The Sun.
London, England, 1840-06-18 00:00:00

EVEMIIkIG .EDITIOM

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their city. The petitioners entered into a long statement . Mr. WA K LEY said that the gist clause of the Bit
of their grievances on the subject. which rendered vaccination gratuitous, would disqualify
Mr. S. O'BRIEN presented a petition from Limerick parties who benefited by it from voting according to the
against. Sergeant Talfourd's Copyright Bill. 1 previsions of the Reform Bill.
Mr. INGHAM presented a petition, praying that the 1 Sir J. GRAHAM intended to introduce a clause into
Courts of Law might be removed from Westminster Hell the Bill which would remedy that inconvenience.
to some place nearer tee Inns of Court. 1 Mr. WA ELM' said that that provision of the Bill
Mr. PO 'CI, IS TM SCROPE presented a petition Icm which e ould put it in the poWer of young and inex-
Ihe Borough of Stroud against Church-rates. i -perienced men to supersede the more competent members
Mr, ROW LMN l) a L emo e; presented petitions fr .m of the professioneeould give rise to very general discontent ;
Hertford against any grant for Church Extension. and lie would advise the Right Hon. Member not to per-
Mr. PE ASE presented several petitions from Durham severe with it. He would suggest to the Hon. Member
and places in the West Riding of Yorkshire, to the same that he should allow the Bill to pass through Committee
. ffect. Also petitions against Church-rates. pro iormaeand that he should introduce a new measure,
Mr. VERNON SMITH presented a petition from the such as weeld be acceptable to the profession generally.
Independent Dissenters of Kilsby against any grant for ' Sir J. GRA HAM said, that he bad then no amendment
Church Extension. ' to introduce into the Bill. He could have no amendment
Mr. HANDLE Y presented similar petitions from places to discus until the 10th clause came under cossideration.
in Lincolnshire. and also for the abolition of Church-rates. The 1331 was not introduced by him, but the management
CHURCH EXTENSION. of it had been committed to him, and be could nor, under.
Sir ROBERT INGLIS gave notice that•on Tuesday these circumstances, accede to the 'proposal of the Hon
I;.e :i0:11 of June he would call the attention of the House Member to allow the Bill to pass through Committee pro
to a : uteset, wires% he hoped to have been able to have forma.
brought leeward yesterday, namely, Church Extension.— Jr.e 'IVA KLE le then objected to the superintendence
S Cheers and laughter. ). e hire: the Bill entrusted to the Poor-law Guardians. He
CHURCH_ RATES. t proposed tl at the Guardians.should be empowered to con-
Mr. EA ST HOPE gave notice that he should, on the tr.,--.T. net merely w'th medical practitioners. but with tl:e
30th of June, move for leave to bring, in a Bill to relieve „legally qualified practitioners" in each Union.
Dissenters from the payment of Church-rates. Sir J. Cr RA HAM thought that the fittest parties to he
SUPREME COURTS (SCOTLAND). entrusted with the power of determining those who should
Mr. WA LI. ACE gave notice :hat on the first supply 1„, emeen as practitioners were the Poor-law Guardians,
day he should call the attention of the House to the repeal tilt; F. FRENCH did not place the same confidence
of the Select Committee on Supreme Courts in Scotland. in the Guardians as the Right Hon. Baronet.
POLITICAL OFFENCES. Mr. WARBURTON thought that the last part of the
Mr. T. D UNCO :MBE gave notice, that on the read- Bat vas that which related to the superintendence of the
leg tile Order of the Day for the House resolving itself Gemdians.
into a Committee of Supply, he should call the attention Alter some further conversation the Committee divided
of the House to the punishments for political offences, and on elm Wakley's amendment, when there appeared—
would submit a motion to the House on the subject. For the amendment ... - ' 33
CANADA GOVERNMENT BILL. Against it
Mr. VE ll NON - SMITH gave notice (for Lord John Majority for the amendment —9
Russell) that on Thursday that Noble Lord would move The clause, as amended, was orded to stand part of the
the omission of the clauies relating to District Councils. slim
LUDLOW ELECTION. On the reading of clause 2, which gave the Guardians
The SPE AK ER informed the House that the sureties of the Poor power to 6x the places and times for the
given by the petitioners against the return at the last glee- attendance of the medical officers for the purpose of vac-
tion of the borough of Ludlow were found to be unobjec- ciliation,
amiable.
