The Sun.
London, England, 1858-10-01 00:00:00

Income received in the Quarter ended Sept. 30, 18.58, as shown in Account I 16,901,052

Amount received in the Quarter ended Sept. 30, 188, in repayment of Advances
for Public Works, he.

Balance, being the deficiency on the 30th Sept., 1858, upon the charge of the Con-
solidated Fund in Great Britain, to meet the Dividends and other charges
paTable in the Quarter to Dec. 31, 1858, and for which Exchequer Bills (De-
ficiency) will be issued in that Quarter

ARMY CLOTHING CONTRACTS.

IVEEDON, THURSDAY EVENING.

The commissioners reassembled this morning
shortly after eleven o'clock—Mr. Selfe in the chair
—for the purpose of continuing their inquiry into
the contract system as carried on at Weedon.
Eli Coats wa.s the first witness, and in reply to
questions by the Chairman, he said he was em-
ployed in the packing-room when he first came to
Weedon in March, 1856. His wages were 15s.
a-week. He remained in the packing-room only
about three weeks, when Mr. Elliott sent him into
the boot-room, where ho remained only three weeks
longer, being objected to by Mr. -Watson, an in-
spector, on the ground that he passed goods too
easily. He was then a labourer, partly in the
yard and partly in the packing-room packing cloth.
He left the service in July, 1857. His reason for
leaving was because the wages were too low to
support him. He had since been living by his
trade of a shoemaker, and worked for Mr. Groom,
of Northampton. He knew the witness Witham
well, and saw him here last Saturday. Witham
said to witness, " You'll be wanted up there," and
he said he should be very glad to give any evidence
he could. lie had been a packer with Witham for
some time. He remembered on more than one
occasion Witham saying to Daly, a viewer, that
some cloth, he was packing was damp, and Daly's
reply was that " the cloth was wanted, and it must
go."
By Col. French—lle could not of himself say the
cloth was damp. He only beard Witham say so.
Mr. Watson used to set other viewers to look after
boots that %itness had passed, While lie wtts-at-
Wcedon he used to work for Mr. Groom during
over-hours. At that time Mr. Groom was a con-
tractor. Witness never made a military boot for
Mr. Groom while he was employed at Wecdon.
He knew Groves and Holmes, but he never heard
of Holmes charging Groves with taking bribes.
The Chairman remarked it was odd that Witham
should have come on purpose to Weedon to see
witness and pass a night there, and that he told
witness he should be wanted to give evidence,
whereas he seemed really to have no evidence to
give.
- .

- By Mr. Turner—He did not get any extra pay
from Groom for work he made for him, on account
of his being a viewer at Weedon.
The Chairman said he should be sorry that the
country should have to pay £3 or £4 for printing
the evidence of this witness ; if the commissioners
wished to refresh their memory on it they could
refer to very excellent sources of information.
Col. French and Mr. Turner concurred in this
opinion, and the evidence was ordered to bo struck
out of the short-hand writer's notes.

Mr.' Thomas Randall, who represented the firm
of Parker and Co., Higham-Ferrers, was next ex-
amined. He said his firm were contractors for
boots at Weedon, and had supplied altogether about
100,000 pairs of boots ' • they had been also engaged
largely under the old system ; he did not think
there was much difference in the profits under the
old and the new systems. The inspection at
Weedon was very rigid, but on the whole he had
not any reason to complain of it ; he thought the
objections made by the inspectors were reasonable;
his house had never employed persons as boot-
makers who were employed at Weedon. lie thought
it was necessary to have a strict inspection, but
he considered it would be desirable to have some
sort of reference in case of undue rejections.
The prices now were lower than they used to
be, although the articles supplied were equally
good ; the country certainly had the benefit of that;
he considered that open tenders were not always
advantageous to the public, as when they became
public the competition would have the effect of
raising the prices.
By Mr. Turner—The proportion of fluctuation of
labour in the boot trade within the last three years
was 10 per sent. ; the price of leather in the last
two years had fluctuated about 100 per cent. In
taking contracts from the Government when the
materials and labour were high, contractors were
satisfied to work for Government at almost no real
profit in order to keep the Government contracts.
By the Chairman--His house had determined
their running contracts with Government some-
times on account of their not being able to do the
work for the prices specified.
By Col. French—He did not find that his goods
suffered very rough treatment by the inspectors.
By Mr. Turner—He did not think it would in-
fluence his calculations if there was a reference.
He admitted that rejections were a loss, but the
contractors took into their calculations that there
would be sonic rejections.
By the Chairman—lf there was an appeal, that
would not have influenced his calculations at all.

