The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1820-10-20 00:00:00

was it from this nagged evidence of his tiriog employed es a
courier that groeral agency was to be inferred > There was
we evader* whatever of his cullertist witnesses resets'''.
or of en application to any other prams whatever to give
'eldest. except Madame Doomed. He apprehended there.
fore that sorb a overoti.le could lust be pot iss the rowel
stage of the proceedings.
Mr. Denman said, Shot there was Nothing whalers" is the
emir.* required by hint incousimeni with the oplahro deli.
cereal by the Judges ; and though kr had before castrated
himself, in s►ewug the agency of tkicelki, with referring to
those pages of the evidroce which respected lisechi himself,
be *Mt sure that their Lordship would not shut their eyes
to what had been slated by the witnesses. of the prueeethogs
of other agents; it wisield be the worst of wafts! ',limier« to
du so, fur he was sure he could establish o coonexiiiii be-
tween his acts and similar one. of other agents. When their
Lordship found that &Kati hail hero employed to go ha
Lansanne to Ming a witness to Milan, and then to go to
Clunsitz, by the same nolividnals, and for what purpose no
one could doubt, it was perfectly clear that he had hero an
agent. He could tort doubt that there bad hero sittfirient
proof of his agency to let in the quest' . Sorely if he
was known to have been an authorised egret going
about the country, abia‘ing most grossly Ike office eons.
tnittrd to hint, their Lordahips would not reject tindltlire of
that fact. If such a rule could be adopted, then his Learned
Friends would be fur ever able to protect and screen fruits
tiaposure the Mikan Coismocdini. But un the principles
bulb of law and common seam, be apprehended it was
competent to their Lordship. to eesmine witnesses as to
what had been the conduct of the authorised agents of the
Milan Commission in labouring to oujore sod death'',
lay weans of false testimony, the character of her Royal
Highness.

The Lord Chancellor asked whether the whole of the evi-
dence opine which they relied to prove that Sacs.hi hail
been a general agent, was to be found is pages 448 ■nd
449? He bad put this question because he theaglitt that
the question at present under ionsideration migist be hush-
ed at in two different ways: first, as to whetberflacchi bad
been ill agent; secondly, whether, sapposing that be were
not an agent, this sort of evidence were admissible to im-
peach his testimony as a witness. If Sacchi were as agent,
then the question could be put ; if witness, then he
might he tolled again and have mew questions put to him 14
iay a foundation fur the proposed evidence of the reties%
witness.

Mr. Denman then 114141 extracts from the evidence of lk.
moot, is page 344, importing that she had been desired td
go to Milan by Sacchi, an Italian Gentleman, who had
bees in the service of the Princess at the mime time she had
been; hr had game to seek and fetch ber, hut she did not
know whether he hid been otherwise in the service of the
Slilao Commission.

Mr. Path, in reply, said, that his Learned Friend had
dealt somewhat to generalities wise.. araknag of the effect
of the evidence of Sleicchi. When asked for the proof of his
agency, he stated fame which proved nothing mire thee
that he had been a mere tonne,. Out the ground of ageocy,
therefore, the giestiou was quite untenable With respect
to the other ground on which it was said to he maintain•
ble, and considering Strehi as a wutuess, it would not be
jast to Sacchi. It would be contrary to every principle of
law and justice to put a question affecting the credit of
soother witness before giving the other person an opportu-
nity of explaining his conduct to the Court On both
ground", he contended, that the question was inadmissible
in point of law.

