The Sun.
London, England, 1847-05-21 00:00:00

a proportion to the decrease of patronage.—(Hear.)
But he objected to it, and objected most earnestly, to
that which still further made the parochial constitution
of this country the Parliamentary constitution. The
moment that they had a Poor-law Minister in that House
—the moment that parochial affairs were brought into
that House—all that time which was at present devoted to
railways—all the time which was devoted to private busi-
ness—would be otherwise consumed, and none left for
those purposes when they had converted the Members
into a parochial--(Loud cries of " Time, time.") The
Hon. Member said the quarter was not yet exhausted.—
(Ironical cheers.) There was one other topic which he
wished much to avoid ; it had nothing to do with this
question. Why it was introduced into the discussion
was no matter of his ; but it was enough that no o :le in
the course of the debate had avoided mention of the A:3-
clover Union Committee.— (Hear.) He was a member
of that Committee, and he wished to make one remark
upoa the subject. The Noble Lord himself, with
the ability which distinguished him, referred to the
members of the Andover Committee. That Committee
lasted for a considerable time—he believed for a space
of nearly four months. It represented every section of
opinion in regard to the law itself. But he was bound
to say that various as that opinion was, and strong as
was their conviction, he believed that every member was
satisfied—impressed with the deep conviction that the
result of that investigation was beneficial to the public.
But the Noble Lord said he would not listen to those
accusations when he found an officer had so forgotten
his duty, that an officer was so chargeable with derelic-
tion that in an underhand manner he should be
discovered creating a factitious public opinion
against his chiefs—he would not hear anything
that made against the Poor-law Commissioners.
He (Mr. Disraeli) thought, and he admitted there was a
great deal of truth in what the Noble Lord said on that
head. But could they then believe that such a man as
Mr. Chadwick was still at the board of the poor-law?—
(Loud and ironical cheers.) Though the Noble Lord
(John Russell) nodded his head as insinuating that to be
the case, he yet could not believe it.—(Renewed cheers.)
He ha.l heard a gentleman who had been a Poor-law
Commissioner, and had a great distaste for family honours,
himself the father of a head Commissioner—( !tear and
laughter)—say, that Mr. Chadwick was a dangerous
person—a most dangerous person to the Poor-law Corn-
missioners.—(lronical cheers.) Having heard Mr. Chad-
wick denounced by one of the Commissioners—(Hear
and laughter)---by the father of a head Commissioner—
(lncreased laughter)—Sir Frankland Lewis ; having
heard him denounced by the Noble Lord, but for whom
they might not have had the Andover Union Committee
or this Bill, he could not believe that he was still at the
board.—(Great cheering and laughter.) What state
secret was he the depositary of that he was still there ?
(Renewed ironical cheers.) If the Noble Lord had con-
descended to leave his red box, and gone to the green
table with a few plain men like himself, and there, with
pen and paper, taken close notes of evidence, he might
have come to a different conclusion. He had heard that
gentleman make statements which he received as evidence.
But they had heard that gentleman characterised as
poisoning the fountains of all truth. If a different spec-
tacle had been presented that night, and if he had seen
the Noble Lord rise that night and say that he would
take upon himself the disgrace anti the odium of one who,
to the extent of his abilities, had served him—if he had
done so, although at the moment of dissolution, and on
the eve of a general election, he (Mr. Disraeli) would
have admired the Noble Lord that night as one who
would not desert an old servant at the moment of attack.
—(Cheers.) But the Noble Lord was willing to benefit
by the services of a man whom he denounced. Yes, the
Noble Lord required a scape- goat and a victim; and, he
said, I am obliged to make a Secretary of State with two
secretaries, on account of the underhand proceed-
ings of the secretary of the Poor-law Commis-
sioners. Yet that man remained at that moment secre-
tary at the Poor law Commissioners' board--(Cheers.)
lie knew him but by his works—his works on the sana-
tory state of the country, and in treating of that subject,
the only places he appears to have passed were his own
office and the secret recesses of the Cabinet. The
House should remember that that Committee was called
under very peculiar circumstances. As regarded this
Bill, it was to be considered only as a Bill for the re-
construction of central control, to which they all agreed.
Let the House zicT forget the peculiar circumstances
under which this Bill was brought forward. When
these charges were made against the members of the
Andover Committee, he felt bound to remind the House
of the circumstances under which that Committee
laboured. His Hon. Friend the Member for Peter-
borough had put into his hand a resolution which was
adopted with the joint approbation of the Committee,
and which, as it was very brief, he would take the liberty
of reading to the House. The Noble Lord the chair-
man of that Committee had stated to him personally the
reason why he had voted against that resolution, namely
that he could not agree in the latter part. The resolu-
don, stated that the conduct of the Commissioners
Messrs. Parker and Day was not in accordance with the
statute under which they exercised their functions, and
was such as was calculated to shake public con-
fidence in the administration of the law. That
resolution was agreed to by a large majority.
