The Sun.
London, England, 1834-03-26 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OP COMMONS. ARCH 25.
EXCHEQUER OF RECEIPT BILL.

Sir J GRAHAM, in moving the further consideration
of the report of the Exchequer of Receipt Bill, intended
to propose two alterations in the bill. Toe first was in
consequence of a suggestion mad.- by the right hon. mem•
ber for Harwich (Mr. Hi rries). He (Sir J. Graham)
had pr.iposed that the Comptroller should only be remov-
wile from his office in case of the address of one or both
houses of parliament; hut the right hon. gentleman Bug-
gest, d that in case of such r: /nova! the Comptroller might
consider himself entirled to colopens dim'. He (Sir J.
Graham) theretOre pro. osed an amendment, that, in such
case, the Comptroller shou:d not he entitled to compensa-
tion, but that the office should be subject to ttlte•
ration and under the control of Parliament.—(Hear.
hear.) He had also proposed that no person holding
the office of Comptroller should he able to hold any office in
the appointment of the Crown during pleasure. Th - right
hon. gentleman ( Mr. .Herriis) had obj-rred that the
clause was not sufficiently comprehensive, as there were
persons bolding office during pleasure connected with the
Government, and yet not riirecrly appointed by the Cr mu,
namely, such as tie Secretary of the Treasury and the
Under-Secretary of State. He (Sir J. Graham) had felt
the force of the objection, and intended, therefore, to
;.ropose that the clause should he metaled, -o that it
would run that no p-rson holding the office of Comptroll. r
of the Exchequer should bola ally cffice during the plea-
sure of the Crown, or any appointment under
the Crown. Some objection had been made to
Lord Auckland being appointed to the office of Comptroller
of the Exchequer, as he held the office of treasurer of
Greenwich Hospital. He (Sir .1. Graham) did not con-
sider that there would be any s citrus objection to the ap-
pointment of Lord Auckland ; but, to remove all doubt,
be would propose a clause to meet the case of Lord Auck-
land, which stated that that noble lord should las allowed
to hold both offic,s. If this arrangement was effected,
the noble lord (Auckland) would eive up two pensions
he then held, namely, one of 4001. and the other of 3001.
a year. He need not say that the arrangement lie pro-
posed would be of an economical nature. In conclusion
he would only add, that from the manner in which Lord
Auckland bad performed the ditties of the office over
which he presided, and from his experience and habits of
business, he was more competent to fill the office of Comp-
tri ller of the Exchequer than any other person whom he
(Sir J. Graham) knew. The right lion. baronet then
proposed amendments to the above effect.

Lord J. RUSSELL observed that Lord Auckland held
his office at Greenwich nominally at the weasure of the
crown, but really as an indeitentlent office. Ir. was granted
to him by Act of Parliament, and, although holding it
" doting good behaviour," the government of the Duke
of Wellington, to whom be was always opposed, never
considered that they had a right to deprive him of it. He
thought, therefore, that it ought to be trea;ed as an in-
dependent office.

Co,onel EVANS denied that the office Lord Auckland
now hr ld could tie considered as an independent office.
It was clearly tetained during the pleasure of me Crown,
and no longer; and as the appointment of Comptniller of
the Exchequer was one of the greatest importance to the
State, the great principle of the bill si.ould not he departed
from in this or any wrier instance.
Mr. BERRIES entirely agreed that it was incompa-
tible, according to the principle intended to be estairlished
by the right hon. traronel (Sir J. Graham), that the
office of Comptroller of the Exciicquer and another office
held at the pleasure of the crown should he fill d by one
and the satne prison. Although he approved of other
parts of the measure he could not give his assent to such a
proposition as this.
Mr. WARBURTON observed that the proposition
which the rig:it bon. baronet had made for tendering the
office of Comptroller of the Exchequer independent w re in
coot' irmity with a proposition which had lr•en thrown
out by his hon. friend (the member for Middlesex). No-
minating any person to the office who held another situa-
tion during gond behaviour would be such a violation ut
the principle of this proposition that he should certainly
resist it.
Sir.J.GRAHAM, after what had passed, did not think
he should be justified in ptessing for a division on t, e
clause relating to the appointment of his noble trieno
(Lord Auckland) to this office. Hear, hear.) He
should, however, persist in introducing the clause esta-
blishing the principle which had been- adverted to,
although he would not undertake the responsibility ert
bringing forty trd the other clause.—( Hear.)
The cl ruse relating to the appointment of Lord Auck
land was accordingly withdrawn, an I the outer clauses
were agreed to.
The bill was then ordered to be real a third time to-
hiorrow (this day) and then engrossed.

