The Sun.
London, England, 1867-06-21 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAHENT

HOUSE OF LORDS.—TINS EVENING.
The LORD CHANCELLOR took his soat on the woolsack at
fire o'clock.

PRIVATE BUSINESS.

Svailbeach Mine Estate, Duke of Cleveland's Estate,
Chichester Harbour Embankment, Cardiff and Penarth
Road, Neath and Brecon Railway, and Crickhowell Gas
and Water Bills were road a third time and passed.
THE PRISONERS IN ABYSSINIA.
Lord STRATFORD DE REDCLIFFE said that he
would ask the noble lord at the head of her Majesty's
Government what was the condition, and what steps had
been taken in the matter relative to the prisoners who
were in the dungeons of King Theodore. He would
quote from a work well known, in which Captain
Spoke, a gentleman who been 10 years in those dis-
tricts, says that Mr. Cameron. her Majesty's consul in
Abyssinia had, with their families, been kept three years
in confinement by King Theodore. He thought that the
attention of the Houses of Parliament ought to be called
to the question, and as it was a national question, where
the honour and integrity of the country was concerned, it
should be taken up by her Majesty's Government.
We ought to vindicate the honour of the na-
tion by inquiring into every point connected with
iniquitous a matter. -What he would ask was—what aro
the number, condition, and quality of the British subjects
confined in Abyssinia, and what steps had been taken in
the matter by her Majesty's Government, and whether
any steps had been taken, and whether it was their in-
tention to take any stops in the matter.
Lord DERBY said that anticipating the question of the
noble lord, he had made the fullest inquiries at the Foreign
Office. The number of captives altogether was 18, and
communications had been continually addressed to the
Emperor of Abyssinia. A letter bad been sent out to the
Emperor, to which, although they knew it had been re-
ceived, no answer had arrived. With regard to all the
papers, they should bo happy to give the house all the in-
formation on the subject.
Lord STRATFORD DE REDCLIFFE asked whether
the prisoners were still in chains.
Lord DERBY said he could not answer that, but the
last information was that they were not.
THE COMMISSION ON RITUALISM.
The ARCHBISHOP OF YORK said that he objectedto certain persons whose names were placed on the Ritual-
istic Commission. Several prominent gentlemen
appeared upon it had pledged themselves to one sid.eorwthe
other. There were two gentlemen who had written on
the question from opposite points of v. He
should therefore on those grounds object to them serving
on the Commission.
The subject then dropped.
THE INCREASE OF THE EPISCOPATE BILL.
On the moving of the third reading of this bill,
Lord SHAFTESBURY stated that whoever might
object to any increase in . the Episcopate, no one
could deny the great Spiritual destitution in Eng-
land and Ireland. He found that iu the diocese of
Rochester there were 601 benefices, many of which were
without residence, and 181 under £2OO. 'rho late inde-
fatigable Bishop ofi London had stated that he wanted 2A
more clergymen for parochial assistance. If aid
was not given to supply the spiritual and
moral wants of the people, if nothing was
done by the new Reform Bill to alleviate this want, not
want of good feeling from impotence to do so ; he (the
noble earl) would not give 25 years for the existence
of the British empire. He had no objection to the in-
crease of the number of bishops, but the amount required
for the creation of three bishops would be not less to
maintain their property than £200,000. The spiritual
wants of the people ought to bo the first consideration of
the house.
The Bishop of OS FORD said that this was one of the
most important questions that could come before the house.
He could not, however, agree with the noble lord's figures
at all. Now it was a fact that out of the episcopal fund the
the bishops had boon giving £350,000 a year to small
livings. lie did not wish that there should bo an
addition of the bishops for the sake of the prelates
themselves, but in the words of the noble earl
opposite, their appointment was to strengthen and inspirit
.the clergy in the country. The sum mentioned by the
noble lord opposite would go but very little towards re-
lieving the spiritual wants of the country. He thought
that the clause relating to the common fund should be left
out altogether, and the matter left entirely to Parliament.
[LEFT SMOG.]

HOUSE OF COMMONS—THis EVENING.
Tho SPEAKER took the chair at 2 o'clock.
REPRESENTATION OF THE PEOPLE BILL.

The house went into committee on this bill.
On clause 31,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER stated tha,
he proposed to insert in the clause the names of the gentle-
men proposed as Boundary Commissioners, viz., Lord
Eversley, Lord Penrhyn, Mr. Walter, Mr. Bouverie, Mr.
Russell Gurney, Mr. Bramstone, and Sir J. Duckworth.
The right hon. gentleman said he should, if it was the
wish of the house, postpone proceeding with the motion
until the new clauses were brought up.
Mr. GLADSTONE thought that course would be the
' most desirable one to pursue.
Mr. BRIGHT complained that the names of the gentle-
men proposed, however unobjectionable, would not give
great satisfaction, becalso hone of them had taken any
very active part in theirtssing of the bill. He thought it
desirable to appoint a body in which the public would
have conlid,nce, and that there should be coma claust
framed to define the powers of the Commissionem ife
was not alt disposed to co-der such extens:ve powers as it
was now proposed to entrust to the Commissioners with-
out sonic ilimt as to their authority. Hu thought the
right hon. gentlen:an, in the inter,st of the bill,
would lipp.tint upon the cetmnissi,n at least
one gentleman who had shown during the
discussion of the bill au honest tut,' earnest desire to make
the bill a really good one for the representation of the
pooph..

