The Sun.
London, England, 1851-05-20 00:00:00

EVENING,

~" '~T

MAY

been considered, and justly considered, advisable to
preserve with regard to the exact prAts and business
matters of a private and confi lential nature. Aceord-
iegly the Act had provided that seven Commissioners
should be selected from the Commissioners of Land and
Assessed Taxes, to whom as appeal should be made in
the first instance, with an appeal, if desired, to a special
commissioner. He was afraid that the appeal could not
be carried further consistently with an income-tax,
and with that secrecy which was due to the private
affairs of individuals,—(Hear, hear.) With regard to
the observetion of the Noble Lord who had last
spoken, ho was not about to express any opinion
very different from that which he had formerly ex-
pressed as to the objectionable character of the income-
' tax as a fixed tax. He had expressed that opinion very
strongly in 1842, and he still entertained !hat opinion;
but at the same time he was bound to say that experience
had convinced him that the immense advantage procurer]
to :he country by means of the income-tax was worth
the sacrifice which had been made for that purpose.—
ffear.) The Noble Lard had remarked that the income-
tax had been calculated only at 3,500,0001., and for three
years; while it had produced upwards of 5,000,0001,
and had been continued for nine years. It was the pro-
ductiveness of the tax beyond what was antjcipated that
farmed one of the reasons why he should be reconciled
to its being imposed. In 1842 his opinion was, that for
so sniall an amount as 3,000,0001., it was hardly worth
while to resort to so objectionable a tax as an income-
tax; but when, in consequence of its greater productive-
ness, the Government were enabled to make reforms in
our financial system, that result was one well calculated
to alter the opinions he at the time entertained. It was
with extreme astonishment that he had heard the Noble
Lord opposite assert that the imposition of the income-
tax had enabled the Government only to get rid of taxa-
tion the relief from which had been felt by no one—
Lord STANLEY—I spoke with reference to the pro-
posed reduction in the timber and coffee duties. _

