it is absolutely necessary that all the information
i43'; snt'. T .Great troops, aided by Austrian drawn. He will excuse me for stating that lam not al- that can be given should be afforded.—(Cheers.) The
Hungarians,stoe:ealetedtle,, in the absence of together satisfied with that assurance on his part. I Noble Lord concluded by moving an address for copies
'."l d "al' • tuinist in believe my Noble Friend stated in the course of de- or extracts of any correspondence between the British
Ist .ee e unae, ry, and consequent con- . •
°te cease "le to oppose any considerable force;
le el, en late that it was perfectly (lee for any Mem er to say
_,
.., ,
b Government and the embassies at Constantinople, Sc.
b land Vienna r
„ tee heart saence was, that the Croats advanced that he did not entirely partake in any opinion which I etees urg t,
~ . .
especting the demands of
f H
''' the Iyv °t the ' • • d • might be delivered, on such peints, and I now state that Russia and Austria for the extradition ePolish, un-
g ear eet. en country, pills hag and plun ermg
i eserataY to te dhe Diet then offeeed the commend• .
Ido out retakep in chat opinion of my Noble Friend; garian, and Italian re fagees; of any correspondence ba-
h •ei ti "'Le Arehd k d his •of Captain- the Government of this country and the Govern-
and I will tell the House why Ido not. the Noble tween , . .
let og e acee„, ue in citpacity
reaseatadetten teed it, and joined nee army, but after Lord will recollect that when these troops first entered b
ments of Turkey, Russia, and Austria, on the same sub-
he -
tees tee Ure,d in vain to effect arrangements Muldavia, I called his attention to the. , fact, and he ject; of any correspondence between the Government
hie utcl te Apposing created the matter very lightly, and said they had en- tthis sy . f countr and the embassies at Vienna and St. Pe-
w te4 rou , ug forces, he left the camp and tr . ‘
N Rtiatio ugh Pestia to Vienna, wit ere he tendered ofthe Russian
tared without the consent
taaeil3tetelse 4' whi h I called his attention to the fact again, and the of this country and
respondence between the Government .
e -are r a c was not accepted. On the 25th In 1848
Pest ehigeed etroyal ordinance, which had not been Noble Lord said they had entered Molda.via, and wouUl
the Governments of Austria and Russia on the same sub-
tj‘lll "'ea% ' "'cod all
of proposal addressed by the late
44 giber erg; but the the Hungaraen troops under
Friend that they have entered Wallachia. Again, my national Government of Hungary to the Government of
\hie sit bran illegal,
and re
Diet declared the appointment
Noble Friend, on the matter being forced upon his at- Great Britain respecting the admission of British manta.
r4ethe ee'l the required the counter signature. . , factures and produce into Hungary; also, copies or ex-
metl, e decree and was proceedin to• tendon, again said
elttis" the hadtei to tan ' ej- ho But a year and three-quarters have elapsed, and they tree of a y P
tract] n corres ondence between the Government
eto-ge in ridge of ec 0 tho commie , when was
are nut act withdrawn. My Noble Friend says, "It is of' this country and the Ambassadors at Constantinople
ese t hen, whins„en ats by a crowd, dragged from the
question of time." Now, I will aele my Noble Friend, and Se Petersburgh, and the Consuls at Bucharest and
eetgeenuel: had i;leeli
madewas seated, and murdered. An
a i supposing that he had a troop of soldiers quartered Jassy, respecting she occupation of the principalities of
„„rt5,,,,..f this event against the lilung,ariens, i
sualoPn him,lg and hai their horses to keep, and that on re- the Danube by Russian troops; of any correspondence
aged be, eis nature , and most des? lovable it was.between tee Government of this country and the Go
P e t' with the commandine officer, he were coolly
gno a cee perretrated by mobs were not the Monsza ing
th'e't tee u ateie toyuntrY could be fairly judged, and they told, Oh, my good fellow,,,
don't put yourself' about, it's vernments of. Turkey and Russia on the same subject;
the Noble Lord and copy of the circular of Count Nesselrode, dated the
bi atie nation any nation, unless indeed it appeared all a question of time. How would
pay? And
h et, he.--(0,. had manifested an utter indifference to like that if he had all the weekly bills to l9th to the 3lst day of July, 1848, addressed to the re-
°Pro °at les of "II hear.") The Hungarian this is just the ca.e with Wallechia and Moldavia. Presentatives of the Russian Government at the different-
tee. r . Ver be, ear,
__ _
eieetireeet wh'ateT passed a resolution expressive of The leuselau Government
does not support its Courts of Europe.—(Cheers.)
wee tk to ee had occurred, sad they directed own troops, but the unfortunate inhabitants are
Mr. ANSTEY seconded the motion.
I; !ilitetet eireentaken to bring the criminals to justice. saddled with the enormous expense because too Lord PALM.ERSTON—My Noble Friend has tra-
tsilleh ~!ts evenlestance had occurred there was a series litrueror of Russia chooses to act contrary to hie yelled over so wide a field that I "am persuaded the
'h. "ell e•entilne. f during andenable him to on his designs . • •
144* . achieh had
from January to October, treaties, to carry House will not expect I should follow him in detail
fee' i,"d I nad the command of the Austrian against Hungary last year and against Turkey.
