The Sun.
London, England, 1841-09-23 00:00:00

FROGMORE LODGE BILL.

people of that country. What was, then-, the conduct of
the Right Hon. Baronet ? He being then the leader of
the Opposition, and having no object t 3 attain, proposed
that the term should be only five years ; that he thonght
ten years too long ; and that it was wise to bring the
conduct of the body repeatedly under the consideration
of Parliament, in order that their Acts might be re-

wised and ' re-canvassed. Another proposition was
made to reduce the time to two years, but that was nega-
tived by a large majority, and consequently the Right
Hon. Baronet and the House were pledged in some degree
to support a proposition for continuing them for five
years. But a change of Ministry having taken place
the Right Honourable Baronet, in deference to public
opinion, out of respett to the sentiments of the people,

merely asked for a Bill to continue the Comm-is-

This Bill went through Committee, and was ordered
to be read a third time on Friday next.

ADMINISTRATION OF-JUSTICE BILL

On the motion of the ATTORNEY-GENERAL this
Bill was read a second time.

ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE (RETIRING
ANNUITY OF VICE-CHANCELLOR) EILL.

for six months, in order

that time

Tlis ATTORNEY-GENERAL having' moved a
clause empowering her Majesty to grant the yearly sum
of 3,5001. to any person who might hereafter vacate the
office of Vice-Chancellor under the pro visions of this
Bill, the Bill went through Committer,
FOREIGN BISHOPS BILL.
This Bill was read a third ti:,ne and passed.
LUNATIeLS BILL.
The Report on the Lu:aatics Bill was received, and the
Bill was ordered to be read a third time to-morrow.
EXPIRING LAWS BILL.

This Bill was, read a second time, and was ordered to
be committe,ii on Friday next.
POOR-LAW COMMISSION BILL.
On 4.-ne motion that the Poor- law Commission Bill be
read a second time,
Dr. BOWRING said, before the :Bill went through
this stage he wished to state one or two reasons which
induced him to pursue a different course with respect to
this measure from that he had pursued in respect to
the Corn-laws. He had not been able to understand
what course the Right Hon. Baronet proposed to pursue
with respect to that particular question. He had said
much very eloquently and very gracefully, but it had
enabled neither his enelnies nor his friends to dis-
cover what were his vie,ws ; and from all he had heard
he feared it was m.,t intended to abrogate those laws
which produced sr.ch mischievous effects upon the country.
With regard to the Poor-law he trusted the Right Hon.
Baronet wol:Id n.t a future time be able to suggest such
alteratior,s and modifications as would satisfy all parties;
that whilst economy was still kept in view, the Bill would
be ',mat the instrument of removing as much suffering
paqssible, and of creating as much happinsss as was
' ceensistent with the necessary control. 'With these views
'he certainly should not object to the continuance of the
Commission.
Mr. WORTLEY said it was as little his intention as
that of the Hon. Member who had just spoken,
to oppose any obstacle to the continuance of the Com-
mission. But he thought it was desirable for the Right
Hon. Baronet below him (Sir R. Peel), to suggest some
arrangement for enabling Hon. Members, who were
desirous of doing; so, to express their opinion. lie
trusted the Right Hon. Baronet would appoint a day for
that purpose.

