The Sun.
London, England, 1858-02-09 00:00:00

country, they were driven to the consideration of what should pass, farewell to the liberty of every one seeking a
was the state of the law with regard to that particular refuge in this country. ( Hear, hear.) The people of this
offence. In the first place, I wish to meet an objection country had established its character centuries ago. They
which many persons entertain to this consideration of the had hitherto maintained it unsullied, and he deeply re-
law being taken up at all. It is said by many persons that gretted that it should be impugned by a bill of this kind
great irritation bee been expressed by foreign nations, and at the dictation of a foreign stat. He cordially supported
that there is supposed to be on the part of foreign Govern- the amendment, and trusted that the bill would bo with-
mints an opinion founded on a mistaken assumption that drawn, for if any amendment should be considered neces-
England is indifferent to such matters, and that this has sary, it could be much more conveniently made in the bills
suggested
tod objection
by ootro
allyth i s
thebil I appeared Emperor
ot of
caused, especially in France, the issuing of addresses from of the Solicitor-General. (Hear.)
military bodier, which have bo u published in the Mold-
&lir, and which are cenidered to be offensive, and that in . be that tßi°t WhaYd sailEbeßensn
consequence of this we should be prevented taking steps,
which on other grounds we think that the character and the French. It was a now doctrine in civilised Europe that
interest of this country require to be taken. I confess I 1 cue ally was not at liberty to suggest to another ally mat"
cannot understand the argument on which such an objection 1 ters which, although immediately concerning the affairs of
is founded. If it is a thing right in itself that we that ally, also immediately affected the government mak-
should snake an alteration in our law, because that •
mg the suggestion. It was too much to say that the French
law is defective and is capable of improvement, it is no ,
reason that we should abstain from doing that which in Government was not at liberty, in an amicable manner, on
our legislation we think right because other nations. in a a great emergency, to bring before the Government of Eng_
moment of passion, or perhaps of fear, have done what we , land matters affecting the security of the French Govern-
think wrong. lam glad to say that with regard to the went, and the security of the life of that person who, by
particular addresses of the military bodies in question, to the votes of the French people, had been placed on the
which objection has been taken on a recent occasion, I throne of that kingdom. That appeared to be all that the
have this to observe, In the first place, if the people of French Government had doers. Thera were some phrases
France are ignorant of the spirit of our constitution, and in the despatch of Count Walewski which might be misun-
unacquainted with the current course of our legislation, derstood by persons not perfectly cognisant of the niceties
we also are ill-informed of the course taken in France with of the French language; but reading the whole' of that
reference to the matter to which we have taken objection, ! despatch he could not conceive a more unobjectionable, in-
It is only within a few days that I have been informed of ! offensive. and proper communication—(" Oh, oh," and
the fact; but it has been stated to me that it is the prat- laughter)—to be made by one ally to another and a neigh-
ties for addresses to be oresented by military bodies to the boar. The question was whether, because certain French
head of the government of France ou all occasions of colonelshad spoken in aninjudicious and objectitz ,ble man-
public moment, and that that practice has prevailed for ' ner, the house would refuse its assent to a bill which was
the last 60 years. When events of public interest have in accordance with international law and with the criminal
occurred, whether good or bad—whether congratulations law of this country. The house was not asked to interfere
were to be offered or strong opinions expressed—it has not with what was sailed the right of asylum. It was not
been considered inconsistent with military discipline inthe asked to alter any principle in our law, but only to alter
French army that every regiment, or even detachment, a penalty, and make it adequate to the offence which it
should present an address to the-head of the government. was intended to punish. The house was not asked to alter
There is nothing, therefore, in the fact of addresses having any principle of the constitution. It was only asked to
been received and published which implies any departure make the law more effectual to repress crimes against the
from the ordinary practice in France. But there were in peace and the safety of other nations. Supposing the
some of the addresses in question passages at which in this house should refuse to pass the bill, in what manner could
country offence was taken, and at which, if it was fitting it more effectually give a colour to the unjust and absurd
that we should examine very narrowly what passes in a imputations of the French colonels ? (Oh, oh, and laugh.
