The Sun.
London, England, 1841-02-03 00:00:00

MARINE FORCES.

Lora GEORGE LENNOX gave notice that he
should to-morroiv move for certain returns relative to
the Marine Forces.
POOR-LAWS.

Lord G. SOMERSET moved for certain returns
connected with the Poor-laws.
Mr. O'CONNELL n ovcd for certain returns
relating to the number of electors in the towns
and boroughs of Ireland.
DROPPED ORDERS.

The Dropped Orders were then disposed of.
Lord J. RUSSELL postponed the introduction o
his Bill for the Registration of Voters till Monday next
On the motion of Mr. G REENE the Select Committee
on Petitions for Private Bills was named : and on the
motion of Mr. HUME the Select Committee on
Printing was appointed.
In answer to a question from Mr. SHAW,
Lord MORPETH said that the lion, and Learned
Gentleman had stated pretty correctly that the amount
of the arrears of tithes owing to the clergy in Ireland,
which had been cistributcd, was very small,
amounting to no more than 6s. 101. in the
pound. With respect to the sums due on
the sam:, account from the landlords, he had to state
that a co3sidcrable part had been got in, and was ready
for a.most immediate distribution, and he could assure
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, and the House, that
his Hon. and Learned Friend was taking the most co-
gent and stringent steps to recover the rem7.inder.
REPEAL ASSOCIATION.
Captain POLHILL said, in rising to renew the
question which he put to the Noble Lord the
Secretary for the Colonies on Friday last, the
answer to which was so unFatislactory that he had
then given notice of his intention to renew the question.
—(Cries of " Order, order, Chair, chair.")
The SPEAKER said the Hon. Member might put
his observations in
doin
as that might give rise to a debate.
Captain POLHILL felt greatly obliged to the
ckuess o question, but he must not make any
Speaker. He was perfectly in order when he was giv-
ing the reasons why he thought the answer of the Noble
Lord unsatisfactory. He was not bound to enter into
satisfactory answer than on the former
occasion.
any discussion of the question : he would merely repeat
rthe eqivu ee
Hr
sat i omn
0, ine the hopes that he and the House would
Ho
would then ask the Noble :Lord
"Whether her Majesty's Government is aware of a
ng the sincere thanks of Prince Albert
letter addressed to T. M. Ray, Esq., dated Bucking-
ham Palace, January 20th, 1841, and signed G. E.
toAnson,fo r hthe a r address
c jono ea
to his Royal Highness upgn the birth
yl iNational Repeal Association of Ireland,'
of a Princess ?"
Lord JOHN RUSSELL immediately rose and
said-44m the Hon. Goutlereau put the questiou to

ale on a former occasion, I have seen the letter t:
he refers in the newspapers, but I have not thotuzlit
it necessary to trn?ke any inquiry on the subject.—(Loud
cheers and. laughter.)

