The Sun.
London, England, 1855-02-17 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, SATURDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 17, 1855.

nistered during the last 11 months of war. In the year 1 six sail of the line, one a three-decker, another of 100 guns ho would lay the navy under the greatest possible oblige-
-1832 a change wasmade the con uo of naval votes,
• in d tand lon two decks, and four other shipi of the line of the largest Vous to him. (Hear, hear.) It had been said that. the
close, all propelled by stew ',owe). • tee it is la-•s ne . Hest 'ltalia.. fl at, loel been he tly le -an I eael we; a- e: et-
more especially with reference to the accounts of the navy. - e. , • , _ • 3 us, Inen, i chi e., e s taeee t, i, a a.- ,
,by 'ilia ,rOverlitlient r,, ..!,-t r:lry- sewn! 71;ips -7,-ia,.-;:‘r .0 pe, a- e iii- se •-- ehla of ....... 4..1„, ~ heta
From a very early period, almost from the Revolution of I the Baltic. (Hear.) Our experience has taught Us thet ; badly manned, and he knew that it was very chili:::; to
1788, owing to the wide extent of the naval expenditure, the mixture of screw and sailing ships is not conducive I bring badly manned ships into good discipline. e 1 number
an expenditure carried on in every part of the world, and to the interests of the service. They cannot be manoeuvred of laudsrnon and men from the coastguard and dockyards
to the accounts having been remitted at uncertain periods, together. The commander-in-chief, not using the same were huddled together and called a "ship's crew." A
whenever a war took place the naval debt began to ac- arm, but having to consider the use, first, of the sailing gallant officer had observed to him that, however much
cumulate, and, before the close of the war, in 1813, the ships
and then of the screw ships, is baffled in his ar- pressed, ho would not have taken the command of some of
naval debt, separates from the national debt, amounted to rangements, and the efficiency of the fleet materially af- those ships, because he was persuaded that if he had gone
8,500,0001. The origin of this debt is to be traced partly fected. It is intended to send into the Baltic in the en- into action with them he would have lost his reputation.
to the circumstance I have mentioned—of the wide area suing year vessels propelled by steam alone, and I hope IHe recommended that bounties should be given to sailors
over which that expenditure is spread, and partly also to before six weeks or two mouths are over 20 sail of the ,as well as to soldiers. The good effect of raising a bounty
the vicious system of drawing bills at long dates, which line, propelled by steam, will be ready to resume i had been experienced in the case of the army, and he could
had prevailed from the Revolution down to the year 1832. operations in that quarter. (Cheers.) Considering the I not but regard it as an act of craziness to withhold it from
In that year precautions were taken by Parliament with scale of those operations, the consumption of coal must be I the sailor. He rejoiced that an Order of Merit was about
reference to the system of drawing bills. Instead of pay- enormous. The expense, therefore, is great, though ex. to be instituted, which would be attainable by men of all
meat by bills prompt payment was introduced, and addi- perience shows that the expense is net so great having re- ranks. He was convinced that it would act as a great
tional precautions were also taken to ensure greater aecu- gard to the superiority of the screw over sailing vessels. I stimulus directly it became known, and he trusted that
I
racy in the preparation of the estimates ; because, under the have already told you that at the end of the French war it would be speedily adopted and promptly awarded. A
more lax system which prevailed up to that time, the we had 147,000 sailors and marines. I ask you only on the I great deal had been said as to the tate of the harbour at
estimates were generally low, the expenditure in war con- present occasion to have 70,000. At the end of th French ! alaklava, and he, as a naval officer, could not conceive
stantly exceeded them, and that excess was met by the war, when we had really not an enemy on the sea, nor a i why such confusion had prevailed there, for thou ,h the
creation of a separate naval debt. Now, sir, the precau- rival, we had in commission somewhere about 100 or 110 harbour was small yet the water was smooth, and the ships
lions taken were considered at the time to be ample, and sail-of-the-line. According to the proposition which I now ' could lie by the side of each other. In the case of the
lam glad to say, after 20 years' experience, they have make, we shall not have above 46 or 50 sail-of-the-line, ' Prince, he should like to know under whose superiuten-
proved satisfactory. An alteration was made in the Ap- but I believe the smaller force, with a smaller number of i dance it was loaded, so that the wrong things were placed
propriation Act, which compelled not only the perpetual men, but with all the appliances of modern art and uppermost, and when it had entered the harbour with a
audit of the accounts, but when there has been an excess science, will be found no less efficacious to sustain the i most precious freight of clothing for the soldiers, some one
in the expenditure of the year beyond the vote of supply honour of this country either in measures of offence or de- I ordered it out, and who gave that order ?
for the naval expenditure of that year, it has been by law fence. (Hear.) And if that be so, although the propor- Sir J. GRAHAM—It never entered the harbour.
rendered compulsory that that excess shall be stated to tion of expenditure may be heavy in the purchase of ma- Captain SCOBELL---Why had it not entered, then ?It
,
Parliament by an independent board of audit, and that ohinery, and the substitution of an artificial propelling was there several days before it lost its anchor and cable or
that excess shall be brought under the notice of a commit- power for a natural one, yet, on the whole, my belief is, two and was wrecked. He trusted that this country would
tee of supply, and the deficiency made good by a separate that, notwithstanding the extra expenditure, the balance 1 not, in carrying on the war with vigour, attempt to imitate
vote ; or, if there be a surplus, that that surplus shall be of advantage even on the lower ground of expense will be the continental Powers with regard to the size of the army.
carlt was impossible that this country could compete with
Had to the credit of the year in which such surplus ec- found to be in favour of modern science and modern ins-'
them in numbers; but there was no reason why the army
carted. (Hear.) The first vote I have to bring under your prevenient. (Hear.) The excess of coal is estimated at
notice is in accordance with this provision. In the year 600,000/. That may appear alarming, but it must be re- I should not be kept in a state of efficiency.
Mr. COWPER observed that, by the regulations made
ending the 31st of March, 1854, the surplus of expenditure membered that in the Black Sea we are rapidly substitut-
over the sum voted was 79,0001. Considering the large hug steam-vessels only for a force mainly consisting of sail- Iby the Admiralty, admirals
sums of which the estimates were composed, this amount ing vessels, and, as I have stated, we intend to solid to the
' service passed off to the retired lists, while officers reached
is in itself insignificant, but the production of this excess Baltic 20 sail-of-the-line, which will form part of a fleet of 1 their flags when they were full of vigour and wore able
now is a proof of the efficacy of the new system and of the 100 vessels, all propelled by steam. This brings me to an- ito render more active service to their country than had careful observation of the role laid down by Parliament. other explanation of this heavy expenditure. France and
I been the case under former regulations. The complaint
(Hoar, hear.) The next vote, as I have already said, has England have come to a mutual agreement to prepare for as to no bounty having been given was note reasonable
reference to the present year, ending on the 31st of March, operation in the Baltic 5 floating batteries, 20 gunboats, one, as it would be seen by the votes that; without the
and notwithstanding the large amount which Parliament and 10 mortar-boats, making together 10 floating batteries,
bounty,