Earl GREY—The statement of his Noble Friend near
him (the Marquis of Lansdowne) appeared to him con-
clusive as to the advantages which the country had de-
rived from our late commercial policy. His Noble
Friend had told them that putting the income-tax out of
the question, the amount of taxes remitted since 1842
had been not less than 10,000,0001., and that notwith-
standing such a remission the logs of income did not ex-
ceed 700,0001.—(Hear, hear.) Indeed he might say that
by the remission of taxes which never went into the
Exchequer, but which fettered trade, the total amount
of' relief given was not over-estimated at 20,000,0001.—
(Hear, hear.) He should not follow the Noble Lord
through all the taxes to which he alluded, and which he
thought ought not to have been repealed. He was,
however, surprised that his Noble Friend should have
adverted to the reduction of the stamp duties as an
alteration not worth the sacrifice of income it had en-
tailed. It was the fate of Chancellors of the Exche-
quer to be very little thanked for their services, but his
Right Hon. Friend had considered what was best for
the public, and had deemed the alteration worth the sa-
crifice. It had been admitted that the schedule of
stamp duties was one full of injustice and inequality—
that it pressed on smaller transactions in a manner that
rendered these transactions frequently impossible, and
that it placed obstructions in the way of transfers of
property, and other commercial and business transac-
tions. By a small sacrifice of revenue the stamp duties
had been placed on a fair footing, and the reports re-
ceived from solicitors throughout the country proved that
the effect of the alteration had been relief to an almost
incalculable extent on transactions among persons in the
hucobler ranks of life. The full benefit of such reduc-
tions might not be reaped at first, but their Lordships
might depend upon it that every obstruction taken out of
the free career of industry and enterprise was at no dis-
tant period productive of the most beneficial effects.
Amongst all reductions which had been made he
believed few were likely to be more beneficial
than the alteration of the stamp duties. He thought
the Noble Lord opposite must in what he had stated
on this subject have entirely misunderstood what
had fallen from his Noble Friend near him. The Noble
Lord had represented the proposal of Government as
implying a determination gradually to get rid of duties
on customs. and to trust for revenue entirely to direct
taxation. Where the Noble Lord found grounds for
such an interpretation of his Noble Friend's speech he
was at a loss to know, for his Noble Friend had specially
guarded himself against saying anything that could jus-
tify such an implication. Perhaps their Lordships
would allow him to state what ho conceived to be the
real principle of this Bill. He considered the object of
the Bill, not to be to get rid of custom duties as distin-
guished from other indirect taxes, but to get rid of those
taxes, whether of custom or of excise, which were ob-
structions to the industry of the country.—(Hear, hear.)
He might remind the Noble Lord that a very large por-
tion of the revenue which had been sacrificed in conse-
quence of the income-tax had been derived, not from
custom, but from excise duties ; and that the reduction
of the duties on bricks and on glass had been no incon-
siderable items of relief. Never had two articles of tax-
ation been so judiciously relieved. Their Lordships were
all aware of the brilliant display in connexion with the
manufacture of glass that the metropolis exhibited at this
moment. The improvement in the manufacture of glass
had been going on, for the last few years, from day to
day; and dated from the time when the exciseman'e in-
terference was put an end to in the works. Although
the reduction of the brick duty had only been made last.
year, still it had been most beneficial. A landowner
himself, and, like others, feeling the pressure of the
times, he was yet sensible of the advantage of the reduc-
tion of the brick duty with reference to buildings and
useful works. With respect to the proposed reduction of
the duties on coffee and timber the Noble Lord opposite
seemed to think that the consumer would not be be-
nefited. Only on Saturday last he had read in a news-
paper the circular of one of the largest commercial
houses in this country as to the effect of the alteration
of the timber duty. Though the Bill had not yet passed,
the reduction had been in operation for some weeks,
and the statement of the firm to which he alluded was.
that as regarded colonial timber there had been no re-
duction in price. fie was fully prepared fur that, because
for some years the import of c donial timber had been con-
fined to timber ot a peculiar quality which the Baltic timber
seldom came into competition with. But, as regarded
Baltic timber, the circular stated that the consumer in
many cases 'oeuefited to the extent of two-thirds of the
reduction of duty, in other cases to the extent of a halt',
and in some cases to the whole extent of the reduction.
He believed that that was even more than the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer had calculated upon as the im-
mediate effect of his proposal. The extraordinary ac-
tivity in all those trades in which timber was much used
—such as ship-building—proved the advantage which
would be gained to the consumer by the alteration. With
regard to coffee, the Noble Lord thought that the reduc-
tion of the duce' would be injurious to the colonies. He
had had communications with persons growers of coffee
in the c donies, and though it was not usual for persons
engaged in a particular occupation to recognise the re-
duction of any protection enjoyed by them, yet none of
the persons had said that any disadvantage would
result to them from the proposal in question. Ceylon
alone produced a larger amount of coffee than this
country consumed, but the protection it enjoyed was
utterly valueless, for the surplus produce regulated the
price. On the other hand, the reduction of both duties
would be of the first value to the Ceylon planter, be-
cause it would extend consumption. The Noble Lord
had complained that the Government had done nothing,
to check the adulteration of coffee, but had rather fa-
voured it than otherwise. Not only the present Go-
vernment, but also that of which the Noble Lord had
been a member, had found it impossible by restrictions
or by excise interference to prevent adulteration. The
other day, when visiting the Geological Museum, he saw
some specimens of very pure chalk, and was informed
that is was used for adulterating the best Durham mus-
tard. He believed the only remedy was for the con-
sumer to deal only with the respectable trades-
man, who sold a genuine article; but as regarded coffee
the present measure, as far as it went, would check
adulteration; fur any reduction of the price of the real
article mutt hold out less inducement to substitute for it
an adulterated compound. He did not think it would
be advisable to establish an exciseman in every grocer's
shop in the kingdom to prevent the adulteration of
coffee. Ho should add, with regard to the continuance
of such a tax as the income-tax for a single year, that
he concurred in the observations of the Noble Lord
who spoke last. It was a dangerous measure, but it
was one for which the Government were not responsible.

After a few words in explanation from Lcrd BER-
NERS, _

Their Lordships adjourned.

PARLIAMENTARY DIVISIONS.

.From the Votes and Proceedings of the House of Commons.)

MONDAY, MAY 19.
ECCLESIASTICAL TITLES ASSUMPTION BILL.
(IN THE COMMITTEE.)
Motion made, and Question proposed, " That the Pre-
amble be postponed :" Whereupon Motion made, and Ques-
tion put, " That the Chairman do report progress, and ask
leave to sit again." The Committee divided :