The Sun.
London, England, 1847-12-09 00:00:00

REVENUE.

Mr. HUME inquired if the Government would
object to the following motion : For a Select Commit-
tee, to inquire into the state of the public income and
expenditure of the United Kingdom ; to examine
the public revenue, under it separate heads, as re-
gards the assessment, collection, custody, and the
establishments employed for the same, and to re-
port whether any and what alteration or re-
peal can be made under any of these heads, with
benefit to the public revenue; also, to examine into
the public expenditure, under separate heads, and to
consider and report what measures can be adopted for
the relief of the country, by altering or reducing any
portion of the said expenditure, without detriment to
the public service.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, was
directed by Lord John Russell to state that the Go-
vernment could not accede to the motion.
Mr. HUME said he should move it after the
recess,

Mr. ANSTY (postponed his motion for a fort
night.
BANK OF SCOTLAND.

In reply to Mr. J. A. SMITH,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER ex-
plained, that in his speech the other night he did not
mean to convey the impression that the Bank of
Scotland and the majority of Scotch banks had
applied to the Bank of England for loans.
He spoke generally. It was needless to disclaim that
the Bank of Scotland had made such an application.
IRELAND.

Mr. J. O'CONNELL inquired whether the Govern-
ment intended to take any immediate step to
provide employment or food for the people of
Ireland, where the rates wereeinsufficient, and whether
they proposed bringing in a landlord and tenant Bill.
Sir GEORGE GREY replied that the attention
of the Government was closely directed to those
parts.which were impoverished, and they had sufficient
means at command to meet any emergency. It was
not the intention of the Government to propose the
resumption of works and relief.—(Hear.) The
Landlord and Tenant Bill would be introduced as
soon as its provisions had been properly framed. It
had been intended to introduce it and other measures
at the commencement of the usual session.
hence the delay. The Government did not wish to
lay on the table a crude and ill-digested measure.
CRIME AND OUTRAGE (IRELAND) BILL.
On the order of the day being read for the resump-
tion of the debate on this Bill,
Sir G. GREY wished to trespass fora few minutes
on the patience of the House, in order to remove
several misconceptions which had arisen with respect
to a part of the Bill, and in answer to observations
which had been made to him by several
Hon. Members with respect to the Bill. It would
prevent some discussion if those misconceptions were
at once removed, and those observations to which he
had alluded answered. The first point to which he
wished to refer was with respect to the amount of the
increase in the police force of Ireland. On a former
occasion the Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire,
towards the close of the debate, expressed his satisfac-
tion that the state of Ireland was such that the re-
medy proposed by the Goevrnment was to be confined
to an increase of 200 policemen. Considering the
statement which he (Sir G. Grey) had made, he felt
conscious that the error into which the Hon. Mem-
ber had fallen was occasioned by his not having gone
sufficiently into that part of the Bill and the present
state of the law with respect to the police of Ireland.
Had he gone more fully into the subject than
he did, that Hon. Member would not have fallen into
the error which he was conscious he had fallen into.
He (Sir G. Grey) had had several communications
made to him upon the subject of the limit proposed
by the Government, which was to be extended only to
200 men He would take the present opportunity of
stating that under the proposed Bill the limit might
be extended to 1,000 men. The real effect of the
measure would be to remove all the limits whatever,
except that imposed by the necessity of the case.
He would shortly refer to the existing laws on the
subject. By the 6th William IV. chap. 13, the
number of police in all parted Ireland was fixed.
A maximum limit was placed, beyond which they
could not go. There were, however, two modes by
which, under that Ac', the police force could be in•
creased—the first was by the Lord. Lieutenant
at the requisition of a majcrity of the magis-
trates at quarter sessions, stating that the
existing amount of constabulary was insufficient
for the due execution of the law. The second mode
was by the proclamation of the Lord. Lieutenant
stating any distriet to be in a state of disturbance.
By that Act power was given under such circum-
stances, to increase the amount of the constabulary in
such districts by 50 men. By a subsequent Act power
was given to increase the amount by 100 men.
In many cases the police have been increased under
the regulations of the existing laws. With respect
to the expense of the increase, half of it was to be
borne by the barony or district in which the increase
was made, and the other was to become chargable
upon the consolidated fund. By the 6th IVilliarn IV.
power is given to keep a certain reserve force of
police in Dublin as a sort of constabulary derot, from
which they are sent by the Lord-Lieutenant to those
disturbed districts where they may be required. He
hoped that it would be: sufficiently understood that
there was now no limits to be placed upon the amount
of increase in the police force. By the measure
before the House it is prcposed that the whole
charges of the additional police should be borne
by the districts to which the police are sent. By the
Special Constables' Act, 2 and 3 William IV., cap.
108, very useful powers were given for calling into
active exercise those duties which devolved upon the
inhabitants of any district where crime existed, by
calling upon them to aid in the execution of the law.
He could not too strongly express his own opiniun
that gentlemen should avail themselves, as far
as possible, of the provisions of the Act,
and induce the sound population of the
disturbd districts to aid in the suppression
of crime. The only other point to which it was
necessary that he should allude was, that with respect
to accessories, as it had been stated that the Govern-
ment had not taken notice of them. With respect to
accessories after the fact, the notice of his Noble Friend
would be well considered by the Goverment. As to the
question of accessories before the fact, such cases were
under the consideration of the Lord-Lieutenant, and he
(Sir George Grey) had his assurance that he would
not shrink from the performance of his duty.—(Hear,
hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet, after stating
what the law, as it at present existed on this subject,
was, observed that his only object in rising was to
remove the misconception that had arisen upon the
snbject. The Right Hon. Baronet concluded by
moving the second reading of the Bill.
Sir R. PEEL thought it would be much better that
the present Bill should enact what would be the law
after it came into operation, without referring to Acts
of Parliament that were at present in existence.
Sir G. GREY apprehended that the Right Hon.
Baronet referred to the White Boys' Act. He did
not see the necessity of re-enacting the provisi,ns of
that Act.

