The Sun.
London, England, 1841-05-28 00:00:00

LOADON, FRIDA.Y. MA? 24, 1,441/,

would not pledge himself to a sliding scale ; yet he '
(Lord Worsley) did not know but the
_Right. Hon.
Baronet himself Might support a sliding scale.—(llear,
hear.) He thought the agricultural interest, who had
had viewed with so much alarm the proposition of the
Chancellor of the Exchequer, would, continue in alarm,
unless they were informed of the intentions of the Right
Hon. Baronet.--(Cheers, and cries of " Oh, oh.") He
ought to make known to the agricultural interest what
amount of protection he proposed to give them when he
came into office, for no man who heard his speee'a the
other evening could doubt for a moment that it was his
intention to alter the present sliding scale. That interest
had a right to ask that question, because one of the
Conservative Candidatea for Manchester, one who
had been high in office " under the Right Ho-
nourable Baronet—he meant Sir George Murray—
rested his claims for support upon his being an advocate
for a low fixed duty on corn.—(Cheers.) He agreed in
the general policy of the Government and could- not see I
any reason why he should withdraw his confidence in
them to transfer it to one of whose policy, even upon the
point he differed from the Government, he knew nothing.
—(Cheers.) The Government had a right to suppose
that the country agreed with their general policy, and he
could see no reason why they should withdraw from
office.—(Cheers and laughter.) When the Right Hon.
Baronet retired in 1835 it was not so much upon eonsti-
tutional grounds, but because he found that it was impos-
sible for him to gain the confidence of the House upon
any occasion. He did not consider that he was acting in-
consistently in supporting the Government----(Cheerslcom
the Opposition)—because he felt himself obliged to vote
against their proposition the other day—he was not acting
inconsistently in voting against the motion, approvine as
-
he did of the general policy of the Government.
Mr. CHRISTOPHER said it •was his custom, as a
Member of that House, to confine himself to questions
which affected his own constituency, leaving matters of
general importance to Gentlemen on both sides of the
House who were better able, from their experience and
talents, to take part in their discussion. But he was
induced to rise on that occasion in consequence of the ob-
servations which had been addressed to the House by
his Noble Friend who had just sat down.—(Hear, hear.)
He confessed that he was very much surprised at the
speech of his Noble Friend.—(Hear, hear.) He had had
the honour to be present with his Noble Friend at one
of the largest, most influential, and unanimous meetings
of their constituents that had ever been held, convened
by the High Sheriff of the county in the Castle-yard at
Lincoln, and he would venture to tell his Noble Friend
that there was no person who attended that meeting
who did not depart from it with the full conviction that
he had withdrawn his confidence from the Government.
—(Cheers from the Tory benches.) What illusion had
come over his Friend's mind since he had returned from
the county of Lincoln, he (Mr. Christopher) was unable
to explain—whether le air of the city of London was
more favourable to the doctrines of free trade and confi-
dence in her Majesty's Ministers than the air of the
county of Lincoln he was also unable to explain ; but
he would remind his Noble Friend that at the meeting in
question he said, in emphatic terms, and was loudly
cheered by his assembled constituents when he said it,
that as her Majesty's Government had overthrown
the . agricultural interest, he would prepare to
overthrow the Government.—(Hear. hear.) That there
might be no misunderstanding when he (Mr. Christopher)
addressed his constituents he gave his Noble Friend
credit for the difficulties which he had overcome in de-
serting his party after so long a connection. It was
true that his Noble Friend qualified his declaration by
saying that, with regard to certain measures he was
placed in this embarrassment, ithit if •his Right Hon.
Friend below him assumed the reins of office he could
not by any means give his confidence to him—(Hear,
hear, from the Liberal benehes)—but there was no per-
son who attended that meeting, and he saw several gen-
tlemen afterwards who were in the habit of supporting
his Noble Friend, who did not depart with a conviction
that on a vote of want of confidence in her Majesty's
Ministers his Noble Friend would give it his support.- -
(Cheers from the Tory benches.). As he had before
stated, it was not his intention to take any lead-
ing part in the discussion of that evening ; but,
as far as his own opinion went, he had no
hesitation in saying that on constitutional grounds
fie motion of his Right Honourable Friend was
justified. What had been the conduct of the Queen's
Government ? In the first place they had come forward
with legislative measures which they were unable to
carry in that House—measures which they declared were
essential for the full development of those principles of
Government which they professed. He was unable to
explain why they had withdrawn the Poor-law, unless it
'was that anticipating a dissolution, they feared it would
not be favourably viewed in the manufacturing districts.
