The Sun.
London, England, 1864-02-23 00:00:00

THE DANISH PAPERS.

Lord R. CECIL wished to ask the Under Secretary of
State for Foreign Affairs a question, to which he ought to
be accustomed by this time—how the Danish papers were
getting on ? (Laughter.) Perhaps the hon. gentleman
would give some detailed information as to the state in
which they were—whether the whole of the copy was now
in the hands of the printer, and if so, whether the hon.
gentleman was confining himself to the Foreign -office printer
or whether he was employing some of those large printers
who could turn the whole thing out with ease in thirty-six
hours. (Hear, hear.)

Mr. LAYARD said the noble lord was well aware that
Foreign-office papers were of great importance--(cheers
from the opposition)—and it was more than absurd to sug-
gest that such papers should be sent out to any other print-
ing office in the country, which might cause great damage
to the public service. The Foreign-effiee had only a limited
means of printing, and all that could be done was being done.
He hoped that by to-night or to-morrow the whole of the
copy would be finished. A large portion of it was almost
ready, but they required the last revise. They might give
an instalment of them if the house wished, but he did not
think it would be treating the house fairly to give only a
part. He hoped the whole papers:would be ready next week.
Mr. OSBORNE wished to ask whether the foreign powers
alluded to the other night had given their consent to the
production of the documents relating to Sleswig-Holstein.
Mr. LAYARD said he never stated that they required
the permission of any foreign powers, but that it was a
matter of courtesy before they published a foreign docu-
ment to ask the foreign minister whether there was any ob-
jection to the publication.
Mr. OSBORNE—Has the question been asked?
Mr. LAYARD—Of course it has.
Mr. OSBORNE—And assented to ?
Mr. LAYARD—As tar as we have gone yet.
Mr. OSBORNE wished to know if there were any other
foreign governments which they had to go to,
The question received no answer.
Sir J. WALSH wished to know whether the whole or
only a selection of the documents would be given. He un-
derstood the hon. gentleman to mean the latter.
Mr. LAYARD said the papers would be so voluminous,
greediest member would be satisfied.
that he thought the
On the motion for going into committee of supply on the
navy estimates,
Mr. DISRAELI said—l wish to make an inquiry of her
Majesty's Government as to our relations Witt', Denmark,
but I do not see the noble lord in his place, and if I pursue
the inquiry for a moment, it is because it la not the first
time when at this critical period of public affairs the noble
lord is not in his place, and I almost despair of seeing him
in his place when this information can be given to us. With
regard to the question of the noble lord (Lord R. Cecil) I do
not think the Government has acted considerately or fairly
to the Howl() of Commons in this matter. The first night
of the session I called attention to the circumstance that
no papers were presented on the all-absorbing question of
the hour, and the most important topic in the speech of the
royal commissioners, and also to the peculiar circumstance
that no paperS were even promised. The noble lord seemed
to be somewhat irritated that any comment should be made
on the subject, and the noble lord said the reason why the
papers were not noticed in the speech was that Ministers
did not wish to make the speech longer than it was. but
that it was a matter of course that the papers should Ise
produced. Well, it is a very curious thing, which we were
not aware of at that moment, that ale: oat at the same time
another account was given in another place by the noble
lord the Minister for Foreign Affairs on the same subject,
which did not agree with the explanation of the noble lord.
For when in another place some surprise was expressed at
the absence of papers, the noble lord the Secretary of State
explained the matter in this wise, He said that the negotia-
tions had unexpectedly terminated, and he gave the house
to underaland that they were negotiations which herMej esty's
Government never expected would terminate, and as they
had not terminated, no proposition had been made for the
production of the papers, (Hear, hear.) The impression
another place was that there wasno prospect of the papers
being produced. Then all that we could get from the

