The Sun.
London, England, 1847-01-20 00:00:00

tee ,
le Place at that workhouse, awl within
ll° should ask, if any orders or
the
permissionlas t w
he week
lee. granted by the Poor-law Commissioners to relieve
ejterl3°t°llr of that district, without compelling them to
Sit e e pestilential workhouse.
Ito,sl' GREY said, that with refehreencseehtjoeeat7
fs'l.7elee that had taken place on t
thool,,s i't would throw any light uthatsubject,ee r rbe
s-
n the
etu" ee happy to lay it before the PHnouse.
MAJESTY'S SPEECH.—THE ADDRESS.e
Th
h s SPEAKER i
tt o-t.
tehEAKER stated that the House, nt the nri.,
Queenpresenceof in the House of Peers, and that her Majesty
IT delivered a most gracious Speech from the Throne.
.thes read the Speech.
tie4l,l'.e. ROWARD rose to move that an arneihnurnmhflner Ahder-
'B be Presented to her Majesty, teci '
.
to ees Speech. But before be would proceed
hat so, he besought the House to accord him
i., ladulgence which it usually granted upon such
eh.
lons, and which he would assureedtlsiiencleiroeulysethlaiet
:t,l very greatly in need of.He
t„°hservations of his would dishttiorit the unnaumlidnibtye•
els. which the Speech of
would
ier
example
lately, and that they
ttll Y set them in Ireland, ward,
fmi.mMitaajteestythew
e,PartY disputes—(Hear, a in a tiorderme forbear
ebaert tferro toin
°te them selves to the considerationher)— oafelereisth mtmeapsruervees:
meet deve s for the penn
hear.) The
improve-
deft of-e
means for
(Hear,
tie Paragraph of her alajesty
h which at pre •
eq' abxiete •and concern for the deartt
's Speech expressed the
e felt sure that
et ei .a Scotland and Ireland.
the in in .
tooP..the would join in
circumstancesthat expression
Pe
sp'a i ltihnagtt
hae h character,
a
k„„_es,Ed that the
ee
trorred to him to. be o f the oflatter
.jht countryur
aeter,
te se beset with dfffiscoultai
himself almost
Bat to to addresssubject.
to be felt confident' that theto mere
rhal,lusainond
hetliteetn would be sufficientatteoffeerxtcaittee sreeritpvae_thee,ta._
et 4 call forth the warmest
fe-ver, hear.) Unfortunately
' te' and famine no the calaemeeiet
fe Ireland. Last year it pwas
prevaatiled to a considerabyr4enexeoec-fr
thtl.l, but it did not take. place .
in August, and s
e,`• °Non. nor was It attended. with such fatal effects.e
come year disease had set in early
the early part of
the
had been the destruction of the potato crop,
At •
exception of a few set in
th , with the
ieuebYear, they had been almost all destroyed. He felt
to unable he was adequately to express in figures the
of things as regarded that
the fai
alure,rbaleubthepbaerlt a
believed
that the eleventh part o
1,200,000 acres, were
eel country, or about
~11 . d with potato cultivation.it
hid failed ;
wereand wastakenThis im mienutosec ociersoip-
n,eretion how many
might be
whendependent on it as their only
'„tibsisteece some idea
T
tress
*which was the consequence efformt
headt
of
failure.
i I utrhee.
ntere many dependent upon
would not attempt to
Ito. s Were so
its
place. He it that it was nearly'
et yeeible to fill
meet this emergene)•
tote
the measure which the Gover.n.melntt
would
ddhede
employment they
tot mg forward tohe
hey had heldemoPut for the em-
I 1 contributions.
he
its,ylteue of the peeoera, and the contributlionnivt,sastheearfrhaaidd
4,11, to resist
they done,
07°Ine all
to prevent
(1114,t_ their diens had not been _sufficient.
tse'es!, er save the country from being reduced to a
Got desperate state. He was
do all they could;.
eer! bnient intended to glad to understand
d e r stthaantd
they
t
and that they Hite
Ter! about to take off all duties which restricted. theeidmet-t
to Lion of foreign
IN ,e,W molasses and sugar to
Ile ere grain hitherto used purpose.—(Hear.)
distilleries
u a
rt 3
fe, rh et
heastepduirnp
but yet he could
Rowan quite aware of the benefit which this Laesneer.et
c'e produce to the country,
Oise from himself the fa't tat afterailel intewweauyl onlyaffect
thecle_f to from
utility, end that it would
ation
try intoconsid.er
such
,
tserpianent condition of the people of Ireland.
.He would
tile whol condition of that coun
ea
ssh
tt4swhould hope that the Government would opurledsednetvdisiestsre ,
4t '4 ss would not onlierelieve .
eld' i
vii, also prevent it from becoming
he
of that country,.
thou etaving noticed the distress a permanent
great injus-
tiee ght he should be doing an injustice—a
ttleZet° the people, if he did not at
tseitir gulag patience with which the had
e
theeopslaemoef Itirmeleanhde
this terrible calamity.
ti%ce.d tee extreme suffering to which they had been
Ile th`ed during the existence of
b shown, that tbe
desee°dneht it but right to make this remark because he
'3'a,e, as he trusted it wou.d e
with
ll'e ' -"Y of that House went
it' would be
a el'eople of Ireland, and that entirely
still
toefinnitnendation to the Irish people
against the distress
thater,,t° bear up their fortitude
He alluded to
Iti 04 f4ilen upon them. There nßg•as another subject
111,4 leh Ile Wished to say a few words. __
erek'struction of the independence of Cracow, and ho
should have
a Vioilat. help expressing his extreme surprise that such
te44 mien of the sanctity of treaties
las e
n,,,el,ace, and he' could not help
.looking upon it
m esty
444-.11,14,5t violation of the treaty of Vienna.—(hear,
Whie, -there was one topic in her —fie
he t
ee to this country
that thou ht of peculiar importan
of Towns'
lepo,',:was, the notice of the Health 's Speech
her Ma-
Je`:.% which had been made Y
this country
t,,Pore eetetnissioners, and he trusted that those
i''' th ihsweeld awaken the people of
ete Be
—Tontine-.
!hat "(,I„,,seeh mease ores as would mainly contribute
to
f that subject, and that they would
e o ieeortant ohjaecees In saying thus much, be uuKhrt.
'')utxliP,rres' his gratitude to Mr. Chadwick and y
nit lli
had made.
ts°4,(l Smith for their exertions and consideration
Ale Foul44luSiPet and for the valuable reports they
fur-
-1,55 not trouble the House with any
for
A 'new_
The Honour
'4. • "rnaths t but at once thank them loaf.
tifiLer K'nee be had received.
Aree , concluded by moving
kek-:tss oe presentee' to her Majesty in return for her
e that an humble
heY's most gracious Speech from the throne.
c), 4(14%11 el
4,0 (
Spec h then read,
. the lieech. which was, as usual, an
said h ItICARDO rose to second the Address...H, ee 'ffere:i did not anticipate that any oppositiontwouletl3
l'hiee te° the Address, for the purpose of seconding
41t " now had ' the honour to rise- ile
Of eVed that even if there were anything eitherof
g;4l, eoliatniision sir omission in the opinion
to
er
aarty, in this case the • would be slop a
loons nY obstruction to her Majesty'. Government ats& -
• -40 tit we
to the!tlire the
Jeeto r nen so large a portion ot her Majesty's I)
his
adoption of measures which would lead
tloe. Frinamediat relief. He should not follow
h end throe
°ci nsid r 1 ugh the details of Irish distress,. because
to .'t e et after vvhat he had said, .1. it . all, he should but compliment
bits sancerity el pay a poor
teetireeete of • 0 was sure that he expressed the
if he alluded
tteted his 6
when he
every Member in the House
be
*- posed NI] conviction that when the measures lo . a
4°-
e hY her
thetyne xisting distress cameo undererm consideration, that.
AhjestY's G v ent for the alleviatio
tee,e_yreuld approach the discussion of them with
t by part hostility or by party con
1 NJ:Lions, and that they would be actuated by the
anddeeisittemires, in ordery to obtain the same endt--.
lead ts. a remedy for 'the present national calameifea,
measure to preveut the recurrence
What
those r state of thinge in future.—(Cheers.) 0
Ibleee nietisures might be, he had no means
re_f
lemur" ; indeed, if he did, it would be pwas
olle ea to discuss them then. Bat
°atereirt of the Speech to which he wishedthteoreallvu.deeg,
l'acilitY' the admission of foreign corn, and for giving
I
belieyle, for its admission.—(Hear, hear.) he
T•h's the
Qlltie,em was understood to be done by removing
1162.11)0n foreign corn, and by the relaxation of.the
Thr"tell laws as far %3 regarded that importation.
Agd had received universal discussion.
e‘t 't but two objections raised against it, one of which
ae•aleiacuh.
lity nfreest extraordinary reason, that i?e, larger
tlian-,,.elara could be admitted under a free imporctlatiori
Tot 4nder the present duty. Certainly, if they could
The get any in, they could not lett any out.
c which was
ilt,e next reason was, that the
letere'l into between Parliament aenodmPahe agricultural
he test° would be materially interferedt with. Now,
hetillressed he thought there was no party in that House
upon itself the
1'4,13 WOuld deem it wise
,y) talie quo tltiEility of adding one farthing to the price
% (4 at the present moment, ian order to sustain such
Ol,tllletilio as this. He did not apprehend that the agri
d think less disinterestedly of
likt.ilrists of 1847 w
4,11' country than theot agriculturists and Parliament of
oer, when it would be borne in. mind, not
is,/ Was corn admitted for the relief of the- suffer-
-IVeePie, but a bounty paid on its introduction.
won u'er.l he did not consider that the state of the country
-ch would by her Majesty's Government
11;"4 he bad as it was in 1800, for the measures
*ewe 'voted be taken.
llet'4, Prevent their arriving at such a point of destitution.
le, tnere was one point to which he. would call particu-
,thattention—they were not alone in their misfortune.
e.43„l.scareity extended through the greater part of the
Belgium
441-411 N of Europe. France, Holland,. andre.
ut
es. i'l,°Pened their ports and remitted thedireceonee,daedi
it
*ohle Were, therefore, put upon their f
110074 utter madness in them if they should impose
prevent
thee,' thebaselres any restrictions which-should
l from obtaining a fair share of the produce
seeseee tirY to their support.—(Hear, hear.) Let them, for
teetteeo
age price of corn to
•es --- s sake, take the aver
° tit net,,,rt
4ee er. Upon that
'hey tang duty, while, under the old corn-law,
they had at present to pay a
It was
Ohei would have but one shilling.
lee
„'lla to every one that the seller would sooner take
four shillings, even
Ilhe-rlrt'e to a free and unrestricted market than to one
o,°epe',!'le would have to pay a toll of
the price of corn.