(Hear, hear.) With regard to measures of finance, the
Government had failed, for on the question of the Sugar
Duties the House of Commons had declared that they
would not sanction that system of legislation. They had
heard nothing from the Government about the Timber
Duties, but They proposed to bring forward the question
of • the Corn-laws in the course of a week. Now
he would appeal to his Noble Friend, and ask him whe-
ther it would not be an insult to his constituency to tell
them that they were solely to oppose the Government on
the question of the Corn-laws, but they were to support
them on every other question. If they did so, they
would in effect be giving a tacit support to the Govern-
ment, and, would enable them, in case a dissolution took
place, to return to Parliament those parties that would
enable them to carry the Corn-law question.—(Cheers.)
Lord-WORSLEY,' in explanation, read a report of the
speech lie made at Lincoln, in part of which lie state I
that there were many questions on which he agreed with
the Government, but when he found they were acting
wrongly on the subject of the Corn-laws, he was deter-
mined to oppose them. In withdrawing his support from
Ministers on the Corn-laws, it was not to be supposed
that he would withdraw his support from them on every
other question.—(Hear, hear.)
Sir J. HOIMO USE was extremely glad that when he
first rose lie gave way to the Noble Lord the Member for
Lincolnshire. It was not to be supposed that any gentle-
man who had so long supported her Majesty's Govern-
ment, as the Noble Lord had done, because he could not
go along with them on one subject, that, therefore, lie
was to oppose them upon every question they
brought forward.—(Hear, hear.) He hoped that the
example of the Noble Lord would not be lost sight of,
but whether it was, or was not, his high character, his
honourable motives, and the situation he held in the
House, and the country, would put him far above
any suspicion.—(Hear, hear.) He stated this
because he thought from the cheers which he had
heard from the other side that it was supposed
that some unworthy motive had induced him to adopt
the course lie had done. He agreed with the Noble Lord
that the Right Hon. Gentleman, in bringing the present
motion forward, had done it with the greatest moderation,
but at the same time he must say that he totally dissented
from the chief position he had laid down. He totally
dissented from the fact that the Government, on the
whole, since:it became a Government, had been unable to
carry into effect the measures it had proposed to Parlia-
ment.—(A laugh.) The same Noble Lord that had
laughed before had done him the honour of laughing
again ; all he could say was, that if in the assertions lie
had made there was anything which the House and the
country contradicted, there was ground for the laughter
of the Noble Lord'; but if what he stated was the fact,
then the laugh of the Noble Lord was entirely out of place,
It was most true that the Government had had to con-
tend with great difficulties. When it first came into
office in 1835,_ the Right Hon. Gentleman took care to
remind the House and the country that the Alinistera
had not the confidence of the Crown. It was true
that they entered into office without having that kindly
feeling on the part of the Crown which every Adminis-
tration ought to have.—(Cheers.) But in spite, how-
ever, of all their difficulties, in spite of opposition on the
part of the House of Lords, they had carried many and
most important measures, some of which he would recall
to the recollection of the House. The present Govern-
' ment came into office in April, 1835, and in their first
Session they carried the great measure of English and
Scotch Municipal Reform. In 1836 they carried the
great measure of the Commutation of English Tithes, a
measure which lie would venture to say was sufficient work
for a Session. They also carried through in the same
Session a measure for the Registration of Births, Deaths,
and Marriages. In 1837 the demise of the Crown pre-
vented any important measures being carried. In 1838
they carried the Irish Tithe Bill, notwithstanding the
taunts that had been thrown against them for the omis-
sion of the appropriation clause. In 1839 they carried
several important measures. They carried a general
measure for the establishment of a rural police, and
also a measure for the reduction of postage,, which
the Right Honourable Gentleman opposite seemed to
think was a measure for which they ought to be con-
demned rather than praised —(Hear, hear.) Who, he
would ask, supported that measure ? why the propriety
of it was urged upon the House of Lords by Lord Ash-
burton—(Hear, hear)—and in that House some of the
most respectable supporters of the Right Honourable
Gentleman, and among them the Noble Lord the Member
for LiverpOol, had stated their opinions in favour of the
measure. Iu 1840 the present Ministers passed the Irish
Municipal Bill, the Ecclesiastical Reform Bill, and the
Union of the Canadas Bill.—(Hear, hear.) During this
time they had also to carry on affairs of a most com-
plicated nature with respect to foreign politics. He
would not trouble the House by referring to any of
him
miend the had
adm con-
ductedi
flmsegrinettat
mannermeasur hetsNavt hich his No
had
won
tion of all Europe, and the reluctant acquiescence of even
some of the gentlemen opposite. He would venture to
say, if the Right Hon. Gentlemen opposite was asked
that it had never entered into his head till verylately
fbe lre
to make such a motion as lie had done that night,—
(Hear,) Ties Bight Honourable Gentleman had referred
to conduct the Government, and
the character it main-
tained in the country, and he had stated that as they
could not carry the measures that they had brought for•
ward, they were not entitled to the confidence of the
Ministry had done,
that he had taaaved that the Government had carried
lTppse. He (Sir J. Hebhouse) thought in the short review.
