The Sun.
London, England, 1855-03-09 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, MARCH 9 1855,

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

"USE OP COMMONS—YESTERDAY.
it L •4. BULLER presented a petition from a place
ettoPeashire, praying for the repeal of the newspaper
P.

SERJEANTS.
me Grie NORTH wished to inquire if the Govern-
er,. woleld reconsider their decision not to allow those
the of of regiments of militia who are pensioners from
reeee"qa„ Y, and who have volunteered to accompaey their
le;•i'ett upon foreign service, to count that foreign
kre.,t,owards increase of pension.
th'EEL said the Government could not assent to
'Proposal of the honourable And gallant colonel.
kr a SICK LIST IN THE CAMP.
tepy LtIEAMLEY-MOORE asked the Under-Secre-
44;at War, if any• order had been issued from the
tee " 'name to the army in the Crimea, stating that
they most be on the sick list fourteen days before
etistelneaY be removed from camp ; or if any such order
kre in the caw_p, and by whose authority ?
.13EEL was quite ignorant of such an order.
e„. SHERBURN HOSPITAL.
for
the tr°-(:)WRRA.Y asked the Secretary of. State
eb.".'e Department whether it was the intention fof
tierb °'"Y Commissioners to propose a nee scheme for fee ,c,tiaje Hospital, in tee county of Du:qrs.:el ; and,toi.
ward, the any, and what, pi-egress had, been rnar 0
wards
approval of such scheme; the mastership f
tse,r'hPltl having been vacant more than a year, nearlyf2,
!!"tare'vlog elapsed since au Inquiry by thei comm
"ea, al'asect Ts, and vacancies having, in tie mean -
''leae?l'eurred among the recipients of the charity,
4 It had
4
e, been imposs,ble ta fill up ?
4141* ‘-*REY said a new scheme ad been prepared,
"41(1 be shortly promulgated inh due frm.
04, THE NEWSPAPER STAMP.
"°llfri.a'Wek-N.—l wish to put a question to my right
Nit„,7°(l the Chancellor of the Exchequer. Great in-
ters-"'eneis felt throughout the country among
114 ctr,, Publishers, and newspaper proprietors from the
,t,'lste,a,,'"Y which prevails as to the bill before the Muse
"hi t° the newspaper stamp. I wish to ask my
keit ;°°. friend when it is the intention of the Govern-
% "c) Proceed with that bill—(hear)—and if he will
a,dge that it shall be taken the first of the orders of
tratkli as it is a matter which will probably lead to a
Thu of of discussion!
et,at't e'IIitNCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER.—The
Efireukl at whiCh I have commenced the duties of
`ira°e-ee of the Chancellor of the Exchequer will render
'llarclBsible for ru to proceed with that bill to-morrow.
tillt:esll-°t bad time to make myself
.master of theiffi-
tieeTJeet which is involved in it. With the permission
t'llFs,"l4Be, I will move the postponement of the order
rttet.l next week, and then I shall be prepared to
1k collage which I intend to pursue.
t• eee,—
understood that the Government
jtsii.V4 Fraley kto the right hon. member for
L'h,t"'„eh to forty rd his notice on the subject of educe-
7,tee et.would suggest that Monday next be appointed
eLaierigaoeellor of the Exchequer.
The
~'"ALMERSTON.—Of course the engagement
Nar,e, wi the right hon. baronet the member for
'k'cor andth
my right hon. friend the Ohancellor of
• .00
truer gives his notice contingent on the discus-
hiebeing
Nueation over early enough for him to
statement with regard to the newspaper
14:1Te.11180.N.. —ls it not desirable to fix a day when
e"-elPeaPer Stamp Bill will proceed with certainty ?
e 'verYbody is kept in suspense when it is placed
tnht ,°tioe likely to occupy the whole night.
I,glisia,'-ANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER.—I
11.:4tirs-ciel°?en Friday next. the. day I shall propose to fix
)r Ussion. If it is convenient to the right
t11,14,Y eerer,o, I will try to make that statement before
13
f'T:• 11'40 SCHOOLS AND UNIVERSITIES.
s-eSI''WOOD moved fora select Committee to in-
tart e- the best means of affording to the nation a
faset -C1,,u41 Participation in all the advantagcs, whicl
ired -n'essaril of an ecclesiastical or spiritual clue:
in,.4)eia-etbe publicY schools and universities of Eng-
la 'relent], and of improving the educational
;"ialt-„,etbose great seats of learning, with a viewf
Ttit„4, veil" their course of instruction in con.cr-
-141!"e1:44 the requirements of the public service.
°q,,4,,,uniher reminded the house of what was done
;,411 last session, when a vote was passed
r• e' ~,eoelissenters to study in private halls ; but
Protestant dissenters were entitled
:41%; °t acme privilege as the members of the
Zer;,;`tellVa d. For that purpose he thought the
`fle's("4esel'ltisi nworship used by the house might be
41,4,1R14 -liatroduced into the Universities, and then '
-,4l4tioeitastild be open to students of almost every de-
: tot% tip 4t might be said that this question would be
1114 P 914 OP the Oxford Commissioners under the new
treleete-se did not think it would while there were
; reps enforced in tb.e universities which ought to be
k''qtle,liat,',l"ll,,t which the Ministers. themselves would nut
I kti.ty w‘rirerefepa they might be well
frialacdtev,aass,ubject for
e this committee. The the edu-
kic!l",ii, 7at the universities had an eye too much to
leritfire •"ereas, if it were made more practical aert
4.ebd bet I would be more advantageous for tae coui try.
11'4,4:11 believed inany of the disasters which had
Iv., our army Alma, Ilikerman, and Be-
' Ice 4 Would have been avoided, if the young men who
Iklqe,cl it bad received a more practical university-
n Modern languages and modern science
e4tb!eerne quite of as Much import nee as an-
\ languages and ancient science, and it was
)41tial for the interests of the country that tilt
lit 41'`te4 tll._a,,cel! of thaintd e higher classes should be maden
oe with those two branches of euucatio •
' motion would facilitate the attainment
of Leet ; it was couched in precisely the same term:
tr,%41,c,,e,1ate Sir R. Peel had used when speaking spur;
• jct." °,f Openin universities and whilst. et
k4tie no an actoft tardy justice toga large portion
'e'tl;-et''refitrity there could be no doubt that it would
; tlrmmote education amongstan important class of
Le„
!tee;ll.' tle4t-'l4 seconded the motion, as one who hail
exe„,,':" at Eton and Cambridge, and knowinl
'le ''c've lance the great room there was for
tt (If tr)ettit In those -great institutions. The Cel-
li els; v0,°.11 'night be safely thrown open to pis-
' s's:rt'reubmii'le the system of education which prevailed
dated' le.° aohoola might be vastly extendedd and im-
te°l4 ins," best authorities of the ay. were of
Olt
ei'lltli-jaarld the time bad arrived when it wasthoet
leseteeetee Land the
as it would be the interest.
• 'Yr to make the change shadowed forth in the
iii,:44dlllA"ii°n•
trollesti --41ERSTON said this was a most intere.st-
lhr
•eey r„,-°11) and ought deeply to entertain the attention
%PIN pie'
of the house. No one could dispute
1401;142 °f abolishing as much as possible re.ligiohns,
kt,'°ll -,e3 in the universities, but he was afraid
k:4,vittll not calcented to accomplish the. object,ove
Velp likely to lead to those modern imprf
the-
114sqeocation which the mover and seconder of
ox.
teillePosed. The commission acting under
k I,litel:Nor, 'er4tY Act had full power to make many ofdtaln,
,v" sliggested ; while, with regard t Cambriee,
taii'etp°4ld be broueht in this session exten n
1,) a folleivereity, mutatis mutandi, the same. provisionseared
tfet',,ite in the expired act, and therefore it a
bir'e 1,14 t a select committee would be a waste or
tee The
Was no necessity for a committee to
freed Which prevailed at the universities ; they
known to the hon. member who had madder
1,,,4,%v",,,,•°, and if the commissionsra acting under
ire:l it ',,,eaeures did not attempt to apply a remedy,
e deal old be open to the honourable mem-
tt.„-ho,i With the subject in a future bill. With regard
1/1 f RI there waq no denying that there was great
4'4°lt in'Provement in the system of education
al dead 4,11- them, but he should be sorry to
erec
,
-
°r classical languages sacrificed to a stul'e Practical character—while he doubted 3
-,le
t 4 bon
could be male good Latin and Greek
besides becoming well versed in French,
or4,,e,talan, and mathematics, within the brier
hPtip•
""x• years (Hear, hear.) That would be
i 51,14 too much ; but, nevertheless,. he knew
Yre4erwn khosvledge, that at Harrow the modern
kfcl4t;:tiiiblad been introduced into the studies, and
'S ""Pe that example would be followed by other
see eeselea,se
'44`l'etikh °E•E was surprised to find this motion
Y gentleman of Eton. Our public schools
keasid hte Iced some of the most distinguished men who
riitle .4 Parliament, and that fact, he thought, was
fr,,P•ee'',t answer to this motion.
'4lllaNkti'LL reminded the house that when the present
f
eeti -eeti, was formed the noble lord at the head o
"S) 'Oilll-rentrient that, its various members wereh re-)
l 4; for sufficient liberality." (Hear,
a Niel,' noble lord had not displayed that sufficient
Ithiell ought to
.satisfy the house or the
th "Y, this question lay. in a nut shell.
'se -Universities were national institutions ,
e "es Were not ;
if they weee, they ought to
"ti 4" to all parties in the State, and made
l'ifli:o7l44glivetivaintage. It as upon that ground that
in favwour of the motion.
41°tic'n Iva's vtloiteen withdrawn.'
fir
ftr.B IrtSTOPPAGES FROM WAGES.
moved for leave'to bring in a bill
etoppages from wages in the hosiery mann-
G.
Iver 4 f BEY opposed the motion.
ns
h words from several hon. members, e
er edi vided. The numbers were-
-kw he 131)1.
A%le
°t t .
...........- ................ 96
_3B
It'lk 4rity against the bill
lio;:41;-1 AND THE BALTIC FLEET.
ki,,ta ros.e to. call the attention of the
NeNttelei" oval operations in the Baltic, under Vice-
JeNO4,,, eharles Napier ; and to move for a copy of any
lerilineee,'4ce Which had passed between the Board of
%I• 61: °r ally member of her Majesty's Government,
4%4'4 Th::4le3 Napier, since the 20th day of December
~!:,°tice he had given was one involving consi-
t::"nt, 1"` 're)? great importance, and he had, on that
, the lesitated to become the organ of bringing it be-
"e- But the question involved considerations
40 114 ht
t,t4it of the public service, inve.lving. as it did the
}:to•hilleet,,,,,,"blie servants and the discretion of the Go-
h° :t b a mat' of the highest importance, that,
sth requested undertake to bring the matter
s hot,to
ket qZ• 'e he did not feel himself at liberty to decline
ltlvitbish Sir Se must be aware of the circumstances nu-
.
I -Napier was appointed to command the
°ft out arether more than a year ago. In February
t,Ceeeverement having determined to equip air
t tely,t oeest fleet trl oT Groat Britt which
io, it was admitted, had eve .
prottoded to robot foi

