The Sun.
London, England, 1823-04-17 00:00:00

MESSAGE.

A Message from the Lords announced that their Lordships
had agreed to several Bills.
FOREIGN AFFAIRS.
_ _ _

Col. DAVIES wished to put a question to the Right lion.
Secretary of State for Foreign - Affairs, relative to the papers
which he had communicated to the House. In statingsehe de-
termination to preserve neutrality, the Right Hon Gentleman
seemed to consider that there were two cases in which that
neutrality was to be strictly observed. That of submitting
to the laws which we ourselves had imposed, and of respect-
ing the Spanish Colonies. Front the manner in which this
last pint was stated in the note of the Right Honourable
Gentleman, it appeared that he had some understanding that
the french Government .meant to do the same; and what he
wished to ask was, whether there was any engagement of that
nature; and if not, whether he had demanded to know if any
attempt was intended upon Cuba by the hostile armament now
in the West Indies.

Mr. Secretary CANNING replied in a tone of voice, that
was sometimes inaudible in the Gallery.; that he'was sur-
prised-at being asked whether they had required from the Go-
vernment, of France any assurance as to possible future con.:
tingenties of such a nature. lie 'took the liberty of stating
the other night, that with respect to the Colonies which had
thrown off their allegiance to the mother country, the time
was come when it was necessary for this Government to state
its opinion of the relation in which they stood towards Spain,
and of the ,claim which she had upon them. Because other
Powers might allege a misunderstanding upon those points;
and,to prevent the occurrenceolisuch a case, they had thought
it necessary to make a declaration of the nature contained in
the Paper. But that they should have required any assurance
from other Powers upon the question, it was most extraordi-
nary to expect.
After a remark, in explanation, from Colonel DAVIES, the
conversation dropped.
Mr. GRENFELL moved for a series of returns relative to
the amount of balances in the hands of the Bank of Ireland,
and of the number of Irish Bank Notes in circulation.—
Ordered.

FOREIGN ENLISTMENT ACT. .
Lord A LTHORPE rose, pursuant tosnotice, to bring on his
motion for the repeal of the Foreign Enlistment Act. lie as-
sured -the Rouse that be would trespass very little upon their
time. The subject was one which did not require much debate,
either for or against it, and the arguments which he intended
to produce might be narrowed into a very little compass indeed.
It, however, he did not give some explanation. he might lay
himself open to the misconstruction of some who would sup-
pose that his object was to involve the country in war. He
wished, in the first instance, unequivocally to declare that he
was a strong advocate for peace.-. 4 Hear, hear !)-- And having
made that declaration, he was also willing to avow, that he was
far from being indifferent to the success of the Spanish cause,
or how strongly, he felt against the violent and atrocious out.
rage against the liberties of man. It was necessary for him
to trespass for a few minutes on the House on matters not
quite relevant to the subject before the House. In the
first place, he did not think that any train who really look.
ed at the circumstances of the country, could say that
they could justify a war.• His Majesty% Ministers have
declared, however, that the country was Competent to
enter into a war, it' the necessity of the case left that
alternative to it alone. But evtry man must admit that
war 'would be at present to Britain the greatest evil that
could be inflicted upon it. lie would even go further, and say,
though great a calamity it would be to Britain, that a war un-
dertalen now would be of little service to'Spain. On the con.
teary, he feared that it would be rather detrunental, and unite
t lie French more strongly than they were.—(Hear I) In making
the motion which he then did, he was satisfied he could show
that a repeal of the Foreign Enlistment Bill was consistent with
the strictest principles of neutrality. It might have been wire to
have spoken of war at an earlier period, on the first expresaion of
hostile sentiments at Verona. The country might have expressed
its horror at an aggression of the liberties of Spain, or even gone
the length of declaring an intention to support her in case of an.
attack. At that time a declaration of war might have been proba-
bly prevented, and he felt .compelled to declare that his Ma.
jesty's Ministers did not consult the honour and dignity of this
country or the tranquility, of Europe. They certainly knew
better than he could the feelings of the Allied Sovereigns,
but his Majesty's Ministers should not have confined them-
selves to mere representations of the interests of. Spain.—
They should have put forward higher grounds. They should
have appealed to the honour and dignity of their stations
to the infamy which would ever attach to their names, and
to the disgrace with which they would be handed down to
posterity. That language Atonic' have been used if the Sove-
reigns were indifferent to other suggestions, and higher prin-
ciples ought to have been appealed to, than appear by the pa-
pas to have been introduced, Wear, hear !}—lf it were ne-
cessary for him to prevent a friend in private life from commit-
ting any crime, he would not appeal only to the interest of the
parties oppressed, but he would attack him on strong
,grounds
of principle—.of the loss of honour and eternal istfamy., His
Majesty's Ministers sent forward nothing but the interests of
the allies, and neglected to appeal to public law, to justice or to
morality. It was quite clear that the only duty which a neutral
state lirsi to perform, was to act with perfect unpartiality.be-
tween the belligerent powers. If permission to one was given
to enlist troops in this country, it would be a violation of
neutrality, to the other. But if we give to bash parties equal right
iwnr°disngsewntseibthuerahe principle which
(tomrdeo
Ctlin
itesnaimnge),
swheeocooliims iheadtno The Hon. Gent.
he advanced was that to be found in all the books of the Jurists.
It was to be found in Grotius, in his Chapter on Neutral
States ; and all the illustrations of those authors were taken
from ancient history; that particular case was founded on a
complaint made that the Corinthians alone were allowed to
enlist troops in the t erritories of Athena, by which the neutrality
of that state was violated. If France became displeased at
the repeal of the Bill, and went so far as to declare war against
the country, it ,would be a war of oven
ggression ; and he
trusted, however wise it would be for hangland not wantonly to
engage in any contest, it was not yet sunk se low in spirit or
resources as to fear or aubmitto
waonuludniluies unjust
gladagr retso inquire uirle how
was Icl:onulnisturynewnatsAnclotn ue-eerevualectime: tie measure by which the neutrality of the
was neutrality shown from the Norman Conquest to the year
1819? He would be glad of .an answer from those who main:
tained that the continuance of the Act was at this day necessary
to-eliow the preservation of a strict neutrality. If, then, the re.
peal of this could' not be strained into a violation of neutrality,
he would next inquire was there any thing of a domestic nature
to prevent it ? When the Bill was first passed, it was staked
would you allow soldiers enlisted fora Foreign Power to be
paraded in your streets? That objection could hive no force
at present, as one of the Six Acts rendered any military train-
ing illegal without the license of Government. The repeal of
that. Act was perfectly consistent with the true principles of li-
berty in the country ; for it was one of the definitions of free-
doat that every man should have a right to do that which was
not inimical to the cenimunity.--(llearly The House would
recollect that by the 9th and .12d George. If. it was made felony

