The Sun.
London, England, 1850-05-07 00:00:00

For the motion ••• ••• ••• 42
Against it ... 165
Majority against re-committal -123
gon
On our re-admission, we found under debate the qua.

ss COLONIAL ECCLESIASTICAL LAWS.
e ale GLADSTONE was saving—tle proposed, what
Establisabs
mvueerhulight be the state of the law in this country, inas
great doubts existed about the right of thei
up
Spiritual matters, " That it shall be lawful for the
001en413 or bishops of any diocese or dioceses in the said
order se
or in any colony which her Majesty shall, by
ter us council, declare to ha joined to them for the
fu_ Peses next hereinafter described, and the clergy and
tnY piersons, being declared members of the Church of
thotand• or being otherwise in communion with him or
and, respectively, to meet together from time to time,
at such meeting, by mutual consent, or by a majo-
resl of voices of the said clergy and laity, severally and
010,1)13(4'0Y, with the assent of the said bishop, or of a
kerns, of the said bishops, if more than one, to make
uch regulations as may be necessary for the better
114 :pet of their ecclesiastical affairs, and for the
Ise ding of meetings for the said purpose thereafter."
tho_ deeply regretted her Majesty's Government had not
e. Light it a necessary part of their duty to include this
in Light
subject in their Australian Bill. He thought
Act which had dregard to the government of our
trelinn colonies it was the absolute duty of Govern-
ha! to
,have considered the state of the colonial church.
who had the best means of discharging this duty,
th,,,r assed it entirely; he had, therefore, stepped into
~L ple, and, with the view of submitting some
Zap, to lace,
House to accomplish the purpose he had in
iodui ne hoped what he said would be received with
veliasiFenee by that House, and that the legal talents
5r,,,,1:1 ought to be eegage3, not in criticising, but in
platod"To ng Measures to this end, would show mehey rc and
gsenen with regard to the propositions had
"e' among the list of motions, which be hoped, if
IN°l?ted, would put the colonies, in regard to
aort!tual matters, on a more rational and suitable
aitlng• The House ought to understand that the
eeto'enl, of an established religion did not prevail in the
pal ll'es for any useful or rational purpose; that it was
Yer eductive of mischief and vexation; that it was an
whipfeelin iment to law and rule, disturbing the minds and
ilge of men, giving occasion to the raising of claims
whatever might be their value here, there were
to
the l out of place—never leading or expected to lead
recognition of claims wholly alien to society in the
/4, flies, but introducing confusion and dissension where
foreee and harmony ought only to prevail. He, there-
ttr called on the House not to take upon itself to de-
tine what the system of Church discipline in Aus-
srs a should be, for in doing so it would be acting in
ofl •sror.
out to untie the hands of their fallow-subjects
sad Members of the same religion to which this country
tb:ered—to untie the hands of those who bad carried
Larne faith and the same principles to distant lands,
tile who, when there, found themselves divested of all
t. advantages we possessed by law, and every advan-
%go
mwhich even dissenting societies possessed in virtue
Q heir constitutional rights and privileges as English-
joa(lllear.) If the House valued the principles of
tile as much as they did those of order and liberty,
would admit the absolute obligation on them to pro-
to °°lle of two things, either that the Established Church
Which the majority of the colonists might perhaps
beeelg, should carry to the colonies the privileges they
etc enj privileges as it plainly appeared, it was not
elolritbia these
should be carried out, then that
turvllrusient fall back on principles of original and na-
to :1! freedom, and that there should not be an exception
le,;.'e general system of freedom in the colonies, by
pose the colonists under disabilities which the law
cu on them, without any compensating advantages.
001 t
(lilear, hear.) The clause which stood on the votes
tit. allied five provisons, all limiting, to a certain extent
tiPowers that would arise on a declaration of the re-
e 411011 to original freedom. He did not believe in
b..
eedAs olute necessity of the provisions, as strictly justi-
eePtlen II Principle; for he did not think a system of ex-
°n
k . a ems non Lot be he most advisable for adop-
sis
bma our coloanies. But at the same time the provi-
tiem ^ere consistent with the attainment of the prac-
, object ho hai in view. He did not intend, accord-
sg to tithe .
has e first provision, " that it should be lawful to
dirse or inflict any temporal or pecuniary penalty or
tieo4bil,itY, other than such as might attach to the avoid-
- °' any office or benefice held in the said Church."
2. That no such regulation shall be binding on any
%sen or persons other than the said bishop or bishops,
aid the clergy and the lay persons within the said colo-
a
thwno are or may be declared members of the Church
e'Lllgland, or otherwise in communion with him or
respectively.
el 3. That any such regulation, touching the existing
reoattien of the said bishops, clergy, and ot'aers, to the
troarePolitan see of Canterbury, shall be forthwith
arossMitted hy the presiding bishop or his deputy, to the
all "bishop of the said see, and shall be subject to die-
%ranee by the said archbishop, under his hand and
the' at any time within 12 months from the passing of
Abe- said regulation, or within six months from
of r•eneiPt thereof by the said archbieh')p, bat not
•erwards.
clergy,
That it shall be competent to the said bishops,
and lay persons, or any of them, to pass any
ettilat•
to. lon affecting the rights of the Grown in the
bent 0
llation of bishops, without the consent of
i onies. Majestys Principal Secretary of State for the
at; 5. That no such regulation made as teforesaid shall
tehorise the bishop of any diocese to con firm or con-
aocirllte, or to ordain, license, or institute any person to
cler;see, or to any pastoral charge or other episcopal or
di office, office, except upon such persons baying imme-
oPY before taken the oath of allegiance to her
-I,,estY, and having likewise subscribed the Articles
United Church of England and Ireland, and
o;',aring his unfeigned assent and consent to the Book
thaw
Prayer.
