The Sun.
London, England, 1860-10-24 00:00:00

NIMETIMIViSIINIOM69I66I274IW•III.IIOI2/1..........iw.
THE SUN LONTPON, WEDNESDAY. EVENING, OCTOBER 24, 1860.

11•••••••ralsora
.FROM THE GAZETTE OF LAST Ef-.ITINU.

MR. LINDSAY ON MARITIZUE
COMMERCIAL LAW.

WHITEHALL, Ocr. 22.
The Queen has been pleased to appoint Francis Pigott,
Esq., to be Lieutenant-Governor of the Isle of Man, in the
room of the Hon. Charles Hope, resigned.
FOREIGN- OF FICE, Ocr. 20.
The Queen has been pleased to approve of Mr. William
Boys as Consul at Hobart Town for. the Free Hanseatic
City of Hamburg.
CROWN-OFFICE, OCT.' 23. •
MEMBER RETURNED TO SERVE IN THE PRESENT
PARLIAMENT.
Borough of Honiton:—George Moffatt, of Eaton-square,
in the county of Middlesex, Esq., in the room of Joseph
Locke, Esq., deceased.
WAR-OFFICE, PALL-MALL, OCT. 23.
7th Regiment of Dragoon Guards—Ensign George Henry
Bacchus, from the 12th Foot, to be Cornet, vice O'Dowd,
promoted.
18th Light Dragoons—Edward Bacon, Gent., to be Cornet,
without purchase, vice Liebert, promoted.
Military Train—Andrew Rutherford Warren, gent., to be
Ensign, without purchase.
11th Regiment of Foot—Lieutenant Francis Armstrong to
be Captain, by purchase, vice Abraham Martin, who re-
tires ; Eneign Geerge. Coote to be Lieutenant. by pur-
chase, vice Armstrong. , The commission of Lieutenant
Francis W. Osborne, as Adjutant, to bear date the 19th
August, 1860, instead of 18th September, 1860, as stated
in the Gazette of the latter date.
13th Foot—Henry Hart, Gent., to be Ensign, without
purchase, vice King, promoted.
14th Foot—Captain William Russell Russell, from the 58th
Foot, to be Captain, vice William Alexander Dobie, who
exchanges.
18th Font—Albert James Alexander Jackson, to be En-
sign, without purchase, vice Stevenson, promoted ; John
George Butts, Gent., to be Ensign, without purchase,
vice Nicolls, promoted.
22d Foot—Ensign. Percy Sandford Nevile to be Lieute-
nant, by purchase, vice Dolmage, who retires.
25th Foot—Major Francis Pane to be Lieutenant-Colonel,
by purchase, vice Samuel B. Hamilton, who retires ;
Captain Charles James Stewart Wallace to be Major, by
purchase, vice Fano ; Lieutenant George Kirwan to be
I Captain, by purchase, vice Wallace.
26th Foot—Captain Edward James Upton, from the 72d
Foot, to be Captain, vice Captain and BreN et-Lieute-
nant-Colonel William WDonald, who exchanges.
29th Foot—Captain John Robert Grimaton, from the 57th
Foot, to be Captain, vice Edward Gorton, who exchanges.
39th Foot—Major and Brevet-Colonel John De Lacy,
from half-pay Unattached, to be Major, vice Thomas
Weight Hudson, promoted, without purchase, to an Un-
attached Lieutenant-Colonelcy ; Captain and Brevet-
! Major William Leckie to be Major, by purchase, vice
Brevet-Colonel John De Lacy, who retires; Lieutenant
Thomas Westropp Bennett to be Captain, by purchase,
vice Leckie ; Ensign Richard Albert *Vercoe Pope to be
Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Bennett.
40th Foot—Percy Cartwright, Gent., to be Ensign, without
purchase, vice Dudgeon,
promoted.
49th Foot—Ensign Charles Caesar Welman, from the 77th
Foot, to be Ensign, vice Henry Tropp, who exchanges.
51st Foot—Captain Geo. Bliss M'Queen, from the 60th
Foot, to be Captain, vice Percy Chaplin, who exchanges.
53d Foot—Lieutenant William -Henry James Clarke to be
Captain, without purchase, vice Brevet-Lieut.-Colonel
Joseph Maycock, deceased ; Ensign Samuel J. Nicholls
to be Lieutenant, without purchase, vice Clarke.
54th'Foot—Bennett Andrew Hume, Gent., to be Ensign,
Without purchase, vice Purnell, whose appointment, on
SePt. 21, 1860, has been cancelled. '
57th Foot--Captain Edward Gorton from the 29th Foot,
to be Captain, vice John R. Grimston, who exchanges.
58th Foot—Captain William Alexander Dobie from the 14th
Foot, to be Captain, vice William Russell Russell, who
exchanges.
60th Foot—Captain. Percy Chaplin, from the 51st Foot, to
be Captain, vice George Bliss M'Queen, who exchanges.
72d 'Foot—Captain and Brevet Lieutenant-Colonel Wm.
M'Donald, from the 26th Foot, to be Captain, Nice Ed-
ward James Upton, who exchanges.
76th Foot—Lieutenant John M'Dermid Allardice to be
Instructor of Musketry, vice Lieutenant John Henry
Tripp, promoted.
77th Foot—Ensign Henry Topp, from the 49th Foot, to be
Ensign, vice Charles Caner Welmatt, who exchanges.
79th Foot—Lieutenant Wm. John M'Crawfurd to be Cap-
tain, by purchase, , vice Brevet-Major Henry Holford
Stevenson, promoted to an Unattached Majority, by pur-