SYRIA.
Air. HUME swished to ask the Noble Lord the Se-
cretary for the Colonies whether, by the despatches that
had lately 'been received by the Government f;om the
Levant, they had. learnt that the treaty of Captain
Napier or Admiral Stopford had been carried into
effect, and whether Syria had been evacuated, and the
authority ef the Porte established in that province ?
Lard-JOHN RUSSELL replied that all the infor-
mation he could give the Hon. Gentleman was to this
effect. The tons cation signed by Commodore Napier
was wahoett the authority of the Ambassador, and
was *vat approved of by Sir Robert Stopford,
and the submission Mehemet Ali had made in
consequence of the instructions given by Admi-
eat Stopford, had been accepted by the Sultan.
The Sultan had in consequence given instructions to
Commissinners to
_proceed to Alexandria, se had
instructed that Commission to inform Mehemet
Ali that he would give to him the hereditary
Pachalic of Egypt. With regard to the evacuation
of Syrin, arreng,ements were making by which
Ibrahim and the troops under his command would eva-
cuate Syria and return to Egypt without molestation.
That operation had not yet of' course been effhcreel, but
arrangements were being made for the purpose of carry-
ing it into effect. Mehemet Alt had given proofs of his
readiness to fulfil the arrangement by giving up the
fleet which belonged to the Sultan. The fleet was
fitted out, and it was expected that it would soon be
ready to proceed to its destination.—( Hear, hear.)
Mr. HUME wished also to ask whether or not that
arrangement had been effected by the Sultan in car se-
quence of advice given to him by the Four Powers?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said the resolution conic to
by the S,ltan was certainly in consequence of the advice
given hint by the Four Powers.—(Hear, hear.")
CANADA.
Sir R. PEEL wished to ask the Noble Lord whe-
ther he had lately received any despatches from the Go,
vernor of Canada, and tell titer it was his intention to
present them to the House ?
Lord J. RUSSELL rather thought no despatches
had been received since the last that were presented to
Parliament, but h© was not prepared to give eny posi-
tive answer.
Sir R. PEEL then inquired whether any day bad
been fixed for giving effect to the Act of Union ?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL replied that it had been
the intention of the Governor-General to proclaim the
onion at the end of January or the beginning of the
present month. But (as we understood the Noble
Lord, who spoke in a very subdued tone) it would be
necessary, very shortly, to assemble the Legislature of
Upper Canada, and if the Union was not by that time
proclaimed, it was the intention cf the Governor-Ge-
neral to propose a Special Council to consider what
time the proclamation should issue.
BETTER ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL moved for leave
to bring in a Bid for facilitating the Administration of
Justice. He said he should occupy but a small portion
of the time of the House, because the measure had
already been before it, and he believed would not
meet with any serious opposition. Tile measure which
he now proposed to bring in related merely to that im-
portant branch of jurisdiction, the Equity Courts ;
was very important that the causes which came
before those Courts should be decided with
all possible celerity ; or that there could be no
debate ; but great and lamentable delays had arisen in
the administration of that branch of jurisprudence, not-
withstanding the high character of the Judges who had
presided in those Courts, and their unwearied endeavours
to afford relief. He believed the great cause of delay
had been the increase of business which toes as-
signed to them. From the increased popu-
lation of the country, and from its stiil more
increased wealth, and the enormous property which came
under the administration of those Courts; it was utterly
impossible that justice could be done to suitors tinder
the present system. The property to be administered
was now increased to a vast extant. The introduction
of railways and the Acts relating to them had
very greatly added to the business which was
brought. before those Courts. The consequence
had been that numerous complaints had been made of
the slow administration of justice. The arrear of busi-
ness was very great. He belived there were at that time
between 12 and 1300 causes in the Court of Chancery.
Between the time when a cause was set down for
hearing, and the time when it came on to be heard,
a period elapsed of not less than three years, and,
open an average, it was five years from the time
when a suit was instituted, before it was fin,:lly
decided. When it had once been disposed of, it came
on again on further directions, and that would happen
repeatedly before the Court came to its fled decision.
The expenses arising from delays in suits frequently
amounted to forty thousand pounds. It often hap-
pened, too, that the solicitors were great sufferers, in
consequence of the large sums which they wereeih'iged
to advance before the causes in which they might be
engaged were ended. Such evils being thus in exist-
ence, what was to be done ? It was quite clear that
some alteration must be made in the administration of
the law.—(Hear, hear.) If they first looked to the
Court of Exchequer, they would find that to
be a tribunal both for the administration of law and
equity. There were two divisions of the Court, one for
common law, the other for equity—one of the many
disadvantages arising from that arrangement was that
the Judge before whom equity causes were heard was
generally obliged to go on circuit from July to Novem-
ber, and if any injunction was granted by that Judge a
delay necessarily arose from his absence. Another great
evil was that there was no appeal from that Court but
to the House of Lords. Some remedy must be found
for those evils. They must either abolish the equity
jurisdiction of the Court of Exchequer, or if they should
continue it, the only mode he (the Attorney-General)
could see of their so doing was by appointing another
Judge who would devote himself entirely to the
equity business of the Court, and from whom
there should be an appeal to the Lard high
Chancellor. It did, however, appear to him (the
Attorney-General) better to abolish the equity juris-
diction of the Court of Exchequer, and allow it to be en-
tirely a Court of Common LAW. That was the universal
feeling entertained on the subject. The first object of the
Bill he (the Attorney-General) proposed was to abolish
the equity jurisdiction of the Court of Exchequer. The
next question was, what addition would be made to the
judicial power of that Court ; because, if they abolished
the equity jurisdiction they should make some substitute.
In 1828, when Lord Lyndhurst was Chancellos, a Bill
was brought down from the other House for appointing
a new Vice-Chancellor. That Bill did not pass into a

