The Sun.
London, England, 1856-06-24 00:00:00

THE AUSTRALIAN MAILS,

Lord NAAS begged to ail( the‘Secretary of the Trea-
sury if he would state to the house whether any of the
•3ntracts that had been put in for the conveyance of
the mails to Atvitraqa had been accepted ?
Mr. WILSON said four tenders had been sent, and

these tenders had been eareinlly considered by the G,.
vernment. He did not think he would be justified in
stating what the Government would accept, but be
thought to-morrow the Government would be in suc'3
position to communicate to one of those companies their

determination on the subject. He thought the service
would cotamenc: in a very shor, time—in two or three

mouths.

LONDON CORPORATION BILL.

In reply to an HON. MEMBER,

Sir G. GREY said to-morrow he a ould state the
course that was to be pursue ,l with respect to this bill.
On the motion of Lord PALMERSTON, the orders of
the day were postponed, to enable Mr. Fortescue to pro-
ceed with his motion on
NATIONAL EDUCATION IN IRELAND.

Mr. FORTESCUE moved the following resolution :
That this house has observed with satisfaction the pro-
gress made in the instruction of the poorer classes of
her Majesty's Irish subjects, under the direction of the
Commissioners of National Education ; and is of opinion
that, in the admmistrstion of that system, or in
any modification of its rules, there should be
maintained a strict and undeviating adherence to
its fundamental principles, securing parental authority
and the rights of conscience to pupils of all denomi-
nations, by excluding all compulsory religious teach-
ing, this Rouse being convinced that no plan for
the education of the Irish poor, however wisely and
unexceptionably contrived in other respects, can be
carried into effectual operation, unless it lie explicitly
avowed and clearly understood, as its leading
principle, that no attempt shall be made to
influence or disturb the peculiar religious tenets
of any sect or denomination of Christians."
In doing so he said he was fully impressed with the dif-
ficulty attending his bringing on the motion under
such unusual circumstances—that of asking the house
to reconsider a decision come to on a former occa-
sion and to rescind its vote on this question, but he
was induced to do so from a conviction that it was noto-
rious to every one that the debate on a former night
would have been adjourned—(loud cries of No, no, and
Yes, yes)—because the leading members on both sides of
the house were prevented from expressing their opinions
on the question from the su tcleoness of the division,
which did not adequately represent the feelings of the
house. (Cries of " No, no," and "Yes, yes.") Tim
hon. gentleman, after r..marking that no Irish Protes-
tant member addressed the house on the right
hon. gentleman's motion, proceeded to argue that
the object of that motion was to attack the national
system of education in Ireland in its religious parts.
[Sir A. CLIFFORD, the Uaher of the Black R el, ap-
peared at the table of the House, and summoned the
Speaker and the members of the house to the Hoke
of Lords to hear the Rlyal assent given by commission
to various bids, for which see Lords' report.]
Mr. FORTESCUE continued, and addressed the
house at some considerable length in support of his mo-
tion, wh'ch, he said, embodied the fundamental prin-
ciple of the system of national education in Ire;and, and
be denied that that system had been a failure io that

country. The great objection on the part of the episco-
pal managers of schools in Ireland to the National
Schools was that the Bible was excluded, but that was
an unfounded aspersion. (Hear.) Hs believed the oppo-
sition of these episcopal managers of sclpols and of the
clergy of the Established Church was in consequence of
their position in that country, and that that position bad
produced feelings which were the springs of action on
this question. They were in a position in which they
considend their false pride wounded, when other deco
minations were put upon an equality with them ; and
the clergy, in consequence of this feeling, had refused to
give any instruction to the children if they could pot.
give Church instruction exclusively. (Hear.) But there
was another cla a of Protestants in Ireland, and they ha•l
accepted the national system. In the first instance, from
the interpretation they put upon the rules of the board,
and which they thought would prevent them from giving
full instruction to the children of their communion ; leut
upon inquiry they found that to be an entire mistake,
and consequently they accepted the aid which was offe.ed
to them. Such, then, was the difference between these
two bodies of Protestants—one, after due coneiderati.m,
accepted the assistance offered by the State, while the
other, from a false sense of ecclesiastical supremacy, re-
jected it. (Hear.) He trusted that the House of Com-
mons would not, on the claim of the Established Church,
as represented by the right hon. gentleman, reverse the
system which had been so great a boon to Ireland ; on
the contrary, he h,oped that the day was not far distant
when the national system would become a still greater
ble,siog to Ireland than it had hitherto been. That day
would have been far nearer than it no'w was had it not
been that politicians in that house and elsewhere had
lent themselves to a most unfortunate agitation of the
system. (Hear.)

