The Sun.
London, England, 1844-01-22 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, MONDAY EVENING, JANUAR 22, IM4.

Londonderry attached to it. Ile denied that the Speech from
the Throne was the personal speech of the Sovereign—it was
not a personal speech at all ; it was no more the Queen's
speech than it was his (Mr. O'Connell's), and he was not very
likely to pronounce a speech of that kind. The suggestion
contained in that Speech was grossly disloyal ; it was disloyal to
represent the Queen to the people of Ireland as hostile to their
liberty. Ile then called attention to the letter in the Morning
Chronicle, signed " One Who Whistled at the Plough," from
which he read extracts. He pointed out the injury done to the
Reform cause in England by the physical-force doctrine of the
Oliartists, and warned the people strongly against violence of
any kind. He said the resolution for the non-consumption of
exciseable articles was not yet.proposed ; it was saved for a great
emergency. Ile would shrink from nothing. He announced
his intentisin of attending meetings at Loughrea and Conne-
mara in the following week, where he would defy the spies and
informers of England to produce confusion. He then pro-
ceeded to detail his plan of the management of the fran-
chise of the Irish Parliament. He would arrange them in
such a manner that if the Queen chose to issue; writs for the
assembling of the Irish Parliament in six weeks, they might be
directed at once to the respective boroughs. He had taken the
population of the Reform Bill as the basis of his plan. He (Mr.
O'Connell) was anxious that men of wealth and station should
join them (the Repeaters). The time was come when Ireland
could no longer be governed for or by a faction. England had
given them emancipation in 1829, but not equality. With re-
spect to the law of landlord and tenant, it had been said by
Chief Justice Pennefather that the nature and intent of the
Act of Parliament was only in favour of the landlord to enforce
his rights. The law never had the interest of the tenant in
contemplation at all. These were the words of a Tory :Lord
Chief Justice.—(Laughter throughout the Court. )
Cross-examination resumed by Mr. Sergeant WARREN—
Did you attend the meeting at Loughrea ?—Yes.
State en what day that meeting took place ?—On September
the 10th.
Who were present at that meeting ?—Mr. O'Connell, Mr.
Steele, Dr. Gray, and Mr. Barrett.
Have you a note of Mr. O'Connell's speech at that meeting?
—I have.
Read it.
Mr. Hsiex, traversers' counsel—ls this a -note you took
yourself, and not a copy of another's report ?—Yes.
Mr. Sergeant WA a eax—Read it.
"Mr. O'Connell said he reeretted that the state of the weather
would compel him to narrow his expressions of gratitude to the
smallest space. They all knew there was high authority for
saying that it rained on the just as well as on the un-
just. He would wish to give before them the outpourings of
his heart at the splendid spectacle of that day. Connaught
was doing well. He had around him that day enough of physical
force to achieve the greatest revolution. But let them as-
semble peaceably, and Ireland would be again a nation."
Sergeant WARREN —Did you form an estimate of the num-
bers that attended the Lourghrea meeting ?—Yes, I did.
Sergeant WA a REN—How many persons, or about how many,
were present, do you think ?—I should say about twelve thou-
sand. I was present at a public dinner on the evening of the
same day. If I said that Mr. Barrett was at the meeting, I
said so inadvertently, and I took the first opportunity to correct
my error. Mr. Barrett was at the dinner. _
Sergeant WARREN—State the names of such of the tra-
versers as were at the dinner ?—Mr. O'Connell was there, and
so too were Mr. Steele, Mr. Barrett, and Pr. Gray. I heard
Mr. O'Connell speak at the dinner, and have a note of his
speech on that occasion.
Are you acquainted with the appearances of the traversers ?
—I am.
Sergeant 'WARREN—Point them out, if you please.
The witness turned round, and, after some hesitation, said—
" I only see Mr. O'Connell, Dr. Gray, Mr. Ray, and the Rev.
Mr. Tierney."
Sergeant WA RREN—Look round and try if you can identify
any more of them? Ohl yes, I see Mr. John O'Connell.
Sergeant WARREN—The traversers ought to be together ;
this difficulty on the part of the witness arises, my Lords, from
the circumstance of the traversers not being all here.
11Ir. WHITESIDE—I am rather inclined to think it results
from the circumstance of their not having been all there
( Laughter.) The Learned Counsel alluded to Loughrea.
COURT—Do the Counsel for the traversers admit that Mr.
Duffy was at the Loughrea dinner?
Mr. WHITESIDE—I do not admit that Mr. Duffy was at any
meeting, except, perhaps, an Association meeting.
Mr. M‘Dosiouc tr —I admit that Mr. Barrett was at the
dinner. but not at the meeting.
Mr. O'Con NELL—The witness did not say he saw Barrett at
the meeting; hut he said he was at the dinner.
Mr. FITZGIIIRON— Unless there be an attempt to dispute
identity, we will readily concede the fact of any of the tracer-
sers having been at any meeting, which, in point of fact, they
did really attend.
Sergeant WARREN—You said you had a note of Mr. O'Con-
nell's speech at the dinner of Loughrea ; pray be so good as to
read it.—( The witness here read from his note-book his note
of Mr. O'Connell's speech on the occasion in question. The
speech commenced with a denunciation of the Tories for having
put into the mouth of the Sovereign a speech, in the sentiments
of which she did not herself concur, for the paltry purpose of
keeping themselves another year in office. He expressed above
that what he uttered might reach the ears of her Majesty, and
that she would learn that from the accession of her family to
the Throne up to the present day justice had never been done
to this country. )
Witness—Then, my Lords, Mr O'Connell proceeded to
denounce George the First, George the Second, George the
Third, and George the Fourth ; I have only a topical note of
the proceedings just there, and, consequently, am unable to
give his express words ; I only know that he denounced them.
Sergeant WARREN—Go on with the reading of your notes
of Mr. O'Connell's speech.
The witness complied, and read his note, the substance of
which was, that the Irish people had ever been distinguished
for their loyalty and allegiance to their Sovereign, and they
would never cease to be so distinguished, for that their loyalty
was— " True as the dial to the sun,
Although it be not shined upon."
That the Government had commenced by threatening civil
war upon the Repealer:, but that the people had not crouched
to that threat, and that the menace, consequently, would not
be repeated ; that the Government had spent. a great portion
of the session in forging an Arths Bill ; and that he (Mr.
O'Connell) would get his arms branded in perpetual
proof of the insolence and tyranny of the Sax,in ; that
the Irish people, if they were unanimous arid did not vio-
late any law, must succeed in obtaining their liberties ;
and that they ought to humble themselves before Providence
for the purpose of imploring that the virtue of perseverance
might be vouchsafed to them, and that wisdom might be
granted to their leaders to conduct them in the paths of peace
and tranquillity into the temple of genuine and rational
liberty, which was fonnded upon religion aed morality. " I
tell the Times that those meetings are the safety-valves
through which the boiling wrongs of the national soul" (witness
remarks) I have lost the next word after soul, bet 1 suppose
it was evaporate') " into the certainty of success ; they raise
in them ( the people) a Divine hope that the days of the woes
of Ireland will net last for ever." '1 he witness continued
to read the speech of Mr. O'Connell at length in nearly
the same terms as previously published, until he came to the
following passage :—" Ireland wants no monarchy."
Mr. O'CONNELL, who was sitting, as on the previous day, at
the table, immediately under the witness's chair, here said,
with the apnearance of much astonishment, "No monarchy ?"
—I would make Mr. O'Connell's meaning more clear if I were
to write out another translation from my notes ; but this is a
literal translation of what he said. Mr. O'Connell did not
mean to say that Ireland required no monarch, for he says
afterwards, "To the Sovereign we are attached by the most
dutiful allegiance."
This part of the witness's evidence and explanation were very
confused, and rather in an under tone, so as to render it difficult
in the gallery to catch his precise words.
Mr. Sergeant WARREN—Turn to the meeting at the Corn
Exchange on the 13th ef September; look at your notes of that
day's proceedings, and say which of the traversers were there?
—Am I to give you an answer founded on my own observa-
tion, or from what I find on my notes.
Mr. Sergeant WARREN—You are not bound to omit any
names, if from your own knowledge you can speak positively
of persons having been present, although you do not find their
names on your notes?—Mr. O'Connell was there. His name
is the only one on my notes; but I know Mr. John O'Connell
and Mr. Ray were there.
Sergeant WARREN—Refer to Mr. O'Connell's speech in
presenting the draft of the address to the fellow-subjects of
the Crown in every part of the world.—The witness then pro-
ceeded to read the speech, after which he said he had notes un-
connected, of the points in that address, and he read several
disjointed passages, among which were the following .
" They say that the English Judges are better than
ours—l deny it." " Such a judgment as that of the
English Judges, respecting the Presbyterian marriages, never
was given on this side of a hot place."—( Laughter. )
When that speech was concluded what was done ?—Mr.
O'Connell moved the adoption of an address to the inhabitants
of all the countries subject to the British Crown, and that that
address be placarded wherever the British Crown had power.
You mentioned yesterday that you had received a manifold
copy of that address ?--I did.
i'sow read it.—The witness took up the manifold copy and
had read about six lines of it, when he was desired to read
the printed copy of the address, as it would be more easily
perused. When the witness had read as far as the fifth article
of the address, he appeared to be very weak—when
The CHIEF JUSTICE said, this gentleman seems very much
exhausted.
Witness—l will be better in a few moments, my Lord.
Judge CRAMPTON—Perhaps it would be better for the Clerk
of the Crown to finish the reading of the address.
The address was then handed to the Clerk of the Crown, who
concluded the reading of the document.
Here the Court adjourned. On again meeting
The direct examination of the witness was resumed.
By Sergeant WARREN— Was at the Clifton meeting; it took
place on the 17th of September ; some of the traversers ( Mr.
O'Connell and Mr. Steele) were present; does not remember
any one else.
A Juror—Only the two ?
Witness—Only the two. Remembers Mr. Dillon Browne
was there; heard him speak. (Head his speech from his notes. )
He said the men of Connemara had actea bravely in rallying at
this meeting ; that if not so numerous as in other places, they
were few, but brave. He wished Peel and Wellington
were there to see their mountain cavalry ; and he would be
glad to know if the heavy dragoons cou.d follow them through
the mountains. They assembled that day to show their strength,
not to violate the law ; they were resolved not to sully their
conscience at the will of any despot. What he had said of Mr.
Darcy was wafted on the wings of the press to the ears of that
gentleman.
Sergeant WARREN—Did you take a r. ate of what Mr. O'Con-
nell said on that occasion ?—Yes.
Sergeant WA RREN—WiII you read it?—The witness then com-
menced reading Mr. O'Connell's speech at the meeting. He
commenced by saying that the present was the most transcend-
ant meeting he had ever seen—that he was now making an ex-
periment, and he wanted to know whether they were not as
brave as the rest of Ireland—whether Connaught was not as
honest and as faithful as the other three provinces.—( Cries of
"We are, we are.") Whether they did not hate Saxon
tyranny as much as any other portion ?—( Cries of " We do
more so.") All he wanted was, Ireland for the Irish, as
France for the French, England for the English, and Scot-
land for the Scotch. The Irish were as brave and more
moral, than any other nation in the world. The battle of
Ireland was to be a peaceable battle, and he would keep them
out of danger. They should proceed in a constitutional
way, but if he wanted them they would come again. He wanted
that every person should pay his own clergyman ; the Pro-
testants could then have what they liked for their own church,
and the more they paid the better. The struggle for emanci-
pation was one for the advantage of the rich ; but Repeal would
bring physical prosperity to the people. They were to use no
violence. He came to teach them another lesson from that—
that peace, order. and obedience to the law, were the means by
which they would wrest everything from their enemies. If they
had the Repeal, prosperity would flow in upon them, and would
they not give a shilling a-year for this object' Every sergeant
recruit,the m btuot ehnehst
toldand th them tra
Irelandhim should ; bu t
bh ee
for the Irish. He again repeated that no violence as to be
did paid
anot shilling
w•a nt to to
eachentrap
used. His motto was—" Whoever committed a crime gave
strength to the enemy." He could not be doing anything that
was bad when he had the support and countenance of the sainted
clergy of the people, and their venerated archbishops. When
they found him possessed of such support, they did say that he
must be doing some good. Then came the quotation—" The
nations have fallen," &c.
Mr. Sergeant WAnues—Were you at the dinner on that
day was.

