The Sun.
London, England, 1847-02-16 00:00:00

THE SUN

in accordance with the general intention of the Government
system. The measure of the Government would alleviate, or
attempt to alleviate, the immediate distress. The Noble Lord
indicated means by which future renovation might be secured.
I The measures of the Noble Lord were such as would se-
-1 cure that employment desirable in early states of that
future renovation. All that was brought forward was projected
as a means of giving immediate employment to the people of
Ireland, but which at the same time was to a twofold effect—
, to give a new character to the country, and so as to change
the very complexion of that long-deserted and unhappy land
by results similar to those which had recently occurred—from
the evils under which she was then suffering. He would not
dilate for a moment on the character of the proposition which
the Noble Lord adverted to, and which proposed to itself two
objects, and principally because it was the most regarded,
although scarcely the most important consideration, he confined
himself to its power of employing the people of Ireland. His
Noble Friend had made a statement from data which he gave
without reserve to the House, and by which he calculated that
110,000 able-bodied labourers would be occupied under his
scheme, and who would represent a population ex-
ceeding 500,000 persons. Although it was not em-
ployment which could cure the evils of Ireland,
he was sure that there was no gentleman present but would
acknowledge that if they could secure such employment it
must be the means of alleviating the present pressure upon the
resources of this country. The proposition of his Noble Friend
had been met—he would not say by an able—but by an ex-
tremely z •alous opposition. He did net mean to say that in an
offensive sense, for he was quite sure that Hon. Gentlemen
who made the opposition had made the best of their means in
doing so. The objection stated by the Hon. Member
of the Government who first rose on this subject was a critical
objection, founded upon the back of this Bill. He found that
the Bill was introduced, not by the Hon. Member for Stern-
ford, but it was also introduced by the Hon. Member for
Sunderland, greatly interested in railways, and also by the Hon. ,
Member for Westmoreland, who was known to be one of the
greatest manufacturers of iron in England. It was the first
objection raised by the Chancellor of the Exchequer against
the present proposal. He was perfectly willing to admit that the
Chancellor of the Exchequer did not for a moment impute, even by
reference, any corrupt motive to his Noble Friend. There
were few gentlemen present who would dispute his proposi-
tion. They all knew the fascination of an engrossing pursuit—
it did give a tone to the judgment, and it was not impossible
that men so interested would view the general affairs of the
world through the coloured prism, their usual acts. He was
not disposed to deny that his Hon. Friends the Members for Sun-
derland and Westmoreland might have viewed the circumstances
place I under their consideration with feelings resulting from one
engrossing idea. Still he must reply that it was not merely
creators of railways and manufacturers of iron, who had fol-
lowed the principle, for he found that three Chancellors of the
Exchequer rose each after the other, so that he was disposed
to view their financial opposition as arising from the same
feeling. The Hon. Member for Portsmouth who came for-
ward on this occasion in a gallant spirit, which all the sympa-
thetic reminiscences of official life could not step, and said
that the Member for Newark had made a decla-
matory speech, but no reply to the unanswerable
statement of the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
If no answer had been given, they had adduced no proof
is the first instance. There had been many alterations made
by the Chancellor r f the Exchequer with regard to railways.
He was surprised that it should be so, but he was more sur•
prised that the Chancellor of the Exchequer should have an •
other Chancellor of the Exchequer ready to be his bail arid
guarantee, and to tell the House that his speech was unan-
swerable. He would then detail the expenditure to the
House, and he would give an analysis of the expenses of the
several railways, and this he thought would decide the
question ; and he thought still further, that as to the accuracy of
this question, it was a bona fide report to those
who were interested in railways, and he was sure that the
House would believe this. Now he would take a dear line and
cheap one. He would take the instance of the Belgian rail-
ways, on which he found that the total expenditure was
49,6501. per mile. He found that the total expenditure on
these lines was 2,1501. for engineering and all other difficulties,
while the cost for land was 6,5601., giving for the average
total expenditure a sum of 3,6501., and showing a return of
26 per cent. Thus, it appeared that out of .45,506/. fully
32,600/. were expended in labour, making a certain account
that fully 62 per cent. would be spent in labour. This was
the evidence of a dear line. Now he would take the evidence
afforded on a cheap line. The Grand Junction line cost
36,2001. per mile, and the expenditure on that for
labour appeared to be about 26 per cent., the whole
amount of money expended fur labour being 7,6001.
