The Sun.
London, England, 1841-05-01 00:00:00

ANALYSIS OF THURSDAY NIGHT'S DIV]
Voted for Alorpeth's Clause
Against
Twenty-two Pairs
Absent l.iber.ls
Absent 'I ot ies 4
Speaker
Chairman, R. Bernal 1

PAI

LIBERALS.
Byt:g, lion. G. S.
Campbell, Sir J.
Cave, Otway
Chapman, Sir M L.
Cavold:sti, G.
Chichester, J. P. B.
Crawley, S.
Oavies, Colonel
Doke, Sir James
Ltwall, It.
Fenton, John
Ilurst, ft. H.

TOittEs.
Maidstone, Lord
Wynn, C. W.
Blvdett, Sir F.
Colquboun, J. C.
Ashley, Hon. H.
Copeland.. W. '
Davenport..l.-,i
tcland, 11,
Di.:lc, Q.
Peel, Colonel J.
Houldswortly
Acland, Sir T. D.,'
Jenkins, Sir R.
Pemberton, Tho Mas
Corry, Right Hen. H.
Vernon, Granville,
Jones, Wilson
Liddell, H. I'.
Kelly, Fitzroy
llagge, W. -
Williams, T. P.
Kerr, D.

O'Con-nor Don

Pryme, 6.
Roche, Sir D.

Spencjr, 1-lon. F.
Shelh,rne, Earl of
Stanley, Hon. W.
Tancred, H. W.
Townley, 11. G.
Vivian, Major C.
Walker, C. A.

ABSENT L'
Barron, H.' W.
Basset, John
Benett, John
Berkeley, H ,n. C.
Donkin, Sir Rufane
Fitzgibbon, Hon R.
Hallyhurton, Lord D.
Heathcote, Sir G.

BERALS.
Heathcotc, G. J,
Jervis, Swynfen
Langton, Col. G.
Maher, John
Seholetield, J.
Turner, William
Wakley, Thomas

ABSENT TORIES.

Chapman, A. l Miles, W.
Goddard, Ambrose Monyi enny. T. G.

LIBERALS WHO VOTED WITH THE TORIES.

Ainsworth, Peter
Fielden, J.

I Howick. Lord
Wood, C.

COURT OF SEWERS, WESTMIN-

STER.
A Court of Sewers for the City and Liberties of Westmin-
ster was yesterday held at the office of the Commissioners, is
Greek-street, Soho, at 11 o'clock, for the purpose of swearing
a Jury, to inquire into such things a, shall be given them in
charge, and to present what houses, lands, and tenements, are
benefited by the new making, repairing, or cleansing, the
Common Sewers in the Western Division of the West-
minster Sewers, or that they may receive hurt, loss, or disad-
vantage, by defect of new making, repairing, or cleansing, such
sewers ; and also the annual rental value of the several premi-
ses, for apportioning, according to the interest of each indivi-
dual, hls due share of the expense appertaining to the sewage.
'the Jury List having been called over, various persons who
had not answered to their names were ordered to be summoned
to show cause why they should not respectively be fined 5/. for
non-attendance. One of the Jur) men, whose real name was
Scollick, having been summoned as Se *wick, a long discus-
sion ensued as to whether the panel could be altered, the
Chairman conter ding that the Court had the power_ to have it
altered; and Mr. Thistleton Dyer, and other Commissioners,
that such power did not exist, and that it was not a question
for the Court to entertain, as to whether the panel should or
should not-be altered.

'1 he CHAIRMAN having put the question as to whether the
panel should be corrected,
Mr. THISTLETON DYER
_protested against the question
being put, and requested the Under-Sheriff to state whether he
legally possessed tt e power to alter the panel.
The UNDER-SHERIFF said he had known such alterations
made in the Court of Queen's Bench and at the Quarter
Sessions.

