The Sun.
London, England, 1840-03-03 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT

HOUSE OF LORDS, MARCH 2.
The Lords met at. Five o Clock.
The Duke of We llingt o so afterwards came into
the House, for the first time since his illness ; and was
cordially welcomed by Lords Ellenborough, Ashburton,
Aberdeen, and Ripon, who were evidently surprised to
see him. They were the only Peers in the House at
the time, except Lords Londonderry and Monteagle.
He seemed in excellent spirits, although somewhat
feeble and reduced. After he had taken his seat, al-
most every Peer (especially Conservative), on coming
into the House, walked over to the Duke and shook
bands with him. To Lord Aberdeen he remarked,
laughing, " Well, we have had Bergara
CHURCH DISCIPLINE.
The Bishop of EXETER presented numerous peti-
tions from the Clergy of Ilehester, Barnstaple, Exeter,
Penryn, and several Deaneries in Chester and Corn-
wall, praying that in any measure which the House
might pass for an alteration of Church Discipline, the
jurisdiction of the Church should not be impaired. He
was happy to say, that in a recent conference of
the Bishops upon this subject, an understanding
had been come to without a compromise of prin-
ciple on the part of any one, which would enable them
to lay before both Houses of Parliament a Bill which
he hoped would give satisfaction to all parties. He was
sincerely rejoiced to be able to make that statement.
The Bishop of LONDON confirmed what had fallen
from the Right Rev. Prelate, and also expressed his
hope that the measure in which the Bishops concurred
would prove satisfactory.
CHURCH PATRONAGE IN SCOTLAND.
The Bishop of LONDON presented a petition, com-
plaining of the state of the law relating to Church pa-
tronage in Scotland, and the dissensions and will
which prevailed upon this subject. He hoped to
be able shortly to submit to the Noble Viscount
at the head of her Majesty's Government a measure
relating to Church patronage in England and Scotland,
which satisfied the moderate on both sides.
The Duke of RICHMOND presented petitions from
twenty-five parishes in Scotland on the same subject.
He could confirm the statements of the Reverend
Prelate as to the extent and intensity of ill-will
which prevailed on this subject, and he begged
to ask the Noble Viscount (Melbourne) whether it
was the intention of her Majesty's Government to adopt
any measure speedily for reconciling the grievances.
He had also to present a petition from Rothsay,
which was the only one he had received, com-
plaining of the conduct of the General As-
sembly in suspending Ministers for obeying the civil law.
Lord MELBOURNE could not say, as the Noble
Duke wished him to say, that he would immediately
introduce into Parliament a measure to remedy those
grievances. But he would say that the Govern-
ment were as much aware as the Noble Duke
of the great extent . of which grew out
of these questions, and the whole subject should have
their immediate and most serious attention.
The Marquis of LONDONDERRY gave notice
that be would postpone to a future day the question
which he had previously given notice that he would,
to-morrow, ask of the Noble Viscount at the head of' her
Majesty's Government.—( A laugh.)
The Earl of ROSSE presented petitions from Perth,
Angus, Dundee, and various other places, praying for
the total repeal of tine Corn-laws.
The Eine of HADDINGTON had understood his
Noble Friend on the cross bench to say that the 25
petitions were complaining of the conduct of the Ge-
neral Assembly. In conclusion, the Noble Duke said
the last one only was against it.. He understood him
so, and perhaps others did ; it was as well, therefore, to
give him an opportunity for explanation.
The Duke of RICHMOND—If he did not say so,
he intended to say that the 25 petitions were against
Non-intrusion.—( Laughter.) He begged pardon, in fa-
vour of that principle. While he was on his legs he
would take the opportunity of saying that he was happy
to hear that the matter was under consideration—
he hoped the people of Scotland would receive the
assurance in a kindly manner, and put an end to the
dreadful excitement which prevailed, otherwise it would
become most dangerous to the Church, and to every one
possessing property in that kingdom.
The Earl of HADDINGTON was quite sure that
the Noble Duke spoke correctly. The excitement
prevailing in Scotland was much to be deplored,
but it ought to be remembered that it was
produced by the conduct of the Commissioners of the
General Assembly, who had suspended a majority of a
whole Presbytery from all spiritual functions, because
they declared that they would obey the law as ex-
pounded by the Supreme Court. That excitement did
not arise from the interference of the Civil Court—that
Court did not at all interfere until it was
called upon to interpret and put the law as declared by
that House in force, and accordingly it had interdicted
any interference in the parshes of the seven clergymen.
Those unfortunate gentlemen had had their me-
fives and conduct grievously misrepresented—their
conduct had been loyal and peaceable, and were well
deserving of the sympathy, regard, and support of all
peaceable and well-thinking persons.
The Earl of MINTO hoped their Lordships would
see the propriety of abstaining from discussing the
question at the present moment. He thought
it would be better to wait until the measure was
proposed, and he trusted he was not too sanguine in
hoping that it would put an end to the excitement so
unhappily prevailing is Scotland. The Noble Earl
then presented petitions from Jedburgh and other places
in favour of the non-intrusion principle. Also petitions
from Jedburgh and Hawick, very numerously signed,
praying for the abolition of the Corn-laws.
The Earl of HADDINGTON entirely agreed with
the Noble Earl. He would be extremely sorry to enter
into the details of the measure, but he had an anxiety
to set the conduct of the seven clergymen in its proper
light.
The Earl of GALLOWAY said he believed Noble
Lords did not wish to say one word as to the merits of
the question, but that their anxiety arose from the
great tardiness of the Government in doing its duty.
The Earl of ROSSE thought it would be prema-
ture to introduce a measure on this important subject
at the present moment.
The Earl of ABERDEEN hoped that when the
subject was taken into consideration, it would be done
deliberately, as precipitation might be most injurious.
To show his unwillingness to enter into the subject at
all, he would not advert to the few words of his Noble
Friend, which, though short, he did not wholly agree
with. The Noble Earl then presented several petitions
from Scotland, to the same effect.

