The Sun.
London, England, 1834-02-13 00:00:00

CHELTENHAM .
Per Bushel. s.d. to s.d. d. to d.
Wheat
Barley 3 0 3 9 Mutton

Oats
Beans
Pease
Hay 3/. 10s

iIA 11KET.—Feb. 11
Pet lb.

Veal
Pork
Lamb
to 3/. 15s. Od. per ton

HULL MARKET.—Feb 11.
Wheat, Old —s. 40. 50s NtiW
Foreign —s. 50s. Ms. ln bond... —s. —s —s.
Oats, Poland
Small or Feed.... —s. 14s. 18s
Foreign —s. 16s. 18s
Barley, Norf. & Sut ... —s 265. 28s. Line. & Wold —s. 24s 275.
- Foreign
Beans —s. 325. 345. Foreign
Pease, White —s .325. 365. Grey —s 308.32 s
Pares —s. —s. —s Foreign
Rapeseed. in bond none.

DUMFRIES M ...... __ _ ___ _,
s. d. s.d.f s. d. s. d
Wheat, Imp. Bush... 5 9 to 6 9Butfer,l6oz. 0 8 to 0 9
Barley ...... ............ .. 2 9 3 O'Eggi,'. 0 0 1 0
Oats ..... .. 2 0 2 4 Beef, per score .........8 0 9 0
Flour, I4lb.
Oatmeal I 6 1 8 Veal t; 4 0 4
Potatoes, cwt.

RKETS.—Feb. 5.

MYSTERIOUS DISAPPEARANCE.—On Fri-
day last a servant in the employ of Mr. Hilary, IS the
Vine Inn, Bishopsgate-street, whose name is John Day,
left his employer's house at about mid day, informing his
fellow_servant that he phnuld return at ten o'clock in the
evening. He has not since, however, made his appear-
ance, No reason can be assigned for bis absence.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT
THIS DAY, THURSDAY, FEB• 13.

