The Sun.
London, England, 1864-03-01 00:00:00

money ho was to apply to the talress, 'M. Plower,
35, Thurloe-square, Brorupton,' Ile (the procureur)
had referred to the _London Commo•cial 1 .rectory
to discover the person, who was thus place 1 in !corre-
spondence with Greco. At page 670 he four I—and it was
in sorrow that ho found it—the name of a member of the
English Parliament, who already in 1S ;7 Lod been ap-
pointed by Mazzini treasurer to the Tibaldi plot, which was
concocted against the life of the Emperor." I have myself
referred to this address in the "London Directory," and I
find it is the residence of the hon, member for Halifax, and
therefore I desire to ask him whether his attention has been
called to those words ?

Mr. STANSFELD—I am much indebted to my hon.
;fried for having enabled me to answer at once this question.
My attention was directed this morning to the speech of the
Procureur-Imperial, and I must say that the astonishment
with which I read that speech was mingled with something
of a stronger feeling. It appears to me that for the Crown
prosecutor of a frienily Power to imagine in the first place,
an in the second place to venture to insinuate, that one
who has the honour of a seat in the British House of Com-
mons,
and, however unworthily, happens to occupy the po-
sition of a Minister of the Crown—that he could, directly
or indirectly, have ever participated in, or even have been
conscious of any supposed implication in, an attempt which
if serious, must excite the execration of mankind—(hear,
hear)—it appears to me that such a statement is sufficient
not only to excite in me feelings of indignation, but also of
disgust. (Hear, hear.) I trust it is quite unnecessary—in
fact, I should feel it an indignity to be called upon to do so
—to plead to such an indictment; and to declare in this
house that I share the feelings of all decent men with regard
to attempts of this kind, and as to which there can be but
one opinion. Bat if there be to me some counter-satisfaction
in the indignity of such a supposition, it is this, that I am
given the opportunity from this place to bear my testimony
to the character of a man who all who know me are aware
that I have known for some 18 years, and than whom I
have never known--I have never heard or road of—a man
who has been more mildly and more shamefully maligned.
(Hear, hear.) I speak, as I have said, from an intimate
personal knowledge of nearly 18 years, and I have yet to
learn the. that knowledge and the conviction which it pro-
daces will no!. have some effect upon the mind of the public
and upon this hoOse. (An HON. MEMBER—Name, name.)
I say as to M. Mazzin:, whose name has been associated with
this attempt, I pledge my ijlarsonal knowledge of him that ho
is absolutely incapable of havin: a hand in it. (Hear.) I
will go further. It is impossible I couloi have read the extract
which my hon. friend has laid before ts.‘".4 house, without
having occupied the time which has interval, :d since in
making some inquiries as to how such an insinuation s'
have been made. I have made inquiries, and I have satis-
fied my own mind; although I will not anticipate declara-
tions which it is the right of others to make in the first place.
Still I have satisfied my own mind that when the case comes
to be fairly tried the answer will be complete and satisfac-
tory in every respect. (Cheers.)
Mr. HENNESSY—I think it is, somewhat unfortunate
(cries of 4 Order")—l shall conclude with a motion. The
house must feel that the hon. gentleman was entitled to the
fullest latitude in all that he said with respect to himself;
but the hon. gentleman has introduced other topics not
personal to himself, which should be placed before the public
in their true colours. Reference has been made to M.
Mazzini, and I wish to say at once that in the opinion of
many hon. members it is unfortunate that the character of
that gentleman should be brought before this house without
notice, at a time when no one expected it, and is presence
of the fact that the language used by Mazzini himself,
within the last few weeks, leads every man who reads it to
believe that grave suspicion attaches to bins. 'What has
been recently written ? Greco was arrested in France for
an attempt upon the life of the Emperor, and M. Mazzini
writes to the newspapers and calls Greco an enthusiastic
patriot, and admits that he was in personal communication
with him last year. T put it to the house, is Greco an
enthusiastic:patriot ? What is the theory of those who hold
that Greco and his accomplices were the instruments of the
French police ? They allege that Greco was a spy. (Hear.)
The ban. member for Brighton (Mr. White) says yes. Yet
M. Mazzini calls this Greco an enthusiastic patriot. I will
not now enter into the question, as it is not denied by the
hon, gentleman whether M, Mazzini is living at the address
designated by the writer of the letter to Greco. I would ask
if money was collected, but I will not say for what pur-
pose.

