The Sun.
London, England, 1858-03-16 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON TUESDAY E'VENING, MARCH 16, 1g59.

the Cabinet who vote in support of the bill. On the other
hand a noble lord in another place who has been called
to the peerage and placed on the woolsack, is its most
efficient opponent. But, sir, while' am on this subject,
I find in one of the hustings' speeches to which I have
been referred that the Solicitor-General for England
(Mr. Cairns) thus expressed himself :
" There are two sorts of questions—questions of princi-
ple and questions of expediency. Now, the admission of
the Jews, for instance, is one of principle which must
never be abandoned. But take the question of Parlia-
mentary reform. That is one of expediency, on which at
different times, and under different circumstances, diffe-
rent opinions may be properly formed. On a question of
expediency, every man in a Government must not hold on
to his own crotchet, otherwise the Government could not
get on ; but on a question of principle no man should
yield."
(Hear, hear.) There is another subject which has been
totally omitted from the speech of the noble lords and
from the statements made on the hustings—l allude to
the Government of Ireland. (Hear.) I take it that
the future Government of Ireland, whatever party may
be in powsr, is a subject of deep importance to both
countries. Yet we have no allusion in any speech
either delivered in another place or on the hustings as
to the policy which is to be pursued with regard to Ire-
land. All we can judge of is from the appointments
which have been made. Now, Ido not hesitate to say
that these appointments are not looked upon with any
peculiar favour by the Irish people. ("Oh, oh 1")
I believe the present Lord Chancellor of Ireland
drew up the rules and regulations of the Orange Society
in that country. (Hear, hear.) On the other hand, the
late Chancellor wrote a letter to the Lord-Lieutenant, I
think, of Down, declaring that the Government would
appoint no man to the magistracy of Ireland who was a
member of an Orange Lodge. (Hear.) What course
does the Government intend to take in that particular ?
Then, what is their policy to be on the important ques-
tion of national education in Ireland! The right hon.
gentleman the present Home Secretary (Mr. Walpole)
moved and carried an amendment in this house, the
effect of whiob, persisted in, would have been to de-
stroy the existing system. The late Lord Chancellor
was a commissioner under that system, while the preseet
Lord Chancellor is a supporter of the rival system of the
Church Education society. (Hear, hear.) What, then,
wilt the Government do respecting national education in
Ire!aadl There is another question to which I should
like to refer. The hon, member for Warwickshire (Mr.
Spoor er), whose honesty and integrity of purpose I shall
always respect . (hear)—is in the habit, irrespective of
all Governments, at' bringing forward a motion for with-
drawing the present grant to Maynootb. What has
been the conduct of her .51aje,ity's present advisers with
regard to this subject ! I hold in my hand a paper by
which it seems that no latter than last year 13 members
of the Government voted against the Maynooth grant.
I won't trouble the house with names, but all these 13
entlemen supported the motion of the hon. member for
North Warwickshire. What do they propose to dos hen
he brings forward the same question next, week ? (Hear,
hear.) What, in short, is the policy of the Government
with reference to Maynooth ? Let the house remember
what has been the conduct of the new Ministry on this
question There is but one right hon. gentleman on
the Ministerial bench, the First Lord of the Admiralty,
who has ever stayed here and given his support to the
Government when that motion has come on. (Hear.)
All the rest walked away, and were content to leave the
Government to fight that question with the hen. mem-
ber. (Hear, hear.) I don't think it is an irrelevant
question, then, to ask what course is to be adopted
respecting Maynooth. A promise has been held out for
for the year 1359 that Lord Derby will bring in a
Reform Bill. The noble lord has no great opinion of a
Reform Bill. He says he rather objects to it, but still,
if pressed, he will bring in such a measure. Here are
leis words :
" Believing that, with all its anomalies and all its imper-
fections, that Act (the late Reform Bill) has given to the
country a' representative system the result of which is a
House of Commons which fairly and fully represents the
feeling of the numbers as well as of the intelligence and
the property of this country, I should myself have been
. well satisfied if it had been the pleasure of Parliament that
. no legislation upon a subjection so exciting should be called
for or demanded from the Government."
That is the opinion of the noble earl. He is very un-
willing to do it, but he says be will do it. But what do
we gather on this question from the description of
right honourable gentlemen on the hustings ? The noble
lord (John Manners) said he was true to the principles
of rational Toryism. He asked what was the meaning
of a Reform Bill, and went on to express his own
opinion that no doubt the representation cf the counties
was deficient and unfair. That is the noble lord's defini-
tion of a Reform Bill. The right hon. gentleman (Sir J )
Pakington) said he had no particular regard for the 101.
f. e,holders, and that he would give no pledge as to what
his course would be. The right hon. gentleman the
Chancellor of the Exchequer said the late Reform Bill
was a gross Whig job. (Ministerial cheers and laughter.)
Yes, but how will the right hon. gentleman recoeciie
this with the language of one of the makers of the Re-
form Bill, Lord D. roy, who said that it adequately re-
presented the property, intelligence, and feelings of the
country ? (Hear, hear.) I want to know, then, what
sort of measure we may expect ; for I cannot be!ieve
that the Governor-lot intend to carry out the Reform
Bill sketched by the last representative of the late Mr.
Feargus O'Connor in this house—l mean the present
Attorney-General for England. (Laughter.) I wirb.to
know what are the principles on which the Reform hill
is to be founded—whether on the principle of rational
Toryism, as expressed by the noble lord (John Manner,)
or on the extreme Chartist principles enunciated by the
Attorney-General ? It is true the.; we have had the
speech of the noble member for King's Lynn (Lord
Stanley), who is, I believe, a true and rational reformer.
(Cheers.) But he occupies a very peculiar positicn in
the Cabinet—a position which I think we should all
honour ; but, at the eases time, I very much doubt
whether this Reforming eEneae will be able to carry the
Conservative Anchises. (Great laughter.) No, sir, I
much fear that he will find some Dido of Conservatism
to obstruct him in carrying out his good principles.
(Renewed laughter.) Well, then, I think I am jus-
tified in asking what is the policy which her Majesty's
Ministers mean to pureue ? We all remember that in
1545 there was a great statesman at the head of affairs
in this country. That distinguished man, in his wisdom
and sincerity, thought fit to adopt certain measures which
had. originally been introduced by his opponents. What
was the treatment which he received ? (Cheers.) Why,
sir, he was denounced by the Conservatives of that day as
the head of an organised hypocrisy. (Renewed cheers.)
He was-accused of having caught the Whigs bathing and
adopted their clothes. (Elear, hear.) He was hurled
from power amid the regret of alt right-thinking men in
England ; and what, let me ask, were the expressions
which were then used with reference to his adoption of
the measures of his opponents'? This was the language
which was held by the right hon. gentleman opposite in
this imbue :
" The noble lord (Russell), the representative of ?Jr. Fox,
will not gainsay the motto of that greater leader Men, not
measures.' I would askgeutlemen opposed to him how has
the opposite system answered for them ? You have per-
mitted men to gain power and enter place, and then carry
measures exactly the reverse to those which they professed
in opposition. You are reconciled to this procedure by
being-persuaded that, by carrying measures you disapprove
of and they pretend to disreiish7 they are making what
they call the ' best bargain' for you. I say that the par-
liamentary course is for this house to have the advantage
of a Government formed on distinct principles. Here is a
Minister who now brings forward as his own measures the
very schemes and proposals to which, when in oppoai-
sition, he always avowed himself a bitter and deter-
mined opponent; let me ask the admirers of the ' best
bargain' system how they think the right honourable
gentleman would have acted had they bean introduced by I
the noble lord opposite lf you are to have a
Parliamentary Government the conditions are yon should
have a Ministry which
WhatdeclreLv principles upon which
its policy is founded. •got instead ? We
have a great Parliamentary middlei man —be
cabman who
bamboozles one party and plunders the otLris(
laughterj, till, having obtained- a position to whicher3 ha is
not entitled, he cries out, Let us have no party questionss,
but fixity of tenure.'"
(Cneers.) This v.as the language which was used towards
that great roan Sir R. Pcel in 1845, What, I ask, is
the Conservative party prepared to-do now ? Are we to
have no party questions ! Is there to bo fixiey of ten-
ure ? (Cheers.) For my own part I am indifferent to
mere party cries. (Ironical cheers and laughter.) But
I at the same time hold that they who w !ha in opp,ei-
Con honestly advocate certain measures ought to deem
it their duty when in office honestly to carry these mea-
sures intc effect. (Cheers.) I am not aware that that is
h proposition from which any hor. gentleman in this
lehuse is prepared to dissent, and of this -I feel assured,
that any Minister who assumes the reins of power by a
discreditable tuaEceuvre (cries of " On, oh," and cheer,),
will advance neither his own cause nor the interests of
the eo,gtr
possible ail I have now, sir, in as short a compass as
endeavoured to exerniee the antecedent.; of the
right hon,
no explanation ofn. gentlemen opposite. Taey leave given
their principles or policy in this house,
and if the observations
to make should prove which I have deemed it my duty
etio be successful in drawing from
them such an explanationi:jeire for one, shall be well satin
The CHANCELLOR Ofs.t)he
EXCHEQUER - -Sir,
one of the advantages arising fromo. the recent changes in
v
the Government is that some se again sound within
these walls which have for a long time been silent.
(Cheers and laughter.) I for one must confess that when
I listened on Friday last to that wild shriek of liberty
which proceeded from the hon. gentleman who has jest
BiP:_'a_atiN4_vzse, with no feeling of alarm or mortification.
ezekte.
,1,41„,,,,,,rs and laughter.) He will, however, permit
eh: was evS:t4it:he.raetmla
rhka:vobel:f
effectively
vos
ahmta
tsohrbeee
weaponet
become
me ad-
whichealittle rusty—(great lea
doubt that with reofnefentet—nhetough I entertain no
,Tast be allowed
brightness which dazzled usPr eve it will assume that
to add, by way of consolation to the h 1
114 present position, that it is only that...Title,naat' in \
Sition be can find those opportunities which empo-
him it 11 absolutely necessary he should avail eitte,aere,
before he can entirely regain that cunning of fence to,; 1
which he was once so celebrated. (Continued laughter.)
Now, the boo. gentleman has to-night repeated the
charge which be made on Friday last—viz., that I have
been gu:lty of an act either ct great presum
theee ption or great
great
inadvertence in taking ury place upon bhes
without offering to the house any formal prcg ramme of
the measures which we are prepared to bring forward or
of the principles which we profess. I am sure, however,
the house will acquit me of any intention of acting
towards it with disrespect. (Elear, hear.) Had I sup'
• posed for a moment that hon. members -expected any
such exposition on my part I should have been prompt
• in my endeavour to act in accordance with their wishes.
But so far as my Parliamentary experience serves me as

