The Sun.
London, England, 1812-03-11 00:00:00

The Wenderers' Bill was read a.third time and
sassed.

The Dublin Coal Bill went through a Com-
mittee; the report of which was ordered to be re-
ceived -to-morrow.

A Message from the Lords announced their Lord-'
ships' assent to the Drury-lane Theatre Bill, with
several Amendments, to which they desired the con-
currence of the House of Cummons.

Mr. W. POLE broucfht in a Bill to continue, for a

time to be limited, the Drawbacks on Sugar exported
from Ireland. Read a first, and ordered to be read
a second time.

REVERSIONS.
Mr. BANKES, after a few prefatory observations,
in which he slated, that the Bill he was about to
move for was similar to that introduced the Session
before last, but that it was hicobjed to make it as
generally acceptable. as possible, obtained leave to
bring in -a Billl° make provision, for a time to be
limited, respeding certain grants of Vices.
The Bill was immediately brought in, read a first
time, and ordered to be reed a second time on
Thursday.

FOREIGNERS'IN OUR ARMY:

Lord FoeksTotse rose to make his promised mo-
tion relative to Foreigners in the British Army.—
During the American war, when there ' were only
5000 Foreigners in our army, considerable jealousy
had existed in the country ; and surely now that
there were 30,.000, that jealousy ought at least to re-
vive. .We it respect to the mode ,in which these
Foreigners had been introduced, he admitted that
it might not be an actual and positive breach of a.
law, but there were. several Acts of Parliament which
occasioned in his mind great doubt as to the strict
legality of that mode. These were the Acts of the
34th and eeth of the King, authoriSing his Majesty
to receive into his service the Foreigners therein
mentioned, and thereby implying that it was not
lawful so to receive them without, an Act of Parlia-
ment. At present they existed in this county in
large bodies of cavalry,- infantry, artillery, and engi-
neers. They had a staff of their own, Generals of
their own, and all the appointments of an indepen-
dent army; and further than that, some foreign Ge-
nerals actually had the command of districts ; as for
instance, Ge-neral Linsingee, to .whom militia and
other British regiments actually reported. But this
was not all. Foreigners had been even introduced
into our native' corps. All the old feelings on that
subject had been done away, and there was scarce-
ly ,a British Regiment in which the names of Fo-
reig•sers were not to be found in the muster-roll.--
In some cases they wete actually promoted from
Foreign Reginichtsinto British ; and he instanced a
transfer of that kind from the German Legion into
the loth Hussars. Nothing cou:d be more cen-
surable than the attempts made in every respect to
assimilate British regiments to Germans. Foreign-
ers were admitted into the 10th and 15th Hussars,
although Irishmen were refused. He adverted to a
permission given by the Magistracy of Nottingham,
to the solders to act as peace-officers. If these
soldiers should be foreigners, what mischiefs might
not ensue ? It had been held in various cases, and
particularly in that of Sir Francis Burdett, that the
duties of a soldier merged in those of a citieen.—,
It was certainly odd, in the case to which, he- had
j ist alluded, that there• was such a large troop of ci-
tizens all clad in his Majesty's clothes. But, sap-
posing they had: been Germans, how would the
country have felt on - the occurrence that took
place ? What, indeed, could be more derogatory
from every honourable principle, than to punish
Englishmen who enlisted into a foreign service,
at the very, moment that' we held out all possible
inducement to Foreigners to enter the English ser-
vice ? Among other observations on the subject,
the Noble Lord took occasion to remark on the ap,
pointment of Count Menster, as one of the Com-
missioners for the management of his Majesty's pri-
vate property. He wished to have the great legal
opinions on the other side upon this appointment,
To him it appeared, that as by law an alien could
not purchase lands for himself, it was questionable
whether he could purchase them in trust for another.
He concluded by moving,
" T)iat a return be laid before the House of all persons
born out r_lthe Kingdoms of i: ngland, Scotland, and Ireland,
or of tr a dominions thereunto belonging, except such as
might be born of English parents, who were serving in any
of his Majesty's land torces, except foreign corps." •
Colonel PALMER, id a very low tone of voice, ap-
peared to us to be explaining the circumstances at-
tendant on the reception into some of our regiments
of German prisoners of war. We understood the
Hon. Gentleman to state; that their services were
accepted in consequence of a petition from them-
selves. . .
Sir J. SEABRIGEIT deprecated the introduction of
foreigners into oar native regiments,,but saw,no oh-
jeClion to the increase of foreign corps.
Lord PALMERSTONE contended, that what had
been done, was fully justified by the existing I .aw.
If Foreign Officers distinguished themselves in the
British service, he could' not see any impropriety in
giving them• active situations on the Staff, either at
home or abroad. With respeCt
,to General Lin-
singee, he had before told the Noble Lord that he
was misinformed as to the command of that gallant
General, which extended only to the depot of the
German Legion. The provisions of the At of
the 44th of the King (under which the German
Legion was raised) had completely removed most
of the grounds of the Noble Lord's objeClions.
The Noble ' Lord, adverting to the occasional
merging of the • duties of the soldier into the
citizen, ' had reprobated the possibility of the
interference of any foreign soldier ,to prevent
any breach of the peace—to prevent felony for
instance. Now really, unless the Noble Lord
was prepared to argue that a foreigner in civil
life ought not to be allowed to interfere for the pre-
vention of a felonious transaBion, for his own part,
he did not see how the Noble Lord could -be justi-
fied in contending that a Foreigner in military life
would not be competent to such an interference.—
The Noble Lord observed, that the At of Settle-
ment passed when a foreign Sovereign had mounted
the Throne, from whom it might be reasonably ap-
prehended that he would give the reins to his indul-
gence by the introdua ion of his countrymen. To
guild against such introduCtion, therefore, the Aa
was made. But now no danger could be expeaed.
Circumstances were go completely altered, that it
would not be fair to say that it was proper to prohi-
bit now what was hthen prohibited. The war was

