The Express.
London, England, 1850-06-04 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARL LAMENT.

HOMO! OF LORDS —MONDAY, JuNi $.
Lard CARrsaza. set Speekrr et 6 tido. k.
PUBLIC BUSINESS.
PETITIONS PRIL•GINTRD
MUIR OF INROLMIIIIT IN BANKRUPTCY. 1
tlLeez:4 WHARNCLIFFI bee ills Clued Intelneel
, peeping ter esspentition. MIMI& hi
tit ihe sup betels sad learned lord (iemlherle)
...„
isteeded se reseed with Me
*medusa* Bill whisk Ite tatredeeed at Ike ___sleet
the seenee
Lent BROUGHAM teiretted thst Es wee slit/s6 le
pinyon* it sato the seat wens, la sesomptems d Me
aleinee asks Loud Cheeenter
IRABTINEI IN EQUITY _ COURT OF CRAM=

BILL.
Lead BROUGHAM rid 'raid paver Ibis sin for
• fortaight. He thespir the petitioner is the ratter bruin
before uteir lordship by hissoble Mead (Lord Witarsalite)
(Ist le be essoprsard.
APPEALS TO THE PRIVY COUNCIL FROM THE
iccLutAanca. COURTS (warm Or DOG-
TRINE )
By lir Bishop a SALISBURY, hosavarioneVi n lib
Arise Bishop et OLOUCESTIR, ham isam
direr ;; Lard STANLEY. trews the Chanel II
mad the of LONDON, tress a plait mot Berl
hum of this WL
The Bishop of LONDON. is trier to situ tbs soma
tubas, said be did so aides a most overpsweenn anti Of
No dl tiaiiq of ski mak, and his owa mobility to a. inir
*la like Jeers tit in import's" sot only will aauaa
to the priasiple whisk it isvolved, bat Om Mau
nature Ugly to arse ken tier lordship'
, rejection of Us meamm. was us lima Ints4
10
is ea trairdinsey Monte; sit lo ma
vivre surmise to Ms soaneasattegrtialb= of
soberest, sad tratb, it was impailit M everostirata the
waters impotence of tie Mina is which their lord-
ships sight arm*. He MI Moult impound with a Micah,
of a podia, character, whieb lasersabirrefroely and fairly.
but se hired is term Me madam of whisk weald sot give
*Maw Ho mast eadosuar to lads.. Weir lordships to ley
aside fur • sheet woos their every-day habit of regordian
tarp nal legislation, sad to consider themselves members
a that great s' iritual lowly by which they were
gaited to the church. He did rot desire their
lordship tent est of their eusideration, while legislation
fie the chanty the relation which she boil to the state to
this Clanks opeatry. ad Me mama shams ad duties of
them both. Oa Me 'massy it was Mouse be believed it
metatial to Na wen-being ed 'tbo Mats that dm shun Mould
be pertained to disibuto bee us pianos, tuitions without
let or Itiodrossa Nat be isersesely metristod their lordships
to &rem Moir auntie more slsssly thsa awn to Ms prow
har Dalian al to laaaapas whin' to the await as
Ms menu and keeper.! OW'. trath. Before bo reseeded
OS Str1011•111 is auger of Me cubes limier eisesideva
Vow it was aresmary Net ho Mould attempt to mum one
or two obismisas of • mareal kis/ Mat We in ha goads tithe
meanie.
.16 might beesid—tis did sot haow Ibis It would

be—that theliesseut Wt malted item the ezeitemet ma.
aimed by a lomat jedgmet delivered by the Jadiidel Cam.
alum of the Privy C .aseil, In • ease ese 'smelly knows
le mak r it .smeary that he should describe it. Bat
seek meet Weed the feet. It was quite true that hi very
wrest impletthee it that plastered, sad the "main of feelings
mad spading is whisk it had given rise had forged himself
sad ahem te • mom mar and critical examination of the
IMMO" of the tribunal of ultimate appeal in ecelesiaatisel
cameo, with • view te dean some modification of the tabl-
ing Intelsat. end be senses sense very grave objeetions to it.
