The Sun.
London, England, 1847-05-08 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, SATURDAY MORNING, MAY 8, 1847.

session of half, or three quarters of an acre of
.land, he might .be obliged _to_come to the board
of gum dians for relie!, and the real question, therefore,
was what was the amount of the relief, and what was the kind
of relief, which the Board of Guardians were to administer.
Under the pressure of en insuperable calamity a man holding a
small portion of ground might be obliged to apply for parochial
relief, and then there was no all ernat ve whatever but that he
must give up his land, and he must either go into the work-
house, and thus become a permanent pauper, for without either
house or land he must be in a state of destitution, and he
must therefore either go into the workhouie or else throw his
exertions into an already overstocked labour-market. For
those reasons he had formed the opinion that it would be unwise
to limit the r. lief to those who were not in the possession of
any portion of land. lie had shown, as he thought, that he
had not come to his conclusions with,.ut sufficient grounds, and
certain he was that some limitation should be placed on the
power vested in the board of guardians, anti with this expres-
sion of his feeling he would leave the clause in the hands of
their Lordships.
The Earl of RODEN said that he believed some limit
should be put on the lavish expenditure of the board of guar-
dians, fir he believed that abuses must prevail, unless th:• pro

visions of the law was strictly carried out. He would state a
case which occurred during the last autumn in the district of
the board of guardians, of which he was a member. A man
in that district had unfortunately fallen into great distress, and
he applied to the board for relief, a:though he was at the time
in p.)sses:irin of the holding from which his sultsistence had
been chiefly derived. The guardians had nevertheless granted
the relief, although he had himself asserted, that if it were
given, he should put his protest on the hooks against the pro-
eecdin s. He had gone further, for he had written to the
Poor-law Commissioners, but had unfortunately received no
reply, although he had had a letter from the Assistant Com-
missioner. For his own part, he believed that the Act could
never be eff !Wall, carried out without out-door relief, and Le
should, therefore, oppose the amendment.
Lord BROUGHAM said that it was very evident that the
relief was granted in the very teeth of the law, and that the
Bill would, therefore, be ineffectual without some stringent
regulation for preventing the board of guardians from grant-
ing assistance contrary to the regulations of the Act of
Parliament.
The 'Marquis of CLANRICARDE thought that the case
which had been made out by the Noble Earl opposite, quite
showed the necessity for granting out-door relief ; but yet, it
was perfectly evident that the small pit ce of land, held by these
small tenants, would, at no tim,, either in the days of pros-
perity or under the pressure of calamity, suffice for their sup-
port, and therefore the clause was directly applicable to the
purpose.
'I he Earl of CL ANCARTY thought that his Noble Friend
was roistAken in the view which he had taken.

ThP aniendmint being withdrawn, the clause was agreed to,
as well as clause 10.

On cause 11 being' read,
The Earl of WICKLOW said that the result of this clause

would be the effect of preventing the landlords improving their
lands. lie would move that the words out-door should be

omitted.

Lord BEAUNIONT. said, that they had now this rate

hanging over their heath, the whole of their united interests
would be to keep. down the interest. The case was totally
different in England and Ireland.
The Earl of DEVON said, that he considered that this Bill
would have the effect of giving employment to the people of
Ireland, by making the landlords of Ireland desirous to employ
the people, and by that means prevent the increase of the poor-

to adopt, and pursue that line of conduct which appeared to
him to he most independent. —(Cheers.)
Lord BROUGHAM hoped and believed that the Noble
Marquis would not have to ascend the s,cps of the Throne
alone.—( Great Laughter.) (Loud cries of " Divide, divide.")
The Howe then divided—
Contents
Non-contents
Majority
The clause was then struck out of the Bill.
Clause 12 was agreed to.
_ _ _

rate.
Lord MONTEAGLE said, he believed that the out-door
relief was the most likely to be the most successful as well as
the most required. If they enabled the Town Council to
make a rate for out-door relief, they would find it would be
the most efficacious provision of the whole measure. What
would be the effect of this clause? Why they would tax the
electoral division on which capital had been expended, and
where improvement had taken place; while they expended
money on those electoral divi,ions where pauperism existed in
proportion to the amount of population, which was, in fact, in
proportion to its pauperism, no matter how that pauperism might
be created. He knew that he was advocating an unpopular view
of the subject, and one that was opposed to the expressed
opinion of Mr. O'Connell. On these grounds he saw no
reason to adopt the amendment of the Noble Lord.
The Earl of HAT lIEII TON said that the proposed amend-
ment would be a distinct warning to all English capitalists not
to make an investment of their mono' in Ireland.
The Marquis of CONK NG H AM made a few observations.
Lord STANLEY wished to know from the Noble Earl who
proposed the amendment whether it was his intention to
proceed with it before the amendment which he (Lord Stan»
ley) intended to propose, for the omission of the clause alto-
gether, was disposed of ?
The Earl of WICKLOW said if he found the Government
disposed to oppose his amendment he would in that case with-
draw it, and support the amendment. of his Noble Friend (Lord
Stanley), but until he heard from them what course they in-
tended to pursue he could not. withdraw it.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE would not accede to the
amendment of the Noble Earl as the effect would be to iniiuce
boards of guardians to increase the expenses for out-door relief,
so as to throw the whole burden of the rates upon the unions

On clause 13 being read,
Earl FITZ WILLIAM made a few observations, which were
inaudible in the gallery, and the clause was agreed to.
Clause 14 was agreed to, as well as clause 15.
On clause 17 the Earl of CLANCARTY said that some
measures should be taken for the more effectual collection of
the arrears of the rates.
Lord STANLEY said with reference to the observation of
the Noble Earl ( Clancarty) that unless measures were taken to
collect each rate as far as it should he done, before another
was struck, the consequence would be, that those who 41,L1 pay,
would in self-defence be obliged to refuse payment also, and they
would do it too. He thought her Majesty's Government should
give this matter their best consideration, otherwise the rates
would not be collected at all.
Clause 18 was also agreed to.
On the motion of the Marquis of LANSDOWNE, the fur-
ther consideration of the clauses was adjourned till Monday.
Their Lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS. Mw,' 7.
The SPEAKER. took the Chair shortly before Four o'clock.

THIRD READINGS.
The following Bills were read a third time and passed :
Caledonian Railway (Extension of Motherwell Branch of
Clydesdale Junction Railway to Auchinheath Mineral Field,
with branches to the Wishaw and Coltness Railway, Can-
derside, and Hamilton).
Caledonian Railway (Branches to Wilsontown, to Fauldhouse,
and to 13iggar and Broughton).
Caledonian Railway (Branches from the Clydesdale Junction
Railway to the Douglas and Lesmahagow Mineral Fields
and to Stratbavon).
Colchester, Stour Valley, Sudbury, and Halstead Railway
(Extension from Lavenham to Bury St. Edmund's).
Glasgow, Dumfries, and Carlisl Railway, and Glasgow,
Paisley, Kilmarnock, and Ayr Railway (No. 2).
Glasgow, Paisley, Kilmarnock, and Ayr Railway, and Glas-
gow and Belfast Union Railway (No. 1).
Manchester Markets.
Scottish Equitable Life Assurance Society.
Wolverhampton Gas.

at large.
The Earl of WICKLOW said that after what had fallen
from the Noble Marquis, he would withdraw his amendment.
Lord STANLEY then moved the rejection of the clause
altogether. It appeared to him to be 11,th unjust and impoli-
tic to introduce such a clause. It applied generally to all
eases—to rack-renters, proprietors, and to liberal landlords. The
former would have this el iwe as the premium for poverty,
which their negl,ct of their duties had occasioned. The
effect of the clause would, therefore, be unjust. He would
owe in illustration of this how he himself was circumstanced.
The greater part of his property was situated in one electoral
divisicn, and comprised the half of the land in that division.
Now, he was accountable for the half of the rates in that
division, while the pauperism on his property was only one-
fifteenth part of the whole. The area of En,,land, as com-
pared with Ireland, was in the proportion of fifty-three to one
hundred and forty-six—which meant that in Ireland they were
nearly threefold, and he now put it to their Lordships whether
-my of them could think that they could carry on their estates
with any power over their property, or the well being of
heir tenantry ; if every person was entitled to charge the
excess of his pauperism on a well managed estate, how were
they to get ori. Under the present Bill, when the rates ex-
ceeded 2s. 64. in the pound, then they were entitled to call on
the adjoining pari,h for assistance; 2s. 6d. was not an imam-