out the policy they hadaat Akt WA. It was very true -
that they could not carry the Irish
.Regiatration Bill,
to Ireltoid them, because
they have motions condemnatory- of emuse
views with respect
the:, `ll/Vid not carry their
like to
hut. they had carried the principle of it. If they were
if the Right Hon. came into office to-
leo, should know,
viand taa-e of his
carrying what chance there
it was true that an ad-
eashire's Bill ?—(Hear, hear.)
amendment moved
irerS ft had been come to on thefor Liverpool. On that
carrying time Noble Lord the Member for :la•T:Ortli'l.all3-
by the 44e f,(04 the Member
of humanity, but a more gi" defe.lttpciun the pretext
,cession the Geveittinfent llad Lee •• -
lace. The attemptu to
set a Government never pool( ,
raise tha opium cry, and anti,alaYefy cry ngu ProYfd
das'hfailitre tlattern,,pt to ap-
i Qentleman apperfe 1
abortive. The Right Tionorabft, - •
upon any great
defeated
refin,ign Alen they wereusual toy Ministers to
N'oWite (Sir,J. Hobhouse) assertc I
Hon. Gentleman
that such was not the case. The Right
nsc:l3::::s.iithrea.ti. it „,,K

had alluded to the case of Sir Robert Walpole. That
Right Hon. Gentleman proposed a great measure of
finance, and he was beaten upon that, but he did not
resign. He alluded to the question of Excise. Upon
that occasion Sir Robert Walpole stated that he consi-
dered the carrying of that measure was necessary for the
support of the country under its then circumstances. But
nevertheless such was the opposition against it, that he
was obliged to give it up, but he did nut resign.—(Hear.)
Lord Liverpool's Government was beat upon the Pro-
perty Tax, by a majority of 37, pretty much the same
number as the majority of the other night, yet he did not
resign. Bat he would give a case in which the Right
Hon. Baronet was himself concerned. He was in office
when the Test and Corporations Bill was repealed. That
Bill was brought forward by his Noble Friend ; he beat
the Government upon the question. It was certainly a
great measure, yet, although beat, the Government, in
obedience to the vote of the House. allowed the Bill to
become law, and yet they never thought of resign-
ing ; and no one that he remembered ever taunted
them with it. With respect to the taunt which the
Right Hon. Baronet had alluded to, it was an act of in-
discretion, of which he had publicly repented in that
House, and he had hoped that the generosity of the
Right Hon. Baronet would have induced him to spare
his (Sir J. H.'s) f,clings on that occasion. He then
came to the Ministry of the Right Honourable Gentle-
man, in 1834 and 1835. lie admitted that he
had at last yielded to the expressed wishes
of the House. He had done so, but at what
period ?—he did not yield at the time when,
in accordance with the principle he now laid down, he
ought to have yielded. He was beat upon the Speaker-
ship, which was a question which, in former times, was
regarded as decisive of the fate of a Ministry. On the
Addres, an amendment, not one of mere form, but one
strongly condemning the first act of the policy of the
Right Hon. Baronet, the dissolving of the Parliament,
in which those on his side of the House had a majority
of about 240—that amendment was curried by a ma-
jority of 7. Yet the Right Hon. Baronet said, although
the vote was one of censure upon him, he would perse-
' yere, because it was not a direct vote of no conti-
dence. He could not, of course, allude to the case
of the appointment of Lord Londonderry, because the Right
Hon. Gentleman said, had he been beaten on that subject he
would have resigned. He acknowledged that a Government
must either have the confidence of the House or they must re-
sign, or they must, of necessity, lake the course which the
Right Hon. Gentleman took. The Right Hon. Gentleman
was beaten also on the Chatham election by a majority of 31 ;
on the Leicester election by 46, and on the grant of a Charter
to the London University by a majority of 110. Then came
the successive defeats on the Irish Church. No man could for
a moment suppose that he had the confidence of the House, but
still he held the reins of Government. At the time, he thought
the Right Hon. Baronet was acting against the spirit of the
