The Sun.
London, England, 1841-04-23 00:00:00

CHINA.

Sir R. PEEL wished to ask the Noble Lord oppo-
site whether he had received any official account of
an action which had taken place near Canton, in
which several lives had been lo=t, and if those accounts
bad been received why they had not appeared as usual
in the Gazette?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that although ac-
counts had been received through India, the, oflicial
despatches with respect to the action in question had
not yet arrived ; when they did they would appear in
the usual manner.
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL gave notice that to-
morrow he should move that after the 3d of June,
Orders of the Day do take precedence of notices of
motion on Thursdays.
Lord GItANVILLE SOMERSET begged to ask
whon the Ordnance Survey would come on ?
Sir HUSSEY VIVIAN proposed to bring it on
tomorrow evening.
NEW SOUTH WALES.
Mr. GROTE then rose to bring forward the reso-
lutions of which he had given notice, on the subject of
the colony of New South Wales. The subject was
the same on which he had had the honour to address the
House on the ?sth of la t month, and it would be
in the recollection of Hon. Gentlemen that the sitting of
tLe House on that evening had been brought to an
unexpected termination before he had had au oppor-
tunity of bringing to a close the statements he
had to make respecting the Colony. He should, there-
fore, entreat the House to bear with him while he
related the main features of the case. The resolutions
he was about to propose were the same as he had
then brought forward, and there was merely a slight
alteration in the last to get rid of an objection in point
of form. It appeared that for the last few years,
since 1835, a heavy charge had been imposed upon tho
Colony of New South Wales, namely, the entire and
undivided charge of the gaols and pohce of the settle-
ment. Up to that time the revenue hind been luily
adequate to meet the demands of the Colony, but
since then the ordinary revenue had been considerably
diminished, insomuch that recou;•se had been had to
trespassing on the land and emigration fund, which had
been already pledged and eomeuated to other pur-

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MORNING EDITION. - V T-- 7r P*
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poses. The Colonists thought that a case of e
hardness and injustice. It should be renter
that this was originally a penal colony, and that
retained marks of its origin, although it was di
suming a more colonial character. He knew it
common to say, that although there was a great nun%
of convicts, a large portion of •them were assn to. ri~r'
private masters, and it was assumed that the whole
benefit of these assignments was on the side of the
Colony ; but in toad of this being the case, a runt
of from three to four hundred thousand pounds a
year accrued to this country from these assignments.
Mr. Secretary Rice, in 1835, had estimated the ex-
pense of the colony at 25,0001., but it now amounted
to more than four times that sum—it was
above 100,0001, Was not that fact enough
to call upon tl:e House to reconsider the whole
subject. Had the Government been aware of the
state of the gaolsat that period, they would have hesitated
before they altogether liberated the Imperial treasury, and
threw the Colony upon its own resources. That the colony
had increased in wealth and population, since that period
was no valid reason for imposing upon it such heavy
charges. When it was recollected that one-third of the
population had been sent out for punishment, it would
not be thought fair that the Colony should bear the
whole expense of the gaols and police eAablishment;.
If they had carried on a system which was gradually
diminishing the resources of that country, the Colonists
had cause of great and aggravated complaint, and he
regretted to say that such had been thecase. No less than
a sum of •)60,000/. had been abstracted from the land fund
to make good that deficiency in the revenue, and for
that sum net less than 14,000 free emigrants could be
conveyed to the Colony. Now, when they looked at that
numle,,r in reference to the existing, population in New
South NV.elef, they would sec that it was a number cal-
culated to effect the most important improyeinent in
their social and ceonomie condition. The great value
of the emigration fund was that it afforded labouring
moo, whose condition in the country were extremely low,
the means of proceeding to another portion of the
British dominions where the supply of capital was more
than in proportion to the supply of labour, and when
the remuneration of every labouring man of ordinary dili-
gence was ample and certain. It was unfortunately those
who were least :dale to meet the expense of emigration
who were most required in that colony, and for whom
a fund of th&t, sort was mart particularly required.

