The Sun.
London, England, 1850-08-01 00:00:00

AUSTRALIAN COLONIES.

Mr. F. SCOTT wished to know from the Under-Se-
cretary of State for the Colonial D,partment, whether
the Colonial-office had received a memorial upon the
subject of the Australian Colonies Constitution Bill, ex-
pressing opinions favourable to a double chamber, and
also the land question?
Mr. HAWES said that no such memorial is had been
alluded to by the Ilon. Member had been received at the
Colonial-offic-. When it was, it woull be laid on the
table of the House.
SITTING ON SATURDAY.

Lord J. RUSSELL said teat it might be convenient
to Hon. Members to knew that it had been thought
nucessary that the House should sit on Saturday, not
for the purpose of proceeding with aay measures that
were calculated to create discussion, but merely to for-
ward measures which pressed.
AUSTRALIAN COLONIES GOVERNMENT
BILL.

On the motion for the consideration of the Lords'
amendments to the Australian Colonies Government Bill,
Mr. F. SCOTT wished to know whether it was the
infection of the Government to agree with allj the
amendments made by the Lords to this Bill, because
if they did, he believed they would agree to a measure
which was never intended to become law, and one that
would be very different from that which had passed the
House of Commous. The Bill as amended was not the
Bill that had he ea introduced into Parliament, and it
was not a measure that had received the concurrence of
the Australian colonies. Ile wi-bed to know whether it
was the intention of the Govertim«nt to persevere in the
passing of this Bill during the present session. Here
they were, nt almost the last week of the
session, and yet the measure that had been
adverted to in her Majesty's Speech at the com-
mencement of the session had not yet become law.
They had decided upon giving the Australian colonies
that which they did not ask for, and to refuse them that
which they did require. it svv.s not fair to the cole-
fiats to bring in this Bill at the fag end of the session,
and ask the Houle to pass it, when it might have been
taken into consideration at a much earlier period. The
Federative Assembly was to have bo power over the
land, though it was well known that the wishes of the
colonists were in fevonr of such power being given to it.
In consequence of the Government arrangements with
respect to the sale of land, cur surplus population, in-
stead of going to the Australian colonies, were induces'
to 6-migrate te North America and to the United States,
where they found the terms more advantageous. The
land was so badly reeulated in Australasia, that emi-
grants were driven from the neighbourhood of towns
and settlements to far &want portions of the country,
where they were beyond the control of the Government,
and were bound by no moral, civil, or religious obliga-
tions. Tnis accounted for the existence of states of society
in which the male population greatly predominated, and
which was characterised by the most immoral and depraved
habits. Another objection which he entertained to the
Bill was that it gave power to the Governor to alter the
various salaries contained in the schedule, and as he
might of his own accord diminish them in amount, the
consequence would be that if the judge of any colony
should do any act which was adverse to his wiehes, he
might be mulcted of a considerable portion of his income.
Nuw, this would enable the Governor to compel a judge
to give a decision eriverse to his honest opinions and
convictions, if it :should be r quire 1 for any particular
purpose or end. The Honourable Geetlemen stated, in
conclusion, that he eeuld Hot give• his assent to a
Bill which gave to Australia a form of government
that was not in accordance with the wishes of the co-
lonists, aed was nut calculated to cement that bond of
friendship and attachment to the mother country which
ought to exist.
Sir DE LACY EVANS said it was preposterous to
suppose that, ef-er this country had gone to great ex-
pense in maintaining her colonies, she should surrender
all claim to the different territories, and give, them np to
the present inhabitants. Although ho approved of the
Bill as a whole, be entertained objections to particular
puts of it—such, for instance, as the appointment of a
large Church establishment in the colony. He
thought the colony would get on extremely well,
in a religious ns well as in a moral sense,
without a > piritu:l establishment; but hardly a new set-
tlement with a few hundred inhabitants sprung up, be-
fore a bishop was appointed and sent out. Much of the
allowance provided for the Ecclesiastical establishments
of the colony might, therefore, he thought, be dispensed
with ; ut any rate. he hoped it would not be
augmented in proportion as the population increased.
But taking the measure altogether it was a very fair
end liberal one, and would have a very beneficial effect
upon the colony, end he was gratified to find that a direct
intimation was given t the colonists in the Bill to suggest
any alteration or modifications of it which they might
think necessary. On the whole he thought the Govern-
ment had acted right in not prematurely disposine of this
question, but leaving it to be eventually settled by the
colonists themselves.
Mr. VERNON SeIITH was not at a loss to form
an opinion as to whether or not the Govern-
ment intended to persevere with this Bill this
session. In the present state of the House they
could carry almost anything, and he could, therefore, not
hesitate in deciding that they intended to carry this
measure, but still before they proceeded further Go-
vernment ought to disclose what amendments of the
Lords they intended to reject and what agree to. The naa.j 0-
rity of the amendments improved the Bill. He agreed with
the amendment which struck out the clauses which were
proposed to establish a federal assembly in the colonies ;
and he should be glad to know if Government would
venture to go the tenth of re-introducing them. The
next amendment established a franchise for the
squatting interest, a prevision which he vainly
struggled for when the Bill was under discussion
and in its progress through this House. The next series
of alterifteens which had been made by the Lords
were far more extensive and far more objectionable. They
would restrict thetunctions of the co'onial legislature, end
continue• in the hands of the Colonial-office powers
which ought to be abandoned without delay.
The amendments would preclude the legislature of
the colony from altering the franchise, but he
did hope the House and toe . Government would not
assent to this alteration, while the clause which had
been introduced by the Lords in the room of the clause
giving this local legislature the power he had
referred to was calculated ito lead to doubt 'and
mystification es to its true and real meaning, audit ought
to be struck cut. The next alteration was of still greater
importance, it struck out the words which gave the
local council power to vary its forms and constitu-
tion, which he thought ought to be restored to
the Bill ; and he therefore hoped, for the sake
of keeping faith with the colonists themselves, the
would Government insist upon carrying that point. As
T).
,Ais was the last opportunity he should have of speaking
tie subject of this Bill, he must again repeat his
t that the measure had not been made more
-'••• iibet 1 and extensive.
•t JOHN RUSSELL should have stated ,in moving
•
$4,• option of the first amendment, tie coar,o
LA t.jk
• r.

