The Sun.
London, England, 1851-07-21 00:00:00

tatto ißlYttton

SUN OFFICE, Seven o' Clock.

TAT TERSALL'S-THIS AVENING
six o'cvacs.

GOODWOOD STAKES.
7 to 1 sgst Empress colt
10 to 1 agst Presto
10 to 1 apt Narcissus
12 to 1 agst Harpeiohota
12 to 1 apt Humphrey
15 to 1 art Miss Whip
KINTINcK TESTIXoNIAL (GOODWOOD).
100 even on Bay Rosalind

GoODNVOOD CUP.
7 to 2 sgst Cariboo—taken
5 to 1 apt Nancy
15 to 1 sgst blontes
15 to 1 agst Russborough
Voltigeur is scratched.

ST. LEGER.
4 to 1 cgs t Hernandez

DERBY.
10 to 1 agst Brother to Elt!q- a
25 to 1 agst Meg of Trumps

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

(THIS EVENING.)

NOUSE OF LORDS.

The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Wool-
lack at Five o'clock.

PETITIONS.
Lord CAMPBELL presented a petition from some
pace in Somerset,hire in favour of the Copybold En-
nchisement Bill.
The Esrl of MALMESBURY presented, on the part
Of his Noble Friend the Earl of Derby, who was too ill
to attend their Lordships' House, several petitions in
favour of the Ecclesiastical Titles Bill, many of which
prayed that it might be made more stringent.
The Duke of WELLINGTON presented petitions
from places in Ireland against the Bill.
Earl FITZWILLIAM presented several petitions in
favour of the Bill.
The Earl of GLENGALL presented several petitions
to a similar purport.
The Earl of ST. GERMANS presented a petition
from Waterford against the Bill.
The Marquis of DREADALBANE presented several
rtitions from plac.l in Scotland in favour of the Bill.
The Duke of RICHMOND presented a petition from
the holders of church leases in the county of Durham
praying that their interests might be secured in the Bill
on church leases before their Lordships' House.
TURNPIKE A.CTS ARRANGEMENT BILL.

The Itotiseresolv. d itself into Committee on this Bill.
The Earl of LANESBOROUGH proposed a clause
prohibiting the use of carts drawn by dogs.
The Earl of IiAL NIESBURY said that many persons
earned their living by means of these carts drawn by
slogs, and he should oppose the motion.
After ft short conversation, their Lordships divided,
whoa there appeared—
Contents ••• •" ••• 27
Non- Contents 56
Majority against the clause ~. —29
The clause was consequently lost.
The Bill then passed through Committee.
ECCLESIASTICAL TITLES BILL.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE rose to move the
second reading of this Bill. He must in the outset
confess that it was to him a most painful duty to dis-
charge to have to move the second reading of this Bill.
He had for 47 years been a strenuous advocate of the
claims of his Roman Catholic follow-countrymen,
and had exerted himself in the House and out of the
House to procure the acknowledgment of those claims,
and it was therefore most painful to him to feel that his
duty compelled him to adopt a course, which might be
misrepresented into an attempt to deprive of their rights
his Roman Catholic fellow ,subjects. It was, however,
some consolation to him to know that this Bill did not
interfere with the practice of religion, or with the civil
liberties of his Roman Catholic fellow-subjects. It was
occasioned solely by—it was meant solely to meet—an
unjust aggression on the part of a foreign Power.

(LEFT. SPEAKING.)

HOUSE OF COMMONS.
The SPILLSER took the Chair at Five Minutes to Four
o'clock.

NEW MEMBER.
Mr. THOMAS COLLINS took the oaths and his seat for
Knareiborough, in the room of Mr. Mooches, deceased.
The Hon. Member was introduced by Mr. B. Denison
and Mr. Walpole.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.
The Lords' amendments to the Great Northern Rail-
way (No. 2) Bill ware considered and agreed to.
The Hove Improvement B►ll was recd a third time
and passed.

