The Sun.
London, England, 1847-11-24 00:00:00

TIIE SUN',

,ar

revenue, with a view of ascertaining how far the
system of taxation might be altered, and the present
establishments reduced. Also, that he would to-
morrow ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether
it was his intention to bring in any measure to modify
or alter the Excise laws.
DISTRICT CORONERS BILL.

Mr. G. BERKELEY gave notice that he would,
upon an early day, more for leave to bring in a Bill
to amend the District Coroners' Bill.
PRIVATE BUSINESS OF THE HOU SE.
Mr. LABOUCHERE gave notice that he would
to. morrow, at the time of private business, move for
a Select Committee to consider whether any and
what improvements could be made in the mode of
conducting the private business of the House.
ARREARS OF ADMIRAL NAPIER'S PEN-
SION.

Lord INGESTRE wished to know whether there
was any foundation for the report that Admiral Na-
, pier had used the influence of his position for the
purpose of obtaining the arrears cf salary due to him
by the Portuguese Government.
Mr. WARD, in answer to the Noble Lord, said, I
am much indebted to the Noble Lord for putting
that question to me at this early period of the meeting
of Parliament. I am happy to say that lam in a
condition to lay before the House the most convincing
proof of the utter groundlessness of such report.
That proof shall consist in papers above all suspicion,
from the character of the gentleman from whom they
came, and the means which he possessed of ascertain-
ing the real facts of the case. Sir Hamilton Seymour
has addressed a letter upon the subject to the First
Lord of the Treasury, with permission to make use of
the document. The letter is as follows :
"My Lord,—As reports to the prejudice of the
Gallant Admiral Sir C. Napier have been inserted in
some of the English newspapers, I em induced to
trouble your Lordship with the following statement.
Upon the arrival of the Gallant Admiral at Lisbon,
the Finance Minister expressed his regret that he was
unable to pay him the arrears of his pension due to
him, adding at the same time that he should make an
effort to do so as soon as possible. The answer of
Sir C. Napier was to this effect : That he had no
wish to be paid before his companions, and that he
would take his chance with the rest.' Sir C. Napier
now acquaints me that four months' pension out of
the fifteen months then due has been paid to him, and
this amount only has been received. He further
acquaints me that two months having elapsed since that
part payment was made, thirteen months' payments are
at the present moment due to him. The Gallant Admiral
is thus placed in thejsame position as every other person
vtio has claims for pensions upon the Portuguese
Government ; he has not, therefore, abused the in-
fluence which his present position has given him. I
do not hesitate to say that I shoul,l regret as a public
calamity the occurrence of anything upon the part
of the Gallant Admiral which should interrupt the
great service which he is now rendering to the
country by the performance of his duties at the post
to which he has been sent by the Government
of this country.—(Hear, hear.) The services
which he is there rendering are of great value, and
will, I doubt not, be of great service to the country."
SUPPRESSION OF THE SLAVE TRADE.
Mr. FIUME gave notice that he would to-morrow
move for returns of the number of her Majesty's
:-hips employed by this country on the coast of
Africa for the suppression of the slave trade ;
els° the number of ships employed by France and
the United States for the same purpose, in conformity
with the treaties entered into with this country for
the suppression of the slave trade.

NEW ZEALAND.
Mr. GLADSTONE wished to know whether it
was the intention of the Government to lay on the
table of the House the answer of the Governor of
Yaw Zealand to the dispatch with reference to waste
lands in that country ?
Sir GEORGE GREY said that the correspondence
which had taken place upon that subject would be
shortly laid upon the table, and he believed it would
comprise the answer to the dispatch alluded to by the
Right Hon. Gentleman.