The Roman Marriag--.4 Bill passed through a

Colonel EVANS held a petition in his hand which he
had intended to have presented at the morning sittings of
the house. He had come down for that purpose fourteen
or fifteen times, but he had found it itupotssible to get an
..pportnnitY.of presenting it, in consequence of the di.eCs.
"-hm which ball of late taken pace at those sittings.
The extent of those discussions had now become such a
vrievince, that he hoped some gentleman more eapaVe of
meeting the subject than himself would torn his attenti-n
to it with a view of discArering a remedy fttr the inenn—
venience. The petition was from a society instituted for
the purpose of affording re:ief to the Polish refugees. The
petitioners stated that they had done all they could in
favour of these unfortunate persons; but than their funds
were now exhausted, anti they now sought, not the Aetna
fiery aid, but the sympa,hy and consideration of t' e house.;
In this prayer he (Colonel Evi.ns) joined. The duty of
. •

Amity was as incumbent upon nations as nn
:Ind he thought that this was a proper occasino for the
..xercise of that charity. It was not without precedent in
his country that relief should be given to the suf-
ferers under despotism. In former times the Hitzit-
note were reli. ved when they fled from France,
and in later times
.the emigrants from That country
received similar relief. He (Colon-I Evans) was wrongly
inclined to think that the Poles did make a representation
,1 the wrongs they endured, and of the evils with which
they were threatened, to each of the five great powers of
Europe, before they rook up arms in their own defence.
He, therefore, thought that, under all the cireumstinees
of the case. some as,istance might be extend,d ithe tin-

fortunate Polrv, without the mlightekt breach of th4t inter-
nationd law which every court in Europe must be anxious
to observe. H, watt impre.ged with the conviction that

both the late and present Governments of this country
h deferred a great deal Ina much 'o the Cabinet of St.
Petersbureh. The petitioners did not ask the house for
any pecuniary grant, but merely lor an expression of its
sympa by wi h their misfortunes; and this was a fart
which he (Colonel Evans) wished to impress on the nAle
I.trd (Lord Palmerston). He thought that, in all the
circumstances of the case, Government ought not only to
extend sympathy to the refugee Poles, t.ut that it 'light
sl%o to grant some pecuniary relief to them. Pecuniary
relief had been granted to the Spanish refugees and tl •
French emigrants by a former Government, though their
claims to such relief were not, in his (Colonel Evans's)
apprehension, so strong as were those of the unhappy
Poles now residing in this country.
Sir HARRY VERNEY supported the petition. He
anxiously hoped this countiy would now become alive to
the d ttigers to be apprehended to the peace of Etirope from
the ambition of Russia, and the alarming extension of her
po.r.rer, and would not silently suffer a further extension
of that power. The Court of St. Petersburgh was eu
deavouring to stifle th, expression of liberal opinions, not
only in this country but in every country in Europe. He
trusted England would always remain a free and open
asylum to which the distressed of every nation under
heaven might resort, and the house continue a free and

