The Sun.
London, England, 1858-03-13 00:00:00

in some measure account for the ill health that was attri-
buted to the state of the barracks. He saw no reason why

he aristocratic officers of the Guards, brave and. intelli-

gent as they undoubtedly were, should be placed in a po-
sition which gave them more rapid promotion than could
be attained by persons of a lower grade in society. A cap-
tain in thepuards at once became a lieutonant•colonel, and
he (Sir J. Trelawny) was informed that the:pay and allow-
ance of an officer of the rank amounted to nearly 500/.
a-year. Independently of the advantages in respect so pay,
the officers of the Guards obtained rapid promotion ; and
during the war in the Crimea many of the higher military
appointments were held by Guardsmen. He hoped the
gallant-general at the head of the War Department would
bring the appointment of officers of the Guards under his
own authority, and would not countenance a system which
was prejudicial to the interests of the service.
General CODRING TON thought it was most desirable
to retain in London such a corps as the Guards which was
specially suited to the performance of military duties in
the metropolis. He knew that, in several cases, officers of
regiments of the line had been very glad to withdraw their
men from the temptations by which they were beset in
London, and which rendered the maintenance of discipline
most difficult.

General PEEL said that the clothing of her Majesty's
troops in India was supplied by the East Indian Govern-
ment, and was not under the control of the War Depart-
ment.

Mr. ALCOCK had spoken to three or four gentlemen
who were acquainted with Indian affairs, and among others
to the Chairman of the East India Company (Mr. Mangles),
but he could not obtain from them the slightest informa-
tion on this subject. (Laughter.) Ho hoped the Minister
for War would institute some inquiry as to the clothing of
European troops in India.
Mr. MANGLES had told the hon. gentleman that the
expenses of her Majesty's forces in India were defrayed by
the East India Company, but ho could not inform his hon.
friend what amount was deducted from the pay of the men
for any portion of their dress. Those details were not
within his cognizance, but he supposed the system adopted
in this country was also in force in India.
General PEEL said the extra clothing suitable to the
climate of India was supplied to the troops by the East
India Company, but he would cause inquiry to be made on
the subject to which the hon. member for East Surrey
(Mr. Alcock) had called attention.
Col. SYKES observed that the native soldiers in the
East India Company's service had not only to pay for their
kite, but for every ornament of their dress, out of 14s.
a month, while from such charges the European soldiers
were altogether exempt.
Mr. BAGWELL had found that applications were made
to young men who were studying for the military profes-
sion by parties who stated that they were authorised to
give them commission, provided they raised a certain num-
ber of men. Such an application had been made to a re-
lation of his own, and it struck him as very odd that while
the applications of young gentlemen of fortune and station
for commissions on condition ofraising men were uniformly
refused by the authorities, persons who represented them-
selves as army agents should say that a certain sum might
be lodged in a bank-, which should not be withdrawn until
a commission was granted. It would seem, certainly, from
this circumstance that there was no attempt at fraud, but
it was stated that if some 50 men were raised a commission
might he obtained without purchase. He thought such a
proceeding was very strange and irregular, and he wished
to know whether the Secretary for War could give any
explanation on this subject.
General PEEL could give no explanation, and could not
understand how such an o.currenee could have taken
place. The hon. gentleman had made the statement from
his own personal knowledge, and he (General Peel) would
have the matter inquired into.
The vote was then agreed to.
On the vote of 1,227,0001. on account of pay and allow-
ances to her Majesty's laud forces.
Mr. W. WILLIAMS asked what had boon the result
of the important change which had taken place respecting
the army clothing, which was now supplied by the Go-
vernment, instead of by the colonels of regiments. The
estimates were so confused that he found it impossible to
ascertain the comparative cost generally ; but he found
that the cost of the Guards' clothing was now 40 per
cent. more than it was in the time of the Duke of
Wellington. lie thought this most extraordinary
and most unwarrantable extravagance. The present
Government could not make themselves more popu-
lar than by effecting retrenchments, especially in matters
of this kind, and this was a subject to which he trusted
the right hon. and gallant General would turn his
attention. From what had transpired before the Committee
on Contracts there seemed to be an immense amount of
unfair dealing in connection with these, and unless the
system was amended, and the receipt of perquisites put a
stop to, especially in army contracts, no respectable man
would offer to supply them.
Mr. P. O'BRIEN asked whether the present Govern.
ment intended to adhere to the principle of competitive
examination in reference to the engineers and artillery.
Some change appeared to be in contemplation, for it
seemed that only on two more occasions was this principle
to be recognised at Woolwich.
General PEEL was much obliged to the hon. gentleman
for giving him this opportunity of stating what, so far as
he was concerned, had taken place on this subject. It had
been recommended by the Council of Education that all
candidates for the military service should pass through the
' college at Sandhurst. Not only would they as heretofore be
subjected to competitive examination, but as far as the en-
gineers and artillery were concerned the candidates for
these services would in future have to undergo a double
competitive examination. It was, however, pointed out to
him that under the new arrangement great hardship would
be inflicted on several gentlemen who had been preparing
themselves for examivation at Wool belch, because they would
be past the ago at which they would beadmittud to Sandhurst.
This was also represented to the Commander-in-Chief, and
the result was that two more competitive examinations were
directed to take place at Woolwich in order to allow those
gentlemen to undergo examination there who would have
been too old for Sandhurst. The principle of competitive
examination, he repeated, was not at all given up ; but, on
tho contrary, so far as the engineers and artillery were con-
cerned, they would be subjected to two examinations, one
on entering the college ; and candidates would have no
more difficulty in entering Sandhurst than in presenting
themselves at Woolwich. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. P. O'BRIEN asserted his right as the representative
of a popular constituency— as one of the people and no
aristocrat—to know the reason why a change had taken
place after the success which had attended the new system.
The house and the country had a right to be told this, and
to know why an admission to Sandhurst was to bo made
necessary.
Mr, GLADSTONE said it was refreshing to hear an hon.
gentleman assert the right of the house to institute in-
quiries, and as a member of the house he begged to thank
the hon. gentleman for his care of its privileges. (Laughter.)
The 'question which the hon. member had raised was one of
great importance, but he did not seem to have caught ac-
curately what had fallen from the right hon. and gallant
General the Secretary for War in roferance to the subject.
If he (Hr. Gladstone) understood his right hon. andgallant
friend correctly, he had stated that the interposition of the
preliminary course at Sandhurst had been recommended
merely as a measure of practical utility by the Council of
Education, and was not intended in any way to bear upon
or to restrict the principle of competition, upon which, if
it had any influence at all, its effect would be to substitute
a double for a single competition. If that were so then
the statement of the gallant general could, he thought, be
unsatisfactory neither to the hon. gentleman opposite nor
to the committee. There was also another statement
made by his gallant friend which ho hoard with much plea-
sure—namely, that the competitive entrance to Sandhurst
under the new system would lee practically free for all her
Majesty's subjects as the public competition at Woolwich.
General PEEL said that any person seeking to be placed
on their list of candidates for admission to Sandhurst had
merely to apply to his guardian or some other, person who
could bear testimony to his respectability, and he thought
it was desirable that some such reference should be re-
quired, but beyond that there would be no limitation
whatsoever. (Hear, hear.)
The vote was then agreed to, as were also the following
votes :-
206,0007. to defray the expenses connected with the pay
and allowances of our land forces at home and abroad.
100,000/. for the embodied militia,
30,000'. for the volunteer force.
60,0001. for the departments of Secresary of State for
War and General Commanding-in-Chief.
116,000/. for manufacturing establishments, military
storekeepers, &c.
180,0001. for wages of artificers and labourers.
229,0001. for clothing and necessaries.
361,0001. for provisions, forage, &c.
214,000/. for warlike stores.
93,000/. for fortifications.
50,000 for civil buildings.
222,0007. for barracks.
55,000/. for the educational and scientific branches.
9,000/. for rewards for military service.
211,0007. for the pay of general officers.
138,000/. for the pay of reduced and retired officers;
69,000/. for pensions to the widows of officers.
17, 00/. for pensions to wounded officers.
10,000/. for Chelsea and Kilmainham hospitals.
4,000/. for out-pensioners at Chelsea.
44,000/. for superannuation and retiring allowances.
The CHAIRMAN then reported progress, and the SPEAKER
having resumed the chair, the resolutions passed in com-
mittee of supply were reported to the house.
EAST INDIAN LOAN BILL.