Under-Secretary of State was to deprecate pressure put
upon him, and to lament the great task whieh fell to his let
of having to print 600 pages ; and to-night t, e says the
quantity of papers when produced will astoni.li end satisfy
the house. In the first place, let me remind a e house that
before the Crimean war the house met on the 31st of
January, and ou the 2d of February pipers were distri-
buted and in the hands of members; and what were those
papers? They were in two parts, the one part consisting of
400 pages, and other of 378, being, in the estimation of
the Under-Secretary of State, a more considerable mass of
papers than those now to be laid before the house. In that
case also the negotiations were not finished at the time, for
it was not before the 27th of March that her Majesty
announced that the negotiations had terminated fruitlessly,
and that war was about to be declared. Take another case,
which occurred during the present parliament. What
happened after the termination of the negotiations
which preceded the Italian war? Why, the first
moment that the new parliament was formed, I presented
the papers to the house. It is true the house had no oppor-
tunity of reading them, because the Secretary for Foreign
Affairs proposed a resolution amounting to a vote of want of
confidence in the Govemment,:prineipalty on account of our
management of foreign affairs, in which he was successful.
We retired from that bench, and about a week after the
noble lord announced with great frankness that he was pur-
suing exactly the same policy. (Hear, hear.) I must say he
pursued that policyfor a brief space,'as in the last four years
he has followed entirely a line of his own. (Hear.) I con-
gratulate the noble lord in establishing a name which bears
terror to no country except his own. (Opposition cheers.)
As regards the papers, I think as far as precedent is con-
cerned and the benefit of the public service, it is clear, from
the habit of Parliament and those rules of common sense
which are still more powerful than even their own standing
rules, that this is the first occasion of equal importance
that the house has been left so entirely in ignorance of the
facts. The negotiations in this case have been going on for
weeks and months and years, just as in the case of the dis-
pute between the Latin and Greek churches. Yet in the
latter case, on the 2d February, 18.55, the papers were laid
on the table within three days of the meeting of Parliament.
We have now been sitting for several weeks in this forlorn
condition; and with a possibility of shortly meeting our
constituents, we are without the opportunity of affording
them any information on the subject. Notwithstanding
this much has happened in the interval which might have
offered an opportunity to the Government of giving most
important and interesting information to the House Of
Commons whieh might throw some light on the state of
that part of Europe. The other night an hon. gentleman
rose and asked a question on the subject of Germany and
Denmark. The noble lord answered the question inci-
dentally, and informed the house that the Government had
agreed to mediate between the contending parties, and that
there was a probability of an armistice being agreed to, and
that they made the proposition under circumstances that
were favourable. Ha intimated with delicacy, but with no
great amount of precision, that there was reason to hope
that Austria and Prussia had taken a sensible view of the
case, Let the house pause and sea the importance of this
announcement, These are Ministers who year after year
have contended in this house that it was most unwise to
propose a mediation between contending States if there was
no chance of that mediation being accepted. (Hear, hear.)
Both sides of the house must be aware of the instance to
which I allude. (Hear.) Though I do not want to intro- !
duce a name and subject that always plunges us into con-
troversy, yet we are all aware that year after year that
great maxim of statecraft has been impressed on the house
by the noble lord and his colleagues. (Hear, hear.) Well,
what is the natural inference to be drawn? If these
Ministers who will not sanction mediation between con-
tending States, except with a probability of success, have
agreed to mediate between Denmark and Germany, they
must have believed that their mediation would have been
successful. That was the natural conclusion to be drawn,
and everybody went home almost with a conviction that
there was a chance of seeing some honourable and concilia-
tory termination of these great and deplorable disasters.
(Hear, hear.) A few days after there was an authentic
rumour—at least a telegram which bore the appearance of
authenticity, to the effect that these negotiations had failed
—that her Majesty's Government attempted to mediate,
and proposed an armistice, but that the result was not
satisfactory. Still it was only a rumour. T came down to
the house to give an opportunity to the noble lord of making
those explanations which everybody in the house and
country awaited with the greatest anxiety, (Hear, hear.)
Everybody had agreed that a minister and a prime minister
who had made that communication to the house on Friday
with these rumours appreciated and credited in every part
of the metropolis, would follow it up as it was his duty to
do, and come forward in his place and enlighten and guide
public opinion ; but the noble lord was not here. I appealed
to his colleagues; I asked her Majesty's Government. I
asked every member of the Cabinet, who on such a subject
one wouldsimagine should be sufficiently well informed and
impressed with a sense of their common responsibility, and
would only have been too ready to satisfy the natural
desire of the house and of the nation. There was intense
silence. Attlast the Under Secretary of zitate, who appears
to; do all the work of the Government, rose with becoming
