The Northern Daily Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1856-02-23 00:00:00

NORTHERN TIMES.-LIVERPOOL! SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 23, 1856

laidupon them a light burthen, :they ;will have a heavy
one laid updn them by the powers above. (Hear, hear,
and cheers.) I should like to know what they will have'
to fcongratulate themselves for ? (Hear, Heir.) I shall
pasi over, sir, the 'subject Of our title, beeaUse we have
not that to deal with here-rand it 'the Maneheater manu-
facturers have such .a very contemptuous opinion of dun
title, Why don't they try it? (Cries of Hear, hear.)
Courts of law are .opeti to them aS *ell d's to the Merchants
who tried,the question semayears ago; and if they have
Suet' confidenee in the opinion of their town-clerk, who
Made .a:Sp'eech df an hour and a half long yesterday;
why do .hey opt instruct hint to dispute the title in some
of her Majesty 'S courts of law, where the question would
Very abort be brought to a decision ? (Hear, hear.), But it
is something new, something dangcnittS,, 3611160)1kt 6tnin-'
ens,- when a title which has been again and again disputed,
and again and again iffirined in Courts ot'justice, now to be
dealt with by an ex pose facto .law throtigh the '.medium
of government and parliament, Ifsuch be the,case; iraw
man's property, or any nutnber of men's property, which
has been, proved over and over again to bc"perfectly good.
and valid in title is thus to be. dealt Withe.what man is
safe? What man in looking at the of property

