The Sun.
London, England, 1834-05-14 00:00:00

1.5,536

13,593,110
True population :3,597,1b7

Error of the average 4,077
Thus it appeared the minimum was 100 ; the maximum
was not 1,000 ; the average number of entries in the year,
then, would be thirty-five. He had constructed a table of
births and of deaths ; and he had ascertained that there
were three per cent. of births to the population, and two
per cent. of deaths. Therefore this gave an average of
five per cent. of entries of both deaths and births upon the
population. There was a less per centage of marriages on
the population. From Rickman's estimate of baptisms,
registered and unregistered, it appeared that the proportion
was 1 in 34 ; the proportion of births deduced from the
table of mortality, formed from Rickman's table of burials,
was 1 in 334 ; the births might therefore be taken at 3 per
cent. ; the deaths are nearly 2 per cent. : the marriages
1 in 128 ; births and deaths 5 per cent. on 13,897,187-
694,859, nearly 700,000; marriages, 110,000-810,000.
Now, the parishes in which there was the largest amount
of population, were not the greatest in extent. In some
the population were scattered over a large surface. The
number of officers accordingly required for parishes, with a
population above 10,000, would not be so great in pro-
portion as would be required for parishes with a population
below 10,000. Therefore he had only to deal with the more
populous parishes ; there would be no difficulty in providing
proper officers, and paying them ; but the difficulty of a
general registration was to provide, say twelve thousand
officers for the various parishes throughout the country,
and thus put an end to any project which should have for
its basis the actual appointment of officers for the purposes
of registration. The next question was, how were officers
to be provided to answer the purposes of the bill ? His
opinion was, that the best way would be to take the pre-.
sent machinery which existed in all parts of the country,
which would only entail upon them a small additional ex-
pense. England and Wales were already divided into dis-
tricts, for the more convenient collection of the taxes.
The number of these districts was 190. In every parish
and township in England and Walesthere were an assessor
and collector. In general the arrangement was, that he
who was the assessor one year was the collector next; but
in many instances both offices were united in one person.
Now it appeared to him (Mr. W. Brougham), that if the
collectors of the taxes were made use of for the registra-
tion of births and deaths, and were allowed a small per
centage in addition to their salaries as collectors, there
would be this advantage from the management, that part
of the machinery already in existence for the purposes of
the state could be made available for this, without
subjecting the country to any material additional ex-
pense. His proposition, then, was to make
in the collec-
tor of taxes in every parish and township England
the registrar of births and deaths. He proposed pro-
riding him with books and duplicates of sheets of
paper for the purpose. The entries would have to be
made in the duplicates of the sheets of paper, and also in
the books. One of the sheets, with the entry made, he
would give to the clergyman of the parish the first time he
met him, and the other would be transmitted to the gene-
ral office in London. The entries would be likewise made
in the large book, which, for its more safe custody, would
be deposited in an iron chest in the church, provided for
the purpose. When this book was full of names, it could
be transmitted to London. The reason why he preferred
putting the books under the care of the clergy in preference
to dissenting ministers was, that the parish churches af-
forded a greater security for their safe custody. It might
be said that dissenters might have conscientious scruples to
apply to the clergy of a church from which they differed
in opinion. He did not see that they could have any tena-
ble objections to making such application ; but if so, they
could apply to the office in London, where no such reli-
gious differences could by possibility interfere. The next
question for consideration was, how were the officers to be
paid? In those districts and places where the population
were but limited, the entries would be but few ; and in
order that their duty might be performed in an efficient
manner, he would propose that their remuneration should
be greater than in populous places. If not sufficiently
paid, it would be found in a short time that the registrars
would perform their duty in a defective manner. He,
therefore, thought that the best plan would be to give
them a certain per centage for every entry they made.
The scale which he had fixed on, after expending much
care and calculation on the subject, was the following :—ln
each of the first ten entries he would allow 55., for each of
the next ten 2s. 6d., and for all above twenty Is. The
general result of this scale would be as follows :

£ 0. d. .. £. s. d.
1,907
4,774
3,12!
,034
, 567 -, 2 4OO or 120
12.9 places, above 1,,100 supplied
with 150 registrars, each hav-
ing 22,000 or 11,000 entries...s7 15 0 ...... ... 8,662 10 0

