The Sun.
London, England, 1864-07-05 00:00:00

TIIE SUN, LONDON', TUESDAY EVENING; JULY 5, 1864.

scarcely a throne that was not subverted. The King of
Denmark, in his character of a sovereign prince of Ger-
many, was affected by that great movement. The popula-
tion of Germany, under the influence of the very peculiar
excitement of that time, were impelled to redress the grie-
vances, as they alleged, of their fellow countrymen in the
dominions of the King of Denmark, and who were, of
course, his subjects. The Duchies of Holstein and Schles-
wig were invaded, A cruel war was excited by ambitious
princes in that country, under circumstances with which
we have become familiar. 'Ultimately, I believe, the whole
of the Continental dominions of the King of Denmark were
occupied by Austrian and Prussian armies. In 1851 tran-
quillity had been restored to Europe, and especially to
Germany, and the troops of Au-aria ultimately quitted the
dominions of the King of Denmark. That they
quitted them in conseqlence of the military
prowess of the Danes, though it was far from inconsider-
able, I will not pretend to say, but they quitted them under
certain conditions, and under the influence of Russia,
which was as that time irresistible in Germany. The
conditions under which they quitted Denmark were con-
cluded by the King of Denmark and the Courts of Berlin
and Vienna; and under those conditions the King of
Denmark entered into certain arrangements, with a view to
remedy the abuses complained of; but he never performed
or accomplished the engagements thus entered into—
partly, I have no doubt, from negligence, because we
know it is not the habit of mankind to perform disagree-
able duties when the pressure is withdrawn, and partly, I
have no doubt, from the peculiar character of the engage-
ments themselves. That was in the year 1851. In the year
1852, tranquillity being entirely restored, the treaty which
regulated the succession was negotiated. In that treaty
there was not the slightest reference to the engagements
which the King of Denmark had entered into with the
German Powers. It was a municipal, a domestic, or as
we now call it, a Federal, and not an international, ques-
tion. Notwithstanding that it really related only to the
King of Denmark and the Diet of Germany, once more it
attracted the attention of the Government of England and
the Ministers of the great Powers generally, who were the
signataries of the treaty of 1852. For some time after the
treaty of 1852 little was heard of the Federal question and
controversy between the Diet and Denmark. After this
exertion and exhaustion the question slumbered, but did
not die. Occasionally it gave evidence of vitality ; and not
long after the accession of the present Government to office
the controversy between the Diet and the King of Denmark
gave evidence of very great activity and life. Her Majesty's
Ministers thought it their duty to interfere in that contro-
versy. Wheth,g they were wise in taking that course of
conduct the house can decide as well as myself, I confess
my own impression is, and always has been, that it would
have been much better to have left the Federal question
between the King and the Diet to have worked itself out.
But her Majesty's Ministers were of opinion—and no doubt
there is much to be said in favour of that opinion—that,
inasmuch as the question, though a Federal question, was
one which probably, in its execution, might lead to abuse
which would make it an international one, it would be
wiser and better to interfere by anticipation, and prevent,
if possible, that Federal execution ever taking place.
