The Sun.
London, England, 1852-06-16 00:00:00

-burti) 14.5Vttion

SUN OFFICE, Seven o'Clock.

HAMPTON COURT.
BY EXPRESS-(THIS DAY.)

(Continued from our Third Edition.)
Railway Plate.

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Longinus

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IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

(THIS DAY.)

HOUSE OF COMMONS.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at Twelve o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.

Adams' Estate Bill was considered and agreed to.
Elwes' Estate Bill, and Spalding's Estate Bill, were
read a second time. and ordered to be committed.
Mr. W. PATTEN moved the Select Committee for
the Revision of the Sessional and Standing Orders of
the House, relating to both public and private busi-
ness:—Mr. Wilson Patten, Mr. Henley, Mr. Bernal, Mr.
Evelyn Denison, Mr. Greene, Sir Robert Ferguson, Sir
John Yarde Buller, Mr. Gladstone, Mr. Wrightson, Mr.
Sotheron, Mr. Thornely, Captain Jones, Mr. Aglionby
Mr. Home Drummond, and Mr. Baines.—Agreul to.

-
PETITIONS. -
praying Sir E. FILMER presented apetition,p g that
literary societies may be supplied with Parliamentary
Papers free of expense.
Mr. HARDCASTLE presented a petition to the same
effect; also a petition from Camberwell, praying for the
inspection of nunneries.
THE " COUNT OUT."
Mr. ANSTBY said he wished to draw the attention of
the Speaker to one or two points of order. It would be
remembered that a short time ago an:Honourable Friend
of his, who was speaking on the Maynooth question,
was stopped in the middle of his speech by the Speaker
leaving the chair, four o'clock having arrived; and yet
yesterday, because the Chancellor of the Exchequer eves
speaking at four o'clock, the House was allowed to go on
sitting up to five o'clock. Nov, he wanted to know why
a distinction hall been drawn etween the two cases.
Again, it would be remembered theta few days ago, while
they were dividing in Committee of Supply, three Hon.
Members were found in the loleby, and forced to °owe
into the hones upon a question which they had not
heard debated or put from the chair; and yet yesterday
evening, when a count out veal moved by a Supporter of
the Ge)vernment, three Members who were standing
hebied the lobby, and who would hero made up the
H eJe had they been counted, were allowed to retreat
into the lobby. -Now, he wished to know if the rule
which applied to one case of foreleg the Members to
attend in their place was not equally applicable to the
other. -

The SPEAKER said, in answer to the first question,
he must remind the Heim that by a new • rule which
bed recently been made when the house met at twelve
o'clock on any oilier day but Wednesday,
and sat till three o'clock, the House met again
at five o'clock, but if the House continued sitting up till
four o'clock the chair rr.es obliged to be vacated, and
the House did not meet again until Cy:. Yesterday,
however, the House did not meet at twelve
but at one o'clock, and the rule therefore
did not apply to that instance.—(A laugh.) With re-
gard to the next question, he had no hesitation in stating
that a Member could not be required to vote who had
not heard. the question put, and if in that
ease an Honourable Member was found in the
lobby while the division was going on he would be
directed to withdraw; but with regard to the last ques-
tion, the Chair could count the Members who were
actually in the House, and although there might be
a hundred Members behind the chair or in the lobbies,
ye: if there were not forty Members in the House the
business could not .be proceeded with, nor could
any Member be permitted to address 'the Chair.

.Mr. BERNAL thought it was important that a rule
should be defined whether Members not actaally within
the four walls of the House should be called on to vote.
Formerly Members in the lobbies voted, but
he should now be guided by what the Speaker
had stated—that only those Members could vote who
were present and heard the question put.
Mr. HUME admitted he MIS a little irregular in in-
terrupting the Speaker last night, but when he stopped
at thirty-eight, and he (Mr. Hume) saw several
Members behind the chair, he naturally called at-
tention to the Let. Ho also saw twenty more
Members outside the door. Thirty years ego, when he
was a teller in a division, Mr. Wilberforce retired behind
Solomon's porch (the Speaker's chair) and was not
counted; he was, however, noticed, and on his (Mr.
Home's) motion, he was called to the table, and asked
whether he had heard the question put, and on answer-
ing in the negative, it was read to him, when he stated on
which tide he should vote, and be was accordingly included
in the division. He certainly thought there was great
ground for complaint in respect to the " count out"
last night. The question brought on by the Hon.
Member was of great public importance, and it should
not have been met in the way it had been by the Go-
vernmeat. He hoped a Committee would be appointed
in the next Parliament to lay down some definite rules
for the guidance of the House on divisions.
The SPEAKER observed, that the mode of conduct-
ing divisions in the old House was somewhat different
to that now adopted. _ _ _

Mr. ANSTEY give notice that to-morrow he should
move, that when the House is counted the Sergeant-at-
Arrng be directed to lock the doors, and that all Mem-
bers both in the body of the House and in tho lobbies
be counted.

