The Sun.
London, England, 1855-03-13 00:00:00

'it was well known that 'seine of their 0 4erefepir.--47--- 4`
ried out in the worst possible manner; . ~,,q_7l4-iiiincii.,--,..tLx,
the clothing sent to the Crimea, and .t,,, •,.., pereap. .:Kt.;-\-,',
plied to the navy. The most reispecta,let gigs: Of the _ N44.4
country would not send tenders to thet'Goprnment, be. -%:,
t.
cause they knew they Would be ottbicfaiir.,perione-Who `:, ;7 r;
b\4l4.
only dealt in inferior articles. Teahad 131i0entione4 by -` ,/,,_
an hon. member, but it would be about 6.:wore4tbing , ',;,."**
the Government could do to go into the ma et and askfor ---7
a tender for a supply of that article. The price would ran- S
mediately run up, and the Government would have to se-
' cept a tender at an increased rate. It would be much bet-
ter to go to a respectable house, which be believed would
!not only undertake to supply a good article, but agree to
furnish it to those for whose consumption it was intended.
Mr. WILSON said the observations he made bad no re-
ference whatever to the army in the East. There was a
great difference* bet Ween an army in the field, subject to
uncertainty and rapid and constant .movements, and an
army in a settled community. He alluded tp,eur various
coMmisiariat'establishnients all over the world—at Ber-
-muda, the Cape of Good Hope, and other places—where
the troops were stationary, and where there were persons
-on whose rood faith they bad perfect- reliance, - and who
I-were amenable to the law. It did not require very much
consideration to see that feeding the army in the Etst by
contract mould he a most inetileient and unsatisfactory
mode of proceeding. The contract system, like every other
systeui, was detective in svaie poiro4;" 'lnd lie asked what
the country would think of their all'oving the officers of
the commissariat and other departtnenti to deal with. pri-
vate individuals without the check of publicity? (Hear.)
Viscount EBRINGTON complained of ;the bad quality
of the clothing which had been furnished o the troops.
This was attributable to takinc, the lowest tend sr, without
reference to the quality, and having persons to inspect the
goods who knew nothing of the duties they were called
upon to discharge. He wished also to impress upon the
Government the great importance of supplying the troops
with vegetables, and this wilether they had salt or fret'}
meat.

1} lb. of biscuit, 1 oz. of coffee, 1 oz. of sugar, 2 or. of
rice, and 1-32 parts of a gallon of rum. . .

On the total amount of the different items in the esti-
mates being proposed,
Sir F. BARING obseried that this was the 'first time
that the estimates had been arranged under the new eye-
tom, and that it might perhaps be the most convenient
opportunity to make a few remarks upon the manner in
which that system had been carried out. He had always
been of opinion that all payments by the Treasury, as far
as they related directly to military affairs, should be trans-
ferred to the War Department ; but he saw no other rea-
son why matters of finance, banking, and other business of
that kind, should be thrown upon the War-office. He very
much doubted the policy of handing over the whole of
those matters to the War-office whish might be transacted
with greater ease in the Treasury. Again, with respect to
the great mass of colonial expenditure, which appeared to
-be transferred to the War-office, he feared that its trans-
action would completely overwhelm that department ; and
that if the war continued for two-or three years more, it
would be impossible to get through it without, great con-.
fusion. He would like to see a commission appointed,
which would provide that while a proper check was re-
served to the Treasury, the other departments should not
be overwhelieed with work which it was impossible for
them to discharge.
Mr. WILLIAMS said the estimate now proposed would
complete the war estimates for the present year, which
amounted to nearly 40,000,000/. He would like to have
seen the estimates referred to a committee of the house,
as it seemed to him that the house was voting the money
without any inquiry. (Hear.) He believed it would be
far better to consolidate all the payments connected with
the war, anti to make one person responsible for them.