Sii 11-OBERT PEEL said that the proper time Cur
discussion would be when the House resolved itself
into Committee. He had stated the other night
that the proper way would be to give notice
of an instruction to the Committee to frame enactments
corresponding with the views which might be enter-
tained. Ile thought it would be for the general conve-
nience of the House that that discussion should be taken
on a more distant day than the present, and Friday next,
when the House would resolve itself into Committee,
would be the most fitting occasion. He would take this
opportunity of correcting an erroneous impression
I \which had gone forth with respect to the Irish Poor-
law. It had been stated that in consequene
of the change of Government a material alter-
, %tion would take place in that Bill, As this
impression tended to counteract the beneficial operation
of the Bill, he would state that in the main outlines' and
enactments of the Irish Poor-law no change whatever
was contemplated.
Mr. WAKLEY said it was extremely desirable that Hon. Members who objected to the
workingng of the
he existing law should have an opportunity of stating what
changes they desired to see eff
effected. He had never ex-
pected to be called upon to vote for the continuance
of
the Poor-law Commission. He certainly thought that
Commission . the most inconsistent authority which
was ever established in this country,--(Hear.)
1 The conviction of every hour showed him that a
inure
mischievous or dangerous enactment, a:, regarded the well
being of the nation, never emanated from that House. The
i Right Hon. Baronet proposed to continue the power of
the Commissioners for six months longer than the period
I prescribed by Jaw. He thought a more rational profit)-
! sition could not be made lay any Minister under the pc-
-1 culiar circumstances of the case ; and if the Right Hon.
Baronet would not defend his conduct as regarded the pre-
would be reluctantly compelled
isnellvtitillijiTittlirtelg' hled!YUl:i'nl2duct, which had been attacked,
to defend that of the Right Hon. Baronet.—(Hear;and a
laugh.) What was the history of the present enactment?
In 1834 the Poor-law _Bill was passed, and by it the power
of the Poor-law Commissioners was continued for five
t. thhee
powerN obleolf.ot Tic:,
ty, ei
ea rtsh. e
n.I 1
elm=
ra
Commissioners for one year ; and it was in the last
flo3irl IS, It‘r. aosu di 1,
ttroe dptri eoel prolong
Session of Parliament that the party, which had
on all occasions professed so much sympathy for
the poor, had dared to beard public opinion by
bringing in a Bill to continue their powers
fur ten years; and in consequence of their being scouted
by the public—being despi,ed by the public—for the
il!ailuer in• which thcv had acted 4.1.6 ft'gzir-A
that measure,- they now found fault i%iLli those
who complained of their conduct. A more pre-
posterous proposition was never made, and it was
wade in opposition to the loudly-expressed opinion of the

Til SUN,ZILONDON, 11:`, P S AY.i SF PTEME RR it4l
A

there was at this time flqu irk. hito the 03.aritilY ail ample
supply ilear.) Distress there certainly
Veasi Aft it was natural that there should be after the
misrule of ten years.—(ilear, hear, hear, and a •
laugh.) One great cause of that distress eas that roori
law which was sought to be contin.A; He ha,A ins eect
one consolation in the centifitiallee of that measure, that.
whatever might be 'tile character of the coming winter, in
the atiministration of relief to the poor there would be
no cruelty or oppression. The very first act of
the Right Honourable Baronet's Administration had
been one of care and attention to an alleged case of
poverty and distress. There was not a single victim
of poverty, or a single possessor of wealth in the king-
dom, who would not honour him for that deed, and de-
rive from it an assurance of his sympathy for the suffer-
ings of the poor.
Mr. WARD said he was surprised that the Hon.
Member should complain of the want of facts. Why,
there never was a measure with respect to which
such ample details had been laid before Parliament.
He would tell the Hon. Member that the great mass
of the people—the great mass of the intelligence
of the country--was in favour of the principle.—(Hear.)
There was a larger mass of information on the
subject of this Bill than upon any other subject
upon which they had been called to legislate,
He gave his full support to the measure of the Right
Honourable Baronet, not upon the principles of the
Honourable Member for Finsbury, but because he
believed the measure to be a most useful ne, atid
also because he believed if the central cheock was
not kept up, the worst results might be ex
pected. He hoped that next year, when they were pre-
pared to take up this measure, they would be enabled to
discuss it with the most perfect impartiality.
Mr. FERRANI) agreed with • the Honourable
Member who had just sat down, that nine-tenths
of the people of the country were opposed to
the harsh clauses of the law. His Honourable
Colleague and himself had been sent by their consti-
tuents to that House to oppose those clauses, and
for which they had broken asunder the bonds of the
Duke of Devonshire in the Borough of Knaresborough.
He had read that a Member of that House had
said that the party with which he acted had obtained
their majority by enormous lying.—(A laugh.) Why,
the Noble Lord opposite, and the Government
to which he lately belonged, had existed for years
by enormous lying.—(Loud cries of " Order, order,"
from both sides of the House, and one solitary
" Hear, hear.")
The SPEAKER (after a pause) said, he was sure that
when the Hon. Member had had some experience in
the House, he would see that such language as he had
just used would not add to the dignity of their proceed-
ings, and that out of respect to the public, as well as the
House, it should not be used.

