The Sun.
London, England, 1851-07-15 00:00:00

1851.

great cause of rel;gions Refs, ty, in more shapes than one, t the Attorney-General on the subjeet of that
was in danger, and when he desired to co-operate in the peragraph, and it certainly appeared to him that it would
philanthropic measures of his Noble Friend (the Earl of be very unadvisable to raise into importance a newspaper
Shaftesbury) It was a great pain to him to leave the which seemed to be one of the most worthless descrir
service of the House at such a time, but it was his tion, and which contained sentiments, which, abominable
bounden duty co longer to incur the risk which he had as they were, he was persuaded were totally different
not hesitated to run when he thought it absolutely ne- from the sentiments of the Roman Catholic people ge-
cessary. —(0 bee rs ) neral I y -Hear.)
The LORD CHANCELLOR was extremely glad to ANNUAL GRANTS TO DUBLTN HOSPIrALS.
find that the Bill now on their Lordships' table met with On the vestion for going into Committee of SupPli
the approbation of the Noble and Learned Lord. He on the Miscellaneous Estimates,
would not follow the Noble and Learned through the Mr. REYNOLDS moved that, considering the public
statements he had made on other important matters, be- importance of maintaining as national institutions the
cause the present was not quite the proper occa.ion for very valuable schools or medicine in Ireland, which hen
doing so; but he wished to observe, that as he was &Hied their chief efficiency from the instruction afforded
aware of the many defects in the Court over which he by the Dublin hospitals, to the support of which tor *
presided—defects which were the growth of time, and long series of years Parliament has contributed, it was
which had existed during the period when his Noble unjust eel impo!itic to reduce the amount of the annual
and Learned Friend and others had held the great seal giant which was allowed in 1848 and the preceding years
—ematedietely upon his entering upon the duties of his to those hospitals. The Government had come to
present office a s.l-cien w s made of gentlemen among the House year after year to move that
toe most it formed at the Chanc ry fa , the most alive these grants should be diminished 10 per cent.
to ttae d fects in the Court. and the meat fitted to suggegt annually, and all they rested their justification upon ill
a remedy; and those gentlemen were called upon to act adopting this course was the evidence of a Seotchmen te-
as a commission to rev:ew the whole system of Chancery joicing in the name of Drummond Chisholm. This person
practice. They had si,ce been most diligently em- was attached to the office of the Chief Secretary for Ire•
ployed, and his Noble and Learned Friend bets g aware land, but had betrayed his trust, and robbed the charities
of the character and ability of those gentlemen would under his charge. He was now a fugitive in America,
dotibtle-e &rive considerable comfort from the confi- his name having appeared in the flue and Cry of both
dente he must enlertain, that an inquiry conducted by such countries, and the Government having offered a reward
gentlemen must be followed by some effective measure for his apprehension. Yet it was upon the unsupported
of reformation There was already a report on the evidence of such a character that the charitable institn-
.elele from the commission, Which had reviewed the tions of Dublin were to be destroyed by the withdrawal

whole proceedings at c moron law, find a Bill, which he
hiiped to present to their Lordships before the close of
the was being prepsred from the materials of
that rep rt. It was not I.kely that a report from the
Chancery Commission could be so f,r advaticed as to
allow of a similar step being taken with respect to it in
the present session, but it would no tar as it might re,
ceive their Lordships' approba-ton. be most caretully
carried into of et. Tne an Learned L ird's sug-
gestions with resret to the present Billl would is-c,ive
the most careful attention. They hsd principal telereinc
,o the Judicial Committee of the Privy Council; but the
present Bill addre'aed itself to the remely of a particu-
lar evil, namely, to prevent the recurrence of the incon-
venience whi&'h was felt to arise last year from the ab-

