The Sun.
London, England, 1847-05-11 00:00:00

TILE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY MORNING, MAY 11, 1847.

and Ireland. The Noble Lord opposite had stated that
the Government were anxious to give the landlords an
interest in the working of the poor-law; hot was it to be
supposed that the landlords, who paid two thirds of the
rates, should be considered as parties Neely to assist in
the beneficial operation of the measure ; his only object
would very naturally be to reduce the expenditure. Ile
felt it his duty, therefore, to consent to the amendment
of his Noble Friend ; and he thought that in doing so,
he was acting with a due regard to the justice, the pros-
perity, and the safety of the people of that country,
Earl ST. GERMANS said the Noble Lord who had
just sat down had advanced a line of argument in respect
of the ex (ilficio guardians founded upon an erroneous
view of the English Poor law. But he could not avoid
adverting to the attack Which the Noble Earl had made
when he remarked upon him, as the bearer of messages
from the House of Commons. He might disclaim this
at once and be done with it. He had not been the bearer
of messages from the House of Commons, but he did
think proper to mention the opinion of a Noble Friend of
his who had been lately efficially connected with Ireland,
and who had not habitually acted with a party ; he did
think it well to zeention the opinion of that Noble Lord.
But to advert to the argument of the Noble Earl—He
had overstated the proportions of the rate levied, as he
would find by reports which lay upon their Lordships'
table. The rite levied by the Bill was by far the most
equable, placiree the grasping and the liberal landlord upon
a level, for the tenant was entitled, out of every pound
of rent which he paid, to half the rate which was levied
upon him. The Noble Lord then reverted to the debates
which occurred both before their Lordships and in the
Commons when the criginal Irish poor-law was intro-
duced, and quoted at length from the opinions expressed
by several Members of the Lower House on the
5/. clause, all which, he said went to make
it more stringent upon the landlord ; nay, more, a Com-
mittee of which the Noble Lord (then Mr. Spring Rice)
was Chaim:lan, went so far as to recommend the imposi-
'ion of the whole rate upon the landlords. He greatly
doubted as to the policy of the amendment, believing that
it would deprive the Bill entirely of any chance of
success.
The Earl of 'MALMESBURY said he would explain,
as briefly as possible, why he would support the Noble
Lord's amendment. He was an English landlord, as
some of their Lordships knew, without one acre of land
in Ireland, and without any experience whatever of that
country. He had, therefore, hitherto refrained from
debates on Irish affairs ; but on this occasion a great
principle was in question, and in that principle he was
interested. It was a principle which the members of
her Majesty's Government had adopted and affirmed in
the English poor-law, which they bad produced,
brought in, and passed. They affirmed then that the oc-
cupying tenant ought to pay the rates. The principle
of the amendment was, therefore, no new principle, and
if Ministers were opposed to it, he asked them why they
did not abandon the poor-law existing in England, and
enact a new law containing a new principle. But
what would be the consequences, he said, of the
present amendment ? On this head reference
had been made to the disorders that had
been stirred against the payment of tithes to
the Protestant clergy. He, however, denied the analogy
of the two cases ; they were entirely different, as the
history of religion alone might evince to them, and one
allusion had been made to legislating for the country as
it was. There was a sense of that phrase in which he
agreed ; but he could not advise, that to legislate for a
country as it was instead of what it ought to be, was not
the way to improve and benefit that country. As long
as they refused to assimilate the poor-law of England
and Ireland, so long would discord continue ; they might
be twins, but they never would be twin sisters.
Earl WICKLOW had always maintained the princi-
ple that the rates should be paid by the occupier and not
by the tenant ; but although he supported such an
amendment at the time the poor-law was passed, he
considered that the present moment was most inexpe-
dient to introduce it. It would cause muck bitterness
between landlord and tenant, and would materially pre
vent the proper and deei,-able carrying out of the mea-
sure. These were sufficient reasons to induce him to
vote against the clause.
The Archbishop of DUBLIN rose amidst loud cries of
" question" to address their Lordships. He should not
support the amendment of the Noble Lord ; but at the
same time he admitted that his principles were right and
sound.—(llear, hear.) Still he believed that the plan
he proposed could not, in the present state of things in
Ireland, be carried out. He was most desirous that the
Bill should have a fair trial, and he was most anxious,
therefore, not to throw difficulties in the way of its
working. He thought, as he had said, that the clause
proposed a healthy and a correct system of rating ;
but still, in the present state of Ireland,
he conceived that the rate must after all
be paid by the landlords. But he feared that the poor
tenants of Ireland were not either in a fit condition of
purse or mind to be induced to believe it they paid the
rates, that they would not be called upon to pay them
again. He cited a case in which 1,6001. a year was saved
by the guardians of a parish by the adoption of a better
and more direct mode of paying the rates. Although
he considered that the plan of the tenants paying the
rate was the best, the wisest, and most judicious that
could be adopted, he could not, in the present state of
Ireland, consent to the insertion of such a clause into
the Bill.
Lord REDESDALE said he could hardly reconcile the
extraordinary argument which had been brought against
the proposition of his Noble Friend, because they were