HOUSE OF COMMO VS.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at the usual hfoorur the
eats.
Mr. STRICKLAND presented a petition
Cum-
Colonel
blishment of a gas company in tbe town of Leeds. a
EVANS presented a petition from tw
certain
missioners of the Court of Requests, praying that
returns made by the clerks of that Court last July might
.
be recalled, and that various errors and false statemes
made to that Hon. House be ainended.—Laid on the table.
Mr. POTTER brought up the report of the Committee
on the North Union Railway Company. The Comun.rthe.
of Aairm.otTio.n with.
reported that the standing orders had been complied
Re also obtained leave to bring in a Bill to amend the.
4th of George IV., for lighting the town of Liverpool
with gas.
but not seeing any of his Majesty's Ministers presents
vious to the establfefitei
should postpone it to a later hour of the day, erl
tmttce
ongaeepfakoiht‘eerßiveseo
ieetngoshhfteti
thstohßt ntede
motion,
hytnnel collection
had taken
content himself by giving notice of his in
tentioa
to move for a copy of the correspondence between
o.'fC
considerableoN 0 R saidi,m
it,oh
ratta
ntee
fohra
hat givenffionrnoitnicse,
int
the
Irish Government and certain magistrates of a tows
easaaccpnhKnkr
correspondence
fkaekdhreeypetnn al
tithesnceelanaeyoef
sdeu,
ta.
dti
hwnp enHoht
nighto betweenl :lei cterahiehtt
sohahfdtfedoirsorheeGtegotireosikoi
magistrates
ien.npngrbp
pntile;aot
Altoci
001
rneetcalt
net:
intention
appointed
inesscfoe:ettot
0n
doooff
the same subject, with a copy of the report of the inves-
tigation
any want of courtesy.
Mr. BENETT presented a petition from the congre-
gation of the independent chapel of Warminster, cora-
pl sining of the grievances to which they had been subjected
by the payment of Church rates. They also complained
of the want of a proper registration of births and deaths i
their congregation—that they could not bury their dead
according to the rules and ceremonies of their Church,
and that, in case of marriage, they were obliged to con•
form to certain ceremonies at variance with their consci-
entious opinions.—(Hear.) They complained, also,
that they were debarred the benefit of having their
children educated in the national schools, unless they sub-
scribed to certain articles which would make them
members of the Established Church. The Hon. Member
stated that in most of the grievances complained of in the
petition which he held in his hand, he fully concurred,
and bore testimony to the respectability of tbe persons
whose signatures were attached to it.
Mr. FINN, in allusion to this petition from the D.
/renters, begged leave to state that their demands were very
just, and that they laboured under great hardships. Tl;e
system of registration of marriages had worked well 1
Ireland, and with regard to burials, the present Lord
Chancellor had introduced a Bill to allow Catholics to be
That
buried according to their own ritual and forms.
was but the legitimate course, and those who were Incn't
anxious for the Established Church would do well not to
resist the claims of the Dissenters.—(Hear, hear.) if the
members of the Established Church, or if his MajeslYs
aivernment did resist them the Dissenters might 11,
resorlbotets
,
very easy mode—the same that was some o
to in Ireland. In Dublin the Catholics established ceine,
teries to bury their dead in, and the Clergy were thu_
deprived of a great poi tior. of their fees ;—the result Ws'
th it the Clergy found it convenient very much to red
n.ene„
their prices. The adoption of that mode by the _
'renters would have the effect of remedying some oflie
evils complained of.
the relief of Dissenters and Catholics as most atisf tan;
a oAdler,..l
to the
eFtEwRo FERGUSON supported
measures
that
had
de
beenpeti t
pi oana.aeacd
ogfor,er
as far as they went. In all their reasonable
public
just demands, and few that he had seen in thiejfdr).....
prin.s could be considered unreason
able."—l:riesenters
they should have his cordial support. The
(Hear,
hear,
of England were a most loyal body of men"--• •,, less
pheeaaere)a—hleanadrviin
qt,iimirets,.twa
thee n, h
,tnheatcnuntry was
I" Was no
instance of Dissenters having shown' the oniv eor;
ttirow the established institution. They bad
indisputable claims to the favour and justice of the o,
and he hoped that none of their claims would go Hanger
dressed another se-sion.—(Cheers.)
considerable
11.1 e. WALTER presented a petition from a 0
number of the holders and occupiers of land 'f
the county of Berks, praying for a commutation °
titheQ, and declaring that the demand of one-tenth of t',l6,
produce of the land by those who did not contribute
produc ion was at variance with reason and justices
was not necessary for him on the present occasion to of
now far lie might he disposed to concur in all the •ng;
bringfweee rte-d a magistratesl
yig
t'i highly
a s respectabletof
tithe
oew no
eur,s.t bodyy.
gestions of the petitioners as to the mode by which tb'
commutation was prayed for, but he must state that chef
ea*nnyr'd esi re there
the clergy were not the only persons inimediat'lY, "ft
of tithe property were in one respect much - of
under • stood ,he alluded to lay impropriation' the
every kind. The original lay impropriations before
time of Henry VIII. were chargeable with providing;
and proper priests for their respective gerigh"' and
J
feare
with their support and maintenance •
*iodicidualo
however that lay impropriators, whether
sterlYs
or corporations, did not at the present time parishes
and aarquately maintain the vicarages of the ared
of which they enjoyed the bent fit of tithes. ge for
The
esnitooernit:hi ens otiniatmehi
de oqfue
best t:raeogif_tr,
that, in too many instances, they retained the pcoPer; .he
their own put poses, and left others to discharq
0`
to
duties without giving them a sufficient red trier
se ure proper attention. lie therefore urged that villages
so situated had an equitable claim to the restitutioricvst
tit. e property, and a full remuneration of their nle .act
incumbents, that the lay impropriators might, bY
process, be made to increase such reinunerahis lion
AM
ect
it was at present inad, quote. He hoped t
wuuld be adjusted in a manner satisfactery to the °,lfergoe
and beneficial to the country at large.—Ordered to "
the table. ins
ColonA EVANS presented a petition from an , io
visual named Richard Ellis, late of Christ ChurFottbe
the county of Monmouth, but now a prisoner in
.iry
Ki. g's Bench, praying the House to institute an Wl°
into his case, with a view to his release. titiotif
Mr. FERGUS OCONNOR supporte I the Pe in
and spoke of the injoi hers effects of the Debtors' Law
Ireland —To lie on the table. frog'
Sir SAMUEL WHALLEY presented a petition g
the electors of the parish of St. Marylebone, PraY.,Weil
for a relief from general and local taxation. He obser'
that the petitioners complained that they had for a
time implored the House to release them from taiat'°-1
but only had the mortification to find, that, instead ,
being relieved, additional burdens were thrown upon their
With respect to local taxation, they complained espeeia;
of the county rate. The House was aware that here'
fore the law was, that when Scotch and Irish Pis'
pers became chargeable to a parish or county, h`
were removed to the borders of that c, unty to w hl.°ll t-t
belonged, but air Act was recently passed for the reit°
sit Scotch and Irish paupers at the whole and sole
of the parish to which they became chargeable, Arras.;
the
Magistrates in Session assembled had
power
tracting for the removal
of such raveis, which be
%
done under h the authority of ti e new Act, at the ra"
hsg
32W. per head. The house would therefore perceive t-re
an the first showing the cost was increased
than six told, being raised from ss. to 325. per head ;:,$
(Hear.) The petitioners were willing to admit that g "io
abuses existed under the old plan, and that an alterati°°
the law was necessary ; but if it was necessary, i°
tisties! point of view, to obtain accurate infortivt"coe
the number of Scotch and Irish paupers which beCd-oar•
chargeable to the parishes of England, and more Par:pers
laxly to those in the county of Alid..lesex, the p'titi.iffi)
thought it bard that the whole expense of the e%Peri:
should be thrown upon them. The parishioneri the
Alarylebone had to pay more than one-sixth pact ° else
whole county rate, and they had seen that rate ineffibe
to such a frightful amount that it had become oneTOle r,)
ost important
in ims in the public arcount..,,o
They complaed that the county rate should belleed lzio
irresponsible body of magistrates. who for the 0105 t 1:1 0
were nut sufficiently infOrmed up in the sti.jectP 9.,°,40%
great alteration mtist take place in the mode of r
the rate before the petitioners could hope for relief vabi;ll
"'
this head they alluded to the agricultural distress, "',..0r
drew a large influx of Irish labour..rs,who, in slowly war
their way up to the metropolis, either transmitted the ve:44
of their hannur to their sawn country, or so cores bey
secreted their money about their tersons,t hat vibe° ,t,
reached the metropolis they only became a burden tbe
fie believed this evil would never be remedied tin"'„ieri
House sh.tilit resolve to introduce into Ireland a 1"°""ds.
system of poor laws, grounded upon the Act of El %Pear,
Sir S. What ey concluded by requesting the most e
Id
nest atten ion to the plan to that effect, and hoped it 0°
lie r,ce veil with acclamation. te•
Mr. O'DWYER cenceivsd that the observatien@ --frg •
Hon. G nth-min who spoke last +urnisheil a wrong a-'ilhe
b„. t''
tnent in LyonoflT r repeal of the ...11.00. spoke ° rgiit
incursions of the poor Irish urn the English, but le „44
to say anything about the rich Irish who visited Sm