law. The question now was what should he the amount
of judicial strength in the Court of Chancery.
It was proposed by the present Bill that
there should be two sew Judges, but that number was
not to be continued without again consulting Parlla-
ment. His (the Attorney-General's) own opinion was,
that the number of Judges in the Court of Chancery
ought to be increased, as by that means a great
influx of the business would take place. The
House would probably be suprised when he stated
that for debts under 1001. no person thought of
going into equity. It was therefore clear that
with respect to sums under that amount
there was a total denial of justice. Here
there was no remedy in a Court of Law, but under the
Bill passed at the close of the last session there could
be no doubt that great improvements would be effected
in the Master's office, and also in the administra-
tion of Justice in the Court of Chancery
He trusted, therefore, that the House would offer no
opposition to the introduction of the Bill. All that he
(the Attorney-Gcneral) was afraid of was that he
should be blamed for not going far enough. His
Right Honourable Friend the Member for Ripon
had given notice of a Bill to improve the jurisdiction of
the House of Lords and that of the Privy Council.
He (the Attorney General) admitted the nece!-
sity for such a measure, for he thought that
the Bill he was then asking for leave to
introduce should be kept to itself. He thought that
the proper course would be to appoint a permanent
Judge of the Court of Chancery, and that the Lord
Chancellor should hear appeals in the House of Lords.
A Bill for that purpose had been introduced last session.
That Bill had not met with the approbation of the
House of Lords. He had now brought in a Bill, which
he hoped would prove a large instalment of legal reform.
One of its objects was to abolish the equity juris-
diction of the Exchequer, and to dispatch the
equity business in a manner that would be satis-
factory to the country. There were necessarily
involved in such a manner, a great number of details
which could only he discussed in Committee. But he
was happy to say, that neither retiring allowances nor
compensation for salaries would form part of those
details ; as there were already funds in the
Court of Equity, Exchequer, and the Court of
Chancery, which were quite adequate to meet the ex-
penses of the Bill, which he now begged leave to bring
n, for the better regulation of the administration of
ustice.

Sir E. SI.) GDEN said that it was now the time
for him to state his opinions upon the pre-
sent state of the Courts of Equity. He had sup-
ported a measure for the alteration of the jurisdictio❑ of
the Courts of Equity, but that measure was postponed
by the Noble Lord opposite (we believe Lord J. Rus-
sell), on account of the late period of the Session. It was
now proposed that two new Judgesin Equity be appointed.
Each of the proposed new Judges must have a separate
Court, with a separate B sr, and thus in fact it was the
establishment of two new courts which was proposed.
He thought the House would agree with him, that if
there could be a greater evil than the want of sufficient
judicial power to meet the judicial exigencies of the country
it must be the baying more Courts than the exigencies
of the country required—there could not be a greater
evil than the useless multiplication of Courts. He knew
that it was proposed that one of the Judges fully be a
temporary Judge, and that at an uncertain period,
aaaaal yt at his death, the Court should no longer bo

