The Sun.
London, England, 1852-11-12 00:00:00

TILE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, NOTEMBER 12, 1852.

the agricultural and manufacturing labourers, more
especially of the manufacturing labourers, is to
be attributed to that legislation, combined with
other causes. which has given to them the advantage of
cheap and abundant food, and which, at the same time,
other circumstances have prevented from being accom-
panied by those concomitant evils which we undoubtedly !
apprehended. If your Lordships ask me what are those
other circumstances to which I refer as having newra-
lized the injurious effects of, while permitting to come
into full operation the advantages to he derived from,
that system of policy which made the provisions of the
people cheap and abundant, I do not hesitate to say that
I concur in a great measure in what fell from my Noble
Friend behind me, and in thinking that two causes have
had a material effect on the result, viz., the extensive
discoveries and production of gold in different parts of
the world ; and the emigration which, partly arising
from those discoveries of gold, and from other induce-
ments, has taken place to an enormous extent, and to a
still increasing extent, in the course of the last two
years. (Cheers.) But it certainly was an apprehension
which I entertained, and which I am happy to find from
various causes has not been realized, but which was until
very lately entertained by a great body of those who are
acting with me—that a fall in the price of provisions,
other things being as they were, would lead to
a corresponding, or to a more than corresponding,
reduction in the rate of wages. I think that is
a proposition which may be theoretically made clear,
and which, bat for the circumstances to which I am al-
luding, might perhaps have been practically proved to
demonstration. (Hear, hear.) And here 1 may say—
though I may have read an erroneous report—that I
read with considerable surprise a statement attributed
the other day to a Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Macaulay)
whom I rejoice to find in a such a state of health as to
be enabled again to devote his talents to public life, and
in whose brilliant capacity I think the New House of
Commons will have made a great acquisition. The
statement of which I speak is in a speech, the eloquence
of which I greatly admired, although a considerable
portion of that speech was directed, and in a manner
hardly worthy the Right Hen. Gentleman's talents, against
myself, and against those with whom I act ; and
I must say that if that speech is correctly reported,
I am compelled to give the Right Hon. Gentleman
greater credit for the brilliance of his oratory than for the
soundness of his judgment. [The Noble Earl here pro-
ceded to reply to,Mr.Macaulay's argument, that inasmuch
as wages were high in Ohio, and yet provisions were
cheap, the Protectionist theory was erroneous, by say-
ing that between a thinly inhabited and virgin soil
country like that of Ohio, and a thickly populat€d highly
farmed country like England, there could be no rational
comparison, England (added the noble earl) could only
be compared with England herself, and in the past cir-
cumstances of England would be found facts sufficient
to justify the former apprehensions of the protectionist
party. He then returned to his general argument.] The
circumstances of the country, then, have been widely
altered by the two important causes, I have enumerated.
In the first place, the large production, and the increas-
ing production, of gold must not only have its effects to
a certain extent on the money prices of all articles of
commerce, but by making money cheap and abundant
and consequently the rate of interest low, it enables the
employers of labour to make exertions they otherwise
could not have made, and so to furnish an amount of
employment which throws the balance in favour of
labour, by diminishing the apparent number, of the com-
petitors for employment. But beyond, and independent
of this, you must look to the emigration which has been
going on during these last two years. I hold in my
hand a return of that emigration, and I find that, taking
England and Ireland together, there have emigrated from
this country in 1850, 220,000 persons ; in 1851, 273,000
persons ; and in 1852, 30.5,000 persons—making a total
in three years of 830,000 persons, most of them, be
it remembered, being in the prime of life, end all
of them being competitors in the labour market. Don't
suppose that this emigration has taken place exclusively
from Ireland, I will show that it has not. Of
course Liverpool must to a certain extent he left out
of this calculation ; for though the returns include it
s an English port, nine-tenths of the emigration pro-
ceeding tnence is Irish. But assuming that of the emi-
grants sailing from Liverpool, only one-tenth are Bog
fish, that is, 18.000 out of 187,000 persons, we find that
there has emigrated from England alone in the list year
a body of 80,000 persons. It is impossible, then, but
teat these two circumstances combined, tho large amount
of gold discovered, making money cheap, and rendering
the means of employment easy—and, on the other hand,
the concurrent diminution of the number of competitors
in the home labour market—must have had the effect of
keeping up the rate of wages of the labouring classes,
and thereby so altering the state of affairs contemplated
in all parties' calculations as in a great degree to pre-
vent the occurrence of those evils which, but for those
mitigating circumstances, would have attended the fall
in the prices of provisions. (Cheers.) But, my Lords,
in reviewing the results of the new system of commer-
cial policy, working, as it does, more advantageously for
the working classes than we had anticipated. I am bound
to look, not so much to the causes, but to the practical
results themselves—to the facts as I find them, produced
as those facts have been by a variety of causes, some of
which were never calculated on by any party. (Cheers.)
And I am bound to look also to the deliberate expres-
sion of the opinions and of the feelings of the country.
