The Sun.
London, England, 1858-05-21 00:00:00

THE SUN, LO.NDON, FRIDAY EVENING, MAT 21, 1658.

the Board of Control, to which allusion has been so fre by what he had done, it would not become the house to
quently made in debate. lam prepared to read that follow so bail an example. (Loud Ministerial cheers.)
extract. It will, however, be necessary that I should i Sir J. SHELLEY withdrew his amendment, and the
first read an extract from a preceding letter, which is i Bill was read a second time.
explanatory of the extract in question. It is as fol. i CHANCERY AMENDMENT BILL.
lo vs :—" Lord Canning, after giving his opinion as to : This Bid was read a third time and passed.
what course ought to be pursued with respect to the ! MR. CARDWELL'S RESOLUTION.
mutineers, goes on thus :—.
"The talookdars, landowners, and their followers, men - THE ADJOURNED DEI3ATE.
who have not eaten our salt, who owe us nothing, who Lord GODERICEI then resumed the adjourned de-
bate, remarking that in the present position of the epee-
' think themselves (not unreasonably) wronged by us, ore in
, a very different category. I will proclaim for them a !
' tion it was of the utmost importance to keep clearly in
view the issue raised.
Icturg mbuetasuunrteilofthmaetrchyapapnednsi,ndourl
He hoped also that the house
Campbell's guns have opened upon the city, I will not put would not shrink from expressing an opinion on the re-
gaetncleeassetftetrillLsucirkncolls
out any public invitation to them. Itolividuelly, Mann solution. The right hon. gentleman the Attorney-
Singh, and all others who show a disposition to come in, General for Ireland and others, had complained that the
are being encouraged to do so. I consider this enough, resolution did not call on the house to express an
and do not believe that mortal man could frame a precis- opinion on Lord C ' ' wining s proclamation at the same
' •if time mation of pardon to penitent mutineers which. issued that it deprecated the despatch of Lord Ellen-
now to those in Oade, would not be accepted as a sign of
keret] th. He (Lord G d • '
. J erich) taought that despatch
hesitation, and weakness, and so work us more evil than ' ;‘ -
unjustamble, because it passed an hosdle opinion on the
good."
(Loud cheers and counter cheers.) I will now read an Proclaruation in the absence of sufficient information.
When the papers recently adverted to were prmiuced,
extract from a letter rf the 6th of March—
that explanation would be forthcoming. He utterly de-
"My letter by the last mail mentioned a proclamation
which I intended to address to the Oude chiefs and land- nded that the proMaination necessarily meant a whole-
holders. It goes to you officially by this mail. I hoped sale confiscation of property in Gude. Such sweeping
that it would be accompanied by an explanatory despatch confiscation would be utterly opposed to Lord Canning's
showing why it is in some respects so sweeping, and in previous policy. The taunt that this proclamation had
others so indulgent, and defending it by anticipation (for emanated from the late Government had been given up,
it is sure to be attacked) on other points; but I have had recalled, (Hear, hear, from the Liberal benches.) The
things more urgent pressing upon me for every hour of best
~ answer to the other taunt, that the proclamation
the past week. You will not, of
.conne, print it until it
has been acted upon ; at present it stands only as part of was the offspring of Lord Canning's advisers on the spot,
an instruction to Oatram.' was the circumstance that the persons who ware to
(Ironical ceeers and counter cheers.) These are the pas-
carry out the preclamation were the secretary to the
sages in Lord Canning'a letter to my right hon. friend ; Government, Mr. Eitnonstone, who was with the Go-
but knowing that Lord Canning bad also been in cor vernor-General at Allahabad, and Mr. Montgomery ;
respondence with Lord Granville, his intimate friend, I the previous acts of both of whom had shown that they
thought it desirable to ascertain from Lord Granville fully rectgnised the rights of that village community.
whether he had received any communications from Lord The hon. baronet the member for Tam worth had spoken
Canning touching this proclamation, and whether be of the difference between the proclamations of Lord Cau-
had thought them of sufficient importance to be eho en rong, and those of Lord Dalhousie. Toe only difference
to the Government. My noble friend Lord Granville between the two was, that Lord Dalhou-ie's proclama-
wrote me, this day, the f eilowing letter on the sub- lions were prospecive, and contemplated confi cation in
ject :
cease rt b silion should breakout, whereas Lord Canninsee
"In reply to your questions respecting my private nor- proposed to deal with a rebellion actually raging. The
respondence with Lord Canning since the change of reasonable Prima f scie interpretation to be placed on the
Ministry, I beg to inform you that the only letter of poli- proclamation was that offered by the right hon. hart. the
tical importance is one which I received on the llsth, and member for Halifax, namely, that Lord Canning was pro-
of which I read the greater part to Lord Elleuborough on posing to continue the course he was pursuing, but in
the 20th of April. I did not read the whole of it for rea-
whichhe tvaS interrupted by the mutiny, and had taken
sons which I have stated in public, and which it is not advanta aof the
events which hal since occurred to en-
necessary for me to repeat, but nothing of real insportene.o able himg to dealwith the msurped rights of the Talook-
was omitted. Every word relating to the proclamation
dare (Hear, hear.) Tee teal question fa• decision, how-
was read, including the fact that General Oatram had oh-
jested to its severity, and that Lord Canning had in conse-
ever, was the despatch written by Lord Ed-nboreugh.
quence added a sentence to the proclamation, which would Before approaching the merits of that question, the
make it clear that, though confiscation of proprietary right nob'e lord replied to some of the remarks a hich had
in the soil is the general penalty, restitution of it is the fellers in the previous debate from the Attorney-General
reward for coining in and behaving well. I was not car- for Ireland, denying that the !ate Presiderit of the Board
Min of the data of my communication to Lord Ellen- . f Control (Mr. V. Smith) had spoken the word ins-
borough, but he has kindly referred to his papers, and has puled to him by the hon. and learned gentleman. If the
read to me a memorandum giving the exact date ()fit, and de ,patch was inland.. dto be secret, ha
secret, e asked whether
in which it is stated that he informed me that he had ' '
the Government really believed the Governor Genera!
written to Lord Canning on the subject. Lard Ellen-
borough has stated that the secret despatch was written on intended a general confiscation of the property of the
the 18th, dated the 19th, and sent on the 26th of April, people of India ? If such was the opinion of the Govern-
and has intimated that no explanations or announcement meet, they had committed a grave error in not recalling
of explanations would have altered his view of the noses- him. (Hear, hear, from the Conservatives.) On the
sity of writing and sending his secret despatch. contrary, they had not recalled L trd Canning, but had
"GRANVTLLE. left the entire responsibility of governing India upon
"P.S.—I have submitted this letter to laird Ellen- his shoulders. The Government should either have re-
borough, who says that he thinks what I have written to called the Governor-General, or have distineLly told blue
Sou is quite correct." that 'ILI proclamation might bear a sinis'er eonst • 110'10
With .Lord Granville's letter is a letter from Lord El • • ' ' 'n,
aid that ha was to continue in the course of mercy and
lenhoreueln which merely says : toleration which had been the characteristic of his paet
"My dear Lord Granville.—lthink that what you have • (se )It '1 1
pelicy. - ear. wow' !saes heel for better if the
said to Lord Palmerston is quite correct.
