The Express.
London, England, 1861-02-06 00:00:00

(Stamped, ld. Additional.) [TWOPENCE,

the cwilised world. lu conclusion, he expressed his regret
at the lose which the house had sustained by the death of
Lord Aberdeen, to whose memory he paid an eloquent and
feeling tribute.
The address warn then agreed to.
Their lordships adjourned at 20 minutes to 8 o'clock.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—TUKADAY, Fee. S.
Ibe members of the lower boltae began to assemble soon
after 1 o'clock. and at the time the Speaker entered the
house about 100 gentlemen were in their places. Amongst
them were Viinount Palmerston, Mr. Cowper, Mr. Hub-
bard, Mr. Kinnaird. Mr. Scholeheld. Mr. Kinglake, Mr. S.
Fitzgerald, Mr. D. Seymour, Mr. Alderman %Jolson'. Mr.
Headlem, Sir W. G. Harter, Lord Mothers, Mr. Crawford,
Mr. Scully, Mr. Roebuck, Mr. L. King, Mr. W. Williams,
Mr. Mellor, Sir F. Trelawny, Mr. Stanfield, Mr. Crawley,
Sir M. Seymour, Lord Henley. Mr. Wrltl, Mr. Spooner,
Mr. White, Mr. Bentinck, Sir H. Willoughby, Mr. G.
Manly, Mr. Brady, Admiral Walcot, Mr. Grew. n, Colonel
Sykes, Mr. Forster, Mr. Baines, Mr. Westliend, Sir C.
Douglas, Mr. H. Radii., Mr. Halliburton, Mr. Hadfield,
Colonel W. Patten, Mr. Henley, Lord Ferruoy, Mr. Crau-
ford, Sir F. Goldamid, Mr. Kershaw, Mr. C. Forrester, Sir
G. Bowyer, Mr. Braid, Ac., Ac.
The Speaker took his seat at the table at a quarter to
two o'clock, and received the congratulations of several boo.
members on both sides of the house.

At a quarter after two Colonel Cliffonl, the Yeoman
Usher of the Black Rod, nppeand at the bar, and gave the
expected summons for the house to attend in the Howe of
Lords. The Speaker was immediately followed by Lord
Palmerston, and moot of the members present accompanied
the right hon. gentleman.
On the return of the Speaker, the sitting was rue-
pended.
The house resumed at a quarter to four o'clock.
The SPEAKER announced that during the recess he bad
issued his writ for the election of members fur several places
where vacancies had oissurred.
BOROUGH OF SLIGO.
The SPEAKER announced that he had received notice
that it was not intended to proceed with the petition aping
the return of Mr. liUDonongli for Sligo.—Order discharged.

Mr. DISRAELI admitted that the reception by the
house of the late Reform Bill of the government was not
such as to encourage them in further etforta ; however,
therefore, they might regret the position of the question,
they could not accuse the government of having violated
its trust. But there was another subject which was full of
perplexity and apprehension. The general position of our
foreign policy was one which we could not regard without
anxiety. He did not accuse the government of withholding
information ; on the contrary, it was from the information -
given them that their perplexities arose. But he demanded
that the government should declare its intentions so
that the country could understand them. At present the
country was so mystified by the official declarations as
almost to regret the secret policy of former times,
which
wad at, least a system. From amemences the public might
believe that our relations with France, so far from being
friendly and satisfactory. as announced in the speech, were
most unfriendly and unsatisfactory. He had hitherto
supported the French alliance, and saw no rea,on
for regretting that support. But that alliance
could not subsist without great forbearance and
mutual sacrifices'. The conditions of both thew
bad been observed by the late government, and
violated, as be contended, by the noble lord, who,
on entering office, adopted a line of conduct which France
believed contrary to her best interests. The noble lord, in
his action in Italy, had professed the unity and independ-
ence of Italy. Was Italy united and independent? Borne
was in possession of the Gauls, and Venetia of the Gerrnamr.
