The Sun.
London, England, 1851-02-19 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT•

HOUSE OF COMMONS. Feb. 18.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at a few minutes before Fent
o'clock.
SUBMARINE TELEGRAPH COMPANY.
The Bill for this company was read a second time.
KING'S COLLEGE HOSPITAL BILL.
This Bill was read a second time.

SECOND READINGS.
The Mildenhall, Burnt Fen Road, Lakenheath and llwe oc k:
wold Roads Bill, and the St. Helen's Waterworks Bill, r'
also read a second time.
HASTINGS IMPROVEMENT BILL.

On the second reading of this Bill being put,
Mr. PIGOTT said that the corporation of 'lasting
were
anxious to carry as soon as possible this Bill; and bebtbereci
fore trusted that the second reading v. euld not be eloVser
ode
until the general Sanitary Improvement Bill bad been
tings
the consideration of Parliament. The corporation of Has
has taken every precaution to satisfy the requirements vms"
that Bill was intended to meet.
Mr. HOLLAND sincerely- trusted that the second readi
the
?
would be postponed until some further consideration f ,
matter. He would move that it be postponed fora to
so that the second reading should not be taken until the low
of March.

Mr. BRISCOE second
oed the motion. f the
Mr. FREWEN also posed the second reading o•
Bill, on the ground that it was opposed to the feelings 0f
the
inhabitants.
The House then divided, when there appeared--
9
For the amendment . •• •••
Against it ... ••• 20
Majo ordered the
The Bill was then tc.be reaTa second - °II
18th of March.
LONDON (CITY) SEWERS BILL.
This Bill was read a second time.
ST. PANCRAS (MIDDLESEX) PAVING 131-Tl'
On the second reading of this Bill being moved.
that"
Mr. CUBITT said that this was not the first time
gen-
had had to oppose this Bill. Several noblemen an" rsicts
tlemen had been appointed trustees of the leant
of the parish. They had at the beginning of the P`o, the
century borrowed money for the purposes of irnpreTirl%he
neighbourhood, which would be affected by this Bill. nt of
Southampton estate had been pledged for the rePsYrl this
that money, and it was therefore a consequence that
of Dec essity
B ill were to pass, great inconvenience must
wise. He should therefore move that this Bill be read ,
second time this day six months.
Mr. SPOONER seconded the motion. ositiost
Sir B. HALL regretted very much that this oPP on.
had been offered to the Bill. So far from the Bill beingferct
posed to the feelings of the inhabitants, it was ine of
consonance with them. It was backed by the names
one of the Members for the district and one of the fie pre
for the county. It was a fact that there were at tucionera•
sent time no less than seventeen boards of cantais!,.eot of
The roads were in a most miserable state, and the eteegt•
the Bill was neither more nor less than to obtain th.€, would.
of self-government for the parishioners. This 131"nrable
have the effect of gaining that benefit. The 11°11°,f the
Member for Andover (Mr. Cubitt) had talks dr :data-
Southampton estate, but he seemed to have ienosa,
that there was also the Somers' estate•
dts-
Somers-town was one of the most populous of the Dirsigued
tricts of London, and many thousands of persons ha ed that
petitions in favour of the Bill. He, therefore, hoPoll.
House would not countenance this opposition to the not
Sir R. INGLIS said that this Bill was neither 111°0 dor
less than an attempt to hand over the parishioners iodsa.
tender mercies of the select vestry of St.
pancras
no advantage could possibly arise from it, he hoped ;. ~ OPt ibe•
Bill wou
DUDLEY
be lost..end °it°
Lord STUART said that his Hon. r'opinion,
Member for the University of Oxford had, ia,,bismitho_t
quite misrepresented the state of the case. The mioew
that the whole of these seventeen boards of colao2l_,, od,
were paid boards, and the parishioners had to pay thet:,.den•
therefore, they now desired to be relieved from OLT, pe•
He asked them to do nothing more than read the feat Cora'
cond time, and send it for the consideration of a Se'
sirable
mittee.—(Hear, bear )
. de
Lord SEYMOUR thought it was exceeding. the 13111
~."'
that the House should pass the second reading 6`niffec_..om
He did not mean to say that the measure 11/83,/
itas
itself as it stood, but it could be amended or at•)
removed when it got into Committee.—(Hear'
The House then divided, when there appeax^-46
For the amendment ***
Against it ... ••'
Majority '**
The Bill was then read a secondiime.... gBrL
SEVERN STEAM-TUG COMPAN

