The Sun.
London, England, 1847-02-12 00:00:00

?TIE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY EVEY!NG, FEBRUARY 12, 1847.

•

ten/. down a competent officer to the spot, who should state, by
Public advertisement or otherwise, the time at which he should
arrive ae, different points along the line, for the purpose of re-
solving the suggestions of the landowners with reference to the
puoposed railway. Ii the promoters of the Bid should choose
to adopt those variations, they., may be at liberty to in-
hem is their line without making a public report
of plans and eections. If the promoters, however, declined to
adopt those s uggestions, it was then proposed that the Railway
Commission era should have the power, should they deem those
restrictions advisable, to authorise those persons to deposit the
Plans and twctions of such variation as they might propose, and
also be eropewered to bring them before the Committee ap-
Pointed to decide upon the merits of the Bill, and to order or
,refuse compliance with such variations. By the adoption of
this measui:e much inconvenience, time, and expense would be
seared• Then with reference to the proofs before standing
lirders, at present conducted before two examiners, Messrs.
May anti! Smith, app'einted by that House in the last
session of! Parliameria; he thought that in future sessions,
that it we Uhl he necessary that the proofs of the standing orders
should be revisteil by the Reilway Commissioners themselves,
Or Officers under their supervision. At present the only mode
of
testins; the accuracy of the plans anti sections deposited with
the House was by means of the opposition of the opponents to
the meature. Numerous Bills had been allowed to pass the
dManding •orders, in which the grosseet ieaceuracies were
gellt: to the Committees, who had no power, however, :,f testing
Rai
It was now proposed that the officer sent down by the
otway Commissioners to inspect the proposed line should be
al'
,owed to make his report upon the proof of the standing
Orders, with reference to the deposited plans and see-
th', 'las The next dbject contemplated by the proposed
Kill referred to the duty of the Commissioners. In
the Bill passed in the lest session of Parliament, ap-
P°iniing the Board of Rail',vay Commissioners, it was arranged
that the Commissioners should report to the House upon the
Itailway Bills brought before them. It was necessary that
large powers 'should be given to them authorizing them to
!,!amine persons before themselves or officers appointed by
'erns with reference to the objections to the intended line of
railway, and also as to the mode of entering upon the lards of
the proprietors. Re did not propose, indeed he thought it
better that eouns6l should not be allowed to be heard or to
examine witness es before the Commissioners on behalf of any
Partse__
e (Cheer s.) The effect of admitting them would be to
Prolong the pro, zeedings to such an extent that it would be
absolutely impof Bible for the Commissioners to get through
the amount of business brought before them.—(Cheers.)
Great benefits •would also result from the examination of the
engineers and other witnesses. by impartial persons. 'fhe en-
tin or opposing the scheme, wenld be examined
Infinitely 800 ti much cheaper, and even more to the purpose,
by an • _ .
Impartial engineer, than by calling in all the expensive
machinery of ,agents and counsel.—(Cheers.) It was pro-
posed that the Railway Commissioners should have the power
to report to the House upon all those subjects which were at
resent decided upon and reported by Committees of the
ouse, referring to the amount of tolls or fares, the engineer-
ing nature of the line, the amount of capital required for the
construction of the rriilway, the number of shares, and the
Powers of borrowing money to be granted-to the company.
lie thought that th,is report would be of great use to the
Committee appointed to consider the merits of the Bill, as a
great deal of untuteessary and useless inquiry would thereby be
avoided. A question might arise as to how far the report of the
Commissioners e,hould have weight, and he proposed to regu-
late the authority' which it should have, not by the
Bill, but by the standing orders of the House. At the same
time he would mention, that in all matters relating to '
engineering and surveying, the report of the Commissioners
should be held 'co be To, ima.facie conclusive on any point that I
might be rai.aed, and he believed that this would be the means
of saving 'the Committee a great deal of trouble, and the parties
a great deal of expense. He said rima facie conclusive, be-
mem questions might arise where additional information would
be absolutely necessary, and if so, he would advise that the
Committee should, in such cases, report to the House that this
was required, and that instructions should be given to the Com- '
missioners to furnish it. With regard to questions of fact,
which might be the subject of dispute, he proposed that either '
party might complain, and have the Bill referred bank to the
Commissioners, and if the comelaint shonld turn out unfounded
that the parties so applying should bear the expenses
His object in introducing this provision, was to prevent frivo-
inns objections. With regard to fares and tolls, this was a sub-
ject which was the occasion of frequent difficulties before the
Committees formerly appointed to consider railway Bills. The
parties who appeared before them in opposition to the schemes
had no interest in this matter, and no party represented the in-
terests of the public. The Committee themselves had no in-
formationeuun as to what the charges were in other parts of the
try,
or on otiver railways, and consequently no data to
guide them in coming to a decision. The Commissioners,
therefore, who would have all this information, would be in a
Position to rentber the most essential service to the Committees
on this point. There was also a subject of very great impor-
tance to which he would now refer—he meant the raising of
capital. borrowing veoney, amalgamating with and leasing other
lines of raitirsay. The Hon. Member for Coventry, who hap-
pened to 'oe Chairman of a Committee, had some time since
called the atteoti in of the House to the subject in consequence
eery objectionable case of this nature coming before his
-"lamitiee; and in to report which he presented to the Home
it vvas suggested that some g regulationo for this subject
'should be adopted. By the now proposed the rug-
festion then made would be carried into effect : one point had
been strongly urged upon him not only-by some railway pro-
prietors' but by some parties who rem: ented the public, which
Was, that the Commissioners should retain in their power
a veto upon all proposed railways. He gave that point great
consideration, and he was bound to say that he could not con-
cur in it. Let him suppose that they retained it with respect
to those bills which had not any merit. The power wonld be
(?f no use whatever, as these Bills would fall of themselves
;0 the ground. Suppose, then, that they exercised their veto
reely on other Bills, it appeared to him that they should be
assuming the functions of Parliament; and, looking to the
circumstances of this country, and considering the feelings of
the
People, he doubted whether a board so constituted would
"se approved of. There was another question urged upon
the
ms namely, whether powers should be granted to future
companies in perpetuityor for a term of years. The latter prae-
!teeprevailed in France, but he wished to observe that
'lle railways in that country stood in a different position from
their railways, for they were laid out aud surveyed, and a large
Portion of the works executed by Government. So that the
railway proprietors stood nearly in the relation of occupying
tenants
under the Government. If they were now, for the '
first time, to exercise the power of permitting the construction
of
therailways, it might be a question for consideration as to how
should proceed, but they were differently situated.
Almost all the groat lines had been constructed and granted in
perpetuity ; and the question now was, how they should act
with future companies—whether powers should be
granted in aeerpetuity, or for a term of years. He
was afraid that if they adopted the latter course
they would excite a feeling of jealousy, and cause an inquiry in
other ways which it would not compensate. By imposing such
a restriction, it might be the means of sacrificing more import-
ant objects, and he did not, therefore, think it proper for the
Commissioners to have such a power. With regard to limiting
the rate of interest on the dividends of railway companies, be
Thought that if they proposed a restriction on the interest, in-
stead of inducing economy it would cause extravagance ; for,
by the present restriction, numerous situations were filled, and
unnecessary expenditure created, which would be avoided if no
limitation existed. Besides, he believed that this would
be beginning at the wrong end, as a means to
economy. They should begin by regulating the
fares and tolls sto be charged, and by seeing that the public
obtained tair accommodation at a fair price. He came now to
fhe second part of the subject—the fares and tolls. With
respect to them, he proposed that the power of fixing them
hould be granted for a term of years. The fires and tolls that
might new be fair might cease to be so in a few years, from
altered circumstances ; and the period he thought of proposing
was ten years. He did not mean to say that at the expiration
of that time they should be thrown open for Parliament to
sower them to any rates it might please, but he thought it right
ghat the power should be given to revise them, and to bring them
'to the same state as when they were first imposed. The object
by such an arrangement, was to act fairly towards the public
at the end of this period, as altered circumstances might render
necessary. Another great euestion now arose as to existing
railway companies which had received their Bills, not subject
to this alteration. There was rlso another class of Acts not
atsubject, but the companies who promoted them' had lately,
Whenapplying for new powers, made them amenable to any
alteration that might be proposed. This course had already
been taken with regard to cheap trains by the Hon. Member
for Tarnworth. With regard to that class of railway companies,
he_ proposed to make it a condition, it they came to Parliament
for an extension of powers, that the power of limiting the tolls
on their main line, in addition to the branch line or extensions,
Should also be conceded. In that ease the question would
be set at rest, as far as they were concerned, in the same way
as if the whole railway Bill had been brought forward for the
ittegory hu
first time. Tshere might be some railway, not in the last
;
it wits proposed, with respect to all railways,
hat the power of revision of fares and tolls should be vested in
parliament in the way he had described, and that they should
continue to keep it in their hands. Another alteration he pro-
POsed woe, that when any change was to he made by any rail-
beY c°lnpany in the tolls and fares, that due notice of it should
Overt to the Commissioners on Railnays and the public, as
great inconvenience had resulted from this omission ; and such
an alteration would be productive of no injury either to the
t("Pane or to the public. He also proposed that the com-
pany should give their reasons to the commissioners for
Cho change, as they might furnish useful suggestions for
the commissioners, when making their report on this subject to
parliament. In making these observations he had no inten-
tion to reflect en the great railway interests. As far as he
"ews it was by increasing their traffic and accommodating the
public that they would be promoting their own advantage, and
he believed that with many of them the wishes of the commis-
sioners would be anticipated by the companies themselves. He
hoped and believed that this would be the case, but that did
not make it the less necessary that the public should have
Some better security,and the Commissioners would not be doing
their duty to the public if they did not see that some such control
be established. It would be also for the benefit of the railway
companies themselves; for suppose three out of four companies
agreed to adopt a reduced system of fares and tolls, and the
fourth refused to submit to any reduction ; it was obvious that
the public would have a right to complain, and the other three
companies would be robbed by the railway company who
took advantage of the increased traffic
consequence of the reduced rates. He thought
ors
thieti their
right, railways n
there-
fore, to retain the power of revising the fares and tolis every
ten years. With regard to the charges to the Post-office for
the conveyance of the mails, he thought that the system
it arbitration now adopted should be changed, and that
distinct and definite charges should be made for this service.
The measures which he proposed on this point of the subject :
were these—that the Commissioners should, in concert with
the Post-office authorities, require the railway companies to
furnish the sates at which they would carry the mails, and
that the scales of charges should be reported on by the Corn-
missioners in the same way as they proposed to do with respect
to fares and tolls. But, as the circumstances might vary, they
had no objection to limit the period, for whsehthe
years. e o
The
m pan
ies
should he' compelled to carry the mails to five
text point, namely, the punctuality of trains, was a very im-
portant one. He thought it was one on which both the publi-
and the railway companies were
equally interested. He hac
heard from gentleman who bad much capital • vested
in railways, that their local traffic constituted a
very important part of their receipts ; certainly the quantityhuotf
local traffic depended very much op speed and punctuality,
at the same time, it must be obvious that it was a difficult
question to deal with, and it was impossible that the Legisla-
ture could pretend to take measures to force companies to
arrive at stated places at stated hours. They could only be
brought to make the trains run punctually by bringing pub-
licity and public opinion to hear upon their proceediegs in
this respect. It was proposed, however, by the Bill, that all
railway companies should be required to keep suspended at
such stations as the Commissioners might direct a list of the
arrival and departure of every trap. He believed tills was
done !or their OA sit That net much addi-
tional trouble would be imposed upon the companies
or upon their officers ; and it was also pro-
Posed that, for the benefit of the public as well
at of the companies, that these time lists should be sus-
pended in a situation where the public might see them, and
where they might check them; and also that, after a certain
"time, they should be forwarded to the Commissioners, and that
stseuld make an annual report to Parliament of the speed.
c" the diE, r,nt " * "i
lion of Parliament to the punctuality or want of punctuality in
the different trains run by the different companies, and their
114.11ee Upon the gaiety of the public. Them us &other