0

the command the most distinguished officer that could be
f?und in the .kVavy List. The Admiralty was, at that pe-
riod, presided over by the right lion. gentleman tho mem-
ber for Carlisle (Sir J. Graham), the presentPrime-Minis-
-ter being "the -SeCretary .of State for the Home Depart-
ment. Upon the right hon. gentleman more particularly
devolved the duty of selecting the commander of the fleet.
The nation looked with intense anxiety to see who would
be selected to command the Baltic fleet, and it received
with great approbation the announcement that Sir C. Na-
pier was selected to that command. The Gcvernment of
that day were so proud of the selection, and were so as-
sured that the man who had been appointed would be
bailed with universal joy, that the event was celebrated by
that well-known dinneito th gallant admiral at the Re-
form Club. The propriety of that dinner had been a good
deal discussed, and it was not his intention to renew
that discussion. lie should not discharge his duty, how-
ever, without saying that the dinner was presided over by
the present Prime Minister, that it was attended by the
then First Lord of the Admiralty, the Chief-Commissioner
of Woods and Forests, and by many members of the House
of Commons sitting upon the Ministerial benches. At
that dinner the members of the Government present ex-
pressed their satisfaction at the choice thtv had been male.
He would read to the house one passage from the speech
of the present Plinio Minister on that occasion. Lord
Palmerston said :

"As bearing on that point (the fitness of appointing Sir C.
Napier), I cannot refrain from repeating an observation which
was made to me by a very discriminating, calm-minded friend
of mine, who passed some time in the East at the period to
which I have adverted, who saw a great deal of my gallant
friend, and who, when he came to town, visited me to give me
an account of what he had observed in the East, which,
considering the position I then held, he thought might
be interesting. When I mentioned to him my gallant
friend (Sir Charles Napier), ,and praised his enterprise and
boldness, his daring and his intrepidity, this gentleman said,
Yes, all that is very true, but there is another quality which
Sir Charles Napier possesses, which is as valuable as any of
these, and as important an ingredient in his success. I never
saw a man in my life who calculated so many moves, before-
hand.' Now, gentlemen, when a man can calculate his moves
beforehand and has, to execute those moves, the spirit and
genius which are possessed by my gallant friend, I think any
country that places its fate and fortune in his hands may feel
confident of success."