The Marquis of BUTE presented a number of simi-
milar petitions from Scotland.
The Marquis of NORM ANDBY brought up the
Report of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners for Ireland,
August 1, 1839.
The Earl of ZETL AND presented peitions from
Stonykirk, Stromness, and other placea, against the in-
trusion of ministers.
THE SULPHUR TRADE.
Lord LYNDHURST had been requested to pre-
sent a petition respecting the commercial relations of
that country with Sicily, and in particular as far as re-
garded the state of the sulphur trade carried on by
that country. It was signed by several merchants
of the city of London, and he had been apprised
that similar petitions had been forwarded by the
merchants of Liverpool and the city of Glasgow ;
but, from some accidental circumstance, he had
not yet received them. The subject was one of very
considerable importance in amount to the petitioners,
and it was also of considerable importance to the manu-
facturing concerns of that country. The Noble
Viscount two or three nights since bad stated
that he had reason to suppose that during the pre-
sent session many complaints would be made with
respect to the stare of their commerce.—(Cries
of " Hear, hear.") Whether their commerce was
sufficiently protected he would not at present in-
quire, but he begged to say that, so far as related to
these petitions, he presented them with no political or
party views, but solely from the desire of obtaining
compensation for the serious losses and injuries sus-
tained by them, as was detailed in the petition.
Their Lordships were no doubt aware, that in
consequence of modern discoveries in chemistry, the
article of sulphur had become one of great import-
ance in their manufactures, and in the course cf eleven
years, ending 1837, the importation had increased
eleven fold. In 1826 they imported into that
country only about 4,000 tons of sulphur, which
was employed principally in their manufactures,
and, in 1837, the importation had increased to the
enormous amount of 44,000 tons, and from that
their Lordships were aware of the increased im-
portance of the trade in that article. Their
Lordships must be also aware that the whole or nearly
the whole of the sulphur imported was from the Island
of Sicily. It was found in other places, but it was
found in such large quantities, and was so easily acces-
sible there, that almost the whole of their supply was
derived from that source. In 1816 a commercial treaty
was entered into between that country and Sicily, and
by the stipulations of that treaty it was provided that
ample protection should be afforded to British subjects
and commerce—that British subjects should without
let or hindrance be allowed to dispose of their property
—that in all respects they were to be treated as the
subjects of the most favoured country, and that no du-
ties, taxes, or imports, should be levied on their pro-
perty beyond those of the most favoured territory.
These were the stipulations of that well-known treaty,
and in consequence thereof, and on the faith of the re-
liance placed upon it, the merchants of that country em-
barked large property in it. They had taken a lease of
the mines—they had established machines at a large ex-
pense, thereby increasing the supply ; in fact, they had
created the trade and extended it, and up to the year
1838 it was carried on most advantageously and bene-
ficially to the parties immediately concerned, and
also most advantageously to the manufacturing
interest of England.—(Hear, hear.) In July,
/83q, it first, aunoulle,l rL,t, the. Sicilian Govor,-
meta hiul granted the mopornly of this most