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e(nintrYse-e(Hear, hear.) 11e denounced the poor va-
Brants, but said turtling of the rich vagahonds.—(A
thatl°4l4) He (Mr. O'Dwyer) hail no hesitation in saying,
any Poor law which could he brought in,—which he,
It ea humble effectiv individual, would support—would be in.
e in affording relief to Ireland, unless there was
alto an absentee tax enacted. —(Hear, hear.) The one
was as necessary as the other; be also considered the legal
impediments to the conveyance of property should be re-
moved, and
these a facility be afforded .
to its transfer. If all
be
points were attended to, the Irish poor would not
spoor on English ch •ty nor would, in his opinion, any
Poor law do so mu.chan oo'd to Ireland, as a law which
"'fluid restore its residentg gentry.-•-(Hear')
Mr
• FINN should certainly deprecate the expression of
'lf Hon. Gentleman who had spoken the last hut one.
The application of the word " vagabond " was ill-timed
to rt
poor Iris! h though in the condition of
11111:4(1,itints, yet didl' who,
deserve that epithet.—(Hear,
1.4;) He h id occasionally met those creatures, and he
(th',TM say that they badly clad, badly fed, and they
e Housal
the . --) might lay to it- own account,
iikitntliserable destitution of those poor people. Mr. Pitt
a, 'flounced the policy of England towards Ireland as
, ha: I.?'" and selfish, and be (Mr. Pitt), who was a . Princef
i Aisister for twentyyears, had a good opportunity o
itileling ; also Lord Grenville said the same ; and
ROI °lf% Finn) would warrant that England was
ft. true to the same policy.—(Hear, hear.)
.He
..,.04vettru.:irnlinhad met some couple of hundreds of poor Irish
Liverpool ; they had been enabled. to save
di enable sum of 30 shillings, because they lived very
sieeelir,°,.tlY from English labourers, and he (Mr. Finn) ad-
t a ''"em not to return to Ireland ag iin, but emigrate
be the
with the3os. they bad saved. He could vouch
anti" fact of their being barbarously treated ; their▪ faces
'ea! ntld themselves otherwise ill-treated. He had seen
',les-4114"R them in good apparel, and concluded that he
leinetill Englishman, but on questioning him he ewer-
t Ds., that he was an Irishman, and his master, who was
c gala • •
Mm,
ue
"ecseA meet the bad treatment that Irish poor generally
ttateelite" in this country. Hon. Gentlemen received the
h 4 eat of the Hon. Member for Waterford, regarding
• det 'irt'd, with shouts of applause. as if he had been
rait%r ! Mine atrocious cruelty, or murder, com-
kleur 'runt he would say that the Irish poor were scarcely
% Mull. aggressions o e 1-'4f the Enclish, when in this
%atotem ens:eh had been said of 13,0001. being spieie,r;
ni, poor creatures, but they should remem
Bilkotek'ao/. was disposed of amongst seven English
lailtal i; , In consequence of the absenteeism which pre-
'lreirtecl -oPland., the resources of the country had been
tome r u to this, and it was therefore nn wondern income
here. et,tnra should be made for the spending of its i
erapi ~,,,,3/4°Rtish servants and English artisans were in the
e0u1ae.,,,7," of Irish absentee., and he (Mr. Finn)
Which "`„:` them that that portion of the Irish people
teoming",elr.e deemed exclusively loyal hitherto, were be-
- 4reu a it: ally deemed
to the injuries and neglect their country had
n
•, Mel logo Mr. Finn here alluded to the reduction
, atreCneßea which had taken place in Irish establishments,
beggetr. the Post-office, Custom-house, gcce, ate , and
from ,`° ask what advantages had resulted to Ireland
(if toe Much boasted union of the two countri▪
es?-
0 'ars Lear, from the Opposition.) He had heard Hon.
(ebtlernen make mentio of gin shops as the source
whirftrie and misery, but did they not remember the
r0,2k1-shups in Ireland had contributed to the debase-
trt of the Irish people, and the ruin of their country ?
do„et(Mr. Finn) traced crime, from the whisky shop to tie
te`s, and was certain mt they were the most fertile
re yes of crime and destitution in Ireland ; but then tl e
latut
tnne of the country profited much by their encourage-
, fet • and therefore was it that every facility was afforded
Itatistablishing them. He had known of 21 cabins in a
44'111111e, seven of them to have been whisky shops;
the enold not by his influence prevent such being
' toe . eatie, as all his dissuasions to that Effce,
of j:,ll,Beleal. He would implore the Hon House, instead
lid L'n'fla to the silly talk of .‘ indignat•ore." to con-
to" The cause of the misery which prevailed in Ireland,
'9ealhe "nd of devi•ing some mode of redress. Since thel
badef
crti''' !Jo' i being passed, the poptilatioa of Ireland
lineal!' -e'ted fromin fourmilliena and a half to eight too
by -, Yet the
h , consumption of butchers' meat was reduce d
Oe4ne "alf• Tuat was an argament from which Hen.
reverse e 0 eou'd at once infer whether prosperity or the
mi,-"` '7,55 'Le ed by this Union.
life";,. "'OTTER said he hoped the Hon. and Learned
districts for Kilkenny would except the manufactut ing
.44 t from the censure of ill-treating Irishmen. He
(Manch ° "aY$ that in the town he was connected with
ke -"ter), Irishmen were treated as well as English-
-0,..,,0f is ores particularly the case in the distribution
He
