The Sun.
London, England, 1833-03-05 00:00:00

that I am a gentleman ; and that my views and calcula-
tions are proportionably obsolete.
Gentlemen, I have said so much on one or two sub.
fects, that I will not detain you by discussing others. To
conclude, then :—I do not wish to speak or think despond-
ingly; and therefore I will not say that the present jury
system is our last position, stronghold, and retreat.
But I will say that our defences are not so numerous, or
our establishments so unassailed, that we should forsake
and raze a bulwark, which is amongst the strongest that
we have left. I hope the Constitution has not, like myself,
" fallen into the sear, the yellow leaf ;"—at least that it
still will find itself at once hale, and surrounded
" By honour, love, obedience, troops of friends ;"
and that it and I may meet you here again;--your fields
not echoing the flagitious nonsense of mob-suited haran-
gues, or the shots and screams and burnings, which their
mischief-making violence has produced;—your houses
without barricades; your pockets without pistols; your
frenzied peasants once more sane; yourselves assembled
under, in substance, that well-working jury system which
has now brought you here; and presenting me—not with
indictments or convictions, but with acquittals, congratu-
lations, and white gloves.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF LORDS, MARCII 4.

On the LORD CHANCELLOR taking his seat, at five
o'clock,

Several Gentlemen of the House of Commons brought
up a Road Bill.

Lord KING presented a petition from Scawby, in Lin.
colnshire praying for the total and speedy abolition of
slavery; also a petition from Wigmore, in Somersetehire,
to the same effect.

Lord AMHERST presented a petition from the rate-
payers of Sr. George's, Hanover-square, complaining of
the assessment for the metropolitan police, and also a pe-
tition from the same persons, complaining of the mode in
which the poor rates are levied in England.
The Bishop of BRISTOL presented a petition,
signed by upwards of 14,000 inhabitants of the city of
Bristol, praying for the better observance of the Sabbath.
He hoped that his Majesty's Ministers would take the
case into their serious consideration.
Lord WYNFORD said that he joined in the wish
of the Right Rev. Prelate, and hoped also that his
Majesty would make some alterations in the present Beer
Act, which had been the cause of a great many evils.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE said, that case was
now under consideration.

The Esrl of ROSEBERY presented a petition
from a parish in Linlithgow, to the like effect. He
also held in his hand a petition to which he would call
the attention of the House, as it related to Church pa-
tronage in Scotland. It prayed that the patronage might
be taken out of the hands of the Crown and the
other holders, and transferred to the congregation at
large. It was from the p Irish of Urquhart, in
Ross. The petitioners had requested him to present
it, stating that they had confidence in him from the
general line of his conduct, at which he felt great pride, be-
cause he was not at all connected either with that county cr
any of the petitioners. Strong doubts existed in his mind
as to whether the advantages which the petitioners promised
to themselves would be realized, and whether they wo tld
not be attended with some evils. He was sure that when
the subject came before Parliament it would meet with
the c .1m attention of all persons, on account of the deep
interest of all the people of Scotland.

The Bishop of GLOUCESTER presented a petition
from a parish in York,hire, praying for the better ob-
servance of the Sabbath.

The Bishop of LONDON presented petitions from a
place in Yorkshire, St. Alban's, and other places, pray-
ing IT legislative enactments, for the better observance of

.he Sabbath.

Earl CLONCURRY presented a petition from the
parish of Carrington Cross (we believe), county Cork,
which the Noble Earl stated had three prayers. Mist, it
prayed that no measures of coercion might be passed in
respect to Ireland ; 2d, it prayed for the abolition of
tithes ; and, Sd, it prayed for a provision for the des-
titute, the infirm, and the aged.—(Hear, hear, hear.)
The Noble Earl also presented a petition from a
parish in the King's county to the same effect. Also two
from parishes in Limerick against tithes.

Th-e Bishop of BATH and WELLS presented a petition
from a parish in the county of Somerset, praying for
a legislative enactment to prevent the increasing demorali-
zation of the poor.

The Marq-uis of LANSDOWNE presented a petition
from a place, the name of which we could not hear, pray-
ing for the abolition of negro slavery.
Earl CAWDOR presented a petition from Nairn against
slavery.

Lord WHARNCLIFFE presented a petition from the
Master Cutler and other inhabitants of Sheffield, praying
for the letter observance of the Sabbath.