Ipoint with respect to cheap trains—there were many other points
of minor importance, on which it was not necessary for him t-
detain the House, as they would be found in the Bill, and be
open to discussion in Committee. The House was probably aware
that the law with respect to cheap trains was this—That
railway companies were required to run at least one train e
day for the convey trice of persons, at an expense of not nines
than Id. a mile, in carriages where they would be protecte(
from the weather, and which might be approved by the Cern-
missioners; and that they should not travel less than twelve.
miles an hour. Any further interference might be objected ti
on the ground that the companies had fulfilled and would
lulfil the provisions of this Act, by travelling tom(
parts of the journey at the rate of twenty or thirty
miles an hour, and by compelling the passenger!
to wait at some of the stations for other trains, yet
completeing the whole journey at the average rate of twelve
miles an hour. Now, he did not think that was a fair way ti
proceed, and that it was opposed to the intention of the Legis-
lature; and, therefore, by the Bill it was proposed not only t(
take the time of starting, but the time of stopping and starting
from the different stations.—( Hear.) Another point was tht
number of passengers. The Commissioners at present brie
powers with respect to the rates to be paid by those parties, but
they had no power aver the number of passengers to be cote
vexed by the trains. He proposed that the number
of pewngers to be carried, should be affixed in-
side a 4 carriages, and that certain penalties should be
imposed, on any infraction of the rule. Also when the train
travelled at night, that there should be lights in the carriages
He came now to another question—namely, the disputes be
tween Railway Companies. He would exemplify the diffi-
culty of adjusting these disputes by two extracts front
evidence given berme Committees last session. Mr. Hawk-
shaw, the engineer of the Leeds and Manchester Railway,
stated, in reply to a question from the Hon. Meet:her for Mon-
trose (Mr. Hume), with respect to the utility of the existing
board, that in some cases it might not act very advantageously,
but with respect to disputes between companies which
formed links in one great chain, that it would
be a most essential and useful tribunal. He
found that Mr. Glyn, a Member of that House, and the
Chairman of the North Western Railway, entertained a simi-
lar view. He said " instances had occurred of one company re-
fusing to put oo third class trains to meet the third class trains
run by another Company, in connexion with it; and that great
inconvenience had resulted in consequence." This, for in-
stance, might occur—suppose two competing lines, meeting at
a given point, refused to give accommodation to each other
with respect to these trains, it was obviously in the power of the
one company to deprive the other of the advantages which i;
wished to effect, by limiting the time of the starting of the
trains, so that the public would derive no advantage
Now that subject he thought deserved the most serious con-
sideration of the commissioners. The law at present was
that the Commissioners, where the public safety was concerned,
might make such arrangements as they might think v oper to
promote it. Now, the Commissioners thought it advisable ti
adhere to the word, of the Act which gave them .this power
with this addition, that where, from the bad management 01
the company, considerable inconvenience was caused to the
public by the want of a proper understanding between two or
more companies, who were compelled to use their lines in
common, that on the complaint of one company, the
Commissioners should take steps to tetnove those inconveniences
Then, with respect to the disturbances which often took place
in connexion with the construction of railways, there was a
difference in the state of the law on this subject. In Scotland.
where parties congregated together and created a disturbance
the sheriff had the power to decide whether a policeman, to be
paid by the company, should be employed or not. In England
it rested with the magistrates. Now he proposed that if any
two justices of the peace stated, by a report to the Commis-
sioners, that the employment of police was necessary for the
protection of the public peace, that the Commissioners might
order the employment of a certain number of police
at the cost of the company. There were, as he had said
minor points, which would be discussed in Committee, and
with which he would not trouble the House—( Hear, hear)—
such as the conveyance of military, military stores, &c., on
which he would not detain the House.—( Hear.) There was
one, however, which he considered a very important one—that
it was proposed by the Bill, that the Commissioners should
have power to call for returns from the different railway com-
panies, and if they thought fit, to be at liberty to verify the in-
formation which they might thus furnish, if they thought such
a course necessary. He did think this absolutely necessary,
as it was impossible that all the facts that wer.
required from time to time, could be obtained.
by re; urns voted by the Legislature. On a former evening,
the Hon. and Gallant Member for Lincoln (Colonel Sibthorp)
proposed that the Bill should contain a provision for giving
parties, who might be injured, or their friends, if they were
killed, to recover compensation ; but perhaps the Hon. Gentle-
men was not aware that a great alteration was made in the law
on the subject, by the introduction of a Bill last session by
Lord Campbell. Before that Act was passed, a person, who
was injured, or his relatives, if he were killed by the mis-
conduct or neglect of a company, had no right
of action, but this Act gave that power. He
was not inclined to propose any alteration or
addition for two reasons—first, because he thought it was right.,
before any alterations were made, to know how the Act worked,
and, secondly, if further legislation was necessary, that it
ought to be general, and not confined to accidents caused by
railways, but in other ways.— (Hear, hear.) He had now
gone into the main provisions of the Bill. He did not at all
pretend to propose it as a complete measure; in fact, it must
be obvious that a measure of that kind could not be complete
and that increased experience might lead them subsequently to
adopt improvements which that experience might suggest; but
he did think, if it received the favourable consideration of Par-
liament, that it. would be found a useful amendment of the
present law, and that it would be found, at the same time, most
beneficial to the public, without being injurious to the reset
interests of railway proprietors.—(Lend cheers. )
Mr. AGLIONBY said, during the fourteen or fifteen years
he had occupied a seat in that House, he never heard a more
clear or satisfactory statement than that delivered by the Hon.
Gentleman who had just resumed his seat; and he thought that
he might congratulate the House and the public that the Hon.
Gentleman had commenced his official duties by introducing
questions of so much importance to the consideration of the
House.—( Hear, hear.) As one of the public, he felt a sincere
interest in the welfare of railways; and he spoke without bias.
as he did not hold a share in one of them—but he had an inte-
rest, as one of the public, in seeing them all well and effi( iently
conducted, so that they might afford great advantages to th
public. He rose to make a suggestion which he was almost in-
clined to believe, railway companies would consider it advisable
to adopt, without interference from any branch whatever—he
meant the stopping of trains at a certain number of stations,
and the taking care that a reasonable number of trains stopped
to meet the wants of the districts which they traversed.
He admitted that this would involve an interference
with the discretion of directors, but it was for the
House to say whether it was justified or not. In fact, be saw
no reaton why interference should not take place in this way
as well as with respect to the fares. The directors of railways
paid every attention to the long traffic but little to the short.
On a railway which ran between two large towns the trains
offered every accommodation—cheap fares and regular jour-
nies—whereas the short traffic was often taken part of the
distance at a rapid pace, and left for some time at stations on
the route. There should be a general rule that, where a dis.
trict had no other means of accommodotion than by railway
that a certain number of trains should stop during the day.
It might be said that this was a matter in which the directors
were the best parties to judge ; but he considered that this
was one of these matters with which they might interfere with,
as well and as beneficially as with most others.—
( Hear, bear.) They had to keep up stations and officers.
and often stopped trains by signals, when passengers or
goods were to be conveyed, se-that the regular stopping of the
trains could not involve much additional expense or much loss
of time; but even supposing there was some pecuniary loss, it
would be nothing compared with the advantages which would
be thus conferred upon the public. He hoped his suggestion
would be adopted in Committee, tie begged to second the
mot ion.