(Cheers.) When at tho early part of the last Session
of the last Parliament I had, most unexpectedly, the hon-
our of addressing your Lordscipa from the place (the
Ministerial benches.) I now stand at, I stated that it
would be my desire to be enabled to conduct the busi-
ness of the country through the Session then in progress
without any reference to those important questions upon
which a difference of opinion prevailed with regard to
legislation—that that must be a point referred to the
deliberate consideration of the country, as it would be
tested by the results of the general election—that by
the results of that general election I and my col-
leagues were prepared to abide—and that we should
abstain, unless we should then have the full sanction and
support of a large majority of the country, from propos-
ing even those measures which we ourselves in our pri-
vate judgment might deem the most advantageous for
the empire. My Lords, that appeal to the country has
been made; and I have no hesitation in saying to your
Lordships that, with regard to any imposition of any
duty on corn, or on other provisions of first necessity,
not only is there not that large majority, without which
I declared I would submit no such proposition to the
consideration of Parliament; but that the country, by a
very largo and very undoubted majority, including a
very considerable number of the representatives of agri-
cultural districts themselves, have declared that whether
desirable or not it might have been as a matter of policy,
yet that in the present state of the country they are de-
termined not to go back from that system of legislation
which has been established, and that they will not con-
sent to the imposition of any tax on the introduction of
articles of provision. (Loud cheers.) My Lords, I
think that question carries with it the whole financial
hp oa
vl y
called,a do the
oaf
fpurtdoe
mlt
oct
that
euanast
have made
I system;
serotmeacadoet: mtfbrhuicegtesheit have
t trade,pisa
rt
oac been
tsupl
iatorsi
sspossible
iarticles
commonly
possible tto lex-
ceptionse
down a system of policy by which you would have free
trade in corn and provisions, and by which you would not
st follow
moneta ttlhd
as bft ea
xl understandte
for
od r bltyhfi com-
htpoeuunmrdpoeoars
txouht that a other
ecat
srs
of
opahunrri anw,hs,
il"free
possibleeaeiin necessitiesttnotintended
nai impose
eehpd same system with regard
thi this—that
e
of the protection of individual or local interests;
that you c ill impose a tax for the purpose of revenue
and for revenue only; and that in the imposition
of taxes for revenue you will have especial reference to
.lightening the burdens which may be impsed on these
articles which mainly enter into the consumption of the
great mass of the people. (Loud cheers.) Now, my
Lords, in that system I see much advantage; but I do
not deny that I see much difficulty and future embar-
rassment. I see great present advantages; but I am
not sure—and God grant that I may be wrong—that
that system may not lead to future embarrassment, by
the necessary consequences of the complete change in
our whole financial system. But I do not hesitate to
say that after the opinion which has been pronounced
by the people, whatever may be the views of myself and
of my friends as to what would have been a desirable
policy, I see that a concurrence of the majority in such
a policy is in itself impracticable; and tha?, if it were
practicable, it would still be undesirable to raise such a
question for controversy among largo classes of the
people. (Loud cheers) On the part, then, of myself
and of my colleagues, I say that I bow to the decision of
(Loud cheers.) iA,.(I h.viug so bowed, 1
declare, on their part and on mine, that—while desirous
to the utmost of our power to mitigate that inevitable
injury which the adoption of the free-trade policy has
indicted on important classes—l do not adopt that po-
licy with any reserve whatever. I adopt it frankly es
the decision of the country, and honestly and fairly I
am prepared to carry it oat. (Loud cheers) I hope
that the Noble Marquis and other Noble Lords will see,
after I have said thus much, that
.there has not. been
any faltering or hesitation in
.declaring.our intention to
to the country. It would obviously be. improper for me,
on the present occasion, to enter into. any detail or
t hos e measures
classes
hwhich s
spoken
e nbelieveof.mt haeyi
interfering
injury r toyo.
mitigated_thhe par-
ticular
described
a that I should now
gmeintiegraatled,powliecy believe, withouts Infrteerefiritnreadwe.it
Into
such details it will not bo expected..
yourthe
Lordships,
pß9,ut thatl if havey otuh ensoad.tis:
ivoge h t
Government,
my to wait for the periilitic:onriue:otsfrhYsotracttaifanogrhtnat
(Laughter)—on the part of her Majesty's
House of Par-
will be prepared to lay before the other
my Right lion. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer'
liament, in full detail, those financial
(Laughter.) Until
measures
Govern-
ment minetnhtearperepsreenptarsetaatetoorfecaff)malmrse,nhue. her Mal 3 Gvve.,v.ern
that period shall arrive, I trust your. Lords.leips. I
ab-
stain from expressing or pronouncing any opinion.
trust that your Lordships will at all events hear the,
views her Majesty's Government entertain ; and I trust
that you a ill give a deliberate and dispassionate conside-
ration to the measures we may bring forward. You
may—or the other House of Parliament may—dissent
from our views, or they may adopt them. If they dis-
sent, and think fit to act on that dissent, they may—if
they can collect among themselves a sufficient number
of gentlemen ready to deal with this subject, and in a
different way, and ready to deal with the other subjects
in which the great interests of the country are concerned
—they may in that case prevent the adoption of the policy
which—without any difference of opinion among them
—without any hesitation subsequent to the decision of
the last general election—the Goverument deliberately
adopted. Bat I believe there will be that gord sense and
that moderation in Purliatnent that they will not secri-
fice the great interests off the nation for the purpose cf
raising personal points,
or for the purpose of indulging
in personal recriminations or individual accusations. I
hope and I believe that on. all sides of the House there
will prevail that spirit of which we see so satisfectory
and honourable an instance in the speech to-night of the

Noble Marquis—a spirit which will induce members of
Parliament to look at great subjects of national import-
ance—not through the medium of this or that section or
party, and not tnrough the medium of priv:,to interests;
but that they will look at them as that great man we
have so Litely lost would have looked at them, through
the medium of that which would, on the whole, be for
the advantage of the great interests of the country, of
those interests of which not a Ministry alone, but of
which both Houses of Parliament are the natural reposi-
tories. On that point, my Lords, I need say no more.
