The Sun.
London, England, 1815-02-21 00:00:00

363,0001.
Tat hon the horses of plea-
re' jor he should refrain from taxing those for
•)(1' sbandry, would bring at the rate of SO per
tteut• about 632,5001. The new duty on the
`rcide or horses would only be 40 per cent. and
'N al(' Produce 85,5001. That on Dogs, at 30 per
,e"1-. would 'yield 105,5f/01. and that on Game
Certificates, Batchelors had hitherto.
I•4id an additional duty on Servants only ; they
should now pay an increase, of '5O per cent. both
°n Servants arid Carriages and Horses. The pro-
',lice of this tax was expected to amount to
'20,0001. and the total of the new Assessed Taxes
1° 2,500,0001. He should now proceed to the
4'hlitions he intended to make to the War Taxes
Ivi'ich were to be retained. He should propose
'1.4 additional duty on Tobacco, on the ground
l
the peace with America would "necessarily
i,nder the price of that article very I°w.', and en-
:t L'le it to bear a fresh' duty of nearly 9d. in the 11.,
the rate of per pound pail to the Cus-
‘l;"`
1' and 6d. per pound paid to the Excise,
,ell would jointly produce 300,000/. The ex-
duties on wine should also experience an in-
:-rease of 20/. per tun, which would yield a reve-
"of 500,000 E annually. The next Tax would
L°lPerhaps, be unobjectionable. It might press
ward upon the persons whom it concerned, but it
ltl~s a°object which had scarcely experienced any
Ivcrease durin,, the whole of the late protracted
ky'lr: Re meant'". licenses on dealers under the
iscse• A duty. of 50 per cent. progressive upon
would produce 300,000/. It would err-
be unequal in its pressure, but by a re-
It ertce to the forty-third of the King, 1759,
'would be found that what he proposed was,
ti'°clerate. The whole of the new taxes under the
't;and'of the Excise would yield to the countty
'biu,oool. a year. He would now proceed to im-
;,°s t 4 of a different description. The first would
t„.,bie very considerable, and' this was not the
t, Irad tune that it bad been thought of, though
I;7never yet been entirely adopted. As early
88, it was recommended that
.one penny
t'"ht be paid on every Newspaper sent,. by
,est This had been‘Carried into efiect ‘vith re-
eet to papers forwarded by Two-penny 'Post,
not by the feneral; It was supposed that
any tiling that would check the circulation Of
p4l'erS :would have an injurious tendency. But
'as certain that every one who indulged in
luxary of reading a London Paper, a lUxury
`1 tilt Which
all were well acquainted., would not
4:Ptive himself of that enjoyment for the sake of
itvrvi
cig. °vie
penny. He should apprehend, how-
er; that Aienthers of Parliament would Fontinue
0l receive their Newspapers' free of postage.----
eirte
Ith2 hvag(.«eneral cry of No, No, arose, and Mr.
said across the table, . Tax Mem-
Qf the cad
As it appeared to be the univerqal -sense
.not to avail themselves of their pre-
ou n
pti
this occasion,, he would make o. ex-
eaterl in their favour this duty., which was
bent:ted to produce 50,0001. a-year. He should
*Pectin l,:.,()N'se any rote to the , Cominittee
re-
pia,") the Post-Qffice, but simply state, that
Tend kyas carrying into execution, to . ex-
Packets- establishment_of .that office by rq.7;ular
INtrts. the. East Indies' , and other foreign,
*ere ~42;e. estimates of its expected 'produce
cot/rs_
c as yet .very loose, but rated at
taxati° 1 On these two branches of additional
)2- -'n'llo°l 2 the public revenue would be benefitted.
lki?i'7. yearly. The total amount of, the taxes
'''
Ire should impose to night would therefore
811„,.1/28,0001. but with an understanding that he
bests be at liberty to. bring forward other im-
F
he thought proper, to complete the ex-
aF Lie had in view an increase
lalstamp duties, except on stamps employed in
the Proceedings. But the House was a..vare of
a: 'difficulty and delay of preparing: a stamp
tcotiellule's and therefore would admit his rea-
r, fqr rostppning a more particular mention of
hated,
subject to another evening. After what he had
te.d, there remained about 600,0001. to be made
eliabut.these would be procured by the repeal of
34,et backs- on the exportation of several articles,
tiu.". as printed cottons and , sugar. For perhaps
t4e,.ti" (lathe
,our the flourishing state of
trade draw-
ceased ceased to be necessary, and the public
14a'iL found to pay more ou their account than on
toy of. the duties on exportation. He bad
141 „atrived
,to that great article, Beet; ; (a
-t,,1, He had received many suggestions to la
that would touch that Commodity. t
But some ago an illePeaSC had taken place in the price,
xcilv. the public were perfectly convinced that it
tili,v.it"as higher 'than it ought to be. He was
tliethe necessaries 'of life, and' should be most
tYLi.t the limit which he had given, led to
artie`t";ag off, instead of impoSing, a tax on that
tgl,:e' When the rise.had occurred some years
te,hthe Brewers had called on him and' Lord Li-
eon,i ,1) atiti stated their intentions, which they
-liv4,(lereti fair at the time, in consequence of the
liar'? charges to 'which war' subjected the trade.
4given the explanation, he trusted the pob-
Q„ °l4ll see, that with the. present high price of
tecilr.),le had nothing to do. (Laughter.) He then
111', t'tlllated the taxes which he had this evening
Pose
their d, and which are all brought into view with
koduce in the following-statement :
lA,
Rec.
lodacco ...... 21d.per lb.
Duto p
2d .6d. ditto ' 150,000
ouble • fixed 150 p,r. Cent. 000
0; .
Per tu ••
....... 1 progressive '
" ...,