Earl GREY presented petitions, praying for the abo-
lition of negro slavery, from Newcastle-upon-Tyne,
Doncaster and Morpeth ; from the merchants of Lynn,
praying for an alteration in the stamp duties; and Irons
the inhabitants of Clifton, in Cheshire, praying that they
might participate in the rights of the corporation.
The Earl of RODEN presented petitions, praying for
the better observance of the Sabbath, from the Presbytery
of Aberdeen, Inverleithy, in the county of Iladdington ;
from Marlow, county of Cork ; from Kirkintulloch ; and
from Tring, in Somersetshire ; and against slavery
from Inniskillen, the Presbytery of Newcastle-on-Tyne,
in connection with the Church of Scotland, and from
Marlow.

Some private Bills were then read a second time, and
;he House adjourned.

ROUSE OF COMMONS, MARCH 4.

At five o'clock the SPEAKER entered the House and
took the chair.
A message from the Lords was brought up by two Mas-
ters in Chancery, requesting the House to permit Dominick
Brown, Esq., a Member of the House, to be examined be-
fore the Lords' Committee of Privileges, on the right of
Viscount Dillon claiming to vote for the representative
Peers of Ireland.
CARMARTHEN ELECTION.

Mr. RICE TREVOR rose to move the order of the
day for taking into consideration the. petition of Mr.
John Williams in respect of this matter. The petition
against the election was presented on the 20th of last month
against the Member for the borough of Carmarthen, and this
petition stated that one of the gentlemen who should enter

into the necessary recognizances for the purpose of
carrying on the petition, had to attend the assizes which
commenced at Carmarthen on Saturday last.—( Hear,
hear.) That gentleman was exceedingly desirous
of attending as an important witness at a trial to be
brought on at the Brecon assizes. To-morrow was the
last day for entering into recognizances, and he had been
subpmnsed on Saturday. Not being able both to attend
his duty in that House, which was paramount, and
to attend as a witness in a court in the country,
lie made this application to the House, that it should
extend the time for entering into recognizances for 14
days. The petitioner also added, that if the Howe should
not grant that extension, it would permit another name
to be substituted for his, in order that the petition
might be proceeded with. He (Mr. Rice Trevor) would
not detain the House with any prolonged statement on the
case, but would leave it to the House, expressing a hope
that they would grant the prayer of the petition.
An Pox. MEMBER moved as an amendment that the
evidence on the Fetition be now gone into, according to the
provisions of the Act 9th Geo. IV. The petition' was
altogether irrevelant.

The SPEAKER said there was nothing more reason-
able than the prayer of the petition. No doubt the op-
posing parties should be extremely watchful, and pro-
bably they might be justified in being somewhat suspicious
when an application was made for a change in the name
of the security. In the present instance, however, the
petitioner only applied when he knew that his
attendance in that House would be a justi-
fication for his absence at the assizes, that
they might extend the time for his entering into the
recognizances. The circumstances did not affect the sit-

ting Member. The petition was not coupled with any
application that the day for taking the petition into con-
sideration should be postponed.
Lord ALTHORP said the petition did not at all affect
the sitting Member. The question was, whether the
ends of justice should be defeated by not granting
the prayer of this petition. He (Lord Althorp) was
of opinion that the House would act harshly
by this gentleman, if it did not permit him to go down to
the assizes. It did not affect either party to the petition
in the slightest degree.
The question was then put by the SPEAKER, and the time
was extended, according to the prayer of the petition.
Mr. WILKS postponed his motions for a Select Com-
mittee as to Parochial Registrations, from March sth to
March 21st, for leave to bring in a Bill to exempt places
of religious worship From poor rates, from March 12th
to March 28th, and for triennial Parliaments from March
21st to May 14th.
Lord EBRINGTON moved for a return of the names
of the Governors and Deputy, or Lieutenant-Governors,
of his Majesty's garrisons at home and abroad, with the
date of each appohatment.--Ordered.