The consequence of that extreme activity on the part of
her Majesty's Ministers is a mass of correspondence which
has been placed upon our table, with which many gentle-
men may have some acquaintance, though they may have
been attracted and absorbed by the interest of more
modern correspondence which has within this year been
presented to the house. I should riot be doing justice to the
Secretary of State if I did not bear testimony to the un-
wearied perseverance and extreme ingenuity with which
he conducted that correspondence. The noble lord found
in that business, no doubt, a subject Which is genial to his
nature, viz , the opportunity of drawing up a constitution
for the Government of communities. (Laughter.) The
Secretary of State is almost as celebrated as a statesman
who flourished .at the end of the lest century for that
ability. I will not quarrel or criticise any of the lucubra-
tions of the noble lord et that time. I think his laborers are
well described in a passage I observed in one of the de-
epatches of a distinguished Swedish statesman—l think the
present Prime Minister—who, when he was called upon to
cousiiier a scheme of the English Government for the ad-
ministration of Schleswig, which entered into minute de-
tails, and with that power and prolixity which only could
have been acquired by a constitutional Minister who has
long served an apprenticeship in the House of Commons,
said—" Generally speaking, the monarchs of Europe find it
difficult to manage one Parliament ; but I observe, to my
surprise, that Lord Russell is of opinion that the King of
Denmark will be able to manage four." (Laughter.) The
only observation which I shall make upon that folio
volume of 300 or 400 pages which is on the table, and which
relates to the affairs of Schleswig and Holstein, is this—
that I observe that the other Powers of Europe, who were
equally interested in the matter, and equally bound as Biz-
nataries of the treaty of 1852 to interfere is required—do not
interfere as the English Government interfere. That they
disapprove of the course taken I by no means 'wish to
maintain. W'nen we make a suggestion upon the subject
they receive it with cold politeness. They have no objec-
tion to the course e hich we announce we are going to take,
but they confine themselves, with scarcely an exception,
to that conduct on their part. The noble lord tolliews a
aifferent course; but it is really unnecessary for me to
dwell on this part ot the eubject. We may dismiss it
from our mind. I have only touched upon it 'to com-
plete the picture which I am bound to lay before the house,
in consequence of the events which very speedily occurred.
All this correspondence—this elaborate, and I will venture
to say, not using the term offensively, but accurately—this
pragmatical cerrespondence—(a laugh)—was conducted in
the perfect ignorance of the people of this country, who felt
very little interest in this subject. I may say, even in Eu.
rope, where affairs of d plouaacy always excite more atten-
tion, little effect was ever produced. This correspondence,
however, culminated in a celebrated despatch, which ap-
peared in the autumn of 1862. Then, for the first time, a
very great effect was produced in Europe generally, and
certainly in Germany and France, and some interest began
to be excited in Es:gland. Tne effect of the noble lord's
management of these transactions had been this. It had en-
couraged—l will not now step to inquire whether it was
eiethwmearesans
should be taken
intentional or not--but it is a tact that it had encouraged the
spread of the views of what is called the German party in
had been the effect of the noble lord's
but especially of this despatch of the
agthoeintsuemreaonlniontf7l:Bl:fde2r.le'nßiliuesl something shortly and in consequence
occurred which renewed that impression. Germany being
almost agitated on the subject, and England at last having
her attention called to the case in 1863, which began to pro-
titotmuhohb gee:
still
trtiti
aonl
poluiaonn thatt
obtaining
nteehslytgreergo i emreeuynt oehjs.rfeeh generally
disquietudetul usyblz wni cbditeah
whichnei
hat madeessppt
and gentlemen of this house beginning to
disquietude,
directed to the subject, and the state of
dhuavcee
affairs shortly before the prorogation of Parliament amount-
Atitojuesgthyt,:Gecoevssearnry.
Majesty's Government a declaration of
some means
in this country by
ap-
peal was not made in any party spirit, or in any way ect to Denmark, That
by both sides brought before the house. It wee
ani-
mated by that disciplined arrangement with which queer.
atitotnhseaerned of the session, when few were lett, and when the
answer of her M woeLy_ ,
Ministers could not at all affect
the position of parties, theue,h it might be of inesti-
mable influents and importance upon the opinions of
Europe and on the course of events. (Hear.) That matter
was brought forward by my hon. friend (Mr S, Fitzgerald),
who always speaks on those subjects with the authority of
one who knows what he is saying. (A laugh.) A commu•
nicetion was made to the First Minister on the subject, and
it was understood on this side of the house, irom a previous
declaration of the noble lord, and from our experience of his
career generally, that it was not an appeal which would be
disagreeable to hire, or which would be an occasion which
he would have any desire to escape. The noble lord wes not
taken by surprise. He himself fixed the moment—it was a
morning sitting—when he would come down and explained
the views of her Majesty's Government. I am bound to say
the noble lord on that occasion spoke with that perspicuity
and complete detail in which
upon diplomatic subjects we
acknowledge him to be
Perfect master. The noble lord
entered into the question) and gave to the house, who knew
little about'it, a popular but accurate account of the whole
question. He described the constitution of the Diet, and
elso, tor the that time, what a Federal execution was, He
hisin
was a little unhapearProphecies of what would hap-
pen with regard to the Federal execution. It is the only
mistake which the noble lord made. He said he did not
think there would be Federal execution; and if there were,
he thought we might be. perfectly easy that it would not
lead to any disturbance in Europe. The noble lord described
the position of Holstein as a German duchy of which the
King of Denmark was the sovereign prince, and by that
means a member of the Diet and subject to the laws of the
Diet. He showed that the Duchy y of Schleswig was not a
German duchy, and the moment that Schleswig was inter-
fered with an international consideration would arise.