He had hoped that the charges for the transport had all
been done with. He had hoped that the charges for the
transport had all been done with, but now ho found an
item of 282,000/. for transport service in the present esti-
mate. He considered that all these charges ought to be
consolidated, so that the house might be able to discuss
them at the same time, and with reference to each other.
Mr. WILSON said that the various duties which the
commissariat officers abroad had to discharge belonged to
various branches of the Government. They were duties of
a financial and executive character, and the way in which
their' accounts were adjusted was that the accourrts were
referred to the audit office, which separated them all,
and charged to each departnaent the portion which fairly
belonged to it. There was a curious element' in the
commissariat service called the commis/mist chest fend,
which contained a floating sum of /,2k30,000/. This sum
was still managed by the Treasury, and the War and
Naval Department were responsible for the portion which
they had of the fund. The Treasury was responsible that
this fund should, merely meet advances, and that all pay..
Infants made out of it should be. refunded as soon -as pos-
sible by the particular service on account of 'which the
advances were made.
Lord SEYMOUH said, the separation of the depart- ,
ments had taken six months to effect; and that it had not
been accomplished in a satisfactory manner. He was not
prepared to say what the beet arrangement would have
been, but he thought that the Treasury had transferred all
the difficulties of the Commissariat Department to the
War Department. This confusion was not, however,
fairly chargeable upon the House of Commons, but upon
the Treasury, which had effected the transfer in so inade-
quate and unsatisfactory a manner. The Commissariat
Department had been assailed more than any other, and
yet he believed it was the only department in which pro-
motion went by merit only, and not by interest. With
regard to the charge of 282,0001. for land and inland trans-
port service, to which the hon. member for Lambeth had
referred, the charge had nothing whatever to do with the
transport of troops by ships, it being intended to cover the
expenses connected with moving men and material from
place to place on shore. The present item included a sum
of 50,0001. for the railway from Balaklava to the camp be-
fore Sebastopol. He did not want to go through the de-
tails of the Vote, but there was one point to which he must
refer, and that was the rations issued. It was generally
'understood that those rations were principally salt beef,
and he thought 'that the Government ought to turn its
most serious attention to the question whether other ra-
tions could not be issued in lieu of salt beef, and that it
ought to strive as far as possible that vegetables should be
issued with the rations. _ .

Lord LOVAINE thought it was a bad system to appoint
civilians to the commissariat department. In the East
India Company they selected men from among the ranks
of the army, who were better qualified for the discharge-of
the duties than civilians.
Mr. ROCHE said it was not the fault of the contract
system that the goods supplied were inferior, but that of
the inspector. To accept any than the lowest tender
would involve the Executive in the greatest difficulties,
and expose them to the gravest suspicions.
Captain BOLDERO said that the navvies had remon-
strated against being deprived of their beer, and that the
Government had accordingly fitted out three vessels with
beer for their use. If civilians were to have it, he saw no
reason why the troops should not also enjoy their favourite
beverage. He wished to know why the supply for the army
Lad been stopped?
Mr. WILSON said that the reason why the Government
had .not supplied the troops with beer was, that it was u
apart of the regulations. The object of the Government
in sending out beer, tea, &0., was to allow the men to pur-
chase em at the lowest possible price.
Mr. STAFFORD was of opinion that the answers of the
hon. gentloman the Secretary of the Treastuy (Mr. Wilson)
to the statements of his hon. and gallant friend (Captain
Boldero) were most unsatisfactory. A general denial was
by no means smfficient. His hon. and gallant friend had
made, s he has. a right to make, complaints of the manner
in which the commissariat was administered ; and though
his hon. and gallant friend had not been allowed to quote
the evidence given before the committee, and had been
stopped in doing so, the facts themselves were unfortu-
nately only too notorious. Were those statements true, or
were they not ? The Answers of the hen. gentleman, he re-
peated, would not be sufficient for the people of thfs coun-
try, who felt so deep an interest in everything concerning
the welfare of the army. What had the answer of the Se-
cretary to the Treasury i'Mr. Wilson) amounted to?. Why,
merely to this—that M. Commissary Fader, having
already made promises which he had not fulfilled, the
Government had confidence? that he would still fulfil
them. Bat the statement c)f his honourable and gallant
friend would go forth to the c.euntry, and would be eagerly
perused. The treatment of ti.,e bo.b:iers wounded in the
Crimea who arrived here was disgraceful to the Govern-
ment. On the voyage, those poor fellows had, to his
certain knowledge, nothing better to eat than pork, salt
pork—not only salt pork, but even van pork quite rancid.
