The Sun.
London, England, 1840-07-09 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, TB EIRSDAY, JULY 9, 1840.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMEN T.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, JuLr 8.

The SPEAKER took the Chair shortly before Four
o'Clock.
The amendments of the House of Lords to the Taff
Va'e Railway Bill were agreed to.
On the motion of Lord SANDON the Herculaneum
(Liverpool) Dock Bill was read a third time and passed.
Lord BARRINGTON presented a petition from
the union of Bradford praying that in the Bill for
parochial assessments, unions might not be included.
The Noble Lord also presented a petition from the
Great Western Railway Company against the Bill for
Assessing Railways.
Mr. VLLIERS presented a petition from Worces-
ter, against the Copyright Bill. The Hon. Member
also presented several petitions from different parts of
the country, praying for the repeal of the Corn-laws.
Mr. HANDLEY presented a petition from 700 of
the handloom weavers of Norwich, complaining of dis-
tress arising from the reduced duties upon East India

silk.
Mr. KELLY presented two petitions from Ipswich,
the one against, and the other in favour of the new
Poor Laws.
Mr. Sergeant TALFOURD presented petitions
from Reading in favour of the Copyright Bill—from
Kilbride, praying for a mitigation of the punishment
of Mr. Feargus O'Connor, Mr. John Cleave, and seve-
ral Chartists ; also a petition from Mrs. Ann Carrier
complaining of the treatment to which her husband has
been subjected in Islonmouth gaol.
Mr. GROTE presented a petition from merchants
of London connected with Australia, complaining of
the application of the land fund to purposes other than
that of emigration. He said he would take an oppor-
tunity, upon another day, of calling the attention of the
House to the prayer of the petition.
Mr. M. PHILLIPS presented a petition from the
Chamber of Commerce of Manchester, praying for
an equalisation of the sugar duties.
Mr. Sergeant TALFOURD withdrew the Copy-
right Bill until next Session.
Sir E. WILMOT postponed, until to-merrow, the
Juvenile Offenders' Bill.
Mr. T. DUNCOMBE presented petitions from
Forfar and Glasgow, complaining of the treatment of
political offenders in prison, and praying the House to
address her Majesty to dismiss her Ministers, they not
possessing the confidence of the. country. Also from
Gorbals to the same effect, and several against the Copy-
right Bill.
Colonel SAL \VEY presented a petition from a
practioner in medicine, complaining of the want of pro-
tection in consequence of the self-election of licentiate
bodies throughout the country, and praying for medical
reform.

On the motion of Mr. GREENE, the Goods on
Canals Bill was postponed till this day week.
Captain GORDON presented two petitions from
parishes in the county of Aberdeen in favour of Lord
Aberdeen's Bill.
Mr. HAW ES presented a petition from the church-
wardens and overseers of Lambeth against the prin-
ciple of exempting public companies from payment of
rates.

Mr. VERNON SMITH presented a petition
from the Mayor and Town Council of Northampton
in favour of the importation of free labourers into the
%Vest Indies and British Guiana.
NOTICES OF MOTION.

Mr. F. KELLY gave notice that on Tuesday next
he should move for leave to bring in a Bill to enable
freeman of boroughs to vote in the election of town-
councillors in certain cases.

Mr. GROTE gave notice that on Tuesday next
he should call the attention of the House to a
petition which he had that night presented respecting
the appropriation of lands in New South Wales.
JOHN THOROGOOD.

Mr. T. DUNCOMBE gave notice, that on

the 21st of July he should move an address to the
Crown, praying for the release of John Thorogood from
Chelmsford gaol.
Mr. HUTT gave notice, that on Tuesday he should
call the attention of the Houle to the dues levied by

the King of Denmark on British vessels entering the
Sound.
Mr. BAINES gave notice that to-morrow he should
move for certain returns relative to the commutation of

