The Sun.
London, England, 1834-11-18 00:00:00

THE LATE CONFLAGRATION.

REPORT OF THE PRIVY COUNCIL.
Copy.) At the Council Chamber, Whitehall,

Nov. 8, 1834.

The Lords of the Privy Council, who were directed to
investigate the causes of the late fire which destroyed the
two Houses of Parliament and other buildings, have exa-
mined various persons touching the same, and report as
follows :

In consequence of an Order of the Treasury, directing
the Board of Works* to destroy the wooden tallies and
foils which remained in the tally-room of the Exchequer
(which was required as a temporary accommodation for the
Court of Bankruptcy), and which tallies and foils were un-
derstood to be useless, Mr. Mined- one of the Commis-
sioners of Woods and Forests, appointed Mr. Phipps, the
Assistant Surveyor of Works and Buildings, to meet him
on Tuesday morning, the 14th of October last, who accord-
ingly met him at the tally-room, and Mr. Milne then pointed
out to Mr. Phipps such of the tallies and foils as were to
be preserved, and directed him to take steps for destroying
the rest, and, pointing to a chimney in the room, said, " If
you burn them there, you must be very careful, as the
building is only of wood and plaster ;" upon which Mr.
Phipps said that he intended to have them taken into the
yard and burnt. To this Mr. Milne thinks he made no
reply, but gave some caution to be careful. This is the
account given by Mr. Milne in his second examination, cor-
recting, or explaining in some particular, his first.
Mr. Phipps states that Mr. Milne gave him directions
to burn the tallies in the Exchequer-yard, or some other
convenient place. Mr. Milne says he is confident that ho
did not give such directions, nor any directions, otherwise
than by approving of what Mr. Phipps said about burning
them in the Exchequer-yard. Mr. Phipps saw Mr. Weo-
bley (the Clerk of the Works) the same day, and told him
to have the tallies and foils burnt, stating that Mr. Milne
had directed them to be burnt in the yard, to which it ap-
pears by Mr. Weobley's statement, although Mr. Phipps, to
the best of his recollection, denies it, that Mr. Weobley ob.
jected at the time, saying it would alarm the neighbours.
Mr. Phipps states that, to the best of his recollection,
Mr. Weobley said that the order should be obeyed, and did
not suggest any place for burning them till the next day.
Mr. Weobley is positive that he stated the above objec-
tion, and that Mr. Phipps then said, " You may do it where
you can ;" " and it struck me," said Mr. Weobley, " that the
stoves of the House of Lords would be a safe and proper
place to do it in." He does not, however, appear to have
mentioned the plan at that time to Mr. Phipps ; and both
agree that it was not till the Wednesday that any plan was
was mentioned, except burning in The Exchequer-yard.
Mr. Phipps, in his second examination, again denies that
Mr. Weobley made the objection mentioned by him to
burning in the yard, or that he said, " You may do it where
you can." The point on which they differ does not seem
to be very material in the case, as they next day concurred
in preferring the mode of burning the tallies in the stoves
at the House of Lords, to burning them in the Exchequer-
yard.
It appears that Mr. Phipps met Mr. Weobley, on Wed-
nesday, the 15th, in Palace-yard, when Mr. Weobley sug-
gested to Mr. Phipps the burning of the tallies in the flues
of the House of Lords. Mr. Phipps acquiesced in the sug-
gestion, saying he thought it a very good plan.
It will be observed that although Mr. Milne parted
with Mr. Phipps on the previous day, in the understanding
that the tallies were to be burnt in the Exchequer-yard,
the change of plan that took place was never communicated
to Mr. Milne, or his assent required to the burning in the
flues, of which Mr. Milne remained entirely ignorant till
after the fire had taken place. Mr. Phipps, in justification
to his agreeing so readily to the proposal of Mr. Weobley,
says that he considered Mr. Weobley as a careful man, and
that he would see to and superintend the burning of the
tallies ; and Mr. Phipps adds, that if they had been burnt
in small quantities he is still of opinion no damage could
have happened. He says, it did not occur to him at the
time that he was running counter to Mr. Milne's orders :
that he considered the furnaces as a safe place to burn the
tallies in ; and that he did not give directions to Mr.
Weobley to burn the tallies in small quantities because he
had always known Mr. Weobley to be a very careful man.
Mr. Weobley employed to burn the tallies two workmen
in the service of contractors with the Board of Works, but
who were in the constant employment of the Board, receiv.
ing their orders from Mr. Phipps, and held to be at the
disposal generally of the officers of the Board of Works.
One of the men, Joshua Cross, had some years before been
convicted of felony and sentenced to seven years transpor-
tation, but had only suffered imprisonment in the Peniten-
tiary, and had, after three and a half years' confinement,
been taken back (with a certificate of good conduct from
the Governor) by his former employer, Mr. Holroyd, then
also a contractor with the Board for plumber's work, and
had, in consequence, come into the employment of the
present contractor, Mr. Clarke.
Mr. Weobley directed the two men to bring the tallies
from the Exchequer on Wednesday evening, which they
did on a mason's truck, going several times for them. There
were about two one-horse cart loads. Mr. Weobley desired
the men to burn them slowly, only a few at a time.
They began the operation of burning at a half-past six
the next morning, Thursday, the 16th of October. They
represent that they obeyed Mr. Weobley's orders, and put
on only a handful of ten or twelve tallies at a time, damping
them occasionally with water, and laying them three deep
in the bottom of the furnace, and not adding a second
handful till the first was nearly consumed.
Richard Reynolds, a fire lighter, whose business is to at-
tend to the furnaces when the House of Lords is sitting,
gives a very different account ; for he says that going to
them between nine and ten o'clock, he remained for three
or four minutes, and he saw them laying the tallies as fast
as they could into the furnace, putting in five or six hands-
ful at a time, each handful containing ten or twelve tallies,
and filling the furnaces up to three-fourths of their height ;
that he knows the flues well, having fed them. There was
an astonishing blaze going on, he could hear it perfectly.
There was a great flame. They were filling both the flues
with great rapidity. He says he told Cross that he was
going on very rapidly burning the sticks. Cross made no
answer, and Reynolds left them.
The men, on the other hand positively state that they
never filled the furnaces so as to make the fuel stand higher
than three or four inches, and certainly not so high as six.
By Reynolds' account the height of the fuel could not be
less than nine inchess.