„ Government hen f Mewed the ex trople of the late Sir It.
" Yours very sincerely, "ELLENI3OROUGII.-- kindred ocea,ion isproposing
P.:el on a _ . , • the curse fer
(Cheers.) Sir, I thought it reasonable, as so much in
the heuse to take in connectioni with a former pr ,clann-
' terest bas been excitediethis bone with regard to these
thin of LerdElblenibeibeoug in (dear, hear.) The cprestien
explanatione, to trespatm on the indulgence of the home,
of publication ar
nde,en
tgiivien up, but if publication
wed I hope that the Lome will think that I have only per-
were intende, ashtir,_
_moot;
y seemed to be ilea case,
formed my duty in neaking the statement. (Cheers.) •
the despatch tires hly
theec ioaable. Toe first part of
Mr. BRIGHT.—As I trust that this unp!easant sub-
rrei to j
the despatch rdeconduct ef Lord Cannine,
ject wail not again occupy the attention of the house, I
to the en
zed the secor;.
i?
knexition cf Oude. What would
wish to put a question to the noble lord. We have heard
the natives o leers. t Hr., of the disavowal by the II rue
to )eight of two letters having been received by the late
Government of tihewhoe of Lord Canning's poiicy with
President of the Board of Centro'. Before to-night we
hadstatement that tigers was more than one.
have no r gird to 0 ede . What would the army of T.ndie, of
(dear, hear.) It has been stated that for 10 weeks General e,- . ft
whMh the Gevern, or- a 3 ~.),' head, think of such
a.disavorvel ? Bet there wan anoth:e• asn,ct of tly! Ties-
there was no conreninieetion of a direct character Item
Lord Cennirg to the I.3,:ard of Control under the late tier', trLiab vitaPy affected the proceedings s. f ehe G,-
Preeident. 1)., I understand the noble I.,rd t eerie :z -Genera ' . L was win 1-
o red the known that one of the
Lowe that these two let'.ers, received by the right hie. greatest obstacles whieh Lord C inning hel to overc'ens
gentleman the late President of the B .ard of Contrel, :yes the eucroacOing policy of his cauntryreen in Lelia.
are all the letters that Lord Canning wrote sea lam te de Ethel overcome that obstacle, but his opponents would
Lim cr to the Prime Minister, during those 10 weeks, gait: fresh ceuraee when they heard Ca et his peliey, on
refer rieg to pubic affairs in India? If the noble lord or an important sold, bad beet, diavo.ved ny the British
the right bon. gentleman had been frank enough to have Government. (Ceests.) The Oede paragraphs in the de-
stated the exact circumstances, we should ban avoided spat. h were in the last degree reprehensible, for by them
very touch of this painful di, cussiaa. toe gaites if t'rat country were toil that their land was
()Ulna] by us by trout, that the ,file of their sovereign
Lord PALMERSTON—The hon. geet.16:11111 was pro-
teas not open to flee censure which had been ;sassed on
bably not in tl.e house a few days am), a hen I gave an
t. A oaeraber of the peatent Goys-Lan . , ee. . ent had s.a.e.! be-
answeranswer to a question on this euLject. (a: ar, hear.) That '
fore taking office that O:-la ought to he given back
was so far incorrect, that I seal my right hog.
1.. 1 ule
again to its c • •rff. . (Hear ) - Was that his opinion
friend had received three letters from Lord Canning,
.01? W 2.8 that toe oiefeion i f the cellective Gavern-
when in point of fact he hart received four. The dates
mint ? The noble ler the member for London had A ell
acre Februar sth • Fb • 20th, n from
y e teary a extract
March Oth an extract remarked that if one Government were to continue dis-
which I have read to the house ; , ,
sdecese it. is Ind'a, caletnit
avowing the acts of ins pro , . , y
from which I have else read ; and a short letter on time
mutt befall our rule. Tess was a matter of innuenee gra-
17th of March, containing a communicetion Oa a mu i-
which it was impoesible to aggravate, acid if they
twhichright hon. friend sent to the Duee
tary - • pin., my
of Cambridge, who said ,nitiod to defend an empire which their ancestore and
he had received the same inlor-
•
c intemeoraries had c isciniered, they ought to pronounce
mation from Sir Colas Campbell, (Cheers.)
their censure on south dangeroui doctrines as were can
H. RAIN- LINSON—I wish to a ,lt the Ceandel'or
Ohned in the proclemation and the del.-ilia:eh. He might
of the Exchequer whether he would have any objection
almost stop taere, for he was content to rest the vote he
to lay upon the table the despatches received to-day free
was going to give on the paragraphs of this despetch,
Lord Canning relative to the 0 ade proclamation, so that
but he found the motion was to be met by an amendment
they may he printed and in the hands of members to
was to be supported by tree Gore, ninent (Cheer.)
morrow, before the adjourned debate is resumed. (Hear.)
Tee CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—It Tee amendreeat was harmless enough is itself. It ix-
they are to be printed, they shall be preseuted to the issessed a great deal cf truth which most could admit,
house in time for the debate to-morrow. I will give a out it also pa; took of the motion of the Lords, when the
inure recise answer' in the course of the evenieg.
Lad Cii inctl'or met a similar vote of censure by the
p
COUNTY FRANCHISE BILL. previous question. (dear, hear.) The amendment stated
that the policy of Lord Canning fa Glade, and the pro-
Mr. L. KING postponed the motion for the second
clatnation referred to, was worthy cf the confidence and
reading of this bill until Teuraday, June 2.
approbation. of the House of Commons, though they had
COMMON LAW PROCEDURE ACT AMEND-
MENT BILL, not sufficient information on which to form an opinion
Mr. ATHERTON moved the second reading of this —not withstandiee it was to •
(else' rs) . . , .. the interest of the
Government to give all the iref aeration they possessed
bill. with referent t to it, whether it told in 'layout or against
them. Tue Government, however, had pronounced a
censure upon Lord Cunning's policy without informe-
tion, and they were going to get rid of a direct censure
on their conduct by adopting an implied one; but he
thought the house would not arr:ve at snob an important
cencludoo. (Hoer hear.) II
,on. members on the Minis-
terial side of the house said the real question, 33 raised
!ay the right lion. gentleman the member for Oxford,
teal between nu • rsuing a poll- yof cletneecy and a policy
of cruelty, tflear, bear, and cheers.) He was rot there
to defend a revengeful p dicy or a tyrannical or cruel
rule, but to ask the hoes: to 4.1.al fairly and justly to the
man who, in a tremendous crisis', and in the midst of the
greatest dangers arid alarm, had al in.sst alone
amongst his erear t
.ryrnen in India resisted the cry of
blood. (Lead cheers.) Leal Canning had thrown the
whole weight of his ilifluence and authority against
those who bad clamoured for indiscriminate justice, and
he (Lord Goderich) warm here to defend "clemency Can-
ning " a eHans, which ho (Lord Goderich) looked upon as
conveying the highest hititle of h-
pre Imo
Canning. (Cheers.) But what did gentlemen on the
Mini torial side cf the house mean when they spoke of a
revengeful policy ? He had board tnaay smegestioes as
to the course that ought to be pursued towards the re-
bels and mutineers. It had been said that every man
taken in arais agai• '
natue ought to be put to death, except
a few who shoel.l he resorted for a worse punishment
than that. and that he ' ,
licy gentlemen On the other side of the house approved.