Constitution—he thought so still. He was of opinion
with Mr. Fox, that without the confidence of the House of
' Commons a Government is no Government at all.—(Hear,
hear.) He was still of that opinion, and nothing on earth
would induce him to hold office for five minutes if it was proved
to him that he did so against the wishes of the majority of the
House. The Right Hon. Baronet had alluded to the occur-
rences of 1784. The real fact was that Mr. Pitt. actually go-
verned against the majority of the House, and Mr. Fox was
perfectly justified in what he had then said ; but that having
been quoted, he might be allowed to state that Mr. Pitt was 11
times defeated. Votes of no confidence were carried against
him—addresses to the Crown for his dismissal were carried—mo-
-1 t ions against any dissolution were carried ; in fact questions were
1 carried against him, which, if now carried, would upset any Mi-
nistry. But what did Mr. Pitt say ? He was the great example
taken by those who followed in the school in which the Right
Hon. Baronet was so illustrious apupil. The Hon. Baronet then
quoted several extracts from speeches of Mr. Pitt, delivered
at that period, to the effect that a Minister being appointed by
the prerogative of the Crown, was not constitutionally re-
movable by the House of Commons. Those opinions coming
from so great a ma., in an emergency somewhat resembling
the present—(Laughter.) Certainly they had not been in
eleven minorities, nor had an address to the Crown for their
removal yet been carried, but these were the sentiments
of Mr. Pitt ; and would the Hon. Gentleman opposite say that
they were unconstitutional? What was to be the test?
Catholic Emancipation had been made a Cabinet
question by those who had all their lives opposed it, and, con-
sidering what they had seen of late, he would not be at all sur-
prised to find the Cern-laws made a Cabinet question.—( Hear,
hear, and laughter.) When they proposed measures that would
give relief to the manufacturing industry of the country, was
there any harm in having their whole scheme laid .efore the
country? Surely the agitation which existed was no fault of
theirs. It was a great question, and resolved itself into mono-
poly—a question whether they should by forming a scheme of
import duties, relieve the industry of the country
without creating any additional taxation, or adding to the
present heavy burdens of the people. While the
people were suffering under the present system, while they were
paying enormously for bread, sugar, and timber, he could not
wonder at the agitation which was going on ; and if that was agi-
tation he was afraid that they must plead guilty; at the same
time he must say that he had never seen any or great back-
wardness of the. Hon. Gentlemen opposite, or those connected
with them, in appea.ing to the passions of the people when it
suited their purpose. The Right Hon. Baronet now stated that
he would not give the country any statement of what his policy
would be, but in 1834, upon his accession to office, he did not
think it condescension on his part to issue the celebrated Tam.
worth Address, nor did he think it anything derogatory in
him to make that address at the Manion-home which
induced many to say that they saw no difference between
his principles and those of the Government he had displaced.
On another occasion the Right Hon. Baronet had observed,
when his measures were opposed, that if his proposal was not
approved of he should like to hear what they proposed on the
other side. That something must be done, and what that was
he had as yet not heard, and that confirmed him in the con-
viction that the measures he proposed were the only ones that
could be adopted. Now her Majesty's Government were
equally convinced that, under the present circumstances, the
remedy they proposed was the only one that could he adopted.
He did not think the Right Hon. Baronet had avoided with
success the question that had been put to him as to what he
proposed in the present circumstances of the country, and if
the present Government was displaced had not the country a
right to ask what course the new Ministry meant to pursue ?