ecooen ndumerous charities which existed in that phase.
~ I say the same of the town lie bad the honour to
•,presenr, where
_a great number of Irish resided ; be
Sever heard of work tieing refused to a
Was an Irishman. In his opinion, because he
,Sot have got 10 its present e
norm° us ecx°tetintn:tnnityriatdheo uwtotuhl de
assistance of Irish labourers.
Mr. A. JOHNSTONE said that he heard much said
hook
Irish and Scotch vagrants, and about sending them
Qu'l,k to their own country. He should very much wish
ft.le informA liy the Hon. Member for Marylebone,where
...; extraordinary influx of Scotch paupers cane from?
afts.4 la
lleh•) Let it be considered that an Englishman
t 4 a resilience of three years in Scotland, became entitled
eo°,l,llrOchi it relief, but a Scotchinan in this country
• MI not obtain such a settlement. Under these cif cum-
5e11,',.. he thought that they might not to be twitted with
e-e' "agrants.—(Hear, bear.) He would take leave to
front that those complaints came with a very bad grace
Irl°ol4 tits Metropolis. He would call the attention of the
pe,!l; Member for Marylebone, w bo bad presented the
drew to the enormous sums which the metropolis
put:" from the whole country.--(Hear, hear, hear.)
tact.. l'i4 months of the year the whole of the aria-
,h_ "eY of England was resident in the metropolis, and
Would:!ole uf their property was spent there. If any one
polio take the trouble to look to the state of the metro-
• rehil the aristocracy was resident and whilst they
alabsent he would find d'ff nee indeed.
e. ' a very ereat 1 ere .
Nast arti'dhueanrio)undTdhe complaints were, in his opinion,
"err before presenting' auralkhe thought that the Hon. Mem-
taution the stateme tonsideration the grine s_re a petition,. oughdt to viewk with
o
reset cif the country. -... ty'ance',en:awinbedtchinwite,reanendutoredta
bey
the
Rnaln. BAR
40
iiipember
Rov.
said that
hear.)
the complaints made by the
theta]. A
fur Marylehone were unfounded, unjust,
very
,Ireland• ichtha.nd r e . ,
great portion of the property of
m Scotland was spent in the very place from
rote for 's
of
came; and if the Hon. Member should.
- -"lnt a return of the number of Irish paupers in this
al,oeefY4 he (Mr. Barron) would feel it his duty to
Irtimci a similar return of the number of proprietors from
Sties,._.n° 'Pent their fortunes in the parish of Maryle-
nil nali rlears hear, and a laugh ) The petitioners, in
bin
°oet;u. h-"!'°n, had taken a narrow and most illiberal view of
Jeet.
ken ---(Hear, hear ) With regard to the intro-
en %e "f Poor L into Ireland, he hoped that the
le -4° would Laws
F ~,--t° th not permit such a measure to re
1 introduced
Xneh 'nit; eGuntrY----a measure which had brought so
'eir A -."-Y and crime into this country—and in
!Pie g re4aztieetY to keep Irish paupers at home, to inflict
44ie d " e°1.50 ti on Ireland that had ever been
that e UPO,n any P.
ir somethin nation. He most anxiously desired
1 or of
eland, t, g efficacious should be done for t le po
'tett the 4at,, he did not think that a tax upon land would
tP°tl bit ti„r-rP°Be• He could not he a resident proprietor
-° help °PertY if he did not feel that it was impossible
in P doing
somethingoche for. the
poor. But there were
f Law, eana of relieving the .
poor better than
c" reel • ."--a", for instance, a national measure
1.4.
"ling
for improving the national
ii, Orcee, in
building bridges, laying els and such
Voss' ail of s..c• i can
' had been
9 tie i -.lca respects the country
Air. k,-,g toed.
linilae '43(VVELLthat in his opinion it would be
lir fitly fo sail,
-I ought f r the advantage of Ireland if a measure. were
i °lwod for the purpose of introducing poor
INF n'o that kin ,
F ' • . -h measure were
ell
eueed, it sho 1 . have obis
it Mk a
it,' $ that if a d lns hearty suppor . r He was
d t d
" %It a Proper s stem of poor laws were a op
_e $
there "aotry, it . y
1,, s told wv,., , , viould be the means of keeping capital
re hoped those
promote the best interests of the country.
'tree port, sentiments, which were those of a very
4 due a,,,i ~.41 of the Poeulation of this country, would have
AI ....era in that "" [Liu tak " I'.• O'coN ae•
any . NOR said that he had not intended to
_, part re
"ghat had b this discus•ion ; but he could not pass by
-
fora,ern said by Member for Waterford
fora, aoticin • the Hen. .
brit land, eelat)
se" ". He had inonded last session to g
con He hititPe!fi6o motion for the improvement of Ire-
lie :f POOP
law"
notice of a motinn fur the introdue
intendeda" reverit,:t firrllo that country, hut by some manoeuvre
a ino., botteith to bringing forward I is metier]. He
11" agiin thi:"ling this to bring f rward such
opening ,;if a markeer°,". His great object would be the
t_ anceilor
a of the E, r,"lbour ; std the Noble Lord, the
herei!(4r o'co ' -"Nu • d him that he liked
acted 1,n0r,5),,,„, or, informed .
.1
stem bad
%1.,..up0n b,, ii }stern, arid that atom arsy
exciting
the 1,:t1Ilon by a.f,
hilt (Lord Althorp), namely,
eir,"on. Meu•ibet:.'icural .
premiums. He thought that”
....uueriarrod s who cavilled at the term " vagabonds
41 ii. me_. Il
fora wrong sense. He thought that the
seao pa wore Al • b
atyle onemeant it in a legal sense
`s'eftr hear, fro
W Sir S, Whalley)--and consequently