for a British subject to serve in a foreign state. The penalties
were so severe as to render it a mere dead letter on the statute
book. In 1819 it was intended by the last Act to mitigate the
penalties of the former, and the fact was changed from a felony
to a misdemeanour. In moving for the repeal of the Act of
1819, ha was of course not be considered as renewing the fore
mer and severer Act. The motion he had to make was, for
leave to bring in a Bill for a repeal of all the clauses in the
Foreign Enlistment Bill, with the exception of the first.
Lord 'FOLKESTONE rose to second the motion. He was
anxious to take the earliest opportunity atibrded him of declar-
ing his opinions on the speech of the flight Hon. Secretary for
Foreign A.ffairs on a late night, and en the papers which be
submitted to the House: lie never addressed the House on
any occasion without deploring that language failed him to ex-
press his sentiments. But if there ever was an occasion where
he was at a loss for terms to express his feelings, it was then,
when he had to declare hie indignation at the utter degradation
which the papers refiectiel upon the country and that House;
and how much the charttoter of the nation was compromised by
all that passed at Verona. If be differed in any respect with
the sentiments of his Noble Friend (Lord Althorpe) on the ex-
pediency of war, he hoped that it would not appear a want of
courtesy when he seconded his motion. If the House would
allow him to refer to the speech of the Right Hon. Gentleman
-oppitite (,Mr. Canning), there were some parts of it to which
his cordia assent was given. He found in that part where it
was said, if this country was to be neutral at all, it should pre-
serve the strictest and most honourable neutrality. Every feel-
ing of justice sanctioned the propriety of that conduct. When
the Right Hon. Gentleman spoke of the ties between England
and Portugal, and stated that we were bound to it by treaties
of defensive alliance, but not of offensive—that we were not
bound to support it in any quarrel of its own seeking, he con.
sidered it unfair to make that public declaration—to go out of
die way almost to do so,. for the, purpose of telling the world
and France of the weakness of Portugal. That feeling had
pervaded. the whole of the transaction—a feeling not of strict
+neutrality, but of an evident leaning anti patiality to the
interests of one side. That feeling was displayed by the two
passages which the Right Hon. Gentleman read on the former
eveeing with so much confidence. From the 'first there could
be no ambiguity as to the part which France meant to take._
It was stated openly that there were other views for the Army
of Observation besides the cordon sanitaire. But if the Eng-
lish Minister had not been duped by the French diplomatists,
he would have construed the first establishment of this force
into a declaration of hostilities. Times were when the posi-
tion of this army on the frontiers of Spain would have called
forth a British annathent into the Bay of Biscay to watch its
motions. The fact was, the Right Honourable Gentle Man
and his colleagues were duped, but if that was so, for what
purpose were so many thousands a-year paid to the British Mi.
sister ut Paris ?—(dear!)—Were our statesmen so little
versed in the arts of Courts, that they, expected the French
would send us notice of their intention to invade Spain ? Does
the robber who means to pillage and murder the passenger on
the highway, give forewarning to his victim of his intentions ?
—(Cheers.)—The Right Honourable Gentleman piqued him-
self on his'" round unvarnished tale." Unfortunately the want
of foresight and political wisdom was too nakedly exposed.-
81tch conduct he (Lord F.) could not consider otherwise
than as disgraceful to the country, and he wished there Was
spirit enough in this House to remove a nun who would
act so, from the directiea of the Councils of the country.--:
He had been hitherto alluding to 'the first dispatch sent by the
Right Hon. Gent to the British Minister abroad, in which the
line of policy which this country meant to pursue was disclosed.
From that he would pass to the last of the Right Hon. Gentle-
man's productions, in which he stated, " That confiding in the
declarations of France that sheelfad no views of aggrandizement,
or of keeping Spain by military occupation, his Majesty's Go-
venivaent had determined" upon acting so and so. In this de-
claration he was sincere, or he was not. If he was sincere, he
was made the dupe of the Trench Minister; if he was not, he
was making a dupe of our Ministers abroad and of this House.
Could he'doubt that France had views of aggrandizement when
Chateattbriand avowed that the object of the war with Spain
waseuplere the. House of Bourbon in that commanding posi-
tion which was first aimed at by Louis the Fourteenth.—
(Hear, hear, hear !), and to give them such a controul over
Spain as would enable them to influence the affairs of Europe.
-e-(Hear, hear, hear !)—But the Frenchman was too keen to
speak his mind so freely to this country—at least if he did so,
that paper was not laid upon the table. The declaration was
made to France, and with a view of making the quarrel al
popular one. For however unpalatable a war undertaken
with such views might be to the English Nation, the placing it
on grounds of national aggrandisement was the best mode of
gaining the support of all Frenchmen. But what would be
said of the British Minister, who, in the teeth of all these de-
clarations, still suffered hiMself to be duped; and shutting his
eyes, contented hiinself with expressing his hopes that the
renchman had neither views of conquest towards Spain nor
Portugal, or of carrying. his interference too far in the relations
between the King of Spain and the people.—(Heer !)—and this,
too, as a time when he might have known that such views were
entertained as might be seen from perusing the papers on the
table? Could the Right Honourable Gentleman be ignorant
of die real views of the French Government then, or was
he deceiving the House by feigning an acquaintance with
them ? There were passages in these papers which made
one's blood boil, and when he (Lord F.) read them 'at
home last night, he let them drop from his hand twenty times
in indignation. It was clear from the very first dispatch to the
Spanish Ambassador, that Ministers had no intention of tak-
ing a manly part in die contest, but that, humbled and de.
seceded, they bent, crouched, and bowed down before the
House of Bourbon, and that too in the cause Of . liberty—a*
cause in which England had ever made it its boast and glory
to bleed.--(Cheers.)—Was not this enough to make one asham-
ed of their country, which was brought thus low by the con-
duct of Ministers ?—Throughout the whole of this affair there
was shown a succumbing to France which was humiliating.
The Duke of Wellington was sent to Verona to lay before'
Congrss all the negotiations which had passed with France,
and the answers of Spain respectin,g them, but France, on her
part, was never called eipon to state what steps she had taken.
Thus, it would be seen, that the Court of London was interfer-
in between the two Pewees, whilst it was not ashamed to tell the
world that France refused to make it the confidant of the
terms she was asking. Why did we not insist on France being
more explicit ?---It was clear that we were afraid to do so. It
was a question which a child, who had received any nbtions of
diplomacy, would have asked.. He (Lord F.) would not advert
more particularly to these papers, as he hail not had time to
Make -himself master of them.. Neither was he prepared to say
that this country should have hastily hung out the show of war.
He was no advoeate for bullying, and did not approve of throW-
ing out a menace when there was no poWer to inflict the blow.
But why was this country reduced to smelt a pass as to be un•
able, on such an occasion, to take a becoming part ? There was
a time when Lord Chatham said," he would be glad to see the
Power in Europe that dared to fire a cannon." This was also
the cant of Mhusters of the present day to a very late period.
That Noble Lord was still 'at the head of Government, who
was invested with the illustrious Order of the Garter, " far
having raised the country to unexampled greatness and power."
—Wear, hear and a laugh.)—lti eight years after that same
country, through b the fault of those who directed its councils,—for
they alone were responsible to Gon and the country for the de-
gree of goad or evil which it possessed, found itself obliged to sub.
mit to dishonottr and disgrace, by crouching before the House of
Bourbon, and promoting the aggrandizement of that HOuse, in
direct opposition to the policy of our ancestors,—that sys-
tem which was acted upon in the reign of Queen Anne; which
induced the wail of Marlborough, and was the great principle
of action since the days of Louis XlV.—(Hear.)--It was also
in opposition to the efforts that we had ourselves made, and by
which that very debt was contracted, which was now the greatest
obstacle to our exertions. For what was that which prevented
us from going to war, to vindicate the liberties of, Europe and
preserve the safety of England? It was never denied that the
independence of Spain upon France was essential to the balance
of power in Europe. The Hum had heard much last night of
the miserable state of Ireland ; but it was still of great import-
ance to this country. The conquest of Spain by France would
afford facilities for fitting out armaments for the invasion of
Ireland, and the subjection of the West Indies. It was theie.
fore absolutely essential to the safety of England that Spain
should be independent of France. This consideration placed
the Right lion, Gentleman's conduct, in suffering himself to be
duped, in a worse light. It was alleged in the other House that
the state of the debt prevented this country from going to war.
Let it be recollected, however, that this debt was contracted in
order to restore the family of Bourbon to the throne of France.
—Wear, hear !)—Unless measUres were taken to get rid or
some part of this incubus, the French must be allowed to
controul all the west of Europe. He (Lord Folkestone) luut
been charged with bronchi systems of spoliation, but he wouP