The SPEAKER haring put the question,
Mr. HUME said, in his opinion the public would derive
great advantage from the Bill. He wished to know whether
he proposed to take any steps with respect to the
running of trains on Sundays. It was not well
to leave the question an open one as at present.
Considerable agitation had taken place on the subject, and as
many as nineteen towns had petitioned in favour of trains
running on that day. In one ease, the matter rested entirely
with two directors. He should be glad to leave the matter in
the hands of the Commissioners. He thought the House ought
rather to favour those who were compelled to travel by the third
class carriages, instead of throwing impediments in their way,
He hoped the Commissioners would turn their attention to the
subject, and promote their comfort as much as possible.
Mr. ELLICE apprehended that great good would arise
from the measure. He had examined the details of the Bill
now before the House, and had found that the capital which
they proposed to expend amounted to 41,000,0001. Now, it
was important to know what course was to be adopted with re-
pect to these Bills, in the present state of public business, the
Hon. Gentleman could not expect to have the Bill passed be-
fore these Bills went before Committees in the ordinary course.
It was right that the House should know if the Hon. Gentle-
man intended the measure he had introduced to interfere in any
way with those Bills.
Mr. STRUTT was understood to say that the Bill had
in view future railway legislation, and would not
affect the railway Bills now before the House. If
there should be any special matter on which Parliament
should require a report from them, it would be in the power of
Parliament to require such reports from the board, but as the
session was so far advanced it would be impossible to go into
such inquiries as were proposed. They would be able to go
into the general merits of the Bill, but they could not enter
into local inquiries. Such questions, as of amalgamation and
so forth, they would examine into to the best of their ability,
but it would be of the greatest importance that they should
keep quite distinct the questions of the general merit, and of
rival merit, as want of time as well as want of organi-
sation, during the present session, would prevent the board
from undertaking such responsibilities; and he was most anx-
ious that they should not have any duty imposed upon them at
first which they would not be able satisfactorily to perform.
Mr. ELLICE wished to ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer
whether it was the intention of her Majesty's Government to
tunder w
Rh iacihl r
oaal ld loßaonasrrde
forlati relating
etier
railroadsa should nbd gr
e foerrdreerds
report, and that that report should be laid before the House.
Mr. EN TWISTLE said that he considered the Bill
to be a very excellent one as laid down by the Right
Hon. Gentleman. The control which they would exercise
over new schemes by the proposed system of deciding between
two rival schemes was excellent; the Board would not
ascertain whether a better line could be obtained, but only
which of the two were the better—neither of which ought to
come before the Legislature for its sanction. He did not see
that the Bill would give them the power of insisting them-
selves on a line which would really answer the wants of the
districtdeii to be supplies. by railway communication. He consi-
ere,xaelrs
col thatse
that with i th
prerogative,repe
respect theand
tveto,her thee
eboonal
could
d then
nhbt use-
fully -
appeal to a Committee of the House. With reference to tolls,
he confessed that the period,b as suggested, did seem somewhat
sshohorutldfora
not trueresult
offer
to
a yoppositiontothe
necessarilyo Bti obtained.—(Hear,
Inpon hear.)
thosee a r .
serveo,bligtehdat
to go
gtowelvselow,hourisi:
points.
Again Again he would
et roanisne
quewnaces of the very great number of trains
frequentlypass n w
tiothbe
moved
valuab
out of
le and
importantthe way, in order that it might
passengers.xctiEQ
F R u
notTihnetecrfHerAe
NwicthEtL.hLecosalfletoyf
the
oftheE traffic, It had
(in answer
to the question of Mr. Ellice) said that
it would be extremely
desirable that such a report should be made, and it ought to be
carefully considered what words would be introduced in the
Bill.
Mr. GOULBURN said that there could be no possible
reason why railway compannies should not raise loans
upon
good securities; hut his objection was, that. the present sstem
gave them the facility of using what was a sort of paper -• circu-
lation in the c, un'ry, which led to very mat.ife,t inconvenience.
He had not heard the latter portion of the Right Hon.
Member's speech, and it was very likely that he had made
some observations respecting this point which he had not the
good fortune to bear. He believed that it was one of material
importance not only as affecting the railway companies them-
selves, but the financial arrangement of the country itself.._
Hear, hear.)
Mr. B. DENISON said that he objected to such a power
tel in the hands of any body whatsoever,
and he was quite sure that Parliament would not consent. to
part with such a prerogative. On the whole, he was favour-
able to the measure, which he wasidered would effect very be-