they obtained 44 more seamen than the number
generously voted foe the naval service in the last year, 40 gunboats, and 20 mortar-beats, all heavily armed, and that had been voted by Parliament. The hon. member
amounting, independently of the cost of transports, to of light draught, and all propelled by steam. In con- (Captain Sco
above 8,000,0001., the actual surplus expenditure for the cart with France—happily our ally, no longer our rival,
d he
()had spoken to the house of the loss of the
year ending on the 31st of March, as nearly as we can cal- except in the honest and earnest endeavour to bring this Prince
made shouldan act as a warning to all who trusted too lightly (Mr. Cowper) thought that the observations
cnlate it, including transports, will amount to a sum of contest to an honourable close by increased exertions—
to the accounts received of the loss of ships in the Crimea,
1,938,0001. Of this sum on a former evening, a vote was we have during the winter been preparing this im- as the hon. member was entirely wrong in supposing that
taken on account for 1,600,000/., and there remains there- manse armament. Parliament, in its generosity, voted
fore to be voted a sum of about 300,0001. Now, the a large portion to meet this expenditure, but a considerable tho Prince had over entered the harbour of Balaklava, foron its arrival, the harbour was so full of ships unloading
estimates for the ensuing year are larger than the esti- amount for steam-engines and the construction of vessels that it became necessary for the Prince to wait outside
mates voted for the current year, independently of this still remains outstanding; and, having mentioned the in-
for its turn to enter. The loss of the Prince could not be
supplementary estimate, by a sum of about 2,000,0001. crease of the vote for the purchase of stores and coals, the 1
I quoted as a loss against the Royal Navy, for the captain
If we take, in addition to the sum actually residue of excess is made up of 650,000/. for steam ma- 1'
was not in her Majesty's service, and, if fault there was,
voted, this supplementary estimate for the current chinerY, and 350,0001. still outstanding for the building of lit ought to reat ou the merchant service, and not on the year of 1,938,0001., the sum asked being about 10,000,0001., floating batteries, mortar-boats, and gun-vessels, to which Royal Navy.
is only an increase of 299,0001., independently of trans- I have already adverted. The 650,0001. for steam machi-
ports, for the whole naval service of next year, as cons- nery will not only be applied to vessels already launched Mr. LAYARD was desirous of saying a few words on
pared with the expenditure of the current year. In former and forming part of the naval force to be employed in the behalf of a deserving and meritorious class of men in the
house was aware of the
years of war the number of men voted has been infinitely Baltic and the Black Sea, but it is proposed, in the course
navy, who he thought had of late been somewhat ill-treated
larger than the number of men which I now ask at your of the ensuing year, to launch five or six line-of-battle
—he alluded to the masters. The
hands. The number of men voted in 1814 was no less than ships and frigates, of a most powerful description, for onerous duties of the mentors in the navy, and, though in
147,000 men. The proposition which I now make to the which steam machinery will be supplied under the vote the Black Sea their services had not been so mach required
committee is, that there shall be an addition to the pre- which I now ask. Therefore, you will observe, steps have in the Baltic the services of this class had been called forth
in a very distinguished manner, and yet not a sin le pro
making force of 6,700 seamen and boys, and of 500 marines, been taken not only to increase the efficiency of the force
itiotiolhristallbeletandart conferred upendliem.-One of theg mpas-
making the naval force for the ensuing year amount to now afloat, but to meet any reverses, should they occur—
c arly distinguished himself, and
70,000 men. The excess now asked for over the sum and reverses in war can never be considered as avoidable. tare,hadbeen. mentioned in theudespatehen. He believed that
voted for the current year amounts altogether, as I have They will occur, and precautions are taken by having shipa
the omission of this branch of the service had created already stated, excluding the supplementary estimate, of equal capacity and equal power to meet any loss which,
siderable disappointment. He trusted that the hon. and
con-
which is the second vote, to about 2,000,000/. This ox- in the course of the coming year, may be sustained.
gallant member for Middlesex (Mr. B. Osborne), in his
cess arises upon five votes. It arises upon vote 1, for men, (Hear, hear.) The next vote of which there is any excess g
ar-
amounting to 231,0001. ; upon vote 2, for victuals, amount- is vote 11, for new works. The sum of that excess is public.t.service, would
etentozve?;ll.ofookh
the claims
oimlapurnosvoef
thisment ovfortyhemoriorions
branch
of
ing to 303:0031. ; on vote 8, for wages, 171,0001.; vote 10, 188,0001., partly to be traced to a new bakery at Deptford, i
the public service. (Hear.)
for stores, machinery, and ships, amounting to 1,088,000/. ; necessitated by the large demand for the supply of biscuits
and vote 11, new works, 188,0001. As I have already to the fleets. The new mode of construction has so added Admiral BERKELEY said, that the subject just alluded
stated to the house, the large number of seamen voted at to the length of ships of war as to render necessary the to by the hon. member was under the consideration of the
the end of the former war, amounted altogether, seamen lengthening of the docks at Portsmouth, Chatham, and Admiralty. (Hear, hear.) A good deal had-been said about
and marines, to 147,000 men, and I hays contrasted that Sheerness, the expense of which is considerable; and there the stowage of the unfortunate ship the Prince. Now,
number with the present force which it is my duty to pro- is also a sum expended on works at Keyham to expedite a committee had been appointed by the Government to in_
pose to you. But I must here call to the remembrance of the completion of the factories there for the construction quire into the loss of that ill-fated vessel, and he would
the house the altered circumstances under which the na- of steamers of war. (Hear, hear.) Now, sir, I have gone read an extract from the report at which this committee
val force is now created. Throughout the last war impress- through briefly the principal heads of excess in the votes , arrived. The extract in question was to the effect that the
meat universally prevailed. I have the pleasure of stating of the ensuing year as contrasted with the votes of the evidence adduced not only disproved the allegation that the
to the committee that, at this moment, the full amount of past, and this will probably form the effective expenditure. loading of the ship was grossly neglected, but also esta-
naval force voted by Parliament, exclusive of marines, It will be satisfactory to the house to hear that what blished the fact that the caotain of the vessel had noground
amounting to somewhere near 61,000 men—the whole of is termed the dead weight of the navy is progressively whatever for stating that shot, shell, and gunpowder had
that force is now afloat and is available for service, by yo- diminishing. In 1831, when my attention was first di- j boon placed on the top of the medical stores. With regard
luntary enlistment—(hear, hoar)—and the whole number rected to these matters, the half-pay of the navy was to the transport service, it should be remembered thatthes e
voted by Parliament is, indeed, somewhat exceeded. 873,000/. For the current year, 1851, it is only could be no comparison made between the state of tho
(Hear.) The expenditure under vote 1, which is some- 693,0001., showing a decrease of 182,0001. Then, too, transport service during the last war and the improved.
what in excess, is to be traced to causes which have ran- with regard to civil pensions. In 1834 1 had the honour manner in which it was now conducted. The house might
dered this voluntary enlistment comparatively easy of introducing a measure for the purpose of effecting con- depend upon it that there was little to complain of with
By the generosity of Parliament various alterations sislera.ble reductions in that branch. The difference is very regard to this branch of the service.