p-eseVere in arguing that this debt world end in overturning
all the establishments mid liberty of the country at home; and
neutralize the powers of resisting enemies from abroad: Two
years ago he gave notice of a motion on this subject, and he
should continue to impress upon the-House, that paying the
full interest of the debt was inconsistent with all capabilities of - •
natirmal defence. The Noble Lord then alluded to the hopes
which had been held out to Spain that this country would adopt
its cause. He condemned the festival of the City of Landon
Tavern as a mockery of 'the distreis of Spain. He din not
charge Ministers with this, because they were no parties to it,
but he blamed those Gentlemen who made mere professions of ,
sympathy there, and did no more. Such conduct was uncon—
genial to the spirit of Christian charity. But thinigh the Raght
lion. Gentleman did not make open professions of sympathy,
yet he was to' blame for leading the house astray, and induc-
ing them to vote establishments nuder the impreteion of war,
which they otherwise would not grant. And if Ministers had
not determined upon going to-war, they should redgee the heavy
establishments of the country. Since 1815 the army had been -
kept up on a war footing, and the existence of so large a force was
justified by the alleged necessity .of enabling -this country to
take an imposing pmk in the politics of Europe. Now, how-
ever, when a case presented itself which. demanded their inter
fermi, the British Government where wholly unable to, take
any part.---(Hear !)—The Noble Lord' eonekelea by again ea.
pres.sing his reprobation of the negociations which had been
carried on with France, in which he contended that the honour
of this country had been committed and its importance comproa
mis al by too much succumbing to the French Government.
Mr. W. LAM B begged to remind the House, that the
Noble Lord who had just sat down, and who expressed himself
"i'a anxious for a war with the Bourbons, was the very same
Nobleman who had formerly outrun all his friends in zeal for
their restoration. The Noble Lord was eager now for a war
against the reigning family of France; but not more eager than
he had formerly been for a war in their favour; and, as regard-
ed the debt of which the Noble Lord spoke in terms of such
deprecation, if there was a man in the country peculiarly re-
sponsible for that debt, and bound in fact to pay it, it was most
decidedly the Noble Lord himself; who had been most promi-
nent in advocating that great measure of the war, out of which
a main portion of the debt had arisen. It was nothing for the
Noble Lord to say that he had opposed the later measures of the
war-=that only event to prove that he had retracted at one time
the opinions he had entertained at another: in voting for hits.
tilities, the Noble Lord voted for all the consequences attend-
ant upon them. For his own part, he (Mr. L.) confessed that
he had not read the documents lately published with sufficient
attention to have made up his mind upon them ; but, will
respect to the Bill which was in question before the House,
upon no one principle could he vote for the repeal of
Certainly, in former times, it had not been unusual for British subjects, in a chivalrous spirit, to-enter into the service of fo.
reign states, r.
and even to raise forces in this country for the se
vice of such powers • but the political state of Europe was now
totally changed. lie objected to the repeal of the Bill, because
he thought the prerogative of war or peace stood vested Tao-
perly in the Crown, and because he wished that it should rest
there. If there was any department of the state in which it
was improper for the House or for the country to take the reins
out of the hands of Government, it was in the department of
foreign affairs, because upon such points Ministets must .of ne.
cessity have superior knowledge. The repeal of the Fo-
reign Enlistment Bill at the present moment could only
be viewed, as he took it, as un act of decisive hostility. As
such it was a proceeding unworthy of the frankness and
honesty of England t if the country was to interfere, let it
interfere t but let it interfere openly and boldly, not co;
vertreia It was well to talk of demonstrations of public feeling,
and of debt incurred contrary to the wishes of the people; but let
it be recollected that our thirty millions of debt had not arisen
out of the acts'of the present unreformed Parliament, but out ela
those of a house which had sympathized too much with the
wishes of the people. The Hon. Member proceeded to depre-
cate the principle of acting upon the public feeling. Cove=•
meats had no right to act upon feeling; it was the duty of a
Government to look to the interest of' the country which it re-
gulated. The impulse of feeling—the impulse produced by
eleqaence—was almost always dangerous. Some of the most
troublesome contests in which this country had ever been in-
volved, had arisen out of very eloquent and popular speeches.
There were Members in the House now, old enough to recollect
the vehement applause, the flinging up of caps, which had at-
tended the celebrated pidlippic announced by Mr. Wedaerhurne
against Franklin in the Privy Council,previons to the first Ame-
rican war. It was matter of curious remark, that when Mr.
Franklin come over to this country, at the conclusion of that„
contest, he wore the same suit of clothes in which he had stood
betbre the Council to listen to that invective. Fortunate was it
far a nation; when its interest and its feelings were in unison.
The task of a 6hyvernment was easy then. Such had been ths
task of the English Government when tl.e former Revolu.
thin had burst forth in Spain ; when it had. been as dearly to the
advantage as to the wish of England to Unite in the contest.
But there were times in which the duty of a Goverment stood
opposed to its inclination. Governmenee, he repeated, were
bound not to act upon feeling,' but 'to-look to the interests of te
nation, and to sustain them frankly, steadily, and impartially.'
In approving the course choaen by England of neutrality, he
still believed that there was spirit enough in the country to un.
dertake a war' if a war was necessary, and means (notwith-
standing the debt) sufficient to carry it on. If France suc-
ceeded in her present object, he was far from believing that she
would derive any advantage from her success ; that euccess, .
such as it was, she must take with all the obloquy which would
be attached to it; and so far from her power as a nation being
in any way increased by it, it would serve only to weaken her
present strength, and to cripple her resources.
Lord FOLKESTONE said, that he could not possibly con-
ceive to what act of his life the Hon. Member for Hertfordshire
referred, which had rendered him responsible for the late war
with France. or must be peculiarly liable to pay the debt which
had accrued out of it.
Mr. WM. LAMB had merely alluded to a speech of the
Noble Lord's (as we understood him) in the year 1803, upon a
question of Army Estimates, in which the Noble Lord had pro.
posed, that the restoration of the house of Bourbon should be
{ made a rine qua non in the war.
Lord 'FOLKESTONE believed that the Hon. Member was
mistaken. He had said, certainly, at the time referred to, that
as the country was at war, it would be advantageous for the
house to set up the interest of the Bourbons against the inte-
rest of Buonaparte. Whether the expression of that opinion
made him peculiarly responsible for the consequences of the
war, or liable to pay the national debt, was a question which
he was content to leave to the House.

