The Sun.
London, England, 1815-04-20 00:00:00

HOUSE OF COMMONS

A Petition was presented from the Clerks in the Office of
the AccOtoptarit-General of the. High Court
:of Chancery,
praying for an increase of salary.
Colonel PALMER presented a Petition from the TraderS of
the City of Bath, against the late Insolvent Debtors' Bill, and
praying for its repeal.
The Count y Rate Bill was read a third time.
The lrish Bank IteStriction Bill, and the Bill for granting
Couniensaiion to the ()slicers of the Commissary Court at
Edinburgh, passed through a Committee.
The White Herrings Fishery and Sweet Wines Bills were
brougkt in and read a first time.
The Muriatic Acid Bill then passed through a COmmittee.
Mr.BANKES gave notice of a motion for Tuesday next,
relative to tine buildings at the New Mint.

PROFITS OF THE BANK.
Mr. GRFNFELL having moved and obtained, that
the 4Gth and 48th Acts of his Majesty should be
entered as read, threw himself on the, indulgence
of the House, convinced that the importance of
the subject which he was about to discuss, would
make amends for the imperfect manner in which
he should treat it. He wished to draw the atten-
tion of Parliament to certain transactions carried
on between the Government and the Bank of Eng-
land, in which the public had a direct interest.—
With the private concerns of the Bank, he was
ready to acknowlege, The House 'had nothing fo
do but in transactions in which the, public
might be considered as one party, and the
Batik- the other, he thought Parliament was not
only Competent to interfere, 'hut that it was its
duty to cuter into call proper investigations.
—These Were tratisActions of this nature. The
first branch arose out of the monies placed in
the hands of the Bank of Vhogland, acting as the,
Bankers of fliovernment. *: he House were aware
of the existing practice by which a. considerable
portion of the revenue was placed in the Bank of
Engiatid on account of several public services., to
be afterwards drawn out of the Bank on the drafts
of the persons at the head of the departments to
which those services were attached. This did I
not go beyond the nature of a simple banking con-
ecru. The Bank ,vas neither exposed to- any '
greater risk than in its transactions with
ittdici-
clrcals, nor subjected to any ,olditional expellee in
providing clerks or buildings for transacting this
business„ The Papers he should inOve for on
this subject -would be -,a .coutinnation of those,
eight in number, produced by the Bank in 1807
to a .Select Committee of this House. They
would exhibit the different balances in the hands
of the Bank under different circumstances, and.
would enable the House to arrive at a correct
statement of the whole of the politic money lying
totally unproductive to the public, bat yielding
such profits to the Bank, that it gained annually a
sum equal to the interest on the whole capital of
the sum vested From the Papers produced at the-
tittle to which he had alluded, it appeared that, in
1807, the amount of,the balance in the hands of
the Bank rose to the immense shim of eleven mil-
lions sterling,. which produced a, yearly interest of
upwards of 500,0001. He thought himself en-
titled to consider this as a bum paid by the
public to :the Bank merely for. the trouble
Of keeping,the money placed in its bands. Tlle
only light thrown ou the state of, this balance
at a later period, was contained in a Letter of
the Chatnellor of the Exchequer, written to the
Bank, in whiCh he mentioned, that in 1808, the
balance was unnitoinished. • Since that time it
must'have increased in proportion to the aligmen-
tation of our expenditure. ate of the prilicipal
objects of his motion would be to show what al-
teration had taken place in the amount of the ba-
lances since 1807,- and what it was at present, in
order that truth., and facti'should lead the'Llonse
to an accurate judgment on this subject. In ISOG,.
the Bank were pleased to advance, as it was
styled, a loan of three millions during the war,
on condition that the public should pay an interest
of three per cent. 'lbis Loan expired ir, the month
of DeceMber last, and the interest due, opon it
amounted to 720,0001. In 1808, another Loan to
the same amount had been procured, and in Dec.
last the Chancellor of the Exchetpier had stated,
that the. Bank agreed to prolong that Loan without
interest until the sth of April next. He did not
consider that transaction either as an advance or
an accommodation, but merely as Q. liberty given
to the Public to use its own money, If six mil-
lions had thus been drawn out of the Bank, five
still remained, and with this stipulation, that the
'Public were to pay 90,000/. per ann. for the li-
berty of using three millions of its own money,—
and' in all, a sum of not less than 720,0001. .-Sup-
posing the balOce to have heen, as in 1807, \ll
. the Bank now • lent the country three,
and retained eight, the annual 'interest Of which
was 400,0001. This was an object on which he
invited and urged -his Right Hon. Friend (the
Chancellor of the Exchequer) to consider, wile-
: titer. in die eircumAtances and difficulties in which
the nation was placed, it would'he ju,t that the
pahlie should pay so vast a sunk for a sacrifice ou
the part of the Bank, so circumscribed in its ope-
ratioli. The next branch to which he sholild call
the attention of the Muse would be the commis-
Hsion granted to the Bank on the account 'tit the
~Natinual Debt. In 1786, Mr. Pitt fixed the rate
of the Cooriaissioo at 4301. on every million, and
there had liven no alteration tilt 1868,. a period of
22 yo-ars. During that time the debt of the coun-

