The Express.
London, England, 1850-02-09 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.
HOUSE OF LORDS.-FILIDAT, FEB. 8.
The Loan Csaricau.os took his seat at b o'clock.
REGIS:EAR'S-OFFICE BANKRUPTCY BILL.
On the ssi,tios of tko WILD Crt•wcau.oz, this bill was
rod a third Www, and passed.
THE DOLLY'S-BRAE PROCESSION.
Lard STANLEY gave notice that on Monday seonight,
W Mb but , M would call dial: lordship.' attstatioa to Jac
tufoltuwq Cifellllo.llllCll col:lowed with the affray at
Doll, 'o-Bras, in colaeownie• of which his right hon. hided
wear him had Won discuss. d from the corawiraioa of the

peace.
Tie HUI of RODEN said that, es he understood the
object of has noble friend woad lee to go into an investiga•
den of the event which took place last summer, in which he
was materially concerned, he begged to say that he should
be fei gip. ca that occasion, and be prepared to answer
any q‘ hseireuesstanees would be referred to, which
amid be kewn only to his noble friend thia L9rd Lieutenant
and himself,o he hoped the noble earl would be able to sue

pretest.
runcHAszas OF GRAIN IN SCOTLAND.
Lent BEJDOHAM laid on the table a bill to protect the
;of grubs in Saddam! from the claims if the land-
Cr:rrtli respect to rent du?.
Tae bill was read a Int time.
BANERUFTCT AMENDMENT BILL.
Lied in aloe' ag tbe arcend reading of
this bill, ui3 be now had
the third time laid toi, bill on weir
lordMige %Ale. It had hem mate icily improve', and he
hood when it passed through their lordships' committee it
would be eirm.iderel with statics, sad with tavoar else
where. must alma uy toot he it ped no naneeeseary
alttm:tions wad be mad. Li it, brews, the most fetal re-
sults had arisen from inch a cows, on a former occasion.
ECCLESIASTICAL COMMISSION.
The nAle lord mid he had given notice of a question
which he intended to rot to Um noble marquis (Lansdowne)
if be bad been present with reference to tte imertion of a
Calllit in tete 3& 4 T.et., e. 113, conferinet aliCe of
ureaeaur and secretary for life oat an isdividual, but he fatted
as inquiry that it was not done surreptitiously, but openly,
and la the light of day, aid that As other bonne ef portio-
ning had b.tur notice of 12 than tbi:r lordsli4e. He shan't
not, theref.m, Lase though: it ntcesary to put the viatica
if hie noble friend bad bora present.
POOR LAWS.
The Eul of ELLIINBOROUI add certain important
questioaa bad been addressed to all the elsaimica and vice-
ember= of boards of guardians la Bogl old, with a viaw to
elicit is detail the real coadition of the prom dames. He
wished to erqui.-e whether answtts had bees received to
thee gsestimal/2 and Um, wh..thcr they would be laid on the
Sabi*?
The Earl of CARLISLE would enquire, and Lamm the
'ibis earl.
Their lordships aljoursed at telf.prot 6 o'clock.

HOUSE OF 0011/10N8.—FaiDet, Fn. 8.
the fler.mons took the auk at four o'clock.
PETITION PRESENTED.
COthataL Osuavaacce.—By Sr' W. MOLESWORTH,
free New Zeabad, complaining of the injustice of the Co-
ia cot givirg fru had:titian to that e^:cir.y ;
from Orshara's Towc, to the c of the Cape of Gooi
Hope, outoplainitur of the gars inolatiou of a pledge kite°
Zeta, cor.,rnor o! that ellony ; esti trout New South Wl!es,
by 6,000 penoas, complaicing of the prop gal f3r the
revival of tramp inatiou u the broach of a solemn pledge
even by her Majesty's Ministers, vul stating that the rope.
titlon of such redact was calculated to weaken the bond of
anion betweea the colonies and the mother country.

REPRESENTATION OF LONDON.
lit. IXSRINOTON withdrew lie notion ea this inAect
as he hid bees informed there was s petition before the
house against the return of Bum Rothschild.

MR. HORSMAN'S CHARGES AGAINST THE
GOVERN MEN T.
HORSMAN said that eousiterin; what had pissed
on the privious evening, he heel felt it to be his duty to
glee notice of bit lineation on Monday mot to more for
the appointment of a elect if* of (Ire, to inquire into
the truth of the charges against the government, contained
in a letter addressed by !timid' to the electors of Cocker-
mouth. Shortly afterwards the hon. gentleman again row,
and asked the noble lord fLoril J. Russell) whether he
would have any objection to the eommittee being appointed
in the course of the evening, so he was afraid that he would
not be able to attend is his pliee on Monday.
Lord J. RUSSELL replied that be should have no ob-
jection.

COLONIAL POLICY.
On the mottos of Lord J. Rvarm., the house revived
itself into a committee of tte whole home to take into con-
sideration the sallied of the Australian agonies, and to a-
rida a statement of the c...lc.isi policy of the government.
The house having gone into committee,
Lord J. RUSSELL the'o proceeded with his statement se
follows Sir, I believe there are very few members of this
home who will not c insider i: desirable, at this early period
of the session, that some statement should be made on the
part of the goverrmsnt of the general policy which
they man to pursue with regard to our eolenial
pomades'. So many etatemmts have been made oa this
eabiat, tech a variety of views and opinions have been
senneisted, and so many lota have been put in qutstina,
that it seems desirable that the government should declut
what are the views which they tike of the great interests
which are for the time committed to their charge, and what
they consider should be the ptunseent character of the policy
to be pained by this country with regard to its colonial
poesosions. I think it is desirable that the house
should consider what our colonial empire is, in order
that whatever coarse their public spirit may lead them to
adopt, or whatever their wisdom may mined them to pre-
serve or to disturb—a judgment whiehll should deem • most
unhappy one,—tbey dated know what it is they
propose to put away, and what it is they propose
to abandon. In endeavouring to do this, I shall ant state
generally how our present colonies were acquired; and as
the faits in detail must be familiar to most members, I shall
wive but the merest outline. Putting altogether aside the
foandation Oche Atorriaso provinces, which afterwards sew
voted from us, I should state that our first modernist in the
West Indies dated from the end of the reign of James I. and
the beginning of Charles IL • in feat, it took plies about the
sommenasiest of the civil war. Islands which had bass
discovered by the Spaniards, bat afterwards
were visited by Britiih navigators, and wt.=
O produce the richest fruits of the ear* but
to be almost deprived of all popeladea, sob bed
been exterminated by the Spann*
the bcrianity and bounty of Provides., and the detbeltlyil
man. Daring the protectorate of Cromwell he had to ern-
sit r pretensions enforced, with Mat IteerOby fist
pow country Spain, that not only so parties of ise rile-
cover continent of America, or any one of Osage
shoal be disturbed by other powers, bat that they
set carry on any trade with any other pert of ihs unineene.
It was not to be expected that Cracow.. 11, with his IMO miles
of British power, should submit to soh preleaniews. As-
ecediagly as expedition was fitted out, and thank that est-
pedit'on did not attain its innsidiate object, the 00..
quest of the island of Jamaica was the result.
kfterw ads, is reign of Charles the Second,
other eland' la the West Indies was occupied and
coaquered. Seek was the commencement of our first colo-
nial mettienente, which have now grown to such an extent
la the beginning of the met watery, during the war, Gib-
raltar fell late war possession. After the gloriosa war of
1766
ameailadditional islands were added to ear dominion,
mid, • we obtained the cession of Canada, an squid-
** w the Marquis Nontealm, who wee a statesman
es well as a soldier, &eland that, although it was a lees to
Prance, it would come the separation of Ho Amnion pro-
vinces from Great Britain, and so compensate the loss
which Prunes was expected to sustain. In the unfortunate
wet with the provinces of America our lame were greater than
der solos; bat in the great re7olutloaary war which began
is 1793 we made farther acquisitions by mesas of oar soil
and military forms, which were 0011fir111141, to us by the treaties
of 1814 and 1816. 1 will now read merely a list of the
Wades width we obtained betercea the al:Weigh and
eirrentetattt essturies, and those which we obtained
from 1700 to 1793, and between 1793 sad 1815. In
the Ant part of the list, vie., the islands we acquired
between the sizteesth and seventeenth materks, I glad
Nova Scotia, New Brunswick, Jamaica, Newfoundland,
Honduras, Bahamas, Bubadose, kedges, Mule, Moat-
▪ era', Priam Edward's IsloA Christopher, Gambia,
St. Helms, sad the Virgin Islands- In the mond port,
betwesa 1700 end 1713, we acqnbed Gibraltar, St.
Vincent, Beanies, Oresada, Tobago, Aisne Leone, and
No ottlements on to Gold Coat; in 1787 the lost
settlemout was beaded in New South Wales; in the
last pan of this list foes 1783 to 1816 we ormalred
the bilewing atomise, coserned to us
;lir peso
at 1816-Bt. Leek, British Guiana, see Dem-
me, Derbies, and Boor iil», Trinidad, N ta, the
Cape of Geed Ilepe, the Mauritius, Ceylon, and Van Die-
mea's land. I act now specify the Weals* whisk we
haw slam hemded, though I may have omits to
memo memo ell them in the coarse of what I have to
nom*. I shall sow sate the general peinsiplee an
whit the., 48111103 were governed. la the first plea it
~sus MI lave bola the object to send settlers out from this
geostry, and to enable them to colones those distant islands
and esontries; bat la the neat plans it was evidently the
of this agastry, vs it Ins of all the other enables of
avepe, to menesia a strict commercial menopely with re.
geed to these Wesley By various ate, to which I
need not Wade, several of them I.aelag been very recently
um, the nretem of tae home, we took ears that
the whole trade of those colonies should mane la this
country, and that no forelgnen should being their colonies
le this emery,eery, introduce ery, or introdu fate the colonies
any of their own productions. It ens maraived,
and until • very late period, that we had • vary great ad-
2...atelt: in the monopoly ; and Mr. Duda., is 1796, isl
g tithe colonies, said " If we agree to permit these,
--would dad a market for their productions;" eke*
inferring that that would he a great loss to this eenntry.
Eat, sir, there is another remarkable character alluding
these pessimism which is, wherever English eettistatiale
were feuded we wherever Englishmen chose to settle, Ibuy
carried with thee the freedom and the laseatsticse of do
ensues eountry. (Hear, hear.) I will take the MIME of
reading same Wrests from • patent gives to the MK of
Carlisle, who was t• be governor and I thiak,_pert
ter, of the blend of Bar does. The palest ie dated Ceregri,
is the reign ef Cheeks I. •.
Feriberkeve ye use we, he ua, our heirs rod sammisees, have
ompwolloofioNiopodsOwl Ins mid JUNG.
of sad Ids
view, adelllF ;vaunts/ jell, awl winkles we
awaisloo •-•
Pa .08 rh/4".1.81.11; er ter

