The Sun.
London, England, 1841-06-08 00:00:00

0 r

MORNING', EDITION

O'Connell) understood the charge to relate to the pre-
sent year, and therefore he did not know whether some
agent of his might not have put in a distress from mali-
cious motives; and. therefore he was not able, when it was
made, to give it a positive denial. Since then he had desired
his son to wait upon Sergeant Jackson to learn from him
his authority for the statement,' and he said that he
(Sergeant Jackson) did not know the name of the
tenant, but that a gentleman called on him some time
since in Dublin, named Twiss,—that he (Sergeant Jack-
son) recollected to have seen him on juries in Kerry, but
did not know his Christian name ; that the affair took
place on his (Mr. O'Connell's) estate in Iveragh, where Mr.
Twiss said he had seen a number of cattle ! impounded
in the month of April, and on inquiry was told that they
belonged to tenants of his (Mr. O'Connell's), and had
been distrained for March rent. His son asked in what
year this was, but Sergeant Jackson did not know—
(Hear, hear)—but said he had a memorandum thereof
somewhere among his papers. He (Mr. O'Connell) was
in Kerry in the mouth of January last, and was able to
contradict the statement in the strongest terms.—(Hear,
hear.) It was not for him to condemn the manner in
which the statement was made, but he would beg the
House to remember that the man's name was not known,
that his address was not known, and that all that the
statement amounted to was, that some one had told Ser-
geant Jackson that these cattle were impounded.—(flear.)
Mr. Sergeant JACKSON said the statement made by
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman respecting him was
not precisely correct. The !Hon. Member for Tralee
called upon me this day, stating that he did so by his fa-
ther's desire to know the name of the person to whom
I had made reference in the course of the late debate,
and he informed me that I should acquaint him with the
whole of the circumstances. He (Mr. Sergeant Jackson)
told him that he had known the gentleman for many years,
having, seen him on Juries in Kerry, that he could not tell
him his Christian name, but he knew his name to be
Twiss. Tha gentleman told him that he had seen the
speech of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, in which he
had indulged in the usual strain of attack on the land-
lords ; that he knew that he was himself an ex-
ceedingly harsh landlord ; and he then told me
what he had seen, in the month of April in a
year he mentioned at the time, but which I could
not tell him till I referred to the memorandum I
made at the time. He said that he had been at
the Honourable and Learned Gentleman's property
in the month of April, when he found the cattle of a
number of the tenants distrained for rent due in the
March preceding. He said he was quite certain
of the accuracy of his statement, and would
be ready lo substantiate, it on any occasion.
In the presence of the gentleman, he (Mr.
Sergeant Jackson) had written down the particulars
of his statement, adding that he should mention the fact
if ever the Hon. and Learned Gentleman made a charge
against the landlords of Ireland. Ile (Mr. Sergeant
Jackson) would not have mentioned the matter to the
House if he did not believe it to be perfectly correct.—
(Hear, hear.)
Mr. O'CONNELL would appeal to the House whether,
when the Hon. and Learned Gentleman stated he had a
document he should not have produced it—whether he
ought not to have taken down the name of his informant.
The Hon. and Learned Gentleman was aware there
were several persons of that name in the county.—(Loud
cries of " Chair, chair.")
The SPEAKER said, if the Hon. and Learned Mem-
ber had anything further to state in explanation of the
facts, of course the House would be ready to hear it; but he
submitted to him whether he ought to prolong this con-
versation when there was no question before the House.
.Mr. O'CONNELL said the name of the party accusing
him sva. . not given, the name of the lands were not
given, or the tiz, when it occurred ; and the only place
where it could happened, was his college
property, because on ral his other property the
rents were received in May and .li;.;vember, and therefore
the statement as regarded his pr:-.4periies would have
contradicted itself. He had been met with a total'ab-
sence of accuser, date, and particulars, and he was
therefore entitled to pronounce it as gross a falsehood
as ever was invented.—(Cheers.)
