The Sun.
London, England, 1812-03-24 00:00:00

TRADE OF LIVERPOOL.

General TARLETON presented a Petition from cer-
tain Merchants, Ship-owners; and Traders of the
town of Lwerpooli against the renewal of the East
India Charter, praying for an Abolition of the East
India Trade Monopoly. Time Hon. General stated,
that the Petition was-signed by upwards of 4000
persons, in one of the largest .assetubles hich had
ever been convened in that town, and the signa-
tures were all procured in a few hours.
On the question for bringing it up—.
Mr. CEEEVEY did not rise to oppose it. On the
contrary, he would he glad to see it on the table.—
He merely rose to cOrreti a misrepresentation of the
HonOurahle General's, with tespea to the aelual
situation of the people'Of the town, and to maintain
that-the statement -which he (Mr. Creevey) had
originally made of their distresses, was the true
ta lenient of their condition. He had stated, and he
now repeated it, that the number of poor had in-
creased from eight to fifteen thousand persons. So
_far from his account being overstated, (as the Hon.
General, in the explanation which he had given on
a former night, had made out) he was, from sub-
sevent information, more convinced than ever of
his own correctness, and of the decay of trade in that
to. wp. It was most extraordinary to him how any
Gentleman could wish to deceive the House, w hen
it was evident that, as he had before said, the ships
were dismastcd, the riggers antr carpenters out of
employ, and the general appearance of the town •
such as to satisfy any person of the distresses under
which the inhabitants labour. The absence of the
American trade, which constituted one of the chief
props of the town, had occasioned this decay, which
was felt in Chester and Manchester ; also, in the •
falling offof exports of salt and goods of various de-
scriptions, To shew the vast decrease in the trade,
he had a document from the Customs _which stated
the exports -for the last to o years for that town. In
the year preceding the last the amount was two
millions six hundred and seveniy-siX thousand
pounds. In the last year 1,770,0001. being a defi-
ciency of about nine hundred thousand pounds be-
tween the two years
_ending sth January last. In
addition to the distress occasioned by the -absence of
trade, there were distresses of another kind connect-
ed with'the colleaion of the. taxes. He understood
that an Attorney in the town, (a Mr. Parti) per-
haps not the most eminent in his profession, find-
ing business not coming in, had made application to
the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and got conveyed
into an InspeClor of the district. In this new cha-
ratter he suggested to his llght Hon. Friend, as his
fellow townsmen would not employ him, that the
revenue would be greatly improved by surcharging
them on their assessments generally. The conse-
quence of these surcharges was a general manifesta-
tion of discontent throughout the town, and an
alarth among the Collectors of taxes. The Sorveyor
of the district finding he could not discharge tie
oust reposed in him faithfully under the new li,-
speclor, resigned his office, and others were about,
to follow, or had followed his example. The At-
torney perhaps had received his appointment in con-
sequence of having been a client of the Right Ho-
nourable Gentleman, at a period of his life when
he followed the profession of the law, and therefore
gratitude might have led to the appointment, At
any'rate, it was not to be endured that men should
be induced by such appointments to become in-
former, against their neighbours and fellow towns-
men.

Mr. ROSE was not prepared for the statements
of the Honourable Gentleman. He would not
deny that Liverpool, in common with other great
towns, had felt decay of trade. With respect to
the statement of the great increase of persons claim-
ing and receiving relief, he would wish to observe,
that there were persons not receiving parochial aid,
but who were, from circumstances, glad to obtain
assistance from the Subscribers Fund, which had
been established to a certain extent. This was no new
fund, for the same assistance had been afforded se-
ven or eight years before, when similar pressure was
felt; and then between seven and eight thousand
more pet sons than the number stated by the Hon.
Gentleman, were relieved. As to the decay of ship-
ping, he had received a return from the Colleaor or
the and tlis numbers were only 93 or

