The Sun.
London, England, 1858-07-03 00:00:00

March, 1858, and the proceedings of the trustees thereupon,
The return was ordered.
THE INDIAN ARMY.
Con. EVANS asked whether the Government intended
to appoint a commission to inquire into the state of the
Indian Army ?
Lord STANLEY said that on the second reading of the
Indian Bill ho stated that it was the intention of the Go-
vernment to appoint such a commission, composed in the
following manner :—Three officers of the Indian Army,
three officers of the Queen's Army, who had served a cer-
tain length of time in India, three civilians, and those
high official persons whose departments were concerned in
the question, namely, the Commander-in-Chief, the Mini-
ster of War, and the President of the Board of Control.
THE TRINITY HOUSE.
Oa th© motion of Mr. CRAWFORD, there was ordered a
copy of the report made to the Corporation of the ¶rinity
House by the chief engineer of the Trinity steam-ship
Argus, relative to the ascertained results from the use of
the patent regulating air-doors fitted to her steam-boiler
furnaces by Mr. John Lee Stevens.
EDUCATTON.
Mr. CROSSLEY moved as eersiiees for retnens n the in-
come, expenditure, and number of pupils of all training in-
stitutions aided by Parliamentary grants, other than those
reported on by the Rev. F. Temple and the Rev. F. C.
Cook ; the returns to be made under the same heads as in
the minutes 157-8, pp. 737-8 and 700-3.
The return was ordered.
PUBLIC BUSINESS FOR THE EVENING.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER wished to
make a remark as to the public business for that evening.
They would go into committee on the Indian Bill as soon
as possible, and if they did not conclude it that night, as he
hoped they would, he proposed that the house should meet
to-morrow (Saturday). Under these circumstances, he
would not move the ordinary adjournment of the house
till Monday.
Mr. H. BERKELEY asked what was to become of.the
questions which were to be founded on that motion ? He
had one of considerable importance on the paper.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the
Government would be very happy to answer any questions
that might be put.
Mr. BERKELEY said that would not do, as he wanted
to make a speech. (Laughter.) He should move the ad-
journment of the house, in order that he might be in order
in making his statement.
Mr. COX said that he also had a question on the paper,
and he should move that the house at its rising do adjourn
till Monday.
Some confusion arose in consequence of these conflicting
motions, but eventually Mr. Cox proceeded.
PARISH OF ISLINGTON.
Mr. COX asked the Secretary of State for the Home De-
partment, whether Mr. Wyatt, who has lately been ap-
pointed superintendent registrar of the parish of Islington,
is to retain his office of assistant clerk at Somerset-house,
and whether any other clerk in the Registrar-General's
office holds the appointment of superintendent registrar
of a large metropolitan parish ? He said that during the
last few years the parish of St. Mary, Islington, had rapidly
increased in population, which now amounted to 130,000.
The office of superintendent of births, marriages, and deaths
for such a parish was a most important one, and yet a gen -
tleman had been appointed who was eighth assistant clerk
in the General Registrar's office.
Mr. WALPOLE admitted that the hon. gentleman was
right in saying that the office of superintendent-registrar
in a large parish was one of very con-iderable importance.
He undrstood that the duties could be very well performed
in those hours in which Mr. IVyatt's attendance was not
required at Somerset-house. The Registrar-General took
very great interest in this matter, and he was certainly
one of the most deserving public servants he knew. In
taking this step he had rewarded a meritorious clerk in his
office. In doing that he had but followed out precedents,.
and supposing the appointment in this case a good one,
and that the duties of both offices could be adequately
discharged by one person, it would not be reasonable to
disturb the arrangements. He (Mr. Walpole) had insti-
tuted inquiries, and he found that Mr. Wyatt was a very
meritorious public servant, and that his services deserve
to be rewarded. That reward had been given in a way he
himself did not exactly approve, but still there were prece-
dents for it in Clorkenweli, where a very good appoint-
ment had been made, and in other parishes. His prede-
cessor in office (Sir G. Grey) did not -as a general rule ap-
prove of such appointments, and he (Mr. Walpole) thought
that, as a general rule, such appointments should not be
made in future. Accordingly, he had written to say that
although this case must not be disturbed, he must request
Major Graham, the head of the department, not to make
such appointments except on special grounds which had
been submitted to the Secretary of State. (Hear.)
HAINAULT FOREST.
Mr. CAIRD rose to correct some misrepresentations
which had prevailed in reference to a speech made by him
on a former evening, and was reading some statistics in
reference to Hainault Forest, when
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER called him
to order on the ground that he had no right to refer to a
debate of a former night.
The SPEAKER said he understood that the hon. mem-
ber wished to make a statement upon some personal mat-
ter, but to refer to a previous debate would be transgress-
ing the rules of order.
Mr. CAIRD proceeded to refer to some contradictions
which had been made on the subject of his statistics by Mr.
Hamilton on a previous night, and was about to prove his
accuracy by some documentary evidence and by a map
which ho produced.
Me. HAMILTON said he did not wish to prevent the
hon. gentleman from going on, but if he persisted of course
he (Mr. Hamilton) must snake a reply.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he had
no wish to interfere between the hon. gentleman and his
personal statement, but he could not see that the hon. gen-
tleman's personal honour was concerned because one of his
statistical facts was not properly appreciated by the house.
This matter might lead to a lengthened controversy, and
' it was not correct to view this as in any way a personal
matter.
Mr. CAIRD said he would take another opportunity of
bringing the matter before the house. (Hear.)
GUANO.