. - .
can say that on some occasion 01,A:1th-et-fit may not be eon-,
sidered for the benefit 9f the ;public tht; be shoold part
:with it---atifl What is his Security ? (Rear, hear.) The
object is. to got all the. control and minagernent of the,
ports ;of the k7ngdom into the haids of the:governnient,
and to have their where' revenues uncontrolled by Parlia-
-rnent,, Oita to-wield a vast 'exereise of patronage and
political power. , (Hear, hear.) why, air, supposing This
bill Carried. and the revenue and expenditure in thehands
of the government, then 'see' the' intitienee Which *lithe
exercised upon our ,parliameritary 'elections ".7 ' - (Hear.)
Look althe State or facts which exists
,in. such boroughs
a3,Chatharii; ROCheSter; Devonport, and>thers where
large .covernment NI orks are' altried on and : large
patronage exercised. .We simply have the members for
those boroughs the creatures-of the ministry of the day.—
Whatever ministry happens to, be its place, whether'Whig
or Tory, the elections which take place folloWs the career
of the ministry of the day. Ate we to turn Liverpool into
a rotten borough of that deseription ? Is it tiir that our
ancestors and predecessors ha've hibehredancl,:toiled, and
rendered Liverpool the glory of the commercial world as
she. now exists. (Cheers.) t say that wo should as one man
raise our Voices against it..and use every lawful means to
make our voices heard—(Bear, hear, and cheers)—and to
avert what cannot but be considered a seilions injurY to
the town and to the commeri e. which 'she carries on.:
(Cheers.) New, it is a good maxim which, advises peoPle
to let well aldne., All those who frequent this ;pert of
ours, Liverpool, are unanimous in giving us credit for:the'
accommodation she posseises, and also
.for the cheapness
of that accominodatinn, in Which re*ect she is Siiperior
to all, or nearly all thei_portS %l the MOO Kingdom. .I
was told the other day hy..a, highly respectable merchant
cif Liverpool,. who imports teas from China, .that he.
II nports them into LiVerpool,,notwithstanding all the dock
dues which are so much 'complained or, that .he can pay
the dues, warehouse the gdods hero,- tenet thee& on by rail-
way to.. London,- and sell them' in the ' London' market
Cheaper, in conseqpnee of the low. Charges here, than if
he brought them direct into Lon.don.., (Oheers.)' But. it.
appears ;that we haYe sortie formldable'riYals,:and among
them the ancient and loyal 'city' of Chester, (Laughter.)
Mr. Lowe tell&hs that a great deal of the trade of Liver-
pool flows, under the walls of that ancient city.
(Laughter.) Sir, I cannot help thinking, from that and
other fteints in Mr. Lowers : speech, that the ancient
authority he consulted on many ofthese points most have
been his grandmother. (Ilear, hear, and laughter.) . That
ancient and venerable lady, no doubt, has her reminis-
cences Of the time when the 'packet-boat sailed from
Parkgate to Ireland ; • and .vessels, came down the ,Dee
from the Walls of Chester with banners floating and music
playing, carrying the Droduce of the dairy farms of the
county of Qhester, to feed the appetites of the hoe unable
corporation of' the city of London. - (Laughter.) One
.would imagine that if all that great wealth flowed into the.
city of Chester,in consequence Of the enormous charges
of the port of Liverpool, .the :citizens of Chester would
be amongst the foremost to hail this bill: as• the greatest
boon'they could receive. But what was the fact P The
citizens of Chester 'met the other day And unanimously
determined to oppose the hill by every means in their
power. Sir, we lindw something of what government
managernent.4s. (Cries of hear, hear, and cheers.) We
know something of the way in wh ch government conducts
its own affairs. (Hear, hear.) et theM learn •to do
it
their own business better before t ey begin to undertake
the business Of Others. (Hear, hear) I will give you an
instance of government :management as respects goods
passing 'through the port of Liverpool, Which carte tinder
my own knowledge. Some time ago a transport vessel
going to the seat of,War lay in the Cove.of Cork. There
was a. quantity of ordnance stores to be conveyed to her
from:the Tower of London. Now, ever,y, man oCeomnion
sense who knew anything about the way of sendinaoods
to Cork-would naturally have taken them to the wharf
within a stone's throw of the Tower, and 'put them
on board the 6ork„ steamer, , which -would hive tie-
liveredthetn alongside the vessel in the Cove of Cork
ate!' expense of abOut 253. per ton. . That , is • not the
government way of doing bitstheis. They
..have a very
much more magnificent way than that: - They had the
roods carted through the streets of London up to Cam-
'den Town. . There. they are put into the London and
NorthiWesterdrailway. By the railway they come dolvii
to Llverpoot ' ''There they are put into carts. again, and
taken to the Clarence dabk. Thei4e they are Put -on hoard
the steamer,' and conveyed to the ditY'of Dublin. There.
they, are again . taken :out, put into carts. and carriedacross the city to the railway station., 'They are put into
the Great Southern and Western railway, and carried to
the the city of 'Cork.' (taughter.) They are not,:however,
yet at there place of destination;_ they have, still nine
miles of land-carriage before 'them. ' They are put into
carts Again and taken to the quays of the Cove; put into
lighters, and conveyed to the vessel destined for them.-
(Great laughter). Now, sir,,my informant, tells Me; that
the , land-carriage of nine miles,:,_ from Cork' to Coe,
actually cost More money than the' whole transit :Tr
Londomtbi Cork WOuld have taken by the ordinary you .
.(Laughter:). . These:be thy gods,. oh (Cheer .)
Israel I
le
TheSe Are the men to conduct the affairs 'of liiVerpthil o