mocle,ty—(laughter)—and asked permission to announce to
the house that her Majesty's Government had made
another diplomatic failure. (Cheers and laughter.)
All the information we received was merely limited
to that result. The house did not want to be as-
sured of the want of success of the Government, or of
the disappointment they and the country necessarily le't.
But they wanted that something like light should be
thrown upon the question. They wanted to know the
reasons which had induced the Prime Minister, who is so
opposed to mediation unless there is a great probability of
success, and who would not have ventured to suggest an
armistice unless previously assured that it would be assented
to, to lead the house to believe that one of the invading
powers at that moment was apparently animated by more
conciliatory sentiments than she had been given credit for,
One would have thought that the noble lord would have
made it a matter of special public duty to have come for-
ward and enter into these explanations. But the noble
lord was not here, and what followed ? Some nights
after that an hon. gentleman asked another question upon
the subject of Denmark and Germany, with respect to
which the House of Commons are, I believe, the least in-
formed of any body of men in Europe. (Hear.) The noble
lord, replying to the inquiry whether Jutland had been in-
vaded, made an auswer in that vein, which in the older
times used to betalled " King Cambyses' vein"—(laughter)
but which of late has become peculiarly the property of the
noble lord, and certainly the noble lord uttered some words
which in old times would have alarmed Europe and ani-
mated the House of Commons ; but in the present instance
they were received with. that depression and despondency
which usually now accompany such expressions on the
part of the noble lord, because experience has proved to us
that they generally tend to the humiliation of our country.
(Cheers and expressions of dissent.) Well, sir, there was a
pang of anguish throughout the country when they heard
that Jutland was invaded. (Hear, hear.) Everbody felt
that that was too much. (Hear, hear.) Everybody said
that was the last drop. It was said only yesterday—there
was an authentic rumour—l credited it myself—that the
Prussians had repented of their conduct and had relin-
quished the position which they had taken up in Jutland.
They found that they had made a mistake. They say so.
That is the report—that the Prussians found that they had
made a mistake in going into Jutland ; as if they had not
made a great many mistakes in invasions before, and that
they had retreated from that country—from Denmark at
least. I believe they had not heard the noble lord s words
at the time—probably if they:had they would have remained
there. (Opposition cheers.) But, sir,Monday comes, after an
anxious Sunday ; Monday comes, and we naturally wish to
know if there is any truth in t he account which has reached
us that the Prussians have retreated from the ill advised
position which they had taken. Because, after all, the
chances of a general war must very much depend upon in-
cidents of that kind. The noble lord is again absent, and
again we are without any one to guide us upon this sub-
ject. It is not therefore merely with regard to these papers
as to which I shall always maintain that the House of Com-
mons has been most scurvily treated—(hear, hear)—but
also with respect to these repeated instances where infor-
mation might have been given, and ought to have been
given to us, that the House of Commons is treated with
carelessness and disrespect. What I want to know from
her Majesty's Ministers, and I hope I shall get an answer,
although the noble lord does not present himself, is on what
ground did they rest the hope that the offer of mediation
would have been accepted by the contending parties—by
which of the contending parties was it refused—was it re-
fused by the Danes or by the Germans ?—was it refused by
both of the invading Powers ? These are all questions of
the utmost interest and importance, and we have a right to
information with respect to them from her Majesty's Go-
vernment. (Hear, hear.) On what ground did the noble
lord think that Austria was about to adopt a rational and
conciliatory course towards Europe ? Is it or is it not true
that Prussia invaded Jutland, and then retreated from the
position which she had assumed ? We want light, we want
knowledge on these subjects from her Majesty's Ministers.
It is our duty to make these inquiries. It is our right to
receive this information. (Loud cheers.) Is the House of
Commons to go on in this way upon a subject which now
engrosses all the interest and passion of Europe—a subject
with respect to which men upon the Royal Exchange are
talking as much as upon all other matters, for their business
entirely depends upon the course of public policy in these
matters ? I say that the place where the most information
should prevail—the most authentic information—is the
House of Commons, and yet that is the place where we can
obtain least information, and least authentic information.
(Cheers.) I ask the house to consider their position—how
much it touches their honour in the country. Suppose you
were sent to your constituents to-morrow—l put that in-
quiry before you because there are frequent rumours that
such an event is not far distant—(bear, hear)—how would
you meet your constituents ? Suppose a man in the crowd
says, " How about Denmark?,, (Cheers and laughter.) I
want to put it to the house—not merely gentlemen on this
side, but the house generally—in their right position. It
may be a matter of perfect indifference to her Majesty's Go-
vernment that they are the derision of every court in Europe
—(cheers and counter cheers)—but we do not want to be
the laughing stock of our constituents, and therefore we
must make en effort to put an end to this highly unsatisfac-

