The Sun.
London, England, 1851-05-06 00:00:00

EVENING,

-..._
in a, i —
lien 'lees. This French gentlemen stated that he saw ever, as the Committee and the: Muse were very desirous 'to his own argument in the same sentence. He , large naval establiehment, in consequen_ce pf its diplomatic_
I''''' arquis of Worcester (the Peese"nt Duke of Beaufort) to have economy, the Goyern„.ent hid agreed to a reduction, , adduced the case of the Duke of Buccleuch, a noble- interferences and its meddling toe much with the affairs of
Nor-It!! fo-r-ernan of the grand Jury, with all the men of to commence from tee beginning of the financial year. ma, of v„t wealth, who would not be likely to other countries. He really wished Lord Palmerston was out
eet4pgthase county for his fellows_ the farme„ and we_ With respect to Turkey, whicfr Nets the only other coon- give up his time to fill any office of Government, and of the Foreign
.department. He would make him Chancellor
tailitenetswat
thepnetty jurm?, and a person of high legal' at_ • try where we bad an Ambassador, our relations with that therefore be was put into a siriecure office. But those were of the Exchequer—anything hehcouldh—for his talenhte were
sefeeigner on th.,i• preen:ling over the court, . what struck country were of such a nature the: it was very desirable the very offices that the Noble Lord said ought to be given great, and he was sorry to see_ t ern t eo_ern away in is pre-_
en of Yariou ie occasion was the manner in which per- thet the embassy sh uld be continuid.- (Hear hear.) With to people who had not the means to support themselves. If sent office.—(Cheers and laughter.) With respect to naval
!Inbi, s ranks were brought together and employed in respect to Vienna, the Government lad already' changed our they wanted more members of the Government—and he ad- expenditure, the Committee that had sat upon, that subject
ilstife"e service' In that case it was the administrati nof Ambassador into an Envoy. The Gemmittee r„ommended eiitted that the memb„s of the cabinet generally, the Prime for some time had made the meet eearching inquriree, and he
Sainte
sWah_iceh. all sy.cre engaged. It ought in some degree various other changes in our diflonnatic arrangements. Minister and the other great officers ot State, were fully regretted that theie recommersdo
ationlo as to the
be i.nction. odf
tens ,0 rutin. in.potitical affairs, and an endeavour shoukt They pr„posed that our various miseons in Germany should worked, and deserved all the remuneration they received— the number of admirals
.from , to 0 had not een came
%thee_
w_ ite in a eovernment men of other occupations be united into one single miseion at one centrai point. He and if money was the only remunerati ,n, he (Mr. Cobden) out. He was glad to find that part of th.e ground had been
!dep‘eteet
eBh. o.
Iwere engaged in the reading and folding up did not himself think that such a chinge was at any time maintained that no monei could remunerate the Noble Lord, cut from under his feet, becaur the Admiralty haw proposed
nG,,,e'rLent n coming to a conclusion upon these points, desirable ; but he thought it was quite obvious that, having or any erne filling his office, for the trouble, toil, anxiety, to reduce the number of admirals from 150 to 99. It waa
/erten 'sun SO far agreed with the Committee ris to have maintained missions there for a greet number of years, and and wear and tear which a Prime Minister must go through. stated that a sum of 6,500/. would be necessary to carry that
S. ely, see(' On d.oing what had not been done for a long time, that at the present moment teere wai in ever Court of G„_ __( Rear.) But it w„ „t money alone that was their re- reduction into effect. He believed, helwever, that soil might
4141' patating the office of Master of the Mint from po- many a different opinion with' respect to the fuyture org' anie,_ w„d. et was patronage. glory, fame, and he hoped there be altogether saved by adopting the system of making one
teir; and he had her majesty's g,ac i 0 u s permission to time of Germany, and that there were different interests and was some Patriotism in the case too. They often heard of appointment for three. death,s. Besides the course recent-
'i°4llte itlae Qe.t° Sir John Herschel. (Hear, hea . ) It was different views with respect to the future „nstitution „d otir benne a loyal people. He wished that could be shown in mended bY the Committee w mild have tlee effect pf Putting
jiht.floe in lt, it would be agreeable to that gentleman to fill , future condition or Germany, we shored not at this mome„t connexi„n with the salaries of those who set ved the Crown. an enol to the sYstere of I.avmiritism•
nee al.
eame degree connected a ith science, and with deprive ourselvee of the me:ins of obetining information upon In America they received small salaries, hut they were con- Sir F. T. BARING s.aid the
.mode followed by the Achill-
',etia:te eee of Newton was associated. _... (Hear, hear.) these points. _ (Hear.) The Comma tee had suggested that tented to serve their country and have the trust and confi- ralty was substantially in accoeaance with the renommende-
:elite, erreniP of the Mint would no longer be a separate the mission at Florence might he united with thei at Turin dence of the'r fellow-countryinen reposed in them. He wanted tion of the Committee ; and with respect to the Generalship
;teen eerl ,as it was when held by Mr. Tierney and an arrangement which he theught wits ()Pen to some objec: our Ministe.rs to look to office as a high honour. Then there of Marines, the Admiralty had done no more than carry
e or corn • •
est ~ bined with the presidentship or vice-pre ident_ tion. They had also recommendel th it the mission at was another department to which the Noble Lord referred— thelr recommendation into effect.
it t "ie Board of Trade, as it was held by eir. Gladst„ne, Florence might be united with one a' Rome. Now, he ad- the judicial department. He was not going to make the . Sir G. PECHELL advocated the propriety ot making re-
lt. "13,11che
. poi__ re, and others. The office of paymaster of mitted that it might be Very deeirable that the mission at reductions of salaries which had been recommended by the tirements for lieutenants and commanders, and recommended
lids '''" was a separate office two years ago, when he Florence should be made the means of comtnunicatin •• with Committee and he spoke of the necessity of having barristers that the money paid for the conveyance of specie in her Ma-
l' ' an ar
rte.? . rangement for joining it with that of the the Court of 11" me• Although the Diplomatic iteirations 4 first-rate' Practice' a-, d high attar nment to fill the office of Jesty's ships should be -pelted to that purpose.
!nereeesid_e„nt of the Board of Trade. It was formerlY Act, Pessed three years go, had never cerne into operation judge. Now he (Mr. Cobden) thought ther , was a mon- ASSIeTANT-SURGEONS IN THE NAVY.
:lien, el. . great emolument, and was held by Lord in censequence of the Pope having therebv been Placed in a etrous exaggeration as to the amount of earnings of barris- Captain BOLDER() then rose to moy.e that
.a resolution
elee'e..atte, the first Lord Holland. Haying combined different position from othe- Severeigns; the Government ters in the p•esene day, because any candid and intelligent of the House .on the. Bth of Aprel„ having declared
elente et., eeaymaster of the Forces and vice-president of under.tood that the Court of Rome would be ready at any man at the bar Would tell you that latterly, with the slight th. at in the opinio.n of this Ilouse the accommodation pro,-
tens' °! Trade, he did not think it expedient to adopt time to receive a special mission. Recent circumstances, to exception of occasional business before Parliamentary Corn- ended for the assistant-urgeens on. board her Majesty s
/ 64'estnni of the Committee, and diminish the salary which it was not necessary now to aeude, might render a mittees, or a period like the railway mania, when vast for- ships of war is inadequate and insufficient for securing the full
S.lairOtear. The combined office was one of considerable po- special mission to Rome et preseet u„advisaine . but at the tunes were made in tw„ or three years, there was no depart- benefit of their Professional services, it is the duty of this
illtliergtance. and it the President of the Board of Trade same time, we must l„k. forward-to hayin `'• ' e•,• • h• untry in which there House that means should be taken ,forthwith to carry the
g relations at seine ment o. professionai exertion in t is co
loieetit
zuous,e of Commons it wasexPedient that the Vice- future time with that Court, and certainly the mission at was a greater tendency to the diminution of earnings than said resolution into effect. The Gallant Officer said that
`lclia "It'd he in the other House, where he must Florence would be the most conve„i„t mod„f commu„i„at_ at the bar. There might be a few gette g large incomes, under the Present system a system of social degradation was
ntseeinregnetoftr measures connected with his office The ing with it. _ (Hear.) He had now trate the proposals but the general tendency was to diffuse the ' business over a fled ociii the assistant-surgeons, which prevented young men
elk . _,e o erefore, proeosed to continue the salary of made by the Committee, and the manner in which the Go- greater number of barristers. Under tiv3se circumstances o go-, acquirements from entering the navy in that capa-
ter-1) ar to the Vice-President of the Board of Trade. vernment proposed to act, They had felt , hemseives at full s'eirel n , it•ht be got to take the office of city. There was no ground for refusing the necessary ac-
y rs -rate ta e,i mig
It'lleth,,a,t he had said the House would be preparee to hear liberty to consider whether th se rec„mmendations were in judge for 6,0005. os 7,0e0e a year. A barrister had to go commodation in line-of-battle ships, whatever might be the
Itil'e("lilee:rtithProlnse to abolish the office of Lord Privy conformity with the interests of the public service, and to through an almost inconeeivable amount of toil to ma_intain case with respect te smaller vessels. If the Right Hon.