If Italy was to be free and united, it could only be by the
sword of France. But could such an effort, and the semi.
flea involved by the unity of Italy, be made by France
without the expectation of some result? That result
would be an alliance offensive and defensive with
Italy—an alliance which France would then be justified in
assuming. The Emperor would thus find himself at the
head of a million of bayonets, and would be in a position to
make those further clianges which be would not then fore-
shadow. This would be the result of the policy into which
our government had urged the government of France,
which at first was unwilling to undertake it. If the noble
lord had wished to effect the unity of Italy we should not
have contented ourselves with moral influence, we should
bars adopted material measures, which would have
given us a real claim on the gratitude of the
Italians. Under such circumstances be did not want
information, but he did want explanation, believing
that our position was one of great danger. Either
we mug hill back upon such an arrangement as the
treaty of Zurich or the far more perilous situation of Italy
united by the sword of France, and with its resources in
the power of France. Either of these contingencies in- '
volved a moat serious responsibility on the part of the
government which bad brought about such a position of
affairs. But beyond this it was impossible to say what the
anarchical elements now evoked in Europe would produce.
Those elements have been called forth while our govern-
ment were pursuing the phantom of a united Italy. What
were they to understand? The information they bad received
had only bewildered them ; the more they were told the
lees they seemed to know ; and especially in our relations
with France they ought to be told whether the two nations
were in Italy rivals or confederates,.
Lord J. RUSSELL repeated that the policy announced
and followed by the government in Italy was simply that
of leaving the Italians to settle their own affairs. The
idea of a united and independent Italy was then, as it had
always been, a subject of derision with Mr. Disraeli,! who
could even find no king to praise but the King of Naples.
He entered at length into the position of affairs
in Italy, defending at ones the policy of the
government and the conduct of the King of Sar-
dinia. Everything in Naples (said his lordship) had fallen
into a state of anarchy. What would have been the con-
sequence if that state of anarchy had continued but
that other powers would then have said they were willing
to allow Italy to arrange her own affairs, and see what a
state of anarchy has happened in Naples. The King is
unable to maintain his authority, • military chief is master
of the state, everything is in a state of confusion—now is
the time for Europe to interfere to establish the Pope in
all his state, to put Austrian garrisons into several other
towns, and show that the dream of Italy is but •
dream and delusion that never can be realised in
the face of Europe. While in that position I think
I the King of Sardinia could do no other than declare
I himself at once to be as deeply interested and en-
gaged, both himself and state, to be Italy's champion,
as to march an army into Naples and establish that unity
which had so long been the wish of his own people in all
parts. But that act of his did not pass unnoticed. The
right hoe. gentleman says that on the 27th of October I
wrote a despatch justifying that proceeding. But that was
not the first thing that had taken place. The other powers
of Europe adopted that practice which the right hon. gentle-
man says is new in this instance, namely, although their
affairs were generally conducted with the utmost
secrecy they put forth • declaration signed by their
ministers of foreign affairs which was intended
to have influence over the affairs of Europe, and
in this case Russia. and Prussia had both thought
it necessary to administer a lecture to:the Kiug of Sardium,
to point out to hire that he led departed from the heir of
nations, and that such an outrage was never known in the
history of Europe. Well, those proceedings were calculated
to have great effect, and the Emperor of the French at the
same time withdrew his minister. Well, I felt certainly,
and so did her Majesty's government, that the King of Sar-
diuia was defending a just cause when he so took up arms ;
said it WIN impossible, 1 think, having regard to our
dignity, that we should keep entire silence while Russia
sod Prussia and Austria and France were doing all in their
power, aa far as moral influence could extend, to extin-
guish the freedom and independence of the new Italian states.
(Hear, beer.) Sir, it was my duty, not only to write a desixa.ch
to our minister at the Court of Turin, but to publish it,
as Russia and Austria had published theirs. The right
hon. gentleman says the Italians owe ea no gratitude. I
believe their own feelings are very different. (Hear, hear.)