tory state of affairs. We meet take some means by which we
can have authentic Information before us, by which these
papers may be placed upon the table, and we must obtain
some explanation of the negotiations which her Majesty's
Government have commenced and conducted unsuccess-
fully without any communication to Parliament, and which
must unquestionably, in their character and conduct, greatly
affect the course of future events. (Loud Opposition cheers.)
The CHANCELLOR, of the EXCHEQUER—Sir, I do
not know whether the right hon. gentleman judges well in
the tone in which he refers to the absence of my noble
friend from the house. (Cheers.) Because most certainly
if there has been any man who ever occupied the dignified
position of my noble friend in the annals of this country
who has been most unsparing in the sacrifice of his own
comfort—(renewed cheers)—even to the serious risk of his
health—being ready at all times to place himself on this
bench whenever he could serve the country—that man is
my noble friend. (Cheers.) It may perhaps occur to the
impartial auditors of the speech of the right hon. gentleman
that it is a matter of some difficulty to know what the ob-
ject of that speech was. The right hon. gentleman—a mas-
ter of political fireworks—had no difficulty in producing at
a moment's notice any amount of display—(laughter)—but
these are matters of grave consideration—(Opposition
cheers, and counter cheers)—and those who speak like my
noble friend at the head of the Government, and like my
hon. friend the able representative of the Foreign Depart-
ment in this house, are bound to consider that their busi
ness is not so much to imagine how they can say smart
things for the satisfaction of those who sit behind them
(cries of "Oh" from the Opposition benches)—as how they
can hold the language which is most compatible with the
dignity of the country, and least calculated to compromise
it in the eyes of foreign nations in periods of difficulty.
(Cheers, and counter cheers.) I therefore entirely renounce
all efforts to follow the right hon. gentleman in his brilliant
career ; but endeavouring to extract from the speech of the
right hon. gentleman the few practical matters to which it
refers, I would reply to them as follows. The real substra-
tum of that speech appears to be the non-production of
papers—that the papers relative to Danish affairs were not
ready for production at the opening of Parliament. That
was explained by my noble friend in another place, and
the fact that these papers were not ready for production
was accounted for by a reference to the undoubted and
uniform rules of Parliament, with regard to negotiations
which have not reached any settlement, and at the same
time my noble friend at the head of the Government,
and my hon. friend near me (Mr. Layard), express
their regret at the inconvenience which had occurred,
made a promise, which every effort has been used to
fulfil, that the preparation of these papers should bo
accelerated by the employment of all the labour and re-
sources at the command of the Foreign-office. Well, be-
yond that expression of regret, and beyond that promise, I
do not know what it was in their power to do. The right
hon. gentleman referred to the cases of papers relating to
negotiations preceding the Crimean war, but he referred to a
case hardly relevant to the issue. In the interesting and
difficult question connected with the present unhappy colli-
sion between Germany and Denmark—or rather the pre-
sent unhappy aggression of Austria and Prussia upon Den-
mark—(hear, hear)—Great Britain has been a friendly by-
stander. In the negotiation preceding the Crimean war
Great Britain was a principal, and one of the two Great
Powers engaged in carrying that matter to an issue, which
ended in hostilities upon a gigantic scale. The right hon.
gentleman says that my noble friend assumed the charac-
ter of a mediator, and stated that in that character he had
made the suggestion of an armistice between the contend-
ing parties. It is quite true that, encouraged by various
considerations, that suggestion of an armistice was made;
but it is not true that that suggestion was made in the cha-
racter of a mediator. It was necessary to give effect—l will
not say to the arguments, but to the taunts of the right
gon. gentleman—that he should invent that circumstance
in order to give point to his remarks, because it enabled him
to say that that which was done in the character of media-
tor must have been done with the expectation of suceess.
And now, said the right hon. gentleman, I will point out
how it has not succeeded. Now, the fact is, that the sug•
gestion was not made in the character of mediator ; it was
a mere suggestion entitled to attention; it was done in a
friendly spirit; it was done in co-operation with other
Powers animated by a like spirit ; and whether a proposal,
judicious in itself, of that nature is accepted by the con-
tending parties or is not, my belief is that it will be appre-
ciated by the country. (Cheers.) The right hon. gentleman
complains that her Majesty's Government have not given
information upon, doubtless, the very interesting and im-
portant question whether the Prussien forces have or have
not evacuated Jutland. The simple reason they have not
given that information is that they do not happen to possess
it. (Hear, hear.) The right hon. gentleman is, I will not
say terribly behind the age, but he seems to forget the fun-
damental difference which has been made by the introduc•
tion of the telegraph, and that the information conveyed
by that measure is not always correct, and is sometimes al-
together erroneous. But still information of a most interest-
character on many important subjects is conveyed to the
public—the chance-readers of newspapers—before it is in
the hands of the Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary.
Her Majesty's Government have received communications
with respect to the evacuation of Jutland, but they have not
been of a character so clear and conclusive as to justify them
in saying anything about them to the house, and I think
that her Majesty's Government would be grossly departing
from their duty if in their anxiety to convey to the house
the earliest intelligence they were careless of the full cor-
rectness of the information they had to give. (Cheers.)

