The Sun.
London, England, 1864-03-01 00:00:00

terested in the difference between Denmark and Germany
without an armistice. I understand that the noble lord

made an announcement to that effect, and that the propo •
sition had been accepted by the French Government. I have
myself great distrust of Conferences pcndente lite. It seems

in the nature of things that these efforts should be generally
fruitless, and sometimes productive of great disadvantage,
however bona fide may be the intentions of those
who go into the councils under such circumstances, It
stands to reason that nothing can be more difficult than to
come to a decision upon events perpetually changing;
and if we study the history, not only of this country,
but of general diplomacy, we shall find that in nine times
out of ten, where conferences for peace have been carried on
during war without an armistice, these conferences have
failed; because, though there may have been the greatest
anxiety on the part of all present to come to a pacific solu-
tion of affairs, yet when they have arrived at some basis
which promised a satisfactory result a strong place has,
perhaps, been taken, a battle fought, or some individual
who exercises a leading influence on events—a Minister or
a Prince--dies; the whole materials are changed in their
aspect and character, and, with all the efforts exerted to
bring the matter to a conclusion, failure has generally been
the result, But in the present case I confess that I have
more than an abstract objection to a conference pcndente lite,
because we have experience of the influence of the present
Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs under circumstances

-
of an analogous character, and they are not of a favourable or

. .... .......
flattering nature. (Laughter.) Nine years ago there were
conferences held at Vienna at a time of war, and without
an armistice, with the view of bringing about peace under
circumstances which many considered not unfavourable.

The noble lord, now Foreign Secretary, but not then filling
that office, was, from the force lof circumstances, without
any occupation at the moment. (A laugh.) He was, there-
fore, chosen by the noble lord the Prime Minister to manage
the negotiation at the Conference of Vienna, under the
conditions to which I have referred. I need not remind the
house—for it is part of our history—of the amount of indis-
cretion and disaster which was accomplished under these
circumstances. (Hear, hear.) I believe there is no page
in the annals of our time—at least of the last 25 years—to
which we can look back with less satisfaction. (Hear.) The
noble lord was sent to the Conference to negotiate a peace
without an armistice. He came back to this country to re-
commend to his colleagues that they should accept a peace,
under conditions which were kept completely secret, Sus-
picions were excited in the House of Commons. I myself
was requested by my friends to bring forward a motion
calling the attention of the house to the ambiguity both of
expression and conduct on the part of the Government in

regard to the proceedings which were then taking place.
The Government were vindicated on that occasion by a very
large majority—not less than 100 expressing their confidence
in the negotiations of the noble lord and the conduct of her
Majesty's Ministers. The noble lord himself appeared in
the house and made a very powerful speech in favour of
carrying on an uncompromising war against Russia. Yet
afterwards the secret came out that at that very period he
was recommending a peace under conditions which the
House of Commons, at least, deemed very disgraceful.
(Hear, hear.) These negotiations at a Conference pendente
lite led to a change of Ministry in France, and to other cir-
cumstances of very great importance. As far as the Eng-
lish Government were concerned, although they had a
majority of 100 on the vote of confidence before the Whit-