meant nothing hurtful to the feelings of Irishmen. He
differed entirely from the Hon. Member for Waterford
(Mr. Barron) with respect to t e effects of the poor laws, and
he (Mr. O'Connor) thought that that Hon. Member was
wrong in supposing that it would be injorants to the
Minded interest. The Hon. Member Premed to be under
an apprehen4inn that his propel ty won't' be injured. Now
it was not fair to assume, that because poor laws worked
ill in this country, a system of poor laws that should be
.tempt from those evils that attached to the poor laws in
this country would also have the same ill effect. He
certainly would support the introduction of poe.• laws into
Ireland.

Mr. BARRON explained. He was most anxious to
see the poor of Ireland fully empl,y .1. What he depre-
cated was the introduction of that system which had been
found so detrimental to England.
Mr. HARDY did not think that the Hon. Member
for Nlarylebone ought to have been found so much fault
with for his using the word vagabond. The class of
persons of whom he spoke were so in reality, for not one in
20 of those who were passed as Scotch and Irish paupers
had ever been in their respective countries for years ; their
plan was to get to a great town, such as Bristol or Lon-
don, and there apply to a parish who forwarded them on
their, journeys. But the fret was they never got farther
than Carlisle ; at that point they begged their way once
more up to the very place from which they bad been passed,
and applied to a different parish, and again were
trewed by what to them was a very pleasant ex-
cursion at the charge of the payers of the poor rates.
they went to these large towns because they bad a greater
choice of parishes, and of course fewer chances of detec-
tion. He under those circumstanees thought they deserved
most fully the appellation of vagabonds.
Colonel WILLIAMS declared that, notwithstanding all
that had been said against the Act of Elizabeth, he would
say that there never was a more benevolent measure than
that by which a provision was made for the aged,
the infirm, and the orphan. He spoke from an
experience of a quarter of a century in the administration
of these laws, and be declared that it was not the laws
themselves that caused the mischief, but their ntal-admi-
nistrat'on.