(Cheers.) Neither himself nor the House; nor the country,
could find any certainty or steadiness of purpose in the conduct
of the Right Hon. Baronet and his friends. They were
charged with division of opinion, but he begged to ask whether
they could not find among Hon. Gentlemen opposite a most
extraordinary diversity of opinion, a divergence of opinion
such as was held or seen among Honourable Gentlemen
congregated under the same banner.—(Hear, hear.) He saw
the. e sonic of the authors of the Reform Bill and its most vi-
rulent opposers; he saw some of the framers of the Reform
Bill, and close to them gentlemen who declared that such a
measure was destructive of the principles of the British Con-
stitution. The supporters of the Poor-law, and those who de-
clared it to be anti-National and anti-Christian ; he saw the
advocates of the Irish Church Temporalities Bill with those
who considered it the first blow at the Irish Church • he saw
also the authors of the gold standard and those who
declared it to be fraught with ruin and misery to the country ;
he saw the denouncers of Orange lodges and the ex-Masters
and Grand Masters of Orange lodges; he saw the supporters
of the privileges of Parliament. and those who considered these
privileges as se much waste ; he saw members of the High
Church, and Low Church, and New Church party; in short
he saw men of every shade of opinion, from the advocates of
those principles which would put down all popular control,
down to the very gentleman who would ally himself with the
Chartists in order to secure his seat.—(Loud cheers.) With
such discordant elements the Right Hon. Gentleman had not
the least chance of carrying OR the Government upon any de-
fined and settled principles. The Right Hon. Gentleman the
leader of the opposite party, who had put the Government upon
its trial, notwithstanding his great talents, had in his
opinion very little prospect of success in his present attempt
to conduct the affairs of the country. The career of that Right
Hon. Gentleman had been one of ineffectual resistance and
ultimate concession. He had striven against public opinion,
and he had been beaten back—he had landed upon shoal after
shoal, which had sunk under him, and been swept away, and
he had hardly recollected one single opinion which the Right
Hon. Gentleman had taken up that he had not been obliged
to abandon. It was, perhaps, the misfortune, and not the
fault of the Right Hon. Baronet; but it appeared to him that
he had generally come too late with his political discoveries.
He had shown himself deficient in one great quality of a
statesman, for be had not been able to read or foretell
the signs of the times. He could tell the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman, that if he administered the affairs of the country, he
would not be able to do so upon the principles which he had
advocated in his early life. No, he could only administer
them upon the principles which the present Government ad-
vocated, and he did not see any very distingui-hable ground
of difference between their policy and that which the Right
Honourable Baronet would be compelled to.pursue.—( Cheers. )
He hoped that in saying that much he was only using the pri-
vilege of a public man. The Right Hon. Gentleman was the
leader of a party, and wielded his power with certainly great
effect against the present Government, but he saw nothing in
his policy that could hold out the excuse for a change of Minis-
ters, or that would encourage the hope that whatever (wile op-
pressed the country would be removed. The Noble Lord the
Member for North Lancashire had said that the present Go-
vernment was tottering to its fall ; but if that were so he, (Sir
J. Hobhouse) would be content to fail with the Noble Lord
near him. He.would be better satisfied to do that than to rise
to any eminence surrounded by men he had opposed in all the
earlier stages of his life, and supporting principles at variance,
in many respects, with those he had always oppotied.--( Hear, )
Whatever might be theresult of the present division, the Go.
vernment felt that they had dome their duty in bringing for-
ward those measures. It appeared to them that the
time was arrived when the changes they proposed
were not only just, but inevitable.—(Cheers.) They thought
they would have betrayed their duty to the country, to the
House of Commons, to their Sovereign, and to themselves, if
they did not run the risk of these measures in the first instance
receiving the sanction of Parliament, and he was certain that
the more they were examined into, the more they would be
approved.—(Cheers. ) It was only part and parcel of the great
principles which had been propounded by the most eminent
statesmen in earlier days, which had been gradually developing
themselves, and would be brought to bear on other subjects
independently of commercial reform, and which he was certain
would be ultimately carried.—( Cheers.) He was as certain as
he was of his own existence, that whatever delays might occur
these three measures would be eventually carried and become
the law of the land ; and whatever the fate of the present Go-
vernment might be, they were satisfied that they had done their
duty in having been the authors of these measures, and in de-
termining in every constitutional; mode to persevere in carry-
ing them.—( Cheers. )
Mr. B. D'ISRAELI said the Right Hon. Baronet the
Member for Tamworth had been one of the most successful
Ministers that had ever held the reins of Government. He
had never undertaken a measure that he had not carried to a
successful issue. Ile had not carried to the opposite benches
principles and propositions which he was not prepared to abide
by. and it was only when obstacles were thrown in the way
of his management of the affairs of the country, that he had
felt it his duty to resign office. The Right Hon. Gentleman
had drawn what he considered a happy, but what was, In his
(Mr. D'lsraeles) opinion, a somewhat infelicitous comparison
between the conduct of the Right Hon. Baronet, as regarded
the Catholic Relief Hill, and the proceedings of the present
Ministry , but he denied that there was any analogy between
a political question affecting the admission or non-admission of
a certain religious party into Parliament, and a financial mea-
sure such as had been brought forward by the present Go-
, vernment. It appeared to him that Sir Robert Walpole and
Lord -North wee the only Ministers, within the last centime
who were fili6d letheY'•eamB-pe&ii6axliet as the l'iei-eli All'
nisters ; but the want of confidencedisplayed by the Votesol
the House of Commons compelled them ultimately to resign.