it was inopportune in the present state of India, and that
it was unwise to weaken the influence of the Govern-
ment in a country where revolt was raging. But what
are the character and influence of the East India Com-
pany after the vote of this house ? (Hear, hear.) It
is not that a majority of this house is in favour of im-
mediate legislatio❑ which influences onr decision upon
this point, but it is the moral consequences of that vote
as affecting the position of the East India Company
which makes us consider it a duty to deal with a ques-
tion which has been thus touched upon and must no
longer be tampered with. (Hear.) That measure it is the
wish, and at present the intention of the Government
to introduce before the Easter recess—(bear, bear)—and
therefore the house and the country will soon be able to
decide upon the motives which have influenced us in the
course we have taken and the provisions we have made
to meet the exigencies of the question. I think when the
house remembers that we have satisfactorily settled the
question which immediately brought us into office, and
that we are prepared before Easter to lay upon the table
a bill for the government of India, it will agree that we
have not been idle since we entered upon office—(hear)--
and that we have exerted ourselves to deserve the confi-
dence of our Sovereign, our country, and the Parlia-
ment. (Hear, hear.) The hon. gentleman has re-
ferred to a subject upon which years ago he used
to be singularly happy, but one which then excited feel-
, ings very different from those which now influence the
house in respect to it. He asks us what policy are we
going to adopt in Ireland. Years ago, when Irish ques-
tions excited all the ascerbity of politioal passion, and
when a question of Irish policy was certain to lead to
an inflammatory debate, no one was more happy than
the late Secretary to the Admiralty in irritating a ques-
tion of an irritable nature to the very climax of excite-
ment, and in enlivening a painful subject with illustra-
tions which excited our laughter amid all the heat of a
party contest. But really it is so long since Irish ques-
tions have been a source of disturbance and disquietude
in this house that one is hardly equal to the occasion,
wheh the hon. gentleman assures us the country is
awaiting with deep anxiety the announcement of our
Irish policy. I hope, sir, our Irish policy will be the
same as that pursued by Lord Eglinton five years ago.
(Hear, hear.) Lord Eglinton is now in the same high
office—he will be animated by the same feelings and
guided by the same instructions, and I hope we shall
find from those instructims and those feelings that the
, same result will be obtained—that he will be the
popular representative of the policy of this Cabinet,
. and that Ireland will continue under his rule as

a guide in those matters—and I believe I may say with
truth it is somewhat longer than that of the boo. member
for Dover—the course which he has indicated is not that
which has been habitually or, indeed, ever pursued in
the House of Commons. (Hear.) Ido not for instance
recollect that the noble lord opposite (Lord Palmerston)
when he acceded to office in 1855—and he was then in a
more eminent position than that which I have the hon-
our to hold, inasmuch as he was the chief of a Cabinet—
favoured the house with any formal statement as to the
measures which he meant to introduce or the policy which
he intended to advocate. On the contrary, the noble
lord was brought into office as the best Minister to carry
out a particular and pressing object, to the attainment
of which he directed with great success; all the energies
1 of his mind, and I may be permitted—notwithstanding
those imputations of iatrigue and manoeuvre which have
been made against us, and which I am happy to
belthink
no hon. member condescends to ieve—cheers)--ee
also say
p
that
called I conceive
totake h
her
tMajesty'een r i :
ofp r
Governmente se n t
for
w the
performance of a special duty to which it wAasbinli waseces usairy.
we should at once direct our attention.
troduced into this house by the late Government and re-
jected—(cries of "No, no")—and the consequence was
that the authors of the measure resigned. I do not wish
to misstate the case. A bill at all events was brought in
by the Minister, and upon the motion for its second
reading an amendment was carried, which was held to
be equivalent to its rejection. (Hear.) I was therefore
virtually correct in what I have just said. Under these
circumstances it became our duty to endeavour to effect
a reconciliation between this country and her ally, and
to refrain from pursuing that course of which the house
bad by a large majority signified its disapproval. Now,
so far as that question is concerned I am not aware that
we have exhibited any great neglect in the fulfilment of
our duties, or that that which we have already achieved
affords any very strong evidence of failure in our policy.
(Cheers.) Indeed, it was only this very night I laid upon
the table of the house papers which will in a few hours
be in the hands of every hon. member, and which proves
that the misunderstanding which unfortunately existed
between as and France is entirely at an end. Not only I
may add is it at end, but that great object has been attain
ed without that condition which we were led to suppose
was inevitable—that it should be accompanied by the
passing a measure which this house has virtually re-
jected, and of which the people of this country entirely
disapprove. (Hear, hear.) While addressing myself to
this point I away say, in answer to the accusation which
has boon made against me by the hon. gentleman oppo-
site of having voted for the amendment on the second
reading of the bill after having spoken and voted in
favour of the measure upon a previous occasion, I should
not venture to trouble the house on the subject had not
the hon. gentleman pressed it so closely on its attention
that to pass it over in silence might seem to indicate a
wish upon my part to evade the question. I may say
in answer to that accusation—and the words which I
used in the debate upon the introduction of the bill will
be in the recollection of many hon. members—that I ex-
pressed my readiness to vote for the motion of the noble
lord opposite, because I thought we should, by assent-
ing to it, be taking a step which would serve to show a
faithful ally that we sympathized with him in the diffi-
cult position in which he was placed. (Hear, hear.) I,
however, at the same time stated that I reserved to my-
self the right of taking up in the second reading of the
bill, if ever it should come to a second reading—the
very words which I used—a free and unfettered course.
(Hear, hear.) I described the measure as feeble and
inadequate to the attainment of the object which its
authors professed to have in view, and I do not think
there is a single gentleman in this house who imagined
that I would give it my support in its sulyequent stages.
(Hear, hear.) Nuw, the hon. gentleman oeposi e main-
tains that, in not entering into an exposition of our
policy in the House of Commons, we have pursued a
line of conduct which is both unprecedented and upper-
liementary. I have adduced the example of the late
Ministry to show that when the Government of 1855
was formed no formal programme was laid before us of
its principles or of the measures which it proposed to in-
troduce. What, let use ask, was the course taken by the
Government by which it was preceded I The Chief
Minister of the Cr ,gin in this house, under the Adminis-
tration of Lord Aberdeen, was the noble lord the mem-
ber far the city of London. The Government was a
coalition Government, and it was but natural that some
explanations should be expected from the noble lord of
the c'rcumstances under which he acceded to office, and
why it was that he had placed himself in intimate poli-
tical connection wish a statesman to whom he had been
opposed during the whole of his life. (Hear, hear.) We
might very reasonably have hoped that the noble lord
would have taken the opportuni'y to inform us how it
was he could reconcile the position which he then occu-
pied with the opinions which he had previously pro-
fessed. (Hear, hear.) But what course did the noble
lord pursue ? Why, upon Feb. 10, 1853, the day upon
which Lord Aberdeen's colleagues took their seats after
their re-election—an instance almost parallel with the
present—the noble lord said :
" I think it may be convenient to the house if I state
the course which her Mej3sty's Government think it fit to
pursue with respect to the measures which it is their in-
tention to bring forward in the early part of the session.
In the first place, I beg to say at once that it is not my
intention, nor is it at all necessary for me, to make any
statement with regard to the general principles and views
of her Majesty's Government. (Hear.) A statement of that
kind has already been made by my noble friend at the head
of the Government in another place, and that statement is
Iso generally known as to require no further remark on
that subject."
1 That was a Government of which the hon. gentleman
the member for Dover, who is my accuser upon this
occasion was, although a subaltern, still a distinguished
member—(bear, hear)—and yet he submitted in silence
fer five years to this unprecedented unparliernentary
course. (Cheers.) Nos, let us remember what wore
the relations between the noble lord the member for the
city of London and Lord Aberdeen. They had come
together for the first time in a somewhat unexpected
combination, but although there might then have been
reasons for expecting some formal statement, none was
ma le. The noble earl now at the head of the Govern-
ment and myself have been fur many years in relations
of intimate political confidence and communication, and
therefore I can appeal to the statement made by my noble
friend in another place with much more authority than
the noble lord the member for London could do under
the circumstances I have mentioned, and yet the noble
lore's appeal was considered by the House of Commons
to be perfectly satisfactory. But then the hon. gentleman
who is so anxious that we should take a course which
is not unprecedented nor even uoparliainactery-
-1 he is indignant at the formation of a Government all the
' members of which are not upon all questiens entirely of
the same mind. (Hear, hear.) " What," says the hon.
gentleman, " are you going to do about church rates 1 "
Well, then, I say to the hon. gentleman, " What did
you do about church rates ?" (Cheers and laughter.) I
find that upon the question of church rates the late Go-
vernment was beaten in this session, and although I may
not refer to speeches, yet I may allude to the division of
Wednesday, Feb. 17. I find that an Under-Secretary of
State, and a noble lord holding high office in the House-
hold voted against the Ministerial suggestion, while the
hon. member for Dover, like most of the other members
of the Government, stayed away. (Hear, and laughter.)
Why do I mention these things ? Not to taunt the hon.
member for Dover (a laugh) or any cf his late colleagues,
but rather to remove aims of the difficulties which are
1 3 pparaLt to him, and which he considers to be obstacles
in the way of ;he present Government. He will now know
how those difficulties may possibly be evaded. (" Hear,
hear, aed a augh.4') But, again says the hon. member,
" Weat are you going to do about the Jew Bill." I re-
ply, what did your Government do ? You respect Par-
liamentary majereies ; you were proud of the majority
you bad upon the measure to which I have always given
a cordial support, but what was wanted from the late
Government was support in the House of Lords, where
the difficulty arose, and what did we find there? We
found a member if the Government in that house always
voting against the measure, which had been carried in
this house by large majorities. (Hear.) Thera ire, sire
this is not the only Cabinet in which differences of opi-
nion exit, even upon the Jew BR (Hear.) Teen,
again, how did the hon. gentleman and his friends act
upon the ballot question ? We had a division upon
that queoticia last session, and I want to know bow
the late united Government—whose members all held
the same vies upon_ the same subjects, or who
ough'r, to have done so—how they voted upon a
question so interesting to ail sinclre and earnest re-
formers I I find that upon the 30th of last June the
subject of the bal-ot came bef )re this house, and a divi-
sion took place. I find the Prime Minister, the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer, the President of the Board
of Control, and other members of the Government
voted in the majority against the ballot. But in the mi-
nority I find tue names of a nobleman holding office in
the Household, cf the Attorney-General, of the Vice-
Pfesi_lent of a Bard, and the distinguished Secretary
for the Admiralty—(hear, hear, and a laugh)--that die-
tingu.shed individual who is nowalarmed at the prospect
of a Cabinet being in existence which is not of the same
mind upon all questions that can possib'y be brought
under the consideration of Parliament. (Cheers.) Now,
I think the course that was taken by my noble friend in
another place was a much more judicious course than
that which should have been pursued according to the
views of the hon. gentleman—viz., that a Minister should
state a formal programme of measures which are never
carried, and elaborately deve!op a policy which a de-
luded people afterwards find to be barren of all results.
I think it is mach better when the general principles of
a political connection are known that the Government
should bring their plans before Parliament than that
they should simply give the house a long catalogue of
measures which are never to be passed, and vague an-
nouncements of a policy to which no one can attach a
practical or precise idea. (Hear, hear.) We represent the
Conservative party. We wish to support and maintain
the institutions if the country, bet we also wish to im-
prove them. (Eleare We believe that the best way to
maintain the institutions of the country is to improve
themnln, when improvement is necessary, and therefore we
~,
a.;., permit the hon. gentleman to be such a monopolist
1..
der,) has treated re
it:
_%
on
all
occasions,
amelioration of society as he and his
\ lii,,,,,,,_,,,,,u.:,:t.,_n_.,pir.cacatsoionii:),e innoansmidaernende.r se(Hgeraer,edyheaanr.d)
nits.
prepared to maintain 1111
, course we are about to :Brnaelicul ltn,vnti eowwahtsshipcaeih:
ttalt.c.heenzpii,pteieutarnnteeiyee.ttht the
ourta intended
,n Y introduction t a i. e
hati
(4
etltitehewei
nt,si
celt
oicingd eis.arno
bill upon oar 7 that
part
I am
eminently consistent with all I
I beiieve will be completely satisfact7e; rje "": Zel
hear.) I never stated, nor do naylo--e Q'untr
l Firers nOw, than
the course we are taking is in deference to the , '.t;
this house is a.wayks't).Ohe
a this houge. A majority of
respected, but
t to be obeyed with servility w
d ot nof the bill of the noble
were opposed t is n
lord opposite (Lord Palwerston) upon the
theo intro u,
Palmerston)
.
ground that