lab' pantos% a the stems utility of "Mg Isla.
ti
Enke,
Oreill. mit set balk,_ mid maw lei or
mich law as he thsedd lad of Catkin erlitithErttle theism
nuillitt.t/smaa=6;fiwirnethial ni frtreessielo to le Ma
lt
la
ma
witer asweiewieflztose4
sintmr
%ids eir,17,..iid...0.,
st...tia...
10.. ... ......... Maw. am•am.. ghis
Me sill gesidsne be of our Ind •11,....daai1nl ffisf7.....
tag69::ensi=le due'
Thaw IMO Mora or ilteWledig
lee Ws, mama sal or sue lato,md answewe
smi is es me Osrheas woo ht ; sod so Yr Wm
tow Whin rest of leisbnion star at beetsiew is
meek, vesease obta limp. ant preem semi me sea Ws, them
se his woo smt.tra..±._ll=
p=oth Om at their gib-
meet owl ales to has out pews, dl
their aorta, Ill' "--a'abfet OM hboiseh sod Ow a
we ma fliii9 a page Of`rasa, whether las or mbs lees.
Wheat mistotime, vexation, injury, a trestle d tag
as beim, rime smosisew ha
Seek was Ws bomb WWII skis', whew high sews of kb
prerogative adlearnals eshoshood the civil war, thought
At to gnarantie Weir inserdes 10 these of the English peo_ple
who cease to milk ia the ahoy of Barbadoen The
omentmest of I weigh, Waal by Cromwell, wa, at first. a
purely military arreseemest; bat yn the reign of Chula II ,
it was sedated that tam assombly should be caliad, sad, with
the assent of the posple of Jamaica, laws should be
ordained. Oa the ameesioa of James 11., there wa a goes.
lion with regard to this very colony of Barbaloa,s and one
'Seeing the whole of the British croloaes. And Mr Fox,
in rolatiag the circumstance, which he has copied from a
despatch of the Marquis of Halifax, ads:
Among the various oblations to that nobleman's (Marquis of
Halifax) political principles, we Sad the charge most relied upon for
the parries ahijuring him is Use mind of the King was founded on
the *Wm he had delivered ha counta, in favour of modelling the
&Mend the British colonies in North Amend t upon the principles
of the rights and privileges of Englishmen. Tate was no roan to
donee the was accused of saying) that the game laws under which
we live in England should be established h a country composed of
Enflame. lte even dilated upon this, and omitted none of the
remiss by which It can be proved, that aboolute government is
mother go happy sot Po s..fe as that which is tempered by laws, and
which limas the authority of the prince. lte esaarriated, it was
mid, to shell& of • sovereign power. and declared plainly that
he meld unmake up his mind to l
eased,er • king who Mould have
tt la his pesterto take, when he pl the many he might have in
Wretta.
aside this a very remarkable circumstance, because of
those who lad enabled Charles 11. to dispense with parlia-
ments, there was none who was so able and s, useful to the
sovereign as the marquis himself ; bit what woos implanted
la his mind was the principle that Etta Inhofe ought to have
an entirely free government ; that when it came to be debated
whether people in the oolouies ihould live under the arbi,rary
will of one or have freedom of institution., he declaved is
favour of freedom of iesiitutionv. That that °pities
was is conformity with the general oesstitstion
of there admire; that it was in conformity with the general
principle of the Kalish law, is, I think, shown by the
ellinitle Of Sir Philip Yorke, who was quoted by Lord
Maosfield is a well-kaown ease of the proclamation of the
King with respect to the island of Jimmie,.
The Amembly of Jamaica being refaactory, it wee rekrred to Sir
Philip Take and Sir Clement Wearier, to knaw "what could be done
if the Ably should obstinately conloue to withhold all the Well
supplies." Tory reported that if !amines was still floundered es •
annuersd MAW, the King had a right to levy taxes upon the lobs.
tits" bat if it was to to considered in the *Anse light as the other co.I
lonies, Do tax could be imposed on the inhabitants but by an amembly
of the island, or by an set awl:meat.
I think that opiate is quite sufficient in regard to
the general law upon this subject. In the case to
which I have referred, the island of Grenada having been
tided by the peace of Paris, in 1716, the king issued a pro•
clamatiort, in which he said that the council in the inland
could make such laws as they might think proper. It
became • question afterwards whether there was to be a
fed certain amount to be paid by the island. Whatever
right he had at the time of the conquest, having by procla-
mation granted an assembly and the privileges of
the English constitution, it was afterwards out of
the power of the crown to revoke tot. In 1786
Mr. Pitt seems to have had, for • time, the belief
that the relations between our West ladian colonies end
the North American states, now the United Water, should
be carried on much a they had been wheo both were under
our dominion. That opinion did not afterwards prevail,
and we °heaved the strictest monopoly with rereW
to New Brunswick and Nova Scotia and the West
Indian colonies; but after a long consideration on this
Subject, and various discussions with the United
States, measures of far more liberal character were
intr.ohteed and carried by Mr. Huskisson, with
regard to ornamental facilities. Lately we have goats
much further in this direction, and by tke repeal
of the navigation laws of last year, I conceive
we have entirely put an end to the whole system of tom-
' menial monopoly as regards our colonies, We have plainly
declared that, on the one band, if we require productions
similar to thew which our colonies produce, we shall be
reedy to take them from other parts of the world; end, on
the other hand, we have left them free to provide themselves
with the productions cf other countries and to impose equal
duties upon the manufactures of Britain and of foreign coon.
Wes. Of course it is not my purpose at present to enter into
the question whether that has been right polity or not. It is,
however. evident that while en the oce hood it has produced
much surprise, and, in some cases, • good deal of discontent,in
some of our colonial possessions, on the other hand it has led
to the quisiion in this country whether that which seemed to
our ancestors one of the main purposes of colonial possessions
was advisable to be maintained, vie., our colonial empire.
