The Sun.
London, England, 1833-02-15 00:00:00

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sat dr
"UMs,o• t, the potent 4%c:cation.;
There was one thine, kin :Viotti which be thouebt
there was some difficulty, and that was as to the appoint-
ment of a Committee; for many gentlemen were in 5,,me
way or other connected with, and felt great inter eat
in, some one or more carp rations.—(Hear. hear.)
He intended to propose a larger Committee than usual.
It was necessary he should do so, because, as the Committee
was to take into consideration nut only the state of the Cor-
porations in England and Wales, but al4o 'in Ireland, it was
requisite that a certain number of Menibvrs from Ireland
should also be on the Committee. He would state the
grounds on which he thought the inquiry isto the stst• of
the corporations of Ireland should be included. In the
first place, it was very deelra‘de that the instil riens
in the two countrie- should he ersiaiilnted as mtrh as
possible. —(Loud cheers.) As a general rule, wilate!st'
was proper and right for a corporate body in Engla
ot er d
would be equally so fur a corporate body in Ireland.
There was also another practical reason that inda •ed
biro to unite the inquiry into the state of the Corpora-
tions in the two countries in one. If the C romitteo.
with respect to the Irish Corporations, should Cettist
simply of gentlemen from Ireland, it was probable
that the eager feeling which prevailed upon
political points might render their deei.ion ore which
would not be quite so satiefactory as the dei•is.on er a
Committee formed of the Members of the United
Kingdom. His Lordship then moved that a Se-
lect Committee be appointed to inquire into the
state of the municipal corporations in England, Woke,
and Ireland, and to report whether any and what ateu.es
existed in them, and what measure was necessary to
he adopted for the correction of those abus:s.
The Noble Lenl further stated that the Lord Advocate of
Scotland had a Bill in preparation for the correction
.of
abuses in the corporations of Scotland.
Mr. WALLACE said that he regretted the motion of
the Noble Lord did not include Scotland, where assuredly
corporation reforms were as much wanted as in England
or Ireland. He did not see why Scotland should be
treated in a different manner from those countries, and he
was sure that he not only spoke the sentiments of
the great sea-port he represented. but of the whole
of Scotland, when he said that the municipal
institutions of Scotland contained greater abuses than
those of England and Ireland united. Among other
offices which the Government might beneficially inquire
into, was that of the Lord Advocate himsel'. He thouoht
they would learn, upon inquiry, that his was au office
utterly inconsistent with the times. If the Government
did not attend to the representation he now humbly
made to it, he should hereafter move an amendment to
include Scotland in the inquiry proposed by the Noble
Lord.

An Hoat. MEMBER—You can now.
Mr. WALLACE—If that he the case, I beg to move that
he words " England and Waite be omitted, and " Great
Britain" he subatituteft.
Mr. HI/ME seconded the motion, and thought it
would be satisfactory that the Lsrd Advocate, as he
was now in his pace, should explain why he had omitted
Scotland, and his Huu. Friend could th-n, if j;e liked,
withdraw his motion, and give notic of it on a future day.
The amendment having been put,
The LORD ADVOCATE raid that he regretted an
accident had prevented him from being present when
the Hon. Member opposite had made his proposition.
He was quite mistaken if be supposed that Scotland %eta
not included in the motion which hard just been made,
because it was considered that Corporation Reform was
not required in Scotland. On the contrary, he believed
it to be most eminently required--(Hear, hear, hear)--
but the reason of Scotland not being included in this
motion tyro, that the Government was prepared with a
Bill to amend the corporations of Scotland in a more
direct arid simple manner than was proposed with res vet
to those of Ireland and England, with respect to which,
perhaps, the tiresome, but indispensable inquiry of a Corr.
mittee must be gone to. The reason why a Committee wr
not necessary with respect to the corporations of Scotland
was, that for forty years past their condition had been
under discussion. Lord Archibald Hamilton bad moved
inquiries upon the subject year after year, and a great va-
riety of publications had come into the hands of the public,
in consequence of the information his Committees bad elicited.
The materials of reform in the corporations of Scotland
were therefore mature, and rendered unnecessary the
delay which must take place, if information had to
he gathered by means of a Conamittee.—(Hear, bear.)
But there was another reason why Scotland ahould.be
treated separately by a Bill. No three or four of the cor-
porations in England laboured under the same grievance.
In the different corporations in England different abuses
prevailed, for the ratification of which no one measure
would he sufficient. But in Scotland the case
otherwise. By the arbitrary statute of 1649, its cor-
pr.ratione, which had formerly been liberal, were by
the single, unequivocal, and baneful influence of that
Act converted into rotten corporations ; and the no-
mination of the magistrates and counsellors was,
by that one fell sweep, declared to be no longer
fit to be intrusted to " simple men"—(A loud
laugh)—and it was enacted that in rime to
come the existing magistrates should nominate their slue,.
censors. All that was to be done with respect to Scot.
land was to abrogate that Act, and provide at once a popu-
lar constituency. Now that remedy had been prepared which,
he hoped, from its simplicity, would he embraced in a mingle
direct and satisfactory enactment England, however, from
the varieties of abuses, from the diversified forms olcorrup-
tion that existed within them; required more minute
and diversified inquiries, and the application of a more
complex remedy. There was no necessity for inquiry into
the state of the Scotch boroughs, and he bud given notice
already of his intention, on the 12th of March, to move
for leave to introduce a Bill to establish the undeniali,,s
And flagrant evils, and to provide what, in form and
substance, would be to take away the corruption of the
self-election system.