(Laughter.) Sir James Graham, on the same occasion,
speaking in a still loftier strain, said:—
" I will not weigh the precise ingredients of valour. My
gallant friend was distinguished for remarkable daring and
bravery ; but even then, in the early part of his career, he
verified that praise which my noble friend has said was
awarded to him at a later period—he constantly looked seve-
ral moves beforehand— and, in my humble judgment, he is
not only a gallant, but I must add that I look upon him as
a discreet commander. He possesses my entire confidence,
and I have rejoiced in the opportunity on a great occasion
of commending him to the approbation and choice of my
Sovereign. That selection I believe has been approved by
the country. I believe also that it is approved by the pro-
fession ; and, although the propelling power of the fleets
may be changed, although naval tactics may be altered, yet
he goes forth the commander, not of a pressed body of men,
but of volunteers for this splendid service. All these things
may be changed, but one thing is unchanged—that is, the
gallantry and power of command of my gallant friend.
He does not go forth under auy hypocritical pretence of con-
ducting a religious war, but to assert the independence of
Europe, to maintain the balance of power, and to resist—
and, I hope, successfully to resist—as lawless a spirit of
aggression and of reckless aggrandisement as ever disgraced
any country. My gallant friend says when he goes into the
Baltic he will declare war. I, as First Lord of the Admi-
ralty, give him my free consent so to do. I hope that that
war may be s',ort, and that it may be sharp. lam sure
that, guided by my gallant friend, it will be decisive; and
although politics are excluded generally from the naval pro-
fession, yet we, as Reformers, may be proud that the honour
of the British flag in the Euxine and the Baltic is intrusted
to two such champions as Admiral Dundas and Sir Charles
Napier. (Laughter and cheers from the Opposition.) They
will prove true to their country in the last extremity, and I
sincerely hope the time may not be far distant when you,
perhaps, will kindly invite me again to celebrate the return
of my gallant friend. This evening is an evening of happy
augury. When we Beat meet I hope it will be to celebrate a
brilliant success."

Now the gallant admiral so selected, having been proclaimed
to Europe and to the world as the fittest man to sustain the
honour of England, having hoisted his flag, and having re-
ceived the approbation of the Government almost every day
while in command of that fleet in the Baltic, instead of
being invited to a dinner upon his return to celebrate his
success, was met by that right hon. gentleman (Sir J.
Graham) with contempt and contumely, and was dismissed
from his command. He did not bring this forward as a
personal question, but one involving the honour of public
servants, and the house would agree' with him that Eng-
land could not insult her most gallant servants without
proclaiming that the Government had either been short-
sighted in the selection of the officers to command the
fleet, or else, if they had been farsighted in the selection,
it was a most unworthy acknowledgement that a man
should receive such a reward at the end of his period of
service. The admiral's appointment having thus been in-
augurated he proceeded to the Baltic. And here he might
state the difficulty he felt in bringing this subject before
the house, lost he shou7d have to refer to anything calcu-
lated to impair or injure the public service. It was not
easy, in so complicated a correspondence, at all times to -
steer clear of such difficulties; but, in submitting those
documents to which he should refer, he would, as much
:is possible, avoid reading anything which was calculated
to give any information to the enemy or which con.
rained anything detrimental to the public service. He
found the correspondence, both pablic and private—that

was to say, the correspondence written by the Board of
Admiralty awl by the First Lord of the Admiralty in his
individual capacity—expressing to the admiral the most
:narked and unequivocal approbation of his conduct from
the day he sailed, down, at all events, to the month of Sep-
tember. When the house considered the difficulties with
which that gallant admiral had to contend—that, although
he quitted these shores -with the most powerful fleet which
England ever sent forth, he quitted them with undisci-
plined men, with men who had no experience in war, with
chips which had never beep eng,iged, and had before him a
eavigation the most intricate which any part of the world
presented—he thought the house would see that tho gallant
officer, having kept his entire fleet without disaster, and
lone all that the Government expected of him, and more,
was entitled to a receptim very different to that which
awaited him. (Hear.) It would b 3 necessary to refer to
:tune letters written by the First Lord of the Admiralty
he his individual capacity to the gallant admiral. It
might be said they were private letters. (Hear, hear,
from the Ministerial side.) Ho had maturely considered
that subject, and he thought he should satisfy the house
that these were not private letters. He could not regard a
letter written by one public officer to another public officer
upon the public service. and calcnlated to influence the
actions of the officer to whom it was addressed, as a private
communication. (Hear, hear,-from the Opposition.) Sup-
posing, for example, the First Lord of the Admiralty, in
his individual capacity, had written to the commander of
she fleet a request not to delay attacking Cronstadt beyond
the Ist of June—he was only putting a case; as no such
thing occurred—and, contrary to his own judgment, the
admiral resolved to make that attack and failed, woulel
not the gallant officer be at liberty• to read the letter
which was calculated, and did, in point of fact, influence
his conduct, if that conduct were called in question?
(Hear.) He could not think that any one would deny
that proposition. But he had a precedent for reading
these letters. It suited the right hon. gentlemen and the
noble lord sitting opposite to appoint &committee, com-
monly known as the Stafford Committee, to inquire into
the conduct of a gentleman, who was a most distinguished
ornament of that house, in the management of the dock-
yards and other matters. The question arose whether letters
written by the First Lord of the Admiralty, by the Lords
f the Admiralty, and by the Secretary to the Admiralty,
in their intlividul capacity, were to be read before that
committee. The committee, which was presided over by a
distinguished authority, the noble lord the member for
Totnese (Lord Seymour), resolved that all those private
communications were to be produced. No person who was
examined was allowed to protect himself by saying any
Letter he had received was a private letter, or that any
conversation between himself and another public eervast
was a private conversation. He thought the decision of a
competent tribunal, that such communications were not
private communications, was sufficient to justify him in
the course ho was about to pursue. (gear.) The house
need not fear that because he had a great many documents
he was about to read them in extenso. He would make
selection of a few passages which bora out the general pro-
position he had to sullmit to the house. He had shown
the circumstances under which Sir C. Napier was ap-
pointed to the fleet, the auspices under which he left the
s. ores of England, and the manner in which operations in

the 13.1Itie were conducted. He was desirous of showing
that those operations-were carried on to the entire satisfac-
tion of the Government, and for that purpose ho would
read a few passages from the letters of the right hon. ba-
ronet. It should be remembered that Sir C. Napier left
England in the middle of March. On. the 10th of April
the right hon. baronet the member for Carlisle wrote
stating :
" That he was entirely satisfied with his (Sir C. Napier's)
proceedings. Neither Lord Clarendon nor himself had anti-
cipated the passage of the Belt by the fleet, expecting that
the admiral would have waited at the mouth of the Cattegat
until he received orders to enter the Baltic,"

The letter proceeded to state—
" He had judged wisely ; the time gained was precious,
and the passage of the Belt in safety was a most successful
exploit. He was instructed to establish a close blockade of
the Gulf of Finland, and to intercept the trade of Revel and.
Riga. The right. hon. baronet said be would rely on the gal-
lant officer's prudence not to be knocking his head against
stone walls prematurely or without the certainty of a groat
success, or the fair prospect of some object being attained
worthy of the risk and loss which, in attacking fortresses with
ships, were serious and inevitable."
He would show that at a subsequent period all this pru-
dent advice was departed from, and that the Government,
which refrained during spring and summer—when it was
the fitting season to attack stone walls, if they were to be
attacked at all—expressed their desire that the stone walls
should be attacked when winter hurricanes and boisterous
weather had also to be encountered. Oa the let of May he
again writes :