CHIEF JUSTICE—Let U 3 take down his answer corrected,
and see what it is. What is your answer, Mr. Ross have
taken a full note of all that I considered important and ma-
terial in that. speech ; for instance, I will give you. my Lords,
an example of the sort of notes I took. When I came to a
passage in the speech which I considered material I took it
down ; for instance, there is a passage in the speech of Mr.
O'Connell, when speaking of the Union, where he states that
trade and manufactures had fallen off greatly in consequence
of the blighting effects of the union. I considered that ma-
terial, and took it down.
COUNSEL—The falling off of trade and manufaoture is rather
material certainly for this country.
Judge CRAMPTON—If I understood you correctly, your an-
swer is this—you took a portion, or part, of the speech, ver-
batim, and other portions of it you made a summary of?—
Yes, my Lord, that's it exactly.
Judge CSLAMPTON—Then, you can't give the words of the
portion of what I call the summary part of the speech, can you?
—I frankly confess I cannot ; nor do I pretend to do so.
CHIEF JUSTICE—In the summary which you took down, I
suppose you put down a catch-word, did you 9—l will give you
an explanation of the manner in which I took the notes.
When Mr. O'Connell came to particular passages, I took up
the words he uttered; for instance, he says here, " There is
another bill of indictment against the Government, and he
( Mr. O'C. ) also read a letter from Smyth O'Brien. He (Mr.
O'Connell) said the Welch committed crimes and they were
favoured with an inquiry ; the Irish committed no crimes, and
were, on that account, denied their rights."
CHIEF JUSTICE—WeII, Sir?—Those are what I call heads,
or the summary of two or three sentences, but I did not take
the precise words uttered on the occasion.
CHIEF JUSTICE—WiII you take on yourself to swear, to the
best of your skill and judgment, that what you did take down
contains the substance of what was spoken on that occasion?
It contains the substance of what was spoken, certainly.
Mr. Hess—lf I understand you right you have taken a
verbatim note of what you thought to be material in the speech,
and a summary of the remainder of the proceedings. Now,
will you take on yourself to swear, that in the summary you
have taken you have correctly taken the substance of what
was said ? Why the topics—(the end of the sentence was lost,
as the witness spoke so low).
Mr. O'CoNNELL—Raise your voice, Sir ; the end of your
sentence is always lost, for you let your voice fall so short, and
so low, that no person can hear you.
Mr. HENN—I want to know from you, Mr. Ross, if you pre-
tend to swear that you have correctly taken the substance of
what Mr. O'Connell said in the discussion of the topics on
which he spoke?—l have not taken a full note of the substance
of the comments he made, but I took down the heads.
Mr. HENN—Then you did not take a full note of the com-
ments he made ?—No, I slid not.
Mr. HENN—Then, can you supply from memory the sub-
stance of the comments which he made use of ?—Yes. I would
be enabled to do so on referring to my notes.
Mr. HENN—Did you not swear, Sir, five minutes ago that
you could not give the comments ?—No, I did not.
Mr. HENN—You swore you could not depose to the sub-
' stance of the comments most assuredly ?—ln general I can
swear to the substance, but with reference to passages of the
comments I do not pretend to give the precise words that were
used by Mr. O'Connell.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said there was a preliminary
question to be settled, and on which he was entitled to the
judgment of the Court before the discussion went further. If
the witness said he could give the substance of the comments,
or the language of Mr. O'Connell on that occasion, they had
a right to get it from him by reference to his book and memory.
If the witness was not able to depose to all that was said on
that occasion from beginning to end, it ought not to be con-
tended that he could not state such portions of the speech as he
could depose to fully, and to give the portion of which he took
the substance. It was a new proposition to say so, and one
that he ventured to assert was not to be found in any law book.
They had a right to get from Mr. Ross any portion of what
Mr. O'Connell did say, and then let the gentlemen on the
other side get the remainder from him if they pleased, and not
presume that they (the Crown) could not get what they
really were entitled to, and could give in evidence.
M. HENN—Why, strictly speaking, you could not use the notes
taken by the witness at all, except to refresh his memory ;
if there was a written publication given in evidence they might
read a portion of it, and it would be then for us to use the re-
mainder of it ; but when a witness takes a partial note of pro-
ceedings, hr is not entitled to use it. By the strict rule the
witness could examine his notes to refresh his memory, and he
must rely on that then.
Judge CRAMPTON—I think you confine your objection to
the short summary taken of the speech by the witness, or do you
extend it to the words that he is really able to swear to ?
Mr. HEN object to Isis entire evidence, unless he has
taken a full note of all that passed, and I therefore submit his
evidence cannot be received.

