The Express.
London, England, 1867-10-05 00:00:00

THE EXAMINATION OF THE MANCHESTER

FICNIANS.

MANCHESTER. FRIDAY.
After our parcel was despatched yesterday one
other witness was examined.

John Francis Doyle was the next witness. He appeared
to be suffering from the effects of hard drinking, and be
gave his evidence in such a peculiar manner as to convulse
the body of the court with laughter in which the prisoners
themselves joined, apparently with the heartiest relish.
He said—l am shopman to Mr. Gilligan, clothier, Oak-
street, and know the " defendant," John Brennan. Don't
know his residenoe, but have an idea whereabouts it is,
though I don't know the name of his street. He
has been carrying on his trade foe years. It is an
out-door trade. Mr. Cottingham—Point out John
Brennan. Witness—That is the gentleman there. As •
working man he has always been respectable, except for a
drop of drink—the same as nreeself. (Laughter). Mr.
Cottingluun—Ab, then you own the impeachment of the
"good old gentlemanly vice" do you? Well, do you
remember Wednesday the 18th of last mouth? Witness.
I do, alas, too well. (Laughter.) That's plain. (Laughter.)
Mr. CottinOatu : Did you see Kelly in the afternoon ?
Witness : Which afternoon?—Mr. Cottingbam : Why, the
afternoon of the "Alas ! too well.") (Laughter.) Witness :
Yea. Surely it would not have lived in my memory but
for it being the afternoon of so remarkable • day, end me
having seen him so often on so many days previously.—Mr.
Cottingham: Well, you saw him that afternoon ? A. Yea.
Q. What time? A. Frequently—all the afternoon. But
when I saw him to my certain recollection was (to bmin
with) when I was in the act of going to get • glass of ale.
I saw him then, and went back to my business. I mustn't
be confined too Gloss to business.—Q. What is your
business? A. An outside business, on the flagstones.
(Laughter.)—Q. When did you see Kelly again that after-
noon ? A. When I was going to get myself half an ounce
of tobacco in Swan-street. From four to five o'clock I was
oonstantly looking at him.—What was he doing ? He was
making his living outside, the same as myself I spoke
to him often.—What did yoa my to him ? Oh, I said,
for instance, " How are you ?" How's trader "Have
him.
RUIZ rl'aularrifoltiomlns thee
"rat, "motions"
mo-
tions ? Quite so.—(From this point In this witness evi-
dence, until the and, the laughter throughout the court
appeared to be inextinguishable. The magistrates found
it equally impossible to check ft on the part of the
public, or entirely control it, even on the bench. The
prisoners laughed aloud.)—You are quite sure you know
Kelly? Sure, I ought to know him, whoa I've known
him ten or twelve years.—Crose-examined Iby Mr. Higgin :
All this took place between four and five o'clock.—Q.
What was Kelly doing ? A. !Getting his living.—Q. How
was be doing it ? A. By buying, selling, and having an odd
glass. (Roars of laughter.).—Q. And where's your place
of business ? A. In Oak-street, on the flags, exactly. oppo-
site where Kelly's place was.—Q. Had you been drinking
that afternoon ? A. No ; be invited me, but I refused,
saying, "No, governor, it won't do, governor." Saw •
couple of women with him when I went for the half -canoe
of tobacco. I had not • glean of beer between four and
five o'clock that afternoon—no, not one • but I might hays
had, for I had plenty of opportunities, and was invited
often. I've come here to speak the truth.—
Mr. Higgin : Don't " protest "so much. Witness :Pm
only • plain person, you use.—Q. Have you had • drop to-
day? A. Unfortunately I have done that the last two or
three days. (Lemliter.)—Q. How many drops to-day?
A. Two Irish whiskies. (Much laughter.)—Q. No more?
A. Not to-day ; and 11l tell you how it was. A friend of
mine met me, and said, " Hare a &rum?" and as I felt as
if I could do with one, I had it. (Renewed laughter.)—Q.
Were you drunk yesterday? A. Well, I bad an odd little
"tot" to cure myself of what I had on Saturday.—Q.