at v_ , ear.) He came next to the office of Secre_ decide according to their views. In any way. whether they a firs'-rate practice and a hige position at the bar. Now in Gentlemen the First Lord of the
.Admiralty would giye him
ttoe eii,er i but, as no proposition was made by the c .m. took the proposals of the committee or those of the Govern- appointing a man to a judgeehip you withdrew him frem ate assurance ehat he would. consider the matter, with the
't t° that office* it was net necessary to say vernment, no such saying would be effected as a ouid exhibit that competiti„n _ you gave him a compe' ence for life, view ef.earrying.the resolution into_effect, he wopld not press
hat poi. t at present. The committee re- any great economy in the public expenditure. What oas and secured him a retiring pension ; so that in taking his motion ; bu.nif the answee shetild b.e unsatisfactory,
.he
1-1' tral 1 ei nn
ad
ee' dul3teri Teel s Pt
e
er instead
ofa2t the Judge-Advocate should have 1,700 , a really desirable was, that there should be no further expen- into account the - honour, the comparatively easy would telee anteehenotppoeitunity ot bringing the matter under
t. ,000/., and that the nuestion should be taken future with respect to their Political, judic'al, or diplomatic mode of obtaining his income, and the certainty of the Fonsideera
BioAnßolf_hGe Heushe.
tiel)ain:rnaaoltdtioenra ion on the next appointment to the.. office. services, than was justified by the services performed ; but a retiring allowance, he thought 6,000/. or 7,0 0/. a year Sir F. T. N said e had endeavoured to carry out
'tinatter aeetessary, therefore, to come to any decision upon on the other hand it would he a most unwise economy for amply suffir,eient to secure the very best talent in the th. e resolutien ot the House as
.far as could be done con-
present, as it would again come under •the tee sake of a very few thousands, to prevent those who country. e here were men who had been puisne judges sistently with the accommpdation afforded by a ship of war,
etlitia, e ist of Government, [so we understood the Noble were conducting the great affairs of the nation from per- who never earned 3,1'00/. a year at the bar, whilst Lord and regulations had been issued for that. purpre. He was
ereigiv` iel'at shpoke. so low that we had great difficulty in terming their duty in an efficient manner. He was Abinger earned 20,000/. a year, and many of those who had not aware how far they had been complied with, but would
Zistittee r e said.] With respect to the Admiralty, the persuaded that in the government of a great empire ',Ply earned 3,0001. might be better men than Lord Abinger. at once issue the necessary orders to procure a return on the
,anbe , neommended that the salary of the junior Lords like this it was most desirable that there should be an He thought that 5,000/. a year was too much for the puisue subject.
:!0
shad 2,000 e a year, instead of 1,2001, and that those efficient performance of the great duties which devolved on judges ; and he felt dissatisfied that in this and other re- Mr. WAKLEY said the assistant-surgeor4 were extremely
!lved aro:, 1,00 /. a year with residences should be de- public officers. Foe himself he could assure the House that spects the Government bed not attended to the recom- dissatisfied, but they were afraid of ' complaining, knowine
(No e aidencee. The Government were of opinion that in the various offices which he had held, he had found the mendations of the Committee et was very discouraging that, if they did, a black mark would be Placed against their
en , ereat convenience to the department that certain labour and am unt of responsibility such as to iequire the to those who sat upon Commitiees, and was almost enough names, and they would have no chance of preferment.
leetoitseords should reside at the Admiralty ; and they. use of all the faculties of which a person might be possessed ; to lead him to adopt the principle of the Hon. Mernber The motion was then withdrawn.
Iltro e' Proposed to agree to the proposed reduction of and whatever might be thought of the relaxation and ro- for Montrose, to decline serving upon Committees when he THE HOP DUTY.
liltjei 'lit t° maintain the residenees•—( Hear, hear.) With creation enjoyed by public men, they were but very few hours, could, seeing that their recommendations were so little Mr. FREWEN moved :that an
,address be mines, ented to
t to th
ksend , e office of Secretary for Ireland the Committee and certainly not many days in the course of the year in at ended to her Majesty, most respectfully to inform her ajesty that
ki.that the salary be reduced from 5,500/. to which the mind of any person in a high political position 'was • very great distress exists in those districts of the county of
!toius,,wbee,ll a vacancy occurred. This question was, not affected with anxiety.—(Hear.) Many important ques- Sussex where hops are grown, and that it will be quite out
MLord P,,ALN,IERSTON.—.I shall follow the example of the
ine ee,, losely connected with that of the abolition tions came before that House, but, after all, that formed but of the power of the hop-planter in that county to pay the
ettineatee of Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland. If the office of a part of the duties and anxieties of a Government—man ember tor tne West Riding rather than his precept, tor he
excise duty on the crop of 1850 during the present year. The
,4 ofai'ele..ut:llant were abolished, it would of course place questions of foreign and colonial policy, which were of thye btheigsaenvbeyninsagy:ianngdtehnadtetdhebydidsciuscsusisosningshoaullldthneotpboeingtosnwehinicthe
hop duty had for a great many years been most oppressive.
e tine f Secretary on a totally different footing utmost importance at the time, which, perhaps, never at- had been alluded to by the Noble Lord. I think it right In 1819 it Was, certainly, not objected to; but in 1822 the
ke u not think it necessary to go into that ques... tracted public attention, althou h the -mi ht have occurni,d
4t distress was so great that Lord Liverpool consented to the
lichrollresent, as it must before long be a ain brought days and weeks of consideratiogn, and cagused the greatest remission of a moiety of the duty. Part of the duty of
'tt's•'''t Consideration of Parliament. He woguld only say, anxiety.- (Hear.) He did not know any persons holding to say one or two words with respect to the arrangements
e '' the 1848, which had been allowed to stand over, had now been
tto, • office of Lord-Lieutenant was to be retained, he public offices who had any grea t interest in asking for any to which the Hon. Gentleman alluded. In reference to the
Ambassador at Paris, I don't expect to make . a conveet of enforced, and the consequence was that the planters had
Setti_irt would be desirable and right to make a reduction extravagant salary, but he was sure it was the interest of the Hon. Member. I endeavoured to do so in C. oemmittee, been compelled to sell their hops at a ruinous price,
en
tee peeretsent'salary of the office of the Chief Secretary. the House to see the public service adequately remunerated, and failed, and lam not likely to do so in this House.— and had now nothing left. Within the last three
kird, t? _to the Parliamentary Secretary ef the Poor-law and that it should not be a bar to the highest offices that a years they had lost 20/. per acre. He trusted that
ken eee Government proposed that the duties of that office man's fortune would not allow him to accept an office with (Laughter.) But, at the same time, I must express my
strong conviction that the public service is greatly benefited the Chancellor of the Exchequer would take the same
ken ue performed for 1,000/. a year, instead of 1,500/., as an inadequate salary affixed to it. It was not considerations course which was taken in 1822.—(Hear, hear.) He had
Paris, as representing this country at t 1 .
