The Sun.
London, England, 1855-08-07 00:00:00

BILL.

On the order of the day for the third reading of this
bill,
Lord J. RUSSELL rose and said he wished to offer
a few remarks to the house on this subject. He be-
lieved, whether we considered the amount of money
voted this year by the house, or whether we looked at
the prospect before us, it was a matter of deep
importance. Taking these matters into considera-
tion, ex.;
tion, if we look to the prosperity of the war, and,
looking to our navy, great as it was, it was
evident the enemy did not mean to meet us in that way.
We were now in the month of August, and the prospects
were not more favourable. With respect to our prospect
in the Black Bea; there was danger to Turkey on the
Asiatic frontier. He was in hopea there would
be some strength afforded by a foreign enlistment
bill, but in that hope he was disappointed. Still
no sach force had been sent to the scene of action, and
therefore, with regard to the Asiatic frontier, we had no
•prospect
decisive of safety there. The force now in the
Crimea would be met by a large Russian army, increased
by large forces from Poland and other places. Those
. were matters of very greatimportance,and such as re-
. quired the utmost consideration. It would be the business
- of the Government to consider the means for the next cam-
paign ; but on that he wished to say nothing, for already
too much publicity had been given to those measures.
It was not his intention to revive the discussion of the
other evening with regard to a particular proposition of
limitation or counterpoise, or any other scheme by
• which the preponderance of Russia should be put an
end to in the Black Sea, but to refer partly to what had
occurred, and partly to the future. With regard to
• himself, although he entirely acquiesced in the
derision of bis noble friend, that it was advan-
tageous for the public service that his despatches
containing an account of his proceedings at Vienna
could not be produced, he hoped the time would come
when they might be given entire, without garbling or
omissions—when Parliament and the country would he
enabled to form a correct estimate of his motives and
conduct. It would have been observed that tie

Turkish Ambassador at Vienna, who was a man as
conversant with European affairs as any person he had
met with, and knew the interests of his own country,
had ir,t stated his dissatisfaction of the terms prop, red
by the Austrian Government, nor had they heard whe-
ther the proposition was received in a similar manner at
Constantinople as it was at London and Paris; and if not
the Turkish Government must have been of opinion that
the terms proposed by Austria was sufficient for the
security of Turkey. If, therefore, the course of the war
had been changed, and they were called on to continue
it for the maintenance of the military and naval reputa-
tion of England and France, and not for the security
of Turkey, no doubt Turkey, as they had been the
means of saving,her would contribute to their assistance ;
but, in that case, there must be no more Turkish loans
and guarantees, but they must give her downright plain
subsidies. Such, he thought, must be the inevitable re-
sult, if the Turkish Government be of opinion at any
time that sufficient terms of peace had been proposed.
He was disposed to pay the utmost attention to any
opinion their ally, France, might give with reference to
negotiations for peace should such arise, and it would be
the duty of the English Government to consider the
whole of the circumstances, who, he hoped, on the one
band, would not consent to any terms they did not think
honourable and safe, and, on the other, not continue
the war when such terms could be obtained. With re-
spect, then, to the three questions—that of carrying
on the war at present, the preparations for the
future campaign, and any negotiations for peace
that might arise, he could only say that there
never could be greater confidence placed in a Go-
vernment than that reposed in them by the bill
they were about to read a third time, and the house
would have a right to call on them at the commence-
ment of the next session to show their confidence had
not been misplaced. He next adverted to the sum of
money granted for the conveyance of the Sardinian
troops to the seat of war, in consequence of a treaty en-
tered into with the King of Sardinia, and in doing so
could not help calling attention to their gallantry and
fidelity to the cause of Europe, and the general support
that cause had received at the hands of the king and his
ministers—(hear)—and who had waived all claims to
any concessions it might have been inexpedient for this
country and France to grant him. (Hear, hear.) He
had come forward boldly and cordially as an ally, and
had sent some of the best troops in Europe to the field
of battle, where he was certain, if occasion offered, these
troops would sustain the reputation they had acquired
during every period of European history. But if the
King of Sardinia and his ministers have acted ie this
manner (whilst subjecting their country to immediate
peril) to uphold the general balance of power in Europe,
it was not to be supposed that they did not expect to
obtain the moral support of tlis country, in a cause
which they, as well as Sardinia, have at•heart—that of
seeing a better system of government prevailing in Pied-
mont and Italy, and their anxiety for the accomplish-
ment of which he gave them great credit. Lord John
then alluded to the present state of Piedmont, the dis-
orders of which he hoped to see checked, and be no
longer consecrated as it were by the Government to the
state of the Two Sicilies to Tuscany, and to the occupa-
tion of Rome by the French. It has been said on the
part of the Roman Catholic powers of Europe, that it
was necessary the Pope, as the head of the Roman
Catholic Church, should have liberty of judg-
ment and independence of action, but if Rome
be occupied by foreign troops, where, he asked,
was his freedom and independence. Any person they
met with acquainted with these things, no matter to
what country they belonged, could not deny that if the
Austrian and French troops were withdrawn the autho-
rity of the Pope would be denied, and the people would
establish some sort of government more consistent with
justice, and admitting some degree of feeling opposite
to those odious means adopted by Ecclesiastical Go-
vernments. If that be the case, what prospect was
there, under the present system, that either the Ear-
perer of Austria or the Emperor of France would con-
sider himself able to withdraw his troops from that
place. But, if they should continue there, it was not
only as he had said logically a contradiction to the theory,
that the Pope, in order to be free and exercise due au-
thority over his Roman Catholic subjects, should have
an independent territory, but they were likely to cause
a disturbance in the balance of power in'Europe ; and,
consequently, they could not carry on war against Rus-
sia, because she occupied her neighbour's territory,
whilst they permitted foreign troops in Rome. thereby
disturbing the balance of power in Europe. This, he
thought, was a subject which .the British Government
ought to exert their power to prevent. Was it not, he
asked, possible for the English Government, in concert
with the French Government and with Austria, to
devise some system of government for these Roman
States consonant to the interests ofthe people, and have
in it the elements of justice. Had the war tsrminated
he believed it would have been one of the first subjects
to which the First Lord of the Treasury would have
directed the attention of our ally—to ask the
assistance of Austria in the task of devising some
valuable system of government for the Roman States,
that would enable the Emperor of France and the Em-
peror of Austria to withdraw their foreign forces, and
that foreign power which now prevailed there. Unhap-
pily they had no immediate prospects of peace, and
therefore it was he called the attention of the Govern-
ment to this subject, and he was aware it would not be
an unwilling attention, feeling certain that if his fiend
at the head of the Government could perceive any mo le
by which he could influence the Government for the
benefit of the people of Italy, and that would place
them more in accordance with the general interests of
Europe and their own happiness he would readily em-
bravos it. Ile (Lord J. Russell) could not see any great
difficulty that ought to prevent the accomplishment of
what he bad alluded to, but of course he did not enter
into the question of the original occupation of Rome by
France,-nor the title of Austria to the dominions he has
occupied. It might be said this was an old subject—
that this beautiful and unhappy land had been subject to
oppression of every kind, and had never enjoyed that
freedom which people of so much genius, of so much in-
dustry, and of such capacity for the free enjoyment of
physical and intellectual pursuits possessed ; but he saw
no reason why, because this was an ojd grievance it
should not be remedied, and he hoped they might all
live to see the end of this particular one. They had seen
in past years Spain, who had not been oppressed by
foreign powers make vigorous efforts to improve her
government, which she was still making, and he hoped
to God so successfully that they might see Spain in the
enjoyment of a representative government, which was at
present no doubt crushed in Italy by foreign influence.
He trusted the voice of England would be raised
for the improvement of the present system of Italian
government, at the same time checking and controlling
that wild spirit of liberty and enthusiasm which Mazzini
and his followers loved to inculcate. After some further
general remarks his lordship said he did not consider he
should have discharged his duty had he allowed the
session to close without commending this subject to the
notice of the Government.