The question was then put, when there appeared for alterieg
the panel 10; against it 4.
The UNDER-SHERIFF refused to alter it himself. The
Court had the power to do so.
Captain BAnuE though the Chairman would be taking upon
himself a dangerous responsibility if he were to alter the panel
after what had fallen from the Under-Sheriff.
111 r. BitouotrroN said it was a mere point of practice, and
the Court clearly had the power to alter the panel in the sante
way as the Court of Queen's Bench exercised the power.
The UNDER-SHERIFF, to put an end to the discussion.
would take upon himself to make the required alteration, and
it was made accordingly.
The Jury having chosen Mr. Thompson as their Foreman,
were impanelled and sworn.
The officers of the Court to be examined having been brought
up en masse to be sworn, according to the usual practice of
the Court, . . .

Mr. THISELTON DYER protested against their being sworn
in such a manner; they ought to be sworn as they came up to
give evidence.
The CHAIRMAN interrupted the Hon. Commissioner. In
point of order he had no tight to discuss the matter then,
and he should put the question that the officers be sworn in the
usual manner.

Air. Mu',Luis thought, as the Jury were to hear evidence in
open Court for the first time, they ought to adopt the usual
practice of Courts of Justice, and not abide by the practice,
which might have been very proper when the Jury retired to
hear evidence. _

BaouGHTON said that if the usual practice of the Court
was to be departed from the matter should have been proposed
when the Court was sitting in its deliberative and not in its
judicial capacity.
The question was then put and carried, and the officers were
sworn in the usual manner.

The CHAIRMAN then proceeded to read the charge to the
Jury, and having explained to them the duties that would de-
volve upon them, and described the state of the sewage in the
western division, proceeded to state that it had been usual
to make the Sewers-rate upon the basis of the Poor-rate ; but
that it appearing that various properties not rated in the Poor-
rate were liable to Sewers-rate, such as churches, public build-
tugs, burial-grounds, &c., the Court had ordered a survey of
such properties to be made, and the result of the inquiries of
the surveyors would be laid before the Jury for their conside-
ration. 'the Chairman then proceeded to read various por-
tions of the law relating to sewers, with a view'of showing the
legal liability of every species of property to be assessed to the
Sewers-rate, that rate being, in fact, a tax upon the land of
a more extensive nature than even the Land-tax itself. Is
was for them to say whether there was any property
legally exempt from Sewers-rate. They might be of opinion
that there might be difficulties in the way of levying the rate
upon Churches and Palaces, but it was for them to say whether
there was any escape from the clear words of the lax. The
Attorney and Solicitor-Generals had given it as their opinion
that the Palace was exempt, but that could not be. The
Chairman then at great length related the history of the liti-
gation respecting the rating of the Palaces, &c. ; the fact of
the presentment of Churches, &c., by a former Jury,
the decision of the Traverse Jury as to Chelsea Church,
and ihe opinions of Dr. Phillimore and Mr. Hoggins as to the
power of enforcing a rate against the Church, together with
the prceeedings adopted by the Court, in consequence of those
opinions. He thought that they would be of opinion that all
the circumstances of the case created a virtual exemption for
Churches. With regard to Cents of Law and the Houses of
Parliament their Solicitors were also of opinion that there
were circumstances which would render the enforcing the rate
against those buildings difficult if not impossible. It wa-4
for the Jury to determine whether, as regarded church-!s, pa-
laces, Royal gardens, the Houses of Parliament, and the Courts
of Law, they were of opinion that it would be advisable to
present them as liable to the Sewers-rate or not. The JurY
might hear the evidence either in open Court or retire to
another room for that purpose, if they thought proper.
The FOREMAN thought it more advisable that they should
retire to another room for the convenience of examining plans-
He wished to know whether the rate was prospective or retro-
spective.
The CLERK—Principally prospective.
The FOREMAN was about to ask questions relating to the
laws of Sewers, when
'the CHAIRMAN said the solicitor would be examined before
them, anit would explain the law.
The FOREMAN wishrd to know whether they must all agree.
The CHAIRMAN—TweIve must sign the presentment, and
a presentment must be male.

The FOREMAN Wished, then, that they should retire toper-
form their duties.