Bet the it "NNW Map In the eeclienstieal Judi.
eaten had bees ieag peretived; sad the only wonder was
that it was net more dearly min an I enforced at the time
when the court of delegates w abolished, and the judicial
email substituted in its room. Why it wa not so, be
maid hardly say. bat he premed this was the tease,
sanely, that eases iavolving quakes of Antrim bad bees
se rare, there having not been mere than three or four from
the time of the lest institution of the court of delegates down
to the period when the Palatial council was substituted for
it, that no efts took such appeals to the new court into con-
widerstioa. The iudi isl committee of the privy council
Was a meet unexceptional tribunal in everything bat
eseleasatical matters' where the tribunal ought obviously to
be sesiposed of ambers of the estabinbed thatch. (Hen,
hoer.) In 1847 he introduced a bill for proutodiag against
elemymes is tartan eases, and it went so tor as to substitute
• new evert of appal for the privy council. That bill was
referred to • "sleet esamittes e wiposed principally of pens
who bad illed legs, aim, and attended by all with the en-
ema's of Lord Drama; and tee dense which substituted
• new court of appeal was sweated to by the whole of that
melon committee, of which the noble and learned lord then
en the woolseek (Lord Csmph,ll) was a member. la the
following pees and ia 1849 he introduced the sass bill as
amended by the Wan comittet, bat owing to various causes
of delay whia he would not stop to explain, it was suffered
to remain Is suspense. Early in the present session he had
introduced the same bill, with a variation in the el toe which
related to the court of appeal, Introduced is deference to
the advice of pergola whose opinion was enti-
tled to respect. A different constitution win pro-
posed for that court : finding that the clans* in
question did not give the satisfaction wLich he hoped it
would, he brought it before his right rev. brstbren, and they
were all of opinion that it we better to treat the subject as
the by itself, and to bring is a distinct and sabstaetisl
measure, rather than mix it up with questions of discipline
or proMedings against clerks in ether cases. They met
repeatedly in full mem* : oat of 27 bishops, 25 attended,
and the result of the deliberations was a determination that
this bill should be p al to the house, and submitted to
their lordships' consideration. He would not go so far as to
say that seem decision was perfectly unanimous, bat with
parsec to the propriety of presentees the bill itself, the deci-
sion wee nearly unanimous ; end those who did sot agree
as to the propriety of presenting the bill, did not so nisch
differ with reference to the principle of the bill as to the ex-
pediency of briogiog forward such a immure without hest
ascertaining whether it would receive the approval of the
government. Ho believed that some of his right
d brethren who mental to the bill in
general, thought that in some particulars it might
require alterations and amendments; and he could only say
that he should be prepared to attend with the utmost N-
epal to any molilicati on which might be suggested, pro-
vided they did not materially and radically isterfas with
the essential principle el the bill. What be had stated, be
thought, was sufficient to prove that this mowers was not
the offering of mist excitement, but the result of a eon
elation of long shading, as to the nesesity of a change in
the constitution of the court of ultimate appeal as regarded
ecclesiastical cams. (Htar, hen.) He bad sow to deal
with another °limiest of far greater importance, although
not of greater weight; and that was the objection which he
understood was likely to be male, and which in some quar-
ters bad been already made, that the present meanie would
interfere with the royal supremacy. And if that could be
sit are, he should be one of the last 'pinions to propose such
• measure to their lordships' consideration. He was
not one of them who thought that the supre-
macy of the sovereign, is matters ecclesiastical,
we. an intolerable burden to the church, at least in theory.
(neer, hear.) He feared, however, that there was
mash misundentanding on this subject : this su-
premacy of the grown must be exercised by legally coesti-
feted triangle. It was not like a personal right in the
scamige, which she might delegate to any iadi ; bet,
es la the 24th Henry VIII., the king war " to render jostles
and Ilan determination to all manor of persons raiding is
the realm, in musts spiritual byjedges spiritual, and in causes
temporal by judges tamporaL" In things spiritual and tem-
peral the royal supremacy was exercised under some
ties ; and think» whatever mat was legally constituted
for the purpose of scarring the Queen to exercise her suers-
may soalii not be held to interfere with that awaiting. It
was quite tate that the "berth might have some reason to
toomOsia of any seelosiestical tribunal erected without roa-
ms given in soatheation ; bat the sonnies could have
nom on the score of supremacy. And he might a td that it
was one great recomasedathe of the present bill
that It did not propose to eabstitute aa estirely
new court Instead el the existing ono, bat to
confer on the present inset additional powers
be enable them M form right and well-grounded Mimes in
eetlesiastied matters, which would steed the test of legality.
