The Sun.
London, England, 1812-02-07 00:00:00

RIOTS AT NOTTINGHAM..

Mr. WHITBREAD, before the other business was
proceeded with, wished to ask the Right Hon.

, , •
secretary of State fer the Home Department; to
whose panicula, charge was entrusted the peace of
the country, for some information as to those dis-
turbances in Nottinghamshire, which, to the scan-
dal of the Government, had so long existP.,, and
which, as he had,been told, were organized into a
regular system; and not merely going on,. but in-
creasing in extent and danger. Had the Right Ho-
nourable, Gentleman any-objection to lay before the
House such information, oh thesuhjett,..as •wciula
enable them to proceed to an inquiry into it, or was
it in his, power to give the House the satisf4tory in-
telligence that ..the disturbances were so neatly
quelled as to tender such an inquiry unnecessary at
the present moment ?

Mr. Secretary.RYDEß assured the Hon. Gentle-
man, that, from the latest information which he
had received, he was justified in stating, that dur-
ing the last two dags the disturbances alluded to had
considerably sunsided ; but, at the same time, not
to that ckgree as to preclude the propriety of sub-
mitting the. subjea at some time or other to the
consideration; of the House, - If the Hon. Gentle-
man had it in .contemplation to bring -forward a
charge against him for the non-execution- of his
duty, he was 'pet feelly ready to meet it; and in-
deed he should be .himself disposed to agitate
that question at that very moment, were it not
thai measures were, in contemplation, which he
shobld have the honour of bringing- before Par-
liament in a few days, on winch occasion hi;
own condua, if it so pleased the Hon. Gentleman
triigh,t be fully discussed.

3
Mr. `WHITBREAD would not give any formal no-
ice
on the subject at the present period, but un,
questionably the existence of riots in the heart of
the country, and for such a consi:lerable length of
time, tt as, prima-facie,. a heavy chaig against the
Right Hon. Gentleman.
Mr. LAMBE declared, that so far were the riots
from having subsided, that he understood they bad
increased to a dangerous eVent.

Mr. C. BATHURSsT, on the contrary, said he had
heard that they had considerably subsided, and that 0
theY had never been so great as they were rt pre-
sented to be.

AFFAIRS OF THE EAST INDIA COMPANY.
Mr. WAx.LIS, alter expatiating on the advantages
hick bad been derived from the labours of lot vier

Committees on the subject, and on the necessity
for obtaining sqcli accurate information with respect
to the finances, &c. of the East India Company, as
would afford materials for considering the great
question respecting that Company, which would so
soon be agitated, mated, " That a Select Cormnit-
tee be appointed to examine into the present state
of the atiairS of the East India Company, and to
report the same, as ir.should appear to them, to the
House, with their opinion thereon." It would be
necessary to make two alterations in the Members
composing the Committee, by substitutin; two
new Members ; the one for Mr. Dundas, no .v Lord
•Nelville, the other for his lamented friend, ihe late
Sir J. Anstruther.

At the desire of Mr. CREEVEY, the Clerk read
that passage of, the Lords Cominis,ioners' Speech
at the opening of the Session, which recommended
to Parliament to make provision for the future Go-
vernment of the possessions in India.

