The Sun.
London, England, 1855-04-24 00:00:00

" newspaper," which it had been sought to avoid, but of
course a legal construction could be put upon the word.
Mr. MILNER GIBSON hoped that in this year 187,5 it
would not be thought necessary for the safety (.1 our insti-
tutions or of private character to put a previous restraint
upon the expression of opinion upon paper. If it were,
however, there was no need for any new enactment, but only
to enforce the existing law under which not only every
newspaper but every periodical and every pamphlet was
liable to securities. He held in his hand the act passel by
Lord Castlereagh, and called one of the six acts, which
enacted that no person should after thirty days from the
late of its passinc, " print or publish for sale any news-
paper or any pamphlet "—let members of the house who
wrote pamphlets but never gave securities mark that—
" or other paper containing any public news, intelligence,
or occurrences, or any remarks or observations thereon, or
upon any matter in Church or State which shall not ex-
ceed two sheets (that was 714 square inches), or which
shall be published for sale at a less price than sixpence,
until he or she shall have entered into recognisances before
a baron of the Exchequer in England, and found two suf-
ficient securities that they will be answerable for any pe-
nalties that may be incurred for any blasphemous or sedi-
tious libel," which responsibility had by au act passed in
the reign of William IV. been extended to private libel.
f they thought securities necessary, why did they not en-
force this tiOth Geo. 111., c. 9? There was no occa,don to,
re-enact any part of that act, as they were now asked to
.10. It ha I net been repo►led. It was still law, and there-
fore he appealed to theright bon. gentleman not to ask the
house to re-enact this act, which was stilt in force ; but.
if ho believed these securities were necessary, to do his
duty as a minister of the Crown and enforce this 60th Geo.
[II. c. 9, and, above all, to take care that the members of
the Government did not themselves violate it. There
never was a more flagrant violation of the law than Lord
J. Russell's letter to the Bishop of Durham. (Hear, hear,
and a laugh.) There was a pamphlet commenting upon
;natters in Church and State, soil in great numbers and
fora very small price, in regard to which his lordship had
entered into no securities, which rendered the publisher
liable under the 60th Geo. 111., c. 9, to " forfeit for every
such offence the sum of 2C1." How large a sum did the noble
lord at this moment owe to the Queen ? a debt which hehad

incurred by violating a law which it was his duty to en-
torce, anti which the Cabinet of which he was a member
was now calling upon the house to re-enact. There was not
slightest necessity for such re-enactment. What was
wasted was that Ministers should do their duty and enforce
the law, and not come to that house with a claptrap to ask
it to agree to clauses which they had not the remotest in-
tention of enforcing, and which they only proposed that
they might say to the world, "At any rate we have re-
tained something ; we have got securities, and there will
be no blasphemy or- se,tition." The extra,,rdinary thing
was that the Government of a few weeks ago—he did not
know whether the present Government was the same one,
hut it looked very like it—agreed to abolish these securi•
ties. The present First Minister of the Crown was a mem-
ber of that Cabinet, and must, theref re, he presumed,
have given his assent to the proposition for their abolition.
He must say a word upon the absurdity of making the
giving of securities contingent upon going through the
post. The act of Geo. 111., enacting securities, was ra-
tional, but this plan was a ridiculous mode of carrying out
an absurd policy. (Hear.) Let them abolish these secu-
rities, because they were not consistent with the principles
of a free press. Let them trust to the power of the com-
mon law to put down the libeller. There were penalties
that could b • enforced, and every man had a right, whe-
ther he was wealthy or poor, to express his opinion upon
paper. How could a poor man express his opinion upon
public affairs if he must enter into a bond for 4001. or
make a declaration that he was worth 4001. after all his
debts were paid, and, in addition to that, must obtain two
wealthy securities ? He hoped and trusted that, profess:ng
a desire for a just measure towards all classes of the com-
munity, and to uphold the knowledge and freedom of the
press, they would. not carry out such a class measure, or
say that none but the wealthy and upper classes of this
country should be at liberty to publish periodical publica-
tions, newspapers, or pamphlets.
Mr. F. SCOTT believed that the press would best consult
its own liberty and dignity if it would encourage a registi
tion of the names of the persons who wore really responsible
for what was published in the jon:nals. Notoing was more
. .