With regard to the question on which I have dwelt so
long, I have frankly stated that we will endeavour as
honestly to carry out that policy to which we formerly
objected, as far as we had been the authors of that
policy; and, on the other hand I say as distinctly, that
I will abstain from no effort which, in my judgment, and
in that of my colleagues, may be calculated to lessen the
inevitable injury inflicted on those who suffer from the
effects of that policy the nation has finally adopted. (Tho
Noble Earl resumed his scat amid general cheering.)
The Address was then adopted.
On the motion of the First Minister, Lord Redesdale
wss reappointed Chairman of Committees of their
Lordships House.
Their Lordships then (at a quarter to eight) ad-
journed.

.ended on the discretion or the decision of Ministers
what tone might be taken, or what turn might be
given, to the discussion on the Address. because Minis-
ters, being responsible far the Speech. Issvints the selec-
tion of the topics contained in it, having the choice of
the friends who were to expoun I the policy of the Go-
vernment, and knowing the desire of the House to be
informed of the views of the Government respecting
the condition of the country, the state of foreign
relatiors, and the policy to be adopted at home,
there could be no amendment proposed to the ad-
dress, or angry discussion take place, unless there was
some omission of matters on what the House desired to
be informed. or some statement of policy which it might
he deemed desirable to oppose. It was under these cir-
cumstances that he rose to complain somewhat of the
Address which had been moved that evening. He did
not say that he complained of much that was contained
in it. There were in it matters which spoke for them-
selves, facts on which they all agreed, and in which he
rejoiced. First of all he might speak of the reference
made to what he might term the national bereavement;
and he was sure that the House would respond to every-
thing which related to that great man, that great mind,
which had left them, with the greatest cordiality and the
deepest emotion. (Hear, hear.) But there were some
other matters of deep interest to the country at large, and
on which it had been anxiously looking for some informs-
don on that occasion. They had met there at a very un-
usual season; and there was not a man assembled there,
and hardly a man in the country, who had not in-
quired wherefore they were assembled. The circum-
stances were so notorious under which the last par-
liament was dissolved, and under which the present
one was assembled, that it was hardly needful
for him to refer to them ; but in order for him to estab-
lish the ground on which he intended to complain of
what he considered defective information in the speech,
it was necessary just to mention what occurred ; and
this brought him back to the formation of the present
Government. It was well known that when the Go•
vernment acceded to power, there was an avowal on the
part of the new minister that he held opinions which he
was not willing to abandon, and which he admitted were
At variance with those of the majority of the House of
Commons. (Cheers.) That minister—he alluded to the
first minister of the Crown—admitted the justice of the
doctrine, that it was not constitutional for any ministry
to administer the Government of this country whose
opinions did not coincide with the majority in that
house. (Cheers.) "But," ho said, " without abandon-
ing my opinions, and without doing violence to the Con-
stitution, I am willing to take a course which I think
will be approved by all teen under existing circum-
stances. I will not interfere with the business which is
required to bo done in this house ; I will put the coun-
try to as little inconvenience as possible ; but I will
dissolve this Parliament, I will take the opinion of the
country, I will ascertain with the least possible delay,
whether or not my opinions coincide with those of the
majority of the electors, and whether or not, therefore,
I am a fit person to govern the country." (Cheers.) Now.
these were the facts, and they were met at that unusual
season in consequence of a declaration of the Minister
that ho would leave it to the country whether he was fit
to be at the head of affairs. There were two ways in
which the difficulties admitted and avowed by the Minis-
ter might have been overcome. One was that the
majority in that House should coincide with the Minis•
ter, the other that the Minister should declare som.
change of opinion on his own part. They were al
assembled that evening, and the country generally
believed that they were met for tho purpose of ascer-
taining whether that coincidence existed. They had
looked to the Speech, and they had listened to the move:
and seconder of the Address to ascertain whether there
was a coincidence of opinion as between the majority of
that House and the present Government, and ho coca-
alained that they had no information on that subjrc
there was a paragraph which referred to the subject os
.vhich a difference of opinion had existed, namely, th.
,iommercial policy of the country; there was a referent
welt to recent legislation and to the present condition of
he people; but ho could not find a clear, distinct, intel
ligible avowal on the part of' her Majesty's Goveruntew
hat they were reconciled to that policy. (Hear.) tzitt)
wet they given no assurance that in no way would the.
Lttempt to reverse s:r to modify it, and that the country
nieht rest assured that it would be permanent? (11, ay.)