150,000

A ite 1 AssEssED T.lxEs, viz.—
t4\,t,,, t lions, .. , pct • .a0a,500
i srv,,i„ •• L,v .• .30 pet Cent.
1:,,. 6. t—etvants' Tax so to 90 do. 308,500
rltir. 4"ers, &c. . • vatilnlS 101,f.00
r:Nit.;-',EV;l,llt•s' and Ser-
-1,1-ti,,t, !"r hik• -
... : { ditto
--T..!... • ... ....... about 75 p.cent• 3q3,o°°
))14411."..1 ,11:asure ....about 80 ditto' . 657,500
~,,ii • • urses .... . •• • t tSG ditto - -83 500
.... ...... a ;on . .
‘L'e Cert.' .' • ..... '... about 30 ditto • 106,300
It:.: • LleateS ...... - - do. do. 42,000
,
!,,,iuws.
NEW DUTIES.
kl, il,l /I 4111'i:rehouse
k. 41.. 4 (I),,ll"tst•s .... s astAl. ii.window 50,000
19'„its arelitioses .... SAM eas limise9.lso,oo
1:11.,,„.? 50 Per cent. additional on 1:120,000
', carriage.s,land Horses, ...

500,000

350,000

148,000

t
441.14. 1
~
(.%* on each -5
New;paper 0,000
•.. d.
Postatie rc,6ufatiori 75;000

2,600,000.