Lord R. CECIL urged that the holm was entitled to
know howfar the honour of England had been compromised.

Mr. B. OSBORNE—It occurs to me that that intelli•
gent foreigner who is sometimes supposed to sit under the
gallery of this house, on the present occasion would be
much puzzled to discover that this is the British House of
Commons. For it would seem to him, as to a great number
of the people of this country, that a more docile set of in-
struments never sat upon these benches. Why, what are
we about to do at the present minute ? War is raging in the
north of Europe; men are losing their lives by thousands;
and our Government has explained itself to-night, or rather
it has not explained itself to •night. For though the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer taunted the right hon. gentleman
opposite with being a master of fireworks, still his fire-
works left some light. (Hear, and laughter.) But the right
hon. gentleman, answering fur the Government, succeeded
in doing a thing which I thought almost impossible, namely,
in making more confused the Schleswig. Holstein question
—(laughter)—for whether at this instant we are media-
tors for Denmark, or friendly bystanders between the
two parties, I defy any man to understand. (Hear,
hear.) What is the position of this house? War
is raging in America, war is raging in Denmark, and there
is a report that Denmark proper has been attacked by
Prussia—and how is the House of Commons treated ? What
information have we as to the policy of the Government—
as to their past policy or their present intentions ? (Cheers.)
Why, there is not a single paper of any importance upon
the table. (Hear, hear.) If It is true that time is of the
greatest importance to Denmark, it would seem to be no
less true that time is of the greatest importance to her Ma-
jesty's Ministers—(hear, hear)--and that they are deter-
mined not to give us the information we want, but to wait
for the chapter of accidents—possibly, as was said by Sir
Abel Handy, "until the fire goes out of itself." (Laughter
and cheers.) That is the position of the Government. And
what is the position of the House ? Here we come sweating
to our places day by day, having nothing to do when we are
in our places on the home policy, but asking questions on
the foreign policy of this country ; and the house has never
yet had an answer what that foreign policy was. 'We have
no sort of information, even while our friendly allies are
being butchered, and we standing by as cold bystanders,
taxing no measures, as far as the House of Commons knows;
the First Minister of the Crown using language of intimi-
dation and menace; so that this country is reduced to a
position that in every foreign print shop an Englishman is
represented as an object of ridicule; and yet Government
comes down complacently—at least, I dare say in a few
minutes the noble lord the Secretary of the Admiralty
will come down, and move a vote for a reduction of the
naval estimates ; while, if there be any truth in the ap-
pearance of things, or any ground for the threats of the
Prime Minister, we ought at least to be preparing for a
continental war. Well, Sir, I say if this be a House of
Commons with common spirit, do not let us be satisfied
with merely getting up aad using language--as the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer very properly says, " throwing
up a few harmless fireworks "—but let us have a vote,
Now, Sir, I feel so strongly the humiliating position in
which this house is placed—(hear)—that, if I meet with
any encouragement, I will now move a vote which will
prove whether these are harmless fireworks which aro being
let of, and will clear up the fog which hangs on the Trea-
sury bench. (Opposition cheers.) I say, sir, that we have
no business to vote these navy estimates with a reduction of
5,000 men and boys. We have no business to come to the
consideration of this vital subject until we know the posi-
tion of the country with regard to Germany and Denmark.
(Opposition cheers.) Therefore, if I meet with any common
support—unless my hon. friend the President of the Board
of Trade will get up and give some explanation of the
Schleswig-Holstein question—(laughter)—which he is said
to be so peculiarly master of--(laugnter)—unless that hap-
pens, I shall move that these navy estimates be postponed
until the papers relating to Schleswig-Holstein and Ger-
many be laid on the table of the house. I move that these
estimates be postponed to this day three weeks.
Sir J. HAY seconded the motion.

If this question were earried, it was quite clear to the house
and the country that the Rouse of Commons had no further
confidence in the Government of the country as regarded
its foreign policy. As far as he himself was concerned, that
was his opinion ; and many gentlemen in that house were
of the same opinion, and if they had courage in their hearts
they would vote in favour of the motion of the hon. gentle-
man opposite. (Hear, hear.)