Ea order to relieve himself from any charge of pre-
sumption in intruding himself thus early on the House.
or asking for explanations which were not needed, ha
'egged leave to a ate to the House—a House eentainine
many Members who were not in the last Parliament—
hh
a d
also knowing
given
ven h
t o chat, from the strong interest which he had taken for
many years in this question, on the first accession of this
Government to power, knowing the opinions which
they had taken throughout the country in condemning
t ea
the policy which now a
ye y,
whichad propounded,they hexisted, and the pledget, he might
reversesactive
e thatp.arpt o lwi chyi --c h
(Cheers)—he did feel an apprehension that they would,
ea ucceding to power, use the enormous influence which
their position as a Government gave them to carry out
their views, and
that they would make some attempt if
not to reverse, at least to modify, their policy. He
therefore put a notice of motion on the paper in the last
Parliament, which bound the Government to a continu-
ance of the existing policy—having been requested to do
so by Members of great influence, because representing
vast numbers of their fellow countrymen in that House;
but at the request of that party who succeeded in chang-
ing the commercial policy of the country, and of the
whole House, he consented to withdraw that notice after
the speech of the First Minister of the Crown, assented to
oy the Ministers in that House. That speech was to the
effect which he had stated. The First Minister avowed that
he was in a minority in that house, and declared that
no would take the opinion of the country. On these
grounds he (Mr. Villiers) withdrew the notice. He
anxiously awaited the assembling of a new parliament,
for the purpose of having this matter decided, because
it was the promise, the assurance of the minister at that
time that ho would call an early session for the pur-
pose of deciding it. (Hear, hear.) Nobody could doubt
the importance of the subject ; it was appreciated on all
sides, whatever view might otherwise be taken of it.
Hon. Gentlemen opposite had said that unless the ex-
isting policy was reversed, or at least modified, inevitable
ruin must follow.l They (the Opposition) had declared it
was their opinion that the well-being of the country was
contingent on its continuance. The minister of the crown
said:—" This is a matter of too great importance to be
left unsettled ; it shall be decided, and decided finally;
so that every man in this country, and in the world, may
feel assured as to what the commercial policy of this
country will be." It was for this purpose, as ho under-
stood, that they were, assembled at this unusual season
of the year ; and he rose, not to depart from what he
know to be the custom of that house, and believed to be
he wish of members generally, namely, that of avoiding
an amendment to the address,—that was not his purpose
—but he wished to call attention to the fact, that up to
chat moment they did not know whether or not the
ministers of the Crown had abandoned their opinions on
the subject of protection. (Hear, hear.) He did assert,
md in doing so he was supported by the opinion of the
drat minister of the Crown, that it was essential that
his matter should be decided. It could not be decided
ay coinciding
with the address. The language was
vague. (Cheers.) He would be very sorry to introduce
tnythieg like an angry discussion on that occasion, but
e might almost say it was deceptive. (Hear, hear,)
['here was an allusion to the great prosperity of the
wdustrious classes, but there was also an allusion to
neasures for the relief of industry. Why, if the indus-
Hams classes were well off and satisfied, what was the
/leaning of a declaration that something should be done
or industry ? (Hear, hear.) It was an opinion en-
ertained on than side of the house by all who had
advocated the policy of Free Trade that Protection
sots an unqn.lified mischief, that not only was it
in enormous mischief to the community at large,
eat that it was even injurious to the interests sup-
oosed to be protected. But when the question in-
volved also the protection of what was called the landed
,nterest, to talk of protecting the industry of the country
by restoring a monopoly of food, he should hardly like to
'may what he thought of such talk as that. (Hear, hear.)
ft was almost an insult to the people of this country to
talk of any person being injured by the removal of the
srossest of all injuries which had been inflicted upon the
:immunity. (Hear, hear.) But the whole phraseology
)f the paragraph was indistinct, vague, and confused;
and it depended on the tone and views of Hon. Gamic-
nen on the opposite side of the House what interpreta-
don was to be put upon it by the House generally.
there was mention made of rociont legisiatluu. Why
Jlot use plain English? Why was not the language in-
wiligible? (Hear, hoar.) If great advantages had been
reaped by the working classes from the repeal of the
tlorn-laws, why not state it?—(Cheers)---and if any in-
jury was done to anybody by repealing the Corn-laws,
et them have that made clear, distinct, and unequivocal.
Hear, hear.) They (the Opposition) would have the
cision of the House on that matter—(Cheers)—
ted he had only risen now for the purpose of stating
that he, for onet haaing taken a great interest
n this subject, cud believing that others, who had
taken a far more • effective part, would agree with
.him, was dissatisfied with the, statement made as to
.the causes of the present condition of the country.
(Hear, hear.) They wanted to know distinctly what
'verb the opinions of her Majesty's Government on the
great question which had been in dispute—the policy of
Orotection or Free Trade; and without further detain-
ing the House, he begged leave most dietinctly to give
notice that he should submit the matter to the House—
(Cheers)—that ho should put the question on so clear
and intelligible a footing that their 'fellow-countrymen
out of the House would afterwards feel no doubt with
egard to the future: H believed that the 22d of the
present month would bo.about the most convenient day
or taking the opinion •of the house on that subject.
,
(Loud cheers.)
..... . . .. •
There was here a pause, daring which were heard
'ceasional cries "of "Blotter," whialf:elicited laughter.