114, ent'ite_necled by the Committee. With respect to the per- of salary, but ot efficient service, which ought to weigh with by maintaining an officer of the rank
hoef Almwbialslsandootrsaat
Y received numerous letters, complaining of the distress which
ie, _ 6 tretaryship, as that office was not Parliamentary, the House.—(Cheers.) Court, but Government of a great country like France.— existed, and stating that, if the Government attempted te
.itite' °;°t Properly come under the consideration of the Com- Mr. URQUHART reminded the Noble Lord of a state- (Hear, hear) We have reduced the salary from 10,000/. to collect the duty in May, the result would be most serious.
Ift and, in taking it into consideration themselves, the ment which he had made shortly after he eMr. Urquhart)
nue_ 8,0001.; and I can assure the Hon. Gentleman, that although Many of the tenants were leaving their lands, upon which
esten ent were of opinion that with respect to a perma- entered that House—thet the Governnaent in former days he may think a Republican form of Government involves a they could not live even rent free, the amount of taxation
iieseeeece of this kind, as it was most desirable to have the occupied itself more with dischargi g the duties of its
nen, of a person who should devote all his time and various departments, leaving tbe business of legislation diminution in the scale of expenditure, any one who k.nows being se. enormous, and in a parish near his residence a
the state of Paris at this moment will know that there is
.not thousand acres had been thrown upentthe
hproprietor. . Hde
tt,ewtt, to the duties of the office, they should not make any 'n the hands of independent Members. He thought that that change in tne habits of society which seems to be im- did not know e. single lan.dedt preprtie oerawr
oor
ohnaedwrzcoeird
Si..ll°Tl‘,s the salary at present allotted to him.—(Hear, system might be renewed with advantage. In his opinion, plied in the opinion of the Hon. Member.—( Hear, hear.) I one-fourth of histrenhte druernitn!duhee lasy_ ,
otiwahh, oaphsd;
tbhuatt
at Lad -day 1850. Theay
erne_
cwith respect to the judicial salaries, there were the whole value of the report consisted in the la' ter part. think it due to my Noble Friend now occupying the post reeeneed any pahr of
eke" onsolerations of very great importance to which he The whole amount of reductions proposed by the Com-
) -et te
erect sse House should pay attention, considerations mittee on civil and judicial salaries did not exceed 6 000/ g
of Ambassador at 'Paris to say, that English travelle.rtsh whhios mheigahnfsbweerteodldtht
statththe
o to Paris must not expect to receive from him, wi
eine- erent from those to which he had referred in or 7,000/ ; but in the diplomatic salaries the ste. ing Would
con- rei uce sa ary, tat very arge extent c ospi yelyshhadadanneenhourmsinouessspyotepugla;
kth,,--,iiith the political offices. The ersons who were placed be between 60,000/ and 70,000/. The impon ance attached • and as such as Hon. Members not acquainted with that system of
idl • h l f h •tality which the quantity of labour employed in the hop-grounds was
hitherto has been exercised, as a right on their part,
tsiee'reeeellest offices in our judicial establishmentshad hitherto to diplomatic action had been overrated. He should imagine
it w ent on labour alone varied, according to cir-
tl s Persons of great eminence, of high legal reputation, that the public newspapers, at the time in which the I d Friend to give that public warning, especially since the ne the amount sp
a duty on his.—( Laughter.) I think it faigto my Noble cultivation could form no idea of. In the cultivation of hops
y ive ,
ke°t'd standing among the foremos,t at the bar.
.He was would
.be found much more ready and correct sources of in-
n' alludin arraugement of passports may induce greater n ,
ld en- ent in this way in his county was estimated at from
tlliites I, gto the offices of Lord Chancellor, Chief Jus- ermation than any Minister. how ever expensive or how- umbers to cumstances, from 12/. 10s. to 15/. Bs. per acre, and the whole
visit Parrs, aseuming that the passports they bear w u sum sp _ . ,
H thou ht that under these
ti I:easter of the Rolls, and offices of that descrip ion. It ever expensive his cook. If diplomatic establishments were title them to the tuture atten ion of the ambassador there.- 120,000/. to e 50,0001. a
3 ear.
eh
dhg t lel
Itstee'ri rgued that there might be persons of sound judge advocated on the gruund ot maintaining peace he pointed (
tee ,end competent learning who would be quite as fit t 0 o the present state of Europe, which had fallen' into a state
i the in bassy at Const mtinople. The post of ambassador gives
.a claims on her Majesey's Gov.ernment, and should conclude by
Renewed laughter.) A similar ground applies to the em- circumstances the hop genwers a t e_ stroeges poesi_ e
,Ned ighest judicial situations as those who were ac- tf contusion, if not of positive hostility, under this ver ss-
el!ltortasged to be foremost at the bar No doubt there might tem• On these grounds he deplores, the conclusion to ywhYich of great importance to the interests of this COtnitrY• 'at see Mr- FULLER seconded the motion.
• peculiar weight to our diplomatic relations there, andfltha+this moving as he had given notice.
ns eln cases be men of this description • but at the same the Noble Lord had come not to adopt the recomnaeeda- '
e e Must Honourable Member says there is one power which has no The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER sirtd he could
et the say that he did not think it'desirable as a rule ions of the Committee for a reduction of diplomatic Ambassador at Constantinople, but which nevertheless exer- not but be aware that there was a part of the district to
kelt fe ancient practice of promoting to those high offices -stablishments ; but as he had a motion on the subject on cises an influence as great or greater than , namely
ours , which the Honourable Gentleman alluded in a state of dis-
nt of the
trk°-,..the greatest eminence at the bar should be departed he bople h,,,e wpuldc,content himself with asking the Noble Russia. lam perfectly ready to admit the exte . tress, and it was Painful therefore to him to feel it his duty
itisie te(Hear, hear.) If the Government of the day were to Lord toe 2 °reign °ecrefary when he intended to re-appoint influence or Russia, but I venture to think thateconsidermg to oppose a motion the tendency of which might be supposed
'erisieeer:,Practice of choosing men whom thf3y themselves he Committee on consular establishments ; because, if so, he 9'e extent of the Russian empire, its
_great military power, to be to alleviate that distress. He wished to direct to this
esgtae atobem„ of competent legal learning and sound should move an ins' ruction to examine into the grounds of its Proximity to Turkey, and the face that its policy is case the attention of those Honourable Gentlemen who at-
ettitnittet to fin those offices, a very wide discretion would he intercourse and make a s cial statement with the wielded by otie single will—l think that if the Emperor had tributed so much of the existing distress of the country to
laers el be placed in their hands, and tere would be much names of- the Pe'rsons employed, paend the nature Of their par- only a siegle attache at Constantinople to represent him his the removal of protection. Let it be observed that the hop
,
ellneeeten for unfit appointments , han w en the . ractice was icular functions, with the view of seeing whether these es- influence would be much the same. The influence of the growers had an absolute and eomplete monopoly of the home
Retioeu to of appointing men who were distinguished, and ablishments were worth the cost of their maintenance. He Government of. Russia depeeds not upon rank, but upon market. It was perfectly true, as the Hon. Gentleman had
lt "k eve t. a it A
an eryeoey aeoweo to be distinguished—men who hould be prepared to prove that no country had suffered the power of the two countries, and upon the proximity of stated, that the protective duty was reduced four or five
kid vnillniling the race, the arduous race, of legal competition nore from our interference than the Turkish empire. He Russia to Turkey.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman years ago ; but it was still so high that no quantity of
like n showed themselves among the foremost and most' hould ask the Noble Lord a question to-morrow with refer_ says we have an example in the United States• As they give foreign hops had ever yet come- in which could be supposed
leo VIII in eh
-t ane, -- e race.—( Hear, hear ) It was quite obvious nce to the Hungarian refugees in Turkey, who, it appeared, only 2,000/. a year to their Minister, I presume he implies to produce the slighest effect whatsoever on the price.