Mr. KIRK seconded the motion. It was an implrl-
ant thing for them to recollect that it was not the liberal
Government of 1831 that originated the national systf m
of education ; but it was the result of a commission ap-
pointed by a former. Government, and of which Lord
Liverpool, Lord Etdon, the Duke of Wellington, Sir
Robert Peel, and Mr. Goulburn were members. As-
sociated with them were several eminent dignitaries of
the Church, and upon their report the b3arci of educa-
tion in Ireland was constituted. In 1840, at the in-
stance of the Presbyterian party, a material change was
made in the fundamental Principles 'of the society. It
was intended that the vested principle should be the sole
arid single principle of the school. That principle was
this—that when private parties subscribed a third of the
required sum, the board subscribed the other two-thirds,
on the condition that trustees should be appointed, arid
the school become private property, Religious instruc-
tion was to be given during a certain number of hours
of the day. The Presbyterians found that they could
not legally transfer their schools so as to make then,
national property. Moreover, they had conscientious
ebjections to allow their school. to be thrown open to
the religions instruction of the Protestant rector and
the Roman Catholic priest. A ciiange was subsequently
made, and it was provided that the schools should be
open to all for secular instruction ; but with retard to
religious instruction, which was to occupy four hour-, a
day, it was provided that nine but Presbyterians should
attend. At the same time it was provided that whet,
ever a teacher saw a child attending religious instruc-
ti:n contr,ry to the views of the denomination on whose
principles it was entered upon the school roll, he should
whim the parents of the feet, in order that there might
not be tbe slightest shadow for acharge of proselytism.
(The honourable gentleman read extracts from the evi-
uuce of Dr. Cook and Dr. Chalmers, with a view to
sula_o.v:rthat it was the opinion of the Presbyterians that
be no circumstances should religious teaching
made compulsory.) While Presbyterians were anxi-
ous to maintain their own rights, they were anxious
to extend the game litierty to others. They di.)
not tee, therefore why the Established Church
hearof Ireland should t:eee
hear-) They eeaaot r Biblesclaim. in (Hear,th e their
schools just as did the members of the Church, but theyr
aaglatiorgisetthtehre,
did not wish to coerce tt,e opinions of those who differed
from them; for they believed that there were two waysßanatilet—heoontehebrybexcfolurdciiirg
of turning children against
it upon ufproomnththeechildren upon all occasions, howevyer inopg-
portant), (Hear.) B.,th those courses the Presbyterians
had always striven to avoid. A good deal had been
said of the failure , that had attended the attempt at
mixed education. It bad certainly not succeeded to tbe
extent that was anticipated. But what was the cause t
Simply because of the opposition of the Establiebed
Church, whose members instead of corning in cordially
when the ground was cleared for them by the Presbyte-
rians, stood aloof and offered every kind of opposition a.
withiu their power. The board ben fuliedog W