" I have read ted your letter of the 19th off
_the en-
trance o{th© Finland. I am glad that you decided
not to proceed to Sweaborg. The weather is still broken
the-channel is not clear of ice, and your force is not yet con,
centrated. A safe anchorage within the Gulf of Finland
would seem to me your greatest and most pressing necessity.
I had hoped that Port Baltic might be available for this pur-
pose, but if it be commanded from the shore, or if for any
other reason you reject it, still I trust that you will be en-
abled
to establish and to hold a close blockade of the Gulf of
Finland, and to cut off the communication by sea between
Sweaborg and Cronstadt. Your force, I hope and think, will
be large enough to render the escape of any Russian squadron
from the Baltic impossible, and to leave us quite at ease; in
England, although we may have no large rcserveready on Our
own shores. It will be best in the first instance to feel your
way, and to make good your hold in the Gulf of Finland.
When I say this I by no moans contemplate an attack either
on this or that place (mentioning two places) I have a great
respect. for stone walls, and have no fancy for running even
screw line-of-battle ships against th m. Because the public
here may be impatient, you must not be rash ; because they
at a distance from. danger are foolhardy, you must rot risk
the loss of a fleet in an impossible enterprise. I believe both
to be all but impregnable from the sea; Sweaborg, more
especially ; and none but a very large army could co-operate
by land efficiently. If, then, you have no means except naval
at your command you must pause long and consider Well
before you attempt any attack on the Russian squadrons. in
their strongholds, and I, am afraid they are much too cau-
tious to come out and meet you. Had you been weaker,
they might .have done so ; now, they will wait and watch 'an
opportunity in, the hope that you will seriously cripple your
force by knocking yotr-head'againSt their fortfi, when they
may take you at a serious disadvantage, and inflict a
fail NM Pah coneitltritiono nand not in over.

looked by you. I recall th=m to your mind, lest in
the eager desire to achieve a great exploit, and to satisfy
the wild wishes of an impatient multitude at home, you
should yield to sonic rash impulse, and fail in the dis-
charge of one of the noblest of duties, which is the moral
courage to do what you know to be r4ht, at the risk of being
accused of having done wrong. It is enough to present this
view to your deliberate attention ; you will reflect on_kand
I am certain that your judgment will not err."

lb (Mr. Malins) did not read those letters for the purpose
of blaming the advice that had been given. On the con-
trary, he conceived it to be a sound advice to give, and a
good adiiice for the admiral to follow ; but he complained
that all that advice which was given at a certain period was
departed from, and the Government thought fit to quarrel
with the admiral because, having adhered to this advice
during the summer and apart of autumn, he did not think
fit at their suggestion to depart front it when winter set in.
On the 15th May he writes as follows :
-

" If anything can be done you will discover the best moans
of doing it ; but no rash experiments must be tried which do
not hold out a reasonable prospect of success. lam anxious
to hear your opinion and intentions when you have looked
at Swcaborg and entered the Gulf of Finland. I am afraid
that the Russians will not pluck up courage and come out to
meet you."
On the 20th June he writes :

" I am well pleased with all your operations; and the con-
centration of your force at the entrance of the Fulf of Fin-
land, in a safe harbour where you can command fresh water,
appears to me a judicious operation. I conclude that you
will leave a squadron before Helsingfors sufficiently strong
to prevent the escape of the Russian squadron skulking
within the harbour, and proceed with the rest of the com-
bined fleet to the neighbourhood of Crousta:lt, which I am
afraid you will find unassailable. If the Russian fleet will not
come out to meet you, and if you find that you cannot reach
them, after having well reconnoitred the works, and ascer-
tained what it is possible and impossible to do, your return
to the more open sea below Helsingfors would appear to be a
judicious measure, every necessary precaution being taken
to prevent toe reunion .of the Russian force now divided at
Cronstadt and Helsingfors. lam well aware of all the diffi-
culties of your position, and of the impossibility of triumph-
ing over an enemy who will not fight you on fair terms, but
you will discipline our fleet, and make our officers and men
ready for any service. It is a disgrace to Russia that she dare
not show a ship in her own waters, and that she is driven to
seek for safety under the shelter of her fortresses. It would
be madness to play her game, and to rush headlong on her
granite walls, risking our naval superiority with all the fatal
consequences of defeat, iu an unequal contest with wood
against stone, which in the long run cannot succeed. I had
reliance on your prudence, which was doubted. Your brilliant
courage was proved long ago. You willnow show to the world
that you possess a combination of those great virtues which
are necessary to make a consummate commauder-in-chief."
On the .27th of June ho again writes as follows:
" I am glad you have gone upto Cronstadt to see with your
own eyes what it maybe possible to do there. Whatever man
can do I am certain will be done by you ; and if you are re-
strained by a sense of duty from embarking iu any desperate
enterprise, en your return to Baro Sound you shall receive
full instructions from me respecting an attack upon the Aland
Islands."

Now he thought that correspondence distinctly showed
that from the time Sir Charles Napier left England down
to the end of August, he received through the right hon.
baronet the unqualified approbation of the Government.
He would now proceed to see whether anything took place
after that period to disentitle the gallant officer to the
same unqualified approbation of the Government. On
the 20th of June, the admiral had been directed to make
a report upon the practicability of taking Sweaborg,
and the admiral himself, on the 20th of June,
made a report to the Government, enclosing another
report of Admiral Chads agreeing with his own, on
the subject of such an attack. Both admirals agreed as to
the particular mode of taking the fortress, and they both
agreed that if proper appliances were afforded them, and
the attack were made at the proper season of the year they
should have no doubt whatever as to the success of the
operation, but they both agreed that the season of the year
must not be beyond autumn. (Hear, hear.) New after
the fall of Bomarsund, viz. on the 4th ofSeptember, the
French fleet sailed from the Baltic and returned to France,
but the French fleet remained there until the 19th of Sep-
tember. About the middle of that month Government were
desirousof obtaining the opinions of the Englishand French
admirals as to the practicability of taking Sweaborg, and
accordingly Sir C. Nayier was requested to hold a con-

ference with the French Admiral and consider what could
be done. A plan for the purpose had been submitted to the
Government by a distinguished engineering officer, namely
General Jones, and another plan by a distinguished French
engineer, namely General Niel, and the English and French
admirals were desired to hold a conference and take those
plans into consideration. Accordingly a consultation was
held on Board the Duke of Wellington, the admiral's ship,
on the 12th of Sept., which was attended by three English
admirals, the French admiral and the French vice-admiral,
and having considered the plans, they agreed to a report,
which the house would not expect him to read, but they all
unanimously agreed in this, that the season of the year was
too late to admit of such an operation being justifiably un-
dertaken. That report was forwarded to the Admi alty by
Sir Charles Napier on the 12th of Sept. ; but soon after, the
Admiralty, feeling some anxiety on the subject, again wrote
to Sir Charles Napier raquesting that a second oonsultation
might be held; and accordingly Sir Charles Napier
again wrote to the French Admiral, requesting his at-
tendance on beard the Duke of Wellington to reconsider

the details of the plans, The French admiral, however, de-

Clined to attend. 4He stated that he had already given his
opinion, and his mind was made up upon the subject.
This was on the .Bth of September; on the 19th the
French fleet returned to France, and now of course the
position of Sir Charles Napier became *try much altered
to what it had been in the middle of June, when he had