As to their conduct being irregular and arbitrary, which
referred to a matter of fact. Now, of those Gentlemen
who bad spoken that evening, not one pretended that
their proceedings was not irregular. Whether they were
arbitrary, was a matter for the consideration of the
Committee, who decided that they were. The Noble
Lord, to whom he had referred, agreed, in his opinion.
with the Committee on that point, but stated he could
not do so with respect to that part of the resolution
which asserted that they had not acted in conformity
with the statute. But by that statute they were bound to
keep records, and the evidence brought before the
Committee proved that they had not kept any records,
but that a person in his private room conducted the
whole business, who, in fact, was only scribbling his own
memoranda.—(Hear, hear.) To show that public con-
fidence was shaken by the administration of the Com-
missioners, was it necessary for him to bring any evi-
dence on that subject. That resolution was not, be
asserted, an intemperate, but on the contrary, a mode-
rate resolution, founded upon fact, after duly
weighing the evidence before the Committee. No
one entering upon that inquiry could help arriv-
ing at the same conclusion to which the Com
mittee had arrived, and no one except by loose
assertion had challenged that conclusion, or challenged
that resolution. He would now say a few words with
respect to an individual because he had no friend in that
House except himself. That gentleman's name had
been brought forward in a most unnecessary and wanton
manner. He was not going to support Mr. Day because
he happened to be an intimate acquaintance of his. He
certainly knew him as a man of attainments and a good
scholar, and he knew nothing against him without it
was that he was a widower.--(Laughter.)
Lord J. RUSSELL—What I said was that he had
not a freehold.

Mr. DISRAELI—Why, the Prime Minister had not
a freehold, but they had no means of removing him
without telling him the reason. The Noble Lord said
himself that no man ought to be dismissed unless he
conducted his business in such a manner as was unsatis-
factory to his employers. Why Mr. Day was dismissed
without any reason being assigned, and that not even
in an official manner. The manner in which Mr. Day
was appointed was as follows:—He had not a public
friend in the world, but he published a pamphlet before
the reform of the old law was contemplated, and he
reformed his own parish on the principle of the 43d of
Elizabeth, he described the reforms which he effected
in that pamphlet. Having no public friend, it was the
last effort of a desperate man; for every one who ever
wrote a pamphlet must admit that no one ever read it.
In 1831, when the Government introduced their plan,
they were looking out for clever men, who, to use the
fashionable language of that House, could carry out their
system, a Noble Lord, resident in the county to which
Mr. Day belonged, said there is a distinguished country
magistrate who reformed his own parish see to him, he has
written a pamphlet. The pamphlet was sent to the
Minister, who read it. Mr. Day was sent for, was
offered the post, which he accepted, and he became a
zealous officer.—(Hear hear.) He was sent to that
part of the kingdom which was declared wholly and the
most incapable of reform, South Wales.—(Hear, bear.)_e
He did reform it. Was it any wonder, however, that
how-
ever, a
should have become unpopular ? In h labours,
he broke his leg, and when he had recovered, he
wrote a note, to say that he was still prepared
to resume his labours. In reply to that communica-
tion, he received a letter, marked private, which
advised him as a friend to send in his resignation, Now
in all this there was a great deal of hardship and arbi-
trary conduct. Mr. Day had broken up his establish-
ment in his county, where, on a moderate income, he
supported a large family. He zealously conducted the
duties of his office, accomplished what was admitted to
be a most difficult task, and received a compound frac-
ture in the service of Government, yet this was his
reward, after all.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. Day was
accused of unpopularity, which was hardly possible,
for him to be otherwise, but Mr. Day brought credentials
from every board of guardians which he had been
brought into connexion with, all expressing their condo-
lence with him, and their confidence in him. He (Mr.
Disraeli) could not refrain from mentioning these facts.
And now, with regard to the Bill itself, looking at it
merely in comparison with the present system of control,
he was not disposed to say that it might not be an im-
provement, it might or it might not ; he, however, would
give the Government the advantages f believing
_atehart
on a vicious system it was an improvement.—(Hear,
hear.) And so far as that went, he
be inclined to support it; but looking as he did
the system of metropoli-
tan
country this
pernici
Bill as one meant to perpetuate
on
,thseo
ous, and which had brought
af
he would vote for the
control, which he believed lt to
the
ee
efivoilfsaotanl
which had been complained o
for nares orough.
Mr. P. BORTHWICK
moved the adjournment of the
amendment of the Hon. Member' K b
debate.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that he hoped they would
fin
ish the debate that night.
Mr. FERRANDssad, that after the speech which had
bye the
measure. Noble
The Lord,
hiot
n.
was
Memberrlist
y
was determined to answer it, and he, for his part, was
determined to offer every opposition to her Majesty's
to been
preys e s s made
t h
Government, if they attempted so unconstitutionally to
press the second reading.—(Hear, and cries of" On.")
And now, as to a question personal to himself, he desired
that the Noble Lord would explain what statements of his
were unfounded which he made on Monday last; he al-
luded especially to those statements which he had made
in reference to the manufacturing districts. He asked
the Noble Lord to stand tip in his place and state what
was the statement he had made.
Mr. VILLIERS said he had stated that they toe];
peasants Cron) the agricultural districts, and sold thei
as slaves in the manufacturing districts. He said also,
that they murdered children in the-workhouses. These
were two of his misstatements, and the House need wait
no longer.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL paid these two were state-