Aerate taxation, but he firmly believed that, if the present Bill
p'ssed, they would never have a rate struck which would he
under 2s. 6d. The great evils of the electoral districts at pre-
sent was, that they were too large.—( Hear, hear. ) By
the present Bill they were about to increwo sham
twenty-fold.—( Hear, hear. ) There was, at the present
a real law of settlement in Ireland. It ran thus—that any
person who, for the period of twelvemonths out of the last
eighteen, shall have oceuvied any tenement within the union,
or not having occupied a tenement, but being resident in it,
shall have a ehim to be relieved by the electoral dis-
trict. Consequently, if he sent a number of per-
sons into a neighbouring town, they should have no
claim upon it, but upon the district where they last.
lived. 'With regard to the injustice of the clause, he would
not say a word upon it, as he had not heard it denied. It
simply imposed additional discouragement on the improvement
and additional premiums on poverty. It would
of Inglisli
eapital nt
hs Irelandothe
taa)lnfsdop property
discouragepecrtiry i!tim thest circumstance investment
ce ame to his 2 knowledge

day of a gentleman about to purchase property in Ire-
land, who asked as a preliminary question whether
this clause would be inserted or nut. For his own part, al-
though he had a pecuniary interest in the country, and much
more, a personal interest in the welfare of his tenants, he,
thank God, could give up his estates and retire on his other
resources, relieving himselt front the hopeleasness of conduct-
ing his property without any benefit to himself or his tenantry.
Earl GREY said that, if they considered this clause well,
they would see good reason for retaining it ; and he could
assure them that they would inflict great injury by rejecting it.
He held in his hand a petition from Killarney, in which it was
stated, that up to a recent period there had been three tithes'
rates collected, and since that, in 1646, the rate collected in
the town was Is. 6d in the pound, and in the rural districts,
only sixpence in the pound. He would prove, not alone from
this, but from many other instances, that they would
inflict great injustice by the rejection of this
clause. Until the calamity of the potato-blight, the
average amount of rates was sevenpence in the pound.
He for one could not see upon what ground this calculation
with regard to the state of Ireland was formed. It was as-
sumed that Ireland was a country above all others in the world
where the labourer was to be supported by charity. If he be-
lieved that he should indeed have a most fearful apprehension of

the future. The population of Ireland could not be employed
millet such a charitable system. Their labour would be used
by those who expected a profitable return for it. In Ireland,
which was said to possess such facilities for the maintenance of
its population, proper employment would, by the operation of this
measure, be gradually introduced. His Noble Friend told them
that even under the law as it now stood only one-half of the
electoral division in which his estate was situated was taxed for
the maintenance of the poor. The legitimate conclusion to
which they would be drawn by his Noble Friend's argument
would be to make every man responsible for the conduct of the
people upon his own estate, and that their employ-
ment, whether profitab e or not, was a duty upon
the proprietor. Such a system would bring about the state of
things which existed in the southern portion of this kingdom in
1833. and which it was the obj••ct of the Act to 1834 to remove.
Under that system each small district held itself responsible for
its own po ,r, and thu. the circulation of labour was put an end
to, and a serious evil brou2ht upon the country. This present
Act, as it stood, was a fair compromise between conflicting
difficulties and existing interests; it prevented the extreme
either of charitable support by any district, or by any indivi-
dual. When the rate rose to a certain height, the burden was
to tall upon a more extended district, and thus much distress
and misery was removed from many small districts and
parishes in that country. He hoped and trusted that their
Lai-iNhips would consent to take this clause whole, and alto-
gether.
Lord BROUGHAM said that it required much self-com-

mand to repress his desire to grapple with the argumvn
confineove n
andw.hi which his
impressivelyN ob Friend
delivered,
had so
but
should
htiiomnsethlrattothtehemore
labourers generall detailsre
land of
weretlie
to Bill.
be The
supportedas assump-
tion
ti),y-
tebhuasrui tuopposed,
upon
uut thatof
assumption. The Bill was not a charity, which would be bene-
ficial)Whow was not
favoured iet . assumption
T h Bill, of
itself,th esew
a"shf(o)
to the labourer, but a compulsory one, which cursed
those who received it, and oppresse‘i those who gave it. t
taught the labourer to rely, not upon his own industry, but
upon this compulsory assistance which this Bill was about to
give them. In the argument upon this measure, as indeed
upon all argument of this kind, they for tot the original prin-
ciple of the poor law, which had been long forgotten, and
which was consigned to a still deeper shade of oblivion by this
measure. What was that first principle? not that the land
should support the poor, and all other property should be
exempt, nor that the landlord and tenant should be
rated at a rack-rent to support the paupers which
the wealthy manufacturer sent forth as locusts from
his soil. such was not the law of Eiiz ibeth. That was an
income-tax, and it called upon all property of any description
whatever to support the poor man. The measure was one of
gross and flagrant itdustice—injustice and partial in its opera-
tion. There was 800,000,0001. of property in existence, not a
halfpenny of which existed at the time of ~..lizabeth, and who
could doebt that if the original system of poor-rating had been
begun in 1817, instead of at the end of the sixteenth century.
that a most effectual bar would have been put to the pr :as
injustice which they were now about to inflict upon the country.
The average in Ireland being 109 to 106, and he would venture
to say that a worse case could not possibly take place than that
which his Noble Friend said took place in his own union. Then
they had to deal with the Irish landlords ; a more improvident,
it might be a more thoughtless, set of men—but still men;
who, although careless of their interests were still aware of
Is.theyere wereno t
leslessasnxpriouudsentht
than
nn
their
management the difference between half-a-crown and a pound, and who, if
nfoorTtthh ee A
possibly a r q u
opinionsi s
a goo
rff e Che
Noble N
tf th le Ca
neAdx RpLrDee
Learned
o, hpen ardud
the welfare of their country.
friend,dottithe
etoa fhnu but he
highest respect
eouresnertessaoptt
thatfur
all political
tllu
of
jceocntoi
Oirn,ys
twoottillide
every estate ought to be made to support the labouringp poor
bcel a us seet
who were born upon it, for if that was not to be the rule the whole
hadaside, e
eaun d
fullyh e
I answered in the speech of his Noble Friend
pthroitulegihptletshaotf
the Secretary for
the Colouics (Earl Grey). TT
Lonabl y there was a

great difference.. between destitution arid moderate employ- 1 State for the Home Department if, in conformity with the
ment. Nor did he think that the pauper iced in the recommendation of the Commissioners in Lunacy in their last
electoral districts ought to have any weight, for the fact, the report upon Haydock Lodge,
reside on the premises;
residents in towns too often held out a premium for 1 anperism, Lancaster, on the renewal of the 'Tense. this year, have. re-
for the induced those who had been engaged in quire(' the proprietor, Mr. Coode, to reside on
~
the magistrates of the county of
What
anelif
becomethuisf . reside
Gin.thGeialEsvylu,min?
country employments to settle thera in the hope of and also to isrovide a competent medical assistant, likewise to
system were . really
for this measure had to a great state, that originally a correspondence
proprietors in towns,
obtaining rack-rents teem
framed with a view to provide for the Commi-sioners and the visiting justices on the subject of this
extent been ,
pauperism of the country. But, in fact, it was in the power license, and the result was that it was only granted for a short
fbrecmaltethreeriir,answer to the question, said—l beg to
of the electoral districts as now provided to impose upon the period. Upon its renewal the license was granted. in
took place between the
Yet, he believed, that a great change would he the name of Mr. Jackson, who resided on the premises,
towns.
wrought by the payment of money wages instead of goods, and he understood that, at the same time, security was taken
Many of the poor of the electoral districts now flocked into , to insure the appointment of a resident medical officer ; and a
the towns, in consequence of the want of employ- gentleman named Green, a most competent person, had since
ment in the country, and if this mode of things been appointed to the office.
W 33 to proceed, the towns would soon be in the ' Mr. W. 0. STANLEY gave notice that,
same position as the country, and the towns would should call the attention of the House to the report of the
comequen ly be ruined. The clause was, therefore, totally Commissioners on this subject. on Tuesday, he
unnecessary, for, it it were adopted, the relief committee would IRISH PAUPERS.
be quite superseded, and the landlords would he quite unable Sir B. HALL wished to ask a question of the Right Hon.
to improve their property in Ireland. It must be a matter of Baronet the Secretary of State for the Home Department.
great cnxiety in that country, for it was ,idstst that He wished to know whether the Government had received any
if the principle of the clause was to be adopted, the lands ad- information with respect to 951 Irish paupers sent to Liverpool
joining the towns icmild have to bear the rates.—( Loud cries by the Mayor and inhabitants of Wexford, 130 of whom im-
of "Divide, divide.") mediately became chargeable to the
parish of Liverpool? He
Lor • DESA ItT said that the best criterion would he the dif. also wished to know whether any steps had been taken to prevent
ferent rates Which had been levied, and those which have to be the spread of disease consequent olion this influx of Irish paupers?
levied if these principles were to be applied. That dofference was Ile wished also to know whether it was the intention of her
between 6'.d. and 6s. 4',d.. but much stresshad been laid upon the Majesty's Government to take any steps to relieve the great
amount of money obtained for the rents in Ireland : but it should pressure of the poor's-rates in various parts of Eng'asal and
be recollected that the system pursued there was one grounded on Wales, by the influx of those upers and also, whether it was
a habit of taking the rack-rents, and these rents were collected the intention of her Majesty's Government to bring forward
pa ;
weekly. so that while. in fact, the number of persons who had any measure for the alteration of the law of settlement in
to pay the rase had decreased, the rents in many cases had in- Ireland ?
creased. This was a strong fact, which he thought it Sir CI GREY had received many communications upon
necessary to state, for between the census of 1t:31 and 1841, the subject , f the great amount of immigration of Irish pau-
there was a great difference, especially in the small towns ; pers to Liverpool. He had been informed that from the 15th
and in one instance which had come under his own particular I of January the number of Irish paupers who had arrived at Li-
knowledge, the population, which in 1631 was 5,431, had in verpool amounted to 18 1,000, of that number between 40,400
1841 been reduced to 4,152, and in another from 901 to 609. and 50,000 had emigrated again from that port, or gone further
Novv, these facts showed that there was s•tnething more than into the country. With reference to the adoption of wrea-
the rental to be attended to in framing a law that was to regu- sures to prevent 'he spread of disease, orders had
late the rates.—( Cheers, and cries of " Divide, divide.") been sent to the port of Liverpool, ordering that
Earl FITZ WILLIANI said that the clause was not rightly two ships should be set apart as lazaretto!, or Ims-
ap;slicable to all the districts, for in framing a poor-law for Ire- pital ships, so that all vessels coming into the Mersey
land, they ought to take all the districts—the high rated din- with deck passengers from Ireland shou'd be compelled to hoist
tricts as well as those which were rated lowly. The matter the yellow flag, and go alongside the lazarettos and put
was of the utmost importance, as it was necessary to equalise their sick passengers on board. This measure had given great
the rating between the town and country districts, and if this satisfaction to the inhabitants of Liverpool. With respect to
benefit was to be obtained, they ought to take some other the question of 250
paupers having been sent
means for it. from Wexford to Liverpool, it aeared that those
The Marquis of WESTMEATH conceived that the right persons were wrecked on the east of Wexf-rd, and
means had been adopttd for accomplishing the ends which the that a subscription had been entered into by the Mayor and
Government had in view, and he trusted that they would be inhabitants of Wexford to charter a vessel for the purpose of
careful in the steps which they took, for if it were necessary, carrying the poor people to Liverpool ; a letter was also
he would take the responsibility of ascending the steps of the sent with them, written by the Mayor of Wexford, recom-
throne, even though he was alone, for an improvement of their mending those persons to the justice and mercy of the
plan. people of England. He was not able either to state that the Go.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE would relieve the Noble vernment proposed to relieve the existing pressure upon the
Marquis behind him (the Marquis of Westmeath) of his res- poor-rates of the variona parishes in England ~nd Wales, and
ponsibility, by expressing his hope that the several Noble they were not prepared to make any alteration in the law of
Lards would take the course which the Government intended settlement in Ireland.