foreign country, offence might justly be taken. Her Ma- ter.) Several cases had been brought forward by our ally
jesty's government thought fit to inform the French go- in which the law had been found ineffectual for the pre-
verutnent of the unfortunate effect which these addresses vention of crime. (Oh, oh.) It had not prevented crime,
had produced in this country, and I am happy to say that and therefore it had not been effectual to prevent it. That
my noble friend, Lord Clarendon, has received a despatch was logic. (Laughter.) It appeared to him it would be
from the Minister for Foreign Affairs in France, in which utterly undignified not to do what was right merely ba-
it is stated that Lord Cowley having communicated to the cause it might be fltinded on what somebody else had re-
French government the bad impression which had been commended. It had been said that if the bill should reps,
produced by that circumstance in this country, Count the belief would be entertained that it had been carried
Wolewski has directed the French ambassador here under the menace of a foreign power. Now, foreign na
to state that the practice referred to has long been esta• tions knew this country well enough to be aware that it
blished in France, but that if, in a few addresses out of was not to be moved by the menace of foreign power—
many hundreds, passages have been printed to which ob- that if anything was done it was done bosause it was just
jection has been taken in England, the appearance of those and expedient; and to refuse that bill merely on account
passages has arisen entirely from the inadvertence of those of what people might say would be undignified, unworthy
who had in charge the publishing of those addresser—(oh of the Government of the country, unworthy of the house,
oh, and cheers)—and he has been ordered to say, on the and unworthy of the dignity of the British nation. His
part of the Emperor of the French, that he regretted that hon. friend had descended to the arguneentum ad hominees
such a circumstance should have occurred. (Loud cheers.) against the Emperor of the French. That was always a
As far, then, as an objection to any revision of the law is bad argument ; it ranked little higher than a schoolboy's
founded on these recent addressee, I think the objection ttc quoque. But it was an argument always disagreeable
ought to be removed by the handsome manner in which to the power to whom it was addressed. His hon. friend
they have been disclaimed. (Cheers.) I now come to the said Louis Napoleon went to Boulogne. That, however,
proposition which I have to make. On examining the state was not a parallel case to the present. Louis Napoleon
of the law, it appeared that the law of England treats was not a pretender ; he went to assert his right to the
conspiracy to commit murder simply as a misdemeanour, throne of Franca ; he held himself entitled to that throne
subject to the punishment of imprisonment for a short under an organic law to the empire. (Laughter.) He was
time ; that is, punishable on the same level and in the same not successful. (Loud laughter.) The Emperor Napoleon,
I
manner as any other kind of conspiracy. In another part when he went to Boulogne, went openly, in mid-day. He
of the United Kingdom, namely, in Ireland, we fierl that risked his life, and his friends risked their lives. Had he
the law is more severe ; for conspiracy to murder there is succeeded, he would have done a most heroic action. (Great
made a capital offence. It appeared to us, that while on laughter.) What parallel was there between the case of
the one hand the law in England was too slight, and the the Emperor and that of the recent attempt ? But lot the
punishment not adequate to the deterring from crime, on house consider the bill on its merits, and ask what it
the other hand the haw in Ireland, which was passed at a sought to do. It was in accordance with international law
former period, was more severe than was necessary for its and with English law. He would refer to a great authority
purposes ; and that it would bo an improvement to make on the subject—Vattel. Tattel said in effect that one
the low of the United Kingdom uniform, by reducing the conspiring against a foreign state in another country ought
penalty in Ireland and increasing it in England. What we to suffer exemplary punishment. The law of England
propose, therefore, is, that conspiracy to commit murder said the same. The house was not called upon to make
shall be declared to be a felony, punishable by penal servi- any new law. No doubt any person who conspired in Bog-
tude according to the nature of the offence, and in the dis- laud was already punishable. (Cheers.) They were only
cretion of the court which tries the offender, for any period going to deal with the question of punishment. (Hear,
ranging from a period of not less than five years to a period hear.) Was it not absurd to think that while breaking
which shall be for life. That is, that penal servitude for into a house was punishable by transportation an attempt
life shall be the maximum and five years the minimum, to take the life of a foreign sovereign could only be met by
(Laughter.) Or it may ho punishable by imprisonment fine or imprisonment. He certainly thought that the law
with hard labour, for any period not exceeding three years, required amendment in this particular. While en the sub-
The law will apply to conspiracies carried on by persons in jest he could not but say that he thought that those who
this country, whether British subjects or foreigners, to had the control of the police did not act with that promp-
commit murder on any other persons, whether British sub- titude which they might do in matters of this kind. He
jests or foreigners, and whether residing in this country or had been informed that in cases of conspiracy the London
out of it. The law will he universal, and will apply to police were entirely at fault. He would remind the house
all persons conspiring, and to all persona with resp!ct to of the ease of Foschini. He had been told that that in-
whom the conspiracy is formed. Of course, if in this dividuel had been fixed upon to put certain other persons
country such a conspiracy sueoseds, and the person con- out of the way. (Laughter.) Yet he had managed to
spired against falls a victim to it, the conspirators will be evade the English police. And he had been told that the
accessories before the fact, and liable to our law. With body recently found at Waterloo-bridge was that of a French
respect to conspiracies against personsout of this kingdom, detective who had been seized, and killed, and cut up in
we propose that a conspiracy to commit murder shall be this country. (Loud laughter.) In concluding, he could
treated in the same way as if it was a conspiracy to mur- not but express the hope that the house would consent to
der in the United Kingdom. The bill will be short one. passing this bill.
