The Sun.
London, England, 1841-08-25 00:00:00

VVENING SUN.

. . , -
assiatihee and cernplet 4)ri
e ca il ltret!.',l in the VIeWS
which hall been sprofessed thole Honourable Gen.
ilemen with- whom he had the honour to -sit in :that
House, and agreeing as he did in• the course
svhich it was propc.)scd
,by those lion. Gentlemen
to take 'Mon that occasion,: lie felt he should
I)" awl, however, backward .lw
might feel personally, he. did not wish to avoid the task.
He felt he s:esuld be shrinking from his duty if he did
not suggest to the House the adoption of a different
course from that whisk they had been called upon to
take by the followers of her Majesty's Government.—
(Applause.) But it' he were liable to anything.
like presumption in his own person perhaps he
might find something of justification in
the circumstances under which he had the honour to
appear before the liouae.—(Cheers.) It was not long
since. her Majesty, by the advice of her present Ministry,
put it to the country at large to decide upon the
policy of their measures, and asked that country to
return her an answer which should serve as a guide in
the future government of the countrv.—(Hear, hear.)
Ile (Mr. Wortley) appeared there the bearer of a portion
of that tined-er ; and. he hoped he might, without too
much prestunption, say that he appeared there not as its
least significant portion—(Opposition cheers) —and
that . being the case, he trusted he would not be
out of place, early as it was in their proceedings,
in standing before them. for the purpose of moving an
amon•lment upon that occasion ; and he felt satisqed he
might take such a course in strict conformity, not only
with the wishes of his own constituents, 'but with
those of the great msjority of the people of this country
--{Loud cheers from the Opposition benches)—while
he asked that House to consider, in the first instance,
whether it was meet that persons sitting in the position
of her Majesty's Ministers were those whom it wished
to entrust with the future conduct of affairs.
(Cheers.) Ile conceived that in recommending the
course which he was about to propose to the House,
he was liable to nothinf, in the way of blame or
imputation, because it had been an ancient -Practice
upon various opinions of a similar kind, to ask that House to
engraft upon the Ad tress which was prepared by the advisers
of the Sovereign, an amendment which would declare different
sentiments from those which that Address might contain. It
was a course which was in itself respectful towards the
Brown—it was a course which was in itself constitutional and
isateilleible ; and he should add, alto, that upoa that occasion
Hon. Gentlemen opposite had no right to complain that they
(the Opposition) should interfere in order to ask for an altera-
tion of those sentiments. In the first place, ha said such a course
was respectful towards the Crown, because the Crown having
put a questioa formally and deliberately to the country —having
sent them there to declare its opinion upon the topics com-
prised in that question, it could not be otherwise than respect-
ful to the Crown, that they should take the earliest opportunity
tof informing the Crown what was the answer which they had
isoen comunssioned to give by their constituents. (Hear,
hear.) It appeared that it was not oily nit disrespectful, but
that it was due to the Crown, particularly at that moment,
that they should give her Majesty an intimation of what they
believed to be the• wishes of the country, in order that
she might be relieved from all uncertainty upon the subject.
The course he was about to mem-ea-tend was also conformable
to the usual practice of the House ; 'and if he wanted any jus-
t4cetion upon that point, he might refer to a precedent very
much in point. Ile might refer to the proceedings in the
year 1835, when his predecessor in the representation which
gave him his present seat in that House (Lord Morpcth, we
believe), took the same course as that which- he presumed to
suggest to the House upon that occasion. Irks-predecessor had
Undertaken the duty, under circhtnstances in'which,perhapsethe
justification was not quite so strong as it was at present, be-
cause he was then told that no fault whatever was found with
the Speech on the Address proposed by her Majesty's Govern-
ment ; but still it was thought fit that an amendment should
be made upon the occasion. If, then, that course had been
taken when the Address was thought unobjectionable, he had
still a better right than his predecessor to ask that House to
pursue a similar course ; and with respect to Hon. Gentlemen
neposite, and especially her Majesty's Ministers, he should say
that they had no reason to complain of the course he pro-
posed ; hut the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell) ought to consi-
der it an act of the most obliging courtesy—(Laughter)—that
be ( Mr. Wortley) should propose an amendment to the Address.