I state this broadly, although there are many modifications
which have been
_proposed by different writers and speakers
On this subject. Now, sir, before we discuss the question at
all, I thick it is advisable to see what has been the increase
with regard to *sacral of these colonies, both
of population and of wealth, while under our
rale—and I will take, in the first lastance, the
increase of population within a very short period sines the
peace of 1815 in British North America. In 1816 the
population of British America was 462,250. In 1835 It
was 1,099,940, and is 1847 it was 1,868.891. That com-
prises Upper sad Lower Canals. Nova Boris. sad New
Brunswick; and the population of this country cannot be
reckoned now at less than two millions of persons, having,
at the data of the peace no more then 462,250. There is
another way In which the extent of this increase may
be in some degree measured viz., by comparing it
with she increase which is often referred to as singular
in the aspect of the world—viz., the great increase of
population in the United States of America. Now I find
that the population of Lower Canada was 433,630 ;
' is 1831, it was 511,922, being in six years an increase of 17
per cent. Ia 1844, it was 1,907,820, being as increase in 13
years of 35 per cent. In 1845, it was 2,770.000, being in 4
years an increased 12 per cent I will not read the account
of Upper Canada, but taking the account of Upper and
Lower Canada together, the increase from 1835 to 1841, in
six yeah, was 29 per cent. Ia 1843, the Osman was
55 per cwt. ,• and in 1848, the increase was 28
per cwt. The proportion being so great, I will
take the proportion of the ten von in whisk time they had
regularly increased. In 1800 it was 35 per cent., io 1810,
36 per seat., is 1820 it was 33 par scut., in 1830, 33 per
coat , sad in 1840 it was 32 pa Pot. Than this increase of
Upper aid Lower Canada was very such greater than that
In the United States. The populates of the United States,
in 1-90, was 3,929.827; in 1800, 5,395,925. decennial in-
ereabe, 36.01; is 1810, 7,239,114. increase, 3945 ; in 1820,
9,654,596, increase, 33 36 ; in 1830. 12.866,060. 3d 28; and in
1840, 17,069,453, hareem, 32 67. With regard to the imports
in the let few years the incomes has not loam lass remark-
able. In 1835 they Intro 2,730,00011 in 18363.952,0001. The
exports were, in 1838, 1,929,0002. ;in 1846, 3,291,0001. The
shipping inwards ha isereased from 1,077,000 to 1,461,000.;
shipping outwards hem 1,025,000 to 1,494,000. This is •
most !workable Menesse, both in population and in wealth;
waif we ere le emsdase test of the wealth of than countries,
vb. the adder emend to local taxation is Upper C
we get a result ho lea remarkable. The property assessed
to the bed taxation, in 1828, was 2,256,0002 ; in 1830,
2,9D,0002. ;in 1833, 3,880,0001. ;in 1840, 6,607 0001. ; in
1846, 7,778,0001. • in 1847, 8,667,0002 With re-
togard another portion of our colonies, in
which there has been an increase of persons of
British dissent, the facts are hardly less remarkable. I
allude mom especially to the Australian colonies, and, in
the first plain, to New South Wales. In New South Wales
la 1828, the people were not above 55,000, of whom at that
time, *oily half were convicts, and the exports were
180,0002 In 1848 the population had increased to
I 300,000, of whisk about 6,000 were free population, and the
opals were In value upwards of two millions. This may
ems tEI msreeesesekable, when I state that at the time of
the supeediso ei the North American provinces from
the serersighty of this country, the whole of
thdr experts were not above ohs million in value.
?Mimeses with retard to sows other colonies more lately
immisil in Now Holland is not km shoveler. Melbourne,
which la VMS owady watered, to years afterwe rata ow-
Wahl 2,000 home, aseassd at 50,000 f. sad the tows itself
did set coated* lass than 2,000, the whole settlement of Part
Phillip being 30,000. South Australia, which at first—
WOW JO OS ant with regard to the mode in which it could
be simeeimedest Into great dificulty in regard to its
ilmlitna, his made moat extraordinary MIMI, and, in the
maw of ten yaw, has not or ly a very considerable popula-
tion, but, I think, exports to the value of
about 300,0001. I mention these fats because I think
=
show, with regret to the large class of cur colonies
the dominion of this country, a most extraordinary
Inatome, both Ia population and he wealth ; they show the
nine of those pesetedous on whisk there is muscle discos-
eke as whisk some persons think with but superficial know-
ledge. Bat I will now take ea bateau of catch's* which
ham underseas two very severe trials—which, owing to the
state of their society in the first plan, and owing to their
Warne the Eat advents(' of those laws of commercial mo-
awely which I have neatened was toe system of this
wintry, bamboos ages* by *changes which have taken
place to what might be isenslid as • certainty of ruin to
these coked" I spelt, ideteargt, et the West I Alia Wanda.
'rah* gr
ach ist at esdaltioebtstteablelatv:y ursine,toesof
is. ho, wet
and ;
9?'11 Ifts•Pli tle '77, might well be apposed to be
likely to aweigh a etematien of all industry in all those
eadades. but OWNlig a nation of a very irksome
sal 'elbows, diseselpelesaposi
ef tr. The change, again, which
tech plata in the course of Mee year', first admitting foreign
him labour sugar, sad then Waukee foreign slave labour
auger, expeasd tam eolonls to another far maw
trial, sad yet, 11 the boss* will attend to the
West Indian
Womitlioall then generally of British, possessiam I think
there be wok to show that they have andergene these
trials with far success that might have beim oz.
"ciliate be emasidend• When
Trdethat if outhrßmtiontiabopoPreemy hadembeenoimaluumitained,iiii
soothe Wpetisteladiz
ithrosuldmhauayrietiuhsadanto:•:th,toe nfrEade!aisetuastaditte.
Toklag an average of three
1818, before soy el these changes had taken pieces
he gonad that the Wed Indies furnished for the anewmp-
tjos og dog agginay, 2,047,824 cwt. of sugar. In the wimp
of three yank 1830,1831, and 1832, before the amandpieloa,
they famished 3,896,820 owls. la the average of the throe