Mr. Sergeant JACKSON said—Perhaps the House
would permit him to say, that he would put the Hon-
ourable Gentleman in possession of all the parti-
culars at the earliest possible moment.
NOTTINGHAM ELECTION.
On the motion of Mr. T. DUNCOMBE, the petition
of William Belbie, presented a few days ago, was or-
dered to be printed with the Votes.
Sir R. H. INGLIS would have no objection to the
'motion, if there were any further proceeding to be
founded thereon.
Mr. T. S.- DUNCOMBE said that the subject was to
be brought under the consideration of the House on
Thursday next.
The motion was then agreed to.
Mr, VERNON SMITH moved for certain returns
connected with secondary punishment in New South
Wales. •
CLERK OF THE PEACE FOR HERTFORD.
Mr. T. DUNCOMBE moved that the C/Plic of the
Peace for the county of Hertford should then attend a
the bar of the House.
John Samuel Storey then appeared at the bar, and
stated that he was Clerk of the Peace for the County
of Hertford. He received an order from that House
for a copy of the Register of Electors for that County.
for 1840 and 1841—he would have had much piettsoe In,
emnplying with the order, but the register was not in
his powitiaiion. or under his control. The 56th clause of
the Reform Bill niatke the Sheriff the Castes of the
register, and it was in his pow:4s4)k
by Mr. DUNCOMBE—He was awaro h-Vig the
55th aeetion of the Reform Bill he was bound to give a
copy of the trpßj§ter to any one applying for it. He
could not say nla.4 the date on which he re-
ceived the order. ff#e iii.gistrates of • the County
of Hertford had censtantly'W..fus,est,i.ti. ni.jjet the register,
and unless they allowed the expenge tkiese no
other way of paying the expenses. He (the witness)
had, from Jjs notion pf respect for that House, refused
to give that tes but a copy of the
register. He had P,9X Fcl;,i-t.r ,ill his pos-
session, and, therefore, could nqt gn & m copy ,or it.
He had when applied to by e. fieekwi-der fo a 900 of
the register answered that tip wPiald t;tirotsl it at a
reasonable price, but he had refused to fuxiii4, ip hp 15s.
He had applied on the subject to the Noble Lord
the Cha.innsw of the Quarter Sessions as to whether he
ought to have tke. F.PFetCI- printed (as we understood
him to say), but is I.4oychhip advised him not
to do so. Witness had not 'been tti it at
either the last St. Alban's or the last county election,
hut, witness's son had been an agent at the last county
election. en is not a clerk in his office, neither
is he his partner. Ile In witness's office.
Does he hold any situation ?—Ws is there as
my son.—(A laugh.)
In answer to questions by Mr. Hooper, witness said
that he had ne doubt as to the authenticity of the copy
in his possession. 14 1;0 been made by his own
clerk, but he thought the* copy
would not bo in compliance with the order
of the house. If any elector had asked him for a
copy of 'time register, he should have furnished it from
that copy. tie did not send the copy in his
possession, because he had pop *pi ordered to do
so. The order of the House was tO fnraiah a
copy of the register. The copy in his possession
was not his own, it belonged to the county—(Opposition
cheers).-.and he did not think that that would satisfy
the order of the House.
Mr. ALSTON—You stated that yoit applipd to Lord
Dacre, the Chairman of the Court of Quarter Ses-
sions, when applied to by a freeholder on the subject of
the register. Did you apply to his Lordship, as
Chairman of the Court of Quarter Sessions, whether
you should furnish the copy after you had received the
orders of this House ?
• Witness—Lord Deere told me that the order of Quar-
ter Sessions absolutely prevented me from having it
printed, and that if he had not been so ill he would Lye
attended the House himself,
The witness then withdrew,
Mr. DUNCOMBE said it must be quite clear to the
House that this order was sent to the Clerk of the Peace.
The Hon. Member for Ripon had been decidedly of opinion
that it was the duty of the Clerk'of the Peace to furnish
a copy of the copy of the register; it was quite clear, after
the statement of the witness, that he was in possession of
the register, and that it was his bounden duty, as Clerk of
the Peace, to furnish it to the House. An Hon. Mem-
ber had asked him if it was an authentic copy, and
he replied that it was. It seemed that his only
object as an individual in not furnishing this copy
was to create delay, in order that the House might
not be able to place it in the hands of the electors.