'thsy"tenß that the toll were repaid
means of trafficing
grotei 'errn their more intimate hr3c.lations with corn-
e "Il countries, and from their
Iler lenena, from their insular
positionhad certainly
eer o
411 g'ettes f internal transit, and supe-
thet, antaee in keeping the' Pr effectually
te do other? countries. But, in order Of
Isle, twothings the first
-le ice of corn lower
were necessary,
e, t 1 asto . corn
laws.
spa
which
W remit their Ala 15 second to relax their navigation
`liar Q h ,
been in
. . . , two nu .
'llions of
.. duties,
e ad been in the habit of receiving
ktte 'l's of wheat from Ireland the would not receive
ve
b, ear, but the probability was,
would
spa to "" export the same quantity, which
11'
this
that they would
'vh,„ deficit of four millions.—(Hear, hear.)
tfieri,,_°Yconsidered the success that had attended the
',lce - Welch had been made to carry out a liberal. system
for
eei:,reerce, they had the strongest presumption,rera
ittttptull, hitherto !It evince that the best effects would follow from
gki -"r9gution of the navigation laws, which.
operated so injuriously to the
„ solo ants
only
(!')1 ''''S °F notthe mother country, but their
e)1 dial
' de not
When they considered the
'Nu I.°l. the British commerce—that it extended
keetet!' every quarter of the globe that their.
S'le :Ns and sailors were toiling everywhere in
ellit," humanity tha. t their empire was
"eli the every sea—that their commercial trader.s
i keettf.:o best customers of the country, and their
'ttlrers Burpmeed by none in energy and enter-

prise,—when they considered all these things, -and
the capital and resources, mineral and other •
wise, which existed in the land, , and when
they all also took into consideration the great
advantages that had already attended the remission of
the old law, which had failed in its operation in this
country, and had lost them the North American
colonies, besides creating irritation in the present de •
pendencies of the country, they had every encouragement
to come forward in the direction they had recently
taken.—(Cheers) There was one other matter in
the Speech to which he would refer. It was
that regard'og the admission of sugar for
the use of brewers and distillers. He did
not intend to occupy the attention of the House at any
length on the subject at present, as many opportunities
would be afforded for its full discussion in future, but he
must be permitted to say that the proposition
would have the best effects in liberating a
large amount of grain fur the maintenance of
the people—(Hear, hear)—while at the same
time he believed a considerable reduction could be made
in the cost of some articles of luxury to the people.—
(Hear, hear) Ho considered that the measure
would be but an act of bare justice to the
agricultural interest, which complained of the
abrogation of the protection that it had hitherto
enjoyed. The success that had attended the new course
of policy pursued—the experience of an increase in the
Customs duties, at the same time that a large consump-
tion of necessary and useful articles, such as timber,
sugar, and brandy had taken place—encouraged them
to go steadily forward in the same track.—(Cheers).
He was convinced that other nations, would not be slow
in following our example, but that they would prefer,
as it was so evidently to their interests, to buy
economically rather than manufacture expensively;
that capital would quickly flow into the country, and
that we should have such a return in answer to our
proffers, that the world would speedily feel the benefit of
those measures, and that their result would be an in-
crease of plenty, prosperity, and peace. With those ob-
servations it only remained for him to second the
Address which the Speaker had in his hands.
The Address havieg been read from the Chair,
Mr. S. O'BRIEN said that, however disinclined
be was to disturb :the unanimity of the House
on the present occasion, or in any respect to inter
fere with that unanimity with which addresses in reply
to the speech of her Majesty should have, he felt
that he should be wanting in duty to his countrymen
if he remained silent, and refrained from an appeal
to the House, in behalf of those whose suffer-
ings could neither be exaggerated nor described.
It was surely not necessary for him to remind the
House of the circumstances that had taken place during
the last three months in Ireland. If Hon. Gentlemen
would only look at the reports which were daily circu-
lated through the newspapers of that country for the
last three months, they would know that those suffer-
ings were extreme, and that there was reason to appre-
hend that, unless immediate measures be taken they
will not only continue, but bo very largely increased.
The latest newspaper which he bad received from that
country contained an account of no less than eight in-
quests in the county of Mayo, in which verdicts had
been returned of death from absolute starvation ; and
also an account of a family who were found living upon
horse-flesh and carrion, the refuse of wild ducks and
other birds. He was not ;prepared to say that
her Majesty's Goverment were to be held en-
tirely guiltless cf having produced such a fearful
state of things. He believed that it was in their power
to have prevented a single death taking place through
starvation. He did not accuse them of a wilful inten-
tion of doing so, but he thought that by the measures they
had introduced; or rather the neglect of those measures,
they had tended considerably to bring about that state
of things. He would recal to the recollection of the House
the pledge given by the Noble Lord at the head of the
Government, at the close of the last session, that no inter •
ference on the part of the Government with food
should be allowed. To that fatal pledge he attributed
many of the disasters which had befallen that unhappy
country. The present Government should have followed
the example of their predecessors, and made a pledge
that, so far as the exertions of the Government
were concerned, they would do the utmost to
present any human being dying of staivation,
The Noble Lord had, no doubt, by this time discovered
that the capital of this country was not of such a nature
as could be immediately employed in obtaining resources
tar a population of .five millions of persons, the greater
portion of which were to be found in places where no
trade or commerce had as yet any existence. The
Government ought, therefore, to have been prepared
to augment the supply of corn, by ransacking
every port in the civilized world, and also to have in•
troduced every description of produce, and by the ap-
plication of that produce to the most remote parts of
the country, have mitigated the evils and prevented
those fearful disasters with which the public were
unhappily too well acquainted.—(Hear, hear.)
Then he wished to ask why should not the duty upon
the importation •of corn have been abrogated months
ago, when the horrible state of the Irish people became
known ? The Noble Lord had been bold enough
in dealing with other duties, or rather the chief
Secretary for Ireland had found no difficulty in legislat-
ing without Parliament. But why should not Parlia-
ment have been called together months ago, for the put..
pose of carrying out the plan only now suggested, viz., of
removing the corn duties, and;suspending the navigation-
la ws, in order to alleviate the existing distress, and conse-
quently of permitting such an importation of grain, and
preventing the use of sugar in breweries and distilleries,
and of employing the navy, as they had only recently
been employed, in carrying supplies of food
to the extreme portions of the country, access
to which was difficult ? Then, with respect to the eee
ployment of the people—and he regretted that he was
addr.ssing an audience five-sixths of whom knew no-
thing about the subject the resident gentry and
the farmers, who had received diminished rents
and profits, from the failure of the potato crops, and
who were consequently unable to give all the 'employ-
ment that was required, stepped nobly forward and did
their best to alleviate the distress, yet the Government
refused to tax the absentee landlords.—(Hear, hear.) In
such a state of things it was the duty of the
Government to provide a temporary remedy. They
passed at the end of last session a Bill which was called
the Labour-Rate Act, under which power was given to
the Executive to undertake works recommended by:the
quarter sessions, in order to give employment to the
people, and under this Act they were employed in de-
stroying the roads, and in consigning the land to perpte
tual barrenness—nothing was done for its proper culti-
vation. He did not blame the Government for passing
this Act, because they, no doubt, did so precipitately,
and without knowing the full extent of the sufferings of
the people ; but he could find no apology for the neglect
of the Government in not calling Parliament together
for the purposes to which he had referred, and of whose
conduct he could not speak in terms of praise.
General remonstrance reached the Government against
the expenditure of such large sums of money on objects
injurious or worthless, which they were for the most
part: The Hon. Gentleman instead of doing that,
which was his duty, took upon himself the functions
of the Legislature, and that without consulting the
Irish representatives, who were the proper organ for
legislative enactments. But the Hon. Gentleman had
taken, the sole responsibility of establishing regulations
affecting the property of the country and its taxa
Lion in a most material manner, and that through
a letter couched in language very obscure and
exceedingly difficult to understand. It appeared to him
that the Minister who set such a precedent—for, let them
remember, it was a precedent—was deserving of im-
peachment. He might stand alone in that opinion, but
he felt himself bound, notwithsianding, to express
it. He was bound to state, in addition, that the instru-
ment had remained a dead letter, and had thrown the
country into confusion; for, up to that moment, it was
his belief that a very small portion of the works
had been undertaken in accordance with that letter.
What they demanded was, that the employment of the
people should no longer be directed to works
of an entirely unproductive character ; at the
present
moment
hundreds and thousands of men
awere e
were
employed e
fitn
udnetsatireedy destroying
ireoaard, s h wear)he
the
t thele
consequence of which would be that the famine of
the next year would double that of the'* present.
He complained that the provisions of the Act had not
been carried into efficient t frect, and that the Board of
Works did not carry out the powers which had been
reposed in them for the employment of the
people. In the county of Mayo, he knew that
the proprietors of land had taxed themselves to
a great extent for the employment of the people, that
due effect to the funds so raised had not been given,
through the inefficiency of the Board of Trade arrange-
ments, while the people were dying by thousands.
There was another consideration why Ireland
should know the measures to be proposed at the
earliest moment. Was the measure to be local or na-
tional ? On that question would depend the reception
which it would meet with in Ireland. If it were to be
a national measure, then should all be called on to con-
tribute to it equitably, without regard to class or party,
landowner, mortgagee, fundholder, and annuitant.
