The National Register.
London, England, 1809-11-05 00:00:00

THE NATIONAL REGISTER.

Mrs. Clarke, in company with Major Dodd, and Mr. Glennie,
without committing that which a Member of that Court (Mr.
Samuel Dixon) said that he would have committed if he were in
the same situation. Mr. Wardle had different feelings respecting
his duties, and yet saw that it was necessary to amuse, by such
an excursion, a woman of her slippery turn, and prevent her
falling into the- fangs of the enemy. if Mr. Wardle had not
persevered in the form of action which first suggested itself to
him as the proper one, it must be recollected that he bad ob-
tained a true bill for a conspiracy against those people, and that
the evidence of the perjury must have been very strong before
the Grand Jury would have found the bill for a conspiracy,
which depended upon the perjury. Mr. Wardle had not de-
layed a single day in endeavouring to bring the matter to a trial,
and he would have Leen content to have it tried at the SCSiiOIIS.
In those two points, then, opon which Mr. Wardle had been
most calutuniated, he and erred to him to be absolutely blame-
less; and he felt no doubi.bot the more his conduct was inquired
into, the mote appreat would the purity of his motives be.
lie coueeived that ;Mr. Wardle had in the la's Session of Par-
liament, rendered to hi 3 country a servii.e much more important,
than it had received from any of the transactions of the late war.
>len that had rendered such great services, and slimed so touch
energy, could not he too highly prized. The country was in
need of such men ; and w nerever they appeared, by sea or by.,
!and, they should he welcomed and cherished. It was always
impossible for any MeMbers who did not attend their duty, to
foresee the precise nature of the Amendrrnnt, that might be
moved to a Motion of which notice was given; but this was one
reason for sett ingaside the proceedings of former Courts, aae.l ex-
punging them from the Journal 4. He felt, therefore, bound to
support the original Resolution which he had moved, and to op-
pose the present Motion.
Mr. JACKS said, he was far from London when the original
motion of thanks to Colonel Wardle came forward, and there-
fore, he hoped he should be in some degree indulged now in the
delivery of his sentiments. As far as he viewed the present
question, he thought both parties were in some degree right.
He thought the lion. Alderman was right in saying, that an
amendment might be moved to a resolution, and he thought the
lion. Gentleman right as to the question, whether the original
resolutions were proper. With respect to Colonel Wardle, as
far as he could view the conduct of that Gentleman, he confess-
ed he could Fee nothing which had occurred since the approba-
lion of the Resolutions which could affect his conduct since. As
to the language of the original Resolutions, he thought there
was much to reprehend. It was said in them that Church we-
.fermentsivere disposed of; now that was not true, although it
was true that Church preferments had been applied for. As to
Lord Castlereagh's conduct in the disposal of India Patronage,
,it was a principle of British justice that no man should be found
guilty except upon proof, and in the present instance no proof
had been adduced before the House. Indeed, the corrupt in-
fluence which in that House, as elsewhere, was attribted to the
Members, could only api;ly to the disposal of Boroughs. He
.aid not like corruption—he detested it as much as any
man; but corruption was, to public bodies, what vice was
to private individuals—neither could exist, in some degree,
without it—they were natural and incidental diseases. In the
free States of antiquity, corruption was discernible: even ip
Greece and Rome. abuse of public men, and the operation of
public measures, were co-ordinate. The principal question
now, however, was, Were the public men of the present day
wore corrupt than those of former times ? He did not think
they were In the earlier periods of even our own history, the
great Lord Bacon, that luminary of science, and light of the
political world, notoriously received bribes when Lord Chan-
cellor. In the wear 1694, the Committee of the House of Coin-'
mons found, that 90,0001. had been annually distributed among
the Members ; and even the Speaker of the House himself had
seceived 10001. for the passing of a Bill. The language of the
present day, a 3 to corruption, was precisely the same as that
which was used formerly. In 1T34, Mr. Pulteney bad said
that corruption was at it its height ; and that unles.s.it was di-
minished, the Constitution would be lost. Yet the !Constitu-
tion still remained. Sir William Windham also used the same
sentiments. In those days, WO Pfacemen and Pensioners were
discovered in the House: whereas, on the late motion, only
78 could he traced by the greatest ingenuity. The House of
Commons, he thought, were vigilant iu the execution of their,
duty : by that vigilance, the case of Lord Melville was disco-
vered : by that vigilance the .case of Mr. Alexander Davison
was discovered, and many ,pikers of equal detrime4.to the