It was for the House to say whether it would have its
order evaded. for such a purpose. lie (Mr. Duncombe)
thought that it was quite necessary that this ordt r should
be enforced, and he would therefore move that the Clerk
of the Peace attend to-morrow with a copy of the 'regis-
ter of the electors of Hertfordshire.
Sir E. SUGDEN, who was nearly inaudible, said that his
opinion coincided with that of the majority of the House,
that if the House made an order it must be obeyed, but
this was a matter independent of an Act of Parliament.
He thought the orders respecting this gentleman were
rather hard. The House did not appear to pay anything
for the copy ordered, but, on its own authority, ordered a
copy to be returned. Such an order must sometimes operate
:harshly on an individual. This gentleman could not
make a copy himself, but must pay to have it done;
and though this was no reason why the power of the House
should not, be vindicated, it was a reason for ! not
pressing harshly against an individual who had not
transgressed against :the order. The House required a
a copy of the register, and he had not the Means
of furnishing a copy, for the register was not in his pos-
session. The Honourable Member was aware this gen-
tleman a.. a copy of the register in his possession,
and aske I him if he did not know that it was a faithful
copy, to which tne witness answered in the affirmative.
He was the-s asked why he did not send that,, and
he 'answered, because it belonged to the county,—could
there be a better reason ?—(Hear, hear.) If he had
the . register in his possession he (Sir E. Sugden)
thought he ought to have obeyed the House, and after-
wards appealed to its justice for payment, but it struck
him that this gentleman. had not the power of obeying
the order. There had been a trial of legal skill between
the Honourable Member for Finsbury and the wit-
ness ; but it appeared to him that the witness had the
best of the argument.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.)
'He believed the gentleman in attendance was called a
prisoner, but a more improper expression could not be
,used.
Mr. O'CONNELL said, that it appeared toy him
that the gentleman, if he thought he could ilisre-
gard the order of the House, was acting under a mis-
take. The Act enjoined that the expenses of the Clerk
of the Peace should be defrayed by the Treasurer
of the county for any expenses he might incur ; and he
had, therefore, no loss to sustain. It was also necessary
'according to the Act, that the clerk should have a puni-
ber of copies, and not as he appeared to imagine only
'one: If he had applied the word prisoner to the gen-
tleman, he had done,so solely through inadvertence.

The question was then put and agreed to, that the C overnment, and of the success of the. British army
Clerk of the Peace for the county of Hereford should in Chilia, it did strike him that he should have been
attend at the bar of the House to-morrow, and bring with justified in stating what abatements were to he' Made
him a copy of the register of electors for 1840 and 1841. to those triumphs.—(Cheers.) But as he recollected
Mr. PALMER wished to put it to atry member of the the Noble Loed the Secretary for Foreig,n,Affairs.would
Government who might be present, whether it were fit not have an opportunity of replying to . him, hp ab-
that public officers should make use of their position for' stained from saying a single word. Now with respect
the purpose of obtaining signatures. to -public petitions. to the Budget, he certainly did state that ..it Was the
lie bad understood that certain officers of the Excise had prevailing impression throughout the country that the
só interfered, for the purpose of procuring signatures to Budget had been adopted at too recent a pstiod. That
Anti-Corn-law petitions.. ' was the observation he had made ; and. there was an
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thought impression that had circumstances been more favour-
that such a course of proceeding would be extremely irn- able to the Government these questions- would not
proper ; but it appeared to him that the Hon. Gentleman have been pressed upon the consideration of the House.
offgjt ehse tyds
country,Government, had
d et viewing'ern
must be mistaken upon the subject, as no such fact had The Npble Lord, however, assured him that he was
come within his (the Chancellor of- the Exchequer's),
'svttrt(t)engo'fatilhae.
it
knowledge.