'Fite House of Commons should not forget that the party it
present ip power had exercisid that pewer in violation' 0 the
spirit- of the Constitution. 'When posiessed. 61 influence in
the Illii pitßollie, ill'eY "treated' that- Heiiie with ininit, ' arid
they now treated the Hpese of Commons with contempt. The
Right Hen! Gentleman who had just sat down, the Presi-
gent of the Beard of Trade, had given flea}} eonee copselation
:that they`wesda hive the prospect of a strong Government
if Ministers went out of office. The party opposite had corn-
menced by assailing the House of Commons—they assailed the

House of Lords—they attacked the Church—they at-
tacks d the rich and they attacked the poor, aid slow
at the last momAit, at one fell swoop, they at, acked the colo-
nial, the commercial, and the agricultural interest IS the
country. Under these circumstances they need net despair
that the prophetic assertions of the Right Hon. Gentleman
might not be falsified.
Air. T. R. HOBHOUSE thought the Hon. Gentleman
who had just sat down ought to be the last to reproach Mi-
nisters with what he might conceive to be inconsistent con-
duct. The Honourable Gentleman had found it convenient to
have a variety in his °pillions which secured to him the
support of Tories and Radicals. When the Hon. Gentleman
went down to stand for Wycombe, he brought with him two
letters from parties of political sootiments far different from
those which he now embraced. Those letters were from the
Hon. Member for Kilkenny, and the Hon. and Learned Mem-
ber for Dublin. The Hon. Gentleman should look to himself,
belore he indulged in the reproaches which he madertgainst Mi-
nisters. The Hon. Gentleman had accused Ministers of un-
constitutional conduct. He (Mr. Hobhouse) denied that
their conduct was unconstitutional, and insisted that the
unconstitutional proceedings rested with the party on
the other aide of the House.—(Hear, hear.) They
were animated by the unconstitutional wish to rob the
Crown of the exercise of its prerogative, and to deprive the
people of the free exercise of their opinions. What right, he
asked, had Gentlemen to stand up in that. House, which ema-
nated from the people, and was the organ of their opinions, and
say that the people were not entitled to express their opinions
on subjects which so nearly concerned their interest. The
Hon. Gentleman opposite and the Right lion. Baronet ( Sir
Robert Peel) endeavoured to give a narrow scope to this dis-
cussion. The present motion must lead either to the renvival
of Ministers or to a dissolution. Whether it terminated
in their removal or in a dissolution, he felt that he ought to
take into consideration the whole of the conduct of Ministers.
He was opposed to the motion because it detracted from the
prerogative of the Crown, and the privileges of the people.
The Right Hon. Baronet in the course of his speech had de-
nied that the case of 1754, to which he alluded, was analogous
to the present position of the Government ; but he (Mr.
Hume) conceived that there did exist an analogy between
the position of Mr. Pitt in that day, that of the present
Government. If the Opposition followed up the pre-
cedent of 1784, and presented an address to the
Cro nn, the House of Commons would then be brought into
collision with the Crown not for the cause of liberty but for
selfish interests—the House of Commons would then be stand-
ing up tor monopoly and the Crown for liberty. He was also
opposed to this motion, because it was brought forward to
avoid discussion. The opposite party found it more difficult
to force monopoly down the throats of the people of England
than they had at first imagined. If they had arguments in
defence of the line they adopted which would be of
any avail they ought to wish for an opportunity of
discussing the question.—( Hear, hear.) They complained
that the Ministerial party excited the public mind about the
Corn-laws, and then desired during that excitement to go to a
general election. But if agitation prevailed in the country, it
was lion. Gentlemen opposite that were to be charged with it.
The deficiency in the revenue, which Ministers were taunted
with pr.:clueing, arose from what was a great benefit to the
country at large—the penny postage; and we were now
in such a state, that we must either levy new taxes,
or adopt measures similar to those propounded by
Government. Those were the reasons that influenced
him in giving his vote in support of her Majesty's Government,
Whether the present motion went against or in favour of them
he trusted that they would pursue their measure relative to the
Corn-laws, from which the party opposite had shrunk like
timid cowards.

Mr. D'ISRAELI explained in a few words, which were al-
most inaudible in the Gallery. The Hon. Gentleman was un-
derstood to say that he resided in Wycombe, and had not gone
down there with principles different from what he now pro-
fessed.