Mr. STANSFELD—I beg the hon. gentleman's pardon,
Sir G. GREY—Wait until he has done.
Mr. HENNESSY—These are facts which have not been
denied, and which are most material to the people of this
country, namely, whether money was collected, as an hon.
friend near me suggests, under a false name. These are
matters of interest to us who are hero the representatives, I
am happy to say, of a country in friendly alliance with
France ; and if attempts of this kind are to be made—l
know it is said by the friends of this person that in truth
Mazzini never attempted to murder the Emperor of the
French, and that his sole object was to terrify him and to
keep him in terror—does anybody believe that is a defence
which this country will tolerate ? Mazzini believes the cause
he serves is to be benefited by keeping the Emperor of the
French in terror ; but, sir, in doing that he renders himself
responsible for the acts of his subordinate associates, and I
venture to think that in this country and in this house this
conduct will meet with universal reprobation. (Rear, hear.)
I beg to move the adjournment of the house.
_ _

Mr. COX—I beg-to second the motion, and Perhaps I
may be permitted to say I hardly expected my lion. friend
the member. for. Halifax would, in answer to my question,
have gone into a defence. (Hear, hear.) What I desired
to hear from my hon. friend was some explanation of the
charge made against him. (Hear, hear.) lie used expres-
sions perfectly justified by the occasion of the horror and
disgust which he and every man in this house must feel at
being charged as an accomplice in such an attempt as this.
(Item., hear.) But my hon. friend did not give me or the
house any explanation as to this Mr. Flower, who resides
at 35, Thurloe-square, Brampton, which is the result of a
search of the "London Dii.ectory" by the French Procu-
reur. But I, too, have searched the " London Directory,"
and I find that this 35, Thurloe-squaro is also the address
of my hon. friend the member for Halifax (Mr. Stansfeld).
I rise now to second this motion, for the purpose of giving
him an opportunity of explaining that, vhich seems to have
been forgotten; and I am quite sure he will be able to give
a most satisfactory reply.

Mr. STANSFELD—I hardly understood, I must say
that my hon. friend was desirous of any explanation from
me on the specific point to which ho has referred, Ho has
searched the directory, and he has been enabled to ascertain
a fact that was easily ascertained, namely, my address. My
address is 35, fhilrloe-square. As to a letter stated to have
been addressed to Mr. Flower, I understand my hon. friend
wishes to know if I have any knowledge of that letter. Now,
I have already stated in general terms—general, because I
wished them to apply to one and all the accusations—that
I have not, and never have had—and it seems almost too
great an indignity to answer such a question—the slightest
knowledge of proceedings of that kind ; and I will add—for
I think I am entitled to add—that I have not the belief in
them which some honourable gentlemen seem to entertain.
(Hear, hear.) I have been blamed by the hon. member for
King's County for having taken the opportunity of defending
the character of Mazzini. I had two reasons for the course.
The one is that my name has been implicated in this
transaction, and the other is that I think I am entitled to;
and I 'should be shrinking from the duties of private friend-
ship if I had not taken this opportunity of testifying what
is not only my conviction bitt my knowledge of his charac-
ter. (Hear, hear) What is the question ?
An HON. ME MI3Elt —Who's Flower ?
Mr. ISENNESSY—I ask whether, in truth, this M.
Flower is M. Mazzini. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. STANSFELD—I have no knowledge. I know
nothing about M. Flower. (Hear, hear.) Did the hon.
gentleman ask any questions as to the collection of money ?
I( he did, will he repeat it?

Mr. HENNESSY—I think I asked the hon. member
whether he at any time acted as treasurer or member of the
committee for the collection of any money to be distributed
among the Italian-patriots? (Cries of" Oh, oh!" "Mon-
strous!" "Nonsense," and " Don't answer.")
Mr. STANSFELD—:WeII, I will answer the house.
Undoubtedly.'

Lord C. HAMILTON—WiII the hon. gentleman answer
the question ? Is' Signor Plod a friend of the hon. gentle.
man, and is he frequently at that address ? (Cries of
" Oh.")
Mr. W. E. FOSTER—I do not rise to prolong this
discussion, but I think when it is read to-morrow, it will
be found that the information it contains is different from
that obtained by the French Procureur Imperial. I am
quite sure my hon. friend the member for Halifax has
answered all the questions that have been put to him affect-
ing himself in a manner that will be fully satisfactory to
the country. I merely rise for the purpose of saying that
the hon. member for King's County (Mr. H ennessy) stated,
as though it were an acknowledged fact and admitted by
Mazzini himself, that although he did not enter into plots
for the purpose of assassinating the Emperor of the French,
he did for the purpose of terrifying him, Now perhaps the
hon. gentleman, as ho cannot state himself, will get a friend
to state for him why ho made that assertion, and whether
Mazzini admitted it, Ido not believe Mazzini ever made
that assertion, and from the little knowledge I have of M.
Mazzini, I would take his denial as true; and my belief is
that he has nothing whatever to do with such plots for any
purpose whatever. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. Alderman ROSE—The question which the house
would like to have answered is this, has M. Mazzini ever
lived with the Yon. gentleman? (Cries of "Oh, oh,"
" Don't answer," Lend loud laughter.) It is right the house
should have that quostion answered. (Cries of "No, no.")
I am quite sure it is sunplsed that ho either lodged there or
lived some time in the house. Will the hon. gentleman
answer that ? (Cries of "Don't answer.")
A few words from Mr. W au.uts were indistinctly heard.

THE STATE OP EUROPE.
'lr. DISRAELL—As there is now a question before the
I take this opportunity of making some inquiry re-
our relations with the Continent of Europe.
(Hear.)
'r to me, since I last addressed a question to the
,n the subject, to have increased in anxiety
(Hear, hear.) I understand that her
lent have been successful, after some
,ew proposition—namely, that a Con-
v the great r mem NA tun in,

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