IRISH ABSENTEES.
Sir W. BARRON wished to know whether any measure
was to be introduced, to send back the 6,000,000/. of Irish
property spent in this country by Irish proprietors, because he
thought that, if the poor were to be sent back, it would be but
right that the property .hould also be sent back.—(Laughter.)
RAILWAYS BILL.
Mr. HODGSON wished to know whether any alteration
was proposed to be made in the Railway Bill, which he saw
was appointed for the second reading' on Friday next?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that it

was the intention of the Government to make some alterations
in the Bill. He thought that. the better course would be to
allow the Bill to be read a second time sub silentio upon that
occasion, and after that to take the discussion upon the pill.
Captain HARRIS said that he wished to ask the Noble
Lord, the First Lord of the Treasury, whether it was the in-
tention of her Majesty's Government to introduce any measure
to stop the continual exportation of wheat from this country ?
The return which he held in his hand, showed that 134,000
quarters of wheat went out of the country in the month ending
the fish April last, and there was reason to suppose that a
much greater quantity of wheat had been exported in the pre-
vious months.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that it was not the intention of the
Government to introduce any such measure.
ARMY RETURNS.
Mr. F. MAULE said that two days ago the Hon. and Gal-
lant Member for Liverpool obtained assent to a motion as an
unopposed return. It was a return of the surgeons, paymas-
ters, and quartermasters, with the dates of their services. He
(Mr. F. Maule) did not object to that, but the motion con-
cluded with an order for the grounds why those parties had
been excluded from the benefits of the recent advances made
in the officers of the army. He wished to make this state-
ment ere he made a motion on the subject, and he now gave
notice, that on Monday next, he would move that that portion
of the order be rescinded. Consideration for that department,
and the public service, required that this return should not be
made.
INCREASE OF PENSIONS TO THE SOLDIERS.
In answer to a question from Captain LAYARD,
Mr. F. MAULE said that it was the intention of the Go-
vernment to recommend the alteration of the warrant formerly
issued, so as to increase the minimum rate of 6d. to Bd. a day.
Also, to provide for an extra pay for good service, after 21 years.
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.
Mr. HORSMAN wished to know which measure the Go-
vernment intended to proceed with on Monday next. He
thought the Health of Towns Bill was in the list of orders for
that. day.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL replied, that it was his intention
to proceed with the Prisons and Transportation Bill on Monday.
hut preliminary to that, the Chancellor of the Exchequer would
bring some business under the consideration of the House.
THE CURRENCY.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, in bringing
this subject before the Mouse, said that he knew that great
anxiety prevailed on this subject, and he trusted that he would
be justified by its importance if he claimed the attention of
the House to the few observations he had to make upon it.
lle wished as briefly as possible to state what were the inten-
tions Of the i;overnment, and, in thiing so, he need hardly say
that the qua slion had occupied the anxious consideration and
attention i.f the Government. His Noble Fiend and himself
had I eceived from day to day numerous deputations of various
parties, and they were in constant communication
with those persons who were the best able to
give them information upon the matter.—( Hear. )
He did not wish to raise any discussion this evening upon the
subject of the currency, but he might tt once inform the House
that the Government were not prepared to adopt any alteration
in the Act of 1844.—(Cheers.) Having made that declaration
he might also add, that the Governmeut did not desire to in-
terfere with that accommodation which it was so desirable to
give in a great commercial country like the present. Neither
did he conceive that any necessity for more stringent measures
exi=ted, and however depressed the money market might be,
still he was glad to say that there was an appearance of improve-
scent in the Bank of England. The last return from the Bank
exhibited a receipt in gold and silver bullion of 4')0,00(t/.
He should, on the usual day, the 18th of May, give the usual
notice for the exchange of Exchequer bills. He thought
it indispensable to raise the rate of interest on new bills from
the day of exchange at 3d. per diem.— (Hear, hear.) He was
happy to state that the bank had found itself in a condition to
make advances on Exchequer hills. He was happy to state
that the demand was far less than was expected, it not having
exceeded 170,0001. He was also ha y
to state that the seve-
rity of pressure had passed over. HeprrOsed on Monday next
to move that the House do
go into Committee for the purpose
of empowering the
Government b Act of Parliament, of
course, to pay interest on advances
by way of discount. On
former occasions it had been usual to
ask for payment of the
whole that might be due, but he did not wish to do that. He
,
y
proposed, therefore, to pay interest, by way of discount on all
sums of money paid
uwpa
st o
to t hs
aeypie f r iaondy wbhoedny
Any person who Paid any portion of his instalment previous to
h
,
the 1•:th or 19,h of June, that might subsequently become due,
previous to the 18th cr 19th of June next.
would be entitled to receive discount calculated from that date
ment, he would receive one month's interest, or if he paid his
J •Iy instalment, he would lie entitled to two month's interest;
e
or if he paid his August instalment
tph,eidinusptaelmarelyntiwnoul‘licalybehciosm
JeudnueeinTsthaal-t
he would be entitled to
three months interest, and so in like manner paying instalments
in June. He expected that a considerable sum
of money would
be paid up in this way, sufficient indeed to enable the Exche-
quer to discharge its liabilities. He proposed now with the
permission of the House, to move that the House. should, on
Monday, go into Committee for the purpose of considering and
authorising the payment of interest in advances by way of dis-
count.

The motion was agreed ta.
PUNISHMENT ON VAGRANT (IRELAND) BILL.
On the question bein
13111, g put for going into Committee on this
Mr. P. SCROPE said he wished to ask a question of the
Noble Lord at the head of the Goverment. It was of the
utmost importance that this question should be decided, and
that the House and the eottntry should know whether the poor-
law for Ireland was to be of a permanent, or only of a tempo-
rary character. If it were to be permanent for three years
only, much uncertainty would be created; and he would draw
the attention of the House to the fact, to the belief, that if it
were to be only of a temporary character, it would be worth-
less and hopeless. The poor would not confide in it, and the
rich would not act upon it, or in any way promote the general
welfare of the country ; for the absentee landlords, who are
now spending their incomes in France or Italy, would not
return to do their duty to their country, and look .t.ter
their property.—( Hear, hear.) On the contrary, if it
were to be of a permanent character, it would be in
every way useful, and he trusted, therefore, that the Bill would
be of a permanent nature. The people of this country had
come to the decision that the time had arrived when some
measures should be taken for preventing the people of this
country from falling into the deplorable state of misery which
had fallen upon the people of Ireland. They had corns to that
opinion from motives which were quite justifiable. He knew
that they had to maintain their own poor, and that unless some
provision of a permanent nature was made for the relief of the
poor of Ireland, the industrious people of England would come
into the condition of the Potato-fed and miserably paid people
of that country. He therefore wished to ask the Noble Lord
whether he was prepared to-night to state what the permanent
character of the Bill would be?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said the Hon. Gentleman had
asked him for an explanation as to whether the Government
should ge on with the present Bill pending the proceedings in
another place. In the first place, he might answer, he was
more than ever convinced that such a Bill for the relief of the
poor of Ireland was necessary. Still, he he did not think that
a reason for postponing the present Bill. He thought, how-
hhei
ngke ni et rwaol
uclhdarbaec trerr4sevri tthoeut a similar
ever, that if the general Bill was limited in its operation' in
p&nt of time, he could not ask the House to pass the present
give way to
Hintoft
limitation.
measure, which was
a feoling of jealousy reaard to the proeeediugs elsewhere.
or that they should say, that unless the Poor Relief Bill was
passed in another place, they would not agree to the Vagrancy
13111 here. He hoped they w,)uld go into Committee now,
and at some future stage of the Bill they could consider
whether they should introduce clauses to limit its duration,
or should the other Bill not pass, to refuse the present Bill
altogether. With regard to such a poor-law for Ireland as
they had agreed to, he was
it more than ever convinced of its ne-
cessity, and that the Bill as had passed through that House was
absolutely required. He had only that day received a state-
ment respectirg a poor 403. freeholder, who, for many years,
had been the serf or slave of a landed proprietor, who having
accepted a small sum for his freehold, was turned out and
allowed to starve, and his wife and child had vied for want of
food refused by those on whose lands he had lived for many
1•-ars.—( Loud cries of "Name, name,)
He certainly shouldnot,
nOt, 1 ut he thought no one could be blind to the circumstances
which were passing in Ireland, and the necepity there
was for an efficient measure for relief. Though
this had not been the case, he
certainly thought
that, in the transition state from the public,
works to the permanent measure for relief, that, the proprietors
in the neighbourhood of the places where the poor people
lived, should find the means for that purpose. He would only
further remark, that two gentlemen who had hitherto opposed
out-door relief (Mr. Richards, the Commissioner, and Mr.
Gulson, the assistant Commissioner) had expressed their
opinion that in the present state of Ireland such relief
was necessary.
Mr. S. CRAWFOftD hoped that the third reading of this