.-.
tithes, and continuation of former returns, and also that
he should move for a return of the number of prisoners
who had been confined in the Queen's Bench prison
during each year, from 1830 to 1840, with a view of
ascertaining what had been the effect of the law
abolishing imprisonment for debt.
On the motion of Sir THOMAS FREE MANTLE
leave of absence for one month was granted to Mr.
Edward Stanley, and So George Rose.
Mr. ORMSBY GORE moved for certain returns
relating to Holyhead and Port Dynllaen, of which he
had given notico yesterday.
Mr. VERNON SMITH suggested that the Hon.
Gentleman should postpone his motion till to-morrow.
Mr. ORMSBY GORE had yesterday stated his

intention to the on'y Member of the Government whom
he saw in the House. It was not his fault if they did
not attend in their places, and he did not intend to
postpone his motion.
Mr. VERNON SMITH said the Hon. Gentleman
having given notice could not bring it on to-day until
all the Orders of the Day had been disposed of. He
(Mr. Vernon Smith) opposed it, and therefore the
lion. Gentleman could not move for it now as an un-
opposed return.
Mr. ORMSBY GORE would not have the least
objection to postpone his motion till to-morrow if the
Hon. Gentleman wished it. The Hon. Gentleman
then presented a petition, praying the House not to
relax the Standing Orders in favour of the Chester and
Holyhead Railway Bill, which was ordered to be referred
to the Committee on that Bill.
OPIUM IN INDIA.

Lord S A NDON said, although he did not see the
President of the Board of Control in the House, he would
yet propose a question of which he had given notice to
that Right Hon. Gentleman, as lie doubted not but
one of the Honourable East India. Company whom
he saw present would give him an answer. His
question was, whether the East India Company had
taken, or were about to take, any steps for separating
themselves from the growth and cultivation of opium in
the East. Indies.
Mr. HOGG, although he would not take upon him-
self to answer as a representative of the East India
House, would as an individual Director say that no
step had been taken as yet to separate the Company
from the growth of opium in It.dia.—(Hear, hear.)
The question had occupied the most anxious attention
of the Court of Directors, and the Noble Lord
must be aware that it was a question not only
of great interest as regarded the revenue, finances, and
commerce of the country, but also as regarded our con-
nection with the independent powers in India.
Sir STRATFORD CANNING wished to
know, as there were many notices for Friday,
on g)ilog into the Committee of Supply, if it was
really the intention of the Government to bring
on the question of supply on that evening, and if it
would be brought on at an early hour.
Mr. PARKER said there was no doubt but it would
be brought on on Friday.
Mr. LABOUC HERE believed the estimates would
be brought on upon Friday, but the Chancel:or of the E-
xchequer would be in the House in a few minutes, and
would be able to give a positive answer.
Colonel SAL WEY seeing the Under-Secretary of
State for the Home Department in his place, wished
to ask when a return he had moved for on the 10th
of April, of the names and residences of the Justices
of the Peace, members of the Established Church, in
England and Wales, would be laid on the table of that
House.

Mr. FOX MAULE—It wag laid on the table of
the House lust night.
TREATY WITH AUSTRIA.

Mr. LABOUCHERE brought in a Bill for autho-
rizing the ratification of a commercial treaty with
Austria, which was read a first time.
SALE OF BEER.

Mr. PAKINGTON moved the Order of the Day
for the further consideration of the Sale 'f Beer Bill.
Lord SANDON said it now fell to his lot to pro-
pose the clauses of which he had given notice, the object
of which was to prevent the consumption of beer on the
premises in houses hereafter to be licensed, or to be
licensed for the first time, and which may be passed
into the hands of new tenants. They had had the
testimony of men of all parties as to the expe-
diency of extinguishing that class of houses which
authorized the consumption of beer upon the premises.
As evidence of the evils of the beer-shops, he might
refer to what had been stated by the Commissioners
appointed to inquire into the condition of the hand-
loom weavers. The Commissioners there went a
little out of their way, to inquire into the effect
o f the beer-houses. One of those gentlemen said
that thousands o women and children were deprived
of the comforts of life by the temptations of the beer-
shops on the road tf:de. There could be no doubt that
the beer-shops perverted the morals of the working
classes, and with regard to the borough he represented,
the Report of the Watch Committee of that borough
stated that the beer-shops were a great source of crime.
The evils of the present system were, however, so ge-
nerally acknowledged, that he did not deem it necessary
to produce any further evidence on the subject. The real
question was whether the measure of the Hon. Member
for Droitwich would materially tend to mitigate those
evils. He (Lord Sandon) allowed that it might produce
such an effect in the agricultural districts, inasmuch
as the limitation for the renting of houses in places
with a population not exceeding 2,500 inhabitants,
amounted to the high sum of 10/.—(Hear, hear.)
measurtownse
the
eu
limitationbe
tlenn dl ae
dr g w
was fixed at P 2./., at which houses of a very low descrip-
tos me
e tn little towns,
effect, however,
for in theh
descrip-
tion might be rented. Again, in the metropolis the limi-
tation was 15/.. which was an exceedingly small sum.
Was therefor.• of opinion that the mnasurc of his
Honourable Friend would be inefficient to increase