i•ettrr "en men must be men of considerable talent and were to be dr tamped after all ; which showed the futility of that something like that same scale would be sufficient for The utmost qnantity of foreign hops ever retained for con-
ice •
elided la their profession—a profession which compre heir diplomacy when the interests of England or the rights us. It is irue that I stated to the Hon. Gentleman that sumption was 259,0001b5. ; whereas our own produce was
~lise temally thousands of persons of learning and ability— )f nations were concerned. when :an American Envoy came into my room at the 48,000,0001b5. ;it could not, therefore, be supposed that this
' eeete,7seY were universally acknowledged to be foremost in Mr. FREW EN asked whether the motions of the Hon. Foreign-office to transact business, I never measure the had effected the home market to any appreciable extent.
las n'elession.--(Hear, hear.) Besides, on lookiag back to elember for Montrose and the Hon. Member for chippenham deference due to him or the weight to be attached to what Nor had the consumption of hops -been interfered with by
sititsemetif te, ho had thus been promoeed - men who had been would tak.e precedence of his, on going into supply upon the he has to say by the amount of selary h.e le ceive.s. - fl-i.ear, the use of drugs, which in former times w.ere employed by
need °I, perhaps, as Attorney-Generao or who had at- naval estimates? hear.) But you cannot ask any impartial American citizen the brewers when the price of hops was high. By the ar-
k-tee, °tiler great eminence at the bar—such men, for in- The SPEAKER said the motions of those two Hon. Mem_ whether the public service does not suffer from the small rangement made for the levy of the duty, the pres,ure on
ttneee'eas, Lords Hard eicke, Camden, Eldon, Mansfield, and bers would have precedence, as haying reference to the sub_ allowance of salary assigned to the Minister, who will not the producer was greatly mitigated, payment not being re-
'gent deers who might be named—he could not think the ect of the navy estimates telt you that they are inconveniently low and that they quired until the whole of the produce had been disposed of.
Itorstrl_had been losers by the practice of choosing men who Mr. DEE DES trusted the House would permit him to oc, ought to be increased.—(Hear, hear.)
.We happen Thus before the growers were called upon to pay the
ken , e most eminent of the time for such offices. - (Hear, upy their time for a few minutes while he explaiued the now to have a' most distinguished citizen of the duty due on the crop of 1848, they had received the whole
fat "r Bnt 1 h ath
. atith . _ ,i, we oao ...e most eminent men of the time reason whY his name did not appear en the minutes of the United States, who has an ample fortune of his own, price of that crop, and a considerable part of that of 1849.
1 '4%4 situations, we could not expect to obtain their ser- Committee when they came to the consideration of their reso- and who lives in a manner honourable to himself and So far was the statement of the Honourable Gentleman from
1 likti wilgess the salaries were salaries eomewhat commensu- utions. He was asked, in the first instance, to form part of the country which he represents. But there have being true, that they paid the duty before disposing of the
isaaee net their gains at the bar, so as to induce them to he Committee, but stated that he was already occupied on been at former times representatives of the United State. crop, when the fact was, that they never paid the first half of
eolies "le bar for such judicial appointments.—(Hear, he County Rates Committee, but that he would be very in this country, whose position 'has been painful to their own the duty till great part of the crop was sold, and never paid
alitste_ It was necessary likewise to consider that with re- happy to give his assistance, provided it were not requireel fee ings.—(Hear, hear.) It has been impossible for them to the second half till great part of the subsequent erop was sold.
at L‘° such men, they were placed, perhaps, in the House un the days on which his Committee sat. He was fortunate return those social courtesies which every Person in this The Hon. Gentleman would not deny OD position, that
lin.°4ls, and they bad provision to make for their faini- enough to be able to attend for some time, but subsequently country was happy to manifest towards them ; and I think when. the producer had a complete monopoty, he must, in
o, e e
reale, 'le be thought it would be a public misfortune if their ound it utterly impossible in any satisfactory manner to it would not be satisfactory to the feelings of Englishmen ordinary-times, be able to exact of the consumer the full
'NO and retiring allowances weie such as obliged them to discharge the duties of both, and requested that his name that their representatives in foreign countries should be com amount of the duty, in addition to the net price of the article ;
af 'le th •
ten eir families on insufficient means. Such a state might be removed from the Committee in question. This, pulled to be different from gentlemen residing in this countr
Y this was the case with the growers of hops. But they. had
eoese-gs, be thought, would rather be a reproach to the however, was not done. He was subsequently coin- -(Hear. hear.) Now, Sir, we have reduced the embassy to done that which must necessarily lead to a fall in the price, '
te ere s,
eete ea Lean otherwise.- (Hear, hear.) [The Noble Lord pelted to leave town, and, on his return, was asked to attend Vienna to a mission ; and when gentlemen complain that in increasing the produce of hops beyond the demand for them.
`4041,;,!ad an extract from the evidence taken before the and vote ; but having been absent for some days, he telt he P For many years up to the year before last, they had paid the
oint of money there has been no saving, we have indeed
rei4;lttee, showing that there were seven or eight gentle- hould not Properly discharge his duty if he had voted for accomplished not a great saving, because the naeure et' the duty without the slightest diffieulty. In 1843, 1844, and
' Itlite it; the bar with incomes of 8,000/. a year, and 23 or 21 esolutions without having heard the evidence on which they circumstance did not admit of any large reduction, but.at 1845, the average preduee of hops was 30,000,000 lbs., but
,In tceomes above 5,000/.] The Government proposed that were founded. the same time a saving of some magnitude, as compared with the production was increased so much that in the three
tOkena.rY of the Lord Chancellor, which was at Present Mr. W. WILLIAM, S wished to k.now if the Government the saving that would have resulted from the entire adoption succeeding years it amounted to nearly, 47,000,0001b5. By
rent n from one source and 4,000/. from another, should in had any objection to lay on the tabie a statement, in the form of the report of the Commi tee. At Paris there had been a throwing so large a quantity of this article :on the market
Ntet,°elo,ooor. The retiring allowance they did not pro- of a return, of all the items recommended for reduction by saving of 2,000/., by the reduction of the salary from 10.000/. beyond what the country required, the price had been con-
Zilen alter. They proposed to agree with the Committee the Official Salaries Committee, stating the points with to 8,0001. ; at Vienna a saving of 4,0001, by reducing the siderablY reduced. In 1849 the produce of `hops was small
z ottt ,pPect to reducing the salary of the Master of the Rolls which the Government agreed, and those with which they salary from 9,0001. to 5,0001.; and at Madrid a saving of and the price exceedingly high, but in 1850 tben produce was
'tot e'°°°l. to 6,0001. With respect to the Chief Justices, disagreed. The statement of the Noble Lord was far from 1,000/., by reducing the salary from 6,000/. to 5,000/e so that very large, amounting to 48,000,00011e5e by whiqe the market
AN Elet to be borne in mind, that besides the ordinary ex- satisfactory.