(Hear.) Yes, and biscuits so rotten that they were full of
maggots, and which, to be eaten at tql, ought, like those
of the crew of Columbus, to be eaten in ,tho dark. (Hear.)
Well, but there was another grievance--a shameful griev-
ance. Why were not those poor, men p aid when they
rived here ? Why did they not receive the arrears of their
pay which were honestly duo to them ? Wan it not cruel
to deprive a poor fellow who, having lost art arm or a leg
in fighting the battles of his country, arrived on our shores
of the means of paying his fare to the place in whieh'his
' relatives resided ? (Hear, hear.) And this, too, when the
money was due to him. The excuse set up by the officials
for this cruel treatment was, that the aszonnts Nati not yet
arrived from the Crimea; but those accounts were iu a
state of the most hepelesa confusion. Was this the man-
ner in which, by our miserable system of routine, our gal-
lant soldiers were to be treated ? Would they permit such
a system to go on in the War-office? He had personally
complained of this, and would continue to do so until the
injustice was remedied. The hon. gentleman also called
attention to the state of tho hospitals in the East, and es-
pecially respecting that about to be established at Smyrna.
Last December he had asked the authorities at the War-
office to establish an hospital at Smyrna, because the cli-
mate during the winter months was favourable to pulino-
nary complaints, but his suggestions were overruled; and
now that the hot weather was about to set in, and that the
climate there would be insalubrious in a high degree, we
were about to have an hospital. (Hear, hear. )
Colonel PEEL deprecated those repeated statements re-
specting matters which were now nutlet consideration be-
fore a committee upstairs —a committee specially app,inted
to inquire into and report upon the state of the army be-
fore Sebastopol. That committee was most earnestly en-
gaged in the inquiry, and would, he felt persuaded, have a
most searching and thorough investigation. Until the
committee had concluded its labours, he would advise his
hon. friend and others to forbear rnakiug those statements
which inculpated absent poisons to the house.
Mr. Stafford had only called the attention of the Go-
ya!' nruent to evils of a most urgent md pressing character.
Mr. M. MILNI. S quite agreed with his hon. friend the
member for Northamptonshire (Mr. Stafford), and Lhought
the committee would prove an evil rather than a benefit if
it wore to have the effect of stopping the mouthsof bon-
members who had a perfect right to make such statements
to the house. (Hear, hcar.)
The vote was then agreed to.
A vote of 42,1201. was proposed to defray the charges of
half-pay, pensions, and allowances.
A.careed to.
The CHAIRMAN then reports 1 the resolutions.
The house resumed.
The house went into committee pro forma on the Militia
(Irelan:i) Bill, and added a clause.
The Intramurial Burials (Ireland) Bill was read a second
time.
The Purchasers Protection against Judgments Bill passed
through committee.
The Lunacy Regulation Act Amendment Bill passed
through committee.
PRICE'S DISABILITIES REMOVAL BILL.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL moved for leave to intro-
duce a bill to relieve W. P. Price, Esq., M.P., from any
disability he may have incurred by reason of a contract for
sending wooden houses to the army in the Crimea.
Mr. PELLA.TT wished to know whether any precedents
existed for interfering with the law, imperative as it was
laid down, in relation to persons taking Government con-
tracts while holding a seat in that house?
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL replied there would be no
difficulty in finding numerous instances ih which the house
had interfered in the case of persons who had incurred
penalties under the act.