Whatever he, as a humble Member of the House, might
think of the measure or the character given to it,
upon that would depend its efficacy as a means of
relief for the sufferings of the Irish people. It would
show to the millions of that country whether
the union was to be productive of benefit to Ireland, or
throw all the advantages in favour of England—(Laugh•
ter) —by the encouragement of absentees" to
spend the rents levied in Ireland out of the
country. There could be real union between
the two countries, unless the interests of Ire-
land were fully recognised and consulted, and he
trusted the measures of the Government would be
an instalment in that direction.—(Hear, hear)
i l put a
that
If that were the case, then it followed that the manu-
facturersense to t
their
r Irelandira agi
imagination
nd
in flourish,wh io
theand he
wouldprinciple
had been advocated could not hold. Suppose, in
the case of an invasion, or any other national disaster,
that should deprive the people of employment, when
food would be as scarce as employment, could they dare
to adopt such measures as those which were now re-
commended, and which would be equivalent to swamp-
ing the whole of the landed interest of Ireland. He did
not wish to offer opposition to the Government, for he
looked upon their attainment of office with the greatest
satisfaction, and had certainly greater sympathy with them
than with any other sect in the House. But he had at pre-
sent no faith in the plans which they had devised, and he
thought that they would not by any means, be likely to
satisfy his countrymen. There had been a committee
sitting in Dublin, whose business it was to investigate
the state of the country. He would not that night enter
into the details of that committee, but he did not hesitate
to say, that, for himself, if their recommendation
were adopted, be would hesitate to give in his
adhesion to the extension • of the poor-law
to Ireland. But if the cry for help that was now making
frinn Ireland was to be Wet, no by relief, but by such

pamphlets as that which he held in his, hand (An
Extract frem Adam Smith's " Wealt'i of Nations"),
nothing could allay the exasperation of the people,
or avoid the dreadful calamity of impending famine.
The opinions which be entertained upon the ,subjects of
political-economy, the duty of the Government, and the
duty of the Legislature, were -not at aIl acceptable
to that House; he felt it his duty, however, to
state then, and so long as the Government of this
country administered the resources of • Ireland and
thheer
Greovveenrnumese,nsto
responsible
gobswiboluld
eforheeirceornytinduce ho
,athto
whiclhd
might occur through starvation—(Cries of " Oh, oh")
—if they did not adopt every -measure which might be
probably and fairly expected of them.
Mr. P. SCROPE said that the llon. Member who
had just sat down li-ad alluded to the employment of the
able-bodied of the people of Ireland on public works in
that country, but had said nothing of the relief of that
large class of the population of that country,
the destitute, who were unable to work upon public
works. The wages which were given to those persons
employed on public works might have been sufficient
for their support when they had potatoes as a means of
sustenance ; but now that the crop of that article was
destroyed it was not sufficient, seeing they had to put chase
corn and grain at high prices. If then the families of the
employed could not subsist on their present wages, what
was to become of those destitute persons who were un-
able to work? He supposed that the Government con-
sidered that the various relief committees would afford
the proper relief ; they were, however, interdicted from
giving relict' in money, and were only allowed to eel
provisions at cost price to such persons as
might be consihred proper objects of their attention.
The Committee should have done more than sold
food at . the prime cost, because ho believed they
were not pre vented from assisting them by grants
of food and money. Then, with respect to
the workhouse system, experience during the
past ought to have taught them that they could not rely
with any certainty, nor upon the voluntary relief of the
gentry. When their attention was called to the
nature of the emergency last August, which
they ought have anticipated, they might have
well known that they could not calculate
with any certainty upon receiving the ample means
which were necessary from the resident gentry of
Ireland. 130 workhouses had been established
in Ireland under the law recently passed,
but they were not calculated to contain one hundreth
part of the indigent part of the population. The work-
houses in England were not calculated to maintain
more than ten per cent. of the population during the
worst seasons; but what was to become of the poor of
Ireland during similar seasons with such crippled work-
house accommodation ? In many instances the work-
houses had become so crowded that their doors had to
be shut to all new comers; and, so crowded were they,
that fever bad broken out, and instead
therefore, of affording relief to the poor, they
had been the means of affi:cting them with
fevers, which too often carried them. off. He
asked them why they bad not interfered be-
fore now, and dispensed more liberal relief.
This might have been done by making the local
authorities responsible for the maintenance of the
poor, more especially the infirm and destitute.
The local authorities would then have been able, through
their own means, to have provided ample supplies of
food, and they would not then have heard of the dread-
ful occurrences in Skibbereen, in which, as it ap-
peared to him, the poor were left to starve or
be swept off the face of the earth.—(Hear, hear). He
lamented that he felt it his duty to make these
observations, and he considered that the facts re-
quired some explanation at the hands of the Minister.
Ile, with others, felt that measures were not taken
which might have prevented the scarcity which was
now so bitterly felt.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said, that although for many
years he had been in the habit of addressing the House,
yet, he confessed, that at no time had he risen
mere impressed with the responsibility of his position,
or under a stronger impression how much he should
stand in need of the accustomed kindness of the House.
—(lcer.) The Hon. Gentleman the Member for Li.
merick had in very strong language depicted the distress
at present existing in Ireland. He (Mr. Labouchere)
wished that it was in his power to say that he con-
sidered that the Hen. Gentleman had overcharged
the picture. There had been, no doubt, in
some particular instances, great exaggeration.
Before Hon. Members could charge her Majesty's
Ministers as had been done by the Honourable
Member for Limerick (Mr. Smith O'Brien), they
ought to consider the ordinary condition of Ire-
land before this great calamity took place. What
was the usual state of that country? It was
no exaggeration to say, that the people were the worst
housed, the worst clothed,' and the worst fed of any
people in Europe.—(Hear, hear.) Ile had in his
possession some facts which would throw considerable
light upon this question, which had been certified as
correct by one of the best authorities on the subject.
He meant the commission for inquiry into the condition of the
poor that had been issued in 1835. The labours of that com-
mission proved that there were 1,131,000 agricultural lahourers
whose average wages did not exceed from 2s. to 2s. 6d.
per week, and of this number one-half were unemployed
for thirty weeks in theyear. Such was the condition of Ire-
land in 1t335. Such was the country on which a calamity had
fallen unparalleled in modern times. By a visitation of Pro-
vidence the food of a large proportion of the people had been
almost entirely swept away. The notato crop had been a com-
plete failure. He had obtained some calculations of the loss
which Ireland had sustained in money value, certified as correct
by one of the best statisticians in Ireland,llr. Griffiths. He cal-
culated that one and a half millions of acres were
under potatoes, the ordinary value of which crop
was 10!. an acre. This was an aggregate value of
15,000,000!., and as three-fourths had been destroyed,
the loss was 11,250,00'. There had also been a great failure
in the oats. There were four millions of acres under that
crop, of which one-third was destroyed, making a loss in
money of 4,666,500/. The total loss, therefore, was
on these two crops 15,916,000/. That was the ques-
tion which be had to put before them. Now
these were the calculations of loss which had been occasioned
by the calamity that had befallen Irelend. What was the mea-
sure of the loss? Why it was found, on investigation,
that the failure of the crop had fallen on a million
and a half of acres of potato ground, and that the
loss in weight amounted to 11,250,000 lbs. The value of this
produce was estimated at 4,837,0001. From other causes
there was a loss of upwards of 5,227,0001. But the House
knew that this calamity was not to be estimated by the loss of
produce, or of the money for which that produce could be
sold. Great as was that misfortune, there was a far
greater one, to endure. Every one acquainted with the
construction of society in Ireland knew how intimately the cul-
ture of the potato entered into it, and how great a stake it con-
stituted in the welfare of the country. He would not trouble
the House with details with which they were familiar, but he
had only to recal it to their recollection to give them
some idea of the distress which this kiss had occasioned.
Not only was the cottage farmer deprived of his
usual supply of food, but also of the means of pay-.
ing that rent for which he was responsible, but which
he now found himself unable to pay. Then there was the
farm labourer, who was now deprived of every resource.
When these two facts were taken into consideration
Honourable Members would obtain some idea of the
deprivation which the loss of food had occasioned,
and what had been the reality of the suffering. The
Hon. Member for Limerick had described the state of
misery and destitution in the county of Mayo, and charged the
Government with having produced that state. Why, in the
year 1835, a witness said, in his examination before one of the
Committees of that House, "that the county of Mayo could
supply beggars enough for all Europe." Was it, then, fair
or just to charge upon the Government the present disastrous
state of the country?—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member
went on to attack his Noble Friend at the head of the Govern-
ment because he had adhered to the pledge which he gave at
the close of last session, not to interfere with the ordinary
supply of food to Ireland. The pledge which his Noble Friend
had given was this, " that the Government would not meddle
with the import trade of provisions to Ireland from foreign
countries." He (Mr. Labouchere) now maintained that it
was most fortunate that the Government had firmly, and
under much obloquy, adhered to that pledge. He knew of
nothing more criminal on the part of the Government than to
allow themselves, against their own reason, to be hurried into
the adoption of a course which they were satisfied would not be
fur the good of the country.—(Cheers.) Ile was
sure that if Government had turned importers of food
on a large scale, and attempted to do that which
no Government could have done, the attempt
would have failed. The short period of plenty would have
been succeeded by all the horrors of an aggravated famine.—
( Hear.) Hon. Members on the opposite side seemed to think
that the power of Government was unlimited. There could not
be a greater mistake than that. He fully admitted that there
were occasions when the Government might step aside from
the rule which should be observed on common occasions.—
(Cheers.) The fallacy of the reasoning of the Hon. Member
for Limerick was to be met not by argument, but by the
result.—( Hear.) Was there any man who did not know
that if the Government had undertaken to supply
Ireland with food the consequence would have
been that all trades would have been paralyzed ?
The pledge which the Government made was this, that they
would not import corn from abroad for Ireland under any
circumstances. It was necessary to speak out on
Go-
vernmentbmwhFeehriefrroaeectrndhe
daet 'thes
:ago
nohwnahoidnuoitn Government
to
saide eet xhdceei tv,
Ae,ebdri
leenrt h!cemlleanntnuit fearsknow ofw h a thet
we
the subject. The conduct of the preceding
ig
ere importingah oot
intention,
ttoo,i
a markets.dH o
e. We
And
hohooduevig
ehhv
had
knowtrao,aN o
ad-
hered die;
not make that pledge without qualification. He added, that
he would not interfere under ordinary circumstances with
the retail -trade of Ireland. There were parts of Ire-
land in which there was an entire absence of retail
trade where he (Mr. Labouchere) thought the Government
ought to interfere. In the western part, and on the southern
coast, there was this absence, and, with respect to them, they
thought they. would do more good than harm by interfering.
—( Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") In other parts they
would have done more injury than good by such an interfer-
ence, for if they bad attempted to control the whole retail trade
they would have signally failed. The Hon. Gentleman had
['reproached them with not acting properly. The Right Hon.
