The Express.
London, England, 1858-05-04 00:00:00

LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, MAY 4, 1868,

I think I shall be able to satisfy the hers that the rate of
the khans in the exchequer wee eadiestary, sod that the
sums found there by the premed gentrimat were
ample for the purposes of the maks year. Is
1866, ths Warm in the mambo was 4919,0 W
but then in that sem wee rehoded • millicig
of ways and tarns bilk in saUcipatica at the maps of the
re crass prier, whisk were defrayed ent eldest
se that dm nerd bilmas la 1866 was 2,910,081‘.
the rises wee 6,880,0001. ; In 1867, 8,8040004 sad as the
Zs=st lest, 11,0117A01., whir the house meet we woe a
un for the yew. (Hoer, hoar.) The lahrmatisa
I received on WM( dm was that no dedderey bills
bearing Interest would le rqninei for the Aga dividend,
and I now lam that am lam been bid easeleary.
Well, sir, if be mpeadhere ci the psi year, Wading the
payment of debts, was filbspei by be mama ad If a sof-
dam ones was Id In Mimes at the sad of the ilaindsl
year, Ma Um bad, I thiak, cans le the smobeita that,
se far se the imasse wont moms& Br Ire
ialt abaft in as tissatbemory ccatiltica. , base.)
I arm mas ea la the plaa et the present govetnamt,
with roped Is that Pea I maid say that it amen ft ma,
sad
Yet se he ham the tight beta regimen opposite being
slandeas Is the deep bomb egoist hint on a Ismer on-
miss of belai ese adanbareas, sit him
teo lir the
beibed adi atadas, he has ea the pamat co-
usin ism Woad Mud be palm, be andows, I
mien shanal asp Imams.
gook hind tsar skim Ilmidssiene pstain.
Is bra mile es aoripsesst wish the view et avoiding a
wild' I few may wif It pal meson be at
mere parse billealey lemmiler. In the fita
Mee. be bee add hi as Om he Yon le mad • piddle
d=of seamed izmdltresott yar.
11 mandliese, inamisha=slm nine—sad
I Wig* of it—% emewhat the awed navy Id-
abel@ of la pedimenr. I give the pranmeas all possiblo
malt far that Isdes, sad as am rtedate m the re-
Modem ilea I do voyeslif. Bet whoa the jevermats c
oat t
talks
of a Mead sap ee as ampere' whit bat of the pe-
arl* year, let es Ise how that Made. The soneslidand
fadroba dareble for Yet year was 1,777,0001. Is cessommes of
the p bomb emermemeleg the podere —sa r-
pm% let me bs allowsl le es", whir wee peer eid =the Into
sevannaost by the Ham Oammas, sa
espean which eddy
_- km the kart ofdick the tore—
in amesonmad that Mb the charge this year
will be 1900,0001. The Mashie lest year, mop the mp-
pimeatsrLioto• kir the baba, were : Army, 11,893,000/.;
die year an 11,7011,0001. Navy Yes year, 9,172,0001. ;
this year, 9„0001. Civil estimates last year, 7,896,00 W. ;
sad this year the right hon. gentlemen ens them down at
7,000,0001. 8o that the total estimates last year were
80,230,00 W. ; and this year they are 30,510,00 W. • Mowing
an blatilie in the present year of 280,0001. That Macre
mu t be retread if you add the supplementary vote for the
makk—whodnr it will be required or hot this
= nals osemet tall—but leaving out that, the is an
this year of 280,0001. This comprises, whisk kir tom the right hon. gentlemaa's own figsres,
11110111• shat be fs am Pound in saying that there will bay
raked= In the tore of the present year, and we do
set newyat wbmhr a time may not arrive for
re estimeles. While mob are the maps=
towed at let us Ni what we are to cam la the et
way of toml The right hoe. gentleman's pieta is shortly
this: he takes off two millicas of trades, or tenser allows
ft to 11110111, and substitutes for it a somewitat peowicies
800,0001. I cell it prooarims, bereft the 600,000/. which he
iambs spirits is doubtful, and I doubt
very are whether the stamp on cheques will make
up _the 800,000 f. (Hoer, bear.) It is true that we
shell Is. only or of two millions during the
peer& ye; bet seretheleis the ultimate lose will be
two, for which he nay provides as • substitute a premises
800,0001.