3 NI.

If I-lon. Gentlemen would take the trouble to examine
the documents connected wi•_ll the state of New South
Wales, they would find that the colonies were suffering
greatly from the want of labour. The Honourable
Gentleman then referred to a debate which took place
in the Legislative Council of New Sout;llns
in October last, in which resolutions were passed stating
the deficiency of 1 tbour and the injurious effect
which it had upon the interests of the Coiony.
The value of colonial lands depended almost en-
tirely upou the application of the proceeds of the
sales. They were of no value in the absence of labourers.
By stristly confining the net proceeds of waste lands to
esnigration purposes, a new property was created which
otherwise would have had no existence. The enormous
fund which had bean derived from the sale of lands Lai
arisen from a general persuasion in the colony that the
proceeds of these land sales would be held sacred to the
purposes of emigration. The lion. Gentleman then, re-
fe;red to docurneats which had beeu issued by Lord How-
ick in 1831, and by Lord Glenelg in 1836 and 1837 .
sorting their intention to apply the net proceeds of land
sales strictly to emigration purposes. If he had been
succes,fal in coinotteiug the House of the hardships the
colonies had suffered, ire hoped the House mould not be
backward in making reporatisn. He considered that the
system, if comi„ne 1, would lead to the interruption cf
these land sales. Ile was a (Onion that reason and
justice required tin; t the Imperial Treasury should bear
one-half al' the charges of gaols and police. If this %Nene
done, the colony would have no other claim upon us than
the claim 'ditch all our colonies have for protection. In
his opinion also, jug.ce required that we should make up
to the calony the deficit that had at isen in consequence cf
the entire charge basing been hitherto defrayed by it. His
resolution did not go into any definite proposition. All he
required was that tl.e House would consider tile subject.
He therefore in. vi:d the fonossing resolutions
1. That it RN eara that, in October 1840, the follow-
ing resolutions were passed by the Governor and Legisla-
tive Council of New Snuth Wales, viz r—
" I. That in the opinion of this Council, the parent
State, indisputably deriving a direct pecuniary saving (in-
dependently of other advantages) from the assignment of
convicts to private service is Nev South Wales, end its
interests being at all event; in an equal if not a superior
degree involved in the due coercion an 1 diaiptioe of such
transported offenders, ought in justice to bear at least one-
half of expenses attendant on the police and gaol esta-
blishments, which are raised to their present large amount
chiefly through the introduction of a convict population
into the c luny.
" 2. That his Excellency the Governor be respectfully
solicited to represent, on behalf of this Council, to her
Majesty's Sneretsry of State for the Colonies, that this
Council has most ielnetantly consented to so large an ex-
penditure for the support at those establishments since the
Ist of July, 1835, and has voted the full amount of the
estimate for the same fur the year 1841, solely from a con-
viction that it v.ould net be justified in declining to make
provisioa for the noonnenance of the public tranquillity and
security.
" 3. That by the nparopriation, for ths period from the
Ist July, 1835, to 31st December. 1841, of so large an
amount (about 597,000/.) of the Colonial Revenue,
wising partly frown the sale of public lands, partly from
ordinary source', in defraying the whole charge of the
police and gad establishments, including buildiiigi and the
consequent diminution of those funds which Would have
been availatle for the introduction of free labour, every
branch of the productive industry of this colony is in dan-
ger of falling into decay, to the great loss arid injury not
only of the colony, but of the parent State also, more
especially of its manufacturing, commercial, and shippirg-
interests.'
" 2. That the above large expenses of police and gaol
establi-hments have, since July, 1835, been defrayed by
the application of a considerable portion of the net pro-
ceeds of the sales of Crown lands in the colony to the
general purposes of colonial revenue.
" 3. That it appears, by papers now before the House
(No. 511, 1840, No. 81, 1841), that there has been re-
ceived front the sales of Crown lands in New South
Wales, during the period from 1831 to June 1840 inclusive,
a gross total sum of -€:958,000
From which deduct
" 1. Charges of various kinds,
including expenses if the settle-
ment cf Port Philip, and of pro-
tection to the Aborigines £41,300
"2. Actual charge of survey and
mana,-,ernent (though for eight
years paid nut of tine general re-
venue of the Colony) about -C149.700
Making together about £191,000
And leaving net proceeds of sales
cf Croveu Lands to June 1840 £767,000
Whereof the sum of 502,500/. only has been applied to the
purposes of emigration from the United Kingdom to New
South Wales.
" 4. That this House will, on Wednesday next, resolve
itself into a Committee of the whole House, for the pur-
pose of con: idering the manner in which the cost of gaols
and police in New South Wales has been defrayed, and
the manner in which the Land Fund of New South Wales
has been expended, since 1835."
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER trusted
his lion. Friend would not perievere in his resolutions,
after the explanation which he had to offer. Even so far
laid
dkit adsevsl.Be2t7h,atlatohredeoGleoedyc,risceh, soon
adse it
cc.ohu,
i( expresslynisghaooulisa.
hear Fume portion of the expenses of its police ad
The at rangentent then made continued in force mad 1834,
linetuomake snottier acis.hrut
,gecce ota
oe increased,La;
y
tndf
full
ty
het
hanrsidecNlaedtntelue cie o
when Lord Althorp, then filling the office he had now the
honour to hold, had some correspondence with Mr. Secretary
colonyßice upon
having then
u expenditure
iould maintain its internal thought
atdhsei,achtlileontey
motherUeaxtepeprirs u
should aff.rrd I
he
c:cstLo,iett,:iivotilr;Y.,
and the
th:,, colony had increased, in conse-
quence of the increai.e of population and trade, vvhioli
caused a necessity for larger police and other establishmeats.
In fact, the colony was now paying, under the new arrange-
ment, less it: proportion to its augmentation than before, and
this country vi as contributisg more. The Right Ilon. Gen-
tleman then read returns of the expenditure of the colony
since 18'22, in suppot tof that statement. Nearly one-half
of the expenses of the colony were defrayed by the mother
c„untry since that time; and there could not be any great
an arr
The nitgement which left that
n undisturbed. increase of
tdlitaiiesrtirpisiohhiciipeticetutet
htoisnt'retgic'eoelwob,al'illtri ii: riot unfairly put upon the colony, as
it was occasioned exclusively by colonial circumstances, is
no way whatever cowlected with Britain. It was inspos_
Bible that ti:e imperial Government could control that ex-
renditure, which must he intrusted to the discretion of the.
local Goverument. The works carried on by the Go_
vcrnmcrit out of the land fund, in new roads, harbaurs, and
public buildings, benefited all the old colonists by im-
proving the value of their lands. It was too much to ex
pent that this country should bear the expense of a
police
ioree over which neither the Government nor the Parlia-
ment could have any control. The Right Hon. Gentle-
man concluded by moving the previous otuetion.
Mr. C. BULLER said the question for the conside-
ratim of tire House vas whether it was aWrtit while for
this House to pay 40,000/. or 50,000/. for the purpose of
prmo3. in ting emigration igxir. m
holler's)itt
to the
e
colony of New South
waic
such
be proie.ly expended in the voruotion cf so
a sum d
so important an
object. The colony, b: sides raising valuable produce for
exportation, took a large portion of our home manufac-
tures, and supplied support and subsistence for a consi-
derable part of cur populmion; and on this slew he
thought tie colonists were entitled to consideration. The
real grnund of complaint was that the colony was suffering
from the mode of punishment adoptod by the another
country—this Was plainly unjust to the colonists. He did
not rest their claims upon the pledges which had been
fromattthheey
pceorupledsensotcdfiveerestigtthae.
land sales
ceuldefthGeteesa-t
gptL;o'n'ye7e be eb(llsv' ril'otefal (it'll ee(m: t°rPi ihnui t°en ow theas h benefito
Britain. Tie expeediture of money upon the purposes of
emigration was GO idle waste of funds, but an expenditure
which ld
tell upon the wealth and prosperity of
the colony;wau
every parson who went out would
increase its value. It was a colony which ought
not to be trifled with. The amount of British experts to
New South Wales, was larger than that to cry of our
most considerable customers in Europe ; it supplied one
of the most valuable staples for our own manufacture. By
providing the colonists with what they chiefly wanted,
namely labour, the Government could at once provide a
market for hotrue manufl.mture, and furnish employment
for the t',e.Altute popula,m. He had seen many evidences

