The Sun.
London, England, 1851-07-30 00:00:00

THE SUN,

bine° then, havi received no fertile! accounts of what
had taken place, t dispatch from the Court of Directors
was approved byfh board, and was no doubt dispatched
by the mail wlch left this in the early part of the
mouth, bringingthe subject to the aj.eetion of the Go-
vernment, and dsirieg that every means be taken to ex-
pedite the payment of such claims as were duly proved.
Every arraugenent had been made by the Court to carry
into effect the payments which would be made in ibis
country, and particularly to insure to the parties a safe
mode of remittance. It was nut in his power to state at
What particularperiod their claims wouli be settled, be-
Canso be bad no information beyond the fact already
Mentioned of tie local Act which was necessary for the
Purpose of enabling Government to settle these claims
haying been read a second time in February last. If
that Act had pissed the Council of India., he concluded
the claims mug now be in the course cf settlement. If
that were not the case, the dispatch to which he had re.
ferred would as doubt hasten that settlement.
DUTY ON HOPS.
Mr. FREWEN rose to move the resolution of which
ee had givennotice : —" That the Excise duty on hops
is impolitic aid unjust, and ought to be repealed at an
early period.' He had brought the subject forward in
compliance with the urgent request of a large number of
his eopstitueits. His Honourable Friend (Mr. Hodges)
asked for a partial reduction 4,f this duty ; but, us the
amount wasnot by any means large, the most politic
course wou'd be to remove it entirely. Ia 1843, it
amounted tc 388.0001 ; in 1849, to 145 0001. ; in 1850,
to 424,000/. A fair average would be 300,0001., or per-
haps a little under. It fell with great severity upon cer-
tain localities ; the eastern division of Sussex had to
Pay about 100,000/. Thousands of acres had been
thrown out of cultivation or were left, comparatively
'Peaking, uncultivated, and teuants could nut be get
au any terms. A tax might as well be laid
Upon orchards—upon apples —as upon hops.—(Hear,
hear.) A gentleman who was agent to a Noble Lord,
a Member of that House, consulted a great number
of large planters last Saturday at Hastings, and re-
quested him (Mr. Frewen) to state that lithe whole Ex-
cise duty on hops was repealed they should not oppose
the repeal of the Customs duty; the Excise duty was so
heavy that, with free trade in hops, they would be placed
to a more favourable position than at present. In fact,
the protection they had was not at all adequate to coun-
tervail this enormous war-tax. The export of hops for
1846 amounted to 448,4971 b.; the import to 228,8001 b.
In 1847 the export was 457,0611 b.; the import, 245,2801 b.
There was a large export of British hops to those coun-
tries were hops were grown—Germany and Belgium, fur
instance. There were large exports to Holland and to
St. Petersburgh. With the Excise duty removed, the
English planter would not have much to fear from foreign
importations.—(Hear, hear.) His claim was strengthened
the precarious nature of the crop, which was some-
timea abundant and sometimes blighted.—(Hear, hear.)
pPoll the whole, and considering that war prices no
40figer ruled, and that we had returned to cash pay-
alama, he trusted the House would see the injustice of
continuing a tax, almost the only war-tax which had
bet been repealed or mitigated since the war.
Mr. FULLER seconded the motion.
Mr. HODGES moved, as an amendment, " That on
!MY reduction of Excise duty on hops taking place, it
is expedient to reduce the Excise duty on British hops,
and the Customs duty on foreign hops by id. per pound
Weight each, together with the five per cent. additional
If thereon granted by the Act 3 Victoria, cap. 17."
ef the original motion succeeded, it could only be on the
accdition of the total repeal of the duty on foreign hops;
„atld he believed there was not unanimity by any means
Ftnang the Hon. Member's constituents upon that sub-
leak 'rho planters in Kent were by no means prepared
Lcunsent to the repeal of the duty on foreign hops; he
rtr- 'lodges) believed very few of them would advocate
i;'-e(Hear. hear.) He kuew the extreme distress of the
tQaP"growing districts, and felt convinced that they were
9,8 t unjustly treated, and, however this motion might