On the motion of Mr. C. ROSS, leave of absence

was given to Mr. Howard during the continuance of the
Northern Circuit.
IRISH DISTURBANCE SUPPRESSION BILL.
On the motion that the Order of the Day for resuming
the adjourned debate on this Bill be made,
Lord HOWICK wished, before the Order of the Day
was read, as the Hon. Member for Bridport (Mr.
J. Romilly) was present, to call the attention of
that Hon. Member to a misunderstanding—(Hear)--
which bad gone abroad respecting what he had stated on a
former evening. That Hon. Member, when quoting
from the late Sir Samuel Romilly, said, that in 1806 or
1807, the then Government proposed to bring into Par.
liament the Insurrection Act for the purpose of putting
down disturbances in Ireland, which they had not com-
municated to either of their law officers, the Attorney or
Solicitor-General, and that the Honourahie Member said
one reason why he would support the present Bill was,
that two Members of that Government were now in
office. He (Lord Howick) believed that that was a
misunderstanding of what had fallen from the Hon.
Member; but it was right, nevertheless, that the
House should know what were the circumstances that
had been alluded to. A Bill certainly was in the con-
templation of the Government of that day, for the
purpose of suppressing the disturbances in Ireland ; it was
drawn up and submitted to Mr. Grattan, by whom it was
approved of; it was then sent to this country, a few days
before the then Administration broke up ; it was received
by the Secretary of State for the Home Department, and
sent by him to the other members of the Government.
It was a fact that the discussions which led to the break.
ing up of that Government were then taking place.
It so happened that his father, who was the leader of the Go-
vernment in that House, had received the draft of the Bill,
but when the Government was broken up, he had not had
time to examine it. It was fit that these circumstances should
he stated, in order that it might be seen that the Bill had
been submitted to the Cabinet of that day, but that it was
not in that state that it could be laid before the law officers
of the Crown. He trusted the House would pardon him
for making the statement he had done, as he had thought
it right to set the difficulty at rest.
Mr. JOHN ROMILLY could assure the House and
the Noble Lord, that he had not the slightest notion or
intention of raising the observations which had
fallen from the Noble Lord. He had never in-
tended to cist any thing resembling an imputation on the
Members of 1806. When he made the statement, he felt
as strongly as he did at that time that the passage
conveyed no imputation whatever; nay, more, he felt
assured he should be acting contrary to the feelings of the
author of the passage had he meant to convey any impu-
tation. If any such expression had fallen from him, it
was quite different from what he had intended—quite con-
trary to the feelings be then, and now, had towards his
Majesty's Government.
The Order of the Day was then read, and
Dr. BALDWIN rose to address the House. The
explanation which the Honourable Member, who
bad just sat down, had made to the Noble Lord, he
trusted, would satisfy Lim ; hut to the Irish
Members it was only a satisfaction in this respect,
that so eminent a man as Sir Samuel Romilly con-
demned the introduction of the Insurrection Act. He
came into this House with feelings of the greatest re-
spect and regard for the Noble Lord at the head of the
Treasury, as also the Noble Lord (Althorp); and he was
under the impression that he should not be opposed
to the Administration, except on the question
of repeal. He knew from a speech he had himself
heard of the Noble Lord's (Althorp), that he was opposed
to the repeal of the Legislative Union, but in general be
thought his views so enlightened, his principles so pure,
his patriotism so unquestionable, his tone of human ity and
desire for improving the condition of the human race,
in every part of the world, so warm, that he (Dr. Bald-
win), had no doubt he should be able to support the Ad-
ministration to which he belonged in all things except
the repeal of the Union. He could not say that the
Noble Lord had not still his respect and admiration, but
he thought the Bill now before them so contrary to
the rights of main—he did not mean to use revolu-
tionary language, and hoped that speaking of the
rights of man was not contrary to the usages of
Parliament ; he thought this Bill so contrary to the
spirit of the Constitution and laws of England that
he could give his confidence to no Administration nor
any individual who supported it. He believed the Noble
Lord to have the kindest disposition and most
elevated principle', but by some fatality or error of judg-
ment, or from that judgment having been misled by
others, he had been induced to lend the sanction
of his much respected name to inflict on his country
a wound which would never heal, but which
would excite feelings which no conciliatory measures here.
after to he introduced, would ever remove.—(Hear,
hear, hear.) It was truly lamentable to see men like
the Members of the present Administration, who had
all their lives professed themselves the friends of liberty,
bring in a Bill to establish military tribunals upon the
models of those of France. If they had no feeling for
the dignity and rights of Irishmen, why did they no

