The Sun.
London, England, 1847-11-27 00:00:00

LE VENIN t4ii NOVEM Brat o7s )047.

hc,ar.) A Bill 'had recently passed to facilitate the
dissolution of railway companies whose Acts
had not been obtained ; but in cases where
the Bills had been passed, or the works partly
commenced, the company had entered into contracts
and engagements with landowners and others. He did
not think, therefore, that it would be advisable to
bring in any measure to allow companies so solicited
to release themselves from the obligations they had
entered into with numerous penalties.
Mr. DIVETT—What will be the extension of
time ?

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
then proposed to allow either two or three years
beyond the time limited by the Acts already passed
for the purchase of land or the completion of the
works. With respect to the proportion of share-
holders, it was -immaterial to him whether the power
should vest in two-thirds or three-fourths of
the whole company. That was a subject which could
be discussed io Committee upon the Bill. He would
therefore move for leave to bring in a Bill fo- the
extension of time for the purchase of land and the
completion of the works of those railways for which
acts had obtained the sanction of the Legislature,
and also for the prohibition for a limited time upon
the directors of those railways whose works were
not commenced from commencing the same until
the consent of a given number of the shareholders had
been previously obtained.
Colonel SIBTHORP did not rise for the pur-
pose of opposing the measure of the Chancellor of
the Exchequer. He had always endeavoured to press
upon the Government the necessity of putting a
stop to these works. A sense of duty alone had made him
rise in his seat and express fearlesslyhis reasons for press-
ing that subject upon the attention of the Government.
Railway speculation had throughout been nothing
more than a gross attack upon the rights of private
property, and in his opinion a stop ought long ago to
have been put to it. The Right Hon. Gentleman
the Chancellor of the Exchequer talked of compensa-
tion to the landholder. Why, what compensa-
tion, in the name of common sense, could be afforded
to , the man who had his land taken from
him by main force, and what compensation could be
made to the Englishman who had his property
snatched from him against his will by a power that
did not exist even in Russia? He was glad the com-
mercial necessities of the country had stepped in to put
a limit to this abominable system of robbery.
He had no wish to oppose the bringing in of the Bill,
but he called upon the Right Hon. Gentleman to
say to those railway companies, " Unless you pay
for the construction of the railways for which you
have obtained Bills by a certain time you
shall not make them at all."—(Hear, hear.)
If the parties who had sought such powers could
not carry them out let the Legislature abrogate what
it had done. He spoke thus on behalf of his coun
trymen, and as a disinterested individual ; when the
Bill arrived at its second reading, he should propose
a clause compelling railway companies to pay for
the land they had included in their survey, or else
to give it back to its proprietors.
Mr. E. ELLICE approved of that part
of the Bill which gave railway companies
power to defer the construction of their works.
At a former time he offered a proposition
to the House, which, if it had been acceded to,
would have averted some of the evils which had since
become alarming—viz., to curtail the enormous powers
which those corporations possessed of borrowing mo-
ney. Canals as well as railway companies sought and
obtained power to borrow one-third of their capi-
tal. Now, he blamed the Executive for not reducing
those powers within proper bounds. But railways
were mainly one of the causes which had led to
the present monetary crisis. It was an
abuse of credit, not unlike that practised with respect
to the South American mines. Railway companies
went into the market with more available securities
than the trader, and prevented him from obtaining those
discounts which previously he had been able to obtain.
There was another point in connexion with this sub-
ject which he wished to direct the attention of the
House to, a point which both the present and past
Government had lamentably neglected. The House
was aware that by law a railway company could only
divide amongst its shareholders 10/. per cent., but
during the late mania instances without end had oc-
curred of companies dividing profits to the ex-
tent of 100/. per cent. The Legislature
winked at such extravagance, and allowed it to
go on against the remonstrance of a Committee which
considered the point, but he hoped, now that they had
seen the folly of such lukewarmness, measures would
be taken to prevent .the recurrence of these abuses.
He thought that some protection ought to be claimed
for those parties who were subject to the monopoly
of great railway companies. It was the duty of the
House to limit the powers granted to railway com-
panies in such a manner as not to interfere with the
interests of other classes of the country, and the
individual exercise of other branches of industry. It
was very difficult for any individual man of that
House, unaided by the Government, to carry
out any reform in these great subjects, but
he hoped that the Government would adopt som
measure to regulate the mode of borrowing large
autos of money, and thereby crippling other branches
of ordinary commerce and industry.—(Hear.)
Mr. HUDSON could conscientiously bear testimony
to the strenuous and continued opposition made by the
lion. and Gallant Gentleman the Member for Lincoln