or 811dh a nature as to make it necessary to employ
foreign troops to supply the drains on the Conti-
nent. With respell to what had been stated about
the immense levies that Bonaparte dra as from the
resources of foreign nations ; that was. true; he
dragged Germans from their country to fight in
Spain—ltalians to Russia—and Poles to Italy. No
serious danger could be apprehended from the em-
ployment of foreigners in our service, as the num-
ber of them was limited by law, and the greatest
part were serving abroad. The Noble Lord had no
objedion to the motion, if it were not for the diffi-
culty which would arise in producing the.de,ired
returns. An obje&tion certainly would arise .as to
the names, because the publication-of those names
on the Continent might do certain mischief to the
individuals, in the event of their being taken pri-
soners by the enemy. The number was already
known by reference to the Army Estimates, and
there were none in any of the regiments of any con-
sequence except the 60th regiment. He should for
these reasons oppose the motion:
Str Jonar NEWPORT contended that the preamble
of the 44th of the King, expressly provided for
granting commissions, by stating that in such and
such battalions " therein they should serve." It
would not therefore he contended, becauie the third
clause omitted those words, that, therefore, it was an
exception to the whole of the A&. He was one of
those old fashioned Members, whothought that the
•guaids thrown around the Constitution by our forea
fathers, were worth preserving now. It would .be
wise and predent not to deviate from those rules
prescribed by those guards. If the principle was to
be admitteJ, by riegrees the whole; of the army
might be composed of Foreigners. He deprecdted
the holding out to the people then idea that they
cannot defend their own country. The pride and
glory of the great LordChatharn was that the people
could defend themselves, and he was, the means of
removing those Foreigners, at that time obnoxious,
and of awakening the „peoPle from the state of
apathy and torpor into which they had sunk. ' He
thought the pradice would tend to depress the spirit
of the people, and therefore was against it..
An Hon. Member referred to the Preamble in the
Ad of Settlement, to strew that it had reference to
the employment of Foreigners in after times.
Sir FRANCIS BURDETT declared that he was ill
prepared to discuss the subjea, because 'he was so
deficient in modern lore in respect to the principles
of the Constitution. Any one, after hearing the
dodrinei broached this night, might suppose that a
new sera had arrived, and that for the first time feel-
ings of jealousy had been excited respeding innova-
tion. The History of the Country; anterior to the
Revolution, furnished ample proofs of the jealousy
of our ancestors on the, occasion : one of the ex-
press stipulations of Magna Charta (made too with a
native Prince on the Throne, who had, only about
2000 Foreigners in pay),was, that the people should
not Isy down their arms until those Foreigners were
discharged.—ln later times, too, when the sttuggle
for liberty had nearly exhausted her, and unk in the
prerogatives of. the Crown, in the reign of the
'Stuarts, particularly of Charles I. Gentlemen might
read that famous Remonstrance of i 64 t, in which a
variety of grievances were stated, brit the greatest
one of which the people complained was the employ-
(tient of Foreign troopse which that King, now call-
ed through courtesy " the Martyr," (but if he was
a Martyr, it was on account of his own obsti-
nacy, in endeavouring to subvert the liberties of
the subjea), had supported.. In that glorious era of
our history, the Reformation, in the reign of Queen
Elizabeth, similar in point of warfare with the pre-
sent, for she had to contend *with as many powerful
enem'es a; we have now-:--the Spaniards, aided by
the Guises and the force they could bring—lreland
in a state of disturbance still more dangerous than
,now—and Scotland divided from the Crown of
England, what did that Queen do ? ' She did not
depend for security upon Foreigners, but she merely
applied to the people, satisfied that, reigning as she
did in their hearts, the country was safe, and.what
.was the consequence ? They carried her . through
the difficulties. Her name was then, and had ever
since, been looked up to with. veneration. Why,
therefore, was the country called upon now to
employ and to:trust for its defence to Gerrit an troops?
To be sure, he had not the same jealousy or Jear
Of German mercenaries as of mercenaries of
another description in a certain place. The Ho-
nourable Bart. then observed, that his Noble Friend
had said nothing to disparage the Colonel Of the
oth Regiment, it was to the appointment of Colo-
nel Quintie that he objected ; and he (Sir F ) saw
no reason for placing Germans over the heads of
British Officers, and, abo've all, to command dis-
tricts. Instead of trusting to this sort of defence, he
would recommend Government to turn their atten-
tion to Ireland, and to enlist the hearts and minds
of between four and five millions of the people,in that
country. A great deal had been said about the Cori
stitulion, without seemingly knowing what it really
is. Volumes of law had passed since ..the Ad of
Settlement, to him totally incomprehensible. Tire
of Settlement was a compact between the So-
vereign and the people, which ought not to be vio-
lated on eithet side. Much had been said about
enlistment from Gaols. He thought that the con-
strudion pet upon the conduct of the unfortunate
sailors found in the army of France, when our arms
capturedt be Island of Mauritius, was not a corred one.
To try men for high treason, and execute them as trai-
tors for the same sort of aa which we encoerage our-
selves in the subjeda of the enemy was too much.
The material part of the question, however, was
Whether we had a Constitution, and whether it
would not be more advisable to adhere to it, and to
depend upon the people for perfed security. In re-
sorting to the first principles rather than to throw
them away, security was to be found ; that would be
the wiser plan. He could not see any difficulty in
making the returns; the IL.M4S of
,the Officers were
published the Army List, and, therefore, there
could not be any delicacy in not disclosing them, as
they were lenown already to the enemy. The rea-
sons which had been urged against the. motion on
those grounds, were mere pretences, and not satis-
.
faaory to his mind.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER observed,
that the question did not embrace a variety of to-
piCs, as to whether the Statute, of the 44tlaand 46th
of the King were politic or expedient, but whether
the construction was right which the Nub!e Lord
and the Hon. Baronet had put upon them. He was
disposed to contend that their construction 'was