yeses, ISA 1166. ad 1846, bettor the great changes In 4111.
NSW stride 4 ohs salmi were 2,646,211 ewt.; and Is the
ITram4:ll/8 Paw 1847r 1848, and 1849, 2,007,667 ggs,
that milk the number I fleet mentiosed be
Ltar,..s lie Out there has been mud leis
have Man onthatad ; has if we take the
4
5 et the Bridal turewdeat the gears to
ia the first three ars, 2,26208 ;is the three years
lIIMI, 4,914,606 ;In the throe years from 1843. 227
sad in the sump Otte hat three years, 1847,
1849 so lies Ikea 6,038,755, brag as increase of mere
tee tallies seta epee the quantity *ensured his Bellith
in MS. So that considering the severe deb titt
esignies, sad set eleieg this as an Instance of each in-
ernes as might have been expected if these °heaps bad mit
taken place, I awed not say it is a matte aordiegey
erienat of the state of British peesessithe, as s the pt,.
deed= of a most valuable artists is mum&
Having now stated, what I costaider to ban bees the
great instance in two branches of these thissise sine IE4
and, having shown the great productieseithidi seise No
another part of the avionics I come now to the pesetbra
which has been much agitated, and of which As.. are err-
tainly advocates of very Gonad. Table ability, viz , the we
should no longer think it worth our while to maintain our
eelonial empire. Sir, I say, in the first plata, with regard
to this proposal, that I consider that it is our bounden duty
to maintain the colonies which have been placed under oat
charge. I think we cannot get rid of an obligation and a
resronsibility to govern thew colonies for their welfare, and,
as trust, bs a means of improving and civilising those parts
of the world to which they belong. In the next plate I say
there are many reasons why we should consiter that these
colonies form part of the strength of this empire. 1 cannot
conceive, whether in peace or war, that it should not be
onnlidered of the utmost importance whether we sustained
these supports of the imperial authority of this country, or
whether we should be deprived of them. In the next plan,
there SITO, in some of thee colonies, naked races, which we
have been able to a certain degree to civilise, and which at
lust we have brought into order and subjection to autho-
rity. There is now in one of our recant colonies a meet re-
I mutable race of men—the people of New Zealand—(bear)—
who, sot many years ago, were gives up to practices the
most abhorrent, but who, in communication with the British
people, appear to be Mr more Capable of civilizitiou than
almost any of the wage races with which we are acqusinted.
There is another race with whom we have lately COWS into
[ untie at Natal, in Africa, which have shown every sign of
' ability and Miter for learning the arts of civilization. There
ate Wien who, if we were* to abandon them, would slip into
lesmdetely savage habits; they would begin, probably, a
war of races with the few Englishmen left in com-
mand of them, and would thus give up those
parts of the world which have been recitalist(' from
barbarity to a state of the most desolating warfare. But
there are other matters relating to our impteal authority
and our security which cannot be lost in considering the
value of these colonies. Every cue admits the value of the
commerce, which penetrates to every part of the world, tut
many of those colonies give harbour end security t, toe
trade, most useful in time of peace, bat absolutely necerry
in time of war—(hear, he .r)—and then let us consider that.
after all, versus, without much investigating the subject
about giving up our Isotonic, and parting with them,
do not consider what would be the probable result with
respect to a great number of these colonin. It is easily
said that because the United States have formed a prospe-
rous, civilised, and fro community, and beetwe they are not
only great consumers of our goods, but likewise receive our
emigrants, therefore it would follow that other colonies
would take the same course; but as to many of these colt,-
nies, they would be uth sly unable, having but small means
of defence, and even a savage race about them, to .preserve
anything like independence and secuedy. What would
they do They would justly, if abandoned by this country,
apply to other countries, the Cspe of Good Hope to Hol-
land, Mauritius to France, others to other countries., and
they would say "We have been abandoned by those to
whom we owseallegiance; protection has bees taken from
us, and so we ask you to protect us and receive our alle-
giance." No doubt the other countries would accept the de-
arer, and they would become strong by that which would
then be your weakness. (Hear, hear.) Either of this.,
things is not consistent either with our honour or with their
safety. There are other things which seem but little differ-
ent, and which are proposed on this occioion. One is that
we should altogether abandon any care of the government of
these colonies, and that we should refuse teem
any assistance towards their defence. I think this
would very soon come to the same result as
that which I have just stated. These colonies would say,
if we are not to be defended, if we are to receive no alma:
from Great Britain, let us look for other defenders ; let us
ask other countries if they will waist us with their arms and
protect us from invasion which may injure our secur.
Anotner tells us that a certain description of laws would
require the as cot of the imperial authority, but that with
riser: generally to our laws no such went is required, and
that a line used to be drawn between throe lows which re-
quire the anent of the crown and thole which should he in
force without any went. Ido not believe it is potable to
draw any such hue. I think we had a strong instance of
that, in the debates of last year, with respect to a measure
passed by the House of Assembly, the legislative council,
and the government of Canada. It we 'sorted in this
house, that that was a measure which ought not to receive
the assent of the crown, and that tier Majesty ought to
reject the measure, although this measure was framed by all
the Canadian authorities. Government, on the other hand,
maintained it was a matter of local government, and
that all the acts of the colony ought to be affirmed.
I f it be, as I believe it is, our policy and cur duty to main-
tain this great and valuable colonial empire—(cheers)—let
us us that the principles we adopt are sound, and calculated
to sarry out our purpose. Let us IN that they are mach as
will do credit to the mother country, and be likely to con-
tribute to the happiness of the colony. (Hear, hear.) With
regard to commercial policy, I have already said
that the whole system of monopoly has been
swept away. What we have in future to guard
is but little; it is merely that in future there should
be no monopoly duties in f of one nation as against
another, and that then should be no duties of such a
nature as to be prohibitory against the product or manu-
factures of this country. (Hear, hear.) I think we are
entitled to ask so much in return for the defence end pro-
tection which the mother country affords. We have a right
to sat it in my opinion ; it is, 1 think for the benefit of the
colony that we should do so, and they canace. I think,
complain, when so simple are the boons demanded. (Hear.)
Next as to the future mole of government. It appears to
M that, as • general rule, we cannot do better than refer
' S. those mania of policy which g d our ancestors
ea this subject. (Hoar, hear.) It appears to me that is
saying that wherever Englishmen went, there they should
enjoy English freedom and English institution, our mou-
ton acted at thee justly and wisely. (Cheers.) They acted,
I believe, wisely kw the mainlines,. of harmony berms
the soother snotty sad its colony, and they seed
likewise fa a maaaer calculated to enable those who went
est to those distant pomusions to sow the seeds of communi-
ties of which Eagland must always be proud. (Hear,
berth) Let us now see how we are sustained on this sub-
ilitl bare here the declaration of a number of gentlemen,
init theme twelve or fourteen members of this house, and
gime Muse er four peers—members of the other home
of parliament—a declaration with roped to our colonial
policy. I think that the question of thew noblemen
and gentlemen forming themselves into an association, and
corresponding with the colonies, is a question of very dubiou
policy indeed. (Hess, hear.) Ido not mean to deny, how-
ever, that in their character of members of the Hones of
Lords or Commons they might fairly declare what are their
views and opinions, and that they might summon govern-
ment either to agree to their views or to show good
and sufficient reasons for expressing direst. If they had
done that I should have made no complaint of their
proceedings, not do I indeed now mean to eater further into
the 'abject. But I have observed with regard to general
principles, that after they have stated their sentiments they
turn out to be not very different from those I have stated
myself. (Hear.) They say, "Tie council are of opinion
that it is right and expedient to delegate to all the British
within whale population has been mainly formed, or is still
being by emigration, full authority to ad-
r their own affairs, and that the colonies at
present entitled to the privilege of self-government
are the North American colonies, South Africa, Australia,
Van Diemen's Lead, and Now Zealand. To those colonies
the association is determined to limit its operations in the
first Instance. The noble lord proceeded to relate what had
been done or it was designed to do with regard to Conde,
Nova Basis, the Caps Australia, Van 'Health's Land, aad
New Zealand. In Cinada he argued that self-government
was already sanctioned to the point of safety ; and while
making the startling statement that a proposal for its an-
nexation to the United States had absolutely been made to
the government, declared that the Integrity of the empire
would be preserved at all hazards Neva Bootie woe equally
independent, and latterly had both eumfortably pacific
With regard to the Cape, his Issinhip west on to say
there has of late years been a gni deg of dietaries
with respect to the iatroductith of regneentstive gnus-
meth Lord Stanley had the spestien under esesiderts
ties, and without at all 71: A. latredeetion of
representative government, he need oat many 4j5.
Ihnillien that had to be dereu before a
could be come to. Those diflicultiss, and, indeed, every
topic connected with the subject have been dimmed at the
Cape by the governor and his advisers. the Colonial Seers
tary and the Chief Justice, parties well capable of giving se
, both frees their general knowledge of the
opinion
Of goventment end their local acquaintance witrtit
affairs of the colony. The result hoe been that her blejsetfe
germinal have come to the decision that repro.
mutative government should be introduced at the
Cape. (Hear, hear.) With respect to the
mutative aessibly, they_ have adopted a trenTi:
into the particalan of whit* I shall not now enter' be
the papers will soon be la the hands of members, cad
enable them to Jades of the proposal, hut merely state
that the representative sieembly will be chosen by persons
having e consist amnia ol property, and being other miss
cruhfted in • maser to be specified. But a question arose
as is the feematies of what Is called the legisla•
by. etheall In ether soleales, sad upon the whole her
thojestfepeneemment Lave come to the opinion that instead
ef imbuing the sonstination of Jamaica or that of Canada
it would be @thimble to Introduee into the Cape of Good
Hip a assay width should be an elected nun% and
*Med by persons having a considerably higher qualification
thes Men who abuse the representatives. (Bear, hear.)
IS b le be esieseth aloe from persons of station is the colony,
as/ *we who had held municipal dies, or
=llllageallosida be minted to fill olio's of trust in this
=lt is pespened that the representative assembly
lima dsniks of five years, and that the aslant
soma oberald have a duration of tea years, but to p
slat Sea be re-elected every
-five
_pus. theeething like a
leanstithibm of Me kW, With. &thrift in svery
1 gummiksii• BardsalsoOn saw_ the dell be
lOW% Inimil et illi sea Iwin esessO, illistilern

