The Sun.
London, England, 1852-02-11 00:00:00

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tenon io tec we; e NO. ;D"tit to be talk' "r
there, and made the means of keeping up a sort of muck
Popularity—a purpose that now vies of no avail. It
Was not for Irish or independent Members to frame for
the law-officers of the Crown a Bill to meet exigencies
which they had over and over again admitted to exist.
It was said that the Hen. Member's Bill proposed to
Compel Irish landlords to l= t their lands at a fixed rate.
They who asserted this had not read the Bill and made
themselves masters of its details. The Bill really only
gave Compensation to tenants for improvements, which
tenants in England would be entitled to claim. He
:Weald ask the-House if the letting value of tee hold-
ings were increased by the tenant's capitel or exertions,
nether it was just or equitable that tenants should be
dispossessed of their holeinge without the chance (t.
!a,inieg a shilling compensation for that outlay of cep:-
:al and that exertion which had been made. It was only
in cases where the letting value was increased that
noolpeasation was to be given; and that made the Bill
identical with the Bills introduced from time to time by
Government. If irritation existed on the subject, it
was from neglect of the introduction of such a measure
aas his lion. Friend the Member for Rochdale had iutro-
nUced. The late Sir R. Peel had introduced a Bill for
that purpose, bus it did not allay discontent, because it
did not meet the evil ner go far enough. If Sir R. Peel's
Government neglected their duty in this respect, this
present Government had mere than neglected their
,duty, for they had faltered with the question—had al-
lowed it to drop to the ground, and now assailed those
Who came forward to advocate the question. Ne one
abhorred crime in Irelaud more than be did. and he ee-
'bored the law, if properly administered in Ireland, was
*efficient to repress crime. But he would tell the Noble
Lord, no law and no measure would be sufficient to re-
press crime, if everything was made a meter of party
enactment, and every person, high and low, placed in
office merely for party objects.—(Bear.) Why had not
the Right Hon. Gentleman the Secretary for Ireland
addressed the House on the subject? Why did he not
state his opinions on this question? Why did he hold
back? Why did he not manfully come forward and
state his deliberate opinions, and let the people of Ire-
land know what they had to expect from her Majesty's
Government on this subject?
Mr. BRIGHT had ne sp-cific for this difficult ques-
tion, as assumed by the Hon. Member for Middlesex.
lie had, however, given a good deal of attention to the
subject, and had spent some time in Ireland, obtaining
Practical information from all classes on the subject. He
had formed an opinion on the subject, and had endea-
voured to embody his opinion in a few clauses in a Bill
which the Noble Lord had examined. The Bill did not
Meet with the general approbation of Irish Members or
the Irish people, so he had taken no step towards intro-
ducing the Bill to the House. He was glad to see the
sill of the Hon. Member for Rochdale had been brought
forward, though for some of its clauses he could net vote.
Ile believed, however, the Bill might be made of use to
Noble Lord
during its progress through the House. The
Lord had made a very ingenious speech in order
get out of the difficulty of his position. The Bill al-
luded to by the Noble Lord formerly not having been
adopted because not sufficiently satisfactory, had met
With this misfortune because the clauses were so complex
and the machinery so complicated that no one could say
the Zpect that the Noble Lord's Bill would have been of
f slightest use fur the purpose for which it was brought
°Mud. It was no me disguising the fact that in the Ca-
elnet there were large Irish proprietors, and it was easy
to understand why large Irish proprietors should be
alarmed at a Bill such as that introduced by the Hon.
Member for Rochdale. They did not like the powers to he
I,oterfered with which a landowners' Parliament for cen-
turies had made law. The question was, were cats the
Proper legislators for mice ? The law as it stood
V.tre the landlord the power of taking possessien of all
e improvements made by tenants at the expiration of
Stheir tenancy, without giving compensation. He would
not consent to any Bill, or ciause of a Bill, which vio-
tated the principles of political economy. But the law
!•11 it stood violated those principles, and that was why
he Wished the law to be altered. Ac omparison of Scot-
land and Ireland was not to the purpose, Tor of 1,100
Witnesses the Devon Commission had examined, the
commission could only make out that about 20 landlords
eara *pant money on the improvement of their property.
they
in Ireland sprang from the same causes now as
did 70 years ago, and it was the decree of Provi-
e,
arr -
s, so long as the population of a country were de-
ed from all the interest in the soil by legal and legis-
lative chicanery, that such crimes as prevailed in Ireland
°h old be committed and exist, as a warning and a
:eon to the upholders of injustice. He should be glad
support any measure that would settle this question,
.;:r he believed there was no question which affected the
reoPle of
Of the England more intimately than the settlement
relations of landlord and tenant in Ireland.
Mr. WHITESIDE said if the Hon. Member for Man-
42ne,ster had in three weeks discovered a remedy for the
Solon
of Ireland, he had eclipsed the fame of either
Von or Lyeurgus.—(Laughter.) He confessed that it
intuitive
not the fortune of all to be blest with the power of
say that
legislation. If the Hon. Gentleman meant to
that Irish landlords generally were merciless and
"PPressors, he would, as the representative of a county in
watch_ tenant-right prevailed, repel the slander, and
:sett that landlords were merciful and considerate te-
lt:ills their tenants.—(Hear.) He admitted that the
hadto it stood, required alteration, and he would be
had "" see the law altered judiciously. HOB. Members
basked why he and other Irish Members did not
hl:g°
this? 44 a Bill on the subject? He asked, why should
kilCit -
The law was cumbrous and perplexed.
ra
was not true that the Members on his side of the
"s Use had not attempted to correct the existing evils.