Leave was then given to bring in the bill. '
SMOKE ABATEMENT BILL.
On the motion of Mr. WILKINSON, returns were or-
dered of the number of prosecutions its the metropolitan
police-courts under the Smoke Abatement Act, 1853, stat-
ing the grounds of such prosecutions, and the amount of
fines imposed in consequence thereof ; of the node ix. which
the amount of suck thane bad been applied ; and of the ex-
penses attending such prosecutions,
METROPOLITA.N LOCAL MANA.GBMENT.
Sir B. HALL postponed his bill for the better local ma-
nagement of the metropolis till-Friday.
The house then adjourned at 11 o'clock till this day-

Sir H. WILLOUGHBY wished to ask whether the vote
of 600,0001., which was taken for the commissariat ex-
penses of the year 1851-55, included the expenses of the
whole of that period, as, although that year was a year of
war, the amount exceeded but by very little that voted for
former years? That was one point which had to be ex-
plained. It certainly appeared to him that when the house
was discussing an estimate, which when voted would com-
prise a AIM of nearly 40,000,0001., it ought clearly to un-
derstand the machinery by which it was to be distributed.
The house did not know, though they were voting mil-
lions, that the articles to be supplied with the sums voted
would ever reach their destination. It was very difficult,
he knew, to discuss the question of transport, but still he
thought the hon. gentleman the Under Secretary for War
ought to tell them by what means the various stores to be
sent out were to reach their destination. Could the hon.
gentleman show that they would ever reach their.destina-
time ? It was useless to send stores at all, unless their
transport.was dealt with in the same manner as any man
of common sense would deal with it. It appeared from
late experience that, though 21,000 tons of provisions and
thousands of tons of fuel had been sent out to the Crimea,
the soldiers had had to eat their provisions raw, and a large
quantity of the stores had never been distributed at all.
The hon. gentleman ought at least to show that something
had been done to prevent a recurrence of those terrific
blunders. When the goods were put on board the trans-
ports, some one ought to be put with them to be respon-
sible fortheir safe delivery. As it was it was mere chance
if the stores ever reached their destination. All those cir-
cumstances to which he had adverted seemed to point to a
want of arrangement in detail.
Mr. F. PEEL said he believed that the difficulties- which
had beau experienced in regard to the transport of stores
were confined exclusively to land transport. The trans-
port of stores by sea was managed by the Admiralty, and
they had established a transport board to attend exclu-
sively to that business. He (Mr. Peel) believed such mat-
ters. would be mush facilitated by their conduct being
wholly undertaken by one department of Government.
Mr. WILSON said with regard to the question of the
hon. gentleman opposite (Sir 11. Willoughby) whether the
600,000/. voted for 1854-55 included the whole expenses of
the commissariat' for that year, he (Mr. Wilson) had been
asked the same question last year, and had then replied
that it was impossible to form any accurate estimate as to
the commissariat expenses, and that the Government would,
therefore, take, as nearly as possible, the usual voteforthose
expenses, leaving it to the vote of credit of 3,000,00.11. to
supply every deficiency that might be found in the amount
vot,d. This year the Government had had a better oppor-
tunity of estimating the probable expenses of the Commis.
sariat Department, and therefore proposed to take a vote
for a sum equal to its estimated expenditure. He would
add that the commissariat accounts would still be audited,
as formerly, by the Audit Board.