Dr. LUSHINGTON said that if it were blameable in a
man to abandon principles which he had once energt,tically
maintained, there was no one against whom the imputation
could be made with more justice than the Honourable Gen.
tleinan who just sat .down. - He did not accuse the Honour.
able Gentleman, but he must say that he was the first in-
stance in his knowledge of a person of great abilities and tried
integrity, who had completely forsaken the sentiments which
he once so strenuously advocated and become a convert to the
opinions of his bitterest antagonists. What must be thought
of him who would discourage dentonstratione of public
opinion because he supposed they placed a responsibility
on those who were parties to sach a dclaration ? What
must be thought of him who would advance such a slavish
doctrine as tins—that when all the atrocities and abotnina,
turns of French policy were laid open, the people of Eng-
land were not to express their cimununion with the sentiments
of the oppressed, and their indignation against the op-
pressor ? Good Got ! were we now to couch and truckle
to a Bourbon ? NVlutt ! had Chateaubriand reduced usSo low a
this ? Were the mouths of the people of England to be stopped,
and were they to go in mourning for the sins of other coun-
tries ? But the lion. Gentle:nail wished to eontroul the expres-
sions of indignation in that House. This was the'first time it
was ever boldly asserted that the representatives of the people
should be silent lest their, opinions should give offence. It was,
perhaps, expedient that Ministers, in the course of diplomatic
business, should use the language of courtesy, but in that
House he trusted, he should never see any attempt successful
to check the honest declaration of feeling, though all the despots
of I.:Acme were leagued together to vent their rage upon the
country. With respect to the measure before the House, he con.
eared with the Noble Lord in opinion that the Dill mirth t be re-
peak** without violating our neutrality. That 'such a mea..
sur.: would be regarded in France es tt testimony of our abhor-
rence of its conduct he was ready to admit. liebelieve4 it would
bwi
reitt
11,c
ronnt
al rel3ecgidiutti litstatiteorial, foreign rneiad gni
ci,,,141a ftnoatrtrec3i,ghtaa, ;Qinnwosetrr3,lg4htlirtitt oeiii isket, itroitionste
fßsotirr:iittl
set
ItonourAbio Getzelman opposite for the rea,ott why the British
P.irliemeot had adopted a particular inea s : '!tit 'would 11, ti's-
oppusineidotruspoaYntitliatet tmheettrst°irreesign.ois:lt'irrralatlitnittt'.)ntit,°luntlireo.ysil?rco4unil

'be shown that they involved a breach of neutrality. He should
like to know, by what authority it was stated that allowing a
,power at war with another to purchase ships stores from os, and
even permitting our subjects to enlist in the service of that,
power., was breach of neutrality. But this bill not only von."
sravened.this.priociple, but it prevented a native of England,
though 'twenty, years living from this country, from entering
into a foreign service, under the penalties of a misdemeanour.
lied not flyigland.the subjects of all nations in her service?
Was there net even a Statute in existence, which gave the
'benefit Onitturalization tea foreigner, who had been employ-
ed for two years during a time of war in the service of Great
'Britain. Was it not the practice that when bound by treaty
to furnish arms, men, and stores, a nation has continued
to furnish'thein after the war had broken put. By allow-
ing
to both parties the same rights and privtleges, there
could be no breach of neutrality. The Bill was most hostile to
the feelings ainl interests of the country. It was not a little
singular that this Bill was passed at•the remonstrance of Spain,'
in order to prevent us from assisting Spanish Colonies from
asserting their independence. What was the consequence ?
—That 'very measure now returned upon the head of Spain,
for it wan. the great obstacle to this country giving her as.
sistance in her hour of necessity. So- far as his judgment
went, he thought the line most becoming this country was
that of hostility. It was not in feeling, but in principle
that he would recommend this country going .to war. A
war should not only be just, but the country should be able
-to say that it was so expedient, as that we could not avoid it
without abandoning our honour and interests. There was no
reason Whatever for believing that we could escape going to
war.' • As' it appeared to him we should go.'to war with greater
chance of 'success, before theforce of Spain was broken, and
'before France had gone so far as to lesiva us the task, not of de
''fending, but of conquering. He did not deny thatx defensive,
treaty with Portugal did not oblige us to go to assist her in an
offensive war. But she might very well say to herself—r""if I
lie by until Spain is conquered by the French, it will not be in
the, power of Great Britain to save me." lie was persuaded
that the country was in it situation to go to war.
Doctor PHILIJIMORE said, that as a fitter opportunity
would be presented for discussing the question on tie pro.
priety of our engaging in the war, he should not address him-
self at all to that question at present, but should confine him.
self to the one immediately before the House. lie thought the
Noble Mover altogether mistook the princiPle of the 13111 of
1819. By the law of England the subject owed obedience to
the Sovereign, in return for protection; and in that obedience
had always been understood the refraining to engage in foreign
wars without the consent of the Sovereign. This was declared by a
statute pasied so long back as the reign of George U. in which it
was enacted, that any English subject engaging in the wars of
foreign States without the consent of ,the Crown, should suffer
death. The law of 1019 vas passed to remedy.littletnore than a
technical difficulty—it being believed that the insurgent provin-
ces of Spain could not be considered as coming within the de-
scription of "States." The whole of this statute law too, it was
to be observed, was merely in aid of the common law, which had
always treated the engaging in foreign wars, without consent,
us a misdemeanour. In looking at this subject with regard to
the law of nations, it was to be remarked that the question had
been much discussed whether neutral States could permit their
subjects to assist one of two Belligerents without compromising
their neutrality. A writer of great authority, Ilinkerslitike,
had laid down, that where by the law of the neutral State the
subject could not engage in foreign war without the,.consent
of the Sovereign, the consent of that Sovereign for such a
purpose was a violation of neutrality. And he then went
on expressly to declare, that this was the rule of England.—
The Act which was now sought, to be repealed, was in strict
conformity with the ancient law; and he thought it would thew
a gross partiality to repeal it. If we decided on neutrality, it
should be a fair and bona fide neutrality: Ile should oppose the
motion.
. . . . . .