Mr. GLADSTONE—If there be any fog near to my hon.
friend (Mr. Osborne), or anywhere else, it is desirable that
it should be dispelled before the house gives a vote. The
construction which has been put upon that vote by the hon.
and learned member for Sheffield I am not prepared to say
is an untrue construction. It is certainly a fundamental,
though an ordinary, part of the business of the country
that is standing for discussion to-night, merely that we
should go into a committee of supply to consider the navy
estimates. My hon. friend has taken a step perhaps the
strongest any gentleman could take by a directly hostile
motion against the Government, without any notice what-
ever—(loud cheers from both sides of the house)—and my
hon. friend who rallies us on our state of darkness appears
to me to be hardly in the clearer condition of understanding
himself, when on a sudden he undercook to propose this
motion, because, Sir, there are no new facts before the house.
(Ironical cheers from the Opposition) The position in which
my hon. friend now finds himself is this, that the papers
relating to Danish negotiations have not been produced.
That is a fact which was perfectly within the knowledge of
my hon. friend at the time when the notice was given that
her Majesty's Government to-night would propose to pro-
ceed with the ordinary business of the country. He has
thought fit to challenge that course of proceeding. Perhaps
my hon. friend may say—(divide)--that he wishes to declare
his want of confidence in the foreign policy of the Govern-
ment, and my hon. friend the member for Sheffield, with
perfect frankness and fairness, has placed his motion on
that ground. But, to return to ray point, it was due to my
hon. friend himself, it was due to her Majesty's Government,
that if a motion was to be taken and vote taken impeaching
the foreign policy of the Government,and declaring a want
of confidence in that foreign policy on the part of this
house, notice should have been given. (Cheers) There-
fore, when I meet the taunts of my hon, friend about the
state of darkness in which Ministers are placed by express-
ing a doubt that his own mind is not in the clearest state,
it is because I think that his proposal is not consistent with
the rules of. Parliament ; and if he entertains that intention,
he ought to allow the members of the House of Commons
to be aware of it. And if my hon. friend is disposed to give
notice of such a motion, or if my hon, and learned friend
opposite feels that disposition, I can only say that no per-
sons will be more ready to join issue on that subject than
those who compose her Majesty's Government. (Cheers.)
Mr. OSBORNE, rising to explain, said—lt is totally
impossible for me, or any other gentleman in this house, to
know what the foreign policy of the Government is, until
these papers are presented. (Cries of "Divide" and
" Order.")

Mr. DISRAELI—The house is placed in a position of a
critical kind. (A. laugh.) Although the hon. gentleman
opposite may think it extremely amusing, I doubt whether
those whom he sits next to are of that temperament or vein.
I never concealed, especially of late, my opinion of the
foreign policy of her Majesty's Government, and I should
never be afraid, if any issue were placed before us,of giving
my opinion and acting on that opinion by vote—but I cer-
tainly do think it is of the greateac importance that, what-
ever may be the result, the Government should not say that
the decision was arrived at by a surprise. (Hear, hear.) It
seems to me of the utmost importance that there should be
fair notice of the intention of the house, and that a verdict
should not be taken at this time, especially in the absence
of the head of the Government. (Cheers.) It is perfectly
open for the hen, and gallant member and the hon. and
learned member for Sheffield to give notice of any motion
they like. Tbey act quite independently of myself and
my friends, and if they do not give notice of any
motion I cannot doubt, in the present state of Europe,
that an opportunity will be afforded to the house of
Commons, unless they relinquish all their rights and obli-
gations of expressing an opinion, and that soon, on the
foreign policy of the Government. I cannot conceive that
this opportunity will not be afforded. Papers are laid on
the table ou all matters under negotiation, and they form
the ease of the Government; and it is to the advantage of
the Government that those papers which are produced
should be placed upon the table of this house. Certainly,
this year we have been placed in a position in which we
have never been placed before. (Hear, hear.) We are
deprived of papers which should have been before the house,
and therefore I am not surprised at the temper and dispo-
sition of the house under such circumstances ; and after to-
night the Government must feel that it is absolutely neces-
sary, in order to meet the difficulties of this case, no longer
to offer apologies, which have been ad nauseam administered
to the house. I cannot doubt that the papers will be on the
table of the house soon. When they are on the table, it
seems improbable that the house can refrain from giving a
verdict one way or the other on those papers. Ido entreat
the house calmly to consider its position. It is possible that
an advantage might be gained over the Government; but,
assuming that, will it be satisfactory to us to-morrow to
find that a verdict against the Government has been so
gained on their foreign policy without any notice, and in the
absence of the chief Minister of the Crown ? (Cheers.) I
hope soon to see the chief 3linister of the Crown amongst
us. The right hon. gentleman:the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer seemed to intimate what was the cause of the
absence of the noble lord ; but it has not reached me
through the usual means of social information that the
absence of the noble lord was caused by indisposition.
Sir G. GREY—That is so.

