The Sun.
London, England, 1812-03-14 00:00:00

getting milder and milaer eVor since 1775 up to
present time. Within the last halt year the
p it.ishments lied been so few ti-at he had hardly
tnot,:ht it worth while to• notice them in a regular
tic ,y 7 _ _ _

Mr. WEIfTBREAD thought the Hon. Generals who
Lad spoken had under-rated the punishment as much
as it I.ed been at different times m:ggerated by
othf-rs. The one prattice he thimight aS injurious as
the other. He contended that death hail frequent-
+een caused by flogging, and` that different pa-
th .:.ments were inflie-led by tying the cat different
ways, according to the caprice ofthe/Officers. The
infrittion ~f the punishment was also frequently pro-
hinged in variJus ways. If called upon to do so, lie.
could 4;rove 51 their bar that men had died in coi4se*
quence of excessive punishment. The repetition of
punishment for the same offence was in his eyes an
aa of wanton cruelty. He wished the .puniSh-
rnent to be abolished altogether without seeking for
any substitute, and he. would therefore vote for the
clause.

Colonel FE ANKLAND defended the present system,
Sts greatly to be preferred to that of France, or any
other country. He contended that imprisonment
would not answer the end proposed, and that the
best soldiers in the army would oppose that sort of
punishment as useless to reclaim the negligent, and
prefer the present system.
Mr. HEUBERT was an enemy to corporal punish-
ment if it could be avoided, but experience had
proved it to be necessary. All other modes of
punishnient had been resorted to without success,
and be should therefore vote against the clause pro-
posed to be introduced.
Lord COGELEANE‘,spoke against taking away the
power to punish. The violence and excess of it, in
some instances, he thought, had orinenated in the
influence of that House—in the appointment of
young officers through Parlfamentary influence. He
knew little of the affairs of the army, but he knew
that influence was much felt in the navy, as the
seamen were were now in many instances employed
in a nonsensical way, being ordered to polish the
deck, and clean various parts of the ship, in an use-
less and fantastical manner, and on this very ac-
count were frequently flogged for nothing. It
would be better to look to those to whom power
was trusted, than to take away the power of
punishing altogether. If it were so taken away, it
would ruin the service. The best men in the navy
would say so, and if put to the vote amongst the
sailers, he was sure the decision would be in favour
of the present mode of punishment, but they would
tell the Lords Commissioners of the'Admiralty that
they (night to be commanded by persons of expe-
rience, and not by young men appointed by-parlia-
mentary influence, or any other, influence. He
thought it would not be amiss, if occasionally a mo-
th:n were made for the Register of the Admiralty
of appointments recommended -by that lord or this.
lady. If au Officer now applied for promotion, and
be had net such interest, he was told that he was
Lot recommended. The Noble Lord concluded, ex-
pre-ssing a hope that he should see the puniShment
of flogging abolished, while the power of infliaing
it was suffered to remain.
Mr. YORKE was almost in doubt, after what he
had heard, whether or not the Noble Lord, as the
Debate had run to a considerable length, had had a
dream while it was going on. In the first instance,
ire had stated that the sailors were foolishly employed
in .cleaning the deck, &c:; that, in consequence,
frequent punishments were inflicted, and this drop'
theiappointment of young officers ; and, finally, he
had spoken of a register being kept at the Admiralty
for the recommendations of lords and ladies. In
each insoince'the charge preferred was unfounded.
He did not knob where the Noble Lord had been
since lie left the service, nor where he gained his
informadon, but there was no foundation for any
one of his statements. He did not know of what
thne the Noble Lord was speaking—whether of the
prernt, or the time of his own promotion. He did
not kt.ow he, her his promotion had been hastened
in the tsay he had mentioned, but he had peen one
of the youngest officers in the service. When how-
eser he was told !in the Navy that no person could
rise to the rank of Lieutenant, till after six years
vrvice, nor till the party was I o years of age, • that
after that t%yo years were necessary to raise him to
the rank of Commander, and one more then before
Ire could be made a Post-Captain ; if he would put
. these together he would find that officers could not
be promoted without having some experience. The
punishments in the Navy were not more frequent
than formerly ; but though in these, particulars he
leas obliged to contradict the Noble*Lord, he should
agree jilt him in his vote. To lay aside that dis-
donne by eedch we had risen to our present height,
would be au ad of political suicide and madness
unpsrallehel even in this age of experiment.
Mr, Kamp spoke against the clause of the Hon.
Batonot.

The Bill was then read tat third time.
Sir' F. BURIIETT replied -at some length id what
bad been* urged in debate, explained part of what
Ire had stated in his former speech,-and concluded
with moving his clause.
Mr. ABERCII&MBIE said, it would be a great satis-
facti,,n to those Gentlemen who opposed the clause
of the Hon. Baronet, if it was considered convenient
by the Judge* Advocate, that a return should be made
to the Houie of the number of sentences which had
taken place during the year in Regimental Courts
lilartial, or it the Hon. Gentleman could
:state the
&arne to the House,
Mr. M. SUTTON said, he knew that the number
had diminished greaily, but not
.having any official
docurraeruc. by him, lre did not wish to state any.,
thing pat ticuiarly to the House.
Tile House then divided—

For the Clause - -
Against it .
- - -
Majority - - .

- 6
- 79

- -73

On. the Gallery being opened, we found Mr.
WHITBREAD fin his legs, speaking on the subje6l of
the intended Bteakwatet in Plymouth Sound, which
lie wished to be postponed, as there were ,many.
Gentlemen who were desirous of -dehvering their
sentiments on the sut?jeo.
Mr; YORKE agreed to its postponenient to Afon7
day f)eXt:•
The Offices in Reversion Bill was.. read a stcond
time, and utdered to be committed on Monday.