r 125,000

re
k3,7zseono
' feiPained to provide for the cArges of

the Loans fot present auzi suoit:atient !Ps, mid
those on the unfunded debt. The Fund for the
reduction of the National Debt now amounted to
abOut sixty millions, and it seemed practicable to
make it defray those expenses ; but he thought it
would be more advisable to allow the Sinking
Fund for the next four years to increase at com-
pound interest withou( being touched. At the
end of that period, it would amount to 150 mil-
lions, awl would be so increased as to redeem at
simple interest the whole of . the funded debt in
45 years, the, time proposed by Mr. Pitt, and
would then become disposable for other services.
Although,he hoped that Peace was now consolidated
and secure, yet the renewal .of war might more
justly be dreaded, when the revolutionary fermen-
tation which had so long agitated Europe had
scarcely subsided,. than when nations had returned
to quiet occupations, and the minds of men were
settled. He now considered every month of peace
as-adding to its security. Should, however, fresh
storms arise in four- years, according to the system
which he now proposed, the country would be
-;more able to' meet any extended expenditure,
should any such be unfortunately once more re-
quired. It would then he in possession of a fund
equal to its wants, and the appropriation of which
would support allits influence, and its credit un-
impaired. The best mode of rendering peace se-
cure was to be ready for mar. By saving the
Property Tax and the Sinking Fond, as our never
failing resources in times of emergency and dan-
ger, e should augment otieoneans, and whilst our
moderation would prevent us from rushing into
unnecessary wars, we should lay an immoveable
foundation for our national credit, and enlarge our
influence throughout the world. It was no small
satisfaction to look over the immense extent of
taxation which we had passed. This night would
deliver us from 'nine millions of taxes, and at the
same time, would powerfully coon ihute to the ex-
tension of our public revenue. This was matter
Of exultation, and he hoped our prosperity would
proceed with accelerated progress. _lt was matter
of exultation, that, on Ale sth of April last, the
total amount of our sevenuc, exclusive of the
Property Tax, was 48,436,0001. ; whilst it had
ortly risen to 47 millions the preceding year;- and
that in
;the year ending last Christmas it
.had
amounted to 51,211,0001. Thus had the resources
of the country continued to grow during a long
and violent struggle, in which we had atchieved all
the great and useful objects-for which we had con-
tended. On hailing the close of so long and tre-
mendous a confliat, he should not apologise to
the House for recording a prophetic sentiment
expressed by the late Mr, Burke. At.the 'first din-
ner given by the Speaker, at the commencement
of our contest with France, Mr. Butke filled a
glass with wine, and drank '' Siccess to this long
war." The whole company were not a little sur-
prised, as there was no probability at the ,time
that the war should. ,last, Mr. Burke perceived
their astonishment, and added—" I say this long
war, and say it emphatically, -hut, -.Purate, 'et
vosmet rebus.wvate•secandis. Let Durate be your
motto." It had indeed been , the motto of this.
'country. Constancy had triumphed over every
difflealty and danger, and should a. new occasion
arise to make .an appeal to the firmness and he-
roiStn of the British People, they would not be
'found, as they never have been . found, to-sfidnk
filial the glorious .call,---(Hear, hear!) He con
eluded by moving his first Resolution.
Mr. WHITBREAD said; it was not his intention
to have said any thing on the present occasion-,
had it not been for a certain taunt or sneer that
the Right Hon. Gentleman had, in a certain part
of his speech,- thought proper to throw outagainst
the trade of which he had the honour 'to be an
humble member. In that part of the speech to
which lie alluded, the Right Hon. Gentleman had
said, " that he had received several hifils, that
an additional tax might be laid on, beer from the
high prices at which it was kept up." The Right
Hon. Gentleman had this night offered his plan of
Finance, and Many were of opinion that one of
his articles for raising the money he wanted would
be a tax on beer. The Right Hon. Gentleman:
had kept every circumstance.relative to his plan
exceedingly snug and close ; not a whiSPer had
made its way to the public till the whole promul-
gation had just issued from his own mouth. . All
inquiries made l y himself. or his friends had been
fruitless and ineffectual. He would not give the
smallest hint in answer by which to guess at ;
so that the trade to which lie belonged could
not form any. true judgment by which they were to
act, as to the continuance of the present prices
of beer, till they were able to ascertain what the
intentions of the Right Hon. Gentleman would
he. The Right Hon. Gentleman had beet' waited -
on, in company with Lord Liverpool, by a De-
putation of the trade, of which Deputation lie
had the honour to be one ; in which they bad
fairly represented' the state in which they stood,
and the injuries they sustained from the then high
prices of barley, &c. The consequence of which
was, the prices had been raised. - A second De-
putation had in like manner taken place between
the same parties, and a second increase of price
had taken place ; but such second price was soon
given up, and the trade had 'since 'waited to see
what the Right Hon. Gentleman would do, before
they could say what they should do. Now they
were possessed of tohat, they would take their
measures within 48 hours ; and, had the Right
Hon. Gentleman condescended to be a little mo‘e
communicative, the tipsiness would perhaps have
been settled, and the Poblie acquainted with the
intentions of the trade before this time'. With
respect to 'the plan of the Right Hon. Gentlenidn,
he should reserve his opinion for some future oc-
.. casioir.

