The Sun.
London, England, 1833-02-21 00:00:00

ronet, and observed, that as to the objection about the bu-
siness being done under the presidency of another person
besides the Speaker, he did not think it ought to have any
weight, considering the importance of the questions of
supply discussed when the Chairman of Committees was
in the chair.
Sir T. FREMANTLE wished the House rather to
adopt his plan of meeting at three o'clock, and devoting
from that time till half-past five to the • consideration of
private business and petitions. The plan of meeting at
twelve o'clock would be most inconvenient. Hon. Mem-
bers would then have no opportuntty of considering and
answering the letters which they received upon public
business. —(Hear, hear.) The House would, besides,
suffer from the want of the presence of the Ministers ; for
though the Noble Lord opposite said he would attend at
one o'clock. that would not be sufficient, for the Noble
Lord, to whose courtesy and attention all the House were
much indebted, could not possibly undertake to answer
questions put with respect to other branches of the Go-
vernment. He objected, too, to the plan, because it would
male the House sit while Committees up stairs were sit-
ting. Now those Committees were often composed of the
most important Members of the House, who would not
like to be absent, and who yet could not be in two places
at once. If a division came on, they must hasten from
the Committee rooms to divide on a question of which
they had not heard a word, or else they would be liable to
the supposition of having been absent from their duty.
Mr. LITTLETON objected to the plan of having peti-
tions presented when the Chairman of the Committees was
in the Chair ; for he feared that there would be neither
such an attendance, nor such if any one but the Speaker
himself presided, though he was anxious to say, that during
the twenty years' experience which be (Mr. Litt'.eton) had
ad in that House, be had never seen any one who bad
discharged the duties of his office with more attention,
courtesy, or ability, than the Hon. Member for Rochester.
He was in favour of the plan of meeting at twelve and
continuing till three, and then adjourning to five, at
which hour public business should peremptorily begin.
Mr. GOULBURN thought that the inconvenience
which they were now endeavouring to remedy was chiefly
occasioned by a want of discretion in Hon. Members in
extending their remarks beyond what was necessary for
the purpose of explaining their object.— (Hear, hear.)
He feared that by giving an increase of time, they would
but increase the tendency of Members to indulge in that
habit.—(Hear, hear.) In his opinion, sitting from Ito
S for private business, would not remedy the grievance
which was found to exist when the House sat from 3 to 4 ;
at last it would be driven to re-adopt the system of ballot.
It seemed important to have a continuous sitting, and that
Committees should meet at some period of the day when
the House was not sitting.

Mr. HUME was much disposed to try the experiment
recommended by the Noble Lord. A long continuous
sittirg was of course objectionable, and the break pro-
posed would be convenient. If business commenced at 11
in the ctiy, he thought that it ought to terminate at 11 at
night. He thought that business would sever be properly
conducted, until private matters were disposed of else-
where, so that the House could devote its whole attention
to the public afftirs of the country.
Mr WARBURTON concurred with the Hon. Member
for Middlesex, and recommended that the quorum should
be reduced from 40 Members to 20.

Lord SANDON was also in favour of sitting early in
the day, but suggested that the Speaker should come into
the llou-e at a quarter before 1, and remain until 1, and
if then a quorum was not present, adjourn till 5 o'clock.
Mr. BUCKINGHAM proposed that the House should
meet at two o'clock—that private business should con-
tinue until four—that public petitions should be presented
until six, and that general questions should be discussed
from six until twelve o'clock, but no new subject com-
menced after eleven o'clock. To regulate debates, he pro.
posed as rules—that no Member should speak that had
not previously put down his name on a list—that no
Member should be allowed to speak for more than twenty
minutes, excepting in bringing forward a measure or mo-
tion, and then for thirty minutes, both for his speech and
reply. On petitions, no Member ought to be allowed to
speak on any petition for more than ten minutes, and to
order or in explanation for only five minutes.
Sir M. W. RIDLEY 'agreed that much would be
gained if Members would compress their sp eches, but it
seemed to him impossible to fix any stated hour for ad-
jeurnment. He apprehended, that if the House sat from
12 t., 3, much of what was said would not appear in the
newspapers. Ile did not anticipate any great advantage
from the plan, hut it seemed the dutyof the House to try it.
Mr. WYNN was of opinion that the Speaker should
take the Chair at 1 o'clock, and that the House should
not then be counted. The length of debates was owing
partly to the increased anxiety of the public to know what
passed in the House, and the corresponding anxiety of
Members to make speeches for the satisfaction of their
constituents. The modern practice of frequently adjourn-
ing debates had contributed to the same end, and it would
be expedient for the House to discourage the practice. A
.great deal of time was wasted upon petitions, when mea-
sures were debated instead of facts only being stated. On
the whole, he was wiling to try the experiment, although
the plan was not unobjectionable.
Lord MORPETH expressed a hope that the proposed
arrangement of his Noble Friend would have the effect of
keeping apart from each other the discussion of subjects
that were not naturally connected, and that they would
pot have upon petitions a series of observations upon mat-
ters totally distinct. He hoped the House would agree to
the motion then before them, and give the plan of his
Noble Friend a fair trial.