consider the injury they would inflict on the British
Constitution by a measure of this kind? Had they
considered what the effects of this measure would be, not
upon the victims brought before them, but upon the of-
faits of the army, who are to compose those tribunals?—
(Hear, hear.) Perhaps they were aware that the
officers, having become habituated as Judges in
Ireland, would be ready if required to act as judges in
England. Did the Noble Lord opposite recollect the
establishment of military tribunals in England, which
once before produced the downfal of the Constitution ?
—(Hear, hear, hear.) If the Noble Lord would consider
the subject in that light, and if he still could bring his
enlightened mind to the conviction and resolution
of inflicting on Ireland these military tribunals, he
was not indeed the Noble Lord whom he bad always
considered him to be.—(Cheers.) He was not the high
minded, patriotic, incorruptible-minded individual whom
he had always taken him to be—(Hear, hear, hear)
—and he could not help expressing a hope that
that Noble Lord would reconsider the step he had
adopted, and yet abstain not only from injuring his (Dr.
B.'s) countrymen, but from dishonouring nis own name.
He bad yet to be convinced that the Noble Lord would
with 11:s own hand stain his fair character.—(Hear.) The
condition of Ireland had been referred to by gentlemen
on the other side of the House, and also by a Right Hon.
Baronet on this side, as a justification of the measure.
He (Dr. B.) would not say that their arguments wete
altogether frivolous, but he would say that whatever
they were, they had failed to make out the case
they proposed—(Hear, hear)—they bad not c invinjed
him that the ordinary law tribunals were insufficient for
the exigencies of the case.—(Hear, hear.) They had not

convinced him that the authorities had made a proper use
of those tribunals.—(Hear.) They had not satisfied him
that they had sent forth Commissioners in proper time,
to the disturbed places, nor had they convinced him that
if they had done so, those places would have continued to
be disturbed.—(Cheers.) He asserted that it was owing to
the Government in Ireland, in not sending down the
regular and necessary commissions—(Hear, hear, hear)
—that the evils now sought to be remedied had gone
on. Would the Noble Lord opposite then say
that his (Dr. B.'s) countrymen should be punished for
the negligence of Ministers in Ireland ?—(Cheers.) If it
be competent for his Majesty's Government to make such
laws, why not make them for the whole kingdom? Or,
if for a part of the kingdom, why not confine it to the dis-
turbed parts of that kingdom? Was it not monstrous injustice,
that the whole of Ireland should be put under the operation
of courtsmartial, and not the whole of the empire ?
(Hear, hear.) Can he justify such flagrant injustice and
inconsistency ?—(Hear, hear.) He might say that the
state of society in Ireland, and the feelings of the
peasantry would justify him, but has the Noble Loud
(Althorp) looked about hint in England? When he
(Dr. Baldwin) came into this country not long ago, and
the Reform Bill, the measure of Ministers, was yet before the
public,he saw fires,and disturhance,and confusion throughout
the country more than could be proved to be existing now
in Ireland.—(Hear, hear.) Englishmen at that time
would have shuddered at the idea of being coerced by
such measures as were preparing for Ireland.—(Loud
cheers.) Ireland is called the principal part of
the British empire—but his Majesty's Ministers treated it
as a conquered province.—(Cheers.) Why send a regular
commission of judges to Bristol, or why not send a com-
mission of judges to Ireland ? Or if it were necessary
to send a military commission to Ireland, why not
have sent a military commission to Bristol ?—(Cheers.)
Again, be would ask, why do not Ministers try the
experiment of Commission of Judges to Ireland ? The Right
Hon, Baronet who now usually sits on the same side of the
House with himself (Dr. B.) delivered on Friday a speech
Of the most persuasive and brilliant description.—(Cheers.)
In that speech he attempted to justify the melancholy
calamity that was about to befal Ireland. In this he had
failed ; but he (Dr. B.) feared that he had not failed
in entrapping the Noble Lord and his colleagues
into a more determined pursuit of their
mistimed measure. The Right Hon. Baronet spoke of
the superabundant population of Ireland—their want of
employment, and the absence of their landowners, and
yet he confessed that the present measure was no remedy
for these evils. He said, "Carry this measure, my Lord,"
but did he tell the Noble Lord what would be the conse-
quence of his carrying the measure ?._(Cheers.) No :