.
I neficial results. He desited to know whether the Board could Government would have in getting back the money from the
not take under its consideration the Bills of the present year— landlords, he (Mr. Grattan) need only remark that a great
( Hear, hear)—for the most valuable part of the proposition portion of the Irish landlords were insolvent, or nearly so.
was that portion which would remove the impediments that He knew of one with an income of 7000/. a year who had to
existed in the proper mode of deciding upon Bills. He con- pay in London 6000!. interest, and of another with an
sidered that it would be well to bring the parties face to face; income of 20,000/. a year, who could not cut a stick on
t was the not adhering to such a practice which engendered , his plantations without leave by a letter from Lincoln's Inn-
distrust in the decisions of the Board of Trade, and that Board fields. As he had already observed, the Irish Members would
would be in existence still had it pursued such a system. He be sent back to make laws for Ireland, as the British Parlia-
believed that there was still abundance of time. The compa- ment for the last 47 years had been trying to cure the patients,
nies would be quite content to wait until after Easter. but as yet had failed in giving the necessary relief. He could
Mr. HODGSON hoped that there would be no delay in not give his support to the series of measures proposed by the
passing the Bills for the present session. Government, and must support the Bill of the Noble Lord, the
Mr. FER R AND said that he had not had the pleasure of Member for Lynn.
hearing the statement of the Right Honourable Member, but Lord JOHN RUSSELL—The Hon. Gentleman the
he wished to draw the attention of the House to a case of a Member for Limerick and the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
railway in his own neighbourhood. An unopposed company the Member for the University of Dublin has asked
eceived the sanction of the Legislature. It crossed through a the Noble Lord, the Member for Lynn, to postpone his Bill,
tensely crowded district, and crossed five or six turnpike roads which stands the first order of the day, being a Bill for con-
e ,on a level. The place to which he alluded was Keigh- strncting railways in Ireland. I rise to state that I shall be
:ey, and the railway passed within one hundred no party to that arrangement, and to express my wish that he
cards of that crowded town, where there were hun- should proceed immediately with his measure, as it now stands
'{reds waiting every morning to enter into the town, for the second reading, or if he thinks it is too late to take it
such a proceeding was most dangerous, and the company this evening, I shall give way to him to-morrow.—(Cheers.)
ought to be compelled to erect bridges wherever they crossed a This is the course I recommend thi Noble Lord to take, but
,vel. He would also draw attention to a case where be was this Ido object to—l object to the Bill being postponed by
‘ufferer to an extent of 4,0001. or 5,()09/. He was tenant which you will hold in abeyance other measures re-
if an estate over which the very same line ran, for two quired in the present most critical state of the country.—
cites. The railway company were compelled to give notice of ( Hear, hear.) What is the plan which the Legislature
?heir intention of applying for an Act, and then it would be in is called upon to admit, and the course which the Government
nis power to appear against them ; but the tenant for life could under the circumstances ought to take ? My Noble Friend, in
make a bargain behind his back, which would deprive him of the bringing forward his motion, has stated that it is no party
:um which he had stated, He wrote to the directors, but they motion, but that it is one which he believes is calculated to
allowed a full month to elapse before he received an answer advance the interests of Ireland. Ido not agree with the Noble
and then he got one, declining to enter into the subject, and Lord, as Ido not think that it would do so, and do not look upon
finishing off with wishing him all the compliments of the it as su':h. But, Sir, lam obliged to say, that with the views
mason- He did not find fault with the railway directors, but I take of the general policy of the Government and the finances
with the careless legislation of the House. of the country, I cannot give my consent to the measure
Mr. HUDSmN wished that the proposition of the Right proposed by the Noble Lord.—( Hear, hear.) I cannot,
;lon. Member should receive the patient and calm considera- Sir, feel that the Government ought to take upon
ion which it well deserved.' But the Hon. Member for itself the application of such a large sum for railways. When
Knaresborough (Mr. Ferrand) might calm his apprehensions I take into consideration the distress which prevails, and the
+or accidents on the lines which he had described were less circumstances under which we are called upon to administer
common than on others. He considered that the Bill pro- relief. In my opinion, we would not be enabled to give effect
erased to effect too much—indeed, much more than he thought to those measures of relief which the circumstances of
the Honourable Member wneld be able to effect. Ireland require, and meet the urgent and extensive distress
There was another point he wished to refer to, namely, punt- that prevails if we give our assent to the present measure. I
uality of trains. He was quite sure the only effect of such a am obliged to say that the granting of 16,000,0001. for the
supervision would be to reduce the speed on railways, because purpose of cunstructing railways in Ireland, under such
t was quite impossible with the casualties of weather, always circumstances, would not be consistent with the
,o keep time. Still he did not complain of this proposed in- policy of the Government, or the interests of the
erference. Parliament, no doubt, had a perfect right to country.—( Hear, hear.) If it were a small sum, there might
undertake such a measure, Parliament occasionally had little be some hesitation ; but when the Legislature is asked to ad-
to do, and he did not deny that it had the privilege of amusing vance this large sum of money, I am obliged to say that I
esself in this way.—( Hear, and laughter.) Certainly, how- think it is the duty of the Government and the House to re-
mem this was not a march in the onward direction. Then, ject the plan of the Noble Lord, as not consistent with the
,gain, it was proposed to revise the tolls every ten years, and financial circumstances of the country. Sir, if the House
no fares were to be reduced without the sanction of the Corn- pleases to g• forward with the discussion, the Chancellor of
missioners. the Exchequer and myself will state the reasons why
Mr. STRUTT—No; not to raise them without previous we cannot give our consent to the measure ;
entice. but, on the present oecasion, all I ask you to
Mr. HUDSON said that certainly was an improvement; do is, to adopt one of two courses, either to bring the
but Parliament had already fixed the rates of railway corn- question to a decision at once, that the House may know, that
ponies, and, surely, if they did not exceed that rate, companies the Government may know, and that the country may know
gad a right to revise their tells, provided they did not go what is the policy on which you intend to proceed—( Hear,
neyend the mark without previous notice. The Right Hon. hear),—or if you do not adopt this course, to give up the plan
Gentleman complained that a particular company raised its km the present.—(Hear, hear.) In asking you to adopt this
fares without notice. He had often reduced his fares without coarse, Ido not state that the Government will not at any
notice, and, doubtless the company in question, had acted future time support any similar plan ; but on the
upon the same principle. He could only say, on behalf of the other hand, I do not say that in the progress
interest he had the honour to belong to, that the Bill should of the present session any large or extensive
lsotdilhnlnlßeeo.nat—itlrwn(efat.Hrytaehsia,enr
have their best consideration, and the Govesnment might rely scheme of railways will be proposed. Ido not desire to induce
upon it, they should have his best assistance to make it as per- any one to vote against the measure of the Noble Lord the
ohtootoeAoi
ler;
,n.
it
rdo :s
tMANGLEStbeneficialhceom
excellentiB
b. fur to
Rightmi
n bearing Hon.
saying
Gt
thus
oni his t l n
iet emus
eta i
}ln-
rFsmlr
Memberei
postpone
bod
ne er
thatff
oho
rri
shNLenye
i willnwl
ln
a. ,
Newark,
kbnA:o tfti lel
di sayrsdottoehhneo
taeodltdthhrhaiit i have
tehoeaf
rreti
hgw proposals hentl
Noblet
made
eaadns eko
tmpLooyosirlt Noble
Lord
postpone-
he n theeto
he did not wish to commit himself to all the details of this ment and that either the measurep will be given up or a decision
Bill. He did not view it with so much jealousy as the Right taken' on it at once. I have no desire to deter the plan
Hon. Gentleman the Member for Sunderland. He could being carried into effect, if the House and the country so de-
speak for the Gentlemen with whom he had the ho- sire it, and they think it to be advantageous ; all I ask now is
nour to be connected in the direction of the Lon- the decision of the House, or that the measure be abaidoned
lon and North Western Company, and he knew for the present.—( Cheers. )
it was their anxious wish that there should be some Mr. OSBORNE thought that the statement of the Noble
stringent superintendence exercised over them on the part of Lord was well worthy the. consideration of the House.--(Hear,
the Government. They had always maintained the position hear.) At the same time he was of opinion that they ought
that it was not by competition that the affairs of a railway corn- not to postpone the consideration of a great monetary question,
pang could be best regulated. but by a strong superintendence like that brought forward by the Noble Lord, the
exercised over them by Government. He wished to know Member for Lynn, for even a fortnight. Many most
whether, in the case of competing lines, the Commissioners important interests in the country would be deeply
would report to which they gave the preference. It was irn- affected if a
.question like this were to remain in a
portant that this should be done : it was well done by the late state of uncertainty for a moment. He (Mr. Osborne) would
Board of Trade, and had its decisions been adhered to the evils support the motion of the Noble Lord, not only for these rea-
and mischief,: which they had recently witnessed would have ssounres,s,bhurtobuegchatusfeorhwearadlsohybtehheevNedohtlheaLt
onrodneatofthtehehtehardeeomf
tehae-
been averted.
he had stated that the Railway Board, in reporting upon and useful scheme of .
Mr. STRUTT said he believed, in the course of his address, Government, wouldbpeoohfliaonywvoarkluse,foirf ulnresluapnpdo.rteldtbsyboaugldrehaet
r
the concurrent merits of competing lines. dt ith re- pulation of Ireland would be out of employment. He would
lines submitted to their decision, would report upon remembered that by the month of April, the agricultural po-
sasionePes:truas
would
' It
put an end to
Bard to a point alluded to by the Hon. Member for support the motion of the Noble Lord, for another reason, he
Knaresborough, he could only state, that in the case of a level would support it, because he believed
erossirg, all the power the Commissioners possessed was to the wasteful system of expenditure at present pursued in that
authorise-companies to erect bridges in the event of their country. He had listened with great satisfaction to the Noble
,decting to do so. The Right Hon. Gentleman the Member Lord when he introduced his measure, and if the Noble Lord
for Sunderland had made some observations on the proposed would enter into the discussion of the question, he (Mr. Os-
revision of tolls; and in answer to those observations, he could borne) would endeavour to prove, in his humble way, that it
my say that that revision would be made upon the same prin- would be infinitely better to lay out money in really useful
ciple that revisions were made by the Acts of Parliament public works, instead of lending it to the holders of property in
themselves, and a due regard would be paid to the interests of Ireland.
the company as well as the interests of the public. With re. An How. Mammas, whose name we could not ascertain,
speet to the punctuality of trains, he did not expect, by any thought it would be bad policy in Irish Members to press the
supervision, that the extreme time could always be kept ; but Noble Lord, the Member for Lynn, to postpone his measure, and
still it was highly desirable that the public should know which he would further say that if they did not support the Noble Lord
lines were most punctual, and which lines were less exact in now, they deserved not to have the opportunity of doing so
their times.—( Hear, hear.) afterwards.-_( Hear, hear.)
Leave was then given to bring in the Bill. Mr. PIERCE BUTLER said that the Irish 'Members had,
RAILWAYS (IRELAND) BILL. after the most anxious consideration, agreed almost unanimously
On the motion of Lord JOHN RUSSELL, that the orders to communicate their sentiments to the Noble Lord, the Diem-
of the day be now read, ber for Lynn, that he should postpone his motion to a future
Mr. S. O'BRIEN rose and said he had to request that the period. The Hon. Member who had spoken last had done so
Noble Lord the Member fo: Lynn would postpone his measure in rather severe terms, for he said that if they pressed this post-
respecting railways in Ireland, and, in a few words, he would ponement on the Noble Lord, they would ace in a manner
state his grounds for doing so. Only a week had elapsed since inimical to the interests of Ireland. Two Irish Members had
the measure came before the House, and it was perfectly already spoken on the one side, and two on the other, and it
obvious that the public in Ireland would have had no oppor- remained for him to give the casting vote.— (Laughter. ) He
t unity of expressing their opinion upon it. It was due to the was not disposed to tell the secrets of the prison-house.—(Hear,
importance, of the question, and particularly to their consti- hear.) It was not his business to do so—(Laughter)—bnt at
Luents, that an opportunity should be afforded them of express- the office in Dowsing-street, where Irish Members attended in