METR')POLITAN WATER SUPPLY.
Sir DE LACY :VANS moved that it be an instruc-
tion to the Committee on the Metropolis Water Supply
Bill to take evidence, and to hear counsel upol the
nature of the proposed undertaking fur furnishing a
supply of pare spring water by the London (Watford)
Woo.' Water Company, the Wens and estimates or
which were by an ordiT of the 11,,use, on the 17th day
of June last, re/erred to the said Cummittee, and to re-
port thereupon to the House.

Sir J. GRAHAM said the Committee had already
dacided that the parties had no focus standi beture the
Committee.

Si: DE LACY EVANS said they did not contend
that thy had.
The inotion was negatived without a division.
YE fI rioNs.
_ _ _

Mr. BROWN prese-clapettion from the solicitors
of Liverpool against the certificate duty.
Mr. DUNCAN presented a petition trom a place in
Scotland seam, the Public-h.ubes (Scotland) Rill,
Mr. REYNOLDS presented a petition from Knights-
bridge in favour of the continuance of the Cr3stal
Palace.

Sir G. STRICKLAND presented a petition from the
solicitors of Preston against the certificate duty.
Mr. B. OSBORNE presented a petition from the in-
habitants residing in the neighbourhood of the Crystal
Palace, against us continuance; also a petition from
iirompton in favour of its cutitiuusuce.
_ _

Mr: NE WDEGA TE presented a petition from a place
in Warwickshire against the RPgistratiun of Assurances

Mr. FITZROY presented a rtitiou in favour of the
COntinuanc,. ~t the Crystal Palace.
Mr. MOORE presented a petition from the millers of
Baliinasloe, complaining of the free importation Gf
foreign flour.
Mr. HERMES presented a petition from the ship-
owners of Exeter, complaining of the repeal of the
navigation laws.

M. S. ADAIR presented a petition from Paisley
against the removal of the Crystal Palace.
Mr. M. GIBSON presn:ed a petition from the Cham-
ber of Commerce of Manchester, praying for the post-
ponement of the Registration of Assurances Bill; also
a petition from Manchester praying for the continuance
of the Crystal Palace.
Mr. MO MATT presented a petition from Falmouth
to the same effect.

METROPOLITAN SEWERS.
Mr. FITZROY wished to know what were the inten-
tions of Government with regard to the Metropolitan
Sewers Commission.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said the Chancellor of the
Exchequer would, to-morrow, move for leave to bring
in a Rift on the subject.
REGISTRATION OF ASSURANCES BILL.
Mr. DISRAELI said an important Bill was expected
to come on this evening, which stood second on the
paper, but looking at the question that stood before it,
there was little hope of its bow, brcught on. Now would
it not be better considering the advanced ate of the
session, and the opposition the Bin was likely to en-
counter, to refer it to a Select Committee?
Lord J. RUSSELL did not thank so, but he trusted
his Right Hon. Friend the Master of the Rolls would be
able to proceed with the second reading this evening.
NEW BARRACKS IN BIRDCAGE-WALK.
Sir DE LACY EVANS asked the Chancellor of the
Exchequer whether it was intended to construct addi-
tional barrack accommodation for another battalion of
'Guards adjoining the Birdcage-walk, St. James's-park.
If so, whether it was proposed
presentosedtoeun;rauectkth, eorreenqtuirireelyd
addition on both sides of
4 the direction of
jmmes.streec, medico?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER,who
..w.tias scarcely audible in consequence of the noise in the
'use, was understoid to say that it had been the inten-
tion of the Government to erect new barracks Bird-
cage-walk but that that intention had been abandoned.
.7,11A1r mitGATE AND RAMSGA.II;
'''''(-4FA.TT asked the First Lord of the Admi-
ralty why the
to investigate the revenue, condition,
report ot the Select Committee appointed
and expenditure of
Ramsgate and Margate Harbours, which recommended
that all dues and tolls now exacted from vessels nut ac-
tually entering
--"=gate Harbour should wholly cease
And determine, had not been carriei into effect; and
whether it was the intention ot her Majesty's Ministers
to introduce a Bill to Carry out the recommendations of
the Select Committee?
Sir F. BARING, who from the noise prevailing was
indistinctly heard, was understood to reply that he had
consulted the law officers in regard to the recommenda-
tions contained in the report of the Committee, and
that be found that thrice recommendations could not be
lepliy carried into effect'.
ALDER VAN SALO MONS' RENEWED ATTEMPT