en amides ems fee the mooed dumber, which
has, I Milisk, • derelicts Cl eight yews, but half
the numbest, ge out at the expiration of the fourth,
Of Mures this esperinteut is new, and it would be presansp-
' tens tom that it must certainly succeed ; but the order in
Maned has beau paned for the purpose of its general intro-
drassion, sad that order and the proper instrestioes will be
seat to the Cape, where it may be considered, with any
(Malls that may be added here, before say final
settlement is made. The neat colonies to which these
intatlemen adverted are the Australian colonies and New
Zealand. With respec• to Australia, hie lordship stated that
the proposed constitution consisted only of a single chamber,
two-thirds of the members being elected by the people, and
the remainder nominated by she colonial government. This
constitution hod some yeah since been suggested, and
appeared acceptable to the colonists. But there was to be
no restriction to their power of altering it, if, upon trial, it
should be found unsuitable. The regulation of their tariff
wm to be left to the colonial legislature. Port Philip was
to be represented from New South Wales, and the popular
element introduced in the assembly of Van Diemen's
Land. Questions involving the interests of ell three ago-
nies, vise Australia, Ne w South Wales, and Van Diemen's
Land, were to be settled according to the decision of
any two of them, and to such a decision the impostane ques-
tion of the waste lands was now to be left. In New Zeeland
some unsuesemfel experiments in sonssitntiun making had
already occurred. A suspension was the consequence; but
acting up in the latest advice, from the governor of that
colonr, progress was making towards its rointroduction,
which was ordered to take place immediately if matters
remained unchanged when the despatches strived In
the settlement. Briefly recapitulate ug some nue%
events in Jamaica and Cuban,, Lord John Renal
stated that the commercial depression and political agi-
tation in those dependencies appeared happily diminishing.
Lord John went on to say,—With respect to Tri-
nidad Lord Harris writes that there has been no attempt
to procure lewd represents/ion, and yet he thinks, and
I meet add, thinks justly, that if it was determined that
because people were unfit ter popular institutions, we must
not attempt ti introduce them, th et neuld be a continual
bar against eny prover towards civilisation, and therefore
he proposes that there should be • municipal
cooped at the seat of government, and that it
should be elleced, his lordship eddies/ that he thought
considerable benefit would result from such an institution.
He gir's these reasons why we should nut go further at
precent in attempting to introduce r .presentative institutions
into that colony. And with regard to the Mauritius, Biz
J. Anderson has ill- re introduced an ordinance fur establish.
ing municipalities, which he thinks will be effective. As
rogues Malta, the governor of that island has dune what I
am aware many thick is not advisable, but what be believes
to be expedient. (H or, beer) He erg introduced some elec.
tire members into the composition of the council. As to
the other reunite, I need nut oa the present occasion enter
upon the question of the eropriety of extendiog tree institu-
tion to them, for I do not think hi pied thine I have
mentioned that there is one of tl ma which can be
named as being a' present fitted 'n receive such ineti.
unions. (Hear, hear.) I creme, here fore, sir, now
to the consideration of another question—a question
of very considerable importance as .. Reels the celouies, but
which is not in its. If -Lolly or striate • colonial question—
I mean the question oil transp.rtetien. (Hear, hear.) It
was decided ray this country, in the year 1780, that we should
found s penal colony in New South Weise, and 19.111111,411
were taken for that purp or, and a certain number of con.
nets were rent out; but they were tart ma. without any free
settlers, sod with manly a sufficient number of persons to
afford them religious instruction. Tan question s f trans-
portation must be considered as one teat concerns the par-
liament et this c sentry, so far es le gi eation is concerned,
and the HOMO er %say ,so tar as tee executive is con-
cerned, Per more teen the Colonial Se eretery ; f r, so far as
he is concerned in tee matter, officially, he would, I appro.
lend, be perfectly satisfied it he were t that La more con.
vista were to be 1411 t out, and that transportation to Our colo-
nial was to be altogethet abolished by le erhament. (hear.) But
inasmuch as parlisratut has decided, ..rid decided more than
once, that the previous punishment of transportation ie to
be centime's, it is for him to endeavour that it shall be
carried out ins masener that shall he lent lel urine to the
colony to which the e' evicts may he sett. Teat it is the
wish of path mem, and also that it is the wish of the country
that thesysiem should omtinue, Lain entitled, I think, to as-
sume, because when I, having myself no great leaning to trans-
portetion, and not very much approving of the, puuisn-
meat, attempted, about the year 18441, to diminish the
aumber of convicts sent abroad, a resolution was pasted by
this house, affirming that it was net right that so large a
aumber ot convicts should he kept in this country, as there
was at that time. I say then, that the leaning of parlia-
ment is in favour of continuing this mode of punish-
seat, because, when the two Secret iris' of State
ccncurrei in the desirability of carrying out
a diminution of the punishment of tessepertatis n,
• committee was appoireed in the other hew" of parliament,
before which several et the judges were heard, and they
gave it as their opinion that trenspertation was uneecesi
eery for the effective maintenance it the criminal law of
this country. (Hear, hear.) Well, sir, if that be the
ease—wee the view is altered, the colonial secretary must
endeavour to carry the punishment ie e tfect, in ach a
way as shall enable the colony, in some cues we hope, to
derive ideal:wogs from the system, but in all, in ouch a way
as shall inflict the least possible injury. (Hear, !Ma.)
When I held the rush of the colonial department, being very
much impressed with the mischief which transportation had
occuioni d in New South Wales, I advised her Majesty and
obtained an order in council fur the purpose of putting •
stop to the practice of inenspertine convicts to New South
Wales; and, sir, I will say that there is no act I d-d
during the time I held those scats, to which I
now look back with greater satisfaction, than
the obtaining of that order in council. (Cheers.)
Whatever may be the case hereafter, Iht it-vs the change of
character which resulted to New Sou'h Wein Item that act,
by altering it from the condition of a eoleny in which a part
of the population were convicts, and no inconsiderable part
were emancipts, a• they were called—penews who bad un-
dergone their sentence of teen portatiou -altering it from
that cindirion to a lime of free people was of erect advantage
to the colony. The present govittnment, when they came into
power, proposed many alterations as to the system of trans-
portation generally, and that in cases who re eoiouies were
willing to accept a small number of convicts, they should
be sent to them, it being aware undi creed, however, that
convicts were not to be forced upon them. Now it happened
amongst the many evils which arose out of the famine in
'reline there arose a great pressure from the great numbers
of persons who were sentenced to transportation, which re-
'melted in the overcrowditig of the gaols and a very meat
mortality in all of them. -rho Secretary for the Cokmies,
this state of things being represented to him,
thought himself justifi.d in sendinz out a number
sot exemdiog 300 of them persons who had
been sentenced to transportation for thefts and
other crimes committed under the pr. ,surd of the famine,
to tee Cape of Good Hope. The feeling which I commend
in iteeli, 'hat by receiving those convict, the colony might
become and remain a penal colony, toek possession of the
population of the Cape of Good Hope, and Deduced in them
exaggerated apprehensions as to the effect of the jeweils@
ties of those 300 convicts, and there has arisen in maw
queues a most unfortunate state of things. (.• Hear, hear"
and laughter.) The intention of the government has there-
fore bees abandoned, and the order in council permitting
the transportation of tho e convicts to the Cape of GAM!
Hope has been revoked, and the ship which took them out
has been ordered on to Van Diemen's land. Of course very
much inconvenience resulted from the controversy between
the colonists and the governor on this subject, but into the
merits of that controvetsy I will not enter. (Hear, hear.)
Sir, there is another question of very great cones-
queue, and which some p, none have thought to be
the main question to be considered in regard to colonial
affairs. I mean the question of emigration. (Hear, hear.)
Now there are, as it appears to me, two modes by whet
emigration can he carried on, and corned on beneficially.
The one is when labourer., whose labour is in cerain states
and colonies valuable, go out In (great numbers to those
states or colonies, to fill up, as it were, the itetenices
in society there, and whose labour is immediately or very
soon in demand, and who find their position changed from
what it was here, vii , a position bordering an destitution—
without employment, and almost without food—to a position
in which they are obtaining high wages and ample sub-
sistence in some other country. (Hear.) Of this kind of
emigration there has been a great mass directed to the
United States and the British North American Colonies.
The other kind of emigration is that when the emigrants
are formed of different classes in society, who go out for the
purpose ot founding new colonies in countries where, at pre-
sent, society does not exist. This kind of emigration also has
Cred to a considerable extent of late years.
regard to the first. I have some accounts
which have been furnished to me by Mr Mur-
doch, the gentleman who is now at the head
of the emigration board, and from those accounts it appears
that the total number of emigrants of this class who have
dazing the last three years proceeded out from this c iuntry
has been 796,3.54, or an average of 266,460 per annum.
(Hear, hear.) Now, I beg the hones to consider for a mo-
ment how large is the extent of this emigration. (Hear.) It
Mounts to within 40,000 er 60,000 of what has been ecn-
reed to be the whole annual increase of the population of
this country. And 'house the natural amount has no doubt
been auentented during one or two of those years by the
pressure of the famine in Ireland, yet I do consider
that as to this first description of emigratioo, which
enselste of labourers and their families going out
to the United States of America and the British
North American colonies to seek employment there, I con-
eider it a description of emigration which is likely to con-
tinue for many years to come. (Hear ) I 'believe that the
means which the labouring classes have found for themselves
to enable their friends and connexions here to join them in
their new and more prosperous home—the transmitting
here sums of money which they have earned and saved from
their wages in the maple, to which they have transferred
their labour, to psy for the passage and bring others over to
them, is likely to go on and to furnish the means of defray-
keg the expenditure of a very extensive system of emigration.
(Hear.) Considering the means, used the gnat extent of country
belong gto the Teethed States and our own province of Upper
Ceaada,l cannot but bring myself to believe that there will
speedily Coin a time when there will he a great demand for
labour there. (Hear, bear.) The difficulty hitherto has
been to find the means of transport to enable persons who are
almost in • state of destitution here, and who can find no
demand in this country for their labour, to go to another
geenuy, where the demand for labour far exceeds the sup-
pl. (Hear, hear.) And I do not believe any government
scheme could have beet devised either so extensive as to
effect that purpose, or, if to effect it, to carry it out in the
same satisfactory way, and to the same utast, as this
voluntary system. In the fleet place, if we had laid out
100.0001, 200,0001., or even 3000001., it would have been felt
as every large addition to the public expediters, but I believe
the sum lei eat in the emigration, end ia the model speak

