The Sun.
London, England, 1833-04-24 00:00:00

triclure had been drawn by the Hun. Member for
ildharn of the distress ofthatdistrict. He would admit,
•
r°Jatitd7as.impo.ssible to deny, that such distress existed in
'strict, in consequence of the effect which the
etree,,,hs
the hand-loom
leavers. °For;fierryachinery had had on
a hand-loom weaver was
,genefally a
elepend d He lived at a distance front the to.vn, and he
re e- 'lly for part of his living on his loom ; but the
()meet mach.
was in roduced, he
totild not pinery, on a large scale,
that h acropete with it ; and the consequence
.wlas,
het, re first li id to apply himself more severely to his a-
ceived°aProeure the same wages which he formerly 7-
had he "he was then obliged to neglect his I ind, which ec), en thf,
rz` aert Peel) Was,
principal source of his support. He (Sir
therefore willing to admit that distress
been great extent existed in those districts where there had
uvatillmanv. hand-looons weavers; but it was absurNil, toi
the„ d",,t the whole country was therefore distressed. -
et err I he admit that it ,vas in so bad a state as had been
lettte-r it the Hon. Member for Oldham. He had seen a
etc, .1a the e daily Papers, signed by an elector of Oldham,
tiot
oretibsd himself as well aequainted with the situa-
the et a that Place, and he gave a very different account of
ssy di,trr al trade'
and the rate of wages. He attributed
failure NI that existed there, in some measure, to the
l
the ratecif one of their banks in 1823, but said that still
tett
til Of wages was good. The Right Hon. Gent en-
tichs irda went into a detail of the state of wages i
Wages Coventry, and Birmingham, to show that the
Peesed' tile midland counties of England were notde-9
P
eat' l'roin which it appeared that the rate of wit!.
etroPeetsrs at Birmingham, was about 3s-6d. per ta?
tad p:;% 4d. to 3. 6d. ; labourers, 2s. 21 to 25..6i . ;
'kali -nte" 3s. 6d.' to as. These (after deductinghea
tatentlian for carpenters' and masons' tools) were tod.
tatte%the average rates of wages in the midland dis-
c :.'w he said that with such wages labourersh li
tetiatlo tv''osuhpfar an change, for they would find that the
(elk a u raise the prices of the articles. which they
trLf th,ireurtauch quicker than it would raise. the wages
-se •abour.--(L d cheers.) He considered this,
filattlath4_t itaPortant pa(i).'tiof the qustion, and be consideree
tlatts' c'insomption of hops, tea, coffee, and sugar, show,ded,
°I the 'jab iuring classes bad now obtained greater comnend
iff
the e'e"ssaries of life than they had before ; a
the se Were convinced of that, he called upon them, as
r
th ePreeentati
'Meet r, ves of the people, to. reflect well before
th,
cur,. neir sanction to a measure which, by depreciating
4tlessirteY, would decrease their command of the nece!.
°4 tle de' It Was singular also, that no two men agreedbt
is tn'' question and while there were so many dou sn,
tp ,11°Y coniiiqing o inions, was it worth while to ope
til'
e'a'ner °f difficulties by an inquiry into the state ofd 11, ;tc'llai,otry ?
The Hon. Member for Wnitehaven—of ahnis
laspo.ecrl him for it—had not said anything more of
by
4'" less ,temedies, than, as that the evils were
into.
d He
'ad that system, he wished that inquired
ate 'Pope] a• had'
tlitt „ adon increased
'sled • `ue standard had not increased. He, therefore,
~'''/' se,btt eatended. The Hon. Gentleman might as well
I.l`,sv'er'ed4als have been made, new countries have been
ee had ~,,' tld yet the mile and the yard remain the same.
had
--":ea of an antiquated standard. He might as.