Mr. TiERNET said, he should not attempt to
follow the Right Hon. Gentleman through the
wide range of argument in•which he had indulged
himself, and with which he had amused ninny
"Members present, as it would seem from time se-
Neral cheers with which they bad so cordially
greeted his speech-, He- would confine himself 'to.
those parts which he considered to be most falla-
cious, and to which .lie could not submit in si-
lence, without being guilty in his own mind .4 a
dereliction-of his parliamentary duty. In the lat-
ter part of the speech, the Right Hon. Gentleman
had given the House the consolatory information, .
that 21 millions a year of War Taxes would be
necessary for the Peace Establishment. The Riglit.

rtotteenathle Ceotlemen bad waetule ettleteised
toe patience, the fortitude, and the patriotic
perseverance of the- people,e by which they
had enabled the Government to bring the war to
agiOrions conclusion ; and what was the effect
and consequence of all this )' 'Why, Sir, no less
than this—that this very people, who had fondly
flattered themselves they should he relieved by a
peace, would now find that eleven millions of the
war taxes were to be continued ; and if they
could place any confidence in the forebodingsof
the Right Hon. Gentleman they had every reason
to flatter themselves that in the short period of
four years they might again expert the happiness
of being once more 'called upon to exert their
utmost energies' in the same sort of warfare
by which they had gained so much honour and
pt'aise from the Right Honourable Gentleman.
Howsuch information should happen to deemed
such a " Gvd ~send" as, by the. cheers it re-
ceived, it appeared to be to a great part of the
ijouse, he was at a loss to conceive. The House,
ehe was sure, would recollect lie had repeatedly
told his Majesty's Ministers that whenever peace
arrived they would find themselves in a state of
great embarressment. • He knew they must, and
he believed they now felt most sensibly that he
was on that bead no false prophet. It was not,
however, his intention to throw any impediment
in their way which should add to their embarrass-
ment on the contrary, lie would much rather do
every thing in his power to assist' theta in getting
out of it.. When be said this, he spoke sincere-
ly, and in order to evince that sincerity to the
House, it was necessary he should give' his can-
did opinion of the plan now submitted to the
consideration of the House by the Right.-lion.
Gentleman: By this, the Right Hone Gentleman
first called on the lekiiise for six millions, to make
good the war taxes ; and then five millions more,
which were to beconsideredin the light of war taxes
in time of peace. This he must Protest against ;
for ilhe did not greatly mistake this plan, it was
by much the, most unparliamentary one he had
ever seen or heard of. The House would observe
there was. noe_a Bing le document, not a word of
information, before them to warrant. the assertion,
that it was the frost advantageous-way for Par-
liament to. proceed at the present moment by rais-
ing a large sum, or in other wortk; the whole of
the supplies within the year. lii his opinion
a Loan would have been iefinitely preferable,
and far better suited to the circumstances of the
country. tie then spoke, he said, in the hearing
of many who knew nothing of what had passed,
hut through the newspapers ; bet those who vere -
present in the House before.the late adjournment
took place, would do him the justice to recollect,
that at that period, When the House was called on.
to vote- 24 millions, •he had expressly' told them
they were all war -taxes, and it now appeared
clearly 'to be the case : for after the speech of the
Right Hon. 'Gentleman; this night, he defied any\
one to say that he could tnow whether it was a
speech -of„ a war character or of a peace charac-
ter... He wants, tp raise twenty-7one millions
in a titre of profound-peace with all the world.
What, said Mr. 'l'. can be his motive for pressing
this .measure at7the present moment ? He had told
the House it was because the Property Tax would
'expire o'n the sth of April; The House must, there-
fore;provide the'tnoneynow. This he denied to be
the ease.; ,There-was no occasion for such a mea-
sure at. present, and the Right I-ion. Gentleman
was not warranted in calling on the House for
such a sum ',ornitiney.- The real fact was, he
wanted it to-carry hint.on. a certain time longer;
andifehe obtained it, he (Mr. T,) should not be.
surprised to see another adjournment. The House
would remember, that'. before the late adjourn-
ment took place, he harp seriously warned them
of the mischief that might arise from being so full
of confidence in Ministers. He bad protested
against voting so large a sum as 24 thillionsovith-
Out it being ascertained as to the manner its which
it was to be expended ; and when the Right Hon.
Gentleman refused to answer certain questions on
which' it was deemed important to receive infor
oration, he '(Mr. T.) had adviSed the House to
grant. no money till they received an, answer on
such points as they deemed it necessary for the
public gOod to have ascertained. Lord Castle-
reagh -was now expected very stain : when he at-•
rived, it kVaS likely he would have it in his power-
to give such information as would nearly ascertain
what money would eventually he wanted, and for
what exigencies or contingencies it Might be re-
quisite -to provide : however, it was evident that
the whole object now was to get the money
without shelving for what purposes it would be
wanted ; and be would venture 'to say, that
such a proceeding was perfectly unexampled in
the practice) of Parliaments. To rai:se the supplies
within the year was not usual, and only to be
continued in time 'Of war. The Right lion.
Gentleman had made a flue funeral oration over
the Property Tax. De thortuis, nil nisi bbnutn,
was certainly the maxim of all humane reasoners.
But in this case it could scarcely be applied, for
the Right Hon'. Gentlenian had given the House
to understand, that his bantling was " not dead,
but sleepeth ;". and that, if we were not very much
out of luck's way, .we might see it revive again in
four veßers in all its pristine vigour.* When the
Right' Hone Gentleman, previous to the adjourn-
ment, - was asked when the Property 'fax would
expire, he was at a loss for an answer ; he did
not know whether it Would expire on the sth of
April or not ; soon atter, he said it would expire at
that time.; afterwards lie was in dOubts again up-
on the subject ; but as soon as ever he got his 24
millions, of which thePropertyTax formed so'liirge
a part, he turned short upon the House, and coolly
told them, they might go.about their . business,
he had no further occasion for them (Or three
_
months, and aecordingly away they -all went to
the right about--(a laugh.)—Having thus got rid
of his legitimate counsel (the, Parliament), the
Right Hon. Gentleman bent his view towards the
country, and transferred his confidence to his privy
counsellor, Mr. Gladstanes; of Liverpool. Hav-
ing been told in that House that the Property
Tax would not be relished by the people after the
sth of April, he wished, through the medium of
Mr. Gladstanes to feel the pulse of the people of
Liverpool on the subject, but it unfortunately
turned out that the only Gentleman be consulted
in that town was the only Gentliman the people
there would net listen to. The Right Honour

