The Sun.
London, England, 1840-02-20 00:00:00

considered too great a period, and it was then recom-
mended that it should be limited to zix months. A Com-
mittee bad accordingly been appointed to decide whether
twelve or six months was the period to which the patents in
question should bo confined. The Hon. and Learned
Gentleman proposed,on the contrary, to extend the copyright
to sixty years after the author's death, which it might
often make that right 100 years in all. Poor mechanics,
however, were not so liberally treated, because there
were authors in the House, and because authors were
respected. He bad called this on a former occasion an
author's Bill, and he would call it so still. He would
prove that a different measure of justice was to be meted
out by the Hon. Gentleman in his own case and in the case of
mechanical inventions. On the grounds of public expediency
he was willing to give a patent of a very limite
period to mechanical inventions, but when he came to his
cwn trade, public expediency was to be excluded altogether,
end the House was only to look to the indefeasable rights
of authors. He knew not in what terms to characte:ise
such a proceeding. He did not think in addition, that
the matter could for a momeet be fairly discussed, and
he was surprised at the very small attendance of Hon.
Members on the occasion. Where, he would ask, was
the Treasury bench ?—( Hear, hear.) It was there, but
where were the Members who usually sat on it ?—( Hear,
here.) Ilia, he would repeat, gave him much surprise.
In what terms had the Whigs in former days characte.
rised Bills similar to the present? The House would re-
member that in the year 1784, when the famous case of
Donaldson came before the House of Lords, it had been
decided that no common law rights existed in literary
works, it had been decided that authors did not possess
by common law the right which they then claimed. A
Bill had been then introduced to the House, of a nature
similar to the present, and in the debate, in which
many Members of great distinction had taken a part, Mr.
Burke had advocated one side of the question, and Mr. Fox
the other. Mr. Fox then said that he could not allow a
Bill so injurious and pernicious, and so flagrant, to pass
in any of its stages without giving his vote against it;
and his name is accordingly to be found among those who
bad given every opposition to the passing of the Bill. It
would be easy to make alterations in the copyright law, by
proposing an extension of the copyright ; but if they ex-
tended it in the manner proposed by the Hon. and Learned
Gentleman, they should observe that they would thereby
have taken a step which, however prejudicial the Bill
might be found, it would be impossible for them to redress,
and the injury which would thus he done, both to the pub-
lic and authors themselves, would be irremediable. The
Hon. and Learned Gentleman would throw a great part
of our literature into law, and net a day would elapse,
if his Bill were passed, in which they would not hear of
actions for the purpose of deciding a disputed copyright.
They would have authors claiming a right to works
which bad long been out of their hands, and which bad
been repeatedly published since then. He therefore
thought that, even for the interests of authors themselves,
the Bill should not be allowed to become law. The Bill,
he believed, would merely be an advantage to publishers,
who would thus renew the monopoly which they possessed
in former times. He found that ha the last century the
exclusive sale of particular books was de:riled by certain
booksellers ; and thst, by an arrangement among the
trade, country publishers who printed the same works were
subject to prosecutions without end. He found that the
publication of such works as " The Whole Duty of Man,"
and Bunyan's " Pilgrim's Progress," had been usurped by
a few. He did not wish to see such a state of things re-
turn, and he would consequently give every oppcsition in
his power to the Bill. He felt, however, that the question
could not fairly be discussed with such a House as he had
then to address, while there was not, perhaps,
sixty Members present in all. He did not know
a Bill of greater importance than that under
their consideration, and he thought that it should
be brought on before a larger House than he then
saw assembled. He did not wish to oppose the Bill by
any of those proceedings which he had recourse to on
former occasions, if the matter should be fully discussed ;
but with a House such as the present, he thought himself
justified in offering the measure all the opposition which he
could. He did not say that for the purpose of intimidating
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, but in order to inform
him of the course wjaich he intended to pursue. He
would move as an ameßment, that the Bill be read that
day six months.