110" o • in over
there was 7,000/ saved by the reduction of the salaries of was aga stocked and the price reduced. . The greater
tel which the Master of the Rolls was subject, they Lord JOHN RUSSELL subsequently said he had no oh- the diplomatic officers. The Hon• Gentleman says this is a part of the hops on which the duty was not: to- be paid had
;tlisi,, exPenses of their circuits to bear which were not 'ectien to lay such a statement on the table of the House. peculiar time, when you might abolish the minor missions in long been soled at the (My-paid price. Bettie, remission of
en,seed at less than 7001. a year. The dovernment, there- Mr. COBDE-N thought it would, perhaps, be better not to Germany ; and he differs from my Noble Friend, who thinks duty wnas t,c. 'le to the dealers who had -paid that _price the
el tePer°Pcteed tbat the salaries of the Chief Justice should enter into any discussion to-night, as he and the Hon, mem- the time peculiarly inappropriate. It is true that the Hon. teentreman's, constituents would derive nO benente but
eq.,te,same as those named in the Bill introduced last year, ber for West Surrey were the only members of that Com. Governments at Vienna and Berlin do exercise, as. if to the first Parties, it was tantamount to a dbinand that so ,
NO th c/ Chief Justice of the Queen's Bench 8,0001. a-year, rnittee present. But he might say, generally. it was with they must at all times exercise, a preponderating in- many thousands of Pounds should be taken from the pockets
etre,e,9hief Justice of the Common Pleas and the Chief disappointment he had heard that so large a "Dronortion of fluence upon the affairs of Germany; but if there is any- of the general tax-Paying community for the benefit of a
‘tts" °' the Excheouer 7 600/ each. The proposal of the the reductions recommended in the diplomatic leranrch of the thing- peeulier in the present state of affairs in Germany small class-
° reitte ' - • •
ellen, e was that the salary of the Chief Justice of the service had been rejected by the Government. Re thought bearing upon this question, I should remind the Hon. Gen- Mr. Ts lee He,OEIGES hoped that some relief would be
Ni,:Bench should be 7,000/., the salaries of the Chiet it would be generally felt that if no saving could be effected tletnan that to all appearances the old Diet is going to be given, as tueeer'stress Wl' the hoP-growers could not be denied,
etee"ef the Common Pleas and the Chief Baron of the Ex- in that branch there was little chance of effecting any saving establishsd at Frankfort, and one peculiar circumstance At Present tuere was a greater number of farms untenanted
eos t',oool. each, and the Puisne Judges 5,000/. each. in the civil branch ; aud, weighing the statement of the connected with that is, that the decisions of the Diet re- thau he had ev‘er known in that county, and it was to be
eleed enimittee recommended that the Vice-Chancellors Noble Lord against the evidence taken before the committee, quired unanimity, and that, therefore, the will of every one feared that witn a large, number of farms oue of employment
Ith "aye 5.0001- a yeare_the Masters in Chancery 2,000/. he did not consider he was justified in the course. he „as of these smaller states is likely to resume the influence it the state of the county in reference to the payinent of poor_
tileitetl'lnid the Accounta,lt-General 2,000/. He quite agreed taking.—(llear.) Embassies to Paris and Constantinople P
-growers some
ossessed previous to the year 1848.—(Hear, hear.) But rates and taxes.weuld benenne. suelnetha.t h 9 Minister could
earrneeilkecountant-Generel should be Paid by a fixed sa- were to be continued. The Noble Lord had spoken of the the information which we got from these smaller states venture tel overurit it,• -T) su„ouiu mei It his duty to intro_
;reel -e'e,ad of, as at Present, by fees. With respect to the advantages of an ambassador at Paris with a large salary ;an a frequently of the greatest importance; and though the duce a Bill for tne reauctlon oalstlie.duty on heps.
;ea itlta al Chincery, considering the importance of their du- ambassador was generally considered to be an individual re-
out, in-
Hon. Gentleman seems to think it is sufficient for Govern- Mr. BASS felt
ldisposetd ttoh
lindulgenne• of the Right
14 tt e did not think it right that there sheold be any change Presenting the Person of the sovereign at the court of another merit to rely upon the information it can get from the news- Honourable Gent eman_ 00l er cdasses of distressed agricul-
osetnir salaries, but that they should remain at 2,500/. It sovereign—(Hear)- and if any form of government could P great sufferers,
eit.s3ar to be remembered that, the whole question of Chan- dispense with the pomp and pageantry and expense of an Pa
importation of
apers may be of events Publicly known, a Government and as they paid a most onerous
.uty on their produce he
pers, I will say that, however well informed the news- turists. The growers of bar ey ha
dbeen very
kiteetteform being under consideration the offices of the ambassador it was the G'Vem ' cut of a rePublic.—( Hear.) that had no other source of information would, I am could not but thenk it quite as leasotnabhle that the Right
%litters might or might not be change'do and, therefore, for Another reason, which did n„t exist when the committee afraid, very soon fall intO great disgr„e in this country Honourable Gentleman should returl,te t ,e'll some part of
!kpedfeaBon, as well as for others, he did not think it mad ; its recommendation, was, that the president of the and in Europe _Meer, hear, ) with respect to the other the duty, as that he should eetueen el° eueeeeiele
alteeenset to alter their salaries at present. -( Hear, French Republic, by a recent vote of the chamber would offices, my Noble Friend stated, in a manner that ought part of the dutY•on holes, which "au a'reauYsegone into their
aotee Aisne of the changes to which he had alluded receive, in tutur et a much less salar ' He (51 - dobden) to sstisty the tnind of any reflecting man that it is of great pockets. He doubted that the existence oi , severe depres-
loitinasdeduty they
the e"'afrect those persons .ho had been appointed before presumed the sales of studs ot horses3-and earria lies and the importance to co;ve-nment that there' should be Offices sion in this branch of agriculture was clearly
thatPmencemen. of last year. It would be remembered greater simPlicitY with. which the Presid nt of tie French to which no -great degree of daily labour is attached, but asinuch as the quantitY of acig °off h4°-PL.!tlider cultivation
after teeatated on a forme- occasion that persons appointed Republic now appeared in the streets, bespoke a greater aim- which being connected with the Cabinet may enable them inereased in 1850 from uPwar 2,oUu 'to upwards of
kle me commencement of last year would be appointed plicity and economY in the Government of France, and we to have, as members of the Administration, persons of great
.t, ect to
4 e any new arrangement that might be proposed. ought te conform in our diPlom,iatic relations to that im- political knowledge, of great talents, of great public character ; foreign hops until the price in re
ancourry was nearly
4e,:titterotnittee also recommended a new sc.rle of salaries for proved sYstem of gevernnlent--4 eleare hear.) But, he con- but who, either through age, infirmities, or any other double the average, as was thhieeca h
e Gseenwtlemetn a last importa-
-43,000. There could be no
.corterabler
atleriend and Ireland—a scale involving a diminution or fessed, as tar as he ha i Imo a r opportunity of hearing the evi- circumstances, however able so be useful advisers to their tion occurred. If Hentinre... ould confine
o n inish an onerw
telly '3 te no very large amount, and by which a small saving dence, he could not gather from Ve witnesses what were the colleagues, are yet unable to undergo the daily fatigue of a themselves to attempting s°
net tiljtnild accrue to the public, but which he owned he did peculiar virtues and advantages connected with the mainte- laborious office. With respect to the law, Ido think that if would meet the sympathy. of roth aides of the
v indulgence te ouse ; but to
tleli ink it expedient to make. Both in Edinburgh and nance of the rank of an ernbassy, either at Paris or Constan- there can be imagined an economy that would be injurious to come and ask for extraordmare -- .- a trade which
le lie . other in the countr a
'nee ',Particularly the former, the chief Persona who had theople. Russia, which eas quite as influential a power at the interests of the country, it would be an economy that led was more indulged than any y !Veered
)ioren.,‘ the head of society ever since the union had been Constantinople as England, had no ambassad rie but a ii..ere eyou te reduce too low the salaries of judicial officers.-e.(Hear.) quite unreasonable.
sed the motion, cont d' (
Akio? Connected with the profession ef the law, especially simple mission, and if England were placed on the same It may be true that you cannot predict beforehand that a Mr. EWART briefly oPPo e en ing as
of je ' and those who held the superior offices in the courts footing he calculated she would enjoy the same advantages man who is a distinguished advocate should, on that account we understood the lion. M.ember, wei° woanseoniasrslyaitntahuediebxle. '
- °lit
the h
take Tee. For that reason he did not think it desirable to as the Russian G vernment. But to take another Govern- be an eminent judge ; but the presumption la in favour of
_in the gallery ) that the relief Prole ed t° he given to the hop
dealers ; that
Nee 'Min those pereons the means of keeping up that social ment, hose Policy had come under the consideration of the his being so--that the man who has shown great ability and growers would involve an injusticiee4ng
tee; Which they were expected to maintain in those coon- Committee. America had no ambassadors, and paid no commanding talent in one department of the law should also it was, in point of fact, merely re i
thetiil to an extent which would not be expected from Minister more than 2,000/. a year. He could not gather that distinguish himself in the judicial capacity. But if there is pense of another.