(Opposition cheers and "cries of "no, no," from the Mi-
eisterial benches )if , hen. members on the Ministerial
side of the house disaperoverl cf the- policy, be referred
them to a recent speech of Lord Derby's in another
place, in which that noble lord had laid down that cer-
tain of the Indian rebels should be reserved for a worse
puniehment than d .h • sta —via, by keeping them in eon-
fieement, arid Make them drag out an existence less pre-
ferable than death. (Hear, bear.) Teat might be the
ministerial policy, but it certainly TVASI not the policy of
the Opp?sitient (asar.) To that they opposed Lord
Cenning a policy contained in hi orders issued in Jul
aid ii'Aeed that due consideration for him which the el:
gencies of the case demands.?, They wero, however,
called upon to decide a question cf greater importance
than the interest tf an individual, viz., whether they
should apnreve of, or condemn the course that had been
taken by the G seams:tient in censuring the Gov, raor-
General in the midst of a state if things , x ting in India
that was likely tee endanger the rafety of that empire,
and inevitab'y multiply the ma,,f,11 difficulties the GJ.
vernor-General had to encounter, and leave him to meet
them with his bands weakened. (dear.). The course the
Government had pursued led inevitably to the conclu-
sion that her Mejostfa Government were ready to
reverse the arrangement Whit:ll had become a part of the
settled policy of that contry, and abandon provinces of
our Indian empire whit',, as Minittsre of the Crown it
was their duty to reada. (Rear.) He had heard it
said on the other side of the house that every man taken
in arms against us in India ought to be put to death, or
reserved for a worse fate (murmurs,.
) Was that their
t
policy, or was it not . (ul, n°-) They disapproved of
it, there "ire every rieu;',o
(cheer,,` and counter cheers).
He himself bad heard a noble lord in another place deli-
berately recemtnendthat pence,
Y and a right hon, and
learned gent'onen in that house (00, no, toad "read").
Well, be a crat! read the remarks of the ndele lord to
whom he ref, rred. They were ae follows :
"But for every one who fought against us, or who
treacherously joined the ranks of our opponents, whether
soldiers or not—for them, if taken in arms against us, there
is but one righteous penalty, and that is death (cheers
from the ministerial benches). But fur those miscreants,
who perpetrated upon the healers of onr women and chil-
dren atrocities and barrens over which human nature
sielerne, and the veil of deceeey tur,l.,
i , be drewn, who have
been guilty of unineeginebl atrocities 'against human
net ore----fer them desalt is too slight a puni,hrneut.
What punishment, what terror, can death inflict upon
them, when one man who was about to be blown from
a ennuee'e mouth—believing that a short and suddea
death would put an and to his sufferiegs—tells you that
he i ice rejoicieg in this, ',het with his own hell he
eleuebtered threat er four of Your cmin a y men and country-
women. For such aim death is a., punislitnee I. They
should here the heavier doom inflieted upon them of
protraetad life, of life, with the Lratid of CAM upon their
bro w, denoting their offence, lest any man sly them.
Severe, degrading, painful corpereal punishment should be
their lot. Hopeless, censtaut slavery should be their. fate.
Cendeineed to the most degrading occupations, he they
Brahmins of the highest caste they should he the slaves of
the lowest periall ; aril is chains rend in hopeless boning.
they should drag out an existence to which death itself
would be a relief they shoul t vainly pray for—a terror to
those who may be tempted te share in their gent -an
obieet of contemptuous execration to those whose feelings
in tho tenderest points they have outraged."
(Cries of "Haar, hoer," from all sides of the house.)
That was the tt I he r momtnended by the Earl of Derby.
An Hon. MEMBER—Yes, for mutineers. (Cheers.)
Lord GODERICHs—The Dale lord (the Bail of

THE OUDE DESPATCHES.

Sir J. V. SHELLEY wished to 11E11 the C'uanc.lior
of the Exchequer whether ho would undoubtedly lay the
despatches from India upon the table to-night. (Cries
of "Order.")
The SPEAKER intimated that the hon. gentleman
was not in order in putting a question unless it were
relevant to the bill before the house.
Sir J. V. SHELLEY. moved the adjournment of
the debate, in order to put himself in order. It was lin •
portant to understand whether these papers were to be
immediately ltil before the house, or whether there was
any reason why they should not be in the bands of
members.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCIIEVER.—I
thought that my answer was sufficiently clear. (Hear.)
The hon. gentleman must remember that
when papers
of importance ore sent home and received there are
many &rcumstaaces which a Minister must consider be•
fore he can promise to place them on the table. (Chu: r 7.)
He has to consider not only the public interest, hilt the
feelings of private individuals and their friends. All that
I undertook wag, that if they were presented to Parlia-
ment—: nd on that point I did not give an opinion—l
would take care that they were presented in time to be
in the hands of members to-morro morning. (Cheers.)

Lord J. RUSSELL—I cannA bit think that the
question of my hon. friend was perfectly reasonable,
because it is understood that papers have been received
in this country, some of which contain observations;
against the proclamation issued by Lord Canning, and
others contain his own views on that proclaination.
There may he remarks affecting individuals' and state-
ments that ought not to be published, but I do not con-
ceive, while we are still carrying on a great debate in
cfnich it is admitted that we are Lot in possession of the
grounds on which the Governor-i General acted, that it
would be right for the Government totally and cntirely
to ref ase the publication of those papers. (Cheers.) I
think that whatever may be the modifications which the
right boa. gentleman may make, he cannot, but agree to
the production of the papers which ought to be in our
p Isuession.

Mr. VANSITTART asked whether there wore any
other letters received from Lord Canning relative to the
Oude proclamation before those mentioned by the noble
lord.

Lord PALMERSTON—I have stated that there
ware no'.

Sir H. WILLOUGHBY was sure the noble lord (J.
Russell) would not be an advocate for layieg papers on
the table without due consideration. The house had only
jut learnt a lesson on that subject. (A. laugh.) Tea
Chancellor of the Exchequer would neglect a public
duty if he did net take care that these papers were not
hid without duo consideration.
Lord J. RUSSELL—I did not say that due conside-
ration ought not to he used. I only meant to say that
the papers ought not to be totally refused. (Hear.)
