The Sun.
London, England, 1815-05-31 00:00:00

NAVAL ADMINISTRATIOrC

The Earl of DARNLEY adverted Co an account
of stores furnished for certain ships on the Awe.
rican station in August last, and stated that the
return on that subject was incwuplete, and %a 5.1.1-
ed that a more comtolete return. should be made.
Lord MiihslLLE said, there Could be no objec-
tion to complete the return, it it could be done:
The-Eal of DATINLE"K said, helhad no doubt of
the disposition of the Noble Lord to furnish a
complete acconnt, but expressed his hope chat it
tnight be niade,before the time when it was pro-
posed to submit his motion on this subject to their
Lardshipa...--AdjoniTed.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.
NEW POST OFFI•CE;

- The Report of the New Post-odice'Bill Was ordered to be
taken into consideration on Thursday-
-
' REGISTER OFFICES.
Mr. Serjeant ONSLOW moved for leave toßring in a Bill
for Registering all Conveyances, Deeds, atnf-liternnbrattees
on all Maii.:rs, Lands, Tenements', and tiereditMnents in the
several Counties of England, except Middlesex' and York.
PRESTON ah:iectcd to it, on the ground that 1)," was
of opinion such a Bill Iroilld produce more
.injury than belie-,
fit-to the country at large.
Mr. ROSE said a few words; hat from the hustle in the
Honse we could not distinctly hear whether he was fur or
against the motion.—Leave given to bring in the Bill.
ROMAN CATHOLIC CLAIMS.

Sir U. PAH NELL said he helcii;hishand a Pe-
tition from the Roman Catholics of England, re-
siriing in London, Wolverhampton, and other
phices, to the amount of 6,000 persons, which he
wished to present to theilouse previous to his
proceeding on the motion of which he had given
notice respecting the Roman Catholics :of Ire-
land, which stood for this day. The' Petition
was ordered to be brought up, and being read, it
stated the disabilities under which they laboured,
and prayed to be relieved front the same It was
ordered to lie on the table.
CATHOLIC QUESTION.
_

Sii 11. PARNELL, io riiiog to bring under the
view of the 'rouse the Claims of the. Catholics of
Ireland, would be as brief on the subject as it
could. admit. In the last Session of parliament,
the House had decided that it was advisable to
take into consideration the removal of the remain-
ing distptalifieatioris sinaer' which his Majesty's
Roman Catholic subjects laboured. The only
thing, that frustrated this decision, was a question
concerning ecelesiaitical institutions. Au that
remained now to ,be COnSiderecr was, how this
question could: be settled with the greatest satis-
faction to all parties. It ,tonic be unnecessary
for hint therefore to d•xell on these great Consti-
tutional questions, on which his Right Honour-
able Friend, the _Member for Dablin (Mr. Grattan)
to whom the Catholics must always look with
fondness, gratitude, and veneration, had so often,
so ably, and so elnquently exerted his great ta-
lents. The Only subject for consideration now
.was. not whether the Catholic Clahns should be
granted, but how and on what conditions, -
or
with what provisions they could be granted. It
was to the conduct of the Catholics themselves,
and to their manner of receiving the -Bill of •that
Sesion, that the failure of that Bill was to be at-
tributed. This was the first time the house had an
opportunity of fully discussing the question of
the appointment of the Catholic Bishops. It
was the ditty of. the opponents of-the Catholic
claims to shew from when-cc the danger front them'
-arose, before they required, that the controul
over the appointmeat of the Catholic Bishops
should be given to GOvertiment. He appealed to
'the past conduct of those Bishops, and instanced
the rebellions of 1713, 17-15, end when they
bad not only been loyal theMselves, bits exerted
themselves-with the greatest effort, and often with
the greatest success to preserve the loyalty of all
the Catholics of the kingdom." Why then, if they
had proved their loyalty_ at :that time, at periods
of grinding oppression and persecution, Iwhy
should they not prove it now, if they hail no op-.
pression or persecution to complain of ? • The.