(Hear.) He told us, in a re-assuring spirit, that his views
upon our relations with Dsnenark were the same as they had
always been. I will read an extract from the noble lord's
speech, not because it is not familiar to the house, but be-
cause upon occasions like this we should refer to documents,
that we may not be accused afterwards of having coloured
or garbled statements. The noble lord's concluding
observations wore—" We are asked what is tlos policy and
course of her Majesty's Government with respect to this
dispute. We concur entirely with the hon. gentleman
(Fiteg,erald), and I am satisfied with all reasonable men in
Europe, including these
inFrance and Russia, in desiring
that she independence ann integrity and the rights of Den-
mark may be maintained. We are convinced—l am con-
vinced, at least—that if any violent attempt were made to
overthrow those rights, or interfere with that indepen-
dence, thoso who toads the attempt would find in the result
that it would not be Danmark alone with which they would
have to contend." (Cheers.) Now that is a clear, manly,
statesmanlike declaration of policy. It was not a hurried
or hasty expression, upon a subject of that importance, of
that character—on which the noble lord never makes hasty
declarations, He is a master of his subject, and he could
not be taken by surprise ; but on that occasion there was
not a chance of his being taken by surprise. The occasion
was arranged beforehand, and the noble lord was perfectly
informed of our object. Ho sympathised with that otject,
of soothing the disquieted mind of Europe, and he knew he
could not arrive at such a doiralle result more happily than

by a frank exposition of the policy of the Government. It
is my business to-night tc vindicate the noble lord, who has
treated this declaration as one used only to amuse the House
of Commons. lam here to prove the sincerity of that de-
claration—(hear)—beeause we have now on oar table re-
cently and long since this speech was delivered, the diplo-
matic correspondence which was then pursued by her

Majesty's Government on this subject. The right hon.
gentleman then proceeded to quote from despatches written
by Earl Russell to our ministers in Berlin and Vienna,
stating that if Germany persisted in confounding Schles-
wig wit 'a Holstein, the other Powers of Europe might con-
found Holstein with Schleswig. That reassuring state-
ment of the noble lord was, I thiple. a wise and judicious
policy at that time, because he knew that then France
was perfectly ready to co-operate with him in any measure
which ho thought proper to pursue, with respect to
these transactions between Denmark and Germany; nay,
not only that Franca was ready, but that she had
spontaneously offered to act with us in any manner
which we liked. The right hon, gentleman quoted a de-
spatch from Lord Cowley in support of this assertion, in
which M. Drouyn de Lhuys expressed himself as desirous
of acting in concert with us in this matter. He then went
on to inquire how this change of feeling on the part of
France had been brought about. For when in September
Earl Russell had reminded the French Government of their
offer, and requested them to act in concert with us in event
of matters in Denmark requiring intervention, the applica-
tion had bees first coldly received, and finally refused. He
then went on to say, I stop now to inquire what has caused
this change in the relations between the two courts. Why
was France, who at the end of the session was so cordial and
ready to co-operate with us, at the end of two or three short
months entirely changed? At the commencement of last
year an insurrection broke out in Poland. Unhappily, in-
surrections in Poland are not unprecedented. This insur-
rection was extensive and menacing, but there have been
insurrections in Poland before quite as extensive and far
more menacing—the insurrection of 1831, for example. For
at that time the Poles possessed a national army, second to
none for valour and discipline. Well, sir, the question of
Polish insurrection in 1831 was deeply considered by the
Government of that day. They went thoroughly into the
matter, and felt the soundings of that question. It was in-
vestigated and maturely considered, and the Government of
that day—the Government of William the Fourth—arrived
at these two conclusions, that it was not expedient for Eng-
land to go to war to restore Poland; and, secendly, that if
England was not prepared to go to war, any interference of
another kind would only aggravate the calamities of that
fated nation. (Hear, hear.) These were the conclusions at