Pho Speaker was about, to put the.qhestion, when
Mr. FIUME rose to address the House. He said he
ad waited, with great:: patieeee
.in the hope that, en-
herding to,l custom,: some .Hen. Gentleman opposite
bould rise to answer the speech of- the Hen. Gentle-
nate who had just. spoken. ' *His-Hon. Friend had
ven a challenge, but no one seemed to have
*kit to answer.- • Why did not Hon. Gentlemen op-
nchito came for Ward like men? (Laughter.) How was
it hat none or them had the reantinese to stand up and
'daft that the acknowledged prosperity of the labouring
"!arses arose from the repeal of the corn-laws? (Hear,
hea%) He begged pardon—the seconder of the Address
lid admit that he was a Free-trader. (Laughter.) The
Govttnneent themselves, however, ought to hare stated
heir Having had nine months, which was a long i
:)-161—(Laughter)—to make up their minds, why did I
wit 11 nst admit in intelligible language that they had
been wieng.—( dear, hear)—thet they found by experi-
ece thtt the existing policy had been productive c f
rierbalaticing advantages to the mass of the community ?
lie confessed that he felt deeply disappointed. Although ;
great difference of opinion bad existed, he did believe

that the Government would have the manliness to avow
their error. He liked a fair stand-up beetle, and not a
fi eht from behind bPdges, and under s quivecAl binguago
r.nd expressi,ffli, %hien nobody rt,ul,l (It:do/to:and. The
ceuntry demanded a decision or the question. ilo had met
with a great many farmers who had net only made up
their minds that the change was good for the country, but
who said that they would be sorry to go hack to Pro-
tection ; but there were others who locked for some
secret measures by which farmers were to be benefited;
and for the sake of such persons, it was absolutely
necessary the question should be decided. (Haar, hear.)
While he agreed with his Hon. Friend that it was not
desirable that there should be an amendment, the ad-
dress being regarded ac a compliment to her hlejesty,
lie had to complain of some omissions in the Royal
Speech. The preoeding Parliament declared by a vote
that there were certain taxes in existence which were
most unjustly and anomalously levied, and that the time
had arrived when there should be a general revision of
oixatiou. That was, he believed a wise declaration ;
but the speech did not contain one word in reference to
the question. Did the Government mean to oppose or
shrink from inquiry with regard to the Income Tax,
which, in the words of the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr.
Disraeli), amounted in many cases to confiscation of pro-
perty ? He hoped the Government would state whether
this omission arose from accident or from a
determination not to grapple with the ques-
tion. There was another omission. He had
anticipated that the Government would declare them-
selves opposed to any further Parliamentary Reform.
Why had they not taken the position assumed by Lord
'Derby in another place, when he declared it to be his
intention to oppose any further extension of what were
termed popular rights, and when he censured the demo-
. cratic principles of the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell)?
(Hear, hear.) If the Noble Lord's measures appeared to
the Noble Earl dangerous, and if he still meant to oppose
their enactment, why was not that stated in the Speech
from the Throne? (Hear, hear.) There was another
important omission. What had become of the clamorous
outcry for the repeal of the malt-tax and other taxes
which were peculiarly odious to farmers? The silence
of the Speech declared that there was no intention to
repeal them. He regretted that the question of taxation
was entirely omitted. In conclusion, ho wished to tell
Hon. Gentlemen opposite, if they were not aware of it,
,hat there was a strong opinion in the country that elec-
tions could not be conducted in future as they had been
lately. He wished to see established a regular repre-
sentative Government; he wished to see popular power
exercising that influence which it ought to have in the
proceedings of that House, while at the same time the
just privileges of the different classes of society were
properly guarded; and he regretted that in a time of
peace and quiet the Government did not seem prepared
to come forward and propose those reforms which the
country required. The question of Free Trade must
soon be settled one way or other; and it would then be
ime to introduce other questions of national im-
portance.
Mr. WALPOLE said—l did not :rise, nor did any
other member of the government rise, after the observa-
tions which were made by the hon. member for Wolver-
hampton (Mr. Villiers), because :it was our duty to see
whether any amendment to the address was likely to be
moved before we gave any opinion in reply to the remarks
which fell from him. As, however, the hon. gentleman
lid not move an amendment, and as no one else has risen
to do so, it appears at present unlikely that any amend-
ment will be moved; and I have, therefore, risen for the
purpose of replying to the observations which the hon,
gentleman has made. (Hear.) Now, I certainly agree
with him, that we are met together at an unusual season
.f the year, and for a special purpose. That purpose
unquestionably is, that the financial and commercial
Jolley of this country shall be finally settled and do-
tiered. (Cheers from both sides of the house.) The
ton. gentleman complains that in the address there is a
certain passage referring to the subject which is embigu-
us; and I think he called it evasive and deceptive.