quiet in temper and as prosperous as it is at pre-
sent. (Cheer...) Again, the honourable gentleman
says, " What do you mean to do about the Orange ma-
gistrates—do you mean to make Orangemen magis-
trates ?" Well, lam not an Orangeman. (A. laugh.) lam
sorry that circumstancA over which none of us could
have any control ►have led to institutions like Orange and
other kindred societies ; bnt I cannot help thinking that
they did not spring out of nothing. Tnere were causes
originally which occasioned their formation, and we
must deal wick establishments and institutions which we
find in the times in which we lire. But if the hon.

gentleman wants me to give a pledge that because a
man is an Orangeman he shall net be a magistrate, I
can only say I will never consent to anything so essen-
tially unconstitutional. (Cheers.) I contend that there
ought to be no disqualification of magistrates except that
which the law of the United Kingdom proclaims and
defines. If an Orangeman ought not to be a magis-
trate, let as bring in a bill to declare that, for nothing
can be more unjust and more unconstitutional than
that any ruler •of a country should make that
a disqualification for place whio'n after all depends on
conviction and net on the law of the land. (Cheers.)
The hon. gentleman next a ke, " What are you going to
do about national education—do you mean to disturb
the system of national education which was founded by
the chief of the present Government ? " Sir, we have
no intention of the kind. We shall maintain that
system of education inviolate, but if we can combine
with it, without in the least impugning the principle on
which that natienal system is founded, a just relief to
those church schools which now receive no assistance
from the State, I think that is a question which will
deserve the consideration not only of her Majesty's
, Ministers, but of Parliament. It is one which mode-
rate men on all sides have considered with great respect,
and if we see a mode of adjustment which we believe
will be satisfactory to all parties we do not preclude
ourselves from attempting to give it effect. (Cheers.)
The hon. gentleman went to the climax of all politic=,
and that in Parliamentary Reform. He seems extremely
alarmed at the opinions which are prevalent on these
benches on the subject of Parliamentary Reform.
Nobody, it appears, may poach upon that manor except
the Liberal party. (A. laugh.) The hon. gentleman,
in his profuse quotations;—fsr which he was always
remarkable (a laugh), though unfortunately they have
not been of late relieved by the brilliancy which in the
old days reconciled us to endless extracts from Hansard.
(a laugh),—hag fixed on the speech I made recently
at my county town in Buckinghamshire ; and he
says I stated that the Parliamentary Reform Bill
of 1832 was a greas Whig job. [An hon. member
oeuuaii tine Trevaury hince.—" S) it was."] An hon.
gentleman behind me says, "So it was." (Laughter.)
My hon. friend is nameless—for I don't know from whom
that expression of opinion proceeded—but I must tell the
hon. gentleman (Mr. Osborne) and the house that it is
a mistake to suppose that I ever used that phrase. On
the contrary, I hope I shall always speak with tke re-
spect due to a Parliamentary statute of that importance
which had engaged for so long a time the earnest atten-
tion and solicitude of the country. I certainly did say,
and I have sail it before, not merely on the hustings in
Thekiigham3lnre, but in the House cf Commons, that,
though it was a great statute, which no doubt in its
primary purpose had the welfare of the country and the
advantage of the State for its principal objects, unfortu-
nately, from the unreasoning excitement of the time,
facility was given for perpetrating gross jobs during its
progress through Parliament, of which ample advantage
had been taken. And I believe that has been the general
opinion of the country. lam sure it is an opinion of this
house not restricted to the Conservative bencaes, and
without doubt it will be the calm decision of posterity.
(Cheers.) Let us now meet this question, with respect
to which the hon. gentlerriaa says it is necessary that wo
should be exnlheit, and that there should be no evasion
—let us meet it, I say, with that frankness with which
he desires to see it treated. When that bill was first
proposed in this house there was a party in the country
who laid it eleven as a principle, while Parliament was
deliberating upon it, that they would have " the bill, the
whole bill, and nothing but the bill." The consequence
was that there were many amendments proposed and
suggested, not only on the Opposition but the Govern-
ment side, which were not duly considered, which were
indeed rudely rejected ; and fur a short time after that
bill became law there was considerable diesati,faction
with many points of detail which the country in its more
sober moments recognized as not having been maturely
considered at the time of its passage through Parliament.
But in this house it was always laid down by the party
who were then in power, and who were properly is
power in consequence of the passing of that bill, that the
grew cause of suspicion against the Tories was that they
had not given a sincere adhesion to the Ref ma Bill. It
Iwas said the Tories ought never to be permitted to regain
power in this country, because, it was alleged, if they
I got into power they would alter the Reform Bill. And
This was so great a clamour, and such an amount of pre-
judice was fostered in censequstice of it throughout the
country, that in 1834 Sir Robert Peel rose in this house
and in the most solemn wanner addressed himself to that
question. He made a compact, as it were, with the
country and with Parliament. He engaged with the
party of which he was the leader that he would accept
the Reform Bill, and he did accept it heartily and sin-
cerely, as the settlement of a great question, and that,
if he found himself in power, he would neither direc.ly
nor indirectly attempt to change or tamper with its pro-
visions. And on that compact the Conservative party,
as it was called, sincerely and properly acted, and
whenever measures were brought forward to change
that Act—not from our side, but from the Li-
beral party—the Whig Ministry were invariably
supported by the Conservative party in maintaining
intact the spirit and provisions cf the Reform Act,
(Cueere.) At last, and late in the day, " finality" was
deserted ; and we were told—and told by the leadar of the
Whig party—that there must be a new settlement of
the questisn and a new R- f 'tn Bill, and from that mo-
ment I held myself free, and I am sure I am expressing
the opinions of those with whom I act and of the great
body of the Conservative party, not merely in this house
but throughout the country--that from that moment we
held ourselves free to con dder that question upon its
merits, and that if any future plan were brought for-
ward to change the Parliamentary eenstitution of this
country we were open to offer those suggestions which,
to our minds, might appear to lead to a settlement most
conducive to the public weal. (Cheers.) The noble lord
the eneneher for the city of London has had ample oppor-
tunities of bringing forward a new Reform Bill. It is, I
think, seven years ago since a new Reform Bill was in-
troduced to thia house. It was not successful, though
the opposition did not corns from the Conservative side.
The noble lord brought forward another bill, lam not
aware that that measure engaged the sympathy of the
house to any great extent ; but the question became
such by the very fact of its public magnitude that it was
totally
neglect sibleth at a
public man of any leading could
ever recognise its importance. Lord Aberdeen
n e
became Minister, and after Lord Aberdeen the noble
lord the member for Tiverton, and we always heard that
those Ministers were going to introduce a new Reform
Bill. At last the subject was introduced to the attention
of the House of Commons even in a gracious speech
from the Throne, in which its magnitude was recognised,
and so it was that it came at length to be acknowledged
that a question of this Ts ,t importance could eo longer
remain unsettled, and that the country was encouraged
to believe that it could not be taken up by state men for
party purposes or selfish ends. If there is anything more
likely than another to poison the feelings of the people
and to alienate their best sentiments from the institu-
tions of the ceuntry, it is the suspicion per fitted to be
engendered in the public mind that schemes fur recon-
structing those institutions are used by public men for
party purposes. (Cheers.) It is impossible that a ques-
tion like that of Parliamentary Reform can be hung up
and taken down at the convenience of any statesman,
so that ashen in Opposition he is to brandish it in the
face of those iu office, and when a Minister to p'ace it in
a rusty scabbard. Under these circumstances we feel it
our duty to consider that tine tion, and we shall consider
it wit's the earnest d termina`ion of endeavouring to
make a settlement of it that will be satisfactory to the
sober-minded people of this country. The hon. member
f,r Dover asked me what are the principles on which our
11.i:fr,ru: 811 is to
uphold
penthoiordlmde (1. I do not think I am called
Oaitti
loi
wtelll, i
et
.h e hon. gentleman what are the principles of
~.1
ti,,
kLii_.s.
ten,:!a
p,
.7,:i;
present
nße,itaipornop; propose to
iifnttrhoedubcoent.ogt6huetiheornuasne
htihlle,
ilntweriellststeollihaimpawrthicautlarit
a, Political It wia not be a bill devised to prop up
""), or