This Bill was read a second time.
PETITIONS.
11fr. C. HINDLEY presented a petition fr°l3l 61
Mht°ll-
under. Lyne praying for a repeal of the paper duties; je ;
'Il
Mr. POWER presented a petition from a Place-asure„,d.
county of Cork deprecating the passing of anY ber
terfering with the religious liberties of any class °'
jesty's subjects. naolll.
Similar petitions were also presented from ado llasr-
Dublin by Mr. Reynolds, from Dundalk by Mr.
and from Tipperary by Mr. Scully. gt. Ad*l"
Mr. C. LUSHIN'GTON presented a petition fraln ' the
Westminster, praying for the unconditional repeal °
dow-duty. .1 unions
Mr. COBDEN presented petitions from gavel' -fuumni"--
Yorkshire praying for the establishment of countY
boards.
pienbar!'s Land praying that no more
Sir WM. MOLESWORTH presented a PetititTlf)reomsenTtliztp"
trail*"

that colony. -
Mr. HUDSON begged to give notice that
SHIPPING INTEREST. ola °
b they i t iglis
Friday ask the Chancellor sent WV . ,
his intention to remit any of the duties at pre 0_....0
a petition ctnbip.
on the shipping interest • and present
w borne by Jo
ing of hardships and losses •
which are no.
owners, of the Exchequer,
bring
wbt -
00a

on i‘'hiri.s TIIE REVENUE.
11mIAotCioGnRwEGithORregsapNe-cetnototictehteharetvhe
fortnight. tic''
THE WINDOW-DITTIES. f the ,
Sir B. HALL gave notice, that in the event of bon°,
vernment persevering in the attempt to imPose .. the OA°
tax in lieu of the window-tax, he should more thm•
be extended to Ireland. IN, a
SHIPOWNERS' CHARGES IN DUBL an 05
Mr. REYNOLDS gave notice that he should, ono, the air
day, present a petition praying for the remission the Or
wise and unjust charges which were imposed urn .04
builders tio.-
builders and shipowners of the port of Dublin. the 0)
enusehouaiildtantoti; der
Sir R. INGLIS suggested that the terms of ' „h
ought to be altered. . , to '04,,-;
Mr. REYNOLDS said that he had no objectio ect to "b,
draw the terms "unwise and unjust" with resPto opt
charges, it being understood that he believed then
ht 0
RAJA OF SAYEARA. cnrteig- tea
Mr. ANS rEY gave notice that on that day
resel•
should call the attention of the House to a petition Pose, rela•
on the 14th instant by the Hon. Member for Wiltr
tive to the claims of the ex-Raja of Sattara.
SAVINGS BANKS. he W
, „f t ia
Mr. SPOONER wished to ask the Chancelicl - bring '
chequer if it be the intention of the Government •
too boo,
during the present session any Bill relating to to nitr°l;
and if so, whether the same, or a similar Bill to toiarvent
duced by the Government in the last session of rgid it 1:
The CHANCELLOR of the E `FIEQL. 5- avin
NC tof 8 hit
his intention to introduce
a Bill on the subjec i
‘f whea
banks, but at present he could not name "aj
would bring it on. tli et
BRITISH MUSEUM. State Wl3e tho
Mr. HUME wished of at
to ask the Secretary aril ° the
any and what measures have been taken tc respecting
recommendation of the Royal Commission
co
future
,management of the British Museum.
under the ueo
Sir G. GREY said subject 0 now ~,,e0 La*
the jvr
had yet be
e°
of
n Government, but no steps
i'
sioners• •og
to carry out the recommendation of the Corn
mtto the /t
ofie
Mr. HUME gave notice that he should
object the Bo
_ any public money to the British Museum
had a report on the subject. STS• ell '4ll
WOODS AND FORE d John R°s3 til°
Viscount k Lor 3
DUNCAN wished to 3' • Ws it W 4 f the
I•;stittla seg o
which number of the Miscellaneous e exPeP
intention of the Government to include th
;,-,c hided
ould 10
royal parks? be
Lord J. RUSSELL said the expense w
No. lof the Miscellaneous Estimates. NA for Ire'
GRAND JURIES IN IRELA. retary,„.o.o..
Mr. HIGGINS wished to ask the Chief Seesty's or' tilts.
land whether it was the intention of her Mn.l„or the reg
ment to introduce any measure, this session, ' •,:l the
tion of grand juries in Ireland? rePll 1
Sir W. SOMERVILLE was understood to
negative.