(Colonel Sibthorp) to all descriptions of railway under
takings, but he could not bear the same testimony to
the conduct invariably pursued by the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman the Member for Coventry (Mr. Ellice). That
Right Hon. Gentleman complained of the excessive
number of Railway Bills passed in the last session of
Parliament, and he added, that he warned the House
that those measures would involve the country in diffi-
culty and distress. Ile (Mr. Hudson) denied that the
distress which existed was to be attributed to railways.
—(Hear, hear.) He could not forget that he had the
honour to move an amendment to a Bill which was in-
tended to connect Coventry and Southend, and he also
remembered that upon that occasion—although the
Right Hon. Gentleman now ascribed all the distress to
railways—that he implored the House, for the sake of
pass the Bill.—(Hear, hear,
the city of Coventry, to
and a laugh.) The Right Hon. Gentleman's example
upon that occasion was contrary to his present
precept, and the maxim was that Example was
better than precept."—(Hear, hear, and laughter.)
The Right Hon. Gentleman said that the powers given
to railway companies to borrow money was too exten-
sive. He (Mr. Hudson) would not say that those
powers were not too extensive, but that was a fair ques-
tion for debate. The companies with which he was
connected, and among them were some of the most ex
tensive in the country, had not borrowed to anything
near the extent of their powers. But if the House
thought the power of borrowing was too extensive, or
likely to be attended with inconvenience to the com-
munity, they might fairly make it a subject for mature
inquiry. The Right Hon. Gentleman, however, seemed
to say that the borrowers were the only persons to be
considered. Was there to be no consideration for those
who lent the money ?—(Hear, hear.) Were not the in•
dustrious poor, who had accumulated their savings, to
be thought of ?—(Hear, hear.) Were they to be told—
" Oh, invest your money in trade, or give it to your
banker, and receive a low rate of interest for it." Why,
nothing could be more ridiculous than to exclude the
public from a safe and profitable investment for their
capital.—(flear, hear.) If
Asuch investment were not
furnished in railways at home, they would find it else-
where. A large amount of English capital was now
invested in railway undertakings on the Continent, and
if say measure were passed calculated to check invest-
ments in English railways they would find their way to
foreign railways. Within the last twelve months no
less than two millions and a half were invested in foreign
railways, and a large sum might follow, for it was im-
possible to prevent capital flowing somewhere. He felt
it to be a great blessing that railway property flowed
where it did—(Hear, hear, and laughter)—although he
felt the inconvenience of so great a number of lines
being sanctioned by Parliament, and though he was
ready to admit that some distress might ensue from it,
still he believed the House could not have taken any
other course.—(Hear, hear.) It was fallacious to say
that the late commercial distress had been occasioned by
the large expenditure upon railways, for all the articles
absorbed in the construction of railways were either of'
British produce or of British growth.—(Hear.) We did
not import railways—(A laugh)—so the drain occasioned
by them could not be said to account for the distress. To
hold that the entire inconvenience which the commercial
classes suffered was caused by railways would be to state
what really was not the case. He believed, on the con-
trary, that railways had been of great benefit to the
poor—that they
had contributed very considerably to
increase their comforts, and that they 'rad caused a large
amount of money to circulate in channels likely to swell
the prosperity of the country.—(Not-
withstanding hear.)
this, the manufacturers of Manchester met
together and forwarded circulars to the railway com-
panies, begging of them not to make any further calls.
Now, if these well intentioned gentlemen had addressed
their circulars to those who were accepting bills for
large amounts to foreign merchants, and thus deranging
the exchanges, they might have done same good.—
(Hear, hear.) But to tell the railway companies that
they were not to continue to employ their labourers
was absurd.—(Hear, hear.) No railway company had
stopped for want, of funds; they might have gone on
less rapidly, but they had not stopped, neither had they
applied to the Government for assistance. When rail-
war stock was at a premium the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer's money was at a large discount.—(Hear, hear.)
and to his cwu knowledge railway stock had been sold
when a purchaser could not be found for Exchequer-
bills.—(Bear, hear.) The public knew very well what
they were about, and it appeared were far wiser than
the Right Hon. 31einber for Coventry thought they
were. He had given it as his opinion, and he ROW re-
peated it, that we could not construct railways and
import corn to a large extent, for in such case the
bullion would have to be sent out of the country. If
the Government were to undertake legislation of this
kind they would have to legislate also for the merchant
and the cotton importer that they should not exceed a
certain amount. When the mercantile class were over
trading the Government did not come down and tell
them they should confine their transactions within
certain limits. He was prepared to say on behalf of
the railway companies that they were ready to make
any sacrifice to suit the convenience of the public.