Abe -at' bapsast say that his e •and d • I think my Noble Friend, if he wire in such a position
ja'bot's es hesee exactions atrocities through all those various important transactions
to which
a. 'gip/ •-• Passed,andonlyequalled by the • I have supposed, would soon be very heartily tired of his speech has related. I can assure my Noble Friend
tab 'anion - as
~ t e arc, s and tine .Calledcruelties of It est ' the intrudere, and would do all he could to get rid ef
ee or some J. q
0,4, e The executive wer of the committee them. And so would Turkey now if she could. This all the information upon those transactions which
te tal Jed Mme In obey • but immediatelytyranny ought not to be [-thawed. If my Noble •
tee oestsle, ,atee, was re- with the public • '
it may be consistent
' 'al "'eta rote ' d I was then that tho Friers I had protested at first against the er.-
Aeitetio "on riga. ca.e . t o
consistent with those courtesies that are duo between
that yet
_t, was inst Count Latour was made, and trance ( f those troops which it was pretended -
get
ant
Hies_ en order to put him to death. had entered unauthorised.7-a very fine way indeed for Governments and
countries, to tfferd. The motion
Ole:at Bat scandalous reports were circulated Russia to feel her way—it, I say, he had protested then with which he has concluded embraces so large
Ti'e fie' eulYany was impl• ated in this act; but energetically, it is my firm belitf that those troops never a mass ( f correspondence, comprising not only
1114, ki,„ Eq to ht, ic
tlirt4ar which elated bring
whateverofl3 I) ite •1 at all, and that in all probe of her M
forward any proof
i:i would
the ave eenai
catastrophesoriNsvele,ich
ntpinro all the confidential communications M-
s-14 deluged
114 w of
eiocip
pee_
ap, these slanders in order to justify a rillthyhloodjesty's Government to our Ambassadors and Ministers
never teoild have occurred. ussia wouldgary
tho 144Y4t lithit Lanni;
•e, as still
Themore atrocious than
la.
tete !leder troself w Latour. murder of Count lave . backed out of this as she has done on misty such abroad, but also communications between ether Govern-
fie, Lo hs of t, as more atrocious, because it was occasions, anthat.
,
d ' would not have ha ned whichmeets, of which knowledge may have been given to the
.pPe
lall
eee onewo the'ieinnocent man. The Government took now all liberal-minded men deeply deplore. say, Government of her Majesty, that I trust my Noble Friend
e aet el. upon ' sentence upon Count Batthyany car- liberal-minded men, for nut only in England, but over and the House will think I am not asking teem much of
4tB Latour the a • o the A whichall the greatest enthusiasm liar been incited in •
rot Neje ur sea. anniversary es dry on
their forbearance if I entreat them not to press the motion
ea Degetat Coll ' murdered, thereby wishing to insin- favour of this brave nation. Nay, the contagion has ,
ok Pere
holy tit Batthyany a crime which they dare spread across the Atlantic; there I have heard of honour in the words in which my Noble Friend has put it, but
re% r_ av, declare
against him. Now, the news- being done to the Huegarians by tee first magistrate of to allow me to select out of that great mass of papers
e
eeoveer th stated
tltl it 0 that Count Batthyany was the country, and I believe there is at this present time such documents as may explain to the House the Fours
li ionc at uf v_murder of
Count Latour, but the under discussion a proposition to suspend intercourse
all which her Majesty's Government has pursued, without
he
eefea tee setae lenea dares not to make such a charge, with Austria in consequence of her conduct to Hungary. giving do ails, which would he inconvenient to the pub •
* ter li-td of nee °ll Count B h • there is not one I could not help, Sir, being sorry to hear my Noble lie service, or laying before the House those confidential
.ee t e te,
sets. • att any
tertkled g raurder atiete. against him on that account. Friend talk of allowances being made; Ido not like cornm , unications that may have have passed between her
her Ministershe-
ll el av rl' Jellarde°;l, Count Latour Vienna was sue- these allowances, which are always to be made for the Majesty's Government and. abroad, or
e'de e reed eetea. The I ',l
forces cf Hun• great and powerful. I hope my Noble Friend tween then and the Ministers of other countries.—
NaN the y to
advance mpe.r.ta _
iht have will take the opportunity tc-night of telling (Hear, hear.) With regard to tho war in. Hungary, I
et 114.° thee'relit which they m g
..
tee e wee-e" to have done; but they hesitates .