seem) of several of the Learned Judges in the courts of
eculity in consequence of illness. It did iiot profess to
go turth-r, because, as the Commission to which he ha
alluded was in ac!usl operation it was thought better to
wait for the report with a view of then applying a ge
nem' r‘qui-iily for existing d-fects. Considering that the
Noble and Learned L.ird had presided over a court such
ss he had de,,cribed, the details which be had given cer-
.ainly entitled him to great sy aspa,thy.
Lord BROUGHAM. said that he had endeavoured to
apply as much remedy as he could to tho defects which
were justly complained of. He should like to know
when steps would be taken to turn to public account the
criminal law digest. L. was thirtveu months since that
he received a letter from the Chancellor of the Ruche-

quer, stating that no time would be lost iu doing so.
Were proceedings in respect to that to be conducted
with the same snail-like pace as business in the court to
which he had just directed their Lordships' attention?
The Bill was then read a first time
The Duke or RICHMOND presented thirty five pe-

of these grants. Though he (Mt. Itey-noldr) wished to
save Dublin from this infliction, be had no hope of sue.,
cegs, sealog the total disr.gard which was paid to Irish
Mernhers in that House when they brought forward
.11} j-ct relating to the welfare of Ireland.
What cli.,nce bad he under these circuit-
siances of pleading tie cause of the wretched and
unl r t clad pau Jets vho w•re sick within the walls of
there ho.pita6? If ever Irish M, mbers were unanimous
u,.on and queslion kkff cong Ireland they were unanimous
upon this. This► very day he hnd had the ho'
'lour of forming a portion of a deputation
that waited upon the Prime Minister against the with•
drove' or diminution of these grants, the address
which was pr.acnt,,i to his Lordship, was signed by Lto

tess than tiinety-f'our Lich Members of Parliament,
and twelve English Members who were coo'
nected by property with that country—in all 106
mber-; and a4l the Prime Minister did was to
drily re:er them to the Chancellor of the Exchequer,
wbo, he said, would state in the House what he intended
uo Even that promise was Lot kept, bemuse the
Chanc.llor of the Exchequer peremptorily refused to
st.te what his real int utions were on the subject.
The Richmond and Hardwick Hospitals certainly had
been spared from the consideration that they were
schools of medicine'., but in truth that was the case with
all the hospitals, and the same excuse might have been
urged fur teem. This was one of the evils which had
been produced by the unfortunate Act of Union, which

'Pious frotn parishes in Essex against, as the Noble
Duke described it, that most iniquitous law, the present
corn law, the present navigation law, and the currency ,
law; »1,0 petitions from Eigin and another place in
Scotland against Paps! aggression, and a petition against
any all tor thy of religious tests.
The Burgesses Iva! Fr eetneu's Parliamentary Fran-
chise Bill went through Committee.
The Attorneys and Solicitors Regulation Act Amend-
ment Bill and the Representative Peers for Scotland Bill
were severally reported.
The General Board ut Health Bill was read a second
time.
Lod MON I'EAGLE gave net'ee that on a future
stage of this Bid he wuuld put, a que,tiott to the Earl of
Shaftesbury with reference to the condition in which the
Has left in regard to iuti- rmenis.
'rile Lodging-Houses Bill was read a third time and
passed.
The Ecclesiastical Jurisdiction Bill, the Highway-
Rates Bill, tad the L+e Societies Bill were severally
real a seciaid time.
The Earl of SEIAF VE.iIiURY gave notice that en
Friday he would m.,ve for a copy of the report mail? b)
Mr. Grainger on the .aeitary state of certain parts if the
tnetr'Pelty, and at the same lime call the ettevtion of the
House to that report, wits the view of showing that un-
less some remedy were speedily applied there was reason
to fear a recurrence of the cholera.
Their Lordships thou adjourned. ,

had peculiarly dues.ged the city of Dublin.
Sir L. O'LlitIEN seconded the motion. He felt bitn•
self imp r.Attvely called upon to speak in support of the
en-tion, I:),-caue he represented the feeling* and the opi-
nions of the majoriity of the Irish repreaeutativea on di'.
subject. The h oTitals of Dublin were school/