Mr. CAIRD put a question to the Government in refe-
rence to the Peruvian guano monopoly. He said that since
he had put his motion on the paper he understood that the
Peruvian Government had reduced the price of their guano
by a guinea a tog. But he wished to know whether it
ought not be represented to the Peruvian Government that
we were paying more for this guano than the United
States.
Mr. W. S. FITZGERALD said he was not surprised at
the question of the hon. gentleman who had taken so
deep an interest in agriculture. The subject was doubt-
less one of importance, and he had that day received a
communication on the subject from the Peruvian Govern-
ment. The complaint the hon. gentleman made was that
the price charged to consumers in this country was too
high, and that a higher price was charged to consumers
here than was charged to the United States. Thera were
certain circumstances affecting the consumption of this
article which must not be forgotten, viz , that the interest
on the )Peruvian bonds were chargeable on this guano. lie
had received a communication from the Peruvian Govern-
ment that day, stating that the price would be reduced
fram 13/. 15s. a ton to 121. ls. a ton ; and, in the second
place, that the same price would be charged to us as was
charged to the United States. 4That would save this coun-
try a sum of 400,000/. (Hear.)
STATE OF THE 'THAMES—BATTERSEA PARK.
Mr. H. BERKELEY asked tba Chief Commissioner of
Works the following question :—Whether he had received
any communicationf from the Metropolitan Board of Works
respecting the main drainage of the metropolis— and, if so,
requested that he would state whether the outfall of the
sewage be proposed to take place on the north side at Bark-
ing Creek, nearly opposite to the Arsenal at Woolwich, or
where? The hon. member stated that a very strong opinion
prevailed out of doors that on the very important question
of thejstate of the Thames there existed great apathy on the
part of the house—(a laugh) - and on the part of the Go-
vernment, who ought to have come down to the house,
have taken the initiative, and have asked for plenary
powers, and grappled with this great evil. If the matter
were not dealt with ibefore Parliament rose, it would no
doubt be red-taped and hung up, and perhaps not dealt
with at all. He was surprised at the silence of the metro-
politan members—(a laugh)—and still more surprised at
the opinion of those members, who seemed to think that
the matter should bo dealt with locally and not nationally.
The people had a right to require that the question should
be dealt with by the nation. If Governmenb came to the
house for plenary powers they could do infinitely more than
all the boards together. Their legislation, in part, if not
wholly, had caused this evil. Some years ago the members
of bath houses found their olfactory nerves much affected
by the nuisance of night carts; that was about the time of
the reign of Mr. Chadwick, who was considered an autho-
rity for everything. Among the powers entrusted to him
was that of preventing night-carts from coming
" Between the wind and their nobility."
(Laughter.) What was the consequence ? Why, that the
ordure of this great city was conveyed away not in carts,
but Chadwick and the House of Commons plunged 100,000
cesspools into the 'flames. The stuff was there out of
sight, and the House of Commons and the House of Lords
never for one moment fancied that there were poor inhabi-
tants on the banks of the Thames who could not get away
from the nuisance. If extraordinary heat had not pre-
vailed and the noses of hon. members been affected the
matter might never have been considered. When they
were affected it was astonishing to see hon. gentlemen who
had been parties to throwing this filth into the river, turn-
ing round and saying, " God bless roe, where can it come
from?" (Laughter.) And then they said, " What is the
Board at Westminster doing ; what are they doing in the
City of London ; has the Lord Mayor got into Petticoat-
lane ?" (Loud laughter.) It was necessary that they should
ei 101 l power to counteract this evil. He appealed to
them on belieir ;Let, ef the 11,1.11,4 of the river
whose noses were forced to be continually 11l toe awc.l,
who could not go to their country houses and to the moors.
There were also the merchants and bankers who were tied
down to their places in the city. Ile trusted that the
Government would give some promise that before the
house rose they would ask for those powers which they
ought to be proud on this occasion to demand. It was a
ejuestion which the Government should be ready to meet.
Let flew prove their utility. They were a weak Govern-
ment, and they would strengthen themselves if they met
this evil. If they did lot do so, they would deserve the
contempt they would area with from every class of the
community.
Mr. GLADSTONE sad that before the question was an-
swered he could not heir saying a word as to the arrange-
meats connected with this matter. A short time ago an
hog. gentleman connected with an importantdistrict of the
metropolis gave notice h© would bring this subject under
the consideration of the house. He wished to know from
whence the funds were toproceed by which this great work
was to be accomplished ? The hon. and talented member
(Mr. Belk; ley) had said that he had met persons who asked
whence this smell proceeded. Now he himself had not met
any person who was sceptcal on that subject--(a laugh)
though he had met men who were much in doubt as to
whence the funds were to come to cure this smell. He
would put it to the hon, gentleman and to the Government
and the house if the matter was so free from doubt, so very
clear. A day should be fixed at once, if possible, for the
purpose of discussiug the mitten The subject was not less
urgent than it was said to te. First, there was the great
question of the mechanical sael material means for curing
time evil ; and then there was the second question, from
what funds was the mirk to be done. On the last question
he entertained a decided opiuion—an opinion, he thought,
not in unison with that of the bon. gentleman. The im-
portant question was, wore the people of London to pay
the a et of their own drainage, as other places in England,
whether wealthy or poor, did. There remained behind a
very important question as to the local government of
London, and in what condition that local government was
to be placed if they called on London to do what was its
duty in this respect. Ho might be excused from making a
strong appeal to the Government to give an early day, be-
fore any great dispersion of, members took place, for dis-
cussing the question of the hon. member for Finsbury.
Mr. ALCOCK rose to call the attention of her Majesty's
Government to the expediency of ascertaining the value of
the surplus land at Battersea-park, with the view of apply.