have been introduced into the pay and allowances sensible, and it will become more and more so. In 1834 Sir G. TYLER said, that in the course of last session he
of seamen. Some of these, I think, I have stated the civil pensions of the navy amounted to 230,0001. This had ventured to suggest to the First Lord of the Admiralty
upon former occasions to the house; some I have year we ask only for 149,0001. showing a decrease, which that bounties should be offered to induce able seamen to
now to state for the first time. There was, for ex- is progressive, of 81,0001. lam warned that I shall not enter the navy, a measure which, he thought, would be
ample, what appeared to tie Board of Admiralty an uu- find it easy to continue these remarks, even if the com- productive of very beneficial results. The consequence of
just distinction in the pay of marines afloat as compared mitts," should kindly bear with me ; but I thought it my such bounties not being given, he regretted to say, had been
with the pay of those on shore. A deduction was made duty to appear this evening for the purpose, however ha- that the Baltic fleet was anything but well manned. There
from their pay in consideration of the rations which were perfectly, of stating the questions now to be submitted to was a very marked distinction betweenthe naval andrnili-
issued to them together with the seamen. That reduction you with regard to the navy expenditure. (The right hon. tary services in this respect, which must, he thought, tend
has now been abolished, and a marine now receives his pay baronet was evidently suffering from recent indisposition.) to excite disgust in the navy, unless it were allowed to
whether afloat or on shore, without any reduction, and It has been said, and said truly, that to bring this war to participate in the advantages enjoyed by the sister service.
when serving afloat is placed on a footing of perfect equality a speedy and honourable conclusion every effort which this The bounty given in the army averaged from 61. to 101.
with seamen. (Hear.) Then, again, there was a new country can make is indispensable. (Near.) I would have per man, and the soldier also received his clothing free.
rating introduced towards the close of the last year—that the committee bear in mind we are making war on a Sove- The right hon. baronet said that clothing was furnished
of leading men, with a higher class of pay, as constrasted reign whose empire is great and remarkable on account of to the seamen at a cheaper rate than its prime cost; but
with ablebodied seamen. Then, again, we have introduced its being almost unassailable. We are carrying on that why, he asked, should he not be presented with it, on
a system of payment infinitely more prompt than hereto- war in the neighbourhood of his resources and at a distance entering the service, in the same wayas the soldier was ha-
fore. By this arrangement, ships are paid almost inarne- from our own. We have carried that war into his Conn- mediately on his volunteering for the army ? The same
diately on their arrival in port, a principle which was in- try—a country almost destitute of provisions—and we are stamp of property might easily be placed on the sailor's
troduced by the Government which preceded the one to carrying it on upon the Black Sea, which is a sea without clo thingaswas impressed maths uniforfn of the soldier. But
which I lately had the honour to belong, by the Board of a harbour. These are great strains on our naval power. the army possessed other advantages over the navy ; and if
Admiralty, presided over by the Duke of Northumber- (Hear.) It is asked, what have you done with regard to this inequality were redressed he believed it would afford
land. In consequence of this system of prompt payment, your expenditure for the navy ? Now, I really must say great satisfaction to the latter service. Another point that
I may mention the Baltic fleet, whI9N, has recently re- that on the whole the operations in the Baltic, as they were had been referred to in that discussion related to the naval
turned to England, had been paid up in full, with the ex- conducted last year, appear to me to deserve the approba- coast volunteers. He saw an item of 50,0001. in the esti-
caption of some two months' pay. Then, again as to allot- tion of the house, Bomarsund, a most important naval mates of the last and the present year for these coast volun-
mentos of pay ;—therehave beeninereasedfacilities afforded station, fortified strongly, and bearing marks of an inten- teers. He thought it would be in the rignt hon. baronet's
in that important matter—the privilege of the seaman in tion to carry that system of fortification to a much greater recollection that he had previouslypressed on his attention
' exercising an independent right of disposal over his own extent, has been destroyed. The naval arsenal close to the propriety of establishing a naval reserve and the right
earnings. Were were restrictions formerly on that right the capital the Theeperor of RBAd. , a rsited by measure,t, swan-. .......„..sea„ oauce a
in,..— vv iso 1 orce were nabio . Joiattie rn., repeatedly o effect that o Jed. He wished, therefore, to ask
which appeared to me to be neither necessary nor iust, A offered and repeatedly declined. (Hear.) Up to last month if the increase of 20,000 men now proposed was designed
...J.... v..s Livv perzniGteu to allot me pay, excepsing ea
certain degrees of affinity—relationship was necessary to Sweaborg, with nine sail-of-the-line, was blockaded by to form the reserve which it was meant to establish ? '
constitute the right of an allottee. The Board of Admiralty an inferior force of frigates only. Never were operations Sir J. GRAHAM.—It would be the commencement
has abolished that restriction, and a seaman now has a more successful, displaying more gallantry, more discipline of it.
perfect right to nominate any person to whom he wishes than the operations in the Baltic. (Hear, hear.) In Sir G. TYLER supposed that they would be kept as a
his pay to be allotted, without reference at all to any degree that sea not a ship was lost, and a most effective blockade mere coastguard in England and Scotland. Another item
of relationship, or any other consideration. Then again, in was kept up, and one that were displayed the energy, skill, was for the additional pay of petty officers in the coast-
regard to another important matter, a considerable sum, and gallantry of English officers and men, and the pressure guard service. Now, he. asked, if these coastgnardsmen,
197,0001., in excess of the vote for slops—clothing issued brought to bear upon the enemy was, I believe, by no when serving on board ship, were to be allowed to receive
'to the seamen. Tie cost price of articles of that desert p- means light. Then, also, lam bound to say, with reference double pay—that was, pay as both coastguardsmen and as tion has risen highly, but it has not been thought expo- to the conduct of the navy everywhere that it has been seamen at ono and the same time ? This would be unjust
dient to raise the price of those issued to the seamen, most satisfactory. You have a commerce covering every towards the other seamen who were doing the same duty at
'
and, in consequence, there is on the face of the esti- sea, and extending to the most remote parts of the globe, sea as these coastgatardemen. He thought that, when we
mates the sum of 197,0001., which is the estimated
and lam net aware that a single merchant ship has fallen had these additional men for a naval reserve, if the coast-
difference between the cost price to the public and the into the hands of the enemy. I hope and believe that, as guard were not required for the navy, they should be
lower price at which they are to be sold to the seamen. you have always done, as you will now have reason to do- allowed to return to their original employment. He had
(Hear.) Then, again, as to continuous service. This prin- pond upon the naval service for the support you have a made these remarks in the hope that the right hon. baronet
ciple was adopted last session, witn the full consent of right to expect. The naval service is the spear and the would consider them worthy of attention, and he believed
Parliament that men entering for a period of years not less
shield of the country„ it is the weapon of attack and the that, if we granted the same indulgences to the navy as
than 10 should receive a higher rate of pay, on account of