- medicine, standing very high in the es:
amation - of the profession; they were furnished
with lecturers and museums necessary for complet:
ine the medical •educetien ce: a large number et
stuf'ents, but if this grant were withdrawn the lectures
aould have to be curtailed, and the mu rums altogether
abolished. The ad vautegea which these schoels con"
erred upon society were incalculable, and he did este
neatly appeal to both sides of the 'Luse not to allow
heir effic,cy to be lestroyed in the manner proposed
by the Gevernmeret.
The C II ANCEL LOR of the EXCHEQUER thought
this discussion ought to have beee brought on in Core'
!settee, but as th!tee who proposed it had not pursued
that eourse, he had no alternative but to state now why
ha should object to the proposal. Only five of these in"
stitutiens received aid from the Irish Parliament, while
at the pre-ent time no less than thirteen were
annudly in the retieipt of Parliamentary grants. as
was therefore at a lees to understand how it could be
eonfeedsd that the Dublin hospitals were worse off now
than tht,y were prior to the Union, unless it was that
they rec-ivel less teappott from the public of a voluntary
chars! ter.
Mr. E B. ROCHE said the Right Hon. Gentleman
had urged a strange reason against this motion. Be
would not all iw the grant because it was not original
made by the Irish Parliament. He contended that this
of all others eas not the time to withdraw
the grant. With Ireland almost in a state of ruin,
e hat power had her people to support hospitals
win voluntary contributions? None whatever; and be
hoped the novae would pause before it perpetrated the
iejusfice of withdrawing this grant.
Mr. GROG AN admitted that similar grants were •
not made to hospitals in this country, but they head
received foundations upon highly favourable terms which
was equivalent to a grant, and therefore, in order that the
io.titutions of the tw-t countries should remain on the
same foeene. his grant ought not to be withheld.
Mr. V. SKI
e_ 1-1_, having presided Over the Committee
which bad teepee-el into ails question, must say that hi.
Right Hon. Friend the Chancellor ef the Exchequer,
in the course which he had proposed, war cerryiog out
the views of that -Ceinmittee—views which had been
Sounded upon the evidence that came boor, them. Be
could tee nothing in the condition of Irela,d, as regarded
those institution., so different from this country andi
Scotland as to induce them to athipt the course proposed
by the Irish Members.
Mr. S. HERBER r admitted that the giving of an'
nual grants to such institutions wee, generally speaking►
detenceless, but the que-tion was, whether in the pre'
sent case there ought not to be au exception to the
general rule ? They should recollect that the eiroula',
stances of Ireland were very different from those 01
England, inasmuch as there was no law of settleuaeet
or power of removal there as there was in England. M
fever appeared to be the national disease of Ireland, be
hoped that the Chancellor ot the Exchequer would take
the case of (he fever hospitals into his consideration. le
place of making a- final withdrawal of the grants Wel
these establishments, he hoped that the Chancellor of the
Exchequer would think it advisable to make one war
ptete grant, amounting to about ten or twelve paid
purchase, for toe support of these institutions, and thee
ge t rid of the evil that neerasarily arises from cemiag
annually to Parliament for these sums of money.
Colonel DUNNE characterised this as but a speCl'
men of the justice that was generally meted out to Ire
land by the British Gevernment. Nothing could be
wore unfair or unjust than to withdraw these grante
from the hospitals in Dublin, which they knew i$
would be impossible to supply by voluntary contribw:
Lions in the present miserable and oft rburdeued sleeting
that country.
Mr. REYNOLDS said, under the advice of his friends
he would not trouble the House by dividing. He would,
however, reserve to himself the right of again brinsing
the question before the House on the next favourable
opportunity.
The SPEAKER, therefore, having put the question,
and a division ueiag called for by aome ,f sue Irish
Memb-rs,