the assistance of a powerful French army and a powerful
French fleet. The French admiral having declined to at-
tend the second conference, Sir C. Napier held a consulta-
tion of his own admirals ore the 19th or 20th September.
The council of war, if he might so term it, was held on
board the Duke of Wellington, and it consisted of Sir C.
Napier and three other admirals, two of whom had at-
tended the former conferences. these admirals considered
the plans for taking Sweaborg, and again the same conclu-
sion was come to, namely, that the sea-on of the year was
tee late for undertaking the operation. In the meantime
Sir C. Napiorhad been directed. to make a reconnaissance
of Sweaborg, and having done so he sent home a detailed plan
for an Ate& on that fortress, which if adopted the gallant
admiral felt no doubt would be successful, provided it was
put in force at the proper time. Tnat very plan was being
adopted at this very moment, but it was to be carried out
under the direction of another adlniral. On • the 25th of
September Sir C. Napier, having been left only with the
English fleet, communicated his plan of attack to the Ad-
miralty • and now came the point of difference between
him Lndthe Admiralty. Sir C. Napier declared that he
should have no doubt of the success of his plan, provided
it was undertaken in the proper season; he would not go
into its details, but there could be no question about it
that it was not the intention of the admiral that it should
be adopted that year, but in this or the succeeding year.
The Admiralty, however, forgetting their former advice
not to risk the fleet against stone walls, and finding that
the admiral had been far more cautious and far more
prudent in such matters than the Government them-
selves, determined that he should have nothing but ob-
loquy cast upon him, instead of being received, on his re-
turn home, in the flattering manner that had been antici-
pated by the right hon. baronet the first lord at the Reform
Club banquet. (Hear.) The admiral had distinctly
pointed out that neither of the plans was practicable at a
season of the year . when you could not depend upon the
weather.; but the Government appeared, about the be-
ginning of October, to have received information about
the fall of Sebastopol, which they seem to have credited,
at the time determined that something should be attempted
in the Baltic, and accordingly the admiral was directed to
commence an operation which had been reported imprac-
ticable even- while the French army and the French fleet
were there. (Hear, hear.) The operation was to have
been carried on by the English fleet alone, and he wanted
to know what could be said of the prudence of a Govern-
ment who would venture to give such instructions? We
had then in office a Government who had found England
honoured and proud of her position is the world ; but
their misnagement had since reduced her to a state that
he doubted whether any man could feel any great pride in
calling himself an Englishman. (Oh, oh.) He heard de-
risive cheers from the other side of the house, but, he re-
peated it, that the want of judgment, the want of fore-
st„;ht, which had been displayed in the conduct of the war
had lowered the character of England in the eyes of the
world. (Hear, hear.) We did not know at present who
was really to blame for all this, but he hoped the com-
mittee whose proceedings had been made public mainly
by the advice of the right hoe. baronet the member for
Carlisle, would enable us to discover to whom we were
indebted for the disastrous expedition to the Crimea, in
the month of September. (Hear, hear.) The late Govern-
ment did not hesitate to risk the army by sending it to the
Crimea, and in the same way they would have risked the
fleet, had it not been for the prudence and foresight of
the admiral. . (Hear,' hear.) Well, then, he thought he
had brought this clearly before the house; he said the
admiral was useless, unless he could be trusted—and if he
could not be trusted, he ought not to have been appointed;
but, according to their own showing, Sir C. Napier was
the fittest man they could find for the command, and they
ought to have had confidence in his judgment and discre-
tion. Because it was confessed that between Russia and
England there was nothing but the fleet for a protection,
and if that fleet had been lost, either by bad navigation or
by operations that could not hope to be successful, there
was nothing to defend us against the encroachments of
Russia. Surely, then, the Government, after receiving a
report from the admiral that the season of the year was
passed for undertaking such operations, should have paused
before they goaded on the admiral to attempt them ; but
their misconduct had lost us the army, and they had re-
solved to lose us the navy if the admiral had been suffici-
ently pliable for their purpose. (Hear.) It was the pru-
dence and foresight of the admiral that averted the latter
catastrophe ; and the country owed that distinguished
officer too deep a debt of gratitude to admit of its being
tolerated that the truth of these transrctions should be
kept in the dark. The right hon. baronet the member for
Carlisle told the house the other night that -"the admiral
had not been dismissed—that he had not been censured—
and although the admiral had proclaimed himself a hero,
he could not allow Hm to proclaim himself a martyr. But
it was not the admiral who proclaimed himself a hero ; it
was the noble lord the First Lord of the Treasury and the
right hon. baronet the member for Carlisle who had pro-
claimed him a hero ; and unless he was a hero, he was
unfit for command. The best evidence that he was a hero
was his being selected to command the fleet ; and he
could not understand how the right hon. baronet could
have come down to the house and said the admiral had
proclaimed himself a hero, and he would take care that
he should not proclaim himself a martyr. But to proceed
with his narrative. The admiral pointed out to the Go-
vernment that the season of the year was too late for un-
dertaking such an operation; but., the Government being
under the impression that Sbastopol had fallen, nothing
would do for them •but that something should be attempted
in the Baltic. " We have taken Sebastopol," said they ;
" only let us take Cronstndt or Sweaborg, and the country
will then be satisfied of what we have all along been satis-
fied with ourselves, viz., that so powerful a Ministry never
existed balm)." (A laugh.) But the admiral (lid not
conform to their views—he could not consent to undertake
an operation which the united admirals of France and
England had disapproved of at the time. Everybody knew
that September in the Baltic was equivalent to November
in England, and that October was like December. Be-
sides, the navigation was the most dangerous iu the world;
there were such rocks and shoals that the fleet could not
go about anywhere without buoying its course, and yet the
Government actually wrote on the 4th of October directing
the admiral to attack Sweaborg, and on his writing home
to say he could not depend upon the weather, the GoVern-
ment again wrote to him, saying, " You may choose your
own day and opportunity." This was pot in a private let-
ter; 'it we's in a letter coming from "the Board of Mini-
raley to the admiral. If he had read such a thing in a
corrovondonvo botwoon two business men, he iihnicl not