buckler of defence, it is the rock upon which we may build were shown to the army, we should be able to secure the
the permanent hold which the country would posses over our hopes of safety without fear of disappointment. (Hear.) services of good and efficient seamen for her Majesty's
their services by the abandonment of the right which men This nation has never failed to regard that service with navy.
hitherto had of claiming their discharge at the end of five the partiality and confidence it deserves, and you, as faith- Sir J. GRAHAM always listened with respect to sugges-
ful representatives of the people, will never do anything tions emanating from the hon. and gallant member. As to
years' service, That higher rate of pay has acted as an in-
ducement, and lam glad to inform the committee that at to injure that service. You will require a strict account the comparative pay of the army and navy, the remunera-
this moment nearly 20,000 seamen and first-class boys of expenditure from those who administer its affairs, but tion of the sailor was, relatively, infinitely higher than
have availed themselves of this higher rate of pay, and you will do nothing to impair its efficiency ; and I am that of the soldier. Whatever was given to the latter in the
this will form, before long, I believe, the best reserve on satisfied that, in so doing, you will best provide for the shape of bounty was reimbursed by him in the form of
which the country can rely for their naval force. (Hear.) national interests and the national security. (Hear.) The stoppages of pay on his first employment; whereas the
I have also to state that we have added, within the last right hon. baronet concluded by proposing a vote of sailor, from the moment he entered the service, received a
three years, nearly 4,000 men to the marines. I cannot 79,6991., to defray the excess of expenditure over the esti- higher scale of pay, which was liable to no such reduction.
too strongly impress on the committee my earnest desire, mates of last year. The gallant member had been misinformed if he supposed
the result of experience and of reflection, that this amount Mr. W. WILLIAMS did not rise for the purpose of 0P- that comagaardsmen serving as sailors drew pay both as
of 16,000 marines should, under any state of circum- posing any of the votes which might bo proposed, as ho ccastguardsmen and as sailors. Tne real state of the case
was that the coastguardsman when on board ship was con-
stanees, whether of peace or of war, be considered by Par- had, since the commencement of the war, constantly ex-
liament as the permanent force to be maintained. lam
pressed an opinion that every facili.y should be afforded received nothing
•e tinued in the enjoyment of the coastguard pay, but he
quite satisfied that this force is the nucleus from which a
fleet can be formed in the shortest time and with the in his capacity as a sailor. Every &ape-
to the Government to enable them to carry en the war sition was evinced to allow the coastguard to return to ser-
greatest certainty. There are no men who, on the whole, with vigour, in order to secure a speedy and honourable vice on shore, but the bargain made with them bound
are of such inestimable value. They are perfect as soldiers, peace. He wished to make a few observations on what them to serve on board ship when required in time of war,
they have been taught with success the light infantry ex- had fallen from the right hon. baronet. The right hon. and a discretion must of course be vested in the ruling
ercise, they are now acting as such in connexion with baronet had referred to the number of men required to power to determine when their services at sea could or
Lord Raglan's army, and, as to fitting out ships, they aro carry on the present war, as compared with the number could not be dispensed with.
so expert that there is a slackness on the part of seamen required to carry on the last; but he did not think Mr. PELL A.TT was understood to inquire whether any
to enter until the marines on board have performed the that there was any credit to be taken because the number provision was made for granting pensions as the widows
heaviest portion of the fitting out. They are perfect son required for the present war fell short of that required of warrant officers, and whether savings-banks were en-
diers, accomplished sailors—their merits cannot be too in the last. In the late war the naval forces of the coun- couraged in the navy ? He wished also to know if cem-
highly extolled or valued, and lam quite satisfied that it try had to operate in all parts of the world, while in the petition was allowed in regard to the manufacture of
is most conducive to the welfare of the naval service, and, present they were confined to blockading the
enemy in two machinery for the navy ?
consequently, to the safety of the State, that this should seas alone. With regard to the additional men required, Sir J. GRAHAM said, that abuses had crept in under
be regarded as the permanent force, and I hope that he thought that unless some more was to be done than had the former system of granting pensions to the widows of
Parliament will not, even in a time of peace, hastily been done last year they were unnecessary. The right hon these officers, and therefore an increase of pay had been
diminish the number of marines, or that any Govern- baronet had taken credit for the reduction of the half-pay allowed to the men in lieu of it. The practice of placing
rant, judging from past experience, will be slow to and, retired pensions list, but he could not join with him small deposits in savings-banks was fostered by every
reduce this forge of 16,000 men, which has required such in expressing any approbation on that account. What was
moans
in
the Admiralty's power. As to the manufacture
great exertions to raise, and which we have so suecessfully the state of the half-pay list at the present time ? The of the machinery required for the service, the Admiralty
trained, and which, I repeat, I am satisfied is the most committee must boar in mind that the services of only 17 found by experience that there wore only six or eight
valuable addition to the naval forces of this country which admirals were required, and of those, 4 were employed as firms in this country that could execute this description
it is possible to obtain. (Hear, hear) Upon the other port admirals. How many admirals, he wouldask,of work ; and the system pursued, when new orders had
There were no lose than 270—that
were ~ .
heads I have explained, so far as is necessary at present on the half-pay lint?
to do, the excess of vote 1 in the number of man. I hare was to say, that there was an admiral for every ship in to be given, was to issue private letters to sack of those
firms, infornsing• them of the nature of the machinery that
shown that, for 231,0001., you will obtain an increase of commission, as there were 9 admirals more upon it than
was demanded, and then to leave them to compete with
6,000 sailors and 500 marines. The next excess arises upon last year. With regard to captains,there 124 each other for its construction.'
creased 2, for previsions. That is easily explained by the in. ployed on service, while the number on the half-pay list
were em-
Mr. J. PHILLIMORE said, that he did not mean to
creased number of men to bo employed—not less than was 480; there were 127 commanders employed, while the enter upon the general question of the blockade at pro-
9, 000—and, in addition, there has been a material rise in the number living upon half-pay was 817. With these facts sent, but he was anxious to know whether an explanation
prices of articles which mainly constitute tho provisioning before him, he did not feel justified in congratulating tho could be given of the extraordinary manner in which
of the navy—salt provisions, fresh moat, and spirits—the committee. With regard to new works, some might be Odessa appeared to have been treated ?
rise upon which articles has been nearly 18 per cent. These necessary or even indispensable, but still he thought a large Sir J. GRAHAM said, that he had no difficulty in
two circumstances account for--this increase. The next vote portion of what was contemplated was net called for at stating that en more thari one occasion within the last six
in which there is an increase is vote 8, for wages so alibi- all. With regard to what had taken place in the Baltic months the attention of the commander-in-chief of the
