The Sun.
London, England, 1856-04-29 00:00:00

• his silence was designed, sometimes accidental; but the required for the Turkish army at Kars. The Under-Sec-
' gist of all was " I shall not answer for Ido not want to retary-at-War took from the 29th of March to the 12th of
sappoint you, but when all is overl will give you an an- April to answer that letter—not- less than thirteen days.
. ewer in full." If that system was to be carried out in all When the answer was sent it certainly was a weighty and
• departments, what was to become of the business of this important one. When the fate of the three empires was
great country? On the 11th of Jan., 1855, the Earl of at stake, what did the Under-Secretary of War say—the
- Clarendon wrote an answer to that document. He said:— Under-Secretary to the great War Minister who had sup-
" This matter has received the careful consideration of planted the Duke of Newcastle? Mr. Peel, writing to
her Majesty's Government, and they find that General Lord Wodehonse, said, "I am directed to request you
Williams mast have been in a great difficulty, and that her will state to Lord Clarendon that Lord Panmure is of opi-
Majesty's Government could not but regret the silence of nion that it will be desirable to urge on the Porte the im.
his Excellency upon the subject." portance of paying attention to these requirements when
Now he (Mr. Whiteside) admitted, on the part of Lord the necessity for the presence of the Ottoman troops sisa-
l' Clarendon, that he had fully discovered the misconduct of where shall cease. (Loud laughter.) If Lord Clarendon
Lord Stratford de Redaliffe. He admitted that he had concurs that it is expedient to adopt that course, lam to
' been made aware of his errors, anti had expressed himself request that you will move his lordship to send instrac-
with regard to them in a manner highly creditable to him tions to the Ambassador at Constantinople to pay atten-
as a private gentleman, but at the same time in a manner tion to it." (Renewed laughter, and cries of " Hear.") And
which was fatal to him as an English. t ttesmae, That was this was the mode of proceeding adopted by men who
' the last of the letters written by Lord Clarendon in answer talked of a vigorous prosecution of the war. (Cheers.) The
to Lord Stratford de Redcliffe. Commissioner Williams very thought that the conduct of the war should be directed
did not submit to this mode of being disposed of by the by men who could write such letters at such a crisis was
ambassador, and he begged to call attention to a letter a - enough to make every man shudder. (Loud cheers.) Then
dressed by CommissiOner Williams to Lord Clarendon after came Lord Clarendon to the rescue to carry out the value-
Lord Clarendon had sent to him the defence of Lord ble design communicated by the UndereSecretary for the
• Stratford de Radcliffe. The despatch was dated Jan. 15, War Department, Writing to Lord Stratford, he said,
1855. They found that on the 21st of Jan., 1855, Lord " I have communicated to the Secretary of State for the
Stratford de Redcliffe concocted another elaborate defence, War Department a copy of the despatch of Gen. Williams.
which he forwarded to Lord Clarendon, in which he fell You will perceive that the Government think it desirable
back upon that trifling matter, as to the superscription of, that your Excellency should urge upon the Porte the im-
Commissioner Williams, and proceeded to speak of the real portance of paying attention to the requirements men-
. difficulties he had with the Sultan, who, having an army tioued by Gen. Williams, whenever the necessity for the
' in the Crimea, and an army on the Danube, could not presence of Omer Pacha 'a troops elsewhere shall cease."
maintain a third. Then, he said, he had applied to the (Loud laughter.) Let it be recollected that the question at
Sultan to make Commissioner Williams a Felid, which issue at that time was the very existence of the Turkish
would place him in a proper position. It appeared that empire. On the 26th of April Count Pisani wrote that it
was not done, or rather that it was done in such an absurd was impossible at present to spare any of the troops in
• manner as to be perfectly useless. Tae appointment was actual service' in the Crimea. These statements, having
granted in Sept., but it did not reach Commissioner Wil- been concocted with great labour, were delivered to the
• liams until the 26th Jan. following. Commissioner Wil- Seraskier and the Effendi, who said they knew all about
' liams earnestly represented the wants of the soldiery, and the matter as well as anybody, for their own commander
' that was communicated to the Minister of War, who, on had told them the same thing. (Lou 1 laughter.) Lord
the 26th of Feb., wrote that "Commissioner Williams Panmure went on indulging in his official slumber until
• would never be able to do any good unless ho was allowed he awoke to mischievous activity in the July follow-
' to have more discretion in organising the army at Kers." ins. (Hear, hear, hear.) Were honourable members,
• Then came a very clever letter from Lord Stratford de under such circumstances, going to vote that there was
' Redcliffe, the scope and purport of which was, that foresight and energy in the War Department? He could
Commissioner Williams, was sent out without any de- not believe that they would do any such thing. It was of
finite object—that he was sent to Kars without little or no consequence what became of a ministry, but it
the ambassador knowing for what purpose he went there, was of the last consequence that the character of the coon-
and then he requested to be informed how he was to treat try should be defended. (Cheers.) If a body of Englishmen
him, what was the extent of his power, and to what extent were of opinion that such documents as th ese to which he
he was independent of the Commander-in-chief. The noble had referred acquitted a minister of all responsibility, it
lord concluded a very clever letter by giving a delicate re- would be useless to talk of a constitution. Let there be a
bake to the Earl of Clarendon, for ho says—" We shall be Government at least intelligible and consistent, exercising
inconsistent with ourselves if we seek to trample down the some kind of judgment. The first thing clone by Lord Pan-
last remains of Turkish independence." Now that was a mure on obtaining office deserved mention. Gee. Chesney
downright request from the ambassador to the Foreign sent to the Wareeffice in the time of the Duke of Newcastle
Secretary to explain the relative authority of the ambas- a plan for conducting the war in Asia Minor. That plan
' Bader and the commander, and the extent of jurisdiction remained in the office for some time. It was pointed out
conferred on Commissioner Williams. Where was the that a force landed at Batourn,er thereabmts, an 1 marched
answer to that communication ? Where was the answer straight to Tiflis, would not only save Asia Minor, but
of her Majesty's Government to that important despatch ? uproot the Russian power there. Gen. Chesney never had
- He (Mr. Whiteside) contended that the Foreign Secretary, the honour of speaking to the Duke of Newcastle ; but he
or the Prime Minister directing the Foreign Secretary, had was appointed to the command of the Foreign Legion in
come to some such conclusion as this —" This will be very January, and the Secretary to the Drake of Newcastle ad-
inconvenient—leave the question in the state in which it dressed a letter to him, requesting him to come to London
• now exists—it is a very pretty quarrel as it stands, and do and to accept the command. Gen. Chesney did not know
not let us attempt to reconcile or adjust it." On the Ist what the future policy of the Duke of Newcastle would
of March there was that extraordinary letter from Corn- be, but he took the command and acted in that capacity
missioner Williams to the Earl of Clarendon, in which he for a fortnight. Now, in the length and breadth of the
said he wished-his influence was sufficient to induce the British empire there was not a scientific officer more corn-
Porte to listen to his warning voice, for that such silence patent to give advice in reference to the country to which
as had been maintained was highly dangerous to the public the troops were intended to be sent than Gen. Chesney,
' cause. " What could I not have done," he asserts, "in and no appointment, was ever more honourable to a British
the way of reform had even a note from Lord Stratford de minister. No sooner was Gen. Chesney fairly in office than
Redcl:ffe by return of the Turkish post, which is as regular he received a note from the private secretary of Lord Pan-
in its arrival, as that between London and Constantinople.' mure, telling him that he could not carry out the views of
The house would hardly credit him when he said there was his predecessor on that point, and dismissing the general
no answer by Lord Clarendon to those despatches. The officer as if he had been a mere footman. There coul I not
least the Foreign Minister could in common justice have have been a more competent man to carry on the war in
said, was that he would consult upon what should be done, Asia Minor, and he believed it was the fixed intention of
and that henceforth no mistakes of the sort should be Lord Panmure, from first to last, not to assist in any way
made ; but he made no reply, and Lord Stratford was the prosecution of the war in that country. What followed
supplied with his defence—" I asked you to give me the was not of much consequence until Jilly. But there was a
necessary information about Commissioner Williams, and letter in June from Lord Clarendon, in which he informed
you did not so much as take the slightest notice of my de- Lord Stratford of the necessity of sending out3oo artillery-
spatch." He (Mr. Whiteside) could not understantla more men. Oh the 15th May a letter was written, which was of
ridiculous aspect than the case assumed in reference to the last importance. That was a letter from Gen. Williams
Lord Clarendon, Lord Stratford de Redcliffe' and Corn- to Lord Clarendon, pointing out the continued neglect at
missioner Williams, for Lord Clarendon left it to the am- Constantinople, the destitute state of the troops, stating
bassador and the commissioner to fight it out in the best that the latest news represented the Russians as preparing'
manner they could. Then _there was another trenchant for the campaign, and sanding plans and sketches of thefor-
letter from Commissioner Williams, which called forth no tifications. On the 20th April Col. Leake had pointed out
answer, He said : the conditicn of the fortress, stating that it was incumbent
"It exhibits, throughout the analysis of my reports to take every precaution against defeat ; and that, with a
from Kars, a marked disdegard to my opinions; and a sufficient force and a gaol supply of ammunition, Kars
future reference to a Muchir to be appointed is the burden would be able to resist any attack. The fair meaning of
of this long story. In forwarding it for your lordship's that communication was, that with plenty of food and
perusal, I must, nevertheless, call your lordship's atten- ammunition, Kars could never be taken. (Hear, hear.)