told that the principle was correct, but that from the
f
gairn,reaadtnmeit toebdryeeti
ouh hl safee
tinemoon tari
nns
moreat
wstehl
iyelh%bsiiehmfy.cp,ral rieirnitseahtdaatntoei
instance
eah'
ne3t,
p. Nhai
st
t aaei °col t rsl could
el
d
h
d a
in the pounce was deducted on account of the rates which
he would have to pay, where was the hardship that would
be imposed upon him, and where was the ex-
traordinary advantage which the landlords obtain—
Much had been said, and, in fact, many Noble Lords
had argued the measure as if that was the sole ground of
the measure, namely, the immigration of poor from Ire-
land to Liverpool ; but if they wanted to keep them in
Ireland they must afford them some encouragement by
providing them the means of lucrative employment and
by making it to the interest of the landlords to afford
them the employment they stood so much in need of.
Much might be done in this respect by leaving the onus
of the rates on the landlord and charging him a smaller
rent. He would thus be spurred to use exertions to im-
prove his soil and to realise greater profits. In Scotland
the rates were paid by the tenants, and the greatest ad-
vantage was derived from the plan there adopted.
Lord ROSEBERY explained the nature of the past
and present poor-law of Scotland.
Lord CL ANCARTY said that, although he entirely
concurred in the clause prolapsed by the Noble Lord,
and was convinced that they were indispensably neces-
sary, he yet noticed that as the House had not yet gone
the length of stating, that they would confide a discre-
tionary power to the boards of guardians, or that the
first clause should be carried into effect—that no assist-
ance on either side would he expected from him. He should
leave the matter to the House unaided by any vote of his
The measure was in the details inconsistent, as those
clauses which referred to the system of relief to be
given were temporary, while the provisions for rating
were of a permanent character. The existence of these
two provisions in one measure was an inconsistency
which he could not feel himself justified in supporting.
He felt
.much reluctance in withholding his vote, but
still upon the present occasion he felt it to be his duty
to do so.
Lord STANLEY said that there had been, no doubt,
in that discussion much which had given hlm the deepest
pain and anxiety. There was not one of their Lord-
ships who in the course of that discussion had an-
nounced their determination to vote against his amend-
ment, who had questioned the soundness of the
principle upon which it was founded. The kind
ness with which their Lordships had listened to
him that evening would be a strong inducement to
him not to trespass upon their attention fcr any length
of time, yet he must still bring a few points under the
attention of their Lordships. It had been stated that
the Irish Poor-law had for the last five or six years
worked well, but what was the Irish Poor-law?—(Hear.
hear.) It had been during that time strictly confined to
relief within the workhouse and to the destitute poor.
His argument was that it was the occupier of land in
Ireland who had the power of employing labour, and as
it was by the employment of the poor that the poor-rate
could be kept down, some inducement must be given to
them to reduce it as much as possible. Ho would sub-
mit that point to their Lordships, and also that of the
principle of out-door relief, for in the course of the de-
bate those arguments had remained untouched. He
felt most deeply that they were about to adopt for a
permanent legislation a mischievous and a dangerous
principle, and when they laid down this law for Ireland
they gave it a mischievous principle for its guidance and
operation. Reference had been made to the poor-law
of Scotland, where there could be no comparison, for
out-door relief was not known to the Scotch law, and
the landlord and tenant might make any agreement they
pleased with reference to which of them should pay the
rate charged, while it was a serious infractionof the law
to do so in Ireland. He regretted that he should be
compelled to differ from so many of those with whom he
had ever acted, and he yet more deeply lamented the
language and tone which had been used on this occasion.
Ile regretted that the majority of their Lordships'
House were opposed to the principle which he wished
to introduce in the Bill. Whatever might be the fate
of this question, he could assure their Lordships that no
personal consideration would prevent him from doing his
duty. He trusted that those who had done him the
honour to support him on this question, and whose sen-
timents coincided with his own, would not think that he
exercised an unwise discretion in not giving their Lord-
ships the trouble of an unnecessary division. He should,
however, feel it his duty, for fob m's sake, and for that
only, to move this amendment on bringing up the report
ou the Bill. He would do this in his own justification,
and in order that it might appear upon the journals of
the House that this amendment had been made.
The Archbishop of DUBLIN explained.
'The Marquis of CLANRICARDE denied that the
a(dlp‘:::sLuerehiol
would
principlereeoddth nkoamot
,ttvcdtoheooes
ttbei
atlyeeakT contended
ettEdnihai
principlese
Aae dal
taGna rfortdgi by,ehvezeEwormt;
hNimaeai
ticooehotbvsioerel
phieodtNpet
lot o%:trovbohtafi
rluisetdshi t
thieLh measuret
adayeoptrtpßoodheiii
appeared
oppositelopalrrueosdhouse
tnwa og and
dsht whaohiavps
e;,
y
d
on in itsb
ynpresentthe
er
Noble
heard sohbablaeepp
law.er
rei
Lord CAMPBELL said, that in all his ybeedxrpoeweprnoieritiecde
wasmotion
cloiknevinthceadt
thatjust
moved
eddr in the Irish noroeorp:d)dsreetiientdneatfnsioahhndree he
eEnglish Parliament
thefiot state at
thatt ew ai
sni a the
whichthe rfirstiliet
couldtlast tao Bthheiel lyp salisfisoleluddl d
ina
four clauses of this Bill two were limited in duration,'
and two were left so far unfinished that they werewit
out limitation,. reminding him very forcibly of Sir
Walter Scott's Melrose by moonlight. Buttress and
buttress alternately seemed framed of ebon and ivory.

