The Sun.
London, England, 1844-01-24 00:00:00

—No, except such words as are usually omitted by short-hand
writers, the connecting parts.
Mr. Tomb—State what the Rev. Mr. O'Rafferty said on
that occasion. .

Witness proceeded to read the speech, the following being
extracts from it :—Dr. O'Rafferty said—" Fellow-country-
men and brother repealers, the regenerator and liberator of his
country had arrived amongst them for the purpose of paying
them a visit. The Liberator had come amongst them for the
first time. It would not be saying too mu h for the people
of that part of the country, when he stated that they would
support that great man ( O'Connell) in the struggle he was
making for the regeneration of his native land; they were too
long trodden under foot by the Saxon. The great man who had
come amongst them would then address the meeting, and would
tell them of the blessing that would result from the repeal of
the union. It would bring blessings on the country, which
Mr. O'Connell himself only could tell them of." That
is all I took of the speech. The Rev. Mr. Flanagan
addressed the meeting also, but very shortly. The Rev. Mr.
Spain spoke at that meeting. He said, "It was a glorious
day for the King's County : they had a few short months ago
another meeting in another part of the county, at Birr, when
Ireland showed her moral strength, and she should again be a
nation." The speaker then read a resolution which he said
was put into his hand. The Rev. Gentleman continued to
say, that "he did not see why English gentlemen of liberal
minds were for continuing the Union, because it benefited
England, but it was an injury to Ireland." The Rev. Mr.
Nolan, of Dunkerrin, also spoke at the meeting, and begged
leave to move a petition for a Repeal ofthe Union. The Rev.
Mr. Kearney spoke at the meeting, and said, "I hold in my
hand a resolution." He then read the resolution, and conti-
nued—" They should persevere in the agitation set on foot
by the great Liberator of his country—they had only to per-
severe in the struggle to make the country prosperous and
happy, for—
" Freedom's battle once begun,
• Though baffled oft, is ever won."
Mr. O'Connell called for three cheers for the Queen. The
Rev. Gentleman said he was sure the Queen would be de-
lighted to kick Peel out of office some fine morning. The
Liberator was the advocate of his country's wrongs.
Mr. Tomb—What took place after that?—The people
shouted out " Repeal, Repeal, Repeal."
Mr. Tomb—Come to the speech of Mr. O'Connell.—(The
witness turned to his notes.) Mr. O'Connell said he rose to
address them on a new topic, which he had scarcely touched on
before. He announced to them the certainty of carrying the
Repeal, and that walling could benefit Ireland except the re-
storation of her own Parliament. They had only to persevere
in their peaceful struggle, and they would carry it as sure as
the sun that shone over them. When he ( Mr. O'Connell)
was a counsel practising at the bar, he always liked to prove
his own case out of the witnesses' mouths who were produced
against him.
The Attorney-General here rose and said he had no wish,
nor did he express such a wish as to compel the traversers to
remain in Court each during the trials. He had not the
least objection to their leaving Court, provided it was under-
stood twat they remained in the precincts of the Court ; but
he was just informed that two of the traversers had lett the
Court; in order to attend a meeting elsewhere, and this was
what he could not consent to. Unless they were at once
sent for and remained in the precincts of the Court, he would
feel it to be his duty to have them called on their reeogni-
zances.