objectionable than that a person should be brought forward
as liable for a publication who really should not be made
liable for it, and if the clause was nostponed, he trusted
the right hon. gentleman would make it effectual towards
bringing forward the persons really responsible.
S r F. THESIGER understood the Chancellor of the
Exchequer to say he considered there was an important
matter requiring consideration with regard to the clause,
and that it was desirable that it should be p pstponed, to

afford his right hon. friend an opportunity of considering
whether he could iraine the clause in such a Way as would
meet the approbation of the house. It was desirable they
should see the clause the Government would present for
their consideration, and he thought the discussion that
had taken place was very unnecessary. He trusted the
Chancellor of the Exchequer would pass on to the other
clauses of the bill.

The clause was postponed, and the amendment was with-
drawn.
Clauses 5,6, 7, 8 were also postponed.
Clauses 9, 10, 11, 12, and 13, with some verbal amend-
ments, were agreed to.
Sir H. WILLOUGHBY begged to ask the right hon.
gentleman whether he ha•l calculated what the revenue
would be if this bill should become law ? The present re-
venue was calculated at about 470,0001, but it was desi-
rable to know what the revenue would be after the deduc-
tion of expenses.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
all estimates with regard to the produce of the newspaper
stamp, when instead of being compulsory it'was volun-
tary, were necessarily conjectural and uncertain, but, ac-
cording to the estimate that had been made, the produce
would be 200, CO/.

Mr. DISRA ELl—There was notice given by the Govern-
ment of a clause on a most important subject, namely, th•
copyright of newspapers, but we have had no statement
from the Chancellor of the Exchequer on this point, nor as
to wh,ther they intend to proceed with the proposition.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—I have the
clause with me, and if it bo the wish of the committee I
am now prepared to move it. I thought, however, that as
some of the clauses have been postponed, it hot now
be convenient to propose a new clans:).
Mr. BARROW remarked that power was proposed to
be given by this clause fur the recovery of penalties in a
summary manner, involving one of the most difficult ques-
tions that ever came before a court of justice. He th,ught
the practice of printing a clause in this manner to ba de-
liv,red to members after they came into the house,

out an opportnidty being afforded to the public at large of
seeing it, was inconvenient, and he trusted the Chancellor
of the Exchequer would not tarnish his fair fame by adopt-
ing a practice that was unfair to the piOlic at large.
The CHA NC iMLOR of the EXCHE:.2UER said it was
quite true the clause did contain a penalty, but that pe-
nalty was not to be recovered by the Attorney• General,
but by the proprietor of a newspaper for the piracy of any
matter contained in his newspaper, and that was a matter
for the committee hereafter to consider. He considered
that the practice adopted by him was of constant occur-
rence in the house, and that there was nothing unusual,
unprecedente,l, or exceptional in it. He had given notice
of the clause three or four days ago; hon. members had au
opportunity to consider it, and it had also recaved circu-
lation amongst the public.
Mr. BARROW replied that he did not receive the clause
with his votes, and he did not know any member who had
so received it.

Mr. BRIGHT wished to know from the right hon.
gentleman when he intended to go into committee again
on this bill? There were some hundred persons in a state
of agony with regal(' to the bill. (A laugh.) The pro-
prietors of newspapers did not know where they would be
next week, and there were oth:F newspapers struggling.
into life. Great expenses were i curred, and a most im-
portant branch of industry would be paralysed until this
bill should be disposed of. (Hear, hear.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER--I will fix
it for Monday next.
Mr. BRIGHT—Why not Friday ?
The ChancePor of the Exch4quer did not reply, and it
was accordingly understood that the bill was fixed for
Monday.
The Chairman was ordered to report progress and get
leave to sit again; and the house resumed.
BANKRUPTCY (IRELAND) BILL.
Mr. CAIRNS move,' for and obtained leave to intro-
duce a bill to amend and consolidate the laws relating to
bankruptcy in Ireland.
ABSCONDING DEBTORS (IRELAND) BILL.