all serfs of misrepresentations, and bad had to contend
with ceaseless opposition. (Hear, hear.) In a report
presented in 1853 by Mr. M'Creedy, the inspector for
the province of Ulster, he gave a list of schools in which
there was a fair mixture, the total being 1,095 schools,
of which 755 were fairly mixed ; and these schools, it.
was proved, .had worked in a very satisfactoiy manner.
In many of the schools the teachers were Roman Catho-
lics and the managers were Presbyterians, and in others
the teachers were members of the Church of England,
while the managers were Presbyterians or Roman Catho-
lics, and so on. In very few cases the opinions of the
teachers and the managers were identical. Taking 2,600
vested schools, be found that in 1,745 the Protestants
were in a great minority, so great indeed in many cases
that they amounted only to 12 or 14 per cent. What
would become of these children and these school's if the
motion of the right hon. gentleman (Mr. Walpole) were
acted upon ? Why, thousands of Roman Catholic and
Presbyterian children would, as the inevitable result
of that motion, be thrown out of all instruction. (Hear,
hear.) He believed that the mixed schools fairly repre-
sented the opinions of the people, and he trusted they
would not be disturbed.
Mr. WALPOLE said that as this motion was made in
a spirit of great candour, and had for its object to re•
scind the decision come to on Tuesday evening, the
house would expect him to state the course which he
th3sght the house should take. Two great questions
were raised by thb resolutions—one affecting the rela-
tions of that house with the Crown, and the weight
which that house should have as a deliberative assembly
—and the other question related more particularly to the
motion itself, which was made on Tuesday evening, and
which he had the honour to propose. The motion was
fully discussed, not because of any particular pressure
from without, but with the full consent of the Govern-
ment. Upon both these questions he would make a
few observations. Upon the first question no one knew
better than the noble lord opposite that when a question
had been discussed, and while the address remained un-
answered, it was not usual or politic to bring it on
again. He entreated the house to consider what the

