The Sun.
London, England, 1823-03-07 00:00:00

Aitt decided ete.isfaction, that that which he had ever considered
as a n3ost unwarrantable encroachment on the rights and pro-
perty
of the poor of Ireland was about to be removed.—(Cheers.)
—Notlung could be more unjust, more cruel, than that: they,
who were principally interested to support their own Clergy,
'should bear the least part of the burden of that support. /le
skid trust that this Bill would bring tithes back to that fair
and proper state of things, under which all were th bear their
proportionate shares of the common burden. lie was quite sa-
tisfied that this bill promised most fairly. (Cheers from the
Treasury bench.) If it was somewhat complicated in its ma.
ettinery, it must be recollected that that was a defect mainly
attributable fo thocomplicated state of society in Ireland. The
working of such a bill would be very different in Ireland, from
that of a similar measure in England. In Ireland, the same
. facilities did not exist, in consequence of the unhappy dis-
soensions that prevailed in that country. Ile earnestly hoped,
aid indeed trusted, that the bill would be the means of effect.
,g_a great deal of goad.
• Mr. CAREW agreed entirely in the proposition of the Right
Hon. Gentleman, and in the commendations that had been be-
stowed on it. Ireland had reason to likes the day on which
the King visited Ireland, and the representative which be had
lent har.
Mr. SPRING RICE could not resist the temptation of con-
gratulating the House on the present conditions and prospects of
Ireland. The Hon. (Jtnt. then contrasted the measures of co.
ercion and severity which had been resorted to last session,
with the beneficial measure of to-night; which would, he had
An doubt, put an end to the greatest of ally the .evils that afflic-
ted tht irteh peasantry---the tithe system.—Hear !)—Th is boon
would not be thrown eivay on the people of Ireland, from whom,
,0111 the contrary, the Government would reap a rich harvest of
• thaoltfulness and gratitude. If a larger portion of the Irish gen-
try gave up that tythe exemption on their property, to which
• they were entitled under the 40th Geo. II i.and offered the whole
of their lands to be assessed for the poor, it, would sufficiently
strew that they were in earnest and willing to meet the clergy at
least half way, in effecting a most desirable object. The securi-
ty to the clergy would be much greater than formerly : then
theii security was only on the lands subject to tithe ; now tt
Weadd be on all the lands of the Irish Gentry. It would be,
matter of great satisfaction, if in future the assessment
should Le levied, not on the tenant, but on the landlord ; and
that the Catholic occupier of the soil should hereafter have no
• mile either to feel, or hear, or regret the operation of the 'tithe
system. He (Mr. Rice) proffered his most hearty thanks for
this measure..--((Hear!}}
Mr. 11. HUTCHINSON warmly acknowledged the boon
which this proposition would confer on Ireland. It was the
more pleasant to thank his Majesty's Governtlent for such a
measure, because for a' long period—and in that House for fif-1
teen years—he had been in warm and angry opposition to their
- general conduct. The measure before them was, of all others,
the most calculated to heal and appease the troubles and irri-
tatfons that had too long afflicted Ireland ; and he was not less
bound to return for it the most sincere Acknowledgments of
her gratitude, than the whole of the British Empire. By the
()oscillation' of Ireland, the whole of the; empire was so eons°.
I:dated and established, that its strength would be irresistible.—
(Chem.) —The lion, Gentleman especially thanked also the
Right Hon, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and the Right j
lion. the Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. Canning), for the'
kindness of their expressions in regard to Ireland upon very
recent occasions. •
Colonel BARRY expressed his approhation of the bill.
. Mr. V. FITZGERALD declared that it was not his inten.
thin to pronounce any opinion on the details of the bill at the
preset); moment.. This, however, he would say of it generally,
that it ;,romised not Only to be an admirable measure to concili-
ate the different classes of the community in Ireland, lint also a
measure Well calculated to prove that the members of the Irish
government were Most anxious to fulfil the pledges which they
had ofl'ered to the people at the moment when its destinies were
that of all intrusted to. their care.
Mr. GRATTAN, Col. T Estes!, and Mr. IlustE severally
eXpressed an opinion that this measure would creme a great im.
prorement in the present system of things in Ireland.
Mr. in reply to a question that had been put
to him by Mr, Hume, stated, that it was intended that the corn.
position should last for a certain period—tbf instance, 21 years;
but that a Valuation should be taken every three years, in order
that the income of the clergyman might always bear a fair pro-
portion to the existing. price of corn.
A desultory conversation then' took place across the table, on
this subject, in which Mr. PauL, Mr. lltcanno, Mr. PLuer-
reTT, and Mr. DENMAN joined.—Leave was then given to
bring in the Bill.
NATIONAt. DEBT REDUCTION ACTS.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCLIEQUER moved the
Order of the Day for receiving the Report of the Malone,
• Debt Bill.