Mr. O'CONNELL could not thus permit the petitions
of the people to he, as it were, thrown into a refuse corner
for that, in effect, would be the operation of the Noble
Lord's plan; it was, in fact, a way rather of getting rid
of the petitions than of discussing them. Another objec-
tion to the proposed alteration arose, in his opinion, from
this—that it was now proposed that twenty Members
tdanuld constitute a House. In his opinion, forty were
too few a number to form a quorum of a body so nume-
OW, as the House of Commons; and he was sure there
WWI no one who took the trouble to reflect for a mo-
ment on the subject, who would not agree with him that
even a hundred would not be too large a quorum, consti-
toted as the House now was ; for the time had passed
Away when the House was made up of the nominees of
borough owners, who only took care to be present at those
ilieisions in which their nominors were interested. The
people now had considerable influence in that House and
accordingly there had been since the assembling of the re-
formed Parliament a very full and constant attendance,
and he felt quite assured, that if a hundred were made to
constitute the quorum, it would be an alteration attended
with no inconvenience, and calculated to produce very ad-
vantageous results. It had been said that the habits of
society had materially changed of late years, and that
those habits greatly interfered with the change in question ;
he admitted that there had been a very great change in
the habits of society ; but on the other hand he was pre-
pared to assert that the change did by no means require
that they should run counter to everything like reason
and common sense—indeed it was his opinion that the
change in the habits of society were rather favourable than
otherwise to the rational practice of doing business by
for the change referred to mainly consisted in
circumstance of the dinner hour becoming gradually
later itod later till it was now approaching towards
o'oloek, Now if the business were conducted in the day-
time, the boor of dinner would not be at all interfered
with, Let them at once come to real business hours, and
no longer encroach upon those which ought to be devoted
to repose and relaxation. He found, upon a reference to
the Journals. that in the year 1614, the House was in
the habit of meeting so early as seven o'clock in the
morning, and that if a House were not constitutes by
eight o'clock, it would adjourn to the following day,
and after twelve o'clock no new business could be entered
upon. He found, too, that all Members not pre-
sent at eight o'clock, were liable to a fine of one shilling,
and that those who absented themselves for the whole
day, should pay a fine of five shillings, and that the Ser-
geant-at-Arms should gather in the money.—(A laugh.)
The first day on which candles were lighted in that House
was an ominous day for England—it was the day on which
the King assailed the privileges of that Houie and the
liberties of the people, by his violent conduct within those
walls, when he assumed the chair in that House. But to
return to the matter before them. It was hie opinion that
the business of the House might every day be concluded
by. eight o'clock, if they assembled at ten in the morning.
Dinner and its concomitants were but bad stimulants for
an effective discharge of Parliamentary duties, though
they might have the effect of stimulating Hon. Members to
continue the debate longer than was consistent with the
health of Members, or the true interests of the consti-
tuent body. He again would press upon the attention of
the House, that they were the only deliberative body in
the world aalio transacted business at night. He was aware
that it would not do to sit ten hours in every day, but three
days under that arrangement would be quite sufficient in
each week for the real business of the country. It was
his opinion that the whole matter should be referred to a
Committee.
Mr. EWART advocated a return to the good old habits
of our ancestors, and do business when beads were cool
and clear.
An Hon. MEMBER observed that any change in the
hours of doing business would deprive them of the pre-