The Sun.
London, England, 1858-11-09 00:00:00

ROYAL COMMISSION ON AR MY
STORES AND CLOTHING.

Yesterday, at 12 o'clock, the Commissioners
appointed by, the. Crown to inquire into the state
of the principal depots for military stores and
clothing assembled again at the Arsenal, Woolwich,
and continued the investigation. For an hour
afterwards they were occupied in inspecting the
more interesting operations in the laboratory,
which were shown to them and explained by Mr
Oram, the principal clerk in the department. Mr
Turner also paid a visit to the gun factory. This
over, they repaired to an apartment at the head-
quarters of the military storekeeper—now Mr.
Gordon, who has within the last few days been
transferred thither in the capacity of principal
from Weedon—and proceeded to take additional
evidence, Mr. Selfe presiding as chairman.
Mr. Howell, the Director-General of Contracts at
the War-office, attended before the Commissioners
specially to make a. reply to a statement which he
said had been made by Captain Clerk, assistant-
superintendent of the Royal Carriage Department,
in his examination on Friday last, to the effect
that certain timber offered by Messrs. Rolt and
Co. to the War-office for use in the carriage depart-
ment at 85s. a-load,•and recommended for purchase
by the officers of the department, was refused
by the authorities at the War-office, and subse-
quently bought by them at 955. a-load. The circum-
stances he (Mr. Howell) said were these :—On the
3d of April last Rolt and Co. offered a parcel of fir
timber (150 loads) at 85s. per load. On the 6th of
April that offer was referred to Col. Tulloh. On
the 7th of April Col. Tulloh said he should require
100 loads by the middle of May, and recommended
that the quantity should be taken if found accord-
ing to specification and the usual conditions of the
department. There being then no special demand
for timber of that kind, and no requisition, a letter
was written to Gol. Tulloh on the 14th April, in-
forming him that it was not deemed expedient to
accept the offer of Rolt and Co. for the supply of
Dantsic fir. On the 16th of April Col. Tulloh re-
turned the letter, stating that if a supply of fir
timber was not made immediately the construction
of platforms must cease, and he requested that steps
might be immediately taken to obtain a supply.
On the 6th of April Col. Tulloh wrote to the Under-
Secretary of State requesting that 100 loads of fir
timber might be bought out of the 300 loads esti-
mated for in the year's supply. This letter was
received on the 22d of April, and on the 24th of
April instructions were given to Churchill and Sim
to buy the 100 loads of fir, referring them to Mr.
Roles proposal, communicating to them the price
at which it was offered, and suggesting also to them'
that it might possibly be obtained upon more rea-
sonable terms. On the 28th of April witness called
the attention of Churchill and Sim to a cargo by
the Harriet, which he understood contained timber
of the quality required. On the 30th of April
Churchill and Sim reported proceedings as follows:
—"That on the previous day Mr. Jones, the timber
master in the carriage department, had been with
themto the docks to survey the following parcels,
from which they thought the quantity required
could be obtained, the timber offered by Rolt and
Co. not having arrived in London. The cargo by
the Harriet contained a large proportion of smaller
dimensions than the service could receive. The
importers offered to sell any floats selected by the
officers at 80s. per load, but it was thought that
only 40 or 50 loads could be obtained of proper size.
Memel Crown timber of superior stock was sur-
veyed, -but pronounced too small for the:required
purposes, being from 12 to 13 inches square. The
cargo of the George Link was surveyed.. That por-
tion offered' at 85s. was found to be of the required
dimensions, but onlylB pieces were pronounced by
Mr. Jones to be of the required quality. The other
portion of this cargo : viz., the Crown quality of
350 loads—was surveyed and found to be of the re-
quired quality and dimensions. The importers
offered the parcel at 925. 6d. per load as lying in the
docks ; or 100 to 120 loads, to be selected in floats,
at 955. ; or they would sell 120 loads, to be marked
by Mr. Jones, at 675. 6d., subject to the rejection of
a quantity not exceeding 20;lsads. On the 3d of
May Churchill and Sim's letter was referred to Col.
Tulloch for his recommendatirn as to the timber
which was best suited for the service. On the sth
May Col. Tulloh recommended that 120 loads, at
975. 6d., should be bought, subject to the rejection
of not more than 20 loads upon its arrival in the
Royal Arsenal. which he considered a safe arrange-
ment. On the 7th May he (Mr. Howell) telegraphed
to Col. Tulloh to know if the 50 or 60 loads of best
timber offered at 80s. were suitable for the depart-
ment ; he replied, that it was not so suitable for the
service as that recommended in his minute of the
sth of May. On the same day witness directed
Churchill and Sim Aro be written to, to make the
purchase as recommended by Col. Tulloh, but that
they should endeavour to arrange for the supply at
, or under 955. per load, as he understood there was
; a cargo expected shortly which could be bought at
955. On the 10th of May Churchill and Sim re-
ported they had bought the timber required at 955.