this
Thenibecroloors to meet the Exchequer Bands,
Mid& tobe WIN year, by entities a new ken,
sad *papas war slaking fund of one and a half mil-
Ike. Fr -the Izeltaqasr bonds he proposes to Issue two
Mika. at 14 per cm., payable at any time not exessing
of yews,• se that the right hoe. ',ad man will have the
power of ogreabag his payment' over that period. He has
not stabs SIP meek in which be propose* to proceed with
this sew ken, but I usdiessmel he bee made an arrangement
with the leek of England kr the gross sum. Whether that
is the most convenient course, or whether the proper holders
were net shied to some ocesideration and an offer to renew
their brim certain terms, is a point which, no doubt, the
right ben. pothenan has considered, and until we hear hie
rearms he the erne he has taken, I shall not press bites
gram as derpoint. But It is to be borne in mind thee
the reader which the right hon. gentleman professes to
brow solved will recur next year. There e ill be two mil-
am Meg due then, and one million the knower an ', d therefore, unless he means to enteryew
into • steady course of borrowing for these bonds,
I do sot see how his present budget can be defended, espe-
cially sere loss of the income tax, which is only one mil-
lion Ude yew, will be two the next. The next point is the
division of the sinking fund. I proposed that division de-
liberately sad its, • conviction that it wee the only safe
mode of arnspman. The Exchequer bonds stood at •
totally Wirer testis. They were in the nature of a per-
menset debt with a certain pried appointed for their
end whin the money is due the parties
be paid unless they wish to resew.
The erne of • Peking fund is wholly different : that is •
eampsisory arrangement, made beforehand. by which the
pub kith shall be kept by the redcroption of a carter
mount of the debt annually. The right hon. gentheass,
however, or perhaps ronviece !hand that sore @W-
esting prosem—by war ystem of the
sessweess debt inestrel dark "s the French we, may
I der my hon. gsall men have read the pee
posed by Mr. Pitt Is the eatioruil debt by a
bad. ad I mad sat remind tie bones how illusory that plan
Is be—how every tree 4 It was swept away from our
art how all that rensdas of it is an obligation
that whoa ray serpent cedsa„ it shall be applied toward' the
rednotion at the asthma debt. (Hear.) If the financial
position of the arks reersbled that of a private individual—
that was, nth" expenditure had to be regulated by the in-
essee--• skids( tend, each se is provided by the act of par-
would be a tameable means of extinguishing •
debtti3nt that is not the ear The system that ninst
nesemerily be pursued by the nation in dialler with
its armor is, bet, at take the expenditure, sad
boa adapt the imam at it. The is that
bay is not likely at my ibis to be any wend prysurplus
',pitiable to that wpm end anises the honesis
ts mks it ohligalieysplizartszvornmest— the
ways ad ream ere year by mar to form
the ilia lark w • mg bate up our wk.& indelly to
Mink le be papsesity cd oar present debt, sad satisfy our
emirs sail amaidly paying the interest whhont to• the peindpal. (Her, hear.) I need not rendad the
right boa pattemea that Inn year when two millions of
Euesper bends fall dna, there would be very peat diffi-
culty is diebergiag • miilion and a half of your sinking
Willd Lbw. how.) Bat when the act of parliament was
pad Inanity was not foreseen, and I think under the
okenosensese the riPt hon. gentleman's proposal for post-
poning the sinking badis ressesable. But what I object
Is In be present miaow is that he makes no attempt to pay
off the two mallow of limeeper bads, either wholly or in
part, and that he empanel be war
it. It bad just
r if so
Mottoblgation edited to pay it. It has
been
ohm said the Mimi debt of - this emir, d ea
Opals a mem Oat it is he van to belts way Maw at
ray I d sod that ma* aggregate ern so he Irsenrinds
the powers of say imerstion to deal with it, we met be OF
tent to submit to what has become an ininitabb desilay.