Mr. SCOTT said, that the despatches received by the
right hon. gentleman (Mr. V. Smith) related to the pre-
st:int subj-pct Of debate. They appeared to be a continua-
tion c f other despatches that had previoudy arrived, sad
it wa,, therefore, only fair to the house t.-..at the noble
lord (Palmer-ton) and the right hon. gentlemen (Mr. V.
Smith) should give the house those parts of these letters
that related, not to private, but to public affairs, so that
they might he laid on the table at the same time ar the
desp:itcbe; of the Governor-GPneral just r.cnived.
Lord P.A.LMERSTON sald that if ho received any
despatchei he should be very happy to croduce them.
(" Oh I")
Mr. MILE 3 s.e;tl that the noble lord the member for
the City of London had entirely misuridvntood the an
seer of h:s ri!ht hon. friend (Mr. Disraeli). It et, me 3
p,r • fectly clear that a Minister of the Crown would ai .t
promise to h.; them immediat ly bef ire the hon e.
(Hear.) Ilk right hou. friend said that if he could
duce thorn they should be in the hands cf meml..ere cc
wort c;v:, moriiirqr. (Hear, hear.)

Mr. ../I.Y.EZTON wished to point out the extrordinAry
~, cour,o which svgs being pressed tipnist the
ortovern n Lt.
Tao motion was made to exellrle from considerat:,:n th,
came and the couseqnenc3s of the proclamation ; but
now there was a w,-,nd .trfal desire to have both the came
and the c mse.quen:!eo; considered. (*lear, hear.) If t'ln
mover of tic resolution wkbed to go into th,rge quo,-
tiona he ,hol:11,'o so honestly, by amending his mot-00.
(Cheers frelt the Ministerial benches.) Why no•J, ae f
all paper', and demand either the bporr.val or oo„,i,„.•
aa.ion f the procla;ration ? (Rear.) Let the right h.m.
{ei,timlau take thst cour:e or &olio by that into which
• e hal fallen—viz., of conAdering the despatch apart
101 l ;be question which it raked. Though it might br,
come the right hon. gentlewao (Ur. azdwell) to ai.id

,way all proprietary rights in the kingdom of Oude
it will have these results—that there will be nobody 'con-
nected with the land but the Government of India and
the humble cultivator who tills the soil -- (heal) —and
that the whole. produce of the land of ()tide and of theindustry of its people, will be divided into two
most unequal portions ; the large share will go to the
Government in the shape of tax, and the smaler
share, ehich w:11 be a handful of rice per da will
go to the cultivator of the soil. (Hear.) Now this the
Indian system. It is the grand theory of the civilians
under whose advice I very much fear Lord Canning has
unfortunately acted; and you will find in many parts of
India, especially in the Presidency of Madras, that the
Foaulatlon consists entirely of these humble cultivators',
and that the Government stands over them with a
screw, which is perpetually turned, leaving the handful
of rice a day to the ryot, and transferring all the rest of
the produce of the soil into the exchequer of the East
India Company. Nov, I believe that the proclamation
sanctions this policy, and I believe further, that the re-
solution which the right hon. gentleman asks the house
to adopt sanctions that proclamation—(hear)—that it
will be so read in India, and that whatever may be.the
infiusnce—unfortunate as I believe it will be—of the
proclamation itself, the statement that this, the highest
court of appeal, has pronounced in favour of Lord Can-
ning's policy will be one of the most unfortunate decla-
rations that ever went from the Government of India to
the people of that country. (Cheers.) Let me, then,
for one minute—and it shall be only for one minute—
draw the attention of the house to our pecuniary deal-
ings with Oude. A friend of mine has extracted from a
book on tLis subject two or three facts which, as we are
considering t e policy of England towards this afflicted
country, I should like to read to the house. It is stated
that under the government of Warren Hastings up to
the arrival of Lord Cornwallis. in 1736, the Eest India
Company obtained from the King of Oude, and therefore
from the industry of the people of Oude, the sum of
9,252,000 L Under Lord Cornwallis they received
4,290,000/. ; un ftir -Lord Teigneneuth 1,280,0001. ; and
under Lord Wellesley, 10,358,000/. 'This, I, ought to
say, includes the acquisition of the Doaa in 1801, in
lieu of a subsidy, the revenue of that district being
1,352,000/. Coming down to 1814, there was in
that year a loan of a million, in 1815 a loan of
in 1816 a loan of a million, in 1825 a loan I
of a million, in 1826 a loan of a million, in 1829,
600,0001., and in 1838, 1,700,0001. Some of, them are
loans, and in one ease the loan was repaid by the cession
of a portion of territory, which the Company in a very
few years, and under an excuse which I should not like
to justify, reannexed, and therefore the debt was virtu-
ally never repaid. The total of all these sums is
31,500,0001., in addition to which the people of Oude
have paid vat amounts in salaries, pew-ions, and emolu-
ments of every kind to the Company's servants in the
employment of the Government of Oade. Now, I am
not going further into details, but I say that the history
of ..ur counexime with the country wacee interests we
are now discussing is of such a nature that it ought to
make us pause before we consent to any measure which
shall fill up the cup of injury which we have presented
to the lips of the people. (Cheers.) Two years ago we
deposed the sovereign of Oude. Everything that he had
was seized ; much of it was soli. Indiguity and wrong
were offsred to his family, as the governors of that
kingdom. I have heard some hon. gentlemen speaking
from this &de endeavour to persuade the house that
this cenfiacatien policy only intended that we should
reed: re the taxes of Oade (hear; heat) ; but that is a
delusion ; it is a statement so ab -mi that I am asto-
nished that even hon. members who euapert this mo-
tion should offer L. to the house. (A. leurgh.) In 1856,
when you dethroned the King of Oude, yen stepped
into his place, you became the recipient.: of all legiti-
mate 11 ttional taxes ; and now, having seized the
500,000/ a-year, the revenue of that emetry, toreder
solemn treaty coivaiairea a clause that if there was aey
surplus revenue it should be put to the credit of the
kingdom of Ourie, and having, contrary to the treaty,
applied that surplus to the general purp.isee of ladie,
yeti descend below the rank of the king, and to every
talooadar, to every landowner large or small, to every
roan who has a proprietary right in the soil, to every
men but tee steeliest, the hutntiest capitalist who cukti-
votes it—to a'l tan se you sty, in language which canon:
b. tnisteken, "Come do n from tee in lependance and
dignity you bare hitherto ci.j yeti. As we have done
in other provinces in India wi shall do her-: Two-
fifths, of you hace not been mixed up in this war,
but in dill general confiscation ianocar.t roust
cellar eith the guilty, for such is iL3 fortune of
war, and sech is the reaf irtune which we are about to
inflict upon you." (Ceeere) If this be riot a proctana-
t:on of unheard of severity, box comes it that so many
persons have proseeted against it? Die any man in
tue world believe that the noble lord the member for the
the \Vest 'tiding understaeds this proclamation better
than the ii!ga authorities whose opiatons Lave
been qu slo i ? (Cowers.) Dies be suppose that the llou
of eozotliozs wi 1 take hie authority open a inetter
this kind before that of the united press-ef India ? (Cries
of Oa, oh I and cheers.) I d say hon. members have
not read anything in the newspapers of India upon the
subject. Some of them applaud the proclamation be-
cause, they say, that at one fell swoop it does that
which line taken us 20 years to do in other dietricts—
it destroys every man who can iefluence the pe lite of
the country against the Britieli ru:e. Others say that it
is a proclamation of such a character that it mu ,t cause
war to the knife against the English name in Ou aad
that the Governor-General who issued ,uch a document
ought to have been prepared with a new army at his
back in order to enforce it. (Gear, hear) Toe right
Iron. gentleman the AAoreey-General for Ireland re-
ferred to what was said two or three weeks ego by the
hon. and learned member for Devonport (Sir E. Perry).