open tribunal to which they might submit their wrongs.
The boon prayed for by the petitioners was poor indeed,
and woof, prove hut a very inadequate compensation for
the losses and sacrifices which they had suffered in the'r
country's cause. Many of them were men who had infivtd
in the higher circles of society in their native land. and
had possessed oil the comforts of life. He (Sir Harry
Verney) hoped Government would confer on them Fame
pecuniary relief, and that the country would still continue
friendly to every suffering nation. He would not trouble
the house further than by the expression of a hope that
bis Majesty's Government would at once accede to the
proposition of the Gallant Colonel, and extend some pe-
cuniary assistance to the unfortunate petitioners. They
had afforded such assistance to the Spanish refugees, and
re the French emigrants. There existed much greater
reason for relieving the suffering Poles, for their sufferings
,:rose from a flagrant violation of treaties, to which this
country was a party on the part of Russia.
Mr. SINCLAIR gave the prayer of the petition his
most cordial support. The feeling in favour of the Piles
was very strong, and bad been very generally expr, see f in
Scothmil. In that country considerable sums had been
raised to assist the distressed Poles in Great Britain.

Lord PALMERNTON >aid that every person of; feel-

ing and humane mind must spontaneously respond to the
sentiments of sympathy which had that evening been ex •
pm sed in favour of the Poles ; but the feelings which
himself and colleagues might entertain on the subject
as individuals were a matter very different from voting
away the public money in their capacity of Ministers
of the Crown. He (Lord Palmerston) was not at
tilprty to hold out any hope to 'he gallant colonel of gee
vernment sanctioning any grant of money to the petitienere.
The gallameeltmel 1110 referred to the case of the Sp Knish
refueees and French emigrants ; and contended, that e-
cause a former Government had effirded them pecuniary
relief, the present Government ought to extend pecuniary
assistance to the petitioners. The cases were quire diffe-
rent. The Spanish refugees who received assistance from
this country were men who acted in concert with the
armies of Great Britain during the Peniasular war; and
it was because of their active co-operation with our troops
that they were expelled their own country. With re-
spect,again, to the French emigrants, they were entithol to
essistatice from this country, because it was in ob-dicnre
to the advice of England that thy had rebelled Our
shores were open to the distressed of all countries, and our
twe affir.led protection.to the afflicted of all kinds ; but
it wound be uofair to expect, that because such was the
case, the un'ortunate of other countries should receive ped
cuniary support from the governm nt. The sum which
the gallant Colonel wished to be bestowed on the refute
Poles might not be great; but it was not the were
amount of money, but the precedent which the grant woull
establish, that the house ought to take into consideration.

—(Hear, hear.) If the principle were once esubli.hed,
that petit;oners were entitled to p••cuniary relief, it iv, u d bs
found afterwards to be a my difficult matter t‘r draw the
line of distinction bc.ween those individuals and °the!.

fiteigners, who, at some tuture time. might pre4ent their
;111e4eil claims for similar aid. —(Hear.) He (Lord
Polmerston) did not see on what principle they combd give
assistance to the petitioners, and refuse it to thou.- Poles
who might afterwerds come over to this country in meat
numbers, and whose claims to pecuniary relief int!l,t be
greater. The ga lent colonel had ground d the claims of
es fromto go theto graspwar
petitbiners to relief on the circumstance of an infrac-
tion by Russia of the treaty of Vienna, to which trece
this country was a party ; and had stated that England, in
consequence of such infraction, would have had a right to
of Russia
Ruitssuisasiab' iinsrhe
of arms. He (Lord Palmerston) admitted that Eng aod
t'- lauvue! iaevveedhad the
Pi
a right
bought popper; but goverumPut did not think that, un-
der ail the circumstances of the case, it would have been
expedient for Englano to go to war with Nicholas. The
mere tact on this ciiuntry tieing a party to the treaty of
Vientia was not, he held, as synonymous with our gua•
ranteeing that thete would be no infraction of that treaty
issia. Ile must tepee' that, while there must be a
feeling of sympathy in every heart in favour of the unfor-
titnat, Pales, goveron-nt could not hold out any hope of
oven iing pecuniary relief to them.
Mr. O'CONNELL had heard the speech of the noble
or i with leeoligs of deep surprise and 'egret. The nibble
!cur I had said. that to grant relief to the Poles wool,' be
ogainst precedent. It would not be against ptecedetr,
the contrary. The vials of his wrath were, in 80 f r
words were concerned, poured out on the head .4 Itus.
sin; but, in God's name, why did not our actions cares.