The SPEAKER read to the House a letter which he
bad received from Mr. Alderman Selomons directing the
Speaker's atten.iun to the proceedings which took places
on Friday last, anti intimating that, immediately after
he was requested to withdraw, he read a paper to the
clThct that he had taken the oaths according to the
forms and caremonies most binding on his consciece,
and in compliance with 4 and 5 Vic., chap. 105,
and, having done so, demanded to declare his
property qualification. The Speaker said he might
state to the House, with reference to this letter,
that minutes of proceedings had been very carefully
prepared. What the Honourable Member stated was
P!!'etlY inaudible at that part of the House, bit after the
""vteulf of swearing was gone through the Clerk turned
pound to kW, •
kthe Speaker), and stated that the UM

Member had omitted certain words from the oath, llh
then ordered him to withdraw., ttinking that it was his
duty to do so.—(Ctleers from the Opposition benches.)
The statement of the Hon. Member was made subse-
-1 quently to his being ordered to withdraw, and therefore
Tiould not appear on the minutes of the House.—(Hear.)
Sir B. HALL then rose, and addressing the Speaker
said—Sir, it may be convenient to put the question 1
which my Right Honourable Friend the Chancellor
of the Exchequer, on Friday evening, requested
might be repeated this evening when the Noble
Lord at the head of the Government was present.
It would be in the recollection of the House that before
the Hon. Gentleman the Member for Greenwich with-
drew he occupied a seat where his Honourable
Friend the Member for Southwark (Sir W. Moles-
worth) now sat (the front row below the gang-
, way on the Ministerial side of the House], and that
you repeated your desire that the Hon. Gentleman should
withdraw below the bar of the House. It will also be in
the recollection of the House that after the Hon. Gentle-
man had so withdrawn I stated to the House that it was
the anxious desire of the Hon. Gentleman to take such
steps as might be necessary for carrying out not
only th 3 wishes of his constituents, but also to take such
steps as might enable him to take his seat in this as-
sembly, and that the Hon. Gentleman did not desire to
take any course which might be displeasing
or inconvenient to the House, but that he
was resolved, so far as lay in his power,
to take his seat as a Member of the Legislature. I then
asked my Right Hon. Friend whether, as the Hon.
Gentleman had certainly taken a seat within the
bar of the House—whether, under such circum-
stances, if the Government may determine or
may think he became amenable to the law, they
intend to instruct the Attorney-General to prosecute, in
order that this question may be fairly brought to an
issue; and I intimated that if he did not think he had
become amenable to the law, or ,that a prosecution
would fairly lay, that the Honourable Gentleman
would take the still further step of voting as a
Member of the House, and thereby render himself per-
fee:ly amenable to any penalties which the statute
dire-cted. The question, therefore, which I put to the
Noble Lard at the head of the Government is, whether
he iutends, or is prepared to authorise the prosecu
Lion, at the instance of the Attorney-General, against
the Hon. Member for Greenwich?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL—I think the Hon. Baronet
is hardly juAiligd is asking me what the Government in-
tend, or what they do not intend to do upon the question
of prosecuting a Member of this 11, use for taking his
seat without taking the oaths. lam ready to say, hoe ever,
reserving to the Government the libert) of future action,
that at present we are not disposed to think that we
ought to prosecute Mr. Alderman Salomons for so doing.
Sir B. HALL—I wish now to state the course which
I think the Hen. Member for Greenwich ought to pur-
sue. We are all agreed I think, that so far as the Hon.
Gentleman has at present acted, he has acted
with perfect fairness towards her Majesty's Go-
vernment.—(Hear, bear.) He has not condescended
to any subterfuge whatever, and in consequence of the
answer which the Noble Lord has given to my question,
I think the only course which the Hon. Member for
Greenwich can pursue is to come within the bar of the
House to take his seat in this House at once.—(Hear.)