ORNING EDITION

- -
of a better spirit in the colonial department. He trusted
the Noble Lord would extend the same wise and bene-
ficial policy to this colony which bad been displayed in
his treatment of the other colonies of this empire.
Lord MAHON said it could not be denied that most
grievous distress prevailed at this moment in New South
Wales; or that it Was owing to the acts of the Govern-
ment at home. Considering the short period of its exist-
ence, the prosperity of this colony was unparalleled in
modern times; the colony in the last year exported six
million pounds of wool. Its prosperity had, however,
been greatly impeded by the acts of the Government at
home. He concurred in the abolition of asslgnmeet, be-
lieving it to be a bad system though adopted for the pur-
pose of reforming and reclaiming the convicts. At the
same time he must express his conviction that the rapid
progress of the colony was to be attributed greatly to the
existence of such a system ; it had supplied this colony
with abundance of labour, vi hen otherwise there must
have been a great scarcity. When the abolition of con-
signment was followed by the imposition of the whole ex-
pense of police, the two causes had led to great distress ;
hut when those were followed by the hasty measure of the
Noble Lord, the very worst consequence; had followed.
He held in his band a despatch received in December last,
stating that in every public deportment the greatest diffi-
culty existed; and that no undo taking, pubic or private.
could be prosecuted, unless at an enormous expense. The
distress arose from the deficiency in the supply of labour.
In many instances lambs had perished where they had been
dropped for want of hands to tend them. He ( Lord
Mahon) contended that a very strong prima
.facie
case of grievance had been made out.—( Hear, hear.)
Mr. Gibbon Wakefield laid down the opinion that the dis-
tress of the colony had not rerched its worst point, and
that " a very dane'ernue state of things was coming on in
New South Wales." Then, if he (Lord Mahon) was
asked how these evils were to be met, how these pr'ev-
ances were to be remedied, it seemed to him that there
were several modes in which the House might interpose
for the welfare of the colony. He was not prepared to
say that he would concur in any vote for the repayment
of all the sums taken from the land fund, for he believed
the labour of the convicts, from 1825, had cancelled the
claim previous to that period. In the motion before the
House as it stood originally, be was not disposed to concur,
but within the two last days a considerable change bad
been effected in it. The motion now, after reciting the
Acts of the Legislative Council in New South Wales,
pledged the House to this only, to resolve themselves into
a Committee of the whole House, for the purpose of con-
sidering the manner in which the cost of gaols and police
in New South Wales had been defrayed, and the
manner in which the land fund of New South
Wales has been expended since the year 1835. This
he ( Lord Mahon) considered to imply no more than a
disposition in the House to afford relief to the colony. but
without binding itself as to the manner. He reserved the
degree of assistance be would afford, and only pledged
himself so far as to state that he thought there was a prima
fec:e case of grievance, and that he would assist them.
But he must also say that just as the claim of New South
Wales in the present instance was, he thought it del ed
additional force from the importance at the present moment
of emigration to the British Empire. He rejoiced to see
the enlightened eagerness of the labouring population to
emigrate. Their sentiments on this subject were well ex-
pressed in the petition from Glasgow. He did not say
the sentiments so feelingly expressed in that petition were
a reason for concurring in the present motion, but they
afforded a motive for it, as shoeing that the interests of
New South Wales were identified with those of a large
portion of our own population. It was impossible to ex-
aggerate the importance of emigration at the present mo-
ment. Look at the increase of labourers in proportion to
the growth of labour, and then say whether emigration
was not the safety valve for our population. Let
country gentlemen depend upon this that emigration
would be found ie the long run to be the best Poor-law.—
( Hear, hear.) But he did not confine the importance of
emigration alone to the labouring classes. It was impos-
sible for any one to be acquainted with the literature of
this country without seeing how persons in those walks of
life were debarred, from the excess of population, from ob-
taining their daily I read. He did feel, therefore, that
there was strong reasons for this motion in the state cf Eng.
land at the present moment. In his opinion, this great and
glorious destiny was reserved for England. It was by
hying abroad the foundation of future empires she could
hest secure her own empire at home. It was by laying the
foundation of free and prosperous colonies we could best
maintain freedom, honour, and prosperity at home. Ho
did not urge this as a reason for this motion, but as corrobo-
ration for it. He believed, in equity and justice, they were
bound to comply with it; and he was the more disposed
to do so, believing that some assistance, such as should
not weigh heavily upon our resources, would promote the
welfare, and confer considerable benefit both on the colo-
nies and the mother country.—( Hear, hear.)
_