Mr.:FERRAND begged to apologise to the House.
—(Cheers.) He had thought he was only using an
expression which had before been used in the
House. As he found it was not so, he begged
most humbly to beg pardon.—(Hear, hear.) Pre-
vious to the new Poor-law becoming the law of the
land, he had agitated throughout the country against it.
He thought it an unconstitutional law, and he op
posed it by every constitutional means in his
power. Even after it became law, he had op•
posed it in every legal way he could, and he only
retired from the agitation against it when he found that
the then Government thought proper to use the
Chartists to damage that agitation. He was
certain that no Ministry could stand which iden-
tified itself with the Pour law. The late
Government had fallen, and unless the Right
Hon. Baronet repealed the harsh clauses of that law, he
(Mr. F.) could assure him that he also must give way to
public opinion.
Mr. BODKIN thought the changes that had been
made in the law were calculated to confer great benefit
upon the parties who Were more immediately inte-
rested in the working of these laws. lie was not dis-
posed to adopt the mischievous and unfounded statements
of those who asserted that the promoters of the mea-
sure were actuated either by heartless indifference
to the sufferings of the people, or a desire to promote
their own private views. He could not help lamenting,
however, the absence of all discrimination in the character
and conduct of the poor. The idle and in-
dustrious, the p►udent and the profligate, were
permitted to stand upon the same level, and
had an equal claim upon the public purse.
The Bill was then read a second time.

On the question that it be committal on Frday,
Mr. WAKLEY hoped the Right lion. Baronet would
not press the committal of the Bill on Friday next. He
thought an opportunity should be afforded Hon. Mem-
hers of discussing it fairly.
Sir R. PEEL did not think it unreasonable to propose
that they should go into Committee on Friday. A discussion
on the whole question would be irrelevant in his opinion,
although, of comae, he could not prevent the Hon. Mem-
be front entering on that discussion if he thought proper.
tie thought there did not exist any objection to the pro-
posal that the House resolve itself into Committee on
that Bill on Friday next.
The question was then put that the Bill be committed
on Friday, and agreed to.
Sir JAMES GRAHAM moved for leave to bring in
a Bill to provide for the payment of the persons employed
in taking account of the population in England. There
were 38,000 enumerators in England and \\ ales, and
only 50,0001. was to be granted for their remuneration ;
it could thus be seen how small the sum was which
was to be paid to each person employed in the duties
imposed by the Bill.
Leave was given to bring in the Bill, and it was read
a first time.
On the motion of Sir R. PEEL the House then Ad-
journed to Friday.

Usual, and fewer have been sold than on former Mon-
days. The pcioes cimtinue Ii w, but have undergone n,
change this week, The wool m-zrltet has ben dull, an,
prices stationary.

LATEST NiANCiIESTEIt WJ:I4TING'.