-•1 us what these allowances are that are to be had an opportunity last session of stating the views
%Ise Teatiselekt ieer puot provided with an authority from male, that he will explain
to us the circumstances which I entertain of that question. I can only say that
opinions which I know ale enter-
‘ll„ e /%ar —valid '“nwever, they did advance and fought which call for those allowances. being made. Ido not those feelings and . .
on ,EI. the
'tie • aoil Only battle that was fought during think that there is any subject of more imports ice tamed upon that matter by the great majority of the
are rer hotd feelings which
Its%ll to a g eye Hungarian. I will not go through which can be pressed upon the attention of my Noble people of this country are opinions an 1
; ttp:(/ Elo vents of the late war; there is not Friend. lam well aware that when first I brought it have done great cre lit to the country, and which,.trust,.
e ell. .se even
ot4o r, With : if • I had a desire to weary forward, it did not rivet the attention of the country, I might almost say I know, no,
Englishman will differ
At the same
`fiber, vf"
that "ny such details.—(Hear, hear.) but now I think the case is different—the country is from in any respect whatever.—(Cheers.) .
et at 13em
11, 0,A,(1N., all 10„.. , who took the command, in De- aroused to the importance of the question,. and it is time lam sure the house will . . feel, that 'a a matter in
iteagdeeeee, by t'Y that originally did not number more fully determined to maintain the integrity of the Otto- fere, the f • -
which England had no direct right to inter ere, urn
d to the di-
•lle 'et tOr T 40 middle of March had cleared the man Empire. Every Government which we have seen, tions of the British Government with regard
se elle e A ranvo .
s Ala ussi. J'aula of the Austrians and had the Government ef the I)ake of Wellington and of the rection of events must be necessarily. extremely limited.
lei.
Nit ' Thale, who had invaded the terr'itor from Ilon. Baronet the ML ruler fur Temworth, as vi el as Therefore, however strong may be the interest
sete al e Hungarians y On.
lei 4 lie re% e who had not abandoned that of my Noble Friend Lelow, and even that Protsc- which the Government ( f England,. as representing
aseo hidisett Oh the banks of the Th • havin tionist Government, whose advent we have been the public opinion of this country, might take in those
IneNeenlefeend gratz, Welded and all the other Ausg- tau lit to expect, will, I presume, follow this events, the House will naturally suppose that the active
ise'Nehuf the cers, and had driven them to te very cougrse, for I have heard the Honourable interference of the British Government must necessarily
rn thalti 4 ad, °lintry. In
ttiti_ ,t, pted • the mean time the Austrian Gentleman, the Member
_. .
for Buckinghamshire have been restricted within limits, perhaps far more nar-
policy in strong row than to which their feelings might wish them ,
st„..ettria eyeey certain measures, which had the effect with very great pleasure, advocate this those . , .
le' the eisenlari in Hungary whO had not already and I must say in 1 quent terms, as that necessary to exceed.—(Cheers.) With regard to tee principah-
eu/vell 9.1) " The ,very e o
"914 It about • - Emperor Ferdinand had some for the honour of his own country and for the voice of ties of Wallachia and Moldavia, my Noble
,Friend and
ens 140 noon violating an oath. Although it Europe. In areuing this question I would not be sup- myself have discussed that question before. The House
°O rein utetet his mind was weak, in fact, that ho posed to be an 'advocat m for war, I believe that war in is aware that Russia does stand, in regard to those prin-
q eon left to lti,tster mental imbecilityestill he had sense this case is entirely' in:necessary. A great deal also has cipalitiee, upon a footing different from that upon which
ft, 'at ot. ac rum uw that he had taken 'an oath, and he been said about " Russiaphobia," and I have been con- the Government
htt d he, es about
a te, t it RO actin in the matter, but, N.. sidered to be afflicted with that malady. . Now, I will to Provinces belonging to another country. There was
tala °a • c'd late • g
tilt° sto_ hdie_
ttlti
no rot his44ollli: throne,and his
, ,
aist9eth tee4astria. rtlels., on the 18th, ascended the voice to Ituesie, and tells her that she will nut have ain thieshape of a convention—by which the two Govern-
tees eOf WOrk of On the 4th of March a new coned- certain course pursued, that the voice of this country ments.of Russia and Turkey oegaged that the forces of
its' eve, tttts tcPount liras and Dr. Bach, now Mi- will be obeyedwithout 1 • occasion to make it heard Russia and Turkey in those provinces should, after a
atit Phb • Vienna, laving
Iltid 44 lialid, was published. The constitu- in the roaring of cannon. I know it is a perfect farce certain period, be reduced to the amount of 10,000
hter thelle°f all thrd bY it all the laws, customs, and for Russia, to talk of resisting this nation. At men. My Noble Friend is correct in stating that the
Peehlaeleerretrian nations, wore Bought Placed
that same time I am so fer a Russiaphobist, Turkish Government has carried that engagement
41n'e, or or usesnienatrol, without regard to taeir bee "at I should dread allowing this weakness into effeet, and that the Russian Government has not
~ef t, the_whether ,or whether they were dear to the of Russia to turn into an overpowering might. hitherto done so. I stated on a former evening that
katoutlkil'Weteete all ueYhadanything to recommend them lam not disposed to allow Russia to become possessed I believed, and it is my conviction, that the Rua-
aueo hialger swePt ab h• t• tt. f 1 '1 • 11 h h . He Government is about to carry that engagemeet into
estr a„, , whint. way yt is new cons i u ion ot ie most tertee portion of tae gmee, nor tue most im- ma
ee ve
Utti nall of ef" was intended to throw allpower Portant btatiens, because if that be done she will be no execution. My Noble Friend, perhaps, does not partake
ew
ttiltut Plibliarld more tr• ilt was more sweeping, more longer weak, she will no longer be able to submit to such of my conviction. I can only. say that the information
4104% ZiqS ofd or non'y, revolutionary, than anything meneures as this country may thin', necessary, but, on the we have received very latel leads me to think that the
nee en e Pratte •latemPlated even by the con- contrary, she will ease made a great stretch towards unl- Turkish Ambassador recently sent to St. Petereburgh
tei to ci °Nem ,e iteelf.