Lord J. RUSSELL said that no doubt it would be a
very agreeable thing for a member of the Government when
a motion was brought forward respecting alleged griev-
ances of the Colonies, and for assistanoe to be given from
the public revenues of this country, it he could advise that
such assistance should be given. He could assure the
Noble Lord that there was no wait of applications, and no
want of cases of other colonies making similar claims, that
part of their expenses should be charged upon the funds of
this country. Some of these were founded on strong rea-
sons. There was a State connected with this country re-
specting which a Noble Lord was about to make a motion
that evening, be meant the lonian Islands, who paid
35,000/. a-year for military contribution, and application
bad been made to relieve them from this burden, and from
the additional taxation it imposed upon them. Ceylon also
paid large sums for military expenses, and Jamaica was
also subject to great expense on this account for her courts
of justice. There were scarcely any of the colonies whose
revenues were at all available that did not say what ad-
vantage it would be if part of these expenses were paid by
the mother country. It was urged that the Governors joined
in their applications, and he found that this never failed to
be the case. The other day he was conversing with Sir
Colin Campbell, who had hardly been appointed a week
as Governor of Ceylon, what it would be best to do fur
that colony, and be had said the best thing would be to
pay part of their military expenses. If he (Lord John
Russell) were to compare all the cases of these colonies,
his opinion on the whole would Le, that the colony which
was the most favoured, and had the least cause for assis-
tance, the colony that had derived the greatest advantange
from the mother country, and had the least grievance to
complain of, was the colony of New South Wales The
Noble Lord said that there was a cause of great grievance
and distress, and he stated that there was a great demand
for labourers. No doubt there was, and no doubt the
colony would be much benefited by a large increase of
labourers, but that was not in itself a cause of distress is
the colony. When he heard Hon. Gentlemen state that
there was great distress in Ireland, that a man could not
earn 6d. a day, and lived on potatoes, and that both him-
self and his family were suffering for want of food, and
from low wages, that he admitted to be a case of distress.
But when the Noble Lord said the demand for
labour was so great, and such high wages
were pail, and there au re such large rations
of food, this was a reason why the colony did not
make such a progress as it migt.t otherwise do ; but it
was not on account of the distress of the colony, but the
reverse. It was on account of their being so much capital
in the colony that there was not employment for that
which might be profitably employed. It was proved by
papers on the table of the House. that 40,000 persons had
been added to the colony at the expense of revenues
granted by the act cf the Government; and yet it was
with respect to this colony the Nehle Lord made a special
c ,roplaint. Government had expended in adding to the
mass of the population upwards of half a million ; yet it
was said that nothing bad been done for it. He must say,
with le gird to many colonies far which little had been
deee, these might be some plausible complaint, but with
regard to this colony the whole complaint was that the
colony might make more rapid advances if they would give
them 50,000/. a. ear more. No doubt their rate of pre-
gress would be accelerated hut, as a general question, he
said, with respect to this colony, more had been done than
for almost any colony under the Queen's Government.
With regard to the assignment system, which the Noble
Lord thought was properly aboli.hed, he agreed with the
Noble Lord that it had tended much to the prosperity of
the colony. If they set aside all views of moraliy, and
of the religious and moral welfare of the colony, nothing
tended so much to advance its prosperity as the command
of slave labour. But if this increase of convicts had gone
on it would have become so alarming that military pre-
cautions must have been taken for. the safety of the colony.
But at the very time this population became dangerous,
Lord Ripon establishied a system by which the lands of
the colony, instead of being granted gr.tuitously, incon-
siderately and improperly, were sol I and employed in im-
porting labourers to recruit the population of the colony
from a more healthy source. When that system was
adopted, the foundation was laid of good community_ in
New South Wales, and it in a great degree
destroyed the effect of convict
thus having first laid the foundation of a g
emigration,
r a andmaterial
prosperity, we in the second instance laid the foundation of
the moral and political prosperity of New South Wales.
Therefore, without saying that it was done for the pecu-
liar advantage of that colony, he did say it had happened
in respect to New South Wales that that colony had been
peculiarly favoured, and that no one of the colonies of the
British empire had been so fortunate. It was said their
present position was one of distress. Now with regard
to revenue it appeared from ollicial documents that the
average revenue in 1833 and 1834 was 150,0001., in 1837
and 1838 208,0001., and it appeared that on the Bth Au-
gust, 1840, including the land fund and quit rent,
the total receipt of the year was 427,3681.
That was the state of a colony which the Noble Lord
called upon the heavily burdened people of England to
contribute 'some 50,000/, to, in order to help up their re-
venue.—( Hear, hear.) He believed there was no instance
in which so rapid an increaso in the prosperity of a colony
could be pointed out. It was alleged by the Hon. Mem-
ber for Liskcard that the people cf that colony were be a-
vily Lazed; but the comparison which the Hon. Member
had made was extremely fallacious. Ile did not find that,
like the people of that country, they paid a heavy window
duty, a stamp duty, a 1 gscv dale, and heavy duties on
coffee, and sugar, and tea—[Mr. Hume—" And corn."l
His Hon. Frieed behind had added even upon the imports-
tion of corn.—( Loud cries of " Hear, bear.") Now he
must say that that was a proof that the people of Great
= drain were much more heavily burdened, and it would
be extremely unfair to ask them to contribute to the assist-
ance of a colony which was progressing so rapidly as that
of New South Wales. Even the taxes that were paid out
of the local and county rates in England were there paid
out of the general revenue, and that was why the expendis
tore of the ordinary revenue was so heavy. In 1838 the ordi-
nary revenue of the colony was 904,000/., and out of that
the duty upon tobacco and spirits imported and distilled,
and wines, amounted to 145,2781., so that, with regard to
the ordinary sources of taxation their contributions were
very light, for he knew of no articles which were more
properly the subject of taxation, than those he had enu-
merated. It was impossible to avoid these comparisons,
when that House was called upon to come to the relief of
the colony. In his opinion, the inhabitants of New South
Wales did not pay one tenth the amount of taxation that
was paid by the people of this country. The House would .