4, and seven or eight of the owners of those ships
had become bankrupts. In po'nt of faa, there
were none lying by the walk, fur most of the ships
had employ in other trades than to America. He
would admit, however, that the interruption of the
intercourse with that country had contributed to the
injury of the saluArade, but upon the whole the de-
cay was less than might be reasonably expected un-
der existing circumstances.
General TAItLE.TON referred to documents which
he had before produced, to shew that the statement
of his Honourable Friend (Mr. Creevey) was not
corre&. These documents, winch he read, were
furnished by the Committee at Liverpool, to refute
what his Honourable Friend had asserted in his
place ; and stated, that with resped to the situation
of the inhabitants of Liverpool, 'diet had been af.
forded, and some of them receiving tickets, had
pawned them, Nat to procure rovisions, but to ob-
tain admission into the theatre ; that labourers
might have had employ at the rate of 3s. per
day, but they refused; that a sum of 2,5001. had
been subscribed for the purpose of affording relief,
and 2,e701. expended. With respe6t to British ves-
sels, and the persons employed in them, there was
. not, on the 14th of March, a carpenter in the place
unemployed.
General GASCOYNE conceived the best mode of
judging. of the state of the town, would be to take
the medium between the two, accounts; most cer-
. tainly there had been a considerable diminution in
the trade. It had been stated by his Hon. Friend,
on a former occasion, that there were 56 ships
no-
employed ; not one half of that number, however,
were for sale. When it was recollected that three-
fourths of the trade at Liverpool was tO Antes ica,
could it
.be thought extraordinary that there was a
stagnation ? He trusted that the inconvenience
would be of a tempoialy nature only , the chief
cause of the distress arose from the depiession cf
the Colonial. trade.

Mr. A. EsaiNC observed, that in the Town of
Liverpool, the Corporation generally supported the
Minister of the day, and their zeal of course in-
creased, to represent the town in a better condition
than it actually was. He thought it was a great in-
jury to the interests of the country, that things
should be misunderstood and misrepresented. It
the Right Hon. Gentleman, who from hii situa-
tion was peculiarly appointed to watch the trade of
the country; was so ignorant of the state of the
Town of Liverpool, as to'credit the reports of the
Mayor and Corporation, little chance of getting
relief might be expected by the people. Whether
the present system with respect to America was
right or wrong, was not the question now, .but the
fact was-, the trade of Liverpool was injured to an
enormous extent in consequence, so also were the
Potteries in Staffordshire, the Salt Work in Che-
shire, and the Trade of Manchester, all these places
had suffered very materially. The Right Hon. Gen-
tleman bad misrepresented the state of the shipping
in-the Port of, London ; there was not now a great
demand for- transports ; - there never was a period
when transports were taken up on smaller terms ; it
was known that the owners were losers by the con-
trads they entered into, but they thought it better
that their ships should be employed. It had b•!en,
stated by the Right Hon. Gentleman, that the
French were giving way, and opening the door to a
great trade. -But be would ask, was it a proper
mode of remedy ing distress, to rake from the con-
tinent French calla-tries, lawns, jewellery wares, li-
nens,-- &c. brought in vessels of countries under the
controul of France, to the amount of between t
and 20001. per ton, and in return export to the va-
lue of only 51. per' ton ? Was this a fair balance of
trade ? With respell to- what the Hon. Gentle-
man (Mr. Creevey) had said about the colledion of
the taxes, he•was performing-an ungracious task in
throwing obstacles in the way of the collection.
„Mr. Rosa, in explanation, denied that he stated
that the shipping of Liverpool was in a prosperous
state, nor bad lie said that the shipping in the ports
of • London was so. The transports had increaSed
from 19 to 235. per ton. He 'believed he was cor-
red in that statement ; sure he was that the price
of transports was considerably more than in former
years. As to the trade with France, he had stated
that he had reason to believe that some trade would
be opened, but-to what extent he could not tell,
nor indeed was the subject a fir one to discuss now.
Mr. A. BARING observed, that the Right Hon.
Gentleman was mistaken.