Peat ein London or in any other place where persons of the American Minister was less influential in any matter one thing more than any other that would be unfortunate for Air. DenBAELI said he was astmaished -that the Hon.
the House of the suffer-
ne 1; lertune resorted, and where they woul i consequently concerning the interests of his country or his fellowecitizens, this country 't would be if the bar, instead of looking up to members eh° now complained to
te tit4a'-consPicuouslY Placed. - (Hear, hear. ) He wished than the Ambassador or minister of England, though the the bench, il;ould look down en it—if the bench should be filled - ins of their constituents, a particular class a agriculturists
tries ate this most distinctly with respect to both coun- latter was enjeying a salary of four or five times the amount. by persons whose professional reputation should be less than should not have availed thenisecelval a the °PPertunii. '
ion during the presenes
Win' and particularly with respect to Ireland, because he He recollected asking the Secretary of State for Foreign that of the persons pleading at the bar, and if the decisions afforded them on more than one. ons
riltant
in support of the sentit
sort aware that a rumour had been spread without an, Affairs, whether the American Minister, entering the of the judges should therefore carry with them less weight, session of expressing their opinto
peet°ft.oauthority, that it was the intention of Govern- Foreign-office would have less weight with 2,000 r. a and command less respect in the country, in consequence of meats which hal so gracio.usly issued fr" the Throne, and-
r H hd b • '
lusters. ehe mese a een told
ii* i change the provision for the administration of year than any other minister with 5,000/. a year, and the its being supposed that the men who gave them were men of been responded to by Mi
e s ssion, that there was gre• t '
eeestrt Ireland, either by a reduction er transfer of the `Noble Lord admitted he would have just as much weights_ inferior ability and character to those who were Pleading the at the commencement of tee -e .
ti aof - •
os „ Justine. Now, 'there was never any such inten. (Hear, hear.) The Committee examined a diplomatic gen. causes which the judges . •
Might deride —(Hear, hear.) The distress and depression in spond h • en
to t at importan
tlisu'n the part of Government, On the contrarY, they tleman, and tried to elicit what were the duties of ministers Hon. Gentleman thinks 6,000/. or 7,000/. sufficient for a the House was called upon tot
re
ber for Kent, and t
the agricultural districts, but wh a I
ahotillt it was of great importance that the cou•rs of justice abroad, and what were the advantsges of the high stipends judge. Well, the puisne judges have only 5,0. 0/ ;it is declaration, the Honourable
AcleCti•ust addressed the Houthe
to., %Ist bn fully maintained in Ireland for the purpose of ad_ our ministers received, and they could not gather much more only chiefs to whom a higher salary is given. In reference Honourable Gentleman who hatate
n ives of the agricultural ise,
'Lobe trnig justice locally ie that part of the United King- than that there was great virtue in keeping a most expensive to those chiefs, the salaries are reduced below what they did not then assist the rePrese-
in, adbdeeitniomn
.atode at
tereei (Hear, hear.) 'The only other question that table, and a good dinner was the very soul of diplomacy.— were ; but I think that, in savings. ot that sort, the actual terest, but they now came forwa.xd and told the House tha-
title hil:d was that of the diplomatic salaries. On this goes- (Hear, and a laugh.) He could not imagine any country pecuniary amount is quite undeserving of attention—(Hear, they represented bodies of suff— ---, w!,re
pwrinhaichag,hriecubltaudri;ltslu.dTedh,etyo
give
elm, teemight perhaps rather to ask his Noble Friend near gaining anything in which it was necessary to bring to its hear.) -and will not compare with the greatly more im- not aiked, on the occasions to -,..--- • -
prot_eceion, ptit merely to
',is im-re Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs. to express ai i the accomplishment of a cook, however great he might portant object—that the lew of the country should be ad- an opinion on the principles oi
I•eterice`enion te the House. He was sure his Noble Friend be. - (Cheers.) With regard to Germany, the Committee ministered in a manner' to eommand the confidence and re- offer their valuable testimony thteo tl
tented
.ue ready to give any explanation that might be re- recommended that missions to third-rate courts should not spect of the people of this country. For depend elem. it,
.if and augu=t declaration which haat!' ouse
this air wever h
a„tete eet hut in the meantime he (Lord John Russell) would be continued, but the Noble Lord said now was the time your courts of law were to cease -to hold that position in from the Throne, Notwithstan i!lgh.
i 'h' oct and' e °few"
eeese-;°rtlY what took place in Committee with respect to when we ought not to change. Now was the time of all the public esteem which lam happy to see they
.do new— superior to any petty feelings mine ;est' 4. , -n-irely
ra on the present
Ron 4nPortant offices, and what it was that Government others when we ought to make a change when the whole if the people wre to think the decisions were given erne- sympathised with these lionourau'e -ern --
lei r°eed t ••h C • -, ' • • • Idth'' ' b f re the House was one for an
th -0 do. There was a question in t e ommitt„ affairs of (..,ermany were centralled at Vienna and Berlin. neously from want of capacity or want of know ege on e occasion. The motion e o .. „ . _
1' reS he humble to Ler Majesty, intormmg Ler that very
arn, Peet to the maintenance of an Anebasader at Never was there a time before when the policy of Germany part of the jadges, you would shake the confidence of t address ai tricts of the counties of Su
%trinena.nd, as he understood from the chairman of the was so completely engrossed at those two courts. The Ge. people in the constitution of the country, inflicting a wound great distress existed in those --s--
, aa setee"ee, it was decided by a majority to maintain vernment had discontinued the ambessador at Vienna, and upon the public interest which the saving of a few thonsands sex and Kent where hops were grown. Tha h S-
t was, t ey we
, t: 1 distre - re
i keejontuassador. Afterwards some of the members of the it was now simply a mission The same rule might be of pounds could not make up, the evil effects of which no to inform her Majesty that there Was P.ar la ss, when
oo red",,,,,,Y stated that they thought the p-esent salary should followed out, ana the missions to the minor courts of amount of money could counterbalance.—(Cheers.) her Majesty had informed them tnat there was general.dis-
Iv; er Ce'e d, upon which the other members ef the Committee Germany be abolished • and he hoped to have the oppor. Mr. I IljelE agreed with the Noble Lord, that it was of tress. Ile could not understated how . her AlsiestY s Minis-
4enpeene°,Pinion that if the salary were reduced it would be tunitY (4. taking the opin' on of the "House on that queetion. great importance, to keep up the credit of the country, te ters, having counselled her Majesty to make that important
Posietietee'e for an Ambassador to maintain the dignity of his The Noble Lord ha'd said it was a great advintage to have judges who might be looked up to ; and it was the duty announcement, and having on several Accasiotn told the
"° the -"and that it would be better to reduce the embassy have certain members of the Government, who had of the ei inistry to select men of the highest public and pri- HollSe that they still held the same °lnnmeie 'on Ma subject
'Jeep, rank of a mission with a salary of 5,000/. In consi- not very heavy dot' es to perform, in order that vate char actec.for such offiCes. But that was not the rule in which they had expressed at an early period of the session,
ey eg t his t motion. What was the case before
„Quid b mateer the Government were of opinion that it their services might be brought to the aid of the other mem- this coun try. Political chances throw people on the surface, could resist the presen
'net e a very serious detriment to the Public service that bers of the Cabinet who were overworked. If the parties and men were Placed in situations high and honourable, who the House? The duty on foreign hops had. been reduced to
e e should b I • but the internal dutie
"ear,) ,e no longer an Ambassador at Paris.—(flear, appointed to those offices were generally selected on account if the selection remained with the profession, would never one-fourth of what it was former 3, . . ...„ s
coulee, eeinsidering the relations which we had with that of their possessing the talent neeeseary to enable them to aid have oet =Pied such P°siti°ns --(Hear hear.) He could had not been reduced in the same proportion. Tete supporters
, and c-Y--considerin hd 1 • h ' eb f the Government, he should ---d h ld d 't• ' h 'a- of this motion did not ask the House to Protect any branch of
gte ai y intercourse tat was required, the otoer mem ers o say there name me eancee—an e wou oso i necessary - w ere i
, ‘,., onside , ,