(How.) Lot it, then, b bone In mind, thes Os aspdrl of
the debt is but • sasiel liability, which the ~.,.._I of
the country will saw be celled upon to dieonp--il AIM
la ths tarn of a obtain amorist make es ps opted ma-
edam Bat I would ad attention to Mt hat, Biel if army
is borrowed at 6 per mt., a sum equal to the whale mild
k paid di the shop of Interest in the °vane el bar*
yeses. Whim it io barreed at a lower ne,—(ao la the mm the senora MI of this oountry)--of same It lobo
• longer tim off in interest a cm mid
to the teed Still within • Halted period
this muse be the remit, and supposing a debt
Mats at three sod me-third per cent., which is the aver-
age rata ke thenatiosal debt, you pay every thirty yam is
Worn • am oral to the while amount. I think, hew-
ever hip the sum any be, it is not ro pest bat that sew
ante
amity lo sere. (Hear, beer.) I new our to nee
der bi t tight hoe. gentlemen es at the Wheel
obliptles maw aad teal!, restmie belsomarlos.
I aria I bees put titlftiftmistmading tit=
Is glib the debt he.. tibm mink as to
ends sates.. If I imilweesed him oreelly
an set of parliament that calls roe Ili bp*
r eatlett of Exchequer bonds is set a bindle' eriege-
an act of refitment that esquires to pay eat a
Milhaud a half as a sinking fund is set • binding seems-
mat ; bat that it Is competent for Wham to like In
band the revision of Ma Mos amipmenta Mies, how-
ever, In comes to the amid= of Maim then ha lays
the ace of pediment Is • .real sopposint which we
are bend a o 5 510, I meld ash the house, in
esesiderbe this maim daYsaal sappbsata, to nem-
lost the et boinedes the tare been year to year
with the aawarmk
ooatDn., sad that In a waft ohm tam iso
he sell&
ter marble mulles ofbairadag
tits wilt the Imam mast be Mead. Now,
whet wad le blew b, w we Is by I den that as il•
dills sod br t mien of Masks ars te le
hold = iej=e b the r payment of debt are
le be spa m? (Hear.) I pile
agree then eripmente ante by eel at wham* is dir
amp aims debt me always subject at canals esedillasa.
I sad tam parliment OM tie apt beads of he
inieweed, bet b opsa te the banes* Fosse-
die dale her that it may have erred Ws.
I au see eumpile of
hr
laws—
Mt lea ihibm dice be is no chaos If Ws
dead, d . babie M mind obramesab dime
Ole fro air inonsilds easmaimea w Medd de ea, sad
Om is winder whoa to falai the eldigetba
wadi by Is ear piglet brain of this is to be the

pried* 'mom which we are to eat It might to be theism&
(Hear.) Tlie right hon. gandemen, la applying this delirium
to the caucus dthe premed year, says we an seder • mord
iegagessmot to mime the theme tax, sad by allowing the
law to take its course to diminish that import from 7d. to 6d.
lx
the paned. But when we are thus celled upon to give
dint to •• solemn notional sometime, perhaps we may mt.
a Mon orianumplam—a ire dissolving view of the amount
of benefit that will be derived by the taxpayer from this
mike Now let me sok, what is the Went of WM which
the change will ailed f Darla/ the war the ineene tax
wee 16d. in the pound—sisal to 61. 13s. 4d. per esal. On the
Mem of puce the has t, not acting in obedience
to isestlis, hat in accordance with what
thig eeedht the latereste d the country proposed to take off
the war , which was equal to 31. 16s. per oent. Entry-
body will see that that was • substantial relief, and it was
hit an oath by every elms of incomes, but especially by the
wilier elms of Incomes, upon whom the high rate oldie war
lames tax praised with great severity. The result was that
the Moms tax of hut year was 7d. Ic the pound, or
21. 18A4d. per cent., which, for en income tax, cannot be oast-
sidled oppreeelve or severe. Well, the right hoe. gentlemen
tikes off 2d. In the year—one million of which onlyeemes thee
east this year—he lama 16e. Bd. per cent., and so video's
the N. 18a. 4d. to 21. le. Bd. per cent., the whole amount of
rsthf allbrded this year being, however, only Ba. 4d. per cent.