class. It will be founded on principles of general jutice
—and, I hope, it will give universal sati, faction. (Cheers
and laughter from the Opposition.) But, says the Lon.
gentleman, what business have you and your colleagues
in that place ; you have not a majority i❑ the House of
Commons. (Hear.) Why that is the very question.
I do not at all agree with him that we are not supported
by a majority of this house. I entirely repudiate the
statement of the hon. gentleman. (Cheers.) Where is the
majority of this house, and who has it t Has the noble
lord the member for Tiverton a majority of this house !
If so, why is he sitting on that bench ? Has the noble
lord the member for London a majority of the house ?
Why, it is only a fortnight ago that the noble lord the
member for Tiverton beat dim by a majority of 200.
(Cheers.) Then, where is the majority ? Is it repre-
sented by the hon. member for Dover (laughter) or the
hon. member for King's County, or by the hon. mem-
ber for Richmond (laughter), for they are the gentlemen
who want from us a declaration of our policy, and a
programme of the business which we mean to introduce.
If they have not the majority, and it the two noble lords
to whom I have referred have not the majority, it does
not follow that I am to suppose we do not possess it.

(Elea;, hear.) On the contrary, we shall carry on the
affairs of the country with the utmost energy, and I hope
with the utmost prudence. (Clear, hear.) We shall
endeavour to do our duty to our Sovereign, to the
country, and to Parliament, and so long as we are ani-
mated by that conviction, and till the fatal truth is
proved by facts which I do not anticipate, I shall be-
lieve that we possess the constitutional confidence of
the House of Commons. (Loud and long-continued

He did not -say that measures were all they need look to,
and that men were of no consequence. The morality of
this country must have fallen to a very low ebb when you
could not pretty well tall from the principles of the men
what their measures were likely to be. Still they must
take care that they did not by any false move give an ad-
vantage to their opponents. It was impossible not to see
that the position of the present Government was weak, and
could only be strengthened by imprudence on the part of
the opposition. They occupied the opposite benches for
the first time only on Friday night, and they had already
made two remarkable concessions. In the first place, that
Conspiracy Bill which he believed was originally suggested
by Lord Derby had been abandoned; and secondly, the
Secretary for War had given an opinion in favour of those
competitive examinations for the artillery and engineers
which his predecessor (Lord Panmure) intimated it to be
his intention to abandon. (Hear.) Their difficulties would
increase with the cabinet meetings. On the question of
national education the First Lord of the Admiralty would
find some difficulty in reconciling his views with those of
the President of the Board of Trade ; while the noble lord
at the heal of the Government would have some family
differences to settle with his youthfal Secretary for the
Colonies on the question of church rates. The right hon.
gentleman (Mr. Disraeli) said he and his friends were a
Conservative Government guiding a Conservative party.
He (Hr. Horsman) had always found very great difficulty
in understanding the word t- Jnservative; and the best de-
finition he had ever met with was that discovered by a

cheering.)
Mr. HORSSIAN said he had the misfortune to dissent
from so much that fall from the hon. member for Dover—

Scotohman soon after the passing of the Reform
This gentleman having been told by a candidate
for the county of Edinburgh, Sir George Clerk, that
he was not a Tory, but a Conservative, looked in
the dictionary to discover the meaning of the word.
He found that "to conserve" meant to preserve."
That did not much help him. On looking at the
word preserve he found that it meant " to pickle ;" and
his remark upon this was that he had always believed that
the Tories had brought them into a pickle, but he had never
supposed that they would confess it. (Cries of Oh, oh.")
Now, he thought the course which the Opposition ought
to pursue was to remain patiently on that side of the house
until they found themselves in such a position that a move
might be made wisely and consistently. For his part he
did not think that sitting on that side of the house was a
very great disadvantage—he did not think their constitu-
tions would be very much damaged by change of climate ;
and he was for their remaining there until they found
themselves under the leadership of those who would enable