Baronet, the Member for Tamworth ( Sir Robert Peel),
when he was the First Lord of the Treasury had to
deal with a calamity in Ireland of has magnitude
however, than the one with which they were now called
different stateee t
the of
uoon to deal. The circumstances were, in fact, different.
eTohmeymerwee-erethaotheetn ht vinidifficulty in which the calamity had placed him, he adopted
a very just and a very praiseworthy course.—(Cheers.)
He reduced the duty on Indian meal, which was at that
that period u;idaenrd, ai n order
to meet
time an article unknown, and prohibited in Ireland. It
in
-hich consequently produced
was imported in considerable quantities, and the Irish became
accustomed to an article of food which was more nouris
than the potato, and vi
excellent effects. The Right Honourable Baronet con-
ducted that operation with the most entire secresy,
and though secret, it was successful.—(Loud cheers.)
And, therefore, when the Hon. Gentleman blamed the Go-
vernment for not having followed the example of her Majesty's
late Government in throwing supplies into Ireland from America,
he did not recollect that it was impossible to do so. The Hon.
Gentleman had gone. on to observe that the Government had
not taken sufficient care to remedy the distress. He need not
remind the House that his Noble Friend had taken office
at a late period in the past session. For a
time before that the former Ministers of her Majesty were
aware that the calamity which has since visited the country
was rapidly approaching, they had accordingly taken such
measures as they considered most beneficial, . and

when his Noble Friend assumed office he found that
a course had been adopted, which had received the•sanctiorr of
that House, and almost the adoration of the Irish landed
proprietors. He alluded to the plan of affording relief to-
the mass of unemployed labourers through the medium of
public works. That system had, no doubt, been attended with
some abuse; but, upon the whole, and as a matter of choice,
they thought it least objectionable, but they never recommended
this measure as one intended to provide for the whole
labouring population of Ireland. They were, in hopes that
works of that description would have the effect of stimulating
landed proprietors to the undertaking of useful produc-
tive works, rather than be thrown away on the roads.
In these hopes, however; they had been disappointed.
The Honourable Member for Limerick went on to com-
plain that the system of public works was deficient, and
that the parties employed to carry it out were inefficient.
—(Hear, hear.) To that he would say, that considering
the extensive operations of the Board there might be some
inefficient servants, but with regard to the officers themselves,
he believed that no reasonable complaint could be urged.
He believed that it would be found that it would
have been impossible for public servants to have
shown greater ability, greater zeal, or greater BUM', iS
in the discharge of their arduous duties.—( Hear.) Did they
consider the peculiar task imposed on them, and the extent of
machinery that had to be directed? Why, at the present mo-
ment there were 450,000 persons employed on the public works
in Ireland—( Hear)—under the superintendence of the Board
complained of. In September last 30,000 were employed ; in
October, 150,000 ; in November, 285,000 ; and in December,
440,000.—( Hear, hear.) To expect that all officers employed
under the Board, to give effect to such large machinery, should
be efficient servants, was surely to hope for too much.—
( Hear.) He would state the number of officers necessary :
inspectors, 74 ; engineers, 36 ; assistant-engineers, 385 ;
clerks, 2,800 ; and overseers, 6,846—(8ear, hear.)
This was the effort which had been made by the Government to
meet the calamity. He could understand any man who blamed
the Government for the course which they had adopted ; he
could understand any man who should blame the Government
for a deficiency of energy, and for not exerting all the power
for mitigating the calamity, but he could not understand how
any man, after having seen the gigantic efforts of the
Government, should still blame them for the fact
that disease and famine still prevailed in Ire-
land. There was no doubt but that disease and famine
did prevail to a most lamentable extent, but ther? was as little
doubt that this exertion had been greatly instrumental
in reducing the evil and relieving Ireland from the
pressure of this calamity. But they were to consider
whether this was a question which only affected Ireland, or
whether it applied to the whole of the British empire, and he
should have no difficulty in answering that question. The
calamity which had spread so fearfully through England and
Scotland had fallen upon Ireland out of all proportion to her
resources, and he did not hesitate to say that the House would
concur with him in the assertion that Ireland had a right to look
to England and Scotland for ttie help which she needed: But he
trusted that the landlords of Ireland would do their duty, and
he believed that the exertions of the people of England would
he somewhat in proportion to the willingness of the landlords of
Ireland to-'assist.their fellow-countrymen.—(Lsud cheers.)
He thought that there was in Ireland an improved spirit
springing up. In many instances a sense of discouragement
had come over the feelings of the landlords. They were
haebneirdld :Po; necs. s a
mst ht
eoarstst
belrelandoyrdtihale
v 'feaesl instrumentalityi
n only
their
wereto b
excited of
sfa vhe
edri
n f ownrtoh is
country on behalf of the suffering people of Ireland, and they
were willing to render them every assistance in their
power, but that assistance could not be honourably
and safely given without the co-operation of the nobility
and gentry of Ireland. The Honourable Member
for Stroud had put a question with reference to the relief
afforded to the destitute and infirm of the population of Ireland.
The best course which the Government thought they could
adopt was to allow the relief committees to afford the necessary
assistance to that class, and it was his opinion that if Parliament
had in the last session passed a poor-law similar in its nature to
the English poor-law, and which the Hon. Member seemed to
think the panacea of all the evils of Ireland, still he thought
that under the pressure of the accumulated distress of the coun-
try, that measure would have broken down, and he was
borne out in that opinion by the fact of the
difficulty which even then existed in col-
lecting the rates necessary for the . support
of the existing poor-law in Ireland. He did not think,
therefore, that the fearful state of Ireland was in any
way to be . attributed to the non-existance of a
poor-law in Ireland similar to the English poor-law.
His Hon. Friend (Nil.. S. O'Brien) wished to know what he
had done when the poor-houses were crowded with poor.
They acted on the principle of entrusting the relief of the
poor to the local authorities—( Hear )—instead of undertaking
upon themselves the whole machinery of doling out food to
the people
through the hands of Government officers. But
they instructed the relief committees to exert themselves to the
utmost to; raise money for the relief of the poor, and informed
them that the Government would assist them with grants.
And here he would pause to assure the House of the great
good that had been effected by those relief committees, the
human misery they had alleviated. He was sure, if it were
in his power to lay a statement before the House of the good
they had effected the House would thank them for what
they had done for the mitigation of the distresses of the
poor. The Government began, when the distress was not so
severe, by granting one-halt of whatever was raised, and 501.
for every 1001. collected, but when the distress increased
they acted upon a more liberal principle, and gave a pound for
every pound raised. The House d.d not hear, and
could not hear, of the multitudes that had been
saved by these committees. He, in common with the other
members of her Majesty's Government, felt deep sorrow that
the famine had committed so much havoc, but when they saw
rich Belgium, France, and Geri egssee suffering from the pres-
sure of famine, he did netsaiptteive that they would
feel surprised that such a countryeas-Ireland,, when it pleased
Providence, bad been similarly/ safilicted. It was
almost impossible for such a - state of things
to be met adequately by Government measures.
There was a retail trade fast springing up in Ireland ; it was
necessary for the welfare of the country that it should
exist, and it would be their duty to foster and encourage
it. But it was utter folly to imagine that they would
be able to interfere with it, and check the price of food. The
relief committees established throughout the coun-
try were doing an incalculable degree of good.
Soup depots had been established in every lo-
cality, and the amount of human suffering relieved
was almost :incredible. Before he sat down he would
refer to one part of her Majesty's Speech upon which
he felt sure the utmost anxiety prevailed—he meant
that part which referred to the state of Ireland.
While famine had desolated Ireland, it could not be denied but
that outrage existed to a considerable extent ; and
s whileta • a the
Government was disposed to meet the fear f
ht I;e' the
things that existed, he warned those who miu
gou' d leave
abettors of the outrages that the Government would
no means untried to secure the tranquillity of the c
s_ ountr
nyw.—ed
( Hear, hear.) The general state of Ireland h
he
an increase of outrages ; but having analysed
o m,
on y.
he found they were mainly attacks
d a rart ian
He was glad to say that the old
prpter
g dim.
outrages had not only not increased, but had actua ll
syed,
n
y
nished ; the spirit of combination had all but cea
gaa d
inst
now there was no difficulty in enforcing the law a
offenders. There was no sympathy with the offenders
--witnesses could easily be found, and the juries-
generally
did their duty.—( Hear, hear. ) Generally through
was as
out Ireland, at the present time, the law .
art of tne
egularly administered as it was in any
pand cheer-
British empire. This, was important a _.
d He
ing in the present state of things in Irelan
made of
would now appeal to the returns which had
been
the crimes committed in Ireland, and, from these 11 e found
that in the month of December, 1845, the burglaries and
highway robberies committed in that country amounted
to eighty, while in December, 1846, they ha
hed ,ed
g
breaeamountin
to the enormous number of 1,383. Now, t
he high
into houses, and the stopping of persons on
t was an
road fot the purpose of taking money from them,
Then
offence quite new in the annals of crime in Irelan
returns,
with regard to agrarian outrages, he found by the s
cm..
that in 1844, the 'number of agrarian' outrage. °
-0 while
milted was 2,486 ; in 1845 they were 1,92 the most
in 1846 they had been reduced to 1,304.
131litch Govern-
particular circumstance of pun was the suport
"who had been
ment had received in the pishment oft hose_ .
c,_
to
escape
guilty of offences hitherto supposed to be most lik II
t ear it had
the penalty of the law. In the autumn of last t a WM..
become the duty of Government to prose.
a,
ers,
shops
bar of persons for breaking into the Dl'
ilty, and were
g,
and stealing the bread; They all pleaded tt
auprisonment,
condemned to the heavy punishment of two years i
ieraao (Mr.
There was another charge which the Hon. t
Ge:alling Parlia-
S. O'Brien) had made of the Government nobouchere)
he (Ittir. La
ment together last autumn. Why, really, _
habit of see-
was in Ireland at that time, and was in the daily
was not one
ing a great number of Irish gentlemen, and there,.i
sake, don't
of them who did not say, "For Heaven
r, yourselves."
call Parliament together, but take the business p 0
sake, call the
One and all of them said, "Do not, for Heavensony unsettle the
Parliament together, that, if you do, you will
Do whatever you
public works which are now being carried onn.
d trust to Parlia-
think right upon your own responsibility,
aerything in Ireland
ment for an indemnity, but do not leave every
for Parliament to
in a state of suspense till the time arrive
be now highly
sanction your measures." It woulds ber Majesty's
improper to advert to those measures
1 before the Parlia-
Government are prepared shortly .
n than the question of
complicated questio
"tted to their con-
ment. A more c
mendot be submi
the condition of Ireland c
the House might entertain of
• Whatever judgment
' Goverument—and he
side ration.
by her MaiestY s t u •
'the course adopted
uld p rea q estion
doubt that they co
Members wouldbring to bear
had no
that Hon.
in a kindly spirit, and
t - feeling or local jealousies—not
upon the dist..