NEW YORK, WEDNESDAY, OCT, 10.
A meeting of the merchants and shipowners of this city
was held last evening in a room in the Mercantile Library
Building, for the purpose of giving an opportunity to Mr.
William S. Lindsay, member of the British Parliament, to
explain the views which he came to this country to repre-
sent, in reference to such a change in the navigation Jaws
as would make the coasting trade of this continent free to
the ships of all nations.
There were over a hundred gentlemen present, repre-
senting a large Ave of the commercial wealth of this me-
tropolis.
Mr. PRIETIAII PERIT introduced Mr.- Lindsay, stating
that this special meeting was called to give him an opportu-
nity of explaining his views on many important subjects
connected with the interests of shipping and of commerce.
Mr. LINDSAY expressed thanks for the opportunity given
him to express • his views in reference to various maritime
questions in which the shipowners and merchants, and
people, Of both England and America, were deeply inte-
rested. As so many reports had been circulated in regard to
his visit, he thought it right to say a few words personal to
himself. It had been stated—and perhaps believed in some
quarters—that he visited this country in an official capacity,
as a kind of ambassador, or perhaps special envoy of the
British Government. He wished to disabuse their minds of
such an idea. His visit was, he might say, one of pleasure.
For many years, as many of those present were aware, he
had had large connections in America. He had a great
many kind and warm friends in Various parts of the United
States, and he had long promised himself the pleasure of a
visit te this great country. Up to the present time, however,
his many avocations had prevented him fulfilling that pro-
mise. Lord J. Russell (said he), when he heard that I was
about to visit this country, was good enough to ask me, in my
intercourse with merchants and shipowners in the States, to
have some conversation with them in regard to commercial
questions which the Government of both countries were
very anxious to settle. Being largely connected with Bri-
tish shipping, and being also much interested in these ques-
tions, I readily consented to do what I possibly could to
pave the way for the settlement of these various questions.
His lordship was good enough to furnish me with the cor-
respondence which had passed= the subject, so as to make
me familiar with the question, and also to write Lord Lyons
to afford me facilities. That is the only connection that I
had with the British Government. His lordship knew that
for many years past I have, in the House of Commons, de-
voted my attention almost exclusively to these great mari-
time questions, and he also knew that for the last two or
three sessions of Parliament both branches of the house had
popular views in regard to these questions. There were
some remarks made about him, he said, which he should not
I pass over lest they might injure the great and good cause
which he had voluntarily undertaken. It was said that he
was not at all competent for such a task because he was a
self-taught and self-made man; but he felt that his being
self-made and self-taught would not make him the less ac-
ceptable to the American people. (Applause.) It was also
said that he had not sufficient knowledge to deal with these
questions. Well, Mr. President and gentlemen, said he, I
am ignorant about many things, and the longer I live the
more ignorant I feel myself to be ; and in coming among
you I desired more to gain knowledge than to attempt to
impart information. But if lam ignorant on general ques-
tions, I ought to be familiar with the questions on which I
am about to address you this evening, because I have been
from my boyhood connected with maritime affairs, and since
I have been a member of Parliament, now many years, I
have devoted myself almost exclusively to the understanding
of these questions. It was said that perhaps I was not compe-
tent to deal with the delicate questions of diplomacy. Well,
gentlemen, however eager I may be to obtain knowledge,
there is one kind of knowledge which I do not desire to ob-
tain, and that is the knowledge of diplomacy as taught in
too many Courts of Europe. I think it would be well for
mankind, and well for the nations, if there were less of that
intricate diplomacy, and more of honest, straightforward
dealing between men and nations. (Applause.) I think I
can best attain the object that I have in view by speaking
to you as a plain man .of business, addressing plain men of
business in a great business city, and frankly pointing out
what I conceive to be wrong in your laws, and as frankly
pointing out what I conceive to be wrong in our
own laws. That appears to me to be the height of all dip-
lomacy, which, to use a homely phrase, is prepared to give
and take, and to do justice to all men. (Applause.) I
think it hardly worth while to notice the remarks of a cer-
tain body of men, known as the Shipowners' Society of
London. These associations in England are very different
from thosehere—from your Chamber of Commerce and Board
of Trade, which represent great commercial and maritime
interests, and have great weight with the Federal Govern-
ment. Too many of our associations in England are small
political factions, got together ostensibly for the purpose of
promoting the interests of particular branches of trade, but
too often they ride hobbies of their own on some political
dogmas. Such is the fact in the face of the so-called Lon-
don Shipowners' Society. This society met together in