(ironical laughter from the ministerial benches)—that if the
hon. gentleman had confined himself to the constitutional
question of the position of the government and the princi-
ples which it was prepared to avow, he should have left
that question where it stood. But his hon. friend, repro '
venting the late government (no, no, from the opposition
side of the house, followed by another burst of ironical
laughter from the ministerial side)--and questioning the
present one, had given to the question somewhat of the
character of a triangular duel, by accusing a large section
of his own party of having contributed to the formation of
the present government. Now he begged to say that he
differed from his hon. friend, not only as to the eircum-
stances under which the present government was formed,
but also as to their present position and character, and as
to the course which it was incumbent on the opposition to
pursue. They (the opposition) had before them in relation
to her Majesty's government, the old and familiar option
of three courses. They might at once by a hostile vote
place them in a minority, with a view of expelling them
from office, or evading that direct course, they might, by
means of a series of eloquent attacks like those of his hon.
friend (Mr. B. Osborne), go on day after day obstructing
to a certain extent public business without raising any de-
cided issue; or they might pursue a third course—they
might extend to the government that courtesy which was
usually extended to the servants of the crown, and post-
pone till the occasion most convenient to themselves that
decidedly hostile movement which they hoped would one
day displace them from their seats. (Laughter.) Now it ap-
e peared to him thut the first and last of these courses were
perfectly legitimate, and that no one could make any Par-
liamentary objection to either of them ; but the course
which he did dissent. ficon, and which he thought
the house would not approve, was that of which his hon.
friend had sot an example that night. If they (the opposi-
tiortYcould justly charge the present government with
having stolen office be intrigue or stormed it by faction—
if they soul I bring home to them the charge that while in
oppo'sition their opposition was systernaaically conducted
in a manner that was unfair and unbecoming, then he
thought they would be perfectly justified in showing them
no quarter; but he roust say that from the day when the
late government was formed the opposition to it was, in
his judgment, conducted with a moderation and a forbear-
ance to which he could remember no parallel in his experi-
ence in Parliament. (Hear, hear.) During the whole
period of the Russian war:during the negotiations for
peace and the subsequent disputes with regard to the
Principalities, and during the progress of the disturbances
in India, there were many occasions on which an opposi-
tion so minded might have indulged in a good deal more
than occasional unfriendly criticism. He had a strong
persuasion that if the lioeral party had occupied the same
benches during the same period, such a total abdication of
the functions of an opposition would have been considered
unpatriotic ; and unless his memory deceived him, when
they
did Occupy those benches they felt it their duty to
take more party divisions; in three weeks than their degene-
rate successors ventured upon in three years. (Hear, hear,)
He must also do hon. gentlemen opposite the justice to
acknowledge that they had not of late manifested any very
great avidity for office. In 1855 Lord Derby was ridiculed
for his cowardice in not accepting office. He had accepted
it in 1858, and they were now astonished at his temerity.
(Laughter.) Moreover, as regarded the construction
of the present Government, he must say that the appoint-
ments were, on the whole, such as public opinion was
most likely to endorse, and he thought that in the sub-
ordinote appointments the head of the Government
had manifested a commendable desire to maintain that
intellectual character in which they must all feel a pride
and an interest. (Hear, hear.) The country had, it
must be admitted, viewed the change of government
with great indifference, and had not evinced that anxiety
and alerm which teeny lion. gentlemen naturally ex-
pected. (Laughter.) The funds had continued not to fall,
and the country had most provokingly refused to rise.
(Renewed laughter.) A bueinessslikuand practical coun-
try like this could not be expected to rise very often. The
majority to sustain the most powerful minister that
country rosier last year, and returned to that house a power-
fulhad been seen in modern times, and it now had a right to
ask what had become of that minister and, of that majority?
(Hear.) Now, he should speak as he felt towards that gen-
tleman who eat on that (the opposition) front bench, with
whom he had been associated for many years in the inter-
course of public life and of priv.tte friendship; while of the
noble lord at the head of the late Government he could
only speak as every man must do who had ever stood to
him in the position of official subordination, and who re-
membered that unvarying courtesy and kindness, that
generous confidence and protection, which superadded feel-
ings of personal obligation to those of admiration and
esteem. But the question here arose, by whom was the
late Government displaced? Its displacement was not, as
the hon. gentleman (Mr. B. Osborne) supposed, the result
of a discreditable maeceuvre. (Cheers.) He accepted all
the consequences of the late vote ; and he maintained that
there was no inconsistency with the feelings which he had
just expressed in his repeating;out of office what ha respect.
fully but pertinaciously urged in office, that the defeat of
the Government and the subsequent embarrassment and
disorganisation of the party were the inevitable result of
the noble lord's (Lord Palmerston'e) fatal and inveterate
habit of always looking to the opposition benches for sym-
pathy and support—(opposition cheers)—turning a cold
shoulder to his friends, always being more intent appa-
rently conciliating and neutralising foes than on confirm-
ing friends, relying too much on adroitness and dexterity
for the firmness cud strength which were to be acquired
only by constant fidelity to political opinions, and, above
all, committing the great mistake of imagining that that
powerful, that earnest, that high mottled majority
which was so triumphantly given in answer to an ap-
peal to the country had no other mission than that of sup
porling the personal position of a minister, regardless of
the principles of a party. It was this carelessness, this
false security, this miscalculation both of the noble lord's
own position and of the position of his party, which
the
Liberal passingparty
had led to the fell of the most powerful Minister that this
country
of the Reform Bill, and
which
a disunited and disor-
ganised body, under a Ministry which they knew could
not be'permanent. He thought the right hon. gentleman
kl hda ill h haated since
te
(Hr. Disraeli) was perfectly justified in retorting upon the
hon. member (Hr. Osborne) when he asked, " What are
your principles ?' by asking what were the principles of
the late Government three weeks ago. Why that was a
question
• which some of them had been in the habit of
asking themselves. Was Parliamentary reform one of their
principles ? That question was indefinitely postponed.
Was religious freedom one of their principles? On that
point he must say the answer of the right hon. gentleman
(Mr. Disraeli) seemed to him most complete. The conduct
1 of three members of the Government on that question,
when in opposition, did them great honour. The right hon.
gentleman's own conduct in reference to it was, he roust
say, such as would prevent him from ever speaking of him
otherwise than with respect. But what was the position
of the Liberal party ? For the first time in the history of
that party—to their shame and dishonour be it said the
question of religious freedom had SO retrograded, that that
which was inscribed on the Liberal banner, that in connec-
tion with which they had gained their most glorious vic-
tories, and conferred their most glorious benefits on man-
kind—for the first time, ho said, religious freedom was, in
.a Liberal Cabins, nisele an open question. That was what
was done last year. This year the question was abandoned
by the Cabinet, and entrusted to more vigorous and faith-
ful hands. Well, than again, there was the question of
church-rates. Was that one of their principles? Why
they knew that during the recess a very large and influen-
tial deputation waited on the Premier upon the question
of church-rates ; they went home, stung with the indignity
of not having been received in the manner they had a right
to expect. (Hear.) Then, as to the question of administra-
tive reform, and the pure dispensation of patronage, need
he refer to the shabby nepotism which, in the county of
Kent and in Manchester, filched from their legitimate
claimants those professional employments which, contrary
to all precedent, had been appropriated to aristocratic con-
nexions of the Cabinet ? (Hear, hear.) Lastly, was it, he
asked, on the question cf national independence and the
honour of the country that they prided themselves as a
party ? Why, it was on that question that the bite Go-
vernment had been driven out of office. Now, be thought
it right to bring to the mind of the noble lord (Lord Pal-
merston) all these facts, that they might be well pondered
before he returned to office (Laughter.) The season of
adversity Was a season favourable to the admission of
truth. With the sunshine of prosperity came adulation ;
and it was quite
n evident that the assiduity and eloquence
of his hon. friend (Hr. B. Osborne) were likely to lead
to the noble lord's return to office, and to leave the mem-
bers of the late Government a very short time for peni-
tence and further resolves. It was said that it would be
unwise to allow the present Government to remain undis-
turbed, becluse in that case they might settle themselves
tili next year, and in the mean time might do a great
deal of nairrohief. He did not think that even the appal-
ling prospect of fixity of tenure on the part of the present
Government for five or six year s would, by the majority
on that side of the house, who preferred principles to
place and the character of a party to the locating of its
chiefs in office, he viewed with very great concern. (Hoer,
hear.) In the first place, he doubted the inclination of the
right hon, gentleman opposite and his friends to do
mis-
chief. They and their- party comprised very much of the
intelligence, the wealth, and the character cf the country.
The leaders of the party were men of high honour and
undoubted raltriotisna ; and, so far as questions of gre..t
national honour were concerned, he believed the motives
of the ministers of England were equally to be trusted to
whatever party the ministers might belong (Heel*, hear.)
But, or) the other hand, oven if they had the disposition
they had not the power to do mischief. Power was appa-
rently deposited at present with the opposition. He be-
lieved that they could contest every move and dictate
every measure, and that their power was greater
on that (the opposition) side of the house at pre-
sent than it was on the other side six weeks ago.
He believed that the interest of truth and pre gress
might be more airily rromoted by a real liberality
in opposition than by a sham libera ity in office;
end jwhile he admitted th ,t the most desirable state
of things for!leh
eem was that there should be a pc-paler
administration in ()Tee, he was convinced that the mostthe
unsatisfactory state of things that could be conceived,
t
most unsafe, and the most unwholesome, was to have
neither a Liberal administration on tLe one side of the
Hear, boar.)
house nor a Liberal opposition on the other, (

them to remove to the other side of the house, and to main-
tain their position there with honour to themselves and
with advantage to the country.
Lord 3. RUSSELL—I am not one of those who consider
it to be necessary that a Minister, on taking his place in
this house, should make a declaration of the policy which

he means to pursue. I stated that as my opinion in 1853.