MARRYAT said he had opposed the Act originally,
because, among other reasons, he thought it was an infraction
of the liberty of the English subject. Now however, that it
stood upon our statutel3ook, he thought it would be highly
objectionable to repealit at the present moment, for the re-
peal would give Spain a decided advantage over France. He
thought our determination to neutrality was a wise one, and
that the proposed repeal would be perfectly inconsistent with
it. At another time, when the repeal of the Bill would not
affect our neutrality between the Belligerents, he should give
his hearty support to such a motion as the present. He ad-
mitted that the conduct of France towards Spain was aggres-
sive: but he thought that was no reason for our making our-
selves parties to the war, especially when he considered the
hostility which Spain had so often directed against the com-
merce of this country. Spain had not entitled herself to call
upon us for the smallest sacrifice of our own interest for her
benefit. Before he sat down he could. not forbear expressing I
his sarprise at the call for war which was now so loudly made
by the same lion. Members who were reluctant to sanction the
former war, and who now not only called for war, but at the
same time also for a remission of taxes, which those Geo-
denten must well know would necessarily be increased if we
went to war.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that the substapce of the
objection made by the last speaker to the repeal of this Bill,
was, that it would be of service to a gallant nation. But the
Honourable Member professed his readiness to support a mo-
tion for the repeal when it could be of no use. The Honour-
able and Learned Civilian had spoken of the English Law, and
he (Lord John) bad waited with much expectation to hear the
name of the English law book to which he would refer in sup.
port of his argument. He had, however, contented himself' with
quoting Binkershuke,_a foreign writer, and one (Avery ques-
uonable authority. The caution given by his Honourable
Friend the Member for Hertford against the effect 'of elo-
quence, was, he thought, unnecessary, and the circumstances of
the two cases were not at all analogous. Mr. Wedderburn
was the Advocate of the Crown, and had exerted his poweee
in favour of a war for the suppression of liberty. Ile (Lord
John) had :tot the same confidence in Ministers which his Hon.
Friend had. He thought they must have been ignorant indeed,
not to know of the Trench. influence which was at work at
Madrid to countermine the Spanish Constitution. Ile had been
given to understand that a French Minister had sent for the
Spanish Ambassador at Paris: and, in tbe name of his Go.
vernment had stated, that if Spain would consent to certain
alterations in her Constitution, France would assist her to re-
gain her American Colonies, and would go to war with England
for that purpose, if necessary. He would conic however to the
question peculiarly before the House. Queen Elizabeth had
permitted soldiers to be raised in England for the aid of the
Protestants in the Netherlands. The Noble Lord here read the
Declaration of Elizabeth on that occasion, which, he interred
the right of the Netherlanders to throw off their allegiance to
Spain. She had even assisted those Netherlanders with
money, although England was then under a treaty of amity
with Spain. The present state of things was worthy of
remark on a comparison of our situation with that of Eliza-
beth at the time in question. The Spanish Revolution took
place early in 1020 ; and in the course of the same year, up.
peered the celebrated Russian manifesto, declaring
.that new
institutions should emanate only from Kings, a maxim which
had been adopted by all the other Continental powers. Virtte
• it then too much to say that the present contest was between
despotism on the one hand, and liberty on the other ? It was,
however, the liberty of England which was principally aimed
at, for that was considered by tyrants as the most dan-
gerous. To protect that liberty, by supporting the liberty of
others, we had the same reason as that which had induced the
conduct of Queen Elizabeth. He denied, however, that the
repeal of this Act would be a violation of neutrality, if upon
neutrality we should ultimately. resolve. It would be merely a
restoration of our old law, as it stood before the year 1814.
Mit whatever might be the course on which the Government
should determine, the hearts of the people of England would
not be neutral. They would express their sentiments in fa-
vour of the gallant Spanish nation, and their hopes for her sue-
ceas ; and he saw no sound reason against our yielding to the
generous feelings of the country, and repealing the present Bill.
Mr. T. COURTENAY rktd that Elizabeth, on the occa-
sion alluded to by the Noble Lord, had given assistance to the
Netherlanders, because she had no objection to go to war ; and
indeed she afterwards did engage in it. There was, therefore,
an end of the comparison made by the Noble Lord, if it wore
agreed that we should remain neutral during the present con-
test. Those who. in 1819, opposed the present Act, and those
who then supported it, might, on the present queation, have
the same opinions as to the effect of its repeal. It could not,
be believed, be denied that the repeal would benefit the
:Spaniards only. It would be impossible, then, to call this neu.
trality.. Genius, Mattel, and other eininent writers on the law
of nationii had laid down that a neutral should give no as-
sisionce to a belligerent, unless she were under an obligation to
'do so. He perfectly agreed with his Right lion. Friend, that
we should be content to apply to ourselves, as neutrals, to the
doctrine we had laid down to neutrals when we ourselves were
belligerents. And no doubt could possibly exist that we had
gone much further than declaring such a measure as the pro-
posed repeal to be a violation of neutrality. This would be
seen on reference to most of our state papers, particularly that
,of Lord Howicic to the Spanish Govermnent during the admi.
nitration of Mr. Fox. Without arguing the greater question,
as to the propriety of our remaining at peace or going to war,
he thought we ought not to repeal this Act unless we mid first
,decided for war.
Sir ROBERT WILSON said, he also should forbear going
into the question of peace or war, and should confine himself
to the question directly before the House. Nothing whatever
had occurred to change his opinion of the present Act, which
beconsidered as impolitic and unjust in princitlel and de:
grad* to the national honour. The Learned hau
qUOtOkt Oerman authority to prove what was the law of Eng-
land; but he believed the peactice of this country had not been

