The Sun.
London, England, 1847-06-29 00:00:00

give Irish railways an opportunity of borrowing money
at el instead of 6or 7 per cent. It was s lid that rail-
way s would be a good "thing for Ireland, so they
would be, but why sl7touid loans of money be
granted to Ireland if not to England also ?
After the signal defeat which the measure had sustained
on a previous occasion, who would have thought that
such a measure as the present would have been pro-
posed by her Majesty's Government. The present popu-
lation of this country were suffering from the effect of the
measures which had been passed to avert famine in Ireland.
and was it fair, was it just to lay an additional burden
upon the people for the construction of railways in Ire-
land? If assistance were to be granted to Irish railway
companies, why was it not to be granted to the
distressed artisans and manufacturers of this
country ? The master manufacturers were fully
prepared to offer more valuable security for such ad-
Na' anndetehse tyh
couldana n any
alsof ri sehmßp
laoi
yl waauyo
uCso)
dmepraanhyl y cl
ao
rugl d p r opo
o r see
amount
of labour. But it might be said that there were some
special reasons for proposing this grant. The Chancellor
of the Exchequer had said that he should not re-
quire the whole of the 8,000,0001. which be had,
borrowed for the purpose for which it was obtained, and
therefore he appeared to think it his duty to spend the
money in some way, good, bad, or indifferent. It would
be better to let the 620,0001. of surplus loan find lean we,'
into the pockets of the English people, ng
it to fructify there rather than squander and waste
it upon Irish railway companies, thereby doing no good
to any person or company whatever. Entertaining these
opinions, he felt it to be his duty to move that this Bill
be read a second time that day six months.
Mr. WILLIAMS thought that the Chancellor of the
Exchequer had done sufficient mischief already d
wiuri thout
ng
the nine months he had been in office
incurring fresh risks and courting fresh dangers.
He had already reduced the balances in the Exchequer
from the sum of 9,000,0001. to 5,450,00/., and had added
8,000,000/. to the national debt of this country. The
railways which it was proposed to assist had not made
out a case to warrant such assistance being rendered to
them. The state of the money market was not such as to
afford the expenditure of so large a sum of money
as was proposed by this Bill. The Bank of Englsnd
and the commerce of this country was just emerging
from a most dangerous crisis, and this measure would
only have the effect of bringing about the same disas-
trous state of things ; and why was all this danger to be
run for the sake of assisting or speculating in some 11111
railways ? Believing the measure to be wrong in P' n.
ciple and injurious, he should give it all the opposition
in his power.
Lord J. RUSSELL had before stated that the Pre.
posed measure was not at variance with the course,
usually adopted by the Government. The Governlnee,u
had felt it their duty to oppose the plan of the Now°
Lord opposite on two grounds, one of which was,
that there was before the House the Wore;
of an immense expenditure for Ireland, on'
the Government thought it unwise at that time to pledge
the House to the expenditure of 16,000,0001. of money Another reason was that the measure would not have
afforded th
e then,requisiteand t
reliefsill d
fiodr,
thatt the peopleof Ireland.
Hethought
calculated to afford such relief as was then rweeqrueirall
The Government had, however, admitted that railways
and other public works, were the legitimate
objects of public assistance. There was
nothing either in the arguments used by the Govern;
ment, or the decision of the House upon that plea, whie
was to preclude the House for ever from snaking ad-
-
vances to any Railway. The House had sane.
tion invariably the application of large sums !?!
public money to the promotion of public works; the Bell
before the House was therefore in perfect accordance with
the practice of the House. And, Sir (continued t
pe
Noosbel,eaLs othrde),Hitoins.ammemisahpoprrefhoerncsioovnenotfrtyhis plan
we purpose to advance money at the rate of three-and-a"
half per cent., therely asking an unusually low rat!:
The rate we propose to ask is that which is usually askesa__
say five per cent., and I therefore conclude that so.lee
to stir
from that being at variance with the genselirPaPl°psesrinct-11350;
sanctioned by the House, it is in perfect accordce with
sanctioned
be-
the general principle which has been found to work _
neficially for both parties. But, Sir, I must admit w 7.
are on this occasion going beyond the usual amount otot
advances for these purposes, and that, in fact—and
not
as the Hon. Member for Southwark has put it--the On f
question at issue is, shall we or shall we not adxc°l3.lis
plan which requires a larger advance than the Ee,
quer Loan Commissioners would he able to advance
they had only such a sum of money as that which"
cording to the usual course of events would come inle
their hands. For this purpose I must admit that
far
necessary to make out a case of exception. But s°
from having any difficulty in making out this case of
exception, I should only fatigue the House we and
to go over again the abundant proofs that Ireland
°f
the state of Ireland do form an exception to OIL. e,
those normal rules by which we are usually guided.
Hon. Baronet the Member for Southwark told us to
look to the public works in England and to the in
and manufactures of this country. But is there anY re:
semblance between the state of England and that of
Ireland?—(Hear.) You must look at the condition
of
of
Ireland, such as it has been made by a long course
legislation and government. You must looleto the state
of the people—to the many millions living in the most
wretched habitations—on the lowest and cheapest de-
scription of food—and without that share of the neces•
series, still less of the comforts, of life usually enjoyed by
the English labourer.—(Hear.) I must confess, looking
Back to the history, the example and condition of other
cities, that legislation and government have an influence
on the condition of the people, not for some ten or twenty
ears, but for centuries. It you look to the present cone
y
dition of the people of Tuscany, you will see there re:
mains a proof of that vigorous republic which once ruled
at Florence. If you look to the condition of Flanders,
you will still see traces of the just and mild govern;
loof,
went of the house of Burgundy ; and if you
on will
to the condition of the territory of Valencia, y
observe traces of the cultivation of its Moorish gover-
nors. In many parts of Europe in which I ha" traci
Yelled the condition of the people has been influences
by the Government, not of the moment, but by rulers
by
governments Which had long since passed away.--
(Hear.) And Ireland, Sir, is no exception to this rule.