There appeared to be a strange misunderstanding be-
tween the Noble Lords on this side, who opposed this
measure, and the Noble Lord opposite, fOr T, bile one pro-
posed to limit the operation of the measur. to the I,t
iJimaniuteadryt,ollBB4,s9o,. the other proposed
moved, thatthat
tihteshopoeurldatiobne
Lord MONTEAGE
of the clauses authorising out-door relief to the able-
fiborsdtieodf psaonrusahroyulldBb49e.limited (as we understooth)dsoe)udtlodtthhbaeet
insertedh
eT ho
ieausiclause
Marquisitihnlimiting
itßi oni flgl Lft
for
re Nt
the
Di
operationnOflVrmNaoEt
if ttnhh
oee
At
hpcerto House;ps
and
at the time of bringing up the report the Government
would feel themselves at perfect liberty to adopt any
course which they might think proper with respect to
that subject.
The Berl of WICKLOW complained that the Noble
Lord had adopted the amendment which he had pro-
posed to move, and he hardly knew what course he was
now to adopt. He thought the only course for him to
pursue, would be to bring forward his amendment, when
the amendmeat of his Noble Friend had been disposed cf;
After a few words from Earl FITZWILLIAM, and Earl
GREY,
The Archbishop of DUBLIN said that he thought
the object of the amendments of the Noble Lord was to
make one portion of the Bill of a temporary, End the
other, of a permanent character ; he had always ex-
pressed opinions uflavourable to a system of out-door
relief to the able-bodied poor, and it way because he
entertained these
le
-b,
portionlunfavourable, idill ol
eould bitoihenniovios:
sloiial.lniil:ateegtdomnohpiotenotruta‘te,hiol.pro-
posedvyerr e that
atthethabt
character all, ncutte rh ;e
nwgh,i)ltea tnheew
principle, should befl
Ir
consideredlisTu AasTpArtmhaonulcgtt.
it
nothing
The Marquis of
more than fair that the system of out-door relief for the
able-bodied poor should be allowed a trial before the
measure was made a permanent one.
After a short discussion, the clause was agreed to.
After some desultory conversation, the House re-
sumed, and the report was ordered to be brought up on
Friday next.

Their Lordships then adjourned, at a quarter past
eleven o'clock.

HOUSE OF G'O4IIMONS. May 10.
The SPEAKER took the Chair shortly before Four
o'clock.

GREAT NORTHERN RAILWAY.

Mr. GISBORNE moved, pursuant to notice, that it be
an instruction to the Committee on the Great North-
ern Railway (Deviations between London and Grant-
ham) Bill, to entertain the petition of the Ambergate,
Nottingham, Boston, and Eastern Junction Railway
Company, under their common seal.
After some observations from Mr. Estcourt, Sir Wm.
Heathcote, Mr. Greene, Mr. Aglionby, and Mr. Strutt,
the motion was withdrawn.
SOU TH-EASTERN RAILWAY (NORTH KENT).
Mr. O. STANLEY moved the third reading of the
South-Eastern Railway (North Kent line) Bill.
General FOX moved, pursuant to notice, to alter the
11th clause as follows :—And be it enacted, that nothing
contained in this Act, or in the Acts herein cited or re•
ferred to, shall extend to authorise the company [with-
out the consent of the principal officers of her Majesty's
Ordnance, or their successors, signified in writing
under the hand of the secretary of the said principal
officers for the time being] to carry the said
intended line of railway nearer to the fortifications
of Chatham than a line six hundred yards from the
counterscarp of Prince Edward's Bastion, and which
line shall be marked out and submitted for the approval
of the Master-General of her Majesty's Ordnance and
the Inspector-General of Fortifications, immediately
after the passing of this Act, and that the same shall
be constructed to the satisfaction of the said Master-
General of her Majesty's Ordnance and the Inspector-
General of Fortifications, at the cost and charges of the
said company.
After a few observations the clause as amended was
agreed to, and added to the Bill, which was read a third
time and passed.
SOUTH-EASTERN RAILWAY (STROOD TO
MAIDSTONE).
This Bill was read a third time and passed, on the
motion of Mr. 0. STANLEY.