State to the jury who were the traversers present at that
dinner.—Mr. O'Connell, Mr. J. O'Connell, Dr. Gray, and
Mr. Barrett.
Look at your notes ?—Oh, no, J. O'Connell was not present
I was thinking of Mullaghmast meeting, when Mr. J. O'Con-
nell was in the chair.
Look to your notes of the Clifden meeting?—There were
present at the Clifden meeting Mr. O'Connell, Mr. Steele, and
Dr. Gray. I don't remember that there were any other of the
traversers.
By a juror—You said that Mr. Barrett was present ?-1

was confounding this meeting with that of Mullaihmast ; the
only persons present at this (the Clifden) meeting wero—Mr.
O'Connell, DIP. Gray, and Mr. Steele.
Have you a note of Dr. Gray's speech on that occasion?--
Yes. Dr. Gray in answer to the toast said—
Have you a note of the toasts preceding that ?—No ; I have
no note of the loyal toasts. Dr. Gray, in answer to the toast of
the people, said —" That formerly the aristocracy tyrannised
over the people, but the people were now showing the bearing
of men, determined to be free—that he was much struck with
the difference in the bearing of the people then and that exhi-
bited by them some two years before, when he had visited that
place. Let their conduct be firm, and let them flinch before
ne tyrant landlord, and where was the man that would dare to
eject them from their holdings because they were repealers ?
Let them observe peace, order, and tranquillity, and they
would finally triumph.
Mr. Sergeant WARREN—Hare you a note of Mr. O'Con-
nell's speech on that occasion ?—Yes.
Read it.—( The witness here proceeded to read the speech,
which commenced with expressions of delight on the part of
Mr. O'Connell at the majestic sight which was presented on
that occasion. He said that Leinster, part of Ulster, Mun-
ster, had done their duty, and now Connaught was at its post.
There was then (said the witness) a sentence about virtue
and religious sentiment which I was not able to catch. The
speech then went on to refer to the prosperity of Ireland un-
der a domestic legislature. He (.Jr. O'Connell) might be
asked why, when having so much physical force around hint,
he did not make use of of it? He replied that he would use it,
but not abuse it. Iteure was legal and moral co.nbination.
There are then, said the witness, the words " poetical imagery"
—(Laughter)—but I have not the whole sentence. The words
are not mine, but Mr. O'Connell's. The speech went on to
express Mr. O'Connell's delight at seeing the thousands and
hundreds of thousands that poured out of every valley to the
meeting. They would use no violence--they would reserve
their strength till they were attacked. But the Government
would not attack them ; the English Government said they
would not attack them. To that statement he would reply,
" Thank you for nothing, says the gallipot."— (Laughter.)
They could not catch an old bird with chaff—( Laughter)—and
they would not catch an old lawyer with chaff.—( Laughter. )
(The witness here stated that a sentenco followed, which he
was unable to catch, and then proceeded.) Mr. O'Connell
then alluded to the reports that hail appeared in the news-
papers of the first meeting of the Arbitration Courts, Dr.
Gray in the chair, and the announcement that they would
meet every Friday after. He stated his conviction that they
would work well, and hoped that hereafter he should be able
to apply the principle on a more extensive scale, so that before
long he should deprive the principal Courts of half their busi-
ness. He would play a game that should checkmate the Go.
vernment in time. It might be necessary to go slowly to
work, and that the people of Ireland should continue their
confidence in him, but it was better to go slow and sure,
than fast and uncertain. In allusion to some opinions that had
been expressed in the newspapers, ke said he never took
advice on matters of lay: from the newspapers ; he
relied on them for matters of fact only. No country
in the world had an abler or more honest press than
Ireland ; and it was a great proof that they were in the
right road, when they found so much talent in the press in-
listed on their side ; but he could not take the law from them.
Ile had more projects in his head for checkmating the Govern.
ment, but he should not speak of them. Ile said further,
that the English Government had done nothing to conciliate
Ireland. They had offered nothing as a remedy of their
grievances but a miserable compromise, giving them what
children called the smallest half. At present his monster
meetings were almost done ; there were not more than seven
or eight to be held. He remarked on the conduct of the
people at those meetings which had been held, and the extract
concluded by an eulogium of the moral and religious character
of the people of Ireland.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL—Did you make any calculation
of the number of persons at the meeting at Clifden ?—I did.
What number attended ?--Five or six thousand.
Were you present at the meeting of the Association at the
Corn Exchange, on the 27th September ?—I was.
Which of the traversers did you see there ?—Allow me to
look at my notes. I never was a day without seeing some
of them.
I only ask you as to that particular day.—Dr. Gray, Mr.
O'Connell and Mr. Ray.
Did Dr. Gray make any remarks on that occasion?—He did.
Have you a copy of that report read by him, or do you know
what was the subject of it ?—lt was with respect to the Arbri-
tation Courts.
Is there among these documents (handing them in) a copy
of the report read by Dr. Gray ?--I have not a copy of
that report.
Were you furnished with copies of any documents on that
occasion connected with the Arbitration Courts?—Yes.
Have the goodness to read them.
Witness then read one of the documents. It was an un-
filled up notice that an Arbitration Court had been appointed
for the district of --, and that Mr. -- hod been appointed
to furnish every information that might be required. It was
signed, Thomas Ray, and printed by Mr. Brown, 36, Nassau-
street.

Judge CRAMPTON—I understand ; that is quite sufficient.
CHIEF JUSTICE—We will admit the evidence, considering
that we are acting in conformity with the well-known principles
of the law.

Sergeant WARREN—Proceed, and state as fully as you can, from
your notes, the speech of Mr. O'Connell ; and when you come
to the portions which you hare not taken fully, er where your
notes are imperfect, state so. The witness proceeded to read
the speech of Mr. O'Connell for a few minutes, and then, ad-
dressing the Court, slid, "Now, my Lords, I have come to the
point at which my note; are rot so full—shall I read them ?"
Mr. Justice CRAMPTON—Do you object, Mr. Henn?
Mr. HENN—If the witness can give the substance and mean-
ing we do not, my Lord. We call upon him to go on.
The witness then proceeded to read—" 'f he Union was not
a compact or agreement. It is not valid. But it is said, that
although it was carried by the foulest and most atrocious
means, that it has worked well for Ireland. I deny
that. From the Declaration of Independence, in the year

Have you any other document connected with the Arbitra-
tion Courts ?—Yes ; but not on that day.
Other documents were handed to witness, and from them he
selected one which was read by the officer of the Court. It
was headed by a harp and crown, and ran thus These pre-
sents ate to testify that the,Loyal National Repeal Association
has perfect confidence and perfect reliance on the ability
of Mr. --, as Arbitrator, to dispose of, adjudicate.
and settle, any disputes that may arise in the said
district of --."

1782, up to the year 1799, there never was a country
progressed more rapidly, and I have the authority of Lord
Clare to that effect. Before Emancipation, no man spoke
of repeal but myself ; I always looked upon the Relief
Bill only as the means to an end—but a step to repeal—
and lest that should happen, which has since happened, namely,
that I should be accused of suppressing from tke people of
England my intention ultimately to seek for it, I always de-
clared my determination. In my address to the electors of
Clare, in the year 1828, a contest which was of such import-
ance in effecting Catholic emancipation, I distinctly put it
forward as an inducement to the electors to vote for me, and I
promised that if I obtained a seat in Parliament I would bring
the measure before the house. I have now, for the last time,
vindicated myself from the charge of concealing my inten,ion,
and I will read an extract from Mr. O'Driscoll's book, dedi-
cated to the Marquis of Lansdowne." The witness tken said
he had not taken a note of the extract.

Sergeant WAR REW—Have you any other documents respect-
ing Arlsitration Courts, which you received that same des?—
At the meeting of the Repeal Association, which was held on
the 16th of October, I got a document which purports to be a
copy of the. rules and regulations to be observed by arbitrators,
and also by persons in various districts of the country who
wish to submit their disputes to arbitrators.
Sergeant WAUREN—Read it.
The witness, who appeared to be very much exhausted,
handed the document to the Clerk of the Crown, who read it.
It was as follows:
" RULES TO BE OBSERVED by ARBITRATORS IN DISTRICTS,
THE PEOPLE WHEREOF MAY CHOOSE TO SUBMIT THEIR
DISPUTES TO ARBITRATION.
POWERS OF ARBITRATORS.
" I. Arbitrators will remember that they derive their legal
powerfthe
and award of the arbitrators, and will therefore be careful
never to enter on any case, until both parties have consented to
disputingto adjudicate
partiin esa,n y
submit their disputes to the arbitra-
tionoto given case, solely from the consent
submit the cause of dispute to their decision. This consent
should, in general, be had in writing, and the name of the ar-
bitrators, as well as the cause of dispute, should be stated
therein. The consent (which is legally called a deed of sub-
mission) should then be signed by both parties in presence of
a witness. In trivial cases, a verbal consent, in the presence of
a witness, will suffice ; but, as in the case of a written consent,
the arbitrators should be named by the disputing parties.
o IL—lt is illegal and an indictable offence for arbitrators to
administer an oath. In hearing cases they will therefore not
only not administer an oath thern•elves, but they will not permit
the disputing parties or their witnesses, or any of them, to take
an oath, or use such asseverations as may be deemed or son-
strued into an oath. Neither ought the arbitrators to take any
form of an oath themselves.
" Ill.—Arbitrators may, when duly nominated by both the
disputing parties, decide and adjudicate in all cases ex-
cept such as are called felonies, as theft, forgery, passing base
coin, and such like.
" The cases that more properly belong to the province of
arbitrators are such as hither to chiefly formed the subjects of
expensive litigation in the magisterial and other Courts. Such
as wages, debts •f all kinds, disputes between employers and
the employed—including servants, labourers, and mechanics—
trespass, disputes concerning meanings_claims on foot of al-
leged damage sustained in any mode whatever, whether by
breach of contract, or by assault and battery. In cases of as-
sault, the complainant must seek for the recovery of damage
sustained as the result of the assault committed, and the arbitra-
tors may award to the injured party any amount of pecuniary
damages that they may diem a just recompense.
" IV.—Arbitrators are not limited as to the extent of their
jurisdiction as are Justices of the Peace and Assistant Bar-
risters. They may, when duly nominated, adjudicate in
cases involving any amount of property. In all cases,
however, over '2Ol. a stamp will be necessary to render the
consent (or deed of submission) an award legal; but in
all cases under that sum, the consent and award require no
stamp to render them binding in law. The ordinary sche-
dule of stamp duties, to be had at the office of every vender
of stamps, will show the amount of stamp duty required in
each case, amounting to, or exceeding 201., and the arbitra-
tors should direct the disputing parties to procure same, and
the cost of same should be allowed, in making up the award,
to the successful party.