solemn conclave in the attic in which they usually assemble
and passed a resolution declaring that they had no confi-
dence in me. The resolution pleased them, I dare say, and
I do not think it injured me; but I shall call attention to
it, simply because it may have reached some parts of this
country, and some gentlemen here might be disposed te at-
tach too great weight to it. I assure you that the gentlemen
who passed that resolution have no influence whatever in the
Parliament of England. With these preliminary remarks
allow me to state to you the objects which I have in view in
meeting you this evening. I will speak first with reference to
the liability of shipowners, because that, perhaps, is one of
the most important questions, and one which I think is
not sufficiently well understood. Ido not think that it is
sufficiently known how the shipowners of both countries
stand with regard to each other on this question. In fact,
as to the law of England, any shipowner there—and
indeed I might almost say the same of the shipowner of
this or any other country—however wealthy he might be,
-might rise any morning and find himself a ruined man.
That is a serious thing to consider. Now the law of Eng-
land with regard to the responsibilities of shipowners limits
the responsibility of the owners to the value of the ship and
freight. In most of the other countries of Europe, also, the
responsibility of the shipowner is limited to that extent.
This is also the law in this country—that is to say, it is so
in this country so far as I understand the law. Speaking
to American gentlemen, of course, I speak under correction;
but so far as 1 understand the law of your country, your
responsibility. in cases of collision, is limited to the value
of the ship and freight. That is to say, if one of your ships
runs down another ship at sea, and you pay into your courts
the value of the ship and freight, your responsibility cannot
be carried beyond the value. That is all very well, so far as
the laws of the respective countries stand. But if my ship
runs down an American ship, and my ship enters any of
your ports, I am made responsible, not merely in your
courts for the value of the ship and freight, but I am made
responsible exactly for whatever amount of damage may
have been sustained through the collision brought about by
my ship. So, therefore, if my ship runs down a vessel with
cargo and freight on board to the extent of £200,000 ster-
ling, I would be responsible for the whole. If your ships at
sea run down any other American ship, or run down a
British ship, and it be brought into our courts, you are
also responsible in our courts for the full amount of the
damage which your ship caused.' Now, this arises from
the fact that our laws have jurisdiction only over British
ships, and that your laws have jurisdiction only over Ame-
rican ships. Now, considering The vast trade which is car-
ried on between the two countries, I think, and I hope you
will agree with me, that it is most desirable, more particu-
larly as the Legislatures of either country have specified
that, the shipowners responsibility shall be limited—l
think there ought to be a convention between the two coun-
tries, who should decide on some principle which would be
common to both countries. We will require to alter our
rules, or rather it will not do for us to have two laws with
reference to the rule of the road at sea. Your rule in America
is much the same as the old maritime rule of the road, with
some slight modifications. Indeed, with some slight modifi-
cations added, it would be desirable for England to adopt the
rule of the road that is now in use with American vessels. I
will not now enter into the details which otight to go to make
sucha rule. What I desire is, that you should go with me in
endeavouring to bring about the opinion amongst shipowners
that there should be but one rule for the guidance of marl •
ners in America and England. Now, with reference to the
use of lights at sea. In 1858 we, in accordance with a law
then passed, adopted a system of single lights at sea which
I need not minutely describe; but that system of lights was
considered so good that all the nations I believe have now
adopted it. • You in America have adopted that systein so
far as steamers are concerned, and your shipowners have
also adopted it. But it is not compulsory by your laws for
your shipowners in all cases to carry lights. Now lam of
opinion that it would be desirable.that the law of America
on this point should be made similar to that of England
with reference to the lights to be carried at sea ; that Ame-
rican and English ships should carry the same lights; and
that your shipowners should be compelled to carry these
lights in the same way as English sl4powners were com-
pelled to carry them ; if we had the same rule of the road,
and established the same system of lights, thneortethwaotumldanbye
place,l e greatbu t, csounrspi dr surprise
tome
t h e is,
no rmous
collisionsinter-
less collisions.
took
course between the two countries, and the vast numbs'. of
vessels which pass through the St. George and the English
Channels, I must say I am much surprised that many more
collisions do not take place ; and this is a matter which
speaks well for the masters of American and Englißh ships,
and the great caution theyraust exercise to avoid collisions.
These come under the head of liabilities, to which I shall
call your serious attention. There are other points of the
subject to which I desire to call your attentiou, and tip on