of (and which is wholly voluntary) has not been less in the
year than li indium (Hear, hese.) If we had expended
thatamount, we should hen bees subject to every species of
abase ; and we ehould find that we were carrying oat from
this country &emigrants persona wholly unfit to emigrate
who would obtain the passage by means of false characters,
and who should be Coned such a cures to the country they
went to, "bother the United States or our own provinces,
that the system would soon be put a stop to by the remon-
offences of those Gelatins. They would say, and say with
justice, do not send out to us the halt, the cripple, the idle,
and the dissolute—if minuted us only the refuse of your own
population, those who cannot or will not labour, but must
remain a burden on us, we must put a stop to the system I
altogether, ss far as we are concerned. (Hear, hear.) Arel
such must have been the obaracter of any government scheme
of emigration. Ido not, however, mean to say, that under
all circumstances some assistance from the government fer
carrying out emigration may net be advisable; but seeing
that the people have found out for themselves that by trans-
mitting a portion of their earnings to this isountry they may
bring out their wives, their children, their brothers, and nth' r
relations to join them in the country where their labour will
be valuable—to attempt to effect the same object by means
of • tax imposed upon this cautery would be • posi-
tive evil, and diminish the value of emigraeun.
Then as to the other sped. a of emigration ; tbet which pro-
Iceeds chiefly to our Australian colonies is of that other
ecirription, and which goes out with the object of founding
new settlements, or increasing those which are already formed
there. 01 this kind of emigrants it appear that in therein
1448 and 1849 the Emigration Commissioners sent out
nearly 37,000, or are average of more than 18,000 a year. In
New Zealand also, there has been a project to form • new
settlement In the Canterbury settlement, which I am told
promises to be successful. Already. I believe, there are
more than 12,000 Europeans in New Zealand, and no doubt
in a few years a very large emigration will be directed
to that enemy, and that it will become one of the most flou•
rishing colonies we possess. (Hear, hear.) I think, there.
fore, with regard to emigration generelly, making due re-
servation fur :he application of special measures to special
ewe, We may look with satisfaction on the present state of
V, question, aid may consider that one of the great wants
of this country—that of finding a vent for the surplus of a
population which is increasing e, rapidly—that that want
has been satisfied without basing recourse to a system of
which I was always apprehensive, of rending out largo bo-
dies of people to distant colonies where labour
was not In demand, and where their condi-
tion would/have bean far worse than in the country thi y
lest. (Hear, hear) I have now stated the principal pant—
nearly the whole indeed of what I wished to put the house
in possession of with regard to colonial government. I have
not attempted to do more than to lay before it some of the
leailing facie—as to many important qaestions arisint out of
this subject, each set which might furnish matter fee • night's
debate, I have not touched upon them ; but I have thought
it right test the house should have belure it a sketch of the
general state of our colonies and the propositions which her
blejesiy'a government were either &Men to carry, or the
no mane which they have carried into effect. The
whole result of what I have to ray is, in
the first place, that whatever discontent exists, and
in Cools cams, without doubt, you will find dis-
content, which it must be admitted has arisen from a transi-
tion puofnl to them from • system of monopoly with regard
to their colonies to one of free trade, that we ought not to
attempt to go beck in any respect from those decisions to
which parliament has come, but that we should treat our
col tees on the principle that we are at liberty to obtain the
predurions of other countries which they can furnish
better and cheaper than our colonies, and that the colonics
en the other hand should be at full liberty to trade with ell
parts of the world, and in that manner which to them may
be most advantageous. (Hear, hear.) 1 hie in future must
he a cardinal point in our policy. (Loud cheers.)
If so, and if we are in future to proceed in conteresity with
the principles of our ancestor., and the plans we have
adopted of late years ourselves, in the British North Ameri-
can colonies, we should, es far as possible, goon the principle
of introducing and maintaining political freedom in these
coloni.s. I maintain that wherev.r you say that pelitical
freedom cannot safely be introduced, you are bound to show
the reason leer the exception—you are bound to show
that the people are a race to whom free institutions are
inapplicable, and that the colony in question is not
formed of British people ; that it has not such an
admixture of British people as to make it
safe to intr Alen tree institutions. (Loud cheers.)
The rule should be to send to the different par's of the world
you would a, lonise,!and maintain in those parts of the world
where yeti have colonies, men who are capable of govern-
ing themselves—men who shall know they have full liberty
Vi govern themselves, and that while you are their represen-
tatives on ail foreign matters, in their domestic concerns you
want to interfere no further t: an is clearly and decidedly
mummy to prevent a conflict in the societies which you
wish to preserve. I do, of e'en., anticipate with others
that acme of them colonies, with which we are now dealing,
may so aro* in population and in wealth that they may say
to us, "our strength is now sufficient to tie an nide-
pewlent country ; the link of the connexion
with you has new become onerous to us ; the
time has arrived when we thick we can our-
mien, in amity and in alliance with England,
maintain cur independence." (Hear, hear.) That day,
however, has not yet, I believe, approached; but, I say,
make them in the mesa time as fee as possible fit to govern
themselves—give them, as tar as you can, the capacity to
manage their own affairs—let them increase in wealth and
in population, and whatever may happen to this great em-
pire we shell have at h alt the consolation of saying we have
eoloributed to tee happiness of the world. (Loud cheers.)
The formal resolution having been put,
Sir W. MOLES WORTH established the right of Autra-
lia to distrust every premise of the Colonial-office, by refer•
ries to the successive occasions when assurances of its politi•
al emancipation had been given, and as repeatedly violated.
Toe Miele!c a complained that they were abandoned
to the bureaucracy, and had asked in vain the inter-
meition of the British legislature between themselves
and the omnipotent Snretary of State. The Cape was dis-
contented; P vet Philip had rejected our convicts; Canada
laid heavy charges against her governor—from every side
complaints arriving that the system was vicious, and re-
quired • radical reform. The colonies selected by the
R. form Amociaion complained of the want of free insti-
tutions, the iteterference of the Celenial-office, end
the transmission of British convicts. With none
of these evils would the changes now introduced by
the Revetment really interfere. (Hear.) The noble
tort bad said it was necessary for hon. members to state
whether they wished to retain our colonial government,
and, if they were of opinion they ought to retain it,
then to describe the policy they thought should be
adopted. Now he would reply shortly to the challenge of
the noble lord, not by expressing in abstract terms his opi-
nions of coionial policy, hut by considering some of the
measures the noble lord proposed for the government of
some of our colonies. In the government of • colony there
were two distinct things to be considered—first, as to the
form of government or the constitution, and secondly
as to 'he power that ought to be delegated to the colonial
au borities. With regard to the form of government, he
could not distinctly understand the form of government the
noble lord intended to give to the colony of the Cape of Good
Hop e It appeared that some form, taken from Belgium, was
to be sent to the Cape of Good Hope, to be there
considered by he (Sir W. Molesworth) did not know whom,
and then it was to be brought back to this country and after-
war's agreed to. With regard to the Australian colonies,
as the noble lord stated! that the bill was to be substantially
the PllOl/1 as that of last year, he (Sir W. Molesworth) could
understand it; but the noble lord had surprised him when he
called it a copy of the British constitution. He believed the
noble lord intended to give to the Australian colonies the I
present constitution of New South Wales. Now,
what was that constitution ? Suppose that in that
house there were 110 members who had seats in
virtue of their holding office under the government ;
and for as long only as they held office, and that, in addition
to the 110 official members, there were 110 others who were
appointed members by the government at the commence-
ment of every parliament, making in all 220 votes at the
disposal of government. Suppose, likewise, that the House
of Lords were abolished, and that, instead of her Gracious
Majesty Queen Victoria, we bad a governor of the ordinary
description, then we should enjoy the benefits of the British
constitution after the fashion of New South Wales. How
would such a constitution week with us ? We should be
divided into two permanent parties, actuated by the fiercest
hatred of each other, one party would pride itself upon
being the repres-ntative of the people, and would look with
acorn aid contempt upon the other party u the bane and
subservient tools of the government. No question would be
considered to be settled which was decided against the opi-
nion of the elective members, and the official and nominated
members would be held up to public odium and hatred
if they ever presumed to defeat the wishes of
the elective members. It was evident that such a consti-
tution was absurd in theory, and that in practice it could
hot fail to work ill. (Hear.) But the noble lord had
stated, that the people of New South Welles, were very
well eerrentee with their present form of government.
He (Sir W. Molesworth) did not know whether the noble
lord had received any late accounts from the colony ; but the
deliberations in the legislative council on the subject, would
certainly seem to show that they only preferred the present
constitution to that worse one which it had been proposed
to give them. (Hear, hear.) But the noble lord would
sat that the Australian colonies were to have power to alter
or amend their constirutims, to the extent of making the
second chamber elective. Now he (Sir W. Molesworth)
acknowledged that if this power were fully conceded to
them, his objections to this portion of the Intl of the noble
lord would be cuusiderat'ly diminished. (Hear.) But be
must say that in his opinion sufficient power to amend their
constitutions would not have been given to the colonies by
the bill of last year. He presumed from the statement of
the noble lord that he did not prop me in the bill of this year
to give thew colonies *enter amount of power; therefore
when the proper time arrived he would certainly propose
an alteration in this part of the noble lord's bill.
The second question, ea to the powers which the noble lord
proposed to give to the colonial authorities, is the most int-
weave one. It appeared from the statement of the noble
lord that he intended to tetain to the Colonial-office its pre-
sent arbitrary power of disallowing all acts of the colonel
legislatures, and than of interfering in the internal affairs of
the colonies. Now this arbitrary power had been, and as
Lug as it existed would continue to be, a perpetual cause of
colonial disco .tent and of -ending discord between the
colonies and the imperial government. All the utopia com-
plained of the arbitrary power of the Coloitial.office, Thom
complaints were frequently but too well founded. flow was
it potable that they could be otherwise than well founded
Let the hoses consider who were the persons who
were entrusted with this arbitrary power. The
heads of the Colonial-ofeee changed with every
of government. They were absentee rulers. Lining at
distance of man thousands of miles from their subjee%
they never had hid ocular experience of the condition of '