conformahle to the maxim advanced by the Learned Civilian.
—The many Irish Officers who had been taken in the Freneh
service had beta treated as prisoners of war. .He was informed
and he helieVedv.tbet the old Spanish Government had asked
for this Act, and, that, the new one asked for its repeal. Much
had heen.said of neutrality ; but had we remonstrated witlo
France on her-conduct, and treated that as a breach of neu..,
trlity? The present Act was in one respect nugatory, for it did
not prevent Englishmen enlisting in favour, of nations who '
were struggling for their liberties, although it imposed punish-
ments on them. when they returned. He applauded such men,'
and would himself he ,prepared to suffer :the inconvenieicts- -
and peiialties ofthis Act; to serve the cause of gallant Spain.
He wag; confident the people would never submit to the degrad-
ing neutrality which was attempted to be imposed upon them ;
for he considered it would be a humiliation to this country if it
allowed Spain to be overrun by France. He should support,
the motion.
Sir JOSEPH YORKE 'assured his Gallant Friend that he
did not yield to him in feeling for the cause of Spain, though
he could not cement trithe refusal of this Bill. He had care.'
fully read. the Papers lately put on the table of the House, and
which he thought did the Right Hen. Secretary of State so
much credit; and he had made up his mind that' a strict neu-'
trality was our proper course. Indeed there_ was a clause in
the Bill of the utmost importance, which, on no account, could
he consent to give up. It-was that which forbade the manning
of foreign ships of, war with English
.seamen., If we gave up ,
`this prevision we should, when we wanted to man our own ships'
with seatnenk-firid a great paucity of that materiel--(A laugh.)—
He knov that newspapers were not always correct, but he knew
also that they sometimes spoke truth; anti he was therefore not
a little alarmed at having read'a paragraph stating that MO sea.'
men had sailed:from Liverpool. to man a ship of war of a Sore-,
reign whom . no one ',Woulsl, have expected to, hear of except
in the Tao, of ,the Arabian Nights. Ile meant the Emperor
of ltrizil..'.-(Laughter.)L-Ile lipped this was not correct. So`
convinced, Sir' said the Gallant Admiral, "am lof the'
necessity of preserVing the means of maintaining our navy,;
that if. the salary you receive for discharging the duties of that
Chair, the allowance to his Majesty on the Throne, and the!
salaries of all the Ministers of State, were necessary to be'
taken for the support of that navy ; I should, notwithstanding!
my great regard for yeti, Sir, give my vote for taking away
your salary for that purpose, as I would also for taking away'
the other sums."—(Laughter.)—lle certainly had not read Gro-
tius nor Puffendorif, nor was he possessed of that refinement;
which enabled Learned Gentlemen to split hairs in an argn;
ment, and twist them to their own purpose, but he thought he
gave a conscientious vote against the repeal of the Act ; thus
forming our conduct upon the maxim taken and quoted by the
Right Hon. Secretary from the Secred Book—" Do as you
would be done by."—(Cheers.)
Mr. IL GLIftNEY said his opinion was against the Bill in
the first instance ; but he thought it would be unwise in us now
to repeal it. He would retain the Bill, rather than run the
chance of our losing the blessings of peace.
Mr. A. BARING said, that if, by voting with the Noble
Lord (Altborp), which he was then disposed to do, he should
contribute, as far as his humble vote went, to plunge the
country, into war, he should be the last man to give such a
vote. But it was, by no means clear to him that such would
be the effect of repealing the Bill under consideration ; and to
have his doubts removed-, he required that it should be shown
how it happened that this country passed so many yearn in
peace before this Bill was passed.—( llear.)—They must, in-
deed, have to do with tetchy Allies if such a measure were to
bring war upon them, and he should be surprised if the Right
Hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Secretary Cunning), who would
of course give his opinion, were to confirm by that opinion SO
extraordinary a notion. The argument of his Honourable
Friend, of the danger threatened by the repeal of this Bill,
from the circumstance of some hundreds of sailorshaving taken
water at Liverpool to go into the service of the Brazilians,
in his opinion told the other way,. since it shewed that
the Bill was inoperative from the repugnance felt towards it.—
They had seen in other wars, both by land and sea British
subjects taking part. In the wars of Catherine against Swe-
den, the naval war was carried on by British seamen on both
sides. He need not mention the names of Admirals DAM-
' stone, Knowles., ,and Sir Sidney Smith, as well as many others
in proof of this. When there came an apprensien of war with
Catherine on the part of this country, they were all called
home again by proclamation, and by this means the Country
had the advantage of experienced seamen after a period of
inactive peace. It he were required to point out similar in-
stances in land. warfate, lie,should mention the name of Marl-
. borough, Who; reeeived his Military education in serving in the
French armies under Turenrie. Unless other arguments than
those which had already been advanced against the repeal of
this Bill were urged, lie hhould certainly vote with his Noble
Friend, (Lord'Althorp). Haring said this, he would venture
a fen, Words the 'general question, which ha thought had
not fairlyheen corMeeteil with the motion before the House.—
tie wan wog anxintis that the' country after the struggle she
hattgone through shottlii have the benefit of some interval of
peace.l--( Hear, bear !) - But he did not see that Government had
any, right to tell them that peace could not be enjoyed without
their submitting to seine indignity. If this were a true posi-
tion, it proved either that there was a great iniquity on the part
of the ruling Powers of the. Continent, or that there had been
great want of skill in our diplomatists. lie was ready to
maintain that no man who could read the Papers that had been
laid on the table could say that he found in them that which
proves that this case had been so argued, or so earnestly put
before the Continental. Alliance as tojustify their being told,
that the war between' Frenee and Spain could not have been
prevented. He did not mean to enter into in analysis of the
Papers, when so many near him were so much more able
than himself to do so;, but he must say, that in his honest opi-
nion, there never was a case of such immense importance to
the liberty of this country, Or to which the unanimous feelings
of the country were so strongly pledged, so loosely thrown
away—(Hcar, hear,'hear !)--:m which, from the beginning to
the end, he was unable to see the proof of any thing like
earnestness or resolution.--(Hear 1)--He never read any pa.
per; that gave him more pain; for he did think they threw
discredit on the Orivernment, and compromisedlhe character
of the country.—(Cheers from the Opposition, returned by the
other side.)—He must again say, that if in reality we were en-
gaged with suchtetchy allies that we could not move one way
or another without exciting hostility, it was time we should
adopt a manly course and pursue 'without fearing those who
might choose to he offended by it...(Vaasa 1)
Mr. WYNW thought, that whether with regard to the
System of neutrality which had been adopted, or with refer-
ence to the particular nature of the .Bill itself, It was im.
possible not to see the impropriety of agreeing to the motion
of the Noble Lord. They who said that the provisions of this
Bill were unknown before it was
_passed, could nut be aware
that by the common law of the land it was a misdemeanour to
enter into the service of a foreign State without permission from
the Sovereign. The Officers of the Irish Brigade had been
quoted as having been treated as prisoners of war, when taken
in arms in Scotland. But was it not a fact, that these officers
were descendants of Irishmen, who emigrated with James 11.
Besides which was it contended that no officer were executed on

that occasion who were taken with French Commissions in their
pockets ? If privateers against this country had been fitted out,
and manned in the ports of France, against this country in time
of peace, would not the walls of that House resound to the ac-
cusations of perfidy of the French Government, by those very
Gentlemen who now contended for a similar line of conduct ?

