The National Register.
London, England, 1816-03-11 00:00:00

AkMY EsTIMATES.

The Order of the Day for the House going into a Committee
of Supply having been read- -oa the motion for the Speaker'.
leaving the Chair,
Mr. W. Wltise said, he believed that this was the period at
which he must bring forward his motion, namely, "That it be
au instruetion to the Committee to provide for the payntent of
the British army now serving in France." lie moved this on
two grounds; first, the extreme impropiwty ofhaving an army
serving within three days march of thi.: metropolis, wholls in.
dependent of Parliament for pay. And, secondly, (lint ieally
neglect should arise on the part of Frowne for pay me Ilie
Ministers could not, without a breach of the Constitution,
Issue any nullity for that purpose.
The motion of Mr. It vs X E was agreed tie.
Mr. PROTHEROF then rose, not to object to the Rouse going
into a C. • tee, but to take the earliest opportunity of dis-
senting Iron, the opinion which had been given by gentlemen
en the other side, that the country was as well abbe nun, as at
any former period, to support the expense of Ike proposed
large establishment. lie also objected to the extensive mill.
tart' establishments proposed in these estimates ou another
. . .

. .
ground ; ate stated by the Noble Lord (Castlereagh) on a
former night ; *keit the Noble Lost, said, it Wil% 111,4 a i,di to
see the military spirit subside. He (Mr Protheroc) also
wished to Fee that spirit subside, te: it OA, only by the eivii
poker gaining the presronderattee over the military, that the
peace •t* Europe could be permanently secured. But woul.l
it be contended, that keeping up so large a military establish-
ment as that proposed would have that effect? lie was eom
strained to admit, that the strong pietiote (Lawn by the Rigbt
lion. Gentleman of the state of Ireland reedeted a large fin fe
nece.sary ; but the Sallie necessity koitid not apply to the
other parts of the estimates. A Noble !Mid (Palmerston) had
said, on a former night, that a reduction of 20,000 men would
only save 00.0001. a year, which was a trifle. Tiiding a.
that sum might appear to Use Noble Lord, he (Mr. P.)
a 11510418 to Cit ; and strongly CC(0111111Clitied it to the Noble
Lind to adopt that saving, and C% cry other, how( ver minute,
which he could adopt.
The House then resolved itself into a Committee.

Lord I'm. II EIVITO r said, Opoqt4 the dgi,It4ICA he iihould
not feel g neeeinai y to gs Into detail, but to sta..e the diffident
heads, and reserve 111111 Set to en..wer the uti.emitions Of Gte-
tlemu•n as thy aupe.--(11ogr, hear.)--lie must again premise,
that the Estimati.s as nou proposed new not a Peace 1-:btablisio-
smut, but out aur the present year, suinelbiog be t*cen a War

MARCH 11.

and Peace Establishineto ; one in which causiderable alters-
Culls-might be made, even Marisa! the present year. If Geode-
alga would look at the Emilie:les now before the /louse, and
compare them with those of last year, they would find that a
very, material reduction had Myelitis taken place, and that
much more was contemplated. Imitating the 30,000 Merl in
Franck, wauld not wain to 1w provided for, there was a
redoetitas in out mili!ary establi,l lit of 87,000 awn ;he con-
sith-red the 36,000 men in France us a transfer, and therenwe
woeld lake the real diminution ot force at 57,000, and the saving
of expence at 41110,0001. The Noble Lord then entered into a
detail of the principal item, on which a d' had taken
place--the household troops were rethiced 1,600, at a saving
of expence of 33.0001. ; the env airy were redneck! 9,000, and a
saving made of 314,0,J0h; infantry had been diwharged to the
amount of 21,000, and a saving made upon that head Or (Ape/I-
diot' e ot' at km 11,10,6001. In the miscellaneous department
dime aa= a •aslag, iii filet, tlds year of 394,0901. thoagli there
would appeer to he a saving of not more than 194,0001. a s
of 100,0001 having bees taken from that 'Mid last vial. This
saving principally anise ou the article, of additional pay, beer
innkeepers' allowance, and contingencies. In fra
die Estimates. the region-ills had all Men taken as they stood at
the begiuning of they ear ; and the whole force would be Maud
to amount to 0;.090 or' ot,ooo men. Under the head of Militia
Expenditure there would 1w found a diminution of expence of
1,186,0001. In the establishment tifG4 mural Officers there was
a saving of 8,7a01. In the Staff and Garrisons 173,0001. The
reduction of Officers on the Staff at home was two Lieutenant
Generals, two Major Generals, three Aides-de-Camp ot the
Prince Regent's, and two of the Commander in Chief. 'llw
saving in the fireign corps would be 110,0001. The foreign
Stall had been reduced one General, five Lieutenant Generals,
fifty Major General, ; and a further redaction of two Major
General*, two Aides-dc-Camp, and an Adjutant General; and
in Jersey and Guernsey two Lieutenant Generals would be
struck off. In Ireland there would be a reduction 111. two Lieu-
tenant General* and four Major Generals. The C ander'
of the Forces at Ceylon, the Cape, the Mauritius, and Gibraltar,
would be removed, and Lieutenant Generals put in their places.
This measure would produce a saving of at least 13,0001. In
the Supernanierary Office there was an iuervase this year of
19,0001. chiefly arising on pensions for retiring Officers. In
Use public departments of the Commander in Chief, the War
Office, and the Advocate General's Office, there was a saving
of 16,0001. (Ibur, hear.)—Ccutlemeti should recollect, that
the labour of reducim.• the army was greater than that of con-
ducting it in its perfect stale ; and that reduction could not
take place all at once.—The Military ,tltowaner s had increased
lao,ouol. The Chelsea and Greenwich pensions had increased
3,8001. The out pensions on these' establishments 162,0901.
The widows' pensions had Mr/eased also 6,4001 In the Vo-
lunteer Corps there was a diminution this year of 43,0001. In
the Local ilit ia there was also ad• •
would this year be I/0 010114 e for training, sad the regiments
were reduced one half. The whole reduction on the Foreign
Carps wound be 455,0001. On the Military College 3771. la
the Military Asylum there was au increase of 11,0001. in the
incidental expences there was a diminution of 53,0001. On
the Cempassioaate Fund, sit increase of about 7,0001- In the
Commissariat of 1 reland:ffiere was this year a saving of 100,0001.
' and in the barracks 3.1,0001. The Noble Lard tit n w cut through
the other heads of expenditure, mid observed, that compar-
ing the expenditure fur the present year with that of :tilt
there would be found a saving of 8,1;04,0001. and as compared
with last year six millions ; and lie further anticipated a saving
of at least one mill' , in the present year, besides w Midi
V,000,0001. included in the present estimates were permauent
charges not attached to the anus. The expellee of maintaining
the 50,000 men in France would be 600,11001. and if that
at my were reduced, the amount of half-pay and pensions to
the officers and men would be 266,0001., lie would not then
teinale the H 0404, with more calculations, rcromutending the
discussion of each Resolution separately. lie (lieu moved a
Resolution, that 176,613 men be maintained for the seri ice of
Great Britain and Ire and, including the armies in France and
the colonies, but exclusive of the troops kept up by the East
India Company.

