The Sun.
London, England, 1841-03-16 00:00:00

upon themselves an undue authority. An ie-
stance of that kind occurred the other day.
, Upon the Government proposing an increase in the navy
expenditure on their own responsibility, the Hon. Member
for Stamford contended that the proper course would have
been to send it to a Committee.—(Hear, hear.) On the
whole he thought the course taken by the Noble Lord was
most unfair to the Government.
Mr. GROTE said he was one of those who supported
the Bill for the formation of this colony, and notwith-
standing what had been said he must await the result of
further inquiry before he would be prepared to say that it
was a failure.—( Hear, hear.) He quite agreed in the
opinion which Lad been expressed that de'ay would in-
crease the mischief, and that Parliament would ev ntuallt
be called upon to interfere to a much greater extent.
The House must not forget that the quantity of ca2ital
now in that colony amounted to not less than 2 500,0001. of
property—that there was a vast quantity of cattle, 180,000
sheep, and 15,000 head of other cattle, and in no other
colony had the stream of enterprise and indust ial labour
flowed in so rapidly as in that of South Australia.---( Hear,
hear.) There was nothing extraordinary in the circum-
stances under which the colony had came forward to ask
the aid of the mother country in a pressirg exterce. If
the question was divested of that party feeling and sprit
which he regretted to see displayed in the course of the
discussion, they were all of one mind as to tie mein pie-
eidle on which the loan was sought, and the necessity of
conceding it. The Committee would recoll-ct Oat there
were a large number of bills drawn by the Governor
upon the colony lying dishonoured. A vessel was about
to sail for the colony next week, and it war most impor-
tant that it should be known there as spe nilly as possible
that there was no intention to delay for an indefinite period
the reli f which was so much required, otherwise they
would throw back the prosperity of the colony for a long
period, and that would be productive ultimately of the
greatest inconvenience and mischief.
L r I ELIOT, as a member of t're Committee,
felt it light to say that ho understood it to be the general
opinion that the immediate intcrpositi m of Parliament was
absolutely necessary.---( Hear, hear.) He had heard as i h
regret, tint uneni sgled with surpri e, the speech of his
Noble Friend near him—( Loud liughter)—and he must
say that in his opinion, although there was a difference of
opinion i s the CAutnittee as to the extent of the responsi-
hi of the Government, there was no difference. as to the
necessity of Parliamentary interposition.—( Hear, hear.)
It app, aced to him that delay in the present case would
be extre.nely prejud:cial.—( Hear.) The Committee
would recol!ect thet bills to a large amount, which had
been dishonoured, were still lying in the hands of the
rne,.chaats t ) whom they had been transferred. If these
tells were returned to the colony dishonoured the result
woul Ibe to paral)se its energies—it would lead to disas-
re-, and plunge them into irretrievable ruin. It was,
therefore, absolutely necessary that no delay should take.
place.—( Hear.) He reg-ened that his Noble Friend had
found it necessary t ) express any opinion upon the pro-
cce of the Commissioners, or to indulge in any un-
c for and unneresea-y censure on the sound and judi..,
cious principle of self-supporting colonie..—( He et, hear. )
The Not,le Lord appcare I to f.,rger that the principle
which the United States filet started was a self-supportiag
one; aid although Colonel Gswler was not present to
defend himself, all must admit thst it was to his misma-
nagement the subseque, t disaqsrs of the colony might be
traced. He admitted that a large sum had been laid out
for public works, but thet was a sum whica the Govern-
ment would ultimately have no reason to regret. He did
Int think that country would suffer any great or permanent
loss by the loan, be even if it. did there were few of the
Australi in cclenies that had been acquirAl at so small an
expense.
Mr. PARKER said that he had endeavoured to make
as fair a Report as he possibly could for his Rtht Hon.
Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer. He did not be-
lieve there were any material errors in it.
After a few wont: from Me G. W. HOPE,
Mr. DIVETT srid it must he obvious to all that there
had been some error committed in the financial manage-
ment of the colony, but he believed full value had been
received for all thet had been expended, notwithstanding
the want of discretion which the Governor had displayed.
It appeared to him that the resources of the colony had
teen very much underrated. He had seen letters from
farmers who had emigrated from his part of the country,
in which it was stated that the land was of the very finest
description, and he believed that the nuns ter of emigrants
would be much greater if they only knew bow prospeious
these farmers and labourers a. e e after a twelve months'
residence. lie had Hole doubt that in a very few years
that colony would be the emporium of a great part of
Australis. Under these eircumst mug, he trusted that
there would be no opposition to the motion of the Noble
Lord

The resolution was aco withdrawn, and the Report or-
dered to be received on Friday.
ORDNANCE ESTIMATES—REPORT.