Mr. CREEvcY then • proceeded to state his objet.
tions against the re-appointment of a Seled Com-
mittee. Such a Committee had existed for five
successive Sessions, and he was persuaded that no
human being was a tittle the wiser for the reports
'which they had presented. Asa sutastiwte, he pro-
posed that the House should resolve itself into a
Committee of the whole House on the .stitjea.—
The exis-ing documents were quite sufficient to
lead them to a conclusion as to what steps ought to
be adopted. This first inquiry must be into the re-
sult of the agreement between the Government and
the Company, as compared with what was held out
when the agreement was entered into. If the House
were to resolve into the Committee, he should pro-
pose-as a resolution, that in the space of 19 years the
sum of 500,0001. which the Company agreed to'
pay annually to the public, was paid but once, and
that that p Tment was met by a loan of thrlfce the
amount. He should also- propose a resolutien,
that the debt of the Company, which by the agree-
ment was fo be reduced to t wo millions, bad attually -
been increased to thirty. He should propose a third
resolution, that the agreement on the part of the
Company to lay by twelve millions out of their •
savings, as a guarantee to the holders of. English
stock, had not
.been cariied into effeet. He ;advert-
ed to the history of the connection between the
Company aneGovernment. Formerly the Corn- -
pony always paid for their exclus've privileges. of,
trade. "ums soon as they were converted from
Commercial men into Sovereigns, they then held
out to the' country a participation of their profits,
from-which participation the public had never
rived any bolefit. The causes of difference
would be manifest to the House, if they would re-
fer to the 9:11 Report of a former Conunittee on this
subjea. Mr. Burke, the 'author of that Report,
had clearly explained the reasons why the ,
Com-
pany, as Sovereigns, could not contribute as they
drd when they were possessed of cisil power. He
had observed, that they were no longer merchants,
and 11131 trade was with them a secondary consider-
alien. But elthough trade might be a seco:tdary
consideration with the East India Company, it was
a primary consideration with the country at large.
From the papers on the table, it appeared that the
produce sot the Income Tax for 'Bll was less by
100,0001.. than the produce of the preceding year.
Whence could this arise ? The laud and the Stocks
had not diminished. The clear inference was, that
the diminution originated purely in the decrease of
trade and 'manufactures. (The Chancellor :of the
Exchequer signified his dissent from this in ference.)—
He.should be glaJ to hear the 4 girt Hon. Gentle-
man on this subject. It' was one of great ;nor-
lance ; for if, as he believed, the decrease in the pro.
ceeds of t he tax wastetributatafe to tliedecrease olcoar-
coerce and manutaeturers, that decrease roust be to
the enormous amouot of t i,000,0001. 'in one year.'
In one large commercial town, he could say of his.
own knowledge, that a great revolution had taken
Alice—he meant Liverpool.' So great was ale Com-
mercialdistress of Liverpool, that a Committee had
been appointed to erideevour to alleviate it ; and he
held In his hand au ottLal report of that Committee,
w
which stated, that during the last ohth the) hat
.relieved—in the first week, B,oou ;in the secoed
week, 11,000 ; in the third week, 13,000; and lu