per mile, or about 26 per cent. Then, with regard to
the Belgian railways, it appeared that the total expenditure was
about 26,0001. per mile; that money, expended for labour, was
6,300/. per mile, again giving the result for 26 per cent. The
whole cost of these railways appeared to be, exclusive of
labour, 12,6001. per mile, an I that would again give a per
centage of 26 per cent.; and taking all the other expenses into
consideration, would give a per centage of 57 for the expen •
diture for labour, and inure than equal to the 20 per cent. pro-
posed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, who only estimated
the return at 25 per cent. He thought that if the 26 per cent.
proposed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer were to be fol-
lowed, that the only release should be provided by the railways
themselves ; and if this were to be done, the advance should
extend to 9,930/. per mile, giving for labour 2,200/. per mile.
He found that the average cost of labour was 40!. per mile,
and on the 1,500 miles of railway projected in Ireland, the
labour expended was 1,8101. per mile. According to the state-
. merit of his Noble Friend, the number of persons employed
was 765 per mile; and, therefore, it was, that it should be
kept in mind by the House, that those works were to be kept
as a matter of consideration. It had been stated by
the Right Hon. Gentleman the late Chancellor of the Ex-
cheuer, that sixty men were to be employed on each mile of
railway. but his Hon. Friend the Member for Newark had
evie.ently shown that upwards of 102 mew were necessary for
that work. By the returns which had been furnished at his
request, it appeared that from October, 1846, to Janaary, 1847,
as well as from the memorial of the Lord Mayor of Dublin,
upwards of 40,000 men had been employed on the public works.
He need not say after such a statement, that upwards of 320
men had been employed on these railways. Upwards of 320
miles kad already been completed, and more than 1,500 were
projected, on which upwards of 200 men per mile were em-
ployed. But by the 11.1ilway Gazette it appeared that works
were engaged for, for 8,600 miles, on which an arrangement was
made that 47 men per mile should be employed, and that would
give an average return of 383 men per mile. What then be-
, came of the assertion of the late Chancellor of the Exchequer,
1 that these lines could only pay 25 per cent., when it was evi-
-1 &rely shown that they could not only clear their own expenses,
but do much more hesu'es that. It was not to be supposed
that the navigators were without families, for if such a princi-
ple were to be acted upon, there would be neither justice nor
security, and they must, therefore, in all their legislation,
remember that each of these navigators had a family at home.
Not only was he of opinion that these 102 men would be em-
ployed upon the railroads of which I,ioo miles had already been
planned, but he looked upon it as a question to be decided by
the numbers to be called into requisition, and in this he in-
cluded not only navigators, but smiths and carriage-makers,
anti all the other artisans who benefited by railways, and who
would bring English capital into play. lie was aware that
this question had been put by his Noble Friend in a matter
affecting Ireland, but it should be recollected that this was a
matter which effected Irish railways and English capital con-
jointly, and from a letter which he had received from a friend,
it appeared that the distress was mainly to be relieved
through the application of English capital. He might
particularly specify the case of the Coleraine Railway.
In commencing these works he found the difficulty almost in-
supportable from the inexperience of the labourers in the con-
struction of them. He was, consequently, obliged to bring
over from England a few persons to instruct them, and now
the works were altogether under the direction of Irishmen,
who were fully capable of undertaking them. He had now a
thousand men employed, and if the Government sanctioned
further lines, he would be ready to employ from three to four
thousand more. There were some works on which it would be
the interest of the contractor to employ the highest priced '
labour, but such difficult works were almost wholly unknown
on Irish lines. He had one tunnel on the Coleraine and London-
derry Railway 1,000 yards in length, through solid basalt, and for
this work he was obliged to get labourers front England, but the
Irish labourers had grown so expert that the others had all re-
turned, with the exception of three individuals.—(Hear, hear.)