s Wl'icll
GOVERNMENT BILLS.
Sir GEORGE GREY said, as there were ressonwith his
made it inconvenient for him to proceed to•riiglites of P,„.rc,
Bill for amending the law relating to the ei..l:ld-0"'-
sheecsuhtoiounids,
paonsdtihwinseStilllefnolrutnhteurteom.rnovoarlroo.Sra:sov_,
COMMISSION TO INQUIRE INTO .1-' fth°
UNIVERSITY. •0 o a
Mr. KEOGH inquired whether it was the intetiti°bers Oa
Government to introduce any Roman Catholic rael,irs 1130
management of the Dublin University, ilit 4
present consisting only of Protestants
sLiorrdE.J.BIutUXSTSOENLL replied that he was at present ri°
postpone his motion condition to say how the c9mmission was COmPesecL
SUGAR DUTIES. . ,entiori,t;,,°
day fortnight. ongraevgeanrcloitniege tthheatsiut;ro-Vieisn' tiliiii IP'

assimilatingmit te
e
Mr. P. SCROPE, in rising to move that a Select p°,l
5c0tia",,,,,,010,'
Ireland, appointedtepoor-latwes ceofnsidEenrgiatnhdet ext, ,_,,d, ,
and promoting the productive `lcoibing
ment of able-bodied paupers, said he knew' anY i°.;
he could say would induce the HOUSE to determine 1 yift
thereforsel,ioes.,
stract proposition on the great question, end,
that he asked the House to inquire into and consideftutZose•
tion, and report the result of their deliberations to 1n71,-tion $
He might be asked why he introduced iuto the Irfiy,,tbe
subject apparently not immediately connected witb idt.',l'd so -f'-'l.
best form of relief to the able-bodiefl poor, but be 'I the
this reason—that the main difficulty' onnectLode At
poor in England, Ireland, and Scotland Was tide'. 'chi'
present existing- of relieving the able-bodied Poi().r, wstlY,
poor-law had always been considered,
the most voluable of our ancient institutions, becaufootry•
of the C Da e 4"
it depended the peace, order, and tranquillity
The poor-law was introduced into Ireland in 1837' 3,1 in itg
tended greatly in 1847, but it was not yet assimilate t point
mode of operation to the English oor-law. The gre3elief ici
and be thoug_": upon
of difference was the enormous disPiarit , a out-door r ,iiet;
door
s'ojie,
the two countries. In Ireland therei was noont-d
in Ei:gland 7-Bths of the relief was out- relict ; ,rbere
to go farther, in Scotland there was no in-door raliel.'wittioat
was also great difference in the mode of levyingl,af— t 6,le°
pronouncing which was the best, be W.,' liftaali'"
why there should not be one uniform sYsteu4 '

tilt , with respect to the management of the poor, he
ir,s,lit it would be better to leave that entirely to the
,`railed`!lities. In England and Scotland that principle
il., and why should not the principle be applied
tt'':_e to Ireland?—(llear, hear.) It would be much
.4s)r._ consonant tu justice if they were to make the
ttrZlni übnii.orin in the three countries. Doing; so would
hi,
main y ein keeping with our usual coarse of legislation..-
lerestw.er.eason for making this motion was the deep in
tnent to b the lower classes had in this matter, and the
Lego .0 which their welfare was affected. This was his
I)l74ctitor desiring that the laws of the several countries
lielin„ be assimilated. If they did not pass sOtitle that
,il'asore as he had proposed, the consequence would. b
(itorLu. Pauper population of Ireland would be driven to
am
.relief from the poor-rates of this country.—(Hear, hear,
thoBa!r,°flieel cheers.) He hardly knew how to understand
fact
,;Lheers of the Irish Members ; but it was an ascertained
Taiieflo!it great numbers of that population had been sent
ho t
tlii, w`l3 the poor-rates of England ; and seeing t a
were,lll: the case, and that the poor of this countyy
lianaberred from marrying lest they should
.increase thef
,I,her),e,rs; Borne reason would seem to serve if
.the state o
zhe—f';ll'ltion in Ireland was worse than in this country.
,relief -,,.et eras, that in England the persons receiving
'went -!re one in forty ; in Scotland it was one in
SI t,Y"ght, while in Ireland it was only one in sixteen.
in "1. 'was it from. being a fact that the Irish people were
Part hiret" destitute condition than those of any other
of t
n eountr3-.
an a th 0x• MEXIISP. then moved that the House be counted,
a, iirritrilreie being only 27 Members present, the House