effect of a second debate and decision would be upon
th'tt house and its discussions. It would represent that
body as discussing great questions, not upon their
merits, but for the mere chance of the moment. He
begged to remind the noble lord opposite that when an
address was unexpectedly carried in that house late at
night respecting the Sunday postal delivery, at the time
the noble lord the member for the City of London was
at the head of the Government, a bill was brought in
to alter the decision then arrived at, but that bill was
opposed by the Government, several members of which
Government were members of the present Administra-
tion. The noble lord then at the head of the Govern-
ment said ,that as the address had been carried by.a
single vote it might be expedient to reconsider
' it, or, in other words, to refer the question
to a committee. As that was his (Mr. Wal-
pole's) own opinion, he should be happy to support
such a proposition if it came from the noble lord at
the head of the Government. The hon. gentleman op-
posite said he had not used the word " surprise," but
meant to say that the motion had been carried at a time
when ivery body expected an adjournment. Now nothing
could be further from his (Mr. Walpole's) intention than
a surprise. That motion had been brought forward before
E ester, but he gave way on being granted precedence
for the 6th of May. On sth May he was asked to give
up that day for the debate respecting the peace. He
thee got an appointment for the 7th of June,
.on which
day it came on, and he felt it to he his duty to proCeed
with it. On the Friday before that day he first heard of
Vee morning sitting, and remonstrated ; hut in vain.
The question, consequently, did come on upon the Tues-
day, and the de ;ate was vi ry uninteresting. The ad-
journment was moved—but I: st by 182 to 34, the whole
of the Government being against it, and the division was
taken. Nothing could be filither from the truth, there-
fore, than that there had been any surprise, and never,
he believed, bad a battle been more honuurably won.
With respect to the address itself, the question now was
what was to be done with it. Nothing but the greatest
necessity could justify the annulling of a vote carried as
that had been. That necessity if it existed must be judged
of by the speeches of gthe two hon. gentlemen who had
preceded him. It was said that the terms of tau address
went to subvert the whole of the established school sys-
tem of Ireland, but he bad- expressly repudiated that
idea. He had entirely excepted the non-vested and even
workhouse schools—the only question was whether it
was practicable to give certain schools the benefit of the
national funds. Of the justice of a universal participa-
tion in the large sum annually voted for State education
there could be no possible doubt. He was quite pre-
pared to support what was called the " National sys-
tem," if it could be modified, as he believed it could be,
to make it what it professed to be—namely, a really
national system. The second reason given for pass-
ing the present resolution *as, that he (Mr
Walpole) wished to substitute the rules
the Church Education Society, which
enable the masters to proselytise the children of parents
•f different persuasions. (Hear, hear, from the Govern-
ment benches). Did he say so in his speech. (Cheers
from the Opposition)? Had he said so anywhere ? If
he thought that the address that had been agreed to
would in the least degree interfere with the rights of
conscience, he would be the first to oppose it. But look
at the facts. Out of 5,000 schools in Ireland over 3,000
were in the bands of Roman Catholics, and he had not
proposed to interfere with them in the siighteat degree.
(Hear.) There was not a town in Ireland where Roman
Catholics had not the opportunity of receiving Roman
Catholic education,' and while that was so, there was no
occasion for Roman Catholic children to be sent to be
proselytised at Church of England schools, nor had he
suggested such a thing. After the explanation giver, in
the other house the other night by the Lord President,
he thought it was too mush to charge him with attempt-
ing to proselytise by that address, when Lerd.Granville,
after full deliberation, and after going through the evi-
dence taken before the committee, tbougbt the only
way of doi, g justice was to make grants to those schools,
the only stipulation being that they shoul4 submit to
Government inspection, That step, on the part of Lord
Granville, was very strong evidence of the propriety of
the alteration suggested by the address ; and when he
was asked to consider the present resolution, he was
bound to examine the nature and character of that reso-
lution, and see whether it was inconsistent will) the
address already agreed to. Now that resolution might
be divided into three parts. The first was an expression
that the house observed with ealisfaction the progress
made in the instruction of the poorer classes of her
Majeety's Irish subjects under the direction of the
commissioners for national education. The next was
an expression of opinion that in the administration of
that system, or in auy modification of its rules, there
should be maintained a strictand undeviating adherence to
its fundamental principles or securing parental authority
and the rights of conscience to the pupils of all denomi-
nations, by excluding all compulsory religious teaching.
Those fundamental principles might be shortly stated as
follews :—First, that parental authority was to be re-
garded ; secondly, that the rights of conscience were to
te respected ; and thirdly, that religious teaching against
the consciences of the pupils was in no case to he en-
forced. To those great principles be had never in the
slightest degree dissented, and never should. The last
eart of the resolution was to the effect that no provision
for the education of the Irish poor could he successfully
carried into operation unless it were expressly avowed as
ire leading principle that no attempt would be made to
,uhvert the religious tenets of any particular congrega-
tion te which they belonged. Those words were in fact
not new, but formed a portion of an opinion delivered
about the year 1812 or 1814, by Vie Irish prelates. And
these three divisions comprised the whole of the propos-
ed resolution. (Hear.) That being so, he thought, it was
clear that to no i a.t of that resolution could he dissent
—on the contrary, to every portion of it he gave his
hearty assent. But then came the question, whether
the resolution was in harmony wita the address. The
proposition was this :—(The honourable gentleman read
the terms of the resolution as before given.) He believ-
ed that the words chiefly affecting that portion of the
address which was considered objectionable were these
—" Whatever their regulations may be as to the mode
of religions instruction." Upon that came the ques-
tion, whether the schools of Wesleyans or any other
denomination of dissenters could participate in the
national grant, and yet act consistently with the
resolution. He believed that they could. But could
not regulations be made by which that participation of
all sects could be adniitte i, and yet do away with the
power to interfere with parental authority ? He could
conceive many cases in which that relief could be
granted. He thought ithat the Government role could be
mod& das Lord Granville hi/Itself had proposed. He
(Mr. Walpole) thought that where there were sufficient
numbers of Roman- Catholic children, these children
might, with the consent of their parents, be sent to the
Church schools. Thera were many other ways in which
relief might be granle 1. He had already stated that he
could not vote for the resolution, if he thOught it was in
opposition t) the address P • but he regarded it rather as
an interpretation of the address, and he believed that
the two could very well stand together. The result, then,
was that, believing the address to have been founded