teach us how to manage our, port. and 011ie aecOm" =da-
tion to shipping! (Hear, hear.) Sir, one Balaklava Is
quite enough!' (Oreaescheering.) They who want to
know what government have dorie, should look at
the colonies. (Hear, hear.)• Why; governments, with
their gross mismanagement and ignOrance, and
bliindering, have driven the colonies very close to the verge
Of rebellion ; and it is only since the colonies have been
left to manage their own affairs_thatthey have:succeeded
and are prosperous. (Rear, hear.) . Look at what Live/.;
pool has done for hbrself ! ' Our gracious Queen, a fe
years ago, honoured. us by a visit to this'
.port, which 'she
had never before seen. There was not a heart In the
breast of any man connected, with Liverpool 'which did
not throb 'higher than before, when her . most.. Gracious
Majesty was seen in her progress through, our stredta.
Dismal as was the Weather, wet'as was the day", many of
us were glad to, get soaked to the skin in ,rain in order
that we might catch a glimpse of- her countenanCe'as, ahe
went through our streets. She went on the. river. She
went up and down in a steamer appointed to receive her,
and saw the .various works actually completed. and id
progress. She saw the vast fcirest of masts extending for
miles—she saw the:noble avenues through which the com+
merce of nearly the whole world pours in a eeaseless tide.
She Saw the vast piles of warehoiases,where riches almost
beyond price are accun3ulatect:for.the benefit ,of the World
at large. Bet, eh, sir, 1 'fear,. that in the train were some
who; looked with gangrened and jealous eyes at all the(
wealth, success, and prosperity. Tnere were some who saw
that in all the arrangements .connected with the great extent
of commerce carried on here, there was poWer, there was
place, there was patronage, there was.political eapitalsaw.
it with envious eyes,and said, that, muat.be ours—locat
management is all very good; but government management
is hetter... There is something to be made out of
something which we. can get hold of, which we, can make*
use of politically. Aye,. and there' was something 'More.'
.It may-have been, if not then, at. least: since; 'that some;
disappointed' politican, whpse relation with, Liierpool'
did not cause to an end of the most satisfactory 'Char-
acter, may have in this' manner wreaked his vengeance
upen those with whom he had had a former connection
(Hear, hear.) Sir, on looking•at the bill, and 'the long
speech of Mr. LOwe, and comparing. one with another,
I, say that if the bolts were shot by Mr. Lowe, they were .
moulded by different hands. (Hear, hear:). ;I, gay the
voice is the voice of • Jacob, 'but the hanls are
the hands, of Esau. '(Rear, hear, and cheers.)
Sir, it is not my intention, to detain the meeting, as there
are other gentlemen.who have to speak after me, but I
must'say that, if the government are really serious in
their" intention to takeaway the burthens on shipping, we
need not go .far to•pbinf out some abuses , which they
would do well to consider before meddling with what they
do not understand.; )( will tell you-one—the British Con-
sular System throughout the world,rwhickis becoming a
crying disgrace, and afcrying nuisance, and it is high time
that it should be chaa;ged. (Hear,. hear.) Who doesmot
recollect having seen in the papers, the other; day, of a
gross attempt at *hat I am really ashamed to characterise
as fcaud, though it• deserves 'no' better name, of a consul
lnPernainbuCco insisting on the ,eaptain of a Liverpool
ship to bring in his vessel over the bar, when it was
scarcely possible-for-her to pass it, even if empty, And
insisting, on, herillscharging her clirgd there,:that'he
he rafght-get the salvage, amounting to some thousands of
pounds on it. (Heari-hear) A like piece of plunder was
perpetratel on a previous ship, 'lait'7Captain Davey,. to;
his honour,.diSregardedthe threatsheld over hini, brought.
;his ship home, Under great risks,. and saved to the'otinerSll
and the nnderwriters a large sum. of money, fat whiCh he.';
;was 'justly rewarded and complimented. (Rear, hear; •
and cheers.)- Lei them begin to .change ..this -system
of tyrannical: and grinding - oppression, ,before they
attempt . to relieve, -a- portion of . the .shipping; inte-
reat Iby'• the spoliation of the. just and ~lawful
rights of Other 'people.. (Cheers) 'Look agaix,i;at :our
'
local marine,board, It consists ofgentlemen
of Liverpool,. who. devote their tithe and influence to the
discharge of' its duties, and it was only this Morning that
I saW, by one"of the, local: papers, that they haVe
mAnondsllvyhsyer in aheir resignation to the-Board of Trade.
ence'and the practiaed by
ly
fact, that local- Mliids'
dBaininnimibheaicahusie.iosfothcoisn'sathoanmtirinabl interfer..•
the Board of .Trade. (Hear, hear.) It would ,seem, in
bat everything fe;
own aintrawirhsiewhitvh:laitrabltuon;loenrdinuttaoiirersto
,40a
t 0
00 troohnadvoen,,,,,wohpeorritrhitiliisnatoemres(t),r,
the, world is centered, Mid. men who canuotinanage their
haffigahirtsitoererofot,r out. ' (Laughter.) It is
dictate to us the
events one freedom is left usi,whether we in manage our
(Flear;hear.) At
.all
rt hat will
.he the next, thing attack p
we have
ed,i butaioltark ,ds we
bertv.of seeelt left.' I; suppose
have it, we Will use it on all proper occasions. (Cheers.)
I see among the various coats of arms which decorate this
hall, one upon which my eye has always dwelt with plea-
sure since
.childhood—" Deus nobis haw otia fecit "—God
has bestowed these blessings upon us. Sir, Providence