tti•lllhe should feel it his duty to bring the subject before
Plane ouse next session. It was easy to say that the
atn might be reduced, but it must be remembered
that the crop was precarious, and the plantation must be
large to secure a sufficient supply. He hoped those who
might be in office next year would take the subject into
tr, their serious consideration, and endeavour to put an end
t 0 the complaints of this interest.
t 'lr. BARROW remarked, that of the three parties
Lied in this question, the labourer, the hopgrower,
mocisthe Chancellor of the Exchequer, the labourer was
t interested, for the wages paid on account of hop
rivation ran from 101. to 131. an acre, which was ten
coons the amount paid for cultivating lands to yield cow
acre to
crops. The hopgrower paid above 51. an
're to the Government, and for years past would have
t'lee glad to have gone shares with the Chancellor of
i
Exchequer He had not risen to second the amend-
eieut - •
, wit to state tnat it was on account of the labour-
tZß classes that he gave his voice in favour of reducing
duty.
Sir G. PECHELL seconded the amendment.
CURTEIS observed, that the crop of last year
ir been disposed of to meet the duties of 1848 and
449, and where the money was to be got to pay accrue
„Ire duties it was hard to say. He approved the motion
,tllO Hon. Member for East Sussex, and hoped the
"Lncellor of the Exchequer would promise some relief
or next year.
t The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thought
ha would best consult the general feeling of the House
,13' Cot going into details on the subject of the hop duty,
11°''? that the financial arrangements of the year had
ik.ela made, and an alteration in the duty could not be
li`roduced in the present year. Tho Hon. Member for
tee
txchequer Must be pe)rfwouldectl aware that he (the Chaellor of
y be exceedingly rash if hencwere to
the promise with reference to the future. He hoped
pot &tense would concur with him in opinion that it was
Nioaddvisable to take any step in the matter at this
j-
tttke • TYRELL entered his protest against the course
lsosett. by her Majesty's Ministers in getting rid of
_pro-
te,,„'"aue with reference to the burdens on land. Availing
(C',3eivea of the imbecility of the party behind him—
tles„•aagh)—the Government treated the agricultural
theu-e, ill a cavalier manner, saying they had no case,
kid Re from time to time cases of gross injustice were
a out
Al •
tl eeit • COBDEN said, it might be taken for granted
tPot:,, free-trade Government and a free-trade Parliament
deb' take off the Customs' duty on hops if the Excise
epic there removed. The Hon. Member for East Sussex
theia? Hon. Member for West Kent were opposed in
*44-„V'ew aof this tax. It operated so unequally that it
%he: Protection in one county as compared with the
the i• If there were no other ground for objection to
teeitaX than the ins quality of pressure, that would of
tath,bke 8 UffiCiellt to condemn the tax. But he objected
tiab "op. tax as a bungling contrivance. Every year a
,t on/tr of supernumerary excisemen were employed for
ly
rtle;""3", iveeks. The plan of proceeding was unworthy
heldhe taßge+
$ll, A, on i.meount of the clumsy mode of collection.
I!. great one ertainty of the tax was another objection to
111;1 °°'etime it yielded 40 000/ or 50 000/ • at other
tes 4, 9
eetedoo,ooo/. or 500,0001. Such variations not only de-
-114 the the Cha acellor of the Exchequer's calculations,
the
of ever), banker in the hop districts were subject
:L5 ts,Bame fluctuutions. There was no ground on which
'kte Should be maintained; it was small in amount,
Web:Mal in its c 'haracter, and he hoped the Chancellor
thel:.,Eachequer s vould feel it to be a tax which ought
,a 1 ',atilt with ear ly. Whether the Hon. Member who
\litt,:ll,(!tle the motion proceeded to a division or not, he
llte,Y.ebden) certa tally went with him heartily in the
3
Laition for the r. move' of the hop duty.
VfOt• ASS express led his belief that the -removal of the
Nit°4 malt would 'lse. attended with more satisfactory
Roll 8 than the comes von of the propositien made by the
1"; k BODGES
for East Sussex.
14„*.,sODGES withdrew his amendment; and,
REWEN having briefly replied,
when there appeared—
he goose divided,
For Mr. Frewen's motion ...
Against it