Mr. WYNN said, that seeing the anxiety of the House an early period,: on bringing forward their measures ;
tit hear the statement of the Noble Lord the Secretary for and having received that. statement he (Sir R. Peel)
einedt, aet
h
the Colonies. he would postpone the motion of which he was bound to place, as he did place, in ie the most im-
had given notice till to-morrow. plicit confidence. But, at the same time, the charge he
CORN-LAWS. had made really remained untouched.; because his.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that on Friday night he charge was this, that if the GoVernment had, contern-
had stated the course which the Government intended plated -those important measures, which partook less of a
to pursue with regard AO the Committee of Supplies financial character than of a relaxation of commercial
and the remainder of the Estimates; he had also stated policy, then it would have been much better to have
that he would announce on this day his intention with called the attention of the House to the subject at an
respect to the motion on the Corn-laws, of which he had early period of the S'esSion,' and to have referred to it in
given notice. It would be in the recollection of the House the -Speech from the Throne.—(Hear, hear.) That was
that he had given that notice on the day on which the observation he had made. The measures in
his Right Hon. Friend, the Chancellor of the Eitche- question were introduced in consequence of theßeport of
quer brought forward his financial statement. the Import Duties Committee--he meant the measures
He (Lord John Russell) afterwards renewed that relating to the duties on sugar, corn, and timber ; at
notice. It was his intention to ascertain least he thought the main arguments in favour of the
what was thought upon that motion, as it was one measures were to be found-in the evidence of that Com-
of very particular importance. He did not make the mo- solace. He had stated on Friday that no member of her
tion for the mere purpose of bringing forward adiscussion Majesty's Government had attended that Committee dur-
upon it, but it was his wish to obtain from..the House its ing its sittings ; but that, in his opinion, if they had
opinion with regard to the policy of an alteration thought that in the evidence taken before the Committee
in the Corn-laws, and with regard to the principle of might be found the principal arguments in favour of
the alteration which he proposed, and the course which these great measures it would have been better, in that
the Government should purSue. The Right Hon. case, either to re-appoint the Committee at an early
Gentleman, the Member for Tamworth, • had, how- period of the present session, or, if the Government were
ever, about a fortnight since, given notice that he convinced that the evidence already taken was sufficiently
would move a resolution to the effect that the present conclusive, and that it was not necessary to re-appoint
Ministers of her Majesty having been unable to carry .the Committee, and that they had determined to pro-
through the House measures which they deemed coed without--further evidence, there, considering that
of the highest importance, their continuance in the measures were less.' measures of finance than
office was at variance with the spirit of important relaxations in our commercial policy, he
the Constitution. After the Right Honourable argued that it was not advisable to delay the
Gentleman had given that notice he (Lord John introduction of, such measures until the produce
Russell) stated to his colleagues, as a matter for their don of the Budget. That . was the cause of the in-
consideration, that if the Right Hon. Gentleman should pression which he had stated he had entertained, but
succeed in. gaining a - majority in favour of his which, after the declaration of the Noble Lord, lie en-
motion, it was his (Lord John Russell's) opinion tirely renounced. Now, on the subject of the Corn-laws,
that he ought not to act under the authority which. lie had he should say it appeared to him that the Government
obtained from the Cabinet, and bring forward the motion of had but one of two courses to pursue—either to deter-
Whichle had given notice. He stated to them that he mine to brill., on the Corn-laws immediately, or to ab-
considered it a measure of the highest importance stain altogether from bringing on the question. Either
to be submitted to . the consideration of the House. If of these courses, he thought, .were perfectly open to the
the lltOese should decide that her Majesty's Ministers Noble Lord, and he did net presume to give an opinion
did not possess the confidence of the House, and ought_ as to what was the best course for her Majesty's Govern-
not to continue in office,. if would not, . he thought, ment in their present position. But he thought. it was
be respectful to the House, nor consistent with hardly fair of thethew Noble Lord, after he had announced
their duty. to submit a measure of so much import- his determination of not going on with the Corn-law
ance to the present House of Commons. He (Lord J. discussion,, to give them the main heads of the arguments
Russell) found that his colleagues concurred with him —(Hear),—which he would have made use of if the
in opinion, and it was not his intention to proceed with questibie had been brOught forward.—(Cheers:) • The
the subject. In stating that it was not his intention Noble Lord had told them what were the four principal
to go on with the subject of the Corn-laws, he might arguments on which he had intended to lay a stress ;
perhaps be allowed to go into the general question—but and he (Sir R. Peel) submitted to the House that he
he steted that he should not have been deterred from could not then state his opinions as to those arguments,
brinaing forward that measure by the various reasons and attempt to immtess upon the -House his reasons for
that were stated.. at different times on the other side entertaining different opinions, without at once provoking
against the propriety of bringing forward that motion. a very inconvenient discussion upon the subject.—(Hear,
Among the reasons urged against bringing forward the hear.) The Noble Lord had given them - the heads of
question.of the Corn-laws was, that it •would increase the chapters which would have constituted his. speech
the excitement amongst the people. Now it rather than the chapters themselves.—(Hear, hear.)