By. Col. French—Under the old system the "am-
munition" boots were supplied through the army
clothier contractors.

Mr. Thomas Wetherell, a bootmaker at North-
ampton, stated he had been in the habit of supply-
ing boots to Government by contract, both under
the old and new systems. The price now was higher
but the articles were better. He supplied the Go-
vernment with about 3,000 pairs of boots per month
for some years past. He considered that the in-
spection at Weedon was arbitrary. He had at times
come over to Weedon to complain of rejections,
but although the people at Weedon were very civil
he found the same thing continued ; the rejections
varied from 3to 10 per cent. He had on some oc-
casions retouched up boots which had been rejected
at Weedon and sent them again there, ana they
passed—having no other appeal he appealed to
himself. (A .

Chairman—Tlien-I supnose your are quite satis-
fied with that mode of appeal? (Laughter.)
Witness—No, because it places me in a false
position. Witness went on to say that he did not
complain of the inspection being always too rigid,
latterly ; but he should like• the inspectors to state
the grounds of their rejection. He thought if there
was a referee he should not be appointed by the
Government. He believed the pay of such a referee
would be very small, as the fact of there being a
referee would make the inspectors more careful in
rejecting goods, and consequently there would not
be much for the referee to do.

By Mr. Turner—ln the case of the boots which
were first rejected, and on being sent in by him
were passed again, he admitted he was appealing
not only to himself, but also to the judgment or

427,042

£17,807,148

1,194,857

£19,0412,005

want of judgment of the inspectors. (A laugh.)
He gave all his workpeople a bonus on all boots
they made for the Government to induce them to
work well ; and if any of the boots were returned
he made a deduction from the pay of his workmen ;
he was able to tell the work of each man by putting
a number on the boots he made. He never gave a
briheto any of the people at Weedon ; nor did he
know of any one who had, although he had heard
the general rumours that bribery was practised at
Weedon. He did not himself believe those rumours;
• but he believed more attention was paid at Weedon
to some contractors' goods than to others ; but that
he considered only legitimate.
The witness was here shown a pair of sealed
pattern boots, which he considered were not equal
in material to the original patterns. As a matter
of opinion he thought the back was East India kip,
and the uppers were also kip ; but they were made
some years, and that would affect their appearance.
As to the soles, he thought they were English butt,
although it was difficult to say, so much depended
on the tanning, which greatly altered the original
appearance of the leather. For his own credit, he
should never have put such material in a military
boot. He thought from 7s. to Bs. would be a fair
price for the Government to pay for such boots,
but he could not think the Government could pos-
sibly buy such boots.
The Chairman remarked that whether they ought
or ought not to have done so, it was a fact that the
Government had bought these boots ; but it must
be remembered that was two years ago.
Another sealed patter.. b..* shown to witness he
considerr would be worth 9s. rt.pair.
- Mr. R ndall was recalled to give his opinion of
the boots. He considered that the first boots were
not proper to have been scaled patterns. The
second patterns he considered much better, and
concurred in the opinion of the last witness as to
the comparative value of each pair of boots.
Mr. Wetherell was also recalled to explain in
what he complained of his boots which were re-
jected being handled with undue roughness by the
inspectors. He also stated that the price he charged
Government for his boots was 10s. a pair.
Mr. Edward Furness, Lambs' Conduit-street,
London, was next called. He stated he was a
bootcloser, and had served a regular apprenticeship
to the trade. He pronounced the boots already
mentioned to be of very inferior material, the
uppers being of East India kip of the most inferior
kind, and the soles of foreign butt. They were
not fit for soldiers' boots. He should say the value
of them was not more than 7s. 6d. a pair. The
other sample of boots was decidedly far better.
Witness examined yesterday 874 pair of boots by
the first or inferior pattern. He made out a lot of
390 pairs in which the uppers were worth more
than 20 per cent. than the pattern. A lot of 312
was about 7 per cent. in the uppers, but in the
whole 874 pairs the soles were quite as good as the
pattern, but he should not say they were boots that
were good enough for the use of the troops, for
when the boots got thoroughly saturated with wet
a ridge formed inside, and the wearer was always
afterwards walking on ploughed land. (A laugh.)
He should say that such boots as these would not
stand above nine days' hard walking in very wet
weather, and he should not certainly say they
were fit to be sent to the troops in India during
the rainy season. He considered the boot inspector
ought to be a bootmaker.

