The Sun.
London, England, 1833-03-15 00:00:00

been proved to be detrimental to health, and prejudicial
to the morals of the community. It had been agreed on
all bands, bath I.y masters, workmen, and the parents of
the factory children, that legislative interference had be-
come absolutely necessary. But the reasons of that
necessity were not so obvious. In the opinion of some
it was owing to the avarice of masters, in other cases it
was owing to the avarice of the workmen, and some
were of opinion that the necessity arose from both being
combined. He was not disposed to attribute it to either ;
in fact, the master manufacturers themselves in the neigh-
bourhood of Manchester, as had b-en shown by a petition
he himself bad presented, were in favour of a measure to
restrict the hours of the employment of the factory
children. He considered the necessity arose from the
nature of the system. None of the parties could do
any thing, in short, without the aid of the law.—(Hear.)
He trusted that the. Bill which had been brought forward
by the Noble Lord would receive the support of the House.
There were some points which in detail might be im-
proved, but he believed that it would generally give satis-
faction to the manufacturers and to the country at large.
After some observations from Mr. FINN, and an Hon.
Member whose name we could not ascertain, the petition
was ordered to lie on the tab'e.
MALT TAX.
Mr. GORDON presented a petition, numerously signed,
from the inhabitants of Aberdeen, praying for a revision
of tic duties on malt ; also from Huntly and Ravens-
' worth, for a repeal of the duties on soap; and from the
Presbytery of Aberdeen, praying for a better observance
of the Sabbath.

UNSTAMPED PUBLICATIONS.
Mr. LANIB brought up a return of the number of per
sons committed for selling unstamped publications, which
was ordered to be printed.
Mr. O'CONNELL, in postponing the motion for leave
to bring in a Bill to restore to the people of Ireland their
right and power to elect conservators of the peace in each
county at large, county of a city, and county of a town
in Ireland ; and to regulate the mode of such elections ;
and to declare and establish the authority of such conserva-
tives .s Justices of the Peace ; observed that it had been
thrown out as a reproach. that the Irish had consumed so
much of the time of the House, to the detriment of the
people of England. He c..nsidered that reproach had
been rather unworthily thrown upon the people of Ireland,
and as he felt convinced the course he intended to adopt
would he attended at ith the best results to all parties, he
should postpone his motion to a future day.
JEWISH DISABILITIES.
Mr. R. GRANT postponed his motion for leave to
bring in a Bill to remove the disabilities affecting all per-
sons prof seine the J-wish
ECCLESIASTICAL REVENUE.
Mr. D. W HARVEY d• ferret' his motion for an ad
dress to the Crown for a return from the Commissioners
appointed to inquire into the ecclesiastical revenue, to as-
certain the description and locality of each sep rate property
charged with any fee, farm, rery, pension, stipend, tenth,
and I` cher payments reset vel by leases,-other than rack rents
and redeemed land tax, Sp ,cifying the prroiabl- number of
acres and annual v due thereof, the tenure, the amount of
the fixed pa, merit, of whatever description, to which it is
subject, whether the leases were renewable upon lives or
years, and the customai y terms of ren• teal.
LIVERPOOL ELECTION.
Lord SAN DON was sorry nit to con-ider himself justi-
fied iu lid owing the example which had been set him by
several Hon. Members, by postponing his motion. Tee
object of his applies ion wee so uneortant that he did
not censoter himself at liberty in doing so. The
House would recoil ct that the object of his notice was
that partie* might have the opportunity of examining,
too; re the Committee to be app m end on the Liverpool
p' y couns, , the different witnesses brought forward
e 0 et, OW they !night tie heard by counsel. The Nome
Lord he:ieved that it was wallets, example the parties
against whom Mtll!!1 an applicatien had been made, should
not he at liberty to defend themselves by Citing-I.
(Hear, hear, bear.) The cross-examination of wit-
nesses could not be so well conducted by those
iin,trqu,inted with the art of cross-examination, as it could
be by Counsel, who were well versed in it ; and if the
Committi e, which was extremely probable, should extend
to any length, it would be utterly impossible for those
gentlemen who were not accustomed to such CemtniVees.
t. ar in mint fit so long a perio•l all the circumstances
which were connected with the case.—(Heir, hear.)
lie had also a petition from another party, requesting to
be head by counsel, which he would take an early oppor-
tunity of presenting to the House.