On the orderoi the day for the further consideration of
this bill as amended,
The CAANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER liadictihtehiltanioe
bill coil I be of greater importance, and he
would pass it with unanimity.
T 4ee wants
nsted the house
hoped
the East
India Company were urgent, and h
would consider the measure irrespectively
of Government for India.
of the question
of what might be the future form of
days
but of hours, and
The urgency was not a question
he did not think that the sum asked for in the previous
bill 8,000,00,1.—was too large. A question existed as to
the 11th clause—( hear
)—which )—which it was proposed to
the hoped the bill would pass
expunge—(hear, hear)—bu
without opposition.
reseed his approval of the reject-
Mr. CARDWELL expressed
tion of the 11th clause.
Sir E. PERRY had no objection to adopt the most
effectual means for supplying the East India Company
with funds, but could not give his assent to the bill or to
the proposition on which was founded.
Mr. BAILLIE hoped there would be no opposition to
the bill.
Sir H. WILLOUGHBY hoped there would he no ob-
jection to a clause of which he had given notice, viz., that
on or before the let day of February in each year the
court of directors of the East India Company, under such
direction and control as aforesaid, shall prepare, or cause to
be prepared, a return of all monies raised on loan under
the provisions of this act, and of the expenditure thereof;
also, a return of all stocks, loans, debts, and liabilities then
chargeable on the East Indian revenues, at home and
abroad, up to the latest period' of time to which such
return shall be made out. That all such returns shall be
presented to both houses of Parliament on or before the Ist
day in February of each year, if Parliament, is then sitting,
and if Parliament is not sitting, then such returns shall
be presented within ten days of the first meeting of Parlia-
ment after the let day of February in each year.
Mr. MANGLES' said that the hon. and learned member
for Davenport proposed that this country should guarantee
the loan, obtaining its remedy from the revenues of India;
but if those revenues were fluctuating and insufficient to'
meet the claim, he could not see, according to the view of
the bun, and learned meraber, how this country could get
its ultimate remedy. (Hear, and a laugh.)
Mr. CRAWFORD reminded the house that the Indian
railways were already paying a larger dividend than would
cover the guarantee of this loan.
Sir G. LEWIS said that if ho was not mistaken, the
operation to which the honourable gentleman alluded con-
sisted in the conversion of a 5 per cent. stock into a 4 per
cent. stock, which was done with the perfect assent of the
bondholders. That, therefore, was not an act which could
with any justice be designated as an act of spoliation.
Whether it was financially a successful operation was
another question, Lie mast at the same time be permitted