tion to one or two salient points." Oa the 9th- of July Lord Clarendon received a Ione; de-
Anti having stated these ho says— spatch from Lord Stratford, informing him that the Porte
"Unhappily it is on record that his Excellency did not was thoroughly alarmed, and desirous of discovering how
do me the honour to acknowledge my communications, they could relieve the army in Kars ; but he inquired how
public or private, until my despatches had reached the are the troops to be found, and how are they to be pro•
number of 61." vided ? Now it was plain that, before the receipt of that
Now these despatches contained the substance of the first despatch, the Government were in possession of the opinion
part of the question now under the -consideration of the of General Williams, and knew that the army was deficient
house. Before, however, he proceeded to the second part, in necessaries and ammunition, and that ir they had proper
he would ask the house briefly to consider the case in its supplies they would hold Kars to the last. The despatch
constitutional aspect. He saw by the amendment of of the 9th of June was received by Lord Claren lon on the
which the hon. and learned gentleman opposite had given 11th of July. General Williams in his despatch had said
notice, that he proposed to appoint a select committee to "On the day I wrote to you I received from General
inquire into the circumstances which attended the sur- Leake a confirmation of the intelligence that Kars was
render of Kars, and especially whether any neglect of duty about to be attacked. I also received a letter from the
on the part of Lord Stratford de Redcliffe, her Majesty's Muchir recommending the abandonment of Kars. The
Ambassador at Constantinople, and inattention to the re- garrison continues in good spirits, and promises to do its
posted letters, statements, and demands of General Wil• duty." Let the house look at the conduct of that gallant
officer, who at the approach of difficulty and danger was
hams, her Majesty's commissioner in that city, are among
the main causes to which that calamitous• event must be endeavouring to inspire hope in every man around him,
attributed. But let him ask, in reference to that amend- and ;stating that they wore prepared to do their duty to
ment, whether the Ambassador was responsible to the the last. In describing the recommendation of the Go-
House of Commons? Who appointed the Ambassador? vernor of Erzeroum as to the abandonment of Kars, Gene-
The Crown. Who exercised control over him, and could nal Williams mildly called it a false step. He might have
call him to account? The Ministry. C told the House of gone much further, and used a far stronger expression.
Commons call him to account? No ; all it could do was, (Hear, bear.) What did that despatch prove in fair argu-
by its voice to act upon the Government, wha had the oaent ? That the false advice given to the officer in cora-
control over the public servants. The House of Commons maul of thegarrison at Kars was to fall back on Eizeroum
could neither dismiss nor appoint, for that would be taking en I elan lon that place in Asia Minor, which-would sub-
the duty of the executive. He would beseech the house ject Asia Minor to the control of Russia, and render. her
to consider the opinion of the country upon the question. :riumphant in peace. (Hear, hear.) That letter having
"True," said the Foreign Secretary, "Lord Stratford de been written, on the 11th of July Lord Clarendon receives
Radcliffe is an extraordinary, intract &ble, and clever War a useful and instructive despatch from Lord Stratford, in-
-he is our Ambassador at Constantinople—l ordered him forming him that at a meeting which had been held, at
to correspond with a valuable public servant, but I did so which certain persons were present, it was clear to all that
in vain." The Foreign Secretary says to Lord Stratford the Turkish army required an effort to be madefor its re-
de Redcliffe, "You heve misconducted yourself-, but still lief with all possible despatch, and he proceeded to show
I retain you at your post." That was in precise accord- how materials might be got for the formation of an army,
ante with the system which prevailed of late, which con- and to set out all the information which had been ob-
ferred rewards upoa men who had failed in their duty, tainea, and entering in'o particulars respecting the
and promoted men according to ties measure of their mis-
Contingent under General Vivian. Lord Stratford sent
deeds. (Loud cheers from the O,iposition.) Some time a second despatch to Lord Clarendon, which was re-
ago he (Hr. Whiteside) took upon himself the case of ieived on the 13th July. The mode then proposed to
relieve Kars was to sent an expedition to Katais. Lord
Mr. Kennedy, and what was the ground upon which the
right honourable gentleman the member for the Uni- Clarendon stated that the plan had been considered by the
versity of Oxford, then the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Government, and that it was objectionable to throw an
justified hie dismissal. He did not say that he was die- army on a coast which was not known, anti unprovisled
honest ;or dishonourable, bat nod he was en intractable with the means of transport. Now it was quite clear that
man, a man who rivalled the Treasury, and sometimes Lord Clarendon could not have read the papers, for there
thought differently from the Secretary of the Treasury. It were at that time officers attached to the army who coulr
was the argument used by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, have given all the information that was required. Having
of an Administration of which the present Prime Minister objected to the plan, Lord Clarendon said, " The Govern-
formed a part, that that house had no right nndor any cir- went are of opinion that the wiser course would be to send
cueastances to interfere with the dismissal of a public ser- rei. f dcoments t ) the rear of the Turkish army instead of
• want; but he (Mr. Whiteside) now asked the house the the roar of the Russian army—that an expedition might
constitutional questior, whether the Government justified go to Trebizond—that if the army of Kars could not main-
the conduct of Lord Stratford de Redcliffe, and wheth r t tin its position against the Russians, it should fall back
• or not it be a fact that they consider hid conduct to have upon Erzerou e. and that the whole Turkish force should
been dangerous to the public cause. If it were the fact besconcentrated there ; and he concluded by stating that
that the army in Asia Minor, fighting in a common Cause, he concurred in an ()pinata which had been expressed by
was disorganised by the ambassador what must ho the Gen. Vivian, that an Army thrown on the coast without
condition of her Majesty's Government' to induce them to transports and supplies was doomed to destruction." Now
retain him, or ire the spiris of c!iquisrn to say, that he was that was not exactly the opinion of Gen. Vivian. What-
the only man who could perform the duties of her Majesty's ever view might be attached to the opinions of the noble
ambassador at Constantinople ? If mea were to be em-
lord on matters of policy, they were not of much value ou
ployed because they were incompetent—if when to a gene- points of strategy, and there was no authority to justify
ral W 33 committed the command of an army he disobeyed, the opinion of the node lord at the bead of the War De•
pertirent. On one side were the opinion of Omer Pacha,
or an admiral when told to go one way went another—if
these things were allowed, there would be an end to all Gen. Guyon, the Soraskier, Col. Symonds, the whole of
constitutional Government. Sat this was not the card(- the French embassy, and the whole of the English embassy,
nal point of the inquiry which he intended to submit to and on the other side the opinion of Lard Panmure.