country& The Speaker's language in the resolution concerning
the sale of scats had been mis-quoted : the language as to the
existence of a public office for the sale of offices under Govern-
ment, had also keen ridiculed. Indeed, all Colonel Wardle's
plans of economy, founded upon such documents, were ridi-
culous. Colonel Wardle economically wished to save the
country by the reduction of its principal defence, the army.
Ile wished to reduce the army at a time when the country was
chiefly menaced, and when Buonaparte had concentrated his
forces as it were into a focus. It was become the fashion lately
to decry public men ; but could Government go on without
them, or would not the peol;:e either sink into discontent or
apathy, which would as effectually ruin the country ? He could
not see why public men should be now so much abused as to a
change of principle ; they tad always changed their principles.
Mr. Pitt had been once an arraot rceori»er, end had afterwerds
opposed reform. Mr. Fox, once a notorious enemy, had after-
wards coalesced with Lord North. Mr. Burke had been it
confessed apostate. Why should public men now. then, be
adjudged with such strictness! Fur his part, he thought the
prerogatives of the Crowa were in more danger than the privi-
leges of the People. He had lived fur half a reoturv, well
and happy under the British Constitution. He had grown rich
under it ; and he wished it a long continuance.
Mr. WAITIIK N expected, frost the speech of the Hon.
Opener of this debate, that be should have very little to say;
as he understood him to wish that the Resolutions should in sub-
stance, stand hut that the irregularity of their introduction was
to be reprehended. Ile was a little surprised, however, at the
pertinacity of the lion. Opener on this occasion; because, ors
the very last Court-day he had, by his silence, countenanced
thr very same irregularity of which he now complained. The
Court had net under a summon. very different from the subse-
quent resolution on which it had agreed. With respect to the
original resolutions he should be as ready as any man to rescind
them, if any discoveries had bees made, which in his mind
militated against them; but from subsequent discoveries, he was
inclined to draw very different conclusions from those who had
already spoken. He thought, indeed, from the indirect and
clandestine attacks which had been made, that the Court was
called upon to vindicate the character of Colonel Wardle. As
to the speech of the Hon. Gentleman • who spoke last, of ail the
wonderful speeches he had spoken, it was the most wonderful.
He had never before seen him so encumber himself with dust and
cobwebs—he had never seen him in so puzzle-brained a manner
steer between right and wrong. Indeed in his conjectures as to
the Church Patronage, he was not there so much to be blamed—
he had stolen his errors. He lied quibbled, like the origiuol and
arch quibbler Mr. Canning, who would not attach guilt broause
the iniquity had not been completed—who would not criminate
the Duke of York as to church influence, although, at •the in-
tercession of his prostitute, Doctor O'Meara, a Clergymen, had
preached before royalty. With respect' to the East India pa-
tronage, so far from the Speaker's speech having been misquo-
ted, cot only he, but Lord Liverpool in the House of Lerds, had
in the highest degree rept,elaen4ed it. It was said, however, that
Lord Castlereagh and his colleagues In office ought not to be
abused because they were the men upon whom the hopes of the
country were fixed. If this was the case, all he could say was,
that the country was lost-.-that the country wag rained beyond
redemption. The Hon. Gent. bad said he loved virtue and hated.
vice. Aye, abstractedly, just as he loved a good dinner—
(A laugh). He was, however, quite a philosopher--a meta-
physical genius—(A laugh). He had found out forsooth that
;because corruption was prevalent in other ages, we ought not to
;abuse it now. This was, however Canning's doctrine. Now,
,!public men were attacked, and now they were to make a stand,
sand now he had come so his rally. The Hon. Gentle-
man had said he had stood up for the Constitution be-
Itause he had made money under it. Oh, what wonderful talents
4!