- •
Bill would not take place until the House was put in pos-
session of the fate of the Bill in another place.
Mr. F. FRENCH thought the question put by the
Honourable Member for Stroud was fairly answered
by the Noble Lord at the head of the Government.
He did not ve any principle which could justify the Hon.
Member for Montrose in putting the que-tion whether these
advances to the relief of Ireland should be postponed, until the
question at present under consideration in another place—he
meant the Irish poor-law—was settled. The Hon. Member
should remember that these advances were for the purpose of
Meeting the distress which prevailed, and he could riot accede
that Ireland should be dealt with in a different manner from
England or Scotland.

Mr SHAW said that it was rery inconvenient in discussing
what was passing in the other house, but he did not think that
they ought to plss the Bill referred to unless their was a right
to relief. He considered that it was very unjust in the Noble
Lord to refer to the case he did without giving the name of the
party, as by his so doing he made the case apply to a whole
class, which was neither just nor reasonable. He therefore
wished that the House would forbear forming en epinion on
that statement, for he did believe that the Irish landlords were
doing their best, under very difficult circums'anees, to relieve
the distress.

Sir H. W. BARRON complained that many humane and
philan•hropic landlords in Ireland had been attacked in that
House for ne,zlwing their duzirs, when, in tru h, they were
struggling by all the means in their power under the most
adverse circums'ances that men could be placed in to relieve
the poverty and distress that was about them. They should
recollect that Ireland had no native manutac!ures ; that her
landlords were absentees, and spent their money here and
abroad, and that the soil was ins overished in conse-
quence ; and, therefore, Honourable Members who had
never been in Ireland, and who knew little or nothing
about that country went too far whcn they legislated
for Ireland in this way, and without an adequate knowledge
of her requirements. With all respect for his Hon. Friend
the Member for Stroud, he must say that this was a most im-
proper time for him to have brought forward his motion. He
( Sir W. Barron) had always been in favour of a poor-law for
Leland ; but, at the same time, lie objected to its being made
a permanent measure, and he had the same objection to this
measure being made a permanent measure, because he had
great doubts as to how it would work.
Mr. ROSS said he bad looked urn the Bill as a hazardous
experiment, b;it he knew they must risk something, and there-
fore he should support it. He hoped, however, that no com-
binations would be entered into to prevent the carrying out of
measure.—( Hear, hear.) He hoped, at the same time,
that the poor-law wonld not be so mutilated in the other House
of Parliament, as to render it defective; if it were so muti-
lated, they would have to perform again all the work they had
done.

Mr. B. ESCOTT said vagrancy in Ireland was punishable
by transportation, and in order to discover how the present law
worked, he had moved for returns on the subject, and complained
that the returns had not been furnished. He stigmatised the
conduct of those who, acting in opposition to the Noble Lord,
had succeeded in mutilating the Poor-law Bill ; but he con-
sidered that the Noble Lord might now appeal to the country
with far greater confidence and sympathy than at any past
period of his administration.
Mr. TRELAWN Y said Ireland had long recognised a per-
manent poor-law, and that was decidedly the feeling of the
House. He trusted the Government would persevere in
endeavouring to pass the Poor-law Bill as left by that House.
The House then went into Committee on the Bill.

Clause Ist was agreed to.
On clause 2 being proposed,
Mr. P. SCROPE proposed an amendment, to the effect
that the capability,of a man who deserted his family to support
them, should be inquired into before his conviction.
Mr. SHAW said the law referred to existed, and that
vagrants were liable to seven years' transportation. It was an
objectionable law, but it did not work the mischief the Hon.
Gentleman (Mr. Escott) seemed to conceive.

Mr. S. CRAWFORD said the law was not often put in
force, but prostitutes and disorderly persons were occasionally
brought up before grand Juries at quarter sessions, in accord-
ance with it, and punished under it. It was a law which ought
at once to be repealed.
Mr. SHAW said no persons were punished under the Act
unleas there was presumptive evidence of crime against them.
Mr. B. ESCOTT said the Hon. Gentleman's statement
confirmed his worst suspicions with respect to the existing law
of vagrancy, and that it placed a man in great danger of losing
his liberty for years if an act of simple vagrancy was proved
against him. In England men were not punished on presump-
tive evidence of crime. The law had been carried out against
several persons, as the returns he had moved for would show ;
and if he was not able to procure them, he should endeavour to
get them through some other source.
Mr. HENLEY considered it necessary that it should be
clearly ascertained whether a man had wilfully deserted his
family, or whether he had been compelled to leave them from
distress.

Mr. P. SCROPE explained. It was unfortunately a com-
mon practice in Ireland for men to slesert their families, but
they frequently did so from distress ; for instance. to work else-
where ; he simply asked them to introduce a proviso to pre-
vent a man from being imprisoned three months, who had not,
in the strict sense of the word, deserted his family.
After a desultory conversation, the amendment was with-
drawn and the clause agreed to.
On clause 3 being read,
Mr. 111. O'FERt{ ALL suggested to the Government the
proprietary of limiting or defining the class of persons who
were to carry the provisions of this clause into effect.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said there were two classes of men-

dicants in Ireland; one living upon the hospitality of their
friends, wandering nbout from place to place, and the other de-
manding relief where their intimidating acts could extort it.
Now this clause was to suppress that state of things. The
country was more infested with mendicants and sturdy beggars
than this country before the law was passed for punishing wilful
mendicarcy, and relieving the destitute poor. True
it would be difficult to effect the reform in-

tended to be brought about by this clause but the
wandering mendicant habits of a large body of the
Irish peasantry must be changed before they could work any
good in that country, and he had, therefore, no hesitation in

„ .
presqng for the continuance of this clause in its present form.
Mr. M. OTERRALL said the Noble Lord had misunder-
stood him. lie did not object to ;he powers proposed to be
taken by the clause. All that he wanted was, that the exe-
cution of the powers should be trusted to cauticus and discreet
hands.

Mr. GREGORY agreed with the Noble Lord thlt the
mendicant habits of th,. people sta.: a curse to Ireland, and he
should certainly vote for the clause.

After a few Words from Mr. BELLEW, who supported the

Sir WALTER JAMES said they were about to attempt a
dangerous experiment, for the confirmed habits of a people were
not so easily changed as some Hon. Gentlemen might suppose.
Besides, it must be remembered that they were dealing with a
Roman Catholic people, who entertained a feeling that they
had a right to big, and they ought therefore, to be the more
cautious in legi,lating upon this subject. He apprehended that
all that would he required, was now and then to make an
example of incorrigible mendicants, and he thought, instead of
the power to commit for the offence of begging being vested in
the hands of one magistrate, it ought to be extended to two
justices of the peace in petty sessions assembled.
After a few words from Sir G. GREY,
Mr. P. SCROPE said there could be no doubt that men-
dicancy was practised to a very great extent in Ireland, by
persons who were not really destitute. Many Irish beggars
had been known to give their daughters marriage portions,
while he found it related by Mr. Carlton in his tales of the
Irish peasantry that is Ireland it not unfrequently happened
that a beggar called upon a farmer to beg a little meal, and
finding that he had none, offering to sell a peck, which he had
in his possession, below the market price. An effort he
thought, however difficult, ought to be made to put an end to
such a state of things as that.—(hear, hear.)
Mr. D. CALLIGAN said no one was more anxious to put
a atop to professional mendicancy in Ireland than he was ; but
it was a difficult task to alter the habits of a people. The
Irish people were remarkable for their hospitality, and he knew
many small farmers who took a delight in relieving all who
applied to them in the character of destitute poor. If they
could pass a Bill which should restrain the donor from Firing
he thought they would be striking a blow at the root of the
evil ; but in the existing state of feeling and affairs in Ireland,
he could not consent to the passing of a Bill of pains and
penalties pressing wholly upon the poor.—( Hear, hear.)
After a few words from Lord Sandon, Mr. More O'Ferrall,
Sir D. Norreys. Mr. Young, and Lord Arundel,

Mr. P. SCII.OPE moved a verbal amendment.
The gallery was ordered to be cleared, but the amendment
was withdrawn without a division.