I will call the house to witness whether, when, in an-
swer to my cpeestion which brought out this despatch,
the Chasc.iller of the Exchequer said that with respect;
to the policy of confiscation—for that is the only Oriel;
in the proclamation about which there is any dispute—
the Government disavowed it in every sense,—l call the
house to witness whether every gentleman present down
hero (below the gangway) did not cheer that sentiment.
(Cheers ) Why, of course, every man cheered it. They
would not be men, they would not be Eoglikisen, they
wasllaoZ, be English legislator?, if they net done so.
They would be men who had never Laird what was just
and right if, at the very instant they heard the de-
claration of the Grovernmeet, every instinct within
them did not compel them to an enthusiastic assent.
hear.) Is was only when the fatal influent: of
party—(':a•:ers)—and the arts that partyknows.how to
employ—(renewed cheerios)—were put in mutton that
hen. gentlemen began to discover thao. there was some-
thing 'serious and dangerous in this memorable despatch,
Now, I would ask the house—because that is the ques-
tion—are we prepared to sanction the policy of that
despatch 1 lam sorry that it did not occur to me until
alter the amendment now before the house was proposed,
or I would have moved an amendment expressly on
that point; because I fecl—l speak it without the
slightest reference to the influence it may have on any
party in this house—that it is of the very highest con-
sequence that whatever decision we come to shall be in-
capable of any misinterpretation when it arrives in
India. We have been treated to a good deal of eloquence
upon the manner of the despatch, and I mutt say a word
or two upon that point. The noble lord the member far
London has fallen into the error committed by most of
the speakers in favour cif the resolution—the error
namely, of treating some of the outside circumstances of
the case as if they were the case itself. (Hear.) He
did not sta'o that there was a single word iu the de-
spatch which was not true—(hear, hear)—although he
did express what I thought was a rather immoral senti-
ment for so eminent a statesman. (Alaugh.) The noble
lord told us that after a great crime had been committed
men in offle-s were never to let it be known or suspected
that they thought it was a crime, (Cheers.)
Lord J. RUSSELL—Tee hen. gentleman is mistaken;
I never said anything of the kind.
Mr. BRIGHT-1 did not hear the noble lord, but I
read his speech, and I can say positively that many
friends of mine, net members of this house, have eome to
the same unfortunate conclusion as myself. The noble
lord, however, did not say what I have just told the
house, but what he did say was, that there was a great
deal of sarcasm and invective in the despatch, and ne
road a passage to show that such was the case. Bat
the fact is a good deal depends upon the retailing. (Hear,
hear.) I could read a despatch of the noble lord in
such a manner as to astonish the house with its
concealed irony and sarcasm. (Laughter) The noble
lord, if I are not mistaken, told the house that if
the despatch were a proper despatch to be sent out to
India Lord atening was not fit to occupy the meanest
official situation. Now, Indian despatches have never
been very gentle. I have read over and over again in
Mill's illstary despatches sent out by the President of
the Board of Control and the Court of Directors, and I
have often thought that they were written in a tone
rather more authoritative and dictatorial than I should
myself be disposed to use or pleased to receive. (Hear.)
The explanation is obvious. In old times the magnates
sitting in Leadenhall-street were writing, not to Lord
Canning or men of that altitude, but to merchants and
agents whom they had sent to India, who were entirely
dependent upon them, and to whom they could say just
what they liked. The consequence is, that their des-
patches for 100 years had a character for severity and
arrogance which I think might now well be dispensed
with. (Hear, hear.) Still, that is a matter to be taken
'Lao consideration when many of us are disposed not
only to censure Lord Ellenborough, but to dethrone a
Government because a despatch has not been written
precisely in those gentle terms which we think ought to
bo employed in a document addressed to the Governor-
General of India. (hear, hear.) But the noble lord
i the member for London ought to be very forbearing, n-
I asmuch as he lives in a house as brittle as that of any of

Derby) said for all who had joined in the mutiny.
An Hon. MEMBER (from the Radical benches)—
Treacherously joined. (Hear, and cheers.)
Lord GODERICH—That might be the policy of hon.
members oil the Ministerial side of the house. It was
not that of the Opposition. (Cries of "Hear, hear,) He
should conclude by saying that he would not wriggle
cut of the question that was fairly before the house by
cot ng for the amendment of the hon. member for S Nau-
sea, and he should therefore support the resolution of
his right hon. friend the member for Oxford. (Great
cheering from the Opposition.)

i Mr. BRIGHT—I am afraid that lam hardly able to
• take part in this discussion in a manner becoming the
magnitude of the question, or in any degree in accord-
ance with the anxiety I have long felt with regard to
Indian affairs. I happen, however, unfortunately and
accidentally to have been mixed up with this matter, and
my name has been frequently referred to in the course of
the debates in this and in the other House of Parliament,
and I am therefore unwilling to sit still and vote without
expressing my opinion to the house. (Hear.) In the first
place I may, perhaps, be allowed to say that almost
everything which has been said or imagined with regard
to any part which I have had in bringing onShis discus-
sion has been altogether erroneous and without any
foundation whatever. (Hear, hear.) There was no
arrangement whatever between the hon. gentleman the
Secretary to the Beard of Control and myself with re-
gard to the question which I thought it my duty to put
to the Government on the subject of Lord Canning's
proclamation. I had some time before spoken to the hon.
gentleman on the subject, because I had been informed
by Mr. Dickinson, a gentleman who has an extensive
correspondence with India, that some-proclamation of
this character was in preparation and was about to be
i- sued, and when I spoke to the hon. gentleman upon
the subject he told me that ho had no information with
regard to ia and I told him then that if anything of the
sort took place I should put a question to the Govern-
ment on the subject. That conversation took place three
weeks before I put the question which I did put to the
hon. gentleman, and when I read the proclamation in
the newspapers I came down to the house, not having
seen the bun. gentleman in the meantime. (hear.) On
my way down I met my hon. friend the member for
Swelport, and he told me that, having read the procla-
mation in the newspaper, and knowing my intentions
upon the subject, he had till the hon. gentleman the
Secretary to the Board of Control that he thought that
in all probability I would put a question to him upon
the subject. I came down to the house and put my
question, and the answer which I received is before the
house and b fore the country, and I confess that I did
not think that we were going to lose a week from the
daces-ion of the Indian resolutions oa account of that
question. (hear.) At regard the qeesaon before the
house I should have been content to leave it as it was
when the hon. and learned Soliciter-General sat down—
(seer)—and I think that then the bone mieht very well
have come to a vote. (Hear.) I could not but com-
pare the speech of the hog, and learned gentleman with
that of the right hon. gentleman the member for Oxford.