• .ussion no par ) Enaihh, Scotch, or Irish
r they were b.
with the subject in
considering whether
Id deal
t that they would
and right to each and all. The
Members—but just
and intention of what was
eeb,
e people of Ireland had'
nature of the calamity wastes d
to Maim as a right, the assit.t-
a right to ask as a boon,
e British people.—( Hear, hear. )
ante and support of
ththoughont his speech was heard
The Hon. Gentleman,
who'hegallery, then went on to say, that'
with great difficulty in
the lris.
h Members, he did not do so
in speaking thus to „.. He hoped they would justify
in any unfriendly spriest and of the Government, by show-
ing on their part a deter.etent 0 itto .
d which might alleviate the
thing undone, no exerttre.aernd. He was satisfied that they
present condition of 1 1
through Irish co-operation. In
could do nothing 'eve
state that he would
speakingg thus, he might .
which place no
of relief England should
limit on the amount
crisis, but he should be
h a sorry to
afford to Ireland in sue
bich would lead to the belief that
encourage any doctrine
sc
to rely altogether upon
a•tgl Ireland for for the future wasnvin ,
chiluren would not axertath
(Hear, hear.) If their
st injury could not fail to em-
selves manfully, the greate
d call with more • •
be done,
for on whom could Ireland
He
hoped they Justice than
on her own countrymerej
one common • would• come to the
discussion of these matters in
o were '
spirit 'When the
measures of her Majesty's Governmentjudge laid before the
able to how
House they would then befar they would
of Ireland,d 11
an ow far
meet the present exigencies they would
. the condition go towards improving permanently in future of on of that coun-
try by preventing the recurrencec such disasters.
N K then rose. He said—ln
answer to the eloquent speech which had been made by
the Right Hon. Gentleman who had just resumed his seat, he
could assure him, he believed, in the name of all the parties on
that side of the House that it was not their intention, and that
shey had no desire to make Ireland the battle field of party. He
and his friends were deeply sensible, that her Mai„ty,a Minis-
ters had been brought to the government! of Ireland untie
circumstances of peculiar difficulty.—(Hear.) They felt that
they had some share in putting them in possession of the reins of
rich government at a- period of the session, and to shortly
efore this 'calamity came upon Ireland, that they have not.
Ministers,; and to deal leniently with such matters witiiwhicl
had- fair :play in dealing with the difficulties which
upon that country.—(Cheers). And for these press
rea-
sons he felt that it was due from them look
to
an indulgent eye upon the measures of her with
Majesty's
they did not altogether concur. It would be •
quite unneees-
sarrfor him to state that he deeply sympathis d e with the dis-
tresses which had visited Ireland, and that they heartily joined
in; the concern which her Majesty had expressed
hn
rat
"Country, and that they should be prepared to give the calamity
and the measures proposed to relieve it, their earnest attention.
But, at the same time, they should be expected to peal
frankly, and whilst they were not disposed to say

that the Government hal acted unwisely, in not calling Par-
liament together at an earlier period,.or to censure them for
having -over-ridden the law ; they were disposed to say that
the measures which-had-been had recourse to, were not ehose
to which they had agreed.—( Hear, hear.) They had been
told that upwards of .four hundred thousand persons had been
employed in works utterly useless—they had been told by
their Inspector-General (Colonel Douglas) that the only
effect of these works had been to obstruct the public convey-
ances, and that, in consequence of the way in which the
Act had been administered, the people had been with-
drawn from the cultivation of the fields.--(Hear, hear.)
With respect to the supply of food, he could not agree in the
principles of political economy, which had been adopted by
the Right Hon. Gentleman. Ireland was a country where the
people had been accustomed to depend for their subsistence on
potatoes grown within a few yards of their own houses.
When such a calamity overtook the country, it was but reason-
able to expect that the Government would have broken
through its harsh rules of political economy, and taken mea-
sures for supplying the people with food, instead of leaving it
in the hands ef private dealers. The Right Hon. Gentleman
stated that her Maje.ty's Government bad done alt that was
possible under the circumstances. He (Lord G. Bentinck)
did not thick so, when the people had been starved -to
death, and whole districts decimated, it would not satisfy hint
to say, that everything that was possible had been done. He
had a letter in his pocket from the Protestant clergyman of
Skibbereen, which stated that from the Ist of December to the
Ist of January, 140 deaths had taken place in the Skibbereen
workhouse. These poor creatures stated that they had gone in
there that they might die under a roof, and be buried in a
coffin. On one Sunday there were 14 funerals waiting for
burial in the churchyard of that parish ; in the adjoining psi ish
nine were waiting one Sunday ; and in two other parishes, six
were waiting at the same time.—(Hear, hear.) It could not
be said that the people had been supplied with food when such
scenes had occurred. In the barony of Skibbereen, which
contained 140,000 souls, 10,009 persons had perished from
famine.---Ellear, hear.) At the present moment, between
300,000 and 400,000 quarters of wheat were lying at the
three ports of London, Liverpool, and Glasgow ; therefore,
what bad prevented her Majesty's Government from sending
food to the west coast of Ireland to feed the starving people?
(Hear, hear.) In 1831, when Lord Stanley supplied the
people of that country with food, ,he succeeded in keeping
down the prices of food within reasonable rates, and if her
Majesty's Ministers had done the same thing with regard to
Indian meal now, he could not but think that they would have
reduced the enormous profits of the retailers and forestallers,
and would have prevented them from obtaining unduly high
prices. He saw that at the present moment Indian meal was
selling at New York at three shillings a bushel, while in Liver-
pool and Ireland it was selling at 9s. a bushel, and he thought
that the Government might, under the circumstances, have
departed from their rigid notions of political economy, and
have supplied the people of the west coast of Ireland with
the food which they so much needed. Then again
he conceived that if the Ministry had encouraged the landlords
by giving the people employment in the improvement of their
estates, instead of the unproductive public works on which they
had been engaged, that there would have been much snore
benefit than bad been enjoyed from the expenditure of the
money. With respect to the compact that it was said had
been entered into between the agricultural party and the late
Government, he begged to relieve her Majesty's Government
of all doubt upon the subject. If there had been a compact
between the agricultural party and the late Government, it
had been endangered in 1842, and it was broken in 1846 ; and
he begged, therefore, on the part of those with whom he
acted, to repudiate the existence of any such compact now.—
(Cheers.) It was not their intention to oppose any obstacle
in the way of her Majesty's Ministers, in abrogating that por-
tion of duty upon corn. When, however, he said that, he did
not mean to admit that the repeal of that 4s. duty would con-
fer any benefit upon the consumer. It would occasion a loss
in the-Exchequer of between 300,000 and 400,0001. But if
the Chancellor of the Exchequer thought that the
revenue was in so flourishing a state as to spare
that sum he (Lord Bentinck) had no ground to complain.
The fact was that the whole of that sum would go into the
pocket of those corn merchants and forestallers of whom the
people of Ireland had such just reason to complain—(Cheers)
—or into the pockets of American merchants and agriculturists.
At New York the price of wheat was 405., and at Liverpool
it was 80s., and it was into the pockets of those who were
making these enormous profits that the Government proposed
to put this extra amount of 4s. a quarter duty. He thought a
better course would have been to have kept the 4s. duty and to
have taken the product of it to feed the Irish people. With
reference to the navigation laws he would not oppose any tem-
porary suspension of them. There was one course yet open
for the Government to adopt, which was this ;—there were
eight line-of-battle ships, measuring each about 2,500 tons,
and capable of carrying at least 2,0e0 tons of corn, and he
had been informed on the authority of an able seaman
in the British service that if the Government would give
him a commission, in little more than twenty-four hours lie
would take out the gun?, hatter down the boards, and caulk
the vessels, and go with them to the United States, and before
ten weeks had elapsed he would come back with 80,000 quar-
ters of corn. He was informed her Majesty's Ministers ha.l
already employed, if the statements in the newspapers were
true, 84 ships, measuring 37,000 tons. But when they saw
that there was little or no grain in the country, and that the
people could not get what there was, because the corn mer-
chants would not sell it at a reasonable price, nothing ap-
peared to him so simple a remedy for the evil, as for her
Majesty's Ministers to employ their line-of-battle ships
now that all danger of war was at an end, and the Montpen-
sier marriage had been rettled.—(Hear, hear.) Eighty thou-
sand quarters of corn by the ships making four voyages, which
might be done before the next harvest could be thus procured
for the relief of Ireland. At that moment there were in bond
and in stock between 30,000 and 40,000 quarters of eome
kinds of grain in the warehouses of London, Liverpool, and
Edinburgh and Glasgow, which, if sold, through the interven-
tion of the Government would no doubt lead to the redaction
of the price of grain and bring food within the reach of the
poor. He would not, however, second the Hon. Member for
Limerick in any impeachment of the Government. He would
now pass on to treat the other matters of her Majesty's
Speech. It was a matter of the greatest regret to the
1 country at large, that the recent intercourse—the recent
policy of the Noble Lord with the King of the French, ha.,l
been on bad terms, with whom it was of the highest
importance to this country to be on friendly terms. He was
glad to find the Noble Lord had protested against the Mont-
pensier marriage, and that the intercourse had now sof!ened
Clown to the correspondence he had seen in the newspapers.
He for one did not believe that the English people took any
interest in this Montpensier affair. The English sym-
pathies did not tend that way. If the conduct of Austria wls
a manifest violation of the treaty of Vienna, what he should
like to ask was the severance of Belgium from Holland ? If
the Cracow business was an infer ction of the treaty, the treaty of
Vienna was torn to atoms when this country agreed to thesepa-
ration of those countries ; and when England sent her line-
of-battle-ships to blockade the coast of Holland whilst the
French were engaged in cannonading the walls of Antwerp.