sir, I can assure the hon. gentleman that no evasion and
to dee,pti,n was intended by that paragraph; hut it has
men worded carefully in that way—which meets an ob,
rvatien which the hon. gentleman himself has made—
it has been worded carefully in that way to prevent at
his moment what might possibly be a warm and heated
liscuseion, and so as to avoid the neces-ity of any amend-
ment being moved to the address either on this or on that
ode of the heuse. The bon, gentleman says, however, and
,0 does the 'non. gentleman the member for Montrose—
(An inaudible observation was here made by Mr. Vit
liers.) Well, it is in conformity with the usual custom
that:you did endeavour to avoid an amendment. I think
the Hon. Gentleman himself said it was the custom. I
believe it is recognized to be a good custom; and cer-
tainly we wished that as far as possible that custom
should be observed on the present occasion; but we are
prepared, if you wish to move an amendment, to take the
discussion at the present time. (Hear, hear.) Well,
now, the Hon. Gentleman went on to remark, and so
also did the Hon. Gentleman who has just sat down,
that we ought to have declared our policy in the speech,
and that we ought also to have been prepared with the
measures which we intend to propose. Now, I tell the
Honourable Gentleman that we aro prepared with all
those measures. (Ministerial cheers.) And I tell him
that we intend, and have always intended to take the
earliest opportunity of submitting those measures to the
consideration of the House. But there are circumstances
with reference to our present meeting which have cer-
tainly made it unadvisable that they should bo taken in
hand until the funeral of the Duke of Wellington shall
have taken place. (An exclamation of " Oh," followed
by cheers.) As soon as that tribute of the nation is
paid to the greatest of its heroes, my Right Hon. Friend
the Chancellor of the Exchequer will rise to bring before
the House and the country the views which the Govern-
ment take of the financial and commercial policy which
ought to be established in the country. But I think there
is sufficient in the speech from the Throne, and in the ad-
dress in answer to it, for everybody to draw this inference
from, that we are not going to propose to reverse the re-
cent legislation which has led to those improvements in
the condition of the industrious classes of the commu-
nity to veh,ich the speech refers. (Loud cheers from the
Opposition benches.) More than this, I think, the
House will hardly expect me to say; because it would, in
tact, be expecting me to announce the different measures,
which my Right Hon. Friend will announce on a future
occasion, and the views which he takes in reference to
that subject. (Hear, hear.) But I thought it right to
make that declaration in the first instance; for it is a
declaration which the Government intend to abide by;
and I do say that those measures which the Government
intend to introduce will be brought forward on the ear-
liest occasion. (Cheers.)
Lord J. RUSSELL said—lt is consoling that on this
occasion we have to consider an Address which begins
by condoling with her Majesty on the loss of that great
man the Duke of Wellington; that we are not obliged
to have a long debate upon topics on which the House
might be divided, or to have a division on those topics.
Sir, with respect to the first part of the Address, I cer-
tainly will not attempt to add anything to what has
been said by the Noble Lord and the Hon. Gentleman
who moved and seconded the Address. With regard to
the Duke of Wellington, I feel that while it remains for
the country and fur history to do justice to his great
merits, it remains for her Majesty's Ministers, for the
House of Lords and the House of Commons, and for
the country at large, to deplore the loss of those
counsels which always inspired that good subject
and ardent patriot. It remains for us, in confor-
mity with the intention of the Crown, to show that
we are not an ungrateful people, and that we
duly appreciate the services which have been ren-
dered to the country by that illustrious man. (Hear,
hear.) Sir, passing from this subject, lam glad to find
that the Ministers of the Crown can congratulate the
country on the ready coming forward of so many men,
amounting, as the Noble Lord said, to 30,000, to serve
in the militia. I trust that her Majesty's hopes will
not be disappointed, and that these mea will prove an
effectual aid to her Majesty's regular forces. With re-
ference to any other measures which may be necessary
for the defence of this country, I feel sure that her Me-
jetty's Ministers will give them duo consideration. and
that they will propose from time to time such measures
as they may think advisable, to which I shall always be
ready to give a favourable hearing. Ido not know that
there is any other topic either in the speech or the ad-
dress to which I need more particularly allude. But I
must say a few words. respecting what the country has
so impatiently looked for, namely, some explicit declara-
tion as to our financial and commercial policy. (Hoare
hoar.) I must say that on this part of the subject I
partieipate in the disappointment which my Hon.
Friend the Member for Wolverhampton has so well
expressed. It seems to me that with respect to our
commercial and financial policy, there were two courses
open to the Government, either of which would have
been perfectly plain and clear, for the Noble Earl in
another place and his colleagues in the Government.
The one was, they might have maintained the opinions
which since 1846 down to the present time, or at least
until February, 1352, Lord Darby most loudly and con-
fidently expressed, and from which he declared with
eloquence and energy that nothing should induce him
to shrink. (Hear.) Another course would have bean for
the Government to have stated that they hail been mis-
taken in all their views, that the country had preTered,
and that the cause of that prosperity was the operation
of those measures which they had thought would be
nationally ruinous. (Cheers.) They might have ad-
mitted that these beneficial results were recognised
throughout the country, and manfully have declared
that they had changed their opinions, and wero pre-
pared for the future to act according to the principles
which they had hitherto opposed. (Cheers.) I con-
ceive that they have adopted neither the one nor the
other course, and the House and the country must be
prepared to form a judgment on their declarations.
Instead of either of the courses I have describhd, we
have a continuance of that perplexity and ambiguity, of
that doubt and hesitation, which for the last vino
months have vexed the country, and made icditc 'cult to
Government.
gather what woes to be the real policy of ,
(Hear, hear.) If one of the Ministers appeared tobe in
favour of free trade, we had presently from another
declaration that prohectriontarhyaof
snoatte:been abandoned.
although he must
(Hear, hear.)
not say that thelheL:cee of protection is a sound one,
principleof the increase of crime end of
yet we find him
the poor rates,B.PZipugndearouring to throw some Cur
upon the prosperity which free trade has produced—
trying, if possible,to, induce the ceuntry to dep:rt from
lice course which it. has finally adopted. (Cheers.)
now, continuing on the same course to the
And even
end, we have in this address some sentences favourable
to free trade, and, in another, words intimating an
approval of ,the principle. Qf protection. (Hear, hear.)