the house. That portion of the inquiry being disposed of, (Hear.) The words " fall back upon Erzeromn," in the
they came to a very interesting portion of our Padiemeu- despatch of the 13th July, were remaraaale. Oa the Ilth
tary history. It was impossible to understand the eines- there had been a letter from Gen. Williams charging the
tion thoroughly without looking back to the disruption of Governor of Kars almost with treachery, for surmising
Lord Aberdeen's Government. At that time the house that it would be necessary to abandon Kars. That letter
would recollect they were favoured with some personal was in the hands of Lord Clarendon, and in the possession
explanations cf a very interesting character, and in aim- of the Government, and be considered it the most cowardly
ther place a noble earl, who possessed a-thorough know- and contemptible doctrine ever recorded in a despatch to
ledge of the subject and great eloquence, recommended s=ad to such a man as Gen. Williams, a suggestion to aban-
her Majesty's Government to attend to the state of affairs -don Kars, and fall back on Erzeroum, and settle down at
in Asia Minor. Having vigour, intelligence, and elo- Trebizond. When that despatch resehel Gen. Williams
grimace, of course the noble earl fillet. Bnt the fate of there could be very little doubt of the way in which he
the hon. memberfor Aylesbury (Mr. Layard) in that house treated it. Most likely-he burnt it at once, saying, "Let
was more fortunate, for he made a convert of the noble it not Le supposed that any such advice was ever given to
lord the member for the city of Lenten. (Hear, hoar.) me—(cheers)—notwithstanding the opinion of Lord dla-
He made a speech on the state of Asia Minor, the infer- rendon, I'll fight against the Russians to the last. It is my
motion contained in which was eminently useful. When dn'Y to maintain the key of the position in Asia Minor—
he spoke on that evening the noble lord said nothing about if I lose it I lose all, and you will not conclude a glorious
Asia Minor, but ho meditated upon it, and the result was war but an ignominious peace." The despatch sent out to
the overthrow of the Aberdeen Government. The noble General Williams ought to have' been c niched in those
lord made an important statement on that occesiore The terms—" I have received your letter—l applaud your
Duke of Newcastle, who was a member of the Adnainis. spirit—maintain your ground to the last—and if England
tration at that time, was held up by the noble lord to has the power you shall have assistance before the siege
judicious and friendly exposure. (Hear, anti laughter.) can be raised." (Cheers.) The next plan proposed
Remembering that statement, ho (Mr. Whiteside) called was to send out some tletechinents of 25 000 men. Every
upon the noble lordsfor his vote, not on 140.101111 L of party, military man who had written on the subject had written
but out of respect for his personal honour, his consistency, consistently, contending that some effort should have been
his conscience, and his country. (Cheers.) The made for the relief of Kars by aiming at ICutais by way of
noble lord, in the statement he made on the occasion ad- Tiflis. Lord Panmure pronounced against the plan, and,
verted to, said that in making arrangements for the next writing to General Vivian, said that it would be open to
campaign he was not satisfied with some of the provisions failure to follow out such schemes as had been proposed her
of his colleagues. The danger of the Russian army ap- the relief of General Williams. General Beatson who
preaching from the Asiatic side was pointed out. The had the command of the Bashi-Bazouks, stated on the 12th
n oble lord said that that was a most important subject, and September, "We could have conveyed any amount of pro-
bed occupied his mind very much, but he could not find visions had the duty devolved-on us; bat the Ambassador
that ho received from Lord Aberdeen the consideration he and Minister-at-War accepted the accounts current. my
hoped for when the subject was brought under the consi- men were declared insufficient to stand before the enemy.
donation of the Government. NOW that proved that the
Had the Turkish Contingent and the Bashi-Bazouke been
noble lord was convinced by the arguments of the hon marched as recommended, the expulsion of the enemy
. member for Aylesbury, and his consequent patriotism in-• would have been comparatively easy. Now the war in
duced him to overthrow the Aberdeen Administration,Asia will assume a formidable aspect".
(Hear.) The sus-
and to bring in a band of chosen Whigs, who 1
takenpwososuesAisiocanrroyf
, out the recommendations
which had' Sebastopol. • (Hear.) With respect to the Bashi-Bazonks,
the noble lords mind. He now asked the noble lord it was well known that they had completely rented the
whether he thought the war in Asia had been conducted Cossacks, and General Beatson was a much likelier judge
with proper vigour, and if he replied that it had not, he of their value than the noble lord at the head of the War
should ask him for his vote on the resolution he should Department, who had never seen them. (Hear.) Tne noble
that night propose. Now, ho (Mr. Whiteside) proposed lord at length knew that the state of things in Eastern
to come to business. (Cheers, and great laughter, it being Asia was desperate, and then said it was too late to regret
just seven o'clock. and the hoe, member having spoken the policy which had left a gallant officer and his friends
more than two hours.) The ambassador was in good tern- to the straits in which they were placed. lout all that
per, the -Foreign Secretary was happy, and the Ministry might have been prevented by a little prudence. _ It ap.
wee changed. Lord Panmure was in the War Depart- neared that, not understanding the character of the War
arerpaettnent, General Mansfield and other officers made
wont, and General Williams was at Erzeroum, writing to
bat order neeativ 1 the • •
all the gentleman, who received his despatches, but soldore a geanente for an expedition, and that the men wore
1 thcrto beenetlealin
readyrhotr marching, and wore only waiting for an order,
March General Williams wrote a letter to Lord Clarendon.vwopitohm%tviohnatenitinerilelnyn.nurr(Elmelara.t)
fe had hi , 'lt was a most important letter, and contained a complete
Constantinople. I account of the state of the war and of the army, and the
W 33 not Ilk Iy to get anything done by
Holvvv.hpiernocetehrel
stoulcttamnsifdoeurnAtlhhant
future prospects of the campaign, and on that letter the 11'
hie elite% he wrote
Government might have acto:l if they heel been disposed
to do anything. Genera' Williams roys he told the to that famous soldier who heel (10,000 men doing
time ti
indtTho Crimea. Omer Paella received a co of de-
snatch of Gen. Williams, and on the 1 lth Jpyuue requested
Muchir that he thought the allies would not leave them
an interview with the cotnmanders. It was worth while
withoa material assistance to bear the brunt of the attack
Bat, he stated that his warning voice was disregarded at
Constantinople. That letter proved that the lines were to compare the reasoning of a Turk with the too extensive to be held Sy the army in Asiatic Turkey. of the head of the English War •Dep,rtment, raenar i
trg
and the necessity of a
supply of. the material of wear, anti arguments of Turkish statesmen wide those of this
of some assistance from the British, French, or Turkish country. Omer Pasha said, " I hasten to inform
forces, or the allied forces. That document must have you that I have received from my Government
deserved consideration from any minister who was anxious despatch informing me that the whole of Turkey
a :for a right conductiof the war. (Hear, hear.) He would in Asia up to the gates of Constantinople is na.
now introduce several other persons, who -took a part in defended. The greater part of roy,,army are Asiatic, whose
,the business. Lord Whciehonse was called into action, wives, families, and properties are exposed to th© ravages
He was the under secretary to Lord Clarendon, and on the of the Russian army, and as my_ariny is inactive, without
29th of March he addressed a note to tho Under Secretary any prospect of employment I consider it my duty to -re-
at War. Lord Clarend
en certainly was prompt on that new the proposal which I made before dor v. conference."
occasion, for he sent a despatch to the hoed of the War But they ilia not like to meet Outer Peelle, for he was a
Dept; tineut, Lord Panuaure, who was bound to consider man of energy and vigour, and went straight to the mark.