The clause was then agreed to.
The 4th clause, as amended, was agreed to ; so were 5,6,
7,8, and tine other clauses.

The House resumed, and the report was ordered to be
brought up on Nionday next.

POOR RELIEF SUPERVISION (IRELAND) BILL

No. 11.

I part to the Bill, bat at the same time he could not help ex-
pressing his conviction that it would ultimately he found to fall
far short of the necessity of the occasion which had led to its
introduction.—( Hear.) During the last few years great alte-
rations had been made with respect to the removal of the poor
both in England and Scotland. Till 1844 the burden of re-
moving the poor was placed upon the counties, and, conse-
quently, when it was a county charge and not a parochial one,
there was much less hesitation in carrying it into exe •
cution. He believed the task was so extremely one-
rous before the Irish pauper could be removed; there
were so many obstructions and so many heavy charges
on the parishes that it was resorted to with reluctance ;
and, in addition, the pauper must be accompanied by an officer,
but he hoped that the time would come when the destitute
Irish poor would be relieved in their own country ; but until
that time did arrive, it would be better to consider whether
the destitute Irish poor could not be removed in a more sum-
mary and cheaper manner than at present. Yet though this
Bill would remove some of the difficulties, it would not remove
some of the objections which now existed to the removal of the
Irish. With respect to Liverpool, the Right Hon. Baronet
(Sir G. Grey) had stated that he had adopted what he ( Sir
James Graham) considered proper measures of quarantine with
respect to the proprietors of steamers in the habit of bringing
over large numbers of destitute paupers; but if he was
rightly informed, the state of things in Liverpool was ex•
tremely anomalous. For instance, there was a stipendiary ma-
gistrate in Liverpool, who, because he entertained some scru-
ples with respect to the state of things in Ireland, would not
grant warrants for the removal of destitute persons to Ireland,
unless a mandamus was moved for in the Court of Queen's
Bench; therefore the law relating to the removal of the poor
wa' suspended by a stipendiary magistrate. But this was not
all ; the Liverpool ratepayers wished to get the destitute
Irish distributed over the whole country, and money had actu-
ally been advanced to pass them, by the aid of cheap trains, to
the metropolis. What would this lead to? It would infallibly
lead to disease, and the English labourer wr,i'd be
brought, of necessity, to the condition of the Irish labourer.—
(Cheers.) Disease, poverty, and misery would, therefore, be
spread throughout the metropolis---( Hear, hear)—and the Go-
vernment would ultimately be compelled to resort to mea-
sures to send the destitute poor to their own country. This
measure, so far from being sufficient for the emergency, would
be found vastly insufficient, and must come again before Par-
liament, when measures equivalent to the necessity which
required them, would be found indispensahle.—( Hear, hear.)
,Ir. P. SCROPE thought a change absolutely necessary,
and that the present shuttlecock system ought to be done away
with. They ought, at all events, not to rest till the soil of
Ireland was made to sustain the Irish poor.
Mr. FRENCH objected to the Hon. Member far Stroud
always referring to the conduct of the people of Ireland in those
matters relating to England.
Mr. CARDWELL called the attention of the Hon. Mem-
ber for Roscommon to the condition of Liverpool during the
last few months. Liverpool, which with a population of
300,000, had had added to it 100,000 destitute Irish persons,
who had been treated by the inhabitants of that town in the
most exemplary manner. Now the object of the present Bill
was to afford a relief to this state of things.
Sir W. BARRON agreed with the Hon. Member for Mayo
in his objection to the portion of the Bill relating to the
removal of the Irish poor from England. The Bill empowered
magistrates in the most summary manner to take up any per-
son on the suspicion of pauperism, and send them out of the
country. Now if Ireland was a portion of the United King-
dom, he could not see how such an arbitrary law should exist.
He could not see how they should apply a different law to Ire-
land, to that they would impose on Scotland or Yorkshire. A
more dangerous, unwise, and impracticable measure was never
devised by any man having common sense. It wasa law more
adapted for Russia, than a country professing to be free.
Lord SANDON was surprised at the indignation expressed
by the Hon. Member. Were it really intended to deprive the
people, coming from Ireland to this country, then there might
be some reason for it. But this was not the object of the Bill.
Its object was to do away with a technical objection which pre-
vented the proper working of the measure, the intention of
which was to provide for the removal of those who could not
give any explanation that they were not paupers, and likely to
become dependent on English relief.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER hoped the
statement of the Noble Lord would satisfy those who had ex-
pressed themselves against the Bill. He must say he had
been much surprised at the speech of the Hon. Member for
Roscommon, which proceeded on an entire misunderstanding
of the Bill. It was a measure applicable to all parts of the
empire alike—whether Scotland or the Isle of Man, as well as
Ireland. It was provided that wherever a person became
chargeable to a parish in England, if he was a native of any
of those places, he could be removed there. A simi-
lar provision existed in the Scotch poor-law, as ap •
plied to the natives of England, the Isle of
Alan, or Ireland.—(Hear.) At present a summons
was necessary in order to effect a removal; but the circum-
stances of Liverpool, from the immense number of paupers
there, were such, that the present alteration was proposed,
which was, that the overseer, or relieving officer, who was

applied to for relief should have the power to take the party so
applying before a magistrate, who had the power, on examina-
tion, to order a removal. The whole object of the Bill was to
dispense with the: service of the summons, and he must
say, that he could not see in the Bill any peculiar hardship to
Ireland.

Sir H. W. BARRON did not object to the poor being
removed from England to Ireland, but he really did object
to the monstrous provisions of thif Bill.
Mr. P. SCROPE explained.

Mr. WAKLEY much regretted having heard the speech of
the Hon. Baronet who had just sat down, calculated, as it was,
to produce ill feeling in Ireland. After the millions this coun-
try had voted to Ireland for her relief, he was surprised to hear
the language used by the Hon. Baronet, particularly when► he
remembered that had the landed interest of Ireland done their
duty towards the poor of their own country, much of the pre-
sent misery would have been averted. Notwithstanding that,
the Hon. Baronet considered the present proposed relaxation
of the law was unjust, he very much feared the law would still
remain inoperative, owing to the great expense which the
removal of the poor involved. Why, in his own
parish, or rather a parish in this metropolis with which he was
recently connected, of all the removals that took place every
eleven out of twelve were Irish paupers. Why, then, (lid th.e
Honourable Baronet sue such language as he had done to that
House. Had the Hon. Baronet read the return which had re-
cently been made upon the present state of the poor in Ireland?
If he had he must have seen that in Cork hundreds, nay,

thousands were dying of fever without a hand to help them to
a cup of water to quench their burning thirst. What were
the Irish gentry about ?—( Hear, hear.) It was time
this vountry spoke out. Already the ill effects of this neglect
oa the part of the Irish gentry had made their appearance,
within a few miles of this metropolis. He grieved to say it,
but it was too true. that the typhus fever had broken out in
many of the metropolitan workhouses, and it was high time the
♦oice of this country was heard. He ur der4tood that in an

other place a ,uceessful attempt bad been made to restrict the
operation of a poor-law for Ireland, but he warned the Iri,h
landed interest that the time was coming when this country
would be compelled, in self-defence, to force such a law upon
their.

Dlr. FORBES said he was unfortunate enough to have taken
an unpopular view of the Irish question, but still he did not
object to the passing of this Bill, though he must protest
against the abuse which some Hon. Gentlemen in that House
were continually heaping upon Irish landlords. As a body
the landed interest of Ireland had strove hard to do their

duty, and it was too bad that they should be subjected to abuse
because they could not mitigate all the evils that surrounded
them without having recourse to s,one adventitious aid.
Mr. GRAINGER sad in his opinion Irish Members had a
perfect right to objt•ct to the passing of this Bill. Its rowers
might be necessary, but there was no protection against their
being abused.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said it appeared to him,
from what had fallen from the Hon. Gentleman who had just
sat down, that Ii ish 'Members did not object to the principle of
the Bill, but only to the mariner in which it was proposed to be
carried out. He had therefore thought that this discussion
would have produced more beneficial and effective results, had
it been deferred till they got into Committee on the Bill.
Sir ROBERT FERGUSON did not deny that the distress
mentioned by the Hon. Member for Finsbury was terribly
severe, but still it did not follow that the guardians and
relievers of the poor had not done their duty. If the lion.
Member would move for a return of what they had done, he
would find that they had been most energetic in their efforts to
mitigate the distress and suffering, while several of the resident
gentry had fallen victims to their praiseworthy exertions to aid
in assuaging the prevailing ',misery of the people. No doubt
there were instances where the guardians had neglected their
duties, but in far the greater number of instances (arid the
absence of many Hon. Members from that House proved the
assertion) they had nobly remained to adminster to the sick in
their neighbourhood.

The Bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be
committed.
On the question that the House resolve itself into Committee
of Supply,
POST-OFFICE ARRANGEMENTS IN THE
HEBRIDES.

