The Northern Daily Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1856-06-03 00:00:00

ROYAL OAK BURIAL SOCIETY

The representatives of this society attended in the
County Court, yesterday, at ten o'clock, before His
Honour, J. Pollock, Esq., judge, for the purpose of hand-
ing. in the draft of rules drawn up, for the proposed
future guidance of the society Mr. H nil, solicitor,
appeared for the committee of investigation, and Mr.
Martin, solicitor, for the office-holders and collectors.
Mr. Joseph Shepherd, Scotland-road, Mr. Curry, and
other members, were in attendance,
Mr. Hull stated that the parties had respectively
agreed upon the rules handed in, with three exceptions.
These were the rules which referred to the holding of
committee meetings in a publichouse, to which the
parties he represented were opposed ; the restriction of
the number of collectors to fifteen, which they considered

should be altered, in order th-it a greater number of
collectors might be appointed, as they believed such
a step to be necessary ; and the continuance of certain
perquisites to the collectors. He stated that Mr. Shep-
herd, who was more fully acquainted with the details,
would explain the points to which the committee

objected.
Mr. Shepherd stated that there was a growing feeling
among working m- n, against having their meetingsheld
in publiehonses, as they believed that such a practice led
to very objectionable awl dangerous results. The com-
mittee were of opinion that the society was one of suffi-
cient importance, to have offices for the conduct of its
own business. The committee were also of opinion that
of the borough, and the growth of
J, rendered the restriction of the number of
ors, open to very strong objection. They also
the propriety of allowing perquisites to col-

the increasing sin

the sock

collec

di~:put~

the transfer of names to

lectors,

new books, fees for turnisliMg cards, and fees for copies
of the rules. They contended that the society itself paid
for the cards, and that members were therefore indi-

itlually entitled to reedy

a card each, without paying

for it a second timo. They conceived that it was neces
vary every member should be provided with a copy of
the rules, and that the demand of a perquisite threw an
obstacle in the way of members possessing copies, inas-
much as a great many members belonged to the humbler
classes of society, to whom even twopence were an
object.
His Honour: Suppose members were furnished in
the first instance, each with a copy of the rules gratuit-
ously, but if any member lost his copy by carelessness,
or wanted a second copy ?
Mr. Shepherd said in such instances, he admitted,
that the card ought to be paid for.
His Honour : As regards the first point, which is
really the most serious of all, that, regarding the place
of meeting. Is the objection founded upon a general
dislike to publichouses, as leading to expenditure in

drink?

Mr. Shepilerd : To expenditure and drink, and dissi•
pation which necessarily follows. I may here explain,
as having been connected for 25 years with working
men's societies, that they have all generally felt the evils
of meeting in publichouses, but there being no places
for such societies convenient to meet in at a reasonable
expense, the generality of such societies have been
compelled to take refuge in some publichonse, or other-
wise they would have no place to meet in at all. We
_ .

think, now, that this society is of sufficient magnitude in

itself, to warrant its removal to respectable offices. We
are in a position to pay a respectable rent for oar offices,
and we consequently think there ought to be no temp-
tation offered to members.
His Honour : Has the habit been to have refresh-
ments at the meetings of the committee ?

Mr. Shepherd : Not during the committee hours.
His Honour : But I suppose it has frequently
happened, that members of the committee sat after_
wards ?

Mr. Shepherd : Decidedly, and stopped all night

sometimes.
Mr. Curry

That I deny—t deny the stopping all

Mr. Shepherd : I don't allude to Mr. Curry's house in
particular.

His Honour : You are talking of the evils which
sometimes arise from such a practice generally.
Mr. Shepherd : Yes, believing that the same evils to
some extent exist in regard to this society. Mr. Shep-
herd also urged that the present sub-treasurer should be
subject to the same annual election, as future sub-
treasurers.

His Honour: You have the power by the first rule of
removing him at a general or special meeting, which has
virtually the same effect. His Honour asked what might
he earned by an active, intelligent collector, under the
rule of the 25 per cent.
__

Mr. Shepherd said, the collectors at present upon an
average would make lOs or L 3 a-week, by dilligent
work. Some made much more than that, but some
made less.