the respectability and diminish the number of t
beer-houses in large towns. But, in addition, it
would give beer-houses a peculiar advantage over the
houses of licensed victuallers, inasmuch as it would not
compel beer-sellers to close their houses until twelve
o'clock, while the licensed victuallers were at present
obliged, in the generality of cases, to close theirs at eleven.
The House would perceive that he had framed the
clause so as to make its operation entirely prospective.
It provided that no person who now had a license should
have it taken from him. He knew his Hon. Friend the
Member for Droitwich would say that it would be diffi-
cult to prevent the consumption of beer on the premises.
It might be very difficult, he acknowledged, to provide
against all innovations, but there was a very strict en-
actment in the 4th and sth of William the Fourth,
against the carrying of beer to neighbouring houses.
He hoped the House would agree to the clause as
Magistrates, clergy, and all classes, even the
poor themselves, were in favour of such an enact-
ment. The Noble Lord concluded by proposing
a clause for preventing the consumption of beer on the
premises, in houses hereafter to be licensed for the first

time, or to new tenants.
Mr. PAK I NGTON had no doubt the intention of the
Noble Lord and himself were the same, viz., to get rid of
the evils of the present system. He could not, however,
agree to the clause proposed by his Noble Friend ; even if
he succeeded in carrying his clause, it would not effect its
object without some very stringent police regu-
lations.—( Hear.) He understood from many Ho-
nourable Members and Magistrates that the houses
where beer was not licensed to be sold upon
the premises were much the worst—(Hear, hear.)
But if this clause would be productive of all the good
which his Noble Friend anticipated, he must ask would
the House agree to it ?—( Hear.) He thought the
House would not agree to a clause of which the effect
would be practically to repeal the present Act.—
(Hear.) He would not risk the success of the measure,
the principle of which the House had assented to, by
agreeing to this clause.
Mr. B. WOOD said the clause applied only to
existing houses ; he thought it would tend much to
settle the question if it were altered so as to be
made applicable to all new houses. Allusion had
been made to the hours now fixed, which in his
opinion would cause a vast deal of difficulty.
He would put it to the Noble Lord whether it would
not be better to alter the clause so as to affect new
houses simply, and to allow existing licences to continue
as they were.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
said he thought it right to interfere between his
Noble Friend on the one side and the Honourable
Gentleman on the other, and to point out that the
effect of the proposition would be to create an
exclusive property in beer-houses, which should go on
for ever—(Hear, hear)—and so confine unto them alone
the sale of beer. This proposition might be very
convenient to the proprietors of the present houses.
It united the interests of the licensed victuallers
on the one hand, and the proprietors of the present
beer-houses on the other ; but it omitted one small
thing only, the interests of the public. He did not
think the proposition of his Hon. Friend would be more
palatable to the public than that of the Noble Lord.
He would not go at great length into the subject ; he
would merely remind the House that this proposition
went to the entire repeal of the Beer-laws, and to the
putting in force the whole system of monopoly which
existed before their enactment.—(Cheers.) The same
power was given to the Magistrates of licensing—
(Cheers)—which had before given rise to so many
complaints—( Loud cheers)—and the same abuses
must be the consequence—(Loud cheers)—but
not under the same circumstances, because now a free
trade in beer had been created, and any attempt to put
an end to it would only have the effect of producing an
illicit dealing in beer which no police could prevent—
(Cheers)—and of rr4tlucing among the lower orders a
strong feeling of dissatisfaction with law.—(Cheers.)
Sir C. BURRELL thought that the f-ec-trade in
.beer had been destroyed by the present beer law.
He believed there was no just ground for the assertion
of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, that beer houses
under the old system were improperly conducted. The
Magistrates, at least in his part of the country, licensed
only those persons who conducted their houses with
propriety and correctness.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER ex-
plained. He did not mean to cast any imputation on
the Magistrates.

Mr. IVARBURTON said the question before the
House was, whether they would allow new houses
and new tenants to be licensed to sell beer, to be drunk
on the premises. The effect of that would be gradually
to worm out all those houses which were at present so
licensed. It appeared to him that such a proposition
was only the knocking down of one monopoly for the
purpose of raising another.
Mr. HAMILTON thought the clause of the Noble

Lord ought to form part of a separate Bill. He agreed
with the Hon. Member who spoke last, that if th•
clause was adopted it would do away with one
monopoly for the purpose of setting up another. As
the clause completely altered the Bill he should give
it his decided opposition.
Mr. SLANEY opposed the dame.
After a few observations from Sir J. GUEST,
strangers were ordered to withdraw, and the House
divided, when the numbers were—
For the Clause 47
Against the Clause
Majority
The Report was then received, and the Bill ordered
to be engrossed and read a third time to-morrow.
DRAINAGE OF LANDS BILL.