•
has. done much for this noble town. He 'has bestowed
on us one of the finest harbours in the world, and He
infused into the breasts of those who went before us, a
spirit of enterprise and a eptiait of self-sacrifice, to make
the best use or those noble gifts of nature. They have
been well used.. if success is the measure of the propriety
of conduct of those who • *tilt before us, we have it.
Where is the port in the World that Can compete with
Liverpool,. 'except New York, in 'the progress of its
commerce?... Every fifteeri , years, within the last
century and a half; the .commerce of this:, port has
doubled itself, and If it. has - been so • -up to the
present time, what will it be fifty years hence ?
hear.) Who can set bounds to the progress of our trade)
With a grosting intelligent-people, and-with a manufaCtur-
ing population at our back, coming their manufactures to

every quarter of the civilised World, who can prescribe a
limit to the domnierea of Liverpool ss (ilear, hear.) The
,day Allan -not come when.its noble efforts;. hitherta:. blessed
'With sach abundant success. are to he controlled, dwarfed
anA, destroyed; by per Sons *he do not understand the nature
of wliat- therare doing.. With unhallowed hawk they are
interfering -W;th the 'pillars of. that noble temple Which
science, niinufthe'ture awl Commerce ,has raised around us.
Le:.itbeim.take care, that in. pulling the temple down they
do nnr, nring,rnin on their own heads. (Applause.) ' •

The resolution was carried by mho:lain
Mr. R. A. Maefie proposed the nest resolution. II
they had been addressed by the highest' representatii(