Catholic Church of Ireland was also very distinct'
front the-See of Route; and- in nothing did 'the-
latter interfere with the former, but in marriages,
fees-elf Clergy, and Cahonical institution. NOW
as Canonical Institution was the only one of
those points of interference which was supposed
in any manner dangerous, lie would beg to ex-
plain this subject; On "the demise of a Bishop,
there were three names sent to Rome to have -a
successor appointed _ from them, and a recom-
mendation -of the one whom the Clergy and
Bishops of Ireland preferred. There was scarce-
ly an instance within the last century, where
the Pope did not conform to this recommendat..
tion ; so that, in fact, it was not the Pope -hot
the Bishops,Of Ireland appointed. lt bad :been
formerly. feared that ally interference on the
part of the Pope would be dangerous, be-
cause of having his person in the power of Buo-
naparte. Bat now this cause of-apprehension no
longer existed. He was led to dwell something
more fully on this point, because he felt that the
appointment of Bishops was the only obstacle to
Catholic Emancipation, and he hoped that the
Catholics may relax something on this side,- and
that the other side may advance to meet them. In
regard to the Resolutions which he had the ho-
nuur to subunit to the House, he submitted for the"
propose of conciliation, and to lay down clearly
the extent of the CatholiC grievances and claims.
Llany Protestants, -he knew, imagined that the
Catholic
_Claims went to some very subverting
measure, and did they not imagine so, would be
as zealous for, as they were now averse-to, those
clanns. But his Resolutions would shew that.
there was no measure required or proposed. No.
thlog Was to be taken from the Protestaut, though
50mething wag to be -granted to the-Catholic.--
With regard to the matter of those Resolutioos,
the three first-of them went to remove difficulties
and restrictions with regard to property. Many
imagined that the Catholics has nothing to.com-
plain on this pOint ; but this .was • not the
fact ; for if the Catholic possessor of any free-
hold property did not take the oaths mid de-
dunitions of 1774 and 1793, be could lie stripped

ef ILA property tar :iii r' of his family Who
turned Protestetit and' infOrineti heainst
An irrstatie Of this lately cleenrrial he Ire!au:: Witit
4 -
itgatti io a pier Son of the re,;ele-o: uneee
tootl from the gall. Bat:oiler) 14' I voy, Ail Heat
tue Catholics asked wat`i tclod benefitB;Opral ad-
eaiitua6Tes, 'and equal duties: If ally concessinn
to tlitan Was to tape fi'o!it another fitly -right,- or
fitly benefit-, he would not aSk for it. `Die Right
Hon. ?"3eatlein;in iii the Chair (the Speaker) anti
other Gentlenien who voted with him out the fOr-
mer distussion of the subject, had epreised their
opinion that every concession should be granted,
which could with safety he granted ; anti under-
these circtonstances he die not conceive how the
House could refuse going into the C?monittee, as
it was so fully evident that tile removal of those
difficulties, -tvith regard to property, could with-
out any danger he granted. The other Resolu-
t ions went to remove the difficulties and restric-
tions with regard to religious worship, marriage,
and education. Eveu now religious worship was
not wholly free to the Catholic soldiery. When
Ile had formerly the honour to bring this subject
under the consideration of the House, lie was
told that there were orders given at the ‘Var Office
to give full liberty c.o this subject to the Catholic
soldiery. But lie held in his hand a letter, -writ-
ten within these three weeks from' a place near
Cork, complaining that the Commanding Officer
would not permit his Catholic soldiers to attend the
religions worship of their own church. The Offi-
cer bad been remonstrated with on the occasion,
but without effect. Inched, application Co Govern-
ment had been attended to, but without alegis-
lative measure to grant free worship to the milt
tary, any individual Cominatoling Officer could de-
feat the intentions of Government on this sub-
ject. (ti the whole, he was sore, if the Rehire
should consent to embody the Resolutions into-a
law, they would confer on the Protestants of Ire-
land the greatest security, and on the empire in
general, the greatest prosperity. They would ex-
cite in the Catholics the most enthusiastic grati-
tude, and they %email unite every heart and every.
anti in suppiurt of the Government. Would they
then barter such Immeasurable advantages for ec-
clesiastical institution ? There had been as yet
. .
no danger found from ecclesiastical institution as
it is ; and would a possibility of furore danger
front it be putt in competition witjt a real union of
both countries, a union Of the hearts and minds of
the people. Under these circumstances, he would
note, that the House do resolve itself into a
Committee to take into-consideration .the Petition
of his Majesty's Catholic subjects of Ireland.