MANCHESTER--I'IJESDAY EVENING.
As far as personal attention and inquiry can accom-
plish truth, we have every reason for stating that the
St. Leger settling has passed over so as to render it a
very harmless one ; indeed, the room this forenoon be-
spoke animation, which would not have been the case had
Satirist made a hard hit or two.
The Palatine Stakes, to be decided to-morrow over
Aintree, promises a field of nine, if not more. It will be
a very sporting race. Last evening the Lord Mayor '
was backed at 4 to 1, and on Saturday, with gist, at 5 to
1 ; the price was laid to-day, and offered on the field.
We cannot name the premier, as no one came out. The
following were as near the Offers, &c., as a well-patronized
room and a dash of settling would admit of obtaining :-
50 to 10 on the field—offered
20 to 10 agst any two—offered
20 to 10
.agst Mr. Goodman—offered : take 5 to 2
6 to 1 agst Lord Mayor—taken
6 to 1 agst Smollett—taken, then offered
6 to 1 agst Remnant—taken
10 to 1 agst Flash—taken.
Orelia, Naworth, Champagne, Clinker, Galaor, and
Ermengardis, were certainly all named, but no one bid
their prices, and consequently, we were left in the dark.
No other event was touched upon as regards Liver-
pool. A large number of turf gentlemen have left during
the evening, to be present at what is anticipated will be
a very good and fashionable meeting.
THE DERBY.—From several inquiries we are prepared
to expect a good betting race. Some engagements were
made, but so much sub rosy that we cannot venture upon
quotations. 10 to 1 was offered v. Lord George's lot,
and 12 to 2 against the Marquis of Westminster's two ;
8 to 1 against Day's lot, offered ;1,000 to 40 v. Aukland,
I offered. _

------ ---
THE MARQUIS OF WESTMINSTER'S STUD, &C.—
Air. Scott is no longer the Noble Marquis's trainer ;
his horses will be trained by Mr. Osborne. at Delamere
Forest. "The string," from Pigburn, passed through
yesterday. As may be supposed, various. reasons are
assigned ; but, from a very leading quarter, we can
state that his Lordship was not dissatisfied, hut wished
ell his race horses, brood mares, &c., to be nearer his
own eye, for the gratification of oftener seeing them; the
distance to 2laltim from Eaton Hall having precluded,
that pleasure.