prod erith our words? Every man ought to feel it a
degrades:on of his country that Poland had been suffered to
income the victim of the contemptible end brutal despot
of Russia.—(Hear, hear.) He (Mr. O'Connell) busted
that national feeling on tl:e subject of the wrongs of Po-
land wrtild vet be done, such as to (hive the barbarians
and reffians of Russia cut t f the pale of society. The
noble lord bad said that the banished refugees received pe-
cuniary assistance from this country because they had been
our active allies in the Peninsular war. That was not
the ground on which that relief had been extended to them.
T'ey were relieved in the year 1823, not because of any
steffetings they endured in consequence of being our aide.,
but merely as an act oft enevelenee on the part of this country.
The noble I rd, in speaking of the relief which had been ex-
tended by a formei Government to the French emigrants,
had stated the reason of such relief to be the circum-
stance of this country having encouraged them to
revolt. That was the case with a small fraction of those
emiareranta-, 4ent not u ith the majority. The grant, as in
are 'cas'eOr the Spanish refugees, was principally to lie
irtkleatted as an act of benevolence. He (Mr. O'Connell)
liatteN an advocate for national economy, and he wished it
*ere more attended to in that house than it generally was;
but he was !sot for carrying his notions of national eco-
tamely so 'bar as to refuse assistance to poor distressed crea-
tutees, Whose claims to our sympathy and aid weie so etrene.
f would like to see a sum of money given by the Govern-
went to the Poles, and thought it should be called Rus-
sian blond money. The ambition of Russia was dangerous
to the peace and well• being of Europe. He (Mr. O'Con
rail) would like to see a cordial alliance hetWeen Euglaud
anti France, to oppose the ambition of the Court of St.
Petereburgh ; but if Le did Lot greatly mistake the siens
of the times, the traitorous Louis Philip did not, in reality.
wish to keep up a good understanding with us, hut was
entet ing into an alliance with Russia, and that the two
powers were meditating a joint crusade against European
liberty.—(Hear, hear.) He thought it was high time for
England to speak out in favour of Poland, and against
Russian ambition. That might yet be productive of good,
Russia, in defiance of treaties of the most solemn and
binding nature, bad blotted out Poland from the map of
Eurt pe—bad extinguished its language, and had banished
its youth. The gallant people of that country were now
trampled under the hoof of the brutal and sanguinary
despot of Sr. Petershurgh.
Mr. THOMAS ATTWOOD said, that the government
of this country bad no sense of shanne.—(A laugh.) He
would tell the noble lord that the people of Evglaed
would no longer suffer the government to pursue the line
of policy they were now adopting. The people of Eng-
land had already, in a great measure, taken the domestic
government of the country out of the hands of ministers,
and they would soon see the necessity of taking the to
reign government out of their hands also. The noble
loud had said, that the mere circumstance of this country
signing the treaty of Vienna was cot to be understood as
tguarautteieg tl:e cheer, ance of that treaty. No honest
man, in the private transactions of life, wou d say so.
If.eard Castlereagh bad expressly sai!t, both verbally in that
trouee, and in subsequent treaties, that this country, in
signing the treaty of Vienna, guaranteed the integrity of
Poland—and Lord Castlereagh was, in his (Mr. Att-
wood's) opinion, a far better roan than the noble lord.—
(A laugh.) Lord Castlereagh, before be died, demanded
in the name of Englarid, the restoration of ancient Poland.
Little cid Lord Castlereagh think, that, in the short
apace of ten years after his death, England should seek to
Mete het self in mean and paltry subterfuges, in atte a pang
to justify her desertion of Poland. The noble lord (Pal-
merston) admitted that England had a tight to go to war
with, Russia, because of her infraction of the treaty ot
Vienna, but said it was notprudent or expedient. Neverdid
a coward think it prudent to go to war, never was it prudent
f.r a base mind to avenge such wrongs as those which the
despot of St. Petershurgh had inflicted on Poland. The
etoble lord bad apolegised, as it was foretold a year aeo
he would, to the brute that kicked his country.—
(Laughter.) Pulite opinion was growing strong on the
subject of Pelted, and the power ot that opinion weave,
ere lene, sot eep away both the noble lord and his paltry
subterfuges. He (Lord Palmers.on) had said as one rea-
son why the petitioners should not have pecuniary relief
afforded to them, that he could not afford the money. Tie
sum of 10,0001. would not hurt the noble lord and Lear
party. Would it, then, hurt the country? Members.
had last year found they could afford to give away
20,000,0001. to the negroes in the West Indies. and yet
they could. not «Efhtd 10,0001. to the distressed Pals.
Ile (Mr. Attwood) thought the noble lord was under an
evil stars—that he was labenring under a species of fatuity
to-night.—(Laughter.) He hoped lie would be under a
better star to-morrow—(Continued laughter)—and he
ciou!d then do au act of justice to the suffering Poles.
Russia was rapidly extending her power. If the house bad
taken his (Mr. A.'s) ar,vice test ye tr, and sent six or seven
line of bottle ships to assist the Sultan, when he applied
to this country for aid, we should not only have arrested
the prop e (IS of Russian dominion in Turkey, but had the
command ,f the Dardanelles, and tie survollaoce of Tur-
key, and by that means had a hoop in the nose of Russia.
- .