... 30
••• ••• 59
-29

Majority •••
THE CRYSTAL PALACE.
tilv,Nl%*6.llEY WOOD then: rose to move—" That an
he address be prese ated. to her Majesty, praying
4411 r Majesty will be graciously pleased to direct, in
that the Crystal
Nta4tiner as to her may seem fit,
N;" be preserved until the Ist of May next, with a
'44 to determine if that novel structure, or any portion
t"teit't.eau be adapted to purposes of publicutility and re-
!`lior,l°..a." Among the grounds on which the apPrePri-
14di <litho building raised in Hyde-park to
.the object
thstOted in his motion seemed to be desirable, he
I+ol4 that not the least important was suggested
vas considered how much larger London tv
uNlts743' other capital in Europe or America. At re-
..111D.-111; esi% suncesaful exhibition of works of industryp
'u,r11.43 oil in the building to which he had alluded,
l
'4l "'itch, thou h it had assumed the form of a g ass
.bstlQk\!ta, et. em megnced with the idea of making it a large
e":444.,‘1111c1in ; with an enormous dome. Considerable
;4eneel he was aware, had been experienced by
Vie had residences along the road near the
1:T- „1 s• but a large glass conservatory for the
qli(lese-, roe ;Nation and amusement would not, in his
13e.,h1,;kue attE Inded with any such inconvenience as that
444 e,..emp Lira might have been made. What he
- t nous e to do was, to give its sanction to the
ietttlbe 11444,..4ea of the Crystal Palace for such a length of
fs;4les ruld nable information to be gained with es
* 44,ti ° ita f ature use, partly for pleasure and partly
op t —(Dear, hear.) He thought it
4littitteer'iw-asew'orthy of consideration, whether
Tit, the ; tni Itt be formed into a good winter garden)
141.0-1;2..11a)it ants of the metropolis.—(Hear, hear.
gentlemen in that House fond of riding,
ttli''4l,4l,;,k,fte f.ound Rotten-row wet and sloppy.
4ifr, n then, be considered how far one part
h„'eYatill Palace could be converted into a
*"llltl',,-48e? If such a thing were practicable, it
;411 F'„ncltiest bly, be a great advantage to that
" a • With respect to one of the soi-
bathe rhe tropelts.
t leg to Which the palace might be applied, they
t!! e!1411:11s f hat ho meant in the Botanical Gar-
t4
-4) Re'"eB oPark.w The conservatory there was a
)1111 elia° What -I
thought might be established within
Wtl,—° range 'lef the Crystal Palace.—(Hear, hear.)
'rho British
Topasee'triere
Wasw inoot,"l.,e; viewY.
of the case.
tsp. the as deficient in the . room. necessary
aN. .reeeP Holt of all te antiquities provided
41u the naturalsts agreed that the speci-
eys ef z.t tnralgrsl atest
Attlsetate hi story there woruldhebaere. exhibited to great
) The British
4hl:44sittila Imiljddesr glan
ss.
f—(Hear,
than filled both in the
"eP art O(
and in that of antiquities, and he
14iktttht the 'ill
be third department, that of natural history,
tiA\kiet.‘silecessfei'ly transferred to the Crystal. Palace.
.
sopsflee The way • in which the Royal Commissioners
tlate 1 the whole affair of the Exhibition re-
the Iteted reat credit 'upon them, and he must sa !hat
rh'dia. 441 -Highness Prince Albert, who was trained
4511. t Astronomer Royal at Brussels, and made
of tbir4bvitef ciency in his mathematical studies, was
eepLY f itted to be at the head of each a body
..44114 'loners for the promotion of any scientific

object whatever.—(Hear. hear.) There hal been
nothing about the Exhibition thet was not
• gratifying and successful; bat nevertheless it must die-
eppear by the Ist of June, and therefore he proposed
that no steps should be to ken towards the removal t'ne
building tall the Ist ef Mey, so es to elf )rd time for a
Bill being parsed next session, if such was thought advi-
sable, to authorize the Oommissiouers to retain posee-
sion of the palace.—(Hear, hear.) Tee Commissioners
would not, in a pecuniary point of view, be held respon-
sible; and he must at the same time say, that he thought
Mr. Paxton and Messrs. Fox and Henderson, who had
distinguished themselves so much in the erection of the
building, deserved much from the Commissioners in the
way of reward, and he should not be sorry to hear that
a considerable sum came to them when the change took
place.—(Hear, hear.) It had been stated by good judges
that a very little change, at a moderate expense, would
adapt the building to its new use, for the comfort, re-
creation and instruction of the inhabitants.—(Hear,
hear.) In that particular part of the metropolis there
was a general absence of places of public resort and
amusement. The only place of public resent was Tat-
tersall's—(A laugh)—there was nothing analogous -o
the Zoological and Botanical gardens ie the Regent's-
park. As to any nuisance being created r f
which the inhabitants could celeplain, to might
observe that the arrangements of the police hitherto
had been excellent, and the same order could be
easily preserved under whatever character the Crystal
Palace appeared.—(Hear, hear.) The particular style
of architecture called crystal architecture was new to
historians, and the magnificent specimen irs Hyde•park
would, no doubt, be spoken of in future history as one of
the great features of the age in which we kved, and one
not unworthy to be ranked with railways, the penny •
pstage, and other inventions.—(hear.) There were
besides, associations connected with this building that
ought to create a feeling favourable to its preservation;
such, for example, as the insgnifieent scene at the open-
ing of th© Exhibition by her Majesty. The Crystal
Palace might be described as the nearest approach to a
ladies' club that had ever been constructed, for there,
uader proper regulations, a lady might walk about with
as much security and quiet as in her own drawing-room.
—(Hear, hear.) As to the changes to be made in the
building, a variety might be suggested for consideration,
such as fitting up the lower sashes with glass, intersec-
ting it with streets, and so on; but all he asked at pre-

