The Express.
London, England, 1861-05-24 00:00:00

SUPPLY.

The house then went into committee of supply.
On the motion of Mr. F. Pest, a sum of 7,225,5001.
was voted to pay off and discharge outatandiog Exchequer
Bills.

On vote 10 of 3,489,4771. being reed, for expenses of naval
MOM. timber, steam machinery, &c.,
Yr. LINDSAY moved the reduction of the first item of
devote, via, that of 919,3711. for timber, by the corn
of 300,0004. He said that he could not understand the
amenity of this largely increased vote for Umber, when we
already bad the largest Beet of wooden line,of.battle ships
in the world. It might possibly be said that this stock of
timber had been contracted for already, and that it was
necessary to provide a large supply of seraotted timber
beforehand. He trusted, however, that this answer would
not be given ; as if it were it would show that one of the
most important privileges of the house, that of controlling
the public expeoditure, was being taken from it. Even if
the sum they were called upon to vote were reduced by
300,0001., it would still be greater than any sum that hail
been voted for timber nines the year 1859.
Mr. BAXTER said this was one of the moat objectionable
items in the estimate. He had himself intended to move
the reduction of this vote by 283,0001., the amount of in.
arose over the *etiolate of last year, but it would probably
be wore convenient that the division should take place on
the lictsourable member's motioe.
.

;;;;;;hicb waned,
Lord C. PAGET pintail out th►t it was necessary to
bare a supply of semmied timber is the dockyards ; and it
waii also neomeary to make the eoutracts beforehand, as it
took a eoeMearabie time to get a supply. It was only two
yean' consumption which was asked.
In this raw he was etreasly enpportod by Sir J. FAZING-
TOO.

Lord PALIIRRINTON etptsmsd his regret that two gee-
ileums of experience, mad w persona prosperity, as well
es that of the country, depended oss the complete-
mem of our navy, should mote ea attempt to strike
at the very existence of the navy. It was • mistake to
suppose that timber was sot required is the coustructiori of
what were called ins skips. The vole would only supply
nO,OOO loads of timber, while Frame had no km than
1110,000 is her dockyanla
Mr. BRIGHT said that the noble lord's speech would be
as applicable to a vote of six times the amount as to the
one in question ; for he had sot entered into any details to
French
the demand. As to the stocks of timber in the
French dockyards, they were as nearly phantoms me the
alleged Beet. of Franco. if this country bad now more
ships of every clam than ell the (beta of every nation in
tke world together, could there be any necessity for
erietiauing the vast expenditure for the navy which had
been going on fur the last two years? According to the
Miorekeeper•Genend, only half the usual quantity of timber
would be required this year. He contended that the house
bad no control over the expenditure of the Admiralty--a
department which was manarjed by men who oould not
know anything of the tramactioa of the business attached
to it. and Nixed that the vast expenditure of the country
must be reduced.

Mr. HENLEY peered the necessity of keeping up sra
adequate supply of aseeened timber, ready for any emer-
gence. He should support this vote, the object of which
was to Orris seek a supply.
Lord C. PAGET. in reference to the relative naval force
of England sod France, stated that since be brought in the
estimates nine iroscred frigates had been laid down in
France, in riddle, to those which be then stated as being
' finished or in progress.
After a further debate a divisiou was takes, and the
amendment was lost by IM to 30.
Mr. LINDSAY moved that the chairman report progress,
is order that an opportunity might be afforded for having
the contracts which had been enterol into for timber am!
other item, in the vote laid before the house.
The amendment was eventually negatived.
Mr. LINDSAY moved that the sum of 291,757!. for
metals, he., be reduced by 71,7571.
On a divisios the amendment was lost by 76 to 32.
Mr. LINDSA Y moved that the sum of 100,000/. for iron
for an hoe-eased ship to be built at Chatham be omitted,
hls iatention being sot to prevent the building of iron
skips, but he objected to one of these vessels being built in
that particular dockyard, while the plan of building in the
dockyards generally would involve an enormous unneces-
sary expenditure.
Mr. ROEBUCK-1 hope the house will consider whether
it is wise to build these iron ships at all. (Hear, hear.) A
constituent of mime recently called upon me and told me
that he hail offered the Secretary of the Admiralty to build
• gun at his own expense which would throw 1,000 lbs. of
shot ; and remarked, " What do you think he rid to me r
I replied, "God forbid !should attempt to fathom the wisdom
of • Lard of the Admiralty." He then said the mower he
got . was, "It is not in my deputmeet." My
constituent made the same offer to the War.ofitos ; and be
rid," Do you know what answer I pot?" I replied "If I
were unable to divine the wisdom of a Find Lord of the
Admiralty, do not fancy lam bold enough to attempt to
fathom the wisdom of a Secretary of State." (Inughter.)
He then said the answer he got was, that if he submitted
his plan they would consider whether it was worthy of being
accepted. (Hear, hear.) I asked what would be the effect
of his gun, and he said it would go through the sides of the
Warrior as easily as through blotting.paper. (Laughter.)
If that retiree's% were true, there would be MUG wisdom
in building vessels like the Warrior.
Lord C. PAGET said he believed the smithery at Chat.
henries as good re say in her Majesty's dockyards.
Mr. DALGLISH—The new ore?

dined Q. PAQCI cOUlllOnlypeat that he believed
it ems as as any in bet Majenty's dockyards.
With regard to the hon. member for Birmingham he bad
ant proved hie assertion, that those vessels constructed by
the covernriseet would cost double the expense of these
built by private Arms. Referring to the Olalen iAtioos of the
boo. member for Sheffield, the question was, act what was
the peoetratiag power of shot. but bow could a shell
known Rs Martin's liquid iron shell be heat resisted. Those
shells were entirely destructive of wooden ships, but were
not ilsogemos to iron vessels.
The committee then divided.
For the ameedment
416-35
lid.tiraLNlEll'Af mid be would make assppeal to the
noble Iced at the head of the government He bad given
notice that be should move venous other reductions ; but
lrs did sot went to take any step which might appear tui-
tion', er to take up the time of the house. The
prie.salm • doea af his amendment. had been already die.
and therefore be did not propose that it should be
discussed over spin. He was reedy to yield these oohs*
provided the noble lord would °unseat to postpone the vote
of 140,0001. for his troop ships and 50,0001. for machinery
for {hoes ships eetil the report of a committee of which be
wee ebairown,which would be made M a fortnight, had woo
tad as the table.
Lewd PALMERSTON said at that hour of the night be
could 110 i resist the postponement of the vote till to•
morrow, bat be could cot consent to the postponement till