—(Laud laughter.) In addition to the other gross insuifs
and injurious impositions which the miserable iner,ness
and vacillation of our govetnment of lite had encouraged
foreign powers to put upon us, we were sh,-rtly lleout to

have 1.1;11316c closed against our vessels.—(oo, oh ; No.)
He knew it as a tnatttr of tact ; by a treaty en the point
of being signed between Russia and Sweden, it was well
known that with a view to this ei.d, Sweden for the last
six weelss had been busily engaged in fortifying the Catte-
gar. It was true that Sweden had long be,n a close ally
of England, but it was squally true, that, disgusted wan

the criminal inertness, vacillation, and want of courage, so
eminently displayed in our foreign policy of late, Sweden
tva. now about to sign a treaty most injurious to ui with

a Puwtr which IA last dared to countenance her friends.
He (Mr. Attwood) wished to know whether in this
critical positi. n Ministers would throw off their inertness,
end by the demonstrations it hich England was so well able
to make, if its Government would give the word, deter
Sweden from uniting with the Russian tyrant against us.
He wished to know, too, whetuer Ministers were going
to allo.v Russia and the Germanic Contedei ation to con-
tinue their unhallowed and fitn.lisli persecution of the
exiled Poles; whether they would sanction the tyrants in
drawing their threatened cordon round Swi,z:rland, the
land which had so nobly opened its rains to the sufferers
The poster of England was competent to vindicate the
rights not only of the Poles but of all the oppressed nations
in Europe; why then nut exercise that power in so just a
caus. ? The monster Nicuolas—(On!)—the monster
Nicholas—for be was a monster, and nu gentleman in the
boo-e, he was sure, could call him by a milder epithet—
(A laugh)—that tyrant of Europe was a mere image of
hra3s and clay, which the power of this empire could
shiver to atoms, and ought to do so, if she wished well for
the liberty and happiness of Europe. The farce of Russia,
which its bribed newspapers here bad paragraphed into
900,000, was in reality but 300,000, and its other re-
sources Lad been overstated to au equal extent. EngLnd
could at one blow crush the bully to dust.
Sir S. WHALLEY heard with much regret the inti-
mation that ministers would not in trfere iu favour of the
unhappy Poles, but trusted that they would reconsider
their judgment, fur the feelings of the whole empire were
most deeply interested in favour of that unfortunate a. d
shatretuily oppressed nation.
Lord D. STEWART trusted that the government would