which Government intended to pursue with respect to
the whole, but after what had occurred to-day, he could
not further delay making a declaration on the subject.
He agreed with the Reght Hon. Gentleman who had just
sat down that the greatest alteration which the Lords
had introduced was the omission of the clauses which
related to the establishment of a federal government.
Under all the circumstances, however, of the case, he
thought his Noble Friend at the head of the Colonial-
office had acted right in consenting to the omission of the
clauses. Many objections were urged against them, and
above all it was said if the colonists desired a
federal assembly, it could be hereafter allowed
by' the Legislature of the parent country On the
whole, therefore, Government was not indisposed to
adopt that amendment. The next alteration was the
introduction of words extending the franchise to squat-
ters. He would not say that this was an impolitic altera-
tion; perhaps it was only fair that the large body of
colonists who came under that denominatio❑ should
be represented in the local legislature—(Hear, hear)
—and Government did not therefore object to
this amendment. The next alteration deprived the
legislative council of power to make any change in its
forms and constitution. No doubt the giving that
power was one of the important objects of the Bill, but
not the object, and as much good would result from the
Bill, even us it now stood, particularly as it would
lead to the settlement of the important question
as to w nether it was advisable to give the colonies a
single or a double chamber, Government was generally
disposed to adopt most of the amendments proposed
by the Lords. With respect to the 32l clause of rte
Bill, it stood in feet and in substance as it was originally
sent from that House to the House of Lords. They
had reduced by one-half the amount of franchise, but
they had left to the colonies the power of altering the
qualification of the electors and the elected. They had
also left to them the power of altering the constituent
body, and also the power of introducing a division
of the legislative body into two chambers, and the mode
in which these two chambers should act. But there had
been a change made, under which be did not think it
would be in the power of the legislative council to pass
an Act by which the whole body of the single chamber
could be elected, and no one member of which could be
nominated by the Crown. Ile did not think it
would be in the power of the council to
alter the proportions of its members, however they
might after the qualification of the electors, and al-
though they might divide the present legislative council
into two chambers, they would not have the power of
saying there should be a single elective chamber, and
that the nominees of the Crown should be altogether
excluded from that second chamber. On that subject
he should certainly have been disposed to say that if
such an alteration had been proposed by the legislative
council of New South Wales, although. it was a
matter for their discussion and deliberation, he
should have felt very great objection to such an altera-
tion. He therefore felt the less objection to the altera-
tion which bad been proposed. He certainly thought
there were advantages in leaving the whole subject to
the legislative council, but if there was anything on
which the House ought to place a restriction, he thought
it was the power of altering the legislative council into
one legislative body. He therefore concurred in the
general policy of the amendments made by the House of
Lords, and he considered that this Bill upon the whole
would be a very great benefit to the Australian colonies.
Mr. GLADSTONE said the Bill before the House, in
his mind, was not a satisfactory Bill in its principle. No
doubt it had some advantages to recommend it; but in
his opinion a matter of the most crying necessity, that
of the separation of the colony of Port Philip from
New South Wales, should be accomplished. He thought
the House would have acted more wisely in seeking to
pass a perfect measure on this subject in the next ses-
sion, when they would be in possession of more infor-
mation from the colonies, than in gassing an imperfect
one at the end of the present session. The point in
which the Bill was not satisfactory lay in the third
amendment °tithe House of Lords, which took away the
power of the legislative council in the colonies of
altering the composition of the council.—(Hear,
hear.) The power of altering the consitution of
the council, and of affecting the balance of power as it
was fixed by the Bill between the Crown and the popular
body, was altogether taken away. The Government had
forgotten throughout ail those discussions that unhappily
of all the changes which a single chamber was likely to
make, that of separating itself iota two chambers
was the least likely, because it cut directly at
the pride and vanity of the parties most directly
interested in making it.—(Hear, hear.) Where they bad
a popular body guiding the fortunes and the legislation
of the colony, it was most unlikely, unless under peculiar
circumstances, that that popular body would consent to
set up another popular body by its side. Again, they
might alter the aggregate number of members of the
council, but not the proportions. The proportions were
sacred, and must not be departed from. He wished to see
New South Wales establish for itself stable institu-
tions, but to be stable those institutions must spring out
of the soil of the colony, and the attempt by the officials
in Downing-street to check the democratic principles of
the peculation of New South Wales, would not only not
check, but would give a more wildly democratic cha-
racter to the feelings of the people of that colony, and
tend to weaken the ties between it and the mother
country.—(Hear.) He considered those amendments
of the House of Lords amounted, as nearly as possible,
to a breach of faith by the Government with the co-
lonists of New South Wales. The colonists would say
we had sent them a Bill which was most essentially
changed, and we had pleaded their consent to that Bill
for passing it in the House of Commons, and then had
permitted it to be altered in the House of Lords. In
tact, he (Mr. Gladstone) must register his pro-
test. against this 811, because, while protess-
ing to give free institutions to the colonists,
it maintained the control of the Crown over the legisla-
ture of the colony, and, introducing uncertainty and un-
easiness into its legislation, it had taken away that
great gift of liberty which was the apology and the argu-
ment that certainly carried the Bill in the House of
Commons.