NOV. 5. THE NATIONAL I
Mrs. Clarke, in company with Major Dodd, and Mr. Glennie, cotta
without committing that which a Member of that Court (Mr. the
Samuel Dixon) said that he would have committed if he were io ea"'
the same situation. Mr. Wardle had different feelings respecting meat
his duties, and yet saw that it was necessary to amuse, by such Plan
an excursion, a woman of her slippery turn, and prevent her culoi
falling into the' fangs of the enemy. if Mr. Wardle had not roue
persevered in the form of action which first suggested itself to Ile I
him as the proper one, it must be recollected that he bad ob. chiel
tamped a true bill for a conspiracy against those people, and that fora
the evidence of the perjury must have been very strong before to
the Grand Jury would have found the bill for a conspiracy, then
• which depended upon the perjury. Mr. Wardle had not de- apat
layed a single day in endeavouring to brirg the matter to a trial, nut
and he would have Leen confers( to have it tried at the SCSiifinS. char
In those two points, then, e2un which Mr. Wardle had been Mr.
most calumniated, he a o.:eared to him to be absolutely blame- "PP(
loss; and he felt no doubt but the more his conduct was inquired wan'
into, the mote apprreat would the purity of his motives be. e"af
lie couceived that ;Mr. Wardle had in the la't Session of Par- artiu
liament, rendered to lii3 country a servii.e much more important, Prer
than it had received from any of the transactions of the late war. loge;
>len that had rendered such great services, and slimed so touch and
energy, could not he too highly prized. The country was in uade
need of such men ; and w nerever they appeared, by sea or by. M
!and, they should he welcomed and cherished. It was always ape
impossible for any MeMbers who (lid not attend their duty, to as lit
foresee the precise nature of the Amendment, that might be stain
moved to a Motion of which notice was given; hut this was one to ht
reason for setting aside the proceedings ()frontier Courts, mid ex- pert
punging them from the Journal 4. He felt, therefore, bound to the
support the original Resolution which he had moved, and to op- thr
pose the present Motion. Cott
Mr. JACKS said, he was far from London when the original quer
motion of thanks to Colonel Wardle came forward, and there- °rig'
fore, he hoped he should be in some degree indulged now in the then
delivery of his sentiments. As far as he viewed the present milli
quest:on, he thought both parties were in some degree right. inch
He thought the lion. Alderman was right in saying, that an airet
amendment might be moved to a resolution, and he thought the clan'
lion. Gentleman right as to the question, whether the original calls
• resolutions were proper. With respect to Colonel Wardle, as to th
far as he could view the conduct of that Gentleman, he confess- WOO
ed he could Fee nothing which had occurred since the approba- He I
lion of the Resolutions which could affect his conduct since. As cobs
to the language of the original Resolutions, he thought there steel
was much to reprehend. It was said in them that Church we- the
fermentsivere disposed of; now that was not true, although it he k
was true that Church preferments had been applied for. As to arch
Lord Castlereagh's conduct in the disposal of India Patronage, the
,it was a principle of British justice that no man should be found the
guilty except upon proof, and in the present instance no proof tem
had been adduced before the House. Indeed, the corrupt in- Prea
euence which in that House, as elsewhere, was attribted to the Iron
Members, could only api; ly to the disposal of Boroughs. He ted,
.aid not like corruption—he detested it as much as any to ti
man; but corruption was, to public bodies, what vice was Lon
to private individuals—neither could exist, in some degree, abus
without it—they were natural and incidental diseases. In the cour
free States of antiquity, corruption was discernible: even ip that
Greece and Rome. abuse of public men, and the operation of rede
public measures, were co-ordinate. The principal question vice
now, however, was, Were the public men of the present day (4
wure corrupt than those of former times ? He did not think PhY
they were In the earlier periods of even our own history, the .beet
great Lord Bacon, that luminary of science, and light of the lthu'
political world, notoriously received bribes when Lord Chan- Pub'
cellor. In the year 1694, the Committee of the House of Cum-
and
mons found, that 90,0001. had been annually distributed among Man
the Members; and even the Speaker of the House himself had caw
• received 10001. for the passiug of a Bill. The language of the he
present day, a 3 to corruption, was precisely time same as that for
which was used formerly. In 1T34, Mr. Pulteney bad said wer
that corruption was at it its height ; and that unless:it was di- use!
,minished, the Constitution would be lost. Yet the !Constitu- at P
and
tion still remained. Sir William Windham also used the same
sentiments. In those days, WO ?lumen and Pensioners were hist
discovered in the House: whereas, on the late motion, only lion
78 could he traced by the greatest ingenuity. T.he House of erP
Commons, he thought, were vigilant iu the execution of tbeir .Ijus
duty : by that vigilance, the case of Lord Melville was witl
vered by that vigilance the .case of Mr. Alexander Davison spot
was discovered, fwd many atiters of equal detriment. .to the rod
•
•

