The Sun.
London, England, 1847-02-11 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

ROUSE OF COMMONS, Feb. 10.
TEN HOURS' BILL.
Mr. BANKES said he did not advocate the present Bill
for the purpose of giving any opposition to the Government.
He was rejoiced that some members of the Government were
in favour of a modification of the present system. Although
they were not prepared to go the whole extent which the
Hon. Member for Oldham required, he was authorised to
state that those who sought for a ten hours' Bill,
would not be contented with an eleven hours' Bill, but if it
was the pleasure of the Government to pass such a measure
it would be a matter of satisfaction to them, as it was a step
in a right direction ; and with reference to the success of an
experiment it might not be unsatisfactory to have a. trial
for a year or two of such a measure before the public. He
concurred in the regret expressed by the Right Hon. Baronet,
that this matter had not been made a subject of private
regulation, but he could not say that he, for
one, was disappointed. But he had high authority
for saying that such a result had been expected by one of the
principal opponent) of the measure. He did not then see the
Hon. Gentleman in his place, but he believed him to be in
an adjoining chamber; he alluded to the Member for Dur-
ham. (At this moment Mr. Bright entered the
House, and took his seat amid considerable laughter.)
On the 23d of May the Hon. Member for Durham stated in
his place that the proper mcde-of proceeding would he for the
operatives to seek a private arrangement with the em
ployers ; and he admitted that they ought to have by
some means or another an alteration in the present sy.-
tem, which he said they would have had
had other means been taken to procure them. Now, would
the Hon. Member for Durham say that those means had
failed? Had there been even a proposal from the manufac-
turers to the operatives? The Hon. Member had been the
subject o`many questions by reaLon of the high and prominent
position in which he had placed himself as candidate for one
of the great manufacturing cities of the empire. Amongst
other questions which were put to him; as lately as the
mouth of December last there was this—" Do you consider
that time should be allowed for education with regard to
young persons employed in manufactories? " In answer to
this question, the Hon. Member said—
Mr. BRIGHT—Read the precise words I used.—(Hear.)
Mr. BANKES—WeII, I will, and I ought to say, in Pa.-
liamentary form, that to prevent mistakes, I hold in my hand
a copy of the Hon. Member's speech.—(Hear.) His words
were as follows:—" Well, I am quite certain that the man
who works ten hours a day is much more likely to be edu-
cated than the one who works twelve.—(Loud cheers.) I
do not differ upon this point, but I differ on the point whe-
ther a reduction of time ought to be carried out by the Legis-
lature, or by a regulation between the masters and the ope-
ratives themselves."—(Hear, hear, and cheers.) Had he
quoted the Hon. Gentleman right?
Mr. BRIGHT—That is correct.

h e Mr.ba had
made K ES
promote
askingate
ta
thim
adjustment whether
anyw aellhlnofuursttted
only right but just ?—(Hear, hoar.)
tempts ?—(Hear, hear.)
which in the month of slay last hp huaaddshtaetehlehtvoeabaemnaoyt
and December made any
andsucha
February, had he made
But now, between December e
couldsu i
there
de ? Was there
more favourable for such an adjust-
have been any period
or d• db hre kn ow
ever, o f aonry
hanavyisnugchbeeenndema
ment, when avour,
labour were shortened, the mills were partlyro hcyloseatywhmenattal-aelhoursof
from other
agree-
ment entered into between
causes
esema awstheircshanhde twhaeuerdernaottiveast,
but shortened
the present moment inquire into, but which showed,
in point of fact, that no adjustment had been made.
If it
were the fact that no effoie. had been made for this par-.