the colonies. They had no personal interest en the well
being of the colonists. They wen 'braes obliged to trust
to seemed hand and partial information we regard to the
winks. They were therefore generally ignorant, and,
worse than ignorant, they were generally misinformed about
colonial question.. They were uid to be revolvable to par.
filmed. That responsibility was a farce, for the house
ciuld not spare time to attend to colonial affairs. Hon. mem-
bers could not obtain accurate and imputi.l information
about the colonies. They were nece.sarily ignorant. Auden
pystem of colonial government might w i h accuracy he de.
scribed u a gos velment by the misinform. d with respont ibility
to the ignorant. (Hear, hear.) This kind of government
war suet bitterly distasteful to men of our race and hehita.
It was impossible for men on one side of the globe
to manage the affairs of Englishmen on the other
side of the globe without producing intense dissatienntioe.
On the other hand, if the colonists were to obtain the uncon-
trolled management of their local affair', and if in any re.
spent they were to mismanage those affairs, for so doing they
would have themselves to blame, and nobody else. There-
fore he inferred we ought to delegate to the celeniee all local
powers, and 'nth:e them to pan any law if cling their lout
concerns. Consequent:y he interr, d that we oust to &Trees
the Colonial Office of its present arbitrary power to disallow
all acts of the colonial legislatures, end to limit the emceed
the Colonial-ofilts to questions affecting imp eri,l powers.
For this purpose it woule be necessary carntully to enume-
rate and to accurately define the powers which ought to be
held to be imperial powers. He proposed lam session that a
royal commission should be appo'nted fa this purpo e, and
to prepare a measure of colonial reform. He regretted much
that the house did not went to that proposal, fir by this
time the bowie would have pomessed a more accurate fisllllll.
ration of imperial powers thanf.that which it could exp. t ea
him. He war, however, prepared to make that enurneraian
whenever it taught be coeveneent to the house to list. n to it,
and if it w.O the pleasuro of the committee he would nolo
the enumeration at once. (Hear.) At present the c donial
legislatures did not know what hewn they might end wnat
Inas they might not make. In fact they might at present
make any laws whetever, affecting imperial interests in any
r meaner whatever, provided the Colonist-effice did hot
disallow th• m within a certain eeriod of time. Oa the
other hand, the colonial legisiatu• • s cool I not make nay law
which the Colonial.' ffice might r.ut prr,po4d,
r therefore, in the manner in which he had t vAsin.-d, to
enable the e lonial legielators to know preisely what
r lawn they might make, and what lbws they must e:ite.in
• from making ; and he proposed to settle all &putts up,A,
r this subject by means art the decisions of one of :ha
• highest and most esteemed judicial tribunals in this
e country. He should, therefore, wh,n the time anis .1,
e attempt to amend the noble lord's bill in the manner which
he had described. (Hear, hear.)