tu
Ther4 ROUS F
axceteoit toE O LORDS, Feb. 18.
nrtly )Ito enok his seat on the Woolsack
1 retorter Rive o'clock.
13)•1EiatisIANLEY presented a petition, numerously. signsed.
boil
~,,ftners in the county of Devon, praying for the impoi
ortioei"`
for duties on agricultural produce and otherb.
reticle,,
lut a revision of the navigation-laws, and for an a
lita,,qa the laws regulating the currency.
t4l)l','f. ittlui' of LANSDOWNE laid several papers on the
Ttl,,°r,-- House.
1)4 ~uke of PICHII ND presented two petitions against
1'441. agg'ressiun‘ 0 °aAarhinpstla'inthinegadmission ot Jews into
arrleat, and s'eveureal of agricultural distress.
The Erna
OF THE LANDED INTEREST.
/arioe f RARDWICKE presented 40 petitions from
bad I:ners complaining of agricultural distress. It
alto oates contended that because this House was composed
tc) ecitisively of landed proprietors they were ill fitted
.ve '4:lnsider the subject. He considered that for that
TontYaid_teasen they were peculiarly well fitted for.t , thend
we.beeriabon of this subject, inasmuch as the prosperity and
tent ele;llfi of this country and its constitution depended p.
Apr the tenance of the landed interest. When the motion
Were t LePeal of the corn-laws was brought forward they
4s!olthal3;l,there would be no great importation of foreign corn,
.v thefc..Yrepealing those laws they would, without damage
Tcoone- 'nterests, be e+ tins rid of an obnoxious impost, the
he'Pletleafitteheisf whichgraigh. t, in times of scarcity, exc.te the
el would country against the landowners—that, in fact,
11t,,, be giv
tr th`" fallatione. Lialk• up nothing. Those assurances
.had
..iste would admit that the condition
hitt tLPe':', Plc generally had improved, and was prosperous,
1;414 e,,411,
decl interest was distressed, and he wouldas k
RVeliWth- tuic foundation for the assurance which had been
ry. 'eta that th' d e-sion would be merely tempo
tb The . . 13 epr .
14‘atet Petitions which he had to present declared that
he4B.; , 4%4,4_11 Persons connected with land was one of dis-
-11,-‘co 1, - 'nould quote, in proof of this, the statements
Lilo op , had received from several pe.rsons detailing the
0111 u'ml and approaching destitution under which. the
,-.`"'t eAt' -'ners and occupiers of land in Cambridgeshire and
Avi,„ -, unties laboure and the state of destitution of the
et,
r) aitur..,
va„.“l labourers; but he laboured under this
tit,l4t-ril;eag,e, that in quoting these statements he was
ty.le Le.r'Y to give the names of his informants. The
st .t3h. 01 then proceeded to read at great. length, ex-
:'+'e em various letters which he had received, describing
11;1 erlettl,ilto_tricts in Cambridgeshire and. Lincolnshire as being
, this of lef great distress. In spite of the represensta
i sus
tue encouraging state of the poor, there wa
- '"inz ; "healthy sate of the agriculturists. They were
s
,141th„-PPorted out of the capital instead of the profi.t,-
/qtlii'lll'' and land. There was one argument which
%tch '`4 specialnotice,namely, the prosperous state an
,i, 00
oils' 1,; 11. of one class would react upon another. That.
tltitije-'inallY the fact; but now, when one-fourth of the
L''4t .„.- 131.°(111ce consumed was brought in from abroad,
end,, .was
not the case. Before, when the harvest was
0074,:t-eq,Pir..ice relieved the distress, but that was not so
4, 'led ti.`„"_?. quantity and average price of wheat im-
I (tout I,ung the last three years would show. the dis-
ka theca'`, it must produce upon agriculture. In
lbk„.
'l/oquantity of wheat flour imported was
,849
e iit, luarters, at 58s. 6d per quarter. In 1849
o.pertillt'LY imported was 4,822,000 quarters, at 445.
i. ,
58
Os 4 quarter; and in 1850 the quantity imported
„,,