wou

upon principles of the greatest justice, he rejoiced that
it had been carried. Belis.ving, also, that it was not op-
posed to the propositions brought forward in the other
house, and that parental authorite, in matters of eduCa•
tion, ought not in any case to be interfered with, he
should accept the resolution as it stood. The regulations,
which must be fra:ited by the board, might present some
difficulties, but he believed they were not insurmount-
able. The question had now long been discussed, and if
his voice bad any weight across the Channel, he would
say to the Irish people that Parliament had agreed to an
address that would do justice to them, t o long as they
did not interfere with the rights of conscience in others.
He would appeal to them to be moderate and temperate,
and he would al,o appeal to the noble viscount opposite
to endeavour to see that justice were done. His (Mr.
Walpole's.) only hope and desire was to bring that long.
vexed question to a peaceful issue, and he could assure
the house that that feeling more than any other bad led
him to the determination of agreeing to the resolution
then brought forward. He believed its objects were
just and practicable, and he trusted they would soon be
carried into execution. (Hear.) •

Mr. LABOUCHERE said it bad never entered into
his mind, nor the mind of any member of the Govern-
ment, that the right hon. gentleman had acted in any way
unfairly in obtaining the vote of the house for the ad-
dress, but it wa; quite impossible to doubt the decision of
te house would have been different if the members had
not many of them been called away to a more splendid
scene.• It was impossible to exa4gerate the importatico
of the question on the vote ; and although the right
hon. gentleman now said he did not intend to subvert
the system of education in Ireland, every one else had
expressed an opinion that the vote, if left as it was. would
hive been the death blow ortbe united system of educa-
tion in that country. If they once introduced the prin-
ciple which was at theleottom of the right hon. gentle-
UAW, Wan* it unit be akonivo of the whole Fidel

AS it stood now. The right hon. gentleman had Said
there was a great danger in asking them to consider the
suby-Tt before the answer to the address to the Crowu
had been received ; but even if there had been no pre-
cedence fur such a course, the importance of the event
in the present a Ise justified the step taken, for the reso-
lution would otherwise bave excited hopes and fears in
Ireland of a most.dangerous character. He (Mr. La-
bouchfrs) had listened with some astonishment to the
reasons of the right hon, gentleman for supporting the
resolution, but 7/2.s too well pleased to have an united
vote on the question to cavil much at the argumentupon
which it was founded. Such a resolution would show

the people of Ireland that any attempt to attack their
system of education, however it might be arrived at,
would be defeated by that house. The system had edu-
cated during the last 23 years two millions and a-half of
children, and was educating no fewer than five hundred
and fifty thousand cbilaren ; while directly it must ne-
cessarily have the effect of obliterating sectarianism and
political bitterness ; while, if the system were to break
down, education in Ireland would be divided into two
hostile camps ; one carried on by the influence and
money of the landlords, and the other by the influence
of the priesthood ; and although there might seem to be
many advantages on the side of the landlord, be had no
doubt that the advantage in the long run would be
with the priests. who would wield the most power-
Eul wek), ns. (Hear, hear.) If the resolution taken by
gentlemen opposite was taken with a spirit of concilia-
tion towards the people of Ireland, he should be sin-
cerely rejoioed ; and that it was so taken he must hope,
however surprised he might be that some of them could
adopt it. They had in Ireland a church of the minority
supported by the State—the church of the majority
resting on its own resources--and they had the national
system of education toucning upon both, but resting
upon neither. Al these questions had been dealt with.
during she present session. The Government had re-
sisted an attack on the Established Church—they had
defended the grant to the College of Maynooth-4r.d
new they had defeated an attack upon the national syi-
tern of education, holding an even band, and endeavour-
ing to do justice to all. Ho should like to hear the
policy which hon. gentlemen opposite would recommend
in connection with the religious establishments of Ire-
land. That country was now peaceable and quiet, and
showing every sign of commercial and agricultural pros-
perity, while morally and socially society was improving,
and religious differences were passing away ; and he
conjured the house to give a firm and determined oppo-
sition to any proposal which might be the signal for the
renewal of that civil and religious discord which had so
long been the .bane of Ireland. The admissions made
by the right hon. gentleman relieved him (Mr. Lahou-
chere) from the task of defending the united system of
education—the right, hon. gentleman had come to curse,
bnt had remained to bless. Her Majesty's Government
would have the vote to which the hcuse was alybut to

come before them. when they recommended her Majesty
to answer the address; and he hoped the result would
show that the present system of education in Ireland, so
far from being injured by the di'cus-ion of the question,
bad gained fresh strength, and would long continue to
flomish.
Mr. CAIRNS said fif the Government thought the
ad re-s so mischievous as they professed, they ought to
have come forward with a direct motion fcr rescinding,
instead of allowing it to be met by an ambiguous motion,
which both parties claimed as favourable to themselves.