The Lord Chancellor apprehended that the whole of the
evidence tending to shear the ageucy of Saechi, would be
fueled in pages 344, 372, and 448 of the evidence. His
Lordship then read the evidence from these different plates,
principally as stated before by Idr. Deren in, and then ob-
served, that as Sacchi was a witness, the first question would
be, whether is the present stage of the procrealitigs a ques-
tion could be pelt to the witness with a view to affect Sac.
chi's credit? He at present put his agency out of view fur
half a minute. According to the prileciples of law, the wit-
ness could not he examined as to declarations of a former
wituess, that former witness not having been apie.tioned to
such declaratious. In the case of Rastelli, the House
had reaulecit that evieleure could nut be received of
whet he had said without calling him. It was on tidy
around that Majoechi bad been milled back. The ease
here was sidtply Ibis—whether, because Sacchi had
been it witness, the Cusnael could nu that account ask the
present wittiest., what his declarations bad been, without
calling Bauchi, when there was an opportunity of ealliug
and examining biro as to the conversation Aced oil that
emend he thought it was enough to say, that Seeds, outlet
to he called and asked what his deckrations to the witness
were Willi respect to the (meadows of vesicy, it depended
ou what hr haul read from the emelt-ore, for their lorddiips
to say, whether employment there appearing, constituted
him solely a in. ssengerOf whether he had l.eme also em-
ployed to collect and induce witnesses In give evidence by
permiasiou' deelarations, mid similar meaus—that was for
their I...n_rdships to dries mine.

bard Erskine maid, that in his time, at an Advocate, he
Iva. quite litre that if • witness had been examined fur
a prowcutiuii, and it waa afterward. found that that wit-
ness had him-elf been bratine lip fur Inlay testimony, be, as
Voiotia. I far the defence, could have called upon that per-
sum himself to gli,c.edst his emit testimony, and other
pennon besides. to chew that he was • corrupt willies.;
and then she Counsel on the other side ...glut call on his
to eatablish hi• owe evidence.

Fart Grey bad been reluctantly compelled to dissect from
his (tubule in a recent instance. He had thought that if
they were to let in the *widener of persons entirely 11111.4111.
steeled with the irmisaciion, it night prolong the pelmet-d-
-onee tu an interminable length, and, moreover, lead to also•
gems* consequences. But thus case appeared to stand on
vett, differeut gruuuds. Here there was evidence that
Saccbi had been ill the employment of the Milan Gtwmia•
61011; and, therefore, whatever proof might be required to
establish agency is other case., hr thought there was enough
stated here so admit Ilse testimony objected lu, on the ground
of his being an agent ; but mach more should the levtimulty
be received ou the ground of Sacchi being a witness, and of
the testimony going to discredit his evidence; [Prange if a
person who hail previously stood at the bar as a witness had
endeavoured in inbuilt witnesses and purchase false evidence
iii the very same cause, who could believe that be would
stop al uttering falsehood himself ?—(fiear, hear.)
The Earl of Live. puul said, that hr could not admit the
evidence sit the want vs on the ground first taken by the
Noble Earl Grey). He thought there was no proof of that
deree of agent), which would justify the question. But
Sacehi baring been a witness, lie was of 01111111011 that be
ought to he called back and questioned as to the con versa.
do with the

Earl Grey repeated his argument for the rereplion of the
evirtrece.

Lord Erskine (we understood) agreed that Swells shoeld
be rolled hick in the first instaisr.-.

The Lad ChAacr:lor suggested that Sacelu should be
sent fur.

The Solicitor•Generat, in the mean time, wished to know
whether S.irclis was to be called back to emitrndatt aoy thing
he lold said b.&we, or to give frr•k eeideoce, which smother
Witsiess might be examined upon
The lord Chancellor Gaud it seemed to be the opinion of
the Hon.,. that Saran should be recalled.

Luca Laittlerd.k thought it ought to be definitely elated
for p hat institute Macau ought is. be recalled. Was it tu
impeach us credit out I.f lus uwa mouth ? su U might
better be pin uu tuber anima&

Th.• I.urd Chancellor legged leave to state, in order to
put an end In Ibe forst 1111 l ,in Ire first place, that he hail
thatinctl) said that Sicelia teas not a general agent ; and in
the taxi place, that his declarations could not be inquired
into till M. sere called himself.

Lord Erskine ohnerved, that the House would not he
bound by the Sr. y of the witnes►. Thry ought to
begin by r•tlin this 111411 to prove the act of curl option in
Yoterbi, and tutu the usher bide might call Saechi to tout'w
dirt hon.

Lord Reties&le !Inmate. that in point of form the Nubk
and Learned Lewd ou the Wunieark omelet ID inform the
Ceenusel at the her on what grounds the es itlerce of Satehi
was to he received

Lord Grenville thought it would be !proper to call on the
CCutivel on the one side in lisle their IC4IIOI/1 why she qua-
tiuu nut be rut, awl un the other to sbew why it
should.