int, their views upon the measure. But he did not think it obedience.—(Cries of " Oh, oh," and roars t,f laughter, much
!,
fair that this measure should be prematurely pressed increased by the Hon. Member's apparent unconsciousness
forward. 1 t was notorious that Government had staktd its of the cause.) He was not going to mention anything
existence upon the issue of this division, and therefore the con- which would be reprehensible—(Roars of laughter)—but he
sequence would be, that should the House decide adverse to had, at least, a right to speak as to what had occurred after-
he views of the Government, there would then be a wards—(Cheers)—among the Irish representatives.—( Con-
change of Ministers. The consequence of that step would he tinued cheering.) He believed he had
especially Pl
ely 1 fe
ase tt
h er iglhotlel e
to throw into confusion measures that were of the most urgent (Cheers)—to state what occurred, more em
importance to the poor of Ireland. The House must he aware Lord, the Member for Lynn, was not present on that occicaosaionine.
that there were Bills before them at the present moment upon The Irish Members met in conclave—(Laughter)—an
which depended the existence of many thousands of to this conclusion, almost unanimously ; they
it would came
htoetdheissircaohnie-
their fellow-countrymen in Ireland, and even for elusion, that under all the circumstances,
the sake of obtaining a permanent good, they that the Noble Lord should postpone his measure to..demworses
ought not to pay as the penalty the loss of human life. He convenient opportunity.—(Laughter and cheers.) 11
was in hopes that this measure would not have been discussed merely giving a simple narration of facts.—(Laughter and
13 a party question, but rather that the Noble Lord the Mem- cheers.) He had not, up to that moment, expressed any
her for the city of London would have considered it as a mea- opinion of his own upon the question. They came to that con-
sure for soc,al improvement which did not require him to stake elusion, and in the most respectable manner conveyed their
the existence of the Government upon the issue. He had sentiments to the Noble Lord, the Member for Lynn. They
hoped that the Noble Lord would have been prepared to ac- had subsequently been led to believe that the Noble Lord, in
quiesce in the general wise of the House, and have adopted the most courteous manner, conveyed to them that he
some measure of this kind. For himself, he had no was 'willing, in the present most momentous periods
hesitation in saying that if Government would bring to concede to the wishes of the Irish Members. He (Mr.
forward a proposal which upon the whole appeared Butler) would not have risen on that occasion had he
to be more desirable than that propounded by the Noble Lard, not seen the extraordinary predicament in which
the Noble
the Member for Lynn, he should support the proposition of Lord, the Member for Lynn was placed, two Irish Members
the Government, rather than that of the Noble Lord. In his having called upon him to postpone, and two to go on with his
opinion this measure was calculated to give immediate employ_ motion. Now, as an individual, there was no Irish Member
ment and relief to hundreds of the Irish people, without involv- more indisposed—(Laughter)—to go on with the question at
ing any loss either to this country or to Ireland ; and he asked the present time than himself, becausehe always desired to sup-
'.he Noble Lord hew they were to act when such a measure was port the present Government. He conceived that the measure
placed in juxta-position with a system of a temporary expediency of the Noble Lord was calculated to raise the unfortunate
which would impose upon this country and upon Ireland, a country with which he had the honour of being connected,
large outlay of public money, without the slightest hope of a re- from the state of misery and mendicancy into which
;urn. He had no hesitation in stating that he should it had fallen ; and however adverse he might be
give his support to the Noble Lord, and therefore to the Noble Lord bringing forward his motion at
he did not wish there should be any question or that time, still, as he had pledged himself on a former
hesitation as to the course he was prepared to take, occasion to support it, he felt it his duty to do so on that oc-
He believed such would be the position of a considerable casion, if the Noble Lord pressed it to a division. He was'
number of the Irish members who were disposed to support as a Member of that House, and as a gentleman, unwilling to
the Noble Lord. He was anxious therefore that it should be compromise his character in any way, and he would redeem
postponed for the present. his pledge, even although unwilling to vote against a Govern;
Mr. SHAW concurred in what had fallen from his Hon. ment which, he believed, had done its best to relieve th
Friend who had just sat down, and cordially joined him in miseries of Ireland. The House would see that he wasre
asking the Noble Lord to postpone the measure. He had prepared with a set speech—(Laughter)— but he considered
on a former occasion supported the measure of the late Noble this question were now pressed to a division, it would neither
on a former occasion supported the measure of the late Noble this question were now pressed to a division, jt ItO?1
and teithdhe
Lord (the Chief Commissioner of Woods and Forests), for be more nor less than the old fight between the Whig; ai„he
extending railways in Ireland. With respect to the measure Tories.—(Cries of "Oh ! oh.") Was it not? WhYesde a
of his Noble Friend, the Member for Lynn, he ( Mr. Shaw) Noble Lord carried his motion they wo ne
Theate _
hoped the Government would think favourably of it, and if change of Government.—(Hear, bear.) di that
they did not adopt it, at least bring forward a similar plan. Lord at the head of the Government had st
Med this .
But' if the question came before the House in the shape of an if the Noble Lord the Member for Lynn ear
for the
alternative, either to reject the Bill or put out the Govern- measure the Government will retire, and it wassdne, and
ment, he was not prepared to press forward the plan, or to House to consider the delay which this would Mem'
of thousands.
vote in its favour. At the same time he would the fact that the Irish were dying by hundreds
ed
to
any d
be prepared to support it, if brought forward under other sir- Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL had never
bate° of sill, there
cumstances. Seeing the constitution and state of that House, cussion with more pain than the present.
Firsters and he
and the awful state of Ireland, he trusted the Noble Lord, the was a division of opinion between the Irish Mern
the miseries of
Member for Lynn, would propose the further consideration of was sorry to say that to divisions they owed
dome to a dise
the Bill ; particularly as that course would enable the House their country. He trusted that if they would
easures they
and the country to give it a full examination, apart from all cussion on the principle of the Noble Lord's Noble '
party motives.—(Hear, hear.) While he recommended that would disembarrass it from all other et:inside:a:tie:
course, he trusted the result would be that her Majesty's important questions which were at presheene,
representieg
Government would listen to the prayer of the people of Ireland, with it. He had hoped that Hon. Mew
and bring forward either this or a similar measure. —(lean ) his country would have been agreedha.
d trusted that
There would be nothing derogatory to the character of the they intended to pursue, and 9
h-
which had nothing
Government in their doing so. While he hoped the Noble they would not have introduced any topic
whether the measure
Lord at the head of the Government would be prepared ;with whatever to do with the mere question erwith
respect to what
some measure of this kind, he could not conceal his sentiments, should be postponed or not. He thought
restd f the Government,
ier:itaeoendmdt coursehteut'rpes
that, under present circumstances, it would be better to post- had fallen from the Noble Lord at the hea
pone the measure. In conclusion, he trusted the Noble Lord he (Mr. J. O'Connell) could not half
eIrP hardly
to slii:tion ; they had to choose
the Member for Lynn would say at once whether he would the Nuble Lord had acted in
a mpaftrtnehim.
postpone his Bill or not.--(Hear, hear. ) Hon who wished Iristfhha
Mr. H. GRATTAN said he would express his views on were placed i assn embarrassing ! his regret that
atton, therefore, was very dike
subject under consideration without any disguise whatever, between two evils, and their here
was a chance of it, let the
as he did not recognise any leadership in the matter. He cult. He would still say, if th but he was afraid his re-
intended to vote for the measure of the Noble Noble Lord postpone his
that which had been urged by
Lord, the Member for Lynn. For twenty years quest would be of no avail, dhow
of Government.
Parliament had been attempting to do something, the Noble Lord at the head „,;Lic said that however painf I
never till the present time had anything effectual been done. Lord GEORGE MENTIte
sobliged to take - • a
on the subject
They had heard that the people of Ireland d • by the h" hhe wa- were dying was course wle id be compelled to persevere,—.
thousands, and there were two doctors who were prescribing before the House he woo ) No change had come over the
for the disease. The question, therefore the had to consider (Cheers and counter cheers., d fth '
was, which of the plans recommended were the best—those• •of his dream .
of the Government, or rho measures spirit
proposed by his Hon.the first day of the setsion .in
Friend the Member for Lynn. He decidedl him •
latter prescription, as it was one which had
by the late Mr. Drummond as the best means referred the still continued in the p
y pre.
been recommended which was one of thedearest;
since therene ay o
.e session ; for, as on
, and the friends who acted with
i ression that this was ' a question
this afternoon that he had received a
theinterests of Ireland. It
tneraescuoriele' cted tbat the professed object
Ireland. Since the year 1835, Committee -signed by thirty-four of the Irish Members of both
after Committee requisition,
had sat on the question, and many reportsof assisting was only at four o'clock
postpone the second reading. The refusal to
made in favour of railways for Ireland had been Houses, to
. hiCh they made to him certainly gave him
; but adopt the proposition sv
to
as yet, no plan had been followed up, The
England, owed a debt to Ireland, and he trusted the Noble of the Ministry was cl• ate
to give imme lat relief to Ireland, and
Lord, the Member for Lynn, would exact it by pushing forwardalthough he and the friends who ached with him were quite
House, and great pain. But it should be
his Bill. If the Bill was carried into effect, he was anxious
and to act •
would occasion a great saving of money, while it would do much to meet the views of Ministers!_uis
in accordance with
for the permanent improvement of Ireland. Since he had the proposal now before the Hlard, se. s s friends
tadb been
persuaded it anxious to carry out that
.object, yet t e were equally
come into the House, he had received accounts of a most summoned from all parts of England,
dcotland, and Con-
shocking character. Fever it seemed was spreading in the tinent; but although they were repare to act, yet he did not
north of Ireland, in Lurgan, Longford, and many other hesitate to say that they would
postponeai h their own conve-
places,nndd tol Sligo.
.It nience to that of the Irish Members. e Government, and
feelings to weigh
a 1 the Irish would not suffer their own against the
public
no
Government,go . good by remaining •
interest. He regretted the
the more,e
therefore,
to see the result
and the They should recollect, t Foreign-office
here. Now to the next point under consideration : they had of the meeting at
and it was expected
shtooduilddextsee
bat in gthe°ffice that day.
of Speech of her
tmembersel wasdecidehis
back,
a betweenoepki opinion
si osn
het
he thathinei
measures
ae
svt
ehe
rdeeys they e f
she
day the
Lord, the ;Member Lynn. Now, what did Majesty on the first . session, that
plan of the Noble
Let them take the Destitute Per- there was an especial recommendation to take the affairs of
N measures pro-
the Government propose?
that in the
there o only 500,000 e ,as a million absence of all political excitement, was an o t •
sons' Bill. On that Bill it was proposed to raise a million and a Ireland into consideration. A statement was made
half; but this amounted in reality tOpportunity for
This sum was to be given through devising such measures as would lead to the permanent advan.
ftrlormelahnids.
had been already expended.
other hand, pnot-tshedou
the means of the landlords. Was that the plan that the tage of a did hone, then, that
House ought to act upon ? On
the
Noble Lord,and he wan therefore, been received
et them take the plan of
the
admitted thatrail- and grievedany party bias;
that this subject
at finding
both surprised
the Member for Lynn. It was generally sidlie ofthe House, would haveall;
• ht made a battle
and that they should be in- of party. Yet, whatever mig be the
ways conferred great advantages, consequences,
d to do so. The he felt compelled to persevere in his
troduced into Ireland. This plan propose
but that theand if difficulties should
any arise,
present motion ;
Noble Lord did not ask for 16,000,000!. at once, whatever those
• in order to carry difficulties might be, not upon his head, but uen the head of
money should be advanced from time to time, p
of this the Noble Lord, must rest the responsibility the works into execution. While such was the nature of those results
' • desert
rnment shouldthe Ministry the helm.
proposition, the Noble Lord at the head of the GoveUnder these circum-
asked stances, he felt that he should not b
for powers through which he told them he would
friends if he did
not persevere in this e doing his duty to his
have to expend 6,000,0001. before the month of Augusts motion.—(Cneers, and
next, without being reproductively employed, and with counter-cheers continually interrupted the speech of the Noble
nti the utmost excitement pery
little prospect of getting back the money. But by the Bill of ! Lord, d ad d h
e t e House during
I
the Noble Lord, the Member for Lynn, they had a chance of 1 is delivery.)
getting the return, la order to show .tlio ability the Alb ROEBUCK thought that the Noble Lord himself had