It was not. for him to enter more fully into the merits of the
case. He, for one, could not so deeply sympathise with the
people of Cracow, and he believed, that if the truth were
known, that the people of Cracow—the well disposed, the
loyal people, and those who wished for peace, are greatly de-
lighted with this incorporation with a power'ul ally. Hon.
Gentlemen might smile, but' he believed that it would prove
greatly for the advantage of that country, which now, for the
last sixteen years, had been in a state of continual alarm, and
however strongly the press of foreign countries might write,
the effect appears to be this, that the news of the incorpora-
tion was received by the people of Cracow with Sc.
clamation and general illumination. With respect
to the other part of her Majesty's Speech, he
trusted that the measures imposed by the Ministers
capital
epioteoamri
wployleadebnet. employmento
in-
duced would fully equal the emergency. Respecting the other mea-
sures that the Government intendedproposing,he hoped that they
must
be b
in eb syjEfrsesoulmacnhed
great.a l t naturewm aes as ssnutorote , encourage
yc
loanubhroaiuge
rhe
oet
rh,a
capitalwotl
taxes that Ireland was to be regenerated—( Hear, hear)—it
wuotitulda,luaatan
evilthe
to pour into the country. He hoped the ,measures
(Cheers.) But the Rieht Hon.
would be such as would be entitled to his support ; but
gaveared that notice
the calamity tia
hwe a s
if the Government did not introduce such a measure,
earliest opportunity bring
,forward a large and comprehensive
measure for that purpose.--
affecting Ireland ; it was an imperial calamity, to which the
aid of all parties in the empire should be diverted. He (Lord
Geo. Bentinck) concurred in that sentiment. Her Majesty's
tGheenntlembaen feared
Government would have their (the protectionists)
in assisting the landlords of that country in support
the evil that had overtaken them.— (Hear; meetingii
If they came down to that House on a justification of etahrei)r
employment of the Irish people in the extremity of distress
on unproductive works, he believed they would have the as-
sistance of the party with whom he acted ; but, at the same
t me, he thought it but right to state that this was an exception
to the rule, and that Irish property, of one description ad
another, should be found to maintain the Irish poor. They
thought it hard that the Parliament or the Government of
England should step in and say you shall employ the people—
you'
shall feed the people, while they are engaged on works that
will make no return of food.
Mr. ROEBUCK wished to - • -
which glee expression to a few words
he thought would be of service to the House and the
country. He deeply sympathised in the miseries of the people
of Ireland. Not having heard any explanation
y from the Noble
Lord or his
colleagues, he warned the House against the danger
of altering that which shall be a mere temporary expedient into
a permanent mischief for the country. Ile was quite aware
that the sympathies of the people might be appealed to on their
behalf. He knew what it was to come begging from Ireland.
Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN—Oh, oh.
Mr. ROEBUCK—Yes, and he said it advisedly, and before
he was done he would illustrate his position by many illustrious
examples. He gave great credit to the measures of the Right
Hon. Baronet opposite (Sir R.Peel), for the measures which
he, had adopted to meet the case of Ireland while at the head
of the Administration. But there was a mischief attending
all those measures. He (Mr. Roebuck) contended that no
Government could propose to itself the task of feeding the
people. The legitimate consequence of not admitting the
force of this axiom was a fruitful source of all that cant de-
tailed in the newspapers which told them that the people had a
right to labour and to provisions. He denied both propositions.
They could not as a Government provide labour for the people,
or pretend to pay them for it. They had it in history that the
aristocracy of Rome paid the people ' • and what was the con-
sequence of they adoption of such a measure? Ruin was
thou, and ever would be, the inevitable consequence.
Heenould not help pointing out the affliction which would be
brought upon this country if we were to pay. the Irish people.
He eras aware thitt in doing so he should bring harsh express•
sionsl upon himself, but, as a duty to the people of England
whom he represented, he was prepared to meet the obloquy
which would this attach to him, and to say that the people of
Irels;nd should not be paid at the expense of the people of
England. For.one year, or for any specified period, he would
cont ibute all he possessed to maintain the people of Ireland
for that space, but it was a permanency that they had now to
see . Last year they anticipated the famine, and the Right
Horse Baronet (Sir R. Peel) to whom he begged to express
his gratitude, did all he could to prevent the mischiefs which
might accrue from that famine. It had come again this year,
and , it was
aggravated because of the knowledge that
England would provide food for every brawling
demagogue who wanted to Enlad would conic exacerbateforward
the misery of
England his country. It was known that g „
to meet any
now as she haddone, and England was p.epare
d
temporary nature, but he protested
possible contingency of a temp
against a permanent provision for the lrishpeople. And now
a word about Irish landlords. He had no doubt that what he
him.
Let not
bitter feelings against
might say would excite be at all hurt at the notion.
his Hon. Friend (Mr. Bernal)
(Mr. Bernal made some observation
landlord of a sudden.—
(latighter.) Those, which did not reach the
gallery.) That
was;i aclu Ithe Hen. Gentleman with great cm.
phasis, pointing towardssa I\lr. Bernal—those were the Irish
landlords for whom the British Parliament had been legislating
They had been legislating against
for the last 300 years.
people of Ireland, and for their B
own personal purposes. The
landlords of Ireland, with the aid of the tans aParliament,
inflicted great mischief on the people of that country. The
,
on his estate fit only for paupers
Irish landlord built cote ges
er centage from the rent of
that he might get a p
in order law in Ireland he would not
If there were a proper poor
them.lrish landlord did not do ibis,
do so. Be had been told that the
he had done it, and built house upon . house for a
but , . whom he had done nothing. He had
paupe' r population for
ou c
r .e of ommons, and all sort of
been legislated for by the
s li. b Act of Parliament.
• leges had been granted to is y
privileges)

But he had taken advantage of all that had been done for him,
and had reduced the people of Ireland, by listening to their
cravings foreland, to a paupered population, spreading over the
_whole land. :After centraties_ole legielationemmkeeae thee Cone
dition of the peop'e of Ireland.. He would ask the people of
England if they were prepared, not only to maintain the land-
lords of Ireland, as well as their paupers, that they had
created. He would. say, that it was the duty of the people
of England, and, he would add, the representatives of the
people of England, to insist that the landlords of Ireland should
maintain the people of that country. He was prepared to vote
for the people of Ireland the fullest equality of rights and lawi
and to sanction the Government in every endeavour. o secure
the peace and welfare of Ireland. If the House of Commons'
was prepared to give them foil and equal freedom, and allow
them, if they desired it, to govern themselves, he would be
quite reconciled. But he would not go beyond this. But he
could tell the landlords Lf Ireland how he would be prepared.
to act. They were goitig.to revise the Poor-law. Now there
was a clause which limited the operation of the Statute to
England and Wales. He would simply alter it to ray, F,eg.
land, Wales, and also Ireland." That ,was:-all he 'nerelcl ask to
be dorfe.—( Heir, hear). He would base thiS. Act, of j
which they had heard so much .l .:w of Eli-
wabeth—extended to Ireland.---(Cries of Hear, hear.") I
He would even be prepared to' give the people of Ireland the
same number of representatives RS England—( Hear, hear)—
he meant the same number in proportion to the population ;
but he would also at the same time extend to them the same
taxation.—(Hear, hear.) He would have no reservation
wheu this were done ; he would settle with the people of Ire-
land, but he was not prepared to support any measure that
would tax the hard-working, peace-loving, law-obeying
people of England in support of a rude system of anarchy, in
that which was called the sister kingdom.---(llear, hear.)
It had been stated by an Irish representative the other day
that the support proposed to be given to Ireland was to buy
Protestants in that country. Such was the way in which the
exertions of this country had been treated. Ireland wanted a
representative—a man that really understood her in-
terests, and was disposed to promote her welfare—
(Hear, hear)—not a man who was actuated by feelings
of personal interests, of personal pelf, and of party ascendancy,
and to merge them all in advancing the interests of the people
of Ireland. They had not got such a man as the wants of
Ireland required, but they had got a man who had done every-
thing in his power to exaggerate the prejudice; and excite the ,
passions of his countrymen.—(Hear, hear.) It was such a
man that presumed to be the representative of the people;
though he did not think he reflected aright the character of
Irishmen,' for he (Mr. Roebuck) considered those in the
union an honest people.—( Hear, hear.) But he wanted to
hear from the Government what they might expect to follow
hereafter. Was this system of relief to last for ever?.
Because an evil has afflicted Ireland, .are 8,000,000 to come
crawling beggars craving the support of the people of
England, and exercise no energy and ability iu order to do
something for themselves? From beginning to the end
there was nothing but a cry of sympathy for the
charity of the people of England. England was Ike
a benevolent lady in a parish, the policy she was pursuing
created around her a host of paupers.—( Hear, hear.) They
could not go beyond the passing benevolence they had hitherto
been in the habit of manifesting. To maintain eight millions
of people was totally impossible. He called on the Noble Lord
at the head of the Government to show how it was possible to
maintain eight millions of people by any Government regula-
tions. The great moving principle of the social system was
private, individual interest, and if they dislocated the machines
it would be impossible for society to go on.—( Hear, hear.)
He called on the Noble Lord not to yield to the clamour of
his Irish supporter', but to legislate for the people
of three kingdomseand not for the advantage of one, and let
him stand out and support the great principle that the people
to be maintained, must maintain themselves.—( Hear, hear.)