the county interest, if he 'Might use the term,
himself also an honourable
.member of the banking
interest. They had been, addressed, also, by representaOes
of 'the shin owning interest, by merchants whom' they
all—respected, and to whose judgment they had always
bowed, and they had also been addres,
of two professions, one of them the law; .
might permit him, a humble manufacturer, to addreidthem
also a few Words. (Hear, hear.) He the more' readily
addressed 'them, because, as a manufacturer, he might
perhaps ha enabled to say a few reords•whiah might be of
advantage to his brother manufacturers of IttatiChester and
that district. In his speech at the Manchester meeting, the
May 4 of Salford said that there, was soarcely a person who
went along the streets, and. certainly no female, however
humble, did.not contribute in her dress to the tel.. levied by
the eon-oration of Liverpool. (Laughter.) Now, what
it he should say that the firm with,which he was connected
paid dues, or,- at all 'events, imported and consumed pads
that were liablelo duties many times, more than were paid
by rill the ladies and females of . Manchestere—(heare
Ivoir)--arid., yet he did not complain. IF the
question was one' for s an adjustment of rates,
he Might Say—" Well, let us examine them, and remedywhat is partial ;" but what they were now slaked to do Wall
to cancel acknowledged rights. They were asked to consent
to be defrauded of property which they. felt 'had been
secured to them by just and lawful means. (Hear, hear.)
He had met no one in the town that had disputed the right
of the eorporatioti to the ding, 'though one friend had
certainly said that he would , like to be quit of them.
(Laughter.) Perhaps they would all like tole qnit of
them. (Hear, hear.) But that was a different thing in
helping other parties to do wrong, to obtain for themselves
that end. There was unanimity in the meeting, and there.
was unanimity in the town, on the subject, but there wale
if anything, still greater unanimity among the press on
(hear bees.), —by which the hill was, in the Most indignani
and forcible terms, denounced as a measure of spoilation
and robbery, and in direct violation of the most sairedt
principles of the congtitution. atm, hear.) Pre referred
to that unanimity • among the press, because he wished
to suggest to the government, who had made theinselves
responsible s
,for the •meashre, ',that when those leaders of
public opinion who sat in judgment on then and things
thus 'spoke, they should be cautious . how • they look upon
any bill' of which themselveS were snspiciour. It was a
measure of injustice, and in that opinion he believed everyy.
mail would agree: (Cheers.) Ite Could not distinguish
between the rights of • property held by individuals and
,that held by a number-of individuals —a public body. - No
later would dare draw a distinction between them, but
the amphibious bsings, half lawyers half merchants, who
.presided at the board of trade, had the temerity to attempt it.
.The darporation were the trustees of the public, and they had
been .faithful to their trust. (Hear, hear ) He would not
-detain them by entering into a calculation of the extra
burthans which Would be thrown on Chem if they were
deprived of this property, bitt 'it was a question which they
should well ponder. If the dues amounted to £lOO,OOO,
and the `population were taken at 400,000, the-less would
be ss. a ydar to each tndivicluali and ,that loss would fall.
chiefly upon the poor and induitrious elasees.. Mr.
Mac& then proceeded to enumerate what the 'Corporation
had done.for the people in; the establishment of baths, the,
opening of parks, and' the collehticia of public libraries for
their use, and urged that' while nothing had been done for
thos& who Were -oalleci the better claims, the. corporation
had shown their. regard for their trust' by Using all their
means chiefly for the interest of the pox. He then continued
to say that the greater part of the trade of this town was in
counection with, the docks. Nearly all the, traffic 'that'
passed through the streets was likewise Connected with: the
docks I therefore, he contended 'hat it-Was not the trade of
Vie town of Liverpool, but was the trade of the whole nation
—nay, he might say of the whole world. There was.
another absurdity in the case which they bad to defend, and
that was—there was a difference .to: be made between pro-
perty held by a many, and property held by a few. He
would say that there could be no difference; and taking
Property under such ''e'reurnstancee, :was doubling' the
injury, But the government was going to do so. They
were-going-tti--take away -the dues- which - were their own
exclusive rights. He sheeld call it the plea of the smuggler,'
as there Could be no difference iu the dealing with one,
'cely made, he was going' to say, the robbery
property more than another; and a 'government doing so,
greater. (Applause.) But the resolution he was about to
as
(Here Mr.
nr.ecmestafirye
thate:l°dht syrh:Osstio
.udstPid eoo:c.niyirhObirillec arblieeaddf tui'ntw.a
ohr advertising
columns) The first subject touched upon in that resolution
is the docks. The Manchester men are men who have been
in the habit of going forward ; but in this instance such
did not appear-to be the case. They complain that we
take the dues to widen our 'streets and improve our town.
He (Mr. Macfie) would tell those gentlemen that it was all
for, .their benefit,, for if they had not had to convey
their cotton and timber through thosteeets from the docks,
Liverpool. would not have been called upon to widen the
'streets, The making of good approaches to the docks was
as neceissary.as it was to make their land-roads to the town.
(tiPplause.) Now, he would ask those gentlemen to give
him the definition of a port. What is a pert? It was
not •"merely the quays and warehouse, but a port Is the
nucleus of different matters, , streets, lanes, quays,
and all the accommodation necessary for carrying on the
trade. Another complaint was, that they were about to
purchase Birkenhead, just as if the whole nation ,would not
receive the benefit of the two sides of the Mersey being
united in one.. But he would ask them how they were to,
carry .on the trade of this great town-=how were thei' to
find accommodation—if they were.not allowed to retain the
dues ? They claimed these in fairness and as a matter of
right. ,He denied that the corporation had been guilty of
extravagance, and said on that head they had a right to
judge of the future by the past. He thought that they had
i right to apply to their friends in- the northern counties—
he meant Lancashire, Cheshire, and the west of Yorkshire
—to give
Lt
veemr
ptohoel i rassu
epvpeorrtth,
easy
ctohutte'
d wbeereinasGdleaespglyowin, teforr-
osperity depended as much on the prosperity
torhefsetierdLiPiyil'e. as 'Liverpool's prosperity depended
en them. lie then stated that he remembered
a person, quite a swell, 'but not in that town,
employment was ? He being a great
dandy, 10h ! I employ myself as a physi-
eiinnud.gl"'7 shkßiesudrte't vphlhayatt was,hwais enn'o t the question—the question is, did
any one employ him ? (Laughter.) He would ask Mr.
Lowe who employed him to set the Liverpool people right ?
(Hear, hear.) Where has he ever tried his hand at it
before ? (Laughter.) Has he tried •it in London ? Let
him try what be can dd there, and then he might come here
and give us his experience, and let us know what he pur-
poses to do for us. gr. Macfie concluded amil considerable
cheering by propotitig the resolution,. which, he stated, had
his most cordial support.