It provides, in the first place, " that if any person shall, Mr. FOX said that the hon. and learned gentleman who
within the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, had just sat down had told the house a very long story of
or in the islands of Jersey, Guernsey, Sark, Alderney, or the incapacity of the English police, but he thought that
Man, conspire against any other person or persons, being it might be matched by a story of the incapacity of the
within or without the said United Kingdom or the said French police. On the recent occasion that portion of the
islands, to commit murder within or without the dorni- affair which took place in this country, and which is to be ,
nions of her Majesty, they shall be guilty of felony, and constituted a conspiracy, was perfectly open ; machines
on conviction thereof shall be liable to p nel servitude for were manufactured in Birmingham, and Col. Dixon was '
life, or for five years or to imprisonment with hard labour made acquainted with a new sort of missile. The whole 1
for three years." Then it provides that "every person thing was above-board until the projectiles went to Paris;
who within the Unite 1 Kingdom, or within the islands of when they arrived there how did the French police act ?
Jersey, Guernsey, Sark, Alderney, and Man, shall incite (Hear, hear.) The atrocious attempt—for most atrooious
or solicit any person within or without the said United it certainly was—which had just occurred might be called
Kingdom or the said islands, either to commit murder on the occasion for this mandate from France ; but he thought
any person or persons either within or without her Ma- it could not he called the cause. They had for a long time
jesty's dominions, shall be liable, on conviction, to the heard of the murmuring at the right of asylum in this
penalties above named." Thou it is provided, that "any country. These murmurs had been heard from Austria,
persons charged with felony under the provisions of this Italy, France, and. Naples. There had been a continual
act may be apprehended, punished, and otherwise dealt feeling. for putting down, if possible. Therefore, he nisi
with in all respects in any county or place in which they this might be the occasion ; but it was not the cause of this
may be found, in the same manner as in any other felony bill being required. • They must look further for that.
charged or committed in that county or place ; and in pro- There were those who did not object to wade through
treading): under this act for murder alleged to be committed slaughter to the throne, and it was only in the common
in any foreign country, the amid murder shall be construed course of events that they should be hurled with slaughter
to be a killing of any person, whether a subject of her Ma- from that throne. (Hear, hear.) He did not think
jeaty or not, in the same manner as if the person so killed that they had any right to call upon their neigh-
had been murdered in the United Kingdom. (Hear, bours to keep watch and guard over their personal
hear.) The fifth clause merely repeals the Irish act, safety. (Hear, hear.) Assassination was not natural
That is therefore the bill which I wish -to propose. to this country; it did not grow here; assassins might
I ask the house to increase the punishment for conspiraoy occasionally go out from England, but they had first come
to murder in Great Britain and to diminish it in Ireland, into Segland. (Hear, hear.) They had come from those
and to make one uniform law on this subject for the whole governments which made assassins. (Cheers.) If a man
kingdom. I think that this will be an improvement in the were treated with cruelty and harshness the spring of
law of this country; and I think at the same time that it kindness would be dried up within him. A man
is due to the character of this country, a groat crime who might otherwise be a good subject would become an
having been attempted the arrangements for which were assassin. It was a very practicable operation. (Cheers
partly made in this country, that as fares we can go with- and laughter.) His objection to this bill was that it made
out doing violence to the principles of our constitution, an alteration in the law in compliance with external pros-
we should show our feeling with regard to a late occur- sure. There might be refugees capable of plotting assassi-
ranee, by a revision of the particular law which relates to nation : he believed them to be but a small number.