Lord MA HON said that he did not think the Hon.
Member for Bridport could conceive that the present state
of the House was fairly to be imputed as an objection either
to the promoters of the Bill, or to the Bill itself. They
had found it necessary to choose that time for the dis-
cussion of the measure, as other nights were occu-
pied by Government, and the measures they brought
forward.—( Hear, hear.) As it was, he did not see
how the promoters of the Bill could have followed a dif-
ferent course from that which they had taken. He
would pass to the discussion of the question. The Hon.
Member for Bridport had said more than once that the
Bill was an author's Bill, and he believed the Hon. Mem-
ber had added that it had been devised without any refer-
ence to the public interest. Now, he could not allow that
insinuation, and, for his part, he was not ashamed of the
interest which be took in the questiou.—( Hear, hear.)
He found himself born to a competent inheritance, and he
found at the same time with pain that others, who were
far superior to him in merit, industry, ai,d reputation, but
below him in the accidental gifts of fortune—he found
men. who wc.ro an hon..r to the country, subject to
wants and privations which men of such merit ought ne-
ver to have had reason to expect. The object was to give
these men full scope for their talents, and to enable them
to obtain that competency which he and others possessed,
without any effort on their part.—( Hear, hear, hear.)
Was that a course which they were to be reproached with ?
If the Hon. Member thought that it was merely an
author's Bill which they were supporting, he was very
much mistaken, and he (Lord Mahon) could point out
to him many booksellers, for instance, who were not
merely favourable to the Bill, but who had petitioned for
its passing. There was one petition of that nature to which
he wished to call the attention of the House. It was from
Mr. John Smith, of Glasgow, who had stated that he had
for thirty years exercised the profession of a publisher in
Glasgow, and that he had by that means made for himself
a competent fortune, while the authors who had produced
those works which had enriched him, had no longer any
interest in their own books. The petition went on to say
that lie was decidedly of opinion that the cultivation of na-
tional literature would be strengthened and improved by
the proposed extension of copyrights. He had quoted that
petition for the purpose of showing the Hon. Member that
it was not authors alone who were interested in the pass-
ing of the present Bill. He would examine the
question, however, on higher grounds. In looking
at the past ages of our literature he found that many
eminent men of whom the country justly beasts, bad re.
ceived far too small remuneretion for their labours, and he
thought that they should now try to remedy that evil. He
would take the instance of Dryden, and he would ask if
it were not painful to find him stating in his old age that
he had early planned a great national poem, but that ho
had been obliged to relinquish the undertaking in conse-
quence of his daily efforts for his bread, and that he had
been obliged to write, in preference, for the amusement of
a licentious Court. Again he wa.uld ask if there were
any Englishman who did not feel proud of belonging to
the country of him who bad produced " Paradise Lost"
—who would not forget the errors of his politics
when they reflected on that mighty genius which had
enabled him to ascend to the heaven of heavens ? But
how had his country rewarded that immortal poet ? He
(Lord Mahon) found in the life of Milton, by Dr. Johnson,
that the last descendant of the poet had kept a grocer's or
chandler's shop, and that when in the year 1750 " Comus"
was played for her benefit, she was so much a stranger to
public amusement that she did not know what a benefit
was. Dr. Johnson added, that the sum then collected
was the largest benefaction that the writings of
the author of Paradise Lost had ever produced
to his descendants.—( Hear.) Were they not entitled
to judge of the past by the future? And if the birth of
such a genius were not impossible, were they not bound to
provide for him a better fate ? Their object was that some
future Milton might not be " mute or inglorious;'' but
that he might be animated by the cheering prospect that
his children after him would reap the fruit of his labours.