Mr. WASON said, that if the House entertained the
motion now before it, there was not a freeman in the
town of Liverpol who might not individually apply to
be heard by counsel before the Committee. It was not in
the power of the House acting judicially to giant the mo-
tion ; and he firmly believed ibis to be only the first of a
series of applications to prevent the inquiry being full, into
which they had been directed by the Huse.
Dr. NICHOLL sincerely hoped the House would grant
permission for counsel to examine the witnesses before the
Committee. He would much rather have the Honourable
and Learned Gentleman who had just now spoken,
to be himself present to examine the witnesses,
with his wig and gown as a feed barrister, and therefore
restrained to certain limits by the rules and courtesy of
the profession, than ha, e him sitting upon the Commit
tee with all the feelings of a violent partisan.—(Hear,
hear.) It had been said this inquiry would not List
long, hut there had been severe measures applied for, to
compel the attendance of upwards of 100 witnesses, and
if he, for instance, was one who might be appointed to
watch the proceedings of this Committee, to examine into
the relevancy of the questions and not the answers, then
to answer the whole altogether, it would be more than his
physical strength could undergo. This being a proceeding
that would affect upwards of 5,000 innocent individuals,
he busted the House would not hesitate to grant this
application.
Mr. WASON explained that at the meeting which took
place the other day, both when the Noble Lord and the
Hon. and Learned Gentleman opposite, were present,
it was considered that they should agree among them-
selves as to the time they might call up certain witnesses,
so as to make it convenient to all parties, and no objec-
tion to this line of proceeding was taken either by the
Noble Lord or the Hon. and Learned Gentleman.
Mr. O'CONNELL was quite confident there was one
point, at all events, in which the Hon. and Learned
Gentleman behind him (Mr. Nichol') had totally failed,
namely, that of showing there was any incapacity in him
to examine any witness that might be produced. Less of
a case of incapacity he had never heard or seen made out.
He thought that the appointment of nominees was for the
purpose of saving expense to the parties.—(Hear.) They
had already a double advantage, and he hoped the House
would not give them an additional advantage of employing
counsel, which would be the means of delaying the inves-
tigation and at a ruinous expense. It wms said that the
corporate funds were not to be used on the occasion, but
as the gentlemen of the corperation were charged with using
those funds to obtain their seats, he thought they could
not hesitate in using the funds to tnaintain their seats. It
was a case that called tor justice, and time House had done
every thing to give it. He, therefore, hoped that the
motion would he rejected.
Mr. W. WYNN said that, because he thought that
bribery was a great and heinous offence, he felt that a
p rry who was charged with it should have every facility
afforded him of making his defence. Even though he
might be convinced of the guilt of the accused, he would
not deny that person the right which every British
subject had of making his defence.—(Hear, hear.)
In all cases of Election Committees the parties were
allowed counsel, and from his experience on those (reci-
sions, he was of opinion that the employment of counsel
shortened the proceedings. It was said that nominees
were appointed, who were to be considered in Vie light of
counsel; bus it should be remembered that the nominees
were members of the Committee.
C lone' WILLIAMS said a Noble Lord had called that
tribunal (the Commirtee) an iniquitous one. The tri-
bunal and the criminals are therefore in that respect
alike. As to the assertion that the Corporation would
not employ the Corporation lunds, he would show
how they had already employed their funds. The Hon.
Member was proceeding to relate Vie proceedings in an
action in the King's Bench, when he was interrupted by
cr es of Question."
The SPEAKER intimated that the question was whe-
ther Counsel should be allowed to examine witnesses.
Colonel WILLIAMS froceeded to contend that he was
in order, e lien he was interrupted hy cries of " Question,"
and lie s.it down.
Mr. BENETT said the Noble Lord (Sandon) had hid
the Comtnotee appointed to his own pan, and he as
sure th it it was he understanding of the Ho is , t tat in ap-
pointing nominees they were to be in the nature of eoun-el.
The propoettion of the Noble Lord's nominee to adjourn
the pros edifies of the Commite e till of mr Eaver, would
produce by delay very great inconvenience, and an enor-
umus increase of unnecessary expense. L was impossible
to say, if the proposition were adopted, to what length of
time it might be protrateed. He had now for three
y, ass been endeavouring to unravel the col ruptioa of L-
verpool, with the view 01 purifying the repres trtation of
that borough. He had been put off, however, and his
obj ct had from time to time been defeated
by a variety of
expedients. It the prepositiun now made were aitoptei',
he bad no doubt the inquiry, at least, would be postponed