The Sun.
London, England, 1841-05-11 00:00:00

ADJOURNED DEBATE.

On the Order of the Day for resuming the debate ad-
journed from Friday last being read,
Mr. EWART rose and said that this question was
looked upon by some as a subject of party struggle, and
that the measures introduced by her Majesty's Govern-
ment were attributed, not to financial considerations,
but to political motives. For his part, however, he felt
that the people of this country would not enter into such
questions, but that they would judge of the measures upon
their own merits. They would merely ask whether the
measures were conducive or not to the prosperity of
the country ; he was sure, at least, that that was the only
consideration which would have any weight in that great
commercial district, which extended from Lancashire
to Yorkshire. lie believed that the alteratiolls
_ _ _

contemplated by the Government would be gladly hailed
by the manufacturers of thin digtriet of the empire,
and 414 they wQIII4 nut attend to any insinuations as to
the motives of Ministers which might emanate from,
the other side of the House. They would also inquire
by what means Hon. Gentlemen would nieet the defi-
ciency in the revenue, wlikh they Wem the first to reprobate.
He should like to know what they had to substitute for
the measure before the House. Were they prepared to
substite for it a tax upon property ? If not, he should
like to know how they proposed to pay the interest on
our enormous tinlft, Ar tO satisfy the commercial wants
of the country ? The country expected to hear from
theni, or from their leader, some statement of the mea-
sures by which they were prepared to meet the emer-
gency, and to protect din entry in a crisis they had
so vividly elescrlhed, There was one circumstance in the
course of the debate, which Hon. Members ho not
adverted to, namely, that the Government had drawn a
clear distinction between sugitr, the prOduetion of slave
by free labour, having
htbonr, nna-thert... prOdnoefl imposed
upon th former a duty. of 425., but on the latter a duty
of only'36s. It was right to call the attention of the
country to this omission. He (Mr, Ewart) had had
the honour, with the ITon, Mehiher ibr Beverley, to
god up,through many long debate, against the sys-
tem
of rest India monopoly, and in claiming the right of
equal duties for the continent of India. Silitle that
period a change had come over the N. 11114 of his Hon.
Friend, who wits 119 W till liftifoit supporter of the mono-
polising ppoposition of the Noble Lord (Lord Sandon).
TheYhad been assailed from the beginning of this debate
with the constant cry of "protection,"—a cry, ish opi-
nion, utterly at variance with the ißte.re.sts df the public,
and which tlught nitt tp he l's:ils:Rded to by a majority of
that thirty or forty years ago, a similar
eXelamatiqn was raised On the part of the West Aim:Han
interests, When it was proposed to, achuit tbreign cotton
into the illailtets fit great Tiritaint About the year 1784
Amerießn cqttpu almost unknown in this country
and 4 was tf, Singular fact that the custom-home Aers
of Liverpool refused to admit the first %To, of :cotton which
came from the United *ftt.t.is, ft:WA an idea th4t in that
country it c4ttki prcithlccd, }ad the attempt
whicli was then nuyie. succeeded, where woUld'lme beep,
that enlqsSal.fa.b*, the. cotton manufacture, at %ice the
wonder and the entry wo,Ticit? ire .93pealed to
then? in hchttif chi c9lAslttilep of this countrl O.

PRICE sd.