..But•
did not appear to him, he confessed, that dis- if he (Sir R. Peel) entered upon the subject at all, it seas
cussion on the subject would have that effect. clear he-should be provoked into a discussion, into which,
Another branch of the arguments he would have used according to the Noble Lord, it was not his intention to
was as to the importation of corn within the last few proceed. He was the more disposed to leave the Noble
years, and the duty which had been -paid upon it; Lord in the full possession of the advantage, and forego any
and he thought the result would have shown that opportunityofenteringinto the discuSsion, becauee he cons
the peoposed duty would afford a greater protection than fessed the Noble Lord's summary of his arguments had not
the duty had been of late. Another question related to the made that impression upn his (Sir Robert Peel's) mind
statement which had been so often made that this particular which would lead him to think any discussion necessary.
law was intended and does • act for the protection —(Hear and laughter.) Of course the Noble Lord had
of the agricultural interest. He thought he could show advanced his four principal arguments ; and they might,
that what had.occurred sincelB2B,especially what had cc- he ehOught, safely conclude that the remainder would not
mead of late years, had shown that the present be so cogent as thoge he had adduced—(Hear, hear)—
sliding scale of duties had tended to derange the and he (Sir R. Peel) • was perfectly
willing
prices resae than eYould a fieed duty. Without going immense evils of being now provol- '
e.,..erreeetr!kthe
„. etvio aiscussion on
into :toy other hranclies of the subject-,(Loud • Tory the subject of the Cor.n-1:.,;„1
cheering)--tile accesatioil against him and the Govern- not prepared, and seeneg
teat the deci+iwliision ia the Ilouae was
meat, of wiii4 he heel net taken any riptice, was that would net be taitme-te Was perfectly willing
of the House
for three week§ or a month they had Put N°6l in possession of the adantal..en?lhtiochleahvee the(Sir
forward the pre.sent question without the hope of R.. Peal) thought he had not quite fairly 7alce*n (Chee. )
carrying it, and solely with 4 view to agitaticm;--,-(009r5.) stating the main arguments on vhich he intended-s
Had he brought forward the qucstion,, he Ahoul.C. ;1:1;e to have relied in case the discussion of
the Corn-laws
shown that tho oiled of their prup§4l Wflii not to raise had been brought forward b)-h er Majesty's Government.
extravagant hopes, but the 0c.,n4440 Ow the question The only other point to which he wished to advert was
was one well deserving the attention and full considera- the proposal of the Noble'Lord with respect to the votes'.