recollect that there was a sum of 300,000/., which they
were called upon to pay, as connected with the penal sys-
tem of that country. He did not object to their paying
that sum ; and there was, besides, the expenses of the
military defence of the colony, which was borne by Great
Britain. The Hon. Member for Liskeard had argued,
that because they had troops they must be stationed some-
where, and therefore it entailed no additional expense upon
the mother country; but it appeared to him, that if they
had not these colonies, they would not require to keep up
so large a military force.—( Hear.) The Noble Lord had
referred to the great advantages that would result from
promotingemigration to New South Wales, and he( Lord J.
Russell) agreed with him. He fully concurred in the
principles laid down by Mr. Wakefield and the Noble
Lord the Secretary for the Colonies, who had advocated
the plan of applying the money obtained from the sale of
colonial lands to the purposes of emigration. That ap-
peared to him a very wholesome and judicious system, and
much preferable to giving a sum of 50 or 100,0001. from
the Impe-isl treasury far such a purpose. From the de-
spatches of Sir George Gipps. it appeared that a sum of
156,000/. had been obtained by the sale of lands, and a
sum of 162,0001. had been expended ftr the purpose of
promoting emigration, so that a sum of 6,0001. more than
had been collected from that source had been expended in
emigration. The Hon. M •mber fur the City of London
had argued as if the Government were anxious to put a
stop to emigration to New South Wale. No such thing.
On the contraty, he thought it was a great bent fit to the
colony, a-d they were determined to promote it as far as
lay in their power. The only way to lay the foundation of
a great, a moral, and a prosperous community in that
colony, was to introduce as many healthy and able-
bodied emigrants as they could from the mother country.
—( Hear, hear.) • It appeared to him most unreasonable
that 50,000/. should be taken from the taxes of the
people of New South Wales, and imposed upon the heavily-
burdened people of Great Britain. Upon that very
question a decision had been come to in 1834, and the
then Chancellor of the Exchequer bad decidedly objected
to such a proceeding. He was happy to say that from
year to year the nature of the population of the colony was
changing, and becoming more resembling the population
of this country, or that of Scotland or Ireland ; and it
would be incumbent upon the legislature of that country
when such a change took place, to give to the colony those
free representative institutions which properly belonged to
all colonies derived from the race that inhabited these
kingdoms—( Hear, hear.) His belief was, that whether
that change took place a little earlier or a little later, all
must concur with him in admitting that such must eventu-
ally be the state of the colony of New South Vale=.

Sir W. MOLES WORTH concurred in most of the
observations of the Noble Lord opposite, but be differed
with him in his remarks upon the assignment system. It
appeared to him that if the whole of the fund arising from
the sale of lands had been applied to emigration, the diffi-
culties which the assignment system had given rise to
would never have occurred. With regard to the argu-
ment of the Hon. Member for London that a portion of
the local expenditure should be defrayed by the public
purse of Great Britain, it appeared to him that there
should be some circumstances in the case to take that
colony out of the general rule, and he thought the colony
of New South Wales presented that peculiarity. Since
it had been founded, between 70,000 and 80,000 convicts
had been transported to the colony, and the expense of
the gaols and police there was nine times as great as
it was at home. It was but just, therefore, that
the mother country should defray some portion of
the extra expense it had entailed upon them.
Those colonies would, in a very short period, become the
best market for our manufactured goods; but, in order
that they should become so, it was necessary that they
should be fully supplied with labour. He fully agreed
with his Hon. Friend the Member for London, that the
nett proceeds derived from the sales of waste land ought
to be applied solely to emigration purposes.
Sir R. PEEL could not deny that emigration might
be a double advantage to this country; first increasing the
population of distant colonies, and relieving this country
from its superfluous population, but he did not think it
would be either wise or honest to charge the finances of
the mother country with a charge of 50,000/. or 60,000/.
per annum. If they were to agree to the principle, as re-
lated to New South Wales, where was it to stop? Might it
not be applied to Canada, pr, in fact, all our other colonies?
New South Wales had made very rapid progress in wealth
from the system of convict labour ; she bad derived the be-
nefit of that system; could she then complain of being
called upon to provide for her internal Government? He
did not think that New South Wales had any
equitable claim upon the treasury of the mother
country for such expenses. The latter already
spent, as he understood, 330,0001. for the establishments
of that colony; it provided for its defence, and in his opinion
the colony had no right to ask for anything more. He re-
gretted that any stop should he put to emigration into the
colony, but the colony might tax itself for the purpose;
at all events he could not agree to saddle the already over-
burdened treasury of this country with an increased outlay
of 52,0001. per annum. At present there was an unhappy
disposition in every country in Europe to prodigality in
expenditure—( Hear, hear)—there was a remarkable defi-
ciency in the income, and unless some steps were taken to
reduce the expenditure in every country the most gloomy
prospects would encompass them; it was not to be done
by spending 20 or 30 millions in fortifications—(Cheers)
—but by enlightening the people. He could not give his
assent to the resolutions of the Hon. Member.