Mr. WILKINSON was perfectly astonished at the
speech of the right hon. member for Oxford (Mr. Glad-
st one)the other night. That any man, much less a member
of the house, should draw such disastrous conclusions
with respect to the resources of England and France, he
must confess he felt greatly surprised and must wink
that it filled him with dismay. The noble lord the
member for the City of London still adhered to his opi-
nion that an honourable peace might be effected if the
proposition
of Austria had been acceded to, and that if
Turkey was satisfied with it, this country and France
had no right to interfere. (Cries of no, no, from Lord
John Russell.) He had understood the noble lord to
say so. Ho confessed he could not see how this war,
which was commenced for the purpose of showing that
the peace of Europe should not be disturbed with im-
punity, and tl at, if it was, the fault should lay with the
disturber. He thought the house ought not to separate
without some expression on the part of the house of their
opinion with respect to the war and its probable results.
Lord J. RUSSELL observe,' that the hon. member
for Lambeth was under a mistake with respect to what
he had stated on two important particulars. The first
was that the proposals of Austria might have been as-
sented to. Now he did not say any suck thing, what he
said was, that they might have been assented to at that
time but they could not now, but an opportunity mieet
arise during the recess for their re-consideration. With
respect to the second part he had stated that it
would be an unwise course to continue the war when
the Ambassador of Turkey, as he understood, was ready
to assent to the proposition of Austria.
Lord PALMERSTON did not rise to complain of
the course that had been pursued by his noble friend the
Imember for the City of London. It was natural that
the great objects to which he had adverted should oc-
cupy his mind at a period when'his time was less occu-
pied than it had formerly been. It was also natural for
him, at the end of the session, to ask the Government
what were their intentions on so important a subject.
The noble lord had adverted to the responsibility of the
Government ; he could assure his noble friend that the
Government were fully sensible of the great responsi-.
bilites that were upon their shoulders, and did not in-
tend to shrink from them. (Hear, hear.) When, how-
ever, a cause was just, and the sacrifice made called
for, lie could not see how one who had been a party to
the war and the continuance of it—iont
seefac howt,itsersueaethesl
advocate—(hear, hear)—he could not
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Whatever might be the opinion of some few n
that house, and a small number of persons outeeofEideoe.Orris.n:
he could never be brought to believe that the opinions
and statements put forward by them were consonant or
would be supported by the country at large. (Hear.)
It could not be expected that the Government could at
theythe ptrh heoseungtttime enter into any explanation as to what
might be accomplished by the prosecution
of the war, or what the effect of its end might be--
(hear, hear)—the operations of war must be dependent
upon circumstances that might arise. (Hear.) It was
unnecessary to tell any man that to state the course in-
tended to be adopted by the Government would have the
effect of laying the, grounds of defeat.l (Hear, hear.)
One opinion had been put forward by his noble friend— i
namely, that Turkey was willing and. anxious to adopt