—The two cases which had been quoted of Admiral. Knowles
and the Duke of Marlborough, were cases in which both those
officers had received express permission from their Sovereign
to join in the war. Nor could lie think it so easy to recal m-
dividuals established in foreign service by proclamation. He
could not reconcile to himself the idea of two regiments of
Englishmen engaged in different• services presenting their
bayonets at each other's breasts. Such bands upon their re-
turn to this country would become dangerous instruments in
the hands of faction. Ile was at a loss to think how those who
had perused a narrative of the sufferings of their countrymen
in South AMerica could wish to giOe any facility to that which
might lead to a similar state of misery. He had uniformly
supported the Bill, and he should continue to do so by oppo-
sing the present motion.
Sir FRANCIS BLAKE said; it 'was hiti opinion that if a
higher tone had been taken by this Country at an earlier period,
the invasion of Spain would hve been prevented.—(Loud cries
of "Question !")
Mr. Secretary CANNING began by observing, that those
Gentlemen being, he believed; by far the greater number of
them ho had then the honour of addressing, who had not been
present from the commencement of the debate, could hardly
nnagme under what degree of restraint he put himself, when
he said, that it was his intention to confine what he had to offer
within the limits of the question then before the House.—
( Hear !)—Those who had not been present throughout, could
not know that from the beginning there had been presented,
whether studiously or accidentally, he knew not, a sort of set-off
to the tessilation ascribed on the preceding night by an lion.
and Learned Gentleman opposite (Mr. Brougham) to the bench
on which he (Mr. Canning) sat, in the alternation of the voices
for peace and war, as they had been raised on the other side.—
The repeal of the Bill then under consideration had been proposed
from a love or peace, and with a view not to provoke hostilities,
by a Noble Lord (Althorp), in a way that he must do him the
justice to say was marked by that moderation and good sense
which distinguished all his labours in that House. This motion
had been seconded by a speech to which he could give no other
character than that it was the direct contrast of the former—
(Hear, hear !)—a speech professing war—indiscriminate and
unqualified war, directed to the support of a pacific motion,
and aiming at open hostility.—(Hear, hear!)--He would not
attempt to follow the Noble Seconder into the matter of that
speech, for in order that lie should be believed, he repeated it

oat requisite that his hearers should have been present when
it was deliiered. The bacedemonians were in the habit of de-
terring from intoxication by presenting a slave in that state
before their children. There was, however, a moral as well as
a phyical intoxication, and the fury which he had seen that
night exhibited he could listen to nothing but the contortionsof
the Sybil without her inspiration.-7( Hear, and a laugh).—Such
a speech, for the reasons he had given, he would not then make
answer to until the proper opportunity arrived. He did not
' now decline the contest because he feared it, for he begged
the Noble-Lord to believe that however he might have truckled
to France, he was not going to truckle to him.—( Loud cheers
re-echoed for some time -by both 'sides of the House.)—He
was perfectly ready to meet the whole case whenever he, or
those who• held his opinions, should please : he postponed it
only because an opportunity had been promised for his doing
so; and because the present question must be discussed, and
if at all, upon the assumption of neutrality. He wished to
assume nothing that could not be granted r but he begged to
observe, that it was impossible ' to treat the question, at all
without some assumption es the basis. He might therefore
take it for granted that nbutrality, without the sacrifice of
any one national interest, and without the prostitution of one
particle of national honour, was the course marked out for this
country to pursue in the present state of the world, so long
as it could e preserved consistently with those interests, and
without the compromise of that honour. He did not mean
to quarrel, as he had said before, with those who held a dif.
ferent opinion. He was ready to meet them at any time ;
but, meanwhile, let them act fairly towards each other—let
them not deal in imputations which it would be inconvenient at
the time, they were made to answer, and such as no man
ought under such circumstances to throw out. It was but fair
to abstain from the Intemperance of debate they had witnessed
that night; whereas the wise and proper course was to try the
different questions on their own distinct merits as they came
before them, with reference to the particular standard of policy
in the meanwhile adopted.—(Hear, hear!)—Taking it then for
granted that this policy met with the general' concurrence of
that House, and of the Country, in which if he was wrong,
opoortunities would occur of setting him right and diasi.
panng the delusion, he would proceed to the discussion
of • the Noble Lord's motion' -with reference to the system
of neutrality. He would merely, observe, that of those who
seconded that motion, those who advocated neutrality, were
nearly equal to the number of suffrages for war. To show the.
nature of the proposition, he would recal that the Bill before
them was passed four or five years ago, partly in mitigation of
the Statute Law, and partly in declaration of the Common
Law. it touched upon that part of the Common Law which
forbade any man transferring his allegiance without the per-
missiqn of his Sovereign, and moderated those statutory en-
actments which annexed to this transgression severe and san-
guinary punishment. By the Article of Peace in 11114 this
country bound itself not to give succour to what Spain then
denominated its revolted Colonies. In the process of time as
these Colonies became more powerful and put forth Par.
Bement'', questions of much difficulty arose which hinged
between the de lure relations of Spain with them, and their
own de facto independence. It became doubtful whether
the Common or the Statute Law could properly be con-
sidered to apply where the limits were daily becoming less
perceptible. To remedy this dubious state of the law this Bill
was introduced, and by it, in fact, the first step towards an ac-
knowledgment ,of the colonies was made. The object of it was
to prohibit the exportation of arms to the colonies or to Spain.
When a war between France and Spain became probable, it
was necessary to review these relations, and the question was,
whether to act in a neutral sense, the prohibition was to
be extended to France, or taken off, with regard to Spain.
It was seen that if it were extended to France, she would
still possess the means of obtaining arms and ammunition
through the Belgic Provinces, so that in that point of view
it would be nugatory. These two modes were pointed out
to Spain a few months ago, and her choice has been acceded
to. She was told, however, that the Bill must be repealed as
regarded the Colonies at the same time ; but it was always
only that part which related to arms and ammunition only.—
Thus it would be seen that no partiality on either side was
ahewn. To have repealed the other part would have been
equality in words, but not equality in point of fact; and
the House, he was sure, would see it in that light. EVery
one who heard him knew, although he might not say it, that
assistance would by that means be given to Spain, and not
to the other belligerent. Whether it was right or not to fa-
vour Spain, was part of the larger question, and not then
before the House, as they were then arguing on the assumption
that neutrality was the proper course. If, therefore, in what
had already been done in the way of repealing, the weaker,
and not the stronger, Wetly, had been benefited, it only remained
for them to examine the Bill itself to see if there was any thing
in its peculiar nature obnoxious to the principles of' fair dealing
betwixt nations. It went to prohibit the interference of Bri-
tish subjects in arms with foreign nations, the' Allies of Great
Britain, and to prevent the fitting out and manniug of privet.'
teem in British ports. The justice of this he thought, could
scarcely be questioned. As to its interference with any aid'
Spain might derive by foreign land forces, he did not think that
could possibly be estimated very high. He did not mean to
say that there was no disposition on the part of Spain to avail
herself of the assistance of here and there a distinguished indi-
vidual or so. But in order to gratify that disposition, a change
in the existing laws must first be effected. The Cortes, upon
first calling out the army on the approach of the French,
even passed a law that those foreigners who had formerly
•aerved in her ranks, and been discharged, might be allowed
tit return, and be permitted to rise, upon good behaviour,
to the rank of ser.jeant—(A laugh)--and foreigners not bear.
in the laurels of former service might be admitted to the
pn ilege of bearing arms in the Spanish service in the rank of
full private, but not beyond that could they advance. This
being the state of the law, he did not think, he must confess, it
was likely to lead to the exportation of much military skill, or
induce the expatriation of any of those great individuals to
whom the honour and safety of our Mother Country was likely
to be entrusted in times of,danger.—( Hear, hear 1)—It was not
however upon these considerations that the present question was
to be determined, but on the principles of neutrality. But he
could not put out of sight that it would be most obnoxious to
his feelings to see Englishmen
_go to Spain to turn the points
of their bayonets against Spaniards. Formerly we had gone
there as an united nation to assist another united nation againit
a common foe. He must say, he had rather they should take
part in the foreign war, than in the civil dissentions. It might
certainly create a sentiment of gratitude towards this country
and towards those who should go to their assistance. He was
not, however, altogether sure that this would be the effect of such
conduct. He coould not help bearing in his recollection some
certain Proclamations that were issued in Spain, after the ter-
mination of the last Spanish war, in which, so fur from expres-
sions of gratitude being found for the blood of the gallant Eng-
lishmen shed on their soil for the recovery of Spanish liberties,
congratulations were put forth that the land had got rid of its
foreign deliverers.--(Hear !)—He would be told, he knew, that
this proceeded from the bigotted councils of Ferdinand. He had
been frequently told; in the course of the late negociations, that
this bigotry would stand in the way of amicable arrangement.
As far at least as the Colonial negociatione were concerned, it
was however the reverse in fact. The opposition of the Crown
of Spain was as one to ten of the difficulty of influencing its
popular assemblies. This disposition might, perhaps,. make
them more national; nor did he say this to their prejudice.
Ile only stated it as the fact, that the Spanish nation was of all
others the most difficult to amalgamate with, or to move from
their stubborn resolutions. He stated these things as bearing
upon the question before them, to shew that they had no
grounds for repealing this measure merely to facilitate the
mixing of English soldiers with the Spaniards, whilst this indi-
moos obstruction existed. The Noble Lord seemed to think
Ile hail been guilty of treason mist the people of this country
in saying their interest lay in neutrality. 'As though.it were a
maxim with Great Britain never to be neutral ! As though our
insular situation did not admit of our not mixing in a 3 Conti-
nental broils !—(hear !)—lt seemed to be the aim of those Gen-
tlemen who backed their opinion, that were bound to reverse the
dispensations of Providence in our favour, and to prove that
there was no distinction betwixt our case and that of those na-
tions countentinous with others at war. He knew that we had
found it difficult to keep ourselves out of Coninental wars
hitherto, but that imposed no obligation. Gentlemen told him
that we must sooner or later be drawn into this war. Then
he (Mr. Canning) gave his vote for its being. later.—(Loud
cheers from the Opposifion.)—lf we were to join in this war
let it be strictly on English grounds.—(Continued cheering.)
—lie did not mean to say it was no part of the duty of Great
Britain to assist the weak ageing the powerful oppressor, nor
of her interest to aid towarila the balance of power. But in
all wars undertaken with such or any,other views, he consi-
dered it to be a sine gun non, that the cause should be just.
Secondly, that our aid should carry with it all the probability
of success ; and next, that if 'the cause were just, the inter-
ference should, if possible, not be productive of harm to our.
selves, and if possible of good,—( Hear, hear, hear 4—Although
opposite sentiments might sound very magnificently in the
mouth of irresponsible- Statesmen, yet for him upon whose
shoulders the weight of a nation was placed, to disregard such
maxims, would be to deserve that with which the Noble Lord
opposite threatened him (Mr. Canning). Let them then cir-
cumscribe the question of war, in order to wage it efficaciously.
When Hon. Gentlemen talked of " participation," be con-
fessed he was astounded. Was there any man, he asked, who
had read the history of his country for the last twenty years,
could imagine that " participation" was the sense in which
Great Britain mixed In the war of the world ?—(Hear I)—Was
it not known that where she appeared in arms she took, the
whole upon her shoulders ? Was not the whole of the last
Peninsular war carried on by her ?—(llear, hear, hear!)—And
now, be it remembered we should now go to aid a whole