*(-)-6'ili-EASTERN RAILWAY (MID KENT AND

DIRECT 'TUNBRIDGE).
Mr. 0. STANLEY moved the third reading of this
Bill. _ .

Mr. R. HODGSON moved, pursuant to notice, that
the clause granting five years for the compulsory pur-
chase of land be altered to three years.
After some short discussion the motion was with-
drawn, and the Bill read a third time and passed.

REPORTS.
The reports on the following Bills were brought up
and agreed to:—

~
Belfast Port and Harbour.
Caledonian Railway (Glasgow, Garnkirk, and Coat-
bridge Railway Branch to Glasgow and Station).

Cork ;nd Bandon Railway.
Cork, Biackrock, and Passage Railway.

Dublin Consumers Gas.
Eastern Union and Ipswich and Bury St. Edmund's
Railways Amalgamation.
Edinburgh Markets and Customs.
General Terminus and Glasgow Harbour Railway
Branches.
Great Western Railway (Branch to join the West Lon-
don Railway, Widening and Enlargement of West
London Railway, and Branches to Hammersmith, and
to join the London and South-Western Railway near
Lambeth).
Glasgow, Barrhead, and Neilston Direct, any Glasgow
Southern Terminal Railways Amalgamation.
Ipswich and Bury St. Edmund's Railway (No. I—Ex-
tension to Yarmouth).
Leith Harbour and Dock Dues.

Lynn and Ely Railway (Deviation and Lynn Docks).
Runcorn Gas.

Ityde Improvement.
Sheffield Markets.

Southampton and Dorchester Railway (Wearmouth
Branch).
Waterford, Wexford, Wicklow, and Dublin Railway
(No. 1).
Wilsontown, Morningside, and Coltness Railway
(Branches to Benhar Coal• works and Edinburgh and
Glasgow Turnpike-road).
SECOND READINGS.

The following Bills were read a second time, and or-
dered to be committed:—
Limerick Docks and Harbour.

New Zealand Company.
C )NSIDERATION OF REPORTS.

The reports on the following Bills were further con-
sidered and agreed to:—
Bingley Gas.
British Commercial Insurance Company (No. 2).
Eastern Union and Hadleigh Junction Railway (Sale
to the Eastern Union Railway Company).
Ewell Rates.
Kingston-upon-Thames Small Tenement.'

Nolverhurripton Rates.
ROYSTON AND CAMBRIDGE EXTENSION

RAILWAY.

Mr. GOULBURN moved that it be an instruction to
the Committee on the Royston and Cambridge Exten-
sion Railway Bill, to entertain the petition of the Uni-
versity of Cambridge against the said Bill. He said the
petition had been rejected because it did not contain at
its commencement the short title of the Bill.
Mr. BERNAL objected to the use of the word " en-
tertain," and suggested that the Committee should be
simply required to consider the petition.
Sir W. HEATHCO rE opposed the motion, and con-
sidered the House ought not to alter a rule, compliance
with which was exceedingly easy, as its wording was
simple and explicit.
Mr. BROTHERTON said, during the present session
many petitions had come before him,-in which the short
title of the Bills to which they referred were omitted,
and in order that the expense and injury might be saved
to the parties, he had himself written the short titles of
the 13illa at the head of them. As this occurred through
the laxity of Parliamentary agents, and as the rule laid
down by the House should not be departed from, he
should oppose the motion.
Mr. GOULBURN withdrew his motion.

DISTILLATION FROM GRAIN.
Mr. BROTHERTON presented several petitions from
various parts of this country against distillation from
grain.

creased by 30s. a quarter, and that there was every
probability of a further increase. He wished, under
such circumstances, to know whether it was the inten-
tion of the Government to prohibit the use of grain in
distilleries for a limited period?
Lord J. RUSSELL said, that in the absence of any
notice on this subject he was not prepared to answer
that question, and he should therefore take time to do
so. Ile might, however, generally state that he should
bring before the House o❑ an early day a measure for
the further suspension of the duties on corn.

DISCOUNT ON LOANS.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER then
rose to bring before the House the present monetary
condition of the country. Ile said—Mr. Speaker, lam
not aware that I need add much mere—
Mr. HUME—Speak up.—(Laughter).
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—I
need not add much more to what I stated to the
House on Friday last as to the intention of the
Government with regard to the present state of the
money market in this country. I stated on Friday
night that I proposed to submit to this Committee a re-
soluii, n enabling the Government to allow interest by
way of discount on all sums of money made
by the contractors or contributors to the loan, in
anticipation of instalments due on a future day.
That is the resolution which I propose, Sir, to put into
your hands. I stated then the allowance which the
Government is prepared to make, and I also proposed
to state the amount of the discount which we are pre-
pared to allow. But perhaps it is necessary, for
the satisfaction of the House, that I should make some
additional statement by which all depressions and all
panics may be avoided, and by which the Government
securities may be admitted as available in the market.
I am free to allow that I did not apprehend, and that I
could not be aware of the high price which corn would
attain, and the pressure which will necessarily
be felt in all commercial circles. The natural
consequence of the high prices of corn is to create a con-
siderable pressure on the springs of commerce. By this
measure I hope to prevent that pressure, and I feel cer-
tain, that if rightly used, it will prevent any such result
as that which many have anticipated. I am quite aware
that by the measure which I am about to propose, that the
result will be to impose a great additional burden upon
the public, Hon. Members are aware that it has been
necessary, from the high rate of interest in the commer-
cial market, to elevate the price of all securities, and the
consequence has been that Exchequer-bills suffered a
great depreciation, and it was necessary to raise their
value in order to give a greater facility to trade. This is
necessary, mot only for the transactions of mercantile men,
but for the interest of those artisans whom they employ.
I believe, therefore, this measure is absolutely necessary
for the credit of the Government. From representations
which have been make to me, I find that the traders and
bankers of the country have been unable to obtain the
ordinary supplies of money to enable them to carry on
their transactions. The bankers of the country
are unable to discount bills as they could do
in prosperous times, owing to the scarcity
of money which at present prevails in all
branches of trade. I have also been told that the in-
vestment of large sums of money in railroads has had a
considerable tendency to withdraw capital from the or-
dinary sources of trade, as well as to render money
more scarce than it otherwise might have been. I have
heard that many parties in Lancashire who have invested
their money in railroads have preferred to sell their shares
at a discount rather than pay up the calls, and of course
that eircuu.tstance has naturally tended to
.increase the
scarcity of money.