Were you drunk on Saturday night? A. lam afraid I bad
more than I ought ; and I say so to my disgrace,for I know
it is to my disgrace. (Laughter.)—Q. Had you • drop on
Sunday? (The answer was lost in the noise in court)--
Q. How about Monday ? A. On Monday I was very
temperate, perhaps for the reason that my finances
had got low.—Q. Are you not a little nervous now ?
A. Not naturally nervous, but it is one of the evil
consequences of alcohol to affect the nevem. (Laughter.)
Q. Ever had delirium tremens? A. Not to the extent I
have read about others having it. (Much langhter.)—Mr.
Cottingham : Had you delirium tremens on Wednesday,
the 18th? A. No • I had been steady for a fortnight
before then, or ahould not have been sober enough to re-
collect all I've said, for it wouldn't have been in my
memory, but I hadn't lost • day's business for • fort-
night before.—Mr. Fowler : That'll do.—Witness: I'm
quite sober this afternoon, and I only wish I had been as
sober since the 18th as am now. To-day I've been "in
keeping " here as • witness for four or five hours, and
that's much too long for me. (Great laughtee.)—Mr.
gin : You've bad nothing since you've been in keeping?
A. Not a drop—dry work !__(Roars of laughter.)—Mr.
Fowler. : There, that'll do.—Witness : Excuse me, but I
want to " identify " the right party. (After some further
questioning the witness signed his deposition, and order
was restored in the court.)
Waimea' were then called on behalf of Patrick Kelly.
—William Hadfield, a potato dealer, sworn: I know
Patrick Kelly, the defendant. That is the gentleman on
the left hand side of the dock. He is • porter in our
market, and often doss work for • Cheshire farmer. He
has borne • good character, I expect. Saw him all the
morning on the 18th, and also in the aftentoon. Was
to 2 him at four o'cdoek—ean's say to a minute I"hr 4`..y. This was in Oldham-road Potato Market.
We said • few words about going to Fred/bans together,
to buy some " rocks" (potatoes). I know the time, be-
cause as I wish to stay in the market to see prices, I was
waiting for that purpose an that particular day. I went
right borne from the market, and found it eight minutes
past four. It is only • few minutes' walk from the
market to my house.—Crose-examined : Can't say if any.
body saw me speaking to Kelly, bat many were round at the
time.—Patrick Featherstone sworn : I am a porter in the
Oldham-road Market, and work carearionally for Mr. Samuel
Woodhull. I know Patrick Kelly. Saw him on the 18th.
He was than in the potato market. I want to put up
his potatoes at • quarter to four, and left at • quarter-part
four. We put them up together—putting the bast ones
on the top, This we Gall topping them. He was putting
in the "toppers."—By Mr. Fowler : I first spoke about
this to Kelly's wife three days afterwards.—Michael
Monaghan Igo by the name of 'Bleck Kick." I have
known Pat Kelly 15 years. I have been poriering for 18
years at the markets. I remember the day the van was at-
tacked. I was working for Kelly all that day weighing
potatoes. I saw him there nearly all day up to 7 o'clock,
when he paid me. He was not out of my sight more than
twenty-minutes, when getting his dinner at twelve
o'clock.—Edward Sweeney, a porter in the potato market,
corroborated the evidence of the preceding witnesses as to
the weighing of the potatoes% tea, and the men who took
part in the work, adding, I wrote three letters for Kelly
about potatoes during the evening. Cross-examined:
One of the letters was for Mr. Thomas Jones, of Fr odsham.
The second was for Mr. Thomas Lynch, Overton; by Prod-
sham. Ido not recollect the name of the third person.
Re-examined : The third main's name may have been
Orton. By Mr. Fowler : I wrote the letters about half-
pest six, and posted them myself. Patrick Ryan : I have
known Pat Kelly for nine or ten years. I am • porter at
the Oldham-toed Market. I remember the 18th Septa.
bee. I saw Kelly in the market at • quarter to four,
Cross-examined : Kelly was " topping " the potatoes at
that time.