The linnet hid bees sadly miseadentood by the people of
this meetly ; and be would therefor* prothed briefly to state
the history sdistrartm of appeal in asses ecclesiastical. The
trot statists which related to soak appeals was the 24th Hen.
VIII., pealed in 1531, and which related to eases of wills, ma-
trimony, tithes, and oblations; sod masted that the animals
should be frees the &rebates's to the bishop, and /ma the
bishop to the arehbithems, the decision of whose court was to
be flan, reserpthig Mine the 'deg me • party geseersed,
and thee the eppeal was es be be the siert of the upper hoses
of
esevosatise. This was the lint est providing for appeals
sealseissthel matters, and It was peassi before the laser-
Use by pantheism ef the kiagte supremacy. had while it
Illthillaised the pewee of the him to reader pram be ell
duns of kis subjems, erelosiestioal and temporal, if Perier
Med the Starve ef the spirituality to determine all quaffiline
which MUM pints of demise or divine Ids. 'timid that
part of the body paint called the spirituality ►bad &Imp
" been deemed @sanest to determias any doubts whim .my
sass of law dines some. tato question or spiritual beariag."
The sent statute pissed was a the following year. 26
Henry VIII., mg. 19, which enacted that an shoeld
Bs to the Liars is Chesney, nada which the =test do-
minos Meld be teal. No farther appeal wee torstiatted by
that sat, but it was always usual to great a consmanion of
review to revise the deckles of **(nest of Delegates. The
third eat was the 38 Homy VIII., which was the
lini to amen the repel sepromuy, eau whim
desired the king to be the gamma head se
Berth is mottoes easissiestical. That mete was repealed
and wee never revived ; bet the Ist El zenith, cap. 1, gave
the MOO power to the .rows, end also the masa of semis.
kg it, namely the High Comatinthe Court, which was in
many Papeete as Meilen of the liberties of the subject, sad
whisk wee repealed by the 16th end 17th Chaska I. Bet
neither the motitatith nor abolition of the High Commis-
sioa Court took away the ultimate "prams isradiethe to
the Court of Delegates. The 2 and 3 Will. IV. abolished
the Court of Delegates, which bad fallen into dime, and
substituted en appeal to the king is council, which was to be
Goal. Tits 3 sad 4 Will. IV. soastitated the judicial coat
mitts* WI the privy coma, and appointed certain parsons
amasses ef it,- and so the law now stood.
It was new his duty to plat out the prin-
cipal objlestises to ;the mestiattion of the present court
of eppeel. It ma palatal sad difficult duty, speaking as
he did hi the primes of some members of tha. court, towards
whom he felt the greeted respect. His objection was to the
vinciplem of the suit NMI rather Um to the seeds in which
jumbos wee administered In it, and sothiar could be better
than the way in whisk it perfeemed Its civil (mean's. It
we *V intim they some to deal with seelesiastical Celle

effidealffinethell they wen mike iffibeeel
illivalcomoLegll.l gessillreeeing le the effineli met thr iirthib ormi
they wen
ei
the es 4 wuPwai WV'dsh
that le lia
q ma
sad elmegb boaeei Meek ef
eleeete le . Be
ed it wee the indlnatka Mead Meth
at the Gemmel with kw
state al dismal* ogres/ !peek
seesolly, It us the duty elel
'sensation of the matt:
meek
Judges wields the terms
du este. Now, it wee thesiduty Mem-
! sem its destrise aid spirited discipline wholly inviolate;
seegadly, M love es the Ise: meet a losefifille power ef war-
reedsy move le this mete; and tic remise to • Mk Mist sl
appeal tidiest danger of MUM& with the math The
whole OWN a his cireameit preseedeff ItPea _o2=
thea *lithe, wire ege likely, In the puma Mateo
M aide thithemithin, the
here he mit Mime
that dee mpai MUM efieeffirentwearived
adva I
ffid thelefk IRO Use le he as
Ildbuieffi w &amp the duty imposed os it is
M eth
na=le le it guested wholly of lay-
=et wlee Micsallisal by pruner
mil night rives hrM "ibis lisamblid
by the alma. If lei IC MINA in *Woe where
he moth is whisk mai net be ellensite.