DESTRUCTION OF THE SHIP
INDIA BY FIRE, AT SEA.
Rio JANEIRO, JULY 25.—1 t is my lot to describe
to you one of the most melancholy events in the annals
of ship disasters which his occurred for }errs, tem-
pered with the merciful interposition of Providence in
saving inaftudes of. hornaa beings from certain de-
struction. On Monday the 19th instant, our sh p the
ledia was in fourtrea degrees south latitu:!e ; after
breakfast or.e of the passengers came to the cebin and
reported that a strenee sail was in view. Not hiving
se,:n one for Vie previous fourteee days, we were all on
deck iostaritly ; bat it was too far diA tot to notice o'ir
signals, and as she was sailing in toe same line with us,
we kept in view of one another all the forenoon, and
came rather nearer after lunch, at 12 o'clock.
The writer at it's that he returned to fie cabin, and
then proceeds with his narrative :
" I had not sat above half an hour, when I was sur-
prised by a cry for water by the second mate, who was
running from the stair leading to the store-room to-
wards the saloon. I immediase'y sprang towards fee
door of ti:e stair which leads to the store-room, where
the cause was but too apparent from the smoke aid
light, Not a moment was to be lost ; the men weie
immediately' call .d att., with all the pails and pitchers
they could lay hold of. Tnis was done with the utmost
alacrity ; the supely of water was, however, far from
sufficient. We had a pump behind the binnacle, but
its bore was very trifling.; some flung buckets over the
ship's sides, hut in the hurry these were drawn up
scarcely half full. All this time, although some of the
hands were breaking up the vessel to get at the seat of
the fire, it was rapidly gaining ascendancy. It being
evident that we could not save the ship, our whole
energies were dirt ctcd to the preservation of our lives.
" When I came forward all was one scene of con-
fu,ion and despair, the women wringing their hands in
tie most heart-rending manner, and this, mingled with
the screaming of children, presented a scene it would
be vain to attempt describing. During this intsrval
guns of distress were filed to attract the attention of
the vessel in the distance. But in the meantime
we sent away the jolly boat with five seamen, to oter-
take or attract her attention to our situation; as it was
apparent that unless she came to our assistance every
soul on board must perish. They next commenced
clearing the long-boat of pigs, goats, &e., which were
tossed overboard. Tne boat was strong and heavy,
and it was with difficulty got over the side. After it
was over, it was immediately filled with the children,
and as many of the females as it could ho!d, with four
men to row them towards the vessel, end the gig was
lowered and I.y off about 50 yards to prevents its being
swamped.
" It was by this time evident that the vessel in view
was aware of our situation, as she appeared to be bear-
ing down upon us, though still about nine miles dis-
tant, and &though to the windward of us, it was not
unreasonable to conclude at the time that our vessel
would not float till she reached us, as she was now one
glowing mass of flame from stem to stern below, and
rising through the hatches, and running up the rigging
with incredible velocity. In lets than one hour from
the commencement of the fire her rnainmost was lying
over her lee-side, and the foremast, from lo.eing stayed
to the jib-boom, was brought forward across her bo.vs,
and carrying along with it tl.e jib-boom, of which I
shall have occasion so speak hereafter.
" Several cf the crew and passengers who could
swim were now floating out towards the vessel, and the
bowsprit W(l4 literally crowded and down the martingale.
The certein and the first mate had by this time taken
the water, and nothing but despair was now depicted
on every cotitifetiancei A number of the men re-
mained perfectly cool .ender these awful circumstances,
bat at the same time every one's Attention was devoted
to his own individual safety. Felber', mothers, and
ebildren t all be found in different positions, in
search of and trusting to such means of deliver-
ance as they thought best j and a great nembcr
were now floating in all direotionti ea pieces of
wreck. A spare maA, which had been thtowo over',
lied upwards of twelve clinging to it, and as they were
nearly all on one side, it was continually revolving,
which caused tl.em always to drop off, and the whole, I
believe, perished. The foremast, which was lying
across the bows, was crowded, and also the jib-booze.
Iprne.eded gang the martingale and laid hold of a
rope; Whether I Went down or was pushed, I know net
but I slid down, and whert near the water I found the
fofic tab lbhg, Allowing me to go quits over the head,
and with the rolling of the vessel the next moment
sus ended about five or six fetttl4
The writer of the narrative ilesetjtiett hit sufferings
after he contrived to reach the mast, statitig his belief
that he remained in this most perilous conditiert Up-
teards of an hour and a half. By this time the decks
were all burned, and the home of the strange vessel had
reached them. S.) great was the rush that one of the
WAS ties upset, and upwards of five or six men drowned
by this accident. Tneir own boat had now Leached
them. By the management of the second mate all left
tali the *reek were brought. away safely.
" The strange vessel proved to be a French whaler
for the South Sea Fishery, about he site of the India,
anti found in provisions. Eery attention bias
prod to the ftfifits of those saved from the wreck, of
whom irony wets actually naked, and none had been
ab'ti to sties deythloee.
" The total tallitiet o 1 board the India was 214, of
whom 18 perished—tiz., ICf ateetage, bee cabin pea.
Sen,s,r; and the boatswain.
tne lire dr4iinated thus :—The second mate and
doe df the boys W6to eteetitig off some gin, and as the
bandlE bias ton short fat the lantern, they took it out
and when plaeiti4 if; it fel between two barrels, where
some of the spirits had been spilled, and to a moment
the whole was in a blaze, the store-room being full of
canvass and other combustibles.
aWe arrived to-day in the harbour of Rio Janeiro.
At tka time of this accident we were 600 miles from
land, and our boats would not have held one-third of
and soul l
were the flames that we
the paesessgers,
could not save a single article of bread or water, nor
oleo provides ourselves with a compass."
No blame could be attributed to the captain or offi-
cers, who all did their utmost at first to extinguish the
fire, and when that became hopeless, to save the lives
of the passengers and crew,