If he departed from this rule, there would be no limit to the
dire calamities that would ensue. He knew how he would be
met by Irish Members—he would be told of starving men, and
of women and children dying from want of food. He did not
require to be told of these things to excite his commisseration
—he knew it all; and he traced it all to the conduct of the
Irish landlord himself; abetted, no doubt, as he had
been by the Parliament of England by the course of
Legislature it had pursued. But he (Mr. Roebuck)
would give the Irish people an English poor-
law, and give them equal laws and privileges. He was quite
prepared for the consequences of this step. The Irish landlords
had their estates deeply mortgaged, and the consequence
would be that nine out of every ten of them would be swept
out. —(Hear, hear.) But the mortgagees would have to step
in and take all the consequences of their position. They had
power to take the burdens upon themselves, and to submit to
the same arrangements as the English landlords. This was
all he would say to the H 01132 and the Noble Lord, on the mea-
sures of relief proposed by the Government. As to the tempo-
rary measure of opening the ports he-was prepared to support it,
only it ought to have been done two months ago. He did not
think it would do much, if any goad now, but he was willing
to support it now in order to express this sympathy with the
people of Ireland, though he had none with the landlords. He
did not believe that the opening of the ports would increase the
supply of grain.—( Hear, hear) He did not think there was
much surplus corn to be foufid anywhere either in Europe or
America. Neither did he think that much good would arise
from allowing the use of sugar and molasses in breweries and
distilleries, though he would not object to the measure, as he
was of opinion that the rise of these articles in the manner
named, should be allowed at all times. But when he asked
what they intended to do for Ireland, he could get no satisfac-
tory explanation. The Noble Lord who last addressed them
(Lord George Bentinck), spoke of a grand comprehensive
scheme which he bad in view. He (Mr. Roebuck) was
excited when the Noble Lord thus spoke. He expected to
hear some great plan in connexion with which the
Noble Lord was about - to come forward as the
regenerator of his - country. He certainly expected to
hear of some grand panacea, some great discovery like the
gun-cotton, but patiently and intently as he had listened, he
had heard nothing that he could understand as to the course
he proposed. He -hoped that the next time, when the Noble
Lord got up to criticise others he would condescend to en-
lighten them on his new plan—what he intended proposing
should he become the Chancellor of the Exchequer.—(Loud
cries of " Hear, hear.") He (Mr. Roebuck) had been much
disappointed: he had heard no proposition to meet the
starving condition of the people o: Ireland, come from
the Noble Lord.—(llear, hear ) He was in a different
position to the Noble Lord. lie represented no party, whereas
the Noble Lord did. The Noble Lord was at the head of a
party in the House ; certainly not a powerful party, yet still
a party ; and he (Mr. Roebuck ), therefore, did think that it
was the duty of the Noble Lord to explain his scheme what he
would be prepared to do, were be called in to be the state
physician.—( Laughter.) He was not yet called in, and if he
(Mr. Roebuck) were allowed to prophecy, he was not likely
to be. Still, he should have told the House what
his grand panacea was to be.—( Hear, hear.) Be
did not expect much from that quarter, and he
would now address himself to the establi,hed parties
in the House, to the parties raaded by the Noble Lord and the
Right Hon. Baronet. Ile hoped that no Ministry would be
led away by the mischievous belief that it was possible for Go.
vernment to frame measures to maintain the people. The
business of Government was the protection of life and pro-
perty, and the rest should be left to private enterprise. If
they transgressed this rule, mischief must he the inevitable re-
sult, and Ireland would continue as it had hitherto been, the
curse of England. He believed that if they were to consider
their policy, and to frame their Acts as statesmen, they would
do all that it lay in their power to do, and all that as statesmen
they were called upon to do ; and with this remark he wculd
take leave of this part of the subject, and turn to another, en
which he was desirous of expressing his opinion. And he did
this now, as he was aware that an explanation was hereafter to
be made by the Ministers of the Crown, and he did not wish to
mix himself up with the dispute which that explanation would
be sure to excite. - He - took it, that to p. ezerve
peace, was of the greatest moment not only to -England,
but to all the world, and his desire, therefore, was
that peace might be preserved with France, but with
all the nations of the earth, and he therefore trusted that no
man, to serve any idle purposes of his own, would disturb the
peace of the world. It was evident that he was referring to
the late transaction) in Spain respecting the marriages of two
young ladies—the Queen of that country and her sister, the
Infanta. With that matter,- as he took it, they, as English
politicians, had nothing to do; but he regretted to find that
the Noble Lord the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs had
thought proper to interfere. He trusted, however, that by
recalling his Lordshie's attention to the true objects of political
controversy, that the mischief would be obviated. He would
remind him, therefore, that, as statesmen, they had nothing
whatever to do with the correspondence that might have ema-
nated • from the Chateau d'Eu. They had nothing to do with
persons; all they had to do with was that which had passed
between the Ministers of one country and another ; nor did he
consider that the private feelings of Ministers should interfere
in the settlement of national questions. He did not blame the
present Government, or desire that the Ministers of the
Crown should take notice of these matters ; but still he felt
bound to call their attention to the constitutional rights of
Europe, and, in doing this, he would repeat that he
conceived that, as politicians, they had nothing whatever to do
with the private correspondence of private individuals. In
making these observations he wished it to be understood that
he did not make them under the impulse of those peculiar
principles respecting monarchical institutions which he -was
supposed to hold.—( Hear, hear.) The sentiments he was
uttering were spoken as the sentiments of a monarchical states-
man. It appeared that the Noble Lord at the head of the
Foreign Department had taken some umbrage at the marriage
which had been contracted by the. Infanta of Spain with the
Duke :of Mentpensier, and a long correspondence had been
laid ma the table upon that subject and the marriage of her
sister, the Queen of Spain. He did not wish to be a critic,
bit he must say that nothing could be more cumbersome,
queer, or unsightly, or give greater evidence of
an unpractised hand than that correspondence.—(Laugh-
ter.) He did not wish to be a critic of words,
but a critic of fact.—( Renews d laughter.) It appeared that
the Noble Lord, from some small pique of his.own, objected to
the succession of the issue of the marriage of the Intanta of
Spain with the Duke of Montpensier. lie did not exactly see
the necessity or the policy of discussing the marriage of a young
prince of twenty-six, or its issue, by a person of the grave
appearance of his Lordship. He thought it rather out of
place.—(Laughter.) He trusted that the Noble Lord would
not suffer any private pique or personal umbrage to interfere
with his duties as a Minister of the Crown. The Noble Lord
depended on the peace of Utrecht. But what was the effect of
the peace of Utrecht? He denied that it in any way effected
the case on the present occasion. By that treaty the Duke of
Orleans and the Duke de Berri had-Severally renounced for
themselves and their successors the title to the Crown of Spain.
Bolingbroke was at that time our physician, and M. Toussin
acted for France, and at that time Bolingbroke had insisted on
this particular article of the treaty. To this Toussin had ob-
jected, but at length told Bolingbroke he might take it, for the
two Dukes could not bind their successors. This was an evident
truism, but the Noble Lord seemed to have forgotten that
maxim so useful in private as well as 'in übltic
_ff.
been
that " sufficient for the day is the evil thereof,"b buehwdasb
willing to excite a disturbance where no disturbance
ne-
cessary. It appeared that the "Noble Lord felt thatoco
h he ef
thathad
been done, and he (Mr. Roebuck)
poor te
opinion. But the great offender was DI.
Noble Lord could cot touch Guizot, and so upon .
fellGujz°t andthe
pr.ncesses of Spain. Even if the Noble Lord were right, cir-
cumstances were so changed that the treaty was quite inope-
rative. At the time that treaty was made there was a Ger-
manic empire, but there was no King of Bavaria, no
King of Greece, no King of Belgium, and even no
King of the French. Thus the state of Europe
,had
been entirely altered, and all the most distinguished writers
on international law, had agreed that a war had always annulled
a treaty, and that it had become inoperative unless specially
renewed, and that, too, in specific terms, for general terms
would not answer the purpose. The Noble Lord might have
recollected that a breach of this treaty, as he understood it,
had been committed by Louis XV., who married the Infanta of
Spain, and even by the present King of the French, who mar-
ried a Princess of Sicily, both being descendants of the
con-
tracting parties to the treaty of Utrecht. Again he would
simply call to their minds the circumstances which occurred-
when Louis XIV. attempted to interfere with the succession to
the English throne. On that occasion the people rose as one
man, and he trusted those circumstances would prevent any.
mischievous intermeddling—any personal pique, from breaking"
the peace of the world.. He would sit don by merely express-
ing a hope that e Parliament would interfere to preventy the penile
of England from being burdened for the support of the Irish
poor, or the peace of the world 'from being disturbed by any
small minded-pique of the Noble
.Lord.
Airji. GRATTAN said that the Hon, Member had said

that he had given up sarcasm and had taken to satire, but he
should recollect that oiliness of language, and silkiness of ex-
pression, would not answer for soundness of argument, and he
should mutation Ahat,gy_e_u_lhe,p_o_lish_ofea shield would be_ lost
when oil and vinegar dropped upon it. The Hon.
_Gentleman
had styled the Irish landlords as hee;zars, but they only de..
H
manded justice. The, an: Member rfor Bath had alluded to
history, and the King of Franee, as he called him,- tad he'read
the speech of that King? if he had, he would see that' the
French Government, although pot feeding the
_population, had
taken care to obtain astipply of food fur the people item the .
ports of Odessa, and other parts where corn was to he obtained.
Why was it that the Government of this country had riot, also,
taken the same step with regard, to the purchase of food. In
the port of Odessa there was. l30,1)90 quarters of-wheat lett
behind by the French, why was it that there were only six
British vessels in that port? It was a -gross neglect upon the
part of the .Government; There
.was also . plenty of corn at
New York waiting "forrships, none were to be obtained., The
Government had their experimental Beet sailing about, and
their pennons floating with every breeze, why dad thee -dot.
freight them with the precious cargoes of food for the suffering
people. GoVernnient had proposed to admit molasses for the
purposes of distillation, why did - they not Couple
with.. that iiivai•ure aprohibition to use lnrley ? - The Hon.
Member for Bath had thought fit, to attack the Hon. Member
for Madill, who was absent ; 'he (Mr. Grattar)'had no doubt'
that he would be able to defend hitnsdf from the charge&
brought against him: Ile would, however, tell the Hon.
Member for Bath that there was a great party in Ireland, who
were banded together to remove the cause of universal misery
and distress which had sunk all classes, and demoralised the
country; and while we are engaged in this noble cause we
regret to find Hon. Gentlemen, who, like the Hon. Member
for Bath, came like an evil spirit to blast. all 0-eir endeavours,
and to sour dissension among their ranks by the introduction of
angry topics of religious differences. tie trusted that the
Hon. Member for Dublin would let his constituents know that
the Irish Members, as u body, were all agreed that they would
not follow the advice, and least of all the example, of the Hon.
Member for Bath ; and that all considerations of party are
lost in the great national calamity.—(Cheers.) As
an Irish Member he deprecated the Government of his
country ou principles of political ceonemy, he flung such prin-
ciples to the wind When starvation and death were staring
the people in the •face, were they to die upon principles of
political economy.? The commissariat officers had become
embued with those principles, and had gone so far as to distri-
bute quotations from Atiara.Smith and from the Bible. The
letters of Mr. Trevellian were better adapted for sore of
Scott's historical romances than for the Government of any
nation. The employment which the Government had given
under the Labour-rate Act was a mockery. In the county of
Mayo the wages of the labourer was only 4d. a day, and meal
was now 3s. Sd. per stone—a quantity equivalent to the sup-
port of a family fur two days. The Government, by their
acts, were employing officers of the army in distributing a
halfpennyworth of bread and some treacle to the poor unfor-
tunate devils who were starving in Ireland. He hoped, if the
union was to continue, that it would not simply be a federal or
a parchment union, but a union of sentiment, having for its
object the promotion of the benefit of the whole nation.