Mr. ROEBUCK thought it his duty to enter his sincere
and earnrst protest against this Bill. The House learned
now that it was acting on imperfect information. Surely if
perfect information were requisite it might be obtained,
but the truth was, that the Noble Lord at the head of
the Colonial Department was so determined in his own
course that he would never listen either to the sugges-
tions from the colonies or to the suggestions 'rem
the House cf Commons.—(Hear.) The House diu
not come to legislate on the colonies without ex-
perience ; they had experience enough to guide
them in that matter, and especially with respect to the
formation of a federative assembly. The Noble Lord
at the head of the colonies was determined to have one
council, and one council only; but was told over and
over again that if he adopted that plan it was im-
possible to make a fair and operative assembly.
The Noble Lord was told there was experience
about that matter to which no sane man
could shut his eyes ; and that there was a
wan at once simple and effective. That plan was simply
to have two chambers, one of them representing the pc-
pulation cf the colonies, and the other chamber repre-
senting the colonies themselves. That was the plan of
the United States cf America, hit upon by
the rraiter-mind of the American revolution.
He charged every one of the Government who had had
anything to do with the Bill with an obstinacy which
could spring from nothing but personal vanity. There a as
also another point. In a Bill which was to be a permanent
measure, bow was it that they had introduced provisions
which would be a source of constant quarrel. He referred
the Howe to the constitution which had been lately
framed by the settlers at California, and he thought that
whsn it was compared with this miserable specimen of
their legislative wisdom it ought to shame :every Mem-
bar of the British Parliament. There was nothing
in it which was satisfactory or certain, but
it was full of the seeds of eternal discord. The only
hope he had was that when it got there it would create
such universal dissatisfaction that they would be obliged
to reconsider the measure. He had denied cfien that
this Bill would please the colonies, and he re-
iterat«d the denial. He thought that when they
heard an ex-Secretary for the Colonies de-
claring that there was no chance of governing
the colonies without two Chambers, he thought it ought
to induce them to pause b( fore they sent out this Bill.
It was, however, now too late, and all he could do was to
protest, and, as far as he w as concerned, he had done his
duty.