Col. Sytnends,
it, alai pronounce a judgment anti opinion upon the mat- an Englishmen, an artillery officer, Attached
ter which it contained.
.Lerd Wodehonse transmitted a to the army of Omer Pacha, said that Omer Paella had ee-
l:46l*QU AMA Qua. Willugue-resPectivg the reinforcement oived. a coraMiinic4ion from CondAntinople, informing
;

him that if Kars should fall there was no force to prevent
the Russians from marching directly upon Constantinople,
and that it was probable that success on the part of the
Russians would decide the Persians to take arms against
Kars. A meeting was at last obtained, but the application
was unsuccessful. Omer Pacha, in a document drawn up
by him, said, "It appears, from incontestible information,
that the Ottoman army in Asia, to the number of 10,000
men, besieged at Kars, is in a position in which it is pro-
bable, from want of food, it may be obliged to capitulate.
The commander of that army, finding his communication
with Erzeroum cut off, requires reinforcements to be sent
without delay, or that a powerful diversion shall be made
in his favour. The object therefore of saving Kars and its
garrison, which is the Ottoman army in Asia, demands the
serious attention of the allies." A meeting was held, but
nothing was done. On the let of August all the former
ideas of the War-office had changed, and Lord Clarendon
wrote to Lord Cowley with reference to the disposition of
the troops, which were to replace the Turks with whom
Omer Pacha was to march to the relief of Kars ; but why
our French allies were written to on the subject he was at
a loss to understand, because they had no control over
Gen. Vivian's contingent nor Gen. Beatson's horse. It was
in the power of the War-office to send these troops where-
, ever they pleased ; and from the blue book he never could
ascertain where it was they really were to be stationed,
for he no sooner found them at one point than a despatch
announced that they, were to take up another. Lord
Clarendon, in his despatch to Lord Cowley, stated that
be had transmitted to him a despatch received from Lord
Stratford respecting Omer Pacha's suggestion for the re-
lief of the Turkish army in Asia, and how the troops
should be employed by him under his command. He pro-
posed that 20,030 Turks should be withdrawn from Eupa-
toria and 5,030 from Bulgaria. Her Majesty's Government
were favourable to the proposition, and hoped the Em-
peror of the French would have no objection to it. Count
Walewski sees objections in it, but nevertheless submitted
it to the. Emperor. Oa the 3d of August, 18F,5, Lord Cla-
rendon appeared to have discovered what was well known
on the sth of March previous, for he wrote that he con-
sidered the relief of Turkish troops in Asia of such vital
importance that he could not abstain from laying before
the Emperor the various arguments by which the plan
propounded was to be carried out, or Kars must be de-
feated or surrender in a few weeks, 13,000 Turks made
prisoners, and the position of Russia much strengthened in
Asia. Erzeroum would then share a similar fate. whilst
the neighbouring country, being in the hands of Russia,
she would soon have advanced too far to drive her oat of
Asia. Should the allies fail to take Sebastopol before the
Russians took Kars, it would have a stranee effect on
Turkey, and bo a disaster difficult to be overcome. If
Omer Pacha proceeded to Redoubt Kell with sufficient
force, no doubt the Russians would be driven back,
aid be forced to retire. Omer Pacha would then be doing
an essentiil service, and which no other man could do,
whilst his presence in the Crimea was comparatively of no
value. (Hear, hear.) No doubt one portion of the de-
fence of the home Government for their conduct would be
that Omer Pacha could not be spared from the Crimea,
but he begged the house to remember that they had in
that despatch the opinion of Lord Clarendon to the con-
trary. (Hear.) Ho was at a loss to know why France
should have been called on to put her veto aye or nay on
the Sultan's withdrawing any of his officers from one
point to place them at another where their services were
required and would be of infinite advantage. Sorely,
that was not the way to preserve the independence and in-
tegrity of the Turkish Empire—(hear, hear)--but rather
to put an-end to it. (Hear, hear.) Lord Clarendon went
on to say that it was very doubtful whether, if Turkey
felt disposed to have Omer Pacha sent to Asia, any just
objection could be raised to it, the allies having no right
to do so ; and even if they had, he doubted wether it
would be wise in them to do so. (Hear.) Every portion
of that despetch was true, except that it should have been
dated the March previous to August, 1855. To that letter
of Lord Clarendon a reply was received from the Emperor
of the French, and Lord Panmure wrote, August 4, that
the French Emperor had no objection to the proposed ex-
pedition of Omer Pacha, provided the Turkish contingent
before Sebastopol was not diminished. (Hear, hear.) No
doubt the house supposed that the matter by that time
was settled, that orders were given accordingly, and that
the business proceeded, but such was not the case. An ex-
traordinary discussion was got up with the aid of the elec-
tric telegraph relative to whether Omer Pacha should take
troops _from B da'slava or Eupatoria, which occupied
another month. (Bear.) It was but just, however, to
remark that from the time the quarrel, as it was stated,
had terminated between Lord Stratford and General Wil-
liams, the former had acted, in his (Mr. Whiteside's) opi-
nion, with zeal, fidelity, and activity, and in the know-
ledge that he was al ways in the right, and the home Govern-
ment always in the wrong—(cheers)—he always contrived
to put Lord Clarendon in the wrong, and no doubt he had
reason for it—and he (Mr. Whiteside) appealed to the house
whether it was a creditable thing for the Government to
attempt to wriggle out of a difficulty and attribute to Lord
Stratford's conduct the loss of Kars. (Cheers) He hoped
when next the country went to war the electric wires would
be cut, for their continual use on this occasion had been
fraught pith great mischief. The hon. and. learned gen-
tleman then referred to the despatches and telegraphic
messages that passed between Lord Clarendon, Lord Strat-
ford, and Lord Cowley, relative to Omer Pacha's removing
the Turkish troops from the Crimea, with which to assist
the garrison of Kars, and on the 28th of August Lord Cla-
rendon wrote that ho was of opinion the Turkish troops
might be taken from Balaklava, and a telegraph was de-
spatched from France, stating that the Emperor had uo
objection to its leaving provided the Commander-in-Chief
had no objection to it, and then Osaer Pacha had to
contend with (them. A long correspondence ensued
on that, and after some time had elapsed Omer Pacha was
under the impression that all difficulties had been removed,
and that he might proceed to Asia; but it appeared that
on the 7th September, Lord Clarendon having groped
among some old papers, found something that had been
written by General Simpson anterior to that date, wrote
to Lord Srra.tford stating there was an inconsistency in his
despatch of the 29th ult. with what had lately come to the
knowledge of the Government relative to Omer Pacha's
plan for taking troops from before Sebastopol for Asia,
replacing them with troops from Eupatoria, and the in-
formation to which Lord Clarendon referred was that sup-
plied by General Simpson that Omer Pacha had stated that
the Turkish troops would not be fit to take up a position
before Sebastopol before next spring, and the Government
had therefore determined that General Vivian's contingent
should not join the army before Sebastopol. (Hear, hear.)