g e wiveeply with that The II ' •ht vernal dominion. She will threaten our Indian 'has received an assurance to that effect from the Govern-
ungarians mi empire; she
not "1 cripple
rit, Leh attach„„ constitution had they weour commerce, and do us an irreparable injury, mont o Russia, f and that the amount of the Russian
ategttriana they h ed to
ad their own ancient mode of and then force us into a sanguinary war, of which there is troops in those provinces will very speedily be reduced
ikesteles wi I, had e enjoyed for centuries. If the now no danger, nor for which is there an •R.• to
yoccasion. Russia 10,000 . ._ •
litse at se; seed to eeen the frantic revolutionistss. theirwill never abandon her design of traditionalfully e with him as to the severe pressure which the
elted seth thi ~7,,Opresent there,
is aggrandise- agree
•) e a aeossot
4 , ere, they might have been meet; but this to be noted in her, that thou ;h she presence of those troops must occasion.
to the inh • able-
Melee, utlon ; but the i U b • be patient, and though sho may agerandise, not by con- ants of those principalities. It is perfectly evident that
e, ce— • . .y, i einz,-
eztitution which they had eu- peat, but by insidious means, yet whenever the question 4 the obligation under which they have been laid for sup-

polt.ng and providing fur so Large a body must have
imposed upon theM sacrifices and privations cl a very
painful and ex'eusive character. With regard to that
more important transaction connected with tho demand
for the e that which took p:a3o between
the Governamits of England and Francs on the
one hand, and the Governments of Ruszia
and Austria avid the Government of Turkey on
the other, is generally so well known that little
remains f A. me to sate which is not already within the
cognizance of the public at large. I shall be perfectly
ready to give such papers as will show the course we
pursued on that occasion. It is well known that after
the termic ation of tl e war in Hungary a very consider•
able nvinber of persow, Hungarians, Poles, and some
Italians, took refuge in the Turkish provinces. A de-
ma7id was made by the Governments of Austria and
Russia Till key for the surrender of such of those

that constitutional obligation which bound the House if
Hapsburgh to the people of Hungary, it must be remem-
bered that England gearantced the I'iagmatic Sanction
adopted by Hungary; he meant the constitutional prero-
gatives of the House of Hapsburgh on the one hand, and
the constitutional rights of the people of Hungary on the
other; and, having wasted our blood and treasure in
support cf it, we had a right, if not a duty, to see that
the stipulations then accorded to that people by that
House were performed.
After a sheet pause, as no other Hon. Member rose,
Lord DUDLEY STUART said, as his Noble Friend
had as,ured him that he was prepared to lay on the table
of the Howe a considerable number of the documents
moved for, if the motion were withdrawn, and the selec-
tion left to himselr, he should be very happy to accept
that arrangement; but before doing so he should like to
know whether the Noble Lord meant to give some papers
on each of the different transactions to which he had
alluded, whether he would give some of the correspon-
dence with regard to the Hungarian war, some with
regard to the Moravian question, a ed whether he
would give the proposal of submission made by the
Hungarian Government. He should like to know
what the offer was, and what he had to expect,
before lie agreed to accept it. The Noble Lord had
sail he did not expect that those persons would be de-
tained and deprived of their liberty f)r any length of
time; that their captivity, for it was nothing else, would
at least be short; and he had also expressed his per-
suasion that the generosity cf the Turkish Government
would be such as to take care that, during the time they
were kept in its territory, they should receive every pro-
tection and every comfort they could desire. He hoped
so too; but he was not quite convinced that it was in the
power of the Turkish Government to provide either for
their comfort or their protection while they were in
Turkey. It was known that the Austrian Government
was unscrupulous in the means to which it
resorted to obtain its ends; witness Gallicia, and the
scenes which had occurred in Hungary, at tne insti-
gation of Austria, of which he had read a
description in the early part of the evening. In Austria
such a thing had happened before now, so that persons
disagreeable to certain Governments had been put out
of the way by assassination.—(Hear, hoar.) He had
information to the effect that something of the kind had
been attempted—at any rate, had been planned—with
regard to Kossuth, and other eminent Hungarians now
detained in Turkey. Some months ago he had this from
a person who was then present with Kussuth at Widdin:
—A stranger arrived there, and took great pains to come
into communication with the cook who dressed the food
supplied to Kossuth, and with the physician who ren-
dered him his medical assistance. And shortly
after it was found that some of the liquor which
came to the table had been practised on, and had had
something infused into it which gave great suspicion
that poison was intended. Later or, in December, a
number of persons were reported to have arrived at
Shumla, where Kossuth and his brave companions then
were; these persons were Austrians, or at least furnished
with Austrian passports, and the Turkish authority gave
nofice to Kossuth that they had reason to believe these
persons had come to Shumla with a design upon his life
and that of some of his companions. Having given this
notice (which he kne e• from Kossuth himself), the
Turkish Government added that they were unable to