suntide holidays, yet after that brief interval they were in
such a position that the noble lord who conducted the nego-
tiations could save the country only by an ignominious
retreat. (Cheers.) Therefore, speaking both generally and
particularly, there is nothing very encouraging to the
country and the House of Commons in learning that Con-
ferences are to be held with a view of terminating the de-
plorable hostilities in Denmark, and that they are to be
conducted without the preliminary and salutary condition
of an armistice. (Hear.) Besides these objections to the
course which the Government are about to pursue, there is
another reason why I think it my duty to request some in-
formation on this point from her Majesty's Ministers. I dare
say hon. gentlemen have all of them more or less examined
the papers respecting the Schleswig- Holsteinquestion which
we so anxiously urged the Government to produce, and I
doubt not they have observed that the noble lord, who nine
years ago conducted so disastrously and fruitlessly the Con-
ferences at Vienna, now, as Secretary of State for the
Foreign Department, impressed with the difficulties which
every day surround him with regard to the Danish ques-
tion, made a proposal to the French Government. I need
not go into the despatch of the noble lord in September of
last year. It is a despatch very characteristic of the writer,
who, having to encounter very great difficulties, suggests
every feeble expedient that can be imagined. Affairs might
be settled by a Conference; they might be settled by pro-
positions; they might be settled by identic notes, by single
notes, by joint notes, by all that diplomatic rubbish (laugh-
ter) which characterises, to use the happy language of the
noble lord the Prime Minister, a Government of antiquated
imbceility. (Laughter and cheers.) What was the answer
of the French Government ? I have no doubt that hon.
gentlemen are perfectly familiar with the answer of the
French Government, communicated by the English Charge
d'Affaires to Earl Russell, It is No. 126, I think, in the
papers. M. Drouyn de Lhuys speaks with a very intimate
knowledge of the character of the Foreign Secretary. M.
Drouyn de Lhuys had been his colleague at those celebrated
Conferences at Vienna, where he negotiated a peace with-
out an armistice, and had lost his eminent post :a come •
quence of the arrangements ho then made with the noble
lord. M. Drouyn de Lhuys had also been infrequent com-
munication upon many very important questions with the
noble lord during the last year or two. Well, what was the
answer of the French Government? lam sure hon. gentle-
men are familiar with it, for it is really the key to the whole
of this voluminous correspondence, part of which we have
already received.. The French Government reply—All
this is very well—these propositions for conferences, for
identic, joint, or separate notes, these means of conveying
to Powers, pursuing a course which we think impolitic and
unjust, our sense of their misbehaviour ; but we have not
forgotten that, under your influence and in your company,
we have taken these measures only recently in regard to
Poland, and what was the result ? It ended in the humi-
liation of both countries—to use M. Drouyn de Lhuys' own
words, which I quote from memory, "in impairing the dig-
nity both of France and England." (Hear, hear.) There-
fore, say the French Government, we will have nothing to
do with these propositions, we will not interfere with these
things; the Emperor is resolved on this; unless you are
prepared to proceed further and enter into a course of action.
(Hear, hear.) 'What more legitimate question, therefore,
can we ask, especially before we go into Committee of Sup-
ply, which is the business of to-night, than this—What is
the exact position of this affair ? (Cheers.) If, as the noble
lord tells us, France has listened with favour to the proposal
of a conference, and is ready at last to co-operate with us in
that direction, is it not our first duty to ascertain from the
noble lord on what conditions the assent of France has been
giver, and whether the noble lord has agreed with the
French Government to go further and to enter into a course
of action in order to effect a common object in Denmark ?
(Hear, hear.) That is a paestion of vital and urgent impor-
tance. I will aSBIII2IIG, however, for the moment, that the
conditions of France have been mentioned and complied
with, that France and England at least have determined to
enter Into a course of action. I say it is also a matter of very
great interest and importance to the House of Commons to
know what that action is intended to effect, and what ob-
ject we are to accomplish, As far as I can form an opinion,
having listened to a varietyofistatements in both houses from
Ministers of the Crown on this question of Germany and
Denmark, there seems so much inconsistency, so mush con-
trariety, not only of views but facts, that at last I feel quite in
a cloud, and am at a loss to understand if the Government are
going to act, it is that they intend to do. (Hear.) If lam
to believe the noble lord, there is a great and common ob-
ject upon which the Powers are agreed and decided, and
that is to maintain ihe integrity and independence of Den-
mark. (FleP:r.) Everybody, according to the noble lord, is
in favoilr of the integrity and independence of Denmark,
and, nobody more so than the Austrian and Prussian Go-
vernments, (A laugh.) It is a great point, especially in
conferences pendente ltte, that there should be one question
upon which all parties are agreed ; but then, unfortunately,
very different meanings arc attributed to the phrase ;—" The
independence and integrity of Denmark." If, for example,
by maintaining the independence and integrity of Denmark,
you mean a union between the Kingdom and the Duchies,
subsisting merely by the personal tie of being ruled by the
same eOrareign, I for one should say that that, so far from
lacing an arrangement to secure the object in question, would
produce constant disunion and ultimate anarchy. (Hear.)
Aro we to adopt the alternative that Europe is to interfere,
and by force of arms to render the inhabitants of Holstein
and Schleswig loyal and contented subjects of the King of
Denmark ? That is a solution not consistent with the prin-
ciples of British policy, nor, to my mind, perfectly in har-
mony with the spirit of the age in which wo live, (Hear.)
Hence this is a situation which requires much explanation.
It is possible—for I wish to view the question in both lights,
in order that wo may, at this anxious moment, elicit some
information from her Majesty's Government—it is possible
that France has generously consented to attend the Con-
ferences without exacting those conditions which the French
Minister in the autumn said were a sine qua non. What
will happen then ? In my opinion, what probably will
happen will be that a great deal of time will be wasted, and
then the spring will at last arrive, 'When the spring arrives
that Power which, from our continual blundering, has
had the opportunity of assuming a position of so much
forbearance and so much moderation, and of offering,
through the Emperor, so many conciliatory messages will,
perhaps, be called upon to settle these disputes, some of
which are to be brought before this very Conference. I
cannot doubt that under the circumstances the Emperor of
the French will probably be very successful, People will
be so very tired, Governments will bo so very exhausted—
they will have appealed so often in vain to England for a
solution of these difficulties, that they naturally will turn to
one who, to use a common phrase, will find himself master
of the situation. (Hear, hear.) Ido not pretend to say
that the Emperor of the French will act in a very ferocious
manner under the circumstances. No doubt in this civi-
Heed ago France, like every other country—France, too,
particularly enlightened—will feel the advantage Jfnioderii-
tion oven in its ambition, Perhaps the revival of the Con-
federation of the Rhine, perhaps the ratification of the
long and anxiously considered question of the Saarlouis
frontier might be thought a sufficient compensation for the