The National Register.
London, England, 1820-05-07 00:00:00

mine witnesses relative to charges against tieorge Ed-
wards. lie miderstood that Edwards was about to leave
the country, and lie had written to Lord Sidmoitilt, de-
fining that such person might be prevented from leaving
the kingdom.
Mr. S. WOIITLEY presented a Petition from the West
Riding of Yorkshire, complaining of the impolitic Tax
on V 4 001, observing that his mind was made up on the
subject.
Lord MILTON presented a similar Petition' remark-
log that the Tax had been imposed when the trade was in
a ruinous state ; as a measure of revenue the tax had
failed. It was within his knowledge that an important
contract, to clothe the Russian army, had been lust to this
country, mid owing, he amity believed to this tax, which
was most impotent as a measure of relief to agticulture.
It had been equally useless in protecting the manufactures.
Even if the tax were necessary, was this the time to im-
pose it ?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER observed,'
that as a measure of revenue the tax had not been feisty
tried—it could not yet be said to have failed.
The Petition was front Leeds and its neighbourhood.
Read and ordered to be printed.
Mr. GORDON moved for accounts of the progress
made in building the New Post Office, in getting plans,
&c. He did not object to the new office, but he still
complained of the mode of raising the money, namely,
by burdeming the Orphan'. Fond. Accounts ordered.
Sir H. PARNEL brought forward his motion for cer-
tain Civil List Accounts. He considered the expence of
the Civil Government of these kingdoms to be little less
than 2.000,0001. a year, made sip by grants from Parlia-
ment, the Fee Fond, ace. He sliouLl therefore require
accounts of the produce of the Fee Faun Office, &e.;
of the Revenue and other emoluments of the Duchy of
Lancaster; and of the several additions made to the Civil
List during the late reign, and of the charges taken away
from such fund.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER replied,
that many of these accounts were ttttt lece-sary, as must
of the intormation was atirady before the House. As to
the report of 1816, lie thought there could be no objec-
tion to re-print it. (Hear!) The accounts being mute-
cessiry, lie should move the previous question.
Mr.TIEUNEY was satisfied that the papers, or some
such documents were requisite; but, even if the question
were waived, he begged to be understood nut to give up
Lis right to have papers on the subject.
Mr. CALLRAFT and Sir H. Parnell ob d, that if
the motion were abaudoned, it was on the understanding,
that the report should be re-printed.—(Hear!)
Previous question carried, and the report of 1818 was
afterwards ordered to lie re-printed; Mr. Tierney hav-
ing remarked, that what he wanted to know was, what
bad happened since 1815 and 1818.
Mr. CALCRAFT (for Sir J. Newport) obtained leave
to bring in a bill to regulate the office of Clerk of the
Peace in Ireland.
Mr. HUNIF. brought forward his motion, also for Ac-
counts illustrative of the state of the Civil List. He re-
quited the sums total fur previous years, hut lie wished to
have all the items for the last year. The House knew that
many sums ceased to be paid out of the Civil List, about
600.0001.; but it would be impossible to understand the sub-
ject without having the items of the Bth class,aod the details
of the occasional class. The information be required was
no where to be obtained without immense labour; lie there-
fore thought there could be no such objecti tttt urged to his
motion us had been made against the previous propositions !
lie conclud .d with moving for a series of accounts of the
alllolllll in total paid on each class since ISIS, of the con-
tinecocies.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that
the A.. Wills were ordered to be laid regularly before Par-
liament, by Act of Parliament I if such direction had not
been complied with. let the instance be pointed out. He
concluded with moving the previous question.
Mr. HUME hoped that the House would assist him in
calling fur these accounts, and nut stiller his motion to be
thus met.
Mr. HUSKISSON said, it was a new doctrine to hold,
that the House was entitled to accounts regarding the Civil
List, whenever they were called for. Mr. Fox had held
that the House ought not to call fur detailed accounts
regarding the Civil List, except where the Crown came for
assistance to the Civil List,--(Hcar, from the opposition
benches.) All the fluorination required could be obtaiiied
from the estimate of the preceding year; and therefore why
ahould the mot' be acquiesced its to grAify the curiosity
of any Holt. Vlember, of how touch might have hero paid
for wine, sir iii the Lord Chainherhon's departmeiit.—
(Hear, hear.)
Mr. TIERNEY said this speech nal noon extraordinary.
It was argued, as ifs Gad Lis, existed, w hereas the quest inn
was, how to inake a Civil List ; and the whole was iiilW to
he begun sir 11110 . 'resides, to piupurtiou to the indelicacy
of agitating the solij..ct a hen "finally arraitAed," the more
incumbeet was it on them to enquire Hun. S thought
that all the money granted had ion been expended ; at all
sweats thi y sought to know ahe ther 101 l much or Ism little
had been grunted. When the sums had been perinaneutly
arranged, then it would be indelicate to Heir ; but HUN'
when they were its agitation, sorely it became theiu to
enquire.
Lord J. RUSSELL thought the motion extremely fair.—
To refuse the A CCOUIIIt, its the present distressed sate of the
people, itould he timing the country extremely ill, and cer-
tainly to say that a Report was made in 1815 or IslB, was
not such an suss% er as Ile I 11011•: hl the !loose roi4lit to !creole.