Mr. HUME—Speak up. It is not usual for a Member
to speak with his.: back turned to the House.— (Hear,
hear, and. laughter.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—I find
also that a system has prevailed amongst the moneyed
men of London of withdrawing their money from
Government securities, and purchasing, with the
money so withdrawn, goods, bills, and railway
shares at very large discounts. At first this
naturally led to a great;, increase in the
number of bills brought into the market, and when the
alarm or panic came, the banke rs, in whose hands the
bills were placed, found it the more difficult to get money
advanced upon them, except its very heavy discounts.
It was further represented to uo, from the unsaleability
of Exchequer-bills, that many men were unable to
realise any money on those which they held, and conse-
quently the effect of the measure lately passed will be
to facilitate them in such effort.i, and it will also en-
able them to dispense with calls upon the bill-broker,
and, further, it must alleviate th,e pressure on the money
market by bringing into circultttion capital, until now
locked up. Now, Sir, lam not prepared to say that it
would have been possible for the Bank to have done this,
except with the concurrence of thk last measure, enabling
the bankers to pay their loans by advances with Ex-
chequer-bills; however the obj ect of the Govern-
ment was to put themselves: in funds, by the
use of the money now lying in th a banks. Sir, the ex-
tent of the demand upon the Bank has been exceedingly
limited. I made no more than the usual call. I had
forewarned the Bank what the amount would be.
Nor was there any reason fo r alleging that an
assurance or pledge was
dividends,dadmeeuaaninidis
mw oeunrsteth
pet
oirai e.
paid,
etw:bvoeuosutal
idotaquvnu
charter that such assistance would. not be required. I
e
given a t the
can find no such promise; but did observe, that in
consequence of another measure, the equalization of
therefore, that it was wise measure.
It I. may be permitted to readxeee
r- et from a speech
which I myself made on
effect from a speech
ehwhiseanhssethat an ex a .
it will be seen
that I then predicted the resultoccafs
themeasure. The
Right Hon. Gentleman he of
extract to that
read an d
t. d
Now, Sir, I quote this to show that the operation of the
measure was foreseen, and that no ex- tectation was held
itre
cr
nhgt
a to
mlaakpep
misapprehension
out of an excessive demand being die. I have thought
gen-
tlemen have fallen into on thislt will be seen,
subject.
therefore, that the time when advances would be required
was amply foreseen, and time iv foren paration to pro-
vide for them. With regard to theecn br' -tors to the loan,
it has been my object to give every facilityontr u
for the purpose
of easing the money market, and experiencem in public
statementoa nd made
vwb aahteehrhnatietiveleanerehossfsl'etobadm,Bhore
4aoaeci,
.trsrnctic
re:cgtat,towhen
wtrs
npeionoauunnt passing
r quarters
emptecrhfi
00.
number
. eshnererearnoool
continued—
Now. larger
think,pf largeera cor-
recting
rohhetreyer
and private life has taught me this; that driving
a hard bargain
It is no doubt true, that whengt lid
is bad, and the
money market feverish,
last fortnight there has been a considerable reduction in
the receipts at the Custom House, yet within the last
the revenuera esuffers. During the
few days, I am happy to say,
improved, and resumed their 'usual course--(Hear,
hear)—aud things are much easier than they
formerly were. The. funds have also fallen; but now I
am happy to say, from the report of to-day, thait they
matters have much
are up again, and there has been an easy day. This
has arisen from the reduction of the loans to be
advanced to the Exchequer, and the improvement
in the exchanges with America. This is, therefore,
a good account, and I would have hoped for
improved prospects in the future, were it not
attended with a rise in the price of corn.—(Hear, bear.)
As far as Loudon is concerned, the pressure for money
is decidedly relieved, and I hope that it may extend to
the provinces, so that a restoration of trade may be
effected. It is, however, impossible to deny but that
corn had risen to a fearful price; but the Noble Lord
at the head of the Government has given
notice of the only course by which to prevent its fur-
ther increase. No doubt to some extent this might
have arisen from the exportation of corn ; but I may
observe that while the exportation has been about 132,000
quarters, the quantity imported was 432,000 quarters.
Last week the amount entered for home consumption
was in proportion to 17,000,000 quarters per annum.
The entry for the week of bread stuffs was equal to
200,000 quarters. The entries for all kinds of grain are
333,273 quarters, or, at an ordinary calculation, at the
rate of 17,000,000 quarters.
Lord G. BENTINCK—For what time?
Lord G. BENTINCK—Is this the amount imported,
weTekhe._TlLAooNghCtEerL.)LOß of the EXCHEQUER—In the
or entered for home consumption ?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER--It is
the amount entered for home consumption. I have
said that the entries for all kinds of food is 333,273
quarters. I cannot give the imports of all kinds
-ad, and the autho-
iot corn, but the import of breadstuffs has on the whole
ri
kept on in a pretty equal increase, the different being
less than 3,000 quarters per week. Ido not know that
I need state anything further on this head. Since
Friday night I observe a slight alteration in the pay.
en
into
tt h
teo Bank
thatot a E
goodngl effect might result
from the extension of the period of payment. I there-
foren
propose to give to every contributor for every sum
of money, in regard of these instalments, which shall
be paid on or before the 18th day of June, interest at
5 per
cent., and in like manner I propose to give to
te s t s there made r
every contributor, for any sum of money paid from the
18th of June to the 10th of September, interest at the
rate of 4 per cent. per annum. The Right Hon. Gentle-
man concluded by reading the resolution.
On the motion being put,
Mr. HUME rose and said that be was not aware
whether, in making the explanation the Chancellor of
the Exchequer had explained anything to the satisfac-
tion of • lion. Members, but he meant to say
that in the explanation he had not shown to his
mind any reason for the pressure which had arisen in
the money and commercial markets. He complained
that the interest of money had risen to five per cent.,
but he bad given no reason. for the changes which had
occurred. He stated, as it seems, that these changes
which had taken place had
put the capitalists, who had
the money of others in their hands, into great difficulty
since the rate of interest had risen. Why he, speaking
as one who had placed money in the hands of
a banker would, under such circumstances, only
be too glad to have it ready for a call. He, therefore,
thought that the Right lion. Gentleman had been much
misinformed, and that he had assigned no reason why
an increase of the discount should have taken place.
He had said nothing as a reasonifor any alteration in the

interest, and had said nothing either that had to do with
the currency of the country. He expected that the
Right Hon. Baronet would have assigned some reason
l'or the changes which had taken place since 1844, which
areuld have been an explanation of the extraordinary
pressure which was now felt ; but he had not done so.
He had taken the trouble to make a long extract from his
own speech, certainly. In 1844 the Right Hon. Baronet
the Member for Tamworth (Sir R. Peel) had
tnatle an alteration in the law, and had separated the
banking from the issue depart►nent, he thought very
wisely; but he was not preparkd to say whether the
reserve of fourteen millions was sufficient"; but look-
ing at the large amount in the coffers of
the Bank, he should say that was ample.
The deposits which appeared to be in the coffers of the
Bank were more than those of former occasions.
Be that, however, as it might ; having provided a
bank to settle or fix the amount of paper issue, it
mattered not whether that bank were continued
at the west or the east end. There was a bank estab-
lished for doing that, and that being done, what was the
next great change that took place? It was to place the
Bank of England,with all her resources, exactly in the same
position as anyother bank in anyother part of the country•,
leaving her to limit the extent of lunr discounts at ht:r
own discretion. It was expected that such an
arrangement would have the effect of preventing a
pressure of the kind the country was now witnessing.
In that respect it had failed. It might be owing to the
conduct of the Bank authorities them-Elves, but he