interfere with those Fersons whose murderous inten-
tions they suspected, on account of their being fur-
nished
with Austrian passports. If this was the pro-
tection and comfort which these unfortunat ?, but noble
and brave, patriots were to enjoy during their cap-
tivity, or during that species of surveillance which
it pleased the Emperor if Russia to subject thorn
to, there was no season to be by any means satisfied
with the arrangement that had been made. And he
rather thought that the Sultan, if any such proceedings
could be brought home to the Austrian Government,
would be peif_ctly justified in departing from any en-
gagement to which he had come with reference to those
refugees and immediately set them at liberty. Nay,
more, if he could not protect them in his dominions, he
was bound, doubly bound, to set them at liberty. Lie
trusted the Noble Lord would diteet his attention to
this matter, and would use his influence with Turkey in
order that Turkey might see these men, who were im-
prisoned under the requirements of a treaty, which
treaty, however, was not so positive that it might not
be read two waye, might not be assassinated in her do •
minions. It was very true that they had no right to press
on Turkey a particular line of policy, however desirous
they might be to do so in the present case; but they had
a right at the same time, to see that Turkey was not
compelled by any other power to adopt a ling of conduct
which would be pleasing to that power. He was happy
to say that tl o Noble Lord had exerted that right most
efficiently.—(Hear, hear.) But hi 3 Noble Friend might
be sure that, although they had no right to dictate to
Turkey, there was a thorough persuasion in the minds
of the people of this country, that such was the influence
of England with Turkey, they would not believe that
Turkey would adopt any line of policy which would be
disagreeable to this country. And if they saw the
Turkish Government disposed to falter in the noble
cause in which they had so nobly embarked, they would
not be brought to believe that it was not owing to her
not being properly sustained by the legitimate influence
of England.—(Gear, hear.) He should be glad if his
Noble Friend laid before them such papers as might be
satisfactory.
Lord C. HAMILTON said that there was nothing in

executions since the termination of; the struggle, and he
had no he3itition in calling it one of the foulest and
bloodiest death rolls that he ever cast his eye upon.—
(Hear, hear.) After Hungary had fallen—not by the
power of Austria— (Hear, hear)—but after she had
fallen by the interl cation of Russia, a foreign invasion
and domestic treason.—(lrea:, he ar.) When Austria
had succeeded by these means, and when, if at all times
the victorious party should show forbearance, there never
was a time when ft)rgiveaess and forbearance were more
appropriate and necessary, Austria, entered upon those
bloody and atrocious executions which were a dis-
grace to humanity, at least in modern times.—(Lond
cheers.) Ile confessed he felt the greatest surprise at
hearing any person &fending and advocating Austria
in these abominable proceedings.—(Hear, hear.) Ile
would read a list of tlose executions, and
the House would, he was sure, fed horror-struck at
the noble and illustrious blood shed on this occasion:—
EXECUTIONS AND PUNISHMENTS.
CHURCII. _ _ _

individuals ai wer,; Austrian or Russian subjects. That
demand was founded on the treaty of Kaimardji with
regard to Russia, and upon the treaty of Belgrade in
regard to Austria. The Sultan, feeling that the obliga-
tions of hospitality, which are considered even ',more
paramount, if possible, in the East than in any other
part of the world, precluded him from complying with
that demand, and looking at the terms of the treaty of
Kaimarq, and dug that he had clearly an alternative,
and that the engagement contracted by that
treaty permitted him to choose that alternative,
he refused- to comply with the demand made
by Russia of Sltrl °adoring. those individuals, but
stated that he was ready to fulfil the other condition of
the treaty, namely, that of expelling those
chiefly Poles, from his territory. With regard to the
demand of Austria, it certainly did not appear, by the
treaty of Belgrade, that there was any condition which
required the Sultan to surrender Austrian subjects who
might have sought reruge within his territories; with
regard to Austria's demand, therefore, he was still more
at liberty to refuse compliance than ho was with respect
to the demand made by Russia. Tne manner in which
those demands were made at Constantinople by the or-
gans of the Russian and Austrian Governments excited
alarm in the Government of Turkey a 3 to the conat-
quences which might follow from a refusal to comply
with those demands, even though the Government of
Turkey felt that they were not by treaty compelled or
liable to comply with them. In that state of things the
Turkish Government turned its eyes to those friendly
powers to whom it might look for support, and an up
peal was made to the Government of England, and also
to the Government of France, fur their friendly
support in the critical circumstances in which
Turkey might find itself. Her Majesty's Government,
acting, as I think they did, in strict unison with the uni-
versal feeling of the country, as it was manifested on

that occasion—(hear, hear, and cheers)—determined to
give the Sultan the support which he had asked.—
(Cheers.) Friendly representations were made to the
Government of Austria and the Government of Russia,
explaining the grounds upon which it appeared to her
Majesty's Government that the Sultan was not bound
to comply with the demands which had been made. It
is but due, howea ee to the Russian Government to state
that the Sultan having sent a special ambassador to St.