Ge:;tliihali soon tolln:! that tIW people of
Liverpool were as, averse to the Property 'Tax:
as they were in every other part of the kiagdoni ;
and to the loud and united cry of the Whole
na-
tion against it, he bad been compelled to give it up.
Having thus given up his darling tax, which was
by far the most -productive of any of the War
Taxes, be (Mr. T.) would he glad to kno,w under,
,what pretence the Right Hon. Gentleman could
fairly call on the House to raise the Supplies
within the year. Among the items voted before
the recess, there was in one line ten millions-for
Army Extraordinaries, which was then said to be
all that was wanted on that head. Would the
Right Hon: Gentleman say so now.? He,believed
not; and yet the Supplies were in time of profound
peace to be raised within the y€9r. The Right
Hon. Gentleman had alluded to the Committee in
1791 :—What was that Committee? By the man-
ner in which he had talked of it, the Hiluse might
he led to suppose it was a Committee of the Whole
House, like that in which they were then sitting.
no such fling. it was such a Committee as he (Mr.
T.) had for the last four years 'been continually
recommending to the Right Hon. Gentleman anti
his colleagues, viz, a Committee to consider of the
finances of the country ; a Committee, the'Metn-:
bets of which would look all the difficulties of our
situation boldly in the face, and would seriOusly
and deliberately recommend Elle proper mea'sures
to remove them. The Right lion. Gentleman,
however, chose a different course. Mr. Pitt would
not have done so. In the• Committee of 1791,
every document necessary to probe the subject to
the bottom was laid before them ; and every lien;.
her knew as well what he was going to vote, As
well as Mr. Pitt himself did : and yet the Right
Hon. Gentleman -comes and trumpets forth praises
on his own plan, as if it could bear a degree of
comparison with that of 1791. The first call in
it for five millions was, he insisted, a most bare.
faced one. -The Right Hon. Gentleman takes
the war taxes at their: full amount, • as available
asset for four years. flow•then did he distin-
guish, or how could he pretend to say we were to
look on that as a time of peace or war ? The
House would, in his opinion, betray. its trust if
they voted this sutra without a Committee. He
by no means intended to say that Ministers were
right or wrong, but a Committee was absolutely
necessary. The Right Hon. Gentleman thought
it was enough if he got the money, and for the
House to consider the supply afterwards ; but we
ought to see if our means are equal to our wants ;
and if they are not, we should endeavour to:make
our wants subservient to our means. He was
confident thZ.re was no such surplus as six mil-
lions, which the Chancellor of the Exchequer
boasted of; and he warned the\House against
' voting this money, which might draw the coun.
try into difficulties which it would not easily get
lid of. •
• 'The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER diSdailll-
ecl any idea of intending to throw out any taunt or
sneer against the respectable trade to Which the
Hon. Gentleman 'opposite (Mr. Whitbread) harl
alluded,