Sir S. WHALLEY explained. He had not used the
word vagabond in any invidious sense, but merely re-
gretted that the law was such, or rather that Ireland was
so much in want of laws of that kind, that it rendered a
great part of its population vagabonds in the eyes of the
law. He presented a petition from the inhabitants of
illarylehone, agreed to at a public meeting, over which a
Noble Lord presided in his capacity of churchwarden,
praying for the repeal of the assessed taxes. He could
not let such an important petition be thrown into the box
of the House wiihoitt saying a few words upon the
subject, even though the House might be tired of
hearing so much upon the subject as they had
done. The injustice of the house and window taxes had
been already so much talked of, and so clearly shown,
that he would say but little on the matter. He would only
say that that injustice could not hr, more forcibly put,
than by the fact that Maryl bone parish p Tid more to these
taxes in a year than 20 whole counties. But there was
another sense—a mural sense—in which the matter might
be put, which would effectually bind the House to their
repeal. When the Reform Bill was under discussion in
the House much had been said in regard to the preven ion
of bribery, and he believed that the House was sincere in
that desire, but be would ask whether they had not
even in that Bill given ti e greatest of facilities to it by
withholding the franchise ruin every person till t ese
taxes were paid Tirough not one of his onoi!uents had
ever insulted him by asking hint to pay these taxes, in
order that he might have his vote, yet it was well
known that the practice had been very general throughout
the whole country during the late general election.
The petition was signed only by such persons that at-
tended the meeting as were members of the vestry, but
he trusted that the House on that account would not
draw the conclusion that, on the reinject of the petition,
the parish were not unanimous. He had previously pre-
'rented a similar petition, signed by upwards of 6.000
persons. and Ire felt no hesitation in saying, if the present
petition had been carried from house to house, that there
would not have been six persons who would not have
signed it. He was happy to spe other metropolitan
Members in the House besides himself, who, be felt no
d uht, in addition to the Hon. Member for Surrey (Mr.
Briscoe), tt ould support the petition. He was perfectly
aware how ineffectual an advircite he was on the present
question ; but he telt it to be his duty not to allow the
petition to be presented sub silentio. He, boa ever, de•
termined not to detain the House at any length, because
he felt confident that the subject must come before
the Huse at a future opportunity. In conclusion the
Hon. Member trusted the House would bear in mind
that the people bad been grievously disappointed upon the
subject, as they confidently expected from what fell from
the Chancellor of the Exchrquer in the last session, that
the olinoxiuus taxes would have been repeded, and it was
not therefore to be wondered at that they had pursur d
steps which he for one felt extremely sorry for, but.
which he was sure the House could not be surprised
at, when the whole circumstances were taken into con-
sideration.—( Hear.)
Mr. BRISCOE in rising to support the prayer of the
petition observed, that he did an the more readily, because
in doing so he trusted he should remove an impression
which appeared to have existed at the mretine from
which the petition emanated, that he was unfriendly
to the repeal of the house and window tax. On the
contrary, he begged leave, in the most pointed and ef-
fectual manner, to impress upon Lord Althorp the wis
door and policy of abolishing such obuoxtous imposts.
The grievous inequality of the house tax lie believed no
gentleman in that House was inclined to deny. If there
were those who would do so, he would beg to remind them
tbat there were two whole counties in which the highest
rate of assessment to the house duty did not exceed 201.
or 301., and there were no less than 15 counties, including
that of Durham, which was so pre-eminent tor the
magnificence of its palaces and castles, in which the
maaimuni did not exceed 100/., while there w•Ts
scarcely a single tradesman in the metropolis so low as
twenty pounds ; but great numbers in which the
maximum of 100/., to which he had referred, was greatly
exceeded. He (Mr. Briscoe) thought that the ink Tbi-
tants of the metropolis had very just grounds for present_
iug the petition for the removal of such obnoxious im-
posts as the house and window taxes ; and, he believed,
that by a reduction of the public expenditure, taking into
consideration the flourishing state of the revenue, and the
improvements, which be thought might be fairly antici-
pated in other parts of it, the House would be
fully justified in repealing those taxes.—(Hear, hear.)
He had every hope that if the Noble Lord (Althorp) would
comply with the prayer of the petition that it would
confer very great relief, arid be received with very nude
satisfaction by the country. Not only did he (Mr.
Briscoe) sympathise with the sufferings of the petitioners,
but also the great body of his constituents were equally
interested, and anxious for the immediate repeal of these
taxes. He confessed that when he bore in mind the very
long period during which the petitioners had borne the
heavy burden of the taxes with so much patience and
forbearance, he conceived that they were justly entitled to
relief from a professedly reforming Administration, such
as at present composed his Majesty's Government.
Dr. LUSHINGTON said that he had been requested
by the very respectable body of petitioners who had
attended the meeting to appear in his place in that House,
to give the petition that support which be conceived
it entitled. He had never entertained a doubt of the ex-
pediency of repealing those taxes, and he might almost
add of the necessity of proceeding to the speedy adoption
of that measure. The numerous constituency which he
(Dr. Lushington) represented were, of all others of his
Majesty's subjects, those who suffered most under the
pressure of the taxes called the house and window taxes.
They consisted of a very numerous class of persons,
by far the larger portion earning their subsistence
by their own industry—in trade and commercial
pursuits. The inhabitants of the Tower Hamlets derived
no benefit front the large expenditure of the aristocracy in
the metropolis—they were entirely dependent on the trade
and commerce of the port 4,f London. In comparison
with the incomes they derived from their labour, those
uses pressed on them with infinitely greater severity than
on any other class of his M Tj.sty's subjects. He (Dr. L.)
knew many instances where persons were assessed for
both house and window taxes, whose weekly earnings did
not exceed 94., and he did conceive that it was utterly
impracticable to adopt any medification by which they
could be made to bear equitably upon all classes of the
people. Nothing hut the entire and complete repeal of
these taxes would answer the just expectations of the peti•
tioners and the country at large. With respect to the
window tax and its mischievous consequences, he would
s iv that in principle it was infinitely more objection.
able than the house tax. The consequence of that
tax was neither more nor less than this, that
it allowed to the rich the benefit and advantages of en-
joying that which was most conducive to good health, pure
air, and circumscribing it tar those who bad not the means
of enjoying it otherwise. No person could entertain a
stronger opinion of the propriety of repea ing those taxes,
or of the necessity of urging it with greater energy than
himself, and here he hoped the House would permit him to
say a few words on the p‘st he had taken in the proceed-
ings upon this subject during the past session, He was

