The Sun.
London, England, 1833-02-28 00:00:00

not-wait two weeks before we unmake the Constitution of
Ireland? You wi►l lose nothing by delay. Ministers allow
that it they obtain this law, they will not call it into
operation at once; they will not use it unless some ne-
cessity demands. Why not let tt rest in this House as
well as in the hands of the Government ?—(Hear.) Why
should the Ministers rush so hastily into the odious re-
soonsibility 01 this danaernus power? Let it rest unal-
t-red, unmutilated, in this House ; postpone it only from
week to week, ready to be passed the inst•nt it is re-
quired; passed too with less delay and less acrimony than
at present; with much less excuse for prolonged and de•
tailed opposition—much less reluctance in the English
Members—much less procrastination—much fewer ad-
journments and debates—l will venture to say, even from
the most indignant of the Irish Members themselves; the
striae purpose of terror will he answered; the Irish people
will equally see this armed law hanging over their heads
—they will see at what penalty they must incur crime.
Thus, pet haps, you will obtain all th•• goad that the pass
ing of the I isv can secure, hut without the same actual
and formal violation of liberty—without provoking the
same exasperation, or incurring the same responsibility.
Let us then try this experiment—let the Government
make tide wise pause—they will lose nothing by it, they
may gain much. No one can blame theta for cowardice,
fir reluctance, in a little white suspending a law by whicti
the Constitution itself is suspended. In the observations I
have made, I have endeavoured to show that these new
powers are not effective because they are violent; that
they will not constitute an impartial tribunal, nor protect
the witness, nor meet the crimes for which they are de-
manded ; that they confound in one blind punishment the
innocent with the guilty; and that, forming part of a con-
tradictory
and jarring system, they suffice to annihilate the
benefits of conciliating one party without the advantage of
cone liating the other. Th, is not all. You desire them
to put down the Political Asie,itiations as well as those
that are combined only for plunder. You may do so, but
you will only throw the eruption into the constitution—
you will only destroy the outward sign of the disease, by
iucreasing its inward violence. We are the true quellers
of agitation, who would give no cause to agitate. We
are the true tamers and masters of the Learned Member for
Dublin, who would take from his hands his only substan-
tial power—the power of just complaint. You flatter
yourselves, that under shelter of those laws you will be
able, with effect, to apply your remedial measures : it is
just the reverse—they will blight all your remedies, and
throw their own withering shad• v over all your conces
sions. Ido not fear an open rebt 'ion against the armed
force and discipline of England; but if you madden the
people, it is impossible to citculata the strength of insa-
nity. But I allow that an open rebellion is the least evil
to be feared—l fear more a sullen, bitter, unforgiving recol-
lection, which will distrust all our kindness and misinter-
pret all our intentions—which will take all grace from
our gifts—which will ripen a partial into a general &site
fur a separate legislation, by a settled conviction of the
itijustic• of this, so that at tact the Eugliah people them-
selves, worn out with unavailing experiments—wearied
with an expensive and thankless charge—and dissatisfied
with a companionship which gives teem nothing but the
' contagion of its own diseases, will be the first to ask for
that very dismemberment of the empire which we are
now attempting to prevent. I shall conclude with a very
few words, to be found in one of the most splendid ora-
tions that adorn our time—l mean the speech of Lord
Brougham, on the second reading of the Ref trim Bill. I
quote it not as an instance of inconsistency—this question
is far too wide to be reduced to the petty criteria by which
individuals are acquitted or defended. I quote it only as
an instance of that large and catholic wisdom which is
applicable to all circumstance and all time :—" Tnose
pal tentous appearances, the growth of later times—
tnose figures that stalk abroad, of unknown stature,
and strange foi in—unions, and leagues, and musters
hags of men in myriads, and conspiracies against the
Exchequer—whence do they spring, and how come
they to haunt our shores ? What power engendered these
uncouth shapes—what multiplied the monstrous births,
till they people the land ? Tiust me, the some p twer
which called into frightful existence, and armed with re
sist'ess force, the Irish volunteers of 1782—the same
power which rent in twain your. empire, and conjured up
toirteen republics—the sauce power which created the Ca•
tholic Association, and gave it Ireland for a pampa).
What power is that ? Justice denied by the right of pe-
titioniog—iights withhela—aye, Trial by Jury—wrong.
perpetrated—yes ! domiciliary viaitsl—the force woich
common injuries lend to millions. This it is that has
conjured up the strange sights at which we now stand
aghast !" And shall we persist in the fatal error co con•
batting the giant progeny, instead of extirpating the exe-
crable parent? Good Gud ! Will men never learn wis-
dom, even from titeir ow❑ experience? Flom their own
experience ! from the speeches ef Lord Brougham him
self ? You calm tt expect to gather in any other crop than
they did who went before you, if you persevere in their
utterly abominable hu►bandry, of sowing injustice and
reaping rebellion. The Hun. Gentleman sat down amidst
loud cheering.
Sir JOHN BYNG said, that before be offered a few
observations to the House, he thought it necessary to state