Sir H. VIVI A isl movel that the Report of ;112 Com-
mittee of Supply on tie Ordnance Estima`.es be re;:eiv,3,4.
Captai.i BOLDER() roi:e to call t'.e attention of the
House, and the Master Genet-oil of the Ordnance, to the
expense incure I Gre a Britain in furniJhing arms, &e.,
to the Grand Signior. In 1840, the sum taken for
Ordnance stores was 207,0001., whila the estimate for the

pr3sent year was 328,000/., making a d ffcreace of
121,0001. on acfnunt of that one item. What was

the sum now required by the GGvernment ? 241,000/.,
while the eve-age for the years 1831, 1835, and
1836, had been 65,000/., and the House was in total igno-
rance of the cause of so large an expenditure. It was de-
sirable that the Howe should know thi.. He supposed it
would be t-a'd, a great part of it was ii,carred in support-
ing our policy in Syria. He found that the Sultan had
been- supp!ied with 24,000 stand of arms for the Syrians.
He thought, considering the awrice aid assistance that
had beer. rendere 1 to him, tire Sultan should pay a portion
of the expenses. It argot be said this was ti-,e policy of a
nation of shopkeepers, hut the great !nen who termed us so,
never assisted a foreipt power and tow his own subjects
to pay fir it. We had the largest fleet in the Mediterra-
nean th a was ever in that sea, and the expense of it :could
fall entirely upon onrselees. Our expenses were upwards
of a million, at the most mederwe calculation.
Suppose one fleet had been destroyed what would have
been the consequence ? Here they went on year after
year increasing expense ; and, as far as he knew, to no
purpose, and for no cause or objet-. He th )ught the
House ought to be infot med on these subjects, and he should,
therefore, move for a return of the correspondence be-
tween the Government and the Porte with respect to the
expenses of the lite operations in Syi ia.
Sir H. VIVIAN sail he should confine his answer to
the Hon. Gentleman to 'subjects immediately conccted
with his own dei.artment. lie had no hesitation in saying
tha,, in the last few years, the expenses of that depart
ment had greatly increased ; and if the Honourable Gen-
tleman had ben in the House a few nights
ege, he would have heard the causes explained. One
great item was the adoption of percussion caps. With re-
spect to the Ordnance expenses in the Syrian expedition,
the Sultan had been furnished with 24,000 stand of arm',

with a propottiot,ate quantity of ammunition, which he
was to pay for. fie should tilt enter into any diicussinn
as to the policy of Oat expedition, but he pleiged himself
that if the Hon. Gentleman should bring forward a specific
motion on the subject, some one of h:s colleagues would
be prepared to justit'y it.
'There was no objection to the motion.
EAST INDIA 'RUM BILL.

Mr. BERNAL brought up the Committee on the Easi
India RA:a BA

Mr. L A BOUCHERE said, in consequence of what
had bee.► said of some ambiguity in the wording of the
Bill, he hal consulted some persons competent t ) form an
opinion en the subject, and though they thought the
clauses as they stood were sufficient, they thought
there would be no objection to the introduction of
other words. He therefore proposed in the preamble
after the word " charter" to insert the words " into which
the importation a foreign sugar is or shall be hereafter
prohibited," and ,fter Cie word " any" to insert the word
"such." If, these ameadinents were adopted, the 2d
clause would become 3urptusage.
Mr. GOULBURN said be thought it would still be
necessary to retain the second clause.
Mr. LABOUCIIERE said he did not think so; but
it might stand if de iced. He now came to what he con-

ceivea to be a more important point. He had stated on a
former occasion that he conceived it was important wh?ther
in point of fact sugar was made in the East Indies to any
cxt2nt worth not re from aiy eti.er mat rial but the sugar
cue. Judging from the evidence before the East India
Committee, he was led to believe that all sugar exported
was bona fide the produce of the sugar cane, and that in
limiting it to that, they were doing ill that the East
Indians asked. But it was stated that at Ben-

gal, if they excluded sugar made frets- the date
they would make the Bid of no avail. He had taken
pains to be informed of tho foes of the n:so, and be-
lieved there was some exaggeration in saying that if they
excluded the date there, and only admitted the produce of
the sugar-cane, they would not confer a great benefit.
He understood that in 13enares the date trees bore no
fruit, and that all sugar made there was the produce of the
sugar-cane; but in Bengal Proper the date trees grew in
great numbers, and sugar was made indiscriminately from
the da e and the sugar-cane, and the nature of the manu-
facture was such that it would be impossible to tell
whether the sugar was made from the one or the other.
lle was confident that whenever sugar was imported from
Indic it would be date-tree sugar as well as sugar the
produce of the cane. On these grounds, and believi.'g.
as he did, that the date-tree sugar was even now int: o-

..--
duced into this country, and that it was impossible to. dis-
tinguish it from the other, and wishing to afford encou-
ragement to the growth of sugar of every kind in
he felt he was only acting according to sound principles in
assenting to the proposed alteration. He would, there-
fore, move that the words " or sugar of the date-tree" be
introduced into the clause.

Mr. HAWES thought the West Indies should have no
protection of any kind which was not granted to the
East Indies. He felt that these latter colonies were much

more valuable and important than the other.
Mr. G 0 ULBURN would not oppose the motion for
the introduction of date-tree suga,..
The amendment having been agreed to, and the' Re lort
reccivod, the Bill was ordered to be rea I a third time t-:-
marrow.