The Gomm' bsiug called In the Iwo..
The Lord Choice Nor informed them that the nem* eon.
sidereal theqweetiou of the tolmisaibilloty or Madmasibillty of
the evidence sufficieatly argued on the ground of impaled
sasere—asad that it was desiroos of hearing thews arise its
inarliMasibitity ee admissibility ua any other grounds they
hail to urge.
taiTolimilmAtlltrroe".Gelbe'qwestionswiass"aw,hothllllytte:laisnis7MPlare"lin to
p. amonstentsi
Is., is whatever way It was to be considered. Was Ilse evi-
dence of corrupt agency offered is toiler 111 •lf..ct the cbs.
meter of Samba as a witness How could they (the Collll4el
011 the other side) have a right to go into evidence of cor-
ruption Rail delitiquency, when is °Military practice they
could nut give ',ideate of convicted crime. against a wit-
ness, except they had a record from Ihe Court winch load
fouisil hiss guilty? Aosd this was on the modern practice
only—in the ancient ISO 11110( could be gives' of olimaccs
alien to the doer which hail been dismantled by a amines. in
order to affect hie credit. 100 the modern practice a wane.,
might be asked if he IeUMIIIIIII.II marl or such arts—he might
refits, to answer if he pleased—if he did sneerer, his answer
moat be received, mod stn evidence druid be aft.-rwarda ad-
mitted to discredit that answer. The reason (or this rode
was obvisiess. A witness. (mold not come prepared to meet
a charge against hie charamer if it were wholly unfottooled.
The law requ,red Host every witness should have sootier ht
some way ur other of all that was to Ire dune to affect his
coedit, it sofficomit lane to enable him to marl Ike charges
which were to he Mooed against bins
Mr. Park ro ferret their leoroblaps to page 290 in Phillips's
Priscipies of Evidence, for the rule which bad been so well
stalest by his Learned Friend also preceded him. lie found
a similar exposition no /entice Belle.. book uu (Seri Prins.
Mr. Brougham agreed wills the general propositions wh ch
had hero held mot by his Learned Friends. He agreed that,
graerelly spealciag, it was ant competent in a COUlleel to
discredit a witness by tendering proof of particular acts, as
to which he had previously omitted to examine hies on
crussexanoinat ion, when called a. a witness in chief. That
was a general proposition, bottomed in sure principles and
expediency. He ...odd also agree, that evidence coatd not
be given to impeach the credit of a willies., of acts dime by
hint out or the particular case in which he was called, ex-
cept as to general character, when it might be asked, "
hou know A. B.; is he a man whom you would believe upon
is oath?" l'lsese proposition,. weer foutoolo-st nn one ass-i
(lbe same pi inciple, and nor vo satisfactorily eatablished,
that it wvel/d be in v3lll h 4.1 they the wish, and they
hid it not) to attempt to misrule them. But the case
they presented was simply this—ihey offered proofs of
she alive coached of • witness in this particular came,
Isaeisig been domed to going :Mout suburodug evi-
dence. He knew that they remold out give evidence of a
tribune called its 10111 cause having $lll/411.11e1l eVioltilee ill any
other cause, without they load the record of his emivicii 111 l
to produce. Ile could agree to that proposition without con-
trolling Phillips's book stn Eridemee. But it was otherwise
with the case in hand, which was caked out of the general
rule. Ile admitted also that he could soot have called Mel-
verlore to tiegatire any thing which Sacehi did nut reculket.
Rut on the highest grounds of justice, he churned the tight
, I of vaulter the question; for of he should prove clearly
that Sadie had gone about suborning witnesses, who, would
! believe his testimony
Mr. Denman, in impport of Mr. Broughams's argument,
put the case aim issue in ronrse sit trial v Soappoee Oil ex-
staining a witness on a collateral inquiry, it should be ells.
towered that on the slay of trial the lawyer 1111 the op.
polite side, who wasn't ex mined witness in the cause, hail
offered a large bribe ld give false testimony, if the Counsel
I were ready lo prove the ect against him (the lawyer), wee it
possible to doubt that they would be at liberty to lint a wit.
mas tutu the box, and immediately examine him as to the fact,
not only with a view to discredit the attorney as a witness, bet
I for the purpose of disgracing the came of his principal? It
I would Iry the last degree of atiturility Its impeose that they
I would be condemned to wait 'odd they had not put the
attorney into the box, soil laid the foundation for con.
! tradicting him It would be quite privilege enough for
' the attorney to be able to come back, and deny by his