Ha Jul not object to the Dill proposed by the Right
Hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer ;
it wt,tild not be of any use to him ; ho did not
want it ; but it might have the effect of allaying an
apprehension on the part of the public that railway un-
dertakings were proceeding too rapidly. He felt a great
desire to know from the Chancellor of the Exchequer
the c ,ndition of the Bank on the Saturday previously to
the Monday on which the Goverment issued their letter.
—(Hear, hear.) Although the Right Hon. Gentleman
bad said that all houses in good credit could get money,
he assured him that Exchequer bills could not have been
cashed at the time without considerable loss. Some of
his own railway works would have been stopped at that
period, not from want of means to carry them on, but
from the difficulty of getting Exchequer-bills converted
into cash had not the directors of the Bank of England
received the Right lion. Gentleman's letter. The Hon.
Gentleman concluded by saying that, unless the House
altered the Bank Charter Act which produced such a
state of things, it would not be doing its duty.—(Hear.)
Leave was then given to brillg in the Bill.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER then
move 1 for the appointment of a Committee on the Rail
way Bills of this session.:
The Committee was accordingly appointed.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER observed
that 11 suspended Bills, as well as new Bill;, would be
included.

BUSINESS OF THE lIOUSE.

Sir J. PAKINGTON moved that, until the Christmas
holidays, orders of the day should take precedence of
notices of motions. The lion. Gentleman said that, in
bringing before the House the motion of which he had
given notice, ha was unwilling to do so without assuring
Hon. Gentlemen, who had given notices of motion, that
he did not wish to cause them any inconvenience. lie
brought forward the proposal without having had any
communication with the Government, and solely from
the conviction that, if the House adopted it, the public
business would be much facilitated, and the general con-
venience of the House promoted. He would, therefore,
move that, under the peculiar circumstance of the pre-
sent session, orders of the day should have precedence of
notit es of motion.
Mr. BROTHERTON seconded the motion.
Mr. BANKES considered that, as the motion was of
so much importance and of so singular a nature, the
lion. Gentleman could not object to the House delaying
its consideration of it until next week. Many Hon.
Members were now absent who would return next week
when important business was expected, and a proposition
of this nature ought, in his opinion, to be discussed in a
very full House.—(Hear, hear.) The proposition was
so extraordinary a one thut he was prepared to give it a
decided negative. A proposition being made at the
1 commencement of the session to allow the Government

to engross all the business appeared to him to be so un-
con,titutional that he would certainly oppose it. He
would not, of course, object to it at the close of a session,
but he was bound to do so now, for it materially af-
fected the arrangements of 'private Members. For in-
stance, he had himself a notice on the books which
could not be postponed, for it related to an appointment
which was not made, but which would be made in a few
days—he alluded to the appointment of President to
the English Poor-law Commission. It was his intention
to propose that, instead of a new president being ap-
pointed to the Poor-law Commission, the office should be
conlerred upon the Lord Privy Seal. This gentleman,
who was at present travelling in Italy, had, it appeared,
nothing to do, and an arrangement such as that which
he (Mr. Bankes) was about to propose would save the
country 2,000/. per annum.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.)
The two secretaries would then remain, the remaining
portion of the Act could be in force, and an annual
saving would be caused to the country. He would move
a direct negative to the motion.