Mr. WARD thought that the funds derived from the
sale of lands ought to be applied to the purpose of sup-
plying the colony with labourers of a class superior to that
which the assignment system offered. He was willing
to admit that the Noble Lord the Secretary for the Colo-
tonics had done more than any of his predecessors to im-
prove the management of our colonial possessions. But
still he felt that the purchasers of land had a right to ex-
pect, upon every principle of good faith and public justice,
that they should be supplied with the labour, which they
had been led to expect, and without which the land was
worth nothing. He would vote for a Committee of In-
quiry.

Sir R. H. INGLIS was sorry to differ from his Right
Hon. Friend (Sir Robert Peel), but he thought that
Australia had a claim upon this country for the expense of
taking care of the convicts who were sent thither, and he
should support the motion.
Sir C. GREY said it would be most alarming if this
country should be called upon to support the police esta-
blishments in her distant colonies. He felt it his duty to
oppose the motion of his Hon. Friend.
Mr. HUME was sorry not to be able to vote with his
Hon. Friend the Member for London. The whole debate
arose from the colonial system being perfectly unintelligi-
ble. It would be highly dangeorous to admit the doc-
trines of his Hon. Friend. The difference with Ms
Hon. Friend was, whether the whole or only part should
be applied to the purposes of emigration. The Noble
Lord had clearly shown that no part of the fund had been
diverted from the expenditure of the colony. It had
been shown, in the course of the debate, that
there were still thirty-eight thousand convicts
working for the colony. The colony, therefore, still con-
tinued to derive benefit from the assignment system, and
it was quite reasonable, therefore, that they should bear a
portion of the expense of maintaining these convicts. He
really did not see what grounds there were f)r going into
Committee. It would be highly unjust to apply 50,0001
to the promotion cf emigration in New South Wales. un-
less they were also prepared to extend the same benefit to
ether colonies. The management of the gaols and the
expense of the police was, in his opinion, a legitimate ex-
pense of the colony.
Mr. G ROTE, in reply said, that had the promises of
Lord Rioon and Lord Glenelg been fulfilled, 200,0001.
would have been devoted to the colony.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw and the
House divided--
For the motion
Against it
Majority acainet the motion —44
lONIAN ISLANDS.

Lord C. FITZROY moved for the appointment of a
Select Committee to take into consideration the papers
relating to the lonian States, ordered by the House of
Commons to be printed the 221 day of June, 1840. The
Noble Lord said his object was to obtsin for the lonian
States, which contained an honest and industrious popula-
tion, the fair and impartial administration of justice. He
also wished to save them from the injustice of the Lord
High Commissioner and his staff, whose representations
respecting them were most erroneous. The Noble Lord
prcceeded to read several extracts from the despatches of
the Lord High Commissioner: of the lonian Islands. for
the purpose of showing the management and great expense
attending the government of these islands. The Noble
Lord complained of the Lord 1-ligh Commissionei's conduct
in entering the houses and seizing the papers of many of
th
e inhabitants. he inhabitants. All these things having come to his know-
ledgehe•gwot he
would not have thought he had performed his
duty had be not put the House in possession of the facts.
He thought
had shown good grounds for rthrring the
papers to a Select Committee.LMorr.dll.l.UßMLETSZE°LndLellitdth_ee
lonian notrn thin there there was any ground
b
for a Committee upon subject.eeeriePe.
18r5ly sit
Allut
a States
didnotNoblefm a
o rLord
ought to remember thethat w
lalitehd, and
colony of this country,
f
were governed under the Treatiza au-
thoritiest in those island; were acting harmoniouslyte to-
getlaCr, nor was there any disturbance among thepe
le,
who were general!y employed at high wages. Was
it
right then of the House of Commons to interfere
and disturb such a state of peace ?—(H„,,,
hear.)
He was extremely sorry that his Noble Friend had brought
this subject again before the House after the decision of
last year. He should give a decided negative to the
motion,
Sir H. HARDINGE defended the conduct of Sir
Howard Douglas against the charges urged by his Noble
Friend Lord C. Fitzroy. He begged to ask his Noble
Fried whether he meant to say that Sir Howard Douglas
opened letters which were passed through the Government
office, and, having informed himself of the contents, sealed
them up again in other envelopes.
Lord C. FITZROY said that an individual named
Courego had made distinctly that charge against the Go-
vernor.

Sir P. H. INGLIS also dtfonded the character of Sir
Howard Dully,las, and referred to the public testimony
borne by the lonians themselves, to his judicious and ire-
parfal conduct as Lord Commissioner.