people struggling for the 'attainment:of ifeemitionobject. They '
would first have to unite a 'contending people,: and then unite
them with ourselves against the common foe--(Hear, hear
Then he would say that any man Who should Undertake Stich a
case without better data as to the actual state of Spain than' he
could possibly have, possessed
.greater hardihood than he
(Mr. Canning) was disposed to imitate. The choice of his
Majesty's Advisers had been neutrality, and he considered
they had chosen well. 'lf they had chosen: too humble a
line of action, it was not to be exalted nor its errors mend-
ed by misstatement and misinterpretation.—(Hear, hear !)
—Let the House chase from their seats if they would the
Neutral Ministers but until they declared for war, let them,
faithfully execute the system they had selected. The Right
Hon. Secretary referred to a decision given by Mr. Jefferson,
President of the United States, and by which he said he was
trig the line of neutrality should be marked out to be pursued
by this country. It happened in 1793, that the Minister
of this country complained that vessels were equipped and
manned in the French service against 'England, in the ports of
the United States.. President Jefferson wrote to the Gover-
nor of New York, desiring all such vends to be seized and
delivered over to the proper law tribunals to be dealt with.
He than proceeded to aniiroulvert on. the case in the following
terms s— The arming and equipping of vessels in our ports
to cruize against a nation at ileace with us is incompatible
with the sovereignty of. the United' fiftates;, inasmuch as it
makes her instrumentalin the prejudice of her, own Allies, and
tends to endanger her peace." Upon that single sentence he
was prepared to defend the princiP eof • this BM. 'lt Im-
possible without contravening the prineiple there 'had down
to repeal this Hear, hear, hear !)—" If honour or po-
licy," said the Right Honourable Secretary, " singly or in
conjunction, should unite with circumstances to dratv us into a
war, let us at least keep strictly within the lines which sepa-
rate us from that awful alternative. Let us keep the peace
honourably, if for peace •we decide—and if for war, let it be
for the preservation 0f our just rights, with the exertion of
those energies which we have .ever shewn to, belong to us in
the proudest, eras of our history. , Let it come, whether
in the shape of retribution for insult and aggression ; in the
shape of protection to the weak against the strong, or of
friendship towards an Ally; but let it not come, for the honour
of England I demand it, in the pettifogging way of fitting out
ships for a paltry gain, for a dishonourable profit. Let us not
be sneaked into a war. The more honourable we keep the
course we have prescribed to ourselves., the more honourably
shall we be prepared to maintain our rights, and the more ef-
ficiently conduct a war should unfavourablecircuinstancett place
us in such a situation." The Right lion. Gentleman then sat
down amidst the unanimous cheers of the House. .
Mr. DENM AN observed, that this Bill had throughout been
defended 'on particular grounds alleged. Now there was an end
to those, why not repeal it ? If they were to have laws passed
for particular cases, and then rendered permanent, those cases
having passed away, because they had been passed, this coun-
try would be in a pretty perplexed situation. He did not think.
peace would be preserved,. but for the sake of real neutrality
he thought the Bill ought to be repealed. He expressed a hope
that the country would not be fettered by foreign•policy so as
to abridge the feeling of action.
The question was then loudly called for.
Lord A LTHORPE, replied, and the House divided,
For the Motion . - 110
• Against it - - - 216
Majority - - - —lO6
The third reading of the Nary Pensions Bills was posponed
to Friday.—Adjourned at Tweble o'clock.