I sey that that is an 'mount of relief that will 'comely be
felt by those •
who pay the income tax. A redaction of
IrelL per cent Is not an amount that would be isedbly
fill by persons of large mans, who do not gees-
rely ialculate their incomes with such strict noomacy se
far er small a change to make any difference to them, and on
the ether hand the persons with Emitedqp inomme—thom with
ir KW. MIL • Ids. r
idielk ill
tee= a susthat peer-e the
it afoot be mid to afford Mlles" any isatiM
au •
dentist relief. ("Oh, oh," and laughter.) Therefore I say
that the right hon. gentleman, in his arrangement, by not
paying the Exchequer bonds either wholly or in part, but
applying the money to the reduction of the income tax, the
violated an Important principle of finance, without giving
any substantial relief to the taxpayer. (Hear, hear.) Thin
is another important question Involved in the right hoe. gen-
tleman's plan. He denounces the income tax as unjust, sad
remade it ae • national obligation that that tax should spire
in 1860. Bat we know nothing deem may be the state of our
finances in 1860 ; we do not know whether our expenditure
will admit dour dispensing with 6.000.0004 of tams, which
is the amount at which the income tax will stand. Is
It pitchable that there will be • surplus revenue
of 6,000,0001. to enable you to dispense with that tax ?
(Rear, hear.) Then may be some few people seamen,
enough to suppose that we may be in • position is the year
1860 to deal with that particular problem. I hope it may so
prove bat it may turn out that there is no surplus, and
then if it fa to be understood that we are bound to absedon
this 6,000,0001., the produce of the income tax, the question
will arise what other source of taxation you can resort to
to obthin an equal sum ? The income tax falls for the most
part on the wealthier portion of the community. (" Hear,
hear," and " Oh.") It is may to get up bete la an meembly
of gentlemen and denounce the income tax in the strong
tines which the right hon. gentleman thought it to employ.
That is • very easy mode of getting up a cheer but before
that tax am be abolished, and before you can substitute for it
6,000,6004 of taxes levied upon the general consumptioa of
the country—and therefore taxes effecting all classes of the
eirausinity—it will become necemary for you to address me
suable* ot • different character--amemblies of persons who
will no doubt meet together, and which will coatain amongsta lime number who do not pay the income tax • very few
who do pay it—es this house contains very few persons who
are exempt amongst • large number who are Sable. (Hear,
hear.) That is • consideration I would prism upon the
notice of the house, before they take a step which may have
the effect in a future year of fettering their deliberations, and
prevent their taking that course which they may them judge
to be most conducive to the interests of the country.
I would call attention for • moment to • brief
comparison founded upon the right hon. gentleman's
own figures for the present year of the direct and the in-
direct taxation of the country—with a view of seeing whether
it la really advisable that we should pledge ourselves to the
abolition of the income tax. Ammding to the right hen.
gentlemen's statement, the produce of the customs and ex-
dee, which form the groat bulk of oar indirect taxation, will
be 41,600,0001. This is the amount of our indirect taxation.
Lit as now look to the direct taxation, and see how very
small is its comparative amount, and that after all that has
been mid about raising a large part of our revenues by direct
taxation tram the more opulent dares. The customs
mid mobs produce 41,600,0001. ; the land tax,
1,200,4001. • the mewed tams, 2,000,0001. ; the
lamas tat i at the reduced rate, 6,000,0001. ; u
logstber 8,200,0001. Strictly speaking that is the torida
als
eirelkeet taxation, and if you take from that the whole ad
the Imams tax, all that will remain la 3,200,0004 There is
mother aim of taxes which I class with direct taxation,
though they differ in some respects from the ppreoding.
Those are stamps, probate duty, and eoaoessioa duty,
amounting to 7,560,0001. Then there is the revenue from
postage, which In moms reenacts partakes of the character of
• direst tax, though it Is in fact payment of service ife
dried—that is calculated by the right hon. gentleman at
3,200,0001, whist together 10,750,0001. But, eddies this
total to the other, they do not equal one-half the amount al
the hafted texas. (Hear, hem.) Well, air, under them
cdreatestanose, I code= it MOMS to me that the house ought
not to come to a amend pledge with regard to the period- at
which either the income tax, or any other tax, shall mem.
(Hier, hear.) Ido not wish to be understood as expriesing
say oplaka *Out the oessedon of the income tax at say
time when the interest of the country shall permit its aboli-
tion. lam ee defrosts for the income tat. All I desire is
that when the time arrives for discussing that subject we
shallbe free to deal with it, and not find ourselves dud up by
a declaration of the right hon. gentleman's by which the
house is to be held Douai (Her.) What the brae is too
war pledged to in the per= eleveartanoss of
the country is the lamer of ezpeediture, and at
the same thee the reduction of taxation. (Hear, hear.)