Was Mr. Arkwright, the inventor of that machinery which
had conferred such benefit on his country, told that he
should look to fame alone for his reward ? Or trap Marl-
borough, returning victorious from the field of Blenheim,
compensated alone by glory ? Should not those who
benefited literature have some public encouragement and
reward? Yet all that was asked for authow was that they
might have back their own?—( Hear, hear)--that they
might have again what their own heads had conceived, and
their own right hands had written.—( Hear, hear.) It
was said that the Bill would increase the price of books.
Was that the effect of copyright ?—(" Hear," from some
Members.) He did not think that was so.—( Oh, oh.)
He knew works cheaper in this country with copyright
than they were published in a country without copyright.—
( Hear.) Moreover, he laid down this position, that it was
quite possible works would be cheaper to the public with
than without copyright. Let it be recollected that he
could only be speaking of highly popular works; none
others would be affected by this Bill.—( Hear, hear, hear.)
A publisher having the whole property in a work would
be able to supply all the illustrations, all the
addenda, &c., for every edition, instead of being
forced to supply them separately for each. Would any
person, fired with admiration by the rich strains of some
second Milton, or some modern Shakspeare, grudge the
additional shilling or sixpence, resulting from the copy-
right being extended, provided he knew thereby the heirs
of those illustrious writers would be benefited ?---(Hear,
hear, hear.) Therefore, in works not of established cha-
racter, the price would not be enhanced, the Bill not ap-
plying. And in books of the highest stamp the readers
would never object to paying a little more for their copies,
to benefit the heirs of authors who bad achieved a death-

'
less fame.—( Cheers.) Again, to elevate the public tastelnch every Legislature
was a noble object, and one which
should sedulously encourage.—( Hear, hear.) Autkors
should be encouraged to look to higher tribunals--to aspire
to greater approvals than those of the mere passing feel-
ings of the day,--( Hear hear.) The course of foreign
legislation had been decidedly in favour of this Bill, and
that was no little presumption on its behalf. In Denmark
the copyright was perpetual; in Russia, twenty-five years
after the author's decease, and ten years more if the work
existed till then. Then in " Liberal" Spain—( Hear
hear, hear, and a laugh).—the law was uncertain,

but the opinion of the best authorities there Was
in favour of the perpetual copyright. So in
Prussia, Austria, and ot2ser parts of Germany the
copyright was fur a long periedi after the author's death.
In France, likewise, the Code Nspoleon gave a copyright
of 20 or 30 }cars after the author's death. All this might
be taken as indicating a strong current of public feeling
in favour of such a measure as this. Seldom had the
Ilcuse the opportunity of doing such an act of grace and
generosity ; for often had they to object, to curtail, to
condemn. Yet was the act of generosity in this case no
less, indeed, of justice. Many would wait most anxiously
the decision of this night—authors who had written works
which would confer honour on their country, yet scarcely
now appreciated, and which, without this Bill, would
confer no benefit on their heirs. Ay, among the hills of
Cumberland would the decision of the House be eagerly
looked for.--( Cheers ) Why should he not mention the
illustrious names of Wordsworth and Southey—( Cheers)_.
writers unhappily not quite independent in circumstances
as in mind ?—( Cheers.) On these grounds—on large,
on liberal, on public grounds, for the enc..uragement of ii-
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Mr. STRUTT said, in common fairness he must say
the Learned .‘ ember for Reading could not be charged
with the thin attendance in the House.—(Hear.) But
the Noble Lord was himself unfair in seeming to imply
that the opposers of the Bill objected to all copyright. He
would observe that property itself was but the creature of
law—( Hear, hear)--founded on!public policy, and it there-
fore lay on the Learned Member to show that the pro-
perty he wished to establish was attended with such regu-
lations and results as would conduce to public benefit.—
( Hear, hear.) Ho denied the existence of any analogy
between this question of copyright and that of property.