the fourth week of the month, 1.5,000 persons. It
was well known that indviduals in neutral nations
had traded so the East Indies with considerable be-
nefit both to their nations and to themselves, and it
watt fair to conclude, that the capital and enterprise
of British merchants, if permitted to be freely di-
reCted towards !hat great .dat t of . the World, might
render it productive of infinite individual and na-
tional advantage. For his part, he was anxious that
the territorial revenue, and the management of
the Indian army, should be granted to the Com-
pany for another term of years, as he conceived
they would be much more abused if -transferred to
the Crown. However anomalous it might be, that
twenty-four private, persons should preside over
the territorial and military affairs of that great Pe-
ninsula, yet he was persuaded it was much better
to allow of that than of a greater evil ; but he
would solicitously divide the territorial from the
commercial sway. Unquestionably, in any new
agreement between the Company and the Country,
founded on the principle which he had described, it
would be necessary to make a variety of proviaiena.
To him it appeared most advisable, that all those
provisions should be made natters of public dis-
cussion ; because experience had strewn, that when
they were not so, the interests of the country were
the invariable sacrifice. As a proof of this fact, he
referred to the _proceedings on the last renewal of
the Company's charter. It was stipulated in those
proceedings, that Government should raise the di-
vidend of the Company from 8 to 10 per cent, and
that the Company should pay four Members of Par-
liament, , tz. the President of the Board of Controul,
two Commissi ners, and a Secretary. All this
evinced the necessity of considering this subject to
an open Committee of the whole House, rather
than in. a S• leCt Committee, and it was on that
gr,,und he opposed the motion.
General Gascoroira; although he would not op-
pose the motion tor a-Select Committee, concurred
in many of the observations made by the Honour-
able Gentleman who had just sat dowh, and parti-
cularly in those which reiated to the trade of the
country. He assured the House that there existed
in Liverpool a great sensation with resped to a free
trade with India. The distress felt by the Mer-
chatds of Liverpool had been truly described by the
Ilon, Gentleman, and they entertained the reason-
able expectat.on that some alteration, would be made
in the state of the carrying trade, and that Liver-
pool, as well as the other out-pot ta, would be allow-
ed to participate in the advantages oi a free com-
merce with India. A petition would have been pre-
sented on the subjea, had not such a step been
deemed premature ; but he could . assure the
• House, that la lien the proper period should waive,
there war not an out-port in the kingdom from
:which petitions would not be presented, for the pur-
pose which he had mentioned. He trusted, that
notwithstanding the appointment of thts. Select
Committee for a particular ohjed, the main and ul-
timate question.would ee taker, into consideration
by a Cominitte of she whole House, and that it
would be discussed as fully and freely as the ‘ast im-
portance of the subject demanded.
Mr. GRANT folloWed, but spoke in so low a tone
of voice, t=hat we are able to give hut an outline of his
spec, h.—Tise tendency of the Hon. Gentleman's
obser,,itions, 03 tar as we were able to trolled it, ap-
peared to was not extremely solicitous
• fin the appointment of the proposed Committee at
the present motile:lt,. ough he inaietained, in op-
posit•on to the Hon. Gentleman, that the former
ComMittees on the same subject, if they bad not
dune all that bad been•expeeted from them, had at
afferded.dgreat deal of very valuable ibforina-
ttote tie aeeined to contend that the public was
nustaken, if it supposed that the East India Com-
pany opposed the opening of the trade on any nar-
row principle, for that their real motive was the
appr, (tension of-opeeing the trade to foreign ceun-
tries, and eventually of exposing India to foreign
subjega. ion.
Gen.:ral TAICLEToN thought the port of Liverpool
ought to be allowed its fair share in the East India
trade. He took occasion to notice the present situa•
tion
,of Liverpool, and comparing it with what it
formerly was, observed, that !lox, if they went
roend its dock, they wou'd see, not signals for sail,
ing exhibited by numerous vessels, as formerly, but
the broom at the mast-head as a signal for sale. He
repeated, that it there was an opportunity, Liver-
pool
ought to be allowed a share in the East India
trade. He
,could not see why the Athericans should
be allowed that which was denied to his cons'itu-
cuts. Every out-port ought to have a share in
it. MiThopolias were always injurious to -commerce,
batieficial to a new, but opposed to the interests of
the many .
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, was of
opinion, the East India trade might be opened in a
very considerable degree, and that such enlargement
might. be' made with .perfect security to the East
India Cumpany. While contemplating this, how-
ever, they ought to keep in mind the great import-
aoce of preserving the tranquility of those, posses-
sions, and he should never enter into the discUssion
w mow attending to both those points. - The prin-
cipal object which he bad in rising in the present
debate was, to express his surpiise with respett to
what had fallen hem the Hon. Genueman oppo-
site, on the siiejed of the falling off in one source
of the revenue. He had stated the produce of the
prOpt•rty tax tor the year ending January 5, 1312,
as compared with that ending in the preceding Ja-
imary, to be 1,16,0001.---(Here Mr. Creevey
stated h a assertion to be founded on the returns
itiere from the sth of Oetober, 1810, to the sth of
()ember, 1811).—.He (the Chancellor 'of the Ex-
chequer)' could not immed ably speak With aa-efer-
enee to tee returns etadieeethe sth of Odober,fB i i, .
but he apprehended the comparison, as made up to
the sth of Jantti!y, 1812 (three months later than •
the period Ukut,ect uy iltC Honourable Gentleman);
would be at least as satiafaetory. to 1119 House.,
Now it so harpeped, that in the returns as madealp•to
Jap."-a, 1-812, instead of a deficiency of f 000,0001.•
aestated by the Hoe. Geollernan (Mi,.Creevey) there
was only a deficiency of 2,89,00;1i. and the produce
of the p.ar en ,itig Jen. 5,, 1312, though 2890001.
less than the produce of the year endh g January 5,
1811, was 789,0001. greater than the [nutlet:a', of the
preceding year. The desponding v iew t daeo of the
situation of the country by- the Hop, Gentlenini, it
ould henee be seen was not insitlied
,:tayfet he real