re-examination, of possible, all that hail betel proved against
him This was • ease precisely similar to that before their
Lordships. lu the Emmet. part .of these proceedings they had
been put to a difficult choice as teethe timeand !node of
duos examining the wituriown for the prosecution. One of
the peruhirdira of their Case was, that having been denied
! • list of aiinesse. they had no opportunity or obtaining
the knowledge is y tOr the doss-moimination until the
examinations were completed—except they hail chosen the
alternative then offered, of Delaying the proceedings, which
• they considered to he for more doucerou• to the interests of
. their Illustrious Client He thought that by the evidence
of Marches jusiency to fetch Demont, mod his excursion,
dinsigh was 'hewn to allow them to prove his corrupt prac-
tices as an agent elsewhele, of which they had abuudaut
testimony in the neighbourhood of Milan.
Mr Park inferred from his Learned Friends having re.
eurred so frequently to. the question of agency, which had
already been €llllpg.e.l of he their Liordships--(" No, no !"
fees all efaaeleee of Me Hoare)—o,, far as the Coisissel on
both sides were concerned, he apprehended the question of
agency was dome with, the redolence to it proved the little
reliance which they load ion the other ground, 'timely, that
of affecting the credit of a withe.a. Mr. Brougham had
admitted the general proposition this a witness must have
due notice of a charge which wis emended to affect his
credit. Ile was al a loss to see what notice Mace's' had re-
, (elect' on the charge 110 W offered to lost brouebt. In as long
crosso xamination no circionstaieces had trampired too lead
hint to suppiele that the charge of corrupt agency would he
brought. It wa. argued that if the proof went to corrupt
conduct in Ilse cease, the evidence must be admitted. That
point hail heels decided by Lord Ellesiborough„ in a case of
weary, wherein be load refused to elbow proof of any other
contracts uoade by the party, except that a hich was the cause
of the trial—aior would his Lordship allow evidence to be
given of au attempt whirls had been made to dissuade a wit-
ness from appearing at the trial.
Mr. Brougham 11 gist that the case of Harris and Tip.
per, which had been quoted, was entirely in his favour.
The Lord Chancellor said, that he had been so long ablest
from the practice of Nisi Pries that he felt great difficulty
in determining on any qiiestion of that nature. His Lord-
ship's opinion inclined to the prevention of the question in
the present stage, no sufficient evidence of Sacchee agency
having appeareJ, and hr not having been examined. upon
the charge now brought iu hie croswo simian:thou, it was
scarcely possible to allow 'violence to he gives of hie corrupt
practices, for the purpose of affecting his credo iii question.
In this opution be was mistse.b,airengthened by that which
lord Ellesibususogh bad
!;tronouncell on the case just quoted.
However, his Lordsloto observed, that wellons simile ea
ideate, according tuer/well.kusrn maxim of law, for which
reason he wished, with their Lordships' permission, to pso.
pose a quesiloo for the Judge*, in order to ascertain the
general roles and peachee in the Courts below. The question
which Ise would propose was. " Whether, according to the
general principles of evidence to be rrceived in Ike Courts
below, when a witness called for the prosecution had brew
examined in chief, end had not beets muss-examined as to
certain acts dome, or declaretioue mole by him, hs order to
pocure other witnesses for the prosecution, would it be cons.
portent in the Counsel for the defence to prove such declare.
limos nod acts without first calling back the wituess to res.
mine him a. to 'loose acts and declarations ?"
The Earl of Liverpool thought that the position was not
very necessary. The Coun I did 1
.e. llO. disagree as 19 one
ground, that of affeclieg fiacchi'e credit. Perhape the
shortest way would he to call hack Moretti, and My Ilse rosin-
ditiou fur b. bootie forward the evidence offered by ex.'
nettling him first. It was nut a question of excluding evi-
dence, but telly as to the master on which the evidence was
to be received. The shortest way would be to recal Macke
The Marquis of Lenaihowin had no objection to the comae
proposed by the Noble Pearl, if the COUUSCI for she Bill ape
proved of it. But be objected to the principle upon which
she Noble Esti proposed to admit the evidence, monody, in
contradiction of Sacchi's recollection or declaration ; whereas
the proof that was offered ass of corrupt acts done Soy
Menlo, which had minting to Du with boo memory ur ad-
missions.