The gallery was Ili is cleared for a dlvision.—Some iliscus-
ttion took place w hile stiangers were excluded. Nu division
took place, soul alien strani,tera were rt.admitte.l,
Lord ON Nil% . llllBllllng that ever) tittle of
evidence should h.• rcfosed alien the, were called ill lO
urrange th C'. .1 LI t dt the commencement of a new reigif.
Sttauger• wei.• .Pain ordered to withdraw fur a dis him!.
The ounitoov were— rt)cs GO—Noes 113—Majority us 53
against 11w 111111111.
Mr. II U DI L, on our ;e-entering the gallery, arging
his neat uu.tion for Papers respecting the Civil C 1111••
tending that the details of Ihe last year were now hese to he
found. Hu concluded w ith moving for oilier hurts
were severalls refused by negativing the snot. ttttt , Ihe Chan-
cellor ut tar Esc loopier mosiog " the pi csious Ques • ."
Air. lIU.tII. Ural 11111%,ed for au Aelllll.llll of his Majest) '3
ROW, vl d Revell al, of Scotland, &c. force accounts he
considered most 11111/1111 $lll 10 a right adjudication of the
Civil List. The Itesecuev were applied to petiblotts to sup-
port Ministers fialuente, and to enable them to c.,rrupt the
Members of that llouve.—(Hear, hear !)—tic should move
au account to such purport, in a few days, as an mower to

1 47

Inoue, taxes on billard tables, besides public lotteries.—
Whether all these sums were sent home Ile knew net ; bat
they were raised to be sent home to the King's pri vjr
purse. Thus she Sovereign exercised a power of raising
mosey for his own private use. As so the economy of the
place, he mentioned that in war there was one Town.
Major, now there were two; in war, these were two
Barrack Masters, uow there were three! and so on.—
Supposing the money was raised tOr the rubiic service,
it ought to be carried to the public accounts, and not to
the pi ivy purse. If they were Crown Revenues, be con-
sidered them to have been viimally given by the first of
Geo. 111., which re-settled the Civil List. Far too murk
was raised, considering the smallness of she place ; and
while a million was voted for the boilding of churches—
a vote which he deemed unuecessary—he regretted that
more attention was not paid to the religious establish-
menu, schools, &c. of Gibraltar. He concluded with
moving for returns of the duties raised in Gibraltar in
1800 and 1818; of the number and nature of the officer
in the Garrison Establishment ; of the total amount of
revenues and how disposed of, &c.
Mr. HOB HOUSE seconded she motion.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER lamented
that she Hon. 51embae had deemed it necessary to go in')
0101 detail, enlarging on the general government of Gib-
raltar. He should move an Amendment for a general ac-
count for the produce (luring a series of years—an ac-
coons that might boon be produced.
Sir J. M'INTOSH thought the Rights of she Garrison
had nut been nested with that consideration to which
they were entitled. He hoped the amendment would by
accepted for the present.
Mr. HUM E's two first papers were ordered, and the
third was altered as suggested by the Cirancellor of the
Exelrequer and agreed to.
The remaining orders having been disposed of, the
House adjourned.
FRIDAY, PLAY S.
Leave was given to bring hi a Bill to light the City tar
Norwich with Gas.