If you go back centuries—if you look to what legislattion.
was a century ago, you will find the great majori y
All
her people debarred from all office in the atate--from
those distinctions at the bar or any other profession_
which talent could aspire. You will find them so des-
barred from the enjoyment of land that in man"s
any relation who might turn out a villain could actually.
dispossess them. If, in addition to this, you find that
the whole course of legislation has been to degrade a_aue
the
should them, then I think no one will wonder that 70
should now find millions of her people living in e
lowest condition of human life, and thrown into
utter destitution by the failure of a single crop.—:
(Hear, hear.) I thisik it would be a narrow, st?
ards
unjust, and an unfair view of our duty tow
Ireland, if we merely regarded what bad been done
for the last ten or twenty years, and then laid down the
general principle, so complacently laid down by tae
Hon. Baronet the Member for Southwark, that
as
England depended on her own resources, so ought Ire'
land, and that we ought not to help Ireland unless we,
also assisted England. But, Sir, if we bad governed
Ireland as we have governed England, can there be any
doubt that Ireland would have been now capable of doing
(foot,:
lehBae249s,heetl
hfarawiaatel
ttwieosfanroettanrl
tardy
ytwe
jclueasgl
tliied upon
selea,ti lovnh,i
citthoi
sdc a
non
of, to
irtnhheser.Afe--cift
years, place the Irish in a position to work out their
own prospects, and to attain anything like that state Of
comfort and wellbeing in which we have the happiness
of seeing the English people generally placed. In Ire"
land we have had insecurity, the absence of capital con-
sequent on that insecurity, and crime arising fro!'
general causes, with which it is your business to de'
It will not do for you merely to find fault with tnee
outrages committed from time to time, and to attribntue
them entirely to the indocility. and opefeasgalt
of the people. I say there is here
more.
reason why you should do something n3erds
The Noble Lord then went on to say the lan 0.
owners of Ireland had, in his opinion, very justly bee
.1. moor
called upon to pay a large burden in supporting ea
of that country. Under all these circumstances, it 1:7;),
in his opinion, the duty of the Government to Itssigite
all means in their power the people of Ireland. ",his
respect to the railways proposed to be assisted by
measure, it had been clearly ascertained
such
very competent persons that they svere f
the
as would amply remunerate the outlay that
went
calculated
proposed capital. lie thought, therefore, d be
takingnail
assing this Bill, the House wortl2„ood
oaf s
to
oep
afford
ffnu
odt
r.hde
Measuresgmh te dd
immediate
ar te ec triheoalnide towards oatwl
or astranddasyt tbheee Joe .pe
a-
countrl7,l,o,
it was now the duty of the House to consider sin' fore
vide measures calculated to raise and promote the ltliro,
permanent condition and welfare of the people roes's-
land, too long delayed by unjust and improper li'essrlt
time The Hon. Baronet the Member for Son"",. this
had entirely perverted the argument used, agairls" rot
measure with respect to the fund out of which the grant
was to be made. His Right Hon. Friend's argn
was an answer to the objection of those who woula_e''of
" How are you to make provision for this sumo a
600,0001. ?" His Right Hon. Friend's answer 1%00
complete one, for he says, " I have no difficulty
°that
this, for there is already a provision made for pre.
amount in the expenditure of the current year 050 e for
vision which will admit of the laying out of 600,
well be
0
this purpose." It is not that this sum might As
in
spent because there is a provision for it, but becaUtirr,,
is an advantageous and useful mode of expend"
(Hear.) It had been shown in this and ill Tbreinreef
debates that this is a most useful object, and ie the
fore he was of opinion that they ought toteP.Fewea
money to this purpose. The Honourable ;che,
who spoke last referred to the balance in theec'os an
quer being reduced from 9,000,0001. to 5,000,0000 E April,
argument against this measure. In the month ',rod
1846, the balance in the Exchequer was 6,500,00601._ of
in 1847 it was 5,459,00 a, beirg about a sum a
1,040,0001. less than in the former year.
leaveßn
tio:titeof
financier, who looks at this question fairly,
its consideration the great calamity which has ()cc
,_irieett
—(Hear, hear.) Or, that this House has been obliged
—(Hear,
to advance a large sum of money to relieve the 015' _us
which existed ?—(Hear, hear.) No one would,schaergrovi
joer
their financial calculations in the same mode,
not there had been a great calamity like this;
.rweriliee
who had been anything of an observer of financial 10-
would do so, perhaps, except the Hon. 'Membetear
the
ventry—(Hear, hear)—or would have assumedad been
results should be the same, although the facts had n'eo
so different. In conclusion, he had but to say the _
to
thought as a general policy which the House ougle_Le si
adopt with respect to Ireland, it would be acting.Wro
good deal of injustice towards that country if it 0,1.
consent to the second reading of this Bill.--aleaer'ait the
'Mr. ROEBUCK thought that the Noble Lor"„ ea to
head of the Government should begreatly ebng