chase.
82d Foot—Captain Frederick Richard Soly Flood, from
half-pay Unattached, to be Captain, vice Brevet-Major
Wm. Roberts Farmer, appointed Captain of a Company
of Gentlemen Cadets. Royal Military College.
83d Foot—Charles Lucius Smith, Gent., to be Ensign, by
purchase, vice Brymer, promoted.
Ist West India 'Regiment—Captain James Shortall Ma-
caulay to be Major, by purchase, vice Robert Follett
Synge, who retires ; Lieut. George Augustus Vaughan,
from the 33d Foot, to be Captain, by purchase, vice Ma •
caulay.
UNATTACHED.--Captain and Brevet-Major Henry Hol-
ford Stevenson, from the 79th Foot, to be Major, by pur-
chase.

BREVET.
Lieutenant-Colonel William Neville Custanne, C. 8., 6th
Dragoon Guards, to be Colonel in the Army.
Major Sir Edward Fitzgerald Campbell, Bart., 60th Foot,
to be Lieutenant-Colonel in the Army.
Captain Henry Scott, 18th Light Dragoons, to be Major
in the Army.
Captain George Dowden Dickson Cleveland, 98th Foot,
to be Major in the Army.
Captain Charles•David,Ctminghame Ellis, 60th Foot, to
be Major in the Army.
Captain Richard John Evans, 27th Foot, to be Major in
the Army.
Captain Charles David Rich, 9th Light Dragoons, to be
Major in the Army.
Captain Frederick Richard Solly Flood, 82d Foot, to be
Major in the Army.
The undermentioned promotions to take place consequent
on the promotion of Colonel Richard John Stotherd, Royal
Engineers, to be Major-General in succession to Major •
General W. C. Ward, Royal Engineers, promoted to be
Lieutenant-General, vice Lieutenant-General Sir C. W.
Pasley, K.C.8., Royal Engineers, promoted to be General,
vice General F. R. Thackeray, C. 8., Royal Engineers,who
died on the 19th September, 1860 :
Brevet Lieutenant-Colonel Francis Gregor Urquhart, Ist
Foot, to be Colonel.
Major Morley Stratford Tynte Dennis 76th Foot, to be
Lieutenant-Colonel.
Captain Thomas William Prevost, half-pay 42d Foot,
Staff-Officer of Pensioners, to be Major.
The Undermentioned promotions to take place conse-
quent on the death of Lieutenant-General Sir Harry G.
W. Smith, Bart., G.C.8., Colonel •Commandant Rifle
Brigade, on the 12th October, 1860 :
Major-General John Scott, C. 8., Colonel 3d Dragoon
Guards, to be Lieut.-General.
Brevet-Colonel Frederick Horn, C. 8., from Lieut.-Cole-
nel, half-pay, 20th Foot, serving on the Staff of the Army
at Malta, with the temporary rank of Major-General, to be
Major-General.
Lieut.-Col. Alexander Murray, 87th Foot, to be Colonel.
_ Major Chas, Barnard Hague, 67th Foot, to be Lieut.-

Colonel,
Capt. John Desborough, Royal Artillery, to be Major.
MEMORANDUM Brevet-Lieut.-Colonel Owen Lloyd
Ormsby, has been permitted .to retire from the service, by
the sale of an Unattached Majerity, he being about to be-
come a settler in Canada.
WAR.OFFICE, PALL-MALL, OCT. 23.
_ _

Hon. Artillery Company of London—The Rev. Thomas
Hugo to be Chaplain, vice_the Rev. J. H. Knox, deceased,

ADMIRALTY, OCT. 19.

Corps of Royal Marines—Secend Lieut. Edward Kins•
man to be First Lieutenant, vice Woodriff, placed on half
pay.