Petersburgh, for the purpose of requesting the Emperor
to desist from the demand which be had made, and to
accept the other alternative of the treaty—it is but due,
I say, to Russia to state, that the day before our friendly
representation reached St. Peterburgh, the Russian
Government had made a communication to the
Turkish ambassador, stating that Russia no
longer insisted on demanding a surrender of the
Poles, but consented to the alternative for their ex-
pulsion, There followed upon that, however, a long
negotiation with regard to the detailed conditions which
were proposed on the one side and objected to, iu a
certain de?;ree, on the other. Those negotiations ended
at last in an arrangement between the Turkish
Government and the Emperor of Russia, by which the
Turkish Government agreed to expel, as by treaty it
was bound to do, the Polish refugees from the Turkish
territories. With regard to Austria, the Turkish Go-
vernmeat undertook to remove the Hungarians—not to
put them in prison, as my Noble Friend has stated, but
to remove them to a distend° from the Austrian territo-
ries, and t!,e:e Oetain themiunder that description of ob-
servation of which, happily, no English word conveys
the meaning—under surveillance for a curtain limited
time. The diplomatic relations between Russia and
Turkey have been reestablished. Diplomatic relations
between Austria and Turkey were not actually re-estab-
lished, but there was every reason to suppose they
would bo within a fsav days after the last dispatches
came away. During the negotiations which took place
at Constantinople the most perfect harmony and co-
operation existed between her Majesty's Ambassador
and the Ambassador of the Republic of France,
and no doubt it was greatly owing to the friendly
offices of those diplomatic representatives that those
questions, involving great difficulty and com-
plications of various kinds were brought to a suc-
cessful issue; and I am bound to say that it is impos-
sible for any man to have acquitted himself in such diffi-
cult circumstances, and in the execution of such an
arduous duty, with more ability, more judgment, and
more discretion, than Sir Stratford Canning had done
in the task which it had fallen to his lot 'to perform.
) My Noble Friend has expressed an opinion
in respect to the arrangement which has been made,
and has declared that that arrangement is not altogether
satisfactory to his wishes and views. I am free to confess
that if had been a matter depending solely upon the will
and decision of her Majesty's Government, there are
many circumstances connected with that arrangement
that we should have wished to be different from what
they turn out to be. But there were treat!es to be ob-
served—there were offers which had been spontaneously
made—engagements which had been voluntarily offered,
and which could not be altogether retracted; and acting
under the circumstances as they stood, and bearing in
mind that although it was desirable to support the
Turkish Government in resisting the demands which it
would have been unfitting for that Government to
comply with; yet, on the other hand, we should
have been acting an unfriendly part if we hai
urged that Government to place itself, without ne-
cessity, in the perilous position of a rupture
with its two great and powerful neighbours—consider-
ing, on the one hand, the difficulties from which it was
desirable to extricate the Turkish Government, and, on
the other hand, considering the concessions which the
Turkish Government ought not ts be compelled to make,
I believe the arrangement such as has been made is the
best which, under all the circumstances of the case, it
was possible her Majesty's Government could see ac-
complished. None of the refugees have been given up.
The Polish part of them are free to depart to other por-
tions of Europe, where they will be in a state of com-
plete liberty; and those Hungarians who are for a time
detained in the Turkish territory I hope will not be de-
tained there long. At all events, I am quits satisfied
nand with
that the Turkish Government, from its generous feelings
and from its some of the duties of hospitality, will take
care that while they are within its territories every at-
tention will be paid to them which is consistent with
their uy n
sie
distinguished.
hot e that my Noble Friend will consent
begquali-
ties
to
efxwophr
rtiec
shnsettu a h re othe
en eminent
conclu n,
to accept the offer I have made to him, and allow me to
submit to the House such portions of the papers he has
beylof;jeitvndhne
traeumtrtneotoot
antee.crdteehebledayert
etrmtauosbysulttebNh
stelotwiabeinitethl
motioniaoF leururti
reasons
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y it
Mr. ANSTEY said he saw no reason, after what had
transpired thct evening, to alter the opinion he had ex-
pressed on a former occasion of the noble conduct pur-
sued by her Majesty's Government with respect to the
extradition of tie Hungarian and other refugees now in
Turkey. In this instance, and he trusted it would be so
on ail similar occasions, they had broken through that
system of truckling to Russia which they and their pre-
decessors in the Government had followed for so many
years. Re thought, too, that the noble sentiments ex-
pressed by the Sultan would not fail to make their due
ivapression on the Cabinet, and he hoged that it might
be long and lasting. He entirely agreed with his Noble
Friend in thinking that the accommodation that had
been efcctel was unsatisfactory; but he could not con-
ceal from himself that the chief difficulty to which the
Noble Lord the Foreign Secretary had advertedealmost
iu express language, was created by that treaty of 1841;
and that with that treaty staring him in the face, our
Ambassador could not, nor could the Ambassador
of France, offer to the Sultan that prompt and imme-
diate assistance which would hate been necessary if
the accommodation hail been rejected and war hat been
proclaimed. He must also say that the result cf the
proceedings was due, not so much to our Ambassador
and the Ambassador of France, as to the Prime Minis-
ter of the Porte, and he trusted that her Majesty's Go-
vernment would learn from this a salutary lesson, and
that in her 'mut e relations with Russia in respect to the
hands as they did iu 1841. With respect to the other
Porte they would take care not again to fetter their own
part of the question alludel to by his Noble Friend, and
to which the greater part of the documents he demanded
related, he must say he could not understand upon what
principle it was that the Noble Lord the Foreign Se-
cretary, as well as every Minister, of whatever political
complexion he might Le, could come down to that House
upon such an occasion and allege that the public service
could possibly suffer from the publication cf the entire
of every document indicated iu the notice of his Noble
Friend. That observation applied rarticularly to the
case of the Danubian principalities, for it ap-
peared that those documents were asked for
with reference to the performance of a solemn
obligation entered into with the assistance at
least, if not by the mediation, of our own Sovereign in
the course of last year, the object of which, as hit
Noble Friend lied said, and sa'd truly, was to secure
peace in the principalities, and ensure the great object
of our diplomacy—the maintenance of the Turkish
empire; but which had been violated by one party to it
—Christian Russia—whilst it had been observed by the
other—anti-Christian Turkey. Tho Noble Lord said
that, although Russia, had violated the treaty, it was
now going to be kept; but it must be observed that the
time for its rerforte awe was the 31st of December,
1849, which was now past, so that it was impossible that
it could be strictly kept; and it appeared to him that the
House would respire something more than the assurance
of the Noble Lord that Russia had fixed some other day
for its fulfilment. He trusted, however, that if Russia
lied done so, she would observe it with more fidelity
than she had observed her recent engagement. There
was, he feared, every reason to believe that the season
for operations would not he suffered to pass by, and that
the numerous forces now quartered orethaepeeple in that
Danubian principalities would at the approach of spring
be employed by the Czar against this Sovereign power.