Mr. Turner—One equal to yourself, I presume.
(A laugh.)
Chairman—There is no vacancy at present, Mr.
Furness. (Laughter.)
Mr. W. Nicholls, a bootmaker at Hands, Nor-
thamptonshire, said he did not complain of the in-
spection at Weedon, to which establishment he
supplied a large number of boots. Last year he
was startled by the large number of his boots re-
jected, and he came to Weedon to ascertain the
cause. He saw Mr. Hoile, one of the inspectors,
who sent two viewers with him to point out what
were the faults in the boots, and the viewers
pointed out " chalk marks," and also that the heels
were too low. Subsequently he sent in these boots
a second time to Weedon mixed up with other
boots, and he had no doubt the greater part of
them passed. Since that time very few of Ws
boots had been rejected; the strictness of the in-
spection did " drive " him to be more careful in the
quality of his boots.
Mr. Turner—Then it was a wholesome lesson to
you. (A laugh.)
Witness, in answer to further questions, said if
Government would furnish the contractors with an
appeal he was sure the Government would have
the benefit of it in lower prices. That appeal or
referee would give him greater confidence, and he
should say he could cut lower in his prices than to
the extent of 2d. or 3d. a pair, which in the large
number required would tell up soon. As Govern-
ment had already inspectors, he should say the
referee ought to be a thoroughly practical man, and
independent of the Government. He should just
as soon pay his share of the expenses of the referee
in ease his goods were rejected as if they passed.
He never gave a halfpenny nor a halfpenny's worth
to any one at Weedon to " make things pleasant,"
nor was he aware of any one who did.
Five different pairs of boots were here placed on
the table for witness to give his opinion of, respect-
ing which the chairman stated that the best and
second best pairs were samples of boots which had
been purchased by Mr. Levy at the Tower, the
third and fourth samples were the present issue,
and the fifth was the rejected lot. He considered
that the fifth pair had no goodness in them, but
they were as good as the sealed patterns. He could
not conceive who had sealed such a pattern. Wit-
ness considered it would not matter in the least to
him if the boot depot was in London instead of
being at Weedon. He valued the first pair of
boots at 10s. 6d. • the second at 10s. [These were
a part of 200,000 pairs of boots sold at the Tower,
purchased by Mr. Levy at ss. 54d. a pair, re-sold
by him to contractors, and then sent into Weedon
by them and passed.]
Mr. James Dovvie, bootmaker, Charing-cross, was
the next witness. He stated that the first and
second pairs of the boots were part of what he had
got from Mr. W. Shaw, who purchased from Mr.
Levy, and Levy told him he bought them at the
Tower. Pairs No. 3 and 4 were returned to wit-
ness by the Dumfries Militia ; they had been sup-
plied prom Weedon to the militia. The regiment
had been suddenly disembodied, and haying thirty