He !admitted it weer thong guiltless of ist•m% to
the laity •thimlng the therith, beeline points Mich he
believed and lenkhipe, or use tiny well
Masud mail he able to say wee, or were not,
moistest with M.dlaatdtea of the telmoth. Bat es the
eau hand mew keleilleee of &Mine um, frem time te
time, which bee reseaseruM the attentiu the laity,
and whisk men those venal la theology Osumi •
41/1111•Ity . He meld ersmd •
terseillen el error bebrought before the judicial
W eke privy eau whisk they amt ally could
let of whisk they absekt.Jy did set en-
thee=illibe.l4ledilleest• Heal net therefore ante low It
was
wit these to &elk gewitieu of fake thetrine,
whim it was be he elbesued that theme beet
sad mare this mind, se weir the .sew of this
eduanon,cousseed their toiling a large mid (ampules-
ales view el theekeloolimithee. There was, however, th*
stew important point to whisk he wished to direct the attthe
timer their 10-dsbipe. Their kWh* wore aware how meth
of ter law had be.. frothed epee the drefeke el jedgesei-
hew seek rioted peeseienth Rug delis. tepee OM
of Antrim Mimeo& by the Privy Ogneell, er_be erise sever
rkr seffissiestieel ourt, beam • pegging. Punkas by
therm medial** law. They deleemimil rile which
the law, fre melee the statutikiolt eseggeds ; gad thus •
ergot part of our law was met malleo„ ned wee not to be
feud fa eery sestets or Gramm 110 is with the doe-
wises of the eliarth. We mated set mattes of new doc-
trines, we may 'puked fit sad prow expounders of the
doetriaee that Met He reedgy- Medgeed that no mom
mild he more esespeteat to dulls dipieled quorum on
matters of last or law thaa time who iseastituted the it:l-
ineal of appeal from the misiethetisal surto. But he dis-
puted their sompeteasy to decide purely theological ques
does. Notwitbstandisg their iikethimen about sot within(
to interfere ia theological waken, k wen evident that their
dubious did affect the holding lw the laity of the doctrines
involved in thou theisioes. Thereffore, althensok they
might eollut:vely sad iatileideally disclaim any iatestiosa
of wishing to dads. • particular point of doe-
tithe, their daisies MI regarded a portion of the
laity at least mounted to such definition, and was acted an
as authoritative. The inconvee knee so adhered to the pie-
ties that It was impossible for the Judicial Committee of the
Prigq Conseil, notwithstanding their disclaimers, to give •
decision ea • Mat of doctrine without affecttca that doc-
trine ; and there was not a akeslaw of doubt that • mem-
pion of such deelsiose would have the effect net merely of
iejuring the character bat the my stability of the cheese
then. He Imams, that sem of the lay members of that
tribunal might be very well reed ia divinity. halted he
was acquainted with more thee gee judge who was deeply
✓ead in %flukey, bet these were exceptional hams, and
could not be expected to he frequently met with. The
right bon. prelate (who was occasionally very inondible) was
then understood to may that there could not be • more proper
triben .1 for the decision of purely theological and doctrinal
questions this the bishops. And here he meld observe'
that that had been the principle of oar eonititwion from •
very early period—that was to say, that decisions in all spi-
ritual cases snould be left sot merely to eccl-siestical, bet
to spiritual italic s. That bad been the spirit of our rued
tenon from the earliest times down to • comparatively re-
cent period. He would endeavour to prove that assertion.
He begged dem to remind their lordships of the dictum of
that treat jurist, who was by unanimous cense.% the inter-
pretet of our mama law. Lord Coke said that certain
it was that this kingdom had been best governed, and its
pme and quiet best preserved, when both lay and eeclesise-
tieal judges kept themselves within their proper jurisdiction,
without esuosehing or usurping one epos the other, sad
that such esuosehments inn usuroatiacs when they did
occur, were tee seeds of great trouble end inoonvenienes.