(Loud criee of "Hear.") I thought that the right hoc-
curable member fur Oxford tacked together a great
many very small matters in an attempt to make up
some great case, and it appeared to me that he ad-
dressed the house in a manner which indicated
that he himself was not perfectly satisfied with the
comae which he was pursuing—(loud cries of " Hear,
hear ")—for I think that if he had been stimulated
by the sense that he was nudertakine a e,,reat public duty
he would 'nave delivered a more lively and impressive
speech. (liver, anil a laugh.) N iw, the speech of the
hoc. and learned Solicitor-General—and I think that
every gentleman who heard it will agree wall nee--wag
closely logical and appeared to exhaust the vagumeitte
which might be 'lied; and I have net spoken to any one
who will not admit that speech was a complete answer
to all that is a, all serious in the charge now brought
against the Gocerninent, (Cheers.) The motion now be•
fore the house is impel teat cateidered in two aspects—
in the first pates, as affmiing the intereets of party at
home—which some person., perlatpa alight think the
most importaat ; and, in the second place, as to tLo
effect which will be peodueei upon them frode of the pea-
ple of In tic by this discus ion and the division abotr, to
;eke pleee. Now, let us beer in rnial that the greet bulk
of the native princes, whether. under or rot subject to
English rule are ni t very like), t c 7rrectly underaterid
what is the result of any cabal or p illtieal C ,CI4p;IT:Cy.
(hoe'.) They w nothing of indaeduals here, and
those "lend cheers" whin in a cleat,, excise us so much
here are nothing whatever to them. The question which
they will ask will hie what is the opitneet of the P..riia-
meat of England with regard t) tee policy announced
in the proclamation of Lerd Caniting—(ctteco—and I
compaeiu, arid I think the house hail a right to countilain
ani
sawyi hear)
wind
h ea
rTt Tae
es
doesnd oe l e
not
blow,l
ootr hn et
that tha re,olution of the right hon. ceetaraa3 cat efelly
de
atlllove'nf lidebsee
ttr htfhaUetr (linth3acetstl,.Sir'''en,b.tyltall:desi
Luz
that he wishes to deal with it in a direct manner. Now,
w hat can be less direct than the resolution itself ?
(Hear, hear.) And that it is so has been proved by the
fact that through the -.Weole course of the debate
every s ratites argument which ha.; been used, every
serious feeling weigh has been txprested, bee had re-
ference to the character and nature of the proclama-
tion, and not to those little matters which Lave been
mixed up with this great queetioe. (Hata) one,
I believe, defends the pros imitation. Geer.) All that
has been done is to endeavour to show that it was nut
rightly understood by those who censured it as announ-
cing a policy of confiscation. In lac we are asked to
believe that it means something which it does not say,
and that it does net mean that which in the Eaglish
language it distinctly states. (Llama) The right hon.
gentleman asks the house to do that which appears to
be an absolute impossibility, for he wants us to con-
demn the censure without expressing any opinion as to
the po:icy of the proclamation. New, I do not believe
that the right host. gentleman, although he has unfortu-
nately been led into this movement—(loud cheers)—
wishes the house to pronounce an opinion in favour of
the principle of confiscation. (Renewed Lamers.) No
man, I believe, would wish us to pronounce that opinion
—(t)ear)—but if we pronounce now a deci,iou against
that ceucure, I ask any man whether it is possible that
the people of India can form any other opinion tean
that the House of Commons is favourable to tee prin-
ciple of tho proclamation ? (aear, hear.) With regard
to the publication cf their censure by the Government,
I can only say that it is remarkable how men can turn
round upon that which they. themstltee formerly pro-
fessed. Upon this side of the house hon. gentlemen have
efteu complained that the secrecy of the Foreign-office
and of other departments has been the cause of the
greatest possible mischief—(hear)—and will they now
Bay that the publication of their censure by the Govern-
ment was a very higher:me and misdemeanour? (Heara
Why, surely, hon. gentleman below the gangway upon
this side of the louse ought to regard it frith some de-
gree of sympathy as leaning rather to the side of virtue.
(Elear.) Now, with regard to the language of the de-
spatch, why any Government or any Minister might be
censured if we chose to take up every word of e. cry de-
spatcb. (Hear.) Some men are more strongly im-
pressed than °triers, and write with stronger feeling—,
and I for my own part like persons to write and speak
in a way that they can be understood. (Laughter
and hoar, hear.) In my opinion the motion
before the House is a disingenuous attempt to lead the
House into a very unfortunate dilemma, and I think
that no judicial mind will deny that by voting for the
reeolu ion we aro acknowledging the policy of the pro-
chtnati.m—(No, no, and bear. hear)—sod that is a step
which will produce an effect which may be very den-
geroas in the minds of the population of India. (Hear.)
I now c 'ma to the real question, namely, the policy of
coufiecatioa as announced in the proclamation. (No,
no, and hear.) There are certain things upon which I
think we are all agreed, and one of them is that the
people of Oude are enemies, but they are not rebels.
(No, no, and bear, hear.) No, no ! Why, I thought
that I understoood that those persons who blame Lord
Ellenborough are of opinion that he would not have
been deserving of blame- if he bad written a deapetch
like that of the Court of Directors. (Hear, hear.)
Well, in that very despetch the principle is laid down
that tee people of Oude are not rebels and ought not to
be treated as rebel e but enemies ; and if so, then we
have no right to treat them otherwise than the law of
natiens indicates. Will the house accept that proposi-
tion? (No, no, and hoar. hear.) Very well, hon. gen-
tlemen who will act accept it cannot be included by the
noble lord the member for West Riding in the list of
those in favour of the policy of clemency and concilia-
tion. (Loud cries of hear, bear.) I am certain that
the people of England will accept that definition—(hear,
hear) —I am certain that civilised Europe will accept it ;
and I am equally certain that history, which will record
this debate, will accapt it as cue which no man claiming
to be a statesman, a moralist, or a Christian can pos-
sibly escape. I new come, and on that point I will be
as brief as possible—to the question, what is the mean-
ing of confiscating the proprietary rights in the soil ?
