The Express.
London, England, 1867-04-03 00:00:00

[STAMPED, id. ADDITIONAL.]

THE REFORM LEAGUE AND THE CHANCELLOR
OF THE EXCHEQUER.

A deputation from the Reform League waited
upon the Chancellor of the Exchequer, in Downing-street,
yesterday afternoon. Lord Derby had promised to be pre-
sent, but owing to his absence from temporary illness, 1,
Lord Stanley attended as his substitute. The deputation
numbered about 300, and consisted of representatives of
branches in all parts of the country. The marching of so ,
large a body along Parliament-street caused much excite-
ment. The interview was held in the large room at the
residence of the First Lord of the Treasury.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, upon taking hie
seat, regretted that the Premier was absent through indis-
position, and ensured the deputation of the gratification he
himself felt in meeting them. He and his noble friend
(Lord Stanley) were prepared to listen with the utmost
attention to what was to be brought forward.
Mr. /STALES, president of the League, said the present
interview had been sought in consequence of the minis-
terial statement that the government were prepared in all '
sincerity to bring the question of reform to a settlement.
(Hear, hear.) It was not for the weal of England that that
settlement should be longer delayed, and there was a deep
responsibility both upon the government and the House of
Commons. Confiding in the siaserity of the government,
he and hit friends felt it their duty, as representing • very
large majority of the working-classes, to wait upon the
Premier and the Chancellor of the Exchequer to state
frankly in what respects they considered the bill now
before the House of Commons was not calculated to effect
the settlement that was so much desired. Thy Chancellor
of the Exchequer, in the House of Commons the other
night, had said that he had received scores upon SCOTCS
of communications from working men of all classes in
favour of the rate-paying and residential conditions
attached to household suffrage. The Reform League
read the report of that statement with the utmost
astonishment. ((hem.) They did not question that the
Chancellor of the Exchequer had received the communi- '
cations, but they denied in the strongest possible way that
they represented the true feeling of the majority of the
people of this country. (Cheers.) On the contrary, they
were a gross misrepresentation, and he here openly chal-
lenged the authors to substantiate them. With the
greatest respect be represented on behalf of the deputa-
tion, that they objected altogether to the ratepaying
clauses. They looked upon all three clauses, including
all fancy franchises, as so many invidious distinctions and
injurious reflections upon the position and character
the working classes. (Cheers.) They regarded them ea
the fruit of that groundless fear and suspicion that were
prevalent as to the swamping of property and wealth by
the working classes, and that seemed to spring only from
an idea that those classes were in a continual state of
conspiracy. (Cheers.) A bill without • lodger franchise
could not be satisfactory to the people of the
country. The Chancellor of the Exchequer had claimed
to be the father of reform, and it was to be hoped that he
would not in the future be so unnatural as to abandon his
learn offspring. (Laughter.) What the working classes
earnestly desired was a large, frank, and broad extension
of the suffrage, so extensive that it would indicate a manly
and generous confidence in the great body of the people.
It was neither wise nor safe to leave the question of reform
any longer unsettled. (Cheers.)
Mr. ilarrtn, a working man, said the deputation was
anxious about two points ; first, that they should not mis-
understand her Majesty's government ; and secondly, that
her Majesty's government should not misunderstand them.
With respect to the first, they were in the hands of the
government ; with respect to the second, it was the duty
of the deputation to address the ministers present in the
plainest of terms, and he was sure the working man's
plainness of speech would not be construed into an
offence. Although they belonged to • society that
advocated and believed in manhood suffrage as
the only true measure of reform, they were not
impracticable men. But they could not accept the
government bill as it now stood. It was unsatisfactory
and utterly obnoxious. (Cheers.) Having pointed nut
the features of the bill to which he objected, the speaker
cor.cluded thus :—Our principles are not of to-day or yes-
terday. In days gone by they have consigned some of us,
myself amongst the number, to prison. (Cheers, and
" -Hush !") To-day they bring us, through you, to the
foot of the throne. We offer to the throne the homage
of our loyalty ; we offer to the government our objections
to the measure affecting us. These are the weapons
which those of us who are called agitators have used
against you ; and now we respectfully request that you
will disarm us, and leave us without the opportunity of
rallying the country against the government. (Cheers.)
We beg of you to reconsider this matter. We feel satis-
' fied you have as keen an appreciation of your coantry's
honour as any to whom we could address ourselves, and
' we hope you believe we are as incapable of doing wrong to
; our country as you are yourselves. (Cheers.) In
, times of danger the blood of the working man has
flowed as freely as the blood of the proudest peer, and we
beg of you to remember that what we were in times out
we arc now. Raise us to the ranks of citizenship and we
shall raise you to the ranks of heroes. Raise us above the
level of serfs, and then history will speak of you as men
, who had a glorious opportunity and embraced it. (Cheers.)
I do not wish to harms you with what are called senti-
ments. lam • representative working man, and have
been twenty years agitating this great question of reform.
I weary now of the work, and would it were settled. We
- come therefore with all humility, but with conscious
dignity, to ask for justice. (Cheers.) If you give it to