sent was the sanction of the House for delay, in order
that future arrangements might be well considered.—
(Hear, hear.) He was satisfizid that the conversion of
the Crystal Palace into a place of public resort would
tend greatly to promote the sanitary condition of the
inhabitants, inasmuch as it would enable many persons
to go out frequently for personal enjoyment who would
otherwise remain at their firesides, to the injury of their
general health—(Hear, hear)—while it could, at the
same time, be made conducive to the promotion of scien.
title pursuits.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman
concluded by making his motion as above.

Colonel SiI3THOTIP would oppose out and out the
motion of the Hon. Member. He had declared his op-
r•osition to the erection of this Crystal False?, from the
first, as he considered it a gross attack upon the rights
of th© people of this country.—(A laugh.) Ho was
somewhat gratified when he found he was borne out in

that opinion by such men as Lord Brougham, Lord
Campbell, and Mr. Justice Cresswell; and he had never
seen any cause to change the views he had at first ex-
pressed. What had been the result of the erection of this
Crystal Palace? In the first place there had been, and
for a long time to come would be, gross desecration of the
Sabbath—(A laugh)—demoralization of the people, and
a complete disunion of parties. In the next place,
poverty greater than existed before had been engendered.
Ile had heard with pain that the poor of this country
had been seduced to come up to see this palace.—(A
laugh.) All that they had saved and all they could
borrow had been in many cases spent in this foolish
journey, and he knew he spoke facts when he stated that
not only had they borrowed money but pawned their
clothes to enable them to come up to this " World's
Fair," as it was called; and now they were left without
a penny in their pockets. One-half of the tradesmen in
the metropolis and the provincial towns would tell them
that their trade was lost—that they had no
customers—all had gone to the Crystal Palace—(A
laugh)—not merely for amusement, but, what was worse,
to make future orders for the goods of foreigners, who
came here to undersell the honest, industrious, and
heavily•taxed people of England. The Crystal Palace
might be a wonderful building externally, though he
scarcely knew anything about it, for he considered it his
duty not to give it the slightest encouragement. He
asked if it was the intention to break the solemn pledge
and contract that had been made, and signed and sealed
by her gracious Majesty, to remove this building? Ile
believed that morally, religiously, and socially speak
ing, it was a great curse to the country; and he hoped
it was in such a state that it would come down whether
they would or not, as it could not be kept up except at

very great expense. After the exhibition of meanness
on the part of the Commissioners when they came to
that House and asked money for the payment of their
clerks, he could expect nothing at their hands but
trickery and manoeuvring. Ho had given his might to
oppose the erection of the Crystal Palace, though in
that they were thwarted by the late Attorney-General ;
and now as an honest man he felt it his duty to oppose
by every means in his power the motion of the Hon.
Gentleman opposite.