CALCUAVT said, he would oppose the further progress
• or the erieaxure, on the ground that greater benefit woold be
conferred On the country by the repeal of taxes, than by the
Owlet) of their existing surplus to the object proposed by
the Right lion. Gentleman (the Chancellor of the Exche.
-Ver), namely, the reduction of the Debt. On his side of the
House they were accused of not taking Statesmanlike views
of this and other subjects: For his part, though he did not
dislike popularity when obtained by honest and fair means,
he should never sacrifice to it what he considered his public
',duty. He was as friendly as any man to the principle of a
Sinking Fund, and should not oppose the application of it,
if the finances and internal circumstances of the country were
such saw to admit of its being directed to a real and Lona jidetbi-
ehargo of debt. It. was objected to his view of the subject, that
if any emergency, should arise, no one would be willing. to come
forward and advance his money, when there was no sinking fund
in mleration. Hi (Mr. Calcraft) held quite an oPpositeepinion..
Wit'eti persona were about to lend money to the State, they
looked flit security rather to the situation of the finances, and
the general circumstances of the country, than to a Sinking,
Fund: He would ask, whether the public tuids were now so
rt:duced in price that it was necessary to support them by a
Sinking Fund ? At the present price, any person who felt so
disposed, inigie, realise more than the sum originally advanced.
What he nitwit now to propose was, that the further progress
.of ~the Report should be postponed to the 20th of April. The,
unlit inconvenience that could arise front this would be, that'
the accounts must be made up to the sth of July in place of the
4th of April. It' this delay wore allowed, the House would.
then hews an opportunity of considering whether mine more be-
.netlecial application might not be made of the existing surplus
than that proposed by the Right Honourable tiendernan (the
Chancellor of the Exchequer.) If ever there was one period
"eve likeiy than another, at which a reduction of the public
reteemie could be .appreciended, it was the present ; because,
with ones single exception, every class of the community was
ire it; most condition. tie should not In the then
state of the Muse make any further remarks, but should move
a'at the Airther proceedings on the Reportahould be postponed
to the itrath Apiil next. • . . • .
Colonel WOOD opposed the amendment, and: said the re-
duction proposed by the lion. Member was not calculated to
.aff.ird. that relief-whieh the lion. Gentleman contemplated. As
far' sot .he Wolonel Wood) could learn, the landed interest had
deriVed no benefit wheteser from the reductnin of one half the
beether Tax, which Should have been effected last year. lle
therefore thought it would not be expedient to hang up the
measure ol his Right Hon. Friend lot so long a period as that
.mentiontal by theotienticman opposite.'
Mr. W. SMITH; in replyto what had fallertfrom the lion.
Oentlentan who had juse set down, begged to state, that Itched
been ittformed by.persons engaged in the leather trade, that
~the reduction of one half the duty on leather had beer preduc,
rive of' coneiderahle benefit to the landed interest, by increasing
the demand for leathereand consequently for hides and bark,
both .of which articles bad eemseqttently risen in price.
Camel WOOD! explained. lle had been informed, from
what Le de rued oaf:eV:authority, that at no period were hides
atuthcn t. rs> low in' prize as at:present.
ie J. RTIN contended that, the stockholder had a
claim to the Sinking Fund, and he was of opinion that the pre-
, sea amount of it was not too large. To repeal 2,000,0004 of
taw, prom by the Chimed-ler of the Exchequer, was as
umuclt 114 could be tione in the present. circumstances of :the
country. lie recommertied that the public accounts should• he
eimplihed, paroculatly as far as they regarded Exchequer Bills.
At present the whole subject was in a state of inexplicable con.
fusion. The Committee on Public Accounts had left this part
of the sultie4 out of view.
Mr. J. BENETT said he would vote for the amendment ;
aud took occasion to express his dissent from many of the doe.
trines laid down by the Ham Member for Portarlington ; and
expressed hiss determination not to accompany that lion. Gene
therm when mounted on his hobby-horse—political economy.
laugh.) —`,The taxes en cultivation amounted to 0 but
cent. o;.rent ; he therefore felt •convioced„ that nothing but
reduCtion of taxation could relieve the landed ioteeeee.
Jir J. suuldr, Y supported the ante.odment ; and recom-
metaled that two millions should be taken front the Sinking
Fund, acid applied tai the reduction pf taxation.
Aleletenan C. SMITH opposed the amendment. lie had
sold ii.great deal of Lark lately, and did not find that improve.
ment price alluded to by the Hon. Gentionan.
Air. LIMN sup ported the_ amendments and contended,
that if the Fund were allowed to go on as at present,
the comory would find that not 1004 of the National Debt
would be rfoloced by it. The Hon. Aleinher proceeded to
argue upon a Variety of calculations, that the Sinlang Fund,
continued Ow its pre3ent system, would ultimately tend to isl.
crease tlie debt to a much greater extent. Ile would ask the
Pron. tthmber for `Taunton if the Americans had a Sinking