triumphantly and treacherously would he assist Minister
in effecting that which must ruin their political
character, and might end in their disgrace.--( Hear. )
The Right Hon. Baronet opposite, be he ever so clever,
be he ever so eloquent—and clever and eloquent he
admitted he was—still he never was the friend of liberty,
he never advocated the cause of liberty, except when he
could not help granting Catholic emancipation. That was
the only act of liberality the Right Hon. Baronet
had ever been guilty of. He (Dr. Baldwin) had no doubt
in his own mind that the progress of liberty in Europe
would be steady, consistent, and irresistible, the human
mind would become more and more enlightened, and that
the principles of freedom would be too deeply rooted to be
obliterated by Government. Would the Noble Lord opposite
set himself up against those principles of liberty which
now pervaded the British empire, and insist in passing so
hated a measure as that now before the House ? He had
the highest esteem for that Noble Lord, but if he carried
that measure, he would establish such a state of things
that would be too dreadful to contemplate. The Right
Hon. Baronet had spoken of the superabundant population
of Ireland, and had deprecated the associations in that
country, whose endeavours were exerted to alleviate tl.e
distresses of that superabundant population. He asked
the Noble Lord if he did not know that the population
in agricultural districts according to the laws of nature,
always increased beyond the rate that was' neces-
sary for agricultural purposes. There was always an increase
beyond the wants of agriculture. What, then, were
they to do with this superabundant population ? They
could not be employed in manufactories, nor in foreign
commerce. The Noble Lord would put down the associa-
tions. He asked the Noble Lord whether he had considered
what the real objects were of those associa-
tions in Dublin, in Cork, and in Belfast? The
Noble Lord took it for granted that that object
was political agitation, and the dismemberment of the
empire. He would tell the Noble Lord' what their
real objects were. Their real objects were, to ob-
tain employment fur the superabundant popula-
tion, to encourage their industry, supply them with
subsistence, and make them useful, intelligent, and
orderly supporters of his Majesty's throne and the
rights of the commuuity at large.—(Hear, hear, hear.)
He was not ashamed of belonging to one of these Associa-
tions. He was proud of being one of the Trades' Political
Union of Cork, and he attributed the honour of his sitting
in that House to the circumstance that he had pleaded,
however feebly, the cause of his country amongst
that excellent body of men. Were these associa-
tions, then, to he put down by this Bill ? He knew
their objects and their rules. When cholera raged in
Cork, and when, having applied to Government for
assistance, they were told that none could be
given unless abundant security were provided for
the repayment of the advance with interest, their only re-
sort was to associate together, and pledge themselves not
to consume any article but those of Cork artisans, which
were equ tl in excellence and equal in cheapness with
those of any other country in the world.—(Hear.)
He would ask the Noble Lords on the opposite side of
the House, the descendants of the patriots of England,
who had fought, and bled, and died for the freedom of
their country, whether they could conscientiously sanction
such a Bill as this? He could not believe that they would.
He firmly and conscientiously believed, that those Noble
Lords would resign their places into the hands of the
heads of the Government, sooner than be any party to a
measure that would inflict such misery upon Ireland.
He might be wrong, but he did not believe that the two
Noble Lords opposite would willingly give their sanction
to the Bill. The landlords of the poor Irish turned
their tenantries beggars upon the world. The conse-
quence was that they became robbers, and committed the
most flagrant of acts. But was it for this that the
whole of the country was to be inflicted with such a ma-
lady ? Was it for this that the liberty of men were to be
invaded, and the justice of the country turned upside down ?
In England there was a right which was acted upon, the
right of a tenant to bold his land ; in Ireland there was no
such light, at least it was not acted upon. The poor
tenants were placed in the power of agents ; they had
no immediate intercourse with the landlord—all their
dealings took place through the medium of an agent, who
had no feelings in common with them—whose only object
_was to make as much money as he could. That was the
cause of so many poor people in Ireland being turned
out to starve and die in the ditches. Then, as to the
necessity of those coercive measures—he would ask, had
there been no insurrections among the manufacturing
population of England ? Had there been no fire raise's
among the agricultural population ? And when such things
were passing, had any Government, even the present Go-
vernment, dared to come down to that House and propose
that the people of England should be placed under the
tender protection of the military ?--(hear, bear, hear.)
Then why should Ireland be treated differently?
He would only say that if this Bill were passed, it was
what he did not expect to have seen introduced,
and enforced by a Government calling itself a liberal one.
The British Constitution was confined to Britain, for this
Bill, and Bills like it, formed the Constitution of Ireland.
—(Heir.) What, however, had been the consequence of the
continual acts of co, mien passed with regard to Ireland ?
The first Lord of the Treasury stated in another place that
the Act of the 12th Geo. 111., embodied all others previ
ously passed for the coercion of Ireland ; but, like its pre..
decessors, it failed in producing any effect. Was it to be
expected, that the present measure would make the
people of Ireland more attached to England ?—(Hear)--
or more loyal or more peaceable, or when the day of trial
came, induce her to lend her aid to this country ?
That trial might not be so far off as some Hon.
Gentlemen supposed.—(Hear, hear, hear.) If the
people of France were to rise against the treacherous
tyrant who now sat upon the throne of that country,
and establish a democracy for its Government,
what would be the situation of this country with
regard to Ireland? He would not say what he thought
might be the ultimate consequences, but this he was cer-
tain would be the immediate consequence of passing
the present measure, viz., the people of Ireland
would no longer place any confidence or trust in the Go-
vernment ;and although they might believe them to be

