The Sun.
London, England, 1847-02-15 00:00:00

-111,4 411

PETITIONS ON PRIVATE BILLS.
JIOT3S OF COMMONS.—(THIS DAY.)
(Room 22, before Mr. Examiner Smrrii.)
UNOPPOSED LIST.
In the two following unopposed cases the customary formal
proofs were put in, and the standing orders complied with :
Liverpool Corporation Waterworks.
Eastern Union and Bury St. Edmund's Railway Amalga-
mation.

OPPOSED LIST.
BLANDFORD AND BURTON.
This adjourned case was then resumed. It occupied the
whole of the day, but the allegations sustained were not of
any great importance.
(Room 23, before Mr. Examiner MAY.)
UNOPPOSED LIST.

In the following onnpposed cases the formal proofs were
completed :
Great Northern Railway—Hertford, Hatfield, and St. Al-
ban's Branch.
Great Northern Railway—Deviation between Grantham
and York. _ .

Boston: Stamford, and Birmingham Railway—Branch to
Wisbech Harbour, and Wisbech Harbour Improvement.
Boston, Stamford, and Birmingham Railway—from Wis-
bech to Sutton Bridge, with Branch therefrom to Sutton St.
Mary, and Improvement at Sutton Bridge.
OPPOSED LIST"
EDINBURGH, LEITH, AND GRANTON RAILWAY,

was in the most perfect state in the days of Pompeii—
(Hear, hear)—and it should be recollected that at that
time there were more violent methods of displacemont.

FACTORY BILL.

Sir W. JAMES wished to know whether it was in-
tended to make any change with respect to the educa-
tion of factory children, and to employ the female chil-
dren in print-works?
Sir G. GREY, who spoke in so low a tone as to be
scarcely audible, was understood to say that, with re-
ference to the first point, the education of children in
print-works, it was unanimously recommended that
such education should be afforded. With regard
to the second question, the subject was under con-
sideration, and a Bill would be brought in upon the
subject. With regard to the third point, he was not
prepared, in the absence of further information, to give
a decided answer.
Mr. BRIGHT understood that there was a clause in•
troduced in the Bill which the House had under consi-
deration that fully met the object of the Hon. Member's
second question.
Sir G. GREY said there was a general report of the
factory inspectors, recommending that certain portions
of machinery should be cased in to prevent accidents.
That recommendation was under consideration.
THE POOR IN IRELAND.

Lord GEO. BENTINCK wished to ask some ques-
tions of the Right Hon. the Chancellor of the Exchequer
with reference to the Board of Works in Ireland, and
the employment of destitute persons in that country.
The first question which he wished to ask was—
What was the average weekly amount paid to each
officer of the Irish public, the number of
whom were 11,587; what were the highest and lowest
rates of wages paid to the officers of those works; what
was the gross amount of maintenance connected with
the Board of Works during the month of
January last; the gross extra expenditure con-
nected with these works as regarded clerks, &c.;
the gross cost of maintaining the destitute poor since
January, the quantity of corn bought by Government
for that purpose and the quantity in bond; and, lastly,
what was the ratio of the expenditure of the staff as at
present existing in proportion to the persons employed ?
Sir GEORGE GREY was unable to give the answer
to the first question of his Noble Friend in detail as
respected the poor in Ireland. The first question put as
to the weekly amount of the money expended for the
relief of the destitute poor in Ireland, and the answer to
that question was, according to the returns, 88,5871. The
next question as to the number of the persons employed on
those works otherwise than labourers. According to
the returns of the officials, employed on these works,
was 486, and the namber of persons employed as
labourers on those works was 10,897. The daily pay
of those persons is 2,7741. The Noble Lord then asks
the amount of the weekly pay of those persons, and
if he would multiply this amount by six he
would find what the aggregate amount was. If
the Noble Lord would turn to the same blue
book, page 19, he would find that the highest
pay of the engineer was 30s. a-day, with 10s. for travel-
ling expense., with an addition of 10s. per day when
they were out. The lowest pay was for the surveyor of
the works, which was 2s. per day. The Noble Lord
then asks, what is the actual cost of these works, and
the maintenance of those who were engaged to survey
their execution. To this he might reply that the
actual cost was 2,7001. per day, and the general
average of the week was 78,0001. To the Noble
Lord's inquiry as to the expenditure during the
month of January he could not reply, but the expense
during the four weeks of December was upwards of
.71,0004 He was not in a condition to say what the
extreme expenses were, but he might say that the actual
pay of the workmen was from Bd. to 10d. a day, and
the extretnest points ranged from Bd. to Is. 4d. for the
daily pay during the three months of November, De-
cember, and January, for the relief of the destitute poor.
The expenditure upon labour for four weeks in the
month of November was 318,3511. For the first four weeks
in the month of December, 588,0451., and for the nine
weeks of December and January it was 1,500,0001. The
amount of corn in bond during those periods amounted
to 218,000 quarters.---(Hear, hear.)
Mr. P. SCROPE gave notice that to-morrow he should
ask a question of the Government, whether, under the pre-
sent law, the Board of Guardians in Ireland were respon-
sible for the relief of the poor ? and if they were, whether
the guardians of Castlebar ought not to be prosecuted
under the law by her Majesty's Attorney-General, and
if they were not whether any steps would be taken to
render them responsible in future.
OPERATION OF THE PUBLIC WORKS BILL.