He must say for himself, that far from being oppo-ed to
national education in Ireland, he for one believed that
system, with all its defects, was one of the greatest
blessings ever conferred upon Ireland. The modification
be would suggest mt.', that where there was a national
school to which the Roman Catholic children could go,
there assistance might be afforded to a Church school

which might be in the same place. Now in point of fact
he stated there was nut a single Church school in Ire-
land where there was not a national school by the side
of it, se that Roman Catholic children had full liberty of
choice. Holding these views he would support Mr.
Fortescue's resolution, with every word of which he
could conscientieusly agree • but he reminded the house
that compulsory religious education was not in ell cazes
repudiated by the National B rare of Riucation. It was
strictly prohibited; indeed, in the case of Protestaute
and he quoted instant's to prove it ; but there were at
leckt 100 convent schools, sharing among them 5,0001.
of public money, though in every one of them religious,
as well as secular instruction, was compulsory.
Lord J. RUSSELL participated in the satisfaction
which bad been expressed by the right hon. member for
Cambridge, the hon. gentleman who had just sat down,
and :the Secretary of State for the Colonies. But he
thought the position of that house one of some em-
barrassment, and was sorry to find that there was
great inconvenience in the rules of the house, by
which an address was adopted at once, whereas in
the case of a bill it bad to pass through several stages
and was more fully considered. (Hear, hear.) He con-
sidered this matter one of such importance, and the
course which had beer. taken so injurious to education
and the peace of Ireland, that he should be content to
vote for a reveral of the previous vote, and the only
objection which he entertained t' the motion was that
it was not a direct reversal of that vote. (Hear, hear.)
So long ae the present Government remained in power
he believed that no change in the system of education
would take place; but in the event of the right hon.
gentleman coming into office, he might deem it his duty
to carry out the principles contained in the address. It
appeared to him that the effect of the proposition of the
right hon. gentleman was this—that there being at pre-
sent equality, he would establi-h inequality ; that there
being at pre-ent religious liberty, his would introduce
religion. exclusion ; and that there being at present ha..
moony, he would introduce discord. (Hear, hear.) Hon.
gentlemen on the other side of the house, who professed
to be the friends of the system of education in Ireland,
were certainly most candid, for they pointed out its de-
fects in a manner which none but a most candid friend
dvipiworroueetseunne would
aitta,nd)di
Aop modification.
ori
1(1
CdL
lgzaoatleeku:gesilhndawetgie r
0.
f)
LordT Tae rightD erb I,:op.iaD bby gentleman
whi pro-
posed tirn-
certain schools the. Scriptures should be read by all the
children attending the schools. That would produce ine-
quality in the system. What would be the feeling of the
couetry if 100,0001. cr 150,0001. should be given to the
schools in which the Roman Catholic catechism was
taught ? A cry would be raised throughout the country,
that it was an attempt lo prbselytise the Protestant chit-
n
rdbbrteoeht rrthee.haritset(
ahati:
(Hear.)
aneetirgnw.
),oeffTni were
thoghneueoge
firstsffP scerurcOoi
ntpbeott Protestant
iratanehrdesi
etdbcpethr the
com-
pulsoryp advantages edchonn ogt
f eh
e children in the Protestant schools, those
who had obtained the advantage would turn round on
the Roman Catholics, and render it impossible for them
to place themselves on an equality in regard to the schools.,
It had been said that all this could be remedied by adopt-
ing a system like that which was established in Eng-
land, and that where there were Roman Catholic chil-
dren they would go to the schools in the neighbourhood.
That would he at once a subversion of the while system
and put an end to a mixed education ; and, instead of
giving the children an impartial rule, would give them
a topographical consolation. (Hear, and a laugh.) Be-
sides this, the plan of the right hon. gentleman would
be an infringement of religious liberty. It was one of
the earliest declarations of Lord Stanley, when he esta-