I believe their feeling is that having the moral influence
of England in their favour, while the moral influence of
every other power in Europe was against them, was of great
value and importance. (Hear, hear.) Sir, 1 have already
said we never put forward the principle of the unity of
Italy ; but if unity under one constitutional monarchy is
necessary, as the Italians think, to secure their indepen-
dence, we should be the last persons to say we should inter-
fere to prevent them accomplishing their wishes. (Hear,
hear.) The right hon. gentleman says that we are DOW/between
two dangers, and these dangers are either that the treaty
of Zurich will Le carried into effect, or that on the other
hand the sword of France will decide iu favour of Italian
unity, and that the result will follow so great that
he does not venture to specify what it will be. But
lie was not talking of the actual present state of
Europe, but he is borrowing from his own imagination
schemes and designs which he thinks will be carried into
effect. Now, I disagree with him on that subject. We
are not acting against the wishes of • people, and the only
danger we have to fear is that of war limekiln; out in
Europe. I hope we may succeed in preserving peace. We
mayfail ; but if we do I hope we may be treated with the
same courtesy by the right hon. gentleman which we
showed to him when lie failed in 1859. Now, I have
to consider the alternatives which the right hon. gentleman
spoke of. One is, that the King of the Two Birdies should
be restored ; that the Pope should have all his dominions
restored to him, except, I believe, the Romagna ; that an
Austrian archduke should reign iu Tuscany and Modena.
All this is very inconsistent. With regard to the Italian
feeling, it is not likely that such a scheme could be carried
out except by force of areas, and ageing the wish of the
Emperor of the French, as well as ourselves, who is deeply
pledged to that, cad he repeated that pledge yesterday, and
he said, what is perfectly true, that acting on the
principle of non-intervention may give rise to ex-
cesses which those who confined themselves to looking
on might deeply deplore ; but notwithstanding those
excesses', and notwithstanding the responsibility which
may be unjustly thrown on other powers, he means to keep
steadfast to that policy. (Hear, hear.) Upon that point
Great Britain is entirely speed with the Emperor of the
French. (Hear, hear.) The right hon. gentleman asks me
our policy. I will Ray at once we are nut divided on any
great question such as the war of 17%1 or 1804. These are
questions of policy, and there is a main question of policy ors
which we are entirely agreed with the Emperor of the
French. We are at the same time in close intimacy with
the other great powers of Europe ; and if ever any circum-
stance make it appear to us that France was in
the wrong, was acting in that spirit of en-
croachment which sometimes Doimates a great
miliMry nation, why then we should be in a position to
appeal to those alliances. So I believe that the second alter-
native which the right lion. gentleman mentioned is not
likely to come to poss. (Hear. bear.) The Emperor of the
French doctored his strong disapproval of any intention of
Sardiuia to break the treaty of Zurich and take Venetia. I
believe the French people would entirely support him in
that declaration. I believe he has no intention of marching
an army into Italy with a view of supporting the !minus in
that attempt. (Hear.) But with regard to the same ques-
tion, while I wrote that desputeh of :tlst August, which
the right hon. gentleman saw ill the Coltrine Genttfe,
1 wrote about the same time a despatch to our
minister at Vienna, to say that we entirely disapproved
of the attack by Sardinia on Austria, and that we should
disapproveof any aid beinggiven by France to such an at-
tack, and such our opine "o was known at Pans and Tune.
We trusted that our influence would have its duo effect,
combined with other considerations which might have
weiVit in the minds of (how sovereigne, but we could go
no further. It was not our intention to take pin in such
a war, if it should arise. We confined ourselves to that
which I have stated. Now the right hon. gentleman has
asked me what are OM relations with France. I would say,
with the hon. gentleman who seconded the address
with so much good sense and practical sagacity, that the
commercial treaty would make the alliance 04 only be-
tween the governments if France and England but between
the people of both couotries. I believe that will he the case--
(hear, hear)—and I render due homage' to my hon. friend
who is not now in the house (Mr. Cobden), who has devoted
sir much labour and, lam sorry to say, so much of his