The Sun.
London, England, 1834-04-28 00:00:00

THE PACHA OF EGYPT.

The following is an account of two interviews with
Mehemet Ali, by an English gentleman travelling in
Egypt

" CAIRO, FEB. 18.

It being usual for English people of any repute,
on their arrival in Egypt, to be presented to Mehemet
Ali, I gladly embraced the opportunity procured for
me by the kindness of Colonel Campbell, the British
political agent and Consul-General at this Court.
The time of our arrival was about sunset. I
found a hale, intelligent-looking old man, the expres-
sion of whose countenance and voice, as well as his
laughter, removed very much the impression of haughty
ignorance and craft created by some of the portraits
circulated in Europe. His eyes arg darkish grey, not
black, and are far from having the ferocity usually
depicted in those likenesses. His manners, neither
thean nor disdainful, seem to have much of the dignity
and ease belonging to the Turks. The French, who
know that it is peculiar to the Turkish magnates to
imagine that they can by speciousness deceive Euro-
peans, say that he is remarkable for finesse. Perhaps
there may be something of that intent in the gracious-
ness with which Franks are treated. _

" At the beginning there was a crowd of courtiers
standing in front of the angle of the divan on which he
sat, having Colonel Campbell on his right and me on
his left. We first spoke of Constantinople and of
Greece, places from which I lately came, and after-
wards f the means of improving Egypt, by the intro-
duction of the bread-fruit tree, the tea-tree, the cul-
ture of rape, &c. The conversation then turned on
Candia, when orders were given for the crowd to re-
tire, and it was continued in the presence of the
Colonel, by the agency of M. Unbar and his uncle,
Boghos Bey, the official interpreters.
" Having stated that I should express myself with
the utmost frankness, Mehemet Ali assured me that
he liked it, and would use it in return.
" On the 'subject of Candia, from which island I had
just arrived, Mehemet Ali declared his intention to
have the quay of Canea rebuilt, and the harbour re-
stored, both having been ruined within 12 months.
He observed, in reference to the executions committed
there by Osman Pacha, in December last, that how-
ever much they might be condemned by Europeans,
he was bound to have the revolt put down, and the
revolters punished. Some had, therefore, been exe-
cuted, but care had been taken that their crimes and
sentences should be publicly known. The remainder
of the prisoners had been since liberated. In his de-
sire to treat the people with mercy, he had directed
that the property of one of the two Turks exiled from
Candia to Anatolia should be given over to his sister,
who claimed it, as being subject to her fortune ; and
he was prepared to adopt the same course in the case
of the property of the other Turk, if any ground could
be shown. I mentioned that all the inhabitants were
not to be blamed for the acts of the revolters, encou-
raged as the latter were by the intrigues of a power,
who, to serve her own views, was opposed to civiliza-
tion and to the constitution f Greece. Of the exiles
in the Morea from Candia, 5,000 had received money
from the agent of that power, in order to return to
the island for the purpose of creating confusion, as it
was expected by that means to excite disturbances in
Greece.