Their lordships would, perhaps, smile if he talked of our
Saxon ancestors, but he might go further beck still. How-
ever, it wee unnecessary for his argument to do so. He
would only remark that in Saxon times the bishop and
the sheriff of the county at togethor—the °pinkie of the
one prevailing in spin: oil, that of the other in temporal,
questions. According to a high authority, "the Court co
Que,th's Bosch admitted that it doth not appertain to the
Kthg's Court to determine *chime or heresies; and that
where the original cause of the suit is tearer whereof the
King's Court bath cognisance, the King's Court is to consult
with divines to know whi thee it be schism or not." The
Refer:natio Lepton Etc provided, " that where any cause
should devolve to the crown, it should be settled, if a grave
cause, by • provincial council, or by three or four bishops
eppointed by the crown." Blackstone said, "If the cause
of refusal te institute be of a spiritual nature, as he-
resy, particularly alleged, the fact, if denied, shell
be determined by a jury ; and it the feet be ad-
mitted, or found, the court, upon consultation and ad-
vice of lesraird divines, shall decide ICS sufficiency."
That we the precise constitution he desired t t introduce into
tne jud.eial committee of the privy council. There could
not be better judges of law than the noble and learned lords
who formed tbat tribunal. But what he wanted wee that if
a question arose whether the doctrine taught by A. B. was
sound or heretical they should consult the leaned divine' of
the church we to whether it was or wan not heretical ; and
when be said heretical he meant not agreeable to the Church
of Busload. Usti' the time of Henry VIII. the seelesies-
noel judges were all spirituel persons. Usti' that reign
there was no trace of common law judges being on
the commissions of delegates, nor, after that, one out of 40
till the great rebellion. The right rev. prelate then
proceeded to stow that the early church had recognised the
principles of regal supremacy, and that g 1 councils had
been convoked by the emperors, who either attended then-
selves or sent delegates. But although they had that supre-
macy, they sever used it to overawe or dictate, and ealy seat
their deliwates to see that all the proceedings of the councils
were regulated seurding to the can mg of the church. The
fish- rev. prelate supported his measure by copious refer-
ences to precedents and analogies, Amuse what had bun
the practice of the Anglican and other churches in times pest
and pieseet, as well as by pointing to the course pursued by
the law cruets, who remitted gondolas o' science awl foreign
law which were beyond their own immediate knowledge to
bodies of arbitrators Moen from among men pro-
firsionally qualified to decide in the particular cues.
He claimed an "qui power for the church, that,
namely, of deciding upon points of her own doctrine.
In reply to the objection raised in the public press that this
ball gave the power of framing new doctrines, he had only
to say that the court to be constituted by this
bill would have no more power than the present court.
He would cement himself with saying, in reply to moths,
objection, that though heterodoxy upon the part of the
bishops, if that were possible, might be a very good reason
for calling upon the legislature to change the mode of sleet.
tag them, yet that it was se reuses for depriving them of the
exercise of their *Miens= emd rights when they were ap-
pointed. Another Missiles was, that thirteen or fourteen
men were to determine the appeasement of others to hold
office in *ocher*, but their iordthips should recollect that
the bishops at peewee had the right, at the time of or-
dination, of provost*, teen hom entering the church-oil
right which was sever exercised without jest reason.
Their lordships should also recollect that it was
tar better that thirteen er fourteen men should exercise sp.
pellets jurisdietioa, than that the right should be milled to
six or HMI. H. admitted that then might happen to he •
difference of opiates among the bishops In cases of appeal,
and that this was a great difficulty to los encountered by any
such measure as the present. But let it be looked at boldly
in the face. It was possible that the bill might be so gash-
had is committee es in a great mum to obviate it ; but,
be the difficulty what it might, It was sot to be pat is compe-
tition with the great principle aow to be mewed. (Hear.)