extend to sugar. the same principle which, fortu-
nately for the interests of the country, had been applied
to cotton, in the assuiiince that as in the one case it was
for the interest of the country that the protection should
be withdrawn from cotton, it was for the interest of the
..e.guntry, equally in principle if not in degree, that it should
be withdrawn from sugar. The Noble Lord the Member
for Liverpool, and those who thought with him on this sub-
ject had asked for further protection. How long was it meant
that that protection should be extended ? He believed the
longer an approximation towards an equality of duties was
delayed the worse would it be for the interests of
the country. If they continued to foster and pamper
up these interests they would never be able to
endure a wholesome exposure to commercial freedom.
The longer they maintained those monopolies the
less monopolists would be able to meet a vigorous
opposition from commerce in other parts of the world.
Not only did the West India interests seek to
maintain their monopoly, but they were assailed
also on the part of the West India interest.
He earnestly hoped that as the commercial part of the
country at least was resisting the continuance of the
West Indian monopoly, that it would equally resist the
imposition of any monopoly, on the part of the East Indies
which, added to the other, would depress the commercial
energies of the country, in a manner that it would never
be able to get rid of. The arguments in favour of pro-
tecting duties were confined to three points-Ist, that the
imports would be sufficient for the demands of the
country, even continuing the present system of mono-
poly ; next, that the revenue proposed to be raised
by the Chancellor of the Exchequer would be insuf-
ficient ; and lastly, they endeavoured to show that the
price, under the existing system of protection, would be
sufficiently low to meet the wants of the consumer.
110,000 tons was the quantity of sugar that was expected
from the 'West Indies ; the West Indians themselves
I calculated it at 150,000 tons, but he had been informed,
upon good authority, that the former calculation was the
more correct one. In Demerara the falling off had been
I considerable, and from the Mauritius no more was to be
expected than last' year - - There was a large stock
on hand but that was easily accounted for by the
high price which sugar bore of late, which had decreased
the consumption. It was calculated that we would get
56,000 tons • from the East Indies, making a total of
194,000 tons, which was almost the exact quantity we im-
ported 12 years ago, although the population had increased,
according to the best calculatons,atleast 'l5 per cent.
He (Mr. Ewart) was anxious for the good, both of the
consumers and merchants, that the duty on sugar
should be reduced as low as possible. . He
was willing to advocate a reduction of the duty
on colonial sugar, and always said that he would give to
the colonists the advantages arising from three princi-
ples :—First, the reduction of the duty ; second, immi-
gration and its consequence, the means of obtaining free
labour ; and last and best of all, the advantages of
free competition. Great Britain ought to be the natural
entrepot for sugar, instead of letting it go to Hamburgh
and other towns on the Continent. Brazil was a country
of the most gigantic resources, which might be here-
after developed to the great and lasting advantage
of this country ; and he trusted that whatever might
be the result of the present debate, the time would come
when that fertile land would be opened to the people of
Great Britain. But he was aware that on the present occa-
sion they would have to encounter the interested op-
position, not only of the West Indian and East In-
dian bodies, but that they would also have to
struggle with the far more formidable phantom of
an anti-slavery opposition. He had always been
anxious, when the question of the sugar duties was be-
foie the House, to draw, if possible, some distinction fa-
vourable to free labour, and adverse to slave labour.
The most mature reflection, however, had convinced
him that such a distinction was impossible. He did not
believe that any nation could act on such a prin-
ciple— The international commerce of the world
should go on, whatever might be the nature of
individual opinions. A few parties might be
found who, from conscientious motives, would
refuse to use articles which were the produce
of a certain species of labour ; but such reasoning could
not be applied to nations. He also entertained the
firmest conviction that if free labour were admitted
into fair competition with slave labour it would,
vanquish it in any market in the world. He found it to
be the result of the inquiries of Mr. Gurney and Mr.
Baxter, that the slave-trade was not to be put down by
cannon or violence, but by commerce and civilization.
Even if we were to make the attempt to maintain freedom
and put down slavery by prohibitory duties, it was im-
possible that we should succeed. The sugars of Brazil
and Cuba would still find their way as an exchangeable
commodity to Hamburgh, and other Continental ports,
and the manufacturers must go t here for produce.