Mr. Moore—They shall be sent. for immediately.
The w its less then p. oceeded with Mr. O'Connell's speech— The
present Administration have proved by their conduct that Repeal
is inevitable. They have threatened to put us down by
force ; but they had not the power to carry their unconsti-
tutiooal threats into executisn. When three millions of peo-
ple nemanded Repeal up starts the Iron Duke and threatens
a ci,il war. Ile threatened to unloose the dogs of war
to put down Repeal.—( A voice, `° Never.") Never be ore
were a Ministry so bewildered. Peel went into the House of
Commons, and took the Queen's name in vain. He said the
Queen had pledged herself to preserve the Union inviolate; but
I told him in the strongest language I could with propriety use,
that he lied, that the words were his own and not the Queen's.
I stated that we had broken no law, and that we stood upon our
constitutional rights—that we would break no law, but we
woulu persevere, despite of threats, in our peaceable struggle.
This declaration had its effect, and the idea of coercion was
given up. The Times newspaper announced the other day
that the Ministry had spent a whole ten hours deliberat-
ing upon the state of Ireland—that they had come to
conclusions with regard to her grievances—but that the
Irish should be cut. down. But I announce my defiance—
the people have broken no law—they have offended no man—
, but, if they are attacked, they will defend themselves. No
breach of the peace shall be committed by the people of Ireland.
They will give no excuse for the use of force against them ; and
thus they will embarrass their enemies. It the Government
attempts to bring in a Coercion Bill I will take -My peace-in the
House of Commons, though much I dislike it—l will move
amendment after amendment upon every clause of the Bill, and I
will keep them two years before they can pass it. This is my
answer to their threat of a gagging bill. The House of Com-
mons deliberated for six days upon Mr. Smith O'Brien's motion
for a committee on the state of Ireland. The grievances of this
country are admitted ; but there was no intention of applying a
remedy to them. Peel has admitted these gi ievances. Whig and
Tory—both sides of the House—admit that such an incubus as the
Established Church cannot continue. -Why should the ma-
jority of the people support a church establishment for the use
of a small minority? A man should pay his priest or parson as
he pays his doctor or tailor ; and no man should pay any doctor
or tailor but his own. The object for which the Church tempo-
ralities were originally given was for Catholic purposes, for the
repair of places of worship, the support of the poor, and masses
for the dead, and a new appropriation of them is now called.
No one defends these things now, and who may you thank for
that ? Why, the Repeal Association. I will never cease
agitating till these grievances are redressed. The Estab-
lished Church cannot continue in possession of its huge
temporalities. I will respect all the vested rights of those
persons now in possession of them. That can now be
done ; but it cannot be done afterwards. Captain Rous
and Lord John Manners have admitted' that these grievances
cannot continue. Peel admits that the landlords of Ireland
have acted tyrannically. The people have suffered oppression
for centuries ; kat the day of retribution is comi.,g, and justice
will be done to all, aria Protestant ascendancy be trampled
under foot for ever. We only looked for equality when we
sought for emancipation, and Peel said it should never be
granted, yet he was the first to concede it. Emancipation
only served the rich, but Repeal will serve the poor : it
will bring three hundred thousand pounds asyear into this
country alone. I call upon the Irish landlords to unite
with me ; they will be benefited by Repeal; it will
put an end to the unhousing of the poor. In these
results her affections were centered, yet her tears
were disregarded, and despite her remonstrances the ruthless
fiat went forth to .puli down the house. There were whole-
sale murders on the one side, and assassinations on the other,
both disastrous to the persons against whom they were perpe-
trated. All persons agree that something must be done. Why
not do it at once ? I propose doing it by the repeal. Mr.
Robinson has a plan of his own. lam for mine. My plan is,
that no landlord should receive rent unless he gives a lease.
Like the payment of the clergy, no penny no paternoster—no
lease no rent. The lease ought to be for twenty-one years, and
the tenant have the right to go before the assistant-barrister if
the rent.was too high. At present no one pan register unless
he can swear that he can get 10/. above rent and taxes. I
want that the tenant shall have power to register his improve-
ments the same way as he is entitled to register his trees, and
the landlord bound to renew his lease, or pay for the improve-
ments. And from this spot—nearly the centre of Ireland—l
call on the landlords to join me ; then they would receive more
He cautioned the
in respect than they now do in money. Property has its rights,
people against Rib-
and shall continue to have them. It has also its duties, and
if any one sought to induce them to be-
come Ribbonmen, to deliver him up to justiee. Let any one
bmounsits
mp e. rafno
dr perform
begged,th e rn
who will do so hold up his hand.
The jury here retired for refreshment.
the examination of Air. M*Namara was resumed :—The meet-
ing After a lapse
was held on Sunday, Witness could not say how many
were present.
more. I saw flags and banners flying at the meeting, and
others in various parts of the town. 1 have no recollection
of the inscriptions on those flags and banners that were carried,
but I remember some of the inscriptions on these in the town.
One was— Ito fwfiafsteehneldmif