Mr. D. BROWNE said he should not have risen to address
the house but for the speech of the Hon. Member for Bath,
who bad given way to the ascerbity of his waspish-disposition,
and maligned the landlords of Ireland. He trusted, however,
that his sentiments would not be responded to by any lion.
Member, so that Ireland might not have that addition to her
present affliction: The Hon. Member for Bath had reproached
the Irish landlords with being beggars. But if they were beg-
gars, they had been reduced to their present condition in con-
sequence of the evil government of their country by the
English Parliament, and if they would restore to
the people of Ireland their own native Legislature, and those
funds which they had contributed towards the liquidation of the
national debt of England, they would be ready to provide out
of those funds for the present contingency, and place Ireland
in a position which would prevent any English legislator from
stating that they were obliged to approach the Parliament in an
attitude of supplication. He was sorry that the Hon. Member
for Limerick (Mr. S. O'Brien) had disturbed the unanimity
which had subsisted between the friends of Ireland ;
' but ihe trusted that neither the Government nor
the Noble Lord at its head, nor the party of
which the Noble Lord opposite (Lord G. Bentinck)
was also the head, nor the party represented by the Hon. Ba-
ronet the .Member for Tamworth would join in the senti-
ment—that Ireland was a curse to this country.—( Hear.) He
agreed in one part of the argument of the Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. S. O'Brien), namely, that the Government ought to
have called the Parliament together two or three months ago,
to consider the state of Ireland ; for, although the means
within the adoption of the Government might last year have been
sufficient to meet the contingency, it wes insufficient at the
present period. There must, however, be energy against the
landed gcntry‘of Ireland. They must devote some of their
large rentals to stimulate the industry of the people
by -providing for their profitable employment—( Hear,
hear) and the first act passed by the British
Legislature with respect to Ireland, ought to be one
entitling a right of the tenants to relief from the landowners,
on whose property they lived. It was the hest tax he thought
which could be imposed upon the landed proprietary, but in-
dependently of this he admitted that at this time there was
occasion fur the Government to extend a helping hand to
1 Ireland.

Mr. BEBNAL OSBORNE wished, as a landlord, to ad-
dress a few observations to the House, but in the outset he
wished to warn Irish Members that if they took the Hon.
Member for Bath to their bosom they would find him like the
" toad in the ear of Eve"— (Laughter)—and although the
Hon. Member for Mayo (Mr. D. Browne) deprecated the at-
-tack of the lion. Member for Bath, he followed up his state-
merit,
by adding, that the landlords of Ireland had neglected
their duty. .11e (Mr. B. Osborne) had dohe his best to
mould his conduct like that of. his neighbours.
Mr. D. BROWNE said he spoke of the past.
Mr. B. OSBORNE thought it unnecessary to refer to the
conduct of Irish Members during the past. They were an im-
proving body, which would be proved if the Hon. Gentleman
came to move for an account of the many acres of turnips
raised, the number of duels fought, and the number of ploughs
set to work in the county of Alayo.—(hear, and laughter.)
They bad the prosperity of their county at heart. The speech
of the Queen, which would be transmitted to Ireland, by the •
next post, was certainly of a cheering character, as they
were told that disorder had been suppressed by the military
and the police ; whereas Ireland was like a beleagured city
without food, which, he apprehended, charity of the benevolent
could not adequately have provided against. These outrages
were only to be repressed by pouring in fend. The Chancellor
of the Exchequer had stated yellow meal could be reduced to
10d. per stone, but yet it was sellieg in Ireland at 2s. GI and
2s. 10d. per stone. He was at a loss to know why the Noble
Lord did not issue an order in Council four months ago sus-
pending the corn-laws. It was too late to open the ports now,
as France had anticipated them. It was too late to:dee EISI..id
January, when the people were starving. Something ovgtst t 9 .
be done immediately to pour food into Ireland, or,',
land would become one vast charnel-house. The Desd
of Cashel had stated that 5,C00 had died from starvation.
The Speech he considered was not a speech conveying the real
sentiments of the Government, but of some political recusants
in the Treasury who pulled the strings.
Sir R. ING-LIS said that he was anxious to say a few words
in answer to tl:e speech of the lion. Member who had lately
addressed the House.' He did so, because he solemnly be-
lieved that the charge made against his friend, Mr. Treveyllan,.
was one which proceeded from total ignorance upon the sub-
ject. Mr. Treveyllan had been described as inimical to Ire-
land. Now, to his (Sir It. Inglis) certain knowldge, it he had
a fault it was that of being too partial to that country.—(hear.)
That gentleman had taken upon himself, not only official, but
personal duties in order the better to promote those measurea .
which were considered of a beneficial character.—( Hear.)
Thp Hon. Member for Mayo began to speak with some appre-
hension that the expression of Ireland's being a curse to Eng-
land, would have a most injurious effect upon the people of
that country, and he appealed to my Noble Friend the Member
for Lynn, and my Hon. Friend the Member for Tamworth,
and my Noble Friend the Prime Minister, and hoped that
they would not concur in such a sentiment. Ills own memory
did. not inform him that such an expression was made use of,
and he had asked three Hon. Members their recollection of the
fac , and they all agreed with his.
i o,
11. Ir. ,D. lIR6WNE.—You misunderstand me. I totally
de y it.
Sir R. INGLIS.—WeII then we must leave the differenog
to be settled elseWhere.—(Great laughter.) The Hon. Gen-
tleman then continued, it certainly was not the most courteous
method of contradicting him which had been taken; for it was ' -.-
open to the Member for Mayo, when he had concluded, to
make a formal disavowal. And -he protested against the use
of such intemperate language.—( Hear, hear.) He hcped that
the Hon. Member for the University of Dublin, and the
Member for Meath, did not represent the concentrated wisdom
of the united Irish party, fcr he could not hope that much
good would result from such a union.—( Hear, hear.) lie
entirely deprecated the principle upon which this claim for Irish
relief was advocated. It was a claim made upon their justice,
and' not upon their sympathy, it was a claim of right, and not
of Compassion, it is a claim of so much debt of pounds, shillings,
and pence, and not of charity. He denied the claim
thus made altogether, while he would cordially
recognise it, if it - were made on the principle
of Christian feeling. The lion. Member for Bath bad made
a speech, which was full of his accustomed sarcasm and acute
reasoning, which, however, in his opinion, was not founded
on the soundest principles. He regarded the claim as a syste-
matic attempt to impose upon the people of England, Wales,
anti Scotland, the exclusive burden of supporting the people of -
Ireland; and his speech served to vary the uniformity of the
dehate,•for the first seven speeches might have adorned the old .
Parliament House of Ireland as a specimen of entire attention
to Irish affair's. Net.one. word had been said of another part
of the empire, which had been 'suffering equally, and with
the most enduring patience.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") ---
He thanked Members on both sides for that cheer, as it re-
cognised the claim of Scotland upon their attention. The
people of that country, it was true, had not a united Scotch
party, they were patient in their own country, and- were not
clamorous out of it—(Hear, hear)—and he trusted that they
would not be forgotten. He fully agreed that the question of
the marriages in Spain was not one in which the Secretary ,
would be able to carry the people of England with him. He
considered that the treaty of Utrecht had been violated, but
its' violation, in his opinion, was not a just cause for involving ,
the people of England in a war. He believed that it was not
the 'intention of any of the contracting parties in thatt
throne, which intention was evident:.;•boerolike
the
that any descendant of Philip the Filth shouldtb
the
everexpsrie s
soti on
expression
the
f
point of a
Philip, who said that that treaty should ,
a nu
ltdhienreinfovroelvhiengc the
needle, eternally fixed in one diree-onn,
at!the same time,
sidered that the Treatyhic
mouldof
wouldUtrechth againar .
abtetslithmajatueeeds,iwwfilatleoeideeuaeniit
(v 4,
ioit:o:,1
idiydait
desnod notono.
tec c
agree
tegropoerni
word
. .
r Lynn that, because illuminations
t of Cracow.
,s3rliwi
uttetir,
tt
it Iyei. i
referencetnN : rbelwetaor ie Governmentme(ti;el;
ajferac,
Austria, with the certainty,
alto, there,
Emperorand t h a to fat
abhlyasdet,itetkhterani°Ptllisaecoetrwo nearest Powers were ready to throw their' .
armies into it, that the people of Cracow were so degraded as
twoh
would,ircehj hadibcey tihonev etrarht
ecarikreeyndeoglfrraeGcliaaondeldoo,n . -He
e trusted that the evils
be
enotdfu r
tnwhehedi
people
0 gpwol
ultimately advance the interests -eeere dwhacocinhoeuavdnitbt,aobarinued: .
their -sufferings in such an admirable manner.—(Cheers.)
Lord JOHN MANNERS ventured to offer a few obser-
vations to the House. He would offer a suggestion or two to' .
her Majesty's Ministers since they were so desirous of bene- '
fiting the people of Ireland, who were suffering so severely
from the misfortunes which had overtaken them. The Go-
vernment proposed to suspend the small duty now levied in
corn, and also to suspend the operation of the navigation
laws. Now he was of opinion that such a course would not
lead to much practical good. It must be known by every
Member of that house that many other states of Europe ,
were suffering from a deficiency of food, and had actually:'.:
prohibited the exportation of corn. He thought the.4i„,
Gevernment of this country ought to have done -,c.
something of a similar kind. Within the last
ten days he had learned that no less than twenty-seven vessels
had been freighted in this country with English corn at the
very time when a great portion of the English people were
suffering from ideficiency. Such a state of things should not
be. permitted to continue. Beyond these observations he
would content himself with calling the attention of the House
to a despatch of Mons. Guizot in reference to the Spanish :
marriage, which was dated Feb. 27, 1846. The despatch was
in reference to the candidates for the banal of the Queen of
Spain, in which it was stated that the Son of Don Carlos was -- )
1 out of the question. In another passage it is further stated :
1 that the French Government had clone everything its