The
Noble Lord sale this was a difficult subject, but
was that a reason why Government should shriek from
Aq Were they only to deal with simple and easy
Questions? Where were the law officers of the
erown? True it was that to condense a large num-
ber of statutes into a few good and practical laws
would be a work of labour and value, but not a
Popular work ; but he frankly confessed he did not
!IPect such a valuable labour from the present
Ministry. He certainly did think the Noble Lord
caught to have done something towards effecting a final
settlement of this great question. But he feared this
session, like the last, was doomed to pass away in mere
Profitless discussion. It would, however, have redounded
more to the Noble Lord's credit had he brought forward
4, practical measure, rather than, as ho had done,
raced before the House a measure of speculative re-
r°l. The great question must, however, be settled at
last,° and then, and not till then, might they expect to
_
that lamiaous measure of the Hon. Member for Man-
chester recorded in the statute hook.
Mr. AGLIONBY said the difficulty of the subject was
,!atl3l increased by the turn the discussion had taken.
and
tone imported into the debate had merged into party
geud personal attacks. The Hon. Member for Athlone's
nor
appeared to him to have in view a party triumph;
at
had the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell) by his speech
ni.` all cleared up the difficulty which surrounded the
_.air It was the duty of all who wished well to
which
country to meet together and to agree upon that
Mich would conduce to the general benefit. Let them
imitate the course of the Members for Scotland, who
met together, and by each conceding something, had
contrived to get through their public business with much
Profit to their country. He should give his best atten-
tion to the Bill, although he had no great hope of its
success,
aelfr• LENNARD thought the Hon. and Learned
"eetuber for Athlone had not put the question fairly,
When he asked whether a tenant ought not to be come egosated for improvements "Wade by him. He admitted
t if the improvements were made under the eyes and
with the consent of the landlord, the tenant would be en-
ttled to compensation. Such was the practice in this
otintry• But if he understood the principle of the Bill
eked t year, the tenant was to make what repairs he
etdeet and the question of compensation was to be de-
''ut by some tribunal. That, in his opinion, was a 0
property
of injustice—an encroachment on the rights ft
suoperty almost amounting to confiscation. He though
naiad
a Bill ought to have been resisted at its first stage;
he Government had not opposed it, he, an humble
prieAiui al, must acquiesce undue protest against the
Leave of the mea,ure.
nrP74 was then given to bring in the Bill.
'cIARITABLE BEQUESTS (IRELAND).
On thew motion of Mr. KEOGH, the following return
Xsit ordered :—Copies of the rep in of John R. Cerballis,
"eireeie bearing date the 10;h day of April, 1849 and
end t° the Commissioners for lharitable D maiions
in at Ine
th 3, Ireland, upon the pecuisiary defalcationa
the Coo department; and of all correspondence between
orealF,si
oners and the Treasury upon that subject,
and the minutes
of
the several
meetings of the Board of
Charitable
Donations and Becreste relating thereto.
Mr
RAILWAYS (IRELAND).
o
Bill • WOULLAGLI moved for leave to bring in a
IDs
to enable grand juries iu Ireland to make present_
rt.
ain aid of railways in certain cases. He believed
th
Government had no intention of opposite; the reee-
'n eat its present stage. In the course of last session a
numerous deputation of gentlemen connected with Ire-
land waited on the Noble Lord et the head of the Go-
vernment on the subject of railways, and received an as-
surance from the Noble Lord that he had no objection to
consider the question raised by them. Acts had been
obtained for a great number of lines for short distances
in Ireland, but unless some stimuluswere given, it was
difficult to say when they would be rlriikeedl oat.o
neral feeling prevailed in the districtsc be twee-
fitted by these lines, in favour of Contributingt by taxa-
tion to their completion, and the Bill which he had to
Propose would confer such a
.power. He proposed that
in certain districts the grand jury should have
th power
fixed-eon the taxis-,
levying a rate—a maximum bring
tion in counties and burghs, and that when the rate wxnae
so levied by the grand jury. it should be in the power of
the particular railway company to assign that rate to
persons who might advance the money required to be
raised. He hoped he should be able to show that
the necessary amount would he obtained without
any application to Government. Every Irish Member
was cognizant of the mode in which post roads had
been made in that country. and his object was to apply
80 much of the Act which related to these roads to the
completion of railroads. He proposed that before any
rate was made that an estimate should be obtained by the
Company which had obtained an Act of Parliament for
the making of the railroad. and that a certificate should
be obtained from the Board of Works that the estimate
!as reasonable and regular. He did not propose that
the Board should otherwise interfere in the transaction.
That certificate would be lodged with the clerk of the
Peace or the county officer, and the grand jury might then
proceed to make the rate. Instead, however, of making
the counties and
once, he proposed burghs liable for the whole sum et
that r the g and jury should have the
power of distributing
it ove-ra
also proposed that the D period of ten years Ile
number of shares to trustees representing
should transfer a certain
by which means the be protected,
the ratepayers,
while a great public interest would
l' e
untiiiia Would be given to a branch of