he had! What a meliincholy reflection it was for himself,
for his country, and fur his frieuds, that those inestimable powers
were not exercised in their proper sphere, where they might be
useful, and where they might not be thrown away as they were
at present ! (A loud laugh).• :t44:Wiriiid. however, ask. the able
and learned' Gentleireins 41(0411,,inodern and ancient
history, whether tiler*;, .fit. : which the comp-
._ , . , ,
tion of the Goverlumit: • • :-serned, until they
produced their oirt:l • be littid corrap.
Coe was prevalenfr„ lightseetitbjf tint was eel.•
Willy encroaching ;• - posing. lie dis
tliot mean to, say ALIC produces by ibis
,inoultry. titb 1144 ..Pax trot a tool
• • ,!,

704

Mioister; aye, tlita good looking after. No Ministela could
be trusted unless a vigilant Parliament watched them. What
w (mid be the case. even in their own little corporation, unless
ihe sers ants were kept to their duty ? '6 1 wonder" said Mr.
Waithman, •• what that man can be grumbling at."—(Mr,
Dixon had appeared to dissent) {Mr. Dixon," I call upon
the Court la pa otect its officers")—( a loud and universal laugh.)
Mr. W ITII MA u hoped the lean would confine .himself to his
own de l'ence—G,d knows it would give him trouble enough ! (a
load laugh). . lle was far from abusing the Officers of the Court.
fle had only said, that public men, in all situation, should be
watt hed-such was the imbecility, of human nature. The Hon.
Gentleman had said, that the House had laughed at Col.-War-
dle about the assertion, as to the existence of a public office frr
the bitle of seat, under veroment. It was true, hat Ministers
a ;towards prosecuted those who held that i!/;ice ( hJar, hear).
Lie Hon. Gentleman had also descaoted upon Colonel ll'ardle's
proposed reduction of the army : he had stolen ail his hose
f:apIll Mr. Canning's old speech (a laugh ).--The reports of the
Commissioners of Aiilitary Enquiry had proved such a reduc-
tion necessary; and indeed Mr. Wyndham had fluty said the
w hole system• was corrupt from bottom to top. In the War-
office, it was said the arrears arose from the negligence of Clerks.
Why , because young Gentlemen of interest and of idle habits
mere put into it. and employed their time in it with no other
aamsement than that of reading antijacobinical pamphlets. This
was the only way in w hid* they could gain an honest livelihood (
rt
tatigh). He quoted the case of a Mr. Charles Hamiitou, who held
under Government 1501. per anu.—next, as secretary of Mr. Dllll-
- 1001. per aim —next a house, or another office, the rooms of
N Welt lie let Out at one guinea per week ! and lastly, he held
the office of Assessor of the property tax, which consumed nine
hours a day, and which of course left little time for his other
avocations. Yet this young gentleman got a pension on Mr.
Dundas going out of Cdef% In the War Office, a servant of a
Mr. Charles J.:Almon, if any one knew such a man, was ap-
pointed a Messenger ; and he, of course ignorant as he was,
could not even teal the duties of his oface before the Commissi-
(suers. Charl Jenkinion who thus paid his servant's wages out
of the public moesney, ought not to he it As to pensioner.,
in tic noose of Commons, he did not like to trust them. Many
might be honest it was true, but still where men were not only
induced to corruption by their own place:o, but by their friends,
by pensious, and by fdture expectations, they might well he
doubted. Public men had now great influence in their hands,
when the public revenue had grown to 75 millions annually.
Mr. Lewis, even, had lately gone out of (ace, with a pension
of 2000/. a-year. In 1795, when Lord Amherst was Com-
mander in Chief, that office was only 1000!. per annum ; and in
1807, Colonel Gordon, as its Setretary, had above two thou-