Other °blew loos had bees made. One or two bad appeared.
in • public print of great infitteue and talent, which had
oet desk with the subject in any very hostile
terms. It said "it might be doubted how far
any aserantsly belonging to the political interests
of the day meld he taken to represent the authority of the
church." He did not say that the bishops should represent
the authority of the church; on the contrary, nobody could
be said to moused the authority of the church except those
asembled is esausatioe. Under existing circumstances,
dm, the new evert wee Mt* be • synod, nor we It are
remit the authority of the shush. (Hear.) He felt that
he had already trespassed at greater Moth than he °tithe to
have done—(heer)--still, the subject was emparatively new
to their lordships, and he therefore felt it right to place sea
ialonnetku before them, with the view of qualifying them to
come to an impartial consideration. He thanked them for
the petiole* with which they had listened to him. It now
remained for them to decide a question which was of supreme
importance to the church, namely, with whom was to rest
for the time to come, at least for some considerable time to
some, the final adjudication of the question, whether any
pertimslar doctrine which wee alleged to be in contravention
of the teething of the thereat of Ragland we really to or sot
He protested mime any interims, which might be drawn
Gem the stress he had laid either on sets of pirliameat,
&Mint pasties, oe the toinuteaey or fitness of the judges
Out he rested his eats as those arm& ; he rioted ir oa the
vital and fundamatal ht—the inherent and indefeasible
right--of the ehmlii, to • finally all questions of
dGettin.. (Hear, bier.) The right rev, prelate, who was
here affected to tears, manaluded as follows: My
lords, I now commend the subject to your lordships' calm
sad seri, .e consideration. I em, in conclusion, as I was at
the commencement, almost overpowered by the oontemela-
tion of the PMI'S likely to follow from your lordships' rejee-
'lon of this bill. I commit it to you, not without apprehen-
sion, but not without hope; and, looking at the greet
im-
porusee of the cthestioa, you lordships will not be sur•
prised if I unclad', with something more thus my um'
anxiety respecting the fate of this measure, by expresaiag a
&met wish that He who committed to Ills church the
scared deposit of His truth may guide you to a right em
elsolea. (Chun.)

tire um, meths hang mat thaithe bill be sew Dead a
math time,
The Menteis mf LLNBDOWNI wee Miley atheltde
el the illeadvantsge Ite hawed under is befits NM-
plled hsl=thdr' ottaitot
obe he • Asa
ito t will math Atheeas rnad shaded bd.
Jobe Well 100011Y1'. erlati add 41
wag, cm (low. goer )
Is Mader musk that
he eleardbie be eidfrie
their paharp, a absme ebb
sahke les=lbysila
hie opiates*. ereadid be enasmised le imply silo swear
teary to his intrados% as the slightest toursslaat as that
mewed and Mused balistwham thetrithXt the 7 peelthe
12 saw
=et walOgrb..
_WV.OI.I r"P"
esestreama arliestemly, sad, with terms to
meet ef lahalithily. the meet sissies sad oaths ,«
ret(ammo He thy at the mem that his meths
troubltag tbilr llydsatpe thee early wee, that
he objected at this eallilmat to ely4islatkia at ail apas
this su Het, bor.) He tat may an
as sack wadi be dellinthd ea haevitthks=
hollatZlietiOS upon the_part of the rutile,—Mat say alieratles
of that *Ahead (dm Privy Coated) whisk was Me masa .
satlesal tribemal of this eriantry far the Mial ef emiesiese
deal eras, and whisk for osintartee bad enemies& that hum-
dos—that may seek aberstina, if made la hales at this to
meat, would be blabs se naleseasiteuedea ; sad be wadi' see
concesi from himself dist the &safety be reseed with this
bill bad bees maned_ ky
_the sUssadsfeelloa fah, if sot =-
pressed, at the rematdsdiea of that aesioet tribusal—Astuteall
awe of " Gorham v. The Ifishop of Hester ")—a
which was fame* by the Mem, the law, and the mastitu-
, with the admisisamMaa of her ajesty's
(deoCheers )He wadi diserable Mfrom
sot as a swabs/ Of dm telbenal, hat la ammo
the publle of thin amstry, is commoa ke behoved with a
great ponlon Mthedergy of this cthatry—tvith •ea Wier
portion of the Aare, that he did thesider the t
given by that Miasmal to be ewe that had mufti
to churchmen in the present unhappy—he had OWN elad
distempered—Mate et the establiohnteat. ("Beam ham,"
sad cheers.) He believed it had gins es mash satleteadea
as the nature of the subject and the diasulties of the cthe
peradt•lal. (Hear, bear.) He therefore asked tisk lord-
ships whether any mous, radar team alemmeMathee, sot
to modify, bat to set adds that tribunal, sad Move
not a judgment, wittiest as °Oaths, stelpped
was a measure which them who were met prerand to make
a great change its the esastitaion of flhi mac they mould be
willing to assist to f What would say lath celled urea
emaskaiisaelly le advabisiff Mis law, 'Oak, if talia•sly
after he bed rmaitemsd a emisfaa so snoops ,11 more f•
alter the maalitaisa of isle mum ? Eleavese immediately
after that Illaseriews mart, the Court of Sias% Ilea" pre-
sided over by Lied MessAeld, lad given ea mishit in idle
celebrated sees it libel, or if immediately Oat the
Court of Comma Pima had pinta a esoliaa is
the eau of Gmeral Wane. • bill were intgednald
iato parliament to take away the right of decision from the
Court of King's Bench, or to alter the eonstitutioa of the
Court of Common Pldr, would sot ouch an attempt have
been a reflective on the jedgmeats given in tbs. courts ?