On the order of the day for going into Committee on
this Bill,
Sir ROBERT FERGUSON remarked that the commis-
sion under this Bill was made permanent; whereas by the
English measure it lasted for only five years. The Hon- Ba-
ronet cursorily remarked several other minor differences be-
between the English and Irish Bills. He thought, if the two
countries were to be similarly governed, the two measures had
better be the same; and he wished to know from the Noble
Lord what was the reason for introducing these differences.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said with regard to one of the dif-
ferences alluded to by the lion. Baronet, namely, that this
Bill was limited in its time of operation ; he had to state that
since the Bill had been introduced, the Government had re-
volved to alter this provision to five years, the time in the
It was impossible to expect that every provi-
sion of the Bills should be the same, considering the different
character of the two nations ; but the general principle exist-
ing in the English measure had beeu adopted for ‘he measure
LAHouseit E , thana n wentother into
Hon.
Gentlemen, Committee
w Bill.a
sagreed
to.
for Ireland. Saving some small difference the Bits might be
said to be nearly similar.
Thel
Clause 1, after a few remarks from Mr. P. SCRUFF, Mr.
oucn
As were clauses 2 and 3.
Clause 4 was agreed to as amended.
On clause 5, Sir R. FERGUSON remarked, the difference
between this provision and the corresponding provision in the
English measure, which required the secretaries, &c., to act
under a seal.

Mr. H. BAILLIE rose to call the attention of the House
to the defective postal arrangements in the Hebrides. The Hon.
Member said that hitherto the only means of postal communi-
cation with Long Island, one of the Hebrides, was by a packet
maintained at the joint expense of Lord Macdonald and Col.
Gordon, the two principal proprietors. A few years ago Col.
Gordon withdrew his contribution to the support of the packet,
and in consequence of the many and repeated calls upon him,
caused by the distress at present existing, Lord Macdonald
had threatened to withdraw his proportion also. The people would
thus he deprived of all post-office communication. He had
thought it necessary to call the attention of the Government
to the subject, in the hope that they would adopt some means
of affording this very necessary accommodation.
Mr. PARKER said that although no official report had
been made to the Treasury, he had no doubt the attention of
the Postmaster would be given to the subject.

SUPPLY.
The House then went into Committee.
A vote of 453,756/. was taken for defraying the charges of
the Commissariat department.
A vote of 40,646/. was taken for the half-pay and pension
allowances.

Mr. F. FRENCH agreed with the Hon. Baronet. Ac-
cording to this Bill, the officers, like all officers in Ireland,
were to be irresponsible. He complained that in the Board
of Works there was no one to answer for complaints.
The clause was then agreed to, as was clause 6.
Clauses 7 and 8 were postponed.
Clause 9, as amended, was agreed to ; so was clause 10.
Clauses, from 11 to 14, were then agreed to.
On clause 15 being proposed,
Sir ROBERT FERGUSON proposed an amendment,
which he, however, immediately withdrew ; and the remain-
ing clauses having been agreed to, the House resumed. Re-
port on Monday.
POOR REMOVAL BILLAND. L (ENGLAND AND SCOT-
Sir G. GREY moved the second reading of this Bill.
Sir 1). NORREYS complained that the Bill would injuri-
ously affect those Irish persons who had become residents in
this country.
Sir G. GREY said that the bill did not materially differ
from the Poor Removal Bill which had been passed ; the
only material difference was, that the process by which a person
was removed to his legal settlement, was more simple, more
expeditious, and less expensive than at present. Thus, if a
Jerson became chargeable, he would be immediately summoned
before a magistrate, before whom he would be examined as to
his settlement, to which he would, in the ordinary course,
he removed ' • but he would not be removed because be WAS an
Irishman. The House was no doubt aware that many com-
plaints had recently come fi om Liverpool, with respect to the
immigration of destitute Irish persons into that town—in fact,
to such an extent had this taken place, that the workhouse
accommodation was quite inadequa`e for their reception. If a
summons was applied for against any of them, it was wholly
inoperative, as the person to whom it was directed, could not
frequently be found. This would be remedied by the Bill
before the House ; as its object was to render it necessary that
parties coming over from Ireland, or from a place from another
part of this country, should at once be examined, and an order
made at once, if the case was a tit one for removal ; but no
one at present, not liable to be removed, would be removed
under this Bill.
sir J. GRAIIAM said he should be glad to givebib sup.

On the proposition that a vote of 50,000/. be taken for the
works on the Caledonian Canal,
Mr. HUME and Mr. WILLIAMS objected on the grounds
that the canal was worthless as a national work.
After a degiltery conversation, the vote was agreed to. The vote if 20,476/. for the paving and lighting, &c., public
buildings in Ireland was agreed to.
The vote of 23,000/. for the salaries and expenses attending
the Houses of Parliament was agreed to.
The following votes were agreed to:-
26 9001., for salaries and expenses in the department of
the Treasury.
16,4001., for salaries and expenses in the Home Depart-
ment.
71,0001., for salaries, &c. in the Secretary' office for Fo-
reign Affairs.
18,000/., for salaries, &c. in the Secretary's office for the
Colonies.
37,700/., for salaries in the offices
of
2,000/., for salaries in the office of the
PrivyehLordl'riCvoyuS Council.
26,72 salaries
2/., for in the offices of the Paymaster Ge-
neral.
The next vote proposed was 15,823/. for the salary and
expenses of the office of the Comptroller-General of the Ex-
chequer.
Colonel
SIBTHORP opposed the vote on the ground that
the office was an useless one, and ought to be " knocked off."
—lt was, however, agreed to.
The next vote was 2,620/. to pay the salaries of the officers
and the expenses of the State Paper-office—vihich was also
agreed to.
3,440/. was next proposed to defray the expenses of the
EcelesisAtical Commissioners to the 31st of March last.
Mr. WILLIAMS opposed the Bill on the ground that the
expenses of the commission ought to be paid out of the ample
revenues
revenues of the Church.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL explained that it was arranged at
the time the commission was appointed, that its expenses
should be paid by the State.
Mr. HUME urged the Noble Lord to postpone the vote
until the mode in which the money was expended was laid in
detail betore the House. The Hon. Gentleman the Member for
Mahlon had a motion on the paper for that purpose—so that
the House would soon be in a position to judge of the expen-
diture.
Mr. GOULBURN defended the Church,
that the State ought to pay for the expense of and
considered
the Commis-

•ion, as they had to perform a national duty with reap •ct t•
education.

Mr. HUME considered that his Presbyterian constit, cents
ought not to be called upon to pay for a Commission st •hick
had no sympathy for their religious predilections.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL could not consent to post pone
the Bill.

After a desultory conversation,
The vote was agreed to.
A vote of 182 2,.V. fair the administration of the Poov-Itw,
England and Scotland, having been proposed,
Colonel SIBTHORPE thought this Poor-law Commission
was only fraught with evil, and he could not support the vote.
Mr. BANKES did not wish to anticipate the discussion
on the new Poor-law Commission Bill, and therefore he would
move that the present vote be postponed till after that debate,
and that in the meantime Mr. Green report progress.
Sir G. GREY assured the Hon. Gentleman that that Bill
would not be read a second time for a considerable period, an d
he did not see what bearing these debates might have upon
this vote.
Captain PECHELL said that he perfectly agreed with
what had fallen from the Member for Downshire it was per-
reedy preposterous to vote away this money until they were
aware how this board was to be reconstituted.
Mr. PHILIP HOWARD said that it appeared from the
general feelings of this House, that it would be better to post-
pone the vote to a future occasion.
Mr HUNIE concurred in the propriety of the suggestion.
Sir G. GREY said that the present vote was tikes with a
view to pay the expenses of the new establishment.
The vote was then agreed to.

...s.
The [louse then resumed, the Chairman reported progress,
and obtained leave to sit again,
Leave was gran.rd to sit again on Monday.
PASSENG ERS ACT AM E NDM ENT BILL.
On the motion for leave to go into Committee,

Lord GEORGE BENTINCK called attention to a Bill
of the same nature passed in the United States.
He had to propose several amendments in this Act, which he
conceived were calculated to improve it. The nature of these
were to improve the sea-worthiness of emigrant ships, ansl its
general of all transport ships.
The Bill was passed through Committee.
The Savings' Bank Annuity Bill was read &second time. and
ordered to be committed.

The report of the Land Drainage Bill was brought up.
The other orders of the day were then thaposed of, and the
Houle adjourned at Half-past Twelve o'clock.

IRISH POOR-LAW BILL.
HOUSE OF LORDS.-MAT 6.
FIRST DIVISION IN COMMITTER
CONTENTS.
Warwick
Nelson
Stradbroke
Desart
Digby
Erne
Malmesbury
Lucan
Fitzwilliam
Stanhope
Delawarr
Shrewsbury
Clare
Lovelace
Radnor
Wilton

'MEE&
Buckingham
Cleveland
Montrose
Richmond

MARQUISES,
Abereom
Headfort
Westmeath
EARLS.

Rosse
Ennisktilon
Roden
Eglintoun
Dartmouth
Limerick
Sheffield
Somers
Clancarty
Hardwicke
Leven and Melville
Orford
Eldon
Iladdington

DLTE.S.

Norfolk
St. Albans
MARQUISES.
Lansdon ne
Clanricarde
Westminster
Conyngh am
EARLS.