been unfair, if any one had, in denying that the House did
not entertain the proper feelings on this question. The Noble
Lord had accused the Mini-try of making this a party qnestion,
but if any one had done so, it was the Noble Lord who was
guilty of the charge, by stating that Government had made it
a party question and one solely resolveable into the convenience
cf the Irish Members. The real question was, how was the
difficulty to be met? The people of England had been squeesecl
until they were perfectly dry. This was not a time for
mincing phrases, and in the language of the Hon. Member for
Meath, they were ROW bound to speak the truth. He
meant to follow that example, and do as the
Honourable Member for Limerick had done, tell the House
that this was merely a plausible pretence for the relief of
Ireland. The object presumed was the immediate relief of
Ireland, and yet the Noble Lord was pressing this measure to
a division to-night in the face of three Bills now lying on the
table of the House. Those who had no historic appeals to
make could well understand the object cf the Noble Lord the
Member for Newark (Lord John Manners), who, the other
night, made such an urgent appeal for the people of Ireland.
There was evidently a split in the camp, and this proceeding
was only a stop-gap to prevent its being known. Ilete they
had a great party. The Noble Lord called it "my party'—
( Cheers and laughter)—a great party, called from al: quarters
of the globe, giving no regard to thci: private convenience,
called together to bring this great question about, affecting,
as it did, all the financial and commercial concerns of
the country. There was not a monied man connected
with the monetary interest of the country who would not tell
them that while this great question concerning 16,000,000'. or
17,000,000/. hung over his head his hands were tied up, and it
was of vital importance that it should be settled. Therefore he
said, as one who felt an interest in the well being of his
country, that it was the duly of the Noble Lord to bring it to
an immediate termination ; and glad he was that, in spite of
Irish convenience, the Noble Lord was forced to do so.-
-
(Cheers.)
Lord GEORGE BEN TINCK then moved that the second
reading be adjourned till to-morrow. (Cries of "Oh oh," " Go
on, go on," " Divide, divide.")
Lord JOHN RUSSELL had no objection to proceed with
the Bill to-morrow, but he trusted the House would take the
third reading of the Destitute Persons (Ireland) Bill first.
The second reading was then adjourned till to. morrow (this
day.)