(Hear, bear.) Inevitably sack mast have been the ewe is
the mind of every redectiag man ; and yet, although some
noble !lords of the period referred to had been dissatisfied
with the decisions of the Courts of siege H-eel and Com-
mon Pleas, not one of them bad ever attempted to take
sway the powers from either it these courts.
For these reasons he was not prepared to give
his assent upon the part of her Majesty's go.
verameat to any further proceeding with this
bill, or with any other measure whatever at this
moment, because he was certain that invites% misinterpre-
tation and misconostrfon upon the part of the public would
be the inevitable result, if their I irdships smarmed this or
any other meaqtre upon this important subjeec. He saw the
strongest ”bjeetion to the measure now introduced. It
struck a blow at her Majesty's prerogative. Kr the drat
time it introduced into this country a tribunal,
the opioioas of which, in the language of the
bill itself, were so be considered as binding and
conclusive." It deprived her Majesty of the power
of exercising that, which nit from the Reformation
alone, but from the earliest and bat days previous to the
Reforestation, had been coosidered to he the special omega-
tin rof the grown—that of the government of the church.
(Hear.) The Queen and her sidebars would be shaeklei by
the bill, for neither could obey the oaths they had calm to
set according to the deeisi as of their own minds. There
was no doubt that sins' the Reformation the crown had
uniformly exercised the power of controlliog decisions in
ecclesiastical affairs ; and it was worthy of remark that the
Court of D .legates was composed of sec! manias and civilians.
The questions to be determined under this bill were ques-
tions of fact and not of theology, for the questions of theo-
logy had tor en waled as the R formation. Ifs was no friend
to the expediency of reviving convocation, because he
doubted whether it would conduce to tranquillity of peace
to revive it at present, but it it were revised he would not
*eel ude from it tie interior (Cheers.)
He thought it would be unconstitutional and
in the highest degree inexpedient to exclude the
inferior clergy and only to include the bishops.
His right rev. friend said that his object was to take
the decision out of incompetent, and place it in corne
petent hands—to give the substance to this sew tribunal
and the husks to the privy council—but unless the object
were to alter existing doctrine, and to intro :tic, new doe-
tribe into our ehtireb—

The Bishop of LONDON disclaimed uy intention of that
kind.

-----
The Marquis of L aNSDOWNE was glad to hear it, but
it was, however, the same for his argument; for, if the ob-
jest were sot to affect existing doctrine, but merely to exa-
mine and determine on mown .4 fact—whether this or
that was or was not the doctrine held by the !Arden
authoriti,e in the church of England then be contended
that I-armed laymen accusomed to take and examine and
tart evidence—were more fully acquainted wit's the principles
of evidence than ocelesiastice, however eminent for their piety
or their learning. What they required was a just decision
of persons not pretending to be conversant with doctrine,
but of persons able to distinguish between what were autho-
rities in mitten of theology and what were sot—(hear)—
and this had been the stains course of the law and con-
atitutlen of England. (Hear, hear.) He pretended to
have formed no opinion upon the particular doctrinal Tie,.