Mr. CAIRNS obtained leave to bring in a bill to facili-
tate the more speedy arrest of absconding debtors in
Ireland.

THE SEBASTOPOL COMMITTEE.

Mr. ROEBUCK said thet his name appeared on the
paper appended to a notice that the hon. na-nuber for the
county of Limerick (Mr. Da Vere) be added to the army
before Sebastopol committee. On consultation, however,
with the committee the result was, that they wished him
to state to the house, as a conclusion to which they had
unanimously come, that in their opinion it would be better
if no further addition were made to the committee. (Oh,
oh, and laughter on the Opposition benches.) He. really
could not see what there was in that announcement to elieit
the laughter of hon gentlemen opposite. (Oh, oh.) He
could take upon himself to state that the members of the
committee had been extremely sedulous in their attention
to business, having only on one occasion failed-to wake a
committee. As yet. there had been no difference of opinion
amongst them, and they regarded the discussions which
had taken place in that house as tending to injure them in
their ju,iicial capaoity before the country. They thought
that they could best conduct the inquiry without any fur-
ther addition to their numbers, while, at the same time,
they would advantage the public service by putting an end
to discussions that interfered with the discharge of their
duties, lie could only add, that he had mentioned the
decision of the committee to the noble lord at the head of
the Government, and he had acceded to their views ; it
was, therefore, not his intention to propose ony one to fill
the vacant place on the committee. (Oh, oh, and
laughter.)
d
exceedingly
exfuasMeu(
apieneref
enunciated
iontEueghe(gl:ry,
h‘bTvettyelhv
veNitae)
hurtre(ie:in7th,fgeoowr,
rnatt.wastshhgoaneentonwootttp:
theetinhugentleman,
ittohhranuio.,scciv.he surprised,
ehoatmwnih sdeeauu
arcisf
eotto:tmstrorai
nmtyt)cenh.
etntelereiN
vies,
gel
gentleman
aeirt discussion
regretted
ut:
th
it. (Loud cries of Hear, hear, from the Opposition
benches.) In making that remark, he begged to say that
he intended to impugn neither colieetively nor individually
the conduct of the committee. Hut having on a former
occasion contended—and contended with the concurrence
of opinion of at least a large minority in that house —that
considering the subjects which were being discussed before
the committee, it was indispensable that at least one
member of it should be connected with the naval profession
—(hear, hear) who might cross-examine closely and effi-
ciently a great number of the witnesses necessarily pro-
duced before the committee--many of whom, trying to
save their wen reputation, would be bent on trying -to
conceal the truth. Now, he would defy even the acuteness
of the hon. and learned gentleman himself to extract the
truth from an unwilling witness of that description. He
could only express his surprise that the independent ad-
vocate of investigation into abuses and maladministration
of affairs at the seat of war should have thought it neces-
sary to refer upon all occasions of doubt for advice to the
noble lord at the head of the Government. (Cheers from
the Opposition benches.) He, however, repudiated the
principle laid down by the hon. and learned gentleman ;
for he contended that the nomination of the committee
oouugghhtt
not
trteo be
rest entirely
dependentupon thearrangements Houseof
with Commons,made
behindan
d
the Speaker's chair. (Hear, hear.) All such hole-and-
corner work was most unseemly, in reference to a subject
like that before the committee. (Hear, hear.) Hitherto,
a large portion of the committee's inquiries had reference
to the transport service—a consideration that very ma:
terially strengthened hie demand that a naval, officer
ehould be Appointed to, serve on it. (Hear,- heir.)-
kiikirefore, though the honourable gentletriareight
justified in withdrawing from further consideration the
name of the hon. member for the county of Limerick, I
he could not consent to doing the algae in referent, to