BANkkg contended, that it was the proper function of
the Home to curtail these Estimates if they thought tit, and nut
to address the Throne fiw their I etiliClloll. rOr the present
year he thought there ought to be no reduction in the force in
Ireland : but he hoped a bt tter system sword be adopted for
the .fteuellt of that unhappy country. No FUril case of necessity
h id been made out for the amount attic other pat is of our force
as had been skean tier Ireland. If there had, be would not have
hesitated to have voted fur it, int the declared necessity of the
case. He considered the I; ti Treaty of Peace as tieing more
iikely to heenre to us permanent tranquillity than any Treaty
he could refer to; and taking that, together with the reputa-
tion and quality of our at my into eonsitiention, there could be
shewa no neer•iity toe maintaining so large a Military Esta-
blishment.

Lord CAuTLERVAGa said, that having been prevented by
indisposition from delivering his opinion on 'hie great question,
he was anxious now to take the earliest opportunity of express-
Mg' his sent:mews on it. He was prepared to admit that they
could do milling in the way of saving, which they did not owe
to their constituents, without compromisine their real interest,
by breaking down a •sli in of At euri t whit-i would iitt.lliV
its in enormous t' pence to ri .establisli —I iv it usted th. Com-
mitter would not suffer Alinisters in t clamoured down by
cry that they were adverse lo ceo..ouie. There was no set of
men whose interest and ditty it more was to adopt or to recom-
mend remit-alas than his Majesty's Minister,.—Hut lie wished to
dispel that damsel of pr judo v I amid against them. Last year
the Home voted the gic.acsi saga ever put nailer the cool roul
tit any Government; for tlic whole amount, including the
was 120 'millions. We were then engaged lila most tremendous
conflict, which bad been orotight to a favourable conehision ;
and with ever) attiaition to reotmey, for thecoutest wits finish-
ed, leaving a *mat of 43 mil!imis ut-exi.ended. The present
was not a perfect return to aA- ire Estaulishment , hut he
hoped that return would be strt.ucr Afii cted than after any
f oilier war; for Ad,,, the Actero ur war we had an riudiini-
iiis'aed i• •everal years. The redaction of the
army of the ans Imo, very considerable; and ear expcn-
more woad be i educed from be millions to ...tr. He felt con-
s incvd, alter Govern rout were uncut to [Mow eight millions
of Property LAX:Okla WO the laps of the hulutc, that they t the
"bile w 1..4 fee! much revs t tha! it should he cutitioned
for a year or two, ill to pivs4:t Ve. the eltarat.ter rti the tri-
tiou. Ile trusted that the British manly si•iitt which Itml sop-
ported them thion.,bout n mug and rattan iis war, W 4.11.41 now
11044)141 system of esiablirletnent for their county Melt would
preserve t 141 Country r ntirr._ _ _

Mr. CALC R AFT 1111;01.0brti a n::djourament.- (Oita $1 Ques-
t/01i, qt. stiot ! G.l 'a, Go on ! Attcr :un,e eatit,eisi,tito.: it
v.ab Agreed that the Committee. weld bit again on Weduao-
dikk

Adjourned at past two in the morning.

lIMMI'

MARCH 11.