have believed it, but here there was no room to doubt;
theinstructions were to undertake in the winter that which
could alone be accomplished in the finest season. The let-
ter of instruction did not specify the day on which the
attack was to be made, but said it might be.made towards
the end of October. It appeared to him to be almost in-
credible, but the correspondence was signed by the Secre-
tary to the Admiralty ; and could the house wonder that
Sir Charles Napier, finding himself thus goaded on to an
impracticable operation, should on the 10th of October
write to the Admiralty, stating that, if he had lost the
confidence of the Government, he was perfectly ready to
resign his command and return home. (Hear, hear.) At
the same time, he declared that no opinion which prevailed
at home should induce him to undertake an operation that
was impracticable or unsafe, as he had had the honour of
Englaudand the safety of the fleet committed to his charge.
(Hear.) All this would be clearly established if he succeedd
in his motion and the correspondence was granted. It was
conducted with consummate ability on both sides. That it
should be conducted with abillty on the side of the righthon.
baronet the member for Carlisle was quite natural enough,
but it was somewhat wonderful to find the gallant admiral
evincing ability of the highest order in the correspondence,
and showing that he was justas capable of protecting himself
with the pen as the nation believed he had protected her
with the fleet. (Hear.) The correspondence, it was true, was
rather angry, but nevertheless he did not find anything in it
which couldjustify the Government in reproving Sir Chas.
Napier for having forgotten his duty; but, on the contrary,
if they had allowed themselves calmly to consider the cir-
cumstances, they would Imo come to the conclusion that in
taking the course he had done Sir C. Napier had not, only
performed his duty to the best of his ability, but he had
confirmed the character give* of him at the Reform Club
dinner, as being a man who well caleulated his movements
before he commenced operations. (Hear.) The correspond-
ence continued from the 4th of October down to the 6th or
10th of November, and then he found the admiral express-
ing a desire that it should br brougot to a termination—
but he could not leave this part of the subject without read-
ine a single passage which occurred in a letter of the 31st
of October. Not that he brought this question forward as
an individual question—no, he brought it before the house
rather as a matter of great national importance, because it
was of importance to the country that her worthy servants
should be worthily treated. (Hear, hear.) Well, then,
he had read to the house the letter of the right honour-
able baronet the member of Carlisle, dated on the 25th
of August, in which he expressed himself to the effect
that the Admiralty were more than satisfied with Sir
Charles Napier's proceedings. The house should bear in
mind that Bomarsund had fallen on the 10th of August,
and yet, notwithstanding that letter of the 25th of Au-
gust, the letter of the 31st of October declared the Govern-
ment to be dissatisfied with the admiral for not having
followed up the successlof Bomarsund with an attack upon
Cronstadt. (Hear, hear.) The true principle 'of carry-
ing on war was this. You selected your general or admi-
ral, and saying to him, " There is the enemy whom we
wish to see destroyed," you left the operation to his die-
cretien. In the present instance the Government de-
parted from that principle in not only dictating the ope-
rations, but almost naming the day on which they were to
be carried out. Why, what would be said to the Secre-
tary-at-War if it were found that he had rrritten to Lord
Raglan to desire that he would take Sebastopol on the let
of April next—(a laugh)—or any other day ? What would
be said of a Government writing to a general to carry out
a particular operation on a particular day, thereby setting
aside the discretion of the general himself ? Would net
his answer be, " This is a matter which necessarily you
cannot possibly know so much about as myself, but if .you
have not sufficient. confidence in me or my discretion as to
the mode and time of carrying out these operations, I beg
that yen will relieve me of this command. lam per-
fectly ready to return home r Now, that was precisely
the case of Sir Charles Napier. The Admiralty wrote him
a letter stating that they were satisfied with his reasons
for not taking the fortress ; but, considering the con- '
flicting nature of the different reports recently brought be-
fore them, General Jones having declared that it could be
taken in six days, while General Niel, the French engineer,
was of opinion that it could be subdued in two hours, their
lordships directed the admiral to make the attempt. The
admiral, however, declines to risk the fleet at such a sea-
son, and then the Admiralty convey their regret to the
admiral that an attack was net made upon Sweaborg im-
mediately after the fall of Bomarsund. Now, he appealed
to the house whether any admiral receiving such a letter
would not naturally feel he had lost the confidence of his
Government, and that his command was no longer satis-
factory, especially as, up to the end of August, his entire
proceedings had met with the approval of the Admiralty.
That naturally produced great dissatisfaction in the mind
of Sir Charles Napier, and the correspondence closed. Sir
C. Napier returned to England, and arrived at Portsmouth
on the 17th of December. As soon as the gallant admiral
could make preparations, ho came up to London, and had
an interview with the irst Lord of the Admiralty, from
whom, considering the terms on which they had parted,
he thought the gallant admiral might rely upon it that he
would meet with a cordial reception on his return. He
thought the gallant admiral might consider himself entitled
to such a reception from what the right hon. gentleman,
said only a month back in moving the navy estimates. So
far from intimating any ground of ditshsaetriisgfahcttihoonn. atwgiethtleho
mp proceedings eseai
said,
gos
no
the
ht
eh gallantel6t ho f F
eabdrmu
ai rrayl
" Bomarsund, a strongly fortified place, and one bearing
n
tmeaar marks oe
hf agnr
eiantteern teixo
tne
ntto, phuassh
bteheant
eseyins tpeime t
eot
yf
der
st it fir
ec
ya tei(ol
(Hear, hear.) The great naval arsenal of Cronstadt, close to
the capital of Russia, was blockaded, and battle was repeat-
edly offered to the Russian fleet, and always declined. Up
to the last moment, Sweaborg, which contained nine ships-
of-the-line, was also blockaded by a very inferior force, and,
on the whole, never were naval operations more successful
than were those there performed, and not a ship was lost.
(Hear, hear.) That blockade of the Baltic, whatever may be
said with respect to its imperfect character, was condudted
with a skill and gallantry uever surpassed, and the pressure
that was brought to bear on the navy was by no means
small."

So that the right hon. gentleman, iu moving tie navy es-
timates only an hour after the question had bean put to him
by a gallant officer on that side of the house as to what
was the quarrel between Sir Charles Napier and tho Go-
vernment—the right bon. gentleman repeated what the
gallant admiral the Member for Gloucester (Admiral
Berkeley) hal said a few nights befor--that Sir Charles
Napier had neither beau recalled, dismissal, nor censured. ;
but he thought he had now satisfied the house that that
hon. and gallant admiral must really have forgotten for
a moment what had passed, for the house could enter-
tain no doubt that Sir Charles Napier had been dismissed
and also censured. (Hear, hear.) With respect to the
gallant admiral's interview with the. First Lord of the
Admiralty, of coarse, he had no written evidence,
and could only rely upon the
.statement made to him
by the gallant admiral, which be could have no doubt
was strictly accurate. He said that the gallant admiral
having come home after carrying on those operations only
a month before, as the right hon. gentleman stated to the
entire satisfation of the country, considering that he had
not lost a ship, and had gone out with the fleet in but an
indifferent state of discipline, and, remembering what had
taken place at his departure, had a right to expect, if ever
any man had, a courteous and cordial reception on his re
turn. Yet the gallant admiral assured him that on going
to the Admiralty. he was received in a manner all but in-
sulting by the right hon. gentleman, who did certainly
hold out his hand coldly to him, but said at once that he
declined having any conversation with him on the subject
of the operations. (Hear.) That was on the 22d of De-
-1 cember ; but be now proceeded to that which could admit
of no doubt. The gallant admiral returned to thb Duke
of -Wellington, at Portsmouth, where he next morning re-
ceived a letter, signed " R. S. Duddas" and " W. F. Cow-
per," amounting to a dismissal from his command. It was
dated the 22d December, and was couched in the following
terms : _ _ .

Sir,—The Baltic fleet, 071 its return to port, being now
separated in different harbours of Great Britain, and several
of the ships which composed this fleet being under orders for
service in the Black Sea and the Mediterranean, you are
hereby required and directed to strike your flag and come on
shore," (Hear.)