t 811 W no injustice in requiring the clerg yto conform
.0 +1
to e principles of the religious system of. this country,
41;14 as they remained in communion with it. There
ai.6"t be some jealousy created if greater latitude were
atbelij
'et) colon if his own opinion were asked, he should
I),sts would not use unlimited freedom i
im -
thleriY; and that if unlimited freedom were placed n
it hands, we should be perfectly safe. He would ask
llouse to consider they were not dealing with the
equo"le.hes at home, but with the Church as it existed in the
from
. The
as state of the Church in the colonies differed
tn eacother much as it differed from the Church
it
lit e urn°. In the West Indies there was a quasi Estab-
h
ed Church which enjoyed every privilege there which
,e Church enjoyed at home. If they went to the North
otornericart colonies they would find great differences
1415.11 g the Churches, yet all possessing some valuable
. Qoctio Though there were the reserved lands,
ns•
thed among the several religious bodies, they
ere thds not divided according to the number of
reit e; bodies, therefore it could not be said that
thsl°ll9 eiequality prevailed in Canada. He would ask
%teat:else to ut aside all idea of the Church at home,
110, the Church as established in the West Indies and
ohtau America, and look at the religious condition of
prit- Australian colonies. In those colonies there was a
Peorlt`eal equality. The Church of England enjoyed no
th
in those colonies. It is true the ministers of
1:0.1/„ Church were salaried, and received stipends—
toiobier, in some instances, than the iacomes of other
Rag
but not larger by any act of the state. There
eitt- a certain sum devoted to religious purposes, which
ties divided simply and solely according to the respec-
Th.° number of the Zdifforont religious communities.
ei4„re Was nothing of a permanent character in these
atea'a'reents—Parliament provided a certain sum, which
ro,,,,aet apart to pay ministers of all religions. Parlia-
eoo3,,' might alter this arrangement, and, if they pleased,
os:4 dt) it under the present Bill. There was not
111": element of permanence in the existing arrange-
ovelltat nay, he did not think thk holders had
any vested interests in their appointments
Thais held the salary only for the time being.
po aPpointments were not endowments because of any
o,ocalitir religious profession--they were open to all reli•
eorhile which were included in the number of Christian
o-eninnities. If this were so, then it was not just that
svh; religious profession should rest under disabilities
el 'en the other did not. All ought to be put on an
thetialitY• Government had no right—he would not say
"ad not the power—to leave them under existing
ess4beislities, owing to laws at home, when those laws had
teu to have any power here. It was a case of _ur-
ea tel? Open to the House. They could not play pranks,
Ivith-IY had been playing pranks in the Church_ here,..
pras,;" great principles of order, without producing
tbeil;_etti evils. He would show that evils did exist, and
bp i,,lue Present state of thing h
s ad been suffered to grow
ewcolonie?. He would refer to our colonies of
Itt; south Wales and Van Diemen's Land—of South
le ?tralia and West Australia—but West Australia was
roeuinsignificant that he would not refer to it. With
Nat to South Australia, the Parliament bad not
etili,,7ent practical information. He did not re-
ha any kind of endowment
ou of the Church
Ile,„een voted from colonial resrces.—[An Hon.
tbe.i'wer here made some remark.] He was informed
;let setnething slight of the sort had occurred. The
men's in operation in New South Wales and Van Die-
them Land was so nearly akin that he would take
exot.as if the same; and inasmuch as the law was more
lAraj:BB, in Van Diemen's Land than in New South
th© iss, he would refer to the law and the actual state of
With Church in Van Diemen's Land. The provisions
tai„ regard to endowments were these:—When a ter-
tian flambe- of adults declared they belonged to a Chris-
ter ti,°lntailnity, and had subscribed a certain amount
the Stipend of the minister and their Church, then
eery elate stepped in and gave its aid in the shape of a
the laPending contributioa. It was also provided by
gthat no salary should be paid to a clergyman
Jests e appointment had been confirmed by her Ma-
coai Etnd the governor—that such salary should not be
he drilled to be paid after such time as a minister might
relo:Priyed of his ecclesiastical office, according to the
proyiej f the community to which ho belonged—that
eeistecfn should be made, in case sufficient ground
tar,„ for suspecting that a minister was not en•
114.1,r,1n the duties of his office, to cause inquiry to be
depiVnto the fact, and if found not to be so engaged, to
Courev,e, him of his salary. This was the nature of the
oo Church
in the Australian colonies. It took
eburfrance whatever of the difference between one
Church and any other Church. There were only three
of 8,0.1,3 a named—the Church of England, the Church
Power and, and the Church of Rome; but there was
ehur.,.,to_ endow all other communities of a Christian
the 7Ler• Therefore, the equality of those religions in
Vas of the law was perfect and absolute. There
elloro?'Y this difference—that the appointment of the
Icy",
1;4 En land ministers rested with Government,
IQ", certainly, the recommendation et the bishop had
ecolosil great weight. In those colonies where the
tuad stical laws of the Church of England
be „been nominally transferred, nothing could
Thou more complete delusion and imposition
leetA,:lat transfer. There was not a single
"" of the ecclesialtical laws of the Churoh