[PRICE SIXPENCE-TIALFPEN7ST;

try having become enormous, the produce of the
commission had proportionably, increased. lc
was consequently agreedi it should be reduced
one-third, or from 4501. to 3001. per
No man knew better.than he the satisfactory
manner in which this service was performed. lie
acknowledged that the Bank were exposed by it
to some losses, and towelled to iNeur consider-
able expence in buildings and an establishment of
cl'rks to transact the business, but when he
looked at the papers, and saw the amount of the
remuneration which had been paid Jast year,
267,0001. be thought the. public had a right to
look at the Bank for a considerable deduction.----
The Bank of the United States paid the dividend
Without making any 'charge to the state. He
was far from comparing it in importance with.
ours, but it must be recollected, that on one
side there was 267,000 pounds, and on the
other nothing. He should also move for
pers to shew what increase had occurred in the
issues on the Bank in consequence of the Re-
striction Act of 1797. The issues of Bank Paper
had not amounted to less_annnally than 16 or 18
Millions, and the profits on them to between 7
and 800,0001. When it. was recollected that the
Bank owed these profits to an Act of the Legis-
lature, he thought the public entitled to be treat-
ed with the utmost liberality. Although he anti-
cipated" the objections •which his Right Holt.
Friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) would
probably make to his motion, he was sure that it
it were possible to. look into his heart, he would be
found conscious of its propi:iety. After expressing
the high respect which be entertained for the Banl
of England, and the persons at its head, he alluded
to the immense profits which they had made during
the last -18 years. They had been able to divide a
sum of' seven or eight millions, besides their or-
dinary dividend of seven per cent. These gains
were chiefly occasioned .by the system of restric-
tions, artd the profits gained by the B Ink on
transacting the business of the Government, and
the public had a right to be admitted a larger.
participation in them, or at least to expect that
the business transacted by the Bank, would be
done at less "expence. He concluded by moving
for an account-of the balances in cash in the hands
of the Bank on the Ist and 15th of every month,
from the Ist of -14'ebruary, 1807, to April 1, 1815,
resulting front. the payments of• the Customs mid
till other branches of public revenue, and stating
the average balance of cash in each ycktr,;. .

The motion having been
,seconded by Mr.
PoNSONBY,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER conceived.
that the lion. Gentleman had-made his motion On
thii subject touch earlier than lie needed to have
done. There ;vould'be titne enough, previousto
the expiration of the Act, for the House to enter
into the consideration which the lion. Gentleman
had pi oposed. Not three mouths ago, the Bank
bad advanced 3,000,0001 to Government, upon
the faith that no alteration should he made in the
balances left in their hands; and the House could
not, with any propriety or justice, open a bar-
gain which they had' so lately approved. , The
Hon. Gentleman had thrown a false colouring on
the balances—they arose from: a great ,variety of
transactions ; and as to that part which related
to the consolidated fund, the House could not in-
terfere with it, without violating the faith of 'pub-
lic credit. Very considerable sums were lodged
in..the Bank to answer the purposes of Govern-
ment, and the profit made by the Bank was not
the point for consideration. Those balances arose
under several Acts of Parliament, over which the
House had no controul.• The Hon. Gentleman
had referred to another advance made by the
Bank, to the amount of three millions, in the
year 1808, but as the period was-afterwards ex-
tended without any interest, the public bad
been gainers in that transaction. It might be
material to consider whether it would not be
possible in future to reduce the balance in the
hands of the Bank, but the House would have
sfifficient opportunity to investigate ghat point be-
fore the next Session of Parliament. Consider-
ing, Vierefore, that the motion of the Hon. Gen-
tleman %VHS premature, he should beg leave to
move-the previous question. •
Mr. BANKES thought it was a matter of indiffer-
ence whether the information mover! for should
be laid immediately' before the House or no, pro-
vided it should be produced in time to give an
opportunity for its fullest consideration. The
public had received an injury, and, had not enjoy-
ed that particification in the profits derived by the
Corporation of the Bank, which it had a right to
expect. The only specific obligation to which
the Chancellor of the Exchequer had bOund
the public was, that the business should he
carried on in the . sante manner, and that none
of those balances •should be withdrawn. But
did he think the House was also bound •not to
Suggest any economical mode of lessening those
balances i If they could be reduced from eleven
to seven or eight millions, would he consider
• such a reduction as a breach of faith ? And did'
he conceive himself engaged to keep the same, or
nearly the same amount of balance.? Due eco-
- nom y on the part of the country, he was con-
vinced, had not been observed, and he did not
think that the • bargains of 1807 and 1808 'had
been as favourable as they ought to have been.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER wished
distinctly to explain, that we were not at liberty,
under the present system, to withdraw public ba-
lances from the Bank. He was willing to lidop
any regulation', in order by every means to lessen,
the amount of issues of every department of the
public service ; but the motion wholly reterret to
the Consaildpted Fund, over winch the house
had no controul.