nut persist it, the refusal they had given last year to inter-
fere for the Poles—a lefusal widdi hail drawn upon them

the aniniadversitins of the whole kingdom ; for• people of
all shades of opinion felt ►he warmest sympathy fur that
unhappy nation. Ministers could loudly refuse to assist the
Poles; never had want of generosity towards the oppressed
been charged acainst thisnai ion ; on the contrary, this nation
had ever been held forth as a glorious example of liberality and
generosity. Since 1802 we had given two millions to French
refugees; and our aid to other refugees, to the sufferers from
the Fiend' ;Evasion in Russia, in Germany, to all descrip-
tions of stiffen re, had teen on the game munificent scale. It
should he recollected that the Polito refugees laboured under
much greater disadvantages than French and other refu-
gees, who cou d stet more gi employmeat as teachers
of On it language, &e. For himself, be bail done both in
the house and out of it, as much in favour of the'e unfor-
tunates as his humble means enahled him, and be trusted
that Ministers would so far consul the wishes and honour
of the country, as to aid the Poles. He was himself
strongly oppo,ed to unoz.c,ssary ev.)eroliture; but, on this
occasion, he thought the liberall,y of the Giiv,rnment
might be exe: cited to the entire satisfaction of the country.
We owed no slight compensation to the unhappy Poles
for the culpable neglect manifested by our Government
towards them on a critical occasion, when, if we had had
the courage to remonstrate wi:h their oppressor, we should
have done so with success. He trusted that the subject
would be again brought forward. When they saw tiiese
►tarving foreigners in the streets, and recollected that the
names of Brougham aad Grey were in the Cabinet, the
refusal to render assistance was almost incredible.
Mr. BUCKINGHAM was understood to support the

iOQ tlityll
petildOr l'f•i-Ct;
;
7fistim,..- _ 1037 ontended that the government
• . lioMid2 It pathy for the Poles in their
', 441 jta.it 444 there had been no deficiency
tYnt . 16:04jit*Iide of the house. While, how.
~ ' 644 :=TAili ireidit to the hon. and gallant gentleman
' . • - ,!!:,, . rable zeal he had exhibited in this matter,
(Albd take the liberty to caution him against being

~~

'on ready o mike a plume without reference to the co-.
sequences. When it was fairly made out that government
could interfere with propriety, i 7 all such cases the ne-
cessary assistance was afforded. He was now called, upon
to state the peculiar circumstances which, in his' opinion,
ju.tify a vote of. money to those who had suffered
by such events as those which had given rise to the pre-
sent petition. But be would suggest that amongst the
inconveni,nces that would arise from giving too freely the
bounty of the Crown would be this—it would tempt un-
fortunate foreigners to come over and settle here—it would
operate as an inducement to foreign countries to rend
foreigners out to this country to partake of the sum pro-
vided. He wished it to lie clearly understood that when
a case was made out for the bestowal of the bounty of the
crown—when it appeared that such a grant would not be
liable to objection in point of principle, as in the prance
of a grant being permanent, then his Majesty's government
would not shrink from administering the relief that they
were now stigmatised for refusing.
Loid D. STUART explained.

Colonel EVANS expressed his great regret at the little
success that had a, tended the presentation of this petition ;
but he was.not without hope of one aivantage, at least,
being obtained; he meant that of pointing out to the press
and the public at large the expediency of further eff,rts on
the part of the public in behalf of these unfirtunate emi-
grants. This must appear to be the more necessary now,
inasmuch as it would he seen that they bad failed in their
attempts to obtain from the Government the support which
was necessary.

The petition was then ordered to lie on the table.
CH URC H PAT RONAG E—(SCOTLAND).
Mr. A. JOHNSTO.NE presented petitions from Bata-
shire; from the minister• and elders of Beagley ; and from
several other places, complaining of the present system of
church patronage.