which the Government of Lord Grey arrived, and they
were announced to Parliament. This is a question which
the English Government has had more than one opportu-
nity to consider, and on every occasion they have considered
it deeply and completely like men. The Polish question
occurred again in 1855, when a conference was sitting at
Vienna, in the midst of the Russian war. Again, her
Majesty's Government—the Government of the Queen—had
to consider the question. It was then considered under the
most favourable circumstances to Poland ; for we were at
war with Russia. But, after performing all the duties of a
responsible Ministry under such circumstances, her Majes-
ty's Government arrived at these conclusions—that it was
not only not expedient for England to go to war to restore
Poland, but it was not even expedient to prolong war for
that purpose. And squally they arrived at the second con-
clusion, that any interference on our part, without action,
would not be just to the Poles, and must tend to increase
their difficulties. Thus this very question of Poland has in
the present century, within the last 34 years only, been
twice considered by two Governments ; and therefore when
I remind the house that when it was considered by the
Cabinet of Lord Grey in 1831, the individual who filled the
office of Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, and who of
course greatly guided the opinion of his colleagues upon such
a question, was the present First Minister—and when I also
remind the house that the plenipotentiary at the Conference
a' Vienna, to whom and upon whose responsibility in a
great degree the decision was then arrived at, was the pre-
sent Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs—l think Eng-
land had a right, when the great difficulty of last year arose
with respect to Poland, to congratulate herself that in a
situation of such difficulty, at an emergency when a mis-
take might produce incalculable evils, its fortunes were re-
guleted not only by two men of great abilities and experi-
ence, but by statesmen who upon this subject possessed a
peculiar experience, who had thoroughly entered into the
question, who knew all its issues and the contingencies
that possibly might occur in its management, and who, on
the two occasions when it was submitted to the decision of
England had been the guiding Ministers in the wise decision
which was then arrived at. Now, sir, I must remind the
house that what is called the Polish question occupies a dif-
ferent position in France to what it does in England. I will
not admit that in deep sympathy for the Poles the French are
superior to the English. I believe lam only stating accu-
rately the feeling of this cmu try when I say that among
people of all classes there is no event which they look back I
to with more regret than the partition of Poland. (Hear.)
It is universally considered and acknowledged by them as
one of the darkest, it not the darkest, page in the history of
the 18th century. (dear, hear.) But in France the Polish
question is not one which merely interests tee sentiment of
the millions. It is a political question, and a question of
the highest class in France. It is a question which inte-
rests ministers, and cabinets, and princes. There is a be-
lief in France which has made the restoration of Poland a
traditionary policy in that country, namely, that that re-
storation would tend to add to the power and the glory of
France. In France it is also a practical question, because
there are men now alive who can remember when the eagles
tt France floated over the ancient capital of Poland. But I
think that their feelings of pride must be dashed with a
sentiment of remorse, if they really value so much the re-
storation cf Poland, when they remember the opportunity
they then lost. Then the house must recollect that when
an insurrection occurs in Poland, it is a different affair in
Francs to what it is in England. It is not an affair that
merely interests those who frequent the cafes and casinos,
but it at once strikes into the secrets of cabinets and prin-
ces. Well, Sir, the ruler of France, a sagacious prince and
a lover of peace, as the Secretary of State has just informed
us, was perfectly alive, of course, to the great issues in-
volved in what is called the Polish question. But France
knew very well that England had twice had an opportunity
of considering this question in the completest manner, and
had arrived at a settled policy, and, with characteristic cau-
tion, the Emperor eitercieed great reserve, and held out but
little encouragement to the representatives of Polish feeling.