did not possess sufficient information as to the
contents of their papers and books to enable him
to criticise their conduct. He had no hesitation
though in stating that it was never held out by any
body at the time the Currency Bid was passed
shat the Bank of England was to make the
seine advances as before upon good bills. Ile
must say that such a proceeding as that just now
stated was never contemplated ; as far as he could
recollect the speeches of the Right Hon. Baronet, he
never made any speech anticipating such an advance,
On the contrary, he found that he provided cash in the
Exchequer to render it unnecessary to have these calls.
He believed that when the Right Hon. Baronet lelt
office there was money in it to pay any demands
made upon it. They had been told that the
Bank had timely notice. Yes, he knew the quarters
were coming round ; but what notice had they of the
present state of the money-market ? Could any
man have believed that circumstances would have
led to the present pressure ? He considered
that it was not fair to t't t Bank of England to have given
such an interpretation, which was decidedly incorrect.
He would be free to say that the publication of the
Bank accounts, showing a deficiency, had spread
an alarm in the country. He believed that more of
this pressure arose from alarm than actual scarcity,
and it only showed what a delicate thing credit is to a
country like this. He might probably err in the views
which he had taken. He had approved of the
first step taken by the Right Honourable Baronet, '
but he objected to two measures i the one was his
placing the Bank of England in a different situa-
tion from the other banks. It was not fair
to the Bank of England to require them
to pay in bullion, while the others were
permitted to pay in Bank of England notes, thus
rendering it necessary for the Bank of England to
hold bullion for the greater portion of the other banks.
He objected to this as extremely prejudical to the bank.
The next error which he considered Government
committed was that they should have any con-
nexion whatever with the Bank.. If they
wished Government to stand upon an independent
basis, they must not permit it to depend on the
Bank for the payment of its dividends. One
of the first and most important duties of
the Chancellor of the Exchequer was • to see
that Government had the means to pay all the just de-
mands which might be made upon it. If this were the
case there would be no embarrassment or difficulty felt
in the money-market, and the Bank would be free to apply
itself to the accommodation of the public. He believed,
therefore, that this dependence on the Bank was a great
error. There were other measures also to which he
wished to direct attention. The currency of this country
was gold. They had a gold currency based on paper.
Hon. Members should bear in mind that the Bank had
14 millions of issue based on securities, and for any excess
beyond that they must have gold in their coffers.
Be this sum large or small, it must be paid in gold. He
asked the Government why gold should be placed on
a different footing to other articles, such as tea, coffee,
and sugar, on which merchants were allowed to make
issues ? He maintained that free trade should be al-
lowed in banking as well as in other things,
taking care that the notes issued were to be redeemed
in gold if required. If the Right Hon. Gentleman the
Member for Tamworth could not give a better reason
than had been given by the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer, he (Mr. Hume) thought they ought
to retrace their steps. At the present time
it was wrong to maintain the issues, when corn
was 120 s. a quarter, at the same rate as it was when
corn was only 50it. What ha 3 beets the case in Scotland
for the last century? There they had a different
system of banking, and he would ask them to give one
instance !of error which had resulted therefrom. On
these grounds he thought the Government ought to
retrace its steps, and that the House should resolve itself
nto a Committee to investigate the whole question, with
;he object of placing the currency on a new basis.
Mr. DIASTERNIAN said that nothing in the proposi-
tion of the Chancellor of the Exchequer had been stated
which was calculated to alleviate the feeling of uneasiness
that exists in the commercial world. Ix fact there ought
to have been a joint consent between the Government
and the Bank. The arrang •ment mule by the Right
Hon. Baronet the Chancellor of the Exchequer would
simply be taking a sum out of the Bank, in order t i
place the Exchequer in the situation in which the Go-
vernment ought to be placed without such an effort. It
was not to be expected that at these several
quarterly periods of two or three millions of
deficiency that the Bank should advanoe the money
without some Government surety, and he would there-
fore propose some addition to the resolution which the
Chancellor of the Exchequer had proposed. It was his
impression that the assistance in the present difficulty
ought to be obtained by some other means, and he would
therefore state that the effect of this addition would be
that the Committee were of opinion that nothing would
tend so much to relieve the present pressure on the
money market as an assurance from the Chancellor of
the Exchequer to Parliament that he had arranged with
the Bank for an advance out of the issue department of
the Bank, such advance to be repaid out of the public
securities like the remainder of the loan.
Mr. GREENE conceived that the Hon. Gentleman
was not competent to move the amendment, inasmuch
as the motion for going into the Committee of the whole
House was for raising the interest on the loan in the
future instalments.
Mr. MASTERMAN said that he had shown that the
amendment was part of the proceeding.
Mr. BROWN was commencing his address to the
House when loud cries of " Speak out " were heard from
several sides of the House, and the Hon. Member stated
that his voice was so weak that he could not exert him-
self more than he did, and then proceeded to say that
one portion of the nation was not consistent with the
other. They were aware that in the export and import
trade there was at the present moment great distress.
Much effort had been made in the provinces, and he be-
lieved that part of the object of the present motion was
to relieve the depression of foreign trade. No confi-
dence whatever was felt in the United States, and though
there were large orders at this time in Liverpool, there
was no sufficient inducement to send out the goods. The
case was the same in the interior among the manufac-
turers, and in Manchester there was the utmost
uneasiness prevalent in the several houses with
respect to the imports and the exports, and busi-
ness had indeed assumed a very serious aspect.
The condition of the country was this. The business of
the country was stopped, and day by day thousands of
her manufacturing labourers were being thrown out of
employment. It was a fallacy to tell him that there was
not sufficient money to carry on the business. At pre •
sent there were from thirty to forty millions of
sovereigns in circulation, and if a portion of that
amount were called in, and one-pound notes substituted
for it, there would be amply sufficient gold placed at the
disposal of Government to enable it to relieve the
country from the prevailing depression without touching
upon the principle of the Bill of the Right Hon. Baronet
opposite.
Mr. NE WDEGATE felt it to be his duty to state
that he had long predicted that the result of the mea-
sure of 1844 would be what it had been so graphically
described. It was impossible that any other result could
happen, for there was no practical man in the country
who did not agree with him, that his anticipations would
be fully justified. Let them, however, not incurgreater
future danger by their endeavours to escape from the
past. He was of opinion that an issue of bullion accord-
ing to the present standard could not be maintained.
On a fair calculation the issue was twice as much as the
bullion remaining in the bank. In 1798, the standard of
Elizabeth, which was silver, was altered to gold. He had
the high authority of Lord Ashburton for such a state-
ment, and that silver standard was one of which the me-
mory of man did not run to the contrary. The Right
Hon. Baronet was in error, therefore, when he said that
the present standard was the one of Queen Elizabeth.
He could not help feeling—when he saw the Right Hon.
Baronet prepared to pass the mighty measure of free
trade in the last year, and, at the same time, determined
to maintain a system of currency adverse to that advo • ,
cated by the advocates of free trade—that the people of
this country were about to be exposed not only to a
foreign competition, but a heavy pressure in their
monetary difficulties. By their present system, accord-
ing to the words of the member for Lancashire, they
must either send their gold abroad or starve the people.
One of the greatest dangers that could befall the coun-
try was to permit to have any posnr over the Bank. of
England ; it would give the executive a
.despotic in-
fluence which they ought neverto possecs; i.t would give
them a control over every man's property an England,
which was a power which they should never permit
either to be held or exercised. He hoped that the
noble lord at the head of the Government would
deeply consider this matter, and although he
might be compromised by his former votes
and although he may be anxious to retain the assistance
of those who were still more deeply compromised, to act
like an honest man, as he believed he would, and save
the country from the evils pressing upon it. Whenever
they sought assistance, either from the pressure of the
home market, or the necessity for supplies abroad, they
were met by this Act of 1844. For years himself and
friends had laboured against that policy, and it was with
no exultation that they found their fears realised now.
The lion. Member proceeded
to read extracts from
speeches of Sir Robert Peel delivered in 1819 and 1844,
to show that the effect contemplated by the measures
had not been realised. With the fact before them of
the Chancellor of the Exchequer advancing the discount
on -Government bills, with the mills and workshops
standing idle, and yet at the same time nine -millions