core, lac., employed in her Majesty's establishments it home. last year, he thought that if nothing more were intended Black Sea had been drawn to the state of Odessa, and, if
That excess arises mainly from an addition of £OO ship- to ho done this year the expenditure proposed was execs. it were capable of being attacked by naval means, an
wrights, which, on account of the war, it has been thought sive. In manning the Baltic fleet last year, a number of opinion was expressed that, should the opportunity ofer,
fit to make to the establishments at home, and also from men had boon taken from the Coastguard at higher wages there should be no hesitation whatever in exercising the
the rise in wages paid to labourers arising from the high than those paid to the remainder of the crews, and he hoped full and complete power accorded of making a hostile visi-
prices of provisions, and perhaps still more from the urgent that the Coastguard men had been sent back, and that it tatioa to that place ; therefore the affair was entirely in
necessity for the prompt execution of works indispensably would be practicable to man the Baltic, fleet in the ordi- the discretion of the admiral in that sea..
necessary for carrying on the war, which has rendered it nary manner. It appeared upon good authority that coal Admiral BERKELEY, in reply to Admiral Walcott,
expedient not only to increase the number of shipwrights, could be procured in the Black Sea at the price of 7s. a- said, the subject of clothing the navy and of leaking penal
but also not to permit them any
longer to work by day. ton, and he did not see the necessity of a sum of 200,0001, the purchase of seamen's clothes, was under the considera-
work, only by task, without any limitation of the amount to supply transports with coal. It was not his intention tiers of the Admiralty.
of work they might be able to perform. This has enabled to offer any opposition to the present vote, but he should Mr. D. SEYMOUR, referring to a statement of the First
us, with great expedition, to fit out a very large lumber feel it to be his duty to offer some observations to the corn. Lord of. the Admiralty respecting gun-beats, said he did
of ships, and, considering the worn which has been done, mittee when some of the subsequent votes were brought not think that 20un-boats and five batteries were stu M-
aud the rapidity with which it has been executed,' hope forward.
eient for our pnrposegsin the Baltic. He thought the Danube
the increase of 710001. will not be thought excessive bY Captain SCOBELL, after expresging his regret at the ought to be cleared of the guns of the enemy, which pre-
the committee. I nowscome to the principal access in absence of the hon. member for Montrose, observed, that vented the free use of that river.
the vote for the ensuing year as compared with that the right hon. baronet the FiratLerd of the Admiralty had Sir J. GRAHAM repeated the statement which he had
i
for the past year, which will bo found in vote 10, for drawn attention to the merits of the marines. As marines, Previously made, in reference to the number of gun-boats
stores for the building, outfit, and repairs of tie fleet, no one could praise them more highly than he (Captain now being built for the Baltic expedition. He agreed that
And for the purchase and building of ships by tontraet &obeli) ; but when the right hon. baronet stated that they
it would be most desirable to clear the Danube, as had been
in merchant dockyards. Tho excess in this vote mainly were accomplished sailors as well as soldiers, he begged to suggested by the hon. gentleman, but that did not depend
consists of the following items :—'With regard tc stores, demur to that proposition. The marine never went aloft, upon gnu-boats. The difficulty arose from the enemy's
prices have risen in some of the most important mate- and he could neither hand, reef, nor steer. In the course batteries on the left side of the Danube, which prevented
riale. I will illustrate this by five articles—timbe; hemp, of their discussions a few nights
ago upon the proposed re- the ships passing up. The right hon. gentleman (in reply
canvas, copper, and iron. I should state tha; under forms in the army, they had been told about a modern ,to Lord Lovaine) repeated the statement which he made
these heads we cover, if I mistake not, somewhere about Hercules sweeping away the Horse Guards. He could only !in answer to Mr. Phillimore's question, relative to the im-
-480,0001. of the entire excess of 1,088,000/. and that of that hope when the modern Hercules appeared, that he would Portance of making a hostile attack on Odessa.
euemm a very large portion is to be traced to the purhases of also attack the Admiralty. He slid net think that we ever Mr. LAYARDsaid that Odessa was the great store-house
cipatod fro- '9''s
,‘ p which the Board of Admiralty have thoughtit expo- had a better First Lord than at the present time •; bet the of the south of Russia, where her corn was brought to be
Q"at to make. It has always appeared to me of the last system wee thoroughly bad. A noble lord, who had had exported in to the various countries of Europe. Russia was
importance th, t
this_ great naval country should 10, omen- some offici.-1 experience, had stated in another place, that , now concentrating her forces there, and from thence Rus-
t „poy or Chhht dhpaaudenca on the Baltic for its Exclusive ii the administration of the army were assimilated to that ! sian armies have passed over to the Crimea. By sparing
riot quality ,„,P,'o(
mile r.) Italy produces; hemp of vow' ?lupe- of the navy it weuld become a het-bed of jobbery and 1 Odessa this country had suffered severely. When the
of Admiraltylarge quantity of Italiaan
ha. blZi:ead with Baltic hemp, and the Board bribery. He did not go quite no far as to say that, but I Tiger had been attacked off Odessa there wore only a few
le,Tportimity of purchamin; a very he did complain Wrongly of the system of promotion in the 1 batter ice; new, it was a etrongly fortified place. If we had
hemp, a quantity quite mapi at a lower price thva Baltic , navy, and he recommended the First Lord to abandon that
quirements of the naval attacked that place with energy, Russia would not have
This hemp will be suppliedat
too, is on
a; ?nt for all the estimated re- system and to determine to advance merit, and meritadone, ! been enabled to make the exertions which she had from
vice for 12 months h come. This cons se had been commenced in the dockyards, and in j that quarter. •
fro Italy alone, anti ve shall the civil service • and if it were carried out in the navy it
thus be altogether emancipated from- , Mr. H. HERBERT said that the Russian Government
Baltic for hemp. The material, too the would lead to the promotion of active, energetic, and ski'. 'had rewarded their soldiers for having effected gallant ex-
exp„taga..l
hurdastcilialia, judg- ful men. (Hear.) There were at the present time Haute-
hog from our own limited
; nants on the list who were of from 36 to 50 years' stand- ,
1 plaits in connection with the attack and defence of Odessa,
jag on the experience of our naval ally maglgnte rely- which did not justify observations which, he understood,
vastly superior to Baltic hemp. I think the -0,-;eaniet,e in
tee their day was one ; but it showed how defective the eye-
Of course they never could be promoted new, for ; were made by the noble lord opposite.
i tfihrestgtroeabtestp parliamentary Lord LOVAINE did not expect to hear in a British
will agree that an expenditure on a large scale, in Ti
a. er to tern w
develops the Italian market for hemp, was a provtent ex- heartbreaking, for it was notorious that the men who had troops should wantonly assail Russian troops.
s. Infact, fact, as at present exercised, it was perfectly ' House of Commons the expression of a desire that British
mentary and family influence were the
penditure. (Hear.) The other items to which.l refer
arose from the circumstance of the war.
10 At thismoment
, ifthe for himself or for anybody else.; but he said that,
in the Black Sea for sail oithe line ' nothing ° advanced. (Hear.) He (Captain Scobell) asked ' The vote was then agreed to, as were also the votes of--
, Mr. WILSON deprecated this useless conversation.
we have substituted
consisting entirely, with
one exception, of sailing ships,
First Lord woutd put an end to the present system 70,000 men for the purposes of the Navy,
! 389,3441. for the expenditure of the Marines.