Mr. HUME expressed his astonishment at the pro-
por.al emanating from the Right Hon. Baronet (Sir J.
Pakington), for in his Opinion it would prevent he pos
sibility of Hon. Gentlemen making suggestions beneficial
to the country, and, moreover, prevent her Majesty
from availing herself of that for which she convtned
Parliament, namely, the advice and assistance of her
faithful Commons.—(Hear, hear.) It did not appear
that Parliament had been called together for any par
titular purpose beyond the transaction of the pnblic
business, and therefore the motion which, in his opinion,
would be very improper at any time would be more so
now, when it was borne in mind that the Parliament
was a new one. He hoped the Hon. Baronet would
withdraw the motion.—(Hear )
Mr. BROTHERTON said the only object of the
original suggestion was to save the public time; at the
same time, however, he thought it only right that such a
motio❑ should be decided on by a full House.

Mr. EWART said the rules of the House were seldom
violated without their having reason to repent it.
Lord J. RUSSELL quite agreed with the Hon.
Member for Salford, that such a proposition, however
desirable, would better be discussed in a full House, and
decided on by universal assent, more especially as they
had only the other day decided that on Tuesdays and
Thursdays orders should have precedence. At the same
time, he would take the opportunity of enforcing a hope
that Hon. Members having notices of motions would not
interfere with the appointed business of the House
unless the subjects were of a very pressing nature. It
might be very inconvenient if they were obliged, on the
23d of December, to adjourn only for a week.—(llear.)
Sir J. PAKINGTON withdrew his motion.
RETURNS.

Mr. HUME moved for copies of Earl Grey's dis-
patches to the Mauritius, respecting the formation of a
bank in that islan.l in the present year ; of all dis-
patches to and from the Mauritius respecting the state
of that colony, since January, 1847 ; and of all dis-
patches to and from the Governor of Trinidad, respect-
ing the supply of labour, and the state of that colony,
since Lord Harris's arrival in that island.—Ordered.

Mr. HUME then moved for a copy of the memorial
of the West India Association on the present state of the
British West India colonies, dated the 11th day of No
vember, 1847, addressed to Lord Juba Russell, First
Lor.l of her Majesty's Treasury ; return of the number
of slaves captured in each year, since January, 1810,
and for which the sum of 1.061,8611. have been paid as
bounty to captors from the public revenue, stating the
nuh.bor of these slaves landed slive, and how the same
were disposed of ; and copy of the correspondence re-
ceived by the British Government from the Commis-
sionei s at the Havanna and Rio de Janeiro, since Ja
nuary, 1847, on the subject of slavery and the slave
trade.—Ordered.
THE RAJA OF SATTARA.