Cilon,.l KNOX desired to know whether the hon. mem-
ber for Birmingham wished to hive seine of the Reform
League or those who made the row in Hyde Park upon
the commission ; or did he desire a selection from the
Fenians, whose petition, which was presented by the
hon. member, and was received with disdain and disgust,
was ultimately laid upon the table of the house; or did
the hon. gentleman wish a selection made from the names
it contained; or did he want Mr. Boales appointed to serve
on the commission ?

Sir J. GREY though; under tho circumstances, the
postponement of settling the names of the boundary com-
missioners was most desirable.

Mr DENISIAN thought it would be better to have men
of pronounced opinions as boundary commissioners, and
that, instead of those names submitted, a thorough-going
Liberal on the one side, and a thorough going Tory on the
other, should at least be placed upon the commission. Be-
fcre the matter was brought on for discussion he hoped
the right hon. gentleman would reconsider the composition
of the commission.

Mr. BERESFOItD HOPE said that it would have been
the best and wisest course to have made the ap-
pointment of the Boundary Commissioners antecedent to
the consideration of the Government proposal relative to
the distribution of seats. (Hear, hear.) He felt the motion
as it stood was one that would lead to party agitation for
further elective privileges in the course of a year or so, a
matter that was extremely undesirable.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said tho
greatest care had been exercised in collecting the names of
those gentlemen whom it was proposed to submit as mem-
bers of the boundaries of boroughs and counties. The
great object of the Government was to get the best members
for the commission, without respect to party; and he
thought it was the best that could be devised. He could
not undertake to lay a copy of the instructions givon to
the commission before the names of the commissioners
were fixed upon. It was of great importance that party
feeling should bo set aside on this occasion, and on Alon-
day, when the question was discussed, ho thought there
would be no difficulty in coming to a clear conclusion in
the matter.

Mr. BRIGHT objected very much to the composition of
the commission. He did not see why Lord Penrhyn, a
member of the House of Peers, should be a member ; then,
again, the hon. member for Southampton—he had, in addi-
tion to his Parliamentary duties, his duties as Recorder.
Mr. Walton had been a county member, and hoped to be
so again, besides which he was connected with a powerful
journal, to which the Government appeared to pay a great
deal of court at the present moment—besides which he en-
tertained a fanatical admiration for what was called the
territorial system of the country. Mr. Bramston had been
a county member, and, on the whole, the commission, if it
was appointed as at present proposed, would not give satis-
faction to the House or the country. He did not
for one instant imply that any of the gentlemen
would act otherwise than with the greatest honour, but
still he thought that they were not the best fitted per-
sons who could be selected. He had an opinion that com-
missioners ought not to bo members of Parliament at all ;
but he would not further refer to that matter. With re-
spect to the assistant commission—the actual persons who
would have to do the work—they were to be appointed by
the seven gentlemen commissioners. That was not alto-
gether the best arrangement that could be come to. In
the event of no alteration being made in the consti-
tution of the commission, he should move the omission
of some of the names and the introduction of others, and
also an addition to the number if such should be thought
desirable. He did not see nhy the number should be
seven. He thought nine would be a better number, and
would enable a stronger and more efficient body being
selected. He gave notice of his intention of doing as he
intimated, if it should become necessary, on Monday next.
After some further discussion, the consideration of the
subject was postponed until Monday next.
Clause 32, on account of the rejection of the clause
relative to voting papers, was struck out.
On clause 33 being proposed,
Mr. DENMAN moved an amendment, the effect of
which was to extend the provisions of the 79th sec. of the
Gth of Victoria, chap. 18, to the new voter as well as the
old one.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thought
the motion could be more easily done by striking out the
clause, as the object he bad in view was, he thought,
effected by the 40th clause.
The clause was accordingly struck out, and clauses 31
and 35, which related to rating, having been previously
considered and agreed to, clause $G was then taken into
consideration, which proposed to treat the corrupt pay-
ment of rates as bribery.
Sir B. KNIGHTLEY moved an amendment to the
clause, and considered the payment of the railway travel-
ling expenses of a voter going to poll might just as well
be treated as bribery.
Mr. ROEBUCK. thought if the words were left out it
would be going against the entire spirit of the act. If a
man was excused from payment of rates he was not a per-
son who ought to be upon the roll of voters. (Hear,
hear.) Suppose a man were to say to a person seeking
his vote, " I've not paid my rates," that person would re-
ply, " Oh, very well, I'll pay them for you, and then you
can vote for me." Such an arrangement it would bo
ridiculous to look upon in any other light than bribery.
A long discussion followed, during which it was sug-
gested that tho clause should be taken out of the bill and
referred to the committee at present sitting to inquire into
corrupt practices at elections. Tho amendment of Sir R.
Knightly was ultimately negatived without a division.
Sir F. Goldsmid then moved an amendment in another
part of the clause to the effect that any person paying the
rates of another person, to enable him to vote, should be
deemed guilty of bribery.
This amendment was agreed to, and on the question
that the clause stand part of the bill,
Mr. DENMAN moved that it be struck out Gf the bill
altogether.
The House then divided, when there appeared—
For the clause,... 250
Against it, ... 196

Majority, ... ... ... ... L-4
The house was engaged in discussing the next clause up
to seven o'clock, at which hour the sitting was suspended
until nine o'clock.