---iii.-6;itingham said that he did not wish to call further
witnesses that day, but he would have one or two addi-
tional ones on the morrow.

On the application of Mr. Bennet, Mr. Fowler directed
an officer to proceed to the grand jury room and inform the
witnesses that if any of them absented themselves to-mor-
row, warrants would be isimed against them.
It being now peat six o'clock, the court was adjourned
until ten o'clock to-day.
The ow for the defence was resumed this morning
before a numerous body of magistrates, Mr. Fowler again
MrMr. Bennet milled James O'Grady for Tbomalßrerni
as
He said—l work in the same shop Ryan, Mr. Robert
Howarth's, in Osytborne. I know Thomas Byan, and
have done so two years. He has been working in the same
place as myself over two years. I remember the day of
the attack. On that morning I came to work at
nine. He came the same time, and we worked till
one o'clock. We went to dinner, returned at two, and
both worked till six, and he was never half an hour out
of my sight. I don't know the railway arch on Hyde-
read.—Mr. Higgin did not ask the witness anything.
John Collins was the next witness. lam a fellow work-
man of Ryan. I remember the 18th of last month. I was
at work all the day, from nine in the morning till six at
sight. I saw Ryan, end he was at work from nine to one,
and from two to six. I lost sight of him no longer than a
of an hour during the afternoon. By Mr. Higgin :
quarter
Howarth is a fustian shearer. I cannot say how many
men, but there may be 100 perhaps. Six is the usual hoer,
and we went at nine because we were sleek. We worked
day-work. Mr. Sendiford, the manager, paid the wages
that week. lam paid weekly. Ryan is paid by the week.
John Joyce, in the same employ, said—l remember the
attack. I know Ryan. He works at the same naeliine as
myself. He came at nine, and worked till six, exeept the
dinner hour, between one sad two o'cdoek.—By Mr.
Higgin: The 18th was on Wednesday, I think. Re was
at work on the 16th and 17th also. I never beard he was
taken in custody till that night. We were making abort
time that week. lam not wraith what time he came to
work on the Tuesday.

John Ratcliffe said—l am the foreman of Mr. Howarth's
works. I know Thomas Ryan. He has worked tinder me
eleven years at the same shop. I remember the day of
the attack, on Wednesday, the loth September. I saw him
all day, except dinner hour, from nine to six. We only
started at six on Monday morning of that week.
Joshua Barrett—l am in the employ of Mr. Howarth.
I know Ryan, and have done so twelve months. Ido not
work in the same room. I saw him many a time daring
the day. In the afternoon I saw him at ten minutes past
four in his own room. By Mr. Higgin—l saw the cloak at
the Duke's warehouse.

said—l am manager for Mr. Howarth,
and act as timekeeper. I know Ryan. I remember the day
of the attack. Ryan was never out of my sight during
the whole day up to six, except for a quarter of an hour.
Mr. Howarth has been attending, but has now gone to
Paris. I have not the time-book. Ryan was booked for
ten hours when be only worked eight and a half, because
be started et nine instead of six.—By Mr. Higgin : He is
paid whether he works or not, unless he loans it by his
own fault. He earns 225. a week. We take the time of
waziokrict men to check their staying away of their own
If there is work to do he ought to be there. If
he is not, his time is pM.
Mr. Roberts then called witnesses for Thomas &alley.
William Ainsworth end—l am a tailor in Bootle-street,
Deanagate. Scalley works for me. He was working on
the 18th. He comae at half-past 9 in the morning. He
lives is Chapel-street, Salford. He only works occasionally,
just ea he may be required. He left work that day at
ten minutes to Bin the evening. I work at my business
myself. I sat on the same board. He was there all day
except from 1 to a quarter to 2, when he went to his
dinner. By Mr. Higgin—l only had Salley and my
wife working with me. He was working for me a fort-
night before. I did not know he was taken into custody
until the next morning.
Mary Ainsworth, the wife of the last witness, gave evi-
dence to the same effect. She said—l fetched him to work
that morning, a little after nine. He was never off the
board all day exempt three-quarters of an hour, nil late at
night. By Mr. Higgin—He bad finished what we wanted
him to do. I remember the day, because when I heard of
his being taken up I looked at the almanac to be par-
ticular. By Mr. Roberta—l have the almanac. Mr.
Roberta—Then go and fetch it.
Mary Jane Wilson said—l live in Clopton-street. I
know Smiley ; I saw him en the 18th at the Let witness's
house. I called there a little after three, and stayed till
after five. I left hint there.