He had read to the house the whole of the letter. These
were the kindly and encouraging terms in which the
most distinguished naval officer of Great Britain was
greeted on his return from a great public service, which ho
had conducted to the entire satisfaction of the Government.
That the gallant officer should have been surprised, that ho
should have been more than surprised, that he should even
have been disgusted, he thought could occasion the house
no astonishment. (Hear.) He wrote, not immediately,
for he had been so much taken by surpriso that ho required
some time for consideration, but he wrote on the 25th De-
cember to the Secretary of the Admiralty, as follows :
sir,—l have the honour to acknowledge the receipt of
their lordships' order, directing me to strike my flag ; and
with reference to the same, I request their lordships will in-
form me whether I am to consider that my command is at an
end 1"

This was speaking very distinctly to them. The house I
would observe that the letter of the 22d was couched in
terms which Wright be customary with the Admiralty—he
did not know— all he could say was that they were terms
in which he thought few of them would even dismiss
domestic servant. (Hear, hear.)
He was assured that it
expect officer
o b
te o u
d was contrary to all usage ; he was assured that Sir James
a in
consequenceof the Baltic
of fleetthe
t
iSna ut
nmas rleazal wwhaern,
uponheh ad
hie
se
rceetuniri:
n
Ifvoirnhteirmhatovirnegrasaeithinthaenred, renderinghad iss
permion to be absent until
it unsafe and impossible
the season should permit the resumption of operations.
Thatr
e h
sathe s s
o have thought
that the proper occasion would have been when the letteruld tender treated
edne ;
o Sir
Charles
erm
similar
s ire
Charles Napier had that right, and he thought the house
circumstances
ts e mannerh
a i
right which
to
o an
would agree with him in one thing, that the letters of the
Admiralty, like every other step taken in this war, were
too lantfet.haTnhkeaytathsoiurgcht,
Napierfit i n t h; e
he
re replysh
•was written to the admiral recalling the
--oet—but no ;
proper things were never to be done at the proper times,
and all was too late. The gallant admiral's demand as to
whether he was to consider this letter as insisting on the
termination of his services was answered as follows :
" Sir—With reference to your letter of yesterday's date, I
am commanded by the Lords CommissiOners of the Admiralty
to acquaint you .that the order which you have received,
agreeably to custom, to strike your flag and come on shore is
always given at the termination of a flag officer's command."
And yet the gallant officer the member for Gloucester
could come into that house..two months afterwards and say
that the gallant admiral had not been dismissed—(hear,
hear from the Ministerial bench)—and that was repeated
a week afterwards by the right Lon. gentleman the mem-
ber for Carlisle. So that here was a great public officer,
the commander-in-chief of the greatest fleet that England
had ever sent forth, who had commanded that fleet to the
entire satisfaction of the Government, and he believed of
the nation, and who returned because operations could no
longer be carried on, told in insulting tams to strike his flag
and to come on shore—and, again, that this order was always
'issued on the termination of a flag-officer's command. Now,
he thought that, unless they were to give up the present mode
of understandingthe English language—unless this Govern-
ment. which had introduced so many new things, had intro-
duced alio some new langnageto direct the operations of the
war, the house would adhere to the construction he put
upon the letter of the 22:1 December, as equivalent to a dis-
missal of Sir Charles Napier. Yet, having dismissed him
without uttering a word of compliment to his services, or the
services of those who had manned his ships, they thought
fit too late—that was on the 26th December—to attempt
to repair the omission, for the letter went on to say, " and
I am directed by my lords to take this opportunity"—why
not have taken that opportunity ?—(hear, hear).— to ex-
press to you the sense their lordships entertain of your
exertions during the period of your service in command of
the Baltic fleet." Now, the house would, perhaps, remem-
ber a debate that took place on a memorable occasion—a
debate in which he (Mr. Mathis) had taken no part, though
he would willingly have done so, but in which the Secre-
tary for-the Admiralty had addressed the house. Whatever
else might be inferred from the speech tho lion. gentleman
6 then made, he saw one thin,
very plainly ; that if the hon.
gentleman were not out of ace, he expeoto4 yery soon to

be, for the hon. gentleman had reverted to his old habits
and found fault with everything, declaring that the army
had been mismanaged, and everything had been misma-
naged, that nothing would ever come right until every-
thing that had been done should be undone; but, added
the hon. gentleman, in a triumphant tone, nobody could
find fault with anything done in regard to the fleet—
everything was perfectly right in that department, and no
one could get a word to say against it. The hon. gentle-
man, beyond doubt, did not know these things at that time,
and he supposed must have thought that the ban of secrecy
could be kept upon this correspondence, and that, from an
apprehension that the public service would be injured by
divulging them, these things would be kept secret, for he
thought if his mind adverted to this correspondence the
hon. gentleman could not have anticipated so confidently
that nobody could throw blame on what had been done at
the Admiralty. No doubt he should be told, as the hon.
and gallant member for Gloucester had told them, that
Sir Charles Napier had shown a very bad example in going
to make a speech at the Mansion-house, and that it was
against all discipline. He (Mr. Malins) had no desire to
conduct this case otherwise than in a perfectly candid
manner, or to express approbation where approbation could
but be_entertained. He thought that Sir Charles Napier
had committed an error in making that speech, and going
to the length to which he went ; but it had been made the
subject of comment that he had said he took the'command
of a fleet badly manned and worse disciplined, and some
officars afterwards wrote to the papers to say that they were
sure it could not be the admiral's intention to cast censure
ou those who had served under him. Now he found from
the letters that passed two months before, that Sir Charles
Napier was thou remonstrating with the Government be-
cause they had not formally given their approbation to the
officers serving under him, -to whose exertions they were
indebted for the safety of the fleet, to whom they, were
indebted for having brought back a disciplined fleet, after
having taken out one that was undisciplined. Sir Charles
Napier, in fact, said in' a letter written in November
that he observed that on the return of the French fleet
to France, the Emperor, in addressing his Legislative
Chambers, tendered his thanks for the operation of the
French eet in the Baltic, that the services of the
English navy had been equally worthy of commendation,
that the exertions and merits of his officers deserved to be
acknowledged, and that he regretted that not a single ex-
pression of thanks should have been tendered to them.

What Sir C. Napier meant by the expression so much criti-
cised was, not that his officers were incompetent, but that
the circumstances under which the fleet had been equipped'
necessarily caused its discipline to be imperfect. He be-
lieved there was not a single captain in the fleet who had
ever commanded a ship in the Baltic before, a circumstance
which enhance 4 the difficulties a hundredfold ; whilst the
fleet, being so large and powerful, had been manned has-
tily, and by men who were incapable of going aloft. He
thought he had now shown the house that Sir C. Napier
had been dismissed from his command in December, and
not only dismissed but censured, and in his conviction it
was for the interests of the public service that such a
transaction should be brought under the notice of Parlia-
ment. He trusted that, in doing so, the house would be of
opinion he had not misconceived his duty as a member of
Parliament, but that he had succeeded in bringing it in a
temperate and moderate manner before the house. He
would not refrain, so long as he had the honour of a seat
iu that house, from expressing disapprobation of the pro-
ceedings of any Minister when he thought disapprobation
was deserved. He had ventured to express what he strongly
felt—that the manner in which Sir C. Napier had been
treated by the Board of Admiralty, and consequently by the
Government of which the noble lord was at the head, was
unworthy of this great nation. He submitted to the house
that it was incompatible with the public service of this coun-
try that its distinguished servants should be treated with
neglect and injustice—that they should receive reproach
and disgrace where honour and reward were due. It was
also his conviction that it was absolutely essential to the
public service that these transactions should not be kept in
the dark, but that the facts should be brought to light, in
order that Parliament might judge as to their propriety. As
the right hon. baronet the member for Carlisle had told
them in the admirable speech he delivered on the question,
whether the committee now sitting should be open or secret,
public reputations were not to be sacrificed in a secret com-
mittee in No. 17. He adopted the principle of the right hon.
gentleman, that the reputations of our generals and admi-
rals were dear to the country, that they were the property
of the country, and that an insult to them was an insult to
every member of the community. (Cheers.) It was upon
their skill and courage that we must rely for our defence,
and if we could not find men worthy to command our flesh
and armies, then England would indeed be reduced to a
miserable condition. (Renewed cheers.) If, when we had
found such men, and when the Government of the day pro-
claimed to us that we had found the most fitting man—if,
because the First Lord of the Admiralty took a view that
was not'in accordance with that of the commander of the
fleet, the admiral was to be recei►ed on his return with
ignominy, there was an end to all security for the efficient
performance of the public service. When he found, there-
fore, that no other member of the house was disposed to
bring this matter under their consideration, hehad felt it his
duty not to shrink from bringing it forward, believing, as
he did, that to keep such transactions in the dark would
be attended with the greatest possible detriment to the
public service in general. (Cheers.) The hon. gentleman
concluded by moving for copies of any correspondence
which had passed between the Board of Admiralty or any
member of the Government and Sir Charles Napier since
the 20th December last.