csieek 5,0 .0 quarters at 40s. per quarter. The
7 ‘ltell 41:14 had felt themselves obliged to us for having
liikhett stimulus to their agriculture beyond. their..
lh, no It,l,c"ceptions. The vast quantities of their ini
'No ."'h the returns showed, afforded a striking in-
Nisi of the way in schich the Americans said we had
fs:zatel their markets. There were other points in
t 'ea%
qn, to the effect upon America of our present sys-
-44,4114 generally known, that was, it was possible for
6141toerlicatul to supply wheat to this country, sad
It
ei' v ()as by it.—(Hear, hear.) It was in this way:to
ihlr't e'lle,is tl°ed to sail to this country in ballast, h
Mail
otthhoe.aty
l'l3'4l,74Lw)%iah was great, but now, instead of ballast
ink.i% „I, 1.-4 with corn. They could, therefore, afford to
.44ttlie,,..4.17.vePrpersith a bought it. This was described.
li 4=a selling 2 1850. The Americans
141. • a quarter lesstli 3,i,ntroduced into this country
bought it for in America.l
cornn Jan.tbs so introduced
kik! cat" Over here, and were selling corn for ess
~,Itet,, Y than they bought .t.—(Hear, hear.) Had such a
hshei 0,..f, things everheeln met with before?--(Hear.)
' It ( w"re told that they must not carry on agriculture
,q it eY do now.
itt t They were told by a leading organ
'' Ife \ Press that they must grow garden stuff.—( A
I'll,oo4'yr bid they ever bear. such rubbish? Did any
" sr,, rd ever make anything by his kitchen garden?
OF
tgain the
ow %not, , very attempt to introduce the cultivation..in
I eki , uer crop would be attended with di -
Itk a%'-. Itnot easy to turn the minds
C Iljeell to wasi•are any
.other description of crops.
1 ity ...57 4tterapted the cultivation of flax for instance,
41 at,'")llld have great difficulty. The farmers would
It -got, .
3' 10 ha now to raise this crop. It was easy to
;,4'11,0 don't you grow something else? But they
13'1v.;13)," let them grow many things. How did they
1.1141 b-at they could not grow tobacco? The answer
11,,c: ,cla will have foreign tobacco in upon you. But
4POttep.; theY know that? Then, again, the malt-tax
111.41 l';' ''Pon them great difficulties. It was a most op-
tolible'it .11,,t4x•—(1.1ear, hear.) They had hitherto been
s
44 .41,„t'''''' a good description of barley at 30s. It wa
." R4:1131-tan inferior sort, but they had always been able
rte 1t it for something. This year it was worthless.
Liti 1, of second-rate quality had been wholly dis-
nie ''' which even in the present state of depression
d h
kid t• Itve fetched 6s. or 7s. a uarter. But it was
1 146 Ph‘sresent state of agricultural depressione could
o
fdr,r'tfiap4tpia -..cause it was said that the chief supplies cam
i ~,,.4% so tiale,iel, Which country was not able long to
_pro-
, 'e th 'etl.----(flear.) He suspected. that it migh b
4ry're ie't they would get no grain from_ Frrance
At
4teueh ',.°l,r3g. but they would get plenty of flou
-rll' of .Ters was a steam-mill erected, with. a hundred
..(11.6ig -,„.°l3es, prepared especially for grinding
t5.,e446-1111w7,41tet• That seemed to him to be a fosotrfrotrnhoga.
rivinz F3' they had the prospect before t
I 'hheemgeneral
uttlaue-0 -r(lcla prance a steady supply .
14'31144f t°,4illterests as between the agricultural and
ria„'Etteaca,ll.'ng interests, was not favourable to thei.f
-te :Ire te- a return f the wealth of the United I ingdom
Of Proije`ratbtli_spiFatusome years ago. The total value of
25,0 that tirleu, the separate interests was 450,000,0001.
of °agricultural property was
Itgatiti(l)°'°°°l• Fromaii the year 1840 to 1851, the value of
4tirte natures had increased to 11,406,0001. They had
.1!"14 a tin, With the proposition that they should improve
Zeller° 11;"4„ of theop several interests in this country