This remark of Omer Pacha was made in the July preVious,
at a time when the critical state of the army in Asia was
unknown, and under the impression that the officers and
soldiers of the contingent -would not be sufficiently well
acquainted and understand each other before then. (Rear,
hear.) It was of the utmost importance that Omer Pacha
should get to Redout Kaleh before the rainy season
commenced, in the latter end of August or the be-
ginning of September, when he would have been able
to effect his purpose and force a passage across the country,
but he was prevented doing so by the delays of the Govern-
ment. (Hear.) Every proposition that was suggested foi.
effecting the relief ofKers was neglected, and the objection
of our French allies was put forth, but which amounted in
reality to nothing. (Hear.) The hon. and learned gen-
tleman next referred to the difficulty and privation the
garrison of K as had to submit to from the want of provi
sinus. In September, 1854, there had been an abundant
harvest, anti supplies could easily have been obtained, but
unfortunately there was a scarcity of money, which lasted
for 15 months. General Williams, seeing the privations
the garrison would have to submit to, wrote from eight to
twelve despatches on the subject, imploring the Govern-
ment to lose no time in collecting provisions, and that there
was any amount of bullock waggons to be obtained by
'eriest payment for th•it purpose. 225,000/. in specie and
paper money was all the Turks sent out to Kars; and, find-
ing how things were likely to turn out, General Williams
wrote to Lord Stratford, asking to be commissioned to
provision Kars, being satisfied that if England guaranteed
to pay, there would be no difficulty in obtaining what the
garrison required. Such powers wore rever forwarded to
trim ; but General Williams, to a certain extent, assumed
those powers. Mules and mule waggons came into the
city in great numbers, and then charges for hire and the
price of provisions for a time considerably increased, but
General Williams was not in a condition to continue it.
Dr. Sandwith in his recent work had confirmed this, and
had ad led that, had General Williams been invested with
plenary powers to have provisioned Kars, that the city
would have bean saved. (Cheers.) The house would un-
derstand by that that the fall of Kars was to a certain ex-
tent a question of money. Had the Minister come down
to that house and asked for 100,0e0/. for the protection of
Turkey in Asia, and have saved the key of A3ia Minor
from falling into the hands of the enemy, would it not have
been granted—(hear)—and a ministry who undertook to
conduct a war could not escape from serious responsibility
if they increased it by saying they did not choose to ask the
house for money with which to effectually conduct that
war; but if they asked for it and the house refused it, that f
was another cage. (Rear.) He contended that this Govern-
ment never intended to grant assistance to Kars, and he
grounded that opinion on a statement male by Lord Pan-
mure in the House of Lords, after the debate on the
Turkish loan, who said, in reference to the affairs of Asia,
" that Turkey in that quarter was able to maintain herself
against her enemy ;" which ho (Mr. Whiteside) contended
was the grossest deception that had ever been practised
on the people of this country. (Hear, hear.) The hon.
and learned gentleman then read other portions of the
despatches relating to this part of the question, and said
he felt convinced that the capture of Kars had been made
great use of by Ramis at'tbe Conference, and he had no
doubt that that had been used as a check against.. their
getting much of Bessarabia. (Hear, hear.) They, how-
ever, found that Kars was lost—the garrison starved out
—and then Lord Clarendon knighted B igadier-General
William - (laughtes) --end wrote a letter to Lord Stratford,
expressing himself in indignant terms against the Gover-
nor of Erzeronm, who, he said, should have gone to the
assistance of Kars, and erdering that he should be brought
to trial. (Hear, hear.) What right had Lord Clarendon
to use such language to an independent pow. r, and the
Government to sanction it ? (Hear, hear.) Lord Strat-
ford replied to that despatch that he would state to the
Porte the purport of his lordship's despatch ; and added,
that Generals Mansfield and Bliant had informed him
that the Governor of Erzeroum was one of the bravest
mea that could be found. Had General Simpson been in
Erzeroum, would he have gone to the relief of Kars ?
(Hear.) No. He was sure he would not; and the Govern-
ment, instead of bringing him to trial, would have pre-
sented him with three medals. (Laughter.) It was one of
the most insolent documents he had ever read, to dare to
threaten to bring a Turkish officer to trial because be and
his Government had suffered the garrison of Kars to fall
into the hands of the enemy, (Hear, hear.) After the
fall of Kars, the Porte wrote a letter to the noble and
brave defenders of the garrison, wherein he referred to
the signal victories they had gained by the grace of God,
and that their heroic deeds would fill a bright page in his-
tory, and described their conduct as being deserving of
universal praise, adding that the sufferings which the Im-
perial forces bad undergone in Kars had disturbed his re-
pose, and all those connected with the affairs of the coun-
try, and that they all had never ceased to pray for their
success. (Hear, hear.) The letter was forwarded by Lord
Stratford to Lord Clarendon, to which the latter replied
that her Majesty's Government concurred with his Excel-
lency in opinion with him with regard to the letter the
Sultan bad addressed to the garrison of Kars, and adding
that they had at least the satisfaction of knowing that
the events and suffering connected with the garrison of
Kars, had disturbed the sleep of the Sultan and his Minis-
ters, and who, in default of other means, had never ceased
to pray for their safety. (Hear, hear.) Was that ironer
Was it sarcasm ? He would not stop to ask if it was jus
tice. Had the noble lord ever heard of a country from
which th© youth and manhood of the land went forth in
high spirit to fight for that country's honour in a distant
land, and who were abandoned by their Government and
he had trespaesed at
allowed to perish by starvation, by cold, and every combi-
nation of harem wretchedness, anti had the miserable fate
(ch etas so
of his conntryrnen never disturbed the slumber or the re-
pose of the noble lord ? (Hear, hear, and cheers) Through
house—
great length upon the patience of the
to which leoeers, o
Realive "no
)—there was one other fact
to, call attention„and the hon, and

gallant member for Westminster would testify that he had
waited upon the noble lord about getting soldiers for Kars,
and though he could get any sol tiers for the war in general,
he could gat no assurance of measures being taken to relieve
the 'finking garrison of Kars. With regard to Persia, the
hon, member for Aylesbury had asked for aid in Per-
sia from the noble lord, but what was the answer ?
"Why did he interfere about
_Kers ?" The papers, too,
were there, showing that the Persian Ambassador was re-
ceived at St. Petersburg, and loaded with presents, with
a view,to future designs against that Herat about which
Sir John Cam Hokhouse spoke so strongly. The noble
lord had spoken a good deal about the fallen nationalities,
but when any proposition was made for the benefit of Eng-
land or Turkey, what was done ? Nothing. (Hear, ,hear.)
The great question of the conduct of the war was before
the house. The first point touched the conduct of an am-
bassador, and the Government attempted to tide off by
saying that it was owing to the neglect of a public servant
—a transparent device that could deceive no ono. (Hear,
hoar.) Was the house satisfied with the conduct of the
war? There were not two merchants amongst them who
after being a quarter of an hour in the Cabinet would not
have made better provision for Kars than they had done.