state of things. It would be taking a very narrow
view of the sehjat to look upon the trade of the
country as ruiner t, from the state of the revenue,
taking only two years, into consideratOne more esPe-
chilly when that ruin was inferred by 'a falling off in
one of those yeers'tas compared' with the other, in
which the revenue was greater than it had ever Beep
before. If on a'comparison being made" between
the returns of the present year, and those of any
former year preceding that in which they had been
so unprecedentedly great, they were not found
unfas curable, it might be for them io regret the
diminution that appeated in the revenue of (he
present, as compared with that of the last year ; but
Ournished_no reason for regarding the trade of
the country as ruined. The great= increase which
took place in .the year ending I, it had
been repeatedly stated, had, ity' part, arisen from
that which had frequently beet; 'made a subject of
complaint in that House, namely, from the circum-
stance of his having conceived it to be his duty;
since he had been in office, to propose various rnea-
sures to the, House for 'bringing up the arrears of
certain taxes. It was the eifeet of these which had
contributed, in no stnail degree, to swell the produce
of the last sear so high, when compared with the
present.. These measures, it was obVious, if they
had the desired effect in the flrs instance, could not
go on increasing the revenue in the same propor-
tion. The sum celleeted its the last year, as being
fairly colleelable uitbin the'-year, independent of
arrears, &c. he thought not interior to that fairly
collectable in the year ending January, 1811.. The
Right Hon. Gentleman- then reheated his state-
ments, to o'rove that the receipts of the last year,
though inferior to Those of the, year ending in
January, 1811, exceeded those of the third year
back, by a sam amonating to between seven
and eight hundred eourels. The Honourable
Gentleman, when stating,the diminution in the Pro-
perty Tax is the - year .ending last month, to be
1,100,0001. had slid he should be glad to hear hint
(the Chancellor of the Exchequer) give a satisfac-
tory expleuatioe, and lee had nu doubt but he was
' glad to hear what he (the Chancellor of the Exche-
quer) had had the honour to oiler to she 'House._
What he bad stated, he believed,to be correct. He
might however be in some small degree mis.aken :
he did not think he was.; but he wished the House
to take the few rapid observations he had made, as
not having been confidently given on mature consi-
deration. With respect to Liverpool, the state-
ment made by the Honourable General could not
be heard withouesorrow, but the Hon'Ourable Gen-
tleman who began. the disCuSsion had spoken, not
of any particular place,' but ef the ruined owe of
our trade in general ; it might appear, vs hen •I he
necessary documents were' before the House, that
the trade of this country had considerably decreased
in the last year, as comp rr,d with what it was
in the year ending in January 'lB4 1, but it was
not so as compared with the year' preceding that.
In the year ending in Jan. 181 I, a greater increase
took place, than had byeh ',frown in any lOrmer
rear. With the exception of one or two. of the
most favoutable years this country had ever seen,
our trade in the year ending January 16,12, was not
deficient as compared with former year-4. He
might perhaps go' farther, fur he had an idea that
it-had been greater than had ever been known be-
fore, with the exception of One 'or two years. The
great increase of trade, in the year ending January
1811, had caused' the market 'to be glutted, and
in consequence of that glum, sonic dee'ression Led
been felt in the fallowing year. That this
depression had been telt in various ways, he ad-
mitted, but dial there was thence any reason to in-
fer that the trade of tee country was ruined, he
denied.
Mr. CREEVEY and the CHANCELLOR of the EX-
CHEQUER severally explained.

Sir S. ROMILLY thought it miglit-be better to go
into a Committee of the %%bole House upon tie
hubjeci, than to icier the matter to a Select Com-
mittee, and- wished to know it the Hon. Gentle-
man opposite was cf opinion, that the Report ut a
Select Committee would bring before the floue
that, which it was necessary thcy should be ac-
quainted with before they
.went into Like grand dis-
cussion.

