The Sun.
London, England, 1841-08-25 00:00:00

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loan, not a very respectable position to be placed in. The
' Purdanb was in a state of confusion, and there they were
planted, and no man could say how soon they might think
it wise to retire, or how difficult they might find it.—
(Hear, hear.) Not a word of these matters was men-
tioned in the 'Speech, or of the great armaments got
together to carry on these undertakings, The next
matt .--,a-was the war in China, and that was a war of a very
' curious kind. It was carried on at a vast expense, under
many very great difficulties, and against an enemy who
would not fight. They knocked his castles about his
ears, they burned his ships, and called on him to sub-
scribe to terms, • which they said their dignity
compelled them to exact—he promised to do so, they be-
lieved him, and it all came to nothing. They had sent
a large force there which took possession of 'an unde-
fended island. Hundreds of men died there—(Hear.
hear)—and the rest were sent away under the impres-
sion that everything was done. They then went to
Canton, and a treaty was made, which ended in ns-
thing. They were told by her Majesty's Government
last year that they had ratified a treaty, and their si-
tuation was, net that they were at war, but that
their negotiations for peace had not succeeded.
They were again at war, and her Majesty's Government
had not told them what the war was abeut. He knew
not why they had failed—whether it was the blundering
of the instructions or of those who were .to execute
them. Now there were two questions, the war in
Afrghanistan and the war in China, which would justify
him if they stool alone in moving it vote of want of con
fidenee in her Majesty's Government. Thero was an-
other point, the state of their affairs in the iNlTaliterra-
nean' about which he would not say one word, as it was
calculated to be productive of serious evil. He now
came •to that part of the speech (i n which
his Noble Friends anticipated that there would not be an
unanimous vote, and he was not surprised at the anticipation,
as under all the circumstances it was impossible that it could
be an unanimous vote. It embraced the revenue, the general
trade and commerce of the country, and, according to the
views of her Majesty's Ministers, these three questions were
linked together. It was said that these measures were pro-
posed to meet the difficulties of a great financial crisis, and if
he thought they were calculated to do so, he should hesitate in
proposing any amendment. But it was because he believed
that this was the greatest possible mismanagement of the public
finances that he called upon their Lordships to say that
her Majesty's Government did not possess the confidence of
the country.—(Hear, hear.) For the la.t four years the re-
venue hcd been constantly less than the expenditure, and the
excess had been less that five millions up to the stla of April
last, and it was most singular that the measures taken to meet
the exigency were nothing unjustifiable. How had the de-
ficiency been supplied ? Principally by tampering with the
savings' banks, by borrowing money from them, or a process
equivalent thereto, and changing the Exchequer Bills into a
part of the permanent debt of the coon ry. He admitted it
was competent for the Treasury to do so; but to do it without
the knowledge of Parliament for a series of years was, in his
opinion, an unconstitutional proceeding.—( Hear, hear.) These
savings' banks were the places in which the humbler classes
placed a portion of their savings, in order to gild the evening
of their laborious lives, being induced by the Acts of
the Legislature to entrust those savings to the pub-
lic custody. But if the Government has the power
to take them for other purposes, what security had these poor
people? He thought such conduct was quite unjustifiable.
Another mode adopted by the Government was diminishing
the balance in the Exchequer, which he thought a very impro-
vident mode' of dealing with a deficiency. During the course
of the last ten years, an addition had been made to the funded
debt of about one million per annum, for which no provision
was made. That was first done when there was a positive sur-
plus ; but for the last four years, when there was none, it had
added to the deficiency. If to those measures were added the
hasty adoption of the Post-office scheme, it would amount to
2,400,0001., or nearly all that was required to meet the defi-
ciency in the last Parliament. In all these matters it appeared
to him a want of common foresight and precaution.—( Hear,
hear.) He had referred to these matters on former
occasion, and his Noble Friend opposite had admitted the
most of his facts and statements ; and although he had not ad-
mitted all of them, he hail not refuted any. When he found
the finances of the country so mismanaged, he thought he was
justified in asking their Lordships for a vote of' want of confi-
dence.—(Hear.) In 1840 her Majesty's Government pro-
posed to meet the exigency of the case by a considerable addi-
tion to the taxes. That had been done in a very clumsy and
common-place manner, and it was ultimately admitted that it
had not answered the proposed object. There was one circum-
stance connected with this matter which was announced on the
part of the Government, so far as the finances were concerned.