Ms. Weobley says he came at an earlier hour, between
seven and eight, to see the work going on, and he found
the men following his directions ; that he returned twice
again in the course of the morning, and made the same ob-
servation.

His account certainly coincides with that of the -tnen ;
but if, as Mr. Weobley seems fairly to admit, the operation
of burning in the furnaces was the cause of the fire which
afterwards took place, it is impossible to account for it in
any other way than that the consumption of tallies went on
much more rapidly, and that the furnaces were fed much
quicker and filled much fuller with the fuel than the men
represent ; and if Mr. Weobley's observation was correct
at the times he saw the work going on, the men must have
departed from his direction during the interval betwOen his
visits. It it to be observed that Mr. Weobley did not go
there after three o'clock, and that the burning continued
continued till between four and five ; nor was any report
called for or made to Mr. Weobley when the. work was
completed.
Before fives o'clock, or thereabouts, the men
retired from their work, and went to their homes.

Mrs. Wright, who acted as housekeeper of the House
of Lords in the absence of her clatt;hter-in-law, states that
she had perceived a smoke and smell of burnt wood as early
as ten or half-past ten, and that, having learnt that it was
occasioned by the burnirg of tallies in the flues, she sent for
Cross at that time, and that he came ; and that having
asked him what lie was doing, he said he was burning the
tally-sticks belonging to the Exchequer. She said, " That
is very odd ; who gave you the order ?" He said, " The
Board of Works." She told him if Mr. Pullman was
there, he would not allow him to do it. She says she sent
again to Cross about half-past one, and that he sent back a
message that she had no occasion to be alarmed, all was
right. At half-past three o'clock she states that she again
sent to Cross the boy Reynolds, who represented to Cross
that the House was in a complete smother, and that the
throne could scarcely be seen. Cross said he could not