3lr. HENN—Are you able, from memory, to give the sub-
stance of that extract am not. Witness then proceeded to
read the remainder of 3lr. O'Connell's speech, where he stated
that from the year 1800 to 1828 the British Constitution was
only in existence in Ireland during an interval of five years,
and stated 31r. O'Connell referred to various Acts of Parlia-
ment passed during that time.
Mr. HENN—Are you able from memory to supply the sub-
stance of what was said?—No.

Mr. Hee understood you to say you could ?—Mr.
O'Connell quoted several Acts.
Sergeant WARREN, for the Crown, submitted these inter-
ruptions ought not to be allowed.
Vitness proceeded to read the portion of Mr. O'Connell's
speech, where he relied on the vast falling off in the trade of
Ireland. There were more cattle sold at 13allitiasloe before
the Union than since. There was not one head of cattle ex-
ported then for every 800 exported now. The Irish people
consumed them, and did not export food. Ile took the trou-
ble to look over Lord 13rougham's speeches, and Mr. O'Con_
nell referred to several passages. Also the report of the Poor-
law Commissioners—number of destitute poor in Ireland--
comparative number of Protestant and Roman Catholics—that
the Welsh, who committed crime, were much better
treated than the Irish, who committed none. He
proceeded to give a summary of the conduct of
Ministers during the last session of Parliament, which
closed with a speech of an extraordinary nature, and said
he was greatly pleased with the Morning Chronicle, which
he was not generally in the habit of being from the way in
which it described the speech. It stated the speech was the
very essence of stupidity or impudence, he forgot which, for his
part, he thought it contained both. He would not banish the
impudence from the stupidity, or the stupidity from the impu-
dence, but rather have both combined. He denied any inten-
'ion of speaking disparagingly of the Queen. He separated
her acts from those of her Ministers. Kings condescended to
scold and Queens to speak hastily of him. Ile called a Minis-
terial speech base, bloody, and brutal, and he never retracted
what he had said. The present was a Ministerial speech. They
could not help giving it utterance. But he blamed the Minis-
ters for not having advised the speech to be given by commis-
mission, and not have compelled her Majesty to speak it. But
she could have expected no better from them. At the very
commencement of her reign the vilest insinuations issued
from their villainous press. A dropsical complaint of one
of 'the ladies of her Court gave rise to statements which out-
raged every feeling dear to a child or woman, and which he
would not venture to repeat in the presence he was in. Did
they not inflame the mind of the English public, until a mis-
creant thought he would be doing a good act to shoot the
Queen? He loved the Queen, the object of his kindliest
affections, and, consequently, with his station, felt towards her
the tenderness of a parent. He thought it was cruel towards
the people of Ireland to disturb the affection they entertained,
by making the Queen utter this speech, and make them be-
lieve they never trusted the English, but were deceived. If
they had given the speech by Commission, he would not blame
them ; but all should recollect this was not the speech of the
Queen, but the Ministers ; but there was nothing in the speech
to retard, on the contrary, it should rather stimulate their ex-
ertions. They had now the additional motive to rescue their
beloved Queen from the hands of those Ministers. He be-
lieved if it had not pleased God to give her a family, her life
was not safe among them. The Queen's family had this
peculiar merit, that they stopped the irregular ambition of
one who it was frightful to think would come to the throne.
Nature had placed their innocence as a barrier against the
worst calamity that could be inflicted on the nation. Oh !
thank Heaven, there is that security against the worst evil that
could possibly happen. We have a double motive for our
exertions—to rescue the Queen from those miscreants, and
our country from tyranny. We have the two highest motives
that can give energy to human action, love of country and al-
legiance to a woman. Rally, then, with me, and hurra for the
Queen. I now come to the Ministers' speech, and Peel, Wel-
lington, Stanley, and Graham. What a scene for the con-
queror of Waterloo, with the Queen in his hands, to make such
a speech to Parliament. She is made to whine out something
half-piteous and half-imploring about the real of her subjects.
The Queen is made to say, I have done something for the good
of the Church, about being unable to do more, and leaving the
rest to the zeal of her subjects. The Duke of Wellington, if
poor Napoleon had been alive to witness his defeat (then fol-
lowed some references to the Church of Scotland and
the disturbances in Wales). It is my opinion that
the Legislative Union is inconsistent with any good
object whatever—that instead of being essential to
the strength and stability of the empire, it tends to
produce weakness and decay—that instead of being a bond of
connexion between the two countries, it is the very thing which
puts the continued connexion in jeopardy. Circumstanced as
Ireland is, I am perfectly convinced that if the union is not
repealed by legal and constitutional means, and above all, if it
does not take place during my life-time, the result will.be a san-
guinary struggle
m
for perpetual
should be u
separsd. I do notaation,and God
say thisdforbi is a
forbid that
any unjustifiable
natural or unavoidable result; all I say is, while I live I hope
my countrymen will not despair. As long as I live, at least, I
will struggle legitimately and constitutionally ; and I bequeath
to those who follow me their own course of proceeding. He
concluded by a motion for a committee to prepare an address to
be placed before the Queen and all her subjects.
Sergeant WARREN—Was the motion agreed to?—Yes.
Have you taken a memorandum of any approbation or disap-
probation of any part of that speech ?—No. I was present at
a meeting of the Association on the 4th of September. Mr.
O'Connell, Mr. Ray, Mr. John O'Connell, and Mr. Steele,'were
present. Mr. O'Connell spoke at the meeting.
The witness then commenced reading his note of what Mr.
O'Connell spoke on that occasion. He commenced by referring
to the meeting which was to take place at Clontarf on the Bth
of October and to the prospects of success for the repeal. He
then referred to the Queens Speech, and the effect which it
produced on the Irish mind. The Ministers dared not to make
that speech till the end of the session, when it could best be ex-
posed to view. A weak and miserable Ministry was incapable
of resorting to any other advice. He congratulated the people
en the increase of the repeal feeling among them, and also on
the symptoms that were apparent of a better temper among the
high-flying Orangemen of the North. He mentioned the
surprise he felt at seeing a sensible letter with the PAW of

"ORDER OF TROCEEDINGS.

V.—The form of notice from the plaintiff to the defendant,
should be signed by the plaintiff, and the notification appended
thereto, signifying the willingness of the arbitrators to act, if
duly nominated, should be signed by some one of the arbitra-
tors of the district.

" V I.—After the parties have come to the place of hold-
ing the arbitration, and before the plaintiff be allowed to
maka his statement, the arbitrators should ascertain
whether both parties be present. If :hey be not, the hear-
ing must be postponed. liut if both parties be present, the
arbitrators will inquire if they mutually consent to submit
the cause in dispute to their arbitration. Should both con-
sent. then tke arbitrators will follow the directions given
in Rule No. I. Should they, however, not consent, the
arbitrators will, on no account, proceed. any further with
the ease. •

" VIL —The parties having indifferently chosen and
named the arbitrators, and consented to abide by their
decision and award, the arbitrators will proceed to hear the
case in manner following : —The plaintiff should be called
xam respectively
on to state his case, and having done so, he may exa-
mined
alled by the arbitrators, and cross examined by the
defendant. The witnesses for the plaintiff to be then
e
by
yecttihe defendant.velyexamitied
Tbhy,
„tahe„ arbitrators ittrhaetoprlsai,aoridld
cross-examined and
having closed, the defendant should then be called upon to make
his statement, and having been examined by the arbitrators,
and cross-examined by ;he plaintiff, his witnesses are to be
called, and a similar course pursued :o that directed in the case
of the plaintiff's witnesses, The case on both sides having
closed, the arbitrators will proceed to make their award, which
must in all cases be in writing, and be signed by the arbitrators
named by the disputing parties, and by none others, save the
Secretary, who must sign as witness. Whew so signed, the
award should be publicly read by the Chairman.
" Note.—In all cases of arbitration, the wife or child of
either party may be examined; and a witness may be called a
second lime should the arbitrators think fit. It may be ad-
visable, for the purpose of eliciting truth, that the witnes.,es on
both aides should be sent out of the room until required for
examination.

" VIII.—The disputing parties, or either of them, should be
allowed to have the aid of professional men if they choose. In
such case the professional agent will state the case, and ex-
amine and cress-examine witnesses, instead of the party litigant,
as stated in Rule VII.
" IX.—Should the arbitrators find a difficulty in coming to
a decision in any case, a reasonable time may be taken for
making the award ; but it is advisable that, in all cases where
it is practicable, the award be made immediately after the
hearing.