Mr. HUME, after the explanations of the Learnej Lard,
recommended the Hun. Member for Greenock to wit;:.
draw hig mewl/writ,

Mr. WALLACE then withdrew bit amendment.
Sir R. VYVYAN said it had been truly stated in hit
Majesty's speech from the throne that sutjects of great
importance would he brought forward this Se,sioct, but no
statements had been made with respect to municipal corpo-
rations. He felt surprised at the course adopted by
Ministers, as be did not think it either fair or just
that Members of that House, the majority of whom had
oxpressed themselves averse to corporations, shou•di cortxti-
tor a Committee to inquire into :he sti.jeet. He offered
no arguments either for or a, ainai the measure. He did
not stand there as an advocate for corporations, Lut
he would say that, in his opini.:n, a mote unfit
tribunal to look into that great question could
not he found.—(Laughter, and cries of •' Oh.")
Sir M. W. RIDLEY observed, that his Hon. Friend,
althaogh he decried the formation of a Committee to

inquire into corporations by Members of that
had not stated any means by which inquiries coulo
made into the subject. He thought the observations of
his Hon. Friend rather hard, and a little unfair, especially
at a time when he had not learned what slemhers would
I,rtn that Committee. —( Hear.) Connected as he was with

. .. a
large corporation, he could nut avoid expressing on their
part his entire concurrence wi►h the inea.ures GL
his Majesty's Minister*, and their entire readiness rt:
meet any Inquiry into the state of the cnanaJement 01

their env❑ corporations. He was quite aware thit kre.lt
distinctions existed in many part+ Of the counriy,
as to the management of corporations, but the corpora-
tion 0! Newcasth- courted rather than shunned inquoy
into their management.

Mr. O'CONNELL could not but express the great plea.
sure he felt that the Mt-inhere for Scotland expies.ed their
satisfietion at the determination of the Nob:e Lord to
correct sbuses in Scotland, and at the appo'ntment of a
Committee to ir,quire into the subject.--(Lowi cheers.)
lie felt it also to be his duty to orate the very
great gratification he felt that the N Ade Lord
should have included the corporations of Ireland also,
feeling confident that the inquiry to be set c.n foot, would
not be a mock one, but formed with the deermination to

correct abuses. Let him, however, not be eg►iu mistaken,
or his feelings misrepresented, as it was by tNe Hon.
Btronet opposite, the Member for Westminster, who con-
:ended, indeed, that because he approved of the principle
on which Church Reform had been, as far at it went,
conducted—because he was grateful for the boon conferred
in removing the burden of the Vestry Acts, that he should
tie content to suffer Ministers to proceed in unconstitus.
rional measures. But, to return to the corporations : he
did not know a more serious grievance in L el sod than the
existence of the corporations in their present state. Th.
~ove of having these evils abated would give the greaten:
taisfaction to Leland. Toe post which announced it

would do more towards tranquillizinz Ireland than the ar-
rival of twenty reeirnenta. The monopoly of the few in-
corporations had been the ruin of the many. The Ptes
condition of the Irish corporations was a monument of the
•nizratitude of the English Government to its Irish sub-
j,cts. Catholics there were exclu• ed front the corpora_
ions, under the same pretence NS in Sc alaod—namely, to
,revert tumults. The Stuarts made an alteraziou which
t once took away all poptil.relec,ion: float the
fhe two great whilities tor a iortn>.er of this Committee
,:eti
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4
The corearativo of Cork 1144 tin ditikrusAl oi 70,0001, a year.