AMERICAN NEWS.

SEVEN DAYS LATER.
(FROM OUR CORRESPONDENT.)
LIVERPOOL, THURSDAY EVENING.
By the arrival of the packet-ship Queen of the West,
from New York, from which city she sailed on the 23d
instant, we have papers to that date inclusive, being
seven days later than that brought by the Yorkshire,
on Friday last.: The steam-ship Ilibernia had not
reached Boston on ttle 2 tat, but was hourly expected.
Two packet-ships, the Rochester, from Liverpool, and
the Quebec, from London, had arrived at New York ;
each takes out two days later news. The papers before
us do not contain any very important intelligence, and
that portion which refers to the war in Mexico has
been almost entirely anticipated by the arrival of the
West India mail. The New Orleans papers state that
no app reht nsion is now fat for General Worth's safety.
The Washington Union of December 19 contains the
following :
Dispatches have been received from General Taylor' dated
the 22d December, near Monterey, representing that he had
left that place on the 15th for Victoria, having previiusly
put in motion the troops destined for that point. At Monte-
morelos a junction was effected on the 17th with the 2d in-
fantry and 2d Tennessee regiment of foot from Camargo ; and
it was intended, with the whole force (3,5(© men) to march,
on the 19th, for Victoria. But on the evening of his arrival
at Montemorelos, a dispatch arrived from General Worth,
commanding at Saltillo, with the intelligence that Santa
Anna designed to take advantage of the division of force
towards Victoria, and by a rapid movement to strike a heavy
blow at Saltillo; and if...successful, then at General Wool's
force at Parras. Under these circumstances, and with no
means of judging bow far this information might be well-
founded, the General returned to Monterey with the regular
force, in order to be in position to reinforce Saltillo if neces-
sary. The volunteers under General Quitman, reinforced by
a field battery, were ordered to continue their march, and
effect a junction with General Patterson at Victoria, while
General Taylor returned to Monterey with General Twigg's
division, now increased by the 2d infantry.
In the meantime General Butler and General Wool being
advised by General Worth of a probable attack upon his po-
sition, moved rapidly to join him with all the available force
at Parras and Monterey, while orders were dispatched by Ge-
neral Butler to hasten up troops from the rear. The latter
General proceeded in person to Saltillo and aseumed the com-
mand, agreeably to instructions which had been given him
by General Taylor before his departure to meet a case like
this.
General Taylor had proceeded beyond Monterey on his way
to Saltillo, when he,was met on the 20th by a dispatch from
the post, announcing the early arrival of General Wool's co.
lumn, and also that the expected concentration and move-
ment of the Mexican troops upon that position had not taken
place—indeed, that their advanced posts had rather been
withdrawn. Deeming the force there, and soon to be ct Sal-
tillo quite sufficient to repel any demonstration at this season
from San Luis Potosi, General Taylor did not think it worth
while to throw forward General Twigg's division to that place,
and after resting it a day, designed putting it again in
march from Victoria, to which point he was to proceed
himself.

General Patterson was supposed to be then well on his
march from Matamoras to Victoria, when his division, ex-
cept the Alabama rangers, in garrison at Tampico, will be
brought together. With a force holding in observation the
passes from Tula, the garrison at Tampico may be reduced
with advantage to the service.
The proceedings in Congress were unimportant. An effort
had been made in both Houses to try and bring the war in
Mexico to an end by negotiation, but what success ulti-
mately attended these peaceful movements we are not fully
informed. _ _

The papers by this arrival contain accounts of the opening
of the Mexican Congress and the President's Message, of
which the following is an extract :
MESSAGE OF THE MEXICAN ACTING PRESIDENT,
GENTLEMEN REPRESENTATIVES,—

The august act which we have assembled here to confirm
is, in solemn compliance with the grand national promise,
enveloped by the resolution of the month of August last.
With that confirmation ceases the precarious situation which
necessarily ensues between the destruction of one class of
political affairs and the establishment of a new one; and by
means of the body of representatives, elected by the people
themselves, by their own free choice, being charged with
the public safety, the nation is nowabout to decide its destiny
in this epoch of a terrible social crisis, when dangers of all
kinds threaten our nationality, and while there remains the
heart of every good Mexican a last hope that we shall finally
consolidate our political being.
Deeply filled with these patriotic sentiments, as a simple
citizen I give thanks to Providence that He has permitted
our reunion, and I give them with more fervency because, as
a public man, I have been permitted to fulfil the sacred pro-
mises which I gave in the capitol of Mexico, and now relieve
myself of the revolution without having deviated from one
of those principles which were so truly popular, or disap-
pointed one of those hopes which the unanimous enthusiasm
of the nation awoke. It remains for you to make this revo-
lution the most grand and the most happy of any of our
political movements. In the short term which has passed
since August, having overcome my natural repugnance to
the exercise of power, and having been placed at the head
of the nation, my first object has been to sanction the war in
which we found ourselves compromised, and in the result of
which nothing less than the independence of our country
itself is involved. _ _