and to that opinion I still adhere ; and I should never

;pink of calling upon the right hon. gentleman to make

any declaration of his policy. I conceive that when a party
has sat for years in this house, and has given opinions on
a variety of questions that have come before it, when they
come into office they will generally maintain those opinions.
At the same time, having filled office myself, lam per-
fectly aware that a party acceding to office may find some
questions in such a position that they cannot immediately
set upon the opinions which they have formerly expressed,
and that on those questions their course may somewhat
vary from that which they have previously pursued. I was
not surprised, therefore, when the noble lord at the head of
the Government declared in another place that, it having
been declared by a large majority in this house that an
India Bill should be introduced, he considered that the
staving off of the question for another year was no longer
an attainable object. It is not then on the subject intro-
duced by the hon. member for Dover (Mr. B. Osborne) but
on another subject introduced by the right hon. gentle-
man opposite that I have risen to speak. Before pro-
ceeding to notice that subject, however, I may perhaps be
allowed to saythat I do not feel it necessary either to review
the course of the late Government or to make any state-
ment with regard to that bill which led to the resignation
of the late Government. With regard to that Govern-
ment, lot me observe that I shall always respect my noble
friend who was the head of it. I shall always think
that the public are indebted to him for the great exertions
that ho made daring the war, and for the opportune mo-
ment which ho chose for signing the peace with Russia.
(Hear, hear.) -I think those are obligations which nothing
can efface from the memory of the people of this country.
As respects the vote which led to the dissolution of the
late Government. I cannot suppose that my hon friend the
member for Dorset meant to say that there was any dis-
creditable manoeuvre on'the part of those members of the
Liberal petty who felt it their duty from the first to oppose
the Conspiracy Bill. I stated at once my objections to
that bill ; I persevered until by moans of a vote of this
house we got rid of that bill; and I consider that that
course was not only a course conducive to the interests of
the country, but a manly and open course with regard to a
measure of public policy. (Hoar.) Sir, the right hon.
gentleman (gr. Disraeli) irigoing over, with very consider-
able talent—talent which is n)t new to us—the various
questions on which he touched, and drawing a contrast
between the late Government and the present one, has not
succeeded in effacing from my mind the recollection that
during the many years that I havo been in this house,
while the party to which he belonged has pursued a policy
which I consider reforming, and that upon all the great
questions of religious and civil liberty, upon questions re-
lating to the Roman Catholics, the Protestant Dissenters,
and the Jews, and upon the que-tione of reform and com-
mercial liberty or free trade, I hove been opposed to the
views of the Conservative party, I cannot but expect that
questions will arise on which they will be found main-
taining their principles, and I shall be found differing from
them ; but that is no reason why I should endeavour to
embarrass a Government who have just taken their seats.
(Hear.) If her Majesty has been obliged to appoint them
to the .high offices which they hold, it is our duty
in the House of Commons to hear the various mea-
sures they have to propose, and to consider
the merits of those measures, and also to consider
how far those measures accord with the promises they have
made. (Hear, hear.) There have been two questians
touched upon by the right hon. gentleman upon which I
confess I was not entirely satisfied with what he said, those
questions being, first, the appointment of Orange magis-
trates in Ireland ; and, secondly, the support of national
education in Ireland. Now, with regard to Orange magis-
trates, the right hon. gentleman states very fluently a prin-
ciple which is generally a right principle, namely, that if
there be no act of Parliament to disqualify, the Lord
Chancellor ought not to impose arbitrary restrictions. But
the right hon. gentleman apparently forgets that many
years ago it was proposed by the late Mr. Hume to adopt
somewhat severe measures against Orangemen in Ireland ;
that I then proposed an address to the Crown, to the effect
that the then Sovereign, the late King William, might be
pleased to discourage the Orange societies and the qualities
which belonged to them (I do not know whether or not
they retain those qualities at present), and that to that ad-
dress we had the good fortune to obtain the entire assent
of Mr. O'Connell on the one hand and of the present Earl
of Derby on the other. I do not think it would be beneath
the present Government to keep the address in view, and
.to act in accordance with its spirit, though there may be
eh curnatances— I do not say whether there are or not—
which render the Orange Society different from what it
was. With regard to the question of national education in
Ireland, the right hon. gentleman proposes to give certain
advantages whiela would entirely destroy the quality of
education in that country, which would cut up by the root
the very institution which he professes to value—that sys-
tem of national education which, by the admission of all
parties, has been successful ever since it was established,
in 1831, by Lord Derby, and which would lead to groat
jealousies on account of one party having an advantage
over another, and to requirements on the part of the
Roman Catholics to which neither the present Govern-
ment nor this house would yield. But, sir, I come
now to what alone led me to rise to address the house,
namely, the description which the right hon. gentleman
has given of the Reform Bill. Now, sir, the right
hon. gentleman has at various times, both in this house
and in addressing his constituents, spoken of the Reform
Bill of 1831 with very great respect., But the right bon.
gentleman is now in the position of the members of a
cabinet which proposes to bring in a new reform bill; and
I own that I cannot expect anything just or anything im-
partial from a man who hes recently givers so uafair, and
I will say so unfounded, a description of the existing act.
This is the manner in which the right hon. gentleman speaks
of the Reform Bill : —" I have never changed my opinions
as to that Reform Bill. I consider that a subject of that
magnitude was dealt with in a manner that was entirel3
unworthy of it. I did believe than, I believe now, and I
think almost everybody now considers, that there was in
the concoctiel of that bill a greater number of jobs than
were ever perpetrated before; and, though the nominal
object of the bill, was to improve the representation of the
people, the groat substantial object was the consolidation
of Whig power." Let ma ask who then were the Minis-
ters who had charge of the affairs of this country ? At
the head of the cabinet was Lord Gray, a man who for
years was kept from power for which he was so highly
fitted by his perseverance in relation to an unpopular
question, viz., the rights of the Roman Celli lice. The
other chief Minister of the day was Lord Althorp, one
who, as was well known to all who knew him, was adverse
to office, adverse to patronage, adverse to all the accom•
paniments of official position. Now these were the two
moe upon whose memory the right hon. gentleman has
cast these reflections, against whose memory he brings
these repfoaohes. I say that these reflections and re-
proaches aro totally unjust and unfounded. (Hear.) Nor
is .Ws all' My right hon. friend opposite, the member for
Carlisle, and myself, wore the two members who had to
prepare the bill. We had many persons engaged with us
who acted according to principles which were geographic
and statistical, and had no regard to party views. At (I all
the plans and measures which resulted from those princi-
plea so acted upon by myself and my right hon. friend were
submitted to a cabinet of which Lord Derby was a member.
I ask, then, if the right hon. gentleman is prepared, with-
out the slightest proof, to say that Lord Grey, Lord
Althorp, and Lord Derby were parties to that series
of Whig jobs which he has described ? (Hear, hear.)
The right honourable gentleman has not brought out the
slightest tittle of proof in support. If he were to do so, I
am ready to go through the history of the bill. I believe
that I could almost dose now from memory, and go through
its details, to answer the statement of the right hon. gen-
tleman. But I think that it would be right for the right
hon. gentleman, bef, re he brings these charges against the
memory of those illustrious persons, himself to go through
the particulars, and make himself master of the details of
the bill, so that his charges may, at least, appear to rest
upon some tangible grounds. There ie, however, swam-
thing more. Upon the opposition benches there sat at that
time ir. R ibt. Peel and Mr. Goulburn, men of the highest
honour. They never brought charges of a character simi-
lar to those which I have read, and I remember Mr. Goul-
burn remarking that he had never repeated such charges,
although they were at that time to be heard out of doors.
I believe that there was but one person in the house who
ofm made
e thew.
facts.
ButTh e I
rightow n hon.tha gentlemanti
lookv
picion and doubt upon any reform bill of which ho is to be
the concoctor if this is the manner in which ho speaks of the
last. (Hear, hear.) I remember mentioning in this house
on a former occasion a story of Cardinal de Retz and the
great Conde. Upon coming to the room to consider terms
,ithcan very know
groatno susng
of a peace, Conde -g'iund a quantity of pamphlets. He
looked them over, and found the*, they insinuated bad mo-
tives for every step which the other bide had taken.
" illy" said he, "these men impute to as the sort of con-
thi
duct they would hold if they were in our places. (He,„..)
I believe that is a just reproach. I believe that the right
hon: gentleman's charge Qn the sul.ject is " a proof of the
spirit in which ho would concoct a bill. ( Oh, oh," from
the government side of the house.) The men who ca.; ried
through the Reform Bill had no wish to act with unfair.
ness either as regarded the commercial interest on the one
hand, and the landed interest on the other. I recollect
stating at the close of the debate that I believed that the
landed interest would have a majority. I thoug3 so, be-
cause I not only reckoned the representatives of counties
(whom tire right honourable gentleman assumes to bo the
only representatives of the landed interest), but the mem-
bers fur a great number of country places in which