liberal and humane towards the people of England,
they would only expect them to be unjust and
inhuman towards the people of Ireland. An open
enemy was better than a treacherous friend. What
did the Hon. Gentleman on their side mean? Was

it their pleasure to play over again the battle of Bos.
worth field ? Were Stanley and Richard going to
take the field again, and Stanley going, as before, to be
treacherous to the cause?—(Hear, hear.) Until he (Dr.
B.) had seen the seal of' the King put to this Bill, he
never would believe that it would pass into a law. Were
Ministers to have no eye to this country ? Were they
sure that there would be no manufacturing distress again
in Manchester, Leeds, Birmingham, and many other great
towns? Were they to calculate upon continual peace in
those towns, and, in the meantime, to cut down the Irish
with the bayonet and the sword? He would tell his Ma-
jesty's Ministers that they did not understand the people
of Ireland. They s'emed to consider them a set of mere
Irish serfs, feeding upon potatoes, living like slaves, and
even worse than the inhabitants of the West India islands.
—(Hear, hear.) But if this was the opinion of gentlemen
on the other side of the House, it was an exceedingly in-
accurate judgment. In fact, the Noble Lord knew nothing
of the middle class of the people in Ireland. The people
were as well educated and as enlightened in many of the
large towns in Leland as were the inhabitants of towns of

a similar description in this country. They had their
Mechanics' Institutes there, they had their sources of in-
formation, and were determined to maintain their rights
and privileges in spite of the Noble Lord, and all his
efforts.—(Hear, hear.) As an Irishman, as a senator of
the United Kingdom, he was bound to caution Ministers.

As a senator, he had taken an oath to his present Majesty,
which oath. he hoped, he still should keep. But he would

tell the Noble Lord, if he should lessen the allegiance of
the people to the King, he would be a traitor to that King

. .
and his country.—(Cheers.) He (Dr. Baldwin) knew
what the people said and thought of this measure, and if
it passed, they would consider their allegiance not as a
matter of conscience, but as a matter of expediency.—
(Loud cheers.) Was it the wish of Ministers to

rive the people of Ireland into rebellion, to ruin this
country, and, above all, to ruin Ireland ?—(Cheers.)
He would ask the Noble Lord if he wished to put the no-