blished this system, that the religious education should
only take place while the children of those who were ob-
jected were absent ; and in reply to a deputation from
the. Synod of Ulster, his lordship said that certain hours,
be they more or be they fewer, would be allotted to the
studit s of the children, and that no Bible or any other
book would be employed, to which the parents or guar.
diens s iuld object on the ground of religious scruples.
He had therefore the authority of Lord Derby for saying
that, according to his opinion in 1831, the proposal of
the right hon. gentleman involved a palpable violation
of religious liberty. ;Hear.) It might be said that Lord
Derby did not entertain the same opinion at the present
time: He could not fol!ow Lord Derby in such a change
of opinion. He knew what the opinions of Lord Derby
wore when he was the colleague of Lord Grey and Lord
Brougham. His lordship's opinions were then sound
and successful, and it wored be a matter of great regret
if he should contribute to destroy the work which had
done bim so much honour. (hear.) This was a ques-
tion which affected 2,700 schools, and the proposition
was to introduce a principle which would be oppressive
to tie minority, and deprive them of the religious liberty
which they now enjoyed. (Hear, hear.) Instead of
insuring harmony, the alteration would produce strife
acd discord. Let the house consider
.what had been
done during the last half-century with regard to edu-
cation in Ireland. In 1806 the Duke of Bedford, then
Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland, entered ireto a correspond-
enee with the Primate as t 7) the propriety of establish-
ing a commission, for the purpose of inquiring into the
state of education in that country. The commission
was continued britee—Diike of Richmond, and a re-
port was produced laying down the principle that no
plan of education for the poor could be carried into effec-
tual operation, unless by an explicit avowal and clear un.
derstanding that no attempt should be made to influence
the religious tenetsof any sect or denomination. The qure-
tion was discussed, and in 1826 a committee, over which
Lord Monteagle presided, produced the outline of the
plan now in existence, which was carried into effect in
1831. No doubi`, there hail been great varieties in detail
in making the system work, but in a country like Ire-
land what plan could be adopted which would not re-
quire changes ard modifications ? None of the chang.s,
however, which had been adopted had touched the essen-
tial principles of the plan, which had been attended with
great blessings to the people, had tended to appease re-
ligious commotion, and to improve the habits and morals
of the people. When then improvements had been going
on for half a century, there came forward a gentleman
to break in upon the system, and renew the animosities
which had in a great measure ceased. (Hear.) The
change, if carried out, would cause the Protestant again
to assume supremacy, and would debase the fair work
which it had been the object of thefriends of national edu-
cation to carry forward. He had no doubt of the
sincerityof the right hon. gentleman, who imagined that
he was satisfying the conscientieue scruples of the mem-
hers of the Church of England, and adding a supplernen
to the scheme of national education. But he entreated
the right hon, gentleman to dismiss the thought from his
mind. So far from being a supplemental plan, the right
bon. gentleman would find that the Roman Catholics arid
liberal Protestants would be unable to, lend their hands
to such a plan of compulsory education—(cheers)—they
would retire from the board, and their places would have
to be taken by men wbo were suspected by the Roman
Catholics. (Hear.) He trusted that so long as the pre-
sent Government remained in power they would make
rto essential modification in the system oleducet on now
acted upon, but would adhere to its principles. (Hear.)
If the plan was to be altered, let the right honour-
able gentleman himself carry it into effect, and reap the
bitter fruit of his uncalled-tor interference.' (Hear.)
Mr. NAPIER said that if the proposition which had
been submitted to the house by his right hon. friend had
been met in the same spirit by the other side of the
Omit uaiglit lowei led to bouedoial reeralts. (Ewa)