The CHAIRMAN said, what they wanted to know
was whether the timber offered by Mt at 85s. a
load was timber which Chttrehill and Sim afterwards
purchased for the Government at 955. The impres-
sion produced upon his mind certainly, and that
which had gone forth to the public, by the evidence
of Capt. Clerk was, that a certain number of loads
of timber had been offered by Rolt and Co. to the'
Government, that the Government declined to pur-
chase it, and afterwards bought that identical tim-
ber at a higher price through the intervention of
their brokers.
Mr. TURNER said that was his impression also ;
and he wanted to know whether Rolt's offer at 85s.
a load was for timber actually accessible at that
time ? The letter of Messrs. Rolt implied that the
timber was in port and ready for inspection.
Mr. Howell thought if Capt. Clerk had known
the whole circumstances of the case, as he (Mr.
Howell) had just related them, his evidence would
have a created a different impression on the minds
of the Commissioners and the public.
Mr. John Sim said, in reply to Mr. Turner's
question, that the timber offered by Rolt and Co.
•to the War-office in April was not in this country
at that time, and that it did not arrive until some
time after the actual delivery of the timber in the
Royal carriage department, which he (Mr. Sim) had
received instructions to buy, and which was stated
in his instructions to be imperatively wanted there
for the
_public service. He found that the timber
Messrs. Rolt and Co. offered was a cargo they ex-
pected to receive by a ship which was then on her
voyage to Lonslon.
Mr. Turner said the fact appeared to be that
Rolt's timber, not having arrived, was not available
for the pressing service for which it was wanted in
the department at that particular time.
Mr. Sim said that was so, and had it arrived
when the pressing demand existed- for timber of
that kind, it would have been inspected by him
(Mr. Sim) and his partner in the interests of the
Government; He added that his attention was
particularly called to Mr. Rolt's cargo, when it did
arrive, as he (Mr. Sim) had by that time received a
second order from the Government to buy fir tim-
ber suitable for the arsenal. He was, therefore,
scrupulously careful to look at Mr. Rolt's timber,
and he found that its dimensions were not suffi-
ciently large for the requirements of the service.
The Chairman said, besides the evidence given
by Capt. Clerk, Col. "Tulloh, the head of the carriage
department, had stated, in his letter to the Commis-
sioners that " instances had, indeed, occurred where
parties had offered timber at a less price, which,
although recoil-unaided, had been afterwards ordered
through a broker at an advanced price, with
charges for brokerage and lighterage in addition—
as in the case of Messrs. Rolt's fir (April 7, 1858),
offered at £4 55., which cost £4 155., through a
broker, exclusive of charges." Surely (said the
chairman), no man who read the English language
could have come to any other conclusion than that
the fir timber which the Government bought
through their brokers at £4 15s. a load on that
occasion was the identical timber which had been
previously offered to them at £4. ss..and refused.
Mr. Sim said he was glad to have the opportunity
of entirely contradicting the statement. The truth
was, that in April Messrs. Rolt's timber, so far from
its being then in this country, was in posse and not
in ease. If it had been ever so suitable the Govern-
ment could not have got-it.
Mr. Turner said he wanted to • ask a question
affecting the commercial class especially. Was it
proper of a man offering timber for sale to say he
hadit on hand and invite aninspectionlof it, when in
point of fact it had not then actually arrived in this
COM) tr.) ?
Mr. Sim said it would certainly have been much
better if it had been stated clearly, when the offer
was made, whether it had arrived or not, •
Mr. Turner—Was it, in fact, a false statement
for a merchant to say that he had in hand, and
invited inspection of, a cargo which did not actually
arrive until a month afterwards ?
Mr. Sim said Messrs. Rolt's letter clearly con-
veyed the impression that the timber was in Lon-
don at the time, but he was sure a firm so respect-
able would not wish to throw dust in the eyes of
the public; and the officers in the carriage depart-
ment might have been under the impression that
the timber had actually arrived.
Mr. Turner—Military men make a point of stand-
ing upon their honour; I am happy to say there a. e
commercial men who stand as much upon their
honour ; and I think that is not a correct statement
of anything they had to propound to the depart-
ment. - -
Mr. Sim said he was not a censor woman.
Mr. Turner—You say you are not a censor
;norm ; but it is ono of the incorrect statements