•an effective Court. Had the Hen. and Learned
Gentleman le fiscted on the inconvenience that must
necessarily ensue from a great Court of Justice being
suddenly extinguished ? The creation of a new Court
would at the same time create a body of lawyers attend-
ing that Court; the supply would be equal to the demand
created, and he put it to the House what must be the
effect of the sudden extinction of such a Court. He was
ready to go to the full extent of granting all the judicial
power that might be wanted, if that want were proved,
whatever might be the inconvenience attending it ;
but he felt so strongly the evils arising from the
establishments of more Courts than were wanting that
he should expect a strong case to be made out for' the
establishment of two more Courts. His Learned
Friend had not entered much into detail in stating the
case to the House, but the returns for which he
(Sir E. Sugden) had moved, which he himself had
seen, and which would be in the hands of Hon. Members
in the course of a few days, would show that his
Honourable and Learned Friend was entirely mis-
taken in the statement ho had made, with regard
to the state of the arrears in these Courts.
His Honourable and Learned Friend had stated
that there were from 1 '2OO to 1,300 cases in arrear in
the Court of Chancery. Now his Hon. and Learned
and had in his statement more than doubled the ac-
tual ammiet—the number of cases in arrear did net
amount to one-half that number. Again, his
Honourable and Learned Friend had stated that
eo cause could be heard until three years after it had
been set down. Now, the fact tens, as regarded
one of those Courts, that the Master of the
Rolls was now engaged in hearing causes
is their regular course, not one of which
bad been set clown prior to Easter term, 1840.
He entirely acquitted his Hon. and Learned Friend
of any intention of misleading the House, but he had
certainly entirely mistaken the case. Ile would not
deny that great and unavoidable delays had taken
place in the Court of Chancery, and, seeing how all the
:treat offices of that Court were filled, he would •
admit that it was hopeless ever to expect to see
Judges more capable of filling their high stations
than those learned persons who presided over these
Courts. It was impossible men could do more by a
total devotion of all their time to the execution of the
duties of their office then. those learned persons did—
(Cheers.) And he felt assured that what they had
not been able to do, no other persons would be
able to accomplish. His Hon. and Learned Friend had
reminded the House, that in 1829 ho had proposed in
that House what was commonly called Lord Lynd-
hurst's 13i11, for the appointment of one new Judge
in Chancery, and he would say that if that new
Judge had been then granted with • the same
good will with which he was now disposed to grant it,
the delays complained of would not now have existed.—
(Hear, hear.) The Honourable and Learned Gen-
tlemen had also said, that the Court of Review had
not answered the expectations which had been enter-
tained of it, and that it was proposed that it
should be abolished. Now when the establishment
of that Court had been first proposed, they had talked
for hours against it on his side of the Mouse without
avail.—(Opposition cheers.) lie himself had shown
the utter impossibility of there ever being business
sufficient to occupy the time of thet Court,
and, notwithstanding all, a new Court had been
established with four new Judges, in the face of
every argument. What had been the consequence ?
Why, that Court had sunk lower and lower
in his esteem, until at length it was acknowledged
to be of no use whatever, and had gone far to bring the
administration of justice into contempt, at least as
far as the establishment of a useless Court could do so.
Ho trusted he bed stated sufficient to show the ex-
treme danger arising from the creation of useless Courts.
As in 1-829 and 1830 so he still thought that it was ab-
solutely necessary that one additional Judge should be
appointed. If his Hon. Friends on the other side of
the House could show him and the House, by figures,
that two Judges in addition were necessary, he should
cheerfully acquiesce in it. He was anxious that the
Court might be placed in a situation to answer
the exigeuces of the case.—(Hear.) It had been
said that a great many compromises had been
made, and that when there was additional accommoda-
tion there would be fewer compromises, and a great
many more cases to bear.—(Hear, hear.) N'-
thing surprised him more than the statement
of the great number of compromises thet had taken
place is the Court of Chancery. It was a great
mistake to suppose that one-tenth part of what
had been stated in evidence was the real amount.
These parties generally took the number of bills
filed, then they reckoned the number set down for hear-
ing, and finding that perhaps thirteen cases have slipped
out, they say ail these had been compromised. After
the cases are set down for hearing, another number slips
out, and here they say is another compromise. Now there
was not. the slightest foundation for that statement.
He (Sir E. Sugden) knew something of the practice
of the Court of Chancery, and he could assert
that nothing aces more rare than compromising.
The case might not be a promising one, and when the
Bill was filed it was met by a demurrer or plea
which formed a complete answer to it, and
consequently it went for nothing. Another class