"GENERAL RULES.
" X. The arbitrators should sit in a room open to the public ;
and it is deemed advisable that all manifestation of approval or
of disapproval by the suitors or audience, be prohibited, as cal-
culated to disturb the proceedings.
'° Xl. The Arbitrators will 'cause the secretary to make an
entry in the minute book of each case that comes before them.
Should there be no appearance to the notice of complaint, or
should the case have been settled, he will enter it accordingly ;
and should the case be heard, he will enter the particulars
under their respective heads.
" Xll.—The original deed of submission and the award are
to be carefully preserved by the secretary, as they may be ne-
cessary for the future security of the respective parties from
NNW PINRIsr It Will be his duty, however, to supply eqies

of the award, free of expense, to each of the parties, if applied
tor. " Signed by order,
"JOHN GRAY,
" Chairman of the Arbitration Committee,
" Loyal National Repeal Association.
" A copy of these Rules should be posted in some conspi•
coons place in the room where the arbitrators sit."
Sergeant WARREN—Look at your notes, and see have vou
a memorandum of the appointment of any arbitrators on the 27th
of September for the districts of Kingstown, Dundrum, or
Blackrock ?—I remember that Dr. Gray made a speech on that
occasion in reference to the appointment of arbitrators.
Sergeant WARREN—Have you a note of that speech ?—Yes,
I have.
Sergeant WARREN—Read it.—The witness read from his
manuscripts a note of a speech delivered by Dr. Gray, on the
occasion in question. The substance of the speech was, that
he (Dr. Gray) as chairman of the Arbitration Committee, was
commissioned to inform the Association that the Committee
had under their consideration the form of a testimonial in
favour of such persons as they thought tit to recommend to the
office of arbitrators, and he then proceeded to read the doeu
tent alluded to, a copy of whirls the witaeas produced.
Did any appointment of arbitrators take place that day ?
I have a memorandum on my notes to the effect that several
gentlemen were proposed as arbitrators and agreed to. I know
that Mr. Nugent, of Kingstown, was appointed, and returned
thanks, and Doctor Gray moved that the Chairman should be
recommended as an arbitrator for Dundrum, whereupon the
chairman returned thanks. I was present at the Mullaghmast
meeting. I took a note of the proceedings of that meeting,
which I hold in my hand.
Sergeant WARREN said there were certain extracts from
that speech, as reported by the witness, which he wished to
have read out. He wished to know whether the Counsel for
tile traverser, had any objections to having certain extracts
read from the speech, or did they mean to insist, as they had a
right to do, that the entire speech should be read over again ?
It would be in the recollection of the Court that the speech
hail already been read in its entirety by Mr. Hughes.
Mr. FITZGIBLON—If your two witnesses agree, Sergeant
Warren, in their reports of this speech, I really cannot see the
use of having it real, or any part of it, over again. But if, on
the other hand, you want now to give a different account of the
speech from that which has already been deposed to, I cannot
see how you can do so, for surely you caw have no right to pit
one of your witnesses against the other. So which horn of the
dilemma will you select?—( Laughter.)
Sergeant Wsteles—l don't want any horn of a dilemma.
I merely wish to have certain extracts read from the witness's
report of Mr. O'Connell's speech, and I ask you whether you.
require to have the w hole speech read, as you are entitled ?
Mr. FrrzGraeos—We don't require anything. Take your
own course.
Mr. lIENN—If the two extracts correspond in omnibus,
there is no necessity for reading the second, but if there be any
discrepancy, I think it very essential for us that the whole of
the witness's notes shouldtbe read.
Sergeant WA RR EN—I believe that the two reports do corre-
spond, fors I trust to the .reporters ; but lam unable to say
positively, for, I have•not examined the reports.
Mr. HENS—We have no opportunity whatever of knowing
whether the reports correspond.
Judge CRA rToN—You have only to state that you wish the
whole s.,tieeeli rend,:alr. Henn.
Mr. Sergeant WARREN—State from your notes what Mr.
O'Connell said at Mullaghmast ?—There was considerable
confusion at that meeting, which 'inconvenienced me, and pre-
vented my taking some of the first of Mr. O'Connell's observa-
tions. I had not an opportunity of ',taking his 'first, words,
but he was speaking of Para ; I put down the word Tara
first, and then I go on. The witness here read Mr.
O'Connell's speech, which agreed as nearly as possible with
Mr. Hughes's version of it, and very slightly differed from the
report as originally published in the Freeman. Whenever he
missed taking down a %void, he said, " I lost the next word."
tle read on until he came to the' passage—" Peel has 500
colours in his flag, and not one off them permanent—to-day it is
Orange, to-morrow green—and next day it is neither one nor
the ether. One of the Scotch historians, Allison, says that if
Wellington got well out of the battle of Waterloo, it was by
the British troops, and by their unconquerable. I have
lost the remaining words of that sentence. He then mine to a
quotation from a song, which he introduced—.
" At famed Waterloo
Old Wellington would look blue,
Only Paddy was there too."
And I have lostithe rest..—( Great laughter.) He said further
about the Duke of Wellington, They had no place for him in
the Cabinet, nor no duty for him to perform, except that ofra
sort of inspector of Anti-Repeal W ardens. I selected this
Rath for obvious reasons to hold this meeting,. for it was the
spot on which English treachery, ind Irish treachery too com-
mitted a massacre unequalled in the annals of history, except by
the murder of the Mamelukes."
When the witness was done reading the speech,
Sergeant WARREN asked him it he was at the dinner in
Mullaghmast ?—I was.
I suppose you took a note of Mr. O'Connell's speech at the
dinner ?—I did.
Can you recollect how many of the traverser, were present
at Mullaghmast ?--There were present, Mr. O'Connell, Mr.
Ray, Mr. Steele, and Dr. Gray.
Now, at the dinner who did you see ?—I saw Mr. O'Con-
nell, Mr. John O'Connell, Dr. Gray, Mr. Steele, Mr. Ray,
and Mr. Barrett.
Did you take a note of Mr. O'Connell's speech upon the
latter occasion?—Yes.
Read it. —I will. I have also notes of Mr. Barrett's speech
on the same occasion, but my notes of his speech are very in-
complete.
Mr. M`Dosouctr—Your Lordships, perhaps, did not hear
what the witness said to Sergeant Warren. lie stated that he
has a very incomplete note of Mr. Bart ett's speech. Now, we
had from Mr. Hughes yesterday a very perfect note of that
speech ; anti I take the liberty. on the part of Mr. Barrett, to
do
napoptslt:h•rgittte:katnhitte orA.ußr
EnNo t too
jet ens,. i e)
_t h i r
a vi eco
Im. incompletecomplete
note
W
(t
of any part of Mr. Barrett's speech? If you have not I ve.ns't
ask you a word about it. Witness (having looked over his
notes)—No, Sir.
Sergeant WA RREN—I should be very sorry to ask you to
give any statement of it You said you had a complete not.
of O'Connell's speech at the dinner ; will you reel it ?--The
witness went on to read the speech made by Mr. O'Connell,
which took place at the Mullaghmast dinner. He (Mr. O'Con-
Dell) asked on that occasion was there any Repealer brought
before a bench charged with any crime? Was there any of
them brought before a magistrate for a breach of the peace ?
Ne, not one. They (the lii-h eople) had made a moral de-
monstration which no country on the face of the earth was ca-
pable of producing save Ireland. They (the Irish) had met
in immense numbers without the slightest violation of the laws
of God or man, and yet that country and such a people were
enslaved. Mr. O'Connell the, spoke something about the
cold water cure, but I did not catch it.—( Laughter. ) Mr.
O'Connell continued, and said the only way to obtain the
Repeal of the Union was by the peaceful wurkiog of the
Irish people themselves. They would not commit a Ineaeh
of the peace. They would not commit a violation of the law.
He went on to read that portion of the speech relative to the
Duke of Wellington, in which it was stated that if a man hap-
pened to be born in a stable it did not make him a horse.
Witness continued reading Mr. O'Connell's speech for some
time longer, and the direct examination being ceneluded, Mr.
Henn, Q. C., commenced the cross-examination.
Mr. HENN—WiII you state what time you came to Ire-
land first?—The first time I came was in July, lEt43. I was
never here before.
M H