tioa of the Bugs(?.---f Hear, Let it be recollected of supply. He inferred, from the statement of the Noble
that - the whole itrinciple on which • his' Right Hen- Lord, that it was the intention of the Government to appeal
eeeehle feiend liroatht tense his Budget, was to the sense of the people, and to. call together newrar-
that peehilettimi §HtAf- !Roger cito.4l}o, tit .4-N (sir it, i'vel) oNprosseti bur opinion what-
the great deficiency in the re;{peniee should' e' etireciliet. ever mien the Kepeiety. of that coons© ; lee left the res-
an alteration in these duties. But it would have been a ponsibility of it entirely to the Noble Lord. The
course which might have given some advantage to his Noble Lord had, on Friday, stated his plans as follows :
Right Hon. Friend in making that proposition if he had "We propose et) t t
4i yute o supply on Monday, and
lerp the Corn-laws altogether on one side—if he had left to tette citily! elki fth
, eefi miscellaneous estimates the
• .••••• •
that question 44 4 ..!#44 (11111.; act }e YeguN Rast—as it was necessity. for wide is so in-mediate that any delay would
under the Government o ord Grey whente assumed office occasion great inconvenience to the public service if not
in 1830, and had not considered it as in any way granted at the present inoment."—(Hear, heav,) • Tht.s.v,
connected with the proposal regarding the sugar and were the terms of the Noble Iford' lotic.c.. While lie,
timber duties, and various other matters. He repeated that Sir (IL Pc Tl.) pt,441,;‘,4 ya;
approPation of thel
the eoes4e4 ft tublhe eoaree whio hei Majest.i,V Government weee await'to
time dl:Lotd (iFei 4414 40.:4'Sn'en4, -44 open 'aaestion, take, intinelY, Wet a vp,,iing to the country on the
but he did not. think that such'enntse would su'oject tile oOirli;laws, while he left' entirely with her
have been fair towards the agricultural interests.— Majesty's. GOvernment the responsibility of such a mea-
(Hear, hear.) It did not appear to him that they sure, he must say at the same time that he was not Fee
could have stated as a general 'principle that prohibition pared to offer the slightest obstruction ill the way at: her
eve with. and that the whole tariff should Ma;esty's Goveroment teens©.—_(Hean, hear.)
be revised—fhtit ettanges tn peertiete Ile eot)ceiyedditere wai a very material distinction tae.
commercial intercourse with 'Oilier '6•Olin'triel's 'Without tween Mid-rife '•' h' Ifof the • 'hit)
pon emse -auy. part
including . the question of the Corn-laws.—(Hear.) and abstaining altogether frgisi itv; test ley :which the
Therefere
.he thought it the fairer and plainer . Government latiellet he eibsteneted Air any delay
.upon the
course
`Wit
peoecedihng to dot not subject ungl‘i cracuu...=,-,(flear' hear.) His opinion was
merely With' 'S-lettv to 'OiCreaSe- ,the' chary thisit at he should leave that resporeibility ex-
but with. a view to isle'various Other, and extended clusiyCly to the advisers of the Crown, if they determined
interests wificl fol4and there- to assume it, and to exercise the unquestionable pruwoa=
-iiffeatect ny It, .
fore, at nearly tle satire' tune, '6' had thought it would tint of dissolving Parliament; but that it Vieh the duty
be best to propose .an alteration in the Corn-laws. the Government to asSagta they ee,speeies.ihility and to ex-
He had now only . one remaining statement. ercise tat e nneeogattia vitathe least possible delay,—
to make es regarded the charge made 1;;;glet (liettri hetkej` Ile said that doctrine applied to all times
Hon. -Genifeno apposite in'tlie 'eo,iislil4 is reply the and circumstances, because the discussion of any im•
other evening. 'The /light-Hon. Gentleman had stated, portant measure by a Parliament, which knew from eke
and as he (Lord John Russell) understood, had stated his nifieant indications, that its days were evegietelcd,
belief in the statement, that the Government had had two and that its fate was deterneioect wctald he evidently most
Budgets prepared—a fair weather 'budget and a foul injurious the liplike taieeeete '
e He said, also, without
weathee hadaet.,-eRInFs;) Tt INp §PttFfl the col., Wti4tog, to introduce one word of aggravation or aspe-
ineneement oftheset iseuSsions, as achargeitgaingahe Go- rity, that the peculiar position in which the Executive,
eernment, that the Budget had been a sudden thought; Government was placed after the vote of Friday night,
that his Right Hon. Friend had, he supposed, in the added, it appeared to him, a further reason for the en-
course of a single morning, prepared the whole of those Cerement of those views, and i!11K14o4 an additional