pose what chance was there that that arrangement would be
Made now. There had been time for malting the experiment,
and since the Hon. Member said that it ought to have been
done, what chance he again asked remaincd that it would be
done at ell? The Hor Member for Durham was
now a candidate—undoubtedly he lied every right
to be tc-.for the representation of one of the
largest and most commercial cities in the country, the
city of Manchester. He might not have been in the _dome
when a petition was presented,Esigned by 220,000 persons
residing there, and with the leave the House he would
read the prayer of that petition. TIT petitioners said that
they deeply sympezhiLed with the fecLoty workers in that
large and important manufacturing city, many of whom were
of tender years, shu.; up in a close room for a period in each
day that was qvite incompatio'e noi,h their nature, and they
added that, owing to the long hours of leboar, these young
persons were debarred from a!( means of enjoying the bene-
fits of religious or secular education ; that, in consequence of
the long hours of which the petitioners complained, the fac-
tory operatives were in a worse poiition than any other
artizans, by which their physical creme was deteriorated,
and if no relaxation were afforded, they would be mere
representatives of the human body, without any of
the vigour which should accnnpany it. They prayed
therefore that the Legislature would pass a ten hours'
Bill without further delay: These sentiments emanated from
220,000 persons, whom the Hon. Member for Durham sought
to represent in Parliament. True, they had no votes, but
they were still the persons whose opinions and feelings he
would represent. If the Hon. Member would, therefore,
wish to please his future constituents, let him vote for this
Bill, and thus render himself a more worthy candidate lor
their suffnizes than be was at present.—(Hea-, i
and laughter.) The Hod. Member said last year that
this was a fit and proper measure, which ought to be by some
means adopted. Thera might be persons in Blanchester,

.~- --=-

perhaps, more powerful there the in wb name
not for 0
were appended to this
tion woul, 1 n ,fluence hie
moment suppose that this consia:ra ha' r it was the
conduct now. He had, however. to recollect. ris measure
expressed opinion of the Hon. Morn her that thew
petit; on. 'brditivildrenant _ .
y of adjust-
ought to pass ; and, as it could not p, operatives
es a
nd thrl
ment and regulation between the errin-laose,t: now to fulfil
he (Mr. Bankes) called upon the Hon. D. 'Ruler'
theme ,
esure by the
the pledge which he gave, and early out actmente-•
only means left, open, namely, a legislat el
let, which,
(hear, hear.) There had been circulated a pampa
although published two years before, had o my be in sent tO
against
him that day. That pamphlet contained grave lehargtarsags,
he
a most honourable person, and containing se cli
charges,
if at
thought that it ought to have been circulated earlier,
ell. It was entitled " A Report of the Cent oralcommittee
e.°
of the Association of Millownersengaged in the • cotton tau
allude to- the personal
Now he (Mr. Bankes) would nos'• ed • Lust this honours,
charges which that circular contained against
able person, but lie would to one pass,age which he0
happened to glance at, fig he had had no time to examine
:That passage stated,.
carefully the contents of the document':
prs,stnt arraz igement
" It is useless to discus whether the
twelve hours for fire days, and nine' -hours on Sfttur.;
day, is precisely the best limitation fo Jabot sr; _
the limit which Parliament has long since e.etablisn ed," Om.
Now, the House would permit him to ask wh ,e it wasc" use-
less less to discuss?" Could there be a better occupation their
time than to discuss whether that which was fie trid a benefit
to the people Co a certain entent should not be further
__
ex-
tended, if any further additional benefit could be conferred/
Could they be better employed than extending a measure
which had been already found good still further
The quotation went on, " Usage and habit has ace, =moda tea
itself to this period." Why that; was said of the slave-
trade ; "usage arid habit" bad existed there for a long
time, but that was no reason why that habit and usage
should be permitted to continue.—(Hear, hear.) el On th
continued certanity of this lirnitatioe, the master manulae:
turer had based his calculation of profitable retort ls." WhY
what right had the master manufacturer to base his. Galen:
lations ore this limitation ? Had not this been a evnstanl.
subject of inquiry, of proper inquiry year after year 2
it not been constantly agitateci in that House, a-nd
histly agitated? Was there any reason wby the
master manufacturers, when the former iw w"'
passed, should speculate upon no further cration
of the law in all time coming? The Honourable MOP:
ber for Moetrose had been pleased to say that he bad got
one besetting sin, and that was his universal advc general
all reductions in taxation and retrenchments in experaeliturse •
But the Hon. Member had another besetting sin, sued that
was his determination to look with such intensity en one
side of a question, that he omitted altogether to look at the
other.—(Hear, hear.) Now, when the Hon. Mernenr for
Montrose supported the former Bill of leleel, he
doubtless thought it the concentration of all human
wisdom—(Hear, hear, and laughter)—but be forgo t that
these Acts limiting factory labour had been passed—Tassed
with complete triumph—Acts reducing nOe labour of these
under thirteen years of age from 74 hours a week to 3V, and
persons above that age from 74 to 69. All these conce scions
had been universally admitted, by every one ,but the Hon.