Mr. FIUME supported the motion, and expressed his
astonishment that the friends of Sir H. Douglas did not
want inquiry. Was it a proper state of things, where the
only crgan of public opinion was the Gazette, published
under the authority of the Government? He ( Mr.
Flame) would not sanction any officer, no matter what his
military farce, who suppressed the liberty of the press.
He considered the House of Commons were bound to
accede to the present motion, and he would support it
most cordially, if only his Noble Friend could be found to
divide on the question.
Sir R. PEEL thought it apparent from the report of the
Finance CommiAce of the House of Assembly of the
lonian Islands, that strict economy waa indispensally
necessary ; this Was on the authority of the Government of
that country. He thought Sir Howard Douglas acted
under circumstances of peculiar difficulty. If assertions
were made reflecting on the character of Sir Howard

Douglas, that gentleman's friends bad a right to complain,
d demand an explanation. He ( Sir R. Peel) was sure
that the Noble Lord ( Ftzroy) had no intention of casting
any imputations on the Gallant Officer.
Sir C. GREY thought there were sufficient grounds for
inquiry.
Colonel RAWDON considered that as the conduct of
a public officer was free to be canvassed, when an asser-
tion was made in a British House of Commons r( fl-sting
on it, it was but right that an inquiry should be instituted.
After a few words from Sir FL VIVIAN,
Lord C. FITZ ROY explained.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the House
divided, when the numbers were—

Eor the motion
Against it
Mil why

Is

On our return to the gallery we found
Mr. HUME, moving for returns, in detail, of
the sum of 3,0271. granted as compensation in pub-
lic offices or departments in the year ending the
3lst day of December, 1840. Also, of 39,001/
18,. 54. gran!el as superannuation allowances, in the
same time; stating ihe name of each person, his present
age, the office he held, the total number of years, the
period of entering, and the time he was in the service. and
how long he held !he (Alice for which compensation or super-
annuation was granted ; the .mount cfsalary and allowance
for such last office, and whether the office he held has been
abolished. Also, a return of the manner in which 3,310/. 2s.
101, and 6 093/ Os. 51. was disbursed by the Me,ropolitan
Police Cummi•sioners in the year 1840, as superannuation
charges; staling the name of each person, his present
age, the period of service, and in what capacity he en-
tered it, and in what capacity he last served, the pay and
allowances of his list rank, and the amount of compensa-
tion now allowed.-.. Agreed to.
The County Courts Bill, after a few words from Mr.
FOX MAULE and Mr. HUME, was read a second
time.

The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and
the House adjourned at One o'Clock.

SPIRIT of the PUBLIC JOURNALS.

FROM THE DAILY PAPERS OF YESTERDAY.

TIM ES.—The expression which suggested itself to us
on opening the recently published correspondence on Eas-
tern affairs, appears to have elicited a little animadversion
from some of our Contemporaries, with whom we are riot
accustomed to disagree. Admitting, however, if you will,
that veracity is a conspicuous characteristic of the quarter
from which these papers emanate, it is surely neither un-
charitable nor unjust to conjecture that a collection of do-
cuments containing the diplomatic intercourse of seven Ca-
binets or Councils, some of them declared enemies
to each other, all of them actuated by various mo-
tives, and all of them putting the most specious
appearance on their conduct, is likely to prove
an enormous mass of mutual deception. We wi,h,
for the sake of mankind and of truth, that it were
otherwise ; and we hastened the other day to express our
belief that the practice of laying d(cuments of this flatua
before the world would tend to check the underhand deal-
ings which diplomatists hive at times being accused of.
How is it possible that this volume should not be full of
lies? The very object of its publication is, we presume, to
expose them. We find the Sultan Malmoud protesting in
the Spring of 1839 of his pacific intentions, and the Rus-
sian Cabinet complaining that it had been deceived by the
Divan, which somehow or other managed to renew hosti-
lities against the Pacha, in spite of the remonstrances of
all Europe—remonstrances which were sincere and energetic
on the part of some, hollow and feeble on the part of others.
We find the 'Pacha protesting with equal energy of his
submission and moderation ; but these assurances, which
were sufficiently strong to convince Colonel Campbell,
were treated by Lord Ponaonby and Lord Palmerston as
the artifices of insatiable ambition. We find France pro-
fessing to identify her policy and her instructions with
those of England, yet swerving from the course whenev
she was called upon to act upon the principles she af-
fected to adopt. We find Ruisis labouring with unremit-
ting address to establish a character of good faith and
disinterestedness, which gains less easy access is the Cs-
binet of the Tuileries than in that of St. James's. Frost
these various and conflicting sources Parliament and
the public will doubtless be able to form a just con-
clusion, by making a due allowance for the purposes
which these negotiations were intended to accomplish. As
far as our own diplomacy is concerned, it is remarkable,
not for duplicity or art in veiling its objects, but for
the strenuous and daring avowal of its opinions, even at the
risk of exaggerating c,,nviction into prejudice, and firm-
ness into imperiousness. Throughout Loid Ponsonby'a
share of the correspondence, these defects are strongly
visible, even in the extracts from his despatehes, which
have been selected far the public eye. L ird Palmerston's
own productions are distinguished by that acute and
peremptory spirit which has enabled him to remain the
master of these negotiations from London to Alexandr:a,
and to animate the whole combination by his own strength
of will; but these eminent qualities are impaired by the
absence of that unprejudiced and unruffled temper of
which Lord Granville is so fortunate an example. To the
influence of this distinguished Ambassador and to that of
Lord Beauvale, acting in immediate concert with Prince
Metternich, it is fair to attribute a considerable share in
these important transactions, and great merit in allaying
the dissensions to which they might have given rise.
GLOBE.—The Post steps forth to shield the
Tory party from the attacks which the Times, in its
" fiery impatience," yesterday, directed against the
leaders of the party, whom it designated a " set of
scoundrels," to seat whom in office the great body of the
Conservatives refuse to exert themselves. The cause of
this " explosion" of fury is found in the impending
election contest at Nottingham ; " with which," says
the Post, " somehow or other, the Tunes is more pecu-
liarly interested than in any other " party conflict.
The Times, under the influence of " intemperance,"
certainly repeated, somewhat coarsely, a few rather
awkward truths respecting the disorganization and dis-
satisfaction which exist in the Tory party. There was
nothing in these disclosures which was not notorious
enough already, and which had not been exhibited in
various ways and on divers occasions for several months
by the recognized journals of Conservatism. The
Herald and the Standard, each in its own peculiar
phraseology, had, directly or indirectly, denounced Sir
Robert Peel and the other " leaders" of the party,
as utterly unworthy the confidence of " Protestants,"
whose " interests" they had abandoned and betrayed.
The latter journal repeatedly called upon the " Con-
servative democracy" to mark their sense of the un-
principled time-serving policy of all moderate states-
men of its own party, by inviting men more consistent
in principle and uncompromising in policy to assume the
lead, and to go before them as their commanders and
their guides. What, we ask, is there in the Times' ar-
ticle of yesterday, to which the Post objects, and la-
bours to explain away, respecting either the post-proxi-
mate Premier, or those who look for office under him,
which has not been said again and again by other
leading organs of the party, in all the various forms of
accusation and reproach which language can be made
to assume ?—not, perhaps, with the vulgar coarse-
ness which belongs peculiarly to the Times, but
not less imbued with deep disaffection and disap-
pointment, because more refined. A public writer is
compelled to adapt his style to the description of readers
for whom he specially designs his lucubrations. The
netts is at present engaged in the disrtputab'e voca-
tion of writing to incite the brickbat-and•bludgeon men
of Nottingham to aid Mr. Walter's " individual inte-
rests" by their striking powers of advocacy, and in ca-
joling the Chartists and dragooning the Conservatives
into act ye co-operation t, further his designs.