They asked for more than their property, and it appeared
to him they were justified in doing so in certain cases;
they asked diet persons should be prevented copying their
property. The Noble Lord said authors were unjustly
treated as compared with other classes of inventors. Was
the Noble Lord aware that at present inventors only had
their rights secured to them fur fourteen years ? But the
Noble Lord went a step further—he stated it was not the
effect of copyright to make works of merit dear, but to
make works of this kind cheaper rather than otherwise. In
this respect the Noble Lord differed from those who had
gone before him. He had understood from Adam Smith
that the effect of monopoly was to make things dear; if
this argument were correct the whole commercial legisla-
tion of the country was founded in error. The Noble Lord
assumed that if there were no monopoly the publisher would
be contented with the lowest possible scale of profit, but
he thought he had good grounds for dissenting from this
opinion.—( The Honourable Gentleman then quoted
the prices of various standard works during copyright
and afterwards, as disproving this assumption.)
He should be happy if the question could be submitted to
a Committee, that it might be determined how the law of
copyright might be altered, not for the sole benefit cf
authors, but that of the public at large. He thought the
Bill was founded on erroneous principles, and should
therefore, second the amendment.
Sir R. H. INGLIS said the Hon. Member admitted
that some alteration should be made in the law of copy-
right. He thought the subject had not attracted the at-
tention it deserved. He rejoiced the Hon. Member for
Bridport had not availed himself of the state of the House
to defeat the Bill. It was some argument in its favour
that on previous occasions the second reading had been
sanctioned by large and increasing majorities. Whatever
was the influence of fame on the " clear spirits" who
wrote for it, ho thought it was an unfair ar-
gument to be thrown at them by those who
were benefited by their labours. On the general
principle that those who had most contributed to the lite-
rary glory of their country were themselves least benefit-
ed by it, he contended they ought not to be deprived of
permanent benefit in their works. If it was not univer-
sally admitted that the law required alteration, it was at
least so admitted that the subject deserved inquiry ; but if
they were agreed upon the principle, but differed in the
degree to which it could be extended, be could not see
why they should not as well discuss that before the House
as in Committee. The aiguments of the Hon. Member
for Bridport were that the Bill should be a reader's Bill.
He thought it should not be exclusively an author's or a
reader's Bill, bat one in which their interests were united,
and thinking the present Bill to be such, he earnestly en.
treated the House to support it.
Mr. WA KLE Y considered that the present state of
the House must convince the Hon. and Learned Member
for Reading that the present Bill did not meet the wishes
of the House. He was sure that Hon. Members would
not fail to have been present to hear the Hon. and
Learned Member's feeling address, if they were not satis-
fied, that, with all his eloquence and all his feeling, be
had failed to show any ground whatever why the House
should interfere to alter the existing law with respect to
Copyright He ( Mr. Wakley) for one, was most anxious,
if anything was done upon this subject, that the matter
should be referred to a Select Committee ; and if the
Hon. and Learned Member would consent to the adoption
of that course he would refrain from offering any further
opposition to the proceeding with the Bill. The Hon.
and Learned Member might not be enabled by his pro-
fessional avocations to attend that Commit.ee, but he
could assure him that he would find a vast number of zea-
lous friends who would be most happy to perform that
duty for him. If the Hen. and Learned Member would
agree to that course, not only would he (Mr. Wakley)
waive all further opposition to the Bill, but he would con-
sent that he should name half the Members of that Corn-
mittee.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member was silent,
and therefore he (Mr. Wakley) must suppose that ho
would not consent to the adoption of his pro-
position, and he would therefore now proceed to
address himself to the subject of the Bill. He thought
it was not fair to come forward and try to legislate on a
question like the present, without any inquiry. The
House was proceeding to legislate without facts, and upon
merely the eloquent and learned statements of the Hon.