Mr. M. A. TAYLOR brought in a Bill to punish cri•
persons found guilty of the negligent driving of
stage coaches.--Read a first time, and ordered to be read
a second time ou Monday nett.
The Committee of Supply was postponed to Monday
nest.

The House went into a Committee on the Insolvent
Debtors' Act Continuance Rill. The blanks were tilled
up, and the Report ordered to be received on Monday.
Mr. W. SMITH moved for Returns of all Extents in
Aid issued since .1 y Itil9.—Ordered.
REVENUES OF THE CROWN.
Mr. BROUGHAM rose to tiling I'm ward his motion
on the subject of the Revenues of the Crown and the Civil
List. The motion had not been songlit by Ilion; he felt
pledged by what passed in 11412 to bring the subject be-
fore the Honse, in the event of Alihisters, ou G .orge
death, not doing so. In bringing it furs% aril, be did not
contemplate any degradation of the Crown, or of the
means by which its dignity was supported. 'these were
not times to tamper with such subjects ; but he desired
not the support of any man who was nut convinced of
the expediency, as well as safety, of his motion. It was
according to precedent, and conformed to principle. It
kept within the strict lines of those principles which had
been previously recognised; and lie submitted that he
should be able to show that it would support the dignity
of the Crown, and advance its security. He deemed
further preface unnecessary. 4s to Ike King's property
and revenue, it was au unquestionable principle of the
Constitution, admitted by the ablest writers, that the
Sovereign of England was incapable of holding any sepa-
rate property. He was prepared to prove tins at length,
if it were deemed necessary; but the principle, lie would
take it for granted, was not to he disputed. It was esta-
blished by the cam of the Duchy of Lancaster, and by a
celebrated cause that arose regarding certain old stores,
reported by Lord Coke, where it was disputed how those
stores could be granted, whether by the King's sign ma-
nual or otherwise. Lord Clarendon also detailed a simi-
lar case. It arose in those times when there were pro-
ceeding most important disputes between the Commons
and the Crown. It was then held to be an unnatural
docti toe to hold, that the King could have any sums that
did not pass through the customary channels, and were
not accounted for in the usual way. Lord Clarendon
declared, that, if a contrary doctrine were held and acted
upon, the King might live to repent the day when he lis-
tened to such principles. That doctrine was long held...
till Mr. Pitt attacked it, and he was the first to attack the
principle, by the a9th of George 111. Turn it was esta-
blished that the King could have separate property, by
which the Monarch might get together resources sufficient
to defeat even the votes of Parliament.—Farther, the
King was enabled to hold copyliolds, and of the subject
toot and yet those who supported this doctrine also
talked of upholding the dignity and 'mite of the Crown.
(Hear, hear!)--The Constitution recognized no such
principle.—What cr.... MS.•'••••••• ••••••••••••
Or igiliAllY granted to enable the Sovereign to early on the
Gut rrninent, and were devoted to the payment of officers.
&c. lie had to admit that at great change had taken
place in the mode of managing the money concerns of tl:e
Guset 1111 l ent—the Parliament paying tor all those se!.
vices of defence, Ste. which were usually 11i-frayed by the
Crown Revenues, Droits, &e. without wholly approp:
sting the rev enues,tlse Crown having nevertheless received
upwards of 13,000,0001. during the last Nor nail
such changes been confined to the The tythea
possessed by the Church were bartietteit wills the main-
tenance of the poor till the reigns of Mary, Elisabeth.
and Edward. Hcre was an analogous case. The CIIUICh
had tyrues and maintained the poor; the Clown had re-
venues, but they were burdened with evenditure. A
bargain was made with the church , thi y retained the
tytlics, but were deemed 14y.propei ty eltaigvahle with
the poor like other property. Let a sine:ar proceeifing
be adopted regarding the Crown revenins. As it wst•, nu
one knew what the King's Income was. They kne o the
amount of the King of France's—oh the President's—of
the StadtholdeCs,&e.;—bst the great.,st adept cool l not
find the exact minutia of the King of England's ineame.
This exposed the Crown to misrepresentation, Amigo on.
misrepresentation.—Mr. Paine, for installer, in his bout.
declared, that the King of Eitgl.mil cost the country lie.
tweet 8 and 900,1001. per mini um ; adding, in his e./Olhe
but strong manner, that he could get an able bodied mar
to do it for atial. a year. (A was the mains'
consequence of the jumblitig that now took place to Ill.!