LONDON,

denouncing in. the strongest terms the crimes and ,
outrages which were occurring in the district. He
had thought it nothing but common justice to the
reverend gentleman to mention this circumstance,
• and he hoped in future he would be dealt with more
leniently. The next sentence in the Speech related to
the poor-law, and he could state from his
, own knowledge that it had proved highly
. successful; but he regretted, nevertheless, to
state that its success had been greatly perilled by
a circular which had latterly been issued by the
Secretary of State, requiring the funds in the hands
• of the guardians to be paid into the hands of
the civil paymaster in Dublin. It had not
only perilled the law, but the peace of
many parts of the country, and he trusted in
future such proceedings would not be resorted to.—
(Hear, hear.) Her Majesty then went on to state
that she had heard with satisfaction that "the landed
proprietors cf Ireland had taken advantage of the
means placed at their disposal for improving their
estates. He could answer for it the landed proprie-
tors had been prepared to avail themselves of the
means alluded to, but he regretted to say Government
had shown a tardiness in giving them the means.
The Speech of the Queen went on to say that " in-
L subordination had led to an organised resistance to
legal rights." He would, in s peaking on this part,
. forget that he was an Irish landlord, and that he had
received much annoyance in fulfilling its functions.
He should approach the discussion of the subject in
a large spirit, overlooking these temporary incon-
veniences. The Hon. Member for Kilkenny rather
taunted him with having gone over to Ireland with
good intentions, but that he had abused them.
He would not say how much of his income
he had forgone, and now he would also have to forgo
his rents for years to come. In Ireland the state of
society was based upon the potato crop; it
was the money as well as the food of
the country; but had the Government proved
equal to the occasion—had they come forward with
great measures and not tinkered, the country might
have been placed on a better footing ' • but now it ap-
peared to him that little was to be done save recon-
structing society in Ireland de novo. The Government
of Ireland was in safe hands, and therefore it appeared to
him that it was ungenerous to tauntLordelarendon with
instituting the delivery of lectures upon agriculture.
Although lectures might not do much good in the
present state of Ireland, still there were counties in
which the delivery of lectures and the em-
ployment of• agriculturists would do much
good.—(Hear, hear.) The outrages which had taken
place in the 'five counties were not, in his opinion, of
an agrarian character. When men, and women, and
children, were driven from their homes into begs and
drains, he tires justified in this expression of opinion.
They were the result of the proceedings adopted
h‘, parties who were determined at all hazards to
obtain p,ssession of the land. Before he could agree
to a Coercion Bill—to the suspending of the ordi-
nary laws—he must first see what measures
the G,vernmens intended to adopt to improve
the order of things.—(Hear, hear.) Though not
disposed to strengthen the hands of the Govern-
ment, and he admitted he had a high opinion of the
abilities of the Lord Lieutenant; yet loooking at the
present state of society in Ireland, he could not rush
to a conclusion that coercion would do wellfor Ireland.
It might, however, be a matter of grave doubt whether
er not a more stringent law should not be carried
out in the counties referred to. Coercion would be
but a palliative measure, and he believed that a
Bill repecting tenant right would :not go to the
root of the evil, for its seat was deep.—(Hear,
hear.) As long, however, as men were
ill-housed, ill-clothed, and worse paid for their labour,
they might depend upon it that there would be no
safety for life or property. They were to devise
means to raise the cohdition of the agricultural labour ;
he did not, however, object to such a Bill, whether for
England or Ireland. He would support any well-
devised measure which would put the relations of
landlords and tenants upon a more satisfactory foot-
ing. Looking over the programme of her Majesty's
speech he regretted to find that a Bill which
would eventually do great service was unnoticed
—namely, a measure to facilitate the sale
of encumbered estates.—(Hear, hear.) Unless they
could free land from the shackles which now op-
pressed it, they would do little benefit to Ireland. He
therefore besought the Government to propose a large
and comprehensive measure of this kind. The land
must be improved by such means, per fas ant nefas.
Though he did not desire to increase the power of
the Irish Church, he thought that the arrange-
ment of the land ii. congregational, instead of
territorial portions, would pave the way to an
improved state of things in Ireland. He urged
them at once to put the legislation for Ireland on 1
a sound footing, or they would have to go on
in the same vicious circle from year to year. With
reference to what had fallen from the Hon. Member '
for Kilkenny, he thought it was unworthy of him to
listen to vague reports; and he trusted that he (Mr.
Osborne) would not long bear the character of an
absentee landlord.