Mr. LAING said that the house ought, in order to be
able to enter into any useful discussion upon the estimates,
to have an analysis, showing how, and to whom, the same
were to be distributed. • One of the sums to be voted was
a million, or more, for rations for the army. Those rations
principally consisted of salt beef. Now; the estimates showed
the amount of rations to be supplied to different military
stations, bat did not show the number of men at each to
whoni they were to be distributed. The house ought also
to know the particular items on which the money was ex-
pended, and nothing would be easier than to give an ana-
lysis of such items. He would also call attention to the
question of many of those articles being supplied by. pri-
vate contract. Many of the largest shippers provisioned
their vessels by private contract, and it was found moat
beneficial to all parties. The majority of emigrant vessels
were also provisioned in the same way; and economy and a
better supply was almost universally the result. He did
not wish to dogmatiseupon the point, for it was a very dif-
ficult one, but it certainly was onoworthyof investigation,
and he thought that, after the transport estimates had been
voted, it would be as well to have the matter thoroughly
considered by a, committee of practical mete upstairs. With
regard to the rations of salt beef which had been supplied
to thatroops in the Crimea, he did hope that some different
arrangement would be come to with regard to rations. He
also suggested that tea should occasionally be substituted
for coffee, as the former would be found not only a great
luxury, but also in casesof diarrhces, possessed of medicinal
qualities. He would also suggest that vegetables should be
supplied to the troops as often as possible. They might be
sent out compressed and dried. Some such packages had
bsen received in the Crimea, and he had heard from a friend
lately returned from the camp that they were much relish-
ed, and esteemed a great luxury. He would also suggest
whether oranges might not be supplied. They might easily
be furnished, and would bo found great comforts.
Sir J. BAILEY asked whether any explanation-had been
given to-the house why the army had for so long a time
.
been rationed almost exclusivelyon salt meat? Anyamount ('2om the Constitutionnel of yesterday.)
of fresh provisions might have readily, with the means of The Emperor Nicholas, was not merely's Man, but,
transport we possessed, been obtained from Europe, Asia like all other Czars who succeeded each ether on the
Minor, and other ports. throne of the Romanoffs, he personified a system, a
Mr. WILSON said ample arrangements were made for people, and a tradition. Though the man is" dead, the
a fresh supply of provisoes from the coast of Asia Minor,
people, the tradition, and the system remain. Whatever
and why it should have failed so much of late he was un- name be may bear, thei sovereign who reigns at St. Fe-
eble to state; but he saw from accounts in the public pa-
pers that the difficulty of transpoit was very great, and the tersburg is always
butthe itC eisart,bauniddetaheofCczaarthisarninoet Nanidchaef-
&faculty of feeding cattle far greater. It also appeared las, or Alexander,.
that cattle had died in considerable numbers. With re- Peter, and what is still more, of Russia. The Emperor
gard to the contract system there could be but one opinion, Alexander, in succeeding Nicholas, can therefore 'lei-
that in every possible shape and form in which that sys- they change the policy of his ancestors, nor smooth doss
tern could be brought to boar it should be adopted. Com- the difficulties of the present state of affairs. His lan-
ers more Kind,
petition by open contracts was supported by all their ex- ganudagheims anyathuerempoerrehamposd:sastet,vhraisnnniranlu.
perience, whether the eud to be attained was economy or
ame-
nity, but it does notPdAelelevnitalcoen ihuiosreowcßourwtielslytoandauaumede;
efficiency. He admitted the principle most fully, and as relations with Europa • • ', ho may in his
far as it could be carried out. At the commissariat eta-
voluntarily to
tiona throughout the world nothing was purchased by pri-
conditions of peace which might di-
tract contract or bargain, but everything by public con-
tract ; and so rigid were the rules of the service, that when minish the grandeur and curtail the powers of Russia.
the accounts were sent in to the Audit Board they had to These conditions can only be imposed on him by the
lee accompanied by the advertisements in the newspapers, authority of victory. This is the feeling which is
to show that the trammed," were made public, and also now generally manifested by the press of Germany, bet-
hperopvreintchipalta t,mheuildowheesetxtteehnddeear ter situated perhaps than any other to understand what
hadt h bet-
the theenedae rsa
accepted.
etehpetme
ds e. I v ells ,0
wt o t
is the true state of the question. Thus the Bowsenhatie
:htehaartmwya?