of cases was injunctions, and when the motion was
once made, whether it semis successful or not, there was
nothing more heard of it. There was another
great class with which the parties having made up
their minds to go to law were anxious to ob-
tain the sanction of a person of character. A per-
son was determined to go to law. He was told by
Counsel that he had no case. The case you have
stated, he was told, affords no equity ; you will be
beaten ; I cannot advise you to file a bill. What did
he say t " Why, Sir, that is all very true, but I tell
you that my opponent has certain papers in
his possession ; he has made admissions to the
effect that ho has them ; those papers will
prove my equity, arid, therefore, if' I file my bill when
this man is put upon his oath, he will prove my case."
Counsel told such a man not to be deluded, not
to file a bill, for that when the answer would
come in it would destroy every tittle of his equity.
If they took what he had stated into consideration, it
would account for a great number of cases that never came
to a hearing. His impression, therefore, was, that they
could not, by melting any great addition to the number
of Judges facilitate the adjudication of causes. From
some returns for which he bad moved, it appeared that
the Lord Chancellor, in the sittings of 1839,
and ending in 1840, had heard 79 original causes,
and 22 exeptions ; so that the Lord Chancellor had
heard 101 original motions as a Judge of orginal juris-
diction. He had heard during that time 130 appeals. As
that seemed to be a very !Loge number he would explain
to the House that the average number of appeals, ori-
ginal causes, and exceptions, was from twenty-
eight to thirty, and the large number that he had
stated was made up of motions and petitions.
Great misapprehension had gone abroad with respect
to short causes. Many persons supposed that they
were not adverse causes ; now that was not the fact,
for sometimes it happened that some of the most im-
portant points of law were decided upon short causes,
without that consideration which a Judge was bound
to: pay to such questionr. A great portion of
the arrears in the Court of Chancery had been cleared
off, and since the long vacation up to the end of Hilary
the Lord Chancellor had heard 106 original causes, 19
further directions, and 22 appeals ; the Vice-Chancellor
had heard 70 original causes, 17 further directions,
and had been occupied twenty-eight days upon
motions, and nearly the whole of the last term the
Vice-Chancellor had been occupied upon motions
end petitions. The Master of the Rolls had heard in
the same time twenty-four original causes, fifteen further
directions, and forty-seven short causes. At present lie
was happy to say there were very few judgments, indeed
he might say there was no arrear of judgments, and all
the appeals before the Lord Chancellor had been heard,
with the exception of six. There was an actual arrear
in the Rolls' Court of somewhere about 100 causes,
and these 100 causes could no doubt be heard in the
time dedicated to them. They would all be cleared off
in the course of the Term. He anticipated that there
would be no arrear whatever in the causes to be heard
in the Rolls' Court in Easter Term. In the Vice-
Chancellor's Court the original causes to be disposed of
were three hundred and four, to which there was an
addition of ninety-five, making altogthcr 195 causes. As
regarded the entire number of arrears, they amounted
only to five hundred and fifty, instead of thirteen or
fourteen hundred, as had been represented. By the es-
tablishment of a new Court they would be enabled in the
course of the judicial year, to clear off every portion of
the existing arrear. They had at present the Vice-
Chancellor's Court, the Master of the Rails' Court,
and the Lord Chancellor's Court, with powers to hear
original causes and matter. He had, therefore, cer-
tainly with great deference to others, but with some
knowledge upon the subject, formed a very strong ()Pi-
nion that one Judge would meet the exigency
case, and that the arrears would speedily be disPo9ed
of. The Vice-Chancellor had told him that there
rwaosf
no arrear of motions, and that there of the
petitions—all the motions had b
petitions,
which had been heard. Besides the railway
been was no
and all the
droppingspff, so that the Courts were ng cleared of
which had occupied a great deal of
bteirine, were nowr
ofimpededease s
that e
hraecgie uoleeero
phi
euds eosrse.
tTh
he seer
eo
Ibvsatsa canotherwhich
e iass
time than the country or the House was aware of—he
meant the questions that had arisen relative to Munici-
pal Corporations and Charity Trustees, in consequence
of a measure that had passed that House. His Hon.
and Learned Friend's proposition, with his data, might
be a very reasonable one, because ho said there were
1,000 or 1,300 original causes, and that three years
elapsed before any cause could be heard from the time
it was set down. Now Ito had shown that causes load
been heard which were set downin Easter Term year.
The business of the Courts was not halt that which it was.
lie would advise the House to pause before they esta-
blished two new Courts at once—lie would say, proceed by
slow degrees, even although they might be necessary.
There might be such a thing as creating causes. He be-
lieved it was Dean Swift who once said to his cook, " Take
away that beef and do it a little less—it is too much