F
• Mr. BROUGHAM said, there were many question's
of fats which were necessary tip to tliscus,ed by the
exaMination of witnesses before the House, anterior
to their proceeding, to decide on the grand qnestion.
He then took a view of the different opinions enter-
tained on the subje& by persons -possssing local
knowledge of our East India posiesSions. Unless
the patties which thus opposed to each other in sen-
timent were biought before the House, so that Gen-
tlemen might haire an opportunity of sifting out of
theM what were really their opinions, it would be
very difficalt for them to come to, ftsafe and satis-
fattoiy conclusion. Wit h' the information be at pre-
sent had on the Subjeal, he was ra her disposed to
think the trade should be thrown open, but he could
not give a prOper-ripinirin.till he had further infor-
mattini ; and, in the Asence of such information,
he thought Gentlemen ought to endeavour to keeo
their minds from leaning either on the one side or
the other.. He Cautioned the Houst;-against holding
out priispeals too flattering to the people, afs to the
zidvantageS to be derived from an open trade to, the
Edit Indies. If this were not attended -to, the evils
'which had prociedA from the too great otptoa-
t ions formed-of South America, might be felt again.
' With respect to the difference between the Right
Hon. Gentleman (the Chancellor of the Exchequer),
and the Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Creevey), the
prodnalion of the papers could alone set the matter
at rest.

The CHANCELLOR of the- EXCH ECLU ER---" They
are all on the'tthle."

Mr. BROUGHAM thought they ought to be printed,
as.that was the only practicable mode of putting
House in possession of their contents. The increase
of commerce, as inferred from the increased pro-
duce of the Property Tax,..was liable to one objec-
tion. rt had been the object of the present'Gp7
vernment not merely to bring up the arrears of the
Property Tax,.but to increase its amount fur the
time to come. The nominal to per cent. collected
nnw, was more in proportion than formerly, from
the'higher tate at which the estimates of property
had been made.

. Mr. LUSHINGTON spoke shortly in favour of the
motion.

Mr. WHITEREAI? %OSLtd to know Wll7lO many
weeks had been suffeted to •pass since the com-
mencement ot the Session before any notice was
taken of the subjedt now before the House. He
wished to know if it was probable that the report
of the proposed Committee would be in the hands
of Members in proper time boore the House pro
ceeded to discuss the gland question ? It it was-pos-
sible the inquiries of this Committee would extend
to all the affairs of the East India Company ? Un
I.tss ibis was understood, the appointment of the
proposed committee was nugatory. The Right
Honourable Gentleman had gone how a strain which
anight delude others, as he himself had been de-
luded, or he would not have brought the commerce
of this country into its present staie. He wished to
ask the. Hon. Gentleman if the flourishing mouths
of commerce to which he alluded, had not been
created by the. representations of the Treasury, which
induced many to believe that South America opened
a taarket for our trade to any amount : in conse-
quence of which, the Gazette had teemed with
Bankruptcies, and many families been invoked in
utter ruin ? He wished also to know if it was in-
tended to propose a renewal of the Charter of the
East India Company ? Without very satissaelory
answers to the questions lie had put, he should vote
against appointing a Selett Committee.
Lord FoLKESTONE thought a Select Cornmittee
would not give the House the necessary informa-
tion, and was of opinion the statement of the sums
paid into the Exchequer yearly, were not sufficient
to give a proper idea of the situation of the coun-
try. The distress, calamity, and ruin from which
those sums were drawn, ought to be c,nsidered, as
Well as the surcharges on:surcharges •by which they
were raised.
Mr. HUTCHINSON called the attention of the
House to. Ihe situation of Ireland, and her right to
a pat ticipation in the advantages Of the East India
trade.

Mr. WALLIS briefly replied to the principal ar-
guments of the various speakers. He, as tar as he
could judge, had reason to think the report would
be made sufficiently early fOr the information of
Members. It was never intended to contain all the
information necessary to the grand discussion. It
was impossible to say whether the question on the
renewal of the Charter would or would not come on
this Session. The business was in .progrew, and
there was reason to tikink it
.might, but it did not
depend entirely upon Government.
Theluest ion was then put and catried.

Mr. H. MARTrt gave notice; that -On Monday
he would mote for gave to bring- in one
of them was understood to be to regulate the Office
of the Registiar of the Admiralty -the other was
not heard, owing to the noise which/prevailed at
that moment in the gallery.—Adjourned.