article to the French, not to the French Government,
but to a number of adventurers. Their Lordships
would find that, by the terms of that contract, the sul-
phur did not at all belong to the Government, the mines
being the property of private individuals. They knew
enough of the manner in a hich transactions of that kind
took place, to be able to form some conjecture—some
apposite conjecture, perhaps—on the subject ; but the
advantage that was gained to the parties to whom lie
had referred, was enormous; for at that time they had
imported into France an immense amount of sulphur,
that was selling at a loss, and in consequence of this
prohibition the advance in the price increased enor-
mously, so as to render that which was before s loss to
the individuals, extremely advantageous to them, at
the expense of British interests. But there was
a direct infraction of that clause to which he
had referred, because by that treaty every Bri-
tish subject was allowed to dispose of his property
without any hindrance whatever. But this limitation
was suggested, as he understood, for -the general be-
nefit of the trade. That suggestion could trot be sup-
ported, for this reason, namely, that those persons who
were monopolists were not bound by the limitation,
for they might export any quantity which they thought
proper, provided only that one-third of the profit of
that part which exceeded the stipulated amount should
be paid over to the Sicilian Government. They had,
therefore, the power to pour into the market what
quantity they thought proper for their own interests,
sacrificing the interests of their competitors, and,
among others, the interests of the subjects of this coun-
try. That was not the only way in which the mono-
poly was a direct infringement of the treaty to which
he had referred. It was provided by the contract of
monopoly that no one in the limitation should sell any
sulphur except to the French contractors. There was
this alternative, however, that British subjects or others
might, if they thought proper, instead of selling to the
contractors limited by the contract, export for their
own benefit, and at their own instance. But the con-
tract in that respect had this term, that if they did so,
they must pay a duty, which duty amounted nearly to
the value of the first cost of the article, and to twice
the amount at which the monopolists had a right to ex-
port the articles, themselves. Here, therefore, was a
direct infringement of the treaty, in which it was
stipulated, in express terms, that British subjects,
with respect to their property, and taxes, and
imposts on importation, should be put in the same situa-
tion as the most favoured nation. It was a direct
infringement of the treaty to which he had referred.
But there was another circumstance of which the peti-
tioners also justly complained. In the course of trade
contracts had been entered into for the supply of sul-
phur at a future period. The monopoly was announced
on the Ist of July, to come into operation on the Ist of
August following, only one month after its commence-
ment, and the consequence was a great increase of
price ; and all those persons, therefore, who had entered
into contracts for the supply of the article at a certain
price, found the prices so advanced that, to fulfil them.
would involve them in ruin ; and the consequence was
that twenty-four British ships, which arrived for the
purpose of conveying sulphur to this country, returned
without their cargo. The sulphur trade, therefore,
which was of so much importance to Sicily and this
country, was put an end to. It was true that parties
still held their property ; the mines were still worked ;
hut, as he had told their Lordships, the trade was sub-
stantially at an end. The price of the article in the
English market was double what it was in 1837, and
the merchants of this country were reduced to all sorts
of expedients to obtain a substitute for the article at a
cheeper rate than the high price they were obliged
to pay the merchants of Sicily. As their Lordships would
suppose this had created a great outcry and remon-
strance on the part of the British merchants in Sicily,
and the Sicilians themselves, because it had the effect
of throwing an immense number of native labourers out
of employment, and he was told that the indignation
excited was so strong that if an English ship of war
had arrived off the coast during that period an end
would have been put to the monopoly. But that was
not the course the British Ministry thought right to
pursue ; they entered into negotiation, and a Mr.
*Gregor was appointed for that purpose, but had
been carrying on negotiations for the last eighteen
months without any practical result. The monopoly
still continued—the loss still continued—the trade still
stopped, and nothing effectual had been done to remove
these evils. Ho (Lord L.) understood that some
treaty was actually signed at the close oflast year. Why
it was not ratified he had no means of ascertaining,
but be was happy to see a Noble Friend in his place,
who was resident at Naples, during these negotiations,
and was then a Member of her Majesty's Government,
and would, no doubt, be able to give some satisfactory
explanation on the subject. The object of the peti-

tioners was to call attention to the subject. They
felt that they hal a right to protection, they had a
right to call upon her Majesty's Government that jus-
tice should be done, that they had a right to insist on
compensation for the injuries they had sustained, and
protection as to the future, and with that view, and

that alone, they had requested him to present the peti-
tion which should be now read.