Knowing, therefore, that it was impossible by fiscal laws
to suppress slavery, he could not concur in the opinion
which had been expressed by the Hon. Member for
the Tower Hamlets. Commerce itself was the great
emancipator. He knew not by what means slavery had
been more effectually checked in all ages of the world.
Had we refused to admit American cotton into this
country, the effect Y'vciiildliave been to perpetuate slavery
in that part of the world. America, confined within her-
self, would have continued the system without a chatioa
of mitigation.—(Hear, hear.) But what had been
the effect of our commercial intercourse with that nation?
There was a strong anti-slavery confederacy rising up in
America, which was shaking that system to its foundation.
He thought the proposed reduction of the duties would
enable them to make: arrangements for the extinction of
slavery in the Brazils—he believed all the people of the
Brazils was ready to meet them on that point, if they
would only introduce a more liberal policy with regard
to articles the produce of the Brazils. His Right
Friend the Member for the Tower Hamlets, in his vigo-
rous declamation against slavery the other night, seemed
to forget the distresses of the poor of his own country.
In no part had that distress been more severely felt than
among the inhabitants of the Tower Hamlets. He ho-
neyed that associations had been formed in various parts
of the country to provide a substitute for sugar not only
for the dearness of its price, but on account of the in:ds.
tice and exclusive nature of the present protective system.
The privations caused by the present system fell exclu-
sively upon the poor, and his Right on, Friend the
Member for the Tower Hamlets left thorn uncared for in
his just declamation against slavery-. He (Mr. wart)
was as ardent an enemy to slavery as any me, even as
his Right Hon. Friend, but in his enthusiasm in that
cause he could not forget the claims of the poor c this
country. Surely if the duties were to be reds ced at all,
that was the time—when commerce was iepressed, and
did not show its usual elasticity in welng—when our
manufacturers were working 0n,,,h, half-time, and our
commercial towns languishing, and the poor suf-
fering great hardships. ear, hear.) The time
was come when some steps must be taken to re-invigorate
the declining commerce of the countv, The labouring
classes were suffering great privations, and that, too, at
a time when their habits had chaT.:ged materially for
the better. These high duties might have been retained
when they were consumers of spirits, but they were now
consumers of coffee and tea, Twenty-five years ago
there was no coffee-bAnse existing in London for the ex-
clusive purpose of §olling coffee, now there were 1,800.
In France the protective system had been partially
abandoned, with great benefit to that country. The
principles of i\ve trade were extending themselves all
over the world. He deeply felt, that, inl these great
commercial changes, Great Britain ought to take the
lead ; and, as we had been the first by our navi-
gation laws, passed under the iron reign of Crom-
well, to introdace the exclusive system into the
commeeelel world, so he trusted we should be the
first to hail the new era, and to enter upon the glorious
career which was opening btfore us. There was a Com-
mittee then sitting to cousider the subject of the ex-
portation of machinery, and he trusted that the result of
their labours would be to legalize such exportation.
Now, if we admitted a free competition in our exports,
we ought to adopt the same principle in our imports,
and assert the great doctrine of free trade generally. If
we valued our country, if we wished her to be hereafter
what she was at present, the first commercial country- in
the world, we should do so ; if we did not, we should fall
victims to 0, narrow, exclusive, isolated system which
had ruined the Dutch, and would ruin the English
afterwards. If, on the, contrary, we adopted the system
of free trade, we should maintain our right position at
the hea,d of the commercial nations of the world.
Mr. HEATHCOTE could not help thinking that the
scope of the debate would be but ill understood through-
out
the country, It appeared to him that there were
two debates going on at the same time. The
one intro-
441Qed by the Noble Lord the Secretary for the Colonies,
who had stated that he intended to propose a fixed duty
of Bs. on corn, and entered largely into the general sub-
ject ; and the other, introduced by his Noble Friend, the
Member tbr Liverpool, who had solely confined himself
to the defence of the sugar duties. In the observations
which he was about to offer to the House, he trusted he
might be permitted to say a few words on the larger and
more general.question. The Noble Lord the Secretary
tar. the Colonies had proposed this measure as the first
step in a new course on which he was about to enter, as the
first of a series of alterations affectieg our colonial, our agri-
cultural, and our commercial system. The three great
articles which he proposed to touch were corn, timber,
OM sugar. With regard to corn he had never known a
snore determined feeling 'bf opposition against any propo-
sition to exist throughout the country, than existed
against the proposition of the Noble Lord—it was par-
taken of by all ranks, and was entertained by men of
every political 11 opinion.—(Cheers.) Representing, he
did, an agricultural interest, he should think himself" un-
worthyt the position which he occupied, if at
once did not
once declare thathe would accept of no compromise.—
(Ch r 4 and counter cheers.) The agriculturists gene-
rally were determined to resist a fixed duty—(Cheers)fixed duty of
but when the Noble Lord talked of a Bs.,
he could not but think that the Noble
seriously mean
Lord was
_ta ing
of that which he could never for an instant
other night, had said
to propose. His Hon. Colleague tho
at all to such a protec-
that he would prefer having Ito duty 8
lath he
a duty of s., t thought
tion as would he armed by
his Hon; Oolkagne might be quite assured that he would
Wes-. have to make his choice of such sad alternatives,
chance of the position
ever. there was not the sligbtest
ever. being carriect.--(Yheerso. , Then with regard to
1.0.,44Q, it was utterly impossible that such a duty upon
ecru could ever realize the expectations of the Chancellor
4 the Exchequer, If a scarcity happened, with the
country, as it anal necessarily- be, dependent upon fo-
reian nations for a supply it 'would b impossible that
444. A (nAt7 could be maintained act that the country