Mr. HUME wished to ask the Government whether,
after the publicity of Major Carpenter's declaration of his
belief of the ex-Raja of Sattara's undoubted innocence
of the charges brought against him, any measures had
been adopted by the Boaro of Control to allow the ex-
Raja to prove his innocence, which he is able and ready
to t'o. it an opportunity is afforded him, as stated in the
papers before Parliament. The Hon. Member also
moved for copies of all documents referred to by Major
Carpenter (in his letter of the 25th day of May, 1846, to
the Secretary of the Governor-General, Parliamentary
Paper, No. 711, of session 1847), by which disclosures
respecting the proceedings at Sattara had been made,
that confirmed beyond a doubt Major Carpenter's be
lief of the innocence of the ex-Raja of Sattara, now an
exile and a prisoner at Benares, and under the surveil-
twee of Major Carpenter, by orders of the East India
Company: and of a letter from his Highness the deposed
Raja of Sattara to the Right Hon. Sir IL Hardinge,
Governor-General of India, dated Benares, December
12, 1844; together with all minutes and correspondence
contained therein.
Mr. EWART seconded the motion.
Mr. C. LEWIS, in the absence of Sir J. C. Hob-
house, said he had so recently been appointed to the
Indian Board that he had not been able to make him-
self master of the case. At the saute time he gave the
Hon. Member full credit for his motives in pressing
the case on the House. It did not appear that Major
Carpenter could have had any peculiar means of form-
ing a judgment. He was at a distance of one thousand
miles from the scene of the transactions in question,
and only formed his opinion from public documents.
Major Carpenter's dispatch having already been read
by the Government, they did not see that the fact of
its having been made public rendered it necessary for
them to take any additional steps. He had no objection,
however, to the production of the papers, though he
believed that they were already accessible to the House.
With respect to the letter of the Raja, Sir J. C. Hob-
house had written for a copy to India, and as soon as
it arrived it would be presented to the House.
Mr. G. THOMPSON apologised for attempting to
address the House so soon after taking his seat, but he
did so, simply because for seven years he had made the
case of the Raja of Sattara his peculiar study. lie had
devoted a large portion of those seven years to the ex-
amination of the papers in the case, and he thought he
relight state without presumption that he belived him-
self more intimately acquainted with the contents
of u'l the documents on that subject laid before
the House, or published elsewhere, than any other living
individual. He had taken a prominent part in discus-
sions elsewhere on this question, and he might also state
that, having visited India and the Raja, and having been,
through the kindness of the Government of India, per-
mitted to confer with that Prince, as well as communi-
cate personally with various individuals of high station
in that country, and, moreover, being somewhat con-
nected with the production of the papers now before
the llouse, he did hope that he should be permitted—
and he had no intention to abuse the indulgence which
he sought—to say one or two words on the question
before the House.—(Hear, hear.) But he bad another
reason, and the strongest reason of all, to propitiate the
kindness; of the Ilouse. There was nothing which he
did believe, which he believed more firmly, or from the
bottom of his heart, than the innocence of the Raja of
Sattara. He (Mr. G. Thompson) did not believe there
was one tittle of evidence implicating that Prince. There
was not one flaw—one act that could be called even an
indi cretion—in his case. Before his deposal he was
one of the most exemplary princes, Christian or heathen,
which ever reigned ; and since his deposal, under his
accumulated and protracted sufferings, notwithstanding
the confiscation of his property, public and private,
and the loss of a throne which he had adorned,
and of a climate which was agreeable to him, and
compared with which the one in which he now lived
was misery and death, and most of all the loss of a re-
putation which had no parallel in the history of India,
ancii-nt or modern—notwithstanding all this, his conduct,
was most praiseworthy and exemplary. Ile (Mr. G.
Thompson) was most anxious to know in what light her
Majesty's Government would regard the testimony of
Major Carpenter. Had it not been for the circumstance
of his (Mr. Thompson's) coming into possession of the
papers containing that testimony, they would be now in
oblivion, and would have remained in oblivion for ever.
—(Hear, hear.) In order to know the real value of
Major Carpenter's opinion, the House should recollect
that before he was put in charge of the Raja of Sattara
he had been in charge of another Raja sent up to
Benares from the central part of India. Major Carpenter
had for twenty-eight years been in the service of the