BANKRUPTCY ANNULLED.
John Henry Cohn, East India merchant, Lime-strea
Borough.

BANKRUTPS,
Henry Alfred Town Fowler, Francis Edmund Town
Fowler, Joseph Stubbs, and William Goodenough Dunt,
newspaper proprietors, Exeter-street, Strand, to surrender,
Nov. 1 and 30, at half-past eleven, at the Court of Bank-

Hrucy.
emy Robert Watts, wine merchant, Blackman-street
Borough, Nov. 1 and 30, at two, at the Court of Bank
ruptcy.
Thomas Powles, hosier, Milk•street, Cheapside, Nov. 2,
at Halt-past eleven, ana 00, at haif-Faot two, at tho Court
of Bankruptcy.
John Huilah, bookseller, St. Martin's Hall, Long-acre,
Nov. 2, at eleven, and Nov. 30, at twelve, at the Court of
Bankruptcy.
Benjamin Humphrey Nicholls, innkeeper, Wilbarston,
Northamptonshire, Nov. 2, at half-past eleven, and Dec.
6, at one, at the Court of Bankruptcy.
John Henry Raw, clothier, Ware, Herts, Nov. 5' at
twelve, and Dec. 3, at half-past twelve, at the Court of
Bankruptcy.
William Boyce, printer, East Dereham, Norfolk, Nov. 8
at half-past twelve, and Dec. 3, at two, at the Court of
Bankruptcy.
James M'Colm, brewer, Manchester, Nov. 6 and 27, at
twelve, at the Manchester District Court.
James Broad, ironmonger, Drury-lane, Nov. 6 and Dec.
4, at twelve, at the Court of Bankruptcy.
Edward Lewis, printer, Coleman-street, City, Nov. 7, at
half-past one, and Dec. 4, at eleven, at the Court of Bank-
ruptcy:
Lewis Jacobs, shoe manufacturer, Whitehapel, Nov. 2,
at eleven, and Dec. 6, at two, at the Court of Bankruptcy.
George Gee, mercer, Walworth-road, Surrey, Nov. 2, at
at one, and Dec. 8, at eleven, at the Court of Bankruptcy.
William Penfold, smith, Market-terrace, Caledonian-
road, Nov. 5, at half. past one, and Dec. 3, at half-past
eleven, at the Court of Bankruptcy.
Anthony Harris, licensed victualler, Seven Oaks, Kent,
Nov. 5, at half-past eleven, and Dec. 5, at eleven, at the
Court of Bankruptcy.
Robert Willan, grocer, Glossop, Nov. 9 and 30, at twelve,
at the Manchester District Court.
Thomas Bennett and Edward Williams, ironmastars,
molt Forge, Tipton, Staffordshire, Nov. 8 and 30, at eleven,
at the Birmingham District Court.
Fuller Coker, builder, Worcester, Nov. 2 and 23, at
eleven, at the Birmingham District Court.
Thomas Parkes, spade manufacturer, Kniver, Stafford-
shire, Nov. 6 and 26, at eleven, at the Birmingham Dis-
trict Court.
'Benjamin Chester Rawles, boetmaker, East-street, Wal-
worth, Nov. 2, at half-past twelve, and Dec. 8, at twelve,
at the Court of Bankruptcy,
Septimus Frederick Martyn, wholesale shoe warehouse-
man, Dowgate-hill, City, Nov. 2 and Dec. 6, at twelve, at
the Court of Bankruptcy,
John Walker grocer, Sunderland, Oct. 31 and Dec. 12,
at twelve, at the Newc,astle-upon-Tyne District Court.
SCOTCH BANKRUPTS.
Thomas Lauder, potato® merchant, St. Andrews.
James Gowans, watchmaker, Hawick.
Linlithgowshire.
ght, bur h.
h residing in Glasgow.
WjsoahnimllivaAemluGlßleveart,rtgrufaerrageawrirlis
Wyllie and Millar, wine merchants, Edinburgh.
William M'Lintock, cement and chemical manufacturer,
Glasgow.
builder,
Thomas Mclntosh, Blairgowrie.
David Anderson, Came
e®
now deceased. •
Francis Sutherland, innkeeper, Clyth, Caithness-shires