Galloway
Clanwllliam
St. Germans
Grey
Shaftesbury
Mint°
Clarendon
Auckland

VISCOIINTS.
Combermere
Strangford
Hereford
ARCHBISHOP.
Dublin

BISHOP.

Devon
Fortescue
Ilchester

Exeter.;

NON-CONTENTS.

EARLS.
Yarborough
Cowper
Granville
Fingall
Essex
Waidegrave
Ellesmere
Vernlam
Morley
Ripon
Harewood
Craven
Uxbridge

VISCOUNT.

BARONS.
Monteagle, of Bra
don
Stanley
Saltouu
Gage
Isiorthwick
Blayne,'
Downes:
Templemore
De Ros
Redesdale
Abinger
Middleton (V. Aral
rick)
Colchester,
Rayleigh
Castlemaina
Boston
Tenterden
Bolton
Ashburton
Faversham

Clifton

BISHOPS.

Durham
Ilereford

aisnor.
St. David's
BARON,.
Campbell'
Cotttnham
Erskine
Strafford
Colborne
Lilford
Dacre
Foley
Montfort
Beaumont
Hatherton
Carrington
Camoys
Kenyon
Kinnaird
Wharncliffe

PAIRS.
Earl of Zetland, till 10 o'clock
Lord Arundel
Duke of Bedford
Earl Spencer
Marquis of Anglesey
Lord Bruce
Earl of Effingham
Lord Vivian
Viscount Falkland
Earl Roseberry
Lord Portman
Duke of Roxburgh
Lord Byron, 10 o'clock
Lord Beauvale
Lord Sudeley
E..rl of Camperdown, half past 9
Earl Duels
Lord Crewe
Lord Langdale
Lord Leigh
Viscount Sydney, 10 o'clock
Lord Glenelg.

Earl of Lonsdale
Lord Grantley
Earl of Charleville
Marquis of Exeter
Duke of Beaufort
Lord Wynford
Lord Willoughby d'Eresby
Earl Tankerville
Marquis of Ailsa
Viscount Beresiord
Earl of Munster
Lord Southampton
Earl of Orkney
Duke of Newcastle
Lord Sondes
Earl of Sandwich
Duke of Manchester
Lord De Lisle
Lord Colville
Earl of Cardigan
Lord ltrougham
Lord Feversham

LA.W INTELLIGENCE.
ROLLS COURT, May 7.

THE EARL OF GLENGALL V. LANHAM).
This was the petition of the plaintiff for an inquiry as to
the intention of a testatcr, Mr. Mellish, and in the event of
his finding, that the Ccuntesa of Glengall, who was the
daughter of the testator, was entitled to let certain pro-
perty in the Isle of Dogs on building leases.
Mr. TURN ER appeared in support of the petition, and his
Lordship granted the required order.

VICE-CHANCELLO-.J' u)(7I2T, May 7.
(Before Vice-Chancellor Sir J. WIGRAM.)
MONEYPENNT V. DERING.
This cause turned upon the construction of a will. The
facts have already appeared in this journal, and the question
came befbre this C,,urt with the view of overruling the deci-
sion of the Curt of Exchequer, which determined that the
word " son" in the will of one of the devisees limited the
estate to :he last male.
Ills Ilosouft said it was the practice of the Court in cases
inch as the present to carry out the intention of the testator,
but he should refer the case to a court of law.
It was then arranged that the case should be brought
before the Court cf Commnn Pleas.

•
COURT OF QUEEIV'S 13111 V CH, May 7.
(SzttingA in Banco.)
HARE: V. ATTWOOD.
lii this case an application was made fin. a new trial on
the ground that the plaintiff omitted material evidence at a
previous trial, when a verdict had been entered for the de-
fendant. An application having been made at the time, the
point was reserved for argument.
The CoultT refwed the application, as it was not supported
by affidavit.
Several other cases of no importance were then disposed of.

COURT OF COMMON PLEAS, May 7.
(Sittings in Bnnco )
MISCHKIN V. ROSCI.
In this case an application was made for an attachment
against a Mr. Levi, a Sheriff's officer of the county of Slid-
diesex. It appeared that the plaintiff owed 161. ISs., and that
this officer continued to levy sums of money to the amount
of 251. 10s.. and afterwards made a seizure on the goods of
the plaintiff, a Air. Rosci, a merchant residing in Regent-
street, to the extent of 121.
The CounT were of opinion that a rule should issue calling
on the Slwriff and Mr. Levi, or one or either of them, to re-
fund the money.

MOVEMENTS or TROOPS.—The Bricklayers' Arms
station of the South-Eastern Railway was visited by great
numbers of persons on Wednesday and Thursday to witness
the arrival and departure of troops at that station. On
Wednesday a part of the Ist division of the 57th Regiment
arrived there from Dover early in the afternoon, and soon
afterwards the Ist division of the 89th depot. left the same
station for Dover. Yesterday afternoon the second portion
of the Ist division of the 57th Regiment arrived at the
Bricklayers' Arms station from Dover, accompanied by th•
regimental band and numerous officers. The second portion
of the Ist division of the 89th depot left the same station
shortly afterwards for Dover. The area outside the station
was crowded with friends and relatives of the troops, nume-
rous carriages with the officers, ladies, and children; those
with the baggage waggons and other military accompani-
ments caused quite a stir in the neighbourhool. In addition
to these troops several companies of the 89th Regiment pro-
. ceeded by the South-Eastern Railway from Reigate to
Dover. both on Wednesday and Thursday, en route from
Chichester. In each case special trains were dispatched.
and we hear that the several commanding officers expressed
the greatest satisfaction with the admirable military service
arrangements made by the South-Eastern Railway Com-
pany.

- CONTINENTAL COMMUNICATION. The South-
F;astern and Continental Steam Ship Company's vessel,
the Queen of the Belgians, arrived at Folkestone, from
Boulogne, at half-past two o'clock on Thus, lay afternoon,
having 70 passengers on board; among whom were Lord
Beauchamp, Sir George Irvine, and Captains Johnson and
Preston, R.N. The steamer Queen of the French sailed from
Folkestone for Boulogne at three o'clock yesterday afternoon,
having 74 passengers and one carriage on bord.
ROYAL ARTILLERY. WOOLWICH, MAY 6.
Lieutenant Godby, Lieutenant Govan, Lieutenant
120 non-commissioned officers and gunners, and
embarked
this of this branch of the Ordnance corps,
I 1 Watermanmb
this morning at eight o'clock, .s.at, i
Nova Scotia, and,Canada, to
Astperlioerirtrpc-oenhripeTcanomceintoenSdteleer rneisshietn2hnere'dtood. embarkefor
ainptashe_
sage to Newfoundland, Halifax, Nova
at these stations. Colonel
fill up and augment the companies
Brigade-Major, superin-
tendedtionCu
.PPaTbgele order for the departure
Crutte n d
theen and
embarkation. Majorrhe
the garrison only arrived at eight
o'clock
ofthe troopsyesterdayff°envening, and some of the men had to be
relieved of guard between ten and twelve o'clock, to be
ready to proceed to the Royal Arsenal, with their baggage at
six o'clock this morning, to put it on board the Waterman
steamer. The band of theßoyalArtillepriyayaedccompie
numerouss
the party to the place of embarkation, and
favourite airs while the men were conveyed in small boats to
the steamer.
THE NEW INFANT ORPHAN ASYLUM.—The anni-
ver;a7 dinner of this charity took place on Thursday at th
London Tavern, and was attended by a company of gentle-
men mustering to the number of 135. The Right Hon. Fox
Manic presided, and during the evening subscriptions to the
amount of 8501. were announced by the secretary, a large
sum considering the charity has been only three years in
existence, and one which promises extended means, and we
hope in proportion thereto, extended usefulness in a very
wide field for benevolent labour.
THE BANK or ENGLAND.—Thursday the follow-
ing notice of the shuttings of the annuities on which the
dividends are due to the sth of :July, was issued and Itixed
at the Bank of En:Jand:—Conlolidated 31. per
of Cents,
16th of
Friday, the 11th June, open Friday, the 16th July. 3!.
per Cent. Annuities, 1726,
h ult.ll' eodfnJ"udha?.', t.rh :Vow V. per
June ; open Wednesday, the 4
Cent. Annuities, ditto. -e•konnounittestheforl6tethrmsofofjuyl. East
eayrs shut
lonuditaheStleictkh stfuts njounei op
he 3d of June, and opens en the 15th
of July.
Tits MAILS.—SOUTHAMPTON, MAT 6.—The Ori-
ental Company's steam-ship Madrid, Captain Weeks, al-rived
in dock last evening, at seven r..r., from Gibraltar,. and
landed the Peninsular and other mails, under charge of Ad-
miralty-Agent, Lieutenant Smythe, R.N., which werer for-
warded to London by this morning's mail train. Her dates
are—Gibraltar, April 25th; Cadiz, 26th ; Lisbon, 29th;
Oporto, 30th ; and Vigo, May Ist. The Madrid has aho d
cargo, consisting of oranges, dates, specie, leeches, wizro Esc,
The Tay, West India packet, is hour!, expected.