—John Seymour,
s t;ifoi, living in Longworth-street,
Deansgste—l know &alley. He has been working for me
two years. I let him go out to work sometimes. I let
hira as on the 18th to Mr. Ainsworth about nine o'clock.
His wife asked me to let him go, as he was busy. &alley
lives with his owls.

Chsrlea Hanciaord, Mr. Howarth's manager, wee recalled
in Ryan'. case, and produced the time book. He esid—lt
is in my handwriting, and the time U. put down each night.
I have no other memoranda. Mr. Higgin pointed oat an
entry on Thursday and Friday of 10i hours, which had
been struck out. lie explained that sometimes Mr.
Howarth allowed them their wages, if they are good men,
whether they work or not, end we enter it as time. Wit-
ness added, earnestly—The man Las innocent as any on
the bench. Mr. Fowler pointed out an entry on the 21st,
and witness said it mart be • mistake. Witness--I can
bring fifty witnesses to swear the same. Mr. Higgin—
Oh, please don't.
Mary Ainsworth was recalled, and produced the almanac
she referred to. Mr. Roberts—This is • curious almanac.
I see some 'draw hieroglyphics here. There are some
handcuffs.

—it-r-.n.--C-o-ttingltant then Galled witnesses foe William
Marti

Susan Kirkby said—l remember the 18th. He came to
my house to lodge in July. I know his brother John also.
He was with me until the day he was taken. I have two
daughters living with Ws. I knew Mrs. Breckall, whose
husband is the head carpenter at the Theatre ItoyaL Mr.
Bracken procured a free ticket for my daughter on Wed-
nesday, the 18th. She went on that night to the theatre
with her husband. I saw William Martin that day. He
was washing himself in the scullery when Mr. Breckall pre-
sented my daughter with the order. This was at eleven
o'clock. He went out near upon eleven o'clock, to go to
the newsroom in livesey-street. He came back about
two o'clock, and remained there till twenty minutes
pest four. He then went out. He was seat on a
message to Clayton-bridge, where his brother John was
working. I saw him leave. I know the time, because my
daughter and myself both looked at the clock. I bad •
reason for it. He did Dot know the way, and we said it
would take him hell an hour to get there. I heard be
was takes on Friday. I waited up that night till one
o'clock. By Mr. Hl In John Martin married my
daughter. They were married on the 19th August.
William Martin came to lodge in July. He was not at
that time at work. I don't know the situation be we. at
previously. William Martin told me he was travelling.
It was something in the picture or gilding, in the neigh-
bourhood of Shudehill. He had been lodging about a
fortnight when he said be had got that employment. He
was not at work when be was taken up. He went every
morning to Livesey-streart to look at the papers.
Bliss Martin, the wife of the prisoner, John Martin,
was called..

lir:Fowler. asked Mr. Cottingham if be could rail the
wife of one prisoner in defence of another, if they were
formally ch
Coarged.
Mr. ttingham said this was • preliminary investiga.
tion, and there never had been an instance of a wits's,'
being refused to be heard at • preliminary inquiry.
Mr. Fowler considered they were there on a joint chew.
Mr. Cottiegham said if they were charged on • joint in.
dietmeut, then of course the wife of one could not be called
as • witness for the other; but in the present case there
was no indictment, and it was possible that the use might
mums a different aspect with reference to each.
Mr. Fowler—But this is • joint charge. He referred to
the case of " The Queen v. Windsor," which ruled that •
wife ovoid not be called under such dreumetances.