euich derting twit an Ambassador bad certain privileges would be some virtue in such a course of policy. For in- dividuals,had been thrown into high and important situations native industry ; they merely contended that i..f the foreign
secured. " net belong to an Envoy, and by which we thereby ; stance, the Noble Lord said that when he was Paymaster of to which they would never do honour or credit ;at all events duty on an article of .English production atm. redu.ced, it was
°Pinion creiderable advantage—the Government were of the Forces, he was enabled to come to the aid of the Govern- the char ces were greatly against such a result. He con- at least just that the inland duty on the samere article should
counterbt
el at the difference of expense was far more than ment upon great and pressing occasions. He (Mr. Cobden) 1 sidered feat the fact of their giving the judges a retiring pen- he reduced in the same peoportion. The non. Member for
Means -"iced by the maintenance of friendly relations by ' had no doubt that the Noble Lord, however little he might 1 sion she uid secure for them the services of the most talented Derby said that, notwithstanding the alleged distress in those
took itietf an Amb„„dor in Paris. At the same time, they have to do, would be one of the most efficient member„f : men, a t smaller salaries than were at present paid. The districts, the produce of hops had much increased of late ,
~
'night n° consideration the question whether some reduction any Government. But it could not be shown generally that 1 fact w 9 .a that the whole society of England was in too high a veers. But it appeared.hy a return which was on the table
Pro-os•
V °t he made ; and they had COnle to the resolution of those sinecure offices were filled by very able and talented tone.- (Laughter.) Every class of expenditure, from that of -of the House, that from 1817 to 1850 there'slead been a re-
fr mg a
~,-°_,°l 10 reduction of 2,000/, a year, viz., a reduction men.— (Hear, hear-) But the Noble Lord said it was neces- the peer downwards, was beyond what the people had means , ductiou of not less than 10,000 acres of land under hop cue-
e`reor. •14°°°1* to 8,000/. a year in the salary of the Ambas- sari to give good salaries in order that Government might to affo rd ; and hence, if the people could hang any portion 1 tivation ; from something like 52,000 acres inrlB47 to about
ne ree was b
reafter th , Yno means certain that we should not find call to their aid men whose fortunes might be moderate, and of theer family upon the Government, they were only too \ 42,000 acres in 1850. This glowed that Allis important
no_ity of oat 'or the purpose of maintaining the proper dig- who had not the means of living upon their own resources. ready eo do it.,—(Hear.) Ile wanted to see an economical branch of native industry . was suffering; that there was
Lae eth ur Ambassador the sum was too small. It was onl New he thought that if individuals were called in to the aid Government, but at the same time one whose servants should , great agricultural distress in this particular district. The
1 Y
dor at 11 daY he was looking at a letter from our Ambassa f G hh d 1 h kto recommend be well paid, though the present h
- o a overnment W o a not wea t Or ran igh rates of remuneration argument of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, that the hop-
ari • .
IlOt ra • .s 1- 1783, in which it was stated that be could them, they would be men who had toughs their way up, and ought to be moderated, If the diplomatic service could not growing interest was protected, meant nothing unless he
~ aiutain li.
"1104 1 mlsolf Properly and efficiently as Ambassador , whose talents would command remuneration in Government be-reduced, he despaired of any great reduction being made I could show that the interpal tax raised on the article did
els ttuul mnon,
,--P-4.... ga year.-(llear, hear.) But, bow. 'or elaewhere. But the Noble Lord gave an gnawer lin the expenditure. Biagland recptired- - fr
to -eep tiP 'irriry ' liot 'exceed the protection- which he alleged. _A however,-
-

the internal impost not only equalled but exceeded the
foreign protection which he alleged, that not only showed
that the grievance was considerable, but showed also
what was the cause which produced that distress. He
did not think that the House would, under the circum-
stances, be justified in refusing to assent to the motion
of the Honourable Member for Sussex (Mr. Frewen),
which merely affirmed the existence of great dis-
tress in a particular district, evidently produced by an
enormous system of fiscal blundering; thus repeating a de-
claration graciously made by the Crown at the beginning of
the session, and repeated by her Majesty's Ministers on every
possible occasion. Under these circumstances, if his Hon.
Friend thought proper to divide the House, he should think
it his duty, consistently with all he had said and done during
the session, to give the motion his support.
Mr. BASS explained that what he had said was, that the
number of acres under hop cultivation had increased from
42,797 in 1849 to 43,125 in 1850.
Lord J. MANNERS—But what was the number in 1847?
Mr. BASS said that he had not referred to 1847 (Hear.)
Lord J. MANNERS—ExactIy so. If any branch of agri-
culturists complained of distress, they were always told that
they must put more capital into the soil and bestir them-
selves, and that everything would then go right. In this
case some thousand acres of land having been brought under
cultivation in one year, the Hon. Member for Derby (Mr.
Bass) drew the conclusion that the state of the cultivators
was therefore most prosperous and successful, and that the
House should, on that account, resist any appeal made on
their behalf. That showed that if the agriculturists did put
more capital into the soil, in order to make head against the
adverse circumstances in which they had been placed by un-
just legislation. it would be brought in argument against
them in that House.—(Hear, hear.)
Lord J. RUSSELL said that the Hon. Member for
Bucks (Mr. Disraeli) had neither correctly stated the motion
made by the Hon. Member for Sussex, nor the state ot the
returns before the House. Any one would have supposed,
from the statement of the Honourable Gentleman, that this
was a county and an interest suffering from a great importa-
tion of foreign produce. But although the duty on foreign
hops had been much reduced, it had not been reduced to
such a degree as to admit foreign hops, except is a year of
extraordinary prices. The importation of foreign hops had
only been 1-190th part of the home-grown hops consumed;
and therefore it was clear that, the reduction in price was
not caused by the importation of foreign hops, but by the
great increase which had taken place in the home produc-
tion of late years. The motion before the House proposed
not only to affirm the distress of a particular class of agri-
culturists, but to represent to her Majesty that these hop-
growers were unable to pay the duties to which they were
charged by law in the present year, and of course that they
should not be compelled to pay the sum so owing from
them. But as the hop-growers had already sold their hops
and obtained their price (a low one it might be), on the sup-
position that they should have to pay the duty, this was a
proposition that they should not be required to pay to the
revenue the sum which they had received from the hop deal-
ers for that purpose. This, he thought, was not a proposi-
tion to which the House could agree.—(Hear.)
Mr. FREWEN said that his motion having come on un-
expectedly, and many of the friends who would have sap-
ported him not being present, he should not divide the House,
but would withdraw his motion.
The House then went into Committee of Supply, but,
on the first vote (one for naval stores) having been pro-
posed,
Mr. HUME objected to proceeding to vote public money
at that late hour.
The vote was thereupon, after a short conversation, with-
drawn, and the Chairman reported progress.
PROCESS AND PRACTICE (IRELAND) BILL.
The report on this Bill was brought up and agreed to.
APPOINTMENTS TO OFFICES, &c., BILL.
This Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be com-
mitted.
COMMISSIONER OF WOODS AND FORESTS.
Mr. BAILLIE COCHRANE moved for returns of the
attendance of the Commissioner of Woods and Forests, since
the Noble Lord came into office.
Lord SEYMOUR thought it would have been only fair in
the Hon. Member to have stated the reasons why he moved
for these returns.—(Hear, hear.) Several of the duties to
which the motion referred were attached to the office of
Woods and Forests by Act of Parliament—others were ne-
cessarily connected with the office, and some had no special
meetings connected with them, hile others mentioned in
the motion were quite incorrect.—(Hear, hear.) If the Hon.
Member had any charge to bring against him of not having
attended to his duties, he would be prepared to meet him on
that ground, but, if not, it was a mere waste of time to give
such returns as these.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. COCHRANE had made no charge, but he should
like to know how often the Noble Lord had attended the
Board of Health, for example.—(" No, no.")