wrong, and,that no blame could be imputed to the
Goyernmet-. for hdviug proceeded upon those Sta.
tutee. The obserration of ,his Hon. Friend was
!right, when he referred to the Preamble of !he Att
of Se:tlement, for that Att lirld refereoce to contin-
gency,out he would not go the length of saying that
it operated as a repeal of the ConstitutionAl Law of
the land. He would admit then, that the 44,n of
the King was contrary to the Ad of S-_-tilement,
As far, however, as he could form opinion upori
it, the Act had two distinct provisions—she
one for enlisting foreigners into corps, specifi-
cally to serve. in foreign parts, and the other having
a general application as to the enlistment. These
provisions were not under discussion now. It was
true that this country, both at home and abroad,.
had.the aid of these persons; bat could,any man,
looking at the state of the army and navy, say that
this country trusted for its defence and protenion to
foreigners ? It was the peculiar nature of the present
war, that all the means for carrying it on, adapted
to British feelings, and to British subjects should be
employed.. With those views foreigners were em-
ployed, and the first employment was from among
the Hanoverians, who were driven from ;heir own.
country by the incursion of the enemy. Could
that description of foreigners be viewed with a
' jealous eye, or &id they come within the prin-
ciple of the obje6.ion ?—They certainly did come
within the meaning of the letter of the Ad. From
time to time, the principle had been extended as
occasion required. The Hon. Baronet had made
some aservations respelling the trial of the sailors
found in arms. But he would put the case in answer
of the forcible seizure of the S:ianiards under Ito-