2,885,567/. for the wages of the men.
1,371,0811. for the Victualling Department.
mir iity (; til:7lr.
•;0,()001. It
tU:il..o Lacitiuri t:lat ,1,65/1. 1;o ge:,n4),.1.,.0r the
of the scientific department of the Navy,
Sir J. GRAHAM, in reply to Mr. J. Ball, said the me-
teorological returns for the Navy were forwarded from the
Admiralty to the Board of Trade, and were combined
with similar returns from merchant shipping.
The following votes were then agreed to, viz. :-142,571/.
to salaries and expenses of her Majesty's Naval establish-
ments at home ; 26,9191. to salaries and expenses of her
Majesty's Naval establishments abroad; 1,102,220/, wages
to artificers, &c., employed in her Majesty's establishments
at home ; and 57,500/. wages to artificers, &c., employed
in her Majesty's establishments abroad.
On the proposition of 2,928,304/, for naval stores, and
the building and repairing of ships, &c.,
Sir J. GRAHAM, in reply to a question from an hon.
gentleman, referred in terms of high commendation to the
conduct of Sir J. Stirling, commanding it the Chinese Seas.
He had visited Japan, where he was received in the most
friendly manner. He bad negotiated a treaty with the Em-
peror of Japan, whereby he had secured, in certain specified
ports of that country, the right of entry, for refitting and
victualling to her Majesty's thipe, and the saint privilege
to all British merchant ships. Ire negotiated the treaty
on his own responsibility, and then sent it home for rati-
fication. It was approved of by the Government. At
the time of sending this treaty home far ratification, Sir
James Stirling intimated to the Government that it would
be desirable to make a present to the Emperor of Japan,
such as that which is included in this vote, in the shape
of a steam yacht of small' size. Such a present, it was
thought, would bo likely to improve our friendly relations
with that country ; and it was highly important to keep
such an object in view, inasmuch as Japan is so near to
the important Russian settlements at the mouth of the
Amver. This country would derive immediate advantages
from this treaty, so boldly and so wisely obtained. The
Government had agreed to Sir J. Stirling's proposal, and
they now asked the house to vete the money for that pur-
pose. .