Mr. ANSTEY obj,eteri to the plan of government 'or
Van Teemsn't Lend, it being, in his opinion, undesiraole to
kayo one third of the council nominees u: the crown.
Mr. BAILLIE remarked upon the sort of constitutien
which the government had ace rded to Btilth Guiana.
The noble lord had stated that the nun:o.er of electors
had increased as well as the population. \•,w, be
limes the house to judge bow far this could be the cars when
he stated that there were but two own in tat province of
Essequibo—the gaoler and the clerk of the curt. The
atlornry-general nes the candidate—he was .yrop.sed b 7 the
gaoler and seconded by the clerk, and cf course warned,
for there wee no !Aber voter in the province.

Mr. LABOUCHERE coegrstulated the house en the
ce'm spirit in which thin di'eussion hot been eclat.' an ; a
spirit in which he trusted all colonise relieve would he dis-
cussed is the c mrse of the present • anion, wh ch was of the
utmost importance, when they considered that the d•cl r t-
liana made in that house found their way to the most eialnt
parte cf the world. He held in hit hand • e 1.7
of the leading newspaper of New South Wales, the
Sidney Herald, which had not only the greatest circu-
lation inthe colony, but was dirk gui-ta d es representie.; the
popular opinions. The date of the paper was Se pt.e.her
19, 1849. and this was the language of the Itaa-
ing article: "Those of our readers who have attentively
p ?Twee the long and elaborate report of the Boar! ot Trade
published in this journal in May last, on tee subject ot the
forthcoming act for the government of the Australian colo-
nies, will no doubt agree with us in thinking it one of the
ablest and most conciliatory documents ot the kind ever 'aid
iwtore the colony. To what extant other British eelonies
may have experienced kind treatment at the hauls of the
home government it is not for us to •ay, but c,r-
tainly we can testify that never before did the
colony of New South Wales receive so large
• share cf ministerial consideration end kin tr.,
as in the present instance. Her Majesty in comma has been
graciously pleased to concede to us nearly every thing that
we have asked." Perhaps he must make some allowtmca
for the first outburst of gratitude, and he was not to igno-
rant of human nature as not to be prepared for mime qualifi-
cation of this praise. At the same time be had a right to
pay that they had been altogether successful in conciliating
the public cpinion of the inhabitants of New South Wel,s
in favour of the proposition, which, after mature
deliberation, they had ventured to recommend to the cr:sen
and to parliament. lie happened to have • newspaper which
had reacted him by the same mad from Port Phillip. He
was ignorant of the character of this newspaper, and could
not speak so confidently of it as be could of the Sidney Il••
raid. It was the V,ctoria Colonist of the 14th Septeitber,
and it stated "It must be gratileieg to Earl Grey and the
rest of her Majesty's ministers to hod that the been sr ice
they have granted to the Australian coloniea in the no w
constitution has diffused general satistaceion throughout the
province of Victoria, that all the newspapers are unanimous
in the expression of their approval, and that there
is not even one solitary instance of dissent." He thought
there fore he might venture to say that there was, at present,
at least, every reason to believe that the inhabitants of Aar.
tralia would readily accept a measure which he could fairly
say win framed and devised with a sincere desire to promate
their ben, tit, to conciliate their wisher, and to place th'm on
that footing which they had a right to be on as free au. jests
of the British empire. They had reason to believe that their
efforts in that respect would be attended with success,
and that they would attain the object they lad
in Mew. So much for the question of the Austria en
which was now before the house. But the worthy baronet
the member for S eithwark made some obatreat ions also i.tt
the proposed cot sfitution which was to he given to the
Cape of Good Hope, to which he felt it cockney
to advert. The report of the Committee of l'r.vy Council
bad been on the table of the house but a short time. so
that the boa. baronet could not have read it with great
attention.
Sir W. MOLESWORTH—I have not read it at all.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said—Then he was the lees sur-
prised at the statement ne made, that the constitution of ths.
Cape of Good Hope was to be left to Sir Harry Smith.
—(Sir W. Molesworth was here nude rstood to ewer his
dissent from this observati nil—Nothing could be more
at variance with the feet, the truth being that in the
main principle of that cocatitution, the distinction hi&
down which would place the government in two councils,
nothing could be said to beat all left to Sir Harty h The
coloties,:as far as possible, ought to have local Ilialatior, gad
the unlimited management of those concerns that were be-
longing to them; but he thought it was amenity, for the
interests of the British empire, to reserve to the government
and the parliament of this country supreme centring. He
believed that these things were reooncileable, not, perhaps,
with the theory of a speculative philosophy, but quite sut-
ficiently with practice, to satisfy the colonists of this coun-
try. Gear, hear.)
Mr. ROEBUCK said he understood the noble lord
to explain two things to-night, he explained the general
policy ot the government in respect to her colonial possess-
ions, and at the same time explained to the house his own
specific act of I gislation which he proposed. The two
things were separate, the one being the general grounds laid
down, and the other a particular illustration of the general
pelicy the noble lord was about to pursue. In support of the
general policy the noble lord stated the fouadation
of the broad history of this country, in res-
pect to her colonial legislation, but he struck out
the moist important part of our colonial history.
The noble lord had laid down most general propositions of
great liberality. He had stated the iutentien of the imm-
inent to make the government of the colonists entirely their
own concern. He was delighted to hear that statemect.
(Hear, hear.) It the members of the Colonial Association
had needed a justification for their conduct, or any eatisfac-
tion for themselves and the country to whom they addressed
themselves, the noble lord's conduct that night (be hoped he
would take no offence at hi* saying so) would have been that
justification. (Hear, hear.) He was very much inclined to
believe that the circumstance of • set of gentlemen being
brought together from all sections of politicians and all ports
of the country, expressing (,deep interest in our colonial go-
vernment had convinced -he noble lord that the country telt
the importance of the subject ; and he had very properly n.reed
his attention to it also. With regard to South Attics,
he had nothing more to ask of the noble lord,--nothieg
at all. His mind had been brought to the conclusion
that • double chamber was requisite, and that bothchambers
should be elective. (Hear.) That was most important,
and he was delighted that the noble lord had brought his
mind to that view. (Hear, hear.l But, baying arrived at that
conclusion with regret to South Africa, he could not em-
otive or understand by what process he should have come to the
very opposite conclusion wish evils ct to New South Wales.
If such • thing were requisite in South Arne.. was it not
also requisite in South Australia? (Hear.) He was told
the government were acting out of some notion of symmetry,
and because there was already one constitution of onl one
chamber, that of New South Wales, that Sydney, lore
Phillip, and every other colony in that part ot the worla,
were to follow that most unhappy experiment. Ile Was
entirely opposed to the project of soaking a certain portion of
the council the nominees of the crown, as it was called, but
in reality they would be the nominees of the goeernor. andst
of a clique who would be always nominally persons egain
whom the popular mind was sure to be directed. (Heir,
heat) He had lived in a colonial government, and knew
teLconstantly bow bitter factions were in these small, narrow communities,
where everybody knew what everybody ate and dreuk—
(lshgh toin immunity
of that kind. Ho would oak the noble lord, where
object he really believed was to govern the co:onies iedt,
) dhewnianldhe nto wtater to advise
liveany one
a who
c did net
why did he thus halt in his march? His b. tter wird
bad acted when oonsidering the case of South Atrica ; with
reference to Australia some evil genius had presided. The
noble lord had himself acknowledged that this did not agree
with his sense of what wee right. There was end y one in-
wt
stance of a constitution with • single chamber, and yet the
government was about to make 11•11 new eollBlilUllollll in
Australia, all on that model, end against their own ba
judgment, for ne other reason than that of symmetry with
the one existing constitution. Let hoe. memben address
themselves to this question as men having • knowledge of
this kind, de that which must be perpetual source of
haulm nature. and not, whoa making
matant. ) a great experiment of

1,

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