Mr. PQNSOIBY was not sure whether he had
perfectly understood the Right Hou. ugatiewati.

)i,l otleetlo prauctlon of the accounts
the present Session, or -only oppose their pro-
idoetion on that day If be meant the latter, be
'(Mr. P.) saw no objection to his taking the day
inost agreeable to himself. He agreed that, under
the. preqe“d s‘stetn, it would not be just to ,alter
the accounts which were ordered to be kept at the
:Bank of England ; and his Hon. Friend who had
made the ► .oiion had no desire of interfering With
the Bank. in the advaotages secured to thent by
Act of Piirlianient, The Right Hon. Gentleman
bad said, that the accounts were very Voluthin-
ons, and that it would occapy, a great length
' time to consider bow to make arrangements ad-
. Vantageotts to the public : but for those very
reasons, it was necessary that the consideration
of the subject shot& not be delayed. The
Right Honourable Gentlethan had not stated that
any. public inepnvenience, or any' inconveOienee
to the Bank, would arise from itiutediate ittvesti-
gation.. The Ac't of Parliament would expire on
the sth of April next ; and he (Mr. P.) left it to
the House t, consider, bow they would answer to
the country for refusing to institute inpiry
as
early as possible.
Mr. IERNEY thought that •it would be proper
for.some of the GentlentetCpresent, belonging to
the Bank, to State their objections to his Hon.
Friend's motion. .
MAavATT was convinced the papers Would
show that an undue
_consideration had been paid
by the public to the Bank for the business which
was done. Private Bankers made no charge, and
were satisfied With the benefit which they derived
froin the money beitigplaced in their hands. Even
with that the Bank would be remunerated. The
profits of the Tellers of the Exchequer had been
found to encrease etiorniously with the augmenta-
tion of the public expenditure, and hail been pro-
. perly curtailed. The Bank stood exactly. in the
same .situation, and the same remedy should be
applied, If the papers were voluminous, the sooner
they should be produced the better.
The Hense then divitled on the Prey."'" clues`
tioll •

Ayes, 9,l—Noes, 75—Majority, 19.
Some of the motions were agreed to, and others
WithdraWn, with a notice that they would be
--bronght forward on a future day;
Mr. BARHAM brought in the.SlLve Trade Bill,'
*hiCh was react a first time, and ordered to be
read a second time on-Monday next.
Sir JAMES MACKINTOSH gave notice that he
should, on the firit open day, move for Some far-
ther 'papers respectiui Genoa. He wished to
kno* whether , the papers already ordered would
be delivered by Friday.
Ldrd ess7l..sx EACH said, that he had no ob-
jection to the new papers being granted which he
had understood that ft, was the intention of the
Eon. Gentleman to move for. _

Sir J. MACKINTOSH then moved "for a copy or
extract of the representations made by his Lord-
ship the Duke of Carnpbchi:u•o r assist) n copy of
the addresses horn the inhabitants at Gcnoa to
Lord W. itentinck, with respect to their wish to
return to their ancient Governtnent, and the an-
swers thereto ; as also a copy of the instructions
to Lord W. Bentinck (in this subject.'—.Grantea.
Sir 3. NI holt twrout then gave notice -of his inn-
t`tu►► redpectingGenna'for Thursday se'nnight.,