Mr. LESLIE wished to know on what authority the Chair-
man gave the Jury the option of retiring. He strongly pro-
tested against such an alteration being submitted to.
ADEY rose to order.
The FOREMAN of the JURY protested against their being
detained by these discussions. He wished to retire-
Mr. Mueeiws protested against the Jury sitting for anY
other purpose rhan for inspecting the plans ; and if he stood
alone he would oppose their retiring.
The CHAIRMAN said the Jury had requested to retire.
Mr. LESLIE rose, but was met by loud cries of " Order,"
which rendered him inaudible.
Mr. Blume }trot; rose to order. They had come to an extra-
ordinary state when a Juryman in the box was protesting against
the decision of the Judges. Never had he heard, after a charge
had been given, any of the members of the Court protesting
against it.
The FOREMAN wished the question should be put at once.
as they were sure the Court would decide they should retire.
Mr. T. DYER protested against a Juryman dictating to or
interfering in the discussions of the Court. It was must inde-
corous, and what he had never before witnessed or heard of.
Mr. LESLIE said the responsibility rested upon the Clair-
man fur giving the Jury the option of retiring. They had
been sworn to examine the questions there.
The CHAIRMAN put an end to the discussion by telling. the
Jury they might retire, and they did retire accordingly.
During their absence, in answer to a question from Mr.
T. DYER,
The CHAIRMAN stated that the charge was to. b. consi-
dered as the charge of the Chairman alone.
Mr. I'. DYER said that Mr. Smith had been sworn to give
evidence as the solicitor of the Court, now he had called for his
appointment, and it was not in existence. If hereafter the
rate should be disputed on that ground, he hoped it would be
remembered he had warned them in time.
The CHAIRMAN said that bills had been presented by M essrs.
Smith and Son, and paid to them for business transacted by
them as Solicitors to the Court.
The .Jury did not return into Court until nearly six o'clock,
when they delivered in a presentment, from which the Foreman
stated they had omitted the churches and burial grounds, and
that they were desire us the Court should be as lenient to cha-
ritable institutions as possible. The Jury at one time had been
desirous of omitting them. They had likewise omitted the
Palaces, the Parliament Houses, and the Courts of Law.
The CIi'AIRMAN then discharged the Jury.
Pre:ions to their leaving the box one of the Jury said he
th,,ug it it hard th,t the Commissioners should have to keep
the ciurches drained, and that those churches should be ex-
empt from the rate. He should therefore be glad to see a pe-
tition emanate from this Court to Parliament, praying for the
ahuliti in of Ecel“siastical Courts, when they might rate
churches without the fear of incarceration.
The usual notices of the presentment were then ordered to
be laubl;shed, and the days of appeal fixed for the 45th of May
and the 22d of June next.
Me. LESLIE desired that the presentment. might be rad, as
he understood the Parks had been omitted also. On ri a ling_
the prese itment it was found that the churches, burial-
grounds, royal palaces, courts of law, Houses of rarliament,
and the parks, were omitted.
On the motion Of Captain BAGUE, the charge of the Chair-
man was ordered to be printed, and the Court adjourned at
six o'clock.
The Commissioners whose names appear on the presentment
constituting the quorum to whom the presentment is made,
are—J. L. Donaldson, Esq., Chairman; Captain Bague,
R.N., G. Barker, W. White, J. Goldsmith, and J. Jacobs, Esq.

BERLIN, APRIL 12.—A great subject of con-
versation in the highest circles is the expected arrival of the
Ele :toral Prince of Hesse, a very near relation of our Royal
family ; he being the son of the pious Electress of Hesse,
sister of the late King. The object of his visit is said to be
to consult our prudent Monarch on the succession to the Elec-
toral, because his sons being born in a Morganatis marriage,
,re not qu aitied to succeed to the Throne.
DEATH OF MR. LUKE HANSARD, PRINTER.
• to THE HOUSE OF COMUONS.—This venerable and muck-
respected gentleman breathed his last on %edruitsclay evening.
at about a quarter after seven o'clock, at hjs country residence,
Nr. Hansard was in his 61st year.