Air. CHISHOLM ANSTEY complained that :the
only clause of any value had been struck out in
another place ; and the Noble Lord had come down
and declared himself perfectly satisfied. He complained
also of the clause introduced there, which allowed con-
victs on tickets of leave an equal share in the franchise.
The Bill, he considered, was a contemptible Bill; and
he should have preferred going without it altogether
than taking it as it was.

Mr. MACGREGOR said the question was whether
this Bill gave or took away any privileges from
the colonists. He believed that it gave many of
them privileges which they never had before possessed.
Taking into consideration the moral and social condi-
tion of the colonies, he thought the Bill was a good
Bill, and that it had been rendered rather more
practical than otherwise by the amendments of the
Lords. He considered that the measure would be
very acceptable to the colonists, and he would give
it his cordial support, being anxious that they should be
kept r o longer in suspense as to what were the intentions
of the IA gislature.
The Lords' amendments were then agreed to
ASSESSED TAXES COMPOSITION BILL.
This Bill was read a second time.
The House then adjourned until five o'clock,

Tho House resumed at Five o'clock.
PETITIONS.
Mr. DISRAELI presented a petition from a body cf
farmers in the county of Perth in favour of protectio❑.
Mr. F. O'CONNOR presented a petition from Lei-
cester praying the House to restore the delivery of
I.tters atithe Post•office on Sundays.
Mr. COBDEN presented a petition from a place in
Yorkshire against Church rate>.
I'S ABANDONMENT BILL.

Sir J. GRAHAM, after presenting a petition from a
gentleman in Birmingham complaining of the conduct ot
the Birmingham and Oxford Junction Railway Com-
pany, asked the President of the Board of Trade
what were the intentions of Government with reference
to the Railways Abandonment Bill.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said the Bill was at present
under the consideration of his Learned Friend the At-
torney •General, who would shortly state what the inten-
tions of Government were with reference to it.
Mr. MULLINGS presented a petition from a place in
Gloucestershire, praying the House to rescind the reso-
lution preventing the &livery ot letters ut the Post-office
on Sunday.
Mr. SOTHERON presented a petition from a place
in Wilts praying for certain modifications in the Savings
Lank Bill orfors the House.

POLITICAL REFUGEES IN THIS COUNTRY.
Lord DUDLEY STUART gave notice • that
he should tc-morrow put a question to the Secre-
tary of State for the Home Department re-
specting certain political refugees, who it was
stated, having taken refuge in this country,
had been delivered up to one of the Governments of
Germany, and sent away from here in consequence of
being blame:: as accomplices in a murder committed on
the continent.