notoriously and evidently the landed interest of transferring it to the militia, but the saving would tell on
prevailed. With regard to the two parties, my belief was the gross amount.
that there would not be that monopoly of power which the Sir G. C. LEWIS reminded the right hon. gentleman that,
Tory party had then, for nearly 70 years pursued. I under the Appropriation Act, there was power to make the
thought that that party which give the greatest satisfac- transfer, and that therefore this additional vote was wane-
tion to the people at large, should, by their measures and cessary.
conduct conciliate the people at large, was the party which After an observation from the CIIANCELLOR of the EXCIIEQUIRI
would be likely to succeed to power during the existence the amendment was withdrawn, and the vote agreed to.
of the Reform Bill. Ithink that events have not proved 849,2851. Salaries of the Customs, &c.
me wrong in my belief. (Hear, hear.) The Government Mr. HAMILTON having promised explanation at a future
of Sir Robert Peel was one of the strongest which has stage, the vote was agreed to.
since been seen; the power which he exercised and the 650,0001. Inland Revenue.—Agreed to.
confidence which he enjoyed in this house are a proof that 242,7001. Superannuations, Customs, Post-office, &c.
the bill was not one-sided in its character. Under the cir- Agreed to, and the house resumed. '
cumstances which I have stated, I think that with regard MILITIA ACT CONTINUANCE BILL.
to this question of reform, we have but little security in- General PEEL obtained leave to bring in this bill.
deed. If we refer to the speech of Lord Derby in another UNIVERSITY OF CAMBRIDGE MATRICULATION
place, we are told that he is not sure whether there are any FEES BILL.
defects in the present system. If he finds any defects he This Bill was brought in by M(rs.GII,NIT.A.O.
)HAMILTON,BILL,
will consider them, and if he fads a remedy he will bring BOARD OF HEALTH K
it forward. (Hear.) We have, therefore, the danger, Mr. ADDERLEY obtained leave to bring in a bill to con-
first, that he may find no defects; and, secondly, that even firm a certain' provisional order of the General Board of
if he does, he may not bring forward any remedy. (Hear, it ealth, applying the Public Health Act, 1848, to the district
hear.) According to his own showing, therefore, Lord of Skipton, in the West Riding of the county of York, and to
Derby is not likely to give us his reform bill, and with re- further declare the limits of the district of Toxteth Park, in
ference to the right hon. gentleman, I must say that I the county palatine of Lancaster, for the purposes of the said
should look with great suspicion at any measure of the act.
kind in which he took a part. (" Hear," and " Oh.") I The Marine Mutiny Bill was brought in and read a first
cannot sit down without stating that I am much gratified time.
to find that the correspondence between the Government The house adjourned at nine o'clock.
of her Mhjesty and the Emperor of the French has resulted
in the termination of those differences which produced so
painful a result. I think that the noble lord at the head of
the Foreign Affairs is likely to carry into the affairs of his
department a due regard to the dignity of this country
and a spirit of conciliation towards our allies. (Hear.) I
hope we shall maintain the alliance of France, which is
one of main importance throughout Europe. I hope we shall
not consider that power as the only friendly power in Europe.
I believe thatthe position of England at this time is such
that there is nothing, which she should ask from any power
which can interfere with our friendly relations with that
power. I trust, therefore,that such a course will be pursued
that whatever I may think of the domestic policy of the Go-
vernment, I may at least approve of the conduct of foreign
affairs. (Hear, hear.)
Mr.'DRUMMOND said they appeared to be entering
upon a debate touching the Reform Bill which could not be
a useful one. But he could not hear the remarks of the
noble lord (J. Russell) and of the right hon. gentleman (the
Chancellor of the Exchequer) without saying that he con-
curred more in those which fell upon that (the Government)
side of the house than in those which fell upon the other.
The noble lord had, touched upon the real animus of the
framers of the Reform Bill when he spoke of the exclusion
from office of the- Whigs.for 70 years. (Cheers.)
Lord PALMERSTON—I have no desire to interpose in
the passage of arms which has taken place between my
hon. friend the memberfor Dover and theright hon. gentle-
man the Chancellor of the Exchequer—a passage in which
I think the house will admit that each knight has distin-
guished himself in the manner in which he has wielded his
weapons. So much so indeed that it is difficult to say on
which side the advantage rests. (Cries of " Oh !" from the
Ministerial benches.) I wish, however, to say a few words
in reply to what fell from my right hon. friend behind me
(Mr. foreman). lam not going to seek in his speech an
answer which he appeared to give to the right hon. gentle.
man the member for Bucks, who inquired with some
anxiety where the majority of this house is to be found.
My right hon. friend seemed to know where that majority
is ; he appeared to be conscious that he could wield it when
he pleased, and although he spoke in very handsome terms
of the Government, he yet informed the right hon. gentle-
man opposite that whenever the time came when he should
think it fit to wield that majority he was prepared to wield
that majority, and eject from office the Ministry who now
sat opposite. (A. laugh.) With regard to those who sit on
these benches, I can only say that we have submitted in
deference to the opinicai of thin house, and that there shall
be rip factious attempts on our part to anticipate the time
wheilthe majority which my right hon. friend has alluded to
shall cause the right hon. gentlemen opposite to continue
oppesita no longer. But my right hon. friend, referring to
the late Government seemed to consider that my course had
been rather to ask the support of those who sit on the
other side of the house than to pursue the line of conduct
which would have received the support of those by whom
the late Government was generally supported. I can only
say, sir, that, sorry as L was to lose the assistance of my
right hon. friend, I was not aware that that loss was oc-
casioned by any failure in political conduct on my part.
If it be, as my right hon. friend says, that, as the head of
the Gavel lament, I looked chiefly for support on the other
side of the house, I must say that the result has shown that
the expectations I might have formed were note founded on
very good grounds. (Hear, and laughter.) But I must
say, that iu pursuing that course which I and my col-
leagues thought was for the good of the country, we were
happy to receive support from every part of the house. We
regretted when measures had not the support of those who
sat on the same side as ourselves, but we rejoiced to find
that any portion of the house approved of the course which
we thought just. And I must say that I think the occa-
sional support we received from menabersi who did not
habitually act with us was as creditable to the Government
as it was honourable to those who gave it—(hear, hear)—
and undoubtedly, if again it should be our lot to be re-
sponsible for the conduct of affairs, I should not think my-
self acting otherwise than in accordance with the interests
of the country merely because our measures might receive
the support of those who did not generally act with us.
(Hear.) tNow, sir, when my right hon. friend seems to
imply that I am not a liberal, but a tory, I beg leave to
remind him that in all those measures of domestic policy
which my noble friend the member for the City of London
has brought forward, and in which he takes, and justly,
so much pride, I acted with him, and gave him all the sup-
port in my power. (Hear, hear.) My right hon. friend
has referred to the vote which has placed us upon this side
of the house. Sir I ara'not going to impugn the conduct of
those by whose vote we were placed in the position we now
hold. No doubt the larger portion of those who voted were
sincere in giving a vote for the introduction of the bill, and
afterwards joining in a vote against it. Bat nevertheless, I
must remind the right hon, gentleman that the vote on the
introduction of the bill against the amendment then proposed
by the hon. member for Bridgewater (Mr. Kinglake) was
a vote utterly and entirely at variance with the vote given
upon the precisely similar occasion of the second reading.
(Hear.) The gentlemen who pursued that course have, un-
doubtedly, reasons which they fairly thought justified'
them in taking advantage of the opportunity which was
given them for placing'the Government in a minority. I
do not blame them, but. I cannot admit the assertion that
there was not a manoeuvre in the step—though I admit
that that manoeuvre might be a blameless one. Those who
sit on those b6nches, I may say, sir, have no intention of
adopting any similar course. The right hon. gentlemen
opposite have undertaken that constitutional responsibility
which belongs to office. From what has passed, it appears
that they intend to adopt some of the principal measures
which we hal proposed. So long as they follow out those
measures, they will receive all the support which we can
give them. (Hear.) Sir, with regard to the course which
we on this side pursued during the three years we held
office, I am content to leave that to the impartial j udgment
of the country. I was called to be the head of the Govern-
ment, not through any effort of my own, not by any pro-
ceeding of which I was the mover, but simply because the
combinations had failed. (Hear.) The Government of
whi ch I was a member carried to a successful termination
is great and difficult war. In conjunction with our great
ally, we 'obtained a peace. We persevered in requiring a
complete executibn of that treaty, although many difficul-
ties intervened ; we hart other difficulties connected with
this matter which we succeeded in overcoming. When that
great calamity which has convulsed our Indian empire
()marred we left no exertion untried to meet evils which
were occurring. With regard to our internal legislation,
in the course of three years we succeeded in passing mea-
sures of great national importance. These comprised mea-
sures connected with trade and coMmerce, and measures
abolishing systems of -long duration, and perfecting
arrangements which had long been desired. It is owing
to our perseverance last session that, although that session
was short in consequence of the dissolution of Parliament,
and we were told by the right hon. gentleman opposite
(the Chancellor of the Exchequer) we were wasting the
session, we carried through three measures of great import-
ance. These were the two acts relating to the divorce and tes-
tamentary jurisdiction and the act for punishing criminal
breaches'of trust. (Hear.) I merely mention these things,
and I will add nothing more, because we are willing to leave
our administration to impartial history, and we feel perfectly
satisfied that, when the results of that administration are
looked at, wo shall be found net to have abused the confidenk e
which our sovereign, and the country, and Parliament placed
in us. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. HORSMAN explained that in answer to his hon.
friend's.statement as to the course of the opposition, he had
merely quoted the statement made upon the hustings by the
hon. member for Northampton, without pretending to say
that that sta' ement embodied his (Mr. Horsman's) opinions.
The report of the committee was then agreed to.
MUTINY BILLg.
Leave was given to bring in the usual Military and Marine
Mutiny Bills.
SALE OF COMMISSIONS IN THE AR I 'UMW.
Upon the motion for going into committee of supply,
Mr. BAGWELL called the attention of the gallant member
the Secretary fur War to a circumstance which he thought re-
quire serious consideration. A young gentleman, a ward of
his, studying in London for a commission in the Artillery,
saw in a daily paper an advertisement, that certain army
ag-nts would procure commissions in the cavahy, without
examination, upon payment of 5501. The young gentleman
entered int some communication with the parties advertis-
ing, but ultimately brought the facts to his (Mr. Bagwell's)
knowledge. He went to the parties advertising, and by them
he was to d that if he would place 5501. in the hands of their
bankers, in Regent-street, he should have an
would
rto raise
50 men, upon the raising of which his ward have his
commission. Now, ho wished to know to whom this 5501.
was to go. HO had applied to Sir C. Yorke, who stated he
knew nothing about the matter. An impression might arise
that the whole was some swindling production. re e be-
neva, however, that the advertisers had actually power to
raise 50 men, and to get the commiseira, When 7,600 men
were got by recruiting within a month there could be no
very great difficulty in raising 50 mon . ?ut this was not the
question. It was, where did this 5501 go I He believed
that au underhand system was in force, id that something
wrong was going on. With a view to c.car up the matter,
he now asked an explanation of the Government.
General PEEL said that, having made inquiry at the Horse
Gnarls, he had found that no agent was authorised by the
Commander-in-Chief to issue the advertiseenent alluded to by
the hon. member. On the contrary, he had found that, by
the 87th section of the Mutiny Act, any person directly or
indirectly interfering with the recruiting service, without the
permission of the Adjutant-General or the East' India Com-
pany, subjected himself to a penalty of 20/ for each offence.
The advertisement had been issued without any authority
from the Horse Guards.
The house then went into committee of supply.
In committee,
General PEEL moved a vote of 500,0001. towards the ex-
penses of the embodied militia for the current year, explain.
ing that the necessity for increasin , the vote arose from the
fact, that unusually large draughts of troops had been sent
to India, and in consequence the militia had to be called out
for garrison duty. Thirty-seven regiments hart been seat to
India since the commencement of the mutiny. 200,00 V. bad
been
the ittnount originally contemplated, but the expenses
had exceeded that amount by 500,0001.
Sir G. C. LEWIS said that the assumption under the late
Government was, that' the saving to accrue from the transfer
of so many troop to the service of the East India Company,
would, with the addition of 210,8001., be sufficient to defray
the extraordinary expense of the militia. Before leaving
office he had not been led by any information from the war
department to expect that any additional vote would be
necessary. If this was merely a. formal vote on account he
would not object to it, but if it was intended to add 500,0001.
to the expense of the 'militia, he thought the committee
ghould have some_explanation before the vote was agreed to.
The CHANCELLOR , f the EXCHEQUER said the vote
would be no actual increase in the_estimates, as 800,0001.
would be eaved in those of the army, Tires.© was no power

Country Markets.