tl,la tiab,ve talked of an antiquated pound. The Hon. Gen
`,ast't 6"" Mistaken when he said the monetary system was
tea lheeZeae the atandard was old. Every improvement
tet Ise of nronev—every expedient adopted at the
ats '44, which economized the use of money, was,
4% i4tai aa increase of its quantity. To say we could
4red Have
a varying-currency, because we had a
4late "'adard, tantamountee,te
en° 'tand li 'llber h. ard at all.—(Heir, hear.) The Hon.
e'.4 ost a 4 condemned the present system, but he
e'llt s'wa to the House what remedy he proposed.d
i; 4 i e--;'', e the Hon Member for Oldham, who he
.hope
i',otkw's,Place (we believe Mr. Cobbett was not in the
at t tal ' agreed with the Hos. Aleneber in li.
Is motion,
'lath,' a"Y differed f 11. as to the principle of the re-
1. „
el, rom im
hate so ei," sr had he heard a speech which disappointed
ttra, tsaab as the speech of the Hon. Member for Old-
'late 'le said he was particularly entitled to address the
She' ause he had studied the subject ; nay more, no
I'L a v'tel Wade in the House which the Hon. Member
i'l,al'hteciaitn as his own.—(Hear, hear.) The Noble
Si'llilt 0- 'aid. had made a clever speech, but be had copied,
am 4441 him' in that respect, the Hon.Memkper for o,d-
-sr!trebed-aered from him, and, he believed, from all the other
r"s arta; for he had not yet beard anything fall from the
',is,. ale'
Which he envied, or which he was desnous
t4tir°Priating to himself.—(Laughter.) In his speech,
ti°s.Q4' Member had not infringed on the currency quebs-
Hoe' at'cl an ingenious young Member,
it
,titreney clueBti"who came into
Itt,
the :e while the Hon. Member was speaking, asked,
%,„I''"ing the navy
then,. over ? for the Hon. Member
estimates."—(Laughter.) On the
4tglte question
onYwhich the Hon.. Member was to
all lit tn the whole world, he had not said one word.h; and
Pared 'f'atl done was to produce his notes of a epees,
"tetitit, the the navy estimates.—(Hear, hear.) He wouldp
Zi4 'st-: ;11°0. Member said, to gold—he would have the
Ntgh„-°'ass-there was something so amiable in Royalty,
be pl'ot'a_ust see the coin—he would have none of the rot-
ir Q,,," money—and yet he consented to go into
.11. raeern,i,ttees But what was the remedy of the
vsal Gia""etnan ? Wbv he proposed to cut down, the.
`tt le es
of" the country to the scale of 1 s 92.
tQaqtty-eir Han. Member would have the dignity of the
kttc't he --kePt up' France must be kept in check. Spain
4111 . kept
in awe; and how was this power to be
of
attli4eit.44, .1
why, without any reference to the power
thatir",r.ta, by the establishments Of 1792. What
The 1/ 'ty l What would lie do with the Cape o
't
1-1,,,q* ? What would he do with the Mauritius ?
.4Pled; Gsntleman desctibed the war as one of unexi
tait i "as, and yet he complained that the number o
bltkialet4-,.! 'vat not tbe same as at its commencement. It
IL4ths, almost an insult to the House to show that it could
I dee, :' The Right HOD. Baronet then referred to
'Nal t4ant opinions of the Hon. Member for liosres-
Ns'•(Mrs Richards), d ) who would have paper money
ztei,ta bars of" larl
's ,f
NVolverhampton, who would
rtalt,,' the hurdenget°ll; or
on the land ; of the North
atelis' bar Yorkshisre rWilriv: would have a rise of prices;
Pqr•t''ra'ingham ' who, if he adhered to the plan
.pro-
-551,1 1-
r 18,17, would have* an unlimited depreciation ;
taii.,:d4fveter,-,‘,"_,Vin referred to these Hon. Members, he
q 4
s'ala
tbegy send
.these gentlemen into the Com-
t, fi
ts 'it tie ad a practical reme.dy for the distress ?