In the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell's) recent address to his
constituents, he used these words:—" As soon as the new
Parliament meets, we shall take the first opportunity of ask-
law for a clear and decided judgment on our policy." The
Noble Lord would, therefore, acknowledge that the anticipa-
tion of the call was an act of courtesy.—(Laughter.) He
was ithAifisd also hy the Noble Lord himself, in asking the
Howse not to separate, without expressing a strong opinion
open a point which they WI a right to consider in.
the first instance,—whether her Majesty's Ministers were
entitled, in the actual state of the representation of this coun-
• try, to dictate the Address which should be presented to the
Queen ?—( Much cheering from the Tory benches.) He
mild not better show the position in which the House stood
with respect to Ministers, than in the words of the Noble
Lord in 1834, during the discussion on the appropriation of
the revenue of the Church of Ireland. The Noble Lord had
laid,—" I consider that the Government of this country must
be formed of persons agreeing with the principles of the ma-
jority of the 'House of Commons ; and J.think the House has
a right, if Ministers have not their confidence, to address the
Crown, with the expectation that IlainiSters would be chosen
wile should have their confidence."—(Hear, hear, from Lord
J. Russell, and mach cheering.) The Noble Lord had cheered.
"Ho was glad to perceive that he was able to
concur with the Noble Lord, and he was doing that, which,
Ise trusted would effectually fulfil the object recommended in
that passage.—( Tory cheers and laughter.) But beyond that
the Noble Lord and he would not concur. Those on the
speosite side of the House, and those with whom he had the
honour to act took different views of the manner in which this
night's debate should be conducted. The Gentlemen opposite
said, that the distress of the country was owing to the rejection
-of the policy recommended by Ministers. But, althsugh it
might be very expedient and very politic for Ministers to
identify themselves with cheap bread and free trade, yet in his
nailed they had no right to discuss these questions then.—
( Cheers and laughter.) He would not preclude the lion.
Member tor Manchester or others from making speeches on
free trade, but the question before the House was not whether
those subjects were important or not, but whether the persons
who compose her Majesty's Government were those whom
the country would confide in to carry them out.—;Great
cheering.) He had stated his opinion on the !questions of corn
and free ti ado, and he would have an opportunity of doing so
again--the savner the better—but the only qiiestion now was
whether Ministers had not forfeited the confidence Of the
House a•al the country.—( Renewed cheers from the Opposi-
tiou.) They had forfeited it by an oblivion of their
pledges. —( Cheers and "Oh, oh.") They had forfeited it
by the abandonment of their measures, end lastly, by
tampering with great practical questions which-affected every
impurtatit interest in the couutry, for the sake of party pur-
poses. (Loud cheers from the force=.) On the opposite
benches he saw two Noble Lords who were members'.
of LOrd Grey's' Government. In the ether House there 'was
Lord Melbourne and other Lords who-carne into power with
Lord Grey, and who were now in office, hut the declared prin-
ciples of that Government were these—retrenchment, peach,
and reform.—( Loud cheers.) diy these fundariental principles
they were to be distinguished from all previous Governments,
• which., when in opposition, alley were accustomed to condemn
as extravagant in expenditure, inclined to war, and opposed to
reform. But in tea years they have had five wars.—(Cheers
and laughter.) First they had a little war at Antwerp.—
( Laughter.) Then a little war-an unintelligable war in Spain
—next in Indiah-neet in Chins, and last of all in Syria.—
(Cheers.) Yet the Hon. Member for Manchester gave them
an exclusive chahacter for peace. He (Mr. Wortley) did not
condemn the whole policy -of the the Noble Lord on account
of these wars—some of them might be right.—( Hear, hear. )
But what matter for that ?—(Great laughter and cheers.)
-There might be instification for some of those wars ;
still he maintained Ministers had no right at the out-
set. to pretend that they hod an exclusive secret for
inamtaining peace. For fifteen years before their ac-
cession to office, the Goverment, whom they accused
of a propensity to war, had maintained unbroken peace, with the
exception of the isolated action of Navarino, whereas in ten years
the ministers pledged to peace have had five wars in ten years.