Mr. DISRAELI hoped his Hon. Friend would not divide
the House on this motion.—( Hear, hear.) If it was his ob-
ject to bring before the House certain circumstances con-
nected with one individual holding a number of offices, per-
haps he would think that he had succeeded; but making a
motion of the kind was calculated to cast a slur upon an indi-
vidual whom he regarded as one of the most valuable mem-
bers of the Administration.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. COCHRANE would not divide the House, but per-
haps the Noble Lord would have no objection to give the
return of the number of meetings held of the Board of
Health and Enclosure Commission?
Lord S. RUSSELL objected to give any of the returns
without a good reason being assigned.—( Hear, hear.)
The motion was then withdrawn.
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.
Mr. DISRAELI asked what business the Noble Lord pro-
posed to take first on Friday ?
Lord J. RUSSELL thought, after what had occurred that
evening, that it would be desirable to take up, first, the re-
port on the Property-tax Bill on Friday, and if possible,
after that the Ecclesiastical Titles Bill.
Mr. DISRAELI—Then, if the discussion should be brief
on the first subject, the Noble Lord intended to proceed next
with the Ecclesiastical Titles Bill?
Lord J. RUSSELL—Yes.
COUNTY COURTS BILL.
On the motion of Mr. J. WILLIAMS, the County Courts
Further Extension Bill, brought from the House of Lords,
was read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time
on the 14th of May.
The House adjourned at a Quarter past Twelve o'clock.

COURT CIRCULAR.
It is understood that the Queen intends to give a third
State Ball in the month of June next, and that for the en-
courarement of trade, her Majesty has resolved that it shall
be a Fancy Ball. The costume will be the full dress of the
Court of King Charles the Second, from the Restoration in
1660 to 1685. The choice of dress will not be limited to this
country, but will include the Court costumes of that period
of other European countries.
The Queen held a Privy Council yesterday afternoon, at
three o'clock, at Buckingham Palace. It was attended by
his Royal Highness Prince Albert, the Lord President, the
Lord Chancellor, the Lord Privy Seal, the Secretaries of
State for the Home, Foreign, and Colonial Departments, the
Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, the Postmaster-
General, the Lord Steward, the Lord Chamberlain, the
Master of the Horse, and the Groom of the Stole to Prince

Albert.
The Right Hon. Andrew Rutherford was by command of
the Queen sworn of her Majesty's Most Honourable Privy
Council, and took his seat at the Hoard.
A proclamation was ordered to be issued, relative to the
apprehension, of parties connected with the St. Alban's
election. The Hon. Wm. Bathurst was Clerk of the Coun-
cil in. Waiting. Before the Privy Council the Queen gave
audiences to Sir George Grey and the Marquis of Lansiowne.
After the Council her Majesty gave aadiences to the Mar-
quis of Breadalbane and Earl Grey.
The Queen was attended by the Treasurer of the House-
hold, the Vice-Chamberlain, the Marquis of Londonderry,
Gold Stick in Waiting, Lord Waterpark, Lord in Waiting,
and Colonel Berkeley Drummond, Groom in Waiting.
Their Royal Highnesses the Prince and Princess of Prussia,
attended by the Countess A. de Harke and Count Goltz,
went to the new Palace of Westminster yesterday morning,
and inspected the Houses of Parliament.
Their Royal Highnesses the Prince and Princess of Prussia,
and Prince Frederick William, accompanied by his Serene
Highness Prince Edward of Saxe-Wiemar, went to Kew
yesterday afternoon, in an open carriage and four, and visited
her Royal Highness the Duchess of Cambridge.
His Royal Highness Prince Albert, attended by Lieut.-
Colonel F. H. Seymour, rode out on horseback yesterday
morning.
The Royal Family took their accustomed exercise yester-
day, in the garden of Buckingham Pal
evening at Buck-
The Queen had a dinner party yesterday
ingham Palace • the company included her Royal Highness
the Duchess of' Kent; their Royal Highnesses the Prince
and Princess of Prussia, his Royal Highness Prince
rland Frede
and
-
rick William of Prussia, he Duchess of Suthe
Lady C. Leveson Gower, the Duke of Wellington, the Duke
and Duchess of Argyll, his Excellency the Chevalier Bunsen,
his Excellency Monsieur Mussurus, Lady Fanny Howard,
the Baroness de Speth, the Countess A. de Harke, the
Countess Louise Oriolla, the Marquis and Marchioness of
Abercorn, the Earl and Countess Granville, Count Pukler,
Major von Bayen, Count Goltz, Colonel Fischer, and Lieut.
von Heinz.
The band of the Grenadier Guards was in attendance
during dinner, and performed the following selection :
Der Fackel Tanz .................... Meyerbeer.
Elvira Polka
Wanderlieder Waltzer.
Fantasie—Die deutsche Sanger ... Halle.
The Council of Chairmen of the Juries of the Exhibition
of the Industry of all Nations had a meeting at half-past
eleven o'clock yesterday morning, at the Exhibition.
Present :—Class 1. Sir H. de la Beche, C.B.—Class 4.
Professor Owen—Class The Earl of Jersey—Class 8.
Baron Charles Dupin—Class 9. Mr. Philip Pusey, M.P.—
Class 10 Sir David Brewster—Class 19a. Sir H. R. Bishop
Class 11. Sir James Anderson—Class 12. Dr. Schafhault,
for Professor Herrman—Class 13. Mr. George T. Kemp—
Class 14. Count von Harrack —Class 15. M. Verryt, for M.
Van Hoegaerden—Class 16. Hon. Colonel George Anson—
Class 17. His Excellency M. Van de Weyer—Class 18. Mr,
Henry . Tucker—Class 19. Dr. Bolley—Class 20. Mr.
William Felkin—Class 22. The Hon. Horace Gresley—Class
24. Ldrd de Manley—Class 26. M. Adam Chevalier de
Burg—Class 28. M. Ramon de la Sagra, for Signor Don
Joaquim Alforano—Class 29. Viscount Canning—Class 30.
Herr von Viebahn.
Viscount Canning was in the chair at the mee tingtenant of the
Council. Dr. Lyon Playfair, Colonel Lloyd, and Lieu
Ward, attended.
A deputation from Yarmouth, headed by Mr. J. Hume,
M.P.', and consisting of the Mayor of Great Yarmouth, the
Deputy,Mayor, Mr. G. D. Palmer, Mr. Wiltiamarrßisou:
roughs, Mr. Joseph Davey, and Mr. J. Hai% !
had an interview with Lord Seymour yesterdaryavt the office
of her Majesty's Commissioners of Woods and Forests.a
A deputation on the subject of the Blr J. Dundas
Orkney_Ports, consist-
ing of the Earl of Zetland, Mr. G. Traill,
with the
and Mr. J. Lock, had an interview yestesir:
Chancellor of the Exchequer, at his -06 laresidence in
Downing-street. A Mr R. H. Wyatt, had
Mr. Hughes, of Manchester, and
.
an interview yesterday with Earl Granville, at the Board of
Trade, on the subject of the Patent-la
Mr. John Wood, Chairman of theeßowcahrda/Inland Revenue,
ellor of the Ex-
had an interview yesterday, with th
earman had also an interview
chequer. Sir Alexander Sp
with the Right Hon. Baronet.
Dispatches were received yesterday at the Colonial-office
from the Governor of South Australia, and also from the
Governor of St. Helena. Dispatches were also received from
the Governor of the Canadas, and the Governors of the other
Norte American colonies.

Mr. CONCERT.—This entertainment
took place last evening at Sc. Martin's Hall. Mr. Willy
was assi ted by Messrs. Zerbini, Hill, Westlake. and Haus-
man, with Mr. Lindsay Sloper at the pianoforte. The fea-
tures of the concert were, Grand ay be conceived, classical,
comprising Beethoven's Quintet in C major, one of
-zpohr's and one of Mendelssohn's Concertos, and the Grand
Trio in C minor by the last composer. The vocal attractions
of the evening were contributed by Mr. and Mrs. Weiss.
Mr. Frank Bodda, and Miss Mira Griesbach ; but we fear
the character of the concert was too classic, and aimed too
much at high art to have made it very rrofitable for' the
deozying beneficiaire,