" See the conquering hero comes."
Another was—
" Grieve for the man with soul so dead,
Who never to himself hath said_
This is my own—my native land."
Another banner had these words—.
" Ireland, her Parliament, or the world in a blaze."
Ido not understand Irish, hut I think it was " cead mille
ailthe" that was on:another banner. The meeting was over about
five o'clock.
Cross-examined by Mr. Ilatchell--i was on the platfcrm.
There were other reporters there, and no obstruction to my
There were children there also, and so
taking notes. Those people I saw seemed as if coming to a
*the persons was concerned, everything
ployed to Cap to the meeting.
market. There were females mixed through the men—( Laugh-
tain Despard.
wasft
ae rrA)ai men—(Laugh-
ter)—or
e.
theoat
ire among
eaatebeG
hl
need.
iui
_et
Ith
Bevvryaf
sw
eh
mo
rn
?—By
Mr. Tomb—Do not answer that question.
Mr. Ilatchell—Were you there on the part of the Go-
vernment ?
The Chief Justice—You cannot ask that question.
I.llr. Hatched—A similar question was answered by Bond
Hughes the other day.
The Chief Justice—The question was raised and argued.

Mr. Hatehell—Yes, your 'Lordship ruled that.
Examination resumed—l did not go to the meeting as re-
porter on the part of the Liberal papers. I did not go on the
part of the newspapers at all. I was not paid for my reports,
and I very much fear I shall not.
Mr. Hatehell—l do not participate with you in your terrors.
Witness—l did not transcribe my notes till six days after the
meeting. I made out my repurt at home. I live in Trim. An
application was made for my report at my house on the evening
of the meeting, but 1 was not then at home.
• Mr. Hatchell—Then ycu did not go home when the meeting
broke up ?—I did.
How long did you remain at home ?—Two days. I arrived
on Monday morning, and remained till Wednesday. I had my
short-hand notes with me.
Were they in a book 2—No, they were on slips of paper.
Were they connected with a thread, or pin, or how ?—They
were not.

They were scattered loose slips of paper ?--They were.
Did you understand when you went to take that note that
you were to be paid for it ?—Certainly. The price was not
agreed upon. I had not been connected with a newspaper
for a year before, but I kept myself in practice by reporting
at the assizes, though I did not transcribe my notes. I was
not written to for my reports, but I made it out because I
knew I should be asked for it. • This meeting was on the I tith
of July. I had my note perfectly transcribed, ready for de-
livery, in about six days after the meeting, but I cannot be
positive. I cannot swear how long. it took me to prepare the
report. It was to be paid by the Job. I never was paid by
the line.

Mr. Hatehell—Did you transmit them as soon as you trans-
cribed them ?-_I did not transmit them at all.
Were they applied tor, or did you transmit them voluntarily?
—I heard they were applied for at my house.
Was the message in writing?—lt was.. I was told the day
after I came home that if a report was not sent by that evening
it would be too late.
Did you conceive that it was too late after getting that mes-
sage ?—Yes.
And still you transcribed your notes? Now, you told me
that short-hand'writers do not voluntarily undergo the trouble
of transcribing their notes, unless they are to be paid for them?
—Oh, I thought it was not t,,0 late, and that they might have
said that to hurry ris.
You did not believe them, then ? But did not you say, on
your oath, that it was too late ?—I said I believed it was too late.
And, now, you cannot say how long you took to transcribe
your notes ?—I cannot. I thought it was possible that I
might be examined touching those notes. I did not think it
probable, as so many former meetings were passed over where
strong language had been used.
Mr. Hatchell—But after you finished your notes, how did
you send them ?—I did not send them at all.
Well, I must be very general with you, you are such a
special pleader.
.flow did they_get oat of your possession?-
1 gave them to my brother-in-law to read.
Auil to return them to you ?—Yes. •
But, he did not ?--A:/h, yes, he did. • • •
Well, having got them back into your possession, how did
they get out of it again ?—He called on me again for them, to