that he bad much expe, ience with respect to the affaits of
Leland. He had dwelt in that country for years, and he
cud never divest himself of the korily terlitis with which
he was actuated ;owards vie I istt p-op:e, for the attach-
ment they invariably manitested towards him. He satin
this to show that it must he with deep regret that h.
round himself campelled to a;:kn...wle.ige that the present
measure, of Governin,nt were absolutely necessary fir the
government of Ireland. At the same time that he allowed
that some of the reports on the disturbances of Ireland
were exaggerated, he considered that they contained ta;.t.
sufficient to call for the present coercive measures. The
Government could not lie misinformed on the whole, sin e
their information was obtained from the reports of the
Magistrates and the Police, and, above all from the re-
ports of military officers. The latter were bound to report
to G“vernment all that happened in the vicinity of the r
respective stations. Such reports were invariably correct,
for officers in making them felt that their characters were
at stake ; and the Right Hon. Secretary for Ireland could
bear testimony that the-e reports were to be implicitly re-
lied upon. With respect to what had been frequently said
by Hun. Members, that Whiteboyisin had no connection
with political offences, he be:tged to differ from that opinion.
He would distinctly declare that the connection existed ; for
he had proofs that the outrages perpetrated by Wiiitenoys
or Nl7hitefeet were connected with political obj,cts, He had
teceived a letter a few days ago from a friend in Ireland,
who stated that, on account of his political opinions, be
had been marked out as an o ject of Whiteboy vengeance.

With respect to this connectio❑ there ct,uld be no doubt.
When lie declared that he would support the proposed
Bill, he me ,nt by that declaration, that he would vote ftx
the first reading of it, and for its general outline, reserving
his opinion as to certain details. He begged to correct
the statement, that officers presiding at couttsmartial were
liable to be impeached and put upon their trials in the
same manner as ordinary Judges. They incurred no such
liability. There was another observation that required to
be noticed. It bad been stated, that the young officers
who might become members of courtsmartial would be
liable to he influenced in their judgments. No one better
than he knew the spirit that actuated young officers in the
army ; and he would say, that any effort made to influence
tom would completely fail. He would conclude by ob-
serving, that he was opposed to the principle of martial
law, and that nothing but the greatest necessity could
compel him to vote for such ame !sure as the present. It
was his opinion, however, that if the proposed Bill was
not carried, it would be the first stone thrown at the
separation of the two countries.
Mr. GROTE rose and said, that it was not without
considerable reluctance he presented himself to the notice
of the House. He could not help, however, commenting
on a measure which the Noble Mover of it himself had de

signated as arbitrary and despotic. He ought, perhaps, to
have given the precedence to some Irish Member, better
acquainted with the question before them than he was, and
more interested in it. His plea would be, that he felt upon
the question, and on the present occasion, that he was as
much an Irishman as an Englishman. Such was his
feeling, and he hoped that it would be, as it ought to be,
the feeling of every English Member in that House. As
Louis the Fourteenth said formerly to his grandson, when
sending him into Spain, " My son, recollect that there
exists no longer any Pyrennean mountains," so he would
recollect that there existed no longer any Irish Channel,
and draw no line of distinction between the two coun-
tries. Ile made no distinction, and he felt as much
interested in the happiness and prosperity of Ireland,
as he did in those of England. There was no dif-
ference in his sympathy—it extended equally to both
sides of the Channel. Having made these few remarks,
he would now say, that in spite of the respect he felt to-
wards the quarter from whence the projected measure came,
he could not give it his approval. It contained, he granted,
some wise and tutelary provisions ; but, taking it as a
whole, he considered it as unlikely to attain the end for
which it was destined. He had listened patiently to the
long catalogue of Irish enormities which the Noble Lord
opposite had laid before the House. Such a catalogue con-
tain, a nothing new to him, as it was not the first time he
had heard th it the Irish were a lawless ropl,, who
were not to be bound down by courts of justice. They
ever had neer' a I.wle,a peok.le, and the Noble Lord
had not sufficiently dwelt upon that tact. If the Noble
Lord had done so, then it would be for them to examine