Su that it was no question of time, but one that called
for immediate decision. As to the other question—that
Ho would merely
wbheahtiiwclielwnlea
nAs latelyut,rsotrmia pha.,itnd ing,
s).
duunan d now, unhappily,
Noble
ga
yrenh de.
concurredti
between in whate
observe that when the Noble Lord_said that England had
no immediate right or obligation to interfere in the set-
tlement of that question, or to enforce the performance of

the Noble Lord's first address which called for any
serious observation. Any person acquainted with the
history of Hungary must be aware of the extraordinary
errors into which the Noble Lord had fallen; and the
condition of the House—the empty benches, and the
frigid manner in which page after page of the observa-
tions ho had read to the House from a bulky manu-
script were received by the few who remained to hear
him, demonstrated the little interest which was felt in
t.c, subject ; but for the honour of the House and the
country, he (Lord C. Hamilton) hoped he would be
supported in calling upon the Noble Lord, if ho
believed in the truth of the insinuations which
he had thrown out against the Austrian Go-
vernment of entertaining the base and inhuman
design of assassination, to come forward like a man
and make the charge distinctly and without circum-
locution.—(Hear, hear.) An alcusation of such ex-
treme gravity ought not to bo introduced into a sort of
reply made on withdrawing a motion. The Noble
Lord had withdrawn the usual phrases of an old we-
man's tale, " it was strongly reported," and " it was
seriously believed," that somebody came to the place
where Kossuth was residing, and had a mysterious in-
terview with his cook, and, because the wine afterwards
was supposed to present an unusual appearance, it was
assumed that it had been tampered with.—(llear, and
a laugh.) It was derogatory to the dignity of the House
that such a gross charge should have been insinuated
by one of its Members against an old ally of this
country, and one which in past days had stood by us
bravely and faithfully.—(Hear.) What! impute t ) the
Emperer of Austria the intention of carrying off by
poison unfortunate men whom circumstwices had com-
pelled to take refuge in Turkey.—(Hear.) The House
must, he was sure, have listened with indignation to
the base calumny directed rgainst a Government which,
with all its faults—and ho ai not there to approve of
all the proceedings of Austria—had always acted in
au upright and open manner, and had cfcen been to this
cone try a useful and fai thf ally.—(Cries of
" Hear, hear.") He would stake his existenco as
to the ground'eisness of the charge, which could only
have entered into the mind of a may who, like the Noble

1. Mr. Razga, Lutheran clergyman at Presburg, hanged in
June.
2. Mr. Me:•zaros, Catholic priest, shot at Raab, end of June.
3. Mr. Gonczewsky, Catholic priest, shot at Pesth, in
October.
4. Mr. Rudnyanszky, Catholic Bishop of N
to five years' imprisonment.
5. Mr. Bartakovics, Catholic Bishop of '
Rosenau
6. Mr. Lonovics, Archbishop of Erlau
7. Mr. Baron Berner, Bishop of Gross-
wardein
8. Mr. Jaros, Great Prior of Gran
9. Mr. Levay, Great Prior of Erlau
10. Mr. Pupovics, Greek Bishop of Idunkacs
11. Mr. Haubner, Lutheran Bishop, dead in prison.
12. Mr. Packh, Lutheran Uishop, hidden in the mountains,
prosecuted by the Hue and Cry.
13. Mr. Michael Toth, Calvinist clergyman at Debreczin
(the most eloquent preacher), sentenced to 18 years'
imprisonment in heavy irons.
14. Mr. Ilorwath, Catholic Bishop of Csanad
15. Mr. Jekelfalussy, Catholic priest of Zipsen Refugees.
16. Baron Mednyarszky, Catholic canon
11. STATE.
1. Count Louis Batthyanyi, Prime Minister, tried by court-
martial and shot at Pesth ; his estates confiscated.