69,583 7 6
The sum total of the fees which this registry would cost
the country would be 69,5801. This was but small when
it was recollected that 12,000 officers, being one for each
parish, were to be paid for their services out of it. He
now came to the question as to what would be the best
way of raising this sum. It had been suggested that it
would be the most advisable way to pay it out of the Con-
solidated Fund, as the general complaint was, that rates
were already, too large, and that it should not be paid out
of them. Ile (Mr. W. Brougham) had an objection to
the payment of the amount out of the Consolidated Fund,
because if paid out of the rates, as he humbly conceived it
ought to be, each registrar would receive it from the hands
of the parish-officer, who, as he had an interest in making
the entries as few as possible, would take care that no im-
proper entries were made ; while the registrar, having an
interest in making the entries as numerous as possible,
would see that none were omitted that ought to be made.
In this way they would act as a check on each other. The
expense would he very trifling. Assuming the number of
families in England and Wales to be what had been given
in the last census—namely, 2,182,400, the amount which
each family would have to pay yearly for the registry would
be only sd. each. ( Hear.) This was a mere trifle, and
he would, therefore, propose, that the expenses
of the Registry Office should be paid out of
the rates, and that each registrar should be paid by the
parish officer. With regard to the London office, and the
expenses which would be necessarily incurred by it, he thought
the general registrar should be an under-commissioner of
taxes ; and that, as he held that office, a salary of 5001. or
6001. would be sufficient. It would, of course, be neces-
sary to have clerks under him, but the amount of their
salaries would be but trifling. With respect to the Lon-
don office, it had been suggested to him (Mr. W. Brougham)
that entries might be sent up to him from the country,
written in a legible hand ; and that, therefore, to insure
accuracy, it would be proper to have them copied over in a
plain hand into a volume, before they were forwarded to
the metropolis; perhaps the suggestion was worthy. of
adoption. These were the principal ideas he entertained
on the subject of a registry of births and deaths. The
question now was, how the objects he had stated could be
,completely carried into effect. He was aware that it was
not possible, as in France, to compel people to forward a
statement of the births and deaths which occurred in their
families ; at the same time, he must say he saw nothing
like the prospect of a perfect registration, if left to the
voluntary principle. His duty was to make his bill as per-
Sect as possible ; and, therefore, he would propose that the
talacyctsireto the
rs of be
of any birth o
equiredtogive nor death thattiee,‘vithin may
three
.)acichunrgvitiothdion
stoh,eti rhepyr eamh
oi suelsd;
be
danthat, t into tahepeenvaelntyt ooff_thseaiyr
40s. which the judge could either modify or depart from
fromf
mu
bdna ecebgc a sei
dges
ueinmlntyaepleel
negligence, it
as
trotcr ucwpemoadsas.st
He
possible.
would
oonurßttl uadhntepeirefeoa
stpthoheesa,too iftnht ihaas
that
birth,to
ee a rn aeol
en-
tries altogether, provided he thought the omission had occurred
would
strhioe
suffice to give the time, the sex, the names of the
parents, and where born. In the case of death, the name
and residence of the deceased, and the time the person
lied. He would not propose that any penalty should be
,nflicted on those who would give false information. Hi-
herto he had spoken only of births and deaths ; he now
same to marriages. He knew it would be inconvenient
for the registrar to move about and watch every marriage
that took place in populous places, and there would, be-

siees, be great danger of losing the book. He therefore
proposed abandoning that part of the plan. He thought
it would be sufficient if the celebration of a marriage were
inserted in the marriage record, at the time it took place,
by the Roman Catholic priest, the Baptist minister, •or
other dissenter, by whom the ceremony had been performed.
With regard to the church of England, he wished mar-
riages to be continued on the same footing as that on
which they stood at present. In the case of the Jewish
child, the name first given need not be the same as that
given at circumcision. Any expense attendant on the
plan would fall only on the upper classes. It was but a
trifling fee at the registry, which, as the humbler classes
seldom changed from the first name, would not affect them.
To introduce the measure to the public, a printed formula
of the manner of proceeding would be left at each house
by the tax-gatherer, and thus accustom, and perhaps even-
tually induce a full compliance with the regulation. He
would then move for leave to bring in a bill to establish a
registry of all births, marriages, and deaths, throughout
England and Wales.
Lord ALTHORP said the plan of the hon. and learned
gentleman had been explained in a very clear and intelli-
gible manner, and it appe-.red to be one which held out a
greater promise of Success than any which had been before
Proposed. The expense, too, did not appear to be so great
as in any of the other plans which had been suggested,
and, bi having the details attended to, would be likely to
be useful. To the general, principle of the measure there
would be no objection; but he was not satisfied how that
Portion would be accepted which compelled communica-
tion with the clergy. With regard to the practicability of
the measure, he concurred with the hon. and learned
gentleman ; and on application being made at the Tax-
"Mee, Mr. Wood was of opinion that the measure could be
adopted without disadvantage. , Any other observations
which lie (Lord Althorp) had to make, he would reserve
until the measure came more regularly before the house.
Mr. MARSHALL supported the motion.
Mr. BAINES also approved of it, and thought it free
from the objections which lay to the measure proposed by •
Lord John Russell.