Mr,•PONSONDY expressed his decided disappro- ,
bation of the mode jn which die Right Hon. the
Chancellor of the Exchequer had proceeded. He •
had not .condescended to inform them hoW these
vast sums now asked for were.to'be expended. All
the consolation he had attempted to afford them
was, that the peace establishment wourtl only be 19
millions a year. He (Mr. P.) did not believe thiS
calculation to be accurate; and yet the Right lion.
Gentleman, without any documents to prove the.
truth of his assertions, Wanted an enormoits suit
by anticipation, "to Wind- up the war expenses :
and the fact was, the 'House would never know,
what they were about, if
.they went on voting
money in that Way'without any information. The
reduction of our expenses was the only likely may
to retrieve our affairs, and this could only be done
by appointing such a Committee as his Right.
Hon. Friend Mr. Tierney had pointed out. This •
was his decided opinion, and he could not con
sent to give his vote for the present War taxes in •
time of profound peace, without being authdrised
to do so by the report of such a Committee.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT argued upon the pressure of:
taxation which most fllll upon Ireland, with
respect to the National Debt, the Sinking Fund,
and the interest.. After the Honourable Barouet
had made Various statements on the subject,
Sir JAMES SHAW rose, and adverted to the
origin of the Shop Tax as proposed by Mr. Pitt,
which proceeded on a principle which that great
Minister afterwards gave up.
Mr. BAJiING thought that the Chancellor of the
Exchequer proceeded on the idea that the taxes , ji
would continue to be equallystproductive. The
change in the situation of the otry must, bow-
ever,•produce a different state of things; as it re-
garded the productiveness of the revenue. The.
change of the price of the USt necessary article
.of provision'; with which; lie trusted; eviry other,
article would fall, was a matter of the greatest
consideration. With respect, to the operation ,
of things as to - the Corn Laws, a farm might
be at two thousand pounds a year, and might
be soon at 10001. a year : but though the rent
suffered that diminution, how would the question
stand as to the taxes ? This, he would con-.
tend, was not the the time to act upon a statement,
without taking into view the allowances for re-
duced rents, • for the price of labour; ai.d for all
the other matters connected with the
:public ex-
penditure. He did not choose to give a vote'
which Might establish a precedent on this bead:—
The whole ought to be submitted to a Committee
of Enquiry. Economy must be attended to. T-.
In our Colonial EXpenditure, we bad a Gover-
nor at the Ca-pe of Good Hope with emolu-
ments. amounting to twenty thousand pounds
year—(No, no.) Perhaps it might be something
less ; and, as he understood from the interruption,
only 10,0001. a year. He hoped he had not stated
the emoluments of this appointment too high ; if
he had done so, he supposed it would be contra.
dieted. Ile could not tell ‘vhat Ministers might
feel it necessary to,do for a great family; but it
was the duty of that House to look after the pub-
lic expenditure. On the departed Property Tax,
be might say a good deal; but be was afraid of
its resurrection. After having presented Peti-
tions against the Property Tax, he could not ad.
mil the panegyric passed upon it by the Chancel.,
for of the Exchequer ; and he thoup-hr ih2r .11 tb.