extensive 4,49*.i.Firr.„; whiqt hiz.4 KozpAgA: ohligation-Af 11;r1 €1(.144.16.441 i:thligation ;could be imposed
a charge • `so extravagant hat he had_ taken no neetce —ut- appealing 4t (glee to the sense of the country.—
of it, and the inventors of it, he imagined, had become (Hear,) He did not think there could be .a doubt upon
so convinced of its extravagance that they had dropped that ettlefeet ; and, as he said before, inferring from the
ia—(Hear, hear.) But those who had, inseensed course of the discussion, and from the language held by
that stossi, 11e4 tilYi .IRTeuted another, not one a Cabinet Minister . during that discussion, that her Uu•
whit more probable 'than 'the extraordinary state- jesty'.s Government had made up thoututuda, even if the
giant to which he had alluded, and that was decision
of
t,19 Neighs©tificgi the resolution which he
that there had been two Budgets prepared, nitess•tid adverse, not to consider themselves
lie could not imagine that eny Rpm quAld he- bound to resign, but to take-the sense of the people upon
lieve that the adOspFs ;:lt the Otluwti wild se far forget their the measures which they had proposed—when the
duty as to frame two biidgets, with a view to their Noble Lord had made the statement upon Friday night
own political situation. There was not the least found- that lie would only take such estimates as were required
ation for the allegation, and he regretted that the Hon. for the public service, his (Sir 11. Peel's) impression was
Gentleman shoidd have brought forward such a charge, that alien tAtinuktii..s ought to be granted at once ; but he
or that he should fist! a Moment have glyen cpedit should say time Chancellor of the Exchequer was pursu-
to so absurd 'a
statement. The course which ing a course very different- from that which had been thus
they then proposed to pursue, was that which had implied. The chancellor of the Exchequer proposed to
been already intimated on Friday evening. They pro- take the whole of the remaining estimates--the Civil
to Con-
posedtake. the sum that was in the estimate with re- tingencies—the Commissariat—the Miscellaneous Esti-
gard to the service pf Cenada and the seryiee of china, mates fur Eir4giaud and Ireland for a period of six
and they proposed to take, with regard to the Miscel: months, That appeared to him (Sir R. Peel) unfair
laneous liestunates, a course similar to the one varsued upon the part of the Right Hon. Gentleman.
in 1830, after the death of King George the ourth ; Lord J. RUSSELL—It is only for a period of six
they proposed to take a sone on account of the Miscel- months, commencing from the Ist of April.
laneous Estimates for six months, from the Ist of April, Sir R. PEEL continued—He would proceed to state
which would supply the immediate wants of the public whatwere-Jtis opinion sas to the course which the Govern-
service, and prevent inconvenience both to individuals mant and the House ought now, in his opinion, to adopt.
and to public officers. He (Lord 3. Russell) thought As he said before, his opinion was—and it was an opinion
there could not be any olejectioo on the pnrt of that in which the House, appeared to concur—that it was the
House to allow them to take that course, The Noble duty of the Government to dissolve the present Parlia-
Lord the Member for North Lancashire said, the other merit as soon as ever it could be done without inconve-
night, that the question of dissolution was not one nience to the public service. He knew that the Sugar
which ought to be discussed in that House, as it was the Bill should pass, and nothing could he farther from his
undoubted prerogative of the Crown. Whether that intention than to oppose stich a'. vote. :But -he not only
opinion were right or not, lie thought there was no thought that the act of dissolution should take place as
man who could say, that after that division of Friday soon as was consistent with the public service ; but he
night, when 623 Members of that House voted, arid must also say, that, according to all usage, Under circum-
there was only a majority of one in favour of the stances at all analagous, a new Parliament ought to be
Right Hon. Baronet, and when, he believed, there convoked as soot.' as possible—(Hear, hear)—not only
were only eight Members who had not de- with reference to the important questions on which the
:
dared their opinions, 'and who had not been public mind
ofnd was now divided—not only with ref
waited upon by either party in that House—(Hear)-.- rence to the interests_ . the country, or .at least
for the support of the existing Government, or any of all persons engagedd in commercial speculation, or.