which I think the law of the two countries should be assi- I he specified the tax for the maintenance of lighthouses on
inflated. I refer to offences committed on board American the British coasts, passing tolls to maintain wretched har-
and English ships. Very frequently offences are committed hours, such as Dover and Ramsgate, compulsory pilotages ;
on board American ships entering our ports, and offences and he eulogised the American Government for its recogni-
are committed on British ships entering your ports, over tion of the humane principle that every civilised Government
which the laws of the respective countries have no jurisdic- was bound to light its coasts and point out their dangers.
tion. Perhaps in the case of dangerous offences, such These charges he estimated to cost American shipping about
as murder and murderous assaults, and serious 1,000,000 dollars annually. If the United States would
mutinies, and such like, it might not be desir- make concessions in regard to the coasting trade, he be-
able that the laws of the respective coun!ries should lieved that England would be prepared to sweep away the
have separate and independent jurisdictions. But the whole of these charges. At all events, he would do his
question might be arranged in such a way as this : that best in the British Parliament to accomplish that reform ;
whenever such crimes are committed on board American and it struck him that if American shipowners got relieved,
ships in British ports, or on ships entering British ports, from the payment of this million of dollars, they would get
that then the British magistrate should have the power to the best of the bargain. As a matter, therefore, of pounds,
issue his warrant, and commit the offender in the same way shillings, and pence, he thought the subject worthy of their
as they would deal under like circumstances with British grave and serious consideration. He reminded them of
subjects. Thus, on the more serious offences enumerated, forty or fifty years ago, when England passed a law declar-
the offender to be handed over to the minister or consul of ing that no produce could be taken from Great Britain to
his Government, to be sent home for trial; but in case of America except in British ships, and when the United
minor offences, it is desirable that the offender should be States responded by a law providing that no produce should
dealt with summarily. This class of offences is numerous, be carried from America to Great Britain except in ships of
and very often the offences are of a vexatious character, the United States. These laws led to the spectacle being
such as disputes arising between master and seamen, in re- presented of British ships and American ships crossing each
gard to dealing with which it would be very desirable that other in ballast. Who gained by that policy ? It would
the laws of both countries should be made to harmonise, so be difficult to show that any interest gained by it. If the
that at the request of the consul of either country, the of. American shipowner got 20 dole. a ton for the produce which
fenders might be summarily dealt with by the authorities, he carried to Great Britain, he got nothing for his voyage
in whatever port the vessel lay. There is considerable back to the United States, whereas if he had got but 12 dols.
trouble with respect to the crime of desertion front ships a ton each way, ho would have had 4 dols. a ton more in his
belonging to either country, and yet there is no mutual law pocket, and the consumers on each side of the Atlantic
giving jurisdiction in the respective countries for the sum- would have got their produce at 8 dole. a ton cheaper.
mart' punishment of the deserter. Such a law is very much The two countries were, at the present moment, pur-
needed, when you consider how ships are detained frequently suing a similar foolish course of policy in regard to
whole months together in ports. By this cause alone you the vast lake trade. of which he had heard so much, and
will see the importance of a desertion law common to both which he was going to see and judge of for himself. The
countries. There is more in this matter than appears at Canadians had a very large and extensive trade on the
first glance. Perhaps you may think the question unworthy northern side of the lakes, and the Americans an equally
of notice ; but when you consider the vast intercourse be- extensive trade on the southern side. As the law now stood,
tween the two countries, and the disputes which constantly while foreign ships might go into the intercolonial trade,
arise between masters and crows, it becomes of graver im- they could not go from port to port in the colonies. An
portance than appears at the first glance. And therefore it American ship could not go from one Canadian port to
is that I call your serious attention to it, and that I say it is another Canadian port, nor could a British ship go from one
desirable that the laws of both countries, with reference to American port to another American port on the lakes.
the matter, should be made to harmonise. The next epics- Was not that precisely the same absurd principle as their
tion I submit to you is a truly great question, and perhaps fathers had carried out some 40 years before on the Atlan-
I feel a delicacy in entering upon its consideration. But tic ? Why should Auch legislative barriers to commerce
it is a question upon which I have felt very strongly for be set up ? They merely injured the consumers of the
many years. I refer to the question of belligerent rights respective countries, and injured the shipowners employed
at sea. I ant anxious to call your serious attention to the in the lake trade. He thought that if the American Govern-
question, because the report of the Mercantile Shipping ment would make concessions as to the coasting trade it ought