Admiral Sir T. HERBERT said—As a personal friend
of Sir Charles Napier, and one who served under him on
many trying occasions, I must beg to trouble.the house

with a few words on the motion now before them. The

gallant admiral the member for Gloucester told the house,
a few evenings ago, that Sir Charles Napier was not dis-
missed from his command. Technically speaking he was
not ; but he was removed from his command by ordering
him to haul down his flag, and, to my mind, in a most dis-
courteous manner, unaccompanied as the order was by a
single complimentary expression in commendation of the
gallant admiral's management of the fleet while under his
order:, Although I cannot approve of after-dinner speeches
like the gallant admiral's at the Mansion-house, yet, after
all Sir C. Napier's eminent services—many or them most
brilliant, and such as to have called forth the admiration of
such men as Lord Exmouth, Sir A. Cochrane, Sir Robert
Stopford, Sir J. Guidon and other distinguished office' s
I have too much respece.for my gallant friend, who was
once my commander during some trying occurrences, not to
hope that his statement will prove to be correct, and that
he will stand well with his countrymen. With regard to the
gallant admiral's conduct in the Baltic, I du not think that
lie could have done more witu the force at his disposal than
he did, and I firmly believe that it is to his cool judgment
and wise discretion the country is indebted for the safe re-
turn home of our fleet; for had Sir Charles Napier been
induced to have attacked either Cronstadt or S weaborg
without the co-operation of a large land force, and the
assistance of mortar-vessels and gun-boats of an easy draft
of water—a force which appears to have been entirely
neglected attaching to the fleet last year—my conviction is
that the attack would have failed, and that his ships most
likely would have been all disabled. (Hear.) Can the eulo-
, gium pronounced upon Sir C. Napier by the right hon.
baronet the member for Carlisle, at the Reform banquet,
ever be forgotten? There the right hon. baronet not only
congratulated the club on so thorough a Reformer having
the command of the fleet, but galled that his confidence in
him was so great that he had his (the First Lord of the Ad-
miralty's) authority to declare war, if he thought fit, upon
his arrival in the Baltic. Now what has all this boasting
and confidence come to ? That the right hon. baronet and
the gallant admiral have fallen out, the admiral has been
dismissed by Sir J. Graham from his command, and their
unfortunate misunderstanding—which I much regret, as
being prejudicial to .the public service, particularly to the
discipline of the naval branch of it. However, the gallant
admiral in common fairness ought to have an opportunity,
somewhere, of vindicating his character. I have not seen
any of Sir Charles Napier's correspondence with the right
hon. baronet opposite; but if the correspondence asked
for is refused to be produced merely on the score of being
of a private character, it certainly does not come well
from au Admiralty who made such liberal use of private
and confidential correspondence in the inquiry of Mr.
Stafford's dockyard appointment to refuse it. •
Sir JAMES GRAHAM--I have great pleasure in
assuring the house that it will not be necessary for me, in
answering the hon, and learned gentleman, to detain them
for anything like the length of time he has occupied in
opening his case. For, sir, I have not come down here
prepared to read extracts from public despatches, and
much less do I come here prepared to read garbled extracts
from such despatches. (Hear, hear.) Much less am I
prepared toenter into the details of private conversations.
I have not the advantage of holding in my hand anything
like that brief of a confidential nature which has been put
into the hands of certain members of this house. But at
the outset of what I have to address to the house, I shall
jest refer to the passage with which the hon. member con-
cluded his speech, when he ssid he was anxious to vindi-
cate the honour of this country. Now, sir, lam not de-
void of a desire to, vindicate the honour of this country,
and I heard the honourable and learned gentleman, with
the deepest regret, say, as I understood him, that the
honour of this country, which was so dear to him, had
been lost by the disasters which had befallen our arms.
Now, sir, whether I look to the Black Sea or the Baltic, as
to what concerns the navy, I am satisfied that the honour
of this country has been maintained ; and as regards our
army, I. know that all is not lost. (Hear, hear.) The
honour of that army and the honour of this country, as I
believe, are still intact. (Loud cheers.) We have never
met the enemy on any one occasion in which our arms
have not been victorious ; and whatever the suffer-
ings of our troops may have been, their exemplary
patience, their gallantry, their good conduct, far exceed
all my powers of praise—(chOers)— and in the presence of
this house I am glad to declare that the honour of the
country and its arms is safe. (Renewed cheers.) The hon.
and learned gentlereart has commented upon an expression
used by my noble friend at the head of the Government
on an occasion to which he delights in referiing—that the
highest proof of sagacity lies in looking several moves before
one. New, I must plead guilty to a great want of sa-
gacity, for the moves made by the hon. and learned gen-
tleman on this occasion were not foreseen. I did not anti-
cipate that he would have thought it consistent with his
duty to read extracts from despatches in his possession—
public despatches of the highest possible importance, which
the Government of this country has not yet been asked by
the House of Commons to produce, and with regard to
which it remains to be seen whether, when they are
asked, they will think it consistent with their duty to the
public to advise the house to sanction their production.
Their discretion will be exercised by them ; what is due
to myself, I will shortly endeavour to state to the house.
The hon. and learned gentleman talks of the introduction
of new things. Is there anything more now, sir, with all
your experience in that chair, have you seen or heard
anything so unexampled as the course pursued by the hon.
gentleman ? I have not culled from private letters, with-
out the consent of the writers of those letters, such extracts
as, to use his own words, would maintain the view he
takes of this case. If there is to be any production of
these letters, let it be complete and entire. But, until
that production shall have taken place, I trust the house
will not form any opinio • • n from those extracts which the
hon. and learned gentleman has called, in order to sup-
port the view ho takes of this matter. I said I did not
expect the moves that have taken place. Had I been
asked before this night whether I thought the day would
come when Sir Charles Napier would put his case into the
hands of a lawyer, sitting upon the opposite side of the
house —would appear as plaintiff in a case charging the
Government, of which my noble friend the member for
Tiverton is the head, with having treated him, as the hon.
and learned member has said, with insult and contumely--
I confess to you that nothing further from nay anticipa-
tions could possibly have occurred. But there is another
part of the conduct of the hon. and learned gentletaan
which, I confess, surprised me.. He referred to the dinner
which took place at the 'Reform Club, for which, as have
1)eforo have done Nom, Kaye gm*
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