Lord MELBOURNE said that the Noble Lord
who had addressed them had stated all the circum-
stances that had taken place—the amount of British
capital that had been employed, the obligations of the
treaty by which the Government of the Two Sicilies
were bound to this country, and the whole transaction.
There was some little exaggeration at the latter part of
his speech, but otherwise with pet feet justice, and with-
out the slightest non-statement or exaggeration. The
Noble Lord had said that he (Lord M.) on a former
occasion had stated he anticipated they should have
many discussions upon commercial subjects in the
course of the present Session—(Hear, hear)_
and that he supposed he did so from some consciousneis
that their interests would not be attended to, but it
was not fro.-n any shadowing apprehension of that na-
ture, but front the motions brought forward, the notices
on the books and the discussions of the two Houses of
Parliament on the subject, that would occasion the
feeling the Noble Lord had alluded to. The Noble and
Learned Lord had adverted to the influence by which
the sulphur monopoly had been established, and hail
done so so fully that it was quite unnecessary for him
to state it over again. He said we knew how those
things were carried on, and might guess the sort of in-
fluence by which it had been attained at Naples. This
monopoly was certainly granted to certain individuals
in France, but he believed by whatever favour it had
been obtained, it was not by the present Government
of France, not by any part of the French nation, this
monopoly had been established. He could only say in
the next place, that the views which the Noble
Lord had stated were those which were
always taken by the British Government
upon the subject, that it was not now a subject of trade
or negotiation, but a direct infraction of the treaty of
1816 and therefore a matter on which we had a right
to cad upon the Government of the Two Sicilies for the
fulfilment of the obligations into which they had en-
tered, and by which they were bound. That was the
view her Majesty's Government had always taken when
the subject was in agitation, and it had been strongly
remonstrated against by her Majesty's Minister at
Naples ; and in August last a verbal promise was given
that the monopoly should be abolished. It was said
that the monopoly would be done away with ; but it
was not so yet ; and it was left for the British Govern-
ment to demand the fulfilment of the treaty, in order
that they might be enabled to afford that protection
to our merchants, to which they were undoubtedly en-
titled. The Noble and Learned Lord said that they
had resorted to negociation ; that was not exactly correct.
In the summer it was understood that the Government
of Naples was favourable to the formation of flaw com-
mercial relations with this country. The basis of the
nogociation was to be an entire new modification of
their tariff. Mr. M'Gregor was sent out to ascertain
what was to be the new tariff—to settle with the Go-
vernment of Naples what was to be the reduction they
would make on their duties. That was the sole object
Mr. M'Gregor's mission. He did, however, go farther,
no doubt with the best intentions. He entered into a

treaty which was unsatisfactory to the Government,
and which they had not ratified. Mr. M'Gregor was
a man of the greatest talents and abilities, and acted
with the very best intentions ; but he did that which he
was not authorised to do, and in ignorance of the feel-
ing of his own Government he entered into that treaty.
It was absolutely necessary that strong measures should
be taken upon the subject. Remonstrances had already
been sent out to the Government of Naples, and they
had been told that the Government of this count!),
must insist upon the fulfilment of the treaty.
Lord LYNDHURST—Was the Noble Viscount
aware that eighteen months had elapsed since the
period of our merchants difficulties arose, and was he
aware that the loss amounted daily to the sum of 1,0001.
Surely it was a matter deserving the serious and imme-
diate attention of the Government?
Viscount MELBOURNE—Certainly ; and it will
receive it. They had already the promise from he
Neapolitan Government, and it remained for them to
enforce it.
Lord LYNDHURST—Was the Noble Viscount
aware that the Neapolitan Government insisted upon
the maintenance of this monopoly for six months longer,
dated from the 31st of Jan. last ?
Viscount MELBOURNE had not heard of it.
Lord LYNDHURST—There were six line-of-
battle ships lying at Malta. If they were sent to Naples
the matter would be settled in a fortnight.
Earl FITZWILLIAM presented a petition from a
congregation of Dissenters in Yorkshire, praying for the
abolition of Church-rates, and the release of John

Thorogoed.
The House then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, 2.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at five minutes be-
fore three o'clock.
Mr. HINDLEY presented apetition from Glasgow
against the Glasgow and Ayr Railway Bill.
Lord STAN LEY brought Ur, the Report of the
Comrnitte,.; on tLc :Borth Unicn: Railmr;
On motion, of. Mr. HAN DLE':