Mr. Higgin said thin was joint charge :they were all
charged with murder.
Mr. Cottingham urged that there war no specific charge
as yet formularimed agamst them. He referred to the case
of " Carrington tr. Kirwin " which bore upon the paint.
Mr. Fowler, after looking at it, said it appeared to bear
out Mr. Cottingham's views, mid he allowed the evidence.

She said—l have been ina;ried six weeks. Trem7mb7l;
the 18th September. My husband wee et Clayton.
Mr. Moan objected to her husband's mune • intro-
duced.

M i.Oottinghhm said he could in the intend of William
Martin.

Fowler said it would be best to endue the ques-
tions to Willisan Marti&

Wit:no674 got an order for the theatre from Mr..
Breekall. I went to the theatre with John Martin. I know
William Martin. He left our house at eleven, returned at
two, and stayed in till a quarter or twenty minutes to
four. I know the time because I looked as we sat getting
our tea. I sant a message by hint to John Martin.
Mr. Higgin objected to the name being mentioned.
Mr. Cottingham—You sent • message to a man. Answer
—Yes. I went to the theatre with only one person.
That person came to the house about • quarter to seven.
Had seen him that day.
Helen Breckall said—l am the wife of Henry Bnsckall,
the chief carpenter to the Theatre Royal. I live next door
to the last witness. I gave Mr. John Martin an order to
the theatre at • quarter to ten.
Ann Brook, Great Ourge-street, Oldham-mad, said—l
am the wife of Luke Brook. I remember the 18th of
September. I know William Martin. I saw him on this
Wednesday In my house, in the afternoon, at 25 minutes
past four. Our house is five minutes from Mrs. Kirkby.
He eked the way to Clayton, where his brother worked.
My daughter showed him the way. She went with him
to show him the way.
Mary Jane Brook, daughter of the last witness, said—l
saw William Martin on the 18th. He came to our house.
I only saw him once on that day. He got my father's
fiddle off the wall and examined it. I went with him to
Hulme-hall-lane, to show him the way to Philip'wpark,
where he was going with a message for his brother. By
Mr. H' —Our clock struck five, and it was half an
hour and five minutes too fast.
Hannah Thompson said—l live in Queen's-road. I re-
member the 18th. I was in Mrs. Brook's house about
four o'clock, and I stayed about an hour. A man called in
and took down • fiddle. The little girl went out and
showed him the way to a place. By Mr. Hlggin—l asked
Mrs. Brook, when the clock *truck five, if it was not fast.
Mr. Fowler—l saw him before. (She pointed him
out in the dock.)
Mr. Roberta then called evidence tor Johnstone.

Ambrose Lomax said—l live in Gorton. lam the time-
keeper for Mr. Jeffries. I have my book here. Thomas
Johnson worked there. I took his time once in the
morning and at 4 o'clock in the afternoon. He bad been
working all the day. (The book was produced and handed
in.) By Mr. Higgin—He made three days on the 18th,
19th, and 20th. The name underneath is Began. I found
out the mistake afterwards. It was given me as Rogan.
They are not particular as to names. By Mr. Fowler—l
altered it on tits pay day. Ilia foreman Potts told me it
was Johnson.

Mi..ooinnghsm thee called evidence for John Martin.
Robert Fielding—l am • butcher living at Clayton. I
know the works of Mather and Folkston., 000pers. I wee
there in the afternoon; having nothing todo, I went sitting
there. Being • botcher, I had nothing to do. There was
• man named John Martin working there. I saw him
there at his work es tumid. By Mr. I ass •
master butcher, and have • pretty good I
slaughter my own beasts. We kill every day, especially
Wednesday and Thursday. I bad not eommeneed killing
on that day. I always kill at night. I killed that night
from six to seven. I killed one sheep that night, and •
beast on the following day. I bought the bout in the
Salford market, but I don't know the name of the person
from whom I bought it.