that particular offence. It may perhaps be said that as There were others who were looking out for better times,
yet our former law has not been ineffectual--(hear, hear) and others again who seemed to have abandoned all hope
—became no proceedings have been taken under it. But that such days would ever arrive. What would become
can any man say, the object of our laws being to deter of those people if that bill passed 4 Their feelings of semi-
from the commission of offences, that by increasing the rity would be disturbed. They would not be reached by
penalty attached to
as offence you do not add to the de- this bill ; they wore not people to conspire ; but they
terring motives against the offence? Therefore, although would no longer receive hospitality in that sense in which
it is possible that the grime in me in question is scarcely known this country ought to afford it to them. They would say,
in this country, and our law as it stood lass not been ap- if this were done to oblige France to-day, what might not
plied, it can hardly be said that we are not adding to the be done to oblige Austria to-morrow--(cheers) —and Naples
security against the offense b dd• 0 to the punishment on the following day i (Cheers.) Once bsgun, there was
which is intended to deter from a in— • • Icannot k •
its COMMISSIOO. no knowing where it might stop. They might go on from
but persuade myself that • • .
increasing the punishment at the step to step until there was nothing to distinguish them
discretion of the court to the penal servitude which I have , from other countries. And let the house look to the ex-
mentions b in the bill will have a wholesome effect,
in ample this house would set to other nations. If England
teaching those who may wish to make this country a place gave way, what could we expect Belgium to do? What
where they can hatchand •of disgraceful Switzerland What Sardinia! Why, the end of it would
concoct crimes a
character, that at all events they cannot do so without be that there would be no corner in Europe upon which a
subjecting themselves to the liability to a severe punish- political exile could find rest. And, moreover, we should
went. I now move for leave •- in bill for the pur- have lowered ourselves to the position of a secondary
to bring a
pose of amending the law to conspiracies. relating
The question having been ut
feeble states in the downward progress of infamy. (Loud
p
Mr. KINGLAKE moved the, ol o • amendment :---e cheers.)
"That this house whil.t Equi tfli'l. " 'g'n with
nation in its indignant abhorrenceamil the late atrocious ' been moved to the motion of the noble lord, but that it had
attempt on the life of the Emperor, solid anxious on a pro-' been met by a downright denial to receive such a hill in
per occasion to consider any defects which may be shown ( that house. Me hoped that in saying this he might not be
to exist in our criminal law, the amendment of which mightl misunderstood—he objected to assassination from his very
tend to defeat the repetition of such offences, deems it inex- heart. Our present law ha I been deemed sufficient for
pedient to make any special enactment in compliance with many generations. It had been the law of England through
the demand of Count Walewaki in his despatch of the a great variety of circumstances affecting England itself,
20th of January, until further information is before us, and affecting the continent of Europe. It was deemed
and the communications between the two governments sufficient many years ago, when the present Emperor of
subsequent to the date of that des etch." (Cheers.) The France was a refugee here; and he found no fault then
people of this c ointry, as A moralpeople, abhorred the with the law of England with reference to refugees. As
invasion
crime of assassination, whichof they had before heard, Louis Napoleon planned a descent
was in fact an
the fair strife to which they were accustomed. (Laughter.) on the shores of France when France was as much our ally
As a thoroughly practical People, too, they abhorred assail- as alas was at the present moment ; he not only planned
sination, and treated it with a great deal of hearty con- that attempt, but committed with his own hands the crime
tempt l and for this reason, that they were accustomed to of assassination. And long after the committal of that
despise those who invariably failed in their attempts. crime he was received with open arms by England ; he
(Laughter.) If the law officers of the Crown had told the Was protected ley England, and he found no fault with the
house that the law required amendment, or if the noble law of England then. Well, he was not about to revile
Lord had spoken as a scientific man, and not ass politician, the Emperor of the French. (Laughter and cheers.) He
sending under pressure from abroad, ho (Hr. Kinglake) hoped that in stating facto which none of the laughers
should have been happy to
give his attention to any sus- opposite could deny he was not descending for it would
gestion for the improvement of the law in that direction. be a descent to him, or to any member of that house—
But how stood the case? It was not unnatural that the that he was not descending to revile the Emperor of
indignation of the French people
should turn in some France. It was enough for him to know that he was the
measure against this country, froth
which the parties had chosen of the people of France. He believed that the wis-
gone. (" Oh," and " Hear.") The result was a despatch dom of this country was best consulted by not interfering
which had boon placed in the bands of hon. members, but with foreign states; and it was not for him to find fault
to which the noble lord had made no allusion. In that with the Emperor of the French so long as the French
despatch the government were called
upon to alter the in- themselves tolerated him. But the next objection that
ternal administration of this law, Now his objection to ho had to the bill was that it was not real. There was
legislate on this occasion was of the simplest description. an expressive word—" sham"—which might be well ap-
He declined to alter the municipal law of England on plied to this bill. He did not mean to impugn the
potentate. the suggestion of any foreign
(Cheers.) Either motives of the noble lord, but he considered this bill a
the measure proposed by the able lord was a piece of law sham. If it went no further than was at present pro-
reform, or it was a political action suggested from abroad. posed it was unreal —it would not effect its purpose.