Committee was carried through the House of Commons on to insist on the British Government, in addition to giving
my recommendation. I desire, therefore, your particular up the heavy duties he had alluded to, making the coasting
attention to the question of belligerent rights at sea, and trade along the lakes and with the colonies free. Not only
your own position with regard to it. During the unfortu- would the people of both nations be largely benefitted by
nate war with Russia, and which 1 did my best to prevent, such policy, but he conscientiously believed that the ship-
England formed an alliance with France, by which among owners of both nations would also be materially benefitted
other things it was agreed that both nations should waive by it. These were questions which he hoped would receive
the right of confiscation of goods found on neutral ships, their impartial consideration ; but he asked that in dealing
and goods not contraband of war found on board enemies' with them they would separate them, and not treat them to-
ships. Now this mutual but provisional waiver of rights nether, for while there might be but little difference of opi-
placed the allies in harmoniousaction, and practically cows- nion as to the one, there might be very much as to the
tenanted the principle, " free goods make free ships." On other. Though he was anxious to see the American coasting.
the return of peace a declaration was drawn up at Pgaris, trade opened, he was still more anxious to see a settlement of
agreed to by France, Great Britain, Prussia, Russia, Sar- the questions to which he had first called their attention—
dinia, and Turkey, abolishing privateering. That declara- more especially the question of responsibility, which was a
tion was submitted to your Government, but it declined to grave question, and one which he hoped would be promptly
agree to the proposition that privateering should cease. settled. Mr. President, he continued, you were g,oodenough
Your Government declared that it was not the policy of the to say that I might encroach on the patience of the meeting
country to maintain vast standing armies and navies ; that for one hour. I have occupied that time, and have finished
whenever war unfortunately broke out you depended upon all the subjects which I desired to discuss, just as thehand
the patriotism of your people and shipowners to defend you on the dial reaches that point. I hope I have laid these sub-
by land and sea. There was great force, I 1 hink, in your jests before you in a clear and impartial spirit, and that you
reasoning when you said to the other Powers, "If you will will receive theni in the same spirit. My anxiety is to re-
make all private property exempt from capture at sea, we move the rough edges that now too often cause friction be-
will cease from privateering ; but why ask us to abolish it tween the two nations, and often lead to rumours of war.
while you maintain and send out great ships of war, which Although Ido not for a moment suppose that there is any
are nothing more nor less than privateers on a large scale, likelihood of war between two such nations as England and
which go forth to plunder, to burn, and to destroy, and America, nations speaking the same language, professing the
which only stimulate other nations to like acts of plunder • same religion, sprung from the same race, bound together
ing, burning, and destroying ?" This was the unanswer- by every tie that ought to bind men and nations together—
able argument of your Government. I fully agreed with still there are constant rumours of war, caused too often by
the American Government when they said, " Make all pri- some of these questions to which I have directed your atten-
uate property exempt from capture at sea, and then we will tion this evening, and which do an immense amount of
agree to that part of the proposition which says privateer- injury to the people of the two countries by retarding for
ing shall cease." I brought that question under the serious the time being free intercourse and exchange of commodi-
attention of the committee of the House of Commons, and I tics. If my friendly visit to the States can bring about a
carried a resolution throuph the house, and many of the harmony between the laws of the two countries, so as to
gentlemen whosevotes carried it through the house now feel prevent the constant irritation arising on both sides of the
its importance. There are two questions more to which I must Atlantic—if I can by any humble words of mine aid in
direct your attention. We are not so likely to be unanimous throwing oil upon the troubled waters, then ray visit will
upon these paints as upon the ones to which your attention not have been made in vain. I hope, therefore, Mr. Presi-
has already been directed. But I knew you will give me a dent and gentlemen, that although I come before you, not
generous hearing and an impartial consideration to what I as a diplomatist, but simply as a man of business, you will
shall say. I think it may take time to have these questions give your best consideration to the imperfect words that I
satisfactorily settled, because they are questions of policy. have addressed to you this evening, and that before long we
It is right that we should see both sides of the question, may have these difficulties removed, and may thus, in our
and I will give you my views, that you may consider them day and generation, make one step toward that glorious end
over and take them for what they are worth. I will first —peace and good-will between the nations and the interests
speak of the registration laws. An American ship may of mankind in general. With these remarks I thank you
come and be registered in the British Custom-house as a warmly for the kind attention you have given me. (Ap-