by representatives
it finally, they

Mr. Charles Saunders seconded the resolution, expressing
a hope that when the statements which were put forward
there that day with such truthfulness, as well as unanimity,
went forth, the wonder would not be at the effrontery of
Liverpool in the defence of its rights, so much as at the
effrontery of Mr. Lowe and his colleagues in bringing before'
parliament snch a bill of spoliation, the introduction of
howereri he, hoped the good sense of the House of
Commons would reject. (Chaers.)
1 The resolution WAS unanimously carried.

Mi. William Rathbone came torwardy to propose the next
♦resolution, and was received with Fond applause: Having
read the resolution, he said it was one.tvhich scarcely needed
;an-old stager like him to come forward to support it. None
iwho knew anything of the mismanagement of central boards
Ivrould*ish tO'see their local managetnebt. transferred: Ile
!was rather.surpriSedat the modesty, not •useally belonging
to members
Board of Trade,
_but ha was still' •rnore::Surprised at his
his.-inkfession, of the vice-president tr.ihe.
•
"moralittog
He shaitcl.io .thought..lawyer—no acitOliwyer—wriuld havaxentared to say that
n
if property belonged to a corporation it_raight be spoliated,
but iT itlieTOnged to an individual it, was safe. •That was
not his,(Mr: Rathbooe's)
.morality, and he hopedit.wer
be the morality of those. around him. . All :the) leasehold
property of Liverpool was corp Orate pioperty, and would Mr.
Lowe say .that if the goyernment were hupgry, they might
slip into that?' 'lie Would ask hoW hiS.,friends ofithe•Lon7
tion'iind,Nottli Western Great Western, and Great Northern
Railway companies,which were all '
corporations would like a-
hungry government ,to take hold of their inilliOns which
were engaged in those lines ? (Hear, hear.) Yetit ttetually
ainPutited to that. lie would say-a word .o his-friends
Manchester.. They had a corporate interest:in their gas
works, by which alllli&irriprovernentit in Manchester were
Carried, 0,44 He chOnld liketo know what the gentlemen 1:4,
Marnhestm whei,wera'so;lrety ivieicenii4gainst Liverpool-..
(4)Y, God knew—be did not)--would say, if a hungry
government wished to have a pull at their gas works. ( Hear,
hear.) They had just. as much right to the gas works of
Manchester as to the town dues of Liverpool. (Hear, hear.)
He was one of those who contested the question whether