Mr. Alderman SALOMONS then descended from the
seat which he had occupied in the front row of the Peers'
gallery, and advancing up the floor of the House,
took his seat on the front bench below the
gangway on the Ministerial side of the House.
This proceeding of his was saluted with
loud cheers from his supporters, accompanied by demon-
strations of a contrary nature from his opponents, and
at the moment he took the seat the uproar was so great
that it was with difficulty that we could hear
The SPEAKER, who said, I wish to call the atten-
tion of the House to the fact, that there is present
now a Member who has not taken the oath of abjura-
tion. I must, therefore, repeat my former request, and
desire him at once to withdraw.

This was followed by loud cries of " Withdraw,"
from the Opposition side of the House, accom-
panied by cheers from the immediate supporters of
the Honourable Alderman. In the midst of the
uproar Lord John Russell rose and attempted to address
the Speaker, but his voice was inaudible, and at the
same time Mr. Bernal Osborne rushed forward
from the lower end of the House, forcing his
way with difficulty through the excited Members who
crowded the upper row of benches, bearing a paper in
his hand, which he handed to the Speaker, without at-
tempting to read it, amidst the noise and turmoil.
The SPEAKER here said—A motion has been handed
to me, but as the question before the House is a question
of order it takes precedence of all others.—(Cheers.)
Lord J. RUSSELL again rose, but was not able to
address the Speaker, owing to the continued tumult
which reigned, of which cries of " Withdraw," "Chair,"
" Order," were the most prominent features. During
the whole of this scene Alderman Salomons continued
to retain the seat in the body of the House which he had
originally occupied, next to Sir W. Molesworth, undis-
turbed by the cries with which he was assailed.
The SPEAKER then said—lf the Hen. Member per-
sists in refusing to obey my order to withdraw, I must
appeal to the House to support me. That order can only
be enforced by a vote of the House.—(Cheers, and cries
of " Withdraw.")
Lord J. RUSSELL then rose. He said—lt seems to
me perkctly clear, and it is a matter which I shall not
waste any time in discussing, that the House ought
to support the Speaker.—(Loud cheers.) I do
not believe that the Speaker has authority
to enforce his order without a regular vote of the House,
and I therekre now move that Mr. Alderman Salmons
be ordered to withdra w.—(Ctieers.)
Mr. B. OSBORNE—I rise to move an amendment,
the purport of which I have already placed in yuur
hands. I beg you. Str, to read that amendment.

Mr. C. A NSTEY seconded the amp ndment.

The bPEAKER then, amid loud crtei, put both the
original motion for the withdrawal of Mr. Alderman
SAlurnons, and the amendment, which was, that Mr.
Alderman S'ilomon* having been duly returned fur the
borough of Greenwich, and having taken the usual
oa 11—(1•10, no)—in the manner most binding on hit,
conscience—(No, no)—is entitled to take his seat in this
Howe.

The reading of the amendment was followed by a re-
petition of uproar, which had ceased only when the
Speaker had commenced. Loud cries of "Divide, di-
vide" nlw followed; in the midst of which Mr. Anstey
rose, and was saluted with groans and cries of `• Oh, oh."
Mr. ANSTEY wished to give the Howe an opportu-
nity of answeriug the case which he was about to put
to them.—(Oh, oh.) It was said that Alderman Salo-
mons had not taken the oaths pres.cribed'by law; but he
insisted that he had, for the oath of abjuration, which
it was alleged the Hon. Member had not completed, was
not prescribed by law. The Hon. and Learned Member
was contit.uing his address, but the uproar was so great
that it was impossible to hear what he said. At length,
however, he abruptly resumed his seat, moving the ad-
journmentof the debate.