He knew well that in 1855 he, then being our ally, had
urged this question upon the English Government, and that
under the most favourable circumstances for life restoration
of Poland ; and he knew that we had then adhered to our
traditionary policy, which was neither to go to war nor to
pursue a war, and therefore the Emperor ot France and the
French Government generally exhibited a very great reserve
on the subject. But what, in a short time was the astenieh-
ment of the Emperor, when he found the English Govern-
ment embrecing the cause of Poland with an extraordinary
fervour ? The noble lord the Secretary of State, and the
noble lord the First Minister, but especially the Secretary
or State, announced their policy as if it were a policy new I
oto the cosideration of statesmen, and about to lead to
im-
wense results. The noble lord the Secretary of State sent
4 copy ot his despatch to all the Courts of Europe who were
signataries to the Treaty of Vienna—from the King of
Portugal down to the King of Sweden—calling Russia to
account for the position of affairs in Poland. We know very
well that for three months Europe believed there was to be
a general war on a great scale, of which the restoration of
Poland was to be one of the leading objects. Is it at all
surprising that the Government of France and the French
people should have responded to such stimulating proposals?
(Hear, hear.) It was not only natural--it was inevitable.
We know the noble lord (Earl Russell) fooled them to the
top of their bent. The House recollected the noble lord's
six propositions, to which he called the attention of the
Emperor of Russia in the most peremptory manner. The
House remembers the closing scene, when it was arranged
that the ambassadors of France, Austria, and England
should on the very same day appear at tho hotel of the
Minister of Russia, and should present notes of the most
cordial tone, ending with three identic paragraphs, to show
the agreement of the three Powers. It was generally be-
lieved there was to be a general war, and that France,
Austria, and England would unite to restore Poland. The
house remembered the reply cf Russia—that the Russian
Minister replied to all this with haughty sarcasm and with
indignation which deigned to be ironical. Well, Sir, there
was only one step to take, according to the view of the
French Government, and that was action. They appealed
to that England which had itself excited agitation on the
subject and raised expectations; but England recurred to
the traditionary policy of this country, and confessed it was
a momentary indiscretion that had animated their counsel,
and that they never meant anything more than words. (Op-
position cheers.) A month afterwards they sent a despatch ;
but this did not alter the position of the French Emperor
and the French Government. He had been induced by us
to make promises which he could not fulfil. He was placed
in a false position to the people of Poland and the people of
France, and therefore I am not surprised that when the Sec-
retary of State was a little alarmed at the progress of affairs
in Germany, he thought it discreet to reconnoitre his posi-
tion ; and that in September he should have been received
at Paris with coldness, and that ultimately his despatch was
answered in this manner : Mr Grey, writing to Lord Rus-
sell, said, on 18th September, 1803, " The second mode of
proceeding suggested by your lordship, viz , 'to remind
Austria, Prussia, and the German Diet, that any acts on
their part tailing to weaken the integrity and independence
of Denmark would be at variance with the treaty of May 8,
1852,' would be, according to the opinion of M. Drouyn de
Lhuys, in a great measure analogous to the course pursued
by Great Britain and France on the Polish question.
(Laughter.) He frankly avowed that he should so speak to
the Emperor as to place France in the same position with
reference to Germany as she had been placed in with regard
to Russia. The formal notes addressed by the three Powers
to Russia had received an answer which literally meant no-
thing, and the position in which those three great Powers
were now placed was anything tut dignified ; and if Eng-
laud and France were to address such a reminder as that
proposed to Austria, Pi ustia, and the Get emu Confedera-
tion, they inuct be lrepared to go !urr.oer, and to es:opt a
course of action more in accordance with the dignity of two
great Powers than they were now &log in the Polish ques-