The Sun.
London, England, 1847-05-21 00:00:00

"laY of
of return September, 1846. By this they Would see
that 113 vessels captured for being engaged in the I
.stave trade, the captors of 74 of them did not receive
esie single sixpence for their gallantry. He was deter-
mined to see, if he had health and 'strength, to the
botte
all these matters, no matter how high
the at of
ratiees were, who were concerned. These fees were
most excessive and it was a great hardship utam those
',the, spent their lives cruising about in these unhealthy
si'.uati'o'as to be thus defrauded. The ;judge of the ad_
Iniralty court at the Cape of Good liope said that he had
pc. onjanisance of any other paaty save that of her Ma-
J"t.'.7- They were all aware 'of what Lord Cochrane said
,°.f admiralty courts. He :eared, however, that since his
Luria another reformation would be exceedingly desirable
as
'frr
as
M the Cape bf Good Hope was concerned.
on
FiUE seconded the motion, and begged permis-
tn add St. Helena and the Australian colonies to the
return; because
were he f-,ad been informed that matters were
.just as bad in tnoae uarters. Those courts we under
no control; the
ject aver dese-a might do as they liked, and if any sub-
. Mr, ass led inquiry the present was that one.
as'stD said that there could be no sort of objec-
V° to the return, and from a specimen of a bill which
beosohaci,„,7,''n, there were other courts which were nearer
making-"on also appeared to have the capability of
(nit
gest an a smart bill. If his Hon. Friend could sug-
rt neva mhod for the oraization
C°u
L'e would be g n
happy to attend to them. of these
COMMITTEE ON FEES.
Tr,r111,7 CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved
to as Lora Seymour and Mr. Pattison to the Com-
-re on Fees in Courts ef Law and Equity.
sotion agreed to.
.0 Mr. BORTIINVICK moved the preparation and pro-
duction of accounts of the quantities of British sheep and
la'ru.°al wool, and woollen yarn, exported from the
vetted Kingdom in the year 1846 ; specifying the coon-
t'sies to which they were sent. Of the quantities of wool
,n,f the Al acs and Llama tribe imported into the United
~,41-Mgdorn in the year 1846 ; and of the quantities re-
,Perted during the same period, and the countries to
u'inh they were sent. Of the quantity of mohair (or
!i°sts' wool) imported, into the United Kingdom.in the
Lear 1846 ; and of the quantity re-exported during the
al'ule period, and the countries to which they were sent.
"i the quantities and declared value of British woollen
tuearaaufactures easported from the United Kingdom in the
r
sent 184 ;'specifying the countries to which they were
s-ss (hi coninUation of Parliamentary Paper, N 0.341, of
sioo 184,6).
tbaTthbeCHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said
-4grae d
"e 'lad no objection to the return moved for.
to.
ADJOURNED DEBATE.
te,ohl the motion for the order of the day for the ad-
ted debate on the second reading of the Poor-laws
''ninistration Bill,
iSir GEORGE GREY, in reply to a question from
jar. rt. Escott, said that no doubt that illegal procee
f,‘"P.s had taken 'era in some parts of the country, but as
fet no personal Pvi ience hed been committed, and thought
is unfair to chroagae the disturbances that had taken place
,rom the higl.' f corn to the conduct of the poor-
teW
14Iguardi • price o
ti
foam: EPSLEY said that the law was in operation_ for
la a,"-eu or fifteen years. The attention of the Poo
few ir-nnaissioners had been directed within the last
the --4Ys to communications that had been received on
stne subject, and he trusted that they would take
lie
the should not make a violent change tn this
to whichanr, k majority of the people still adhered, froam
tioo-',,vrPral of its principle, namely, local administr -
rai • ..11`4 central control. The question of due local ad-
of rostra..
ion depended upon the weakness or the strength
zaipta, Government, when Government was strong it
th;!,, Snap its fingers at poor-law officers, and when
the 1143 a Weak Government, this most important law,
°,Peration of which was so beneficial to the country,
ahsn'cl be endangered. He did not wish to enter into the
to (ra', ct question whether or not Parliament had power
Thp del question its authority on the subject in question.
authorities that had been advanced on this matter
were oot
Cons th at all analogous to the matter, and the defini-
ease, at were given of what was understood to be unjust
Gecit of Gistress, wets most contradictory, as Hen.
th.feet„erall would perceive by a reference to
Wt -.Port of the Commissioners of 1839, 1841, and 1844.
mth res
Peet to the medical treatment of the poor, the
thht"`ssiuners said, in their report, and he would read
11,‘ report to the House.—(The Hon. Member then read
s," extract fro_
,nneas tu the report of the Poor-law Commis-
Ln the which it appeared that the parishes were
't of paying small salaries to the incomesponc,„
other leaving them to make up their from
of th:splirees• The Hon. Member then read an order
*ma '°lnnaissioners, recommending that the charge
to Joni of the medical advisers should be left open
t,..,,MPetition, but expressly providing that the charges
11,747 unction,
that order should not exceed the expenses
the hr the previous system. Now, had it not been for
aecluottrnanitY of the medical men themselves, the con-
es‘tre neees t° the poor would have been disastrous in the
sta"rnaer'll; Pad the parish in which he resided the salary
presentrs'aa4 to the doctor was 101. per annum ; under
anoo, system it vvas reduced to 21. 17s. 6d. per
that ,a."7"jkliear, hear.) And in the union in which
tph4ltrae:filaroiastihtwiraosuasiTated the Commissioners had reduced
001. to 290 L, being a reduction of the
Vhat ssureaeuful,°!... Now, it was evident that the poor
l en, With res.'" such a distressing state of things.
e t great ast I).ect to workhouses, he must say that. he
lion. Baronet°lnshalent at the statement of the Right
Partment in
tbe Secretary
D , in answ_ of State for_ the Home De-
orsetshire er to the speech of the Hon. Member for
14 the satti-rr• Bankes t the inspecto of prisons
lt4socrii.ers as thePP"ooerr-lianwt)Cho'emt rate
Commissioners
eorns
hadof thein diet o f
regulatingthe
to", 1" of the poor in the workhouses, such state-
-43, s should not be made in that House without, at all
4„e,_114, his (Mr. Henley) endeavouring to show that
b'en WAS not the case. There were express regulations
cap. 64,
filing' the of Parliament, the 4th G
The the minimum of the allowance .to Prisoners.