Lase lndia Company, and during that period had main-
tained an unsullied reputation; and, although in conse-
quence of the opinion he had given, he received from the
Governor- General a qualified rebuke, yet he had not
been displaced, but allowed to continue at his post.
Major Carpenter was not only charged with the custody
of this deposed Prince, but also with the duty of in-
, forming himself of every movement in which the Prince
may be engaged, and every officer so situated was per
mitted by the employment of agents of a certain kind
to resort to measures to inform himself of everything
said, done, and written, by night, on the part of those
„under his charge. When in 11t40 the Raja arrived at
Benares, accompanied by a character for intrigue and
disaffection, Major Carpenter was, in consequence of that
charact, r, led to regard him as the principal conspirator
in 'he Deccan, and exercised an extraordinary amount
of vigilance to prevent him from engaging in conspiracit
in that part of India. On that account the testimony of
Major Carpenter possessed now additional value. Major
Carpenter now stated that he never met with a man so
transparent—so honest, even to his own injury, as the
Raja of Sattara. This testimony was the more importaqt
its being borne to the Governor-General himself, for hi'
sole guidance, and with no idea that it should afterwards
become matter for discussion in the British House
of Commons. The Governor-General, in his reply, did
not use ose expression impugning Major Carpenter's
opinion, but said, " Whatever the real facts of the case
may be touching the guilt or innocence of the Raja,
and whatever your own private conviction may be, you
went beyoed your duty in giving your opinion." If
Major Carpenter did commit an error, it was one that
would be forgiven in that House—it was one that would
be forgiven throughout the world, and which would
plead for him when we all came to that common judg •
meat where we would be tried, not by the rules that
governed the political system of India, but by the rules
of justice and humanity.—(Hear, hear.) He (Mr.
Thompson) should not trespass on the House by enter-
ing into any details on the merits of this ease ; suffice it
to say, that he should deem it his duty most humbly to
render his best services to the Hon. Member for Mon-
trose, who had already in that House so ably, ener-
getically, and perseveringly advocated this cause of the
Raja of Sattara. But while he (Mr. Thompson) did
so, it would not be in a spirit of faction or from any
desire to embarrass her Majesty's Government, or da-
mage their reputation, and, by so doing, their influ-
ence ; no, he had crossed the threshold of that House
free from such feelings and dispositions ; but he
must discharge a duty to his constituents, who felt
deeply in this ease, and also a duty to the coun-
try at large, who were desirous of seeing justice
done to the Raja, and, above all, to the convictions of his
own mind, which had long been made up on this
subject. Whenever the House granted an inquiry on
this subject, he would demonstrate, by testimony that
all would admit that the Raja was au innocent man. He
was prepared to prove before a Committee of that House
that every document produced to condemn the Raja was
a forgery and a fabrication—(llear, hear)—and that
every witness against him was a perjured man. He would
tell how much they got for what they said, by whom
they were hired, who instigated the hirers, and who put
the springs in motion; and he would also bring home to
every man, whether European or native, the conviction
that the proceedings in India against the Raja ot Sat-
: ara was a conspiracy to depose him because of a diispatch
that went out to India which favoured the claims of the
Raja to the sovereignty of a certain portion of that
country. In consequence of that dispatch, the Raja of
Sattara addressed the directors of the East India Com-
pany on the subject, and a conspiracy was set on foot,
which ended in his dethronement. Having apologised
to the House for his trespassing so long on their at-
tention, Mr. Thompson concluded by hoping that the
House would speedily grant a Committee to inquire into
the whole affair.