tbitl ,„.''ea When a patient was in a dangerous state
tigalt‘tiejrt'i to bring physicians to consult on his case
to Ro fr of decidedly opposite opinions ? Was Sangrade
1r leerrei°la Oldham and Luchille from Birmingham
4'itht over the dying patient.—(Hear, and laughtetr.;),
''','l(litin he laughable to suppose, but what must he l
i''tge-tli at the country in the mean time ? They
.were
;14ill'ihe, t° appoint a Committee to adjust the details of
;iPPoitte,-.'" on which they agreed ; but, while they were
'4(4 'lnt such a Committee to inquire into the causes of
e, stre,
4..4 to
.4 s the whole country would know that the object
' the "ePreciate the standard of value. And what would
sr ae,,,er), ateeuence of that ? Nobody would buy an estate
:are oring else. If every man who had a sovereign
.was
losid tetting twenty-two shillings for it in a short time,
44
q kit he take care of his sovereign? Be assured, an
ISPotiedePreciation
.could not. take place, except
.by some
'qv Power, which carried it into effect, while every-
t „ta, : .
,t'ee p',- in ignorance of its intentions.. To notify a
I,:r p',- in
was to cause inevitable ruin. Debtors,
d-a'asdb?-ase benefit the scheme was proposed, would be
Th
"iht .1: the creditors would exact their debts. Those
1441 iarlbeen contracted in wad ; and, dreading the 11-
°,t414.t-'41,, in naper, they would hasten to demand them in
t,11,1s i'quiti'y -and justice would be on their side as well
t.,,°alrlia-°: i they would recover their debts, and debtors
'hsa'lll-7ained. Whet, too, would be the result of a
t Role mercand on the banks? The deposits were. made
,;,°slts ;,,tbe depositors dreading the coming depreciation,
1,-'1 b :"tend back 'their gold, and the banks would
"e otta'ainea,..- Heer, hear hear.) No money would
Ike,. aced
•
00(
__ e .
no
theretempt mortgag ~ man could sell his
Dr l't to-i Would be no specul& ion—and the at-
k ~ktttd • ethe
t, qePreciat currency through the means of a
ts:i'q 04
aln_quiry would he
.tbe greatest curse ever in-
let acee. •"untry. He believed that. part of the distress
leti't't4ad''e,";d by the political excitement, which had
ehit,,tbkiv -"'"Y commercial undertakings. There were
The Bank
N 5 ,er I,;44great questions in suspense.
aioo aesetrrea,ndecided, the East India Company's charter
dam:" tceittitul and with all these great questions, if the
stead theor '0 suspend all other business by propagating
bes' °I cm !he standard of value ; if they ineant, ian.-,
hettte4e toanng the people, to give the suspension of
farl
elosetp\v, eoltitihenl as a remedy for political agitation,an
Coe) ieir tit he for them to terminate their labours
thed
to 4.4littee t tit be
for ever. Rather than appoint
better
the ll‘Olve
th° alter the currency, it would be far r
of
ti Praceedin'taaelves.--( Hear, hear.) The impo "ey.o3.
theire ,as reoa was as clear as its injustice, and its in
of
of eoestito manifest. If they had the interes
thentleh abao-eettt° St heart—if they considered the effects
- he ~,,°e. on the condition of the labouring classes,
Ree4l'es, their -,,,14 implore the Members before they
reorti vote
Prop, • !Ig the ' to weigh well the consequences of
but
iftettot
to (lnestion. It was mixed up with a plausible .
the d. ti4Y Iverelequire into the distress of the country.t;
of
thittreis
1, convinced, as he was, that this inquiry i
real cit, rvloo wouldaPosed merely to swell the numbersl
seal
was vote for the Committee, while the
th_%l7o, 1,2 h_ to effect an alteration in the monetary
sir duty
t:
disregard assert respectfully, but firmly, it was.
V the plausibility of the question, and
I