Member for Reading. He (Mr. W.) doubted very much
from the statements of some of the Hon. Members whether
they had made themselves acquainted with the facts of the
Bill. The measure of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
affected to a most oatraordinary extent the trade of print-
ing and publishing in this country, and if it did not he
(Mr. Wakley) must ask for what purpose it was intro-
duced ?—( Hear, hear, hear.) It had been assumed
by the Hon. Baronet and by the Noble Lord that the Bill,
if carried into law, might benefit authors of a certain
class. How was that proved? Had a single fact been
adduced to favour such an allegation ? The Noble Lord
had referred to authors of past times—to Milton, Dryden,
and others. Why, at the time that Milton wrote, it was
presumed that copyright was perpetual. What did that
poet get for his splendid work " Paradise Lost ?" The
statements as to the sums were various—some said five,
others fifteen pounds. Could Hon. Gentlemen fail to
perceive the benefits authors themselves derived from the
art of printing. Was it fair, then, that authors should
have protection, while those who carried on the art of
printing had not. No one appreciated the motives of the Hon.
and Learned Member for Reading more than he did, and
with more feeling. He besought the Hon. Member to rely
as to the course he should adopt, upon the evidence that
might be brought before a Select Committee, rather than
upon those whose feelings might be carried away by his
eloquence. He felt sure that the opposition of his Hon.
Friend, the Member for Bridport, was founded upon his
sense of public duty—(Hear, hear)—and that if he could
be convinced that the measure was beneficial for the public,
he would at once withdraw his opposition.—( Hear, hear.)
If the Hon. and Learned Member for Reading did not ac-
cede to the appointment of a Select Committee, the
result would be that they would go on struggling
for two months, and then the Nojle Lord, the
Member for Stroud, who was not now present, would
come down and say it was a question of great
importance ; that he doubted very much whether they
ought to proceed to another stage ; that he lamented that
a Select Committee had not been appointed; then the
Hon. Baronet, the Member for Tarn worth, would get up
and agree with him that then there would be an end of the
measure. In conclusion, he trusted that the Hon. and
Learned Member would agree to the appointment of a
Select Committee.

Mr. E WART did not consider this a question between
authors and readers—he looked upon it as a public ques-
tion, and therefore one in which the interests of the public)
alone should be the basis of their legislation.—(Hear. )
It appeared to him that the Bill of the Hon. and Learned
Sergeant would be a very unfair mode of legislation, and
unless he saw bis way clearer than he did at present, be
would not consent to on alteration of the existing law.
He did not think the Hun. and Learned Geutleman
would deal justly either with the House or with his Bill, if
he refused to con.ent to the proposition that had been
made for referring the subject to a Select Committee.

- - --- ---
Mr. CHARLES BULLER felt— great difficulty in
coming to a decision on which side be should give hls
vote; but he had come to the conclusion that he ought to
vote for the second reading of the Bill, on this
simple ground that, balanced as his opinions
were, and thinking the House required information on the
subject, he was on the whole inclined to let the Bill go on
in order that a fuller discussion might take place upon it.
The great objection that had been made to the Bill was,
that making the copyright perpetual wou'd increase the
price of books. He could not agree to that at all. The
Hen. Gentleman near him (Mr. Warburton) had referred
to the price of wcrks before the expiration of the copyright
and after, but other circumstances might have led to that
reduction. It was to be remembered that a very
great change had taken place in the mode of
publication. He was ready to admit that a man who had
property did not always use it wisely. The copyright of
Gibbnn's " Risp and Decline of the Roman Empire," for
instance, might have fallen into the hands of some scrupu-
lous man, who might hare thought it his duty to suppress
it. He did not think, however, the Bill of his Hon. and
Learned Friend would secure the object he had in view.
He (Mr. Buller) acknowledged it was a distressing thing
to see the descendant of Milton in a low and ignoble si.
tuation, but then the Hon. and Learned Gentleman ought,
by his Bill, not only to create the copyright, but to entail
it.—(Hear, hear.) In nine cases out of ten, the book-
seller would buy the copyright out and out.—( Hear.)
He had stated that he would vote for the second reading
of the Bill; when he had any doubts he thought it his
duty to promote discussion. But, at the same time, he
thought the suggestion thrown out from that side of the