Mr. WARBURTON said that the 31 elate° gave
COLONIAL PASSENGERS BILL. sufficient power to the Guardians, and he should recom-
Mr. Is ABOUCHERE, on the part of the Noble 5e- mend that the clause should be withdrawn. '
cretary to the Colonies, gave notice that he should defer Sir J. GRAHAM said he had no objection to the
the third reading of the Colonial Passengers Bill from postponement of the clause.
to-morrow to come future period. After a few words from Mr. Lucas, Mr. F. French,
Mr. El LITT informed the Speaker that he was placed mr. Warburton, and. Mr. Wakley, the clause was
in circumstances of peculiar difficulty with respect to the postponed.
Committee which he had obtained to consider the expedi- On the reading of the third clause, which was to the
mcy of allowing the grinding of Foreign Corn in bond, effect that the Guardians and Overseers should be re-
being also appointed ono of the Committee for e quired to conform to the regulations of the Commissieniers
forming New Docks, and finding it impossible of Poor-laws.
to discharge the duties of both. He should therefore Mr. Ne' AKL E Y objected, on the ground that it would
feel obliged by the Speaker's advice as to what he should reduce, under the authority of the Poor-law Commission
Jo under these circumstances.—( Laughter.) not only the Overseers of parishes, in which at present the
The SPE AK ER was understood to say, tha' it was not New Poor-law was not: in force, but also the medical
his duty, nor was he able to advise the Hon. Gentleman. practitioners of those parishes. The medical teen instead
DROPPED ORDERS, of blistering the public, would be themselves severely blis-
The Dropped Orders were then disposed of. tered by this clause.
VACCINATION. Sir JAMES GRAHAM would assert, that the Poor-
Sir JAMES GRAHAM rose to move the Order law Commissioners always availed themselves of the high.
of the Day for the further discussion of his Vac- est medical authority in the country, before they made any
ciliation Bill. In doing so, he would not detain regulations respecting medical matters.
the House, as he felt the disadvantages under which -Mr. WAKLEY replied, that if the Commissioners
he laboured on the occasion, it not being in his power to were in the habit of consulting the highest merle:al au.
bring any professional knowledge or any practical expe- thority ? that authority ought to be known._( Hear,
rience to bear upon the subject, while the Hon. Gentle- hear.) , Why did they not have a medicel Commissioner?
man (Mr. Wakloy) who was opposed to him possessed The consultation of " high authorities" was nothing more
both those qualifications. The best course, he thought, which than a sytem of jobbing—(Hkar, hear)—and those au.
could be followed would be, that he should first submit his thorities were respected only by the Commissieners and
motion to the House, and that the Hon. Gentleman opposite their friends. lie objected strongly to the clause, but he
should propose his plan by way of amendment. In his had no doubt that it would pass.—( Hear.) This Bill was
(Sir J. Graham's) Bill, he had not provided an absolute the first nibble of the Poor-law Commissioners' at the
pretentative for inoculation; and he had abstained from whole of the parishes of the metropolis, and it would en-
doing so, not because his owe opinions did not incline to able them to swallow them all,
such a measure, but because he doubted whether the public Sir JAMES GRAHAM repudiated the insinuation of
mind was prepared for such a prohibition. His Bill dishonest motives.
merely proposed considerable restraints on inoculation, Mr, WAKLEY denied that he had imputed dishonest
but it fell short of absolute prohibition. One of these re- motives.
straints was, that no one, not a medical practitioner should Sir JAMES GRAHAM said he used the word him-
inoculate for the small-pox.. The Bill of the self, because the imputation of dishonesty was conveyed
Honourable Gentleman went the whole length of in the language of the Hon, feentleman.
prohibition, bet he ( Sir J. Graham) should ob- After a few words From Sir George Strickland and
serve, that if the . House would consent to go Mr. Darby, in fervour of the clause, Mr. Wakley spoke
into Committee on his measure, they might strike out the vigorously egainst it, and Sir B. Halt moved a proviso to
10th and Ilth clauses, and substitute the Ist clause of the the cf.f.2ct that it should not come into operation in parishes
Hon. Gentleman. So far' there was no absolute differencel having local acts for the poor-rates.