-•- - - - here to report the proceedings at the meeting held at Donny- Was there a contested election in Carlisle in 1841 ?—I rear:
brook—you could not report unless you had a place on the do not remember. If there was an election, it made no ira•
platform to hear and see. Tell me to whore did you apply ?—I 1 pression on my mind.
do not know.
1 And you say ycu don't know who the candidate was?-IHow did you get to the meeting ?—I went there with a, do not.
gentleman connected with the Dublin Evening Post; he Do you remember any election in Carlisle ?—Yes, there wall
being well known did everythins for me, and got me a place on an election in '39 or '4o—it was an election for the county.
the platform. Look to this placard, it is addressed to the working classes
You said when Mr. O'Connell arrived there was great con- of Carlisle ?-1
have looked at it, hut never saw it until now'
fusion ?—Yes. I may have seen it on the walls. Let me look at the date. ,
That was created by persons coming on the platform?— (Witness then looked at the date, and said he mistook
the
It was. dale; he never saw that placard before. )
There was no breach of the peace—no alarm on your part? Mr. Henn handed him another placard, an address to the
—No.
working classes of Carlisle, and he said he never saw that
Mr. HENN—You would not give 50,0001, to get away from either.
it—(Laughter)—was not all quiet and decorous?—lt was. Now, you edited the Carasle Patriot in 1839 ?—Yes.
you
report of what occurred at Donnybrook you transcribed Look at this (handing him a printed document), have
__ from the notes you took ?—Yes. any recollection of that ?—I have not the slightest recollectipla
Have you that paper ?—Yes. of it.
Now, having come over in a double capacity, did you furnish a Was it not publishrd in the Patriot as a leading article?---1
report to the Government and to the Morning Chronicle ?—Yes. do not know. I have no recollection of it. To the CHIEF JUSTICE-1 assisted in preparing a report Can you say that that did not appear in your paper?....l
for the Morning Chronicle. cannot say.
Mr. HENN—Was that on the same day ?—Yes, it was on But it may have appeared ?—lt may, Sir; I cannot JAY it
Monday.
did not.
Did you on that day copy the short-hand notes you took to The article to which I call your attention says—
tiro.'
" •• ur e s
furnish your report to the Chronicle? Oh, no ; I sent off by test in the most ardent manner against the conduct of the
post that night, and it was not more than thirty flues ; I only magistrates in compelling us to give evidence against the Pr'.
wrote a portion of Mr. O'Connell's speech without referring to loners." Do you remember those words?-4 do not.
my notes at all.
Sergeant Waiters; begged to interrupt Mr. Henn. When did you write out the report for Government?—On the Mr. HENN—I think I amentitled now to ask him will
_ next day.
he swear that this was riot inserted in the paper with his sad
Is it a full report ?—As full as possible, except in those per- tion ?
tions to which I have referred. Sergeant Wait REN—He has already stated that he has no re.
I understand you took a verbatim report of what you consis collection of having seen that document before, and, therefore,
dared material ? Yes.
you have no right to read one word of it.
You cannot he always precisely verbal?—Oh, no; and the Mr. Justice CRAMPTON—Certainly not.
change of a word might otters make a very material difference Mr. HENN—Very well. lam entitled at all events to
.al‘
.' in the sense of a sentence. him this. Will you swear you did not, when editor of the Pa'
But of those parts you did not consider material you did not triot, protest against reporters being examined ?—I said before
take a note ?—No.
I did not.
You took what you call topical notes of what took place 7 I know you did, but answer me again ?—I did not make 1.11
Yes.
such protest—even in this sentence which I have used
But you do not pretend to say that you even gave the sub- (Laughter)—l made no such protest.
stance of what was said in those special notes?-1 do not un- Then you did use the sentence ?—You mistake roel..-
derstand the latter part of your question. I took notes in such did not.
a way as not to misrepresent the een,e of the speaker upon those Were you in the habit of reporting in the House of Cow points on which he spoke ; bt,t Ido slot pretend to have given mons ?—Yes.
the words, or anything like them. I suppose you often reported Mr. O'Connell's speeches 7—t
Do you pretend to any you have given even the substance of did—very often.
the observations made on the various topics 7-1 do not know Did you ever state that you found considerably difficulty ill
how far the expression " substance" ezends. following Mr. O'Connell ? Yes, I did.
Mr. HENN—Why substance is substance, and it is so plain a And that is the fact ?—Yes ; almost all reporters find dim'
word that it could not be made plainer.—( Laughter. ) Did cuity in following Mr. O'Connell.
you give the sonsub?stance?—l gave the substance, or meaning of Nvr o the Donnybrook meeting was perfectly quiet and
the observati
e a eeable ? It was.
Of all the observations ? Oh, no. peaceable?—lt
it not so at the Clifden meeting ?—lt was.
What then ?--1 he discussions of these topics might have was
as it not so at Leughrea ?—lt was.
occupied twenty sentence, •; but those twenty sentence, might Was it not so at Mullaghmast?—lt was.
contain but one idea, sod I only put down the idea.—( A 14410 And at Clifden you saw men corning on horses, with theu
W hat are the topical note,? —The substance of the obeerva- wives behind them ?—(Laughter. —I cid. •
lions made on the vapour topics allud, d to. And numbers of the
cavalry witho)ut any saddles or bridles'
, Now, Mr. liras, having escaped from the savages —(Loud (Laughter. ) —Yes.
A
slaughter)— on
and got back to Lrlen, you got courage to come You were not frightened ?—No, I was not frightened at
- i_
bark again ?-1 did not come back again. any of the meetings ; I knew that near any of the traversers
Why, you were only at Donny brook first ?—Oh, yes, I I
was sure to be sate, and I always kept near theme''' came back.
(Laughter. )
Were you not under the same alarm then, as at first ? Yes, Was it so wet at the Clifden meeting as to interfere with
I was ; 1 had experience of only one meeting tnere ; but it your reporting ?--No, we had an umbrella over us—still it WI
'was not in the neighbourhood of Dublin that I was afraid ; I unpleasant.
entertained apprehensions at first. Were you able to take notes fully ?—Pretty fully.
Were you then in the employment of the Chronicle ?—No. But only " pretty" fully ?—Yes.
Did you come as a reporter for Government?—No, 1 came Did you at end the meeting of the Repeal Association et] the
as a reporter for the Standard. 4th of September ? Yes, I (lid.
Not on the part of the Government ?—Yes, on the part of There used to be a great number of persons besides al
the Government also.
traversers at the meeting of the Association—used there not
Who recommended you to the Standard?—Myself. —Yes, there used.
Were you known before ?—Every person connected with the The room was very large in which the Association bad to
press knew me in London.
meet?—Yes, it was; I think it would, probably, held as maul
You know Mr. Bond Hughes, then ?se-Isits. I, have not the as this rain. ' '''' '-' ' ' '-''' ' ''-- ' "-` ^ ' '
'pleasure tilkieWrig-Sli:lfirglie4. —4" 4' - "' 4 '44- Used large numbers to attend the meetings and the dinner!
Did you see him here ?—Yes.
He knows you ?-onl7 by reputation. in the country ?—Yes, the dinners and meetings were very DI
Your reputation recommended you to the Standard 9-.-1 did merously attended. Answer me this question, Sir, if you please—Did you at sot
not say itein that way, but 1 believe it was my reputation that of those meetings see any of the traversers do any' act inconsis
recommended me. tent with the duty of a peaceable citizen?—Do any act? Yes'a
Having been thus recommended to the Standard, you came Was there any tendency to a breach of the peace at any °,13,-,
here on the part of the Standard and the Government, and of these meetings ?—No, there was not ; I attended the rtreetl°6
with that intention you attended several meetings of the Asso- of the 4th September at the Corn Exchange.
ciation ?—I did. Mr. Herne, after cross-examining the witness at greati,
Now, you will tell me how you got access to the Association. length, in reference to his connexion with the CarliP_
Was it your reputation introduced you there ?—No, it was either Patriot, and the protest put forward in that paper, whilst bl
the gentleman who went with me to Donnybrook, or another was editor, against the examination of reporters, proceeded
gentleman from the same establishment. to ask him several questions, on the subject of a speech of
—Yes. you tell him you were connected with the Standard ? Mr. O'Connell, made at a meeting of the Association, der
icc
—Yes.
ing the course of which he read a letter from Dund d
And with the Government?—No, I did not want to tell him respecting Ribbonism. The witness declared that he 131
that I was connected with the Government. taken no note. He was cross-examined in reference to ,
You saw Sir. Hughes ; did he knew you personally ?—Yes ; speech of Dr. Gray, delivered in the Association on the 27th'
he was, lam told, in my company about seven years ago at an and a speech of Mr. O'Connell, in moving the insertion da
entertainment given to a gentleman. the minutes of a letter from Mr. Napes, of Lougherews Iti 1 Did you send reports to the Chronicle ?—I sent reports of a letter from Lord Londonderry. Mr. O'Connell on that
three public meetings to the Chronicle. occasion denounced in strong and emphatic
Wig's!,,
When you came here, did you come for the Standard and the conduct of Mr. Conner, in attempting to give non .
Chronicle and the Government 2—Yes.
of a motion for the non-payment of rent, and moved that 10
Did you ;end reports to the Standard, Chronicle, and Go• name should beexpunged from the list of members, which 03°.
vernment ?—I did to the Standard and Chronicle, but not to lion was carried unanimously.
the Government. I wrote the report out here.
Did you not transmit reports to London?—Yea, Mr. HENN here closed his cross-examination.
Standard and Chronicle. to the By Judge PERRIN—Did not send the report of the DoooY'
The Standard is a Government paper?—l never disclosed brook meeting to any newspaper ;it was very late at the time'
cross_examined by Mr. H aTcsrEee—Saw Mr. Hay at Mu
. • de.
the fact that I was here on the part of the Government until highmast, on the scaffold, and spoke to him there; came
,__
last night.
rect from London in August, by railway; took a strong jaw:
May be you stated that you had come here for the Chronicle rest in the Cumberland election of 1837; knows Sir Jame-
alone ?—Oh ! is it I? 1 never stated a falsehood ;n my life, Graham.
and it is too late now to begin. 1 did not state at all that I Mr. HATCHELL—Had
in
mes Graham June last?
came here on the part of the Government. There is one with
Ja
whom lam connected-1 mean my wife—whose wishes and
The ATToRNET-GENERAL objected, and the Court rule
feelings I always consult—(Much laughter among the ladies in that the question could not be put.
the gallery, and the persons in the body of the Courtj—and Sr. HATI'HELL—You may go down.
she was averse to my coming here as a Government reporter. The Court adjourned to ten o'clock (punctually) to.inur*
I had my own feelings, too, on the matter. An artist of re- row morning.
putation, who had been asked to exhibit, in Dublin, a picture
containing portraits of celebrated Englishmen, had refused to
do so; and when a gentleman, such as he, entertained appre-
hensions on the matter, some allowance must be made for my
having a reluctance to state why I came.
Well, then, I take it for granted that yen would not under-
take the business for 50,000/. ? You (lid not communicate the
matter to the Morning Chronicle?—No.
Now, Sir. Riiss, you attended at Loughrea, Clifden, and
Mullaghmast meetings. Did you send reports of the proceed-
ings at each to she Chronicle ? I did not send the report of
the Mullaemast meeting to the Chronicle.
You are acquainted with the prisons who represented the
Chronicle there ?—Yes.
Had you any communication with him at that meeting ?
Yes; he was close to me.
Oh ! then, you know Mr. Geary ?—Yes.
You at e quite sure you did not send that meeting to the
Chronicle 2—Yes.
Did the Chronicle pay you for that meeting ? The Chronicle
paid me only for what I sent.
Did you charge them anything for the Mullaghmast meeting?
—Yes, I did.—(lndications of surprise in the Court.)
How much did you charge for sending them nothing ?—Oh,
they got the Mullaghmast meeting.
Gear. then (lid the whole of the meeting, but you charged
for it, anti got the money ?—No.
What !—Allow me to explain (witness, turning to the