The Lord Chancellor ;squired if the Counsel had any
objection to n•cst &arch, ?
Mr. Bruath•~m thst the last timc tlrcy wished to
recil a W 1411,113 be was ROI to be found.

• The fmrJ Chancellor—lf he is to be Wend, here roe soy
obleetion lo rains, him?
Mr. growellain *mil, Nose in the least, if we ems eaansine
kit% sew.
The Lora Clotot•ellor said, every ogle who knew wind evi-
dence was .ant two. the girt...4,11y of r‘mssoioc a witness
at the time un which hr was r illrol, rather than at any other
Inge.

t.urj &Aine made sum- oh•ervations ou the terms of the
opte.tion, which he so.oset.e..l either to alter, or submit •
separate twat. at Ihe
Lard Re.leollto 'poke.
The Lord Chant-rib,' pot the rerestinn to the Howie, " Is
it your Lordships' ;demo, Ih.t ope4tion elionttl he pot
to the Willies,. on the erollll.ll of them totirretent prow'
of Sarchi ha•tor hen, netti ..f the Milan Coannitmom
before the que•tion wrest to the

The Earl 01 I. tr•lrrel4lr tur.le game remark,.

The Lord Chancellor punted riot the difficulty which
',frock hint, of taking the sense of the Moose on the polltog
of this question, upon one ground, for which some of the
Peers were ready to vote, when there was milither, ion which
perhaps some of the Veers who WOllll.l object to the tiro!
grained, would wish the siosesti.os il. ht: WO. II Wl* on thAt
aerwilit he hail poeferred 11x plait of Irking nn sip. from
the Jot/lova, le v Ingot to their I Air,l4lii pa afterwards to decide
of tine woonld allow She orie•tiool to he pot.
Kul Grey, after valet...ow,: the 'Stitt to which, on the
present sits..dims, he viewed oh« character of agency, namely,
Of I. proved so have heels time in a part trills, came,
!toroth the author's isnot were out diitinctiy proved, aereed
to the opreition twos( pot In sloe Mouse.
The Lord Chinceilor actin asked, if it was their I
ships' pledsoooe that the polo ion idniold he put to the willies,'
Holhool 'lid not approve of putting such a ques-
t too. One pi f their 1. r I.hips were iesdy to allow
the qamition, on the around of alrectitai the credit of the
wittiest;; another portion would allow it is.. Owe ground of
proved agency. If it wrist to the vote on either of these
erounds separately, the Iloilo. might be led to reject a
gamine, which the tnajoroiy, (ruin thlTereut motives,
wished to have put.
After a few remarks from the Lord Chancellor and Eul
Gres:,
Lust Erskine then reqetesteil that the following question
should be put to the Judges:—
. IVhetker,ifon any trial, in any ram in the Courts below,
a witness is called sin the part of she plaintiff or prosecutor,
nod gives evoleitre mg dust the AeGndant in smelt case; and
of after the cross-examination of such wdoes., if you discover
that the witness so examined bas eorropted or endeavoured
to corrupt other •ittiemes, the Cututvel for such defendant
oily not be permitted to give evidence of such eiwropi
Lord Carnsrvon moved. as as ameednient, " That the
goes/ion he mow put,— and observed that it was .55.1.5. to
be referring questions to the Judgesouid after ilk y hid iwen
their opinion, *part front it.