On the motion of Mr. HANDLEY, the House
went into Committee on the Drainage of Lands Bill.
After a few observations from Mr. DARBY and
Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET, which, in con-
sequence of the noise in the body of the House, were
cox i
pletely inaudible n the gallery,
Major HANDLEY said, ever since the commence.
ment of the first session of this Parliament, he had en-
deavoured to pass the Bill beyond its present stage.
He therefore hoped the Noble Lord would withdr'aw.
his charge. With reference to the arguments of the
Noble Lord, th9t the small proprietors would be
over-ruled, lac thought nothing would be more unjust
than that a parish should be deprived of the benefits of
the Bill by the opposition of a few small, or even large
farmers.
Mr. DARBY said in a former Bill great difficulty
had been felt as to fixing the number of consents.
The number io that Bill he thought was Lis much
too high as in this it was too low.
After a few words from Mr. WILLIAMS and Mr.
LYNCH,
Lord G. SOMERSET opposed the Bill, because it
proposed to bind one-third for the benefit of the other
two-thirds--it ought to be matter of arrangement. He
thought they ought at all events to introduce the same
words in the Bill as were in the Sewers Bill.
Dr. NICHOL thought the: Bill would work very
great injustice, as the value was to be taken, not upon
the original value of the land, but upon the improved
value.

After a few words from Mr. Darby, Mr. Pryme, Mr.
Hodgson, Mr. Handley, and Mr. Hodges,
Strangers were ordered to withdraw, and the Com-
mittee divided, when there appeared—
For the clause
Fur the amendment l6
Majority in favour of the clause
The clause was then ordered to stand part of the
Dill.

Clauses up to 15 were agreed to, with a few verbal
amendments.
On clause 16 being proposed an Hon. Member moved
that the House be counted.
There were however 40 Members present, and the
Committee proceeded with the Bill.
Clauses up to 23 were agreed to.
Mr. DARBY objected to clause 24, and after a
few observations from Mr. Handley, and Mr. Rice,
The Committee divided, when there appeared—
For the Clause
Against it
Majority
The clause was then agreed to.
Clauses 25, 26, 27, and 2S, were then agreed to.
On the reading of clause `29,
Mr. HODGES moved a verbal amendment, which
was agreed to.
Clauses up to 49 were then agreed to.
The remaining clauses up to 67 were agreed to.
On clause 67 being proposed,
Mr. WILLIAMS moved the omission of the clause,
and strangers were ordered to withdraw, but the House
did not divide, the clause being
withdrawn.
The remaining clauses up to 92 were then agreed to.
On clause 93 being proposed,
Mr. HODGES moved the omission of the word
Sewers from the clause, and also that Middlesex should
be exempted from the operation of the Act.
Major HANDLEY said that the amendment would
make the Act inoperative.
Mr. DARBY opposed the amendment, and said
that if it was carried he should propose a clause ex-
empting Sussex from the operation of the Act.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the
Committee divided, when the numbers were—
For the amendment .................. 22
Against the - Idment ............ 48

amen,
Majority ..................... —26
The clause was then ordered to stand part of the Bil.
The preamble was then agreed to, and the Bill was
ordered to be reported to-morrow.
MARRIAGES ACT AMENDMENT BILL.
The Houss-, having resumed,
The Marriages Act Amendment Bill, on the motion
of Mr. LANGDALE, went through Committee pro
forma,for the purpose of being're•considered on the 16 h.
PUNISHMENT OF DEATH BILL.

Mr. F. KELLY rose to move the second reading of
the Punishment of Death Bill. The Hon. and Learned
Gentleman said that he had but one observation to
make. His Hon. and Learned Friend the Attorney-
General had stated on the first introduction of the Bill,
that he thought that its pros kions should be exten4d
to Irellaud And to 6t;otiand, auci 1u that upituon he (Mr.