SIXTH DAY—BY EXPRESS.
SATURDAY, JAN. 20.
The Judges sat at ten o'clock precisely, at which hour the
traversers were in attendance.
The jury having been called over, the evidence for the
Crown was resumed.
The first witness called was Mr. John Jackson, the Irish
correspondent of the Morning Herald, who, having been swortil'
was examined by Mr. BREWSTER, Q. C., and deposed as
,tl.°o;
logs:—I ass connected with the press—with 'the Lon Morning Herald. lam the Irish correspondent of that Paper,
and was so in the course of last summer and last autumnt n
attended at the meetings of the Repeal Association. I Was is
the habit of transmitting regularly to London by the post re.
ports of what took place at those meetings.
Mr. BREWSTER—My Lords, I wish to apprise you that it
is not my intention to make this gentleman go over all ~,,
s:;ceches which the Court has already heard. I will cow::
myself almost exclusively to asking him who took pare at LP'
meetings. Take these dccumelits in your hand, Mr. JacksOth
and see whether they are the original notes which you sent t°
London?—Yes, they are.
Is this paper which 1 now hand you your report of the :nee'.
ing that was held on the 30th of May last ?—lt is.
I wish you to look to page 3of that report.—l are it.

nots
. ....
._ Jo you see in these notes a report of a speech made ur
Ir. _ENN-Were you much (Figment,' at the idea of bench, said)-I regret I must state those circumstances, but that occasion by :Mr. O'Connell ?-Ye I do.
coming over?-Yes, I was frightened a little. lam compelled to explain. This, gentleman, Mr. (scary, Read the first few liees. -The witness proceeded to 04
the report. which commenced by noticing the fact of :If;
Mr. He N N_lsuppose you found the alarm false?-Why, yes. wanted some money to enable him to go to those meetings, in
O'Connell's having directed the atteution of the Assoeiatio
,_e
Mr. HEN N-I suppose you were paid fairly for coining over 7 order to send. reports to London. I advanced him money
.on
several occasions for that purpose. On this occasion, being a, error ,
Yes, I got 3501.
which appeared in the report of the proceedings of ,=_,
Mr. lIENN-Altogether do you mean? I got 501. for the run a little short, I wanted some money myself, and he could Longford Repeal meeting, which had been published in °
Donnybrook, and 350/ for attending all other meetings, and up get no supply of money from London, and he therefore pro- Freeman's Journal of the same date. In that he 'cal
nmy msde to apply ' report
0'
to the next session of Parliament. posed that the Mullaghmast meeting should be sent over i
the phrase "ruffian soldiery" to the arra),
hid
Mr. lIENN-You have fount it a profitable speculation, name, as I should be sure to get paid for it.
Great Britain ; but he begged leave to state that he ne j
Did you get the money from the Chronicle for that meeting ?
then ?-Yes, I have.
used any such expression. 'She circumstance to which he ini.
Mr. HENN-Have you ever made as much money in as short -I did, but I gave it to him.
alluded in his Longford speech had reference to the pathet.iee
a time before?-No, I have not ; I have sometimes done very Having attended at those monster meetings here, may 1 ask ballad of " Aileen Aroon." He (Mr. O'C. ) then proceeded 1"
you whether you have ever, in the course of your duties in
well, sometimes not.
his customary strain to -(Laughter.)
Mr. HENN-Have you ever taken the benefit of the Insolvent England, attended at any of the great public meetings there ?- er t 3
alr• I3REWSTE R-That will do.
Act ?-I have once. Not at many, but at some of them.
Go to page 6 now and read from that ; I believe you b......al
Mr. HENN-Only once ! when was that? I was arrested on At any of they Anti- Cornslaw League meetings?-No, I not seen those manuscripts since you sent them to London ?
the 25th of June, and my petition was heard on the lath of never reported an of them.
only got them from Mr. Kemmis to initial.
6 st
July, I think ;it was some time before I cams over. Don't you think it very wrong that a reporter should be Take that document, and refer to the meeting of June
Mr. HENN-You have stated that the employment you have called upon to give evidence ?-No, certainly not. I think the Association. I should observe, my Lords, that this ge,""
undertaken was suggested to you by some person on behalf of a reporter should obey the law of the country ; and I tlernan's evidence applies only to the meetings of the Assoelly
the Government-who was that person ?
never heard that uestioned until I heard it by some gentlemen tion at the Corn Exchange, and nothing else.
Sergeant WARREN-I object to his answering that question. here. 'Tis preposterous.-(Laughter.)
in this
Mr. lIENen-I have a right to test the accuracy of the witness You were not always merely a reporter ?-No. Look to page 1, and see which of the traverser, were at that
way.
You were, I believe, an editor ?-I was. meeting ?-Daniel O'Connell.
Looklir
sergeantWAaneN-Thisprinciple wasdecided in Hardy's case, Were you the editor of a newspaper called the Carlisle
-Yes, the Member for Kilkenny, Mr, John O'Conce the"
and Lord Erskine distinctly laid it down that a witness em- Patriot ?-I was. there to page 6, and see if there were any others of
ployed by Government is not obliged to disclose the name of his About what time?-In the years 1837, 1838, and 1839. I.llr. Barrett, of the Pilot, and Mr. Steele. Go back to page 6, and read a portion of Mr. O'Conetell'l
employer, and Lord Chief Justice Eyre also said that though in What were the politics of that paper ?-Conservative. speech. - Witness, reading, "He (Mr. O'Connell) Itsesese
general a witness may be asked such a question, yet the secrets Are those your own politics?-They are.
yesterday amid the scenes of Saxon cruelty, and the sangum%
of the Government ought not to be laid open unless in an ex- Were they always so ?-Not always.
Cromwellian, cold-blooded butcheries, commencing with. 1,110
teems case. In Philips on Evidence, the doctrine was also For the last ten years ?-The title has not existed for ten murder of Sir Charles Astley." (Mr. O'Connell correcting t'
stated. Mr. Philips says that though under ordinary circum- years.
witness, " Askell"), Sir Charles Askell, and ending with the
stances the credit of a witness may be tested in this way, yet But the principles might ?-True enough.
little drum boy.
Why, Now turn to where he announces the meetings he has fixendf
witnesses will not be permitted always to disclose the What were you before you became a Conservative ?-
names of their employers, and it was not proper to inquire if I might define it--
to come off, lied read.-" I will be at Kilkenny on the Bth
,-„,
what officer under the Government hid induced a witness I only ask you to name it ?-Why, I might answer that June ;at Mallow on the 11 th ;at Murroe or Abingdon one!"
to come forward. He quoted this from the Ist volume of if I may define them-
13th ; at Ennis on the 15th ; at Athlone on the 18th ; at 1°1;
Philips on Evidence. In another case Mr. Gibbs had asked a "In moderation placing all my glory, niskillen on the 21st."-(Mr. O'Connell, " Oh, oh," I°.
witness under cross-examination-How came you to go ?By The Tories call me Whig-the Whigs a Tory." laughter.) thew iiness again corrected himself Ennistysrs°°'
whom were you sent ? The witness replied_lf it be a fair been complained of (said the witness) by some of my own at Galway on the loth ;at Dundalk on the 29th.
the
question I will answer. Chief Justice Eyre said-If you family, who are strong Liberals, for being a 'auk Tory ; arid I Did Sir. Steele snake a speech at the meeting ?-Yes ;
choose to answer the question you may; bet I will not insist have been condemned by some of my Tory friends for being Steele came forward amidst great cheering, and said than 0
upon it. The then Attorney. General said, Ido not think the too much of a Liberal.- ( Great laughter.) I had received a letter, stating that the Glasgow Re peelers Vero
examination should be permitted to go on where the delicacy of And perhaps, both were right ?-Perhaps so. I can only Ito hold a banquet on the 29th ; and Mr. O'Connell handeei t,
the witness is interfered with. Mr. Gibb 3-1 don't see arrive at a mean by the asset lion of opposites.-(Laughter. ) , a sovereign from an Englishman, who blushed for the LT°
where the delicacy is. Lord Chief Justice Eyre--I do not lam glad you came over tu Ireland to enslighten us ! When t mere by his countrymen of the noblest race ir, the world. A,
think it proper to press this witeess to answer. The nature you edited the Carlisle paper you had re, objection to tell me i Mr. HATCH ti.L. asked if this meeting was set forth ire 1"