Member for Montrose, to be attended with the happiest sue:
cess, without any counterbalancing inconvenience to Any of
the parties interested. But, said the Hon. Member for MOif
trese, these persons are blind to their own interests; ohNn.
they were ignorant it was the duty of the -I'ea,`;eg
member to educate and prepare them properly. At that
time, when an extended measure of education was hiving
nein-
trodueed into the other House of Parliament, surely' sae"
arrangement should be made by which the artizan
mon with all classes in the country might be benefited. la°
measure (as far as the factory workman was con:
cerned) was an insult to 11;:e, for they provided a leg;
fund fur educational purposes, from the benefits
which he would be altogether deieerred. The Honer?:
able Member for Darbam had arimitted that the
man who worked ten hours had more time for the purn,ri
or education than the man who worked twelve iueers. Pea
the man who worked twelve hours any time for educailell as
all? He was compelled to devote twelve hours to work, eine
he required two heurs for meals--where thee could the tirSla
for education be found? The Hon. Member for Montrose:,
had put a hypothetical case. " You cannot," sail`
he, " pass an equal law for the limitation of labour?
because the labourers are of different conditions in life:
One has a father and mother, and another is o°'
burdened with either." He ( Mr. Bankes) said, givef
them all the advantage of the same law. He could e!
no distinction that could be safely made between the ono
labourer and the other. The House would remember that
when this measure., was first brought before' them the":
were shocked at the recital of the cruelties perpetrated!!
the factories; they had heard of the physical defornfitg;
which resulted from the nature of the employment. el'eg
(Mr. Bankes) had always beard and read those statemaaw
with much pain, and with a belief that, while the manufti
Curers were not guilty of the cruelties imputed
to to them, the offences themselves were greatly exaggerateaz
but neither could he shut his eyes to the consequences whiccl
would follow the want of education. He could not be
to the physical, as well as the moral deterioration IC" ee
would result from this course; and if Government did
apply the remedy,, to whom were they to look for it? He wee`
r
of opinion that this was the fitting opportunity lne
the enactment of such a measure. If they passed tlns'
Bill at this period it would entail no inconvenience
on the manufacturer. The Hon. Member for Durban
erit
had been unable to carry into effect a measure
he himself declared was fit and proper, and therefore
it behoved the Government to interpose and rectifY the
_.A
grievance. He would give his cordial assent to the sews-
reading of the Bill. for
Mr. MARK PHILIPS said that the Hon. Member
Durham had had a speech made at him as candidate for
Manchester, perhaps the House would allow him as
words for him.
repre-
sentative tor Manchester, in essc, to say a few - mpathise
He trusted it would not be considered he did not
67 de in the
with the workmen in factories if he did not coielel
()O but henions of the Hon. Member who had last spoken, ,
(Mr. Philips), as the representative of a vast cominercia;
interest, could not let his feelings run away with his tilt!te
judgment. He thought that any interference between capo. ..,
and labour would tend to the most mischievous consequences
for the House might depend upon it that one-tenth of the
manufacturing power of this country could not be repressed
without the workmen's wagessuffering in the same proportion.
Why was the Government to stop short with reference to
agricultural labours? He believed the present was such a
departure from proper legislative interference, that he could
not but augur the most serious results from the adoption of
the measare.—(Hear, hear.) He did not like the proposed
"nibbling," piece by piece, of the measure, such as that
alluded to by the Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State
for the Home Department, to reduce the hours to eleven in-
stead of ten. If the experiment were to be made,
let it be made at once, upon a bold scale; lle
would much rather at once give his support to the_
ten hours' measure than to such a meddling system of kV!:
lation proposed by those who had not the courage to go s,
once to the completion of the full measure, but who stepped
at a sort of half-way house.—(Cheers.) He believed that
great ignorance existed on the part of Hon. Members with
reference to the subject of factory labour. It was not for
him.to catechise Hon. Members on the subject; if he did sox
Ise might, in all probability, be told " that he had better
mind his own business, and give them credit for
ir
the. knowledge they possessed upon subjects which
even the most experienced manufacturers and inhabitallen
of the district were unable to obtain." It was quite true an't
the measures which had been passed for the purpose of re:
stricting labour in some factories had been attended Witl
some success ; but he begged most earnestly to protest agahl
the arguments urged by the Right Hon. Baronet the been
tary of State for the Home Department, that because part'n
success had attended the measures passed for the protection'
of women and children, that therefore future legislation fof
adults should be equally successful. With those views, seeing
nothing but mischief attendant upon the passing of the"
measures, and not at all underrating the comforts of the
working cusses. or being one whit less desirous than the lion-
Gentleman who had last addressed the; House to see educe;
tion afforded to the people, still he was obliged to weigh
carefully both sides of the question, and he had come to the
conclusion that nothing but mischief would result from the
interference by the Legislature in the large manufacturing
districts oO the country.