between the two Bills. The real difference between them I Mr. G RINISDITCH supported the amendment, upon
was in the frame-work of the two measures with re- which the House divided, when tire numbers werem. -
epect to the encouragement to be given to vaccination.. For the amendment -
The difference bet Ween the Hon. Member and himself, i . Against it
was, that the Honourable Member treated the Poor-law I
Majority
machinery, to which he was compelled to have re The clause was then agreed to. -'. - ' •'m s
course, as merely , subordinate, because he placed no On the -ith clause, giving the Poor-law Commisaioners
confidence in it. Whereas be (Sir J. Graham) finding power to annuli contracts, • that the Legislature had confided greater objects to • Mr. WAKLEY again objected to the centralizing sys•
the Commission, and thinking it worthy of their confidence tern, and the House divided—
entrusted the entire execution of the plan to the Guardians, ' For the clause 4O
and the general superintendence to the Commissioners. Against it ll
The .Hon: Member for Finsbury would forgive him for.say- Majority 29
mg that there appeared, in his Bill too much regard for Other clauses
up to 10 were agreed on, On that
his brethren c f the lancet.—( Laughter.) Why the clause
Hon. Member proptsed that every medical man be en- Mr. WAKI,EY said the question now arose—end it
titled to a fee of 2s. for vaccination, and as there were at was the most important part of the Bill—whether the
least 300,000 persons in the, kingdom who must under House should imperatively prohibit inoculation, which he
the Bill be vaccinated, it wamequivaleet to a grant of earnestly called upon the House to do, and he therefore
300,0001. to the ptoFession.—(Hcar, hear, and laughter.) moved the omission of the words which prohibited any but
Mr. WAKLEY said he should not, without the express regular practitioners from inoculating, thus making the
permission of the Right Hon. Baronet, have moved the imbibition general. •
Order for his Bill, as the conduct of the Right Mr. WARBURTON seconded the amendment.
Honourable Gentlemen had been so courteous, so Sir G. STRICK LAND was convinced that no pro-
' considerate, and kind—( Hear, hear)—in allowing his hibition to innoculate for the small-sox could put en end to
Bill to stand over for weeks, though he had the priority, that disease. He, moreover, thought it would be an inter-
till he (Mr. W.) brought his forward.--( Hear.) Let the Terence with a man's management of his own health, which
House recollect that they were called on to legislate to en- they had no right to make. lie thought if they passed this
courage vaccination against a popular prejudice. Would Bill some descendant of Dr. Morison would be coming to
it net then be exceedingly impolitic to pass a measure, the House and saying that alt pills but his were
the execution of which was entirely committed to a body injurious to health, and praying the House for a law pro-
so obnoxious to the poor; as the Poor-law Commissioners ? hibiting the use of all others.--( Laughter.) He was
—( Hear, hear.) The poor would imagine that the intent therefore decidedly opposed to the amendment.
tion was not to preserve, but to destroy their offspring.— Mr. C. BERKELEY thought all experience went to
(Oh, oh.) Under' the Bill he (Mr.,.Wakley) proposed, prove inoculation should be prohibited by law.
a poor man would be able to go to any medical man he After a few words from Mr. DARBY, Mr, M. O'Cos.
liked with an order for vaccination. Let the House remem- NEU., and Mr. F. FRENCH,
ber this appalling fact, that 17,000 died annually of the small- Dr. NICH 0 L L said he doubted if inoculation had ever
pox, the number before Dr. Jenner's discovery being 45,000 been of any benefit. He believed the number of cases of
annually. Why should so awful a scourge be per- small-pox after vaccination was very slightly superior to
mitted to rage, when it could be put a stop to by the number after inoculation; but the difference was, that
preventing inoculation 2—( Hear, hear.) In conti- after the former it was always of a very mitigated, and
nental states, inoculation was generally prohibited. atter the latter of a very aggravated, nature.—( Hear.)