To complete the whole, we have moving the addrent
Noble Lord who is a fi m adherent of proteetien, while the
Hon tali tuber •vh SPconds fi;m speaks heidlt and ae •
oddly fie trse teed, (Ca ers end lie oh .e) IT • h
let the umbigeity eructated by the Goverennent and its
adherents, I think it is full time we came to a settle-
ment, and—in the words of the Hon. Merebe•r who
spoke last—that the commercial and financial policy of
this country should be finally settled. ( Hear, and
cheers.) Let us then have some declaration to settle
that policy; let us have some declaration which shall
serve as a point of departure for future Ministers of the
Crown, and enable them seftly to direct their policy.
(Hear. 'near, and cheers.) The country has lwen ep-
p"aled to, end you know the result; and it is for you. the
Ministers of the Ccowa, to declare manfully the feelings
and opinions you entertain on this great subject.
(Hear.) And when I say " This great subject," it re-
minds me the• in the doubtful sentence to which I have
alluded, the importance of that subject has been stu-
diously diminished. To illustrate the greatness of the
subject, let us see what has been done in the way of
commercial and financial reform during the last ten
years. The whole system of corn laws which the
country had endured for so considerable a time, has
been totally repealed. A tariff of exorbitant dudes has
been reduced within moderate limits. Our taxes have
undergone an extensive system of revision, and when
Hon. Gentlemen opposite talk of revision of taxation as
a novelty of their introduction, I would remind them
that revision of taxation has been going on since the
time of Sir Robert Peel, and has been carried on in
such a way, that while the taxes were reduced, they
—although for a moment leaving a void in the receipts
—soon restored the revenue by the general buoyancy
they communicated to the general interests of the coun-
try. (Hear, hear.) Let me add to this, that the ditetr-
ential duty upon sugar has been equalized, and the people
of England have consumed 300,000 tons of sugar in the
year at a cost of five millions less than they would have
paid had the duty continued as before. (Hear.) I may
add that the consumption of sugar has so increased that
the revenue at the reduced rates will in a few years be
, double what it was previous to the reduction of the duty'.
Add to this that we have had the navigation laws re-
pealed, and I have enumerated a whole system, I will say
not only of great importance, but, taken es a change of
policy adopted by a great country, a change than which
nothing since the revolution of 1688 has been more im-
portant in its effects, not only upon this country, but
upon the commercial policy of all civilized nations.
(Hear, hear.) Because, although I was not one of those
who were sanguine enough to expect that the moment we
declared for Free Trade, and abjured Protection, all the
nations of the world would follow our example; yet, on
the other hand, it is my confident belief that, if this
country continues to flourish under the system of Free
Trade—if its Govornments declare themselves satis-
fied with the consequences, and that they mean to
persevere—there is no nation that will not, by fre-
quent discussions, come at last to the conclusions
to which we have arrived, so that ultimately there
will be derived, not only a great increase of the wealth,
but of the peace and harmony of the world. (Cheers.)
Well, then, if such be the importance of the sys-
tem, if such be the gravity of the stake ; and if, on
the other hand, there aro many persons who still main-
tain that the system of free commercial policy is in-
jurious, it is not enough to say of it that it is one of the
causes—putting in a parcel of nameless other causes--
(cheers)—by which the industrious classes of this coun-
try have received great and important benefits. I affirm
that her Majesty's Ministers ought not to evade the
question in this way—(loud cheers)—that however ne-
cessary it may be to avoid division on the present occa-
sion, a night should not pass over without the House
of Comm )119 giving its verdict on the question. (Hear,
hear.) The Right Hon. Gentleman who has last
spoken says that there is no intention on the part of the
Government to revert to the policy that prevailed pre-
vious to 1846. I was very glad to hear that declara-
tion; but there are certain words in the paragraph to
which anusion has b: en made about artificial props and
artificial prices, which are only the principle of protec-
tion disguised in another way. Therefore it is neces-
sary that we should have something clear and decided,
and that we should not allow ourselves to t>e enveloped
in one of those mists in which the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer, like some goddesses we have read of, likes to be
worshipped. (Laughter.) The Speech and Address
next speaks of the state of Ireland, and I am glad to
see recommends the adoption of a liberal course of
policy towards that country, but in a previous portion
of the paragraph there are words to which I am unable
to attach a precise meaning. I me in those which.
refer to an unhappy spirit of insubordination and
turbulence in that country. There were insubordi-
nation and turbulence in Ireland during the election
which has just been decided, but that there is any snirit
or insubordination and turbulence in that country at
present, is a statement to which I am not prepared t.,?,
give my assent. (" Hear" from the Irish members.)
believe that with a due and proper execution of the law,
the state of Ireland may be considered to be a state of
tranquillity. (Hear, hear.) And I must say that
trust that that country, having suffered so severely frond
famine in 1847, is now about in some measure to recover,
s
as there are symptoms which encourage us to hope at
.