The public press said, " What was the use of referring to
the past ?" True, they could not redeem the past ; but
they might take precaution against the future. Peace,
with its blessings might disappear; war, with its horrors,
might break forth again ; nay, a more terrible war might
yet be lurking under a hollow peace. It was for them now
to take good precautions. It was a maxim of the ancients
never to pardon a second blunder in the conduct of a war,
a profound maxim that it would be well for the house to
adopt. He would ask them could they affirm that reso-
lution. He asked the question fearlessly, not appealing
to one party more than to the other, because he believed
that all were resolve I to maintain the honour of their
country. Wee they satisfied with the war ? Should
it go forth to the world that England could do no more
than subscribe four meet and a doctor for the bloody strife
in Turkey, and leave the army there to perish upon the
sm sliest atom of sustenance ? Would the house consent
before Europe to acknowledge its obligations to the Turk-
ish army ? He had placed that first in the resolution, be-
cause he thought it deserved best that position. They gave
aid to the English, they endured suffering in every form,
they followe 1 the gallant Williams exclaiming, "This is a
paths such as we never followed before.' Once only had
they broken out in murmurs. It is re:lorded that they
dashed their muskets to the ground, and cursed the coun-
try that they b elieved had betrayed them, but they mis-
took and confounded the country with the Government.
He believed there was not an artisan or a mechanic ie this
Empire who would not have shed his blood to have saved
t leen. (Loud and prolonged cheering,) Will you refuse,
I ask again ( ontinued the hon. and learned gentlema )), io
make your public acknowledgments joy.at ly of your debt
of gratitude to the officers who fought at the siege of
Kars? I should hardly think there will be d voice against
that. The gallant Williams speaks to the hearts of all of
you, from his bed of suffering. Will you say that the tall
of Kars did not endanger the Turkish provinces ? It did,
and involved larger interests in terrible peril. Will you
hesitate to say that there was a want of foresight on the
part of her Maj esty's Ministers ? Where was the grand
scheme boldly devised and ably executed? Where was the
use of that allied army fit to conquer a worl:l, or tbat
mighty fleet which was to sweep the seas ? Search the
mass of jargon in that blue book, and tell me where.
(Cheers.) Will you be satisfied with hollow words for
deeds, and take badly-written despatches for brilliant ac-
tions ? I rest this re ;elution upon the truth of the case.
I place it in your hands, invoking the high assistance of a
patriotic power, and anticipating the approving voice of
an indignant people. [The hon. and learned gentleman
took his seat after speaking for four and a half hours,
amidst immense cheering, which was prolonged for several
minutes.)
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL begged the house to de-
scend from the lofty heights to which the vivid eloquence
of the hon. and learned member for Enniskillen had carried
them, into the more sober region of fact and reality; and
while going through the facts of the case, it was not neces-
sary to excite hostile feelings towards Russia by recalling
her acts of aggression. We had now arrived at a peace
which he believed had achieved all the objects aimed at.
He would therefore come at once to Kars, and for that pur-
pose it was necessary to go back to the commencement 'of
the war, and see the position of the Turkish army in Ar-
menia. However brilliant the successes of the Turkish
army on the Danube, in other places they had been com-
pletely disoomfited. The. Russians beat them in August,
1851, and it was just after that that General Williams was
chosen to proceed to the seat of war. He would not read
blue books, but simply the despatches of General Wil-
liams, from which it appeared that there never was an
army less worthy the name of one than the Turkish
army in Asia when General Williams joined it. The
men were without discipline, food, or clothes, and the
officers were worse, if possible, than the men. They were
utterly incompetent in action, and when out of it the worst
set of robbers that ever disgracedjthe name of a soldier.
The colonels robbed the men of their fations of bread and
rice, and the chief man was the head of a band of smug-
gler?. In the medical department there were no medi•
tines, which, as Dr. Sandwith says, was fortunate, because
they did not know hew to use them. The medical officers
sold all their stores and instruments, and pretended they
had been seized by the Russians. Colonel Williams im-
mediately set to work to remedy that state of things. He
.urged upon the commanding officer the necessity of sup-
plies. The next thing was to get rid of Zedir Pacha, who
commanded the army at Kan, and countenanced all those
things. To do this it was necessary to get the co-operation
of the Turkish Government, and Colonel Williams was
put into communication with Lord Clarendon and Lord
Stratford do Redcliffe. His instructions were clear and
definite, to get all the information he could, and give the
best advice ho could to promote the welfare of the Turkish
army. It hid been said that he had not bean referred to
Lord Raglan, but that was inco rect, as the despatch from
Lord Rag' in, instructing him what to do, would show.
Bet then it was said ho had no authority over the Turkish
soldiers ; bnt that was no fault of the Home Government.
If the instructions sent to Lord Stratford do Redcliffe were
not attended, to, the Government were not to blame. Col.
Williams immediately put himself in communication with
Lord Stratford de Redcliffe, and urged that stores should
be sent from Trebizond, which was impossible. The sup-
plies had to be collected in Asia Minor, and forwarded to-
wards Erzeroum and Zas. He (the Attorney-General)
did not believe up to this point that anybody would say the
Government were to blame. As far as regarded Lord
Stratford de Reilcliffe's refusal to correspond with her
Majesty's commissioner, he was not there to defend that—
(hear)—but any high-spirited man who was sensitive of
censure from a, superior would consider the despatches
of the 6th and 11th of January, 1855, sufficient to cause
much pain and moitification. But what he would ask the
gentlemen opposite was, would they have been prepared
to say that her Majesty's Government ought to have re-
called Lord Stratford do Redcliffe? He was the most dis-
tinguished diplomatist they could command, and certainly
no partisan of the present Government. It was Lord
Derby's Government that had over-leaped the first and
unusual step in the peer tge, and made him a Viscount at
once for his great seryi-ees. No arnblssador of ours had
ever filled the post of ambassador with gi eater influence
and success, and he thought that simple proposition was a
better way to try the question than all the eloquence of Lis
hon. and learned frieed. World gentle eel opposite have
recalled Lira Stratford de Relcl;ffe?. But fro n the point
he bad just alluded t Col. Williams was found to he in
constant communication with Lord Stratford de Redcliffe,
and there was no lack of energy on his lordship's part to
promote the objects that Col. Williams had at heart This
part, however, the hon. gentleman opposite had pissed
over. [The hon. ant' learned gentleman then referred to
the procedings adopted to get tile incompetent leaches re-
moved.] Such was the state of things in March, 1855. The
army said to have been at Erzeroutn was found not t
number 20,000 men, the g enerele h tying conshntly
doubled the actual number of men so as to draw double
the rations required, and pocket the difference. Colonel
'Williams then writes for riinf a cements. The Turkish
Government would Lot withdraw any men from
the Danube or Bulgaria ; but honours de gentlemen
said, "You ought to have sent me I," but from whence
were they to co.no ? Evorybo ly a emitted the import-
ance of aiding Kars, but how was it to be done? This
country, never a gre tt military Power, had just awoke
from a long dream of peace. All the men that could be
got were wants lat Sebastopol. The Turkish Government
said they had 15,000 men at Bat Rim, of which they would
send 10,0)0; but when the 15,030 came to be examined
the whole number was found to be only 3,770. It was
afterwards proposed to send the British contingent of
20,000, General Beatson's corps of 3,000, and General
Vivian's ci n'degent, but this was not done owing to their
being raw beer-re. Omer Pacha himself, in July, declared
them unfit for •service in that country. Another reason
was, that the British Government know nothing of Cle
country nor of the roads, and shat would have been sail
had 30,00) or 40,000 men been landed in a strange country,
and the expedition had failed ? How could the Govern-
ment have Justified themselves? It was afterwards' pro-
posed that Omer Pacha should take his. own course. He
went to Constantinople, and at the council, which was
attended by Lord Stratford de Redcliffe, it was suggested
that Omer Pacha should take the Turkish forces from
Eupatoria, and attempt a diversion in Circassia. But it
was previously necessary to obtain the concurrence of the
French Government, and ho was sure that iu doing its
duty the house would not forget what was due- to our
Imperial ally. Tile French Government, however, wished
all the force_ practicable to be concentrated upon Sebas-
topol, believing that the fate of the operations there
would decide the issue of the war. The French Govern-
meet acccr lingly agreed to Omer Pacha preceeding to
Armenia, or Circassia, upon condition that the number
of troops before Sebastopol was not diminished. But
then another diffioulty arose. Omer Pacha peremp-
torily refused to move unless he had the troops from
Balaklava, who had followed him through the campaign on
the Danube, instead of the Eupatoria troops, in welch be
had no confidgpce. What did the British Government do ?