What right had they then to lead people to believe that
they had a peculiar faculty for preserving the country from
the evils of war? - They ph. mi3ed to be the most economical
Government the 'country ever saw, and yet the country had
now an ate:emulated deficiency of seven millions awl a
hes rfui increasing expenditure.—( Hear, hear.) Again he
:aid, that although he did not pretend to denounce all the
sources of expense, from which this increase hal arisen—
' and God forbid---lie should oppose the application of money
• to improve the Navy—yet the Ministers had no r:ght to
• make the promise of retrenchment one of their claims to
• • °Him—('rory cheers.) With respect to reform, it might
be said that in that item they had not deceived the couotrv.
Ito must grant that they reformed Parliament and the
h- Corporations, but some hail a lurking suspicion that there
were amongst the supporters of those measures, persons
who hoped to derive from them personal gains and importance.
Ibe would ask those persons who hail watched the proceedings
of leer Majesty's Government for the last few years, be should
- rather say for the last five years—(" Hear, hear," from the
Itlinisterial benches)—he would repeat, the last five years, whs.-
• they they had not in the course of that time lavished more
pieces and peerages than any other previous Government?—
( Opposition cheers, and counter-cheers from the Ministerial
benclissa ) Arid what wee their last act ? It was an indecent
clutch, towards the close of last Session, patronage', i
means of a prospective and impasse.l Act of Parliament, Is! 'h
• was proposed to be brought into effect by whatever Govern-
ment might be in office at the: time of its coming-into opera-
tion. There was no pretence whatever for its being iinme-
tiiately laroueht into operation. In fact, whether they looked
•, to topice amnesiacs! With
... the Church, topics elms.
• • nected With the Colonies,' or topics eunnect (el wit,h,
.• • the internal government of the country, they would find all
e those questions which gave rish to the !eerie stiles:times—pies-
tiefts Which justified the same charge,. If they look ds.
ee Inc itiAtinu,, to the tpteation of the Appropria-
t • lion Clathe t them censider the hhaorey of that
for a single rnornelds In the year 183• I it was proposed to :ap-
psopriate a esrtain portion of the Irish Church revenue in a
way that would facilitate the settlement of the question of
tithr.s in that country. Government proposed a Commission
to inquire into the subject, and that teas opposed. In the year
1835 what cours, did the same parties in the Government pur-
- sue ? Th:'y pr, posed that Partiament should vote that no-
thing eculd he satisfactory on the sultjoct until it was ascertained
what amount was to be appropriated. Well, they attained 1
office hi agreeing to settle that question, and in the year la3B,
after basing gone- through discussion after discussion, they
se: fled the question of the Irish tithes without including the
question of appropriation. That was another case where the
Government did not fulfil the promisee with which they set
out. Without detaining the House he would come now to the
subject which was more especially before the country at the pre-
sent moment. Ile woul•I show what was the conduct of her Ala-
jesty's Government on the question of the Budget containing the
topies of the reduction of the duties on sugar and corn. Let
them look first to the question of sugar. last year it was
prop esed to reduce the duty on that article. It was objected
to that proposal that it was not fair at the present moment,
when the c 'lonics were subject to the consequences of a great
exphitnent, to introduce foreign sugar in great quantities into
• thIS country. If he (Mr. Wortley) wanted effective argu-
menls upon this subject, he would refer to the speech delivered
on the occasion referred to by the Right Huh. the President.
, -efthe Board of Trade. In June 1840, that Right Hon. Gen-
tlenian opposed the proposal, anti again on the ilth of August
its th, Fame year, in a s'eort discussion on the same subject.
... the Rightllcn. Gentleman made the same statements with
respect to his opposition to that. proposal. I-le (Mr. Wort'ey)
would only state that for himself his opposition to any idlers-
; lion in those duties rested on no ground of a financial nature.
They rested on the conviction that the peculiar circumstances
• of the question at the present moment justified that opposi-
, .lion. In 1811, notwithstanding his opposition in the former
. year, the Right Hon. Gentleman was one of those who came
Ic clown to the House to make that identical proposal
which in the Preceding year he had opposed. With respect to
the Cam-laws,- lie had to say that he had also seen some of
that distress whiSh the Hon, Member fer Manchester (Mr. 31.
Phillips) had so feelinein tt
lyioken of that' evening, 'and- which
no man:could deny.
course of all the distress and suf-
fering which he had witnesseately, nothing struck him more
than tho calm and reasonable terapesehthe patient fortitude--