. ::tidati4; eow, how did the agriculturists stand? I.t
%,,ttlt, 1eP,,,,' a bad d estimate if they asserted that agri-
ie-"414 el"PertY had fallen in value 10 per cent. That
man
them, as compared with the increase_
!Itlte-4telotaeturing wealth, a decrease in thoes
Lt 46,000 cLagricultural property to the amount
be
411'ed,t, „ Was that fair? Where, it might
k.'"er 'pal the wealth gone to? It had gone n0.►41
.►41 re; -,4eir exports had not so much improved as
i ttirree Year. as would appear by a comparison with
here 1.1„64. Take cotton, for instance. In 1815 there
183e-P°lted 68,230,000 yards of manufactured cottbon.
!*as Oe there Were 74,000,000 yards exported. T. at
P°l74 rh°r° they received provisions from Americaf.
:pads eaa Years 1842 to 1846 the average number o
`nee k Ported was 37,135,000. Therefore, with all
itrci thee, they were still very much behind. Now,
4/11:1oet ad they been doing in Europe? If they took the
%tittle's from Russia, Holland, Belgium, and France, t aos
i ear 1846 With the imports into those countries up to h
'tlt vie-'6, and then looked at the returns for the follow-
lettist°, the result would not be favourable to the
*ere /rears. Therefore, with all they had done, they
Itc'airl 0°617 much behind. They were told that.thereo_
~t h 1 sort, lit reciprocity; but there had been nothing
..1
_eißti i.s" The gain had all been on the part of the fo
;4%4%1 s_,ad the loss our own. He asked, what did they
iskt Carr)?°Lit' Why did they not go on with their.l9y..-
ea el it out? H they carried out their princi
„he lY they could not get a revenue.—(Hear, hear.)
than `aadget yesterday showed that more strongly
fuseh '4l3' he had ever seen. The imposition of a
f ta3t Was not likely to satisfy the country. It would a itt hett
de •er that there should be some decided mode of
sous .t With the land There were five classes of per-
-1 seatedkna . •
the e etob,.. in land. The landlord, h occupier, the
(14er:,r, the poor, and the Chancellor of the Exche-
'4Pt the The receipts of all these had been reduced ex-
Wll4 relast• Rent was coming down—the occupier
`.sotieq-ceo almost to destitution—the tithe-owner was
et ths. Capp the wages of labour were reduced; and
', (14-arkn demanded the same amount of revenue.
Zate aiLrtear-) He thought it was easy for them to
's ter" su°w, and represent the prosperous steAte of
Dte,f,t-leilitural interest, as any one might do who was
11sIttititt4rinylialldeodrotoods,uppose ho was looking upon a fabric
but that was only on the outside.
tlitiotWts not a true representation of the state and con-
hilllng °Erothe agricultural interest which is now a strug-
:oo4 h•-" oPpressed interest. The owner was living
'lttirt, hie ial, and was not enabled to earn that just
tIP°II th:r outlay which he was compelled to make
Lord ®obit
ttli,Poll 116 Clith,ANVlLLE7complimented the Noble Lord
0-4„6., Pr t'"? sPeech. The Noble Lord had alluded to
-r"rati°`-eeles which bad been indulged in as to the
thounau of the free trade. Many of them, no doubt,
PrieerVhat there would be an immediate reduction of
Woe) 0,..'w, if there be anything more difficult to tell
d another if
it is to say what the price of any article
~tokia 1,1,,1tt altY given time.—(Hear, hear.) He bad
free tra-riteeticni of prophecies being indulged in that
cal are would have the effect of throwing land out of
)the it 1...°11 made abourers out of employment. But
lio was out last year to the satisfaction of the
Use_ 1..
Zas era'
puiyoyreeprils wenthe subject, that the labourer
4,41 0,,,h,
to they told by Noble Lords that that
;77..! vved i f -urde .
Wait i I ccf
oird e ns i
zt a 1 circumstances, and that if
Months they would see
erect State of tbingsf--(Uoar, bear.)

4N