as muchamo
amoat
importantper head he
point, a Hamburg,ol,fo a
have
been o f thef
journal
uia tdhe
di lust.,
oaa tnn. ,
cannot
statesoh te d eat thiht
itself
of
fl f
tverytohethEiillusory
k petrart further by ratioiohosinyg
not prepared
and it was one well worthy the consideration of the Go- "
Nicholas.- That bring-
venni:lent.
a, PEACOCKE said it appeared that the troops sel- r Alexander will over consent to transform
dom received a ration of fresh meat; but, if he were cor- the military port of Sebastopol into a commercial one,
rectly informed, preserved meat to any extent might be and destroy the strongest and most formidable bulwark
supplied to them at a price only 2d. or 3d. above the cost. that Russia possesses in the Black Sea, and the asylum
1 the Emperor
of salt meat. He did not think, considering the services ,of the domination of the Czars over _a point of the globe
on which they were engaged, that the house would grudge from whence they menace at the same thin- Asia. and
that additional expense. Europe, Persia and Turkey. The eituation '6f- the
Col. DUNNE said the same reokl eisness and waste Eastern question before the conference at Vienna is,
characterised the distribution of the relief fund during the I
which
famine in Ireland marked the expedition to the East and I therefore, now precisely what it was before
the
of
the consequences were the mime, in both instances. In lof the Emperor Nicholas. This is the opinion also
the
East, the destruction of 2,000,000 of people ; and in the the Augsburg Gazette, which is persuaded 1 •
Eest, the destruction of an army. In each case the blame ' ellange which has taken place on the throne of Russia
rested with the cominisspriat. The Government were now gives no fresh chance for peace. This idea is also that
about to organise a laud transport corps ; but he could not ' of the Ust Deutsche Post of Vienna, which refuses to
which
th efadt
fate
does
understand why, with the examples to be found in former , see in the renewal of the powers and the coliErailition
campaigns of the necessity of such a corps, they should
have omitted forming it before the expedition started for I eam,ras,tee for the moderation of the Emperor Alexander.
tient i
tSipv
eensse:lus
solution
nztuttlektiil
;elf the instructions gieen to Prince Gortechakuff any
the East.
Lord SEYMOUR thought the observations of the Se- ' it be possible for the t• •
cretary to the Treasury required some further explanation. not think that can
' to 'ln - de
He uuderetood him to say the contract system was the best Vienna to leac . y
1 This 'is also the opinion
decided, for in its
system, and would be universally adopted by our army Sebastopol is
_opinion no peace which
abroad. Now, it might be very excellent in this country, should leave tha citadel of Russia in the Black, Sea
where there was a large mercantile community, but it standing, would offer any gua, antee for the future soca-
would fail at Constantinople, at Varna, and in Asia Miner. rite, of Europe. toss s Gazette, the Wanderer, and the
(Hear, hear.) If they made a contract with an Armenian, I Hanover Gazette express the same idea in different
or a Jew, he might break it almost immediately after- terms. The Volkshalle goes further,• and states that the
wards, and they could not subject him to any penalties. death of the Emperor Nicholas has rather weakened
He, therefore, wished to know whether, in the - purctiasee
d than strengthened the hoes ofeace. In fact they all
made in the East, the commissariat service was require seem to come to this conclusion :—" The Emperor
to proceed by contract, because, if so, the sooner the matter
Alexander may regret that Russia should have engaged
was inquired into the .better.
Mr. RICARDO very much doubted whether the con- sln a rash struggle with Europe under unfavourable cir-
tractback except
system was the beat even in this, country. There oumetances. But he can no longer draw by
was added to moat of the proposals of public companies force, and now that the sword has left the scabbard, it
for tenders an important proviso, that the parties did not will not be returned to it until Europe, which now sees
bind themselves to accept the lowest tender. The same the object to which Russia aspires, shall have gained the
. plan, however, was not followed b 7 theGoyernment, and ' cause of civilisation on fields of battle. 4 •

THE PACIFIC TENDENCIES OP Ti.TE
NEW EMPEROR.