The army which united with the people and raised itself
to destroy those who usurped their sovereignty, and who
threatened the establishment of a foreign throne over our
country. after having completed the national movement,
marched to the spot where dangar called them, and are at
this day in front of the enemy, and under the command of
an illustrious soldier whom the republic called to the defence
of its nationality. A section of our troops were quickly dis-
patched to the reinforcement of the old army of the North,
and in the city of Monterey they awaited the attack of the
invaders. Congress already knows the fatal results of that
encounter, in which North, American blood ran freely. The
chiefs who:there commanded our arms having been sum-
moned to a court of inquiry, the nation remains satisfied,
and it is not for me now to comment upon the judgment of
the judicial tribunal.
But worse than all, this unfortunate event has thrown.
into the power of the enemy one of the capitals of our states,
also a vast extent of territory, thus transferring the theatre
of the war into the heart of our republic. The Government,
undismayed by these disappointments, thought only of raising
new forces. The illustrious General Santa Anna, by an act
of his life which will cover him with imperishable honour,
(refused) to take upon himself the supreme command, but
marched at once to San Luis, where, in the space of a few
weeks, he united ani organised an army of more than
22,000 men, sections of which have already thrown them-
selves before, and encountered the enemy! On their part,
the Government of the United States, pledged as they are
to " conquer a peace," have given orders to General Taylor
that he should advance. Thus, then, another encounter be-
tween the two nations will soon take place.
From the valour and number of our troops, the enthu-
siasm and skill of their chief, and the justice of our cause,
we ought to expect a favourable result. But, however it
terminates, this action will neither be the last nor decisive.
Our country being invaded and occupied—not only the ter-
ritory in question,, but a great part of that which never
belonged to Texas—whole states over which the sovereignty
of Mexico was never questioned; enveloped in a war for
our race, and aggravated in a manner the most unjust and
atrocious which the mind can conceive of, our honour and
the welfare of our children—this sacred interest which
nations are not able to disregard—obliges us to sustain
the struggle, however prolonged and obstinate, until re-
spected for our valour and our constancy, we hall arrest
the immoral ambition of our northern neighbours, and make
sure the position of our race upon this hemisphere, peopled
for the greater part by them, and where at no distant day
their ardent and generous deeds will shine forth, brilliant as
the noon-day sun.
If great sacrifices are necessary for this strife, disgraceful
would it be to lose the whole for the false advantages of a
deceitful and fugitive peace. In a great crisis we.are called
upon to give illustrious proofs of our power and virtue. Our
fathers fought for their independence eleven years, in a strife
always disadvantageous, spilling their blood at every mo-
ment. Thanks to their spirit we were raised from an humble
colony to the position of an independent nation. If Mexico
fights with constancy and intrepidity, her's will be the
triumph and the merited respect which she will acquire
among the other nations of the earth. Acting on these
principles, the Government has not desired to receive any
propositions of peace ; the question of war remains submitted
to your decision, and the Government can only recommend
to Congress the urgent necessity of aiding the army with all
the resources necessary for the campaign.
'

The people of Mexico, who know end feel the magnitude
of the interests which are at stake in this war, will not refuse
their resources for its prosecution. The strife is not one of
those wars which pride so often engenders. It is the pheno-
menon of an object still more important and transcendental,
whose motives are in their nature similar to the causes, and
the extension of whose consequences it is difficult to conjec-
ture. The northern race has spread itself over this continent
with celerity and force, unexampled in all previous ages, and
now, in their growth, they threaten to extend themselves
over our territory and extinguish our race, establishing the
predominance of their own in its stead. This invasion will
produce the same results under the auspices of peace, as in
the days of war; and thus to make sure the permanency of
our race we have need of institutions which will promote our
solid growth and prosperity.
Lucre the President leaves the subject of the war, and
goes on to review the political state of the country. He says,
that since the revolution of last August, all the states have
introduced the old constitution, finding that much the best.
He regrets the previous loss of their democratic institutions,
but rejoices that they now have a prospect of recovering
them. The choice of their officers and the laws of their
country, he is convinced, should be the sacred right of the
people. After portraying the great Mexican nation as it
once was, he describes it as it is now, and concludes as
follows :—]
I do not wish to sketch this melancholy picture, but
these calamities moved my Mexican heart; they in-
spired me with the resolution to place myself at the head
of the recent revolution, and to proclaim the return of the
democratic and liberal opinions, the only ones that can
make us respectable and happy. God knows, gentlemen,
that no ambitious wish enters into my views.
The power which necessity threw into my hands, has
been held by a continual sacrifice of my aspirations. I
have never harboured any thought or desire, except to
see my country the conqueror of its enemies, and to enjoy
in its bosom, the peace, the liberty, the glory which she
merits. I have believed that the meeting of this Congress
would signalise a happy epoch, and I bless this day, by me
so much desired, on which, depositing the power in your
hands, nothing will impede my road to the army,tosiiare
their dangers, to fight like a soldier against m
country's
exercise of
foes. On this day the nation enters into the full
its sovereign rights.
Gentleman Representatives,—The revolutionlthasc
remainso m -
pleted that which it promises to. the peop
have
now for you to fulfil the hopes wlnchwheicfeh
ever}- Mexican
ev
con-
ceived; to make certain the prayers o
at this moment oilers to Heaven for 4hueurprudterioncteisam yourndfor
tune of their worthy representatives. patriotism,
your virtues are the best guarantees that
these
knowledge sacred and your
will be fully satisfillet.
ARIANO SALAS.

of Congress,
n6cYl BS4eGn.o r Sublets, President
Isis
sxicEo Dec.
nt Sir, The national represenatives have
heard with pleasure the solemn words which
repliedi‘rt ase followsc
excellent
:--
the Executive
has spoken. The chief of the glorious revolution of August
4th has manifested his satisfaction, to see the vote of the
people which was given at the capitol, complied with. The
representatives of the people desire to return, through me,
the most cordial response to the chief of the people's revolu-
tion. The element of democracy rules through the republic,
and I am able to give assurance that the fundamental laws
of the country will have for their object the common welfare
of all, without yielding to the exaggerated pretensions of
the minority.
Truly difficult it is to commence this work at a time
when the powerful republic of the North insults, invades, and

threatens us with the absolute annihilation of our nationality;
but these representatives, so far flow' being discouraged by
this melancholy situation, will press forward in the Inidsf o "f
the combat to give all convenient organization, to the end
that the integral parts of the nation may have vigour to,
resist. _ _

No, Mexico will not be less than France, who, though the
legions of Europe came to invade her, conquered princes and
organized her government at the same time. By good for-
tune the mildness of our climate, the blandness of cur customs,
and, if I may say it without boasting, our ♦irtues, will cause
us to work in an energetic manner, without committing the
crimes, and covering ourselves with the blood which stains
the history of the old_ world.
The decision manifested by the supreme power, the in-
trepid valour of our army, the noble resolution of its com-
mander, and the reanimation of the public spirit throughout
all the states, appear to be good symptoms that the epoch
fixed by Providence has arrived, when the Mexican nation
may be able to call itself, and to be called with truth, sove-
reign, free, and independent.

Before 'the Supreme Being we were, yesterday, sworn to
procure, 2B far as in our power, the good and prosperity o
the nation. The oath will be fulfilled with all the loyalty
which a sacred duty and tried patriotism demand.
The commercial news by this arrival is satisfactory. Ex-
change at New York was 106 c. to 106 c. for bills on Lon-
don, but at the fatter quotatit n the business was very
dull. In bread stuff few transactions were being effectei,
and prices were advancing.
AFFAIRS IN YUCATAN.
(From the New Orleans Papers of th. 11th.)
The following is a more pr r: account of an overture
by Yucatan, mentioned in the previous accounts from the
Gulf:—
A Mexican schor ner, bearing a flag of truce, arrived from
Campeachy on the 24th. She brought the news of a decla-
ration of the independence of that province from the central
Government, and claiinirg for her porta the privileges of
nentrAlsCommodorewhich it is believed Commodore Conner refused
unless they
hoisted the American flag. Merida, and the
country adjacent, had refused to unite in the movement, and
proposed to put it down by force of arms.
'I he Campeachanos had marched upon Merida with a force
of 2,500 men, the Meridans having 4,000. It was supposed
by the captain of the flag of truce, that a decisive battle was
fought on the 21st ultimo, that being the latest date front
the army, at which time they were within a few miles of
each other. The flag of truce left Anton with the answer
of Commander Conner, on the 27th.
AFFAIRS AT TABIPICO.
(From the New Oilcans Tropic, Jan. 11.)
The brig Hallowell arrived at the South-West Pass on
Saturday morning, after a passage of sit days from Tam-
pico. The captain reports matters quiet when he sailed,
and nothing of interest had transpired since our last dates.