Mr. RUSE.--- I do avow again that the Hon.
Gentleman is-most entirely mistaken." _ _

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER conceived
the House would not think he adeff correctly, were
he to allow the observations-of the Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. Creevey), to pass unnoticed. The tone and
manner of the Hon. Gentleman, when talking of
the appointment of the Distil& Inspector of Liver-
pool, must have impressed on the House an opinion
that he felt most warmly fur, some old client, as the
Hon. Gentleman was pleased to term this surveyor,
to whom he (Mr, P.) had owed a good turn for,for-
mer_favours, and therefore thought the best thing
That could be done for old friendship was to get him
to surcharge his feli9w-townsmen, for which pur-
pose he had appointed him to a situation in which
he rnklit carry his object into effect. S•A the. Hon,
Gentleman wi:shed the House to understand. -It
appeared from the statement of the Hon. Gentle-
man, that this old client and new protegee, so anx-
ious to carry on his nurpoSe, had 'under him a person
of very delicate nerves, who, not being able to fol-
low his superior Officer in his duties, thought pro-
per to resign. Now, with respect Co this attorney
and client, he had no knowledge whatever,_ but fie
did recoiled something of the Gentleman under him
of delicate nerves---the same, he supposed, from
whom the Honourable Gentleman had colleeted
corred information—who had been called upon
to account for some misconclud, and this call
had so abutted him,, that he thought it better
to resign.—He did recoiled that another per-
son was appointed upon the recommenda-
tion of Mr. Lowndes, and that person, he ima-
gined, was the old-client of whom he had spoken,
but of whom he had not the most distant recolle-c-
-tion. , Now, it would become the Hon. Gentleman,
before he roundly asserted any thing fur fact, a lit-
tle to suspect the accuracy of his informant, espe-
• cially when that informant was a discarded Sur-
- veyor.—(l-lear! hear !)--The tone and insinuation
of the Hon. Gentleman implying more than was
said in words. If he (Mr. P.) had roade'a bargain
with an old client, as was insinuated, would not
1.14 Hon. G,Ciltlqa)RD have acts wore fairly-, if Int

had made it the sublect or a grave charge agairat
him (or an act, as unworthy a one as could be yell
imagined ? With respect to surcharges generall,
there was no intention of making any such agree-
ment, and „until the persons making surchprges
Were examined, it was the greatest assumption
which the Hon. Gentleman could take upon him.,
self to suppose they were wrong. Was it nut right
that pers,,ns assessed should pay their just proportion
to.the expense of the-State; and therefore if they kept
back, was it not equitable too, that they should bo
chzfrged to the extent of their liability to pay ? The
Right Hon. Gentleman deprecated the pradice of
making false statements of the trade and resources
of the country, as injurious in the highest,degree_

Mr. CR EEVEY denied that he had received his
fin-Illation from. a disc t.deci Colleaor. The-1-Jon.•
Gentleman was proceediii,2, when
.the House.calie.l'
but " Spoke, spoke!" And after .an obseivatioit
from the Chancellor of the Exchequer, the Petition
wai brought up.
Mr. A. BARING declared that he should not
gone into the subjeti, if he had not thought the pe.
Lion wag a general onc, complaining of distress, atsLi
not for the non-renewal of the Company's Chat ter.
He wished to know whether it was intended to'
bring on the suhje..l of the Company's Charter thN:
year ? He hoped if so, it would,not be put off ti.l
the close of the Session.

Mr. Rosa was ready to meet the subjea when it
was regularly before the House. It would not bo
decent or becoming. to make any obierrations Oputt
any sui*Cl totally irrelevant to the question before
the House.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER stated, in
answer to the. Hon. Gentle►uan, .that. it was -his in-
tention, after the recebk, to bring the measure be-
fore the House.

The petition was then laid on the table.
General TA BLETON presented two other peti-
ions on tie saute:subject fiorn the Corporation.

On the motion.ot Mr. Rosa, an account of the
number of tanspoits hired, and the prices paid for
the same, flout 1.807. to the 20th► Match List,
ordered to be laid hetore,the. House.
Lord CASTLRREAGII gave notice, that on Wed-
nesday he would move, in,a Committee of Supply,
the usual subsidy of 400,0001. for the deleoce of
Sicily.
Lord PALMERSTON brought up certain returns,
ordered by the House, and, obtained lcave to bring
in the usual Bill for incmsing the rates of Int:-
keepers' allowances.