us we shall ever he grateful. We cannot tell how the
' government are going to deal with us, but we can tell them
if the bill now before parliament is passed in its present
i form, we shall look upon the signing of that bill as the
signal for renewed agitation. (Loud cheers.)
Mr. Memo., shoemaker, spoke upon the subject of the
lodger franchise, the absence of which from the present
bill he insisted was a great injustice. Referring to the
reform debates of last year, be said his class was 'cantle-
, lcusly and shamefully vilified ; for the persons who were
guilty of this the working classes had no regard, but the
acclamations with which they were received hail created •
gulf between classes which might now be bridged over.
' Speeches upon tenus of residence, the savings bank
clause, the compound householders question, &c., were
made by Messrs. HOWELL (the secretary) and Mr. CRENEIL
The speeches having lasted over an hour, and anxious
glances having been cast at their watches by the Chan-
, cellor of the Exchequer and Lord Stanley when the time
' had passed for their appearance on the Treasury bench,
Mr. BEALES said he was sorry so much time was being
occupied, but he wished to ask two gentlemen from large
provincial towns to say a few words.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—We are stopping
away from our duties in the House of Commons, Mr.
, Bealea. We do it cheerfully, howevtir, and shall be glad
' to hear your friends.
I Alderman Itatowix, of Birmingham, and Alderman
I BARTER, of Leeds, then delivered brief addresses.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, in reply, said—l
, believe we have hail the pleasure of listening to all the
' speakers mentioned by Mr. Beale*, and your views have
r been placed before Inc and my noble friend with ability
' which no one can question, and listened to I hope with
that attention they deserved. (Hear, hear.) You will
allow me to say, without any offence, that I collect from
, the observations you have made that you are the professors
of what are called extreme opinions. Penult me further
to observe that there are also in this country professors of
extreme opinions which are of a very different character
from those I have heard this afternoon. They are very
powerful, and perhaps very numerous. They are very in-
fluential, and they are of opinion that there is no necessity
to improve our parliamentary representation—(oh, oh)—
and they take upon all the questions you have
advocated with so much fervour conclusions exactly dif-
ferent from those which you adopt. Now the morel I
drew from that is, that if anything is to be done there is
• great necessity for mutual forbearance, mutual conces-
sion, mutual conciliation, and mutual compromise. (Hear,
hear.) lord Derby has introduced a bill into parliament
for the improvement of the representation of the people,
of which, although some very hard words have been used
in this room respecting it, I believe impartial persons of
consideration, even although they might not approve of ft
altogether, must admit it is based upon very popular prin-
ciples. (Emphatic shouts of "No, no.") Those who
say " No, no" are gentlemen of extreme opinions.
(Laughter.) Now I dare say if I was receiving a
deputation of gentlemen holding extreme opinions in an
opposite direction they would say " Yes, yes." You may
depend upon it if )au wish to arrive at army solution of
political difficulties, you will not settle them by calling out
on the one side, " No, no," and on the other Yes, yea."
It is only by mutual concessions, mutual conversation,
mutual understanding and conference between different
parties, that an adjustment can be arrived at, which,
although you may not completely approve of it, will on the
whole be advantageous to the country, and will assist in
the progressive development of its manifold resources.
I here recur again to the observations I made before, that
on the whole it will be admitted by impartial persons that
the bill now introduced into the House of Commons is one
which is based upon popular principles. (Loud shouts of
I " No, no.") No one who undertakes to introduce anygreat
measure into parliament, supposes that he introduces •
perfect measure, or imagines that it will per through the
ordeal of parliamentary criticism without alteration and
improvement. And I may be allowed to say before vou,
because I know there are some of you who have indulgral
in very different observations upon that assembly, that I
have been amember of the House of Commons 30 years,
' and that I have now the hononr of being the leader of
that house. (Hear, hear.) The House of Commons has
not on the whole supported me, and perhaps, therefore, I
may be considered an impartial witnera—(laughter)— but
I believe there is no aseenibly in the world which,
collectively, is animated by purer, or more patriotic semi-

(TWOPENCE

manta. (" Oh, oh," and derisive laughter.) I dare say you
would be very much annoyed if when in the House of
Commons this League was spoken of there were a murmur
of disapprobation ; and I say that when I go back to the
House of Commons they will not be pleased to know that
when I vindicated its; conduct and character my remarks
were received with a murmur of disapprobation. Depend
upon it when there is a better understanding between the
House of Commons and assemblies like this, these mur-
murs will disappear. (" Hear, hear," and " Du us justice,
then.") Now, let me again recur to what I began, by say-
ing, no bill can be supposed to pass through the House
of Commons without much criticism and without much
alteration, and, as I believe, without much improvement.
All the a that have been made to-day will be
remembered, and will be considered. (Hear, hmr.) I
have only now to thank you for the honour you have done
us, and to say, I trust this conversation has not proved un-
satisfactory. (Cheers.)
There were calls for Lord Stanley but his lordship,
remarking that he agreed with his colleague, merely apolo-
gised for his father's absence, who very much regretted
not being able to attend.
Mr. Br.st•-i thanked Mr. Disraeli for granting the inter-
view, and the proceedings closed.