They tried to Obtain the consent of the French Government,
and Lord Clarendon sent a telegraphic despatch to Lord
Cowley proposing that what had been suggested by Omer
Pacha should be agree 1 to. It is at page 267 of the blue-
book, No. 291. Lord Cowley sent back a telegraphic mes-
sage to the effect that the Emperor had no objection to the
removal of the troops from Balaklava, if they appeared fit
to the generals in command, but that he himself would not
take the responsibility. But it turned out that Generals
Pei
rem omvi ae lr oar ti
ie Simpsontroops had the greatest o
Balaklava.
General
to such
Simpson
protested in the strongest manner oven against having the
Turkish Contingent sent to the army before Sebastopol, or
'sent to the Crimea at all in its actual state. What, then,
was the precise nature of the charge brought against the
Packs
refused have
hi
Government?-what was the specifidaccusatioe ? We had
said that we objected to sending our own troops without
necessaries, but we had no objection to sending Turkish
troops frtoomreEc:ipvaettoho
Eupatoria,
id
.1
the otthhveterans from Balaklava, or he would have none at all.
The ontingEint. must besides, in that case, have been taken
to Balaklava from Eupatoria, a most necessary point to
saeart h
heand m, ()sut el;
defend. Meanwhile the generals said—You must not move
a man from Balaklava till the place has fallen, Was our
Government, then, to fly in the face of our allies, and
have taken the troops from Balaklava ? Suppose the Go-
vernment had done all this—suppose they had taken the
troops from Balaklava, and sent the troops at.Eupatoria to
Balaklava—and suppose any catastrophe to have occurred,
site have wrung with exclamations at their folly and hn-
what would have been said—how would the het.e'.es oppo-
providence. If, then, the troops could not be sent from
Eupatoria, and the generals forbid their being sent from
Balaklava, what troops had the Government to send ? We
had exhausted ourown resources to send men to the Crimea.
The winter had passed over with much distress, but our
'army bad at lest become efficient; and were we to divide
it—to have sent one-half of it to Armenia, while we left
the other half before Sebastopol? What would have been
the declamation if the Government had adopted such a
course? lent then it was said that we might have sent
supplies. Supplies from where? What was to be got was
in Asia,-Minor itself. Some supplies of war might have
been sent from Conszantinople, and the blue-book shows
that the exertions of Lord Stratford-de Recleliffe were int-
ceesant to get supplies sent, and supplies were sent, Gen,

Williams acknowledges the receipt of ammunition, powder,
and ban, for the heavy guns. Some artillerymen were also
sent off. Many of thorn never reached their destination ;
they were stopped at Erzeroutio, but the British Govern-
ment were not responsible for the irregularities and pecu-
lations of the Turkish authorities. But then again the
hon. and learned gentleman said that the Government
ought to have sent money. Money ! in what form ; as a
gift or as a loan ? (Loud cheers.) If as a gift, it would be
said that we were recurring to the old system of subsidies.
If as a loan the ministry would not have dared to ask it.
They had asked leave to raise the Turkish- Continent.
It was said that what was wanted was efficient soldiers,
commanded by efficient officers. Now, he believed
that the Turkish soldiers were bravo and efficient,
but the officers were just the reverse. When they asked
for the contingent how were they met ? Who was so loud
in his denunciation as the hon. and learned gentleman op-
posite. Then, when they asked for a loan they were told
that they had not made out a sufficient case? They were
toll that time was wanted for consideration, and the right
hon. gentleman the member for the University of Cam-
bridge urged in July the postponement of theloan. Where
was the hon. and learned gentleman on that occasion he
should like to know, who to-night was denouncing the am-
bition of Russia, and actually seeme 1 to grieve at the re-
turn of peace? Why, the hon. and learned gentleman, on
that occasion, opposed the loan He had no doubt that
the hon. andlearned gentleman acted conscientiously when
he said that rendering pecuniary assistance to Turkey was
a false policy ; but what he did complain of was, the in-
consistency of theirturning round and denouncing the Go-
vernment for not sending money. The sum and substance
of the attack was, that the Government had not done all
to avert the fall of Kars which it might have done. Now,
he wanted to know what were the precise points by which
the Government could have prevented the fall of Kars
which they did not do. He was not one who judged solely
by events, yet when the hon. gentleman said that the down-
fall of Kars was the downfall of Turkey, yet the concentra-
tion of the troops upon Sebastopol had proved to be the real
test of succws. What was the result? Kars fell, Sebastopol
fell also, but the Russians have not advanced to Cene tan ti-
nople. The-reel responsibility for the fell of Kers rested,
he asserted, on Selim Pacha, who commanded a consider-
able force, and most wen were agreed that if Salim Pacha
had done his duty Kars would not have fallen. Was it
fair to throw the blame on the British Government, seeing
that there was already a sufficient force in Armenia that
they did not withdraw their troops from Sebastopol--or to
assert that they would have been justified in so doing?
Again, it was said that Omer Pacha might have prevented
the fall of Kars. Now, when Omer Pacha found his
troops at liberty, he did land at Circassia, but he could get
no further. Ho would have been in time to have relieved
Kars. He (the Attorney-General) heard some one say he
would have relieved Kars if he had been in time He denied
this. The reason wss not advanced, but he was stopped
by the same difficulties which would have been met with
by our own troops if they ha I made the attempt. It
seemed to be the universal opinion that Omer Pacha failed
because he went by way of Circassia, and if he had fol-
lowed the plan which Gen. Williams advised, he might
have succeeded. Was it a ground of objection to her.
Majesty's Government that Omer Pecha's expedition failed?
But now that peace was ratified, that the substance of its
condition was known—that the herald of peace would most
probably to-morrow announce it in official language—an
attack was made on the Government for this single failure.
Turkey was preserved and the British name honoured.
When were the resources of the British empire ever s gre t
—as a proof of whish there was the noble spectacle which
they all witnessed on Wednesday. (Laughter.) Hon. gentle-
men might laugh, but he did not think this eu object
for ridiaule or merriment. It really showed that while
the enemy was in a state of exhaustion, Britain was
never is a batter position for continuing the war. This
was to be attributed partly no doubt to the liber-
ality of Parliament : but some credit was due to those
un ler whose administration of the country such results
had-been produced in so short a time. On looking round
he saw every reason for exultation in the present position
of the country. But the hon. and learned gentleman, in
the midst of peace, found, on looking back, one little dark
spot which had produced no results, and hail not retarded
the successful issue of the war. The hon. gentleman
seized upon this as a party triumph. But the house and
the country were too just and too generous to take such a
view of the affair, or to visit it with their censure.
