The Sun.
London, England, 1850-04-11 00:00:00

MONDAY'S DEBATE.

There Rai nothing satilictory in Monday's debate
beyond the victory won for the assistant,urgb oils in the
I navy. Certainly it was an editing spectacle to see Ad-
miral Dundas and Captain Berkeley—gentlemen living,
as Colonel Sibthorp expressed it, " on a comfortable sa-
lary, with coals and candles, in a house rent free, and in.
a dry and airy situation," come down to their places to
denounce the presumption of poor graduates in medicine
humbly praying for something more than 18 inches of
hammock-room amongst boys, with the ship's company
in front of thent. Captain Berkeley's indignation at
such audacity knew no bounds. As a guardian of the
public interests he declared the attempt to be " one of
the greatest blows that could be inflicted on the naval
service of the country," while, as an advocate of the offi-
cers themselves, he asserted that the freedom of the ward-
room would inevitably lead them into inextinguishable

debt, place them over heads of their superiors, and
be opposed, after all, to the general wishes of their own
class. We are sure that the Gal'spit Member's impres-

sions on these points will be better corrected by a little

quiet recollection on his oan part than by anysuggeS.
Lions of ours. He must necessarily be aware that the as

sistant-surgeon has already more pay than two of the
wardroom officers, and as much pay, on the average, as
two others; so that all anxiety for the adequacy of his in-
come to support wardroom mess charges may be dis-
missed as groundless. The "superiors" alluded to can be
no other than mates, but, as they were only ranked with
lieutenants in the army by an order of 1844, ss hereas
assistant-surgeons have enjoyed that rank for nearly half
a century, it is difficult to see how the alleged "su
periority" of position can be substantiated. No person
denies the equality of midshipmen in respect of birth or
education—the difference, as Captain Berkeley will re-
member, was in respect of age—midshipmen and mates
quitting the junior berth about twenty-one, whereas as-
sistant-surgeons of that age were just entering it. We
have no desire to fight over again a battle so well won,
but there is one point on which our information is per-
haps more accurate than that of the Admiralty authori-
ties, and we can assure tbem that if they have been led
to believe in any disinclination or indifference on the part
of the assistant-surgeons to the proposed reform they have
been seriously deceived. We can state, on unquestionable
grounds, that the earnestness and unanimity of the
petitioners and the profession generally is something
extraordinary. After this satisfactory skirmish came the
great fight for the " establishments." Col. Anson made
as good a case, perhaps, as his brief permitted; bet,
in the whole four columns of his speech, what, we ask,
is to be found in any degree justifying the enormous de-
mands on this score? ".These establishments cf the Ord-
nance-offices at the Tower and Pall-mall had already,"
he candidly premised, " been made peculiarly the sub-
ject of remark and complaint as to their cost." No
doubt they bad; and what, then, is the apology offered
in their behalf ? Was it shown that the duties attached
to them were performed in the most effectual and eco-
nomical manner possible? Was it shown that the least
possible waste of power was secured in the general ad-
ministration, or that the most jealous scrutiny had failed
in detecting any weak points in their constitution or
management? Quite the contrary. Colonel Anson did,
indeed, presently arrive at a conclusion, which he ex-
pressed as a logical consequence of certain previous de-
monstrations. " Therefore," said he, "he thought that
the Government should hare credit for having gradually
brought the cost of this department to the lowest point
compatible with the actual requirements of the
public service." But, when we come to ex-
amine the source in the premises from which
this ergo is derived, we find nothing beyond
a simple statement that small reductions have been re-
peatedly made in the total demand. We say, with Mr.
Hume, that 86,9611. per annum is a monstrous charge
for "an establishment maintained for the purchase of
about 100,0001. worth of old stores a year;" and we are
cold in reply that there was a time when it cost still
more and did even less. We don't question the accu-
racy of the assertion—we only demur to its pertinency.
The Ordnance-offices undoubtedly cost 101,971/. iu
1828, and 95,5641. in 1848, whereas the figures are now
modestly set at some 9,000/. less. But how much does
this prove the case for maintaining them as they stand
at present? Let the reader consider the facts simply
admitted in Colonel Anson's own statement. During
the time that the country had been charged with
100,000/. a year for the maintenance of these esta-
blishments, " the store accounts had been shown to
have been kept in a most imperfect and unsatis-
factory manner," though the difficulties in the
way of improving the system were in reality
so small as to be " readily " overcome by a method
" pointed out " by the deposing witness. Other
suggestions were confessedly calculated " materially to