Mr. LIDDELL was surprised that Hon. Gentlemen on the
Ministerial side of the House should taunt that (the Conserva-
tive) side with attempting to encroach on the prerogative of
the Crown, when, but a few nights ago they were not present
to support that prerogative when an attempt to in'ringe on it was
made by the Hon. Member for Finsbury (Mr. T. Duneombe).
The Right Hon. Gentleman should have been in his place on
that occasion to have supported the prerogative of the Crown.
—( Hear, hear.) He had heard the Right Hen. Pre-ident of
the Board of Trade present the beat defence tha` could be put
forward on behalf of the Government, and he must say that
the feebleness of that defence could only be rivalled by the fee-
bleness of the attack which he (Sir J. C. Hobhouse) had made
in return on that side of the House. The Bight Hon. Baronet
admitted that if a Government did not possess the confidence
of the House it was bound on constitutional grounds to reign
office, and he further stated that himself and his colleagues
were prepared to set the example if they felt they were acting
against the opinions and feelings of the majority of the House.
He hoped the result of this division would leave ro doubt on
that subject in the minds of the Hon. Baronet and his col-
leagues.—(Cheers.) The Right Hon. Gentleman hal spoken
with triumph of the Government's having carried, in the pre-
sent Session, the principle of the Irish Rsgis.ration Bills. He
thought the Right Hon. Gentleman could find but sorry satis-
faction in that.--( Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet
might plume himse f, if he pleased, on the second reading
of that Bill having been carried by a majority of
five.—( Hear, hear, hear.) But what was the result ?
Did they abide by that which they stated was the vital prin-
ciple of their Bill ? On the contrary, with their usual aban-
donment of their principles, did they not abandon it? Were
they not absolutely defeated upon the Bil ? And had they
not finally abandoned it, as they had done by many other mea-
sures they had brought forward?—(Cheers.) The Right
Hon. Baronet then went on to say that they had suffered no
defeat at all, or at least, all the di feat he would admit was,
that on the Sugar Duties. But had they not prepared them-
selves for future defeats in the p-esent session on this mea-
sure? Were not all their future attempts at financial arrange-
ment rendered nugatory? The Noble Lord the Member fur
Lincolnshire had thought fit to vindicate himself from the
charge of inconsistency in the vote which he meant to gi,,e
on the present occasion. The Noble Lord thought they should
not limit this question to such narrow grounds. He asked
the Noble Lord whether the Government themselves consi-
dered those to be narrow grounds, which had arrayed all the
important interests of the country, and on which they were
determined to resort to the extreme measure of dissolving Par-
liament.—( Cheers. ) The Noble Lard (Worsley) said that
the people would not desert the principles of Reform, on which
they had supported the Government. He thought the Noble
Lord would find that rather a stale argument, for whereas
those who once clamoured for the Bill, the whole
Bill, and nothing but the Bill, now professed
themselves utterly dissatisfied with it as an ultimate remedy,
and insisted upon the five points in the Charter. Unless,
therefore, the Noble Lord was prepared to join the Chartists,
he would gain little by his reform cry. So far as he (Mr.
Liddell) was concerned, he had never given a vote with a
clearer conviction of its necessity, than that which he should
give on the present occasion. Did the present Ministers pos-
sess the confidence of the House? Had they forgotten their
many defeats last Session, the number of which
escaped his memory ?—( Hear, hear.) What do they think of
the abandonment of their Bill for the amendment of the Poor-
laws, which the Noble Lord (Russell) hadstated were essential
to the welfare of the country ? How did the Noble Lord propose
to get rid of the inconvenience that would result from its aban-
donment? Did he mean the powers of the Commissioners should
expire without renewal ? Did they forget the abandonment of
their measure for the abolition of Church-rates, and the
destination of that great property to other purposes? Were
they not aware of the result of the Church Leases' Bil?
Again, was not that an important point to which the Right
Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Peel) had alluded for the reduction of
the postage? Was not this effected by the demands and re-
presentations of the Radical section of the House? All these
things resulted from the weakness of the Government, and
from these things the House was called upon to defend the.n-
selves and the country, and thus at the eleventh hour the
Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Tamworth had become
too painfully sensitive, and he therefore stepped forward
for the interests of the perplo with a resolution which he (Mr.
Liddell) trusted would have the effect of driving Hon. Gen-
tlemen opposite from office. —(Cheer4.) Was it not the
true constitutional principle long acted upon in this country
that when the Administration had lost the confidence of the
House of Commons their course was either to resign office or
make an appeal to the country by advising the Crown to dis-
solve the Parliament.--(Ministerial cheers.) But when
ought that extreme measure to be adopted by;the Government ?