L )rd J. MANNERS said that the hon. and learned
gentleman sued for the approval of the house in forma,
pauperis, net on the particular case, but on the general
issue. He felt it his duty to recal the house to the real
question. The bon. gentleman had candidly admitted that
there was ono little dark spot on our military affairs, and
hail endeavoured to diminish its importance with something
approaching to ridicule. But what was the importance of
the fall of Kars? It meant that the power of England
had failed before that of Russia in the East ; that Persia.
had become a moral province of Russia; that the power
of Russia had been established from the Caucasus to
Hindoo Moosh. When he was asked respecting
the fall of Kars, the honourable gentleman would seem
by what he said to suppose that Kars had not fallen. Ho
had done justice to the Turkish Goveranceent in admit-
ting that that Government had done something to re-
lieve Kam It was not the fault of the authorities at Con-
stantinople, and those in Armenia had shown the most
laudable desire to put the army on an efficient footing.
But the hon. gentleman in his desire to whitewash his
Government throws the blame on Selim Pacha, when
Selim Pacha was responsible for Eizeroam, the nest im-
portant place to the Russian armies. He had but 3,000
men ; and what with these could he have done against
30,010 men admirably equipped; when, if h 3 had failed,
the result would have been the immediate capture of
Erzeromn. If, then, there was no one else to blame, upon
whom could the blame fall but upon her Majesty's Minis-
ters ? The hon. and learned gentleman passed over that
part of.his hon. friend's (Mr. Whiteside) speech, which re-
ferred to her Majesty's agent at Constantinople. He (Lord
J. Manners) did not think Lord Stratford implicated in
the neglect which had lost Kars. If his advice had been
taken, Kars would not have been lost. He did not think
that the catastrophe would have happened if the hon. mera-
Om for Aylesbury had been Minister for Foreign Affairs,
and Lord Ellenborough, Minister at War. When the only
use made of them was to deprive Turkey of 20,00 J men, then
he said their absorption into the English army was one of
the causes. which led to the fall of Kers. Let them read
the language of Omer Pacha, Colonel Symonds, and
others, and then say whether if they had remained in
Turkish pay in August last they would not have effected
this diversion, which Our Government would not let them
make when in their pay ? The hon. and learned gentle-
man had not correctly stated the facts with regard to the
projects fur the relief of Kars. Had he shaken the opi-
nion expressed by all the military authorities at Consten-
tinopl in favour of the diversion proposed by the Turkish
Government in Juno ? He said, indeed, that Omer
Pacha, could not hive succeeded if his expedition had
bean underlaken at •an earlier period, for he
said that the weather had nothing to do with impeding
his march. But we were expressly told by his. Oliphant
that the season of the year and the state of the elements
had everything to do with the matter.
The ATIORNEY-GENERAL did not say that the
weather was no obstacle, but that it was not the only ob-
stacle.
Lord J. MA NNERS said that all other obstacles had
been removed by the genius of Omer Pacha. The Russian
troops had been defeated ; the Georgian and Mingrelian
levies had been dispersed ; broken bridges had been re-
placed, and nothing but the break up of the weather pre-
vented his taking Ktitais, in sight of which his army ap-
proached. In fact nothing c :uld have prevented the suc-
cess of Omer ?ache, bad he undertaken his expedition at
an earlier period. The fault of this ley with our Govern-
ment. For the French Government did not at first stipu-
late that no Turkish troops should he taken from. before
Sebastopol, but simply that the total number of the troops
there should not be reduced. But then, said the lion.
and learned gentleman, what could the Government do
but yield to the objections which the French Government
raised on the 2d of August to the departure of Omer Pacha
with the troops from before Sebastopol. But he could
net see the necessity of a second reference to the
French •Cabinet., after they had once acceded to
the fernier proposal. And even when they nut it
was clear that the despatch sent permitted the allied
generals no latitude but to decidd in what pro-
pordous Oyer. Paella's troops were to be replaced
by tlie contingent, and by troops from Eupatoria. Omer
Pacha was, subject to their being replaced from these
sources, to be allowed to take as many of his own troops as
he liked to Asia Minor. But then the end of the despatch
threw upon Gen. Simpson and Gen. Pelissier the respon-
sibility of deciding whether Owe: Pacha—the independent
general of an independent power—should be allowed to
try to save the key of one of its fairest provinces. 13nt it
was said that after Sebastopol fell Gen. Simpson and Gen.
Pelissier showed no indisposition to allow Omer Pacha to
proceed! to Kars. But he deduced very different conclu-
MOM from the blue-book. Nearly three weeks after the
fell of Kars, Col. Symonds stated that on the 13th Sept.
Gen. Pelissier had permitted the embarkation of three bat-
talions, but that up to that time that was all the Turkish
troops before Sebastopol that he had allowed to embark.
This showed the ill effect of that addition to the telegraphic
despatch of August, which threw the responsibility of
detaining the troops of Omer Pacha in the Crimea on the
allied generals before Sebastopol. They were told that the
Government would have been deserving of censure had
they run counter to the opinions of the allied generals, and
had determined to allow Omer Paella to make his expedi-
tion. One point which should not be lost sight of had
hitherto escaped notice. On the L3th and 14th of July
Lords Clarendon and. Pantoure repressntel the fate of Kars
as nearly hopeless, and rejected the best plan for relie-ving
Kass as wild and impracticable. But on the 18th of July
Lord Clarendon wrote a (:esdatch to Gen. Williams to
continue that defence, which, on the lath of July, he had
proclaimed to be 'hopeless. Was this creditable to the fore.
sight, or the decision, or the clearsightedness of our Beg.
lists Minister ? Did that letter produce no effect on General
Williams ?• We hear from Mr. Sand with that General
Williams was kept at his post, and deterred from attempt.
ing to cue his way through the Russian army by the vehe-
ment encauragetnentsof Lord Clarendon,who had, neverthe-
less, a few days before, stated his belief twat their care was
hopeless. Then the hon. and learned gentleman said that
the Government did all a Government could do ; that,
they wrote despatches to Lord de Radcliffe and General
Williams. But of what value were these despatches ?
They sent neither men, money, nor materiel. And they
refused to assent to- the proposals of either the Turkish
Government or Omer Paella to find ,men, and to make an
attempt. And when at last they did permit an expedi-
tion, they clogged their assent with conditions that ren-
dered it valueless. They refused the Turks permission to
make their own efforts, they sent them nothing, they gave
them no assistance; but they sent them advice by reams,
its only defect being that it was foolish, impracticable,
and inconsistent. Could any one deny that the advice
given by the Government was deservedly characterised
in this way, when they saw that the counsel they declined
to take in July they tardily adopted in September?
This charge against the Government. was, that while
they did nothing, they prevented others from doing that
which might have had the effect of relieving Kars.
He charged against them inconsistency, vacillation, self-
contradiction, of proposing plans which %ere imperfect
and useless, and defeating plans which were statesman-
like and useful. He charged the Government that the
noble lord at their hoed, who had opposed that wise settle-
ment of our differences with America by the Ashourton
treaty, had so'copdnated our effail s in Asia Minor as to
restore the military supremacy of Russia in Asia, and to
enable Russian diploniatists iu Paris to regain in Asia
what tbey had lost in Europe. (Hear.)
When the noble lord resumed his seat no one rose, and
there were loud cries for a division. After a short interval,

The LORD ADVOCATE Mid the honourable and learned
gentletn'anwho had proposed the resolution had passed from

one brilliant incous:Stcney to another. It was not true
that the fall of Kars was due to the want of fore4;lit ou the
part of the British Government. For if there was one thing
clear, it was that if there was one man who had exerted him-

self throughout from first to last—indefence of Turkoy, and
iu promotion of the relief of Kars, it WAS Lord glarendon.
Indeed the hen. and learned gentleman himself seemed to
feel clniethin of this, for in the conmencenatut Of his