lie meant the negotiations for a commercial treaty with
France, which were then going
,on. z This announcement
took place when the Budget was opened, and there
taxes were imposed. Now, if that treaty had been carried
into effect he would undertake to say that it would have
been absolutely necessary to have called upon Parliament to
undo a great part of what they had done ; hut, however, that
difficulty did not occur, because the treaty was put aside.
He now came to the present year, and acre he found that
the deficiency r 'mained the same—no, not the same, for
it had accumulated; and then the Government came for-
ward with a plan which they professed to consider as one
which would put the revenue on a sound footing. That
plan consisted in an alteration of the duty on the three ar-
ticles to which his Noble Friend had alluded; and it was
stated on the part of the Government that the alteration would
have the triple effect of improving the revenue, extending
commerce, and benefitting the consumer. It would not be
difficult to show that not one of these measures
could by possibility have effected these objects.—
He would point out, for example, the mode in which it was
proposed by the Government to deal with the question of tim-
ber. They said, and said truly, that the proportion between
the duty on foreign timber and Canadian timber was unduly
great. He was not disposed, in the abstract, to deny that the
duty might require revision—(Ministerial cheers)—but what
he questioned, was the policy and prudence of the mode in
which the Government proposed to do it. They proposed to
increase the duty on Canadian timber from 10s. to 205., and
to reduce the duty on Baltic timber from 555. to 50s. Now,
his Noble Friend stated what was perfectly true, that although
Canadian timber was not fit for certain purposes, there was a
great deal that was exceedingly, useful, and in exact proportion
as the duty had the effect of causing people to substitute
Baltic timber for Canadian timber, would have been the
effect of the measure in increasing the revenue ; but it would
not increase the interest of the consumer, so far as related to
colonial timber. Then, how far would it affect the interest of
the consumer of foreign timber? Mr. Macgregor, in his evi-
dence - before the Import Duties Committee, propounded a
scheme for altering the duties, which lie (the Earl of Ripon)
believed was the foundation of this Budget. Ile stated that the
duty on Baltic timber varied from 50 to 200 per cent.
Now take 100 per cent., was there any person why did not
know that a reduction of ss. in I 10s. in an article like that
might go into the pockets of the builder, but could be of no
benefit to the consumer.—( Hear, hear.) Therefore in his
opinion, the scheme could never answer the three ends
propOsed ; and with respect to the trade, in exact proportion as
it increased in this one branch it must diminish in the other
Ile therefore called this a complete fallacy as a scheme of
finance. The next thing was sugar. He thought in this re-
spect the Government scheme of finance could never succeed,
because it was admitted by the Government that the effect
wonld only be to reduce the price of sugar corn,: fraction of a
farthing per pound. Now, unless the price of sugar was re•
dusted ono penny in the pound, the consumer could gain no
advantage. He was not prepared to say that he thought no
time could occur in which the duty on foreign grown
sugar ought to be reduced, but then there was the
question that had been alluded to by his Noble Friend, of
slavery and the slave trade; and, although his Noble Friend
had told them, that if he thought these would be promoted by
the measure, with all his love for 'free trade, he would not
consent to it. He (the Earl of Ripon) thought it must have
that effect,—at all events, there was great danger of it. The
experiment of emancipation had not been fully tried. He be-
lieved it was working remarkably well, and would entirely
succeed ; but he thought it would be unwise, in the greatest
possible degree, to risk its success by such a measure at the
present moment. He came now to the most important part
of this case, namsly, to the alteration in the Corn-laws. The
subject was so inclosed in difficulties, that he hardly knew how
best to approach it. He thought he should be able to show
that the proposed plan was one in which they ought not to ac-
quiesce. His Noble Friend, who opened the debate, talked of the
importance of free trade in everything, but, above all, in corn,
and very fairly stated what exaggerations prevail on this sub-
ject on both sides. But might not he (the Earl of Ripon)
ask, was the proposition of the Government a bona fide one,
and, if not, what might be the result, and to what might it be
intended they should come?—(Cheers.) If the argument of
his Noble Friend prevailed, it would come to an abolition of
all protection.—(Cheers from the Ministerial benches.)