bility against the people ? Let him look at the combined
Russian, Prussian, and Austrian despots, who were ready
to ally themselves upon every occasion, when they had
the slightest prospect of success against the freedom of the
people. Would the Noble Lord endanger the cause of
liberty in Europe ? If that Noble Lord knew the state of
the people of Ircland, he would see that the present Bill
would make them more dangerous. The Noble Lord
might compel the people to pay to the amount of our
) The Irish people
stocks in tithe, but would be be able to compel them to
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prived them of the rights of men, and of British subjects.
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only crime was that of resisting oppressito
consider ,
lure.n-e were, would never vtehreycownseernettotoo sgueenheroaons. ito_apr,_
too i
upon the Noble Lord and his colleaguesio., ;101 tot
amount of the exports and imports of Ire d
put an end to them ; and, when such
towns"
,that!
representatives of the great manufacturing
metire,t !
land could never give their support to that . fide 00
would never consent to see the Irish peoPf! !11, eel
place between the countries. The przetrvitasnlteharcrnesfee:f.,.;
people
theycotowd obuel dma theni
Ie tcoeawsoertko cl
poral punishment they might be forced t cultivate.s
successell!,
soil. Such an experiment might have onceu be ,00Im
tune. The Noble Lord seemed to thinkl3rtabia7:th:ylee!..r
d its cloY --me;
tyranny might have done for a time; I' ' ;II
tell the Noble Lord that tyranny had had twwgo whichaul di tnb ee Y'latec sWtr allowance.cun ti 'di
pv‘!: ?II It j;tist :I'
enlightened—they began to have a prope:
to goo
own dignity, and of what was du _ they d
land.—(Cheers.) The Irish were now
sbeeir-glacref-thi
men—they were arrived at that point wheu t prod°,
under the whip for the benefit of those who e oreisted tr_ai
not work under the whip—when they
instrument. In mercy and humanity alone e.ndestrl' i
wisdom ; exten ling education and increasing ' .as WI
dhe ri, 1
the only sound palicy that could be pursue . e
_OOO , .
land. But as of course oppression was quite th
motive' o! 1
toyed
tlitor!
h all sroj 1
since it would take away from the Iris be .
allegiance towards the Sovereign of this counetryilobie berl. I
entreat, in the most supplicating manner, rh excite ir :
to withdraw this measure, which would OE4 "f 0
vengeance of the Irish, and call down the contemn .Qt
English nation. He would ask whether Minister'
reets,
to collect the interest of the national debt with dldallid ,
and by oppressing his poor countrymen ? If the Yr. 0b •
so, they would find themselves sadly in errs II!
been said that some of the Irish Members had a d °pelt
upon the banks. He could assure the Noble L/1 es Irli
that no such advice was necessary. Such 8......°.e:y.i- a
not simply floating in the minds of the Irish looenostai
resolved upon it; he knew them, and he was to be
that the result of the passing of this measure o°oooo
rush upon V e banks on their part.—(llear')„te, and,,bel,;
then would have again to suspend cash PaYme-f the et" '
that suspension would destroy tie confidence 0% +od JP
try, and oblige the people of England, Scotland
oubi sad
land to rise up against the Government. Ifervi,„.ool pen''
more call upon the proposers of the present 10/''obi tbel
sure to withdraw it. If they did not, how °°oo will°
expect that the prayers offered up by those wh° Trod bast;
and lawn sleeves for the King of the Realm e°„ eitythr
ceptable in the sight of Heaven ? But he wetn" it or
no prayer could be acceptable before God as long a 9 it
accompanied by the curse of the Irish ; and 0o
!vas Ors,
offering could be graciously received as long 0 It
He woe' -
nected with oppression, exac,ion, and tyranny' „foe 114
not go further into the details of the question we'll
House, and would conclude by thanking rheln.„virlts 11
dially for the polite attention with which his rew"
been listened to.—(Hear.) threadthreadLord CASTLEREAGH said, that with t.h .e ,pig
and menaces thrown out by the Hon. itielnber eat°
numerous than he recollected to have been &O; left it
any political question—he had nothing to do, ano regent
to the members of his Majesty's Government foe 08,
them. He would now come to the question be rof trj .
House, and he would confess that it was with 8,...(n.ad0ar,,,
with shame that he saw such measures about to Pc as r
towards his country. He called it his countrY:hipki/
thought it as much his as theirs, who seemed '9000;,
person that had heard the splendid speech deliver RAO
their especial country.—(Hear, hear.) Every led a felt
,'
evenings ago by the Right Hon. Baronet (Siew aft
Peel) near him, must be convinced of the nenegs'',, lee,
measures now proposed, and that there existed Ds; or"
any respect for the Constitution in Ireland, since ,pd
of the most dismal outrages, murders, and burying; try
carried on there. He considered that all the e°,....119, '
afflicted his unhappy country sprang from agiratit COl4 i
agitation ; no matter whether it was that of tw'realsr i
oia,ugadti
tExchangeatztoliooo tn .boeArejno f
sufficiently the Castle.
careful—that that
it
bGa7neet• boat:
manyea s hueinroo,neistuusthi
