The Sun.
London, England, 1850-03-15 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT,

HOUSE OF LORDS, March 14.
CONVICT PRISONS BILL.
Earl GREY (in continuation from our Third
Edition of last night) proceeded to say—lt was essential
that there should be some place to which convicts in the
colonies, having tick( ti of leave, could be removed and
placed under the control of Government in case of mis-
conduct. As he had before stated, it was desirable that
removal to a distant colony should form part of the sen-
tence cf transportation, for various reasons. It had
been found by experience that punishment should con-
sist of a combination of various elements. To one class

of men a sentence of transportation from their native
land to a distant place would strike the utmost terror—

whilst to others ft would be an additional incentive to

crime. To a man of sensitive feelings the idea of being
compelled to labour in company with the worst of cha-
racters, in a convict's dress, and in the public view,
would be the severest torture, whilst others would to
callous to all sense of shame. Some would prefer the
comparative comforts of a prison to the precariotrz sub-
sistence they obtained out cf it—whilst to others the

deprivation of freedom would be acutely felt. It had,
therefore, been deemed redvieable to combine thue

elements. Another reason why it had teen dit?rmined
to retain removal to a distant colony as a part t.f the

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punishment, was to give the convict a better chance of
retrieving hiselost position in society, by placing him in a
colony where his having' been a convict would not ope-
rate as a bar to his finding employment. In this coun-
try he had no such chance, as, even if animated by the
most earnest desire to gain an honest livi lihood, his con-
viction was an insuperable obstacle to his so doing, while
if he went to a spot where he was unknown, ho was
liable to be discovered at any moment by some one of
his old associates, and again driven to crime for a liveli-
hood.—(hear, hear.) In :a penal colony, on the con-
trary, he might rise to respectability, and even wealth;
and this was proved by the number of former convicts
who, according to calculations made at the Colonial-
office, were now subsisting by their own exertion, there
being in New South Wales and Van Diemen's Land no
fewer than forty-eight thousand persons who had gone
there as transports, while the number of i‘ ticket-of-
leave men" made an addition of twenty thousand. But for
this system of transportation all these persons would now
beve been at large in this country, having no resources
except crime, and the result of that might have been
guessed, by looking at a neighbouring country and its
army of forcata. He lo,lieved that under a proper sys-
tem of management the colonies might receive convicts,
after they had emerged from the discipline which
they had undergone, not only without injury to those
colonies, but with positive advantage. At present the
convicts were sent out with tickets of leave instead of
conditional pardons. The difference being this, a ticket-
of-leave man might remain about the town, and so fall
in with his old associates, and under the present system
of allowing certain gratuities to men of good conduct
while on the public works, a man so situated, if posses-
sing any money might be robbed, and induced by want
to resort again to crime. But a man Laving a conditional
pardon might be required to go at once into the more
distant regions of the colony, and to accept employment
from any respectable settler, who might offer a fair re-
muneration.—(Hear.) These conditions, it was pro-
posed, should be invariably insisted on. They should
also be required to pay a certain sum of money out of
their earnings before they should be entitled to an un-
conditional pardon, the motive for requiring such pay-
ment not being any desire to obtain a sum of money,
but to carry out the system of punishment and dis-
cipline under which the convict was placed. Ever since
transportation bad been a punishment the Crown had a
property in the services of the convict. Under the system
of assignment those services were transferred to the
master, who had a right to make him work in return for
certain specified rations and a supply of clothing; that
is, they were neither more nor less than slaves. ID
olden times they were literally slaves. In the early days
of transportation to Virginia, the convicts were sold by
public auction for the term of their sentence; and the
pictures which were drawn by Defoe in one of his works
of the nature of transportation to the plantations were so
near to truth that he would content himself with referring
to them as an exemplification of what transportation was
in those days. The system of assignment had been
found productive of many evils, and it had, therefore,
very properly been abolished. By requiring a sum of
money as a condition to • entire freedom, they also be-
lieved that they gave the convict an additional stimulus
to industry and good conduct. The sum thus raised
would be applied to' the promotion of free emigration,
and would thus indirectly benefit ti .e convict himself, by
assisting in the development of the resources of the