plause.)
Mr. CHARLES A. DAVIS suggested that Mr. Lindsay
might be in error in regard to the trade between New York
and San Francisco. His idea was that a foreign ship could
go from here to Aspinwall, send goods across the Isthmus,
and transport them front Panama to San Francisco, without
violating our laws.
Mr. LINDSAY, in support of his original position, referred
to the opinion of the Attorney-General *he United States,
that a foreign ship could not load cargo from an Eastern
port for San Francisco via Panama.
Mr. T tromls TILESTON moved the thanks of the meeting
to Mr. Lindsay for the able manner in. which he had spread
the facts before them.
The motion was carried unanimously.

British-built ship. Here is an advantage to British ship
owners. We can register the ships of any nation. This is
a great advantage to us, because we have bought American
ships which are of a particular construction, and which we
might not have been able to build in our country. The
American law says, " Now, Mr. A., you may invest your
money in an American ship, but not in the ships of any
other nation." To pass a prohibitory law like this is rather
too great a stretch. I think, it least, you might be allowed
to purchase whatever ships you please, and where you
pleased, and that you ought not to be prohibited from do-
ing what you please with your capital. This, however, is
altogether a matter for your own consideration, and it is
for you to consider whether or not you are losers by this
law of prohibition. The next question is a wider question
—and it is the coasting trade. In 1850 we opened our ports
to your shipping, and in 1854 we opened our coasting trade,
se that since those dates your ships can enter all our ports
in India, Canada, and other provinces, on. the very same
terms as British ships. Now, a great adhering principle
of your statesmen (and you have had some of the greatest
statesmen the world ever saw) was reciprocity, and they
were willing to give to other nations what other nations
gare to them. We gave to you the coasting trade. It is
not of much importance, you may say, to have the coasting
trade of the small islands of Great Britain and Ireland ;
but then we gave you the, trade of India, Canada, and
Australia as well, and which you will admit is most im
portant to you. Now, Mr. President, while we did so, you
still exclude us from your coasting trade ; you still call the
trade between New York and California the coasting trade,-
and you go even farther, and say the trade to Panama and
across the isthmus, through a foreign country, is a coast-
ing trade. I speak to a body of wise men, Now, I ask you,
in all justice, is it fair to call these trades a coasting trade ?
It would be as fair to call the trade between England and
Calcutta a coasting trade as to call the California a coasting
trade, whatever it be on the grounds of national, law and
technicalities. Now to be frank I must tell you that a large
number of influential men in Eagland, both in Parliament
and out of it, feel very keenly about that question, and
wonder to think that you should call that vast trade with
California a coasting trade. By the repeal of the Act of
1849 a clause was maintained in that act which gave the
Queen the power to exclude the ships of non-reciprocating
nations from British ports. The Parliament have the power
to put that clause in force. Ido not think the clause will
be enforced, but if it should, see what an injury it would be
to your•eommerce. If the opposition to the Liberal party
got into power I do not know but they may have it enforced,
and they are very likely to be in power before long. It is
true they might not be able to keep it in force more than a
year, but see what injury might be done to your shipping
in that year. Suppose the order came that no American
ships in the ports of India, Canada, or Australia Were to
load any more cargo in those ports, see how many thou-
sand tons of freight you would have lacked up. , Of course
it would enhance the prices to coneamers of those freights
and raise the prices of freights in British vessels. Now I
would, to avoid the possibility of such an event, ask you to
aid me by making some concessions in your coasting trade.
I do not think any foreign nation can compete successfully
with you for the trade along your own shores. Every na-
tion can conduct its own coasting trade to the best advan-
tage. England has got Swedes and Norwegians to com-
pete with her for the coasting trade which she has
opened ; but they have not done it, and they cannot do it,
unless they remove themselves and their families to our
shores. And before you could compote with us in the
coasting trade you would be obliged to come and live near
the.trade ; and before we could compete successfully with
you we would have to come and live here. But when I
see your beautiful clippers of I,ooo' and 2,000 tons, and
your fine Baltimore clippers of 200 and 500 tons, all
thene-
gaged in what your laws term the coasting trade, toeued
exclusion of all chance•of competition, the
your
frankly y
principles to adm it that a t
reciprocity,yo u have
seog laehcltye da
do
to
to
great statesmen. Mr. Lindsay requested SciloimPnlerce the
bear in mind the fact that the larger the r
vas
a mere
better it was for them ; because the ship°
The ;Ivor the
carrier, and does not create trandee.
development of trade,
inter-
course between ports the larger
ttof the trade the more
and the the greater the development
they were not prepared to
ployment for shipowners.
e en of the coast trade,
recommend the entire throwina (3,
common justice, to make some con-
they ought at least, in t o make some conces-
cessions. He thought y_
theid oughtthe
probability, or even the
conces-
sions if it were only o
with England in regard to the coasting trade,
possibility, of the Britishe the colo-
nial trade. England had also concessions to make. While
ne
cid Ohn InyeP d
tavo
Government closvriln°ac3ae•bnlaut
various taxes levied
he did not think that the United States dealt justly and
he did not think that
StatesE withn la England dealt
gard t
o'
justly and generously
on American ship frequenting English Ports, Among them)
United n e d
,generouslywi t h e