teslarf,dteoaet 8 encouragingpecti
n g
u, e
Church insteada 0 dwiiniliel,stel;
I been too much talked of by his . Majesty's
.2.4". 1051:t
and he would ask, bow could any man jin Irs'ueb gig: '
petted to pay tithes after the remarks made by he
I
Hon. Secretary opposite? Having said that —tetlf,i, I
was the cause of the evils of Ireland, he wool° 1 alltkt
proof of his assertion, that that part of Ireland saaei;
was not worked upon by agitators was perfectly tr 000
He would say little more upon the question, tit would,
the House, that it was with the gravest sorrow Thad 7,
vote for the measures now proposed by Ministere ;ere Or
trusted that they would use those coercive pod till
discretion, and retain them for as short a allace.,loOL
as possible. He could not, however, help exPr7nres P.
surprise, that one of the first results of the Re'w- i
should be the adopting of such arbitrary measureB;diag..;
An HON. MEMBER would support the first red semis
the Bill, because he was of opinion that it w°ll.-
the peace and tend to the prosperity of Ireland.
..,11101„
Major FANCOURT (we believe) would state ;00
had voted fir the address to the Throne. It %W.. lobea
be could not refuse additional powers to Aliniat'e'-d sbe°,,
they solemnly stated that they would not delnanhet die
mand. He thought that they had not satisfactorwv noir
propose I. When the Noble land opposite had c°7,, fie'
from
_expecting that the Noble Lord would ole-pabe
liable to the charge of being inconsistent 80%-isst,
_had, on a late occasion,
claim his co-operation and support, and the suPP°,:j berL
against
;tiietivdil yeneee lenient
to(i
tieatfwtnhhi aitteeehrmdmdne s,'
behGahyai inssooutdsvuhruepseeroesirnilp mpowprberhit
eye 9
eti;steluis:o:o:°'
t3:o f
00,1:
enrol.boui
sures. The charge against the Hon. and Learneu ',et Itr
ber for Dublin was unfounded ; for lie had aboWn..,,pi- .I°.
sAulirnesis.teiT•s,hae
wished to support Ministers in their beneficial pr
,I foe, ,
wards Ireland, and would oppose them in their ra joy •
n‘dViowflethoefetvhiedesntacteeilnaeidntbseifnoardeetbhye bilisofful,:oeollid
to show that it was not wanted.—(Hear.) '1! eesrs
begTt thvbrldpo'ul veheeEi r.
unel
remarked
s'itlsetr:i propose
vdanoairroßst:AYks.coaretli.iantesys el
I dstklj oibmee behavedt
‘eol nohyytt I ibtnifh:el cryingcams' eeearaheltv:i taNi
shown htsptiwihrsooo. ea consistent]
requiredn,mosl, outsl eteidra Lies, gnauoaa'rranaresdudd: andffiienhonhtafcogitiiLwteueCeynterrihaettiriueriwm finieerrtceecaordisf':lne' wantseßAreltdeprivedillaenensfgluv i rd
rsrebameroar ref'
ni'r aadtf:Pb°Pii ttolEe'vt bbsl:l °li
' :farri fi id'
1:.
: .
f d
pe
ttoharteminemthbaetrdtehspenieomixtadvietcehnesiaec,nrnihntdissttihtojyofernsasNl,anoivobnfebei
right to petition the Legislature_a right which ' rites','
ways been considered as the safeguard of their ILI!: aot',.
He considered that as the most flagitious part of tulefr ~
rageous and unconstitutional Bill. He would tell `-tsene,.,
odeeraof its warmest advocates. (Clfee 0. rt:
nistsrs, that in bringing forward this measure, they 0 e
tu,oa(swhuenfral
el
yfvttso:
sea:
roilsegtramf
u.vi
übtt)ni
slavery
elarontacytsoiTtaeosrmiinhl
impossible
eirssoeistosuohnani the greatest agitators
him, who was formerlyah treasure was
employ.wb aitnrs e
ntchloute:swusitsdarl
eysinsiognopgepes
ttotrhsaoei rnsdgg:ifc
abettinbie&joregr :Oct! ,
Members of the Government, to Russia. Ile - theil re;
on that mission—a result which would drive 01".,'"- OP;
:la;
al NobleLtooEridll
whichm infinitelyt hu es
Lord'
Yt
the hs
vs lalcv in:re:.,lliieOebti 100
ler I I eas,ll°.::
condemned the unfortunate Poles.—(Hear, bear'
, so'
lie called on the House to consider, before t.,n,eti Were '
dilated the liberties of Ireland. If the -1/".t item
Passed, and the dangerous principles whie"lasigm.
volved allowed, they could not know where "be de;
stop, or how soon a similar measure mighttie ad'
mantled to extend over the rest of the empire. ' that I
rather see 'be country plunged in civil war thand b feh
Bill so despotic, nay, tyrannical, should pass ; a° o'l or
that if they went on with measures of such rig said fall°
pression, the cons( quenees of these measures won/-
their own heads.—(Cheers.) %. salB
An HON. MEMBER said, that in tall the sr eeuZi/i9 iklr
against the adoption of the measure proposed by of tl/8
jesty's Ministers, not one of the outrages, or pre dieted'
murders mentioned by Ministers, had been contr liberty
—(Hear, hear.) He was as great a friend to th.e.
_..ty le,
of Ireland as any man, and as a friend to that n..
lid
th°'d
would vote for this Bill, because lie was convince oe ell
was necessary to insure that liberty.—(
not mean to deny that Ireland bad grievances to r.'7 er ,
of, or that it had been misgoverned ; but that was .sops'
this Bill. It v." 6 7 if,
gument against the adoption of
sary to adopt it, in order to give an opportunity:_ies,
proving the Government. And if even a strong.. 'Zie,
suppress agitation, he them'
port sure were proposed to
efore for
port it. Waen the measure came regularly h e.e
he would vote for every clause of it. He would
_1.0,,„,r,
Hear.)
_,..0je10
any measure which Ministers would bring for ward.,lll; je
not any treasure—(Loud laug bter)—.he meant to At,