Government the. Right Hon. Gentleman (Sir R. Peel) enterprise of any kid in
whose advantage it would
might form—(Hear,. hear, and laughter)—he said he to know. what was to be the state of the law affecting
when such was the division of opinion in that House, the importation of corn, not only with reference to these
whatever might with
be the case, as to the propriety of giving considerations but also tl:eference to the position of
any advice to her Majesty respecting an appeal to the the Executive Government which manifestly stands before
country, he thought it must be generally allowed, both the people as notpossessing the confidence of the
there and in every part of the kingdom, that it was not House of. Commons.---(Hear, hear.) The combined
to be expected, during the continuance of that House, force of these considerations compelled him to say that
any majority would be found in favour of the support of the interval ought to be as short as possible, and that
the Government. Such being the case he confessed that her Majesty's Government, after having resorted to the
it appeared to him as clear as any proposition in politics act of dissolution, and taken the sense of the people,
ever did, that the only mode of solving the question was ought to summon the new Parliament without delay.—
that the country itself should_ decide upon a question (Heat', hear.) He thought that no considerations con-
which so affected it—(Hear, hear)—that that decision fleeted with-the private or personal convenience of
being made, if it was not in favour of the party in office, Members ought in the slightest degree to interfere upon
he thought it would be highly inexpedient and unad- such a subject. He looked upon that as a great consti-
visahle to continue any struggle for the purpose of eon- • tutional question in which personal considerations
tinning in the offices they now held ; but if the opinion should be. discarded. According to all analogy—
was the contrary way they might then make some progresS according to all former precedents when a Par-
in those measures which they felts() necessary for thepuh- liament • was dissolved—the . succeeding Parliament
lie welfare. This was the whole statementhe had to masse ought so be immediately convened.—(Hear, hear.)
with respect to the course which they meant to pursue.. The Noble Lord •opposite would recollect that in the
Ile had at least stated as fairly and freely as he could, year 1784, after IStr• Pltt dissolved the Parliament; as
their intention. He knew not if there was any question i short a time as possible was suffered, to elapse'before
which he had not touched upon, but if 'there was any - another was called together, .In 1807,. and again in
such, and he could do so consistently with his duty to. 1831, when Earl Grey dissolved Parliament on account
the Crown, he should be ready to answer it.—(Cheers.) of some obstructions With regard to theneform Bill, a
The Order of the Day was then read for going into a 1 similar course WASP uesued. These were three • cases
Committee of Supply. analagous to the present '; itnd he therefore felt that the
Sir ROBERT PEEL said he „would simply state, 1 House had a fair right to expect' from 'her .Majesty's
clearly and distinctly, but he hoped as frankly as the Noble Government that a new Parliainent should be assembled
Lord, his view of the present position of the Government. ! at as early a period as possible.. If the Noble thought
In reference at those questions to which the Noble Lord it consistent with his duty to • make a declaration that
more particularly referred, in the first place, he would that was the advice which would•be given. by her Ma-
notice the charges which the Noble Lord had brought
.jesty's servants to the Crown, he -(Sir IL Peel) should
agaMs • t him. He was somewhat relieved to find that S:1.; that such a declaration ,would satisfy him.—
they with referenceHe should consider, a declaration, so
were at one to the budget. He had Il','hear.)' •
.( 77
not taken advantage of a reY on the late debate, al- made-by the leatteroi's"' "°llSe of,Commons, possessingthough he knew that he had a perfect right to do so. the confidence of • her Majesty, as -a declaration on
Nothing could .be farther from his intention. When which be could as implicity rely -as he could
he heard the Noble Lord speaking of--the advantages upon any proceeding whichtlie House might adopt for
resulting to the country from the Foreign policy .of the -.the purpose of controlling the Government, lie said at
. . •

E SUN, LONDON. TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1841.