country in which his future lot was cast. In principle,
this past of the plan of conditional pardon was
similar to that of the " passholders" created by Lord
Stanley, from whose wages a reduction was made. He
considered it of importance that convicts should he as
much as possible dispersed, as the bringing together a
large number was a source of much danger, and with
that view the Government had been anxious that they
should be disperse& not only in those colonies where
they were already sent, but also in as many different
colonies as possible. Unfortunately the attempt made
to gain that end was frustrated by the opposition of cer-
tain colonies to receive convicts, and as those colonies
had not originally been penal settlements, Government
had not thought itself justified in endeavouring to over-
rule that resistance. New South Wales also must now
be considered as in the sense position, so large a portioa
of its inhabitants having gone there since it had ceased
to be a penal colony, as to give them a right t) have it
considered as a free colony. Van Diemen's Land, how-
ever, was originally established as a convict colony,
large sums had been expended on it by the Goveremt ut
with a view to carry out,that purposr, and the fre e in-
habitants who Had gone there had done so with their
eyes open, and ought not to expect any extra-
ordinary indulgence. If they sent convicts to the
colonies, they should take the utmost care that
it should not be done to the injury of the colonists.
They had altered many and were endeavouring
to alter all the regulations respecting the superintend-
ence and government of convict) that were injurious to
them. But their great object was in Lending convicts to
any colony, that free emigration to the same colonies
should be promoted' by all means. That would prevent
the evils resulting from an exclusive convict element in
society. Parliament had voted a sum of money for that
purpose, and they had appropriated it to a certain ex-
tent in sending free emigrants to New South Wales and
other colonies. They had also sent out the wives and
families of such convicts as were reported to have le-
hayed well, under certain regulations. In Van Diemen's
Land they had adopted me asures to secure a superior
class of colonists. Persons of that class wore thereby
enabled to settle there with the greatest possible benefit
to themselves. Practically they got their lands for
nothing. Several ships had arrived there lately, and the
labourers bad obtained employment at once, at wages
Varying from 101. to 151. per annum. In the northern
parts of New South Wales, there were the finest pas-
toral lands, of almost unlimited extent. He regretted
the vote of the colonial legislature at Sidney against
sending convicts with tickets of leave there, in conse-
quence of which they bad been preventing these
ann from going to thoic-C,Parts at present. Free settlers
did not like the seclusion and absolute solitude of these
regions where wool was cultivated. They preferred the
associations of towns. But the grow ti e f wool in these
pastoral regions was just the employment for convicts
with tickets of leave. In Western Australia Government
had determined to establish a very small colony, and
they had sent 70 convicts of the best class there. But it
was not intended that there should be any large number
of coerced convicts in any of the colonies. The con-
victs would be employed in those works which most
developed the resources of the country, in opening up
communications between the colonies, the formation of
roads, Sac. He looked forward to the greatness and
prosperity of Western Australia, as coal, timber, and
other natural resources existed in abundance. All they
wanted was sufficient labour. He now had stated what
were the arrangements in progress and in contempla-
tion, with regard to convicts under sentence of trans-
portation. :He was aware improvements might be
made. He had confined himself entirely to the
interests of Great Britain, as the Bill only referred
to that. He regretted the greet increase in the
number sentenced to transportation. It had greatly
increased. In 1848 the , number was 2,658,
and in 1849 above 3,000, while, a few years before' Ike
number was about 600. They had formed several set-
Clements, but many of them were over crowded. He was
sure their Lordships would see that the subject was one
of deep importance, and it should be thoroughly under-
stood. He had avoided matters of a controversial nature,
or the motives ascribed to Government, which they did
not entertain. A foundation had be en laid to establish a
system of convict renal discipline, deterring to otlenders,
and beneficial to the country. With these observations
he should move the second reading of the Bill.
The Bill was than read a second time.
STATE OF OUR RELATIONS WITH GREECE.
Lord STANLEY gave notice that to-morrow he
should call attention to the state of our negotiations with
regard to the affairs of Greece, and that he would ask
for information from the Noble Marquis opposite (the
Marquis of Lansdowne) upon she questions arising upon
recent communications made by Russia upon this sub-
ject, and also respecting the precise moment when orders
were sent out to put an end to coercive measures towards
Greece.