We have beard from a noble lord in another place, and
it has been steel in the course of the debate here, that
this sentence of confiscation refers only to certain un-
pleasant persons alio are called telookdars, who are
barons, anil robber chiefs, and the oppressors c f the
people. (aear, hear.) This is by ne means the first time
that after a great %neg has been committed the wrong-
doer has attempted to itijure by calumny those upon
whom the wrong has been inflicted. (Hear, hear) Lord
Shaftesbury, who is a sort of leader in this great war,
has told the world that this proclamation refers only to
600 persons in the kingdom of Oude. Let us tyke him
upon Lis own term. The kingdom of Dada La,
5,000,000 inhabitant', abut one-sixth cf the population
of the United Kingdom. Ape lied to the United King-
dom in tee same ratio, this population would affect
3,600 persons. In both Houses <f Parliament there are
probably 700 landed proprietors ; it would, therefore, be
an edict of centl,cetion to landed proprietors in the
United Kit glow equal to five times the number in both
Houses of Parliament (hear ) An Loa. gentleman al;
that I ate all alma; is my figures ; I shalt be glad to leas
his figures allerwarda laugh.) That is not the fact,
but it it were, it would amount, cot ton poittical, but to a
comelete suoild revolution in Oude; ame living in a coun-
try where we have one great province, in Scotland, be-
langiug to one member of tbe house of Lords, and 70 or
SO milee cf territory to another, rand having Duke. of
Bedford and Dukes of Devonshire in England, surely
we ought to be a little careful that we do wEhout
jsetrce overturn the proprietary rights of the greet
telookdera and landowners in Ragas. (Neer, bear.)
But it is a fact which anybody may ascertain by
rearrieg to books which have been written, and
witnesses who cannot be mistaken, that this document
applies to more than 40.000 landowners in the kingdom
tf Oude. Anil what is meant by these preprietary
right.? We must tee what is the general ceurse of
the policy tf our Government is India. If you sweep

ne. (Cheers and laughter.) When the noble lord takes
his pen in his hand it is irupossiolo to say what he will
send forth to the public. (Laughter.) I have known
the noble lcrd to write an c-xtraorJinary Ltter, which he
.übtiess intended to be my pryer in its
phraseology,
toa bishop. (11.enewed laughter) I am not ADXIOtI3 to
deal severely with the noble lord, but when a grave
statesman writes to eo holy a man ASass bishop one might
at lza,t expect that he would avoid tarcasin and invec-
tive. (Cheer:, and laugh:er.) Yet, in the letter to which
I refer the noble lord hurled his sareisai and invective
against sinus 6,000,000 of his fellow-subj,cts, and
did great inischitf to the peace cf the united king-
dom at the time. (iLar, near and cheers). I can tell the
noble lord of another letter, in which there was not
much sarcasm or invective, but an eannzing amount of
insinuation cf the most unplemant character. It was
written not to the Governor-General of India, a proc°ll-
EUI 10.000 tnilo9 away, but to a nobleman filling one
the most delicate and difficult offices connected with °f'
' Upon that
home government of the united kingdom
occasion tto noble lord transgressed further, for in the
most manner, when nobody asked him, he published the
letter, and thereby for a long period weakenedt the hands
anal damaged the _character of the no la viscount the
rumba f)r Tiverton. (Queers, anj. laughter.) There is

one other point which I must notice—the offset of the
despatch upon the feelings of Lord Canning.. I am not
so intimate with Lord Canning as many niembeis of
this house, 'out I have had the pleasure of his acquaints
eine, and have always thought that he was one of the
last men who would knowingly do anything inhuman or
unjust. (Hear, hear.) That is my opinion still. (Cheers.)
I think be is to be commiserated, as any other man in
his position wool! have been who happened to be is
India at such a time as the present ; and we are bound
to take a lenient view of such errors as we may suppose
he has committed: (Hear, bear.) If I were in India or
anywhere else in the service of the State. I should ex-
pect that there would be a general disposition to give
me fair play in the exercise of my office, and that no
strained construction to my injury would be put upon
anything which I did. (Hear.) Tbat is the view which
I hold with respect to Lord Canning. I have never said
a syllable against him in public, although I think some
of hie acts have been open to objection, and I am not
about to say anything against him now, (Hear, hear.) I
would not support a resolution which had for its object
the damaging of Lord Canning, and I think the hon.
member for Swansea has not done amiss in offering to
the house the amendment of which he has given
notice. (Hear, hear.) But it is just possible that
Lord Canning is in the midst of circumstances which
have rendered it difficult, perhaps impossible, • for
him to exercise his own calm judgment
upon the
great question which forms the subject of hisprocla-
mation. (Hear, hear.) I see in that proclamation
not an emanatii n from the humane and just mind of
Lord Canning, but an emanation from that mixture of
red tape and ancient tradition which is the foundation
of the policy of the old civilian council of Calcutta.
(Cheers.) But if it were a question of hurting Lord
Canning's feelings and denouncing his proclamation, I
could not hesitate as to the choice which I should make.
Private and personal feelings are but of slight and tempo-
rary importance compared with the vast and permanent
interests involved in the dangerous questions which we
are now discussing. (Hear, hear.) I think, moreover,
that the right hoe. gentleman the member for Oxford,
the nablo lord the member for the West Riding, and the
noble lord the member for- London, have no right to
throw themselves into contertions of agony—(a laugh)—
witis regard to the manner of the despatch, because, as
was stated the other night by the lettorney-General for
Ireland, they did not care so mu h for the feelings of
another public servant acting on behalf of the Crown at
a still greater distance from England, when last year
they joined in pronouncing an emphatic condemnation
of the conduct of Sir John Bowring. (Cheers.) I like
fair play, (Cheers.) I would treat Lord Canning as I
would treat Sir John Boa r;ng and Si,. John Bowring as
I would treat Lord Canning, (Hear.) Do not let us
have iu the service of the Sate low-caste men who may
be trampled upon at pleasure and high-caste men whom
nobody dare criticise. (Cheers.) I said when I began
that the resolution is important to something else beside
India. It is important to the position ef pernes in this
house. (Hear, hear) Lat me devote a few wards to
teat breach of the sutject. lam afraid—and I hope I
am not slandering anybody in saying so—that there is
quite as much zeal for what is called place as zeal for
the good of ue (Cheers.) If the despatch had been
published three months ago, when we were all sitting on
the other side cf the house, it is prebeble that many
gentlemen who now speak so severely of it would
have thought it a noble &spates, c mteining noble
se. timents, expressed in noble language. (Loud
cheers and laughter.) But for the last two
months there has been a ,`rowing irritation observable on
this side of the he use. (A. laugh.) There has been a
feeling which no ingenuity has been able to disguise—
(clsers)—tlat if the present Government remained in
office over the session no email difficulty would be found
in dilelacing it. (Continued cheers.) When a tree is
newly planted it n ay easily be pulled up, but it soon
strikes its roots right and left and downwards, and at
the end of a year the etrongeet man may not be able to
tear it cut of the ground. (Cheers.) Now, hon. gentle-
men oppoeite know that I (I.ff•r very widely from them
en many pane gut-alone, an l provably at no very die-
' tant (Inv they may find it out in some net of severe hos-
tility —(a laugh)—but I put it to the house whether out
cf dowel tbo reptration of the present Government is
no:, in ene.ey respects, better than that of the last
((liens ) i uofertelee to say that, with no exception,
the judgment of deputations from the couutry, for ex- -
ample, will be in favour of the manner in which they have
been ;ecieved by the present Ministers, and of the way
in which their t.iggezti9os requests have been treated.