James Heap said—l am a grocer at Clarion, near Folk.
stone and Mather's. I was close to their works on the
18th. Imw John Martin, one of their men, between one
and two, and also afterwards, but I cannot positively say
I saw him afterwards. At two o'clock John Martin came
to my shop for some tobaooo.

Samuel Mather said—l am a cooper at Clayton. Joha
Martin was in my employ. I was there from ten minutes
put twelve till twenty minutes put six. John Martin
was there. He left at twenty minutes past six. I saw
him there all the time. He had his dinner, and I took
mine with him. He could not have been away throe
minutes without my knewiedge. He was sever away.—

By Mr. Higgin—We employed two besides myself am
portner.
Edward Folkston, partner of the but witness said_
John Martin wus in our employ, and had been'there R
month and three days. He was at work all the day
on the 18th. I was there myself all the day, e
a short
tt,
iefore twelve. He has been very stead,.
By Mr. • • —We work generally from six to sis. We
are not err about hours. By Mr. Cottingham_j
would coke bin, beak if he was free now. John Marna—
Thank you.
Monism Killgalan maid—l am a cooper in the employ of
last witness. John Martin worked will, me. I was at
work on the 18th from a quarter to six to a quarter peat,
Martin wee there all day. We had breakfast and dinner
together.
Henry Crompton, druggist, Ashton New-read, said—l
know Martin. He was asked to point him out, sad after a
close scrutiny he pointed him out, but said, .If that's
him, he locks • deal thinner." I saw him on the Saturday
before I heard he was arrested. I saw him on Wednesday
the 18th in Mr. Mather's workshop a few minute; to four.
I had known him for four weeks. I have doubts about the
man, he is so altered, but the men they called John ?diutie
was there. There is only one John Martin. There are only
two men in the employ of Mr. Mather. I saw Martin
about four, a little after four, and again about five. I can.
not tell the exact time, the neighbourhood was so dim
turbed.—Witneas was asked to go closer to Martin, and he
said—l am now satisfied be is the loan. I bad mostly
seen him without his coat.—By Mr. Hiain—Wbea I saw
him at four he had a hammer, and was looking at a mak..
Mrs. John Martin was recalled, at the request of Mr.
Higgin. She said the play at the theatre was the Greet
City sad Hoseydorea Troubles.
The court adjourned for half an hour.
After the adjournment at noon,
Mr. Bennett called witnesses for Michael Maguire.
Mr. Fowler—How many more alibis are there ?
Mr. Higgin—Thirteen, sir.
Benjamin& Waters sworn—Saw the prisoner in the after.
noon of the 18th September tea or a dosen times. Could
not speak to the time.
Samuel Bulman sworn—ls a tailor in Edge.etreet, nude-
hill. On the 18th September saw Maguire every half-hour
of that day from eight in the morning till seven at night.
By Mr. HitgOn— Was working as a tailor lot the pri.
saner, who is a clothes dealer.
Enoch Noble said he saw Maguire on the 18th seven'
times during the afternoon at a vault in Shudehill, when
witness waits.

By Mr. Higgin—Would not swear he had not told police
officer Kirkland last Sunday that Maguire might have been
away on the afternoon of the 18th without his knowing it.
Did not see him change his clothes on that evening. He
had on a light shooting coat. Heard on Sanday from the
police that he changed his clothes.
Michael M'Laughten, salesman to Michael Maguire, laid
he sew the all the afternoon of the 18th. He
might have out of sight of witness not more than 10
minute,.

Ann Wood, draper, Swann-street, saw the prisoner that
day at 10 minutes past 4. She was at her shop door, sod
he was brushing clothes.
By Mr. Higgin—Saw him at three o'clock and a quarter
to four.

Thomu Field, draper, Bmithfield-market, said he had
known Maguire nine or ten years. Prisoner is • clothier
and bee • shop in the market. Sew him on the 18th
from two o'clock till half-put four in the afternoon.
By Mr. Hiuin—Baw him all that time with the exception
of an interval of 10 minutes. Was talking about hones. lie
was • betting man.
The came was proceeding at four o'clock.