There! , The mystery was unveiled.—(Cheers.) The mover
and seconder of the Addrese, 'before they came to the House,
must have made observations on the subject, and he there-
fore must suppose that his Noble Friend at the head of the
Government was perfectly aware, when lie selected them for
the purpose, that the moter and seconder of the Address
walki argue the question on the principles of free trade and no
other ; and, therefore, it was not unjust or uncharitable to in-
fer that that was the end to which this scheme tended.—
( Cheers.) There could not be the slightest doubt of it, whe-
ther they regarded this circumstance, or what had been said in
a hundred pamphlets, in the newspapers, or in the outpourings
of the Anti-Corn-law League. If this were indeed a bona fide
question of a fixed duty, instead of a graduating scale, was that
a question on which to agitate the country to its foundations,
and to excite all the worst passions of our nature ?—(Cheers.)
How could they settle such a question as this on a fair and
reasonable basis, when all parties were maddened respecting
it by a violent agitation, which produced disorder
and broke up every social feeling. This charge appeared to
him to be on the side of those who clamoured for what. they
called cheap bread, and never thought of what his Noble
Frierel who moved the Address, with all his knowledge and ex-
perience, had told them--that cheap bread it would not bring.
lie dal not think that the institutions of the country were
secure when insinuations were spread abroad by persons not
without influence respecting the disinterestedness of those to
whom was committed the task of framing our laws. Insinua-
tions of thin kind were contained in the Report to which he
hail alluded. It had been stated that the existing laws had
entirely failed in producing the objects sought to be obtained
by it, but he would show not only that it had not failed, but
that it had produced exactly the effect desired.—(Cheers. )
Their Lordships would find on the table, that there was
a statement of the weekly averages of corn for a series
of years, going down to the end of the last year, and
in the course of the 12 years inclndcd in those tables, the
average pike was 58s. and 3-10ffis. Now that was not
at all an extravagant average ; but if that period was
divided into two parts, the average of the first six years
would be found to have been 595. ld. and the next six
575. 6id. Now from that he thought it might be said that
the scheme of the Corn-laws had not failed. If the 12 years
were divided in'o three the same result would he found to
take place. The Noble Lord opposite had alluded to another
argument, and that was with reference to the country be ing
dependant upon foreign supply, and he had denied that
any danger would result from that. Now he ( Lord
Ripon) felt convince that there was danger in such a
state of things, and that was the real grounds
' and justification in his mind for supporting any Corn-laws
whatever. He could not divest himself of the most grave rip-
prehension, that if they depended upon importation from
abroad for the supply, they would thereby cause the neglect of
the growth of corn in this country, and would impose great
difficulties, and difficulties that would increase every year ;
added to which, he thought it extremely likely, if they admitted
foreign corn into this country, and thereby injured the cultiva-
tion of corn here, the time would come when foreign countries
would not have corn to send them. He believed if the mea-
sures proposed were carried, a great portion of the land of this
country would be thrown out of cultivation. Looking at the
subject in a mercantile point of view, it was said, if free trade
in corn was given, that the manufacturers of the country
would flourish in a much greater degree. Now for his own part,
he thought there was great reason to doubt that. By far the
greater part of the nations of Europe had Corn-laws for their
protection, and how was it therefore to be supposed that those
countries, if the Corn-laws in this country were repealed,
would take the goods of this country at a greater price then they
could manufacture them -themselves ? It was said
that the Prussian League was the result of the Corn-