The Northern Daily Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1853-12-02 00:00:00

DOCK COMMITTEE.-YESTERDAY.

The usual weekly meeting of the committee was held
on yesterday, in the dock offices, Mr. C. TURNER., in the

The other members present were—Messrs. Shand, Ran-
kin, Smith, Rounthwaite, Holden, Malcomson, Barber,
Littledale, Healing, Chaloner, Brocklebauk, Robinson, Roy-
den, Robertson Gladstone, Lockett, and Evans.

The sub-committee of works reported the purchase of a
dwelling-house, No. 41, south side of Sparling-street, for
£450, it being wanted for the arrangements of the London

and. North Western Railway Committee. Confirmed.
Mr. BARBER wished to know if numbers of their work-
men at the granite quarries in Scotland had not left their
employment, and if many more were not likely to follow, in
consequence of the dearness of provisions, and other causes ?
He understood that the work required particularly skilled
labour, and he therefore thought it would be well to insti-
tute some inquiry to see whether it would not be well to an-
ticipate their requirements in that particular.
The SURVEYOR replied that skilled labour was not at all
required at those quarries. The commonest labour sufficed,
and for that description of employment they had too many
applications.

The warehouse sub-committee recommended that James
Gaskill and David Johnston be appointed asssistants at the
transit sheds, to fill up the vacancies caused by the dismissal
of T. Fry, and the promotion of John Edgar. Confirmed.
They also recommended the dismissal of James Forster, de-

ivery foreman at the Albert dock warehouses.
Mr. R. GLADSTONE inquired what was the cause of the
ismissal ? lie thought it would be well to state the cause

m all cases of dismissal.
The CHAIRMAN replied that in this instance there could

be no— objection to state the cause, inasmuch as it had been
the subject of a public prosecution; but it was questionable
whether it would be prudent for them to state the cause in

all cases. It might subject them to an action. In this in-
stance, however, the cause of dismissal was the robbery from
the warehouse of goods of which Foster had charge.
Mr. GLADSTONE observed he had asked the question, be-
cause he conceived that the public who paid those men

should always know the reason of their disnlissal.
. The recommendation of the sub-committee was adopted.
Mr. Gladstone's suggestion to he taken into consideration.
The marine sub-committee produced a chart of the chan-
nel as corrected from the last survey.
The harbour masters' sub-committee reported the r esig-
ti on of Mr. Williams, who held the situation of clerk in
the office, and recommended that the vacancy be filled up.
The CHAIRMAN observed that Mr. Williams had always
performed his duty diligently, and that he left the service as
he had received a better situation.

The sub-committee also reported the death of Thomas
Moore, gateman at the Sandon dock, and recommended
that the present office for regulating graving-docks be
enlarged according to the plan submitted ; the estimated cost
being from GO/. to 701. Confirmed.
A letter was read from the owners of the cargo of the
" Tiger," demanding compensation for damage done to the
cargo, on the occasion of the drying of the dock, when the
vessel herself was injured.
The CHAIRMAN observed that the committee disclaimed

all liability in this matter.
Mr. LocKErr said that the best evidence that the injury
to the vessel was not through their fault, that the master
himself paid his own expenses.
The letter was referred to the solicitor.
A communication was read from Messrs. John De Wolf,
and Co., to the effect that as they had learned that the com-
mittee were about letting one of the graving-docks to
the British North American steam-ship, company, they
begged that the same favour be accorded to them.
The CHAIRMAN remarked that they.were not about to let
any dock to the British North American steam-ship com-
pany, and that if at any time they considered the subject,_
the present application would be also entertained.
Mr. R. GLADSTONE asked what was the gross amount
received from the graving-docks, or what per tentage they
paid ?
The CHAIRMAN : My impression is that they pay us
tl% o-and-a-half per cent.
Mr. It. GLADSTONE said they were told that the public
graving-docks were the cause of the disputes between the
ship-carpenters and their masters, and if by letting the
docks to private individuals they benefited the trade, and in
place of two-and-a-half got four per cent. on their money, he
did not see why they should not do so.
Mr. LOCKETT replied that in that case they would nothave
graving-docks enough to supply the trade, as every carpenter
in Liverpool would want a dock for himself.
Mr. BARBER suggested that some arrangements should
be made with the town council to provide gridirons for the
use of vessels at the other side of the river. Much incon-

venience was caused to vessel;at present owing to the fact,
that from the position of the gridirons at the Liverpool side,
they could not dry soon enough.
Mr. LocxETT observed that large ships would not like to
cross the river without being ballasted, particularly at this
time of the year, and he therefore thought that Mr. Barber's
suggestion would not obviate the evil.
Mr. BARBER differed with Mr. Lockett. Numbers of

vessels would stand on without any ballast at all.
Mr. R. GLADSTONE : Tle T understand that at the other
side of the river the gridiron is more elevated above the level
of low water than is the case in Liverpool ?
Mr. BARBER : Yes. They are there six or seven feet
above the level, and the consequence is that .they can do
four times the work upon the gridiron at the other side than
they can do on any of them at this side.
The CHAIRMAN thought the application should be direct
from the shipowners to the council and not through the
committee. _ _