!compelled to vote, not against the repeal of those
taxes, but in support of a motion which left it doubtful if
• that motion had not been carried whether they would not
have been subjected to a property tax, with an income tax
annex d to it. It was not because he wavered or had
entertained a doubt that these taxes should be repealed,
hut because he conceived that by voting otherwise he
should run the risk of encountering a greater evil without
being able to ohtain what his constituents sought. It bad
been said that at the meeting at which the Hon. Alentber
for Marylebone attended, there had been a gross misrepre-
sentation of the conduct and motives of other Members.
He was quite satisfied of this, that no person who at-
tended that meeting, much less any Hon. Member of
that House, would condescend, for the purpose of oh•
taining the applause of the persons assembled there, to
misrepresent the motives of others. In pursuing the
course he did last year, he did so, conceiving it to he his
duty, under the most painful circumstances. He acknow-
ledged, as he always bad done, that he set a great
value upon the app'ause and approbation of those who,
although not couneel among the higher classes, are
capable of forming a correct estimate of the proceedings
of that House. He had their good at heart, their opinion
he valued, but above all he valued it in the present
instance, from a conviction that the means adopted by
them were twee likely to effect the object in view. With
respect to a deficiency—be differed from the Hon. Mem-
ber who preceded him. He should deplore a deficiency
as being likely to shake the confidence of the nation in
the public engagements, and as being likely to increase the
difficulties under which they at present laboured.
Because looking at the foreign relations of England,
and the position which she should bear towards them, he
(Dr. Lusltington) should not like that any suspicion should
be entertained that England was not rich or honest enough
to maintain all her engagements. No man was more
anxious to see all just and reasonable retrenchment pr ice
tised. They could not forget that a great experiment was
at present making respecting the abolition of slavery in
the West Indies. He had entire confidence in the success
of that measure. It would, in the first place, save the
expense of troops in these colonies, and in the second place
that which was more valuable, the loss of life which had
been pt;ofusely squandered in those colonies, wherever
they were unable or unwilling to protect themselves
He looked forward to that period as soon as those colonies
should have completed the change which they were now
undergoing, and then he would most willingly vote for
a reduction in our military establishments. There was
another subject most painful to him, he alluded to the
present state anti condition of Ireland. Would to God
he so understood the condition of that country as to be
able to devise measures for the preservation of its tran-
quillity, without the necessity of enforcing it by the pre-
sence of a large military force. He hoped, however,
that would be done, and then again there would be an
opportunity to reduce the number of troops, which would
he infinitely creditable, not only to the revenue,
but to the character of this country. He would not
trespass further than by stating, that he cordially con-
curred in the petition, and, to speak more openly end
candidly, lie would vote for the reduction of the house
and window taxes whenever that question came simply
before tt e House; but if ever he should be placed in the
same painful situation as he was last year, when there
was a possibility that he would, by a contrary course to
that which he then adopted, be doing a greater
mischief,—when, on the proposition to take off
the malt tax, and substitute a property tax, the Riget
Honourable Baronet, the Member for Tatnwoi th,
(Sir R. Peel) declared that he would never consent to a
property tax, without an income tax being appended to it;
then, and then only, he should, however painful to him-
self, feel bound to act as he had then done.
Colonel EVANS would not occupy the time of the
House by going at length into the policy of continuing or
repealing the house and window tax, but would reserve his
observations until the question came in a formal shape be-
fore the House. The Hon. Member for Marylehone had
truly stated that the existence of those taxes, and
making their payment necessary to the ret-ntion of
the elective franchise, had a tendency to produce
corruption amongst voters. The House had known many
instances, showing that that was the consequence ; and
many members h.td been applied to to pay the taxes of
electors to enable them to vote. It was true that that
part of the metropolis from whence the petition came de-
rived great advantage over other parts of the country,
fram the residence of the aristocracy ; but it was also
true that the metropolis bore a much lager share of taxa-
tion than any of er part or district of the country. In
I teal and direct taxes it paid as much as three mil
lions ; and Mr. Marsh Al, who published some tables
under the authority of this House, had in a ncte at
the foot of one of them, observed upon the evrandinary
irregularity which govern. d the imposition of those taxes:
It appeared that the cite of Westminster alone, with a
population of only 200,000, was assessed to the house
and window taxes to a greater amount than Scotland
with a population of 2,500,000, and it could net be
denied that the property in Scotland was ten times greater
than that in Westminster. That partiality towards the
aristocracy of that city, and towards the property of
Scotland, could not by p ssireiliry be carried no without
gross perjury, and be thought, although the Government
did not deny that there was great inequality ; they were
liable to severe reprobation for allowing such a course to
exist. With regard to the Hon. and Learned Member
opposite (Dr. Lushington), it was to be regretted that
h e vote and conduct were misrepresented, for be (CA. E.)
eelieved that very few members of the House had rendered
a more noble and generous ask,stance to obtain reform.—
(Cheers.) But his appreensions with regard to a
defalcation in the revenue were certainly fallacious.
It was well known that this Government could go into
the market at any time and raise ten or twelve millions
without any d,fficulty, so that any trifling defalcation
could be easily remedied without producing any want of
confidence by Foreign States. He should always regret
to see any serious or permanent defalcation in the
revenue so as to produce that want of confidence, and
be appealed to the House if he had not always so ex
pressed himself.—(Heari hear.) As to the expense of the
troops in the West Indies, he thought the force kept
up there and in Ireland much too lavers. The inhabitents
of Jamaica ought to provide a sufficiently armed mili-
tary for their own protection ; and, as to Ireland,
he should like to know how the Government could justify
their conduct in maintaining a larger military force there
than their predecessors did under a very different line of
policy. There was another paint which I e roust not lose
eight of ; the metropolis was positively declining in point
of its resources.—(Hear.) The altered system of living
aiming the aristocracy was more economical, and the es-
t ,blishment of Clubs at the west end of the town,
(institutions which by the way he approved of) had
tended much to lessen the expenditure of the aristocracy,
and therefore to diminish the resources of tradesmen and
shopkeepers.—(Hear.) With respect to the symptoms of
opp, sition to the payment of these taxes, which had ma-
nifested itself rather strongly, he believed that, in many
cases, it arose from utter inability to pay, and not from
a spirit of opposition to the Government itself.—(Hear,
hear.) Very severe consequences arose to those per.ons
who were compelled to get together small sums of money
at a given period ; and when the tax gatherer did levy,
the consequences were literally ruinous; for the sum of
5/., for instance, the loss to the family was in general not
less than 201 —(Hear.)
Mr. SINCLAIR did not rise for the purpose of oppose
ing the petition, but to correct some statements made by
the Hon. Member who had just sat down. He had st tted
that certain perjuries were committed in Scotland in the
assessment of these taxes.