Now ready, in 2 vols. Bvo., with Map, 315.6 d. bound,
NA:tRATIVE OF A
jOURNEY ROUND the WORLD,
PRINCIPALLY OVERLAND.
By Sir GEORGE :SIMPSON.
es'nuir-iii-Chiel or the Iluasoh,, llay Company's Territories in
North America.
Henry Colburn, Publisher, 13, Great Marlborough-street.

Now ready, Vols. 111. and IV., Completmg the Work, of
LIE I IS70i:.1" OF THE
C A PTIVITY OF NAPOLEON,
AT ST. LIUEN..I.•
By GLNE,:AL 'CO. NT MONTHOLON.
71, • v..lar;i,e co!,e:ti•le this very hiteresVng work. The most
valu '".r 'ea, Although not, perhaps, the most i•;t.'resting, is that
in w toe • omt r..cords the opinions of Napoleon upon events
in whi li hr• hAI himsel h 71 a prominent actor. These reso de are
valivbi!!, as clucioat ions o, the conduct of the Empuror in posi-
v•tH, ry h r either mi,coistrued him, or been at fault
1%-•••, nia ,i•-•tiu,s."----,Vcekly Chronicle.
• ij, ; 13, Great Marlborough sir- et.

Le-elt aul.i George Craikshatik, and
o ;u a author, price IN rid. bound,
I.EW ,t; ONLUDING VOLUME OF
TUE IN.GOLDSBY LEGENDS;
MIRTII and MARVELS. And other POE3IS.
With a M E NtOIR of the AtiTtiOß.
EDITED by his SON.
New Editions of the t irst and Second Series are now ready.
• " Of the school to which he belonged Ingoldsby may well be called
Poet Laureate. It is long since the town has been present° i with so
racy a boi,- of xicedotes a, are to be bound in his life."—Athenmuru.
" Alive whit epigram, and anecdote, and fun, and merriment in all
It•-+ whini,icai varieties. We mu,t confess we have found the work
prodig.ously di v erting."—English Review.
Rieriafd Bentley, New Burlington-street.

HER AJES CY'S THEATRE.
The Th7r.l appearance of Mdlle. JENNY LIND in this country.
T 11,5 EVENING, Saturday,
May Bth, will be performed Meyer.
beer's Opera,

ROBERTO IL DIAVOLO.
; Roberto,
ALce, Mdlle. Jenny Li•ld ; Isabella, Made. Castellan
suitor Fraschinl ; Itarnbaldo, Signor Gardont ; Sacerdote, Signor
Jtofi.,h., ; and , • ertratn, Herr stathily,l.
10 el-. 3 Seco:id Act a.: Incidental Divertissement, In Which Mills.

will ripixsts.
- Divertissiim• nt,
with•
usF, DU CARNIVAL.
I.n A •.ien will be intro.iuced a Grand Pas by Mdlle. Grahn, supported
~11,111,.
,Lones, and Honore; and " La Manola," by
1L alt. cerilo and Leon. Pas de la Rosiere, by Mdlle. Marie
Ta4.totti.
Tile Free Vet is suspended, the Public Press excepted.
T.:, d...ri ,-Ten at Seven. The Opera to commence at Half-past
Seven o c.ock.

HER M WEST Y'S THEATRE. •
The Nobility, Subscribers, and the Public, are respectfully in-
formed, that an EXTRA NIGHT will take place on THURSDAY
next, May 13, when will be performed BellinPs Opera, entitled
LA SONNAMBULA,
Amin 31dlie. Je Lind ; Lisa, Madame -olari ; Count Rodolph,
Signer F. I,4blache ; and Elvino, Signor Gardoni.
v moue ntertaluments in the BALLET DEPARTMENT,
comr,:ning the talents of Mdlle. Cerito, Mdlle. Rosati, Mdlle. M.
Mdlle. Petit Stephan, Mdlles. Honore, Cassan, Julien, La
moureux, and Mdlle. L. Graien. M. Perrot, M. P. Taglioni, and M.
St. Leon.

ROYAL ITALIAN OPERA, COVENT-GARDEN.
On THURSDAY next, May 13, an EXTRA NIGHT, on which
oceasion the combined s'rength of the Company will perform.
Tt.e OPERATIC PERFORMANCES will embraee the talents of
Madame Gr:si, Madame Pecs.ani, Signora Alboni, Signor Mario,
Signor Salvi, Signor itovere. Signor Marini, and Signor Tamburini.
The BALLET will be supported by MdFe. Fanny Elssler,lle.
Thamiia.tre, Mdlle. Eaderna, Mdlle. Demelisse, Mdlle. Aurlol, Ma-
d !me Deletions, M. Petipa, M. Croce, M. O'Bryan, M. Delferier,
The Doors will open at Half-past Seven o'clock, and the Opera
will ,ommenee at Eight.
Tickets, Stalls, and Boxes to be obtained at the Boa-office, Bow-
street ; and at Cramer, Beale, and Co.'s, 201, Regent-street.

vv
N
TiIEATRE ROYAL, HAYMARKET.
Under the Management of Mr. B. Webster, sole Lessee.
THIS EVENING
Will be performed Sheridan Knowles's Comedy of THE LOVE
CHASE, Sir William Fondlove, Mr. Tilbury; Master Waller, Mr.
Howe ; Widow Green. Mrs. Glover ; Constance, Mrs. Nisbett.
After which the Grand Astronomical Extravaganza, called THE
NEW PLANET ; or, Harlequin out of Place.
To conclude with a Farce, by J. IL Planche, Esq., called SPRING
GAIZDENS.

THEATRE ROYAL, ADELPHL
tinder the direction of Madame Celeste
THIS EVElsritiG

Will be performed the original Drama,~ called THE FLOWERS
OF TIIE FOREST ; a Gipsy Story. Cheap John, Mr. Wright ;
Ishmael, Mr. 0. Smith ; the Kinchin, Mr. P. 'Tedford; Leybourne,
Mr. Worrell; Cynthia, Madame Celeste; Len.nel, Miss Woolgar ;
St irliglat Bess, Mrs. Fitzwilliam ; Lady Agnes, .iiss Harding.
After which the new Opera Buffs Sketch, called JENNY LIND.
Principal characters by Messrs. Wright, Paul Bedford, Lambert,
Selby, Culleniord. and Mini Woolgar.
To conclude with the Farce of A NABOB FOR AN HOUR. Mr.
Frampton. Mr. Worrell; Sam Hobbs, Mr. Lambert; Dick Dumpy,
Mr. Munyard; Miss Leslie, Miss Harding; .Nancy Scraggs, Mrs.
Matthews.

INCESA'S TiIEATRE, OXFORD-STREET.
:11a,1,tox. pole Lessee and Manager.
THIS EVENING

Will be performed MIDSUMMER NIGIIT'S DREAM. The
principal characters by Messrs. 11. Hughes, Ryder, J. Vining, C.
Fisher, Wynn, and Compton ; Miss Winstaniey, Mrs. Stirling, Mrs.
H. Mabel, Miss S. Flower, Miss .Lune Homer, Miss Marshall, and
\lie Smithson.

After which, the Comic Opera. called THE BARCAROLE. In
which Nle:yr:. Walton, Llo,lda, Leffler, Allen, Miss E. banner aid
Aline Romer will appear.
To e.melthle with the Farce, entitled A WIFE FOR AN HOIJIt.
Princ,vai characters by Mes.rs. Walton, Granby, Vining, Cowell,
Compton, Mrs. Huvhes, and Mitts E. Stanley.

rIfEATRE ROYAL, LYCEUM.
Under the Management of Mrs. Keeley.

THIS EVENING
Will
be performed the new Drama, called THE CREOLE ; or,
Lowe's Fetters. Damiron, Mr. F. Mathews ; Alphonse, Mr. Murray,
Hyacinthe, MISS Dickinson; Bokes, Mr. Keeley ; Latour. Mr,
Emery; Virgule, Miss M. Keeley; Louise, Miss May; Bellona,
Mrs. Keeley.

er which, the entirely new occasional Dramat'e Sketch, called
JEN Y LLND AT LAST; or, Tile Swedish Nightingale. Charac-
ters by it r. A. Wigan, Mr Turner, Mr. Kinloch, Mr. Belling atti,
INIr. Bender, Mr. Yarnold, and Mrs. Keeley.
To cone nde with a new Burlesque Extravanza, called TIIE
WOOD D.E \ION ; or, One o'Cleck, In which Messrs. Keeley, A.
Wigan, F. Matrlew., Bellingham, Kinloch, Silver, Miss Dickinson,
31:1.4s Daly, and Mrs. Keeley will appear.

FRENCH PLAYS.—ST. JAMES'S THEATRE.
Lessee, Mr. John Mitchell.
MONDAY EVENING
Will he performed the amusing Comedie, enticed L'ENFANT
TROITYI.:. Delbar, M. Regnier ; Castel, ille, M. Cartigny ; lien-
ri Mille. Vallee ; Marianne, Mdlle. Rhin.
o conclude with the popular Comedic of LES DEMOISELLES
DE ST. CYR. Dubouloy, M. Reguier; Charlotte de Marian, Mdlle.
Dcnain.

Boxes, 6s. ; Pit, 3s. 6d. ; Amphitheatre, 3,.; Gallery, 2s.
Boxes and Stalls may be engaged at Mr. Mitchell's Royal Library,
33. Runt-street ; and at tho Box-office of the Theatre, which is open
daily from Eleven till Five.