Sir 1. Cox HaraEsLEY dissenter! 10104 from
the prayer of the Petition, which went to ask for
unrestricted concession. He regretted he was not
in,the House when the English 'Catholic Petition
was tektite He was convinced there were not an-
nexed to that Petition any two respeetahle names,
That-he wished-as much es any- man to grant the
Catholics as much as could with safety I.?egrimted;
he lilt it his duty to Oppose unqualified conces-
sion. The restrictions lie would wish to' retain
were not restrictions on tee „Catholics or on the
See of Rome ; but restrictions on the Pope .of
Rome. It had been the invariahle practice of
every country in Europe to impose iestr:etions tits
the interference of- the Pope with its people ; yet
those restrictions, which evei/ Ca:lndia countries
thought it necessary to.impose on the power of the
Pope were desired to be renioved 'here. Was it
any unjust or oppressive pOwet in the Governinetit
to enquire into the character of the
who was to be appointed a Bishop, and if that
decimeter
.was found improper, to negative his
appointment. In every other state the Govern-
ment provided sonic guard over the, Clergy. Why
should we not do so in this 'country.? 'the
suits were abcant to be revived, and be was asked,
what clanger there could be appreitendvd:fro!'n
though there should be no guard.oyer them.
It was said that Jesuits existed in Russia,invl that
ebere had been no danger experienced from then:.
But the Empress Catherine-placed them under the
surveillance of . the gret t Priests.. :111 stked this
to shew the gross misunderstanding 011 this poiut.
Long as he had been an advocate for comvsu,ions
to the CatbolicS, lie had never contended for them
on the score of right. He contended against the
right. The House had a right to exclude or to
admit the Catholics to farther concessions as it
thought proper. - He would wish his Hun; Friend
(Sir H. Parnell) had brought forward Resohltions
fit to conciliate all his Milltsty's subjects, and he
would gladly support them. But they were far
from it. Perhaps -they may conciliate foor toil-
lions of Catholics in Ireland, but 'there-it tie (thir-
teen millions.olProtestants, who look with alea-
lousy to any further concessions. to the Catholics.
Was not even the course the Hon. Baronet had
taken reprobated by half the Catholic population
of. Ireland ? Did the Honourable Baronet seri.:
onsly approve of it even himself As to the oath
mentioned in the Resolutions it was wholly abro-
gated. It was only imposed on those who accepted
situations tinder the (:roars.. And this oath Dr.
Milner said no Catholic priest could take. There
vvas a.clause in the Hon. Baronet's Resolutions
going to. capacitate the Catholics tca- fill all offices
This then • would capacitate them to fill the Pro
testant Sees and the EcclesittstiealC'.fices in Doc-
tors' Commons. Now, how was this at till
rc
coneilable with common reason I And the Re-
solutions•would also remove all restrictions and
'checks. Even Queen Mary left over the Catioi-
lies all those checks of premunire mortmain, etc.
which the modern Catholics %%mold Ic.e removed.
Ile had on a former Occasion called for several do-
cuments on this question, VOL there was but a
single one of diem on the table. He would.not,
however, oppose; going into the Committee,
though he would not support it, because he did not see that it could produce any benefit. lie
Avould not resist any thing likely to throw the least
new light on the subject
Mr. Yolue.a expressed his surprise at the.coo-
duct of the Hon. Baronet who spoke last. With
a full view of all the duingerS which tvould result
from granting the claims of the Catholics, he still
would not oppose taking them into consideration.