CHELMSFORD-31Aacg 12.

The wheat trade to-day was in a rather dull state,
and is below the rates of last week. Spring corn also
dull, and all else unchanged in value.
Wheat, white, old, per s. s. ■, s.
qr. 45 51 Oats, per qr 24 29
new.... 45 51 Peas, Partridge 40 43
red, old 42 46 White 38 42
new.... 40 46 Boiling 39 44
Barley 34 40 Dun 38 40
Chevalier 38 44 1 Beans, Tisk .36 38
Grinding 2B 32 1 Harrow ticks 36 40
Malt 70 73 I Mazagan 32 35
__...

Chevalier ..........72 73

Ditto; new... 32 34

COLCHESTER— MARea 13.

Rather more wheat on offer ; the driest samples realised
last week's rates ; other sorts the turn lower. Barley
readily taken, at late rates, and for fine malting qualities
a slight advance. Beans and peas Is dearer.
Prices to-day were as follow :—Wheat, white, 46s to 525;
red, 42s to 48s; barley, 36s to 44s ; oats, 24s to 28s ; beans,
Mazagan, 34s to 365; middle and small, 36s to 40s; peas,
white, 40s to 42s ; grey, 40s to 425,

Official Statement of the Quantities of Corn, &c., receive&
in the port of London, from the following ports, front
March 8 to March 13, both inclusive.

• ta:. • _
+: 5 -3* j•
,4 z S
' 7
75870 09
1-
---
-
- ; 68
- 1369

Colchester —
Harwich — i
Leigh
Idaldon ;1397

184', -
129) -

11M

KIRKCALDY-MARCH 13.

1 80

We had good supplies of grain to-day of all kinds. Sales
quick, and prices of barley and oats is per qr. higher than
the rates of; last week. Wheat a slow sale, at is per qr.
reduction.

Wheat. Barley. I Oats. J Beane.
I First 4Bs Od 3ls 01 289 Od I Os Od
Second 46s Od 28a 6d 23s y Os. 01
I Third 34s Od 23s 01 I 18s Od I Os Od

COAL MARBEI
Prices of Coals per ton a'

.-21A.Rou 13.

s. d.
Bell's Primrose l2 6
Taufield Moor Butes 14 6,

the close of the market

Wallsend, &o.

Framwellgate l6 6
Acorn Close l7 0
Stew ,it's. 19 :1
Hartlepool Hetton lB 0
South Kelloe 18 01
Ships at marks

Wallsend, &o.
: . s a;
Eden
~,16 9
Radon l5 0
Powell's Duifryn Steam 21 6
Riddell l4 9
I Haswell 19 3
Cassop - lB 0
Ifleng a Hall l6 6
Lambton l9 0
)t, 49 ; sold, 32. ' .

Thu SWANSEA CONVICTS.—AII hopes of a reprieve for
the two convicts sentenced to death for murder at
Swansea are now at an end ; the execution will take
place at Swansea, and not at Cardiff as was at one time
expected ; and Saturday next, we believe, is the d:ey
fixed, trough no official announcement is made of the
fact. A written application has been made to the sheriff
by a resident in Swansea, who tendered his services in
the capacity of executioner, offering to despatch the two
men "cleverly and well" at a reduced charge upon the
tariff of Calcraft. Calcrafr, however, has been engaged.
[ADVERTISEMENT.]—Holloway's Pills are undeniably
the finest medicine for debilitated constitutions!, disor-
dered liver, bile, and indigestion. The wonderful ale
cacy of this salutary medicine, and the good effects pro-
duced on patients suffering from the above complainti4
would appear incredible if it were not confirmed by daily
proofs of the cures effected by them, and the pet:lusters*
benefit derived from their use. The exhilarating ,t
pro-
perties of these invaluable pills entirely banish all ne -
vousness from the system, and strengthen the Stomachs,
thereby promoting . digestion ; also persons sufferiisg
from dropsy should use these pills, as they are the moat
safe arid certain remedy ever known for that dreseifiil
malady.—Sold by all medicine vendors throughout. the
world ;at Professor Holloway's Eitablishrseut, 44r '
Strand, London.

[ADVERTISIMNII.—It would be to some extent a neglact oaf
the duty which we owe to our readers, if wo failed to allude
to the unprecedented mass of evidence that has reached u 4
in proof of the remedial efficacy of Du Barry's Revs.lents
Arabica Food, in many disorders whic's, whilst most painfid
and distressing in their symptoms, have, at the same tivssi,
through their obstinacy and continuity, been inaocessible to
medical skill. We have looked over some of the lists of
heartfelt testimony to the beneficial effects of this. Food, ha
various and complicated stages of disorder, including dy.-
pepsia (indigestion), constipation, functional irrogularltis
obstructions, acidity, cramps, spasms, fits,, heartburn,
diarrhoea, nervousness, affections of the liver and kidneys,
flatulency, distention, palpitation of the heart, nervous head-
ache, deafness noises in the head and ears, giddiness, paina
between the shoulders and in almost every part.of the bodY,
chronic inflammation and ulceration of the stomach, ernp.
tions on the skin, scurvy, fever, scrofula, impurities, poverty,
of blood, consumption (if not beyond human aid) dropsy,
rheumatism, gout, influenza, grippe, nausea and vomiting
during pregnancy, after eating, or at sea, low spirits, spleen.,
general debility, paralysis, cough, asthma, tightness across lifts
chest, phlegm, inquietude, sleeplessness, involuntary blush
ing, tremors, dislike to society, unfitness for study, delusio Sias
loss of memory, vertigo, blood to the head, exhaustion, met en-
choly, groundless fear, indecision, wretchedness, thong *till
of self-destruction, dm. One or two examples, from the FUSTY
THO USAND Testimonials received by Messrs. Du Barry, n 57
be interesting and useful. The "Ven. Alex. Stuart, .A.rch•
deacon of Ross, informs us that he has been relieved, frt
excessive nervousness, pains in the neck and left arm, gene ral
weakness of constitution, and other a lments, rendering :his
life very miserable." Mr. Hunt, barrister-at-law (a gent In-
man 85 years old) certifies that he has been radically cured. of
paralysis of 60 years' standing, as well as of otlieraillictiorts ;
and after a long life of comparative misery, he gratefully pp as
tests that he is now "a stranger to ill complaints; except.;
hearty old age." Major Edie states that; after " having
suffered fearfully for two years from an enlargement of tree
liver, and an inveterate diarrhcea," which had totally deg, sd
the most eminent medical aid, and had brought him to tha
brink of the grave, being unable to lift his' arms 'from pot jet
exhaustion," ho had recourse to the Food, and he then g bee
os to say :—.l The result of eating this delicious Food is the
perfect restoration of my health within a month, and I takis
peculiar pleasure in recommending all sufferers to follow my
example." But to pursue these testimonials would be an as
task. Upon 50,000 authenticated certificates, wa h,s, se
the " great!' and auspicious fact that, for the first time inlie
history of pathology, an agent has been discovered tad&
cbmpletely effects all that had hitherto bees fruitls ssly
attempted by all the nauseous preparations of the lab ora-
tory.. Not merely in its remedial, but in its prose rva-
tive capacity, as a protector, as well as a. restore r of
health, its efficiency is attested by the grateful evident e of
those who have had experience in propria persona.—Thei cir-
cumstances brought to light in connection 'with its na as,
food for infants, shew that whilst it prolongs the lives tL
thousands of adults, it is calculated to cause many to ream,-
maturity who would otherwise perish in early childhood.
Altogether, we confess to the pleasing conviction that that
extended use, amongst all classes, of Du Barry's Food, inns
produce a marked change for the better in the avow
rage vilue of life, and in the sanitary statistics of our errs.
Supported by testimonials from the following celebrated. Pre-
fessors of Chemistry: Dr. A. Ure; Dr. Shorland; Dr. Ilaisvoy;
Dr. Campbell ; Dr. Gattiker ; Dr. Wurzer ; Dr. Ing ram. ;
Lord Stuart de Decies; the Dowager Countess of Castlestmart;
Major Gen. Thomas King, and many other respectable par-
sons, 'whose health has been restored by it, after all other
means Of cure bad failed. Suitably packed with full insstrssos
tioris. .In canisters, 11b. 2s. 9d. ; 210. 4s. 6d. ; 51b., ;
121 b. 225. The 121 b canisters are sent carriage fres", co 1 re-
ceipt of Post-office order. Barry Du Barry, and Co,
77,
Regent-street, London. Important Caution agaisaSt the fears
ful dangers of spurious imitations.—The Vice-gkancellmr sir
William Page Wood granted an Injunction en the 10th Ist well,
1854, against Alfred Hooper Nevin, for imitating 4" Da
Barry's Revalenta Arabica Food."