Was human life of so little value that 200,000/. was too Sir J. GRA HAM thought the Hon. Member for Brid-
large a sum for saving it ? If the medical man performed port had even understated the evils arising from the small-
his labour, the labourer, was worthy of his hire.—( Hear, pox. Under 'many foreign Governments vaccination was
hear.) Look at the contracts for medical officers to the strictly enireined, and it would be found that where this
Unions—had they reflected credit on the profession or was the case small-pox was almost unknown. He was
otherwise ?—( Hear, hear.) Yet it was never proposed not, 'however, prepared to make vaccination imperative,
to put the whole vaccination of the country into the hands tut thought the most prudent step the Legislature could
of these persons. He would like to knew how medicel take would be to prohibit inoculation.—( Hear.) He
practitioners in any country town would like to have would not advocate the Bill, if he did not think that
another practitioner introduced. into their neighbourhood every precau'ion would be taken, under its operation, to
by this scheme? It was a scheme that could produce encourage vaccination, and to secure that it should be per-
nettling but heart burnings. He therefore trusted that House formed by competent medical authority. If pressed to a
would fully consider it. It was not a party question, but one division, he should vote for the substitution of the clause
affecting all parties equally.—( Hear.) lie did implore the of the Hon. Gentleman.—( Hear, bear.)
House to consider the public prejudices on the subject, Mr. WAKLEY hoped, after the declaration of the
and not to increase them by placing vaccination in the Rigia Hen. Baronet, there would be no division, and that
hands of those against whom the public was justly pre- the public would receive confidence from the manner in
judiccd. Let the House remember the discovery was which the proposition had been received by the House.
made by a Doctor of Medicine, and that many who The ATTORNEY-GENERAL had considered the
were undervaluing it to-day, might not have been subject many years, and was decidedly of opinion that ino-
there to do so but for the discovery of that great man. cuiation should be abolished.—( Hear, hear.) He was
The greatest care was necessary in performing the opera- exceedingly rejoiced at the measure of the Right Hon.
tion, and should, in his opinion, be lap to those elude. Baronet, and hoped there would be an universal concur-
cal practitioners whom the people might choose, and not be rence in it, in every house in the kingdom.—( Hear.)
entrusted to the medical officers of the Poor-law Unions, Sir J. GR A HAM acquiesced in the amendment of the
who were frequently the most incompetent professional men Hon. Member for Finsbury, and inoculation was pro-
in their neighbourhood. The Hun. Member concluded by hibited without a division.

begging tlae House to adopt the amendment, and reject
the original resolution.
Mr. CRAVEN BERKELEY seconded the amend-
ment. He was of opinion that the practice of inoculation
should be altogether prevented.
Mr. WA R B LT RTON said there was one point on which
all were agreed—namely, that it was their duty to
prevent inoculation, and to encourage vaccination as
much as possible. He believed that the time was
come when the state of public feeling would
authorise them to prohibit inoculation. He thought
that the clauses of the Bill of the Right Hon. Baronet on
that subject did not go far enough. He therefore gave a
preference to the Bill of his Honourable Friend,
but if that Bill were not adopted he would support the
Bill of the Right Hon. Baronet, rather than have no Bill
at all cn the subject.
Mr. LUCAS objected to the Bill of the Hon. Member
for Finsbury as likely to produce a system of canvassing
for paltry half.crown fees. He much preferred the mea-
sure of the Right Hon. Baronet. Certainly the salaries of
the medical practitioners under the Poor-law were very
inadequate.
Mr. F. FRENCH supported the Bill of Mr. Wakley.
Mr. GOUL BURN said the public feeling would not
yet stand a positive prohibition of inoculation : all that
cou'd be done was to discourage it as far as possible.
Mr. WARD said he did not understand the object of
these Bills was to prohibit inoculation altogether. Medical
practitioners generally, ho thought,were in favour of the Bill
of the Hon. Member for Finsbury, but whether this were
so or not, he thought the best plan would be to withdraw
both Bills, and compound out of them one better than
either.—( Hear, hear.)
Lord SA NDON said he thought it was the opinion of
medical men all over the world that vaccination should be
encouraged, and inoculation altogether prohibited.
Sir GEORGE GREY thought the best plan to come
to an arrangement on the details cf the Bill of the Right
Hon. Baronet would be to allow it to go into Committee,
upon the understanding that it should then be decided
whether they would restrain inoculation or prohibit it alto-
gether.—( Hear, hear.)