" He admitted the fact, although he for a moment
appeared to doubt it, but on my repeating it, he de-
clared himself fully aware of it, yet he said that to
maintain his authority he was bound to do justice;
the expenses of the island far exceeded its revenue.
His intention in future, in order to remove the causes
of complaint on the score of taxation, was to conform
to the system newly established in Greece, and even
to diminish it from 20 to 25 per cent. on the Greek
scale, so as to show that he did not wish to oppress the
Candiots.
" The observations on the schemes of a Power to
embroil Greece and to involve Egypt led to speak of
the late treaty, which I said was decidedly inimical to
him, he understanding it to be that of Unkier Skelelir,
formed last July between Russia and the Porte, stated
that he had been informed of its contents soon after its
formation, and that he did not fear its results, for if
he had not been prevented by England and France he
would before now have torn to pieces all the treaties
made since the time of Catherine 11. I then men-
tioned that the allusion was to a treaty made within
three months by Austria and Russia, as stated in the
last news from Europe,* for the purpose of insuring
the continuance of the Ottoman empire, even in case
of the extinction of the Osmanli family, to the total
exclusion of the dynasty of Mehemet Ali. Of this
treaty he did not appear to be aware, and upon my
noticing that to counteract it would demand his utmost
decision as a Power, he observed that he had never
assumed the rank or rights of a Power ; he was plainly
Mahommed Ali, as his seal, with that name simply
inscribed on it, always had shown besides, having
never looked upon himself as a Power, he had neverformed
treaties with any nation ; however, notwithstanding all
these proceedings on the part of Austria and Russia,
he, with the assistance of England and France, would
defend himself, and prevent the Russians, even if in
possession of Constantinople, from obtaining a footing
in Anatolia ; 'besides, such treaty can never be put
into practice, as Austria and Russia can never agree
about the partition of the booty.' I replied that the
specified treaty was not to be regarded as a partition
treaty, but solely in the light of one which would give
those powers the pretence of interfering, and the
means of occupying the Ottoman provinces, at least,
in Europe. Another treaty would then be formed for
the partition of the invaded districts ; Austria coveted
Bosnia, Servia, Albania, and the neighbourhood of
the Adriatic, where she sought to extend her power
and erect a navy. He replied that the city of Con-
stantinople would always form a source of dispute be-
tween-them, and that he believed the provinces sought
for by Austria were of little value comparatively. I
have,' continued he, 100,000 men under arms, in-
eluding the navy ; and although I am now prevented
by France and England, in their wish to give no
ground of dissatisfaction to the powers, from making
any further increase, I am ready, in case of necessity,
to raise 100,000 men more ; so that even if Turkey
be deprived of Roumelia, I, with the succour of Eng-
land and France, shall be able to drive the invaders
out of Armenia, and even Georgia, and shall effec-
tually prevent all encroachments in that quarter. Of
Bagdad he said that it was in a most disturbed
state, the present Pacha being blockaded in the city
by the surrounding tribes of Arabs. The Porte was
about to name another, who he knew was a man of
no capacity, and would produce much greater confu-
sion there.
" Of Syria he declared the produce to have been
greatly increased since the peace, the people being de-
lighted in finding tranquillity preserved and security
given to property. Some of the inhabitants of the
mountainous districts and of the cities who used for-
merly to gain by marauding and extortions, were now
discontented, because their occupation was spoiled, al-
though many of them did not actually pay more than
200, 300, or 500 piastres, who used formerly to give
the Pacha there ten times those sums. Even in
Damascus, where Christians did not dare formerly to
enter, they now lived and rode about in perfect security.
" In Egypt itself the increased supply of food
proved, as he contended, that the populace had not di-
minished. He instanced several districts in which, at
the period of the departure of the French, scarcely
any population existed, where there were now abund-
ance of people. As he was about to place dams across
the Nile, he hoped to have one more million of feddans
(nearly the same number of acres) in addition to the
millions already under cultivation. This would also
tend to increase the population.
" He spoke with great satisfaction of his fleet and
of his eagerness to place it on the best footing. As to'
steam-boats, he had one building in England, of 220
horse power and of the most improved construction,
which he expected to arrive within two months.
" The monopolies he maintained to be useful to the
Egyptian cultivators and producers, as they were
thereby always sure of a market. He had offered to
give them to some commercialists, who declaimed
much against them, provided guarantee was given
that the production would be encouraged by the prices
given by those merchants. But these persons, who
were anxious to buy from the peasantry, for their own
profits, would not give him any security.
" Of loans, he said, he had been offered several on
different terms. He had one time wished to take one
of two millions of dollars, payable with interests and
costs, within the term of two years, but the bankers
refused to make one for so short a period. He had
hitherto done without them. and did not even now
want money.
" Some observations being made on civilization, he
stated he presumed those Powers who wished for the
amelioration of mankind could find means of support-
ing the efforts of the government of Egypt; but when
I mentioned that all the European Powers did not
equally encourage it, he allowed that there were some
* See Augsburg Gazette of the Bth for it.