Sir J. W. HOGG would, in reply to 'the charges
brought forward by the lion. Member for the Tower
Hamlets, and which implicated every authority in India,
beg of the House to bear in mind that Sir R. Grant, who
was then Governor of Bombay, and all the members of
his council unanimously agreed, and reluctantly came to
the conclusion, that the Raja was guilty. Two succes-
sive Governors of Bombay and their respective councils
confirmed that decision. Lord Auckland, as distin-
guished a man as ever ruled over India, painfully and
reluctantly came to the same conclusion. The Court of
Directors of the East India Company, and three succes-
sive Presidents of the Board, expressed their unanimous
' conviction of the Raja's guilt. When the Directors of
the East India Company heard that Major Carpenter
had so far exceeded his duty as to pronounce an opinion
on the Raja's conduct, they addressed the Governor of
Bombay on the subject. When Major Carpenter was
called on to explain this circumstance, he pronounced
the greater part of the statement made by the Hon.
Member for the Tower Hamlets to be purely imagery,
and that the propositions detailed in the document
read by that Honourable Member were never made
by him (Major Carpenter) to the Raja of Sattara, upon
his (Major Carpenter's) own account, or on the part of
any one else. No disclaimer could be more direct and
satisfactory. And what said Lord Hardinge? He said
the Governor-General considered that it was as unbe-
coming as it was uncalled for, on the part of Major Car-
penter, to give any opinion on the charges against, and
the previous conduct of, the Raja of Sattara.—(lronical
cheers from Mr. Hume.) The Hon. Member indulged
in derisive cheers because an officer placed in a most
confidential position -violated his duty.—(clear, hoar.)
Would the House say that it was right for a person in
the confidential situation of Major Carpenter to have
entered into communication with a person whom he
was sent to take charge of, when such communication
could be shown to be unjust? however humane the
motives of Major Carpenter might have been, no one
could doubt the unsoundness of his judgment. In
fact, when he was reprimanded by the East India
Board of Directors for the busy and medding manner
in which he had conducted himself; he wrote an
apology to them, and said that " under ordinary cir-
cumstances the officer in discharge of a dethroned
Prince should have no concern in the chases which
might be brought against him, or with his previous con.
duct, but he (Major Carpenter) submitted, with all de•
ference and respect, that the case of the ex-Raja was a
peculiar one—(Hear, hear)—and that he had not in
this instance exceeded his duty.". So that Major Car-
penter broadly admitted that in ordinary cases the
course he had taken would have been blameable.—
(Hear, hear.) But what peculiarity was there in this
case ? Had any new fact come under the notice of Ma-
jor Carpenter ? Had he discovered some new facts
which would have convinced the Court of Directors
that they had acted wrongly in condemning the Raja ?
If Major Carpenter had been able to do so he (Sir J.
Hogg) would not have said a word against him. But
the truth was, Major Carpenter was not able to
produce any new fact which could throw upon the
case that extraordinary new light which the Hon.
Member for Montrose had talked of.—(Hear, hear.)
The importance of the case had been greatly
exaggerated. The whole of the income of the territory
of Sattara was no more than 100,0004, out of which the
Indian Government gave the Raja 10,0004 out of coin-
passion.—(Mr. Hume, " Nay, nay.") 'Why, his grand-
father and father had been incarcerated in a dungeon,
and the Raja himself had been released from captivity
by the Indian Government, previous to his being placed
on the throne of Sattara. In conclusion, he
thought the Hon. Member for Montrose, by his argu-
ment. in support of the motion had rather diminished
than added to the weight of the ex-Raja's
Mr. ANSTEY begged the house to consider whet
must be the condition of the natives of India, who are
governed by a company whose chairman did not hesitate,
on the floor of the House of Commons, to give utterance
to principles of morality of the most extraordinaiy cha-
racter.—(Hear.) He (Mr. Anstey) rose on this occasion
for the purpose of doing some justice to that meritorious
officer whose name bad been introduced in the course of
the debate--Major Carpenter.—(Hear, hear.) The mo-
tives of that gentleman had not been fairly treated.
Major Carpenter had given an unequivocal and uncon-
ditional denial of the accuracy of the reported conversa-
tions which had taken place between him and the de-
posed Raja of Sattara. Nothing could be more cautious
than the language which Major Carpenter had used in
his interviews with the Raja. The Court of Directors
could not show in what manner Major Carpenter had
exceeded his legitimate duties. He denied that that
gentleman had conducted himself in this affair
in any other than a firm and fair manner.
He (Mr. Anstey) trusted that the Honourable Gen-
tleman who might follow him would do justice to
the case of the Raja, in which were involved the
character and justice of the entire British empire.
He trusted that those Hon. Gentlemen who had taken
upon themselves the conduct of this question would en-
large their views, and that having satisfied themselves
of the innocence of the Raja, they would come to the
conclusion that those who had oppressed and persecuted
him deserved condeinnation.—(Hear.)
Mr. WAKLEY—The Right Hon. Baronet opposite
(Sir J. Hogg) had spoken that night in a manner which
made him (Mr. Wakley) think that he was satisfied that
the Raja of Sattara was an innocent man.—(Hear.)
He firmly believed that the Right Hon. Baronet could
not have put his hand upon his heart and say, upon his
honour, that he believed the Raja to be guilty. The
Right !Ton. Baronet had referred to former governors
and chairmen of the East India Board who had stated it
to be their conviction that the Raja was guilty, arid he
had also spoken:of the Raja having a gaoler. Now, he
(Mr. Wakley) would ask the Right Hon. Baronet whe-
ther the Raja had ever yet had a trial?—(Cheers.) He
had a gaoler, but had he ever had a jury?—(Hear.)
It was a well known fact—it was now notorious through-
out the whole of this country, as well as throughout all
India, that the Raja of Sattara had been treated as a
guilty man, and most grievously punished, but that he
had never undergone the ordeal of a jury—that he had
never had that advantage which was afforded to every
man in this country, when charged with a criminal
offence. He had never yet been heard in his own defence.
—(Hear, hear.) He had not even seen the evidence
which was adduced against him.—(Hear, hear.) Now
he (Mr. Wakley) could only say, that anything that
'night be said upon the case that night, after the motion
had been acceded to by the Government, would be mere
loss of time. Within a very brief period a motion of
another character must be submitted to the House.— I
(Hear, hear.) The justice of that House would then be
tested.—(Hear.) It would then be ascertained from
that House whether they were prepared to say that an
injured and persecuted man should not be heard hi
his own defence.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet
had alluded to a violation of confidence, or a breach of
duty, or an overstepping of the boundary of proper con-
duct on the part of Major Carpenter. W by, Major
Carpenter had violated no confidence.—(Hear, hear.)
He had violated no duties, he had in 'no respect broken
any engagement that was imposed upon him as a servant
of the East India Company.—(Hear, hear.) He was
asked by the secret department of the Government to
report upon certain things. He made his report accord-
ingly in secret, which brought out a communication be-
tween him and the Government, He was not the man