rnana, who were marched forward„ and forced to,
serve against the interests of their country, until re-
lieved by being taken by this country into its service.
We enlisted teem therefore out of a service into
which they were compelied to enter. Was there
any analogy in the cases ? Was the case shinier
to that of our sailors ? The principle of enlisting
foreigners was to fight the battles of their Own
country under our banners. With respect to the
infringement of the Constitution, the Aa of 44 was
enlarged by that. of 46, when the last Administration
was in power, of course the present Government
could not be blamed for carrying into effect the prop,
visions of that Ad. The Right Hon. Gentleman
contended, that the Apt legally interpreted autho•
rised general enlistment, proceeding upon the prin-
ciple of granting Commissions and Letters of Ser-
vice to appoint Staff Officers, as tie understood.--
[General Tarleton signified his dissent.]—The Gala
'ant Officer might and certainly ought to be better
informed on that subject.
General TARLETON observed, that twenty years
ago Letters of Service were given for raising Regi-
ments. They might now to be sure hear a diffeient
signification.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER contended,
that the third section referred to went merely to
cover all that the Noble Lord complained of. It
would have been certainly highly objectionable; if
permission had been given by the Ad to engraft
Foreign Officers into all regiments of the line. The
Right Hon. Gentleman then alluded to the appoint.
ment'of Count Munster, which he had recommend-
ed in perfea ignorance of the extent of his Majesty's
private property ; but conceiving it likely that part
of that property might be of Hanover extradion, if
he might eo eacpress himself, he thought informa-
tion might therefore be derived from that Gentle-
man. It the appointment was illegal, be trusted the
House would dired it to be correeted; and the per-
son recommending the' appointment indemnified.
With respect to the Noble Lord's motion, great dif-
ficulty would arise in producing names from Portu-
gal, the East and West Indies. As to the numbers,
it was admitted that greater numbers were abread
than was authorised by law, but necessity enforced
it. There would, as his Noble Friend had statel,
be difficulty in acceding to his motion. ,
General TARLETON recolledecl that letters of
service were given for raising regiments during the-
Anierican war.. In. 179 e,, while Lord Amherst was
Commander in Chief, he applied for one-and was
refused. They now certainly had . a double mean-
ing. As to the .facilities in obtaining returns, it
must be recolleded that returns were made every
year at the War Office, as to the age>, size of the
men, and whether enlisted for limited service or
otherwise. He was glad' the subject was before
'Parliament, for if the war was to be carried on in
the same manner as' hitherto, we could not, in his
opinion, 'have too great a number of Foreigners in
our service abroad; but be was against taking them
into segiments at home. It was like mixing a baser
alloy with gold and silver. His opinion of British
soldiers was well knower ; he bad the most puled
reliance on them. It was the opinion of Marshal
Turenne, and of Villiers, hi the wars of Marl-
borough and of Wolfe, that English soldiers were the
best in the world.
J.ord .A. HAMILTON 'deprecated the enlistment
of foreigners to a great extent, especially of Officers,
when so many British Officers were unemployed.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER observed,
that the. Ad only extended to the termination of
the war,.and a few months after that period, and
then Foreign Officers ceased to hold commissions.
• Mr. BENNETT wished to know why the Irish
nation were treated with such indignity as to be re•
fused, by order, serving in.the loth Hussars •
The CHANCELLOR Of the EtCHEQUBR knew no-
thing of the fad.
Colonel Pareee,'in reply to the Hon. Gentle-
man, stated, that he did not know any sueh order
was made. Their frequent desertions, however,
was an objection to theit being taken into the re-

giment.
Lord FOLKESTONE, in reply, strongly insisted on
the propriety of granting the returns he called tor,
which he contended could do no harm. He enu-
merated various inconveniences arising, -from the
number of foreign troops taken MI6 our pay, and
greatly objected to trusfing•the defence of this coun-
try to foreigners who had done but little in defence
of their own. This-policy he admired no mo.e
than' he did that sort by which the Right
.1-lon.
Gentleman h►d defended it, and under all the cir-
cumstances of the case he hoped the papers would
not be refused.
The OHANCELLOR Of the EXCHEaUER said he
would not objed to the motion of the Noble Lord
if it were not extended to the Officers and in:-n now
serving abroad.
.Lord FOLK-01'0NR then begged le.ave to withdraw