Mr. DISRAELI—I very much regret it, because, under
all the circumstances, the presence of the noble lord is a
source of great satisfaction ; but it would have been easy
to have intimated that to the house; and I say this as an
additional reason why the house should not come to a deci-
sion upon that vote which would be accepted by the Go-
vernment, as a verdict upon their foreign policy. I condemn
that policy:not merely as relates to Denmark and Germany
only, but I think it a deplorable and disastrous policy,
which has reduced the influence and lowered the dignity of
this country, But the House of Commons should come to
this conclusion after ample discussion, after an appeal to
sufficient documents, and after all those matters which give
solemnity and force to a decision, and which would give
solemnity and force to their verdict. That verdict ought
not to be obtained by surprise, without discussion, which it
seems the present disposition of the house would do; and
therefore I do trust the hon. and gallant member, who, I
think in a very spirited manner—(laughter)—made this
proposition, will upon reflection feel that it will not be with-
out benefit to the conduct of public business to withdraw his
motion; but if he persists, he will really prevent that very
result he most desires, namely, that the foreign policy of
the Government should be fairly considered, deliberated,
and decided. (Cheers.)
Sir G. GREY said no one more than the Government de.
sired that the deliberate opinion of the House of Commons—
and through the House of Commons the country—should be
expressed on the foreign policy of the Government. He
entirely concurred with the right hon. gentleman, that to
come to a vote on that question, when the hon. gentleman
said he did not know what that policy was, was a proceed-
ing unworthy of the House of Commons. His hon. friend
had said the Danish papers would be laid on the table at
the earliest possible moment, and then he hoped the hon.
gentleman (Mr. Osborne) would give notice of a motion on
the foreign policy of the Government. With regard to his
noble friend at the head of the Government, he had called
on him that morning and found him suffering from a cold
—which was hardly surprising, considering the state of the
weather—and a slight attack of gout ; and the noble lord told
him that, subject to the opinion of his physician, ho intended
to be in the House of Commons that night, and ho hoped he
would be shortly there. (Hear, hear.)

Mr. CLAY and Mr. KINGLAKE insisted that the motion
of Mr. Osborne was not intended to pledge the house to an
opinion as to the foreign policy of the Government, since it
was matter of complaint that the house know nothing of
that policy.
The discussion was continued by Lord R. Montagu, Lord
Dunkellin, Lord Ingestre, Mr, Walter, Mr, Neate, Mr.
Laird, and other members.

The House then divided, when the right hon, genVeman
the member for Bucks and a large number of the Conserva-
tive members left the house, to avoid votiog. The numbers

WOll3--0

Sir F. SMITH thought it was quite necessary that a post-
ponement should take place, on the ground that sufficient
time had not been given to examine those estimates and the
three volumes which had accompanied them. (Cries of
" Divide.")

For Mr. Osborno's motion
Against it
..
Majority -163
THE MALTA DOCK.

Captain TALBOT, who had given notice of a motion
(which ho was precluded from making by a point of form),
—" That the project of constructing a dock at the head of
the Marsa at Malta be abandoned, and that the site at the
head of the French Creek, recommended by Admiral Sir
William Martin and Vice-Admiral Codrington, be selected
for that purpose,"—called the attention of the house to the
subject, complainkg of the conduct of the Admiralty in
the matter, and fortifying his complaint by a great variety
of derails, showing the disadvantages of the Mersa, and the
advantages of the French Creek.

Lord C. PAGET, after defending himself against charges
of misstatement brought aganst him by Captain Talbot,
and justifying the course taken by the Admiralty, ob-
served that this was not the proper time to discuss the
question, an engineer having been sent out, and till his re-
port was received he asked the house to delay the expres-
sion of its opinion.

Sir J. PAKINGTON thought that this was a time to
discuss the question ; they wanted no more reports of
engineers, and ho hoped the opinion of the house would be
taken upon it before more money was thrown away.
After some observations and statements by Mr. C. For-
tescue, Captain Jervis, Sir J. Hay. Mr. Whitbread, and
Mr. Addington, the subject dropped.
Mr. LINDSAY called attenZion to the report of the
Commissioners appointed in 1863 to inquire into the con-
trol and management of her Majesty's naval yards, with
the view of suggesting that the recommendations of the
Commissioners ought to be carried into effect. He read
soma of the recommendations of the:Royal Conomiosioners,
and asked what had been done to carry them out, and if
nothing had been done, he asked the reason why.
Mr. BENTINCK said all the recommendations of the
Commissioners might be included in one—an alteration in

Lord C, PAGET said that exactly the same course was
taken with regard to tho naval estimates this year as last
year, and that members had had the same time to consider
the question.
Mr. ROEBUCK did not wish the house to be misled.
The question was whether they were to know anything
about Denmark. (Hear.) It was not only the naval esti-
mates ; it was the Government—(hear)—and if they were
put in a minority on the present occasion they all distinctly
understood what would be the necessary consequence thereof.
(Laughter.)
Mr. OSBORNE—Nothing at all.
Mr. ROEBUCK—That was the understanding clearly.

THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 23, 1864.

the constitution of the Admiralty, which he regarded as a
political jobbing office.
Sir F. SMITH, in a discursive speech, brought under
notice a variety of topics connected with naval expenditure,
ship-armour, and artillery, concluding by an inquiry on
what grounds the Admiralty had declined to apply to Par-
liament for a grant of money in aid of the erection of a
church and schools at Brompton.
Mr. FERRAND narrated incidents in Devonport in
support of a charge against the W big Boards of Admiralty,
of political tyranny exercised over elections in the dock-
yards. To substantiate his charge he read extracts from
the evidence taken by the Royal Commissioners, and com-
mented at much length upon the facts disclosed in his evi-
dence, mingling with his comments strong censure upon
individuals.

After a few words from Mr, DA.LGLISEI, the house went
into a committee of supplypro forma.
The LORD ADVOCATE obtained leave to bring in a
bill to make provision for uniformity of process in summary
criminal prosecutions, and prosecutions for penalties in the
inferior courts in Scotland; and a bill to provide for the
alteration of the circuits of the Court of Justiciary in Scot-
land, and for holding additional Circuit Courts.
The house adjourned at half-past 10 o'clock,

The Exhumation of the Body of a Gentlemn
at Stoke Newington,

Last evening Mr. Humphreys, the Middlesex
coroner, resumed and concluded the inquest upon the
body of Mr. Joseph Hankin, aged 64 years, at the
Rochester Castle, Stoke Newington.
Mr. Beard appeared on behalf of the Read family,
and Inspector Lsngdon watched the case for the
commissioners of police. The court was crowded.
The deceased was a retired builder, living with a
Mrs. Read, at No. 2, Union-court, Newington. He
died suddenly on the 26th November last. He was
placed in a coffin on the 27th, and he was buried on
the 28th. The doctor who gave the certificate had
not seen him for a fortnight previously. After the
death his relatives were told by Mrs. Read that he
had no money. The relatives knew that he had
been possessed of £5OO, but nevertheless they could
only find £l4, and they had to make a shirt to
him to be buried in. Subsequently it was ascer-
tained that notes to a large amount had been
changed by the Reads at the Bank, both before and
after deceased's death. Other circumstances also
conspiring to render the case one of strong suspicion,
the body was exhumed a fortnight ago, and then it
was found that the deceased had no shirt on, but
was naked in the coffin, with the exception of a bit
of calico laid on his chest.
Upon the resumption of the case,

Mrs. Maria Read was called and sworn—She said
that the deceased had lodged and boarded with her
for about 13 months. He paid her 12s. a week.
She did not expect his death, but he was ill. She
had not denied him to the district visitor or the
clergyman, but he did not like to be seen. He used
to stay in bed a good deal. He was buried within
two days merely because Mrs Vickers, his relative,
suggested it, and witness had to pay for her son's
lodging out of the house while the body lay there.
Tee Coroner—A shirt was put on him for burial
but none was found when the body was exhumed ?
Witness said she did not know what became of
it.

Coroner—Did you possess yourself of deceased's
money ?
Witness—Mr. Hankin gave me acme prior to
his death.
Coroner—How much ?

Witness, by desire of Mr. Beard, declined to say ;
but she admitted that in July she had changed a
note for £2OO at the Bank of England. She also
said that herself and son had since then changed
other notes to the amount in all of £390. They
were all given to herself and her family by
deceased. She told Mrs. Vickers that deceased
had no money, but that was because the deceased
directed her to do so.
Miss Ada Sewell, district visitor, and the Rev.
Mr. Jackson, proved calling to see the deceased, and
not being permitted to de so. Miss Sewell sent him-
relief at the request of Mrs. Read for wine, &e.
Dr. H. Letheby made a careful analysis of the
contents of the stomach of deceased, but found no
poison. There was great emaciation, and death
apparently arose from want of nourishment. In
the absence of poison, he thought death arose from
congestion of the lungs from want of clothi➢g and
warmth and fend.
The Coroner having summed up,

The Jury returned a verdict—" That deceased
died on the 26th of November from congestion of
the lungs, accelerated by want of proper nourish-
ment and by privations, and the jury are of opinion
that the conduct of the Reads has been most unsa-
tisfactory throughout."