that disclosed that communleaf,lorlii., hei4—and
he had not, therefore, committed any violation of that
confidence which was imposed upon him in the observauce
his duty. lie (Mr. Waldey) was very sorry to see the
lion. Gentleman (Mr. Lewis) the ex-Poorolaw Commis-
sioner, occupying such a po,ition as he occupied that
night. He should have hoped that any speech which that
lion. Gentleman might have had to make in that House
would have been in a far different cause—he did not
think that he would hare made an attempt to, withhold
justiee from a persecuted man. -(Bear, hear.) Be
hoped the lion. Gentleman himself felt hoW annoying
and disagreeable his situation was ; but he (Mr. Wilk"
ley) was glad that there was no board of guardians at
Benares—(Laughter)—te receive instructions from the
Lion. Ex-Coannissioner—(Hear, hear)—for if there
were, it was possible that the Lx-Raja of Sattara
might consider himself fortunate if he had three pints of
gruel and sixteen oui.ces of bread in twenty-four hours.
—(Great laughter.) lie could easily conceive that the
lion. Gentleman did not consider that the Raja of
Sattara had been severely dealt with ut Benares ; but he
Mid sincerely trust that the Lion. Gentleman would alter
his views on the subject, and that he. would come to the
same conclusion that his advocates in that House had,
namely, that the Raja of Sattara was an injured and
persecuted man, and that he was entitled to justice from
that llouse.—(hear, hear.)
The motion was then agreed to.
The Railway Bill was brought up and read a first
time, and ordered to be read a second time on Friday
next.

The House then adjourned at Nine o'clock.

BANK OF ENGLAND.
(From last night's Gazette.)
An Account, pursuant to the Act 7th and Bth of Victoria, caP• 32.10 t
the Week. ending on Saturday, the 'iOth day of November, 1847.