Mr. LABOUCHERE had no intention of following
the Gallant Officer through the great variety of topics to
which he had adverted in his discursive speech, but, as
one of the Commissioners, he begged to offer a few ob-
servations. He did not agree with the Gallant Officer
in the general estimate he had formed of the merits of
the Exhibition.—(Hear, hear.) His belief was that it
had not only ministered to the gratification of hundreds
of thousands of persons of all ranks and conditions—
(Hear, hear)—but that its permanent effects on the trade
of this country, as well as on the improvement of all the
arts that ministered to the comfort and well-teing of
the people, would not be little.—(Hear, hoar.) He de-
spaired, however, of making any impression upon the
mind of the Gallant Colonel by any argutro nts be
could use, and therefore would leave that question to
the general sense of the House.—(Hear, hear.) But the
Gallant Officer talked of the general demoralization of
the country caused by this Exhibition. Now, he be-
lieved nothing could be more moral, in the highest
sense of the word, more humanizing, or civilizing,
than the great spectacle they had seen in this coun-
try.—(Hear, hear.) So different were his views from
those of the Gallant Colonel, that though he had seen
with admiration the magnificent assemblage of works of
industry collected within the marvellous structure which
the genius of Paxton had raised, yet there was another
spectacle he had seen with still greater delight, and that
was the orderly demeanour of the hundreds of thousands
of our fellow-countrymen of all ranks and chwes, from
the hives of industry in the macufacturing towns, as well
as from the agricultural distticts, almost without a single
case being brought before the police, and without the
slightest disturbance of the public peace, in spite of those
sinister observations they had heard so much of, that the
metropolis would bo a scene of disorder, if not actually
burnt and pillaged.--(Cheers.) Nor could he omit to
say how gratifying it was to find that, nNwitbstanding
the great influx of foreigners to our shores, there had
scarcely occurred among them any more than among our
own countrymen, a paltry police case or the slightest
breach of the public peace.--(Hear.) He therefore formed
is very different estimate of the Exhibition from that en-
tertained by the Gallant Officer; and be could not help re-
ferring to the circumstance, so gratifying to them as
Englishmen, while it had excited the admiration of fo-
reigners, that all this had taken place without any display
of military—(Cheers)—that the mere staff of the police-
man, enforced by the love of order and of law which
happily distinguished the people of this country, had
crushed everything like disorder, notwithstanding that
the streets of the metropolis were crowded beyond all
former preceient.—(Cheers.) He would now make a
few remarks upon the motion before the House. The
Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Heywood) had brought forward a
motion, asking the House, not to pledge themselves to
the eventual and permanent maintenance of the building,
but to consent that a sort of reprieve should be given
to it, so as to enable them next session fully to consider
the matter.—(Elear, hear.) On that question be, as a
Commissioner, and as a member of the Government,
would express no opinion whatever. He held that it was
a question for that House to decide.—(Hear, hear.) Both
as a Commissioner and as a member of the Government,
he considered himself pledged to pull down the building,
unless that House expressed a different opinion. Fur
his part, not for all that was in the Crystal Palace
would he be a party to the violation of that pledge, with-
out the consent of the House of Commons.—(Hear,
hear.) At the same time it was right the House
should be mindful of how the Commissioners stood in
regard to this matter. The engagement which was
entered into with Messrs. Fox and Henderson as
to the taking down of the palace presented two alter-
natives. It was, is the first place, agreed to pay a
certain sum for the use of the building f a certain time;
and that it should then be taken down; but, if it should
be finally resolved to retain the building by the Commis-
sioners, it was then agreed that- they should purchase
it by the payment of a further sum. They had paid, or
had engaged to pay, for the use of the building about
120,000/.; and, if the building were purchased, they en-
gaged to pay 70,000/. more, making together 190,000/.
It was also agreed that:unless the Commissioners gave
notice to Messrs. Fox and Henderson for the removal of
the palace before a certain day they should be bound to
purchase it, so that even if the building were to stand
they would be obliged to give that notice, unless those
gentlemen were ready to release them from that obliga-
tion. The Commissioners were, in fact, bound to pull
down the Crystal Palace, unless the House interfered to
prevent it. The whole question was before the House,
and he would not give an opinion on the subject one way
or the other. Every Member was
perfectly competentto form a judgment upon it, and it was pre-eminently
the duty of the House to decide the question. He should
not vote on the motion, but wait and see what decision
the House came to.

Sir R. INGLIS, differing entirely as he did from the
feelings expressed by his Hon. and Gallant Friend (COl.
Sibthorp) on this subject, nevertheless concurred with
him in the conclusion at which he had arrived, namely,
that the House was not at liberty to al;or the contract
into which the Commissioners had enters d with regard
to the removal of the building from Hyde-park. He
agreed with his Right Hon. Friend (Mr. Labouchure) in
nil that he had said as to the benefits which had already
resulted from the Exhibition. And when they acknow-
ledged those results, it behoved them not to be proud,
ipt, thankful that there had been communicated to a

larger mass of their fellow creatures than hed ever be=
tore been congregated together more rational, intelli-
gent, and benirficial pleasure than had bsen ever before
enjoyed. He did not hesitate to confess that he was one
of those who, last year, though he did not prognosticate
tvil, did in his arcret mind anticipate almost all the evils
which others openly foretold. Thank God! he could now
bear his testimony to the truth of all that his Right
Hon. Friend had stated as to the good conduct of the