LAW REPORT.

COURT OF.KING'S BENCII, F. 6.

THE KING V. VIGON.

. .
The defendant in this case was called" on to 're-
ceive the judgment of the Court, having -been Con-
t7l,-tetl at the last Assizes for the county of Kent,
;ruder the -following circumstances. The defendant
is a butcher at Maidstone, and he had eid;.:red into
a contract to supply the troops in that distriet„ with
good and whoiesoMe meat, from the 251 h of-Sep-
tember, 1810, to the 24th of March, 1811. With-
in this periodi.it appeared, that he had once sup-
the tro,ps with bad and unwholesome meat,
and for t b:s offence he was indidted and found guilty.
'lime ATTOINEV-GENKRAL said, it Would not be
rce3sary tur his Lordship to read his notes of the
case. The Commandant of the District had foUnd
it to be his duty to institute the prosecution in-ques-
tion and, .by the veidiet hch had been obtained,
and the 'effects of it, lie was happy- to think the end
of the prosecution had already been answered.. The.
xpence of such a prosecution, their Lordships must
be aware; fed heavily upon the defendant, sn much
so as.to amount to a pnuishment fully adequate to the
ot&nce.. The end of the prosecution was to satisfy.
Ilse adders that every attention should be paid to
their comfort and accommodation, arid the Com-
manding ()dicer of the Distria tsas- satisfied that
this end had been attained.

Lord ELLIA;r OROUGU. said, the Court could not
know. what puntNhinent would be adequate to the
offence, or-to the protetlion of the .public against
siindar otfeoces in future, if the notes of the tt ial
were not read.

Mr. GURNEY, for the defendant,. submitted that
his client having 13,:en charged with one solitary
'offence, ►he expellees already incurred were punish,
mein sufficient for that of which he had been guilty.
He trusted, theiefore, the Court would.fall in with
the humane inclinat.or► of hip Learned Friend, thi,!
'Attorney-General, by allowing the defendant to. re-
main at large on his own tecoguizatice: •
The ATTORN EY GENERAL agreed that the justice
of the case would be best answered by this arrange-
tnen't.

The defendant - W3S. accordingly liberated on his
own reeogniz.ince,-to :come up for-judgment,When
called on.

HABEAS CONP.)I? A

Mr. PARK Morit4il•Ccir a Writ of Players Corpbrn to
be uiretted to a Mr:ll,ra), si cotton-spinier in West-
moreland, calling.on him to,
.bring op .the bodies of
nine children belonging to the pa) ish Of St. George,
lianov er-square, in the county Mof iddlesex. It
appeared that the nine children in question had been
apprenticed out, under the At of Parliament, by
the Overseers of the Poor tithe palish of St. George,
I-Lawyer-square, to a tuanufadurer in -Manchester,
who had finice become banki upt. The Overseers
of the parish of Manchester, on this event occurring,,
without any intimation to the Overseers of the,
parish of St. George, Hanover-square, advertised
the children as having become a burthen upon
them, and .they were taken, also without any pri-
vity on the part of the Overseers of the latter
parish, into the employment of Mr. Birch, against
whom the present appl'catinn was made. The
Overseers, however, having come to the. knowledge
of these circumstances, seta two of their Otticeis
to ins Pied into the. condition of the children, whom
they found to be over-wrought,
.badly fed, and bad-
ly clothed. On this they sent a special mes•enger,
and again other messengers, desiring that the chit-
dren might be given up to than, but without effect.
Mr. Bitch had offered to take the children as ap,

MAR R lAD.

On Saturday last, at Clifton, foseph Cookson, Esq. of
the City of Bristol, to Elizabeth, daughter of William EL-
ton, Esq. of Clifton Wood.
On Tuesday last, at St. George's, Hanover square, Mr.
Wyld, to Eliza, second daughter of William Legg, Lsq..
of Ox torsi-sire:t.

The same day, at St. George's, Hanover-square, the Rev.
1. Radc 'Vicar of littlebonts, Kent, atm Minor Ca:3w
of the Cathedral, Canteroury, Miss Simpson,-daughter
of the late General Simpson.