Kelly) entirely concurred, As he had found that his
first motion had received the sanction of the great ma-
jority of the House, he had caused two additional Bills
to be prepared for the purpose of extending the Act to
Ireland and to Scotland. With respect to the Irish
Bill he slould only observe, that if the House gave its
sanction to the second reading of the English Bill then
under their consideration, he could in that case antici-
pate no opposition to the other, and he would be pre-
pared to lay it before the House on to-morrow. The
two Bills would by that means go together, and with
them •, the Bill which related to Scotland. With
regard to the last Bill, however, he should ob-
serve, that as the jurisprudence of Scotland dif-
fered so much from that of England or Ireland,.
and he was so imperfectly acquainted with the techni-
calities of the laws in that country that he felt that he
should find the subject attended with some difficulty,
but he still hoped that he should be able to lay the Bill
before the House in a short time, and certainly before
they could be prepared to go into Committee on the
English Bill. Having made these statements he would
content himself with simply moving the second reading
of the Bill.—( Hear, hear.)
Mr. FOX MAULE said it was not his intention to
oppose the second reading of the Bill.—(Hear, hear.)
But at the same time he thought it fair to warn the
Hon. and Learned Gentlemen that there were many
alterations which he intended to introduce in the Bill,
when the House went into Committee. He would ob-
serve that there could be no apprehension that if the
Bill should not pass into a law this Session, the practice
observed for the last two years in the administration of
criminal justice would be departed from. That prac-
tice was founded on the principle of the Bill, and it was
mainly for that reason that he (Mr. F. Monte) did not
object to its second reading. He was opposed to capi-
tal punishment in all cases in which such punishment
could not be justified on the principle of holding out a
good example—(Hear, hear)—for he held that the
last sentence of the law was not an act of vengeance,
but recourse should be had to it merely for the pur-
pose of deterring others. On those grounds he would
net oppose the second reading of the Bill, but as the
I Hon. and Learned Gentleman had stated that it was
his intention to introduce a similar measure for Scot-

land, he hoped that as soon as the Bill was prepared
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman would be ready to
submit it to the consideration of the Lord Advocate or
other law authorities of Scotland, because all legal
proceedings in that country were of such a
nature that he was sure that the Honourable
and Learned Gentleman, with all his talent and
industry, would not be able, without consulting Scotch
lawyers, to frame such a measure as it would be advi-
sable that the House should adopt.
Mr. F. KELLY said that with regard to the
Scottish Bill he should be happy to be assisted in the
framing of it by the law officers of the Crown, and he
would certainly submit it. to the Lord Advocate as
soon as it was prepared. He also wished to express a
hope that if he should be unable to carry that mea-
sure during the present Session, that circumstances
would not offer an obstacle to the passing of the other
Bill, which he was sure would be carried unless opposed
by the Government.—(Her, hear.)
Mr. FOX MAULE said that he was sure the Lord
Advocate would not sanction any Bill with regard to
Scotland which was not comformable with the laws of
the country, but he could not, however, pledge himself
to sanction the measure.

Captain BERKELEY said that there were many
clauses of the Bill to which he was opposed, and on
which he would take the sense of the House in Com-
mittee.

The Bill was then read a second time and ordered
to be committed.
CIVIL BILLS COURTS (IRELAND) BILL.
The Civil Bills Courts (Ireland) Bill was read a
second time.
PAROCHIAL ASSESSMENTS BILL.

The House then went into Committee on the Pa.
rochial Assessments Bill.

Clauses I and 2 were agreed to.
On clause 3 being proposed,
Mr. WAKLEY suggested the better may would be
to allow the Bill to go through Committee pro forma,
as many Hon. Members. were absent upon the sup-
position that the Bill would not come on that evening.
Nothing satisfactory► with the Bill could be done that
cventng, and he therefore hoped his suggestion would be
agreed to. _ . _

After a few observations from Captain PECHELL and
Mr. E. J. STANLEY of a similar nature,
Mr. P. SC ROPE agreed to the suggestion.
Some alterations were then made in the Bill.
On the motion of Mr. P. SCROPE, the Bill, with
the amendment, was ordered to be printed, and re-
committed on Friday next.
On. the motion of Mr. E. J. STANLEY leave was
given to the Committee on Petitions for Private Bills
to sit and proceed forthwith, and take into considera-
tion the Metropolitan Improvement Bill.
Mr. BALD WIN obtained leave to bring in a Bill to
authorise the compounding and commuting of charges
on freehold or copyhold property for charitable pur-
poses, and to extend the provisions of the Act 1 and 9
Geo. IV., c. 92.
The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of,
and the House adjourned at a Quarter past Eleven
e'Clock.