The galery was cleared, when the numbers were—
Fer the amendment 43
Against it 106
Majerity against the amendment —63
Otistivetitly negatived.
The amendment wee s
THE SEE OF GLOUCESTER.
Mr. HUME was understood to ask the Hon. Member
for Bela-ol whether he wits prepered to 'mkt, tiny answer
te the statements ee the Hon. Member for CoAtermoulb
relative to ibis income of the bist,op of (.5,1 wester, 10
which a reply had beau attempted it, a place where the
evidence was not to he ferret on which his Lion. krieud
!IA relied. The Hon. Member for Bristol had in a let'
ter in tile neaspape.s prowls, d to give an answer to the
statements of his lion. Friend.
Mr. P. MILE:i said that he had called upon the pub'
tic to suspend their judgment until information could
be iecreved from the Bishop ot Gloucester. He was now
pre pared to answer any charges that might be toads
against the Right Bev. Prelate. He was now prepared
to give any tutorwation that might be called fur.
Mr. HORSM AN explained that het had made it state'
meat witch was grounded Upon evidence given before a
Cktool:mo:tp' ereese4neellt'otf Elicee haillesiastalic4eilleCtotatie statement,
t:,
and thee• was
an%sah:wer or explanation to that state
went. Tout knew n thing of what had bteo
dGloucester. He had coontail'
e .riewber tor Bribed. and Feinted
dctn eej b!it thhe the Bishop
iion of tt
.
out ,0 him what were the specific parts of the evidence
on which he grounded his statement. He agreed with
the Hem Member that it they could bring this matte!
o„fore the House it would be very desirable to do 50?
but he toUiitl It was not po.sible' to do so either on
Government Sight or upon a motion da), as each me'
not. da
• y was fully occupied up to July 29th. He now,
then, reiterated the tunnel- statement tie had made•
tie had, how! veer, heard with great surprise that the
!tight Rev. Pr, late bad given au explanation elsewhere.
in a place where the evidence was not accessible to
those who listened to the Right Rev. Prelate. If the
Bishop ot Gloucester did not think a statement made iv
th,tt Ruse worth au answer, arid if he were satisfied
with tusking a statement in a place where the evidence
was not in existence, and in an assembly that was nr
eessatity ignorant of all the mil:urns' anees—if the Bishop
ass contented so to act, the public would draw their
own conclusions. He (Mr. Horsmati) stood there anxious
to substantiate his steeemetes; and the circumstanceb
he said, turned out strot ger than he had first put theta
torward. It was not his fault that the explanation was
made elsewhere, and the discussion removed to another
assembly. He remarked that the Hon. Member for
Bristel was riot a part) to those proceedings.
Lord J. MANNERS remarked that while the Hoe
Me mber wes so particular about the discussions that
occurred in this House, he should be so inconsistent
as to refer to debated in auoth-r place. He considered
that the charge that had been made by the Hon. Myra'
ber had been satisfsctortly disposed of by the bishii--
(Llear)— and be was sorry to find that, the Hun. Member
had L-.king teis opportunity of indulging in snottier in'
vective against the Right Rev. Prelate.
Mr. GLADST ONE toad he could not quite under-
stand hew they were entering n0t..12 this subji et at 00
present tnoment.—(flear ) He excused films& for en'
te, log Upton it, as the discu,sion then seemed to him to
be both iteploper anti irregular, but he must, in all
frabkness, say. that :hey were bound to go further wirtz
the, proceedisgs.—(llear ) In his judgment the stete-
leant of the lion. Gelasensan hail been impugned 00
ever) most m,,terial still he wait
say that tt was most d. siraele they sht,Uld have a further
distfussien on this suhjsce—(Elese.) L wets with great
pain he halt heard the charge s made by the Hon. Mein'
tier against the Bishep of Gloucester, because there was
no one on the episcopal bench more distinguished for ,
character of liberality wad charity than the Dish* 4)*

HOUSE OF CO PI oiv S. July 14
The SPEAKER took !he (14bir a• F .ur u'elduk.
PRIVATE BUSI N ESS.

The Lords' amendments to the following Bills were
conblde•red and agro-ed t
&tot Anglian Railways.
El.ctrio Tel-graph Company.
Ulverstoue Bud Laneavter Railway.