These labourers were earning 3s. a day, and several of them
had left him to undertake other works in the capacity of sub-
contractors. On the Enniskillen and Londonderry Railway
fifteen miles were completed, and forty-five yet remained to be
constructed, on which some thousands of Irish labourers might
be beneficially employed.—(Hear, hear.) English labourers
in Ireland were only engaged on the average of 2i per cent.
This statement was fully borne out by Mr. Montgomery
Martin, than whom no one knew butter the
state of Ireland. The writer of this letter, Mr.
Samuel Henning, was one of the greatest contractors
in that country, and he (Mr. Disraeli) hoped that the House
would allow him to put the statement before them. It was a
sufficient answer to the so-called facts and shad my objections
heard trom the first, again from the second, and again from
the last Chancellor o the Exchequer. Mr. Henning also
i found that as more labourers were wanted, the peasantry came
even front Connaught, on the west coast, in search of work.
The farmer was benefited in an equal degree with the other
classes of society; in fact, it was the entire community that
this Bill proposed to benefit.—(Hear, hear.) If they
therefore on that side of the House could prove
that the measure would benefit the community, he
trusted the House would support it ; or if the Right Hon.
the Chancellor of the Exchequer and the Hon. Member who
supported him could prove that the Bill was adverse to the
interests of the country, he (Mr. Disraeli) was prepared to
vote against it.—( Hear, hear.) He thought the House would
agree with him that this document from Mr. Henning was well
worthy of its attention. He showed that the labour employed
was Irish labour ; he showed that the average was only as 2i
per cent. of foreign labour ; he told them that they might em-
ploy thousands more on these public works ; he told them that
in two or three weeks these men were capable of making tunnels,
and that when he wanted more labour they came from a dis-
tance to obtain it—from Connaught, on the western side of
the island. But he (Mr. Disraeli) was told that these navi-
gators were "gay Lotharios"—that they had come from Eng-
land, where they had left their wives at home. He had
shown, however, that they were Irishmen; and that they had
their wives along with them. He would read to the House
another document he had received that night. It was from a
gentleman well known to many of the Hon. Members around
him—he meant Sir Harvey Bruce. That gentleman, re-
marking, err the Chancellor of the Exchequer—it was a
continuation of the criticism on his unanswerable speech—
(Loud laughter)—said that he sat on the Coleraine
and Londonderry Relief Committee, and he found that the
works going on in that district had greatly relieved the
pressure upon them. He stated that many of the labourers
upon the railways had wives, with families of from eight to
twelve children—( Laughter)—and it was considered a very
small family which did not number more than from three to
four. The labour was cheap, and the land, in many cases,
could be had for 6001. a mile. There was new data for the
Right Hon. the Chancellor of the Exchequer, if he wished
to ascertain the proportion paid for labour to that for land.
—(lf:ar, hear.) The Right Hon. Gentleman said that none
but unskilled labourers were employed on railways, but the fact
had been proved to be otherwise. It was said also that moneys
hail already been advanced to widen the streets of a certain
corrupt corporation ; why what was it to them if that money
had never been returned? He had rio doubt that the Govern -
ment of that day had had the support of two .Members from
that very corporation. Let the Government meet them with
facts and correct data, and let those decide on the merits.
Let them not talk to him about the broad streets of Cork,
while they were considering the broad guage of Ireland. It
had b.-en said that the measure of his , Noble Friend would
only make the half of Ireland rich.—(Hear, hear. ) Why,
did any Government who were ever in officer or
did those who were now in oilice ever propose a measure cal-
culated to make one-half of Ireland rich: If the Noble Lord
had succeeded in doing so much, he thought that he had really
done enough for one session.—( Cheers. ) Multifarious as had
beentt the
objection: offered to the measure, it would be found
was . they
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,1 Chancellors of the E xchequer. The first, the
of labour. That objection be
Exchequer,i said, that under the opera-
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the
eo commensurate employment
objec-
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i disposed of. Another objec-
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those objections had been disposed of ; he 1