facilitate the transaction of business." When we come
to the system actually existing, we find it described as
"occasioning great loss of time to the clerks, incon-
venience to the members of the board, and consequent
disadvantage to the public." This "point," we are then
told, " had been attended to," from which admission we
presume we may infer that the alleged clumsiness and
costliness of management were not denied. Now, is it
not demonstrable from these acknowledgments that we
were paying, but a few years back, enormous sums for
work very ill done, and that at this moment, while the
cost is but little diminished, the returns are but doubtfully
increased ? It is surprising that the advocates of
establishments should not see what conviction they are
bringing home to themselves by arguments like these.
The Dockyard and Admiralty authorities took just the
same ground two years ago; but what would be said of
a tradesman who should challenge public support and
sympathy on the score of having instituted, in his twen-
tieth year of business, a system of book-keeping by which
he might know how much he expended and how much
he received, and whether his servants did or did not
perform the work for which he had been paying them?
We assert that " establishments" in which so little was
done, through so long a period, for so much money, and
in which the very commonest suggestions of prudence,
economy, and good management have been only adopted
after years of ignorance or wilfulness, in of edience to
pressure from without, are plainly convicted of radical
rottenness, nor can their tardy amenability to public
opinion be set against their proved propensities to ex•
travagance and their notorious liabilities to abuse. This
much, we say, can be demonstrated from facts admitted
on all sides. We will go further and assert, that the
costliness and inefficiency of the Ordnance-offices could
be inferred from their very constitution, and that if they
were really found to work satisfactorily, the result
would be a miracle. There are at present no fewer
than six offices, departments, or establishments con-
nected with the administration of the army.
1. The Secretary of War and the Colonies.
2. Horse Guards.
3. Ordnance.
4. Secretary at War.
5. Paymaster of the Forces.
6. Adjutant-General.
The reader will be aware that without the co-opers•
tion of the establishment standing No. 3. on this list, and
which has been characterised in the foregoing remarks,
the Commander-in-Chief could not sent a single gun
from London to Bristol, and we have heard of a corre-
spondence between No. 3 and 4, touching the account-
ability for a certain rope which lasted for several months,
and was ultimately re erred to the Treasury for arbitra-
tion. The true function of the Ordnance-office, in so
far as it is not an actual impediment to the efficiency of
our military administration, is the supervision of stores,
and it costs very nearly half as much to keep these
stores as to purchase them. A homely proverb says,
that " stores are no sores," and people usually find a
consolation in reflecting that such inanimate bar-
gains " don't eat and drink." But our public
stores do eat and drink, through their keepers,
and with a very steady appetite too. The Ordnance-
office alone, with its Master-General and 22') subordi-
netts, costs nearly twice as much as the three officers
and 2,182 non•commissioned officers and men constitut-
ing the corps of Royal Sappers and Miners; and the
" Ordnance establishments at home and abroad," even
in their revised form, cost no less than 432,8291. per
annum, while the charge of the whole regiment of Ar-
tillery, with its 544 officers and 10,755 sten, all miscel-
laneous expenses, allowances, and contingencies in-
cluded, is but 465,5841. We remember an instance of
an lash union, where the entire sum collected from the
ratepayers just amountei to the expenses of the work-
ing staff, leaving a remainder cf 01. Os. Od. for the said
staff to distribute. If Mr. Hume could carry his motion
for unconditional retrenchment, the Ordnance staff
would find itself in much the same predicament; but
John Bull has a long purse, and can keep up a lively
game.—Times.

BRUTAL CONDUCT.—On Monday last, two men
named Edward Craine and Thomas Gill, proceeded to a
hill side on the estate of Renabb, parish of Maughold, for
the purpose of procuring a bundle of heather for the making
of brooms; while thus engaged the proprietor of the pre-
mises observed them, and remarked that he should quickly
make them remove their quarters. In accordance with this
determination, lie at once set fire to the dry furze and heather,
directly under the place where the poor men were engaged
as above stated. The fire spread with great fury, and it
was only by rolling himself down the brow of the hill, and
fallicg over the edge of the precipice into the river under-
neath, that Gill escaped, whilst his unfortunate companion,
who was a pensioner, aged 8J years, and quite a cripple,
was left in his helpless state a prey to
.the devouring ele-
ment. After the flame had subsided, Gill went in search of
Craine, whom he found burnt to a cinder. The proprietor of
the heath has been apprehended.—Nonx Liberal.