at length the labourers of Ireland will obtain thattle,
ward for their labour of which they have hitherto
the
so sadly deficient. With regard to that portion °fu'
address which refers to the commission to inquire
into
the state of the Universities of Oxford and Cambridge,
I am rejoiced that those commissions, which worn stig-
matised by the noble lord at the head of the Govern-
ment as illegal commissions—(hear, hear)—when I ad-
vised their issue, are now acknowledged to be productive
of good, and, instead of being cast aside as an illegal
body, are to be referred to the universities themselves,
while we are to be asked to pass laws to enable the uni-
versities to carry into effect the recommendations of
these very commissions. (Hear, hear.) Whether the
measures so contemplated will be sufficient I cannot
say, but lam glad that the attention of the ministers
of the crown have been directed to the subject. I am
sure nothing can be more important at this present
time than that the whole question of education, begin-
ning with that of , the higher classes at Oxford and
Cambridge, thence to the middle classes, and
comprehending also the education of the working
classes, should be promptly and fully considered.
(Hear, hear.) With respect to this part of the subject I
am rejoiced to hear thattit is intended to extend the
means for instruction in practical science as applied to
the general business of life. lam also glad to hear that
some measures on the subject of secondary punishment
will be proposed, so that transportation to Van Diemen's
Land may at the earliest possible period be abolished.
There are two circumstances to be considered in the
treatment of that question—one, that we have given re-
presentative institutions to our Australian colonies; and
the other, the recent discoveries of gold in a portion of
those colonies. It is quite obvious that these two cir-
cumstances render it necessary that we should revise the
whole subject, and I am glad that the Right Hon. Bart.
the Secretary for the Colonies—to whom I took the
liberty some time since of speaking on the subject—hag
come to the wise conclusion of not confining the question
to transportation to Van Diemen's Land, bat that the
case as regards the whole of the Australian colonies
should bo reconsidered. (Hear, hear.) Of course, there
are other subjects connected with our penal laws which
must be discussed iu company with this question, and
which will no doubt occupy the attention of Govern-
ment; but, upon the whole, I am rejoiced to find that,
with the exception of the topic of commercial policy, the
question of the great case between Free Trade and Pro-
tection, there is nothing in the Speech or the Address
which calls for more than the few slight remarks I have
made. I trust that when the policy of the Government
on that subject is declared, it will be to secure to us
permanently our present universally-admitted advan-
tages. (Hear, hear.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—I can-
not help fancying, Sir, if the only paragraph of which
the Noble Lord the Member for the city of London dis-
approved in the answer to the Queen's Speech was really
so evasive as seine Honourab!e Gentlemen had stated,
that an amendment to the Address would have been
made. Ido not think that the constitutional delicacy of
my Honourable Friend who has addressed us would
have deterred him from taking a course for which his
well.stored memory and ample experience would have
furnished him with sufficient precedents. (A laugh.) I
cannot say that I concur with the Noble Lord the
Member for the city of London, or his friend, in the
version which he has placed upon this paragraph, which
they have described as so evasive. It appears to me to
be perfectly well adapted to the circumstances under
which wo meet to-day. (Laughter.) I mean by the
circumstances under which wo meet to-day, that
there are two parties in the House which are both
c
indisposed to come to any collision on the Address.
(Hoar, hear,) Certainly, with that feeling, I think
the paragraph is framed in a manner which can leave
no mistake upon the impartial mind as to the inten-
tions of the Government upon the subject.
(Hear.) For
the only point which is laid down in this paragraph re-
specting which there can be no evasion, is the descrip-
tion of the principles upon which the commercial system
of this country is recogniztd and established by the Go-
vernment, and Unit is the principle of unrestricted com-
petition. That is the only distinct expression in the
paragraph describing the views of the Government, that
the legislation which gradually has produced that system
of unrestricted competition has in its operation caused
injury to certain classes of the country. (Ministerial
cheers). The Noble Lord the Member for the city of
London says this is Protectionism. But I read an ad-
dress of the Noble Lord, recently
published, just before
the dissolution of the late Parliament, addressed to the
constituents of the greatest commercial city in the king-
dom, and there I found that the merchants and shiP-
ownsrs of London wore reminded that they were sub-
jtcted to great burdens and unjust restrictions (Mini°•
Serial cheers)—burdens and restrictions which only could
'Therefore,
consich re 1 such by the action of recent legislation.
the noble lord was of opinion, when ho {gascandidate for the city of London, that it was quite
possible to maintain unimpaired that commercial system
founded upon the principle of unrestricted competition,
and yet to remove those restrictions and those burdens
which one great interest was suffering from, and which,
by his own acknowledgment, were virtually occasioned
by recent legislarion. (Clue rs.) Was that a Protec-
tionist declaration of the Noble Lord ? Well, then,
very recently I have had representations made to ale
by bodies of merchants and shipowners--gentlemen of
ex-reme liberal opinions, upon all subjects connectedit
with Commerce, some of them titting upon the oppose
tide of the House, and cerainly. so far as I can coiled.
their feelings, representing one of the great interests t
t,
the country. they will be extremely dissatisfied and
dis-
contented, if the restrictions under which they suffer'
and the burdens which they boar, are not taken into
consideretiem by any body of men who may form her