But he (Mi'. Yorke) could not follOer roe of
conduct; and he would vote against going into
the Committee. The gill brought io in the Ses-,
sion -of 1813, was fifil.of restrictions, Yea lion, it
was songlit to remove all restrictions. The minor t
points of the concessions he would grant, but on

•
tor gr•nter iinints, e witieb essciie
etidangz,red the ,-:(-„„.lit,oi,ot; to'2 re4lll' ujoa,
cturities before coold gatti theta: Paricio-
'arottet said, i.e had brousr,lit fOrwitol Lis
lutiorri with .ti :v sic'' it V, !led c°strilect.
Lion. But what -was to be t'
be.
ed, Vekeii there kvas SuPlt a differe"c-o did
the Ca:boric!, th-inseives, hetveeill
titr`o••rent bodiet of Catholics of 1rt"3,2.1.Pg:
between the
of the RugliSli CAtbolic re, coo.
lion) Sheffield, atrked for titirestriete(j.ity."'
E'tssion,. unaccompanied with sc'"lsiong;
It. eras argueti in favour of .5,,1-11 ewl°'.'
that it was by our Catholic ancestors 011;1.01" otif
stltption bad been formed. Piut it OIS ".I',l3teti;
Il't/ignailglilatnbdeSsf;axi(cni:lt:vcae:tio)yrs that it had °rigiesteri.
it was matured. Yes, it w(a),;"b‘C;/-Itiell°lrii;',,lTtilli.o°:ll'
Queen Marr. Those who sai- this, (14.0 "yi„t'oll',
what our Constitution is. the Ives°/;'-koi,
of the Lion. Bart. be compared with lb!,
the last year, and there would be fot"';',„:0`)
great difference. There were sense of t"' 00°
lutions to w hid) he had no objection, "50 etle
with respect to estates, to marriages, to'd I'4
and if the Hon. Baronet would br''' tst
B!il to
should
Hcatchsitiii,ra:f;;lselllolll,Sicser
efur the purpose 7111g)1(e:.51:cii.ti;D;:let:0131riif:
‘Vithollt any security except gu
the Bill of 1813, it was provided that the ! io;
should have the power of .interfering tt'igo'
troduction or the brills of the Pope. Ti'` t`',l° tie 4
m
ost natural exception was the attemp '
t •.,, 4
right of the Cto',vn of interfering t,•0013
point nient of the i Catholic Bishops; ft0(llle
ask any Gentleman whit voted for tb 13id astisoar
whether it was possible to entertain it 00"..,,,ce
all
ntsh
.7
ldifferencesastii oere tfh e
ceiltsati s
pt arU7:1!)(:,sbia01).,;1. °!:!(,;•
• pith
now • hel.ng able to get through the fie;
satisfaction, when it Was clear that we
ther conciliate nor satisfy the petitioners
seoti
14,
not the Petitioners shoWil IhrOilLr,hoOt ti)e
lof their proceedings, the most invetera.'ve
ity ? It was impossible to satisfy ale"
told us that they would not hear of aliY
enee in their Church, and therefore Ile 11- -e'irt
tloose would refuse to cro into any C°;9',l};.ttltvit'l
all. lie never would entertainb this tioes-(1.11';;;11°.
regard to great concessions till it 14.35
what the See of Rome would do on tilt., cot;
f
points of it ; as it nots tiecessin:y that ".