The galleries were accordingly cleared, and the
House divided, when there appeared—
For the adjournment „, 65
Against it ... ... 257
Majority against it
Oa our return to the gallery we totad Alderman
Salomons still in his seat, ar.d

Mr. M. GIBSON on his legs asking k question.
He said he understood the Speaker to eay on
Friday last that the Hon. Member for Greenwich
must withdraw because he had not taken the
oath in the sense in which the House understood ths
Act. Now, he wished to ask the Speaker whether he
could refer him to any minute of their proceedings, in
which would appeer the sense in which the House un-
derstood the Act. He wished to proceed upon as much
information as possible, and he should therefore be glad
to know in what form, during the present session of
Parliament, the sense of the House had been taken as to
its understanding the Act.—(Hear, hear.)
The SPEAKER said he made no references whatever
to any decision of the House during the present session.
He referred to a decision come to by the House
last session under precisely similar circumstances.
The Baron Lionel De Rothschild was returned
for the City of London, and took the oaths in precisely
the same way that they have been taken by Mr. David
Salomons. The House, upon being made aware of the
omisson from the oath, came to the resolution that
the Baron Lionel De Rothschild was not entitled to
sit, he not having taken the oath of abjuration required
by law.—(Cheers.)
Mr. M. GIBSON said he was not present then, and
therefore he was not aware of that proceeding.—(Oh.)
He wished to ask the Speaker whether the resolution
of last session, relating to another person, was
binding upon them now I)—(Hear, hear.) He also
wished to ask whether the words of the resolu-
tion pointed out the form of taking the oaths as re-
quired by law, so as to point to the conclusion that the
form in which Alderman Salomons proposed to take
them was not the form required by law.—(Hear, hear.)
Lord J. RUSSELL rose to order. It was not com-
petent fur a Member to draw the Speaker into a debate
upon what the House had already done.—(clear.) He
found by the minutes of their proceedings, that there
wasa resolution come to last year that the
Baron Lionel de Rothschild is not entitled to vote
in this House or to sit in the House during any debate
"
until he has taken the oath of abjuration in the form ap-
pointed by law. Now the Speaker went upon the au-
thority of that resolution, and he (Lord John Russell)
believed the Speaker had a perfect right to do so.
Mr. MILNER GIBSON apoh.gised to the Speaker for
baying troubled bins a second time with the question,
but he was not in the House towards the close of last
session, and was, therefore, not fully aware of what then
passed.—(oh I oh!)
Mr. ANS fEY then proceeded to address the House,
and was received with cries of ke, spoke ;" but he
infermed Hon. Members who were interrupting him,
that he had not yet sp ken to the original qurstiun, and
he was allowed to proceed. The question before them,
as raised by the Hon. Member for Manchester, related
to Alderman Salomons, and not to Baron Rothschild.
No decision had yet been come to in the Alderman's
case. The House would remember that last year the
result of a similar inquiry to this was a resolution,
pledging itself to take the matter into its serious consi-
deration in the then next session of Parliament,
but up to this very hour that pledge remained
unfulfilled. Only look at the inconsistency they were
falling into. They acknowledged Baron Rothschild and
Alderman Salomons to be the sitting Members for Lon-
don and, Greenwich,
,and yet they refused to let them
sit.—(Hear, hear.) The oaths had been taken by
the Honourable
Member for Greenwich in the form
prescribed by the Ist and 2d Victoria. The words which
he had omitted were not required to be taken by law.—
(Hear, hear.) The Act of Parliament to which he re-
ferred was a declaratory' 'Wind- it pro-vid..3d that in all