Lord JOHN MANSERS was quite surprised to hear the
Hon. Member for Montrose say than the present measure
was advocated upon party grounds. He did not think such
a charge ought to have been made. The slightest
refiec!ion upon the history of the question would
suffice to show that such. a charge was teener
unfounded. No one could look upon the Passt
history of the question without seeing that never was anY
question of great national polity supported upon such dis°
interected and honourable grounds, and carried on in such 8
manner as to be in every way worthy of the great else
itself.—(Cheers.) The great cause had been going on for
years, though warrior after weldor had fallen in the
glorious struggle. Sir Robert Peel first advocated
the question, died, and left the care to the
care of Sir J. Hobhouse; he carried it en for tome time, until
it was taken up by Mr. Saddler. That great advocate of the
cause died, and left the conduct of it to Mr. Oastler; he, in'
his turn, gage
place to Lord Ashley, who carried on the 'war
to the very verge of victo, when circumstances on"
curred which prevented his proceeding further With
the measure, and he resigned his glorious charge to
the Honourable Member for Oldham (Mr. Fielden)-
Still they found the same teeolute, indomitable persever-
ance in the great cause. And row, in this year, 1847, they
found the great question again brought forward, and boldly'
advocated by its irdelatigable supporter, the Hon. Member
for Oldham ('Mr. Fielden).—(Cheers.) Well did Lord Ashley
say in that House, and truly, "that it was possible, nay,
probable, that the efforts of her Majesty's Ministers would be
successful, and that they would carty their motion, but
for how long? If the Government would wish their
victory to be complete, they mast extinguish those senti-
ments which had given rise to his." In that sentiment
was to be found the feeling wbich nurtured and fed the in•
domitable courage o: the supporters of this measure.—
(Cheers.) And so long as men had eyes to weep, souls to
pray, hearts to feel, voices to raise, and hands to lift up, so
long would the struggle be continued, until the arduous
contest was eansummand by the glory of a triumphant victory.
The Right Hon. Baronet, the Secretary of State for the
Home Department, had used what he called "old arguments,"
those arguments
were year by year becoming weaker and
weaker, and he hoped those arguments, the fallacy of which
had been so long exploded, would be consigned at once " to
the tomb of ell the Capulets."—(Cheers.) The present was
the most favourable time for the passing of this law, in con-
sequence of the depressed state of trade in the manufacturing
districts and the high prices of corn. The mills
were now working short time. When, howeverOthe current
set in the other way, if this measure were passed, then
stability and security would be the result, instead of a wild,
insane, and reckless re-action, which had before been the
bane of the prosperity of our manufacturing districts.--
(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord then went on to quote
trurn the circular of Meyers. Parkissoa and Taylor. The'e
gentlemen said:--" Stocks aro :lady accumulating, and must
be ore long press heavily upon the market. Yet the spinners
and manufacturers with reckless infatuation, in the face of ic;
creasing stocks, of advanced prices in the raw material, and
of a declining demand 6)r yrens and goods, have for the
greater part reverted to fell time, and production within the
last fortnight has resumed almost its former vigour." This
state of things would no doubt be followed by a serious de-
pression. What was the select of these rapid alternations o
prosperity and depression in the condition of the workman?
—during one week he had nothing to do, and the text week
he was tone and racked by fatigue. In such a state, was it
possible for the working man to contract habits of sobriety
or forethought, or to perform his duty to his country
and the society in which I:e moved?—(Loud cheers.)
It had been said by the opponents of this measure, that so
much walk could not be done in twelve hours as in ten • (va
if it were so, the great p ractical reeelt would be, that if this
Bill were passed it would spread a larger amount of labour
over the working classes, and thereby equalise the amount
to be performed. It had also beeu said that it was
wrong to interfere in manufacturing speculations. Nothing*
could be a more decisive refutation of that argument than
the declared officiel value of the exports of the country, as
given in a Nvfli ?Tr Til‘Clo!!..t.•!,, from
which it op; en: ,1 inn, iii teel ,e;.; vele., c••!14)1'
exports ii it ,i to lenee,neeo leee it. .Lll,4.ailted LO
17,344,5764, but in the year 1842 the declared value
of the .cettoa exported was 21,770,1271. This
would at ouce dispose of the argument of the mischief 0