That is a rooms which of course cannot go on eny long, '
urea you have reruns to the mimes system alpma
hens. I admit the tight hon. gentleman the et
the Exchequer has not hinted at any snob mares ; but unless
the house is prepared to have recourse to a system of pesos
loans, inc eased ex tare and reduced taxation cannot go
on very Meg
Mr. GLADSTONE observed that his tight hoe.
friend had spemmd an unfavourable opinion of the
plan of the thiller et the Exchequer on more
points than ow, semi k see portion of his speech
he urged that the house shield not enter Into or
✓eed= rash angemmirs for year, to ems; and
although his right her hind hadweed that argument
with sarber view, yet he Mr. Gladstone) could not help re-
ramabmisegthet Ms right bee. friend hed himself entered
into • nth ingpegnmse Ile pay off, under the name of •
idaking feed, • mien esta haN or debt amenity. This woe •
most hapereint gerstion, and in dealing with it his
right hoc hind ireat book to Mr. Pitt, and stated that the
admires el that sielmen—for it was mach more the ed.
minis or Db. Pitt this he himself who retained that opinion
—dogrel Get tie arlikhrsest of the slekime fond would
he his best ddstm to Ss ablation of pesterily. In a way
few yews re doctrine el Xr. Pitt was
blown to steer (Herr, her.) Het he (lir. Gleirses) might
be allowed to ay that thee teem greet deg tree la Mr.
PiPitt's theory o f • =kin Ind thee he et= hr he sever
hered to the Awry safer it hod failed. Heit isior bed we
dose ? After the owest dairee mod mequiving posh of its
Men is former the= sad ekes we bat re= it free war
stare book, we had nee yule ego
=sl it, and ebeedy the aid had
pis
hed sheer us had login to amser,
and the=liaZis' es aegis of it wee no be hind h the
present yes; gar the vagerible =abbe d ihe row de-
Glared esti was Impossible le fulfil the oblisplisa whisk
had bra andracted, and his right hon. fried, Omsk be
objected to the proposition al the Chanseffor el tioe Hare-
quer,e= led sewer mid this be had =oh surisesse hhie
own that hit would be pre to go to a divots age.
it. Rear, bear.) He (Mr. OWthine) deeply eureir the
revival of the system of sinking heads, and thstLie
boa. Mend bad assert= that it re the thily
mode of redring as debt of the sootatry. Ks .(11w1•.
stone) wee ronEy le go say hoer in the Med= if the
debt of the 'omen but he was bleed h seedier
whether this ea 611 peeper Ma. 61=11.11. KM
not the Mof aws Ire :l gampab fory,
ley rillises of art dr sedhary
if lessulf DM hie sight his= =TX '
ble gin wail pay era rid or a bat of whet bed
been ass by whet hie righlitspe hewdeinide hind err set
froposelleable MAW ? Asa horsetails I
Mend would bring theHe ids
well= le se frrightee thee ow=
lug. (Rear, hem.) If the leer thesight rot •
fund was a good thing let them &dm for opisio=
Musdto act upon It. bet if they Sher a had thrg let 1
proosed at oar to me rid of it. (Hoer, Mar.)
His right boa. trio= led r deer= that 1,140,0004 theedd
be every year laid ant in rook, whir= might be gee gar
of the rereme. Then wee • rue shirrs to the mods is
whisk ties wee to be hut the eirethe ward bosom I
=anger and grener the you kept pita saes. I
The rag qeestien:wes this. •am of I,6die,OM, rood I
In the bee= of the national writ, Ned pilled awe i
by Ms hon. hied, who deretated any eeMpethe of
the ihrashi yew. (Heir, ber.) the ream holes
delete= weary Cheerfer of the Hsabseper weft el I
awn= he drier h hy et tors to the watt if
to pay of the =As *ad. Meer, hear.) tre sir
Cheneekor of the weirs le ae Oadd ern I
his right be. Mend If 10 were aria Ciesieuer of the Hz- I
arra= alle.s r iaL en fixesle Ile pular of paying of 1
the feed? H eight hen did sr de jostles I
Is the ibis* tonelorliot wiled ea), to oar- I
pies mows. Theme weal be INC issillestre ergs-
rag ia hewer al this phis • hr if the Ammar of the
Tbasherper and the writhe= drislorege 111 their I
duel, the Ohierihr of the Zarlarpor odlorlod W ;
=l"getherserillefally.thesed Ilirsoange ama=
ounoldwoblembis
So
tas
parneweafta year
rigusgsgerbish agektin Nat=