If it was a piece of law reform, it
ought to have been Those who had watched the criminal jurisprudence of this
suggested by the law officers of the crown. But if it country knew well that it was nit by added severity that
was a concession to the pressule Upon the noble lord he they could make conviction or detection of a crime more
declined to concur in an" such gisot ittio_
- (Hear, hear.) certain ; and sure he was, that unless they took on© very
It did so happen that the votes Contained
notice, of
motion wide step further in the course of legislation, to please the
law. OnEmperor of the French, by admitting French espionage
for the revision of this very. Thursday last a no-
•the Solicitor-General ofinto this country, this law would be a dead letter. (Hear.)
tics was given by his intention
to
l*ntrod ace several bills, amongst which was a bill for cons It might deceive the Emperor of the French, and the noble
solidating, improving, and amending the criminal law ; a premier himself might be deceived by it, but to all intents
bill to consolidate and amend the statute law of England and purposes, unless they were prepared, which he trusted
relating to offences against the person ; and a bill to con- they never would, to sacrifice on the altar of expediency
England
solidate the statute law of and Ireland relating to the great and glorious principles which had dietieguished
accessories and abettors of indictable offences. If it were the English nation, this bill would be a dead letter. Ye
not intended to make this legislation exceptional, why not hoped there were those who with him would oppose it in
that
comprise it in the bills of the Solicitor-General? But, pee• every stage. (Cheers.) Did the noble lord suppose that
be
hap% that would scarcely satisfy the exigencies in which the this would be the last of the bills of this kind he
monarchswou
1
noble lord was placed. (Laughter.) After quoting a con- called upon to introduce ? There might be other
of the despatch, the hon, —the King of Naples, for instance, though he hardly
siderable portion member said he
the Rouse of . enough—but there might be
did not think aright for e Commons to legislate would, for he was not strong
in such terms. (a monarchs in Europe, as strong asLouis Napoleon,
ear.) They had other . .
He maintained
on an appeal couched
had • not been answered. He who might ask for alterations in our law.
been told that the despatch
proposed that theshould be
foreign answer
those
ers ) He believed that .
fidence in the abilitiesstandard of our law. (Cheers.) .
and then. Ile had great con of Lord by the voice of
Clarendon, but he believed it was not in the power of who opposed this bill would supportedbe
and hon. gentlemen
'ty to write so good an answer to that de. the-country. (Hear.) Ho recollected,
'n
human ingenuity
probably reoelloet, certain
the as that which would be involved in a simple vote of on both sides of the house might
bout which the people of
the house of Commie:, and therefore he trusted the house acts of a certain Home Secretary,s
satin opinion—acts which
would accede to the amendment. which he had proposed. England were not slow to ex
express
of illustrious exiles, and
Mr. II ADFIELD, in seconding the amendment, expressed did compromise the right ofl asylum
b inded men to roll on the scaf-
his decided objection to the measure, the effect of which which caused heads of noble m
and such was the reception
would be to render two suspected persons talking together folds of down-trodden Italy ,
these that they were repealed. In another
guilty of conspiracy, and subject them to a severe penalty. given to acts like
boon a strong opinion expressed by a noble
This was an invasion on the constitution of the country plaoo there hadhich he hoped would tea ympathised with
which he hal little expected from the present government. lord, an opinion_howb th sides of the house. A noble lord regarded
It had been the pride of Englishmen that this country and adopted Y
party' to whom he (Mr. ,Gilpin) used
lovers of liberty allas the leader of a pa
over tho world. true English words, and they had found au echo in
afforded an asylum to the
b
But under this bill there woulden_ eno safety for them. If thee*
English mind, Not for the security of the sore-
they had enemies abroad, d
the
spy
system was set in • every
of Franco, or for all the sovereigns of Europe twenty
• ht be watched and convicted of conspiracy reign .
motion, they.reig
Lord Chief Just' that times over, would I consent to violate in the slightest
on mere suspicion. Theme had stated
degree the sacred right of asylum for foreigners by which
t law was
in his opinion the presentalteration law
our history has always been characterised. (Hear, hear.)
was not necessary.
every purpose, and that an
bill of the And that speaker was Lord Derby. He would only read
There was danger in the. noble lord. He was ,
one cheat extract more, an ortract from the speechof Lord
sofit in the Highest degree, If It
auspicious and ia"