(feeeere.) Itia,; nosy be no great master; Ido nit say it
is ; but I make the observation f r the benefit of gentle-
men who sit on this side ef the house, because it is pos-
sible that they ally Lave to receive deputations again.
(a. laugh.) Take the con 'not of th r present Ministers
in this how.e. I know i may be sail that being a weak
Government, aid not having a majority at their backs,
they are obliged to be very civil. (,' Hear, hear," and
a laugh ) Bat what I maintain is, that every Ministry
ought to be very civil to the House of Commove—
(cheer-)—and what I am prepared to assert is—we all
know the fact—that during the existence of the late Go •
vernment civility was entirely unknown. (Great cheer-
ing.) Take another point, for it is worthy of the coo•
Bid, ration of hon. gentlemen on this tile of the house ;
and I ask honourable gentlemen sitting below the gang-
way to look to the., hereditary trouelee that were
going on with resptet to our foreign policy, and
which the existing Gavernmount found they had to
deal with on their accession to office. There was the
Censpiracy Bln which would have landed you on
the very verge of a war, if not in war, with France. That
danger has ben avoided, by no concession, certainly, in-
jerious t i the honour of England. (Hear.) Take another
question which agitate 1 the p abhc mind with respect. to
Naples. I am not going into details on that subject ; but,
as fer as a Government could act I think this Government
has acted with judgment. (Hear, hear.) I believe the
noble lord below me (Lord J Russell) admitted that him-
self. With respect, then, to these questions, seeing the
dilemma to which the foreign affairs of the country were
brought under the last regime, it is but fair, generous, and
just that we on this side of the house should take no step
which bears the colour of faction for the purpose of
throwing the present Government out of office. (Cheers.)
Whenever I join in any act to put the right hon. gentle-
men opposite out, it shaq be for something I clearly un-
derstand, and something that the country will clearly un-
ehrstand—(eheere)—:_omething that shall offer a chance
of good to sumo portion of the British empire, and a
chance of advancing distinctly the great principles
which, if we are a party at all on this side of the house,
we profess to have agreed upon. (Hear,) But there is
another point to which I wish to advert. Not only is it
feared that the right hon. gentlemen opposite would get
firm in their seats, lout it was also feared that some mem-
bers near me might get less firm in their alliance with
right Lon. gentlemen on this s de. (Hear) I have heard
of mutinous discussions and meetings, and of language of
the most unpardonable character uttered, no doubt in the
heat of debate, as gentlemen say now. But something
was going on in committee room No. 11, which, it was
thought, unless it were put a stop ti, would break up
powerful ranks, which, if united, might storm the Trea-
sury bench, and replace the last Government in office.
(Cheers.) I believe it was intended that there should be
a desperate effort made to change the state of things
here before Whitsuntide. (Loud cheers.) That was a
resolution come to long before anybody knew anything
about Lord Ellenborough's despatch, and this teemed
to be a convenient opportunity, inasmuch as it ap-
peared to be defending an absent servant of the Crown,
and teaching a lesson to the government for what was
declared to bo their injudicious conduct in publishing
the despatch. Teis altogether appeared a very likely
occasion for putting forward a pretext on which right
hon. gentlemen might rile to office. (Rear, hear) Ido
not now speak to the Whigs in this house, or to those
gentlemen who have been in office and expect to be is
office again ; but I should like all those gentlemen who
call themselves indeplndent members, and who come to
this nouae with ineelenwt of place, patronage, favour, or
emolument of any kindlor theinselyes, but with the ho-
nest desire to serve their ceuntey as members of the
House of Commons, would consider what might be the
result of the present discussion... if the present resolu-
tion should be carried, it was ,Supposed that the oil go-
v,rnment, or some thine like it, would come back again.
Now, there was great discontent with thatgovernreent
before it want out of °filen; but no pledge has been
given as to its future conduct; no assurance that it
would be better or different than Ikermerly. No new
measures have been promised, no nisw policy avowed,
and no new men have been held forth to the public very
distinctly to take the high offices in the state; but there
has been something %na I think the members of this
house must have felt pain in witnessing. (Hear, hear.)
There have been newspapers greatly in the interest of
the ex-Treasury bench (cheers), and in themostruon-
blushing
knew exactly
manner articles have proceeded evidentlym
the pen of s nneeody (loud cheers) who
h f
what was wanted to be done. (Sear, hear) For exam-
ple,
whom I do
in committee-room No. nle gentleman.
case—a gentleman who
as the other circumstances of.hthtehe
not mean to mention, for de house knows him as well
meeting, is held oat,
took a moot prominent p
for a certain o
another gentleman, who made
and no one is tnifioreeeinidfigaannralteart fgtotvhearahmhiemnstelfca, as fixed
)thelriler olratoaoinved or seconded a resolution, is
a(Cshpeeeercsh.
he is to be placed ; and before
also held out for office, but it is not stated exactly in
positionere is held u tha glittering ball
place
.in. the incoming government. I
many what precise
o t
herst
that this is meant merely for the hon. gentle-
but the glittering ball is held up, and every
Eadmoofaennn'oi;steleaereYmpeeCted to look at it. (Loud cheers.) These
are not all the al is employed. lion, gentlemen sitting
bslow the gangway with us for years—gentlemen of the
most independent character— receive flattering and
beautifully engraved cards for great parties in splendid
mansions;
and not later than Friday last, of all times,
those invitations were scattered abroad, if not with
more liberal, no doubt ssi.h a more discriminating band
than Lreiterly. Oi course (it is very absurd, no doubt,
but that is why I mention it), if those cards of invitation
coetain,d a unto giving exactly a history of them, that.
note would say, " We have measured your head and
gauged your soul, end we know, or believe (for I believe
they do not know), that your principles which you came
to Parliaineet to support, your charaoter in this house,
and y, ur self-respect, will go for nothing in sight of a
meseratle tempta:ion like this.' (Cries of "Oh I" and
cheers.) If we could see those persons taking the counts
sail to ho takee by the celebrated horse-tamer, who ap-
pali, I am told, to the noble and intelligent instincts,
of the acitnal he tattles, then I should not complain ;
but they appeal to instincts which every honourable
mind repudiates, and to aspirations which I hope la()
gentleman in this Louse will be influenced by. (Clbstevo
Ifthey euceeed, what sort of Government should It,
e ? lam as anxious for a Liberal Government a,
any man in this house, bet I cannot believe that in this
pr Bent p 0.1,10 n of parties on this side of the house i
liberal rod solid Government can be formed. We are'
toll, and the whole country is fixed in expectation and