only contemplate the ruinous consequences which must
inevitably result from its being supposed in the country
that an alteration was to be effacted in the monetary sys-
tem by means of an inquiry into the distress of the coun-
t, v. " They owed"—it had been said by that great man,
Mr. Burke, whose writings were the most consistent,and
enlightened by the purest intentions, of all his contempo.
varies—who, of all other men, past or present, took a
more comprehensive view of the relation of the governors
to the governed, who saw the progress of things with a
clearer vision than any man since Lord Mean, and who
had laid down the doctrines in a most enlightened man-
ner which ought to regulate the respective duties of repre-
sentatives and electors—" they were hound," it had been
said, '' to sacrifice their repose to them, but not their de-
liberate judgm-nt. They were hound not to defer to the
wishes of the constituents, if they, in their deliberate
judgment, thought gratifying those wishes would injure
the people themselves." Why, he asked, were they
placed upon the mountain tr-p, if it were not that they
might take an enlarged view of all those interests of
society, Ns hich lay hid from those who were at
its base, and might pry into the future further than
other men?—(Hear, hear.) Theirs was no hied
agency; they were not to defer to the will of their con-
stituents, when that will was opposed to their own better
jwigment. They might depend upon it, that if they
acted upon their judgment, and resisted going into the
Committee, which might be likely to unsettle the cur-
rency—depend upon it, though they might suffer from
that in some instance-, though he did not believe they
would, if they rejected the plausibility of the motion, their
constituents would do them justice. All he could say
was, that if they were called upon to mike the sacrifice,
it would re.lound to their future pe ice to be enabled to
say that they had deliberated well and given a wel!-
weighed opinion. In the language of the immortal man
he had already referred to, they might say—" I wish to
be a Member of Parliament to have my share of doing
good and resisting evil. I deceive myself, indeed, most '
grossly, if I had not much rather pass the remainder of
my life hidden in the recesses of the deepest obscurity,
feeding my mind even with the visions and imaginations
of such things, than to be placed on the most splendid
throne." His constituents demanded sacrifices of that
great man—he had resisted the American war—he had
pleaded for the amendment of the criminal code—but
in one thing he would not; and let them now, after
the lapse of so many years, contrast his conduct with
that of others, and say which tile), most admired,
and which their countrymen would say was most worthy
of praise. That great man further said, that among his
many reflections, he could not reproach himself with
having neglected his duty, by acting on his own deliberate
judgment of what was most consistent with their perma-
nent interest; adding, " in every accident which may
happen through life—in pain, in sorrow, in depression
and distress—l will call to mind this consolation, and be
comforted." So he said to them, that if they sacrificed
the confidence of their constituents, they would be con-
soled by reflecting, with conscious satisfaction, that
they had done their duty. They might depend upon it,
that whatever sasrifices they might impose on them-
selves in doing justice to all, their constituents would in
the end do justice to their motives; and as they acted
from the purest motives, and fulfilled their real duties of
representatives, there would not be wanting those who
would always choose them to protect their permanent in-
terests.—(The Right Hon. Baronet sat down amidst loud

cheers.)
Colonel TORRENS rose amidst loud calls of " Ques-
tion," "Divide," and " Withdraw ;" and moved an
adjournment of the debate.

Lord ALTHORP put it to the Members, whether, after
so many Hon. Members had spoken, it was desirable
further to adjourn th• debate.—(Great cries of " Go on,"
and " Divide.")
Mr. M. ATTWOOD thought the debate could not
close to-night.

Mr. ROBINSON wished to address the House at some

length, and co did other Hon. Members, and he was for an
adjournment. —( Calls o I "Go on,""Divide," "Withdraw.")
Colonel TORRENS persisted in his motion for an ad-
journment of the debate, and the gallery was cleared for a

division. -
The House then divided—
Against the adjournment
For the adjournment_ 9B

Majority against the adjournment
_ _ _

O❑ re •entering the gallery, we found Colonel
TORRENS addressing the House.
Lord ALTHORP observed, that he was anxious that
the debate should terminate tomorrow ; and it was ulti-
mately agreed that the discussion should be resumed this
day, on the understanding that it was to terminate the
same day.
After disposing of the other orders of the day, the
House adjourned at three o'clock