The Sun.
London, England, 1851-07-19 00:00:00

THE SUN,

Alderney, whereby this coantry extended its outworks
to within five or ten miles of the coast of France.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the
object of those works was not aggressive, but to protect
our own shipping in the Channel, which during the late
war had suffered greatly from privateers coming out of
St. Melo and other neighbouring parts.
Mr. M. GIBSON observed that Alderney was a most
out of the way station to send protectieg ships of war
to. All our trading vessels worked up channel close to
the English shore, and Spitbead would be a far better
station for the purpose. Besides, the strong tide and
surrounding rocks at Alderney would make it, instead
of a harbour of protection, a harbour of destruction for
their war ships.
Sir F. T. BARING attached all due weight to the
opinion of the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Gibson) as
a military and naval officer. But there were military
and naval engineering views on the subject quite op-
posed to the Right Hon. Gentleman, amongst them those
of the Duke of Wellington, which had greeter influ-
ence with him. Those views were in favour of Alderney
as an import int station, and it certainly was not a bad
position from which they could watch the motions of
the enemy.
Mr. COBDEN said he looked upon the works at Al-
derney and Guernsey as aggressive proceedings, for
they were attempts to erect fortifications in the imme-
diate vicinity of the coast of our great neighbour. He
thought it would be better to suspend the operations in
Alderney and Guernsey, and rather to sacrifice the
amount that had been already laid out there than to go
on with the expenditure. He should move that the vote
be reduced by a sum of 60,0001.
After a few words from Mr. WILLIAMS,
The Committee divided, and the numbers were—
For Mr. Cobden's amendment... ... 21
Against it ••• ••• ••• •.. 57
Majority against the amendment —36
The vote was then agreed to.
THE SLAVE TRADE.
A vote of 50,0001. for civil contingencies having been
proposed,
Mr. HUTT said that as that vote bad some connec-
tion with the efforts made for the suppression of the slave
trade, he wished to take that opportunity of submitting
to the Committee a few observations in reply to the
statement made the other evening upon that subject by
the Noble Lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs. He
believed that statement was incomplete, and calculated to
mislead the House and the public. He admitted that
the slave trade was at present at a lower point than at
any period in the present century; but be attributed
that gratifying result, not to the exertions of our
squadron on the African coast, but to the honest and
zealous efforts of the Brazilian Government for the
suppression of that trade. It should be remembered
that during the years 1847, 1848, 1849, and the begin-
ning of 1850 the slave trade had been more actively car-
ried on than ever; and as the squadron had then been
in full operation it was manifest that their exertions
were not sufficient to account for the recent check
to that nefarious traffic. The fact was that the
Brazilian Government were at present making very
unexpected and very honourable efforts in that direction;
but he feared that the favourable circumstances which
enabled them to carry on those efforts might not be of
long continuance. A dreadful pestilence had been in
troduced during the last summer along the whole coast

of Brazil in con—sequence of the introduction of slaves;
and the result of that devastating evil had been that
many of the persons who had been engaged in the trad©
had totally abandoned it. He would remind the Noble
Lord that the price of slaves was at present 100 per
cent. lower in Brazil than it had been in the year 1845;
and the natural consequences of an increase in the price
of slaves was to giro a fresh impulse to the slave trade.
There was no ground for believing that they were ap-
proaching the extinction of that trade, and it had not
been by means of the squadron that the late gratifying
diminution of the traffic had been effected. lie wished
to say one word as to the expense of the squadron which
was employed in the suppression of the trade. The
Bishop of Oxford had estimated that expense at 160,0001.
a year, and the Edinburgh Review had estimated it at
260,0001., but the Committee which had inquired most
carefully into the subject hadasccrtained that that charge
could not amount to less than between 600,0001, and
700,000/. a year.
Lord PALMERSTON said he was sorry that it had
so happened the other evening that ho had felt called
upon to make his statement upon that subject in the ab-
sence of his Honourable Friend. He should observe,