n-I EVANS—Not in Scotland alone.—(A lough.)
Mr. SINCLAIR—WeII ; while he felt that these taxes
ought to be taken off, and concurred in the prayer of the
petition, he wished to remind the Hon. Member for West-
minster, and the House, that another c iuse of the decline
of business in the metropolis was the absence of the aris.
tocracy, who went abroad to support foreign artisans and
manufacturers by the very resources which they drew from
this country. He was in the habit of conversing with
the st opkeepers of this metropolis, and inquiring into the
sta' eof trade. Their constant language was that it was
very bad—they con d hardly make two ends meet, being
so much oppressed by the burdens of public and local tax-
ation, and having no business. They did not find toreign
noblemen come from Germany, France, or Italy, to
spend their money in London, and to encourage British
.hopkeepers and manufacturers, hut our great people were
corcontly in Rome, P iris, and other Continental citie.,
spending the money drawn from the Exchequer at home,
by the taxation of those who derive no advantage at all
therefrom. This was a very serious complaint, and the
great source of disc intent.—( Hear.)

Air. HAWES had been requested to support the pe-
tition, and referred to a rumoured intention of Govern-
ment to establish malt houses throughout the country,
which would greatly affect,some distracts, and particularly
and especially the Tower Hamlets. He would support the
repeal of these taxes.

111r.FORSTER also supported the pPtition,and said the
repeal of these taxes would enable the manufacturing
districts to enjoy more light, and give additional 'etnploy
ment to those who were engaged in the manufacture of
glass, and the construction of windows.
Mr. RUTHVEN considered that the present subject
was one of the most important brought into con•

sideration during the session. He would consent to abolish
a tax that came so heavily on the industrious and poorer
portion as the one alluded to did. With regard to the
substitute for this source of income to the Revenue,
he supposed that a property tax was the dernier resort
to the Government, but he (Mr. Ru'hven) could not
vote for a property-tax with an income-tax at the same
time. If the reduction were to be made in any such
fertile source of revenue as the present tax, the best
mode of meeting the deficiency would he by a corres-
ponding reduction of great establishments. The public faith
should be supported ; and the Exchequer stood now in the
situation of a hank, which most either enter into a compo-
sition, or stiff r bankruptcy. The great expenses
which at present 'oppressed the country, should
be diminished—an equitab'e arrangement to the
public debt should be made, if possible, and in the now
precarious state of the financial department, he did not
see how it was to he done, unless by lowering the rate of
interest paid on it. Such would be, perhaps, the safest
mode of adjusting the desirable compromise. He (Mr.
R.) was not anxious for a reduction of military establish-
ments in Ireland, as long as the soldiers there conducted
themselves properly, and as long as money was diffused
through the country by the me hium of such establish-
ments. Mr. R. urged the reduction of the establishments
and the abolition of the taxes, which weighed, as they
did, so heavily on the people.
Lord ALVANLEY presented a petition in favour of
Church Reform, but the Nohle Lord spoke so low, we
could not hear from what place.
Mr. JOHNSTONE supported it, and alluded to the
proper regulation of Church patronage in Scotland. At
present a chapel was built, and an endowment obtained by
the parishioners ; but, then, some one who had patronage,
said " I will appoint the clergyman." This was most unjust
and most offensive to the parish, and no doubt prevented
the erection of many chapels of ease in Scotland.
Mr. SINCLAIR presented a petition of a similar kind.
Sir CHARLES BURRELL presented a petition from
Lamb,' burst, in the county of Sussex, praying that the
Act of Geo. IV., called the Labourers' Act, should be
continued. The introduction of this Act he said hod been
productive of the greatest possible advantages; the farmers
were entirely satisfied with it, whilst the population was
fully employed, and there was no dissension in the parish.
The Poor Law Commissioners had been in communica
tion with the parish, and he believed that all
the answers received from the parish expressed the
most entire satisfaction with the working of this Act.
He trusted that the Act, which was admitted on all hands
to be productive of such advantages, would be suffered to
continue.

There being no other petitions to present, the Speaker
left the Chair at Ten minutes after Two o'clock.

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