His Honour : The real welfare of the society, or at
least its progress, must in a great degree depend upon the
collectors. They therefore must be, and ought to be,
respectable men, and thoroughly trustworthy ; and if
men are respectable and trustworthy, they ought to he
well paid. How they are to be paid is another ques-
tion. Undoubtedly you ought not to expect to get men
who, from their character, intelligence, and activity,
would be really valuable, without a proper remunera-
tion,

Mr. Shepherd said it was the desire of the committee
id members generally, that the colLetors should be

7ronerly paid

Mr. 'Alartin replied to the objections on the part
of the collectors, &c. He contended that the colleemrs
and Mr, Curry should be placed in 'the same position
-ules as under the old. He denied
vn by Mr. Shepherd, from the

under the new r
the inrerenee dr

fact of the pia

of meeting being a public house.
"here were rooms fitted up there as offices, for the
society. Members did not go there to pay their sub-
scriptions, as the rule was that the collectors should
receive them. It was not suggested that the house was
conducted improperly, or that the relatives or friends of
deceased, who came there for their money, were induced
or invited to drink.
His Honour said there was no allegation of the kind.
Mr. Martin said, if any of the collectors or committee
who met in the house did occasionally drink a glass
there, he did not think it was a matter which called for
interference. He denied that the allowances to the
collectors could be considered as perquisites, but con-
tended that they formed a portion of the salary, fairly
earned and paid. The collectors who bad to go into the
country were entitled to receive some allowance beyond
those who collected in the town. The penny charged
on a card was only charged when the old card had been
filled up, and a new one was furnished. Only one copy
of the rules was charged for, even where half a dozen
members of a family received them. With regard to
the transfer money, the collectors' books were audited
every half year, and new books had to be prepared.
The collectors had to transfer, from the old books, the
whole of the names, streets, and numbers, and to calcu-
late and transfer the arrears owed by each member,
which was a work of considerable labour. For this I
they received lOs per 1,000 names, including streets,
numbers, &e., which would be found, on calculation, '
to be below the sum allowed for legal copying.
Another allowance objected to was, what was
called Thursday money. The collectors had to
come to the office every Thursday, to have their
books and the amount of claims called over.
It had been the pra:tiee for a considerable time that
each of the fifteen collectors should take it in turn to
assist the secretary in calling over the books and enter-
ing the amounts of claims in the claim books. For this
duty lOs a week was paid to the secretaries in rotation,
and if the practice were discontinued it would be
necessary to have an assistant secretary or some such
person appointed, while he contended that the collectors,
from their knowledge of the books, could do the work
much more rapidly and effectively. In all these matters
he argued that the collectors should be allowed to
remain in the position which they had for so long a
period occupied. Finally, he contended that if any
increase hereafter became necessary in the number of
collectors, the proper way to make the change would be
by calling a special meeting of the members, for which
there was machinery provided in the rules.
Mr. Hull briefly replied to the arguments of Mr.
Martin, and urged upon the court the points already
stated.

His Honour said be presumed the intention was, after
he had looked over the rules and signed them, as having
been submitted to him, to lay them before a general
meeting of the members, and then forward them for the
approval of Mr. Tidd Pratt.
Mr. Shepherd replied in the affirmative, and stated
that the next general meeting of the society would be
held in July.
His Honour said he would therefore look over the
rules, and state the results of his consideration within
ten days or a fortnight.
All Parties then withdrew.

Mn. BARON PLATT. —We are happy to learn that the
health of this learned and estimable judge is much
improved.

NEW SERJEANTS AT LAW.— On Tuesday next, Mr.
Ballantine and Mr. Parry will be called within the
bar cf the Court of Common Pleas, having obtained the
coif,

COLONIAL APPOINTMENTS.—Mr. Christopher Temple has
bean appointed a puisne judge of tho Supreme Court of
Ceylon ; Mr. W. G. Forbes has been appointed govern.
ment agent and fiscal for the southern province ; Mr. W.
Morris has been appointed government agent and fiscal
for the eastern province.—Civil Service Gazette.
~. .._

.-1 he Limerick Obs6rver mentions

as a rumour that Mr. Smith O'Brien's return to Ireland
will be delayed for some time by a tour on the Continent
with his eldest son, and it is lUrther said that his arrival
at Cahirrnoyle, his seat in the county of Limerick, will be
strictly private. If this latter rumour be true, the good
taste evinced by Mr. O'Brien cannot be too highly com-
mended.