of gold in the Bank, ho thought it was high
time to retrace their steps. Could they forget that in
1833, without the assistance of the Bank of France they
would have stopped payment; and that, on
i another oc-
casion the Bank having only 600,0001. n gold, and
420,000/. in silver, applied to Mr. Rothschild to change
the silver, and by which he cleared, it was alleged.
100,0001. He trusted these circuinstaeces would lead
them to reconsider the course they had been pursuing.
and place the currency on a better foundation in future.
Mr. FORBES wished to say a few words as it re-
garded Scotland. In 1843 they were a contented people,
but ever since the passing of the Bill of 1844, they had
suffered the greatest difficulties, arising from the ope-
ration of the measure, and he trusted it would be re-
pealed. He could not see how the law should be altered
in regard to corn and other produce, and gold be made
an exception. He submitted that gold should be placed
on the same footing as any other thing that was con-
tinually changing in value, and be called on the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer and the Government to reconsi-
der the question, and have the subject fully investigated
with the object of effecting a remedy.
Mr. FINCH said it was no matter what a currency
was made of, provided it fulfilled the function of distri-
bution. The bust form of currency for this country was
a properly restricted paper currency, b, cause it would
then protect the commercial interest of the country trout
such pressures as that under which it was now suffering,
by affording the amplest facilities for the interchange
of commodities. If, however, they continued the pre-
sent system, none of the speculators would venture to
-send out for corn, and the people would be starved. He
di .1, therefore, hope that Government would Like this
matter into their serious consideration. Alreudy ruin
was impending over the manufacturing community, but
still the pressure had not yet reached its height, and it
was the opinion of all parties, that if Govsrament were
at once to take decisive steps:the commercial world
might be restored to a healthy position.
Lord GEORGE BENTINCK said it appeared to him
that the proposal of the Right Hon. Gentleman the
Chancellor of the Exchequer would go but a little way to
improve the state of the country, though it might in
some degree relieve the Chancellor of the Exchequer
himself from immediate and pressing demands. 'a he 1
Right Hon. Gentleman had not told theni whether the
contractors for the loan were prepared to accept the dis-
count he had named. It was certainly below the amount
now required for goods bills, which had only 60 days to
run, and whatever might be the anticipations of the
Right Hon. Gentleman, he very much feared Govern-
ment must yet have further recourse to the coffers of
the Bank of England. The Right Honourable Gen-
tleman had told them that the money market was
easier now than it was a short time back, but
when it was remembered that wheat had reached the
high price of 120 s. per quarter ; that the stocks on
hand were exceedingly low; that the importation of corn
and cotton was considerably above the quantities im-
ported in the corresponding period in former years, it
was not unnatural to suppose that the drain of bullion
would not cease for some time to come without recourse
were bad to some legislative enactment. If, therefore,
Government were anxious to prevent the gold in the
country from being exported the present law must be
continued, but, then, what must be the result of that
continuance ? Why, it would have a tendency to keep
up prices, reduce supplies, and still further depress
trade. The exchanges with America were against
Eng-
land, while the exports were falling off to
an
enormousextent, and unless something were done instantly
price of corn must rise and the drain of bullion become
greater. The prospects of the supply of provisions from
Ireland were very bad if not exhausted, for from axe-
turn which he held in his .hand he perceived that
in December last, 15,000 dead pigs were sold in the
Cork market, as against 3,000 in the corresponding
period of the previous two years. It was sufficiently
plain,
therefore, that the country must depend for its
supplies upon foreign sources. Now this state of things
bad not been brought about, as in the year 1825, by
over-speculation on the part of the people, but it was
attributable to the system pursued by Government.
Out of 161,000 mills in the manufacturing districts,
728 were either working short time, or not working at
all, and as that circumstance alone would have a ten-
dency considerably to reduce the exports, he confessed
he did not look for a speedy return of the gold which
had gone out of the country. Money must, therefore,
of necessity rise in price, and, in addition to the manu-
facturing labourers thrown out of employment, it was
clear, that unless something were done, most of the
new railway companies must reduce their operations,
and throw an immense number of labourers out,
of work. Now this distressing state of affairs could not
be attributed to want of money, because it was well
known that the coffers of the Bank of England, although
locked up, were full, and all that was wanted to restore
prosperity, was to set the credit of the Bank and the
country ,at liberty. The position of men of the
highest credit was at the present time most perilous,
and he was assured, on the highest authority, that be-
fore a month elapsed, many of them would be obliged
to stop payment, in consequence of the present difficul.
ties. lie was informed, on the best authority, that one
house in Lancashire, which had no less than 60,0001. in
bullion, were unable to carry on their business. Was
not this, then, a monstrous state of things, that
they were obliged to prevent the importation of
food, and to starve the bellies of the people
for the purpose of keeping up the Bank Restriction Act
of 1844. Mr. O'Connell said in the course of last winter
that rapidity in the supply of food was with regard to
Ireland the essence of humanity and of political saga-
city. He fully agreed with him, and called upon the
Government to have no longer recourse to temporary
measures, but to 'proceed at once in a rapid and eff,etive
manner to procure lood f r the people, otherwise far
more disastrous results would take place than they had
hitherto witnessed. The famine would visit their own
shores, and he now called upon the Government to look
to the great interests of this country—which were not
limited to cotton speculators or to railway promoters.
Those who were walking in the steadiest manner in the
legitimate pursuits of trade, would be involved in the
general ruin. Those who traded to the east, and those
nho traded to the west, had to suffer in
the impending distress. From all the indica
Lion of the late elections in the United States,
it would appear that the tariff of America would become
more restrictive than it was at present, and he very much
feared that America would not be disposed to adopt
those free-trade measures which had brought this
country to such a crisis. Russia, also, that formerly
could not go to war, unless the Barings and Rothschilds
came to her assistance, had shown no symptoms of
meeting this country on free-trade principles. He
trusted, therefore, that her Majesty's Government would
imitate the example of the great Ministers of this
country who had preceded them in power, and would
come forward with measures to take off the present
monetary restrictions; and would also make an advance
of Exchequer-bills to meet the embarrassments of the
country. He hoped they would not persevere with the'Act
of 1844, and he was highly gratified to hear the Righti
Hon. Gentleman (Sir R. Peel) say that no feelings of pater-
nity would induce him to advocate its continuance if it
proved to be mischievous in its operation. Now he
(Lord G. Bentinek) thought that this dangerous opera-
tion was discernible in the complicated embarrassments
in which they were at present involved, and that all
these indications were grounds, at any rate, for the
suspension of the Act. The Noble Lord then cited
some statistics to show that the Bill would become more
restrictive in future than it was at present.
With regard to the conduct of former Ministers,
he found that in 1793 Mr. Pitt came foward
with 5,000,000 of Exchquer-bills to relieve the
then monetary pressure of the country. In 1816, when
there were 2,000 bankruptcies, cash payments were
postponed; and in 1819 further relaxations were afforded.
In like manner in 1825, and in 1826, Mr. Huskisson
issued a number of bank notes to relieve the embarrass-
ments in which the country was then involved. Lately
the Bank of France was much in the same predicament
as they were at present, and it got 800,000/. as a loan
from this country, which greatly relieved the pressure
under which they laboured. To show the effect of this
credit to the Bank of France he would just state that
200,0001., the last instalment of the 800,0001, had never
been called upon, as the pressure ceased to be felt. Now,
if the same system of credit was applied to this country,
he had no doubt that the same results would follow.
They had now three years' experience of the Bank
Charter Act, and they found that its influence was most
injurious, and that, like the barren fig tree in the vine-
yard, it deserved no other fate than to be destroyed for
its unproductiveness.
Mr. CARDWELL said, he could not but coincide
with the Hon. Gentleman who had addressed the House,
that when an Act had been passed, and had been
found to be impracticably inoperative that then the time
for its repeal had arrived. The Noble Lord opposite,
who had voted for the Bill when it was brought forward,
would allow him to say, that those who heard his pre-
mises must have been most grievously disappointed
at the conclusions to whiCh he had arrived. He (Mr.
Cardwell) had heard that Noble Lord make statements
in which he concurred, though he totally differed from
the results which ho drew from those statements. That
Noble Lord had said that he saw no reason why the pre-
sent distress should be permanent. All his suggestions
had been directed to the circulation of the currency.
He believed that those who directed their attention to
this subject would find it to be the fact that they never
would be able to extract any artificial advantages they
might arrive at.—(blear, hear.) Adam Smith had
likened the currency to a wheel, which in
,its °Tirs°
spun round anything that was placed upon it. They
had a certain quantity of articles, and currency was the
wheel that bore them round. What was the cause of
the pressing under which they laboured ? Not long ago
they had bad harvests. This country undertook, under
an intoxication, to execute larger works than it or any 1
other country was capable of performing at
that time. The predictions of the time had
been realised, and the .country was labouring under the
effects of that intoxication. He found that the Bank of
England at the time had not contracted its issue at that
time when the danger began, and when considerable as-
sistance was demanded. He thought, in the respect to
currency, that in the first instance they should have
truthfulness for their standard, and in the next
instance economy in its application. With
regard to the first they had adopatepdreacedmieasure which
a complement of
was merely
measure,
namely, that of 1839. A temptation had been offered
to individuals which was too great for individual pru-
dence, and circulation was increased
.. at the very moment
when it should have been diminished. But they were
in great danger, therefore it was a mistake to say that
there was any new principle in the Bill of 1844. The
effect of that Bill was to drain the gold in the country,
which went into the private coffers of the bankers of
England and Ireland. That Bill had saturated thecoun-
try with gold. It was now said that that Bill had
done much mischief because it contracted circulation.
He contended that it they send abroad gold they
diminished the-circulating medium of the country. He
thought, therefore, that the effect of the -measure would
be the direct reverse of what was asserted.