cession of the Pope shOuld be grrove'l
Iwiws before i.ve could proceed at all. ber,i4
it to be stated distinctly`What Se6ait • Or%
oared ; for he aPprehended that ;tot 014, I"estio','
hod beendotic at all in this rt!' s9ect since tile WI) „toile
was last. agitated, bot that notlijog lis; I brtYl-k.,100.f
"1) to this very hour. ilc had also tta•Wfi''"
hat there was so great a &truer-fee ber'%.°.ltlo-
(':ithoiirs in the two parts of the cc/
ttr,goes had been e;arvin,, on with
prevent. him.trom coating t(; any d'-'ci'''(ll-t't 11;D'r
-(11"1.' hear 1)—It woulds be found that 13c 0/
I,,it ,r,
material points. of the oath had' beeurt-is,•o',..(f
lio\s. then was it possible to c•;o, on
when it was evident that the Catholics
give this one vecessary security
was convitieed • that t:orbiug pract'c'}c:
he done to conciliate them an,d. Ow! ,I;"eocsi''•
'''
Fill',llloii of the subject a matter of ("5-oin'trir
lie should therefore v,;te 'agtinst
would Only lead to ilisterhatices ill the c 1-e
gotri;,
nth
(.:ofninittee. syo
Mr. KNOS: eras of o•
pinion that iwt"'t's .een
do more to stren4tlien the he fria 141;
Cat holies of Ireland and Great Britju• 1 :; b`k
granting them the obiect of their
Le believed that the Parliament never `l-°"1; tfiti;,4• 1
to concessions which would not ese'l-`1(-,,,
front all interference of the Papai
did hope, though as it had 9.‘,,,corti
1,8-13, that this Ind tter migt,t:h-ar-e
r“"11 as 101 ob•.ctionS 1'1'1'17! 'Is:1110;• li. I
elated the rope ;' and, Le. thongr:t, rhatt
berai l'otent ate would not have lies;:t3lll6 if
benefit so great portion of his flock.
.--o".it,terit-',.).,;
plaspects which then aopearod were "ct,o"-
theY had been altogether banished by toc
"1: the Catholics onrcland, who had °Pe-1-:170 t`f
fessed their determination :tot to meet `l,-,:t fe/
views of the Pope, or those of t he .'rott's.fl'i. 41'1:
Lion of the Etiipir.?. Even the it e'c'.iPt et
1-,tiltotti had not been receive(' by th.ell) '`.01)0117
titud 4M
e, though it was the oitly toilb. td: Vl4-1:elf
tt(hiep°ulbleiccteixt)tl"T'i;it Mill ille au tell:eor11°-ft.1 lit ?(:01;bciii:ti.:tiiP1511;
was not spared. 'Th•
ere trete ()they c 11°:t'
staved, Snell al. the increasing of r3,„op('/lit.
of. the Crown, b • • • &tic '
y vesting in ty•
meat of the Catholics /3oillovs•'
100
teas st.
11)P-sed thßt-the Pope tViS t7l
to the Veto, the Carbolic Leaders, tur''
- and tound other objects. tO` .ohject t(); of 10:.1,1
•
they appeared to 11.1ve DU 'V w
; bitt dot
allg alive a spirit of insurrection ; o"dosePto4
at y hop,:s that did appe9r before the
! against tine
zi:iticet:ttit,y'ii:ol
test iste°olcl4::::^es
el to (it
possible at this thin. to proclwce rrice-jhl)
ilo
never Ih.,able to obt.iin those sectirßieS to Of 4-0,
the present
,Cltholies, "ought anctannilissithe'gvre'irdcbde st•i:l,c.lst:".Ca ;1111;
The admission of their preteosious h‘il,t)rbtebec'olito;
L2ee would only he an Indio:ewe°
. persevete, iii the hope that they 11,4 1„tra1'5,,,„0
pletely successful ; but if, on the ci°-
sbo,t(`:s
was rejceted, there cenll‘l,
th"t the Catbolics would soon rei°4ve, b Y
'il)ose violent tncu who hod ('clot# (1
Iteo
to solicit asst boot) ►► bat they „ 1" e, 2`
Eli°'t>, ithi
u tensions hich never could be g"' ,ose,
t stirr od,
(Cii:lN'Yi::fi.:Aeullt.,ik:Ciiiirte.tciat;stFt(TiczeGist,i(nyil,LD Colll'l ll°
ajoe4:
iflSCOSible to the tigthhte9r3cll:l.ei'llji:irill,°/esoe::1';
the people, as to re.ist the ineasore
lle uenied that the statetneot of tbt 14' tlik11(01
ile"llewa" Wzls eoriect'ctin en l,)11
Petitioners had claimed as a right thc
the .Bdl i hey had fainted, aod "f'• a to `4'
'l'hey Esnly 'claimed to- 1.; rest'oet
held to be the rislinisoltl t.';"
ject• lie trusted that the House Iv—

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