STANDARD.—It seems to be conceded on all
sides that tie Chartists have to a great extent in their
hands the event of the Nottingham election, and it
such is the truth that event, whatever it may be, must
be productive of good. Should the professors of ex-
treme democratic principles accept their representative
from the Treasury, and return a man nominated by
the authors of the New Poor-law, apparently for no
other reason than abject submission to his patrons, the
country will be wiser for the choice. It will then be made
clear that the Chartists are nothing but a mere unthink-
ing rabble, led by a few noisy inceadiaries, neither better
nor wiser than the rest, though cunning enough to see
that, by making themselses important through the
violence of their deceived followers, they have
a chance of indulging their vanity, or filling their
pockets, without resorting to fair enterprise or honest
labour ;—such a lesson will be more profitable to
the country, and more particularly to the cause
of the Conservatives, than beneficial or honour-
able to the Chartists. Should the Chartists, on the
other side, succeed in returning the friend of the
poor, it will be their first real victory, the first
unequivocal manifestation of that moral force upon
which all of them who are respectable pro-
fess to place their sole reliance. Hitherto they have
found nothing but defeat, because, hitherto, with moral
force upon their lips, they have too plainly shown by
acts, as at Newport, that other means of success were
in their hearts. Prudence and public duty, however,
concur in suggesting the infinite importance to a
party so often defeated of winning one victory,
and winning it by unexceptionable means. The
Whig Radicals despise the Chartists, because they know
that the Chartists cannot displace them from office, or
make any serious impression upon Parliament while
they appear to contemplate revolutionary designs ;
and these they must continue to appear to con-
template so long as they neglect to use the lawful
and constitutional means of forwarding what they
profess as their objects. They have now an oppor-
tunity of forwarding the object which they have ever
nprofessed p tor
ta
er
te,g
aa
inasdeed,
nadseealt, oriel emeo v lett;
tnheea rgerseta
ta npdr 0 the
roost important, as, indeel, removing the great provo-
cation which has called their union into existence—
they have now the opportunity of forwarding the de-
cisive modification, if not repeal, of the New Poor-
law, by means which the most bigoted votary of order,
at all price. cannot reprove.

MONEY MARKET and CITY NEWS.

tlt
stagnation FROM THE MORNING PAPERS OF YESTERDAY.
POST.—The dulness which had prevailed on the Stock
total ttahle Exchange from the beginning of the week continues.
ETnhgerleishwhaosutshei!
while, in
thael ost a
foreign,
g
transactions were
confined chiefly,to the Peninsular securities, and these were
of trifling extent. By far the most important operations
of the day were in shares. The approach making by the
m
Company to the completion of the Brighton line causes
much more activity in that speculation. The shares, which
were, at one time, as low as 15 or 16 dis., wet° done to..
day at a fraction less than 2 dis. ; but there was some fluc-
tuation in the market, and the highest value was not fully
sustained at the close of business.