Mr. ROEBUCK stated that he had a petition to pre-
sent from a poor man named John Hogan, residing in
Dare in the county of Limerick, and which made out
rather a curious case of hardship under which he was
suffering. lie stated, in the petition, that his family,
a short time since, were in number 4, and he, with
his son, were employed on the public works by the agents
of the Government. He had the misfortune to lose one
of the members of his family—a daughter ; and in con-
sequence of his loss he was dismissed from the works ;
he and his son having been employed for some time on
them. His son only was retained. Under this
singular case of :hardship he applied to the Board
of -Relief, and their answer was that they
could not relieve him. The petition went on to say that
it was lamentable to allow such determined oppression
to be exercised upon a poor family who had not a single
perch of land, whilst there were instances to be found in
the locality of people who had land and corn, and also
money in the savings bank, working on these works, and
sent there by their landlords for the purpose of enabling
them to pay their rent better.
Colonel RAWDON presented a petition from Armagh
in favour of tne Bill introduced by the Noble Lord the

Member for Lynn.
The Marquis of GRANBY hoped that the House
would extend its indulgence to him whilst he endea-
voured to make some observations upon the measure now
under the consideration of the House. He could assure
the House that it was his anxious desire to ab.
stain from saying anything which could excite a
personal feeling. He hoped that he might be
allowed to say, that he heard with the deepest regret
the determination which the Noble Lord at the
head of the Government had come to respecting this
measure, for he had hoped from the assurance his Noble
Friend had given to the Noble Lord at the head of the
Government, that he proposed this measure, not
in hostility to her Majesty's Ministers, but
as a means of facilitating the carrying out
of the measures proposed by the Government.
The Noble Lord the Member for London said he could
not support the Bill, and also expressed his
determination, if defeated on it, that he would resign.—
(Hear, hear.) He (the Marquis of Granby) was quite
sure the Noble Lord was actuated by high and
patriotic motives ; but he regretted the determi-
nation, as he believed it would be for the injury
of Ireland. He would not go into the compara-
tive merits of the Government and the Bill now under
consideration, as he did not think the two schemes were
incompatible.—(Hear, hear.) In considering any plan
of relief for Ireland, he would not enter into the causes
that had brought about the present state of that country.
Whether it had arisen from unwise legislation, or from
the conduct of absentee landlords ; whether it arose
from any peculiarity of disposition in the Irish
people, or the system of letting land which
prevailed he would not affirm, but this he would say,
that there was only tws practical modes of meeting the
evil ; either by a diminution of the population, or an
increase of capital. There was no other remedy.—
(Hear, hear.) Now the Noble Lord, the Member
for the City of London, had said, that he had no
Government or general plan of emigration. Though he
(the Marquis of Granby) thought a good deal might be
done in that direction, still he did not think it would be
a cure for the evils which afflicted Ireland. The next
course, therefore, was to introduce capital into Ireland,
and as from the state of the country and the want of
confidence, from whatever cause which prevailed in
regard to it, private individuals were not prepared to
introduce capital, the Bill of the Noble Lord the Member
for Lynn would be the effectual means of doing so.
His Noble Friend had shown so clearly the benefits that
Ireland must derive from that measure—he had stated
so eloquently the employment it would give—the new
mark ets it would open, the increased value to that coun-
try in the most essential points. The benefit the poor
man would derive, not only from the employment it
would give, but from the industrious habits t 1 would
cherish, by attaching him fully to the comforts of
his home, that he thought it would be one of the
most desirable measures ever proposed.—(Hear.) He
would refrain from expressing any opinion of his own,
but he might be permitted to quote the opinions of others.
He would call the attention of the House, in the first
place, to a memorial presented to Lord Besborough
in 1846. The memorial was from the inhabi-
tants of the City of Dublin, whose opinions
certainly N
obloeugLbotrd here
tobe
considered
eed
which,
.stated that the memorialists were aware of
the strong opinion of the country to promote railway
enterprise, from which they expected the greatest pos-
sible good would result ; that the 40,000 persons were
employed by the works then in operation ; and pressing
the matter warmly on the attention of his Excellency.
He was not arguing that in a country where employment
was ample, where food was abundant, where artificial
wants had already been established, where happiness and
abundance reigned—he was not arguing that in such
a country as that they might Rot quicken the pulse of that
country to a feverish and unhealthy action; but what he
was say ing was this, that in the present low
and unfortunate condition of Ireland a system
of railways well carried out might produce the
most important benefits. Amongst the other important
effects a system of railways must have in Ireland at the
present moment, he thought would be the means of facia
!Hating the transference of fish throughout Ireland.
He held in his hand a letter he had received from
a gentleman in Ireland who was well versed on this sub-
ject, arid for whose talents and integrity he could vouch.
It was nut, however, written for the purpose of assisting
the Noble Lord's motion, because it was dated and he
received it so far back as the end of October, 1845.
The writer said, that at the end of October, 1845,
he was in Galway, and was much interested with
the proceedings of the Claddagh fishermen. The
herrings were on the bank, and he observed
at leastra thousand boats shoved out to sea. The com-
munity were under the direction of a king, whom they
obeyed more implicitly than any other monarch.
The thousand fishing boats brought in, on an average,
8,000 herrings, which sold at the rate of 103. a thou-
sand, or 120 for Is. This number was equally
divided among the fishermen, and before the close
of the day they were sold to purchasers who
attended with horses and carts, to hawk them over the
country. Eight thousand herrings at 10s. per thousand
came to 41. per brat, and the gross amount was,
therefore, 4,0001. per day. The shoals of herrings
continued off the head of the bank; but the King of
Claddagh would not allow any of the fishing boats to go
out until the hawkers returned.—(Sear, hear.) Thus