The conversation then dropped.
Mr. L. HEYWORTIL presented three petitions for
inquiry into the causes, practices, and consequences of
intemperance.
SUPPOSED WRECK OF THE PRESIDENT.
In reply to Mr. IL BERKELEY,
Mr. STAFFORD said it was perfectly true that the
wreck of a large steamer had been driven on shore in
the county of Banff, and that considerable excite-
meet prevailed on the subject, in consequence of its
being supposed to be the wreck of the President. The
Admiralty had directed an able and intelligent officer to
institute an inquiry into the matter; and he had
carefully examined the "scantlings" of all the
timbers, and communicated the particulars to
all ship-builders: who had constructed large
steamers. The inquiry was, however, of a very pro-
tracted__, nature. Some of those builders had communi-
cated answers. bat others bed not clone so. It had not
yete been found that the timbers' were those of the Presi-
dent, but the i
nve2eigation was still being prosecuted.
When the
thought, it,
statements on the subject were complete he
..., would he sati.faetory to make them public.
ROYAL
-14_110cLAmATioN AGAINST ROMAN
C& OLIO PROCESSIONS.
Mr. 1-E()GII said
seen a Royal preeiva Ilenoureble Members must have
wiation which is addressed to certain
clauses in the Cet
Relief Act, and which was intro-
duced into that Aete lie
Boman
other very old Act.
directed again":
They are Catholic ecclesiastics
. wearteg the dresses of their order in public. Those
clauses of that Act, all must
.be aware, have remained
dormant .siece the passing of the Relief .
Go-
vernment of the Duke o w
f—, Bill. The disa did
Geyer
them; nether did the
.„. tan i
--ants of Earl G
not enforce
of Lord Melbourne, nor of Sir Robert peel, This
oy., nor
fires occasion on which any intention has been
is the
t of tie lion
as expressed
of putting that
par cede Relief
iAct in force,
against the Roman Catholic
d with s-11lie11- A morning
journal, which is conducted eery
e acts of the great ability, and
is generally devoted to the acts present Adminis-
tration, • '
be its organ—I le minis-
tration, and supposed to
tby —all° the Morn-
ing Herald—says, " This is an ac which the Gave
ment, in the immediate parcect of an election, A.-- ril-
f religionists. We need not to
offend a large class o
whole life, never °t saY
that Sir Robert Peel, in his O/1„. ,
And What ''' wait
guilty of such a piece of manhood.t earn_ ,
care that tho 's‘
Protestants ought to do is, to take
a 6 who
mean honestly to carry out in
the laws do not tuff er
for their manliness and sincerity n so thane..
Raring reference to the immediate dissolution of 111,..
liament, and to the observations made in the Govern-
ment organ, I wish to ask the Government whether it is
their intention to publish that proclamation in the
Dublin Gazette, with the view of giving it
the same effect in Ireland as in England?
The Hon. Member (Mr. Hume) says a proclamation has
no absolute legal effect. lam sure of that, though there
are some cases in which it is not so—for ihstance, in re-
gard to the proclamations under the Crime and Outrage
Act—but then it may be said this proclamation is pub-
lished in order to prevent the public at large being taken
by surprise by a dormant Act being put into operation.
I have also to ask whether it is the intention of the
Government, with that manliness and sincerity for which
they have got credit in the newsvaper I have mentioned,
to direct the Attorney-General for Ir,land to prosecute
Roman Catholic ecclesiastics in that country for doing
that which they have been permitted to do without ob-
servation or punishment since the year 1829 by every
Government, or whether it is merely a set-off to the
dropping of the Maynooth debate?
Mr. WALPOLE.—Boforo I answer the two ques-
tions Which the
Honourable Member has pat to
The, I think it right to state, on :the part of the
tfrovernment, that I am not responsible, nor is the
Government responsible for any particular observa-
tions contained in
I think it als • an y particular newspapers.—(Hear.)
o right to state that the Hon. Gentleman
has not correctly, because not fully, stated the law with
reference to this s e-
n iect. The statute of George the
4th applies to two
ecclesiastics
vv....,_ purposes—Roman Catholic
`"tug the habits of their order,
and exercising the rights and ceremonies of that
religion in other places than those
of private worship—
not in public placed. Islow, having explained this matter
to the House, I will now state th
Government think ittstita' theme in
neasonsf which the
provisions of the Act in question. Fiernstorocfluall, the
lion. Member says—Are you Roing to publish a answer
to ie the Lublin Gazette? M ar
y answer
to that is, that two months
i Liao the Govern-
ment heard of preceseicns n which a Roman
gittholic bishop tooktooka part, and the rao meDi
We heard of these proensions, 4 hich, I bAieve
i
, are en-
lirely new—(Rear, hear)—we sent an
mei intimation