Mr. ROYDEN said that the whole evil referred to arose
entirely from this fact, that there were not half enough men
in Liverpool to do the work ; and if Mr. Barber had got
more work done on the Cheshire than on this side, it was
in consequence of the number of men he had.
Mr. BARBER replied that it was not.
Mr. ROYDEN continued so say that the evil arose
from the want of men, and the consequence was
that one man was giving a shilling more than the
other until the men, in some cases, got 10s. a-
day. He was sorry to say that some of them had
not fortitude enough to take care of themselves under these
new circumstances, and accordingly the" evil was rendered
still worse, so that in the case of almost every ship there
was a constant begging of time. In some measure Mr.
Barber was right in what he had said ; but there were suffi-
cient graving-docks, if they had sufficient men.
Mr. R. GLADSTONE said that Mr. Royden should recollect
that the parties who applied for the graving-docks, made no
complaint with regard to the want of men.
Mr. BARBER remarked that it was very important to the
commerce of the town, that there should be every oppor-
tunity for doing with dispatch patch-work to vessels.
Mr. ROYDEN did not see even if they were inclined to
let the graving-docks to private individuals, how they could
do it under the present act of parliament.
The CHAIRMAN : You could not do it under the existing
act.
It was referred to the surveyor to see whether the present
gridirons could not be improved.
A letter was read from Mr. Rudd, manager of the Wood-
side Ferry, enclosing a memorial signed by 450 residents of
that locality, praying that the approach to the landing-
stage might be improved.
The memorial will be taken into consideration when the
alterations in the neighbourhood of Nova Scotia and James's-
street arc about being effected.
A letter was read from Mr. John Kennedy, master porter,
urging the propriety of allowing the same person to be and
act as a master-porter and stevedore at the same time. He
stated that he had brought the subject before the sub-com-
mittee before, and argued that the alterations he suggested
would be of great advantage to vessels, particularly to
steamers, which required to be discharged in as brief a time
as possible.
Mr eiliarkea -that the sub-committee
had thought it ad risable that the two offices should
b...p.r atoa, n,enrdinel been passed.
It was thought that the one would be a check upon tile
other, and that the safe and expeditious discharge of cargo
would be by this means best insured They had applied
several times to the council on the subject, and the town
clerk always stated that it would not be advisable for the
council to exercise any control whatever over the steve-
doors, who were an exceedingly mixed holy.
Mr. R. GLADSTONE : Don't you think that in proportion
as you increase the responsibility, you will get a better class
of men to accept of those duties ?
Mr. ROBINSON replied that there was no compulsion on
any shipowner to discharge his ship with these men.
Mr. BARBER said there was one serious objection to em-
ploy the same party in both capacities. It was the duty of
the master-porter to see that the goods were delivered from
the ship in proper order before he received them. A great
great deal of injury was caused by working out, and that
being done to economise labour, if the same party did both
duties, there would be no one to check the proper delivery of
the goods at the ship's side. The injury would not be dis-
covered until the goods were at the warehouse, and then,
the only but troublesome remedy would be to send them
back to the ship, for once they were received within the
warehouse, complaint would be of little avail.
The letter was referred to the master-porters' sub-com-
mittee.
Mr. R. GLADSTONE wished to know why the practice of
giving stamped receipts for dock dues bad been stopped;
the matter had given rise to much complaint outside doors.
The CHAIRMAN replied that they never gave stamped re-
ceipts for dock dues. The paper was merely crossed in order
to prevent fraud, and the practice had been discontinued
for this reason,—that the solicitor thought it exceedingly
doubtful whether or not it might not be construed as coming
within the act.
The Somerrou : And instead of throwing obstacles in the
way of the commission of frauds, it was found to facilitate
them.
Mr. R GLADSTONE thought that if there were any ques-
tion, as to whether or not they were bound to make use of
the penny stamp receipts, the sooner the matter was decided
the better. He did not see why public bodies should be
exemplified, and private individuals prosecuted for not
making use of the penny stamp.
Mr. MALCOMSON said that the public would compel them
to do it. At present, on a man passing entries, they had no