Sir J. GRA El AM said it would be quite competent for
any person who voted for the Second Reading of the Bill
to introduce a clause in Committee to prohibit inocula-
tion altogether. The Hon. Gentlematt had somewhat
taunted him with the number of petitions in favour of his
own Bill ; but there had beer, a medical agitation on this
subject, and he had not the means of counter.agitation.
The question now faitly before the House was, shall the
Poor-law Commissioners have the sole control over vac-
cination, or whether it should be left to the unaided and
private exertions of medical practitioners in each district,
with a view of profit.
The House then divided, when the numbers were—
For the motion
For the amendment
Majority —l7
The House then went into Committee on Sir J.
Graham's Bill, Mr. PAYNE in the Chair.
On clause 1 being proposed,
Mr. W AK L E Y said that the clause proposed to enable
the Poor-law Commissioners to do that which they were
empowered to do by the existing law.
Sir JAMES GRAHAM said that the object of the
clause was to render it imperative on all Unions to con-
tract for the vaccination o'f the patties within each Union.

The clause, as amended, was ordered to stand part of
the Bill.
Clauses 11 and 12 were agreed to.
The House resumed, and the Report was ordered to be
received to-morrow.
PAROCHIAL ASSESSMENTS BILL.
Mr. P. SC ROPE moved the second reading of this Bill.
Sir B. HALL opposed the second reading • Almost
the sole object of the Bill was to take the appeal from
the vestries and give it to the Magistrates, who knew
nothing of the subject. ' He, therefore, moved that the
Bill be rely seconded Mr. dßalisecondti s
ttilkic m that day
threeemonths.
D
RAE, ap*raei
reluctantly
Pct
aEnCti
vH
opposedEL L a ntdh
et
sh
eec
oAnTd T
reading.o NE Y- GENE-
Mr. BROTHERTON thought it very desirable
that • facilities should be given for appeal to Quarter
Sessions, and therefote he should support the Bill.
. Mr. WAELE Y said this was another Bill from So-
merset House.—(Laughter.) Unless certain clauses
were withdrawn, be must oppose the second reading.
Mr. P. SCRO PE would withdraw the clauses, though
he could give good reasons for their insertion.
Sir B. HALL said he must Persist in his amendment.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw. No divisixt,
h("NN,r. j
silerv. cri our:.. place.triosfo,:uitztito t
PE
ha
Onthe Galleryinquiring we found
e
la
uses
the
Hon.
Member would withdraw.
E said the Hon. Member was pressing
his power of having a short number of Members too far.
The Committee was the proper place for discussing the
clauses.
The Bill was then read a second time, and ordered to
be committed on the 24th inst.
On the motion of Mr. BAINES the Borough Watch-
rates Bill went through Cornmittee. To be reported on
Friday.
The Marriages Act was read a second time, on the
!notion of Mr, LANGDALE.
SUDBURY ELECTION.
A petition was presented, complaining of
,an undue
return for the borough of Sudbury, and praying that the
election might be declared null and void.
On the motion of Mr. BROTHERTON, it was or-
dered " That an humble Address be presented to her
Majesty, praying that she will be graciously ptee,sed to
give directions that there be laid before this House a
copy of the Proposals by the Sub. Committee of Chap..
tors, for a 13111 to be substituted for the Ecclesiastical
Duties and Revenues Bill ; with observations and tabular
statements, intended to show the comparative merits of
the two measures."
Adjourned at Half-past Twelve o'Clock.

ELECTION COMMITTEE.
The General Committee of Elections havQ appointed
Monday the 13th day of July next for nornioating„ from
Panel No. 3, the Select Committee to try the merits-of
the Ludlow Election Petition.

TEMPLE CHURC understand this
Church is closed to enable the solicitors of the Inner and Middle
Temple to effect some extensive alterations therein.
Mr. Charles Kean has brought bothe from
America a confession of the murder of Lord Norbur.'rriad
by two Irish labourers, who absconded from Ireland sbOri. after
the murder, and were employed in the United Stders.—..:Lime-
rich Chronicle.