Lord G. BEN TINCK protested against the doc-
trine laid down by the Chancellor of the Exchequer
that no debate should take place on the report to the
address. He considered it as most remarkable,
that neither the Noble Lord nor the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer should have thought
it worth their while to state the reasons vihich

had induced them to give permission to the
Bank to break the law, and to propose a new
usury-law, raising the rate of interest and levying
new taxes on the trading community of the most
odious natnre. Why did they fix on the 25th
of October, neither sooner nor later, to give
this relief to the community ? lie did not
regret that last :night the subject of Irish
distress took precedence of the not less distress
with which England was now inflicted, and im-
patient_ as the nation was to know the inten-

tion of the Ministers with respect to banking
measures, he was sure they would not regret
that the first attention had been paid to Irish
distress. But both would be disappointed if this de•
bate should be brought to a conclusion without
eliciting from the Ministry a declaration of their inten-
tions with regard to the Bank Charter Act. Last year
his Right Hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exche-
quer had been urged by deputations from the mer-
chants of England and Scotland, and also by himself
and his friends in that House, to relax the restrictions
under which the Bank was placed by that Act ;
but ' his Right Honourable Friend had re-
plied that the worst was passed.—(Cheers.)
The House would recollect that at a later period in
September a deputation waited upon the Chancellor
of the Exchequer from Newcastle, who foresaw that
increased difficulties would come upon the commerce
of the country, and they applied to the Right lion.
Gentleman to remove the Bank restrictions. What
was the answer of that Right Hon. Gentleman ?
lie said that -he could not be expected to guard
against the emergencies :of over-trading, and over-
speculation ; and that there was nobody
who did not know that there was no
undue pressure in the money market as
regarded houses •of good credit. Why, good God !
this was at a time when exchequer bills were at 255.
discount—when there were doubts as to whether the
Bank would be able to continue its payments, and
when, at all events, among the houses of bad credit
was to be reckoned the Treasury, when exchequer
bills went down to 40s. discount. On the 22d of Oc-
tober another daputation waited upon the Right -Hon.
Gentleman, from Liverpool, and as they were leaving
lais room, it was said that he gave them no hope.
Time went on, and suddenly, upon the 23d of October,
a deputation of bankers and others of the city of
London waited upon the Right Hon. Gentleman ;
the Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Tam-
worth also came to town. He did not
know whether he acted as amicus curia,
in the matter, suddenly the Government began to
relent at the same time Mr. Pease, late a Member of
this House came up from Northumberland and paid
a visit to the Noble Lord at the head of the Colonial
Department, and the Right Hon. Gentleman the
Member for Northumberland.
Sir G. GREY—Not to me.

Lord G. BENTINCK—That showed how neces-
sary it was that the House should be made acquainted
with the whole facts of the case. Such, however,
was the nature of the reports prevalent at the time.
The Government at length listened to the cry which
came in an appropriate moment from Northumber-
land and Durham. They were informed that the
Northumberland and Durham Bank was upon the
point of stoppage, and unless the restrictions were
taken off from the Bank of England there would not
be a collier in these counties who, upon the following
Saturday, would receive his weekly wages, and a
significant hint was given of the value of keeking the
colliers in full employment. —_(Hear, hear.) It
r was quite unnecessary for the House to know the
reasons which had induced the Government to post
pone the removal of the restrictions to the late period
they did.—(Hear, hear.) Precedence had been allowed
to the discussion of the late question, in order to allow
of the question of the currency being brought forward
upon a subsequent occasion. No compromise had
been made upon the subject. There never
was so gloomy a speech made by any , Sovereign
as that which they were called upon to consider
now.—(Hear, hear.) It had been stated by Honour-
able Members that 161,000,0001. had been expended
in railways since 1841. Where Hon. Members
got their information from he could not tell ; but were
12,000,000/, a
pltva thr
they to be told after such statements that the country
ey were
told country.
e d
bt would be brought to ruin by the expenditure of
year. It was not the high price of corn
bu
de es
offf e c3tosoo,of
on
free
soldierstra de tahnadt took
the gold. out
oft Up
this
formern timeso p
a at h
feeywc could- lodu s
apna yd
marines, but now
railway labourers
bankruptcy.—(Llear without bringing England -to
, hear.) They had lately .
theyl