After a few words from Mr. BROWN,
Mr. BAttING said that he could not concur with the
lion. Gentleman who had just addressed the House
(Mr. Cardwell). Other count: ies wanted corn, other
countries were importing corn; France wants corn, and
is imp sting it, but in France there is tea such a state of
ticancial difficulty. It might be said, that it was the
metallic circulation .in France which effected this, true
it was that there was a larger proportion of metallic
currency there than in this country, they had
eighty millions of gold for fifteen millions of paper,
while we have thirty millions of paper to fi!ty millions of
gold. With regard to railways, he was one of those who
believed that railways had been carried to too great an •
extent. At the same time he did not underrate the great
advantages of the economy of labour, and the develop-
ment of the resources of the country which were obtained
from it.—(Hear, hear.) People bad invested their
money in securities, which were unavoidable, and there-
, fore he was of opinion that railway enterprise had been
carried too lar•, but there had been other times when there
had been speculation twice as great, but there never has
hoer. such a want of power to meet the engagements of
the day. It was not the Bank of ISegland which had
nOsmatiaged the mutter. He did not mean to say that
the reduction of interest was not a ssise measure ; Ito
believed that. it was. It there was any pr,neiple in the
charter of 1844, it was this, that the Lank elieuld in-
iiiatty,Frepertton to a
the bullion
crease its paper circulation
in its coffers. There muy Lean Mint or rt„on,
lust it was not such it want which eiu this monetary
ptvistit e ; he believed that the a alcetoe of it sprung front
tee limitation of the pouers tit tie very feet of
a limitation, produced the evil. lie 111,4 tat; any
part in the brier-sire %skid' ',rose oil the Batik charter,
as he did not feel himself competent to euttr upon the
subject of what should be the currency of the country.
lie did tint mean to set himself against high authorities.
but he would state a fact, that for ten days there was
an impossibility to obtain money under any pre-
tences, acid all from the want of power in
the Bank. Well, then, ought not these facts to
be taken into consideration by those who were
the advocates of this proposition. There were sixty •
thousand pounds of silver, and not one shilling could be
raised upon it; its owners sent to the bank to buy it, the
bank refused; it dare not, in consequence of its limita-
tion. They might say then, why not send to Hamburgh
or Paris? But bills of a fortnight were even refused to
be discounted. Did they wish to keep an unnecessary
amount of bullion in the bank, until they could
see how far the screw had to be driven until the whole
commercial interest of the country was shaken to its
centre ? They wished by the charter to make trade
secure and certain, why they would make it the greatest
lottery in the world, if they made money bear three
per cent. in April, and in August thirteen per cent.—
(Hear, hear.) There was undoubtedly a great pressure,
and they might make it a panic if they refused to grant
facilities to commerce. The Bank of England should
have power to borrow of other countries, and not
borrow in our own market ; where, the very fact of
it so doing, only increases the scarcity.—(Hear, hear.)
He thought, under the present circumstances, that the
Government ought to have the privilege of extending
the issues upon securities, so as to admit of its granting
larger accommodation to the trading classes. He did
not blame the Government for the present difficulties
which had arisen, only so far as the policy they bad
supported had contributed to this result. They had
gone on stop by step to take duties off a variety of arti-
cles, and so long as.business was good all operated well;
but,now they found a falling revenue and a disordered
market, with difficulties of such a character as to force
the Chancellor of the Exchequer to take the course
which he had that night proposed. He thought the
Right Hon. Gentleman would havepursuedawisercounse
if he had not taken thenarrow view ofa needy Chancellor
with an empty Exchequer, but had taken the wide andcom-
prehensive range of all the great interests of the country,
in the proposal of some large measure. to relieve the
pressure which at present existed.—(Cheers.)
Sir GEORGE CLERK could not agree with the Hon.
Member that the present monetary difficulties of the
country were attributable to the measure of 184.4. Under
such a system as would satisfy the Hon. Gentleman,
there would be continual danger of over issues of paper
as no test of any paper that might be issued would exist,
but the alleged solvency of the issuer. The surplus ca-
pital of the country was not an unlimited quantity which
could be increased to any extent by an issue
of motes, but it was limited by the real produce in the
coantry which was forthcoming for distribution. This
regulated the disposable capital of the country. This
year they had had a scarcity of food, perhaps to the
extent of twenty or thirty millions. Other nations were
suffering from the same cause. There had also been
large investments in railways. The effect of all these
causes was to restrict the disposable fund for the pur-
poses of trade and the employment of the people.
He could not see how this evil could be lessened
by the relaxation of the present system, and
allowing the banks to discount bills with their notes.
Were this so, the bullion would be all driven from the
country, and a general monetary crisis would take place
like those of 1826 and 1839. Though the issue of one-
pound notes might induce a .short period of prosperity,
the day of reckoning would eventually come, and the
distress then be far greater than it could be
under the present system. The only safe founda-
tion for a currency was a metallic basis, and
not one of paper. Certain he was that the
measure of 1844 was not the cause of the difficulties.
_Under these circumstances he very much regretted that
a debate should have arisen on the Bank Charter Bill.
The Hon. Member for Huntingdon held a high position
ix the commercial world, and if it were true, as the Hon.
(it ntlemaa represented, that that measure had produced
such distressing results, it was his duty to move that it
be repeated, in order that Parliament and the country
might have an opportunity of xpressing an opinion on
the subject.—(Hear, hear.) With rcgird to the question
of the currency, the velue of a pound had long been
settled, and it would be unwise, nay, it would entirely
break up the commercial relations of the country, if they
attempted to re-open that question. The pie sent
distress was to be traced to one natural
cause, namely, the country had undertaken too
many heavy works, and, like an individual
who attempt to do more than he had the means to ac-
complish, it had overreached itself. The fact was, the
country had embarked in too many railways, and they
must wait with patience till it had recovered its former
flourishinc, condition. Tampering with the currency
would only aggrevate the evil, and he therefore trusted
the House would adopt none of the suggestions which
had been thrown out upon the subject, but leave it for
time and the natural course of things to restore the coun-
try to a state of prosperity.
Mr. DISRAELI was glad the Hon. Member for Hun.
tingdon had not made the motion of the Right Hon. Ba-
ronet the Member for Stamford, because such a motion
Could have nothing to do with the question before the
Committee, and therefore would not have been entitled
to their consideration. The Hon. Gentleman, the Mem-
ber for Clitheroe, had touched upon all those subjects,
which he seemed to think they ought not to treat of.
The Hon. Gentleman had laid down certain principles
for the establishment of a sound currency, which might
he difficult to challenge, but which certainly bad no re.
ference whatever to the circumstances with which they
had to deal. The Hon. Gentleman also passed a very
warm panygerie upon the Bill of 1844, which had it
been discussed would have at once decided the question
they were discussing. The Hon. Gentleman told them
that the object of this Bill was to saturate England with
gold. That might have been the object of the Bill, but
the truth was, there was more gold in the country in Sep-
tember, 1844, than there had been subsequently to the pass-
ing of the Bill. The Hon. Gentleman then endeavoured
tb trace the present depression in the commercial world
to the fact, of the alarm not it lying be la earlier taken.
Now he maintained that they had no right whatever to
criticise the conduct of the Bank. The Act of 1844 de-
fined its functions. By that Act they invented for the
regulation of the Bank a machinery that was almost as
perfect as the sliding-scale itself. The regulations for
the issuing department were enunciated by the Minister,
matured by the House, and received by the country, and
they had therefore no right to criticise the conduct of
the Bank, because that conduct had been defined by
themselves. Oh ! but the Hon Member for Clitheroe
said the Bank did not take the alarm early enough.
Well, it was true in tke month of August last the
Bank reduced the rate of interest, but he wanted
to know what there was then in the country
which should have made the bank look with
any alarm to the future. It had almost an unprece-
dented amount of treasure in its possession—he believed
perhaps the largest amount they possessed for the last
two years or two years and a halt before. It was in
a position to command the precious metals throughout
the land, and being placed in that position, the bank
had a right to suppose that it was justified in assisting
every well founded commercial movement. True, it
might have heard of a Member of that House
Right moving_H0n
that the ports should be opened; but did teheßi
give the proposal their sanction. b
Baronet the Member fur TamworthTohre
btlaihk,too,Governmentmight .
complaining
eiewgereef
but
tand therefore the Bank
future. He
put down by the Government,
the have
cohmeainrdg ofscoartchietry, Hon. is iheemir e rscorn
complaintsla
which no one
wanted had nodo knowtocsanse whether look
hew
theltthhataladromcumtoent,
could falsify, and which any one could appeal to—he
wanted to know whether it was not a sufficient justifica-
tion of the Bank of England? There, however, was
the Act of 1844 in a state of distress, and, as a cry must
rleaallonidnwTohr(etilh,Beaaarnn, and
ss
re-echoedch firstee rms .a)de
bTbyyh
tethhe
ec
Mem-
ber ro gne
be found to come to the rescue, it was found to be the
d
oßfanimk
Member porfu dfEoeurngcr
didtthh ae
that
foresight
ee tssaiekg
he
allegations
for Clitheroe, and it was asserted on all sides that it
ctha
that
bo
onwdyeinrientitieudee.u, Hno
rge
had
ha de rita denied,rate of
thowever,
been
fo
interestfor
in the course
of last summer, they would not now be in
a con iition to meet the crisis in which the country was
at present involved—their merchants would not have
scoured all parts of the earth for supplies of food—they
would not have been able to procure 6,000,000 quarters
of wheat to meet their own deficiencies—they would not
now be exporting large quantities of corn to France—
nor would the exehangesia Europe be influenced in their
favour.—(Hear, hear.) And though that Act had been
so political, so sagacious, and so beneficial in its opera-
tion, it appeared from the statements that had been
made in that House that the Bank of England was the
great criminal, and all upon the authority of the Right
Hon. Gentleman the Member for Tamworth. He be-
lieved if the Act of 1844 was properly examined the
House might be led to a result highly beneficial to the
country. What appeared to him to be imputable to it
was that it could not prevent any of the mischief that
arose out of the system which was previously in exist-
ence, but it could and did prevent the benefits which
sprung from that system. It failed in every object that
it held out. In the first :place they were told that it
would prevent anything like the financial disturbance
and disorders, that were called by the name of panic.
Now, it was a consequence of the embarrassment of
1836 and 1839, that the House was led to pass the