Mr. J. O'CONNELL did not consider it neces-
sary to go at any length into the objections which he
entertained for this Bill. Not only was it an unjus-
tifiable measure in point of severity, but it cruelly in-
terfered with the liberties of the people of Ireland.
The House, however, had always been indisposed
to act with justice towards Ireland, and this Bill was
nothing more than what was to be expected from it.
The Right Hon. Baronet seemed a little irritated at
the questions which he (Mr. O'Connell) put to him
just before the motion for the second reading of the
Bill, and he 'regretted that they had caused him any
uneasiness. He admitted they were merely repetitions
of questions which he had put upon former occasions,
but he was anxious once more to give Government an
opportunity of setting themselves right with the peo-
ple of Ireland. He did not think, however, that he
should have occasion to trouble the Right Hon. Ba-
ronet again with such questions, for he felt that it
was now the duty of those who took an interst in
the welfare of Ireland to proclaim to her people
that all hope of England ever redressing their griev-
ances was at an end. England had, from the com-
mencement, shown a strong disposition to a et harshly
with the Irish people, and he was afraid it would re-
main so till the end of the chapter. It was hopeless for
Irish Members to expect to he listened to by that House
with attention, and he, therefore, did not think it
necessary to dwell at any length upon the circum-
stances contained in the Bill. No later ago than last
year the Noble Lord at the head of the Government
declared that he was against coercive measures for
Ireland, and he wanted to know what had occurred
since then to render coercion necessary now.
The friends of Ireland might now give up their

" long game," so far as the Government 'was con-
cerned, for they left their appeals unanswered. Was
that the way, if they were in error, to make them think
that they were so, and that they should put their faith
in the present Parliament, and not in one composed
strictly of Irishmen, sitting in Ireland ? Was
that the way to induce the whole people of
tdo4unbgt tli
undoneeexpetdoieenarcryyofththeeirrevpeoawls
?o—f
wthase
iutn
tihoenw,
atyo
Ireland, who had pledged themselves to leave no-
te lead the Irish Members, who bid vowed to