90th Foot—Henry Bingham, Gent., to be Ensign, with-
out purchase.
ot—Lieutenant W Me-Bean to 1.0 Adjutant 'rico
-!, p-Ginoted.
West India Re4irecut---Licuteuant George
liatcu
Cary-, from half-pay Rifle Brigade, to be Lieutenant, vice
Eaton, appointed to the 26th Foot ; Ensignßobert Bourne
to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Cary, who retires ;
John Robert Thomson, Gent., to be Ensign, by purchase,
vice Bourne.
St. Helena Regiment—Ensign J. S. Helps to be Lieu-
tenant, without purchase, vice Cowell, appointed Adju-
tant.

LAND TRANSPORT CORPS.
To ba Quartermaster of the Corps—Charles Hudson,
Gent.

To bo Quartermasters of Brigades—Lieutenant D. S.
Ogilvy, Madras Native Infantry; Miles Monckton, Gent.
Beitiard Henry O'Reilly, Gent. ; Sergeant-Major Henry
M`Gorrery, Royal Artillery ; C. V. Trotter Trotter, Gent.;
Henry Miller, Gent. ; Thomas Yokes, Gent. ; F. W.
Dowse, Gent.; Robert Godbor ; Richard Brennen ; Thcs.
Downie.

The vote was then aff reed to.
The next veto was 567,5631.. for new works, improve-
ments, and repairs in the yards &c.
Sir J. V. SHELLEY asked fer a word of explanation
in reference to the sawing machinery ?
Sir J. GRAHAM said that this curious machinery had
been found so useful at Chatham, that it had been intro-
duced elsewhere, and a great saving of manual labour had
thereby been effected.
The vote was then agreed to.
On the proposition of 62,1001. for medicines and medical
stores,

Mr: STAFFORD said ho could not allow this vote to
pass without bearing his testimony to the efficiency of the
arrangements at the hospital at Heraclea. He thought the
parties who supplied that hospital should be nand, that
they might supply others. He then called attention to the
difficulties attending the disembarkation of the wounded.
The arrangements were not so efficient as might reasonably
b, expected from naval men. He trusted that the atten-
tion of the Government would be directed to this point.
Sir J. GRAHAM was pleased to hear the hon. gentle-
man's favourable testimony respecting the hospital in ques-
tion.

Mr. G. DUNDAS was understood to say that Dr. Rees,
of the Britannia, had organised this hospital.
The Hon. A. KINNAIRD referred to the case of the
Harbinger, and the evils attending the disembarkation of
the wounded in this country, whereby valuable lives had
been sacrificed.

Sir J. GRAHAM said, the duty of the Admiralty ceased
when the invalids were brought into harbour ; they were
then in the hands of the military authorities.
The Hoe. A. KINNAIRD said, that was just what he
complained of ; they were driven from pillar to post—from
the Admiralty to the Horse Guards, and from the Horse
Guards back to the Admiralty.
Mr. LAYARD said Smyrna was unhealthy; Rhodes or
Mytilene would be better.
Sir J. GRAHAM said, during the cold months Smyrna
would have its advantages for convalescents; it was not
intended to form any permanent establishment there.
Mr. STAFFORD said that the Smyrna Hospital would
have advantages in affording facilities for the disembarka-
tion of invalids.
Mr. LAYARD complained of the state of the hospital at
Balaklava.
Lord PALMERSTON said the commission would in-
quire into that hospital as well as the others.
The vote was then agreed to.
The sum of 73,0861. was voted for miscellaneous stores ;
635,4971. for half-pap, retorved half-pay, and retirement to
officers of the Navy and Royal Marines.
The vote was agree to, as were the votes 469,7201. for
military pew ionne and 49,538/. for civil pensioners.
On the vote of 5,128,0001. to defray the expenses con-
nected with the transport service and pi isiners of war,
Sir J. GRAHAM, stated that the superintendence of
this department was formerly confided to oue individual ;
but for the future, as the transactions were of so large a
nature, the contracts for transports averaging from
3,000,000/. to 4,000,0001. annually, he proposed that this
duty shall be eontided during tie war to a board of super-
intendence, consisting of 3 members, selected from the
naval service, tne mercantile service, and the army, the
Lords of the Admiralty attending and assisting in the ad-
ministrative department. Sir James then detailed the
number of troops and stores which were conveyed by trans-
ports during the past year, and the preparations that were
in progress for increasing the efficiency of tie service dur-
ing the continuance of the war. The management of the
transport service in the Black Sea had been placed in the
charge of Sir Edmund Lyons, and to him would the Go-
vernment look for its efficient conduct.
Colonel KNOX considered the arrangements proposed
by the right hon. baronet very good, and he quite concurred
in them. A large transport service, it was quite true, had
been sent out from this country, but what became of them
when they got out to the Black Sea ?
Mr. V. SIIIITII objected to the appointment of the con-
templated board, as he considered that the management
or superintendence of "one experienced brave officer would
be more economic and effective. In the event of the happy
prospect of peace being re-established, he wished to know
if it was intended that the feria.;„--
UWWW.

