The Sun.
London, England, 1840-06-30 00:00:00

I respect to the taxation clauses, until he saw what would I
be done in the other House. He would not with his
eyes open, encroach upon the privileges of that House
—(Hear, hear)—until he saw what course the Go-
vernment would take. But at the same time he reserved
for himself to determine what course he should take.
ILord BROUGHAM expressed himself much re-
lieved by the•explanation just given by his Noble and
Learned Friend.—(Hear. and a laugh.)
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE protested against
I the injustice of the amendment, which would subject
the towns to a double taxation,—first for their own pur-
poses, through the town councils; and secondly for
county purposes, through the grand jury. There would
however be no objection to bring in a Bill to give the
power of taxation to the municipalities, surrounded
by as many guards as the Noble and Learned Lord
might deem necessary, provided only that they
did not amount to a double taxation. At a time
when the Government were endeavouring to esta-
blish corporations responsible for the administration
of their funds, the Noble and Learned Lord attempted
to create a body corporate in this Blue-coat School re-
sponsible to no man—a body electing each other, and
carefully excluding the public from any protection
against the rest of that body.—(Hear, hear.) He
hoped their Lordships would hesitate before they sent
down to the other House of Parliament a clause
creating a body perfectly irresponsible to any human
creature, in a Bill, the object of which was that all ad-
ministration should be responsible.—(Hear, hear.) To
that clause, therefore, as it stood, he should give his
most unqualified; opposition.—(Hear, hear.) He now
begged to call their Lordships' attention to some
amendments which the Noble and Learned Lord had
studiously avoided bringing under their notice. The
Noble and Learned Lord had introduced a provision
that ten months should elapse after the people had been
assessed before they could enter upon the enjoyment of
their right.—(Cheers.) There was also a clause, which
the House of Commons would never consent to, giving
the Lord Lieutenant the power to tax the muni-
cipalities at his pleasure.—(Hear.) So that while the
mostjealous distrust of these new bodies was professed
power was given to one man, because he was Lord
Lieutenant, to tax every one of these municipalities
without limit. Such a power was never heard of.
(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord could not expect that
the House of Commons would consent to one man
having the power to tax the people, and when they
came to that amendment he should divide and take
the sense of the House upon it.—(Cheers.)
After a few words from Lord IV YNFORD, that
were inaudible in the gallery,
Lord LYNDHURST said the Noble Marquis was
under a mistake in supposing that he (Lord Lyndhurst)
intended to create any irresponsible body. Those
parties would be responsible to the Court of Chancery
for the discharge cf their duty. There was an express
proviso to that effect.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE replied the pro-
viso was that in any case where a poor child was re-
fused admission to a school, the parent of that poor
child might appeal to the Court of Chancery.
Lord REDESDALE observed that the same pro-
vision had been inserted iu the English Municipal Bill,
with regard to the Louth Charity.
Lord LYNDHURST, from his acquaintance with
that part of the country, could state that the business
of the Louth School had been conducted admirably
since the period that clause was introduced.
heir Lordships then resolved themselves into CLm-
mittee.

Clauses 1,2, 3,4, and. 5 were agreed to, with ver-
bal amendments.
On clause 6 being proposed,
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE objected to the
amendment which had been introduced, giving to the
members of union guilds the right to the Parliamentary
franchise. He considered the amendment had bean
introduced for no other reason than to confer upon cer-
tain persons the Par.iamentary franchise, merely be-
cause they were of a particular religion, or entertained
particular opinions. The object of the Bill was to de-
stroy the exclusive diameter of corporations ; and if
their Lordships agreed to this amendment, they might
as well throw the Bill out altagother.
The Earl of V ICKLO\V wished to retain the ex-
isting rights of Parliamentary voters entirely, untouched
by the present Bill ; hut he had been so perplexed by
the opinions given by the two Noble and Learned
Lords upon this subject, that if an amendment were
pressed to a division, he should abstain from voting upon
it.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.)
The LORD CHANCELLOR contended that the
amendment interfered with the principle of the Re-
form Bill.
Lord LYNDHURST submitted that if this amend-
ment were not agreed to a large class of persons would
be most unjustly- deprived of their rights.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE observed that
the way to obviate that injustice would be to extend the
franchise in cities and towns, and instead of raising it to
10/, to lower it to 3/. He opposed the amendment
because it would confer an exclusive right upon exclu-
sive persons.
The Marquis of NORMANBY said that the ad-
missions to guilds were always of an exclusive cha-
racter.

Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the
Committee divided when there appeared,
N.)r-Contents
Contents
Attj iri'y far the Amendaier t —44
The clause as amended was then ordered to stand part
Di the Bill.
On clause 8 being read, which authorised the Town
Clerk to make out a freeman's roll,
Lord LYNDHURST said that as the clause at
present stood, it would effect an alteration in the Par-
liamentary franchise, which was never contemplated.
He moved that the clause be amended by inserting the
word " servitude."
The LORD CHANCELLOR contended that the
clause merely corrected an error in the Irish Reform
Act, hut it did not take away any right which previously
existed.
The Eirl of WICKLOW deprecated any discus-
sion upon the errors in the Irish Reform Act. If any
mistakes lead been com-nitted in that Act, let them
bring in a all to amend it, as they had done with re-
gard to many other measures.
The amendment was then agreed to, and the clause,
as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
On clause 9 being rend,
Lord LYNDHURST moved an amendment, the
object of which was to give the freeman a right of
appeal to the Judge of Assize.
'The LORD CHANCELLOR could not agree to
that proposition.
Lord DENMA N thought the amendment very ob-
jectionable, and suggested that there should be a sum-
mary appeal to the Court of Queen's Bench.
Lord BROUGHAM concurred in the observation
of his Noble and Learned Friend the Chief Justice.
Lord LYNDHURST would have no objection to
postpone the clause for the present.
The clause, as also clause 10, was then postponed.
Clause 11 was agreed to without observation.
On clause 12 being read, which refers to the schedules,
Lord LYNDHURST moved an amendment for the
purpose of including Galway in schedule B.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE supported the
amendment.
The Earl of WICKLOW congratulated her Ma-
jesty's Government on the support of the Neble Mar-
quis, who professed himself a strenuous advocate of the
Bill, and yet would exclude the town with which he was
more immediately connected, from the good govern-
ment which was provided for them under the Bill.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE said the Noble
Lord had, he was sure, unintentionally misrepresented
him. He objected to Galway being included in sche-
dule A, merely because it was at present under the
pro►isions of a Local Act.
The clause as amended was then agreed to.
On clause 14 being read, which empowered a ma-
jority of the inhabitants of any town to apply for a
charter of incorporation,
Lord LYNDHURST moved an amendment to the
effect, that the application be made from a majority of
the inhabitants " rated to the relief of the poor."
The Marquis of NORMANBY objected to the
amendment, inasmuch as it would give a small minority
of the inhabitants a power of taxing the large majority.
The Earl of WICKLOW could assure their Lord-
ships that the rating to the relief of the poor in Ireland
was a mere nothing. He knew many vilages which
contained 3,000 inhabitants, the number required by
the clause, and the great majority of these were
paapers. Now, when the agitators. came among the in-
habitants of such a town or village they would be easily
induced to make application for a charter against the
consent of the wealthy portion of the inhabitants who
would have to pay the taxes.
Lord BROUGHAM said all the applicants could
obtain was a charter, which would enable the wealthy
portion of the inhabitants, who were alone eligible to be
burgesses, to impose taxes upon them.
The Marquis of WESTMEATH said that several
of the houses had been raised, in order to qualify the
holders.

The Earl of WICKLOW thought it would be
better to reject the clause altogether ; and be should
therefore more its rejection.
Lord ABINGER thought the amendment of his
Noble and Learned Friend would bring it to precisely
what the Noble Marquis (Normanby) desired.
The Earl of WICKLOW would postpone his mo-
tion for the rejection of the clause, and give notice
that he should move its rejection on the bringing up
the Report.
The amendment was then agreed to, and the clause,
as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 19, 20, 21, 22, were agreed to.
Clauses 23, 24, and 25, were omitted.
Clause 26 was postponed.
On clause :44 (the qualification clause) being proposed,
Lord LYNDHURST said that he proposed to
,Imend this clause by making the qualification ze,:eral in
all towns as a 101. qualification.
Lord STUART DE DECIES said that the oppo.
sition to this clause afforded a very melancholy proof