2. Baron Perenyi (upwards of 70 years of age), President
of the House of Lords, and Judge of the Supreme
Court, hanged at Pesth; estates confiscated.
3. Baron Jeszenak, Second Lieutenant of the county of
Neutra, hanged; eslatcs confiscated.
4. Mr. Csanyi, Minister under Kossuth, hanged; estates
confiscated.
5. Mr. Petocz, High Sheriff of the county of Presburg,
shot at Presburg.
6. Mr. Szacsvay, Secretary of the Diet, hanged at Pesth.
7. Mr. Csernus, Counsellor of the Treasury, hanged at
Pesth.
E. Mr. Novak, Secretary in the Home-office, shot at Pesth.
9. Count Leopold Nadasdy, Privy Councillor, Lord Lieute-
nant of the county of Comorn, imprisoned for four
years, sentenced to pay a fine of 14,0001.
10. Count Stephan Karolyi, inaprisoncl for four years, fined
14,000'., Lord-Lieutenant of the county of Pesth.
11. Count Raday, Lord-Lieutenant of the county of Nograd,
imprisoned for two years.
12. Count George Karolyi, fined 10,1100/. for having shown
great joy at the arrival of the Hussars.
13. Mr. Marczibanyi, Lord. Lieutenant of Trencsen, the first
of the Commoners of Hungary, fined 2,0001.
The number of the shot and imprisoned of no high
station is much greater.

Lord, v 0.3 ready to swallow anything against Austria.
—(liear, hear, and laughta.) Ot course the Noble Lord
wait not the originator of the atrocious calumny; he was
mcre:y put forward by others to utter it; but the Noble
Lord basing insinuated it in an assembly of gentlemen,
in a hesitating manner, whildt withdrawing a motion, he
(Lord C. Hamilton) felt that it would not have redounded
to the credit of the House if some one had not stood up

and called upon the Noble Lord either to make the ac-
cusation openly and explicitly, or to withdraw it wholly.
—(Hear, hear.) To show the state of misty ignorance
in which t so Noble Lord existed with respect to the
Hungarian question, it was only eeceseary to remind the
House that the Noble Lord had spoken of Hungary as
having been always an independent nation and in pos-
session of a constitution. The Noble Lord had evident'y
never heard that for more than a century Hungary wai
underithe dominion of the Porte—that a Turkish Bashaw
dictated laws to her from Buds, and that the house of
Hapsburgh drove back the Turk, and restored her con-
stitution to Hungary. With respect to the murders
committed at Vienna and Pesth, which the Noble Lord
represented to he the unpremeditated -acts of a mob, it
was well known that they were planned and determined
on beforehand.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. COCKBURN said he hoped his Noblo Friend
would not press his motion, but would rest satisfied with
the aesutance of the Noble Lord (Palmerston), that he
would produce such papers as would throw a sufficient
light on the course of policy pursued in these matters.
Otherwise it would seem to him that his Noble Friend
would imply a doubt of the perfect propriety of the course
of conduct adopted by her Majesty's Government. lie
thought the explanations given by the Noble Lord tha
Secretary for Foreign Affairs, on the pretest occasion,
and on a former occasion, when he made a speech that
gave great satisfaction in the country, should be a suffi-
cient guarantee that the course pursued by her Majesty's
Government, and by the Noble Lord, towards Austria
and Russia, in the present instance, was such
as became the honour, the dignity, and the
interests of this country.—(Hear, hear.) And
therefore ho thought his Noble Friend ought to be
satisfied with such papers as might be produced by the
Noble Lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs.—(Hear.)
He should not have trespassed on the House on the pre-
sent occasion were it not for the extraordinary speech of
the Noble Lord opposite.—(Hear.) He could quite well
understand that a difference of opinion might ex st as to
the right and justice of the struggle iu which Austria
had bt ea engaged with Hungary. But whilst he al-
lowed that a difference of opinion might exist on that
point Wove ,n Hon. Members of that House, he did not
mean it to be inferred that he did not himself consider
that the cause for which Hungary engaged in that
frightful struggle with Austria was one of the greatest
and most righteous in w hich any country could be in-
volved.—(Cheers.) He believed it to be a struggle for
the maintenance of an ancient constitution and esta-
blished laws, and that it was improperly and unjustly
designated by terming it a rebellion against a lawful Ste
vereign.—(fleas, hear.) He was not, however, going to
enter upon the discussion of that mater now. But when,
af:er what hal taken place—after Austria had, by the
aid of foreign bayonets and foreign hor.!e t—(Hear,
hear)—succeeded in putting down the Hungarian cause
—wuen they recollected what had since passed—the
frightful executions and the bloody murders which en-
sued—(Cneers)—he was surprised to hear an English
gentleman and nobleman, with a zeal worthy of a better
cause, but discreditable when employed in such a cause
28 that which the Noble Lord had Just pleaded, enter
upon the defence of Austria after the conduct cf
which she halt been guilty before the world.—
(Hear, hear.) He held in his hand a publication by
Austria herself—an official document of the number of

;nsol, sentenced

In prison un-
der trial for
high treason;
they are tried
by court-
martial.