that his Honourable Friend had completely confirmed
the statement put forward by him (Lord Palmerston)
the other evening, that a great diminution had of late
taken place in the slave trade. But he (Lord Palmers-
ton) had never stated, and neither did he mean to state,
that he relied solely on the operations of the squadron
on tho coast of Africa for accomplishing the destruction
of that nefarious traffic. He had merely said that the
employment of the squadron was an essential element in
the accomplishment of that object.—(Hear, hear.) He
was quite ready to do justice to the very proper and
honourable course taken by the Brazilian Government
in that matter. Various causes, both external and inter-
nal, had led to that course. There could be no doubt
but that a great change had been produced in public
opinion in Brazil upon the subject. But he believed that
the real people of Brazil had always been less favour-
able then had been supposed to the traffic. The party
that supported and practised the slave trade in that
country consisted chiefly of foreigners, of Portuguese, and
of the inhabitants of other distant countries, while the
natives of Brazil had always felt that the slave trade
was not only eminently disgraceful, but was a positive
' curse to the nation. He should tell his Hon. Friend that
the two parties in Brazil—the party which practised and
patronised the slave trade, and that which wished to see
it cease, had looked with the most anxious feelings to
the proceedings of the Committee of that House which
had inquired into the question of the retention of the
British squadron on the coast of Africa, and to the de-
cision to which the House might come upon the subject.
All that was corrupt and base in Brazil clung to the
view taken of that question by his Hon. Friend, while
all that was honourable and patriotic in that country
were desirous that her Majesty's Government should
persevere in the course which his Hon. Friend had con-
demned.—(Hear, hear.) His Hon. Friend had been very
near doing great mischief. A distinguished philosopher
had said that half of the evils of mankind arose from the
vices of men, and that the other half arose from their
erroneous opinions; and he (Lord Palmerston) should
tell his Hon. Friend that although he gave him credit
for the sincerity of his opinions upon that subject, and
although he believed that his Hon. Friend would be
among the first to shudder at the calamities and atrocities
to which the adoption of his opinions would have led—
he should tell his Hon. Friend that these opinions
would, if they had prevailed, have opened the flood-gates
of iniquity ou the world—(Bear, hear)—.that they would
have deluged Africa and America with misery and with
crime, and would have caused results which he was sure
that his Hon. Friend, when he came calmly to consider
them, would never have forgiven himself for having
even unintentionally been instrumental in producing.—
(Hear, hear.) He agreed with his Hon. Friend that
they should not be too confident that the means of
suppressing that trade which at present existed would •
continue. His Honourable Friend had made one
mistake, to which he (Lord Palmerston) should direct
his attention. His Honourable Friend had said that
the price of slaves had of late fallen 100 per cent.; but
he could inform his Hon. Friend, on the best authority,
that the tact was that the price of slaves in Brazil had
risen 100 per cent. in the commencement of the present
year, as compared with the price a short time previously.
His Hon. Friend was also mistaken in supposing that the
importation of slaves into Brazil had been very consider-
able in the year 1850. The fact was, that in that year
the number of slaves imported into that country had only
reached half the number of those imported in the pre-
ceding year.
Mr. HUTT said he had only spoken of the beginning
of the year 1850.
Lord PALMERSTON continued—Daring the whole
of the last year the importation had considerably di-
minished. But the great diminution had taken place in
the present year when, the co-operation of the Brazilian
Government for the suppression cf the slave trade had
come into full play. He agreed with his Hon. Friend,
that however great might be their success at present, it
was not complete, and that they could not rely on its
being Permanent; so that they should continuo to cm-
ploy6u ct tbheonseefi tic
ae
la
res
swa
lht
si ha
and
da d
should already a
ohne et
inn
uaet t etnod
givee
that Brazilian party which wished to get rid of the
supwpohritchwhtihcoh hadll enabledat
present theeome
gtros
taut:
t atgeast•
on
lstaalatienvdeadtn
rvaade h
themselves. And then lila' ahoped that in the course
of no very distant period
they might rejoice at that
constancy, that perseverance, that generous determina-
tion of the British nation, by which, and not by the con-
duct of this or that Government, which had only been
the organ of the national feelings upon that question—
by which this country would have tnhaesoantis as
well as
nosf
having accomplished a work which, if nations
individuals reaped the benefit or reaped the punishment
of their good or cf their bad actions, would, ho trusted,
tell to the advantage of the British peapie,_(Cheers.)
Mr. GIBSON had always considered the interference
of the squadron on the coast of Africa, while unable to
prevent the slave trade, was calculated to increase the
horrors of the middle passage. The Noble Lord had
admitted that the slave trade increased during the years
1847-48-49, and that it was only when the Brazilian
Government was acted upon by public opinion that the
change had taken place. He hed always contended that
there was only one power which could put down the
slave trade in Brazil, and that was the formation of: a
public opinion in Brazil. It was public option which
had ab dished the slave trade and slavery in the British
dominions; but it took 30 years to convince even the
bishops that the slave trade was a great crime and a sin.
They could not, therefore, expect a country like Brazil
all at once to jump to the same conclusion. But he
wished to ask the Noble Lord whether the English Go-
v( rnuient was prepared to act upon the promise of Lord
Aberdeen, who introduced the Act called the Brazilian
Act, which authorised British cruisers to deal with Bra-
zthan ships according to the laws laid down by Eng-
land in reference to the slave trade, and who said he I
would repeal that Act as soon as the Brazilian Govern-
ment should enable him to do do. He wished the Noble
Lord to state whether he thought the time was now
come for acting upon that promise?
Lord PALMERSTON—I do not consider that the
time has come.
Mr. CARDWELL said the Right Hon. Gentleman
was inconsistent with himself in wishing the abolition of
the slave trade, and asking for the withdrawal of the
combined squadron. The Right Hoe. Gentleman ad- •
mined that in 1850 nothing could be more prosperous
than the Brazilian slave trade; but at that time there
lay on the table a report, with a majority of one recom-
mending the cessation of the blockade. The Right Hon.
Gentleman boasted that public opinion hi Brazil had
esustethe present movement; but the Brezilian Minister
.has):aeitnitted that it was impossible to carry on the slave
trade in opposition to the expressed determination of