Only when there was a distinct expression on the put
of the country, and a distinct impression on the n•inds of
Ministers thst the opinions of the country and the House of
Commons were at variance, and therefore that they ought
to appeal to the opinion of the country.—(Cheers.)
He did not think that any one Administration, though he had
not a very high opinion of the principles of the present Govern-
ment—( Hear, hear)—would justify a dissolution of Parlia-
ment for the purpose of agitation ; nor unless they believed
the view of the country was with them. What was the simple
and natural course for Hon. Gentlemen opposite? They had
abandoned two important Government measures ; the ad ninis-
tration of the Government in Ireland, and their attempt to
change the representation of that country, and one great
financial project introduced by the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer. After these defeats, could they say that they pos-
sessed the confidence of the House? The Right Hon.
Baronet (Sir R, Peel) had been taunted on the subject of the
Corn-laws; yet he put the question on most distinct and in-
telligible grounds. fhe Government said that they advocated a
fixed duty ; the Right Hon. Baronet said that he maintained
the principle of a sliding scale. That was sufficient grounds
for confidence in the Right Hon. Baronet. Would any man
in the House venture to say that the present was the very best
plan that could be adopted ?—( Ministerial cheers.) Attached
as he was to the present Corn-laws he dldnot so consider them,
and he lamented that the Corn-law proposed by Mr. Canning
had been altered. His Right Hon. Friend (Sir Robert :'eel )
was too wise to enter upon a speech of details—(Ministerial
cheers)—but he had spoken out on the principle. He s Mr.
Liddle) was surprised that the Noble Lord (Palmerston), the
colleague of Mr. Canning and Mr. Huskisson had not been
convinced by their arguments, and (lid not maintain their
policy. He feared that he had trespassed too long on the at-
tention of the House. He felt strongly the position in which
the Government was placed, and he felt convinced that it would
be for the best interests of the country that a change should
take place in public affairs, He was convinced that the Right
Hon. Baronet had not wrongly estimated the feelings of the
nation, and the circumstances of the time, in bringing forward
this motion, which, so far from being an invasion. upon the
prerogative of the Crown, he believed would bring the Crown
and the people of this country more in harmony and unison
than they had been since the accession of her present Majesty
to the Crown, and that of the weakest and most imbecile Go-
vernment to office that had held it in the recent history of the
country,—(Cheers.)
Sir H. FLEETWOOD said that his only apology for ad-
dressing the House on so important a debate as the present
was, that he had not trespassed, on any other occasion, on
their attention, during the Session. He represented besides a
large and suffering constituency, who felt the deepest interest
in the questions now under the consideration of Parliament.
The Hon. Member for Finsbury (Mr. Wakle)) had expressed
his readiness to vote for the Opposition in that House, provided
they brought forward measures which would have his approval
and he, too Sir H. Fleetwood) would have been ready to
sacrifice, as it had often before been his fate to do, the interests
of party to the general interests of the people. —( Hear,
hear.) He was decidedly and conscientiously opposed to the
present Corn-laws ; as he did not wish to tax the
great necessary of life, and as he thought the present system
was prejudicial to all classes. He believed that the present
was a crisis such as had never before been known since the
British Constitution watt in force. That was the only time
When they had before them the questions of a free or a re • •
stricted trade. Gentlemen now for the first time advocated
the welfare of the community at large in opposition to privi-
leged bodies. That was, however, the time when Nay Neer
called upon to vote against the Adminstratioo tip, reso-
lution were to be carris,d, he believed it *(Aid lead to a
ehaoge of men, and not 'to a clianks of Measures; and he felt
assured that ttliatiy Tien. ''Gentlemen opposite would bz
posed to advocate principles similar to tor Aniroclticesi by
her Majesty's Gevermhent on t.l isrsent oceastol,l•—( tfrar•
The countryw.is new labouring, under the disadvantages of
deficiency of, revenue', anti thtey iVere' caged Upon to provide
remedy fOr this evil. Th'ere'Were but two couples (s•
sued under the eireumstances—either to, iocrea.se. the taxation,
or to diminish taxation, and g\a497lleVtni:enh, e'hadde4v,,c,l47l7et Yos:
increased The G
the latter alternative, and had endeavoured to meet the wants j
of the country Without adding the burdens of the people. I
He wished this question should be fully discussed before they
again appeared before their constituents. 14 however, they