The Lord Chgistellor then put the two cistestionsi and the
amendment of the Earl of CArsinevon woe negatived.
Lola I.:•.kines 'potation won 'lon pot to the Learned
Judge's, wiso.atier considering fora Assort tone, re,psentesi
premiss lO be allowed to commier of the isse-t t until
to.moces.w morning, %I'll II Man .sgresql

It •wii Italf-pa%ithrec o'Lloct: the !lonic adjourned to
to-morrow.

MEETING TO AIWRI:SS THE QUIPItN.

Yesterday it very timainerous meatiug of the lobs.
totem* of the Parish of Sr. George, II snorer.
square, asiersubled sit the Great Rootu, 'tissue,' of
Venison-yard, Lower Brook-street, to consider of
an Address to her Majesty.
At one o'clock the room was crowded to excess.
A great number of Ladies were present, fur Wiluill
accommodations had been provided near the Chair.
Jnitte CAM 1105140n:46, E•q. being unarmemou•ly
called to the Chair, addressed the meeting. Fle said,
that he was uumt happy at all tines to inert any
portion of hie constituents, anti was particularly
gratified to see hiontiell: at the present alumna scr.
noseband by such a numerous and resort-table as.
wmbly. lie was sorry to leans that thaws whose
duty it Wet, it his humble opinion, to attend to
the wishes of their fellow-parishioners (alluding to
the Coon:kw:nib:us having refused to call the meet-
ing) had not thought proper to afford to them Nil
opportunity of expres.ing their sentiment,. They
had assembled to express their opiuitms, not biassed
by the consider mtion of the rank of the party,
but by the desire that justice should be dose so
every individual, let their rank he what it would.
The question had, within thew ten days, ste-
mmed a very different aspect to that which it had
hitherto borne, as it had been said in time House of
COlikillol4 it was not now a trial of the Qtieemi, but
of his Majesty's Nlinteters; nut of her Majesty,
but of her Majesty's perseteutors.—( Loud cheering.)
Front the itmoceedings is the !louse of Lords it
would appear that tome or the charges had left the
slightest slur on the character of her Nlajes.y, but
they had blotted with Untenable trains the characters
of those who had pursued her ; hot for a month or
a year, but for a quarter of a century ; so grossly
treating her, who„whether as a woman, as a stranger,
or as a Quern of these realms, was entitled to their
respect till she had forfeited it by some act of her
own. He would not endeavour to Inflame their
minds by considering the injustice and persecution
winch her Majesty had Puttered, for that sympathy
lie might securely rely tit the sentiments spouts.
neously springing up iu their own boson's. Ile
thought it a question that required 'wither argument
nor der-I:maim, st wits merely whether this Illus-
trious Lady, who had been Ilse contirmued subject
of insult, shonlil be crushed by the hand of
power, or upheld by the sympathy of a generous
people. He would like to put it to sortie of she
Noble Lords or Gentlemen, the perescutors of this
Illustrious Lady, how they would feel if a sister of
theirs (for that was the way in which the case
should be put, in order to he felt) were to be sub.
jected to such treatment ? He would ask. sole.
thee they would endure such persecution against a
female relation of their own, out rise up in yen-
geauce against her persecusors ? Suppose it were
the sister of my Lord Castlereagh. the sympathy of
the people would be the same as for the Queen—if
she were to be accused by u Commission, who if
they found no charge were authonsed to make
one, fur that ails the astute of the Milan Cons.
mission: they were seat out with an empty Nag,
and ordered to to return without a full one—
(Loud laughter and upplasrael—it signified no-
thing whether the charges were true or false,just or
'millet, so that "hen the bag was b•ought over
here it appeared to be fall. lie would like to
lie informed hum it happened slut the Milsii
Commissioners, during all the lime they were
occupied with their inquiries, had not acquired the
same tnrana to 'hew the falsity of the charges
aganist the Queen, which her Majesty's Colossal
had got in the short space of four weeks. Surely
smiler they had got the depositions of the Demonta,
the Ssechis, and Majocchip, it was their duty, its-
stead of' giving implicit credence to their testimony,
to have asked of oilier persons if the charges were
true or false, or likely to he true. Why had they
' not applied to Dr. Holland, the confidential physis

AIM.

•