of the connexion between the parties ought not to be dis- what denomination of politics you belonged to?-The title bill of partiuulars?
closed here ; and Mr. Gibbs then added-I win not press the existed at the time, designating a body of men who enter- Mr. lintEwsrEit said all the meetings' were set forth id it'
q stion In Monaghan's case there was also an objection. Mr. tainted opinions in reference to 'mien, affairs, in which, gene- , but he would now turn to that of the 4th of July.
Erskine'sue' question went to test the credit of the witness ; but ' rally I concurred with them. If you ask me what I was before Mr. Forso made an observation, which was inaudible ies the
Lord Chief Justice Eyre held it was a most important rule fur that, I should say, a moderate Whig before the Reform Bill gallery.
re
the public that the nannies of persons were not to be disclosed, passed.
Mr. BREWSTER should not tell the jury that, because, there
unless they were material to the case. He referred to pages Never had a touch of the Radical about you ?-Never ; I was no such meeting. It was struck out. ( Handing wiitne4
807 and 823. When Mr. Erskine wished to examine a wit-
;had the same feeling as all young men in favor ot Liberia in- enother document), Look to page 1, and tell me which of lilj
ness as to information obtained from a particular quarter, and. stitufions, end I trust I shall always entertain it. !reversers you find attending that meeting ?-Mr. Daniel 11°
asked if the information came from a man or woman, the Mr. HENN-And I hepe yet, may inspire the Government Mr. John O'Connell, Mr. Steele, and Mr. Hay.
Chief Justice would not allow the disclosure to be made. The with a similar feeling.
Go to page 7, and say if there was any money received theca
Ames
rule was clearly laid down in Philips's Law of Evidence. NVitness-I don't think it at all necessary.
from America ?-Yes, several sums were. handed in from Ael-e
Mr. HENN, Q. C.-There is a manifest distinction between ,W. re any of the members of the ',resent Gevernment con- rice. 3lr. Duffy and Mr. John O'Connell were present at 111‘
the principle here, and that relied on by the Crown-between fleeted with that Carlisle paper ?--Not that I know of.
1 °'
meeting which took place on the sth on July. I see page so
questions arising out of cross-examination and front the direct. ' You clen't know who the proprietors were while you were toy notes of that meeting ; Mr. O'Connell said he wished
„.
This is a questions arising from the direct examination, and I t editer ?-No, not one of them (after a pause), except from their call the attention of the meeting to two points ; he had
another
was rather surprised to hear it asked in a leadine form, " Was own statement.
eeived a letter tram a person in Sligo which inclosed anot;,
it not suggested to you on the past of the Government ?" and Do you remember a prosecution of a person named Taylor at letter from a discharged soldier, who stated that he stsseese ,i,
the witness answered in the affirmative. lam now testing his Carlisle-Dr. Taylor-and giving evidence on that oceasion ? ploy ed by O'Connell to drill the peasantry. He (Mr. 0%0%,
credit, and how can I test the accuracy of his anseer unless al- i -No, I do not.
bell) then called the attention of the meeting to the Ilibb,°es
lowed to ask the question?
You do not. Is that your answer ?-Why, if I gave any conspiracy which existed in the north, and said it was origins ke
Chief Justice PENNEEATHER-The Court are of opinion evidence, or answered any questions, it must have been about by the Chartists in Scotland. He (Mr. O'Connell) spOtrf
the distinction taken by you Mr. Henn, makes no difference ; . some very ueimportant matter, fur I don't recollect it.
',se about Lord Cloneartby who attempted to prevent his ten°
Very likely : I suppose it was a topical note you took of it as from going to a Repeal meeting.
the protection must be upheld.
Mr. HENN then proceeded with the cress-examination-You ' ,ou didn't consider it material?-1 took no note: at all. It ft re"
Was Mr. Ray, the secretary at that meeting ?-I don f
had a communications with a person big}, in office?-Yes. was just an examination before magistrates.
O that. The witness proceeded to read an abstract °,4
Shortly before you came from England, were you in connexion I Fee your recollectien is reviving. Now, I again ask ou Sir. O'Connell's speech in which he alluded to the Marquisvg
were you riot examined before the Magistrates ?-1 don't re-with any newspaper ?-Yes, the Morning Chronicle.
How long in connexion with that paper?-About a collect that I was, Duwnshire, who endeavoured to prevent his tenants from glie
to a Repeal meeting or joining the Repeal Aesociation•
oe,
year.
Did not you protest, upon the high authority of a reporter, (Mr. O'Connell) also read a letter from America on that ell
that you should not be called upon to give evidence ?__Wisness casion. I see page 4 of my notes where Mr. O'Conn-
Does it support the present Government ?-No.
t the
Were you in connexion with any other paper ?-Not at that (apparently astonished), Oh, certainly not. moved that the letter be inserted on the minutes, and the ,10
.
time.
Are you sure of that ?-sure of if ! I „over did any such thanks of the Association be conveyed to the writers. or
Were you at any other time ?-Yes ; the Times. Arc
in my life.
poi
(Mr. O'Connell) said there were allusions in the rip,
When did your connexion with the Times cease . In 1836: Did you take any active part at elections in England ?-No. which came well from America, as the tone of it was
or_
When with the Morning Chronicle 9-After the last session Not at all ?-No.
sponsive to liberty. The witness continued to read a sltto
of Parliament.
Did you always confine yourself to the mere drudgery of re- tion of the speech made by Alr. O'Connell. Be i the
Since then, have you been engaged by any other paper ?- porting. -When?
O'Cdimell) concluded by moving " that the thank, ° ow
Yes ; by the Standard.
During the course of your connexion with the press ?-No. I meeting be sent to the subscribers in America." The ly.
Then, when you came here in July were you not connected have occasionally written articles.
with the Morning Chronicle ?-Yes ; I wish to state the tion was seconded by Mr. Steele, and passed unaniV:'-uise.
Did you ever write an election squib ?-Not that I am I see page 10 of my notes, and observe a portiren of tfe,
reasons why I came.
aware. If you will show anything of the kind l'll tell you im- O'Contiell's speech ; the notes are not in shoei-handn 4;00,
Mr. HENN-You have already given 330 substantial ones for snediately.
' John O'Connell read a letter on that day from Wiltni of
coming.-(Laughter.)
Do you remember an election at Carlisle ?-Yes, , Delaware, which letter contained subscriptions ; a voten to
Witness-If I had not come as a newspaper reporter, I would Do you remember a Alt. Wentworth standing as a eandi- thanks was passed to the subscribers. The witness went °
„ell
not come for anything.
date ?-"-No.
read portions of Mr. O'Connell's speech. Mr. O'Cina"riye
Would you not come forward for 100,000/. ?-Oh I I might You do notl-I do not, ' said the people ought to avoid the example of 1798, and any'
-(Laughter) for 75,000/.
Mr. HENN (handed up an election placard to witness)-Do - thing like it, as it was by such means the Union was carried'
Ca,
Why, would it be so hard to tempt you?-I was led to ap. . you remember that placard ?-No. tHe did not forget the language used by Members of thet peel
prebend some damage.
Do you remember the name of the candidate whose name is binet ; Wellington, in the House of Lord,, and Sir Robert.
civil
Well, now that you have come over, would you entertain the to it?-No, Ido not. I never saw or heard his name before, 'in the House of Commons, had the audacity to speak " they
same apprehension ?-Now that I have seen how things are Were you connected with the public press in 1841 -Yes; war, but that would check the march of Repeal. Whe.nand if
carried on, I would not have the same apprehension.
I W 5.3 connected with the London press. spoke of civil war, let them look beyond the Atlantic they
Having been deputed by some one high in office, and while And do you tell me that you, who were connected with a the people were attacked they had the consolation to feel,o,
in the employment of the Morntng Chronkie,
you came to London newspaper in 1841 did not hear of a contested dee- would not stand alone, but the people of Ireland looked t° j' to)
Iceland -Yes.
. tion in Carlisle at that period 7-1 tell you again I never heard and under his advice they would never commence, but "
Well, to whom did you apply on your :mini ? Ycru came .of rho names Were. i they was, attaiiked.