(ton which had given rise to this bill, but looking at the
deelaratioss of cur ancestors, and so far as he had
had an opportunity of examining them, the doe-
trims of the most eminent divines—men holding
various mid conflicting opinions on many subject/
boiling at the articles of our church themselves, and to the
retorted opinions of the best writers and commentators on
those articles—be had coma to the conclusion that it was the
intention of thou articles, and that it was the in-
testiest of the bounders of the church to Lave a certain
lati.ude of judgment and a certain freedom of conscience in
interpretation of some doctrinal matters which may reasons.
bly be obnoxious to doubt, and that to go back/rota that
wise freedom of conscience end fie an arbitrary interpreta-
tion on all such points, so far from 'miming to peace and
quietuses, would lead to dissenoion, difficulty, and ill-
will, and be the surest means of preventing the union of
good and wise and holy men in advancing those great
interesi in which our convictions as churchmen and our
prosperity and happiness now and hereafter were involved.
(Loud cheers.) The decision of a majority of persona, how-
ever learned, coming to the consideration of a question with
preconceived opiaims, though it might be binding for
a time, would act as an encouragement to agitation
with those who aided with the minority with the
view to obtain • reversal of mush decision, and who weld
continue t > sets% and disturb the church until an alterelies
in the constitution of the tribunal by reversing the
sins of the majority, should enable them to asseen-
plish their object. (Haar, hear.) But while he meld not
consent to maiflos the prerogative of the crown, as hitherto
exercised is rasped to Mine questions of appeal, be was dim
Posed to think that it might be desirable for the of
showing to the public that these questione esW net be
determined witeout the [great authorities of the amok befag
tally heard and considered, that it should not be left to
the crown or the President of the Conseil, as it had boon
to him last year. merely to invite the atteadasse of certain
members of the right rev. Moak, bet that every right
reversed prelate should be de jute a somber of the
judicial committee. (Hoar, hem) He was disposed to
thick that might he • satisfactory
the chuck—ea change satis-
factory both to church and the publ and at the same
time free from any inconvenience. (Hear, er.) Rethought
also that for the satisfaction of the church it might be well to
provide that no member of AM privy sonncils not being a
member of the church of England, should be allowed to sit
and decide on questions affecting the church. (Hoar, hear.)
These were alterations he was disposed to think might be in-
troduced with advantage, but with regard to the present
bill, being mavineed that is the present setsion it mold lead
to no practical utility, and objecting to it generally on the
grounds he had stated, believing that it would tend to keep
alive as heat sad controversy, which might else be
allayed, he felt bound to move that it be read • second time
that day six mouths (Cheers.)
Lord BROUGHAM feared chewers, he wuabout to take
would give eatisfertioa to neither the right rev. prelate or
the noble marquis, for he could not altogether agree with
either. If he was called upon to say " Aye "or " No" to
the bill as It now stood, he should vote for postponing the
second reading. There could be no doubt that there was a
schism la the church, and it was the duty of their lordships
to take oars that they sanctioned no measure which should
have the least chance of widening that schism, but at the
same time they were called upon not to reject any measure
without due consideration which was brought forward for
the purples of healing the breach which existed, and pre-
'otitis, further difference. (Hoar.) It was on this ground
that he had determined sot to reject the bill
Immediately, bat to give it a fair consideration,
In order to see if it Might not be so altered
(and as it now rioted he confessed he entertained to many
parts of it issupersble objections) as to make it efficient for
the object with which it was brought forward. (Hear) He
believed, if the Judicial Committee of the Privy Council
lad beta originally formed with the view to deter fn, eerie
saw led questions, some other arrangement with regard to
its constitution would have been made. (Hear.) But it
would be disadvantageous to make an alteration in the 0311-
siltation of any tribunal immediately alter any particular
decision, issamsch sa it would lead to the opinion in the
public mind that that decision am wrong, and
that it was became of such decision alone that
the *image was made. But be altogether objected
to the play proposed by his right
d friend
—he &ejected to bind the Judicial Conn'ttroofdethde
Privy Council by the &Maimother
of any body, because he,a
as • member of that committee, was sworn to administer
poetise exordia( to his awn conscience, and not according
to the views of an other body. Meer, hear.) His right
rev. friend t.ad seM there wee aa analogy in the practice of
the Court of Chancery for sanh• ?reseeding. It was true