-'e amounts fixed by that Act have never been re-
duced, they might have been increased. That Act
tea
made adequate provision for the spiritual wants of
"ue prisoners, and the appointment of chaplains.
Sir G. GREY was understood to say that in the
IPJeeeli which the ion. Member had alluded to he had
111.1,..ere1y intended to meet the arguments of the Hon.
Commissioners
for Knaresborough (Mr. Ferrand)—that the
`naraissioners had exceeded their powers in regulating
the dietary of workhouses.
Mr. HENLEY should proceed in his course of argu-
?tea
of '4l and endeavour to contrast the careful provisions
the Act he had referred to, with the reckless conduct
of the Commissioners in the course which they had pur-
;lV towards the poor in the institutions of this country.f
towards
Member then proceeded to read the clause of
„.of.e.ci.i...ptiottifn; Geo. IV. c. 64, regulating the appointmented
and fixing their duties, and contrast.
447ttih that Clause the order of the Poor-law Commis-
,eia on the subject. By the one, two sermons on
the latter,4Yawe rley
to catechise toesnebe preached to the prisoners, but by
4813417
ttohetillket
or to the paupers. He was not required.
Ise the children, or to instruct the inmates,
IV., and a miserable stipend was
113' the 0 e clergYman for the performance of his duties.
apss deli gyred of this Act, the unfortunate girl who
worse
take an of a child in the workhouse, was treated
Is_ an the dest't t •
tu-saueretitifkuelia; u e girl out of the workhouse, who
away the life of her child, for which offence, a
theati„,_ Jury te,..,
4L °r conc-,.""u her guilty of the comparatively. mild
two """ng the birth of her child. And when
'What girls should
tlndergwooisue?l tentthteore• meet again in their native villages
result of the treatment they had each
Minds of au
that tho who impress upon their minds, and the
were acquainted with the subject, the fact
menttb se Wh° had committed crime obtain better treat-
or,,rt an those
who were guilty of no crime, except their
la:es Commis "ow could the House believe that had the Poor-
%s „ nansissioners made the same provision for the pauper
'Witness- went made for the criminal, could they have
so much disease and misery as had recently
con' tound in many of the workhouses throughout the
A'll,,,tlV(Flear h ar )
cou-n-tel'ad.N. I.lEatn' Et here. moved that the House be
atgalleries were accordingly cleared, but there being
v,t4e than 40 Members present,
i r. HENLEY proceeded to say that he had shown—
ofeast he had endeavoured to show—that the adminis-
ion of the law ought not to be taken out of the hand
the Legislature. Now he was particular that in making
say revision of the present system, they should not in-
ase the difficulties of parties seeking
relief, and he,
therefore, regretted the more. to see that this Bill did
oners any of those powers
til,ot. take from the
~heich they had indecorouslyommissi exercised, both as regarded
law and the people.. It relieved them of some of
then ormulas which had brought them into so much dis-
t, but it did not take from them the real powers
'exercised by them formerly. It was intended by this
Bill to associate three or four Cabinet Ministers with
bthe Commissioners ; and what, let him ask, would be
'he result of that
step ? Why, what chance would a
ar result
have of making an application in that
ender' °Pe for the redress of a grievance, committed
~... the law, against four Cabinet Ministers, who
"old constitute a- third of the whole Cabinet. Would
not every question of that sort have to be fought tooth
these Cabinet
a% a Government question, and then how could
working
Cabinet Ministers give their attention to the
that 7 king of the Ministers
It was foolish to suppose
be they could, and the result would be that there would
one or two
irassejoilna.s now, conducting the entire business
Still, however, every question of
badri9vance would be fought as if these Cabinet Ministers
taken part in the matter, and of course it would
aas°,.ule a Government question. Look again at the
Iln`lPe %th'eere political influence it would give to the Government.
er
Poor-law,
employed throughout the country
testede
law, and in times of a severe con-
testedoo
election it would be almost impossible for
theo r7rnment to refrain from exercising its influence over
tomb
,lie,sicies, he thought they already had a sufficient
bOt a° roue Government officers in the House, but it was
its the soixi on that account that he objected to this Bill
dutiesa ng uP of Cabinet Ministers with a board whose
_were merely connected with matters of petty de-
counonit as the election of guardians, examining of ec-
ho ts' and appointment of officers; all of which would
at eto be made Cabinet questions. He had now gone
th eate lh ength into the various matters connected with
Bill tan he had originally contemplated; and in
conclusion he implored the House not to continue a sys-
,_eta which left the poor of this country in the state they
zleere in
at present—he implored the house to take from
I? 1
agitator and the demagogue the powerful area-
. t)i_' , which
mseent he now Possessed, and which he
not scruple to wield when he told the
one ented poor, that Parliament legislated for them in
ica ,tacKle, and for the rich in another. Hitherto the
• rtdTtle of the country had looked up to the Crown as the
been
of grievances `,l hen thev kit ha, there
thealtitimal-administration of the lavv, they appealed to
turtt_tor mister ; but if the Crown were made the adminis-
of the law, to whom would they have to appeal.
fir wapled the House, then, not to be two precipitant
Pe44Blag this Bill, but to direct their maim attentive