Mr. PETRE said it would give satisfaction to the class
With which he was connected.
Mr. WARBURTON thought the name of the tax-
gatherer would prove obnoxious. Some people were of
opinion that there would shortly be no tax-gatherers, as
there would be no taxes to collect, and he saw no objection
to providing them with this new employment. ( A laugh. )
Sir G. STRICKLAND, though he had paid close at-
tention, thought some parts of the plan were imperfectly
made out. Unless great attention was paid at the office in
London the plan would fail. The hon. baronet instanced
a case in which ecclesiastical parchments forwarded through
the Post-office, the postage not being paid, had accumulated
to such a degree as rendered it necessary, for convenience,
to commit them to the flames.
Mr. PorTEK and Mr. WlLics approved highly of the
plan, applauding the industry which was exerted upon it,
and eulogizing the principle on which it was founded.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL concurred in its approval, and
said, that if any sacrifices were to be made, they were such
as the country ought to undergo, for the benefit which
would be conferred by having the present imperfect system I
done away with. (Hear, hear.) In that nart, however,
which related to marriages, he did not think sufficient se-
curity, in the way of publicity, was provided against im-
proper ones; but this was an objection which could easily
be provided against in committee.
Mr. BROUGHAM replied—As to the apprehended
danger from the transmission by post he had sufficiently
provided, as he proposed to adopt the plan used in the tax-
office.

The motion as then agreed to.
Sir T. TROUBRIDGE obtained leave to bring in a
bill to alter and amend the laws respecting Cinque Port
Pilots.

Mr. NICHOLL moved for leave to bring in a bill de-
claring illegal the continuance of the Glasgow Lottery
beyond the third drawing, proposed to take place on the
22d of July next, or any addition to the number of tickets
comprised in the scheme thereof already announced.—
Granted.

Mr. GUEST moved that a select committee be ap-
pointed to consider how far it may be practicable to di-
minish the number of houses and apartments now occupied
by public officers, and others, at the public expense; with-
out detriment to the public service.
The following committee was then appointed :
Gu, st, J. J. lElliot, Captain Stanley, E.
Russell, Lord J. Aglionby, H. A. Romilly. E.
Hume, Joseph Fszakerley, J. N. Hawes, /3.
Lowther, Viscount Divett, E. Colborne, R.
Ewart, W. Ma,,erly, W. L. Hutt, W.
Dillwyn, 1.. W. Gisbilrne, 'l'. Rumbold, C. a
'fenny on, C. Verney, Sir IL Walter, J.
Ord, %V. Hall, B. Yorke, Captain
Wabini, R.

The report of the Bribery at Elections Bill was brought
up, and ordered to be further considered on Friday next.
The other orders of the day were then disposed of, and
the house adjourned at a quarter-past two.

COURT OF KING'S BENCH, MAY 13.

ST. MARTIN'S SELECT VESTRY.-SIMPSON V. HOLROYD

AND OTHERS.

This action to try the right of the selc-Jt vestry in
the parish of St. Martin in the Fields Wil:3 continued
this day.
Lord DENMAN, having read through the whole of
the evidence, left the jury to consider whether this
select vestry had continued from the earliest time,'
namely, the reign of Richard the First. If they
should find it had continued from that time, the de-
fendants would be entitled to their verdict.

The Jury retired from the box, and on their return
negatived the validity of the select vestry by finding a
verdict for the Plaintiff.

The decision was hailed by the ,opposers of the
select vestry with apparent satisfaction. Many evinced
their joy by clapping their hands.

SHERIDAN RAPHAEL.

This action was brought by Dr. Sheridan, to re-
cover 101. for an address to the electors of West-
minster, written for the defendant, who was desirous,
some time since, when it was expected Sir F. Burdett
would be called to the peerage, of standing as can-
didate for the honour of representing the city of
Westminster in Parliament.

The jury, after hearing evidence, found a verdict for
he defendant.

COURT OF COMMON PLEAS, MAY 13,

Sittings at Guildhall before the Logo CHIEF JUSTICE
and a Common Jury.)
EICHE v. NOKES.

This was an action brought to recover the amount of
an attorney's bill of costs. The only question was
whether the plaintiff had complied with the statute
which regulates the delivery of attorneys' bills of costs
one month before any action was brought. The
statute required the delivery to be made at the then
residence, or the late place of residence, of the party.
The plaintiff failed in the proof, and the jury found a
verdict for the defendant.
HOLLOWAY, CLERK, V. GRIFFITHS, CLERK.

This was an action brought to recover a sumo]
0681. for furniture sold and delivered to the de.
elidant

Mr. Sergeant r ,t_ ADDY with whom was Mr. BALL,
conducted the plaintiff's case ; Mr. Sergeant TAL-
FOURD the defence.

It appeared that the plaintiff, the Rev. Mr. Hol-
loway, was the proprietor of Gordon House, Kentish-
town, a seminary for the education of young gentle-
men. In December, 1832, he sold the furniture and
fixtures of the school to the defendant under a valua-
tion for 1,3681., subject to a revision, to be paid for in
the following manner :---.5681. cash, and the defend-
ant's bond for 800/. ; 600/. was paid in cash down, and
the defendant passed his bill at a short date for 268/.,
which he ultimately paid. The defendant lodged
2201. in Court to meet the present action.
The appraiser's valuation was put in, as well as the
agreement to pay 1,368/.
For the defendant it was contended, that the agree-
ment which was executed by the parties for the valua-
tion was to be subject to a revision, and to be made
by two valuators, with a reference to an umpire if
necessary.

After much discussion between Counsel, it was
ultimately agreed that a verdict for 6211. should be
entered for the plaintiff, subject to a reduction by a
reference.