Sir J. GRAHAM said that the warrants of appointment
of the members of the Board bore upon the face of them a
statement that the office should continue only during the
pleasure of the Crown, or until the termination of the
war.

Mr. STAFFORD expressed his satisfaction that the
transport of the sick soldiers from Balaklava to the Bos-
phorus was to be confided to the care of Sir E. Lyons.
Mr. HENLEY inquired how much of the vote of
4,200,0001. was for arrears, and how much was for the
actual service of the year 1855-6, as it did not appear very
clearly on the estimate ?
Sir J. GRAHAM said the estimate for the year 1855-6
was framed on the experience of the past year, and the
words used were those which had been invariably used
from time immemorial for the same purpose. The arrears
outstanding were very small, but the custom was to take
the vote large enough to cover unsettled and disputed
Mr. HENLEY said the right hon. baronet had not yet
explained what portion of this large sum was for arrears,
or whether the arrears were arrears of pay to accrue in
1856, or arrears which had already accrued.
Sir J. GRAHAM thought he had sufficiently explained
the matter in making the motion for going into committee.
The estimate was a growing expenditure • and any excess
would be reported by the Audit Office in 1856, and carried
over again to the account of the Trea,ury.
Mr. HENLEY had every confidence in the practice of
the Audit Office, but he objected to the wording of the
vote, as being far too wide, so as to admit of the expendi-
ture of 1854-5 being defrayed out of the vote for 1855-6.
He wished they had seen more explicit.
Sir J. GRAHAM said, if the right hon. gentleman would
allow the vote to be taken to-night he should be happy to
have his assistance on a future occasion in making the
wording of these votes more explicit.
The vote was then agreed to, after which the Chairman
reported! progress, and the house resumed.
The motion with respect to the newspaper stamp duty
was postponed till Mondaj.
The report of of the Committee on Ways and Means was
brought up and agreed to.
Sir J. YOUNG moved the second reading of the Fairs
and Markets (Ireland) Bill.
Lord NAAS thought a bill of so important a nature
should not be proceeded with at so late an hour (quarter
past twelve), and suggested that the second reading should
be pee pened to a future day.
After some conversation, Sir J. YOUNG agreed to the
suggestion, and postponed the second reading to next
week.
On the motion of Mr. SOTHERON, the Friendly So-
cieties Bill was read a second time.
Tie other orders of the day wore then disposed of, and
the house adjourned at half-past twelve.

THE LONDON GAZETTE OF LAST NIGHT.

CROWN-OFFICE, FEB. IG.
MEMBERS RETURNED TO SERVE IN THIS PRESENT PAR-
WENT.
Borough of New Windsor—Samson Ricardo, of Titness
Park.
County of Wilts—Southern Division—The Right Hon.
Sidney Herbert, one of her Majesty's Principal Secretaries
of State.

WAR-OFFICE, FIB. 16.
Scots Fusilier Guards—To be Ensigns and Lieutenants,
without purchase.—Lieutenant Godfrey Wentworth Beau-
snout, from the 21st Foot; Lieutenant Henry David Ers-
kine, from the 30th Foot.
let Regiment of Foot--George William Thompson,
Gent., to be Ensign, without purchase ; Lieutenant John
Martin Brown to be Adjutant, vice Turner, promoted.
4th Foot—To be Ensigns, without purchase—Edward
Brombead, Gent. ; John James Martin, Gent.
9th Foot—LieutenantWilkinaon to be Captain,
without purchase, vice Dent, deceased ; Ensign C. J. Bor-
ton to be Lieutenant, without purchase, vice Wilkinson ;
Ensign H. C. Vibait to be Lieutenant, without purchase,
vice Borton, whose promotion on the 12th Jan., 1855, has
been cancelled ; Sergeant John McQueen to be Ensign,
without purchase, and Adjutant, vice Burden, promoted ;
Samuel Edward Wood, Gout., to be Ensign, without pur-
chase.
14th Foot—Frederick Francis Wall, Gent., to be En-
sign, without purchase.
20th Foot—Francis George Holmes, Gent., to bo En-
sign, without purchase.
23d Foot—Colour-Serjeant John Luko O'Connor to be
Ensign, without purchase.
33d Foot—Lieutenant W. H. Parry, to be Captain, with-
out purchase, vice Burke, deceased; Ensign H. Donovan,
to be Lieutenant, without purchase, vice Parry ; Ensign
F. A. Ball to be Lieutenant, without purchase, vice Dono-
van, whose promotion on the 9th Feb. has been cancelled ;
Ensign J. H. Campbell, from the 56th Foot, to be Lieu-
tenant, without purchase.
31th Foot—Lieutenant Spencer Ley Greavos, front the
48th Northampton Militia, and Julius Dyson Laurie,
Gent., to be Ensigns, without purchase.
34th Foot—Algernon Henry Belfield, Gent., to be En-
sign, without purchase.
39th Foot—Charles Prichard, Gent., to beEnsign, with-
out purchase.

42d Foot—=Quartermaster William Wood to be Design,
without purchase, and Adjutant, rice Drysdale, promoted.
49th Foot—Lieutousat W. Estie to be Captain, by pur-
chase, vice Brevet-Lieutenant-Colonel Browne, who re-
tires.

62d Foot—Lieutonant Graham Hay to be Captain, by
purchase, vice Brovet Major Mania, who retires; Assistant-
Surgeon Dndley Hanley, M.D., from the Staff, to boo Sur-
geon, vice Langley, promoted on the Staff.
63d Foot—Frederick Harris Dawes Voith, Gent., to be
Ensign, without purchase.
68th Foot—Henry Milligan, Gent., to be Ensign, with.
out purchase.
71st Foot--Edward Williana Donne, Gent., to be En-
sign, without purchase.
88th Foot—Ensign H. Waring, from the 12th Foot, to
be Ensign, without purchase.