sand. The Hon. Gentleman seemed ail of a sadden to have new i
lights thrown upon his intellects. He had found out that the I
best way to support the prerogatives of the Crown, was to op-
pose the privileges of the people. In all times, he thought,
but at all events in such a time as this, the people ought to be
supported. One of the Judges of the land, Justice Bailed; in
speaking of the sale of offices, had said in the case of Sir Chris-.
topher Hawkins, accused of bribery, that the sale of such offi-
ces was scandalous, and that their continuance would reduce the
Conaitution to nothing, or to a mereshadow. The lion. Gentle- i
matt, had, however, denied that doctrine, and had said, that he-1
cause Pit, Fox, and Burke werecorrupt, we ought to trust other
public men, This was indeed infallible reasoning; it was, a'
wag be the case in all absurdities, proving the very reverse of
what the orator intended. Now there was Ho time to think of
the people, yet abuses were confessed, and stilt no exertion was
mode even by one Gentleman, who formerly said " Petitions to
the Throne ought to be presented once a week, till they were
remedied;" and by another whom he saw, who declared " his
blood was chilled in his veins by their recollection !" For his
part, he felt horror at the present complexion of affair4----ut
the sight of our armies lost and pining with disease—ai the sight
of our parliamentary corruption, and of coufessed imbecility
of our Government. He thought Colonel Wardle deserved
the thanks of the country ; he had done much good, awl
our ultimate success might be depended on, if the people were
firm, 'like him, and went up to the Throne with the complaint
cif their.grievances. The Hun. *Gentleman had said Buonaparte •
had eonceutrated his forces iu a focus. Oh !ss hat a strange way
4 wax of collecting forces 4ta focus, to spread them all over Bu-
ape - laugh). This he supposed,4iowevir, was the abstract
jetaphysics of the lion. Gent's philosophic mind. Strange '
s 3 ophy which couldbtiast those syho bad brought'ail its raisfor-
..

THE NATIONAL REGISTER.

•..

NOV 5.

tunes on the country—who bad.saeriticed.ourliernie
who hadttent our brave army to pine and perish in Walcheren—
ho were declared bv all think ing men incapable. Strange phi-
. losophv ! which could look unmoved at the w reek of all which
was great and good in the nation, which could relish the cant_
in; and hypocritical charity which affected to give relief while
it ‘viKked at delinerate cruelty. He did not wish to despair of
the country. He tnongtit Ministers inight he foond effective,
th:A was, provided they were well watched by lin honest,
rilant, and unpensioned Parliament. Genilemen were •shieeked
'now at Parliament being ~track: NI but if they looked to
(headdresses of the City in the time of Wilkes, they would find
inuch stronger language than w as used in these republ i: an dais.
lie thought Colonel Wardle had beery used mos: ungraiefully,
and if he had done so much good as Colonel Wardle did, and
then hail his private character and house searched for scandalous
anecdotes, whereby to vilify his character, he ,would have
thrown their gold box in their fate SO oner thin have taken it.
Ile opposed the present motion, heculise he thou:;lit its adoption
would he a censure on Colonel Wardle.

Mr. Dixon supported the Resolution. He did not see why
we should he so %cr% particular about corruption at home, when
(he power of Buontiparte a:)road wa= so terrific.
Mr. Keta(le declaretrhe should not have brought forward his
motion, if he had thonght it would have hurt Colonel Wardle.
Alderman Atkins supported the motion.
Mr. Miller spoke against the re :lotion.
The previous question was then carried by a great majority.